16 Episode results for "Karen Campbell"

Full Episode: Friday, January, 31 2020

20/20

1:20:22 hr | 1 year ago

Full Episode: Friday, January, 31 2020

"I'm David Muir and I'm amy robot. This is twenty twenty. I still have a sense of disbelief. That this man that I love. Go Out Lisa Turmeric cripple. Mr Ted Bundy she'd been involved oversize l.. We came up with sturdy. Could have been well over a hundred but we'll never know now. Decades later at the mother and daughter who shared his life to tell about it are speaking speaking on. TV with the new book and a new Amazon Prime series for the very first time I knew him so well and she loved him so much everything everything had been so good so this was just crazy person. You'd everything would be a serial killer the ladies love anybody pretty confident that we were not going to kill. I just gave me chills to to hear you say that you were pretty confident that you wouldn't pretty continent you know. He referred to. The women is again as cargo. Pretty hard to explain. Why drive around with an ice? Pick any NGOs mass. How could he possibly explain that away? To almost taunting quality catch-me-if-you-can complete remorseless is evil. So thank you for sitting sitting down with us. I know that over the years. There have been a lot of Ted Bundy stories. This is a your story. You saved all all of those photos of your time Ted as a family. Why did you save them? It's a strange phenomenon. That's like symptoms. I can't believe this has really been my life and I kept those photos with us when we were happier before we knew what he was capable of. The photos are joyful much like most people's families photos they don't look any different. That's my child and unfortunately the memories that are attached to those pitchers have lost their original emotional content and become something. Jay Different still have a sense of disbelief. That this man that I loved seem to be such a great guy to go do do such horrific foods since two so hard to accept less. I'm sure you've asked herself why not completely and and I hate to even say this because it makes him sound normal but I do think you loved us. Heard a story told by one of his attorneys. They said Ted told him that he would play games with Lice. Then he would let some of them live and make some of them die and due to me about us were just these mice dollar allowed to live There isn't anybody who grew up here. That is certain age. That doesn't have Ted Bundy Story. His presence here is huge. It's such an amazing story that touches on and so many things. It is part of the history of the Pacific northwest. It's part of the history of criminal justice in the United States. It's a story worth telling. Who was this young man and the Pacific northwest? He knew how to flatter people he knew how to win their trust. The it was good. Good looking and charming and seemingly had the world in his grasp and was going to be a successful guy. There were two Bundy's the only people that ever saw the diabolical Monday for his victims. I think people were born evil but my opinion about that change when I met. Ted I think US Seattle was a smaller more venison place but it was a time when many women were filing very independent. So people didn't think right away that a woman who hadn't been seen for a few days might have fallen in harm's way when you look at Ted. Bundy was about the right age to be in college. He drove a Volkswagen Beetle. Very very popular car in the seventies and so when he moved into a college campus he just fit right in but he graduated in June of a seventy two from the University of Washington with a degree in psychology. Why does he get a degree in psychology from my view? Does that because Kei wants to be able to continue. Can you to manipulate people. One of his activities was to be involved in political campaigns governor. Dan Evans brought down to the aisle and given a tumultuous. Welcome it worked for the committee to re elect. Dan Evans aspirations. He wanted to go to law school. I mean he was thought to be sort of a rising star in the Republican Party in Washington State. I think a number of things conspired to make Ted Bundy Ted Bundy. It looks at childhood of serial killers there are some common themes that I see them. Intense case where there's dysfunction in the family and what happens is they grow up with with a lot of rage typically towards women. He wanted to be from a family that had money and he wasn't. This is a guy who from the earliest age was a petty thief. Telling me I realized he was stealing banks. These still Paris gabled from the Student Union Building on University of Washington campus. And he brought him over to my apartment and he said if I had stolen somebody else motive so he just took him talks about having been peeping Tom at some point. And the idea that Ted Bundy was involved in peacekeeping actually make sense because it's basically a training gene ground about how you isolate people how you watch people how you get into houses. He was a night person he would get restless get in his car and drive for great distances so he was a role model always but a part of the belonged to be with somebody or a part of something something part of a family. This long time girlfriend. Who had a child WanNa go back to when you first arrived in Seattle? He for a single mom. You went out to that bar and you saw a handsome man. Tell me about when you first met. Ted Bundy was pretty smitten. Right from the get-go sime sitting in the table. I went over and talked to him because I told him he looked lonely. And I took him home with me that night. It wasn't in the habit of doing out of character for you yes. She was a young reasonably single mother from Utah Who met the man who was considered by virtually everybody in society and culture in the nineteen seventies as the dream date the perfect husband material? A prince charming. Is it fair to say at least at first the Ted Bundy was a gentleman. Oh completely put a lot of energy into making. He can happy doing fun things. My parents loved him. He was really in my opinion and I really wanted to marry him. Give me the activities. You all would do as a family together. So he had a favourite everything a favorite restaurant favorite carpet store. Save wanted to take all the places that he thought McCall zoo into all fun kids things. He always seemed to embrace us as a family unit when he was what Liz. He's he's he said he really enjoyed Being a family man he said the things I would expect my brother to say about his family mm-hmm but as the years roll on T.. Determine no I'm never gonNA be married them. Never Away of children never going to be. The governor never going to be attorney. I'm just GONNA murder. And this is what makes nineteen seventy four so extremely different terminent uh-huh he's GonNa launch him so often before he's just gonNa keep doing Scherzer killed and you've written about how things did actually get disturbing at the time the ag were addy was mostly just confusing yet. It was confusing. And you didn't tell your mom. No he had become naked during the course of a game of hide and go see and I was very confused by that you said is is chain. His is changed and I got a real sense of direction at that moment of looking into is with him there. Naked that this. This was extremely dangerous and bad. Can you describe to me what your relationship was like in one thousand nine hundred ninety four. Well it had changed you know got together in the fall of sixty eighty nine so we'd been together. Several years and things changed in that he would start walking home late at night rather than spending the night at my house. It's a subtle changes Where I felt like maybe losing him he thought maybe worse case scenario someone never in my dreams? I think he was out stalking women and then eventually abducting the murdering women. Dan Healy was a very popular a young woman because she was on the radio five days a week at seven o'clock in the morning she gave the scare report all all my years of studying murder and never heard of an abduction quite like the limbaugh. Abduction I was one of many who listened to her in the morning morning and I realized the day that she wasn't on the air that there was something unusual she ever show for work by the use of frequent bar. You're Dante's to ever on the last night over life Linden. Haley went to Dante's with another girl in a friend of theirs but he I probably did follow them home and waited and he checked. The front door was unlocked. This says what makes this abduction. So incredibly surreal. He goes down in the basement. Healy's room he's aware that there's another bedroom on the other side. He would tell a brighter laters that he choked her. He moves off the Bat. He takes her ninety over. Hangs up in the closet. And he makes the bed Almost like in the military fashions and he cares at the end of the night. He takes her down the front steps and their steep APPs to wherever's cars parked and puts her in there he would turn new passenger seat around so nice. Why did that? Because that's the way he put his cargo in in. The Car Has Africa disgusting. What's he got girls to the destination key rape them? He bludgeoned them key. Molested their bodies. Uh and from there the nightmare began then Don Manson. She disappeared from Evergreen State College. And then you have. The abduction of Susan Ran Court from central Washington. Susan rank-order and Ellensburg was on her way. Were meeting to see about being a dorm counselor in May of nineteen seventy four reverted Kathleen parks missing and in those stays reported just as a missing student and these young women started disappearing and people wondered what's going on here and then Brenda Ball was abducted near the flame tavern. She wasn't a college student that made it all the more challenging because it it adds to to the randomness of the victims. He took his victims from where he could fit in. I mean he fit in great this. This is the psychological factor. You don't think a killer of women is going to be a good looking particular young man. You're not thinking in terms like that. John Hopkins was a student at the University of Washington. Georgeanne was is abducted in June of nineteen seventy four. She disappeared from an alley. One night lag wrong being a university district people walk around with all all hours. She went down the alley. It was Bundy is moving up the alley using a briefcase in some crutches and the Yemen walk down by so on saw her round the the north end of the block into the alley and stop for a moment and then keep walking down the alley about halfway down the block. I encounter and asked her to help me carry a briefcase which she did. We walked back up the alley does does he look like a killer look like an abductor. Women looks like somebody in need Scott like cast on his on his crutches who went to his room and one night. He had crutches leaning against the wall by the door to his through. My ask him what it was. Who's what was that for? And he said mm-hmm that his landlord had heard himself. I was on crutches but he was going to take the coaches back to the rental place so I made sense to me so they warheads. According to him right replaced a crowbar behind the right rear tire reached. A what happened was the bar was such force that she came out of one of shoes and both earrings there along with the crew and passengers. Joel Joel and drive to a spot. That he's already picked out going to be off of the main highway sometimes. Check the moon out to win when when it's going to be Bryant. I don't want to leave my headlights on to see what I'm doing and the speed with which she would have had to bone abducted tells you that probably probably the person that had done this before. We really could not find anything definitive. That tied all the victims together. It was and that I get knocked unconscious. Ted loved nighttime. Because he could be out Japan but not be seen but then there's the day where he took two girls in broad daylight and abductions would come back to bite Bundy converse people saw when it comes to hiring. You don't have time to waste. You need help getting to your shortlist of qualified candidates fast. That's why you need indeed dot Com post a job in minutes set up screener questions then. Zero win qualified candidates using an intuitive online dashboard. And when you need to hire fast accelerate your results with sponsor jobs new users can try it for free at indeed dot com slash twenty twenty. That's indeed dot com slash twenty twenty terms conditions and quality standards apply offer valid through March. Thirty first twenty. Twenty wave of fear swept all across crossed. The state of Washington was last seen Monday evening. Someone was inducting young women. It's hard to say whether there's any player not there was incredible pressure on law enforcement enforcement to find the person who is responsible for causing women to commission what cleverness cleverness or what sophistication of the suspect are you're looking for that can manage to pull that off. There were no clues whatsoever. I mean it's kind of remarkable that nobody saw anything but lakes was another story. Smashed Avo Clark was huge it was a magnet for all of us. Young and old place you would go to the mid West or something with this old fashioned concession. Stand and people just coming out with their little sailboats. SAILBOATS are coming out Tucson Joel. Fourteen by the place was absolutely packed or forty thousand people people there. I signed that morning he came over. We weren't giving along your well so I was surprised that he came in on what is going to do that day. I said I I was going to go to a park. And my in the Sun Molly was in Utah and he asked me Bitch Park and I think he was just wanting to know if you're going to like semantics than he wouldn't he wouldn't be going knowing that way a number of people that day at Lake Sammamish were taking photos and shooting film. Little did they know the police would want to review you. This footage Ted was able to to Meld into the crowd. He was wearing casual speech type clothing he was able to strike up conversations with people. He was able to convince Denise Naslund and Janice odd to help him with the reuss that he had a sailboat that he had his arm in a fake slang. If anybody has seen the silence of the lambs were the killer. Had Ed trying to get that couch into the van. And he's got a cast on that. That all came from Ted Bundy career. Sheriff Lundy was a real SCHEMA. Remember these abductions. Were benign nine on the face of them. They were always bundy. Approaching the women in a state of of presumed need or weakness. Nisa can you help me carry my books. My arms and slang. Can you help me load my sailboat. Onto my car there were three women that saw Janice hot roller roll or bicycle up to the beach. Lay Down Band. She had on Yellow Bikini. You can then. They observed this man walk up to her they. They heard her get up and say hi. I'm Jan he said I'm Ted. It is a real name. She was last seen headed toward the parking lot pushing her bike with him walking next door then she's never seen again. We did have about five or six. Other women come forward that said that they had been approached by guy with his arm in a sling. Her and they look just like Jan.. Assad Denise Naslund the First Janice went missing and that was early early in the morning she disappeared and then later he came back to to the Park Carney. Junior's farm K.. Jr's Seattle and Kevin O.. Rien at four zero nine. It was a Sunday afternoon. And my buddy and we noticed off to the side guy just a few feet from a standing in front of the women's bathroom and he was dressed nice casual joie clothes. With the oddest thing about it as he had a cast on his arm. Four Seventeen K. J. R.'s Seattle being a couple of SMART aleck teenagers. Who are thinking? Maybe maybe razzing the guy a little bit but it turned out it was our turn to get ice cream so we lost track. Guy Didn't think anything more about it. And that's when Denise Naslund was abducted those abductions were very brazen and in front of literally thousands of witnesses but witnesses did not know what they were saying with regard to introduce NASLUND her cards in the parking lot. Her purse is still there after her keys to cars. But she's done. Does that satiated with just one thing. He was trying to make a statement that day. It was almost the ethical way to women disappeared. It was as if the the stakes of the story had been raised if this dramatic way. Obviously it's not until much later that you're able to go back and piece together. Those abductions those murders with what you were actually doing with Ted at the time went out together shortly thereafter he called was pretty early in the evening. I WANNA say five thirty right after the second woman missing and did he sound any different. No no no no like as if nothing had happened right so we did. Did we went out to eat. It's just so hard to believe that. That's what he was doing. That's heartbreaking. It was also oh critical that people who were at the park that day who were taking photographs of their friends and family any filming that they had done turned over their photographs and filmed to us to see if we could find something that would be a clue. Marriage objections would come back to bite Bundy. People saw anti identify themselves as Ted. There's a Ted and he drives the Volkswagen and he's handsome and from from the witnesses that saw him composite drawings made. The picture came out. No question there's no question that this was the guy. Each lead has to be followed. Every phone call has to be made mostly nowhere some out with a speck of information. That may he's someday help. Clear up the mystery of the whereabouts of genocide and unease NASLUND nineteen year old Denise Naslund and twenty three year old Janice ought disappear on on a warm summer day at lakes a manage. Several witnesses told the smooth-talking good looking young man named Ted. He was starting to come upon him clues now. Guy Named Ted of VW a composite. Sketch your co workers brought over the sketch show to you. Was it because they thought the sketch looked like Ted. It was something about it. Grab on attention. There was something about the jaw line or something like that. Made me really weird and you call Seattle. Police call them honestly to a tip line that they had set up. There was something like three three thousand potential. Ted's who may or may not drive a Volkswagen and he was one of them but he had this terrific spotless clean record. You have to understand that. Detective work was organized in a very different way in the seventies there was no DNA evidence. Police departments didn't even have a fax machines let alone the Internet when they had a profile of him. I brought up to similarities to him. I said this is Ted Cheer. Name's Ted this guy has a VW. You drove the w you know it's you and he just laughed no monkey. Of course I would never do anything like that and you didn't think it either. No you were teasing. I was teasing him. Did you ever ask Ted. Are you concerned about the similarities Very beginning I asked. I said she read this. You know what you're saying. There's so many things that people are going to be looking at you kind of making making a joke out of it. But once they started to worry like could this be true. I didn't feel safe bringing that up on the notice thinking so so you did feel fear. Do it wasn't like was afraid of him I. He's kind of afraid of my own brain scored over and over this Monday. They realized that if he wanted to keep killing he was going to have to go somewhere where there was no investigation. He has the presence of mind to move from the WASHINGTON CANARIA TO UTAH. These excuse of going to the Utah Law Score. He gave Liz the option of going with him when he was probably probably delighted when she said No. I want to stay in Seattle with my friends. MONEY LEFT FOR UTAH. September third nineteen seventy four within twelve versa hours he would be murdering the Idaho. HITCHHIKER BUNDY WENT TO UNIVERSITY OF OF UTAH. School of law. When I was there at the law school I would have regular contact with Ted Bundy and everyone liked him? There were periods of time when he was absent percent from class and people would occasionally comment on that all. Ted's gone again the first semester. He's in class three times. He's like a kid in a candy store up to in in Utah around four women in the in just a matter of weeks. I get mad at myself. She weeks later on mine. Another pair comical. But that's what everything Bundy we had within. What is known as his murder? There were reasons behind it. The tire iron the garage of course gloves the items. There weren't there by chance and they all had a reason the raw connected the murder he said. I always trying to get rid of all all the evidence that would put me to the crime. So that meant I had to restock. Talk might toll kid. All the time Bundy ran to the Mormon church is kind of refuge. Kind of thing his angle at that point. They didn't know it was a bad guy by baptized tat. After we discussed the church with him and he made commitments. So we immediately started inviting to our social events parties dinners. We chatted and had fun and play Games. Are you still in daily contact with Ted is. He's in Utah. We'll talk on the phone a lot. He's just the ten. I knew nothing was miss. It's actually not uncommon for Su- killers to have quote unquote a normal life whether my killing people shortly after seven o'clock on the evening of November the Eighth Nineteen seventy-four Carol Garage parked car in this parking lot at the fashion mall shortly after began. What she now calls her personal nightmare nightmare? What makes the garage abduction? So pivotal is that. She's the only one who ever got away from Monday. She was approached by a man near Roldan's bookstore. This man identified himself as officer Roslyn and he said. Do you drove Camaro. She said yes so well. My partners holding the suspect individual tried to get into the car. He said they would have to go down to the main. Murray Police Department to sign a complaint right when I was in encouraging new I had made a mistake. Suddenly he just pulled the car over and it kind of went up on the side of the curb. And that's that's when I started absolutely freaking out. I remember screaming out. What are you doing? This isn't playstation. What are you doing and I tell he? He just changed and Salsa car tax. She knows she's in a fight for her. Live any handcuffs. The right wrist but in the midst of this fight when she scratching conforti she gets the pass new open and jumps out of the car. He came out after me out the passenger side. I remember filling a crowbar. A bar in his hand. He was trying to hit me over the head with a and struggling for awhile and then a car came along a ran out into the street and I just threw open their door and just jumped in on him. An elderly couple drove raunch to the Murray police station. The search for her abductor began. And so so this is the first time we have an eyewitness of somebody who survives Bundy attack. Sometimes the urges become such a compulsion and that they can't control themselves and that's when they make mistakes his compulsion that day was so high he had the Kelso Body. The first one didn't work out. He's now frustrated and so he goes to find a second victim teenager. Debbie can't they came back from Utah and she said. I don't want to scare you but it's happening down there now. The headlines of the missing woman had stopped in Seattle indeed left and they started in Utah is where he was CS. What did that feel like? Oh my God like the bottom of world was falling falling out too much of a coincidence so I did call King County. Police and I did meet with the detective. He knows that was one of the hardest things I've ever done. I gave them some pictures of him and the children to the best witness from lexa manage. She pulled his shot. Sure the staff at the detective given said No. He's too old and put it back in the stack so you had cleared near conscience. The police have cleared him. I I just need to put these fears aside. You didn't trust your instincts. I knew him so well. Yeah and she loved him so much everything. I've been so good so this is just crazy. I think that Ted's girlfriend was very brave to call us. I think she called us in part out of fear in part out of public duty perhaps in part out of protecting herself show multiple contact with the police. They did do some investigation but it kept coming back. He's not your guy at the same time while he's committee new murders in Utah. The COPS in the state of Washington are finding finding bones and those funds are ultimately going to come back to haunt him. The heat is building up on him. Ted Starts Looking for a new killing field in Colorado. It's the winner of nineteen seventy five and TED head. Bundy's gotta find a place where there's not a lot of talk about missing women and where he can blend in so he ends up in Aspen. He was very familiar with ski resorts in Colorado. Already understood that Those places are populated by basically basically strangers on January twelfth nineteen seventy-five Karen Campbell disappeared from wild would end thirty six days. Later canoed body was found almost three miles away. Two months later he heads over to Vail and ends up killing twenty six year old ski the instructor Julie Cunningham. He was just not going to stop more relationships with dead woman by now living women it was all about the haunt bundy goes on this killing spree and he kills three women a twenty year old fifteen year old and a twelve year old and in the summer of one thousand nine hundred. Seventy five Bundy's luck is changing. He was going from being the hunter to being the hunted in. GRANGER Utah a small suburb. It was like two o'clock in the morning. Born cop is just getting off. Duty is name was Bob Hayward and he saw this Volkswagen parts and trying to a house he he knew they were too young women. Living there I turn that corner. Walk night my lights on bright stepped on the gas us. He's squirted freaks me out okay. He picks big mistake so there was a chase. He pulled a meal. Gas Station stopped. I pull my magnum out to sit in the crotch of the door. Uh unlicensed hole right there when hayward comes up with the car he sees the seat is out of space. You can stick a body and one of the car in his car. He had what we would call burglary tools. It's the scheme ask pantyhose with the is cut out. He had a pair of handcuffs head coach for student. Use them in my classes. I took him in and booked him. Unless there's something wrong with this guy that put him on the radar of Utah Law Enforcement and they had this unsolved abduction. Yeah I got a call and it was tapped. Says I've been arrested. Take what were you arrested for. All they think I'm the Ted Murderer and he laughed laughed. I didn't think he was guilty. At one point police did show you a photo of the items they found in Ted's car. How could he possibly explained that a way to you? They tried to just brush it off. I need the crow bar for if I get in a wreck and pray cars apart. I need this scheme ass for what I'm shoveling snow. You Know Carol Durant came to the police station was shown a lineup and was able to identify Bundy as the person to attack. Yeah he was arrested and charged with the kidnapping of pure raunch. WHO's a likable guy? And if he could be a killer who else might be. So people just didn't want to believe it I helped raise money to Bailey. matted jail everybody. Everybody in the ward felt he was innocent while he was on bail he came back correct. What was was that time like when I showed up at my door unannounced is taken aback? Started talking again. This is just ten. She was always kind of playing this. This dance around what her gut instinct was telling her and what the world around her was saying about the possibility of this perfect male person. Doing these terribly violent things. There was like a fleet of police cars undercover that would follow he and my mom if they and went anywhere and because of our placement in his world is the only reason that we're still alive. I'm quite certain because people had their eyes on it. Did that thought ever cross your mind. It is going to kill us. No did you think he was capable of murder. I mean I still believed leave. T. was innocent at that point during court proceedings in Utah. Bundy actually comes outside side and talks to the media. You want to get involved in the Criminal Justice League yes. I intend to complete my legal education and become a lawyer and Be a damn good lawyer. Testified in was the worst witness in the world he was an arrogant. You know. And that's the way he came across on the stand at the trial. Dhiraj picked out Bundy as her abductor. Thought he could lie about everything and get away with it. It's pretty hard to explain. Why you with an ice pick any PATIOS mask most of us? Don't have that in our cars. Ted Bundy was convicted with kidnapping. Carol Older Watch. Even after he was convicted. You thought it was a travesty of justice. You thought he was innocent. I started to think that my contacts with the police actually felt guilty so after Ted was convicted absolutely still thought he was innocent. Unvisited in there were still many people who thought that he'd been railroaded. Thought that he was innocent. He thought that he could Miss Police. Officers from Utah Washington State and Colorado get together together share notes and determine that they're all talking about the same God. Everybody knew he was there. Man Who's just just a case of proving but was that the moment that you knew the Manu loved was a serial killer and not just any serial killer Ted Bundy. The question is why can you imagine this woman and her. Her young child spent more than five years with him and somehow they survived decades later. They're speaking out on television for the very first time. Why did he love? You could have been love. It could have been just another manipulation at the center of the Ted. Bundy story is the idea that you you could've sat next to him and yet had no idea of what he was up. When you saw the Florida murders? Did you think it could be ted. Oh Oh my heart just dropped mice dollar Lancet the Ted Bundy. A Washington state resident was convicted last year of the kidnap assault of a young woman from Salt Lake City. After Bundy's convicted of the kidnapping. If Harold Garage detectives have found evidence linking him to the murder of Karen Campbell. January twelfth nineteen seventy-five Karen Campbell Campbell. Disappeared from the wildwood and. Here's in his Volkswagen bug of Victims Own Colorado in Utah that gave them enough evidence Winston file on him in Colorado or the first degree murder and kidnapping. They transferred him to Colorado to stand trial for the murder of Karen Campbell and they took him to the Jalen Aspen. At that point Ted. Bundy had become pretty big news. I called the sheriff. I asked you if I can speak with Ted Bundy. We sat in this narrow cell and the interview. You are not guilty. I'm not guilty. That include the time. I stole a comic book when I was five years old. I am not guilty with terrorists which has been filed against such a pleasant taught. Full calm demeanor. I wasn't at all convinced he was guilty. He's the most pleasant killer Brenner. Viewed no man is truly innocent. I mean we all have transgressed in some way in our life. I've been impolite and other things I regret having done in my life life but nothing like the the things I think you're referring to. I asked him physically made him angry and he said yes. I don't like being locked up for something I didn't do and I'll let my liberty taken away and I don't like being treated like an animal and like people walking around at ugly me. I can some sort of Weirdo. Because I'm not you think about getting out of here. Well legal issue graduated law school. where he he was assisting in his own defense he had a right to go? Use The library. This old courthouse allow library was up on the top floor. The judge decreed that he didn't have to wear shackles handcuffs so he walked about the courtroom and back into the library as the Freeman over the month. Side the number of the opportunities to just walk right out on a great deal of vanish gate than I get to know if I had the guts to cry. Frankly there's a picture of him coming into the building that morning and he's got really concentrated look on his face. He addressed with an extra layer. He had a sweater wetter under the one on the outside so he was planning to go that day. Outside for smoke. The windows are open and the fresh I share burn through in the sky was ready to go at a window to your honest to God. I just got tired of me talk about ten minutes before anyone realized they came out and shouted Bundy escaped. The team went up to the mountains aspen and he broke into a cab. You stayed in the cabin a few days into Aspen to this car which was unlocked and had the keys in ignition Russian. He drives through downtown Aspen in a Cadillac. who was a terrible driver by the way and there was a patrol car and they see this? We've this is late. Must be a drug well. He wasn't drunk of Ted Bundy back. He goes Here and you can see him grinning. When he's been captured he always acted like he pulled pulled one over on on everybody? He was moved to a facility. Lead with springs. Now's one of the staff photographers at the Seattle Times. I was given a chance to photograph this felony Ted. She had shackles on and I lay on the floor and photograph all kinds of different ways. I wanted to be seen Ted Bundy. Look at me. I'm captured but in his own mind. I'm not going to be here for long. So there was a great in the ceiling that was not secured there was a light fixture that was due to be welded. It had not been mauled when I visited him Glenwood. They noticed that he had lost a lot. Wait so I'd say the last twenty or twenty five pounds. I would think this would have come to the attention of jailers. Perhaps why is he doing this. Keep used a bunch of his law books and Kacem them along with some pillows to make it look as if they were body in the bed. Bundy had succeeded in carving a enough opening in the ceiling of his cell. He lost so much weight that he was able to wriggle through. You called through the ducting just like in a movie. He came down into the closet. And the jailer's apartment new the Jetta wasn't there and he put it also includes this astounding and he gets out into the light and these free again. They woke up in Glenwood glenwood springs and discovered at Bundy had escaped. Basically twelve hours before as you think it was possibly out this way. We've eliminated what we felt at that. Title Heini possibly escape from the roof. However we were all these keystone cops as the paper referred to let this guy go again with Garfield feel county doing the fight them? We're looking everywhere of trains. Buses the usual thing and I have no idea where he is he should be very careful. Should check on their neighbors. I make sure their cars are secure. We're just looking. I couldn't believe escape twice. This is bad ted. Bundy is on the loose and they have no idea where are he is who once he escaped he had an opportunity to go somewhere and disappear but he couldn't even do that he had to killing Bundy's escape bordered on a Houdini escapade through a twelve inch by twelve inch hole. All in the ceiling weaned. Bundy escaped detectives. said it's GONNA kill again. It's just a matter of time we don't know where or win but he will kill again when we now have to wait. Bali playing the Chicago Chicago took a train stole a car girl south to Atlanta and trailways bus Tallahassee. Bundy was an expert thief. Everything that he obtained was either through the stealing of credit cards or cash from wallets or purses and the money was very very very good at Florida State University in Tallahassee. The campus this was generally safe and secure that. We've not unusual three o'clock in the morning to see people walking back and forth across campus. Because they felt safe. I had joined disparity Chi Omega living at Cayo. My parents felt was much safer than to live in the dormitory. Being in Cuyamaca was wonderful. Part of my life was just like living with forty friends. Lor early morning hours often route. Fifty three o'clock and three fifteen a m there was an intruder in the column Mega Sorority House. He had with him some sort of wooden club. It was on routine patrol that night with my partner. We were approximately two blocks away from the Kyle Mega House. When we heard the call come on the radio so we drove straight there? I've lost up. The girls. Were yelling upstairs upstairs. And then there was a lot of cry and at the top of the stairs girl named Kari Chandler. She was down on the floor. She was bleeding quite badly for head injuries. Pretty much every bone in my face was broken. My front teeth Mostly gone I ask her what happened. She said there was a loud banging. We know it and then she made mention about make avocado. Her injuries. Were much more extensive of jaws actually hanging off. I remember then laying on my bed and trying to talk and I couldn't make any noise because my jaw was broken in three places decided to go ahead and start the room by room. Search a knock on the door from that moment and then get a response. I open the door and I went up. pull the covers back and I could see to strangle and beaten about the head. You could tell you that cost up across the hallway and there was another body in the bed Lisa leaving was being severely about the head and body she also strangled and a bite marks left on. It is so hard. See those girls. Sorry for their families. He's now on the run he's lost control to. He does something with little planning high risk taking on multiple women these on on a frenzy at this horrendous attack Chi Omega he goes just about four or five blocks away ended up at a we. Call the dunwoody resident. Don't which was the residence of Cheryl Thomas. I was a student Florida State University and I was a dance major. I woke up to this loud banging being sound. Then we could hear Cheryl Moaning whimpering and I called Cheryl. We could hear or the phone ringing because the wall was so thin but she wasn't answering her phone. And that's what possessed me to call the Police Department Senate investigator investigator. Immediately to that location. She went in and she found Cheryl Thomas on the floor and blood and beaten. I learned that Eh. He came in through my kitchen window. He had worn a hose over his face. He pulled that off and that was dropped on my floor. If I did not have my neighbors calling. I don't think I would have survived. Gosh I mean he left her for dead and I think it was a couple of days before I woke up and I didn't know what had happened. I remember flashes if things does that. Basically up intensive care I could not get the funeral. I wasn't hostile. I wanted to call the feelings but so it wasn't fair. It wasn't right that that should happen to them. They were both beautiful. Wonderful People There's no reasoning behind it. I was asleep in my room and yet evil opens a door and attack me and he went in there and food license space of fifteen minutes. That's breach woman came. He calls you. Can you tell me about that phone call in Florida. And what did you think when he said my heart is dropped from New York this is ABC weekend. You Four. Young women were beaten with a club and two of them were strangled to death last night. By a man who found around his victims sleeping and this sorority house I was leaving the Sorority House driving and I got a call over our radio that there's an investigator that wants to talk to me. From Out West I talked to the investigator and I wrote down a name that he gave me that he he thought. Maybe I should look into that name. Was Ted Bundy. But obviously I didn't think that was possible the Mo of abduction in a car didn't fit the MO of potentially abducting among some person and taking them somewhere. Perhaps in the woods a murdering them lasted down so we had was fresh asche murder in a house so I was somewhat dismissive when I was at the morgue and I looked at the bodies on Lisa lead. There was a bide laughed. That was very important. The person that bit at least a levy the once leased and then went back and build a second town. Almost exactly the cycle is I mean it was done so perfectly that I just believe in my heart that it was a signature about three weeks after the Chi Omega the tax in Tallahassee there comes word from Lake City. That's about ninety miles east of Tallahassee. That junior junior high school student Kimberly Leach disappeared during the middle of the smolder. It was raining drizzly. Very Dreary Day are went to are designated spot to meet up to go to our next class together and she wasn't there. We knew something was wrong. Kim Was not a student to skip class to leave campus. I mean we were twelve and she was very shy far fodder coming home and he saw a man walking across campus Kimba on him. He assumed that he was her father. Urging anyone anyone with any information about Kim relates to contact them as soon as possible in Pensacola a month onto after the mega taxes. This man is arrested on a traffic stop. He also made us stop because of the unusual babe bureau Volkswagen. He walked up to the vehicle. Then it crackles over the radio that this is a stolen vehicle Michael the officer and they have quite an encounter. Initially when I was put in place in the handcuffs on he kicked my feet south. Mummy and struck me with handcuff. That had been placed on one risk. And of course not be all puffy. And that's when I started to my own following. He wound up pistol-whipping to win. He's got this round mark claim right here. That's where you hit him with pistol barrel on he spends a couple of days stonewalling the police. Who is this man? He refused to give his name to authorities and then told his arresting officer many would probably get a promotion for nabbing him. They find out that his driver's licenses and who he is. The car. He's driving doesn't belong to him. Justice mystery guy to to people who want most to know who he is our Tallahassee Detective Steve Waterford and Dan Patrick. I sat there with my gave me. Ms Writes ask him. His name was started saying. Where'd you get? VW from he's stolen from you but similar about all these credit cards while got him out for people that were next door in the house the mystery man will be kept behind bars for three more weeks before returning to court to edit replete officials. Say by then. They hope to know who he is he says to the police. I'll tell you who I am. Just let me make a phone awesome. And he calls his old girlfriend describe telephone call receive. He said he was in custody. He repeated over and over again. That was really really gonNA be bad when it broke. Ask Him where he said Florida. And what did you think when he said Florida heart dropped and I said it was afraid that you who can be in Florida said I know I saw some pictures in the newspaper about some tragic murders down there. He said well. I wish I could talk with you. Nobody listening trying to tell me you're sick. He got really mad. He told me that he was sick. And that he he was consumed by something that he didn't understand and that he couldn't contain it by called back in the middle. I love the night just a day or two later. Said I want to talk about what we were talking about on the phone the other day and I said about being sick and he said yes. was that the moment comment that you knew the manual loved was a serial killer. took him telling me himself that he he had handed something wrong with him that he knew that he can be around a certain thing that he was addicted to something. He meant young woman causing them. Harm arm awful. How this man that I loved was seemed to be such a great guy could go out and do such horrific everything since two so hard to accept looking back? Obviously hindsight is twenty twenty. Were there any red flags. There'd had been one episode in particular right the week before. These two women are dotted from lake. Sammamish we've been rafting down very cold river. I was sitting on the edge of the rafting pushed me e n just quite violently the grabbed the whole of the road was dragging behind wrath. So that I could get back in but his eyes were so they just got really weird looking and it was like he couldn't didn't see me anymore. I got back in the raft and my started to chew. Chew him out for doing that and he finally came back to his body incid. Okay take jokers on the kidding here has is change absolutely like another person almost emerged moment. Did you feel fear no not at the time. I felt anger anger. Her yes about two months after she went missing Kimberly Night Leitch body was found. I should've been placed in the lane to shed in hog banned in this area. Ashley you don't understand even when you hear the details you can't comprehend it as being a twelve year old and this is your classmate who was innocent. Electricity Grand Jury issued a sealed indictment which presumably names Bundy for the murder of twelve year old. Kimberly Diane late. The the evidence against him in the Kimberly Leach case ranged from eyewitness testimony people seeing him grabbing or fibers receipts location. WHO's putting together pieces of a puzzle? We're starting to put all this together and we're tying it up. And what appears we now one bundle already. Two dozen law enforcement agencies told the Pensacola police that they want to talk with Monday. The walls are clearly closing in on. Ted Okay did you got the indict. It's all you're gonNA get Ted Bundy. The master manipulator makes a move that no one thought was covering. He called Glenis on Wednesday. Will you marry me. She said yes I do of ties or they can. What's going on? They always say in for the Chi Omega murders grand jury in Tallahassee issued an indictment against Ted Bundy can concern us sheriff of Leon County with low cameras rolling lights on read through the whole indictment. Robert you were charged. And of course he kept in a rotating me but I I just kept on. He's still look like the boy next door. Until that night indictments indictments were read. And that's when the devil came out he looked each of us in the. This was the killer in that room. You could feel and as you plead not guilty right now and your grandeur Abrahams running After ted is charged with murders and assaults at Florida state. You still always cases not west. Clearly Florida has the best evidence in so the prosecutors got together and said look. We're going to prosecute Ted Bundy from our perspective. I WANNA get bundy off the street forever. The trial got off kind of slowly because Bundy was not cooperating with his attorneys. Ted Bundy wanted to be the one who is in charge. They told me he was gonNA confess. Make it right for the people hurt and then he went on to this show of saying I'm innocent. I'm innocent I'm innocent. I'm just so angry about that. I'm here today because I assert my innocence. The judge allowed Ted Bundy to you. ACT AS CO counsel for a defendant to be a part of the defense team is extraordinarily unusual. He had gone to law school cool. This wasn't so farfetched for him to be in a courtroom lawyer that represents himself has a fool for a client. And I want to caution function you about that but I'm not going to deny that right so it's the ideal stage for Ted Bundy. He thinks he can manipulate and convince cheery through his charm and good looks that he couldn't have possibly committed these crimes every day during the trial and the courtroom was filled some reporters but mostly spectators. A number of them were young. Women who are I think just drawn to the allure of seeing this guy on trial carol. Boone was one of the constant personalities. Karel Boone actually met Monday back in his Washington Lynn state days so she knew him before any of these things happen. She was his advocate. She called him bunny. She was affectionate towards him. He literally sort of pulls her into his web convinces her he's not guilty. Your conclusion is what that he did not commit. The murders in Washington Washington state that he did not abduct Carol that he did not murder or of duct any of the other women in Utah that he did not kill Karen Campbell that he did not commit. The Crimes Mega City or on Dundee Street. Tallahassee was a true believer and she wanted everybody else to have the same conviction that he was not in guilty person. I called Ray crew the afforestation university police department to kind of set the scene of what uh he saw whenever he got to the cow mega house and for some reason. Mr Bundy decided that he wanted to crossing salmon officer. Craig Morrison Awesome. He asked him to describe in detail this horrific crime scene. You describe what you so. Listen listen to cover as much detail call for peaceful. She was live basically faced down. There was a considerable amount of around her head manager. Here on the walls there was a palpable reaction in the courtroom and among jury. When he did that her mouth there was what appeared announced that it around her neck as I was describing her injuries and the blood his grip on electron tightened up and it is actually got a little bit larger? I had the distinct impression that he was precariously. reliving it and enjoy it was so chilling. It was sickening thickening. The week began with the prosecution. Introducing evidence to prove that Ted Bundy was the man seen by an eyewitness leaving the scene of the crime that Ted Bundy's hair matched hairs found in a pantyhose mask that a bite mark left on one of the victims could have been made only by Ted Bundy the bite right mark evidence. It was both new and Unorthodox and compelling and the trial versus a verdict. The jury defendant the door Sunday after the indictment of murder in the first degree of putting one Margaret Bowman guilty as charged. Ted's ultimately convicted basically all the charges. The jury recommends he gets death. The judging gives death it is further ordered that on such schedule late that you may put today after the Chi Omega trial and he was convicted convicted in those murders he was then facing a new trial. The second trial was over the kidnapping and murder. Kimberly Leach which occurred in Lake City. Florida the murder. I think you've felt most connected to was Bundy's last murder and abduction action of a twelve year old Kimberly Leach because you were twelve. Yeah I mean it's hard to find words for you. How devastating it is the loss of this Girl and the things that he did her really so as you can see been a lifelong source of agony thinking about about her her parents her friends that someone was capable. That's one enjoyment in harming a child mm-hmm and utilizing a child was very compelling circumstancial evidence case it did not surprise me at all. The verdict is guilty. Then abilities bundy represented himself and he called and Perr on Wednesday and had her tests. How about how much she loved him and out of the blue happens? He actually proposes loses to Karel Boone in front of a camera Cara and I now pronounce man and wife at that time under Florida Law. If you ask someone to marry and the person says yes And there's a notary public there. It's illegal march okay. Sime soon limited married her on there in the middle of pinks. Thanks so now ted. Bundy is a convicted murderer. He's an new husband and he is in effect a dead man walking. I don't think anybody doubted that I've done some bad things that the question is what of course and he accordingly wine Ted Bundy's now on death row and and you have a whole range of people who still want to talk to him. We don't understand what makes a person like that click. So we won't try a five figure that out Ted Bundy primarily talked to Bob Keppel a homicide detective from Seattle and Bill Myer an FBI theat profiler we were interviewing serial killers serial rapists were looking for understanding and how you or someone like you got away with what you did and he said you think I'm going to say I did anything to you and I said no I don't think so at all I'm just GonNa ask you your perceptions. On different cases he didn't launches into conversations Sion's about quote unquote helping them with other show killers going in telling things about with the killer might have done. He's actually telling on himself became clued me and he went back to a lot of scribes returning bodies whatever whatever drives them to do that curiosity or desire in here is some kind of real place. You'll always be sacred to them. Typically if he killed their wild Ted Bundy is on death row. He's even figured out a way to manipulate the system and possibly father a child married Carol. Boone we thank. The guards allowed them to have an element of Privacy Masih to where he can have sexual intercourse with are there. Were pictures at the time of Ted Bundy with Carol and a child. It's clear clear. The photograph was taken on death. Row On January twenty four th at seven seven. AM The death warrant will be an effect just a few days before his execution he decides. He's going to start confessing because he felt that if he finally starts doling out information nation perhaps the state will keep him alive indefinitely he became very desperate and he wanted to offer the authorities. Something called bones for time. I I mean I'm the only one in position this information. That's just the way it is to do a proper job for everybody we're GONNA I'm Meyer was quite successful in getting Bundy to actually confess. How many we went over this a little bit earlier with thirty experts experts think the number is much higher than it could have been well over one hundred but we will never know him? He's talked about having sex with them while they were unconscious conscious or having sex with them which is called necrophilia after they've died. I'm not sure how many you onto December the heads. Were you cope with thirty now. All of a sudden he wants to tell the truth for him to be negotiating for his life over the bodies. The victims is despicable juvenile in fifteen years. A couple of months is not gonNA make any tips. You don't negotiate with a murder. You don't negotiate with a killer. The Florida Governor says. He's fully confident. Bundy will be executed tomorrow morning. The really festive Ted. Bundy t shirts people truly were saying Now bundy's meeting with the minister. In one of those death row cells behind the minutes head will be shaved as he's prepared Genuinely scared to justice he'd been shaven he didn't look like the way next door. His head was completely bald and I literally saw him these just collapse. When he saw the chair knew he wasn't going to get away? I welcome over and I sat down. Share in line and tell switch been thrown mm-hmm clinching owner. How many throats time around it was executed? Sixteen care it's been more than thirty years since that day. Now Liz. Talking about the darkness she lived through and how she survived and her emotions are still very intense. Have you both been able to love again. And Trust crossed again There have been a lot of Ted Bundy specials documentaries people have been fascinated with him for more than three decades and you been conspicuously suspiciously absent from all of those projects. Well we've been approached a lot about participating in various things but we really didn't want to put more Ted Bundy out into into them. Now as a part of their healing process live and molly had decided to take part in a five part series called Ted Bundy falling for a killer. It tells hostess story from the Perspective of the women who were directly affected by his crimes very surprised that he was having this meltdown. I know now in hindsight what he was talking about. I came to age at the time the crimes came to light. He is metaphorically. Still the reason I locked my door at night and I didn't feel the story had been told ever from the perspective of the women. We all know oh a lot about him. Few people can name any of his victims to see those women's names when you see their faces. What goes through your mind world boss so much Susan ranker's mother who talks about the fact that she would she loved science? And you just wonder if Ted Bundy him taking her life what could she have done without love the Docu series so powerful because it makes it clear what our society is lost by. This man's actions at Bundy story is the idea. You could have sat next to him that you could have been in a relationship with him and yet had no idea of what he was up to. I know you've asked yourself this many times. Why do you think he spared you? Whatever transpired at the beginning of his interaction with my mother put her are in a different category and I think our placement and his life kept us safe involved involved with us? I feel grateful nod to open heart when I see what the big picture was here. I don't feel sorry for myself. I actually felt very grateful to be alive and really grateful to. How'd my mom alive? Listen I think especially for you. I'm sure there's guilt guilty about causing Nissim. My daughter's life guilt about what he had done guilt that I had loved of dismantle it so gruesome. I quit drinking right after. He was convicted in Utah Kidnapping and started a recovery program. Go ahead I just feel like a lot of delivering immortals pretty depressing. I think that was the start of rebuilding my life. But it's taken a lot of time. What can we learn from your story? Great and all those other women's stories. What do you hope people take away from this? I hope to see that it's possible to have terrible traumatic addict experiences. That it's possible to rebuild you are processes probably nothing like the process. The families of these are killed. Surely a million times harder Being in the room there with molly and Liz it's clear. Even after all these years how raw emotions still are and how they will never fully escape those memories so understandable and your interviews are really powerful so Braida them to come forward. You can hear much more from these women on the Amazon Prime Video Series Ted Bundy falling for a killer and it streaming now that is twenty two thousand four tonight. I'm David Muir and I'm amy robot. Thanks for watching from all of us here at twenty twenty and A._B._C.. News good night.

Ted Bundy Ted Bundy Utah murder Assad Denise Naslund Seattle Washington Volkswagen Karen Campbell Campbell attorney University of Washington Tallahassee Colorado Florida officer Ted Cheer TED head Dan Evans COPS
Full Episode: Friday, February 15, 2019

20/20

00:00 sec | 2 years ago

Full Episode: Friday, February 15, 2019

"Are you hiring with indeed you can post job in minutes set up screener questions than zero in on your shortlist of qualified candidates using an online dashboard get started today at indeed dot com slash twenty twenty. That's indeed dot com slash twenty twenty. State prison. Mr. Ted Bundy he'd been involved in how many Amish. L we came up with thirty could've been well over honored. But we will never know we collectively still have this fascination about him. This new film filming which Zach Ephron plays. Ted bundy. I'm going. Was debonair you could be classy when he needed to go ladies loved it could've dated anybody. Almost the African away women disappeared. How do you vanish? But it hard to explain why drive around with an ice pick and a pantyhose mass almost taunting quality like catch me. If you can what do you got there? Bob. Well, it looks like a job got teeth in it. Yes. He would be the last person you'd ever think would be a serial killer. You're gonna find. There isn't anybody who grew up here that is of certain age that doesn't have a Ted Bundy story. His presence here is huge. It's such an amazing story that touches on so many things it is part of the history of the Pacific northwest. It's part of the history of criminal Justice in the United States. It's a story worth telling who was this young man on the Pacific northwest, the son. We raised was a wonderful good person. He was the perfect young man empathetic sympathetic ambitious. You know, how to flatter people? He knew how to win their trust. It was good looking and charming and seemingly had the world in his grasp and was going to be a successful guy. There were two bundy's. The only people that ever saw the diabolical Bundy whereas victims there is the personality that was the fake and on. There is the personality that was the killer. I think we definitely have to be careful to not remiss a Cise people like to bundle. I never wanted to think people were born evil, but my opinion about that change when I'm at Ted. I think uses warning. Seattle was a smaller more unisom place. But I mean women were moving about ways that were probably more autonomous and women's movement was you know, in full early flour than it was a time. When many women were feeling very independent. So people didn't think right away that a woman who hadn't been seen for a few days might have fallen in tarps way. When you look at Ted Bundy was about the right age to be in college. He drove a Volkswagen beetle very very popular car in the seventies. And so when he would move into a college campus, he just fit right in. But that was disarming to his victims. Like, he should be here. He looks like one of us. He drives one of our cars. I remember being with Ted and driving up the road and just having a great time. And they have a lot of man-made little lakes in the middle of Seattle. And we'd go out and may there go swimming. I like talking to teddy was an intellect, and we talked a lot about political things and how they ran the government and things like that where he graduated in June of seventy two from the university of Washington with a degree in psychology. Why does he get green psychology for my view? He does that because he wants to be able to continue to manipulate people. One of his activities was to be involved in political campaigns governor. Evan brought down the aisle and given a tumultuous welcome. He worked for the committee to reelect and Evans he had aspirations. He wouldn't go to law school. I mean, he was thought to be sort of a rising star in the Republican party in Washington state people thought he was going to be, you know, young Ted Kennedy, but for the Republican party, but again, they saw an exterior that he worked hard to create this facade. I think a number of things conspired to make Ted Bundy Ted Bundy. Was filled with rage at his mother. Ted was illegitimate. There are a lot of things for tend to be angry about who. When you look at childhood of serial killers. There are some common themes that I see them and Ted's case where there's dysfunction in the family, and what happens is they grow up with a lot of rage typically towards women he wanted to be from family that had money and he wasn't. It's another sort of checkmark to use against his mother that she didn't marry somebody wealthy. So he didn't have to go out and steal to look wealthy. This is a guy who from the earliest age was a petty thief. He talks about having been a peeping, Tom at some point in the idea that Ted Bundy was involved in peeping actually make sense because it's basically a training ground about how you isolate people. How you watch people how you get into houses. He was a night person. He would get restless get in his car and drive for great distances. So he was a role. Mom, always one thing. We know is that as a youngster that the very early warning sign about people who become killers about mutilating animals. He was doing that animal. Mutilation is really fairly common in people who ended up being Syra Gillers just because his fascination with death. But a part of him longed to be with somebody or a part of something part of a family. He had this long time girlfriend who had a child that he spent a lot of time with them, Elizabeth clever was a young mother, and she was just getting over a terrible relationship. One night. She meets a charming stranger in a bar. It's Ted Bundy they start having an incredible relationship in her mind. I went to go meet with Liz and Liz brought out these photo albums, and I'm coming through these photo albums. It's this happy family unit. There's pictures of these three people camping birthday parties skiing. There's the young daughter. There's Elizabeth club for and there's Ted Bundy when he was what lose he's he said he really enjoyed being a family, man. He said the things that I would expect my brother to say about his family. People are complicated. And Bundy was that he was also somebody who had impulses, or at least wanted to appear as a helpful benign member of society and contributor one day in Seattle when Ted was Northgate mall, and he was coming out of the mall and saw a young man the grab a woman's purse in Ted took off after him. He managed to go and physically restrain the offender until law enforcement got their got the woman's purse back and her thirty dollars that was in her wallet. Do ultimately sort of written up as a quote, I'll good hero. He's really big on. I want attention. And that's a way to get it. Obviously. But as the years roll on T determine that no. No, I'm never going to be married. Never alive. Children. I'm never going to be the governor a never gonna be in the Terni. I'm just going and this is what makes nineteen seventy four. So extremely different. Determent? He's gonna launch himself into fulltime murder, and he's just going to keep doing it until he was captured or killed. In Seattle in the winter. The ski report is a very big deal. Because that's when you decide whether or not you're going to work or you going skiing. Wendy on. Healy was a very popular young woman because she was on the radio five days a week at seven o'clock in the morning. She gave the scare report. All of my years of studying murdered and never heard of an abduction quite like, the Linda man Healy abduction. I was one of many who listened to her in the morning, and I realized the day that she wasn't on the air that there was something unusual. She ever showed for work while the use of frequent bar Dante's to ever on the last night over life Linden. Healy went to Dante's with another girl and a friend of theirs. But he probably did follow them, home and waited and he checked the front door, and it was unlocked. This is what makes us adoption so incredibly surreal he goes down in the basement enters Healy's room, he's aware that there's another bedroom on the other side. He would tell of writer later that he choked her he moves off the bed. He takes her ninety over hangs up in the closet, and he makes the bed almost like in a military fashion. He cares at the end of the night. He takes her down the front steps and their Steve stabs to wherever's cars parked and puts her in there. He would turn passenger see around. So it was and I asked him why you did that. Because that's the way he put his cargo in in the car. As effort disgusting strange during the chances, he took it's not just that he went out and committed murder, but he seemed impervious to feel and from there the nightmare began. Then Donna Manson she disappeared from evergreen state college in their Olympia. And then you have the abduction of Susan ran court from central Washington. Susan ranked courted and Ellensburg was on her way. When meeting to see about being a dorm counselor. In may of nineteen seventy four I was at Oregon state university and reverted Kathleen parks went missing. And in those days reported just as a missing student, and these young women started disappearing and people wondered what's going on here that seemed to be a narrative that was just building in this incremental way. And then Brenda ball was of -ducted near the flame tavern. She wasn't a college student that made it all the more challenging because it it adds to the randomness of the victims. He took his victims from where he could fit in. I mean, he fit in great. They were in places that Ted Bundy feel comfortable. This is the psychological factor. You don't think killer of women is going to be a good looking or tick Hewlett young, man. You're not thinking in terms like that. Georgeanne Hawkins was a student at the university of Washington georgeanne was abducted in June of nineteen seventy four on a beautiful warm summer evening. She disappeared from an alley one night behind Greek role being a university district. People are walking around all hours. She went down the alley. There was Bundy. Mr. tape recorded interview. Bob keppel. Bundy was moving the alley using a briefcase in some crutches and the woman walked down. A so on some around the north end of the block into the alley and stop for a moment. And then keep a walking down the alley toward about halfway down the block, I encountered her and asked her to help me carry the briefcase, which she did we won't back up. The only those you look like killer. Does he look like an end of Doug of women? No, he looks like somebody in needs got like a lake cast on his on his crutches. He had placed a crowbar behind the right rear tire. What happened was not do? Unconscious or the cool bar. Was such force that she came out of one of her shoes and both are earrings rule. It was a man there along with the group and go through glitter in passengers card. Drove away. Drive to a spot that he's already picked out going to be off of a main highway Z said sometimes you check the moon out to when when it's going to be bright. And I don't want to leave my headline. So into say what I'm doing? Physical person here. One second and seconds later. They're gone, and nobody has seen anything. Georgeanne Hawkins was last seen Monday evening shortly after midnight. She had been visiting at the beta house and was returning to her house. Just a half block away down. This alley and the speed with which she would have had to of -ducted tells you that probably the person had done this before police say they will return to this alley at night to determine the lighting of the area. Meanwhile, they're asking the girls to stay out of the alleys and travel in groups of twos or threes and use only the front doors. We really could not find anything definitive that tied all the victims together these spec foul play in this disappearance. The suspect any foul play. We've just got the case this morning. And it's it's hard to say one of those any foam layer, not long short of it was that I again, knocked unconscious. Remarkably considering the circumstances under which these women disappeared. Nothing was seen or heard. There were no real clues. Nobody saw them leave with anyone. No one saw them in a automobile Ted loved nighttime because he could be out, and but not be seen. But then there's the day where he took two girls in broad daylight, and those of Dunkin's would come back to bite Bundy. And the very simple reason as people saw him. Are you hiring with indeed you can post a job in minutes set up screener questions than zero in on your shortlist of qualified candidates using an online dashboard get started today at indeed dot com slash twenty twenty. That's indeed dot com slash twenty twenty. A wave of fear swept all across the state of Washington to us last seen Monday evening when someone wasn't deafening. Young women. Player or not. There was incredible pressure on law enforcement to find the person who was responsible for causing these women to go missing. It was an ultimate challenge. Burger. What cleverness or what sophistication of the suspect? Are you're looking for that can manage to pull that off. There were no clues whatsoever. The minutes kind of remarkable that nobody saw anything. But lex manage was another story. Waksman mistake. Clark was huge. It was a magnet for all of us. Young and old lick place. You would go to in the mid west or something with this old fashioned concession stand and people just coming out with their little sailboats or coming out to son. Joe out fourteen nineteen seventy four the place was absolutely packed forty thousand people there. A number of people that day at lake sammamish. We're taking photos and shooting film a little did. They know the police would want to review this footage. Ted was able to meld into the crowd. He was wearing casual beach type clothing. He was able to strike up conversations with people. He was able to convince today's Naslund and Janice odd to help him with the Reuss that he had a sailboat that he had his arm in a fake slang. If anybody is saying the silence of the lambs wherever the killer had that trying to get that couch into the van, and he's got cast on that that all came from Ted Bundy. Sheridan, Monday was a real scheme or. Remember that these abductions were benign on the face of them. They were always. Bundy approaching the women in a state of of presumed need or weakness, you help me carry my book, smile, arms and slang. Can you? Help me load. My sailboat onto my car. There were three women that saw Janice hot rower bicycle up to the beach in lay down. And she had on yellow bikini. Can then they observed this man walk up to her. Here. They heard her get up and say, hi, I'm Jan. And he said, I'm Ted. He gave his real name. She was last seen headed toward the parking lot pushing her bike with him walking next door. And then she's never seen again. We did have about five or six other women come forward that said that they had been approached by the guy with his arm in a sling. And they look just like Jan Assad. Denise Naslund, someone is far as the parking lot saw the Browns Volkswagen bug, but no, no boat. And at that point he said all the boats have my folks house in its acquire. It'll just take it. Those women backed off, but Jan Assad left walking with him at noon and never came back. First Janice went missing and that was early early in the morning, she disappeared. And then later he came back to the park. The time difference to one was about ten. Yeah. There was four thirty. Junior's farm K JR's Seattle and Kevin O'Brien at four zero nine. It was a Sunday afternoon, and my buddy, and I had this great idea. Well, hey, let's take a break. Let's go down to the lake maybe we can grab something to eat. And we noticed off to the side this guy just a few feet from standing in front of the women's bathroom, and he was dressed in nice casual clothes with the oddest thing about it is he had a cast on his arm four seventeen in K J R's Seattle. So we were going to actually being a couple of smart Aleck teenagers who are thinking. Maybe razzing the guy a little bit. But it turned out. It was our turn to get ice cream. So we, you know, lost track of the guy didn't think anything more about it. Twenty six Nelson was abducted. Those abductions were very brazen. And in front of literally thousands of witnesses, but the witnesses did not know what they were seeing. With regard to these Naslund her cards in the parking lot. Her purse is still her her keys to riccar still there. But she's done is good. Does that satiated with just one thing? He was trying to make a statement that day. For Ted the thrill of coin back to where he'd been successful in the morning and being able to abduct another woman was probably. Very exciting for him. It was almost the Africa the way to women disappeared. It was as if the the stakes of the story had been raised in this dramatic way. It was also critical that people who were at the park that day who were taking photographs of their friends and family any filming that they had done turned over their photographs and filmed to us to see if we could find something that would be a clue. The like Samantha objections would come back to bite Bundy. People saw him and he identified themselves as Ted there's a Ted, and he drives the Volkswagen, and he's handsome and from the witnesses that saw him were composite drawings made. When the picture came out, you know, when they finally got eight Ted Bundy picture of this person of interest. No question in our minds. No question that this was the guy h lead has to be followed. Every phone call has to be made mostly some pan out whether speck of information that may someday help clear up the mystery of the whereabouts of Janice and an east Nadler. And it was a very creepy sensation knowing that we were just steps away from somebody who is ultimately responsible for doing some very very very dastardly dis. One thing since the publication of the description of the man called Ted there have been no further disappearances from this area. John Sandifer for ABC news in Seattle. Find. Intelligent, others. Nineteen year old and he's Naslund and year old Janice aut disappear on a warm summer day at lake sammamish. Though, there was no sign of the women. Several witnesses told of a smooth talking good looking young man named Ted. Keet was starting to come upon him because of his daylight adventures in lake sammamish. Clues. Now, the guy named Ted of VW a composite sketch funding if you want to keep killing he was going to have to go somewhere where there was no investigation. So what is Bundy do? He has the presence of mind to move from the Washington area to Utah. And again, he starts changing his tactics finally killing Brown use excuse going to Utah law score that he gave Liz the option of going with him. He was her prints. She had dreams of him becoming an attorney and having a white picket fence was probably delighted when she said, no, I want to stay in Seattle conference at the houseboat where I lived and and pitcher of him. What makes this photo that has surfaced from Maryland Cheinal? So in credibly interesting and incredibly important is because he's. Stressed been basically the same outfit that he warned at lake sammamish on July fourteenth of nineteen seventy four. She was crying. And I just you know, kind of gave him a good bye. And he got in the car and drove away. Within twelve or so hours. He would be murdering the Idaho Iger. After this picture appeared the task force received one call among thousands of others. This particular caller said a man named Ted Bundy looked quote, something like the picture. Tuned in. And the police never did anything with it called the police more than once stating that she believed her boyfriend Ted Bundy was the color. Bundy went to university of Utah school of wall. When I was there at the law school, I would have regular contact with Ted Bundy, and everyone really there were periods of time when he was absent from class and people would occasionally comment on that all Ted's gone, again, the first semester he's in class three times. He's like a kid in a candy store up at in in Utah around four women in the end just a matter of weeks. Get mad at myself. She weeks later because it has to mine other pair comical, but that's what everything Bundy had within. What is known as moderate get. There were reasons behind it the tire and the garage, and of course, gloves, and it wouldn't matter the item on the planned very carefully to use everything that he had his standard Merck at it wasn't the items there weren't there by chance. They all had a reason. The raw connected the martyr. He said, I always tried to get rid of all all the evidence. That would put me to the crime said that meant I had to restock Mike toll kid all the time. Bundy ran to the Mormon church is kind of refuge kind of thing that was his angle at that point. They didn't know it was a bad guy. So they took him they meant damn joined the church by baptize tat after we discussed the church with him and he made commitments. So we immediately started inviting to our social events parties dinners, and he was a gourmet cook. And he cooked dinner for about seven of us fabulous cook. And we chatted and had fun and played games. It's actually not uncommon for sue killers to have quote unquote, a normal life whether violently killing people shortly after seven o'clock on the evening of November the eighth nineteen seventy-four Carol Dhiraj park Takhar, and this parking lot at the fashion mall shortly after began what she now calls her personal nightmare. What makes the Carol the raunch obstruction? So pivotal is that she's the only one who ever got away from. Money. She was approached by a man near Roldan's bookstore. This man of dinovite himself as officer Rosalyn. And he said, do you drove a Camaro? She said, yes. So we'll my partners holding the suspect in this individual tried to get into the car. Just starting to feel a little uneasy night thought I could smell alcohol, and that's when he just promptly pulled out. His wallet showed me a bad, but we walked across the street to a laundry mad, and there was a side door marked one thirty nine. And he said that was a substation. Anyone drive and he said the doors locked he said, they would have to go down to the main Murray police department to sign a complaint drama Volkswagon, which I thought we'll bass kind of odd, but maybe undercover and I got in. He had a downside straight. And then he suddenly pulled over a on the side of a curve by an elementary school. And that's when I just start freaking out. What are we doing accordia talks? She knows she's in the fight for her life, and he grabbed my arm, and he got one hand of on one rest, and he didn't get the other one on and the one was. Dangling. I had never been so frightened in my tire life. She jumped out of the car. The man jumped out waving what looked like a crowbar. She broke loose ran to the street flag down a passing car and an elderly couple roved raunch to the Murray police station, the search for her doctor began, and so this is the first time we have an eyewitness of somebody who survives a Bundy attack. Sometimes the the urges become such a compulsion that they can't control themselves. And that's when they make mistakes, his compulsion. That day was so high he had to kill somebody the first one didn't work out. He's now frustrated and so he goes to find a second victim. We were having dinner and department. It was when the composite pitchers of a so-called Ted murder were coming out in Salt Lake City because a girl had been kidnapped and she had survived and Ted said, I know how someone could do this. You would kidnap the person in one county take her to a second county murder. Her throw her clothing in a fourth county on her body or body parts somewhere else. I think Ted was a little proud of how it how he was getting away with it and explained exactly how he was doing knowing that we wouldn't ever catch on at the same time while he's committee new murders in Utah. The cops in the state of Washington are finding bones, and those bones are ultimately going to come back to haunt him. The bodies of four more young women were found on Taylor. Mountain all of them had been strangled or bludgeoned by this brutal killer. The heat is building up on Ted then starts looking for a do killing field. Colorado. It's the winner of nineteen seventy five and Ted bundy's. Gotta find a place where there's not a lot of talk about missing women and where he can blend in. So he heads up the mountains to Colorado. He was very familiar with ski resorts in Colorado already understood that those places are populated by basically strangers, and he was fit in quite well, he ends up in Aspen. On January twelfth nineteen seventy-five Karen Campbell disappeared from the wild would end. The end up at the Wildwood. Karen Campbell was a nurse from Michigan. She had come to the world with that just like David four Karen Campbell sat with her fiance. Dr Raymond Godot ski in front of a fire in the lobby of the Wildwood end, they had just finished dinner miss Campbell wanted a magazine from her room about eight o'clock in the evening. She caught the elevator to the lobby to the second floor. That was the last time. The Dow sqi saw her alive. These there. Anyway. She was gone. Thirty six days later, her nude body was found almost three miles away. True months later, he heads over to Vail and ends up killing twenty six year old ski instructor. Julie cunningham. He was just not gonna stop had more relationships with dead women by now than living women. There was all about the haunt. Bundy goes on this killing spree. It costs north west. And he kills three women a twenty four year old fifteen year old and a twelve year old. There was no pattern between Seattle and Utah and Colorado. There was no physical tide of them. There was nothing to loopless altogether. In the summer of nineteen seventy-five, bundy's lock is changing. He was going from being the hunter to being the hunted. In Grainger, Utah's a small suburb. It was like two o'clock in the morning. Compas just getting off duty is name was Bob Hayward. And he saw Volkswagen parts in front of our house. You knew their two young women living there. Neck core. Kicked the burden. My lights on bright stepped on the gas. And he's it. Dale, okay. All big mistake. So there was a chase. He pulled a meal gas station stops stopped all my door. And he was out coming back towards me. I pull my magnum out to sit in the crotch the door unless his whole right there. Standstill. When Hayward comes up with the car. He sees that the seat is out. Electon that side. This e was leeann in the backseat. Quarter space. You can stick a body. He says the seats broke out again. Thanks. If I look through your car. In his car. He had what we would call burglary tools. The ski mask pantyhose with the is cut out. He had a pair of handcuffs. I'm a law student use them in my classes. Now, what is the person doing out in the middle of the night in a residential neighborhood with all of those items and he's driving of? Okay. So I can buck. I took him in and booked him. I there something wrong with his guy. That putting on the radar of Utah law enforcement, and they had this unsolved abduction of Iran. I got a call and it was dead. He says I've been arrested. What were you arrested for all? They think I'm the Ted murderer. And he laughed. I laughed. I didn't think he was guilty. When he came to the police lineup. We made all sorts of attempts to make himself facially difficult to identify part of his hair on the other side. So he did have a chameleon like quality. Carol Durant came to the police station was shown a lineup and was able to identify Bundy as the person who attacked. He was arrested and charged with the kidnapping apparel. Watch a likable guy. And if he could be a killer who else might be so people just didn't want to believe it. I helped raise money to Bailey matted jail. Everybody in the ward fell. He was innocent. I was assigned. Ted bundy's case by the office opposes fence ten. Immediately said something is silly little case in Utah. Kind of I'm rooting it's not a slew little case. During court proceedings in Utah Bundy, actually comes outside and talks to the media. Do you feel about the Justice system in your head? Well, I'm sure it works. You've got to have faith little work or else, you do you be reduced to some kind of in a mumbling idiot. I believe it works. I believe it needs to be improved. When you mentioned improvements does that mean, ultimately, you want to get involved in the criminal Justice? Yes. I intend to complete my legal education and become a lawyer and be a damn good lawyer. Whether you testify or not is one of the only things that defendant has the sole decision making power over and Ted. Of course ignored vice testified in. Was the worst witness of the world? He was an arrogant. Basically. And that's the way he came across on the stand. At the trial Dhiraj picked out Bundy as her objector. I pointed out him said he was he was the one. He was the man that tried to kidnap me. Thought he did lie about everything get away with it. It's pretty hard to explain why you drive around with an ice pick and a pantyhose mask most of us. Don't have that in our cars. Ted Bundy was convicted of kidnapping Carol Dirac. Verdict is guilty. He was going to be headed to Utah state prison. Police officers from Utah, Washington state and Colorado get together share notes and determine that they're all talking about the same guy. Everybody knew it was there, man. It was just a case of proving. But. He's planning the scape. Anybody else that done bad things? The question is. Here does I mean years after this? We're still talking about the person they invented the terms through killer for. He referred to the women in his folks again as cargo as advocates. You don't think killer of women is going to be a good looking articulate lost in the ladies loved. He was entertaining funny. There were clues. Now, the guy named Ted w a composite sketch that was an intruder and the column latest Rory house. He had with him some sort of club. Sleep in my room, and yet evil opened the door and attack me, but I was dealing with a beast Damon. Ted Bundy, a Washington state resident was convicted last year of the kidnap assault of a young woman from Salt Lake City after bundy's convicted of the kidnapping imperilled Doron. Detectives have found evidence linking into the murder of Karen Campbell on January twelfth nineteen seventy-five Karen Campbell disappeared from the wild would end. Here's in his Volkswagen bug of victims from Colorado in Utah. And that gave them enough evidence to file on him in Colorado who was a first degree murder and kidnapping charge. They transferred him they took into the jail and Asman. At that point Ted Bundy had become pretty big news. I called the sheriff. I asked him if I speak with Ted Bundy. We sat in this narrow sell to the interview you are not guilty. Not guilty. Does that include the time? I still comic book when I was five years old. I'm not guilty terrorists which have been filing into such a pleasant full calm demeanor. I wasn't at all convinced. He was guilty. He's the most pleasant killer Burr interviewed no man is truly innocent. I mean, we all transgressed in some way in our lives. I've been impolite and their things event having done in my life. But nothing like the things I think that jury for two creeps kind of grew on me when he talked about feeling for the family. I've been told. That, you know, the parents of these these girls are fairly decent people. I don't know. And I really feel for that. Because apparently they suffered some credible tragedy in their lives. You could tell he was just mouthing the words they didn't really sink into him feels much for anybody. Can I ask him to physician made him angry? And he said, yes, I don't like being locked up for something. I didn't do like my liberty taken away. And I don't like being treated like an animal, and I like like people walking around at awfully me like in some sort of weirdo because you think about getting out of here. Well, legally, sure. Graduating about a month. Law school becomes we're he was assisting in his own defense. He had a right to go use the library. This is involved or courthouse allow library was up on the top floor. Judge decreed that he didn't have to wear shackles handcuffs. So he walked about the courtroom and back into the law library is the Freeman. The number of opportunities to just walk right out. It's a great deal about escape. And I didn't know if I had the guts to do it cry frankly. Picture of him coming into the building that morning, then he's got a really concentrated look on his face. He addressed with an extra layer or he had a sweater onto the one on the outside. So he was planning to go that day. Dard went outside for the windows are open in the fresh air blood through the sky was blue. And I ready to go to war with window. Joe tout. Honest to God. I just got tired of me. He was gone about ten minutes before anyone realized that came out and shouted Bundy escaped. Reporters. Ran to the courthouse in Aspen because this was such a big deal. Jumped out of this second story window at the front of the Pitkin county courthouse this morning. He was scheduled for a court appearance and apparently had been locked into the law library by sheriff's deputies at both ends of town. The sheriff's department put up roadblocks they were warning people. If you see this man, be sure and call the police when was seen. About ten thirty this morning. I'm going to jump from the window. Then he went up to the mountains and Aspen, and he broke into a cabin you stayed in the cabinet few days to Aspen to this car, which was unlocked and have keys and you've Nishin he drives through downtown Aspen tavern. It was a terrible driver, by the way, and there was a patrol car, and they see this car weaving. This is late. It must be drunk. Well, he wasn't drunk. It was Ted Bundy back. He goes. Here. You can see him grinning when he's been captured. He always acted like he pulled one over on on everybody. He was moved to a facility in Glenwood springs. Thous- one of the staff photographers at the Seattle times. I was given a chance to photograph is fellow named Ted. She had shackles and I can lay on the floor and photograph all kinds of different ways. He wanted to be seen. I'm Ted Bundy booking me captured. But in his own mind, I'm not gonna be here for long. South. There was a great in the ceiling that was not secured. There was a light fixture that was due to being welded. It had not been welded. When I visited him and Glenwood noticed that he had lost a lot of weight loss twenty twenty five pounds. I would think this would have come to the attention of jailers. Perhaps why is he doing this? His law books and assembled them more with some pillows to make it look as if there were body in the bed Bundy had succeeded in carving a big enough opening in the ceiling of his cell. He lost so much weight that he was able to wriggle through called through the ducting just like in the movie. Came down into the closet and jailer's apartment near the job. It wasn't there. And he put on civilian clothes astounding stuff, and he gets out into the night and these free again. They woke up in Glenwood springs discovered at Bundy headed escaped basically, twelve hours before. As you think it was possibly get out this way, we've eliminated what we felt that that time any possible escape route from the roof. However, we were wrong these keystone cops as the paper referred to them ask let this guy go again Garfield county, doing play them. We're looking everywhere trains buses, and this the usual thing I have no idea where he is. He should be very careful should check on their neighbors. Make sure their cars are secure. We're just looking I couldn't believe anybody. Let them escape twice. This is bad. Ted bundy's on the loose. And they have no idea where he is. Once he escaped he had an opportunity to go somewhere and disappear. But he couldn't even do that. He had to kill again. Bundy's escaped bordered on a Houdini escapade through a twelve inch by twelve inch hole in the ceiling. On the escaped. Detectives said it's gonna kill again. It's just a matter of time. We don't know where win but he will kill again. The we now have to wait. We now have to wait. Me chicago. Took a train offer stole a car. Drove south to Atlanta and trailways bus to Callahan's e. Florida State University printout has the campus will generally safe and secure that we've not unusual three o'clock in the morning to see people walking back and forth off cat felt safe. Coming. I had joined this forty Kyle mak- living at Cayo. My parents felt was my safer than to live in the dormitory being mega was a wonderful part of my life was just like living with forty friends. Early morning hours. So ten fifteen twenty three o'clock and three fifteen. There was an intruder in the cow mega sorority house. He had with him some sort of wooden club. Dave patrol that night with my partner, we approximate two blocks away from the Kyle mega house when we heard a call come on the radio. So we go straight there. As I stepped into the girls were yelling about stairs upstairs. And there was a lot of cry. And at the top of the stairs, girl. Name carry Chandler. And she was down on the floor. She was bleeding quite badly. Head injuries pretty much everybody. My face is broken. My front teeth were mostly gone after we're going to water it happened. She said there was a loud banging noise, then she made mention about her roommate, Kathy cloud. Her injuries were much more. Extensive jaws actually hanging off. I remember than laying on my bed and trying to talk, and I couldn't make any noise because my job was broken in three places decided to go ahead and start a room by run. Search a knock on the door from the moment. And then get a response. I open the door. And I went up pull the covers back, and I could see to strangle and beaten about the head. You could tell you that. So I stepped across the hallway and there was another body in the bed. Lisa leaving was being severely about the head and body. She also strangled and a bite. Mark was left her. Is so hard see those girls that. That. So sorry for their families. Tend to have insurance bad back. If you were here of this attack and the familiar with on these crimes, and you don't Colorado you biggest the same Rosen. His now on the run he's lost control. So he does something a little planning high risk taking on multiple women. These on a frenzy. After this horrendous attack Kyle mega he goes just about four or five blocks away ended up at a we call the Dunwoody residents, which was the residence of Cheryl Thomas, I was a student Florida State University, and I was a dance major. I woke up to this loud. Banging sound. Then we could hear Cheryl moaning whimpering, and I called Cheryl. We could hear the phone ringing because the wall was so thin, but she wasn't answering her phone, and that's what possessed me to call. The police department. Senate investigator immediately to that location. She went in and she found Cheryl Thomas on the floor in blood, and beaten, I learned that he came in through my kitchen window. He had worn a hose over his face. He pulled that off in that was dropped on my floor. If I did not have my neighbors calling. I don't think I would have survived. Oh my gosh. I mean, he left her for dead. I think it was a couple of days before I woke up, and I didn't know what had happened. I remember flashes. If things that basically what Cup intensive care. I could not get the funeral. I wanted to call the feelings, but. It wasn't fair. It wasn't right that that should happen to them. They were both beautiful wonderful people. I was shocked and wondering who he was and why he had done what he did is no reasoning behind it. I was asleep in my room and yet evil door and attack me remained worried and badly frightened scared. Just walk into class and keeping doors. Locked. I knew that I was dealing with a beast Damon playmate a personal commitment. This person would pay. I said we're taking vitam pressures from you Ted Bundy said you can't do that. I said, yes, I can I have a warrant to search your mouth. From New York. This is the ABC weekend. You four young women were beaten with a club and two of them were strangled to death last night by a man who found his victim sleeping in this sorority house. I was leaving the sorority house driving. And I got a call over radio that there's an investigator that wants to talk to me from out west I talked to the investigator, and I wrote down a name that he gave me that he thought maybe I should look into. That name was Ted Bundy. But obviously, I did think that was possible. The MO of Duchesne in a car didn't fit the MO of potentially objecting some person and taking them somewhere, perhaps in the woods, a murdering them that did Vitton. So what we had was fresh murder in a house. So I was somewhat dismissive. When I was at the morgue, and I looked at the bodies on Lisa lead. There was a fight left. That was very important. Person that Lisa Levy once policed. And then went back him a second town almost an executive cycle. I mean, it was done so perfectly that I just believed in my heart that it was a signature. About three weeks after the Cayo mega tax Intel has e. There comes word from Lake City. That's about ninety miles east of Tallahassee that junior high school student Kimberly Leach as disappeared during the middle of the smolder. It was raining drizzly, very dreary day went to are designated spot to meet up to go to our next class together. And she wasn't there. We knew something was wrong Kim was not a student to skip class to leave campus. I mean, we were twelve and she was very shy firefighter coming home. Walking across the campus Kimba on. He assumed that he was father police urging anyone with any information about Kimberly leads to contact them as soon as possible. In Pensacola a month after the car mega taxes. This man is arrested on a traffic. Stop the altar native stop because of the unusual behavior of Volkswagen. Hey, walked up to the vehicle. Within it crackles over the radio that this is a stolen vehicle. The officer and they have quite an encounter when this when I was putting place in the handcuff. So I'm he kicked my feet out from under me and struck me with a handcuff that have been placed on one risk kind. Of course, not meal feet. And that's started falling. Following out of pistol-whipping. He's got this round. Claim right here. That's where you hit him with that pistol barrel on he spends a couple of days stonewalling, the police who is this man. He refused to give his name to authorities. And then told his arresting officer many would probably get a promotion for nabbing him. They find out that his driver's licenses. And who is the car is driving doesn't belong to him. He's Justice mystery guy to people who want most know who he is our Tallahassee detective Steve Bodiford, Don patching the asset there with him. I gave me MS Reid. I asked him his name was. I started. Where'd you get VW thrown? Is it I stole from you. What about all these credit cards while I got him out of people that were next door in the maga- house. The mystery man will be kept behind bars for three more weeks before returning to court to win a replete officials say by then they hope to know who he is. He says to the police I'll tell you who I am just let me make a phone call, and he calls his old girlfriend blues club from the scribe telephone call. He said that he was in custody repeated over and over again that this was really going to be bad when it broke that it was not gonna break tomorrow morning in the press for this going to be really ugly. Finally tells officers I am Ted Bundy. His name is Theodore Bundy, and he's wanted for questioning and thirty six on day, one of the FBI's ten most one it is a custody in Pensacola and as a suspect in last month sexual when he was apprehended in custody. He would laugh and say, oh kin the evidence is there. You just couldn't find it. But I did. We had the bite marks that night from the more. I personally wouldn't sleep thinking. How can I get an impression from him? We can't enter his mouth. We can't remove evidence. Unless we have a search warrant. The search more in order to compare bundy's teeth to the bag Mark that was left only. I went late at night too. And I said tad. You're coming with me. We took him to my dentist's office. Now, he started a mmediately saying you can't do this. Can you can't do this without my attorney? I said, yes, I can. But I want you to listen carefully. Because it says from the judge that we can use force. He looked at me. You could see he resigned just his whole body guy. He sat down in the dental chair. Leaned back opened his mouth and said do what you have to do. Can you know, I'm not a violent person? About two months after she went missing, Kimberly. Their body was found. Been marred. She's been placed in Elaine to shed and the hog banned in this wanted area on one arm. Don't understand even when you hear the details. You can't comprehend it as being a twelve year old in this is your classmate who was just innocent grand jury issued a sealed indictment, which presumably names Bundy for the order of twelve year old Kimberly Diane leaked the evidence against him in the Kimberly Leach case ranged from eyewitness testimony people seeing him grabbing or fibers receipts location who's putting together pieces of puzzle where starting to put all this together. And we're tying it up, and what appears to be now. One bundle already two dozen law enforcement agencies told the Pensacola police that they want to talk with Bundy the walls are clearly closing in on Ted of indict it's all you're gonna get Ted Bundy, the master manipulator makes a move that. No one thought was cutting called witness. On Wednesday at winging marry me. She said, yes, I do ties are they what's going on. What we have here. Always say right on Tarita. For the Kyle mega-mergers. Grand jury in Tallahassee issued an indictment against Ted Bundy can consult the share of of Leon county with the cameras rolling the lights on read through the whole indictment. They had Robert founding charged. And of course, he kept in a rotating me. But I I just kept on. It was combination crime drama combination political theater. He's still look like the boy next door until that night that indictments were read. And that's when the devil came out. He looked each of us in the I this was the killer in that room. You could feel it. I'll plead not guilty right now and your grandeur. After Ted is charged with a murders and assaults that Florida state. You still all these cases not west clearly Florida has the best evidence in. So the prosecutors got together and said, look we're going to prosecute Ted Bundy from our perspective I wanted to get Bundy off the streets forever. The trial got off kind of slowly because Bundy was not cooperating with his attorneys. Ted Bundy wanted to be the one who is in Chartres, Ana I'm here today because I served my innocence. The judge allowed Ted Bundy to act as co counsel for defend that to be part of the faintest team is extraordinarily unusual. It's happened. Exactly. Once in my career that was Mr. Bundy he had gone to law school. This wasn't so far fetched for him to be in a courtroom. And so instead of being the guy in the orange jump. Suit who looked like that crazy serial killer suspect, he was the lawyer guy lawyer representing self has a fool for a client. And I want to caution you about that. But I'm not going to deny you that. Right. It's the ideal stage for Ted Bundy p self-assured he thinks he can manipulate and convince a jury through his charm and good looks that he couldn't have possibly committed these crimes. Every day during the trial courtroom was filled some reporters, but mostly spectators, a number of them were young women. Who are I think just drawn to the allure of seeing this guy on trial. Carol Boone was one of the constant personalities. Carol Boone actually met on the back in his Washington state days. So she knew him before any of these things happen. She was his advocate. She called him bunny. She was affected towards him literally sort of pulls her into his web convinces her. He's not guilty. Your conclusion is what that he did not commit the murders in Washington state that he did not abduct Carol ranch that he did not murder or of duct any of the other women in Utah that he did not kill Karen Campbell that he did not commit the crimes kind of mega in Lake City or on Dunwoody street, Tallahassee was a true believer. And she wanted everybody else to have. The same conviction that he was not guilty person. I called the Ray crew the Floresta university police department to kind of set the scene of what he saw whenever he got to the cow mega house up until then Mr. Bundy had led his lawyers cross examined the other witnesses. And for some reason Mr. bunion decided that he wanted to crossing salmon officer crew. Bunnies. Cross examination in my mind was the determining factor in the case. He asked him to describe indie tale this horrific crime scene. Describe what you saw. As much detail. Call. She was live basically faced down. There was considerable amount of love around her head mad at her hair on the walls. And there was a palpable reaction in the courtroom and amongst jury when he did that. What? Docking netted around her neck as I was describing her injuries in the blood his grip on the lectern tightened up. His breathing became shallow, and sped up and his eyes actually got a little bit larger. I had the distinct impression that he was precariously reliving it and enjoy it was so chilling. It was sickening. As the trial went into its final week Bundy claimed he didn't know how he got caught up in the web of crimes the week began with the prosecution introducing evidence to prove that Ted Bundy was the man seen by an eyewitness leaving the scene of the crime. That Ted bundy's hair matched hairs found in a penny. Hose mask that a bite. Mark left on one of the victims could have been made only by Ted Bundy. Evidence was both new and unorthodox and compelling in the trial. Defendant was cool and collected throughout most of the trial minutes before the verdict was returned Bundy told ABC news and a telephone interview that he was prepared for the worst. Verdicts. State of Florida versus. Defendant the door Monday as to council the indictment murder in the first degree of one Margaret Bowman guilty as charged. Ted's ultimately, convicted, basically all the charges. The jury recommends he gets death. The judging gives death was further ordered that on such scheduled that you'd be put today. After the Kyle mega trial ended. And he was convicted in those murders. He was then facing a new trial. The second trial was over the kidnapping and murder Kimberly Leach, which occurred in Lake City, Florida. It was a very compelling circumstantial evidence case, and in my opinion, much stronger than the case in Miami. And it did not surprise me at all the verticals guilty, then a Bill failures Bundy represented himself, and he called hero by and on Wednesday and had her test about how much she loved him. And so the out of the blue happens. He actually proposes to Carol booed in front of a camera. Mary. Lamour you on our now live at that time under Florida law. If you ask someone to marry the person says, yes, and there's a notary public there. It's a legal marriage. So. Signed sale limited and they married her there in the middle of piddly, folks. So now Ted Bundy is a convicted murderer. He's a new husband, and he is ineffective Dead Man Walking. I don't think anybody else that I've done some bad things. The question is what course and how? Most importantly wide. Interesting. People costly little ask me. Ted bundy's now on death row, and you have a whole range of people who still want to talk to him. We don't understand what makes a person like that click. What what drove him to do what he did. And so we won't to try to five figure that out. Ted Bundy, primarily talked about Keppel homicide detective from Seattle and Bill Hegg Meyer, an F B I profiler, we were interviewing serial killers. Rape. We're looking for understanding, and how you or someone like you got away with what you did. And he said, do you think I'm going to say I did anything to you? And I said, no, I don't think so at all I'm just going to ask you your perceptions on different cases heathen launches into conversations about quote, unquote, helping them with other serial killers. Go a hobby. In telling things about what might have done. He's actually telling on himself. Became clear to me. And he went back to his grime saints returning to see. But. I mentioned whatever drives to do that. Curiosity or desire? Make sure didn't leave it here. Or just some kind of thrill place will always be sacred to them thickly if he killed there. While Ted Bundy is on death row. He's even figured out a way to manipulate the system and possibly father a child you married. Carol Boone think the guards allow them to have an element of privacy to where he could have sexual intercourse with are. There were pictures at the time of Ted Bundy with Carol and child it it's clear. The photograph was taken on death row. On January twenty four th at seven AM. The death warrant will be in effect. Just a few days before his execution. He decides he's going to start confessing because he felt that. If he finally starts rolling out information, perhaps the state will keep him alive indefinitely. He became very desperate. And he wanted to offer. The authorities something called bones for time. Only one possession this information. That's just the way it is to do a proper job for everybody. We're going to I'm gonna eat some time. Bill Mayer was quite successful in getting Bundy to actually confess. What I was a little bit earlier. We came up with thirty which just trying to summarize what states they were in when periods of time, California or lush, I know Utah. Colorado Florida between nineteen. Three. Experts think the number is much higher than it could have been well over one hundred, but we'll never know you said much of these girls were good Christian or Jewish girls. He said whose parents bought them up to love and help other people when he said I exploited that it it's possession. I can just look in your eyes and their their last breath comes on that breath is mine and part of me forever. Talked about, you know, having sex with them while they were unconscious or having sex with them, which is called necrophilia after they've died. I'm not sure how many you to several the heads from the victims. And where do cO thirty. Oh, that's. He wrote down twelve you know, on a piece of paper while he was saying half dozen. He wrote twelve now all of a sudden he wants to tell the truth to be negotiating his life or the bodies of victims. This despicable. Pupa fifteen years. A couple of months is not going to make any difference. Don't go with a martyr. Don't negotiate with a killer. One of the things that had been traditionalist that death row inmates. Bent allowed last interview of their choosing bundy's had chosen duct James Dobson. I don't wanna die. I'm not gonna kiss you. Okay kitchen. Dr James Dobson was a crusader against pronography well-meaning decent people will condemn behavior. Of the Ted Bundy while they're walking path to a magazine rack full the very kinds of things that send young kids down the road to be Ted bundy's Dame option interview, Ted bundy's last que asp attempt at avoiding that they have penalty by becoming an anti pornography spokesperson Ted Bundy is to die at this point at seven AM tomorrow morning. It was really festive atmosphere there even Ted Bundy t shirts for sale. People chewing that we're seeing. Plight. Now, bundy's meeting with the ministering one of those deathrow behind me in a few minutes is head will be shaved as he's prepared for execution. We came in room. He was scared to. Just as why sheet he'd been shaving? He didn't look like the boy next door has head was completely bald. And I literally saw him these just collapse when he saw the chair knew he wasn't gonna get away. There was fear real fear Ted Bundy and a knowledge that he was going to die. The white smoke was assigned. That Florida's electric chair was powered up prison. Officials say the execution is on schedule. Komo. I said. Crawl over. Swish been thrown. Plate you say. Ellen. How wonder how many throats time around? Peter Bundy was executed at seven sixteen this foreign incur the electric chair toward state prison. At seven sixteen this morning. Bundy was indeed executed the hers with his remains pass by the street. I remember sitting on the sofa with my fiance and crying and feeling that Lisa and Margaret finally at peace. It's been thirty years since Ted bending was executed. We collectively still have this fascination about him an anniversary like that always provides an opportunity to kind of look back and see what the legacy of somebody was sack Ephron plays Ted Bundy, and in many ways, we are taking his kind of teen heartthrob image and turning that on its head. Understanding why women were so attracted to this charismatic killer through Zack's performance. At the center of the Ted Bundy story is the idea that you could have sat next to him that you could have been in a relationship with him. And yet had no idea of what he was up. There was the outside Bundy. And then there was the inside Bundy a whole different world right behind his eyes. I think the continuing fascination with Mr. Bundy results from a myth that he is charming intelligent individual. And that somehow that charm and intelligence was involved in the murder of these women. When in fact, he didn't charm these women, he tricked them. He attacked them bashed him in their head. And he killed him. Being a rare survivor of Ted Bundy, it makes me feel like I have to represent those women who did not survive. And I hope that I always can do that. Because I don't want him forgotten. Feel absolutely new animosity towards any other to death row. But. Still hate they had Mundy and eighty onto the day on. Die. Are you hiring with indeed you can post a job in minutes set up screener questions than zero in on your shortlist of qualified candidates using an online dashboard get started today at indeed dot com slash twenty twenty. That's indeed dot com slash twenty twenty.

Ted Bundy Ted Bundy Donna Manson Seattle murder Utah VW Washington Ted Kennedy Karen Campbell Colorado university of Washington Washington officer lake sammamish Pacific northwest Elizabeth clever Bob United States
Wednesday, June 16, 2021 - The Christian Science Monitor Daily

The Christian Science Monitor Daily

12:32 min | 3 months ago

Wednesday, June 16, 2021 - The Christian Science Monitor Daily

"Welcome to monitor daily wednesday june sixteenth. Thanks for joining us. I'm dave scott. Molly you've probably seen news reports about the fifteen elephants trekking across southwest china's yunan province. These peripatetic pachyderms have traveled three hundred miles over the past year and are now on the outskirts of coming city. Four point five million people. China just recently started twenty four hour monitoring more than three hundred people in eighteen drones have been deployed to track the heard. Set up roadblocks and lately leave food pineapples and corn in an attempt to steer them away from the urban areas. Some thirty five hundred people were evacuated from their homes. Saturday has the elephants approached. the ship. news agency reported. No one knows why these asian elephants are migrating so far wildlife experts suggest. The unusual behavior could be a lack of food crowding in their home preserve or a loss of habitats. Still this fascinating cross country. Stroll is a source of endless amateur speculation. Maybe this heard just needed to stretch. Its legs taken a few sites. Perhaps it's a case of enduring curiosity or a journey of self discovery or communal wanderlust. When i asked my eight year old niece what was going on. She pondered and after a moment smiled. Her answer was as plausible as any biologists. Why did the elephants crossroad after road. She asked because they weren't chicken. She giggled now. Today's stories our first story. The conversation between joe biden and vladimir putin was constructive said the russian preston ultimately. It may amount to little or it may be a modest start for progress on nuclear arms control and cybersecurity. The much anticipated summit between us. President joe biden and russian president vladimir putin had little sense of unity or common purpose yet despite the absence even of a concluding joint press conference. Us officials say the two leaders three plus hours of talks lay the groundwork for areas where the two adversaries can work together as a sign that said see need to try to put tense relations back on better footing. The leaders agreed to return their respective ambassadors to washington and moscow. Some in the united states had judge the summit premature and likely to primarily serve. Mr putin's interest. Mr biden has no illusions about the challenges of working with mr putin white house officials say but he concluded that airing differences was still the better course. It always better to meet face to mr putin said while seated alongside mr biden before their first meeting mr biden agreed declaring his closing press conference. There is no substitute for face-to-face between leaders none. The russian president at his press conference characterized the discussions as constructive and said. He considers the glimmers of confidence. I saw between us as the principal result of this meeting. This story was reprinted by howard. The frankie in geneva for the last summer's popular pro. Democracy protests have faded with russian help and weak response from europe belarussian president alexander lukashenko has strengthened his crackdown on the opposition. There are a few creative resilient pockets of resistance the may twenty third hijacking passenger plane by belarus to seize a critic of president. Alexander lukashenko may have stirred the european union react. The man called the last dictator in europe. But for many months belarus has steadily been shifting into de facto martial law. Thousands have been detained in connection with protest activities. And nearly five hundred. Political prisoners are behind bars. Poland and lithuania shelter many who fled those left and belarus live in a climate of fear analysts question whether fish sanctions will actually help the situation and while the eu responded quickly to the ryan air flights interception and the arrest of belarussian board condemnations and flake bands. And let's say that the blood has been largely ineffective constraining. Mr lukashenko germany and other european countries have never refrained from pine belarussian oil potash and related products that directly fund the regime and preventing european companies from selling in belarus would potentially allow turkish and russian companies to step into the vacuum restrictions. Alone have never been an ultimate magic wand says independent analyst punch took a combination of external pressure and internal national mobilization is the key. The future of belarus can be determined. Only by its citizens. The story was reprinted by lenora. Chew in berlin and dominique seagal in switzerland for the monitor while g seven nations welcomed. The us back into a global leadership role are london columnists observes. They are skeptical. That america's fractured democratic system can deliver on president biden's promises on climate infrastructure and governance. It's a tough jobs. That president joe biden set for himself and america to lead the way in promoting democracy against hockey on the international stage he found us allies receptive to the idea when he met them in europe this week and last but his trip has made another message clear. His task will not be easy. That's largely because many foreign leaders in their citizens are voicing skepticism about america's democratic health one recent poll found that while seventy five percent of respondents trusted mr biden to do the right thing on international affairs only seventeen percent. America was sitting a good example for democracies worldwide to promote democracy. Mr biden will have to prove that it meets people's needs that it works. He has set before western nations ambitious goals on climate change and building new infrastructure for poor countries. The trouble is that the domestic american version of these goals. The american jobs plan is currently mired in congressional gridlock. That raises the question. How can an american president convince the world democratic governance and deliver effective and ambitious policy. If he's unable to make good on that promise at home this column was written by ned tempo in london for the monitor in our global progress roundup. This week we see women taking key leadership roles in the loom pentagon and has miami's first ever chief he officer we also see how a headstart program boost. Survival rates for australia's endangered wallabies confined her fullest points. Progress by lindsey mcginnis in today's issue in this interview with gavin larsen author of being a ballerina. She looks at success from the perspective of the worker. Bee dancer she also debunks. Some of the myths and misconceptions surrounding bali larson's commitment to dance started early and carried her through a rewarding nearly two decade career in her memoir being available china the power perfection of dancing life. She upends hub culture narratives but big name stars and competition among dancers revering the everyday moments that build a life in dance her memoir honors the day in day out dedication and a thousand dancers and they're mutually supportive community in sharing her insights. Ms larson wounds to demystify dance and make it more accessible. I hope the book gives la where universal appeal. Everyone can dance and everyone should dance. She says this story was reported by karen campbell for the monitor Now commentary from the monitor's editorial board on increases in giving in the last year reports out of myanmar indicate a country on the verge of economic collapse and possible civil war yet. Despite this adversity the people of myanmar are living up to the reputation as one of the world's most altruistic people according to other reports they have stepped up donations of food and money for both poor people and the protesters. The southeast asian country is just the latest example of loving kindness rising to the occasion. In turbulent times in the united states which last year saw three great upheavals a recession pandemic and racial justice protests charitable giving reached record levels americans gave four hundred seventy one billion dollars or a three point eight percent increase over the previous year when adjusted for inflation worldwide last year. More than half of adults. Help someone they didn't know. The highest level ever recorded according to the twenty twenty one world giving index the health of democratic society may be measured by the quality of functions performed by private citizens nineteenth century frenchman. Alexis de tocqueville remarked after observing american society. But a society's future can also be judged on its ability to respond to adversity with compassion and generosity. News find the full length versions be stories but stays issue or dot com slash daily. Thanks for joining us. Come back tomorrow. We're reviewing two films that look at the childhoods of famous athletes. We'd also like to invite you to meet the humanitarian solving community problems. Meet your fellow monitor. Subscribers join the conversations at our community connect page if you've visit. Cs monitor dot com slash community. You'll find panel discussions and interviews an reporter profiles. They're all included in your subscription. It's our way of connecting you with the work of good samaritan in the work. Today's christian science spiritual perspective contributor shares. How understanding and living the truth of what we are as children of god divine love brings us satisfaction. That never match can find the column in today's issue or monitored dot com slash daily final grace note of gratitude to our staff including today's audio production. Jeff turn and tara adhikari. This podcast is produced by the christian. Science monitor copyright. Twenty twenty one.

mr biden mr putin belarus Mr biden united states yunan alexander lukashenko vladimir putin President joe biden Mr putin joe biden China dave scott Mr lukashenko europe dominique seagal president biden eu
Full Episode: Friday, January 31, 2020

Nightline

19:16 min | 1 year ago

Full Episode: Friday, January 31, 2020

"This is nightline tonight the double life of Ted Bundy a face of Evil Nana. I'm here today because I assert my innocence accused of murdering dozens of women now the unsuspecting mother and daughter who wants love sadistic serial killer still have disbelief breaking their silence. After nearly forty years to amy robot I still believe she was innocent at that point. While a facade of doting partner Erin father figure murder on his mind never in my dreams and I think he was out stalking eventually ducting. Why were they spared by one? The most infamous murderers in American history. That thought ever cross your mind. WHO's going to kill US nightline? We'll be right back when it comes to hiring. You don't have time to waste. You need help getting to your shortlist of qualified candidates fast. That's why you need indeed dot Com post a job job in minutes set up screener questions then zero in on qualified candidates using an intuitive online dashboard. And when you need to hire fast accelerate your results with sponsor jobs new users can try for free at indeed dot com slash nightline. That's indeed dot com slash nightline terms conditions and quality standards apply offer valid through March. Thirty First Twenty Johny Twenty. I still have a sense of disbelief. That this man that I love could go out and do service talk to Liz Kendall Ted. Bundy was not a sadistic murderer. Who Killed Dozens of women I've been involved in L.? We came up with thirty but the man she loved. Is it fair to say at least at first the Ted Bundy was gentlemen. Oh completely my parents loved him he was really yet my opinion and I really wanted to marry him. He was like a father to to her daughter. Molly seen here together in these childhood photos. I adore this man. They were together for about five years. While Bundy's secretly began his his descent into a serial murderer. There were two Bundy's the only people that ever saw the diabolical Bundy or his victims at I. I didn't want to believe that. Her smart charming and charismatic boyfriend could be a serial murderer you thought he was innocent. Did now in the new Amazon Prime Series Ted Bundy falling for a killer. He is seen through the eyes of Liz. And Molly the women who knew him best. We were like a family. They're breaking in their silence after nearly forty years in the Docu series and in a book the Phantom Prince my life with Ted Bundy less. I'm sure you've asked yourself why not. May I mean I hate to even say this because it makes him sound normal but I do think you love this Bundy was in his early twenties when he met Liz Kendall at a bar in Seattle Washington. I was pretty smitten. Right from the get-go she was a young reasonably. I BELIEVE NAIVE SINGLE MOTHER FROM UTAH. Who met the man who was considered by virtually everybody in society and Culture in the one thousand nine hundred seventy s as the dream date the perfect husband material prince charming but there were two sides to Bundy? This is what makes nineteen seventy four so extremely namely different determined. He's going to launch himself into fulltime murder and he's just gonNa keep doing until he was captured or killed. One of his first known victims was twenty one year old Linda and healy a senior at the University of Washington. Bundy spotted added Healy and a bar followed her home and strangled her in her bedroom. Can you describe to me what your relationship was. Like in nineteen seventy four subtle changes were where I felt like. Maybe I was losing him. He thought maybe worse case scenario. She sings someone else. Never in my dreams. I think he was out stalking women and then eventually abducting the murdering women over the next four months young women in the Pacific northwest started to go missing. There were no clues whatsoever. The minutes kind of remarkable that nobody saw anything but that changed on July fourteenth nine thousand nine hundred seventy four bundy went to Lake Sammamish state park looking. Thanks for his next victim. A number of people that day at leg Sammamish or taking photos and shooting film a little did they know the police would want to review this footage. Ted was able to Meld into the crowd. He was able to convince Denise Naslund and Janice Chris odd to help him with the reuss that he had a sailboat that he had his arm in a fake slang. uh-huh if anybody has seen the silence of the lambs where the killer had that trying to get that couch into the van and he's got a cast on the Dow. Can I help you. That he kidnapped and and killed the two young women those abductions were very brazen and in front of literally thousands of witnesses. Police asked the public to send in any video or photos taken that day. Antea down by themselves. As Ted Police knew the suspect drove adults wagon and we're able to produce this composite sketch. Your Co workers brought over the sketch to show to you because they thought the sketch looked like Ted. Yes yes there was something about it that just grab my attention. There was just something about the line or something like that making and you called Seattle. Police call anonymously to tip line. That they had set up. There was something like three thousand potential. Ted's heads who may or may not drive a Volkswagen and he was one of them but he had this terrific spotless clean record. You have to understand that detective have to work was organized. A very different way in the seventies there was no DNA evidence. Police departments didn't even have fax machines. Let alone the Internet did you ever ask Ted. Are you concerned about the similarities. In the very beginning I asked him. I said did you read this. You know what they're saying. There's so many things here that people are going to be looking at you kind of making a joke out of it. But once they started to worry like could this be true. I didn't feel safe life bringing it up. Want him to know what I was thinking as the police investigations intensified Bundy realized he had to leave the Seattle area. The front killing Brown use the excuse of going to the Utah Law School. Listen Molly stayed behind. Bundy drove away. Well hours later he. He killed a hitchhiker in Idaho. In law school bundy barely went to class. He's like a kid in a candy store up to the Utah around for women in the end just a matter of weeks but one woman escaped carol garage. Who managed to get out of his car after after he lured her in pretending to be a police officer investigating a crime so this is the first time we have an eyewitness of somebody who survives Bundy attack My friend CAME BACK FROM UTAH. And said I don't want to scare you. It's happening down there now. What did that feel like? Oh my God like the bottom of my world is falling out. It's like this too much of a coincidence. So I did call King County police place and I did meet with the detective. I gave them some pictures of him and they showed him to the best witness from Lake. Sammamish she pulled his picture shouted the staff at the detective had given said No. He's too old and put it back in the stack multiple contacts with the police. But it kept coming back Eric. He's not your guy. It's the winner of nineteen seventy-five and Ted Bundy's gotta find a place where there's not a lot of talk about about missing women so he heads up the mountains to Colorado. I Aspen where he finds his next victim. Karen Campbell Doc. Unearths from Michigan thirty six days later her nude body was found almost three miles away. Two months later he heads over to Vail and ends up killing twenty six year old ski instructor Julie Cunningham. He was just not gonNA stop get more relationships with dead woman by now than living women. It was all about the hunt but the hunter was about to become the hunted in Utah. Later that year he got stopped by a local cop in his car a ski mask handcuffs and pantyhose with the is cut and took him in Boston. And all of his Guy Bat put him on the radar of Utah Law Enforcement and they had this unsolved unsolved. Abduction of Carol Carol Durant came to the police station was shown a lineup and was able to identify Bundy. The personal attack was arrested and charged with the advent of Payroll Dhiraj at one point police. I didn't show you a photo of the items they found in Ted's car. How could he possibly explained that a way to you and he's tried to just brush it off of you? We need the crow bar for if I get wreck can lead to pry cars apart. I need the ski mask for shoveling snow believing he was innocent. His friends raised money for his bail while waiting for his trial. Bundy returned to Seattle to see Liz. What was that time like? Well when he first showed up at my door unannounced. I've taken aback. Poke started talking to Guinness. It's like this is ten because of our placement in his world is the only reason that we're still alive. I'm quite certain because people had their eyes on it did that thought ever cross your mind is going to kill us. No you think he was capable of murder. I mean I still believed he was innocent at that point. Listen Molly come to grips with the horrible truth truth about the man. They both loved after years of killing at least sixteen women across five states. Ted Bundy was on trial. Not for any of those murderers but for kidnapping in court. He testified in his his own defense. Thought he could lie about everything and get away with. It was pretty hard to explain why you drive around with an ice pick. Any patios mass ass. Bundy was convicted of kidnapping Carol Garage finally putting him behind bars. Here's in his Volkswagen bug. We're of victims shown Colorado in Utah and that gave them enough evidence to file on him in Colorado. Who was the first degree murder and kidnapping? He was transferred to a Jalen Aspen where he was allowed access to a law library. The judge decreed that he didn't have to wear shackles handcuffs so he walked about the courtroom. For whom and back into the library as Freeman a great deal better than I get to know if I had the guts to thankfully he addressed with an an extra layer yet a sweater onto the one way on the outside so he was planning to go that day. Darwin outside the windows are open and the fresh air. Run through the guy was boom. I'm ready to go to work with Joe PALCA. He was going about two minutes before anyone realized that came out and shouted Kenedy escaped driving through Aspen in a stolen Cadillac. Bundy was quickly picked up by police. You can see him grinning. When he's been captured? He always acted like he pulled one over on on everybody back in custody. He was moved to a new allegedly more secure facility. There was a light fixture that was due to be well. It had not been welded. Bundy had succeeded. In carving a big enough opening in the ceiling of the cell called through the duct just like the movie. It came down into a in closet and the jailer's apartment new the wasn't there and then he put on civilian clothes and he gets out into the night these free again. Once he escaped he had an opportunity opportunity to go somewhere and disappear but he couldn't even do that he had to kill again. Bundy made his way to Tallahassee. The home of Florida State University and the Sorority Chi Omega I had joined the Sorority it Kyle Mak- Living Cayo. My parents felt was much safer than to live in the dormitory being in Cuyahoga was a wonderful careful. Part of life was just like living with forty friends on January fifteenth. Nineteen in seventy eight Bundy broken and started attacking the young women with a wooden club. Police arrived to a scene from foreign movie last up in the they were yelling upstairs. Upstairs and there was a lot of cry and at the top of the stairs was a girl named Karen Chandler and she was down out on the floor she was bleeding quite badly from head injuries. Pretty much every bone in my face was broken. My front teeth Modestly gone I remember then laying on my bed and trying to talk and I couldn't make any noise because my jaw was broken in three places bay. Hey we're the lucky ones a knock on the door from the bone and then get response. I open the door and I went up. pull the covers back and I could see two spinal and beaten about the head. You could tell you that frost up across the hallway and there was another body in the bed Lisa leaving was being severely about the head and body. She also trying so hard to see those girls Dan so sorry for their family likes four blocks from campus. He attacked again. The neighbors heard his victim screams and called all the police say the Cheryl. Thomas is life. I think it was a couple of days before I woke up and I didn't know what had happened. Ah I could not general. I wasn't hostile so I wanted to call the fuel. Mix and what it would take take four weeks for authorities to find Bundy and arrest him in that time he had killed his last victim a twelve year old girl a month after the Carl mega taxes. This man is arrested on a traffic stop. He spends a couple of days stonewalling. Police who is this Smith refused to give his name to authorities and then told his arresting officer Betty would probably get a promotion for nabbing him. He says to the police. I'll tell you who I am. Just let me make a phone and he calls. His old girlfriend told me that he was sick can that he was consumed soon. Bhai something that he didn't understand and that he just can contain it. was that the moment that you knew. The manual loved was a serial killer. took him telling me himself that he he had something wrong with him that he knew you can be around a certain thing that he was addicted to something humint young women and causing them harm wanted for murder in multiple states. Bundy was ultimately put on trial in Florida. The Cayo mega murders. He told me he was going to convince offense. Make it right for the people hurt and then he went on to this. Show saying I'm innocent. I'm innocent I'm innocent today because I assert my Innocence his State of Florida versus Robert. Buddy verdict we the jury the defendant guilty as charged. He was sentenced to death in a separate trial. He was convicted of murdering twelve year. Old Kimberly Leach. The murderer. I think that you felt most connected to was Bundy's last murder because you were twelve. Yeah I mean it's hard to find words for. Oh how devastating it is the loss of this girl and the things that he did. Bundy was executed by the electric chair on January. Twenty Fourth Nineteen eighty-nine. Aw before his death Ted. Bundy confessed to killing thirty. Young women could have been well over one hundred but we'll never know. I still have a sense of disbelief that this man that I loved seemed seem to be such a great guy could go out and do such horrific things too so hard to accept. I'm sure there is guilt guilty about causing Nisa. My daughter's life guilt about what he had done killed that I had loved. This man was so gruesome Ted Bundy falling for a killer is available now on Amazon Prime Video. Hey everyone is. ABC's Paula Farris. I'm the host of journeys of faith as you know all too well. We are in an election year so on this season. We're talking to twenty twenty presidential candidates and other political figures about how their faith and religion influence their person and their politics. Before you tell me about your religion for show it to me and how you treat other people you can call God by many different names but they are worshiping the same God checkout journeys faith wherever. You're listening now.

Ted Bundy Liz Kendall Ted murder UTAH Molly Seattle Ted Police Sammamish Amazon stalking Carol Carol Durant Liz Aspen amy Colorado Lake Sammamish officer Liz Kendall partner Florida
Season 3 - Episode 16

They Walk Among Us

32:46 min | 3 years ago

Season 3 - Episode 16

"Support for they walk among us. His brought to you by ADT ADT canal design and install a smart time just for you backed by twenty four, seven protection. The new smart home is customizable to your lifestyle and make you feel safe for listening to this podcast. For instance, you can say neighborhood, watch service, an ADT will turn on outdoor lighting and make it look like your home. Even when you want ADT will set up your home with multiple smart devices and security features like video doorbells, cameras, locks and more visit ADT dot com. Forward slash smart to learn how ADT can design and install secure smart time just for you. when concedes in three episodes sixteen of they walk among us. A podcast dedicated to you carry true crying. This is one of the two story. Listen caution is advised as this episode contains adult themes descriptions that some listeners may find distressing. the leeann abductions in Scotland, have nothing to do with little green men from another planet in two thousand nine members of one of Scotland's. Most dangerous crime gangs began kidnapping there royals at gunpoint taken from their homes. The victims were robbed of their possessions, which often included drugs, cash and firearms who's were placed over their heads, and they were driven to a disused building these alien abduction gang posing as armed police, tortured their captives with employments that included power tools, blow torches and syringes. After suffering, severe beating long with both physical and mental torture, the victims were then set free naked him wondering the streets. They often couldn't recall what just happened to them. It was either too harrowing, they feared reprisal. The attacks were carried out to control the drugs trade in. Gotland by scaring rival drug dealers out of operation or to steal their drugs, cash and guns. An arrest for one of the kidnappings would bring down one of the most sophisticated organized crime gang Scotland had ever seen. Around midday on Friday, March thirteenth, two thousand and fifteen emergency services received a call. A man was found on a grassy verge near to the junction of Stewart field way and stewed field cresent in east Kilbride. The man appear to have gunshot wounds to both of his knees opposed to by walking their dog in the town, less than ten miles away from Glasgow it seen the man lying on the ground in agony, the possible use their mobile phone to call the police. The man told them that he had been held captive tortured and then shot owned officers supported by mobile patrols. And the helicopter searched the area for gunman were not successful in finding the culprit paramedics treated the victims injuries than police officers carried him down the gross verge to the once dressed in a white forensic stone suit to preserve evidence. The forty five year old victim was rushed. The two malls to, hey, Myers hospital. And part of Stewart failed was closed off as police continue their investigation Detective Inspector. David Scott seen gave an interview to the presence stated. Firstly, I would like to reassure people, the tolerant queries carried out so far lead us to believe that this was a targeted attack. A lot of police activity has been ongoing in the area today with specialist offices conducting a detailed examination of the scene detectives are also in the process of gathering Cici TV images remaining around the area and house to house inquiries are ongoing in an effort to gather further information. I am appealing to anyone with information to contact us as a matter of urgency. Forensic team work to the scene late into the night. The following day was reported that the victim had been tortured for two days before he was shot through the knee caps on a country lane and then thrown down. Embankment in view of nearby supermarket. The man's name wasn't shared with the public, and it was understood that he had been transported to east Kilbride buys captors you remained in a critical, but stable condition in hospital was kept under police guard. Authorities, believe the attack was motivated. You to a drug debt were not forthcoming with information to the press. Chief inspect to Mark landed also appealed to the public and said, I know people will be shocked when they hear of this incident. But I would like to reassure them to have a range for additional officers to be in the area. Many people will be concerned, but we are doing everything we can to locate those responsible, the public ranch to contact offices at east Kilbride on the nonemergency number of one zero one or two contact crunch stop as if they had any information that might assist with the investigation operation. Drake in police task force was set up to examine the events surrounding the man's abduction. Following month, two men from Glasgow with kidnapped at gunpoint. One man was almost killed. Police believe both incidents were connected. A third of duck, shin from an address close to the first happened on November twenty. Fourth, most men barged their way into the property and took the hostage before dumping him in folk over thirty miles away days turned two weeks and weeks turn to months. But despite a number of appeals, no one came forward to identify the people involved in the abductions moody, towns regarding the background of the men found any Kilbride were released. He was identified as Robert Allen three men force that went with hyme bombs lay on March eleventh around seven thirty pm. He was then driven two hundred fifty miles to Scotland during the early morning of March. Twelve robitaille's injuries were so severe. It was believed he would never walk unaided again. An e fit of three men. The police wished to speak to in connection with the incident was released to the public detective, chief inspector, Gary Boyd who is now leading peration drinking stated. We believe that a number of men were involved in this violent attack where king for the public's help, we reviewing fits of three individuals who wished to trace you may have critical information that could help with our enquiries. Do you recognize these individuals? Can you give us names of these people? If you can, please call us to make it clear. We do believe that this attack was targeted was not a random assault. The first man was described as between five foot ten to five hundred eleven inches tall with a medium build in his mid to late thirties. Second was slightly older than the first around six foot tool and had a muscular build. The third fair, slim build was five foot eleven inches to six foot tall. And in his life thirties, older men spoke with Scottish accents detectives from Scotland's major investigation team confirmed that they'd piece together the victims movements over the last two days before the attack created a time line of events in his statement, detective, chief inspector, Gary Boyd went onto, say, the people who carried out this obstruction and shooting a merciless and have absolutely no regard for public safety. They have access to firearms as evidenced by this incident and have no hesitation in carrying out extreme violence. They are dangerous individuals and must be caught. Images of a great transit van believed to have transported the victim along with his BMW a state car with a distinctive red interior were released. Once the coporate stole the BMW from the victims, accommodation indulge worth bounds. -ly drove it to Scotland, but the vehicle had not been recovered. It was reported the robot. Thailand have been released from hospital into police protection. It was alleged the stolen, multiple shipments of cocaine from his captors annoyed the money in a drug debt. So the violence inflicted on him was to warn others stealing from them would not be tolerated. Robot Thailand had been issued by the gang for two years during his prolonged abduction. He was punched in the head and body pissed the whip and the gun a Beretta. Nine thousand fitted with soil answer was repeatedly pointed at him to coerce him to comply alum was then punched in the face by fist wrapped in a metal chain which broke his cheek. A fourteen pound sledgehammers used to break one of his legs. It was then forced to wash in bleach during further beatings of bone was broken his back bruises and lacerations marked his body. On December sixteenth, two thousand fifteen police broke down the front door of a property in east Kilbride and a forty eight year old man was arrested and taken into custody in connection with peration Draken. He wasn't believed to be one of the three men depicted in the fits, but he was brought before Hamilton sheriff court on December twenty first and charged under Scottish law with duck Shen an assault, the danger of life. He was identified as David sell. We made no plea or declaration. He was remanded in custody pending additional hearings. The following year trial was scheduled to take place in October. It's after the defense of Mitte list of witnesses late. The troll was agenda. March two thousand seventeen the witnesses supported the defendant's claims that he wasn't involved. But again, further delays were seen when the defense counsel was unavailing. Eligible for trial. It would be nearly three years after the abduction that David cell would learn his fate, but he wouldn't be the only one brought before the judge. Support for they walk among us. His brought to you by ADT ADT can now design and install a smart time just for you backed by twenty four, seven protection. Their new small-time is customizable to your lifestyle and make you feel safe for listening to this podcast. For instance, you can say, lockup service ADT will lock your doors, closed the guarantor, an arm your system ADT will set up your home with multiple smart devices and security features like video doorbells, cameras, locks and more visit ADT dot com. Forward slash smart to learn how ADT can design and install a secure smart home just for you. Nearly ten years earlier on February fifteenth, two thousand night troops on the how barracks in cancer break-ins were preparing to deploy to Afghantistan. They were taken by surprise when the police raided their quarters during the raid on the barracks in Canterbury, seven sticks of plastic explosives sixty. Foreign was a ninety. Six detonators were found in thirty seven year old color sergeant, Gary grams, looker agreeing zip up bag was also found which contained smoke grenades and blend communication along with a metal container which housed further detonators traces of explosives were found in the boot of Gary grams car and INA. Vehicle previously owned by sergeant at the barracks Kieran Campbell. After a six month undercover operation authorities discovered the time initiative from the barracks had been used in a gangland assassination, six weeks earlier during New Year's Eve, two thousand seven drugs right on the gloss, go home of twenty six year old. Andrew Quinn also taken place. Police found one and a half fouls rounds of rifle machine gun and pistol. I mean ish in along with three parachute flares nine smoker nights in a black suitcase. An identity card from Twenty-seven-year-old launched cool promoting Fitzsimmons was also found along with two kilograms of heroin scales bags of Morphing. Andrew Quinn had been hiding in a cupboard, holding shoebox with six thousand pounds inside when officers burst into his flat Quinn was dishonorably discharged from the army in two thousand and two out of failing drugs test when ecstasy was found in his system offense. The former member of the barracks. Denied the tea was involved, but was unable to say how the initiative drugs came into his possession. Traces of explosives were discovered at his home. You would like to go into a mid to being the middleman when brokering the sale of the initiative. Bullets were being sold on the black market for up to eighty pounds each and following coordinated raids across Glasgow, both soldiers stealing the initiative and boys were arrested. After three and a half week trial in October two thousand eight at Maidstone Crown Court. Gary Graham and Martin Fitzsimmons were found guilty of two charges of conspiracy to possess explosives. The Rousse found guilty of conspiracy to dishonestly undertaker assist in the retention removal disposal realization of stolen goods. Each received twelve years and the judge requested an investigation into the missing initiative. Sergeant Karen, Campbell pleaded, guilty and received four years after giving evidence for the Crown Prosecution Service. Andrew Quinn received six and a half years in prison. At a trial a week later, it was alleged the men were smuggling plastic explosives from barracks across the UK and the scheme unravelled after the rate on Andrew Quinn's Heim, plastic explosives are soft putty like material that can be molded by hand is often used to demolish. Calls or objects. During the sentencing hearing the judge addressed the men and said, you have dishonored, you'll battalion. You'll regiment the army and your country. If the explosives are used by those who wish to harm the people of this country, you will have betrayed them as well. Following the trial. It was also reported that just over one hundred guns have either been lost or stolen from army barracks in Britain between two thousand and two thousand and seven with only thirty five being recovered. Several brushes with the law and drink related charges. Martin Fitzsimmons had served in Bosnia and alongside the SAS in two thousand and five Fizi. He was nine was trained in the use of high techs violence equipment. It was described by fellow servicemen was a great soldier. He thrived on the front line but couldn't face life on the barracks. Fitzsimmons was parole during April two thousand fifteen, but again appeared before a judge. Later that year he had begun correspondence with his cousin during two thousand and ten while he was in prison and slowly became infatuated with the woman who wished to remain nameless received letters, which suggested she had better not be in a romantic relationship. When Martin Fitzsimmons was released from prison, multi declared his love for his cousin insisting he wanted to father her baby and will put a bullet in the back of the head of any other man. She had been with, you say, threatened to set them on fire of the his fingerprints were found on the letters. He pleaded guilty to engaging in a course of conduct which caused fear alum over the period of nineteen months. The woman never spawned into the correspondence, and instead took them directly to the police. Multi Fitzsimmons was sentenced to three hundred hours of community service in a six month night curfew a fellow soldier told the press. Everyone knew he was bad news, did their best to keep away from him if they had any sense. He had a real reputation as a bully in the army and used to terrorise any new guys joining the battalion. A lot of people in the army would have been well and truly glad. See the back of. Davor year after Martin Fitzsimmons and his accomplices were sentenced for their part in the feft of munition. Three men were arrested off the police carried out to search for property on funny hill road in Edinburgh, following a tip of the drugs being prepared at the premises officers approached the flat at seven, fifty pm on December ninth, two thousand nine. They found the front door unlocked and could see straight into the kitchen to men were cooking will by the Cubans would not prepare food. Long twenty five year old Dylan McCollum twenty three road. Mark Richardson was busy breaking up a large white substance through a sieve the pump boiled on the stove. They were so absorbed in what they were doing. The two men didn't even notice the officers making their way through the flat work tops, kitchen utensils, and pots and pans were covered in a white powder. Open containers covered the floor filled with what police believe to be cocaine, salt, Mark Richardson and Dylan McCollum in the middle of preparing crack cocaine, cutting the powder with baking soda, which would have an estimated street value of seven hundred thousand pounds surprised by the officer's presence. There was nowhere to run. The pet were arrested after they were taken into custody. A third man Twenty-seven-year-old, Gary all was also a rested when it was discovered. He acted as a courier, transporting drugs worth nearly one hundred twenty thousand pounds between Edinburgh and Glasgow. The men went to trial due to take place the following year. It was reported that despite his young age, Mark Richardson was a principal figure in the Scottish drugs trade. It set up an underground network, the distributed cocaine throughout not just Edinburgh, Glasgow. The most of Scotland and the north of England Richardson had a very criminal record and even helped his father. Mark Richardson, senior distribute cocaine throughout Edinburgh in two thousand and three. When Mark was sixteen years old, it was reprimanded for the possession of a knife while on bio year later, he was charged with a salt in two thousand and six. He was again fined for possession of a knife that same year he was sentenced to thirty two months in a young offenders institute for being concerned with the supply control drugs along with his father who received four and a half years in prison. He built an empire based on violence and intimidation, amassing Sawyer collection of firearm. SMS and making drug contacts in Scotland, northwest England, and spine. A police investigation into the Scottish drug trade spining a year and a half had been monitoring Richardson and his associates nearly seventy people would eventually be arrested. Most of them, it was believed work for Mark Richardson in some capacity for a million pounds worth of assets were seized from the prophets of the seventeen kilograms of cocaine smuggled into the country by Richardson and his acquaintances yet connections with the Daniels crime gang, one of Glasgow's, most notorious underworld families you so so she ate it with Kevin Carroll an enforcer for the gang and a man who started the Scottish alien of Duchesne's. Our Carol was shot dead in announced the supermarket in January two thousand and ten. During the trial had behi- corps to August two thousand and ten. Mark Richardson admitted to supplying seven hundred thousand pounds worth of cocaine between April twenty first and December nine, two thousand nine. He was sentenced to ten years in prison. He's co-accused Dylan McCallum who admitted to being concerned in the supply of one hundred fifty thousand pounds worth of cocaine was sentenced to four and a half years. Gary all who so pleaded guilty to being concerned in the supply of one hundred twenty thousand pounds worth of the Saint drug Zo say given three years and nine months after the sentencing hearing head of Lowthian and boarders, criminal investigation department detective, chief superintendent, Malcolm Graham stated. We won't come today's sentence which is a testament to the hard work of the police and prosecutors who brought this case to a successful conclusion. This investigation has destroyed a seat. Organized crime group that was heavily involved in drugs, threats violence, which was blighting local communities with its actions. After the trial monk, Richardson was granted leave to appeal his sentence. He believed the ten year jail term was excessive during January two thousand and eleven panel of appeal. Judges agreed. They felt he was not a minor player in the drug scene is sentenced did not reflect his position in the hierarchy of the Scottish drug trade. It was reduced to seeks years and nine months. His release. It wasn't long before Mark Richardson was, again wanted by the police on a warrant as part of an organized crime investigation in Edinburgh, as well as a recall to prison older towards the end of two thousand and sixteen. He was spotted by police. So it chasing shoot. A police helicopter was deployed jumping into a black mini. Mark Richardson led police on a high-speed car chase, weaving in and out of traffic on the opposite side of Joel carriageway before abandoning the vehicle at an s. o. petrol station in cappuccino road in Glasgow. It wasn't until the following month, January two thousand seventeen that he was captured on arrested by the organized crime and counter terrorism unit. When he was run DM, Lee spotted what appeared to be an unconnected arrest. Will they Mark Richardson's arrest in January was a notable achievement. It circumstances were far less dramatic than the car chase. He led police on, but he was far more confusing. During January, I'm Fanie woods. Francis mulligan an Michael Bowman with three men will thirties believed to be involved in the Scottish drug trade. So a detained, by the organized crime, unit officers have been paying close attention to a vehicle, silver, Toyota Yaris that had been connected to the criminals. Activities as the officers will busy arresting the three men recovery truck arrived to you. The vehicle away a group of men might attempts to pull the car onto the recovery truck police spotted Mark Richardson, mum them after a brief chase on foot. He was rugby tackled to the ground and the keys to the Toyota Yaris with found in his possession. Officers were asking themselves why Richardson would type the chance of getting arrested for something as simple as a small compact car. He was making vast amounts of money in the Scottish drug trade had escaped from police the month before. So why risk getting arrested again? When searching three, Mark Richardson's possessions an officer noticed a key for was attached. The keys for the Toyota Yaris. The officer could find no use for it as it didn't seem to activate any of the causing turn security systems is the vehicle was being analyzed. The officer past the device through his fingers pundit. What this key for was four is he did. So a secret compartment in the boot of the car roping. Six. I am on the morning of September twenty first two thousand and sixteen Robert. Cal was getting his two children ready for school at his cottage home in Ruffo. Edinburgh Ruffo is a rural area in the west of Scotland's capital with only a small population of nearly two thousand people is easy to spot the comings and goings of locals along with his wife and children. Robot cowbys, mother and sister was staying at the house to is the family were packing the children's school banks too loud cracking sounds boom through the house. Realizing these were bullets. The family fell to the floor. One shot penetrated the gloss in a back bedroom window and the other hit a window in the port frantically robot shouted at his mother to activate a panic alarm in stored in the home, and the authorities were notified police race to the scene and the property was cordoned off as a team of Rennes officers searched the undergrowth close. Luckily, no one was injured in the attack. The home, which is surrounded by Cici TV in spiked railings also have been the location of another targeted attack nearly three years earlier. The shootings were not run them. There had been previous attempts to end robot kelp is life. He'd been shot in the back outside Ballantine's health club in Edinburgh during topa two thousand ten, but no one had yet been charged for the attempted murder. It was reported that the attack was allegedly orchestrated. By Mark Richardson, you had a long running feud with robot Camby the route so allegations that he might be involved in this sheeting to is the press around the home. A photographer captured the image of a bullet hole in the coach window. It was believed the shooter had been located at the back of the property possibly in a neighboring garden before taking aim and firing at the home. If the attack had been ten minutes later than robot count be would have been out. So at the property with his children. And the ramifications would have been far worse. Is the investigation to find the shoot continued details of robot. Kobe's life will relate in the press. He had been involved in a number of alleged violent incidence. However, in all cases, he had escaped prosecution in two thousand twelve. The XBox are admitted to nearly one hundred fifty thousand pounds worth of mortgage fraud. It was later required to payback almost thirty five thousand pounds onto the proceeds of crime act in two thousand fourteen. He was declared bankrupt for failing to pays council tax. After the shooting robot Koby took his family to five or the investigation continued. two men were captured on CCTV fleeing. The scene wanna taken up position hiding among the foliage behind a three foot high wall in a neighboring garden before shooting into the conservatory of the cottage. The ped- jumped into a stolen Saab car that was later dumped in west Lowthian. Operation Pembridge was formed to find the assailants and four months after the shooting in January two thousand seventeen police arrested a male in his early forties. He was charged with a tempted murder, Allen O'Brien, Detective Inspector of gay field. CID stated to the press following protracted investigation. A man has now been charged in connection with this incident. Enquiries is still ongoing. Identify second man involved in the incident and to trace the whereabouts of the firearm? Used. Forty one year old, Jared, Dhaka-team so identified as the gunman and appeared before Edinburgh, sheriff court, a hit charges of attempted murder and firearms offenses. But this would only be the tip of the always bird along with David sell Martin Fitzsimmons, Mark Richardson and five other men. Jared Dougherty would go before a judge in one of the most significant organized crime trolls Gotland has ever seen. This is the end of episode sixteen to hear more on the crimes of those involved in the eventual downfall Scotland's most sophisticated and brutal crime gang please Choon in next time. Thank you for listening and special. Thanks to patriot supporters for more information. Please visit. They walk among us podcast dot com. You ready to delve into the dark side of your town. These are the true crime stories from ten towns across the u k. Ten stories of people. He might to pay just like us, but capable of evil. They are the stories of murder town. Who are they? Where are they could be anywhere. Every week, nine pm from Monday. The third of September, which the brand new TV documentary series, murder town hosted by Katherine, Kelly, exclusively on crime and investigation. Then join me Benjamin fit and from they walk among us on this, the official murder town podcasts where I'll be following on from each episode and exploring brand new case from each mud town. Support for they walk among us sees brought to you by ADT. ADT can now design and install a smart time just for you backed by twenty four, seven protection. The new small-time is customizable to your lifestyle and make you feel safe or listening to this podcast. For instance, you can say, lockup service ADT were lock your doors, closed the guarantor, an arm your system ADT will set up your home with multiple smart devices and security features like video doorbells, cameras, locks and more visit ADT dot com. Forward slash smart to learn how ADT can design an installer secure smart home just for you.

Mark Richardson Scotland Glasgow ADT officer Martin Fitzsimmons Edinburgh ADT ADT cocaine David Scott east Kilbride Andrew Quinn gunpoint Gotland army Detective Inspector assault Robert Allen Gary
Filmmaker Joe Berlinger Goes in the Dark Mind of Ted Bundy

Kickass News

43:04 min | 2 years ago

Filmmaker Joe Berlinger Goes in the Dark Mind of Ted Bundy

"This is kick ass news. I'm Ben Mathis. When you need energy on the go and don't have time to wait in line, grab it spreads. So monster, Espresso monster is a premium blend of Espresso and cream made with freshly brewed Espresso, coffee hormone free milk, and a unique energy blend complete with taurine and B vitamins each can has three shots of Espresso and comes in vanilla Bresso and Espresso and cream flavors. I had one this morning before I came into the studio, and let me tell you it gave me just the boost I needed to get my day going, plus it tastes so delicious. I'd drink in anyway. So close your eyes, take a sip and enjoy Espresso Munster today. And now enjoy the podcast. Murder the person of this type hungry on field would also leave him with the obviously irrational belief that the next time he did movies seal. And the next time. He did it. Or the next. I'm not free the personality. Hi, I'm Ben Mathis. Welcome to kick ass news. That was the chilling voice of America's most notorious serial killer, Ted Bundy from a new true crime docu series that premieres on net flicks today, titled conversations with a killer. The Ted Bundy tapes, the foreparts special brings an infamously twisted mind into the light for the very first time through exclusive never before heard interviews from Ted Bundy himself this unique and gripping docu series focuses on a man whose personality good looks and social graces defied the serial killer stereotype allowing him to hide in plain sight as he committed the brutal sex crime slayings of more than thirty women before being caught in nineteen seventy eight it also examined the role that the media played and sensationalizing everything to do with Bundy. And how it paved the way for America's obsession with true crime as entertainment, and it's no coincidence that the director of converse. Nations with the killer. Is none other than Joe Berlinger who's been credited as one of the fathers of the true crime genre with his award winning documentaries like brother's keeper and the paradise lost trilogy today. Joe comes on the podcast talk about why he wanted to reexamine the Ted Bundy murders on the thirtieth anniversary of his execution and how he gained exclusive access to more than one hundred hours of prison interviews with the notorious killer, he discusses how one of bundy's first jobs gave him an inside view of the flaws in America's law enforcement system, how Bundy exploited those weaknesses to his own devilish advantage, and how it led to dramatic changes and how the F B I profile serial killers. And how state and local police share information. We talk about how Ted bundy's clean cut good. Looks helped him elude capture the groupies who showed up to support Bundy during his trial and the movie heart-throb Joe Berlinger cast in a new feature film about Bundy. We talk about the media serve. Circus that turned Ted Bundy into a household. Name the influence the Bundy trial had on the modern true crime genre. And why Berlin ger known as the father of the true crime documentary doesn't actually like the term true crime coming up with the ward winning filmmaker Joe Berlinger in just a moment. Joe Berlinger is an Academy Award nominated and EMMY and Peabody award winning filmmaker behind such landmark true crime documentaries as brother's keeper and the paradise lost trilogy as well. As the rocky memory Metallica some kind of monster in many other films. Now, he's produced and directed a four part docu series called conversations with a killer. The Ted Bundy tapes which debuts on net flicks. January twenty fourth as well as a dramatic film, titled extremely wicked shockingly evil in vile, which premieres at Sundance just two days later. Joe Berlinger, welcome to the podcast. Oh, thanks for having me. Glad to be here. Well, this documentary was just fascinating. And it comes on the thirtieth anniversary of Ted bundy's execution. What do you think is at the core of our enduring fascination with this monster? Yeah, you know, I think I it was convenient that the thirtieth anniversary of his exit. Cuche in kind of gave, you know gave the show an organizing principle, but I think thirty years from now will still be fascinated with Bundy, I just think because you know, he taps into our deepest darkest worst fear. Not that not that we're going to all be killed by serial killers per se, but rather the person next to you is ultimately unknowable because Bundy defied all stereotypes of what you want to think, a serial killer looks like and feels like, you know, people wanna think that serial killers are these odd social outcasts that are easily identifiable in society. But the reality is and particularly for Bundy who embodied this, you know, Bundy was a charming good looking guy that people liked who, you know, he declared his innocence for a long time a lot of people believed him. And so the whole idea that somebody could be so evil could be the. Serial rapist murderer of over thirty women, and he did terrible things to these women both before and after death that it's a person whom many people liked and admired, and that's that's our deep. I think a very deep dark fear that that he and fascination that he taps into. I mean as Bundy himself says in the show, you know, murderers, do not come out of the shadow with long fangs dripping in blood. They are people, you know, you like you work with you admire who the next day or capable of of the most demonic evil possible. You know, so that's that's my fascination with him. And also, I you know, the other reason I thought it was a good time to take a look at him. Now is that? You know, I don't need to tell anybody that. There's seems to be an insatiable appetite these days for anything true crime related. I've never been busier. And there's never been more stuff coming out about you know, that's crime related, and I think we can trace that all the way back to Ted Bundy because Bundy who represented himself at his own murder trial the Bundy trial in Miami was the first nationally televised trial. It was the first time cameras were led into the courtroom and people just saw serial murder as entertainment of from gavel to gavel for the first time, and you can take that line and trace it directly to the OJ Simpson trial in ninety five and then to where we are today, which is just we just seem to have this fascination with this kind of material new just talking about the fact that Ted Bundy wasn't what you pictured when you think of a mass murderer. He was handsome. Well-spoken well-dressed how much of this. Do you think played into his ability to allude capture for? So that that that was part and parcel to how he was able to go on a multi state killing spree and not be captured was people just didn't think that this guy could be capable. In fact, some of his earlier murders were in Seattle in the Seattle area in this place called lake sammamish, which was outside of Seattle the this state park, and he was so he had escalated his killings instead of nocturnal preying upon a female walking alone in in an alleyway type of killing this time at lake sammamish. He he brazenly went out in the open on a very busy weekend day at a at this park that was on a lake and he brazenly approached numerous women to which was his class. Classic Rusi had fake cast on and asked different women. If. They would accompany him to help him put a sailboat on his vehicle, and even though he successfully ended up killing not one but two women that day. There was enough people who heard him say his name Ted who heard him say he had a VW and enough information was gleaned by authorities that a composite sketch was made of him, and when this newspaper article with the composite sketch circulated around Seattle, including his name in the his first name Ted and the mention of his VW a lot of Ted's friends pointed to the newspaper and said, oh, boy, isn't that a coincidence a guy named Ted, and he has VW to and look at the sketchy kinda looks like you. But nobody thought oh jeeze. Maybe he's the killer. I think the fact that he was able to present himself as a up and coming lawyer law. Lawsuit made people, you know, give him a pass yen at one point wasn't even going into politics. I guess it was on the staff of a gubernatorial campaign. Do you think that he saw himself one day becoming president good question? Well, you know, there's certain psychopaths have lots of things in common in their aspiration for the high the high office. But I I don't I don't think he saw himself that way. I think I think actually, sadly, despite the outward appearance, he had this nagging, insecurity, this nagging emptiness. And that's what compelled him to kill. So I'm not sure he really thought of himself as somebody who was going to have that career. But I think others who looked at him thought he was on the path to success the skeleton around which you built this document series is a collection of over one hundred hours of audio interviews with Ted Bundy from prison win. And how did you first become aware of these recordings was Stephen Michaud? Oh, and Hugh Ainsworth who are journalists. They conducted these interviews in nineteen eighty right after his conviction. The these audiotaped interviews and had exclusive access to Bundy. And they turned it into a book called conversations with a killer and Michaud was a fan of my work and reached out to me. And when I heard these tapes, you know, fairly recently, I thought, wow, this is something amazing to build a show around. I like how you use the word skeleton. But you know, we might wanna use that word a little more careful as as as it relates to this story. Just just kidding. But when I saw that the tapes were, you know, when I listened to these tapes, I thought, you know, because there there is a lot of stuff on Bundy out there already. And so I and I've always been fascinated by his story. But I never. I thought I would be adding to the kind of you know. Shows and media that's already out there about Bundy. But this these tapes, you know, felt like there was something new to say so my partners at radical media. And I went to Netflix and to see if they were interested in they agreed that there's a real opportunity here to tell a somewhat familiar story through a whole new point of view in a new lens, and that is entering into the mind of the killer himself to get some kind of understanding of how he operated and why he operated, and you know, it's utterly chilling. And fascinating to hear the killer himself talk about his crimes, I'm interested in how these two journalists you and Steven actually got permission to do this. Because a lot of people requested interviews with Bundy in prison, and he always turned them down. But Stephen and Hugh convinced him by reaching an unusual agreement with Ted Bundy could you talk about their deal. You know, Michelle. Ios agent. You know, reached out to him saying that Bundy was looking for somebody to tell his story that seemed interesting to those guys because you know, at the time Bundy was declaring his innocence. I mean, that's another hallmark of Bundy in that, you know, most serial killers once they're caught, you know, just love to spill the beans about their evil acts Bundy maintained his innocence throughout the trials throughout the entire appeals process and didn't actually confess until days before his execution in nineteen Eighty-nine. And even that was a cynical attempt to extend his life because he hoped that by becoming useful. And finally talking about the crimes that was his kind of you know, Ason the hall that would keep, you know, investigators investigators would want to keep him alive until they closed. These many cases in multiple states that were still technically open. So I think Stephen and Hugh thought well if he's telling the truth, and he is innocent. Then it's a hell of a story. And if he's not telling the truth, and and we reinvestigate the case, and we have access to Bundy, it'll still be an interesting story. So they decided to sign on. And kinda Stephen was tasked more with doing the sit down interviews while he went off in tried to put together the pieces of the case. Of course, us investigation turned up the fact that you know, Bundy was obviously the killer. It sounds like he's sent them on a fool's errand. And they actually talk about having a certain amount of buyer's remorse at some point because he would just jerk them around for hours and talk about his idyllic, childhood and bloviate about this and that and anything other than the murders. How did they finally get him to talk about that even though Bundy was looking to tell his own story and look for some investigator to exonerate him. Stephen wanted to drill into the crimes and. Bundy kind of refused to talk about the crimes which defeated the whole purpose of why were they were there? And so Steven had this kind of epiphany in which if he you know, he he offered to have Ted just be an expert witness to talk in the third person. And he theorized that if Ted was allowed to talk in the third person, you know, a serial killer loves to talk about their crimes, but he didn't want to implicate himself legally. And so he suggested to Ted that one one you talk in the third person and tell me what a person like this might do if they were in this situation, and you can kind of be an expert for me, and that idea really appealed to Bundy and Bundy, then it was like the floodgates opened. And he started talking, you know, quite extensively in about. You know what? A killer would have done in these crimes and clearly he's talking about himself because the the level of detail that he knew clearly suggested that that he was the person doing these things, but it allowed him to talk in a way that didn't implicate him legally, they admit in the documentary that they got pretty frustrated with all the games Bundy was playing with them. And eventually they just got sick of being around the guy. Yeah, they were fascinated by the time. He started to talk. But by the end of the process, they were so disgusted by what they learned from this person that you know, they had had enough. You know, I I can relate, you know, I've done now kind of almost simultaneously. I did the scripted movie with Zach Ephron lily Collins, which takes a different part of you. And I've been deeply immersed in the in the tapes and doing the series, and I am, you know, not that I'm sick of talking about the show right now to use to take the wrong way. But but it's it's the. Acts that he did are so vile what he did to another human being so repulsive, and he demonstrates such a lack of remorse, which was one of the remarkable things about my entry into these tapes was just a deeper understanding of how that mind works, and how remorse lis- he was. I'm sick of it too. Because it's just you know, it's the darkest side of humanity. That's been revealed here and their experience of kind of being led along by Ted Bundy was not uncommon one constant weather. It was Bundy talking to the reporters or even to the FBI whether he was on the Lam from the law or standing trial. He seemed to always be one step ahead just toying with people and relishing these little mind games Bundy was a master manipulator. I mean, his whole MO approaching women with fake cast or limping with a with a fake crutch. You know pr-? Paying upon the female instinct to nurture seeking out help and then using that to isolate a woman by his car and then killing them in horrific ways. Whether it's that or declaring his innocence or manipulating his live in girlfriend, which is the subject of my scripted movie was Acque Ephron, but he was always doing things to trip up the police he would change his modus operandi and change up. How he did the crimes he would leave things at crime scenes that had nothing to do with the crimes to confound them. You know when the heat started getting hot in the Washington state area after that lake sammamish brazen daytime attack onto women resulted in a sketch of him being circulated in the Seattle paper. He moved onto Utah became a member of. The Mormon church as cover continued on his on his killing spree. You know, he was enrolled at the university of Utah law school, but he chose to go to law school in Utah. As a way of getting out of Seattle, we're gonna take a quick break. And then we'll be back with more with Joe Berlinger when we come back in just a minute. If there's something interfering with your happiness or preventing you from achieving your goals better. Help online counseling can help. Better. Help offers licensed professional counselors who are specialized initials such as depression anxiety relationships. Trauma anger family conflicts, LGBT matters, grief, self esteem and more connect with your professional counselor in a safe private online environment and get help at your own time. And at your own pace, anything you share is confidential. And it's so convenient you can schedule secure video or phone sessions as well as chat and text with your therapist. If for some reason, you're not happy with your counselor though, you can request a new one at any time for no additional charge. Best of all, it's a truly affordable option. Kick ass news listeners. Even get ten percent off your first month with the discount code kick. So why not get started today? Go to better help dot com slash kick. Then simply. Fill out a questionnaire to help them assess your needs and get matched with a counselor. You'll love that's better help dot com slash kick. And now back to the podcast. I want to ask you a little bit more about this scripted feature film. That's premiering alongside the documentary. Does it take a different angle on Ted Bundy than the documentary? You know, lily Collins plays the real life, Elizabeth club for who. You know? That's an aspect of the story. That's so fascinating to me that during the six years that Bundy was doing most of his killing he was living with this woman named Elizabeth club for who we met in a bar in nineteen sixty nine and for six or seven years, they had a wonderful relationship. He was a terrific surrogate. Father to her daughter from another relationship he was by all accounts at terrific boyfriend. So he was just you know, masterfully manipulating people. Although I think he actually really did love a Elizabeth in as much as a psychopath can love that relationship is what I focus on on in the scripted film. Extremely wicked and Zach Ephron. Plays Ted Monday and lily Collins plays Elizabeth for. Yeah. Which is perfect because he did have a certain movie star like quality to him. You wouldn't want to cast a monster to play Ted Bundy? Yeah, exactly. I mean, that's, you know, in many ways, we're kind of poking at Zaks kind of teen heartthrob image that he wants to get away from, but is still part of his personality part of his kind of persona and Bundy, you know, even at his Miami trial after much of the information was already out in known to the public that trial was attended by a number of, you know, I hate to use this word groupie, but that feels like an appropriate word number of young women who were so titillated by the idea of Bundy in the courtroom that they had to go for themselves and witness witness the trial. He had that kind of pull over women, which I. Found fascinating. Yeah. And it's interesting because America seemed to have this duality with Ted Bundy where there was the revulsion in the fear. But there was also especially after he escaped from custody, not once but twice this sense of him as a folk hero and sex symbol, and it's absolutely astonishing. You know that a guy who, you know, kept declaring his innocence. And yet the legal troubles kept mounting, and he escapes from prison not once but twice and while he's on the Lam does his most vicious killings in Florida at Florida State University in Tallahassee the cuyahoga sorority killings. You would think that somebody who was, you know, had the presence of mind to plan to prison escapes. I mean who who who escapes from prison once let alone twice you would think that he would learn his lesson and lay low, but that compulsion to kill was so strong that by the time it got to. Florida two weeks after his second escape he does some of his most vicious killings. And yet he still had his admirers and fans, and there was this odd duality as you say of of, you know, people, you know, fearing him, but also almost according him some kind of folk hero status which continues today. I mean, it's just it's, you know, a America, you know, has five percent of the world's population yet, we've had sixty seven percent of the world's serial killers. And the one name that constantly floats to the top despite those many, many serial killers. We've we've you know had here in America. The Bundy name is just so well known and I think, you know, it goes back to bundy's trial. He was this was the first nationally televised trial the. First time serial murder was kind of turned into mainstream entertainment because basically technology meeting this increasing fame of this guy. Just a few months before his trial. A number of new stations were still shooting news on sixteen millimeter film. But around the time of the Bundy trial, this new satellite technology, and electronic news gathering as we know it today was was just coming into its own. And so that allowed live coverage of his trial. The Florida judge allowed the cameras in because it was such demand for coverage from around the world by the time the trial started. I mean, there were cameras from fifty states in nine countries watching this horror unfold gavel-to-gavel, you know, you can draw a straight line from there to the Bundy execution when Bundy was executed ten years later. It was the first time mobile satellite. Trucks were kind of in vogue, and his execution was also a live television event. Obviously, they weren't looking at him actually being executed, but all the fanfare outside of the death house was covered, you know, extensively. And I think because he was our first media celebrity in terms of criminality in a whole new way of covering these stories, it, you know, it's made him into this this memorable figure that people have, you know, all sorts of odd feelings about. Yeah. And he almost seemed to have an intuitive instinct for how to manipulate the media you talked about during the trial, and how he was allowed to be his own co-counsel and lead his own defense cross examine witnesses, and he's filing all these crazy motions in court. Like, you know, I want to quote unquote, change of menu because he's tired of eating grilled cheese sandwiches or proposing marriage to a witness on the stand. I it seems like. He's playing more to the press than he is to the jury. Yeah. Absolutely. He was playing to the press. But also, I think to his own detriment legally some of the things that he did trial. I think greatly benefited the prosecution merg sample very early on the prosecutor Larry Simpson called the PO the first police officer who was at the crime scene at for the Cayo mega murders. The the first police officer to show up at the scene, and the prosecution was not planning on diving too deeply into into the details of the crime scene because they were going to present forensic evidence later in the trial. So is a very brief kind of just table setting establishment of the crime scene, and and this particular police officers role in it Bundy to the consternation of his public defenders. Stood up and decided to cross examine extensively with great detail. The crimes the this officer who was the first at the crime scene and going into such detail that everyone in the courtroom kind of felt like this was a serial killer or a killer relishing going over the details of his crimes, and you know, it it it did not help in the minds of the jury that he did those kinds of things and yet he played to the to the press into the media and the and the and the spectators in the in the galley were hugely entertained by him. And I almost wonder if you think that maybe the theatricality of his defense strategy pre-stages what we see in politics today, where if you can create enough distraction in theory, maybe the facts won't matter. I think that's a I think that's a very good point. And I agree with that wholeheartedly. You know, he was. You know, he was somebody who just kept denying denying the Niang. And and a lot of people signed on but much to their chagrin later when he confessed just a few days before his execution. I mean, the the most notorious example of courses caroll-ann Boone a worker of his from earlier days in Washington state during the Miami trial. She came down to support him. They ended up falling in love he proposed marriage to her while during the mitigation phase of his death sentence during the Kimberly Leach trial, which was the second trial after the Cayo mega sorority trial and he proposed marriage because he became aware that you know, a declaration of marriage proposal in an open court in front of court. Officers crew. Created a legal marriage in the state of Florida. And you know, the prosecution dismissed it as charade designed to you know, you elicit sympathy like who's going to you know, how how can you sentence me to death on my marriage? They give me give me life without parole. Instead that was that, you know, how the prosecution and many people perceived it, and yet the public just kind of ate it up and caroll-ann said, yes and still believed in his innocence. And they actually you know had a child together while he was on death row. So it was it was an extraordinary set of circumstances. I was interested to learn that before he even began his killing spree. I think he worked at the Seattle crime commission. Do you think that gave him an insider knowledge of the weak spots in the system that he could explode to his advantage? Oh, absolutely. I mean, the fact that he had that kind of knowledge of you know, how police investigations worked as. Is one of the many ironies and interesting facts. I think Bundy is very much a product of his of of the era. You know, the the seventies was a time before many police investigation techniques had been created for example. There's a common perception that profiling F B I profiling is what captured Bundy, but it's just the opposite. The failure to capture Bundy after his conviction caused a lot of soul-searching at the FBI and led to the creation of their profiling program. And so Bundy was interviewed by the FBI after his conviction as a way to, you know, start creating this profiling program, you see a fictionalized version of it in in the Netflix series mindhunter. But this was you know, the local police. Departments. All of whom I think did as good job as possible. So this is not to criticize either the King County police in Seattle or the Colorado police because in Colorado, for example, Mike Fisher, the detective there was tenacious in trying to solve the murder of Karen Campbell. But police departments didn't routinely share information there were no central databases forensics as exists now was in a far weaker state. There was no DNA evidence. There weren't even fax machines, or you know, police are police departments communicated by teletype. There was no internet. So Bundy, you know, exploited the system and was able to elude capture for for far too long. In fact, to me, one of the most fascinating and horrifying things about the Bundy case, you know, in particular is that you know, he was apprehended three times he was apprehended in Utah. And that ultimately led to his conviction. For attempted kidnapping of Carol Durant. He was apprehended in Colorado after his first prison break six days after his prison break, he was apprehended and he was apprehended in Pensacola, Florida, which ultimately led to his his final murder trial in Miami for the cuyahoga killings. But in each instance, he was not arrested because the police were on his trail, and they caught the right guy. Each of these arrests were because he was driving stolen vehicles you radically and an alert police officer noticed either a stolen vehicle or the erotic driving. And that's the reason he had been pulled over in each of those three instances, and then only later did they realise who they had in in custody. So I've always kind of thought it's amazing that had Bundy been a better driver. He might never have been caught. Wow. In the aftermath of Ted bundy's killings, you mentioned that the F B started, profiling serial killers. And there's this kind of silence of the lambs mind hunter aspect to all of this where at a certain point Bundy began actually helping the FBI with cases in volunteering is theories and information about different active cases, or what kind of things was he telling them and was it useful? I think a lot of what he's he offered. The FBI was useful. And again, it was you know, sent his cynical attempt to keep himself alive by bargaining information. But you know, he had, you know, a unique insight, and I think for Bill hag Meyer, the FBI agent who interviewed him, and who was part of that profiling program, I think he was incredibly useful to them. So some good came out of the Bundy saga. But at obviously way too high a price. I wanna go back to his execution because as you mentioned the media circus even carried through all the way to his death. Seth you show. Thousands of people gleefully showing up at the prison selling souvenir t-shirts shooting off fireworks in this macabre carnival around his execution in a strange way. Do you suppose that the ultimate sociopaths final? Masterpiece was that he made the media and by extension America as a whole just a little bit more callous in less than pathetic. I think that's an outstanding point. And one of the things that troubles me, including myself. You know, I'm I-. I impartially self reflexively looking at how we've become this nation of what I call rubber neckers where you know, we do want to see what's happened to other people. We do look at crime as entertainment, unfortunately. And while I like to think that much of my true crime stuff. In fact, I hate that moniker. You know, if you look me up in the Wikipedia page it says, I'm a true crime pioneer. But true crime for me is you know. Is a mixed bag because sometimes, you know, it's just wallowing in the misery of other people. And I hate to think that that's what I do. You know, there's a certain aspect to my work that I believe, you know, as I've advocated for the wrongfully convicted I've helped wrongfully convicted people get out of prison with my work with the arise law series. You know? So there's a social Justice component to my true crime filmmaking and yet I'm part of genre. That takes other people's tragedies. The worst tragedy you can imagine the loss of a loved one, and we make entertainment out of it. And you know, I'm highly aware and conscious of that. And I do think all of that the the circus like atmosphere, the t shirts that were being sold. You know, burn Bundy burn, you know, people driving by with banners, you know, FSU students wanting revenge who you know, were not old enough. We're probably ten years old when the crime. Uh-huh. Actually happened. You know, I do think it's it was kind of a low point. And a floodgate of where we are today where there is an insatiable appetite for this type of programming. And I think often the victim is forgotten. You know, we have to remember that there are dozens of family members dozens and dozens and dozens of family members who are the the victims as well of bundy's crimes, and I do think, you know, and I'm applying the criticism to myself. So I'm not immune from it. But at least I I wanted to pull back and analyze I think sometimes our our desire to examine these crimes is often at the expense of the victim. Well, I want to also ask you about that social Justice aspect to what you do your most famous documentary paradise lost played an instrumental role in freeing, the young men who were wrongfully accused of murder, and I wanna. Her how you feel about the ethical state of true crime today. Do you worry that you might have created a monster in that too many directors in this next generation are now starting with the innocent man, ending in mind in skewing, the story to fit their desired narrative? You know? Look, I think the worst one of the worst things that could happen to a person is to be convicted of a of a crime that they're not guilty of and that and prosecutors have unique power to take away your personal liberty and sometimes they don't always play by the rules. So and once you're convicted it's really hard to get unconvicted. It just it takes far too long for the wheels of Justice to operate. And sometimes they don't operate at all, you know, it's estimated that, you know, five percent of people in prison by many experts are are wrongfully convicted, you know, with two million people in prison in our country every day. That's a lot of people who are. Potentially innocent, you know, more and more filmmakers taking up the cause and shining a light on these injustices. I think can only be helpful. I just hope that it's done responsibly and not done in a way where we're letting guilty people go free. But I think by the time these cases make it into the lens of filmmaker. You know, there's a pretty good chance that the person is is innocent. So I don't necessarily think we've we've created a problem. We have such a problem with the criminal Justice system is in such need of reform on so many levels from over sentencing from the legacy of the the the the the horribly conducted war on drugs, the racial inequity. There's just so many issues of incarceration that need to be addressed that I don't think there can be enough films and television programmes being made Mike my fear is not that they profile the wrong person. My. Fear is that there's so much documentary activity going on these days the form has never been more popular. There's so much activity that I hope people don't become you know, kind of. Immune to what's going on. You know, it's it's, you know, sometimes we become so inoculated from having any feeling because we keep hearing the same situation over and over again, you know, when brother's keeper in paradise lost first came out, they were rather unique films. And so they were able to cut through and tell their stories now, we have so many of them that I hope people really pay attention to the underlying issue as opposed to just treating it as the latest piece of entertainment to consume. And then forget about we'll before we go. Do you think Ted Bundy was insane? Or is that a cop out, you know, one of the things the tapes taught me is that he was highly aware of what he did. It's not like some act done by a split personality or an M amnesia. He was highly aware, and therefore it's hard to say was. The insane or not insane. Because anybody who would do these kinds of things is by definition insane. But he was a highly aware of his acts, and therefore he got the the punishment. He deserved. Whoa. Conversations with a killer. The Ted Bundy tapes debuts on net flicks. Thursday, January twenty fourth and Joe's film, extremely wicked shockingly evil and vile Ramirez at the Sundance film festival this weekend. Joe Berlinger, thanks so much for talking with me. Good conversation. Thanks for having me. Thanks again to Joe Berlinger for coming on the show conversations with a killer. The Ted Bundy tapes is available on net. Flicks beginning today, January twenty four and also look for his feature film. Extremely wicked shockingly evil and vile at the Sundance film festival and in theater soon. If up with Joe at Joe, Berlinger dot com or on Twitter at at Joe Berlinger. Whatever struggles you're facing from depression and anxiety trauma and grief better. Help can connect you with a professional counselor in a safe and private online environment. It's so convenient you can schedule secure video or phone sessions as well as chat and text with your therapist and anything you share is completely confidential. Best of all, it's a truly affordable option. Kick ass news listeners. Even get ten percent off your first month with the discount code kick. So why not get started today? Simply go. To better help dot com slash kick. And fill out a questionnaire to get matched with the counselor. You'll love today again, that's better help dot com slash kick. If you haven't already be sure to subscribe to kick ass news on itunes and leave us a review, you can follow us on Facebook or on Twitter at at kick ass news pod. And as always, I welcome your comments questions and ideas at comments at kick ass, news dot com. I'm Ben Mathis. And thanks for listening to kick ass news. Kick ass. News is a trademark of Mathis entertainment Inc.

Ted Bundy Joe Berlinger Seattle Murder America Miami FBI Ted Florida murder Ben Mathis Stephen Michaud lake sammamish Netflix Acque Ephron Sundance Steven Utah Espresso Munster lily Collins
Dr. T. Colin Campbell Interview - Link Between Animal Protein and Cancer

Love, Gianna

44:39 min | 1 year ago

Dr. T. Colin Campbell Interview - Link Between Animal Protein and Cancer

"Hello and welcome to love Jonah. I'm Jonah Simone actress producer Vegan activist and your host on this podcast. We will cover health. Wellness weight-loss healing disease and so many more benefits of a plant based. Diet and lifestyle. Be sure to check out the video versions of these interviews by going to Amazon prime and searching love Jonah or U2 by searching love Jonah. Thank you so much and please enjoy. Hello everyone and welcome back today. I'm here with the legendary. Dr Colin Campbell. Please tell us a little bit about yourself and how you became a leader in the field in plant based nutrition and any books Uber. In or anything you want to talk about your decisions professionally in nineteen fifty six. So I've been involved in this for sixty Near around for wealth how that was started with my graduate studies at Cornell University I was raised on a farm milking cows part of the story. Where in Virginia? Okay and then Eventually I ended up according to graduate. School did my graduate research on essentially trying to show or ways of improving on the production of animal. Protein concession with my personal background consistent with West Cornell was all about two at the time and so it was all about making sure we get Which animal protein basically so then after that I spent three years at Mit especially ended up bitch and attack There we had a project sort of nationwide push project in the Philippines attempting to help malnourishment starving children get better nutrition through the US State Department and Mishra Pelted Philippines. And so we went. There were more or less to ideas. Were central to the question concerned now. Those children one was. You weren't getting enough calories. Secondly that won't get enough protein so basically being in by Tennessee has had you know I like to look at this. We did we'd like to look at the fundamentals of cancer growth investments. That sort of thing. And that was Kinda use attrition to sort of change the pace of cancer development. That's and actually it turned out. There was a story boasts about nutrition. Adami cancel as has ended up. We just learned a lot of things really applied to humans. Nice and that's what led to the study. Okay speaking of the China study. I have it here with me and It's available on audible too so you can audio. Listen to it That's how I read this amazing piece of information and I highly recommend that. You all go out and you buy the China Study and you co authored. This with your one of your sons correct. My youngest son who was at the time when it was first published in two thousand five He had just graduated Cornell in theater. Nice and he. In fact he was Was IT DR? No he was an actor. Actually you don't quite well for young guy and something like he had five straight auditions when he got the lead role in Chicago. Playing Romeo and Juliet. It's amazing so he was. He was he liked acting. It's always going to have a career in theater. But we were cited for him. But the thing is I was looking around for somebody to help me right to sing. I go still working fulltime. And he's a good writer so My wife is mother tongue so eight. He dropped his acting for the time. Being just to come back and help me get some money. Maybe how long did he stop that to help those years? I mean we took a little time right in the book. And and meanwhile having been in the arts he didn't have any by commission on the chemistry and that sort of thing but he gets so excited about this stuff that he started learning more about it and like me too. I'm an actor and I'm so obsessed with everything that you've researched and have written about well. Hey get back home and worked with me for three years. But meanwhile he decided because he got so about it. He thought he might WanNa go to medical school. Do think still secretly he'd like to go back to To Actually Yeah. But he's you know we've got some pretty major responsibilities now medicine. That's true I don't know where there's always time there's always this way okay. So shall we get into the questions? Okay what is the China study? And what did you discover from it? The China studies the name of the book of reflecting a big project. We didn't China study involving six thousand five hundred adults and author deserted televisions across. And we. We did that because by the time that the opportunity came along to do the work in China early nineteen eighties. I had already been learned quite a bit in the laboratory about this attacked animal protein diet native ways. It was so spectacular. It's a man. We're joining it in the laboratory. I want to know something more about you. Know she was so The opportunity China was a fantastic opportunity because China There were a hundred thirty village around the country authentified different rates of cancer for better a dozen different cancers and veggies. You for about another four dollars. Different diseases took the Chinese government Gatera. So we organized. I study to measure as many as we possibly could collect blood samples samples food samples and so forth and so on and then comparing that with disease rates and what turned out of that. Just somehow we confirmation that what was working laboratory worse than humans. I mean it wasn't a dry thing. But at least the data were consistent Change version attrition patrician action on any kind of jeans and a moral same way. Animal protein will tend to increase the expression of those genes informed cancer. Okay and also in the genes that become involved in fostering heart disease and diabetes and so forth but try to study the China Project Cole. It then became the China. Study Forum Actually that this is not the title we wanted. What's the title Utah Domino? We had a different idea There's the first book I published in kind of green to the publishing business. We signed a contract. We've I I get some offer. Some measure companies that sort of thing for this story but I didn't. They wanted me to put a bunch of recipes and stuff like that that I don't even know what possum task kitchen and that's that was not by game and I wanted to do a story from a research perspective so we offer was about two hundred names. A my favorite was Sense and nonsense that has always spent about twenty years but at that time in government sort of working with government sort of on an expert panels in Washington and that sort of giving testimony before congressional committees. So I I was quite familiar with and I should say disturbed by the way that the policy for new S. basically Kerr's as I said says the nonsense of this really is And my son wanted a child. Great Food Sacred Okay. So I know the publisher. He was nervous about taking a small published in Texas. The big companies are sort of interested in taking a boat. But they do all these things how they want to do. So we're GONNA lead to a small company in Texas okay and I said to find dragged and so he came back with this Chinese of the two hundred and as we didn't have that that was not one of the two hundred and he's a wide needed to have because That time he wasn't sure DISAPP- lives interesting but he's going to probably new publishing company and he was one of the took a chance and he was trying to capture this China. Study idea because that was featured in the New York Times okay just prior to that okay had gotten quite a lot of attention so I wanted to take advantage of that publicity in China study. That's why Troublesome ever since that title but anyway it's working out so that the China study with. Let me say one more yet so we. We did all this research laboratory. Lots of different things. You technical sort of Matt issues but training into human population essentially green. So this became so. They're trying to study book only one. Chapter. There's you know. One chapter is devoted to the China Project. Itself was very small yes right. It's only a small part and the only point of putting in new was just as you say. Okay here's here's this thirty minute in China right and then agrees essentially but you've done so much more studies from that. That initial study isn't that's what you mainly talked about him and how that relates to the most common leading causes of death and common diseases so while you were turning on and off cancer right so cancer still today regarded as a disease caused by gene's mutations specifically new tasting gene since this word starts you get things like Some change we've learned about the associated with cancer these genes are basically mutated by by some chemical SDS. The idea so cancer starts off with a genetic mutation where the new new cancer cell now. Mutated it doesn't vaccinate So cancer is considered to be a genetic disease. You'll see this in all to cancer. Genetic disease by back mutating you mean inverse reverse right okay so you normally converted cancer cell mutation. The question is will that normal cell revert back to normal self very rare and so and also the main point is at once it becomes a cancer cell. It doesn't verse. It keeps on progressing so cancelled become essentially a progressive disease a genetic progressive disease. A we showed in the rash. That is not that that was not true Basically we could turn cancer on office. You know that had nothing to do with today's and how are you doing? How are you turning? It ought was that was the experimental animal study. And the way we were doing it all then new -tated especially we put one group one twenty percent protein and we'll in that case type of animal protein in cow's milk and so we had a higher level not very relevant level county coal twenty percent of total dietary calories. So when he said Casey ended that level it's a twenty percent level All all the animals got chancer five percent. Even though they both had the same amount of same journey activity destroyed the same place Concern that nothing to do with really yes. It started but approaching it dropped to twenty percent to five percent. No cancer a whole lifetime. It was that way. That's amazing. A meal spectacular so in China Sunny. You say genetics only have two to three percent association with total cancer. Risk that two or three percent was from some friends to service your dollars. Famous epidemiologist Britain and Sewer Shapiro. They were involved with thing this study by the way with a coordinated Saudi between Cornell University Offshoot University and two major is interested in China. Came out to be but That torture to three percent was Came OUT OF STUDY. They did for the. Us GOVERNMENT EARLY. Nike pays the estimate of cancer that we now see if you look at the population based studies that you can only tribute to three percent of the Kansas too gene. I mean is. It may have on some occasion. Some special effects you know and caused some disease but That's preserver okay. Which fitted those faded tolley with what I was saying. And we're using. Were you ever turning on cancer with an increase of plant protein? No that's right. The specific for in this case animal protein the Casey Milk one retried soy. Wait for example. No effect either to fit high lows. Okay so just startling. Spectacular Scheckter through. Okay question number two. The annual economic cost of diabetes. Two hundred forty five billion dollars can type one and type. Two diabetes be prevented and or reversed. And how we're so far Type two diabetes almost a hundred percent of candidates. People who have type two diabetes out work is work of many others take diabetic and tight. Choose Poaching Pie base by there you. Can they can recover from their diabetes matter of weeks or a very fast Days is obviously it'll be different more difficult in that case. The individual can't make endsleigh if as a so. I would cells of the pancreas or not making a concerted. It'd be a lifelong problem. They've gotTA take insulin on regular basis. But actually I've now met factor Sir Yesterday a couple of people come up and tell me It has not yet really validated enough. In science by type was for sure they really decrease the amount of is made by substantial amounts of known a couple of people who completely scrubbers one. Why do you think protein is synonymous with meat? Does it really give us strength endurance and agility or is it making us sick weak and impotent? Well project ahead. Quebecer approach was discovered as protein is a chemical with isolated in eighteen. Thirty nine by detriments and It was found to be essential or dogs to survive s worthy discovered to the central nutrition. They thought was very very important. Musicians really precious and they isolated David a name from the Greek language produce these prime importance. Okay so nutrition baptize in a sense from his birth Nine as a crucially important nutrient and it was in May so we don't understand that but There are some sort psychological or cultural reasons that we become almost like a cult negotiated project I know. Therefore that's what that's what given justification for eating animal food and so proud to be synonymous with a lot of people public in in the China study it says maybe it was originally the human desire to dominate other sentient beings and really resonated to be true. That's all I'd say. That wasn't my idea but I believe true. Yeah from some other material bread okay. Number four is meat or animal protein in and of itself bad for human consumption or is it the growth hormones antibiotics. Gmo Food at the what about the happy. Free Range antibiotic free. Grass fed organically raised. Meat Dairy and eggs. Because some people say well. I'm going to get organic grass-fed chicken. I'm going to meet my needs. And and you know there's no -Biotics in it it's produced free range. They're not in a cage. So is it really the animal? Is it really the meat or is the antibiotics? Gmo food is to be made more specifics. Approaching okay in fact. It lays the study we started back in the sixties and Seventies. We didn't even hormones or even being used at that time so are are portraits also. There was probably almost no pesticides herbicides. So all those Asher Chemicals. As part of and so- grass fed animals for example will produce exactly the same kind of protein as there may be some minimal sort of data suggests that breath animals might be just a shade better. But there's nothing really important because a lot of people that I come across to. Seo will we get free range eggs and cage free? It's all BS ally. Okay number five does meat and dairy give us anything special that we can not otherwise. Get from eating plants. No central special meat for cats a specific technical point By we're not catching we're not force Number six should we be eating organic avoiding pesticides and GMO's so in o. w. f. an organic whole food plant based Diet Well it sort of makes sense by the way you to use your day. Food food grown in nature and gardens and so forth. Don't put the pesticides on this and that that there is some Real evidence to suggest actually better than trying to taste. That's for sure Just commonsense things but when you look at the the evidence comparing table or gay eating organic food version of snot difference okay. You're saying it's disappointing. There might be that our studies are just simply the discriminating enough. When you do that kind of study you go with you only inorganic people. Not I mean and then you have to wait for a long time to see what your so. Let's don't have evidence better. So would you say it's it's probably best to err on the safe side and eat organic or washer fruits and vegetables. Vegetables OFF DR. Liston says that to just wash your fruits and vegetables. I personally eat organic just to air on the safe side because the GMO's and pesticides haven't been around long enough to conduct these studies. So you're kind of in the middle like well. We don't know for sure but there's a lot of interest now in Persian food plan base food of course Under so-called sustainable conditions meaning using organic soil uses soil or using the environment where. You're not spraying pesticides herbicides. Like that right and what? We're learning this more recent research. Is that a organic food. Can actually prove just as much of food per acre as the pro-life Fertilized sprayed food is very exciting concept. Because when I was on a farm. That's what we did. We didn't have pesticides herbicides. We do any of that. Ten we just use cloud to ground planted the seeds and stuff like that and so. It's really a fairly recent time that we didn't emphasis. I only fifty years. Okay so okay. So we're going to go back to that sort of they call a sustainable agricultural. You know do the things that with. Really screw around with a simple. It's so perfect the way it is intended to be absolutely okay number seven. What are your thoughts on? The very trendy ketogenic diet is another fad diet that will eventually lead to heart disease cancer and other serious health problems. Low on that is for people who find it trending? This should be a small book. I wrote called low. Carb fraud Provocative title but Cugini Diet is the same as actions. Same as Paleo Diet same as zone day same as the South Beach Diet statements. You know the whole sort of star books and essentially Book said that my good friend. Dr do I said People like good things about their bad habits change and he goes. He's books you know one name after another they they call it Cheeto Genita- that's the latest and the reason is that did the Diet. That's very high in protein right very high. Bet All with the premise. That somehow we reduce the Cobra hydrate consumption. That was that was that was a that was a technical. Another technology was a very devious activated. That he was saying for example that and then he wanted to protect the consumption of animal protein. That's really what they wanted today. All did they want protection. The consumption of food that simple to come up with these little strategies here and they they say. Oh the reason you're you're talking about this. There's you'll eating plants Jessica low carbohydrate. That's what comes from all too much Cobra. Hydrate is bad for us to that was added low card. If you card then you have to consume a lot of protein and that that interpretation some product called tetons and Keough bodies she told bodies in in our system. That when you're taking nice elation yeah you can move some weight lose weight on a cheater Jenny. for a while but It doesn't last long. It's not sustainable or not sustainable and you all you do is look at the data. After one. Two three. Maybe twenty thirty years on people I does they die earlier. They get all the decisions is nonsense. Well Dr Atkins died from what disease? He sure did and So he he's the one that really started the game but A little bit of that trae said even before him but in any case there's always been this effort on the part of some people usually authors. Who Don't do research. I should tell you. They a disconnect with these different ideas to try to fool the public and makes a lot of money because as I say people like to hear good things about their bad habits right and come up with a new name and and then the meat and dairy industry love to Lor Studies. They love those kind of books because you know them. I know I know and one of the studies that are out there that people will argue and say well. They're studies about the Ketogenic Diet. And it's it's good for the brain or it's good for building muscles or what about what what would you say? Or what could you help people spreading the truth and the proper message of good nutrition? What what can you say to us or or people over about these? These studies that are that are coming out saying Makita genetic or the Paleo. Dyer are actually good for us in their healing us when they're actually making us sick they are immediately as I said you know in early stages one has lose weight and everybody was some weight. Looks good in the first month or two or three or whatever it is But everything else going wrong so you might see what appears to be something. That sounds good But the real question concerning is this a Jewish Hu stuff. Brainiac of data reflects A riche serious long standing misunderstanding of of what nutrition really is. We tend to think of nutrition as the effect of individual nutrients. You know causes specific specific diseases if you will operate through specific so-called mechanisms so we go from one nutrition to one mechanism one disease but very very narrowly focused. That's called reduction of debt. In fact is really the hallmark of the practice of medicine. Best a hallmark of misunderstanding attrition. When when you wanted to take that approach somebody new book on this right now and also tells about whole by the way nature there but in any case When we take this reductions approach which in fact is really science almost. It's a sense of medicine the size of Russian and so forth and so on when you take that approach. There's infant numbers things improved. You could do and do studies on doodle short term study end show. Something looks good. That's very simple but it's taken totally out of context blown out of you. Take the individual nutrient. You know some good food was good. He took over and put until for example doesn't work vitamin supplements. Don't work just illustrate that point and so. We have fractured brash. Unaided I I guess you know. We're thinking about this person. Over the years it's called a massive amounts of confusion and the reason that happens primarily is because if you can fish out something that looks good avenue a little study in the laboratory of nothing you know then you can tell you that if you put a pill you sell it. Make money right. The whole thing about so The car for Jenny Diet Electing Free Diet. You know people coming out with all these crazy. They very good. Tomatoes are good for Russia case blueberry. Go for this. I mean it's crazy. It's singularly focused not what you say. Look at the holes because Mommy is okay number eight. Is there any beneficial or safe amount of animal protein to consume? So some people say well. I'm still going to eat just just a little bit a week. So I feel like I'm being healthy is a good question is this is a little question. The problem is data showed that we do not need animal pumpkin period and of course we have zero the healthier we become as simple so therefore. Why did any exactly why you're and the other part of that story is to? Is that when you start eating it? I came up that way Rona Bisexual. You become accustomed to it you like it. That's what you want to eat so we're addicted. We've become addicted to sexually. And so all those reasons it just just get the best health. We get rid of that additions and we don't you know destroying the whole Animal Kingdom. Exactly exactly okay number nine. I want to read a passage from your book. China study it says. Can you guess what food we might eat to? Most efficiently provide the building blocks for our replacement proteins. The answer is human flesh. It's protein has just the right. Proportionate amounts of the needed amino acids and the next best is other animal flesh while this fact is pretty crazy and our fellow humans and animals should be off the menu. Can you please elaborate on this? What are high and low quality proteins and does greatest quality equal greatest health but the long string of amino acids? There's about twenty two different amino acids and they infant combinations. Okay so approaching of a certain kind will have a certain proportion of this status. Immu acid knowles twenty together in a certain horror okay and so when all that is in this form of Shimin flush example is perfect. Because you know we're we're consuming approaching and we are now form then theory. Okay we got everything says my initial order because so that and then we can make protein faster. It became known as high quality protein. It's nothing more than it. Means that proteins used more efficiently and of course other animals are like animals too so animal protein has a a nicer order. Nice new secrets similar showers and it turns out that Bush would've eaten at and as I say the Alta charter bid but human flesh is the most perfect protein. Because that's ordination we bring. Our enduring digestion is broken down as his resemble as a body. Having all of these nicely all these protein in right proportion stuff you will so in in your book it also talks about why highest quality protein is not the greatest for for health. So can you elaborate on because highest quality think? Oh well let's quality so I'M GONNA I want. I want the best quality because that's GonNa give me the greatest help but can you explain. Why highest quality does not give us the best how that really was central to my thesis. Way Back in late fifties. It's fascinating to me that that the highest quality you know what it really means is to Most efficiently utilized Noah and that information quality mostly came from studies on tastes. Were to give pace. You know hire a good proportion of protein and right right kind of protest with the go faster and so forth and and we will fetched. We've both ashes well in humans. It young people are consuming a lot of animal protein. We already have data on this one of the things that happens when we got good for China on this here quite passionate reproductive or age. America girls has over so they're they're periods. Come on quick exactly and then when that Judge arrives and then have a higher level of estrogen circulates obviously bells down over the course of a month but it comes up like this disappear and then In naked situation where. Let's say a woman at that. Point is consuming a lot of approaching it remotely. You're when she goes to the bench. It's been false in American. Women Occurs Route Fifty two years and China's for years okay And also the Asia in the United States at that time leading yours average how settled said grow but lower Albert somewhere around here baby at ten or eleven years old. That's the idea. But in China the average age of milk was seventeen years and some counties had average was nineteen years. So here's here's a source translator that when we're consuming animal protein diet we grow faster that determines when sexual maturation curves fashion rate of growth you come to sexual maturation earlier. Come up here like that. You have higher estrin higher levels for all. Those years is associated with increased risk for breast cancer. Your cancer cervical cancer in the Chinese woman and they quit earlier. American school on American one of one particular teachers average should have much longer reproductive period. Now Good Night. Good good for breast cancer in a negative for breast cancer colon cancer so forth and so until all those pieces of that puzzle seem to fit together really nice model explain more or less breast cancer is and everybody has to do with consuming di really high animal protein. Deal not a good deal. Number ten does what we eat in our lives affect our children and grandchildren through epigenetics. I just heard a talk on that yesterday by one of the better known people who feel more sociologists I think than a cat I generally had some good information can be passed on some Some new kind of information that we're SORTA learning about Not just O. J's right you can pass on something to look like you're qualified genetics. But And now dissipate after maybe a generation or two they'll trail and create a little bit of fact But it's it's Kinda might not important effigy nations the case where It's not genetics where everything is determined by genes That's a presumption epigenetics. Is that the EPI factors outside of the genes. Okay so it's not just chains. That's the concept has been around now for three decades. There's not just change. The expression of genes interesting data expression of the genes. Raise the question. What causes you. What's really affecting the expression of genes because genes foreign proteins proteins form enzymes to become school? We are so genes are important sense but So epigenetics The the the expression of genes on the outside of the physical property of Help desk caused by nutrition controlled by nutrition environment. Some other things come into play stress environment. What you name it kind of thing so. Those are kind of like the keys to the locks that can turn on. Generics can be turned off by nutrition is well as shown. Animal studies their genes. Are they were chancellor? James we try to off just by nutrition nice spectacular idea number eleven. How much protein fat and carbs do active men and women need daily? And can we really eat all we care for and throw away the term everything in moderation when it comes to food? I use it. I mean we used to numbers okay. Thirty percents Don't don't try to get lower. We have all these numbers for things. I I have a problem with numbers to get every time China to come up with some number. Is Dan Rea? Oh Okay I can get this choice. I don't want you know they get fixated on numbers so I go in for numbers too much so I don't I can't tell you exactly okay. Numbers what determines for me That information is just a whole Jesse. Vegetables foods grains legumes and maybe some and minorities any combination and you actually say that potatoes even if we ate potatoes for a while we'd still get enough protein potatoes. That's right. That is the key point this kind of diet but will these vegetables and stuff like that. We give all approaching. We need an thank we ideals approach. We don't need to consume animal food to get to settle the question and so then when it comes bed come hydrated for example in that kind of Diet then once you know that works I that we know that worse than you back in half well. How much hydrogen that kind of Diet? Or how much fat is it right right. And that's interesting because he average carbohydrate diet is around seventy to eighty percent maybe higher hydrogen only plants the way so yes around seventy seventy five to eighty percent and our bodies and brains mainly function off of carbohydrates. Yes for energy. You're right We need energy. Obviously and we can get energy mostly from one of truth or Kabbage. Siri gets approaching. But that doesn't really count. It'd be honest about it. Yes some for alcohol too. So in terms of the major foods we Trump's from fat or for or carbohydrate addict Kito Table You know now side they want more. You get more edgy. That way from the reverse is true when eating plants we all the energy we need from the carbohydrates cops are good from whole foods like fruit. Don't be afraid of fragrance right. That's exactly right. I mean when he'd hopeful destiny you take out the Nita Bud shelves problem and so everything in moderation we can throw that term away when it comes to whole foods plant based Zola Sleep. I mean you can. Some people have a tendency to gain weight. maybe And they they can even overeat a whole food by especially the emphasizing. Let's say maybe potatoes I only. They might have some difficulties. Okay but usually if you're if it's a variety of fruits and vegetables and nuts and seeds in grains for you can really eat until you're satisfied and then move on with your life and you don't have to say only gonNA eat ninety percent of my player. I'm only gonNA eat forty percent. I actually come from a background of eating disorders and I grew up with. I think most women do nowadays because we all WanNa stay thin and look good and we think oh well I just I'm GONNA eat heck. I'm only going to eat a quarter of my plate and I'm GonNa Starve and as long as I'm hungry. I'm losing weight and this really set me free this way of eating really Dosa. It did and I just can eat until I'm satisfied in full sometimes to be honest with you to be to be transparent sometimes overeat and. I'll be like this is so good. I just want some more and I'll tell them stuff and I'm I'm in the shape of my entire life. I mean I don't over eat all the time but sometimes I'll eat until more than than satisfied it has set me free from eating disorders so interesting it's true true true it'd be one of the whole food by it's a matter of fact it tends to sort of set the bar for after pike does and then you eat and then you can move on with. Your Life. I'm not constantly thinking about food because I'm hungry. All the time is Because I was eating in moderation. Okay so the last question so many people say when it's time to go it's my time. I'm going to eat whatever I want to do. Whatever pleases me? This justifies their ambivalence towards health. Information and says in your book or good health is about being able to fully enjoy the time we've been given being as functional as possible throughout our entire lives while not being sick and avoiding debilitating painful lengthy battles with disease. Can we really control cancer? Inflammatory Disease Diabetes Obesity Heart Disease and many other leading diseases through nutrition. Yes I'm where say that. They qualified. That will please because when people say we know that the Tennessee for a perfectly healthy says for one Hundred Years One hundred twenty years something like that but the odds are greatly that when we this way we're going to extend life by can maybe twenty years but the important thing is we're not going to have to suffer the consequences of Gypsies to the last ten twenty thirty years of my life and so it really is In my mind about the quality of life that occurs later in when we get older quality life and of course we can get another twenty years out of that just like that's okay too yeah And so but the main thing is just having alert mine you enact a body And be happy you know and Joy Yourself and I I just say four and you were just telling me before. We started this interview. You're traveling all over the world and would you mind sharing how old you are before. And you're traveling all over the world drugs. That's amazing. Well that's what happens. Yeah I mean I I guess I didn't really experimental I said I'll pay for myself. That's true we have a family now. We've had five children my wife. She deserves tremendous credit for this because she was the one change in the Diet as learning the information. And what's your wife's name if people up Karen Campbell? I just got award last night and Indianapolis the Lifetime Achievement Award and she was honored on that thing. I have to say that that's amazing. Congratulations last night. Yes Internet medicine. She's been really important. I knew within the next fifty six year. We got five children now. We have loving grandchildren got spouses. Of course though there's twenty two of US nobody takes drugs. Everybody uses way and there. You have it as I said family one but you know that's basically say the same thing. Yeah the well I first of all. I WanNa thank you for for sharing your time. Because I know it's precious and ensuring all of your knowledge and everything that you've devoted your life to and I know that for most of your adult life and your professional life you have been fought pretty much by meat and dairy companies. The government Institutions and whatnot. And you just have to commend an applaud your tenacity and your strong will and I that comes through so much in this book and I recognize that and I honor you for being so strong because when we we live my life to to help this world life to to help this before I die and can i. Can I do good wall here on this earth and you you have done so much good and I know you're you're continuing to do so much good But I need to tell you that you can rest easy knowing that you're you're changing this world and you already have So thank you thank you so much and I think you're really really special. Thanks so much for tuning in. Don't forget to subscribe and like this. Video loved Jonah and through sample. I hope you enjoyed that episode as much as we did shooting it. Be Sure to tell me your biggest takeaway on my instagram at G. Simone G. S. I. M. O. N. E. Remember you can check out the video versions of these interviews by going to Amazon prime and searching love Jonah or youtube by searching love Jonah. Thank you so much for listening and please subscribe to stay up to date on the latest episode. Release as always loved Jonah

China Study China Jonah Simone Us diabetes Tennessee Amazon Dr Colin Campbell Cornell University Texas Virginia breast cancer West Cornell Adami China Sunny Chicago US State Department writer Philippines China Project
The Campus Killer Pt. 2: Ted Bundy

Serial Killers

49:57 min | 1 year ago

The Campus Killer Pt. 2: Ted Bundy

"Due to the graphic nature of this killer's crimes listener discretion is advised. This episode includes discussions of abuse murder and sexual assault that some people may find offensive. We advise extreme caution for children under thirteen. December thirty first nineteen seventy seven another freezing morning at Garfield County jail in Glenwood Springs Colorado. As the early guard began his shift. He whistled to himself desperately trying to inject some cheer into the place. It was new years after all but as he made his way. Further down the row of cells his whistling stopped at the end of the hall was one cell he dreaded visiting Ted Bundy was nice. Enough charming even but the guard knew what he was in for murder. The thought gave him chills so as he approached Mr Bundy's cell at the end of the hall. He steeled himself but what he saw when he arrived was off. Ted's dinner tray from the night before had been left untouched. This alone was nothing unusual. Ted had lost his appetite in the last few weeks sometimes. Only taking a few bites of meals every day. It seemed he got skinnier but it wasn't the uneaten food and Ted sell. That made the guard uneasy. It was the fact that Ted wasn't up. Usually at that hour he was wide awake reading. Or clicking away in his typewriter Lagarde looked over at Ted Asleep under some blankets and called his name. Ted didn't stir then he called again louder this time still nothing. The guards mind began to race. Oh God was he dead. The guard unlock. The Sal rushed rushed inside the tiny whitewall broom when he pulled back the blanket of the bank. His heart nearly stopped underneath was nothing but a pile of books. Ted Bundy had escaped again. Hi I'm Greg Poulsen. This is serial killers. Apar- cast original every Monday. We dive into the minds and madness of serial killers. This is our second episode on Ted Bundy. One of the most notorious serial killers of the twentieth century. I'm here with my co host Vanessa. Richardson Hi everyone. You can find episodes of serial killers and all other podcast originals for free on spotify or wherever you listen to podcasts to stream. Serial killers for free on spotify. Just open the APP and type serial killers in the search bar at Park asked grateful for you our listeners. You allow us to do it. We love let us know how we're doing reach out on facebook and Instagram at podcast and twitter at parkhouse network. And if you enjoy today's episode the best way to help us to leave a five star review. Wherever you're listening. It really does help. Last week. We cover Ted Bundy's background from chaotic childhood to a struggle with identity and rejection as a young man we also followed his slow metamorphosis into a killer leaving nearly a dozen murders in his wake in nineteen seventy four. This week will track Ted as he continues his killing spree mutilating and murdering nearly forty young women in cities across America. It was a bloody rampage that spurred multiple arrests and trials leading him to become one of America's most infamous killers by the summer of nineteen. Seventy four Ted Bundy's transformation into a serial killer was complete for the previous six months. Twenty-seven-year-old Ted had terrorized the Pacific northwest. He began in Seattle targeting female co EDS at the University of Washington but eventually expanded his hunting crowns Ted abducted and murdered college aged women on university campuses in alleys and hitchhiking off the interstate but no matter where his victims were from. They all looked the same police and the media noted that each victim was white young attractive and had long. Brunette hair parted down the middle across the northwest. Young women started bleaching their hair blond in a desperate attempt to avoid the same fate with no reliable evidence or witnesses the Seattle PD was at a loss watching helplessly. As women continued to disappear but they still had hope a lead would emerge the killer was growing more brazen abducting multiple women in a single month. Sometimes even mere blocks away from the last crime scene. They knew it was only a matter of time before he made a critical mistake. Then finally on July Fourteenth Nineteen seventy-four. Ted's violent sexual desires got the better of his caution. He abducted both nineteen year. Old Denise Naslund and twenty-three-year-old Janice ought at links park back to back in broad daylight one of Ted's defining characteristics as a killer was his boldness. Ted was a risk taker and he prided himself in testing his limits. In fact it's possible that Ted's overwhelming desire to push the envelope obscured the possible ramifications of his actions. Almost as he believed he was immune like there was no situation he couldn't slip out of. Vanessa's going to take over on the psychology here and throughout the episode. Please note. Vanessa is not a licensed psychologist or psychiatrist but she has done a lot of research for this show thanks Greg. Many researchers and psychologists have found a link between boldness and psychopathy and according to psychological researcher Shannon J Fernandez in her article entitled prediction of a rise of antisocial personality disorder. This connection may be explained by the brain activity of adolescence risk. Taking in teenagers is caused by an undeveloped cognitive control system the areas of the brain responsible for regulating impulses and making positive long-term decisions however though most individuals see a decline in risk taking behavior as these areas of the brain mature. Psychopaths continue these tendencies well into adulthood if risk is consistently met by reward. Some adults may develop a kind of fixation on the behavior associated with that risk. And if left unchecked these tendencies may progress years and even decades past adolescence. This may lead to what Fernandez describes as desensitization and fearlessness and a need for higher level risk taking in order to achieve stimulation for Ted. This behavior most likely stemmed from his peeping Tom. Days as a teenager. For over a decade. His voyeuristic habit went unchecked. Meaning the only outcome. Ted faced was his own sexual gratification. However once the thrill of peering into women's bedroom windows no longer scratched that each. Ted's fixation gradually progressed into something. Much more violating. It's important to note however that not all risk. Taking behaviors from adolescence may develop into violence depending on the objective associated with this risk. Desensitization may have different outcomes such as drug addiction but if an individual stimulation is achieved through antisocial behavior psychopathic tendencies may be born for months. Each murder Ted committed had been met with nothing but reward. He had killed nearly a dozen women and in return he received sexual release and escaped entirely without consequence but that changed with the murders of Denise Naslund and Janice odd in July of Nineteen. Seventy four this time. His boldness had made him slip up before he abducted Janet. Ted had introduced himself to her within earshot of witnesses and now the authorities were onto him now. They had his name though. Police weren't positive that Ted was the real name of the killer. They had good reason to believe that they were on the right trail. As soon as they released the information to the public they were flooded with thousands of leads. People across Washington state called with their hunches and soon by cross-referencing which of those men also drove a ten VW bug. They narrowed down their suspects from thousands to just one hundred on. That list was twenty seven year. Old Theodore Bundy a coworker of Ted's as well as one of his former professors submitted his name to the saddle PD but when asked by police if they observed suspicious behavior outside of his similarities to the suspect neither had an answer. They were mere acquaintances with a hunch. Nothing more and on paper Ted was practically a boy scout. A well liked young law student with a SQUEAKY CLEAN RECORD. So detectives simply put his name on a list and moved on. There was only one person who could blow the lid off of Ted's facade and she wasn't talking yet for almost a year Ted's long term girlfriend. Elizabeth Clever observed that there was something strange going on with Ted. He often disappeared in the middle of the night after. They've gone to sleep and once. Liz even found a bag of unfamiliar women's clothing in his apartment but at the time she didn't think her boyfriend could be a killer. She assumed he was cheating on her. This devastated Liz so much so that she was too absorbed with his possible infidelity to realize the striking connection between her Ted and the one at Lake Sammamish. That was the case at least until he left. Ted had decided to try his hand at law school once again. This time at the University of Utah and so when Ted left Washington near the end of the summer in nineteen seventy four. Liz was left with the space to put it all together. The nighttime disappearances the clothes all of that was deeply troubling for weeks. Friends urged her to call the police at for weeks. She resisted then finally on August. Eighth Nineteen seventy-four. Liz called the SEATTLE PD. But when detectives took down her tip they simply filed it among all the others without further evidence. Matching their killer with Liz's description. Liz's lead was just another call from a jilted girlfriend and they'd had plenty of those Seattle detectives were at a loss with no promising leads. Their trail went cold and suddenly after nearly a year. Women stopped disappearing. Ted Bundy had moved onto another hunting ground. Salt Lake City as Ted drove south on the interstate toward Utah. He remembered feeling euphoric. Once again he was going to pursue his dream of becoming a lawyer and leaving. Washington was a relief. Now that the police had his first name he knew his time was limited before they caught onto him in. Utah. He be safe. He'd have a fresh start. Ted arrived in Salt Lake City and he did what he was best at he blended in. He threw himself into studies and quickly made friends that the University of Utah and though he had lives kept in touch and continued the relationship long distance he started dating another law student. Sharon our that year he was baptized and became an involved member of the Church of the Latter Day saints attending congregation meetings and Church functions but no matter what identity Ted put on. He was still a wolf in sheep's clothing and Salt Lake City had plenty of rams once again. Ted Found himself surrounded by young beautiful college students and once again his violent urges became too overwhelming to contain. In the fall of nineteen seventy four. He began his second murder spree. Sources vary on some of the details and circumstances of each of Ted's kills but according to author and rules book. The Stranger beside me next victims were claimed in the following order electoral. Second Ted broke his abstinence and murdered. Sixteen year. Old Nancy Wilcox. Her body was never found that same month on October. Eighteenth ted killed seventeen year old. Melissa Smith the daughter of a local police chief. She was last seen by her father at home before she left to meet a friend for dinner. Nine days later her body was found in the wilderness. A nylon stocking around her neck. She'd been beaten raped and strangled on Halloween less than two weeks later. Seventeen year old. Laura aim vanished. Her body was found in the wasatch mountains on Thanksgiving Day. But not all of Ted's attacks successful on November eighth nineteen seventy four. One victim escaped eighteen year old. Carol Durant was window shopping at a local mall when a man claiming to be a police officer approached her he told Carol he'd seen someone break into her car and asked her to come with him to the parking lot. She needed to verify if was missing from her vehicle. Carol was caught off guard by the seemingly normal looking man he was just wearing street clothes no uniform but she figured the officer was working undercover so she followed him outside once. Carol look through her car she grew suspicious. Nothing it seemed was missing but the officer insisted she keep looking then. He asked her to come with him back to the station defile report. Finally Carol had enough. She wasn't getting in the car with a stranger. She asked to see some kind of identification. The officer pulled out his wallet and showed her his badge embarrassed that she doubted him. She agreed to go to the station when they approach the officer's Car Carol Thought It was strange that he drove a vw bug but still tasting her earlier embarrassment. She didn't say a word. They drove off in silence away from the mall. After a moment the officer suddenly pulled the car over and parked care last him what he was doing but instead of answering. He grabbed her wrist and hand cuffed it. Carol panicked. She struggled as the man attempted to secure the secondhand cuff. But he pulled out a gun. He threatened I'll blow your head off but this only spurred caroline to action. She opened the car door and jumped out. The man followed in tackled her to the ground. Carol kept fighting. She thrashed scratched but he seemed unaffected. When Carol looked up at her attacker there was no range on his face. What she saw was far more terrifying. His eyes were blank deadened. Finally Carol broke free from his grasp and sprinted toward an approaching car. She opened the door and jumped in the back. Seat crying hysterical. She begged the driver to take her to the police station. Carol durant narrowly escaped an awful fate. But she had just fled with her life. She knew her abductors identity his face coming up. Ted Bundy continues his murderous rampage in Colorado and faces the first of many trials. We WanNa take a moment to say thank you to all of our listeners because of you serial killers just reached its third anniversary. Three years of serial killers isn't possible without your support so to commemorate this incredible anniversary and your loyalty. Serial killers will now be airing twice a week. That's right in addition to the regular Monday release of serial killers. You'll also get a brand new episode every Thursday so mark your calendar and get ready to hear US twice a week every Monday and Thursday and thanks again for supporting serial killers now back to the story in the summer of. Nineteen seventy four twenty seven year old Ted Bundy's brazen murders in the Pacific Northwest. Finally drew the attention of the Seattle PD. Ted sought out a fresh start in another state that fall. He left Washington to enroll in law school at the University of Utah in Salt Lake City. But once again his dark urges followed him in less than three months he killed four more victims but one woman managed to escape. Ted had left his first living witness eighteen year old. Carol ranch in November of nineteen seventy four immediately after escaping. Carol went to the police to report her abductor. She had no name or concrete evidence. Just the handcuffs still attached to her wrist and the image of his face burned into her mind for months. Police kept their eyes open for the PERP but came up empty handed. After the day of Carroll's escape Ted tried to ignore his bloodlust and keep his head down but even still his darker impulses had gotten in the way of his education. He failed out of law school. For the Second Time Twenty eight-year-old Ted returned to Seattle in January of nineteen seventy five to visit Liz. After spending almost half a year apart she observed that Ted head seemingly changed for the better. His temperamental nature was long gone. The tender warm-hearted man. She loved had returned. Liz felt an enormous amount of guilt forever giving his name to the Seattle PD. But little did she know Ted had committed his own betrayal. He was still dating. Sharon. Our and Utah. Neither Liz nor Ted revealed their respective secrets. Instead they made plans to get married and decided to have their wedding the following winter then as quickly as he came. Ted was gone again. He told Liz he was returning to the University of Utah for his spring semester. But that was just one more lie designed to conceal his biggest secret of all instead. Ted left Washington to kill again by this point. Ted had been murdering for almost exactly one year in that time. He established a sort of pattern or cycle. He would kill in a frenzy for months consumed entirely by his blood lost then he would suddenly stop for a time as if the urge had simply passed that January when he returned to Washington and saw Liz. Ted was in this dormant period charming and collected. Who was kind of calm before the storm of his next murderous rampage? Dr Frederick Worrisome Defines these stages of criminal action as a catatonic crisis worth them. Breaks down the concept into a series of steps these include an emotional buildup that precipitates into the crime a calmness after the crime that allows the person to behave normally and finally a resolution a stage in which the individual self regulates adjusting so that the act won't be repeated however according to criminologist Donald J sears serial killers never reached this final stage of resolution. Instead they'll be caught in a perpetual cycle of build up and release as this pattern continues. Sears explains that each crime will only become more violent and more frequent than the last and for Ted. There was no doubt that he'd been consumed by this bloody feedback loop for a year. Ted At held onto a small semblance of normalcy. His dream of becoming a lawyer but by January of Nineteen seventy-five. It seemed as if Ted given that up to succumbing to his bloodlust when he left lives in Seattle he didn't go back to Utah to continuous law degree instead. He went to Colorado with only one goal in mind to rape and slaughter as many women as he could on January twelfth. Nineteen seventy five twenty eight year old. Ted made his way to the ski town of Snowmass Village. Colorado where he abducted twenty-three-year-old Karen Campbell. From the wildwood in Karen was staying at the end while on a ski vacation with her fiance that evening. The couple was relaxing by the fire in the lobby when she left to grab a magazine from their room she stepped into the hotel elevator and was never seen again. Thirty six days later her body was found naked and ravaged by animals in the surrounding mountains and soon there were more from January to July of nineteen seventy five. Ted Killed Four more victims the same epidemic of missing women that plagued the Pacific Northwest and Utah was now happening in Colorado but before Thornton could lead. The murder stopped. Ted once again moved on. It's unclear why but Ted traveled back to Salt Lake City in early July. Perhaps it was to visit his second long distance girlfriend Sharon our whatever the reason his returned to. Utah was his biggest misstep yet on August sixteenth. Nineteen seventy five at two. Am Ted was pulled over by police and his car was searched inside. They found a series of suspicious items rope. An ice pick a crowbar and handcuffs among others but to the police officer. These weren't weapons of murder. They were burglary tools. Ted was arrested but ultimately released without bail. It was only after he'd walked back into the night that the police noticed something. Chilling Ted matched. The description of a wanted suspect Carol Tarantulas kidnapper. A few days later Ted was brought back to the station to participate in a lineup of suspects for Carol to identify in preparation Ted entirely altered his appearance shaving his moustache and changing his haircut but nothing would Carol Forget. The face of her would be killer. Those thin lips at straight pointed knows it was him. Ted was arrested and charged with Carol. Garages abduction for months as he languished in jail awaiting trial. Ted Wasn't identified for a single other crime and so on February twenty third. Nineteen seventy six twenty nine year old. Ted was tried for kidnapping and nothing more at the trial. Ted was anything but defeated or remorseful. He felt exhilarated. He loved the intensity of the courtroom. He may not have finished law school but he used his own case as a way to flex his legal know how ted wanted to be as involved as possible in his defense. He did extensive research and frequently consulted with his attorney. He strutted around the courtroom confident that he would win the fight. He was wrong on March. First Ted was found guilty and sentenced to one to fifteen years in prison. For the first time he'd have to suffer the consequences of his actions and it wasn't long before his true crimes came back to haunt him eight months into a sentence. Ted was charged with Karen Campbell's murder for months detectives in Colorado had been gathering circumstantial. Evidence that place Ted at the wildwood. In at the time Karen went missing when they learned their prime suspect had already been imprisoned for kidnapping. They believed they had their man thirty year. Old Ted was extradited to Colorado that winter? Ted lost his biggest supporters Liz clip for and Sharon. Our listen Sharon had stood by Ted side throughout the Carol. Durant trial completely unaware that he was seeing both of them but with the murder charge. The two women reached their breaking points. They both left him and so with few supporters. Left and with the looming. Possibility of a death sentence. Ted took matters into his own hands on July seventh. Nineteen seventy seven. Ted attended a pretrial hearing in Aspen. Colorado that would determine whether or not he would face the death penalty that morning during a court recess. Ted asked to use the courthouses low library. This was not an unusual request. Just like he had with the Carol durant trial. Ted was adamant about researching his own defense. And so the deputies allowed Ted access alone and unshackled as the deputies waited in the hallway outside Ted. Open the libraries second story window and jumped. As soon as he hit the ground he felt. Us hearing pain. Shoot up his leg. The impact tore ligaments in his ankle. But Ted didn't stop. He scrambled to his feet and sprinted toward the surrounding mountains. By the time deputies realized he was gone he'd already disappeared into the Colorado wilderness. Ted's escape was no impulsive decision. For weeks he'd been planning his escape and he'd worn multiple layers of clothing for the occasion. He was going to need all the warmth he could get to survive freezing nights at elevated altitudes Ted was determined to go as high and as far as he could. Ted Remembered psyching himself up as he made his way into the mountains. He later told journalists. I was saying to myself again and again you must go. You must go. Don't hesitate. Don't stop. Don't stop Ted had good reason to keep running because very soon an army of Colorado ones rallied together to hunt him down. Authorities orchestrated a sweeping manhunt locals from the area even showed up to volunteer on horseback armed with rifles. Everyone it seemed wanted to track Ted Bundy down. Police set up checkpoints on the only two roads out of Aspen. Hoping they'd catch the killer as he tried to flee town but not a single vehicle contained the runaway murderer. That was because Ted left his first night on the Lam he broke into an empty hunting cabin only partway up the mountain. He spent every night after outside in the freezing woods trekking the wilderness with his injured ankle. Just steps ahead of team of search dogs but eventually a brutal rainstorm forced Ted from his hiding place in the mountains exhausted starving and nearly twenty five pounds lighter. He made his way to a small town below. Got A meal and stole a car. It was time to get out of dodge. But Ted's Road to freedom was short on July thirteenth nineteen seventy seven at two. Am Police stopped a car driving erratically and the highway inside a haggard looking man with wild eyes squinted into the beam? Of the officers flashlight. Finally they found Ted. Bundy was on the run for nearly a week before he was apprehended. When he returned to prison he flashed his signature grin for the cameras and reporters crowded around him. He cracked jokes downplaying his escape. He told them honest to God. I just got sick and tired of being locked up for the next five. And a half months Ted languished in prison awaiting his murder trial but he had no intention of setting foot in court with a twenty five pound headstart after his escape. He continued to starve himself until he was thin enough to fit through an opening in the ceiling of his cell where light fixture hadn't yet been installed in the early hours of December thirty first. Nineteen seventy seven. Ted made his move at less than one hundred forty pounds. He lifted himself through the hole in his ceiling and army crawled through the air shafts into the guards apartment located above his cell from bear. He dropped into the room and stole a set of clothes then. He walked out the front door. Ted Bundy America's most prolific serial killer escaped for the second time and slipped into the winter. Night Ted Bundy goes on a bloody road trip across America and captures the fascination of the entire country. Now back to the story from nineteen seventy four to nineteen seventy five ted bundy murdered at least seventeen women moving his killing spree from the Pacific Northwest to Utah then Colorado but when an unrelated arrest led to his first murder charge. Ted realized his time was fleeting in the months following his extradition to Colorado. He made not one but two escapes and on New Year's Eve of nineteen seventy seven thirty one year old. Ted broke out of prison and disappeared into the night that morning using money donated for his. Defense Fund Ted Securities exit out of Colorado. He hopped on a bus to the Denver airport and then took a plane to Chicago from there. He wrote a train to Ann Arbor Michigan but at the time Ted's priority wasn't hiding out. It was college football on January. Second Ted cheered on his Alma Mater University of Washington as they defeated the University of Michigan in the Rose Bowl then that night without a single sent to his name he slept in the sanctuary of a local methodist church. The next morning he stole a car Ted decided he needed to be as far away from the North West as possible so he set his sights on the opposite corner the country. He went to Florida. Ted figured that in Florida. No one would be looking for him. He wasn't wrong. Due to a lack of expedient communication between police departments the sunshine state was left in the dark after his escape and Colorado. The feds got involved in the hunt for Ted and soon he was placed on the FBI's most wanted list but even so with no computers and no central database authorities on the east coast. Had little idea that a killer from the West may be headed their way on January eighth nineteen seventy eight one week after escaping prison in Colorado. Ted Bundy drove Tallahassee specifically to the University of Florida in Tallahassee. Ted told people his name was Chris. Hagan and after stealing a handful of strangers credit cards from a local Bar. He secured himself. A room ended apartment complex next door to a sorority house Chi Omega just one week later in the early morning hours of January fifteenth. Nine thousand nine hundred seventy eight thirty one year. Old Ted embarked on his boldest crime yet. Ted watched as the sisters of the Chi Omega Sorority trickled back to the house from their dates and headed to bed by two thirty. Am when it seemed. The last girl had fallen asleep. He made his move Ted slip through the sorority houses back door carrying a small oak tree. Limb he found in the backyard as he walked quietly through the house passing portrait after portrait of Sorority Sisters Past. He could feel his heart pound. Finally he approached the room of twenty one year. Old Margaret Bowman inside Margaret was fast asleep in the span of just minutes. Ted had beaten and strangled her to death now panting and spattered with blood. Ted Could feel himself losing all control without hesitation. He moved on to his next victim. Ted Entered the room twenty year old Lisa Levy. She was strangled and clubbed to death like Margaret but tense attack on Lisa was particularly vicious as he assaulted her Ted bit. Lisa's POTTY TED had lost himself entirely in his bloodlust he sunk his teeth into her buttocks and tore away a nipple on her right breast. Ted continued to make his way down the hall of the Sorority House. Attacking two more women there that night. Twenty one year old Karen Chandler and twenty year old. Kathy Kleiner like Margaret and Lisa Karen and Kathy were unconscious during the attacks but fortunately days survived just barely when emt's later arrived at the scene. They weren't sure if they were alive or dead as he watched the girls. Beaten bodies being loaded into ambulances. Sheriff Ken Cassandra's wondered. What kind of monster could have committed a crime so heinous? But before he could ponder the answer he heard a call over his radio. Another young woman had been brutally beaten only blocks away Ted had barely made it down the street before succumbing to his murderous urges again. Ted's brazen behaviour had reached new heights. This time he'd left evidence behind when Cassandra's race to the scene he found a mask made out of women's nylons and semen stain in the woman's bedroom. Ted Gotten so absorbed in the thrill of the kill heat sabotaged himself. Criminologists commonly classify serial killers based on distinct dichotomy organized and disorganized murderers for years. Ted's crimes had placed him neatly in the former. He was a textbook organized. Killer socially competent and high functioning. He always planned his murders in advance sometimes. Elaborately and took pride in his ability to leave without a trace. But over time Ted's classification dramatically shifted according to researchers Barney Warf and Cynthia Waddell the lines between organized and disorganized killers commonly blurred when a murderer is left murder over an extended period of time warp and waddle explained that as a killers urges heighten their psychosis intensifies often changing their previously. Well established habits and for Ted. This transition happened quickly when he entered the Chi Omega House that night. Ted was an organized killer. But when he walked out he'd seemingly devolved Ted subsequent kills only became more chaotic. He was no longer following a plan. Propelled ONLY BY LUST. Ted Murdered Multiple Women in quick succession and left their bodies at the crime scene. He was spiraling out of control soon. Propelled by the chaos of the Chi. Omega murders Ted fled Tallahassee and headed southeast to the small town of Lake City Florida there he would deviate even further abandoning the one characteristic that had defined all his other murders his victim profile on February ninth. Nineteen seventy eight. Ted spotted twelve year old Kimberly Leach crossing the Basketball Court of her junior high school. The last anyone saw Kim she was climbing into a white van looking upset after murdering nearly three dozen White College age women with long dark hair. Ted had taken an entirely new type of victim. He murdered a young child. This signified an extreme turning point in Ted he was no longer the slick deceptive killer with crystal clear intent as the stress of his life on the run intensified and his inevitable. Fate in prison loomed larger. It didn't matter who he killed anymore. He simply needed to keep feeding the ravenous part of himself that urged him to continue five days later on Valentine's Day an officer notice Ted driving under the speed limit in an orange. Vw Bug following his instincts. The officer decided to pull the vehicle over instead. Ted panicked and sped off a high speed chase ensued and then a fight once. The officer managed to Corner Ted. He lashed out even reaching for the policeman's gun but the struggle was futile and Ted was arrested and searched. Officers found more than twenty one credit cards in his possession with a variety of names. They were all stolen. As was the car. Ted refused to reveal his identity. Authorities. Were baffled and suspicious. Who was this mystery man by the next day they had a hunch by tracing the VW's plates they discovered it had been stolen in Tallahassee. Near the Kyle Mega Sorority House soon. The Pensacola PD called up sheriff. Ken Cassara of Tallahassee and broke the news they believe they had the co Ed killer in their custody for days. Ken and his detectives questioned Ted. They brought him cigarettes to win him over and eventually Ted agreed to reveal his identity on one condition. He wanted a phone call. He wanted to call Liz club for. He warned her that she'd soon see really ugly stories about him on the news he was right once. The media got a hold of the story. Ted's name was everywhere at the time he was already one of the ten most wanted men in the US. The Chi Omega murders only raised his profile. But the thing that truly sealed Ted Bundy and America's collective consciousness was perhaps not the details of his crimes but his bizarre performance at his own murder trials. Following Ted's indictment the Florida State Supreme Court made an unprecedented ruling due to the high level of public interest. In the case. Ted's trial would not only be open to Florida residents. It would be the first murder trial to be nationally. Televised in June of Nineteen seventy-nine hundreds of people flooded the Miami courtroom for the first day of proceedings television crews from all fifty states and nine countries set up lights and rolled cameras and spectators many of them young women fascinated by the curiously charming murderer filled seats as thirty two year. Old Ted entered the courtroom he beamed at the crowds and winked at cameras. He had an audience. The entire nation was watching. Ever the showman. The spectators only emboldened Ted. He made impassioned speeches and crack jokes making the courtroom roar with laughter just as he did during the Carol Durant case and despite his lack of a law degree Ted led his own defense though. A team of young public defenders was assigned to his case. Ted assumed the position of lead counsel much to their annoyance multiple times. He drove his lawyers to walk out of the courtroom in frustration. Ted insisted on cross examining witnesses often undermining his own argument in the process and in the end there was little his attorneys could do to stop him. Ted was too caught up playing lawyer in the role of a lifetime but the stakes couldn't be higher for all of his showmanship. His impassioned speeches and the Ad Trix. Ted was still dealt the death penalty on July thirty. First Nineteen seventy nine in his thick southern drawl. Judge Edward Cowart sentence Ted to the electric chair but it seemed that even the judge at Ted's murder trial hadn't escaped the serial killers charms after he delivered his verdict coward lamented that he saw a bright young man's potential wasted. He stated. Take care of yourself. Young Man I say that to you sincerely. It is a tragedy for this court to see such a total waste of humanity. You're a bright young man. You'd have made a good lawyer and I'd have loved to have you practice in front of me but you went another way partner. I don't have any animosity to you. I want you to know that but even after being sentenced to death. Ted's antics were far from over in January of nineteen eighty. Ted represented himself for the last time in the murder trial of twelve year old Kimberly Leach and once again he was given the death penalty but it was nearly a decade before. He saw his sentence through in that time. Ted Bundy lingered on death row taking interviews with journalists since psychologists and as execution grew closer. He began admitting to more murders just to delay his sentence ultimately he admitted to thirty one in total but Ted could only delay fate for so long on January twenty fourth nineteen eighty nine forty two year old. Ted took his seat in the Electric Chair. In front of a large picture window behind it was a gallery of onlookers. Many of whom were witnesses at his trial in his last words to his very last audience. Ted Apologize For all the trouble he caused. Then a metal skullcap was placed on his head followed by Black. Could the executioner flip the switch and moments later at seven six? Am Ted Bundy was pronounced dead at his request? Ted was cremated and his ashes were scattered at an undisclosed location in the cascades in Washington state for after his death. Ted Bundy took his place among a class of America's most prolific serial killers but his bloody legacy lives on not because of the number of his crimes. But because of Ted himself. Americans were and still are fascinated with the good-looking charmer with a capacity to kill. It's this duality. That we fixate on the shadowy boundary between all American men and notorious murderer that he embodied so well countless movies documentaries and books both fiction and not have been inspired by his brutality and his charisma making him into a kind of macab. Celebrity Ted Bundy has become synonymous with the idea of serial killer the prototype of a psychopathic lust murderer. But as the media's love affair with Ted Rages on it begs the question. Was this what he ultimately wanted? There's no doubt Ted used his unique position at his televised trial to his benefit. But perhaps he'd always intended to make a lasting impression that would live on long past his inevitable death in Ted's last act he'd manipulated an entire nation creating a dark stain on our collective consciousness. Thanks again for tuning into serial killers. He'll be back Monday with a new episode for more information on Ted Bundy amongst the many sources we used. We found the book the stranger beside me by an rule extremely helpful to our research. You can find all episodes of serial killers and all of the podcast originals for free on spotify or anywhere. You listen to podcasts. Not only spotify already have all of your favorite music but now spotify is making it easy for you. Enjoy all of your favorite podcast. Originals like serial killers for free from your phone desktop or smart speaker to stream serial killers on spotify. Just open the APP and type serial killers in the search bar and don't forget to follow us on facebook and Instagram. At podcast and twitter at podcast network. We'll see you next time. Have a killer week. Serial killers was created by Max Cutler. And his apart cast studios original executive include Max and Ron Cutler sound designed by Juan Boorda with production assistance by Ron Shapiro Carly Madden Isabel away and Joel Stein. This episode of serial killers was written by Alex Garland with writing assistance by Abigail Cannon and stars Greg Poulsen and Vanessa Richardson.

Ted Ted Bundy murder Ted Ted Bundy America Ted head Ted At Ted Rages Ted Securities Seattle Corner Ted Colorado Liz club Pacific northwest America Carol Durant Salt Lake City Utah officer
S10: Infamous: Ted Bundy Pt. 2

Parcast Presents

49:16 min | 1 year ago

S10: Infamous: Ted Bundy Pt. 2

"Due to the graphic nature of this killer's crimes. Listener discretion is advised. This episode includes discussions of abuse, murder and sexual assault that some people may find offensive. We advise extreme caution for children under thirteen. December thirty, first nineteen, seventy, seven, another freezing morning at Garfield County jail in Glenwood Springs, Colorado, as the early guard, began his shift, he whistled to himself, desperately, trying to inject some cheer into the place. It was new years after all. But, as he made his way further down the row of cells, his whistling stopped at the end of the hall was one cell. He dreaded visiting. Ted. Bundy was Nice, enough charming, even, but the guard knew what he was in for murder. The thought gave him chills. So as he approached Mr Bundy's cell at the end of the hall, he steeled himself. But what he saw when he arrived was off. Ted's dinner tray from the night before had been left untouched, this alone was nothing unusual. Ted had lost his appetite in the last few weeks. Sometimes only taking a few bites of meals every day. It seemed he got an ear. But it wasn't the UNEATEN Food and Ted sell that made the guard uneasy. It was the fact that Ted wasn't up. Usually at that hour, he was wide, awake, reading or clicking away in his typewriter. The looked over at Ted, asleep under some blankets and called his name. Ted didn't stir then he called again louder this time still nothing. The guards mind began to race oh God. Was He dead? The guard unlock the SAL rushed inside the tiny whitewall broom when he pulled back the blanket of the bank. His heart nearly stopped. Underneath was nothing but a pile of books Ted Bundy had escaped again. Hi I'm Greg Poulsen. This is serial killers apar- cast original every Monday we dive into the minds and madness of serial killers. This is our second episode on Ted Bundy One of the most notorious serial killers of twentieth century I'm here with my co host Vanessa Richardson. Hi everyone, you can find episodes of serial killers, and all other podcast originals for free on spotify, or wherever you listen to podcasts to stream serial killers for free on spotify just open the APP and type serial killers in the search bar. At Park. Asked grateful for you, our listeners. You allow us to do it, we love. Let us know how we're doing. Reach out on facebook and Instagram at podcast and twitter at parkhouse network, and if you enjoyed today's episode, the best way to help us to leave a five star review wherever you're listening, it really does help last week. We cover Ted Bundy's background from chaotic childhood to a struggle with identity and rejection as a young man. We also followed his slow metamorphosis into a killer, leaving nearly a dozen murders in his wake in nineteen, seventy four. This week will track Ted as he continues his killing spree mutilating and Nearly, forty young women in cities across America it was a bloody rampage that spurred multiple arrests and trials, leading him to become one of America's most infamous killers. By the summer of Nineteen, seventy four Ted Bundy's transformation into a serial killer was complete for the previous six months, twenty-seven-year-old Ted had terrorized the Pacific northwest, he began in Seattle, targeting female co eds at the University of Washington, but eventually expanded his hunting crowns, Ted abducted and murdered college, aged women on university campuses in alleys and hitchhiking off the interstate, but no matter where his victims were from, they all looked the same police, and the media noted that each victim was white, young attractive, and had long Brunette hair parted down the middle. Across the northwest young women started bleaching their hair blond in a desperate attempt to avoid the same fate with no reliable evidence or witnesses, the Seattle PD was at a loss, watching helplessly as women continued to disappear, but they still had hope a lead would emerge. The killer was growing more brazen abducting multiple women in a single month, sometimes even mere blocks away from the last crime scene. They knew it was only a matter of time before he made a critical mistake. Then finally on July fourteenth nineteen. seventy-four Ted's violent sexual desires got the better of his caution. He abducted both nineteen year old denise, Naslund, and twenty three year old. Janice ought at links park back to back in broad daylight. One of Ted's defining characteristics as a killer was his boldness Ted was a risk taker, and he prided himself in testing his limits. In fact, it's possible that Ted's overwhelming desire to push the envelope obscured the possible ramifications of his actions. Almost as he believed, he was immune like there was no situation, he couldn't slip out of. Vanessa's going to take over on the psychology here and throughout the episode, please note. Vanessa is not a licensed psychologist or psychiatrist, but she has done a lot of research for this show. Thanks Greg. Many researchers and psychologists have found a link between boldness and psychopathy and according to psychological researcher Shannon J Fernandez in her article entitled prediction of a rise of antisocial personality disorder. This connection may be explained by the brain activity of adolescence risk, taking and teenagers is caused by an undeveloped cognitive control system, the areas of the brain responsible for regulating impulses and making positive long-term decisions, however, though most individuals see a decline in risk taking behavior as these areas of the brain, mature psychopaths continue these tendencies well into adulthood. If risk is consistently met by reward, some adults may develop a kind. kind of fixation on the behavior associated with that risk, and if left unchecked, these tendencies may progress years, and even decades past adolescence, this may lead to what Fernandez describes as desensitization and fearlessness and a need for higher level risk, taking in order to achieve stimulation for Ted this behavior, most likely stemmed from his peeping. Tom Days as a teenager for over a decade. His voyeuristic habit went unchecked. Meaning the only outcome Ted faced was his own sexual gratification, however, once the thrill of peering into women's bedroom windows no longer scratched that each Ted's fixation gradually progressed into something much more violating. It's important to note however that not all risk taking behaviors from adolescence may develop into violence, depending on the objective associated with this risk desensitization may have different outcomes such as drug addiction, but if an individual stimulation is achieved through antisocial behavior, psychopathic tendencies may be born. For months, each murder Ted committed had been met with nothing but reward. He had killed nearly a dozen women, and in return he received sexual release and escape entirely without consequence, but that changed with the murders of Denise Naslund and Janice Odd in July of nineteen seventy four this time his boldness had made him slip up before he abducted Janet Ted had introduced himself to her within earshot of witnesses, and now the authorities were onto him now they had his name. Though police weren't positive. That Ted was the real name of the killer. They had good reason to believe that they were on the right trail. As soon as they released the information to the public, they were flooded with thousands of leads. People across Washington state called with their hunches, and soon by cross-referencing, which of those men also drove a ten VW bug. They narrowed down their suspects from thousands to just one hundred on that list was twenty seven year old Theodore Bundy. A coworker of Ted's as well as one of his former professors submitted his name to the Saddle PD, but when asked by police, if they observed suspicious behavior outside of his similarities to the suspect, neither had an answer, they were mere acquaintances with a hunch, nothing more and on paper Ted was practically a boy scout a well liked young law student with a squeaky clean record, so detectives simply put his name on a list and moved on. There was only one person who could blow the lid off of Ted's facade and she wasn't talking yet. For, almost a year Ted's term girlfriend Elizabeth Clever observed that there was something strange going on with Ted he often disappeared in the middle of the night after they've gone to sleep and once Liz even found a bag of unfamiliar women's clothing in his apartment, but at the time. She didn't think her boyfriend could be a killer. She assumed he was cheating on her. This, devastated Liz so much so that she was too absorbed with his possible infidelity to realize the striking connection between her ted, and the one at Lake Sammamish. That was the case at least until he left. Ted had decided to try his hand law school once again this time at the University of Utah, and so when Ted left Washington near the end of the summer in Nineteen, seventy four. Liz was left with the space to put it all together. The nighttime disappearances the clothes. All of that was deeply troubling for weeks. Friends urged her to call the police and for weeks she resisted. Then finally on August. Eighth Nineteen, seventy-four Liz called the Seattle PD. But when detectives took down her tip, they simply filed it among all the others without further evidence, matching their killer with Liz's description, Liz's lead was just another call from a jilted girlfriend and they'd had plenty of those. Seattle detectives were at a loss with no promising leads. Their trail went cold, and suddenly after nearly a year, women stopped disappearing. Ted Bundy had moved onto another hunting ground. Salt Lake City. As Ted drove south on the interstate toward Utah, he remembered feeling euphoric. Once again he was going to pursue his dream of becoming a lawyer and leaving Washington was a relief now that the police had his first name, he knew his time was limited before they caught onto him in Utah. He be safe. He'd have a fresh start. Ted arrived in Salt Lake City and he did what he was best at he blended in he threw himself into studies and quickly made friends that the University of Utah, and though he had lives kept in touch and continued their relationship long distance, he started dating another law student Sharon our. That year he was baptized and became an involved member of the Church of the Latter Day saints, attending congregation meetings and church functions, but no matter what identity Ted put on, he was still a wolf in sheep's clothing and salt. Lake City had plenty of rams. Once again Ted found himself surrounded by young beautiful college students, and once again his violent urges became too overwhelming to contain in the fall of nineteen, seventy four. He began his second murder spree. Sources vary on some of the details and circumstances of each of Ted's kills, but according to author and rules book the Stranger beside me. Next victims were claimed in the following order. Electoral Second. Ted broke his abstinence and murdered sixteen year old Nancy Wilcox. Her body was never found. That same month on October, eighteenth ted killed seventeen year old Melissa Smith the daughter of a local police chief. She was last seen by her father at home before she left to meet a friend for dinner nine days later, her body was found in the wilderness, a nylon stocking around her neck. She'd been beaten raped and strangled on Halloween less than two weeks later seventeen year old Laura aim vanished. Her body was found in the wasatch mountains on Thanksgiving Day, but not all of Ted's attacks successful on November, Eighth Nineteen, seventy, four one victim escaped. Eighteen year old Carol Durant was window shopping at a local mall when a man claiming to be a police officer approached her. He told Carol. He'd seen someone break into her car and asked her to come with him to the parking lot. She needed to verify if was missing from her vehicle. Carol was caught off guard by the seemingly normal looking man. He was just wearing street clothes. No uniform, but she figured the officer was working undercover, so she followed him outside. Once Carol look through her car. She grew suspicious. Nothing it seemed was missing, but the officer insisted she keep looking then he asked her to come with him back to the station. Defile report finally. Carol had enough she wasn't getting in the car with a stranger. She asked to see some kind of identification. The officer pulled out his wallet and showed her his badge. Embarrassed that she doubted him, she agreed to go to the station. When they approach the officer's Car Carol Thought It was strange that he drove a VW bug, but still tasting her earlier embarrassment, she didn't say a word. They drove off in silence away from the mall. After a moment the officer suddenly pulled the car over and parked care last him what he was doing. Of answering, he grabbed her wrist and handcuffed it. Carol panicked she struggled as the man attempted to secure the second cuff, but he pulled out a gun. He threatened. I'll blow your head off. But this only spurred caroline to action, she opened the car door and jumped out. The man followed in tackled her to the ground Carol kept fighting. She thrashed scratched, but he seemed unaffected. When Carol looked up at her attacker. There was no range on his face. What she saw was far more terrifying. His eyes were blank deadened. Finally Carol broke free from his grasp and sprinted toward an approaching car. She opened the door and jumped in the back seat, crying hysterical. She begged the driver to take her to the police station. Carol durant narrowly escaped an awful fate, but she had just fled with her life. She knew her abductors identity his face. Coming up Ted Bundy continues his murderous rampage in Colorado and faces the first of many trials. Now back to the story. In the summer of Nineteen seventy four twenty seven year old Ted Bundy's brazen murders in the Pacific northwest finally drew the attention of the Seattle PD. Ted sought out a fresh start in another state that fall. He left Washington to enroll in law school at the University of Utah in Salt Lake City. But once again his dark urges followed him. In less than three months he killed four more victims, but one woman managed to escape. Ted had left his first living witness eighteen year old Carol Garage In November of Nineteen, seventy, four immediately after escaping, Carol went to the police to report her abductor. She had no name or concrete evidence. Just the handcuffs still attached to her wrist, and the image of his face burned into her mind for months, police kept their eyes open for the PERP, but came up empty handed. After the day of Carol Escape Ted tried to ignore his bloodlust, and keep his head down, but even still his darker impulses had gotten in the way of his education, he failed out of law school for the second time. Twenty eight year old returned to Seattle in January of Nineteen, seventy, five to visit Liz after spending almost half a year apart. She observed that Ted had seemingly changed for the better. His temperamental nature was long gone. The tender warm-hearted man she loved had returned. Liz felt an enormous amount of guilt forever, giving his name to the Seattle. PD But little. Did she know Ted? Had committed his own betrayal. He was still dating Sharon our and Utah. Neither Liz nor Ted revealed their respective secrets instead they made plans to get married and decided to have their wedding the following winter. Then as quickly as he came, Ted was gone again. He told Liz he was returning to the University of Utah for his spring semester, but that was just one more lie designed to conceal his biggest secret of all instead Ted left Washington to kill again. By this point Ted had been murdering for almost exactly one year. In that time he established a sort of pattern or cycle. He would kill in a frenzy for months consumed entirely by his bloodlust, then he would suddenly stop for a time as if the urge had simply passed. That January, when he returned to Washington and saw Liz Ted was in this dormant period, charming and collected, it was kind of calm before the storm of his next murderous rampage Dr Frederick. worthen them defines these stages of criminal action as a catatonic crisis worth embrace down the concept into a series of steps, these include an emotional buildup that precipitates into the crime, a calmness after the crime that allows the. The person to behave normally and finally a resolution, a stage in which the individual self regulates adjusting so that the act won't be repeated, however, according to criminologist Donald J sears, serial killers never reached this final stage of resolution. Instead they'll be caught in a perpetual cycle of build up and release as this pattern continues, sears explains that each crime will only become more violent and more frequent than the last. And for Ted, there was no doubt that he'd been consumed by this bloody back loop. For a year Ted at held onto a small semblance of normalcy, his dream of becoming a lawyer, but by January of nineteen seventy-five, it seemed as if Ted had given that up to succumbing to his bloodlust. When he left Liz. SEATTLE HE DIDN'T GO BACK TO UTAH. To continue. Was Law laundry instead? He went to Colorado with only one goal in mind to rape and slaughter as many women as he could. On January twelfth, Nineteen seventy, five, twenty eight year old. Ted made his way to the ski town of Snowmass Village Colorado where he abducted twenty-three-year-old Karen Campbell from the wildwood in. Karen was at the INN while on a ski vacation with her fiance that evening the couple was relaxing by the fire in the lobby. When she left to grab a magazine from their room, she stepped into the hotel elevator and was never seen again. Thirty six days later, her body was found naked and ravaged by animals in the surrounding mountains, and soon there were more. From January to July of Nineteen seventy-five Ted killed four more victims. The same epidemic of missing women that plagued the Pacific Northwest and Utah was now happening in Colorado. But before authorities could find lead, the murder stopped. Ted once again moved on. It's unclear. Why but Ted traveled back to Salt Lake City in early July. Perhaps it was to visit his second long distance, girlfriend, Sharon, our whatever the reason. His Return to Utah was his biggest misstep yet. August. Sixteenth, one, thousand, nine, hundred, seventy, five at two am. Ted was pulled over by police and his car was searched. Inside they found a series of suspicious items. Rope an ice pick a crowbar handcuffs among others. But to the police officer, these weren't weapons of murder. They were burglary tools. Ted was arrested, but ultimately released without bail. It was only after he'd walked back into the night that the police noticed something chilling Ted match the description of a wanted suspect Carol garanges kidnapper. A few days later Ted was brought back to the station to participate in a lineup of suspects for Carol to identify in preparation. Ted entirely altered his appearance, shaving his moustache and changing his haircut, but nothing would make Carol forget the face of her would be killer. Those thin lips at straight pointed knows it was him. Ted was arrested and charged with Carol Ranch's abduction for months as he languished in jail, awaiting trial. Ted Wasn't identified for a single other crime. And so on February Twenty Third Nineteen Seventy six twenty nine year old Ted was tried for kidnapping and nothing more. At the trial Ted was anything, but defeated or remorseful. He felt exhilarated. He loved the intensity of the courtroom. He may not have finished law school, but he used his own case as a way to flex his legal know how ted wanted to be as involved as possible in his defense, he did extensive research and frequently consulted with his attorney. He started around the courtroom confident that he would win the fight. He was wrong on March first Ted was found guilty and sentenced to one to fifteen years in prison for the first time he'd have to suffer the consequences of his actions, and it wasn't long before his true crimes came back to haunt him. Eight months into a sentence Ted was charged with Karen Campbell's murder for months. Detectives in Colorado had been gathering circumstantial evidence that place Ted at the wildwood. In at the time, Karen went missing. When they learned, their prime suspect had already been imprisoned for kidnapping. They believed they had their man. Thirty year old Ted was extradited to Colorado. That Winter Ted lost his biggest supporters Liz clip for and Sharon. Our listen Sharon had stood by Ted side throughout the Carol durant trial completely unaware that he was seeing both of them. But with the murder charge, the two women reached their breaking points they both left him, and so with few supporters left, and with the looming possibility of a death sentence Ted took matters into his own hands. On July Seventh Nineteen seventy seven Ted attended a pretrial hearing in Aspen Colorado that would determine whether or not he would face the death penalty. That morning during a court recess, ted asked to use the courthouses long library. This was not an unusual request just like he had with Carol. Durant trial Ted was adamant about researching his own defense, and so the deputies allowed ted access alone and unshackled. As. The deputies waited in the hallway outside. Ted opened the libraries second. Window and jumped. As soon as he hit the ground, he felt us, hearing pain. Shoot up his lack. The impact tore ligaments in his ankle, but Ted didn't stop. He scrambled to his feet and sprinted toward the surrounding mountains by the time deputies realized he was gone, already disappeared into the Colorado wilderness. Ted's escape was no impulsive decision. For weeks he'd been planning his escape and he'd worn multiple layers of clothing for the occasion. He was going to need all the warmth. He could get to survive freezing nights at elevated altitudes. Ted was determined to go as high and as far as he could. Ted Remembered psyching himself up as he made his way into the mountains. He later told journalists I was saying to myself again and again you must go, you must go. Don't hesitate. Don't stop! Don't stop. Ted had good reason to keep running because very soon. An army of Colorado ones rallied together to hunt him down. Authorities orchestrated a sweeping manhunt. Locals from the area even showed up to volunteer on horseback armed with rifles. Everyone. It seemed wanted to track Ted Bundy. down. Police set up checkpoints on the only two roads of Aspen, hoping they'd catch the killer as he tried to flee town, but not a single vehicle contained the runaway murderer. Bat was because Ted hadn't left his first night on the Lam. He broke into an empty hunting cabin. Only partway up the mountain. He spent every night after outside in the freezing woods, trekking the wilderness with his injured ankle just steps ahead of a team of search dogs. But eventually a brutal rainstorm forest, Ted from his hiding place in the mountains exhausted starving and nearly twenty five pounds lighter, he made his way to a small town below got a meal and stole a car. It was time to get out of dodge. But Ted's Road to freedom was short on. July Thirteenth Nineteen, seventy, seven at two am. Police stopped a car driving erratically and the highway inside a haggard, looking man with wild eyes, squinted into the beam. The officers flashlight. Finally, they found Ted. Bundy was on the run for nearly a week before he was apprehended when he returned to prison, he flashed his signature grin for the cameras, and as reporters crowded around him. He cracked jokes downplaying his escape. He told them honest to God I just got sick and tired of being locked up. For the next five and a half months ted languished in prison, awaiting his murder trial, but he had no intention of setting foot in court with a twenty five pound head start after his escape, he continued to starve himself until he was thin enough to fit through an opening in the ceiling of a cell where light fixture hadn't yet been installed. In. The early hours of December thirty, first, nineteen, seventy, seven, ted made his move at less than one hundred forty pounds. He lifted himself through the hole in his ceiling, and army crawled through the air shafts into the guards apartment located above his cell from bear. He dropped into the room and stole a set of clothes then he walked out the front door. Ted Bundy America's most prolific serial killer escaped for the second time and slipped into the winter night. Ted Bundy goes on a bloody road trip across America and captures the fascination of the entire country now back to the story. From Nineteen, seventy, four to nineteen, seventy, five, ted bundy murdered at least seventeen women, moving his killing spree from the Pacific Northwest to Utah then Colorado. But when an unrelated arrest led to his first murder charge Ted realized. His time was fleeting. In. The months following his extradition to Colorado, he made not one, but two escapes, and on new, Year's eve of nine, thousand, nine, hundred, seventy, seven, thirty, one year, old Ted broke out of prison and disappeared into the night. That morning, using money donated for his Defense Fund Ted Secured. His exit out of Colorado he hopped on a bus to the Denver airport and then took a plane to Chicago from there. He wrote a train to Ann Arbor, Michigan but at the time Ted's priority wasn't hiding out. It was college football. On January. Second Ted cheered on his Alma Mater University of Washington. As they defeated the University of Michigan in the Rose Bowl. Then that night without a single sent to his name, he slept in the sanctuary of a local methodist church the next morning. He stole a car. Ted decided he needed to be as far away from the North West as possible, so he set his sights on the opposite corner of the country. He went to Florida. Ted figured that in Florida. No one would be looking for him. He wasn't wrong. Due to a lack of expedient communication between police departments, the sunshine state was left in the dark. After his escape, in Colorado, the feds got involved in the hunt for Ted. And soon he was placed on the FBI's most wanted list, but even so with no computers and no central database authorities on the east coast had little idea that a killer from the West may be headed their way. On January eighth, nineteen, seventy eight one week after escaping prison in Colorado Ted, Bundy drove to Tallahassee Intel A- Hassi Ted, told people as name was Chris Hagen and after stealing a handful of strangers, credit cards from a local bar. He secured himself a room in an apartment complex next door to a sorority house Chi Omega. Just one week later in the early morning hours of January fifteenth. Nineteen seventy eight, thirty one year old Ted embarked on his boldest crime yet. Ted watched as the sisters of the Chi Omega. Sorority trickled back to the house from their dates and headed to bed by two thirty a m when it. The last girl had fallen asleep. He made his move. Ted slipped through the sorority houses back door, carrying a small oak tree limb. He found in the backyard as he walked quietly through the house, passing portrait after portrait of Sorority sisters past he could feel his heart pound finally, he approached the room of twenty one year old Margaret Bowman. Inside Margaret was fast asleep. In the span of just minutes Ted had beaten and strangled her to death. Now Panting and spattered with blood, Ted could feel himself losing all control without hesitation. He's moved on to his next victim. Ted Entered the room of twenty year old Lisa Levy. She was strangled and clubbed to death, like Margaret, but tense attack Lisa was particularly vicious S. he assaulted her Ted bit. Lisa's POTTY TED had lost himself entirely his bloodlust. He sunk his teeth into her buttocks and tore away nipple on her right breast. Ted continued to make his way down the hall of the Sorority House attacking two more women there that night, twenty one year, old Karen Chandler and twenty year old Kathy Kleiner. Like Margaret and Lisa Karen and Kathy were unconscious during the attacks, but fortunately they survived just barely when emt's later arrived at the scene. They weren't sure if they were alive or dead as he watched, the girls beaten bodies, being loaded into ambulances, share of Ken Cassandra's wondered. What kind of monster could have committed a crime so heinous? But before he could ponder the answer, he heard a call over his radio. Another young woman had been brutally beaten only blocks away Ted had barely made it down the street before succumbing to his murderous urges again. Ted's brazen behaviour had reached new heights this time he'd left evidence behind. When CASSANDRA's raced to the scene, he found a mask made out of women's nylons and a semen stain in the woman's bedroom. Ted had gotten so absorbed in the thrill of the kill heat sabotaged himself. Criminologists commonly classified serial killers on a distinct dichotomy, organized and disorganized murderers for years. Ted's crimes had placed him neatly in the former. He was a textbook, organized killer, socially competent and high functioning. He always planned his murders in advance, sometimes elaborately, and took pride in his ability to leave without a trace, but over time Ted's classification dramatically shifted according to researchers Barney Warf and Cynthia Waddell the lines between organized and disorganized killers is commonly blurred when a murderer is left to murder over an extended period of time, warp and waddle explained that as a killers urges heighten their psychosis intensifies often changing their previously well established habits. And for Ted this transition happen quickly. When he entered the Cayo Mega House that night Ted wasn't organiz killer, but when he walked out, he'd seemingly devolved. Ted Subsequent kills only became more chaotic. He was no longer following. A PLAN PROPELLED ONLY BY LUST TED murdered multiple women in quick succession, and left their bodies at the crime scene. He was spiraling out of control soon propelled by the chaos of the Chi Omega Murderers Ted fled Tallahassee and headed southeast to the small town of Lake City Florida there he would deviate even further abandoning the one characteristic that had defined all his other murders, his victim profile. On February ninth. Nineteen Seventy, eight, ted spotted twelve year old Kimberly Leach crossing the basketball court of junior high school. The last anyone saw of Kim she was climbing into a white van, looking upset after murdering nearly three dozen White College age women with long dark hair. Ted had taken an entirely new type of victim. He murdered a young child. This signified an extreme turning point in Ted. He was no longer the slick deceptive killer with a crystal, clear intent as the stress of his life on the run intensified, and his inevitable fate in prison loomed larger. It didn't matter who he killed anymore. He simply needed to keep feeding the ravenous part of himself. That urged him to continue. Five days later on Valentine's Day an officer notice. Ted Driving under the speed limit in an orange VW bug. Following his instincts, the officer decided to pull the vehicle over instead ted panicked and sped off. A high speed chase ensued, and then a fight once the officer managed to Corner Ted. He lashed out even reaching for the policeman's gun. But the struggle was futile and Ted was arrested and searched officers found more than twenty one credit cards in his possession with a variety of names. They were all stolen, and was the car Ted refused to reveal his identity authorities were baffled and suspicious. Who was this mystery man? By the next day they had a hunch by tracing the VW plates. They discovered it had been stolen in Tallahassee near the Chi Omega Sorority House. Soon the Pensacola PD called up share of Ken Cassara Sotela Hassi and broke the news. They believe they had the co Ed killer in custody. For Days Ken, add his detectives question Ted, they brought him cigarettes to win him over, and eventually Ted agreed to reveal his identity on one condition. He wanted a phone call. He wanted to call Liz club for. He warned her that she'd soon see really ugly stories about him on the news. He was right. Once the media got a hold of the story. Ted's name was everywhere at the time he was already one of the ten most wanted men in the US. The Cayo mega murders only raised his profile. But the thing that truly sealed Ted Bundy and America's collective consciousness was perhaps not the details of his crimes, but his bizarre performance at his own murder trials. Following Ted's indictment, the Florida State Supreme Court made an unprecedented ruling due to the high level of public interest. In the case, Ted's trial would not only be open to Florida residents. It would be the first murder trial to be nationally televised. In June of Nineteen seventy-nine hundreds of people flooded the Miami court room for the first day of proceedings, television crews from all fifty states and nine countries set up lights and rolled cameras and spectators, many of them young women fascinated by the curiously charming murderer filled seats. As thirty two year old Ted entered the courtroom. He beamed at the crowds and winked at cameras. He had an audience. The entire nation was watching ever the showman. The spectators emboldened Ted. He made impassioned speeches and crack jokes, making the court room roar with laughter. Just as he did during the Carol Durant case, and despite his lack of a law degree Ted led his own defense, though a team of young public defenders was assigned to his case Ted assumed the position of lead counsel much to their annoyance multiple times he drove his lawyers to walk out of the courtroom in frustration Ted. Insisted on cross, examining witnesses, often undermining his own argument in the process, and in the end there was little his attorneys could do to stop him. Ted was too caught up playing lawyer in the role of a lifetime. But the stakes couldn't be higher for all of his showmanship. His impassioned speeches at the at trix Ted was still dealt the death penalty. On July thirty, first nineteen, seventy, nine in his thick southern drawl judge Edward Coward sentenced Ted to the electric chair. But it seemed that even the judge at Ted's murder trial hadn't escaped the serial killers charms after he delivered his verdict, coward lamented that he saw a bright young man's potential wasted, he stated. Take care of yourself. Young Man I say that to you sincerely. It is a tragedy for this court to see such a total waste of humanity. You're a bright young man. You'd have made a good lawyer, and I'd have loved to have you practice in front of me, but you went another way partner I. Don't have any animosity to you. I want you to know that, but even after being sentenced to death Ted's antics were far from over in January of Nineteen Eighty Ted represented himself for the last time in the murder trial of twelve year, old Kimberly Leach, and once again he was given the death penalty, but it was nearly a decade before he saw his sentence through. In that time Ted? Bundy lingered on death row, taking interviews with journalists, psychologists, and as execution grew closer, he began admitting to more murders just to delay his sentence. Ultimately, he admitted to thirty one in total. But Ted could only delay fate for so long on January twenty, fourth, nineteen, eighty, nine, forty two year old Ted took his seat in the electric chair in front of a large picture window behind it was a gallery of onlookers, many of whom were witnesses at his trial. In his last words to his very last audience Ted Apologize. For All the trouble he caused then a metal skullcap was placed on his head, followed by a black hood. The executioner flipped the switch and moments later at seven sixteen am. Ted Bundy was pronounced dead. At his request Ted was cremated, and his ashes were scattered at an undisclosed location in the cascades in Washington, state. After his death, Ted Bundy place among class of America's most prolific serial killers. But his blood legacy lives on not because of the number of his crimes, but because of Ted himself. Americans were and still are fascinated with the good-looking charmer with a capacity to kill. It's this duality that we fixate on the shadow. We boundary between all American men and notorious murderer, but he embodied so well. Countless movies, documentaries and books both fiction, and not have been inspired by his brutality and his charisma, making him into a kind of macabre celebrity. Ted Bundy has become synonymous with the idea of a serial killer, the prototype of a psychopathic lust murderer, but as the media's love. Affair with Ted Rages on it begs the question. Was this, but he ultimately wanted. There's no doubt Ted used his unique position at his televised trial to his benefit, but perhaps he'd always intended to make a lasting impression that would live on long past his inevitable death. In Ted's last act, he'd manipulated an entire nation, creating a dark stain on our collective consciousness. Thanks again for tuning. Into serial killers, we'll be back Monday with a new episode for more information on Ted Bundy amongst the many sources we used. We found the book the stranger beside me by an rule extremely helpful to our research. You can find all episodes of serial killers, and all of the park cast originals for free on spotify or anywhere you listen to podcasts, not only this spotify already have all of your favorite music, but now spotify is making it easy for you to enjoy all of your favorite podcast originals like serial killers for free from your phone, desktop or smart speaker to stream serial killers on spotify just open the APP and type serial killers in the search bar. and. Don't forget to follow us on facebook and Instagram at podcast and twitter at podcast network. We'll see you next time. Have a killer week. Serial killers was created by Max Cobbler. And his apar- cast studios original executive producers include Max and Ron, cutler sound design by one Boorda with production assistance by Ron, Shapiro, Carly Madden Isabel away and Joel Stein this episode of serial killers was written by Alex Garland with writing assistance by Abigail Cannon and Stars Greg, Poulsen and Vanessa Richardson

Janet Ted Ted Bundy Ted murder Ted Bundy America Ted Apologize Ted Rages Ted Bundy. Liz club Ted Secured Colorado Ted Subsequent Ted Driving Seattle ted panicked Corner Ted Carol Washington Carol Durant Utah
Ted Bundy: Buried Secrets

Scene Of the Crime

1:33:43 hr | 1 year ago

Ted Bundy: Buried Secrets

"She was a blondie with Hayes allies. Ann Marie Burr at eight years old was lively and good natured. Her smile was legendary. She was big sister next in line was Julie. Who was seven Greg Five? And Little Mary was three years old. The large Catholic family called the North End of Tacoma home, a tidy brick, English style bungalow. The kind of house, the big bad wolf could not blow down. At least that's what they thought on that. Hot August Day in nineteen sixty one. It was a Wednesday and the last week of summer vacation. Then Labor Day and back to school, and on that day sunshine had been muted by dark, forboding clouds. The Air had turned monkey when Anne Marie came bounding through the door, begging her mother Bev Force sleepover at her friends. But with summer, winding down the harried mother of four. Felt it was high time to tame her. Wiley brewed from the Ad Hawk summer routine. Going to bed early and preparation for an early morning school schedule so. She next that sleepover. and Oh. How that split second decision would later come to haunt her. The storm kicked into high gear. Heavy rain hit the rooftop wind howled. It was a batten down the hatches kind of night. That night Anne Marie was sharing a room with Mary who is still nursing a broken arm? She story crying out for her mother and Anne Marie dutifully brought her little sister to her parents room where their mother soothed. And then sent the girls back to bed. All was quiet except Barney, the family dog barking. Bevin don dismissed his cries believing. The storm was to blame for spooking the which. They had no idea. Evil had entered the family home as they lay sleeping. At Dawn Bev awoke with start. Fear in her heart. Was it mother's intuition. She rushed to check on the children. and Maurice bed was empty. She descended downstairs to the living room like a flash flood. The front door was ajar. The dining room window wide open. Outside she noticed a garden bench had been moved from the backyard, and placed beneath that open front window, heart thumps, and a high gear blood rushed into her ears. Where was an Marie? Anne Marie father scoured the neighborhood. A construction site at nearby University of puget sound caught his attention especially when he saw mounds of fresh dirt in piles around dishes and other excavated sites, a chill when up his spine, when he observed a teenage boy, kicking dirt into a ditch with his foot. To that kid has smirk on his face. Don Begged police to search the site which they did four days later, but by then. had been filled in. Dan Marie was never seen again what they didn't know. WAS THAT SURLY TEEN? Just could have been Ted Bundy, so he was like fourteen. Then it was known to ride a bicycle through the neighborhood and Murray's mother would later say she had not prepared her child for evil in the world they had taught her that everyone was good. But how could any mother ever prepare their eight year old child for the evil depraved twisted teen, hiding inside the package of the boy next door, the smiling handsome, mild-mannered preppy. Who all the while behind that mask was scheming how to get away with abducting sexually assaulting and murdering young girls. Say snapped that I knew that. The couldn't control them. More of these barriers have been is still. Not Enough a hold me bat with respect to. Seeking out and an army's body. I'm Caroline Gloria with Kim Shepard and this is the scene of the crime. That is a parent's worst nightmare. You think when you have your children tucked in at home cozy in their beds. At night. You lock the front door that you can go to sleep that you can turn off that little voice in in a mom's head. That is constantly worried about what could be going wrong with her children like. My kids tucked in the house is locked up for the night. The whole world has kind of gone to sleep and rest I think that's maybe the only time that I am not worried about my children with sleeping and now I've given you something to worry about right. But, I was looking up information on the likelihood of missing children being murdered, which is surprisingly unusual in like ninety nine percent of the cases when children missing, they're not killed their found. Let versus good very good, which is really good, but to the Attorney General of Washington state who conducted a study in one, thousand, nine, hundred seventy, said in seventy four percent of cases where the abducted children were killed, it happened within three hours of. Of the abduction, so is this the scenario where you hear it? We've done these stories and it's like well. We can't do a missing child report until it's been a certain amount of time. Because Ninety nine percent of the time they come back well, and that used to be the case. Those rules have really been changing in recent years. I mean think about the amber alert that you now have in place. It doesn't have to be. Be a twenty four hour situation. I think they might still have those rules for adults, but when it comes to children, the general's report, their conclusion of it was the importance of parents calling police immediately. They said the biggest problem they had was that. In most of these child abduction cases, parents would wait at least two hours before calling the police because they would think. Oh, baby, Janis, over at a friend's house, or maybe they just. Just snuck out there down the street we'll find them, and so they do a little bit of looking around I before calling authorities, and so the takeaway from this report was you call us within an hour or so much more likely to find your child, and have it be a good outcome? Well, in this case, I know that Bev she basically left the house went and spoke to. The neighbors came back in they immediately. Immediately called the police, and but that's the thing. She left the House and talk to the neighbors. I yeah not to put any blame it on whatever, but like. If there's one thing that maybe could have been done differently, it would be call the police immediately well, and I think that in this case what I didn't include that in the scene center is that they had seen a peeping Tom in the neighborhood as they were getting. Getting Information and so it's sad to say if this was Ted Bundy knowing what his Mo now is. She didn't stand a chance. Yeah, so hindsight is twenty twenty things in this case that yeah I mean. Maybe things could have been done differently, but when it comes right down to it, there's not a thing that anybody could have done. Yeah so first. Let's go back in time to start at the beginning to tell this story. Story though I had a lot of help, my sources include the documentary conversations with a killer. The Ted Bundy tapes Cairo. Seven TV ABC News, the Seattle Times and Wikipedia, so we're going way back to November twenty, four, th and nineteen forty six Theodore Robert Cowl was born to Louise and a home for unwed mothers in Vermont now Louise was twenty two, and after giving birth, she goes back home to live with their parents in Philadelphia. Philadelphia and Theodore or Ted he's raised to believe that his grandparents are his parents and that Louise is his older sister, so louise flees her parents home when he was three years old life was tough in their home, but allegedly what prompted Louise to pack up and move to Tacoma Washington was a situation where Louise's sister woke up to find her bed covered in kitchen knives with three-year-old Ted smiling at the foot of her bed. Yes three years old so crazy. Yeah, and I guess the which I'm GonNa get into in a minute, but the the grandfather. Who they were you know, he was raising Ted as his son and the grandmother was the mother, and then he thought that his real mother was actually his okay, so he was this horrible guy. Terrible grandfather, yeah, who ted later said that he identified, but that's such a zero to three I mean people could say oh well. It wasn't that long, but those are the the formative formative years yet and I was looking up I was curious about this because I know that there was a lot of rage and trauma that was happening in the family, and so I was curious about what affects childhood trauma could actually have on the development of the brain and I found this study from Dr Michael Develops. Who is with? With Duke University, and what he says, basically that those who experience a lot of childhood trauma are particularly prone to having chronic issues later in life including PTSD depression, anxiety, antisocial behavior, greater risk for alcohol and substance abuse, and the reasons for this are the changes in the brain structure that happens when you're in stressful situations, traumatic situations, your biology releases Cortisol and other hormones into your system that can not only impact your behavior in the moment, but when it's a brain that still in the process of forming can actually. How that brain forms, and make you more susceptible to having flights of anger, flights of anxiety, antisocial behaviors well and at three with the knives around the bed. Like clearly clearly, we've got issues here. So the so his mom who still believes as his sister they fleet Tacoma. Cousins for a while, so they have family, and that's what basically led them to. So it was just a really chaotic home life, but then a bright spot in early nineteen, fifty one Bundy's mom Louise Mary's a man named Johnny Bundy and Theodore is given his new stepfather's last name. Johnny is described as everything Louise's father is not caring, sweet and loving Bundy later thinks of him as an uneducated poor. You know he doesn't make a lot of money, and he's like really dismissive, even though the husband is like totally awesome and treats the. The family really well and takes them camping. You know Bundy kind of never really they have four other children together and Bundy always kinda keeps himself on the outside of it well, and that's the other thing that early childhood trauma effects is the child's ability in later, the adults ability to form connections in bonds with other people that is stunted in the brain win. You have so much early childhood trauma, so I'm not surprised that he had a hard time feeling any kind of attachment a stepfather, but I think though that we get this. This impression at least I do where it's like. We had the trauma at three up to three where it was super chaotic. The grandfather, which will get into in a minute was just completely psycho, but then he has this loving you know by all accounts, loving family, and so it gets back to that whole nature versus nurture, and you're. You're kind of like, I? You can't erase the trauma that's been done by having a nurturing family. I mean that three years of trauma changed. His biology changed his brain in a way. That can't be. Be Undone by okay well now you're around Nice people, so just stop being this PTSD, person like It just doesn't work that. Let me think about people who go to war and come home, and now you're in a loving family environment. Why can't you just move on and put that behind you? Because it's not that simple? Yeah, when it comes to the brain there still so much. We don't know, but that's what I think. That's what you and I love trying to figure out so in nineteen sixty five, though bundy graduates from. Wilson High School in Tacoma and then in the fall of nineteen, sixty five. He enrolls at the University of puget sound that same school where an Marie. Parents are convinced that Bundy buried her so I talked to collate Steiger about an Marie disappearance and presumed murder, and he says there are so many other cold cases that investigators are still trying to figure out if Bundy was responsible people `specially an I I tend to agree that he probably did that one. I've actually we actually went down to I've been to his childhood home. Ameri burs home and it's he would ride a bike and it would. It'd be about eight or ten minute bicycle ride from her. How his house to her house and then there was a a shoeprint outside her window, maybe six and he was like fourteen then, and that probably would have been about the size shoe war so I mean that's you know those type of things and. Disguise are notorious serial serial killer that didn't live far away and was known to ride his bicycle through the neighborhood, and this little girl disappeared midnight Corsi. He denied that he did it, but you know the serial killers will admit to some and not to others because. They want you know they don't want to be thought of as a child killer although. He killed Kimberly was twelve in which ultimately executed for and I think he had another twelve year old victim or something very close somewhere else, but know that's the way that's the thing is. There's a lot of cases that are ted by cases across this country that deplete agencies have no clue that it's the Ted Bundy case because it's only one murder. Murder He's he's. He drove clerk. US country went for Vermont then down to Florida and you know he was all over the place, and he didn't just and he he would have stopped. Places need probably killed all across the country and to that agency is just. It's just a single murder, right? We have this one unsolved murder. They don't have any clue. That has anything to do with Ted. Bundy Cam you'll remember the voice of our favorite detective Cloyd Steiger up him act. It's such a pleasure talking because he's so curious, he is a retired Seattle police detective, and he's the author of the books homicide. The view from inside the tape I actually just ordered that We're going on a camping trip and unlike. Can Sign. And then he also of course Seattle's forgotten serial killer Gary Gene. Grant which we did a vote on. Yes, and today, though and this is where you know. I was really happy to talk to him because today he's the chief criminal investigator of the Washington State Attorney General's homicide. Investigation tracking system and what they do is they track all murders in Washington Oregon and Montana as well as assist local agencies with homicide investigations, including cold case homicide, so he's in this deep. Yeah, and that's part of the reason why we wanted to do this case. Even though you know Ted, Bundy, everybody kind of knows who he is and what he did, and you know it's not exactly a new story, but. Cloyd has such an interesting take and has so much knowledge about the cases that might be connected to Bundy that they haven't been able to definitively say. That we really wanted to talk about Ted Bundy. Talk about these cases and talk about the ones that were. Possibly connected, but they haven't yet figured that out yet. Because I think, that is really interesting, well in another one in Washington, and this is, and it's interesting, too, because these are all before his main killing spree like these are when he is still really young. This has mainly the prequel yeah. Yes, I, mean it's. It's no joke. Like in another case, it was a huge case. In the June of nineteen sixty five included talks about this one. This chilling case that they just didn't put together I mean. How could they know to flight attendants that were. Roommates in a house in Queen Anne. and. They were asleep when somebody came into the middle of the night and bludgeoned them with a board. It's very similar to kyle mega and bludgeoned him both severely One of them died at the scene, the other actually survived because she had curlers in her hair, but she suffered brain damage, and has no recollection of the event, and so, and it was a terrible crime. And you know that's that's one over the years people have speculated. Could have done and I tend to agree that he probably did do it like I said he worked at the Safeway not too far away, and it's exactly the basically the same always come egging down in Florida. It's really incredible that they now have these cases that they think might be connected an oak. Loyd is working with this state. Wow, national database on serial killers I mean. is he able to get anywhere with these like you looking at DNA to move these cases forward to actually see if there's a connection, he brought up. How the that this particular one? There's a picture of that bloody board and they're holding it without gloves the detectives. So it's like you know, it's before nine, hundred sixty five before they, even thinking about DNA is so far away from being on the radar, but Cloyd says another interesting point about bringing up these early cases that although this is anecdotal, it's chilling because he spoke with a detective that work that case and it. Kinda shows Bundy's. And, he told me goes this guy's close to ninety years old now. You told me he was standing on this on the outside of the perimeter. When this young guy came walking up to him and say hey, what's going on here? It's a homicide. And he said can I go in. No, you can't go in. And he says the Guy said hi I'm Ted and shook his hand and walked away and he sure to this day. That was Ted Bundy. What yeah, I mean! It just shows the audacity. He had from an early age. Things that he was just bulletproof in this way. I know it is now. It was never confirmed that Bundy went to that went back to that scene of the crime that day, but it surely fits his Mo as they would later come to know was so brazen and so cocky, and any thought Naked Never Taito. Any was obviously maybe right, because it's been fifty some years later. He's still not was never charged with that case, and it isn't cleared, but that some people just are that way again. It's part of their psyche. It's not necessarily the whole killer back into crime doesn't isn't necessarily true, but just because of the way Bundy was. It sounds like exactly something he would have done. So by the fall of nineteen, sixty six. We know that he was in the area he'd moved to Seattle and is now attending the University of Washington and from one thousand, nine, hundred, sixty, seven to nineteen, Sixty, eight here another bread crumb. He's in a relationship with a girl named Stephanie Brooks. Who breaks his heart and it's worth noting that she closely resembles his future victims, which is long brown hair parted in the middle in big hoop earrings. Apparently, this relationship ended because she thought he was sort of like drifting through life, and he lied and he. He shoplifted, but this break up really had an effect on Bundy and it really upset him on top of that. In early nineteen, sixty nine, he visits the town in Vermont where he was born, and he learns that he is illegitimate. Cloyd says coincidentally a woman is found murdered very nearby. He was born actually in Burlington Vermont in like a home for unwed mothers, basically, and this girl lived like right next to that home and was found murdered when he was there when he was probably. There I don't know if they linked down by so he. The he's. He's been to show him in the area when the murder happened. It's a murderer that matches them all, so they have not been able to definitively link that to him though it's still unresolved. Yeah, because you gotta understand, it's again one of the the off murders completely away from Washington, but it had the same Mo.. Beaten to death, so investigators say that Bundy another piece to this puzzle might have been fathered by his mother, Louise's abusive and violent father. Samuel cowl Oh, so we're talking incest. Yes, we are now. I remember you talking about the rage issues that his grandfather or father had. I was actually curious about this. I looked up whether or not rage is hereditary, and there is a A doctor Dr Redford Williams. WHO's the director of Behavioral Medicine? Research at Duke, university looked this, and he said you know it's been proven that prolonged periods of anger can do raise your blood pressure your Adrenalin your cortisol levels. It can damage your immune system, and essentially it like attacks your body in a way. That almost is like it's killing you when you get these really serious fits of rage. And, so he wanted to study less. What they say. Stress can kill rage. Can I mean it's all? It's all part and parcel to the same kind of emotion. And what it does to your body, so when he did his research on this, he found. There is a tiny molecular variation on a gene that is known to predict people who will have bouts of anger. Whether or not that genetic variation comes from your lineage He hasn't been able to determine. Is this genetic variation something that is like a fluke, or is it something that you get from you know your mom or your dad or whatever? He wasn't able to determine that, but he said there is definitely something in your genes that can make you more prone to fits of rage and according to this paper that I was looking at, he was hoping to do some more research to determine just how closely it can be linked to heredity well, and it sounds like Ted. Bundy could be very close to the. The Person News the ranger in the family according to Wikipedia and nineteen, eighty-seven Bundy and other family members told attorneys that Samuel cow was a Toronto bully and a bit who hated blacks. Italians Catholics and Jews beat his wife and the family dog and swung the neighborhood cats by their tails. He wants through Louise's younger sister Julia down a flight of stairs for oversleeping, and here's a key piece. He sometimes spoke aloud to unseen presences, and at least once flew into a violent rage when the question of Bundy's paternity was raised. That sounds like it was a sore subject. We'll talk about childhood trauma if he was there or if he knew about that situation. How would that impact a little kid who's two or three years old to hear your father, grandfather or whoever it may be? Angry about the fact that there your father. Yeah, I mean I get that, but I mean. Have you ever read the Glass Castle I mean it's just like the most traumatic, but wonderfully written amazing memoir, and it's like the type of abuse that kids in that story underwent and poverty and conditions like not just until they were three like ongoing i. mean it's just it's really hard to read, but it's one of those must-reads. I just have a hard time with. The nature versus nurture the I. Guess Maybe I've just read into so much. The story that I just can't even justify and I'm not saying you're justifying his actions, but it's like he makes me sick like I. Don't I just can't. You know what I mean. Yeah, just my. Desire to understand how he became the serial killer that he became is. How do we keep this from happening again? How to keep other kids from winding up in this situation that damages their brain in a way that they are prone to fits of rage, and no and I'm glad you're thinking I'm like in cavewoman mode where? I Think beyond like just retribution. What. What but I think that it's I'm so glad that we have people asking these questions and I'm glad to be talking with you about the questions. This is a great point to transition into advances. DNA technology, matter of fact I was involved in a documentary pro project. A couple years ago audion where they were because they had access to clothing and note pads from one of his previous attorneys, and they're gonNA. Have that processed for DNA to see if there were the markers of incest in his DNA. They just decided. Halfway through production that they were going to instead focus on the victims and not on him. Unless you had a sample from his grandfather, you couldn't definitely say. His grandfather was a father, but there are markers in DNA genome that show and then sexual relationship. Yeah, they had DNA they could definitely. Figure that out, but you mentioned that he moved to come up with his mom when he was three, was that his sister mom or his? That was his sister I mean that was his mom, who who he thought was his sister when he was three, and he moved to coma. Did he think he was moving with his sister? I think so. That's weird. Yeah, but doesn't make sense to me it doesn't I mean I? Looked I looked because to me on. That was a point whereas like, wait a second. It seems like because especially when the his stepfather adopts him, there's inconsistencies, but you heard Cloyd saying he didn't find out until later, and that's basically the narrative from all the stuff that I've read is that he really didn't find out that his sister was actually his mother until later Serious case denial, but okay, I mean it was and that's why he was really upset and angry that he was kept in the dark this whole time. Yeah I mean I, could I could definitely see where you know. Aside from the fact that the childhood trauma of having this father slash grandfather, who had this rage was violent, and perhaps mentally ill in more ways than. Than One, that would be traumatic enough, but then to find out that you've also been lied to and Yeah I. Mean That's that's a lot it's it's definitely a lot. But what was interesting cloyd and I had continued that conversation. When you think about what does it mean to know if incest runs in your family, but and that's I. Mean, that's not an excuse. But. He had a lot of deep anger about lot of stuff. WHO HAS UPBRINGING? He went back to Vermont to the unwed mothers home where he was born, and then incidentally while he's there later. This girl is in the house. Next door is murdered. I mean the guy's lashing out losing control. Angry upset and I. Don't know how far you want to go with this discussion, but one thing that stuck with me from class on cultural anthropology was the idea of taboo. Yeah, every culture in the world has some things that are taboo and one thing that crosses cultural boundaries. Almost two hundred percent of the world is taboo against incest. Yeah, it's up there with cannibalism I. Think clearly it's happening a lot more than people want to admit. I mean look at that case that we did with the emery. Brothers and people don't want to talk about it, so the interesting thing about taboos is that they do two things they do minimize that behavior, so if there's a taboo against incest, society says incest is bad. People are generally pressured not to do it, and let's be honest. Most people don't really want to. To do it anyway, but when it does happen, no one wants to admit it. No one wants to talk about it. It's hidden. It's put in a closet shoved into the back and nobody wants to so taboo. It's like a catch twenty two where it's like well. Yeah, it makes people less likely to do that behavior, but it also makes it more likely that if they do the behavior. It's going to be hidden. It's going to be you know secretive. No one's going to want to talk about it or admit to it. And so it's weird in a way that it it works both kind of beneficially and non beneficial if It feeds on itself. Yeah, what about the DNA aspect would you want to know if you had a marker for incest, or would you rather not know it depends on? What would you do with that information? Is it something that would be helpful to you later on in life like for your medical benefit? Is there a reason that you would need to know that or Can't have any of the information if somebody said to you Kim I, have your your profile here? Do you want to know if you have incest in your family or not? You know. Do you WanNa? Take the red or the Blue Pill. I mean I it. Just. It's so much depends on the situation I in my case, I think I think everybody's different. Yeah, I don't think I'd want to know. I think I would if I was still in contact with any of the people that might have been involved. Hell Yeah. Well or just stay away from them I mean if if they're capable of that I, would wanna know so so I wouldn't bring my children around them. So it depends well. I. Think in the future they will. Probably we can send off an me one two three or whatever on. Like I think in the future. You know that that's that's coming up. You know so. We'll see but anyway back to the fall of Nineteen sixty-nine. We go and Bundy is at U. DUB and he begins a long term relationship with Lindsey with Liz. Kendall who has a young daughter, so in Nineteen, seventy and nineteen from the years of nineteen seventy. Seventy to nineteen seventy-two. He is seriously living this double life. He was active in politics and also worked at the suicidal hotline with the famous true crime, writer and rule who worked alongside him? I mean at the time. She wasn't famous she was you know she was just? She was just an yeah. He was my partner at the crisis clinic in Seattle. And every month every Sunday and every Tuesday night Ted Bundy and I were locked up all night long alone together in this big Victorian Mansion in the highest crime district of Seattle. And we were saving lives, and he would walk me to my car when I left it three or four in the morning. And say and please be careful in the way home. Lock your doors I don't want anything bad to happen to you. He was sympathetic. Hit a gentle voice. He was so understanding, and he was good at keeping people alive, and would later go on to write the stranger beside me about her time with Bundy and Bundy also graduates from with a degree in psychology from the U. Dub, and one could say that he wanted to use that knowledge to manipulate not only his victims, but the world who, in their wildest dreams could not imagine their friends family member Co.. Co worker who he really was, but basically Bundy had been educating himself on law enforcement for a long time he was studying how the police caught killers, probably to be titillated, but also to understand so this was before his first known murder. Well, nobody no see that's the thing. He flew under the radar so long and he's trying to maintain this normal life, but that's the thing is. It makes me think like he's already been killing people yeah. Own Killing. He's like okay. I better. Make sure that I'm doing this right if I want to keep doing this so that I don't get caught Oh. Yeah, that's been his. He's been doing that for a long time, but it's even more reason to think that some of these previously unconnected cases could be connected. Yeah, and the degree in psychology. Like yeah, you know he's. He's picking. You know he's A. A quick study on how to maintain a normal life while he's a killing machine driving a Volkswagen bug, he fit into his surrounding so well. Most people had no idea they had Predator in their Mitts, and in November nineteen, seventy-three, he ab- ducks and murders. Kathy divined from a street and Seattle. Her body is later found near Olympia and I'm including all of the the murders here just to kind of. Of Give you a chronology of of how rampant he is and brazen. He is in January nineteen seventy four attacks. Joni Lens in her apartment in Seattle. Amazingly she survives in February of that year. Bundy abducts and strangles Linda and healy from her basement apartment in the district. Now she is a well. She is well known in the community for giving the Weekday Ski Report on the radio so these bodies. Bodies again. It's like in different places. A couple of Martin Seattle or few of them are in Seattle in March of Nineteen seventy-four Bundy murdered Donna Gail Manson a student at Evergreen State College now that's in Olympia. Her body was never recovered. So imagine this bug is driving all over all over the Pacific northwest and I just hear the engine I know, don't you? Everyone would know it was coming. But see that's the that's the saddest part of all. They wouldn't know it was coming. There would know what was coming. They would know it was coming out. In April nineteen, seventy four, so one a month. He abducts and kills Susan Elaine. Ran Court a student at central Washington. University, that's an ELLENSBURG. May Nineteen seventy-four Bundy abducted Roberta. Kathy Parks from Oregon State University he claimed, was sexually assaulted and killed her at Taylor. Mountain, what wait a minute. Yeah, more than twenty five miles southeast of Seattle and where I am going. As soon as we get done recording this so Mike, are you? Worst. Horse I ride Taylor. Mountain will describe Taylor Mountain because that's one of his dumping ground. I mean if you're familiar with cougar out cougar about what does. Tiger, mountain, I looked it up because I thought. Did they right this wrong note? Tiger Mountain, so if you're familiar tiger mountain basically Taylor. Mountain is the backside of Tiger Mountain. It's almost like its little brother where you have highway eighteen that runs in between the two so to the west side of highway eighteen is Tiger Mountain and to the east side of highway eighteen is Taylor mountain and Taylor mountain like tiger. Mountain is completely evergreen trees yards. The I can see very secluded, and I can imagine back in the seventies. It was even more secluded than it is now. Now, and now there isn't anything up there. It's one of the largest trail systems in the area in the King County kind of Western. Washington area and that that's why so many people go horseback riding up. There is because there isn't anything up there, and it's just really all trails and wilderness, so June, first nineteen seventy-four Bundy abducted Brenda Carol Ball from Burien. Her skull was later found at Taylor Mountain, so it's like you can see the pattern here where he's abducting them from a certain place, and then bring them to a completely different place. Yeah, that's nowhere near. You probably an hour. Oh, no, well in. Olympia has like three hours away from Seattle Oregon State. University have a bug. He's committed here and he has a plan. And where does he put his victims in that bug driving them around in the back seat, going to explain this so in June eleventh, nineteen, seventy four bundy would later describe years later probably right before he was to be executed, he would describe to Robert Capelle. He was the original Seattle detective assigned to catch him how he hunted and killed Georgeanne Hawkins, pulling one of his ruses that he would become infamous for an alley near her U. DUB Sorority House. Moving up the alley. Using! A briefcase. In some crutches! And a young woman walked down. About halfway down the block. I encountered her. And asked her to help me carry the briefcase. which she did, we won't back up the alley. Basically reached the car. What happened was I. Knocked her. Unconscious, With a crowbar. and. Handcuffed put her in the driver's. I mean the passenger side of the car. Drove away. Thing that makes it. Among the things that makes it difficult at this point. She was quite lucid talking about things. It's funny, it's. Funny, but it's odd the things people say an. Under those circumstances and She had a Spanish test the next day and she thought that I had. Taken her to? Help, to to make I banished test. Long short of it was. That I again, not unconscious. The, Girls head was. severed. Up The road of. Twenty five fifty yards. At buried in a location about ten yards west of the. Rocky also. By this time, it was almost dawn. On this particular morning. I was just absolutely. Again just shocked and scared to death shot horrified about. Went down the road throwing the briefcase, the the crutches road. Just tossing out the window and the crow everything Anka's everything. I get mad at myself two weeks later because they'd have to go buy another pair. Not Comical, but that's what when. This was just. I was in a state of panic of just absolute horror. You know it's like at that point time. Consciousness of what has really happened to psych. He break out of a fever or something. I would add is and so I would I drove. Talk about details coming back. I couldn't find one of the shoes. So. I thought it was there. But it wasn't. So I went back. This is this is. My bicycle road back to the parking lot I knew there are police all over the place by that time. So it may parthenon found both pierced ears. Pierced earrings and the shoe link in the parking lot. Hawaii surreptitiously gathered them up. So. They are. That's Ted. Bundy right yeah voice. Yes, what is he on because? He sounds like he is on some serious medication during that I'm. Probably like lithium or something, I have no idea but to me. It's like the other thing I noticed is that he started to get more lucid and coherent as he was talking about the details of the crime, not the details of luring her, but the details of what he did after he got her well and was interesting in that interview. When you listen to the whole unedited, that was an edited version of it, but you have the detective asking questions trying to have him admit to sexually assaulting her all night in the woods, and he just wouldn't go there. He just. Wouldn't you know he? He would always say these things, and and as I. I was listening to all these different interviews taped interviews of his confessions later like I mean the guys about ready to die. I mean if you're hearing something in his voice, it's fear. It's you know all of his emotions, so it just sounds like he's given up. He sounds like he has just given up. And you know why even bother drawing another breath. He's still at that point bargaining for his life. He's wanting to get that. He did not want to die up until the very end. He did not want to die, but he would always want. He had to be in control of everything in these interviews like he didn't want to admit. How he had sexually assaulted them all night long what he had done how he had done it. He ever admit to sexually assaulting any of his victims. He did to some of them, but he couldn't go into, and this isn't to go into detail. What tell us all the gory details, but but it's like I. Think it's. If he's willing to admit to certain things and not others like. Yes, why is he willing to admit to this horrific crime, but not sexual assault which I mean also is horrific, but. It's not worse than matter. And that's what cloyd was saying. Some of these guys will admit to some, but won't admit to others. No matter what it almost makes me wonder about the idea of the way that he came into the world and the incest and the situation with his mom slash, sister and father slash grandfather. If? There wasn't some kind of sexual deviancy. Maybe, he felt like a don again. Grasping at straws, trying to understand the minor killer, which is impossible, but I wonder if it could have been something where he could admit to rage, she could admit to murder, but the idea of admitting to sexual deviancy was just something he couldn't do because of his history to his interviews where he's like he'll, he'll gloss over and he's like well. You know we don't have time now to go into those deeper. Deeper caverns and you can tell he's trying to control control the narrative control. The situation I mean who knows like what some people think is perfectly normal that I'm a complete Weirdo and other people think like you know what I mean. It's like I think it's the individual person where they're shameless boundary lines, are we? You know what that's. The interesting part is that how used himself how? He views his crimes how he views his his personality. Choices, it's not about whether. This is right or wrong or good or bad, or did he do it, or did he not do it? It's about how does he view himself? And how does his perception of himself affect his choices that he makes, and it's and it? It helps to know like that's why this was a long cut to include. It showcases his Mo. how he loved to game the system. A former friend explained Bundy was watching a news report about one of his murders and this was. was before he was caught, and he bragged to his friend there right there. He said that he would know how to get away with killing someone. He explained you pick the woman up in one county. Throw away her clothes in another and leave her body in another county, because different counties would mean law enforcement was less likely to talk with one another, and so that he was so right. I mean we've seen this hour. Cases covered up until this point anything that happened before. Let's say two thousand. Chances are very good at the agencies. We're not talking to each other. Yes, and up. Until this point his Mo and the police are not making the connections to one suspect or person of interest in all these murders. That will change in July, Nineteen, seventy four. When Bundy's compulsions are ramping up and would lead to mistakes so every summer. There's a fun event on the shores of Lake. Sammamish state park which is really close to Taylor Mountain, folks, young and old would gather to play games and have fun. Bundy was there for a different reason trolling for young women to sexually assault torture and murder this time he had his arm in a sling, pretending to be injured and needed help loading his sailboat onto his vehicle. So, in separate incidents, Janice ought and Denise Naslund were. From Lake, Sammamish State Park. He was a cunning Schemer, but he made mistakes in this brazen killing of two young women at Lake managed between the hours of ten am and four thirty PM. When police investigated, they talked to someone who heard Janice ought say hi, I'm Jan and the preppy looking man with a distinctive sling shorts and button-down shirt replied. Hi, I'm Ted, so he gave his real name. The last time she was seen was pushing her bike as he walks alongside her, so witnesses are now able to give a composite sketch, and the man's car is a Tan Volkswagen bug. Each lead has to be followed. Every phone call has to be made mostly. Some out with a speck of information that may someday help clear up the mystery of the whereabouts of genocide. And Denise Naslund so. This is a cut from ABC, and what's really intriguing and I don't want to say great, but they finally have people and leads to chase down and try to figure out. What happened, they still haven't connected these two crimes to the other women, but they at least have a situation where they can start piecing together some pieces here. I also think it's interesting that he killed two women relatively same place same time. It's like he wants people to figure out that he's a serial killer. Because if you just had killed one woman at Lake Sammamish, likely the police again would. Would think this is a one off. Maybe not connected with any other cases I think it's both it's two things. He's both brazen and thinks he's smarter than everybody. Yeah, and to he is becoming unhinged with his compulsions. It's all he thinks about he's you know he's getting further away from this dual life. He's two sides of a coin. He knows how to pretend, but now these lives are. Splitting you know he can't control it like he did. And in an interview later when Bundy was asked about the murders of Ott and Naslund, he told investigators that ought was still alive when he kidnapped Naslund and one was forced to watch as he murdered the other. There's something about the idea of like him wanting to get caught. Yeah, real secret. He wants to see how close to the edge. He can get pull back like how close can I get to them figuring out? It's me without actually being caught. You know, but that's going to be his downfall. I mean the thing for sure right there that I keep hearing that I'm wondering about is he keeps using. Using this VW bug serial killer one. Oh, one switch things up, so they don't connect your crimes. And here he is using the same vehicle over and over and over again so in September of one, thousand, nine, hundred, seventy, four, the body parts of ought, and NASLUND and Hawkins are recovered two miles from Lake Sammamish in a wooded area after the Spanish killings Bundy knew he wanted to keep killing young women, he would need to move to another state where they weren't looking for a suspect named Ted who drove a VW bug, so he moves to Utah and guess what happens fall of Nineteen, seventy, four, Bundy Anders, the University of UTAH. Law School and in October. October of that same year Bundy Murdered Melissa Smith and Laura Amy in November of Nineteen, seventy four. He's messes up again. He tries to abduct Carol Ranch from a shopping mall and here is a newscast explaining what happened during that time Carol Garage parked a car and this parking lot at the fashion mall shortly after began what she now calls her personal nightmare bundy posing as a police officer approaches a young garage. He tells her that they've apprehended. A suspect was trying to break into her car. He said they would have to go down to the main. Murray Police Department to sign a complaint. The ranch entered the abductors car. She jumped out of the car the. The man jumped out waiting. What looked like a crowbar? She broke loose ran to the street, flagged down a passing car, and an elderly couple drove ranch to the Murray police station. The search for her doctor began. It's so funny the style of it you can tell what era is he just kind of cool I mean well. It was from a different time. People are not used to these types of crimes back then they have described it so much in Washington. Has Seattle in Washington was known. It's like no crime matter where they've wrong. How many serial killers did we have under wraps that we didn't know about? Yeah, yeah, but there's still this. These are shocking. And then again back to his obsession, he fails to get killed ranch and then that same day. He abducts Debbie Kent From Her School and Bountiful and kills her. But botching the abduction of Ranch Utah is now looking for Durant kidnapper. They don't know anything about Ted Bundy they, but she does have a description, and of course the car did he call himself Ted again. She didn't even get that far. Okay, yeah, I don't think I don't think so, but can I. Put out there to that like if you're a detective looking to help somebody out. You're probably not driving a VW bug, but we'll, and that's what she said the way she did smell his breath, which made her suspicious, but then when she saw his car, she was like Oh. He's undercover. So these things that we knew to kind of like our hackles are raised, but we kinda talk. Try to talk ourselves out of it. We don't. Think that people are that evil, or we WANNA see the best in people a lot of times we'll yeah, and and I think he was so quick about it the second she was in his car and they were driving and she was like. Hey, wait a second. The police stations over there. He's starting to try to handcuff her and there's no door handle I. mean they were up against a seasoned killer by this point? The abduction of Durant Utah is now looking for her attempted abductor. Bundy looks for victims in a new killing field trolling ski resorts in Colorado. Where of course he's going to fit in okay, but a VW bug is like the worst vehicle to use at ski resorts in Colorado Yes, but he's GonNa fit right in, and there's people from all different states that come to ski resorts, and he's just gonNA slide right in right under the the you know the radar in March, Nineteen seventy-five. He abducts Karen Campbell from a hotel in Aspen Colorado. Her body is found a month later in February so now March, nineteen, seventy five Bundy abducted and killed a ski instructor named Julie Cunningham from Vail Colorado. was never found. April nineteen seventy five Bundy killed Denise Lynn Oliver Son from Grand Junction Colorado. He said he left her body in the Colorado River, but but she was never recovered, may nineteen seventy five bucks kidnapped and drowned Lynette. Don Culver his youngest victim twelve in a bathtub, then later said he discarded her body in the Snake River and her remains have never been found I. do want to point out that Grand Junction and Vail. The Ski Resorts are several hours away from each other. So he is in his driving. And? He supposed to be in law school at this time and so there notably, he's like missing a lot of school and gets warnings that hey you know you're gonNA fail. My Class I'M NOT GONNA. Let you take the test. And he goes in Chm uses the his law professor, and so he goes back to Utah in between to take these classes Oh. Yeah, he's still. He's still at the university on striving. Yes, he's driving obsessing. He's like a shark so June. Nineteen seventy five, he kidnaps and kills Susan Curtiss Fifteen, and she was at Byu at a youth. Youth conference I mean she's in middle school in July nineteen, seventy five, he abducts and Kills Shelly Robertson from Golden Colorado three days later he abducts and Kills Nancy Barrick from Layton Utah, but on August Sixteenth nineteen seventy five bucks. Luck runs out Utah Police Sergeant Bob Hayward notices. Bundy's Tan nineteen. Sixty eight Volkswagen parked outside of a home at three am and Sergeant Hayward knew there were two young women that live there. When Hayward Approach Bundy took off like a bat out of hell, and of course sergeant hayward gave chase eventually pulling him over and after a brief struggle. He made a chilling discovery while searching that car earlier. You'd asked me about what he does and how he does it. The passenger seat was out of Bundy's car, so it was gone and he's like what's up with your passenger seat and he's like Oh. You know it's broken, so he had removed it completely, and he saw that Bundy, and he did not know this, but his kill kit, which was there which included an icepick handcuffs, a ski mask pantyhose with holes cut for the an is in a mouth. Gloves rich sheet flashlight trash bags I mean it was just like a horrible scene. It's like a serial killers. Yeah, it's as being intricate. It's hard to believe that. The sergeant didn't put those pieces together, or did he well they started to. He brought Bundy in for evading for evading arrest, but he got bailed out the next day, but unable to shake bad experience hayward. Talk to the sheriff who happened to be his brother. Then they talked to detectives who thought Bundy and his VW sounded familiar. And you know they starting to put the pieces together. They reach out to Washington state where they found out. That bundy or Ted was on a shortlist of suspects for murders in Washington, and that the murders had coincidentally stopped when bundy relocated to Utah, so in October, nineteen, seventy-five Bundy was identified in a lineup by Carol garage the one that got away he was arrested and charged with aggravated kidnapping and attempted criminal assault. He was held in Salt Lake County jail, but he gets out of bail and in February thousand, nine, hundred, ninety six. He Kills Debbie Smith and Utah. And here Bundy is in the spotlight for the first time in his trial so up until this point. He's maintaining this double life. Although it's teetering toward, you know his obsessions and he's still in law school. He's still in law school. Yeah, but during this trial for the kidnapping attempt of of garage he comes out and talks the media, and he's like a pompous prince wrongly accused. How do you feel about the justice system based on your? Real I'm sure it works. You've gotTA. Have faith it'll worker lsu deal be reduced to some kind of you. Know Mumbling, idiot I believe it works I believe it needs to be improved when you mentioned improvements. Does that mean ultimately you want to get involved in the criminal justice. Yes I intend to complete my legal education and become a lawyer and Be a damn good lawyer. He's like this preening. Prima, Donna, he's laughing at everyone. He's laughing at the system. He's laughing at the sergeant and everyone who's trying to put him behind bars. He's laughing at his victims. It just to me feels like he is laughing at the entire world, but he's getting away with US fortunately. Bundy insisted on testifying on his own behalf and came across surprise surprise as an arrogant asshole. And, he was convicted of never a truer word, so he was convicted of the kidnapping charge on March, first he was sentenced to a minimum of one to a maximum of fifteen years in Utah State prison, but this was just the beginning as I said before Washington Colorado and Utah were getting on the same page, and the consensus was that Bundy was looking good for all the murders that were going on of young women, but how to prove it. One WAY COMBING THROUGH HIS VW Utah investigators found hairs around the stick shift of the Volkswagen. Of Victims From Colorado and Utah which gave them enough. For them to file charges against him on October. Nineteen seventy six now, this was before DNA though So, how were they able to connect the hair to the victims? Was it just like a type matching was like type matching whatever they had to say. Yeah, this is the wasn't DNA, but it was enough to say yes. Hairs belong to. It was probably that plus other circumstantial. The kill the cat joke. It's probably one of those where they could prove. He was in the area. They could prove. That hair, just kind of was the tipping point of Oh. Yeah, okay, slightly the tipping point, and it was enough for them to file charges on the first degree murder of Karen. Campbell and he was transferred to Colorado. In January nineteen, seventy, seven, Bundy was transferred to Aspen. And remember in the kidnapping case in Utah he had an attorney representing him, but in Colorado. He was assisting in his defense, which gave him access to the law library that was upstairs, and the judge ordered that he was free to use the library, and was not to be shackled or handcuffed. Essentially, he was free to move about, and he escaped in June nineteen, seventy seven. He literally jumped out of the second story window. Of the courthouse. On June Thirteenth Nineteen, seventy seven. Bundy is caught in Aspen. Over the next six months he start losing a bunch of weight, but he scheming again. It's not because he feels guilt for what he's done. He scheming to escape sitting in his jail cell. He realizes that if he removes the ceiling light, and if he loses enough weight, he can actually fit through. So, he makes his way through the crawlspace to the jailer's apartment near his cell, he jumps down into the the apartment. Knowing that the you know, the jailer isn't going to be there. He puts on regular clothes and escapes and had a twelve hour lead before they realized he was in the wind. Talk about all the things that we've talked about before about how he has obsessions. He was wanted to do whatever he wanted to. Because he could have dropped off the face of the earth, but he chose not to do that. He boarded a plane flew to Chicago then he took a train to Ann Arbor Michigan and then for the next leg of the journey he stole a car and drove to Atlanta and then took a bus to Tallahassee Florida. He signed a rental agreement at a building, called the oaks, and began his next reign of terror that he would later refer to as his barbaric state within two months while on the run, he would attack five people murdering three of them. On January Fifteenth Nineteen Seventy eight three M. Bundy, crept inside the Chi Omega. Sorority house near Florida State. He savagely beat and strangled Margaret. Bowman and Lisa lead to death Karen and Chandler and Kathy Kleiner suffered severe injuries after he bludgeoned them while they slept, but they survived on that same day Bundy broke into the apartment. Of Cheryl. Thomas, a student, at Fsu, and he attacked her Bundy took off when her roommate's heard noise and called out to her when she didn't answer, they called police and Thomas survived. The attack but Bundy was in the wind again. On, February. Ninth Nineteen Seventy Eight. He abducts twelve year old Kimberly, Leach from her school in Lake City Florida Leach was one of Bundy's youngest victims. It was his last murder. On February fifteenth, Nineteen Seventy Eight. He is pulled over by the Pensacola police officer sees a man at one thirty, a m driving a stolen Volkswagen in Pensacola. He what he went back to the bus. Ie. Him and the bugs. I. Don't know but obviously. I know it's like one of the. It's like a compulsion. He can't help himself. I mean obviously, but it's funny that that would be one of his compulsions. Yeah, so they take him into. Custody was at Tan. Okay, but for the next two days Bundy refuses to give his name, and they don't know who they're dealing what they have. NO IDEA I mean we're talking. Florida's not whole Mo, they even have fingerprinting at this point, yeah! I think so. Yeah. They're gonNA eventually. Figure out. It's him even if he doesn't yeah, finally he gives his name as Theodore Robert, Bundy and he's probably all like you know just cocky as hell and just thinks he's so great, but in short order the Florida police would find that Bundy. Only a week earlier had been put on there. The FBI's ten most wanted list. And interesting again we see Ted. Bundy's Deatrich in July of nineteen seventy eight when he's in custody and it was just a really weird exchange like bundy comes out of the elevator, and he doesn't have any handcuffs on or anything like that, and he stands like right by the sheriff, as the Sheriff read the indictment and the Chi Omega murders. It's just weird. We Kim with. Invite! Onto Religion, aren't you? Ain't got into. The bond told me that told him you're going to get me. You said he was GonNa get okay you've got the indictment. Is All you'RE GONNA get? Three to go. Theodore Robert Bounding. Charged indictment counts burglary to counts murder in the first degree. Three counts attempted murder in the first degree. Vine intent to affected out the Fed lethally my chance to talk to the press contrary to section seven eighty, two more batch it. I'll plead not guilty right now. Yeah, wow, yeah, it was really bizarre. Wouldn't the sheriff be like? Get him out of here. I think that I think that was everybody's question. Even during that during that time like, why would you why? Why would you do this? I mean it just didn't really make sense, but again so many things about Ted Bundy and what he's allowed to do and gets away with could be also that the sheriff knows Bundy's. GonNa make an ass out of himself and wants the whole world to see this guy for who he truly is. I don't know, I mean th. That's a that's a cop is half full. Yeah, I. Mean I feel like you've probably got game to by Bundy as much as I hate to say it. I don't want to give him any credit, but I mean it just makes them both look like what so Bundy went on trial for two counts of first degree murder. As you heard this time. He's representing himself and this is where it just gets, so we'll for a client. Yeah, and it's it's. It's strange because he's referring to himself in the third person calling himself Mr Bundy. Watching court videos from that time, it's surreal. He's like prancing around court talking to the judge like he's a seasoned lawyer wearing tweed jacket a button down shirt, deep blue. It's a deep blue shirt. The kind with a huge lapels over a white. Seattle Mariner sweater. It's sort of playful. Not I guess to his Washington routes. I mean he's not acting like I mean these are serious crimes that you know or have major consequences. There's the death penalty in Florida. There's not the death penalty in Washington like why he chose to go and. And murder there I mean some have to wonder. Why was earlier? It's his connection with Florida I. Don't know so the other thing that I've been thinking about as you've been. Sharing the information about his behavior is the fact that he did have that degree in psychology. I wonder if there's something to the the idea that if you act like somebody who is guilty of these crimes, you're more likely to be found guilty, whereas if you act like this is so ludicrous. There's no way that I did these things. Maybe people would buy into that. Maybe that's why he was acting so strangely and. flippant about the charges I think it's all with his dynamic that we've seen all along before. If, you, look at that, and there weren't all these heinous crimes that he's now. People are like Yeah I. He could have done I mean for a long time. There's so many people that knew him that were like. There's no way that he did this. Even though they talked about Ted with a with Tan Volkswagen, so many people in Washington new, there's a Ted with Volkswagen. They still couldn't believe that so many Volkswagen's today there was it. It was like his persona was larger than life. Well, another twist in this very twisted case is how many women would flock to the trial addressed to the nines and many dressed as his type. Because by this time he is like a media sensation. Everybody's talking about it. They know that he has a predilection for women with long hair Brown. Hair parted down the middle with hoop earrings, and there's a name for this bizarre phenomenon. It's called. Failure and was interesting here is he ended up proposing to one of his fans Karel? Boone and she came to testify on his behalf as a character witness. So He's says do you WanNa marry me, yes, do I wanNA marry you. Yes, and what is the last question? And he said something and I really do I do really do? WanNa marry. You. Wow, that's so romantic, so even more. Another you know they're not supposed to be able to have sex? According to you know because he is a suspect and it has escaped twice. Yeah, but at some point they end up consummating their marriage, and she conceived a child name Rose Bundy during one of her visitations. How would you like to be that child? I you know what I mean I changed my name. I'm sure she does. I mean what a legacy to give your kid. You want to go on to have your life, but it's like you can't be president. You can't be you know. There's so many things that are preordained I mean they could be. Society wouldn't let them. That's the thing. It's going back to the taboo of it. Your Dad's a serial killer. Could any of that have been passed along to you? Because if there's even a possibility, no one's going to want to have anything to do with you. Yeah, yeah, so it's interesting though I thought you'd like this one of Bundy's attorneys, former attorneys, John, Henry Browne, which yes. Yes so he's a prominent Seattle attorney who briefly worked with Bundy and he described Bundy's folly, and taking the stand as a fatally narcissistic miscalculation in his book the Devil's defender. Quote Ted believed he could lie has way out of anything and could charm. The judge writes Brown. He was wrong so what we were talking about earlier. Why was he doing this? Why was he acting all flippant and like you know leaning into his like? Than Life Personas good boy, next door, kind of thing, good natured guy and I never do these horrible things. Yeah, so in May nineteen, seventy-nine Bundy actually rejected a plea deal that would have allowed him to avoid the death penalty if he admitted to murdering Bowman Levin and Leach. He didn't take it I think he thought that he could get somehow. Get Away with it. On July? Twenty, fourth nineteen seventy-nine, and later in February nineteen, eighty to Florida juries would convict Bundy. Counts of first degree murder and later he was convicted for another first degree charge for murder of the Levy Bowman and leach murders before he was sentence. The judge asked if he wanted to say anything. About asking for mercy. Pr- I find it somewhat. Absurd! Ask Mercy for something I, did not do. So I will be tortured for and will suffer for. And receive a pain for that. But. Share the. He is the victim here. And fortunately he didn't get mercy. Citing this average jury of the crimes and Bundy's callous attitude scored independent of but in agreement with. If I ever sentence rendered by the jury is hereby imposed only. Upon the defendant. Theodore Robert Bunn. Then in a shocking statement, the same judge Edward Coward added this. Young Man, thank you. SAY THAT! It's a tragedy for this to see such a total waste. Humanity that I've experienced in this court year. BRIGHT YOUNG MAN! You may have good lawyer. I'd love to head you. Practice in front of. You want another way. That's disgusting and disturbing and I almost feel like that judge should be disbarred for showing any sense of humanity to somebody who's committed such awful crimes. I understand his way of thinking and why he might have had those thoughts, but it's totally inappropriate to express them out loud especially in a public setting where there's recording happening just so inappropriate so disrespectful to the victims and their families yeah, incredible, well the fact that he even though he'd seen all the evidence in everything had been charmed by Bundy. I mean that's basically what happened there. Even after everything that he'd seen I think the judge may have been a little bit like me where he wants to understand how bunny became this person when he was a smart guy when he was. You know kind of an all American kid. I mean that's where I had to stop you earlier in it because I'm normally like so with you on that like trying to understand why people do what they. They do but in this particular case after getting beginning to end and listening to the cuts and listening and listening in this case, it's more of like. How can we stop this but I don't there was no way of stopping it right? And there's a time and a place for that kind of reflection. The courtroom immediately after he convicted is not the time and or the place every time I hear that. Why would he say that I would love to go back and deal to ask him, but he's probably not around anymore. No probably not okay, so bundy finally starts admitting to stuff trying to save his own neck so while on death row. Bundy gives a series of interviews and he reached out to other serial killers. He wanted to get pen pals. He even contacted I don't know if you'll remember this, but when we did the green. River killer case contacted detective record at the time, who then later became the king? County Sheriff and ultimately caught Gary Ridgway. But anyway he reached out to him and said that he could help him catch the river man like he, you know. Reichert would later describe that he felt like you know Bundy was almost like jealous of the attention that the Green River killer was getting I could also see where he might want to try to get a hold of some of the crime scene evidence, some of the pictures and things so that he could live vicariously through this person who was still going out committing crimes murders very similar to what? What he would do, but one of the things that was interesting that he he really recommended that the King County Sheriff's office stakeout one of the places where they found the bodies, because he was sure that ridgway would go back or the Green River killer, because they didn't know who it was at the time would go back and gauge Necrophilia, and it's interesting because during that time when he's trying to bargain for his life and talking to different investigators, and he explains the necrophilia part which he engaged in. Bed the next day because those three days later to do that the business. About there. was sort of a crude attempt to disguise identity densification of the remains such I don't know what it wasn't. Retrospect it doesn't it sounds pretty incoherent, but that's. Motivating you. and then. Maybe about a week to two weeks later went bad for. Again just to see what was going on. But of course after you know in June after a week, it's you know what with all the local. Wildlife, there's not much. Left. You know a lot of psychological stuff going on here that we just don't have time for I. Mean we just different days explaining? This is why I am so keen on the sticking out of crime scenes this type. Fascination with the. Sea wouldn't come right out and say what he was doing to the bodies. He has to control how he shares it the. Right, now I know it over going back after a week or more after this person's been murdered, left out in the wild, who knows what animals have come along and take bits and pieces. I just it's shocking to me that he would still be interested in wanting to go back to the crime scene because I'm sure it happened more than once that he did this Oh. Yeah, so he knew going in what it would look like, and he still wanted to go back and be a part of that. Yeah, it's just it's mind blowing me. Yeah I mean I. think that that's why he wants to control it because he knows that nobody's going to really understand except for someone like a ridgeway. You know and that's why he can tell some of it to get attention. You know he's got. He's GonNa talk a little bit to keep people interested in him and you know he doesn't want to confess to these things. It's a way to try to get him off the hook of this upcoming. He's in Florida, but he's trying to save his neck, so he starts talking more. January twenty first nineteen eighty-nine over the course of several days, Bundy confesses to multiple agents from different agencies. He tells the FBI agent Bill Hag Meyer. He's killed thirty people in California Oregon Washington Idaho, Utah, Colorado, and Florida between nineteen, seventy, three in one, thousand, nine, hundred, seventy eight, but by you know January twenty third. It's not changing the course that's already happening. He's had a couple of stays of execution, which bought him a little bit more time, but time has has run out in his last interview the night before his. His execution, he spoke with Doctor James Dobson and is going all out for a Hail Mary, because you got to remember, two of the stays of execution happened, one was fifteen hours before, and the other was like seven hours, so he's really still not doing this for the victims. He's still doing this. I mean from from my point of view himself. He's still thinks he's got a shot down another stay, so he doesn't. He says he doesn't want to die, but pornography was a factor in what made him what he was. Trying to tell you is honestly as I know how what happened think. This, is a message to get across, but as a young. A young boy and I mean the boy of. Twelve or thirteen certainly. That I encountered outside the home again In. The local grocery store or the local? Drugstore the softcore pornography. What people call softcore? but as I think I, explained to you last night, thought adoption. An anecdote is young boys. Do we explore the? The back roads and sideways and byways of our neighborhood, and oftentimes people don't. The garbage in whatever they're cleaning out of their house and Fontana time we come across, so he's like we. He's like normalising it. Who comes across pornographic books and they were looking for l., but even if you're looking for it, it's. Just dump on the side of the road. Apparently, he had a neighbor things I did lieutenant magazines. More involved violence. Yes, yes, and I and this is something I. Think I want to emphasize the the the the most damaging. Kinds of pornography in my again. I'm talking from personal experience. hard real personal experience. Most damaging kinds of pornography are those that involve violence in sexual violence. Because the wedding, those two forces as an Italian, though only too well brings up behavior that is just. Is just. Too. Terrible to describe, now walk me through that. What was going on in your mind at that thought okay before we go any further I think it's important to me. and. The people people believe what I'm saying to tell you that that I'm not blaming. Pornography and not saying that it caused me to go out and do certain things and I take certain things if whatever I've done. Not The question here. The question and and and the issue is how this kind of literature contributed and helped mold and shape the kinds of violent behavior. Feel you're. In the beginning at fuels, this kind of Thought, process then. At a certain time, it's instrumental in what I would say. Crystallizing it making into something, which is almost like a separate entity inside. And that that point you're Virgil I was at the verge of acting out on this on this kind of. These kinds of really won't understand that. You had gone about as far as you could go in your own fantasy life with printed material. And you made or printed and video or Film. Is What happened? And and then there was the urge to take that little step or big step over to physical. Happens it happened in stages gradually. It doesn't necessarily not to me at least happened overnight my experience with. A say pornography generally, but with pornography the deals on a violent level with sexuality. is it. Once, you become addicted to it and I look at this kind of addiction. Like other kinds of addiction of addiction, you keep I would keep looking for. More potent more explicit most Greg. Of Material like an addiction, he craving something, which is harder, okay? Can we just be done? Can't even listen to him anymore. It's so ridiculous. He is basically. Picking and choosing things from psychology, textbook, and molding them to his situation to try and convince psychiatrists psychologists that will certainly. Hit on the head and that's really. Why wanted these longer cuts because? You can see where he loses it, and that protective coding, or whatever of him controlling the narrative, trying to sound like he's intelligent trying to woo the person he's talking to. And, it's like a part of that toxic manipulation that he was so well known for he's still manipulating. The other thing I noticed is that he is trying to compartmentalize the part of his personality who is D- that deviant as not really being him, not really who he truly is ask this deviant part of his personality that is is like separate, so I can see his thought process of will. You can't kill me. I didn't really do this. It's this deviant side of me that I don't really like that. I wish I didn't have that. I want to get rid of. Please help me get. In the earlier cut where he was draw describing Hawkins how he went about murdering her. He describes it as being a fever. Wasn't he's a few state. He's not in the driver's seat. I absolutely is in the driver's seat. So as you can imagine outside the Florida prison were bundy would be executed. There was a huge huge media present detailing the execution from outside the prison. Step by step. What was happening when people showed up, they signed a release war. You know a release form and eighty. You got into the van. We're driven the whole. Have you done that knows a reporter know-how? Yeah. Who can you know which terrible is I? Don't even remember who it was. I'm sure you blocked it out. Probably I was working as a reporter in Colorado Okay and went to. You know one of their maximum security prisons where there was an execution happening in was part of that media. Will that just kind of is right outside as the execution is taking place? It's a bizarre feeling like we're sitting here waiting for someone to die. Yeah, and here is they were coming out. You know they'd have people from the prison coming out talking about you know the next step you know his last meal, I? Don't think he even eight I don't i. don't know what he ordered, but he did whatever it was. He didn't eat it. But this is them talking about prepping for the execution. Be Correctional officers with them right now there'll be preparing him for execution. They should begin shaving his head, and so forth within a few minutes. It's really Modlin it's very procedural. That's that's the way they delivered it in. My experience was just very procedural, because he can't get into the emotion it the humanization of the person who is being. The crowds that were out there. They were not I mean if he was out there. They ripped him to shreds the thousands of people, but on January twenty fourth nineteen eighty-nine he was executed in the electric chair, known as Old Sparky at seven sixteen am. Cheers erupted from most of the crowd. Win The when the announcement was made. To my family and friends that was it and then they put a black hood or black Put over his head, avail and He was electrocuted off to your left. You could see hooded executioner. You can only see. The is little slit in the wall on the left hand side of the room and you just see the eyes peering out, and the a nod is given to the executioner, and he's executed his speaking kind of Lurch back in his chair, his fiscal went back like that seemed maybe they gave him two thousand volts for a minute, or so, and as the crowd roared its approval Ted Bundy, and the people who waited so long to see him dead, said their final goodbyes. I mean there are people out there with like frying pans and I didn't get it and I'm like Oh frying like. Big I was like no. Frying Pan have you heard the story about old sparky. When I heard, it sounded so familiar, and that's why included in there, but what do down Let's just say it wasn't the best piece of women always work properly. Yes, there were times people had to be electrocuted multiple times, and I believe there were some times wearing even accidentally sent sparks out yet. On Fire Yeah I caught fire and hit some of the employees who were there, so it got its nickname for a recent so I. Love the fact that you know he had to go. That was the perfect way for him to go right so Bundy was forty two. And he was gone obviously, but his evil deeds, and the effects on the family's lives on I included this cut, because it's from Bundy's former law professor at the University of Utah and he shared his experience of meeting he in this interview, he would say oh well, students would always come up to me during one his law lessons and say hey. Wasn't Ted Bundy. After one of these experiences where he talked about you know what it was like having. Ted Bundy as a student. After everybody left the classroom, a student came up to him, and who said that his sister was a victim of Ted Bundy! Somber look on his face, and he said that one of the victims was evidently his sister she had disappeared. During the time young women disappearing and that evidently Ted Bundy had killed her. Her body was never found course I sympathize straightly with him and I ask you. Do you ever get over a thing like that and he's known my family still. Is Very much disturbed by the fact, not only that she's gone, but that we. Could never find her body the victims. Feel these things for many years after. That happens I'm very sympathetic to them. So, there's no knowing just how many women Bundy murdered on the night before his execution, he admitted that his total might reach into triple digits. He reportedly replied. At one digit to that and you'll have it. was He being sarcastic or did he mean thirty seven murders? Or did he mean a hundred and thirty six murders? Or did he mean three hundred sixty murders? That's an rule I think. She's reading from her book. And did those murders include poor, precious and Marie Maribor. Her mother wrote a letter to Bundy three years before he was executed, just begging for an answer, did he? Did he kill? Her daughter! Dear Ted. On August thirty, first nineteen, sixty one just before school was to start for you and our children. There came a black rainy night with lots of the heavy winds. You were fifteen and had been wandering the streets late at night and peeping in windows and taking cars. I feel your first murder was our Ann Marie Burr? The bench from the backyard was used to climb in the living room. The orchard next door was dark setting for a murder. What did you do with the tiny body? God can forgive you with all appeals likely to be refused and soon there is nothing left for you in this world. There can still be everything good for you in the next. Your life started wrong somewhere. When you were very young, there had to be a lot of bad things. Happen to make you have your strong feelings of Patriot. I came close to ruining my life because of my cruel actions, and feeling no sorrow about them, a lot of strange circumstances brought help to me or I would not have found myself even though I knew I needed help. And my actions were getting out of control. You should have received that same help when you needed it. God can still give the help to you. If you can gather together any strength, you have left and try to feel a real sorrow inside for the horrors. You have brought so many. You will face these scorer alone if there's no chance to be with God after you die. You have nothing more to lose in this world by explaining your sickness, you will feel sorrow and gain everything in the next life, as God promised you and all of us. Please? Try. There isn't much time. I am deeply sorry. You did not get help when you needed it. I have not written until now because the end of life for you did not seem near until now. Will you right back to me regarding Anne Marie? And his response was just so. He responded though I'm a little bit surprised that he even did that much. Quote again and finally I did not abduct your daughter I had nothing to do with her disappearance. But, he also told investigators when questioned about burs, disappearance that that he wouldn't hurt a little girl and denied involvement in nineteen eighty-seven. Bundy confided to law enforcement that there were some murders that he would never talk about because they were committed to close to home to close to family or involved victims who were very young burs. Disappearance matched all three of these categories. Bundy was never arrested or charged with any of his Washington Oregon Colorado or Utah murders, but because of its coma cold case detective working the Ann Marie Burr case his DNA got put into the system. It wasn't even in this system and so cloyd kind of talks about how that amazing facts came to light. It's not in the state of Washington Data Bank, because he was never convicted of a felony and say to Washington even though. He confessed all these murders it. It's just a glitch in the law that that he was formally charged with the murder in Washington, so they couldn't put it in watching quotas data bank, but Lindsay when she was working for Tacoma PD because she was looking into the emery case, she contacted Florida the prison where he was executed, and if they had blood samples or something, and they did, they had a card or something. With his blood on it, so she asked them if they could have it submitted for DNA, they did, and so it's in the national data bank now, but which is good work on her. Because otherwise he would not be in any COTA system if it wasn't for that. I find it incredible that he was never brought to justice for the crimes. He committed here in Washington. State though I, know I mean that that's where it all started. That's where so many of his victims were left and I understand that he was already looking at the death penalty in Florida, but so often when there are cases that cross state boundaries, they will still prosecute because they want the families of the victims here to get their day in court to have justice served, and it's just really sad that that never happened while I know and that he wasn't even put his DNA wasn't. Wasn't even put into the KOTAS when technology caught up to like. Hey, we can find out what happened with these other murders. One thing though that is really interesting speaking of DNA I asked Cloyd because you and I always love talking about this. If in the future we would be able to tell if there's a psychopath marker hard question to answer because there's a big argument. Is it nature or nurture right so I mean if it's if it's nature, then, yes, if it's nurture than no, but they've. They're doing a lot of study right now about psychopaths and trying to detect psychopathic personalities. A friend of mine, WHO's a Canadian is criminologist and he was doing a study on certain personality traits that show up in psychopaths, and so he did all these different studies on these different groups of known psychopaths I know not to be psychopaths and one of his assistants. who was doing the analyzing said. What do you think of this guy and they have some kind of chart you? That's definitely psychopath. He goes. That's you. What so he had all the psychopath markers, but he wasn't a psychopathic oh. Maybe you starts out with a propensity, but there has to be that little. Push to make you become a psychopath, so that really amazed him and I thought was fascinating, too, but you know the thing about DNA. It's advanced more than two years in the previous twenty. So who knows yes? Yes, yes, and I love the way he put that you. You have a propensity, but it takes something to push you over the edge. Breed actually become a psychopath, and I wonder about the incest part of it now that we have his DNA, it's in the database. Have they thought about looking up or does it even say a daily matter? It was cleared with all ready to do. It's just that the the the one funding the test because I'm sure these are really expensive tests. And they decided to go a different route that whatever show they were putting together. Because as we know so often, the victims get the shaft, which is why I wanted to really include all the names of the victims that I. could because the serial killers are the ones that we talk about them and the victims get forgotton anyway I think that that particular series that he was working on? They decided to talk about the victims, and so they didn't. Didn't pursue that, but yeah I mean it's totally available to do. And he was employed was ready to do it. They just didn't want to find somebody with deep pockets. I'm really curious and I know the state's not going to they with the bill for that data Bain and honestly I get it. What's the point right like? It doesn't really change the outcome of. Of the case at this point, and plus you know budgets are super tight right now, so I wouldn't expect any kind of agency to put money into doing any kind of testing on that DNA at this point, but man if there was somebody out there who has deep pockets. He's think about all the different. The FBI behavioral unit all the data that they collect. Collect! It just goes to reason that they would. This would be one of the things that they'd want to find out like one of the most prolific horrible serial killers and our nation's history. Yeah, was there incest? What? What's his background? You know that's not just one factor, but like yeah, it'd be interesting to know and as Cloyd said he's not the first one. Cloyd said that I. Don't know if you caught that in the interview. He's not the first one meaning like. One to have been a product of incest turned serial killer. Yeah, I think that's I. Don't know if that he kinda referred to, and I just didn't go there, but I think that call cloyd back. Another. Excuse to call. Our favorite. Take any excuse. We can get all right. So what's up for next week? Imagine finding out that the man you going. GonNa marry was wanted for murder. Not just anymore, but a heinous despicable, disgusting violent crime. That doesn't sound anything like the man that you know. We'll find out how that one ends next week. And don't forget to check out the crime podcast dot com to get more information on all of the stories that we share with you, photos, links and lots more I'm Caroline Soriano with Kim. Shepard and this is the scene of the crime.

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... And Chill! on Siren Radio: Episode 61 - Emma Jade

OC Talk Radio

1:50:05 hr | 2 years ago

... And Chill! on Siren Radio: Episode 61 - Emma Jade

"Your baby girl you've been practicing. You're digest for weeks and now she looks up and begins to her very first words. This is the moment you've been waiting for. It's time to visit your authorized mercedes-benz dealer and test drive the all-new with the first era the Mercedes Benz user experience and optional third row seating for your whole family smart Mama Smart Dada visit Mbusa.com/gle to learn more per sadi's Benz the best or nothing described is optional walk on your Monday evening. Thank you for joining us Muslims Valentine. This is an chill and we're here until midnight but I am not alone in the siren studio this evening. I've got to wonderful guests and I'm going to introduce you to the first of now. Her name is Emma Jade. How're you doing great thank you? I'm doing great. Thank you and you are here tonight for people who don't know about Emma Jade Euro country music singer they perform all across the U._k.. You've got a few gigs coming up in Lincolnshire very important one coming up on the twenty third of March but we'll talk about that Moore as the show goes on and you're going to be performing live in the studio I tonight hi indeed I am so how'd you find it when you've because you'll from doncaster how'd you find crossing the border over here to Lincolnshire. I mean it's fun. It's played here on Friday night. was that in Lincolnshire. I'm not very good at geography define and it was fun and yeah. It's just like being home so so it's good it's currently eight minutes past ten. You have mentioned that this is normally the time where you settling down for bed. Oh no I'm usually asleep well. We will talk more about <hes> the GIG that you've got coming up very very soon but I think he's time that we listen to your first song of the evening. Give the listeners attest of what Emma Jade is all about so the first song is called. Only you do has ever story behind it yeah so this one <hes> back in Nashville in I think it was I was at the end of October the beginner November and and I guess it was just one of those songs why is very tough <hes> being on the road all the time and <hes> like relationships at tough when you're on the road especially when you're like some of my age and <hes> I think had just been hearing it more more <hes> a lot of relationships and my friends of breaking up and I can out because because they were on the road all all the time so I guess this son came from so yeah. Let's take a listen Emma jade with only you live on siren radio <music> <music> Lebanon's ruined Nah <music> through that kid lab umbrella ooh Eh changing you haven't and only <unk> you having cam our whole birds sma down Jay ooh eight <music>. Can Shy a whole foods thank you you sit down <hes> leave this la Oh siren radio fresh sound Lincoln and jade that with only you you're listening to who siren radio going to be hearing all from Amer in a couple of minutes time but up next it's Miranda Lambert with all kinds of kinds stay tuned to siren radio GNAT who went and family with that ratio the human-cannonball wedding the big cocktail with Barker's clams and then spat show family oddities joe is the Tattoo Lady was crying beginning to keep the many eggs ought to tie. She's from waiver Tom to Danny to keep the world's this guitar children's show smokey Joe's attack a brag and think about stood on never dared not talk to the trash population son. You can't go linger if they there the beginning to keep the world spending take Saul Oh gains again. Oh Miranda Lambert's you're listening to Siren Radio Sixty minutes past ten on your Monday evening what sitting back relaxing chilling out celebrating the fact that Monday is almost over and choose Tuesday is on its way of still up Emma Jade in the studio with me a you enjoying your time on the show so farmer picking some good songs so yeah your fun of Miranda Lambert Dake Fan really big fan awesome stuff and we have resident guests to the show. It seems Mr Ian Whole you may have heard him last week. How you doing very well thanks? I'm doing great. Thank you and we heard you last week as you were here with always stevie Stevie O'Connor talking about the showcase of British country music which is coming to the -Tario toll theatre later this month and it's not just stevie this on the lineup as Emma. We'll be there as well and we'll be there as well. Yes I was going to play us of acoustic songs so that will be really nice for people to come in here in that environment actually because a lot of Emma songs very delicate delivery and us very loaded with meaning and it's not always as easy to hear those types of songs in pops and clips and things like that so the fits is a great place to see him play and people are getting a good teaser of that this evening really good which is awesome awesome now Emma you were actually usually willing award about two weeks ago. Didn't you did yeah I learned. Is it ever won an award the best you ep yet about thousand gals award which are really established back country music everything on on yeah. We're really good friends actually with bells and galvanize not why make we'll kill me no so I wanna say thanks to nick. Actually he's really supportive is a huge champion of country country music in the U._K.. Is Huge Champion of women in music in general what we need absolutely yeah and he just lost a great works. People should should should check out his facebook page and give a light can find out ways to because there's lots of great female artists the champions am was at the top of that pile for U._k.. EP so that's great that's awesome and I know we've got a lot of country music fans listening in this evening but people who may be the casual music fan may have recognized your voice and your name before as you appeared a couple years ago on the voice U._K.. He added as it was a long time ago but it happened yeah. It was like two thousand fifteen monagas through to you. Tom Jones's tea and same. Tom Yeah Team Tom. We made some we made some good music and I was going to say like I know you've probably had this over the last couple years law in like interviews and chanceless but what was that experience like being on because you eighteen at the time I was really young. I'm being online at a huge T._v.. Show was adulting experience. Yeah it was tough. It was I I they had personally had a really great time. I was very young though so the toughest part of it I think was the media aspect and I think the hardest thing for young artists and female female artists especially is them like the whole the whole media thing like media really really comfortable you and I I had a really tough time with the media book. I had a great time on the show. I made some really good music and some lifelong friends and I would stand with Tom Jones so no love eighteen year olds can say so. We've got friends on the voice. The shares all right now. Remember Yeah Yeah I mean I'm somebody so we all looking forward to the GEE showcase of British country music come into the Terry O'Toole theater just down the road on Saturday the twenty third of March and you'll be able to hear Emma along with Stevie and care amac performing some amazing songs including possibly this next one yeah probably which is called. This one is called stole. Morning is the story behind it. <hes> yeah yeah so this one <hes> this is on the EP that I just released the I won the award for the piece called <hes> older now <hes> and the whole ep was about a certain time in my ally and this one I wrote about <hes>. I guess I thought I thought that I was getting cheated on a no of so so that's what it was about and it's just a typical country music song really. Let's take a listen storm warning by Emma Jade live on siren radio. They took it shine some hartill risen my pillow Smith so about a million times and you ran full founded <music>. Who is the WHO've cash she? She didn't know the Ghana this comes <music> <music> <music> <music> <music> me feel than every since serve as <music> and <hes> Tom Shoes John bitchy and the only one anju unpredictable just lack loaded gun so he'll legacy <music> <music> skid the <music> siren radio arms proud jade will be back on siren radio after a little bit of Tom Jones and the stereo phony x. what some whispering into water should not what's all tracy questions. They're asking this. Is that good ever don't turn <music>. It's not the window shopping from the smell and the cigarette slow scammy half to death over the window. Well let me chats right. Radio lasted looking at my past that I've seen so many things <music> sir. You're listening to you siren radio. I've still got Emma Jade and in hole in the studio with me Emma we're talking before about when we were planning about what we're going to chat about on the show and still you said that you really liked cats and you could talk about Casper go unless you have a cat ought to cats while they called Benjamin umbrella. I know my girlfriend is going to be listening to this going. Oh I love her so much more now. Just the best best thing in the world is just a cow do you you go more of a cat person than adult person yes. Oh we might differentiate amass slightly me like I love all creatures in the entire world spiders. Maybe like not so the March the best creatures thing she was actually nearly late for Gig on she got distracted by count in the cow on road and I said that 'cause going to get run over if we don't go back and get it and then my friend said you can't just take the cap I think it probably belongs to somebody writes on key. I've decided to ex girlfriend saying Oh cat now. This is quality see radio. Come and tell you when I drove back from the Gig the cat the cat was there again as the cat was and there's a cow just that maybe but I mean having account apoe as opposed to a dog is actually grit for you as a musician because you know when you're out in about onto going going and doing gigs you can leave them and you go. You've gone all across the U._K.. Yeah the U._K.. Everywhere in Nashville Nashville Nashville yes that like to ask you Nashville Fun. It's so nice little place to like. I don't really play shows that but I get get involved in riot is nice if there are around and and Yeah Nash Nashville's Gray. It's like my we call it. We call it home. I call it home yeah as a country singer. I'm sure that's that's a place that so you you you want to go yeah. That's that's sort of my dream right that to be to just end up there and that's why I think a lot of my friends are that's where I get my inspiration. I don't get inspiration when I'm here in the U._k.. So <hes> so yeah what was the May when was that you decided that country was the genre that you wanted to go down a didn't really they have that like country music moment. I think a lot of people the thing about this sean recently in the past few years most than before is that I think people have seen it as a quick money-making scam and that gets really sad to me because obviously this is something I do because I love it and I kind of fell into it because I realized that that's how my voice fell <hes> nothing about the way that I saying the music that I make his aunt soul. It's all just exactly how it happened and I think that's why managed to write music. This <hes> comes from the Hawk and I think it just happened my daddy's to listen to Johnny cash and I remember when I was a kid MEMISA. Listen to Shania Twain and yeah I just it happened a thing of an email kid in school and I used to to have role Avena law and I had Levin Singer cover of you a mind by the dixie chicks decided did joining cover it myself in that so that's how it happened and then yeah so I just saw fell into panther this is doing. I get it now awesome where we still got two more songs to hear from you tonight so let's get into the next one. It's cold get to leaving is their story. Behind this one I'm asking you this because I've loved the story so this story. There's always a story behind every single arrow. I'm I'm one of these people were I can't I can't write a song that's not real so a lot of the some Zor about same person of untold by Stevie Contin name so this next one it was kind of written about going on from stole morning at the I saw a new keen on me and then with get to leave in it was still if the okay cool and I know I know about this now so so you WanNa do then I'll sealy of time for it so so yeah we I wrote this song in Nashville as well. Let's take a listen. You're listening to Siren Siren radio. It's ten thirty four on your Monday evening and this is get to leaving by Emma. Jade live on siren sit down. How can talk about your shoes onto anyway? Evans says it's just me and you know that you're trying to truth. <music> LANC- this comes lack and say the stranger in your Sneha <music> if if view <hes> let's take we can shoot was gone. Uh No chew don't even just sounds crazy. This covers PLA- sees he'll and <music> that you ben if you eh <music> of how could you free <music> leave then she <music> she louise <unk> so if you thank God now Siren Radio the <hes> music he love Liz big records about an already heady Gal by the name of Joe Joel Joel. Please don't take combs. It's beyond compared with flaming Lopes of Auburn hair with every skin your smile spraying you let summer rain gene talks to sweep game winning. Call Sir can easily understand how you can easily take what it means to me. Lean of you. Don't in your choice of men. I couldn't no Cassini use the the only one stung winning depends on you mm-hmm. It's just too Joe Lean by Deli Kelly parts and you're listening to siren radio. I'm personally I'm having a great time here this evening with Emma Jade and in whole I hope you guys are in June. As much as I am great. You're going to break into song them when he said No. People people people have heard me singing this thing. I think that's you know I think we'll leave it to you to the big reason why they're this evening evening is to talk about the M._G.. Showcase of British country music which is coming to the -Tario toll on the twenty third of March any final bits of promotion that you want to do for it we career until I was GonNa say twenty seconds much. Can I ask you a bit about care Amac because <hes> you know we've heard from stevie with heard from Emma Care Amax story so carries stories from stoke she is we'll. We'll forgive very very toll very. He's like a giant prepare yes. She's she's been Ram music for for a long time. She's been graduate so she's kind of gone. Through that city diller degree in kind of professional musicianship and songwriting she spent a little bit time on some cruise ships as a lot musicians due to break their way in and <hes> yeah care is found a way into country music. She's got together with our kind of in housebound. If you like so we've put together some musicians and she's she's going to play some of our original material and some fairly well known co aversions so there's a really nice mix Serta so we've got Amer. He's very soulful. We've got stevie is really kind of as you heard last week. Very honky-tonk very bluegrass and and care is an hour and out rupp chick. He's going to be a cool an awesome night and welcome people get tickets. You can find us on facebook so you can find him H._M._G.. On facebook and we've got details on there you could of course called the Fisa boxoffice directly so you can Russia's guys on a one five to two eight three to one for tickets awesome stuff now Emma your final song of this evening you very much looking forward to it. They call them. What's your story for behind it so this is called a losing sleep now? This song is only p. and is not suitable suitable for sensitive ears but I'm GonNa make P._G.. She's trying to general through gritted. I'm GonNa Make P._G.. But yeah it some. This is basically a I think I wouldn't I went through a time in my life. All EP is called old now for that exact reason I went through a very like growing time. Guess and I used to be the history timid and shy of little girl and Ian will tell you that I'm definitely no. I'm very very outspoken and very late to stand up for I believe in a strong views I have very strong views but a lot other views are like regarding like women mm-hmm and music and B. M. definitely one for standing for myself and our this song because I kind of been through its situation with somebody. Buddy who I kinda just let walk over me and it was that the sort of sparked this whole change and this like growth so <hes> our son called eight Lewiston sleep sleep because I still kinda done with this person for it so why we start about the situation so yeah so I'm going to sing. It and it's GonNa be P._G.. A._G.. But if you WANNA hear the real vision you can find me on social media and you can download the listen losing sleep by Emma Jade live on siren radio <music> <music>. I shouldn't kiss you is long in the kid assets so <hes> so you're said you know few relax wrong. The thought you he strong Zoe no Ooh do your said no Ta uh they used insurance so <hes> watch you used choose would ask say then set me free you <hes> give me and the used was in those Eh watch you <music> <music> notes <music> Luzon's Judy Siren radio seven point three that was ain't losing sleep by Emma Jade live on siren radio is been a pleasure to have you in the studio this evening and I hope you enjoyed your appearance as much as our listeners at home have enjoyed it a lot. Thank you very much. Where can people find out more about you and your U._K.? EP of the year two thousand eighteen older now you can find me on all social media's Instagram at the facebook and it was just Ama- jade music music you can find me on the <hes> on my labels page on the page <hes> and you can download the on cheers <hes> spotify. You can buy hot copy. I'll sign unit. I'll send it to you can buy that on my social media's those links to the page on that so yeah awesome Steph and Ian where can people find out more details about the coming showcase you can find that on social media as as well so few have a check on facebook if you just pay no major. I'm Jay on their. You'll find our page. It's also quite well publicized on the -Tario tool theater page and website as well so we had a nice post inmates to actually actually so I saw the picture out to Anna who made a fantastic posters so yeah that will be getting plus around that. You'll be out of that on on social media as well. Thank you very much for joining me. This evening goes and we have a really safe journey home. BACTERIA CATS too bad. You're listening to siren radio. It's almost eleven o'clock of got a couple of songs to sake as up to the news ats eleven. Let's take a listen to this one by local artist holy star WHO's coming up on the show in a couple of weeks time this is the tree stay tuned to Siren Radio and again and talk about so we would says and the rest is his day you lift you sat in my heart's out and ours his own ca spe <music> the the true true true true Sir two listen race but I'll think of this cabbies the truth even again next but Austin him so bad zoo musk you yeah <music> uh-huh <music> online mobile. This is Byron Radio Lincoln Siren Radio. He'll magnitude siren radio. It's just gone eleven o'clock word back from be scully News Center. We've said goodbye by two image aid now some to sit back and relax. She'll aren't we may for fix. This is female of the species by space phasing amazing and on them shop shot aw it all back ladder on the Hugh Jag on that cleanly seal Eh. uh-huh fall space female of the species yield listening to Siren Radio just gone eleven o'clock on your Monday evening were celebrating celebrate. The fact that Monday is almost over and choose day. He's on its way and hopefully the rest of the weeks going to be that little bit nicer for you. How are you how you doing? Are you tired. My show Ram <hes> <hes> I have had a very very busy week seems this week only GonNa get busier. I'm working a lot of the next seven days. I'm sure many many of my <hes> Retail Warrior friends out there listening will be to those who maybe not radically listeners to the show when I'm not gracing your airwaves on a Monday evening. I'm working five hours. A week in a local coffee shop on Lincoln couldn't highstreet retail trade chain. I should say but he's one of the joys of this job is in our for for two hours every Monday night. I get to relax with the rest of you and into think about the <hes> the depressing week ahead. Let's say but now he's really. I'm really glad that evolved join me tonight. Emma jade was absolutely fantastic in the first hour you can find out more about her on on US social media pages and by going to the showcase on the twenty third of March now. I've got lots of relaxing Choon S- for you of the next fifty five minutes also <hes> some artists that you've heard on the show before some that's <hes> I've never played before and even the U._k.. Number one single at the moment that was announced on Friday night a crack in June but that's all to come this next Nick Song was requested by Ryan from Lincoln. He got in touch and said he'd heard this one on an advert earlier this week and fell in the actual full song when you when you do listen to the entirety hierarchy of the track really well for the show so let's take a listen. This is Mark Brown featuring Sarah Cracknell. The journey continues if you can recognize what this comes from and still common just leaves me big end yeah. Thank you mm-hmm. Hello Take the journey continues Mark Brown Sarah Eric Cracknell. You're listening to siren radio. This is an chill wrangling touch said that he's been listening to this song after discovering the entire track how ever you may recognize parts of it's from <music> a classic T._v. and for which goes PAC twelve years than that makes me feel old because that song there was used in an advert twelve years ago for the first time foot foot Lloyd's T. S. B.. Can you believe it. They were Lloyd's T._S._p.. Back then kids. If you're listening you might not remember that those were actually two separate bags. I remember when they split up because I was part of that and I'm Brian got sent to one bank modesto sent to the warm and he was just so many people I mean no one wants to be with one particular bank of them. I'm not going to say which because I don't want to get done for slander. I remember that you could swap and change. It was such a mess but before I get into any more trouble that we could have done. I went emma dearly was passing her ain't losing sleep track and trying not to swear then nine we should move on with the show lots of great chill-out tracks full you this evening including this next one which only I've chosen because I played the artist on last week after saying that I don't see them at the Blue Room here in Lincoln and a discovered the band for the very first time and a plane one of their songs. <hes> and I said I was like really I was like all these guys are great. I've been listening to them. This is an awesome suddenly only to listen to and he's east got a good response from people listen at home so thank you for that and that's why I wanNA play you another one of that tracks <hes> this is the captain of the lost waves chiefs and can you believe that it is now the fourth of March today the fourth of March it still feels like the beginning of the feels like this year was just come so quickly or ready were already a third of the inner not quite third neely a third of the way into the year and that is absolutely crazy <hes> but these next track back. He's all about the first month of the I'm really not building out very well. I realized that checks of the first month of the year is called January. Stay tuned to Siren Radio Choose Myself. I'm the month say the most <music> they call me and you. I'm the Monday it seems off. I'm announced with disdain St Monday brings nothing so just still the all the way through through mall <music> simply imply it is sayings wings. Y precarious July August which is constantly sned may drugs and December's also <music>. I'm sure strong AIDS the Oh aw <music> feed to why wouldn't you on such you hide their fame every bond screaming. No one wants to say you confers that I'm not the one on entrusting would anyone can use <music> uh-huh aw January by captain of the lost waves comes from that two thousand and nineteen album that latest release synthesis which is available where all good music can be found. I'M NOT GONNA lie to you and sit along but these past week especially I have been completely marking out for them of the last few days listening to as many of their tracks as possible district constant loop. I was really really tempted to play this track for spotify missed many men which you can find by looking at their spotify page. It's twenty eight minutes long. I believe I'm just checking twenty eight minutes thirty five seconds so I don't think quite got away with that one but January's just really nice track as well and if you get the chance to go see them live now. They're in Hong Castle in a couple of weeks time maybe next month you can find out more on their facebook page canton of the lost waves but whilst have been planning full today show Oh you know I don't spend time looking for the music speaking to the artis researching the artists. That's going to be on the this evening but I also try and look at what's been going on in the world today in history because sometimes you know some fun stories can come up which inspired tracks thus I can play on the air and I'm telling you what the fourth of January in history will not go down as a very historic day. Sometimes I'll look through and I go oh. Oh that's a really really interesting story but he's not exactly you know chill-out material but even today there was not even a war was started on the fourth of March. It seems like every time I research they show war started somewhere in history but alas that has not been the case there was warn historical occurrence which happened on the fourth of March though and that was that John Lennon tend around and made the quote that the Beatles were bigger than Jesus. The Beatles were more popular than Jesus. Can you disagree at the end of the talent. I miss so let's listen to a bit of the Beatles knows GonNa Complain it. That's what going across the universe stay tuned to siren radio fly into this will last this way across the unit waves of joy drifting shifting through the same <music> shine is GonNa the Change Alive which Don's faithful our committee is calming Karaz stay inside also loved made their way <music> gene the two shades Komo news inciting riots in which around me <music> Sons Change Change Junior U.. P. Souls <music> a cross the universe you're listening to Siren Radio Twenty five past eleven wow time is flying aware with us this evening gentlemen and I mentioned have the Beatles <hes> <hes> because he's in so many years since on this day of the fourth of March that John Lennon would proclaim that Beatles were more popular than Jesus and I mentioned the there's a lot of things the that wasn't motion news that happened on this day in history. Now I do want to just do want to bring up the fact that the today we have had to very very sad. New Stories Stories <hes> coming up on the news today <hes> the I was the earlier this morning the news broke the prodigies key flint's died at the age of forty nine. Now the hasn't been much news yet on how this took place however he was found his home in Essex so <hes> if you haven't heard that news yet nice that the prodigies Keith Flint passed away earlier today at the age of forty nine and then fine <hes> just a couple of hours ago the news broke this <hes> actor from nine to one Oh and Riverdale wait chose talking to him Ajay about earlier. She was saying that Riverdale one of her favourite T._v.. Shows Luke Perry sadly passed away at the edge of fifty two. He was found at his home in California after suffering a stroke so to really massive new stories from the entertainment industry there too massive losses to their field wants that will be greatly missed and that's why the end of today's show going into Tuesday the morning just after the news at midnight we will have a tribute to the <unk> proteges Keith Flint with his iconic song fire starter but we're gonNA keep things going here on Siren radio this evening sitting back relaxing chilling out and celebrating the facts that Monday is almost over and choose day is on its way this next on has been requested by Chris in Lincoln. He told you earlier today and ask for a little bit of Jack Johnson. They says banana pancakes. You're listening to Siren Radio half past eleven. You see that is just no need. Hardly even though we're not trying data show you songs key words bows wake up to Mabel we because Lee Mc you banana bay digs. Pedestrian lack is man <music> the time to see rain no need to go as just may ebbe alaka. ooh Mama made obeyed really I don't mind this zero laid a love to liaise. We Cook those incurred. Thanks Dan Lock. There's no world outside the window but Dan you see that is just rain. They no need to go. Oh asset no need nonni gadget you see and JUIC- ran out but the sand rangan is too don't pick it we don't need to tame and he just so easy when pay attention to the where they hardly even no. We're not trying to show songs man to the doer what is way to earn. Maybe the Bay is do we on time. Badges see it is just rain. No needing the juicy juicy check Johnson the Nana pancakes. You're listening to a Siren Radio and coin fittingly as I've just remembered thank you Christopher suggesting that song because this week is pancake day and I hadn't noticed until I was invited to celebrate the day with some friends ends tomorrow. I haven't actually realized that Pancake Day was tomorrow because I always think of Pancake Day being in or as Fisher people out there will call shrove Tuesday the ones who aren't just thinking about the bellies yeah but I always think of as being something that takes place in February but it turns out that we are actually having pancake day very later on in the in the annual calendar this year because last year two thousand eighteen was on the thirteenth of February now the two thousand nine days of course will be the fifth of March tomorrow going get eubanks kicks mix now before they start putting the prices up twenty twenty was a next year will be February the twenty fifth and then when <hes> twenty twenty one will be February sixteenth now this is because he takes place before Ash Wednesday each. Sheer which is the start of lent the <hes> the season for <hes> for the Christian celebrates and <hes> yeah it's now we could go into all the meaning behind pancake talk about the seriousness of as shrove Tuesday and Ash Wednesday but no what I want to know about Tonight Lynn Gentlemen for my sins his your your topping of pancakes water is your favorite pancake choice of topping now when I was a kid when I've made pancakes with my parents and trying to hit the sailing with them all make a message side. I was always. I don't know whether I'm a weird in person for this but I was always lemon. I used to love the on the Pancake Day of the day before mom or dad were go out and they'd get one of those little plastic lemons from the shop which you don't need need anything else throughout the year and you don't go out and pie just a normal lemon. No you're GONNA get a plastic lemon lemon juice inside. Is this just a Yorkshire thing. Do you have this down in Lincolnshire at no let me know audible seven nine seven eight hundred seven one six eligible seven nine seven eight hundred seven one six he can twitter's and Siren F._M.. Orbiting touch on facebook Siren Radio one seven seven three. I want to know your pancake topping of choice and Amai weird for having lemon juice on top of my pancakes out of a little plastic squirt bottle. I don't know whether that's a thing mom if you're listening to help let me out listening to siren radio. I'm looking forward to your responses and now it's time to listen to the number one single in the U._k.. Right now finally a song in the chance where I can actually play slate on a chill-out show on Monday evening. Let's take a listen. This is Louis Cataldi someone you love stay tuned to Siren radio non undoing the Sabathia. There's no lucile nothing really good Makusi on need some somebody somebody to Sumberg home. It's easier to say but it's nervous. I guess Oh you know you know the instant in uh ongoing known to win the Sarma fielders no on its own to this soul and nothing we love and go be sleep in with those are need sue mode. It's somebody zoom you know the answer in the Newport they do eh no he used to billion so royal always be hours getting used to be so <music> the number one single in the U._k.. This week Lewis Cope Holy. Someone you loved Lewis has been he's been supporting steel on their two thousand nine hundred eighteen tool still avoiding tomorrow and has been working on the single release all through two thousand and eighteen and the big news hits on Friday that it reached number one in the U._k.. In my opinion is gorgeous track and it just makes me. I'm looking at his age. Now and Louis Cataldi was born on the seventh of October nineteen ninety ninety six that means that he's in fact younger the May wow he's three months younger something like that that that that that makes me feel a little bit sick that he's having such a success in his life and <hes> of course I'm having so much fun saying here and entertaining you all now at least keeping your company until midnight hour strikes butts. There is part of me going. I could be on stage with steel well DOC. It's getting to that time of the show where I'm going to talk about a couple of the films that have seen this week because you know that's becoming a regular occurrence now but next I'm GonNa play a song which I decided to put into the show because I'd been up straight here. It was playing in the toilets cost cinema today and I went all and in edges so I'm gonNA show tonight so his ass apply and the classic last week hits Stay Tuned Siren Radio with twenty one minutes till midnight <music> head on the phone again view to La. We Shan't could carry your smile but I'm so they can meet you. Just say that I want you to to go back from Beijing. Were is say by gone on easy way uh-huh <music> I Hanno you were right. uh-huh yeah it all out of love supply. Take me back to nineteen eighty. s few of the Oklahoma probably going wow I feel old now. That was twenty third nearly thirty nine years thirty nine years since wow of my musk's correct there must be twenty not that thirty nine years since all out of love by air supply was released to the world and played today because I heard it in a toilets at the Odeon cinema but don't worry I was <hes> seeing a great film. It's cold on the basis of sex. I've been wanting to see it search a long time and it was a follows the powerful and timely true story of the U._S. Supreme Court Justice Ruth Beta Ginsburg who led the fight against gender discrimination. If you haven't got to say I can't even explain how good it is to you and how important is so you can see the amazing what this woman is. It tells the story basically of her of her fight for her very first fight against gender discrimination basically make doc gender discrimination thing that is how far back we're going in this fight and it doesn't even get to cover everything else that she's in her career since right to the point of now still sitting on the Supreme Court benches and very much disagreeing with a lot of Donald Trump's current progress as president we will say bursts yeah. It's it's incredible film. I urge edgy will go check it out as I do the other film which I saw earlier this week it was Friday the day that it came out and it's now gone onto the number one film in the U._K.. It right now fighting thing with my family produced by Dwayne the Rock Johnson and written by Stephen a mention also directed by as well which I didn't realize until the credits fell a wonderful film it heartwarming <unk> homing. It's it's heart warming. It's hilarious and it's just got great blend of the two and the the really great thing about it. I'm most edgy wall is that you don't have to be professional national wrestling fan to enjoy this film follows the story of family and Norwich which isn't quite that far from where we're sitting now here in Lincoln and the pastry as as a professional wrestling family the idea that the DASA got into the W._W._e.. Over in America moved over there and was aiming to become these big star her brother was left behind and basically state and train these wonderful wrestlers. I'm one of them was blind. Now I would go into too much of it but he trained a blind wrestler who is now a full-time professional wrestler and he's blind that is a an incredible fee on its own and one thing that I am going to check out this week because of realized that I've never actually watched it. I've heard about it so much but the fighting with my family documentary which it is based off was followed the family all around Norwich for a few months. Only I'm definitely GONNA check out on the awful website of the weekend over the rest of these week. Should I say and I urge you to go and check out the movie as well fighting with my family is out now at while I was gonna say cinemas across Lincoln but the Odeon Cinema. It's the only one we've got the does like fulltime movies anyway. Let's carry on the show still a few more songs to go uh-huh <hes> including this next one. This is freya writings. We've lost without you. Stay to you. <music> <music> you see <music> <music> <music> <music> <music> save <music> ooh <music> <music> <music> <music> who <music> Siren radio seven point three getting closer to that midnight hour but I wanNA play a song now by another local artist getting Karen Campbell East East Coast solve those two thousand years ago glad changed Lebron's will know and although to go what's happening to four of these Anjana see realize it is just buying say down sounds just sanzar house things have changed scales ways to stay realized areas just by without data east coast <music> Sung Kim Campbell. You're listening to siren radio. Thank everyone who's tuned in over the past two hours for another really enjoyable show on my end anything for until this evening ten to midnight is creeping upon us and the reason why I wanted to throw in a little bit of caring Campbell there is because I'm we've got another episode of the local music spotlight coming coming tomorrow from three to five if people don't know the look music spotlights is been running for just over a year in fact he was a year last week here on Siren Radio Show in showcasing some of the best talent on Lincoln's Lincoln's music scene today you can find out more details by going to our website. If you want to get involved with you think that you've got a song that we'd love to hear that the community of Lincoln would love to hear than getting church local spotlights at Siren online dot co Dot U. K. or go to a website click the local music Boston at the top of the banner and all the details can be found there. That's from three till five tomorrow. You've also got the siren simply just show with. Tom Stevens from twelve till one. You've also go what else you got your tank top eleven till midnight. I'm just going off the top of my head Lynch drive time with Chris Clarkson from five till seven and the guide with Joe Haden in the morning from seven o'clock so they're all in the wrong odor and as the as the late great starwood say we all in the all the open to write notes not necessarily in the correct order Mr Andrew Preview. They're just carry on with Eh. You're listening to siren radio is been. It's been a pleasure to join you here on your Monday evening as whole pace. Let's wrap things up so I can go to sleep. You can and find me on twitter at Kaija Valentine the show at Siren radio at the show on the station at Siren F._M.. On Twitter Serum Radio One seven three on facebook but you have survived your Monday. I thinking I just have it's over. Choose is on its way and good night. God bless levy tonight with crate track from ultra vox to send does off to sleep. This is Vienna. Thank you for listening and you'll see me here right back here. Next Week <music> doc they consume switching with you too take into side and things to this <music> <music> uh-huh uh-huh <music> income aww <music>.

Siren Radio Emma Jade Emma facebook stevie Stevie O'Connor Nashville Byron Radio Lincoln Siren Radi Lincoln Lincoln Lincolnshire Tom Miranda Lambert Nick Song Mr Ian Amer Siren Supreme Court Judy Siren
... And Chill! on Siren Radio: Episode 61 - Emma Jade

OC Talk Radio

1:50:50 hr | 2 years ago

... And Chill! on Siren Radio: Episode 61 - Emma Jade

"The world is changing at a rate like never before so why isn't education strayer university is revolutionizing higher education to help you finish your degree we make transferring credits simple create binge worthy course content that keep view engaged and design A._i.. Powered tools to help you graduate welcome to the future of Education strayer university out with the old school square. University is certified to operate by chef walk on your Monday evening. Thank you for joining us. My Name's Valentine. This is an chill and we're here until midnight but I am not alone in the siren studio this evening. I've got two wonderful guests <music>. I'm going to introduce you to the first of them now. Her name is Emma Jade. How're you doing great thank you? How are you under in Grit? Thank you and you are here tonight for people who don't know about Emma Jade Euro country music singer how you perform all across the U._k.. You've got a few gigs coming up in Lincolnshire very important one coming up on the twenty third of March but we'll talk about that more as the show goes on and you're going to be performing live in the studio I tonight. I am indeed I am so how'd you find it when you because you'll from doncaster how'd you find crossing the border over here to Lincolnshire. I mean it's fun. It's played here on Friday night. was that in Lincolnshire. I'm not very good at geographer and it was fun and yeah it's just like being home so good and it's currently only eight minutes past ten. You have mentioned that this is normally the time where you settling down for bed. Oh no I'm usually asleep well. We will talk more about Ah the GIG that you've got coming up very very soon but I think he's time that we listened to your first song of the evening. Give the listeners a taste of what Emma jade is all about so the first song is called. Only you the story behind it. Yes so this one <hes> back in Nashville in I think it was I was at the end of October the beginner November and and I guess it was just one of those songs why is very tough <hes> being on the road all the time and like relationships a tough when you're on the road especially when you're vianney age and I think just been hearing more and more <hes> a lot of relationships and my friends of breaking up out because because they were on the road all the time so I guess this came from so yeah let's take a listen Emma jade with only you live on Siren Radio <hes> Lebanon Israel <music> through kids lab umbrella. ooh Eh changing has been you haven't and <music> leaving him our whole thought too many birds sma just back down <music>. I can't change ooh. Hey <music> even shy whole foods. Thank you ma old. Tom Leave this La. Oh <music> siren radio fresh sound for Lincoln and a jade then with only you you're listening a two siren radio going to be hearing more from Amer in a couple of minutes time but up next it's Miranda Lambert with all kinds of kinds stay tuned to Siren Radio Matt you went and family low with that ratio the human cannonball wedding the big cocktail with Barker's clams and then spat show family on it easy our joy lady was crying beginning to keep the many Jake Paul and Patty it could constitute the banter she'd Waiver Tom. Messina to the World Guitar Children's show smokey Joe's attack a brag and stood on the never stared talk the trash population sign in the world linger they beginning to keep the world bending take Saul Oh lanes Oh Miranda Lambert's you're listening to Siren Radio Sixty minutes past ten on your Monday evening what sitting back relaxing chilling out celebrating the fact that Monday is almost over and choosed is on its way of still got Emma Jade in the studio with me. Are you enjoying your time on the show so far Emma picking some good songs so yeah you're a fan of Miranda Lambert aac Fan really big doc fan awesome stuff and we have resident guests to the show. It seems Mr Ian Hall. You may have heard him last week. How you doing very well thank you? I'm doing great. Thank you and we heard you last week as you were here. Wave Stevie Stevie O'Connor talking about the showcase of British country music which is coming to the Terry O'Toole theatre later this month and it's not just stevie this on the lineup as Emma. We'll be there as well and we'll be as well yep so I was going to players of acoustic songs so that will be really nice for people to come in here in that environment actually because a lot of them are songs are very delicate delivery and and very loaded with meaning and it's not always as easy to hear those types of songs in pubs and clubs and things like that so this is a great place to see him. Play and people are getting a good teaser of that this evening yeah really good which is awesome awesome now Emma. You were actually usually won an award about two weeks ago. Didn't you did yeah I learn. Is it ever won an award the best you ep she had yet about thousand Gauls award which are really <hes> established country music everything on on yeah. We're really good friends actually with bells and gals that is not why won the award. We'll kill me no so I want to say thanks to nick culturally. He's really supportive is a huge champion of country music in the U._K.. Is Huge Champion of women in music in general what we need absolutely yeah and he just lost a great works and people should should should check out his his facebook page and give light can find out ways to because there's lots of great female artists assists that he champions an was at the top of that pile for U._k.. EP so that's great that's awesome and I know we've got a lot of country music fans listening in this evening but people who are maybe the casual music fan may have recognized your voice and your name before as you appeared a couple years ago on the voice U._K.. Yeah it was a long time ago but it happened yeah. It was like two thousand fifteen through to to. Tom Jones's tea and Tom Yeah team. Tom We made some. We made some good music and I was GonNa say like I know you've probably had this over the last couple of years law in like interviews and chancellor this. What was that experience like being on because you were eighteen at the time I was really I'm being on like a huge T._v.? Show was daunting experience. Yeah it was tough. It was I I I personally had a really great time. I was very young though so the toughest part of it I think was the the media Specht and I think the hardest thing for young artists and female artists especially them like the whole the whole media thing like media really really comfortable you and I I had a really tough time with the media book. I had a great time on the show I made at some really good music and some lifelong friends and I would stay with Tom Jones so no of eighteen year olds can say so. We've got friends on the voice. The shares all right now. Remember Yeah Yeah I mean I'm going to be somebody so we are all looking forward to the Angie showcase of British country music come into the Terry O'Toole theatre just down the road on Saturday the twenty third of March and you'll be able to hear Emma along with Stevie and care amac performing some amazing being songs including possibly this next one yeah probably which is called and this one is called stole. Morning is the story behind it uh-huh yeah yeah so this one <hes> this is on the that I just released. I won the award for the piece called older now and the whole EP was about a certain time in in my life and this one <hes> I wrote about <hes>. I guess I thought I thought that I was getting cheated on her nose so that's what it was about and it's just a typical country music song really. Let's take a listen storm warning by Emma Jade live on siren radio and to shine some hartill risen my pillow SM- I sell about a million times and and why you ran full founded <music> who is e who've cash she. She didn't know the Ghana this E._U.. Comes <music> <hes> <hes> <music> to <hes> <music> me Fi lassen every since sir. <music> <music> now. She's a one pitchy and the only one anju unpredictable just lack loaded gun so you'll break a hard lag a toda's <music> <music> <music> skid the <music> siren radio arms proud MMA jade will be back on siren radio after a little bit of Tom Jones and the stereophonic six wants someone whispering in water. Not What's all these questions they're asking. This is the craziest ever don't try Ooh Mama Mama <music> shopping from the smell of stay on the cigarette slow scammy half to death over the window. No let's chat aww radio's lasted looking at my past that I've seen so many things yeah uh-huh you're listening to you siren radio. I've still go emma jade read and in whole in the studio with me. Emma were talking before about when we were planning about what we're going to chat about on the show and still you said that you really liked cats and you could talk about Casper so so go unless you have a cat. Our two cats called Bella. I know my girlfriend's GonNa be listening to this going. Oh I love her so much more now just the best. The best thing in the world is just a cap do oh you know more more of a cat person than adult person yes. Oh we might differentiate a mass slightly me like I love all creatures in the entire world spiders. Maybe like not so much. The best creatures thing she was actually newly late for a Gig on she got distracted by car in the rug is a cow on the road and said that it's going to get run over if we don't go back and get it and then my friend said you can't just take the cap I think it probably belongs to somebody writes on key of ex girlfriend saying oh cats now this is quality. Let's see radio. Come and tell you when I drove back from the Gig the cat the cat was there again as the cat was and there's a cat's just that maybe but I mean having oppose as opposed to a dog is actually grit for you as a musician because you know when you're out and about onto going going and doing gigs you can leave them a new go. You've gone all across the U._K.. Yes the U._K.. Everywhere in Nashville Nashville Nashville Yeah. was that like wanting to ask you Nashville Fun. It's fun. It's a nice little place to like. I don't really play shows that I get involved in Ryan is nice if they're around and <hes> and yeah Nash Nashville's Gray. It's like my we call it. We call it home. I call it home yeah as a country singer. I'm sure that's that's a place split. You want to go yeah. That's that's so if my dream that to be to just end up there and that's where I think a lot of my friends are that's where I get my inspiration. I don't get a lot of inspiration when I'm here in the U._k.. So <hes> so yeah what was the when was it that you decided that country was the genre that you wanted to go down a didn't really we have that like country music moment. I think a lot of people the thing about this sean recently in the past few years most than before is that I think people have seen it as a quick money making scheme and that gets really sad to me because obviously this is something I do because I love it and I kind of fell into it because I realized that that's how my voice fell nothing about the way that is saying the music I make his on Seoul this all just exactly how it happened and I think that's why managed to write music. This comes from the hop and I think it just happened in my daddy's to listen to Johnny cash and I remember when I was a kid minimum useless into Schneier tway and just it happened to think of an email kid in school and I used to to I've role Avena law and I heard of relevance thing a cover of you a mind by the dixie chicks decided did joining cover it myself in that so that's how it happened and then yeah so I just saw a fell into to answer. This is redoing. I get it now awesome where we still got two more songs to hear from you tonight so let's get into the next one is called get to leaving. Is there a story right behind this one. I'm asking you this basically because I've lived the story so this story. There's always a story behind every single song Arrow. I'm I'm one of these people are I can't. I can't write a song that's not real so a lot of the psalms are about the same person of untold by Stevie that cotton name so this next one it it was kind of written about going on from storm warning at the I saw a new keen on me and then with get to leave and it was still over there okay cool and I I know about this now so what you WanNa do then I'll sealy of time for it so <hes> so yeah we I wrote this song in Nashville as well. Let's take a listen. You're listening to a Siren Siren radio. It's ten thirty four on your Monday evening and this is get to leaving by Emma. Jade live on siren sit down. Now we can talk about your shoes onto anyway. Balance Says he saw just me and you know that you're trying to truth <music> LANC- this come lack and see the stranger in your Sneha they do. Hey if view <hes> she'll. Let's say the shoot was gone. Uh No chew don't even just sounds crazy so men. The governor's sees he'll you. You know that you Ben. If you Ju- you Eh <music> of how could you Ju- free. I don't know the <music> no she. We you know she if you josh is good God Siren Radio Radio Music He love Liz big records about an already heady Gal by the name of Joe Joe Joe Joel. Please don't take combs the H._B._O.. Compared with blaming Auburn hair with I of risque of the your smile through sweating bullets let summer rain in two minutes. What do you call <music> can easily understand how you can easily take what it means to me? Lean of you. Please don't the choice of Cassini's the all. The dumped winning depends on you you you. Tom Lang he's please don't take Joe Lean by until the parts and you're listening to siren radio personally. I'm having a great time here this evening with Emma Jade and in whole I hope you guys are doing as much as I am great. It's going to break into song when you said that you know people. People people have heard me singing for. I think that's you know I think we'll leave it to you to the big reason why there this evening is to talk about the age M._G.. Showcase of British country music which is coming to the Terry O'Toole on the twenty third of March any final bits of promotion that you want to do for it we in carry on until I was GonNa say twenty seconds wash. Can I ask you about care AMAC. We've heard from Stevie with heard from Emma Care Amax story so care. Aries from stoke she is will will forgive about very very tall very tall. He's like giant prepares yes. She's she's around music for for a long time. She's been graduate so she's kind of gone. Through that city invasion and Dila degree in kind of professional musicianship and songwriting she spent a little bit of time on some cruise ships as a lot musicians due to try and break way in and found a way into country music. She's got together with our kind of in-house bound. If you like so we've put together some musicians and she's she's going to play some of our original material and some fairly well known cover versions so there's a really nice mix in the thirties so we've got Amer. He's very soulful. We've got stevie is really kind of as you heard last week. Very Honky tonk very bluegrass and and care is an out route chick. It's going to be a cool an awesome night. And where can people get their tickets. You can find us on facebook so you can find h._M._G.. On facebook and we've got details on there you could of course called the fifth box office directly so you can reach those guys on a one five two eight three two one two tickets awesome stuff now Emma your final song of this evening you very much looking forward to it. Call Them. What's your story for behind it so this is called eight losing sleep now? This is only P and is not suitable suitable for sensitive ears but I'm GonNa make it P._G.. She's trying to jam through gritted. I'm GonNa Make P._G.. I assume this is basically a I think I wouldn't I went through a time in my life well. The piece called older now for that exact reason I went through a very like <hes> growing time gas and I used to be the history timid and shy of little girl and E.. N. Will Tell you that I'm definitely no. I'm very very outspoken and very I like to stand up for I believe in a strong views I have very strong views but a lot other views are like regarding like women women in music and <hes> definitely one for standing up for myself and our this song because at kind of been through a situation with somebody somebody who I kinda just walk over me and it was that the sort of sparked this whole change and this like growth so <hes> our son called eight Linson asleep because I just knew I didn't Kinda done with this person for it. So why am I sad about the situation so yeah so I'm going to sing. It and it's GonNa be P._G.. Pagey but if you want to hear the real version you can find me on social media and you can download EP listen losing sleep by Emma Jade live on siren radio <music> <music> shouldn't kiss you is long gone <music> the Kid Israeli so <hes> <hes> so <hes>. You're said you know few relax wrong the thought to do he straw <music>. Do Your said no <music>. They use injuries so Lisa Leslie. Watch you US choose would ask you then set me free you <music>. Give me the used those they watch you <music> <music> <music> notes Eh Luzon's Jude Siren radio seven point three that was ain't losing sleep by Emma Jade live on siren radio. It's it's been a pleasure to have you in the studio this evening and I hope you've enjoyed your appearance. As much as our listeners at home have enjoyed it a lot. Thank you very much. Where can people find out more about you and you're a U._k.? EP of the year two thousand eighteen older now you can find me on all the social media's instagram with facebook and it was just Ama- jade music you can find me on the <hes> on my labels page on the M._d.. Page <hes> and you can download the on I._T._N.'s <hes> spotify. You can buy a hard copy. I'll sign Linux. I'll send it to you can buy that on my social media's those links to the page on that so yeah awesome Steph and in where can people find out more details about the upcoming showcase. You can find that on social media as well so if you have a check on facebook if you type in H._m._g.. On their you'll find our page it's also quite well publicized on the -Tario tool fitter page and website as well so we try to Nice Post two mates to actually I saw the picture out to Anna who made a fantastic poster so that will be getting clustered around that you'll be out of say that on on social media as well. Thank you very much for joining me this evening goes and oh you have a really safe journey home bacteria caps. I'm glad you're listening to siren radio. It's almost eleven o'clock. I've got a couple of songs to say as up to the news at eleven and let's take a listen to this one by local artist Holly Starr whose coming up on the show in a couple of weeks time this is the truth stay tuned to Siren Radio again and so we would say and the rest is his day you you sat in my heart and ours was on her back. uh-huh it's true true true true one and to soon yeah the cafes and the truth is you really have even a- and but Austin they so bad Mizzou mice you yeah yeah breath <music> online. This is Byron Radio Lincoln Siren Radio. He'll magnitude siren radio. It's just gone eleven o'clock word back from these new center. We've said goodbye to Emma Jade and now it's time to sit back and relax chill. Aren't we may for bits. This is female of the species by space grail amazing shot shot aw I'll stop by take all franken ladder back on that Burns cleanly but sealed ed <music>. Space female of the species yield listening to siren radio. It's just gone eleven o'clock on your Monday evening. Were celebrating the fact that Monday is almost over and choose day. He's on its way and hopefully the rest of the week's going to be that a little bit nicer for you. How are you how are you doing? Are you tired. I show Ram <hes> <hes>. I have had a very very busy week. It seems this week. It's only going to get busier. I'm working a lot of the next seven days. I'm sure many many of my retail warrior area friends out there listening will be two for those who maybe not radically listeners to the show when I'm not greasing your airwaves on a Monday evening. I'm working five hours. A week in a local coffee shop on Lincoln can highstreet retail trade chain. I should say but he's one of the joys of this job is the in our for for two hours every Monday night I get to relax with the rest of you and and think about the <hes> the depressing week ahead. Let's say but now I was really. I'm really glad that you've all join me tonight's. Emma jade was absolutely fantastic in the first hour you can find out more about her on a social media pages and by going to the showcase on the twenty third of March. Now I've got lots of <hes> relaxing tunes for you of the next fifty five minutes also <hes> some artists that you've heard on the show before some that's <hes> I've never played before and even the U._k.. Number one single at the moment that was announced on Friday night a crack in tune but that's all to come this. The next song was requested Boeing Ryan from Lincoln he got in touch and said that <hes> he'd heard this one on an advert earlier this week and you know what the actual full song when you when you do listen to the entirety entirety of the track really well for the show so let's take a listen. This is Mark Brown featuring Sarah Cracknell. The journey continues if you can recognize what hurt this comes from both it still common. It just leaves me again. Uh Hello like you and I aw doc alone town. The Journey Continues Mount Brown Sarah Sarah Cracknell. You're listening to siren radio. This is an chill wrangling touch said that he'd been listening to this song after discovering the entire track how ever you may recognize parts of it from. I'm a classic T._V.. UNFORT- which goes PAC twelve years that that makes me feel old because that song there was used in an advert twelve years ago for the first time full Lloyd's T. S. B.. Can you believe it. They were Lloyd's T._S._B.. Back then kids. If you're listening you might not remember that those were actually two separate backings. I remember when they split up because I was part of that and I remember I got sent to one bank and then my dad got sent to the warm and he was just so many people I mean no one wants to be with one particular bank of them. I'm not going to say which because I don't want to get done for slander. I remember that you could swap and change when he was. I just remember it being such a mess but before I get into any more trouble than we could have done when Emma dearly was singing her ain't losing sleep track and trying not to swear then we should move on with the show lots of great chill-out tracks full you this evening including this next one which only I've chosen because I played the artist on last week after saying that I want to see them at the Blue Room here in Lincoln and discovered the band for the very first time and a plane one of their songs. <hes> and I said I was like really I was like all these guys are great. I've been listening to to them. This is an awesome song. You're only to listen to and he's he's got a good response from people listening at home so thank you for that and that's why I wanNA play you another one of that tracks <hes> this is the captain of the lost waves chiefs and can you believe that it is now the fourth of March today the fourth of March. It still feels like the beginning of the year feels like this year is just gone so quickly or ready were already a third of the inner not quite third neat neely a third of the way into the year and that is absolutely crazy <hes> but this next track back. He's all about the first month of the year. I'm really not building out very well. I realized that checks of the first month of the year is called January. Stay tuned to Siren Radio Choose Myself. I'm the say the most <music> call me and you. I'm the Monday seems awfully. I'm announced with this week. Monday brings nothing so just still the only way through through mall awesome simply imply it is sayings signings y precarious July August they just constantly sned and December's also. I'm sure strong the AW to be to why wouldn't you on such you hide fame every bond screaming. No one wants to say it you yes. I confess that I'm not the one thing anyone can yes <music> aw uh-huh in January by captain of the lost waves comes from that two thousand and nineteen album that latest release synthesis which is available where all good music can be found. I'M NOT GONNA a lot but this past week especially I have been completely marking out for them of the last few days listening to as many of their tracks as possible district constant loop. I was really really tempted to play. This track for spotify missed many men which you can find by looking at this page. It's twenty eight minutes long. I believe I'm just checking twenty eight minutes thirty five seconds so I don't think I quite gone away with that one but January's just really nice track as well and if you get the chance to go see them live there in mm Hong Castle in a couple of weeks time maybe next month you can find out more on their facebook page canton of the lost waves but whilst have been planning full today show Oh you know I don't just spend time looking for the music speaking to the artis researching the artist. That's going to be on the air this evening but I also try and look at what's been going on in the world today in history because sometimes you know some phone stories can come up which inspired tracks thus I can play on the air and I'm telling you what the fourth of January in history will not go down as a very historic day. Sometimes I'm look through and I go oh. Oh that's a really really interesting story but he's not exactly you know chill-out material but even today there was not even a war was started on the fourth of March. It seems like every time I'd research they show war started somewhere in history <hes> but alas that has not been the case there was one historical occurrence which happened on the fourth of March though <hes> and that was that John Lennon turned around and made the quote that the Beatles were bigger than Jesus. The Beatles were more popular than Jesus. Can you disagree at an over. The could've Italian so let's listen to the Beatles. No one's GONNA complain it. That's what going across the universe stay tuned to Cyrus. Radio is like and listen to this this this way across the waves of joy drifting drifting through my opened mind passing <music> shamed was GonNa the Change Alive which Don's faithful aluminium come come on man woman inside. I also loved made there. <music> Shea. It's a landings incite rioting in which around me on sons of Ron Change Change Kareem you beat souls <music> across the universe. You're listening to Siren Radio Twenty five past eleven. Wow time is flying away with us this evening. Gentlemen mentioned have the Beatles I'm pro because he's been so many years since on this day of the fourth of March that John Lennon would proclaim that Beatles were more popular than Jesus and <hes> I mentioned and there's a lot of things that the that it wasn't motion news that happened on this day in history. Now I do want to just do want to bring up the fact that today we have had two very very sad new stories <hes> coming up on the news today <hes> the I was earlier this morning. The news broke that the prodigies Keith Flint's died at the age of forty nine. Now the hasn't been <hes> much news yet on how this took place however he was found his home in Essex so <hes> if you haven't heard that news yet nice that the prodigies Keith Flint passed away earlier today at the age of forty nine and then then just a couple of hours ago the news broke this <hes> actor from nine to one Oh and riverdale which chose told him to a majority of our earliest she was saying the Riverdell is one of her favourite T._v.. Shows Luke Perry sadly passed away at the age of fifty two. He was found at his home in California after suffering a stroke so to really massive new stories from from the entertainment industry they're to massive losses to their field ones that will be greatly missed and that's why the end of today's show going into Tuesday st morning just after the news at midnight we will have a tribute to the <unk> proteges Keith Flint with his iconic song fire starter but we're gonNA keep things going here on a siren radio this evening sitting back relaxing chilling out and celebrating the facts that Monday is almost over and Tuesday is on its way this next song has been requested by Chris Race in Lincoln. He got in touch earlier today and asked for a little bit of Jack Johnson. They says banana pancakes. You're listening to siren radio almost half past eleven. You see that is just no need hardly even know we're not trying. Arta show songs men to do work was bowls to wake up to burn. Maybe a week XLII Bay Madera lack is banned <music> Potanin Time Gysi just rain. They no need to go as just may Eh. ooh Mama made obeyed really don't mind Brag. This zero laid a love to liaise we could goes incurred tasman. Dan Locked. There's no world outside all the time you see there's just rain. No need to go ASA. No need nonni juicy juicy <hes> but the fall saying it is too early. Don't pick it. We don't need to taming. He just so easy when you're paying attention to the <hes> but they hardly even know we're not trying to show songs man to <music> dope. were way up to earn. Maybe the Dan dare lot is the we <music> fantasy. It is just rain. No need juicy. Check Johnson Banana pancakes here listening to Siren Radio and and coast fittingly as I've just remembered thank you Chris suggesting that song because this week is pancake day and I hadn't noticed until I was invited to celebrate the day with some friends friends tomorrow. I hadn't actually realized that Pancake Day was tomorrow because I always think of Pancake Day being in or as the official people out there we'll call it shrove Tuesday the ones who aren't just thinking about the valleys lease but I always think of it as being something that takes place in February but it turns out that we are actually having pancake day very later on in the in the annual calendar <hes> this year because last year two thousand eighteen was on the thirteenth of February now the two thousand nine days of course will be the fifth of March tomorrow going get eubanks kicks mix now before they start on the prices up twenty eighty twenty so next year will be February the twenty eighth and then when <hes> twenty twenty warm will be February sixteenth now this is because he takes place before Ash Wednesday each this year which is the start of lent the the season for the Christian celebrates and yeah now we could go into all the meaning behind Pancake eight-day in talk about the seriousness of as shrove Tuesday and Ash Wednesday but no what I want to know about tonight. Lynn Gentlemen of former saints is your you'll topping of pancakes. Water is your favourite pancake choice of topping now. When I was a kid when I've made pancakes with my parents and try to hit the ceiling with them all make a mess side? I was always I don't know whether I'm a weird person for this but I was always lemon. I used to love the on the Pancake Day or the day before mom or dad would go out and get one of those little plastic lemons from the shop which you don't need for anything else throughout the year and you don't go out and pie just a normal lemon. No you're GONNA get a plastic lemon. Have Lemon juice inside. Is this just a Yorkshire thing. Do you have this down in Lincolnshire at no let me know audible seven nine seven eight hundred seven one six audible seven nine seven eight hundred seven one six. He can tweezers and Siren F._M.. Orbiting touch on facebook Siren Radio One zero seven three. I WanNa know your pancake topping of choice and a- my weird for having lemon juice on top of my pancakes out of a little plastic squirt bottle. I don't know whether that's a thing mom. If you're listening help me out listening to siren radio. I'm looking forward to your responses and now it's time to listen to the number one single in the U._k.. Right now finally sung in the chance where I can actually plates on a chill-out show on Monday evening. Let's take a listen. This is Louis Cataldi. Someone you moved stay tuned to Siren Radio. Non Undo field is no order soon Liu sola nothing really good Makusi on need some birdied somebody to Sumberg home sees you but it's never so you know for instance in the Newport breath ongo unknown do win the Sarma fielders nor turn to the soul and nothing we love and go be sleep in with those or need sue mode. It's somebody's soon birdied fees. I guess <music> in the Newport News Art no he newport news billion and so royal it has to be the the number one single in the U._k.. This Week Lewis Cup holy. Someone you've loved loose has been he's been supporting steel on their two thousand nineteen nineteen tool still voiding tomorrow and has been working on the single release all through two thousand and eighteen and the big news hit on Friday that it reached number one in the U._k.. In my opinion is gorgeous track and it just makes me. I'm looking at his age. Now and Louis Cataldi was born on the seventh of October nineteen ninety six that means that he's in fact younger the May wow he's three months younger something like that that that that makes me feel a little bit sick. He's having such a success in his life and of course I'm having so much fun saying here and entertaining you all now or at least keeping you company until that midnight hour strikes there is part me going. I could be onstage with steel well well. It's getting to that time of the show where I'm going to talk about a couple of the films that have seen this week because you know that's becoming a regular occurrence now but next I'm GonNa play a song which I decided to put into the show because I'd been up put it straight here. It was playing in the toilets cost cinema today and I went oh and in edges so I'm GonNa play my show tonight so his ass apply and the Classic Classic Hits Stay Tuned Siren Radio with twenty one minutes till midnight in my head on the phone again of you to uh-huh shed could carry your smile. May what's good. I'm so lost so to just say that. I want you you to come back from the gene. Tom Is say by gone on easy way. They need you mm-hmm you. I know you were right. It all out of love as supply taking me back to nineteen eighteen s few of your home or probably going wow I feel old now. That was twenty nearly thirty nine years thirty nine years since my math correct there must be twenty twenty th at four thirty nine years since all out of love by air supply was released to the world and played today because I heard it in toilets at the Odeon cinema but don't worry I was seeing a great film. It's cold on the basis of sex. I've been wanting to see it search a long time and it was a follows the powerful and timely true story of the U._S. Supreme Court Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg who led the fight against gender discrimination. If you haven't got to say I can't even explain how good it is to you and how important is as you can see the amazing what this woman is. It tells the story basically of her her fight for her very first fight against gender discrimination basically make make gender discrimination thing that is how far back we're going in this fight and it doesn't even get to cover everything else that she's done in her career. Since right to the point of now still sitting on the Supreme Court benches and very much disagreeing with a lot of Donald Trump's current progress as president will say but yeah it's. It's an incredible film. I <hes> jewel's gun. Check it out as I do the other film which I saw earlier this week it was Friday the day that it came out and it's now gone onto be the number one film in the U._K.. At right now fighting sing with my family produced by Dwayne the Rock Johnson and written by Steven mentioned also directed by him as well which I didn't realize until the credits fell a wonderful film it heartwarming <music> homing. It's it's heart warming. It's hilarious and it's just got that great blend of the two and the the really great thing about it. I'm most edgy wall is that you don't have to be professional professional wrestling fan to enjoy this film it follows the story of a family in Norwich which isn't quite that far from where we're sitting now here in Lincoln and the pastry as as a professional wrestling family the idea that the adults got into the W._W._e.. Over in America moved over there and was aiming to become the big star her brother was left behind and basically stayed in train these wonderful wrestlers <hes> one of them was blind. Now I would go into too much of it but he trained a blind wrestler who is now a full time professional wrestler and he's blind that is a an incredible fee on its own and one thing that I am going to check out this week because I've realized that I've never actually watched it. I've heard about it so much but the fighting with my family documentary which it is based off was followed the family all around Norwich for a few months yes I. I'm definitely GONNA check that out on the awful website over the weekend over the rest of this week. Should I say and I urge you to go and check out the movie as well fighting with my family is out now at some while I was gonna say cinemas across Lincoln but the Odeon Cinema. It's the only one we've got the does like fulltime movies anyway. Let's carry on with the show still a few more songs to go <hes> including this next one. This is freya writings. We've lost without you still loves you. <music> <music> you see <music> <music> <music> <music> serves <music> ooh AH <music> <music> snow <music> who <music> Siren Radio seven point three why getting closer to that midnight hour but I want to play a song now by another local artist getting Karen Campbell East Coast solve those two thousand years ago Vlad Changed Lebron's will know hello to go. Let's avidly though to Anjana see realize it is just by without said Ben Roger Just Sanzar House things have changed scales ways to stay realized by now the East Geico Song Kim Campbell. You're listening to siren radio. I'd like to thank everyone who tuned in over the past two hours for another really enjoyable. Show a Mayan that anything for and chill this evening ten to midnight is creeping upon us and the reason why I wanted to throw in a little bit of caring Campbell there is because I'm we've got another episode of the local music spotlight coming tomorrow from three until five if people don't know the look music spotlight has been running for just over a year in fantasy gear last week here on Siren Radio Show in showcasing some of the best talents on Lincoln's music scene today you can find out more details by going to our website if you want to get involved with you think that you've got a song that we'd love to hear that the community of Lincoln would love to hear than getting touch local spotlights at Sirin online dot co Dot U._k.. Or go to our website click the local music Boston at the top of the banner and all the details can be found there. That's from three till five tomorrow. You've also got the siren a simply jazz show with Tom Stevens from twelve till one. You've also go what else you got your tank top eleven till midnight. I'm just going off the top of my head. Listen drive time with Chris this Clarkson from five till seven and the guide we've Joe Haden in the morning from seven o'clock so they're all in the wrong order and as the as the late great starwood say we all in the all open to write notes for not necessarily in the correct order Mr Andrew Preview there. Let's just carry on with Asia. You're listening to siren. Radio is been a it's been a pleasure to join you here on your Monday evening as always let's wrap things up so I can go to sleep. You can find me on twitter at K J Valentine the show at Siren Radio at the station at Siren F._M.. On Twitter Siren Radio One seven three on facebook but you have survived her Monday. I I think I just have over choose is on its way and get night. God bless Levi tonight with Craig track from Ultra Vox to send in does off to sleep. This is Vienna. 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Hour 1: Breaking CBB

First Take

45:05 min | 3 years ago

Hour 1: Breaking CBB

"I think smoking always affected my daily life because I was a closet smoker. It really sort of controlled my entire day. My boss is the one that recommended jewel. So I decided to give it a try. You don't get any of the odor of smoking. There's no ash all over your car. I would say give it a try get the flavor and satisfaction of smoking without the mess of cigarette. Asher lingering odor. Switch to Joel check out. J L dot com slash sports. If you don't smoke Vate don't start warning. This product contains nicotine nicotine is an addictive chemical. What's on everybody? Welcome into. I take. Thank you so much for hanging out here with us day to LA. He Stephen a Smith. He is max Kellerman on Molly Cairns with phone on fellas. Got a lot of damn, thanks. My mom do such a month for right off the LA, sunshine. Men. Let me tell you something. I watched some great great basketball last night. And I watched some disgusting basketball last night. I got a hit list today. I got a few. I don't need a hug. I'm I'm I think he got a few people. I got you pay. Thank you. Thank you very much MAC. But I'm here to tell you I got a lot of a lot of my mom. I'm in the mood today. But what happened? I saw some great basketball, and there's some bad. Yeah. You understand? They tell you guys. Let's say focus. I was raised to hate the Duke booed doubles. You know, where I went to college. My father went there as well. But those boys showed up right now. Let's get into it right now. Born in Kentucky to the tune of one eighteen to eighty four this is of course, their first game, featuring the top three players in the ESPN one hundred Stephen a Smith one went through your mind when you were watching this quad. Well, several things went through clearly. First things first. Pooley's me. Let me tell you something right now. Zillion Williamson is special now I had to check Mr. Jalen roads at the few minutes. Go on. I'm leaving you out of this man had no death getting golden go on national television and said Zion. Williams would not have been a five atop spotting five-member. But a fab five excuse me. I love to be king rejected czar. Synthesis. This stop it. All right. That's number one. He thinks I got to get back off my chest. My goal. It was something special to a ho disc kit. He ain't even Duke the best point do RJ. Barrett is the truth the truth. He is a faster more athletic version of Jalen rose when he was on a fair, that'd be this brother is special. Okay. That those are the thought that came to my mind, here's another thought that to my max Cullen. Supposed to be the top recruiting classes why the drop off between class last. I mean, I I have been in interest of full disclosure for those that may not know I wrote for the Philadelphia Inquirer for seventeen years. One of my very first assignments at the Philadelphia Inquirer in nineteen ninety four was the beat writer for temple university covering John chainey, then number one nemesis was Cal John Calipari, and you mass when Marcus Camby and Lou Roe and Mike Williams in the crew. Okay. I have got my relationship with John Calipari goes back to nineteen ninety four ladies and gentlemen that that that's what if. Twenty twenty five years. I have never seen John caliber John Calipari team. So dominated the way they will last night. They were completely outclassed. I'm not even putting it on coaching putting it on a recruiting because clearly Alabama. Might be. I wanted to say this to you. I am this is just one game. And I understand that. And I got to watch them tonight against Kansas. But I must confess to you. If I see this tonight against Kansas max, Kellerman, I'm gonna walk away thinking this was that UNLV team that went undefeated before they lost the NASCAR championship game to do. Right, by the way. But I'm just telling you right now, we got a shot right now if they're focused and they're ready, and they want this. We got a shot at seeing a basketball team that could go undefeated for. I defeated win the national title on the same thing was this him. I am now. Let me say Jalen Rose's, right? These guys don't shoot. And the key to them going undefeated is going to be moving that ball. Because when you every guy in the court can take their defender than the temptation is always the short term incentive is always go. Get it go get those points. They're going to have to keep that ball in motion the offense in motion that'll be the key to them. I think they can do it. I think they are capable of going undefeated in the regular season, very difficult. But I think they can do it. And I think they can win the national title. And I think this is good for college basketball, the difference between this, and let's say Alabama or or a Golden State Warriors in in the NBA, or what's another example of an incredibly dominant team, uconn, women's sure is that. Yeah. Absolutely. Is that when you have the dominant name-brand storied franchise where team that trots out year after year the championship team? One year. They had this incredible juggernaut that cannot be stopped that kinda ruins the sport. Because they win every year. It gets boring. The patriots again, it's boring. The warriors again, it's Alabama. And this is the best version of that maybe ever it's kind of boring. It's ruining college football this season. Not Duke Duke as the story franchise. It's been in the mix, but hasn't been just destroying everyone every year and now because of the nature of college basketball regular season, which many people ignore is now interesting look at this Duke team and then the tournament because it's one and done increases the odds, they may get upset. This is great for college basketball. And the reason I think they can go undefeated potentially. It's very very early. And then win the whole thing. Guys. What why couldn't UNLV do it because Duke head coach K why couldn't the fab five win the whole thing? Well, we know why that was a different story. Okay. Fine. But still coach Kane got in the way of a lot of teams net. And now he's playing in the one in done sandbox. Right. He's like, okay. Everyone else you're playing now. I'm playing one in done. But these one in Duns are being coached by coach Kane, they have a chance it's ridiculously early. They have a chance to do. What hasn't been done in a long time? A couple of things number one. Let's not act every time. We talk about the fab five not winning the national championship. Everybody points to the time out that wasn't a time out. Chris webber? Let's remember that the year before that they got a nine late about thirty by UNLV. I'm sorry about Duke. Right. So this remember that that's double one number two. Everybody's talking about shooting. I don't see a team that can't shoot Zion could hit perimeter shots. Barrett can hit perimeter shots can reddish can shoot. Okay. And there is something to be said, remember we're talking about kids. We're not talking about an NBA team. We're talking about kids. And if ever there are individuals that could be demoralized is on a basketball court see with football, you have so many you have so many different components on on a basketball court. If you got one superstar that can intimidate a team if you got to it could overwhelm a nation and college basketball if you got three. Hopeless telling you right now. Listen, the Kentucky Wildcats was supposed to have the number two recruiting class at nation. They want on test test, and I'm the and you look at Zion hates cho- seventy. But you know, what it's like what a handle it's pass it triple. It's like an NFL home. That has a great quarterback who can run. The temptation the temptation is always for the quarterback to pick up the first down with his legs because he can but the short term incentive can interfere with the long term incentive because playing out of the pocket. You can get hurt. You may not have the same vertical kinda guy. This team is like that they can crush everyone because every player on the floor can take their defenders anytime the temptation will be to hold the ball. And the reality is going to have to be to go undefeated. They gotta keep it moving. Perfect. And we need to keep it moving. And speaking of a good quarterback. Let's go to the states a closed mouth doesn't get fed. You know, all the cliches Dez Bryant has been very vocal. About wanting a job, and we could have good news hour, Dan Grazziano is reporting that Bryant and the saints are communicating after a positive workout max Kellerman. We know the saints are the real deal and it could make a run down the stretch. Do what kind of an impact would having dead on their roster? I don't think he really moves the needle because he's not going to be the best receiver on the team or the second best receiver on the team. He is a big target as I said if the saints picked up a guy who could stretch the defense, I'm not saying that Michael Toscana, obviously, he can I'm saying, but if Dez was that kinda guy not just a big kind of guy who can get the fifty fifty ball. Then I'd be like, oh my God. This is ridiculous. Drew Brees has these weapons. And I understand with veteran coach and a veteran quarterback a guy like this who may be seen as a locker room potentially locker room disturbance or a distraction. I'm not saying he that is the case. But even if you've seen that way that can create it because now the media will start asking questions thereby it becomes a distraction. But like Josh Gordon can work on the patriots Bella chicken bringing similar situation here. I get it. So you're thinking there is some upside maybe drew Brees can make this guy. Look like a hall of Famer again. There's also a potential downside, and that is the distraction that is the chemistry. This is a team that chimera can be the possession for job for so long. You don't think he'd be on his best behavior? I think it's possibly a help. But I don't think it's an enormous difference maker. I think the risk of it being a hindrance is too. Great for this team that looks like it may be the best team in football. I thought they would win it all going into the playoffs last year. It's it's maybe they don't want to take the saints their real success. Not just drew Brees and the old line. And the receiving core. Rush defense is the key. Like, they have a lot of things for that. You want to interject what if there's an injury. What about having more depth? Yes. That's what I'm saying. It's it could work that way. I don't see it as a difference maker. But it could work that way. Listen. Well, thank you for stepping out on a limb there, here's the reality of the situation. Drew Brees doesn't throw a lot of deep balls. Michael Thomas is has stood. We get all of that. But drew Brees doesn't throw a lot of deep. Balls. So you're talking about thorn in between the numbers instead of outside the numbers you're talking about a short range gain or short game. Picking you apart are lot. Kenny stabler from the eighties was obviously drew Brees has a much better arm, and we get all of that. But I'm just talking about the manner in which you're dissect it and picked apart when you look at what does Bryant brings to the table. I think that's incredible. I think it would be an incredible match made in heaven to be honest more. So for Dez Bryant than the New Orleans Saints. I'm not disagreeing with ending thing. That's what I'm saying finished. I'm not saying that the saints don't benefit they do benefit Dez benefits exponentially more. But the saints could stand the benefit number one because Dez can't catch passes in between the numbers number two because you're not asking him to go long number three because we're talking about one of the greatest passes in NFL history. All the time passing lead in NFL history. And drew Brees completing seventy seven percent of his passes this year, seventy six hundred three to be exact. If you look at what drew Brees brings to the table. You don't have to be open in order for drew Brees to get you the ball which to me, which to me is the part that everybody's underestimating about dad's potentially going to New Orleans. You're not asking Dez to be something. He's not a matter of fact, you're not even requiring it all you need him to be is what he's been drew Brees. We'll make him look better might Tom Michael Thomas. We'll make him look better Alvin Kamara and Mark Ingram. We'll make the offensive line. We'll make them look better. The offense of Leon will make him look better. It's so when you have all of that going on, and you are. Dez bryant. Remember, he didn't vibe with that? But he did with Tony Romo and Tony Romo. God bless of doing a great job of CBS, by the way. God bless, and we know he could play no one has ever confused. It would be drew Brees. Okay. So let's remember that that is the answer it fit. If the question was this who stands to it does Dez Bryant stand to benefit from this. Yes for it's all up SARS for the saints. There's potential upside there is also risked. So then you have to ask yourself does the upside over outweigh the risk. I'm not sure that it does for Dez by. Of course, drew Brees could wasn't gonna make them look bad. Of course, not. Did you do it? No, I probably wouldn't be going after this. I would I would. And then let me tell you. Why would hit first of all? Dez took a step back. I got it. He's lost a step. I've got it. He's not a scrub. He can play and bottom line is is that he also has something to prove now because people didn't pick him up and his name has been sullied. He's got a lot to prove you'll going you potentially going to New Orleans play for one of the greatest quarterbacks in NFL history who is having Hansi Wiens season. Yeah. Yeah. And they got a chance to win the Super Bowl. He's in a better situation. And he goes if does ri- goes to New Orleans he will be in the best situation of his career realize that hit will be situation that he was in. When he was in Dallas yet. That is true. They're not saying there are there are arguments for it or that that it's an easy decision. But what I just saw from the saints the way they're playing right now. Sometimes you see a team with chemistry where everything's working. And if you have a chance to get a special difference making kind of player. Okay. This is more of the kind of move that a team that really needs something and is willing to take a risk would would take especially this is the middle of the seasons late in the season already. And I'm not saying there aren't compelling arguments on the other side, we're I the saints. That's probably not the direction I would go. And I tell you something you want Dez Bryant somebody like death. Brought to help you move the change. Because a lot of times the the saints is a big play or nothing number to throw his come out. Say you're gonna Kamara you listen, but you could use Kamara Thomas's decoys you could do that to what you targeted excuse me. Let me tell you. It doesn't get target. You're thinking he might be a distraction. Let me tell you what you do with the structures when you're a Super Bowl contender. You throw them out. We yesterday's trash. That's what you do. So if Dez Bryant, thanks for one second, he has the leverage to walk into New Orleans, the home of Sean Payton and drew Brees, and Michael Thomas and be Avak via it the spy who Shagged me, please come on. Now. I don't think I have nothing to worry about that. There's gonna be all right. So let's go back to his former team. So we all know the Cowboys are off to a slow start. But we just heard Jerry Jones say yesterday and one five three the fan that he is committed to Dak Prescott as his long term quarterback. He used the word extension. Take a listen. Well, I think that is capable very capable of me say this just right for you is completely capable. I didn't know that two years ago, but he is capable. It's back is the quarterback of the Dallas Cowboys. He's young and he's going to get extended. Keywords Steve Knight. He's gonna get extended. He said he was very careful with what he said there didn't mince it is this a good idea is a good idea. But here's the thing that just absolutely flabbergasted me about the Cowboys specifically, Jerry Jones. So you didn't know he was ready three years two years ago when he led you to a thirteen three record and a berth to the playoffs. But now, you're three and five is struggling and he's five hundred since that three at thirteen but not your shoe. So you weren't sure what he was thirteen at three. But to show what what he's five hundred Jerry Jones. My goodness on the demand needs to be checked right now. This is just don't understand it. Okay. It makes no sense whatsoever. If you were if you were sure now, you should have been sure season one let me get that out the way. Now, let me say this. I have no problem with Jerry Jones position. Because Jerry Jones is telling us something without publicly acknowledging it admitting it that Prescott is not the problem. Jason Garrett in Scotland a hand on the problem the head coach in the coordinator if they were doing a better job than that Prescott would not be in this position. That's basically what he's saying. He don't want to admit it publicly problematic for Jerry Jones admit publicly because God forbid he stood up there until the truth in that regard. Because Jason Garrett is like an adopted son probably shopping for Christmas right now. But the point is at the end of the day when it comes down to you're saying your head coach and your offense coordinator is not doing the job. This is on them. It's not on deck Prescott. And although Dak Prescott has made his share of mistakes, and he has looked anything. But stellar we all see the impact that a damn good coach can have on a quarterback Jared Goff right here in LA, courtesy of show him vais instead of Jeff Fisher. That's what you got going. On the Dallas. And maybe Jerry Jones just told her on himself and let the world know change is indeed coming because damaged it needs to as a giants fan, I'm thrilled. And I think it's a great idea at the Cowboys are looking no farther than deck Prescott. He should he should retain him. Seriously. Dak Prescott is not a guy who's going to stop a great team from winning a Super Bowl. In fact, he's even a guy who may get hot when you need him to under pressure. I think he's that kind of player where if he has a great team. Maybe he actually helps them win a Super Bowl. He's not a guy who's gonna make up for deficiencies on your team and put you over the top like Aaron Rodgers and Tom Brady has become this as his career went on are the kind of guys who can take a bad team and make them better than they ought to be a guy like Ben Rothlisberger. If he has the weapons you can win the Super Bowl with that. Ben Ross give Ben Rothlisberger weapons. He's going to really use them. There's guys like manning. If he's on a really good team. Not only is he not going to hold you back. But at the moment of truth, he's gonna put you over the top. And maybe Dak Prescott. Maybe could be like an ally. Type. Maybe I think that's that's looks like the ceiling for him. And that's fine. But what are we see in the NFL? Your time to strike with a quarterback like that is on their rookie deal because they're not expensive. So if you want to extend back and still win the Super Bowl, you gotta do. The Elway thing middle-class quarterback if you extend them as like for nineteen million a year, you will never win a Super Bowl if you extend them nineteen million over three years now you've cost controlled quarterback. You know, the guy's not gonna make you better. But at least he can hold it down. And now you have money and resources to spend in other areas. You only spend a fourth round pick on him. So extend him. But only if the price is right. John Elway would handle this. Exactly. Right. First of all, why are you worried about that? There can be no wrong price because Dak doesn't have much leverage. Was he going to do? Well, what's he going to do? Excuse me. Excuse me. I'm not sure if this status is on restricted, A, B, M, more importantly, let's keep this in mind because he's been strong. He's been struggling. It's the perfect time for Jerry Jones to take the position that you're going to keep him why? Because he's not in the strongest position possible to get paid as much as he might deserve down the line when you're under five hundred this season when you've got a five hundred record at twelve and twelve over the last two years when you seemed incapable of doing anything without Zeke Elliott for six games last year when you've been up and down roller coaster ride this year, but you believe enough in him that's the perfect time to engage a contract negotiations because you're the one with deliver. What else you know, what Jerry Jones will not be doing this season or this Peng off season spending a first round pick on a quarterback? You know, why? Because they don't have a first round pick to find out about their quarter. So So Jerry is saying he's going to extend the quarterback at a moment. When what choice does he have? It's not. His though Dak has zero leverage year. That's why I'm saying when it shakes out if you have him to a contract that pays him as just a guy. You're all right. A penny. One above that. You're hurting yourself come on now. I mean, I it's not gonna happen. Now. I'm just saying I mean, you're not gonna listen Jerry Jones loves his money. Ain't got. I mean think about it. You clean your own glasses. No, no, no, I clean my own. I'm not a billionaire. I'm not a billion. I'm working on it though. My name is Lauren. I'm thirty three. I didn't want my identity to be the smoking mom my first experience with jewel. I do remember being like distance good. It's it's it's like a cigarette. But not I don't miss smoking at all. Like, I can officially say it grosses me out jewel is the tobacco alternative that delivers nicotine satisfaction without cigarette. Ashra lingering odor. Make the switch at J U, L dot com slash sports. Warning, this products nicotine nicotine is an addictive chemical. Right now month, the Collins CJ McCollum making headlines this morning after a huge night. Mccollum led the way for the trailblazers pointing in forty points, nineteen alone in the third including a savage move undaunted Chen. So in case you missed it. We got to we go to Portland now. This is a play. We're talking about late in the third McCollum working on John to given ten so hits the fadeaway jumper now. Twenty seconds left in the third McCollum making the move on Devon ten so and he falls to the ground running around him the loader he'd post nineteen points in that one in the third quarter. Now in the fourth blazers lead by eleven McCollum working up top drives the defense with good visit kicked it to Evan Turner for the dagger three pointer, the blazers hand bucks just a second loss of the season. Also shining last night Mavs rookie look at Don Kitch up by four in the first quarter gone. It's here. Hit three pointer twenty three points on the night. Now late in the second quarter. Dennis Smith junior finding Don cage down four. For the mass of the nineteen point lead. Under fifty seconds to Bill in the game. Smith junior driving on toy Brown junior finishing with that monster dunk Mavs win one nine thousand nine to one hundred days snapped a six game losing streak. Now. Let's get you back. I take. To you. To play for a month round, a great. You can't play defense away. The Los Angeles Lakers have been playing defense. Bamyan help shoot out coaching. Outside get to do. Let's go on on everybody beautiful shot up the staple center. Good morning to you. I take out here in downtown, Los Angeles. And all the action goes down there tonight because the Lakers will be playing, and it's no surprise they've gotten off to a slow start. But they did just add Tyson Chandler, and they host the timber wolves this evening. The other thing that happened as well as the drama going around with the Luke Walton situation and Reggie Miller. Joined the Dan Patrick show, offering his suggestions, take a listen. It was magic in Pelinka that went to before he massages said don't worry about a slow start. You gotta give them a leash. It understand the struggles. That's going to happen. When you've got LeBron James and a bunch of young hard-working guys. But they don't know how to win how they finish this year. They've got to make the playoffs. I will say this. If they don't make the playoffs. I could see them making the change, but they should make the playoffs, and then whomever, they bring into the after bringing in another free agent next summer. That's when the Lakers are on the clock. That's when you can't get off the slow starts. That's when the scrutiny for magic for rob Pelinka for Luke Walton for LeBron James to me it all starts next season. Okay. So that was Reggie Miller on the Dan Patrick show. He says stay the course next year is the key max, what should the Lakers do what they should do is. In fact, what they're doing like the the idea that Luke Walton it's always unfair to the incumbent coach when a new regime comes in magic and Pelinka come in and he's not there handpicked guy. So we all know when the new regime comes into a team the guy who they haven't handpicked has a short leash. The only way to survive is. He must be great good is not good enough. We know Luke. So this is perfect the way this is shaking out for the Lakers. We know Luke Walton is a good coach in the sense that he took a warriors team with half a season did better than Steve Kerr did with them Steve Kerr, great coach. Right. We know Luke Walton is at least good. But is he great is simply going to take the basic general philosophy of the warriors and Naff it onto the Lakers. Or can he take the lessons that Steve Kerr? Oh, really exemplified as a coach. Which is I'm taking from here. I'm taking from there. I have a full toolbox. And here is my set of players and let me apply the proper tool to this unique circumstance rather than kind of write a prescription one size fits all. Right. If Luke Walton can be a great coach. But only if he can be a great coach he'll keep his job a lot of times that's unfair to the incumbent. But as I said yesterday, this is the loss Angeles Lakers number one franchise by far in the history of basketball worldwide in the known universe, Lakers number one in the modern era by far and look Bron James just got there. This franchise needs and deserves a great coach. That's the only way Luke Walton saves his job and that remains to be seen. First of all you stand path for the rest of the season as a pertains to Luke Walton? Although if he did not listen to my suggestion yesterday on national television, right here when I said modified that coaching staff magic wants more experienced guys on his roster. I'm telling you that for reason, Luke Walton, listen, if you don't hear me, I don't know what to tell you. That's number one number two. Let me put this out of frustrate right now. Max Kellerman, the Los Angeles Lakers. Excuse me. I want I'm away I'm away. Wait until we finished with that video not that the producers are doing anything wrong. But I want the camera looking at me when I say this Brandon Ingram should be traded trade Brandon Ingram package him. I don't care if this would Lonzo Kentavious Colwell PO as long as only all. Oh, trade them. As long as it's not harder coach fan that keep blah broad, coups and heart. I don't give a damn who else you give up, but as Pacific -ly trade Brandon Ingram package him with contagious. Call. Well, pope Lonzo ball both throw in a ballboy masseuse of somebody to do pedophile. All baggage. All right. Do all the Washington Wizards for Bradley Beal. That's what you do. Because I'm about to get into the water to whether to tell to tell everybody about that trust city that watched last night. But before I do that let me be clear. Brandon Ingram doesn't fit on. This Laker squad doesn't fit in the them. What magic set? I you know, how much I love. Magic johnson. We go back a very very long way would sit right there next to you MAC. And when he said Brandon Ingram we were running out of time. What did I do y'all? I'll look right ahead. Like really that. God that's our second. Stop it. Nobody's buying that. Brandon Igwe ka play. He is not a scrub. But he doesn't fit on this Lakers squad. Berlin, the Lakers should trade him. Yeah. The Kent packets Casey p logs. Oh, if you. If you. Trade. You do what you gotta do you? You you call Ernie Brooklyn and Washington with because dammit wholesale changes here, they take place in judo ready to go there. When Magic Johnson came on this show and was touting Brandon Ingram and Lonzo ball. What did I say the next day or the next show? It may have been was that a Friday show the next show. We came on the fact that he's doing that tells me he's pumping those guys up because he's thinking about moving them because he knows kouzmine and heart even if they have less upside or already good NBA players like Josh art and Kyle Kuzma or league average ish already at their position. So you got three guys Steven said with three of the starting five, and when you have when you have LeBron James at the hell of a starting five two other guys league average already in their young. And you need another star at least. So we agree. Lonzo ingram. Magic wants to inflate their value to move them for a star. I don't know that Bradley Beal is the right. Stop. Saying, okay. Okay. Let me say this because we don't go to the wizards. And I understand that the reason why Bradley Beal at work. I'm not trying to tell you. He some superstar. I'm trying to tell you him in concert with heart and Kulu, Judy addressed the perimeter. And because it's a trade as opposed to pick up a free agency. It doesn't compromise. What you want to do next summer that to my thinking? That's all I wanted to say about that. Can we get to the wizard? So you want them to trade Ingram just to be clear. Okay. Just make sure I got okay. To our nation's capital. We go on nervous for this subject as the wizards fall the two on the season after getting blown out by the Mavs night. John wall said the team just as in communicating law out on the floor Dwight Howard. Yep. He's there with that. Team said the effort just isn't there with this team? Stephen a Smith. Is it time to blow up the wizards? Just to this is tough will blow up it didn't work already Grunfeld. It did work for those who don't know one talking about only Grunfeld is the president of basketball operations, this this conversation hurts me because Ernie Grunfeld, and I go back to his days with the Knicks. I've known this map over twenty five years. I love that man. But this is a disgrace taking place in the nation's capital. We've been talking to people had their opinion of a negative Roddy about what else goes on in the next capital? Thank god. They didn't contaminate themselves pro by going over to the Dave Rogers center, what a disgrace that has taken place in the nation's capital. Scott Brooks say that again, gotta go gotta go, and listen, let me let me be very clear, I've known Scott Brooks like him. I'm not trying to say he can't coach he is not the right man for this job. This job requires a heavy hammer. Scott Brooks is one of the nicest guys, you could ever meet. The problem with that is that unfortunately, you don't like confrontation with the wizards unique confrontation. Let me tell you why. Because I got to reach that told him to look it up. Rob me, look, just like you. Please. Let me look let me read not as you the wizard the two and eight that's the second west worker, then please ladies done. Give me Tom with this this day. I want to see the video you get it off the screen, please come back to we don't need to see Scott. I got a better look to him. Anyway, here's the deal to eight. Then a second worst team next next to Cleveland, twenty-sixth and offensive deficiency. Twenty eighth in defensive efficiency. They're getting out scored by ten point three points per game third worst than the NBA. They can't suit shooting. Just thirty one point three percent from three point rates, which is Fort Worth in the NBA. They don't rebound a rank debt last. But it gets worse. Max Kelvin I got John Wolf contract right here. And let me give us sat out to Rich Paul because he deserves profited. There's nothing better than an agent that gets you your money when it clearly when it looks like they don't deserve it. Now. Let's be clear. Okay. John wall here signed a four-year supermax deal. The what sixty nine point three million this next season hasn't even kicked in yet. Hens get he's getting paid thirty seven point eight next year forty point eight the year. After forty three point eight million to get after did have. Did have the opposite. Shit up forty six point nine billion dollars. Not the we're not coming back now that team now, listen, I like John wall. John wall is it all stop John Hall could play then this year. Rod for some reason. A man that struggled with his perimeter shooting comes back and assuming. He can't get to the whole with the what they eat that he used to he's actually bigger. He looks out of say that's a problem. So now, you got that the problem then you got him at Beale Mesic at the problem. It's contaminated Moore. Keep more was who can play. He looks comatose at the top one hundred. I was going to play twelve does not have the word a contract on that said, let me tell you something you could say that. But what I said to you is that John Hall. He can bowl Molly Yang. I'm listening. Right. Not questioning John walls abilities. I'm questioning his level of production. It ain't just job to score. It's your job to lead to lead. They have no leadership. They have no chemistry. They don't even look like they wanna play together. Don't get me. Started hanging out together. Got Dan Schorr. I've seen it. Okay. And the next capital enough. Trust me that if they were doing it. Nope. So you're looking at that Otto porter looks coma. Toth Markeith more isn't playing up to snuff. And that has a lot to do which point guard, and you'll lack leadership and that enough that you got the super max deal. But it hasn't even kicked it yet. The nation's capital when it comes to the port of basketball Stanley Cup championship in hockey have absolutely positively nothing to look forward. To this situation is an abomination it has to change. And a fortunately, you're can't trade wall because of the contract that I just entering rich made that Bradley Beal is your one commodity, that's movable and the way he's got a fifteen percent. Trae kick kickin. It's that means wall wall. That means if you're trying to max, you gotta give fifteen percent at what y'all. Yeah. Yeah. Maxine you get him to be able to. Oh, I would say no it's not the time to Brooke blow. Great tea, calm down time till the blow up the wizards. I disagree. Stephen at a time to blow up the wizards was at least a year ago. This is what I mean when I say trade them a year too early instead of a year too late you'll branch Rickey sang said it about the legion of boom in Seattle. But they're still good, right? You can get something for them when they are perceived as fat Natta shape and not good anymore, and they have a huge contract. Now, you can't get anything for them. It is painful to make unsentimental sober decisions. The likes of which Bill Belichick makes those field. The fan base doesn't like it. The media doesn't like it. What are you doing? Not like it. It not always. But usually a lot of the time right now this wizards team does not have a lot of assets they can move. They overpaid auto Puerto who's a nice little player, but not a hundred million dollar player. They overpaid. John wall clear. Bradley Beal's a nice player. How much is he how much how much better is? He than Avery Bradley, a little better is he a superstar though. He's a nice player that you're not gonna really hit TV your most tradeable asset. Good luck like rebuilding that team. Now, the guy's clearly none of them seem to like each other. It's clear that they weren't going to ascend to become the best team in the east for at least two seasons. Now of now is John wall. Untradable, I don't know. You know there. There's a sucker out there with the Sixers look at him and think maybe he puts us over the top even though we can't shoot with the Knicks thing. Hey, we need a star point guard. They usually do stupid things like that, man. Don't make me take some water and throw it over there. Did you just I just explained to you the brothers one hundred sixty nine million dollar contract hasn't even started yet? It's a bag. We're looking at him. Listen, this is the worst contract. Ryan Howard, scientists Philadelphia, Molly, how do you? How do you salary on Trump? How do you sign a contract? Com in overweight. Who've done that overweight. Becoming overweight excuse me. Listen talking about how do you do this? How do you do? I'm looking at people at our nation's capital better than this tracking. The domestic doesn't Bundy you come to find them hiding under wardrobes next to low soaks due to sudden ill scurry off what's ugly fascinating about the dust bunny? Is that ov- o- they'll actually sanctioned creatures when they would not only saves people money, but also has ninety seven percents customer satisfaction rating. It's obvious to them you should switch because Yesler. Switching to Geico. Is a no brainer. Oh, no. It's the dust bunnies. Only natural Prentice on the long run along. Welcome back to Los Angeles, very exciting week of college football, ending with the Alabama feet down of LSU that had ordure on calling out his team it is a Wednesday. So you know, what that means time for our weekly visit from our friend the mouth of the south whole fine bomb. How we doing Paul man, I'm doing great. I need to go to an ENT Manhattan, though after that last segment, Molly paint here. It is out of control. He is on. Let me ask the question Paul finebaum. Molly Kerem since I want to say something. Karen campbell. My question is the question is the question. John would y'all y'all want me to sit back and mumble like my brother shat that which I want. Now, if you wanted to do that you want me to do that. For you're doing. No, no. Are you taking a shot Shaq? That's is. On TV. My talk. I could do that to my brother. I could lose. I listen to him. I usually don't listen to him all day half forty cents that what you're saying. I can mumble I could do that be mellow. I'm just saying. All right. All right. Strive let me ask you this. Michigan moves into the top four. I like low key support Michigan now. Full disclosure watch. A lot of Michigan games if they don't beat Ohio State. Does this even matter the success that they're having not really because it Michigan? That's what you're what you prime for. That's what you work all your four in. I think Molly by the way Sunday morning. I said something nice about Jim Harbaugh. Sportscenter man before the guy rolled out of bed. I got blown up on Twitter by Stephen Smith. My point being that there is more pressure on Jim Harbaugh today than there would have been if he was just going into this game with a mediocre season. Owen three maybe you're about to go and four because no one really has any faith in the buckeyes right now urban Meyer looks like a broken. I don't think he is. I don't think they are. But this is enormously important in Michigan loses the entire season, if they can't beat the buckeyes Paul or during calling out his team talking about we got overpowered and stuff like that considering it's Alabama, and they're going to do that to everyone. And like, what are you supposed to do? I read that as like an indictment of himself as a recruiter. We're you're right. I mean, like isn't that really the question with coach Ken, he recruit at the level? It's going to take. Well, that's fair point match because he built this entire season about beating Alabama. Now, remember he took over two years ago in the middle of the season. For last mile. But these are now mostly his players especially a quarterback. Joe borough was a graduate transfer from from Ohio State, and everyone thought he was going to be the salvation, and he was barely serviceable against Alabama. So yes, but it's not the first time a couple of weeks earlier. Jeremy Pruitt did the same thing. So we don't have the players a right right now. I don't think anyone in the SEC with a possible exception. And I don't even think they do of Georgia have the players right now to beat Alabama. I'm wondering why are we even playing these games? Paul. I I mean, I'm just hopeful I'm hopeful and prayerful that somebody will give us some kind of a competitive match up of all the teams that are out there. The other four teams I'm not talking about just the three teams in the playoff picture. But those on the outside looking in. Is there anybody that can give us a game by the time, you know, late in the second half Ross five minutes in the game. And we won't even know the outcome is that possible. Yeah. I mean, I have to answer the question. So I will it is Clemson at the moment. I don't think I don't I don't think it's Georgia. Although they were they would maybe be next. Clemson is is good for a couple of reasons. Stephen they have a really good in dynamic quarterback in Trevor large. He can get the ball up and down the field. They have a great running back. But the key for Clemson is the defense they have come come and gone this year. They didn't look good early. They're looking better now against some tomato cans from the the ACC. But but I think that's it. And besides they've already played Alabama three straight years in the playoffs. So they know what they're getting into. Let me ask you this in golf script for a second. So I'm a fan of the New York football giants. Okay. And your quarterback. Clearly. Yes. Do you feel like to at the next level is going to translate in the NFL, and I apologize to norby for the double barreled question. Or is there some other quarterback that they should be targeting? Symbolizes question comes up every year. I mean, he won't be eligible this year. Herbert seems to be the best of a lot. Drew lock. Oh, it looks like an NFL pocket passion quarterback to too. I think is can you? Wait, can you wait another year for two of them? I think is really the question, Molly. And and how in the world did you end up a fan of the New York Giants eight Paul one of the teams it won't be challenging Alabama Clemson whooped up on his Louisville. Who's just been terrible. This year was Lamar Jackson and even better college quarterback than we realized what is going on down there. Yeah. I mean, I think he was extremely good. This is finally caught up to Bobby portray. No, it wasn't that long ago that Bobby portrayal was in the SEC at Arkansas about eight years ago and considered the second best coach to Nick Sabin. He went to Louisville, of course, and he built quite a program there. But it's over for him. Bobby portray knows nine only a dislike -able guy. He he's a surly guy. But but. But it's caught the the the defense is have caught up to his offense. The only problem with getting rid of having not Pyo on. He's got about a fourteen billion dollar buyout and Louisville. You think they've gone through some turmoil? Getting rid of Rick Pitino getting rid of time, George they athletic director their basketball program in chaos now their football program. So I I don't know if the school can stomach biting that bullet and paying fourteen million dollars to get rid of between and really with no option. I mean, they could they could bring in rom who's who's an alum of the school from Purdue assuming he would even take the job. Appreciate the insight as always I will see you Sunday in Bristol, my friend. You have a lovely day. Thank you best. All the way you said you said apologies to. Annoy me who's that? Okay. In the world did not. So we waited. There's no I'm just saying I'm saying you said no can't wear. My name is Lauren. I'm thirty three. I didn't want my identity to be the smoking mom my first experience with jewel. I do remember being like distance good. It's it's it's like a cigarette but nine I don't miss smoking. At all like, I can officially say it grosses me out jewel is the tobacco alternative that delivers nicotine satisfaction without cigarette. Asher lingering odor. Make the switch at J U, L dot com slash sports. Warning this team nicotine is an addictive chemical.

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7.22: Tomorrow (Live with cast and crew of The West Wing)

The West Wing Weekly

2:14:32 hr | 1 year ago

7.22: Tomorrow (Live with cast and crew of The West Wing)

"Hi Ho Josh here. Before we start the episode I want to tell you about a brand new podcast series called partners that was created by my partner Rishikesh as her way partners is a terrific show about the connection between two people who have made something together Richie interviews them and then meticulously edits that into an intimate portrait of their relationship as told in their own words. Now there are all kinds of partnerships featured in the podcast every episode features. A different set of partners like the CO founders of Instagram the author and the illustrator of the hit cookbook salt fat acid heat w digs of Hamilton and his best friend collaborator Rafael Castle and the Co creators of the Emmy Winning TV. Show crazy ex girlfriend and a bunch more it is a beautiful touching fascinating fascinating and often hilarious show about how to people manage to connect and learn from each other and build something together. Plus look it's made by Richie so hopefully you already. I know that it's GonNa be great and you're probably GONNA love it. It's a male Tim. PODCAST produced in partnership with our friends at Radio Tokyo. So right now look pause the episode. If you have to just do this now go subscribe to partners by Rishikesh her way and you can leave a five star review while you're there and tell him how much you're looking forward to listening to it. You can also find partners partners and links to subscribe to the podcast at partners dot show. Now you can get enhanced security for your home wifi network with xfinity the x Fi if it's connected it's protected now. That's simple easy. Awesome go to xfinity DOT COM. Call one eight hundred xfinity or visit a store today to learn more restrictions apply. Hello you're listening to the final episode of the West Wing Weekly. They're not booing there yelling Josh. I'm Joshua Malina and I'm Rishikesh your way way happy birthday John. Thank you all so much for being here. Thanks Josh for being here on your birthday. The most pathetic way to have a party and charge at the door. WE'RE DELIGHTED TO BE HERE AT THE ACE hotel we'll show botulinum the delightfully unger podge. Good Ace hotel. How awesome is this venue before we get started tonight? We want to take advantage of the fact that for the first time ever on this final episode. Our team is all here in the same place. So please welcome Zach macneice Margaret Miller Nick Song. AH quickly before we move on. I know this is going to turn into a jumble of an evening and chaos and finishes. I WANNA make sure to say that. I've let's talk this privately. I want to say publicly much like the West Wing itself the West Wing Weekly is certainly a collaborative effort but also like the West Wing. It is in its Own Way the vision of one man with drive and vision and creativity spare and that is risky Chrissy here. It's the truth today. We're discussing episode twenty two of season seven the series finale of the West Wing. It's called and I'm doing this under duress but it's called How can you not be inspired by that? Little mop it I can tell you know on. I can tell you I was written by John Wells. It was directed by Christopher. I don't act like he's here and first aired on May fourteenth two thousand six six over ten million viewers watched this finale and their names are for this final synopsis. It seems appropriate to the Roman philosopher. Seneca who said every new beginning comes from some other beginnings and and yes that's also a line from the song closing time we have a few guests as you might be able to help from these chairs. I'm going to say their names. And then and they will come out in whatever order but please welcome to discuss the episode with US Tonight Bradley. Whitford Mary. macomer the Allison Smith writer at Mrs Helen Santos Teri Polo the Director of this episode. Christopher Miss Yano the the incoming president-elect Jimmy Smits and last but not least by the way in this house when he stands nobody sits our president Martin Sheen and that's the show. I'm emotionally drained already. Let's start from the beginning. Actually before this episode aired. NBC replayed the pilot of the West Wing. There was also a commercial for studio sixty on the sunset strip. Tomorrow begins is with the white screen black type treatment. The unusual one make sense for our final and it's inauguration day the whole episode takes place over the one day the first person who we see the president elect Santos thoughtfully gazing out the window. Yes Santos is very folger's commercial centers in the window looking very very manly with his morning cup of Joe Various wounding six. Am and then we see Josh in bed with the comforter tastefully pulled up to hide his bare chest hiding also with the scar. No scar and Josh is not alone. He's there with Donna. They're back from vacation. Shen still together. It's a sweet scene even just even though it's wordless it's really beautiful tender moment and it's nice to know that these two kids made it back from their trip and and are still going strong. Also another swooning seen it made me pine for a men of West Wing calendar calendar where I would be any month other than February. There is a theme in this episode. Owed of men thoughtfully gazing out the window. We got to get to more of them later. I we get to CJ. She's reading the newspaper Super and listening to the news at the same time which I'm impressed by multitasking ability and she has an expression that I would describe as inscrutable maybe melancholy I duNno. She's the news is calling the Bartlett era often tumultuous which I think is accurate. That's how they sustained seven seasons and then enter. Will Bailey early this baldy installed in the office. Which means that toby's still there too in a lot of ways? Toby's spirit hangs over this whole episode even though Richard Schiff does not actually appear in the episode. His presence nonetheless is there. Yeah the main plot of this episode other than sort of tying things up and bringing us to a gentle stop is the question of will toby get pardoned or not and the president is up this morning as well also thoughtfully gazing out a window. It's a good look for a president. Sure and they have to amortize the cost of those windows over the course of a season one more episode to use them. I feel like if you're going to contemplate the future of the world. It's good to have some nice natural lighting. And if you look actually if you Google President looking out the window there are a lot of results Pete. Souza got a lot of mileage out of President Obama just looking out of a window. Christopher Misano IRIGA could you tell us about what conversations you had before you started filming this episode. So what were the discussions like at a practical level in terms of all the things that you had to accomplish with this finale. Well it's been a very long time. John had written the script right and and he basically E- sent us. The gift was able to go to Washington. There was one story that Jimmy do you remember being out with Michael. Hello Neil and Terry and being out walking through a school and we got outside and we were GONNA film the end of the scene and the National Cathedral Bell started to ring and I thought okay cut. We'll wait and then they went and literally than we sent the PA and they went at the National Cathedral and they were ringing for two hours. It was a concert being recorded and did it hold up filming for dine entire time. God bless Jimmy and Teri and Mike Low Neil. They kept speaking just a little louder but anyway we by that point I think we had such a shorthand that John and I we had some conversations but they weren't in depth about it. It was like we kind of all felt and what this was which was a kind of reverie to what we had done and I think everybody staring out the window what I feel guilty about already is so. We like to feel a little criticize redundant we do. Oh Chris this is what we do but we just knew that it was thoughtful and it is slightly different pace than we had marched through the halls all the rest of at the time as a director to begin the final episode. Or are you feel fresh absolute. Did I psyched and scared. But they go this. I seen with the the president and the first lady on their last morning in the White House is a really point. One and I think one of the most immediate impressions this episode gives it is not triumphant. I think on either side really even for the incoming president and the outgoing president. There isn't this sense of fist pumping victory and I think even just that contemporary look out the window you can tell with both of them that they're they're thinking about something larger than themselves so it's not a criticism criticism at all but one of the things. I love about this episode because of what John Christopher did is that it has a strong sense of what's lost in addition to what's gain and like the transition of power is not treated lightly. Here's a criticism. Though not of you know the Brad's performance comment. The first lady talks about how cold. It's going to be inauguration. And and she he says this mind decided that January would be the best time of year to hold an outdoor ceremony. North of the Equator Jefferson Franklin. None of them came up with the idea of inauguration. In January inauguration until nineteen thirty-three was march fourth. A much better time to stand outside. The first inauguration took place on April thirtieth seventeen eighty-nine and then from seventeen march for it but there was bad weather. Bad weather is funny. Apparently and then from seventeen ninety three until nineteen thirty three. They were held on March Fourth Twentieth. The amendment addressed the change and that's right because previously March fourth was the day on which the federal government began operations but then with the Twentieth Amendment Inauguration Day moved moved to January twentieth. And that's where it's been ever since unless it's on Sunday. And then they do January twenty first ally had they missed that. Yeah you know. It's funny watching the episode rewatching the episode. I caught at this time. I have no memory of that error. But it's but it's a commonly known Lawrence O'Donnell and I were just talking backstage about this. Are you saying that Lawrence ars not at all quiet about who you've been chatting with backstage Mr just off to a bad start. Forgive me all right. I will say this. I think the reason that was changed was because the transition to FDR was such a long one. The previous is president. Bill that was a lame duck exactly and it was felt at the time that it was just months where nothing happened in the country really needed relief. And that was the impetus for changing. That and I should stop now because I'm already behind. No I really mystified. That mistake. made it through and don't really know why and neither do people that I talked to on the phone. Context with repeated with Dr Bartlett's trying to joke a bit but the president is not in a joking mood and she can read them and I love that without having to explain anything as she says. You did a lot of good jet I did. Could you tell us a little bit about what it was like. Working with. Stockard channing the dynamic that the two of you have on screen. I was talking to her backstage. And she said my only disappointment working with daughter is that she did not like one of my my favorite movies Greece. It was forbidden forbidden topic. I don't know why let you didn't like the movie. She didn't like herself in it. She was terrific nine thought so too. Maybe she'll get this message and then she can come on the next episode soon. Did it take a long time for the two of you to find a rhythm that seemed onscreen to be so natural and so lived in. There wasn't did just wasn't enough time I'm on your television. You have to move very quickly and I was delighted. I don't mind saying that I had made some suggestions inch for the first lady that we're not accepted but I was delighted. Names spill seriously sister. Mr Yes new Farrell. Come on out interesting yes. She was my first choice rate. I you got bigger problems than Greece. Now I'm done. I think with the business of the series mostly done what comes through in this episode is that it's mostly about the marriages of these two administrations. Those are my favorite parts of the episode. Owed the moments between the president of the first lady and the president-elect and the first lady elect first lady in waiting and and they're really beautiful complements to one another sort of see this kind of symmetry. But also you know the regret on President Bartlett's side and then this sort of stepping into the unknown void on the Santos aside Terry or Jimmy. Could you tell us about what what your memories were about. foaming this last episode. He thought I'd never or leave. I do know that we watching them recently. The banter between the spouses was something that was an ongoing thread with all of the couple characters. Whether you were male male female female male husband wife and I thought that that was beautiful that that was the jets the position that was happening there. I love this moment between Han and Matt early on where Helen comes in and asks it just felt very real. She asks which necklace to wear and Math Santos tells her and then she decides is to the other one. Did you guys. You guys are prepping for the inauguration at Blair House did you shoot at Blair us or that's a no no well we. We were allowed to exit Blair House. Everyone's allowed to lead A. Ah You just stand in front of it and I don't think that's true during the scout we were actually invited in and we got to go through Blair House and we actually got to go down into the basement and see the sign in book which had gone these signature. Sure in it and I don't know I I can't remember as my memory's not great how or why but had been through the West Wing. I got to go visit Blair House and got the sand in the room. Yeah Yeah Huge Will Bailey. Fans I remember I got this. I got to stand in the room. Where Francis Preston Blair offered the generalship of the Union Army you to Lee which of course turned down and went to the other guys? How Ya? It's an incredible place. It's an incredible place. In Abraham Lincoln sat with with his advisors and all the rest it was it was an incredible moment but when we filmed we were able to stab them in the door and then step the magazine. Yeah there was also I think infamous assassination attempt attempt on president. Truman's life in front of Blair House. There's a lot of history in Blair House. It's a downer. But where did we shot. We actually shot that scene on the stages didn't we didn't we shoot. The scene of us. Getting Ready on the stage is is getting ready stages but it was that. Walk the walk across the street that we actually shot from Blair House. Yeah inside Blair House or not Blair House As the Santos is getting ready Bram knocks on the door and Helms a little surprised because he just comes right in. I think we've gone from the era of the walk and talk to the knocking walk. That is it's very Downton Abbey. I think the knock and immediate entrance. Isn't that what they do. You guys watch any other. TV Justice. Terry I love your performance in this moment. I'm going to play this clip on an adventure. What you told me when you wanted to run for city council and I didn't want you the two not being adventure? What was I doing to him the I will say? There is a whole vibe between the Santos that is very playful or it. But that's not what's happening in this moment. I think it's just I was putting his clothes on. It just feels like there's so much subtext loaded in this moment. It feels like a combination of pride and also this recognition that life visit never ever going to be the same and all of the feelings that go along with that acceptance. I felt like that that all came through. It's really beautiful moment. It's it's very much like the Crown Wash Matt but what you're giving up as you as you ascend to power you know what's really interesting about their chemistry and throughout the whole thing was I always sense that there was from Helen. There was a reticence since A. I don't know if I really want to do this. and Are we really doing this. And I guess you're just kind of okay. We're doing this okay. Cool on the first first lady and in that moment I think it was more about her giving him and encouraging him and in supporting him because he was nervous he had you know but I I think that that was more about him for her of supporting him. And and just making sure that it's tyler tyler good because he's a horrible tire. Yeah it was. That was always very interesting. I was just going to say one thing rewatching the episode. That that I thought was very interesting. Was the audience knows the complexity of being married in that building in a way that the Santos's don't yet so it's a very pregnant moment I think and that's true of a number of those little hand off moments watching it. which is that we have so much more information about the toll it takes about the highs and lows and everything everything is head of them and can you tell us what your involvement in the writing of the script was John? John not not a whole lot. I mean other within the fact that yeah. I'm just I'm really just here to tell you who's backstage. Ally was in charge urge of the inauguration research but one the thing that I remember really even before the last say three episodes was John Asking the writing staff you know. Think about moments you you want to see as we wrap up the series. Think about things you want to pay off and just you know how you would want the show to end because I think he always had in mind that this was going to be a really valedictory episode and that it was going to be maybe a little less story driven than kind of emotional conclusion so there was discussion in the writer's room about bad ad and everybody chimed in different things here and there. I think the stuff about the train. The ice storm that affected that Amtrak train. I had researched and given that. Actually exactly this is actually me saying how little I had to do with the in this appearance Eli Attie becomes our most frequent guest true. WELL EDGING OUT EDGING AT Bradley Whitford by one. It's it's I'm GonNa leave now and he can. No It's been a pleasure and I know this is probably the second half but it really feels to me and and I've talked to other people here that it's the end of the kind of a second run of the show. It's been such a lovely thing to have been a part of this twice you so thanks to you both. I'd like to talk about this train. Seen Oh yeah. You mean the crux of the episode. The money seen gene unveiled it. Anyway becomes the Amtrak regional train. And I'm just going to play. This sounds like a state matter. Yes but it's between the Exeter and haverhill stops also known as the New Hampshire Massachusetts Border Governor and I'm impressed with the accuracy because the Amtrak the regional does in fact stop between those two cities however I cried. Let's not get too excited. United because Kate mispronounces both of them and it was the last day she how imperative on behalf of Exeter. And Hey we were pretty loaded at that point and then even more shocking and to me is I mean the President says nothing New Hampshire came. I thought what self-respecting a New England. pedants let's that slide. Certainly not this one. What is the correct pronunciations hateful and Exeter? Oh pinky pick the new baby. She had a new baby. My milk was coming in also coming in. Is Charlie Nice segue. Thank you trolleys wandering the halls he meets up with. Cj they're discussing some of the last minute business that has to be taken care of they get to see Jay's office and Mars there and I love that. Cj Calls Margaret Sugar. It's a nickname. I'm that I only really started to appreciate recently over the course of this podcast. At some point I heard Josh calling one of his family members. Sugar over the phone and it was so cute it was nice. I always thought about this before. It's sort of like a creepy thing. That is only old-timey detectives said it like hey sugar I wish I could pull it off. Gibson said sugar tits. Is that creepy sweet borderline so. The president gets both governors online to deal with this circa trained situation. Both of them are online. They're both waiting to be spoken to. And he says to will and tecate gestures both of them and says pick a number two or four and will says two and Kate says for which is entirely predictable that they could have chosen to different numbers. You're asking to different people. Choose to different numbers. Just pick one person. I think he was talking to me though. I think he was talking to me when I just jumped in and the president gets frustrated. But it's silly strategy. It's almost as nonsensical as Leo suggestion in the season. Six Finale for three way rock paper scissors match which by the way was also written by John Wells which makes me wonder. How does he make make decisions? What the hell are you guys going to do after this? The also mallory is back in this the joining us for the first time on our podcast. Listen Smith I WANNA start. I WANNA start at the very the beginning. I WANNA I wanNA talk about any. We've already referenced. It slightly slightly insulted. You didn't use a clip of me played any on Broadway when I was young. How old were you only? I only do finale name tomorrow. Parents it had a little more of foresight. We would have gotten your club that we can do. A little live Hajjah stuck with a J. Square and lonely. You do my gym and green you. saw as a that was a mic drop. We definitely should have charged more for these tickets. That was awesome. Okay Okay how did you get to be in the West Wing from the very beginning. What's your origin story? And what's your superpower. The origin story is that I went in for Mallory. O'Brien and I had a friend friend at the time Eric Stoltz and I said I have this audition and he said Oh you gotta talk fast you gotTa Talk Fast All my sports nights friends like you gotTa Talk Really Fast so I was lucky to have that tip and and I talked really fast in that audition and I walked doubt. Aaron was there and Tommy and John Wells and I walked out and I had that actually moment where I was like. I think I could do better better and I had that horrible horrible thing that you can do as an actor when you're not in the space to just own it and say can I do it again. You're which is lingering in the hallway holding your car keys pretending like you have something to do but you're afraid to leave because you feel like you could do better and then then I waited a minute too long and Aaron comes out the door there. They were done and I was like I think I can do it better. I think I wanNA do it again. I think I want to do a better. And he said yeah well you got it so you don't have. That was pretty good look pretty generous. It was amazing. I love the malary's reason this episode. Of course all of our characters are connected to Leo and Mallory has her own personality persona in the show as well but the fact that malary's there and part of this I felt really brought Leo into the episode. Really tangible way well she has to bring the gift and I was honored to have the writers think of Mallory to bring the gift and I think when I was watching the episode. I think it did bring Leo Baeck but I also felt like John was always there like John and Leo were just ever-present until the very end. Everybody Eddie missed him and the characters missed their boss and their friend and the actors mystere dear friend so even though we we don't see toby in this episode as we as we talked about we feel in his presence as well and I really love the moment where the president in his Final Act behind the resolute desk considers and then eventually grants grants the pardon to toby. Felt like you did this. Incredible thing where it felt like the president considered every single bit of frustration that he had with toby all the things that he had pent up. And then there's this giant Cathartic cy and something passes something changes. It's it's like some kind of Exim and the ghost of that feeling is gone and then forgiveness is able to come in and then finally the President signs the pardon I could not imagine. Imagine not pardoning toby because I don't think Richard would've ever spoken to me again Richard Richard. He didn't do it anyway. If only you were here one thing did make me laugh is that I freeze framed on the pardon. Pardon letter and a guest. The property people did not foresee net flicks and the ability to freeze frame on the letter. Some of the word of God the pardon letter ends with a sentence that begins in testimony whereof I have here unto agreed and then after that it's actual gibberish. Just thought this was not writing made pausing. I wasn't going to bring bring up the fact that I paused it as well. I like also that in the first paragraph every line begins with a capital letter. As if it's a poem the notice that to the whole thing reads like a trump tweet breath random capitalisation and it makes no sense. You know I really should have read it really exactly. We've read. What maybe maybe that's the whole point of the shame? Then the president says also that he's GonNa take a final stroll around the joint and Eli told us that if this is correct Kris you might remember. That was the final scene that you shot the final walk around. The set was also the final shot of the series. Yeah it was. I don't know if it was the keys or all of us collectively or John's John's idea that that it was as you can imagine it was an incredible day on the set and everybody who had been around and whatever collected in the lobby and Aaron was there and everybody was there and I was trying to shoot but but anyway. I'm not so sentimental but but it was this idea that that would be a fitting last moment for us to go out on because it was so collegial and it was so lovely and Martin God bless him is just the hardest thing to do is to stop him from talking to people. I thought the most accurate the most ambitious and was where Bartlett's walking and mentioning. Everyone by name. Oh my God I was like anybody. Anybody writes that scene from Martin. Sheen is a brave writer. Indeed I will just mention excited when he knew my name tonight. I just mentioned that earlier tonight. Sorry sorry Mr Sheen he did forget. Aaron Sorkin the guy who created it Mia Farrow he remembers. I'm kind of glad that I only did one other of the you didn't know it was going to be a roast. Maybe the cutest joke of the entire series. This happens while the president is doing this. Walk around we get the scene into. How's your mother doing? She's fine now. Mr President within Florida senior again. So would you please absolutely excellent thank you. That's President Bartlett played by Martin Sheen speaking to Nancy played by his actual actual daughter Renee Estevez telling her that he's looking forward to seeing her mother. Janet her mother in fact is backstage but she will not talk to alive for some reason. I wanted to ask about acting getting beside your daughter in the west wing yet. She played renee renee. You'd think it's funny. I've always enjoyed working with my kids and that was the second time I am. Did we ever worked together and is always a joy and you you have to take special interest in. It always made so personal so I particularly enjoyed that I hope she did. She doesn't talk about it. Let's ask her. She's backstage. Okay do you want to talk about your missing. Yes maybe you'll remember. There are some vestiges of what was a small will. Bailey storyline references. I think Josh says to will. Have you written it yet and never really find out what it is and Josh says just make it fun and the storyline was that in reality. There is a man's Tuxedo vest. I which each press secretary passes down to the next secretary they refer to it. As the flack jacket as if it's going to protect you from the reporters the questions and there is a tradition of leaving notes in the pockets of this vast for the next press secretary and the storyline was that Janine Garoppolo Ruffalo Louise Lou was going to be the incoming press secretary and I felt all this pressure about what to leave for her and it had to be funny and then Janine Garoppolo Ruffalo off camera who was originally in the episode. Put a lot of pressure on. She kept saying you better make my job easy a better be really a here. You're really funny and I felt I WANNA stand up comic that you love you better be finally I just completely collapsed under the pressure and we filmed the scene and I wrote every single. Take Take I had to write like a new frigging thing was to make her laugh and every single one bomb did she was like I'm obviously just going to have to act. It was the only the two things I remember. That one was like a very bad Michael Jackson joke and then the other one. I drew a picture with a really long stick figure and then a tiny little stick figure and and labeled them Janney and Genoa. She did not like that and the storyline was cut. Do you remember that. Yeah I mean what what I remember mostly about the episode as a whole including the you know the fabulous train storyline is that is that in a typical west swing episode. Something like either of those would have been stretched out over three or four and I think maybe uniquely in the series John fell from the the beginning at some point but even more so as he got into the editing room that this episode wasn't really about story that it was about the emotional resolution more than it was about beats of a plot and it was too long and a bunch of things were cut and and you want to focus on the character's you care about is Brad Brad. Brad is absolutely right and I'm not offended by that and there is a parallel story. which is that? The outgoing president has written written a letter for the incoming president that this would be more important story. I agree and actually there's a fantastic scene. Jimmy has an incredible acting which which is just a man reading a letter and I wonder what are you reading was all you was there. was there something good left for you. When view after read what prisoner Bartlett has left behind? It's it's Great Act. It is Mardi left me letter. Is that true. That was close. So you're just looking at whereof I have here unto even even even better acting than I realized my friend now because that hard to do I felt so honored to be part of this show and the legacy that it had left for the seven seasons that it was on that it was just channeling that I think I think I think everyone who came late to the show can sort of sympathize with that I mean I feel like I'm laid to every party. I'm always like hey hi. When did this start? And and that's how I felt when I came to the West Wing. I mean in in the episode before Allison Janney has a line to me he goes. You've got two years ago. It looks different on the backside of living and I I think that was true for the new piece I mean I think that was true for us. I remember one of the strongest memories I have of this final episode is what I think was the final scene and everybody clapping and surrounding Martin after finishing the final take and I remember kind of backing up and feeling even though it was very special and I was moved but I felt like it was other people's moment the people who had been there from the beginning I just thought it was. It was their various special thing and I was happy even peripherally involved and it was. It was gonna say something real sorry no. It was a very very when I was watching it. I was thinking about how so much of that show you use. You didn't have to act. We were always tired. We were we were always trying to get through the day really quickly and I just remember. I realized I didn't watch any of the episodes after I hadn't seen seen this episode until today because I really had not watched them and I think it's 'cause you know John passed away and that was a big Dale and it was a you know we're all navigating that along with kind of trying to celebrate this wonderful we'll thing but you know everybody took an existential hit on that which unfortunately or fortunately we were able to put into a show. I guess I wonder how much that feeling was being channeled by John Wells when he wrote the script to be sort of sambre finale overall you know even though it's not expressly about that there are of course these beautiful moments like. What would Leo do post it note that? CJ gives to Josh. An Josh is questioned. This ever stop feeling. Leo's Office to you. But even apart from those moments it's I think there's some of that the entire time and in terms of emotional beats and closure. I wanted to highlight this moment between the president and Charlie this anymore. I thought maybe you could get some use out trying to remember. My father had given it to me when I was in the Tanta grade or the eleventh considered getting your tie with scales of Justice on figured you'd use US more. Aw thank you Mr President thank you. He gave him the constitution and how it cuts like a nice. I have to say this is just to to be able to be meadow. Bertha's for a second. I really appreciate getting to have these kinds of conversations because that is a moment that just kills me in the episode and the performance from Delay Hill is so beautiful so touching but then to get to know that that was actually the last thing that was being filmed for the series that there was other real world emotional component to it too just for me at least it just makes it so much richer and deeper and I appreciated shaded even more immediately after that scene. Apparently there was a deleted scene. The scene continued ten. You'd in some version where everybody been claps for the president in this final moment and not only. Do we have a lot of the the White House staff that we know they're applauding him. It was actually a chance for ally addy and Josh Singer to be in the background as well but but they cut it. Yeah John had just asked any of the writers who wanted to. I think probably Josh. And I were the only people who wanted to. And other some other members of the crew through if they wanted to be as barley walks a little bit further just applauding him as he left the building. which is something that would really happen? And I have a copy of the scene and and it was not deemed suitable for broadcast. But that wasn't really heavy night and I remember goes a bunch bunch of a bunch of the writers because we were going to be in that scene. You know we're dressed up and everybody was coming back from the life of the show. I think of that as a really intense emotional day every time you would go to the monitor so the video village there would be more and more people as the night went on and as we got closer to that last shot it was really something I think I got to see it because I showed me the scene but I think it was the right note to cut it because I mean it's some of my best work but you want that good looking staff you've gotten used to not a bunch of writers no I was. I don't know why I thought of this at this moment. It doesn't pertain to the scene. But I just remember sure that Alan Alda we were walking down one brothers and it was. We knew we were ending. And you know I mean I was on awe of Alan alda as I. I should've been an and he put his arm around me and he said so. Are you ready for it to be over and I was like in denial. I suppose Anna and I kind China said Yeah you know Alan. I think it's been seven years. It's an organic time it. Should you know it's coming to the end of the presidency. Feels right and whatever and there was a pause and he just. I said it's GonNa be a lot harder than you think. And he was right by the way. I did notice in rewatching the episode. Chris Lovely Wife. Hillary is any episode. Well not cut from the episode which I totally I understand better performance. I totally get it. I totally get it. Also the guy who created the show that's correct. He's at the inauguration. curation Aaron I wish I had given him a better angle but but you know maybe what was what was that like Erin back. I think John Probably Said said it would be lovely to have you have you there and we had built I mean it was before digital and whatever and I mean it was a remarkable thing that we the day that we had built this incredible platform. It looks grim. Ken Hardy the production designer. Did an incredible job with building the facade and we had this whole platform warm out in the parking lot of warner brothers and so it was just this whole grains and this and that but it was just massive amount of people and I was like I think about it now and I'm going. I can't believe we managed that we did that by the way. I don't know if you remember this crisp my memory which could be wrong of that. Is that Aaron was working on the Warner Brothers Lot at the had an officer and I think someone just reached out to him that day. Oh I think someone just went over there and said do you want to be in this shot. I could be wrong wrong. I think you're right because I think it was a surprise to me but it was. It was like a okay. I think we should get a shot of him. Aaron Aaron in writes in inauguration where that was convenient. I'll be right. There inauguration ready. He took off his top hat for the CNN. I'm so dumb. I because there are exterior shots in. DC and the setup is so impressive ah thought building in DC. Do they built this enormous thing. I mean I can only imagine it now that we would have had an incorporated into the massive crowds in the whatever and but that doesn't include that it just didn't really includes the people on the platform. A lot of people don't know that the trump inauguration actually took place in the warner brothers. The Chief Justice Chief Justice Lang swears in the president which is which is great. But much like this podcast. I guess you all couldn't get Glenn close. I mean we can ask her when she comes out. You were close almost over. It really is time to posters. This is it for me to say. I think I love all the stuff. After the inauguration of the changeover in in the White House you see the White House domestic staff. Come and take all of the Bartlett's stuff away and then as the new kids come in and the old administration in his moving out. There's a funny feeling in there. You know we get to see Josh. And Donna. Walk in with the sense of familiarity and but also the sense of something something new Sam walks in like he owns the place which is great. But then there's this scene between Charlie and Bram. I love this me too. It's funny to to think about this scene. In contrast to the first episode with Charlie and talking to Josh about how the feeling doesn't go away but now it is the end of his time in in the White House and it's kind of anti climactic brands moves into his office and Charlie says the trust them something about the thermometer in doesn't even listen to him and then eventually just charlie just walks out. I love that moment because Bram is played so well by matthew grow yes not everybody shows up with a reverence for what came before and an openness to input and so I like that you also see that moment charlie attempts to kind of make a connection and maybe give him a little advice and touch. Base and Brahms more interested in kind of sit in that his desk askin kidding Charlie out of his office kind of a kind of a prevent seen in its way I spoke to Gary Lee. who was a staffer in the Obama? White House about the last days there. Jerry Lee Fan. Gary Lee came in as a originally came in as a legislative assistant. He basically just grabbed his job. As if Eddin Larry had an assistant. That's what he would have been but then by the time he left. He was the director of planning for the Office of Political Strategy and outreach but the last day he said was anticlimactic for him and it wasn't even inauguration day his last a stay was was a little bit performed by the very end. There's only you there are actually probably more people in the White House in this episode than there actually are on those final days and he said he took a few photos and then we just left I think also for them. It's a slightly different situation going from the Obama Administration to the trump administration. Everybody everybody in the Obama Administration was extremely depressed. And here we get to have this moment of a democratic administration to another democratic administration. Asian even we have not had a transition within the same political party since nineteen eighty-eight. Yeah Reagan to the first point. Nine I just wanted to mention one on one moment that I actually really love in terms of that which was when Lily Tomlin is in her office. And and and the actress. Who I've seen recently named Karen Campbell comes comes in and she has this extraordinarily for me? I think one of the most touching moments in the PS where she just steps to the door of the Oval Office and she just looks at it. uh-huh and Lily is just kind and supportive and she just that glory that we want that place to be. And it's it's really reverend texting these guys yesterday and something. That is not got a job here tonight. That was not a joke but something that I was remembering as I was just rewatching the last ever. Episode of the series was I'm a time in season four early in season. Four when Aaron one day came into the writer's room and said Hey I know how I want to end this entire series. I know what I want. The last ask visual image to be and it was going to be of Bartlett walking out of the White House Gates and then just slowly disappearing into a crowd of people walking on the street and I think the next episode or maybe the one after that he wrote that we worked on that season was the red mass. And the Senator Stackhouse character. That's how he leaves the story at the end of that episode which I thought was a great story about Aaron because he puts every single idea he has into the thing in front of him Bat. That second which is why. He's so good but I mean it. Was this idea that one day he thought he would save for years in the series and used it a week later it looking for an end. I have one misgiving about this new administration transition because we see Rana takeover for w Federer and then you know when we finally get the Santos team in there. We've got President Santos and he's got Sam and Josh and Bram in they're all men surrounding him after. Yeah after having to and Rana is out. Rana's out ah the outer clipboard. Yeah it did not. That didn't feel to me and I thought well. Hopefully Amy Gardner is going to get in there and make some big structural changes is that was really surprising especially in the last few seasons between CJ as Chief of staff and Kate Harper as national security adviser. I mean it felt felt like this was an administration that had good representation and so just end on that note. A little surprised a little disappointed by that. I thought run. A you know had been such a key part of the strategic team the fact that she wasn't in there getting to weigh in on these kinds of conversations didn't feel fair to hurt here here. We all learned but one thing that we do get just so satisfying Louis. We you get this from President Santos but at a certain point in season three or four. We're Erin had told me about the TV show. Tanner Eighty eight. which was this? Hbo Series that had been fantastic series very different from the Western. But it'd been directed by Robert Altman Altman and written by Garry Trudeau and I remember him. Just telling me how great it was and telling us how he couldn't believe that when the West Wing premiered more people didn't see the the influence of tanner on the West Wing and it's totally different and it's a half an hour and it's kind of a comedy but I eventually got the episodes. I don't even think it was available available on DVD at the time. And what's next is a phrase. That appears in Tanner Jazz. A button to one important scene and so I've mentioned that Aaron the other night and it may well have been in the recesses of his mind when he then got that idea from Tommy. But you know who knows. It could also be a coincidence so when John was working on this episode before before he wrote the script I had sort of we were all throwing a lot of ideas at him and I pitched to him that however the episode ended with President Bartlett which. I didn't know what John was planning to do. At that point. Some emotional scene with the music playing and flag billowing in the wind there should be a sort of a hard cut to the Oval Office with no music doc and military advisers leaving and Santos behind his desk and Josh just kind of with him and him turning giants. What's next and then hard cut to black and John didn't do that? He did a version of that is the penultimate scene and John had a rule which is to never give him the same note twice and it was my last note on the series so I gave him the same no twice but he didn't take it but but watching the episode. I think he did the right thing. Because we end with our hero and our leader and we end with that emotional title moment of the story. We've been following the whole time. And so he. He knew a lot of things I did not. It's weird. We didn't cut back to the train wreck. You didn't because I go to the movies and what's more emotional than that. The president and the first lady are on. Well it's no longer air force one because he's no longer the president so now it has to be called Sam to eight thousand or whatever. That plane is called when Sam to South West look like and he opened up the gift for Mallory. And it's the it's the for America and it's just killer and then we get to have one more shot of the president gazing thoughtfully out the window which we love. It's beautiful and it ends like this. What he's thinking of Tomorrow the Ladies and Gentlemen snuffy Walden Snuff note note on that note. Let's take a quick break roby back potentially with Lawrence O'Donnell and Mia Farrow. We'll we'll be back soon. The West Wing weekly is sponsored by squarespace. Since the very beginning all the way wait till the end squarespace has been a sponsor of the West. Weekly that's right. They've been with us from the beginning and our West Wing. Weekly website has been squarespace websites from the beginning. It's true they've seen as through an entire podcast of sharing our thoughts. Our ideas pictures video and they can help you out out there share. Whatever it is you have to share with the world this right? It's the easiest way to turn your ideas into a website. 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It's no wonder that four out of five have employers who post on Ziprecruiter get a quality candidate within the first day. And right now you can try ziprecruiter for free at ZIPRECRUITER DOT com slash west swing. That's ZIPRECRUITER DOT COM slash W. E. S. T. W. A. J. Ziprecruiter the smartest way to hire no back to our show. The alliance more friends than you thought for the second part of the evening. Please welcome our guests. Bradley Whitford Played Josh Lyman. Mary McCormack placate had Harper Alison Smith. Who Played Mallory? O'Brien producer writer. Eli Attie President chose AIA Bartlett Martin Sheen Teri Polo. Who Played Helen? Santos this Jimmy Smits Played Matt. Santos Richard Schiff played. Toby Ziegler. I'M GONNA I'M GONNA have to ask you to hold your applause to the end guys arguably trader to the country. We have way too many names to go through so half. Lean Bird your Andrea. Wha Marlee. Matlin played Joey Lucas Jack. Jason is marlies interpreter and producing partner. Melissa Fitzgerald Played Carol Fitzpatrick. Does anybody have any popcorn. Ginger has the Popcorn Kim Webster writer executive producer Lawrence O'Donnell team Santos is here Matthew. Del Negro Played Howard Campbell. Who Played Ronna Beckman? Evan Arnold who played net Carlson Raimondo Comma who played auto all here representing Kevin Falls Co executive producer. Paul Radford co-producer Dylan math and CO producer. Peter James Smith played either editor. Larry William Duffy played either. Ed or Larry Run Ostra played reporter. John Davis read played mark. O'Donnell and Christopher still here and Josh Singer late show producer and writer. Oscar winner on on. Paul Redford producer and writer. The love of God is there anybody else there is someone else. In fact there are are two more people. They are the reason why we are all here. Please welcome Tommy. Salami and Aaron Sorkin. I'm sweating from that. This is something so my first question is for for Tommy. I was wondering if you remember when you first learned that the West Wing was ending first of all or the series. You like this. Well thank thanks very much for having us here and it's I cannot sir. I'm overcome seeing seeing everybody. I think this may be the first time. Yeah I've been with this group of people and not been behind on a script and I have to say seen you in this New Light. You all seem very nice. That's the scary anymore. When did we know that we were leaving or or when did we know the show? Did you know that the the series was wrapping Ping honestly. I don't know I think I have a relationship with John Wells and we have been talking a little bit and I think honestly it was probably probably with the passing of John that it became sort of clear John Spencer clear to everybody who was still on the show that that's a possibility the show will find a way to gracefully and it's incredible run. That's when I knew. I read a quote in from the Oakland Tribune that John Wells was actually trying to see if he could tempt you back Aaron to write an episode or two for season since seven. But that you were you were busy at the time and just couldn't make the stars align. I don't remember that I I like. I would never be too busy to do that. Do you remember filming the final episode. Your Cameo in the in. The scene during the inauguration man at inauguration what happened there was I drove to work. My Office is on the Warner Brothers. Lot and in the parking lot you guys had built this enormous. Stand for the inauguration of I believe Jimmy Smits I've not seen them spoilers uh-huh one hundred percent sure and I just went over there to say goodbye to Christmas. WHO's wrecking episode? And whatever I happen to be around this was going. This was the last shooting so this was my chance to say goodbye and I went over there and I happen to be wearing a jacket and tie a AH Chris at aren't you've got just sit up there I'm just going to. We're just GonNa Dolly past you like that and I thought Okay Tummy. Did you get to come to the set for any of these final days as well. Yeah I came. I think it was like the second the last day of shooting because I was still at Warner Brothers. I think we both went over there. They didn't ask me to be in any shock because I've also don't wear coats and ties to work. But I do remember going there and I just I remember you were there. We went to the Oval Office and took a picture and it was very the last shot. Actually it was. It was the last night. Yeah and I remember being on on the set on stage twenty three it was the last and people were looting the West Wing Set Matthew. Perry stole the fake Nobel Prize. That was won by Teddy Roosevelt and the in the Roosevelt Room. It's like Matt. It's not a real Nobel prize props me. They probably got ten of them. That was one of my questions to throw everybody. I took the plaque. This white has communications department and it hangs proudly right outside my office. Anybody else take anything my friend. I have the door to the White House. Communications Office is my office door. And it was given to me by Tommy as long. I have one of the pillars from the White House Portico outside my own house. I Have Richard Shifts in my house. He cooks books. We check me. I started to prepare things but I think there's no no I hope that and I think we would just love to hear from everyone about the end of the show and not just the end of the show. Really just your favorite memories from filming this. This is a really incredible occasion to have all of you here and if we can just take some time to talk about the West Wing would love to hear any stories that you WanNa Ital- I think we're all anyone has a favorite forty of us. Somebody better have a story. I'll say something. They're whenever anybody asked me that. I always the first thing. That pops into my head is. Yo Yo Ma. Playing Cello and delay improvising rising on the show and delay tap dancing Something I will I will never forget. Here's what I remember. I listen I'll have a lot of memories from this show and I. It was also a couple of us. Were having dinner the other night and we were talking about about the role that luck plays in this and it does it. It plays a big role a role frighteningly large role to get cast. Uh like this that worked so well together. Director like Tommy setting the template and directors like Christmas. Alex Grace Coming in and doing the work they did the technicians that we had and then just the way that it landed with the audience. Somehow just the sight and sound off of decency and competence and kind of reaching for something higher really landed with the audience. But I'll tell you my first memory of the show and it was this. We were just a couple of days away from shooting the pilot. Tommy came into my office very excited. And there's nothing like lighting mm Tommy up as a kid. Tommy was always incredibly supportive. But I'd say twice a year I'd write a script. That would really light him up. He just couldn't wait to direct this anyway. He came into my office couple of days for the pilot starts shooting with that spirit. He said come with me. I gotTA show you something. And he brought me over to back. Then we were on stage seventeen to our set which was almost finished and he wanted to show me an idea that he had four not the cold. Open not the part of the pilot where everybody is learning about. And by the way the opening of the pilot depends entirely on nobody having ever heard of the acronym acronym potus remember that. We could never do that opening today. But after that Spencer walking through the door I they had basically set that whole I seen I think in one room. Okay and Tommy said just walk with me for a second and I'll never never forget those took me from the door through Josh's bullpen. which is what it would be? He called them the script back through the lobby. In through the communications office through Mrs Landing Hams Office through the Oval Office and into Leo's Office and he said you know we can do this whole thing on the move. Okay and that was it and so I am telling you right now when it comes to the walk and talk. I'm talk parts okay. He did everything else. I will say one thing incredible memory. I was at the end of season one where it was the assassination and we had set up this huge huge sequence. And we're two of US were like standing up on a scaffold. Sort of look down at everything and I just just look at Aaron and I went. I can't believe they're letting us do this. And that's the same exact moment just had backstage standing standing with Aaron and I looked at him and I went twenty one years ago. You had this idea and we got to do it and look what you guys have done to bring all. Aw I wanted to ask some of the writers who were on in season seven what it was liked to know that the ending was coming. Because I feel like it's a privilege that a lot of shows don't get to have you know to sort of wrap up a show and say we know you mean we're not making more to to be able to have your show sort of instead of abruptly cut off Costa to your finish to me. It's felt really incredible. I think especially as we've we've been doing the podcast in conjunction with it because it meant as we come to the end of our own series. We got to have a sort of mirror image of some of the feelings that the characters were having some of the things that were going on you know our our ending gets to follow along with an actual ending and it struck me as we got to these final episodes how rare that must be well. It meant that we actually and the writer's room at has writers individually and writing the final episodes. And I guess I wrote would I guess twenty the third last episode. We experienced the end before anyone else. Because I typed mary-louise Parker workers last seen and her rap. We were the ones who went through that moment. I and there was nothing quite like that. Especially when you were writing thing your final episode. Eli where you twenty. I the last one I did was Requiem which was the Jon Spencer. Leo's funeral and so that was its own. That was its own kind of natural ending point but I was just going to say I was going to echo what I was going to echo. What Tommy said before? which is that ends has been talked about on the podcast? I think before but when John Spencer passed away and Aaron Time came back and you know there were sort of services on the set and it just felt it took so much wind out of the sales I think in a lot of ways and that made it feel like a much more natural and point and I think at that time maybe carrying on felt almost kind of like might have dishonored him in some way so I think that was when it really felt real for any any of the actors who were in that final episode dear member filming your last. Seen your series wrap William Duffy on the West and so and editor. Larry Larry yes the other area we know it was. It was great because awesome family last day was like especially that last shot because we were in that last year when Martin comes down and says goodbye to everybody and he got our names right eight for the first time seven years and I also found out I had kids. He says to me. How are the kids who wrote rotate? I had kids. I had no idea for seven years ed kids but it was. It was a great. It was a great great time with everybody. It was it was a family as it is today an extended family over the seven years so it was great Peter. James Smith Hello. As the end of season four Aaron Erin. Generously got US end credit players tickets to the EMMYS and and so it was actually very boring. Show until we one then it was fantastic antastic and there are so many people rushing up to the stage and we had an credit player seating and so by the time we got up to the stage security trying to not not let us up but Nicole Robinson who played Margaret as you. Oh Kim would you finish this story then. Kim Webster Ginger abroad the pot bar I would I punch him in the stomach or for no like side swept them and the Sopranos people are looking at us like we were thugs but you know it was a one time. One time I'm due for us. The always the best part of the emmy four zero and always the best part was everybody comes up on stage age when you win and just watching everybody come up on stage. I remember Josh. The one season for you ran right up to the onstage and said I didn't ruin the show well but watching as Richard had been telling me for months that I had there was always this very glamorous problem that I had and I know that you guys inherited guys had the problem to which was was that there were so many mouths to feed on the show. There just weren't enough basketball's to go around and that every week you felt you were shortchanging someone and that was the case with toby and CJ in the first couple of episodes as a matter of fact when we were casting the show there wasn't enough in the pilot episode to give to the actress reading for Toby and CJ. So Tommy said just do me a favor just write a scene just in mid air to write a scene that isn't part of any episode for Toby and cj so we can see these actors. Do something and I did and Tommy promised me. Don't worry no one's ever going to see this. We're never going to do the point. A camera at the scene two episodes in Thomas said hey you know that scene that you wrote for castaing that would be a good thing and it turned out. It was a good thing because what that scene led to was an episode called the crackpots and these women in which I finally kind kind of toby put a flag in the ground of who he was and especially who he wasn't relation to Bartlett. And what the intention of school was anyway toby and cj a series started off. Those were the two most underfed roles on the show. Richard Allison I two people to win Emmys for the show. Incidentally the crackpots and these women is the episode of which David Rosen is not mentioned. I did not know that story. Oy Now you knew better for knowing it now. Here's another little one three days into shooting the pilot and suddenly I noticed. Richard was wearing a wedding ring and I I didn't it okay. I didn't think toby was married. Ah That's underestimating. The way you reacted for everybody out there. He was so o all sometimes wearing a wedding to Richard Richard. I didn't think toby was married. and Richard said he's he's not and I said why is he wearing wedding ring and Richard set for you to figure out. So the which is why Richard is in love with Kathleen York and twins game on. Actually what was in my mind because you know when you start a show. The prop master comes to you and says you know what kind of watch do you want to wear earned. Are you married because here are the wedding rings and I had already decided on a might have told you that day but I already decided that he had been married and lost his wife which is what kind of gave him this kind of dark drive to devote. I actually would have been pretty good. This is before I knew. Kathleen was in. The picture would've changed the entire story so I understand but but it's what kind kind of gave me this. This dark drive to be focused on work. I remember it as you both running up to me which often happened frenzy. Easy of neurotic energy coming out. We didn't grab you by the neck pass blocking for you believe me. I didn't know who are toby was married. And and then this idea came for to be to have an ex wife and I went. Wow that's a lot of adjustments that I have to. Hey but that's the nature of television is that we have two different ideas of where they come from and where they go these characters and you have to constantly adjust but when you have you know this kind of writing in this kind of directing. If they don't match you can have a discussion and figure it out Josh wishy. If you don't mind I just want to say something about the other writers I'll say whatever he likes. I appreciate that first of all. Kevin falls in Paul Redford. We're both on sports night with me. We're we're both in valuable. And I once wrote something where I described Kevin as being like hoover in Animal House that head of the sororities art is just trying to keep everything cool a so Kevin handled the craziness in writer's room in addition to having fantastic ideas. Paul had fantastic ideas and in addition to being a great writer the second in the middle of the second year fear of the show. I think it was correct me if I'm wrong. My longtime assistant is backstage Lauren. Lohman we've been together twenty years and the Lauren is a great gatekeeper. Sometimes too great. A Gatekeeper Lauren. Came into my office one day and said seriously then vice president. Al Gore was on the phone. Do you want to take the call. Look crazy there's one person in the world doesn't take that call and Al Gore got on the phone to to recommend a senior member of his staff. Addy who we. We were the destination for Democrats leaving Washington with their tails between their legs. Came to the show and we started with Lawrence O'Donnell a AH WHO's there for two years came back for the last two years now hosts possibly the most indispensable hour of television all of it. It's it's the second most Rachel Maddow's on at nine o'clock pretty good but I stick around for you and then writers who who came after. I left Josh Singer a woman who's not here Deborah con fantastic. The and I would imagine that it wasn't that easy Kind of you can do the show without me. It's harder to do the JOE now. Tommy and you had to find a whole new way of doing the show because I assume that no longer was my nutty way of doing the this show really going to be tolerated by John Anymore. Anyway the admiration respect and love. I have for you guys is marrow deep. Thank you very much on the plane. Today from New York American Merican Airlines has the first five episodes. So I manage to watch a few of those and I remember we probably had shot about four before we went on the air. Something like that. We certainly had at least four read throughs before we went on the air and so after maybe the fourth read through true that that would be almost four hours of television almost two movies. I remember walking across the Warner Brothers. Lot thinking the script is great. All of Erin scripts have been great. Great this is great. I love it but the fact that I love. It doesn't mean you're going to get any viewers at all and at this point I said to to so many of the writers were walking a lot with that. Okay bye now. Meaning by the time the audience sees all of this all four of these they will beyond to us. They will know that nothing happens. They will they will know the cops aren't chasing anybody. There's no one dying in the emergency room. There's just nothing that happens. That's within the convention of Hour Long TV. This isn't what the audience thinks. Drama is and and I'm thinking you you know They're going to be wrong but I just don't know how they're going to stay with this and then of course you yeah stayed with it and and that's where we discovered that's where we as television writers discovered. The drama is what Aaron Sorkin says it Tau. It's that's that's nice. If you show that Lawrence's describing the audience was is going to miss that action. Adventure show is the show that NBC wanted originally. The show was put off for a year. Warren Littlefield was the head of NBC. At the time that I I turned in the pilot and I remember you might remember from the pilot that Cuban refugees on rafts are trying to make their way there ninety miles to the coast else to get here. Warren Littlefield in the NBC executives wanted Josh to basically swim out after them and rescue them like really rescue them. rahm Emanuel in a Speedo and I say explains plans why they didn't want toby. I just wanted to add one small thing to errands very kind words that he said about me. which is that I've never told Aaron this actually so I was Al Gore's speechwriter and was with him through the end of the Florida recount and wrote speeches and talking points points for him and you know was with them all day most days and we were pretty close and so I'd already had a brief phone conversation with Aaron and I thought I had no background in Hollywood or screen writing but I thought this would be the coolest job in the world and I really really wanted it and so I emailed out Gore and I said hey and I was already no longer working for him and I said Hey. Here's this job that I'm interested in. Here's this guy's phone number. Here's the show and I wrote talking points for that call it and it's true and to Gore's credit. He was always very good on email about ten minutes. Fifteen minutes later later I got an email back from saying I spoke to him. Thought it went great so so. I'm sorry if this all began with an actor fraud I apologize but but I'll add to that that this is the honest truth that when I was working on the show in the in the post Aaron Years Anytime I had to write anything for that show Oh I always felt beneath the task which is partly how I am and partly that it was probably true but I would. I would study the old scripts and I was constantly asking myself off. What would Aaron do in this situation? Would Aaron right and and and I sometimes now in other projects and on other shows. I try to remind myself to still do that. Because there's no one who writes writes like him. That's very kind of you to save. I promise you if you have a favorite moment at least from the first four years of the West Wing which are the only ones I can testify to. Chances is our Kevin Paul Eli Lawrence. It was their idea at speaking of which the pilot originally ended with the line. Thank you Mr President. Okay Bartlett said Josh. Don't ever do it again. Josh thank you Mr President left and we faded to black. We rolled credits and it was. Tommy who said you know I just I feel like we should get the sense that life goes on and perhaps it was because I had no idea what episode two would be and I didn't you want life to go on resisting that anyway. That's where the line was next across. The one of the things that I think is so interesting you know when you're describing the walk and talk from the pilot and he goes through Mrs Lending his office and as the show has gone on through seven years characters have changed new actors have come in characters have changed their roles but that room is still misses. Landing Bingham's office even through the end of season seven and and even there's an exchange between CJ and Josh where they say. Do you ever stop thinking of this as Leo's Office and what I love about the show and how it began in where he came to is that there is such a sense of permanence right from the beginning in in the pilot. These things feel so established that there's enough cement there that you could rip off of it and so it allowed for enough room for evolution and you could see all these changes to get to a completely unexpected place. I think by the end of the series while still feeling connected to the legacy of everything that's started with. That's really nice to hear it really. Is You know so much of we're in a bunker when we're doing doing the show I remember Rob Lowe. I wish rob was here saying that like before he went to work on this show. He asked candace Bergen Of course You know what am I in for here. And she said you're going to walk onto a sound stage and you're gonNA walk off and it's going to be seven years later and that's what it feels like. We're not really aware when when we're doing the show because it's such a dawn to dusk the thing of how it's playing out there on. How people are feeling about it like this is really incredible? Hello I'm Melissa Fitzgerald and and first of all I think some of you might know that I moved to Washington DC. And I work there now. And they're there's not a day that goes by where somebody doesn't come up to me and say that the west wing inspire fire them to spend their lives in public service and has been such a gift to be a small part of such an extraordinary show with this extraordinary group of people people and I just want to say thank you to this West Wing family for everything including supporting the work. I'm doing now and thank you to the West Wing weekly podcast family Josh. And Yes for all the support you've given us and about three hundred thousand people that got into a treatment program instead of a sitting in prison because of the support of people like you guys and the support of people like Allison Janney. Who's on the fan? It Okay Speaker. Hello everyone there. The the audience everyone on stage. I can't believe I'm not there but I I love new all and thank you for supporting this podcast podcast and the show and everything West Wing. Wait what win. Are you getting back ballistic. Because I need to know the the key out the I will be home as soon as we're done here is normally love you. Okay thank you I. I'm Marlee Matlin. Thank you and I have a lot to say. Only because they told me that we we only have a limited amount of time. But first of all I o I mean. I am extremely indebted to Erin for taking taking my call when I called him about about a chance to me just an opportunity to meet because of sports night a character that you had written a character on the show that was offscreen a deaf sister of one of the characters. I believe it was Josh's sister. Yes and so. That was my way of getting working my way Aaron Sorkin and then thank you for the Chinese lunch. You treated me to and from that point on. He wrote my beautiful awful character of Joey. Lucas and we all know that I mean how difficult it is to get work for for a person who is deaf in Hollywood and he. That was the last thought on errands. Mind the last night he is one of the very few people in the business who just writes a scene for me just writes the scene and it fit and I am forever grateful for that and the other note that I just WanNa WanNa make before I finish is to this day wherever I go no matter where I am they say West Wing West Wing West Wing West Wing West wind and the question. They always ask me is. Why didn't joey get to hook up with? And and lastly and sorry. My husband is up there in the audience. Somewhere Hollywood so he knows what it's all about people. Ask me please please. Could you save this. And I'll say I'm Joey Lucas. I'm Joey Lucas. You Idiot is one of my favorite lines written but ah Marley is an example of another really big problem. which is that like? I said there were eight. The people on this show eight star of the show who could each be carrying their own show and then a guest actor would come Mont who would just hit it out of the park and you would just you pray for one of these people to come on and be boring so I don't have to. Marley Marley came on and killed and so many other people did Alison Smith in the pilot. Episode another nine people people. Everybody just kept coming on and killing it and so did you. Josh Run Astro. This is a more narrow memory but there are people on the stage that I've known for over thirty thirty years and I've known Erin for over forty five years. And how old are you. I am one hundred hundred seven years ago. Ooh when I joined the show and I got the script and my character's name was John I called Aaron. I said did you name my character for my son one and he said of course I did and that is a story that I just WANNA share. Because I don't think in in in Hollywood would we get a lot of stories like that and I'm thinking that I may be the only actor that has been in all four of his television shows and That is also something something that you don't get to say to somebody a lot. So thank you Erin and part of thank you very much. Thank you. The Quick Kaplan York two things. How many men Dan have? I had come up to me in the last fifteen years and say and there are all kinds of toby lookalike. Now one guy actually was executive producer of NPR of in the literally said. I can't believe you didn't take the house us and these guys mean it and I have to say it was dated right. It's a television show and the only other thing I want to know is what writer was responsible for. It wasn't until the very last episode of season for that. Richard looked at me and spilled the beans and said I'm really glad you know. Oh after you had the baby that you made it and when my agent called me and said You know you want to be more involved in season four and I read the script and I think Aaron said you're going to be pregnant and I thought great great but back of my mind. I'm like they're going to get rid of me. Something's going to happen when I have that. Ben I heard you're pregnant with twins. I thought they're never ever GonNa but there was a plan. I guess for Andy to not make it and then I like Richard I think turn there was. This is discussed. Look once they killed the once. I killed Mrs Landingham. Nobody was safe. So thank you for letting me live. Do you remember the names Molly unhook. And she likes a little bird. He likes a little bird. There's a beautiful moment backstage right before. The curtain came up where I saw cars Campbell speaking speaking to Aaron Sorkin. I heard I heard the words. It's nice to meet you and that's I can't get over it myself. That there are are people on Stage IV meeting for the first time. Yeah Hi Erin. I'm Raimondo Cam played auto and I thought thank you and I thought I could give a kind of idea of what it's like to be. I think it was the newest most of the staff members who was fired or not fight. I was the newest so sorry Eban was good. It was great seeing but I came I came into this and it was my very favorite show. It was the it was everything I wanted to watch. It was something that I would watch again and again it was a huge responsibility. And that's really what it felt like that. I was this young a young actor that I had just come to La. And I got to do the one thing that I really wanted to do. And I was so scared and I gotta say that every minute of it were these scoops of generosity from these. Really Amazing artists peppered by Bradley Whitford. Trane Hayes me. At some point he said and Got Josh me as a bad actor I'm coming for you is what he said which made me feel like family. But I'll tell you the minute that crystallized and I was thinking about in the car on the way here my my my time in the West Wing was we. Were doing this this long. Walk and talk and at the end of it. I remember just as a spry trailer and I think I was like stretching my calf out and which was not. I wasn't wasn't because of the walk and talk was just stretching and John. Spencer comes up to new ones. And what's going on and I was like I'm just nothing I was just he goes. I know what that is career and I said okay so using something coming come to my trailer so he walked into his trailer and he goes you know what it is and he dug into his closet and he said it's the shoes and he brought me his slippers his his soft memory foam beat up slippers and he was like you can have these their gift where them on on the set in fact. If you're not walking so much probably let you wear during the scene. And he was. He's obviously here's our. Here's my favorite person. And that was what this show was. was these incredible artists who I looked up these these giants giving you slippers slippers to support your feet. The first really big. I've never called it a welcome top before I really big steady cam shot. That we did was the cold open for five votes down right which took Bartlett offstage after a speech in a hotel through lobby down through a big kitchen and up onto the shave. Dave CRA mighties. Dave of wow. That's Great Dave Dacre Mighty right steady cam operators very hard job counterweights about one hundred ten pounds. And you're walking very fast backwards. Okay what twenty nine takes as I recall yet all my we shot it at the a hotel downtown. I just biltmore hotel but we were shooting in an active hotel so we had to shoot between ten PM and four. AM or something and it's a hard shot to do. And we're all at called video village where I watched the show from where the director watches the show from you looking at monitors You're listening to it. And the shot went so deep into the basement into a kitchen covered in cinderblocks that there was kind of this radio blackout period during the shot where we just lost contact with the actors with the image on the screen. We had no idea what was going on until they reemerged up on the sidewalk outside. And we'd get word from a second and it all worked down there and it was. I don't remember how many takes it ended up being but I know as it was eleven I know I remember all day take was printable and Martin and and this had to have been got the place if we took over the place at ten we probably got off the first shot at one. AM or something right. Martin starts jumping up and down. Yeah let's do it again. Let's do it again. We have something in. The actress are having fun. But I don't know if you remember that shot what wasn't designed yet because Michael Lamond wonderful director ended up really finessing that but while we were doing the pilot we were shooting at the biltmore and setting setting up and I went for a walk. It was just trying to add. I saw that room and then I walked down another set of stairs and then another set of stairs and then I was was in the kitchen and then I kept going down for and did you come to me and say. Here's this look at this. We could do this one day if we ever get picked up which neither neither of us thought there was again never supposed to be an episode to But I I don't remember that. That's great. Am I imagining. Did we catch that hotel on fire. Yes we did a couple of times which is why I knows. Take eleven because they were not going to give us a take twelve and plus it was very important to Tommy that would rob walks past the stove like agrees. Shawna so yes we. I want my Greece. There's another little item that I remember about that shot. You Remember Ken. The sound guy. There was a stretch. Watch when we lost our wireless mics and he goes. I have done documentaries. I can do this with the boom. and He tried to walk back into the camera guys Dave Commodities The choreography of it is guys constantly. Sort of changing places at that and they're walking backwards down the stairs so so Ken. WHO's as you know my age? Now then is I've done documentaries. Holding up the first he hit the hit. The stairwell is go catch him best the other reason we only did eleven but we we had like an hour of a break because they had Thursday. It wasn't the only time I can't count the number of times I've been watching a scene on a monitor and suddenly you hear this horrible sound and the shot goes up to the ceiling because the operator has fallen down backwards it down a flight of stairs but you guys keep talking like you're care. You're just doing your thing the Christmas Yano while I just in line with what you're talking about. I guess I came to direct the first time. Oh for the pfister Wilkes right. Yes it was Mr Willis and I was I had. I had seen the pilot and and was just stunned and startled like everybody. I was just this. I had been in a involved in politics as a young kid. I loved it and I. I just wanted to do that. Show when I was like crazy. The wreck was incredible. The writing was incredible. I needed to do it so I actually fortunately got that Opportunity Unity and and I got to the one number. All these steady cam shots had come on those episodes before and I was waiting a little bit not long but the little bit for my teaser to come and whatever in there with word went out across the lot and got called it. And it's your your teaser on your desk and I went running to the office and I thought what is it going to be an. It was six people at a card table five pages it again. Hope was the only time I think we brought a crane into Leo's off. Something had to happen. Sometimes you get that too but you know you mentioned you said you were waiting for the teaser for the call to open not one of these directors maybe the exception of Tommy with the pilot but not one of these directors. Got The amount of time that director is supposed is to get the before they shoot an episode of the amount of time before the actress too for that matter but I handed out the scripted. Five pieces the tease. For the First Academic Mack Concert Third Act and the fourth act in a kind of trust me thing and somehow they managed to make it look beautiful with no prep time at all. I think the only damage that was done was perhaps demonstrating to studio that. You don't need as much time a as you say you do. But now that I've tried directing you need way more prep time. Then you're given in the same way you were talking about the writers for me to be able to work with you and Alex and so many other directors but specifically specifically the two of you and what you were able to bring to this show and then after we left where that show wet I mean I think visually it took on another life. You guys were extrordinary and part of the reason for the success of this show is because of what you guys brought to. Yeah one thing I would just jump in and join the chorus of people who were inspired by the show. I was in law school in the show came on and I didn't watch TV and I had a buddy you said watch this and I was like Oh and that was that was it. I was the only show I watched and when it came out here actually what I did to try to get a job was I stated impartial response to the show which is an incredible episode. I must read it one hundred times. I little the diagrams in an excel. Like you know here are the five different storylines and this is how many different scenes are in an act and and and I couldn't. I was amazed at how he had gotten. These five. Six storylines is that all were about proportional response. You wish the president would watch that episode. Maybe but that aside you know I I was so inspired and and then to be able to come and play in this incredible sandbox that Aaron created with the best actors in the world and these incredible double directors to learn from and I learned so much Christmas Yano and Alex gravesend and all the actors on this stage as well as the incredible writers. So I got to work with. And that's that's the thing that I was a fan but there are so many writers you know one of my favorite writers in Hollywood. Liz Hanan I go back and forth on West Wing lines like swap them man. You know. Well that's this and that's I mean. There are so many writers who were inspired to join the business and to try to hit the heights that Aaron hits which is it's almost impossible every day trying to fill those shoes is you'll live is saying I mean that's that there's that other gift of this show. I think for a lot of us. Thank you the one I wanted to add one addendum to what Aaron was saying about the the late scripts which is just that. I don't even know. Oh how much. Aaron was aware that he'd be his office and he'd be working on an episode and it would be two days into shooting in. There would only be twelve pages of it done and the directors would sometimes is come to Kevin. And Paul Laurence or myself. And just say where do you think this storyline is going and we would say well. We can't guarantee it but it might. It might be going here as a testament to the quality of the writing that it would shoot so well when you know. Even the director didn't really know the end of the story. I appreciate that it would be expensive to my lateness. Real dollars for instance at the end of season one had I known own who had gotten hit. We could have shot the beginning of season two while we were in Rosslyn Virginia right on that same location but I. It didn't yet all I was able to say to. Tommy was keep my options. Open the way you shoot it. Just make sure that my options are open Hi Evan Arnold. I played Ned thank you. I don't know if I'm pronouncing his name correctly. I just WanNa give a shout also to Michael Mayors. Yeah because when you're new to the cast there's often a trial by fire where you're doing a walk and talk and and I was just thinking the whole time. Hey Michael you're you're incredible one. One of the many people walking backwards take after take after take after take so I just want to give him a little respect. A A Lotta people. Listen when it's an eight page steady can't seen you do not want to be the person who screws up on page sovereign okay so that you have to go back again. You screw up on page age one but you don't WanNA purchase page seven. Just hardly ever happened. Everybody was always up for it. Everybody was came to work prepared. Ready to go. Nobody was learning the scene in the hair and makeup trailer. What happened in those days? I gotta say something about the walk and talk. I didn't know that it wasn't called that that you never even thought about it. But I didn't. I'm sorry Chris Tommy directed episodes of Er didn't walk Anton Er before we did our show. I think they even did it. Well before that I think so too I I have seen movies where people have been walking and talking. Become this thing on our show like we invented this because there are TV shows where you stand and you stand and look at each other and that's what you do so let me just tell you I'm on sets now where This I read a script and it says walk and talk and the director comes up to me and goes. Hey you know you walk and Talk Right. We're GONNA WE'RE GONNA WE'RE GONNA start walking and we'll do the scene like this and there's no motivation to start whatever. There's no reason to stop and by the way the the hallway ends right there. Where are we going to go? They design these these shots. Try to imitate you guys. And there's no reason or way to even do it well. We had a set with a lot of acreage it was. I'm not sure if it still is but it was at the time that it was built largest set ever built for television so there was a lot of places to go in. Tommy made sure there was a lot of glass on the set so that shots had a lot of throw all that when you were standing in one hallway you could see through the Roosevelt Room into another Carter into the communications. Bullpen into Toby's office. which meant that? There were days as where these guys were the most expensive extras in Hollywood. Because we'd line up a shot. We need toby to be sitting in his office during the shot. That's fifty yards away government but Tommy really did all that and it's it started with sports night all of the movement and all of the throw for the shots. She did all that because he understood stood as I'm putting myself down really but he understood there's very little visual interest in what I write that I right white people talking in rooms say that is not true because when I read both those scripts sportsnight right and west wing on the same night. I remember reading them moving around literally moving around. Because I think everyone can attest to this. There's so much energy in your writing eating. It's just I don't know anyone else who does it. It doesn't read like anyone else and you just start to feel it as you're reading the words and it didn't feel sedentary to me. It felt there was motion to what you it's almost like. They blocked themselves in in some sense in that took a an RC Shakespeare workshop and he had a bunch of actors to scenes from Neil Diamond and the end up in people standing. Pretty much like the honeymooners any motors in a line and do the scene and then he would give him a scene from fellow or from some other play. I'm not allowed to mention in here. And and all of a sudden the scene to happen and he writes so that people know who they're talking to new sire bad news whatever and and it created a movement because there was energy behind behind the line. And that's what you're writing. How has that kind of you know what you're doing? You have a reason to be there and you have to actually physically league demonstrate that it has it has to express itself physically. There was an idea that Kevin False had five times. He pitched this idea to me five times times really important to him. It was sweet and I love Kevin and would do anything for him. But I just couldn't do this. I couldn't come. It was Halloween and Kevin would always comment comment. Remind Me Jesse you know this episode episode. Four it's going to air the week of Halloween. Don't you think we should do a Halloween show and I was thinking i. I'm just not seeing like Pumpkins and spider webs. All of them have the idea for it. I just don't I'm sorry. So Kevin Evan. Sick Didi Myers on me season. Three D Myers was one of our consultants. Halloween was coming around again. Kevin was going to his annual pitch and so she had called me and say this is usually how how ideas would begin to happen with the consultant. She said listen. I just want to let you know that on Halloween. The White House press corps. They get to bring their kids to the White House to trick or treat. I thought all right. Well there's something something in that like. What if Bartlett is just scrooge about Halloween? Like he doesn't get it. He thinks kids a little thieves coming for candy. And he's going to lecture them about the true meaning of all hallows eve and Kabbadi Crane or something like that it'll be a cold opening and that's that's all I need to start right if I can. Just if I could just hand these guys eight pages. Tomorrow I'll be happy. I don't have to know what's going to happen and the rest of the episode. I thought that was a really good teaser. That was the first first time Kevin let me up and that day that was September tenth. Two thousand one and I woke up the next morning prepared to write this. Halloween thing in the world changed. Let me take this in a different direction. I want to mention someone on. I want to ask Brad about this. Actually this is someone who couldn't be here tonight because she's with her two beautiful children and husband Brooklyn John. Maloney the reason why Marley you never got together with. And what Janelle is a great example of is how collaborative this kind of work is and how synergistic it isn't and and the energies come from all sorts of different directions when we're sitting in the writers room we kind of think it's up to us and we'll come up with it or you know we'll just let Aaron come up with maybe we can throw throw a log on his fire if we're lucky maybe but actors also generate energies in the writing of the show. Janelle all is I think maybe a really singular example of this because in the pilot shoes just hired as a day player to get through the pilot. Two lines to odds and and was not a regular sees a series regular when we started off. She was just being hired episode episode but she was being hired episode to episode because she was inspiring airing Aaron every single time. The camera was aimed at her. And Brad you're in all those scenes. We were sitting there trying to think up stories stories. Were trying to think up Donna stories. It's church was not necessary because it was all in this relationship. Yeah Janelle who had done a scene on sports night and so she was actress actress. Tommy and I knew about she had started with two lines in the pilot and then incredibly Tommy got done in the editing room with the pilot it was forty seconds short. And there's very little wiggle room with the network in terms of length of the episode. He just asked me to write a little bit more. I remember when Donna I think surname said to Josh. You're late for a meeting. That really worked. That was good. Let let's have them do something else together. Laurence's right Janelle was not a series regular. During the first season she was not in the main titles. She simply hired as a guest actor in every episode. Janelle didn't quit her waitressing forcing job until the second season she was still waiting tables during the first season because she just thought not only will be my last episode of the Western. We'll be in the last episode of anything ever. I will never get paid to be an actress again. And it's just sort of an example of the Darwinism that that goes on it's one of the unintentional advantages. Says I think actually of the of the way you work. which is you are if you've planned out an entire season as other other show runners do which has its virtues? I've heard You would you. Would you would never pick up on. And you're sitting there. Watch you know watching dailies and seeing something work which I think really kept things alive. I have very very clear. Memory of remember said cut and I walked over. I think you were at the Monitor and I was like I love her. Yeah I remember that. Yeah Donna is the answer to why didn't show Lucas. and Aw 'cause I was worried I was going to kill and I understand on other shows. Jimmy that characters date many people and everybody is constantly changing. I I know of a standard for David Kelly but I just I had a hard time. Coupling people just carris Sherry. Hi I'm Karen Campbell. Symbol nice to meet you Erin. I actually had a segue to Noah Maloney segue And I wanted to give a special shout out to Laura Chef and Josh Heinsohn who were the casting directors. At the time that I came on board. They were incredibly talented. And you were speaking about out the guest cast on this show and I think it was a huge cast and the people that were come on. We're all just was A. I was constantly in off the people. I was getting to work with but I did not have an agent so they brought me in for the show. I had no agent. They brought me in a couple of times and they kept on saying. We'll find something for you which you know you're optimistic. And then Debra. Kahn wrote the role that I ended up playing and I was still waiting tables at the time and Laura have called me directly because I had no agent. She said we have three episodes for you. But that's all we're promising right now and my boyfriend at the time is now my husband of almost fourteen years said yeah he said I think you should hang up your apron and you know like really lean into this opportunity and I'm like oh my gosh okay. So I quit. Quit my waitressing job. And two weeks later I was on a plane sitting in First Class next to chill Maloney flying to Toronto to shoot on location and my head was spinning. I just couldn't believe it and then we got to Toronto. I think it was you ever actually. That called me from the hotel room and said over downstairs on stairs having drinks and some food. You should come join us. And so I started trotted downstairs. And ironically. It was a location of the restaurant chain that I had worked in two weeks prior literally two weeks before. Then I was standing in a Chris. White shirt hurt and Bowtie doing a menu presentation holding giant steak and now I was sitting in a bank with these phenomenal actors on location on the most most spectacular series and give you her slippers. I have other questions like. Why were you shooting in Toronto in which leads me to what a thrill? It was a two three times a year. We would go to Washington for four days or soda to shoot the Washington Exteriors earlier. This cast when we go to Washington. They were the Beatles. It was unbelievable. They would have to like turn down and coffee with a senator because they already had coffee scheduled with another senator. I was summoned to Sandy Berger's office at the time Sandy. Berger was Bill Clinton's last national security adviser are and you get someone to the office of the National Security Adviser. You're not sure if you'RE GONNA come out of there alive. Aw or not he can kill you pretty easily and it just wanted to know why there was no national security advisor on the show. That's how I got a job. Yeah this is my story to sitting in Lafayette Park on an off day and my phone in rings I guess we had cell phones in those days and it was John Podesta from the White House Chief of staff of the White House he said what are you doing. There's a maximum across the street and Lafayette Park. He goes would you mind coming over to the treaty room in the OB. The the National Breast Cancer Coalition is meeting at the Treaty Room and Bill and Hillary were going to host them but they got busy and they I found out you were in town. Would you mind very much coming over and I think I called you and I think we both wanted you remember this when overton made speeches but the second time the second one we were there in DC for the correspondents than I was working with the creative coalition. So I was working all day I was actually going out and doing stuff and then the next day I was at this brunch. And all of these You know Washington people that were famous for their you know everyone that you see on TV and this very strange looking looking man started making his way toward me. Like his eyes focused right on onto me and I realized Oh that's in general Alexander Haig and his eyes were boring down into mine and he comes up to my face and he says I find your show Eerie walked away. I said to myself thank you. Ah You should've said I find your show. You're shooting a scene with Brad. It was a long shot. Brad was way down on the sidewalk doc and he was just going over his lines. He's muttering to himself and it was a fairly animated seen muttering to himself on that turns out he who's doing it in front of the FBI building and there are cameras on agents. Come out for hours at this huge thing at a memorize. And I'm pacing back and forth like screaming about like Congress got together and then and then when when people would come by actors like when you're doing that you just stop and then they're going to do it and this guy comes running around the corner with his got got out. He's going what's your name. What's your name I'm dean on Brad? Whitford I'm an actor. Life facility does shoot the one quick one. I know we're I like people. Don't they need to eat one. One one very funny thing. We were doing well at that point. Bush was in. And we're going in and out of the gate and I sort a new some of the secret service guys and they're seeing me exit the gate and then going back in and Josh Bolton who was the actual deputy chief of staff comes in and we're in that little gate where the secret services and I'm walking in with them and they go yeah go ahead and they wave give me right through and they go hang on to Josh and they search. They search his bag. And he's like this is ridiculous just before you 'cause I know you got to sign off. But he mentioned no well and I just want to end on this quick Noel Story. That was the one Washington in trip that I wasn't able to go on because my daughter was born but Tommy was shooting the scene in the last scene in the episode. Would that choir sing the bell song in front of the White House. Josh and Donna coming out it had to have been freezing outside. It had to have been two o'clock in the morning or something something and Tommy asked everyone the choir and the crew and everyone to do him a favor. He got the choir to sing. My daughter was a Hebrew lullaby. Oh by which translates roughly to welcome little princess and Did a beautiful crane shot where he showed the White House at the end and on and gave me that tape. And that and having you and your wife at the time over to watch Noel and seeing her just weeping and weeping no those are two really strong memories for me all right. I feel like the bummer. Dad comes downstairs at the sleepover. And it's like guys it's eleven thirty ready go to bed but I think we need to thank Josh appreciate Ride West Wing Weekly. Then they kept his show alive. Yeah so it really is that time. I was hoping to have something profound to say the end but I don't what I do have is profound gratitude to Aaron First and foremost and Tommy and all the people that are on stage age and that worked in front of and behind the cameras to make this show. That was such a special experience. That ingratitude to Richie. We found a way to relive for a few more years. It's a testament to the experience that we want to that. There's the vibe in the room where you just don't WanNa go home. Nobody wanted to just last a little bit longer and what I will say as well. We're all wrapped up in what the experience was. The beauty. Part is that what's left behind and twenty years. Later is the work and so that what will go home and wish that we had an excuse to all be together again and hopefully we'll find reasons at least in small groups to actually see each other again a hope for you guys. The experience will continue because tomorrow you can go home. Hit a button. MM and watch the pilot again. It's going to be impossible for me to express all the things that I feel and all the gratitude that I have to everybody here and all the people who aren't here that made this podcast possible. I can't believe that a night like this even happened. It's really incredible and it's been an honor and a pleasure to do this with Josh and so I'll just leave it there. I'll just say thank you all so much for being here. Thank you for making this one of the great pleasures of my life. Thanks so much to Zach macneice Margaret Miller Karen Nick Song for their help making the show. Thanks to everybody here at the ace. Who have been incredible? Coordinating this circus. It's been amazing. Thank you to energy and Vanessa. Thank you to our photographers. Thank you to everybody who helped make tonight possible. And whom helped make the podcast possible. astle including Radio Topa. We are proud part of radio. Topa you need a new podcast to listen to check out. Radio Topa Dot. FM There are a a slew of wonderful guest. There and I think this is the last time we're going to get to say this but okay okay. Tomorrow this is plant the radio.

president West Wing Ho Josh President Santos John President Bartlett Jimmy Smits Aaron Aaron writer Toby Ziegler Martin Sheen Mrs Helen Santos White House Blair House John Wells Bradley Whitford Eli Attie John Christopher partner
6.13: King Corn (with Karis Campbell, Evan Arnold, Lauren Schmidt Hissrich, and Michael Grunwald)

The West Wing Weekly

1:22:27 hr | 2 years ago

6.13: King Corn (with Karis Campbell, Evan Arnold, Lauren Schmidt Hissrich, and Michael Grunwald)

"The west wing weekly is brought to you by Virgo. That's VR B O. You is pronounced for about turns out. Apparently who knew I've stayed in one. I mispronounced it. I'm embarrassed will Virgo if you don't know is a leading vacation rental site. And it's a great way to rent your, home, short-term and earn extra cash. Yeah. Here's the beauty of Virgo. You rent when you want? How you want your in control of everything the availability of your place, the pricing and your house rules set those rules. Verbal lets you rent whatever kind of property, you have condo or a cabin or apartment in over one hundred ninety countries while staying compliant with local regulations give it a shot. See how much you can make try it for one weekend. If you wanted just put a foot in the water find out how much you can earn by visiting VR B O dot com slash west wing. That's VR B O dot com slash west wing. And please be sure to use this URL because it helps out the show. Support. For today's episode comes from Wells Fargo with two hundred billion dollars committed towards the development of clean technologies and renewable energy to eight America's transition to a low-carbon economy. More at stories dot W, F dot com slash environment. Hello and welcome. You're listening to the west wing weekly. I'm Joshua Malina. And I'm Russia case here way today. We're talking about king corn. It's episode thirteen from season six it was written by John wells. It was directed by Alex graves it first aired on January the twenty sixth two thousand five this. So takes place entirely in Iowa. We get to see one day from the perspective of three different campaigns. And joining us later, we'll be to the actress who portrayed to the campaign workers cares Campbell and Evan Arnold who played Rana and Ned from the Santos campaign, respectively will be joining us to talk about their experiences on the west wing and with this episode specifically Huzzah, that'd be fun. Josh I wanna start off by saying this. I think this is my favorite. John wells episode favorite episode written by him favorite episode written by John wells. Yeah. Because usually the John well's episodes are the season, openers or finales, and they have more of. Cliffhanger. He kind of flavor to them. Right. And as you know, I like this sort of slice of life episodes a little bit more. And this one is really like a slice of life on the campaign trail. And I thought the John well's take on that kind of story was really great me too. I love the way the three stories are told it's another breath of fresh air episode. And it feels like the energy of the series is moving out on the campaign trail and moving away from the core crew, we've become accustomed to over the past many seasons. The focus the show is shifting in some ways. This episode does feel like a pilot. I know does almost feel like it could be a season one episode one take on things there moves that are made here that are so different from the west wing in some ways, it feels like a blueprint for a new show. Even though there are so many familiar moves within it. I love the structure of this episode taking this one day starting at five forty five in the morning going up with the wakeup call. And telling each story within its own kind of silo in the middle of the episode. And then wrapping them up at the beginning in the end altogether. I thought that was really cool. It put me in mind of Russian doll on net flicks. Yes. A great show. Yeah. I've only a few episodes into it. Yeah. But many deaths into it already. I mean Russian doll in this episode. Both think oh a debt to groundhog day and dude here especially because the day starts with an actual wakeup call. And you get the shot of the alarm clock and the time it feels a lot like the beginning of every day in groundhog day. Yes. I did notice though that in the Josh Lyman wakeup he's gets his five forty five. Am wakeup call at what appears to be five forty six according to his desktop clock. It's true. And you know, the the opening title that we get for each of them is that it's actually five forty six in the morning. There you go. So it's the call that's off the the calls just coming in a little bit late. You know, they gotta make they've got a call all these different people at five forty five unless the title card is off. All right. Let's start at the beginning. We don't actually begin the episode on this Wednesday morning that episode centers around. We actually start the night before with again, a different kind of motif than we've seen on the show. They're just all these different shots of different hotel signs in Iowa as Patsy Cline plays. Just establishing where we are in the flavor of the place as Donna rise at the Holiday Inn. Yes, I wrote down that. I really really liked the cold open terrific. It's tight it's taught it's fresh. It's new kind of. Wow. This is a different version of walking after midnight by Patsy Cline that I'm familiar with it kind of set the tone for what we're talking about here where it's like, it's something both very familiar all the moves all the notes in the song and the lyrics of the same. But it's presented in a way that I was not used to. And so in some ways, it can felt like a good template for this episode could point one of the reasons why I love this episode is because it feels really economical like I think they do a lot with few moves, and it starts right away. Donna walks into the hotel, and she has a shorthand with the people at the front desk. Four. Mister Baileys stole McAfee. Wakeup call. Just have someone come to my room and hit me over the head with on mallet or something just a couple of lines. You know that she's been there for a long time and not only Donald but a bunch of people. They they say, oh mister Baileys still over here liked Mr. Bailey. Yes, I tried that I felt respected for once. Just smart writing how much they convey in just a those few lines. Yes. Good storytelling. Then we go into the mobile version of the Russell campaign and mister Baileys pretty again, brutally tactical. Yes. In his little booth that he's coming geared. Yeah. What'd you think of this strategy to recently released federal inmates airline mechanic to men over the age eighty comedian? None fill the debate stage with fringe candidates. So that poins looks closer to the fringe candidates than he does to Russell even though they both had served as vice president. Yeah. I like it. I think as we'll soon learn that seem Donna that. There's such a thing as too fringy. Right. Scary fringy. Yeah. But the idea that if you put crackpots on stage to gravity will actually pull horns closer to their direction than towards Russell's direction is a shrewd one. I mean, if he's right. I don't know that he's right. I mean like you said like some of them are so fringe that. I don't think that it will actually work the way that he wanted to work. But it is it's also pretty harsh assessment of where horns actually is. Indeed will also has I think very carefully created tired hair. I'm like to myself. I'm like, I wanna how long hair worked on me to make me. Look just that sort of tired work up lay. I mean that was nice right to go into hair and makeup and not have the usual. Oh, it's fantastic. Yes. The normal daily fight is try to look my best to which is just an utterly depressing endeavor. Like when they're like, you know, not have to worry about shaving, or maybe even showering, and we don't have to do your hair. Nowadays, going to hear is depressing for another reason because they have to create the illusion that I'm not losing my hair, but back then they had to tired up so Donna's come back from raising a bunch of money. They're raking it in on the Russell campaign. Teas. Money is not an issue. The issue is the actual campaign events. They have to do this event in front of the corn growers expo the Iowa corn growers expo this really becomes the heart of the episode because all of the candidates have to decide what they're going to say about ethanol ethanol being the touchstone of the Iowa caucus. And apparently, this is in fact, the case you can't show up and not talk about ethanol. Yeah. There's sort of one thesis underlying this episode, which is that you can't win in Iowa without being a supporter of ethanol. And it's a matter of either you come out for it. And and pander and get further ahead, or if you're against it you come out against it. And as most of the candidates everybody Russell Santos and vinick are all against it. And it's a matter of whether you know, you say that and torpedo your chances are not what history since this episode is aired has proven that. That's actually not the case since Ted Cruz in twenty sixteen went to. Iowa was against ethanol, which I guess makes sense as a Texan pulled Vinik, and he won the Iowa caucus that said, I think you, and I both read the same article suggesting that the Democrats are still kowtowing to ethanol by in large in order to do a rural vote that has been alluding the party. Yeah. There are a couple of articles that will link to s- people can read about this more on their own one is an article in political magazine that sort of details the twenty twenty Democrats stance on ethanol and how all of them have basically fallen in line in support of ethanol despite other policy positions that they have that might make you think that they would have come out against it. And actually spoke to the author of that piece. Joining me now is Michael Gren walled senior writer for politico magazine. He's the author of the peace from March twenty nineteen how the twenty twenty Democrats. Learn to love ethanol, Michael thanks so much for joining me. Thanks for having me. So in this episode, one of the central plotlines is that all the democratic candidates are expected to support ethanol production, but it's actually. Kind of cynical because none of them actually believe in ethanol production. And I was surprised when I was researching for our discussion to find your article in political magazine because it turns out that maybe things haven't really changed that much since this episode aired in two thousand five well, the main thing that's changed is that there's a lot more evidence that ethanol is bad. But certainly the ethanol pandering has not changed their I guess a lot of rural votes in Iowa. You know, I read a study from the department of energy that said ethanol production is getting better and getting more efficient, and you know, at one point in the west wing episode. They talk about how it takes a gallon of fuel to create a gallon of ethanol making a gallon of ethanol takes almost a gallon a boil it's like same using tonic. Water is an attitude reduces our demand for Jin. So, you know, it's not a net energy creator. But in this energy department report, it says the ratio is actually gonna to one, and it's gonna get better as technology continues to improve have you found that that's not the case. We'll know that part is true. Certainly agriculture corn growing ethanol production all of that has gotten more efficient but back in two thousand five there is a real misunderstanding of ethanol's impact on the environment. Partly because people weren't as focused as they should have been on climate change. Which is the the main area were ethanol so problematic back in those the days of two thousand five people figure that the actual act of growing ethanol was carbon neutral because you know, you took the corn. And you ran it through the ethanol plant and that created some emissions and then burning it in your car created emissions. But then you would grow more corn and through photosynthesis. That would take the carbon out of the atmosphere so between growing and burning that seemed to sort of cancel each other out, but what people realized seem sort of obvious, but it took a big article in science magazine. Gene kinda point this out for the first time is that, you know, it wasn't like before we started using ethanol that that land had been, you know, pavement or a parking lot hidden. In fact, been growing corn. And when you use an acre of land to grow corn to grow ethanol somewhere else, you've got to grow an extra acre of corn to feed cows or feed human beings, and essentially that acre of corn is likely to come out of grasslands or wetlands or or forest land that used to store a lot of carbon. So essentially the opportunity cost of growing this ethanol is taking a lot of carbon sending it into the atmosphere. And that's why all bio-fuels really have a carbon problem, but ethanol seems to be the worst. I thought that there was such a surplus of corn growing in America the ethanol production rose out of that that we had corn to spare. And so we didn't have to worry about taking an acre from somewhere else in order to grow. The corn that ethanol was supplanting. Will you to hear that a lot? The remember we're this is a global market. There's a fixed amount of land in the world. And there's a you know, there's sort of a fixed amount of food demand. And when we use that great agricultural land in the middle of our country to grow corn. It can be used to feed somebody or it can be used as fuel to feed SUV land turns out to be extremely efficient at storing carbon and growing food and not so officiant at growing fuel for the people who were on the ethanol industry side of things say to you when you're talking to them about this. Well, one thing they point out is that they've gotten a lot more efficient as you mentioned end. They do say that it's not like the United States has a corn shortage. But remember about ten years ago when the United States renewable fuel standard went into effect and really the US had a huge boom of ethanol production started devoting. It's now I think about forty percent of its. Corn crop goes to fuel. You saw simultaneously a huge spike in food prices around the world and tremendous geopolitical, instability, you had sort of these tortilla riots in Mexico, the places like Sudan and Pakistan where that were not exactly particularly stable to begin. With were having tremendous problems with the rising price of food. I remember it was about ten years ago. I went to Brazil and talked about how the increase price of soybeans and grain was creating tremendous pressure on the Amazon and you talk to people in the field. And what they said is the price of grain goes up the forest comes down. And that's essentially the problem with that at all it is pretty transparently and effort to boost agricultural prices to boost grain prices, which is great for the farmers, and we're very good at finding ways to use public policy to help farmers, but it's not so good for consumer. And particularly when it comes to raising grain prices that has a real effect on land use around the planet. So it's almost like the exchange that we should be looking at is not how much it takes in terms of fossil fuels to produce the ethanol at ethanol plant, but actually in terms of the carbon exchange between what the ethanol gives off and what the plant life that might exist in that finite amount of land might be able to absorb back in exactly we're sort of talking about it, and it's kind of complex these sort of, you know, life cycle analyses of carbon. But essentially when you think about it, there's sort of a a fixed amount of land in the world and with that land, we're going to need to feed seven billion people, and we're going to need to store an awful lot of carbon the sort of carbon that we use to store a naturally before we started burning fossil fuels. And now we're going to have to sort of this store extra carbon to hopefully, someday remove some of those those fossil fuels that we. We've already spewed into the atmosphere. And so really the way to think about all bio is that every acre of land is really precious. And if it isn't sort of serving one of those functions if it isn't store in a lot of carbon or it isn't producing a lot of food. It's having a negative impact on greenhouse gases. So given everything that you've learned why do you think that the twenty twenty Democrats aren't coming out against and all what's the reason for hanging in there? You know, it's funny in in some ways, this seemed like the perfect year for Democrats to turn against the ethanol industry because first of all, you know, in twenty sixteen Ted Cruz on the Republican side actually ran against ethanol, and and he won Iowa. Right. It was one of the only states he won. So it sort of showed that it could be done and that theoretically is even a harder mountain to climb than what Democrats have to do. Because maybe he's got a court rural support even more strongly and deeply than Democrats wear their support my becoming more from her. Urban parts of Iowa exactly they've done so badly in rural America that they feel like that's just not sustainable that. If they want to win back, the some of those rust belt states in the middle of the country that they're going to have to do better with rural voters, and there's no question that in Iowa were ethanol creates about forty four thousand jobs, and it really is a pretty big industry in a lot of these small towns that have been so sour on Democrats. They feel like this is a way where they can say to rural voters. Hey, you know, President Trump. He's been kind of a mixed bag on ethanol he's supported the renewable fuel standard. But he's also provided all kinds of exemptions for oil refineries because he's even more in the tank for fossil fuels than he is for corn at the same time, a President Trump's tariffs, and his trade war have really a created huge problems for farmers corn farmers in particular and for rural America. In general. So a lot of Democrats are saying, hey, you know, we can't afford to give up this opportunity. So you're seeing even Democrats who have been really quite critical of ethanol in the past like Krista Jila brand. Cory Booker are now saying like, hey, this ethanol may be not be the long term solution. Maybe it's just a bridge fuel. But we've got stand with Iowa farmers. You have this quote in your article from Senator Booker saying, it's not a question of if it's a question of when so right now, I support at an all I support our farmers. But no this transition is coming. I mean does this feel emblematic of the twenty twenty Democrats in general kind of wanting to play both sides? It's a little like a Saint Augustine, right? Like Lord, give me chastity, but not quite yet. Look, I think what Senator Booker said is exactly right that you can see a transition gumming to electric vehicles in the sort of the global marketplace, you know, or the sort of the rush for alternative fuels electrification has done really well and biofuels have done really badly. But what he's saying is like right now there aren't enough electric vehicles to provide one for everybody. Anything look if we want to do something about climate change in the transportation sector than for now. Ethanol is the only option the problem is that the really is just mounting science that ethanol which really was touted as this kind of bland to save the world and a lot of people like, you know, Al Gore were really excited about it in its infancy. It really turns out to be more of a sort of planet killer than a planet saver while. There are still several months before the actual caucus. Do you think that there's any chance that anybody from the crop of Democrats might change their tune? She. No, I have to say, yes, I would say there's a chance because it seems like when you've got twenty people running for president in one party. You would think that these candidates would be looking for ways to set themselves apart from the pack and being the greenest of a green pack seems like a pretty obvious way to do it. Even if it turns out to be kind of better politics in New Hampshire than in Iowa. You wanna stand out somewhere that said so far you haven't seen anybody take a bold stand on ethanol among the Democrats, a not even Jay Inslee who's running as the climate change candidate. And I'd be lying. If I say, I really expected somebody to do it in the west wing episode. You know, the Democrats that we see all take the pledge despite bleeding otherwise. And the one person who doesn't is the Republican candidate the character that Helen all the plays, then it comes out against and all because he's been against it as a Senator from California he's been against it publicly. And then he. Sticks to his guns and in the episode. It's sort of a foregone conclusion that he's basically committed political suicide in Iowa by doing that. But at the same time, it's a very, you know, admirable west wing moment because it's somebody who has decided to go against group thinking move away from hindering and speak their mind, despite the consequences law on the Republican side last time, you saw Marco Rubio, and Jeb Bush who were had always been anti ethanol flip-flopped. You saw Bernie Sanders who had always been anti ethanol he flipped lopped and the the one who stuck to his guns was Ted Cruz. And he won though, I must say as a caveat that I heard from Democrats and Republicans in Iowa that a lot of them they pointed out that it usually is a pretty right wing candidate like Ted Cruz who wins the Republican caucus in Iowa. And some of them think he would have won by a lot more. If he hadn't come out against at the all and that Donald Trump who came out very strongly in favor of ethanol. During the Iowa caucus that that really did help him win Iowa in two thousand sixteen against Hillary Clinton res-. Remember, Barack Obama at one Iowa fairly easily, and he was a big bio fuels guy and NFL guy. And it was the biggest flip of any state in twenty sixteen. That's I think part of the reason why it seems even more surprising that they would stick to supporting ethanol because it does seem to be not just in urban areas. But throughout the state, it seems like it's receded in its importance in favor of other kinds of issues social issues, abortion gun rights, things like that that voters are actually more keenly tuned into I pointed out in my story that even in Iowa the wind industry is a much bigger industry that produces far more energy than the ethanol industry. Even though Iowa is the number one producer, and yet you still saw even Michael Bloomberg who back in two thousand seven when he was trashing ethanol had said that basically the. The only reason to support ethanol is if you're a presidential candidate. And and I'm not interested in that. You don't want he became a sort of momentary presidential candidate. And he never even ended up announcing he flipped to right? Well, I guess we know it's bipartisan issue then. Yeah. A political courage is or the lack thereof tends to be bipartisan as well. Michael. Thanks so much for taking the time to talk to me about this your article was great, and we're gonna link to it on our website. So people can check it out. Thank you so much. Yeah. Anytime. One of the interesting things about this episode, and I guess about the current date situation. Is there seems to be like a whole guess you'd find this law and politics for almost a wink, wink about it, you're pandering to people they probably know you're pandering, some people in your own party who would disagree with the position taking you're probably inclined to let you off for it. Because they know your pandering it's a whole like multi level approach that just isn't genuine. But it's to sort of have the game is played. There's a quote, I read from John wells when he was talking about this episode saying that this is the central issue for campaigns. I said what are you willing to sacrifice what your integrity? What do you have to do to be politically expedient? The political professionals are telling you, it doesn't really matter. What you say you're just trying to get votes and make a difference when you get elected. That's a recurring theme. After someone's actually elected us to something that you have will Bailey, Josh Lyman and the new introduction of Stephen root. And Patricia Richardson coming in a further vinick campaign all kinds of serving this role of telling their candidate, you just need to do this for your political future. And then you see how the different candidates react to that advice, even the they all get the same advice. Yeah. It's interesting. What we don't really seem to have is anyone on the strategy and with his or her head in the clouds. It's the candidates who rankle under the pressure of being pushed towards a position. They would rather not take that. They in fact, do not hold and all the operatives are saying for the love of God, just indulge me here and say what you need to say. Yes, I wonder what the Russell haters might think of Russell in this episode and what he says because he has his reasons for why he's against Athen all and he articulates them. In fact, he's just. The person who happens to buy in to the arguments that the all these political advisors are making he gets it and he has his objections, but he also doesn't need to be spoon. Fed a kind of campaign strategy one one in order to go out there and do the pandering that needs to be done for set on this ethanol speech don't worry recital. Take the pledge. Yeah, that's right. In a sense. I could almost although it wasn't a real focus of this episode. I could a little bit see because I was looking for what will sees in Russell in terms of this one microcosmic issue. We've heard we'll say before Russell might be the next president of the United States you get in. Now, you can make him the candidate. You want him to be after that we make them the president. We need them to be. And that's sort of like, that's what this you know, that John wells quote was about. Yeah. Get him in office. And then start doing the good things that you'll know her right and good and will Bailey at least have someone who's gonna play ball into understands that. That approach right? Whether or not that's admirable. He's he's got what he needs. And what he's looking for. Josh Lyman MSN seemed to have never had a very basic conversation. I know I kind of said this before. But again, Josh seems to be misreading or forgetting what caught him up in the Santos orbit in the first place or with the aura Santa's he's not that guy. He just isn't that guy. And even though he even does it you can see and it's a good performance. You can see it in Santa's face when he stands up there and reads from the teleprompters, basically gritting his teeth. This is not look like a happy guy. This someone is taken his medicine and Josh Lyman should have made that read by now and on top of it. The candidate's wife is also making clear that that's not what she's a bad. It's not what Santa's is about. What are they doing? What do they get into this for you know, it's like Josh has got to take a deep breath and figure out whether we can work with this guy in some ways admire Russell because he doesn't you don't have to waste all. That time they sort of have these philosophical arguments about why is the Iowa caucus even important, you know, and this is the board and how you're gonna play it. I guess it feels like it should be played at a more sophisticated level than what we're dealing with here. Although I like I said I liked this episode a lot just in terms of the actual mechanics of like making a campaign here, you are at the Iowa caucus in deciding, you know, yeah. No. I split. I eventually just let go yes. I had to to enjoy the episode rather than continuing to write down, essentially what you're saying. Like, the aren't they're not past this point. And I just decided, you know, in its own terms something interesting going on between Santos. And Josh there's they've already even had that moment where Joshua's like, wait a minute. Are you not even in this to win it right out here to do something? And they really should be past that point. Now, come down to one strategy. Are we going to do the politically expedient things that we need to do in order to try to mount a serious campaign for the presidency? Are you just trying to make a statement in which case, I think would Josh? Would've been on board with coming out to Iowa. And you know, speaking out against ethanol. Yeah. Let me also add another layer of ambiguity to the story line. Because there is this kind of aspect to it. That's taken for granted that like ethanol equals bad. Right. But there is a little bit more nuance to it than that. And you know, this episode not surprisingly pissed off the actual ethanol industry who pointed out that the episode got a lot of things wrong. It hasn't improved that much in the very recent past, but from the nineties when this energy sink that Russell describes actually was the case till two thousand five there were actually a lot of improvements. So by the time the episode aired even then it was no longer the case what they're talking about. And now the energy efficiency is higher still better. I think there are plenty of reasons to criticize ethanol, or at least be wary of it. I feel like they're using it as the stand in for. We're all meant to understand that ethanol is bad. Right. And doesn't make sense. Yeah. And I think. Really the issue itself is just sort of a convenient reality that this is on the after talk about in Iowa really could have just been a black box to get to the thing that John wells was talking about which is the idea of like, what do you say? That's actually in your heart in versus what do you say? In terms of what you need to get elected. Yes. But you know, when you're a TV show that millions of people watch, and you treat a real issue that has responsibility there. Yeah. And people weren't happy. And that's not the only thing that people were upset about what else there is a smaller thread in this episode, not even a thread, really just a mention of a woman in Turkey who is going to get the death sentence for adultery. And turns out Turkey was not so thrilled about that Turkey where the death penalty was abolished. They had not executed anybody since nineteen Eighty-four. I mean say what you will about prime minister to one he abolished the death penalty fully in two thousand four. This episode got a lot of criticism from Turkish politicians, and it ended up leading to John wells and the president of NBC Jeff Zucker sending an apology to the Turkish ambassador as they should have. I mean that that's a big miss. Yeah. The letter said in the future, we will not only visit Turkey a country that we admire but also present a better and correct portrayal of your country, or as we have in the past will make up a country and say it happened there. This is the reason that you have Kamar right dumping on Kamar got no embassador to apologize for when you make up a country that was a big miss on their part. I also I had trouble with the that story for another reason, my usual reason, which is language and language precision. Precarious time for Turkey who has until recently enacted Turkey who recently is that the right pronoun- for country. Yeah, I'm trying to think Turkey who has recently enacted reforms. I think he would I think he might I think specific Turkey, maybe. Turkey was recently eaten at the thanksgiving table. I think you might like if you were talking about say a debate in the UN, and you referring to the positions that the countries are taking on a specific issue. You might refer to them as who on the UN. I could see you're kind of putting a person in Basseterre on the on the as the represent his day. Yeah. And giving them a voice as if they are in individual just country America who usually supports. Yeah. Like in a war. I could see the use of who they're now. Maybe I'm just wrong way in people America who fought against Germany in World War Two you'd say America, which fought against Germany. I would say which country fight against your. That's how I speak. No. I guess when you're talking about war who fought whom. Well, but I don't know. I don't know. Maybe I'm just rolling it sounded very odd to me in this context. Yeah. You know, what the Turkey death penalty thing reminded me of was Aladdin iron. Remember being a teenager or close to it whenever it was that Aladdin came out. And there was a song at the beginning of it that listening to me like, wow, that's super racist. It starts off with the song. He says come from a land from faraway place. Cameras. Where they told your ear if they don't like your face. It's our attic. But hey, it's. Wow. Yeah. No that I don't recall that. And I remember thinking at the time that was incredibly racist. As like that's really thinking about this sort of the social responsibility of an enormous, Disney movie and terms of its portrayal of other geographical regions. They should have set Kamar. Even if it is, you know, it's not modern day, of course, anywhere, but still. Yeah. That's rough. Yeah. There's xenophobia in there that that's a bummer, and it's crazy that show a sophisticated as the west wing would fall into this too. I called up Lauren historic on the west wing bath phone, and I talked to her a little bit about king corn, and she had to great stories to tell us. Joining me now is Lauren historic to tell us about the town of Santa paula's crazy campaign to get Arnold vinick to be from their hometown. This is the thing that actually happened after this episode came out how did it happen break it down for us? So the very first thing that I remember happening was getting a box of oranges delivered to my office. Postcard. But it was attached to a box of citrus and was from the mayor of Santa Paula at the time Moran, Cresa and Choudhry open. She had started a campaign on behalf of Santa Paula to half Arnold, Nick. Thank fictional character. Be from their very real town. And that's where it all began. Actually, it's just because a one point Vic says. Schichman community in California. Correct. It's just that one line one single line. So what did you do this box of oranges, and then what would happen? Well, obviously, I ate some of the oranges and shared them with the writers. And they were great. Santa Paula is known as the I believe the citrus capital of the world is the self title. So when you get requests like that, you sort of think, well, that's nice. And then you just keep writing story and those requests number Dr story, so we eventually get to an episode in the future where we do return. And all of a sudden we need to make it as where he was from. And that decision was very easy at that point in. You know, I still did a lot of the researching on show at the time as well. So I looked into Santa Paula. And I made sure that it is a place where vinick could be from not just the citrus part of things. But a town that could build the political character that we had built, obviously, a sort of small town would help us in a way, you know, he he talks about when he moved there with his family. When he was a child after I think he was born in in New York, but that his family wanted to move away from the big city and into a small town. So obviously Santa Paul is a small town that suited us. Well, you know, but also sort of would build the moderate Republican vinick was, you know, this sort of economy of the town the local makeup of the town, and it all started to fit for us in a really nice way feels a little bit greedy of Santa Paula to want this given that they're already calling themselves the citrus capital of the world. Like, how many how many supreme do you need? I have to say, though, eating's one of those hilarious stories that you just think like, well, this can't be real it seems to weird to be true. And in fact, it's true as amazing. That's a great tidbit that you got tangled up in because of this episode. But I also wanna ask you about another crazy outcome from this episode, which you've told us about when you first came on the podcast, you mentioned briefly. But we you know, we were so far from this episode. We didn't get into it. Which is that you ended up in court with the government of Turkey. Is that king corn? I had forgotten which episode that was also this episode. Wow. That's a lot for one episode. I think I'd never went to court, but I was named in the lawsuit. That's what it was yet. Which was against NBC Warner Brothers. John wells and me a no one who had just found a single article about a woman who I believe was stoned to death in Turkey for cheating. I wanna say and Turkey did not like how this sort storyline with elected on our country, which I understand that's crazy. Because what I had read was that at least state sanctioned executions had been abolished at that point. But this is not a government execution that you were talking about. That's exactly it is that nowhere in the upslope resetting that the government of Turkey was allowed to stone. Someone to death executions happen all the time all over the world by people who aren't the federal governments of those countries. And yes, that's exactly what we were saying. But the good news is is that when I was researching. I mean, I obviously. Really good records. And the case went away pre quickly because evidence that this had in fact happened in that we were just reporting it as fact so to go away quickly. But then definitely the weirdest lawsuit that I was ever part of that's crazy. So, but you have to parse the idea of the news person. In the episode says this person has been sentenced to death for crime. And somehow you had to spin that. So that the Turkish government could feel like they weren't actually being the somehow that wasn't a government decision. Yeah. That's exactly right. Entities. Again, sentenced to death, you use that term loosely anyway, again sensitive doesn't have to mean in a quarter fall, you know, someone can be facing their own death sentence by a group of people. Crazy. Learn thanks so much. Of course, of course, I'm so happy to be doing this again. This is always fun. Okay. So before we get into the actual three chapters of Wednesday at the beginning of this episode. We get Josh encountering Donna in the elevator. Delightfully awkward. Yeah. It's chilly on that elevator. Indeed. I mean, they really can't they can't find anything to say. It's amazing that the relationship has devolved to this point. I love that scene because it's so well acted and we have invested six years of understanding into it all the things that have happened to those characters before that moment that that scene. Wordlessly evokes. Yeah. Absolutely. And we know under different circumstances. This could have been a romantic thing mean here they are out on the campaign trail there at a town route hotel over right across from each other. I mean, you know, those people who are shipping. Josh, and Donna were wishing they would just choose one room or the other. I know it almost happens almost, you know, not only their on in the same hotel there on the same floor. They're on the same elevator. And then the rooms are across the hall. And then, you know, there's this cute moment where Josh still doesn't know how to open his own hotel room, and Donna has to show him. How to use the key? Josh makes these stupid jokes in Don is not amused. You know, the. First time, I watch this house. I is this it is it finally going to happen, and he goes up to her door, but alas he does not hashtag finish strong. Indeed, not and then he goes back. And I thought this was a great little piece of business. Nice piece of behavior, and he tries to open his door the same way used to his learned nothing. It's a good payoff. Yeah. So that ends our night for our heroes. And then and then the next morning begins with Donna's POV, Donna goes off. And she's driving around. We get to see Trevor who dropped her off at the beginning of the episode. And it's Aaron Ashmore who people might recognize from any number of things. I I saw him in Franck Mars where he played the ridiculously named Troy Vander graph. He was in in plain sight with Mary McCormack who wasn't. And I think a lot of people probably know him as playing Jimmy Olsen in smallville. And apparently he's on a show now called killjoys that I will refer to as kills dry. Donnas day is sort of what begins this first chapter, but we aren't tied to Donna's POV. It's really more Don as a stand-in for the Russell campaign. We're just sort of following that campaign storyline. She just is our our entry way later, we get the scenes on the bus that we talked about between Russell and will and one of the things that Russell makes reference to which is not explained until later within the Santos. Storyline is the black and Brown will says the black and Browns coming up, which is the black and Brown form in Iowa. It's I'm reading from Wikipedia the nation's only presidential forum in which all candidates have the opportunity to answer a central concerns of African Americans and Latinos, and that is recognized as the oldest continuous minority form for presidential candidates in America. So it's a little bit whiny of Russell to say do I really have to go to that. It's not a fair fight is as Atkinson Santos get to stand up there holier than thou rail against racial Justice. Well. Loiter around with those two vinyl twins from a matrix. Any kind of good sense about his comments of ethanol netted come before. Kinda get washed away with that. Well, wrestles generally awash, every for everything you say is kinda slick or kind of on top is always something dumb. He did or said bounces and then the day and the chapter ends with Russell going to the expo. Yes. And doing what he's expected to. Now. I'm not saying this just because I'm in Iowa. I say this everywhere, I go we need more at an all production. It's not it's not a struggle for Russell. No. And everybody agrees. You know, Donna comes back from her tour of the fringe candidates and says it'll be a circus without the jugglers. Russell delivers his line and will says. Me. This guy's not Jewish. I don't buy it. It's not already circus. It's cannon he's going. Yeah. Yeah. Okay, chapter two. We get to watch. Brad Whitford wake up. Either five forty five or five forty six. Let me see Josh lyman's day and his day completely misunderstanding candidate having had a speech drafted for him which conflicts with the candidates own views. This is where I started to have that feeling again. I've come on. Yeah. Talk to the guy. Yeah. Have a five minute head to head before you jump into Iowa. This is an interesting contrast from our last episode on the road with these two because they had the same conflict about the education plan right Santos did not listen to Josh at that time. Josh was saying, hey, you can't talk about this stuff in the end. He did. Anyway, it moved the debate forward and got him some attention and it ended up being an effective strategy. Even though it was went against what Josh advised here. Somehow the impact of that. I don't know maybe Santos was exhausted from having fought that fight even though he won and here, he capitulates. Yeah. But I'd like an away with John wells has done because I really I didn't remember what happened then I kind of thought it was going to be a retread. Sort of the same beats in the same story where he's going to stand up disregard, the teleprompter and say was on his mind. And so it was kind of actually pleased that they went to different way with it. And we see that the guy is human that is subject to the pressures of a campaign, and maybe felt bags. He didn't have very many beans in his jar. Right. And he's starting to look a little bit more than not like a invigorated when he's looking more like a candidate his like a guy who's willing to play the game. And who's however begrudgingly doing the things he needs to do to position himself with some success at least here in Iowa. I like the idea that someone who starts off being on the margins gets to have these approaches that you can only do sort of with the luxury of not taking your own candidacy, very seriously. You know, you can do these sort of more daring moves going against the conventional wisdom. But then as those unconventional moves give you success and move you more into the mainstream in terms of your renown you. Then back off of the things that actually got to there because you do have to abide by conventional wisdom, if you want actually stay in those places, I mean, it's kind of feels like the story of let Bartlett Bartlett. And you know, a lot of things about the Bartlett administration here getting to see it on the campaign trail is a neat. New microcosm for it. Right. These little storylines. Always remind me of the greater storyline of the movie Bulworth in which I play small rural it, which you have Warren Beatty. As Senator j Bulworth who has in fact, hired somebody to kill him for insurance reasons, and he realizes for the first time in his now soon to end life that he has the ability to say, whatever he feels and believes and say it any form he likes, and it's freeing for him the same way that a candidate who believes that he's not going to win or a president who has no more racist to run the radically is free to do say as he or she pleases. Yeah. But being leashed by your own success from having. Off the leash as a really neat hamic. This is a strange moment in this episode where Josh and Santos are having their own version of the ethanol debate when Josh's visits the insult and injury tour going to North Dakota, South Dakota as core sounding name farm stuff. It was a strange example since in season three we already had that storyline. Kind of of true. You remember the Dada has to go to North Dakota early about the Kotas and about their names miss moss? Are you where the studies clearly showed the word north leaves the impression that the state is cold snowy and flat significantly depressing tourism at business startup due respect, sir. Your average temperature seven degrees your average snowfall forty two inches in aim change isn't going to take care of that. We enjoy roughly the same climate of South Dakota. We took in seventy point seven million in tourism revenue last year. They took in one point two billion. They have the word south also mount Rushmore. Four. Yeah. That was a great scene in that episode. I was good. They didn't quite top it here. It's like a little. It's a weird callback a little tip of the hat. That's what I was wondering like it doesn't feel like it can be coincidental. And yet at the same time, it also feels like it doesn't remember this previous scene. It's an interesting question. Yeah. Here's the part that I loved after this. Josh Allen Santos, then arguing about the black and Brown forum, and what Santos can say or can't stay while. They're having that argument. I think this is again, just great economy of storytelling, while they're having that argument, you might not even paying attention while it's happening. They're walking out to a runway, and they go to this small plane, and as they're talking Santos walks around the plane, I love that. And you see him sort of like touch little parts of it. And it's easy to miss the fact that he's actually inspecting the plane because there's no we aren't giving a reason why he would do that it in some ways it just feels like the walk and talk happens to be taking place around this plane, and then it pays off. Off afterwards when Josh finally gets on the plane after worrying about the size of it. And you see that Santos is actually in the cockpit. And he's going to be the one flying. Upfront. I can't exactly why in fact here. You might want to buckle up. Josh don't think I'll ever get time doing battle roles. Yeah. That was great. I noticed it too. Like, it was really taking like a nervous flyer was trying to remember where did you serve, but he was a marine on the air force. So that was a good little review. Yeah. By the way, there's stuff that gets talked about in this episode issues that are mentioned in this episode an immigration Bill that was you know, co sponsored by vinick and Santos. So in just the briefs way possible like the they mentioned the word immigration. They talk about free trade at one point. And they talk about NAFTA. And they talk about ethanol and one thing I kind of wish I don't know if it's possible in episode of TV, but I wish there had been a moment where there was some policy person somebody who could come in and explain how all of these issues are actually all intertwined like NAFTA and free trade and immigration. All these things they share if not one fulcrum, they're all sort of interconnected, and I. Would appreciate it just for the educational value for myself. But the idea of how subsidized corn exports from the US to Mexico. Depress corn growing right efforts in Mexico, sending waves of unemployed farmworkers north of the border to the US to try and find work. There's something really fascinating. There's root level connection. Yeah. And I wish there was just a little something to so those altogether. Don't we know anyone smart? I mean, that's where where was Lawrence O'Donnell on that. Which candidate says that one point during this episode, do we really want workers in Malaysia to the owning our minimum wage again. The idea what real estate costs in poor. I thought that was an interesting that really caught my attention. The finnick is an interesting case it feels a little bit like in some ways he is as much a liberal fantasy as president Bartlett is. I know what you're saying. I don't know if I'm completely able to articulate it. There's something about it's like this is who a liberal would dream up for principles conservative opponent. Yeah. Not just as as a principal opponent. But one who is getting a lot of success in the Republican party as well. Like, not just somebody who is like, oh, here's a principled opponent whose doomed to a guy that can get some traction. Yeah. In in the mainstream of the party. Yeah. Yeah. No. I know what you're saying. And I it feels to me what I think we know to be the case, which is that the maybe it was undecided at this point. I think the powers that be on the show or revving up towards potential reinvigoration of the series and continuation of it with a new president. So I guess you know, I can feel. Feel the approach by John wells and company of trying to give us to viable candidates either of whom could take the series forward for another four or eight years. And we know that Alan Alda was a candidate for president Bartlett's job before Martin sheen got it and here he does come across as the most west wing a character of the rival. He's the guy who's got a going on. He's the guy that is not going to talk out of both sides of his mouth. He's going to lay it out the way, he sees it and still come out. Okay. Politically, he's not going to, you know, self immolate him. He seems to be the person who can walk the line, and kind of be the genuine real deal guys telling you what he believes and either do well with it or or suffer little fallout for it. Yeah. There's stuff. I like I really like about where we are right now in the series because they are really giving you the sense of an election. I think. You have these three storylines in these three characters. One is the established. Right. We have will and on it. And Russell we know all of them that we've known their stories for a while. And then we have this sort of upstart Santos this character came out of nowhere. And in this world of the show the candidate comes out of nowhere. We're going to get to know net and Ron a little better in this episode when we talked to Evan Carris, but to audiences at home, they might not be as familiar with them as actors we've got Josh trying to do what he can push his way up the hill. And then you've got vinick and the way that they're presenting Vinik as a threat to the democratic counterparts is so real one by casting a huge heavyweight like Alan Alda, right agree. But then also by casting his staff with Stephen root, whom I love and actor can do anything and we've loved with Gary cole- in office space. Exactly. Yeah. That's right. Yeah. So that's a little mini reunion. That happens offscreen. That's right. I forgot about that of. Course and Patricia Richardson who millions of people know from home improvement, and so it feels like they're setting him up like even when the casting to have this kind of formidable quality. And I think when we finally get that meeting, although it's a casual encounter between Santa's Vinik in a restaurant. I think they sit down they have we'll chat if feels like two titans coming together. I mean, I do think the one thing that will say is there's a little bit of telegraph coming from the show and that Russell and joins or straw. Man. Winds. We never even see just mentioned and Russell is Russell. It was never going to be Russell. So we're we're sort of you know, the gloves are off. And we're kind of seeing the true it's going to be these two guys. Yes. And I like that they sort of have a little meet cute and the smiley friendly sort of humorous conversation at the restaurant, and they both seem formidable and kind of worthy opponents. Yeah. So going into the third chapter the introduction of vinick. Well, first of all, we should mention that. This is the first episode in which Alan Alda appears in the opening credits did notice I lost even more time. It's right now, there's a single there's just a single still of me. There's not even room to flash your entire name across. It's just says Joshua. That's right. Bad agents. They. Well, you said if it means I can get even one more dollar. They can take my name out entire less. Ju I just don't remember getting an extra. So Alan Alda joins the series as a regular here in the opening credits. He also would eventually be nominated for an EMMY for this season and in part because of this episode, but again, one of the things that I love about the economy of this is when he gets his wakeup call. He sits up, and you see he looks at a couple of photographs in frames, and we don't even see what the contents of the photo frames are, but I think you can tell just from his expression, he's such a good actor who's looking at family. He's looking at his I'm to me. I'm like, oh, that's a picture of his wife, and there's a combination of somehow he manages to get across both happiness and grief in his expression. Yeah. You're absolutely right. I later he'll sort of give voice to it and the sacrifices you make right? And he talks about missing many birthdays of his kids. We get a is. I don't know what the word is for said of von killer. His grand puncture. With it. He's got his granddaughter on the phone. He sings to her. It's a very sweet moment as he's walking to give his speech. I also really cute that he makes reference to montavani to his granddaughter. Two. Funny. Can't possibly have landed. With his granddaughter, whatever age is. Yes. But it's just sweet moment. And we see what he's given up by the end of the episode. We actually do get to see what's in the picture frame. We see Vinik and his wife or a woman who we might assume to be his wife who is no longer alive. But kind of wish almost that. They hadn't shown it because he had already gotten it yet. It ties the whole thing off, but I didn't need it. I got everything I needed in that first version, and you know, I love that. And I was I was impressed by the restraint and really impressed by the performance a little bit of writing that I like to in the booth when Santos professes his admiration for vinick not taking the ethanol pledge what with my ethanol tantrum. I I suspect my work. Here is done. I think I've managed to successfully drag my like my poll numbers buffalo pro hockey scoring. Well, at least you still got a full set of teeth. They're both in the hockey metaphor there. But I like that Santos is also like his his full set of teeth is also talking about like sort of. He hasn't had to make this sort of toothless move of saying he's four something that he's against I liked them. And Vinik ruefully is like my staff is very proud and Santos. You know, again, I I love the performance one. If they weren't I once the humility there, and the the sort of honesty of that confession to say to like your political opponent. Like, I admire your principles, and you did a thing that that. I couldn't do. I just I thought it was a really wonderful how much he downplayed that line. I agree. All right. It's time to talk about it. I've been waiting for it. I think it's I think we've built up this fever pitch moment. The montage Ryan Adams acoustic song desire desire up song choice that almost certainly wouldn't be made. If the episode were made today good point, maybe they'd have a Bryan Adams acoustics. Very good point. Yes. A song that is explicitly about desire, and we get a long loving soul. Tree. Look from will Bailey as ice cream novelty machine. Hoover's up the love of his life Nestle's ice cream sandwich. I thought it so sweet how when we see will Bailey. Wake up in the morning. He has a picture frame next to his bed with an ice cream sandwich in it. Yes. That would have been. Yeah. It's a nice moment. I've been asked about this moment. Many many times I think you're really by. Now, I should have put it to Alex graves, and I will ask him. I remember I believe I remember that when we were shooting it, I found the whole thing odd. I didn't realize how odd indeed it would be until it became. It was part of a montage set to a song about deep desire and dippers the close up. I'm sure I wasn't around when they decided to do an extreme close up of the ice cream sandwich. I mean on a certain level as sad a commentary. Is on we'll Bailey's life in a very deep way. I relate to. I like me some ice cream. Yeah. But this is a level of food porn that goes beyond Instagram photos. Indeed. Indeed, there's something sexual about the machine itself. I mean in the eye of the polar, I guess. By the way, I'd like to give a little callback. Shoutout to a past episode of our own way back way back in two thousand sixteen row. We're talking about season. One episode sixteen twenty hours in L A. Sure, I was talking about Donna, Josh we often do and the dynamic between the two of them in the hotel room. And how really we're getting a very clear sense of how much donnas into Josh. And how sort of cute and she's being on the bed, and you said I will somewhere down the line of a an episode rhyme and hotel room, but I'm in love with an ice cream novelty. That's like wish. Fulfillment for me. Do you remember that? And there's a musical montage during which I stare lovingly at an ice cream in a vending machine. That's my romantic storyline. That's years from now. And we'll approach it again. I haven't seen that one. Oh, you actually haven't you literally don't get the reference. King corn meet you here. Same place. Same time two years from now it took us an extra year. Well, I hope it didn't disappoint. No it lived up to it. So I've been waiting for this. It was a little mini spoiler. For me. I knew at some point. There was going to be some scene between you and an ice cream sandwich. And I just gave about two minutes worth of what the ship name would be for these two lovers. Sandwell was like. Oh, I'm sure somebody out there can top it. I like it. This is like this is like I could actually see the conversation where they say was Pratt. And how we're deja vu. Did Brad say this just when they finally, you know, they've writers in a desperate attempt to come up with some sort of romantic pairing for me could only come up with an ice cream sandwich. Go who else would? Josh Molina have chemistry with. I know can have carnal knowledge of carnation ice cream sandwich. Very. I'm having a little bit bear with this ice cream sandwich. Wants. Here's the real question. How many ice cream sandwiches? Did you get to eat out? None if memory serves zero well on that note rip off, but actually in all seriousness. I am really drawn in by these campaign episodes, so far opposition research and can corn. I love them. They're making stylistic choices in terms of like the lighting in the way things are shot kudos to Alex graves and crew. Yeah. But it ends up making me feel like I'm watching a spin off of TV show. Right. Shared DNA. But at different greeter. Yeah. And this might be heretical. But I think I might like the spinoff better at this point. Yeah. I think the series is progressing in a way it needed to. I mean, we know there's just a season and a half left, but it's feeling refreshed and like could have gone a little bit further yet. Ultimately, we'll go. Yeah. I also wrote it kief lintel because just just as we go to black and the. The credits begin. We hear Brad kind of Mon in bed. It grows. Again, it keenness is in the ear of the hearer. That's right. I'm sure there are many fans loved it over and over and is probably somebody's ringtone. Let's take a quick break. And when we come back we're going to be joined by Kerris Campbell and Evan Arnold. The west wing weekly is brought to you by squarespace squarespace is the best way to showcase your ideas online. And it's so easy to use. You can showcase your art or your music or your business or say, you have a podcast like us. 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That's good because I don't like there to be safe zones and scary zones in my house. I want the whole thing protected. Well, the verge says this is the best home security and at one readers choice from PC magazine. I've also been told the two-time winner of sea nets editor's choice as true. So I guess by pretty much unanimous acclaim, it's the company to go to for security, and you can get a sixty day risk-free trial. So really, I mean, you shouldn't even be scared about trying it that's two free months of not being scared. I've never gone two months without fear. Well order now and have your home protected within a week at SimpliSafe dot com slash west wing. That's SimpliSafe dot com slash west wing. Make sure to use that you are ill. So they know that we sent you the west wing weekly is brought to you by blue. Blue apron if you're looking to switch up your cooking routine. Try something new with blue apron. It's the secret to easy meal. Planning yet is I am an accomplished blue apron cook. And I look forward to seeing what comes next because they'd never repeat themselves in the course of a year. Here's some of the things you might get if you were to order blue apron this month, my favorite part Austen style breakfast tacos with cheesy eggs roasted potatoes and spicy sour cream. Or if you wanna head east from Texas, you could hit New Orleans inspired chicken poboy with roasted potato wedges and spiced mail, or if you're feeling carb conscious, you can have seared chicken and goat cheese, mashed potatoes with fig butter glazed carrots, I'll say even though there is no state associated with that. I think California really is the home of carb consciousness. I think you're right. There are lots of delicious meals that you can make it home without any hassle with blue apron to start making delicious, brag worthy meals at home without the hassle. It'll try blue apron check out this week's menu and get sixty dollars off when you visit blue apron dot com slash west wing. That's blue apron dot com slash west wing a better way to cook. And that back to the show. Joining us now to friends of mine to whom I haven't spoken in a long time Karras Campbell who played Rana on the show and Evan Arnold who played Ned. Welcome guys. Thanks, both of you for taking time to talk to us, and coordinating your schedule. So we can talk to both of you together. Absolutely. I think one of the reasons why I'm so happy to have both of you on at once is because I think of Rana net as a team this team Santos is the team that's established when Josh shows up at their door. And I wanted to know if that feeling over to you too as well within the the world of the west wing did feel like you two are coming in together as a team and do you live together now? Well. Yeah. We do work at parenting. I remember meeting Kerris doing our first episode together. And please correct me if I'm wrong Carris. But I remember we actually had to Riyadh dish in for our rules. Yeah. I remember waiting there in the waiting room next to care us just thinking what if I don't get my own part? Go to Paris. I really liked working with Carris. I'd like to be on the team with with her. What does that mean? Readmission for your part after shooting. Yeah, we did. So we were introduced in the liftoff episode as congressional aides. And so we came in and did these small roles, and so we did that episode together Evans said, and then they started considering expanding the story line, and they wanted to bring they thought it was very reflective of not Santos's personality to bring his crew with him and his kind of reflective his loyalty. And so yeah, we had to go back in and they were going to determine whether or not we have the chops to really carry these characters through. And so, yeah, we sat next to each other thinking, gosh, I hope I'm right for this. I've been through a lot of indignities in this business, but that's pretty horrible. How making you addition for the roles you already booked. Exactly that we had originated. But in all in all fairness to them. We ended up having very little screen time in liftoff. Maybe they just didn't realize it. You know, if we could act beyond walking around a room. Do the two of you know, each other before you started working together on the show. We didn't now that was an introduction. Yet was fun. I remember talking to you by the star wagons outside the sound stages. We were just trying to get to know each other. And you know, my story was like where are you from? Oh, I'm from here. You are. Yeah. I grew up in L A. What about you, my family's globe-trotting? You know, your story is very very interesting Carris full upbringing, your parents were Harlem Globetrotters, and yet they were our live shutters, which is so strange. I know it doesn't look like I'm the product Globetrotters. And since Evan comes from Washington generals family. You were pitted. Against each other. I was always the actually. Exactly. Yeah. I know. I just I grew up broad, and how did you work your way towards acting? I sorta found acting when I was in high school and just really loved it. I found my home and from that point on continue to explore all sorts of different aspects, and I was classically trained. So I did quite a bit of theater before ventured out to Los Angeles. Reluctantly the west wing legs. It's theater actors to me fence, right? I have a very fond memory of just loving the moment and being jealous at the same time. I was in the makeup trailer with John Spencer and Kristen chenowitz when we were outside Royce hall at UCLA one day, and they were just trading Broadway stories. Fourth, and I was a fly on the wall. And I was listening to their opinions critical supportive loving hearts specific. And it was so much fun. And I can see how they do love their theater actors, and you need it you need training and competence for these very fast walk and talks. Really? Yeah. This is true. Do you have any memories of this specific episode king corn, where did we she? I can't remember where were you? We're we're that mixed bag. We started off in Pasadena and then ended up going to Toronto. And so a lot of that was shy right outside of Toronto. And that's all the he knows the authentic cold air scenes. Rosie noses cold read hands. Yep. So we transitions you can see everything that was happening in the this sort of defunct sports store, the beginnings the humble beginnings of the campaign that was all in Pasadena. I remember every location from city orange when we were in the winnebago. We were going up and down like zoo drive by Griffith park. We did we did. Burbank. We did Toronto. There was so much block shooting going on. They were cross boarding three and a half episodes at the same time. And then it's in Toronto that wonderful junk it up there with LA. It was it was wild from a scheduling perspective. Can you explain for people don't understand block shooting and cross boarding and all that? I think you do a lot better explaining that. What what I know from my hack lay perspective is your shooting bits and pieces of multiple episodes at the same time. They'll try to say, okay, which actors can we use this one day, or if it's more location dependent? We're gonna do scenes here, and then we'll filter it can someone give better definition than now. That makes a lot of sense. I was just going to say in contradistinction to the Sorkin years where this would never have been possible under John wells. They would have banked scripts ahead of time or have a sense of where they were going. So that scenes could be shot that weren't in. In the next episode in it takes a certain amount of planning. And then, of course, they'll sue a money saver when you can you know, that you're going to shoot scenes over the course of several episodes in one location rather than keep having the book that location going back and forth week after week or whatever it is. You can actually plan ahead the locations don't correspond to what we actually seeing in the story, but you did have to go travel together to shoot some of these things and one of the things that I love watching this episode is the sense of how this kind of travel ends up bonding, the different aids together is the nation's oldest Dairy Queen where you try soft serve and talking about jobs and the economy next. Is you on the mighty sort of corn based fuel speech when he goes wondering, if you had a similar kind of experience going on the road instead of just sort of showing up on set and doing this as a day job when you actually have to travel to end up making you bond more tightly, I think so I think one of the things that I was really kind of touched by honesty revisiting these episodes because been a long time since I've seen them is how much paralleling was happening. And I don't know if this resonates with you as well Evan, but we were at the very beginning of this journey together on the campaign trail, they Riveria modest humble beginnings. I think our infatuation with Santos, you could really see in both of us that we were just taken with him and honored to be part of this journey and kind of this really probable level of disbelief like we just couldn't believe that. We were doing this that there was even any kind of hope that he could be president. And I felt very much as an actor the same kind of sensation. Like, oh my gosh. I'm on the west wing. This is I think I was filled with so much disbelief and just kind of a wide optimism. And I felt like it was really blurry the lines between Rana and myself as an actress Caras just being completely. Aw of getting to be on this journey. I had so much fun. As soon as you go on location for me it feels like actor camp. Yeah. Yeah. And it's just it's another level of venture. Yeah. Our characters missions were aligned we both are loyal to Santos. We both love him respect him. We work in concert with each other. But I thought as people and as characters we got along swimmingly, and it was just it was so much fun in the second year traveling to Toronto you're like goes extra adventure. Oh, hi, Sam Robarts. Oh, yeah. Josh and Janelle ohi Bradley look at this. Hey, there's snow. This is something different for everybody. It's kind of it was so much fun. How about Jimmy what was Jimmy liked to work with? I just want to say one thing quickly. About jimmy. He's one of those actors who is so giving he looks towards you in the scene he gestures towards you in the scene. How can I include the other actor? How can I give a moment or share a moment with the other actor, no one was neurotic or obnoxious on this set? Everybody was so highly competent had nobody had to be weird. And I had the best time ever. But one of the first thoughts I had about Jimmy was he's got a lot on his shoulders. You know, a lot of focus a lot of words, and he still taking the time to be giving to another actor and thinking about another actor. I felt that for me. And so I'm a fan. I totally concur. He is such an inclusive and just warm human being. And I think echoing what Evans said I think it was a huge undertaking for him. And I think even in his own quiet way. He sort of was. Questioning you know, why he was there and being able to kind of play with these other actors who were so well established and so confident in the roles that they embodied on the show, and it's such as it was such a specific show as far as pacing and language and everything else. So I think it was really humbling for him. But he was just such a delight and Evans, absolutely, right. He was always so inclusive on and off camera, and you could tell valued everybody, but high praise indeed that's one of the nicest things that you can say about an actor actually is that they're looking to connect and to make moments and to share the focus, and it's important you guys help create the whole world around the candidate that has to be kind of filled with life. And you guys did a very good job of that. There's this the hubbub of a campaign that surrounds them in a lot of it is in between the lines of dialogue and around it. Thank you so much. I mean. Yeah. Bratz fashion and Jimmy's depth and pay those made it easy. Easy for us to just look at him going like. Yep. This is our guy, but he's by absolutely. And I think we were there to protect it as well. Josh is struggling to try to understand this guy. He believes in him that the depth of his commitment to him is evident. But he's trying to figure out like this guy isn't anything is up familiar to him at all. And I think our jobs were to also help to kind of explain that bring them into the fold bridge the gap between these two men. It's interesting in this episode, one of the things I wrote down a note says I watched is the still seems evident here kind of a massive misread on Joshua's part of who he's dealing with even though we've seen him kind of fall for the guy and jump in like the entire ethanol issue where he's just drafted in entire speech. That is counter to the guys take on the issue. And then just really pressures them hard to just read it out the teleprompter. It's like it's still a classic. Josh Lyman hubris Dillard play. Absolutely. Yeah. I felt at times. I was being a little negative Ned as I've looked towards John. We did call you that? That I like being called Elmer Fudd junior the best or ten couple other moments when you're on. But yeah, because I was protective I was wearing and this guy is he bending our guys you're gonna break our guy, you know, who's the new guy in the process of working on developing these characters did you end up finding a new kind of connection to real world political figures. Yeah. I mean, I'm completely deluded. I'm actually quite convinced that I worked in politics. Which my husband always has a nice, you know, he chuckles about. But I feel like every time there's a new campaign season. I really genuinely feel like I was in the trenches. And I think working with people that had been embedded in Washington and had such intimate relationships with real campaigns. They brought such authenticity to the world that I mean, it was a civics lesson. But I did have somebody come up to me once he worked in government. And it was so sweet they were very few sieve and just how much they adore the show. And they said, you know, there is one thing that we feel like doesn't quite ring true about the west wing 'cause we work in government. We actually live in Washington DC and work in government. And and nobody in government actually works that fast. I thought that was really good. Maybe if we gave them all only forty four minutes to take back. Thinning parameters the arc? Can I say a favorite moment for me from that episode? Besides watching every graceful moment of garrisons brilliant acting was actually watching Alan Alda when we were in the forum or wherever we held that. Ethanol pledge triple moment between the candidates. There was a moment. I believe we're Alex said could you just speak? You know, we're just trying to get the light flares right or camera angle. Right. And he just extemporised what seemed like a legitimate political speech that went on for in my mind, twelve to fifteen minutes stream, it could not have been that long. But he just went. He wasn't yapping. It was it all flowed and and made sense. Thank you so much both of you for taking the time to talk to us. Absolutely at now is the setting pleasure. Such a thrill to get to revisit the series. Then get to be on with you guys. And and I've been thoroughly enjoying the podcast. So I will definitely continue to listen to them. Thank you. This has been an incredible honor an incredible honor to work on the series. And it's so wonderful that you called us up together to recount some memories. Oh, can I just say one other thing about these do Karras and me? When you were talking about our bonding and our connection, and I think for me, you know, I will always feel this strong connection with Karras. And I, you know, I'm staff or also with Ramon Diana Maria Riva matinee grow, the horrible horrible situation of John Spencer passing away were all invited to the memorial on the Warners lot. And Kristen sang for good and Bradley spoke. And I just remember, you know, okay. I'm walking in. Oh, I'm obviously going to sit in the row, you know, near Carris, we're this element where this unit together as characters and people. And so that's just a a way I wanted to articulate the fact that yes, I just feel like we're we're linked. We haven't seen each other much over the intervening years, but it's one of those things where we talk again right now are we see each other and you pick. Yeah. Certainly that's the actors way. I agree. Those bonds have certainly lasted even if we don't see each other on a regular basis. Well, thanks for giving us the opportunity to bring you to back together for this conversation. It's great great to talk to you guys. That was fantastic. Thank you. Huge. Pleasure. I thank you so much. And that does it for this episode does indeed we've done it again. Thanks so much for listening. Thanks to heaven Arnold and Karen Campbell for joining us. And thanks also to learn history. And thanks to politico senior writer, Michael Grunwald for talking to me about his article, you can find the link to that on our website. Thanks to Zach macneice, Margaret Miller and Nick song for keeping us. Join together go to the west wing weekly for all the links that we talked about lots of additional reading and materials, and you can leave comments and get into fights with people. If you want a threat if by the way, the west wing weekly dot com is too spicy of form. You can always talk about the episodes on our Facebook page where you might have. Little bit more control over what you see you can know his block people or high comments that you don't like there's also a west wing weekly discussion group that is moderated. If you want to buy some of our merchandise or even better give us money for nothing. You can go to clog, blogs dot com and hit the merchandise or donate buttons, the west wing is a proud member of radio topa, which is a collection of great podcasts. That's all I've got go to radio dot FM. To learn more about all the shows. You can follow our guests online too. You can follow Kerris Campbell on Instagram at Carris underscore Campbell. Michael Grunfeld is on Twitter at Mike Grunfeld and Lauren Schmidt historic is at L historic on Twitter. You can follow us on Twitter. You can follow us on Instagram. You can follow us on Facebook. But don't follow us on the street. That's creepy. Okay. Okay. Snacks. Radio too. Ex.

Iowa Josh Russell John wells Josh Allen Santos United States Turkey president Josh Lyman Donna rise America Ted Cruz Joshua Malina Alex graves Russia Mexico Michael Mr. Bailey
Heartland Newsfeed Radio Network

Heartland Newsfeed Radio Network

5:01:00 hr | 5 months ago

Heartland Newsfeed Radio Network

"Start dropping a what crap. And then i saw the first first lexus. They were probably two thirds the price of a cadillac and twice as good just immediately right off the bat. I'm going you know. I went to the show. They had the first. Lexus came out. They had a smaller and a larger version. Eight tier came to my i. I mean just unexpected. I was like whoa really were that bad. We're we've gone this far. And what do you think is going to happen. It was obvious what was going to happen. Cadillac brand all they had this one was called the sierra. I think it was and it was a glorified pontiac that they slapped a cadillac logo on and that was the beginning of the end for me. I always called this cimarron or something like that. And i'm want a piece of crap and it was and clients i have for years. They would trade and get new cars and it just and they try and buy american and it's been an illness sickness corporate bottom line first quarter by quarter profit of something else is going on. Then you find out that eight thousand dollars of a thirty thousand dollar ally back then back then. Eight thousand dollars went to pensions. It went overhead employees. This is not sustainable. Amazon has a big vote. I guess you know. I just kind of glazed. Over the headlines. That amazon had a union vote and they the amazon employees didn't vote to unionize. You know no no matter. How many horror stories they got pm of make quota the shift of whatever the hell and robots are going to take over all the jobs there. I you know you guys keep doing this stuff. You're just gonna put yourself out of a job and that's one thing you'll moscow has been going on about. He goes everything everything that a human can do. A robot sooner or later is going to be able to do. Better everything everything you know. So and he's like pretty much. Everything so universal basic income is becoming a big deal. You had was a yankee something that the democrat big deal. Now he's talking to run for mayor or something new york whatever and based company boss going man reversal basic thing. L. is going to be something. Could be all these people looking for a job. Robots why about freedom. Grab all this abundant about okay. Here's some land homesteaded. Go do what you won that dancer. What's the question. Why did you move to the shire. I moved here to the shire. Because there's other people around who take liberty just as seriously as i do. I moved to the shire. Because i saw videos of people challenging authority and thought that i could get support myself. It called to me like do this right now. I wanted to be around people like me. Who got it and once i got here i knew there was nowhere else i wanted to be. I've always wanted to change the world. So i moved to the shire to join people who were actually working towards doing the same thing that people here are awesome loving and positive it was for the adventure and for the feeling of something important is happening here and i just wanted to come to sort of be part of that. Visit society dot com to read and sign the shire society declaration and learn the reasons. Why if you love liberty. You should immigrate to the shire. Plus connect with others via the forum at shire society dot com. That's shire society dot com. I'm grateful to have heard from some of our satellite listeners. Recently i appreciate knowing that people are out there like what we do and are willing to support it financially l. don. Fm's free to air satellite feeds blanket. Most of two continents. It was my goal to put our channel there. So people without internet could receive our programs and feed pirate radio stations. We started a fundraiser on patriot. A few years ago to back to satellite channels. I recently announced that. I was considering canceling the feeds and donations increased from fifteen to twenty percent of our costs which are around one thousand dollars per month. That's a good start and to incentivize more contributions. the shire free church will be matching every dollar. Can we reach five hundred dollars per month with your help we can. You can join our satellite fundraiser for just two dollars a month at fund dot l. our end on fm if we raise enough to keep both of the channels on the air awesome if we raise more all add more channels if not we can shut them down and go internet only. It's up to you. Thank you for your support f. u. n. d. dot l. r. n. dot fm looking for a great real estate investment. Consider new hampshire which is ground zero for the liberty movement. Your first call should be to mark worden from porcupine. Real estate is more than just a real estate agent. Easier new hampshire concierge. Where are the best places to live. Do you want farm city the burbs or forest. Do you wanna duplex multifamily buildings. So that renter's pay your mortgage their homes in all price ranges in new hampshire and mark and help with financing to invest in liberty and property mark warden can help the dot fm social media channels have been revamped. We've eliminated facebook and focused on other platforms like twitter and mastodon the decentralized alternative to twitter on our accounts you'll find posts from multiple l. r. n. dot fm show host together in one place. Follow us on twitter at twitter dot l. Our end on fm or better yet move to the decentralized mastodon social media platform at toot dot l. r. n. dot fm t. o. T. dot l. dot. Fm i think you'll like it for the protection of life liberty and properties with free state price. Ever to move twenty thousand people who understands. It's about demonstrating to the entire country. Yeah we can have a free market truly free market and making it just a great place to live. It's the world's largest fall interests libertarian community. And it's it's only getting bigger. That's amazing to be able to move to other people like passionately. Believe in being free and independent with the free state project is managing to do though is to put their money where their mouth is physically getting up across the country and saying let's go someplace. Let's demonstrate the power of these ideas. There's a lot of kind of philosophy that surrounds liberty. There's a lot of thinking about it and talking about it. But here in new hampshire people are doing one hundred one reasons. Liberty lifts in new hampshire a documentary by free state project early. Movers watch it free at one. Zero one reasons. Film dot com. Oh one reasons. Film dot com. What's up next. Visit the liberty radio network program guide to find out at shows dot l. r. n. Dot fm that shows dot l. r. n. dot fm. It's time for declare your independence with ernest handcock. Welcome back we're almost. Then we can do that. Recordings right and start bad more was bangs and stuff which we'd be doing. You know the big thing is is that it's going to be the month of may where we get a lot of the studio setup with more lighting green screens and get all the crawlers on video and make it pretty perfect now. I kinda stopped because that's what we should be working on now. Are hoping to. But it's just been about thank. Well it's almost done buttoned up back onto route again. This is going to be another phase of this whole thing. We knew that Sooner or later this is going to get kind of old with the people. And then what dan. It definitely has bifurcated a country and those that kind of tolerated the government's shenanigans and those and i'm wondering you know what is going to cause people now that take a side against what the government has been doing now. Of course they want to give you the impression that you know everybody's supportive and if you're not you're out liar. I kind of stopped but sooner or later that goes away and you can see what's happened is different things that can do it. Visors experimental are in a vaccine takes out famous c. n. n. legal analyst who celebrated the jab a celebrity legal analyst named midwinter. Charles passed away after receiving fighters. Kobe vaccine she joins thousands of other people have reportedly died in the days and weeks after yada yada so well that had an impact before. If you died everything was cove it now if you you die after you get the kobe shot. It's anything but covert shot. You know so. I'm just i. I'm really interested in how this plays out in the minds of the people as we go into another election cycle you know is the. It's the most important election of time that you know how many times we heard that. And i'm and i'm what if you had an election. Nobody came what if you had an election and state seceded. What if you had an election and people seceded just between their ears. It's just an opinion and a lot of people during. I'm really looking forward today. After the show we have at the top of freedoms phoenix liberty on the land. You know corbett you know back from the memory hole which is urban farmer you know. Here's an urban farmer. I'm be tempted to all the talk. Show hosted i know and everybody that would get james on and of course. We'll be talking to him tomorrow night but you know it's Him being canceled on youtube has been long common. I mean i mean. I don't know what the hell they waiting on. But they finally got to it and when they do. There's always these tin cans that are out there when they do this ad. It'll be the time when they do door-to-door gun confiscation when they do door to door mandatory vaccines and they do door to door door to door. We're going the threat of door to door or make you think it's going to come to the door. Are you better get with the program now before they come door to door so this it's it's fear and fear does not you know last of either knowledge or competence or confidence or you know fears of the unknown. What happens when you know them what i don't. We're getting to that point. I i don't have to get all up about or trying to make it happen. It's happening and what is always turned into it. Turns into food thing. And i talk with my family and so on about that and just you know food thing and then we took anytime. We have our grandkids. I want to talk about my granddaughter's phone thing but this first whenever we had them helping us where we look for an excuse for them to come make money and you're good help. Our kids were little army kids and grandkids. I mean they are. They get married effort to well. Yeah they're little slaves. I didn't mean that. Disparagingly what i meant is you know they. They work hard. They don't get much other you know. Of course they get they experience and get a roof and food and everything. But you know so. I didn't i didn't mean that they're a little slaves. They work like slaves you know. They're not getting paid or but then of course we started paying them as they got more past the apprentice stage and there are actually being useful and it's not taking more time to train them then it is the use i get out of them. But you know that's an investment so whenever you're changing oil and you bring a six year old kid underneath kind of break loose the you know the drain plug and then you let them do everything. I will make sure it's not too hot. Watches is going to go into here. Make sure you got the you go through all that stuff. The mechanic and i were talking yesterday about the boston thing it was. You know he was talking about his wife being concerned about bringing her daughter down there so he goes. Are you kidding me. I'd rather she be down here. Learn what real work is this. I mean you want to go college one thing but you come out and you don't know how to freak and change a tire. They failed just in life. And so i'm i was like and then one of the employees going trade school. That's where you know best thing happened. I didn't have a student debt. Ni- got this. And i learned that and living raising a family of all this michael row thing so mike rowe from dirty jobs. Bob bob's and tone upon now. And bob was just telling me he goes by caro- has his own a new show that they're doing you know dirtiest jobs. And then he's out About promoting work during the lockdown. And so on. He had rv him and his producer and sound video guys. They just wanted to stay busy. During the lockdown and it was it was interesting. Well he has a new show and it's called six degrees and it's like six degrees of kevin bacon kind of thing. I mean you know it's like you know there's there's a history to whatever. He said it reminded him of the show connections. Bbc had a show back in gaza eighties or something. It was called connections and it would go. How do we get to programming computer now. And it goes back to these. Cards had holes in them. That did designs for big tapestries. Rugs or so on and that. Coding kinda went to you on the they did. They invented this and this with this stage and it went to and computers. I mean you know that kind of thing. Well it was telling me. This series is awesome and that one of the episodes or about how they designed to integrated circuit did this and the common. And what was the commonality of all these great inspired high-tech into the future inventions. All these guys were doing acid mushrooms and lsd. That's a common connection over god. Okay i got to watch this. You know so. It's amazing you know he'll he'll bring to the table these connection so i remember that i look for before said look it up. I bet you can't find it sure enough. You can't watch it anywhere but you can order the dvd set for a hundred and forty four dollars of this old bbc thing. That would be played on pbs. You guys may remember. It's called connections and it was about you know why you know the solid rocket boosters on the shuttle or this big because that's what will fit on a rail card and the size of the railcars with the rail that with the roman road which is do with the two horses pulling the buggy. That's how we got our roads. You know the size if they are because it was the the back. End of two horses pulling the buggy. I that that's that's out. Is you know and you just you make these connections. Well i'm i look for that and i'm like why is that. Not more available as at three ninety nine on amazon or netflix. Or something and as you go back and all the things that i liked all the things that i thought were informative all the things that were. Give you the why. Why did this happen. Why why you know. It seems like it's on lockdown memory of stuff. There's it gets you thinking in the wrong direction. It's the same reason that they cancelled. Firefly you know you know the serenity movie so i could it freedoms perspective. This is you know one. Other thing i found out the matrix was a story. Written by that they took and lawsuits and settlements. And whatever the hell it was way more Why he was the enemy. Neo was a Black guy that was much more woke at the time and wondering if the watch st siblings order they are now. There was a reason they did the videtic to to kind of twist. It makes you wonder who their word against its general public opinion. Pop culture shows it. Are you feeling confused about the current economic reports that dominate the headlines. Not sure if this is a good time to buy or sell your home or feel like the process can be overwhelming and confusing. This is done. Hancock was silver alliance realty in phoenix arizona. And i can take some of the guesswork out of the home buying or selling process providing you with market trends in your area and detailing what to expect before during and after the process a home is a place where the most important moments in your life happen so making sure that you know exactly what to expect along. The way helps to ensure that you have control. The future is here. So let me help you move forward with your real estate. Needs being in the real estate business for almost twenty years now has afforded me knowledge of the market networking with industry specialists. Along the way now more than ever you need an agent that can help you make sense of what many think is complicated and mysterious process. Feel free to call her. Message me at six zero two eight two eight one eight one nine that six zero two eight two eight one eight one nine or visit my web page today at donna. Hancock dot com. If you're looking for work it's a process of elimination and you're trying not to be eliminated. So here's a tip for making the cut and this might seem subtle but to the person interviewing you. it's not. There is a world of difference between applicants who convey. I need a job. And those who simply who's i want to work especially in these lean times when many you're competing with will seem desperate in. I'll take anything mode if you convey specific interest in this job at this company. You will be conspicuous. Thus the value of going to school on the company you're applying to before the interview with money and attention so tight now. Effective communication skills have never been more important for more tips for job seekers and everyone else hit survival. Speech dot com. I'm holland cooke. Are you tired of governments. Murdering people around the world stop using their money. There is an alternative. Bitcoin is stateless free-market non-political currency. Bitcoin cannot be inflated or controlled by any government by using their money. You are helping the state stop doing it. You have an incredible alternative available now learn it use. It spread it get started with bitcoin. Bitcoin dot com. That's bitcoin dot com. There are lots of ways to listen to free talk live. Our podcast has been around since podcasts began and now the f. t. l. feed is loaded with content besides are full show archives. Does you know that we make it. Easy for you to customize your podcast subscriptions we have different feeds. One that includes only are full shows one with just the daily digest and our main feed. That includes everything. You decide what you listen to. It's quick and easy to customize your feeds at feeds dot freetalklive dot com that's feeds dot freetalklive dot com free talk live you guys live in a dream world. No sir. you're the one that lives in a dream world and you're the one that wants to have a police state in america where you get to determine who can come in and who can't you wanna have you wanna third world into this country. Let me all answer that question by reading short excerpt from a poem. Maybe you've heard of it. It happened to appear at the bottom of the statue of liberty was your poor. You're tired tired masters right. You are legally come on the league. The league come out because when your ancestors came across. And i don't know what they are. Let's say they're italian. When your ancestors came across all they did was taken dallas island. Screw up your last name sitting around for three days and then bam. You're out the door now. Legal is a huge pile of paperwork and tens of thousands of dollars. Free talk live seven nights a week from seven to ten eastern live on the liberty radio network at l. r. n. dot fm video. Varkey new hampshire bay shows screamed on d. live please follow and share at live dot l. dot. Fm that's d. Live dot l. n. dot fm freedoms. The answer. what's the question you're listening to ernest hancock. And i wanted to make sure. I got sidetracked. I wanted to bring up the silver kids and made a note to myself. We'd have the kids come and grandkids and help do stuff and they get to be actually effective. It's worth paying them and you want to pay him. You wanted to get the feeling of it but in what you know just giving them cash and teach many dance like delayed spending they get enough and they go by video game or some crap and i know dope dope. You gotta say yeah. I'm going to pay your savings you want to do. There's going to be for saving well so you give them sober. You give them the reasons behind it well. A an interesting thing happened this week. One of my grandsons. He was all excited about getting a fifty dollar bill so he gets fifty dollars bill. You got enough. money had a bunch of prizes. The easter eggs. Whatever the heck in the as he he's built he's thinking rich. He had like ninety seven dollars so he goes. I get a fifty dollar bill. I facto that piece of crap paper. You know you know He gets real money. And we went. Into silver and stuff well robertson robertson's broker up and top left to freedoms phoenix silver guy. We know we encourage you to us. And he takes crypto so as cryptos up guess what he gets more silver and so when each of my grandchildren were born he would send them a nice walking. Liberty proof of american eagle proof of approve of something and it comes in a case. It's nice and shiny and pretty and all that well by daughter. Youngest daughter sierra goes to jude. Says oh you got silver shoe engage okay and they got a little save for him. He's so proud of that. That's oh that's like you know to those for fifty dollars. You take that piece of crap paper and you can get to these and these like real money. So he's like. Oh cool. So i want so. He did some horse-trade with me and i had two rounds. I gave him your force fifty dollars so you what do you do. That won't go by more. This is gonna do so. He's like cleese silvered them. We went to another one of my children. He has four kids and the two boys are ten and five well and we had Older girl and another girl in between the two boys so we had the two boys. He's helped me on the bus. I owe him some money. So i think it was like thirty dollars so i gave him thirty s another cash and so on i go man. You really need to get this in the silver. 'cause man is just gonna be worthless and i hate to leave and you not having silver. So we'll go to the coin jewelry store that was within a couple of miles of their house down the street. Go in there. Got buzzy in you go in. It's a nice jewelry store. It's kinda got white walls and everything and then it. Has you know a lot of rain and some jewelry is kinda nicer cabinets cabinets and then a whole probably at least a third a half of it was gold silver and which is why they're the doors locked in their fifty calibers somewhere you don't see him or whatever but you got the a gold and silver laid out and i said look we got the kids need to get all your grandpa you going to learn and you know just give some time to do some calculations and play and get an education. It's all good and he was probably not thirty. I mean he's probably he's young guys by somebody son and later as we were leaving added another probably nine year old kid that came out from the back and everything i see he knows you know so we got some junk silver and yup right over here now. Of course he had their thirty five forty dollar rounds of you know pretty good. Show what they did. Is they go over. Spot or twenty twenty two times face value. That's it so if you had four dollars and fifty cents in half dollars that were sixty four earlier there ninety percent syllabus. I call it junk silver and but it's in. Us minted coins. Silver dimes quarters. Silver half dollars so if you do the math twenty two times it was like five fifty cent piece. Four dollars and fifty cents and face was worth where he goes fifty five bucks or something well then his little brother the five zero i want some to and he had forty four dollars reasons he could get four so these half dollar things were about nine dollars and something almost ten bucks so nine dollars and something for that and i did the math out because it's point seven seven ounces of silver per whatever and then you get a dollar so you have a four dollars and fifty cents supply that out the it was only like three dollars over spot and going really well. We're not getting ripped off in number rip you. I will come by all your freaking silver dunk sewer so i might do that. Got a good deal. Because i'm paying silver. I mean now you're paying you. God forbid it'd be less than five dollars. And so i'm going that's okay and we did the math and i showed him what normally what i paid for my silver biden. Ten ounce bars around or whatever that so they get an education then they guy go. You can't spend and you spend they just give you fifty cents for or the silver is worth yada yada yada so on the business card i wrote i go four dollars and fifty cents and silver is now fifty five dollars okay forever and always you remember. These coins costs you fifty five dollars. That's just need to know that. Okay so you go all right now. What were you just wait. And then it'll be one hundred dollars two hundred and then it'll be it's it's you know it just keeps going and going so he paid like ten dollars over spot so it was not that bad a deal so i'm going okay. Keep track of this when we come back you know from our trip or a year so forever and always they will have seen at the because what was it when we were kids. You know silver was a dollar eighty nine or some crap like that three dollars early. Two of my kids were in high school. It was you know six dollars. Five six dollars you know. So what do you think it's going to happen when it's another ten years from now and it's five hundred dollars or whatever. Will they get the lesson. Then see my point at the same time. His older sister one year her first birthday. She got a baby brother so they have the same birthday. Okay she got her phone and we had a talk and the social dilemma on netflix. We showed some scenes from it and then we had over this last weekend. Pablo scher recommended. Video them talking about google and the surveillance grid all the stuff they're doing to your data and the like i said you know here's an hour and a half documentary. I just put it out now. Know two-thirds i. I just stop it right here. You watch a minute of this. you'll get it. I just remember chock full of stuff. And i just go in there boop and it was like two-thirds recorders the way into it was a perfect. You know segment of what they do with your data and how god thing i go to leave it up to god damn boom there. It is made the point. You feel me so this and then she goes. But i don't want to post anything. I just want to get an instagram. A is want to look. And i go one instagram facebook to. That's what they get you. They want to know what you're looking at. And then they will serve up other stuff. They think that they can get you do something based on what you're looking at. This is how they do. So i go through all this stop it in. Like damn you know their. He's acknowledging the information so finally she goes all right. Thank you for telling me papa. Yada yada yada yada. You'll just shut me up right. So yeah so that we of course showed her some more stop and and while doing that her younger brother and her other sister was paying attention. So this is. I can see it happen because i sought happened with my kids when my space came out there was my space in it. Went hot or not remember. They were doing that and boom facebook hot or not was thing they took. Facebook was really i i. It was harvard than it. Was you know some other colleges and they kept on a college thing so of course all the highschool guys wanted to do it so It was profiles that they took from your college online record to something and boom put more of the things that they did. That was kinda cool. They they drove a lot of attention before that zuckerberg did it was called hot or not and what they did is they took pictures. Always you know girls from their profile. I guess at harvard yale. Whatever the hell was going on and they put it up and you would compare the two which was hotter hot not and you go back and forth back and forth back and forth back and forth. It was just a training. Now they know and then all of a sudden boom just one member kidron highschool. The boys are in there doing this thing. Go let me see all that one. And i seen the progression of this and how they came by by grandson of going look alike games. You get the patient. You're sitting there for hours playing sunday on this one freaking eight x bank shuba gangs keep going back to back in back. That was the first day new stuff from the nineties and early two thousand now they got it on your social media for that same rat. The rat thing. Hit the play button electrified. Then the pleasure by day got an education. Then what are you going to happen. I don't know we'll report back. And let you know grandma. Grandpa get to have a little bit of influence is spreading the message of liberty crypto currency and peace around the globe. Worth two dollars per month to you as you may already know. In addition to our internet feed dot. Fm broadcast on free to air satellite across north and central america as well as sub saharan africa. And we've been available on satellite for free twenty four seven since twenty ten the laura dot. Fm free to air satellite signal is reaching some of the most oppressive regimes in the world. And there's no doubt. Our ideas are making an impact. You can learn more about the channels impact by watching the three minute video at fund dot l. r. n. dot fm if you'd like to help free minds. Globally with our ideas of liberty crypto currency and peace. You can donate as little as two dollars per month via fund l. r. n. dot fm. You can help us. Continue and expand our satellite broadcast multiple continents. Visit fund dot l. are indo fm today. And thank you for your help. 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Facebook new people are signing up for the shire society forum so drop in and say hello at forum dot shire society dot com. You're listening to the heartland newsfeed radio network broadcasting live twenty percents and our by newsbeat. This stream is supported by advertisers and contributions by you follow us on facebook twitter and instagram. The public service doing newscast april thirteenth. Twenty twenty. I might kick him as testimony continues in the derek chauvin trial. The emotional pain felt by the black community and racial justice advocates has reached new levels after a black man was fatally shot by police in minneapolis. Suburb president joe biden and state leaders responded monday to the weekend incident in brooklyn center. Where twenty year. Old dante right was shot during a traffic stop. Police officials say the officer intended to use her tasers but pull their gun by mistake but way find your foundation director and civil rights attorney and activists and the chemo levy armstrong says it shows. The state has failed to address the issue of racial profiling. The fact that police officers would prioritize pulling someone over for allegedly having expired tabs is unconscionable in the midst of a pandemic activists a right who had an outstanding warrant and got back into his car while being handcuffed should not have been that situation because he wasn't a serious threat the incident resulted in protests and civil unrest. Sunday night and prompted curfews. Monday evening announced by governor. Tim walls i mike. Moen a union drive an amazon warehouse in bessemer was voted down last week but many see the effort as an extension of the historical civil rights. Work by the mostly. Black workforce in the birmingham area. Bessemer is about twenty minutes from birmingham. Once known as the nation's most segregated city jennifer bates a learning ambassador at the amazon fulfillment center there helped lead the effort to join the retail wholesale and department store union. She says workers face long hours lots of walking and stair climbing the one elevator designed for human use not just merchandise is only accessible to upper management. Beat says she was offered a promotion with more responsibilities. But no more pay of us. If we didn't take the position as ambassador we would not be considered for any other leadership role amazon. Even dog position do not come with pay. Alabama is one of five states without a minimum wage and has the so-called right to work law which prevents unions from requiring workers. They represented pay dues. This story was produced with original reporting from janae platinum berg. For yes media. I'm lily bulky reporting texas big religiously diverse state but faith communities say controversial voting bills before the state legislature will disenfranchise both rural and urban voters. Bee moorhead is with texas impact voter suppression in the current environment is not about distracting people from things that already happened. It's about assam on the scale of what could in the future republican lawmakers in texas much like their counterparts in georgia say the new voting bills are needed to improve trust and confidence in the outcome of the elections. This is pms. You're struggling with your mortgage. You think about it all the time. What are we going to do if we lose the housing. It's time to stop thinking and start dialing. Call one eight nine nine five hope for free government program that offers expert one on one advice about your mortgage options. We've helped over a million homeowners. And we want to help you. 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You're in the look at whether from the heartland news weather center. Tuesday scattered showers in the morning. Otherwise mostly sunny with a high near sixty one tuesday night mostly cloudy with a low around forty wednesday sunny with a high near fifty six. That's the latest weather checkout more news and weather on our website at heartland newsfeed dot com. She donlan their three young children and six delicious chocolates sandwich. Cookies all half dozen of which perished in the intense heat and towering flames now live from the studios of freedom speaks ernest hancock. Believe me when. I say we have a difficult time ahead of but if we are to be prepared for it we must i shed our fearless standing here without fear because i remember i remember that i am here. Not because of the path that lies before me but because of the path that lies behind me. I remember that one hundred years. We have caught these machines and after a century of war. I remember that we are still let us make them remember. Okay i got some news for you guys. We're going to get bug. Sep boom morality and go into mid fast and oklahoma and just go to mid fat. Just look mid fast in oklahoma and boom new all the goodies and they're already camp there for the past week or two and may go extra bird and no big hurry once we get there. Donna and i need some time. Just chill and get the bustle set up and do and some studio things in order some crap and be in one place and get delivered and you know install and change this and doing that and we're going to be on it and and then of course cryptos gone stupid. You know. And i keep trying to keep my crypto down date. Berta tidiane by some silver go robertson. Robert dance silver but what happens pay. It uses bit. Pay not like secret you know. So what am i am i converted into. What silver's that money. It's just a commodity. When when does it when does it become a taxable event. When did you go into cash if never go into cash. Well if i never used banking system mortified never were you got you got this like shiny stuff that we don't like and don't want to acknowledge guy go. Yeah so where. Are you going to do that. By trade this to get that and we all barter crypto. We all barter silver all bar. I don't ever touch your you know currency of none your business. So now they're going to have to make silver money again. they're screwed. I have no idea what they're going to do. This is just so messed up. We're in interesting times. So i am well. One of the things is we're gonna need to communicate now here is Colin paper from research is The search engine guy. We're working on for fast. That's a very important part. Also very important part is just email or texting or outside. You'll communication between you know the liberty community outside the man's whatever that's going to be part of this i mean there's a whole suite Stuff that we're talking about at mid fast a lot of the guys now. I need your phone's back at the campsite. Go out here in the middle of the you know by the stream of the babbling waterfall. Nobody in here brooke of whatever the hell and talk about stuff or we just do it openly and nobody ever puts her phone up. Nobody gives a crap. You know so. I don't know which is better attitude but we're going to have a face to face we get back about it and one of the things calling. I'm going all right. I'm face to face with several. Ipf s devs this weekend. At mid fest. Anything you need. Thanks for checking in and asking. Here's the deal if we can't get someone to build an pf search module that we can plug into pre search are open source community package platform. I have a twenty five hundred dollar bounty budget and pre to match. I can transfer it to you in escrow. if you want yada yada yada. They can use the existing resources. I mentioned the other day. He has a search thing that they're working on. And here's some of the goody about it and here's another place for let me know if there's anything i can do so there is pre search and i put it together. And he's got twenty five hundred dollars and they'll take the module you. You're still going to need if you've got the ability to do it. You're still going to need a place to run it. You know or a service to has it or place to get it or maybe not vote for not but you know if he's willing to put this in. There's an incentive for this to get done. well anybody. Listen it's at least twenty five hundred dollars already you know. just get. Get you motivated. When i talked to these guys are gonna be. I'd be motivated to do it. They've done a lot more for a lot less so here we go so now. We have search the big thing now. Also looking forward to start nine. Labs is the ability to be able to even communicate to have. We have all this data storage. You know bob who's just tell me going. Look and you got all this data storage. That's cool you know. You're you're saving. Corbett's videos for humanity. That that's cool and there's a lot of other information you wanna make sure you get really gonna be about homestead food growing and being able to barter what you make see. The problem was not whether we have abundance or not. There's a lot of people make a lot of stuff. It's how do you get it. Who has it. How are you going to pay for. It was the part about transportation. That's another thing that i i guarantee. This happens because because we need it to happen there is going to be. They got you heats and lift and uber and get hub everybody gig economy by got my car and i'm delivering whatever and give me money. I'm going. I need this package taking over there. They used to have this all over the place or the bicycle couriers in new york city. I mail it. Get there in a couple of days during this guy either forty five minutes about that. Let's do and that was lice. Fans spooner bystander. Spooner in boston. He created competition with the postal service and they did not like it. You are so free not allowed so they use the constitution against the free market because this constitution postal roads in the post you're not allowed well then. Wells fargo started using transportation on the rail lines and the stage coach. You know but the rail lines was regulated. Because they didn't have that in the you know that was before they didn't have assault weapons assault vehicles. Go down to track. I wasn't in the constitution. So you get all these men spats freedom every now and then and it explodes into an industry. Well what happens when you have individuals that can privately communicate. I have this package. I need delivered there and what's happening like salmon. There's a lot of people go into these different festivals around the country to fast pork fast of what we wind up one year. Don i had a full trailer. We had money left. You know big giant vending machine. We add on the trailer. We had all kinds of different supplies. We brought domes. We've done to ship this ship that and it's just it's gazillions of dollars into well you're going put it in the trunk and pay my gas boom done. This is going to happen. That's already happened. I'm sure if you go look. I went and looked a couple years ago. And sure enough there these kinds of services but we need in the liberty community to wear. It's decentralized no one's in charge. I put up on this channel. You can go search and see delivery state the state. Okay it's from arizona. The main all right. You know who need stuff. Who needs to go. Florida new hampshire and take my pickup truck of i gotten gift. Where's that where's that button. I push whose will set crypto. I use you know how. Oh my goodness how are we going to be able to you know. Connect the people. This is where the future is going to be. It's going to be outside the system. It's going to be border. What happens when you just have a bunch of solar panels. I don't need the supercharge or whatever crap you got harvest host of that my dairy and pull in your car and you getting charged by twenty dollars worth of honey from me in whatever you get free electricity. I mean this stuff is going to happen if you let it and the only way that you can stop somebody actively going out and support and some monopoly supported by the government. A good example. Now j. a. newnan new hampshire. He sent me a man. Some of the is a picture of an icebox that he created and he had there was old panels. That old ice boxer frazier's that they use the built a box that fit right in the bed of a pickup truck. Well you'll hack to a little window shaker air conditioner. Dang were getting colder and insulated yet. Frozen meat put it in their both. Now he can go deliver. I remember when i was a kid in a sixty used to have these trucks born around selling meat neighborhood. I thought you guys don't remember and it's going old school. From the six letter of captain mark a pirate's life is characterized by voluntary interactions. Unfortunately the crown presses everyone into involuntary servitude landlubbers believe slavery was abolished years ago. But the crowns still claims to own us. When it comes into service against our will given sufficient ambition it would gladly draft thousands of hapless victims to kill or be killed it simply slavery by another name and are routinely commanded to serve the so-called justice system in jury duty but before you swell with civic pride consider that how you feel is irrelevant to the crown you will appear. As ordered or face punitive measures the crown insists that you participate in your own oppression. Jury summons provides pirates with a unique opportunity to obstruct injustices jerkin vote not guilty. Even if it's proven the law was violated a juror can equipped for any reason at all and not even a judge can reverse that verdict receiving a jury. Summons is basically winning the sedition lottery. But if you reveal that you know this during jury selection you'll probably be dismissed. If the crown foolishly crimson pirate into jury duty. It behooves the pirate to conceal their intention to nullify unjust laws. If he master takes one hundred percent of your labor it's called slavery but if they only take fifty percent they call it taxation a difference of degree not kind whether the crown claims a fortune on her assent is irrelevant. Most of all a slave owner desires contented slaves meaning thoughtless ones. Except their bondage. These house slaves see no contradiction and being drafted in a ward in slavery or summoned to a jury to prosecute tax evasion and ideal. Slave knows no higher call than the masters will the crowds highest. Ambition is that it's slaves revere the authority subjugate stem but the crown does not own me. I will not surrender my time and treasure. To the crown's ambitions. Join the conversation at pirateswithoutborders dot com the new fourth edition of healing. Our world the compassion of libertarianism. We'll take your understanding of liberty to a deeper level and has ever thirteen hundred updated references new cartoons and a foreword by dr ron paul with discounts for multiple book purchases. The fourth edition of healing. Our world is a gift for the liberals pragmatists environmentalists and christians in your life. Who think libertarianism is cold hearted get yours today at healing dot freetalklive dot com and use promo code f. T. l. for a five dollar discount tire to cancel culture. Sick of mega corporations holding an axe over your head joined the end on. Fm matrix chat server itself hosted. So no one else can tell us what to do or say don't like the existing channels. You can make your own. You can even connect into some of our channels from other matrix servers. it's federated for the full l. Aren don fm matrix experience though. You should join our server via the step by step. Instructions at chat dot dot fm chat dot l. r. n. dot fm on free talk live. We're bringing people to the ideas of liberty. Every day from wrestling superstars. Like glenn jacobs you guys really are having an impact. I believe like. I said a lot of where i am now. He's not listening to free. Talk live you change my mind on some very important issues years ago to random people tuning in on the radio i was stuck in the left right paradigm by on your show by chance on a saturday night from there i went on joined the free state project in become an amplifier. So that's really the reason why i am is because i know that if it wasn't for you guys being on his hdr. I never would have found the idea of liberty. Your ample directly change more lives by getting free talk live in front of people looking for talk radio online and on the air when you aunt free talk live you get perks. Like access to the ample facebook group and an podcast visit amp dot freetalklive dot com. You're listening to the best liberty oriented audio streamed around the clock on the air and online this liberty network at l. r. n. dot fm to be a part of the show call six zero two two six four twenty eight hundred six zero two two six four twenty eight hundred and now ernest hancock. And i'm in the middle of putting this offering the bounty up on the okay. You guys heard it. I you know before. I pushed the button here. You know you're winding later and here. We go pirate box project group and boom and they're on it. Starting starting gun just went off of pre search putting pfm paying a bounty for the add onto yadda yadda yadda here. We go. and we're going to be talking to the guys. A few days got Mid fast about doing this. What we need is communication for bartering. And it's going to what it always is a food thing now. It's going to be you know you're homeless and you find where it's not too hot not too cold and you know i got a white spot in the road but i'm wondering where they make. It seem like you know you could just live anywhere on the street on a corner and park and they're just gonna leave you alone. Maybe some places. They highlight that but. I don't think it's going to be that. And god forbid you're out in the forest where you're not bothering anybody. I remember a decade ago. There was people that were you know during the housing crisis there happened in. Oh eight nine. You know nine. Ten eleven people had found a nice life out in the wilderness. And they just take you out. In the middle of the desert out in the forest live up north. They go down south. They got you know maybe a a bus or something and get there and then they start improve much. They have like a little pathway. A little garden they got a little stream diversion manpower low halo. We got drones and satellites and found. You're not allowed healy. Well you know. I can probably get away with that in the wilderness of alaska or something like that and some people do in fact. They tried to a homestead thing and so on show. I saw a documentary. Well it was a series of woman does on different alternative living on the land kind of thing and she goes around the country highlighting these people to camp. She has a camera another guy camera. Go round hook you up audio and have you give it to her. Their you know their homestead and so on and it's easy by hour hour and a half and you know it's a nice little tour. Explain it to you. Well this one couple when they're younger late twenties early thirties. And now they're in their sixties. They went to alaska because they were shutting. Down home steady. A lot of people don't know that home studying. You could homestead property up until like the nineties until the clinton administration and what they had done. Is it not that you couldn't do it. It's that they could. We don't we close that officers. Nowhere to file the paperwork that goes into the file of the trash you know. Well yeah on the books you can do. Yeah but nobody takes paperwork now. That where you're gonna do you know obviously and ended. they just ended it just. Wow you know this kind of stuff happens all the time. So they did that for a while and a difficult making a go of it and they finally perp purchased some farmland in. What was it in the mid west somewhere you know is like missouri or something that and they were saying that north america was this big oak savanna. They all latitude certain kinds of trees. You know chestnuts this and hazelnut that and different perennials. And so on what they did is they look at all. The forms around them is just an ocean a green of soy this week that and corn whatever. Now that's not what you back a more natural but still managed but they did like What they call it they call it allie culture or something and they would plant fruit bearing or nut bearing trees then they would let between the rows which was probably forty feet or something or or maybe even forty yards. I'm you know depending on what they were doing. And following the contour of how they have the water run and they divert and just as natural as possible. 'cause insects birds ducks. Lynn eggs in the bill of the grass field of whatever to act and digital trees that we harvest. We do the light. Here we plant a bunch of these we let them get disease during the ones that make it. You know they're doing well. And i cut this down. It's got you know this rot thing. Which other ones get it at resistant to that. They make these go away. I use them for timber. Now i got stronger over the decades. He had worked this land which was out a lot hundred acres or something like that and into a self sustaining. I walk out and feed myself. All i want farm and then of course they make money on different things. You don't get as much yield. He goes yeah. But i have hardly any costs. My costs is a chainsaw. Just let it go so this is the old kind of. They're looking for the cash and you're going okay. Well you got these big farms. Big incentives you got any big taxes and you got you got you got. And it's all the social economic engineering of a people to what i have no idea. It's not freedom. It's not serving the benefit of the individual or a healthy life of people on the land. I it's you know they're talking about this universal basic income. Like you just think it's better. Just give you cash. Well they called it you know. I guess universal basic right or something it was forty acres and a mule in other like here go freed. Slaves your own damn land here. There's your reparation peace out. Well can i get on can we. Can we do that. we know instead of universal basic. You get a check from me all the time. Sit on your ass. How about we give you land. But there's not enough zona so you go if you took the entire planet and population and put them in the state of arizona. Everybody would get like a. It's like a forty by forty space to live. You know what is that. These thousand couple thousand square feet. And that's just the all went one level just in arizona and hold the power i mean was just to get that concept when i was a freshman in high school. Like seventy seven around there or something. I remember math klay going on about whatever the population i just go. I wonder let's do the square foot. Okay just see. And i think that the time i did five billion or something. So let's say ten billion. It was size of a classroom. Everybody data family of well. Of course you know you're crammed into one place but you know i give you new york city. I mean the density. There's a lot more now. So i'm just going. It's really not that much of a crowding. That's all this. Social engineering and technology can make it to where we have transportation food production just as individuals taken care of themselves kind of spread out. But what's happened. Birth rate has plummeted the the population of the planet's going down and with these shots and so on air sterility fears involved. They're going to change. You were already starting to have a loss in population in this country and a lot of developed countries. It's going down as this by design or is it just a side effect. I mean i don't know i know care. My whole thing is that it just doesn't matter but we're going to need to have communication so this weekend amid fast. We were a lot closer than we anticipate. I tell you the biggest thing is that It a lot closer is that we have an understanding of the need desire and privacy. Becoming a thing to clear you look at today's archive you'll see the old clear bone affiliate That we have to go through us. You get you know better fit you know as you get a good idea. They can suck. You know we're giving this a shot to are you. A crypto currency advocate. The crypto tip is the ideal outreach tool to help. People discover crypto currency. It's a printable. Business-card-sized tip that you can give to service providers preferably in addition to a good cash tip when the server scans the qr code. It'll bring up an explanation of crypto currency how to install a wallet and allow them to claim the tip. If they don't claim the crypto. You get your tip refunded to you. After a time period you specify plus if they do claim the tip you get an email alert create as many tips. You want crypto tip dot org. That's crypto tip dot org. 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That's move dot free keen dot com. Do you love twitter. Make sure your favorite dale end on. Fm twitter account so you can receive our tweets at twitter dot dot fm. that's twitter dot dot fm. There are those that just want to be left alone and those that just won't leave them alone. Which one are you. The earnest handcock show. Oh let me tell you a little bit of what's going on okay. There are some hardware needs. Some of these guys need to meeting of that. If i could only have. And i need and i'd i'd save the planet for whatever this is what has been common knowledge for love or close friends and family. And certainly donna and i has been for want of two hundred dollars or two thousand dollars. It was always two hundred dollars to two thousand dollars two hundred dollars to keep the lights on two thousand dollars to do the project him. If i had it right now and i can save the world and a lot of times we were able to raise it. We would show that we should look for two thousand bucks. You know we can do this and do this. And it's the right time come had big save the planet and the right time in a boom and not you know and this has been going for decades. There's always two hundred thousand two hundred dollars all you need a raspberry pi with this and that and everything developed boom done you two thousand dollars in bang kind of the plant boom done. I will raise the money. So what do we have here. one of the is. It's doing the float channel of doing creating a channel. I guess as a station a running of different feeds of having them alive or archived and whatever it be able to be accessed from or be able to run like a radio station that you could pull it from these files that can't be deleted or censored or an fbi. Bearcat you know with our big ram on the front of the new hampshire police a bust in the door yank cords out of servers and stuff. You see my point. You can't have that. Because if they can they will so i go. What do you need one of the guys working on this. He needed to be able to do. Some of the larger sites cocker mccullough and lou rockwell is giving of a problem because the computer was using the process to transfer from the website. Straight over the was given a problem. I go. that's it. I supply boom. I put it out. He's getting a brand new computer. I'd probably ought to be close to a thousand dollars. They'll be there this week. Now you've probably been added bringing mid fast. Well what's your excuse now. Excuse eliminator well here. We have guy doing the studio thing. Well i need to do that. And i need to process. You knows anybody got it. I go that's it. That's what's holding you up. Tell me exactly what. I will get the job. Whatever it is you need. let me finish. this here. Might need a new computer platforms large sites too fast boom. What do you need to complete this task there. This is what i do. Take away the excuses there a couple of thousand year a couple of thousand air twenty here do whatever it takes. Oh you go to wealthy supporters. And i go. Hey you know we we do this. You'll get your love bus. Help the engine here. We need to have a computer here. This guy's going and they show the work that's all these guys are looking for is actually show something being done win. Right before james. Corbett gets taken going. Do we see now. I mean are we starting again the stand so i'm so optimistic that we have created a team who bag is going to go after they have to go after individuals or ideas or concepts but ideas are bulletproof. This is what michael barbaric was talking about in. The first hour is the idea you know. And they'll go after and they'll do it. And it just motivates even more to what what they're not gonna understanding will he was here a minute ago and now he's gone. He went underground over here. He's got his own low communication thing. We're setting up the pirate network of you guys can keep all your ones and zeros on your side of gold and you know and we can't pass none shall pass to get in to communication now. We created our own. If we're not creating our own we're wasting precious time because it's going to come down to that it's the i get no pleasure going neon i told you so a year from now maybe a little bit player but you know i really just rather not have to worry about the main things that we're working on is just surviving a food thing. You know donald. She really wants to be here in the desert. She didn't like it cold. She'll put up with the heat. Whatever down here. So i. I'm going to be all these people got would to build everything. I got dirt. You know they got you know nice foliage in the river no water diverted and i got you know cactus rain water wells and i get you know. And how are we going to divert. Do you know it's going to be desert dome or something. Whatever you know. And i'm looking forward to doing that and sharing that with people but where is the opposition. It's the fear we'll go over some of the headlines real quick here in this segment and next and you can see why i don't even i only focus on this stuff. I mean it's great. You subscribe the freemen's phoenix and we keep you up on this stop but i i get enough of it. I mean wow episode. Three ninety nine. P. h. w. james corbett. Join me for this special podcast. Humble birthplace of the corporate report as i reflect on the fourteen year journey journey that has led me to this point and how we can proceed forward into the post youtube era. Now what are we going to need to do to get him to promote s. john bit shooting. We got this and you've got his site and everything and of course he has his. Ipo link you know on his page and all that but until we hit search which you're gonna tell hey them on ip fest now. Where's that was going to get to his site. I even be able to go and be able to search it. So that was of course but prompt colin pre show been here. We go we got guys integrated into you. Got some people that know how and help my guys in helping. Put up a twenty five hundred dollar bounty of we kind of you know here we go. I just do it so guys. This is how it's done so we take on the big conglomerate of google for a few thousand dollars. I can do that do that. I think we should do that now. We have urban farmer on the top of freedoms phoenix right now. Liberty and on the land alive with james corbett urban farmer. We talked to james tomorrow night. We have already been discussing this and prep in this for you know here. We go if you refresh the front page of freedoms phoenix eventually. You'll see the mid continent liberty festival mid fast dot info. Banner ad up there and to tell you every little thing you need to know. This is going on right now. Peaking this weekend. Mid festival peak april seventeenth and eighteenth at the copperhead rally grounds and spa the nov home now oklahoma. Yoda the copperhead rally grounds. That is i mean a lot of the festivals and so in that you see their photos it so there was. This is the place where a lot of harley davidson going in there you know tattoo in spring break in for old people kind of think and i'm going cool. You know that. I see where that you know that that get through kindred spirit of the people there you know the it's Liberty festival for you. You know if jack fast arizona and pork fest forecast hampshire and a gore fest. South dakota and and arcand. Virginia a midwest peace liberty michigan vote fast illinois or too far away. Well contact midst asked about you. Know any other similar outdoor non events to be listed here. But you know go to mid fast because in the middle of the country it's easy and accessible and it seventeen hours for us here so when we finally get the by the hour got seventeen hour drive against like i do four four and four and four we just you know in less than twenty four hours damn there. Because we've got a bus goes sleep. You know we could do it. I hate doing that though. I didn't want to do that. I wanna i got this. You do four or five hours a day. Not do that to do that but we gotta get. There's always gotta be somewhere well after we do. We're going to relax for a little bit. We got a lot of stuff to do and people to help and places to be. But we're going to go at a slower pace and this is you know we're going to share this with you over. The next couple weeks is going to be. The fruition of we are going to be able to communicate. P- barter sell what is mid festa. Also working on a forest dot market a market regarding. This is all been planned for this now. We want to accept bitcoin at your online store. There's a good chance you already have. What you need a wordpress using commerce and a bitcoin address now all you need to start taking bitcoin payments on your website is the any pay app on your android or iphone just paste your bitcoin address into any pay then connected to your website with our one. Click plug in for wordpress now. Your website takes. Bitcoin start to finish in fifteen minutes or less with no complicated steps. Download any pay from the app store today. Did you know you can listen to l. r. n. dot fm vr free to air satellite channels. We have channels over nearly all of north america and much of africa. All you need is an affordable receiver and a dish smallest thirty inches. There are no monthly fees. Learn more at sat dot fm plus if you are a broadcaster or want to be one. This is a good delivery method for our content cr coverage maps and get details at sat ella dot fm l. dot fm sat dot fm. This michael dean from the freedom teens. I've run website since nineteen ninety six and have used over a dozen web hosts in that time address hosting dot. Com is the only one that hasn't broken my heart address postings up time and services stellar and their dos. Gatien is the best. I've seen that's important because if you tell the truth in this world you'll ruffle feathers and some people will try dirty tricks to silence your voice no matter what the haters us with avarice hosting keeps our websites online. If you have a mission critical commercial presence or world changing activism site you cannot tolerate any skulduggery so go with actress hosting dot com have a wordpress blog site. But you're not satisfied with performance or up time or just want raw hosting wanna pay with. Bitcoin eggers hosting specializes in high performance hosting with personalized service. Go to address hosting dot com and click on the button. It says get hosted. That's agress toasted dot com. How many lawyers does it take to change a lightbulb. None that rather keep their clients in the dark. There are too many lawyer jokes to count however there are some lawyers with more noble attentions at the institute for justice we bring the light to our clients. We are a nonprofit public interest law firm with clear values and principles at i j we fight for those whose most basic rights are denied by the government. Visit our website today at j dot. Org now that you've found the liberty radio network at l. dot fm. You may want to help expose others to our great programs to assist you in doing so. You'll find resources at promote dot l. dot fm including details on how to get a free bumper sticker quarter page flyers. You can print out and distribute manners for your website as well as files allow you. Make your own custom. Banners and graphics visit promote dot l. dot fm and help bring new listeners to the liberty radio network that's promote dot l. dot fm. We have some good news. The indictments against celebrate in the district of maryland were dismissed with prejudice meaning. They can never be refiled. This is especially good because those indictments contain the only charge ever made that ross engaged in murder-for-hire this was a serious allegation at rolls. Operate denies it was never prosecuted or rolled on by a jury. Putt was trumpeted by the federal government. And the media. As if it were proven fact. The maryland court held these indictments for almost five years poisoning. Ross's case and leaving him under a cloud unproven allegations as explained in ross's appeal to the supreme court the fact that the judge use these allegations to give her all say draconian sentence of double life without parole violated his sixth amendment right to a jury. Trial judge required to issue sentences based on convictions. Decided by a jury not unproven. Allegations never even charged at trial. Although this is a positive development that dropped indictment will not set rolls free now. A presidential pardon is ross's only hope of freedom signed the petition at free. Ross dot org free. Ross dot org. You can put the liberty radio network on the air in your area. Visit broadcast dot l. Dot fm to learn how broadcast dot dot fm and now live from the studios of freedoms phoenix ernest handcock. I still got another. What what what. What i thought that show was. I'm sorry guys. Crap you'll shutting down and everything holy crap. Well let's go ahead and pull this. I can yack some more guy actually more more. I mean do this start. Because i'm gonna edit this in the thing anyway it's not. It's not their fault thousand. Meet me that was me. You know sorry about that. I thought i heard The shows still or connected. Yeah okay crap man. Sorry guys at a practice. I mean holy crap. Well as donna telling me hey get air go so we were out picking tomatoes. Now bob's garden we're going got some nice ripe cherry tomatoes Are good too. You know he's doing aqua politics thing. We got a lot of information about how to keep ourselves Fed and what do you do. You gotta be able to share it. You gotta barter it. You gotta be able to transport. So that's what we're talking about now is already man getting ready to get start unloading a trailer and setting up all the stuff. That's going back into the boss. I mean crap man. I got a full day own. Put my i can spend ceo up to you. Sorry about that guys. Got man out to all the problems in the nerdy. Just doesn't come. Sit down time. Because i have my time all jacked up. So let's go ahead with through some headlines here because you know here. We go rule by fiat when the government does whatever it wants john. Whitehead from the rutherford institute you know as always negative waves. Tell you ruled by brute force. That's about as good a description is you'll find the sorry state of our nation and the navy yard care individuals. It's just your general public opinion. But ernie there's we gotta come together to go up against dewey. That's what they want to try and get you to do. What if you just don't come together. What if you just take care of yourself and your family what if it's just a anarchist decisions of a whole bunch of people that none your business and we're over here in the small town a bite me but you wanna be able to communicate you wanna have division of labor. You want to have access to information. Well what's happening all the information. I really want a lot of it's gonna come down. Is that approved. Gardening is that approved. You think you don't think so what. What do you think's happening in the last twenty years thirty years on health food on supplements on call codex alimentarius out of the european union day. Determined what you could and could not get prescription to get vitamin c kind of crap. This is what's going to become an here because they need to. They didn't have to be able to control. Want you to be self sustaining ensures. Heck no healthy. They're gonna they're gonna tell you what you got you got. You need a shot Future of energy storage beyond lithium ion over the last decade prices of solar panels wind farms of retail time lows however the price of lithium ion batteries. The leading energy storage technologies main too high so reaches our researchers are exploiting their alternatives. There is one that we were looking at. It could be for like a neighborhood. It's a storage container shipping container full of just plumbing. The storage in it is rust iron and win electrolyte gets all used up you. Just you know. Put it on the orchard. You just dump it out and recharge it again. And it's environmentally sustainable. That's kinda big. It's not made for putting in your car. But it's made for your homes and i'm going to this. A lot of this stuff is just in this. Pvc tanks. i'm going. This is this happened. You know how. I store eggs for twenty plus years. No canyon required no canning. Homestead families can be a food thing. Might be interested in something you need to know. Then we got a war the economy stop and you know how many people dying from the shots and you know know. The french police are going after airbnb. That doesn't report. Customers violate lockdown rules. They're going. I mean it's just control control control. But then you have florida's throwing the tea in the harbor by denying vaccine passports and here. We have a congressman from arizona. And andy biggs as introduced a no vaccine passport legislation in congress. Now how much legs is. But you know at least. Somebody's doing it and i know andy biggs the news home. He's one of the more conservative. Mormon constitution means something guys. But we'll see under pressure to these guys folder. Not know who's really controlling things rand. Paul was here last month. And i went to a it was a fund raiser forum and they just wanted. I didn't have to give any money. You know just want me to come see your son so we go and we talk and i asked him. I just have one question who really runs washington. Well the speaker president any kind says that crap you know who runs them who runs washington and he kind answer non answer of okay. So he's not going to say you know and it's not like there wasn't an answer he didn't know he just not saying it's earning just five. Okay that's all. I need to know one if you knew. And if you're gonna share or who you're against because he's going to run for president in twenty four. That was clear. So rams are gonna run for president twenty four. Where's the solution. It's not going to be politics. It's not going to be this. i mean you know. of course you're going to have you know trump again make fun of his hair again. How big everybody's hands are. Something i mean. Is that what it takes to get elected or guinea thing done fine. You will do that go ahead. I don't care now they're going to inject you with this. As in this video we break down the government plan inject you with a chip with a sensor that goes off. If you have a certain sickness egged they wanna get elling do it with your fit bit and through your phone of whatever anyway. What was the one thing. The kids wanted you know. My grandkids had to have a year or two ago. Everybody's got fit bit. it's a watch. They took an and that kinda got old after a while. They know where it anymore but they had to have it for a while. Some people are locked into it with her fitness their regime of how heart rate of something. No tesla cyber truck twenty twenty one insane new updates revealed well all of a sudden now. We got pickup trucks coming out our blood. That are electric. Yeah it's going to be electric. This electric bad electric electric. You charging it. Well the solar panels getting freaking cheap. You know bob now he. He runs his generator. You know our in the morning at four thirty for an hour just to you. Know because keep it goin. He goes the amount of fuel that he has a diesel now with the extra solar panels and batteries day. He has enough diesel fuel for two years just to have it as back just to make sure that is ever without pow. So it's changed. We're getting off. Get aw- go to phoenix and sixty minutes hit job onto santa's governor in florida backfired. Because now everyone's aware of gruesome to california's maxine scam in california. You know it doesn't matter what they say or do. Then you had. There's a couple of interviews that he was doing their kept hammered autumn. About whether you're gonna take the shot or no. He's not well. What about your voice. That he goes. Don't stay home more. you're gonna pay him out. This is it. it's it's the pushback is common. It's in our opinion that i am doing joint jock rock. What's run for president. There's join liberty minded. Volunteers anarchists and libertarian from june. Twenty eighth through july fourth for fork. Fast twenty twenty one at rogers campground in the beautiful white mountains of new hampshire. Forecast happens the week after the porcupine freedom festival and fork fest is decentralized which means no one is in charge that also means. There's no ticket cost just reserve your camping. Rv side or motel room with rogers campground for june twenty eighth through july fourth. Where better to celebrate independence day than around to other freedom loving activists in the shire you can relax and enjoy the camaraderie of like minded people or you can create whatever experience or event. You'd like others to have if you're planning an event for forecast be sure to let others known advance. You can connect with fellow fork festers via the unofficial telegram chat or the fort fest forum links to those are on the unofficial website forecast dot party mark your calendar for june twenty eighth through july fourth. Twenty twenty one. We'll see you at fork. Fast dot party the l. r. n. dot. Fm social media channels have been revamped. We've eliminated facebook and focused on other platforms like twitter and mastodon the decentralized alternative to twitter on our accounts you'll find posts from multiple l. r. n. dot. Fm show hosts together in one place. Follow us on twitter at twitter dot l. Our end on fm or better yet moved to the decentralized mastodon social media platform at toot dot l. r. n. dot fm t o ot dot l. r. n. dot fm. I think you'll like it. Bitcoin dot com has launched a trading platform at local dot. Bitcoin dot com allowing you to buy or sell bitcoin cash via dozens of payment methods like paypal then mo bank deposit remittances or meeting in person with cash. There are no i. D requirements to sign up for and use the site and all communications between buyers and sellers are encrypted finally a global trading platform. That respects your privacy. Visit local dot. Bitcoin dot com to get started trading. Bitcoin cash local dot. Bitcoin dot com. Where the rubber always meets the road. Actually i'm not even sure what that means. Speed radio network live at heart news. Feed dot com. This stream is supported by advertisers and contributions by follow us on facebook twitter and grams service. Doing newscast april. be thirteen. twenty twenty four. I'm mike as testimony continues in the derek chauvin trial. The emotional pain felt by the black community and racial justice advocates has reached new levels after a black man was fatally shot by police in minneapolis. Suburb president joe biden and state leaders responded monday to the weekend incident in brooklyn center. Where twenty year. Old dante right-wing shot during a traffic stop. Police officials say the officer intended to use her taser. Bipolar gone by mistake. But way find your foundation director and civil rights attorney and activists nikki levy armstrong says it shows. The state has failed to address the issue of racial profiling. The fact that police officers would prioritize pulling someone over for allegedly having expired tabs is unconscionable in the midst of pandemic activists say right who had an outstanding warrant and got back into his car while being handcuffed should not have been in that situation because he wasn't a serious threat the incident resulted in protests and civil unrest. Sunday night and prompted curfews. Monday evening announced by governor. Tim walls i'm mike. Mohan union drive in an amazon warehouse in bessemer was voted down last week but many see the effort as an extension of the historical civil rights. Work by the mostly. Black workforce in the birmingham area. Bessemer is about twenty minutes from birmingham. Once known as the nation's most segregated city jennifer bates learning ambassador at the amazon fulfillment center there helped lead the effort to join the retail sale and department store union. She says workers face long hours. Lots of walking and stair climbing the one elevator designed for human use. Notches merchandise is only accessible to upper management. Beat says she was offered a promotion with more responsibilities but no more pay. That will show them. We didn't take the position as ambassador. We would not be considered for any other leadership role amazon even though the position did not come pay. Alabama is one of five states without a minimum wage and has a so called right to work law which prevents unions from requiring workers. They represented pay dues. This story was produced with original reporting from janae platin- berg for yes media. I'm louis bulky reporting texas big religiously diverse state but faith communities say controversial voting bills before the state legislature will disenfranchise both rural and urban voters. Bee moorhead as with texas impact voter suppression in the current environment is not about distracting people from things that already happened. It's about a thumb on the scale of what could happen in the future republican lawmakers in texas much like their counterparts in georgia say. The new voting bills are needed to improve trust and confidence in the outcome of the elections. This is pms. You're struggling with your mortgage. You think about it all the time. What are we gonna do. We lose the house. It's time to stop thinking and start dialing call one eight eight eight nine nine five hope for free government program that offers expert one on one advice about your mortgage options. We've helped over a million homeowners and we want to help you call one. Eight eight eight nine nine five hope or visit makinghomeaffordable dot gov brought to you by the us treasury hud and the ad council. Did you know that birthday parties. Help build confidence in kids. Yeah did you know that giving kids less sugar before bedtime helps them sleep better. Oh totally did you know that friendly kids have more friends. Everybody knows that. Hey guys did you know that. Most people think they're using the right car seat for their kid but they're not. I didn't know that parents who really know it. All know for sure that their child is in the right car seat at the right age and size visit safercar dot gov slash therightseat to make sure your child is protected brought to you by the national highway traffic safety administration and the ad council. Can you tell if these vegetables are being contaminated with bacteria that could cause paralysis. Listen you can't see it either. Use different cutting board. So that the bacteria in raw meats and seafood and their juices doesn't touch prep services for other foods like veggies. Raw food may contain bacteria that can make you very sick or worse. Roughly three thousand americans will die from food poisoning this year. But you can keep your family safer check your steps at foodsafety dot gov brought to you by the usda hhs and the ad council dear. Smokey bear for teaching us how to prevent wildfires. For seventy years. Outdoor lovers would like to say something. Happy seventy bigeye. Let's bring it in for a bear. Hug come off for safety tips. Visit smokybear dot com brought to you by the us forest service your state forester and the ad council. Join me as i prepare. A collection of cherished family recipes passed through generation watch recipes for disaster at foodsafety dot gov. You'll learn the right steps as maria. Does everything wrong brought to you by the. Usda h s and the ad council. You're the look at whether from the heartland news feed weather center. Tuesday scattered showers in the morning. Otherwise mostly sunny with a high near sixty one tuesday night mostly cloudy with a low around forty wednesday sunny with a high near fifty six. That's the latest weather. Check out more news and weather on our website at heartland news feed dot com. Paid for airtime media you guys. It's rick ten zero. Welcome to another live edition of titillating sports with rick tuttle. Hausa callan how you how you doing. I've noticed over the years. That more time spent in europe. I started to turn into joey from france. England like the first few days. I'm like. Hey how you doing and then like to excluder her doing. I'm walking here. what are you enough. But i won't do that today on the show. At least i don't think so someone by the way a fan and thank you. Fan sent me a called a sound machine and Said rick you can live up your show. It sound effects This isn't a morning zoo. Show on halloween. I do that. Little screaming pumpkin guy. But it's stuff like this even here that and I like this one makes it sound like people are actually a laughing. That's a good one. I promise not so. of course. there's there's always this one to that one works all right. And that's the sound machine but Thank you fan. Ricky's the fan have name. Nfl has name. But anyway thank you for the this. The glorious stefan sound machine. Where am i at tuna nap. Iheartradio app stitcher. App are all afropop having also american forces radio network worldwide. Five hundred dollars to one hundred and seventy seven countries ships at sea. Awacs overhead if you're in the military minder side seriously. You're doing a great job at thanks for protecting us and our allies. We appreciate it very very soon. We streamed through sports. Pylon dot com. Go there click. Listen live emails. Rickett sports byline dot com a captain. Keith colbourne has been my show. Many times from discovery's deadliest catch. He'll join us in the third hour. Bruce marshall on the second hour from the gold sheet karen lyle sales for talk dot com. We always do that. Tuesday's about a half hour and we'll also have an east bay. Filmmaker todd darling. Documentary called occupy. The farm is awesome. But it's also a lot of work the good news finding help for your projects. Easier than ever introducing. Angie the puts all your home care needs at your fingertips need a pro to fix that. Emergency leak maybe find someone to build a deck or even set your seasonal tasks on autopilot. Angie can handle all that and more expert pros. Hundreds of home projects clear pricing and the easiest way to book and pay in seconds. This is angie your home for everything home. Download the app today. Are you paying too much for term life insurance. There's a tremendous price war among the major term life. Companies rates have dropped dramatically in the past two years for example. A man aged forty five non-tobacco user one million dollars of coverage is only seventy five dollars per month level for the next ten years or a man aged fifty non-tobacco user can buy a half million dollars of coverage for a monthly premium of only one hundred ten dollars guaranteed not to change for the next twenty years that's right level rates for twenty years and if you're a smoker we have great rates for you as well at the term lifeline. We specialize in policies of a half million dollars and above. So if you're looking for new or replacement term life insurance call right now for a free quote rates. Availability may vary by state sample rate quotes or patient preferred non-tobacco underwriting exam required to qualify eight hundred eight zero seven nineteen eighty one. Eight hundred eight zero seven nineteen eighty one. That's eight hundred. Eight zero seven nine thousand nine hundred eighty one. I am a non-attorney spokesperson representing a team of lawyers. Who helped people that have been injured or wronged. Have you been diagnosed with cancer. Are you one of the millions who have taken zantac or other generic versions of this popular grad to help treat stomach issues then. Pay close attention to this message. The fda said he take a little levels of a probable cancer causing chemical known as andy ama in zantac and other generic forms of this popular drug. They've banned sales and even removed it from the market. If you've been diagnosed with cancer and you've taken zantac or a generic equivalent. Call the legal helpline now. You receive a free cash award and heavy medical expenses covered. And there's no upfront cost to you. They only get paid. If you win so please call now. Eight hundred two five one four six eight hundred two five one seven four six zero eight hundred two five one seven four six. That's eight hundred. Two five one seventy four sixty out at taba towels. We started with the toughest matches and quickly realized towels. Heavy duty cleaning wipes can clean just about anything like stubborn brake. Dust spilled paint even permanent marker. There's literally thousands of uses proudly made in the usa with over thirty thousand five star reviews find Towels heavy duty cleaning wipes at your local auto parts store the home depot. Lowe's and more look for the big yellow tub lighting sports with rick tittle rick tidwell his genius the best show ever. He's so wonderful. Genius show ever. He's so wonderful. Sports with rick tiddle. Tiddle has a key so handsome diese genius. Hey thank you for that and welcome back to the show. Great to have you with us. There are great one eight hundred eight seven eight play. Somebody told me the other day that their keynote speaker at their high school graduation with some kind of long name. Like do you know. Alexander falcon heimer unlike like now. Oh he was the voice of tony. The tiger it's kind of a grandiose name or whatever it was but you mean they're great. I he made a career off of that. You know like care taco bill. Can you make a career out of one thing. We do chicken right. That's a one chord song. By the way just picking chord g c guitar. we do chicken right blount. Play us get into show. One eight hundred seven eight play yesterday. Nba history was made for certain franchise. And that is that. The atlanta hawks had a guy belch five times in one quarter. It never happened before. But more importantly the warriors now have an all time leading score and That is steph. Curry passing will still chamberlain held that record over fifty years With seventeen thousand. Seven hundred and eighty three but steph by the way has been red hot lately and to finish the evening. The ridiculous fifty. Three points beating the nuggets. Who are a pretty good team. And he's thinks remember steph is only thirty three years old. He's expected to resign. The warriors will not let him leave. I don't care if staff turned into a dream on where he's yelling at female soccer players or he's you know he turns into a duran who quietly brooding I if he knock on wood gets her like clay. They're not letting him leave. He even if he punched in the face julich would get up and put a handkerchief a silk handkerchief on his bloody nose and still say. What did i do to make you mad. They're not going to let him leave so if he maintains his average per game which is twenty four points per game over five more seasons he could retire with over. Twenty seven thousand points only thirteen players. Nba history have gotten to twenty seven. Thousand points doesn't mean keep in mind about the nba during chamberlain's time and during steffes time obviously there was no three point line. Chamberlain got to that mark and about half. The games steph did because chamberlain average forty one points a game. What did you say. I thought you said forty one. You meant thirty one. No forty one points a game. That's what chamberlain average when he was with the warriors in his career and it also shows you just how many people my size were playing center. I mean i don't know six. Two six sixteen might have been considered a little bit taller. But six to you. Better be a power forward Yeah he's done it all with one team. has curry and it's fantastic now A couple other things to keep in mind Is if you think about a career. Game with fifty points and ten made threes. That's five more than anyone else's ever had in the history of the league in fact only two guys have to those once again. Fifty points with ten made threes s james harden and klay thompson. Those are the only other guys and by the way. I said he's red hot. He has scored thirty points in seven. Straight games no one has done that in the nba this year. But just all time when you talk about one of the all time greats and the all time best shooter and once again just watching him last night. You know. Sidestep back step. There was one of my favorite plays a last night If you get a chance to see it. And i don't ever remember. But there was like a screen. Where a teammate wentz and there was kind of a split and he steph was standing on the stripe and he took a little fake pass like it was just as perfect like thread under the legs pass and then await no. He didn't pass it and then he hit it. Three but steph curry is the nba's all time leader in games where he said at least four threes. That's three hundred and forty four games. He's the all time. Nba leader in games with five threes. Two hundred and forty nine all time leader six threes one hundred and forty two all time leader seven threes eighty three all all-time leader in eighth threes fifty three. I'll leader nine. Threes twenty eight outside leader in ten threes seventeen all time leader in eleven threes nine all time leader with twelve threes to. There's never ever been a guy like him and people love to say well. He can't do this and he can't do that. With donna the days of donelson talking about what he couldn't couldn't do but since he got back from that tailbone injury he's averaging thirty eight point four thirty eight point four since this month started or two weeks and just about he's average forty points again. He's leading the league by a laughable margin since the beginning of march because since the beginning of march average thirty. Five points a game. So when you talk about how curry was going to be exposed this season. There's no splash brother. There's no durant he's going to be exposed they can triple team him I remember that game six. Nba finals and he when when clay did knee and then i mean currently still have last shot of the game winner and then people are. He's not clutch is always something right. Always so we might have. The wires missed the playoffs. And he's not gonna win. Mvp but really who's more valuable more valuable curry. When he doesn't play he's missed seven games. Lawyers are one in six and what happened. Were the warriors lost by fifty three to toronto. Or should i say. Tampa bay steve. Kerr maybe has taken too long to embrace the idea. That curry just needs to have the ball in his hands. Every single possession. And i know in the name of preservation. He has rested curry in those extra fourth quarter minutes in tight games which has almost certainly cost the word of some games and some wins. But i think he's coming around because last week we talked about. How curry with eight minutes left. Instead of six minutes left in the fourth quarter the warriors are trailing by nine and then they one by one. Because curry came in two minutes earlier and the whole balance of james weisman's development was maybe hurting the warriors for their playoff chance that they have to worry about that anymore. Obviously i'd rather have him be healthy You know as i said. They're still talking to other doctors by the way about what they should do. The meniscus is a tricky thing for wise. I had a meniscus tear when i was playing quarterback in high school. I got sacked by three guys at once. A my knee bent backwards. And i yelled out in pain and then i went to the doctor's like yeah. You got a little tear in your meniscus. We're gonna leave. It ripped like what it goes. Yeah there's just. I mean there's no no one is really invented a good artificial pad. There's this doesn't grow back if you cut it out it's out forever and okay but anyway You know if you think about if the warriors they face the jazz in the first round. They face the lakers in the first round. It's still going to be fun. And who knows curry. What's going to happen but congratulations. The staff is absolutely deserving winner anti deserving champion to have that record. Come back on the other side. We'll have filmmaker todd. Darling armor kittle seems second and an. 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I'm really worried about him addiction. I haven't seen them like this ever. I never wanted to start using. I knew the drill. But i was out of options. I just wanna tell them. It's not your fault there. Are people out there who can help people who have felt your pain. They know what you're going through. This has to stop. I'm losing everything everyone you've been strong your whole life. You can do this but have to reach out for help. It's time i can do. This addiction is a disease and diseases need treatment. Call quick drugs three two one now at eight hundred three three eight six nine zero six eight hundred three three eight six nine. oh six. that's eight hundred three three sixty nine. Oh six paid for by the detox and treatment. Help line are you sixty plus and love to travel introducing. The senior travel discount network brought to you by low cost airlines. Call us anytime day or night and save up to seventy five percent under airline and hotel reservations. We can help you. Save a ton of money to fly almost anywhere. We have inside discounts and over five hundred airlines and five hundred thousand hotels worldwide. And when you call and mentioned the discount code sixty plus we'll give you an extra free night with your qualified air and hotel reservation now. You can get the best prices on air and hotel reservations with your phone. We make it easy and fast for you to save money and book a trip remember. Cova senior travel discount network mentioned the discount code sixty plus for your free hotel night with your qualified reservation. Call now eight hundred four nine three six one one eight eight hundred four nine three six one one eight eight hundred four nine three six one one eight. That's eight hundred four nine three sixty one eighteen. It doesn't really matter. I don't want my job. And i don't think i'm gonna go anymore. Tiddle things. there's a direct correlation between dogs and lightning. Thank you for that. We'll come back to the show recap with you. Coast to coast round the world on american forces radio network. It's our pleasure to welcome to the program top darling. His film occupy the farm Is being released again on. Pbs on earth day. They will have Qna roundtable discussions as well and this all has to do with a A piece of land that at one time People who were using it to grow crops and farm were arrested for trespassing and now they have the keys to the joint More or less todd. Welcome to the program. How did this all get started. This film thanks very much by the way i'm fascinated here about your correlation between dogs dummy to So how this all started was There's an east bay San francisco bay There's a research farm that's owned by a public university university of california and they are by their charter. they're supposed to teach agriculture and Do agricultural research. This is their last farm and they were had plans to develop it so a bunch of after numerous attempts to going through the bureaucracy failed. A group of two hundred people took fifteen thousand seedlings walked onto the land planet. Two acres of crops in order to save this land from becoming a real estate development. They managed to stay there for three weeks before they got kicked off the land but the crops stuck and the whole episode embarrassed university such that they recognize that they need to do something better with land and allow these people to start at collaborative Community farm. That's still going today. And that during the pandemic was able to feed seventy families a week on just one acre of land. now are we talking about. This is where i'm from by the way. So are we about the land that sort of by the albany police department by like miranda and buchanan over there exactly is is on the corner of san pablo boulevard and and marin slash buchanan. That's exactly now. I think a lot of people too who aren't from around here might hear this and say oh. Yeah people's park. I remember that site. Now that's something completely different. This is completely different completely. Different set of land. This this land was acquired by the university. Back in the late twentieth. Nineteen twenties and they would they would. The family was told that the land would always be used for farming and they were hoping that it would be a research farm and steadily over the years. The land has been whittled away with housing and various development And now down to just about you know a little more than ten acres of open. Space and about six or seven of those acres are Have never been built on and it only been used for farming and are and those acres that acreage is like prime farmland. There's like nothing better. I know that you see on that. Land going sort of like from that farm over to target and they have a little league field there they have. They have uc housing and now they've built like a sprouts and a habit burger and they they sold that end of it but when the The people came to occupy the farm. How did the community react. They say hey. We're with you or did they say get these dirty hippies outta here there were a few people like get these dirty hippies outta here but what would have made me more amazing. Why really the bulk of people showed up in a huge way because people had they that land used to be open for people to walk on and and So people actually really liked the place so when this all happened it was suddenly like like a neighborhood. Carnival and opened up. I mean people by the hundred showed up and they were the neighbors. Were cooking food for the farmers In one very telling episode the university cut off the water to the this land so there was no lot water to you. Know the irradiate the two acres of crops. They planted so the neighborhood showed up a pickup trucks. Some people bought some big water tanks and those kinds of plastic water tank super metal cage around him they would go around the neighborhood and fill them up out of people's garden houses truck series of pickup trucks with bring them to this land. People offload them onto a stack palace and then more people would take one gallon juice bottle still them up and go out and water this field of two acres plant by plant by hand and that went on for like two and a half weeks so by the numbers and by you know by proof of their action. The neighborhood really showed up and it ended up the water. Being turned off ended up being A development that that really made this a community action. It wasn't just these active only became the whole the whole area was involved in it and it became quite the same so i would say i'm balancing neighbors. Were in favor of it and for people who can't picture it. I mean we're not talking about a farm in the middle of nowhere you've got city streets neighborhoods you. Have you know the the beautiful picturesque albany hill. You have palm trees and you also have when anything like this happens you can get into hierarchy or a pecking order like. Why are you in charge. Why do you decide where we plant this plant. That was there ever any kind of disputes with that. This happened right at the end fat. The of you recall the occupy movement and so it seems there was a movement afoot point to try to make decisions by consensus which is difficult but considering all the arguments that happened between any group of you know fifty people hundred people It went surprisingly smoothly. I mean there like a plan about how to plant the plant so they came the day they came on. They had a plan about. You know what went where and had a planet and how lay out the road so that happened very efficiently and then how to run. The camp was a matter of consensus and there would be lengthy meetings So you know we've all been in meetings with other people may never rarely. Do they go all that smoothly but considering it went pretty well they hung together. Hang separately so the you have to say that that that in the end it however they managed to organize themselves at work out but it was generally generally speaking by consensus until it came some blogger. Heads someone had to make a decision and the decision was taken But it turned successful strategy last question for you. When you're a filmmaker you no matter what the cause you know. Cause celebre or whatever's going on the film has to be compelling and it has to be entertaining so did you ever get to the point where you're like okay. Now everybody's in their tents and our bodies watering the plants and you're thinking who's gonna wanna watch this you know how do you how do you make sure as a filmmaker that you made it the success it was by keeping the entertainment value in there as well without selling out. You know what. I mean right. No i completely Selecting the right topic is frequently the best route to doing a documentary. And i have to say from the minute i walked on. I realize this is a great story. There was there was a different conflict popping up every other day with the authorities. There a land with beautiful There was tons of things to do. It was like popcorn and other other journalists. Who are working on this story for you know news outlets separate from what i was doing made and said this is the best story. This is great So it was. It was very exciting. We'd like spills and chills. And i was like. Oh what's going to happen next. You know and so the entertainment value of. It was a from me. I was confirmed. I mean within you know literally minutes. I'm having arrived so but yeah it is. It's a huge way making a film It will it be entertaining and how to do that. And that has to be know key my experience. I mean the one of the projects had worked on before coming to do this film was i was booking. Tv doing laguna beach. If you couple years before that and that's all about being entertaining all the time. So so yeah. That was definitely. I was not absent from my mind. When i was making the film. I want to remind everybody occupy the farm making its pbs. Debut earth day locally krc on the twentieth eight o'clock kp jk the twenty second at seven o'clock. We've been speaking to the director. Todd darling. once again occupy the farm. Make sure to check out this award. Winning documentary talk. Congratulations on the film. Thanks for stopping by. Let's talk about the when you finish an excellent man. Thank you very much really appreciate the time. You're gonna take good stuff once again Lines as always available at one. Eight hundred eight seven eight play when we come back. We'll check in with karen. Lyle as we always do at this time on tuesdays with sales sports talk dot com. I'm rick till come back on sports pilot by an an. This is karen. Lyle of sales boy talk. And i've been chatting with sarah. Knox johnson whom you know is the first sailor to single hand around the world and the founder of the clipper round the world race and his good friend. Sir john henry mcanally retired vice admiral of the royal navy. They each have a drink in hand and this photo came up of the two of them back in nineteen sixty five when they were young officers in training and having a bit of fun in paris go to sales sports talk dot com for the photo and listening to the story will recognize to in survive. A that is far engine in before here. that mabel fainting fainting spend groups about fourteen. Each impact was a specialist school James establishments emotion. Iran portsmouth around folks and make less stations and so on and has cost vance this nineteen eighty-eight fire engine which we talked aris sixty people watch stock act yes members of x eighteen cool nine hundred sixty five. We're not. We're now our engine to what i can tell you. Carry that We incited john's calls. I was a reserve Imagination people said we were doing a different solar coast because cited jones schools and we thought that fire engines loves because we could time on it. Go to the local nightclubs dorsey each member. John and we go about about two o'clock in the morning on sunday. We decided we better go back. To weigh on country re scope and we come on this star. Forty young nate losses announcement and someone very stupidity ryan the fab l. and within seconds surrounded by police cars and they just cannot justly jecklin the good citizens gluttonous sleep. If you will that ben giant we'll take you laden you tomorrow and that'd be bacterial crafts and know. Feddie john hospice. We'll sit. Yes you have to take the citizen. So would you mind going back to white audiences that bill so we muffled the bell ambi retention autumn. And i still remember that job. I suspect you're hanging onto the firings at the same time i never. Of course you've got a great story arena. I thank you for that. Welcome back to the show with you on sports byline. It's eh tuesdays at nine forty. This is when we check in and how many other networks do this assignment on sailing and it's Brought to you by sale sports talk dot com and as always co hosted by karen. Lyle and karen. I understand that you and your guests who will get a second. But you're actually in studio so after more than a years. It all spider webs and dust. No no they've been keeping really good track of this. So it's it's it's it looks just like when i was here last and and you and i did the show together in person. Well that was built in the carter administration. I think it looks the same from when it was built as well but Hopefully in a couple of weeks. I'll be able to get back in there as well. Let's talk about your guest in studio eric jones. A guest so nice. We're having him twice. He was on last week as well. Eric i understood that the un karen campbell over to the west side of the bay on a rigid inflatable. That you use with c. Valor for some of your search and rescue. Get a little bit more about that craft blues. Sure it's a fifteen foot zodiac pro with a fifty horsepower outboard and took us about probably half an hour or so to come across this morning. It was a beautiful morning and a great way to start the day. That was it Did you freeze your tail off. Karen or are you okay. No it was good. I this is. You know. I'm i'm co host and i'm also adventure so this is just a all in the course of a day. You know i've come over here on boat many times i remember that. Of course we all. We also had a gas is with us in the studio. He's not on the mike but you can tell. Tell us about who went with us and drove today. sure friend. who's a captain. Local fire department came. He drove boat. Great small boat drivers. I gotta be a passenger for the first time in a while which is really nice. Now mind you a passenger. His standing in the inflatable rib with his hand on the bar with really awesome sea-legs now this is not correct me. If i'm wrong eric. This is not unlike what the military uses. Because i know they have ribs as well sure. It's the same concept small flammable boats with original so Last week we heard. Just some really heartbreaking tragic stories But it's very important about what you do and About you know the the sneaker waves and the riptides and all the other things that go into it so just for people who didn't here last week just a quick reminder on on what you do with cevallos replace sure will in regards to the riptides these sneaker waves in particular in january loan i think five people have been swept off the rocks and the beach by sneaker waves and drowned and we're actually part of a search and rescue that it ended up being mostly for the recovery operation for the twelve year old was swept out to sea and We just think a lot more needs to be done to help educate people about the dangers of sneaker waves and try to get these numbers down. I think the average is about twelve people every year round in northern california alone just by by copy sneaker waves and so we're trying to do something that can get those numbers down and help prevent these tragedies from happening to other families and eric you've also designed something which is a life ring that can be attached to a post and has a really cool logo that shows a wave overtaking. Someone on them falling. It's mu you can look at it and go. Oh that's not good. Tell us about what. You've the pilots that you have installed so far and what they do and how it would work especially in relationship to the story of the young boy drowned shirt and sort of it. The idea came to fruition having dinner with the boys parents and essentially. They took their children to the beach. One day to you know. Enjoy nature and get out from kovic. Their their kids weren't playing games and they just had no idea the danger didn't even know what a sneaker wave was the signs at the beach. that'd be careful riptides. And they said no swimming and so. The parents obviously told their kids. Stay out of the water But they had no idea that just being on the beach was so dangerous and So that was the first thing is there needs to be better sign. 'age better education and the second thing was once he was swept into the ocean. They watched him for about fifteen minutes. She just slowly drifted further and further away. So had there been excuse me had there in a life ring with Hundred feet of line attached. The idea was somebody on the beach could have thrown him the life ring and then pulled him back to safety in. You know it's not one hundred percent that would have saved him but it certainly would have been better than nothing. So i think the combination between better sign age and then having these liferings Position at some of these dangerous beaches by actually make a difference and help save lives so eric. How does it work because obviously the the you know the police the fire department the coastguard first responders will be on. Where do you fit in the first responder Changed as the coast guard. Said hey we would love some additional help or is there a hotline right to you. Are you the first one out valor. No not not at all like that and this particular. I mean obviously the the coast guard and the fire departments and police departments in the sheriff's departments harbourmaster there. The authorities are the ones in charge. What we provide is simply assistance as needed. We have a lot of people a lot of boats a lot of professionals whether they're retired or or on a volunteer basis that are happy to lend their assistance. In this case. Really what we do is as just whatever is requested by us and in this particular case was to step in after the coast guard had called off their search the family and asked if we could continue searching for their son and so. That's what we did but on a larger aspect it would be you know if there's a mass casualty situation or if there's parts of the bay that for whatever reason the coast guard can't reach the idea would be that we use our resources and our network of people to to step in harvard were requested and make sure that we don't interfere with any any ongoing searches or anything like that. Eric you also have quite a few sets of skills. You're a pilot. You're a captain with coast. Guard license. commercial captain and you also have Responded first responder working with the fire department. And you also went to haiti. Can you tell us a little bit. About what the you know with the nine eleven and the haiti just a little synopsis of of what you did in the serie instances so it was a firefighter and a paramedic back in the late nineties and on nine eleven. I was driving depending on when the plane hit. And i pulled over and started carrying people out in the night spent four days. There in the mortuary affairs team recovering. The bodies of those killed when up to ground zero for a couple of weeks after that ended up in haiti was asked to go be part of a team. That was out of johns hopkins So i went there for that and spent about a month. And a half in haiti and eric. Your skills and great personality have actually given you the opportunity to to include a lot of people in the c- valor program. Which is a new nonprofit. That was started in two thousand nineteen To be involved in helping. Because you know you're one of the skill people you attract skilled people. Also some of the people that are with your are pretty awesome and that sort of ideas initially started at to help people with ptsd. Because it's something. I feel very passionate about I've experienced in sort of dealt with. Ptsd for about twenty years now Sadly i've known seven people that have taken their own lives because of it and so a few years ago. I just after after a friend here in berkeley killed himself I just realized that something better needed to be done. That losing people in this It was just sort of unacceptable and that sort of what. I've dedicated the last years of my life towards is trying to get these numbers down and figure out ways that that we can improve people's lives to the point where they're not so depressed and don't feel hopeless and what i found was for me sailing and being out on the ocean and being part of a crew and having a specific tasks and learning new skills. That really helped me instead. The idea was that if it helped me. Perhaps it would help other people in so far it has. We've taken out. I think just over a thousand people in the last two years and it was this little harder with covert obviously we had to reduce the numbers and the trips and everything. But i think the response has been pretty good and a lot of people. Wanna get involved. A lot of people have boats and it seems like a great opportunity because it pairs people with boats and the experience with people that might not otherwise have those opportunities and so it seems like. It's a win win for everybody. Eric is see valor subsidize in any way. Do you get donations. Do you get a grant or is this. All out of the pocket of the individual boat honors Thus far it's been it's been self subsidized It was it was something i wanted to figure out and make sure it was a working model and sort of a proof of concept so now we actually are gonna start applying for grants and looking for donations in a way to keep the self sufficient in make it sustainable but thus far it's been out of the pocket of owners and the sailing communion particular extremely generous and we never charge. We've never charged a single penny for taking people out People want to contribute for gas money or bring food or drinks or something like that to help. That's fine but The sailing community in particular is extremely generous and so far boat owners have been been more than willing to more than happy to volunteer their boats and their time to help. Take people out and also eric. When we had one of the reasons. I had you back on. The show was to talk about wales because right after we talked you finish the show and we had a conversation on your way home. You encountered a dead whale in called it into the coastguard and you know all of us. Who sale have been out there. And you know. Have to navigate around whale so we don't hit them for but This particular will tell us the story right Like you said after we talked. I was bringing my boat back from a boat yard and i saw what ended up being the dead whale and went over and i rated into the coastguard. Because as you know it said pretty big navigation hazard to have a thirty foot whale floating in the channel and the coast guard said. Thank you for the information. And that was in about an hour later. They called back and they had someone from the marine mammal center and someone from noah somebody from the department fisheries on the asked if we could go back actually take photographs the whale and give them a little more information so said sure went back and took the photos and actually my one of my crew. We had we had told his boat once he has a forty four foot wooden boat focal and we had told his. All the way from drake's pay back to san francisco and so Jesse said to the coast guard. He said you know if you want us to would be happy to toe the whale. Because they what they wanted just do is essentially stay with the well until they could arrange towboat to come and then they told the whale to enjoy owns they can have the scientists study and try to figure out the cause of death and so essentially volunteered to toe. The on and we learned a lot from that. It's not as easy as you might think trying to tow a whale into just even attach the towline around. The whale's tail took a little bit of trial and error but We figured it out and we spent about three hours a day towing the whale and then we put an anchor around. It's fin incurred it overnight. And then the next morning finished the rest of the way to the angel island and the scientists came and they. They performed their necropsy in this one in particular. Unfortunately it was killed by ship strike. So that's particularly sad and That's something i hope. The community can sort of come together and brainstorm and figure out ways this. This well was number three in then a few days later there is actually a fourth wheel was washed up on your beach that made it a total of four dead whales within nine days which is pretty high number and the fact that some of these are being killed by ship strikes. I'm not sure if all three or four kill bishop strikes. But i know at least one was and you know whether it's having these container ships slow down a little bit during well season Or figuring out ways to protect his wells a little better. I would hope that we can all get together and figure out ways to do this. Because there's such incredible creatures to see one dead because it's been hit by a container. Ship is pretty heartbreaking. There's eric jones with c. valor and of always. You can find out more about eric. All our topics at sales sports. Talk dot com karen and eric. Thanks for coming in. Enjoy your sale back. Have a picnic on angel island or whatever else you're going to do and we'll see next week wales actually on our ribs so all right sounds good. We'll take a quick break. Come back on sports pilot. I'm gonna tell you how you can get real healthcare for as little as six dollars a day. Yes now you can get affordable health care for you and your family immediately and save as much as fifty percent of your current monthly healthcare payments are plans are perfect for people that are self employed can afford health benefits where they were or just wanna pay less for their current healthcare and coverage is guaranteed regardless of your medical condition. We even offer some of the new christian faith based health benefits. Save up to fifty percent on your family's healthcare makeup free quick call now there are no contracts and we give you a ten day money back trial period call provision enrollment right now for your risk-free guaranteed health insurance quote starting at six dollars a day. Eight hundred four seven two five one four five eight hundred four seven two five one four five. That's eight hundred four seven to fifty one forty five. I don't even recognize myself anymore. I'm really worried about him. It's addiction. I haven't seen them like this ever you. I never wanted to start using. I knew the drill. But i was out of options. I just wanna tell them. It's not your fault there. Are people out there who can help people who have felt your pain. They know what you're going through to stop. I'm losing everything. Everyone you've been strong your whole life. You can do this what you have to reach out for help. It's time i can do. This addiction is a disease and diseases. New treatment call quit drugs three two one now. One hundred three three eight six nine zero six eight hundred three three eight six nine. Oh six that's eight hundred three three eight sixty nine. Oh six paid for by the detox and treatment. Help line are you sixty plus and love to travel introducing. The senior travel discount network brought to you by low cost airlines. Call us anytime day or night and save up to seventy five percent on your airline and hotel reservations. We can help you. Save a ton of money to fly almost anywhere. We have inside discounts and over five hundred airlines and five hundred thousand hotels worldwide. And when you call and mentioned the discount code sixty plus we'll give you an extra free night with your qualified air and hotel reservation now. You can get the best prices on air and hotel reservations with your phone. We make it easy and fast for you to save money and book. A trip remember called the senior travel discount network mentioned the discount code sixty plus for your free hotel night with your qualified reservation. Call now eight hundred four nine three six one one eight eight hundred four nine three six one one eight eight hundred four nine three six one one eight. That's eight hundred four nine hundred sixty one eighteen. Oh come now. Don't be ashamed. We will have a crisies job. Laura's pick apple talk down. I wish you would try and slap rick kittles mama's face he would clown you. Thanks for that couple of minutes. Left in our number one of three. We still have bruce. Marshall and captain keith. Colbourne of deadliest catch watching the as yesterday at diamondbacks the as one four five. Red hot But madison bumgarner. He's just a. I mean it's early season but he's terrible right now and he wasn't good last year in his first year. Nerves on of the area was over five before he got hurt but he said three starts as areas eleven point two low so owen to he gave up six earned and foreign two-thirds the velocity is just not there. The breaking ball ain't break in their cutters are all hangers. And when i think about the giants will sit on the show over and over again when he was going to walk. I go you gotta train them. You've got to trade on our hottest june in history. You can't do that tabuchi when he's leaving. The giants are making the playoffs. I'm like no. They're not trade. Everybody trade cueto build for the future And then he walked but you talk guys that come back and haunt you you know. Oh he's gonna end the division. He signed a five year. Eighty five billion dollar deal. He's only in his second year in it. He's by far their worst pitcher. So i hope for him he turns it around but this is not something that keeps giants fans up at night that they let bumgarner get away in fact they probably liked the fact that here's a division rival and he lost another game for them. He's still kind of helping the the we'll take a quick break. Come back on sports. Vile you're listening to the heartland newsfeed radio network at live dot heartland you stayed dot com. This stream is supported by advertisers and contributions by follow us on facebook twitter and instagram's democrats and republicans are pushing back. I'm pam cousteau fox news. That's what texas governor greg. Abbott says about the surge of migrants along our southern border. Some of whom he says are being sexually abused. overcrowded holding facilities. The by demonstration has done nothing to address these situations that will lead only two more allegations of child. Sex-abuse the governor on fox news sunday house republican jim jordan tells fox is maria puerto romo. The media is still being denied access. Joe biden go down. The president won't go to the border. The vice president will go to the border. Press aren't allowed in and the reason that the that the press aren't allowed in is because they don't want the american people to know what's going on the white house has said it's working on ways to provide access to members of the media during the pandemic as stands right now. Democrats may have to gobert alone. When it comes to the president's infrastructure proposal transportation secretary pete buttigieg was on fox news sunday. We don't have a lot of work to do to persuade the american people that. Us infrastructure needs major improvement. The american people already know it. Republicans don't like the two trillion dollar price tag. They also questioned. Why something like universal pre-k as part of an infrastructure bill allegations of sabotage out of iran. About what was referred to earlier as an accident at a nuclear facility. The country's nuclear chief said on state tv the facility was hit by a terrorist act. He also said iran reserves the right to take action against the perpetrators. Hostilities are rising sharply in eastern ukraine. Where the military says. One ukrainian soldier was killed today and another was seriously hurt by artillery fire from russian back separatist rebels. The us has warned there will be consequences and there will be costs if russia acts aggressively or recklessly. America's listening to fox. News are mobile devices. Key to your business operations security analytics content distribution and all must be done remotely. Keeping track of everything is impossible right actually. It isn't the sodhi. One platform gives you total visibility into your entire fleet of mobile devices manage and support your devices. Analyze data even create absent minutes with sodhi. You don't need silence solutions to run your mobile ecosystem. Visit saudi dot net slash fox for a free trial for fox news radio listeners. That's s. o. T. i dot net slash fox. A shooting at a convenience store has left one person dead and three others hurt. Police in southern missouri say the suspect walked into a snappy mart store yesterday and opened fire authorities say christopher linley caused with murder new. At least one of the victims shooting suspects are being sought in hartford connecticut yesterday. A three year old boy and a sixteen year old boy were killed in separate incidents financial fallout over the decision by major league. Baseball to move this. Summer's all star game out of atlanta. Republican governor. brian. Kemp is outraged. So who is getting screwed in. This is the little guy. In the georgia's governor spoke at a seafood restaurant near the home field of the atlanta braves. Where the game would have been held. And it'll be decided to move the game. Over georgia's new voting law. Many democrats voiced opposition claiming the new regulations will restrict voting access especially for minority voters but kemp says minority groups will be heard by the games. Move from a city and a metro area. That is fifty one percent african american to city. That is ten percent african american republicans. Say the new law will instill more trust in elections. Rob dawson fox news. Well-wishers continue to lay flowers at windsor castle and buckingham palace following friday's death of britain's prince philip who was ninety nine the funeral will be held here at the castle next saturday due to it again and the princess prior wishes. It'll be a low key scaled down affair those in attendance about thirty small procession inside the walls. It'd be televised though for the public for the world. Facts says greg palkot at a church service today at the royal chapel of all saints prince edward the youngest child of prince philip and queen elizabeth called his father's death a dreadful shock but said the queen was bearing up. I'm pam and this is not again when your business strategy relies on mobile technology. The last thing you need is downtime. Downtime leads to lost productivity angry managers unhappy customers more remote workers using more mobile devices. Means more risk for costly downtime and you can't constantly by ship and deploy new devices whenever they go down fortunately with sodhi you can view the screen of any remote device. Whether it's across town or around the world this lets you diagnose troubleshoot and resolve issues anytime anywhere. In minutes opened a whiteboard session and draw directly on the screen to guide the user through the issue instead of typing simply record audio and video of the call and attached to a support ticket minimize downtime maximize your business mobility visit sodhi dot net slash fox for a free trial for fox news radio listeners. That's esotique i dot net slash falkirk's. Your a look at whether from the heartland news feed weather center. Tuesday scattered showers morning. Otherwise mostly sunny with a high near sixty one tuesday night. Mostly cloudy with a low around forty wednesday sunny with a high near fifty six. That's the latest weather. Check out more news and weather on our website at heartland newsfeed dot com. Thank you for that Welcome back have another two hours to go. And then you'll be with us for all three you know the When they do these Ratings they say that the longest someone usually will ever listen to any radio. Show is forty-five minutes. That's now some people will go over. And bless you if you were this real and i know that almost all of you would be for all three hours. I mean come on. But one thing. I've never done is redo the same topics over and over and over again and that that does happen on some stations. I used to work at a station. Where the One program director wanted this. Say if he did a four hour show. You did the same show. Four times and every fifteen minutes. Was that topic. You know what i mean. And it's getting ratings. And it's because people say i got in the car and i went to a movie and then i got out after you're still talking about the same think just for my own boredom. I can't talk about the same thing over and over and over again in the same show maybe different shows. The topic will come up but I try to mix it up just for my own entertainment going over again but the good thing about this show is. I'm so good. Now is that I'll go the way you would like to know if i'm talking about basketball and you call football question. I'm not going to say sorry. We're not talking about that right now. L. and we have had some screeching halt non sequiturs from people over the years. Just shoring lee shocking. Like you really wanna talk about that now. So we do a little hockey coming up with bruce marshall at ten forty at eleven. Forty cath captain. Keith colbourne seashells. Says he'll join us as well. Ten and app iheartradio app stitcher app also. Crn plus two cable radio network channel to kill provider. American forces radio network army navy air force marine coast guard national guards base for still forced to integrate chops. Stay save come home soon. We're proud of you. And what i say sports on facebook twitter at rick to come back having your own home is awesome but it's also a lot of work. The good news finding help for your projects easier than ever introducing. 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And you can get yours at relieffactor dot com or by calling one eight hundred five hundred eighty three eighty four your life your freedom get back to living at relieffactor dot com our two of simulating sports. You thought it couldn't get any better but potter little back. He's so great. I can't believe how awesome he is. More sports talk. Yes couldn't get any better but spotter ripped journalists back. He's so great. I can't believe how awesome he is more sports talk. Yes our two of letting sports check me out. Thank you for that. Welcome back to the show and lines one eight hundred eight seven a play as you get in get hurt you know a lot of times in. Nfl mock drafts. People will start plugging in name so then saying okay well. That's a done deal there. This guy's going here and you can. Just you can just turn in the car to roger goodell right now. Like the steelers. Eighteen are taken naci harris. No one's gonna take him before that and they're the team that really wants him and that's just the way it is they're taking naci harris at eighteen. They are well. It makes sense. No one's going to be surprised. What i'm saying i'm not saying he's not gonna be great. He's the best running back in the draft. I think i take him over. Travis etienne absolutely and i love the kid. He's at east bay like myself there the similarities end but i root for him you know he's supposed to be a really good guy too. So as much as i hate the steelers That's a fantastic organization to go to one of the best coaches of our generation. Really if you think about you. Know andy reid and bella check and sean payton you gotta put tomlin in that conversation you have to maybe not as offensive wiz but just as a leader of men leader of millionaire crybabies and and teenage millionaires practically. I mean he's in that conversation but my point is is that we all just kind of accept. That's where this guy's going and right now. We all accept that the draft begins with the third pick. That's when the draft will begin because lawrence jacksonville and wilson to jets. That's locked so then. Now people want you to believe that no no. The draft begins at four because mac jones. Now as the lock to san francisco. And i'm telling you right now. That's not true. I'm not saying that he hasn't been discussed. I'm not saying they didn't go to his pro day. 'cause they did. I'm not saying they're not doing their due diligence. I'm not saying that drafting him out of the question because they might do it. But i'm telling you that they won't do it. They won't and i love you today. I heard on a national broadcast on tv. I don't even know what the guys name was. I think it was espn. So i'm not gonna hold them to it is i remember his name. But he said mack. Jones was better at alabama then to And he had way less playmakers than two. And so i spit out my oval team. Mack jones had chelan waddell first round pick. Devante smith heisman trophy winner. First round pick najji harris first round. Pick i'm not saying that to didn't have some players to don't don't give me the less playmakers when you have a too wide receivers and running back will all be first round. Picks and wonderful won the heisman trophy. It's just stupid to say that but to me mack. Jones is just maybe scotia. Better than sam darnold you know. Is that what you want. Sam darnold that three overall again. And then you start buying into these notions like we had when two it was coming out that two of who was going to be the number one overall pick and then elat now. Who's this kid. Joe burrow coming out of nowhere the transfer from ohio state. Lsu no no no. It's going to be joe burrow. We'll we'll go after that. And you know blah blah blah and then before the draft nope he's falling out of the top ten and then you look at it and you're like no no miami's taken him at five. He's not getting past them. He might go earlier. But miami is not passing onto at five are they. Are they gonna take justin. Herbert at five. So but the thing is you start buying into the national story. And i don't use the word narrative because it's a stupid word that gets overused like peter falk and the princess bride not narrating anything. The niners for them to get the next. Sam darnold the next. Aj mccarron did not need to spend two first round picks to get it. The niners are head over heels in love with either just feels trae lance. That's the only way they do this. These are not blithering idiots. That doesn't mean they can't make mistakes because everybody makes mistakes. Oh i paid a lot of money and still make mistakes. I heard a comedian. The other day say you know when you back a tv show that gets cancelled after four episodes or if you pass on a show that becomes a huge hit. Why did those executives keep their job. Well that's the same thing in sports. There are some guys. That just like billy beane. He's the can't be fired. it's not possible. But what about three last place. He can't be fired as impossible. So this whole thing when you look through mocks now. It seems to me as i look. Daily at the draft now begins at four which makes zero sense to me now. There are a couple of teams that like mac jones where they sit in the draft and that starts to make more sense and those two are new england. At apparently sean. Payton likes mac. Jobs well new orleans at twenty eight and mac jones is not gonna make it to twenty eight. New england is at fifteen That's really rolling the dice. If you wanna sit up fifteen like the redskins washington football team did with haskins if they love him you england could move up a few spots to get because mac jones has done enough to get drafted in the first round. I'm not saying he's useless. I'm just saying when you look at a team. Like san francisco and kyle shanahan the offensive wiz. And he's very good playcaller. He passed on patrick mahomes. And that doesn't probably haunt him because every other team that passed on. Patrick mahomes as like well at the time we knew he had a great arm. We didn't know he was going to be like this. For pete's sake but i think that just a little bit while it doesn't haunt kyle shanahan. It works him and he sees a guy that in this draft at three that he cannot possibly pass on. He's not going through. Another patrick mahomes with and do you really think that guy is mack jones. The guy that'll keep him up at night because he didn't draft the next aj mccarron. Do you really think it. Now you could say well. Look everything you say about mack. Jones i said about tom brady In fact he's more athletic than the unathletic. Tom brady. Why can't he be like tom. Brady well i could see bill belichick thinking that you know i had the stiff on. Atlantic dope ended up being the greatest quarterback in history. So i see a lot of that. Amac jones and i think the patriots had fifteen makes perfect sense from actions although he might be gone by then probably will be gone but you just have to take a step back instead of saying. Oh jones is the most pro ready guy. He's kind of a plug and play. You don't put a plug and play guy and when you trey to future. First round picks niner fans will be sitting out drafts plural that thursday night draft woohoo pomp and circumstance niner fans. Go to a movie. This has nothing to do with you because you spent it all on this draft and you think mack jones is that guy no no kyle. Shanahan does not want to pass on a guy that will keep him up at night. Like patrick mahomes does and that guy is probably trae lance but it could very well be justin fields if not mack jones so when you see a mock draft that has jones at three and says this is when the draft is beginning. You know going to begin. I disagree. I think i've fatty told you. I disagree. It's not mac. Jones arterial come back. 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But i look at it a little bit more now ryan wilson who is a guy read for a long time and i almost feel like not reading him anymore because not just because he has mack jones going three to san francisco. I can forgive him for that because he's falling in line with all the other toy soldiers do this but he has naci. Harris says a third round. Pick this bone headed. you know. i'll apologize to him. If i find out he goes. Rick i understood that he had had microsurgery on his kneecaps. Microfracture searching that's why. I put them there but to say that g harris is a third round. Pick if you wanna say travis. Atm we'll be taken before him. That's fine at n is a different type of guy. He's a bit smaller. I mean najji harris what he did in the passing game the running game the way he blocked how you would not pick him before eighteen. But i could see it. You know this guy. At and play clemson for four years. I saw him play in the national title game. I took a picture of them. Actually jumping into the stands. When i was down on the field after the game to hug his family But that would mean Devante williams north carolina running back as a second round pick who's gonna take devante williams before nausea harris. What are you doing and like. I understand. You have to do something here to stand out. Otherwise you're mock draft. Just a mock drafts. When i do my brackets with march madness. When i do. I'm i always have a thirteen. Fourteen twelve winning otherwise. It's no fun you gotta get a little bit crazy. Life's too short. He got to it at some point But also you know as they said it set in stone that trevor lawrence goes number one overall. I remember after that. Title game at levi stadium in santa clara trounced alabama and there were Suggestions that may be trevor. Lawrence should just sit out and workout individually for the next two years and get ready for the. What are you methuselah. Are you a vampire. How long are you going to be good. Could you imagine that somebody would have taken a if he will take an suggestion. I'm telling you right now. Two trevor lawrence would not be the number one overall pick if he did not play football for the last two years. He'd be like that basketball player. Who went to china high school and then he came back to a combine and be like. Oh you know we could see him in the low twenty s. That's where trevor lawrence would be. It's still be a first round. Pick he'd be in the low twenty s because he would have been outta sight outta mind for two years his timing off he. You know the sophistication of sec defenses. Will he was an acc anyway but then sophistication of power five defenses. He just isn't ready. It was a bonehead decision. But i bring up trevor lawrence because according to s i There is a jacksonville jaguars. Fan named eric dillard. Eric dillard found out that trevor lawrence married his longtime girlfriend. Marisa just this weekend. And how south of the mason dixon line do you have to be to get married at twenty one but in the old days. This is what people did in. There are still a lot of cultures a lot of places in the planet. A lot of places in america where you just marry your high school. Your college sweetheart. You might your high school sweetheart. I remember when i was in college and My girlfriend was in a sorority cal and at least three of her sorority sisters got married right after they graduated college. And i was thinking what are you. What are you doing but anyway. Congratulations to them Obviously she knew she's been with them the hallway and he knows she's not a gold digger and they're in love and mercy. Maori marissa lawrence. I should say but anyway this guy. Eric dillard jaguar's fan He wanted to find out more about the wedding and what he found was when he went digging. This is why it's scary on the internet. Like the to me. There's nothing more scary than people who put pictures of their kids on the internet. Their kids on the internet. You know how. Many freaks and weirdoes are out there. Ask the curry's about freaks and weirdoes. Ask joe montana. Woman walked into the house and took his grandkids for like. You wanna put him down. Oh sorry the only thing a little bit less freaky but still horrible is the she said yes. You know. there's a guy on the beach and he's on a knee and a girl her dresses blowing in the wind and and nowadays. You didn't really get engaged unless you did it on social media and you don't really love your fiance unless you let strangers look lots of strangers so dillard wanted to by lawrence a wedding gift already. That's bum-bum-bum-bum-bum-bum-ba but at a at scary right he found their wedding registry online. Yikes and he found that. No one had bought the three hundred dollar toaster. First of all. I don't care if you're jeff bezos. What the hell is a three hundred dollar toaster. Does sprinkle beluga caviar on it. As he checks visits the slide out into your mouth is a come out sprinkled with cinnamon and sugar. I don't know maybe it's gold plated right. Maybe leonardo davinci painted the side maybe picasso that some cubism art. I don't know but a three hundred dollar toaster and So dillard said. I quickly jumped back on twitter with the idea of Maybe buying the vacuum. I thought it was important to float the idea. Because i had already collected two thousand two hundred fifty dollars and i want people to be okay with where the money was going. And so at the end the pulse said send the rest to charity sell Lawrence and. Mary both grew up in carterville georgia. While it was probably good that she went to a different school. She went to something called anderson university which is also in south carolina But it's a very exciting time for lawrence's as they're going to be the number one overall pick and they're going to stay at home by the way remember they're not going to be Go on to the draft but urban meyer's come into town and You know one of the great college coaches really of all time if you think about what he did. At four different schools. I throw toledo in there as well as Utah and florida and ohio state. Fantastic coach sata's health problems. He's the same age as i am. He's had a couple of episodes so hopefully the pressure doesn't get to. You might remember the whole way. He had to leave columbus a little. Bit yeah. He was complicit. Some people thought it would happen to do somebody on his staff who is abusing his wife. Don't get into all that but Soclean slave for him. I guess But just the fact. 'cause i know there are certain members of the soccer team. I root for also the baseball team. I root for that. Whenever anyone who comes in i know a few people and they just happened to be female. It has happened to be but immediately if he has a wife or girlfriend and they wanted to go to her instagram or twitter and they know everything about her. She's a lawyer she's an interior decorator. She likes cats. You know and they follow her on twitter. It's i'm just telling you. I know that the people think this erasure and this is just the way you do things. It's scary now. These people mean no harm. They're just nosey is how you know what is what is his girlfriend. Look like then. They judge her She has fake boobs or oh she's real she's nice like you've never met her. Don't judge the fake boob. Girlie don't judge. It's all judged on what they look like you know. Oh she's a trophy wife she's real. it's all bs. They don't know the the wife or girlfriend or wag as they say But yeah he now. Your wedding registry people can tap into that and they can buy you your three hundred dollar toaster and then give the rest of money to charity and have other people pitch in. It's not nice. It's creepy and if i was lawrence's i wouldn't return it but i would definitely give to somebody else. We'll talk a little hockey on the other side. Come back on sports violent And now today's russ eating tip of the day presented by free all deep penetrating oil. You're all set for a quick tie rotation until you have a rusted on wheel koto lug nuts and penetrating oil. Let them sit for a few minutes and you'll have them often essential now. Give a generous spray into each mounting hall. Place a two by four on the outer edge of the wheel and smacked a would with a mallet just enough to create some braking force and vibration repeat if necessary and now a word from free all. Stop wasting your time. Struggling to loosen. Rusted nuts and bolts start using free all deep penetrating oil free. 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Get it out. Here's a away patrick. Who cares about anything else. When you've got rick tiddle on the radio. Always great to catch up with bruce marshall the proprietor of the gold sheet and the gold sheet dot com in las vegas. And we like to talk hockey on tuesdays bruce. The trade deadline closing up yesterday and Some moves all around the league. Let's start off with the washington. Capitals getting anthony mantha from the detroit red rings for richard panik yaacob brana first and a second round. Pick a first round pick this year. Second round pick Next year and the potential for mantha. I mean the guy's a monster. He's at six five and he's scored twenty four goals in a season at a twice and you can see what the capitals are doing. They're getting a twenty six year. Old guy who has signed for three more years for a guy like ranna who's going to be a restricted free agent Did they pay too high a price. What do you think of the deal. I like it and In memphis got gives them a lot more down the road. I don't think he's going to be any less productive than brana. Would've been now. he's got some versatility upside. He gives him another big body out there Not quite like wilson like that not too far away from ed in the guy who can can can score So i think that was. That was that was pretty That was pretty a pretty good work there and it it was probably pretty good I think the red wings are really happy with the deal too because they were able to squeeze a first round the second round or out of it and A couple of players who could help out shorter term. But it's sometimes you get. Nhl you can get these deals. That are win win both ways. I think this might be one of them. I think that might be true about the panthers. Getting sam bennett from calgary for a meal heinemann and a second round pick next year. Because if you think about bennett who has been in the league. A while even though he's still young. And i think what does he like the fourth overall pick but he's only twenty four and maybe as best days were behind him but he adds a lot of depth to the To the forward line and For for calgary you gotta like heinemann. Who's a second round pick last year. I don't know was it a bit of an overpay. What do you think it could. It could be. But i know it may be one of these guys who just needed a change of scenery and and and maybe he can Be can flourish now down in florida or come closer to it so i think it was again. This is one of these deals. That i think both teams are probably pretty Happy about it Right now for the same. Get a player and a second round. Pick out of it for bennett. That too bad Although i think the overall overarching thing calgary's they're they're kind of disappointing. Disappoint ted that things haven't picked up a little bit quicker since Dill sutter came in as as coach. And they really haven't played better than they do. Jeff ward so. There's some other factors. Going on with calgary right now but i think florida's probably pretty happy that they got out of your your Golden knights get Matisse on mark Chicago gets a second round and a third round. The sharks got in as well and a three three way deal A fifth round pick From vegas but the knights had been on it in on a few deals. They were in on the hall. Deal the felino deal. But like jahn mark very speedy player And i think what this was was vegas looking at. Calgary can't just send an sorry at colorado thinking we can't just stand still because we don't want the avalanche to fly bias here just a extra little speedy piece for him. Yeah it is. His versatility is good rick Because they can move him anywhere he can play senator if they need be and i think that if there was one thing that it was a little bit more coverage senate they thought they might have been a little bit thin there so they have to. They can play. They can play on mark there but he does. Give them some flexibility and You know he'll probably you know you'll probably be in you. Know second or third line there and get plenty of work and it gives them some flexibility. How they've been. They've been historically active that the deadline. It was Tar trade three years ago. Mark stone leonard. They picked up a last year. So in filling the kremlin now wishing those buttons with george mcphee overseeing things but They weren't you're right. They were they were they were in. They were trying to get in on all somebody else. But i think this year probably the best they could do was a young market. This time and happy with the bruins were aggressive. Let's talk about taylor hall. They got him for a second round pick and honors bjork from buffalo. There are some out there that i was listening to the deadline. That said they don't even want taylor hall. The the offensive production is just not there and he comes with some baggage as well. what do you think about the bruins and the straight i worked while risk for them although i feel the same things about holidays not the most efficient shooter sport or he does I mean history. That was you know. Mvp not that long ago worthwhile risking. Apparently this is the part. Is you get a guy. Get him out of buffalo. And and and maybe you know that will really get him focus. Apparently he's had dreams about playing for the bruins for a long time. So if he's in his dream destination that Can only help whether buffalo does play boston tonight too. I think the other half of this though is is buffalo and That's the best giving a second round right as the best they could have gotten hall. You look at some of the guys that buffalo's tend to move here And it's just a function of where they're at this season. How the season has gone but They've had to move a few guys didn't get near the return that they it would have seen. They could've got at one point for him but they're in this transition phase. It is what it is. They got a i g gm there. He had to make something happen here in and i think it was a buffalo case so that was the best they got. They really were holding out front number. What all that. Nobody was really often. Come more questions for bruce marshall of the gold sheet jeff carter leaves the kings going to pittsburgh he'll over. The years has made these moves for older guys like like marlowe but if you think about malkin that still being out and crosby played with carter on the canadian gold medal team in twenty fourteen and a lot of people thought would be part of the any significant trae bin laden picks so they gave up a conditional third round next year and a conditional fourth round in two years and to add a veteran. Like that for you. Know those types of picks How do you not do that. Move if you're ron hextall absolutely i mean there's the window was kinda closing here on the penguins. I think they know that and They still think they might be able to make something you know happen right now. You know run next all. I've been reading this nights with the carter back on the phase of the flyers so it made some sense in. Carter still got some decent hockey. It's thirty six. It's a short term deal. But they're kinda thinking you know short term right now and in pittsburgh maybe this Helps them out. So we'll see. I understand the move for carter and The the kings are taking back some of the salary too so it's not a letter asking potential higher awards. I think that's just sort of deal likes to do right stuck about a couple of Netminders on the move devon dubbed. Nick didn't even last an entire year. In san jose. Martin jones has been playing a lot better recently so he moves on to the avalanche for an up and down your player guy named greg pattern and a twenty twenty one fifth round pick. You think about all the injuries that the latch of had between a sticks a dub. Nick is a big guy who is not a joke. He's not good. It's funny how he goes to a situation where he might even win the stanley cup. What do you think about. Nick as a depth th-this for colorado. I worth while because we saw it happened to them. In the bubble last year and with so's hurting. Now i mean grew hours had to take on way too much of a workload i think So at least. I think this allows Jer bed at least to pay. Screwball a little bit more In this last month before we up into the playoffs. And give doug nick somewhere and if they have to use them in emergency if it gets like last year i i guess w better than what they've done next has has gone downhill the last two years. And he didn't even play in in the bubble last year and And he'd missed most of last season and then didn't quite Ignite for the sharks the way they thought he would either but it wasn't that long ago he was one of the featured netminders and Right now you know. Maybe he's he can assume a riot miller type will be and you know there's a backup that is useful and i think that's really all the colorado was looking for. Maybe got it. Yeah we said david Rich go to toronto from calgary little depth as well but before we go. I want to ask you about the felino and stephanos deal. Toronto gets those two guys jackets. Get toronto's first round pick this year a fourth round pick. Next year is sharks again. They did a lot of little moves. they get a fourth round. Pick out of this As well was it worth the high price that Toronto paid and do you like the fact that they're being very aggressive. I think it might be worth it but again. This is one of these things. I'm sharks a factor in this one but columbus as well economic a little. Different spot right now but this is sort of a. i'm okay. Line was able to make these some of these moves And not really panic with it. I ain't got a pretty nice return Couple of i picture players and expiring contracts politico could be a really big plus for pretrial. i think And but he he could. He could be back in columbus next year because he is going be on an expiring contract so i actually i like. I like to kick line and did this but i also understand where toronto's was coming from these. I mean that the deals with us and then getting riddick too because they also had some problems in goal there. If anderson doesn't come back. Jack cam really good. Since he's been in there but can never have to make quality goal is especially. If one of them's been hurting anderson. So i like getting riddick as well for right. The gold sheet. That's where you wanna go. If you're gonna be taking a punt or fletcher as they say in england. What's going on with the gold sheet ricky. It's pretty busy even though College hoops is. I'm an mba is still going on heavy. Nhl baseball started with double champions league today tomorrow. Europa league thursday. So soccer's ramping. Up pretty nicer to we got picked on that stuff every day. Ever go dot com basketball publication every day as well my picks well up there also as vegas inside or done. Best dot com. There is bruce. Marshall check it out gold sheet dot com bruce extra coming on and break it down. The trades appreciate it. We'll talk to you next week. Buddy all right. i'm rick tuttle. We'll take a quick break. Come on that sports smile doc. Now you can make your home. Look great and save money right now. When you call renewal by anderson you can buy four windows and get the fifth one free. Plus you get twelve months with no interest. No money down. 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What could you use it on How about audio interior and exterior leather vinyl metal. Rv's atv's boats wall floors tiles outdoor furniture and grills. There's patio furniture again. Appliances and countertops paint rollers brushes and pans fabric and carpet lawn and garden equipment. So like enough of me yacking about it. Go to tell the tells dot com once again. T. u. b. o. T. o. w. e. l. s. tullow tells dot com to check it out. Is that All right we got another ago. And we have Captain keith colbourne of the discovery channel. He's on the show many. He's just keeps rolling along after year on that deadliest catch very entertaining very popular amick. That'll come back. You're listening to the heartland newsfeed radio network at hartland. Newsfeed dot com. This dream is supported by advertisers and contributions by follow us on facebook twitter and instagram's mounting concern about russia. Lisa brady fox news. The us sending a message that russet military buildup near ukraine. Isn't okay the top. Us general in europe appearing before congress while president biden spoke to russia's leader. Get a phone call. Today with russian president vladimir putin president and biden voiced concerns over russia's military buildup in crimea in ukraine's borders in called on russia to deescalate the white house provided details of the phone call that also included discussions on arms control cyber intrusion and election interference. President biden suggested a summit in the coming months in a third country to discuss a full range of issues facing the united states in russia this year at halpern at the white house to. Us worships are due to arrive in the black sea this week. Meantime president biden is reportedly set to drop a may first deadline for us troops to leave afghanistan as peace talks with the taliban continue setting a new goal of september eleventh which this year will mark the twentieth anniversary of the nine eleven attacks at the us capitol. The foreign bars dignity. Decency is loyalty and kurds biden among those paying tribute to capitol police officer billy evans lying in state. Just over a week after he was killed during an attempted capital breach. A rare but serious. Form of blood. Clotting and a handful of people leads to a pause for the johnson and johnson kobe. Fox's jonathan serrie the six point. Eight million americans receiving jay jay's vaccine six women developed a clot called cerebral venus sinus thrombosis in combination with low levels of blood platelets. The independent advisory committee on immunization practices will meet on wednesday to further assess whether these cases are connected to the vaccine or coincidental. Cdc recommending a pause until that process is finished. One of the women died. America is listening to fox news. Don't let the challenge a free mobile app store. Your business building apps takes time special skills and a lot of money. Fortunately with sodhi snap you can unleash your inner developer by allowing you to build and deploy apps you don't need to be a software developer and you don't need a lot of money with sodhi snap. You can create apps up to ten times faster than traditional methods. Leverage sodas free at prototyping service visits sodhi dot net slash fox for a free trial for fox news radio listeners. That's esotique i dot net slash fox. Defense begins calling witnesses to the murder trial of former minneapolis. Police officer derek. Chauvin in the death of george floyd for firms called you. Police officers who described unruly crowd then gathered head. Last year's arrest seen a paramedic who previously treated floyd testifying that he had an extremely high blood pressure at the time to floyd french Wanda hill who was with floyd. In his car till endures that floyd fell asleep and when they came near to wake him up go live over and over and he's trying to wake him up and he can't be woke up then he'll say something he made little jason back off until floyd was aroused by police the defense claims it was a drug overdose and floyd's bad heart that killed him as the state points to derek. Chauvin is the cause. Jeff monosso a second night of violence in brooklyn center minnesota traffic. Stop death of dante right. Also sparking protests in other cities and renewed calls for police reform airbnb pandemic driven. Crackdown on big parties. Apparently isn't going away. Gather a group of people together at an airbnb this summer. And you'll have neighbors using technology to report you to the company it's expanding its neighborhood support line. You could even have your noise. Level detected by minute sensors provided at a discount to hosts. It's part of airbnb. Summer of responsible travel especially focused on the four th of july weekend. The home rental company has stepped up support to hosts and we'll ban one night or last minute stays especially for guests who don't already have a positive review it already has a sixteen person limit on gatherings janie. Casilda fox news for the dow right. Now it's down one hundred seventy eight points but the nasdaq and the s&p are higher. Sobriety fox news not again when your business strategy relies on mobile technology. The last thing you need is downtime. Downtime leads to lost productivity angry managers unhappy customers more remote workers using more mobile devices. Means more risk for costly downtime and you can't constantly by ship and deploy new devices whenever they go down fortunately with saudi. You can view the screen of any remote device. Whether it's across town or around the world this lets you diagnose troubleshoot and resolve issues anytime anywhere. In minutes opened a whiteboard session and draw directly on the screen to guide the user through the issue instead of typing simply record audio and video of the call and attached to a support ticket minimize downtime maximize your business mobility visit sodhi dot net slash fox for a free trial for fox news radio listeners. That's esotique dot net slash fox. Here's a look at whether from the heartland news feed weather center. Tuesday scattered showers in the morning. Otherwise mostly sunny with a high near sixty one tuesday night mostly cloudy with low around forty wednesday sunny with a high near fifty six. That's the latest weather. Check out more news and weather on our website at heartland news dot com. Thank you for the welcome back to the show with you. Coast to coast around the world on. Fm cath keith. Coburn the wizard crab wizard. He'll be joining me in about a half hour. I put a little picture of them. On the old social media asterik total facebook fan page so many fans to the league sports with rick little and i got up on the bass pro shop hat and If you go into brass bass pro shops he the hat that he's wearing. It's called. I think the three ninety nine to pay. It's kind of funny says america's cheapest to pay but the thing about keith burn. Have these guys on the show. I actually. I've had so many of these guys on my show over the years That you know. I figure it's about time that i watched you know more of them. You know what i'm saying. And the fact is is that I saw mike a not my dave turn his shell and i said to him. We're not going to see any tears this at this year arly because it said an emotional year he goes. Oh actually there are some tears. Yeah i was watching it. And he got a call and he's like no he did not know crying he gets a call it. His dad died. It was really hard to watch. And i'm here gone. There's no tears are there and he said others and tear the kid lard. I wished i had a question. Now i feel bad for him but anyway. These are big. Tv stars big stars biggest star in the world. You hear me. Mickey rooney all right tune in app. I heart radio app. Stitcher gets the show also on sports byline dot com streaming along any emails. Rick at sports vile dot com. And on your tv set if you have able see our digital plus two that's the cable radio network channels to open lines at one. Eight hundred eight seven a plumber kittle if you owe the irs back taxes. Don't worry there's a bright side. The experts at bright side tax relief dot com will protect you from having your wages garnished money deducted from your bank account and your home or business seized bright side tax relief dot com will fight the irs negotiate to reduce or eliminate the amount. You owe visit bright side tax relief dot com or call eight hundred seven three zero forty three thirteen. That's eight hundred. Seven three zero forty three thirteen. The consultation is free. 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Seventy one okay. We are running a car drive right now to help veterans all across america. So if you have an old car truck or van even a motorcycle or an rv sitting around you can right now. Give it away and help. Vets they really need your help. And your car will help support the vets and their families and guess what you even get a tax donation plus come and pick up your car for free and all you've got to do is pick up your phone right now and make a free call. Now is the perfect time to do something. Good for the vets give back to the vets right now for all they've done for this country and your old car can really help him. Call the veterans car donation program right now for free pickup of your vehicle. The vets and help your taxes at the same time. Call right now. Eight hundred two one five six eight one to eight hundred two one five six eight one to eight hundred two one five six eight one two. That's eight hundred. Two one five sixty eight twelve whether classes in school at home or a little bit of both school goes on and staples has everything you need to start the year right from lap. Desks to notebooks. Noise cancelling headphones to uv sanitizers. And all at amazing prices this week notebooks and rulers are just twenty five cents each back to school deal. You don't wanna miss shop in store order online or pick up herbicide upside school on at staples and nine twenty six limit. Thirty limits vary online while supplies last curbside available in most stores writing sports with rick tittle. Rick tittle is genius. The best show ever. He's so wonderful genius ever. He's so wonderful. Elating sports with rick tittle has keys genius. Thank you for that. And welcome back to the show rick to the with you. Coast to coast and around the world on american forces radio network. Just got the odds from bet online about The twenty twenty one. Nfl mvp and it's just kind of. It's kind of fun to look out for a second. Because patrick mahomes the favourite five to one. That's not bad. Put one hundred dollars on the home. A few ngos five hundred bucks. why not. i spent one hundred dollars on dinner. That's really not bad. Aaron rodgers nine to one it nine hundred bucks then. It goes josh allen. Lamar jackson and matt stafford the new quarterback of the rams matt stafford ahead of guys like tom brady and dak prescott He's got to shawn watson he bet online dot com. It's got to shawn watson twenty two and one. Which is the same as justin. Herbert and russell wilson. That shows you at our grade of ricky or justin. Herbert has the same odds as the guy who led the nfl in passing a great player in prescott coming back from an injury and Interesting thing about the shawn watson with these what is it twenty two civil suits and three criminal suits and now the lawyer saying oh ya everything happened. But it was all consensual Yeah it's gonna be hard and just wonder. Can he still play. Play well with this hanging over his head you can. it depends. How can you compartmentalize things. Ken burns on last thursday to talk about the hemingway documentary. Which i i watched on pbs. And i think what it says. A lot in that documentary is like if you're really good looking and really smart how you can manipulate people but also that documentary shows like there was a time when he was married and then he had his girlfriend on the side and he said i knew everything was wrong but i was really happy and so you know as i said there are some you might call them sociopaths but there are some people who they know that what they're doing is wrong but they're still happy so i mean it's possible this. It's possible that the shawn watson could still have a tremendous season. Derek carr is a forty two one for an mvp. Always look just for fun. Which is the same as jalen hurts now. That probably hurts. Eric cars like i am in the same places jalen hurts. But how about this mack. Jones is a one hundred and fifty to one as is trey lance justin fields. So those are three rookie quarterback's and teddy bridgewater they think. Teddy bridgewater has the same chance of being mvp as mack jones. By the way which is still worst than sam darnold. Sam sam darnold is a hundred to one to win the mvp. So if you really wanna play the home version of the lottery which is Ripping up a one dollar bill if you wanna play the home version You can do that If you want just go ahead and put the money on. Sam i said listen. I know i'm hard on him. He's an easy target. He really is also some nfl news. Julian edelman failed his physical so he's retired bill. Belichick rhoda very heartwarming long Not eulogy send off talking about how he's one of the best and land you look at the fact that You know the number one Playoff receiver of all time as jerry. Rice that number two is settlement. I've found that very surprising. I mean eshelman has a case for the hall of fame which you know to me seems laughable. Just a few years ago but now he has a pretty good case. The interesting thing about retiring after twelve years all with member. He was a seventh round. Pick a quarterback at kent state and bella check thought you know. I can use this guy in the offense. No one thought that little guy be as good as it gets and you think about that comeback against atlanta in the super bowl. That ridiculous catch that. He made with his fingertips But rob gronkowski those a thing or two about retiring and on retiring. He told tmz sports. That element has a sixty nine percent. Chance of un retiring and joining them in tampa bay. Why does it have to be sixty nine percent. Cousy always has to have a little bit of a laugh right so There's also the patriots position in all this because the club terminated his contract following the failed physical and You think about hanging onto the rights of a guy who may find his way back into the league similar. what they did with gronkowski Elleman said that. He's honored to retire as a patriot and he kept saying foxborough forever. And somebody says oh. He can't walk that back at this point. of course he can. of course he can say no. I'm just kidding. Look you can have a change of heart. I mean it's april. It's baseball season. We're getting ready for basketball and hockey playoffs. You know we're wrapping up another soccer season. We're not. We're not thinking about football right now outside of the draft. We're just not you know. Some free agent signings one way or the other so Yeah right now. It's very easy to retire Then you can see about whether you wanna come back Another interesting piece of news. Is that james carter connor. I should say james conner. Now i'm a frontal silicon. Told she was here. James conner has found a new home twenty five year old running back leaving the steelers to go to the arizona cardinals on a one year deal. he did fly out for a visit yesterday and he was impressed at the got a little one on one time so that means his time in. Pittsburgh is a now underwear. After the first four years there and in arizona was in the market for running back after the raiders overpaid and my opinion for kenyan drake and you know as it stood chase edmonds was looked at as the week one starter at the position but now you have connor. That gives the club another back. Obviously but there's some familiarity. The running back coach james saxon longtime assistant with the steelers and You know his best years. He was a pro bowler few years ago. That's when he ran for nearly fifteen hundred yards over five yards a carry. And so there's familiarity there as well but last two years. The injury Bug if you like really bit him and so he's even injured right now. He and rappaport said he went underwent back surgery and he had turf toe but obviously arizona fills that the bill of health is now clean so some people were saying that naci harris could be If the steelers didn't take him to land in arizona still could be. But you know the steelers were already going to draft naji harris. I said set in stone now. The connors left. Now they're in italics. Really gonna draft dodging harris. Amer till back on sports violent watching me watching. I can attention timeshare owners. This is an urgent consumer or from the timeshare exit hotline a national company specializing in helping consumers legally get out of their expensive timeshare contracts. We're offering you away to legally get rid of your timeshare. 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Taking it back to the paint store title is a majestic stallion. A welcome back to the show captain keith. Colbourne of deadliest catch will be joining us in the next segment and lines are available at one. Eight hundred eight seven eight p. l. a. You ain't got no other by you up the girl you ugly Taking a look into the ncaa. There's supposed to be significant. Headway being made towards instituting a one time. Transfer legislation during the ncaa council meetings. That'll be taking place this week and they've been waiting a long time for this landmark statue that will allow athletes to transfer one time during their five year eligibility window without having to sit out a year residence and one source close to the ncaa council. Said i would expect an action on that Now well the expectation is that athletes and fall sports. We'll have until july first notify their schools. They are transferring to take advantage of the new rule and college football and basketball athletes who have already transferred this academic year as well as those that are in the transfer portal would be immediately Eligible coming up next season. The year in residence restriction has existed in some shape or form by whole life and mid sixty and athletes in only five of the twenty four sports sponsored by the ncaa so called revenue sports. Like it's really just football and men's basketball but there is a little bit of revenue produced by women's basketball baseball and men's baseball and men's hockey little bit out a year in residence. It's called so unless you're justin fields then you can transference start and be the third overall pick way works so if they approve this they have to go to the ncaa board of directors. And they're having a meeting on april twenty eight and then we'll see if that works or not but the debate on the issue And the board of directors will have. This is something that came up and twenty nineteen and the board issued a moratorium on transfer legislation. That's why they're kind of expecting it to kind of go down now but the big ten itself kind of quietly proposed a one time transfer legislation just for their conference and that has created a lot of momentum of being part of this rule. That's been around for parts of seven decades because to qualify. Athletes have to be in good academic standing and not face any disciplinary issues. Either leagues intra conference role will still supersede any nca legislation but those walls appear to be coming down ten. The acc for example recently did away with incan. Intra conference transfers restrictions. The pac twelve is supposed to be headed that way as well in other words. If you're a clemson you can't go to north carolina. If your account you can't go to stanford without sitting out a year you can go to texas am you can go to alcorn state but legislation Which is expected they said to kick in. This fall got delayed because mark amer whose president expressed very strong concerns about it. And that's why the meeting between the ncaa and the justice department's antitrust division still has not taken place but the transfer legislation has been forwarded to the council That's going to be working on this this week. Council by the way has forty people. They're responsible for the day to day legislative policy decision making it. has a representative from all the d. one conferences. And some of those are just basketball. You know how many deland conferences there are. Thirty two Yeah now there are ten. Fps conferences and with that half of them are the power five. Acc big ten. Big twelve. Pac twelve sec. So if the spf conferences though it is group they control You know a lot of power there. obviously The power five can't decide anything on their own Being five thirty two. But the ncaa council is going gonna meet tomorrow. They're going to meet thursday and it's during that time that They're expected to end the recruiting dead period in all sports that has existed since march madness of last march at still going on And one administrators said the only reason why one time transfer legislation hasn't passed. Is this meeting with the department of justice. Whatever formal sit down. They felt like they need to have didn't happen as of last week. So if there's a delay and students will have to get that waiver once again. The justin fields waiver normally. that's you know you. Can you have to have special circumstances. Special circumstance was. I'm really good. I need to play. So let coaches have been recruiting for months if not years with the expectation that this transfer One time transfer thing would already be in place because pressure has been mounting on increased player freedom. Ncaa athletes were found A i should say bound by those transfer restrictions. that don't impact normal students. Can you imagine just being a student and saying well. I'd like to go to this college now a year and i understand why it was put in right in the beginning it sounded like a good idea to keep kids from all running and jumping on the team. That's winning. oh you're winning now. Although there nope you gotta sit out here And i get it. It's like the idea of unions back when workers were exploited. And if they unionized got beat up and now most unions are so twisted. You have some guy with the eighth grade education wearing a windbreaker that says local one forty two. That tells you to go on strike as you don't like the dental plan like wait. What happened. I remember at the coliseum. One time a light bulb burned out. And i went to change it and everyone panic that i was in the wrong union. I wasn't allowed to do that. Do you know that during covid some of these Zoom shows like Coal bearer out having his sons and his wife like work the camera and his house they had to get a special dispensation a waiver from the union. Saying that you know you you're not an ab or whatever it was you camera. You're not allowed to operate the camera big. Because it's co that are will let you so i get it mike. Loxley head coach at maryland. Said we all knew it was coming down. the track. kids should be allowed to transfer one time whenever or wherever they choose to go and You know we've seen these high profile profile challenges. I mentioned the ohio state quarterback. But there's always there's very little consistency when it comes to this type of stuff and you know it's just something that i grew up with so it's something that i never questioned because that's just the way it was. You know you want to transfer. Well that's what you get. You're going to have to sit out a year. And what year are you sitting out a year where you're really good usually but you can get the deferrals and you can get the hardship cases the hardship. Meaning that you know. I was out for the season. That shouldn't count against me and normally that would be granted you know. Technically i was a fifth year senior And that's why my friend said. Hey are were in the draft no or not because we were automatically eligible to get drafted that we were in the draft. Which sounds kind of. It's kind of like saying I can be president. Because i was born here. It's basically the same thing. Yeah the i think the odds of being being present president are actually higher than me playing in the nfl. It's like anybody can be president now but Yeah so this is. I've never and like i said one time i think that's fair you know and somebody's like i wanna go to hofstra okay. I hate it here. Now i want to go to syracuse. It's like a weightier. There's nothing wrong with one time and then it it does make it more serious. If you only got one bullet in the gun unicef not gonna shoot it out in the air you gotta make it count so As i said everyone's going down this road with the whole thing about An i l. name image likeness. That's a whole different bag of hammers right now but Student athletes are getting more freedom as we keep going and I don't see anything wrong with it. i don't see anything. That's going to ruin sports at the college level. Scott emmer all right when we come back. We'll talk a little discovery. Channels deadliest catch with captain keith. Colmer kittle option me. 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They only get paid. If you win so please call now. Eight hundred two five one seven four six zero eight hundred two five one seven four six zero eight hundred two five one seven four six. That's eight hundred two five one. Seventy four sixty receive a five dollar rebate by trading a non contact thermometer toward an extra temporal scanner purchased at any retailer. Fever is a leading symptom of covert and using an accurate. Thermometer has never been more critical in published studies. No touch thermometers. Miss more fevers than they detect while the new co vaccines are becoming more widely available. It is important to make sure you are protected monitor for fever with an accurate thermometer backed by more than eighty published peer review clinical studies details at exigent dot com. Where accuracy matters. You have to serious. You cannot be serious town. Rick tittle is a majestic stallion. Thank you for that and welcome back to the show with you. Coast to coast around the world on american forces radio network. One of our favorites is with us. Now captain keith. Colbourne of deadliest catch and by the way Starting off streaming on discovery plus. But we'll be having season. Premiere airing this tuesday at eight o'clock on the discovery channel and captain. Keith has been with us every year for six years in a row captain first of all. How are you feeling because That whatever you had going on in your gut. It looked ugly. It felt ugly. You had to get off the boat or you do all right now. I you know what i'm doing. okay. I've had some other issues but For the most part. I'm feeling pretty good and You know it's been a long strange here. I'll tell you that yes. It has been for all of us. But especially i think for your business because of covid. The fishing game up there in alaska. They couldn't do their crab surveys. So you went out there. It's just basically flipping a coin right. Well yes and no you know i. I've got twenty years where the information backed up You know we did get different. Midge of inflammation But yeah not. Having a survey basically had shouldn't blind to start our seasons And it's It was definitely a different year to catch. Grab and You know we're were now wrapped up with both king crab baird i end and you know for the most part. I think the managed to whether storm has this year so the wizard. Which is i mean. It's from like world war two right. How's that old girl holding up. Well not as good as we would hope. At the end of the season my brother Took out a window and pretty much violated the whole wheelhouse finishing the season up So right now. Under massive repairs on the electron ix the entire wheelhouse and under a real short time frame to try and get them out for a famine tender care about two months but prior to that she held up pretty good. We just you know took a frequent With a full stack a gear and three hundred seventy five thousand pounds on board and you know Had to make some with the coast guard and But to get the motor home safe and both of seattle now and well underway into just specialty getting tore park. What's that like when you go into shipyard and maybe your dry dock visits does i mean i'm sure the cost mount and then there's a decision of rushing it back or making sure it's ready to I mean is that something you like. You know we. We hate going to the hospital. As i mentioned as sort of like you hate having your boat dry dock like that. Well i guarantee you. there's never been a guy. Leave the pitch and nascar with three tires. So we we basically made sure that we're one hundred percent before we leave the doc you know now there might be cosmetics that we won't finish until in the off but You know all of the primary systems redundant systems we'll be up and running prior to vote getting back underway. Have you ever had. And i don't mean like in a fatalistic way but if you ever had like because of the weather or because of the something with your craft where you just think we really and you know as you're leaving thinking that we're doomed. We shouldn't be going out right now. it i wouldn't say so much i shouldn't be going out at that. I've had times when i left and the weather deteriorated or Extended the period of time And created even more severe conditions than than we're anticipating And and you know definitely. There's been a handful of times where You know we've been white. Knuckling it out there no question about it when you get a forty foot wave when you're getting hurricane force winds. It's not enough to just hunker down. I mean you still have to make sure that you're pointing your ship the right direction and going into the waves or with the waves. Not you know. A parallel to the waves. Is that what you mean when you're like white knuckle and you know those things can go on for hours and hours and hours. Do you ever think yourself. It's like a hungover alcoholic. I'll never drink again. Do you think if. I actually get back to port. I'm never coming out again just before. the It's you know especially at night. And i'm living in forty five second increments you know so frequencies roughly fifteen seconds. I can see about freeways That fourth way may not look as bad as it is but you come over the top of the third one and all the sudden at thirty five foot trough you're diving into is forty five feet and that next nextwave is massive An all you can do is just try to back the down. Hold it on station and keep the boat right into it You know and and basically just hang on you know we had. I can't. I don't even know how many ways i've had to get like that but it's been more than i would like no doubt a couple more questions here for captain keith. Colbourne the seventeenth season of deadliest. Catch coming out Next week at this On the twentieth at eight o'clock on discovery when you think about a show. That's had so much staying power and i've had a lot of here Compatriots on the air from Cygan and jake and some others but why do you think it is that you know going out on a boat throwing some crab pots the water that this has been the number one show and still going strong. What what to you is the most compelling thing that you think that that we just love about this show. I think it's everything that they try to recreate. You know. get a really harsh environment. i mean the work environment. You could possibly imagine data winner. You know we've got hurricane. Force winds we icing. I fact we have all those scenarios we've got a crew working in close proximity You know any day anytime. A guy get knocked down swept across the deck And at the end of eight. You know it's It's a treasure hunt too. So you know. I mean we're just trust me. We're more excited than the people at home for. Wait for that to break around the cf where you know heroes or if were scrambling to find somewhere to fish. So it's i think all of those things combined Are what make catch what it is and it's just you know it's real it's raw it's and at times it is scary and i think that's one of the things that But people really enjoy that. The other thing is people. They're like watching say. Wow i think i'll keep my day job. Do you still get butterflies at times. Everything so old hat you like seen one way of seeing them all. I'll tell you what man i'm not an adrenaline junkie. I probably need to go to adrenalin. We have you know. I i it just it. It ebbs and flows through all day long at times. I mean it'd be nice weather or severe weather but you know it's Yeah i'm i'm constantly on edge And i think that's one of the things that i've really enjoyed about my job. Well you know a lot of careers. There's an exit strategy whether that's you know. 401k or pension or or maybe a boxer going to get to this much money before i get punchdrunk for for you. Is that as long as i can. Go out there. I'm going to go out there or do you think five more years or maybe if i get to this amount of cash do you do even think about the you know at a transition point right now. Not right and You know my brother is more than capable and ready to take over full time driving the boat me just moving into a management position. All we which i do as well So you know i'm slowly kinda tapering back. My time at the helm and giving my brother mani more time But at the same time you know what there's nothing like the feeling of leaving town with pelota gear as a beautiful night. You're heading out for the greatest treasure on the planet. And i just you know i live for and even the bad weather i just. There's something about it. That just really keeps me energized. So you know it's gonna be a while before. I pull the plug on actually fishing but the business itself will continue to keep and manage for years. Yeah and unlike the rest of us when we fish. Are you know. Our livelihood doesn't depend on it so many times. Have you been out there. And you don't have the amount of crab you want and everything tells you you know it's too dark. It's too stormy. I need to get back and you're like just one more hour i mean. How many times have you just push the envelope like that constantly. you know. it's not just one more hour. it is sometimes. It's just trying to work in the bad weather. Really treat there at if you don't get them now could cost you twelve hours to go. Retrieve them later You know there's just there's a lot of things at times you push the envelope more than we should try to be safe. Try to understand what our limits are. Limited is basically wherever you've got to before. Don't go past that again. and I think Yeah no it's It's pretty confident every season. There's there's times we have to try and stuff that we really don't want to and then finally keith. When i think about these other skippers who i was talking about you know on the northwestern the time bandit and and what have you cornelia marie you your brethren. No one knows what it's like like you guys. It's a very small fraternity but you're also competing as well. What's that line like. Where your your friends. But you're also kind of enemies sometimes too well you know in town roll fronts But once we get on the ground then you know. The competition starts You know there's times when we'll try to help each other and work with each other but generally on have a isolation if i'd like to work by myself You know just. There's any any information you're getting better be really good or really bad but really honest and more times than not working with someone. You don't get any of that so I i try to do my own thing. And yeah there's definitely competition out there on the ground and You know that's another thing that keeps the blood swan. Great stuff from captain keith. Paul byrne deadliest catch as i mentioned seventeenth season on discovery next tuesday eight o'clock member discovery plus streaming system There as well make sure to check it out captain As i said six years in a row coming on and we really appreciate it. Best of luck and We'll talk next time all right. Hey steph curry good night last night. Oh not too bad man. All time leading score in the history of the warriors. Yeah and just throwing laser beams again. Mankind it's really fun to watch that gut shikha ball and you while your hat and you don't have to wear the bass pro shop one hour where you're at and i'm from northern california. I know you're a tall guy right. Absolutely man i grew up with the warriors fan. They were always kind of tough. You know but Sky giants niners warriors. All right. i've talked about. This is the one time. I didn't but i'm glad you got that in. Yeah all right go team. Thanks captain talk to you next time. Buddy thank you take care right. I'm rick to the will come on back on violin. Now you can make your home. Look great and save money right now. When you call renewal by anderson you can buy four windows and get the fifth one free. Plus you get twelve months with no interest. No money down. No payments upgrade your home by four windows and get the fifth one free installation and warranty or even included and the renewal by anderson certified retailers. Take every safety precaution to protect you and your family pay for twenty five years. People trusted renewal by anderson for their window. Replacement needs and you can too so call right. Now don't wait. Learn how to get your free window when you buy four. Eight hundred four one. Three six nine nine two eight hundred four one three six nine nine two. That's eight hundred. 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Three six zero zero four zero two eight seven seven three six zero four zero two eight seven seven three six zero four zero two. That's eight seven seven. Three six zero zero four zero to business heals all wounds to be looking at our relationship with germany or japan who can even remember what all the fuss was about again rick tittle. You broke my heart. But i still take you back. You hella fine. You better getting langrell. All would last one of the crab boats and the over under would be a half hour. I'd probably take under. I'd be fine leaving but as soon as everybody started screaming at each other. Yes stupid mother blank and then you go into a thirty five foot froth. I'm good you know. What else is good. Free all deep penetrating oil the original roster eater some of its most popular uses rested nuts and bolts rusty exhaust clamps and brackets fuel tank. Removal sees the engines stuck ball joints frozen. Emergency brake cables rusted machine cruise. 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We'll do it again tomorrow at nine a. m. pack tat We don't have brain damage. You're listening to the heartland. Newsfeed radio network. Markman newsfeed dot com. This stream is supported by advertisers and contributions by follow us on facebook. Twitter and instagram's resignations in minnesota. On lisa brady fox news just getting word that the police chief of brooklyn center and the officer who shot dante right during a traffic stop have both resigned. The minneapolis star tribune publishing a letter from the officer that sites the best interest of the community that she had said the officer twenty six year veteran of the force appeared to fire a gun by mistake instead of her taser and a struggle to arrest rate during a traffic stop. There have been two nights of rioting over his death in that minneapolis suburb. Some reassurance from top health officials about covid vaccine supply now that the johnson and johnson shot is on hold white house. Covert response coordinator. Jeff zionist pause and the johnson and johnson vaccine will not have a significant impact on the country's overall vaccine supply. We really have thought of this as a wartime effort from the beginning which is why we purchased excess supply so that we'd be ready for any contingency zion's patients who were scheduled to receive the j. and j. single-dose are already being rescheduled for a two-shot moderna or pfizer vaccine jared halpern at the white house. A pause and the jj shot was recommended to study a possible link to rare blood clots in six people including one who died. President trump's may first deadline for. Us troops leave. Afghanistan is postponed. President biden has chosen a significant date as the new deadline. Fox's grenell scott with this live lisa. The president according to administration sources is setting september eleventh twenty twenty one as the day. All troops should be out that day here at home the twentieth year after the deadly nine eleven attacks officials says policies based on conditions of kept us there at most one hundred thousand troops have been on the ground now only about twenty five hundred remain and nearly that many have died during america's longest ever war lisa. Thanks cornell. president plans white house remarks on that tomorrow. America's listening to fox is sensitive business data leaking from your fleet of mobile devices. It could be from devices using unsecured wifi. Maybe an unlocked. Corporate tablet was left in a coffee shop. Those leaks must be plugged now. Sodhi provides enterprise mobility management solutions to monitor control and secure your mobile devices work easy knowing the drip of lost data is shut off with silly. Visit sodhi dot net slash fox for free trial for fox news radio listeners. That's s. o. T. i dot net slash fox. Democrats in congress are pushing for debate on a new anti asian. Hate crime bill. The covid nineteen asian. Hate crimes act proposed by hawaii democratic. Senator macy hirono asks for the justice department to do expedited reviews anti-asian crimes and asked to use more culturally sensitive length in describing the pandemic senate majority leader chuck. Schumer said. this should be a bipartisan effort. The way to do that is for sixty senators to vote to proceed the legislation. I hope it'll be many more than sixty. Who would oppose this very simple but necessary legislation. It isn't clear for publicans plan to filibuster the bill. But schumer says they plan to amend it to get more. Gop support adding in other hate crime legislation that is being sponsored by a democratic and republican. Senator fox's jessica rosenthal a permit for a confederate event is denied at a park known for hosting the same groups events and others centuries. These stone mountain park's had ties to the ku klux klan and been a gathering spot for white supremacists. But this here. The stone mountain memorial sociation has rejected a request for a gathering permit from the sons of confederate veterans who will not be able to host its annual confederate memorial day service at the park outside atlanta something. The group says it son at least eighteen times before without issue the atlanta journal constitution reporting the association cited reasons such as safety concerns specifically the pandemic and tensions for denying permits the park which has the largest confederate monument ever crafted lilian. Woo fox news. Recapping the breaking news out of brooklyn center. Minnesota minneapolis suburb. Where a black man. Dante right was shot during a traffic. Stop over the weekend. Just getting word that both the officer involved and the police chief have resigned on wall street a mixed day. The dow is down one twelve brady fox news. Don't let the challenge of reading. Mobile app. stole your business. Building apps takes time special skills and a lot of money. Fortunately with sodhi snap you can unleash your inner developer by allowing you to build and deploy apps you don't need to be software developer and you don't need a lot of money with sodhi snap. You can create apps up to ten times faster than traditional methods leverage saudis. Free prototyping service visit so dot net slash fox for a free trial for fox news radio listeners. That's s. o. T. i dot net slash fox. You're the look at weather from the heartland news feed weather center. Tuesday scattered showers morning. Otherwise mostly sunny with a high near six one tuesday night mostly cloudy with a low around forty wednesday sunny with a high near fifty six. That's the latest weather. Check out more news and weather on our website at heartland news dot com been one. That's eight hundred four one. Oh forty seven. Seventy one from san francisco. I'm a sports byline broadcasting network. You're listening to wrestling observer. Live with your hosts bryan alvarez and mike let's get it let's get it mike semper v. here with you for the next hour talking professional wrestling and mixed martial arts. Which is something bryan alvarez. And i do every single day right here seven days a week. And however you're joining me today tune in iheart american forces radio over the air affiliates like the mightier ten ninety sports byline dot com sirius. Xm be podcast or streaming video. Live for the homeys here. Twitch dot tv backslash f. george w video won't say. Thank you for giving me a little bit of your time today. Bryan alvarez didn't have any time for you today. I don't know where brian is. I don't believe he's at the beach. Although if you heard yesterday show you would have known that it is going to be in the eighties around his locale. He had taken off the shawl he usually wears and put on the muscle shirt gave us a little bit of a flex at the end of the show yesterday. That scared children nationwide. That's okay. Brian is going to be back tomorrow. And i have a feeling that he didn't do the show today because well he just can't hold it in. He was going to pick up a couple of fcc fines today. It's possible possible. Ice still might raw was last night and it was not could it. It was not good at all. It was very very bad. It was very very bad. The day after wrestlemainia. And it's not like it wasn't a show without some focus. They know where they're going with some of these things. At least they they do right now but there are a whole lot of low points last night and a whole lot of head scratching decisions. That were made. That just didn't make any sense but we'll get into all of those the wednesday night words are over. I'll give you the card for exte- tonight a gesture. Dvr's who accordingly if they don't do it for you already and we're out of the mud of battling over the ratings. Every single wednesday will know it annexed. He does before e w begins and we'll have. Aws run down to the dynamite card coming up here in a little bit as well to plus your phone calls and video different number two days. We're using the sports byline studios we're gonna make dom were probably opened those up in the second segment but when we get back you know the topic. Monday night raw. Trust relied cleaning. Your fuel system can make your car run better and improve gas. Mileage visit o'reilly auto parts and pick up a bottle of chevron tech ron fuel system cleaner and added to your tank during your next fill up on sale. Now buy one get one free at o'reilly auto parts stop by and talk to our professional parts. People today or visit o'reilly auto dot com auto parts. I am a non-attorney spokesperson representing a team of lawyers. Who helped people that have been injured or wronged. Have you been diagnosed with cancer. Are you one of the millions who have taken zantac or other generic versions of this popular to help treat stomach issues then. Pay close attention to this message. They fda said it detected low levels of cancer causing chemical known as andy ama in zantac and other generic forms. This popular drug. They've banned sales and even removed it from the market. If you've been diagnosed with cancer and you've taken zantac origin eric equivalent. Call the legal helpline. Now you could receive a free cash award and have your medical expenses covered and there's no upfront cost to you. They only get paid. If you win so please call now. Eight hundred two five one seven four six zero eight hundred two five one seven four six. Oh eight hundred. Two five one seven four six. That's eight hundred. Two five one seventy four sixty. I'm ron bar all mine. My body now tells me one enough is enough. And i've done too much. Did you know one hundred million. Americans suffer from ongoing pain. Due to aging exercise overexertion and the effects of everyday living i wanna recommend relief factor to relief factor can help all those body parts that are hurting source such as neck and shoulder back hip or knee or just general. Muscle aches and pains. Here's what i recommend. Go to relieffactor dot com to find out. More and relief factor has something special for the sports byline usa network listeners. You can get their three week. Quick start programme for just nineteen ninety five. That's ninety five cents a day so give them a call at eight hundred five hundred eighty three eighty four. That's eight hundred five hundred. Eighty three eighty four are check it out at relieffactor dot com. Stop wasting your time. Struggling to loosen. Rusted nuts and bolts. Start using free all deep penetrating oil free. All spreads deep into rusted or frozen parts to help release tough bolts and washers. Its formula delivers three times. More lubricant. that means less sprays less tour and less time than any other penetrating oil on the market. It's even silicone. Free professionals have trusted free all deep penetrating oil for over forty years. Now it's your turn yet free all today at autozone o'reilly and napa look for the silver plan. You're listening to wrestling. Observer live with bryan alvarez and mike semper. Vv on the sports byline broadcasting network. Likes them for the year with your wrestling. Observer live seven days a week for an hour. Time listing along twenty four. Seven can't have me but the easiest access to try to get to me that way would be through my twitter at semper. Vv the timeline. For this show ad. W f four w broadcast or at sports byline usa a and if you love per wrestling mid atlantic pod if you love bryan alvarez. It's bryan with a y. Bryan alvarez he'll be back alongside with me tomorrow and he'll still have something to rant about. There was there was plenty of raw last night to rant about and i don't know when he made the decision to not do the show. Today i woke up about twenty minutes before the show started. Had no idea to. You're doing the show today. And i went okay. I didn't have any caffeine to go out. Run out and buy that so here. S markets. I had nothing planned because i honestly thought much like every other tuesday we would begin the show. Brian would do the intro. We'd go to break. We come back like we are right now and for the next ten minutes for all you twitch homes out there who are watching right now or watching later on our youtube channel. This is how. I thought. I was going to be for not only ten minutes but the three minutes we'd have after the segment. I'd have nothing to say. Why because brian would be ranting this whole time about the hideous show that we had last night but now it's me and i don't know what to say about that show it's Let's start with adnan. Virk and in virk is very good at what he does at virk has been working for. Espn for years. You worked for the maple leaf sports and entertainment network before that. Oh by the way for wrestling fans who may have been in a in a bubble last night adnan. Virk is the new play by play announcer for monday night raw. He is a very very talented Sports announcer you did very well with their baseball coverage. In fact now he works for the mlb network also works for zone. He's very good in sports. He was not good last night. And i don't blame. Mr daul much like when mike adam league out there. It's like when they throw in other people in that position. What do you want this guy to do. He's a big wrestling fan. But he's got a job he's got a family he probably is not into this the same way that all of you out there listening are but he was probably thrown a bunch of money. Thought this is going to be really cool. Let me give it a shot. And he was thrown out there to the wolves last night. And hey look. If you're a professional you can make a. You can make a quick improvement. But i don't know how you can make a quick improvement in memorize as many moves as this gentleman is going to need to memorize because there were times last night where. I'm not even sure if he knew. What a superplex was and this is not meant to to bury an advert. It's meant to be very the fact that they threw him out there in that position to start the show the day after wrestlemainia. You know a new start a new fresh Revival and i understand that the season begins in september for the fall tv season. I get that but like this was going to be a fresh start. It's kinda like with brian. bitched about with bobby. Lashley getting the victory over drew and you start the show and that type away where you have. The he'll going over you know at this time where you know. You're introducing this stuff to peacock. And he pointed it out also about alexa bliss and all that stuff with bray. White and randy orton. Is that really how you wanna start. The show is this how you wanna present yourself. And it wasn't anywhere near the level of brian's ranting about that when he comes to to adnan virk foot just it just was crazy just seem to be a crazy move made for god knows what reason. We still don't even know why other than they want. Tom phillips deduce more other things for for peacock and they have a big name. I guess corey graves back there. I think that's a good thing. I like corey graves alive. I know a lot of people. Don't but i don't care i don't care. You can think corey games as a prick you can think he's a terrible person. Has awful takes whatever. He does a great job being fed the stuff that they feed him and he regurgitates it out in the best possible way. Look at everybody else. Who's gone through there with dasa and renee young on commentary. Unfortunately for a lot of other people byron you know is good and he's going to be desperately relied on to to help adnan virk along. Fire in is byron. Unfortunately they want him to play the fool's role in that's what he does. And that's enough about that. i guess it was just. I was really surprised. Because i thought i didn't expect to be moral. You know and have that kind of you know knowledge or that type of excitement or anything like that but it was a tough one you know and then the show begins with matt riddle looking an idiot again and i know everybody goes will matt riddle. Ed vince mcmahon things. Matt riddle is funny. Vince mcmahon also when he stops thinking something is funny or he stops being interested in it drops. It like a rock. And that's what. Bobby lashley did matt riddle last night. Dropped him like a rock in the opening segment before we even get started we go into a match with the two of them and it goes for ten minutes and it's a glorified squash match. Were matt riddle. Got a couple of moves in at the end before he got hurt locked in laid out. And that's that. I don't know what you can do with matt riddle right now and i know look. He's is believable. When he's in there shame as i talked about it yesterday but like how you have have made this character in. How can anybody cheer this guy. How can anybody support this guy by. Just being goof and then being a goofy usually gets beat up. It's just terrible. The viking raiders. Come back. that's good. Unfortunately shelton benjamin cedric alexander. Were on the other half of that match. And they didn't get any entraces. They look to be gone as far as being something that vince interested in. You know maybe we'll see them chasing around The truth in new characters our for the twenty four seven title. Then we get oscar saying. She's she's ready for her rematch. She gets a rematch tonight. Even though there's no automatic rematches she gets a rematch. Tonight with rhea ripley cool. Then charlie flare comes back and this is how we end the first hour basically with with charlotte flare coming back and cutting a somewhat perplexing promo on a perplexing night. She complained about the fact that she was wasn't on wrestlemainia because oscar needed a partner member that to go after the tag titles that that that did happen then she completed better dad being foolish legends night which he was and then complained about lacey. Getting pregnant all those things happened. In odds are she was going to face lacey evans at wrestlemainia but like that was done in over with and then she had challenged osco but they said oscar didn't take her challenge in and ria slipped in there and she stole the match. And that's why that'