18 Burst results for "Josh Barro"

"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

KCRW

01:32 min | 2 years ago

"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

"Actress Regina hall from scary movie girls trip and now black Mondays here next on press point I'm Josh barro today on all the president's lawyers the idea that people file lots of dumb lawsuits all the time it seems slightly different for the federal government to be filing the dumb lawsuit you know this isn't just a trump is personal capacity filing some done lost it still seems like a remarkable reach to use the government in that manner well Josh is in a federal criminal defense attorney I would have to disagree with you that the federal government doesn't file dumb lawsuits they do that's today at one thirty only on KCRW this is pressed play on KCRW I'm Alan bramble fans of the spoof comedy scary movie one two three and four you know and love Regina hall is Brenda it's a roll hall says she was told not to take because Brenda read like Hollywood's stereotypical black female character I look over and there was your girl getting **** by having the jacuzzi Sarah we the answer is the modem security guard security can get you backstage but that role ultimately pave the way for hall to do a string of rom coms including the successful girls trip where she showed off her serious side my husband is having an affair when I first found out I well I felt a lot of things the trail anger.

Regina hall Josh barro president attorney KCRW Brenda Hollywood Sarah Alan bramble
"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

KCRW

06:43 min | 2 years ago

"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

"You're listening to KCRW in this is Josh barro we're socially distance right now but that doesn't mean we need emotional distance from our friends and loved ones reach out and touch someone not physically fight loneliness make that phone call he well and stay tuned to KCRW it's three oh seven four is owning a decision from NPR news I'm Rachel Martin and I'm no well king good morning George Floyd's brother Thelonious Floyd is asking Congress to pass laws that will ensure his brother did not die for nothing on the joints and make the necessary changes that make Blom force but the solution and not the problem hold them accountable when they do something wrong he's still what it means to treat people with empathy and respect Mr Floyd was speaking at a house hearing yesterday house Democrats have now released their proposals for police reform and a group of Senate Republicans is crafting their own plan senator James Lankford of Oklahoma is part of that team he's on the line with me now good morning senator good morning to you so what specific policy changes will be in the Republican police reform package where most players and transparency actually lines up extremely well with what George Ford brother was talking about on Capitol Hill the house hearing yesterday trying to work through the process of how do we get more information out read greater transparency for law enforcement and to actually get some areas where we don't have equal justice exposed about me give some examples of a section called the George Ford Walter Scott notification act this provides transparency in the time that there's a deadly use of force that that information will come out about forty percent of the departments around the country already provide this information we want to make sure all of them provide this information that data helps everyone to be able to see it we have the brought a tailor notification act which some of this try to get information out on no knock warrants we know that they're used another appropriate at times but we don't have a good tracking of information on this one of the years in talking with black law enforcement that I've had the conversation on multiple times has come out but they're not enough African American recruiters for law enforcement and that many of the big city departments they don't match the ethnicity of the community and also one things reading is grants to increase recruiting for the African American community women also included in that and then to make sure that the departments match the ethnicity of the actual community increasing funding for body cameras and successful important include including adding penalties when body cameras are worn but not actually turned on that's been an issue as well at times it body cameras sometimes quote unquote malfunction or they're not turning on at certain times we want to make sure there's some accountability and that record breath preservation is another area if a police officer moves from one department to another apartment we want to make sure the records good and bad have been kept on that officer and so the next which department can get access to all of the records for someone as they transition justice for victims of lynching act this is been something Congress has talked about for several congresses now is either passed the house or the Senate or different versions about the house and Senate how we want to make sure this gets done you are talking about a great number of reforms there which makes me wonder do you believe that the U. S. policing system is inherently racist and if you do is what you are essentially calling for here and overhauled rather than just a few reforms I don't know it I would I would not say that police officers are systemically racist this is been a big conversation that we had around the country lately to me calling all police officers are all police departments racist is like calling all protesters writers there are some writers that are in the middle of some peaceful protesters that are frustrated there are some police officers that are bad apples in the middle of some police departments and those police officers are frustrated that they've got some bad apples in the mix as well so part of what we're focused on is how to be greater training how do we work through better transparency so we can expose individuals that are in the middle of good police departments among good officers that really do want to serve and protect the community that are working very hard and we are grateful for the work that they're doing but that those officers also get frustrated when someone commits a murder clearly as a police officer where does a racist act and also that this is one of those issues that we can't paint all protesters with a broad brush for paintball police officers with a broad brush we've got to be able to people as individuals it's one of the major aspects of the democratic proposal is an end to qualified immunity that it is a legal doctrine that protects police officers from civil lawsuits do you agree that qualified immunity should and I do not actually in the one of the areas that becomes a difficulty because you've got good police officers that make very difficult decisions and rapid pace so we've got to find a way to have greater conversation about how do we hold police officers accountable but we can see even the situation that happen with George Ford within hours those officers were fired and as they work through the criminal justice system being held to account so you can hold people to account if you have a body camera footage there you have the details you have records that are coming out there are other ways to be able to do this with your second yeah I would note that the original police right up on Mr Floyd's death or killing was completely inaccurate and it was because of a girl a seventeen year old girl was recording it that we have that video not because of body cam so I think when when people talk about ending qualified immunity it's that kind of thing that they're really after I'm very quickly last use okay understand that that's why we're trying to increase the use of body cameras so we can get more footage and get every situation and not have to count on a bystander to take that in the seconds we have left are you having discussions with your democratic colleagues are you getting anywhere essentially yeah we've had great conversations we have a proposal to be able to use the museum of African American history for greater use in training and they do some great training there for law enforcement here in the Washington DC area would like to be able to spread that out nationwide and we're having great conversations with that and other areas with our democratic colleagues we should be able to solve this together again senator James Lankford of Oklahoma thank you thank you West Virginia has announced it will be the first state to allow visitors back into nursing homes beginning next week across the country visitors have been banned for three months because of the pandemic that ban has meant family members have had to make do with window visits and video chats and some have seen a serious decline in the health of.

KCRW Josh barro
"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

KCRW

05:33 min | 2 years ago

"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

"In this is Josh barro on left right and centre we talk about being civilized that means being thoughtful in your words and actions especially at the grocery store it means being kind to one another looking out for the common good and fighting this virus together the weld stay tuned KCRW it is three twenty nine here at KCRW thanks so much for being with us up ahead on All Things Considered America's crisis centers and hotlines are not only seeing spikes in call and text volumes the problems people reach out with now are also much more complex than before the pandemic ahead how the pandemic has changed the equation about where to send people who need medical help later while most of the countries under walked down the U. S. military continues its operations a trip to continue their training in the airforce keeps delivering supplies worldwide during this pandemic more on what has been said has been considered by some to be life during wartime will have that story for you and in state and local news coming up at three thirty two how some criminals may be exploiting the new cash bail policy in the state that more after this from NPR live from NPR news in Washington I'm Louise Schiavone the re opening of business across New York will depend upon the state's ability to test for covert nineteen and undertake contact tracing and P. R.'s Hansi lo Wong tells us New York City is eager to make that happen with public testing step to started all of the city's public hospitals next week New York City mayor bill de Blasio says cove in nineteen testing at public hospitals will prioritize seniors and people with underlying medical conditions testing is how we get out of widespread transmission of the coronavirus and on to the next phase well we can start to get life back to normal testing is key to everything your city is going to increase the number weekly test of forty three thousand test by mid may the mayor says testing labs need federal resources to handle more this is still the biggest missing link lab capacity and the products that go into the lab process like the reagents cities also giving out free face coverings in parks where city workers are trying to enforce social distancing on you along and your news New York as of tomorrow in Georgia the governor shelter in place order will be lifted social distancing requirements and bans on large gatherings remain in place the state's elderly and medically fragile in order to stay home till June twelfth in Orange County California beaches have been told to close by order of the governor other California beaches may remain open but with restrictions more than thirty five hundred inmates in Ohio's prisons have tested positive for the corona virus from member station W. O. S. U. Paige Pfleger reports no other state has reported as many cases of covert nineteen behind bars as Ohio in large part because state authorities say no other states have tested as many inmates as Ohio has eighty percent of one prison facility tested positive and activists say it not enough was done to slow the spread Paige Pfleger reporting Wall Street the Dow closed down two hundred eighty eight points this is NPR news San on Thursday April thirtieth on Larry pearl this is Casey R. W. here's what's happening at three thirty two what could give some felons a break in late March when it eliminated cash bail during the corona virus pandemic California expanded statewide this month that was done to minimize the number of people coming and going from jails and possibly spreading the virus but it seems some criminals are exploiting that policy as KCRW's Carole saxman reports judging by arrests crime is way down in Los Angeles and stay at home orders took effect with one exception repeat offenders the LAPD says it arrested more than two hundred people multiple times within a month of this year about policy taking effect one man was picked up four times for Grand Theft Auto in less than thirty days and another was arrested six times including once for brandishing a weapon that's according to review of arrest records by the LA times police chief Michael Moore is now calling for a re examination of the zero bail policy saying that career criminals are being arrested over and over with no real consequences district attorney Jackie Lacey who endorsed the move to zero pale says it's unfortunate that a few defendants are taking advantage of a public health measure California court officials implemented these zero bill policy after governor Newsom declared a state of emergency over the corona virus a global team of scientists led by doctors at UC San Francisco say they've made some breakthroughs that could lead to a possible treatment for COPD nineteen doctors say they've discovered a patchwork of existing drugs and experimental compounds that appear to block the novel coronavirus in lab tests in a paper released today in the journal nature the scientists detail how they tested forty seven drug candidates five showed an antiviral effect San Francisco Chronicle reports the substances already have FDA approval and are typically used to treat everything from menopause to malaria the director of the study at UCSF says human clinical trials of the five substances on people with covered nineteen will start soon governor Newsom has a starring role in a new political after president trump's re election campaign every time I've called the president he's quickly got on the line well we asked to get support for for that mercy chefs and southern California he was able to direct that in real time Newsome has been a vocal critic of the president especially over immigration and environmental issues but his tone has softened during the corona virus pandemic and he has praised the president on occasion for help delivering resources to California to fight the virus the clip you just heard came from an interview with CNN earlier this month this online and from the trump campaign features a string of sound bites from Newsome and other.

Josh barro
"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

KCRW

02:46 min | 2 years ago

"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

"Got a brand new bag and classic prince let's go crazy by requesting officer little he did everything yeah so I'm agenda that would you to Levin and then more music on a collective twenty four coming up brand you know Laura Marling also the latest in the strokes south Pasadena's own Phoebe Bridgers a new single from smiles Davis and tons more on twenty four stay tuned to music during the rona rotation right here on KCRW's it's KCRW in this is moments of serenity with me Garth Trinidad one reliable way to feel good it's taking three long deep breaths read in reading read out read be well stay tuned to KCRW hi it's Josh barro host of left right and center there's a lot of noise in the news right now and a lot of noise on the news but for nearly twenty five years left right and centre St civilized yet provocative no matter listen to me in the center rich Lowry on the right and Liz pruning on the left as we talk over the most important issues every week from every angle we don't fight too much you don't waste your time we're here for you every Friday at one and seven PM or wherever you listen to podcasts.

officer Levin Laura Marling Pasadena Phoebe Bridgers KCRW Liz Davis Garth Trinidad Josh barro
"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

KCRW

02:24 min | 2 years ago

"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

"The bill withers albums in a much shorter run than a lot of his contemporaries but you know it lasted a little over a decade you can put his top five which we kind of ran through in this first said no sunshine use me lovely day just the two of us and lean on me you can put its top five up against just virtually anybody we've got some deeper bill withers cuts coming up well some covers he knows and he knows he knows G. we one thing they know send the dark meaning NO sense any she goes any you go she's got more bill withers ahead plus will be sprinkling in some new tracks from Frank ocean JG chromatics thundercat and more stay tuned it's KCRW hi it's Josh barro host of left right and center there's a lot of noise in the news right now and a lot of noise on the news but for nearly twenty five years left right and centre St civilized yet provocative no matter the listen to me in the center rich Lowry on the right and Liz pruning on the left as we talk.

G. Liz KCRW Josh barro
"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

KCRW

01:49 min | 2 years ago

"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

"KCRW in this is Josh barro shopping is different right now but our food supply chain is intact thanks to farmers truckers in grocery workers staying on the job through this crisis say thanks when you shop and don't buy more than you need they'll keep restocking fee well and stay tuned KCRW forty four twenty nine here at KCRW my name's Leri parole thanks for joining us on this Friday afternoon here's what's coming up on All Things Considered for weeks Olympics officials have maintained that the Tokyo games will be held as scheduled as other sports leagues cancel competitions athletes are training even though the games may not happen they held a symbolic torch lighting the other day which appeared strangely hollow we'll have more on that story so as the economy takes a hit who gets a bailout Congress is forming plans to rescue businesses hit hard by the effects of the corona virus outbreak just as it did during the two thousand eight financial crisis state local news at four thirty two why finding out if you have the corona virus could be a case of have and have nots when it comes to testing more on that after this from NPR live from NPR news in Washington I'm Louise Schiavone it was another painful day for the U. S. stock market as Americans finish their first full week of hunkering down against the corona virus and P. R. Scott Horsley reports the Dow fell more than nine hundred points or four and a half percent the Dow fell back below twenty thousand and is now almost three percent lower than it was when president trump took office as public health officials urge Americans to stay close to home and avoid restaurants bars and retail shops the US economy is slamming the brakes like never before forecasters at Goldman Sachs say they expect the economy to shrink at an annual rate of twenty four percent in the next three months that's worse than anything we saw in the Great Recession after years of low unemployment the jobless rates expected to climb rapidly but forecasters say it we could also see a.

US president Tokyo Olympics Leri Goldman Sachs KCRW trump P. R. Scott Horsley Louise Schiavone Washington NPR Congress
"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

KCRW

11:18 min | 2 years ago

"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

"We heard that he's here to take it off our hands particles and all turned into great public we did have some amazing times on that but when the weather cooperated would listen the case here every single day so do it we do don't your boat or car or whatever com slash cars welcome back left right and centre I'm Josh barro your center and business columnist at New York magazine on the right is rich Lowry editor of National Review on the left is Elizabeth Bruenig promised at the New York times it's the second week of March and this was the week that almost everyone came to realize how dire the corona virus crisis is according to scenarios presented by the centers for disease control and others it's plausible the death count in United States could even go into the seven figures depending on how deadly the virus turns out to be and how effective our social and medical responses to it are the president is finally mostly stop saying this is under control in fact on Friday afternoon he declared a national emergency Italy is an absolute nightmare with the health care system that is completely overwhelmed in a death rate that is elevated because some patients cannot get the care that they need to live other countries like South Korea or doing a lot better they appear to be getting a handle on their outbreak but they have capabilities that we do not including widespread testing that makes it possible to identify and isolate people who have the virus on Sunday South Korea has been running about as many corona virus tests as we have run in total the United States since the start of this crisis state and local governments are taking action here in many cases closing schools in banning public gatherings individual citizens are increasing their vigilance to avoid getting or transmitting the infection but this situation is very scary and it's also in raging watching our federal government fumbled its response and our president transparently demonstrate that is key concern is what the resulting stock market declines will do to his reelection chances this crisis is going to be the key topic for our show today we will also be looking at key developments the democratic presidential primary and I should note like many of you this crisis has changed the way that we are working at left right and center our panelists are taping the show from home I'm still in the studio for now modern recording technology is a wonderful thing and I think you'll find the sound quality sounds pretty similar to what you're used to but please bear with us if things are a little different and to talk about the corona virus crisis were also joined today by Samuel Brannan Sam is senior fellow and director of the risk and foresight group at the center for strategic and International Studies and he's a former policy planner with the department of defense hello Sam hi Josh so as you've been watching the elements this week Sam has public perception now caught up to reality yes it has there was a real lag in the sense that unlike the kind of crises that we have experience in our lifetime before say the nine eleven attacks this is something that gathers overtime minutes invisible until it's sort of overwhelms the system but I think the images that we started getting out of Italy were somehow less abstract than what we've what we've seen in in China earlier in the year and suddenly leaders at all levels seem to be making decisions about the seriousness that experts and scientists have long told us we should associate with this outbreak and so have we had that realization early enough in your view because I mean you talk about the hidden nature of this the problem is that you know once you're in the situation like Italy with you know so with hospitals overwhelmed and so many people dying around you you also have a lot of people who have been infected or not that sick yet but will be in the near future it's sort of a it projects a system that is going to be even more overwhelmed than it is already have we have we made that jump early enough in the United States to get ahead of it Josh we haven't and there are a couple of reasons for that the first is that the United States government and working with state and local officials have struggled to get out the amount of testing that we needed to do to get a clear picture of what the threat is on the ground there were some mistakes made early on just at a technical level there some regulatory challenges the White House tells us that those have now been overcome but the reality is that when you look at the level of testing that say South Korea was able to quickly deploy when they first had cases that emerge there they've had more recent experiences without breaks with sars and mers which didn't hit the United States that might have been the reason why politically they moved so quickly but in this case you've also had another challenge which is the White House politicizing what really was a public health use on the one hand you had real experts like Dr Anthony Fauci out there who have from day one been warning that this is a a real pandemic that it's gonna cause a real challenge to us and the White House has largely been trying to downplay that we you had the president accusing the media of of creating a hoax environment I think what really might have gotten the attention the White House this week was the remarkable market reaction where the market simply the bottom seemed to fall out earlier this week there was a loss of confidence there were concerns about liquidity in the bond market in the corporate credit market and suddenly you had the federal reserve leading one and a half trillion dollars loose into the financial system and you have the public health crisis response that we've been waiting for happening now which included the travel ban from many European countries excluding the U. K. N. in theory seems to be accelerating testing and some of these other sticking point issues Richard are you angry about the way that the president has responded to this I mean when we look at at the time table and you know in January him not really wanting to be briefed on it you know it's H. I. secretary Alec kids are trying to reach brief him on it and he wants to talk about vaping then when he does talk about any sort of saying these things that are that are that are false about the you know that we have this under control that there's testing available to whoever wants it saying that you know the that the stock market is just reacting to the fake media and urging people to go out and buy stocks and his his response it turns has been has been dilettante issue has been counterproductive has been dishonest and it seems to me that has that has really important real world consequences in terms of the tone that's set for how his government is going to respond to this and also among the public really downplaying for weeks the need to to take steps to prevent the spread of this infection the president has changed his tone somewhat this week but it's it's outrageous to me how late that is yeah that the statements have been irresponsible all you need to know about the way he regard this least up to now was his press availability down at CDC where he said he didn't want the the cruise ship where people are affected come on shore because it the numbers would go off track itself it does those people are sick or not are are sick whether they're here or not and actually contributing to the numbers of the people who are ill on our shores and they're Americans one way or the other so just show that he consider this that at a certain level personal front he's obviously been terrified all along about the market the fact is we talked about last week really took the approach of trying to minimize it and orders to try to talk up the market which was the exactly are wrong approach just in terms of public health and also in terms of trying to reassure the markets because ultimately the markets are gonna recover until we get a handle on this and we've we've lost some crucial first steps in terms of doing that now we also discussed last week I don't think you know he's responsible for the reagents being contaminated these initial initial CDC test you also just had a lot of peta fogging bureaucracy at the FDA The New York Times ran a maddening piece this week about and it fit a research project in Seattle that had a test for the corona virus and they want to start testing people in the DA I said no repeatedly and set up every kind of a road block in keeping with rules you know they're on the books but obviously didn't make sense and a crisis so you want the president to be bearing down on that you need to be asking every day okay you know we're only testing fifty people a day here and there doing ten thousand that South Korea why is that and how can we make that better and he was so but I don't excuse anything he said or done or any failures at that the CDC or the FDA but this this is kind of I think we're gonna see a characteristic American way of dealing with crises where we can't mess it up and scramble around at the beginning and then we end up throwing massive resources and technological innovation added and in getting it right at the end now that doesn't make up for that in the next couple weeks here we we should have more testing but there's news that test has been approved that has resulted in a ten times faster than anything than we have so I think we're gonna get our arms around it but it's it's it's gonna be rocky and certainly isn't very rocky here at the beginning Liz I I can you talk a little bit about some personal experience you've had around testing for this virus yes so I was in Detroit reporting on the Sanders campaign and as it turned out I was in the same hotel as Utah Jazz they were playing the Detroit Pistons of my closest brush with greatness yet and shared an elevator a couple times with you know groups of players and and then it turned out that a couple of players nineteen have tested positive for coronavirus based on that the NBA suspended their season when I got back to my home here in Washington DC I was sick but but not you know horribly sick I would say it's like a four on the one to ten scale of colds an email considering everything that had happened I I called my doctor told them about the the history of a and they said well you know how high has your fever gotten I said I have no idea and take my own temperature the I know when I have a fever it feels like a fever but I don't go around documenting my own health stats I mean you know I'm a of got kids it's not really important what my temperature is I'm not considering whether or not to keep myself out of school and so they said it you know well then we can't we can't give you a test because we can only give you a test if you've met these specific criteria so here we are I have a mild cold my kids have a cold my husband has the same cold and and so we're we're just kind of sheltering in place here so I mean I mean same to that point Liz does not sound like one of the most you know acute possible suspected coronavirus cases in the United States right now but presumably if we had an extremely robust testing capability it would be like a lot of other things and if you had you know even a relatively low level of suspicion you'd be able to go to test instead the the government that there has been extreme rationing of these tests because they're very narrow availability it took to what rich was saying there do you have a sense of you know how that went so wrong and how quickly can be turned around and rich is saying you know we're going to get a handle on this but the the problem an epidemic like this it seems to me that being a few weeks late with the availability of the test is extremely important even if you know even if you actually do have plenty of them it's sort of a date in a way it's too late because you had uncontrolled spread of of the infection for that period when you were failing to identify who had it yeah I I it did it's a failure there's there's no other way to put it and that is is what now in three felt she is is going around telling people and it's something that the administration has had to fess up to they said they fixed it but that it was a failure but have they fixed it yet I mean I'm still seeing news reports day today about the difficulty of getting it now maybe maybe.

Josh barro New York magazine
"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

KCRW

02:40 min | 2 years ago

"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

"Some new from the mill the album recently released called cages sunlight automatic give us you know a lot about what's on the other one on top of the set new jungle fire okay model right surely Scott sure shot this is the best coming up some new from thunder cat free nationals with six in a single from black space and then once you got past the Jones so if you months all this music center Hey it's Josh barro it's crunch.

Jones Josh barro Scott
"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

KCRW

11:08 min | 2 years ago

"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

"At all no collision well he was a lawyer for me for one of many I I you know they they would say the lawyer and then they like to add the fiction well I don't know a fixture I already know you started yesterday that is correct right I understood Michael going very well he what turned out he was in a very good lawyer frankly so so this is Josh barro host of KCRW's left right and center listening to all the president's lawyers the podcast about president trump's legal issues and can white is with me can as my co host a criminal defense attorney and former federal prosecutor anti blogs oppo Pat dot com hello can hello Josh it's been an eventful week of course the impeachment trial of president trump has been ongoing but the biggest trial developments have arguably occurred outside the Senate chamber The New York Times has reported on the contents of John Bolton's forthcoming tell all book Bolton of course is the former national security adviser among other claims the book says that the president told Bolton he wanted military aid to Ukraine with held until Ukraine would probe Joan hunter Biden that contradicts the president's claims that he would help the aid for other reasons to do with his general suspicion of foreign aid and his broad concerns about corruption in Ukraine but the Senate may not hear about this from bold as we tape senators are asking questions of the house managers of the president's lawyers will be done without on Thursday and then the Senate will vote on whether to call any witnesses at all news reports on Thursday had senators on both sides of the aisle increasingly confident the Republican majority would hold together and reject the proposition of additional witnesses including Bolton can let's start with what we are hearing in the trial obviously one of the key questions that they are getting at here is whether any quid pro quo regarding Ukraine was a corrupt quid pro quo when can the president ask a foreign country to do something to the president do so in a way that was so improperly deserves to be removed from office and I gather that Alan Dershowitz who's one of the attorneys representing the president said basically the president can ask for anything that he sees is enhancing his chances of reelection and so long as the president believes that would be in the national interest for him to be reelected that's okay it's not a misuse of government resources to make that ask I I wish I could say that was an exaggeration but if anything it's under playing what he said this was the modern equivalent of president Nixon's famous if the president does it it's not illegal in the context of talking about whether or not president trump could for the reason that he warned aid his own reelection ask for this quid pro quo professor Dershowitz said very clearly that if he thinks his reelection is best for the country then that is not impeachable even if he asks for a quid pro quo the president's defenders have shifted noticeably from attacking the concept that there was a quid pro quo which seems like a truly lost because over to suggesting that it doesn't matter if it was of quid pro quo or a related argument somewhat softer the argument that if the president had mixed motives if partly he was interested in investigating corruption but also interested Jill is electoral chances that that's acceptable in not impeachable so basically I mean you you talk about the two possible defenses there the president didn't do this or so what if he did do it and they're moving toward the so what the fans I feel like there's a third unspoken defense mostly unspoken we haven't been hearing in the Senate but we we got it actually from secretary of state Mike Pompeii in his blow up with NPR reporter Mary Louise Kelley where she asked him some questions about Ukraine and ambassador Maria von of itch that he didn't like and one of the things that Pompey said to Callie off of off recording is do you think Americans care about Ukraine and so I mean I I guess the third possibility here for why you wouldn't remove the president is is not that he didn't do this and not that he was allowed to do it but so what if he did it who cares it may be against the rules but because Ukraine is unimportant to America's interests and concerns why would we care if the president acted in a proper manner with regard to Ukraine well that seems to be the subtext of the arguments that we ought to let the voters decide that we should impeach someone for misconduct when there's election coming up so soon but it seems to me Josh that Ching it is about how important a Ukraine is has it completely wrong the issue is it just that the president was extorting abusing Ukraine the issue is that he was attempting to use a foreign power to harassing disadvantage of political point here in the United States that he was it a fact impeding a fair election here by using his power over another country so doesn't you know whether he did that with Ukraine Liechtensteiner whatever it doesn't come into it it's the impact here I think that's important is that precisely the charge though I mean what when you when we say that the president abused his power isn't it isn't that he was taking something of value which is to say the foreign policy United States and using it toward his own personal purposes they're gonna go for the who cares defense it seems like a key question there is how valuable was this thing really the foreign policy the United States it was incidental to the concerns of Americans what he did with the foreign policy with regard to Ukraine and you know maybe it's you know maybe it's like stealing the coat hangers from your hotel room you know you're it's illegal you're not supposed to do it but who cares well but it's not only just the using the power it's the end for which he's using the power it's the what is the personal benefit and I think here the argument is that the personal benefit benefit is fundamentally corrupt that he's using the power through this cut out of Ukraine to attack someone he's running against a that that undermines legitimacy of our elections it's not explicitly spelled out that way in the impeachment can't but that's been in the house managers presentations through a lot of this the notion that there's a terrible spectre of the executive being able to six foreign powers on their opponents using the might of the United States to make them do it so when we think about the president's culpability here at as hinging on his motivation did he think that he was doing this for a genuine national interest purpose or was he doing this for a personal purpose that seems like where John Bolton's testimony would be likely to be really relevant I mean Bolton says that the day that he was told something by the president about why he was withholding the aid that is contrary to to the defense that has been made of him so it seems like you know that what one thing we talked about last week was how what we've been hearing over the last few days were opening statements in this trial but they're really of a different nature than the opening statements he would have in a criminal trial much longer with much more content to them content that is based upon witness testimony that was delivered in the house so I guess my question is you know the it is this trial really incomplete without John Bolton's testimony and are there any other witnesses with it without whom this trial is incomplete as the senators look back on what they have heard over the last week and a half we you're right it's completely unlike a normal opening statement it more resembles a closing statement in a trial where you get to marshal all the evidence that's come before and argue to the decider fact how they should come out of but if the that question of whether or not any witnesses are essential is definitely the Senate's to decide I think every indication is that they're going to decide it's not by the typical fifty three to forty seven vote and I think that the way that they are going to spend it is that these witnesses don't matter because even in you know the scenario most deferring to the house managers argument it doesn't matter because he had mixed motives and that's okay or because a quid pro quo is not impeachable or whatever it's going to be I certainly think if you cared about what the truth was here if you cared about what the president did you would want to hear from Bolton and several other people at least but this does have a parallel to some questions you would have in a regular criminal trial right where like you know the question is do you have a dispute a fax or do you have a dispute over the law and so if you know the if if the question is you know the here are some things the president could have done that would that would be removable here are some other things that would not of been removal we need to know exactly what he did what his motivations were for it but if you buy the Dershowitz argument or or something closely related to it then maybe John Bolton's testimony doesn't matter right because it doesn't you know with the additional information on the president's motivations is not material to the question of whether you would remove him or not well sure if you buy Dershowitz's argument to the entire house manager presentation is completely irrelevant because his his rather startlingly broad pronouncement is that if the president thinks that his reelection is in the nation's interest than no quid pro quo that he might put together is impeachable so it does become a role that it does become suitable for a motion to dismiss but I would be surprised if many of the senators were really comfortable openly embracing a position that extreme and it would be hard to imagine many of them liking that shoe being on the other foot with the president of the other party exercising such a broad and frankly illegal powers I think the work we've the the Republicans a box themselves into a position of articulating an almost unlimited presidential power almost imperial greatly Kiana off of the foundation for individual rights in education how to excellent point that if you put together all the GOP's positions on the president's positions they seem to be that only an actual crime is impeachable but the president cannot be investigated for a crime by anybody federal or state and if Congress wants to investigate him for the crime then he could refuse to cooperate and stop any branch of the government from cooperating other stuff you can do about it that's a rather shocking series of propositions that seems to make the president really not a limited government figure but an absolute power and I think institutionalize is the argument you've been hearing the specific situation from Republicans which you know the president would remain accountable only to the electorate on that situation and you could say well you know the president if if voters don't like what the president's been up to they can remove him but then the the question would be why there's an impeachment clause at all in the constitution I want to ask you about something that you said a few weeks ago we were talking about John Bolton who'd resisted efforts to to bring him before house committees to testify he was never actually subpoenaed but he was making clear that he was going to to type it up in court if he was subpoenaed he is he was signaling a few weeks ago that he would he would be willing to talk in a Senate trial if you were asked in and you thought at the time that he was not being genuine that he did not want.

Michael KCRW Josh barro
"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

KCRW

01:58 min | 2 years ago

"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

"From a new artist from national his name is Devin Gil fill me in that's next Hey it's Josh barro it's crunch time for the presidential primaries and it could all come down to the fourteen crucial states including California will vote on super Tuesday to.

Devin Gil Josh barro California
"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

KCRW

06:01 min | 2 years ago

"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

"With left right and center I'm Josh barro of New York magazine on the right is rich Lowry editor of National Review unlocked as Elizabeth critic columnist at The New York Times and our special guest is Gustavo Arellano features writer at the Los Angeles Times PBS and politico hosted a democratic presidential debate on Thursday at Loyola Marymount university in Los Angeles I thought this was easily the most interesting and best moderated debate the primary so far of course IT help that there were only seven candidates on stage Gustavo what did you take away from this debate it was long two and a half hours like at the end I was just zoning out black that said a blue is that said the move pretty crisply there was a lot of talking by everyone there was not one candidate who dominated the the entire conversation all the time so I of course yeah why was he there at this point and I think everyone played to what they were supposed to do at least internally I I I was trying to think of a winner I would say I would have said Bernie Sanders would have been the winner because I actually thought he had a really good sense of humor and self effacing about himself but his problem was whatever the Cup the question was he would not answer it and then go back to one of his pet causes like climate change or economic equality gap as as a listener I just wanted him to actually answer the question and Andrew Yang he was the other one where I don't know if he actually thinks he's going to be present although he says so play definitely played up to whatever and yank supposed to be like some guy who's thinking about the future some guy who wants to give his freedom freedom to relatives and someone who has a very funny droll broly sense of humor Liz I mean I I think the consensus on on the web was that all or at least most these candidates had a pretty good night but obviously not everyone can win a debate this is a zero sum game only one of these people going to be the democratic nominee yeah I mean and you did see more class than I think you typically see probably because the state is a little bit smaller this time I thought Bernie did pretty well I mean one thing about Bernie is that you know you could lay building foundations by the exact thing identical nous of his positions over time and and that includes his debate performances in his public performances Bernie is on message she always is and that's because he believes that a lot of serious issues in society are outgrowths of these underlying problems of that that he is talking about so I think that's that's a no predictable and I think that the is that I think that Bernie a is predictable is a good thing about a man is something that a lot of Bernie fans actually seem to appreciate about him I think the clash between Warren and booted judge was pretty spectacular of sparks really flew there he asked if she could pass her own purity test in terms of donors could he accepted donation from her of for example if you couldn't be in a room with millionaires he could be a real in the lives of the war and that was a pretty serious attack but then later on in the debate club which are came back at boo to judge and told them to effectively respect his elders which seem to share a little bit so I think it was a very very active and energized debate rich what were your highlights yeah I have much to add to the conventional wisdom I think Joe Biden was indeed as a lot of people thank the best is then any these forms relatively loose entirely cogent kind of funny a moving answer it with that stupid question at the end there is has to be some stupid question at the end it was like what what would you ask forgiveness for what gift would you give other candidates and Biden hit on what just is is one of his great strengths as a candidate just is Billy talk about grief and he also brought up which is never talked about before that I'm aware of his his struggles with the starter and how how people who have a stuttering problem come to him for encouragement and advice so really good night for buying and obviously you know when you're sitting on top of most of the polls a good night is this mensa status as a front runner people judge I thought he won hands down the exchange with was with more in the probably lost exchange with any club chart there's not a great answer to being mayor of a small city in Indiana in terms of the experience and just I I've increasingly find him annoying just because every answer so perfect and that the only see one node to him in the club Ciara I don't know what it is maybe just not hanging on at that you know of the extreme edge of the stage among ten candidates but she'd made much more of an impression and Andrew Yang although I've been a times annoyed with him and rejected the central because of his campaign the idea that automation is going to cause an enormous economic and social crisis he's a you know he's a thinking person you know any surprises you and has unusual it is for some credit cancers and also a sense of humor so all in all I thought it was it was a good debate and the best night for Joe Biden yeah I'd I broadly agree with what rich had to say there enter Yang has even been growing on me and I've complained a lot about him before now I don't I don't think you should be president I don't think he's going to be president but I increasingly see him as someone who could be like secretary of commerce I am a democratic administration which would be a pretty good return on this long shot presidential campaign but he has run in and and over performed expectations I thought it was as everyone's been saying Joe Biden's best debate so far of the campaign and you know since the previous much more lackluster debate performances were enough to keep him in the lead I have to think that that is a good thing for him to put in a genuinely good debate performance and I also thought Amy had a really strong night actually want to play some of that sound from her fight with to judge over their retrospective experience if you want to talk about the capacity to win try putting together a coalition to bring you back to office with eighty percent of the vote as a gay dude and Mike pence's Indiana one.

Josh barro National Review New York rich Lowry editor Elizabeth
"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

KCRW

03:31 min | 2 years ago

"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

"Josh barro it's thanksgiving week and this is a special episode of left right and center looking at some of the trends in political behavior that are reshaping our politics Lauren Hutton joins me to talk about the political activation of college educated middle age suburban women whose new activism the Democratic Party has been expanding the map of where Democrats win given Phoenix joins me to talk about the anger gas why anger moves voters and why whites can use it more readily than blacks and we'll talk about how that gap shapes the choice Democrats will make this winter and a step Herndon and Charlotte alter political reporters on the campaign trail well tell me what they're seeing on the ground including how Elizabeth Warren is trying to build a diverse coalition she'd need to be the nominee that's all coming up next on left right and center I'll be right back live from NPR news in Washington I'm deal will police in London say a twenty eight year old man who was released from prison on probation last year was responsible for a Friday afternoon attack in that city Lishman conserve six years for terrorism offenses police say he stabbed two people to death near London Bridge and wounded three others before he was subdued and killed police commissioner Cressida Dick says that because of the attacks security in the city will be increased in the coming days you will see more police both arms and on on patrolling our streets to help reassure those who are understandably concerned Americans views on the death penalty for convicted murderers is shifting that's according to a new Gallup public opinion poll NPR Cheryl Corley has more so here are the numbers sixty percent of Americans say life imprisonment without the possibility of parole is the better choice for person convicted of murder thirty six percent favor the death penalty Gallup says that's the first time since it began asking that question thirty four years ago that a majority has said life imprisonment is a better approach even sell without that choice offered as a question Gallup's recently released survey shows a majority of Americans fifty six percent still support capital punishment for convicted murderers however that's the lowest percentage it's been since nineteen seventy two and death penalty support has been on the decline for years Cheryl Corley NPR news the public has until the end of the day Monday to comment on the proposal by the trump administration to change the way food stamps or snap benefits are calculated the change would increase say for some people but cut it for others NPR's Pam Fessler reports this is the administration's third proposal this year affecting food stamp eligibility it would change the way you tell it costs are calculated in determining monthly benefits something the administration wants to make more uniform across the country in a new report the urban institute says this proposal would raise benefits slightly for two point six million households but cut them for three point two million separately the administration wants tougher work requirements for snap recipients and to make it harder for states to waive asset in income limits the urban institute says those two proposals which are also pending would eliminate food stamps for more than two million households Pam Fessler NPR news Washington a major storm system making its way across the country is threatening holiday travel this weekend forecasters are warning that snow and ice could prevent millions of people from getting home after thanksgiving the storm is already show it down highways stranding drivers in California authorities in Arizona meanwhile urging travelers to wait out the weather the storm is expected to reach the northeast U..

Josh barro thirty six percent fifty six percent thirty four years twenty eight year sixty percent six years
"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

KCRW

05:37 min | 2 years ago

"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

"I'm Josh barro host of left right center our two shows were made for this moment LRC is KCRW's legacy political round table and for the legal issues there's our spin off show all the president's lawyers we dig deep into the possible outcomes every move on the poor listen to all the president's lawyers Wednesdays at one thirty and left right and center on Fridays at one and seven or subscribe to our podcast where everything's so from eighty nine point nine F. the world at KCRW dot com music from tomorrow spring island folds in the set dreaming of this cut lyric us as a new project called subservient your take tents here from America automatic with suicide in Texas this excellent signal from at least on automatic Moses some they heard zero the record cold gray for Moses some and just released a new album from Michael Kiwanuka simply titled hard to say goodbye at the top of the set V. P. from one of only nine Jessica Lea Mayfield zero seven jets F. K. I when I was young the homes midnight hour were settled with space for in all more that living transportation stay tuned the very first zoning rules in LA had a rule that no home could have more than four horses it's garage and I think you know that that's the W. case sponsors then include patina came restaurant the automobile group reservations and the rules are available change to celebrate and thanksgiving then later on in they the said heart okay of a downtown single family LA house at Nick up to and staff four steak cars house in its and garage fifteen the a restaurant parking dilemma guests and can LA's enjoy a future Turkey dinner.

president America Texas Moses Michael Kiwanuka F. K. LA Nick Josh barro Jessica Lea Mayfield Turkey
"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

KCRW

01:36 min | 2 years ago

"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

"Josh barro honor twice a week for all the legal trouble there's all the president's lawyers Wednesdays at one thirty and left right and center is Fridays at one and again at seven right here on KCRW now this from KCRW knows it's been a busy summer for the presidential candidates everything from fundraisers to rallies to prepping for debates now new data from the non profit news organization ProPublica show the impact that's having on the candidates day jobs some have missed half of the votes in the Senate this year among them California senator comma Harris KCRW's cherry glaze or has the details come on Harris's miss just over fifty percent of the votes in the Senate so far this year that makes her the second most absent member of the chamber behind New Jersey senator and rival democratic presidential candidate Cory Booker Bernie Sanders comes in a close third missing more than forty nine percent of this year's votes and the really heavy duty campaigning is still to come Republicans hold a slim majority in the Senate so Democrats can't necessarily affect the outcome of votes the San Francisco Chronicle reports terroristic cancel trip to Iowa this spring in order to cast a vote on disaster relief that included billions of dollars for Californians affected by wildfires she's also made a point to be in DC for intelligence committee business KCRW's Terry Glazer time is four forty five this is KCRW good morning I'm Rachel Martin squirrels are gonna squirrel person Holly Persik learn the hard way when they found two hundred wall that's hidden in the hood of the car the whole engine was covered in knobs and Masi.

Highlights and analysis of the debate

Left, Right & Center

11:35 min | 3 years ago

Highlights and analysis of the debate

"And center I'm Josh barro of New York magazine on the right is Megan McArdle of The Washington Post on the left is plain old also a columnist at The Washington Post and when it Lopez of business insider is our special guest all right so we talked about trade but obviously there was much much much more than trade whole lane who won these debates I'm I don't think anybody won these debates actual lay I think everybody I went through and read tons of commentary at one point and came to the absolute conclusion that everybody thought the candidate that they like the most won the debate I read impassioned defense you know a passion Biden won the debate Warren when the debate Sanders won the debate I even saw John Delaney won the debate I saw in this way I mean it was across the board and conversely people generally thought whoever they didn't like didn't do particularly well so you saw well you toward in Sanders only did well because they teamed up and you know they were against some lilliputian and you saw well by now only did well because you know he was against terror out send and so on and Harris only did well or you know whatnot because she wasn't fully attacked the way she deserved and so on down the line and I think it just sort of became a sort of wash and I think the pop that was the public's reaction to I mean barely anybody watch I think it had viewership of about eight million at fat and to be honest it's actually already it's Friday it's already kind of hard to remember very much of it so I mostly agree with that with two exceptions one is that I don't really think I saw anybody saying that they thought Kamel Harris had a good night even people who work fans of commerce he didn't work for her campaign you probably weren't saying that she won the debate and and then the flip side of that is I saw a lot of people saying they really thought Cory Booker did a good job in that sort of elevated himself above the the lower tier position that he had managed to hold on to in this debate I Meg and I know you wrote about Kamel Harris this week yes I think that there's no question that she lost the debate in in part because you know she her last debate she was definitely the clear winner rich she went into the debate point seven percent she comes out pulling at fifteen right that is a major move and that is because she she took the fight to Joe Biden sort of questioning him about his history opposing federal school busing efforts and people thought here is the fighter who can really dismantle trump on stage but the problem with that is that she then went into this debate as a front runner and people were gunning for her and it turns out that she's all offense and no defense and so when people started landing punches she was just reeling and really not able to mount an effective response on the other side of that I thought Elizabeth Warren did well enough I mean I think she slightly improved her position she looked very good but mostly she siphoning voters from Bernie who I think did not do well in this debate not because he did badly but merely because he's just holding steady it's not really widening as support Cory Booker I agree absolutely like god himself noticed finally after months and months of waiting for this to happen I think enter Yang also I don't think he's gonna be president but I think that you know he went into this debate with almost no one knowing who he is he made a couple of very well timed jokes sounded very coherent and you know plausible if not to me personally very convincing on things like his signature universal basic income initiative so I think there were a number of people who really committed this to be looking much better but in part that was because of what the for one of the sort of great white hopes came out looking much worse can can we and and I hope this is the last time in my life I ever have to say this phrase can we talk about and Yang for a moment alleluia the Ted talk version of politics yeah I I don't get it at all I don't get the people who are you know talking about you know good night friend Riang I mean I guess you know if you're if you're not really Yang gang if you're judging it like a like a high school debate competition and you know he won some points that might be right but the the problem with Andrew gang is that is central idea that virtually every problem in society is best addressed through universal basic income of a thousand dollars a month is both wrong on the merits and also it doesn't speak to any particular constituency in the Democratic Party and he has this idea that basically the problem is that our jobs are being automated away which is if it's if it's ever gonna happen it's not happening yet if that was what was happening you would see really fast productivity growth in the economic data because the robots would be doing all the things that people used to do and yet right productivity growth is actually pretty slow and then you know what what kind of Democrat is supposed to be into the entry on message if you you know if you just want things to go back to normal and you want a third Obama term he's not your guy if you're very concerned about inequality and the concentration of wealth in the hands of certain of a few powerful people of political and economic power he's not your guys you're very concerned about racial justice he's not your guy he said the sort of bizarre thing about how basically it's too late on climate change and we need to give people money so they can afford to move to higher ground I do not get at all what this suppose it gang constituency is supposed to be I've actually gone to so I went to an injury Yang rally so I can actually talk about this okay so you go to a rally right and it's a bunch of guys it's a thirty five and under many of whom like have to pause for a minute went before the answer a question like who did you vote for two thousand sixteen they often can't remember if they voted in the primary if you ask them if they very who they voted for in the general there's also this pause and then they also Hillary Clinton and I'm not convinced if that means they had to think about it whether they are voted for trump and no they shouldn't say that or if they actually like you to vote I mean I'm not convinced but I'm not convinced of any of those but what I think it does is it appeals to this kind of people who I don't wanna say they're disenfranchised because their tech guys by definition are not disenfranchised but they see themselves as disenfranchised and you know this is kind of you know vaguely lake we could rent okay higher episode on these guys right exactly taken over the internet this is not a large box and enter right now it's not all it and expect it might not even be a voting block is again as I said I'm not sure how many of them vote but you know this is a sort of stuff that looks really great on an internet chat board I mean this is like a plaque right exactly it's a platform for internet chat board it is a platform that appeals to people like engineers who lake systems with very simple rules right that's actually like I've been lot of libertarians in that camp rate is the lake extremely simple operating rules and then it's kind of set it and forget it government and I think it does appeal to those people and I should point out that while it is true that probably most the people coming out for him don't didn't vote in twenty sixteen certainly in a primary truck did pretty well in twenty sixteen by mobilizing those people because in fact even though they're not a big portion of the electorate the primary voters are not a big portion of the electorate and so if you can get people moving you can get a fairly small group to swamp primaries especially in early races that said I do not think enter Yang is gonna be present and at what I want to ask is like is that the point right so yes if you if if you're asking like why would he be doing this if it's not this kind of classic democratic lake little bit from column a little bit from column be little bit from column C. coalition building politics that is how democratic primaries usually work then yes it's it's not a good strategy but is the goal to actually become president or is the goal to get himself noticed to make himself higher profile to get his ideas on the board and I think he did that in that debate when I want to give you an opportunity to talk about anybody other than Andrea ang and Marianne Williamson I haven't you haven't gotten it yet on the on the one question what were your big takeaways went winners and losers my big take away is that the progressives won in the moderates just found it blocked they just sounded like they didn't have any answers and they sounded like they were not willing to make that the sweeping changes that I think a lot of Americans want to see I think that the progressives are right a lot of people are not happy with their health insurance as much as I hate to say bill de Blasio was right and I think that you know when you hear guys like John Delaney and Tim Ryan talk about confronting China on green tech or and the technological space at all they say things like well I'm going to hire a chief manufacturing officer it's like that's not a real plan Mister Ryan that's actually nothing you need to put your money where your mouth is China has spent ians and billions of dollars and has spent eight spent a lot of time planning their technological advancement the United States needs to at least match that effort to be able to go toe to toe with them to see what you want about the A. O. C. new green deal at least it matches the problem in scale even if you don't agree with that the actual mechanics of her plan and the moderates just sounded like they were petty like they didn't have any real solutions and that they were not up to the task of winning the next century or the next generation or whatever the next monumental thing it so here here's what I don't get about this if if the if the democratic primary electorate is is hungry for a bold progressive who wants to you know really radically re imagined what government is for once things like single payer health care that sort of thing white is Joe Biden have such a persistent poll lead I actually I thought it was it was weird how much of the analysis of this debate of the campaign generally has sort of glossed over the existence of Joe Biden there was a an op ed by Bret Stephens in The New York Times this week complaining that quote Democrats are not up to their historic responsibility unquote he's this you know conservative columnist who wants the Democrats to not be such a Liberal Party it is because he doesn't care for Donald Trump he's complaining you know you had John Delaney and Tim Ryan up there making these good points but nobody's voting for them but people are are are intending to vote for Joe Biden and you had Joe Biden up their forcefully pushing an incremental this message and pushing back on some of the ideas from the progressive candidates saying basically that if you take away employer provided health insurance the polls show that's on popular you're gonna get beaten up over that there are a lot of people who wants to insure that everyone has health insurance but who don't want to do that saying that a lot of these plans that involve big tax increases you have to tax the middle class for them and that's impractical and that that incremental is message basically saying you know we can't have maximum change here's what we did in the Obama administration was built on that that does seem to have a lot of appeal among voters in the democratic primary I point out that a lot of Biden's appeal at this point seems to be that people think he can beat trump and name name recognition in general were early yeah yeah we're we're not that early I mean to and Bernie Sanders has has very very high name recognition and had and as the champion of this message and Sanders is nowhere in the polls I kind of think of all these debates completely as prelude to September when we will finally get all of the major competitors on one stage and I think at that point you might finally see some movement among the competitors that is actual real movement and will hold as opposed to for instance after the first debate where Biden fell after fairly weak performance and then slowly crept back up as people kind of forgot about it so make in one of the things that we heard when you're having these conversations between the center candidates in the left candidates as you would talk about one of these ideas like like getting rid of employer provided health insurance and you would speak that someone would say that some popular and then the progressive candidate would say that's a Republican talking points this is not a Republican talking for it this has nothing to do with the Republic Republican talking ports your question is a Republican talking point we cannot keep with the Republican talking points on this you got to stop the thing is in what again the thing that I take from Joe Biden's poll lead is that

Josh Barro Megan Mcardle The Washington Post Lopez New York Thousand Dollars Seven Percent
"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

KCRW

10:42 min | 3 years ago

"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

"This is Josh barro and welcome to left right and center your civilized a provocative antidote self contained opinion bubbles the dominant political debate it is the start of August and this week it was political debates that dominated the political debate twenty democratic presidential candidates took the stage over two nights in Detroit it was the same line up as in June but with Montana governor Steve bullock swapped in to replace California congressman Eric Swalwell not that you necessarily noticed the first night had Elizabeth Warren and Bernie Sanders fending off attacks from more moderate and less popular candidates less popular because most of the moderate support goes to Joe Biden who was on the second night fighting off Kamel harassing Cory Booker later on today show we will look at the winners and losers from these debates who had the best arguments and who position themselves best to be the nominee now let's bring in our left right and center panel as always I'm your center and I'm joined by Megan McArdle columnist at The Washington Post on the right on the left is plain old one of the Washington post and Linette Lopez senior finance reporter business insider is our special guest for the show hello everyone hi hello hi there so I actually want to start this week by talking about trade with China it was a topic at the debates and was also an issue on which president trump took somewhat surprised action on Thursday announcing ten percent tariffs on a further three hundred billion dollars a year of Chinese imports that move cause sharp declines in stock prices interest rates and oil prices all signs of the markets think the escalation of a trade war with China is going to be bad for the global economy Megan what did you make of this move well I think that for president trump trade wars are a bit like axe body spray is for fourteen year old boys if you do not get the desired attention or results from the first round of application just keep spraying Amman until finally you get what you want I don't think that this works any better for Donald Trump than it does for fourteen year old boys but I think that that really does sort of go to his fundamental idea about how politics works about how economics and business work which is you know he gets he has like a couple of tricks in his bag and he just keeps pounding those those nails with the same two hammers over and over and over again occasionally he gets lucky you know works more often it fill spectacularly but since it one of those tricks work to get him to the oval office in twenty sixteen he hit feels validated in this life strategy Elena how much does the federal reserve give the president cover to impose these terrorists because before the president announces terrace on Thursday with a press conference on Wednesday from the federal reserve chairman Jay Powell the fed announced they were cutting short term interest rates by a quarter point and Powell also made these comments everyone wants no well you know or are you going to cut interest rates more and one of the things he said was basically that's going to depend on what the global trade situation looks like if there's more trouble more uncertainty in global trade that's something that could lead to more easing more interest rate cuts so it seems that the signal that Powell is standing there is the more trouble the president causes like this the more interest rate cuts he's going to get and that will do something to offset one hopes the economic damage that might come from the terrace right I mean I would use a slightly different analogy that Megan I think if trump is sort of a parent at a dysfunctional home who governs by unpredictable temper and chaos and I think that everyone is responding to him because they know that as a result we never know quite what he's going to go off it results in people sort of kowtowing to him ultimately they ultimately will do what he wants even though they don't necessarily want to do it and I think we kind of saw this with the federal reserve this week where they kind of left room opened to maneuver around him which is exactly what you would do with a chaotic dysfunctional person in charge of your life but the the the fed is doing the right thing there right I mean the fed is supposed to respond to economic conditions that includes economic conditions created through the president's dumb policy action right but it's it's kind of it's a no win situation for the fat because of course if they don't respond to it they're going to make things worse but on the other hand that they do respond to it simply encourages him and I would say that's from strategy to me that's always been trump strategy is he kind of sets off chaos and the does whatever the heck he what's and with in that chaos he kind of gets his way that radic parent analogy though can also be that can be used on the Chinese response if you read the read outs from both countries after the Stevenage and Robert like Heiser jaunt to Shanghai both of them were that Steve Manouchian the treasury secretary and Robert light Heiser who's the US trade representative our top trade negotiator with China and other countries yes they were inching high long enough to put their little heads on a soft pillow and then come right home and after that you know both countries put it but I released read outs that seems somewhat positive to give both governments political room to continue to make negotiations especially the Chinese government which has ginned up a lot of nationalist sentiment in the media and you know you can only really she can really only de escalate if it seems like the United States is also going to de escalate so trump ramping it up to a thousand the way he did the very next day paint CG into a corner as well because his people and friends in the media is in a frenzy and this does not give him the opportunity to go back to the table with the United States so someone out one homeland says you know the president throws tantrums and eventually he gets his way I it sounds like you're suggesting that it that's not going to eventually get his way with the Chinese essentially because it's it's it's too embarrassing for them to give in to him at this point do you do you not by the president's very basically that the terrorists because a lot more economic damage to China than that because the United States so even if there's pain here there's more pain there and they eventually have to cave China is prepared for economic pain they're going to have economic pain what there's a trade war not because of their cycle in de leveraging this is a perfect excuse for she and the people's bank of China to lower rates to maybe you know let they'll the wand appreciate a little bit and blame it on on Donald Trump instead of their domestic situation Megan is that's on right here look I think that the fact is that what Donald Trump wants from China is for them to not export nearly as much stuff to us and and to buy a lot more of our stuff and that's something I think China can't do I'm not arguing about whether it's fair or not but but for internal political reasons the idea of the Chinese Communist Party can actually give in on this stuff and sort of try to compete as if they were a western European nation that would be politically disastrous for them and so you know they're looking at the lesser of two evils and for them at least a trade war kind of mobilizes the population against America and and stirs up exactly the same kind of nationalist sentiment by the where the trump is using these trade wars to stir up so there's a there's a kind of a vicious cycle is a factor but yeah yeah but I mean ray is that that it's better for them to have a trade war in which they can blame America than it is to make concessions in which people will be like why are you such a wuss you sold us out to the Americans making described there what I think is president trump's view on what the trade problem is with China that he's just singularly focused on the trade deficit his concern is that China exports too much stuff to us doesn't buy enough stuff from us everyone of the democratic stage seem to agree that there is some sort of trade problem with China although I don't think people by the president's framing of it but so what what is the problem in trade with China since everyone seems to agree that there's a problem that needs to be fixed here what do we need a policy that gets out because I think that's been very unclear from a lot of the candidates so I think there is actually a they're a bunch of problems with China right I mean so one is that their state led industrial policy results and things like massive goal what's an overpass E. in industries like steel right and then everyone else has to deal with the fallout of the the wild swings in the prices that they caused by dumping a huge amount of product on the market the probably wouldn't have been built if the kind of market were disappointing the construction of the steel companies rather than state owned banks so that's one problem another problem is look if you look at what we're good at doing they do in fact attempts to to shield domestic industry is protected **** industries from the stuff for America has a competitive advantage well Pat taking free trade terms from us on the stuff that they sell and so yes it would be good to see you tried out for example embrace more robust intellectual property controls that's all stuff that should be on the table but it's gonna be a long time getting there right this is not like Donald Trump is good I have a trade war and then he's going to go sit down on the table and and two months later he's gonna come way with everything you what's it's going to take years to push China into entering World Trade on a kind of more level playing field now that they have reached middle income and are are trying to work towards high income country status eventually they're gonna have to get there there are a lot of the businesses here in the United States that would love to be in China that are simply not allowed there are a lot of partnerships that are forced between American companies and Chinese companies were and the exchange of ideas is not necessarily on the up and up and out yeah V. I. V. I. P. theft in particular is a huge problem that is extremely real and also things like wall way maybe having back doors so that they can spy on US consumers these are actually really yeah right to be addressed and we and we have to address also the fact that she's in paying is is a nastier sort of authoritarian government than his predecessors you know the he seems more like interested in closing the economy than opening it and we have to adjust our relationship with the country to that new reality yeah and and the president has not seen focused on that I mean he even had comments this week essentially to the to the point that Hong Kong is part of China and that's something the they're going to have to work out internally which is not normally the talking point you'd expect from a U. S. president I thought the third part of the debate about international trade were actually some of the most productive parts of the debate this week substantive and got it real a distinction between the candidates one thing you heard from Maryland congressman John Delaney and also to an extent from for vice president Joe Biden was that a big mistake was getting out of the trans Pacific partnership that that was an agreement that would have put us on a United front with Japan Australia and Canada and eight other countries around the Pacific to basically try to set the terms of global trade policy with China on the other side of the table and then you also heard Delaney essentially arguing that Elizabeth Warren was proposing to replicate some parts of the problems with the president's trade policy we can isolate ourselves from the world we can't isolate ourselves from Asia center warns plan basically did she put out we would not be able to trade with the United tell them we would not be able to.

Josh barro Detroit Steve bullock Montana fourteen year three hundred billion dollars ten percent two months
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10:15 min | 3 years ago

"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

"And center I'm Josh barro of New York magazine on the right is rich Lowry editor of National Review on the left is Felicia Wong president and CEO of the Roosevelt institute we're going to do something a little unusual in this segment Felicia has brought a guest with her GW Mason who is a fellow at the Roosevelt institute GW is an interesting new paper making a macro economic case for the green new deal of Felicia before we bring in GW can you set the political context little bit Frusciante what this paper represents in terms of sort of re framing the debate about the great new deal right well the Roosevelt report is really designed to do three things first to show that we don't have to trade off between improving the economy and making the economy more green you can do both so that's a re frame the second thing is to show that to really make the transition to a green economy not just to move to phase out fossil fuels but also to expand mass transit our director of the buildings are pay farmers to capture carbon you simply must have a public investment led strategy and then the last thing that the report is designed to do is to show that we can actually pay for it the problem now is no longer climate denial to actually climate austerity and the report is designed to show that that austerity is wrong well let's bring in jail be amazed JW is an associate professor of economics at John Jay college in addition to being a fellow Roosevelt I did a hi so your paper argues that a robust green new deal program might entail new expenditures of five percent of GDP which is a lot for context to existing federal spending about twenty three twenty four percent of GDP you see we can encourage those expenses with little or no new taxes and we should think of this not as an economic cost at all but as an investment how how does that matter well the idea here is we're trying to connect up to conversations that really have been taking place in separate silos there's a conversation about the carbonization climate change and then there's a conversation about the macro economy in the macro economy conversation we know that we've been facing inflation below the fed's target for many years we know that we face the problem is your lower boundary faced persistent periods of high unemployment we faced very low interest rates in the US and around the world and now we're looking at a new round of fed cuts we're looking at the C. B. are talking about a new extraordinary stimulus stands in central bank yes thanks so so essentially when we turned macroeconomics we're looking at a world that seems to be suffering from a persistent lack of aggregate demand suffering from persistent lack of sufficient spending to employ all the labor and other productive resources available to us with a lot of economic cost then unfortunately when we talk about climate we tended to assume that we are working with the economy at full employment that full using its resources and so anything that we devote to D. carbonization is going to have to be taken away from meeting some other needs but in a world where we have the problem of this you're a lower bound we have this problem of secular stagnation as Larry summers and other people have talked about a persistent demand shortfalls it doesn't make sense to think of it that way that when you spend money on a public program like D. carbonization not only are you cheating what are some very urgent goals for society but you're also helping plug this gap you're also helping make up the shortfall in demand as we've seen conventional monetary policy is simply not able to do sort of break that down the the usual way that people think about the economy and and the way that the economy works and in certain economic situations is basically that if the government goes out and spends more money and either taxes or borrows in order to do that spending that that's gonna crowd out other activity in the economy the government borrows more money that pushes up interest rates that makes it more expensive for businesses to private investment and so the government spending cross a private spending your contention is because of this economic situation we're in where there's a shortage of aggregate demand the government can go out and borrow and spend in that doesn't crowd out private activity so the government could spend conceivably not just on the green new deal but on anything and it essentially would cost less than it appears to cost on the government's financial stuff that's exactly right that's exactly right the social cost new spending is much lower when you have a a shortfall of aggregate demand and that's really in a way that's what a world of low interest rates is telling us world a persistent low interest rates is telling us of the opportunity cost of public spending is much less than it might have been it at various times in the past I have one more person I want to bring into this conversation and that's Joseph Mike who is the director of climate policy than a scanned in center just was one of the people on the right has been trying to interest conservatives and libertarians in the idea that we need some sort of aggressive climate policy welcome Joseph thank you for joining us happy to be here thank you so is this an argument that appeals to you that essentially you know so many of the debates that we have about climate change mention and with the the assumption that there is a really large economic costs associated with them the you need to convince people that that cost is worth incurring the basically that frame is wrong in that we can go out and set of people actually this is something that it's not completely free but a lot of it is free well I think it's I'm a little skeptical though I appreciate the argument I agree there's evidence there slack in the economy into an act in demand and I agree that oftentimes the costs of climate action have been overstated as a means of of opposing individual policies but I I do question it if it's if it's going to be a constructive move to cast the costs of the carbon eyes in the economy which we should do as as a feature as opposed to a bug of the of the policies we want to use well I think it it really depends on your read of the situation I think if we're in a situation where we simply can't spend enough money and we we seen a situation we saw the situation during the Great Recession where conventional monetary policy in the US and elsewhere were simply not able to get the economy up to full employment and where I think today there is widespread agreement that the stimulus package adopted in the US and elsewhere was not large enough then I think we have salute we have to say that spending more money on anything is a feature not about now as it happens we're fortunate to have a very urgent a problem to spend the money on but this is the phrase on anything really key in there this this macro economic argument that you're making an obviously this has been a controversial topic in US politics for for over a decade it would apply to to any new public investment so isn't the burden still on you to show that this is the appropriate way to to spend that money I mean you could you could spend it on healthcare on child care on infrastructure not particularly aimed at at at green benefits isn't the burden still to show that this is the best use of these resources even if it is feasible to finance them through government borrowing well I think to some extent our our report is aimed at people who agree that the problem of climate change is an extremely urgent social problem and that it is one of our highest priorities and are concerned about the paying for site I I don't think our goal was to convince people the urgency the problem I think there's plenty of other evidence and arguments out there to convince people that I do think there's a certain argument FOR D. carbonization in particular because there is a certain time limited aspect of this it's not unlike healthcare education it's not something that the government is necessarily going to be doing permanently so if we think that this period of weak demand might not be it might be something that will last for ten or twenty years but not forever there's a certain argument there and I also think there's an argument that when you want to do this kind of macro economic spending there's a lot to be said for public investment in particular and I think that you know that's something that clearly is a big component of the carbonization way that it might not be for some of these other is rich have Republicans to an extent opened up this line of argument for people on the left which is to say that you know the Republicans came into office with some priorities they want to spend more money on the military they wanted a corporate tax cut and they decided that there was no need to pay for that that the macroeconomic situation was such that the government could just borrow more money in order to pursue those priorities and and so far economic performance seems to continue to be fine in that environment of increased borrowing why shouldn't the left pick that up and and pick its own policy goals and say that's what to use the increased deficit spending for yeah I don't think Republicans have any credibility at spending at the moment and deficit spending we've had hasn't had any obvious media economic harms my fear is just by the time we all agree that we can to spend any amount of money and deficits don't matter at all we'll spend ourselves to a level where Texas matter and economic conditions will change and it just seems to me that this this paper with all due respect my today W. it's it's more of a case for spending than than spending on a green new deal per se and I would think if if you accept those promises and and I don't you want to spend on things that make the economy more efficient and more productive their infrastructure projects that could do that for instance like basic are in D. where we're I think we're not spending as much we should as a no brainer about the green new deal involves and not just creating new sources of energy but scourging the sources of energy we already have that are represent great national wealth and a more efficient and I I just don't buy the argument that making energy basically more expensive and for swearing sources of energy that that are more efficient is good for the economy you can make other arguments for that it's allegedly gonna save the planet but there's gonna be a big free lunch and a boon to the economy makes no sense to me what did you do you do do you buy that premise because it it seems to me that the way that that you and some others talk about some of these investments in new technology are similar to the way that people often talk about the Apollo program which is to say that you know we did we had this expensive program to go to the moon and we had all sorts of ancillary learning from doing that that that boosted productivity in the economy and that led to other useful innovations and ultimately produced more economic growth so I think that sometimes the argument you hear about green technology the claim is that this particular area both public spending and of regulations the four shifts in private spending that they'll they'll force people to do useful are indeed it will make the economy more productive in the long run I guess the question is how do we know that because usually when the government comes in and tells private businesses no don't do the thing you thought was most efficient do this other thing you should tend to expect that to to reduce economic output so why is this a case where you get positive knock on benefits from that one piece is Felicia said we're not just talking about regulation we're talking about public investment and there's a big difference I think when you're trying to build up at new industries from scratch it's true that simply raising costs as something like a carbon tax you this is why we don't agree with people who say the carbon tax is the be all and end all policy here because all that does do is.

Josh barro National Review president and CEO Roosevelt institute New York rich Lowry editor Felicia Wong Roosevelt institute GW twenty three twenty four perce five percent twenty years
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11:21 min | 3 years ago

"josh barro" Discussed on KCRW

"I'm your host Josh barro on the right is rich Lowry editor of National Review on the lettuce lane Oland columnist at The Washington Post antennal Berta chief political correspondent political magazine is also with us ten is the author of the new book American carnage on the front lines of the Republican civil war and the rise of president trump us so Tim this book is is about how we got here and you start the book really by talking about the two thousand eight financial crisis and the top vote and I I'm interested in what what you're thinking is about why is that the right place to look when we're sort of trying to start tell the story of how Donald Trump took over the Republican Party got elected president yeah look you can obviously start fifty years ago you could start with Buchanan taking on bush in ninety two you could start with newt and ninety four the revolution that there are a lot of places you can begin the story I chose to focus on a ten year window here and starting a weight because you had this incredible convergence of events in two thousand that you had your George W. bush preparing to leave office he was historically on popular in there obviously a lot of conservatives who aside from the wars believed that and aside from Harriet Myers and Terri Schiavo and all the all number of other things that were you know politically divisive and and poorly handled by the administration a lot of conservatives felt that the George W. bush presidency had been a betrayal of you know small government principles whether was Medicare part D. or no child left behind or any number of other decisions made by the bush White House and so bush has not only lost you know the middle of the electorate and certainly lost the left a long time ago but there are a lot of people on the right who have soured on George W. bush and so he's sort of preparing to leave office with his tail between his legs and the new standard bearer is John McCain who is kind of persona non grata to the conservative movement a guy who's had any number of his own betrayals over the year and so what does he do to try to mobilize the base and fire up people behind his candidacy against Barack Obama he picks Sarah Palin who you know unwittingly for McCain Palin exposes this enormous rift between sort of the Republican intellectual governing class in the Wall Street journal editorial board verses the you know blue collar Republican base across the country that feels as though they have been looked down upon and mistreated and sort of trampled upon economically and and that their concerns and grievances have been ignored by that governing class and then you have the financial collapse in the fall of two thousand eight which only makes things worse because obviously Wall Street gets bailed out and and you have a lot of Americans of all political persuasion really at that point who begin to cry out you know the system is rigged against us Washington and Wall Street they play by one set of rules the rest of us get screwed and so you put all of this into a boy under and then of course the cherry on top is the election of Barack Obama the country's first African American president and he takes office at a time when unemployment is soaring there are millions of manufacturing jobs being shed during this period of time so you have enormous you know economic unease you have enormous cultural unease for a lot of people across the country and so there's this powder keg that is beginning to form and as we trace it forward to connecting the dots through you know the twenty ten election in the tea party wave in twenty twelve and Ronnie's failure to defeat Obama and the perceived sort of weakness of the party all of it is building towards something eventually those of us covering it up close could sort of tell that that powder keg was going to explode we just didn't know that it was going to be trump who was you know lighting the fuse you start with talking about discontent because the Republican Party had abandoned small government principles and they sort of you know that the elected George W. bush we didn't give them what they were what they were supposed to get and John McCain was never real economic conservative but trump is not an advocate of small government principles either if anything he is moved to the left on issues of government spending compared to to George W. bush and John McCain so was this ever really about small government it seems to me that it was basically about that you know Mitt Romney and and John McCain seem too nice and that trump was willing to upset people that were bothering you know culturally conservative voters what I think that's right I think the point you make is really important but I do think it's worth recognizing that the playing field has shifted pretty dramatically because look it during the bush presidency you know the truth the more traditional reaganite wing of the party was still very much a send in and in control and so you know to the to the effect of talk radio and even cable news although was it was much younger at that period and obviously there's no social media what was driving the conversation was in in much more so than today this sort of philosophical debate about how the Republican Party was performing relative to yeah you know it's it's core platform etcetera etcetera but to the point you made Josh I think it's absolutely right trump was really pressing and I think in identifying that a lot of Republicans believe that the party was weak and it wasn't just that McCain vouch for Obama's character in two thousand eight when when the going got tough it wasn't just that Romney who was brutally defined by the Obama reelected twenty twelve never really swung back and everybody thought that he was sort of a Patsy it was also the George W. bush was peddling this compassionate conservatism and all this talk about refugee resettlement and an aids relief in Africa and you know prisoner re entry and I talked to the the director of faith based initiatives in the bush White House again engine to eat and he had this incredible remark where he said you know the term compassionate conservatism really ticked off conservatives and they felt like you know all this talk about refugees and and and prisoners in minority communities this is how Democrats talk what do you what you know why you saying this stuff and so there was I think this surging cents on the right that the party was trying to be too PC was try to be too inclusive it was too soft and that they wanted somebody to be a brawler and even George W. bush who was an evangelical Christian and sat in the pews with them that even he was not willing to really go to the mattresses on some of these big cultural issues it's remarkable to listen to some of these top conservative movement leaders today who will tell you look in the first year of trump's presidency I was at the White House more in that first year than during all the years of the bush presidency so obviously much of that is transactional but these folks don't seem to care because trump is at least willing to get in the arena and throw those haymakers where as most Republicans weren't there's sort of two sides to this coin of trump's appeal being so based on style and cultural grievance that is not necessarily connected to the public policy Alain which is that Democrats as unpleasant as this period has been for them have essentially won the argument over entitlements Republicans are not trying to touch social security Republicans at least implicitly are not even trying to repeal obamacare there is this litigation that the why it houses decided to support that I think it's unlikely to prevail but basically the the the democratic agenda around what the shape of the welfare state should be they they've got the Republican Party very grudgingly much more on board for that than the right then the party was fifteen years ago you're much more optimistic than me Josh I see on the ACA under continue to task that could be successful I see attempts to reform the welfare state by such matters as read as potentially redefining how poverty is calculated to make it a much less generous standard when in fact it should be a bunch more generous standard which will in turn cut into things like you know snap food stamps and Medicaid and I think that this is not an argument that has been one and the other thing I would say is I think what was set off in two thousand eight was the flat out racism and some and anti semitism we're starting to see now and if you were paying attention in two thousand eight two thousand nine you would start to hear it said more explicitly if you went on to internet chat boards it was most certainly there and I think it has become a bigger and bigger part of our discourse and I think that's part of what trump tapped into and I actually think why it's the reason why you can't totally compare two thousand eighteen to two thousand twenty trump wasn't on the ballot in two thousand eighteen he will be on the ballot in two thousand twenty which one of the themes in in Tim's book is essentially that Paul Ryan had very poor political judgment on all the time comment on this as well but basically that that Ryan really believe that his economic agenda was something that spoke to the concerns of voters in the Republican Party and the trunk basically thought that was ridiculous and that trump was was proved right about that in the in the primary and the general election so where does that leave conservatives like you who presumably did not like the the direction that trump has taken the party in policy wise compared to Paul Ryan so I think they're at their to the chains of anti establishment sentiment and timber properly a fox on a big one which as you know we had to bail out we hate that we hate spending will reform entitlements knows obviously were huge themes of that the tea party this populist movement on the right but there was another one that turned out to be more potent and more important and more press in regarding the rice trump and that was the opposition grassroots opposition to these comprehensive immigration reform bills that were repeatedly defeated by results on the right but were repeatedly offered again the autopsy about why Mitt Romney lost basically said we got to do even more immigration reform like that and and that was really the the anti establishment sentiment that survived and grew and was developed in trop all the physical stuff is just been completely cast aside and was was clear to us that Nash review of that through the cultural conservatives was more powerful than the the economic conservatism but we wanted both and now the question is is politically if we're getting to a place where the party is gonna have you no more trouble winning into the southwest and ultimately in a place like Texas and needs to win Pennsylvanian upper Midwest how are you going to do that favoring any kind of entitlement reform that's a huge question that I don't know the answer to but yes trump had his finger on the pulse of the party more than Paul Ryan did and he realized that the the no goes we're not you know it's saying we need healthcare for all are saying we're not going to touch Medicare social security the no goes wrong cultural issues he couldn't be pro choice he couldn't be pro gun control but he could depart on the economics orthodoxy Tim I think one thing that's useful in this book as I I think it pushes back against a narrative you hear from a lot of Democrats which is that basically that the the obstinacy of the Republican Party was to simply a fact of nature created by Mitch McConnell and there were nothing's no strategic choices the Democrats made our that had any influence on the level of obstinacy and I think you described some stuff particularly to do with the stimulus package early in two thousand nine the basically choices that were made in both parties that set them on this course for for very little bi partisan cooperation over the following eight years and built up some of the tension that that led to Donald Trump the the last question I have for you that relates to that is basically you talk about Obama developing some of that resentment by you among vote Republican voters and politicians by seem to be lecturing seeming to consider himself morally superior implying that Republicans were in serious sometimes implying that they were racist I guess the question didn't the party prove Obama right about that in the end by nominating Donald Trump I mean what should Democrats.

Josh barro National Review rich Lowry editor Oland The Washington Post fifteen years eight years fifty years ten year