20 Episode results for "Mccoy"

[068] Instant reaction to the release of DT Gerald McCoy

Buccaneers Observer

38:33 min | 1 year ago

[068] Instant reaction to the release of DT Gerald McCoy

"Welcome to the buccaneers observer podcasts row. Philipson Molly bay today's may twentieth two thousand nineteen who cares. How many days is to kick off? Big news is show is going to be dedicated to one thing, and one thing only gel McCoy Jerry McCoy is no longer a Tampa Bay buccaneer. He and the team apparently mutually decided to part ways. That's what the team said. Anyhow, we'll see what McCoy has to say probably tomorrow, I haven't seen anything any replies that he's had he won't be off social media much longer. He's been pretty quiet for the last few months, and I'm sure it's driving him crazy. So it's going to be interesting to see who if anybody picks him up, how much for agent at four o'clock tomorrow. That's when we'll find out there's speculation, he could go to the colts because they have so much cap room. But who knows there is rumors that we. We are pursuing Dhamma consumer to take place, which that's been reported by Gregg Allman JC Cornell who's connected to the areas. Family Putera report is also reporting it to me is a fascinating because if we get the bottle could sue, he's going to cost us almost as much as Gerald McCoy, we might could getting for a little bit less. Maybe a couple of million less, but that will be a huge megaphone shout that we didn't get rid of McCoy because of his cap space. We got rid of McCullough, because attitude, we are trying to have an attitude adjustment with the Tampa Bay Buccaneers, especially on defense. It appears getting the could sue would be a huge signal. And I think it would just be really, really fascinating. We talked yesterday and in the podcast before that, about bursary and sending a message to Jeremy quake, three. Through the media and jerem McCoy did not take that, well, I think that could have been the death knell forum. I think that may have had more to do with his release than anything. Now not to mention that last season, you know, he's always been talented as the leader of the defense, and then he's not even voted, captain, just that was very, very telling last year we he's we got JP last year who got paid more than hill. That's the first defensive player. I'm pretty sure that's been paid more than McCoy since McCoy's been here. Not sure they're rebus might that I'm paying more for that one year. Maybe fact, check that. Yes. In two thousand thirteen they'll Rivas got paid sixteen million dollars Darrell McCoy got paid eleven million, but that was the first time and the last time until last year the McCoy hasn't been the highest paid player on the defense. Now, normally he's been. Been the highest paid player on the team total up until I think Mike Evans last year if in the not be voted as a captain, you know that's the team that does that teams won that vote for captains. I'm surprised that wasn't a bigger deal when it happened. Everyone just kinda downplayed not really big deal, and he let the new guys come in and take over the leadership of the team. Well, there's been a lot of that that's happened since jerem McCoy's been on this team. Everybody kind of downplays a lot of things with him. I'm going to say this Gerald McCoy n- has a lot of fans and for all you fans that are upset about Jerry McCoy, leaving the team I'm here to one make you feel a little bit better about the situation as far as the team goes and to probably going to piss you off because I think this is the best move the buccaneers could have done. They should have done this many, many years ago after the two thousand eleven to Bockel. I wanted everybody on the. Team taken out and only ones left Regina McCoy and demar Dotson now with McCoy gone that leaves demar Dotson not too worried about him because he's not much of a leader or anything of that nature German coy stepped into that roller. At least vocally said he was going to step into that role but we will be a better team without jerem McCoy Garin t it I do not like talking bad about players while they're on our team, which is why we haven't really said much before. Now, I'm not a big fan of calling for people to be fired or anything of that nature. But bottled tell you law sit here, and I watched film, I get so aggravated watching Jerrell McCoy because. Yes. Well, he is talented. I will not I'm not going to say he sucks. He's probably above average. He's basically got one move, and it's a speed or one quality and it's his speed other than that. He really does a trip. Much on the field liabilities sometimes as well because he gets a lot of penalties very very big liability on the field. And this is one of the things that really pisses me off about the media, and the announcers way he's been handled is always show his highlights though, show a sack. They always come six time pro bowler all bringing yes, which he earned it, I guess can't take it away from him. But that has nothing to do with the team, but they never show his love lights. And trust me when I say, jerem McCoy has a lot of lowlights his negative plays far outweighed his positive plays. And I think Bruce Arians saw that, you know, Bruce Arians is a film grew he loves it. And also Bruce Arians is the only coach that has come in here with enough clout to get rid of jerem McCoy, you know, it reminds me of the Dallas Cowboys, I think it was. Join me they sold it to Jerry Jones and the all owners sold it to him on the condition that he got rid of Tom Landry that he fired Tom Landry because he couldn't fire Landry. And I kind of feel like this is the same thing. I mean you had I you had he Moore's come in, and they drafted McCoy, they wanted sue, but they ended up getting McCoy and he made his own issues to deal with he was a new ad coach and all that. So he didn't have as much clout to begin with Gerald McCoy did. And then we get rid of hill after that two thousand eleven to buckle where the team just totally quit on him. And they we get Greg's Yano Greg Shana was a last-minute higher. He came in immediately the media hated hill and jerem McCoy was at the same time touted as the face of the franchise. Now this is after two years of being hurt and not really contributing. A whole lot to the team. And then all of a sudden he's just lifted up as the face of the franchise. He didn't earn it. And I think the reason was image. That's the buccaneers under Rahim had an image being partier 's horrible, image. Yeah. I mean he had to keep Toledo Raheem Morris is going to strip clubs with the players. Josh Freeman Atsu board, not showing up practices. He's doing drugs. He's alienate and all of his teammates sell. I think that they put your McCoy forward as a leader, not because of his reputation or what he had done for the team. But just they had a PR problem that they had to fix brought in McCoy n- no matter what about the guy. He's, he's excellent at PR. And he is what the NFL wants in football players. He's clean cut. He speaks. Well, he stays out of trouble. He's a family man. All those things are commendable. He's. He's christian. So his faith is really important to him. Right. But that does not make you a good football player. And it does not make you a good teammate in there in lies. The problem dude I think he was a good teammate. And I do not think he was that great of a football player. I am in the same camp as Ian Beckles that he is one of the most overrated players ever in the history of the hidden fell the way he was touted. I mean this guy was on Kobe poor. He was on the league. You know, he's been on the NFL AM NFL network inside training camp in fell tunnel access. I mean he's just he's in the media a lot and he gets touted by the media, a great deal. They're always talking about how he's double teamed. You know what he's a defensive tackle. They get double teams. He gets double teams no more than any other defensive tackle in the league German McCoy had D world's most powerful marketing team behind. Creative arts association. He had top courting as his manager. These are the same people that handle Tom Hanks all the big stars. They handle a lot of big football players to Peyton Manning was one of them, but they're very, very gifted and good at marketing in Jerry McCoy was perfect for them. And he did a lot of marketing for himself. But again that does not make for a good player or a good football team. Now, one of the things I'll say about Jerry McCoy is a football player. I was touching on this earlier. He's got he's very quick. He's light on his feet, but he's not strong. And he would get pushed out of the way ten fifteen yards out of the way the play all the time, I have literally hundreds of video clips of jerem McCoy, getting pushed out of the way getting completely moved out of the play if he didn't get to the quarterback quickly. He was. Basically, useless, and in Beccles touched on this, and one of his podcasts that the media made up a word for Gerald McCoy disruptive, but he never saw on the field. And I think Ralph is in that camp as well. Yes, he would get in the backfield, and he would might make the running back mood to the left a little bit or whatever, but it wasn't like he was blowing plays. And stopping the plays they were basically just going around him if he got in the backfield, and that was it if you look at his tackling stats, the really quite atrocious, especially if you compare them to Donald could sue and defensive tackles tackling is kind of a thing, it's, but they're supposed to be the run stoppers. Right. That's what everybody says about McCoy L. He's got fifty four and a half sacks, which is impressive for defensive tackles because sats aren't really good measure of their caliber, as a defensive tackle. Yes. And. That's true. I mean defensive tackles aren't really supposed to be the Sakhon is. But if you look at Germany coys sacks, they're not distinguishable and all he rarely had sex in late quarters games. He never had Saxon, important parts of games. I mean I can think of maybe one maybe two where he got to the quarterback when it mattered. But generally, it was first quarter second quarter I down second down or garbage time for garbage time. Yes. Like we game against the Buffalo Bills when he had one of his few multi sat games, heck, even I think the whole defense had seven sacks, I want to say they're Rivas head to sacks and we play against Atlanta. There was one against atlano to wanna gets to Atlanta. That was dare McCoy's biggest sack they had three sacks. But and this is another big thing, it was up against a guy who was absolutely horrible. All three sacks where? Against the same guy of the right guard. I can't remember his name. But if you search his name in Google the first thing that pops up is so in so sucks. Atlanta hated him because he was just horrible. So anyhow, once they took that guy out of the lineup and put another player in general coy, didn't get any more sex that game, one of the things I've always said about Gerald McCoy, or I've always said to Molly about jerem McCoy is he does not play well at all against high competition when he goes up against really good lineman. You don't hear from him. He disappears and get Majer of that was hill wasn't Jeremy's zoo that went to play for. Yes. When Jeremy, Zuhdi played they came and played at Buchan ears, and Jeremy Zuta and McCoy went up against each other quite a bit, and Jeremy zoo, just basically tossed, Gerald McCoy a rally rag doll round. There was one play where he'd knocked Jeremy coil office feet and a good ten yards bag that was also the game we're jerem, quote was helping a bunch players up to, and that's what everybody really got upset. Now, I wanna touch on that as well to people said, Gerald McCoy, it's okay for jerem McCoy did not help opponents up. He's just being a nice guy and all that. I agree with that, that's fine. If you're the one that knocks them down. But if you go back and you watching that Baltimore Ravens game. He was helping guys up that he didn't knock down. And he was helping guys up on the ravens team while Buchan ears guys were still laying on the ground. It was a very, very strange thing. I don't know what was going on in his mind. I've really I've really felt like he was getting his. Whoop so bad that he was trying to appease them and say, stop hurting me. I'm a nice guy cow, easy on me guys. That's how I felt in that game. And that's the game. Also the flack said a record for what, what he scored four touchdowns in the first half. I think it might have even been five. Okay. Where they just beat the heck out of us. But all you McCoy fans I understand where you're coming from. I really do. But don't fret McCoy will probably go to somewhere else, and we'll actually see if Darryl McCoy is the player everybody thinks he is. But I'm gonna tell you as far as the buccaneers a concern. If you're still a buccaneer fan, this is a good good thing. I know people don't want to hear me say that, but Mark, my words are defense is going to be so much better without jerem McCoy there. I mean you gotta look at since he's been on the team aren't defenses sucked. He's only played on to winning teams and we've changed everything from top to bottom through taint coaches coordinators. Everybody on the defensive now. Exactly. And it was always oh he's never had any help help last year last year. But even before that we had player. They didn't cost much money but they were just as productive if not more productive, and they got no attention. They got nothing. But blame we went out and got Clinton McDonald who was decent more days above average. I mean there were so many Adrian clayborn ROY he's he went one Super Bowl. I liked him when he was here in two Super Bowls, one, one of them Michael Michael SuperBowl. Winter, you know, and Germany co is never gone to the playoffs. It's just amazing to me, but there's, there's much much much we could say about this. But what I wanna to do is really a no, I'm pissing. A lot of people off that are jerem Koi fans. But that's how I am. I do not like to call for players to be fired or whatever while they're on the team. I just not a fan of that. I think that when you're saying you support your players ever problem kind of call JIRA McCoy, but it's hard to do. Because when you call. Jerry McCoy offer bad play or whatever you just get attacked attack tacked by not only fans but the media but now that he's not on the team anymore. Kind of feel good about saying what I think Lawley. What are you doing? The part that really turned me off to Gerald McCoy was when lavar anti David had a really productive season. I think one of his best seasons and jerem McCoy was asked about it, and they media and his response was, yeah. I get double team so often. So he's able to go in there and get a lot of sacks. If I were live on David that would piss me off because he's essentially taking credit for David success. Oh, yeah. It was it was mildly infuriating for me to we need to get that clip and play with the, that's one of the things that, you know, when I say that jerem McCoy being got off the team is going to be better for the team. I'm not talking about his play as much as I am about the way he affects the team. Like I said, he's been paid extremely well, and he's gotten all the attention. I mean it's all over granite, and none of the blame. Yes, he gets all the credit. I remember during the Cleveland Browns game few years ago, he got a sack and they played it over and whenever talking about it and Clinton McDonald got a sec right after that they didn't even mention his name. They didn't mention they were still talking about jerem McCoy and then Clinton McDonald went and got an interception. A couple of plays later. It was a fantastic play. I mean he literally knocked this guy off his feet, and then he ran down the field. And caught a tipped pass the announcers didn't say a word about it. They didn't even replay it. But Jeremy McCoy gets all the attention for whatever he does anything he does and he gets the tension. When the team does something it's Jaren McCoy now. I understand why the NFL does that, because like I said, they want to push their McCoy as the new face of face the NFL, but could you imagine what it's what it feels like being on a team with a guy like that, that? Sucks. All the achievement right out of the room. You know, he's making all the money, and he's getting all the attention. What incentive do you have to play good? If you're going to play good jerem McCoy is going to get all the attention for an and all the money. I'll think about wherever you work. You know there's one person there that gets more credit than they deserve. You know, there's somebody there at the job that, you know, they far off with the boss thinks great or you know, they get paid a lot of money, and you sit there and you go I could do that. Anybody that watches jerem McCoy's fill, you know, and I'm not talking about looking at his highlights. I'm talking about watch a whole complete game. What take whole complete season of Dera McCoy film, you're gonna look and you're gonna go, let's not that great and these guys see that. But yet, they see him get all the accolades, all the money all the attention. And like I said, you know, Clinton McDonald does great doesn't even. Get a mention he doesn't even get a replay most people didn't even know his name while he was on the team. Same thing with Michael Bennett. Michael Bennett was on the team. He was playing lights out. Nobody really knew who he was until we get sent to Seattle because Jerry McCoy took up all the attention. And I think that it makes players resentful. Absolutely. An it's a bad example when McCoy is on the field. I don't think that he plays to his troop potential, which I think, is what areas was kind of getting at, when he called him out in the media. He wanted him to play as hard as ever played. But so you see a co worker, who is not working nearly as hard as anybody else. And it doesn't matter. Nobody calls him out for it, right? That's, that's a huge thing, nobody ever ever ever criticises Jeremy McCoy. If you do you get blocked on Twitter, and you get a bunch of hate mail from people. Yes, in the media also comes after I did not get that in the last few weeks, Rick Stroud and Tom metrics of the Tampa Bay times. I think that they have an an with Gerald McCoy, but they were not just reporting on what was going on. They were actively defending Gerald McCoy from fans criticism that has not your role as the media is not your place not your job, but they were just incessant. And they've done it since he's been here. The only one who mildly criticizes him is Peter report and they were blocked by McCoy. Joe bucks fan kiss his ass for extravaganza. I mean they all do. Yes, it was the two thousand fourteen week. I'm not sure what week it was against Cleveland. Here. I've got this written down the second quarter at seven to Spence had a Tf L on the center. Okay. This is the same. Mm center? He was a this was his first game with the Cleveland Browns he was brought in because they they're center got injured. It was a long story didn't have the guy was really out of position a lot. And so our defensive line took advantage of him. So Spence had a tackle for a loss on him in the fourth quarter. Eleven thirty seven Clinton McDonald had an interception McCoy was not even in that play in the first quarter McDonald had a tackle for loss on that center as well in the first quarter a minute later McCoy had a sack on that center as the same center that spans McDonald, both were able to get good plays on. And this center was a scrubbed at it only had one game with the Cleveland Browns before that. But McCoy has got all the praise from the announcers he got articles written about him because of this game. And that play in particular I think it was books nation. Yes. But books nation dot com. Leap Sanders wrote a huge article on it. Read it made gifts wealth the, the sack. Mccall even said, after the game, he said everybody's frustrated, but I don't think anybody is upset enough with losing, but no money pointed out, fence plays at McDonald's plays that they both had excellent games actually better games McCoy did. But yet McCoy gets all the praise for it, and that just happened all the time. Here's another example of McCoy's non criticism in two thousand and thirteen. Nobody knows this in two thousand thirteen jerem mcquaid led the team and penalties. I believe that he had ten penalties nobody ever pointed that out. Now this was also the same year that everybody was freaking out because we were one of the most penalized teams in the NFL, but yet nobody would point the finger Jeremy McCoy, nobody now that you say that I remember that it was under his team right? Just everyone was like, oh, where someone disciplined, so undisciplined, right? Who was undisciplined, there, Gerald McCoy. But yet, nobody pointed to Jerrell McCoy as the problem he had ninety one. Yards lost on penalties that year he only had seventy two yards lost on tackles and sex. Wow. So he caused us twenty yards here. If you wanna look at it that way, I mean, there's just so much so much, and we'll probably do more videos on this, but we wanted to get on here right away and get the news out that Jerry McCoy was no longer with the team, and try to kind of make everybody else feel a little bit better. This is not the end of the world. As a matter of fact, this is the beginning of something really good at Tampa Bay. Well, and maybe we'll see for certain he can go to another team and see how he does there and the buccaneers can move on and go on without him. And we'll see how they perform. I think it'll be really telling at the end of next season, whether this was a good thing or about thing. Yes, if we can consume that, man, that's going to be so crazy. I don't say it happening. But now that everybody's bringing it up. We joked about it in the podcast was at last podcast, some podcasts, we're talking about Jerry McCoy leaving and what would happen if we get sue, I tell you what I will say this in a little bit of prognostication, if we get sued we're going to the playoffs. No doubt in my mind, no questions asked. And that was show you how much Durham McCloy was keeping us back. It just praised that one player can have an impact both negatively an positive exactly. He got any ideas where he'll go, I've heard that he's wanted to go to New Orleans. You know, he works out with your breeze off season which that bothers me tale. He's done that for, like eight years, or something, which is insane to me. Go to hanging out with the enemy. I mean, I get that they're all professional, and it's a business and all that. But younger competitors. I mean any advantage, you're going to get from working out with them. They're going to get it too. I think drew Brees is a strong competitive than jerem liquidity. Is out there like oh, you know, just trying to have some fun and drew Brees without their like on the learn how to beat this dude. Is that only talk? Doc, and Derby's is what like nine into against Gerald McCoy, you made like record wise. Yeah, they've matched up family. That's the record every time that they've matched up in fact when he made his Instagram video he was in New Orleans. Yeah. Trevor sick succumb a- sick. I'm gonna learn how to pronounce his name one. If you know how to pronounce his name, please tweet at me. Trevor Tampa Bay trae tweeted today. Right after that, news that a lot was going to come out about McCoy's tenure with the bucks now that he's left at team, which I'm very curious about that, especially because of what you said, and I wouldn't be surprised if that was part of the issue with the two thousand eleven team. Oh, bill. You know, I'm want to know that so bad, you know, not only what happened to the to the team. But how much does it was Gerald McCoy because here it is you're looking at a whole party team. You know, like we said, we had a keeps telling keep mcgeer blonde NAR Jackson, Josh Freeman. I mean these guys were serious serious partners and we're talking jog strip clubs on a get stuff. And then you had Gerald McCoy who you know, he's Christian family man, and all that stuff. There had to have been a confrontation going on. You know, some type of conflict between those that group but back to you and drew Brees go back and look at how many times when we talk about Durham McCoy and sacks how many times he's sacked quarterbacks in order to Beijing. I think you'll be quite surprised. You think the number is pretty good given that you matchup against him? Twice a year broad. But it's pretty much the exact opposite. He gets more sacks out of the division than he does in the division, think on number. That would be, my guess Peter. Cox was the name of the sooner. But Atlanta Falcons, the German Koi got two three sacks on its Peter KO in Z. Never heard it. Yeah. I thought it was, but it Peter cops. But if you look, you'll see that land falcons fans just they could stay in. He was his horrible. But that's one of the things with dare McCoy as I said earlier, he did not play well against top tier offense of Lyman New England Patriots known saints teams, such as that. And it's cowboy Dallas Cowboys go back and watch the game last year that we played 'em coin and do nothing. Can he play in that game? I don't remember. Injury problems last season. Yeah. And that's another thing whereas SuperBeets Djerma coy assume does not get injured too. He's only missed two games in his whole career how and those are both been due to suspensions. He does not get her. I'll tell you I remember in, I think it was two thousand fourteen when we were playing the NFC west when they were the powerhouse division. We're talking about the dec-. Hawks were the top team in the league, the car, noses with Arians was there, it might have been the year. They went thirteen and three. The Rams were kicking butts in the forty Niners had Copernican all mean the they were the powerhouse division at this time and lucky us, we got to play them ear. And this was Xiantao's first or second year I think it was the second year and we played the Seattle Seahawks at Seattle and we played them so hard, we took them into overtime. I remember that one. Yes. And we had them beat. I mean we had them beat and on the ground, they were huffing and puffing. In all that good stuff. And Jeremy McCoy left the game in overtime. I, I remember sitting there watching TV going. Oh, what am I watching here? I don't care if my arm was broke I would wanna play and he, I don't know. We had like a twist at Angkor you know, he never missed any time point left the gay just left the game. He actually got carted off the field on a card. And I remember he, he looked over at the Seattle sideline or the diva whoever was on the field whenever he looked at Seattle players and did his shoulders shrugged. Like I can't believe you guys did this to me, something like that. But I remember watching a game in thinking why in the that's not championship material right there. You know unless you're either I'm I was thinking about this guy. He must have really broke his ankle. You do not leave in overtime against one of the best teams in division at their house, and your team has been kicking butt and, and to be carted off the field and nothing's wrong with you. He did that quite a bit, where he would, you know, trainers would have come out take him off the field, and then you come back. Couple plays later have quite a bit. With but it doesn't have it was SU so it just doesn't leave the field. So if we do get sue we can expect to be out there for sixteen games. Jerry McCoy's only played sixteen games once or twice if the calculations I did a while back. He was he typically admits twenty five or thirty percent of all games. Yeah. But a lot of that was because the two thousand eleven he missed ten games. I think it was was torn by years. Arou- where he tours buying south, I two years because of that reaching out, China arm tackle people. Well, if nothing else was durable, and we learn from the Donovan Smith re-signing. Durability is absolutely an admirable attribute. Yes, I'm gonna say that's all you Gerald McCoy fans. I've been saying this since we've signed on with Smith. If you're mad, you got McCoy cut from the team blamed on him and Smith because he took all his money. But one of the things that you always say about championship guys is they make the players around them better. You can't say that about Jerry McCoy. I can't think of anybody that's been on the team that you could say they were better because they played with your McCoy. Now, the thing that they say about championships caliber, people is they step up. They make big plays in big games, Jemma going never did that nobody can point to a play, which is one play that Jerry McCoy ever did that was a game changer. I talked about this a couple of podcast ago. But I said, we couldn't bring up Jeremy Koyo went downtown mount J, P and sub going to do that right now. We had never really seen that before JP came on the team. At least I haven't I've been a fan for ten years. But J P did that number of times, or he showed up? He got us a stop when we need it. You know. Yes. Quite a few times, actually. And JP played hurt and he and he played. He was out there. Hurt three fingers on one hand half a hand in any case it can be done. It doesn't you don't have to have help on the line to do it, though. I think back with Gordon sap of awards pad. Marcus Jones, tedium HANA to Brad Culpepper. Guys like that on, on the defensive, nobody's saying, hey, these guys are what made Warren sat better. Although they most of them had they all had more sex and did and one point or another again, two defensive tackles are judged by sex, but, you know, going Sam didn't need everybody on the defensive line to be Probo Kyle players in order for him to be. Be good in order for the team win. So I I'm just here to say it, we are going to be a much better team. Now the Jeremy McCoy is gone. I think he was holding us back quite a bit. Especially defensively. We always heard about crime Alexander in that he was kind of the energy of the defense, and that's where he was going to be missed the most. I think there's something to be said for Leno energy as well. Yes. I mean, if you're just constantly sucking all the energy out, or you're not working as hard or as motivated as the guys around you, and they don't, and they don't pull you up. You're just going to bring them. Now, if you have someone at your workplace again, wanna analogies. That's just I don't know if this is what McCoy was doing. But if a bad attitude in their bitching all the time and their oranges unmotivated. It makes you wanna motivated. That's contagious. It's harder to over. Become bad energy, negative energy, or even low energy than it is. It's just hard to come back from that it would take a whole team. I think to bring up one guy who's got low energy. So I wanted to get on that train that this is a good thing for the Tampa Bay Buccaneers if you're Jeremy McCoy fan and you've made it this far. Don't be despondent. Seriously? Don't be despondent for the team. This is a good thing. And it's a good thing for Tara McCoy to, you know, he needs to go somewhere where he could start over and, you know, hopefully, get on with the team that's already got a championship caliber people. You know, we're talking about the colts. There's some somewhere where they're not too far away from being a winner, because I think his time at Tampa had just run out. You just can't be the leader of the defense the face of the franchise for so many years and have your unit. Be absolutely horrible during that whole period and expect people to continue to praise you for name. I mean we did for a long time, we made excuses for him for a long time. I think the excuses, just run out. Yes. I think last year was pretty much the nail in the coffin of excuses for Jeremy McCoy. He knew that at the end of the season even before Dirk koetter was fired. But oh yeah. We hired areas. I mean that last game in December he made that statement in the locker room. Whatever happens happens, and I'm very grateful for my time, here he knows over, and it might have been hill. He might be the one doesn't want to play here anymore. Don't know. Well, Trevor Tampa Bay trae senate's gonna come out so we'll see his Tampa Bay trae. Trevor second. Yes, yes, you never do that connection not changes his name. His Twitter handle are the display name. He changed at all the time. So we're going to find out soon if we're going to get Donald could sue. I don't know how likely that is. But I tell you what it would be extremely fascinating in my prediction is we'll be a playoff town team. We get the Donald could sue. Thank you, really. You would really see a culture change here. Immediately can't just say, one more thing we have a lot of young impressionable. Guys on the defense, not impress me in, you know, naive or whatever. But football wise earned experienced since that they're going to look to the veterans on the team. What type of veteran do you want them learning from the smashmouth guy or the gun, the PR guy? Right. That's having fun. And that's lost his whole career ran food for thought and jerem acquainting is going to be remembered fondly by Lana bucks fans. He's probably gonna get into the ring of honor. He'll be missed by law. Fans probably some teammates, the fella have to say. And again, I'm not saying Germany. Koi is a horrible person or that he's a horrible football player. But I am saying he was highly overrated, and I think he was more harmful than he was good in the locker room. So this is a good thing for the buccaneers. If you're fan of the buccaneers. This is a good thing, if you're fan of jerem McCoy following wherever he goes, that's going to wrap it up for us. We just wanted to get on here and let you know, the news and our thoughts on it not doing anything fancy this time. We got another podcast. I guess we'll do Tamar. No, no. Well this make it up for it. I don't know. I just barely got to one out today. Well, we have not as tomorrow in the media will be there. So it's gonna be all kinds of stuff coming out, especially with the McCoy's staff. And the media is going to have access to the teams him football. Maybe I will. I think that we should probably do one tomorrow. Again, three days in a row and make up for last week. Three in a row. All right. That's gonna wrap it up for us till next time that lacks.

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115 - Hatfield-McCoy Feud

Timesuck with Dan Cummins

2:17:55 hr | 2 years ago

115 - Hatfield-McCoy Feud

"Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Law now go now feel McCoy few if. Yeah. Murder more murder. Vigilante Justice more murder revenge killings posses being formed a father losing and five of his children's lives to another families violence still hog a family home burned to the ground by an angry mob government, corruption forbidden, love affairs lot of drama in today's tale. The Hatfield mccoys repeatedly attacked one another in the rural tug river valley. Separating West Virginia and Kentucky for over a decade in the late nineteenth century two. Patriarchs Deva lands Hatfield and old Randall McCoy, let their hatred of one another infect I their entire families and then entire region of the country governor pitted against governor West Virginia versus Kentucky supreme court of the United States would end up getting involved few general last for many decades. So how did it all start? How did it finally end? And how much blood was shed in between the origins and the dirty deeds of America's most famous. You'd revealed today on time suck. Have you Monday time soccer's hail Nimrod Hailu Safina praise. Bojangles hail. Triple m Dan comes the master sucker. And you are listening to time suck recording suck dungeon today. In court. Elaine, Idaho, Reverend Dr Joe motherfucking paisley. Hope you loved him on last week's special guest addition of it is the internet. He did some magic today to had some tech problems recording this episode the day before thanksgiving it was looking rough. But Joe he figured out some wizard trick from some wizard forum and got us going. Hope y'all had a one thanksgiving. I know I did record this again beforehand. I'm sorry. I hope I did. How would I know? I haven't had it yet. Or my talking about time gets confusing here. Sometimes Gordon episodes in advance just going to be Lindsey ni- and penny ginger this this past thanksgiving. And I'm guessing we were able to relax lots. I know in this moment that I record this. I'm very much looking forward to that just to chill out for a couple of days and just for being thankful man super thankful for this little world. And how far it's comes. We started and all of your guys support like very, very thankful. Somebody little cool things. I was coming back from Grand Rapids. This this past week is walk into the Spokane airports and space lizard, don't know his name because he was on the other side of security glass who's coming into the airport. I'm leaving he's in little TSA area. And and he just mouths the words, you know, actually, I can't say 'cause it's for space only he mouth a secret spaces or code. I knew what he said I gave him a secret spaces or hand sign. He gave it back to me. It was it was very cool moment that I'm super thankful to have life experiences. Like that. Yeah. Just thankful for man. You guys sharing this podcast with your friends and families and just seeing grow, and you know, Senate in stories of reconnecting with family members. Kevin something new to talk about every week reconnect with old friends making new friends having fun with your with your lovers and your spouses and just enjoying the silly little world that that we've created right? Just basically try to be honest. Try to make fun turn out to shove either a conservative or liberal agenda down your throat and just try to instill re-instill, a childlike sense of wonder about the world some important, man. And so fun just to be like a kid that way and just be curious and excited about stuff. Just just have a Reverend fun with stuff. I've said it before. But it's like, my grandma always said, you can you can laugh or you can cry. I loved it our community can just laugh about almost fucking anything. It's I think super healthy and Superfund love you meet sacks. So so thank you for giving me the most meaning work wise for sure that my life has ever had a now, let me awkwardly transition from heart warming, thanks to a blatant sales pitch, speak speaking of meaning there's no there's no segue. But I want say cyber Monday sale happening now in time suck store everything in this up. Shop is twenty five percent off using the discount code cyber Monday eighteen so cyber Monday in the number eighteen during checkout, and it'll be a banner that says that on our store so make real easy. Just cannot be combined with the spaces or twenty percent discounts. But yeah. Twenty five percent off of everything and the offers good through this next Sunday sunny. Day Sunday coffee tumblers challenge coins? Hoodies beanies loose. Athena, sleep were set. So many sweet tea's, vinyl, decals, all kinds of exotic animal skins and furs and body parts. Twenty five percent of all twenty five percent off. It all ends at midnight Pacific time, Sunday, November seconds. We were gonna start at this past Friday black Friday, but I messed up fucked up forgot s- based on recording schedules win, the episodes were coming out based compared to when I was recording them and didn't realize last week when I recorded that I was recording thanksgiving new world order episode when I should've mentioned it there. But we're still doing to sell for a full week all ends up to same all comes out in the wash. So thanks again for spread in the sock bypassing around new preview videos for episodes. We put on Instagram Twitter and Facebook at times podcast sharing. Those clips tagging friends retweeting all spreads suck. Now. Thank you to the street suck or this time suck street team streets, three sucks. Different time. Suck street team was announced in the private Facebook group awhile back. Some you lovely time suckers now spreading sucked by blanketing very sections of the world with LUSA Phoenix face. My face other time suck our work had somewhat response that and I know I never mentioned that on the the podcast before. But that was intentional. We wanted to mention it in the private Facebook group. I feel responded, and we had way more interest, and we had stickers which again 'nother thing to be thankful for. So hopefully, this three team goes, well, people actually put the stickers that they've got around around their towns and communities, and then we'll we'll buy a whole bunch more serious, and they're really cool danger. Rented a good job on those. They do on everything. And then. We'll we'll get a bunch more people involved. I just love that people were excited to be involved. Yeah. Turns that I did have a great time in Grand Rapids Michigan last week and holy shit. Every show outside of Thursday was sold out. Most an advance. This is this is new territory for me. Thanks to all of you who made long drives for those shows. Thanks to Jeff and Cadillac for showing up so many years in a row now and thanks to a few times suckers for for some green medicine. Thanks to C four in Washington for handed out some delicious edible medicine when I flew back into Spokane the ride it just keeps getting more fun. Yes. Forget I'm going to be only be tuneup. A lot of that as I just kind of relaxed a little bit get some rest over thanksgiving weekend. All be Spokane comedy club, November twenty ninth thirtieth and December first tickets really sellin fast for those shows so happy. Thanks. The spokesman review for interviewing me for those shows look forward to that coming out, and they'll be in Saint Louis December six two nights, wrapping up the flutters tour. Those will be the last ones happy murder tour next year. I'll pose. Dates for that soon got most next year booked, and and then after that state last night Lewis show, I'll switch gears and prep for that. Ted talk Ted talk and coordinated Kroc center, January twelve link for that in the episode description, very excited to think about what's gone on the last two years here. And and think about how to share that TED talks, hopefully will inspire other people to pursue their passions and make the most out of them. Now, let's get suck. And I'm very excited that a lot of fun research in this a lot of fun a suck bunch of McCoy's. A lot of hatfields in today's Bigalow. Meet sex showdown. All right. The time and the place today's tale factors. Largely news stories always seems too few to the magnitude of the hatfields versus McCoy's wouldn't take place in America today. Today's laws current level of media coverage just never allow the combination of vengeance. And vigilante Justice to to go on for as long as it did. And yes in actually there weren't many places this series of events could have unfolded elsewhere in mid to late nineteenth century, America. Either a life was just different in the tug valley than it was for for much of the nation. Dentistry was frowned upon clothing. Optional is were Beatty. Many folks walked on four legs instead of two dogs oranges pets, they doubled his actual legal brides for for many valley. Resins a local pastor saw what was inevitable and thought he couldn't stop vomit -able unions. He might as he might as well make him official name is a God hogs or just for love. Neither many hogs actually help provide for their human families taking up farming logging fur-trapping. Jobs put food on their tables, the line between animal and man became blurred. And then legend has it it actually merged and new races of hog folk and dog folk were brought into the world and the tug valley, and and then those hog folk became known as the hatfields and those dog folk became known as the mccoys and everybody knows duck folk don't miss know-how folk now out a few guk. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Sorry life wasn't that different in the valley. And again, I wonder what the people of stairs the noises here from the suck dungeon. The valley where the famous Hatfield McCoy feud to place was nestled in the rural mountainous region of Appalachia nailed it Appalachia. That's not how they say. It's on the pronunciation guides. But I learned I learned last time we were in this region the country that if you are from Appalachia, you don't say Appalachia, that's that. That's how you know. You know, folk, you know, dog folk go. Yeah. Anyway. Yes. Nestled in the rural region of Appalachia at the border of Kentucky and West Virginia right on the border. There was centered on the valley of the tug fork because big old big sandy river, one of the least hospitable parts of the Appalachian highlands here. The tug fork forms both natural and political boundary. Dividing the states of Kentucky in West Virginia. However, while the river did divide the two states didn't divide the tug river valley community, both the Hatfield mccoys. They had relatives on both sides of the river. The hats family had his largest concentration in Logan county. West Virginia in the mccoys were most numerous in pike county Kentucky with the two clans did travel continuously back and forth between West Virginia and Kentucky which just ended up adding to the feud because we're always in contact with one another the tug valley was is extremely remote one of the largest Choubey one of the last areas. Settle in both West Virginia and eastern Turkey. The first settlers mostly of Scottish descent scotch Irish descent arrived from southwestern Virginia around eighteen. Hundred and if you'll recall from the Andrew Jackson, suck these early Scots are the origin of Boza term redneck and the term hillbilly quick recap the origins of those two terms the term redneck counts from sixteenth century Scotland when Presbyterian rebels rose up against the church of England sign manifestos in their own blood hardcore, then we're red close around their necks to signify the rebellion during the bishops war of sixteen forty in Scotland the term hillbilly comes from the term hill folk Scott's from the highlands of Scotland we're called hill folk and then during another war, the sixteen hundreds of Scots who supported king William of England were called Billy boys after their patron king. You know, William king, Billy hill folk who were called Billy boys, then called hillbilly boys, which eventually was shortened to hillbillies and that name followed them to colonial America. And then both the terms redneck and hillbilly became a derogatory racial slurs essentially synonymous with rough rugged ignorant rural folk quick to fight. Maybe. Slow to take up reading and writing and arithmetic and the tug river valley elements this derogatory description actually did fit for many, and I say that someone with a with the Scottish last name of Cummins and over sixty percent British and Irish I'll answers ancestry. Lot of my ancestors were probably some of these rough rugged on educated people education. It was just hard to come by in the valley. There were a few school houses in the region. But kids only ten school for three months out of the year, most dropped out entirely after only a couple years, and the majority of people in the tug valley were illiterate throughout the early nineteenth century this region remained extremely isolated with frontier conditions persisting. They are even as the rest of the region around them progressed and developed the area also suffer from extreme income inequality. Most of the land was owned by small percentage of the population. In some eastern Kentucky counties up to seventy four percent of the population. Landless a minority population of back country elite dominated extremely Krupp, local, politics and hatfields. Mccoy's they belong to this back country elite the patriarchs of each family, were landowners and kept a considerable number of livestock. They held similar social and economic standing. The hatfields were better off what actually ended up becoming quite a bit better off during the few. Just just you know, a a little clip up above the McCoy's. But both clans were were well off for West Virginia kind of tug river valley standards. And they both had a numerous family members serving in local politics in the judiciary system, both Kentucky and West Virginia. And again hatfields would have an advantage. There seemed to be more of them seem to have more prestigious positions around the committee. But both of them had some pull that fills McCoy's occasionally intermarried over the years, and they're intertwined social familial political relationships created a complex network of allegiances that would make feud more complicated. Add to the violence, another important point to make before we get into the time line of the Hatfield mccoys feud is that feuds were not unusual in this area. At this time, no less than six major feud took place in the Kentucky side of the tug. Fork the sandy river in the wake of the civil war and additional also took place nearby Perry and Roane counties a lot of these were partly due to conflicting loyalties in the area during the civil war and then afterwards, both West Virginia Kentucky struggled with union and confederate loyalty. West Virginia was formed when a total of fifty counties chose to succeed from confederate for and former new union estate officially admitted to the union in eighteen sixty three. However, some West Virginia residents, including the hatfields still had confederate loyalty still had confederate sympathies and took it as a sign of treason, if one of their own supported the union these future also partly due to the clannish hillbillies of his area acting like Clinton ability the scotch Irish area. Other poor rural whites wanna Torian clannish. Just like, you know, the courts after the civil war did not protect African Americans. Equal to widen. Reckons? They also didn't protect all white Americans equally in the racial pecking order of white America, this time know, hillbillies, we're at the bottom. These scotch-irish were at the bottom many found strength in numbers due to their rural backwoods kind of living situations. The law wasn't always easy to find. Was often very corrupt, and they just these families would take it upon themselves dole out and seek Justice and the combination clans Vigilanteism that's perfect. You know, kind of environment for feuds most of the foods manifestations of power struggles between prominent local families like feels McCoy's product of competition for for land, wealth and power. Just just countries, you know, say motivation for countries fighting when another, you know, a lot of those trickle down to these feuds just one family wanting, you know, more more power more land more wealth on I was trying to take it for another family finally view took place directly on a state line. The majority of the half as we said lived on the on the West Virginia side of the tug fork. And the majority of McCoy's of Kentucky side, and if you'll recall way back from way back in the bunny, and CLYDE suck. If you're an outlaw in the early twentieth century crossing state lines often gave you the chance to escape with authorities starting life. You felt a little bolder to go break some laws in a in a nearby states because you. Oh, back to go to different state and get away with it. This was even more true in the late nineteenth century, the federal government, not as strong as it is today, especially when it came to law enforcement, and you know, one state was usually extremely reluctant to push into another state to apres Hindu criminal. And if they did do that local government in that state could and would often push back against the other states officers, maybe not recognize them as being lost recognize him as trespassers. So, you know, in some ways different states where we're almost like different countries. It's another understand a little bit about the context. Take some broad strokes to the two biggest players by foreign today's tale of the patriarchs of the Hatfield and McCoy clients, maybe the most important character in the feud is Devlin's Hatfield have paid have man headed home full about no hall, folk don't take. No for no doll folk. Sorry, Lea leader of that Bill Clinton patriarch of one half of the information infamous feud born William Anderson, Hatfield an eighteen thirty nine Deva lands. Hatfield grew up in. What is now Logan county? West Virginia born raised the tug valley soured and West Virginia Wayne from his mama's sweet Tate's route there in Nevada. Yeah. Hatfields or some of the first settlers in the region and the river serves the boundary between Kentucky and Virginia. One of the eighteen children born to Ephraim and Nancy Hatfield Deva lands half filled and star if I keep repeating some of these details there's so many characters in today's tale. I kept just having to do like mental recaps to remind myself of what in the hell is happening. It was become more important as the story goes on. But. Yeah. Devils while one of eighteen kids born to Ephraim Nancy Hatfield known to be an excellent marksman and horse rider eighteen kits eighteen kits sweet Jesus. Poor poor mother. I'm surprised more women didn't kill her husband's back. Then you're gonna hear about a lot more women. Have a lot more kids. That's just ridiculous amount of pregnancy. I told him to not put a seed in me. No moss. I told him I said, Robert, Bob, McAllister, FitzGerald, you take that devil. Stiff, and you special baby post on that deal flow pregnant full teen, my twenty seven years on this. I'm John look like ole witch lost of fat with the bail. And he went to mount Manny house, and that's when I my husband dead. Said the young William hatfill was so strong and fears that he could take on the devil himself, which is supposedly where his devil nickname may have come from another room regarding his nickname is revolves around him fighting off a mountain lines of bare hands as youth tougher than devil. Eighteen sixty one devil Hatfield a married. A LeVine shaven daughter of neighboring farmer and right after marrying her off to civil war. He goes fighting on the side of the confederacy. He ended up a local confederacies confederacy supporting militia known as the Logan Wildcats with his uncle Jim Vance Jim known locally crazy Jim after the war ended Hatfield settled down with vic- turned to farming cutting timber buying real estate heaven bear cubs for pets seriously and pumping out thirteen kits that I asked I tell don't tell you spill your seat us out of me pregnant, again, you bastard, I have any more babies I'm just gonna let him fall out to push fall out of my poll woman, hold it won't. Close baby's going to fall out whilst I'm walking over to spit on your grave ambitious aggressive had field created one of the most successful timber businesses in the area vigorously defendant, eventually taken a man to court because he reportedly cut timber from Hatfield, Lance. This man was Perry Cline? He'll factor in today's tale had failed won his suit against Perry. Cline perry. Cline would later. Bring national attention to the feud Perry Cline, the relative by marriage, and friend, and then attorney to the McCoy's Randolph. Randall McCoy Devlin's future nemesis core victory. Devlin's had over Perry. Ended up giving the devil five thousand acres of Perry's land making him one of the biggest if not the biggest landowners in the valley. So that's Dev. Lance powerful landowner, especially for this for this area. Important patriarch of the Hatfield side of the food and toughest shit. You know, maybe maybe he did fight off mount line when he was a kid, maybe he didn't. But by the end of the story. He'll he'll seem like a man capable of doing that. So it's talking about his nemesis. Randall McCoy headed a dog vote. Oh, born Randolph McCoy eighteen twenty five. And by the way, getting confused. They were never referred to as doc vogue and hog folk. That's my little thing. I'm run with it the rest of the suck. But I want you to ever be talking to somebody and think. Yeah. Yeah. There was dog born Randolph coin eighteen twenty five in the tug Rivoli Randall later, sometimes known as old Randall born fourteen years prior to devil. He's one of thirteen kids because apparently back then you had to have at least thirteen kids. Thank you, scientists for birth control. Thank you for the sect Amies. Thank you for dismantling, my balls, preventing me from from place in the curse of having far too many kids upon myself. Mccoy grew up in poverty, his Father Daniel had little interest in work. So as mother Margaret had struggled to care for feed and clothe the family eighteen forty nine McCoy, married. His first cousin Sarah Sally McCoy, doc, folk Mirren dog folk on won't do know. How haven't hall folktales the bloodlines like, mama anto? Daddy, grandpa uncle don't poke you'll flesh inside. No one who went kin. Bending ding, dang mingling. Dane. Dilling dang bang building. Bang bang bang to be fair as we have learned before. Marrying? Cousins wasn't just some hillbilly thing. Royals often would cousins even Einstein Mary his first if you'll actually recall Einstein, Elsa, Einstein Albert's his second wife. Oh, it was our first cousin on his mother's side and second cousin on his father's side double cousins. So I guess what? I'm trying to say is random coy was probably genius Sally haired land from her father a few years after they married Luggy for Randall, and they settled on this three hundred acre spread in pike county Kentucky where they had seventeen kids together. Seven teen kits before eventually Sally wised up and put a mouse trap inside her vagina. Oh, damn you scheming woman. You broke my damn Pekka. You damn near snap it in to your mouse trap, which trickery. I'm honestly surprised at anal sex wasn't way more popular back then like like, maybe initially in your marriage as as lady a lady of the tug valley, you don't have any interest anal sex. But then I think like after the twelfth kid, I would think you'd consider it. I'm surprised more women were just like, okay. Okay. If you if you have to keep putting that somewhere, you put it back there, you put it you put my back Dover Jonah, you know, but but if nine minutes later, I'll give birth to some, but baby Damon, I will kill you random car. I meant to say nine minutes, I feel like the Jess station period for a demon. But baby would be shorter than for a human baby. Anyway, about bud babies war. It's never enough actually about bugbears. I could talk about all day long during the civil war, though, McCoy served as a soldier for the confederacy as well. He may have actually served in that same local malicious Deva lances later nemesis. While most of the McCoy's supported the confederacy Reynolds brother as. A Harmon McCoy fought for the union side. And this is important to note because his death would kind of be the start of the future would at least, you know, get brought up later as far as some bad blood as because as a returned home. He hit on a cave. He's ostracized from his community for support in the union. But he couldn't hide, you know, forever. Eighteen sixty five he was shot and killed by someone who objected to his union sympathies is what is believed. It's thought that either Deva Lance Hatfield or his fellow confederate leader. And crazy uncle crazy. Jim Vance murdered this McCoy for for being essentially a union sympathizer. And even though as Harmon had been ostracized from the McCoy family. You know, some sort inside just killing again was the start of the bad blood. Because even though they're not speaking to him. He is still family. Okay. So now a little bit about background rural area back with Justice as a norm clans or the norm poverty is ripe. Ignorance is rampant. Two large families. You know, they've been they've been kicking shit done kids in the tug revealing for generations one in the Kentucky side of the river. One in the West Virginia side, petty normal rivalries between the two probably have been going on for years, and then devil Anse, you know, Hatfield taking a McCoy relation to court for logging on his land, and he won. So it got some land from the McCoy's and roundabout way, then Hatfield relations rumored to have killed him. Aucoin eighteen sixty five for being a union sympathizer. Bad blood starting to develop thirteen years after the death of as Harmon McCoy the feud begins internist with of all things the theft of a hog. So let's hop today's times I've timeline right after an important word from today's I sponsor the let's get right into time's up being brought to you today. One. Again, by the whole air banjo academy the whole air banjo kademi is sponsoring the first annual tug Rivoli bluegrass festival. The entire month of August. Two thousand nineteen the festival will feature performances from legendary air banjo bluegrass group, the piney plumbers, bang, bang bang. Bring thing naming Mangan leaning, bang, bang, mailing, Bing, Bing, Bing, Bing, Bing, Bing Ling. Ding. Ding, ding. The festival will also feature performances from. Nirvana bluegrass tribute band, air never mind. Bring bring bring bang bang, bang, bang, bang bang. Manning running adding bring main rank thank thank thing. Ring bang bang. Thank thank thank thing. And then headlining festival, of course is air banjo. Triple in budding burdening didn't thank thank thank thank. Brang burning. Thank thank Bank Bank Bank. Thank dang bang Bank. 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In autumn of eighteen seventy eight Ronald McCoy leader of the McCoy's visiting Floyd Hatfield cousin Debbie lands at his farm, and they're Randall claimed he saw hog bearing the earmark of McCoy penned up with the Hatfield animals who I see what you doing Randall, notoriously hot tempered, immediately cues Floyd Hatfield of cedar one of his animals files, a formal suit for the hogs recovery. With Reverend Anderson Hatfield, the local Justice of the peace enemy who happens to be devil answers. First cousin. The matter goes to trial in an attempt to keep the verdict. Fair. Anderson had fields jury made up a six hatfields and six McCoy's. Then Bill Stanton nephew of Randall McCoy brother of Sarah Stanton, who was the wife of Ellison Hatfield, sister-in-law Deva. Lance testified that the hogging question did indeed bear Hatfield, Mark. And he said he'd per- personally personally witnessed Floyd Hatfield applying that Mark and damn conflicting family loyalties old at he didn't know which way he didn't know which way to. To to which side to be on this dock vote is supposed to marry how folk now you've got some men connected. Both families bound to piss off kin one side another his full mouth. Surprise verdict. The jury found fully healed innocent of any wrongdoing because Selkirk McCoy cousin Randall apparently gave the swing vote for innocence. Who you don't did? Now, you would trade you'll bloodline. The McCoy's were outraged the verdict subsequently ostracized Selkirk from the family. He's out now is a traitor for supporting the hatfields in this decision. And then he would just be aligned with the Hatfield clan in the future. I mean, these people were serious about man, like so clannish, you know, you fight on which side of the civil war that our families decided to fight you testify only on our behalf. Always you don't you'll find out later. You know, in the story date anybody from that aside, you do any of those things you're fucking out for life. You're out of that is still hardcore. I'll never understand like that. Like people don't like in the world. But if Roe got involved with them, I wouldn't be like you make decision now. You'll with the comments clay, and you told me for Allah people do that all the time back then. Okay. So selkirk. Yeah. He broke one of the first rule speed in clan. Testified testified against kind. In the months following the hog trail hawks witness Bill Stanton. Now he's harassed and threatened by the mccoys for testifying on behalf of Floyd. Remember, he's you know, vaguely related to the McCoy's. But there like man you testified against us. You couldn't keep your mouth shuts. Now, there's like crazy confrontations between him and various McCoy's it included gunfire. You know, he's once once in a while just riding around through the valley getting fucking shot at because you opened his mouth about a hog. But no serious harm was done. Initially. Just just gotta boy as being valuable us just showed one another. That's how settled disagreements until eventually a chance encounter between Bill Stanton. Salmon, Paris McCoy brothers of old Randall McCoy leads to a shootout ending in the serious wounding of Peres McCoy and in the murder of Bill stance. Now, he gets killed for open his mouth about the hulk you try to testify now you try to testify cast Kim from hail you feel stooge. Sam Koi stands trial for Stanton's murder and other the evidence and judicial system seem very stacked against him. It seems very obviously he did this. And also, you know, Deva lands owned brother Valentine Hatfield. Now, the judge this trouser cousin preside first cousin preside in the last trial over last row. Now, he's now his brother is presiding judge in this trial, but still Sam found not guilty by reason of self defense and some story and things decision was handed down per the explicit instructions of Deva lands to defuse tension between the two families to prevent further. Violence. You know, it's like, yes. Yes. You know? He okay. One of our conned was killed but Conde provoke him. Let's stop it. Now, let's get back to making a timber money. Wellspring eighteen eighty some forbidden hog folk dog folk romance is the feud going again ED's ED's actually a whole heap. Afa to the whole whole he fuel to the fire pike county Helder local elections at the home of Jerry Hatfield. That's bring not not sure how Jerry is related devil ends. There was fucking billion Hatfield mccoys in this tale. And you know, the the articles about all these different situations. Don't always talk about how like some random person was to the next. They had the same last name guessing his cousin of some sort. So yeah. So the host the election to the home of Jerry, Hatfield him hosting election. Shindig seems to be his only contribution to the legends fuse natives and come up again, and it was common for for the home of a wealthy person to be used as a local polling place. Elections were big social events more social than they were political as this time in this area. Women make all kinds of food and refreshments candidates would supply ample amounts of whiskey both of legal whiskey end of the moonshine variety. Both the hatfields and the mccoys were fond of making moonshine John's e Hatfield one Devlin's. The son was big moonshine maker NIA. People would come out early the men would votes and then on the fan would spend an entire day socializing with your peers on this election day, the West Virginia hatfields also come over to pike county. Kentucky can visit France drinks. Chad devil Anse himself shows up with his sons, John z and cap, and it was during the course today, the John's e an Tores local, ladies man meets rose, Anna McCoy daughter of ole random coin considered to be one of the most beautiful girls in the county. Oh shit. Got got a classic backwards Romeo and Juliet situation kicking off. Now stock crossed is John's Montague pursue an Rosanna Capulet didn't end well for Romeo, and Juliet and their families, and you can imagine will not end well here done clear, exactly what transpired between them. But after spend the day together, they disappear for the party for a good amount of time. Only returning at dusk. Some guessing they did strongly guessing they did hailers fana- say Vegas. Odds says that Hatfield penis shit car. I know Hanes with the mcco of Jonah that day. Doubt. They took off into the woods, you know, to get away from the wedding party for hours to play a secret game of chess or to do some some catfish fishing Rosanna was anxious at the face in her dad after disappeared with the Hatfield boy for hours, especially. Yeah. She's she's own wit virgin. And she may she may have tainted tainted his with Hatfield boy. So instead of return to her family home. She goes back to the hatfields goes back to West Virginia spends night there and then Jonty expresses his desire to marry Rosanna. Endeavour lands forbids it he's not having it. He's furious. And then we're gets back to rent a McCoy. He's furious as well as half the boss told him his family's Ana Randolph. Ran Lieven sent the three was other daughters to retrieve Rosanna initially. But then she defied her family's wishes remained with the hassles for several months seems she only left when it became clear that Johnny had no real intention of marrying her because his family forbid is what most stories think other historians attributed to Johnny being in the Tories playboy despite the strong objection. Both families John's e continues to court Rosanna at the house of her aunt, Betty Blankenship, mcquaid Kentucky after she returns to Kentucky, you know, and raising the McCoy's further. Also, it's possible there. There's no official documentation of this. But some historians think that Rosanna became pregnant with John's baby. A rental three of his sons, they ambush Johnny and Rosanna one night during one of their little lovers. Get togethers going to teach John z lesson Rosanna fearing that her dad is going to kill Jonny borrows, a horse from a neighbor rides to West Virginia to tell the hatfields. What's going on doesn't want her her dad to kill the man? She loves Dev lands. His son cap is brothers Ellison and Elias along with Jim Vance crazy, Jim and family, friends, Tom Chambers and Moses Christian right off to reclaim John's e and they overtake them 'cause rescue Johnny without any violence at this time. This does Mark the end of the relationship between John and Rosanna and also marks the end of Roseanne is relationship with her father Randall who now completely disowns her. Oh, E Jones aware fall out. Del John's e did not follow in refuse on name. If that will not be but swollen my love. And I'll Longo be a dog folk Makola, shall I hear more she'll speak at this. Tis. But that name that is my enemy, thou all self thou. Not to hulk folk Hatfield stock. Cross loves bang bang. Bang bang, bang, bang, middling wing, dangling thing. Despite trouble. Jonty not quite done chasing McCoy women. Don't Rosanna, but he's gonna go after another McCoy. Now this dude he ends up having a quick courtship. And then marrying Nancy McCoy who is rose and his cousin daughter of the previously murdered as a Harmon McCoy that guy that union sympathizer. And they get married on may fourteenth eighteen eighty one and so many so many constant interconnections here, and I'm gonna repeat family like how the related because if not this story gets real fucking confusing real fast Harmon again the union soldier disowned by the McCoy family. Rumored to have been killed by Jim Vance rumor driven Kilmore, the devil and himself. And now that guy's daughter is marrying, the devil is son. Now, if if you wonder why John Zee would be so foolish to be fair to him. There was not a tremendous amount of single women in the area even less that weren't closely related to him. Well, cousin love and clearly forbidden also not necessarily first choice. So so maybe he kept chasing McCoy women because there just weren't that many other options or going back to education levels in area. Maybe he really was just fucking dumb. Despite all this romantic drama things settle down following Jones wedding for little over a year. Nancy's brother Jeff is frequently crossing into us Virginia now to visit his sister and her Hatfield family for a while without issue, the hatfields spending these amount of time impound pike county with no trouble. No, big trouble. And then the relative peace will end on another election day, August, seventh eighteen eighty two this election also held at the home of a Jerry Hatfield. So I guess he I guess he reappears in the story is. His house is used to get the West Virginia hatfields again cross the river to visit their family and enjoy the festivities among the West Virginia contingent. This time is Devlin's his brother, Ellison and Elias and their cousin another Elias, bad Hatfield, bad lies, endeavour, Lance. You don't get nicknames like that for being the friendliest? Most hospitable fellas in the region owner, how many other like, you know, bad Hatfield nicknames have been lost to history. I wish I had a whole list of all of them. I'm David Ames and is my cousin bad last and this mild. This is my other Candice. My uncle crazy GM this. This is my brother here, this is evil. Ellison. This my nephew here. This is strangling Sam I'd also like to introduce you to my second. Cousin? Terrible. Timid my second cousin once remove this is rape. And Ricky don't stand too close to him. This is my brother throat punching Paul keep you on him as well. He's troublesome. He's is my third cousin twice removed. Scoop with the rush to spoon eat it in front of you pop Lago. Rob grape in between his taste Terrence. And he insists I will account emphasize enough. He insists on being addressed by his full nickname. You will say it in its entirety. Oh, he will display to you. Exactly. How he got that nickname? Yeah. Anyway, as the nickname suggests bad less had a reputation for his hot temper, bad disposition after long day, drinking this election party. One one old rannells many sons Tolbert McCoy accuses bad lies of own him and outstanding debt for a fiddle. Of course, as fiddle only thing, it would be a banjo this story, which bad lies vehemently denies argument breaks out quickly settled by bad. Lies is more even tempered brother deacon Anderson Hatfield that judge despite efforts to keep the peace arguments continue throughout the day until a passing comment from Ellison to Tolbert sparks another fight right now, we got Hatfield McCoy fight happened. A little fistfight starts off as a fistfight. And then Tolbert takes out a knife attacks within slashes with his stomach. These people are fucking animals knife to the stomach over a possible fiddle debt as about the most backwards type, squalor I've ever heard of damn you saving Hoffa. I done told you I get my fiddle Nichols. Wrapping up your Dame hall goods. I will spill you'll feel goods all over this. If you don't give them fatal Nichols. Elson fights back to of Tolbert's brothers. Join in now three on one. Ellison's being attacked by three McCoy's. I'm sure everyone just sitting around laughing watching this drink moonshine. Ellison grabs a rock to defend himself and ends up getting stabbed twenty six times twenty six times. And then it's finished off when Fara McCoy shoots him in the back farmer. Another son of old Randall so should ask relates big time. Now, allies bad lies Hatfield, grabs a gun tries to return fire shoots at McCoy, brother. But they take off into the woods. Can't can't get a shot off. Can't get an effective shot off. Then they get captured. Shortly thereafter, by two justices of the peace. Joseph and Tolbert Hatfield and constable Matthew Hatfield, so many fucking feels feels like there was about a thousand hatfields the tug valley the bullet wounds. Ellison gravely does not does not kill him right away. And he's taken to a friend's home. The western half fields notified of this. Alz Valentine wall. Hatfield Ellison's, brother. Assembles a posse to head to Kentucky the next day. Find those dog folk McCoy's exact some righteous vengeance upon them the following day. And August eighth the Hatfield pasta on the way to receives words McCoy brothers have been arrested by local authorities. So just confusing to me. Yeah. So I guess he's just as the piece where where related to them man, and I have gone over this so many times to try and separate the families. There's anyway, I guess what's important in this segment of the tail is whether or not these these these local law officers were hatfields or not local officers get him. But then some some hatfields possibly some other hatfields think like no we don't want this to go to the court. They form a posse. They get these three McCoy San's in some vigilante kind of take down. Right. And then they take them back to one of their homes. So they take take us the of them. They have them in West Virginia. They put him in an abandoned log schoolhouse. They're real under under armed guard and that night, Randall's wife, the boy's mother Serra McCoy her daughter-in-law Mary butcher arrive. Beg to see their kin Deva Lance relents the women get to spend. A fair amount of time with them co-boys, supposedly Sarah pleads with devil Anse not to kill her sons, he promises her he will return them to Kentucky soil alive, but then the following day, August, ninth devil and his brother. Ellison dies endeavor, Lance enraged, he's grieving he decides he is not going to return service boys to her not after killing his brother. She returns again to see her son. She is denied, and then the McCoy prisoners are bound and March to the tug fork where they crossed the river there returned to Kentucky soil where the hatfields some had time to some bushes. Cross the creek DO back to the West Virginia side, and then from across the creek opened fire on the bound prisoners fire. Well over fifty shots there. They're, you know, very dead. The bodies of Tolbert farmer and bud McCoy then discovered on the riverbank next day by relative. Yeah. If any of these points, I have to do a little bit wait what? There's there's a a lot of a lot of tales out there about these guys. And it's a very fusing tail even when you do it down to the truth. And yeah, takes a lot of like, wait what have to be very clear. What what am I saying now? So if you're keeping track let's do a recap because this shit is getting confusing. If you're keeping track of significant hostilities, let's go over the important points before we move forward in this tale as a in McCoy thought to have been killed by some hatfields likely by either Deva, Lance or crazy Jim Vance in eighteen sixty five and as a Harmon McCoy is Renell McCoy old Randall head of the McCoy clan. It's his brother the brother that was ostracized by the family for being a unit soldier. That's eighteen sixty five eighteen seventy eight Randall McCoy accuses Floyd Hatfield cousin of devil Anse of stealing one of his hogs Floyd found innocent. But the trial may not have been that fair. Shootout over the hog dispute. A few months later leads to Paris McCoy. Son of renovating wounded and Bill Stanton, relative of both the hatfields and the mccoys, but a man closer in community ties to that feels getting killed himself in eighteen eighty John's e Hatfield one of Devon's is sons hooks up in the woods with rose Anna McCoy one of Randall's daughters. Ran will end up his own in her over the romance eighteen eighty one Johnny Hatfield courts in Mary's rose. And as cousin Nancy McCoy daughter of the just previously mentioned as Harmon McCoy eighteen eighty two three McCoy, stab and shoot devil ends as brother. Ellison Hatfield posse forms leading to the to three of Randall's nine Suns Tolbert farmer bud McCoy getting executed in a display of Hatfield vigilante Justice. So so far it seems that random McCoy's getting the shittiest end of the feud stick by far his brother as Harmon. Likely killed by Hatfield possibly by Deva. Lance other brother Paris wounded in a gunfight. His daughter has. Okay. Yeah. My god. I have to count to keep this my head. Yes. Another Paris McCoy. Yes. Wounded minute gunfight his daughter her reputation soiled by an unmarried carnal union with the son of Deva lands. His nephew Bill Stanton killed in a shootout with hatfields three of his sons killed by vigilante posse led by devil. Lance, brother. Nephew three sons killed a daughter and niece seduced by Hatfield five dead. One wounded to virginity taken. Meanwhile, Deva Lance has lost one brother and his clan has been accused of stealing a hawk so very lopsided. Hong folk hatfields way up dog folk McCoy's through the summer of eighteen eighty two. Okay. August tenth age eighty two both Ellison Hatfield and his now dead McCoy, brother. Murderers are buried shortly thereafter, judge, George Brown of pike county Kentucky convened a grand jury to determine the identities of the killers of McCoy. Brothers as for ten days of deliberation. The jury with neither Hatfield Norma Koi on it. Returns indictments against twenty men, including Deva, Lance, his brothers wall and Elias his sons cap and Johnny a number of other well now Hatfield supporters and that and that those three murders just would keep coming up like the the legal repercussions. Keep this going for a long time because you know, they're just continually not brought to Justice despite the indictments no arrests were made in the murder of the McCoy sons in the four years afterwards. Mateen eighty to eighty six and that goes back to what we said earlier about you know, states being very reluctant to to pursue supposed- fugitives of Justice and other states, the Hatfield mccoys would occasionally take a little potshots at one another during this time. So the food still on they shoot each other from time to time. But no one's killed members of both families do continue to cross back and forth over the state line between Kentucky and West Virginia. Deva lands involvement with the feud less. Since his son capstein kind of takes the reins as the leader of the Hatfield clan. At least in terms of their conflict with McCoy's all random Koi, still bent on vengeance in the death of his sons, he hires an attorney he's related to by marriage. That man Perry Cline that guy that, you know, got acres from way back when rep and he and he hires Perry to represent the McCoy family and their quest for Justice Perry. Cline brother-in-law of the murdered Harmon McCoy Reynolds brother in equally has a personal vendetta as well against the hatfields at some point during the time period things start to go wrong in the marriage of Nancy McCoy in John's e Hatfield apparently Nancy was a notorious gossip who found the details of the feud fascinating. Yeah. Why of course, she did. She and her Sister, Mary Daniels frequently discussed the details the feud this convinced the head feels that she was a spy or the I guess both of them were spy her sister. And that they're informing. Hatfield secrets to the McCoy's not trust into women's husbands to punish them accordingly for this. This is insane cap Hatfield again when a devil and sons and Tom Wallace, a hassle support burst into Mary's home one night, hold her husband gun point. And then lash I Mary than her daughter with a cow's tail just whip 'em like a couple of mules again is people fucking savage cap. And Tom Wallace warned the women to stay at home mind their own business going forward. Neither do the story of the assault rapidly circulates throughout community. Sometime in the fall of eighteen eighty six Nancy Mary's brother, Jeff McCoy stabs, and then shoots pike county mail carrier named Fred Wolford, Jeff is Johnny hatfields. Wife's brother son of as a Harmon McCoy. Jeff flees Kentucky to Nancy Thome investor Geneva hide out from the law, and there he learns about Mary and her daughter getting whipped by cap Hatfield. Tom Wallace, Jeff is outraged. Huff Oto whip no dog folk he decided to punish Hatfield associate Tom Wallis. Maybe a little bit hesitant to to go after cap Hatfield directly will Jeff along with an accomplice named Josiah Hurley, they wait until cap is out at his house, then kidnapped Tom Wallace take him to jail in pie feel Kentucky. However, Tom Wallace manages to escape and return to caps house. Jeff chose area catch up to him. But after a short confrontation, they give up and then when cap learns about the assault on his home and Wallace being taken. He files a complaint with local Justice of the peace his relation. Who issues warrants for the arrest at points Kappa special constable, how convenient he gets become officer. You know, so that he can serve the warrants himself. So now he gets to go after McCoy somewhat legally quasi illegally. And he does arrest Jeff McCoy Josie Hurley, but then Jeff escapes, quote unquote, during transport to county jail dives into the tug fork tries to swim back to Kentucky. He does make the riverbank or then captures shoots in from across the river, and he dies. So another McCoy a nephew of all rantel has been shot and killed by a Hatfield hog folk still still way up in this food. All right in the wake of yet. Another killing Deva Lance tries to soothe the the bad blood between the two families on December twenty six eighteen eighty six day of Christmas, Devlin's writes, a letter to McCoy attorney Perry Cline, assuring him to the hatfields. We're very sorry for all the trouble. He would have prevented the violence if he could have and not surprisingly the feud continues. I feel like we've gone way past the point of an apology letter to clean everything up right now. Right. Just dearest random coop opera. Few Slee apologize for the death of another one of you'll feel the dog full kin on know that the past few years have been hard on you with us hatfields continually whooping Apollon you McCaw so so severely in so consistently sometimes I'll lopsided feud. Looks like a big strong man fatten Atanas sickly baby must be hard to think about how how it'll took three. You'll boys to bring my brother down. And then you'll boys will within killed, you know, soon full that. He'll yo Dada Roseanne is still unwitted that's a pity. She was so beautiful. And now now it be hard to find the man willing to make meal out of my son Johnny's leftovers any who saw from clan killing another one of your kin, a deepest, condolences devil. Hatfield PS. We did steal. You'll mother fucking hole in not did kill you'll brother as Haman had feels forever. Probably probably a little bit nicer than that one. But it, but it still doesn't end the feud in the spring of eighteen eighty seven Jacob and Larkin McCoy sons of as Harmon nephews of all rantel brothers to Mansi marriage. Jeff God, dang, man. I feel like I need to have one of those detective things like like in their in their war room where they have like all the different people on the wall. And then just lots of fucking string connecting everybody. Spring eights ninety seven Jacob look at McCoy sons of as a Harmon nephews of rental Brotherston, Nancy Marion Jeff cross the river into West Virginia to capture cap Hatfield and Tom Wallis for the murder of their brother. Jeff, the only managed apprehend. Tom Wallace take him to pike county jail after a week of incarceration, he escapes. Of course, people escaped all the time from Joe back. Then we've talked about a lot here in the second. And then a short time later, maybe his escape was convenient to maybe they wanted to let him out to get a vigilante Justice because a short time later, he's found dead in West Virginia. Identity is killer killers does remain unknown. But his death all like all likelihood caused by Jacob Larkin McCoy, either directly or indirectly so small possible victory. Probable victory for the McCoy dock. They didn't kill a Hatfield, but they did kill Hatfield associate in the summer of eighteen eighty seven Simon Bolivar Buckner run on the democratic ticket for governor of Kentucky McCoy family. Attorney Perry Cline reaches out to Buckner. Promises to lend him the political sport of the McCoy clan. Not insubstantial number of people in exchange for his intervention in the various cases and indictments pending against the Hatfield. So he's trying to he's still pissed about that five thousand acres, and he's trying to basically bribe the governor to we'll help you become governor Kentucky. And then you help us squash. These fucking hatfields and Buckner is receptive. The idea and then elected governor of Kentucky in August. Eighteen eighty seven. This is a win for the McCoy's the hatfields understandably concerned about this arrangement. They organized local vigilante group called the Logan county regulators to defend themselves from Kentucky aggression, the regulars right letter to Perry Klein on August twenty ninth eighty seven addressing their concerns about the state of Kentucky's possible interference in the Hatfield cases. This is a real letter this time, not my horse shit, and it does really speak to the power and just the arrogance of the hatfields and the valley, just they're bad. I guess at this time. The name starts off. The letter starts off my name is net. Hatfield, and this is another hatfill were I am unclear. Exactly how he's related to devil. Anse? Not a lot of info on him and nothing no infiltrate find the pertains to his direct relation. Probably another cousin. Get a net rights. I'm not a single individual by good many. And we do not live on toe grid. But we live all over this county. We have been told by men from you'll county that you and you'll men fix into invade this county for the purpose of taking the Hatfield, boys. And now, sir we forty nine in number at present do notify you that if you come into this county to take all bothe- any of the hatfields we will follow you to hill. Otake you'll hard, and if any of the hatfields Kyoto bothered in any way, we will charge it up to you. And you'll hod will pay the penalty we are not bothering you need all the hatfields. And as long as you keep your hands off Logan county men, we will not do anything. But if you don't keep your hands off all men there. There is not one of you will be lift in six months. There is present at this time forty nine of the men who regulated matters at this place is short time ago, and we can get as many as we need in six Alice. We have a habit of making one host loyals keep their boots on. And we have plenty of good strong rope left and all hangman tattoo, not full you. And laid it quietly away until we see what you do. We have no particular pleasure in hanging dolls. But we know you have counted the miles and mocked the tree at dog reference. Israel, by the way, dog woke I made that part up, but they were calling dogs, man. That is a very very threatening letter. Yeah. If you missed out any part of that he is in no uncertain terms. Letting the McCoy family turning fuck with us in any way, we will hang you till you are fucking dead, and we will wipe out the McCoy clan. Perry Cline Wisey does not take this letter to these orgies until the autumn of eighteen eighty seven had McCoy feud, essentially as limited to the families little intervention with authorities and either piker Logan counties. Not a lot of big advance transpiring. But then with the election of governor Buckner the few becomes embroiled in state, politics and this push the feud into its most violent period governor Buckner keeps his promise to Perry. Cline intervene in the case against the hatchets. Despite the letter the governor's. Still try to pursue some kind of Justice against the hatfields September tenth eighteen eighty seven. He makes a formal requisition to West Virginia. Governor Emmanuel Wilson, Willis Wilson. That's unfortunate. Name governor Emanuel Willis Wilson. Oh, what is Wilson? Oh wheel of the extradition of devil and nineteen others to Kentucky to answer charges of Randall Randolph. Three sons being killed way back in eighteen eighty two there, you know, these these still insistent on Justice for that on September thirtieth. Governor Wilson denies the request on the basis of missing affidavit from pike county authorities on on October thirteenth governor Buckner then sends the David west Virginia's governor Wilson is not a stupid, man. He takes his time responding to Kentucky on November twenty first. He finally does right back to to the Kentucky governor stating that he will. He will or the requisition for all the parties named except for lies Hatfield, Andrew Varney. He said neither had satisfactory satisfactorily demonstrate. That they were involved in the murders. Perry cline. Then does despite that letter that he got an earlier does have been bench warrants issued. Then on December twelve I arrest is made so Kirk McCoy that deciding juror back in that hog case is arrested is jailed the next day Klein sends an amended requisition to governor Wilson request only warrants for Deva lands. Johnny cap Daniel Whitten album McCoy. Son of soak so McCoy who's on the Hatfield side, Perry Cline urges governor Buckner to induce. The state of Kentucky to offer large monetary reward for the capture in the arrest of the West Virginia hatfields, and then Perry climates amazing. He didn't die in this tale Perry. Cline extorts money two hundred twenty five bucks. From some of the hatfields promising to use that money to bribe the Kentucky governor Buckner to withdraw. You know, the the warrants and multiple witnesses confirm this arrangement, including attorneys AJ Ocsar, James your could both in present at a meeting between Johnny and and Perry Cline, December eighteen eighty seven. When the deal was made despite learning of Klein's double-dealing Kentucky governor Buckner determined to end the feud December eighteen eighty seven he addresses, the state legislature in Kentucky condemning the feuds condemning the feud assists and the violence. He says the law abiding character of the people of Kentucky estimated by others in a great measure, not from the general disposition of its citizens to obey the law. Ause, but from the violent conduct of comparatively a few lawler's individuals if from neglect or inefficiency, we failed to repress this lawlessness bring the offenders to Justice, we have no right to complain to the false estimation in which we held by people of other states. So you know, what he's saying here is, you know, I'm sick of Kentucky being looked at a bunch of fucking backwoods hillbillies as an entire states because the actions of this one family feud with other family and then in private he probably said Daniel's inferno hillbillies. I wish the grid. Value would spend wide open enough to unlatch a polar to hail safe and pull both how folk and dog folk into its tuna flames. The Hatfield see governor Bucknor's headlines hardline stance me on the feud as both a personal threat. Also as an insult, I guess they also see evidence that the McCoy's are using political actions in the state to pursue them justly despite their warnings. And then later the hatfields hold a council. And decide the only way to end their persecution was to eliminate the head of the snake. Eliminate random coy and all the members of his family who might testify against them. If they were brought to trial and pike, and they were kidding about. That letter earlier Perry fails to take it seriously Perry Cline, the McCoy's failed seriously. And they're like, all right. You guys aren't gonna leave us alone. We're gonna fuck come after you now like really come after you all of the men, including Jim Vance cap, Johnny tomb chambers. All everybody agrees to the plan to go after the McCoy, except possibly Deva Lancy may or may not have. Agreed. He was he was sick. At the time uses bad hells as an excuse not to take part in their plan and leadership falls to Jim Vance many things that didn't want what's about to happen to happen. At least not in the way, it's going to. So it's so it's own its own now. So now in the most cold blooded event of the feud so far Jim Vance along with cap. Johnny bobbly Elliott Hatfield son of Ellison tomb chambers. Ellison mounts who is the the bastard son of Deva Lance's brother who was stabbed and shot earlier in the story. Charles, Gillespie, French dock Ellis. They launch a midnight attack on the McCoy household New Year's day eighteen eighty eight so have a New Year's McCullough the hatfields just own been surrounded. You'll for years just hold onto a ship Natal Yukon, the Voltaire ex you caught in a Brown off the half Fieldstone under the cover of darkness, the hatfill surround the house demand the McCoy meant surrender ole Randall in his son Calvin refused. They take up defensive positions inside the house against orders to hold fire. Johnny start shoot into the house in the ensuing. Gunbattle crazy, Jim Vance, Tom Chambers. Set fire to the house of one Randall McCoy's young daughters, Allah fair shot. As she opened the kitchen door to try to get out of a burning house, by the way, if you have seen the history channel hatha McCoy mini series drama, which is excellent is historically accurate for the most part. She was not a young child as she was portrayed in that in that docu series. She sears. She was she's twenty nine possibly even thirty have sources say one have said the other. So she gets shot coming out of the burn house. And then her mother Sarah McCoy goes to try to aid her dying daughter. And then Jim Vance strikes her repeatedly with the butt of his rifle despite her injuries. She continues to try to help Allah fair and then Jonty. The dude who wanted to be her son-in-law while back in this tale pistol whips the fucking shit out of her to a point. She will never mentally recover, man. Johnny pistol whipping the mother of the woman he dated for months supposedly wanted to pistol up in the aunt of his current wife. The fire spreads Calvin McCoy tries to make a run for the some corn. He gets shot. Wanna rental sons? Oh, Randall he's able to escape into the woods at this point, the Hatfield party realizes not only had they failed at their plan to to kill Randall. They'd made their situation far worse it escalated in shit that they probably in a way, they probably not imagine both Calvin Allah, fair dead. So two more two more Randall McCoy's kids five of its kids. Now have been killed this feud Sarah, his wife gravely wounded with the broken arm, broken hip and crushed skull. Yeah. And she would be brain damaged for the rest of her life. Most of the property was also destroyed forcing Randall to move in with his remaining family in the pike Ville, home of Perry Cline there. The formerly disowned daughter Rosanna goes over and takes care of her beaten mother. God man, Randall is getting the worst of this view. Holy shit. Hatfields of now. Killed four of sons one of his daughters. Kill the pair of his nephews beat his wife almost death burned. His fucking house down killed his brother years back. Meanwhile, the only blood kin devil Anse has lost his brother Ellison this few to this point, you know, the midnight attack on the McCoy farm. This is this is the event of first drew national attention to the feud newspapers all over the region running sensationalized headlines about the event feud in general, January eighteen eighty eight Frank Phillips pike county sheriff's deputy official agent of governor Buckner in the Hatfield matter. Ally of the McCoy's assembles a party of twenty seven men to go into West Virginia. And and chase down the hatfields taking the hatfields by surprise Phillips and his posse do capture cap, and they actually kill Jim Vance shooting him in the stomach and then the head so now devil answers lost a second blood kin doubtful. We payback on them. Half oak. Now, kill Dylan's, bro. The AIn he's throughout the first part of January Philipson his men would occasionally cross into West Virginia for more short rates hoping to repeat this excess and taking cap and killing Jim Vance. But then on January nineteenth Philipson his men find themselves at a much bigger conflict, and they expect it in. What would become known as the battle on grapevine creek Phillips eight. Eighteen of his men many of them. Mccoy's find themselves in a fucking battle almost like a military battle with thirteen. Hatfield men who themselves carried a warrant for the arrest for the murders of Jim Vance. So see like this keeps happening. You know? West Virginia's like all right. All right. We didn't like they killed people in our land that we didn't. Okay. You know? So we don't recognize him as laments. And now, you guys it'd be law in so each side has warrants for the other side each side will you know, think that they had the law on their side when they're fighting. This is just crazy during the battler several deaths on each side, none of them directly related to either Deva lands Hatfield random Koi Phillips did capture. A number Hatfield partisans though in the battle, including wall Hatfield, Tom Chambers. Allies Mitchell, Andrew Varney LS McCoy son of Selkirk, Moses, Christian Sam, Mayon, doc, mayhem and pliant. Mayhem in the aftermath of the battle of grapevine creek. West Virginia offers rewards for the capture of Phillips and twenty one members of his posse. You know, the states considering them to be acting legally in Logan county. So this. It's really gotten big now man, this is this is invive in bringing in law men from each side, you know, is causing a battle. You know, you got West Virginia offering rewards for Kentucky law makers. You know, you got, you know, Kentucky offering awards for what are century? Now. A West Virginia law. I would be a back and forth back and forth. Man. I get I get why the stories captured so many people's imagination for so long. I think most of us have had a dispute with a neighbor or very least had a neighbor we really don't care for. But now imagine to kind of under personalizes a little bit. Imagine you have a huge family. You're super close with and that your entire family hates a neighbor and their family, and then basically your family declares war on this neighboring family. And now magin there say like a city county or state line, dividing your properties, and that local law enforcement actually porch. You waging war on your neighbor? And then that local areas law enforcement's support that neighbor war what you back on you got. I mean, I think about this neighbor, Chuck I had that I'd screaming watch a screaming match with before he moved out. Like what if just may instead of yelling him? I just fuck and shot at him. And then didn't get in trouble at least not right away. You know, even though everybody knows about it. And then he shoots back of me. And then I have my dad and some and some cousins come over and just raise fucking house. Have a shootout says house on fire kill couple of relation beat his wife have to death. This really happened with these people they essentially wage war and fellow citizens in the battle rages wherever decade the battle of grapevine creek finally ended the marriage of Johnny hatfill, Nancy McCoy can't believe last as long. Vanc- then returns returned home to her family in Kentucky next and actually marries pike county sheriff's deputy Frank Phillips the man who've been pursuing all the hatfields in West Virginia. This is such a fucking soap opera Mary's the man hunting, her husband and husband's family Mary's the man who sought Justice for the hatfields who'd kill numerous members of her family. How crazy is this shit? Mary's a man whose father and or great uncle or yes, she had married. Skews me the man whose father and or great uncle were rumored to have killed her dad's. She had married the man previously. Johnny who participated in the execution of several of her first cousins remained married to him. You know, when when his family killed her brother remained married to him when he pissed whipped her aunt's participated in in this shootout killed a few more of a first cousins. I can only imagine marital arguments. They had I can't I can't take you continually moping about two cabin Nance. You can't keep dwelling on the path. So let's have a picnic. Enjoy a Sunday down by the river. And well, we talk about John's. Well, we talk about which in my kin you'll crazy ass, dad. Plan. Don't kill a mix. We talk about what my aunt did to deserve your pistol whipping, maybe we could discuss what felt like to burn down my family's home. A what my brother said before you'll kin killed him who killed my daddy. You'll father or you'll ankle all all right? That's enough. I hear you you make a lot of good points. May we shouldn't talk about another. Maybe she just qualification something along those lines. Yeah. How fuck do. They ever get married and stay married around this time Johnny's former lover Roseanna McCoy, she dies of some unknown illness, probably a broken soul oul random Aucoin his wife Sarah lose yet another child. He's people are cursed. Newspapers around the region published accounts of this new battle draw more attention to the feud. The wheeling Intelligencer, declares if if one half of the stories of brutality and motor are true. The case would seem to want the authorities of both states in taking hold in ending the trouble, even if it is necessary to call the state troops into action. So a lot of people getting very sick of this late January pike county judge to buy swagger county attorney Lee Ferguson, personally, visit Kentucky governor Buckner to request. That state troops are indeed deployed to protect by county. But Buckner refuses to do so suggesting instead that local citizen reassemble a militia deal situation. Yeah. Because that's been working out real well, the same time West Virginia delegation from Logan county, but Titians West Virginia governor Wilson. To either provide troops for the county's defense provide them with arms to defend themselves. Both Logan pike county. Officials believed that the situation the tug valley has now gone beyond a mere family blood feud and requires greater intervention on the part of the state and the neither state is willing to provide that the events of January eight aggravates relationship between the governors of West Virginia and Kentucky. Especially in the wake of grapevine creek. A governor Wilson, you know, he resists complying with Kentucky's request for extradition of the hatfields. Instead, he suggested Bo states, send independent agents into Logan pike counties to try to get to the truth of the matter then worked together to suppress violence in the tug valley while this joint investigation is a good idea in theory. It does nothing to resolve the conflict. Bows, investors, come to the same conclusion that the recent spate of violence all the violence that occurs. Mostly as direct result of those indictments against the hatfields for the McCoy sons murder eighteen eighty two five years after the fact the subsequent killing student subsequent kidnapping men, West Virginia by Phillips in his posse. Have incited the violence have continued the violence the results of the join investigation marked the end of cooperation between West Virginia Kentucky and opens a new chapter in the feud one what will take one that will take place primarily in the courts rather than an entire valley. And all although most of the violence is over regarding. By the end of January eighteen eighty eight the legal maneuvering legal dramas just begin and we're gonna get into legal drama right afterward. From today's final sponsor times. Today is brought to you by chicken. 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And also took about five minutes for me, not kidding to set the Eero system up, and I don't I don't think I even used a bunch of profanity which is kind of my norm when setting up technical things so easy so fast. So stop worrying about WI fi upgrade Eero get one hundred dollars off the Eero base unit and two beacons package and a year off euro. Plus when you visit Eero dot com slash time suck and to the code time suck at checkout. That's e r o dot com slash. Time suck code time. Suck at checkout. Now, let's talk about how the preceding years of Hatfield and McCoy violence, but mostly violence. Let's be honest pits Kentucky and West Virginia further against each other takes both states all the way to these prima court February of eighty eight recognizing the governor Buckner not going to budge on his desire to see the Hatfield extradited governor Wilson decides to begin legal proceedings against the state of Kentucky. First Wilson's agent to governor Buckner demanding that the release demanding excuse me, the release of nine prisoner hatfields asserting their arrests at the hands of Phillips acting as the state agent had been legal Buckner refuses to requests. So then Wilson files a writs of habeas corpus on behalf of the Hatfield prisoners on February nineteen eighty eight. The cases presented the US court. Louisville Kentucky the main argument west Virginia's case was Phillips and his crew actions agents of the state of Kentucky had acted illegally when they went into West Virginia to arrest. The hatfields. And this Philipson men were acting as agents on behalf of the state of Kentucky. And because the constitution protects all its citizens against unlawful seizure. The case had become a federal issue used as Gibson lawyer who represented West Virginia in the hatfields in these proceedings also challenges the legitimacy of the warrant since the state of Kentucky had waited five years to pursue the hatfields and only did. So after McCoy attorney Perry Cline, essentially bribed the governor to get involved. The state of Kentucky represented by j Proctor Knott. A former governor refutes the argument that this was a federal case on several points. And also argues that Wilson couldn't file writs of habeas corpus for the prisoners as a state agent or a third party. The judge ultimately found in favor of West Virginia and ordered that all nine prisoner had fields appear in his court on February twentieth for habeas corpus hearing the press Kentucky outraged by this decision. Those in West Virginia. Feel Justice has been done the here and begins on February twenty fifth and after debate by both. Sides court recess until Monday, February twenty seventh during the hearing Kentucky argues that a criminal could not try to escape prosecution by claiming illegality or irregularity of his rest officer Phillips had been acting as a private individual rather than estate agent when he wrested the hatfields and the state was responsible for Phyllis men's actions during the course of the arrest was for genu- argues that the arrest is legal because the prisoners have been held in custody for twelve hours before the legal execution of their warrants and that Phillips had claimed the thorny as a state agent at the time of the arrest a bunch of legal maneuverings March third. The judge delivers his decision he feels that. The case is essentially an argument between the two states and refers the case up to the US supreme court harmful versus doll folk mega sway from the tug river valley old away to the supreme court of the US out. Yeah. Wingding then bang bang. Dang, dang dang thing. Mending mainly main West Virginia governor Wilson appeals a decision on March fifth. The judge GRANDE. Appeal which passes to the US circuit court on April fifth here used as Gibson the lawyer who represented West Virginia in the hatfields again argues that the rest of the hatfields in West Virginia constituted, unlawful seizure, steady of Kentucky Turner form of Kentucky. Governor j Proctor Knott knowledge that the arrests were unlawful but claims that it did matter because they were unlawfully rested in Kentucky and the judge in. The appeals case reaffirmed the decision to send the trout to the US supreme court. So now, April thirteenth eighteen eighty eight lawyers for both West Virginia and Kentucky arrive in Washington DC to present their arguments for the case the arguments begin unable twenty third with Virginia, aka the hatfields lawyer Gibson. Stick is original point the whole series of events from caption, West Virginia through arrested incarceration, Kentucky, continuous constitutes gives me single continuous act by the agents on behalf of the state of Kentucky, Kentucky's attorney AK. The McCoy's attorney not declared that had never been that. It had never been shoot me an issue between the two states, but. Rather between private individuals? And if it had been a state issue West Virginia should have filed US supreme court directly instead of going to the first the district court. He's Christ general opinion was that this was correct. And the West Virginia had made a procedural error old supreme court rules that while the initial arrest and induction the hatfields in West Virginia was on constitutional. There were no grounds for charging Kentucky with wrongdoing to the state of West Virginia. So now Kentucky wins the case. And hatfields are now on the run get you through the hot Fokion. Now, get the feds are gonna be chasing you swan. So now several hatfields are being searched look for to be put on trial for the New Year's attack on the random McCoy's home in the spring of eighteen eighty eight West Virginia thirties take legal measures their own against the men responsible. For the arrests indicting Frank Phillips that Debbie sheriff or. Yeah. Indicting excuse me. Frank fields deputy sheriff John Yates pike county and assorted McCoy's for the murder of Jim Vance. Additionally, the offer substantial rewards for the rest of Philips and other men McCoy men on the run now as well. So. A lot of legal maneuvering for really the same results. You still have Hatfield people being chased by authorities on behalf of Kentucky. And you still have McCoy people now being chased by thorns on behalf of West Virginia by the summer of eighteen eighty eight the rewards offered for the hatfields and Kentucky and the McCoy's in West Virginia had totaled to about eight thousand dollars, which draws the attention of various kinds of detectives from all over the country Pinkerton and others descended on the tug valley with the hopes to get rich by capturing some of these people and collect rewards. On both sides. These these new outliers these new, you know. Detector met with disdain sometimes outright hostility. Most of the wanted had McCoy seek refuge in the mountains. Just hide out until things cool down letting their women and kids at home. You know, let them mind the properties Deva, Lance. He himself moves to remote narrow valley nearest West Virginia. Sorry, I'm saying that name wrong. Two small unincorporated area and Logan county that no one outside of the area gives us single fuck about no one has published any type of pronunciation guide. So if you like actually that's pronounced stare you and seven people care about that. Anyway, devil Anse hides there to protect himself from these new outsiders heave and set up a kind of fortress for his clan. Should they need to flee into the woods to defend themselves? He stocks cabin with water food fuel arms and munition in case of a prolonged siege. Nobody will just just building a backwoods hillbilly castle to hide out and shoot it mccoys or any law Thursday, come to give me kind of goof Mandevu, he truly did that nickname guy was tough shit. Not going to go down without a fight the feud itself does quiet down as guys are not captured this despite a ceasefire the newspapers, they try to, you know, keep the feud Goma publishing stories. Delighting the rest of the nation with details. Unflattering details of Appalachian life and culture, which I get you know, it's kind of exactly what I've done, and I stay a little bit occasionally members of each clan or interviewed the hatfields maintained that they just want nothing, but peace, you know, the McCoy's maintain they just want. Some Justice finally on August twenty fourth eight hundred eighty eight hatfields including cap, Johnny Robert Elliott, Hatfield Elliot's Ellison mounts, French Ellis, Charles Lepe, Gillespie Thomas chambers are indicted for the murder of alad fair McCoy ole Randall's young daughter during the infamous New Year's Eve attack. All those years back on McCoy homestead in the fall of h ninety eight Charles gloves. He's the first man arrested for the attack captured in Virginia on September fifteenth Ellison mounts that illegitimate son of Ellison Hatfield, nephew devil, often called cotton top mounts is arrested before the end of October. Also in the fall of eighteen eighty nine nine Hatfield prisoners end up going on trial for. Eighteen eighty two murders of the McCoy Suns at the end of August aged eighty nine so this those two events the retribution killings of the three sons in the attack on the cabin. They just haven't died still be because no one on the happy side has been punished. Before the trial begins. Ellison cotton top mounts confesses to the role his role in these murders provides testimony recounting the events of August, eighteen eighty two. He name's Dave lands. John z cap Bill. Tom Hatfield, Alex Messner, Tom Chambers is shooters describes the murder of Jeff McCoy as told him by cap. The prosecution presents additional nineteen witnesses, including eight more hatfields. The jury fines wall Hatfield brother of Deva lands. Guilty of murder recommends a sense of life imprisonment while appeals verdict and on September fifth eighteen eighty nine his sense suspended for sixty days while several other defendants are tried Hadfield associate Alex measure, doc, Mayon wall, hatfill son-in-law pliant may and other son-in-law tried simultaneously all found guilty all given licenses. None of these people end up serving as long as maybe were supposed to bastard, Ellison mounts described historical accounts as being dimwitted cotton top mounts. Yeah, basically is intellectually disabled confesses again had confessed that role of Alpher McCoy entered guilty plea, and he is actually sends to death. So sadly, the one person involved in this food who really just mentally is the least responsible this intellectually disabled person is the one sentenced to death. He's held in pike county jail until his execution. The rest of the convicted hatfields transported to Lexington on September fifth all appealed or verdicts, but on November ninth eighty nine the Kentucky court of appeals up holds these convictions and sentences although mounts execution originally scheduled for December third it was postponed until February eighteenth. Authorities Kentucky fully expect to have failed to mount a rescue attempt. But it doesn't happen in the days leading up to the execution large crowds began together and pike Ville to witness the hanging, despite the fact that Publix Kyushu to Kentucky this time for his part. Mount seems resigned to his fate refusing to talk eat receive word from local pastor smoke a cigar refused to speak on the morning, February eighteenth, his death warrant is read before before public executions were legal officials had surrounded the site with the wooden fence or shoot me because they were legal. However, they place the fence at the base of a hill. So that people to sit in the Hilton just look down over the fence actually put a scaffold up there. So people can view the proceedings when asked if he had any final words mount said, he was ready to die. But at the final moment, he did cry out. They made me do it. The hatfields made me do it. And then the public execution of cotton top does seem to finish the feud. They've just hung hanged. I guess sorry. They've just hanged and intellectually disabled man, this low point seems to wake everybody up to the craziness of what all has happened doesn't bring anybody back West Virginia withdraws the rewards for the capture of the McCoy's although charges against the digital hatfields. Do remain outstanding Kentucky such as the charge of murder against devil. Anse for that vigilante execution of those three McCoy boys little is ever done about it on February twenty fourth eighteen ninety one word that the feud is overcome from a member of the Hatfield family in the form of a letter to the press cap at field or cap half. Hield? One of Devon's sons writes, this letters to the Wayne County new sane. I ask your valuable paper for these few lines. A general amnesty has been declared in the famous Hatfield McCoy feud, and I wish to say something of the old in the new do not wish to keep the old few to laugh, and I suppose that everybody locked myself. Is tied of the names of Hatfield McCoy and the border wolf air in Tom of peace. The war spirit in me has abated in. Sincerely, rejoice at the prospect of peace. I've devoted my life to arms we have undergone a fearful loss of noble lives invaluable poverty, valuable property in the struggle. We being like Adam not the first transgresses now propose to rest in a spirit of peace. That's kind of a funny line goes near at the end, though, we'd be like Adam not the first transgressors 'cause they always do that with these apologies in this. Well, how about it? But just record. It was it was those other people's fault regional economics may have also had a hand in the end of the feud by eighteen nineties the region of Appalachia of the brink of an industrial boom, coal number companies are expressing an interest in developing the area. However, these companies had been put off by this air of lawlessness in the region, and this provided further incentive for state officials on both sides them to clean up the racks. Let's let's violence start making some real money. The new. Governor of West Virginia. William a mccorkell saw industry is a way to prevent further violence saying this discord in the mountains was never ending because no new laugh on. No new blood was brought into dispel it. A railway destroys a feud manufacturer area. I know kind of fucking word Manufactory. There's a real word Manufactory absolutely wipes out neighborhood animosity and public improvements. Bring in new conditions. I guess it is meant Manufactory. Bring up any spell red lines and everybody lives happily ever after not quite despite the mutual desire both families in their communities to end, the violence things did not settle down entirely in the valley in ninety the hatfields still had fire in their veins. Check this shit outs man after all this. They're just you know, what was a half field. Always a half hield November eighteen ninety six cap Hatfield in stepson. Joe glenn? Visit the nearby town of mate, Juan West Virginia for winter elections, they encounter John Rutherford. A man who kept shared a little grudge with the two men opened fire soon as I saw one another is Christ's Rutherford is brother-in-law Henderson chambers and Rutherford's nephew all gunned down capping, Glenn or captured tried for murder in April eighteen ninety seven and then cap is found guilty of involuntary manslaughter, and Glenn please the same charge. Both receive one your senses, they they shoot down three dudes over a grudge in broad daylight. And. Out you. All right. You get a year since we don't care for that was civilized now. And then campus caves from jail just three months later, clearly feels still have some in the obviously still corrupt tug river valley political Justice systems. Yeah. And then after a scaping cap resettles in the area somehow doesn't go back to jail, right? Just can't g supposed to be in jail for killing those few men. Nah. I don't I don't. I don't call them. Nothing. Okay. I'll our at my momma stike saw about that camp. I'm mostly when thinking about someone else recently killing several men in broad daylight. I guess I'll leave you be. The following year. Eighteen ninety eight John's e is finally arrested all this time later for his role in the McCoy brothers execution. Eighty two sixteen years later. And also for the his participation in the New Year's day McCoy homestead massacre eighteen eighty eight ten years before he's captured by a posse led by local law men, named Humphrey dock Ellis dock. It must I guess is. There's so many of the same name. That's also it's fucking terribly confused about the trying to figure out tale. So many people have the same God damn name. 'cause there was a guy named dock Ellis who participated in the New Year's day McCoy homes at massacre. I believe this is a different kill us. So. Yeah. So so John's is convicted for participating in both killings. But then he'll soon be free because that's what happened back then also eighteen ninety another son of Deva lands. Johnny's younger brother Elias, m hatfields commits another murder allies too young to be involved in most of the major feud events or even to remember them in eighteen ninety. He was only twenty one years old intelligent had a head for business like his dad like pappy who's well liked like his daddy. Like pappy had a head for business. He wasn't well light like his pappy. 'cause I don't think I don't think you'd call him. We'll light of he also had a hair trigger temper and his brother Johnny is captured all those years later. He swears vengeance on this dock Ella's fella who may be couldn't find anything. But it may be the same guy that did participate in that New Year's day, which makes all the more ridiculous. And that stuff would happen back. Then one guy would be part of a posse involving killing somebody else then years later that guy would somehow become a lawman we'd be like go after capturing and arresting dudes who are part of the. Same fucking posse. He was part of on July fourth h ninety eight at a local independence day celebration dock Ellis, speak speaking or scheduled to speak publicly during the days events that morning, he boards, the train draped in American flags and independence day decorations in the tiny town of Yager West Virginia with intention of heading towards Wilmington or Williamson for the festive occasion along the track. The train makes scheduled whistle-stop at gray yards. Approximately twenty miles east Williamson across the river from place called Skinner's, the same time, the train belching clouds esteem team slows to a stop graveyards allies just happens to be crossing the river has the picket heading to pick up mail to post office, Coleman, Hatfield historian and grandson of Deva, Lance Hatfield later documents events in his own writing, stating the dock Ellis consummate politician intends to step off the locomotive and shake hands with pastures who've preparing to boat as doc Ella steps down to a rough wooden slats between two passenger coaches. He just happens to come face to face with last Hatfield. Who's older standing on the boardwalk talking to travelers? Hello, alas, doc Mona's. He tries to start step the show at temple Hatfield. Hello, doc, allies replies with a wide grin. He places his hand undock shoulder stopping him in mid stride. So doc, you think you can come take me cross Kentucky, easy, as you did my brother after a few tents seconds alas. Decides was not the time or place to get revenge and turns away mumbling you son of a bitch. And he starts speaking with another travel in friend Ajay peril. When all hell breaks loose, doc. Ella shouts. I'll show you who's a son of a bitch as he lunged for the doorway of the passenger grabbed his rifle leveling added last seen was about to take place or seen. What was about to take place peril through his armful pushing allies back which just as doc squeeze the trigger and the Winchester exploded in gunfire travels on the boardwalk dove for cover scattering as gunsmoke build the shot. Just misses Alaska's head and he instinctively pivots while. Job and his Colt. Single action from his belt and returns fire. The shot was definitely next round. Hit a middle cuff link on docks reaced in the forty five bullet ricocheted upward breaking dock Ellis. His neck blood spotted from the entrance wound. Doc, Phil would dit on July twelfth allies turned himself into the Williamson courthouse in his arrested and then jailed on murder charges relating to death of Humphrey. Daca. Plead is self defense before license court case can come to the conclusion to its conclusion his brother cap, second son of devil intercedes. Decides gotta help his baby brother break at a jail and escaped possible. Life in prison or the hangman's noose in the middle of the night on August eighteenth while lies weights and the small cell cap slips through the backstreets Williamson on horseback. Leads large buckskin pony up behind him, according to family lore. Kep carried heavy Riggins with him. And once he arrived the jail he secured one end of a heavy rope cable to a saddle horn. Tie the other to the iron bars covering the jailhouse window, and then just he Spurs his horse in the force Yankee iron bars free, along some chunks of masonry around the window casing, and then, you know, allies pushes some more of your sides Jimmy's out to the opening in the two just fucking takeoff. They flee the mountain state that night bounced around various nearby states for about a year. Then just come home. Well, when allies eventually returns, the mountain state, he's immediately arrested and later convicted for the murder of doc allies, he sent to the West Virginia penitentiary mounds Ville, but as quickly paroled by George W Atkinson governor, the governor of the state in a man with ties to the hatfields tug Ravelli. Of course, Jon also gets off easy. Lieutenant governor of Kentucky. William Pryor thorn, request his request for a pardon. Shortly thereafter, the hatfields still have a little bit of Poland in Kentucky as well. Cap. Ends up becoming a lawyer shortly after that setting up a practice in Logan county, which then would pass onto his son Coleman and his daughter. I lean in the line. An I lean skews me little trivia, it would become the first female attorney, Logan county. I wonder if he used that jailbreak story to win over any clients when you hire kept half, you you oughta get off or you broke out is a half way. The first decades of the twentieth century, the Hatfield mccoys largely steer clear of trouble. They steer clear from a labor rights that would trouble Mingo and Logan counties from nineteen ninety one to nineteen twenty one with the exception of one big part of family lore. When mate Juan chief of police Sydney to gun. Sid Hatfield, it's his nickname. So they still got some fire. He's actually adopted hatfill but half out on the less. He's at the center of the mate Juan massacre, violent confrontation between miners and guards of the Baldwin felts coal mines which nine men are killed had in twenty others. Tried for murder who knows exactly how many Hatfield himself shot before eventually found not guilty and released which doesn't set well certain people later on trial for conspiracy charges nine hundred twenty one to gun sid Hatfield gunned down himself killed on. The McDowell county West Virginia courthouse steps retribution killing most of the other Hatfield mccoys did well and the changing landscape of the tug valley taking on. Professional careers, in fact, in nineteen thirteen Henry jury Hatfield nephew Deva lands elected governor of West Virginia, passing significant social legislation working to settle many of the labor disputes plaguing the region at the time of his election. Seventy three year old Deva lands is still alive. And well, so he gets to see this Kenna his elected governor at living through all the fucking crazy. Feuding Deva lands. This time was a prosperous farmer with money invested in the local coal and timber traits. Randall McCoy still alive in nineteen thirteen not doing as well as devil ans-. No, McCoy's are really kicking ass and state politics or crushing it and local colour or timber either to make ends meet the now eighty seven zero random Koi still working still making money, but working as a ferry operator in pike Ville, he dies on March twenty eighth. Nineteen fourteen. Succumbing to burn injuries. He received after fallen into his own fire fell to a fire. He'd made cooking his homestead tease after all that. He doesn't get to die peaceful death burned up his own fire. Probably trying to cook himself some shitty meal if a long day work in the ferry the guy was cursed his wife Sarah had died twenty four years earlier room to died in the mental hospital. Never fully recovered from that pistol whipping Jones put on her Deva lands died of pneumonia. Seven years later on January six nineteen twenty one. His funeral was the largest ever held in Logan county, his death attracted national media attention, supposedly his last words, were I one fucking one. How come out top dog fo? Yeah. Yeah. Fuck rental McCaw. He didn't phone no file pushed him into the flames. I made with my own mind. I'm the devil, goddamn devil, the devil. Don't die, and I will haunt them cost forever. That's probably not true. But it definitely takes us out of today's time suck time. Good job soldier made it back there. Ooh, that was exhausting. That was an exhausting suck. Hope it got all the the names and places. Right. I rewrote this edited. This talk you to work off of so many times this past week so many relations so many people to keep track of this story. But essentially, I mean, you get the gist just to families not letting shit die for so long. They suck. It really did make me truly truly think about the consequences of just not letting shit slight. Like, I've written a lot of stand up over the years. A lot of stand up comedy essentially about vengeance. Spent? You violent thoughts what I'd like to do to somebody to teach them a lesson for some minor infraction or perceived insults and today reflect on this food. I just think about how maybe that's not always the best way to live. I thought about this this moment I shared on a plane with a stranger a couple years ago long pet peeve of mine about how people are getting off a plane. They don't unders- like some people don't seem to give a shit about. Just etiquette etiquette breaches and general obviously fire me up. But this one in particular is when you know, if you travel, and you don't know this. It's very simple. You let the people out in the row in front of you before you get out. What you don't do is just push your way down the aisle pass people trying to get out of there. Just fucking route. I don't know how people do not understand that. And it's driven me crazy over the years, and sometimes I will just openly like all right, man. That's cool. Just what can do what you wanna do? Don't worry about anybody else in the plane like grouchy moment. I'll just openly say shits once I threw my arm out of the islands. Like, no, that's not how this works. You wait for the people in front of you. And you know, maybe that's not that's not the best way to do things. And then I was bitching about this one time. Openly bitching about someone who just pushed past me and some other people. I I was sitting in first class I fly so much. I get upgrade sometimes can can sweet if you fly a crazy amount every once in a while. Yeah. You get these upgrades for free. And this guy was probably somebody who paid his first class. He was dressed as someone who's probably had a lot of money in my mind, at least seem very successful common poised, and I asked him if he ever just kind of snapped in these people, and and he just kinda looked at me like I was saying, and he goes, no, it's not worth it got too much to lose. And then just didn't talk to any more, and I feel like an idiot. And I just thought you know, what the fuck am. I doing, you know, maybe maybe saying something isn't that big of a deal with maybe I shouldn't do my arm out in the aisle. Because then I was thinking like I thought about what he meant you know, like what you can lose from just overreacting. What if I throw my arm out, and then that causes somebody to push past my arm, and I pushed them like escalate into something physical. And then while it's being sorted out. What if I banned from flying that does that can't happen? That's would seriously fuck my. Career up. What if I I can't exactly drive from lane Idaho to Buffalo New York in time to also have my family here in run this podcast and make it to my next. It's just not feasible to drive the way my kind of two routing ghosts. Or what if we took out to get him further? What if a fight breaks out what if I intentionally actually? Unintentionally intensity end up hurting somebody on a flight becomes it's federal thing. What if I go to fuck prison, you know, lose my career lose a lot of money all because I just couldn't let shit slide. How stupid, you know? It's tough, man. The one hand you don't want to let the world walk all over you. You know, just be a doormat for everybody. But on the other, you know, you gotta think of joy you want to overreact and throw your life away needlessly to escalate a situation, very scary place. A lot of lessons to be learned from this Bill McCoy feud. You know, when did you just cut your losses? Windy, you just walk away. What Fran McCoy had went to the authorities after three sons kill with hatfill posse. I mean, the only reason that posse went after them is because you know, during some stupid fight at an election. His sons had stabbed the shit, and then shot Devlin's brother in cold blood. They weren't innocent. But Randall couldn't let it go. He wanted what he thought was Justice. And it just kept escalating you'll end up getting fucking house burn. Down ended up getting his wife pistol whipped into a mental institution. What's that saying cooler heads, prevail? I think there is some truth to that. It's a lesson. I need to remind myself often or is a lesson that when you're facing a ruthless appoint opponent like Deva lands. Do you need to be more ruthless and things like what if rather than go into your thirties? What a friend of a storm devil devil ends house with his own posse and burn that to the ground. Or would that have just escalated the same way probably is less than to know your limits, you know, should should random choice. Should he have learned that devil Anse was just a superior opponent? That's what it seems like to me dig into the story trying to piss off the many McCoy some who I'm sure looseness podcast, but you know, maybe devil out of rannells league. He had more men more guns more ruthless. Maybe should recognize. He was outmanned. He was out mean, I don't know. I think the lesson you can take away the very least to think about your actions thinking about the consequences of your actions. What reactions could they cause what chain of events? Could. They kick off are the consequences of those. Potential reactions worth the actions, you're choosing to take think before you act. Always a always probably good thing to do. Yeah. Maybe maybe there's some important lesson. Just missing let's find out by checking in with today's idiots of the internet. User fast. The latest news published a video called Hatfield mccoys what really happened on July twelve two thousand thirteen two hundred thirteen thousand seven hundred seventy views hundred seventy five comments the description reads, the nineteenth century rivalry between two Westview new clans has become the most famous family feud in American history. Correspondent Rita braver spoke with the senators from both sides to help navigate the stork battles countless MS and tall tales to find the truth. Yeah. Because there is so many rumors online about stuff, Dr madcap are rights. I have a feeling in today's world McCoy family would all be hooked on meth. Crappy. Yep. Probably possible at the very least, I think actually Metheb use would have been kinder to the McCoy family. The devil lands was. More of an observation than a lesson drawn from his tail, but but an interesting one user Joshua wit posts, a great captain obvious comment typing fucking love when people do this types, the hatfields lived in West Virginia and the mccoys lived in Kentucky. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. Josh. Thank you for writing that in the compensation. Thank you writing for with the narrator just continuously says in the video, why do people do that? That's like watching a trailer for mission impossible road nation and then commenting Tom Cruise Tom Cruise is in this movie or even better this movie called mission impossible rogue nation better. Still under this YouTube trailer for mission impossible rogue nation comedy. I just watched the trailer for mission impossible rogue nation. It's on YouTube. Yeah. Yeah. User lost nine four one three three types. Good blessed. The confederation may it rise again, especially idiotic. Of course, someone wanting to see the confederate states rise again is someone fucking terrible spelling got only has one oh dip shit. User, berry BART's wants us all to know, he enjoyed this video riding thought the video was good. It's nice berry that he decided to write that lukewarm compliment like how you also made it clear that the video might not be good. You know, you just think it is. Yeah. I thought thought the video was good. You not throwing a hard facts and trying to push people to art is your opinion. Nothing more. You seem sweet berry. Probably not a riveting conversationalist, but sweet user Remmy J posts related or not. You are not them. You are what you are. But if the main points in this post, and I have a feeling that Romy J would think she was a lot smarter than Barry Barnes if she met him. But I think she'd be wrong, she seems like one of those pseudo-philosophers thinking they're thrown out profound shit, but it's just like a fucking series of like, okay. I guess I guess you needed to write that. And then bury bar is back back in the comments. Few comes down the thread typing, very love the history of this family. Oh berry. We have a lot of nice people in your life that the love you inspired the dumb shit. You must constantly say, what do you think of dinner bear? I thought this meal was good Sheila. I very love your tuna casserole. Use a Riley has me second guessing how ancestry works posting. My great grandmother was a direct descendant of the hatfields doesn't that mean? If your great grandmother is a direct descendant of family within aren't you fucking direct descendant this? This is really like I've thought way too much about this. I had to look up the meaning of direct to send after reading Riley's comics. I wait a minute. It's stupid or is this or is he right? Here's definition a direct descendant is someone who can trace their lineage by child relationships all the way back to a desired ancestor, non direct to send it has to go through a cousin or by marriage or some other non child relationship in order to find the desired ancestor. So I would think the way I the way I'm looking at it unless you're opted. You are the direct descendant of your cram, right? I mean, your grandma gave birth to either your father or mother and your father or mother, married. Someone produced very what? Ever have relations somebody and produced you so you would be the direct descendant of anyone that you ran parent is direct ended up. I don't know. I still feel confused whatever Riley has may be contagious. I'm sorry. If I just infected you now swell. Brooklyn McCoy wrote. This just I was tired. When I read this it really fucking rotated me. She wrote this made me cry. But I forgive them fucking stop. It Brooklyn stop you cried you cried like literally cried and felt the need to to publicly forgive. What for how you've been wronged because ancestors of yours died with your last name McCoy, I'm guessing over one hundred years before you were born you forgive people who kill them who also died in all likelihood over one hundred years before you report the feud was over in eighteen ninety one hundred twenty eight years ago. I just it's always annoyed me when people try to glommed onto tragedy that I don't feel. They have any ownership in right like like nine eleven terrible tragedy. But there was people who I feel like went way out of their way to get a tension for themselves when they weren't real related to anybody who died they weren't related to anybody who is related to somebody who died didn't know anybody who. Known anybody who knew somebody that died, and it just felt like like look at me. Look, how sad I am look at how much of a caring person. I am. Yeah. I just never be close friends with somebody that melodramatic. What's what's going on Brooklyn? Why are you crying? Why are you set? I am. So. That. I just I read I just read about the black plague. Very tree in some of my grandparents died horrible deaths every day. They your your grandparents died in the black plague. My great, great, great, great grey, laid fifty more Greg Graham. Yeah. I'm gonna grab my shit now and fucking leave and never talk to you yet have a nice life drama Queen eight percent of the posts on this thread are of someone leading the rest of the commenters know that they are either related to the Hatfield mccoys. Just a lot of comments of I'm Hatfield, I'm McCoy, which is why I think Chris official wins the section of today of the internet today when they post simply I'm not related played Chris if you see it in the in the threat, it's so great. It's like twenty comments just like, I'm really to this. And finally someone's like, I'm not related. I don't think I'm related either. And that's enough for today's. It's the internet. Okay. So turns out and learn much and say, it's the internet examination. Maybe we should had paisley back in today. Maybe he could have added his insight. I did learn that, you know, I do really think it's ridiculous. When you when you weep over shit that happened to people who you never knew who died long ago. Maybe I'm maybe I'm wrong that way, maybe I'm just a cold blooded monster. It's possible. I have been accused many times over the course of my life of not being empathetic enough to people through. I did joke longtime ago about how I could never be a counselor. You know, which was supposed to be pass. Just because I'm not. I can't entertain people's, you know, winding like some people can't it comes across some people. Complain of their problems comes across to me like shut the fuck up suck it up Bill chuckles, and since I can't think of any additional lessons. Let's look back again on the ones we did. Learn today have some fun with some silly new info in today's top five takeaways. Time away. Number one, the two instigators of this feud were Deva lands Hatfield, and Randall McCoy patriarchs of the Hatfield mccoys families and ironically, both would famous feud. They started number two random coil it the long life of misery. He lived at the age of eighty eight south five kids die in the feud. Saw his wife beaten nearly to death Deva Lance head field to me is undeniably, the winner of this feud. Yes, his nephew would hang his brother murdered and other relatives would be sent to prison, but none of Suns with die in the feud eleven of thirteen kids would outlive him. Even though he lived to be eighty one ten years before he died, two kids Thirty-three-year-old allies. Thirty one year old Troy would die in a gunfight, of course, in the gummy West Virginia nine hundred eleven killing the man shooting both of them over a disagreement about whom got over who got to sell liquor to whom Gumri the half brothers. Leisurely? Started the fight fire. Still fire running those Hatfield hog folk veins number three. The feud began in earnest over accusations of hog thefts and eighteen seventy eight and ended with the hanging of an intellectually disabled man in eighteen ninety and in between hog theft. And what seems like a very ill advised hanging. A lot of other people died. Number four, number four is Bing, Bing, Bing, Bing, ding, ding, ding, but Dane, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding. Number five new info in nineteen seventy nine the hatfields reunited there feud with ROY family, the two families joint for an entire week of special taping of the popular game show family feud hot folk dog fo for cash prizes, and how great is this pig kept onstage during the games that whoever the winner. You know, got got to have the pig as well. The McCoy family won the week long series three games to while the hatfields one more money eleven thousand two hundred seventy dollars to the McCoy's eight thousand four hundred fifty nine dollars decision was made to augment the McCoy family winnings to eleven thousand two hundred seventy three one dollar more. So than say had won the most games, and if Deva Lance was still alive he would have been slided enough by this incident to to kill at least two more mccoys. Bye. Feels Amoco's have been sucked. Hope it did. It justice. Yeah. Mandela Lance not a man to be trifled with whole shit man and random Koi, not a guy who could let shit slide. But. Yeah, deadlines man, he's saying he seemed scary some of the serial killers that we've sucked on the show. Thank you. Again. The tire entire time suck team the high priests of the harmony village camp Jesse guardian of grammar dober- out sick this week. Hope you feel better. Jesse Reverend Dr Joe paisley times, high priest Dugan the guys at Biddle danger brain spaces merch wizards axes apparel, Queen of the suck. Lindsey cummins. Speaking of access. Yeah. Again, we get that twenty five percent off sale store starting cyber Monday lean to the following Sunday. Hope you take advantage of that huge. Thanks to first time suck researcher. Devon Stewart for kicking some ask Devon, I hope I did Justice your research. We get more help from Devon on at least one more suck going forward. Hopefully, more after that, man. You crushed it in an Email with Lindsay Devon wrote. I thought this was fun to share. I talked to my Hatfield friend about any good. Stories while he didn't have any. He did share. What I think is a pretty interesting piece of information. Apparently, his Hatfield ancestors were only distant relations to the Appalachian hatfields and didn't even live in the region at the time the feud occurred, despite this his grandmother who is only that kind of Hatfield by marriage still takes the relation very seriously and still insists that the hatfields were in the right in the dispute, I found really funny and really telling giving the ferocity of clan loyalties, and how they propelled the feud Yam and feud continues in some people's minds, I guess at least an argumentative form. How folks still not taking from Dr? Uh-huh. Thanks everyone for for enjoying the time. So private cult curious Facebook group, and and those finding the the discord group, obviously on dischord linked to both places in today's episode description getting their mingled with some like minded meet sags don't start no feuds time because like a fun school than those are the places like a fun recess hail number. Hale number. Next up topic wise, he space selected Pinkerton detective agency nineteenth century American history continues. Maybe more Banjul. I dunno might not might not might be Pinkerton, America's first -tective. Chase down a fair amount of wild west outlaws law dogs, the Pickton's actually inspire the term private eye. The Pinkerton agency I made his name in the late eighteen fifties. For hunt down outlaws, providing private security for the new railroad business as the company's profile grew conic logo, a large unblinking eye, accompanied by the slogan. We never sleep gave rise to the term private eye nickname for detectives eighteen fifty six more trivia twenty three year old widow Kate Warne walked into Pinkerton Chicago's office requested jobs detective founder, Allan Pinkerton was hesitant to hire a female investigator, but gave in after Warren convinced that she could quote worm out secrets in many places to which it was impossible for male. Detectives to gain access true to her word worn proved to be an expert working undercover. One. Bust in thief, by cozying up to his wife and convincing her to real reveal the location of the lute during another case. You gotta suspect to feed her crucial information by disguising herself as fortuneteller. That's awesome. Pinkerton would later worn is one of the best investigators he'd ever hired following her death in eighteen sixty eight he even had her buried in his family plot. So you want a little more than just trivia, you want some jokes on story. Listen next week or watch on YouTube time now for time updates. Times. All right, once I I date new World War. One invoked from World War. One of says time sucker Sam little who writes, dear master, sucker and night errant of Nimrod. My name is Sam beneficier commie long before time. So I can like many others. I was thrilled. When you started it and loved it since thank you very much. I listen to my job as letter carrier for USPS. And I'm pretty sure the people think I'm insane on account of me burst out laughing every ten minutes or so hail Nimrod. Now. I just wanna say waiting for the World War One for a long time, and you have so the crushed it. That's nice. I definitely gave it. My all. Short miss lotta stuff. But especially interested in an important part of history that often gets overlooked, and you really did a Justice the hope you and the rest of the time community learned a lot from it. If I may I just wanted to share some other interesting details as to why the US finally entered the war, and I did not know this stuff censor. Thank you for sharing. This many people think that was the sinking of the let's wanna. I don't have input phonetic there. I think I kinda got that. Right. That big ship that finally drove us to it. But as you know that happened in may nineteen fifteen and it would be almost two years before the US declared war on Germany. It is also important note that the US was sending weapons and munitions to Britain via civilian ships. Germany knew this and did warn the US to see sending supplies to ease. Tensions Germany began to restrict the amount of you use the war dragged on they were preparing to restore unrestricted submarine warfare, which all but confirmed US intervention, and it was the Zimmermann telegram that really drove the nail it. I'm sure he came across as well propulsion, your research German foreign actually did not the not the specific Zimmerman. Telegraph German Foreign Minister, Arthur Zimmermann, attempted to strike a deal with Mexico vowing to reestablish the territories loss to them in the Mexican American war. The message was intercepted by English. Codebreakers shared with their allies. Mexico also rejected the terms on may first nineteen seventeen. It was released to the American public and one month later the US declare. War. Here comes cheeseburgers and freedom, you Jerry, bastards fascinating stuff and like with most pivotal moments in history. You gotta ask yourself. What if what if the US decided to remain neutral until the end what would rush today, if Lenin and the Bolsheviks did not get support needed to take control of the provisional democratic government? Would there be more or less suburban Mexican family restaurants, if Mexico did declare war who knows thank you so much for listening? Thanks again for this great podcast Duma bestest for the suck at work, my friends and family was bummed of mister show in providence. But I hope YoM OB back, y'all. Road novel be. Sam Sam I didn't know about the telegram new the gist about the submarine stuff, and at any government, US obvious. He was getting obviously getting pissed at German u boats were were thinking some of their people supply ships some of their merchants supply ships going out there. Now, a scary ghost story of date coming in from Phil foster love, these this is from that in the rain demon allergist suck. Hello master soccer space, fill in the real world beefsteak on discord. And I have a short ghost story few that all these other ones manage to drag. Short ghost or few that all these other ones manage to drag out of place in my mind, where I hide scary shits when I was around twelve of my sister was ten she kept telling us that she would see multiple all black shadow people her room at night. Yeah. You know, I freaked out shout people. She was say that they would not notice her at all. But seemed like it was some kind of social party than one time. She told me about something that is currently making my skin crawl one night. She saw one of them Ben down to one of the family cats, the shadow person and reached out to pet it and the cat reacted the shadow persons stroke, the cat, and if you've ever petted a cat from head to tail the always have their butts raise up, and she said that happened. I have no reason to doubt it, but but man freaky thinking shadow people might have been petting our pets. Also, you'd better invite Joe motherfucking paisley and on the internet until your podcast together starts, softly crying a corner, and you'll have to live without having making a fellow bearded man or you have to live with having made Filiberto men cry. Suck suck master Ville fos Bank, you fill man, you're crying today. You're crying out here in this, man. We'll have well paisley pop back in for the two internet until we can get our podcast up. Hilarious Email from Kate Rittenhouse K wrote. Dear great time Selker. My name is catering house. I'm a nineteen year old college student trying to become an electrician mega for you. I tell you. I was listening to your Woody bit. With my headphones in during my business break room, or with my headphones in my business break room while I was listening to my boss. The corporate boss was in the break them having a meeting with my boss, and some of the higher ups were another employee friend of mine comes in and rip the headphones outta my phone normally the podcast with pause. But this time it did not. So would he your what he played out loud in front of my boss and the higher ups? My boss looked at me with anger, and I was terrified that. I was going to get fired. When one of the higher ups looked at me like I was crazy. And then from said his big deal. Shocked I clocked into work. I was so shocked I clocked into work and Clinton got to my post. We're gonna ever twenty minutes. And then my boss called me into his office. I was scared was gonna lose my job. And then I went into his office. And my boss is smiling. He said the man who laughs local merchant of sorts that they've been trying to get a deal with and it playing your podcast got help. Get us the deal Abbass was so happy. He gave me a raise. As you. What the podcast was said time saw can week later. My boss talking about Shakeel. Are you fucking serious? I mean, you don't you don't say you're kidding in this message. I want this to be true so badly, and I'm I'm assuming it is you say, so thank you master time. Soaker Cade Rittenhouse that is fucking amazing. A lot. I love how this is spreading. I I have heard other messages from people we've got people have like, you know, some kid in the classroom or teacher, maybe saying that he's a sharing something from time in the classroom like at high school classroom, then in some of the his saying stuff like we all needed that or hail Nimrod, and that kinda shit crazy now another World War One update, a sweet some sweet marine info coming in hot from time. John house, dear suckiest of all suckers. Thanks for being awesome. A bit of years since crazy with capital F of long wanted to see and was surely sad, the Massachusetts show had to be canceled. Yes. Sorry about that as well. But I we do have I'm ninety nine percents. Sure of Boston date on the books. I just ask Lindsey about that today. And I'm yes, I'm ninety nine point nine percent positive. I'm going back to Boston in the first half of the earned for a couple nights instead of just one then you wrote peer pressure intended. Yeah. Okay. I listen to your World War One sock. And I had a few things. I thought you'd find interesting. I Pol the last two paragraphs preach. Oh, yeah. And I did like cut those out just because it was a little bit longer. There's more info. And yeah, the the two paragraphs were just referencing where to get information and John did share some really good things. Yes. And that maybe the the one American news is maybe they don't always share the most unbiased information. So. Yeah. Is there such a thing with man trying to find info? You know, you find what you think is unbiased might be unbiased someone else will think it's by still it's just it's so hard, but John did share at the end of this. And I didn't I'm not gonna read it now, but he did share like the AP has their own app. So rather than get like AP articles through other newspapers, you can go directly to the source. I mean, they are what America's biggest media to Shen. I do think it's very least most time they really get things. Right. And I have enjoyed that. So thank you for adding that to my research repertoire, okay? Anyway, the battle of Belew would is a noted battle in Marine Corps history. Some consider the battle the broad initial claims the marines and developed mythos surrounding them that we know of today during that offensive. We lost more marines in that battle than an all or wars before combined still the marines pushed through and captured ground be hand to hand combat incredible sharp shooting during that offensive to noted things happen. I Dan Dailey two time medal of honor recipient and outstanding suck candidate was in charge of unit was pinned down by intense fire rather than retreat. Or stay put he famously yelled come on you son of a bitches. No, come on you sons of bitches. Do you want to live forever? Bad ass, man. Second story emerged in the battle of belly. Would that said the marines were so fearsome with their sharp shooting, the Germans nickname them devils dogs? Do remember come across that another Succoth thing while some claim this was actually American propaganda? I prefer to think that the as the marines of World War One commenced bad assery, the spirit of the original devil dog bojangles imbued them with right? Just power praise jangle. He's back there. The day before Veterans Day is November ten also known as the Marine Corps birthday. I did know that. But yeah, thanks for reminding me to share that the most famous of marine generals are in World War. One was General John a the June who right after World War One decreed that the marines would forever. Celebrate their birthday on November tenth with birthday message cake the celebration is carried out today regardless of presence in combat. I won't bore you with the whole details of the ceremony. But no that ten November tenth is a glorious day and has got some ties we're one another famous. Marina one was Smedley Butler, aka the would be king of America. He was a Major General who to medal of honors during his career for general bad assery and his talked of in the same conversational tone as chesty puller. He also wrote the book and coined the phrase wars a racket anyway during the great depression, the US during the great depression, skews me US veterans of World War One wanted advance payment of bonds. They were promised to them the bond. Whoever couldn't be paid until the nineteen forties. Dude economics mumbo jumbo that. Of course, didn't matter to disabled vet struggling with PTSD, poverty, and this led to the creation of the bonus. Army that marched on Washington to demand payment when the bonus army formed it was potentially powerful fighting force. Someone wanted to use it that way as these were all hardened fighters of war veterans years later, a bunch of industrials actually coined decided that they wanted to perform a military coup on the American government to stall a fascist government and recruited Smedley Butler to manipulate and lead. What was likely the bonus army to overthrow the government bother told them that they could go fuck themselves reported everything to. Congress congress not investigate much given that the industrials for some of the most powerful men in America. But this is now known as the business plot and was time that we were dangerously close to a very bad situation. I may have some details wrong. But this would be great suck. 'cause it's actual conspiracy that actually happened. Love the podcast year, Semper fi bojangles. John house. Thank you, John. And yeah, I didn't share anything. I got a lot of details out there to people, and I appreciate you write in and. Yeah. And finding good media is important because not all not all news fake, news metex still a lot of investigative journalist true seekers out there. You don't wanna go to place. We just can't trust. Anybody wrestling out from Haith major. A new world order wrassling update who says he says all you ham and Egger Jubran. Motherfucker kidding sucked. Him as prime. I hate to correct you. But I feel I must in the new world order suck. You stated at the wrestling NWF faction in world class wrestling, aka world wrestling federation, when an actual fact they were part of world championship wrestling, which was purchased by the world Federal Way by purchased by the world. Wrestling federation owner, Vince McMahon, definitely a fucking space lizard, luminary wacko in two thousand world class championship. Wrestling completely different wrestling company. The former pro wrestler in me wanted you to know. Yeah. You know, I think I feel like I just misspoke in that the way it was kind of written. A lot of articles was it was tied to the WWF and the w CW, but I probably did sports rate as they were the same entity. But yes, yes, they were not thinking, he's writes, thank you for allowing us to smell with the suck is cooking each and every week, and I'll. See your candy ass. Next time, you're Portland, Oregon for no Roe barb wire. Bed of nails barbed wire. Board rain some tax time bomb death match. Please don't think you're sending that in. Now, another World War One update from Canadian or some Canadian veteran loves us me coming in from Canadian sucker, Melissa king, Melissa writes. Hi master sucker. Just finished a World War One episode as conduct from the true, north strong and free. I couldn't help. But notice the distinct lack of Canadians mentioned the victory at Vimy ridge was only one example of the epic bad assery that was Canada and the great war. The Canadian war effort was ultimately what led to Canada bean recognized as a state and the signing of the armistice was the first time that Canada sign a treaty on its own behalf. I did not know that thank you for sharing that the storm trooping. You mentioned is what gained Canadians the nickname of stormtroopers because even though even through piss soaked rags, we were bad ass. I love worshipping at the feet of Nimrod Halen run while cleaning my igloo. Well, cleaning my igloo and taking my dog's let it out much lovey, Melissa Kate. Thank you most. I love katie's man. Yeah. I kind of get back up to Canada getting I gotta figure some shit out with Canadian government. And I gotta get back up there. Now. Shoutout requests from Connor Forbes says, hey, there suck master November. The as with McGraw friends birthday was also the day the campfire started in northern California. She and her family lost everything sees like so many others in the communities of paradise and Michaela suffice to say she had a pretty shitty birthday. Yeah. I bet and I thought maybe reached out to you and asking to have her shouted out on the south would be a cool way to make up for it. We're both faithful suckers space lizards met you at Sacramento back in may her name is Madison, and she would be. She would absolutely melt if you mentioned her realize, it's probably a long shot. Why the hell not sincerely faithless basis or Connor Forbes Connor thank you riding in man. And yes, Madison. Happy birthday sorry that you had such a terrible terrible. Terrible last month. And hope things are getting better. Hope insurances fixing stuff hoping to good spot. Now, hope you safe and then last message. Another. Shoutout, actually. Yeah. Yeah. This is last batch sorry last night another shadow coming in from Ken. Hey, Dan quick. No from Grand Rapids. Michigan. I was able to catch your show Dr grins last weekend. Friday, PM wife, and I were supposed to be there was friends of ours. But the wife of my friend wasn't feeling well, so she was at the hospital getting tested friend was at the show, but then had to leave before you took stage because he found out his wife needed to have her gallbladder removed immediately. Everything went well through surgery, and she is on the men. I love the case you by the way that she went to the hospital for possible surgery. Like you baby. I'm gonna see you after the fuck is show guys. He comes. Man. Thank you. I'm not one of those first shot. I have never emailed anyone for something like this. But I know my friend would think it's cool to get some love from you sending prayers good wishes to his wife, Amy that she'll be back up and feeling better. My friend's name is Abe Abe, Amy, and he is a car carrying space. And I like like, I said huge fan of yours. Thanks, the time Dan Gratiot in Grand Rapids. Thanks closed with one of my favorite bits jury duty the world needs a little more chicken. Joe Bob playboy Bach. Ken. Well, thanks for sending that in can. And a man. Thank you so much, dude. Yeah. Huge. Thanks. So dedicated the you are still coming even though you your wife wasn't feeling good. I'm glad she's feeling better. Now, Amy how fucking dare you get sick during my Tim show, but you ever fucking do that again. But other than that. I think you're great. But don't ever get sick. You guys just in general it really chaps my ass when you guys get sick. And when you don't feel good when things don't go, well and your life. I don't care for it. I like it when time suckers are only kicking. S so knock it off have everything be great always. Okay. That's that's what I'm the happiest when you were all also the happiest but seriously, I hope you're feeling better soon. Amy, and thanks to everyone who sends him ashes, man. You know, if you don't hear your shout outs because we don't care promise. Sometimes we get a lot of them coming in. Sometimes it's random timing of when they come in compared to when I'm prep in the show. But we appreciate all the messages. Thanks for being the best meets acts on our for. Sure. There is no real debate is definitely around planet. Love you guys. Thanks time. We all talk to you next week time suckers, don't get dragged into an over a decade long murderous feud this week hope again, you had a great thanksgiving this past week and keep on. on second. Thing thing thing. Thing main mainly Ning maintaining, the ain't meaning meaning Joe ping name. They know only low name they wanna live. Yeah. Yeah.

Randall McCoy West Virginia Kentucky McCoy San hatfields Rivoli Randall tug valley Harmon McCoy Randall McCoy Devlin Hatfield Ellison Hatfield McCoy Reverend Anderson Hatfield Nancy Hatfield Deva Floyd Hatfield Tolbert McCoy Paris McCoy murder Virginia Ephraim Nancy Hatfield
The Hatfield & McCoy Feud Pt. 2

Crimes of Passion

45:02 min | 1 year ago

The Hatfield & McCoy Feud Pt. 2

"Due to the graphic nature of these families crimes. Listener discretion is advised. This episode includes discussions of murder and violence that some people may find offensive we advise extreme caution for children under the age of thirteen. Cap Hatfield was certain about one thing some women gossip too much for their own good. Maybe it was harmless most of the time, but when his family was under attack. He couldn't abide loose lips someone in the Hatfield clan was spilling secrets cap suspected the culprit was his sister in law. Nancy after all, she was McCoy by blood. It was foolish to trust her. The question now was what to do about her bad behavior had to be punished. Cap. Thoughtfully stared at the wall. He saw the tail of a cow nail to the wooden logs of his cabin. He had chopped it off just to see the animal jump then hung up to dry cap. Rip the tail down and brandished it like a whip swishing it through the air, he smiled as a plan began to form in his mind. Those gossiping McCoy woman had. Earned a beating, and he would be the one to give it to them. Hi, I'm Laney Hobbs. And this is crimes of passion. Apar- cast original the legal definition of a crime of passion is a violent crime that occurs in the throes of extreme emotion, leaving no time to reflect on the consequences. But in this show, we explore passionate crimes, how does marriage progress from husband and wife to kill her and victim or killer and co-conspirator if there's a thin line between love and hate what manipulates our relationships and a deadly results at par cast. We're grateful for you our listeners you allow us to do what we love let us know how we're doing reach out on Facebook and Instagram at par cast and Twitter at podcast network. And if you enjoy today's episode the best way to help us is to leave a five star review wherever you're listening. It really does help us. We also now have merchandise had depar- cast dot com slash merch for more. Formation. Beginning in eighteen sixty five the hatfields of Logan county, West Virginia and the mccoys of pike county Kentucky or locked in a lethal feud that would entangle the families and bloody cycle of violence over the subsequent twenty six years. The trouble began with the death of thirty seven year old harm in McCoy. The former union soldier was killed in January of eighteen sixty five by confederate leaning militia group, led by devil, Anse Hatfield and his uncle Jim Vance in eighteen seventy eight thirteen years after Harman's murder, his older brother Randolph McCoy accused a Hatfield of stealing his hogs at the trial to determine the ownership of the animals a McCoy cousin named Bill. Stayton testified against family lines. The mccoys were so furious about this betrayal that two of Randolph's nephews shot and killed Bill. Stayton in eighteen eighty. That same year. Twenty one year old Roseanna McCoy fell in love with eighteen year old Johnny Hatfield. But after a brief affair that left Rosanna pregnant Jones, he jilted Rosanna to marry her cousin Nancy these events pushed the McCoy's to a breaking point on election day, August seventh of eighteen eighty two three of Randolph McCoy sons stabbed and shot confederate war hero and Baptist. Deacon? Ellison Hatfield after the brawl a posse led by devil Anse Hatfield grabbed the McCoy brothers. Tolbert farmer and bud and drag them to an old school house on the West Virginia side of the tug fork river there they waited to see whether Ellison Hatfield would survive his injuries. At three o'clock in the afternoon on Wednesday, August ninth eighteen eighty two forty year old Ellison Hatfield succumbed to his wounds word quickly got back to the old schoolhouse Sarah McCoy, the mother of the captive brothers had been holding vigil outside. But when the news came in the Hatfield mob, ordered her to leave devil Anse gathered twenty of his men, he instructed them to lead the McCoy prisoners outside at nightfall. They began their journey back into Kentucky the policy was primed for murder, but one Hatfield remained reticent. Valentine Hatfield nicknamed wall Deva, Lance is oldest brother and a Justice of the peace in west Virginia's Logan county. As wall. Hatfield tourists reach the edge of the tug fork river. He watched a group of men grab Tolbert farmer, and bud McCoy and hustle them towards the riverbank the rush of the river couldn't drown out the frantic pleas of the young McCoy, boys. Wall fell doubt creep in as he stared at their tear-streaked faces wall looked around. But none of the other Hatfield men seem to be affected. He couldn't help. But think of the McCoy boy's father Randolph who had gone onto bike Ville to find a lawyer to defend his sons Randolph had put his trust in the principles of law and order up until this moment wall had dedicated his life to those same values. Now, he felt ashamed at how easily he had let his anger sweep his principles away wall. Hurt is brother Deva Lance order. The posse to take the McCoy brothers across the river into Kentucky. The prisoners would soon be outside of walls jurisdiction and beyond his responsibility. But wall felt more burden than ever. Finally. He had to speak up wall told the posse to reconsider. He reminded them that the bible prohibited. Murder, but walls brother, never had much use for religion. Devon lands. Had always been stubborn even as a boy when he had his mind set on something trying to convince him otherwise only made him dig in harder. As wall, protested devil. Anse just stared at him coldly, then ordered his men to keep going wall thought of other please. But he couldn't seem to voice them. It seemed pointless to stand up against the inflamed passions of his kin. He kept silent. And let the men drag the McCoy prisoners away. With wall gone. The rest of the men fell in mind behind Deva lands following his instructions without question before it continue with the psychology. Please note, I am not a licensed psychologist or psychiatrist, but I have done a lot of research for this show. Rebecca Saxe and associate professor of cognitive neuroscience at MIT has conducted research on how a mob mentality can prompt individuals to ignore their own morals and commit acts. They would never have considered on their own in. Her study sacks measured the brain activity of people performing a competitive task both alone. And in a group when the participants of the study acted as a group the areas of their brains responsible for self reflection or less active than when they acted alone. They were there for less capable of applying their usual standards of conduct wall Hatfield was able to overcome mob mentality, but the rest of his kin gave into it. After the group crossed the tug. Fork river the posse founded ditch not far from the riverbank a smattering of broadly Papa trees grew within this hollow the Hatfield mob tied the mccoys to the pawpaw trunks. According to witnesses Tober McCoy remained impassive. He said, I want the man who kills me to stand right before my eyes. I want to look him right in the eye ignoring Tolbert's request the hatfields tied him to the tree backwards. So that he wouldn't be able to face his executioner farmer and bud didn't make any final requests. They only sobbed. The firing squad included devil Anse and his sons twenty year old Johnny eighteen-year-old cap and fifteen year old Bob they were joined by several family members and friends, including a man named Ellison mounts known as cotton top due to his white blonde hair. Cotton top was the twenty four year old illegitimate son of Ellison Hatfield, whose death the men were now avenging cotton tops at an later account that a half field ally hung lanterns over the heads of the McCoy brothers. So that the posse would know where to aim moments later the firing squad unleashed a torrent of gunfire. The blast echoed through the mountains. Jim McCoy the oldest of Randolph McCoy sons was still awake that night. His mother Sarah had convinced him to stay away from the trouble because she didn't want another one of her sons to risk his life by getting involved. Jim was restlessly sitting on the front porch of a family friend's house? Waiting for any news to come in? When he heard the shots. He knew what those shots meant. But he hoped his intuition was wrong. He said out into the now silent woods when he came to the palm. Ditch. The hatfill posse was gone, but the bodies of his three brothers remained. The next morning Randolph McCoy returned home from pike Ville, having secured bail and legal representation for his sons only to learn he was too late. The McCoy's called on neighbors to help them retrieve the three bodies and bring them home. They were buried that day. August eleventh eighteen eighty two. Fifty-seven-year-old Randolph McCoy was ready to put together his own Lynch mob, but his wife Sarah convinced him, not to retaliate. She couldn't bear the thought of more killing Randolph relented, but the matter wasn't over the same day his sons were buried Randolph road to the town of pike Bill Kentucky to speak with the county. Prosecutors about filing indictments against his son's killers a month. After the funeral a Kentucky grand jury raw charges against devil lands. His brother wall, his sons, John and cap and sixteen other men for murder. Coming up. We'll talk about the hatfields attempts to evade the law while continuing to stoke the flames of the feud now back to the story. On August tenth eighteen eighty to a group of Hatfield men and allies killed three McCoy brothers. Twenty old Tolbert nineteen year old farmer. An eighteen year old bud and retaliation for the stabbing and killing of Ellison. Hatfield a month later Kentucky at thorns issued indictments for forty three year old devil Anse Hatfield and two of his adult sons, but apprehending the hatfields proved to be difficult. The sheriff of pike Bill Kentucky claim that he didn't have the authority to arrest man outside of his jurisdiction when the court reconvened in February eighteen eighty three six months after the pom-pom murders the record show that beside each indicted man's name. The sheriff wrote not found in this county to avoid capture. It seemed that the hatfields would merely have to remain in their home state of West Virginia the lack of legal repercussions immediately after. After the pom-pom murders may have helped spur later episodes of aggression between the two families sociologist and professor of history. Roberta Senegal wrote that collective violence arises where law is lacking she explained that when thorns are perceived as weak and ineffective civilians are more likely to take the law into their own hands as a method of self help the Kentucky sheriffs failure to act meant that the hatfields weren't afraid of being arrested, but the lack of legal oversight made them feel vulnerable to vigilantism. It's not clear whether any of them accords were seeking retribution at that time. But the Hatfield seem certain that payback was coming research conducted by German psychology and behavioral experts, Robert boom, Hanis rush an Oscar revealed that the perception of an existential threat intensifies a groups hatred of an imposing group moreover this perceived. Threat to an Ingraham triggers. A greater likelihood of preemptive violence towards the out group over the next few years, the Hatfield state in West Virginia hiding out in the woods whenever they felt threatened. Authorities continued to turn a blind eye to their activities, but the hatfields grew increasingly paranoid when one of their forced hideouts burned down. They suspected someone was leaking information about their whereabouts to the mccoys. They believe the most likely culprit to be Nancy McCoy Hatfield. She was the daughter of harm in McCoy the union soldier whose murder had sparked the feud nearly twenty years earlier Nancy McCoy had married Johnny Hatfield in eighteen eighty when she was sixteen and he was eighteen bonanza did not remain enamored of Johnson for long. She quickly grew tired of John sees womanizing, and drinking and she made her feelings clear now that the mccoys had found success in locating their hideouts Johnson, his father devil, Anse worried that the embittered Nancy was passing Hatfield secrets to her sister. Mary who then relaid the details to their ankle Randolph. So in eighteen eighty six devil Anse enlisted his twenty two year old son cap Hatfield to send the McCoy's a message cap Hatfield had become one of his father's fiercest lieutenants in the family war. According to witnesses. Mises cap Hatfield didn't have a quick temper like his brother, Johnny or his father Deva, Lance, but caps common difference. Only made him more unsettling one of his cousins said that quote cap wasn't mean, but if you troubled him, he'd shoot you and shoot you mighty quick to he just didn't care to kill you. That's all cap wanted to stop his sister in law Nancy from leaking information, but as brutal as cap was he was apparently not willing to mess with Nancy McCoy Hatfield. She was described as a hell cat willing to kill any man who crossed her in law or not so cap steered clear of Nancy in targeted. Her sister. Mary who he believed to be the recipient of Nancy's leaks. One summer night cap in his hired hand, Tom Wallace dawned masks, and led a group of a dozen men to the house of Mary McCoy Daniels and her husband Bill Daniels. According to one account Bill Daniels was away that night, leaving his wife elderly mother and children alone cap and Tom Wallace entered the home and rip thirty five year old Mary out of bed. They dragged her to the fireplace and forced her to kneel in front of it. Cap had brought with him a cow tail mopped from one of his life stock and used it as a punishing lash. He whipped Mary across her back until she fainted, the men trudged out leaving Mary unconscious later, she identified Tom Wallace as one of the attackers from the distinctive white streak in his hair. Mary Nancy's brother Jeff McCoy soon heard about the attack this fourth child of Harmon McCoy. Oy. Hastily grabbed his gun and went to the home of Tom Wallace, Tom escape, Jeff's clutches and ran cap hatfields cabin as Tom hidden inside. Jeff trying to scare him out by shooting up the place. It didn't work, but it angered cap Hatfield unhappy to find his cabin riddled with bullet holes. A short time later cap and Tom went out in search of Jeff McCoy when Jeff realized they were looking for him. He led them on a chase through the woods. Jeff tried to swim across the tug for river. But as he reached the other side and began to climb up the Bank cap Hatfield Anton Wallace spotted him and fatally shot him in the back. The following spring of eighteen eighty seven Tom Wallace was discovered shot dead near his home in West Virginia. Most residents believed he was murdered by Jake and Mark McKoy the second and third children of harm in McCoy the McCoy brothers claim they had nothing to do with it. But they had been vocal about their grudge against Tom Wallace ever since the beating of their Sister, Mary and the death of their brother, Jeff this back and forth. Vigilantism seem like it might go on forever in eighteen eighty seven five years after the pom-pom murders sixty two year old Randolph McCoy still hope that the law would intervene to end the violence. Although with authorities had thus far been ineffective in bringing any hatfields into custody. Randolph still had an important ally. On his side, Perry Cline? Perry. Cline was a friend of the McCoy family with his own grudges against the hatfields. His sister Patty Klein McCoy was the widow of in McCoy, which meant that Mary Nancy Jeff lurk and Jake were his nieces and nephews he wasn't pleased about their repeated run ins with cap Hatfield. Not only that Perry. Cline was still nursing an even older resentment Perry had once been the neighbor of devil Anse Hatfield until Deva. Lance sued him for trespassing and took five thousand acres of his land. As a settlement Perry. Cline had moved at pike. Ville in the early eighteen seventies by eighteen eighty seven. He was thirty eight years old and had become a lawyer. And prominent democrat among Kentucky's political circles, it was an election year and a man named Simon Bolivar Buckner was a democratic candidate running for governor Perry Cline made Buckner an ally by. Promising to campaign for him in his part of the state Klein delivered and Buckner was inaugurated on August thirtieth eighteen eighty seven. Perry. Cline was quick to call in a return favor. He asked the governor to finally act on the Hatfield indictments Buckner agreed and issued a five hundred dollar bounty for each of the hatfields capture on September tenth. He contacted west Virginia's governor Willis Wilson and sent a formal request. For extradition of the men Wilson was slow to act so Buckner also appointed a friend of Klein's a deputy sheriff known as bad Frank Phillips to bring the men in twenty five year old bad Frank Phillips was described his graceful looking with a smooth hairless face and soft expressive is his delicate appearance. Led many to underestimate him in truth. He was a ruthless two nations bulldog of a man. Over the next few months bad. Frank led several raids into West Virginia in search of the indicted hatfields, the participants of the Paul Paul murder firing squad were forced into hiding. They couldn't stay in one place for more than a night or two out of fear of being caught. They lived like nomads moving around from the home of one relative to another and even camping in caves and ditches the hatfields knew that this life was unsustainable. Deva Lance even tried to bribe Perry Cline with two hundred and twenty five dollars to end his pursuit Perry Cline kept the money, but he didn't stop bad Frank from continuing his efforts. On New Year's Eve of eighteen eighty seven the hatfields had been invading bad Frank Phillips for three months and avoiding their indictments for five years. They seem resigned to the fact that they might soon be arrested and charged if they couldn't stop the raids they could at least eliminate any witnesses who might eventually testify against them that afternoon devil. Lance his sons cap and John C his nephew cotton top mounts, and a handful of others men in the home of Jim Vance. The held a council to make sure all the men were in agreement together they worked out a plan to murder sixty two year old Randolph McCoy and his family. Jim Vance seem especially vehement that it was time to end the feud once and for all in a final tidal wave of violence, his great nephew cap Hatfield was similarly eager. But some members of the family were having second thoughts. Thoughts. As soon as the sky grew dark. The men were ready to write off to the McCoy homestead if any of them felt unsure about their mission. Jim Vance had taken care of that. He had whipped them into a bloodthirsty frenzy. He blamed the mccoys for all the troubles eight had since Frank Phillips had started hunting them down. But devil Anse felt strange to his own surprise. He felt reluctant to go through with their plan. He wasn't a coward after everything he'd done. Nobody could accuse them of that. But he was tired every time he closed his eyes to go to sleep. He wondered if he'd wake up to find the barrel of a gun pointed at his face. This was all happening because he killed those McCoy boys in a fit of rage. Now uncle Jim wanted to finish off the rest of the McCoy, Ken. But what good would it do if anything it would only bring more indictments? On their heads. The men were ready to go loaded with guns feeling numb devil. Lance started to walk towards his horse. But then he stopped. He told the men that he was feeling ill. If they wanted to go ahead. They could he would even give them his best gun, but they would have to go on without him. Jim. Vance led a group of nine men across the tug fork river into Kentucky the temperature was freezing earlier that day. There had been a downpour, sleet. But the skies were now clear leaving the group with few obstacles essay road. The group's snuck up a hill leading to Randolph Sarah McCoy's modest cabin as a crept through the darkness. They crashed into a fence sending the post clattering down the hill, the group hastily retreated worried that the noise had warned the McCoy's of their approach after a quick discussion. They decided to call the attack that night. But Jim Vance insisted that they all return the following night January. I eighteen eighty eight in order to finish the job. Coming up. We'll talk about the New Year's day massacre and the aftermath now the conclusion to our story. After twenty years of bloodshed between the Hatfield and McCoy families, a group of Hatfield men decided to settle the feud once and for all led by sixty one year old Jim Vance the troop headed for the McCoy family farm on the night of January. I eighteen eighty eight on a mission to kill the whole family. Around ten thirty pm the men lined up in front of the farmhouse inside the large family slept Randolph McCoy his wife, Sarah as well as four of their children who still lived at home twenty five year old Calvin and his sisters twenty nine year old ala fair seventeen year old Adelaide and fourteen year old fanny and addition there were two small grandchildren Mel and Cora. They were the son and daughter of Tolbert McCoy left fatherless after the Paul Palmer's as the Hatfield mauled move forward. A dog began to bark the McCoy family woke up in alarm Randolph in Calvin grab their guns and began to fire at the doors. John C Hatfield took a bullet in his shoulder and cotton top mounts was shot in the arm. But this didn't stop the hatfields from returning fire. Jim. Vance took a match to a bag of cotton leaning against the house and the cabin began to burn. Allah, fair dashed outside to grab a bucket of water from the well to put out the fire as soon as she left the house cap Hatfield and cotton top mounts began to shoot Allah. Fair was struck in the chest. Her mother, Sarah, ignore the bullets flying in all directions and raced out of the house to Allah fair side, Jim van spotted her and ordered her back inside when she ignored him. He struck her with his gun barrel knocking her down and breaking two of her ribs. But Sarah kept moving forward now on her hands and knees crawling to Allah fair before she could reach your daughter Johnson Hatfield leapt Ford ambassador school with his pistol. She finally collapsed unconscious overwhelmed by smoke Randolph grabbed his grandson Mel and ran to a neighbor's barn Calvin tried to follow but was fatally shot in the head his sisters Adelaide and fanny. He managed to escape the burning house with Cora at that point the hatfields began to retreat smelling, the smoke neighbors arrived to help they carried the unconscious Serra McCoy to the home of her oldest son, Jim, but Allah fair was beyond helping she died on the ground or she had fallen the McCoy's buried their children, Allah Farren Calvin the following day afterwards Randolph wrote back to pike Ville to again, press Perry. Cline for help Klein intern advise bad Frank Phillips to double his efforts a few days later bad Frank planned, another raid into West Virginia. He took with him a twenty three men posse including several McCoy family members. The group discovered a trail of blood on the ground year Randolph McCoy's burnt out cabin bad. Frank had a hunch that the blood would lead to an injured Hatfield. So they followed the trail soon. They came across Jim Vance and cap Hatfield. Jim and cap dove behind some rocks as posse thunder toward them. According to family stories, Jim Vance felt sick that day from eating too much raccoon meet he told cap that he had no plans to run. He would stay in fight ordering cap to go find reinforcements as he fled. Jim tried to hold the men off. But he was shot in the arm while Jim Lee bleeding on the ground bad Frank strode over and shot him in the head. When cap reached his father's camp and told the men what had happened. They rallied a group to fight the Kentucky posse, but the two groups never met that day after killing Jim Vance bad Frank and the Kentucky posse went onto the home Valentine wall Hatfield and placed him under arrest. They escorted wall and five other Hatfield prisoners back to the jail and pike Ville Kentucky. Bad Frank planned another rate for January eighteenth eighteen eighty eight he brought thirty three men with him. This time the remaining hatfields where warrant of his arrival and they had prepared themselves for confrontation Deva Lance had refused to participate in the New Year's attack. But he felt compelled to defend his family in the wake of Jim Vance's death. He called on cousins neighbors and even to west Virginian lawmen to help the areas constable John Thompson and special deputy Bill Dempsey were evidently, not pleased with the way these Kentucky inns were invading their territory, they felt bound to protect their own citizens. Even those wanted for murder, the two groups clashed at grapevine creek about a mile east of the tug fork river near the home of cap Hatfield, the Hatfield spotted Jim McCoy, I he was carrying the gun. His brother Calvin had used the night. Of the New Year's massacre. Jim managed to hit special deputy Bill Dempsey with his first shot, the Hatfield scuttled for cover as more. Members of the Kentucky posse appeared. The hatfields returned fire. The Kentucky posse climbdown off their horses and dill behind a nearby stonewall from those positions the two groups fired on each other for over two hours. It became clear to the hatfields that they were outnumbered and they began to retreat Bill Dempsey injured by Jim McCoist shot but still alive try to crawl away bad Frank Phillips coldly placed the barrel of his gun against Dempsey's neck and blew his head off. None of the hatfields were captured that day, but they were stunned by the battle and by the casual cruelty of Frank Phillips. They were beginning to understand that Phillips was willing to go to any links done them down after the battle of grapevine creek devil. Anse sent a letter to the Winchester company in Massachusetts placing an order for ten thousand rounds of ammunition and twenty-five new Winchester, repeating rifles, which could be fired many times without reloading. These guns were an upgrade from the one shot rifles and muzzle loading guns. Many of the Hatfield had been carrying the shipment would arrive the following October if devil Anse couldn't beat the Kentucky inns a numbers, he could at least have superior firepower. The battle of grapevine creek didn't just alarm the hatfields for many residents of tuck fork. It invoked memories of the civil war the drama of the. Vent caught the attention of journalists who began to sink their teeth into the story. Many newspapers took sides in the feud by embellishing the indecency of one side or the other one report claimed without evidence that bad Frank Phillips, not only shot Bill Dempsey, but also picked his pockets after he died another reporter for the Pittsburgh times. Extolled the doggedness of Frank Phillips and express sympathy for the McCoy family, while labeling the hatfields as a cowardly gang band together for the purpose of murder, the hostility spread to the local and state politicians west Virginia's governor Wilson objected to the arrest of wall Hatfield and the others taken into custody. He claimed they had been taken without any legal process and unlawfully transferred across state lines. He demanded the prisoners be released Kentucky's governor Buckner refused by his reckoning. He wasn't under any obligation to release the men. He felt that once the prisoners were in his state's custody Kentucky had the right to try them for any crimes. They had committed within their jurisdiction. The matter went before a court and Louisville which determined that it did not have jurisdiction over controversy between two states. According to the US constitution only. The US supreme court had the power to decide such a dispute the supreme court heard the case on April twenty third eighteen eighty eight the court agreed with Kentucky that however the men had been brought into the state even if the manner of their capture was a legal. They could still be legally tried once they were in custody Kentucky was free to prosecute the men already behind bars. The ruling of the supreme court rattled the hatfields. It also Blida rated any expectation that the Justice system would treat them fairly to them. The actions of bad Frank Phillips amounted to kidnapping. The work of Janice Nadler, a research, professor of law and psychology showed that when people feel that they are treated fairly by the Justice system. They are less likely to reaffirmed in the future. Conversely, when people view the law as unjust. They are more likely to act out with criminal behavior. If the hatfields were comfortable evading the law before the supreme court decision only made them more defiant. In the summer of eighteen eighty eight. Rumors spread throughout the tug fork valley that dozens of bounty hunters were combing the mountains in search of hatfields cotton top mounts was caught by two detectives and taken into custody there. He joined wall Hatfield along with about a dozen other men indicted for feud related crimes the trial for the eighteen eighty two pom-pom murders began in August of eighteen eighty nine in an odd change of heart Perry Cline, decided to take up the legal defense of all Hatfield, some say, this was because wall offered him more money, which overruled claims friendship with McCoy's. Others say Perry was still loyal to the mccoys and his defensive wall was a sham. Perhaps the ladder theory was correct wall Hatfield was found guilty in his trial and given a life sentence. Wall was shocked by the decision. He was one of the few hatfields that had tried to temper some of the flames of the feud, and was sure he would be acquitted. He wasn't the only one bewildered by his trials outcome. Cotton top mounts had participated in both the Popol murders and the New Year's raid. But he hadn't planned them. He had just gone along with what Hatfield leaders had told him to do. He was described as easily influenced some historians have indicated that he may have had an intellectual handicap while in custody cotton top confessed to the New Year's raid. Murder of twenty nine year old ala fair McCoy some reporters speculated that he was bribed into doing. So one article suggested that cap Hatfield promise cotton top five hundred dollars a rifle and a new saddle if he would take the fall for the murder, the Hatfield seemed to hope that by making cotton top. Scapegoat. The rest of them would get off lightly. If cotton top was promised a small fortune in exchange for pleading guilty, he would never get to enjoy it following the trial of Allah fares murder. He was sentenced to be hanged. His execution was scheduled for February eighteenth eighteen ninety. Cotton top waited on the edge of his cot. He was told that his mother would soon be arriving to visit him. He wanted to see her one last time to hear her promise that she would not be present for the hanging. No mother should have to see that. As he waited. He couldn't stop a flicker of hope from consuming his thoughts. There was still time for rescue. Maybe his family would storm the jail and break him out. There were rumors that cap Hatfield might be planning such a scheme thinking about cap made cotton top feel angry. He was the real culprit. They were both guilty of shooting up the McCoy's farm house, but it was caps bullet that it struck the McCoy girl, Allah fair contact felt sure of it. Cotton top could hear a crowd beginning to form outside spectators for the hanging, but nobody came to break down the jail doors and set him free contacts hope curdled into despair he had wasted. So much of the last few years hating McCoy's, but he didn't feel any hate. Now. They weren't responsible for him being here. It was his own kin the half fields who had pushed him to violence. Cotton top at unleashed his worst impulses for the sake of his family. Now, his family had abandoned him witnesses on February eighteenth send that just before the executioners covered his face with a black hood cotton top cried out the hatfields made me do it. An estimated seven thousand people came to see the hanging including Randolph McCoy afterwards. Tensions. Seem to settle contact wasn't the only guilty party, but many tug fork residents just seemed happy that someone anyone had paid for the havoc the feud caused the violence sedate had cost the Hatfield seven lives, and the mccoys ten now the families were no longer out for blood most of the remaining mccoys moved away from tug fork settling permanently in pike Ville, Kentucky Sarah Randolph for too heartbroken to think of vengeance. They have lost their sons Tolbert farmer and bud in the pom-pom murders of eighteen eighty two their son Calvin and their daughter alla fair died in the New Year's massacre of eighteen eighty eight. Roseanna McCoy had been cast out by her family in eighteen eighty after her fair with John Hatfield, but she had restored ties after the New Year's massacre to take care of her injured mother, even after reuniting with her family Rosanna suffered from severe depression in the spring of eighteen eighty nine her family reported that she seemed to be wasting away one night twenty nine year old Rosanna went to bed and never woke up her close friend and sister-in-law Martha McCoy would later say she died of a broken heart Roseanne is younger brother Bill had suffered from unbearable guilt ever since the Popol murders. Bill along with his brothers farmer and Tolbert had taken part in the stabbing of Ellison Hatfield, but when the Hatfield mob came to settle the score. They had taken bud McCoy instead of Bill Bill carried the responsible. Ability of his brother's death on his conscience for years in October eighteen eighty nine at the age of twenty three he fell ill and died Randolph McCoy remained bitter for the rest of his life. But he felt it best that the feud come to an end before could claim any more lives, the Hatfield suffered fewer losses, but came to the same conclusion on February twenty fourth 1891 Twenty-seven-year-old cap Hatfield sent a letter to the editor published in the Wayne County news in this letter cap wrote the war spirit in me has abated and I sincerely rejoice at the prospect of peace. I have devoted my life to arms we have undergone a fearful loss of noble lives and valuable property in the struggle now, I propose to rest in a spirit of peace caps at a to'real didn't mention the fact that he was still wanted for murder in Kentucky. He also oversold his purported spirit of peace in eighteen ninety six cap was arrested after a shoot-out unrelated to the mccoys and convicted of manslaughter the crime carried only a one year sentence, which cap served in a small county jail in Williamson West Virginia. He was worried that if he stayed in custody he might be extradited to Kentucky so three months into his sentence campus gift from the jail using a drill that his wife managed to sneak in my most accounts, he fled to Oklahoma his spirit did eventually settle in his time away. He attended law school after a decade cap returned to West Virginia to start a legal practice. Capsule, their brother, John also carved out a new life for himself after the feud his hell cat life Nancy McCoy Hatfield divorced him. She in fact, left him for bad Frank Phillips, but Jones he remarried and started a logging business. His rule in the feud seemed to be in the distant past, however, a US marshal named Dan Cunningham was still interested in collecting the five hundred dollar rewards for the capture of any indicted hatfields in June of eighteen ninety nine Cunningham nab Johnny in the town of Gilbert. West Virginia and escorted him to Kentucky for trial Johnson was found guilty and he received a life sentence. But six years into the sentence, another inmate attack the warden of the prison jonky fought the other inmate off and as a reward he was granted parole. Unlike his sons devil Anse never saw. The inside of a jail. He kept up his quiet life in the mountains in nineteen eleven seventy two year old devil. Anse sent a message to Randolph. Mccoy's oldest son Jim Deva Lance offered. Jim a sum of ten thousand dollars and asked whether the indictment against him could be withdrawn Jim McCoy refused the offer. But sent back message telling devil Anse that he had let go of all resentments, and he did not consider the hatfields to be a target any longer even as the Hatfield McCoy families moved on from the feud the story has become immortalized as an American legend. It may be that people see their own grudges and passions echoed in the conflict. Psychologists, Michael McCulloch, Robert curse. Ben and Benjamin. Toback have suggested that revenge is a universal and necessary human add obtain often, but their work also states that the capacity for forgiveness is just as inherent to the human. Experience the final peaceful outcome of the Hatfield McCoy feud seemed to prove their points. Thanks again for tuning into crimes of passion. We will be back Wednesday with another up Assode, you can find more episodes of crimes of passion as well. As all parkas other shows on Spotify or your favorite podcast directory. Several of you have asked how to help us if you enjoy the show the best way to help us to leave a five star review. Don't forget to follow us on Facebook and Instagram at par cast and Twitter at par cast network. We'll see you next time when true love Meech true crime. Crimes of passion was created. By max Cutler as production of color media. And as part of the park has network. It is produced by Maxon Ron Cutler with sound design by Michael lanes ner production assistance by Ron Shapiro and Paul liba skin additional production assistance by Maggie admire and Freddie, Beckley crimes of passion is written by Christine. Pam he's I'm leaning Hobbs.

Randolph McCoy McCoy Nancy McCoy Hatfield murder Ellison Hatfield Kentucky Jim McCoy West Virginia cap Hatfield Frank Phillips Patty Klein McCoy Hatfield Jim Vance Johnny Hatfield Jim Perry Cline Anse Deva Lance Johnson Hatfield Hatfield
The Colt McCoy Game

The Kevin Sheehan Show

1:28:23 hr | 7 months ago

The Colt McCoy Game

"You want it you need it. It's what everyone's talking about the Kevin Sheehan show. Now here's Kevin you're listening to the Sports Pixar. We were off yesterday. Ended up having to stay at the radio station longer than I thought But that's all right. Today's to listen to the Cooley show which he was on Wednesday. I urge you if you have not listened to that to listen to it. It was great An hour and forty five minutes with him talking about free agency and redskins players and a lot of stuff. Actually that added to take the conversation in town about all of these guys that they've signed and other players that they may be thinking about including players that they might be drafting That you don't necessarily hear others in town talking about so I I would. I would urge you to listen to that Tommy's by phone of course how are you feeling You good note. No signs of anything right side feeling good. Are you staying away from the radio station? Well you know what Wednesday They had me call into sad for segment so I didn't go in Wednesday and show I co host Saturday morning. They told me to stay home. Okay they didn't tell my partner next to say all. They told me to stay home. Well that's I don't know what that means. I mean either. I don't know what that means. I know what it means. They're concerned about you. That would probably be the case. As I am a susceptible age group. I would think there probably are a little concerned over. Nineteen is gunning for you sir. That's that's what it's gunning for. You've already made that very clear. Yeah fell felt. Maybe I talked them into it with me with all my alarm but So now I'm not going into the radio station. The only trip I've made out of the fortress of solitude. This week was This morning when I went to see a rheumatologist about these Pain attacks I had over a couple of weeks Determined if I doubt or not and He didn't have the guts to pull the trigger and say. I give me medicine. Id So why have to wait until why didn't why do you put it that way? She didn't have the guts maybe she didn't diagnose it but it's only a lot of other things have been ruled out. I hate when you try to play doctor. It drives me nuts. What do you mean? She didn't have the guts to pull the trigger and say John F. Count more likely than not no. No I think I if I have anything. It's doubt But some doctors. You know you go in there and they listened to you and they say yeah. You're probably right okay. Well I'll give you this you know but there's other doctors who were just afraid to to sign their name through a prescription pet so Talk about old school So So she said well lots of wait and see if you have another attack all right away and then you can come in or else who threw it over like tell telephone or video or God only know. I don't know I don't know I. It was not fulfilling so if you think you have gout here first of all do you have that horrible pain in your in your feet and your toes right Yeah I pain in my elbow and then both feet at different times. We'll your elbows doubt right or am I wrong but it affects the joints and I have you know I. I don't know if you do but I have in my elbow so so you know I mean there's only Ev. They did blood work a couple of weeks ago. They ruled out a ton of stuff There's only two like she said Gal or or the Phil Mickelson Disease Story Attic Arthritis Right. It's not that I just know. It's not even if it were. It's not like you're it's GonNa Affect Your Golf Game Right. You know the so. I've had friends that have had gout knocking on wood. I never get it and knock on wood. I don't get anything actually in this day and age. I don't want anything I just want to be able to. You know sleep comfortably get up. Go to work in just have a normal life. I think in right now. I don't know that anybody's having normal life right now and by the way we have it much better than so many out there. People are losing their jobs. Their healthcare workers that are putting their health at risk every single day. Which is really remarkable stuff. I mean you know even when you think about just you know police and fire department and all of those people. The the grocery store grocery store clerk. Of course you know so but I've had friends that have had gout and they. Typically you know had a diet Okay so everybody knows. Tommy Tommy is not you know you Tommy is is not spelt. You're not skinny okay. But you've actually gotten yourself into much better shape in recent years. I've been very happy about that but your your diet. You don't need a lot of sugar you don't eat any sugar really do you know. I stopped drinking soda about a year ago. So the only sugar I get is what's sugar. That's in processed foods. That's the only sugar I get right. I don't I don't have any sugar other than what you know. What is already out there in foods? You Red Meat Eater I've got a big rig. He meter running red meat. Eater God mighty but I do like to partake in red meat. But I'm not a big steak guy. I would say maybe thirty percent of of a dinner meal of dinner meal might be read me. You do drink out you drink beer and beer alcohol and beer in red wine. Which has a lot of sugar in it. Obviously but I know that. A big beer drinkers. Sometimes get gout. I I don't I wouldn't say you're a big beer drinker right. Here's here's what happened. This doesn't explain elbow because he elbows started before I went to Florida and I wasn't doing anything out of the ordinary At that point and I might drink ordinarily four or five beers a week. Okay top maybe But when I went to Florida you know you go out a lot. You're now all the time and you know especially when I'm in Destin and Taibbi island with with with the family I'm drinking four or five six years accurate between lunch and dinner So that may have contributed to the foot pain. But since I've been home I haven't had any For well I had a beer with dinner last Sunday night. The only thing I've had in two weeks and I'm fine I I somebody said not. Somebody says you can't ever drink beer ever but you got to lay off fear. I'm fine with a beer once every two weeks through while that's fine with me so but but it may have been. It may have been accentuated by my by beer-drinking on the road in vacation. You tend to indulge. I well I hope you feel better and maybe that doctor you know should have prescribed you something just for the hell of it. I mean who knows maybe the drug would have taken would have you know fended off corona by the way you get me some drugs. I don't think you've got you've got all kinds of. I don't think I can get I need to take. Can you get it for me? Yes you find out the name of the drug and I'll get it for you of course I'm sure that'll happen So a couple of things number one. I think I talked about the other day Erin and I talked about with Cooley. That this this mention of this malaria drug that That that had some promise had been tested on Like forty patients with corona virus. In had you know had had looked like it is going to work anyway. I think we talked about it. The other day. Are you familiar with this new drug that they're it looks promising for the treatment of Corona Virus? Listen I block. I've I've blocked out all corona virus. At least drug. You Know Drug Cure News. Yeah I'm getting all my news now about Corona virus from Adam Silver and the NBA. That's a good place to get it. Yes it turns out that we'd up is better off if Adam silver has been running a country at this point because if you espn story that came out Last night about the past that took them to the ability to test their player so quickly they were on top of this. I have ill early. I haven't read it actually to tell me about it. 'cause now a religious they sent out a memo. January thirty first for think. They had already in their handbook a plan in place from conversations. They had two years ago about the possibility of pandemic and how to deal with it so they already had a plan in place in in their in their management manuals. Whatever you WanNa call them and then January thirty first remember. They do business and sign a lot of of course so they were. They were pretty much earlier in the year. Yes we did and January thirty first they said the memo after the first case in China basically based on all their clubs saying these are the preparations you have to take. I mean they. They sounded the alarm January thirty first and yet it was one of their players that basically shut down sports. Not that it wasn't going to happen anyway. And eventually and it could have been a hockey player could have been a college basketball player but it was rudy. Gobert down in by the way it was one of their players that was acting like a child leading up to it. And now you're telling me after the club after these teams essentially got sort of a stern warning and directions on how to handle it go go bear was rubbing his hands. And face and Sweat. All over microphones in the locker rooms Make him look even worse. You're right you're right it does But the the the drug that I was talking about the other day I think coolly and I were talking about it is this clorox chlorine and or chloroquine however you pronounce it anyway. The you mentioned you know Adam Silver and I actually said something on the podcast yesterday and go back to it here in a moment And you can weigh in. We're GONNA get to the Colt McCoy stuff. We're GONNA get to all the sports here but The there there are a couple of drugs that have been tested in this chloroquine which is a drug. That's been used to treat malaria. Apparently he's been working so they were. GonNa hold this big press conference yesterday. With of course the president leading the press conference to tell us about what? They believed to be a breakthrough. I'm sure many of you watched this. It was incoherent. It was so embarrassing. Ba- embarrassingly awful. I Swiss screaming at my TV. Shut the F. Up and let the Doctor Speak You. Moron. I mean look this is not I know people who are trump supporters. Who also feel that. He is narcissistic. You know a horrible communicator. And you know in in all of the other things you'd say about him maturity levels low A. As in eighth grade vocabulary whatever you would say instill they like them and they like their his policies etc etc. I'm not making this about. I'm watching this yesterday going. Look this is a crisis and we cannot have someone who cannot communicate breaking big news you get up in front of them the podium and you say we think we had some really good news here. I'm going to turn it over to FAO Chee. Who Wasn't there are? I'M GONNA turn it over to one of the doctors and they're going to explain it. He goes on and I've said this to you before. Tommy Narcissus make the worst leaders in crisis situations. Because it's all about them not about us any book on leadership anybody any of you have ever read. We'll say that a narcissist in general can be a good leader. Front running leader can build a company lots of ego with CEO's we know that lots of self-absorption with major league CEO's the best CEO's have self-awareness are not narcissistic and by the way have empathy. And this guy gets up there day after day and the only thing he seems to be empathetic towards is the stock market crashing. That's about the only thing it's all about him in. Yesterday I thought was one of the worst of it was incorrect. Toss it with the bottom of the barrel at this. When you think there can't be a bottom another bottom comes up. It is amazing that someone with all of his life experience and exposure has such a a limited vocabulary and be over the inability to truly truly communicate in a way that that connects in in that kind of a situation. Now with that said. I'm thrilled. I mean when we I think I knew what he was trying to explain. He couldn't pronounce drug names. None of them. He was butchering those left. And right and that's when I think the whole world even a trump supporter would be saying my God. Get the hell off the podium and let somebody who can communicate knows what they're talking about. Let them take this thing over so we can find out if there's a potential treatment or not because all you're doing is is making scream at the top of our lungs and of course. I can imagine that nobody around him would tell them to do that. Like Dude Dude. You just aren't. You've got a limited vocabulary. You don't communicate very well. This is serious shit. You make the announcement that there's big news in turn it over and let your experts run with it. That's how you handle it but let me go back to the other day because a lot of you got upset with me. A lot of you got upset with me when I said that personally. I think it cheapens the currency of legitimate racism to call the referral of the virus as the to to the China virus or or the Wuhan virus racism or xenophobic. I just Tommy to me referring to cove in nineteen you know as Wuhan virus or China. Virus is not in my opinion racist or xenophobic. Sorry you're not GonNa Convince me otherwise and let me finish when I'm going to say here because this is a follow up to the conversation the other day because some of you were really really many of you totally agreed with me and many of you. Who didn't really were very harsh. And I don't think you heard me clearly enough all right in my opinion accusing someone of being racist or xenophobic or even just accusing someone of saying something racist or Zena phobic when it comes to the referral of this by its geographic origin. It just to me. Minimizes legitimate. Racism that's me. That's my opinion geographic adjective used to describe a virus that actually originated in that geographic region to me isn't racist xenophobic. Just isn't now if using that geographic adjective and. I said this the other day in some of you didn't hear this part. If using that geographic adjective to describe the virus creates an unfortunate and ignorant reaction whereby Chinese Americans or somehow discriminated against or racially confronted or worse than I think our leaders should stop describing it that way all right not because it's racist or xenophobic but because our leaders have obligation to protect our citizens from ignorant dumb dumbs if some dummy believes that Chinese Americans are responsible for the virus because our leaders keep calling it and people around the world by the way keep referring to it as the China virus or the Wuhan Virus You know. And they are these ignorant people are spewing hate towards Chinese Americans or any Asian American. Then let's stop describing it that way. Okay so for all of you that heard me just say tell with the people that are being confronted about this. It's not what I said. What is what I said is. I don't believe it's racist or Zine phobic and I think it cheapens the currency of legitimate racism. That's what I do. That's my thought. I mean all evidence points to the origin of cove in nineteen being from Wuhan China and the early cover up in the lack of transparency is at least partially responsible for this becoming a pandemic and when someone in Communist China's says that referring to the Wuhan or the China viruses racist understand this. They had an outbreak just last year. That was killing pigs throughout the country they referred to it as the African swine flu. That's how they labeled it that's how they referred to it. I personally don't think people especially in the news media should be admonishing or lecturing people on how dangerous they're labeling of the viruses and I think they should inform people consistently the ignorant people inform them that Chinese Americans and Asian Asian Americans for that matter had nothing to do with the virus because they didn't and let's be real here for a moment people. Okay if we never referred to it one time. None of our leaders Democrat or Republican says could because some Democrats referred to as early on as the Wuhan virus do if nobody in the world had ever referred to it as the Wuhan China virus. Don't you think after round the clock coverage of this historic world pandemic that we would have already known the origin of it without it being named. Don't you think at this point if it had never been called? Wuhan virus or China Virus Ones. Don't you think we'd all know at this point? We're originated from? I think we would. So I WANNA be clear in in in in my reaction to some of you that really got after me on twitter and that's fine and I don't mind the debate at all. I don't think it's racist or xenophobic to use that Geagea geographic adjective to describe this virus. It's never been for any other virus. I don't think it is for this one with that. Said if it's leading to ignorant reaction from a bunch of dummies that think that. Oh my God. A Chinese-american. Walking down the street. It's that person's fault and that person's being confronted physically or verbally then. I don't think we should use that description. There you go. I'm done. Did you WANNA weigh in on this? Well I think I can. You made it well put I mean no matter how you feel about it ultimately According to some reports it's damaging to refer to it like that it may not be racist but it is damaging Certainly to the conversation that basically create a billing i. It's something like this and China China is the villain in this. I know that people aren't that's that's totally true. And I mean you know. And and look legitimately so people question the motive of the president when it comes to targeting People who aren't American I. He earned that reputation. So I mean the first move of course is going to be outrage and anger and cries of racism because they expect they expect the lowest common denominator from the president. They understand his motive from the past. So I mean I like you said at the very least damaging. There's a name for the virus already that people were using the referred to it. You don't need to substitute a new name no you don't you don't i. Just WanNa make sure you know the president's different conversation because the beginning of that incoherent press conference yesterday. He opens it up by saying basically. The latest on the emphasized very strongly that China virus and did. Did you see the picture? He had his speech writer had written. Corona virus. He had crossed it out. Chinese yeah so he's trying to make a point now whether or not you think. It's a racist xenophobic point. That's that's up to you. I'm just saying that if I call it the Wuhan virus or the China Virus Don't call me a racist or xenophobe. Okay just don't because it's not and and and Tommy you know I think a lot of these things and obviously we've had to confront and deal with a lot of these things over the years in more recent years. You know it just to me you know you gotta be careful because if everything ends up being racist or xenophobic nothing. Is You know we know all of us? What legitimate racism and xenophobia's we do and using as has often been the case with any of these viruses the geographic region as an adjective to describe. It is not hasn't been an isn't racism or Zena foup all right now again. Let me be clear like you said if it's doing damage okay and I've seen some of the pictures. Some of you sent me pictures at that. Look Awful now. I don't know if this is a one off situation or if it's dozens or hundreds or thousands of Chinese Americans Asian Americans that are being confronted with this thing. I hope it's a lot less than whatever number I gave out. Because it's stupid and but we have a lot of ignorant people in this country obviously a lot of dumb dumbs in this country so if the dumb dumbs if we need to protect those people who are Americans from the dummies the ignorant people then we should stop using it as as a way to describe it and we just refer to as cove in nineteen or the corona virus which those are the other names that everybody knows but again you can't you can't you can't separate the motive from the problem. If that this is the thing had a name it had it had an identity. Well the first name was really hand virus. That was everybody was calling it but go ahead. Fake and see what the most popular name was Corona Ryan. Yeah so it had an identity. It added name and each time to change. Why well again? I don't think he's trying to change it. It's well it was already referred to as the Wuhan Virus and the virus and the corona virus and Cova Ninety nine people. Most people don't know where we'll hint is Kevin well. Most people don't know where lime is Tommy or where the Ebola river is Tommy. That's not the point. The point is the point. That's what that's what people were calling early on yet but no. I didn't hear anybody called the virus early on virus. Maybe not I heard both but I heard Wuhan a lot more. That's true. Yeah that is true. I heard Wuhan a lot more. I don't think Wuhan is a Disney movie. Well maybe that's why people started referring doing his China so we got at least some recognition of where came from. Look this is. This is a really really serious situation. We all know this. You know this anybody that's still is going to claim that the you know this is out you know that it's overrated or the reactions. Been an overreaction. I mean you're insane at this point As as foul Chee who by the way is very impressive said the best possible result is if three months from now the country is saying. We way overreacted to this. That would be a wonderful result right because it would mean that it turned out pretty well. And by the way that over-reaction may lead to a more positive result which for some reason spring breakers in Florida are not getting the message at all I. When are they gonNA close those? Goddamn beaches in Florida. How do they do in Florida? Charlie apparently neither are the The Cherry Blossom fans. 'cause I heard I've been hearing all morning. How packed it was down there this morning. Viewing the Cherry Block. Will you can stay in your car in in view the Cherry walking around my God. Well at least you're outside the beach you are too but I mean my God. We've seen the videos coming from an air. Hasn't even cloud closed restaurants yet. They're not closing the beaches. This is crazy. How California? They're they're they're the first in more coming total lockdowns. What's going to happen in a total lockdown? Are you allowed? What what I mean. I've seen the shots of Italy. We've all seen that. But if states locked down here or if they went to a national lockdown does that essentially mean? You can't leave your home. Yes it does I think one grocery store trepidation or something. Yeah I was GONNA say you're you're allowed to yeah. Yeah you're allowed to leave the house. 'cause they said like they're not going to arrest you if you leave your house or anything. They're just basically an order. Hey unless you absolutely have to leave your house. Don't leave your house and they're not gonNA arrest you because they have no place to pull you. They're not arresting people for minor crimes. Not GonNa Rescue for walking out on the street. I mean look it there. There's no answers for a lot of this stuff you know Some of our leaders are are are like you said if the worst you can say. Is We overreacted? That then that's protection protecting. Yeah and by the way folks about thousands I I think I read somewhere that He promised he with the at the hearing today. or the the session. Today people have been in a panic because he hasn't been visible for the past couple of days. He wasn't there yesterday. Yeah people people are partying about. We can't lose. Doctor felt she now. I mean seriously he's the he's the communicator. I would even suggest to you. That pence is a million times better communicator. Than than trump. A million times better was he was he was understand that get some midwest he understands. I mean what do you agree with his politics or not? The understands the concept of governing a little bit league. I wish they would. I wish when he spoke that he would get up off his knees at the beginning of it. If you know what I mean I mean. There's a bit too much of that going on with everybody and that Deborah bricks is impressive to. I mean we get it. You guys are telling us what a great job the president's been doing we don't need to hear it every single time you step to the podium anyway Interesting times we're living in. I mean I'll tell you Tommy. My house is still crowded. Nobody's leaving early. I mean we we. We're hunkering down but I'll tell you what's happening a lot. There's a lot of food being consumed. I mean it's just like what else are you going to watch. Television read You know be on your phone on your computer and eat. Essentially although a lot of people are walking I got out and walked the dog yesterday for like an hour. I love my new dog. I don't know if I've told you about a new dog. Have what kind of dog is in English bulldog? Oh cool yeah. She's the best cool issue. What what what's her name her. Name's Laney I didn't name her But She's she's she's a fun dog all right We get great. We get some sports to get to First of all once I saw this news I was. You know. Wait a minute wait a minute but you gotTa Post Pictures Dog. I don't I haven't posted pictures of my dog. I might. I might do that if I've got some time to kill. I'd like to see a fair and I've sent you have. I sent you a picture of the dog. You showed me something. Yeah I've shown him some pictures that you've been here so I would show you pictures of the dog. The chair here with everybody by the way Aaron and I are within we're six feet it. There's plenty of space between I would. I would estimate actually closer to seven feet between the two of US may be closer to sixty backup a little bit. Actually all right the other thing I was gonna tell you man. There's no traffic. There's no traffic. I E I drove into downtown Bethesda. Half the places are closed was coming through Bethesda from silver spring after doing the radio. This morning I mean there's like no traffic. I want traffic back. Actually I want us to have traffic back. I'm sorry I'm sorry I wanted to say a one doctor anguish coach morning visit to the Galleria. It's not about the cow. What's going on there? That's that's Post nasal drip. I've had for a couple of weeks now from the cold at before I left for Florida You know I've worn rubber gloves. The disposable gloves doctor's office and and at one point she said smugly to me. She says you know you really spreading more Germs by wearing because everything he touched. Then you know you're going to have that on your gloves unless you change gloves so I pulled out a bag and I showed her. That's why I've got two or three pairs of gloves with me. As soon as I'm done here I'll change at put on another pair of gloves. I set her up pretty good. What was her answer that she she sounds like she may have been a problem this morning. Well no okay but she. She's she's giving me grief about the glove like I haven't brains to figure out yeah. I'm still tossing surfaces and stuff and I wouldn't touch my face with them actually. They're a good reminder not to touch your face with them and as soon as you know at a certain point I throw them away. Put on a new pair of gloves while I'm out right so you know I you know I was smarter than expected. Let's say that I had a conversation yesterday with a good friend. I mean I'm GONNA leave his name out but he was used to be one of the team doctors with the wizards and he's developed into a really good friend over the years and and you know that is a profession where your first reaction would be you know. Doctors Hospitals are going to be busy. You know they're gonNA be taking calls taking patients who are going to be sort of alarmed by all of this. I know they have to you. Know basically do telemedicine. The can't see patients. I mean your Doctor Saul you. A lot of doctors are not seeing patients. Because you know all it would all it takes is one patient that tests positive and you gotta shut the whole place down and now you've infected a lot of other people and I think that's what's going on to and a lot of emergency rooms and that's why there there's this discussion about the military getting involved in setting up these these temporary hospitals with bed so that they can see patients that don't have corona you know In in have other significant more pressing and probably more serious you know Needs Acute needs But you know he said you know this telemedicine stuff. It's like you know a lot of the patients at a Lotta. These doctors end up seeing older you know. They don't know how to do facetime. They don't have to put a camera on on their on their laptop if they even have a laptop and so right a lot of people at a disadvantage you know B B because of this. You're you're absolutely I WANNA point out I suggested After the hostage video that That the president could have announced that you know we're setting up temporary hospitals where activating military activating National Guard setting up temporary hospitals in these empty. Arenas that are not hosting any events right now except that they got really clean down because you know Rudy Gobert played in a bunch of 'em and other players testing positive. How about Sean Payton Being the first He apparently was not there. Weren't significant symptoms. And and he's feeling better in in any way Yeah So yesterday when the news came through that Colt McCoy had signed with the giants. I just thought man. You know Tommy's hunker down. He's reading this and he's probably excited for a son but also you're gonna be sad to see her son move out of the area that you live and you've been able to hang out with them for six years. Cole. Mccoy was here for six seasons. That's really remarkable for a guy that really barely even played. He barely even played and listen. He's just an accelerator train. Ride Away Buddy. So he's not that far right now. The cell is running but let us. He barely played. He was here six years but he had the biggest win of any quarterback over that six year period. I would argue at Monday night win. Not In terms of what it meant her. Say like it wasn't like a game that got them in the playoffs or something like that but But in terms of euphoria expectations you know Legacy it was. It's the biggest. It's the biggest day. Gruden's tenure Boy I didn't even consider that that's actually a good one to j gruden's biggest win. I mean you could probably say it was the game to clinch the division in Philadelphia But so this morning and we'll do it right now and I wasn't planning on doing it right now but I think it's actually I go through a lot of these. And you're gonNA remember even though I didn't prepare you for this. You're going to remember These games to the Colt McCoy game the late October. Twenty fourteen game in which he came in started the game the week before many of you remember kirk cousins had already taken over in two thousand fourteen for rg three who got hurt in the opener. or hurt early in the second game against Jacksonville Kirk came in had a couple of really good games and then lost. Confidence started throwing picks and Jay. Gruden benched him. Halfway through a game in mid October against the titans at Fedex Field Colt McCoy comes in the first pass. He throws a hitch to peer zone. And he takes it seventy yards for a touchdown. The redskins ended up winning. That game and Colt McCoy starts the following Monday night at Dallas two and five Washington against five and to Dallas Tony Romo DeMarco Murray Dez Bryant Cole. Beasley cowboys are pretty good. That year and Colt McCoy leads the Redskins to a twenty two seventeen overtime win in Dallas. They were a near double digit. Underdog that night. It's another one of those games that goes and cowboy redskin. Laura is a game that you know when you least expect it because really any cowboy fan will tell you any redskin fan will tell you about the rivalry. You know what you never know like. Anything is possible in the game's over the years like you think you're better than that team in. Somehow you end up losing that game. We've seen that in that rivalry. That was one of them. You know ten point underdogs nine and a half point. Underdogs and Colt McCoy goes twenty. Five of thirty for two hundred. Ninety nine yards rushing for a touchdown and the Redskins beat the cowboys in overtime. Twenty two seventeen a game that will forever be known by Redskin fans as the Colt McCoy. Game that is a game with a name. Tommy and there are lots of others in redskins history and I ended up going through this. We took I could've taken calls for all three hours of the show this morning. The phone bank never ever wasn't completely full with people calling in with redskin games with name. So I'm going to get the others in a moment you you can start thinking about him too but I wanted to mention that this was also the first time that we realized if we say first time it was another example of the owner stepping into an area that he should never stepped into Jay Gruden was forced to start. Rg three the following week. Rg Three was back healthy. They were playing Minnesota. The following Sunday on the road the REDSKINS had gotten it to three and five. Colt McCoy had just played a wonderful game. A memorable game a memorable game and a half for that matter and I wanNA point out at that point the team. The player were so in love with Colt and so one hundred percent behind Colt after that Dallas game. Oh my God yes. Oh my God. There's because what we sort of knew at that point but some of us knew you and I knew we were talking to people. I was talking to Mike at that point. Mike it yet to come on for that. You know to our reveal with us on our show but we we were. Everybody was starting to get you know. The news certainly media members about how Griffin wasn't very. Well liked that. He wasn't very good. That gruden was already extremely frustrated with him in his first season He was already starting to see that. This guy couldn't do it couldn't run. His offense and Colt knew the playbook you know back and forth. He knew it front way sideways backwards. The whole way he was so confident. Gruden was in Cole McCoy. But Snyder said nope. You're starting Griffin. You told me you could develop Griffin. Were three and five Roberts. Ready to play in the truth is is that the following week. Robert didn't play that poorly against Minnesota. They lost the game. But then it went downhill and it was ugly. He was terrible against Tampa. Horrible Against San Francisco. I mean these were the days were Cooley would do his film breakdown and he would say guys. I got to tell you what seriously I can't even evaluate the other players on offense because the quarterbacking is so atrocious. And that's when we got the story from NFL network. I think was breer. Who The story where. Gruden was gist laying into griffin publicly. It was truly one of the worst coach. You know articles in season about one of his own players. We'd ever ready totally submarine. He decapitated a griffin and did it publicly. Which probably you know was not the right thing to do. I remember John Thompson. Coach was still doing a show. And I remember him saying. Y- you can't do that. Maybe he wasn't doing show. I forget maybe I forget maybe you and I had him on the show or something and he said you can't do that to your quarterback publicly. You know whether he feels it. And whether he's right or not you can't do it. And he just annihilated griffin embarrassed him in that story end so griffin then got benched he finally. I was able to convince. He basically told He he told Snyder in. Bruce what Shanahan had once told Snyder and Bruce and that is if I don't start the other guy I lose the locker room remember. Mike told us that at the end of twenty three. He's like I got to the point where I was losing the locker room by playing him and Gruden. It got to that point too. He was losing the locker room by by continuing to stick Griffin out. There now. Colt McCoy didn't have another moment. You know the rest of the he didn't and then he got hurt against the giants but will forever have the Colt McCoy. Game and so Off The top of your head other redskins games with names because I got a long list including a long list. That callers and guy on twitter sent me that say. Recent wreath is ten twelve years or so One that comes to mind is asleep. Engaged game yet. That was only list. Yeah trying to end of two thousand eight Zoran run swinging gate. The the the fake field goal play the giants had called time out and they had They had to line it up and he ran it again thinking that they hadn't seen it and they stopped a cold. I mean you say demise is the PURP- you like you like that. No doubt which by the way has two names for that game. Do you remember what the other one was? No code regular bread. Yeah the Code Red gave. That's right against Tampa. Yeah that was the code red haired. Yeah that's two names. Well I mean a lot of things things in that game. Just lots of things could've went the other way down. They had lost that game guy. And you know what Tommy? That's so true because think about how much money kirk cousins made over the last five years. It's like one hundred and eighty million something like that. If he doesn't bring them back against Tampa in the U like that Game Down. Twenty four nothing. He is probably benched now because they had a bye week. They were going into a bi week. I'm pretty sure they were going to. They were and then it was like New England coming out on the other side. He might get benched. They probably don't win the division that year and his whole career moneywise earnings wise is different. Although Kyle was always going to give him a shot you know Sean would have probably given them a shot to 'cause they loved him and they thought he could play but that really was such a huge moment for him and for the team as a coach. That's right and the coach. Of course. Of course see me obsessed with. Yeah yeah calling for Kirk a code red for him but we all said that worst case if they lose kirk gets benched. That's it. Yeah yeah you know and airs one that comes to mind And this is a very rare one because it's a preseason game talk I've got. That will made the list to know how many how many preseason games are on the list. None just one. Oh soccer. Yeah we don't even have to call it the Osaka Game. We say suck as Redskin fans and everybody knows what we mean and for those that. Don't this is a pre season. Game in Steve spurrier's first year as Redskins head coach in two thousand two. They're playing the forty niners Osaka Japan and the first preseason game the skin score thirty eight points throw for four hundred yards or whatever it was and he's he basically walked away saying this is easy. I figured out my favorite part of that is in the regular season alright. So a month or two months later they play a game against the forty niners in candlestick and they lose the game to the forty niners and they sort like thirteen total points and after the game. So help me. God you can find this quote spurrier. Says they didn't run some of the same defenses. We saw Osaka. And somebody like I think it was Andy and Steve had him on his had him on their show every Monday night following the Games and I think Steve may have said will. They probably didn't have a lot of the same players on the team that you've faced in Osaka. I mean that's how completely clueless he was to the pro game. You know. He had no idea he just thought well. Remembering College. You don't have a preseason that's right well it's studied at Osaka Film. See what they're running. And it's like wait we got new numbers jerseys out here That's a good one. That's the only preseason game on the list. Okay that's my contribution. Let me give you the names like to me the all-time Redskin name Games. Okay this seat. Cushion game is on the short list of the all time you name Games. That's the playoff game against Atlanta. And the Falcons Jerry Glanville de Dion Sanders. Mc Hammer and of Andhra Holyfield or on the sidelines and they handed out seat cushions before the playoff game. It was pouring rain. Mud Gerald Riggs scores late in the game in the seat cushions. Start flying out of the crowd and onto the field it was it was a surreal scene. These yellow seat cushions. You know fifty five thousand of them basically are flying out onto the field. That's that's a definite you know redskin game with a name. A madero green punt return game is against the bears in the playoffs. That's an all time moment. Whenever you refer to that game it's the Darryl Green punt return when he had the punt return and pulled the rib cage muscle during the return and it gave the Redskins the lead at soldier field and they went on to win it the Monday night miracle which is one of my all time favorite games but Brunell the Santana Moss twice in the final five minutes of the game at Dallas on a Monday night when the redskins were down thirteen nothing generated no offense the entire night and then came the miracle two touchdowns both bombs to Santana Moss. One on a fourth down and the redskins stunned the cowboys. Fourteen thirteen in the Monday night. Miracle and then sticking with Monday night. You've got the Monday night massacre. Which was the Michael Vick game where you know? The the redskins signed Donovan mcnabb to that Phony Baloney extension the week leading up to it and it was twenty eight nothing at the end of the first quarter and on the first play the second quarter was thirty five to nothing and they went onto win at fifty nine twenty four There is the The Ken Houston game which was another Monday night game. You know the redskins beating the cowboys in nineteen seventy three fourteen to seven on the final play of the game. Craig Morton throws to Walt Garrison. Garrison's about to get into the end zone and Ken. Houston you know. One of the great safeties in the history of the League comes up and makes the tackle. That's always been referred to as the Houston game and by the way that's part of my twitter. Avatar is the Ken. Houston tackle on Walt Garrison. I've been thinking about changing that for a while but I actually like to look at it. there is the the Joe Theismann broken leg game which was another one day. Night game against the giants. Everybody understands that game. There's a body bag game the body bag game in the Clint Longley game or on the shortlist of the all time games. The Clint Longley gained seventy four Thanksgiving Day game when they knocked out. Staubach and Longley comes in and throws three touchdowns which gave Scott van pelt grandfather a heart attack. Which is one of our favorite Thanksgiving weekend story. Scott tells it he was. You know I don't how old he was. He was like six years old. And he's watching the cowboy game on Thanksgiving and old GRANDPA Lorenzo as Longley throws the last past drew Pearson. For the touchdown he clutches his chest and the next thing Scott remembers his old GRANDPA's being wheeled off into on a stretcher into an ambulance. And yeah the body bag game. Of course the Monday night game in Nineteen Ninety two game that brought Brian Mitchell into the game late to play quarterback and one redskin after another was carted off the field. The Eagles pummeled the redskins. It also by the way time he created not a name game but one of my favorite all time. Revenge Games in Redskin history to you know a month and a half later at the vet and Philadelphia. Rippin was back because they went through. Humphries Rutledge Brian Mitchell in the body bag game but the playoff game in Philly at the Vet Wildcard game and the Redskins won twenty. Two six Buddy Ryan runs off the field before the clock. Even expires doesn't shake Joe Gibbs his hands a hand and he gets Fired the next day that was a sweet satisfying revenge game like none other for me and Redskin History. A never forget how satisfying that was to answer the body bag game by knocking the eagles out of the playoffs in their home field. And sending Buddy Ryan off the field for good that was great There's the head but game gusts Viraat. You know smacking his head against the wall after school. After the only touchdown of the game for the Redskins in a seven seven tie against the giants There's the Sean Taylor game which you know. He had several of them. But this one is when Troy Vincent Block the Field Goal Taylor picks it up on the final. Play the game and a tie game. He's running around and he gets Trying to score and they grabbed his facemask. Which leads to an untimely? Nick Novak walk-off Feargal. That's a good one Hold on what else Where's my list? Oh so they're here's another game with sort of two names to it. The no Danny no game. You remember that. No when Tom Landry we absolutely which some people also refer to as the fatigues game because the redskins arrived in Dallas got off the plane and a lot of the players were wearing army fatigues like they were going to war and that game was late night season. Both teams were twelve into. They were the two best teams in football that year. Nineteen eighty-three The two best teams in football at dallas-fort Division for the number one seed and the redskins blew out the cowboys. Thirty one to ten and on a fourth in one Danny White was supposed to try to draw the Redskins offsides but he took the snap. The redskins got the stop on the running play. And there's that famous shot Tom Landry. Who never showed any emotion screaming? No Danny no as don't take the snap and and boy you know nothing when you think about the the great rivalry redskins cowboys over the years. Especially when you you know bring up the the significant figures in the rivalry. Tom Landry obviously was one of the top five figures in in the rivalry and he never showed emotion. And yet you knew. How big that game was you know how much they to beat the redskins because he showed emotion like you never saw on that play. Part of the identity of the cowboys was built on their rivalry with the REDSKINS and and and and Landry was a big part. A building that identity right you know so absolutely. I mean he didn't verbalize it like maybe toward talented but you know he felt the same way. The the There was oh the Darryl Green runs down Tony Dorsett game. You know that Monday night. Game in eighty three. That opened up. The season cowboys won that game. Thirty one to thirty the most memorable play of that game in a memorable play in redskin history is Darryl Green playing his first game as a redskin and him starting fifteen yards behind the great Tony Dorsett and on the other side of the field in somehow catching door set like at about the five yard line man. Darryl Green is in a in a bunch of these you know. There's the rams skin game of Nineteen seventy-one George Allen's first year they went to the coliseum with all the former rams that he had signed and traded for during the off season and that was actually a game where the Redskins Clinched THEIR FIRST PLAYOFF BERTH. In like twenty five years And there are a few others. I mean you know thirty. Five thirty four. The Cowboy Redskin game at the end to seventy nine. Some of the caller said what about forty eight forty seven which was the highest Monday night scoring game of all time until I think until Aaron I didn't know the answer to this on the air and I didn't go. Look it up the rams chiefs Monday night game from a couple years ago remember was did that break. The redskins packers record for the most points wasn't fifty fifty something. I think it did often look that up at fifty four fifty one first. Nfl game in history where both teams scored more than fifty money that that broke the redskins packers record for the highest scoring Monday night game which stood forever in by the way. Moseley missed a couple of field goals in that game including a thirty nine yard or at the gun that would have won the game. Fifty to forty eight That was one of two games in nineteen eighty three that the redskins lost in their fourteen into season and both of the Games they lost. Were by one point. You know to to the cowboys on Monday night. Football thirty one thirty into the packers on Monday night. Football Forty eight to forty seven but you can tweet me or tweet. Tommy at Kevin Sheehan DC. Or at Tom Lavoro if I mean I know we've left some games often. I we I took calls and wrote down some of the ones that I didn't have some somebody came up like if somebody. Who's trying to remember Gary Clark Game? I'm Gary Clarke had so many great games but I don't remember a game sort of named for Jerry Clark What about the shock shock and awe game you know what Tommy I mean you and I call it that I've forever giving you credit you nailed that one? Rg Threes first game against the New Orleans. Saints in two thousand twelve his rookie debut and Tommy said during the week leading up to the game. He's like I am predicting shock and awe and it was. He was unbelievable. I mean yes the offense. They rolled out in that game was spectacular To Watch Anyway I think we've hit on a bunch of them but feel free to tweet us any that we have forgotten I would probably say that the body bag game the CL- you know. Some of these are losses. The Clint Longley game The seat cushion game The Monday night miracle. Those are the ones that really have one name like. If you say as Redskin fan the Clint Longley game. Everybody knows what you're talking about the body bag game. Everybody knows what you're talking about. You know the Monday night Monday night miracle everybody knows what you're talking about and really you know the Code Red. You liked that. Everybody knows what you're talking about pretty much darryl green putting I. I would argue the swinging gate game. It's the one that people think of to define the The tenure of Snyder. I think that that is true that it is a memorable memorable label. I don't know how I don't know that you immediately immediately say oh. That's that giant Monday night game before resorting got fired. Oh I think they do. I think everybody does. And they got beat like forty five fourteen seventy five to twelve or something if something like that. He was terrible and then they lost the following week with when they hired Bruce L. in the following week and fired Vinnie Serrato. And Alan was there for another night game Debacle THEY GOT. Shut out by the cowboys. Seventeen nothing or something like that. Oh here's here's one last thing on this so the Seattle playoff game you know the RG three getting injured game which will be a much debated game forever right. It's it's the it's it's certainly a top ten memorable all-time redskin game because of the circumstances but it really doesn't have a name to it although some people said it's the RG knee game. I've never heard it described as that. It's just the Seattle playoff game where Griffin got hurt. I don't know that anybody ever really labeled it with a name. I never heard of a knee before I mean you know we you know. Some of our friends still blame old shanty for that one. Whatever I am. Let's get to some other redskins stuff more current As in would things had happened yesterday and things that may happen here in the coming days. Logan Thomas. They signed To a deal. Logan Thomas is a tight end now. Most of you remember him as a quarterback for Virginia Tech they also signed Cornelius Lucas to a two year. Five point. Three million dollar deal Lucas played tackle for the bears. Larry's really been a journeyman for the most part and he six eight He's he's a backup. This is a depth you know signing unless they get desperate and they lose Trent Williams and they can't resigned Donald Penn and and they don't anybody else to play because I'll tell you what's becoming very clear To me is they have no no confidence in Jaren Christian to be a starting tackle for them. I think that ship has sailed. I think the tape proves it. I think the fact that he played so little in meaningless games at the end of the year sort of was an indication that they pretty much moved on from Christian. A third round pick But Lucas is more of a depth guy. I think there's a chance and Cooley told us to see other day that Donald Penn could end up being resigned in Josina Anderson who does a really good job as a reporter sort of suggested that Donald Penn would be open to coming back. I think it brings up as we as we continue to to move forward with free agency without a Trent Williams. Deal Tommy to me. The it's not likely okay but the possibility grows day by day that Trent Williams could play for the redskins next year. Now I'd still put it at a twenty percent twenty one percent chance you know. I think it was a twenty percent the other day. So move it up to twenty one percent now. Bottom line is he wants too much money and the redskins aren't going to get back what they want for him At least as of now you've got a draft loaded with left tackles. I think we may be in a situation. Where if a team pulls the trigger on Trent? It'll be after the draft I I can't say that definitively they may decide in evaluating the draft. You know what our answer is not in the draft. Let's make a move for him right now and Tampa could do it. You know Arizona could still do it but I think that the left tackle situation is going to be interesting because I bet some at redskins park. Think there's still a chance he could line up and play left tackle for him. I guess though I don't see how I just don't see I just don't see that happening I think they're going to have to trade him half they have to find somebody to trade him to somebody that's willing to pay him what he wants in somebody willing to pay. The redskins compensate the redskins for what they want. If that doesn't happen he's not going to hold out two years in a row now. He's not so his demands will come down and it'll become more tradeable. That's possible trade. I think I think the the odds significantly favor that too I'm just saying that if he is like Javy cloudy right now. You know counties unsigned. It's very interesting. The clowney thing I found out I mentioned this maybe a week ago or two weeks ago in the podcast that that Houston offered. Jv and clowney straight up for for Trent Williams and the Redskins weren't even listening at that point but they got the message across to at least somebody. Maybe not Bruce but somebody else in the organization that they would trade David clowney straight up for Trent Williams the redskins. You know they were. They were intent on making Trent Bleed As less carpenter wrote So clowney. You know when he got traded to Seattle Which was another? You know? Mindless trade by Bill. O'brien and Houston in terms of what they got back. But part of that trade was CLOWNEY GETTING COMMITMENT FROM SEATTLE. That they wouldn't franchise him. You know what Erin in some ways cloudy probably would have preferred to have been franchised. Maybe I mean nobody's paying him what he wants in. It's sort of a you know it's sort of an indicator for Trent Williams right now that you know you're not worth what you think you're worth you know Clowney Godman. He's such a good player. I know I would want clowney since we last. I think this is going to have to. I think both sides are gonNA come to reality. Where transparent have the lowest demands and the redskins are going to have to lower their expectations of? What's cat for him? I would not lower my expectations. I would not I would. I know you would. I feel differently now. I I mean I'd love to see him traded but only for you know The top half of the second round pick or higher nothing lower than that. If I don't get that I'm not trading and I'm just telling him go ahead hold out if you want or come in and play in three. Two threes is sort of the equivalent to one too. So yeah I mean I I would be. I'd be okay with two third rounders. I guess the have him couple of other teams have them. I think I'd be the third round this year or next year. Yeah I gotTa pull up the draft of the jets. The jets do have Jets how I don't need to third round this year. Why not. I'll take one third rounder this year and a third round or next year. I'll take him sooner than later. They're they're they're worth more immediately I just let me just look this up real quickly because in the third round I think it was the jets that had to third rounders yet. They do they have sixty eight and seventy nine And then other teams that would be potentially interested what is Tampa have in the second round and the second round Tampa Scott Friday the thirteenth pick. They have forty five overall so that's thirteenth exactly in the second round. And that's what they had. Oh they have to second rounders no they have one second rounder. My Fault Tampa has one second rounder and Tampa has one third rounder Anyway all right so Real quickly before we get to a quarterback conversation. 'cause there was there was some quarterback discussion yesterday about guys like you know well two days ago by Cam Newton yesterday about James Winston The the other signings that they made since we were last is. Sean Davis is fine with me. I ought to be honest with you. I think Monty Nicholson's upside is much higher. But Monte Nicholson you is is a bit of an issue with the off the field stuff that he's been involved in and by the way he misses games. Now Sean Davis was available for not a lot of money. You know deal one year deal worth up to like four or five million bucks because he missed fifteen games last year with a shoulder injury I personally think that this guy. Jd mckissick play. It also is very telling me that they signed. Jt JD mckissick. Because it was my understanding that they were gonNA make a run at Kenyon Drake if he had become available and what it says to me is them signing mckissick. Even though it's not a big deal it's a one year deal. Okay but they feel they have a need at running back a versatile running back. Why because Darius Geiss you know isn't always available and by the way you know there may be some other concerns with various geiss juicy. The Yeah I saw. That isn't ever availed. Yeah ever I mean out of the thirty two possible games. He could have started in. He's been available for three of them right. Am I right three or four of them? Mckissick fast I is is a former receiver at Arkansas state. Which is why he became a really good pass option for the teams that he played for Detroit Seattle He wouldn't surprise me if he ends up making the team. It means the end by the way clearly For Chris Thompson and then reset. He's when he was one of my favorite player. Everybody's right that's a smart guy. Such a good guy and like I said this before when you saw him and Jordan Reed healthy and on the field. At the same time you saw how potent the redskins offense could have been under grew. Know those guys when they were healthy and the line was healthy. And by the way you had Gar sewn and you had Jackson and you had gruden's pass offense with a guy running it like cousins. Who really knew how to run it. They air in twenty sixteen. You know moments in two thousand fifteen in early two thousand seventeen before all the injuries they really did have a very potent offense. They did absolutely and he could have been a big part of it My Phantom hand draft pick drafted the same year Jordan Reed was And I hope had success elsewhere in his career me too because what you said is so true in a lot of our listeners. Don't always get the sense this you if you ask any media person you can't find one. That didn't love Chris Thompson. Chris Thompson was mature. He was smart. He was a great interview. He was a nice nice guy and you know not all of them. Are that way you know. That's let's be honest. Not all of them. There are a lot more that are like that way but Chris Thompson was certainly a media favorite in a way. You could tell a team favorite in a coaching staff favorite. And for what it's worth. When I had him on my cigars and curve balls podcasts and one of the guys one of the questions I asked him was who defeated nudity. Like going up against who gave him the most problems on defense as a back and he mentioned. Thomas Davis has one of the smartest players in the late. Well let me end with that before. You get into your column about the quarterbacks and we can talk about quarterbacks here for a moment so 'cause I this I forget if we mentioned this on Wednesday night Sir Thomas Davis's GonNa turn thirty seven before the season. He's a longtime linebacker in. The League had very productive season last year in Los Angeles for the chargers He was one of Ron Rivers favorites. If you remember those Carolina teams with Keithly and Davis in K. One short and then in the secondary guys like Norman. Etcetera Kirk Coleman. The great really good defensive teams. The team that went to the Super Bowl. Thomas Davis was tackling machine was smart was well liked was like a coach on the field. And if you watch what the Redskins have done here early in Free Agency. You know one of the things. We're learning and by the way I would say this about Amari Cooper to Amari Cooper is is very. Well liked very coach. -able thought to be a super opposite of the diva wide receivers. Not to mention really really talented. Which is why I think the red skins really made a a hard run for for Cooper but they reassigned Adrian Peterson. Okay who everybody likes and respects in is become a real mentor and leader on that team. They re sign Jon Bostick Jon. Bostick was like the coach on the field last year. By the way John is another one of those guys that everybody likes out there smart And they signed. Thomas Davis like right. Now what we're learning about what reveres trying to put together here and by the way just the fact that they're really pushing hard on another running back might tell you what they think about. Not only the durability but maybe something else about dairy guys you know in some of their young running backs But they want you know. They want a combination of really good players. But he's trying his best to change the culture you know. He's just doing his best in trying to bring people that will not only be able to play. Well and Davis played well last year in Zimbabwe. If I didn't say this on the Wednesday podcasts because I think he hasn't been signed yet but Davis is an outside linebacker for those of you wondering in their four three defense. He's really more of a weak side outside linebacker. Which is what I thought. Maybe Coal Hawkin would play. I think they're gonNA like Ryan Anderson on the other side and then you know your middle linebacker right now. You know as John Bostick depending on what Reuben foster is availability is in by the way how they feel about Reuben. Foster is a new day. You know this is a new group in and I think we're seeing some of the decisions made about the quality the character of the people that they want in the organization as well But anyway okay that leads us to your column and a conversation not a column. It was just a twitter. I'm sorry 'cause I didn't think I gotta call him from you but I thought you said that before the show We'll get to that After I quickly mentioned stamps dot COM STAMPS DOT COM is perfect for small businesses but in the environment were living in right now. It's good for you at home as well. It saves a trip and eliminates a trip to the post office If you're hunker down and you need to continue to pay bills and put stamps on them and get them into the mail us. Stamps DOT COM. It saves you time it saves you. 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They still don't have one. What are they GONNA do well? That's the question. I put out on twitter this morning. I mean we've heard from Ron Rivera about competition at the quarterback position And we keep hearing that drum being Being banged in terms of bring again a quarterback who can push dwayne and compete with dwayne. And then I see you know. The some of the names mentioned like when they became available. I Cam Newton and Jameis Winston And I'm thinking well I can't do this coming here If he's not the starter but let's even say you're bringing Jameis Winston. I don't think that's happening either To compete which Wayne Haskins. He's going to beat out. Wayne Haskins some odd. I mean come on. He's got a beat him out. He's a five one four or five year. Nfl quarterback from thirty touchdowns in the league. Last thirty three interceptions. I know he's got a was it or was it opposite. Aaron WAS THIRTY THREE TOUCHDOWN. Berry I. It was thirty two. I think it was thirty three touchdowns thirty and I think that's what it was so so my question would be. Are they really going to bring in a quarterback that would that would risk? Actually winning the top. If they had a real competition or they go to bring in a nonthreatening backup and I've maintained and you have all along that they're not going to bring in somebody who's really going to compete with. Wayne. They're going to bring in somebody who knows the minute you sign them. Everybody knows he's a backup including him. That's what I thought. Would that's been my take all along. Is that when we got down to it? They would sign. You know the we'll chase Daniel's sign with somebody else but it would be you know a Brett Hundley or a Matt Moore or it would be one of those guys that we would all say to ourselves as fans of the team. Y- that guy's a backup that's who they bring bringing in a backup Yeah I I. So they're not gonNA they're not going to bring in one of these guys To to push away because there are many games those guys left except for Newton and Winston Right. Am I forgetting anybody else's land spot? Andy Dalton you'd have to trade for and Newton might get released. Yes yes you might and I keep hearing about how how close the relationship is between Newton and Ron Rivera. I've heard that for nothing but two days. I mean I don't know that. But that's what that's what you hear from people and Carolina. Well it was that guy. God Why do I keep blanking on his name The the fantasy guy for ESPN Matthew Berry Matthew. Berry who is a big redskin fan? He was the one that had that like a month ago. That said Cam Newton in Rivera are super super tight. Do you think he winds up here. Well the thing that I said the other day that you weren't here for I don't think no I think the answer is no personally. I don't think they should want Cam. Newton I'm here. I'm for for a number of reasons but the reason that they might want someone like Cam. Newton would be the following. This would apply to all teams with new coaching staff. Sir New quarterbacks in that is Tommy with no off season you're not gonNA have. Ota's you're not gonNA have minicamp. I mean at this point you might have a very condensed training camp. It's GonNa be really hard to you know. Get a new quarterback in a new offense to you up to speed on your system that you're trying to implement it's going to be much more difficult. You know how we hear every year how important it is for all the off-season worked for the quarterback in the offense and the whole thing so all I thought about the other day and I don't think it would happen. But what if they get into a position where they say? We've got no off-season work. They're going to give us a week of training camp and then tells to go start playing games or two weeks of camp and we're going to start playing games you know. Then maybe maybe they bring in Cam to say we got somebody that can run. The offense until Dwayne is comfortable enough to run it. It wouldn't be Dwayne now. It wouldn't be way fault but he wouldn't be happy about it and I I guess I guess we could find out that F. L. Football is not brain surgery if people can get ready for within a week or so. Maybe you'll hear is about how hard the offense is to learn and how what a struggle it is to learn the offense true and and so. I think we'll see a little bit different seeing if it's a very short and preparation periods to start a season to throw it you here in a moment but I do you know I i. I understand the sarcasm And you know the bottom line is they'll figure it out and if they have to play a game they'll get they'll get a scaled-down playbook ready to play. But I do think it's one of those things that you know. It's not just the quarterback when it's a new coaching staff. You know when. It's a new coaching staff in a new system. It's everybody on offense and if you don't have an off season to implement that remember you know when you've got a new coaching staff you're exempt from hard knocks right. That's one of the exemptions from hard knocks right Aaron. If you've got a new coaching staff. Yes you typically. Don't you typically get an extra minicamp when you've got a new coaching staff or at least that was the case in the old? Cba You know. There's a reason for that because it does take time to put in that new system so teams that are coming back with. Continuity are teams. That you're probably GONNA WANNA play early in the season if there's no offseason if we end up having no off season now you know but no go ahead. I was GonNa say you know. Somehow we always managed to figure out at the L school field how to run play. We managed to figure it out. Tell you what you know in the Games that we would play on Brookway drive. It was see that tree over there. You know fake like going out and then run a post. Yeah you always could figure what do you think? What do you think Saudi says? It's really tailor exactly So there's another name that that became available yesterday and that name is. Joe FLACCO Oh black is available. You know I feel badly for Joe. You know him most people that listen no that I've always liked Joe FLACCO. I think he's clutch performer. Always has been I've never ever said. He's an elite quarterback. I've just said that in a big game I'd love to have joe because like like Tommy. We used to joke. He was oblivious to anything. Not The brightest bulb on the Bush never felt pressure because he really didn't understand what was supposed to be a pressure situation. More likely than not always incredibly well liked by his teammates and respected by his teammates. When he when he left. Baltimore last year I loved some of the things that his teammates both current and former said about him in what Harbaugh said about him all the more loved flacco even though I think a lot of fans realized it was time to go in a different direction with Lamar Jackson and you know the truth of the matter is last year in Denver he was. Actually you know the numbers won't say it. But I was following the broncos early in the year last year and watching some of those games and they got jobbed. I mean he brought him back in a game They started off the season with a Monday night loss at Oakland. And then they got totally hosed on a game or flacco drove him for the winning touchdown and there was a a late. Hit called on on the On the Chicago quarterback trubisky that gave him new downs and they ended up winning on a field goal. Same thing happened to him against Jacksonville. They started Oh and four they should have been two into okay co potentially could have been three in one and then they started winning some games and then flacco got hurt And you know. And that was it you know they. They put drew lock in. They like lock locks. The future FLACCO is released. He's available personally. I think he'd be a really good backup. He's not a guy right now. That probably I think he probably understands that. He's not going to get a starting job next year. And he's a great teammate. And by the way a guy that you could bring in that's sort of similar to Duane you're not I think Twain's more mobile But you know big strong can make the throws. It's not a bad backup. I don't know you've got a lot more faith Joe flacco than I do so you don't even think he can be a backup not here. I don't think close to home. Do the Redskins were interested in FLACCO. Last year there were some reports that the Redskins were one of the teams that were interested in flacco but flacco went to Denver the Denver money and the RAW elway. push Made made that the more tradeable partner. 'cause THEY SORTA GAVE. Joel say I think into where he got traded Well there aren't look in terms of the guys. That would really push dwayne at this point. Bridgewater signed Brady signed rivers signed Mariota signed are committed. Right to the raiders. So there who's left of the guys that you know other than it's Winston Newton. Those are the only two right right. So if you don't think Winston I don't and what's really interesting. All the reports that Winston could end up in New England. I think that's fascinating. I think Winstons got so much talent man so much talent if if for whatever reason if if he can figure out a way to stop throwing it to the other team as much as his own team. He's going to be prolific by the way Tommy. Aaron did did I mention this to you? The other day I was listening to this interview with Rick. Stroud on mad dog is route. Is this reporter in Tampa covered? Buchan ears in this guy went on and on about how well respected and well liked Jameis. Winston is by players and coaches in Tampa. He said that specifically said the coaches Bruce Arians they love Jameis Winston. They love his talent. They love his leadership. They love his commitment And the problem is he's throws to many inter interceptions. That's the problem but I think that's a different view or narrative on him than most people would think. Yeah I think it is absolutely. I'd love to see him in New England with Bela Tick. Yeah that'd be interesting. I'm excited about Brady and Tampa. I really am Words coming in on the deal that he signed Do you have that Aaron? I thought it's two years fifty million guarantee not sixty fifty million guaranteed and then there's nine point five million in incentives which some people are saying are kind of easy so it's basically going to be that two year sixty all guaranteed at least a fifty. Millions all guaranteed. There'S NO TRADE CLAUSE. They're also not allowed to franchise him they made. He made sure to put that in not allowed to franchise them at the end of the two years. Which is interesting because you would think that that would be. It would be it. Y- because he'll be forty five at that point right after two full seasons because he's going to turn forty three to have that writes forty two but he's about turned forty three so at the end of that second season he would be low. Forty four getting ready to turn forty five. I guess I think that's what he is. Yeah yeah look I mean Brady with TB twelve and the whole thing. He probably thinks he can play until fifty he probably does. I'm more the Guy. I'm much more excited to see what bellichik does when everyone's laughing at him and counting amount. It's funny I'm both. I like them both and I'm actually in some ways rooting for them both to succeed. I know that's weird but I did. The greatness of the two of them together in their teams. I mean I've never hated the Patriots at all And I've loved watching them and I've loved this era. I mean two decades. We've had think about what we've had is. Football fans with the New England patriots greatness being a constant for two decades. It is the all time. Nfl Dynasty. I mean. Is there any debate to that? Tommy no there's not. I mean you could argue the steelers since nineteen seventy. I've won. What six Super Bowl? Yeah that's you know that's fifty years. I know was seventy five. Yeah at the Post. The twenty you're right I mean the packers didn't do it for twenty years. Did the bears of the thirties and forties. I mean the Redskins of the thirties and forties are great I don't think we've ever seen greatness like this for two straight decades in the NFL. We you know it's possible you know that we saw it with the Celtics in the NBA. You know fifty sixty seventies right you know all those titles but you know in in by the way you know. Same quarterback same coach You know the the the same two guys at the helm twenty years. It's really amazing. I think it's GonNa be fascinating to watch the NFL next year because of this. I personally think that. The buccaneers Super Bowl contender at of the NFC When we first started talking about this Erin I dunno three months ago and I said got to meet Tampa would be the perfect spot for him. If he doesn't end up in New England and not that that was the odds on favourite. I thought he would end up in Tampa. I just thought it was a great fit for him. they're going to be very good next year. The difference of course is they play in Division that is not the AFC east you know. They're not going to have six. Easy wins every year. Or certainly five. You know that. Nfc South has been consistently pretty strong. Atlanta's going to be good. New Orleans will probably still be the favourite. I haven't seen the updated odds on that but I'm assuming that Orleans will still be the favourite and maybe a slight favorite over Tampa. Yeah But we saw the the super bowl odds on on Tampa the they are the fifth favourite on sportsbook dot com. Right now actually. They're now tied for the fourth favourite. How about that Chiefs Ravens? Forty niners and then the saints. And the buccaneers both fifteen to one on sportsbook. Dot Com. I wouldn't take that bit not even close i. I don't think Brady's go to success that you think he is where everybody thinks he is. I don't think I think Santa's going to be a disappointment. Explain explain this one to me and I know it has to do with schedules and divisions and then what the postseason would look like the odds to win the NFC championship. The saints are the favourite with the forty niners and the cowboys are eight to one in the buccaneers or eight and a half one so the bucks or the fourth tied for the fourth overall super bowl favourite but they're the fourth in the NFC on their own. Don't forget it also has to do with the fact that over the past forty eight hours People have been pouring in Super Bowl. Bats that's probably on the NFC championship with a healthier over under number moved I think I saw eight to eight and a half something like that. Well how can you be the fourth favourite in your totals eight because everyone just wants the Super Bowl? Yeah I like. I think they're going to have a really good chance. It let me just say that if it weren't if Bruce Arians or somebody of his calibre weren't there. I wouldn't feel as confident but I think that's one of the reasons Brady Pick Tampa you know is that he knows that. They've got a really solid coaching staff and a guy. That's really been good with quarterbacks in Bruce Arians sixty million bucks over two years fifty of guaranteed for Tom Brady at forty three years old. That's pretty remarkable. It really is all right. What else do we have? I got nothing else for you but I have one more thing for you and Freyre into thinking about all the players that you're starting to hear testing positive for corona virus. Would it be any like at this? Point Sean Payton in the NFL Marcus smart yesterday. From the Celtics and to Lakers. That have not been named yet right. What if Lebron James Tested for Corona virus? I was wondering what kind of impact that would have on sports on pop culture on anything like what if a cause I mean. Wouldn't we pretty much say that right now? I mean I guess Brady would be there with Lebron in terms of the highest profile athletes. I would say so. What kind of impact it Tom. Hanks think positive. I think it was an eye-opener like to anybody I know he's he's in his sixties. Lebron's in his thirty s right. Who's WHO's more fame. Run or hanks I would say it's probably pretty close. Yeah I I would say. Hey I don't know anyone who these there is open at this point again younger people. It's on spring break. Needed whatever That's it for the day Tommy and I are out. Have a safe healthy weekend back on Monday.

redskins Tommy Tommy Colt McCoy president giants Wuhan China Florida Cooley twitter Jay Gruden cowboys Dallas China gout Griffin Wuhan China Clint Longley Kevin Kevin Sheehan
[069] The Buccaneers are moving on and its glorious

Buccaneers Observer

40:34 min | 1 year ago

[069] The Buccaneers are moving on and its glorious

"Every year in the NFL it's a new team. As far as goals. Go. We have one. Putting a fucker ran on a finger. Up into the observer podcasts Billips. Molly bay today is may twenty Firth two thousand nineteen one hundred six days to kick off day, one of a new era. Definitely definitely, the knives are out fans are fighting it's terrible bloodbath on Twitter to of gun. There's two camps the right Cape in the raw camps. The right camp though. It's the right camp in the idiots. Yes. Tell we, that's what it's come across as Email very divisive on Twitter. A lot of people I understand our emotional, but they're kind of lashing out at the other side is true, there's a lot of comments about. There's a lot of idiots on Twitter today, or I'm just over these dumb comments or not a whole lot of engagement or discussion. Just a lot of name calling Beck's steps thrown around back and forth between both parties. And of course, you can make stat say whatever you want. Yeah, I saw some last week or earlier in the week, maybe comparing McCoy and sue, and you actually pulled similar stats couple podcast ago. Or did you just text them to me? I can't remember you talked about him in the podcast. Yeah. In the stamps later. So then. They cherry picked all the ones that made the coil good left out the ones that made him. Look, not so good compared to sue. That's what everybody's doing. I think it's one of those things where we're just going to have to wait and find out, you know, if you haven't heard McCoy has been cut by the buccaneers and the rumors which aren't really rumors. I mean, we got top NFL guys, Adam Schefter, and all those saying that the buccaneers are signing the dominant sue and fell tweeted a picture of him in about the Air's uniform cartoon with the number ninety three now that was crazy. I was like, whoa. Oh, you wore that number. It's not like they're just know this lab jerem coined the vase. Maybe they are. But he's always order, ninety three right McCoy both have ninety three throughout their whole career net McCoy are seal were ninety somewhere because ninety three is taken, I can't remember where it was because he ninety three at the Rams ninety three Troy which. Heme which is a big smack in the face. And it's a huge statement if they do get sue. I mean, they just released McCoy today at four pm was the official actually release. Yes. And by what five o'clock they had already said there were signing sue, yes, so the details haven't been released. I'm not sure that it's completely Inc debt back through, but it's a one year deal and Greg, almonds reporting that he heard, it's ten million dollars house before I think McCoy was even released which is exactly what was about ten million dollars. So we're only saving three million adult take, apparently, it was not the money that was the issue. I think it's the culture change and swapping out McCoy for sue is definitely a culture change in. It's going to be telling it's going to it's going to say a whole lot about both players and I guarantee you wherever McCoy goes, he's going to bust his butt to prove his critic draw and I guarantee you. Zoe. So. If Suu comes to the buccaneers, he's going to bust his butt to prove that he's better than McCoy, we'd situation, but just about everybody if you ask me, but I think it would be very interesting, if McCoy went to New Orleans, or somebody NFC south we had to play him twice a year. But yeah, it's too huge statement by the buccaneers areas. I would assume don't know how. Now. Yes, it might be one of those things that goes pretty far up now I don't know if McCoy pissed off Glazer's or what happened there because he was there darling for a really long time. I think they put a lot of eggs in his basket. He just didn't pull through and they were like fine. Let's get rid of him in areas was the to do it. I mean hearings made no bones about the fact that he's just not high on McCoy from day one. He talked of every player on the roster just about. Typically, then do a couple of barbs Adam along the way, I haven't theory, I just came up with this news. It is a conspiracy there. What if German Koi is the source of a lot of leaks to the media. We now he's like, BFF's extravagant and Tom enter the guys at the Tampa Bay times. And maybe that's why the glazers are pissed off. 'cause you know, he's given the media information that maybe the glazers don't want out there or that may be benefit McCoy, but not the team. Interesting take, and with areas his motto is trough loyalty respect, you can't trust him if he's doing that. I don't know the. You couldn't trust him. He's clearly not loyal, and he doesn't respect organization when these to get on that find out, it is interesting to me how just about one hundred percent of the media. The local media is advocating for McCoy still. Yeah. Well, there's some of the ones that are making comments about there's a lot of idiots on Twitter. Rick Stroud to the one who broke that MacAulay was being cut. Rick Strahl also the one that said McCoy was going to be here in two thousand nineteen and he was also the one that asked Bruce Arians, y Bruce toll McCoy, not to show up to voluntary minicamp was, like that's wrong, where you got that room. Yeah. Conspiracy theory, so on Joe bucks fan. What are the Twitter comments said that the media has Gasol it us into thinking that Jeremy coy was a good player? I mean, we're constantly getting shoved down our throats that he is a six time. Pro bowler. All pro people, a have Sachs, they've done that pretty much since he's been here, but it really ramped up in two thousand twelve after we basically clean house with Ray Morris and his whole crew. And she came in and then they just immediately put McCoy front and center in the media, took it and ran with it watching Buchan ears game without them talking about McCoy, at least six times. Yeah. The announcers do every time yes. Even got name recognition, even if he's sitting on the sideline could be McCoy McCoy McCoy in the local media. They get all kinds of access with him. And the most of them have stayed quite a few times McCoy never met a microphone, you didn't light, so they all have access to. And it's we've talked about that on the podcast access media is kind of dangerous, when it becomes to getting the turn because they don't want to lose their access. So they're going to say things to make their access people happy and it's convenient if you don't have to work too hard for story. Someone's just gonna tell you the story. Well, it's gonna be interesting. We're gonna find that a lot of stuff about your McCoy and pretty sure now that he's gone. Some players will probably start opening their mouths. A lot of players were upset from the buccaneers, like lavar, David Donovan Smith tweeted sums in Judah, John, do we have him? For a long time ago. He was tweeden about McCoy n- to lamantia gave it wasn't. I don't remember I mentioned ex- player who was. I think they're still the league tweeted till Avantis David said I feel real bad for the von Tae right now. It was like why wouldn't you feel bad for McLean? Very, very odd crickets, cut people feel bad for the day. I don't know. We'll find out it's going to be interesting. But then, again, we ever find out two thousand eleven season. What happened there? Don't know enough will ever found out somebody fills in gives some dirt. Okay. Now that we're done with them. Koi, can we get it all shaken out anymore? Just little bit more. I've got we talked about it. We really blasted McCloy last podcast and talked about how we think it's a good thing for the team to move on from him. And I had said that I had hundreds of video clips of him, getting pushed out of the way. I don't have hundreds. That was an over exaggeration. Which I do that a lot over exaggerate quite a bit when talk about things, but I do have quite a few and challenged on Twitter to post them. So they're going to become an out tomorr-. I'm gonna have if all of them. Exhausted. At one minute to minute mash up. Tickets could be more than that. But it'll be quite a bit enough to where you can go because most pains, don't see that they see the highlight of players rarely see the low lights. So I'm just gonna show in these are not because I'm specifically honing in on just McCoy getting pushed out of the way. That's does have plenty of other things I could point out about McCoy like how he always not always see that's over exaggerating. How he gets in the way of the defensive end quite a bit. It's one of the reasons why I think that we have not had a defensive end been dominant because Tim McCoy will loop around a lot Thome like stunning but he's not stunning. But who get pushed into the defensive end by the right guard left guard. Whatever a lot of times knocks couple of players have been hurt by gerbil. Koi getting knocked into who was the ninety five number ninety five George Johnson. I'm pretty sure it was number ninety five hour Jones, actually got hurt cut it off feel at the game. Because typically got knocked into him confess on top of him was like, so, you know, there's all kinds of things that I could point out about McCoy lowlights. You know, the guy wasn't double-teamed all the time. He wasn't constantly disrupt in thing. I mean he did. I'm not saying he's a bad player say Nieves overrated. You know, listen to last podcast, you hear all the stuff we say I mean, he had plenty of downsides and I think that getting rid of him is going to help the team out. So when you look at it look tomorrow on the Twitter account for deer McCoy, getting pushed out of the way because that's one of the things he just was not strong just did not have the strength. That's what su- has over top of the Koi. Mccoy's great on his feet very fast very light on his feet. But he was not strong dominant sue, and strong. You know he anchors the center, more of a natural defensive tackle keeps the quarterback from being able to step up in the pocket stops the gaps from the runs. You always felt a German. It was more of a almost a defensive end in his you know, he was really about getting to the quarterback. And he would go all over the place to do it. And, you know, flailing arms and all kinds of stuff. But he did not anchor his gaps like you would normally expect defensive tackle the do, I think suit will be much better at that will between sue Bo Allen and Vida, my boy. I think we are going to be stopping everything the middle, it's going to be insane. Yeah. I mean that's basically it'll be those gods. Jobs is just plug up the middle. Oh my gosh. Going against the division. We talked about this right after the draft or free agency, maybe about how the whole division is sure enough their offense of line and predicted, maybe it was Vida, pretty sure it's because of gotten down conceal. Don't have yet, it's not official. We're NFL tweeted the newest member of the buccaneers defense down consume till the buccaneers an ounce. It, we can't say it's done it. Here's another thing. That's interesting. And you brought this up Molly that German cobras released they afford clock. Haven't heard a word about him being going anywhere. I think extreme said that the team was allowing him to find trade partners. They were allowing his agent to talk to other teams and see if they can find a trade partner that would be verbal. And yes, so he was released four hasn't been picked up. Maybe there's a bidding war going on there. Entertaining. The several different offers. We'd be hearing about that. I mean if we've heard already that's worse outing. Sue Adam Schefter tweeted that, like an hour after McCoy was cut you would think if there was anything about the coin being looked at or tined out Schefter would be saying that to you just. You just pointed that out. And I was like, oh, and think about that. So it's gonna be really interesting. I'm really excited about it. I'm excited about this year in general. But this is just added a whole new layer. It hasn't been a really good offseason member off season like this. Now I pretty excited when we got into events wasn't. Here's the thing about Durell Rivas. I didn't I thought he was overrating, and when he played with us he was he was over it. He didn't need that really. This like his retirement. Now what do they call it sabbatical basically? A year in between high school graduation and college. I can't remember what the call anyway. Yes, semi retired. And hopefully sue do that. But I don't think he will because he's got something to prove chip on his shoulder. He's always shoulder, but anyhow back del Rivas. I thought he was over rated I talked about was the best quarterback bub-bubba came here and I was like, I just don't see it. And then he went to the New England Patriots. And I saw him make some plays and do some things that were just amazing. I'd never seen a cornerback do before. And I was like why couldn't he have done that here? If your players like that we've had a lot of players players like to don't even go to the list, every time we go. Depressed? I was excited about the Vincent Jackson signing. Well visit Jackson he came in. He played hard. He was I like that. He's immersed himself in the community and he's still there. And he's very active golden restaurant. We gotta go to restaurant next. But yeah, but what they didn't like about Vincent Jackson and it wasn't him. It was the fans when he basically retired not a peep, nobody said a thing, but we had Mike Evans at the time. So everybody was just kind of like didn't really even. But Vince Jackson really helped the buccaneers a lot. He was a very he was up to that point. I think our best free agent signing. I mean you could say Keyshawn Johnson, but we all know how that turned out. I mean helped us when Super Bowl but we all know that was the defense. And if anybody tries to tell you, John, that want us. That want us to Super Bowl single to me, and I'll. Booking your helmet. That was our defense thing. It that's enough der McCoy probably not. We know of it'll never be enough. He has given us some good material over the past nine years. I wonder if there's a Petit if people are sick of hearing about, it's only been a day, though. It's kinda fresh. I know a lot of people are grieving. A lot of fans that are really upset. And I understand that too, because I've had players like that, where I'm upset. Go both. I was like, man seriously. Gary was probably the hardest for me. Well, besides judge Edward Edwards towards that left. Owns I felt that way. When Greg Xiang was fired. Yeah. Yeah. I think so too. I've always wanted to see him do something else that we can point. And guess? Stake when he was when he signed with the New England Patriots this year and he was going to be their defensive coordinator. I thought this is it. Medication? I don't know will ever go back to the NFL that Wilson. Yeah. I don't know the fan base hate him. But most of most of the hated him because of the media, the media could not stand great. She honor. Any is NATO that really I now let's followed. In fact, check all those he'll podcast ago we didn't do the less last pot. Check check glass podcast. It's funny because I'm sitting here looking at the game of thrones picture, picking Padraig from gave thrones mean you said FEC checks on just do it all together. And I sent a pod check, as a cool story around. Tell him again. Okay. So the last podcast we did distract terrible going in the podcast before that read a little bit in the instant ninety months. Yes. And I don't think we cover the following fact checks from the week before because I was sick Friday. We do the podcast. So this is following fact checks. Oh, if you of, but actually, I think these are just friendly Monday podcast. Anyhow, we talked about carbon tally being the book and break some news doing not as now get stuff, and we were like, who is Harvard. Hell we had never heard of before since two thousand eighteen and we'd asked could she had said this the training camp? They look much more excited energized and everybody flying around and all that we were like, what did she have to compare to their last training camp? Right. So any I looked it up, couldn't find anything from power tally on the books before last year? I did find her on the book and your staff media guide for two thousand seventeen but she was listed as the marketing communications coordinator. Okay, says she just changed Johnson twenty eight teen at town flank. Yes. And it's very strange because there are. There is no more marketing communications coordinator, listed as the book in the book, and Megan's staff anymore in two thousand eighteen she's listed, as a staff writer slash senior digital content producer at is more terp position. Yes, it seems like they do that with the buccaneers a lot. I don't know what's going on with their front office. But there's over two hundred people that were booking your front office. Now, I know there in council, I was like, man. This is a lot of people. You know, when I got from that is that yet a lot of time on your hands. Send counter into the names will agree with pictures. So I just was five across. That's not including the coaches or players anything to front office staff. I know one buccaneers places not that big. We're put all those people. Very good question. I don't now everybody saying, Glades spend money or not paying attention, because two hundred people in, you know, they make chump change. And then you got Bruce Arians, whole staff, which is basically to coaching staffs. And whenever they've done to the stadium nice stadium. Yeah, it is. It is still got that nineties feel to it. But since upgraded the screens, it looks a lot better, the only thing I think they could do better is don't get me wrong. I love the stadium the stadium and leave the parking lots now the grass the grass. Yeah. It's too hot water evaporates immediately. It's all right. Fact check. Here's what was Molly was horribly wrong about the game of thrones prediction. She gave us the thing. I regret is that I have this on recording. I wish that's how it did. And if you didn't listen, I send that in areas was gonna turn on winter fell and kill all the starts with dragon. It was a anti climatic agree with you, underwhelming news. But it wasn't horrible. It wasn't as bad as the last episode lost. It was as bad as last sopranos. Yeah. So they it was okay. I heard today that George are Martin is doing this book, which will end like where the series ended, and then he's got another one coming after that. Okay. Don't turn into a game throws podcast, what we just wanted to point out that Molly was wrong. We wanted to. I lost their Ralph did make a prediction because he said, I had no I do couldn't predict it. I wouldn't predict the dasher happy. In didn't expect to see a happy any game. My issue with that, unless you were fainted areas not too much of which happy ending for her. I'll tell you people complained about I don't want to go into my name throws, but people complain about the keep going on. Call myself. That was before the season. Finale was fantastic. I thought it totally blew me away. A lot of people are upset about it. But I think they were more upset about the fact that the nary us turn into the bad person. I thought it was great. It's takefuji. Literally, it was beautiful exit. Sodium, moving on next check Ralph. It said McCloy was off the field in the Seattle game two thousand thirteen in overtime mcquaid hot count. So yes, this is last podcasts. Ralph was wrong. Look, I'm doing the whole. He was not carted off the field, but he did get basically carried off the field between traders and he never returned in the game. Now I brought this up as a put of contention with me in McCoy. It was kind of when I started looking at McCoy, is this something wrong here with what I'm hearing from the media in what I'm seeing on Phil McCoy, we played as we said, in the last podcast, we were playing the NFC west at the time when they were the powerhouse to Beijing, and we went into Seattle and Seattle with their twelve man, good stuff and we played them hard and we played them into overtime the first play in overtime that McCoy was on the field he left and then Seattle ended up driving down the field and won the game. And I was just shocked. I was like how can somebody leave the game and then he didn't end? I thought what he's going to be out. At least a game he was. And it just really made me think. Mccoy's was he's just not that, that leader. Shift. You don't want that to be what the team follows. Yeah. What kind of leaner does that? Yes. I did not like that. But yeah. He the first defensive play the overtime he got hurt. And you couldn't really see it on film. It looked like he got road. And, you know, he grabbed his ankle, and he laid their the trainers came out, and it took forever. And then they finally took him off the field, but he did not come back during that game. He played the next game. And there wasn't much mentioned about it in the meteor anything about what was wrong with his ankle or nothing. And we ended up losing that game after fighting them hardboiled a good game when Thursday night football Monday. Maybe a don't think so. He might have been late Sunday afternoon. I don't think the prime time game I think it might have been gaining the week though. Don't remember that was a good game. I remember that. Yeah. So they bring car now for Coileman ended up talking about Jeremy Ralph together. See hell who go that talk about McCoy or game of thrones news? The box have signed Tom more as an off. Offensive consultant old tomore. Do you know him? He's like a three thousand years old. Eighty works old. Because he played. He was coaching coach receivers for the Steelers in nineteen seventy seven. Yeah. You started coaching before you were learn. Yes. College yet nine hundred sixty one I believe recognize his name. Okay. Who okay? He started coaching receivers at the Steelers. Nineteen seventy seven he was the offense of coordinator for the colts. When areas was the quarterback coach with Peyton Manning first year. Miserably. Yeah. And then areas brought him in as an assistant head coach and consultant when he was head coach of Zona, and now he's what the buccaneers. But it's not a full-time thing he's only here during training camp. Remember when she added that he wasn't I can't remember he brought him in as a consultant heading all season little, but this is it's not going to be this away. Not going to be here for the full season. Must have time coming in just for a very specific purpose drinking, buddy. Towns, a little fast. He might keel over any. We hit OTA's today. This is the second week, though taes are going on today. We're going onto more Thursday. The media's only land to be there. Today is correct. I think I didn't see last week this McCoy store. Look broke McCoy again, this McCoy story seems to have overshadowed all of it. I didn't see much from the media pocket about the OT as I saw things because the tally did her wrap-up OTA's today. Oh, and buccaneers dot com. She said this, and I'm going to verify this, what she says here, quote. She says every practice includes a field goal period where both car Saito's and Matt Gade kick from various distances. The rumors are true when gay kicks there is a very distinct. Boom and today was kicking toward the uprights closest to the actual building. I'm not sure the team will make that mistake again as gay lost ball on the roof because he kicked it so hard into quote, yes, I watched a video of him kicking, you can definitely tell. It sounds like he's hit with a baseball bat. The power big guy, and he doesn't have a full. He doesn't get like a running start like you see most back in the days, the kickers used to do, like a three step thing straight on it. He's kind of like dead. He doesn't do the whole twisting, and soccer background. Yes, maybe it has to do with that big guy. He's like Sebastian Jan account sqi would he hit? I was watching it headed on. And I was doing something else that I heard it the hope what was that the looked over and a dream? And sure enough, it was kicking him football kicker Cairo's gonna lose his job. Yeah. Yeah. Do poor Kyra. I did like him. He's billing horse jockey. He's really tiny most kickers are remember the gramatica brothers are gramatica little petite. Nude whatever fun to watch. Because every time they kick the ball, they do their their soccer celebration. Joep down everything and ended up hurting themselves. I think it was Kimber yet celebration after hurt their Saint down there. Buddy, guy's me books cleaned. Former jets tidied, Jordan leg off of waivers. Now this guy played with bowls at the jets he was drafted in two thousand seventeen by the jets were bowls is there but ended up getting hurt and training camp. And got put on I r didn't play all two seven two thousand seventeen he played in two thousand eighteen limited. Ilise started four games. I think he he played in fifteen but he was started four you had fourteen catches for hundred fourteen yards and a touchdown. And this guy we've got what six tight ends now. Roaster. And we've got Jay kmered -brate Claire, or clear, all clear, but behind -brate, they're all expandable. This guy might make the team. I think they're all fighting for that number three spot. But break and OJ have injury problems, so they might consider Brabham. Maybe that's true. Hopefully they will get in sync like a bunch of women on their menstrual cycle together, they'll have their injuries staggered. The. He's pretty pretty big tied into so he'll fit right in with her dog is yeah. He'll probably make the team though because just this connection with bowls. Maybe we'll see that we picked him up off waivers. Yeah. Now, I wonder if the waiver thing works the way offseason the way it does in the regular season. Like if we were top of the waiver list now, we're down at the bottom because we got this guy. Interesting to find out the only thing I know about Weaver's fantasy football kinda works saying. This life. Ashley presented a forty thousand dollar check for Texas aid to establish to need based scholarships for students students that come from his hometown. Dallas, Texas are eligible now this is a coding to Texas AM foundation and a picture of hill in Ashley, a couple of people holding up a big old corboy check, you know. And I think this is probably the money he raised from his charity event, there the other day, so that's kind of forty thousand dollar tax write off, j either way felt like forty four thousand dollars ailments, like twenty dollars to us. Right. I was trying to figure out the taxes like income taxes, people pay players would pay a photo. They don't pay a whole lot now. But you still pay federal income tax. Yeah, they're probably right around eighteen percent or so. They make twenty million mass thirty six thousand I can't ask today. All right. Let's keep it moving through her and sixty thousand. Yeah. He won't even miss that, whatever they pay their agents usually get quite a bit. Yeah. They're not like real estate agents, only get like five percent. Right. Like we talked about. Say bam McCoy one hundred million how much that went to agent quarter probably I think I had said that his his age. It was Tom Cadran, but it was big to thank anyhow, but one of the ones that worked at CA a neighbor big expensive agents. I mean I know he was getting over thirty percent and MacOS probably have to pay for the marketing to. Yeah. Of course, given up half his paycheck to his brand. Don't have still he's still walked away with fifty million dollars about now. Bad news. Bad news. Cowan Winslow junior used to be tied into the buccaneers left to mind loan with the Seattle. With the Seattle Seattle did that video in the locker room mocking Buchan ears, but mocking Cina he is on trial for three rapes. Well, yes, the guy is really, really in a bad way. He's going to see inside a prison for a long time. Now this has been going on for a while. Cut an hal's and they were called the police on him because he was like going around the house and looking in windows, and the call the police on him. And he got arrested. I think for breaking and entering or Sunday. And he made it he said, you know, they were profiling me. He was he was just looking at the house because he sailed from the owner, which the neighbor knew that wasn't true. Well turns out he was case of the joint. Yes to apparently rape, somebody he'd be charged with raping a fifty fifty four year old hitchhiker a fifty nine year old homeless woman as well as a seventeen year old girl when they were in college. Seventeen year old girl is now older, but he hasn't mid to having sex with these women, but as saying that it was consensual, but he also I mean there's so much with him that's going on. I keep tracking but he also bail for this. He ended up going to a gym twice and masturbate in front of us. Any one year old woman this woman say twice, and he got caught masturbating a car in a Wendy's parking lot. Yeah. That was a while bad. When he was still the lead. Yeah. Yeah. He's got so many problems. And here's the thing. His dad was a great receiver and had a great career. His dad was in the courtroom watching this, and they said he was just he was crying and miserable, could you imagine seeing your son just just ruined? His life lake to write seems to be quite a bit of evidence against him, the including blood stain underwear DNA has test. Which that's probably why he saying it was consensual because there's that kind of evidence. And he's married with kids. Right. So, you know, the law his lawyers are saying, yes, he cheated on his wife, but don't hold that against him. It's immoral. But it's not illegal. Okay. Just it's one of those things where it's there's, I'm normally, not a fan of if they're smoke. There's fire. But in this case, there's a sound much. It, you know, are so that sad news story here that good news though. Tampa, according to Gregg Allman is going to unveil downtown statue for Buchan ears, greatly ROY Selmon. He's a franchise first draft pick and hall of Famer. He also served as athletic director for US F. He died in two thousand eleven at age fifty six but gonna put up a statue commemorating, LeRoy Selmon. That's great news. Wonderful news, what he diner. That's really young. There were died of a massive stroke. He was young fifty six. Is that right? Yeah. That's really sad said, the but at least getting the statue I said that was gonna be good news. They make Ted the needed depressing yourself that it might be don't bulleting I dunno. They're Roble Twitter said that the NFL is starting to have a mental health clinician that has to attend the players eight to twelve hours a week for each NFL team, nothing. No. Okay. Well, that's good for the middle health clinicians. Eight twelve hours a week so that they just have to be at facility, I guess, and available in case people wanna talk. I don't know just says that they have to attend to players eight to twelve hours a week. I guess I said counseling sessions, but what nobody wants to do. I mean do date of kind of sit there and sit there for twelve hours a week, mostly. I wonder if they're doing that because of the implications of. C. T E. Yeah. I'm sure that's what it is a PR saying plus. They care about the players. I think they're just the way things are hitting pretty soon every company organization's going to have to see we already have human resources. We have diversity trainers diversity counselors, we're gonna have mental health counselors at every job of his job had a staff like high interest. But that's what this is. I don't know. But like with a pharmacy. Everybody. I know it'd be dragging my bosses. Prozac zanex their coffee. Out of cups of coffee on. Go. See miss Judy on the second floor stressed out. Yeah. And if they like sound CBD Gumy's and become make you relax. I don't know what about this. Other guy works next door than deals now. He sells kind of CD products to why are you friends them? I'm for twisting until I relaxed. At OTA's today, Vernon Hargreaves was available. He was practicing and monroy and his mind is right? And we got a little bit of clarification about what went on last week. Apparently, we all blew it out of proportion, Vernon wasn't quite right. It was an injury related issue, not that he wasn't ready to practice. He just wasn't quite recovered from a lingering issue that he's had not his shoulder and wasn't practicing. Hit even his it was his choice not to practice. And he said that the a had talked to him a few times before then he said it didn't turn him off to be said. I'm a, a coach's kid. That's what he called himself a coach's kin. And it was just a little bit of tough love being coming out in making those comments about him, but they had talked beforehand, so all is well with Vernon Hargreaves with on that. Feel do something tired of him being injured all the time. And when he is on the field, not really doing much come over and three show up, buddy. You got this. I think he feels a lot in the pressure. And I. He's like a veteran on the team. I get the sense that he wants to live up to expectations. Good. Sal. I'm excited to see what he can do or it's one last thing about jerem coy the book. Well, we're going to have rapid when I wanted to say this, there is a lot of contention between the fan base she'd, like everybody's divided between pro McCoy anti McCoy. I'm gonna guess there are quite a few people in the middle her like, well, I like to call, but I think it was the right thing to do any there. Well, I liked McCoy but on the bucks fan. So if that's what they think we need to do to win then. So be it, which is what I'd like to see everybody do. But my whole thing is dull, then great people that feel different than you. We all have our different opinions. It's good to talk about him. I like say people throw out stance, and there was the one at all comes down to. We're all bucking your fans. We all support the team. I mean sport each other. We want the team to win. I my discussion I like discussion. I love that confrontation. He's arguments debates. Don't get an confrontation with Ralph has he's absolutely brutal. I kill and that real quick, he'll toilet the for a while. I remember Ralph was in fantasy Lee. League with his high school. And there was one guy that was a Steelers fan all worked for the guy that was. Wanna listen to drown arm house. Right. So anyway, Ralph was talking shit to the one guy. He was a Steelers fan and Ralph is talking about how bad the Steelers we're gonna be that year. And it was the year. They went to the Super Bowl. So the next draft, the guy is in the chat to talk and smack, you said my Steelers, we're going to go anywhere, and we got a Super Bowl and all this, and Ralph absolutely embarrassed guy in the trash talk is fine. But Ralph quashed it real quick, like the Hoeger quiet. I think you ended it with something like I'm gonna put a Ray Lewis is boot up your house. That was. And no one else talk show the rest of the season. And they didn't ask Ralph to play again not remember that at all. You had somebody over. Probably if you're on the receiving end but you had something from every team in that division. Like a Ray Lewis is boot up your ass something to do with the Bengals something to do with the Browns. It was good poetry, almost interesting store. This at all. I remember being part of the league pretend they were all remember lice stop plame. No. Just. Oh, that's funny. I just remember there were a lot of them worked FBI. The main girl who I was friends with in high school. She works FBI, so's book, FBI, co-workers, hers, and stuff. So that's really that was a long time. How do you remember stuff like that? I remember everything like a steel champ. So we're discussion. He start calling idiots. And I'm sick and Ralph on you. Bring up some Ray Lewis and boots. I'm sensitive. So don't be mean to me. Just kidding like people at its two or this, wrapping up for us tonight. One of the podcast out, it'll be out Friday morning, usually we try to get them out about one o'clock Friday morning. So you can enjoy your drive to work or whatever, but we don't have advertise on this show or anything. So no matter what you do in stop right now, share. After listening in shared to whatever social media platform Facebook, Twitter and. Wherever you reside. Share-out stop all this stuff to yourself. If you wanna get in touch with me, you can reach me at Molly Bay Buccaneers observer dot com. If you'd like to set Ralph, your favorite Gerald McCoy staffs. He could be reached at Ralph at buccaneers observer dot com. We've got a Twitter account bucks underscore observer and a website ears of their dot com. Bookie stuff. I think he did. We have some deadbug, he stuff on our Twitter. But he's already does for us next time.

McCoy McCoy buccaneers Twitter McCoy NFL Jeremy Ralph Keyshawn Johnson Tom Cadran Adam Schefter Steelers New England Patriots Buchan Greg Xiang NFC official bam McCoy Beck Molly
The Hatfield & McCoy Feud Pt. 1

Crimes of Passion

1:08:11 hr | 1 year ago

The Hatfield & McCoy Feud Pt. 1

"I'm delighted to announce an incredible new podcast original called espionage. It tells the stories of the world's most unbelievable undercover missions and healthy covert operations, succeeded or failed. And if you stay tuned after this show, you can hear a clip of the first episode to listen to the full first episode subscribed to espionage wherever you listen to podcasts. New episodes come out every Friday. Due to the graphic nature of these families crimes. Listener discretion is advised. This episode includes discussions of murder and violence that some people may find offensive we advise extreme caution for children under the age of thirteen. Rosanna crept quietly through the forest anticipation tingling through every nerve of her body. The twenty one year old woman was in love with a dashing eighteen year old name Jonty meeting him in secret in the dark of the woods only made their encounters more. Thrilling Rosanna knew her family didn't approve of their courtship. But she couldn't resist jonky when she spotted him crossing a dry creek bed coming towards her Rosanna trepidation faded away. Johnson took Rosanna and his arms. It was a chilly autumn night. But they began to undress not wanting to waste a moment of their time together as Johnny kissed her. He told her everything she wanted to hear he promised that he was going to marry her and that they would soon be happy together. But a moment later Rosanna heard the heavy stomp of men's boots. She turned to see three of her brothers Tolbert farmer, and Jim clamoring through the brush towards them Rosanna could tell by their expressions that it would be useless to argue with them before she could even try her brother's grab John C and loaded him onto a horse. The men left Rosanna alone in the forest clearing. She was cold and terrified. But also resolute no matter what her family thought Roseanna McCoy was determined to be with Jani Hatfield. Hi, I'm Laney Hobbs. And this is crimes of passion. A cast original the legal definition of a crime of passion is a violent crime that occurs in the throes of extreme emotion, leaving no time to reflect on the consequences. But in this show, we explore passionate crimes. How does a marriage progress from husband and wife to killer and victim or killer and co-conspirator if there's a thin line between love and hate what manipulates our relationships into deadly results at our cast. We are grateful for you our listeners, you allow us to do what we love let us know how you're doing reach out on Facebook and Instagram at podcast and Twitter at podcast network. And if you enjoy today's episode the best way to help is to leave a five star review wherever you are listening. It really does help us. We. We also now have merchandise. Head depar- cast dot com slash merch. For more information. In the highlands of the Appalachia visitors can find some of the most gorgeous scenery in America. But the area's natural beauty is overshadowed by oblique history. The Hatfield McCoy families lived among the hills surrounding the tug fork river, the waterway marks the border between West Virginia and Kentucky. The feud between the two families span from eighteen sixty five until eighteen ninety one since then it has inspired hundreds of newspaper articles, dozens of books and a handful of movies and television series. The violence has commanded the public's fascination for well over a hundred years, it is not clear why the squabble has received so much attention. The participants weren't celebrities. The crimes they committed while cruel were no more horrifying than many other murders reported at the time. But perhaps the dispute has stayed in the public consciousness because the violent seems so senseless these families were neighbors. Many participants were related to each other by marriage, some by blood, they should have been helping each other survive the Talibans of frontier life, instead they let petty slights turn into track. Gic bloodshed in this episode. We'll learn how tensions mounted between the hatfields and mccoys during the civil war. And in the decades after until they erupted in eighteen eighty two with a gruesome murder that shocked. The residents of tug fork next week will discuss the bloody acts of retaliation and the court trials that followed. When the feud began an eighteen sixty five twenty five year old William Anderson Hatfield and forty year old Randolph McCoy where the proud patriarchs of their respective families. Historians name these men as the primary engineers of the discord William Anderson, Hatfield went by ants or commonly devil Anse. He was given this nickname by his own mother. Nancy Vance Hatfield, according to one apocryphal story. Nancy witnessed her unruly fifteen year old son fighting a mountain lion with his bare hands and remark that he was not a feared of no kind of farm it, nor of the devil himself devil. Lance was born in eighteen thirty nine the fourth of eighteen children on the West Virginia side of tug fork valley living in a border state devil Anse was at the center of America's conflict when the civil war broke out in eighteen sixty one. West Virginia remained part of the union. But dental lances loyalties, evidently, did not align with the state wants to civil war started the twenty three year old enlisted in the confederate army and served as first Lieutenant and the forty fifth battalion Virginia infantry in eighteen sixty three as it became clear that the confederacy would lose the war Deva, Lance deserted the army and returned to tuck fork or he formed a militia group with his uncle Jim Vance, they call themselves the Logan Wildcats the group rove through the mountains on horseback. Meeting out vigilante Justice and attacking union sympathizers throughout the area. One such sympathizer was thirty seven year old harm in McCoy brother tweet eventual futa Sgt Randolph McCoy. Harman lived on the Kentucky side of the tug. Fork river Kentucky citizens were divided during the civil war. But the majority of men fought for the union including Harmon despite being a former slave owner. He served in the union army's thirty ninth Kentucky mounted infantry regiment until he was honorably discharged in December of eighteen sixty four. On his journey back to tug fork Harmon encountered Jim Vance on the road as Harmon past him. Jim Vance sneered and warned him that Deva Lance and the Logan Wildcats were gunning for him. Vance had recently lost his brother in the civil war. He was looking for someone to blame and Harmon represented a convenient target the Logan. Wildcats may have also carried a previous grudge from his allegiance to another of their vigilante targets union general William Francis. In fact, some historians of the feud site Williams murder at the hands of the Wildcats in eighteen sixty three as the true beginning of the conflict. A few days after receiving Vance's threat Harmon went out to his yard to fetch water from the well he heard a shot and felt a bullet with past him. He crashed to the ground and crept back into the house. His wife Patti urged him to go into hiding for a few days to give bitter prejudices time to heal Harman. Agreed. He gathered supplies ammunition and provisions and set out into the frigid cold. He set up camp in a cave about a mile from his home. The logan. Wildcats did not give up their pursuit of Harmon. According to some accounts, they followed footprints left in the snow by his thirteen year old daughter Mary who had gone to warn her father that the Wildcats more patrolling the area. Other counts see that. The Wildcats followed the footprints of the McCoy family's. Former slave Pete who had gone to replenish Harman's food supply in any case on January seventh eighteen sixty five below gone Wildcats tracked harm in McCoy to his cave hideout. Armand through the blanket office body and began to massage his aching leg, which he had fractured in the war the bones had healed, but the pain lingered, especially in the cold. He didn't need a reminder of the battlefield. He felt as if the war had followed him home, even here he might be surrounded by the enemy at any moment. His breath rattled on top of everything else. He was coming down with pneumonia. He longed for the warmth of his bed and his wife as he mold over the risks of returning home. He heard footsteps outside Harmon froze he raised his rifle and limped towards the mouth of the cave. He hoped he could sneak out before his pursuers found him, but as he stepped outside he heard a crack of a rifle Pierce hair and felt a powerful blow to his chest knocking. Off-balance? He looked down to see blood spilling from an open bullet wound as he died Harmon thought of his five children and his wife Patty who was pregnant with their six. He had come home so eager to see his family and restore the bond weakened by his absence during the war. But now he would never have the chance. Later Patty found her husband's body draped over the long of a fallen tree. Most residents of tug fork believe Jim Vance had murdered him. They were also suspicious of gyms nephew Deva, Lance as the two men led the Logan Wildcats together, but devil Anse claim to be home in bed at the time. Harmon was murdered despite the suspicions. Nobody was ever charged for Harman's murder except for the perpetrators. There were no witnesses and no physical evidence. Linking anyone to the debt? Some historians. Claim that Harman's neighbors ignored the crime because they felt that the union sympathizer. God what he deserved. But the reality seems more complicated before a continued with the psychology. Please note that I am not a license. I kinda tryst or psychologist, but I have done a lot of research for this episode. Many of harm and McCoy's. Neighbors also served in the union army, even some members of devil Anse Hatfield family, according to civil war historian. Eric T dean, some of these returning veterans were suffering from severe PTSD apathy and emotional numbness in maybe that people were horrified by Harman's death. But also too overwhelmed to seek Justice at that point the war had already claimed hundreds of thousands of lives the community was traumatized by the constant guerrilla warfare tactics of militia groups, like the Logan Wildcats and the retaliations from the union army. That winter the war was finally winding down. Nobody wanted to dwell on another death. They were ready to move on. However, the tension between the Hatfield and McCoy families did not disappear over the next few years. Various members of the families took each other to court over small infractions such as trespassing or destroying beehives. But for a while they were content to let the legal system handle their problems instead of resorting to violence. When the civil war ended in the spring of eighteen sixty five twenty five year old devil aunts settled down with his wife will vic- and resumed a life of hunting farming timbering and distilling whisky family responsibilities. Kept devil. Anse busy in the years. After the civil war by eighteen sixty nine thirty year old aunts and his wife live. Icy already had four children and would go on to have nine more. As Deva lands face. The challenges of fatherhood. He didn't have much outside support his own father, e from Hatfield gave five of his other sons attractive land when they reached adulthood, but due to some unknown grudge. He refused to give any land to Deva lands devil lances strained relationship with his father may have contributed to his prideful combative nature in a time. When land ownership was one of the MO. Most potent symbols of a man's worth devil. Lance had to make do with the small plot. His wife had received from her father Deva, Lance was especially frustrated to have so little land because his closest neighbor Perry. Cline had so much. N B is one of the most basic human emotions, but it is often driven by more complicated. Feelings of inferiority and exile. Eighty one a man perceives himself to be less well off than people around him. He is more likely to feel shame and stress about his status, Richard Wilkinson and Kate Pickett experts in the field of public health have linked these anxieties to higher levels of violence and delinquency Perry. Cline was about a decade younger than devil. Lance Perry's parents died when he was just nine years old any ad inherited five thousand acres of land from his father, according to the Klein, family devil, Anse regularly trespassed on Perry's land to steal timber, but the official property boundaries were murky and devil Anse claimed. He had a right to be there around eighteen seventy Perry Klein agreed to sell devil Anse some of his land perhaps in an effort to resolve any animosity between them, although the trade was not recorded devil. Anse immed-. Took possession of the land even moving into the cleanses. Former homestead soon after devil Anse came across Perry. Cline timbering on the land. He had just purchased. There may have been some confusion over precisely which acres Perry. Cline had agreed to sell to Deva, Lance. But instead of chalking it up to an innocent misunderstanding devil Anse decided take Perry. Cline to court for trespassing. The men settled out of court, according to the terms of the settlement Perry Klein agreed to give all five thousand acres of his land to devil Anse. It's not clear why Perry Klein agreed to such a harsh penalty for such a small offense. But his writing suggests that he felt intimidated into doing. So after the settlement Perry Cline slunk away to the nearby town of pike Ville with this victory. Deva Lance became one of the largest landholders and tuck fork valley devil lances behavior. Ruffled a few feathers and tug fork Perry's father had been a wealthy and influential person in the region. Many residents were sympathetic to the Klein's especially Randolph McCoy who live just across the tug. Fork river on the Kentucky side of the valley. Born in eighteen twenty five forty five year old Randolph McCoy had one thing in common with devil. Anse? He had not inherited any land from his father. Instead, he lived on a small farm that had been passed down to his wife. Sarah, unlike devil ans- Randolph McCoy refused to bully his way into greater land ownership such behavior was a coroner to him. His wife Sarah was a devout Christian and menacing tactics. Didn't come naturally to him. He was known to be more of a sour old gossip than a ruffian, even if Randolph had been inclined to take someone else's land. He wouldn't have targeted Perry Klein with whom he shared close family ties several of Perry. Klein's siblings had married. Mccoy's. In fact, Perry sister Patty was the widow of the murdered harm in McCoy the injustice to Perry. Cline was. Yeah. Another insult added to the injury of Harman's death and soon these insults would be too much for Randolph McCoy to bear. Coming up. We'll see how Randolph McCoy's grudge against the hatfields pushed the families towards an inevitable confrontation. Do you like puzzles if so I have a great mobile puzzle game for you? It's called best fiends, and it's my new favorite game. It's about the world of my new show, and it's cute courageous inhabitants. There are thousands of fun puzzles to solve and tons of cute characters to collect I found myself playing best fiends a lot after work as a way to unwind after a long day. I just started playing it. So I'm only on level six, but it is so much fun. I like the game moves quickly. And it makes me stay sharp and focused while I play it's really easy to learn but difficult to master, and if you're out and about you can even play it off line, but you don't need to take my word for it. Best fiends is five star rated on the apple app store and Google play. Plus it's been downloaded over ninety million times globally. You probably already play games on your phone. So why not try best fiends? It's. It's free to download give it a try. Don't miss out on the must play game of the year. Download bus beans for free on the apple app store or Google play. That's friends without the our best scenes play today. Codenames deception gadgets. It might seem like something out of the movies. But these are just some of the essential components of being a spy most spies. Don't stand out like characters JAMES BOND and eat and hunt. They are ordinary forgettable people, which makes them all the more dangerous. So what does it really take to be a spy every week espionage a new park. Cast original explores this high stakes world in analyzes the missions behind the world's most incredible spies, and how these covert operations succeeded or failed. Find out the real world's by tactics required to impersonate, exploit an infiltrate the most confidential places in the world, you'll be shocked by the episode on Larry chin one of the CIA's top Chinese linguists. Who was also China's top spy for over thirty years and you'll be in spy. Fired by Virginia hall who despite losing part of her leg, organize sabotage missions against German army and helped allied soldiers escape during World War Two search for in subscribe to espionage wherever you listen to podcasts again, search espionage or visit park has dot com slash espionage till listen now. Now back to this crime of passion. The happy McCoy viewed was ignited in eighteen sixty five with the death of thirty seven year old harm in McCoy. He was likely killed by a thirty three year old man named Jim Vance a confederate sympathizer who was angry about Harmon service with the union army. Vance may have had help from his nephew twenty six year old devil Anse Hatfield Harman's older brother Randolph McCoy did not initially seek retaliation. He may have had too many other worries to pursue vengeance tending to his wife and sixteen children. But it was the first slight and what would become an avalanche of grudges Randolph McCoy descended from some of the original pioneers of tug fork valley, but Randolph's father had to sell off their family farm in order to pay various fines and debts therefore Randolph inherited no land from his father. He and his wife, Sarah. Lived in a tiny cabin in the blackberry district of Kentucky about two miles south of the tug fork river, they had very little land and had almost nothing to pass down to their children research conducted by scientists Paul Tiffen Mark s Pierce and Louise Parker show that men who have gone through a downward social trajectory experienced significantly, greater mental health issues than men who social status remains the same over time. The loss of status often gives rise to feelings of shame and distrust, according to Richard Wilkinson and Kate Pickett for Randolph McCoy the daily struggles of poverty, only added to the usual stresses of trying to raise a large family in the harsh wilderness of the mountains. In the late eighteen hundreds Appalachia, many families survival depended on the success of their small-scale farming and hurting opperations Randolph. Mccoy's family was no different. Raising. Hogs was critical to their livelihood. A single four hundred pound animal might make the difference between getting through the winter and starving to death. Therefore farmers took their hogs very seriously a Kentucky circuit court judge noted that he'd convicted more men for stealing hogs than for murder. In September of eighteen seventy eight fifty two year old Randolph was pending his hog. So that he could castrate the piglets in the middle of his work. A Sal broke through the fence and ran off with six of her piglets Randolph. Let her go the hongs or territorial animals and didn't often stray far from home. But when they hadn't returned by that winter Randolph mounted a search. He was confident he would be able to recognize the sow if he found her farmers Mark their hogs by cutting notches into the animal's ears. Each armor had his own distinct Marc Randolph track the hog to the farm of his nephew, Tom Stafford Stafford didn't know who the hogs belong to. But he had been keeping them penned up with his own pigs until the owner came forward since it was nearly night. Randolph didn't want to go through the trouble of dragging the hogs back home in the dark. He knocked on Tom's door. Four and let his nephew. No that he'd come to retrieve them the next morning. But not long after Randolph left. Another man Floyd Hatfield showed up at Tom's door. Twenty nine year old Floyd was a cousin of devil Anse Hatfield. He also happened to be Tom Stafford's brother-in-law. He claimed that a few of his hogs had crossed over the frozen tug fork river and had gotten stranded on Tom's property. Tom worn Floyd that Randolph McCoy claimed ownership over those same hogs Floyd didn't listen, he rounded up the livestock and herded them across the river to his farm. When Randolph heard about this the following day. He was furious. He immediately went to confront Floyd the men checked the hogs ears, but the brands were so scuffed up and scarred over nobody could tell who's marks. They were Floyd Hatfield kept possession of the hongs, but Randolph McCoy promised that the matter was an over Randolph took his claim to another Hatfield cousin confusingly also named Anse Hatfield this cousin went by the name preacher ants in contrast to Deva, Lance, although he was a Hatfield by name and blood year old preacher. Aunts lived in the same district as Randolph McCoy on the Kentucky side of the tug. Fork river rather than the West Virginia side, more most of the other hatfields, resided preacher. Anse led the congregation of the old pond creek Baptist church where both hatfields and McCoy. As went to worship, he was seen as a neutral party among the families and as a Justice of the peace. He was also accepted by both families as a qualified arbiter over the hog conflict. Preacher aunts organized. A hearing his log cabin farmers from all over tug. Fork valley came to see the disagreement playout preacher Anse called for everyone to cast their weapons aside. The men grudgingly laid their rifles and pistols against the wall and the trial began testimony went as everyone expected with the McCoy witnesses swearing that the hog belonged to Randolph McCoy, and the Hatfield witnesses insisting that it was Floyd's one witness deviated from family lines Bill Stayton Stayton was a cousin of Randolph McCoy. But his sister was married to Ellison Hatfield. Ellison Hatfield wasn't just statements brother-in-law. They were best friends state and testified that he had personally watched Floyd brand the hog in question. The mccoys were furious Randolph. Mccoy's nephew Paris called. Stayton a damned liar. But Stayton stuck to his testimony. Once the witnesses were through it was time for the jury to come to a decision preacher. Ants was determined to be impartial. He had selected a jury of six men with Hatfield affiliations and six men from the McCoy clan. Perhaps he felt that if the trial ended in a hung jury, the men might both feel vindicated and let the matter drop with no hard feelings, but predicting jury loyalties crew to be an impossible task one of the jurors Selkirk McCoy was yet another cousin of Randolph McCoy, but he had served in the confederate army with devil Anse Hatfield and he worked on devil answers timber crew with Selkirk joining in with the hatfields the jury turned in a verdict of seven to five against Randolph McCoy. The McCoy's were astonished and infuriated Randolph cursed the verdict, but his wife Sarah convinced her husband to accept the outcome. Although he growled about the injustice Randolph allowed Floyd to take home the prize tog the feud could have stopped there in its tracks. But Randolph McCoy had nine sons and countless nephews who did not have Randolph's passive temperament to them. The verdict wasn't just about a stolen pig. It was a matter of family, honour and betrayal. Harvard Medical School psychiatrist James Gilligan spent several years as the medical director for the Massachusetts prison system. He wrote that the inmates violent acts were nearly always triggered by a recent humiliation. The men used violence as a way to recover their pride after a loss of face. The aftermath of the hog trial showed that the mccoys were determined to punish the Hatfield for injury to their egos from then on flare ups of violence between the families became a regular occurrence, the mccoys directed most of their IRA at Bill Stayton who had sided with his Hatfield inlaws over his cousin Randolph McCoy after the trial state and try to steer clear of his angry relations by staying on the West Virginia side of the tug fork river, but run ins were unavoidable one autumn afternoon. Bill Stayton was hunting deer in the woods with Ellison Hatfield. Ellison like his brother Deva, Lance was a confederate veteran locally hailed as a war hero. Unlike Deva, Lance Ellison had a reputation for being even tempered and fair-minded. He was a deacon in preacher answers Baptist church. And he was known as the peacekeeper. Ever of the Hatfield family. The men came upon to McCoy brothers, Paris and squirrel hunting Sam the McCoy's bristled when they saw Bill Stayton remembering his traitorous testimony at the hug trial squirrel hunting Sam aimed his rifle and shot the gun right out of Bill statements hands then he dropped his own gun and threw himself at his cousin. They scuffled on the ground until Ellison Hatfield, pull them apart and shoved squirrel hunting Sam away the men separated without any serious injury that day, but the next few months were punctuated with similar skirmishes on June eighteen eighteen eighty Paris in squirrel hunting Sam again, cross paths with Bill Stayton in the woods. This time. Stayton was alone. There are several different accounts of what followed on that day. According to McCoy historians. Bill Stayton saw Perez and Sam I and he ambushed them shooting Paris through the hip. Paris felt the bullet ripped through the flesh of his hip, and he snarled in surprise and pain. He turned to see Bill statement barreling towards him acting on pure instinct, Paris raised his own gun and fired back hitting Stayton in the chest. Paris's Pull's raised as he watched the blood spurt from the man's wound. But Stayton wasn't stopping he lumbered toward Paris and began to pummel him with his fists. Paris drew up his arms grabbing Bill by the shoulders as he stumbled backward. He clot at Bill drawing. Blood Bill, Baird his teeth rabid suddenly Bill lunched forward and tore at Paris's jugular vein with his teeth. Paris began to panic. He felt sticky blood pooling at his caller, he gripped. The other man's jaws and tried to pry him loose Paris church. Nd his desperate is towards his brother squirrel hunting. Sam who watched the fight from a few feet away. Harris couldn't speak. He couldn't manage to do anything. But grunt regardless. Sam got the message and raise his pistol. Sam wasn't nickname squirrel hunting Sam for nothing. He had an aim so sharp he could pick squirrels out of trees as they leapt from limb to limb now he was aiming at a larger target with one shot from SAM's gun. A bullet pierced Bill state and skull Peres felt bills body jerk against him, then go limp. Paris breathe a sigh of relief Bill Stayton had finally gotten. What was coming to him? Historians. More sympathetic to the hatfields tell a different version of Bill statements death. They say that's grow hunting. Sam and Peres were the first aggressors and that Bill was minding his own business when they attacked regardless of the exact details. Historians agreed that squirrel hunting Sam shot and killed Bill. Stayton salmon Paris ran off leaving Bill statements body to grow cold on the forest path. But Paris now had a bullet wound in his hip and Gouges across his face obvious injuries indicating that he'd been in a fight. When Bill statements body was discovered a few days later people made the connection between Paris, McCoy's injuries and statements death, the Hatfield Klan responded, quickly devil, lances older, brother, Valentine nickname. Wall. Hatfield was a Justice of the peace for the West Virginia district in which the murder had occurred. He drew up warrants for the arrest of Paris and Sam and the pair were soon apprehended. Next will discuss Paris and Sam McCoy's trial for murder, and how it would March the families into a bloody cycle of violence that would earn them notoriety across America. Now back to the story. After a series of altercations between the McCoy and Hatfield families. The feud was cemented on July eighteenth eighteen eighty with the death of Bill Stayton, a Hatfield sympathizer at the hands of Paris McCoy and his brother squirrel hunting. Sam the men were both charged with murder the deceased Bill statements best friend and brother-in-law. Ellison Hatfield was particularly determined to see Paris and Sam brought to Justice Ellison was among the witnesses who testified against the McCoy brothers at trial. But ultimately, the jury acquitted the pair on the grounds of self-defence, according to some accounts devil, Anse Hatfield went out of his way to pressure. The jury to acquit Paris and Sam he reportedly did so in an effort to defuse some of the tension building between the families. If it's true that devil aunts arranged for Paris and SAM's acquittal. The McCoy's apparently didn't appreciate the gesture. They were angry that salmon Paris had been charged with murder in the first place. It seemed that nothing could assuage the wounds left in the aftermath of Harmon McCoy's murder. The harassment of Perry Cline and the hog trial. But in August of eighteen eighty election day provided an enjoyable diversion. For residents of the blackberry district of Kentucky election day, wasn't just a chance for people to select their favorite candidates. It was an opportunity to eat drink and socialize with neighbors. The women unable to cast ballots brought baked goods to hand out in a show of support for their preferred elected officials and the men brought plenty of moonshine. Only Kentucky residents could vote in blackberries elections, but the district's West Virginia neighbors often showed up to be spectators or to try to influence voters. The communities were so close together that Kentucky's elections affected them to. That year. One of the polling locations was set up at the home of seventy six year old Jeremiah Hatfield, Jeremiah was a great uncle to devil Anse though. He lived on the Kentucky side of the tug. Fork river naturally double aunts and the rest of the clan showed up to be a part of the amusement. The McCoy's also arrived cast their votes. But luckily, nobody was in a fighting mood. Among them was Roseanna McCoy the fourth daughter of Randolph and Sarah McCoy Twenty-one year old Rosanna was described as a beautiful woman tall and slender with dark eyes and long Auburn hair that looked golden in the sunlight eighteen year old. Johnny Hatfield must have met Rosanna before. But he had never taken much notice of her until that election day. Johny Hatfield was devil lances oldest son. He was known as a dapper playboy he liked to dress. Well, he liked to Drink, Man. He liked to chase women that day. He and Roseanna McCoy got to talking in the late afternoon while the families began to depart Rosanna and John city snuck off into the woods and spend the evening together. As nights set in and passion, abated Rosanna grew freed. She didn't want to return, home and face. Her father Johnson agreed to take her to the Hatfield home. He promised that he would marry her and that everything would be all right, Dev. Lance Hatfield didn't mind having Rosanna stay with the family. But by most accounts, he strongly objected to a son marrying a McCoy. Meanwhile, Randolph McCoy was furious. He sent Rosanna several messages demanding that she returned home Rosanna refused holding out hope that John would marry her. But he didn't either he wouldn't defy his father or he didn't want to be tied down after a few months. Rosanna finally left the Hatfield homestead and return to her family by that time, she was pregnant being pregnant and unmarried wasn't the end of the world. Puritanism didn't run as deep in the southern mountains as it did in the northeastern part of the country. There weren't many churches in the undeveloped wilderness of Kentucky and West Virginia. And it wasn't uncommon for couples to start a life together before they had a chance to make it to the alter the community might not have judged Rosanna. Unfortunately. Her father did Randolph kicked her out of the house. She moved in with a widowed aunt about half a mile up the river, although Johnny Hatfield didn't marry Rosanna. He still wanted to see her. The couple continued to meet secretly in the woods when Randolph heard about this. He sent his sons Tolbert farmer and Jim to put a stop to it. Roseanne has brothers were all too happy to interrupt the couple's clandestine. Rendezvous Tolbert had gotten himself deputized and he arrested Johnny for carrying a concealed weapon. It was a dubious charge given that most men of the area never left the house without a firearm. But the McCoy's didn't care they carry Johnny off intending to take him to the pike. Ville jail Rosanna was terrified that her brothers might kill jonky. She ran to the nearby farm of her neighbor and cousin Tom staffer. Heard. She borrowed a horse and race Bareback to the hatfields farm where she called on devil. Lance to rescue his son. Deva? Lance gathered up a posse of Hatfield brothers sons and nephews the group use shortcuts to intercept the McCoy's on the road to bike Ville, outnumbered. Rosanna 's brothers were forced to give up their captive relations between Rosanna and John C soured soon after. In the spring of eighteen eighty one he began to pursue a different McCoy Rosanna sixteen year old cousin Nancy unlike Rosanna Nancy didn't have a father to criticize the match. She was the daughter of harm in McCoy the union soldier who had been murdered by the Logan. Wildcats in eighteen sixty five not long before Nancy was born Nancy's mother, Patty, however did oppose the marriage as the wife of in McCoy and sister of Perry Cline. She had more reason than anyone to hate the hatfields. The Nancy was a headstrong girl and she married John C in may of eighteen eighty one without her mother's approval that seems spring Rosanna gave birth to her baby. A daughter named Sarah, Elizabeth tragically the infant died after contracting measles. Than pneumonia. At just eight months old for months afterward Rosanna would spend hours each day sitting by the baby's grave. She would never have any more children, and she would never marry. This time of grief was also a time of relative calm between the families. But by the next election day on August eighth. Eighteen eighty two tempers flared once again. As they had done two years prior dozens of members of the Hatfield and McCoy families gathered at the polling grounds, and blackberry district. Everyone seemed to be in high spirits, Tom Stafford who had family connections to both the hatfields and the mccoys was on the ballot. That day folks were eager to support him, many of them accordingly were also relieved to discover that the most despised members of the Hatfield clan had stayed home, including devil, Lance and his son Johnny the mccoys had every reason to enjoy the festivities but Randolph McCoy's twenty eight year old son Tolbert was in a dark mood. Tolbert was described as one of the most hot tempered members of the McCoy family. He became particularly angry when he drink that day alcohol was flowing freely. Apple jack. And corn liquor. There may have also been a genetic basis for Tolbert's frequent bouts of fury. Many modern day descendants of the McCoy family have been diagnosed with on hippo endow disease. This rare genetic disorder causes tumors in the adrenal gland, which can then cause the body to produce excess adrenaline if Randolph son suffered from the same disease. They may have been frequently overloaded with fight or flight hormones and easily provoked a trivial thing set Tolbert off he accused a Hatfield relative of owing him money for fiddle. He'd sold him the men began to argue Ellison Hatfield arrived to stop the fight. Ellison. The well liked confederate war hero back to St. gin and respectable brother of devil. Aunts might have been successful. But the mccoys were still angry at Ellison specifically for. For testifying against squirrel, hunting Sam and Paris McCoy in their trial for murdering Bill Stayton. Of course, they were also still angry at all the hatfields collectively for Johnny Hatfield treatment of Rosanna and his seduction of Nancy for fully tat fields victory in the hog trial for devil lances possession of Perry clients property and for the Logan Wildcats murder of in McCoy, according to some accounts. Ellison try to defuse the situation with humor he took off his straw hat and offered it Tolbert in lieu of the price for the fiddle. He said that it would at least give Tolbert something feed. Cows humorless. Tolbert shouted back. I'm hell on earth. Ellison replied, your damn hog Tolbert's pride could not withstand. One more insult. He pulled out his Jack knife and stabbed Ellison through the ribs. Ellison was hurt. But. He managed to pull out his own blade and slashed at Tolbert's head. The knife glanced across Tolbert's ear at that point. Ellison lost his grip on the knife. He began attacking with his fists. He was bigger than Tolbert and would have had a good chance of overpowering him in a fair fight. But Tolbert still had his knife. Tolbert began to stab Ellison again. And again. Tolbert's brother Bill McCoy briefly entered the fray to stab Ellison with his own blade, then he ran off into the woods Tolbert. Kept stabbing and one of the blows Pierce through Ellison stomach puncturing his liver. Ellison Hatfield desperately grasped in nearby rock and lifted it up and tending to bash Tolbert's goal at that point another McCoy brother farmer grabbed a pistol and shot Ellison in the back. Ellison went still as he collapsed. He muttered I'm shot and shot for dead. Tolbert suddenly came to a census he dropped his weapon as a number of angry Hatfield, surrounded him and farmer. The also grabbed eighteen year old bud McCoy who hadn't even joined his brothers in the fight. Perhaps. They mistook him for his older brother Bill who had jabbed Ellison with his pocket knife before disappearing into the woods the rest of the hatfields fashioned stretcher out of an old blanket and used it to carry the badly wounded Ellison Hatfield to a nearby house to receive medical attention preacher, Anse, Hatfield, the blackberry district. Justice of the peace instructed, a pair of constables to take Tolbert farmer and bud McCoy to the pike Ville jail Randolph McCoy, accompanied them. Anticipating he'd need to hire a lawyer for his sons defense. It was a twenty five mile journey and dangerous to travel the narrow ridges and mountain paths after dark so the party stopped to rest for the night before continuing the journey the next morning by then Deva, Lance had heard what happened to his brother. Ellison. He went to Kentucky at daybreak where Ellison was still clinging to his life despite the twenty six knife wounds and one bullet hole that martis torso Deva, Lance, then gathered up all the hatfields and family supporters. He could they set off to find the constables transferring the McCoy's to prison devil, lances older brother wall Hatfield found them. I he explained to Randolph McCoy and the constables that he wanted them to return to the blackberry district. He felt that as a practical matter the charges should be brought in the district where the crime had taken place. Whoa. Wall was about to take custody over the men when devil. Lance arrived with his posse. Wall had been trying to act as the rational law man, but Ellison was his brother to when devil Anse commanded all hatfields to fall in mine while relented and let devil Anse take charge. They loaded the prisoners onto a corn sled. Terrified for his sons Randolph McCoy took off for pike Ville, still hopeful that he might find a lawyer there to assist them. Devil. Lance and his posse drag the prisoners across the tug fork river into West Virginia and marched them to an empty ramshackle schoolhouse a mile from the river Bank. They waited their guns pointed at the three McCoy brothers as messengers wind back and forth to get updates on Ellison hatfields condition. Bud McCoy shivered and terror. He was only eighteen he barely understood why he was supposed to hate the hatfields. He hadn't even participated in the stabbing or shooting of Ellison Hatfield. It had been his brother's Tolbert farmer and Bill he knew that devil. Aunts had sons of his own some about buds age. He prayed that the old Hatfield patriarch which show him some mercy. But as he listened to the Hatfield joke about lynching and speculate about the most painful place to shoot a prisoner. He began to lose hope than mercy was on anyone's mind daylight was fading eerie shadows filled the schoolhouse, but tried to choke back his rising panic he heard someone approaching from outside. He looked fearfully up as the door. Swung open to. His astonishment. He saw his mother Sarah McCoy standing in the entryway, she looked more terrified than he felt Fifty-three-year-old Serra McCoy had come to Bank for the lives of her sons. She had brought Tolbert's wife Mary and their four month old baby Cora with her the women drop to their knees and front of Deva, Lance and wall, the pleaded with the hatfields to release their kin Sarah didn't try to excuse her son's attack on Ellison Hatfield, but she argued that they should be tried a affair court of law. According to witnesses devil. Anse was unmoved by the women's attempts to reason with him. He simply told them you needn't beg, and you needn't cry if Ellison dies, you boys has got to die. Thanks again for tuning into crimes of passion. We will be back Wednesday with part two of the Hatfield McCoy feud story will discuss the aftermath of Ellison Hatfield stabbing and the cycle of violence that it perpetuated. You can find more episodes of crimes of passion as well. As all of our casts other shows on Spotify or your favorite podcast directory. Several of you have asked how to help us if you enjoy the show the best way to help is to leave a five star review. Don't forget to follow us on Facebook and Instagram at par cast and Twitter at parkas network. We'll see you next time when true love meat true crime. Crimes of passion was created. By max Cutler is a production of Cutler media, and is part of the park has network. It is produced by Maxon wrong Cutler with sound design by Michael links ner production assistance by Ron Shapiro. Paulie skinned and Maggie admire crimes of passion is written by Christine. Pam hayes. I'm Laney Hobbs. And here it is a clip of the first episode of espionage. It's about a young American couple who were accused of spying for the Soviet Union in the late nineteen forties to listen to the full first episode subscribe to espionage wherever you listen to podcasts. Rose of records flash past Julius Rosenberg as he made his way deeper and deeper into the army signal corps building he checked his watch trying to remain as casual as possible. That was the secret to being covert remain, perfectly normal. He pulled a paper bound file from the shelf, and unwrapped it inside was a manual dictating the full schematics on the US jet fighter. The p eighty shooting star this plane was the choice fighter for the American forces in with any luck. The Soviets would know every system on board just then a door slammed at the other end of the room. Someone was there. Julius didn't have much time. He pushed back his horn rimmed glasses and removed a small like a camera from his suitcase. Be snapped pictures of the file one page at a time faster faster faster than as the footsteps turned the corner, he tied the string around the file and placed it back on the shelf. It was just a record assistant restocking books. Julius nodded and continued on his way. That night Julius called his handler on the phone it rang twice, and he hung up. That was all his handler needed to know. Julius had information. This is a new park cast original exploring the missions behind the world's most incredible spies, and what brought their covert operations into the public eye. I'm your host Carter ROY throughout this show. We'll explore real world spy tactics required to impersonate exploit and infiltrate the most confidential places in the world. This is our first episode on the world's most infamous, atomic spies. Julius and Ethel Rosenberg in the mid nineteen forties. Twenty-seven-year-old Julius and his thirty year old wife Ethel orchestrated a top secret operation to steal information about the atomic bomb from right under the FBI's knows on this week. We'll explore how to American communists turned from activists into international spies next week. We'll follow. Oh, the Rosenbergs as their operation comes crashing to the ground. Julius Rosenberg had lived on the Lower East Side since he was a child. He knew it better than anyone the noise. The heat the discrimination. The big businesses flourishing while hardworking families starved New York City was proof that American capitalism had failed. Everyone said America was the land of opportunity on. That's why Julius says parents had moved there from the Russian empire. But the reality of life during the great depression, especially for working class Jewish immigrants like the Rosenbergs was far from utopian. All Julia saw was injustice and inequality. Well, Julius was a student at the City College of New York in the mid nineteen thirties. He worked part time at a pharmacy in Harlem one night. A black man was hit by a bus on the street just outside the shop. Yep. They brought him inside. But in the hour. It took for an ambulance to arrive the man bled to death. If that was the best America could offer Julius wanted to see his other options. Like, many young people in the nineteen thirties, Julius. Aw. A more promising vision of society in his family's homeland Russia at the time serving as the center of power within the Soviet Union on their communism equality was a promise not a dream the poor would be lifted up and the rich would be held in check. By the time. He was eighteen in nineteen thirty six Julius was arising leader in C C, N wise, young Communist League. How the communist party USA was enjoying a moment in the spotlight in the nineteen thirties membership rose from seven thousand five hundred fifty five thousand over the course of the decade, this was partially due to disillusionment with capitalism during the great depression and also in response to the rise of fascism in Spain Germany in the days before McCarthyism, communism wasn't a dirty word in the party attracted droves supporters by fighting for labor laws women's rights and racial equality at a political rally in the winter of nineteen thirty six Julius met another free thinker Ethel Greenglass Ethel was a twenty one year old aspiring actress and out of work secretary. She'd been fired from her clerical job the previous year for organizing a worker strike, but it didn't scare her away from activism and fact, it only made her more. Fiery Julius and Ethel were both true. Believers in the communist cause and politics became the passion that bound them together. Julius was bold and fearless at one point in college. He led a raid on a German ocean. Liner, the SS Bremen and tore the Nazi flag from its Jack staff Ethel on the other hand was cautious and practical Julius could never be bothered to do his homework. So at the routinely wrote his college papers for him typing them up on her second hand, Remington typewriter. If it wasn't for Ethel's diligence Julius may not have finished college at all. But he finally graduated with a Bs in electrical engineering in February nineteen thirty nine one semester late and ranked seventy ninth out of eighty five in his class. The next year Julius got a job as a civilian engineer inspecting equipment for the army signal corps in New York. For most electrical engineers, this would have been a boring entry level job. But Julius saw the hidden value. This position offered him access to America's advanced radio radar and sonar technologies. The foundation of the US military's communication systems. Just a year later in December nineteen forty one the United States entered World War Two the Soviet Union and America where allies in the war, but they were still ideological opposites. As two of the world's rising superpowers neither country wanted to see the other surpass them in technological advances, and as two of America's rising communists, Julius and Ethel Rosenberg knew which side they wanted to come out on top. When the war was finally over. Throughout the early nineteen forties, Julius snuck as much information as he could into his briefcase, circuit board diagrams company messages. He didn't know exactly what Russia needed. So he grabbed a little bit of everything with Ethel's knowledge and support he hid the stolen documents on their apartments bookshelf, waiting for an opportunity to pass it along into the right hands to do that the Rosenbergs needed to contact the N cave. E D the Soviet Union's interior ministry and secret police agency, which would later become known as the K G B, but how do two twenty something. New Yorkers get connected with a foreign country's top secret intelligence agency. In nineteen forty one Julius and Ethel began feeling out potential contacts in the young Communist League, and the communist party USA, the attended weekly party meetings across New York City, and at every meeting Julius made it a point to mention in casual conversation that he happened to possess sensitive information that could undermine the American military laughter. Almost two years this method failed to produce any results. The N K v very rarely touched base with the communist party USA, which was basically an intellectual organization run by politically powerless left wing academics, a proper nineteen forty Soviet agent. Focus their time on Ivy league universities. This was where the next generation of American statesman could be found by the end of nineteen forty two when Julius. Was twenty four and Ethel was twenty-seven. The had a new plan if the N K V didn't want them. They would build their own spy network for many of Julius friends from college had found jobs in engineering facilities, where top secret US military equipment was turned out on conveyor belts every day. He started by reaching out to his old friend. Joel Barr who also worked with him at the army signal corps, his friend. Morton sobil was at General Electric. William Pearl was at the national advisory committee for 'aeronautics the predecessor to NASA. Other friends ended up at bell laboratories, western electric, and chemical engineering firm called the Celtics corporation and Julius is sales. Pitch was always the same. According to his friend, max L at your Julius would tell each potential recruit that many of their friends were already. Giving secrets to Russia and that together they could bring about a change in the status quo for most. This was all it took by April nineteen forty two Julius and Ethel had amassed half a dozen American engineers who are loyal to the communist cause together. They gathered information about sonar military radio radar and cutting edge avionics from their corporate day jobs, a few months later, their work finally caught the kind of tension Julius had been waiting for. In June, nineteen forty two Julius was making his rounds at a communist party meeting when he was introduced to a man named Bernard. Schuster Shuster wasn't an N K b agent himself, but he told Julius he knew an agent by the name of Jacob goalless codename sound Jacob goalless was a rising star in the N cave. E he was a Russian immigrant who had made a name for himself in the nineteen twenties by stealing American passports, which the Soviet Union used to forge American travel documents with extreme accuracy by nineteen thirty goalless was recruited by the Soviet Union as a bona fide spy his job was to recruit American intelligence sources aka assets who are willing to sell secrets to the Soviets Julius and Ethel Rosenberg were. Exactly, the kind of people. Go lows was looking for Schuster saw Julius has value to Russia and told him that he would contact goalless later that month by the end of the summer Bernard Schuster told Julius that goalless would meet him in the upper east side within the following month. August nineteen forty two. Julius could feel the August heat pressing down on him. His glasses slid down the sweaty bridge of his nose finally a car stopped along the street and a man with a round face and large lips stepped out. This must be Jacob goalless. There was nothing special about goalless appearance. He looked totally unremarkable. This was by design. According to former chief of disguise of the CIA, John Mendez spies, try to be the man or woman that quote gets on the elevator. And then gets off. And nobody knew they were there. Goalless approached Julius and stopped a few feet away. What happened next is called a recognition signal. According to the international spy museum. This is a simple phrase word or object that is used to identify yourself as an ally agent, and we don't know the exact signal used for this conversation, but ex Soviet spy Klaus folks, describe some KGB tactics after the Cold War as a spy he was instructed to wear gloves. But carry a second pair or to hold a tennis ball as he walked down the street on the goal of these recognition signals is to be settled enough to seem normal but overt enough to identify your ally. Once the recognition was confirmed goalless gave Julius a small slip of paper with a telephone number in perfect English Colo's told Julius to call him when he needed. To talk Julius nodded goalless got back into his car and left the whole meeting lasted no more than about thirty seconds. But it was the most important thirty seconds of Julius Rosenberg's life. Coming up. We'll hear how the FBI began to tighten a noose around the Rosenbergs life.

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[063] Gerald McCoys future gets murkier as JPPs comes into question

Buccaneers Observer

37:48 min | 1 year ago

[063] Gerald McCoys future gets murkier as JPPs comes into question

"Every year in the NFL. It's a new team. As far as goals. Go. We have one. Putting a fucker Renata finger. Welcome to the buccaneers observant podcasts. Ralph Phillips today is may seventh two thousand nineteen one hundred and twenty days to get off. That's like four months next month's. It'll be less than one hundred as anybody that when it gets down to like double digits. We were excited for me. The season starts win hard knocks comes on that seems to be when football really gears up. They announced they're doing yet. All right. We got some interesting enough to talk about I I want to get some follow ups. In fact, Jack's we'll have to follow ups. One is Molly asked me what my conspiracy theory is. Well, I with and I looked at the top thirty conspiracy theories. They consist of Kim trails gloomy more global warming is a hoax. They viruses created in a laboratory harp. H AARP h AARP plastic coffins concentration camps. Anything about that one to two thousand four Indian Ocean soon. Nami Florida Asian and flight one zero three Philadelphia experiment Pearl Harbor peak oil conspiracy the protocols the Zahn never heard that one. Harold Wilson was a Soviet agent black or unmarked helicopters, the Moscow apartment bombings Gye, seven two thousand five two bombings. Paul is dead the disappeared so sugar. Shakespeare was somebody else. I have heard that one. Yeah. Let's never even heard on. We're just not up on the conspiracy. Need to watch more Alex Jones, I guess North American union project in K ultra odd concern that was proven fact operation north woods. Elvis Presley faked his own death, Princess, Diana Princess of Wales the Jesus conspiracy the aluminum body and the new world order NASA faked the moon landings a flying saucer crashed at Roswell in nineteen forty seven the assassination of John F Kennedy and September eleventh two thousand one those are all the top thirty conspiracy theories now. Now, my theory is everybody believes in at least one conspiracy theory in Mali copy by asking me. What was mine, I didn't know. But I do now the peak oil conspiracy. What does that? But that saying that we already hit peak oil, and everybody's kind of hoarding their oil waiting for the markets, the crash oil markets, and then there's going to be big global fighting over the oil and all that good stuff says I'll tell you think though. No. I don't think that I think the exact opposite. We have more especially with the shale revolution here in America. We've got enough oil just in America for the next heart and fifty years easy. So I do not believe wait a minute. Yes. I did that exactly wrong. In any of these now. No was I thought of you know, what global warming is believe that one. So they're they're doing all that for that. I thought I had the peak all conspiracy down. But now, I didn't believe in that the exact opposite. Yeah. Okay. Now the follow up. Molly was right Rojo had twenty three carries. Joe? Type. Ronald hose and twenty three carries in two thousand eighteen for a total of forty four yards and one touchdown. I don't remember touchdown. I don't either as long as care was nine yards in the averaged one point nine yards per tempt. Now, he was targeted nine times and had seven receptions for thirty three yards. I remember him not catching Arlene. But that's not to barely caught. Most of the ones that are on his way seven out of nine that's really strange because all you ever hear is how he can't can't anything. The obviously can catch conspiracy theories. Conspiracy theory that road Joe does not catch passes, but he caught seven out of nine and install. Yeah. I listen to Rick Strauss podcast the other night. And he was pretty funny talked about the pingpong controversy. I've got an article coming up on the website pingpong gate. So keep an eye out for that. But he really broke down about why it's silly for people to be harping on the ping pong table. But what really impressed me about it? But other than his argument was a guy disparate good impersonations. He does a perfect Gruden impersonation. I actually thought they had cut in some Gruden talking audio. He here for grooten. I don't know. I have to check if all of that. I think so if you haven't listened to check it out extra podcast, I think it was Friday, it's pink controversy. So agreed. It's stupid. You have to check more clouds here. So in all I think that the fans want punishment they want they don't wanna see these guys. Haven't flown the family put in a lot of stuff to be a fans, we buy jerseys. We buy. Tickets. We buy paraphernalia. We spent hours and hours watching the teams talking about the teams that we don't get anything retard it will compensated it when they lose and they're playing and laughing and all that rightfully so make pan pants upset. Now, they don't have just a ping pong table in the locker. They've got right down the hall in the players lounge. They've got a pool table video games all kinds of stuff. So external argument was if you take it out of the blocker room that's gonna stop. I mean, they're still going to go to the players lounge play, you know, it's not gonna plus plenty of teams have ping pong tables a near locker rooms, apparently Seahawks coach Carroll p Carroll. Yeah. He started this whole mess. And now teams the falcons have it Jaguars. Having did have it until Coughlin came in there and took it out. But some teams have it. And they are winners teams haven't they're losers. Like a falcons their bottom of the division with us. So it's not a guaranteeing. Having a big table doesn't correlate to winning or losing. But my point is, you know, we're we talk about holding teams accountable holding players accountable coaches cab, all that mess. Sometimes we confused between accountability and Justice. And I think fans see the ping pong table as a punishment take the ping pong table out because these guys don't deserve to be goofing off. And that's what I think reached out missing. You know, this is about a fans. This is about players does there's some really good points. Thank you reborn. I haven't put a lot of thought into bet. I don't think it should be at the locker room. I think it you have to think about the mentality of that space. It's like the same reason that they tell you not to put a TV in your bedroom. When you because it makes your bedroom a place where you want TV non-pleased where you're sleeping really cutting to your sleep point. And there's all kinds of things in your house that you can do to change your life on your habits in your so good point rewrite article. There's a whole bunch going on with Jerry McCoy JP. We're going to get to that general McCoy and put on a video on his Instagram the other day, we're basically he was saying don't question me. I'm working hard later. He said don't you ever question me? I found it kind of ridiculous. You know, this is this is the McCoy wave seeing furred nine years. You know, he talks a lot of stuff during the off season. I'm going to be the leader put the team on bag where we're practicing the win. We're going to play offs as you stuff. And they went the regular season comes you never hear from begin. You know, he's not saying any of that. And that's what I see here. I wish he was like that all the time out there on the field beaten, his Jessen. Don't question me. But that's not the general. We'll get into season. I liked to see him. Take verse sponsor -bility for the losing in the same way. JP, Dan, we have very few people in the locker room not saying this is on us. We have to do better. This is true. That's again, it goes back to that accountability. Right. Another strange thing found with this whole dare McCoy saga. I mean, we don't know what's going to happen. We don't know the mindset, I'm of the painting is just speculation from what I know about Bruce Arians, and he doesn't like McCoy leadership style, especially as a veteran. So he's of the mindset, let's get rid of jerem McCoy, you know, plus, that's that's a pretty big salary for a guy. That's getting thick tax. I mean, Masseev got six X a half. I think and you know, he didn't play as much Jerry McCoy, and he's not getting paid near as much as job. Of course. So I could I could see Bruce Arians where his mindset would be totally different than the previous coaches. We've had in you. However, what's really freaking me out about all? This is how the media is just downright defending Dermot coy, and they will harass anybody that is against McCoy's questions. Jerem coin I find that very strange because I don't think that's the job of the media. You know, all these guys that are reporting on the buck near their job to try convince fans that certain players need to stay on the team. Right. And that's all we've gotten especially after the end of the season because that's when jerem McCoy in the locker room and sounded like he was preparing for his last game with the team. And then you got all these puff pieces about him. Oh my gosh. There's there's five articles of day written about how great Dermot goal is. And how he needs to stay on. Team. Right. And it's all basically concentrated with the local media in Tampa. Now, I can understand if they did this routinely. If they did it with keep to leave or one or with just Freeman they kind of did they took his side over Greg Xiang does. But even Jameis Winston or any other player, I've never seen anything like this. Where all the media is just totally unified in aspect tear McCoy is a good player. Why the best players have ever had? And he needs to stay on the team. No matter what. And here's why. And now come out with all these obscure stats superb. That's the big six, which we all know pro bowls popularity contest. So why do you think that is do you have an opinion on that with that's done this before that, it's certainly an access media? Where they're not doing a lot of hard hitting reporting or digging. It's whoever gives them access that's kind of where their stories tend to go. I think McCoy is he gives good sound bites. He's comfortable in front of a camera. He likes to talk. And so the media's attracted to them because it's not like it's pulling teeth to try to get information out of them or a very savvy. I mean, he's been on Stephen Colbert Howdy. Buccaneers players can be saying have been on a nationally televised production like that I agree with you. And you said the phrase access media. I think that's what it is. And of course, this is all speculation. But it seems to me in most of the guys in the media have said at one point or another that there's not a microphone Joe McCoy doesn't like in like you pointed out to he's been very good at marketing himself being on Stephen Colbert and all the NFL shows and other good stuff, and he seems to be able to middle. How do talking? Points and get sound bites out there. It's like the being bell teamed. That was Jerry McCoy started that I have the exact day. But I don't have it with me. Hold on one second. I can't find it. But somewhere in I wanna say two thousand twelve or two thousand thirteen Gerald McCoy started mentioning that he got double teamed all the time. And then the media started picking up on that. And if you if you notice back, and you watch their McCoy's interviews and his press clippings and stuff like that. He always brings out that he's being double teamed him doing and in the media has followed along and said that he's being double team if you the website, you can lock many years. I did charting on who was getting double teamed on the defensive line because somebody always double team we're in a four and three guys online. There's five on offense line style. Somebody someone. Seventeen. Yes. And your was double team. No more than anybody else. And it was not that often. It was less than twenty percent of the time. And I even changed the way I looked at it. I started off doing double teams are I consider a double team win two linemen. Two more alignment specifically single out a person to block, then I changed it because I was getting around ten percent. Double teams have probably even less than that. I don't have my notes up right now. But it was way down there on McCoy. So then I switched to Zini time to offense lineman touched Gerald McCoy or anybody else on the defensive line. And it still didn't change the stats moved them up to around thirty percents twenty twenty-five percent somewhere in there. But everybody on the difference while it was getting those same numbers dare McCoy started pushing the double team. And then it was the media that followed along behind him and started pushing that narrative he did something similar with the stunt center, Xiang. If you remember, yes. See he's complaining that overdue into many stunts the problem. And then he said I went to Greg Xiang now, and I spoke with him, and we're gonna less stunt Royd than exactly right after that. Nothing changed. I studied that game film to see how we changed the starts or reduced. We actually increased the stunts and Jemma quite did stance before cion over Kane, always both and similar rate. Always McCoy's always done some ever since he's been here. She had so different kinds of stuff. So they win there. But he didn't do any more than lovey Smith in it up doing or cutters administration. Anybody stunt just part of the team. And it's something McCoy is always done. So is good at working with the media, and they seem to marry much like working with Jeremy McCoy we have mentioned about Scott Reynolds. I think it was the Peter report who got he wrote an article that was negative towards Jeremy Koi a few years ago. Actually called him up on his cell phone inhaling. Correct. The article and retract it. So why would you do as a journalist because I think they're scared of losing access to Gemma cool because he is so open. He will talk to. I mean, he's on the podium all the time in the locker room. They always talk to Gerald McCoy. He's he's guaranteed article writer, you get an article out of Gerald McCoy fan favorite as a fan favorite click on these articles just because of his name. Yes. And then you have the national media or the broadcasters will the hypo- jerem McCoy during the game. Yeah. He's got name recognition one because he's been on the clean for so long to because he was such a high draft pick for us, right? And he's likes dichotomy of dedom- consume. Yeah. And he is McLean is what the NFL wants to see as far as character is concerned in the NFL clean, very clean, very, family oriented and all that stuff. And I love that about coy. But I think that. The media is doing disservice to the fans by trying to make fans feel guilty and feel bad about having increases journal. There's plenty criticism. Be had about your cloud about his game. His game play is not perfect. There's plenty of things you could say about Jarrell game play that is critical. But you don't ever get that from the media and then fans to it? They're considered Jeremy Koi haters and their land blasted is Twitter today and yesterday, it's just near-constant. There's people on both sides of the aisle. Unfortunately, the bucks media is on one side, they're unequivocally the only the only one I know that criticizes Gerald McCoy. And he doesn't relentlessly is Ian Beckles, and he's the only one that doesn't have doesn't have anything to do with getting access to one buck place. He's a total. He's an objective outside person. Even though he did play for the buccaneers for many years. He doesn't seem to have. He's not there for the media Vance and. Locker room, it doesn't require access. And I would also like to point out a podcast not too long ago. A few months, maybe put out by the Peter report guys they or joking about something or maybe it might have been Joe bucks fan in any case. They were joking. And they were like all the, you know, the buccaneers are gonna take your credentials for you. And it had nothing to do with McCoy. I don't think they were big remember what you're talking about. But they were joking about don't say that because the buccaneers will take your credential claim. So it is very much a quick pro quo relationship, I think between the buccaneers organization and the players and the media, then it makes sense. That's the way it is a lot of places. Yeah. I don't think it's unique to our football team. I think it's any football team any sports team. Would you just have to take biased writing with a grain of salt? You only get one side of the story when someone is trying to push their narrative on you. And that's why I don't I give a little more slack because they're clearly bias. They always have been there blog more or less than you have good insider information, but every single one of their articles Aslan voice their opinion their of ours that I'm constantly sending Ralph tweet throughout the day. Making any inappropriate sexual innuendo? What these journalists are doing to German coin? It's the Tampa Bay times in particular are really his jock. And I don't know why Tom bassin germ tell metrics he loves thrown out stats about Guay. And what a fan pointed out was that those are great stats for Joe McCoy. But they're just about him. They're not about what he's bringing to the team. What does he done for the team and see what he's done for his career for his numbers? Yes. We don't know anything about what goes on with locker room, and how you interact with other players and all that stuff stats are one thing. But you gotta admit to guy has been the stalwart of this defense. He's the only one left from two thousand ten he's been there that long and ever since he's been here aren't defenses sucked. And he's got good staff for defensive tackle. And I'm not bashing Odera McCoy either way, it's just it is what it is. But you have to look at the whole picture. The team hasn't his of the. Of the ball has not gotten better any gotta lay some blame at his feet, but they don't do that. And that's kind of bothered me about his video where he said don't ever question me never to era at one buck plays. And there's this thing called accountability that Bruce Arians likes to push very hard, and no one's exempt from that. Everyone should be held accountable. There shouldn't be one person who can't be question, ROY. And that's the thing with your McCoy. He's never ever since he's been here. He's never one had in competition to his job is never been threatened. I mean, he has every coaches come in here as of mmediately said Jeremy coins the best player on defense. And this is the first time he's ever had any adversity his workplace and to say that we can't question who assume be talking to us. I don't know who's talking to. But we was pretty general. I'm like, no, no, you won't be questioned is like everybody else all the way from the media. All the way up to ship. I'm a fan. I'm question. All of you sports, you if you're on the team, but I'm going to question, you, hold you accountable. Grow up. I'm gonna talk about it. So we don't know where Jerrell McCoy what's going to happen. I think at this point clearly he is a disgruntled employee at a minimum. I don't I don't think it would be a good idea to bring you can't. I don't think it can't. If you cut it salary. He's going to be disgruntled if you don't make amends between Burs areas and hill, he's gonna come in disgruntle. He's gonna require a public AFC kissing for the coaching staff from, sir. Yeah. Happen. We'll we'll see we don't know. But here's the interesting thing. If you're not aware JP got into a car wreck, we covered this in our last podcast. We said everything was okay. Fortunately, doesn't appear to be that way. It's we don't have answers yet. We know he went to the hospital after his accident. They cleared him send him home. The buccaneers medical staff. Got a hold of his skin's that he had done at the hospital, and they said, well, we don't think everything's okay. They saw something on the scans. They didn't like. And now he's going for a second opinion. They're concerned that it's a fractured neck, and that he may require surgery. There's a report L about an hour gal at eight o'clock on the seventh that it may heal on its own. He may not require surgery. It does look like he's likely to miss some time. If it's if it's a fracture, and he doesn't require surgery. They're saying it takes five to six months. To recover. So that puts him back in October ready to practice, and then he probably wouldn't even see the field right away because he's got to get in football shape. If it requires surgery. That's he's gonna miss next season. Do you have he comes back in October? I don't see how that's going to help. Because this is a totally new defense not just for the team. But for hill he's never played in this type of defense before I don't see how he could get on the field without a crap ton of practice in his off season. If he doesn't participate in the offseason practices. I don't think he's gonna make the team you think cut him. I think there's a high possibility. I mean, they're not going to we're in salary cap crunch is one of the things which is we need that there may now if we can cut JP recoup some of that in a seven main or whatever it is. Nobody knows nobody knows anything about his contract. Gregg, Allman is even come out said, we don't know the specific language in JP's contract. Void a guarantee of. When we would have to be Nejla cited on a car accident a lot we don't know as to how the books can will handle this moving forward. Very true. We don't know anything about what's going to happen. What Gerald's Cupper GP's contract looks like whether how much money we could recoup cutting or bench name or putting him on the non football related injury list. We don't know anything right now. But it does put him on the chopping block. And if we cut him, we might not have to cut general coy, I think he still cut jerem Koi. Irrespective of what happens with JP that would be a huge huge holes to fill losing JP, Gerald coil defense alone. You've got some money you three. Three or topic? To get. That would be hilarious. Could you imagine? If we got rid of McCoy we brought sue in then we're gonna play offs. Oh my gosh. That would don't answer a lot of questions certifies because sue has been to what three or four different teams and he's been to the playoffs. Every single one of them. Right. No stranger to the limelight. Hopefully JP will not need any type of surgery. And this is just a fluke thing. He's getting a bunch of second and third opinions on this moment. So we won't know anything probably tomorrow or later in the week. Yeah. I think it's gonna be a while. The bucks organization is kinda Salone and turn around information without Beckwith list on them still don't know. Could you imagine if JP is out because of a car wreck Beckwith outlast your car wreck JP this year because car wreck I'm going to start bubble wrap? These players now for the offseason get ridiculous, or you haven't they have personal drivers over never understood that you can still get a car wreck in an Uber. This is. True. Which banned cars. Get them on. Yeah. They can't go anywhere. No, no, traveling Vinnie time, you go sleep at one Buc place, which is a fan. I won't be perfectly fine with it was chilling on Twitter to see all the argument about McCoy this morning, and then this afternoon, the no the news came out about JP, fractured necking. It might be more serious and people immediately jump to. Oh, good. Now, we can keep McCoy like very little concern for JP future with the bucks his health. It was immediate jump. And it was well it key thinking about them. Yeah. And a lot of people are now even like Joe box fans put out articles. Well, here's the McCoy situation. Now that JP may not play. Or now that JP is in question. And you know, Tom passenger with the Tampa Bay times was advocating to trade JP months ago. So I'm sure that he's just like I told us how we should have done a month ago, train them out broke. Now, that's another thing about the whole German coast of it. I don't like is. I don't think one player on the team, and he has done this ever since he's been here. He has sucked up all media attention since he's been here and some players are. Okay. With that. I think. Oh, yeah. But I'm talking about as a fan, right? No. I don't think anyone player should be given that much limelight on a team. Now. I don't think so either because what about their people, and you don't want the limelight. Do you want to be quest? Gained and give interviews and no one cares. What they say. It's a it's a strange situation gets resolved soon. Other does give us something to talk about during it does in Beccles podcasts on this was refreshing. If it's refreshing, you mean full of darts, and honest, he just turned a long more to the side of jerem coins. Head that was that was a podcast if I was McCoy. I would probably wanna fight Ian, Beckles he blocked in Beccles. The gal was pinned block. Probably can't Beck was not appreciated. Terrible coy at all since he's being here is just got worse and worse over the years. He's got a different perspective. Because right. The NFL rim before he played against defensive tackles. Right. That was his position. So he he has a little better perspective on it. Then say Rick Stroud. Right. So if you wanna hear the other side of the story, listen and Beccles, but make sure there's no children in the room. And if you love McCoy, you probably don't wanna turn it off immediately. Yeah. That's what we need. We need the balance we need. Right. I don't think it should be as biased on both sides is. But if you're gonna listen to one side, you need to listen to the other side to just to get balance within yourself. He's been really easy. I say this about NFL players same thing. I say about college players, I take any game and make a highlight feel of any player on the team anywhere. You make them. I could make a highlight field even somebody that all they do. They play special teams. I can make a highlight film of it. I could also do the exact opposite Becca low light film of any player on the team. So it's really how all this is being framed. If you're listening to only people that are telling you, the highlights, you go, thank these players are awesome, or whatever. But if you don't ever see the low lights, you're not getting a balanced approach, and you're not getting the full story. And I don't think people are thinking of this critically like you're either in one camp or the other. And if you are in the camp where you loved your McCoy a lot of people are saying. Oh, the real the real fans, the real fans shouldn't be talking about your McCoy like this. Yes. And that's another thing that bothers me about this whole situation. So I don't like to see the fan base five. I mean, we should just be able to talk about it and disagree in. Unfortunately, what happens is you get you say all I really liked your McCoy is a really good guy. Good player. Then you're gonna have some bonehead that comes up and goes on. This this net and they'd use your position you start attacking now. And then it becomes a war. Everybody pick sides and pitchforks, John. I've definitely gotten like that before not with Jeremy McCoy and other people on the team where maybe coach or you know, and the families turns against him, and it makes me really upset and angry. And actually, I got on for that reason because the buccaneer, and I was just very very angry tacking on team. And you're like that's my team. So I can understand people who really like McCoy getting upset about it. We was removed from the team that really really bothered me. Because I thought and I turned out to be right? That mcgeer Bont is a superstar. He's an elite player in. He was fun to watch. Mary entertaining. Not only on the field and off field any like strip clubs. So you know, how the big fan of? Some common interests. As a Sterkel held. So when Libya bluff was removed from the team was pretty despondent because I thought it was the wrong decision and turned out. I was correct in that. But that's not here there, but I didn't start attacking people. And even when it was brought up that we should get rid of blonde. Because there was a big contagion of people. That was like we need to get rid of you know, I didn't attack them. I don't think that's right. Where fans were supposed to support our team sport each other. If I wanna get attack. I'll go hang out with saints fans or Carolina Panthers fans, you know, as far as buccaneer fans, we should be able to have good discourse talk about our agreements. Put our pros economy out there. I never agree with calling for people fire. That's one thing. I love about Bruce Arians when he said that he said, I will not fire. Anybody on last staff? I was like clapping because I believe in. Yeah. I mean, of course, there are extremely circumstances. You somebody like Hernandez comes up starts killing people. Get rid of. I'm talking about for performance issues or silly off. Field stop or they say something somebody, you know. It's just people get so riled up did volved in this stuff. And understandably, so what you get you. Also, gotta look at this. This is the team we've chosen to support there's thirty one other teams out there filled with millions of other people that hate our team. We don't need to be one of those support team is putting everybody on the team include as water boys the cheerleaders the cultures the media the feigns to front office. It's our team we on the twelfth man on this team. I wouldn't mind in somebody on the teams that well, I'm not gonna play because I don't like the coach or I'm not complaining because I don't like to general manager and stuff, but you get the fan base all time on I'm not gonna watch games or I'm not going to go to the stadium until they get rid of this coach or they start drives me crazy. That's the very definition of Bain wig bandwagon fan fair weather fan watch team when they're winning come on. So, you know with the journal McCoy stuff whether you like him or you don't like him. You don't make a big deal out of it with other fans. And understand that you're probably half. Right. You're probably half wrong. Just like everybody else's if he's with the team fantastic. If you go somewhere else, you'd better not be the NFC south. Go hang out with his buddy. Juries you could still root for him as long as he doesn't go to team. We play me I prefer not to root for anybody. That's not on the team another team darn enemy. But I might they might be like a lower class enemy. If I really like it was hard for me when John Lynch went to Denver and that was hard because I've big John Lynch fan. And I was just like I cannot like John Lynch, I cannot not like John Lynch, but I forced myself to do it. Powered through powered through. So hopefully, this'll get wrapped up soon, and we can all move onto being United fans again. Yeah, this has really been divisive for the fan. Baynes only happens anytime like with the Mike Smith coaching thing with the end of a coach's tenure when they start losing all of a sudden the fan base to start to tackle each other in the media gets involved in a big wheel. They're usually the ones that start it to just sit there and stoke the fires. You're not gonna get that from this podcast. You never hear either. One of us talk about getting ready to somebody on a team or in front office or anything like that. I think I just talked about getting rid of German coy. I think so KOMO Mahler come home go. All right. That's short podcast for tonight. We just wanted to get those things out there. Molly still has the press conferences with the coaching assistance coaching staff. She's restore reviewing all that we're gonna fill those things in when there isn't any book news, but some pretty potent stuff going on with Jim McCoy JP today. So we thought we would cover that next podcast nothing else breaks. We'll probably have Molly finishing up her or 'continuing. She don't have it with us and finishing up. Like, man, there's a lot of coaches 'continuing her breakdown on all the different coaches. We have in their interviews. We did have some news the science Ajay Pierre jerem acquainting kind of ever shout on everything run as getting into the ring Alon or. September twenty second during the giants game. He'll be inducted Greg to help. I'll tell you. What probably the best cornerback that's play forty over forties interceptions. Over twenty sacks. He's only cornerback has never done that. There's another stand in there to remember. What is but I mean, he was a solid player. He'd never left field. He's always there for us. I started being fan at the end of his career to love Rondo lover on and tell you what he did the number one play for the buccaneers and puck near history. When he intercepted McNair in the NFC championship McNabb McNair. Get my brain check. When he intercept McNabb in NFC championship against filled out the eagles game that took us the Super Bowl. He intercepted. Ran it. Back for a touchdown. It changed every Buchan ears bands life. I remember sitting there because that was that was intense game. And the Philadelphia Eagles had knocked us out of the playoffs for many years previously. And when he intercepted that ball and started running back, we all just stood up and screaming unison were going to the Super Bowl. And they're still quite a few minutes left. But you know, it is done wrapped up, and that was Ronnie Barbara that did that. So I'll never forget that man. He needs to be in the ring of honor. And he needs to be in the hall of fame. If nothing else just for that one single play gonna get their fame and not remember it was the Philadelphia Eagles that we play. And it was during the Shia tenure we were right on the cusp of gone to the playoffs. And we lost that game and rendezvous barber was standing in the end zone. And he looked like a samba to stand. Yes. He was so depressed because he knew that was that was end of it and he was never gonna play offs again. And he we really had a chance, and that was just lose the way we lost that game and get knocked out of the playoff. Run was devastating the hill. And I want I'd like to see that when you lose. I want to see the players more upset than I get paid dollar. So it's really not that big of a deal tool, but I like to see just just despondent over a loss, especially a loss like that. And you could see they had to camera fixed on running Barbara in the end zone. And he just he just looked like a beaten, man. And I'm not saying I like to see Barbara a beat man, but I do like to see the players not like to lose. And hopefully, Bruce Ames is going to bring that end to back to one buccaneer place, fun fact, very Syrians was run by dad's roommate in college used to babysit round babysat. Rhonda her crazy games Iki seeking a lot of health problems when they were young. So the parents when take Tiki the Hans that all. Paul MBA incur Syrians keep run day. So that'll be a special thing. I think just especially when he gets inducted into other fun. Fact, Jon Gruden was inducted into the ring of honor. He was broadcasting the game at the time. He came down during halftime got inductive went back up into the booth and finish the game out. Rendezvous was going to do the same thing. He's broadcasting the game third his ring of honor ceremony. So he's going down to half time. And he's gonna go right back up and talk about how great it wants to be -ducted, which really need the help. Bruce Arians has such a connection to the barber's. Yeah. Best friends with Barbara's dad's roommates with him and all that good stuff in college. We also signed running back today was there yesterday. Maybe do I think they announced today kirwin Williams, and then we waved wide receiver Sergio Bailey dollars went back to his stick in. We're going to keep four we've got seven on the roster right now, it's gonna be interesting to see who stays on. No, Payton bars. Stay of course, barring Inge. Areas. Under LT is probably going to stay that into everything's grabs. You don't think it's going to stay? No. I mean, they're talking about him. Like, he's gonna stay why they're also talking about him. Like he's got a lot of work to do to get on this roster. And if they get somebody in there that they don't have to work as hard with got it said. Didn't drafting he's not there. Right. All right. That's gonna wrap it up for us. If you want to get in touch with us and Ralph angry Email, tell me how did you love me? He can reach me. And Molly Bay Buccaneers observed dot com. Ralph director now females to him Ralph, Boca nears, observer dot com. We're on Twitter at bucks underscore observer. And you can check out our website Buchan ears observer dot com. We're gonna have more contact coming up on the website. So you might want to start making a habit of checking it out until next time backs.

Jerrell McCoy Gerald McCoy McCoy buccaneers NFL Bruce Arians JP Jerry McCoy JP Jeremy McCoy Ralph Phillips football Twitter Joe box Greg Xiang Jon Gruden Molly Jim McCoy JP Paul MBA Odera McCoy Tampa Bay
The Panthers signed Gerald McCoy

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48:49 min | 1 year ago

The Panthers signed Gerald McCoy

"You in. But we got some I got some food. I reading some Gogi tonight's good. I don't know what that is. That means we can't afford it Brian. It's not. No not expensive. It's like. Beef. That's cut like, really thin. And it seasoned. If you ever go to like mayo. If you. Dipper go to like on a Korean barbecue place. It's like the main is one of the main options that you'll have to whoever that wasn't annoy said bless you, by the way, Brian said bless you. Who's my wife? Can you hear that squeaking little bit came? I need to might need to put this week toys in the. Three. Cute. Hello, welcome to the keep sounding podcasts, this is your, the Panthers signed, Gerald McCoy hell. Yeah edition. This is Ryan to in by Brad, and John as always. Brad, how're you doing this fine evening? I am. Well, however you break. Just great John. How are you? I'm good. Good. Brian. I don't know if you guys heard about this. But I the buccaneers cut a really good defensive tackle and he was on the market and people were like, oh, the Panthers have interest and they actually signed a guy that they were having interested in publicly Gerald McCoy defensive tackle, high performer, and quite good pickup, in my opinion. I'll just go ahead. And let Brad point you to start. It's off. Give us your take. It's very smart business. It is. Jerrell MacAulay still has a lot left in the tank like I'm really surprised that Tampa Bay let him go. And I know it was mostly money because he was supposed to make like thirteen million this year, and they cut Gerald McCoy and then signed Dom consume, and somebody else, I don't remember who else they saw him, but they signed two players for essentially the same thirteen million. So they trade at two for one and you know, we're only paying him four million dollars guaranteed. And if he meets certain parameters in his contract, the deal is ten point two five million and Gerald McCoy is worth every penny of ten point two five million dollars. So I think that for the first time in, I can't remember when the Panthers made a move that not only made sense, but made them a much better team. I can tell you another move that happened like that. Not too long ago. That would be Eric. Decide. Yeah. Eric read. That's fair. Yep. So john. Gerald McCoy, we've been we've been talking about how the Panthers are going to be shifting to a hybrid defense. But bringing in McCoy to pair with Don Terry PO in K one short. I'm the seems to indicate they might be leaning more towards the three four this year. Yeah, I don't think it could be a hybrid at all. I think it's basically be three three man fronts. Story of the time, I guess it'll be a hybrid in, in the sense that, like, we don't always have the same front. Yeah. Yeah. It'll be a hybrid because sometimes we'll run a four man front. Yeah. It's going to be three four mostly. I mean we have what like one four three defensive end on the roster. Mario Addison, FAO badeah and Brian, there's. Cox doesn't even make the team in bought as a bigger like he's a pretty easy like plug and play two three four three or four. I think so. Well, there's also the possibility that he's not even going to be on the roster after we go to London. Rephrase. None of our good players. We have no good for three defensive ends of the Maya Addison. Yeah. And Morio Addison is kind of more suited to be a standup outside linebacker in a three man front anyway. Yes. So. Our defensive in. Yes. I think it's pretty pretty cut and dry, that it's going to be three man front, most of the time for you guys surprised that we got coy or like. Even after he came here to visit, yes, I was surprised it came out the day after we announced the signing that Cleveland only offered him like six million dollars. Wouldn't see that. Yeah, they offered him less money than we did. And so I knew he wasn't going to go to Cleveland because, you know, he he feels he's more valuable than that. And there was at least one team that offered him more money. But our parents Baltimore offered him more money than we did. And he really just thought that we were a better shot at contending, and he's probably right. I think Carolina has more pieces in place right now than Baltimore does. But and he has said several times that this isn't a factor. And there been people who've said this has nothing to do with it, but no one will ever convince me that he did not sign with us because he does that him getting to play against. Tampa Bay twice doesn't have anything to do with his decision because I find it coincidental that, about an hour after they announced that Dhamma consumer was getting his old number he announced that he was signing with us. I just find that too hard to believe as just a coincidence. So. I thought after like once it was like made known that he was visiting here I thought there was probably. Seventy five percent chance to signing him because if he liked if he really likes Cleveland and Baltimore had to offer he wouldn't have taken another visit like you assign there. I think that's fair. I mean, like especially Baltimore like he went to Cleveland, I if I remember correctly and then went to Baltimore. And if you really liked it like you said, he wouldn't have he would have never come to Charlotte. There were. Yes. I think he came, I figured he'd come here with the intention of like unless they offer me something insulting, which I don't think the Panthers would ever do I would like to play because also you know, he's it's more his area, more his part of the country and stuff like that makes the most sense that he would sign here. I would have been more surprised were it not for Torrey Smith. Suddenly freeing up two million dollars apps face not now. So a true hero, a true hero. I'm not I'm not naming right now. So. You know, I had heard like the Panthers were interested in them or whatever in like they've done that before they've, they've called, for example, they called, Eric Weddell. In the in the offseason, like there's been times they've been remorse. They reportedly been interested in some guy, only for it to not even come close for wish but, you know, we say interested in everyone but wet way to keep yourself in the fans. Good graces is just to say we tried to sign all the good players, just sometimes they didn't come here. But when they when they freed up that cap space with Torrey Smith like right before the June first deadline, I was like they might be serious about this. Like when I because I tweeted it like days before I think they're actually going to make a serious run at Gerald McCoy insurance. They did. I'll tell you the real hero is though, Brian, you said Torrey Smith is the real hero. He's not the real heroes short and trae tournament because they went to a vegan restaurant to convince journal McCoy to come here. Yes, they did, and they're not even vegans honor their sacrifice to trae Turner was trying to recruit him back in January hundred if you saw that on Twitter. I did see that. Yeah. While he was on another team. Yup. Good. As far as the fit goes. Yeah. Like you said, John seems like they're they've pretty much all but telegraphed, like a full on move to the three four and that doesn't necessarily mean that it's you're just gonna see them stubbornly, do three down linemen two Outside Linebackers in two inside linebackers every snap. But they've pretty much done everything they can to be a lot more versatile what their defensive line. And it's kind of refreshing just because he'll Bella do it for so long. And Ron Rivera is, you know, a defensive coach so bringing in jail McCoy is the piece they kind of needed. That's kind of why they were I feel like they were interested in Alan Bailey was to find somebody where they can comfortably fit three defensive lineman on the field and just kind of sent people all over the place at the quarterback. So definitely a great signing. I. Yeah. Yeah. The only question I have is why was it only a one year deal? Like why didn't they sign him to a two year deal? That's probably a jail McCoy thing. It could have been a journal McCoy thing. He wants to reset as value on the market, but I thought that was strange. But you also have to think about the fact that he wasn't out there with all the other defensive lineman getting draft getting deals either. So it wasn't like he had the competitive situation on the market to like get those high hard facts because other people were out there. He was the best consensus defensive lineman. Still out there four or the Panthers did that because they can let them walk in this next year and get a confict. Yes, that's true. That's, that's the most important thing to consider. Because he's also thirty one years old, and he could possibly be looking at he only has one year left in the tank. That's true. 'cause he he's, you know, he's right at three hundred pounds and he's been playing NFL football for decade. That's a lot of mileage, Andy played damn near every snap for the bug. Yeah. He played on ninety eight percent of snaps for, for ten really. So. Yeah he was on the field saying what? When he was under course, but yeah. Yeah. That's still, let's doesn't seem like good personnel management in my Tampa Bay Binion. But. Yeah. Sounds like him. I don't I well before we get sued into oblivion by somebody who actually cares and wants to well, actually this podcast. I'm not one hundred percent. Sure how often he played, but I know he did play a lot. Hashtag along this giant find it. I was trying to find it but it's, it's he's still been twenty worker. He's still been pretty consistent, too. I think he's had like what six sacks year at least for the last four years, something like that. He's had in the last four years starting with two hundred eighteen in going backwards. Six seven eight and a half. Yep. Gotta at least five sacks every year since two thousand twelve. Yeah. Now he's gone. The already didn't have five. Was his rookie. And then he only played six games guessing. Yeah. Now, he's going to get put on an actual defense, and he's a defensive tackle too, so that even even better, he he's very consistent pass rush threat of the middle. My, my friend was asking me because he didn't know a lot about defensive players like what if Joe McCoy was good. And we basically have like two Cohen shorts on the front line. Now at the same time. Yes. Which is. I mean they're arguably. Now we're arguably the best defensive front, second best defensive front in the NFC. I think the Rams are probably still better. But you know there's an argument to be made that we have the second. It's easily a top five defensive front in the NFC. Agreed. I mean like now NFL. NFC. You the NFL. I mean, the ravens have a really good front seven. We with I don't think I could I don't know if I could say, obviously not top two, but there's, there's an argument that they could at least be top five or six in the entire NFL. Yeah. I guess we don't have a very proven in. But like that front three is very, very good. Yeah. And on top of that. Like it free. It actually is like the best thing they could do when they're moving into a three four defense with out really a whole lot of actual three four Outside Linebackers. I mean like Bruce Irvine's on the tail end of his career. Brian burns is just now starting out. He's undersized. Mario Addison's by four three defensive end is entire career. So like adding those three guys who are just gonna take up a lot of space. As my old high school football coach would say, they're just going to be fat. It's going to make it easier foods Outside Linebackers to rush the passer, and they'll get wider splits to, like, Mario Addison. And Brian burns rushing from the outside with, like high outside leverage, one on one against it offensive tackle where the docking be bumping into the guard if they, it's been inside who. Give who's really going to benefit from this. Leuke cly. Oh, yeah. So at least probably going to get five hundred tackles this year. It'd be like when a his early career when he was averaging like one hundred seventy tackles this season. Yes. Yeah. Back when they had starla to lay who was just eating up space in the middle. Now they got three space eaters. Few of which are, you know, multi all pros. And Dante Russia meddler. Yeah. Can be a hell of a front to fight. We might not even need a free safety. Yeah. Not matter. That much. I actually was just about to mention that. So funny, you ask funny. You mentioned that. Yeah. So a lot of Panthers fans were kind of bummed at the Panthers didn't go after a free safety yet. I say yet with an asterisk. Just because they had they freed up a lot of cap space using it on another defensive lineman. But honestly, I mean you look at that twenty thirteen defense, and they had Melvin white Drayton Florence, captain Monir Lynn at their corners. Mike Mitchell Quinton, Michael like this secondary, even before they signed. Yes, I agree. Even before they signed Gerald McCoy was like way this secondary top to bottom is like way better than that. Twenty thirteen secondary. So all they did was kinda add more pieces to make that easier on them. I mean the only weakness in the secondary is free safety position. I mean, the, the corners are fine, bradberry Jackson or fine. You know that nickel corner might be an issue with cockerel seem more competing and corn elder competing for for minutes. But Eric raided, a good strong safety is just, you know, I don't know if I trust Rashawn golden or Colin Jones to play free safety, but, but with the other ten guys that we have on the field. It's not gonna be as much of a disastrous people think it's going to be. No. I mean and one of the nobody has. Nobody has a strength at every position. I mean, I understand the frustration in the, the pay has seemed to be completely ignoring the position because it seems to be like the only position we don't have even like training camp that, but it's not the end of the world if we have one position, that's like as a question Mark, like if that's all we have is one compliant them. All right. Yeah. And plus, like especially if it's a safety. At nickel corner. You have your you have an emergency backup plan of Dante Jackson, kicking inside and Ross cockerel playing outside. I mean Dante Jackson did do that. In college Ross Cockrell has been a pretty good outside zone corner, his entire career in the NFL so that part's not really an issue, even if they don't find a true nickel, Horner full-time like it's not like Dante Jackson sucks at it. If the no and worst case scenario, weakened put corn elder on, like, the, the five yard line. So he doesn't have to turn around and he just run forward. You know, as a free safety Williams, gerbil peppers thing. Yeah. Whenever angel. Whatever you do corn. Don't flip your hips. Just stay just stay back. You're running a straight line. You don't have to turn around because I don't think he's still I, I think he still hasn't turned around. But, you know it's not going to be the end of the world. And hey, you know, we, we, we not only signed euro McCoy, no already wasn't done. We also signed the corner. Hey, I'm Spencer home. I'm Holly Anderson. I'm Ryan nanny. I'm Jason Kirk. And we're the host of the shutdown full cast your avengers of college football podcast. It says in the script onto riff on what that means and basically, what I mean is a all spoiled every Tuesday. We talk about everything from cooking. Disasters to pro wrestling, too unfashionable those pants worn middle school. We also do talk about college football every now and then, like mascot fights announcers, fleeing the booth early and unfashionable pants that coaches where now if you want to college football, exactly as seriously as it should be taken subscribe for free on apple podcasts or in your favorite podcast app. Hi, I'm every woman, and I'm hosting curbs new podcast. Nice, try it stories about how people have tried to design a better world. And what happens when those designs don't go according to plan season. One is called utopian. And it's about the perpetual search for the perfect place. It includes cannibalism fascist architecture. Poly-amorous hermetically, sealed domes and Courtney Kardashians dining room chairs, but not necessarily in that order, new episodes of nice, try come out every Thursday. Subscribe for free on apple podcasts or in your favorite podcast app. JV and Elliott, we are taking all of Tampa Bay's cast-offs I thought it was Vernon Harbury, call call jail McLean. Garry McCoy cast off like that. I mean, they they cut him technically. Yes. Just lump him in there with a guy. I already forgot his name. I wrote I wrote the story on signing him and I had to look up his name. That's how forgivable this guy is j Elliott one year deal. No, no idea, how much money it is. But it's probably a million dollars or something like that. Because that's the most important part is how much David Tepper is gonna pay him. Yes. That is. Absolutely. Correct fun fact to he was PF Fs highest graded Tampa Bay defensive back last season with a sixty three point eight percent rating. And that just so you know, guys that is hashtag, not good. Tampa secondary was a disaster, but he was the best of the bunch. In the number of great aside. Sa- fact that their best defensive back. We keep forgetting his name, even though we just talked about him shows really, how bad their secondary was like. Yeah. Can't name a single person on there, other than the recent traffic just because he a reason traffic. Correct. Burn heartless. I do you have that poll finds David to safety, right? Like he's. Feel like he's he's, he's not a safety. While she is a safe. He's better than. Leuke. Kley. Oh. That's with some people say that, that is what some people say. Most them usually are wearing bucks hats. But yeah. Yes, but they say people say. So I don't know what Brad's doing, but I'm looking I was looking for PF grades for our secondary to see who read. Dirk Reed JV in Elliott compares to as I was gonna say, Eric Reed was our highest graded player last season. And that was, you know, coming in midseason lowest graded patriotism, though. True. I forgot about zero patriotism. In the secondary to its knees. Okay. Donte Jackson was sixty seven point two James Bradbury was sixty four point nine and Molin was sixty point three and Mike Adams was forty five point three h. Wow. Well to be fair. I don't take PF as the be all end all because I really felt like bradberry actually had a good year. Yeah. I don't either. I'm just giving you a frame of reference to how. How you can compare what's his name again. JV and Elliott. Our, our guys like he, he was Tampa's, best corner that doesn't mean much, but he kinda compares to our, you know, according to PF, anyway bureau. Bureau, therapists, corner, which are third-best corner, which is that's fine. I say if you if you're signing your third best player in any position in June. You're you did a good thing. Yeah. I would agree with that. I guess. The downside to this though. And with every move, because there's a roster limit in the NFL. The Panthers were already at ninety players when they signed McCoy and. JVM Elliott that they had to get rid of two players to make room on the roster. And that means we unfortunately have to say goodbye to future hall of Famer wide receiver training camp. MVP. Most Frazier, Notre most Frazier, aka Steve Smith, aka Mussa Muhammad aka Jerry Rice, you work Bruce for a little bit. He worked Bruce and, you know, it's honestly, it's unfortunate because Fraser broke his arm during OTA's, and he would not have been released if that didn't happen. They would have cut somebody else, they would have, you know, cut one of the. Thirty seven tight ends or whatever. But I feel bad for most because I think he had a decent shot at making the, the fifty three because the coaching staff likes him. And you know he he he's not bad, but he broke his arm. So he wasn't going to get to participate anyway. So they scratched him. And there's always a chance out. He comes back when he's healthy. There is always that chance. I think he is the New Britain Burson like we're just gonna see him come back. Well well in spirit as in Brian calmed, down, as in, like he's just gonna he's gonna keep coming back. Not that he's genuinely the best receiver that doesn't get a chance. The panthers. Let somebody else, go to. Right. They did they lit Brendan man. Go the offense of linemen that was gonna save the day like the training camp MVP offensive, linemen, Brendon, man. That was, honestly a little bit surprised. It was still I was legitimately surprised and I do have a legitimate take on that. I am surprised that they let him go instead of Taylor Hearn got knocked out in a bar. Fight a couple of months ago and is surprisingly still on the team, you know, and if we're just gonna cut a UDF a guard, why not cut the guy who can't even hold his own in a bar fight against a guy half his size, who was also intoxicated. But you know what do I know? Wasn't a at Burnden man actually actually played last year. The last year. And Brennan man actually play somewhat decently. Well, given the circumstances, and I know it's not a high bar, but he was actually better than Amini Sola Tolo. And if you're better than Amini stilleto, Lou than you're at least decent enough to be on the fifty three man roster. And I just and at the very minimum the ninety man roster. So it was kind of strange that they they cut him unless he's hurt. And we just don't know about it because he did not only better than. Now is he better than me? And you see all the he's far enough better than a seal tiller that the coaching staff kept him over Macy. Let's do 'cause being better does not enough because he's played ahead of much more competent players. Maybe it's a deal where they, they know they like him and they know they're going to bring him back. Like when training camp or minicamp starts, and they know that nobody will pick him up on waivers are I you know, I don't know. But it was just odd that they, they cut him. We also have Kofi Michio brand in green Dorian Johnson kit. O'brien. That's it as guards on the roster that I didn't even know who half those people were that we kept instead of Brennan man, didn't they still keep Kyle Alan Taylor and Taylor heineke as well? Like I feel like. They keep for quarterbacks during training camp. That's right. Yeah. The camp can't throw they, they definitely are not true. He's been throwing. That's. Yeah, exactly. See, you're, you're putting people into a panic. Just like why didn't we cut? You know Marcus ball. Or Jonathan Celestin or Brandon chub or. Elijah. Holyfield Elisha Holyfield. Reggie Bonna fund. You can't cut him though. No. You can't cut Rajabali and he's gonna make the team he's going to be the next mar. Mex Marcus Allen or whatever, Marshall Faulk that's him. Yep. Yep. From a quarterback slash halfback slash wide receiver right there. Can't look at town, Cordell slashed, or I wonder what it's like, just as an aside, to be someone Reggie benefit or like Deandra white guys like that. Who have they who you know, they know they had, like a one percent, chance of actually, making the team like wonder what that whole, you know, camp experiences like no, this is just a part time thing. Then I'm going to have to also the fall. They probably look at it. Like a like you said, a part time job, but there's also the aspect of maybe I can be better than the other. What is it forty guys that are going to get cut? And I can make the practice squad. Yeah. That's a great gig right there. You make money on the dollars a week to practice and you don't even have to play. Yup. But I think that would be my mindset anyway. If I'm if I'm like, Reggie ball enough, and I'm going to try my best to be better than. Elijah. Holyfield. Elijah hood. You know Cameron Artis Payne and see if I can make the practice squad. Like one two three like twelve wide receivers. So it's like. We feel eleven. Torrey smith. Damian Jean-Pierre knows that he's like he's not going to be a football player in September. Yeah. Andrea LeBron knows. He's not going to be on the team in September. That's why he's gotta make his presence felt news. Flex fridays? Yeah. That dude needs to switch to left tackle or tied in red duties joked. Six to two twenty five eighty he's a big guy. Like Aldridge Robinson like he's not gonna make the team. Might he's actually a veteran. So you know, you never know nail. You never done it, that scored like a his scoring percentage is like insane compared to catches these made in the NFL. You know what? That's right. I got him confused with somebody else. Yeah. He's actually like a legitimate NFL player. Yeah. I got him mixed up with where's this name, Matt? Rashad Ross show, the one that came from the af I got those two guys mixed up in my head. Yeah. Especially for a team like us, like the Panthers have a pretty much established wide receiver group. Yeah. I mean like more Curtis Samuel as much as John hates it, Tori Smith. Jerry's right. And probably Terry Godwin because we're not gonna cut a guy we just drafted through. Well, that's not true. But Chris HOGAN. So I just don't see any of these other guys making it like we might cut. Somebody like Chris HOGAN, because we don't own that much money like we might just cut him if somebody has a fantastic camp. But I, I think we already know who are six wide receivers are going to be. I mean. I mean, the same for good. I was going to say like you know, there's always that like one injury. That happens in training camp with the wide re dammit, Brian don't say that. But they have receivers to make up for it. I mean HOGAN Andre Robinson backup that around out that top six wide receivers real nicely. So see, I think that's the thing our Aldergrove insane. And Chris HOGAN, the same guy, basically. So one of them will make the team one of them won't they fill the same role. Right. Pulling on his collar. That that's not true. But okay. I just not true. Well, like Chris HOGAN, algebra Ahmanson, bring a lot of different skill sets the table like. Hogan wasn't really all that good last year. I feel like he's like the guy were he'd be most likely to be cut of those top six. But like Robinson's, more of like a game-breaker as far as well not even game-breaker but he scores the ball. He scores a lot. We're like Hogan's always been more like a. Move the chains type guy, I guess, so. I don't think that the same player at all. But. Yeah. I mean, like they're not, neither one of them is going to make a huge difference. Whether they're cut brought back or whatever, so I do agree. I feel like our fifty three man roster is pretty easy to predict this point it. Yeah. I mean like they really don't have a lot of things that are. That are up. I think it's up in the air. I think the I think the hardest thing to predict is going to be the running backs after Christian McCaffrey. Yeah. 'cause I mean, we've got Jordan scarlet Elijah, who had allies. You're Holyfield Reggie bonafide in Cameron Artis Payne like two of those guys are gonna make team. Alex Armagh factors that Alex technically a fullback though. So count. I mean I know they, they roster him as a running back and they'll keep four. So he's already on the team. But, you know, two of those scarlet hood, Holyfield bonafide in Artis Payne, two of those guys are going to make the team. And the rest of them aren't. And that's probably the most exciting. Battle. We're going to have in camp. Yeah. I mean the only other thing I would look at is the nickel corner spot because I know in free safety. Because I know Ron Rivera is going to fight tooth and nail to like see what competition they can make out of the nickel corner position before relegating it to Dante Jackson going to the nickel. So. But yeah, I agree. I mean, like there's not a whole lot of stuff that's up in the air. And it is kind of nice me like we, we all suffered through the years. Whereas like Jericho Khatri, Philly Brown. Ted Ginn where you're like top three wide receivers and everybody else behind that. It's like a game your bird. I guess even have six NFL players at this position that team to the Super Bowl, they did true. Maybe we should try to have a worse, which to try to have wide receiver core. Maybe that's the problem. Yeah. They need to get rid of Curtis. Samuel enda. Gary, right. I think. Yes. Yeah. Hey guys, did you remember that? We signed Joel McCoy. Yeah. We did. We did. We also signed what's his name JV and Elliott. It's gonna be it's going to be really fun to watch jealously having Joe McCoy co onshore. I feel like it's going to be one of those things where it's just gonna. I don't know. It's going to be so refreshing to watch the defensive front that makes the quarterback move and stuff like I almost want Cam to just throw interceptions. So we can watch the defense play. I, I believe okay? What I will say is I think that k- want shorten at this stage is career and Gerald McCoy at his stage at this stage in his career on their own with their respective teams. Would not have been as exciting. But you're putting them both on the same team. Plus, Don, Terry PO where it's like you can only really double team, one guy on tap, like so that's going to be really cool because how do you act? Fun fact, we think Gerald McCoy is old. He's only one year older than K one short. Yeah. Cuanto. It was super old as rookie. Yeah. He's, he's thirty. Josh Norman like twenty three year old rookie. Yeah. Kelvin Benjamin thing. So I'm guessing Joe. Mccoy's gonna probably be ninety six. This is the only the number ninety nineties, a number in the nineties left other than he's either going to be ninety six or he'll by number ninety three from Kyle love. Which would be the best move. The Kyle love could make honestly. He may not make the roster. Yeah. Might as well, make them an extra ten grand, it would probably better on McCoy, and then Kyle can get one of those ugly numbers in the sixties or seventies, we'll Kalo can just have ninety six or that. Yeah. Yeah. What numbers are left. Seventy eight because I think we should we should pick a new number for kala based on how it would look on his belly eighty nine. I was gonna say, I was gonna say, seventy seven but which is taken by two players that will make the team right now. But. You don't know that. Sixty three and O'Brien. Sixty three is available. Seventy eight. Okay if Woodrow Hamilton and kid O'Brien are both number seventy seven and there's no seventy eight. Why is why do we have kit? O'brien. Cope, wearing number seventy really wanted. Seventies that doesn't make any sense. We also have to seventy sixes. And to seventy five. We've doubled numbers at everything in the seventies in the no. That's weird. I guess channel numbers then retired I think player, I want him to have a double number like sixty six or seventy seven. I think those that would be the best for, for the Bill Dillon Gordon's probably not gonna make the team. So I think he could have sixty six. We know that going on the team. I mean other than ninety six because he's not going to get ninety because that's going to get retired. But, you know, I think either giving them ninety six or giving them like Jon said a double number like seventy seven do the best thing to do. Yeah. Greed. White quite the insightful analysis of the roster. Numbers there guys. Great job. Support. It's very important. The most one of the most important thing you can have good players wearing stupid numbers now that is that is true. That is one hundred percent. True. I agree. I. You gotta actually war seventy seven for the Panthers in two thousand sixteen. There you go winner winner. So that back. He also wore sixty one for the Panthers. So we can't do seventy seven. He needs to just have all the different numbers. He's worn seventy four ninety nine ninety four sixty one ninety three in seventy seven. So he needs to wear seventy eight just to have a different number. With me. Wanna play the what other player would be like to have from the bucks. Game to close us out. I think that's a good idea. I don't even know who else is on the buccaneers. I'm going to let Brad start so. Brad of all the players, left them the buccaneers who would you like for the Panthers to pick up next. And let me look. Madman rain because I'm not that familiar with what Bruce Arians has done like who is cut who he's kept. And I'm assuming we're not gonna take their draft class. Probably not the buccaneers. You never know. Yeah, that's true. Okay as tempting as it would be. I'm going to avoid taking somebody like Peyton barber because they'd never see the field. Let's see. Oh, this is easiest thing ever lavar anti David. That would be a fun. Is a very good football player. So he's probably the best player on their team by far. Yep. It's funny, I pulled up there. Madden ratings in the fourth best player on their team is Gerald McCoy. So we, we did pretty good. If I had to pick someone not to pick on someone other than who Brad did OJ Howard. Really? Oh, Jay Howard. That would be a solid tight end core. I mean he's Greg Olsen ran very long how it's really really young. Now if you want to factor youth into it, I would take Vida avai. With. Wan short, Dante repo and Gerald McCoy. Yeah. To that. Yeah, yeah. It's amazing. What happens when like? Oh your players. So, well, I'm gonna just say the easy. What here Mike Evans, why the hell not? Easy wide receiver one gives a Curtis Samuel end DJ more some relief on playing against number one wide receivers probably just hair. Samuela DJ, more would be wide open across the middle on like literally every down. Yeah. I mean like Mike Evans draws the number one corner against every team, fun fact. The James bradberry does really well against him. So could he wouldn't be playing against James, bradberry anymore? Yeah. That would be my pick. So. Buccaneers still have a lot of players. I guess. Oh, the moral of the story. Let's go with the layups basically are there any. I mean playing Gabbard some the team. He's decent right? That'd be fun. Justin Evans is a safety. Let's look at safeties. Maybe we can still their free safety. See I don't think it would be worth it. Probably not. But all they have to do is be better than Colin Jones. And Rashawn golden Dion Buchanan is a pretty good player. I forgot I signed him he's but he's more like Shaq Thompson, though. He's like a linebacker more than a safety. Yeah. I'd be on board with Chris Godwin. He showed pretty well, after the Sean Jackson kind of fell off as a good. They have a lot of players listed it safety. They do. I know it's just painful, Justin Evans might not that he had sat on. Yeah, if I was going to take one of their safety's our take Justin Evans. There's all running backs or pretty good, but we don't have any use for a running back because we have Christian McCaffrey. Right. Right. Ronald Jones and Peyton Barbara both good. But they'd never see the field for us. I mean, we could go for Don King sue that'd be that would be really cool. And. Oh, we just traded for indaba CSU. Here's ninety three. I really piss off somebody. Moral. The story is the Panthers have a better roster than the buccaneers. Yeah. Yeah. Noah, Spence, we could take Noah Spence. What him? Andre Ellington, what used to be someone that people were hyped about for a little bit. I think the answers are lavar David Mike Evans are probably the top two. Yes, we already stole one of their best players already. Yeah. It's a shame. It's a real shame that, that happy. Four could you imagine a three four defense with Luke Keithly and lamantia, David as the inside linebackers? Oh, god. That would be a terrifying. I mean you could you could literally just put Shaq Thompson at strong safety and put Eric Reed free safety because it wouldn't matter like, you know. It literally would not matter who is at safety at that point. How does enjoy that? Like every single play would end up with both of them. Tackling the ball carrier at the same time. Yeah, I have one hundred fifty tackles because they both tackled at the same time they only have like fifteen solo tackles all season. Because it's all just combined tackles all this. It's the one play that the other one took off because you know they have to they have to take a playoff every once in a while. The most combined tackles by a linebacker duo were only they only averaged fifteen solo tackles the whole season. But say both finished with two hundred fifteen total tackles. Yeah. Yeah. Oh man. That was a fun, exercise damn bucks fan though. Like jesus. Well, the thing is we can make fun of them now. But I really think in five years, they're going to be good again. Because Bruce Arians knows what he's doing if he last that long. But yeah, I think last that long. Yeah, that's the key. Because, you know, they've the last couple of years they've been victim to they have coaches who don't know what they're doing, and they don't have that problem anymore. Theoretically, and it's life is a cycle. So the saints are getting ready to be on the downturn because drew Brees is getting old, and Sean Payton, there's probably gonna get an offer from Jerry Jones to go to Dallas. So they're going to be without the genius behind the the machine. And I think Tampa is going to start competing for division titles again. It's going to be like it was in the early two thousands when they had John Gruden. Maybe. We'll see Tampa Bay. So it's entirely possible that Bruce area and says, you know, fuck this I'm out and quits halfway through the year. That would be really funny. So. Yeah, Johnny lasting thought okay? John wall. Steet is Koreans the Gogi. So hungry. Brad, any lasting thoughts about anything we discuss? Go ahead. Yeah. I think I'm gonna wax poetic for the next twenty minutes on something completely meaningless. No, I don't have anything else I had. Had. Yeah. Me neither. I think we're, I think we're all we're all good here. It's the slow season. So we gave enough. That good analysis here. So I guess. Yeah. From all of us here at the keep sounding podcasts and John really wants to go eat, because he's not dedicated like me. And Brad are so from all of us here at the keep sounding podcasts Brian joined by Brad and John. And we will talk to you about framing Kampen all the off season stuff, and all those late risers getting cut in training camp that you'll be disappointed about. You guys have a great week. Keeps the football. So for the touchdown. Yes, the Dale tell the. Oh. Took it in. Thanks for the. Jonathan Stewart that he's in for a touchdown. That's interesting. No. Gets a road win in New England.

Panthers Gerald McCoy Brian burns NFL football Brad Tampa Bay buccaneers Joe McCoy John Torrey Smith Tampa j Elliott Mario Addison Curtis Samuel Garry McCoy Eric
The Ocho: Gerald McCoy is out for the season

Blogging the Boys

19:03 min | 2 months ago

The Ocho: Gerald McCoy is out for the season

"American What a world welcome to another episode of the Ocho presented you in partnership as always spn nations blogging the boys dot. com. Arduous Choi of course from. Mightier as humble host on the Ocho it is. Tuesday August Eighteenth Two thousand and twenty. Hope all is well wherever you are. We hope you're happy safe healthy and that you are enjoying basketball games being on all of the time I'm not the I. I'm not the five thousand person to say that if he a lot like March madness, which is a very strange thing to feel in the middle of August but alas, here we are. Really, arming item of discussion for today. Remember that we do give you two episodes every single day here on the blog on the voice podcast feed you get this show every morning depending on when you listen, of course, for your latest headlines, kind of latest news going on in the world of the cowboys, and then later on in the day you get meteor show a little bit more. In depth analysis on different things later on today, you will have a brand new episode of the seven, five zero with myself and two time superbowl champion Tony Casillas and Tony, and I will obviously talk about this because he is an Oklahoma sooner a college hall of Fame Oklahoma Sooner Mind you and a very prominent sooner signed with the Dallas cowboys this off season in jail McCoy and on Monday unfortunately devastating news. Joe McCoy lost for the season for the Dallas cowboys a ruptured right quad tendon in Monday's practice and Monday's practice marked the first padded practice of the season for the Dallas Cowboys, which is always a mantis occasion. Anytime you put the pads on for the first time. Super. Shave. juicer flow in excitements in the air, and that seemed like it was the case. And unfortunately, Joe. McCoy was casualty of that and. You. Look at it. You know we we've talked so much about how the cowboys had. One of the best. If not the best draft class across the entire NFL season we all know that we all agree with that. We've discussed it at great length. while. Some teams in other years have had maybe flashier sexier free agent. Classes if you WANNA call their. The Dallas. Cowboys had a really productive or really efficient free agent class which kind of meshes with everything we've seen from Mike. McCarthy to this point now that we've gotten to learn more about him as the Dallas Cowboys head coach a lot of people excited about a lot of different free agents. Take one pick one I mean ha ha Clinton Dix has a lot of people excited. Don Poe has a lot of people excited and obviously as of late Everson Griffen has a lot people excited but Gerald McCoy, kind of was the headliner for that group in factual. McCoy was the first free agent at the Dallas Cowboys signed in the Mike McCarthy era outside free agent that is, and unfortunately he will not be playing for them. This season Steven Jones spoke with the media later on Monday and he was asked if. This is something that maybe Joe McCoy's candidate for. Return from injured reserve and he said that he really didn't think that was the case at this is a season ending now joe McCoy did sign a three year deal with the Dallas cowboys when he joined the team this off season and this? Really. was just an accident. I mean, you look Joe McCoy tweeted this out. Here are how many games he has played every season since entering the NFL two, thousand, ten, thirteen, two, thousand eleven. The obvious outlier here played six games since then is from two thousand twelve through two thousand nineteen. Sixteen Games Sixteen Games Thirteen Games fifteen games, fifteen games, fifteen games, fourteen games, and last season he played all sixteen games for the Carolina Panthers his lone season away from the Tampa Bay buccaneers. So a relatively relatively honestly not even stronger and afford generally always healthy player. Gerald McCoy that's why this is so unfortunate and while we all were very excited about who joe McCoy was going to be as a player for the Dallas Cowboys, I think we all were equally excited to see who he was going to be as a leader. Joe McCoy I know I've made this connection and he was on I think with Martin Smith at this point it's been some time but I think it was Marty Smith or me SPN. He was on a podcast a few months ago and he talked about how he met. Michael McCoy McCoy. And Mike McCarthy? Chat to mark McCoy though. Mike McCarthy at the Pro Bowl Michael McCarthy did mention by the way. Just. The last question that Mike McCarthy was asked in Monday's press conference before he left before, he would go to the practice for Macleod injured was actually about Jerem. McCoy and Mike McCarthy said that they'd met at too many pro bowls obviously noting that when you're at the pro bowl, you're not in the Super Bowl and so back on Marty Smith's podcast that point Joe McCoy talked about how He kinda talked about that kind of made references to Charles. Woodson and that was what I saw. I thought Joe McCoy was kind of what are could have been too micro Dallas cowboys what Charles Woodson was to Mike. McCarthy's Green Bay packers kind of this better in awesome player who had been there done that on a team that hadn't gotten it done with the raiders and then ultimately served as an important piece of the Green Bay. Packers. Won The super bowl in two thousand ten in fact on cow brands podcast recently, Aaron Rodgers named Charles Woodson is one of the greatest players replayed with and so I thought that was the kind of impact the Joe McCoy could have. And I do think it's worth noting that he could still have a leadership impact I. Mean I think a great example. The great recent example is the way Travis Frederick was around the cowboys two years ago obviously didn't play a snap for them. But. But still around still leader was still a teacher was still an instructor Joe McCoy did release a statement ESPN's Edward of the first with this We wrote about this for you blog on the boys dot com if you want to read it for yourself, but here is his statement. Just want the fans to know I truly appreciate the warm welcome and I'm sorry this happened the Jones family opened their doors to an old vet to have an opportunity to come and help his team win and I was beyond excited to be a cowboy. I was really looking forward to this amazing opportunity we have in front of us. Remain the mentor I. Am the young guys and do my part to make sure that this team goes were needs to as far as my mindset people deal with real life palms everybody day especially now with the state of our country, there's a lot of pain and heartache taking place right now that all of our attention needs to go towards whether it is the pandemic our fight for social justice in retrospect what I'm dealing with is minimal compared to that. Therefore, this is light work for me anybody who knows me knows I love challenge challenge accepted I will be back better. Let's get it obviously Joe McCoy has spoken his mind on all sorts of different matters in different ideas hovering around our world and around our country. So it is really nice really great to hear from him that he plans on mentoring the younger cowboys players. And there are a few. There are definitely a handful of defensive tackles defensive Lineman on the cowboys that are going to need that point of veteran leadership. And that kind of. To the point of WHO's going to replace Joe McCoy and you think about it you know our friend, Dave, Hellman made this point on twitter on Monday while you never want to see any player go down with injury it is unfortunate is not agree it is terrible in just about every single way. The cowboys are kind of prepared for this defensive tackle and maybe they're not prepared in a way that has you feeling swell or has you not losing any sleep at night but? You think about the options to Catholics they obviously have John Terry Poem McCoy's Team Carolina. Last year, they have tyrone. CRAWFORD IF THEY WANNA kick inside tyrone Crawford met with the media on Monday and noted that he is prepared to play anywhere across the defensive line. Some people have thrown. Alden. Smith. Is Clicking inside given his size. I don't know about that one necessarily. But then you talk about you know the young guys you've got second your Mantra Hill who I know a lot of people. Don't necessarily feel great about and a lot of people thought I was going to get cut when I tweeted. That Everson Griffen was going to have a hard time getting number ninety seven because I and hill war. There were so many people who said that he would get it as soon as tristen hell was cut but that will not be the case but you've also got rookie third round Japanese Naval Gallimore, tyrone Crawford called him an animal when he spoke on Monday and so there is depth there are bodies. There are a lot of people. There are a lot of options and so while again, it is never an ideal thing and Joe McCoy's loss is a huge one for the Cowboys Defense Mike McCarthy. Has said many times. They've built their roster to be prepared for different things because it's a long season you know when he's talked about. The different variations of Defensive Lineman. He's talked about how the most important thing is having defensive line because it's a long season it's a long battle. It's a battle of attrition as many people say all the time and that battle has begun for the two thousand and Twenty Dallas Cowboys but support for this podcast comes from cdw and Dell Technologies. CDW, Gee. We get migrating your agency to a hyper converged infrastructure is challenging. Anyway WHOA slow down friend CDW, Jeez experts can help simplify your transition from legacy to hyper converged infrastructure with Dell technology solutions that offer speed and agility. Isn't it under it orchestration by CDW G people who get it find out more at cdw dot com slash deltec. Support of this podcast comes from state farm with surprisingly great rates. State farm is the real deal. It comes to home and car insurance state formations are always ready to help you personalize your insurance plan. You can create a policy that fits your needs. You can manage your coverage, pay your bill or even file a claim right from your phone with the state. Farm. Mobile APP. And you can always call one of the state farm agents in neighborhoods across the country. Get a great rate without sacrificing great service. When you want the real deal like a good neighbor state farm is there speaking of the defensive line speaking of things Mike McCarthy said this happened before the Joe McCoy injury on Monday and so there was a point of optimism surrounding this. There are many talks about the cowboys move into more three, four fronts she. Confirmed that when he met with the media on Sunday that has been anticipated I, think a lot of people have kind of. Started to imagine what Mike Nolan's three four Dallas cowboys defense could look like not that they'd three four entirely. But at least three, four in different moments in different perspectives. That would obviously me the demarcus Lawrence would pick his hand up off the ground and would stand up and be more of an outside linebacker and that is an interesting thing I know the back. A few months ago really a lot of months ago on. ESPN SAN ANTONIO. mcclay on the blitz and we asked him what he thought about demarcus Lawrence potentially playing outside linebacker and he said that he believes he's talented enough to do anything Mike McCarthy was asked about this specifically on Monday and he had an answer there really was exciting. We wrote about this as well. We read about everything blog was that com. So if you're looking once again for the latest and greatest coverage in the world of America's team aspirations home for Dallas cowboys content is the home for you but here's what Mike McCarthy had to say about Demarcus Lawrence picking his hand up on Monday I've had a chance to watch just a couple of guys in my. Career go through that transition and the one that I think of right off the bat is Julius peppers on your primarily playing at a four man front and really delays was in the same defense he played for rod there in. Chicago talking about Rodman obviously when you came up to Green Bay the opportunity to particularly play in a two point stance on first and second down especially some of the. Delays experience and his instinct and awareness at the line of scrimmage. It will give him more vision to the tendencies and the mannerisms of the offense I think think's going to really like but still at the end of the day, if it's best suited for him to put his hand on the ground and then a pass rush situation, then that's what we'll do. I know just watching Julius go through. It. He liked it. He enjoyed it because it gave them a chance to really tap into is years of experience playing with more vision and it was primarily more in the first and second down because we came down to the hit it and get in the pass rush he would go to a three point stance, but we'll work through that would delight and I think he'll really benefit from this. That is really exciting. That is really exciting and. I continue to say continue to believe that Mike McCarthy is very thoughtful. And it seems like he is taking a long time to put together this plan for the Dallas Cowboys and he's keeping it really kind of under wraps. I thought you know a really interesting answer the McCarthy gave on Monday he was asked about Ezekiel Elliott and Tony Pollard by the way. Zeke met with the media as well on Monday I say this all the time if if you want to watch or listen to any of the players and their media sessions, those are available on the Dallas Cowboys, social channels, you can go there Youtube Channel, Dallas Dot, com, you can watch and listen to the answers and the questions that are posing these players. So you can go check out with Zeke had to say, but he was asked. For his impressions, of Tony, Pollard obviously entering his second year, there is a wide ranging school of thought that Tony Pollard. Could be utilized to a great degree and so. Zeke Elliott noted that you know there will probably be more times they're both in on this field and While the idea of that. Does involve taking a wide receiver off the field which a lot of people feel is a cardinal sin. The reality is that Tony Politics very talented as well, and so if the cowboys are able to do things and I think it's very much worth mentioning that Mike McCarthy has said multiple times since becoming the Dallas Cowboys head coach that the coach and team who he really liked watching last year was Kyle Shanahan and the San Francisco Forty niners and what did cash Hindu a lot last year he used basically every running back in the bay area. If you've ever carried the ball in the bay area, Kashan Hand Fan awaited us you last year and we know that. That is something that Mike McCarthy is a fan of Mike. McCarthy has two running backs in Ezekiel Elliott in Tony Pa that can do a multitude of different things that can provide a variety of different looks of different anticipations and those are very good things I think when you combine that with Blake Darwin said recently referencing the Cowboy back position we talked about that and how we discussed it with Ben mcadoo, the position coach that play had Oklahoma state. You combine that with Blake Bell, the bell does dozer and everything. The cowboys have a number of guys who are athletic who have varied skill sets. Obviously, some of them are much better at some than others namely Zeke, Elliott? But there is flexibility there. We know that the cowboys love position flex. So when you marry that idea with creative offense of mine like Kellen more Mike McCarthy the results could be very interesting and so I think. I did a hit on ESPN San Antonio on Monday and I was asked if I was more excited for the cowboys offense and cowboys defense and I said this about the defense but I do feel about the offense it'd be clear I'm more excited about the offense in general because the stadium on it however I feel more hopeful about the cowboys defense and I have a long long long time and within that I feel very hopeful for the cowboys offense that it will be creative. These are training camp tropes. They're trying all sorts of things are doing weird stuff and packages and all sorts of stuff it is normally and generally a bunch of fluff but here in two thousand and twenty it. Does seem very real and that is a very exciting thing. We will have a brand new episode of the seven five available for you later on today myself in Tony Casillas oddly obviously touch on Joe McCoy and everything else going on in the world. The Dallas Cowboys, you can follow me on twitter instagram at Joe, Joe on both by the way. Dak Prescott Youtube video with dude perfect. Did did drop on Monday so you can go check that out for yourself as well. I did tweet that if you want to watch his particular clip hey, do me a favor have the absolute best Tuesday of all time you know why? Because you deserve it we will see them in the Anna friends is always What I'm actually going to. Cite the right there because I thought if something yeah that's right. The old rope a dope one last thing. Man Look at fourth quarter clutch. Point. We've talked about Mike McCarthy and how he has. Adjusted different things and wanted different things himself. And I WANNA give shot at the NFL network because it's on the back on and what reminded me in this moment we know that Mike McCarthy, has the cowboys quarterbacks wearing ledgers. We've talked about that a lot we also found out that Mike McCarthy. Has All of the cowboys players wearing their names, their last names on the back of their practice jerseys that is a new development interestingly enough I find this fascinating on a Monday we found out that the New York giants Are Not wearing names on the back of their practice jerseys. Now I realize I recognize I fully admit and you know obviously know that Jason Garrett is only the New York giants offensive coordinator, Joe Judges, the head coach there but I find it just awfully coincidental awfully interesting whatever you WANNA call it that in the first year without Jason Garrett The Dallas cowboys suddenly have their quarterback's wearing red practice jerseys and names on the back of all practice jerseys and that the Newark. Suddenly in their first year with Jason Gary involved in their franchise in any capacity. Remove the names from the back of the players jerseys reacting that is very interesting. Don't you think I mean it's it's not hard to connect those dots and again I'm not trying to intimate it. Jason Garrett has more of an influence. In New York Joe Judge Does and to be clear, Joe Judge a bill belichick disciple and I actually remember reading about this last year and I do think it's worthwhile and cool but it's only worth while and cool if you're the New England. Patriots because you're at the standard. They had all of their skill position players wearing their non normal Jersey numbers. So like Sony Michelle was not wearing his Jersey number and the purpose for that was so that you know Tom Brady or whoever any player could learn the body movements of players and not become reliant upon Jersey numbers I get that I I certainly understand and can accept that logic. It is fair. It is sound. It is true mostly if you. Are, the New England patriots but if you're the New York giants with Joe Judge with Jason Garrett with Freddie. Kitchens on your staff people are GonNa. Look at you and they're gonNa Kinda wonder what the heck is going on especially when the thing you're doing in taking names off the backs of the jerseys and they had names on them last year again, they took them up a wipe them off like the the magic marker like. Wipe off. They took them off when the Dallas Cowboys added them when Jason Garrett Left I. Just I have to wonder what what that means but I find it. It'd be fascinating. So yeah, that's that for real though. Let's sign off four. Do me a huge huge huge favor have the absolute best Tuesday of all time. Because you deserve, we assume Indiana, my friends is always go cowboys and out.

Dallas cowboys cowboys Mike McCarthy Joe McCoy Gerald McCoy Michael McCoy McCoy Mike mark McCoy Dallas Jason Garrett Tony Casillas Joe Everson Griffen NFL John Terry Poem McCoy tyrone Crawford Zeke Elliott McCarthy Oklahoma Marty Smith
BONUS: Hyde, Singletary, McCoy and More! (Fantasy Football Podcast)

Fantasy Football Today

19:15 min | 1 year ago

BONUS: Hyde, Singletary, McCoy and More! (Fantasy Football Podcast)

"This is fantasy football today from c._b._s. Sports your email us at fantasy football ed c._b._s. I dot com. Take time to dominate your fantasy. League of of chaney bona's. Yes saturday night at a mazer here and <hes> roster cut day so then ben ben you made the team congratulations relations motto cuts on the fifty three yeah for sure yes so ben is are you know esteemed teamed analyst out in washington state. Who's hopping on here. After taking the huskies football game is afternoon so we appreciate his time. He wrote a story about the bill's running back. Situation situation is up on the website c._b._s. Sports dot com slash fantasy but if you're drafting tonight if you're drafting tomorrow we wanted to get something out as soon as possible. Then who is the biggest winner <hes> from today's events was probably the single terry. I mean look sean. Mccoy getting obviously opens up a ton of opportunity but i would be a little bit <hes> hesitant to say yes huge upside. I think for me. His upside is very similar to what we saw from kerryon johnson last year he still has frank gore there. Who's going to take some early down rushing work still t._j. Yeldan there who's bene- pretty efficient pass scattered throughout his career has at least thirty catches in each of his four n._f._l. Seasons thus thus far <hes> pretty pretty good pass catching back. There's some potential single takes even more of that <unk> i would suspect as the bills maybe fall out of contention if it presuming they do they might surprise this year but <hes> if they're a little bit of contention they would give him some more run later in the season but especially starting off. That's kinda how i'm viewing it that he e._s. Guys on both sides taking a little bit of his rushing work in a little bit of his receiving work at it kind of limits as upset okay. I'll be a little more optimistic and just say that they released lucia mccoy and maybe they realized that the future is now so let's not have devon single -tary lose too many carries to frank or i. I do expect that to be the case at the start of the season bed. I agree with you there. I just wonder if there's an opportunity for single tear into really win. This job and i think that's what was happening with kerryon johnson. That's a good comparison. I think he was winning that job. I think he was starting to get that feature work and then he got hurt so i wonder if by mid season we do have a real true starting running back for the buffalo louisville's yeah and i i mean i think if we look at who's going where in twenty one thousand nine drafts in and where to take single terry two names jump out to me one. I wrote about article. One is on twitter. <hes> mao sanders is the name that i mentioned similar situation right. He's coming into what seems like a little bit of a committee and we're hoping that he can earn more works works now. Sanders is in a better offense behind a really good offensive line. I would take sanders over single terry. The other name is darius geiss similar situation. He's got adrian peterson probably taking some of the early down working chris thompson taking some of the pass catching work and probably worse offense than the bills <hes>. The washington might have the offense in the n._f._l. Although a team we're gonna talk about a little bit later. Eight or miami is is is contention with them so i would take probably take single tired a little bit ahead guys. Even though i think guys might be a little bit more talented <hes> <hes> but you know we really don't know with any of these guys guys obviously missed last year sanders single terry being rookies how good they are but that's kind of the group and that's where you wanna look to draft him i think can you believe the dolphins and the redskins once played in the super bowl okay so your biggest winner is devon single terry. I'm going to cheat my biggest winner. Today is to shawn watson great day for him. I know that's not really what we were thinking about with this podcast but he gets laremy tunsil and he gets kenny stills which could only help him so he's obviously a big winner. Carlos hyde is a big winner. Carlos has has a role now on a very very run heavy team whose lead running back as a guy's never had more than one hundred four carries and that's duke johnson so who's get to him in a second. Who's your biggest loser loser. I mean it's probably duke but <unk> mccoy but i wasn't really necessarily drafting mccoy. I think do johnson's whole situation obviously changed but i i hesitate a little bit to call him a loser because we figured they would bring being someone in and we knew they bring someone in <hes> and calls height is not the most talented players not been very efficient the last few years he somebody that i projected there in in an article. I wrote a about a week ago right after the lamar miller injury. It's interesting that houston didn't press and didn't go sign somebody right away like doug. Martin was available for instance <hes> <hes> and they also made a lot of trades where through a joke out on twitter that guy in your home league that always gets flees to never trade you can start calling him calm holland him o'brien because says he's the texans seemed to give police on every single trade today but for high they gave up a player. They're intending to cut anyway so the didn't actually shell allowed a whole lot for him. They waited a little bit patient. It doesn't seem like they were panicking. I'd still kind of like duke <unk> backfield in of all the scenarios that could have come. This may have been one of the better ones so maybe i'm maybe i'm misspeaking a little bit by calling him the no i mean we. We said that they were going to add had someone and we weren't the least bit surprised at that. Someone was carlos item. There was always a chance of that so this can't be a huge shock so i think he's a loser observe just because it would have been better if they added nobody right and they added somebody that had no pedigree carlos hyde actually did not play very well for the cleveland browns last year but in his i four games with cleveland <hes> he score double digit fantasy points in non p._r. In every game and he only had four catches his yards per carry was terrible scored five touchdowns in those four games so you're hoping that he gets the lamar miller workload which in three seasons was sick about sixteen carries per game sixteen point three carries per game aim for lamar miller and three seasons with houston. That's two hundred sixty one carries. I actually you're not hoping he gets that because if he gets that that limits duke johns upside but like i i had carlos hyde god and before the cuts last night i was trying to make some waiver claims and i was thinking about picking up some players. I don't remember who just looking at just looking you know who's available and i had had on my bench and a couple of weeks and i said i'm going to wait and don't cut him because let's see what happens here so what i said on facebook in our facebook group. I asked the question russian. Let's see how the fantasy football community is feeling about. These guys right now rank them in half duke johnson carlos hyde devon single terry leshan mccoy and frank gore most of the answers had johnson and single terry at the top and i think typically johnson but then some some people started saying do johnson played behind carlos hyde last year in cleveland and people think he will again this year. I don't know that that's going to happen. Maybe hide gets the first kerry but i think johnson should and i think he will get get more touches. But how would you rank duke hide single terry mccoy franko right now. No i was gonna say i mean that's sharp from the listeners. That's how i would rank the top johnson and then single tehri mccoy would be pretty far down although if you've lands with the chargers and melvin gordon who now the chargers have given melvin gordon the the ability me to seek out a trade and if he ends up getting traded a lot of things can happen. Maybe a mccoy resuscitate it a little bit his value by landing there but he would be lower for me frank gore. We're probably the absolute lowest on this group because he's still part of a committee. We know he's not going to be heavily involved in the past game and he's probably going to be phased out late new year. There's just no upside there. I mean as a non p p r early-season falen if you've drafted so terribly that you need in early season <unk> typically. We don't need fills early in the season so he's somebody that would be probably last for me but i i would put duke johns at the very top and the reason is yes. We've seen these two team these two players on the same team and we've seen high play ahead of him but this is a different team and it's important to look at how the team what the teams are actions. Tell us and the houston texans traded a fourth round. Pick that can turn into a third round pick and likely will now turn to a third round pick to get do johnson to get carlos side. They waited a week like i said after they had a massive need <hes> we're hoping to maybe get them for free. They ended up trading a player that they're gonna cut anyway so essentially they did get him for free. They're to me that that is a symbol of bringing in a guy yes a priority guy because they didn't just grabbed you <hes> doug martin when they could but they brought in a guy for depth they didn't panic they don't send a first round pick like they're sending for every other player in the league they just brought in a guy for death but do johnson they went out and they actively acquired even before the lamar miller trade to me. They have told us that they prioritize do johnson and i think especially because do johnson is going to to get more of the receiving work. The more high value touches in p._r. We have to still have to johnson ahead of carlos hyde even despite the fact that and it was just last year at the beginning beginning of the year in cleveland even despite the fact that was playing ahead of johnson on a different roster okay so let's do some rankings wanna talk about kenny stills going to the texans as that hurt will four what goes on with dolphins now is albert. Wilson main is albert wilson asleep prevent. I i mean i like yeah. I mean he's kind of watchlist guy for me is not drafting thing but if he's going to be playing a lot of snaps in week one in the slot yeah and especially with stills gone. There's gonna be more available targets now. They have a lot of receivers there but yeah i i will. Yes i mean could be devante parker if he's on the outside and you know ryan patrick kuby preston williams. You'll be pressing williams team. Grant was <hes> you know kind of a gadget player. That was pretty good last year as well. They'll probably use. It's like the worst offensive line. I do want to take a quick break when we come back. We'll wrap things up. We'll tell you when to draft these. These guys will be right back. What's up. Everybody will fix podcast here c._b._s. Sports is daily n._f._l. Podcast eb your inbox every morning and before you get in that car to go to the gym to go to work whatever it is. You're doing make sure hang out with us. We have a whole host of people lined up for the season jason lockenfora doc id four brady quinn bryant mcfadden as well as n._f._l. Super fringe ryan wilson sean mcgovern john breach join me every day wherever you get your podcast okay so let's let's look at a._d._p. And do johnson describing to recent a._d._p. On fantasy football calculator do johnson going sixtieth overall austin ecuador sixty first overall an echo could be really impacted big. I think i may want to avoid the chargers situation right now. In case mccoy ends up there and i. I don't want to have outdated information but you've got do johnson darius guys james white. I think i'm looking at non-ppp. Let me switch it over to half p._p._o. Real quick here. I'm sorry about that so all right. Well okay so tariq cohen. How would you compare three cohen with duke. Johnson devon's cemetery our two favourite running back from the guys. We've talked about not so far. It happy are yeah. I think i would probably still take i i think i would take duke duke over cohen. I mean what about terry that's closer. I think i would probably take coming over single or just based on the strength of the offense is kind of how museum as a tiebreaker and why would still do a single terry and i guess you know collins. Offense is just i gotta run of the mill. I i think the bills are not going to be a great offense but they're like. I mean the biggest thing. I think the biggest takeaway should take this pot is it's easy to just not <hes> mm respond to late news and just like i'm not gonna draft any of these guys but there's a lot of opportunity here and so you i it's almost like you have to take a stand somewhere. Uh i'm pro pro devon single terry big time i really so i think i'm gonna be a little anti on him because i think the bills kinda struggled offensively have seen frank engorge siphoned too many touches in the past <hes>. I'm big on him long term. I guess i agree with you that it's gonna. It's gonna take a little while. They're not just going to hand over the keys to him by the away their fifty three man rosters out today seven of ten offensive linemen from last year or seven of ten. This year are new so they their offense. It was awful last year. They did work to upgrade it. I don't think it's going to be great or anything but mitch morris being out of the concussion protocol. That's their best offensive lineman. He's there center. That's going to help and also oh. I think single terry will catch passes. I don't think it's just that. I don't think it just t._j. Alden comes in on third down gets all the catches because they were using single terry as a pass catcher in the preseason season so i had no limit single terry's catching pass catching upside much like kerryon johnson with fuel riddick there last year gary caught passes and was effective but speaking of upgraded upgraded offensive line's laremy tunsil right so i that's a dude. Johnson's situation got a you know. I call them the biggest loser earlier in this. I what i don't even i'm almost swing all the way back around and calling me huge win because adding that a huge left tackle there as well is pretty pretty positive for his situation as well if he can be <unk> delete back so he's the guy out of those three that i would prioritize person i we. Let's wrap up the running backs here so you're on twelve team league and you're drafting. What round are you looking looking at. Duke johnson devon single terry with shawn mccoy frank gore carlos hyde not in that order. Let's start with johnson and single terry which rounds or you're drafting adding them and and give me the running backs that they're going to be around in the rankings even though you already sort of did that with single terry yeah so johnson. I think tariq owns a good a good comparison. I would probably take him just above above to rico and probably in that. He's been getting up into the fifth round in some drafts. I'm hoping that this helps him. Slide a little bit in grab it in sixth ext but i would be comfortable taking him in the fifth <hes> single terry yeah like we we sat. I mean i think right where miles sanders serious going. He's right in that range. I think probably the mal sanders is going a little higher in about the sixth but <hes> guy cisco maybe in the eighth or ninth somewhere in that seventh eighth round range seems seems good for me with with devin single terry the other guys i. I'm not really interested in taking mccoy or gore. I i typically just won't take a lot of running back over thirty and an unsettled situations is in hyde. I could see the case for hide but again the stand i'm going to take the scenario is i'm gonna be taking the stand on do johnson side. He catches the past as he gets. The more valuable touches hide to upside is like alfred blue plus like in this houston. Texans offense in alfred blue used to be like usable at times but never good so he's. He's not a guy that i'm really interested in either yes so i think the format also matters for the texans guys because i would be interested in hide in non p._b._r. V._r. Just like a standard scoring league said hit four his first four games scored five rushing touchdowns but keep this in mind with the texans. Lamar miller just never scored touchdowns. He he just was not a touchdown guy. He didn't get a lot of carries inside the five yard line he had he led the team and carries inside the five yard line three straight seasons but he had eight five and five. That's really eighths. Okay five is really bad. He was tied with shawn watson for most carries inside the five yard line so it just hasn't been a staple of their offense and if you draft guy who needs touchdown to be effective carla side is going to if he doesn't score you're in trouble and this team didn't give a lot of rushing touchdowns three straight years now and and for yeah for johnson obviously like a non p._r. League i dunno if i'm not probably taking into round eight i i'm probably not getting him and n._p._r. Colleague it helps a lot. I could see him being around five but i'm just a little nervous about a guy who's never done it like we're hoping for duke johnson. He's never had more than one hundred four carries. He's he's only had one season with more than a thousand thousand thirteen hundred total yards. He's only had one season with more than three total touchdowns so it's a little bit in the a._c._c. In his last two years he averaged over eighteen carries. He averaged over eighteen carries per game in over one hundred twenty yards per game and that's just on the ground not touches touches per game but rush attempts per game ben. You know where i went to college right. Where's that the u. Man the you. I know that's it. I know i i know i was. I was tickets. I watched every game <hes>. That's what i was telling you on. The friday show used to get hurt all the time. He broke his leg once but he he he just always hobble off the field. He led the hobbling off the field. As i like joe now look i get it he did. He was great in college. Five star recruit big time recruit just kinda small. He's kind of these. He's not the biggest guy but <hes> all right. Let i gotta wrap that up. I gotta get outta here and go do the radio show on saturday night. I on fantasy football. If you're listening to this before that please he's call us up ten p._m. Eastern you can listen on sirius channel two. Oh six or you can listen on c._b._s. Sports radio on your local affiliate or on c._b._s. Sports radio dot com or at the the app whatever so wide receiver will fuller. I'm a big willfuller fan. I got him on a few leagues. I don't know maybe up to three of the seven seven drafted so far i love willfuller <hes> i think he's better than kenny stills but it does bother me kenny stills as their does this affect the andre hopkins zor willfuller or kikuchi at all. I mean i think it affects kick acuity the most because it it could mean fewer snaps for him. I'm i'm hesitant to say that it will will affect willful or too much. He's been so productive with shawn watson. I agree with you or your take earlier in the show that just shawn watson is a big winner today with the addition of laremy tunsil and the addition is still stills always has been ab- a productive receiver <hes> i think his skill set in will fuller definitely overlap a little bit end. It is a little bit concerning for fuller but i i'm with you. I really early life fuller. I'm still buying that fuller will be productive this year when healthy. I think it's more of insurance call. I'm not necessarily jumping on steals but he will be a watchlist guy. Hi is playing enough. He's definitely gonna be viable. In this offense. We know watson can support downfield receiving threats like fuller <hes> but yeah i think we might see a little less of cutie. We might see both stills fuller stretching the field and creating all sorts of space underneath for hopkins to work underneath. I mean they're going to be a lot more multidimensional now after adding still going to stretch the field. It's really big for watson. I totally agree with that cool and if you know if there's a bit of a mix track record of wide receiver receiver switching teams during the season right before season. Is it similar. I mean you don't have training camp to learning a new playbook. Obviously mark cooper was great. Last year but golden tate was was terrible devin funchess or <hes> not devin funchess kelvin. Benjamin was okay but yeah i mean overall. I don't like wide receiver switching teams teams so ben. Thank you for hopping on man. I appreciate it all listeners. Thanks so much being dedicated. Hope this helps you out. Get ready for your drafts on sunday or saturday night and we'll talk the fresh episode on monday.

kerryon johnson Johnson devon Carlos hyde mccoy football frank gore terry shawn watson kenny stills c._b._s lucia mccoy lamar miller terry leshan mccoy mal sanders terry mccoy franko twitter tariq cohen doug martin cleveland houston
The Ocho: Dallas Cowboys release Gerald McCoy

Blogging the Boys

18:30 min | 2 months ago

The Ocho: Dallas Cowboys release Gerald McCoy

"What would you do? If you found out your family had a dark secret legacy from Michigan and J.J, Abrams comes HBO's newest series, lovecraft country a John Wall, bending drama that blurs the line between science fiction and reality in one thousand nine hundred fifty s Jim Crow America starring Jonathan. Majors. Journey smell. Courtney B Vance and Michael Kenneth Williams lovecraft country Air Sundays at nine pm on HBO and streaming on HBO tax. None of America. What are The welcome. To another episode of the Ocho is entity partnership as always nations blogging the boys dot Com name Joe showing me, of course. And for mayor, as you're humble host onto the OCHO, it is a Wednesday August nineteenth two thousand twenty. Hope all is well wherever you are. We hope you're happy safe healthy and that if you never have you have sweet potato fries because I've seen a lot of those lately and goodness gracious I, got to the sweet potato fries game late and. Let's just say I'm glad to have arrived. It is our episode for Humpty. So happy, Hump Day to you. However, we are dropping this earlier going to drop this about. On, about probably about five o'clock maybe five thirty PM central time on Tuesday afternoon. because. We have some breaking news and. Breaking news certainly not as optimistic as the cowboy signing Everson Griffen however. It is breaking news nonetheless that cowboys on Tuesday afternoon, it was reported. That they have released defensive tackle Gerald McCoy and there's a lot to this store. There's a lot to understand and we're GONNA talk about here in detail. But if you are the type of person that. Likes to read. Dinh's wants to understand, etc. You can head on over to blog on the boys dot com. We've written an article for you and you can kind of check out all the details there for yourselves but. I think to begin we kind of have to start at the beginning and the beginning of this whole process specifically. Obviously, we know the Joe McCoy signed with the cowboys in free agency back in March. He was there first free agent signing he was literally the first free agent signing the Michael McCarthy era. Let's fast forward to Monday to Monday of this week, the cowboys held their first petted practice of the season on Monday the first petted practice in the Mike McCarthy era in before practices over it was reported by Ian Rapoport that Gem McCoy went down with a leg injury. Then there was a report that the cowboys feared that he had torn his ACL finally it was reported and then confirmed that Joe McCoy suffered a ruptured right quad tendon and would, in fact, will miss the two. Thousand Twenty NFL season Tony Casillas, and a fellow Oklahoma sooner defensive tackle for the Dallas Cowboys and I talked about this on Tuesdays episode of the 750 up. You do want to go back and listen to it. Remember to subscribe to the blog on the boys podcast get episodes every single day it is football season. We have all sorts of things to talk about as evidenced by the current moment but so okay. So Jeremy McCoy, we find out Monday afternoon has ruptured right quad tendon. He's going to miss the season Monday people are so sad understandably. So we talked about that devastating loss big time loss for the cowboys day afternoon via espn's Ed Water Joe. McCoy releases a statement where he talks about how he's going to keep his head up how what he's dealing with is minimal compared to things happening around the country and around the world and he talked about jail McCoy did in his statement that ESPN's Edward are released on Monday Jerrell McCoy talked about how he was planning. On mentor the younger players on the cowboys we've talked so much about how big of an impact that was going to be for this team on Tuesday morning my McCarthy met with the media for the first time since Joe McCoy went down with injury. Obviously, he was asked about this etc and Mike McCarthy corroborated that idea Mike. McCarthy. said that he was hopeful that he had spoken to Joe McCoy about that and that the plan was for Joe McCoy to be around mentoring the younger players this. Is You can imagine if you somehow missed this yourself, this was music to cowboys fans years people were very excited about the idea of Joe McCoy kind of you know Roman the sidelines coach and players up working with guys like Neville Gallimore Tristan Hill players, that Mike McCarthy also spoke about in his Tuesday morning press conference. kind of I know I equated it myself to what we saw from. Travis Frederick two years ago. So. That was where things stood Monday morning a little bit later Monday kind of mid morning ish not even really mid morning Joe McCoy posted a video on instagram of himself. Getting Ready for surgery to take care of this ruptured right quad tendon and individual. He talked about how he was still smiling he. told his family and friends that he loved them that he appreciated their wealth thoughts he told his coaches and his teammates he said, IAGO? To, win. He told the fans stay tuned. It was a very. Very warm video message I very reflective of the personality we have come to know from Joe McCoy if you have followed the NFL since his career began ten years ago in two thousand and ten that was where things stood and I think by lunchtime on Tuesday just about every Dallas cowboys fan had made their peace with the fact that this really sucked. But the future was certainly helpful with regards to Joe McCoy in terms of his involvement with the team, this season and in terms of his presence on the team in the future, all of a sudden on Tuesday afternoon bombshell drops that the Dallas cowboys have released Joe McCoy and that brings us to here. So what happened here? Why did the cowboys release Joe McCoy I don't understand etcetera. The cowboys have released Joe McCoy per a lot of NFL insiders. They've released him via an injury waiver. Now according to ESPN according to NFL network according to the Dallas Morning News. The, Dallas cowboys were aware of this potential medical issue when they signed Gerald. McCoy and as a result, they factored this in his contract, a particular paragraph of his contract. In fact, NFL networks Mike, Fellow a follow twitter at excuse me. That notes the cowboys are off the hook for the two point five million dollars in base salary. Guarantees this season because of this. So. This is really an accounting move for the cowboys if you WANNA look at it. That way if you WANNA put it in terms of numbers. Joe McCoy gets to keep his three million dollars signing bonus for this year. But the cowboys are indeed off the hook for the rest of his money. According to douse covers, dot com eaten in the cowboys maintained an interest in re signing. Joe. McCoy next year in two thousand and twenty one. And so. I. Think you have to think about everything here and I think the first thing is that in this goes without saying the NFL is obviously a business right business first business always usually this was a business move for the Dallas cowboys to save money on their salary cap and you know if you're looking at an vacuum, you can certainly say, well, you know there are already questions about the salary cap, etc. Giving financial comment of our world The Dallas cowboys have every right to conduct their business. In the way they see fit that is certainly one line of thought here the other line of thought or one other line of thought is that. This doesn't look great. That this doesn't look super warm and cuddly. You know you hear all the time when people are arguing about why a player should or shouldn't take this deal he should take a team friendly deal, etc. this sort of serves as proof as to how NFL teams can find a lot of ways to do what they want because they truly hold all the power. If you read through the paragraph that microphone tweeted Joe McCoy's contractor puts obviously a lot of pressure and responsibility on McCoy. He's obviously the one risking a lot of things, but he obviously stands to gain a lot of things that's just kind of the way contracts work, and so it is the business of football. It is an unfortunate reality. I also think that it's worth mentioning that given the Dallas Cowboys medical staff detected this and that it was factored into McCoy's contract Joe McCoy was. Aware of it. That's a point that Dave in our friend pointed out. Sorry for my my rapid breathing. My dog wanted to sit on my lap is that recorded this feeling a little bit needed today he wanted to hug and so bear boys is being hugged while I record here but So Joe McCoy was very likely aware that this was in his contract. And again, the point that Dave pointed out man the Dallas Cowboys medical staff really really good at their jobs seemingly they were able to isolate this as a potential incident and on the first day of padded practice, it showed up. But so journal McCoy likely aware of this. So I don't know that it really caught him off guard again I can't speak for Joe McCoy but it makes sense that that he would be able to make sense of this given that it was clearly talking point in his contract negotiations and so it is possible I don't know this for a fact but I'm just kind of speculating here. It is possible that the Dallas cowboys and Joe McCoy in the last because I'm recording this about five pm central time in the last, you know thirty to thirty two hours or so have discussed things jail McCoy with his agent have said look man, this is terrible. This sucks. We really want to around we really value as a mentor because again, Mike McCarthy on Tuesday morning said that Joe McCoy was going to be mentoring the younger players. This was the plan. Who knows who the first person was to remind everybody that this clause existed in Jomo contract but anyway, it is possible again I'm not saying this is effect. This is simply one possibility. It's possible that the important people in terms of this discussion in terms of jail. McCoy sat down and said, let's execute this move to save the Dallas Cowboys football team money in two thousand and twenty one, Joe McCoy don't go anywhere just take time get healthy we'll help you out in that department and we'll talk then we'll figure out a deal that works. That is possible and I realize that I'm trying to be as optimistic as possible there and trying to you know envision a scenario where nobody. was was. was focused more on themselves than anything because I do think it's fair to say the Dallas cowboys generally do take care of their players and you never hear of an instance where they didn't take care of a player I have a very hard time imagining the cowboys just kind of leaving Joe McCoy in the cold. But this I understand if you feel that this did not look great for the Dallas Cowboys. It again is reflective of the idea that football is a business but Joe McCoy has been released by the Dallas Cowboys. So He will not be mentor in the younger players at least this season. So. We'll see what happens. On that note though because the cowboys did have a roster spot open when they did release Joe McCoy, they signed offensive Lineman Pace Murphy and also of note Don Terry Po the other defensive tackle the cowboys signed from the Carolina Panthers. Last season has passed his physical and we'll be activated on the physically unable to perform list. So. I mean it's hard to call it a bummer I mean it's easy to call a bummer obviously and Joe. McCoy is such a fun guy and. I'm recording this on Tuesday and later on tonight is the second episode of hard knocks and if you WANNA see more of Joe, McCoy's personality you should go watch the season of our knocks at the Tampa Bay buccaneers were on He's a fun. Guy. I think that that's obvious and a lot of ways if you watch the video of him right. Before his surgery I think you can see kind of how positive a person he is. You can check that video ad on on my twitter I'm at Joe are on the blog and the boys instagram we are blogging dot the dot boys are on the blog and the boys page just go like us on facebook right there but so that was. Again, a bitter pill to swallow for cowboys fans something that was very very, very encouraging happened on Tuesdays well a little bit before the Joe McCoy News in fact. We know that I think we could all sit around your name from Dallas Cowboys, players, and figures over history that deserve to be in the pro football hall of fame that are not in the pro football hall of fame and one of them is unquestionably drew. Pearson, the original eight is a travesty to be honest it drew Pearson is not in the pro football hall of fame and in fact, a year ago when we found out that the class of two thousand and twenty, which has yet to be in trying themselves when we found out that that class was going to be larger in celebration of the NFL's one hundredth anniversary, it was going to be the centennial class and everything. I. Know I said that that really opened the door for guys like Drew Pearson that made it more possible and we saw a lot of guys get in that had had trouble getting into the hall of Fame I. Think Cliff. Harris, was one of those. And so you know the fact that cliff Harrison Jimmy Johnson's still haven't had a chance to experience their enshrinement best sack given obviously what's been going on in our world for the last few months by Drew Pearson, it was announced on Tuesday is the senior nominee for the pro football hall of fame class of two, thousand and twenty one. The hall of fame typically has a senior nominee or senior nominees. They also have a coach nominee. Former Oakland raiders head coach Tom Flores. was, the coach nominee this year he's the only coach nominee. Andrew Pearson is the only singer nominee. What does this mean? Why is this important? Well, if you don't keep up with this specifically, generally the people that are these particular nominations, the senior nominee to coach nominee to get to this point generally, these people are locks for the hall of fame. I mean, you know obviously crazy things happen but it is about ninety nine percent certain that drew Pearson on the night before Super Bowl fifty five and the Dallas cowboys are obviously getting ready to play. We'll call it the Kansas City chiefs. That drew Pearson will be announced as a member of the pro football hall of fame class of two, thousand, twenty one, and so when you consider the fact that the hall of fame has said that they were postponing this year's enshrinement in districts facilities to next year that means that assuming that does happen, which is a fair assumption at this point in time the cowboys will have a hall of Fame Group next year that consists of cliff branch after cliff Harris of Jimmy Johnson and of drew. Pearson So Nice of the seventies there. And very very, very cool. peyton manning. We'll be eligible for the hall of fame. So you've got that going on as well and I was thinking. Wind Drew Pearson. Put in the hall of fame it will mark two different sets of triplets for the Dallas Cowboys in the pro football hall of fame obviously drew we'll join Roger Staubach and Tony Dorsett. You've obviously got the nineties triplets and Troy Aikman Emmitt Smith Michael Irvin both of their head coaches now in the hall of fame with Jimmy Johns joining his triplets Tom Landry has already been in the hall of Fame Jerry, Jones, the owner and operator of the cowboys in the hall of fame. Just an incredible legacy that analysis cowboys have America's team all that jazz etc etc etc but. Obviously. Tuesday is I think going to be ultimately remembered is the jail McCoy day for what it's worth. There were media sessions for three different players on the Dallas. Cowboys. Jalen Smith Smoke spoke goodness gracious Jalen Smith spoke, Andy. Dalton. Also spoke and Michael Gallup spoke I thought Andy. Dot. Comments were interesting given that. Like everybody else they were his first comments this year and therefore Andy Dalton's first comments as a Dallas Cowboy and actually I should check that because endymion did speak on Adam Schefters podcast shortly after joining the cowboys but Andy spoke talked about how much respect he has for Dak Prescott how much he's enjoying Mike McCarthy, etc. How Mike McCarthy was a big reason why he chose that ask hours so that was very cool. I think the ultimately the coolest quote from an optimistic standpoint that we've got on Tuesday was Mike McCarthy was asked in his Tuesday morning press conference. Say. That press conference press conference anyway. Mike McCarthy was asked about the value of having Michael Gallup as the team's number two I receiver yet quote was hurt all around the world. You'd likely different places he said, let me be clear Michael. Gallup is number one receiver in my mind. Good for Mike, McCarthy for identifying that Michael Gallup was about that. He was very humble. He said that he wasn't going to say that himselves. Himself excuse. Me But he was appreciative of Mike McCarthy for Africa. Wet. But neither way Tuesday was an unfortunate day given the jail. McCoy. News I think a lot of people. are going to be bummed about that like I said, football is a business and sometimes the business side of things is is not that pretty is not that glamorous and that was clearly the case with Joe. Mccoy we have some fun things coming podcast. Wise had a meeting on Tuesdays. We have some fun things coming podcast. Wise. That will certainly impact you a good way. Don't worry. And certainly be great for espionage in as a whole something I'm very excited about. But in the meantime. What you've grown accustomed to is not going anywhere. All right. If you are new around here, you need to know what is going on every day. You're on the block on the boys pipe case, you get two episodes you get this show the Ocho, which catches you latest headlines Latest News what's going on in the world of America's team. We make sure that you know what you need to know. Later on every single day, you get a beef episode and episode a little bit more news of the more now says a little bit more breakdown of what's going on with the cowboys. Later on today on Wednesday, you will have A. Brand new episode of talk on the style with Kawhi, Miller and called Patterson. So that is kind of where things are in terms of the podcast makes you do subscribe we are available on all major podcast platforms, apple devices, spotify tune in radio. We are everywhere you can follow me on twitter or Instagram at our job show like I said, if email is more your thing. So people prefer email, you shoot me an email rj dot Ocho at ESPN ASIAN DOT COM this. This week has already been kind of wild. So we'll see what the week has in store for us as it continues to roll along. It is Hump Day. mytalk is ready to get off my lap. So with that, we'll we'll go ahead and wrap up Wednesday's episode. You do me a favor you have the absolute best Wednesday of all time. Because you deserve it assume my friends is always go cowboys and peace out.

Joe McCoy Dallas Cowboys cowboys Jerrell McCoy Mike McCarthy football NFL Gerald McCoy McCoy ESPN America Andrew Pearson Dallas Morning News Everson Griffen twitter Michael McCarthy Drew Pearson Michael Gallup Dallas
BONUS: When to Draft Chiefs RBs (Fantasy Football Podcast)

Fantasy Football Today

08:10 min | 1 year ago

BONUS: When to Draft Chiefs RBs (Fantasy Football Podcast)

"This is fantasy football today from c._b._s. Sports golf smell us at fantasy football ed c._b._s. I dot com. Take time to dominate your fantasy league janey. Go stop it on labor day weekend. There's big news got to tell you about it. I hope we're not you know. Inundating your feed with a bunch of episode. You don't wanna hear i hope instead. We're helping you out. Get ready with some last minute draft prepped so i'm outta mazer and he's dave richard. Hey dave on adam happy labor day labor day weekend. You were putting the labor and labor day this <hes> this year so dave doesn't sound like normally does because as i've mentioned all the guys had to travel from south florida to get away from hurricane so dave is just a on his laptop using using the the onboard mike there so apologize when dave types we can hear him type just letting him know we're just gonna react. That's okay we're gonna react actively shawn mccoy and then i'm going to get your thoughts on what you what the listeners heard me and ben talk about yesterday the rest of the news. Let's start with mccoy. Why what does this mean for all three chiefs running backs now while the first thing that i think of is did damien williams do anything to lose in his grip on starting or being the lead back and i'll use the term lead loosely and i would answer that question. No i don't think shawn mccoy. It was brought on to take the job away from gaming wines. I think damian has played it looked amazing on his touchdown catch in the preseason and the hamstring injury slowed him down but he seems to be past that i think that this is a case of andy reid getting to bring in a guy who he knows he trusts to add to his backfield in their mind. It's a huge upgrade over carlos hyde in my mind. It's a big upgrade over carlos. I kinda stopped myself when i said big. It's an upgrade. It's it's an upgrade yeah. <hes> and i think it's going to be there to allow darwin thompson to take his time. Keep daryl williams from hit in the field so much and this is going to be the one two punch at the chiefs run game will add with damian amazon mccoy and the thing about it that it's gonna stink for fantasy managers is that we know oh that both williams and mccoy can do the same things fairly well. It's just that one of them is younger and seems more spry and probably won't come off the field limping every other week only to go back again and struggled to get three yards per carry the other one right yeah mccoy aging banged up last year two straight years with the correo carrillo yards precarious so let's just get down to business. When are you drafting. Damian williams shawn mccoy oy darwin thompson so i'm i'm still okay. Drafting damien williams number two vincent running back not as a number one which is where i had him before as much much as i don't like devante freeman. I've gotta take freeman head of damien williams. I think that they're both gonna get right around the same amount of work and i don't think there's anybody that's gonna take freeman out of important high. Leverage plays like right shawn mccoy might with damon one. What about josh jacobsz. I'll take jacobs editing damien williams seventeenth for me in non p._b._r. And he's going to be right about the same in full p._b._r. I think he's the top twenty running-backs still but i don't think he's <hes> around to pick anymore. I would probably look for him. Actually round four is probably when i would feel best taking d up's aaron jones mark ingram. I'll take williams ahead of them but again. I am not a big aaron. Jones guy ryan so a lot of people will will gravitate toward jones because he's that a plus back in green bay and they'll. They'll just take him ahead of <music>. I'm just it's not something i'm gonna do. I'm very worried about aaron. Johns the the injury to andrew or the retirement of andrew luck has eliminated t. y. Hilton and marlin mac from round three this this news here has pushed damian. Williams may be too late round three. It just makes me want an early pick so much more like an early first and third round pick okay so how about the chama coin darwin thompson when he drafting them. I think they're both still going to be who do you like. Who do you like better better. Oh you got electron mccoy better better and i it pains me to say because darwin is so much fun but he's now in that round ten range darwinism because he's the one that's going to be impacted quite a bit by shady eighty showing up i have lucia mccoy's a top one hundred player. I believe i've got him at the end of round eight n._p._r. And about the same thing finan p._b._r. Okay how would you rather have devon single terry early sean mccoy. I'm taking. I'm taking single terry. I don't i don't know how the other guys feel about devon single jury but i'm i'm excited okay. I'm i'm really pumped about his chances now. We're going to get really into this on our monday episode with with dave jamie and heath so we'll have a nice debate eight there but okay. Let's so let's so let me give you a few more shaw mccoy's and then we'll wrap things up with shawn mccoy or rashad penny. I've got shady over for pennies because i'm just not sold on penny being a a very good running back not that lesean mccoy is but he's in the better offense. I i think to to be a running back in there but out about tobacco ahead shawn mccoy or matt brita. I'll take rita the shawn mccoy or dairy geiss. I've got guys retire all right all right so it's in that range there i guess for dave and <hes> finally you want to get your thoughts on duke johnson devin single terry carlos high rank. I'll be real quick single terry. I'm very excited about round six round seven <hes> a number three fantasy back with plenty have upside. I'm not scared off by frank gore or t._j. Yeldan i think the guy that was really going to challenge him for touches with shading. He's gone <hes> carlos hyde i i i think the texans are gonna learn what everybody else seen about him but they are going to insist on using multiple running backs. They're not going to be comfortable. Duke being the only guy there i oh i didn't move to johnson down. I knew that they were going to bring in somebody else so i kept him round six p. around seven eight and nine and <hes> in carlos hyde is maybe a double digit round around guy. I guess i'm not real excited. Take him he might score four touchdowns this year anybody. Who else did you will how do you i said frank or but nobody's interested in him. Do you like like <hes> w lately wrong devon single terry or duke johnson single-story wow okay devon single terror tevin coleman coleman okay all right more on the <hes>. Did you think willfuller at all no. I'm not a hundred percent sure that kenny stills wasn't isn't a guy that the texans or that the dolphins insisted was part of the deal like you want laremy tunsil. You gotta pay off form and you've got to take this wide receiver her that talked trash about our owner. You gotta take him too. So maybe there's an opportunity for for stills. Maybe stills works on the salat and he has slot weapon in that often exam zan that gives them the chance to rest kiki so he could speculate with stills on a late round pick but i don't think he's gonna he's not gonna challenge hopkins and he's probably going to be the guy that would replace fuller in the games that fuller misses. I spoke to a column for the houston chronicle last night on the radio. Show brian t smith. I asked him is willful or still going to be the second best receiver on this team and he said if he's healthy not even a question so i'll talk about more of that on monday. Show thanks today for hopping on. Thanks to all of you again. I'm not trying to <hes> you know annoy you with a whole bunch of episodes over the weekend because our ninth the episode of the week but i hope this is really helpful as you prepare for your drafts and we'll talk to you on monday morning. Lock in your drafts everybody.

shawn mccoy damian amazon mccoy Damian williams dave lesean mccoy aaron jones damien williams mccoy darwin thompson shaw mccoy lucia mccoy damian terry carlos frank gore devon daryl williams sean mccoy football carlos hyde c._b._s
The Ocho: Gerald McCoy | Maurice Canady | Anthony Brown back

Blogging the Boys

22:37 min | 7 months ago

The Ocho: Gerald McCoy | Maurice Canady | Anthony Brown back

"T. Mobile's the first and only wireless companies offer nationwide five gene covering over two hundred million Americans counting. That's right it's not just five gene. Select PARTS OF SELECT CITIES. T. MOBILE NATIONWIDE FIVE. G. Covers over five thousand cities and towns. And that's just the beginning. Indoor outdoor no signal goes farther or is more reliable than T. mobile's five G. Find out more about the first largest and only nationwide five G. Network at T DASH MOBILE DOT com. That's T- dash mobile dot com capable device required coverage not available in some areas. Downlink only some uses may require certain plan or feature. Ct DASH DOT COM. None of leading. What upward welcome in an hour to another episode of the Ocho presented you in partnership as always sp nations blogging. The BOYS DOT COM name R Jewish. Show of course from bt an from radio as you're humble host on the show. It is Thursday the third day March Nineteenth. Two Thousand and twenty once again. We hope all is well wherever you are. We know that things are You know things are tricky. The world is in a very dangerous place with the cove in nineteen pandemic. And we hope you're safe. We hope you're healthy. We hope all is well once again. Wednesday was a very busy day for the Dallas Cowboys. Lots happening to them and for them and around them in a lot to discuss. And that's what we're going to do because that's what do here on the Ocho if you're unfamiliar every single day the blocking the boys podcast feed you get this show first thing and your podcast feed in the morning you wake up. We'll give you a daily briefing on what's going on in the world of America's to update you we give you the ones the twos the threes fours and everything in between so make sure go ahead and subscribe to the blog. The boys podcast feed or available. Wherever you get podcasts apple devices spotify tune in radio stitcher soundcloud Google play. While you're at subscribe. Go ahead write a review. Give us a rating. Those things really helped show. We really appreciate it when people do. You know if you want to give us five stars up to you. If you don't hate him we appreciate honest views all the time but anyway as mentioned Wednesday The new league year began. That's right four. Pm Eastern time brought with it the beginning of the newly again so we are officially in the twenty twenty NFL season and as noted it was kind of a busy day for the Dallas Cowboys. And obviously we've known something so this point and we have updates and trackers and all things for you of course it blogging the boys dot com. We've known that Amari Cooper is going to be back with the Dallas cowboys you know the Dak Prescott Franchise tag to another Blake. Striving got an extension. We know the Baron Jones is headed the Miami Dolphins. We know that half of the cow was it. Feels like we're headed to the Las Vegas Writers Jason Win Me Collins and Jeff. He's but Wednesday brought with it some news in fact. I should say that Tuesday brought with it some news. So you know we we. We're always running. We are always doing what we can to give information at blog on the boys dot com and we put kind of everything. We'd set everything up on Tuesday night and sure enough word broke. The cowboys got one. The cowboys got their first outside. Free agent late Tuesday night. We wrote about it for you. It was all over our social channels. Didn't have a chance. Obviously podcast about it because we already pushed our podcast off for the day so apologies for being late with this but late Tuesday night. The Dallas Cowboys did agree to terms with defensive. Tackle Gerald McCoy. Oh yeah that's right Gerald McCoy you know the one the only jail McCoy thirty two years old defensive tackle extraordinaire since two thousand and twelve. Which I know that feels you know two thousand dollars. That was like three years ago. That was eight years ago since two thousand twelve. He has never finished a season playing less than thirteen games. Or with less than five sacks. See if you're telling me. I can count on from a historical from a trend perspective. Thirteen games and five sacks for my defensive tackle. I will take that all day and run to the bank with it and speaking of the bank there where people wondering. Whoa and I hope it wasn't a lot of money and you know and I hope you know I'm fine with it if if it's a good deal if you know the money's right. I'm fine with in and it's kind of what everybody says. What do you think about insert? Whatever free agent here. Well you know if the money's right that's I don't know if the money's right then maybe you never hear anybody say. What do you think about this guy to give them everything? Jim Jim? Everything's throw it off. Throw the kitchen sink at him. I don't care whatever it cost. It's always if the money's right speaking of the money with regards to jail McCoy. It was reported on Wednesday three years. Twenty and a quarter million dollars. If you're doing that math in your head that comes out to less than seven million dollars per season for one of the more. Prominent defensive tackles in the game and obviously as mentioned the cowboys did lose Melito Collins to the Las Vegas raiders landing. Joan McCoy is I think an upgrade and I say that with all due respect to me cons the cowboys suddenly look. It's hard to know exactly what the guy was defensive. Line overall is going to look like at the very least. You know that you've got demarcus Lawrence Jel McCoy now. Maybe you've got Randy Gregory. Obviously you're kind of counting on Antoine Woods and Tristan Hill to a certain degree and by the way nobody better for Tristen Hill to learn. From Stud like Gerald McCoy and Joe McCoy he spoke to. Espn's Jason Anderson. He said that he's excited. To be part of America's team is excited to play for my car that talked to him at the pro bowl before Joe McCoy son just committed to the University of Oklahoma to play for Lincoln Riley. So it's it's a cool story. I mean if you care about that and so it is nice to cowboys got one. That is a very very big deal for them. I think to land Gerald Mccoy so that happened late on Tuesday night then Wednesday. Everybody woke up. Okay crack the knuckles. What's going to happen today? Let's get it done. What are we going to see today? What are the rumor is? GonNa be what what's going to happen to the cowboys on Wednesday Hump Day when the newly officially begins today got started with some interest. Nfl Networks Jane Slater reported that the Dallas Cowboys and Emmanuel Sanders have interest in each other. That's right not just. This isn't a one way thing this isn't you know looking at a crush down the hall. No no no no. No this is when you meet is and you get a letter feel in Ho. You know the one. I'm talking about cowboys and Emmanuel. Sanders reportedly have mutual interest in one another Emmanuel Sanders. Obviously has been around the NFL for awhile. Coming off Emmanuel Sanders has kind of been used as this sort of one person. Focus Group with the fact that now with the new. Cba The NFL is going to have at some point in the near future. Seventeen Games regular season Emmanuel. Sanders just played seventeen games last season. He started off the season. Obviously with the Denver broncos hadn't had his by yet then got traded to the San Francisco. Forty niners who had already had their by so Emmanuel sanders played in seventeen games. He played all seventeen weeks and then followed that up with a playoff performance. Went to the Super Bowl with the forty niners obviously did not win it but he has won a super bowl. Before incidentally in the home of the forty niners Eh Levi stadium while a member of the Denver Broncos so Mayo it will sanders certainly a A legitimate wide receiver. I think and obviously the cowboys las Randall Cobb to the Houston Texans. I think Emmanuel Sanders can come in and can really kind of cushion that blow. I think that manual centers is a great option. If you're telling me the cowboys top wide receivers in two thousand twenty wide receiver trio I should say are Amari Cooper Michael Gallup and Emmanuel Sanders. Man. It's almost you know. I think you know that's pretty good. I mean right like that's that's pretty good. That's a pretty good way to live so Recording this on Wednesday evening at about seven fifteen. Pm Central Time so as of this particular moment because everything is fluid there are no answers as to where Emmanuel Sanders is going to end up. Now I should say Emmanuel Sanders. There are a lot of Dallas connections here obviously went to Smu. Just like Kobe's Lee by the way So he has that prominent Dallas connection and two years ago. Friend of the show. Bobby Belt reported that at the time if Emanuel was to be released by the Denver broncos the he would have interest in playing for the Dallas Cowboys. That did not happen. Obviously he wrote the two thousand eighteen in two thousand nineteen and with the Broncos but now he has a choice in the matter and for what it's worth if you care about this thing back around twenty eighteen. There was a tweet a tweet. Somebody tweeted saying that Emmanuel Sanders would do well with the cowboys and he liked it. Oh yeah he liked it and you know things are serious one dude tweets so Emmanuel Sanders In the cowboys who knows? Maybe that's going to happen. Maybe it won't but the cowboys were also linked to some other players They have been linked as we mentioned at the very least by Joe Thomas To W on Clowney who as of this recording does not have an NFL team So we'll see where county ultimately ends up. Wednesday's reports did note that he has not gotten the offers that he thought he would. And so I know that that gets a lot of people sort of optimistic. The cowboys offering something So maybe maybe that ultimately happens but we'll see There were against some other people that the cowboys were connected to. We've SEEN THEM BE CONNECTED TO CHRIS. Harris junior the cornerback. Also even the Denver Broncos but that will not come to pass is Chris. Harris Junior is headed to the Los Angeles chargers cowboys were also connected to a different cornerback. That's right Desmond Choo Fan. Who is coming off a nice career? So far with the Atlanta Falcons guys have been connected. A true font but that dream is gone as well. True Fund is headed to the Detroit Lions And you know. I think part of the reason why Chris Junior and Desmond show font probably chose other tinges because the cowboys ultimately got themselves a cornerback. That's right the cowboys I can't say signed. I mean nothing has happened. Nothing technical because of the way things are right now but the cowboys agreed to terms. Not just one cornerback with two quarterbacks. That's right the cowboys like. I said they were kind of busy on. Interestingly on on Wednesday so the cowboys had a lot going on for them. Specifically let's talk about the cowboys. Related elements are free agency. That went down on Wednesday but before we do. Let's take a very quick break to hear. A word from our sponsors hiring is difficult. You're looking for the just right candidate for your team's unique needs but knowing where to start the search can be challenging according to ziprecruiter research three out of four employers say. They're having a hard time filling open positions. If you've got a difficult role to fill no matter what industry you're in hire with Ziprecruiter and right. Now you can try Ziprecruiter for free at ZIPRECRUITER DOT com slash. Vox here's how ziprecruiter finds candidates that you can get excited about. I they send your job to over one hundred top job sites and what they're powerful matching technology ziprecruiter scams thousands of resumes to find the people with the right skills and experiences for your job and then actively invites them to apply. It's so effective that four out of five employees who post on Ziprecruiter get a quality candidate within the first day to try ziprecruiter for free go to ziprecruiter dot com slash. Vox that's ziprecruiter DOT COM slash V o X ziprecruiter dot com slash. Vox Ziprecruiter the smartest way to hire while you're listening to this PODCAST T. Mobile was busy building the largest five G. Network in America. Well into it all during this one podcast. They spent years improving their network to be ready for the future. Wireless Five G well. The future is here and it's nationwide. T. Mobile's five G. network is over five thousand cities covering more than two hundred million Americans. It's five g service you can actually use even in places where other signals just get locked like your living room or a bank vault not the last one. Now's the time you get ahead of the five G. Game why not picked the first largest and only nationwide five G. Network Goatee DASH MOBILE DOT com. That's E. Dash mobile dot com capable device required coverage not available in some areas. Downlink only some uses may require certain plan or feature the CAT DASH MOBILE DOT com. All right everybody welcome back to the OCHO. Hopefully the break was prosperous for you. Hopefully you got something done. Got a snack. Whatever you did. Hopefully it was fantastic. So as mentioned Wednesday was a very busy day for the Dallas Cowboys. We talked about the players they had reported interest and Emmanuel Sanders. Still on the open market as We record this episode again About seven thirty. Pm Central Time Desmond now a member of the Detroit. Lions Chris Harris Junior now a member of the Los Angeles chargers. Now we've seen the cowboys lose a lot of people so far to date in free agency you can go on and on Byron Jones has joined the Miami Dolphins Randall. Cobb is joined the Houston Texans. let's see who else we got. Jason Witten. Hello has joined the Las Vegas raters. Malate collinses during the Las Vegas Writers Jeff. He has joined the Las Vegas Raiders. Robert Quinn has joined the Chicago bears or excuse me Robert Quinn has joined the Chicago bears and the cowboys lost another one. If you If you're kind of keeping score at home the cowboys lost another free agent on Wednesday Xavier. Sue Afi low is now a member of the Cincinnati bengals. It is worth mentioning that the cowboys do play the AFC North in two thousand and twenty. So they will visit Exhibit Sufi Low Cincinnati bengals. They will also visit of course the reigning. Mvp Lamar Jackson in the Baltimore. Ravens are cowboys. Will host the Pittsburgh steelers and the Cleveland. Browns remember Mike McCarthy that defeated the steelers inside the building the cowboys playing in Super Bowl. Forty five that's going to be. I imagine it's going to stir up some good memories for him at the very least but exhibits to appeal. It was kind of the only cowboy to be lost on on Wednesday. The cowboys did As mentioned signed Joe McCoy or agree to terms Joe McCoy on Tuesday night and they got another one. The cowboys now have to outside free agents. Cowboys have agreed to terms with defensive. Tackle Joe McCoy and with cornerback. Maurice candidate that's right. Maurice Kennedy Excuse me Is the newest Dallas cowboys. Cornerback in this particular signing was met with a lot of who a lot of people always candidate? Who WHO's this? What who who and I'm always Kennedy was a sixth round draft. Pick of the Baltimore Ravens in Two Thousand Sixteen. Actually taking twenty picks after the cowboys took any brown who get to in a second spent most of his. Nfl career to date with the Ravens had a brief stint with the New York. Jets last season for what it's worth. Maurice had one interception last season and now the highest paid cornerback in the NFL. Byron Jones did not have a single one so clearly. Maurice's better I tweeted this out by the way that that little joke and there were some people that took a little seriously so apologies. If it was meant to be said in jest but I thought something was interesting. I wanted to see and I think this might say a lot about Mike McCarthy potentially we've heard them. Mike McCarthy is big on analytics and we know that he spent a day pro football focus in Cincinnati. Works feel now play and so we know that Mike. Mccarthy is hip to this right. He's part of football twitter and everything not literally but you get the point. I wouldn't shock me. You know if we find out someday in the future Mike McCarthy had a burner and he was part of this he was one of the people tweeting. The running backs. Don't matter and all this stuff but anyway I went back and I looked at pro. Football focus is for the two thousand nineteen season. And if you're familiar with pro football focus you know this but if you're not they grade in a lot of capacities they. Have you know grades from a quarterback standpoint in run defense and pass defense and all sorts of different things broken down but in terms of overall great on defense? I thought this was very interesting. When looking at cornerback Byron Jones finished fourteenth last season. Okay Maurice Kennedy Finished Twentieth Okay. That's interesting to me for what it's worth to debate elusive finish twenty-first which says that apparently Maurice Kennedy was better than which also shows you that if more if she was regarded as the twenty first. Best cornerback by pro football. Focus last season that maybe the metrics aren't perfect. I think it's the kind of way to say that. But for what it's worth desmond who fought the newest member of the Detroit Lions. A lot of cowboys fans wanted finish thirty second and Chris Harris Junior now a Los Angeles chargers will allow fans wanted as well finished thirty fourth. So Moist Kennedy again. I'm not saying this is necessarily the case. But it's possible that Mike McCarthy later sky and there's maybe some analytics to support Maurice Kennedy and that's why he went after him. I don't know I'm just speculating at this particular point in time but The cowboys now have two free agents that they have brought in from external places. So we'll see if the cowboys are going to get somebody else. Maybe it isn't manual sanders. Maybe maybe it's player. Why it's cloudy. I mean who knows but for now the cowboys have pulled into players to add to the group that they already have now for. What it's worth. The cowboys did bring back some other people again. They've really kind of been focused on that to this point in free agency. I don't think we talked about this either. But on Tuesday night it was announced that they are bringing back law snapper L. P. Ladder. Who now that? Jason Witten is a member of the Las Vegas Raiders. Lpd only member of the current Dallas Cowboys. That has also played a football game at Texas stadium so I put that in perspective. Texas Stadium The final season there for the cowboys was two thousand eight L. P. has been doing this for a long time. He is the goat when it comes to long snapper so I was like I said have been focused on keeping a lot of different people. So they brought in Joe McCoy they brought in Moi's Kennedy and while they did lose to the Bengals The cowboys are bringing back. The legendary Kai forbath. That's right the cowboys have a kicker on their roster for two thousand twenty who knows if maybe they maybe they draft you know. Maybe there's an undrafted. We talked about that. How next show mark ten years since Dane? Baily was brought him as an undrafted free agent but for now Kai forbath is returning to the cowboys. Kai forbath for what it's worth a perfect ten of ten on field goals and a perfect ten of ten on extra points through three games with the Dallas cowboys last season. There's a lot of reason to believe in four. But he's only thirty two years old so he's fairly young. As far as kickers are concerned It seemingly came down to as we've discussed before Kai forbath or Greg's align new cowboy special teams Corner John Fossil obviously has a history with Greg's or online with the Los Angeles N. Saint Louis Rams but forbath go perfect. Yo You perfect. Twenty four twenty on on all sorts of kicks and. I think that that really says a lot about you. Car forbath even had an instagram post about it. So you know that it is official. Now the cowboys brought back more than Kai forbath on Wednesday in fact We talked about this. I wrote about this at least when Collins. He's been a big name. We've said millions name a lot on this episode but when me Collins left to the raiders It just was another member of that. Two Thousand Sixteen Cowboys Draft Class. That headed elsewhere. And you look at it. In two thousand sixteen cowboys had kind of a franchise changing draft as people have said since then obviously took. Zeke Elliot. And then Jalen Smith Collins Third Pick Charles Tabar DAK Prescott and in the four sixth round picks to force sixth-round picks Into Italian where cave on frazier. We'll see what happens with him. Rico gathers the greatest tight end to ever live Darius Jackson radius in the minds of many bTV fans and of course Anthony Brown. Antony Brown only played nine games last season for the cowboys. Thanks to injury. But he's been saw it right. I mean I think we've all sort of learned in appreciated Anthony. Brown has been able to do over the course of his four seasons with the cowboys. And in fact there are going to be three more Brown back to the cowboys on a three year. Deal and that's good. I mean is Anthony Brown going to set the world on fire? No but you need death at quarterback. You need those players. You need those guys that you can rely on those guys. Kinda know your culture know your system and Anthony. Brown certainly fits that mold. Who would have thought that anthony row would get a long-term or excuse me a second contract with the cowboys before Dak Prescott interesting? But so the class of twenty sixteen at the very least has Zeke has jalen now has Anthony Brown and has DAK Prescott at the very least on the franchise tag So still kind of holding strong. Maybe Rico galleries will come back. Let me get a real party but for now the cowboys. Cornerback group Chittabrata Join Louis Maurice Kennedy and Anthony Brown. So maybe that's enough for you. Maybe it's not. I feel like that group. All potentially include the seventeenth overall pick. Random makes a lot of sense but who knows. Maybe the cowboys aren't done. But the big names are definitely off the board at this point Other than that the cowboys did get another optimistic sign. It was reported. That cowboy's quarterback cooper rush is has agreed. I should say to sign his restricted free agent tender with two point one million dollars so cooper rush coming back and. I thought this was worth mentioning Cooper Rush. Joined the cowboys in two thousand seventeen as an undrafted free agent. Two thousand seventeen was the first season to the cow was played without Tony. Romo is that was his first season in the booth for CBS. That means that the cowboys have had an undrafted. Free agent quarterback think about how difficult that is an undrafted free agent quarterback. The cowboys have had on their roster from two thousand three at the very least through two thousand twenty almost two decades. And if you want to round up the cowboys have had at least one. Undrafted free agent quarterback team. That's impressive so I don't think. Ideally you want to always find quarterbacks that rabbit a cool story Kuba Russia's a good guy fan of the show he's been on this show before and so. The cowboys didn't have a quarterback under contract before this week and so now they've got DAK Prescott on the tag and Cooper Rush On his on his tender so good times. We'll see what happens on Thursday again. The third day for the cowboys This is kind of the time where they're a little bit more. Active generally I it's bargain bin time. That's that's where the guy was like to shop so we'll see where the cowboys ended up doing. Whatever they ended up doing we'll have you covered of course a blogging. The Boys Dot Com right here on the blog on the voice. Podcast feed makes you subscribe us. Ryder review those things. Help us so much. Go subscribe to the black in the boys YouTube channel. You can follow me on twitter and INSTAGRAM AT ARJA. You can shoot me an email. Rj DATA SHOW AT ESPIONAGE DOT com. And you can do me a favor. You have the greatest Thursday of all time you know why because you deserve we will. One of my friends is always go cowboys and peace APP.

cowboys Dallas Cowboys Emmanuel Sanders NFL Joe McCoy Gerald McCoy Mike McCarthy America Desmond Choo Los Angeles Kai forbath Maurice Kennedy Denver broncos T. Mobile Las Vegas Jason Witten bt Detroit Lions Miami Dolphins
The Colt McCoy Reality

The Kevin Sheehan Show

1:10:31 hr | 1 year ago

The Colt McCoy Reality

"You want it. You need it. It's what everyone's talking about the kevin sheehan show now here's kevin you're listening into the sports fix. That's right. Tommy is here. It's tuesday august sixth and yes. We did a show yesterday. The problem is it. It crashed after we did it aaron. Would you like to explain to all of those got upset that we told them once. I started back on radio. We weren't gonna stop the podcast and they thought the podcast was over yesterday. Yeah we did a nice show. It was very smooth. Nothing went wrong and then i pressed stop at the end when in back-to-back edits and it crashed never happened one why ever happened before making erin explain. It wasn't his fault. I don't have an explanation. It wasn't his fault. It wasn't in his fault in the why didn't you just did. It's your podcast aaron. Why don't you explain to tom. Did i get upset about it now. No you know me if if if somebody's breathing we're good i don't get worked up about the small stuff but we did actually come in here and we did a show yesterday and and by the way it was one of the best shows we've ever done of course was and that can't be beat why because you are not exactly and then it just crashed in the problem is aaron has another show that produces in the afternoon and our backup producer. My son was doing something malia concert somewhere <hes> he was actually in in his studio recordings and stuff and so i just said all right whatever so the plan by the way the rest of the summer is we're gonna do this podcast but not five days a week. I was planning on taking days off anyway in july and august which i've done in july a few and i was gonna take off some days in august as well and then when we get post labor day that tuesday after labor day we're back to a normal schedule with the podcast and maybe a few wrinkles to the podcast as well which will explain as we get closer but sorry about not having a show yesterday <hes> that was <hes> <hes> unfortunate. Did this make the papers. I don't think it made the area this at all. No but people did tweet me. One person tweeted me and was really upset that no i. I'm sorry about that and for those of you that want here's the thing i'm learning after two days of being back on radio radios easy when you're in the car. The podcast is easier when you're not in the car because by the way also the quality of the <music> audio is for straight and you're on the podcasts yes. That's the more important thing speaking of which y'all i'm looking at this this. It's beautiful studio that we broadcast from. Yes and how how how tremendously it's decorated. It's almost like a man cave. Would you remember my office. Yes well. How have your office was decorated like a guy who needed to leave town in five minutes. Here was here's my thing. It's always been this way when it comes to work. I don't it's it definitely an insecurity going back to whatever company i was in. I never really decorated an office because i always felt like once that happened and you're comfortable being like you looked really comfortable that more likely than not. You're on your way out well. I could speak to that since i made my office office. At nine eight hundred eight nine it was to yourself and say that's a long time to pack it up. Yes in by by the way you know. We're in a business really where you don't make money in your office. You make it in the studio or you know outside of it and i always felt like before where i got into broadcasting and business was like look. I don't make money in the office. I'm selling and i'm generating revenue being outside the office but anyway you're right eighties sparse force but mike a western spur spurs. This is because i'm looking at the only things that i brought in the only things that are in here hear of any note is and i brought them all in denard span bobblehead a max scherzer bobblehead a buck show snow walter our snow cone and a nats october fest mug but i noticed the bryce harper chia pet is missing. I didn't touch it really. I swear to god. I didn't touch it. It's gone. It's gone and i do remember you bringing it. S i have no idea where somebody stole. Somebody took it and nobody comes in the studio. You know what they don't even come in to clean this studio. I actually twice a week. Get a vacuum cleaner leaner from down the hall in vacuum up all the crumbs it around your chair. That's usually the mess. That's been made in the office but i swear to god. I have no idea where that i don't know if it disappeared or or somebody took his aac yeah. The price harper chia pet is missing. It's missing. If you're listening out there and you broke it and took and he took the <hes> would have been in here. There were a few other mike mike mike wouldn't take the corbin would have zero interest in taking the chia pet. We've had other people in here. That's true but i didn't see anybody walkout with the chia panel. That's the big mystery today. It would be nice to have just a big picture of antonio brown's feet up in the studio. Have you seen those pictures now the blisters on his feet now i have not you know he is not ah practice the i know that as raider and jon gruden said the other day you know really disappointed that we haven't gotten our you know our star off season acquisition musician on the field and he tweeted out pictures or maybe instagram doubt pictures of his feet. Oh my god there shredded you gotta you gotta check got that picture and if you haven't all your feet google and <hes> probably not you know you know it's funny. This is how you know that you've crossed the age barrier the the the age of no return when you wake up one morning and you look down at your feet and they're your father's feet or hands. I think the same thing with hands since only gosh. Are you looking at the pictures of his feet yeah there nightmare. He's got major issues with his feet and i'm telling you this this whole wide receiver thing the oh b._j. The antonio brown if i'm running a football operation i just i just assumed not have all all of that west russian distract distraction. Look give me hopkins in a second. Give me julio jones in a second but the guys that have clear clear mental issues. I don't want any part of them. I'm predicting times have. I've been telling you told me that for years when when we had the argument i i'm gonna tell you right now who we had the we we always argued about one player do you remember was i- dez bryant. I thought he was a star. I thought the cowboys needed him. I thought he was a big time player. He was a headache. No no doubt he was a headache but i would have preferred to have had him than not had him. You're right. You're right on all these guys because again. I mean if you follow my philosophy sophy of building a team from the inside out. If you have great interior linemen to to help your passing game you can get by without diva wide receivers you can. I mean jerry. Jones made the comment the other day that you don't need a rushing champion anymore to win in the n._f._l. Thing is he. He needs a rushing champion. That's my position. I mean zeke elliot. He needs it. I think that's true. I actually think that his team is built for zeke doc elliott yes and that he's the difference between you know two wins potential year which can be the difference between eleven five and a and a division title like last year or nine and seven in no playoffs. I think they need zeke elliott but i do have this strange feeling about the steelers this year without out. I love latvian bell as a runner. I just think he's got one of the most unique running styles ever. I love him as a back but he was a problem and antonio brown was a problem wouldn't wouldn't surprise me at all if pittsburgh being really good this year well what and the giants are better than people think i think the giants are going to be better than people think <hes> and there is this sediment adam and that the steelers will be fine just because they've built up a reputation of excellence over years and people think that the institution of the organization or stronger than individual players if that happens. Is that a statement yes. Is that a statement two other players around the lease statements of the league. If if the judge let's just say that the steelers went ten and six and went to the postseason and the giants were the surprise team in the n._f._c. and went ten and six and got a wildcard hard and cleveland and oakland tanked badly and obi. Jay was a problem and antonio brown didn't play and was mouth and off once he came back. It was a disruption yet would be a bit of a statement. I think people have an intuitive sense of how this could work out the the problem with those two players in particular is they are so gifted they're so over the top gifted and talented indifference makers and antonio brown's been a difference maker in terms of winning. Yes you know he's played on winning teams in pittsburgh but i like their team and i don't know why people are all i mean the cleveland. The thing to me is getting a little bit out of control in the end the a._f._c. north. They still have smith schuster who has a chance to be a very good player. They drafted james washington. The oklahoma state kid last year. A lot of people think that he is potentially going to be a star. James connor showed you that he is a he's a twenty twenty carry a game back. He's not levy on belleville. Maybe on bell was a massive yes and they still they still got been and yes. They've got ben roethlisberger yeah look. I don't think the giants are good. I don't think the giants the giants have different problems steelers. That's true. Giants have a quarterback issue do that. A lot of people think exists prop maybe over inflated but still i mean they have issues beyond their their wide receiver. I don't think it'd take ten wins for the giants to make a statement. I think the giants are five hundred team. They've already. What were they last twelve. What were they last year. The giants can't even remember what they were five and eleven something like that that i don't know but they had very good not. They weren't very good although they got better at the end of the year if you recall that they were getting better at the five and eleven but i i wanna pull up their schedule last year because i'm pretty sure at the end of the year they were winning allergy points against well. They beat chicago and they beat. They crushed the redskins. I should've beaten philly on the road beat san francisco in tampa and then lost their last three games two of which they lost by point two two playoff teams the colts and the cowboys. I don't i think the cowboys had anything to play for and that season finale if my memory serves me correctly but if the steelers are good and the steelers are playoff if the steelers the bell and brown then i think that's a statement of i agree the giants. It's interesting that you say that the the giants you know. They got rid of a lot out of players that i still can't figure out why they got rid of those players when you think about them. I don't know why they would have gotten rid of olivier. Vernon like that guy is a beast and do they really have his replacement. You know the snacks harrison vernon <hes> landon collins letting him go. They got rid of talented players on defense that made them pretty capable defensive team the last few dave gettleman. Dave gettleman put his his his butt on the line. I mean he he. He's already being ridiculed before they even play a game. Because of some of the personnel decisions he's made in somebody guys that he's kissed off like landon collins yes well we'll inland to collins's made it very he's going after he's going after they've already promised super bowls you know he's already gotten caught up into the racket that he's over promising and under delivering and ashburn promising not one super bowl but two and dys he's he's promised that he's going to destroy his former team for being so disrespect and he's going to get the general manager and he's gonna knock the general manager of the ground in pre game warm warm ups the giants here here early in training camp have had a two big losses at wide receiver sterling shepherd shirt and then golden take suspended for a few games so i they've got saquon barkley. I think eli manning still has something left. I think i'm the only person that believes that they've upgraded their offense. I agree with you and they've got tim young talent on defense. It's not proven talent in peppers who they got back in that trade right they got your peppers back right erin yeah and then they drafted after the the <hes> the defensive linemen from clemson <hes> with their second pick you know because they picked <hes> the quarterback overall first and then dexter extra warrants so i think the giants could be better. I think eli manning is a better quarterback than most people think. I think daniel jones is going to be a better quarterback than most people think. I think the one thing i do have a question about is i. I have no idea of pat. Shurmur is a good good point have noise either yeah. Have you seen some of the early things being said about daniel jones training camp. It's training camp. I mean we we don't know what's really means but the overall there was a story i read. I'm gonna gonna forget where i read it. It was last week. I don't think i've mentioned it on the podcast or or the radio show but i read it <hes> and it was basically quoting various people around on the league anonymously about daniel jones and the net of it was most of the elite insiders think that the giants got got it right and had no problem with dave gettleman reaching for jones where he reached for them. It is the media in the fans that were you know. Are you kidding me. You passed on dwayne haskins for this guy from duke. You picked him here. You could have got him at seventeen in a lot of the league insiders think the gentleman is is going to be proven right on daniel jones that he may not be an elite quarterback but he's going to be solid good top half of the league starter it with a long career and they said bottom line is you can't take the chance. If you think you've got your guy. When it comes to a quarterback on waiting until will your next pick seventeenth overall right wasn't it the giants had a jones at six in they had seventeen for dexter lawrence correct that was right right so and they said a lot of the league insider said despite what some people were reporting that he wouldn't have been picked before seventeen they believe believe that denver and or washington or somebody else would have selected jones before the giants got on the clock at seventeen and the inside view anonymously from league league exacts in league. <hes> people in the league is that the giants are going to be proven right on daniel jones. It is what it have been interesting and i think it would have gotten ugly. If daniel jones wasn't picked with the six pick and was available at fifteen well. That would have gotten a little bit ugly. Well we know again. Whoa from what we know and what's been reported. The football people didn't have dwayne haskins with a first round grade raid and if it was i run. It was super late in the first round more like a second round. They liked him. They just didn't like him. At fifteen they liked their guy really was montas sweat but remember sweat was falling because of the heart conditioning stuff and some of the other stuff that was <hes> you know leading up to the draft about potentially being difficult to coach etcetera <hes> <hes> i did. I mean i'm not the only person learn this. I think was my blanket underneath from his p._i._n. Channel four diane and resilient of who i i love diana diana you know also i think had the report that some in the organization like jones more than haskins wins in the end. I also learned that at least a couple of the football people liked rosen in a trade more than jones or haskins but whatever what you t- times going matter because cole mccoy is your quarterback baby none of that matters so that's at the top of my list for you today took us awhile to get to it and i wanna just mention stamps dot com because the show today is brought to you by stamps dot com if you're a small business like the kevin sheehan show joe is the podcast you stamps dot com and i'm serious about this because it's totally built for small businesses it seven hundred thousand small businesses. This is right now. Including this one used stamps dot com. You don't have time to go to the post office. You're busy and you've got reasons to send out out invoices ship out products you know even if you're a warehouse in a bigger business in your sending out thousands of packages a day stamps dot com handles it all with ease you simply use your computer. You print official u._s. Postage twenty four hours a day seven days a week for any letter package any class of male anywhere you want to send it wants. Your mail is ready. Just hand it to your mail carrier or drop it off in a mail box. It's that simple with stamps dot com you get five cents off every first class stamp and up to forty percents off priority mail. It's a no brainer saves you time in money. It's one of the most popular time saving tools for small businesses right now. Now my listeners our listeners get a special offer right now. It's a four week trial which gives you free postage and a a digital scale without any long term commitment. Just go to stamps dot com. Click on the microphone at the top of the homepage and type in kevin d. See that's k. e. v. i n. D. c. stamps dot com enter my code kevin d._c. Yet colt mccoy tommy. That's at the top of my list for when tom he gets in cole mccoy number one on the depth chart the official depth chart <hes>. Do you think he's got a chance to start at the opener well. I think he has a chance yeah. I think he has a chance. I think he's got more of a chance talking to some people know yeah. I i think look let me just get the truth in front of some of the illusion that comes out from time to time. I've liked colt mccoy for two reasons one. He had we at his post game a press conference after he led them to a win when he came out who hasn't had you with their posts conference like r._g. Three when he started to let the planes landed and indulge and you sit oh my god. This guy is just the best when i was in full time colt with that cold was so emotional and that moment so much cowboy monday nike it it was the tennessee when he came in. He ran to win for him and that post game press conference. I was so so impressed with that and got to know a little bit but that's not why. I thought that he would wind up being redskins starter at some point. I i learned how much jay gruden liked him and that was the whole thing. I knew if the head coach like this guy. There's got to be something to i think jay gruden is. It's a good judge of quarterback. He's a better judge than i am house that so my whole thing about cole mccoy was more because i knew the head coach wanted him to play liked him. A lot really loved the way he ran his offense and so we're at that point now. This is the the only thing getting in the way of cole mccoy. <hes> starting at this point are bandages and splints which are even money to be part of the conversation. I had worked with that. I agree with all that this is why i'm not jumping up and down <hes> you know celebrating aden for up to high heaven because he is so fragile he soap breakable so you know it's surprising as we're sitting here talking about it. It's first time i've thought about i i michael phillips on the radio showed. It actually really like michael. I think he really lets loose like he's. He doesn't worry about <hes> you know. Piss anybody off and you know. I think it's not you know i. It's not surprising that dwayne haskins according to everybody. That's been down there in his talk. Coach's isn't ready yet that it's coming along slowly for him. It is surprising however what michael phillips told me today and that is that it's coming along very slowly slowly for case keenum now. He doesn't know the system either. He's going to be behind the eight ball with coal if colt was healthy and ready to start camp because colts been in the system since it's twenty fourteen but case keenum when they made the trade for case keenum when bruce made the trade for case keenum which turned out to be nothing trade in terms of what they gave up i swap of sixth and seventh round picks in they got there on the hook for three and a half million in base salary. If he didn't make the team they wouldn't even be on the hook. Look for that <hes> but when that trade was made i think it was made with the understanding that we we've got to have a backup plan. If we don't get our quarterback in the draft <hes> or even potentially via trade you know for a josh rosen or or somebody else <hes> and and we i know that colt can't really start sixteen games. We're not even sure for confident and kirk starting sixteen games. Let's get somebody cole. I'm sorry colt. Did i say herkus. Sorry sorry about that. I've always got kirk on the brain and everybody was just screamed and center there podcasts but you know apparently the other part of that and i didn't know this at the time the case keenum trade unlike the alex smith trade that jay gruden was lukewarm on jay gruden really liked case keenum a year ago. He thought that that could be another guy to bring into the mix. <hes> once kirk was gone before bruce made the trade for alex smith <hes> but i guess the surprising thing is that right now at least according to the people that i've talked to cases pretty far behind colt i maybe maybe it shouldn't be a surprise this early in camp but if we get to the third preseason game and we're hearing that colts got a substantial lead on case keenum i would suggest to you that it's possible that case keenum won't be on the roster on opening day that they might try to move them especially. If a team is desperate for a veteran backup up so you think that they they wouldn't go with three quarterbacks. Jay doesn't like to go with this situation to go with three quarterbacks because you've got the franchise down the road quarterback right but but do you think there'd be a mentality among people in the organization that say well okay okay. We'll live with dwayne. Haskins not being starter but you're not going to bury him at number three tommy. I don't want him buried at number three okay. I don't want him buried at number three. I don't get the part of the fan base. That seems so willing to go along with a plan that says sit him for a year. That's fine e patient. Let's err on the side of patients. I wanna see this dude play. He's the future he's the light at the end of the tunnel if he's not not ready to start against philadelphia play against the the bears the cowboys or the patriots in week five that's fine but i think i've referenced this with you before referenced it multiple times on the podcast the conversation that i had with this guy chris ray-ban from the action network who did a ton of research on quarterbacks from in two thousand five through the end of last year that essentially suggested that if you don't play a lot of games in your rookie season as a highly drafted quarterback it's because either you're sitting behind brady or farve or you're not very good. You know mahomes is the only exception to that rule well. He sat behind alex smith and you can make the case and i would make the case too and this guy did that. He probably didn't need to sit behind alex smith after what we saw on your to <hes> <hes> and maybe the chiefs even blue opportunity in a super bowl window opportunity by playing alex smith in two thousand seventeen instead of mahomes but but i want to see the dude play if you tell me in week eight and their two and six that he's still third on the depth chart with three quarterbacks or that he's not ready. That's telling them it's not telling now but it would be telling then whence goth mariota winston you know all all of these quarterbacks that have last year darnold josh allen <hes> mayfield they haven't sat for no one's been sitting for a year now. Now i agree with that. Joe is says. I know that that's not really what the recent trend is. The recent trend is if you're highly drafted quarterback then you you you have a future you are ready at some point in that first year to take eight games nine games ten games of of starting play well if you trae case keenum if view go into the season would colt mccoy and dwayne haskins. You'll see twain haskins. Yes you will you'll see him. He'll be starting for this team right <hes> at at some point during the season and then it'll be his team. I'll tell you what if caught mccoy didn't get hurt for the first time you'd still see dwayne haskins. 'cause you know i love colt as a guy. I just don't see it as a guy that can really you know. Take them to an nine ten win. Suck it. Whoever plays quarterback isn't ain't gonna come out of that first five games with a winning record at the very minimum more likely than not i guess so really is healthy and places best. He's not going to beat the eagles on the road. He's not going to beat the patriots. He's probably not going to beat the bears and probably not going to beat the cowboys but do you you by the way i i would bet keenum is not traded and i just suggested here they should go with recline suggesting that if he's way behind colt well and he doesn't really grasp it quickly enough to give jay gruden the confidence that there may be a contending team same sort of <hes> thing with you know with williams. There may be a contending team that needs a backup that isn't comfortable with their own backup or has a starter you go down in preseason early in the season and ends up offering you know a shitload for for case keenum or a lot more than you'd think that's what i would do at trent williams is well. The redskins start need to start accumulating future picks by leveraging a couple of key players. They have case keenum's not a great player but he plays very important position. He's played it at a level that could make them attractive to a team. That's desperate but back to haskins moment. Do you agree with me that it seems uh-huh that a lot of people seem resigned to <hes> haskins sitting for much of if not not the entire his entire rookie season and being okay with it and that that's not a good thing. I don't think that's a good thing i don. He better play this year and there's context cole. Mccoy stays healthy and they're eight and three and they're having this incredible season. Okay well then. He's not gonna play but if they're three and eight or they're two and five. I wanna see that dude out there. I understand that you know the the reaction. I get from people on social media media and what i read is <hes> that if case keenum is the starter they're more comfortable with wayne haskins sitting but if colt mccoy is the starter there through the roof angry they they don't wanna see that i mean colt mccoy's reputation among redskins fans is so low in terms of his ability to play that. I think that they that that's some people can live with a haskins sitting behind case keenum. They can't live with him sitting behind colts. Yeah i see i know what you're saying and i. I do think that the majority of the fan base feels that way about colt not personally but just in terms has as a starter as a quarterback in that they'd rather see somebody else elsa case keenum if it's not going to be haskins but i do think that the majority of the fan base seems to be okay with the franchise being super super patient with haskins and i am not in favor of playing with these nowhere near ready to play. I think that that could be something that ends up being detrimental title detrimental to his career but what i'm saying and you still have an answer. I just want to get a a clear cut answer from you if they're two and five two and six and they still tell you that haskins isn't ready. Do you think that that would be an indication of something. That you know isn't good long-term i to be telling i'd say it was a red flag. Put redskins park ran at red flags along time they don't. They don't have any pink flags. I don't know what october yeah. I don't know what color they've used. They've been using the white flag <hes> on occasion. Wanna see the dude plate but but if if they get through that early part of the their schedule schedule pretty banged up and with a losing record than yet. It's time to see the kid play. I think it's i think it would be time to see see and plate look. I've said this a million sometimes in it pisses some some of you off next. Year's quarterback class is first rate on paper with herbert with two with from <hes> and i'm forgetting somebody there aaron but if for whatever reason you're not going to learn anything about dwayne haskins without him playing in regular season games period. You've got to see him play eight nine ten plus regular season games so if you get to the end of that in your like hey we got something something here fine then. You don't have to worry about a quarterback if you've got a top five pick next year but if you get through eight nine ten games and you're like whoa this is a long long way to go well. This is the position just like arizona did with rosen and cuyler maury where you say to hell with who we took a year ago. We've seen in for ten plus games. We don't feel confident in them and we think to is going to be a star and we got a chance to draft him at three overall all next year. You gotta learn something this year about your quarterback about your rookie quarterback and here's the least amount you would learn kind of competitor. He is by putting them out there if he isn't ready how how competitive izzy what kind of creator izzy. How does he handle the adversity. You know as a rookie quarterback. You need to learn those things. I'm not saying that if they're seven and three with colt that you bench him or with case you bench him just to put him in there then. I just don't think they will be seven talk with either one of those two. I don't think there will be either now. We have to take this into account because it's it's the redskins what about the business factor of empty seats at fedex field to open the season. What about that well again the n._f._l. Did the redskins a solid by scheduling the cowboys bears and patriots as their first three home games which is going to really boost attendance with the opponents fans. You think that's going on the diffuse some of that well. I mean i can just tell you from dollars and cents standpoint. They're going to do better with dallas chicago england as their first three home games than they did last year with indianapolis. I can't remember what the second home game was but they didn't. Have you know they have the colts is the for the packers the second home game and then the panthers is the third a better start. Yes it is in terms of their home schedule. The packers helped last year. I don't remember with the crowd was the cowboy game was not completely sold out but it was close and and we have we have this year you think he sold out. I think you're albouy. Fans are really fired up and i think bear fans are really fired. The cowboys game will be sold out. I think there's a chance both of them will be sold out with sixty percent plus of the stadium being packed with the opponents fans bear fans. Are the chicago chicago bears. Fans are as excited about this team is they've been in a long time and by the way i think they've got good reason. I think they do too. I'll just be real curious about how the business factor plays into the quarterback decision because you're kidding yourself if you don't think it's a factor <hes> well. Oh you know what if it's a factor then why was dwayne haskins third on this unofficial depth chart they would've taken advantage of that opportunity for them higher in the del sol some take hoyer has has i mean because jay gruden has controlled the depth chart well that that's what that's all jay. Gruden cats control when it comes to the quarterback back but the training camp depth chart but if if you're you're if you're right and i'm not suggesting that this isn't a possibility i i do think that there is a chance that dwayne haskins comes in against cleveland on thursday night the fourth quarter in goes eight for nine and bruce and dan say go get him. They don't need to worry about goes. After chart. This kid could sell himself yet but if they were really like all dialed in on revenue and ticket kit sales then with this unofficial depth chart they would have said jay put join at the top who cares where he is right now. We'll get people fired up. We might sell some tickets 'cause there's. They certainly didn't sell any extra tickets pudding cult for wayne third no they didn't you're right. What did you make of honest honest. J. directed jay saying no chance or highly doubt trading trent williams. I i think that was <hes> him speaking in the moment. I think they're gonna wind up trading trent williams because i think they're going to have to i think i don't i think he's going to report. I think he's going to sit out the seas. I'm surprised you didn't pick up on what that meant. Okay are usually much more perceptive than that. Let me help you with you know. It's a little bit early the morning still embiid with this one. That's bruce allin bruce allin. Tommy is in there saying f him and he this medical bullshit and this contractor charley casserly. Did you hear what he said to j. P. feeling on his podcast yesterday now said it's all about money all about money any nothing about medical. I don't know if charlie no something or fees just speaking from experience but i think bruce allen has told this organization. We're we're not budging. Remember what less carpenter story said last week they are going to try to bleed him dry and make him suffer the pain of not getting a game sunday check and he'll come back bruce's stubborn like that tommy i think the best thing to do would be to have him actively on the trade bloc waiting waiting for the offer that you can't turn down also simultaneously saying get your ass in here. We need you and by the way you need to be here here. If t to play the redskins could trade him when the regular season starts even if he's in but i think with jay gruden said is yeah <hes>. We're not trading them. I know bruce and once he gets his heels dug in on something like this he doesn't wanna lose that battle. I also think so. I'm surprised that you didn't pick up on that. <hes> the other part of that is that they feel and i've heard this that they would be setting a terrible precedent of leading the player win. You know bruce doesn't want players or agents to win. I just don't think trent williams. I think trent williams outlier. There's no other player that would have his is kind of leverage right now. There's no cop so therefore it's not a precedent you have a player whether you agree with with charlie casserly or not you have a player that according to all reports and according to some of his former teammates like dangelo hall is basically said the redskins medical staff it. You can't trust the people who take care of. You and i don't want to play for them anymore. I don't trust is them. That's a precedent setter. I mean how can you think of how many holdouts have been because the star player basically through sub sub channels not directly yet. He hasn't spoken directly hasn't done anything social media wise it your surrogates through friends indited if he's done it rather than them breaking his confidence right basically indicted the redskins medical staff. I mean that's never been done before and that's my memory anywhere. I'm hearing that it's been trashed the reputation of their doctors in particular but also their trainers is have been trashed without legitimate justification that does it matter. I understand. I understand that i was right. Okay but put aside who's right <hes> if and i suggested this to you last we can missed out on something so obvious which neilan rockville pointed out to me after the show on thursday that we did and that is the redskins can't speak to this right now because of hip because of privacy you can you can speak to generalities of your medical. I guess you could do that. That can't speak specifically william so you can't do that but you can defend your medical people. The redskins announced <hes> just the other day. Okay yesterday yeah yesterday a partnership with a company that called them and official health and wellness partner of the washington redskins now. It's it's a medical bill review company but if you're in accounting but if you're in the medical business at this point do you want to be announced as a partnership of the official health and wellness partner with the redskins when their star player is basically saying to health and wellness staff of the redskins is garbage and and i don't trust them and i don't want to play for them. Why would you want to be in business with that team. Do you know you know this right that the redskins training staff earned the training staff of the year award in the n._f._l. In february okay they got the two thousand eighteen ed block courage award n._f._l. N._f._l. athritis athletic training staff of the euro. What's the narrative right now. I understand with the narrative is perception is reality. That's fine but you know what the perception in is. Among coaches and players in the league is gonna be interesting well. It's that we don't wanna play for that organization but this gives them this. This gives them a reason that need a lot of other reasons but money always spoke over the other reason not recently this is this is something different this visit this this i mean this is basically accusing them in a way of malpractice and you know what the timing of it with the colt mccoy quoi infection after his surgery in the alex smith infections after his surgery. It all gets put together in oh my god. They got this major issue. I've just been told that that issue hugh isn't an issue that they've got good doctors good training staff and they won this award for training staff and they've had people come in because of the two straight years of horrific injury problems looms in two thousand seventeen in two thousand eighteen and review what they're doing outside consultants and they've said look bad fortune more than anything else. I'm not saying by the way and we talked about at this last week. I'm not saying that trent williams doesn't have justification for the way his situation was handled by the team and maybe the team feels like he he his justification is really very thin <hes> because they suggested to him two years ago. Let's get this thing. Look at whatever. I'm just saying you're right. It's it's it's right now. Perception becomes reality <hes> but <hes> there are other reasons that free agents in coaches have stayed away from this organization that have nothing to do with medical training staff. I think in this day and age where you've got an organization that's accused by player with the stature of trent williams of being a poor medical operation. I think the damage is is irreparable. I don't see how he can come back to play. I don't see how he can come back to play for them. The only thing michael phillips said j._p. Finley's told me either guys that are covering the team is that they still have this impression talking to people that money could solve all this but i don't think bruce is going to give him a new deal and by the way i don't think he should give trump williams a new deal. I don't think that's the way the redskins should go. I don't think that's the right move for their future. Let them at that point. Nobody none of these people are likely talking to trent so nobody really knows <hes> right so that's the thing that's interesting about this too. <hes> <hes> is that in this day and age of players you know in controversial situations or you know being publicly discussed. He's not responding responding via social media not not his agent. Not nobody and you know what that's now. As you said and neil rockville pointed this out to me earlier today he has had had people on his behalf. If you believe that dangelo hall was speaking on his behalf or others to jason lockenfora which is where the original reports came out that he's leaking stuff off through people or perhaps he's had conversations with friends and those friends have leaked information. I don't know here's what you do know. It's very unusual in two thousand nineteen for a player going through what trent williams is going through to be completely silent publicly. It is sell this redskins are silent too so so this is a different situation that tells you this is something different. It's a different case yeah. It tells you that the medical which is what i learned last week is easib is a big part of this thing charlie cast whether you think it's justified or not. What do you think it's fair or not. It really doesn't matter. It's what trent williams thinks yep. I i agree <hes>. I wanted to talk to you <hes> about kirk cousins in this story that adam killed or wrote in the post on sunday because it's actually sleep for people like me who actually root for cousins <hes>. It was a bit disturbing on but we do that real quickly <hes> do that. I'm sorry after a real quickly talk about wants workplaces in bethesda. If you are looking for new office space and you live in upper northwest but as chevy chase potomac just over the american legion aijun bridge in northern virginia consider launch workplaces in bethesda they just opened up a brand new spot fully furnished offices co working desks high speed internet. They've got a cafe twenty four seven access and free parking and plenty of it go to launch workplaces dot com to check out all all of their facilities including the new facility in bethesda yesterday when we did the show that crashed and didn't get out <hes>. I talked about this but i'm actually glad you're here and i can save it for you. I i read <hes> adam kilgore's story in the post on sunday about kirk cousins <hes> a story titled burden of proof <hes> and then what do you call. What do you call this under the headline the subheading yeah subheading subheading <hes> after signing kirk cousins the ascending vikings didn't return to the playoffs this year a new offensive philosophy could help both parties meet great expectations and i'll get to the part that that disappoints me as a kirk cousins fan and worries me as a cousin fan in a moment but some of the things <music>. I'm not sure everybody realizes they just saw that. The vikings went eight seven and one off of a n._f._c. off of the n._f._c. championship season the year before and they didn't make the postseason and they blame it on kirk well the truth of the matter. There was a lot going on like tony soprano. Their offensive line coach drop dead before the season started very tragic a very good position coach and they had a banged up offensive line that turned out to be last year either the second worst offensive align in the league or the worst. The giants in the vikings were one in one a in terms of bad offensive lines. They couldn't run the football last year. Their defense wasn't nearly as good as it was in two thousand seventeen they had very good receivers feeling and digs and by the way for all of you that keeps suggesting that the redskins should just trade trent williams for stefan fundings. They just signed digs to this massive deal last year. They can't trade him. If they trade him. They'll have an insane salary cap hit based based on the acceleration over the <hes> over the next two seasons in trading digs that report remember that his brother tweeted trayvon digs reported that you know that you will remember that thing erin learn from the spring when people blew it up on the internet because digs was holding some redskins helmet or something and his brother tweeted out that picture was raven tweet out something about the redskins yeah yeah so. He's not getting traded. They're not trading stuff on dick's but anyway back to the cousins story that adam kilgore wrote so cousins last year statistically had his best season <hes> he threw for forty three hundred yards thirty touchdowns ten interceptions is best touchdown to interception interception ratio ratio of his career seventy point. One percent completion percentage had some monster games at green bay early. We drove him down. The field down eight through the touchdown pass the two point conversion and then the field goal kicker miss to kicks one at the end of regulation and one in overtime they ended up tying the packers at lambeau had a phenomenal nominal game in a loss at <hes> los angeles against the rams and the coliseum four hundred and twenty five yards four touchdowns in that game and the defense couldn't stop the rams rams in that game had big games early and then faltered late he had to horrific games against the bears have very good defensive team but all they needed was one of those games against the bears to get into the postseason and he couldn't deliver and he didn't play well and either one of those games but one of the things that kilgore focuses on <hes> is the the fact that kirks overall record career record against teams with a winning record and this is what all of you anti kirk people always point to an it's true. It's it's a fact five hundred twenty six all time that's pretty bad against teams with a winning record and this is what i wanted to get to first of all before i get to the response to that his response to that. They've got a new offensive coordinator. Kevin stefanski repair replace john de filippo filippo had him in shotgun no play action last year throwing sixty percent of the time that's not kirk. Kirk needs play action. They were twenty-seventh in the league last year and play action throws yet. He was second in the league behind breeze in play action production when they went play action. Kirk was at his best like we saw him. Jay gruden but <hes> d- felipo dropped him back accolade had him in a lot of shotgun s- fancies come in gary kubiak come in and they're very bullish on this new system for kirk in minnesota but in response response to the record against winning teams <hes> cousins said the following he says quote you gotta peel back that stat a little bit <hes> he in kilgore writes he doesn't run from it but he doesn't accept it either quote you gotta beat winning teams eventually right but how many of those games because that includes some years in washington right were we the favourite most of them. We weren't picked to win. So then we don't win and it's like he didn't win <hes> by the way of those thirty one games that he's five and twenty six in against winning teams they were favored everton seven of the thirty one between washington and minnesota his record in the games in which they were favored in is one in six so in those games that he was favored to beat a winning winning team <hes> he still didn't deliver <hes> in their words that other quote that i wanted to to read <hes> wow this is this is it's like a defendant given out allocution allocution whenever they call it in a quarter of a law well so what i wanted to say was he's got to stop. Stop with these. You know very subtle. Excuse making situations in interviews interviews about last season. He's got own at one of the things that has bothered me about kirk. Cousins in the last couple of years going back to the redskins year is that it is true. I've never denied this that occasionally in big spots he hasn't come through and he has an elevated his his team. You know around him in a big situation now in some gain he it's not that he hasn't done it. Go back to two thousand fifteen. He did it multiple times including adding next saturday night game in philadelphia two two to clinch a playoff berth you know three hundred and thirty five yards and four touchdowns and one of his best games of his career but last year against the bears and that season finale he was bad and he didn't do anything to elevate his team. He didn't create plays. He didn't look like he was fighting to his death to to get into the postseason. He's very process oriented. We always hear that about him. In sometimes he's way too analytical. It's you know the old analysis that leads to paralysis and i think that that's him that he's got too much of that in him. Sometimes and on this you know subtle excuse on well. How many of those games were favored. You gotta own that you're five and twenty six against winning record teams own it and say i'm gonna try to do better and i think that the excuse making is all part of his over analysis and his you know he he gets deep into this stuff and i think sometimes sometimes it's the people who are completely oblivious to the stuff like flacco you know who deliver in the clutch and i think some of that is his personality and he's either the personality changes or he's just going to be a good quarterback that can never elevate beyond nat and he'll be good when he's on good teams around him. I do think that that's n- that's the floor for him. You know on a good team is that he's a good quarterback back on a good team if he's not a bad team he's gonna have he's going to it's going to have some rough times but i don't know if he takes that next jump without getting getting away from thinking this way. What do you think y'all. I'm trying to think about quarterbacks who have been championship quarterbacks. Who have i've basically been cut from the same mould <hes> guys who who tried to distance themselves from their failures and i can't think of any off the top of my head. Well you know when you think about the all time greats. <hes> steve young was very analytical. He was super analytical as a a quarterback really into a lot of the minutia very very bright. <hes> also just a bad ass quarterback order back but think about it was marino brilliant was he over analytical. No was montana brilliant over analytical. No <hes> in recent years the painting was peyton was peyton was yeah. Peyton peyton definitely was an but brady isn't doesn't seem to be brady isn't that way rivers isn't that way now. Rivers hasn't won it benz not that way now in recent aaron rodgers can be a little bit right but for the most part there is a there's like an there's an edge you know look comparing him to some of the greats of all time in the game is not what anybody's ever made him out to be including his fans hands like me. I've always said he's not elite. He's never going to be an elite quarterback but he can be a very good quarterback. If you put a good team around him and you can win with them would bothers me. Is this stuff. He had a very good season last year but you know statistically but he didn't elevate his team in the key moments last year. I think even less so last year than in washington look in washington. He had no running game to speak of in a terrible bill defense in two thousand fifteen twenty sixteen and even twenty seventeen not early in two thousand seventeen but for the most part terrible defense for the majority of the year last shear they they were struggling around him but man at times he looked jumpy. He looked skittish and those times were in <music> in games that were big against good teams. It's bad form. It's a bad look for him to to make that kind of statement and and like you said he should own up to his record his teammates would respect him or if he did his opponents would respect more to people who don't like them even would respect expect more if if he did <hes> and you know look mike shanahan has said you can win a super bowl with kirk cousins. I'm not so sure you can say that anymore. <hes> i think i still believe that i still believe that about him and i would not be surprised with a better offense of scheme in coordinator in the kubiak system system that he has a big year this year <hes> but you know there's been too much of that too much of yeah you you know i. I don't beat winning teams but you know how many of those games were. We actually supposed to win to begin with. You know you have to peel it back. Stop being analytical when it comes to things like that own five and twenty six. Don't talk about the fact that you were an underdog in a lot of those games and by the way the fact that in many of those games you weren't the reason you're team lost. You were the reason you're team actually had a chance which was the case here in washington with a horrible defense when they they won when they lost a lot of close games against teams with winning records because their defense in their kicker was atrocious. You know in missing big kicks but you can't it. You know that that's that's a number that's attached to him right now and if in trying to explain it away i think reveal something about about a flaw in his character a flaw in his competitiveness. Yeah i mean look at his coaching situation. Last year could have been in a disaster it it. It sounds like it was kind of it was for for his first year with the organization to have that much instability <hes> on the offensive coaching side of the ball. I'm sure heard him yet but he's not going to. He's not going to hang coaches out to dry but then your your explanations should did they. It's on me you shouldn't be looking for. Someone throws anybody else. He doesn't but he did he. He's not taking it this he he this is the thing that really gets under his skin. You know because if we went back and looked at all thirty one of those games against winning teams i would bet i bet you any amount of money. I did it when he was in washington that if you go game by game in the majority of those games he was actually really good and he had a terrible defense or dustin hopkins missed a thirty one yard field goal in overtime or miss two field goals in detroit or missed two field goals on thanksgiving against the cowboys boys when he threw for five hundred yards or whatever through four on thanksgiving day that year <hes> but it's it's just revealing and there've been a couple of these situations sion's with him over the last couple of years that that definitely you know as a fan of him and is a guy that i'd like to see him succeed because why tommy because i want to be right of corey wasn't be right about where she want to be right and by the way in many ways i i'm already right because most of you said he wasn't even a starter order that he shouldn't even be in the league and i said no. This guy can start and be a top half of the league quarterback <hes> but anyway <hes>. Let's it on him. Okay what i'm i'm looking for something that you mentioned about <hes> dustin hopkins i mean you mentioned dustin hopkins and this is an accom- i wrote i write for warpath. Ask the publication the redskins publications since when i've been right for them for years. You've never told me that well yeah. I do lots of things. I don't tell you. I swear to god. I never knew do that. Well and i wrote a column about redskins. Who will pass milestones this year probably over the course of the season on the all time career accomplishment commit list and dustin hoffman's is is fourth all time on the redskins kicking. We ninety nine field goals. He'll probably move up to third this year and about twenty five years the kicking issues they've had yeah so. I mean so it's remarkable. That doesn't hopkins's third. We'll be one low miller to taking. I believe so i just know that he'll pass he'll pass kurt nights wind up third on on the list and trust way and this isn't a surprise he'll probably move up to second and go by matt turk in second place with third three hundred eighty eight punts for the most points jeff as is in the top of that list or mike bragg. <hes> mike bragg is probably at the top of the list. <hes> look dustin hopkins and he's got a big leg. He's hit some clutch kicks before but you know those seasons when they had another chance to get to the playoffs in two thousand sixteen which by the way and i mentioned this in recent days in trump williams got suspended for four games down the stretch that season but that particular year was the year that on thanksgiving he missed. I a huge kick in dallas in detroit. He missed a huge kick. The cincinnati game he missed two kicks in the london game including the short worked one to win in overtime got. Was there ever a tied. It felt more like a law. Oh my god that's bengals los angeles loss <hes> and so you know you've had some of that with him <hes> over the years <hes> but but but anyway <hes> that's enough about it. Let's talk about what's going on. What do you think all now we can. We can we have doing podcast thursday or not yeah. We're doing podcast. There's okay. I'll it's going to say before the game. Yeah we'll talk about. We'll talk about the game before thursday <hes> i did want to. I had to other things that i wanted to do with you. In that is <hes> cliff branches passing which i and i talked about this on the radio today. Those raiders teams the seventies. You and i love the n._f._l. From the seventies and the eighties those raiders teams of the seventies were just so much touch fun to watch in cliff. Branch was the al davis wide receiver. He was the guy that they that lamonica not lamonica he didn't throw it to him but stabler and then eventually plunkett could just throw the bomb to cause that's the raiders of the seventies and eighties the al davis raiders for those of you that don't don't know just win. Baby <hes> were teams that thrived on menacing defense and an offense where you had a quarterback with a big arm that would throw the bomb. That's what he wanted. He wanted to stretch the field and throw the bomb and cliff branch was his best speed receiver and one of the great speed receivers of all time in certainly of that era. He's not a hall of famer. Cliff branches not a hall of famer but he's had maneuverable games in memorable moments. He tommy i talked about this and this to me is one of the great regular season games in in redskins history. The redskins in nineteen eighty three played the raiders twice. They played the raiders at r._f._k. In the regular season and then they played him in the super bowl super super bowl eighteen. The game at our ks one of the great regular season games in redskins history. They trailed thirty five to twenty in the fourth quarter by fifteen points not no two point conversion back acton and they came back and they wanted thirty seven to thirty five <hes> thighs mindy joe washington late but cliff branch in that game had the longest you know tied with other the longest pass reception touchdown in n._f._l. History ninety nine yards from jim plunkett and then by the way caught a touchdown in that super bowl when he torched anthony washington you know in that super bowl <hes> by the way the big difference between the regular season in the super bowl is that michael haynes was not on the raiders. <hes> and marcus salom didn't play in the first game against the redskins in the both were there for the super bowl game but i i just clip branches passing at seventy one years old just reminded minded me of those great raider teams of the seventies. I loved watching those writer teams. I'll look there. Were there were a group of great a._f._c. Teams of the seventies the raiders leaders people forget that the patriots were a double digit win team under steve grogan that they had raymond clayborn that stanley morgan that john hannah hannah and so they had the raiders were there the colts were right there with bert jones yeah but you're missing the steelers the steelers dolphin and the the dolphins when i'm trying to i was mentioning the ones that people forget right and those are the patriots and the colts and as far as clipper is the colts have a better seventies in the patriots probably probably yeah but the pulse were better franchise in the seventies in the patriot. It takes me close the patriots hat. The patriots didn't become good until seventy six. The colts were first of all. Oh yeah in the early one seventy one and then you know were a multiple playoff team reminder with bert jones. Yes yeah put up the patriots under grogan. Were very entertaining very competitive. You mentioned we talked about cliff branch. I go back back to the days of warren wells right who was clermont ranch before cliff branch talk about a a deep threat at wide receiver you the one thousand nine hundred sixty nine. He averaged twenty six point eight yards cats and that was the raiders yes and all he played for the rangers four seasons. How many catches i don't know fourteen touchdowns okay and all four years. He played for the raiders he the average twenty yards a catch and all four seasons while that's so they've always had the vertical game and everyone thinks cliff branch and rightly so because he was a lot of fun to watch. Would i go back to the war and wells days by the way i'm just looking at the patriots. The first good year for the patriots who seventy six they went eleven and three in loss that very eric controversial game on the late hit unstable. We by the way is one of those calls that totally decided not only a playoff game but the eventual super bowl champ all upset about the saint game. Go back and watch stabler get hit in it. It's not roughing the passer shouldn't have been called roughing the passer and and the patriots lost that game and then they're only other playoff season to the seventies was seventy eight they went eleven and five <hes> and lost in the playoffs then and then and they made that you know obviously in eighty five they made that saif rise run with only easson to the super bowl when they beat the dolphins in the a._f._c. championship game what else you got us. Yes <hes> what else do. I have the nets last night. I'm i'm assuming you didn't stay up. You go to sleep pretty early. <hes> do you know how many pitches the giants through last night in baseball game a hundred and fifty two hundred ninety eight pitches really in the game last night against the nats and only gave up four runs and i was talking to zuckerman this. It's morning and i said it's kinda like that. Buccaneer redskin game last year. The bucks were the first team in n._f._l. History to score three or fewer points but have five hundred yards yards and last night the giants had one hundred ninety eight pitches in the game and only gave up four runs but the most amazing part of that game and i watched is the first five or six innings smarter was the starter. Do you know how many pitches he pitched in. Hold on him. I the number just wanna make sure i have the inning count right in four or innings. He threw ninety eight pitches while it's yoga zala start yeah. It was unbelievable. How long these innings were going and yet. The nats only got one run off of those ninety eight pitches against him but eric fed eric fatty. I mean talk about a mystery. Eric fernie was terrible voted previous start. I mean the kind where you say well. I mean they need to give up on this guy and then he turns around and gives them an important game. I mean and that's and that's our fighting right now. The mets are coming light up eleven of twelve now. You've got basically another team within their division. They've got to compete with because the mets are back in their real. You think they're for real either. Just on on a roll made that trump or trade for strom and people are like why are they doing that well. They've got great starting tejan great starting and there's two and a half out in the wild is that's great starting pitching. The mets have great starting pitching it's going to be they picked up. A game on the braves raves last night. I think the these games with the giants are important because then they get the mets for three you know an and that that's now looking like a very difficult road. You you know end to this trip but <hes> nobody should. Nobody should breathe easy until max. Scherzer is on the mound health. I hear you. I mean i mean it's all it's all for naught if shirts her has back problems that keep them from being one hundred percent <hes> i agree <hes> <hes> it's gonna be fun though over these last two months of the regular season to watch this play out because there's a crazy wild card race by the way in both the american league and the national league <hes> so many teams involved in trying to get one of those two wild card spots by the way <hes> there was a report <hes> just getting back to football for a moment moment that zeke elliott is absolutely <hes> apparently giuseppina anderson from e._s._p._n. Essentially said elliott's not reporting to cowboys campaign and is not going to play for the cowboys this year without a new deal. I think melvin gordon sort of feels the same way so right now as a gordon trent williams and zeke yes in god quite reported and gawker way reported. There was a secondary report that said that the cowboys do plan on extending major offers to zeke cooper and dak. They need zeke. Yes say i hope they don't bring zeki. Bring them in and week three after they come here in week too but we're in agreement that you know there are certain yeah. I don't think the chargers need melvin gordon. I think the guy from north western justin jackson is really a good back and could be a potential you know in a very hey good not elite back but a very good back and i think you know you saw some of that <hes> last year when melvin gordon was actually hurt <hes> but i think the cowboys elbows definitely need zeke lesson one thing about the trent williams hold out. I don't think it's going to be as much fun as john. Regan's hold out was you don't think you'll oh come back and say on board back in board broken back now. I don't think i don't think we'll look upon that's right williams. Hold out with this much fond memories as they do the rigo holdout although rigaud sat out an entire yes season in nineteen eighty and the redskins went from being you know seconds away from being the number one seed in the nineteen seventy-nine postseason to going six and ten the following and rigaud left in training camp rego left in training camp in in carlisle because dire. Tau told me the story about how rigel was drunk and banging on his door yelling at talbert saint tabby. They won't pavee. Maybe they won't pay me. I'm gone and then i'm gone and then the next morning talpur woke up and he heard that riggins drove to dulles and left on a plane and never came back that you know all right. You got anything else. That's all i got off all right. <hes> rate us review us. If you're listening on i tunes we'd appreciate that subscribe as well doesn't cost you anything. <hes> i'm back tomorrow. Coolies can actually call in and beyond the podcast tomorrow and tommy will be back on thursday. What i just i mentioned promote. I want mentioned that you could still hear me on the weekends on one. Oh six seven fans. They'll they'll push russell. <hes> yes this weekend with chris russell and and are you on with chad tomorrow. There's nats game tomorrow afternoon. So i've been preempted by that all right well. You can typically listen to tommy with chad on wednesday. You can read me in washington. The times washington times dot com follow me on twitter and facebook and listen to me back on nine eighty seven to ten weekdays on the team nine eighty. Thanks to erin a thanks to all of you back tomorrow.

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Episode 45: Parents!

The Past and the Curious

33:56 min | 4 months ago

Episode 45: Parents!

"All aboard for Family Fund at the Kentucky Railway Museum. Take a nostalgic trip aboard LNM's historic Lebanon branch, special events throughout the year include train robberies dined by rail car, show, and Christmas trains Stroll Museum exhibits include large h o model, train, layout, hand, car, steam, whistles, and much more for more information hop aboard. At Kyi Rail Dot Org or call eight, hundred, two, seven two. One five to the Kentucky Railway, Museum? Volvo. All Right? Okay, let's do this. Welcome to the past curious. My name is Mick Sullivan and this is the forty fifth episode Whoa, I I need to issue an apology forty five episodes in with much chagrin. I I have been unable to access my facebook account since mother's Day, so if you've tried to message me there, well I haven't gotten it more. Embarrassing I found out that the contact form on my actual website, the past and the curious dot com wasn't working like ever. So I had hundreds of messages there that have gone unanswered and I'm very sorry about that. If you emailed I, did not ignore you. I'm just a knucklehead about some things and hope you forgive me. That issue resolved though so back in business. There I'm excited about this episode. It's all about parents. These are some parents who did some pretty cool stuff now. The second story is focused on a family who helped in the underground railroad. It's not graphic in how we talk about. But it is realistic and that's important. I think you're really like hearing it at least I hope so. I also have to thank my friends. Greg and More for lending their excellent voices to the first story they are alight, and they do delightful things including a musical act called. Gazoo. Thanks to you as always. It's a pleasure to create the show for your ears, so let's go. Exploration is dangerous work. There are unknowns challenging landscapes severe weather to contend with, and that's just the tip of the iceberg at extreme locations or just factual, non metaphorical icebergs and everything gets much more difficult. Early. Expeditions to the Arctic and Antarctic circles near the north and South Poles were some of the most incredible undertakings in history. Of course there were plenty of failures, but every time someone tried. It helps the people who came after. Learn a little bit more. By the early nineteen hundreds several different parties from many different places had succeeded in exploring the frigid areas and returning to tell the tale. Eight! Adele Tuck was born not too far from this brutal cold, She I opened her eyes in eighteen ninety in Alaska, not far from the city of nome, which is on the West Central Coast at one time. Alaska was known to Americans as seward's folly because Secretary of State William, seward purchased the land from Russia for seven million dollars in eighteen, sixty seven. People thought it was a terrible mistake and a waste of money, but when golden were discovered, there seward was like who's laughing now y'all seward's folly more like seward's stroke of genius that you all were super wrong about L. K. man. We get it. Anyway Alaska would still not even become an official US territory until Ada was a teenager, she was initiate one of the indigenous groups of people native to land. But growing up, she never learned the survival ways and traditions of her tribe. She was raised by missionaries people who moved to the area to set up a school in order to convert people to their religion. It's a circumstance that happened to many native Americans and as a result, many traditions were lost for generations some forever. In school eight learned to read and write English read the Bible and learned cooking and other domestic skills, the reading and writing served her well, but as you might have guessed in a story about exploration, these domestic skills would not go near as far in helping her as more traditional skills like hunting, tracking and survival might have. As a young adult! Sixteen! She married a man named Jack Black. Jiang. Yep. You heard that, right? Jack Black Jack. No. He was not a cartoon outlaw, nor was he a professional poker player. He was a dog musher hauling freight across Alaska on a sled pulled by dogs. Together! They had three kids. Sadly, only one survived a boy named Bennett. But one day, Jack Blackjack left the family high and dry. Up and left her in the middle of nowhere which in Frigid Alaska can be a pretty serious predicament. Though he was not the greatest of guys she did keep his greatest of names and earned her future fame as Ada blackjack. When Jack blackjack deserted her. She was forty miles from their home in known, and she and Ben Walked the entire way back in the bitter Alaskan cold to make matters worse than it was very sick with burke. And infection of the lungs, so ada quite a small woman carried the boy much of the way. She desperately wanted to get her son treatment for his illness, but could not afford to do so. which must have been a terrible feeling for her? Money was what she needed, so she looked for a way to earn some. Word traveled fast in nome, because there weren't a lot of people there and she caught wind of a unique opportunity. A famous explorer named. Bill. Stephenson. was making plans for an expedition. He was very famous for his Arctic explorations, so the news attracted a lot of attention. Stephenson was planning a trip to Wrangel Island, which is west of Alaska off the northern coast of Siberia. If you know anything about Siberia you know. It is a very cold part of Russian. And wrangel island is north of that. Surrounded by frigid water, which turned to solid ice much of the year Stephenson wanted to claim the island for Canada. He must have missed the memo that it belonged to Russia plus Canada didn't even want it. He heard that though and decided instead to claim it for Great Britain. Feeling bit of allegiance to the crown there. Great Britain's reaction was basically whatever man. We don't really want that island either. For some reason, he didn't really hear that because it remained his plan despite the lack of enthusiasm from the government. This dude just really wanted that island. For young scientists were chosen for the journey, each one feeling very star struck by the explorer and eager to win his favor, but the roster was not yet complete. They need someone else for the year long expedition. Someone to cook. Handle the medical needs repair their extreme weather survival gear, which was mostly reindeer, hide and furs. This teammate wouldn't just be a seamstress, but and. Streams. That was where Ada came in and by the way they had no idea just how extreme she could be. The fifty dollars per month. They were offering was a tremendous amount of money at the time. Still she struggled with the decision, being separated from her beloved child would be agonizing, plus the journey was terrible risk, but if she made it back, she could afford treatment for her son. There were no other options she saw that earned her this much money. It must have been heartbreaking to take her son to the foster home in the best case scenario. She wouldn't see him for a year. Worst case scenario. Who knows, but she knew it was the only way she could save her dear Bennett. She had to take the risk. Ada Bid a tearful goodbye to her only boy and joined the expedition. Stephenson thanked. The five travelers wished the muck and gave them advice. Wait old up. You're not coming with us. No, it's cold, but your the famous explorer. So what do I have to gain I'm already famous. You guys and gals will be fine. They were all pretty horrified to learn. They'd be going without the experienced explorer and immediately their anxiety shot up a few. Despite this? They climbed into the boat. That would take them to the Arctic island for a while. Things were mostly fine. Eight was depressed for the early part, being apart from her child isolated and in a desolate environment was overwhelming. But slowly, she got used to her circumstance and focused on the jobs at hand. The scientists collected information specimens took photographs and planted that British flag in the cold cold ground. But there are six months. Worth of supplies started to disappear. They figured they'd hunt for food. But. They were scientists and not very good hunters. That's not a scientist couldn't have been a good hunter. It's just you know all these scientists weren't. And neither was ADA. She had spent her time learning in a missionary school, but she did what she could. With the change of seasons it started getting incredibly cold ice formed in the sea around the island. The party had little food which makes for a pretty lame party. The five thought it couldn't have gotten worse. Were they right? They were worse than right. They were wrong. One of the guys got sick. He had scurvy and was not doing well. Also and this is the real kicker. There was a boat that was supposed to come. Pick them up. After a year it was called the teddy bear, but the teddy bear couldn't get through all the ice, so they just turned around. Just turned around. And left them. It was decided that the three not sick men would try to make it across the ice of the frozen sea to Siberia and get help. Ada would stay behind and take care of the remaining sick scurvy Cintas. As you expect? Those other men were never seen again. For months eight attended to the sick man. She hated guns but new. She'd need to learn to shoot. Practicing wasn't easy because she couldn't do it too much. The noise arouse the curiosity of wild animals and not the kind. She wanted to hunt. Instead, it brought fearsome polar bears. And those bears can be bad news bears. You've got no real place to hide. Growing increasingly comfortable. She hunted the frozen land. She built a lookout tower to spot the polar bears, coming from miles away, and she even built a rack above her bed for her rifle, so that no bear could surprise her in the middle of the night. When the not sick, but never seen again, scientists left. They didn't take any of their stuff. Left behind was a typewriter which she used to make regular journal entries. They also left all of their photography equipment ADA experimented with the cameras, taking some of the most extreme weather early Selfie of the one thousand nine hundred try as she might, though she was no match for the combined efforts of cold weather and scurvy. The man in her care passed away leaving Ada on. But, she never wavered. She knew she had to survive and get back home to get her son. Cold Ice Wolves and bears were no match for the indomitable spirit of Black Jack. She dressed herself in reindeer skin, Fed herself from the frozen wilderness, protected herself from her lookout perch, and even continued to snap picture of herself with the camera left behind. It was a cold lonely. But She mastered it. Her perseverance paid off Lo and behold one day two years after arriving on the island, she saw a boat. This was the boat that would bring her home. Once again to known the crew was impressed at how she had adapted so greatly to the challenging life, one witness on the ship wrote Blackjack had mastered her environment so far that it seems likely she could have lived there another year, although the isolation would have been dreadful experience. As soon as she got to nome, she found her son using her pay from the ordeal, which was not as much as she had been promised, she traveled to Seattle where Bennett would receive the necessary treatment. Doctors were pretty successful and he survived living well into adulthood. Ada Of course became a sensation of sorts, but as so often happen to people without privilege who did remarkable things throughout history. Other people made more money off of her story than she ever did. That part is sad, but the happy part is that she spent the rest of her life with Bennett. She died in one, thousand, nine, hundred, eighty three, and was buried next to him. Her story is not regularly told, but should be more so because of a famous book about a castaway. She is commonly referred to as a real life Robinson crusoe that truthfully she should just be remembered as the one and only Ada blackjack. For you have thirty seconds. This mind here comes sylvie to tell us a woman who was many things and one of those things was also apparent. Talk About Harriet Tubman. Harriet was born in slavery, was inspired by the story of Moses Saharan, runaway and non-road she the hundreds to freedom, but when the civil war broke out, Harry was was in. She became a spy. And lead one hundred fifty soldiers while becoming the first woman to do this. She also free seven hundred from slavery during the mission. Awesome I was just listening to an episode of Side Door, which is a podcast that this Sony and puts out and they did an episode about this photograph that they found of Harriet Tubman. Just recently, it was like two thousand seventeen, and it was a photograph from when she was like much younger than we picture her like she was forty five. I think the picture and it was such a cool thing. Thank Sylvia great job. If anyone else out, there has a you have thirty seconds. There's instructions on our website the past, the notorious dot com. We'd love to hear from you. squint stat. With. Chris time here we go parents, which of these presidential pairs where father and son William Henry Harrison and Benjamin Harrison. John Adams and John Quincy Adams where Theodore, Roosevelt and Franklin Delano Roosevelt. William Henry Harrison was president for one month. He got sick at his inauguration and died thirty one days later. Benjamin Harrison was not his son though he was his grandson and Theodore Roosevelt and Franklin Delano Roosevelt will. They were distant cousins. John Adams and John Quincy Adams were father and son. John Adams served one four year term as the second president of the United States, and his son John Quincy also served only single term as our sixth president. Question number two Mary wollstonecraft was a writer and philosopher in the seventeen hundreds who fought fiercely for women's rights. It was a time that this was unusual, and she has seen as a pioneer in particular for her book, a vindication of the rights of woman. Her daughter would go on to be famous writer herself. In fact one, we featured on the show in many ways. You could claim that she was the inventor of the Genre of science fiction. Who is she? Mary Shelley was Mary wollstonecraft daughter, and as you may remember. She spent one boring summer cooped up in her house due to a natural disaster. Does that sound familiar to anyone? Well? She used that time to write Frankenstein or a modern previous, more commonly known today just as Frankenstein. Quite a mother daughter duo question number three the famous composer. Johann Sebastian Bach wrote a lot of music. He also had a lot of kids guess how many he had. Twenty? He had twenty kids now. This was back in the early seventeen hundreds and life was a lot harder for people when it came to medical matters. So sadly not all of them survived into adulthood, however, many of us children became successful musicians, and even composers themselves. Sometimes the apple as they say doesn't fall too far from the tree. And it would have taken a lot of apples to feed that family. Anna McCoy was a little girl in the mid eighteen hundreds, and like many children of the time she had chores to do one of her chores to walk to the post office and retrieve mail addressed to her family. There was no postal carrier delivering to her home, and Epsilon Michigan so would carry any letters or parcels back from the city along the banks of the Huron River to her family's home near the stark weather farm. The trip was a rare time that she could be away from her siblings, and alone with her thoughts, occasionally, her mind would wander back to the unopened mail in her hand. What the letter said was never shared with Anna over time she grew familiar with some of the names that were written on the envelopes. One in particular caught her attention. Anna noticed that whenever a letter came addressed from a Mr Hatfield of Cincinnati Ohio. Set of peculiar circumstances would usually follow typically a few days after receiving Mr Hatfields Male Anna would find her mother millie in the kitchen cooking, an enormous amount of food. The McCoy family was large, but on these occasions millie would bake more bread and cook more ham than the family could possibly eat before it would spoil. Anna also noticed that one night soon after this, the kids would be told. It's good for children to get plenty of sleep and they were sent to bed early. This felt unusual to Anna. What else was unusual was the unmistakable smell of coffee wafting through the House on these nights she could smell it from her bed as she laid awake, trying to make sense of what was happening. Her parents usually drink coffee with the sunrise, not as the moon shone through her bedroom window. Stranger still was that when she awoke the next morning, Anna would find nearly nothing left of the large amount of food. Her mother had spent so much time preparing. She wondered where it all could have gone also on these confusing mornings after the strange nights. She'd find that. Her father had left early on a business trip. This in and of itself was not unusual. It was common for him to travel for Work George McCoy grew tobacco and made cigars, which he would often load into his horse drawn wagon to sell in nearby Detroit typically though when he did this. It wasn't a sudden spur of the moment kind of trip, Anna and the family would have known. He was heading out days in advance. She and her siblings probably would have helped him. Load the wagon even. These strange mornings he was just gone over the years. Anna would see this happen many times. Although. She didn't know everything about her parents. She knew some of their story. As, Anna grew older, she would eventually piece together the story of their lives from before she was born through her childhood years including those strange coffee centered nights. Eventually she would share what she learned in an interview when she was an older woman. Interviews like these are called Oral Histories. The person giving oral history simply talks in response to basic questions to share recollections more so that their words can be preserved forever. The things they say survive in writing or audio or both. Some amazing stories have been collected through the years this way. Luckily for Everyone Anna told the story of her family to another woman who collected these oral histories in the early nineteen hundreds. The transcript is held in the eastern Michigan University archives, and it was a primary source for the story. Anna's father George McCoy was from Louisville Kentucky. Georgia's mother was black and his father was white. According to Anna's memories and family tradition, her grandfather Henry McCoy was a reasonably wealthy man of Irish heritage. It's most likely that Georgia's mother was enslaved to his father Henry. Because George himself was also enslaved to Henry his own father, a son with dark skin owned by his own light, skinned father wasn't unusual at the time. Enslaved George worked and Henry Successful Cigar business. It was here that he would learn the skills that would feed his future family and give him his own sneaky way of fighting slavery. As George grew up the Ohio river around which his city was built loomed large in his life. For the enslaved people of the area, the Ohio River was seen as the barrier to freedom. The Free State of Indiana and Ohio were easily seen just on the North Bank. But though it symbolized freedom, the Ohio was also one of the major trade arteries that kept slavery firmly in place. Many enslaved people toiled on farms, growing crops like tobacco, which were then brought in huge quantities to cities along the river to be shipped down the Mississippi River to New Orleans, and beyond slavery in the city, looked different than on farms and plantations, many of these workers, loading and unloading hogs, heads of tobacco whisky, and more were enslaved people whose owners had contracted their Labor to companies in charge of shopping and receiving the constant stream of goods along the river. For the owners who held the fate of these human beings, it was a way to make money. For the company's renting their labor. It was cheaper than hiring an employee. For the men and women held in bondage, it was a frustratingly cruel existence, working alongside free people of both colors yet unable to control their own fate. This is the World George grew up around and witnessed daily. But it was not to be existence forever. When he turned twenty one George McCoy was freed by his father and given a horse, a saddle and one hundred dollars. Instead of leaving, though George decided to remain in Louisville and continued to work in his father's cigar business. It appears that George did not want to leave for one big reason. He had fallen in love. Though George was technically free now his love milly was not. She was legally owned by a wealthy family in downtown, Louisville for whom she was a housekeeper, according to tales that she would tell her children. Her masters weren't particularly cruel, and she wasn't particularly anxious to leave them. But she was enslaved, and above all she wanted to be in charge of her own life. She wanted to marry George and she wanted to raise a family. But she knew it was dangerous to have children while enslaved. Any children she would bring into. The world would not be free. These children would legally belong to. And situations like these could be the most devastating of all. Throughout the years, countless families were horrendously torn apart when children were taken and sold often to be sent far away, making it unlikely that parent and child would ever see each other again. It is impossible to imagine such anguish and heartache milley had recently watched her very own brothers sold away from the family, and did not want the same fate for herself, nor any children that she may have so she decided running away, and heading north in hopes of freedom was her only real chance, she and George were married, and soon after they made their escape, attempting to escape was dangerous and most runaway slaves as they were known at the time were not successful George was technically a free man, which may have made it a bit easier for them, but the risks were no less extreme. The pair headed east on the river and laid low in Cincinnati for a while they had to hide from is of men who were trying to find millie and return her to her owners. In Louisville great care was taken everywhere and every day newspaper advertisements in the area offered a reward for the escaped slave from Louisville named Millie even describing the unique and distinguishing mole on her forehead. So anyone that they met could have turned them in Cincinnati is likely where George Milli I met. Mr Hatfield the very same man who would eventually send the letters that their daughter Anna McCoy. From the post office, and which would lead to her ping, the mystery of who her parents were and what they did. Do to Mr Hatfields well-known status today as a figure in the underground railroad. It is also reasonable to assume that he had a hand in helping. The couple safely escaped Cincinnati, eventually, the pair settled on a farm and epsilon, t Michigan where they felt safe and became part of the community. The McCoy family would grow to include eleven children Anna was the fourth, and by eighteen fifty nine began to make sense of what her parents did beyond their business of tobacco, farming and caring for a huge family. One day while playing in the yard. And I was surprised to see a man and a woman with three little girls from a distance on the McCoy family property. This was tremendously exciting for Young Anna because she desperately wanted to play with these new young faces. But before she could get to them, her mother grabbed her and hurried her away. Terribly upset, she later set out again to find them searching all over the farm. They were nowhere to be found. With nowhere else to look, she headed to the barn to see if she could find even a clue about the mysterious family. But the barn was empty. No little girls, no parents. And no sign of her father's wagon. The! Fate of this family was the fate of many other families who passed through the McCoy's Ypsilanti farm. It all had to do with her father's wagon, which he drove to the city, regularly loaded down with cigars George had cleverly built the vehicle to have a false bottom when it was loaded down with tobacco and cigars. No one would ever suspect that there was a compartment. It was in this secret compartment that her father would hide fugitive slaves, people who had resisted and fled their enslavement in the south and made it amazingly all the way to Michigan. Even Michigan could still be unsafe, so every precaution had to be taken. Georgia remembered how scary it was and how people helped him to freedom, so he in turn played his own important role in helping. Over the years, dozens of families huddled cramped inside his wagon and recovered covered with crates to all is in town. George looked like any other man toting his product and those letters from Mr Hatfield that Anna had noticed will. They had been sent to let her. Parents know that the fugitives were on the way traveling with the help of a secret network of people between Cincinnati and Michigan all to get them safely to the McCoy family farm. Every step of the journey would be dangerous, and they would have to travel with very little knowing fugitives on the way, Millie would cook those memorably large amounts of food for their hungry bellies. After spending a night in the barn, unbeknownst to anyone McCoy children, they'd stealthily be transported in Jordan Wagon on one of his surprise overnight trips. The McCoy family farm was a stop on the underground railroad and Anna's parents helped many other escaped slaves get to the freedom that they deserved. From if Cellini, George would take the fugitives to the town of Wyan dot where they would meet. A boat named the Pearl. The Pearl would ferry them across the Detroit River and into the freedom of Canada. It was an elaborate and secretive path for people to follow, and it was dangerous for all involved. If the secret was exposed, it would mean the end of freedom for many fugitives, and it could also mean the same for the people working to break the law in helping these people escape. It is for this reason that most of the people involved in the underground railroad never told anyone only a few told their children, and some observant children like Anna were able to figure it out from watching their brave and committed parents. Many of these stories were lost, and will never be known but Luckily Anna McCoy was able to share the story of her family with us all. A Lo Que everybody. Thank you all so much for listening. This was a really special episode to put together. The McCoy story is one that I have been wanting to put on the show for a couple years now actually and it took me a while to figure out how to how to present it in this format for the podcast and I. I'm happy to have done so now i. also man how `Bout Abigail Greg they were awesome. I can't wait to have them back. Thank you to you both and speaking of thank yous. I have some patriotic people to think quite a few actually. Hey Chris White. I have a song for you next month. It was a little late getting that. Ultimate tier sponsorship on Patriot. But we've talked about, so we'll have something for you enjoy, but today I wanted to say thank you. Ellen wanted to say. Thank you to you as well. If there's someone else that I should say, thank you to then just send me a message. Think them next month. I had some really cool emails with a listener named Erica. Really Great, really great conversation, and wanted to thank you for that and also wanted to say hello to hugo out there for joining on patriotic as well. So thanks to you both. Yes I need to give a shout out to somebody actually to. Somebody's in West Virginia Hello Andrew and his Cat Hamilton. Yes. WHAT'S UP Hamilton? Thank you I bet you're pretty stoked about the July. Third. Hamilton I'm guessing about the about the Disney plus thing I'm GonNa. Be Watching. Oh I still have more people to think, too. In fact here we got. Bela's Cummings. Guy Thank you so much. We're so happy you're out there listening. Thank you very much and last, but not least but. I was late so late, but not least but last. Whatever Hayden Elliot Hey, he did. Thank you so much? So glad you're out there. Heard. and Everybody else out there. Yeah, you thank you glad you're listening money. Mix Eleven misses the past in the curious. We'll be back next month with more fun.

Anna McCoy McCoy ADA George nome Cincinnati Alaska Bennett George McCoy Jack Black Jack Georgia Wrangel Island Mr Hatfield Stephenson. Louisville scientist William Henry Harrison Ada Abigail Greg Siberia
Stay Positive This Holiday Season w/ Zykia McCoy

Capt. Hunter's Podcast

55:25 min | 11 months ago

Stay Positive This Holiday Season w/ Zykia McCoy

"Yeah hello everyone. And welcome to another episode of Captain Hunters podcast. Thank you so much for tuning in in a truly appreciate the love and support that you all have been giving thank you so much for tuning in for another episode. Maybe you can tell but I have a little frog in my throat. Still trying to get over a little cold that I had but you know we gotta go through it to get to it right. No biggie about that. On today's episode we are going to feature a fellow podcasters by the name of Zakia. SAIKIA McCoy missed McCoy's fellow podcast. Did I met through a facebook social group for fellow podcasters so we can hooked up and Being that she is living a positive type of lies down being a fellow. podcast Sir I asked to be on the show and she asked me to be on her show. So we Kinda Did Cross platform kind of thing so you can listen to my interview with her on her PODCAST which is called cooking with positively eighty being the holiday season at the time of the release of this. Would most people count as about thanksgiving. But I actually for my own purposes. I include Halloween in that right. Just a time of feasting and family and just getting around just sitting around getting to know another in in that whole bonding time. I think that's that that is really important. That starting at about Halloween time through Thanksgiving through Christmas through New Year's call the holiday season we eat. We tend to overindulge and and all that kind of stuff so I wanted to keep this positive. Have someone on who knew something a little bit about food. Maybe give us a recipe or two. And so that's why I decided to Hook Cup with Miss Zakia McCoy so I'd like to read just a little bit about her bio before we get into that limit. Just make sure you guys remember the hit that subscribe button rate share remember. The podcast can be supported through pay. Pal that's Lawrence Hunter ads. CPT L. Hunter Cash App C. P. T. L. Hunter and also through van Mo- cpt L. Hunters captain l hunter all those. You can also go over to my page on paid support. The page support the podcast Captain Hunters podcast cast on Patriot. P. A. T. R. E. N. DOT COM page on dot com become supporter and. Just helped me get this message out to. The people also remember follow him at Twitter Instagram facebook Moss on YouTube Captain l hunter. CPT L. Hunter For although especially for twitter. CPT L. Hunter in for instagram. CPT all hunter without further ado. Let's get into the interview with Miss Zakia McCoy here's her. Her Bio Zakia McCoy is a caterer and creative writer. She has been writing since the age of seven and has written poetry and sorts short stories in every genre. She has written lyrics for up and coming artists and entered into several poetry competitions. Her goal is to become recognized for her work. Through novels. Poetry and Phil Saikia is working on three novels into screenplays. She has recently embarked on several entrepreneurial plural endeavors as of January two thousand fourteen SAIKIA launched her own catering company called Z are Z.. Catering with the slogan slogan from the kitchen to your table. This website can be found in facebook with a search Z Z. Catering aunt at xikion McCoy dot com at Z.. Z. Y. K. I. A. M. C. C. O. Y. DOT COM which is growing every day with events like birthday parties Bachelorette parties luncheons etc.. Being a native New Yorkers Kia has tried to stay connected to our hometown route and often writes about the street. She remembered from New York in the people she met while while living there Saikia is a single mother of two little girls whom she loves in wants to succeed she created a social group called single. MOMS cloud also also inspired by a tyler. Perry movie this group can be found on facebook as well. A group of single MOMS go that goes on outings and enjoy each of this company. So I ki- four major passions are kids writing cooking and reading with everything on her plate. SAIKIA has decided to take her talents on swing other level and combined them under one business. Header Zakia McCoy the cooking. Positively podcast that focuses on positive Spreading positively and remaining positive in all aspects of life. So the reason I wanted to focus on miss McCoy's because she's a single mom. She's doing positive things. She is a inspiration to the community and she's one of those people who's trying to make the community better through her work through literature through her writing other her raising children and being active member in society of you've wondered why can't the hunter is talking in speaking with people who are not necessarily in law enforcement will. This is the reason right. It's about building a new bridge between the community and the police in one way to do that is to build up the the community. And here's a strong member of the community. Who's doing positive things? Her podcast is called cooking with positively. And that's why we're going to have a great conversation with with Miss Saikia McCoy so without further Ado Ladies and gentlemen. Here's a interview with Miss Zakia McCoy and do may show that you check out. Our podcast called cooking with positively. Thank you so much Zakia McCoy for being on Capitol Hunters podcast. Thank you so much for being here. Perhaps I read alleged your bio. So why don't you tell us a little bit more or something different about yourself and what you got going on. Well I am a caterer. You're in a writer of course but I also the host of Cook Mokaba City podcast in we promote positively and everyday life. And that's not just you know through cooking or through writing through every aspect of life very nice. Your Bio said. You've been writing since you were seven. Tell us about that. Yes I've I've been writing. I WANNA assassinate writing poetry since I was telling you know I took I took to writing after After time in class actually and my teacher had a treat a Poem allow them and if our music by Linda Michelle Baron in that clone stuck with me and I felt like stick which you this much if I was doing it didn't make me feel just as good or even better so I picked up my opinion. I haven't stopped writing percent. And what poem was that. It's our music by Linda. Michelle bearing okay and that was what university degree yeah. I was in grade and actually visited me in the fifth grade. 'cause we for Marcus graduation I'm able to perform that bomb. I was never into poetry poets. I like when is and people like bat so I I love. I love the poetry of hip hop to it. All the same is odd musically right right right So you've also written for some Some poetry competitions is right. Yes I actually we won the The Baron and mournful competition. I wrote a poem for my cousin who I lost Im- violent and he was A. He was eight years old when he was murdered. Committed upon that I wrote for his Ritu Aries. Oh yeah well. I'm really sorry to hear that. How long do we just lost his sister? So you know it's kind of that was with Four years ago and then we just lost his sister at the top of the years. Though kind of raw I can imagine really. I mean sorry to hear that. Yeah but the pond over him it It went a purple ribbon. It's your wisdom and for me putting his killings upon now is that when yeah he was trying to say one of his sisters. Yeah Do My story or is it too raw. I mean I mean it made national news like it was everywhere was being sexually assaulted in the backyard. Hi of his house and he was tracking her ambience too but of course you know he's smaller. You're only and the boy overpowered. I mean he hit him in the head with a brick. Oh My oh my God I mean I assume they caught the boy. And he's he's he's under arrest and yeah he in he's been in jail thin and how it was the sister his sister at at the time but she thirteen Tom. Thank you. Is that the one who's you just lost. No they're older sisters one. We just lost okay. I'm really sorry to hear that. That's that's really horrible He certainly sounds like a hero. Who would step in To try to do something when he sees his sister being assaulted so the horrible infinite. And you've also written for some other poetry artists is that right yes I've written for a few up and coming artists. I will not mean me because they're That was part of our deal is that they hadn't I remain anonymous. Okay very well. That was that was a while ago but it was his name Lake. Now everybody writing for everybody and everybody knows who you know anyway but that was a while ago so so is that a big thing. It goes writing for poetry for artists. Is that a big thing. I I don't know I'm not into that world. I don't know it's a big thing to me. Need because that means you respect me as an artist and you want you want to use some of my work I look at it as content writing. 'cause I do content right and that's well so if you have a business or you have a website and you need some confidence and I go and I see you know what you have to offer offer and I put it into words. I look at that as it goes right in as well because I'm not getting the credit for the words. My name is plastered lasted all over your website. But you know I wrote that worry. You know I did that work. Okay so explain to you. What content writing is? I don't know what that I'm familiar. It was a constant right in this. When you co- by content for it can be like I said a business a website? I do Content right and for other poets content edited editing. And things like that. So if you have a website or you have a business I do loop promotions on my podcast as well and if you have a business and comes to me with your product or Your Business and let me know what you do the create a commercial for you. That's pretty much. What content rating is? Of course. You have someone who is your personal emails and and things of that nature. There are so many different types of content writers rapper by creative confidence and competence to help your your business or website. Pop Okay Very nice first of all. Do you have a website where people can reach you at indoor your email address where people can reach you. Get some content awesome done for them. Yes everything is I care McCoy Dot Com and like here McCoy at Yahoo Dot Com and GMO DOT COM. Everything is Kim Kim who and make it very easy very well. You're contacting you get me very nice so you and I met as part of this facebook group that we are For podcasting so tell us a little bit about your podcast again. My podcast is about Spreading positively in every aspect of life. So I haven't seen and 'cause then we'll positively is about being positive whether being your business your life everyday decision making and I so that you know this was needed and my community as well as around the world because we have so many negative things going on so many dark things happen in this world that we forget to be positive and so I felt like if I shine the light on in a positive things it will help bring some light to this dark world that we're living in right now and also a great way to bring my Catering I and my right and business together 'cause I create You know like I said content for my podcast as well as a share recipes in an interview. You know caterers checks things like that and people that actually do very nice now. Where's your podcast cast located at? Where can people find? Well we are based on anchor is a great podcast APP. Actually someone someone who Yes someone who Told me about it. They were going to start their own podcast but then they got gun shy but they told me about anchor and I've been with them everything it's then it's been a year and a half now almost going on two years that I've been doing a podcast and it's worked out great but I can also be heard on iheartradio Stitcher I soon pretty much everywhere. You listen to podcasts okay. So it's cooking with positively. Now you told us about your writing. How did you get into cooking? As far as positively positively so this is a this is kind of a funny story. My mom my mom's a great cook. She wanted the greatest in the world. I come and go so growing up you know. I watched her. You know do certain things around the house and outside of the House and I thought it was magic and so I started asking her to teach me how gotTa do here one day one day off. She's like okay. I'll teach you how you know breath and I wasn't getting it and she said to me this is not for you. This is my for you. You don't get it braving this something that you know how to do you have it in you and you WanNa WanNa do it practice just makes you better so I put down the hair and I started watching her in the kitchen and I found that I was able to follow like recipe when she wasn't home because I used to watch my brothers. My mom will be at work and so I'm the oldest of seven so a majority of the time I was supposed to be responsible for for my siblings and I would just start doing my mama do so cooking was a big thing and I remember I remember my first. My first cooking endeavor I was eight I started trying to pancakes mid came. How pretty on the outside but they were they were pretty much raw and the inside he felt like He? What's too hot but I graduated? I learned along the way but she told me she said You did a great great job on the outside. You just gotTa take your town and ever since then. I've been ticking time in the kitchen and I've been cooking and actually opened up my own catering business in two thousand and one I had my first official catering event as in my best friends Uh Twenty Fifth Birthday Bash and it was amazing so very nice looking for other ever since. So that's that's been a while now right eighteen years you opened up a two thousand one. So you've been not just for. Wow Yeah I've been I like I said I've been in the kitchen by by myself since eight. My Mom let me Cook my first official meal by myself at age eleven. So Yeah I've been in the kitchen for. Wow Okay now you for a while. Yeah now you're catering but now you're based in New York is that right I am. I'm not I'm originally from New York. But I am based in Richmond Virginia Oak in Richmond. All right I thought okay. So what's the. What is the span ban of your of Virginia? You go all over. Virginia disdain the Richmond area for your catering events all over. I go all over Virginia. Yeah and I also you know shit food to other States sound like I have a shipping that I do to New York Chicago Etcetera. Very nice thing. Yeah what type of items do you should see. What what are the people getting shipped to New York and Virginia and Chicago okay so one of my biggest sellers are my big MAC and cheese. It is a family only recipe listed in handed down. And my mom would not let me Have it in my business is there was not good so just doing sir very very protective but a big Mac and cheese is one of my biggest sellers in those. Oh and I sell a gift basket you know for every holidays as you know. You've got birthdays coming up my mug cakes. They go pretty fast as well. Those are my holidays sellers and I also have like seasonal than I do last last fall. I did The PUMPKIN PIE pop up like Pumpkin pies on those went pretty bad now is this. Is this a family only business that you have I mean is your mom involved. You are your kids involved. You have cousins or is it just you my kids my kids. My kids help my kids. Definitely the only hope I'm actually Writing the children's cookbook with my with my daughter as we speak it's already written. We just have to type it out and I and you know do the recipes because when I do a cookbook. I like to do all the recipes and if I'm not recording them all I like who at least do like you know a walk-through on my blog of at least five of the recipes. So my kids so definitely involved in my mom she does help time-to-time when especially if I have like a large event my brother's Dave been servers they bring cooks. They've they've definitely helped as well. That's very nice now. Do you have your own Space to do this or are you just not. You're not trying to get you home okay. I didn't want to get in trouble out of my home home. I'm allowed by law to kind of home. I cannot have you think in my home. The actually a loophole. So I prepare everything in my home and I take it to whatever it is for the okay now. How was business business pretty good? I gave it to support yourself. Am I trying to be too personal. But I mean businesses good able to support yourself and give yourself a good living they send your catering business right not work like every like every business it has lag time for sure especially being you know a small business is pretty much mean at the helm. So I'm not able to take a lot of jobs and I don't WanNa take job and not be able to perform to the Max so I'm very particular with jobs that pay and then there are few scam around here that I've come across cross almost durell my business. Yeah There are if you are caterer and you're trying to you know get get business out there. Don't trust people who touched you in action. You you know if they can get you to doing last minute. And then they tell you they can't meet you or you know facetime with you because they may be in the hospital it can someone else meets. You are anything like that. That is a school. Okay so tell us a story give us an example of that so i uh-huh envisioning what you're saying but obviously this is something to happen to you so tell us ask I I have a few ways that you you know. Advertise the team my podcast and my website and social media. But I had an account we yell and my name was coming up in a lot of different you know search engine as far as catering in the Richmond area. Now I'm used used to getting you know text and people telling me. Oh I seen your business come up on facebook or whatever but this person wouldn't tell me exactly where they saw my business come up so I found that odd. That was a that was a pink flag. It wasn't a red flag. Okay okay okay. That's a little weird and so they asked for A hundred grilled chicken and they wanted a hundred grilled chicken and Assad of Aside of Mac and cheese and I was like okay. That's not odd odd because it is the summertime and I was like. What do you want any sauce to go in it? I make my own barbecue sauce so I was just like you just want road chicken. I'm like kind of confused with the event you know it was very like everything was very suspect because because it wasn't like a lot of details I mean it was just like okay. So what's the cost. What's the price and then once quoted a price they were like okay? Paid is great. You know now. What's the next step and I was like okay? The next step would be US either meeting for US having having a facetime conversation and eastern you the contract so you can assign the contract and then you putting your down payment. That's when the OH. Oh I'm in the hospital on the hospice and I really can't my husband needs you and the contract and I was like wait a minute. What if you're hospice isn't that like I'm confused? So I explain that I cannot do a contract with your husband because you have. You are mckinney agreement. You are making the arrange you. In time. We'll be paying for the food so it will be a contract with you. Her husband man. I would need to speak with you. Verify that Ju- and see that as you and she was very adamant and then I had another situation where they want to pay. Hey are there. Dj through me because the D Day doesn't accept. These are mastercards. What we're going to take them going to pay the pay you whatever they're going to give you a thousand dollars just to say they were going to give you the money and then you had to pay the DJ cash? Is that what you're saying pretty much. They wanted to run it. Run it through. My account was none. No that's illegal. That's that's the legal. You're trying to mess up my account by giving me a bad credit card information and once it clears clears in my account. Then you want me to. It's pretty much cleaning money for whoever is doing right right now at what was to burn four new. I'm sorry go ahead. I was scam before in my personal. There's some life okay. So my antennas. They raise very easily now. If I feel like something you know like. I said the fact that they wouldn't tell tell me you know how they heard about me. You know where they got my number from. That was a little bit so I mean because most people in the case of this in the case of the first story that you said about the woman who was in hospice I assume it was a woman. what would be the reason for for doing this just to in just a mess you up. I mean okay. He doesn't tell you where she got your information from okay. That's that's certainly like. You said pink flag but what what would be the reason for scamming jamming just a have. You burn through time and energy and money. I mean she was at least willing to have her husband. Come out and meet you what. What was the problem with that? SEE chief said it was her husband. Okay okay okay okay. We never got to payment method. Okay and you never got trying to write me a check. Okay yeah no it was it was too. It was uh-huh I was very uncomfortable and ninety five percent of my clients. They are eager to tell me where they heard about my services because ninety seven percent of the time is a discount evolve sauce today. How they heard about you through yelp or through facebook or whatever then you give give them a discount? Is that what you're saying it depends. It depends on what you heard about. You got you know where you click on the link or where you've got my phone number from and then you'll get that discount applies to wherever you heard about the fact that she just gloss over that. I'm still assuming assuming that it's her. I got you but it's not it. Don't very suspect. Think she gave you a real name. Do you believe that she gave you really no. No 'cause I searched everywhere for for the day that she gave me on all of my like social media media everywhere again so let me ask you. Why would she make this up? What me what? What's the I mean as a former police officer right so I ah we often come across people who would do silly stuff as pranks as far as ordering pizzas and you know senator your rivals house and stuff like that. So there's you know there's there's a method to that madness. What's the method to this madness as far as Just having you cook a whole bunch of chicken is the waste your time to. What's the reason why? What would you believe the reason for that would be okay so in this case I believe that you know once they were able? Because there are hackers out here and once. They're able to get like certain information like get into your payment or access to your payment account even if they're making the transaction on the other end they're able to access your account got you. I got the information was so suspect. And then I will be communicating with the male versus female. It made me very uncomfortable. So did they ask like okay. This is this is thank. You very informative for anyone else who's who's running a business So did they ask you for your credit card information or pay pile today. Would they want that kind of stuff from you during these conversations. She didn't. I didn't let her get that far. Okay okay the first person with the DJ situation. And we're asking me if I said you know credit card and I said yes I accept credit card and then they were like great. That's when the whole DJ team about all my day doesn't accept and I was like well. That's no two different businesses. I cannot accept the payment for another person's business you know and if the thought like it could have been that thing person trying to come back around No no no because I did. I didn't talk to The second person on the phone okay. Text me okay but the first person it was definitely a lady or at least it sounded like lady who's nowadays most but it you sound like a woman okay. Okay wow okay. Well so yeah but it sounded like like a similar scheme like they were trying to get in a different way especially with the hospice. It was like a SOB story. They try to weaken my defenses right. Now how close were these two events. I mean there was like a week later a month later. How would those it was? It actually was a week later Because the the first person the first person she asks that's our quoted her you know she hit me with the DJ stuff. And I was like okay. No this is not gonna work and then like a week later. The lady contacting me about grilled chicken and it's for their fresh in my mind because it doesn't happen often They actually do good business with a lot of different types of people but these foods that got him my mind because they were so odd right. Now you've you've been in business for two years so you've obviously are doing something right. Have a good reputation And and you have good business sense right. So you're not scanning the people that are allowing us to be scammed definitely tracks and all that kind of honesty. Yes I do yes I do even with my best friend For her birthday party she paid me everything. So yes I try to keep him very above above board especially nowadays attacks me and it's coming after everybody. They lock people up or simple stuff so I try to make sure well the thing is I just read an article Not Too long ago that talked about how the tax man. IRS is coming only after mostly middle to lower class people right so they're not coming after everyone they're going to going up the middle class and those who are lower economically because they're not going to go after the higher classes because the article was saying that it was just too complicated essentially to go after them which those are the the people they ought to be going after right so once again move forget lawyers etc exactly exactly exactly so the problem when I knew you and I both you and I both so cooking with positively? Now you and your daughters are writing a cookbook. Are you giving away your family secrets as far as recipes or are you scared about that word about that. You don't care or what. Well I don't give away all secret like I say. My mom is very protective. Because we don't have a lot moving here from New York this is kind of our generational history passed down and when I told her you know I was starting my catering company and she was like well. You know I gotta try everything. So I'm very mindful of what I put out there. Let me and my mom. We both cook great but we cook different. I think risk my mom. My mom cooks what she knows. She's fixed what she knows. She eats what she knows. Unless I've been I heard something and then make her fall in love with it now literally had to do that. Like what's the range of foods you you cook mostly soul food you dabble in Italian Food Mexican food. What would a little bit of everything is suffering Chinese okay? I don't new timing or Asian cuisine. I had a client who actually that because they saw that I do orange of food but no no. I'm not messing with the Chinese. Very now okay. No today. I've been I've tried it. I've dabbled appaled in. It didn't come out like it was something that I will present to. My family. Let alone of potential clients. So I shows that for now but Yes we do. Italian food is so food is basically a so food well dressed up for the occasion. So they if you want Big Mac and cheese which he wanted to appetizer form. We have Massachusetts cupcakes. They're cute they're small. You can pick them up to pick. You know things like that so that'll be good for like luncheons and you know branches and stuff like that. Okay very nice. I was a forum a few days go last week as a matter of fact well by the time has come out to be a few weeks ago so I was out of form some time ago and It was a lot of different the people who were sitting there different cultures and we somehow the topic on food. This is before the former actually started. You know we're kind of just talking and mingling and so this one lady says you know Oh you start starter. Accidents Conversation started over coffee. How community bringing up copies for everyone else was kind of a joke kind of thing and so there's One lady says you you know in the Jewish culture? This is what we do give people food and just trying to fatten them up and then another lady says well. That's the same thing in the Italian we like to found people up everybody's eating unhealthy and I'm like oh listen to the black thing too. You know so so coop. Food in cooking are so intertwined with so many different cultures in ethnicities. Yeah Yeah it's so important to to US bonding to us. You know to these marriages that you that we have these ceremonies that we have. It's it's everything it's cultures essentially the food that we eat. Why why are we listening and dancing to the music that we that we love and enjoy? So it's it's really really important in our lives and so Naro. I'm saying that to say that I appreciate what what you're doing and I like that And you also following another passion of yours which is which is writing and reading so you are a person who has find your niche as far as writing poetry reading and cooking. Not many people can say that. And so I give you a lot of credit and Kudos for that. Uh well I appreciate it. The journey was not easy because I was I with porn most of my life I had A. I had a few love and my life and I had to choose to which one to go down and that the end of the day I couldn't choose between food and writing and they both they both held on. You Know Theater left me because I was going to be an actress. I was going to be a singer right thyroid issue so that went out the window because my voice is not consistent. One day I wake up found like count von next day I wake it got kind of like Barry. White doesn't so things thing works out worked out best for me and I love talk so the plaque asking would be so. Let's get into the Aug.. Yep So what made you decide to start start podcast you have. If you have a good niche cooking cooking with Positivi. So why did you want to start a podcast. While I I was looking for a way to marry my to love for a while and of course you know I have cookbooks. That's a good way to marry them but I wasn't fully fulfilled and I felt like people weren't getting all of me as far as you know who I As an author and WHO. I am as a caterer so I was like. Where can I put all of this together? Because I've created the business pages and things like that but it wasn't altogether my website. It has everything together but it's not together. It's not married doesn't make sense to me. They're not one pretty much and I listened to a few people like on talk radio. And you know podcast and someone who I follow. They were talking about You you know there's ways that you can you know. Get Your Voice out. There is free podcasts. You can create a podcast on inker and I started you know searching up. Well what is anchor. What is this in air go? PODCAST opened up. That's where I started and I'm a loyalist so I stick with anchor even hello. I'm on other platforms. I stick where where I started and anchor has been very easy for me to you. I'm able to navigate it. I've tried to like navigate other podcasts. But I digress. It was easier to just take take you from inker and put it on these other the platforms. And that's what started it all because I've always wanted to do something. Where I'm expressing myself so creatively? I'm marrying my two loves and I am spreading positive. My best friend just told me the other day. 'cause I sodas that I had to get back to being positive me and she's like you've always been positive ever since we were younger. Like that's crazy that you say that and so I had to. You know. Take a step back for myself and envisioned that a game because there was a time back from the podcast. Because I felt like I wasn't an positive has speaks so much things happening around me so many things we wanted to my personal personal life I felt like if I would have recorded it will come off as positive as I like to spread to the world so the podcast ask seemed like a natural natural thing. And I'm a talker. My grandmother had on at one years old talking up a storm so it is. Yeah so how long have you been podcasting. It's been about two years now. He's like I said I didn't looking in searching or you know an outlet that accompanied all of my wonderful assets and and being positive in the process. But everything comes when it's supposed to on your podcast. You do mostly discuss cooking or do you also get into the writing and poetry marrying the two loves together. Mostly stick with gooding aspect. I get into a bit of everything it just depends on. You know because it's a it's a podcast so it's a show so I have to keep my listeners interested so I have different themes every month and we have different topics and I've added different segments and I do everything with the the guide of positives so if it's positive we're talking about it and one of the things that I did talk about at at the top of the show was how to be positive in every aspect right so when it comes to food. I know it's very very big on healthy. People are looking for healthy options and be healthy throughout their lives. So what I I started doing was sharing the recipe that I was sharing I would offer you know the alternative. If you're Vegan vegetarian lean. I would offer that option as well. I tell you how to make this thing recipe but in being a vegetarian form and what substitute so I share. I share recipes on my podcast every month as well as a poem of the month. And that's the way I get. Yeah yeah I I used to have a segment called storytime where Started telling the story for the podcast but it got it became became much. It became much. People wanted me to do that. All the time so I had to fall back and readjust nother story time was was just is to segment. Is that what you're saying. Yeah I started it as a segment back in February it was a love story okay and if followed but these two teenagers who had a love for art you know jazz and Tan and things like that and when people wanted to hear that story all the time and it was just before the month Sabri well that does sound interesting so I think. TT's take the people out there. I think you tease them a little bit. So that does on interesting but I had to take a step back but I will be bringing it back this February. Okay so if you listened to cook Tiffy you can look for that in February now. How often I knew I'm sorry? No no go ahead. How often do you release an episode? Okay so we are now up to three days a week when I first started. It was just Wednesdays every Wednesday but there was such a demand for the podcast people. Ask Me when I wasn't releasing episode. You know win next episode will be out. And how do I survive Mondays. And and things of that nature so I started Doing Monday Wednesdays and Fridays. Now and on Wednesdays I have a co host. Who has joined? Join the positivity families Miss Lisa Sean. And it's been working out fantastically because I'm able to focus on Mondays and Fridays and I have different A focuses on each day so Mondays are Mondays and mm-hmm that's about my listeners. I WanNa hear you know whatever your stories are how you remain positive in certain situations i. Have you know different traffic like I said so on Mondays. I provide surviving Monday tips on how you can survive Monday. Because I had so many people come up to me and ask me. How do you remain so perky and so positive upbeat on Monday? 'cause people suffer from the Monday doldrums and that made me say okay. That was one of my listeners questions and turned it into a segment so every Monday. I provide Survivor Monday to and also every the first Monday of every month we provide A shoutout to businesses is doing positive things or have a positive message or positive movement so they could be like donating money to organizations. Who thinks whatever so? We shine a light on them on Mondays and Fridays on Fridays. I provide A raffle Oh we play The blink game I was playing a Bingo with. I think it got too much So I'm shopping that until next year but Fun Fridays has been. It's been fun because if you support cooking we'll patentability if you've ever like shared heard etc guest you get a raffle ticket and Andrea name in you. Get prizes from my business or from Lisa Johnston and it's been it's been fun so far three days a week. Well that's that's and it is it is but it's IT'S A. It's a schedule of love so I enjoy. It gives me Kinda my therapy especially Mondays. I love Reading listening to stories I love you know talking to this and I love creating so is your is. Does your podcast lie. Your podcast is not live right. It's not it's not live but next my December depending on when this year's years I will be doing A live experiment where I provide interview while I'm live on my social media and I'm GONNA be cooking a recipe with my guests from side of things but some I would really interesting. That sounds really interesting. Yes so I'm going to be doing that next month for our holiday our holiday months and then in I'm also doing twenty. Five days of positivity where I provide my platform to people who think they might want to. They have a podcast but don't know how to get started or want to try it out before they jump out there and go for their selves. So you are able to come on positivity the in run the show yeah good idea like it. Yeah so so I have a lot going on yes you do. Yes you do. This episode going to air during the Christmas time during the holiday season so tell us some good holiday recipes that are going to be fun. Culturally culturally culturally diverse cultural cook and also GonNa be somewhat healthy. What would you recommend? I'll give you When I just shared on the podcast this is our Our recipe of the month because we have Is Turkey Day you know Thanksgiving. That's a big Holidays the big food holiday and people tend to overeat during the holidays. And what I found is if you cook with intention they won't overeat. I mean you won't have tons of leftovers and if you do you have ways to minimize your over eating so I created the Turkey meatballs now. Many balls are when I'm taps others but I mean all types of people and Turkey meatballs with gravy. They've served twelve. That is a great way to not overeat cookman intention and it's delicious like who doesn't love Turkey and gravy right so I shared this podcast so for the Turkey meatballs. You need two pounds of ground beef or two pounds of ground thirty four tablespoons of minced garlic charlie one and a half teaspoon of salt one is one of the upper. Two large eggs one clip Panko breadcrumbs half a teaspoon of Paprika one seats one of onion powder and like I said it serves up to twelve this worth it. You can always be found around my cookbook. A fifteen fifteen minutes or less. It can be found on Amazon. Very nice very nice and so for my final question. I WANT TO START DOC. Some trouble who is the better cook you or your co host. Well I haven't had my co host is cooking yet can't I'm I'm a very honest person so something better than me. I will give her her her just to her. But I haven't had. I can't say okay very good. Tell us Just give us a brief summation of once again. Your website. This cookbooks that you have and when and where we can find you already told us but tell us again where we can find your podcast right well. The website is I came Aucoin DOT DOT com. That's the Zebra why Kia MCC. Oh and you can find everything that have gone on as far as my books far as the podcast as far as catering all on that website also you can find my books on Amazon Dot Com. or You have to do is type in like here McCoy and all of my book should come up and it's not if you're looking for specific title definitely just type INS. I Kid McCoy and type in that title and that'll oh come up and cook politician and be heard on anchor iheartradio. Aisin's pretty much wherever you listen to. Uh that and if you don't have it on the APP that you listen to definitely contact me and get them to put it on. How do my best to get on that platform? Very nice. Thank you so much psyche McCoy. Congratulations on your business. I wish you best success with the catering with your poetry which you're writing and also with your podcast so much for being a guest and capital pockets and thank you for having me because you've had on your show. I'm wants to be providing you with a free fifteen fifteen minutes Alexa book a free copy of that book. Oh awesome I look forward to that. I can't cook a licks. Well that's not true I can cook but I can't cook But I I'm not the Best Cook. I'm not the best cook so I need all the help I can get. I put it this way. I can easy recipe. So you're doing great okay. Very nice and easy very good there. We go all right thanks again. We'll talk to you once again. I want to thank my special guest. McCoy coming. Ah Capitol Hunters podcast. Please make sure you check out her. Website Design Kia Z.. Y. M. C. C. O. Y.. I DOT COM. Check that out. CHECK OUT OUR PODCAST Cooking with positivity and if you're living in the Richmond area or also if you want item shipped to you right for this holiday season make sure you check her out. She's willing to ship items to you. Different food items so be a supporter of the business and support. What she's doing also remember that? I have a blog on hunter. Police Training Training Dot Com. Go to hunt police. Training Dot com hit that blog and make sure read through some of my past blogs their thoughts and insights Maitree tree check on twitter handle C. P. T. L. Hunter instagram cpt L. Hunter that's Capitol Hunter for all those once again. If you'd like the background music that was done by my Godson Abraham Airing Av e R Y H E R. I N G TWO AT OUTLOOK DOT COM. That's where he can reach that you. Do you like the the artwork that was done on my stepson. Philip mccorkell p. m. designed eight zero eight a g mail DOT COM. So that's bit much love and peace take care bye.

Miss Saikia McCoy facebook New York Richmond C. P. T. L. Hunter twitter SAIKIA Lawrence Hunter writer US Captain Hunters Virginia Phil Saikia Zakia Linda Michelle Baron Kid McCoy
[074] Instant reaction: Gerald McCoy signs with the Panthers

Buccaneers Observer

41:05 min | 1 year ago

[074] Instant reaction: Gerald McCoy signs with the Panthers

"Every year in the NFL it's a new team. As far as goals. Go. We have one. Putting a fucking ran on a finger. Welcome to the buccaneer observer podcasts as row Phillips Amalia bay today is doomed. Third two thousand nineteen ninety seven days to kick all how many days telly matchup against your McCoy, not enough. Many loosely, we play them week to on Thursday night football, one hundred one days to we play the Panthers at the Panthers Wheeler play four days after opening day Thursday night game. Oh man. Is going to be fun. Fun fun, exciting stuff news today unless you've been hiding under Iraq. Jeremy Koi has signed with the Carolina Panthers. The kittens you are way too. Happy thrilled. This is this off. Season has been crazy. I can't remember in all my years of watching buck nears. Football such an exciting off season, just stuff, Hatton, it left and right. Just some of it's great. Some of it's sad. It's just nuts. Everything for Bruce. Bruce Arians Bruce, to be short be getting hired bringing his staff and Todd Bowles Kwan Alexander Lieven, and then JP getting hurt in us getting sue and cut McCoy and all the McCoy drama. And now this man days of our lives, it really is. I don't wanna hear at all that men don't like drama. We love the job. I love the drama. We just don't like drama where everybody stands around and talks as the difference. Watch watch woman's movie and watch a man's movie. We like to drama where talk. Now, have you ever launched the NFL network? What is Twitter people talking? Move actually doing something they're typing. Fill that we're always stayed in around and throw in there, talking while he'd do it. That's what I'm saying is such a low bar for action watching, what was movie vase sit around a table and eat. The whole something I guess that in breathing. That's, that's the bore for anyhow count. But typing does. To get type type it is not. Twitter. I said on Twitter and you said, you actually have to use your fingers. You're typing. I was being facetious. Okay. I don't see Twitter as a man's drama arena. Have you been on Twitter drama in at all the time? Full breakdown jerem signs with the Carolina Panthers. Whereas we like to call him Keaton's. I've got another word, I linked to column. I don't think it's not. This is a family show. There might be children in room. He got a one year deal with a four million dollar guarantee. That's the signing bonus other than that he and guaranteed Nutting three million dollar base salary five hundred thousand camp roster bonus five hundred thousand in forty five man per game. Bonus does that mean we don't know? Here's what I'm thinking, though is going to be broken up into six five hundred thousand is going to be broken up into sixteen paychecks at and he's got to be on the forty five man roster. Not fifty three man roster. He can't be a backup. Like the inactive. He can't be like third stream. Gotcha. Anyhow did. He's got incentives. If you get six and a half sacks, it's five hundred thousand if he gets eight secs, get some one point five million. He gets two hundred fifty thousand dollars for a Pro Bowl appearance, which that is just totally bummed to me, while would a team care. If your guy gets voted, most popular, it makes the team look doesn't now I don't know. People talk about people took put too much into a vacation because that's what it is. He's going to play football. Insist ed. Part of that contract. And then he gets two hundred fifty thousand for playoffs. You didn't just say that with confidence, you added side of things. All right. So that's total up to two ten point two five million but his guarantees four million. And if he makes it through the season staying on the fifty five man roster without making any of his sentence. He gets eight point five million something like that. I don't know someone to do the math, not that it matters not that it's a competition but we are winning sue got more money. What is sues incentives? They wanted to. Breakdown like this, you know why. Because because didn't text or sued didn't text Rick Stroud with his roster bonus numbers now. Wasn't it? After I'm being delirious tax Stroud. See you in week two supposedly, that's what we're extract said. He takes the tweeted that out he said, McCoy texted me, so you week two and then he goes, you may not hear McCoy say it, but the chance to play Tampa Bay twice to say nothing of the books giving away his number three to the Namakonha. Sue may have tipped the scales in the Panthers favors. Absolutely did. I don't think it's any coincidence, that the bucks tweeted that picture of ninety three and then like an hour later. Mccoy's like I'm gonna sign with the panther. Did you see the picture in the gloves gloves? Grams? It was funny. By the bucks marketing department, they should've Photoshop out, at least they should've gave him a pair of gloves. Right. But maybe those are gloves any likes him simple. You know, like maybe you break them in and it's just not the same. When you get a new. So Rick Stroud tweets this out and he said McCoy texted me this, but you may not hear it from Koi. Koi is going to be noun will he already? Did he texted, Rick Stroud, like like Rick Strahl was gonna tweet it out McCoy plays? These guys like chumps, what'd you calm? Useful idiots. Yeah. Maybe that's not maybe I shouldn't be named calling am I any better than Thomas passenger if I'm calling them looking. Well, that's something I guess we'll get. We'll get to the media here to moment, of course. But I want to go through this the sun. What do you what do you think about it? Molly, I think, okay, first of all, I'm going to get this out there. I was wrong. I actually had to go back and listen to the podcast, where we talked about where we thought McCoy would sign and why and I said he'd signed with Cleveland, for the money so I'm just throwing out there. Clearly, that's not what happen, clearly revenge petty petty. Revenge was more of an incentive then millions of dollars everybody more spot down on the podcast and just played on loops. Molly said she was wrong. Now, here's the thing, we're gonna get into this later to with the media, but Cleveland could away outbid both Baltimore and the paint supposedly one of the teams in. Iraq, poor says, probably the Ramon's actually bid double what the Panthers did. Okay. Well just blows away when I was getting everything. Out of the way. So it really wasn't the money, apparently, not it really wasn't going to championship team for sure. Talk about this. Let's talk about that we covered this earlier in the offseason. I did a know your enemy segment. I actually did a couple of them and we discussed all the changes that different teams in our division win through. So let me just recap that very quickly, and I've just highlighted the sections that are relevant to a Koi, as far as the coaching stock is so the in twenty eighteen in December head coach Ron Rivera, fired the defensive line coach and the secondary coach because because they were so bad. He took play Colleen responsibilities from the defensive coordinator, Eric Washington. He is going to retain those play Colleen duties in twenty nineteen Ron, Rivera is Eric Washington is a second year defensive coordinator like he's never. Been a defensive coordinator before, but he kept his job. He is going to be responsible for the front, seven the secondary's. So he's not having anything to do with the secondary defensive coordinator. That's only the front seven country. That's unusual and Sam mills was an assistant, defensive line coach. So after the other defensive line coach was fired in twenty seven twenty eighteen he was promoted to defensive line coach. So he's been an assistant and with the team since two thousand fifteen he was also named as the game management coordinator. Gosh, that means McCoy is going to have fifteen coaches just this year. Well, let's get on that. I know. Well, you have Sam mills defensive line coach. There's probably a systems thrown in there. Eric washington. There's only coaching the front seven the defensive coordinator, and then Ron Rivera is going to deal with play calling. So I mean, there's at least three or four cooks in the kitchen, right there. Will that'll be a good excuse from a quote when he doesn't do crap. And there was rumors that they were going to convert to three four, what is actually probably happening is that they're throwing more three four look. So they'll sell via four three but just kind of shake up the playbook a little bit just as a recap. They finished the Twenty-eight teen seasons. Seven nine they started this season six into Cam hurt shoulder and they finished the season one in seven. So they didn't do so. Well last season they were third in the division above us crush Burnley. Yes. Now falcons were third individ. Okay. Newton is a going through his soldiers told shoulder surgery. He's had his second shoulder surgery. He's still not throwing in Cambridge thing. Throw untold prep before preseason that preseason games that they blamed that loose streak on he was pretty horrible but he's never really had an arm to begin with. He's always been a runner. I mean he's got he could throw the ball deep but. Right. It doesn't hit the Mark and his receivers aren't good enough for that know the offense of line is probably worse than ours. At least we have consistency. They have no idea what's happening with their offense of line through left tackle, left tackle. Matt Kaleo was released because he just underperformed and had injury problems. So they only have him for two years, if we don't know where they don't know who's going to be left tackle right now. They drafted a left tack or a tackle in the second round and the six round but it's still completely up in the air. What they're gonna do the their center Ryan Kalil longtime center. No. He retired retard retired. And so they signed center Matt, Paradis from Minnesota. I think he was like their big free agent acquisition the season but they still have no clue what they're doing with offense of line. Now we. Talked about this in a prior podcast. I forget, who I think our offensive line coach when they had those press conferences on the assistance offense of line coach, Joe Gobert talked about offense blinding coming out of college that there's a steep learning curve, and it takes them along time to get acclimated to the position. Well Carolina has drafted to and. Yes. And they picked up one in free agency. Who is has one year of experience looks like it came from the bears. I'm sorry, he yes, he was on the bears practice squad for twenty seventeen. Then he playing with the Birmingham iron of the af that was low locus, but he's a guard, Brandon green, so they picked him up. They've kind of been doing offense of line carousel. They're just a mess. And when you rely on the run as we found last year, you need a good offense of line. What are they gonna do destroy destroy them? Telling you go into this screen passes to McCaffrey. And I really think that Ron Rivera is on the bubble. There was a lot of clamor last season when he had all this turnover with this coaching staff. I think he was at a point where it was like he needed to do. Something or else it was gonna cost him his job. And they lost their longtime running backs coach. He retired he retired. And he's been the one that's been keeping their running game. So fear's. Exactly. So they've got a lot of question marks turnover. Secondary is still woefully bad. They lost cabin Modernland this offseason. Let's go through that list. Okay. On their defense. Let's talk about defense has a whole Julius peppers gone retired. Thomas Davis not resigned. That's a huge laws. Right. I mean, they're front seven was so fears in the last two years, that's what they've been known for until these two pieces like that. They released cap Monir Lynn safety. Mike Adams, wasn't resigned. They did resign safety, Eric Corinne, some she has. So their team is what we're saying that because the narrative was one. Dermot coy was not looking for money, which, I guess you could kind of say that that's true. I mean, if there was another team that was willing to double that. And he didn't go there. Yeah. I think it's fair to say Cleveland could've offered him twenty million. Right. Braves. Couldn't have apparently they were willing to they were going to. Know if he was going to a contender, which is what the media was claiming. And that's what he said it would not have been the Panthers. Now, even would have they, what have they upgraded? They were third in the division last year. I think it was a six game losing streak towards the years. Right. And third quarterback can't throw the ball. They drafted a quarterback in there. So what makes them a contender nothing Bs who was the podcast that you love? That was saying that he was just getting sick and tired of hearing Durham McCoy say stuff that was ran on, Peter, Catherine computer casts. Yeah. Saying, look, I'm just tired of jerem McCoy Saint stuff, not fulfilling and that's that's awful here. It was just all talk. I mean, that's how in the offseason as always get to talk going on. So he's going to the Carolina Panthers. He's getting paid pretty decent money. But why do you think do you think it really is? Because he's being petty. I think that might be a part of it because an hour before he signed Rick Stroud, who apparently has texting buddy wrote an article, which changed the narrative immediately previously, it was pushed very hard that McCoy wants to sign with a contender. That was his major focus, right? We've all been hearing that. But yet right before it was an asset McCloy sign with the Panthers. Straddling article in the Tampa Bay times has had McCoy might choose the Panthers to get. Revenge on the bucks. Here's what he said, quote, Carolina favorites reached the postseason four times in the past six years. And we're in a c champions in two thousand fifteen losing to Denver in the Super Bowl quarterback, Cam Newton still is unable to throw after off season shoulder surgery and head coach, Ron Rivera has taken over floundering defense. What the painters can offer McCoy something that other teams can't revenge in quote it then then McCoy signs after this article comes out in lane tweets out, one hour after the suit revealed that he would indeed be wearing number ninety three Jared McCoy signed with the Panthers not a coincidence in quote. She said. So the narrative changed immediately, even before he signed with the Panthers. I can't believe okay now that you point that out. It's like everything. I've said in the last twenty minutes exactly that inet crazy just rates. Stop and you don't even realize it's impacted your opinion. Yeah. That's how they get you. They get you. Let's talk about what Jerry McCoy's doing here, though. He's gonna do the team that really is. We've said this on the podcast since the made of last year that they are on a steep decline. This is a team that we even made the prediction. You said that came Newton's not going to last the season this year, I said him Rivera going to be gone within couple years. I think Rivera will be gone. I at the end of the season if they don't turn it around. Really, they're up against the odds are angry. I don't think I think Cam would probably get another year or two, depending on we'd have to look at his contract when it's coming up and signing because I don't think he's not gonna get into a contract with airline. They love him though. That's because Carolina Panthers fans are mentally, unfit. If they weren't, they would be buccaneer fans. Here's the thing. I mean, this is really, really fascinating to me, because I mean, the narratives are just flying up and down they have been ever since the Aussies about what core is gonna do whether the team has treated him, right? Whether they're going to sign him, whether they're going to cut him, whether they're going to trade him. And then when they do cutting, whether he's going to a contender, whether he's going for money. And now he's going for revenge. Mccoy's played against the Panthers fifteen times in his nine year career with the buccaneers taxi had in those fifteen games. Fine. What would you say that you look at my notes? That's a low number five, but it's not as four and a half, only three and a half of those or against Cam Newton. He's only sect Cam Newton three and a half times nine years when now they're going to be on the same sign. So that doesn't matter. Right. Right. Right. But I'm getting to the getting. All right. He's had twelve total sacks. Our division in nine years, fifty four and a half out. That's channel sack number. Yes, fifty four and a half sacks only twelve of them have been in order to Beijing. I'm just flabbergasted. I know it gets even worse. Five of them have been the falcons. That's the most he sacked. That's because he got three of those in one game against against one linemen back. He was a horrible. I'm they took him out of the game. Mccoy. We've talked about McCoy didn't get any more sex. Nobody do. He's had four and a half against the Panthers. But he's only had two and a half against the saints. You know, when the last time it was he sector breeze. I think on top concede. Look at look twenty fifteen. Yes, he is not had a sack against your breeze since week till of two thousand fifteen. I do know that because I think you've said that before I do listen to you. Now mcgaughey plays over eighty percent of the snaps he has the buccaneers ever since he's been here. He's a three down defensive tackle with us. He's going to the Carolina Panthers who have can watch short Dante pogo as defensive tackles each of them play fifty percent. They bro Tate over there. He's going to get rotation. He's going to be in rotation. He's not going to get his eight hundred snaps a season he's not going to be getting sick sacks and he's definitely not going to be doing it against divisional opponents. He can't do it now when he's getting eighty percent of the snaps you're reducing this NASA by thirty percent. You expect them to get more sex not gonna happen not going to happen. And I tell you what he ain't go get a single sack on alley more pet who he's going to be going up against every now. And then pet him around a right guard. It's a little iffy there. We got better knock in there. We'll see been clicking. I known feet. Gets beat out of Spain moods. Not that McLean has been move everything, but McCoy is quick on the seat. But. That's why I think War, I can be in there or a guard as yet to be named Ryan Jensen. He's gonna be able to handle the Koi. They're talking about McCoy's going to be second. Jameis winston. It's hard to sack James Winston. That's champ best way to James Wisden's go, Donald Smith will be going to Donaldson McCoy likes to do the stunts though likes to run around and run into the defensive end. Right. So urban is going to get. That less access your. Yes, so short and Don, Terry power. They're starting defense of tackles, these guys, play fifty percents of the snaps appease, everybody on the defensive line plays about fifty percent of snaps Morio, Edison was the defensive and he was the only player on the defensive line that got over sixty percent of the snaps last year. He got sixty seven percent actually, so they rotate all the time Jeb, Oye Como at McCoy is going to be in that rotation. He's not going to be at three down back now. So that just really he had to have known that going in. He's not going to be three down back. He's not going to get the snaps. He needs to get the sacks. He needs because with he was playing eight hundred plus snaps the season and getting sick ax. You cut out that snaps you cut out the sacks. Do you think he wanted to maybe he wanted to cut back on his apparently, who didn't sues going to be a three down? Defensive tackle sue averages over nine hundred snaps of season. You know who only beats him in that as far as defensive tackles? No, no defensive tackles, do, but, you know who. Like players Philip rivers, Philip rivers is one of the only players that plays more than the congress. Do. Wow. Ridge has not missed a game in two eleven eighteen twelve years, something like that he's got perfect attendance. Perfect attendance as a star. Sue is a player soon get out there, and he plays. I mean he's on there and that's why he wanted kind of tamped bam sir because he knew I get to take the spot where I get to get every down McCoy's go into place where he's going to get half the downs so weird stuff going on there. But hey, if you want to say it's revenge. That's fine. We'll see them twice a year. It's gonna be great. There is no exactly Alamar pet knows how to beat him all day long. I think it'd be funny if they did they are in front of McCoy every day. What happened behind McCoy never Koi dances around on offense of line? He doesn't shoot straight ahead. So he might lined up in front of Ben and knock at the right guard and end up over by Ellie marvette, Donald Smith just the way he rolls. So he's not going to a contender. He's not doing it for the money. He's getting less snaps. He's going to be in a rotation with two guys that are getting more money than hill. Pose Nate making nine point three million can want show. It's making seventeen million which we're one of them they mess expensive. Yes. Last year stack or say, yes, it around flight three on the defensive tackles took their salary. Sack numbers and calculated who has the most expensive sacks go on short. I've got that around here somewhere. It's one of the podcast so, so McCoy is going to be behind two guys that are making more money than hill, just for the opportunity to play the bucket nears twice a year. If he has made that sounds kind of petty that absolutely is petty. I mean eighteen percent of the Panthers salary cap is going to defensive tackles, that's the most of the by far the last team to spend over seventeen percent of the total caps may sell the defensive tackle position was the two thousand fourteen Detroit Lions when they were paying the Dhamma conch sue a whopping twenty two million dollars. Third, especially for twenty four team number. What the tweet from Greg almond said that Carolina was spending over fifty million on the defensive line before signing McCoy, which is the most in the league where we heard this story before we heard this before. Hm last year. We spent what fifty two million on our defensive lands somewhere around the most expensive defensive line. Yes. Yes. Athletics, though, Jay. JP got swim, and have sex five and eleven. That's how it worked out for us. And it wasn't offense to problem. Now, one thing I would posit is the reason why McCoy signed with the Panthers as opposed to anywhere else is because they play in a system that he's for Mary with you said that they're going to have more three four looks we have three or four looks last year. Everybody does, you know. Right. And they're the rumors were out there. Switching to three four and Ron Rivera said, now we're not we're staying for three but throwing more three point luck. So, yes, the ravens in the Browns they play totally different systems than what McCoy's used to. So I think that this being comfortable and you know he knows the Panthers he's played twice a year. And as you just mentioned, to me in Rappaport, said that McCoy wanted to stay NFC south. South in the south because he's more comfortable in this out, because Kover I guess, not earned. Yeah. But he didn't go to a contender so they can take that narrative and buried six feet deep teams that are contenders. Here's a here's my list of teams that I would say these teams have the highest chance of going to the playoffs. There's only three patriots. Saints chiefs. Now they're not guaranteed. I mean, none of us know future. But if I were to say pick all the team from all the teams in NFL who would you bet money on is going to go to the playoffs. Those are the only three teams pick now I might would say, the cult's charges and Cowboys, maybe that it's tossup cross board none of teams wanting or they didn't go talk to him. Whatever wasn't no money thrown his way, I guess the kittens now. That's ridiculous. No, he did not go to a contender going to a contender was not his goal. And now he's saying he would just want to stay in the south. So what that leaving Jacksonville Miami, stay with the buccaneers, New Orleans could go New Orleans, southern teamer western team. Okay. So south Atlanta, you know, saintly. Yeah. The saints of the only ones in the group that were contenders. So that whole narrative they talked about for two weeks with him crap. Now. It's all about revenge. But as I pointed out, ain't no revenge to be had there. He's getting his snaps cut in half and he can't sack in his division, guess who's in his division, the bucket nears. He ain't never sat Jameis Winston. Pick you will that's going to be so fun, though. Now, I can't wait to watch that because I don't think offense of lime and really like jerem Aucoin, this is pure speculation on my part. When lovey Smith came in, Jeremiah was his sweetheart immediately talked about McCoy lead the defense mobile never their faith. I think and he was very clean. He he's the type of player that love is drawn to write in the first thing, lovey Smith did was totally cut off our offense of line. Now, Donald pin was on that offensive line. Donald pan is a he's more of a urban hip hop guy. And I was like going out along well plus offense wanted defensive line, rivalry stuff there. And I never heard any offensive lineman talk nice about McCloy, especially after they left and Jeremy Zuma was part of that line that got cut Jeremy's luta win on be starting center for the Baltimore Ravens. Well, we played the Baltimore Ravens at year and Jeremy's zoo. Wta beat the crap out of Jerrell McCoy, Donohoe offense blind date. But there's tape Jeremy Zuta hit McCoy so hard. He takes him off his feet quite flies back, like five ten yards. Yeah. I don't think often have lemon have a real love for general McCoy, so we're going to say when he comes and plays how Ranjitsinhji actually feels about jerem McCoy and I'm telling you this offense of line is gonna be a lot tougher. That was last year for a number of reasons. One as go make them. Tougher than they were last year to, we've got a new office of line coach. We don't have that. I hop wore hop teaching these guys how to run around. They're going to be a lot tougher. This year said he wants offense of land be tough unit and three and this is the biggest one they're going to be. Tougher because they're going up against the Donna Kong Soo during practice. No more this fancy dance footwork around. Let's have fun, Daryl McCoist off. You're going up against your business. I wanna step on your face domico. Sue, I guarantee you Evan. Smith has been talking about the Dhammika he had to play sue twice a year. He got step on few times. And I'm sure he's been telling everybody hey, guys, y'all need to y'all gonna have to watch out for this guy. So our offensive line is not going to be the SIV that everybody thinks it is, Jerry is only going to play against them, half the snaps and personally, I think they don't like him if past offense lineman, the way they treat jerem quote when they play against him as Indian occasion, they gonna be thrown him around knocked him off his feet. Tony back fifteen yards vestige must make elation. That's how I see things working out. What kind of impact do you take hell have on the Panthers front seven who has known for being one of the tougher? Visions in the one of the tougher units in the league, he's harder. Now, I do think the German Koi is going to toughen up a little bit getting fired and getting treated this way by the buccaneers basically being replaced by somebody who everybody considers or a lot of people consider the better player the tougher player. Mccoy's gonna feel like he's got the proof. But here's the thing when we don't know he could do it talks a lot. He's always talked. He's always talked a lot. We've always heard this. But he's never shown up now. Here's his opportunity, and this is Soviet. This is so beautiful. I love this because it is going to prove I don't know if I've ever seen this happen in football, but it's going to be proven beyond a doubt, who was the better pick. You know you got sue replacing Jeremy. I don't care. What suit says everybody knows he's replacing Jeremy Koi, he's taken his spot. He's taken his snaps. He's taken his number and jerem. Mccoy better. Hope you've got his wife and kids out of town, taking them to and McCoy's going to a division rival, and it's going to be playing against us twice a year. We're going to see how he performs up. Close impersonal. I'll tell you couldn't ask for anything better than this. We are going to know definitively by the end of this year. Who's the better defensive tackle? It was gonna be is gonna be question answered my prediction is McCoy's gonna get hurt. I think he's going to get injured not place to the season. And this might be his last playing less snaps I can see that you see, he's going to team, he's always been the defacto leader, the most respected by the coaches the media here at Tampa Bay. He's never had any competition. He's always been the highest paid or the second highest paid on the team. He's the one that gets all the attention all the recognition now, he's going the Carolina where he's not even going to be in the top five. They got Leuke cly. Got Cam Newton. They got McCaffrey. They got Cohen short. They got done, Terry PO he's done a long list, he's not gonna be getting media attention. He's used to he's not going to get his picture on the side of those stadiums. The banners and downtown Charlottesville that they play Charlet you know, he's, he's stepping down, CLYDE bit here, and I think that it's going to it's going to mess with him, physically and mentally because you gotta figure if he wants to get in front of Cohen, short and Don, Terry, one of them was either going to have to get injured or he's going to have to outplay them to be. I mean right now, he's second-string crazy that he's second-string. He's come on short. Are you are you? Thank you. Know. No. Why would they he's on tested? They don't know how he's gonna play maybe after training camp. They might put him in front or whatever. But still either way he's only gonna get snaps bigger rotating Monroe take him in. Everybody's gonna be rotated in Carolina does. And so he's going to have to if he wants it. He's going to have to work much much harder than he did hear the buccaneers, which opens him up to injury. He gets injured a lot anyhow. So if he pushes himself harder, he's more likely get hurt. So I think it will be possibility. Go doesn't make good season point. Yeah, that's just speculation telling speculation of course because it's the future. I think his size he's a lot, leaner than it used to be used to have a lot more weight on him. And he's a lot more toned now Egan. Yeah. How much of an impact Baskin I saw it worked for kapernick? Yeah. Just Atip it there, I think is worth mentioning all gushes be so fessing minute, which the season started the Morrow actually this has been jealous fun as a regular season. I'm still watching football old games, but which the next podcast breakdown of can show Bryce type a hill. That's more media bashing to do as well. Don't wanna bring it up. We're just trying to keep strictly about McCoy and the kittens, which is great. This is. You couldn't ask for any more. This offseason, is everything I've wished for the buccaneers saints with good time long longtime. Wow. This is exciting. Anther is don't start. There minicamp until next week. Did we find out if they have contacted minute? Now I tweeted I Greg Allman, but he hasn't the answer. It's only four days and then they have like six or seven weeks until might be training camp. They don't put the pads on. I think it's probably trying to this is just made the Tory many camp saying, just getting everybody together, basically deal what they've already been dealing. I guess Novak's tweet graphic today about the off season workout, so from anti-tory mandatory minicamp. They have practiced Tuesday Thursday ten hours a day. That's a long. Yeah. They're allowed to practices, totaling three and a half hours, each so seven hours total. They're practicing and then three hours doing other stuff. The second practice is limited to walk through activties. So it's three and a half hours of walk through. Yeah, well, I listen to pew report today, and they mentioned that even though the OTA royals they're not supposed to. May contact the rookie have been making contact and not as loan. Toby saying that will get us find them. Who said Peter require getting along overzealous nothing. You don't say I'm saying they should be saying. Aeriens is going to get drummed for that one that happened a few years ago where some reporters Redskins or something they reported offhandedly that there was contact at a practice and the coach ended up getting suspended or fine. Do that in a follow up. So, yeah, it seems like a lot of people are excited about this. A lot of people are sad that McCoy is being treasonous. Do you think that's going to impact his ring honored chances? I don't know. The ring of honor stuff to me is popularity contest. Again, it doesn't really matter that much to me. But McCoy, he's a great marketer. I think he'll be able to pull himself out of this. But as right now, I think a lot of buccaneer, fans who support McCoy are really, really disappointed with him right now. I would be, but there is a contingent of people who are happy for McCoy, that he's going to be getting revenge on buck near me. That's weird mindset to have. If you're a buccaneers fan, I don't get that it was a couple of riders. Evan winner for the bucks nation. He's actually rooting for McCoy in this situation. It's, it's just weird to me. I mean, I'm of the opinion. Once you leave our team you dead to me. When you go in our division. You are enemy number one so well. Can that can't gorge Gerald McCoy? You know. And here's the thing, it was very, very looking back on it now in retrospect, very, very smart of areas, and like to not have him coming to OTA's, and all that, so that he doesn't have any information on their schemes game plans at all to share with. That's trying thought about that. I wonder if even got the play no guarantee. They kept him away from one Buc place. He wasn't allowed to go in that area and showed up that day, remember when he came into the building and McCoy was there too greedy. That was probably the last time John McCall was able to step in one book, close about areas was all nice. When everything might have said. Well, you know, son, we're going to have to keep out here too. We what to do with you on the roster or what you're gonna do about whatever that was last time, he put in there probably idea LA you say that tell you what if anything, Bruce Arians is not GIC mother effor, strategic strategically, so no matter what your feelings are about jerem coin, whether you're happy, he's gone. Whether you're sad. He's. He's gone. Whether you happy, he's getting revenged going to Carolina or upset you, hey, be thrilled to death because this is exciting crap. This is once in a generation football experience here. This does not happen. It's realized southbound bre and falling before your is right. Queer we're going to get the cease of fun, stuff and start running away. We to not even week to four days after the start a week walkman on Thursday night football. You know, that's going to be the whole story, the whole story, Thirty-nine football. They're going to be talking about the Dom Khan sue and Jeremy Koi, awesome. And soon comes through on stuff like that. Sues? Well those players he plays when a manner he plays great in great games. Now, let's kind of criticism of him was that he didn't show up till the playoffs critising. Yeah. You played great playoffs in the SuperBowl. Right. So never even sniff that mess. Every time he's had an opportunity to show up Thursday night game one and that game he just disappears the Baltimore games perfect example, going up against Jeremy Zuta. He lost that one. You know, there's some other ones I won't say Ted Larsen to, I can't remember Daven Joseph. That's right. Daven Joseph beat the mess outta hill with the carnal. Didn't he I'll take it was a car? It might have been Carl. I've got clips Daven Joseph just whooping him up and down the field was the Saint Louis Rams. Two thousand fourteen Joe's ball gerbil coin that game. So Jeremy has the opportunity to step up in big games, or games that have, meaning it just seems like it never happens. The domico sue another hand seems to be the exact opposite. When it's. Big game. He steps up, or he steps on you, I think it was thanksgiving game when he stepped on Aaron Rodgers or maybe one way stepped on Evan Smith. Yeah. Yeah. Thanksgiving, which I'm going to go through all that sues penalties and stuff next podcast as part of the, the bashing the media segment, we still have come up with an aim for them, y'all. Got an idea for a name lemon. So no matter what to repeat, no matter. Whether you San happy about this whole situation be excited because you may be proven right or wrong this coming year. But just the fact that you have a chance to find out the odds are astronaut, and it's gonna happen. This is going to be glorious. No matter what. Hey, even it comes out in tears us a new one. That'll be awesome for us. But it'll be like, hey, there we go. We now it's not gonna happen. But man, that's going to be a media vent of epic proportions Thursday night football is going to blow that up so big, and then we meet them in London the London game. That's right. Oh my gosh. Which sucks because, you know, we're not gonna get to see them at Jade Stadium now coming for him. No interesting. All right. That's gonna wrap it up for us guys. I want appreciate everybody shared our podcast on their social media. It's really been fantastic responsible gun guns, that if you get a chance, just go ahead, click the chair button, your app or wherever you're at listening to it. Post this episode on social media somewhere Twitter. Facebook, whatever you're happy with if you wanna get in touch with. I to get in touch with me. My Email is Molly Bay Buccaneers observer dot com. Ralph can be reached Ralph of book nears observer dot com. We're on Twitter at bucks underscore observer, we're now on Facebook where also on the world one win buccaneers observer dot com. There's all kinds of stuff where we're gonna be talking about this. Jeremy cohen. The domico assu situation, probably all year, but this situation right here where he's gone in the Panthers. I'm sure they're self. We're going to think of, we'll bring it up. Next podcast we might not have won out tomorrow. We might just wait till Friday to do the next one. But anyhow, if we think of anything, we'll go ahead and put it in that podcast. But until next time ex.

Donaldson McCoy Panthers Ron Rivera Carolina Carolina Panthers Cam Newton buccaneers Twitter Jeremy Koi Sue defensive coordinator Tampa Bay Football football NFL Jeremy Donald Smith Evan Smith Iraq
Episode #16  New Year, New Focus, New Beginnings: Julie McCoy

OC Talk Radio

27:33 min | 1 year ago

Episode #16 New Year, New Focus, New Beginnings: Julie McCoy

"You're listening to workplace perspective and Employment Law podcast presented by Sapphire legal workplace perspective is a regular podcast series for employers and employees. He's focusing on education training and the law to help organizations of all sizes develop and maintain successful workplace relationships. The opinions expressed by guests on workplace perspective do not necessarily reflect those of Sapphire legal or it's attorneys eggs should not be considered legal advice and now here's your host founder and principle attorney at Sapphire Legal Theresa McQueen thank you James and welcome welcome everyone to workplace perspective where we are striving to raise the bar at workplaces everywhere on today's show the first of the New Year. We're talking with life coach Julie McCoy of Dragonfly coaching about new beginnings in the New Year Julia was I was our first guest has to the New Year last year and we received such positive feedback on the show that we decided to bring her back again for our first show twenty nineteen as a life coach and retired attorney Julie's going to show her unique perspective on helping individuals in setting and achieving their life goals. It's going to be a great show. I want a great year. Don't go away. We'll be right back. The opinions expressed by guests on workplace perspective do not necessarily reflect those of Sapphire legal or it's attorneys Ed should not be considered legal advice. You're listening to workplace perspective and Employment Law podcast presented by Sapphire legal. Welcome back to our listeners and welcome back to workplace perspective Julie McCoy. Thank you so much for having me again. I'm honored to be back. I'm really excited to have you here but before we get started. Why don't you tell our listeners a little bit about yourself and about got your professional background sure I'd be happy to so I spent <hes> thirty five years in the trenches so to speak as trial and appellate lawyer <hes> a profession that was very good to me and I enjoyed it very much but <hes> after those thirty five years I retired in August and I am now professionally trained a life coach and I'm coaching <hes> some former colleagues among others and <hes> and loving my my new life in my new profession that's awesome? It's a great transition and I remember in the first show that you did for us. We talked about how unique that transition is and how it kind of parallels a lot and some of the things we'll talk about today all kind of do the same thing because it really is a great transition so we're talking about New Beginnings New Year's new focus new beginning so how'd You Beginnings Figure Into Life Coaching. Oh well the answer that is prominently <hes> so so the primary goal of of like life coaching is <hes> personal on transformation and so most people who come to coaching come with a goal in mind of <hes> adopting a new habit or discarding an old one <hes> adopting a new way of being discarding an old way of being in other words change in a word which is what transformation entails we hope for <hes> big and bold <hes> life changes that really have an impact on the on the person's life and their <hes> their life satisfaction their fulfillment as human being but sometimes small things <hes> lead to bigger transformations and are are equally satisfying to my clients so each person is unique. Each person decides what kind line of transformation they want to embark on and <hes> and I help them hopefully achieve that well and I like the transformation idea because <hes> I remember when we did the first I we talked about the fact that life coaching. It's not about chuck it all take this job and you know Johnny paycheck it. It's it's about transforming not just chuck it all in but we're you at where you know. How are you doing it so what kinds of when you're talking about transforming? What kinds of things are you talking about? You know coaching spans the entire realm of human endeavour so some some clients come to coaching because they WANNA make a career change. Some people come to coaching because they're not satisfied in their current position and WanNa find <hes> ways to make it satisfying. Some people come to coaching for things that have nothing to do with their their work life right so it could be relationship. Issue could be finances health and fitness <hes> <hes> work life balance. Finding meaningful things to do with their with their down time diversions so it really spans the gamut and and from time to time it changes sometimes over over the course of of coaching client they they'll start off in one one direction and and it will be the goal will expand or it will change because life happens right so do you what are some of the some of the less traditional things that people come to a life coach about <hes>. That's a good question so <hes> well one of the one of the less traditional ones that I had recently was a client who had no hobbies couldn't figure out a hobby but what wanted one so we coached on on finding a hobby that would be it really as funny as that sounds. It's really important. I notice it more in from my perspective I see retirement where people are coming up on retirement very quickly and they all of a sudden realize why never really thought about what I'm GonNa do and they don't have hobbies so we'll go to that person for reaching out to find someone to help them do that. I love it exactly and on the on the tool that we use in coaching all the wheel of life. It's it's a traditional coaching tool where we have the the new client coming into the coaching relationship complete. It's it's a wheel and it has the sectors that make up most people's lives family and relationships <hes> love life friendships money work mark <hes> diversion <hes> everything you can think of that you know most people find they need to have in their life to live a satisfying life so what what's interesting is some people <hes> come into coaching with the idea that they have everything all dialed in and and very often my clients really do they. They really are sorted out but they'll be one piece. That's Kinda like Outta. Whack it hasn't received the same attention as other parts parts of their lives and it's understandable you know I work with a lot of busy professionals so it makes sense that sometimes their their work. Life is all squared away. They're very accomplished but maybe the their <hes> health and fitness is is is being sacrificed to that or perhaps their family relationships are communication are friendships so it's it's <hes> it's interesting and and as you said when people are on the cusp of retirement they do begin to talk more about what am I gonNa do with myself. That's a common coaching topic but what I mentioned before was kind of less common of very busy person who came into coaching needing needing a hobby needing a diversion I just think that's really interesting and and when we were prepared for this show you talked about. I remember you mentioning the wheel of life. So how important is it that you strive to make the coaching experience about the individual as a complete person like you said and not just someone on focused on the traditional okay where do i. Where do I see myself in five years? I think people think traditionally well. That's what you go to someone for. Where am I going to go? How am I going to get there? This person going to help me get there. There's more to it than that. This this idea is far more to it than that really. Coaching is about achieving personal fulfillment wherever you are and you're you're not at the five year place yet. So what do we do in in today's world where you are. Maybe you WANNA make a career change in five years but right now you're staying in the in the the position you're in. How do we make that more satisfying before you or perhaps it's not even about the workplace it's about things outside of work that that can transform you as a person and make you feel more fulfilled and satisfied while you're at work so it's really coaching is about coaching the total person and we talk about <hes> not coaching the topic so you're <hes> by? Where do you see yourself in five years? <hes> query is really more topical and Want Life Coaching at least the model that I studied and I know what it's about is that is the total person how do we bring transfer transformation and fulfillment the person right now in the here and now y could see how that would really bring up way more more issues than you know because professionals and people very busy at work and focused on work no matter what level you're at. It's very easy to compartmentalize that to say well. I'm going to look at my career but I could imagine if you start talking about someone. One in whole person capacity when they come to you and this is their focus so how does that work so they come to you and they're very focused minded and you start asking all of these other questions about their life and other things do you do you get pushed back or do you get appreciation creation for wow okay so not so much. It's it's not really a matter of pushback because coaching is the client's agenda. I always let them set it. Even if someone who I know to have a relationship problem right a big issue comes demand says the issue I want to coach on my kitchen. Pantry is disorganized and I want that's what we coach on right and we'll because every person is naturally creative resourceful and whole and and they know what their agenda it is and what I find happens in the course of the coaching relationship because it is a very it's a very intimate and trusting relationship. It's completely confidential. What I find is that people begin to dig deeper in Tinley? It's not about the kitchen pantry. It's there's some other things going on that provide a richer playground for her coaching around than something more mundane yeah I could see that because I I would imagine people would I could just see the correlations because someone who's very organized right that might be what they're focusing on but that's also probably if they really looked at that that whole issue is seeped into other areas of their life not just their personal life and work-life and maybe some of their relationships. I could really see that so when you get that because now we're talking about someone who's come in with one idea and now they're they're looking at the whole person they understand the concept becoming complete so how do you help a client. Stay on track toward a new beginning or a goal that they might have identified. That's really all over them. That's a really good question and that is the key role of the coach. One of the key roles is to keep the conversation Asian on track very often. What happens is especially client? That has a big life goal a client who wants to leave a relationship or wants to make a job change or to relocate if it's a really big thing typically what what happens is at some point as we're starting to make progress and we have the surrounding dialogue going and some movement is happening all the sudden. There's a wall and sometimes that wall shows up as just procrastination intonation. Oh I didn't do my homework. I didn't get to it because I thought you have time. Sometimes there's homework. That's part of the process. Hey Yeah yeah but but a lot of it's a lot of it's really fun and some of its is no more complicated located in just contemplating what we call an inquiry to think about something over a period of time in between the coaching sessions but but anyway what happens very often as just when the clients on the cusp of making a breakthrough through we'll see the barriers start to appear and lose a real because like I said before life happens and I understand that and but I have to do as a coach is try to ferret out. was that life happening that caused my client and not do what he or she committed to do at our last session or or is it really another voice of saboteurs voice coming in from behind saying to my client. What are you doing what you can't do that? Are you kidding me. You're going to fail neil recordings in our heads right exactly and and sometimes they're not even our heads imposer people in our lives right because when we try to make big changes that people who are close to us that sometimes makes them uncomfortable too so sometimes they're in our head but sometimes there's thousands appearance friends right yeah right. Well intentioned very well intention but that yeah changes is a difficult process in comfortable. It's uncomfortable for the person doing winging for those who are close to US watching us do it. That's awesome well. We're GONNA take a quick break and when we come back Julie's going to share more life goal insights and some tips and insights into this great area of life coaching. Stay with us. We'll be right back <music> hello. It's me that designer jeans and the back of your closet what happened to us. I used to summer in the Hamptons and now I'm stuck behind a pair of sweats. Okay maybe I never really fit you right but I got a lot more Sunday. Fun Days left in me so take me to goodwill where I can really make a difference your donations to goodwill create jobs training programs and education assistance for people in your community to find your nearest donation center go to Goodwill Dot O._R._G.. Donate stuff create jobs a message from goodwill and the Ad Council learn everything you need to know about the new legislative and regulatory changes for twenty nineteen by joining Sapphire Legal and Ellen done insurance on January fifteenth for our annual Twenty Twenty Nineteen Employment Law update visit our website at Sapphire legal dot com for more details or call us at nine four nine five three five five to six six. We love to hear from our listeners. If you have questions feedback back or unique workplace perspective or experience you'd like to share email us at perspective at Sapphire Legal Dot Com or get in touch the are Sapphire legal facebook page. Just use the HASHTAG workplace perspective in your post so we know you want your question on the show and together we'll continue to raise the bar at workplaces everywhere. Welcome back everyone. We're talking with dragonfly coaching life coach Julie Mccoy about setting and achieving life goals in the new year so Julie kind of talking about it's from a complete person perspective. How do you know you're talking about? You could sense when someone was coming up to a barrier and so is that how you know that someone's kind of on the on the cusp of a good change when you start to see those walls and some sometimes but it's not always like that with some clients and I would say this is more the exception than the rule with some clients. What you see is an actual an Aha <hes> moment you know that epiphany that happens when suddenly it's not just a theoretical conversation anymore but there's real byin and the client instead of talking around an issue like it would be nice to data the client is suddenly I want that that's the thing that I want for myself? I'm committed to that. I'm going to do that and that's really cool to see happen doesn't always work that way and it never happens during the coaching session oddly early enough and you tease me about the homework but oddly enough part of the <hes> what we use the homework for in coaching is to keep the issue percolating in the client's mind in between sessions and that tends to be where a lot of the good stuff happens and where the a home moments come in is the Klein is is either doing homework or thinking about what was discussed in the session and and why they want whatever ever it is you know they're coaching on and that's where <hes> where that sometimes comes in but like you said it's more the exception than the rule typically I have to be more aware for things like diversions like with the Clients Coaching on one thing week after week after week and then suddenly they show up with a something autumn complete left field or they're procrastinating and you know not doing the thing they committed to do over and over again. I think the whole thing it's really interesting I really do find the the whole concept of looking at those questions and it sounds so much like traditional therapy. We probably have some people out there going. This sounds awfully like therapeutic counseling psychology crossing over in any way but there's got to be a little get up. Do you see any type of a crossover. How do you draw that line because you know his attorneys were used to that council a role where sometimes you know that client just wants to you know they just WanNa talk and so you take that on but no it's actually VIP coaching is very different from traditional <hes> psychotherapy? Some people like Dan. I don't totally buy into this but some people like to say that psychotherapy is about what happened in the person's past and coaching is about the future but that isn't entirely true because therapists therapists work with with their clients futures too. I think what is different is that and I'll speak from my own experience. My clients are very highly functioning individuals. If I sense there's some really deep seated emotional emotional issue. I will refer them out to therapist. I'm not a therapist. I'm not licensed to do that. Work so Mike Lancer Dave already most of them already achieved a lot in their lives and as I said before they're pretty much like ninety percent sorted out ten. In percents is not fulfilling to them. It's not working the way they want it to so I I am I am <hes> aware of those issues <hes> but I really very seldom seen that happen where I felt that someone how to really deep seated emotional issue that required a therapist but on the other hand on one of the students when I was undergoing coach training one of the students in my class was was a licensed psychotherapist and she wanted to bring the coaching tools into her therapy practice which it is interesting that is interesting because you think they'd have all the tools they need already to address. These issues no matter where what would be. I like that <hes>. I think that's great yeah. That's a great thing and what happens if you're going along Aung client comes in they have goal you've talked about you know the complete person thing and all of that but then all of a sudden they change their mind about the goal that they set. What does that do to the whole the whole train you've been on does derail things or will well it can and sometimes the trains should be derailed because life happens you know and sometimes the client shows up with one thing they want to coach on and life intervenes and and suddenly something else takes priority and that other thing is is not so important? Sometimes it's a diversion as I said it could be that the client the verse goal the Real Goal of the coaching got too big and scary and they were getting too close to making a breakthrough in realizing this entails real real change and you know the human animal being what we are change is hard for us. We seek we seek the comfort of the place where we've always been the place that we know a little voice inside of each of us tells us that that's the safe place and we should stay there and not explore the unknown when you know quite often. It's the most dangerous place to be but something inside US tells us Let's maintain the status quo and stone you know rock. The boat when I started encountering that I have to figure out is this is this change in goal is a genuine. Is it really driven by something that happened in the client's life that we really need to pick up this different and that's fine because it's the client's agenda but if it really seems like it's a diversion what that I won't do as a coach is because coaches never judge. It's the client is never has never wrong and so the coach's role is to be curious about okay so let's see for nine weeks. We've been talking about a career change and today we're GonNa talk about the Pantry so and maybe that's fine bless. Find out what's going on. What's driving this? How important is this pantry thing? Are we going to go back to the career changer. We don't want that. It's a matter of of probing and finding with what's really behind this change of course well that makes me think about so if someone's thinking about new beginnings new focus. What kind of questions should they be asking themselves not about? How do I go find a coach but I mean what kind of questions should they ask themselves that they are considering new focuses in new beginnings? The role of the life coach is to ask probing questions right the open ended questions that caused the client to do the kind of soul-searching that that is really part of the of the coaching process because that's where the transformation happens and I think that's an important distinction. There's an important Distinction Distinction between a coaching conversation and a conversation that you would have with a trusted friend over glass of wine right because the typical trusted friend. If you come to said friend with a problem they're going to give you advice. They're going to say we'll win. That happened to me. Here's what I did or here's something you know sued down the street because we're very solution and base extremely based. You know what I love about. This coaching model is just respects the integrity of the person and honors that each of us really has her own solutions we really do they might be covered up by all those voices of family the saboteur voice in our own head that says you can't do that. It's dangerous. You might fail but our solutions are really in there so if a coach is effective they ask the right open and ended questions. We don't want to ask a leading question right and supply the answer but the open ended questions that caused the client to do the soul searching and mined for the answers that they already have inside can. Can you think of a type of question that I could ask myself before. I even decided if I need it like coach or if I'm just thinking about it what's important to me. What do I value? What do I want to honor in my life? I like the idea that someone's thinking about it kind of questions. Can they ask themselves to start that internal dialogue with themselves because maybe there's searching and maybe they don't know maybe it is work. I've been stuck in this job for a long time. I really want to go after that promotion and then going back to that idea that but there's something going on. I want to make some kind of a change. I don't WanNA leave my job. I like my company or if you don't like my company. It sounds to me like that's almost the wrong question to ask. Would you agree with that because the right question sounds like the internal question yeah I agree. I think the in in coaching the questions that we most often employ are questions that sound like why is that important to you. How would your life be different if you were to implement that in your life what's something else you might do? What other things have you considered? If you were to embark on that course what's the first step that you might take things like that. What's really thought provoking? I like that because it does it ask the right questions and and hopefully they're thinking about new beginnings innings and you focuses it will focus a minute goodway year helping people make decisions and make choices. Do you ever find that your clients become dependent on you in their decision making process never and and the reason is it goes back to my answer sir about the Difference Between the conversation in coaching and the conversation with a trusted friend because the coach never tells the client what to do or judges the clients choices. I might be curious about a choice especially if it differs from what we've been talking about for weeks I might be curious but I'm never going to judge the client because every every client is naturally creative resourceful and whole so I I'm not gonNa tell the client what to do. I'm not going to to make <unk> judgments about what choices they make. I'm going to ask the questions to get them thinking. It's really important to honor one of the goals of coaching which is to leave the client more equipped to deal with life and not less so and very often when we go to trusted advisers and I'm not saying there's anything wrong that has a role in everyone's life but very often creates dependency on that person where WH- right might begin to feel that we can make a decision or at least not important important one without input from Said Advisor to the goal of coaching is really to empower the client to have the confidence and feel that they have the internal resources when the same issue shows up or a similar issue in the future they they can. They can grapple with it themselves because they've learned those skills but it's sounds like it's learning a skill if they don't if they don't come to you with that. It's learning a great skill. I think it's very much about learning skill right. We're just about out of time so what some parting being wisdom or some tips that you have for us for our listeners in our last few minutes I know your audience is very high functioning and probably they have everything very well dialed in of course they do but I have never met a person myself assault concluded who could not benefit from for making some changes or tweaking one area of life right and I've I've worked with some very very accomplished <hes> professionals who had everything together except for one thing and and that's the thing that that we coach on so I I believe it's a tool that can help pretty much. Anyone and most life coaches offer on free sample sessions. It's very hard to understand what coaching is from talking about it right. You really have to experience it so most coaches myself included offer free sample sessions all you do is you show up with your topic. Whatever it is big or small and you spend a half an hour kicking it around and you get a feel for what coaching thing is about and whether it might serve you or not great advice well? That's our show for today. I WanNa thank you so much Julie for joining me on our first show the New Year thank you for having this great expertise that you have and providing our listeners with Elvis great information thank you if you want to find out more about Julie and dragonfly coaching you can find them on the web at dragonfly coach Julie Dot Com. That's D. R. A. G. O. N. F. L. Y.. Coach Julie Dot com you can also connect. Would you leave the our website at Sapphire legal dot com slash podcast and clicking on episode sixteen. I want to also thank our listeners for joining us my radio angels James and the nave at night and workplace perspectives team extraordinaire engineer producer Paul Roberts but music provided.

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Episode #16  New Year, New Focus, New Beginnings: Julie McCoy

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28:03 min | 1 year ago

Episode #16 New Year, New Focus, New Beginnings: Julie McCoy

"You're listening to workplace perspective and Employment Law podcast presented by Sapphire legal workplace perspective is a regular podcast series for employers and employees. He's focusing on education training and the law to help organizations of all sizes develop and maintain successful workplace relationships the opinions expressed by guests on workplace perspective. Do you not necessarily reflect those of Saphire legal or it's attorneys egg should not be considered legal advice and now here's your host founder and principle attorney at Sapphire Legal Theresa McQueen. Thank you James and welcome. Oh come everyone to workplace perspective where we are striving to raise the bar at workplaces everywhere on today's show the first of the New Year. We're talking with Life Coach Julie McCoy Dragonfly coaching about new beginnings in the New Year Julia was I was our first guest as to the New Year last year and we received such positive feedback on the show that we decided to bring her back again for our first show twenty nineteen as a life coach and retired attorney Julie's GonNa show her unique perspective on helping individuals in setting and achieving their life goals. It's going to be a great show. When a great year don't go away? We'll be right back. The opinions expressed by guests on workplace perspective do not necessarily reflect those of Sapphire legal or it's attorneys Ed should not be considered legal advice. You're listening to workplace perspective and Employment Law Podcast podcast presented by Sapphire legal. Welcome back to our listeners and welcome back to work place perspective Julie McCoy. Thank you so much for having me again. I'm honored to be back. I'm really excited to have you here but before we get started. Why don't you tell listeners a little bit about yourself and about out your professional background sure I'd be happy to so I spent a thirty five years in the trenches so to speak as trial and appellate lawyer <hes> a profession that was very good to me and I enjoyed it very much but <hes> after those thirty five years I retired in August and I am now professionally trained <hes> Life Coach and I'm coaching <hes> some former colleagues among others and <hes> and loving my my new life and my new profession that's awesome? It's a great transition and I remember in the first show that you did for us. We talked about how unique that transition is and how it kind of parallels a lot and some of the things we'll talk about today kind of do the same thing because it really is a great transition so we're talking about New Beginnings New Year's new focused new beginning so how'd You Beginnings Figure Into Life Coaching. Oh well the answer that is prominently so so the primary goal of of like life coaching is personal on transformation and so most people who come to coaching come with a goal in mind of <hes> adopting a new habit or discarding an old one <hes> adopting a new way of being discarding an old way of being in other words change a word which is what transformation entails we hope for <hes> big and bold <hes> life changes that really have an impact on the on the person's life and their <hes> their life satisfaction their fulfillment as human being but sometimes small things <hes> lead to bigger transformations and are are equally satisfying to my clients so each person is unique. Each person decides what kind kind of transformation they want to embark on and and I help them hopefully achieved that well. I like the transformation idea because <hes> I remember when we did the first I we talked about the fact that life coaching he's not about chuck it all take this job and you know Johnny paycheck it. It's it's about transforming not just chuck it all in but where you at where you know how are you doing it so what kinds of when you're talking about transforming. What kinds of things are you talking? What about you know coaching spans the entire realm of human endeavour so some some clients come to coaching because they WANNA make a career change? Some people come to coaching because they're not satisfied in their current <hes> position and WanNa find <hes> ways to make it satisfying. Some people come to coaching things that have nothing to do with their their work life right so it could be relationship. Issue could be finances health and fitness <hes> <hes> work life balance finding a meaningful things to do with their with their downtime diversions so it really just spans the gamut and and from time to time it changes sometimes over over the course of of coaching client they they'll start off in one one direction and and it will the goal will expand or it will change because life happens right so do you what are some of the what are some of the less traditional things that people come to alive coach about <hes>. That's a good question so <hes> one of the one of the less traditional ones that I had recently was a client who had no hobbies couldn't figure out a hobby but what wanted one so we coached on on finding a hobby that would be it didn't really funny that sounds it's really important. I noticed that more in for my perspective I see retirement where people are coming up on retirement very quickly and they all of a sudden realize why never really I thought about what I'm going to do and they don't have hobbies so we'll have that person for reaching out to find someone to help them do that. I love it exactly and on the on the tool that we use in coaching all the wheel of life. It's it's a traditional coaching tool. Well where we have the the new client coming into the coaching relationship complete. It's it's a wheel and it has the sectors that make up most people's lives family and relationships <hes> love life friendships money work work <hes> diversion <hes> everything you can think of that you know most people find they need to have in their life to live a satisfying life so what's interesting is some people <hes> come into coaching with the idea that they have everything all dialed in and very often my clients really do they. They really are sorted out but they'll be one piece. That's kind of like outta whack it hasn't received the same attention as other parts parts of their lives and it's understandable. You know I work with a lot of busy professionals so it makes sense that sometimes their their work. Life is all squared away. They're very accomplished but maybe the there <hes> health and fitness. Is is is being sacrificed to that or perhaps their family relationships are communication are friendships so it's it's <hes> it it's interesting and as you said when people are on the cusp of retirement they do begin to talk more about what am I going to do with myself. That's a common coaching topic but what I mentioned before was kind of less common of very busy person who came into coaching needing needing a hobby needing a diversion I just think that's really interesting and and when we were preparing for the show you talked about remember you mentioning the wheel of light. So how important is it that you strive to make the coaching experience about the individual as a complete person like you said and not just someone focused on the traditional okay okay where do i. Where do I see myself in five years? Yeah I think people think traditionally well. That's what you go to someone for. Where am I gonNA go? How am I going to get there this person GonNa help me get there? There's more to it than that. This this idea is far more to it than that really. Coaching is about achieving personal fulfillment wherever you are and you're you're not at the five year place yet. So what do we do in in today's world where you are. Maybe you WANNA make a career change in five years but right now you're staying in the in the a position you're in. How do we make that more satisfying for you or perhaps it? It's not even about the workplace it's about things outside of work that that can transform you as a person and make you feel more fulfilled in satisfied while you're at work so it's really coaching is about coaching the total person and we talk about <hes> not coaching the topic so you're <hes> by. Where do you see yourself in five years? <hes> query is really more topical and Went What Life Coaching at least the model that I studied in. I know what it's about is that is the total person how do we bring transfer fee transformation and fulfillment to the person right now in the here and now why could see how that would really bring up way more or issues than you know because professionals and people very busy at work and focused on work no matter what level you're at. It's very easy to compartmentalize that to say well I just I'm going to look at my career but I could imagine if you start talking about someone went in whole person capacity when they come to you and this is their focus so how does that work so they come to you and they're very focused minded and you start asking all of these other questions about their life and other things do you do you get pushed back or do you get appreciation nation for wow okay so not so much. It's it's not really a matter of pushback because coaching is the clients agenda. I always let them set it. Even if someone who I know to have a relationship problem right a big issue comes demand says the issue I want to coach on my kitchen. Pantry is disorganized and I want that's what we coach on right and we'll because every person is naturally creative resourceful in whole and and they know what their agenda is and what I find happens in the course of the coaching relationship because it is a very it's a very intimate entrusting relationship. It's completely confidential. What I find is that people begin to dig deeper in Tinley? It's not about the kitchen pantry. It's there's some other things going on that provide a richer playground for her coaching around than something more mundane yeah I could see that because I would imagine people would I could just see the correlations because somebody who's very organized right that might be what they're focusing on but that's also probably if they really looked at that that whole issue is seeped into other areas of their life not just their personal life work-life and maybe some of their relationships really see that so when you get that because now we're talking about someone who's come in with one idea and now they're they're looking at the whole person they understand the concept becoming complete so how do you help a client. Stay on track toward a new beginning or a goal that they might have identified. That's really all over them. That's a really good question and that is the key role of the coach. One of the key roles is to keep the conversation Asian on track very often. What happens is especially client? That has a big life goal a client who wants to leave a relationship or wants to make a job change or to relocate if it's a really big thing typically what what happens is at some point as we're starting to make progress and we have the surrounding dialogue going and some movement is happening all the sudden. There's a wall and sometimes that wall shows up as just procrastination intonation. Oh I didn't do my homework. I didn't get to it because you have time. Sometimes there's homework. That's part of the process. Hey Yeah yeah but but a lot of it's a lot of it's really fun and some of its is no more complicated located than just contemplating what we call an inquiry to think about something over a period of time in between the coaching sessions but but anyway what happens very often as just when the clients on the cusp of making a breakthrough through we'll see the barriers start to appear and ends lose a real because like I said before life happens and I understand that and but I have to do as a coach is try to ferret out. What was that life happening that caused my client to not do what he or she committed to do at our last session or or is it really another voice ah saboteurs voice coming in from behind saying to my client? What are you doing what you can't do that? Are you kidding me. You're going to fail bill and so recordings in our heads right exactly and and sometimes there aren't even our heads imposer people in our lives right because when we try to make big changes the people who are close to us that sometimes makes them uncomfortable to so sometimes there in our head but sometimes there's thousands appearance friends right loved ones yeah right well intentioned very well intention but but yeah changes is a difficult process in comfortable. He's uncomfortable for the person doing eh for those who are close to US watching Stewart. That's awesome well. We're GONNA take a quick break and when we come back Julie's GONNA share more life goal insights and some tips and insights into this great area of life coaching say with us. We'll be right back <music> hello. It's me the designer jeans and the back of your closet. What happened to us? I used to somewhere in the Hamptons and now I'm stuck behind a pair of sweats okay. Maybe I never really fit you right but I got a lot more Sunday. Fun Days left in me so take me to goodwill where I can really make a difference your donations to goodwill create jobs training programs and education assistance for people in your community to find your nearest donation center. Good at goodwill dot org donate stuff create jobs a message from goodwill and the Ad Council learn everything you need to know about the new legislative regulatory changes for twenty nineteen by joining Sapphire Legal and Ellen done insurance on January fifteenth for our annual Twenty Twenty Nineteen Employment Law update visit our website at Steph are illegal dot com for more details or call us at nine four nine five three five five to six six. We love to hear from our listeners. If you have questions feedback doc or unique workplace perspective or experience you'd like to share email us at perspective at Sapphire Legal Dot Com or get in touch. The are Sapphire legal facebook page. Just use the HASHTAG workplace perspective in your post so we know you want your question. I'm a show and together. We'll continue to raise the bar at workplaces everywhere. Welcome back everyone. We're talking with dragonfly coaching life coach Julie McCoy about setting in achieving life goals in the new year so Julie kind of talking about it's from a complete person perspective. How do you know you're talking about you could sense when someone was coming up to a barrier and so is that how you know that someone's kind of on the on the cusp of a good change when you start to see those walls and some sometimes but it's not always like that was some clients and I would say this is more than exception than the rule with some clients? What you see is an actual an Aha the moment you know that epiphany that happens when suddenly it's not just a theoretical conversation anymore but there's real byin and the client instead of talking around and as you like it would be nice to data Edita? The client is suddenly. I want that that's the thing that I want for myself. I'm committed to that. I'm going to do that and that's really cool to see happen doesn't always work that way and it never happens during the coaching session oddly early enough and you <hes> tease me about the homework but oddly enough part of the <hes> what we use the homework for in coaching is to keep the issue percolating in the clients mind in between sessions and that tends to be where a lot of the good stuff happens and where the Aha moments come in is the Klein is is either doing homework or thinking about what was discussed in the session and and why they want whatever ever it is you know they're coaching on and that's where <hes> where that sometimes comes in but like I said it's more the exception than the rule typically I have to be more aware for things like diversions like with the clients coaching on one thing week after week after week and then suddenly they show up with a something autumn complete left field or their procrastinating and you know not doing the thing they committed to do over and over again. I think the whole thing is really interesting. I really do find the the whole concept of looking at those questions and it sounds so much like traditional therapy. We probably have some people out there going. This sounds awfully like therapeutic counseling psychology crossing over in any way but there's got to be a little bit. Did you see any type of a crossover. How do you draw outline because you know brought? His attorneys. Were used to that counselor role. Where sometimes you know that client just wants to you know they just WanNa talk and so you take that on but no it's actually VIP coaching is very different from traditional <hes> psychotherapy? Some people like Dan. I don't totally buy into this but some people like to say that psychotherapy is about what happened in the person's past and coaching is about the future but that isn't entirely true because therapists therapist work with with their clients futures too. I think what is different is that and I'll to speak for my own experience. Mike Lanes are very highly functioning individuals. If I sense there some really deep seated emotional emotional issue I will refer them out to therapist. I'm not a therapist. I'm not licensed to do that. Work so Mike Lancer Dave already most of them already achieved a lot in their lives and as before they're pretty much like ninety percent sorted out ten percent is not fulfilling to them. It's not working the way they they want it to so I I am I am <hes> aware of those issues <hes> but I really very seldom seen that happened where I felt it someone how to really deep seated emotionally issue that required a therapist but on the other hand on one of the students when I was undergoing coach training one of the students in my class was was a licensed psychotherapist and she wanted to bring the coaching tools into her therapy practice which interesting that is interesting because you think they'd have all the tools they need already to address these issues. No matter you no matter what where what would be. I like that <hes>. I think that's a great yeah. That's a great thing and what happens if you going along young client comes in they have goal you've talked about you know the complete person thing and all of that but then all of a sudden they change their mind about the goal that they said what is that due to the whole you know the whole train you've been on. Does it derail things or will well it can and sometimes the train should be derailed because life happens you know and sometimes a client shows up with one thing they wanna coach on and life intervenes and and suddenly something else takes priority and that other thing is is not so important. Sometimes it's a diversion as I said it could be that the client the first goal the real goal of the coaching got too big and scary and they were getting too close to making a breakthrough in realizing this entails real real change and you know the human animal being what we are changes hard for us. We seek we seek the comfort of the place where we've always been the place that we know a little voice inside of each of us tells us that that's the safe place and we should stay there and not explore the unknown when quite often it's the most dangerous place to be but something inside us tells us let let's maintain the status quo stone. You know rock the boat when I started encountering that I have to if you're out it is this. Is this change in goal. Is it genuine. Is it really driven by something that happened in the client's life that we really need to pick up this different and that's fine because it's the clients agenda but if it really seems like it's a diversion what I won't do as a coach is because coaches never judge. It's the client is never has never wrong and so the coach's role is to be curious about okay so let's see for nine weeks. We've been talking about a career change and and today we're going to talk about the Pantry so and maybe that's fine bless find out what's going on. What's driving this? How important is this pantry thing or we're going to go back to the career changer we don't that it's a matter of of probing and finding out? With what's really behind this change of course well that makes me think about so someone's thinking about new beginnings new focus. What kind of questions should they be asking themselves not about? How do I go find a coach but I mean what kind of question should they ask themselves that they are considering new focuses in new beginnings? The role of the life coach is to ask probing questions right the open ended questions that caused the client to do the kind of soul-searching that that is really part of the of the coaching process because that's where the transformation happens and I think that's an important distinction. There's an important distinction between coaching conversation and a conversation that you would have with a trusted friend over glass of wine right because the typical trusted friend. If you come to sad friend with a problem they're gonNA give you advice. They're going to say we'll win. That happened to me. Here's what I did or here's something you know sued down the street did because we're very solution and base extremely based. You know what I love about. This coaching model is just respects the integrity of the person and honors that each of us really has her own solutions we really do they might be covered up by all those the voice of family the saboteur voice in our own head that says you can't do that. It's dangerous you might fail but our solutions are really in there so if a coach's effective they ask the right open and ended questions we don't want to ask a leading Shin Right and supply the answer claim but the open ended questions that caused the client to do the soul searching and mind for the answers that they already have inside can and you think of a type of question that I could ask myself before. I even decided if I need it like coach or if I'm just thinking about it what's important to me. What do I value? What do I want to honor in my life like the idea that someone's thinking about it kind of questions? Can I ask themselves to start that internal dialogue with themselves because maybe they're searching and maybe they don't know maybe it is work. I've been stuck in this job for a long time. I really want to go after that promotion and then going back to the idea that but there's something going on. I want to make some kind of a change. I don't WanNA leave my job. I like my company or maybe I don't like my company. It sounds to me like that's almost the wrong question to ask. Would you agree with that because the right question sounds like the internal question yeah I agree. I think the in in coaching the questions that we most often employ are questions. It sound like wise that important to you. How would your life be different if you were to implement that in your life what's something else you might do? What other things have you considered? If you were to embark on that course what's the first step that you might take things like that. <hes> what's really thought provoking. I like that because it does it asks the right questions and and hopefully they're thinking about new beginnings innings and you focuses it will focus a minute good way year helping people make decisions and make choices. Do you ever find that your clients become dependent on you in their decision making process never and and the reason is it goes back to my answer sir about the Difference Between the conversation in coaching and the conversation with a trusted friend because the coach never tells the client what to do or judges the clients choices. I might be curious about a choice especially if it differs from what we've been talking about for weeks I might be curious but I'm never going to judge the client because every every client is naturally create a resourceful in whole so I I'm not going to tell the client what to do. I'm not going to to make <unk> judgments about what choices they make. I'm going to ask the questions to get them thinking. It's really important to honor one of the goals of coaching which is to leave the client more equipped to deal with life and not less so and very often when we go to trusted advisers and I'm not saying there's anything wrong that has a role in everyone's life but very often it creates dependency on that person where WH- right might begin to feel that we can make a decision or at least not important important one without input from said adviser for the goal of coaching is really to empower the client to have the confidence and feel that they have the internal resources when the same issue shows up or a similar issue in the future they they can. They can grapple with it themselves because they've learned the skills. That sounds like it's learning a skill if they if they don't come to you with that it's learning a great skill. I think it's very much about learning skill right. We're just about a time so what some parting unwisdom or some tips that you have for our listeners in our last few minutes. I know your audience is very high functioning and probably they have everything very well dialed in of course they do but I have never met a person myself concluded who could not benefit from for making some changes or tweaking one area of life right and I've I've worked with some very very accomplished <hes> professionals who had everything together except for one thing right and that's the thing that that we coach on so I I believe it's a tool that can help pretty much. Anyone and most life coaches offer on free sample sessions. It's very hard to understand what coaching is from talking about it right. You really have to experience it so most coaches myself included offer free sample sessions all you do is you show up with your topic. Whatever it is big or small and you spend a half an hour kicking around and you get a feel for what coaching he is about and whether it might serve you or not great advice well? That's our show for today on a thank you so much Julie for joining me on our first show the New Year thank you for having this great expertise that you have and providing our listeners with Elvis great information thank you if you want to find out more about Julie and dragonfly coaching you can find them on the web at dragonfly coach Julie Dot Com. That's D. R. A. G. O. N. F. L. Y.. Coach Julie Dot com you can also connect. Would you leave the our website at Sapphire illegal dot com slash podcast and clicking on episode sixteen. I want to also thank our listeners for joining us my radio angels James and the nave at night and workplace perspectives team extraordinaire engineer producer Paul Roberts but music provided headed by the very talented Stephen Bruce Aloni. Thank you all for joining us on workplace perspective and until next time keep raising lavar Hi it's Jamie progressive's number one number two employee leave a message at the Hey Jamie. It's me Jaime this. Is Your daily Pep Talk. I know it's been rough going ever since people found out about your acapella group mad harmony.

Coach Julie Dot Sapphire Julie McCoy James Sapphire Legal Dot Com Employment Law Podcast Employment Law US attorney Sapphire Ed Julie kind founder Tinley Ad Council Johnny Julia
The Ocho: Gerald McCoy loves the Dallas Cowboys

Blogging the Boys

17:01 min | 4 months ago

The Ocho: Gerald McCoy loves the Dallas Cowboys

"NONA! What. Do Welcome to another episode of the Ocho presented in partnership as always SPF nations, blogging the boys dot com, my name, arduous show of course from. And from as you're humble host onto the show, it is Wednesday June tenth two thousand and twenty, a very happy Hump Day from all of us to all of you. We hope that all is well wherever you are. We hope you're happy. Safe healthy practicing social distancing, and we hope talking about the Dallas cowboys brings you some level of joy. It is the middle of the week so hopefully. You've got some fun things in store this weekend. I mentioned that We're moving and so lots of packing my future. You know you just you never need boxes right? And so you get all the boxes and then all of a sudden. You need boxes now. You know what all the boxes now, but I digress. Tuesday we got some Dallas cowboys action in a weird way. Tuesday had some interesting Dallas cowboys. I don't say headlines But content lurking and something really cool Troy Aikman was on the Darren Woodson show a new podcast out there. I've checked out there and podcasts pretty awesome, so if you haven't make sure you go, support a former cowboy and Darren has had on variety of people on his podcast so far, but he obviously had troy remain, and there was a lot discussed here, and it was just really cool to hear troy and Darren, talking about life and football and everything. But Troy I thought he was asked about how he handled success. Once he finally achieved it with the cowboys after they want Super Bowl twenty twenty-seven, because if you know troy kamins entire career, you know very well, you know that. Obviously. You know in college things then get off to a great start for him transferred to Ucla and obviously things didn't get off to a great start in the NFL with the cowboys, but I thought this was a really interesting answer that troy kind of took a number of directions. Here's Troy Aikman on Darren Woodson show. At the time, whenever teams had gone on and won a super bowl, then they always talk about the super bowl hangover, the foul and sees and how they struggled, and they typically had most teams had struggled after they'd WanNa Super Bowl guys, doing book, deals or appearances, and you kind of lose. Lose the focus. I guess and. It was always strange to me because after we won our championship. I thought man. That's such a such a magical time and the feelings you have when you go through that playoff run and win a super bowl. To me, it only fueled the drive that much more. How do you not want to feel this every year? You know so I got even more motivated to to to win at all costs, and and so that's really where it came from, and then knowing that we had become an offense that we throw the ball. There's this. There's this idea that that all we did was run the ball you know and and we ran the ball obviously, and we ran the ball well, but we threw the ball really well, too, and early on in Games, in the first half, we would throw the ball more with we'd run it. And then we'd close games running the ball, but if you go back and look at a number of those years our best years. are are yards per per pass we were. We were number one a few times. We were top three, so we didn't throw it as much as Miami or San Francisco Green Bay, but when we did, we throw it as well if not better than anybody who did so we? We were a really good throwing team, but with that being stead I knew that I knew that I wasn't going to win. Passing titles or touchdowns and I would have loved to have thrown the ball more than. Than we did, but my legacy was going to be about winning championships and and that's really that's that's why I'm in all fame. I know that and and so I knew that early on that that this is this is how I'm going to be defined and quite honestly I was okay with that. I mean that's that's the way as it should be. especially as a quarterback and so I think that only fueled me a little bit more and the frustration for me. I moved through. My career is I just felt that there were a lot of decisions being made that I had no control over, and yet they were reflecting on me because of how we were playing on the field, and and so I I know what it was like when I first got in the League, and we weren't very good, and then I know what it was like. When we got good that five six year window, and then you through that you earn some respect urine, respecting your own locker room and urine respect around the league. And I felt like I was at risk of giving that up. Because of nothing that I could control and that's where the frustration became Each year got more and more frustrating and I really felt that I'd go on and play after I left. The cowboys didn't obviously work out that way, but You know my career was cut a little bit shorter. What it wasn't. It really was not due to injury it was due to. Just. Finally got a breaking point, and and not not wanting to continue to do things or go along with the things that were being done in Dallas. Troy we have heard say at several turns. that he well I suppose I should say we've heard Choi, make some interesting comments or things that people would chop up to be interested in comments and. Maybe you don't find it interesting that troy would kind of blame. That's harsher of things on the front. Office certainly saying that you know. He was just kind of worn out there at the end He's spoken before about how he was. You know maybe you're. GonNa play somewhere else. He talked about that in his episode of a football. If we talked about that with Chris Weaver our friend from NFL films. I, just I don't know I mean obviously Troy Aikman knows better than anybody else about the life of Troy Aikman but That's interesting to hear and you know. Troy has also spoken about how he kind of has some sort of goals to be an NFL general manager, and how? He's realized that you know that's not going to happen with the cowboys because he's not a Jones and I don't know I just you know it's interesting to hear Troy Aikman. Continue to talk I think I think that people are and I'm not saying nobody should be, but I think people love Tony. Romo. In love him as an analyst, and as a commentator that we almost take for granted, how good trike is at his job as well and Troy Aikman a great public speaker, and so hearing him on this podcast was awesome We talked to Edward or last weekend 750 about he was on his podcast, and by the way I know that we did not have a new episode of the seven five. Oh this week Tony. Mentioned that he was getting some knee surgery, so he is, he's on on the men, so our best wishes to our fellow bt. Beer Tony Casillas. That was why we weren't able to get an episode of the seven five hour, but we should have one next week anyway. Interesting comments from Troy I thought the coolest thing was how he talked about how he knew that he was going to be defined by championships, and he really didn't care about anything else. He just wanted to win. You know in in your super cliche world. That's what you want to hear from your quarterback. Right I just want to win. Whatever win it all cost win win win! This offseason has felt so long. That I've already forgotten until this moment that it was just a few months ago, that people tried to make the case that Tony Romo was more talented than Troy. You know I'm just going to say. I disagree and we'll leave it at that but that was not the only interesting point of audio recently. And so Something Else Joe McCoy has made the media rounds. As one of the newest members of the Dallas cowboys, and that's kind of something that I think. He's excited about honestly that. Although to be fair, you know I know. He was a panther last year, but the buccaneers are at the center of a lot of NFL scopes right now. Thanks to Tom Brady, but. Joe McCoy has been on all sorts of shows. A HIT WITH DALLAS COWBOYS DOT COM did hit with the SPN. He's He wrote something and the Players Tribune. He You know was recently on the herd with Colin. Coward and he. This was a really awesome conversation. If you have not go, listen to Joe McCoy on the heard. I think it's on their youtube channel a really awesome conversation. He talked about everything going on in the world right now, and just kind of shared message of spreading the law spreading positively while also really providing. Some high points of intellect on some very important subjects. But with regards to football he he didn't mention the cowboys, not brand, but well. Here's what did here's what he told Colin Coward about life after playing for the Dallas Cowboys. was. One of the top, if not the top. Analysts on Fox. Aikman okay, okay. Who took over for Jon Gruden after he left Monday night football Jason witten cowboy. Okay who is going to be the highest pay analyst year? Tony Romo. All right, I'll leave it there. So, if you if you don't think that being a cowboy has its advantages in is benefits. Yeah, it does so Gerald. McCoy. Maybe someday he's calling when the night football. You don't know how that's going to go in the future, that production is obviously always in need help, but Joe McCoy and we talked to Casey Phillips about this when she was on the show. Obviously Casey works for the buccaneers. How Gerald has such a fun personality I can totally see him in the media some day, and it makes sense that he. He would set himself up that way. Certainly near the end of his career while playing for the cowboys I think the National Nationally Televised Game Primetime Games. Have you want to qualify? That's a big deal I'm in jail. McCoy will be seen by millions and millions and millions of people while a member of the Dallas. Cowboys and that simply has not happened to this point in his career. So cool words from from Jomo McCoy. That's that's pretty sweet, but something else. That I thought was interesting. Is You know I talked about with Troy? Aikman, how in the most cliche way right? You want your quarterback to be this question leader, and you want your quarterback to want to win above everything else. Etcetera and I think when we look at Phantom. We all want the players we root for and the teams root for etc. We all want those players to love the team as much as we do right, and we all wanted to mean as much to as much as it means to us. That's why so many people have college football. And I thought that Joe McCoy said about the Tampa Bay buccaneers was really really cool. He was asked about his thoughts on Tom, Brady, being the buccaneers quarterback and. How you can do in the Tampa Bay lifestyle, obviously, he knows it well, and he talked about his friends and relationships has on the buccaneers team and well. Here's what he had to say. For me I'm a lifelong books fair. Okay, and until we have to play them I'm always going to root for the books. I'm just I'm just telling you that I hope they go undefeated, and then they lose to us in the playoffs. I'm just be honest. I'm always a lifelong bucks man, one of my best friends Lante. David I believe he deserves all the TV time. He's going to get I believe he's very very underrated. I'm excited for all my former teammates all them to get all the publicity. They deserve I believe that. Tom Brady can be what they need in our hope. They women. I really do I hope they everything. except the soup both 'cause. That's. That was Gerald McCoy on the heard again. Highly encourage you to go. Listen to it all. I think it's the coolest thing that he is actually of the mind. Say Yeah. I want the bucks to do. Well I hope they go into feed it unless they're planning to always I want the bucks to win. That's really cool. I think to to act like Joe. McCoy doesn't have any allegiance. Our loyalty or whatever the box is ridiculous I mean. He spent almost a decade there and so. He talked about how he's been Bucks Fan, Lifelong Bucks Fan, and so that is really cool and I think that just as an NFL fan. I love that it means that much to players to play for teams and I that that is a really cool answer to me. So make sure you go check that out. The last thing that I thought was interesting. That kind of spawned question for me and I think we'll turn this question into an episode all on its own, so maybe this teaser for tomorrow. But so NFL DOT COM did an article where they highlighted key homegrown players for every NFL team, and what that is a player that that particular team drafted and therefore is home grown somebody who's been in that team system since they've been in the NFL and the player, they highlighted for the cowboys ahead of two thousand and twenty, it was late in vanish. Obviously, the cowboys drafted late in two thousand eighteen, so he's never played for anybody else. You get the picture now last year in the same exercise and dot, com highlighted Michael. Gallup, and Michael Gallup incredible season so coveted now by cowboys fans that nobody and they would be correct would trade him for Jamal Adams. That's how much my Gallup means that they're cowboys and we've talked a lot about late and I. Don't mean to take the article that was about late in turn it into Michael Gallup, but that sparked an interesting question for me especially because. Again when the Jamal Adams stuff was Kinda hot a few weeks ago and Michael gobs name was thrown out there by Gary Myers. Everybody who's anybody, said No. I wouldn't turn Michael for Jamal Adams I'm one of those people. I wouldn't do that and so let me put it to you and I'm going to give you a second to think about it. which two thousand eighteen cowboys draft pick? Is Better or more valuable to the cowboys. However, you want to call you get the pointed question. Lane Vander ash or Michael Gallup. I think that's an interesting question because. I think that a year ago. It was no doubt late vander slate, and had this incredible rookie season, and you know we have a video up on the block on the boys Youtube Channel that talks about what position are most likely to disappoint in two thousand and twenty. None of us would have guessed the linebacker position last year because of the advantage and Layton obviously I don't think anybody thinks he's a bad player, but I think people are concerned about his. Status Health Status and I know. We talked to Ron Slaven few months ago and he said there's no need to be worried about that. And for what it's worth in the NFL DOT com right up compared under Sean Lee in comparison is easy, but it's easy to understand why somebody would make it, and meanwhile while Michael. gobs never been all pro. I think we all agree. The Michael gap is criminally underrated. I think that we all agree that he does not get enough attention. He does not get as much love as he deserves. Who is better? Who is more valuable to the cowboys? Because if you would not trade Michael Gallup for Jamal Adams then I have a hard time imagining that you think. Russia's better the Michael Gallup and I had never thought of it in those terms, and so I think I leaned Michael Gallup But if you told me I, had to give up one. I would give up Michael Gal if that makes sense, just because you know, there's a surplus there. Shoutout to that episode of the office, but that's A. that's a tough question for me, and I don't even know if I feel supremely confident in the answer right now. That's what I'm saying. I think we need to hold episode and some discussion to kind of. Kind of float this out there, so I'll tell you what think about this question. Hit me up. I am at Joe. Show on, twitter and instagram. Email me RJ DOT Ocho at Nation Dot Com and tomorrow on Thursday's episode. We'll dive into this a little bit. WHO's better? WHO's more valuable? Who Do you prefer again? However, you want to characterize it lane, Vandermeesch or Michael. Gap and they're both obviously on rookie. Rookie contracts but we're not looking at finances. Here were just talking about who they are as players. Obviously, health is a big part of that so late in Vandross, Michael Gallup. Who Do you got? Let me know also do me a favor. Have the absolute best Wednesday of all time you know why because you deserve it, we will see you many Outta my friends is always go cowboys and peace APP.

cowboys Troy Aikman NFL Troy Dallas cowboys football Jomo McCoy Michael Gallup Dallas Gerald McCoy Tom Brady Joe McCoy Tony Romo Darren Woodson analyst troy Michael Jamal Adams