18 Episode results for "Jonah Junkies"

66 | Fantasy | Feeding the Wolf by Jennifer Leigh

Genre Junkies | Book Reviews

1:16:47 hr | 1 year ago

66 | Fantasy | Feeding the Wolf by Jennifer Leigh

"Weirdo bookworm unite. We want to share our love of genre fiction with you. Some readers leaders out there may look down on you for your love of horror sci fi and fantasy but not us so stop by as we discuss what we've been reading. Jonah Junkies. Welcome back. This is Sandra this is Scott and here. We have our last book episode of their year of the decade in fact. Isn't that crazy. No we are going to have one more episode before the end of Twenty nineteen and that's GonNa a b our our wrap up. We have to do our favorite books of the year with cocktails. It's a tradition. We also candidate for Scott's birthday this year which was a lot of fun. It's kind of like our signature thing is like cocktails. So that'll be cool. Look forward to that but today in just a few minutes. We're going to start talking in about a fantasy novel feeding the wolf by Jennifer Lea and really excitingly. We haven't author interview for this spoke. It's been a little while and so we're excited to get back into the SETON. Get that interview going. So that'll be cool because we haven't done one and we love interviewing being authors especially female authors when we could a chance and it was really fun to pick her brain and here's some insight. She has about this novel in about the writing writing process in general if you are into writing and the process of writing and kind of what that means I think you will find her perspective. Live to be really interesting refreshing. Yes and very honest so look forward to that. We're going to you know how we do. We're GONNA Sandwich that in between do. Don't lock me Regan Sandwich. Ed Twain are spoiler free and the spoilers section. Uh before we do Scott Sandra. Have you been enjoying any genre elated media lately. I mean it's all the man Delorean all the time it is. It's disgusting. How obsessed we are without Shell and I mean in all your better people are? It really reminds me of the what's now called the legacy novels or the disbanded UNIFIL. Yeah I mean. It's not called that anymore longer. Canada our childhood and young adulthood it's written so similarly to that and it just. It fills a void. That I didn't realize is was there. Jon favreau such a genius and we don't deserve him now and I have I think did I share on this show my theory that quote unquote baby. Abo is a clone. Probably not I think. I think that was on spooky slumber party. I know I shared it over there but I couldn't remember fishermen here that's one of two theories of have one. Is that the child baby. Yoga as they are better now is a clone of Oji. Yoda got that theory and then I also have just. Is this kind of wild. What if theory that the child is a girl? Do you think the child is a girl it could be because we already had a boy I would. Maybe this is a girl. Yep certainly couldn hidden and who knows maybe the the Yoda race. I don't they don't have a name. Maybe they maybe they are not gendered. Awhile no they could be. I actually floated that that they could be Kinda hermaphroditic I mean honestly I don't want to get involved in processes because I don't think anybody wants to go there I'm EU child. I kind of do want to go. There will and you know what I was thinking is. Maybe Yoda chose the name Yoda because he he was under the impression that he was like the last of his species and maybe the species is called Yoda while he knew there was at least one other because there was another one on the on the Council Soleil. Yeah that little controversial figure who like everybody's like that's another. Yoda I remember for many years. I thought if people are like you trip in. That's another Yoda and I'm like. There's another cheese I got the animated my angered at I just smacked the microphone. You're really brings this hour to me. Scott and I like everyone else are incredibly protective of the child. They better not drop the child in any more episodes scan a little being in top. I think we're all getting a little bit sick of that. It's not okay. Protect our baby. That's right ovation for that child. That child anything else hurts all all mandatory and all the time time for me. It's just it's just that yeah. I'm reading the Queen of nothing right now. Also the end of the folk affair trilogy. That's going to be real painful. It's a lot of tears. A lot of laughs absolute auto tears and yeah just working on other shows and Spooky Number Party and cult show staff GonNa be he doing some gremlins related content on the cult show which is really exciting. Because you know Gizmo Gizmo fans have kind of popped out of the woodwork with baby. Yoda like like what you know about the mark. Y that's completely legitimate. Gives most of the original little cute baby creature with the big is in the years ears and the small stature to like good he spoke out. Yeah very few Christmas movies. Unless they're kind of horror Jason that I'm well versed in Grammy's has I like to call it pretty high up there who doesn't love some Grammy's okay. So without further ado we're GonNa talk to you about last genre junkies book of the decade feeding the wolf by Jennifer Lea as a captain in the king's Army Terron Ellsbury led led his men with courage and honor winning battle after battle to become a decorated war hero and though he escaped. Death Survived Warren claimed victory. He paid a heavy price. Not Not only did he lose valuable men his brothers in arms he lost something even more precious a piece of his soul. He returns home with a heavy heart. Too overwhelmed by pain and guilt to forgive. Forgive himself only just beginning to heal. He is thrust once again into the chaos of were ordered to lead his young cadets to what he fears is certain death. I'm actually going to leave it there there. I think it's good to leave it there. I always like to well. I mean not always. I often like to not read a whole synopsis because a lot of people are like Scott. Were the don't really lead like to read. synopsys Scott is lucky because I read excuse for yeah for the show but I know a lot of people are also like they they do cover buys or they do just like they want to hear just a little bit about the book or the Jonah is so sometimes we do to cut it off early. I think it's interesting thing about this particular This particular synopsis. Because I have read the Synopsis On this Multiple Times. It's it is very accurate but at the same time. This book was not at all what I was expecting I mean would you agree with that. I was not expecting this book to be what it was eight. They definitely exceeded what I thought it was GONNA be. I definitely almost think of this. Like play and it's like in three acts. Okay Yeah and and I mean nothing else about it is really like a play but It is kind of like a play in my mind where it's in like three acts kind of like an a shakespearean kind of way of like this character's journey through these three stages it is a fantasy novel but it's not you know what they call. Hi Fantasy. There is no wizards. There's no majors or dragons or anything like that. It's more book or I should say season one one of game with yeah more season. One of game of thrones Lord of the Rings. Yes yes I think that's pretty good way to put it and because it is said and obviously a distant past in faraway fictitious land and the kingdom where there's kings and Knights and battles and things so maybe if you're kind of looking for a break from that more heavy handed fantasy Or you're just kind of getting into being your toes into the fantasy genre. Sometimes books like this are really good for people so that they don't have to like get Chu stressed start with world building. Because I know it's hard for those of us who love fantasy to believe but it's a real thing that people get stressed out with world building and fantasy and I believe because I've gotten close to that so sometimes it's a little bit nicer to be like okay. This is fantasy that's really character focus. This is very character focused. And and I understand why this particular thing is not in the book but Jennifer. Why is there no map in this book? Lena Ninety where is the map. Where's the map though? It's not important doesn't need it but I want it. If we send you this book we draw who don't sign it. Just draw up. I love a book with a map. We love a book with our love. A book with Matt's Matt's just sets up it just sets up so beautifully for me. Yeah like there's a wonderful low. Oh book with a map map aside it still Experience Score. I was actually going to have you go first OK. The feeding the wolf is a solid page. Turner for me okay. I was incredibly engrossed in this book. I read it into sittings sittings I I really just found it real just incredibly interesting on the character choices and the the progression of the story in the progression Russian of of where the characters were going. I really wanted to see where they ended up. I really cared about Taryn. I really cared about his success. Asset recovery and it just it just completely grabbed me. I totally hear you on that for me. This book started as solid solid. All it good read and then turned into a page Turner for me and that you know. Sometimes that's a mood and that's like a mindset but I really really cared what about Taryn a lot. I liked all the characters. There's a character that comes along later in the book called Amelia. Who I really kind of bonded to but I really like tearing a whole whole lot and that kind of leads me into kind of overarching theme of this book? That I don't think is addressed addressed enough in any genre but especially in horse I find fantasy which is mental health agreed. I don't think you can talk about this book and not talk about mental health. I think that that mental health is the the actually pretty I was gonNA say unspoken but pretty directly referred to main character territory of this book so Scott. If may I call you Scott Humane. May I call you Sandra you may. We've read a lot of books. We've had a lot of fantasy books except for before John Ra- junkies even. Have you ever read one. Where a healer heels people's mental health absolutely? I wasn't wasn't that something fantastic. There's a character named grace. He's a healer but she doesn't just set bones and give you tinctures she. She heals people by talking to them. Like therapist yes. Are there not more in books. Why are you Friday thing? Because you know it's it's very easy to kind of create this this idea in your head that okay. I'm writing fantasy so it's it's kind kind of a historical sort of thing and they didn't really know about mental health back then which is partially true but it's fantasy it can be whenever you want right and and I think it's really brave and interesting that Jennifer Made mental health be such an important part of the story in this setting. I've read ahead. I never quite to the same level. But I've read science fiction stories that deal in mental health particularly post traumatic stress disorder. uh-huh this is the first fantasy that I can think of that that no only touches on it but but highlights it emphasizes it. Our World in general is turning more towards towards a place of being really open about mental health and physical health as well. I haven't really talked about it a whole on this show but a lot of people know I have P. HE CEO s which polycystic Ovarian Syndrome. If you want to look it up and it's a big challenge and it's crazy way that changed how I live my life life and it's not something that's well-spoken of and even more so we don't talk about mental health. Hold on this show honestly. I don't talk about what my mental health because I imagine it's very boring. I think other people's mental journeys are interesting but I imagine mine is boring but it but I have have it have a mental health journey. I have depression anxiety. Obsessive compulsive bipolar. And you know and I've done a lot of work for it and I I still do and it's not that I'm ashamed of it or anything. It's just like like I said I just doesn't really come up. I don't know but it's nice when we have books and characters Jason Stop. That's like hey this is something I'm going through. You know I never really thought about it but you are right. That mental health is becoming less of a stigma. Ma Phrase But we as a society have still not got quite got to the point where we openly talk about our mental health with others. Physical health is a a little bit more acceptable. Now and and it's accepted that you know society has accepted more that it's okay to have mental health issues in. It's okay okay to seek help for those issues. Yes but it's still a bit of a stigma to openly talk about it. Yeah and it's so funny. I was thinking about that with like if I was GonNa talk about about mine and I was like nobody cares not interesting. So do you think you like I said I love hearing about other people's much. Yeah so anyway I was like well. What a nice time to throw it out there that if like you're genre junkie that's just something else you can know about me is that I'm on a mental health? Lifelong lifelong journey as well. Well I guess I should join it on this. Since we're you know we're we're sharing and we're de stigmatizing it. I have my own mental mental health journey as well I mean I have. I have general depression but I also have pretty severe seasonal affective disorder. This time of year is very very difficult. I think it's I you know when it gets dark when it stays dark layton. It gets dark early. It's hard and it's it's hard to stay motivated to do anything. And so you know I. I think what's important when it comes to mental health is it's never one person's is worse or better or less or more than someone else's everyone else's journey is their own It's not a competition. Everyone has one. Yeah there's no one on this earth that does not have some sort of mental health journey. They may have rested or not addressed it. But it's there it's like. I'm so fine and I was so perfectly well-balanced all the time it's like Okay I started to get suspicious of you but no that's great and you know what if captain of the King's Army me Prince Terron can talk about it by God. We can talk about it. How about an appeal score? I'M GONNA go first on this as well and I am giving this the very rare mass appeal score to this book that his rare. That is where we don't we don't just hand those out route. I think that this is not just for fantasy. Readers I think this is incredibly well written when it comes to as we've just been discussing his mental health journey and everyone I feel there's something to relate to almost anyone in this book and I think that's that's really special and that's really powerful and you know there's nothing in there that's GonNa turn off people who are quote unquote nod into fantasy. Because it's not it's it's it's low fantasy yes not not fantasy light. It's low fantasy and I think that that actually feeds into it even better. There's there's everything and is explained in a human natural way and everything is is realistic in that sense and for that reason. I think that this is a this is a powerful book that anyone one can enjoy. I agree and I was actually leaning somewhere in between but I thank you. Swayed my vote. Over into mass mass appeal. I agree because because like I mentioned earlier like if you're kind of just getting into fantasy or kind of dipping your toes in this is a comfortable place to do it this type of book or if you've read a ton of fantasy and maybe looking for kind of had different take a different perspective. This is a nice opportunity for that too and I want to touch on one other thing that that before we go into our spoiler sexually about the writing style alkyl on this is a very uniquely written book to me me where it where Jennifer definitely writes this story in a sense where it's you can tell it's kind of written in one one go like it's it's it's like a creative writing prompt but turned up to eleven in a good way which which is a really unique way to write a mass published book. That really works very well for the story and so this is this. This is a unique book as well that I recommend that you are dear listeners read because it is not written like many other books that we have reviewed viewed on this show in the past. Yeah and it's a really good example of this style of writing. ooh That was really well said Scott. I don't I don't know that I could say it any better. That's pretty actually occurred. Actually my hat. I tip my hat to you. I take your hat. I wear hats I am your. I'd become your hat. We're just talking about Canada. America's hat hitting bidding. We Love You Canada. We have a new listener in Canada. Who wrote a really nice reviews? Oh yes we yes yes Sydney are L.. In Canada left us a review on apple podcasts. I didn't catch it when you I left it because we're not in Canada but I did just get notification. Thank you so much very very very sweet. We don't do a whole lot of like. Hey comment like subscribe on this show. Why can subscribe the? Yeah but we really do like it and we do like to hear from everybody is really cool and you know we have a pretty pretty good presence on social media at least my God we try instagram anyway. Scott is overwhelmed or twitter so but we are available to you and listen on spotify or apple or whatever we really deeply appreciate it and thank you for doing so yes thank you so much and and without further ado. Why don't we talk to this author Jennifer and see if we can find out a little bit more and then we'll see you for some spoilers all right everybody in without further ado as promised promised we are GonNa kick off our interview with today's author Jennifer Li? Hi Jennifer. Hi this is Lee or is it lay just realizing think mess that up it is Lee although my son for whatever reason insists on calling me lay your right you got. It stopped cutting one all right off to a great start Jennifer. Thank you so much for joining US tonight. Thank you for having me. I'm super excited. This is really exciting for us to get to talk. Talk to you We haven't had in a few little bid and we especially loved to interview female authors whenever we get a chance. Oh cool while then you've come to the right. Replace all right awesome. Scott do you WANNA kick us off. Yes so I just WANNA start right off right at the beginning. What inspired the story? Meanwhile that That question is low number one question. I get asked about this book because no one seems to understand so it's based off of an old Cherokee okay or a native American legend where an old man is talking to his grandson about the two wolves that are inside of us. All right we have a good wolf. We have a bad wolf both warring against each other all the time and the wolf. That wins is the woolsey feed so basically it's all about not giving into the negativity in your lives and making sure you're not getting overwhelmed by all of that and you're feeding the good wolf the whole time so my story. My poor hero Taryn is just besieged with all of these negative emotions all the time and he's constantly struggling to not feed that wolf basically for months and months after he gets back from war. Okay the legend. That's really really beautiful. Yeah so do you have. Do you have experience with that sort of that sort of mythology in the past or is this. There's something that you researched in in writing this book you know. It's kind of a shame to say I didn't do any research whatsoever. Don't judge me I please no But I always I've known about this legend for a long time. I've kind of seen it out there just in random searches for book topics and things like that and one one day. My daughter was talking about something I don't know. And she came up with this line and she just said Bob it's like there are bodies everywhere and I was. Oh my gosh. What a great opening in line and I thought about bodies being everywhere in who that would pertain to okay? A soldier all right a young soldier and there's bodies everywhere and I love fantasy honesty so I'm gonNA choose fantasy. What's this guy's story? It's the bodies are everywhere so obviously the battle is done and now it happens to him well now basically he has. PTSD St Right. So it's about this poor guy who has all these problems in the aftermath of what he's seen and done and then trying to deal with all that kind of blends into this feeding the wolf mythology the dark and the light the good and the evil all that warring within us all the time. Wow there's like scanner like in awe. That's deep man but it is deep. It's actually quite deep. It sort of is but I'm again I didn't do any research into PTSD. In retrospect I probably should have the book this kind of came out of me and turned into what it is and yet poor Taryn just having to bear the brunt of my strange neuroses I gets kind of happens right like characters can take on a life of their own and we get that all the time from authors that we talked to you is. They're like I don't choose what this character does. It talks to me. Yeah it's so true in my organic writing style. That sometimes gets me in trouble but more often than not works out for the better that you're so right all of a sudden the characters will do something. Say something or they'll just up here on the page. Also they just kind of grow into existence without you even conjuring them it's pretty cool So did you. You always want this book to be a fantasy or did you. For a little while think that it could be a contemporary science fiction No I think fantasy overall overall I've written five other books and they're all kind of different genres and I discovered that fantasy was my favorite too right from so I thought well if I'M GONNA have this book that'd be the best it can be the best representation of my writing than I'm gonNA write with. Start with the best of me which is fantasy so it always started out that way. Nice so so. We've often described that like Scott night in our interests lake in if you look at it as a van diagram like I am like more. The horror he's sci fi and fantasy is like where we overlap unlike cava shared Who are some of your favorite fantasy? Writers were fantasy novels. Oh Gosh I love Sarah J Moss. Yeah I know you like that to her court of Thorns and roses. Series isn't quite as dear to me as the throne of glass but still. I enjoyed it very much. I've I've actually read it twice. Yeah I'm an avid avid reader Jay Christoph is another favourite although he's kind of a hybrid. I just finished a series of his never night. Chronicles which was fantasy to me. But I'm also now reading his Aurora rising which is more of the sci-fi so I kind of a hybrid blend to actually actually nice. Okay Yeah I was GONNA say kind of on that note. How about Sifi? Yeah not a huge sci fi fan but I did enjoy Books like the Hunger Games aims the divergent series the illuminate files actually another J Christoph. Yeah things like that so kind of something. That sort of almost has a little bit of a magic sort of element element to it or a fantasy element to it and also dystopia and so I don't know if that's considered sci-fi probably not as much but mechanic yeah for sure yet. Jay Kristof illuminate. He wrote that with another author to yes. How very cool? I think you are a little bit. The same star Wars Scott's more more like a spaceships and whatnot and I'm more like the will. What if you know worst case is yeah agreed no totally? That's a perfect way to describe it. You're more star wars. He is more star. Trek's got it. Well he looks wounded Star Wars. Let me start worse. But you're also a star trek exactly more than I am. Yeah I mean I've watched like four upset star trek in my life so I think thank you thank you are i. I liked them both just like them. Both you can like them both at absolutely so Jennifer. What is your favorite part of the writing writing process while well? The process is so multifaceted and for me being an organic writer. I don't really have a starting point. I just kind kind of jump in wherever the mood takes me so sometimes I'll even start with just something simple like title coming up with a title or coming up with the characters name or a place where they're from or the color of their. I is super random but overall for me the best part is just creation. It's taking something from my brain a thought of an inspiration image even and putting it onto the page with words in a way that someone else could potentially see what I am seeing. So that's definitely What kind of calls to me with the whole writing in general as at creation process very cool so used a term that I haven't I haven't heard before and I I think I understand it but if you could explain it you said your organic writer can you? Can you explain that the way I understand that I've applied to myself is is that I don't have a super strong outline. Usually when I start to right I have more nebulous ideas. Something that kind of exists like I said a title jumped from this one line bodies everywhere that kind of jumped off from with my feeding the Wolf Story. I think it's mostly that the stories kind of grows naturally as you write it. I have a starting point usually an endpoint. I know where my want my characters to go but how they get there is usually up in the air. It just kind of one thing leads leads to another as I'm writing. It grows so more organic in that way. Does that make sense does actually do you find. Do you ever find yourself at a point with with your books where you have to kind of turn back time and change directions or do you just let it flow. It depends on the book book. I have a couple of books where it just one thing led to another beautifully. I didn't have to do a lot of backtracking. I didn't write myself into a corner and then I have other books that not only changed direction but changed vehicles like we jumped from like a bus to a truck to train to something else. It was ridiculous and those were super hard to write in super hard to finish so I learned my lesson a little bit. He kinda do have to have sort of an outline or bit of structure otherwise you really get into the weeds. And that's not a good place to be so I have written myself into the corners for sure but then other times it just kind of flows Outta me it's weird. I don't know really why that happens. If it's the subject matter or the content or the I'm more invested in the characters Thursday. The story itself not really sure how it works every once in a while I just Kinda yeah right myself into a corner and have to do a lot of backtracking to get back to a good starting place. I'm thinking like when you're saying organic I have this vision in my head of you like writing with a pen and paper like outside somewhere. I don't know why it's like a really beautiful visual but you probably don't you probably right at a computer. I'm guessing. Well there's one of my books actually That I wrote completely with pen and paper which is called something to believe in and it was really Kind of a challenge to myself. I had read an author's authors blogger. An article something somewhere. That said you're a more creative when you right with pen and paper because something happens. There's a direct link between your thought process and your body so things flow not literally but flow down your arm out your hand through penn onto the page something. You don't get that connection you don't get actually when you're typing on word processing. Whatever so I tried that I thought? Hey I'm GONNA try it see if it works. I love to challenge myself with my writing amounted. Write a whole book with only a pets. Let's of course it was several pens. But that's what I did and it was actually really. That was one of those books that just Kinda came. I just kind of flowed out of me. Just break-up writing and writing and writing the story kind of went in different places. I didn't know it was going to go here. It didn't know this person was going to do this. And all of a sudden they did it worked out great so a lot of backtracking GIG and of course. The editing was a little more arduous. Because when you type A story when you're riding on the computer you can sorta edit as you go whereas with pen and paper you really have to wait till you're all the way at the end before you can go back and start to fix things so that was a challenge but it was definitely a more more creative to me from the creation process than then just typing on a on a computer that it is. Oh my Gosh I feel justified. Thank you no problem commitment that it is incredible. Yeah it was like I said I love to challenge myself every book I've written represents a different challenge. I started out doing something that I'd never done before just to kind of see a can I do it embiid. Do I like it there. Yeah what's the first story. You remember writing When I was a kid I didn't do a whole lot of story? Writing I was was really into poetry when I was in third grade. Actually run a poetry contrast at my school. Thank you yeah and then I just didn't really write too much other than normal school assignments although I loved the creative writing essay assignments way more than argumentative or any other type of essay research the terrible but then after that I didn't do a whole lot I kind of graduated high school. I went to junior college for a little while. I met the love of of my life song named Neil him I so he wants kind of that happened. You get married you start having kids. You have to kind of think about more realistic goals and expectations for your life like. Hey that's got a job that pays money instead of being a star Dreamer for the rest of her life. So you kind of settled into that routine right in things from your childhood tend to kind of followed by the wayside so I really didn't write forever until like two thousand eleven. I finally only said Hey. I want to write a book and I did as crazy as that sounds. It's actually exactly how it happened. So that's my very first book. I ever publishes bushes called better off. It was self published but even still. It was my first flurry into. Hey can I do this and what does it feel like and do I like it and from there it was just I was lost lost. I am completely one hundred percent obsessed with writing. That's incredible de Right daily all the time. Oh my gosh do you yourself up to like a certain word count per day. No I have found that in when I try to limit myself in Little boxes around. Okay you have to do this. You have to do it this way you have to. Have you know the three acts and you have to do all this other ridiculously which is not organic writing. which is how I know? I am an organic writer. I don't like it. It feels like work feels like a task. It feels like a job. It's not fun to do that for me. So I say you know what if I only read back through what I just wrote. And that's all I do for my creative process today. Then that's what I do but end up writing ten thousand words. That's also what I do so I just let it kind of take me wherever it wants. Have you ever written ten thousand words in a day. I how she was going to say. Yes like when you said that. I'm like eating or oh my goodness yeah. Yeah there's been a couple of days I'll sit also K.. Today is going to be a writing day. I'm GonNa see what happens. I'm working on the middle of a story. Really WanNa get to the end or whatever and I have literally got sat on the couch. Like nine o'clock in the morning and I just right until like nine o'clock at night and I go back. Wow I just wrote ten thousand words. That's pretty cool. Yeah we it doesn't often but we have a slew of authors at our back right now coming to beat down your door and ask you how shared shared the answer than I probably would be an actual writer like for my full time job. But I don't know how it happens. That just happens and it's luck and it's not very very often it just kind of very random to a certain mood certain head space have lean a certain physical location. Yeah within my house. Everything has to be sort of quiet all kids dogs on and then I have to just be in the zone and then I'm in his own and I'm off to the races. That's really inspiring. Though that you that you have you know published multiple books and you still find so much joy in it that it doesn't feel like work and are able to be you know that that productive with it or just happy with it Yeah I really feel like I have so many stories to tell I mean I have the five books I've self published feeding the wolf which was traditionally published in a have probably about twenty others in progress at some point in the writing process. They're all kind of out there so I have a lot a lot a lot of imagination and stuff going on inside me that want to get on the. Hey I'm always writing. Something always doing something. Yeah absolutely that makes a Lotta Sense. When you describe your process that you would have different projects can going But you gotta see what's what's really true and what's really working for you read then exactly it's kind of like being at a buffet. You know you go to a buffet and you're like okay. What kind of food? Ma In the mood for tonight Chinese. Oh sweet here's some Chinese food or pizza or whatever so I say to myself what kind of riding my in the mood for by WanNa look at fantasy along contemporary a romance and adventure whatever. Oh Yeah I want to write about this and boom. Hey there it is I already have something in the works so believe it or not on occasion. Scott they do actually read literary fiction. So you don't have to you can and nonfiction and stuff too. I was just curious about some of your favorite works fantasy sci fi or not. Oh Wow I have read. I don't even know thousands and thousands of books over my life Dean Koontz used to be one of my all all time favorite authors. I haven't read a lot of Stephen King think to his books but I've read every single dinkins book he's ever written. That tells you a lot about the kind of writing that I liked lately. Though it's been all fantasy I mean it's do contemporary romance. I have read some Nora Roberts. Thank you very the course. Yes Jodi coal to read a lot of her stuff very moving lots of research involved with her stuff. I like also vampire book sandwiches and and you know all that kind of stuff. I read almost anything you put in front of me. I will read it and if I don't like it within the first three paragraphs out put it down and never pick it up again. uh-huh catches my interest. Already all the way through. Yeah that's you know it's bold in this day and age to to admit and we do too sometimes one musty. NF It's it's just you know what this isn't working for me did not finish goodbye. Yeah and the problem. I think that we have right now with the book. World is that self publishing exists Rates so anybody can write a book and self published it and sell it on Amazon or offer it for free or whatever so as an avid reader. You're constantly looking looking for new things to read and you're GonNa Recommendations by Friends of course to and good reads and all kinds of other bestseller lists etc but we run out of material. Sometimes and then you start controlling these lists of book picks and whatever else and you come across a lot a lot of junk and for me the more I write the more sophisticated indicated I guess my palate becomes so that means I want to read things that are more in line with what I write and the pickings are very slim at least for me. I don't find find a lot that I actually can stomach. I'm just like this book as a piece of crap. I can't believe it is out there in the world. I can't believe this person wrote this and called it like the Highlanders Islanders Lust at least name your book. Something a little bit more. I don't know creative or oh it's drives drives me crazy to see a new book jackets with this guy this kilt and he's got nothing on top and he's all this gleaming muscle and flowing hair like this is ridiculous. I I liked when I was like sixteen right. Yeah I'm guilty about but I think it would even though no it's so true it's like self publishing shing is just it's changed our world so much and there's stuff about it that's wonderful and then there's also like oh my gosh. I'm overwhelmed by so much coming at me at the same in time. Yeah it's hard. It's hard to pick the wheat from the chaff and get something good and then you stumble across something wonderful and by an author that you've maybe never ever considered reading before. They only have like two books. Dammit Yeah what like twenty from you and we need more of your style or your whatever and you're like oh man. You're so disappointed appointed to books and you just want more. We've had that discussion so many times. Not I mean sometimes on our show but even even just like in life where it's like but I want to devour the whole Canon. Why have you written a whole Canon? Exactly and what have you not Abella and like spinoff series and like Kanno Lee more for me to devour. And then there's the ones that start like trilogies and and five book series and they only get two books in like I. I want the rest though these yes exactly and so sometimes. I'll even look if I find a book that I want to read. Okay is it one of a trilogy or Douala College or whatever and if it is are the other books already available. Because of the aren't I'm not GonNa read this one yet because I want to be able to devour like binge-watching i WanNa Binge read. I want the whole series every episode all at once. Now please he is. And I think that's why we end up kind of rereading some books and some favorite authors is because it's like. Oh well I mean I just needed hit again. It's like drugs one hundred percent agreed. And you know I've read a fair amount of Gene Kunes in my life. Life was I was raised on the KOONS. I'm from one of those households where I've gotten into a fight with my dad over. WHO's better Stephen King Dean Koontz? Because my dad loves Stephen in King Dean Kootz till I die and you know Mr Mr Kuc can get pretty scary. He can. He's but he's also one of those where it's not so scary that you feel like you have to put it down because you're going to have a heart attack if you don't it's one of those stories where you need to see what happens next and that is his brilliance. I I liked that I I can see that are Human Scott. You haven't read Enough Dean Koontz. I think you'd really enjoy him are probably would i. Don't know if I've read any Dean Koontz now. I can't think awesome ahead. I know I know you should. Yeah yeah well psychological thriller if you like that. That's I think his specialty and the good thing thing about Dean Koontz if you read him and you like him he's written like a hundred books so we don't have that full problem of where I want. More guess what there's all walk nor and all of his I don't think he has any series that he hasn't wrapped up either. So I think you're pretty safe. Yeah yeah the Odd Thomas Series. I love his Frankenstein. Stuff is really good. Yeah Yeah and all and all the rest of his standalone staff is just amazing. Amazing so I would like to talk about some of these works that you say that you have working working in the future. Is there anything kind of near completion that we can look forward to. Hopefully there is one that I'm probably in my seventh Seventh round of editing. This might editor and we're getting very close to being done. I've been working on. This book feels like forever. It's called Cemetery County and it is contemporary. And it's about a private investigator who is struggling with the ghosts of his past coming back to haunt him not literal ghosts but Komo Sandra already. So I'm just lumped into the carpet. No that sounds really. ooh that sounds awesome but as someone who's a huge fan of liberal coats I was like worried. She read it. Goose store I did did not and I wouldn't. I would love to write a ghost story but no this particular one. So it's it's and like I said with everyone of my books. I've tried to challenge myself so this my challenge with this one was to write all of it in first person present tense from the male perspective. Oh so that's what I've done. I've never done that before. So we'll see what happens now. Give now you've caught Scott's attention for sure I'm definitely. I'm definitely interested in it because I have troubles with that particular perspective that tents l.. Really why is that. I don't know always read. It's always just read different for me. Maybe just because I grew up reading so much past tense. That present tense. It definitely creates a a sense of urgency. It's just sometimes it it just it hits me different snow it is. You're totally right. The tents and the point of view make a huge difference with the story. You're telling so I always consider that with my stories stories. This one this private investigator like I said he's Kinda dealing with this person coming back into his life that's really throwing him for a loop and he's all mentally messed up and it was sort of. PTSD to think about it thinking. I sense a theme I with my writing but he kind of action and a lot of love this. This person is kind of running through the gamut of all these mind games so he's constantly like looking for the hidden bodies over here in the criminal over there. Erin all this kind of stuff. So it's sort of crime but it's it's also sorta thriller. He's a serial killer the bad guys serial killer so there is a sense of urgency in the story itself so when you tell it in present tense because the story itself is urgent it only helps the story that I am really intrigued intrigued by that premise. That sounds pretty pretty cool and I think it's Really admirable and fascinating that you've got another character coming up. That's working through trauma because I think that's what makes our characters interesting right is when they're working through something really dark and heavy and it kind of helps us was reader and I imagine as a writer to no definitely. It's it's kind of meat juicy. It gives you something as a writer to sink your teeth into your character and this is definitely a redemption story. I mean this guy is kinda starting out on the wrong side of right and he really needs to get to the other side so the whole book is kind kind of about him exploring the mistakes he made trying to work through all that to get to the place where he can be actually be happy or these healthy with what's happening in his life and in the meantime time there's this bad guy trying to not let that happen. Essentially go a lot of challenges coming his way both internal and external and just kind of seeing him handle. Well it and the best part about the book is his name is Neal. Oh so I finally modeled the character after my wonderful husband. He's super thrilled. uh-huh yeah except for all right. We'll see how you feel my wife in the end the pack of dogs and cats. I wouldn't be surprised now doesn't happen man. Yeah we'll just we just wrote our own fan fiction version I think so weights. I have to say to that cover feeding the wolf is. It's really simple but it's really really beautiful. I love typography. That was chosen as well Severi. Pretty Buck Yeah. I was really surprised because my publisher we were going back and forth the funniest story the book cover so I kept trying to explain to him that there's not an actual wolf in this book. Wolf is a metaphor okay. uh-huh literary publisher you know what a metaphor is. Listen to my words. But he didn't he he to covers the first cover was a picture of a wolf on a hill howling at the moon. No yes but the second picture I can cover was a picture of a very close up picture. Picture of the side of a wolf's face head on front on not a silhouette profile shot but not just half of it and with a big tree in the background and then also oh a full moon kind of up in the sky so I wrote a real fast at him and I was just like okay for the hundredth time. The Wolf the book is not a Literal Role Wolf. Can you please just like it's more subtle. It's like it's like the idea wolf so then finally he. He came back to me with the cover that you see. He's like Oh. This isn't a middle grade a book about a Werewolf. Oh Okay Oh my God no Oh yes so finally. He came back with that and I love it. I love the is at the top. I agree the simple typography the gold with the white and then just my name at the bottom real simple. The only the thing I worry about it I was the cover makes it seem like it's contemporary but it's not so it was kinda worried that people will be thrown by the cover expecting being a story that you know that takes place kind now and this story obviously doesn't take place now I don't know. Do you think that made a difference when you read it did. Were you thrown by that at all. Not at aw. I wasn't thrown by it and now I think it actually added to the darkness of the just the general feeling of the book like that that just that depression that that Dr the darkness of the cover is very striking. And then when you're actually holding it and you close it and he's like oh it's just so ominous yes I love it. It's black the requested it be black but it came out I was like Oh my God. This is brilliant. This is beautiful so so finally you got it right. Time's a charm by the way I wouldn't mind if you did write a middle grade where we'll book. I'm just saying if that was if that means speaks to you. We're going to read that. Yeah I don't have any where will folks in the works right now. I do have a book about a shadow demon. So we'll see what happens with that and a book about an angel and a demon who our enemies. This constantly fighting each other across millennia does the closest I have to wear wolf. I guess right now we will. We'll take my she would reach. Please looking for natural books. We'll take two of each send them to our Po box and match absolutely. You could be my Beta readers for life. I love it. Oh God you know we. We've had to write many an apology because we've tried to Beta readers but with our with the content creating what what we do we fall behind. Were terrible Beta readers. We don't we don't agree to pay to read anymore. I know because we just we couldn't keep up. We felt so guilty. So you became Omega readers. Then right bottom of the packs just I got true actually. Yeah it's true and it's you know what it's like. We'd love to read your book. We're just gonNA unfortunately have to read a finished copy. Oh totally no yeah. Absolutely get it for sure. Oh good yeah. My feelings are not hurt whatsoever. Thick skin. I'm a writer later. I can deal with it. Alright yes absolutely. Okay so Jennifer. You are so flipping positive about everything that has to do with writing and publishing. We never asked this. But what is the hardest part about writing for you. Editing no hesitation editing. I actually hate it. I hate the editing process because it is the antithesis to creation. You're actually taking things and you are destroying them your une creating creating because you are taking what you originally wrote on your changing it. Or you're deleting it. I've had delete delete entire chapters of my books for feels like someone is taking out. What a piece of my heart with a spoon painful? I hate it I hate it. Yeah it makes the books better. It makes the story stronger. The characters more well rounded overall. It's it's nothing but a positive thing it's part of the process. You can't skip it. I have read books where it's obvious people have and today's suck. I want to put out the best product I possibly can. And if that means spending hours and hours editing than that's what I'm GonNa do I'm not GonNa stop until it is absolutely as good as I think it can be. I have extremely high standards for myself because I know as a reader I hate reading crop and I don't want anybody to read one of my books and say that was crap what I mean. So yeah that's it. I'm just going to have to embrace the suck and power through now. That's I think that's very very wise and I mean that's the truth I who like my minds blown a little bit editing like the antichrist entity it's so true uh-huh isn't it Yup. That's why I hate it. Scott Editing. PODCAST that's creative. There is a creative aspect to it because sometimes is you have to put more in. You have to add dialogue here. You have to expand a section there you have to at an Intro to this chapter or an exit or whatever you do have to put stuff in but more often than and not your taking stuff out your deleting words. You're altering things like I said entire chapters sometimes more than one and sometimes it can also take forever might the fourth book that I wrote called Uncommon started out as a vampire book. Okay Okay Ninety up. I wanted to write a story. Started out where there was this girl. And she was hitchhiking talking and she gets picked up by this guy who turns out to be a vampire and it was all about him having a familiar. who was a dog but it was written such that the reader did not know the familiar was a dog? It was written. That familiar sounded like it was a person and they wouldn't find out it was a dog until the end. Anyway I started out with his great idea and that was well on my way I was like thirty thousand words in which is quite a lot and my friend who is also made editor convinced me to change it and I. I don't know why I let her do that. To me was really mean when I think about it you know just to tell me my idea was crap and to start over again but I was. You know younger then more impressionable. Why did I listened to her and I started over and we took that book again? I was thirty thousand words. Ends talk about backtracking Scott like how do you get to a place where sometimes you have to let go way back in time and start over again. I did and it sucked and we spent the editing getting like a told you about Amman round seven of my book of Cemetery County Right now. We took seventeen rounds of editing for that book to be finished hole whole and that's after I was done writing it. Oh my goodness yeah. We don't start the editing process until the story is done so I had not only rewrite it but rewrite it to completion and and then spend seventeen times of going through the book in its entirety. Until it was done riddick just you basically rewrote the book. Look tiny increments. Yeah like I said. That process taught me a lot. That book was the first book that I wrote in present tense so there was a huge huge learning curve. There right so it taught me a lot in that regard. It also taught me that editing can be a good thing because again. The story only got stronger with each iteration Shane with each round. We went through the story stronger and stronger and stronger now. It's something that I'm proud of right. So it was worth it. If I kind of like childbirth go through these hanging and and it hurts like a son of a and then you come out the other end anyhow this gorgeous product. I appreciate that honesty and all. Yeah I mean 'cause how do you know till until you know like it's trial and error and it's a labor of love one hundred percent. Yep Well Jennifer thank you so much again for joining US tonight. And where can our listeners find you. I haven't had any signings not for lack of trying but I haven't done any signings. I'd have a book launch but it was private so nobody we found me there who didn't already know me and my website. It's really important for people to go there because there is another Jennifer Lea so I'll dishes so if you just go to Amazon search for Jennifer Lea. You're gonNA come with a whole bunch of books that I didn't right. Okay okay. That's good to know. Yeah so Jennifer Lee author Dot Com. com is my website. It has a page has my current five self published books plus the link to feeding. The Wolf has a blog which I publish about once every three to four weeks and also links to my twitter facebook fantastic and I in preparation for interview. I did read your blog and it is lovely great eight website to thank you very much. I don't get to the blog as often as I'd like but that's mostly because I forget your cheap. Is he creative in writing. I am too busy working on other stuff and dealing with my full time job and my husband and my two kids of my pets and my yes very busy I like it. You're you're my type of girl. Stay busy yes. That's nightly that. We don't get into trouble as neil extra say. Yeah this is sounding really familiar. Yeah running really feeling really seen right now all right Mr all right then. Well I guess we're going to let you go but thank you so much Jennifer for giving us an interview. It was an absolute pleasure and I'm sure this'll be something really exciting for a lot of maybe budding authors out. Thanks to hear your take on the process. Yeah I hope so on. Thank you so much for having me. It was super cool. The beat you guys and to be on I really appreciate it Wow that was interesting. Thank you again Jennifer Jennifer for that interview and without any more delay. Let's talk about spoilers. So I want to open up the spoiler section by saying that yes we do have a connection to Jennifer. Oh we have never met her prior to recording that interview. Yeah and yes. I was terrified to read and review this book. Having the connection that we have with her. She's a local author. Yes I was really afraid that I would not like this book. Of course Same Yeah and when I first started it I was still afraid I wouldn't like it's book Man Does this book just below expectations out of the water. A really it really did for me too and and I mean of course I was nervous about it but I was like well. You know like sometimes like that's the positive takeaway from a book is like this book is just not for me but I can tell you who this facebook is four but no I actually enjoyed it for myself as well. So that's always a really really nice. I don't know this is nice so so yeah. This book revolves directly around Taryn and his mental health issues in regards to him going off to war and losing losing men that he truly cared about and falling towards that darkness that starts with depression and anxiety and I an unwillingness for him to open up and turns into him becoming a crazy assassin will which is really bad ass us but not okay well right because he wasn't like dealing with stuff. Yeah he actually has a panic attack in. This book are few few but very refreshing again. I think that we are seeing shades of this in a lot of genre books were mental health is being addressed but especially especially when you think about our fantasy characters and the issues they go through all I mean they need help they only healers look at the things like look even my ferry books in my fairies or walking out to these things unscathed like no. They need help absolutely. And there's a lot out of books that definitely makes mental health part of the part of the character part of the the larger picture as far as an individual This this book T.. The the main the main driving point of the plot of the existence of this story the reason for it to exist is a exportation of the mental health of characters in a story. Such as this. Yeah I would say. Jennifer's biggest strengths is writing characters actors and Specifically writing a really well saturated lead. I think that that's a really really cool thing and really big compliment. We've talked about before generally speaking. We're really into character motivate at work as opposed to plot driven It's it's just really important for us. And this was no exception and I think the fact that she made a lead hero that you could really sink. Thank your teeth into and that you care about like you like you said like she does some kind of bad ass things and stuff. But then you're like this is like healthy. He is this really the way he wants to be living his life but he's not bad but he's not an angel and it was just very refreshing and even what what what I found powerful towards the end is all the choices that he made when he was going down that dark path or understandable and even justifiable liable. Oh sure but they were ultimately still not okay. Hey they were damaging to his soul. They were damaging you know legally uh-huh the good choices despite how well intentioned they seem to be and we'll yeah because I ki- rationalizes those decisions Asians and so like you're like Oh okay yeah I get it but then at the same time it's like Cisco them the ending did something that I know you and I have touched on and other books too that we really like where the characters the romantic to he and Amelia. They spend time apart and that is huge in a book when it's like they don't just go immediately together and then they're going to get married and La la La la La. It's like no. She has some stuff to work through stuff to work through and they take time apart from one another very healthy it is healthy. There is is something to be said that I actually quite enjoyed but the relationships in this book with the exception of Roffe in grace ah or you say Ravi Essay Rave I went back and forth in my head but I should have stuck with Rossi we should feel. I'm okay with my head cannon. I'm comfortable with it. With with the exception of their relationship with D.. which definitely does kind of go through like an ebb and flow and a slow build? A lot of the relationships are are set from a very early point in characters meeting and I actually was kind of okay with that because because it doesn't follow the standard you know. Writing Conventions of the relationships are what a story is built around and what the characters are built around in real life. You know how you feel about somebody pretty quickly into meeting. I guess that's true that's true I mean how many times is like do we just become best friends like like when you have those interactions with people. It's either like Oh yeah. This is a person that I met her. Oh this person that I'm friends with now. It's very quick for me. Everyone is is my best friend. Now what does that mean. Oh that's true but the the other thing is because it allowed the again the mental health development of Taron to become the main driving point and not the relationships of him with other people becoming the driving point and I actually found that kind kind of refreshing and the characters themselves are honest You know they're they're presented in their true sense from the get go. You know for a while. I was waiting for the other shoe to drop on other characters. Because I'm a very mistrusting person. When it comes to reading it could be after years of reading the books that we've been in reading? I kept expecting His sister the princess to to stab Greece in the back or the king or to find out that the king was really behind these horrible atrocities to these other nations which is why they were trying to invade and none of that stuff happens because these are these are the characters these are who these people are. They're generally kind people and they generally have for the most part healthy relationships relationships and expectations. I'll go into Greece and Taryn in a moment in that regards but I like that just that that that honesty st of character in everybody in this book it allowed me to focus on what was important. This really really good. Take away from that. Actually I think that there's there's something to that. And there's a quote that's often said originally Maya angelou quote and then Oprah uses it. A lot is in a lot and it's kind of paraphrase. I basically when people tell you who they are believed them. I love that quote me. Two and Scotland's unreliable narrator. And but I think I think we've just been an abuse still slow reader. It could be used and abused to go ahead. He went to talk about grace and turn okay. So the one exception to that is the the relationship between grace and Taryn is very complicated. It is In regards that there's there's very strong romantic question-mark feelings between the two of them in the beginning the two of them don't really understand the feelings they have for each other inches. Part of it Slightly slightly problematic. Yeah it is. It is a very unhealthy thing for someone who is in charge of someone not in charge but who is somewhat responsible for the healing of one's mental health to become romantically involved with that person and it's like they kind of like no so it though. Don't you think I felt that. Yeah but I didn't read that. Does that make sense. I think so because like they I think they just don't really know what they are in a lot of ways because there is a chemistry to them and then like grace is able to get him to taken up a bit. Yes and I can imagine that someone is really not used to talk about mental health. And it's supposed to be like this strong young macho guy that that could create a discomfort certainly and I think it's completely natural for someone who has gotten so so close to somebody that they know like they are one of the only people that know their their darkest secrets and in reverse. This is one of the only people I've ever told my darkest darkest secrets it's complicated like should we like she like hook up now. There's going to be strong feelings around that which is which is kind of a therapist. Dilemma from You know getting to attach exactly. Yeah and that's and that's a very real thing. I would have liked to have seen a little bit of of exploration into that particular subject Whether it be covered by by I mean it doesn't even have to be a guilty realty thing that addresses it would have would have been welcome by me. Yes I agree and a character that I actually really he liked was ray for Raffi. I think I think he was a really good complicated character. That was also kind of like take somewhere between lists. I'm supposed to be masculine. And this is like my bro. And then also like like this for this girl and there's almost like a I love triangle going on and the fact that he just really really wants to help Taryn so much There was a lot there era and I could've used more of his character and his exploration Rossi's my favorite character. Yeah I think he's probably mine too. I did want more of Roffe or Rafe. Like I love. I loved grace. Oh Yeah I really liked her perspective. Eleven million to I could've used more Rossi's perspective earlier on and continuing throughout I would've I would've been happy to see a three part split between those three characters because I thought that all three of them deserved spotlight. But you know it's funny because it kind of leads me back to my shakespeare comment where there's like a lot of Shakespeare plays there's Cadillac take these supporting characters. That's like you're actually really interesting. Though like you're Ben folios whatever like Rosencrantz and kill them. Stern I'm sure there are really but yeah like how did the same thing of like. I'm really interested in what you have to say. But this is in their air story but I could still but I still wanted more from them. So and that's where that's where ultimately like my my position on on the book and the where and I feel like the books position separate a little bit because I feel that I feel that the the main plot plot device in a sense is terrance mental health. And it's very important and powerful. Yes but I don't feel like it was his story not his and his alone. I felt like it was more the story of grace and Roffe. I I wanted it. I should rephrase this. I wanted to be the story of Roffe and grace uh-huh and the and the direction of the plot and the story to be driven by tarrant. Yeah and what ended up being was obviously more of a book just about Tehran. Yeah both in both in being his story and the plot. Yeah I I would love I I just for me this book doc was the story of grace and Roffe dealing with this poor this person. They share chaos. Yeah no I agree and I. I found their our relationships like I said this kind of a triangle triangle is like a trope. That doesn't quite fit here. It's more of an emotional emotional triangle and I it really would have welcomes more of that into the yeah. I would've been real happy with that. I really do like Amelia and I think she really added a Nice Punch to the story. Because I think that terron needed somebody that hasn't known him in the way those other two characteristed stood and I think that that was an important foil for him. Plus she's like the Robin Hood of like their area. That's cool I I liked. I light her character a lot. I wanted to actually talk a little bit about her character and Taryn combined at the moment when they met each other is the point when I said okay okay. I could cut the book right here and this is the beginning of my new. DVD campaign with the two main care. I mean they're near perfect. They're perfect to assassin slash rogue class characters he's multi classed into warrior and just uh-huh and just go out on adventures and be bad ass. Assassins I was down for that. Well you know we don't know where they're these characters are GONNA go. Oh Oh I don't think Taryn will ever kill again. I don't think they need to kill anybody. But maybe they need to do missions and stuff no. I don't think that he'll ever go out and do missions against I don't that's okay to say this like really sad though. I think that it was very important for this book to end with Taryn. Coming home home and being you know being human again and feeding the good wolf as Jennifer would put it. I think that that was that was where this book should have ended. Yeah but what I would cut off fifty pages for my dvd campaign. I see okay. You know he hasn't found that happiness yet he's still has the darkness in them and let's go kill a dragon and I think that you know if he ends up Kinda ruling the kingdom. I think that a meal be a really good person for him them to have in his corner I mean obviously there romantically involved but she could almost be like a senator or something like I mean I get the idea that she would be. The Queen. Queen agreed agreed. She I think the three of them Amelia Roffe and grace would ultimately ebby his counsel. Yeah and I think that the four of them combined make a very good leadership system. Yeah and kind kind of hand in hand with mental health there's vulnerability to that is very appealing in these characters especially interns arc. Because vulnerability vulnerability is something that I've struggled with in my life but it's important to be vulnerable so that other people can be vulnerable to you and that's like a lesson that I took away hugely from this book. I agree with you. Ultimately vulnerability is the the magic of the healing of the story. Yeah so you know the only way any of them can be you know can be happy in this story is to be vulnerable to someone else. Grace has to be vulnerable to herself in a mid her own feelings and explore her own feelings roffe has to be a vulnerable to grace and admit his feelings to her. Taryn has to be you. You know I mean Taryn has to be vulnerable to somebody. Anybody ends up being Amelia and Amelia's the same deterrent. It's it's Amelia. Teaches teaches that to Tehran very very very very true. Okay guys I think it's time to give this one a execution. I'll go. I know you you go first. Oh I go for yeah you go I see how many moons out of five okay. I think this book is incredibly unique and inventive in the way that it approaches which is mental health issues. And I think that it's incredibly brave to put it into a fantasy setting. I think that Jennifer does a really good job of treating reading those issues with respect as I said. There's a few slightly problematic areas that that that just you know scratched me a a little bit wrong But ultimately I can vary much. Forgive those because of the way this was approached. I'm going to give this. I'M GONNA give four moons out of five. I think that it was a fantastic. I think that it's inventive. And unique and I think that it should be read. ooh I really love that I think I think you've really Sir Mayes this book very well this episode and I don't know why I sound shop but I am. Yeah really affected me. It's because we've done a lot of horror recently and that's more your wheelhouse to explain. Maybe that's true been kind of in that mindset. I agree I think. The book is just very brave and very compassionate and interesting and very introspective for a lot of people. Hello and I just have a lot of admiration for its source. So that having been said I am going to also give it for moons Out of five though. I'm still waiting for middle grade. Where Wolf Book you know we don't you don't think we usually agree on the four on the four level right usually usually? It's I mean this that which just stands to how good this book is. How how interesting this book is? Yeah I think this book opened up Parme minds and our perspectives as readers and reviewers in a little bit of a different way that neither of us were expecting and that is very compelling to me and it'll be something I think about quite a bit all right everybody. The Yuletide is upon us or as I like to call it. Christmas straightness Goffman also acceptable. But most importantly you'll Christmas and GRANDPA's time campus time so I guess like we said earlier. Thank you all for being amazing listeners and followers and for reading books anybody that reads books your a fricken hero. Never Stop we love. You guys love you so much. This is also the season of mold wine which Scott I I really look forward to every year. Yes gingerbread as gingerbread. I loved Gingerbread I like gingerbread the Qiqihar. The better ginger. And Yeah you could just get rid of the bread. Your happy switch singer all right. Join US very very soon for our end of the year. Here's a tackler. But until then please keep reading past your bedtime Aw just start collecting items while our recording. I swear by the time we're done recording always have like four or five items in my hands. It's a weird thing like you me with stuff is you. Were shaking your leg. It's an octopus thing building a garden while we record. He's built the vending little gardens.

Human Scott Jennifer writer Scott Sandra Taryn Canada Dean Koontz Jennifer Lea PTSD Turner Jason Stop UNIFIL Kanno Lee depression Council Soleil Jonah Junkies editor Regan Sandwich Jon favreau
71 | Horror/Fantasy | The Babysitters Coven by Kate Williams

Genre Junkies | Book Reviews

1:09:37 hr | 1 year ago

71 | Horror/Fantasy | The Babysitters Coven by Kate Williams

"We should do this episode though. Clap pop I beat you to it did now. I gotTa do it again. We dental chill. Okay Redan Weirdo bookworm unite. We want to share our love of John. Fiction with you some readers out. There may look down on you for your love of Horse Scifi and fantasy but not us so stop by as we discuss what we've been reading. Hi John Rich uncles. This is Sandra and this is Scott. And you're looking forward to one of the most buckwald editing situations. I am ever going to put myself into. Yeah because tonight is a very special episode of Jonah Junkies. That's right. We are reviewing a very special book with two very special friends from the Spooky Slumber Party. So we're we're probably going to air this episode on bull channels. Yeah yes this is also one episode of the Spooky Slumber Party so I guess you guys introduce yourselves to yes now Dover on John Junkies. What we do is we review books. We Review Horror Scifi and fantasy and all the sub genres there in the first half is always spoiler free and on occasion. We like to have guests and interviews and this is a really Meta episode. Because not only am I John Junkie. I am also a spooky slumber Ed de my worlds colliding and I love odds. Collide pods collided. So you know who I am you know who Scott is over on spooky slumber party. I am known in some circles as the lit which that is true. Yeah why the call you that Sandra because of the books and the Magic. Yes all right. Who else who else we got here. Whose mother slumber at roll call. I'm Kelly Hitmen. I'm known as the Scream Queen on Spooky slumber party mother and right over there all you scream queen. Oh because I do all that kind of acting type of stuff. There was a little shoulder movement. Rusty. But you can hear it very sultry. Yes like assaulted nut. How was assaulted? Nuts soldiery just did it? You just showed it that. Was it cash shoe or a honeyman? Daime acquit naming nuts. And who's this fabulous creature? Hi It's me Emma. I'm known as the Derby Devil on Spooky Slumber Party that because I play Roller Derby is my other true passion in life besides podcasting from just all things pod so thanks Donald Junkies for having us here. Thank you for joining us. It's and this book is perfect to have you guys on earth. It in fact. I believe it was three of you on Spooky Slumber Party. That suggested this book must think so. It's never like Sandra. Yeah I listened to your episodes more than you do you guys get at. It's all the content on the on the genre junkies network so let's just kinda get into it. I'm going to read the synopsis for You guys. So this is the babysitters coven by Kate. M volumes. Seventeen year old as Pearl has the baby sitters club. She knows it's Kinda Lame. But what else does she supposed to do? Can Job Gross besides as babysitting and she's good at it and lately as many needs all the cash she can get because it seems like destruction follows her wherever she goes. Let's just say. She owes some people in Nutri. Enter CASSANDRA haven. She's instagram model. Hot dresses like she found her clothes in a dumpster and has a rebellious streak as gnarly as the cafeteria cooking. So wise Cassandra willing to do anything even take on potty training two year old to join as Maze Babysitters Club. The answer lies in a mysterious note. Cassandra's mother left her. Find the babysitters love mom? I'M GONNA leave it at that. I am so glad that I did not read. That Synopsis Likes hated it. He doesn't like to read synopsis. Yeah I don't either. I generally don't Spoil Myself With Synopsis Seizes but avoid trailers No no movies are different books. I books like the longer period of time that it takes to read it. I like to be more surprised as I go along and I always tell him. He's spoiled as a book podcast. Somebody needs to read and so I do that. I keep I keep his little world pure such a sacrifice just sacrifice. I'm not as worried about spoilers and books. Though and I learned that from Kendra Blake. What can Dr at wonderful beloved author of the show? Kandara sales is that even like if with a book. Even when it's done those characters live on so it doesn't matter if it's spoiled for you because you can't really kill the character. They're still going somewhere and I always thought that was really cool. And I'm like I can hang with that. I really love that. Basically when conductor tells me to do something do it she is. She is the best. She's awesome that this this synopsis does. It's weird because it tells a lot and at the same time it really doesn't because there's so much more than that I agree. There's a lot of stuff that that is between all of those points that are in that synopsis. That really flushes it all out but that really does cover a lot of kind of the growth of the story. And does I two thirds of it? Yeah one thing that doesn't really give away like the feel of the story just all the little details that make it so much fun and the humor. I mean there's a little just hearing you read it. There was that little part where you were like gross okay. That was funny. But this book is how Last outlaw areas like and I had read a few little things here and they're saying that it was funny and like okay. How funny is going to be no I was? I was laughing out loud parts. That funny is that funny. Yep So actually. Let's just kind of get into it with the experience score. And we're GonNa do this round robin style. We are going to talk about our patented John. Ra- Junkies Experience Score Let's START WITH OUR GUESTS SO EMMA O. Me I experience score hit US okay. I think I'm somewhere in between good. Read and page Turner. Because I did read this book incredibly Fast Thing. I finished it in like three or three or four days. Which is very fast for me. Because I haven't read books in a long time to talk about this on Zwicky slumber party rules one of my goals for this year. We should just read more books. And I'm already into my third book end up February so that feels good. Would you other books? The first one was babysitters Kevin and then the second one was my sister the serial killer. I was pretty good. Oh Okay Yeah. We need to hear some hot takes on that. Yeah it was it was. It wasn't what I wanted it to be but it was still really and now. I'm halfway into Saturday. Night Goes Club. You keep a very tidy. Tb Are you can tell your back on your reading game because for most readers the TB are is a little bit of a mess. You should be read to see my nightstand right now. It's awful horrifying right looking at his purple rolling. Show for you. This is like a tenth of a got a kindle so the nightstand mountain and their shrink a little bit. It doesn't guilt you just by falling on you and your sleep apnea so let's just a little bit more from Emma Kazai kind of cut you off. It got it okay. But what was it just a little bit more about this book for? Us did buster. It's Oh quickly because I really just wanted to know what was going to happen next I. It reminded me a lot of the craft in a way of you know teen which is. Kinda thing was Super Fun. Which is which is no not here with you. Know the craft rules all. Yes it does I love love. Love the craft. I loved the craft so much and it did. It did. Remind me a lot of the craft with like more humor and more. I don't even like the the little fashion references ought for fun. Yeah a lot of like you could tell like as really loves the nineties as a teen in the in in two thousand eighteen nineteen very fun. Yeah I I like it a lot. I think I would definitely read it again as like a when I need just some chill time Yeah numb my brain for a little while book for and that's what we call in the book community when you have a book hangover like you know. Sometimes you read a book and it's like it's so fricking good that you're like. I'm not ready for my next book. So then you need to have books on hand than usual in sub in for the hangover. So it's like those I read it and you know you can. You can rely on it to calm you. Yes Santa thing. Yeah Yeah I feel that yeah. Let's go to our slash next up so confused. Kelly incestuous episode. I love it. I feel like a Lancaster but Lancaster is my house in Gable thrown so Kelly no okay moving on. I have to say it say it. Say It's an obsession. All a you guys already knew it. I had to go there. I had to go there. I'm so I'm so critical when it comes to my entertainment but when I love something I love it. Hard and their love. I love it so much. Oh my gosh have you read it once through or have you read it multiple times just once just once. The fashion references. The I don't WanNA spoil too much. But the animal companion. Yeah I mean that was like like I got teary eyed. Does this hit close to home. Yes no she has. She has the most wonderful pit bull actually does only. This book is already racing to me and I was loving loving it so much and I found out she had a pit bull and I have a pit bull is like I love. I love it. I love your obsessed. There's nothing wrong with being and you know okay. Scream Queen and Hawaii A. That's that's like what I live for. If you if you listen to Bernie you'll quickly find out. We know that's why I am in. Am Into my children and Teens Horror Scifi fantasy? I also knew the how how much you would be obsessed with this. Just because cates descriptions of how how she describes outfits Oh I was like always living for this. I feel so seen by this book. Because that's how I got through high. School is every day. I did exactly what she does in this book and I was like. Oh my gosh. I'm not alone like not that I thought I was alone. But certainly none of my friends at school did that coming up with the different regions. No no it was like. Oh I'm GONNA wear pucajl. Loosen growing I would is okay. Overhaul of jeans jeans. They came from a thrift store. Okay they were they were they were they. Were kind of between you know boot. Cut and bell-bottoms and I wore them for like three years and they were the most comfortable jeans I've ever owned we Abercrombie still exist. I haven't been I does it. Smells exactly the same. I feel like I need to walk in just for the Nostalgia Club. I'm going to Scott. I'm sorry I'm going to have to interject here. So I'm somewhere between page Turner and obsession on this book. I really had a great time reading. It is laugh out loud funny. Very inventive has great pop culture and also like current references. Not Open not too much not in a way that it's GonNa feel dated someday. It's going to feel just like a nice little slice of life of its time but not like you know when it's like. Oh this is trying too hard and all these things or to obscure now So I was the same way like in high school. Yeah I my look was as I call it wearing. The whole damn thrift shop was look and I I mean I'm not super far away from that like life now but it is like where you kind of have like a look like a character and it's like a funny thing like an outfit you put together and it's just one of the ways that you adolescents. Yes album and it made me feel so inspired and so happy because you know sometimes you get nostalgic for those pieces of yourself that you're like Oh. I missed that weird thing I used to do and that makes me like one hundred to do that anymore. I'm GonNa do that again. Why did I ever stop and I like the witchy stuff in here? I liked it. It's a little bit different in like you know there's always fantasy. Witchcraft is different than like real life which craft but they take a little bit of a circuitous route and I thought it was very clever so yeah I love this book Scott I'm GonNa put this solidly in page Turner for myself. I really enjoyed this book. You know there was. There was about a two day period between me reading the first half of it in the second half of it. That was actually really rough for me because I wanted to pick it back up again. I just think it's really fun. It's nostalgic while being really fresh and inventive at the same time. One you do have a lot of like really strong nineties. Kids feels in there with like the craft and that whole thing. He's Club. Yeah Oh my God. We love event but but the language in this book is it doesn't without trying too hard is very relevant to now. You know the acronyms and just the slang. Yeah you know a lot of times. They throw those notebooks to just Kinda like flesh it out and make it feel more modern and more real and and even when it works well it kind of feels like it just kinda shoved in their this one like it felt like it was written by someone who just speaks that language fluently and I really. I always think about Scott on on a previous episode of John Junkies. We've talked about Betty Bites back. Did the whole lake. How's it going my fellow team Chevy leading to how read why because I'm always testing like okay. Does this is believable? Or is this a grownup person? Try It in like it's so it's just so real and so yeah it's just real legit and how much you guys. How much should we love that? Cover the fest but covers her weight. Did we see that? Kate posted the cover for the new book. The sequel as we gorgeous. He's still hold on okay. So let's describe the cover. It is here passed around. Oh okay over the next one. Oh my God I love it more than he must solidarity it. Might Yup. I'm so so the cover of the first one shades shades ruined her Magenta pinkies purple. Yes there's like a pretty kind of moon and cloud and star Motif going on. The main subject is the back of what we perceived to be a young female Wearing that we think is that. Oh I think it's Cassandra CASSANDRA CASSANDRA. Now that you all might senators under Cassandra belong dark area And the Denim Jacket. Young is that is that as you say as mayor says me say asthma asthma so I think in the new one. I'm pretty sure that's as may there as a great android that seems more as a Newton. She got sick denim jacket with patches. Paddle is just so clever. Like when I when I first saw the cover I was sold immediately. I like couldn't follow Kate Williams fast enough. I guess she's for sure can a before we get into the appeal score. I did want to ask you a question really quick. Okay Ready Ready Ready. It's not that juicy South Asleep the babysitting aspect of that. Where you guys babysitters yeah me too. That was my first job. A ton of babysitting. I still do my nephew and I love it. I love kids as I've said before I don't breed well in captivity so I will not have any but I love children. I think are wonderful breed. Well yes it did. That's the thing I didn't I kinda did here and there but not not much but I've always. I've always loved kid. I did a bunch of babysitting about maybe three or four years ago. I had a terrible babysitting experience and I was like you know what I'm good. I'm done hanging up my babysitting hat. I'm done and then what about you Scott? You didn't really until we had nieces and nephews actually. That's not true. I didn't entire summer of babysitting a couple of kids every weekday or like a month. Yeah where was this was when I was a teenager? These children they were they were. They were a friend of my mom's kids and As kind of a summer job by babysat them. I don't know if it's five days a week. Maybe like three days a week. I don't remember because I also quit a week before my quote unquote contract was up because it was not my thing. There's a line had to highlight because Oh my God. This holds true to the babysitting idea now for for my nephew. I mean the number one perk babysitting is. Oh P P other people's PICCI's Oh my God Yup. Yeah Yeah 'cause like for my nephew don't get paid money but I'm like I want the good snack. It's me your snacks. Also when she talked about the I don't remember what she called it. Like the crunch. Oh highlighted can we eat it? Can we make I have no found? Okay I grabbed what I'm wanted found a big bowl. Import in a layer of frosted flakes. I smashed up a few pretzels and added them then. A handful of corn checks some potato chips and a generous layer of EMINEM's sprinkled. The whole thing was sugar poured some milk on it and stood back to admire my specialty babysitters crunch the perfect mixture of salty and sweet. Kellogg's should market the stuff. That is like a food orgasm. I I need it I. I need almond or OATMEAL dream. Right there right. I need the almond the old or milk. But I'm down. Oh my God I'm so into it was just WANNA try it. I. I don't know man. That's a lot the sugar just sugar on top. That's unnecessary at least as a teen. Yeah baby we're all old and decrepit. We're like out. Just leave off the extra shirt. I feel like if I was if that was me. I probably would've topped it off with like fruity pebbles. Instead of sugar I love Ferdie. Pepple pebble crest on top would probably make it. Did you make rice? Crispy treats but with fruity pebbles. Yes yes I mean hell. Yeah do us yes. My I guess. My fellow teams. I just feel like we need to get an outfit description. Is that going to be in this? Boiler section needs to be split island a good one because I know I there are some really good ones where I was like. I have to say this is something I just realized on our last episode with the last story that we are reading. I appreciate a good clothing description written by a woman about a woman way better than a man does it. It is odd so totally different. And it's one. It's a realistic. You know they actually like go together. It's not like I was wearing jeans with fuzzy top and a Green Fidora and then if K if Caitlyn describes it it's a I don't know I'll e W W K Yup. I could see everything that she was wearing his book. All really and I wanted to wear detail her and and Janice Oh. Here's one that I love. Oh my gosh. Fifteen minutes later in a forest green mock turtleneck said Cardigan knee-length floral skirt cream colored tights and penny loafers. I as May Pearl Babysitter on Halloween. Left I school dressed as Laurie. Strode Babysitter in Halloween. Wait Fort Way. No one got it. Oh well ask me Everyone knows what it feels. Like to be smarter than the people that you're dressing up for so true today at work I warm. I wore my shining shirt. That just had the the twins on it. Yes and I had multiple people. Ask me who are those kids on your shirt just like? How can you in Highschool for me? It was like Oh like are you gonNA play. What player you in like? What's your costume for? Sure thought it was costume. Like every day is like you saying the rupaul. Thing world board naked the rest distracting. You love that vote now if someone asked you about your costume you'd be flattered right like just if you were walking down the street so my God like how did that cost you like doing it right today. Show good played. Then I'd be like come. See my show. We open on April. Both this is for my podcast. This week is referred my podcast costume also. Come Watch Mama Mia. This costume isn't from that. But I'm in it. I'll one other super relatable thing that I loved so much is. I decided to do what I always did. When I was depressed. Watch horror movies. Try to scare the sad this out of yourself. How seen how seem reveal me? I just wanted to talk about. Without spoiling it specifically the magic system in this book interest is so. It's it's it's just like everything else in this book like. It's it's very different and yet I feel like I've seen it before like it's familiar but not very unique very elaborate not familiar. It's its own language and anyone who has even the slightest bit of interest in like wordplay or was the etymology. You know like different languages. You'll really appreciate the spells in particular one of those things that I wanNA point out in this book because books like this. Have a tendency of either going like you know just like very fantasy. Don't question it. Sorta thing which I I love but But rarely digs into like kind of more of a hard magic system. Kind of actually successfully plays in both sandboxes. Yeah and I really like that because I love. I love a good hard magic system. Where like these are the rules? This is how it works. And normally you don't see anything like that in a book like this and this this stays very playful wall still having kind of a sense to it. Yeah I kinda gets into that magical realism. Yeah I love so much. So smart Can I hit us with the appeal score? Before we move onto the spoiler section. We'll go in the same order. Listen from our podcast Emma Devil. Yeah what's Your Jonah? Junkies Appeal Score. You know honestly I think I'd give it give it broad. I do a lot of people could could get into this not not like everyone because not everyone loves the craft like we do. I do think a lot of people especially women would would jump on this and feel seen and and And Style J. Yeah Yeah Yeah I love that answer and I. I'm pretty much right there with you. I'm I'm somewhere between a general and broad. It's hard because there's a lot of you know why and we're not super into like this is why this isn't why this is a young adult. This is new adult or any of that stuff. We're always just like a good book is a good book but I will say this one. I don't know that I'd recommend it for maybe like a baby. Boomer like analysts Nicole. I'm not sure I and that's a generalization but I think that you'd have to probably be a gen-x or younger to to really appreciate this book so I have to kind of scale it back a little bit but I mean I'm sure there's boomers who would love this book and I love the idea of them reading it but With love this book exactly there's exceptions but it's like I think of like we always used Scotts Mama's an example. I don't think she would enjoy the interest in it whatsoever. But there's other way that I know she would love and she has loved that we've told her absolutely and I I happen to agree with you. I think it's it's it's I think it's somewhere between general and broad. I'm a little bit more towards general which I think that this is great for just about anybody who is you know gen-x and younger so basically all of the children of the world. I don't think there's been an adult since the boomers so but agree boomers and of course we'll basically if you haven't seen drafted in a war of but I think I think that within that range mass I mean there's very little in our generation particularly which I guess we're all millennial millennials right. Yeah I was just thinking yeah I think that this is a real strong millennial book like just if you are a millennial just just read it. Even more than essential I think millennials and really cool. What's Your Appeal Score Kelly? It's probably just wishful thinking but I go with mass because I think there are so many you teens so many of my fellow teams that need to read this and need to feel seen and by this I agree and just the just the playfulness. The humor of it. I think is so appealing. I absolutely love this universe. This world that she's created an like. Oh my God. This is only the first book like. There's so much more to come. This is so exciting. I can't wait and this is her first novel. I think so. I'm just so excited to read anything else. She does your. I'm going. I'm going mass. I'm going all the way going. Big Go bigger the hall. Yeah I'd like to believe that for the unions today a lot of teen girls for that. I see from fully interwebbed. Yeah I will say I. I think there's a lot of kids and tweens. That probably aren't going to be allowed to read it because I think parents are going to be scared by the title. Having coven in the parents are going to be scared. And they shouldn't because which is your kids are going to WanNa read it even more Amen I actually heard that she was originally. She originally wanted the title of the next book to be called big curse energy away last. Oh Yeah it's called for the seat belt to the babysitters Kevin is called for better or cursed. What's in her editor? That one that one too. I like I like them both. But the bigger centers curse energies amazing. That's that's okay. So before we move onto the spoiler section just in case you didn't know with one of my cohorts plug spooky slumber party for the Jonah Junkies listeners because I plugged for the slumber party. Yeah so spooky. Slumber party is three goals. It's kind of like a babysitters clubs kind of like the baby. Sitters club accepts shoulder except we're not babysitting except for nephews. Nephews are yes he says. So we're three gals that are really into horror and have been for a long time. Grew up with scary books and movies and some of US got into it at different times but I mean we all met here now as adults. We don't act like adults. Which is the point of having this podcast because it hearkens back to the days of your when you go to a slumber party and you'd Watch Spooky VHS tape in your PJ's and play light as a feather stiff aboard and Bloody Mary so if all that sounds appealing to you then check out our podcast because it really is a slumber party we sit around and RPG's and talk about spooky things where the PJ's right now. It doesn't cosies on. I'm the only one in like jeans. Change I really why. Why am I not like joining you and I? This is my house after work with food in my car and I was like nope got up. Got Cozy close macos. Become a face had the opportunity to join you in your own house. Go put on your comfy pants do it. He's he's always changing. Continue to talk about a wonderful ipod. Gases yeah so it's it's very different from other horror podcast where we do review movies and books and music and now things are related. We were not to. I guess we'd sometimes get kind of scholarly about it. But it's it's very laid back. We keep it accessible knocking. He exact gatekeeper and Horror Jason. Do I'll just sit a Sifi episode. Yes and there's a Lotta Lotta female empowerment. And He needs to not have to be a female. That's a good point good point I have a lot of dude friends that really enjoy your show that makes me very happy. They want that energy everybody regardless of your gender or lack thereof. I think once that energy. That's slumber party energy so you're all invited to the slumber party so we hope you'll you'll come by swear your PJ's bring your Ligi board a look you're very color coordinated as I know I was so normally like if you guys that's an ensemble if you were here he would have just kept on that same blue flannel. I actually probably would`ve. Yeah and just as like four really well. Maybe besides your Mario off on Halloween. That was pretty Kathleen. That was barely clothes. It's barely close. All right gotta take a quick break and be back for the spoiler section enjoying the show please like in subscribe on I tunes. You can find us on twitter and Instagram at John. Ritter Junkies and don't forget to visit the website. John Junkies Dot Com. Can we just talk about pig a little bit more? Getting the real star of the real are babysitters. I hope pig continues to be so big you know. And a member of the Coven. Yes yeah. How cute was that? Okay when pig talked when pig talk talk and like what? He looks really sweet though. Is that like it was just a temporary thing like she decided she didn't really like pig talking like actually. Yeah actually. This is better before I thought that was so sweet that it was like. She wanted her just the way she was. It was like it was very much like pet cemetery like sometimes they're just live better last better but sometimes like the natural course of things is better. You guys know Kyle Right. Kyle likes to make Kyle likes make stupid. Puns likes to make stupid funds or I tried gluten free for a little while. But you know what they say. Pet Cemetery sometimes. Bread is better. Actually a long doesn't It doesn't all the time so like these huge long setups where I'm like actually invested in a story. I think he's telling me. And then it ends up with stupid Pun. And I'm like you might. You're GonNa be a great dad. And he does that on instagram with like not necessarily a pun but like a weird Lawns setup for like a story but I love it. It's totally are you good. Yeah see we don't have the same thing lake because our cat stitches talks and says what you would normally say it's all there and we know what she's saying we know when she's cursing and as we know what you me but pig was so sweet and I loved it pig. Like was part of the coven. Like really yes. Legitimately was part of the covenant was needed for the ritual. Sanal pig was a rescue. Pig was a stray rescue awesome. So let's we kind of bounce around and all the spoiler sections so you can kind of feel free to chime in with you know some stuff that was just kind of like burning at you and I actually had one thing that I wanted to post to the group. That's a little bit Syria interesting. So I like many non near typical people but to out anybody but everybody in this room is not typical when a problem or it could be. A physical problem is solved by magic and at first with mom I was not immediately happy lake when she was in the. You know the the mental hospital. I don't know nicer way to put that. It was like Oh God. Is this going to be like a magical thing is she magically quote unquote crazy? Yeah and then like you get magically cured and I was really like had to think about it like honestly. It took me out of the book for a few times there and then of course when the reveal happens but then I was like it's okay because they never actually diagnosed her with anything. Yes you hit this button and it is like a cursed. It's Kinda like a trade sort of thing like as long as you know. Arabists is here. You know Bluh Bluh Bluh like that's the way it's gotta be that but that was what took me a minute where. I was like honestly I was like am. I offended by this and then I was like no. I'm not but I had to think about it. A minute yeah. I don't think it's as problematic as if she was cured by magic spell. I've found that makes you normal. Yeah exactly the fact that it was caused by magic makes it less problematic in my view is totally understand what you mean because I kind of had a weird feeling with that. Yeah I needed to be clarified in a weird sort of way kind of the same way that I had had a weird feeling with pig when she first started talking. I'm like I don't know off. I if I want want anamour forget a little. No thank you it. I didn't have any of those thoughts. It never bothered me because it was just part of the story and I feel like it was. It was actually a clever thing to come up with where her being cursed. It turned out in a way that made her like it. Didn't seem like anything magical. It just seemed like Oh. She's has a mental illness and has to be hospital treated for it but I it wasn't like she was cursed and she has green tentacles growing out of her head. You know it was like something that would fly under the radar and not be seen as quote unquote. Magic set. Like there wasn't a diagnosis. It wasn't because I I know this sounds like I'm making this up. I am not. There are books where people are like Walt dyslexic. Or they are. I mean just a billion other types of you know like I said like different abilities or like mental wellness and it gets cured. And it's like that is so irresponsible it's other cured or it's the source of their power. Which can be empowering but in some in some cases it's also kind of tread carefully. Yeah you think it's maybe like the author like maybe they I don't know they're using it as a coping mechanism like maybe they're suffering something they're like. I wish I could just be magically cured because I'm so frustrated with this thing I'm struggling with. Oh yeah so I'm not there. Yeah you know it's like yeah but it's it's not saying it's a healthy coping mechanism but yeah maybe writing about it. Help THEM GET OUT. Some anger situational. I feel like there's going to be kind of stronger theme in in the future books as well. I mean I wouldn't be surprised that's touched on a little bit. You know even harder like okay. Well what is the right thing to do? In this case like is he going is the right thing is to trap him in the negative for the rest of eternity handed against their code. Right like lit. The things you're supposed to do like we don't even know. Walder code yet but we know we we know they can't kill him but if he's really just going to be that destructive then maybe him being in the negative is the right thing in. Is that something that you know? That's just? She's going to have mental issues because of that. I think that's something that can really be explored in future books and I don't think it's it's been ruled out at this point. I don't have any concerns about kate. Williams being like problematic at all yeah. It was very compassionate for characters. Yeah I was just one of those things that for yeah alike made me do the record scratch a little. It'd be like let's see. Let's see this plays out but I am. I loved that there is some diversity in the spot new. You'RE GONNA love that I was like Oh S. Andrews hiking because you got to you have to and especially like you can tell and I won't name names. It's not really the stuff we review on here but when people throw in diversity just to have diversity and it's my biggest pet peeves. Yeah and it's like no like this is natural and real diversity that we have him as Cassandra is Hispanic genesis black. It's like it's all good you don't find out. I mean you don't really find out. That Cassandra is Mexican until way later. In the match thing I loved that it wasn't in there and Janice when when she's being described it's clear that she's a person of color and I love that but it feels in this book Like so many other things like it's just natural. And that's how she. Yes how she pictured the character just from the get go and that's just who the character was. Yeah as I was pleased as punch. Yeah more and more and more Can I talk about the these semi? Ah Love interest that ended up being. I love how turned out at the end. It just made me happy Leon. Dmz on yeah. I when I started reading it when it got to like describing Dion and like you know I was just like Oh God this is such a teen book like g right like teen got one ever but that when it turns into at the end were talking about him for like the last like four five. John was like this guy's an idiot loved it live so accurate teenage experience. Yeah Yeah like only eleven Semaj then three weeks later. It's like Oh actually dum dum actually buried. Tom Is he. Seems like Kinda sweet and like you know. Just kind of unbothered by the end of it. He's a Zuber every toddler. I love how you turn though because I was a little nervous that I was going to be like a Oh like romance is going to be in the thing about this book. I was like those kind of like no thank you but then it ended up with Lake. You know majority of like this is about the coven and female empowerment passes the the BECHTOL test. Yeah yeah it was nervous about it like when when that came up. I was like this. Don't pass the Michael Task and then and then at the passes we're really into names of characters to everything And is perfect for him. Being DNA says who's the god of wine and partying in kind of Bacchanalia? Because if like it sounds like he's so like Oh dionyssis. Oh Wow that's so awesome and sophisticated. And you're like no he's actually is Kinda dumb like a Frat guy. Yeah and then same thing with Cassandra. Because that's you know she's a she was a prophetess who saw the downfall of troy and nobody kind of believed her and I kind of feel like. That's kind of art. Cassandra to you where you know she has all this stuff going on under the surface and people have just been like whatever your foster kid. You're dumb you know not taking her seriously exactly. Yeah I love how the Dushi guys at school talk about her. Because it's so real even though it's like super dirty and not okay and inappropriate. I like that. She went there and it wasn't just like well. Look at that smoking. Hot Babe. No it's like they say disgusting stuff about her this book but I'm like that's how it is asks. How teens talk. Like I'm so glad she didn't censor herself. I love the part where Janice are like sizing her up in the cafeteria. Or the like all right. Where's she going to say? Where's she going to say? She's dumps her tray into the garbage can and walks out Janus just goes bold Costa. Who's your favorite girl? Oh God that's hard. I'm okay part of the magic of this story is the the fun- diversity of all girls. Yeah I think Cassandra's my favorite I think. High by with Cassandra CASSANDRA. Oh man especially with the dealing with kind of thing. 'cause it's as may like no question so for me. Yeah Oh yeah I think I'm it. Yeah but I I think as as who I relate hardest to but at the same time I see so much of myself and Cassandra and Janice Istan Janice so much emphasis amazing. 'cause very real. She is really real. I mean she. I mean this whole thing that just like comes at her sideways is a lot to deal with anyone else. Yeah higher life sudden can move things with her mind and she's like okay. I'm just going to take I am. There's the person a broken when she's babysitting and it's like that is actually dramatize it. Yeah horrific let it be but at the end of the day. She still there for her when she needs her. And she's like I just need one more thing and she's like no screw that I'm not leaving until this is done. Yeah it's just such a wonderful female solidarity female empowerment and so much of this bug. Yeah I just WanNa say like when I got about two thirds of the way through and I realized all right. This is definitely. This is definitely setting for a sequel. There's no way this is going to be wrapped up in a bow. Like at the end of this. I started to get even more. Yes there's GonNa be more. I don't have to be afraid of finish in his book. There's going to be more. I just I love this this this mythos but she's created. The coach is it was his name again Bryan Bryan so ridiculous and like almost monty python level ridiculous. Now yes yes. He starts his character. You would think they would have nothing in common. He reminds me of the teachers that I had that I just like did not even and she says he looks like ludicrous. I imagined him especially after when when he like took them back to his house to like. Tell them everything. I imagined him. Like Samuel Jackson in New Marvel movies. Who is he fury? Yeah I imagined him like Nick Fury at why are you serious but like like no both but also like sarcastic as fuck? I loved him and I love that like the the comparison was just thrown right out there. Because it's not a comparison. Just kind of like her other references. It's a total. Oh Mosh to buffy totally because like I even like calls it out. Yeah I've never heard of that. Explain and then he's like. Oh Yeah I'm like passing familiar. I've heard of that. Yeah but like he's so different. Okay so I'm a huge fan. Buffy fans I am obsessed with the nineties movie. I'll okay okay. I was never seen the show when I was a kid. Because you have not answered this question this is very important. Never seen it. I've never seen it. I know the gist. I know the dentist I was too young. I was like you've never seen. I WANNA watch it because I ten thousand today. You're absolutely going to be introducing you to buffy the vampire island one three. You'll still like we'll see about after that so I was huge into buffy as a kid I did like the movie is obviously where it started but I loved the TV show. I watched it religiously. I read the books all of it and I still have like retained a lot of my buffy knowledge but yeah it's great because Cassandra is a lot like faith only way cooler than fave. Yes but Giles and Brian early. Nothing say and he's ways it really the same as buffy either. It's just kind of like it's again. It's a fun just like with the baby sitters club with all of the references. Slippy what it is and it's a bold choice to only like it's one thing to be like those kind of like buffy like kind of like a little wink. Wink nudge nudge. Yeah I know this is kind of like buffy. That's Kinda the point and to go like Okay No. I want to explain the whole premise of buffy. The Vampire slayer Kinda like no seriously. This really is like this. Yeah all Atlantic and then I got major. American horror story coven vibes with some of the stuff to especially the council. Yep slow good one of the things I love about about the magic system in this with the four items and more like that I feel like we could make spells rally spells. You Guys Marsh Ri- Yes we try one. Let's try some spells together and then and then we can just I dunno levitating touch more quotes here. Lady Oranges scrolling. Great jumping off point. I love how she describes cans this God. That was funny but it just so just so sweet and touching and just again so perfectly teenage and relatable she says the skies huge in close as if you could touch it if you just found the right tree to climb and the landscape is a subtle as no makeup makeup there are no mountains intimidating you into appreciating them and there's no ocean throwing itself on the rocks to demand your attention. The planes are just like we're here and we're chill it's poetic so teenage is. It's very much like it's not California. It's the opposite of California and it's Nice. It's nice in its own way for not being helpful honestly have never heard. Someone speaks lovingly about Kansas. Before might be the last week I haven't either but I think that I was really trying to be like. Oh Yeah I think kate is from Kansas. She's got she's originally from Kansas describe. That is just so cute like she needs to write more about her her home and I wanNA know that Sculptural Garden Israel. That was frigging. I'd go on. I love the dedication of the book to to the Babysitters President Future something. So yeah you're really takes off and get a movie who I think there's actually could make a very good movie. Wanted to be a movie. I'm very protective of love. But this would make a good move. I have not watched it nor have I read the books but kind of like all the boys I love before where it's like you know like they're kind of throwing out like movies every once in a while of the series. I could see it like that. Like it doesn't need to be like an episodic ten part thing maybe but like give me a good movie every every once in a while I worry when it comes to Waie kind of fantasy sort of situations like this. Though where you kind of run into like Percy Jackson problem you know what I mean. We're like Percy Jackson so dirty did it real bad real bad like it's almost too childish. It's almost too like like like grandiose and more like it will yeah and then you have Pierce Brosnan as a Centaur. Yikes nobody asked for that. Nobody nobody is that big. Yikes quote for US Shorto. This is a little shoutout to everyone with things. I'd I'd never felt powerful in my entire life. I mean I was forever paying with larger bills because I was too scared to hold up the line while Doug for not changed. I lived in fear that a stranger would ask me what time it was but I do things that other people can not that I wanted to but if I had I could even smashed the hell out of everything stacy. Wasser made in pottery class and really made her pay for touching my turtle. I love tea and then it goes on and talk about Chunky Mary. Jane's I'm just like okay. I'm sold out just gets better. I'm sold. I want her. I want her causing everybody. Everybody does that is a really really sweet way to look getting Zaidi especially I think that young adult anxiety. Yeah just a little. Yeah I like that. It's not to like just describing anxiety with the little everyday things like that like. I don't WANNA be digging for change and now I'm like I will hold hold of the day if I want my change. I'll use them a change. This the Wasserman reminded me. I know it's different character but when the cheerleaders like try to jump them. Oh Oh my God and Cassandra's is throwing those sick burns because that is exactly how I fell in high school when Schick with think like owl year looking at my man. It's like your man is disgusting. A child and I'm not looking at him again wishing you were my friend good. I'm GonNa ask you guys a question that I asked last week when you read a book that takes place in a high school. Do you picture place in your high school s. Now you don't you do. Yeah me too me too almost every time for me. It's not like like parts of it will remind me my high school but then parts won't now so yeah I. I mean the high school I went to I was partially home. Schooled partially took classes at the school. I home schooled through and it. It's it's it's not a high school. It's dumb I imagine the gym because for some reason. Galley cushion took their basketball various. Very Nice Gym so I imagine the gym whenever I think of Jim. Like read about gym classes or anything like that but anything else like hallways lockers all that stuff like I am Agean. A Beautiful Pristine really cool high school. Because that's what it is for me to you. It really depends 'cause like we didn't have lockers. Lake know like a lot of that stuff. That's in books and so many books and movies talk about lockers. That's like a huge thing and like nobody. Nobody used their locker in my school. Have Locker oh I use it. Yeah did you decorate no pictures and stuff in it not really? Yeah no one knows you know for your. We put everything into our backpacks and got all kinds of like back and shoulder problems carrying around all those books laughing and we laughed at the kids who really backpacks and it's like they were. They were similar. I don't think any of you would have been friends with me in high school early backpack. I did for a while. He did theater. Yeah but not at the high school theatre outside of high school. I was too good for her. I were I were jeans. Usually those bill mentioned Abercrombie bell-bottoms with a Hawaiian shirt and often a often sporran from kilt. As my specific wild Combo I was a nut. Meanwhile floppy hair I wanNA. That was freshman year. I didn't do that after after that. I had to hear like yeah like the I like that. We had a mall. Seen Man dying. Yes Dying Law. That just hit close again hitting close to home. You know what something about that. Dead Mall wasn't as bad as the dying malls that we see right now. You know what I mean. It's better when it's dead because it was sad and creepy. But it's not as sad as like when it's in its death throes and still like they're still like those five stores that are hanging on and there's like twenty empty stores and it's like why is this place even occupied anymore. You know what I mean. There's one in Bakersfield that Jonathan and I would like actually hang out like our first date was at this dying mall that had like five stores in it but it's a big mall and had the movie theater and then it had a comic bookstore that we hung out in a lot and there was like a little arcade and then maybe like a soccer store like it was so weird. He's actually like don't dying mall. Though was dopes hung out there a lot east hills mall dude and Bakersfield. Yeah We saw cabin in the woods there for her first official date cute. Yeah it was a very sad place. 'cause I remember when I was like kid when I lived in Bakersfield they remembering the east tells mall being this elaborate fun awesome plays and then being back. There is an almost like an almost adult at eighteen years old. And being like this is this is sad. Okay real quick though the coven. Laurie strode is in there. How does that work? Let's talk about that as I rather back that. I don't think it's I. I mean she. I don't think it's lory strode. I feel like it is a spirit of I know that it's Jamie Kirtley's Oh no I think is it's Jamie Lee Curtis played. Laurie strode in the movie. Laurie strode is she saying Lord Stroz an actual person. I think it's Jamie Jamie Lee. Curtis I think it. Somewhere in the middle where. I'm not saying the spirit of like the ghost of Laurie Strode. I'm saying it's like this. The spirit of the the Helped me like the feeling of the like I know girl Babysitter Thai Thai guest of like Laurie Strode. You know and see I. I'm a different one where I think it is like. It's like this quintessential you know late seventies early eighties babysitter. That is like at some point. John Carpenter saw this real witch and was like that's my laurie strode and he really heavily off of this real person. Who's like yeah that that's me like he basically stole my look my identity. I loved her. I loved her just like sweater. Got that that that moment when when they come in and just save the day but like enclosed the porter like that was so awesome. Like just like okay. I in a way was actually kind of relieving to me. That the bigwigs. The leaders of this secret organization are for women like that that that was really nice. Well that was worried. I was worried like this is going to be like. Oh you know there's really like two sides of the story kind of situation which do that in some books but in this one I was not prepared for that kind of thing to happen and I don't feel like that is really going to be happening. Because they are women in charge and everything's Okay and kind of like off. Only the rest of the United States got on that or the world or the world to kind of piggyback. On that I can have the same feelings. She because I'm fine if is may ends up being a you know quote unquote chosen one like a special special sitter. But I liked that in this book. It's like she's obviously got skills but she doesn't have it all down. She still needed help. And I really liked that because kind of over that trope a little bit of like. Oh my God. She could do something that like the council couldn't and it's like under I try out the gate. Dafna who lived? Yeah Yeah I don't I don't get a chosen. One feel from her at least from the she does that being a special end but yeah they're all the thing is like they are framed framed as being bad ass from like from every single one of them all those pictures on the wall of them. Getting like you know beat up. But they're like smiling and they're they're just fat ass women like it just usually. They're all awesome like they're all awesome. There's no like okay. This one's like the best of the best or this one's like they're all great. Yeah and they have their own special skills but they're just all awesome and I really like that you know. I don't want to see a whole lot of competition backstabbing. I think that would that would allow to damage damage. What's been built in this world? I trust Caitlyn to do that. Also can we get like pokemon style trading cards of the little creatures like Olga? We can we. Can we have that? I want to adopt Kevin Love. So Sweet Poor Kevin. Explain to me with a little slimy in the nerve minded me of up because the bird he needs he names him. Kevin. Oh so good it has anybody else. Just love is is my God. I'm now I'm connor. Somebody Else Abbey. Does anybody else just love as Mazda? Yes and I feel so bad for him that his friendship is my heart now but again. I. There's another book that we read that I'm thinking of that. Had A similar kind of twist to that. Where everything that a character knew about the people who loved them was wrong and it just like shattered me. Something about as may saying her heart broke for him a little bit as like kind of healed. That wound a little bit to recognize like. Yeah this sucks. This sucks and it's kind of a problem but sitting with those feeling. Yeah you know it's like well thank you for actually like like admitting and maybe like have a little bit of sympathy for the dude because you know maybe this thing. That's really important to him. Doesn't you know as not real but in a way? It's kind of like funny because there is a thread of the real because Brian is forced to care so much bigger song how along the way like he's become obsessed with it even though we eat it football but I'm like this is the most important thing in the world now for some reason is almost like a magical thing they like put on him. House was too because like being designer writer to him and now he's just like a football like Nancy throw pillows. I hope dad gets his moment in a future book like him and I want him to shine Sam a good dude his moment in the spotlight this week dad. He's not an abusive weird neglectful dad. He's just a real just working right. He's not like the Cool Dad. Either Shafei trying to raise a daughter. Everything's not around everything. He owns his moisture. Wyking like visual Scott. Did you feel seen yet again. I wasn't going to say it but yeah I on a lot of moisture can clothing done. Yeah we gotta do our final sports X. Execution Score. Does anybody have a clever thing out of things? Ooh pebbles many bowls of babysitters crunch that. Don't tell me how many how many how many spoonfuls I love it. Okay Scott One. And she kicked off then. Okay okay. I feel like she specifically went into this book. Trying to make a very female forward empowering book while being really fun and really kind of Harkening back to some of those older you know which stories while making it very recent and with that. I feel that she was completely successful. This is five big bites of babysitters crunch. I thought that she absolutely nailed this story and I am so excited for the next one. I'm I'm feeling very similar. Pardon me pardon me wants to give it the the four point five because not because I just half a by alum nibble. I'm feeling awful But I also feel that the four point five comes from while I when I started it and when I was leading up to like the the last third of it there were some things that I was like. You know like the whole like trope of the boy crush in just like a few things I was just like. Oh this is such a such a teen book. I was I was just looking for something a little bit more meaty but then that lasts third. Brought it up to five foot five spoonfuls for me because it's just like it turned it around and it it just became way more. I don't WanNa say serious but like it. Just Kinda did away with all of the stereotypical teen book tropes that I was like no. This is great so I give it a again five five big oil spoonfuls of Babysitter scrunch. I love like I love that whole wrap up you just gave but it also kind of hurt my head because I started to feel like it was a math problem a little bit and then I'm saying if ex-eagles it's four and a half times one third of God that's me that it'll be so for myself I mean I know this is a little bit. We're all going to say kind of a reiteration that everybody has their own kind of spin to put on it and mine is what we often say when we really love a book is. There's just nothing I would change about it. There's nothing that like. When it's all said and done I would do differently. Own OSCEOLA center do differently and I miss it and I will crave this world and these characters. So it's definitely five spoonfuls of babysitters crunch for Yup five big old spoonfuls. The whole bowl of babysitters crunch with generous layer of him and sprinklers. Sugar all of that all of that like like we all said it was just it was that it was nostalgia but it was also very contemporary. It was magical but also believable and so real all the details down to their fashion choices. Just I love it so much and I didn't know what to expect. I fell in love with the cover. I knew I had to read it but I was like okay. This could be super cool as can be Super Corny. I don't know where this is going to go but it win. It just ticked all the right boxes for me. Kate has built this amazing universe and I cannot wait to see how she expands upon it. All the stuff we're going to learn about the sitters and their whole world. Oh Man I'm so excited. Yeah the future is looking bright for you. Kate Features Female. The future is sitter. Just that are sell. I guess we've gotTa do sign offs. I guess we do this. How do we do that? I'll we'll we'll just do one after the other after the other celery kind of it like ooh Okay Little Mary yes. I'll see how it goes. So maybe we have it. I think we should 'cause you're like the because I'm kind of like the Middle Man. I can mail. Wow token feel so good does it. Shoe's on the other foot through thrill true. It's real true. Alright you had fun well glass and thank you so much. Thank you so so so much for having we did this season of crossovers. Can I just say like Y'all keep it very busy? How do you feel having lost your donkeys cherry? Oh my God. It's the best I I want. More uniform was like the best ever thanks. I didn't know that was great. Thanks Kelly I just want to help. Help my girl out. You know what Scott. We're going to bestow an honor upon you. Which is that you get to do both send-offs oh my goodness. This is very exciting. Saudi even your birthday okay. Well thank you so much for joining US listeners. And until next time stay light as a feather stiff as a board and keep reading pasture bed times.

Cassandra CASSANDRA Kate Williams Scott Laurie strode US John Junkies Kelly Hitmen John Turner John Rich Sandra buffy Janice Istan Janice Jonah Junkies Kevin Donald Junkies Janice Oh Maze Babysitters Club John Junkie
83 | Supernatural | Sucker Punch by Laurell K. Hamilton  With Interview!

Genre Junkies | Book Reviews

1:45:51 hr | 9 months ago

83 | Supernatural | Sucker Punch by Laurell K. Hamilton With Interview!

"Weirdo bookworm unite we want to share our love of genre fiction with you. Some readers out there may look down on you for your love of horror, sci fi and fantasy, but not us. So stop by as we discuss what we've been reading. I under Junkies Sandra this is Scott stitches over there and we are ready to talk to you tonight about a very exciting author interview we had. We got to talk to Laurel K Hamilton which is pretty big deal. Big Deal it is a big deal. I was excited Sandra was very, very excited and. This was my first time reading one of her novels, and so I'm excited to talk about my experience with that as the first time reader. So we'll talk a little bit and then we've got our interview with Laurel. It is spoiler free, and then we'll come back and do the spoiler section Kinda same as always hope everybody's been doing as well as possible during this absolutely insane time to be a high. Had Our. We had our first Cova. Scare I guess you'd say an air quotes. Yeah. Like a work related possible contamination Sich situtation not not too bad for either of us. But of course, we took our tests passed with flying colors but at least now we've had that experience. Yes you've had that experience. So if you think you have to do it, get it done your honor junkies have they lived to tell the tale don't be scared Jonah Junkie So something else that was like really really exciting three. Sorry. I just want WanNa. Talk a little bit. John Related is we finally fine the Lee was true detective season one? Yeah, we did and. That was a huge deal for me. That was a huge deal so I will say. This the first couple episodes. It took me a while to really get into it and really like like the characters. But after after the whole season was done, I was very happy with it Sandra. I'm completely obsessed with it. I can't wait to watch the other T. seasons. It was one of those things like I described season one is like I feel like somebody made it for me somebody crafted it for me and like molded it and like shaped it and made it all Mason and pretty like clay and they fire baked in the oven and a glazed it and they're. Like here you go here I, made you this made you the season of television just for you and absolutely adored it. Of course, no spoilers for those who haven't seen it. All three seasons are anthology but this one has to do with a lot of stuff that ticks myi boxes of things that I like and it is kind of a procedural though be all tradition untraditional one. Just like the book we reviewed this week. Procedural, however nontraditional. So a little bit of background on our book. This week I think that most readers are going to at least be familiar with Laurel K Hamilton is she's responsible for two series of books the Anita Blake Vampire Hunters series and the Merry Gentry This is obviously in outing in the Anita Blake vampire hunter novel so this newest book is called Sucker Punch. So this was first of all book is frigging gorgeous like if you get a chance to eat some really pretty cover oh my gosh, it's got like you know kind Of like our our leopard on the front and it's lots of blues and blacks in a big gorgeous like aquamarine Gold I. There's like a blood drippy thing and like when you shift the cover to and fro, you get like Shiny Shiny bits I can't I don't know it's gorgeous. Super pleased in its when you open it up to when you open up, it's a beautiful hundred green and black with like blood red on the spine. It's definitely a departure of from the the covers that I am familiar with seeing for the series Oh. Yes. So I I could look up exactly what it was but a number of years ago the book switched covers from kind of like what a lot of us knew to these much more. Beautiful. Dare I say serious covers. I. Don't want to say that in the sound insulting but. We're there more artistic and not just here is a book cover. That kind of vaguely represents the story inside. There's definitely an artistic style when it comes to the covers of books when it comes to you John Re related books particularly fi supernatural were you know where you have like the hero or heroine on the cover and? That kind of art you all know what we're talking about and this new trend towards kind of a more more subtle cover while still being just beautiful. I'm a big Fan of Oh. Yeah. No at least covers have been great for years and years. So this was no exception it's such a treat. So let me tell you a little bit about, Anita Blake, the series, my my history with it, and then we'll talk about the book more specifically. So Anita Blake Vampire Hunter is a series of novels and some short novels also comic books of which I have quite a few of. Those that way. That mislocate Hamilton has been writing since hundred ninety three when guilty pleasures came out. So this is an urban fantasy series in that it is contemporary it is basically our world. Only there are supernatural things. Everybody is aware of them but other than that, there's a lot of things that makes it exactly like the world we live in there is the character of Anita Blake who starts out the series as basically known as the executioner known as war. She executes Vampires and Super Naturals. She raises the dead as an animator where she raises zombies. And that goes into a whole whole bunch of stuff. She gets into some romantic entanglements with supernatural characters in that grows leaps and bounds throughout the series Her love life is very fascinating and prolific and vary entertaining. And you need a flow chart, these are. In case, you couldn't tell these are one of those books where adults can into adult situation kids how just know that? A lot of the books we read our like that we don't usually give a warning for that, but you know just saying. So my history with the books. History. With the books is I started reading them not in one, thousand, nine, hundred, eighty, three of a little young. But I started reading when I was a teenager let's say about fifteen to be safe and my friends read them and I read them and I really enjoyed them and I continue to read them and continued to stay at least somewhat involved in the series as best as I possibly. Could like I said I love the comic book run when that was coming out and I got some of those, these books were very, very key part of my teen and early adults and into my adult reading it's when you've been reading character Carrick Durr's but especially one character for this lawn you get very, very involved emotionally it just becomes a big part of you I guess I could say I mean. So obviously, she's been writing these books for more than twenty five years. This is the twenty seventh novel in the Series Laurel K Hamilton is a bestselling writer, New York Times Bestseller. People all over the world. Love Love love these books and have for very long time I. See a lot of myself in the character of Anita lot of ways were super. But in a lot of ways were really the same I've always appreciated that she was an assertive strong female that spoke her mind that she was very capable as the books have gone. On in the series of gone on, she's opened up a lot and she's more vulnerable and she's embraced her insecurity. She's embracing her mental health really really incredible stuff. She's found love as she's found love with multiple people. Her character is poly-amorous, which is really cool. You don't get to see that a lot I. it's not common books to see that that viewpoint no and. She is in love with people who are not. You know fully human there where people like him thrope. Big. Word. I cannot say empires were wills. On all that stuff and I. I'm not poly-amorous Scott's poly-amorous. We don't know enough to say that like Oh this is just the most wonderful representation of polly emery but I like the way it is depicted in these books. It makes me feel a lot of love for these characters and I want them to be happy and be happy with each other and I think that's what really matters at the end of the day. Right? I agree yeah, I. Think you know coming into this fresh I knew some stuff about the series. Because of you and then going into this book, I did spend a little bit of time on Wikipedia kind of catch up on exactly who these characters were. Yeah. But not a lot of time on that and I I have to say wikipedia doesn't do her relationships justice when you read the Quick Synopsis, Synopsis Sees No any wicky you find out there. It's like it'll be good to Kinda like give you a crash course. Yes. Yeah. But you know wikipedia makes it sound kind of Harem Ish. And there is a bit of a fun level of Hamish of Harem this this in it, but it's not it's not the the complete harem fantasy that the wick the wikipedia kind of makes it sound like it actually is very sweet and the characters are very honest and open and trust each other and I think that that's really really powerful to see and it's it's it's nice. Yes. Very very cool and as the series has gone on. Anita has you know collected all these people and characters in her life and enemies, and she's developed other sorts of powers as time has gone on one it's really really interesting is called the door which is kind of hard to describe. But for the most part have been found only in vampires until Anita kind of developed, it caught it I don't know what exactly to say but it's A sexual power that allows her to feed from other supernatural creatures and humans, and of course, that's going to make her relationships and the you know kind of sexual erotic scenes way more interesting frankly. And supernatural I'm not a huge romance reader as you guys have probably noticed even when like I mean it's not really one of our Jonah's that we focus on here John Junkies and so I'm Kinda like picky about my romance that I like but I like the way Laurel K and her characters handled their romance. It's it's fun Romp Times. But make no mistake a lot of the books including Sucker Punch really really focus on the mystery, the fantasy, the horror, the creepy nece at May I just say to these books have gotten even funnier time have gone on I just I. Love How much of her sense of humor she's putting into these books fantastic. Yeah. So Anita job is a martial she's a she's a supernatural Marshall. Now I don't know if I even said that there's so much to recap. Well, let me say this because I am not as privy to all of the changes that have happened but this book does a really good job of catching you up without it being a whole bunch of exposition. You know she talks about her her history is being originally one of the vampire hunters and being one of the four horsemen and how things have changed, and now she's her job is I guess quote unquote a little bit more legitimate. Yeah. It's a little bit more of like a like a really A. Government arm, but it's you know I. Think I. Want to say this because I have read none of the other books if you're interested in this at all by all means, you can start at number one, but don't be afraid to go ahead and jump in at at Sucker Punch I, think that this book stands R- up really well on its own and like how rare is that in a series this in depth there's like sway shorter series where you can't do that. So it's actually really inclusive and cool that she writes her book that way and we talk about it in the interview we do. So I WANNA, talk about my experience with this with the book. This was an absolute page Turner from me Injury Really Long Book. Like it's almost six hundred pages in its hardcover edition, which for me is is an epic novel. While at first looking at it I was I was. Ethical intimidated blew I blew through this book guys it is such a fun fast paced read and it's that kind of fast paced where you know when you're reading a book and you just you're you're just devouring it ends and you're like I want I want like two hundred more pages of this. This gives it to you and it doesn't really ever let up and I really I was really impressed and surprised by that. I think. That is so cool to hear. You say that for me, this was absolutely a page turner solid solid page Turner, and I was super happy with it. It's wonderful to get to see old friends, which is what it's like when you have been with the series for so long is these are old friends of yours and my favorite character in the Book Edward He's Imas Book. So that was like, yes, I was super stoked to see him. Yes. She does a great job of giving you a lot of back story but like what's relevant like is there are lots of characters and lots of moving pieces in the series. So it's like okay and another book that has more these folks in it should give you a little bit more oh this has. References to a pass case of hers. Cool. We'll tell you about that case from that other book and it's like it's really really nice because you're like just kind of waiting into the water like okay I'm comfortable. I'm comfortable here even though I'm a new person. I could totally see bat and those references don't feel too inside baseball. There's somewhere that need to be explained that are for the for the for the plot of this story, and there's some things that are just kind of references to things that have happened in the past which they actually the they're more than just a wink wink to regular readers. To kind of your appetite to read more I WanNa know about some of those stories. Yeah. You want to know about those stories, those cases, those characters everybody's very in depth and none of them. The men none of the women supernatural human in these books are paint by numbers they're really -ther. And I should say to one thing I always really admired about these books. Now, we have the poly-amorous connection, but there's been a lot about sexuality and sexual orientation and gender. Really really cool stuff. That I really love to read about you guys know we talk about stuff on the show all the time, and especially for me having read these characters for so long when I first started reading them when I was in my teens there was not a lot of books that were talking about You know so many different types of people and way to ways to identify and ways to have sexuality, and it's really really cool that it's like something that was kind of foundational in that sub genre. And also urban fantasy in general. Let's just kind of kind of categorize it as that they're really you know we hate to be to contrite about any John Rica's things blend, but she is also one of the pioneers of that and if you like a bad ass woman detective who can execute supernatural naturals and navigate crazy worlds and all of that stuff you you definitely have to thank Laurel K Hamilton for that she was foundational in having that energy in books. So can I tell you a little bit about sucker punch sure. So just Kinda give everybody you know what are what are we going to get you here with the story? One of fellow US Marshal Asks Anita Blake to fly to a tiny community in Michigan's upper peninsula on an emergency consult she knows time is running short when she arrives there's plenty of proof that a young wear leopard killed his uncle in the most gruesome and bloody way possible as the mounting evidence to him a warrant of execution is already underway, but something seems off about the murder and Anita has been asked for her expert. Opinion on the crime scene despite escalating pressure from local cops and the family's cries for justice for their dead. Patriarch Anita quickly realizes that the evidence doesn't quite add up time is against Anita as the tight knit community is up in arms and it's fear of supernatural is growing she races to uncover the truth and determine whether the marshals have caught the killer or about to execute an innocent man all in the name of justice it really is a murder mystery I was not expecting that we like I said, usually the books there's. Something, like that, there's a murder mystery. There's a there's a, there's a body in town or something like that. There's a really good plot, but a lot of her books are centered around really good mystery. You can't beat that. We love mystery we do love mystery. So for our readers who have not been introduced to Laurel K Hamilton and the to Blake, who do you think should be picking this up of our listeners to read it. I'll man that's a toughie because it's obviously going to plug it. My Heart Street is a little bit. A series that I've been with for so so long You know, honestly, I think that these books do have quite a mass appeal I think that men would like them. Women would like them. Non Gendered folks would like them human supernatural. So Everybody I mean jump in. Now jump in at the beginning you know like figure out where you WanNa get in and just give these books at try and being credibly entertained and I for a lot of people they love it when a series has a lot of books for them to devour and why not try one. That has you know twenty seven novels. There is something to be said about falling in love with a series and already having a whole lot of stuff to dig into. It's hard to give an appeal score to a series. That's successful. That's this this big. I think that this has a broad appeal I think that for for those who are not into anything supernatural at all the you know this, this might not have it but man if you like supernatural at all. Yeah. Out here normal supernatural. into creatures and there's so many great I wish I could say the word can. I. Say the word if you're like me stupefy can't say it either. But if you're like me, you should and you have you're like me, you haven't picked up the series even though you've probably heard about it for decades just pick it up, give it a shot and I don't hurt. It's not GonNa hurt you and you don't have to. Start from the beginning if you don't want to really as someone who's only read this book, Go ahead and pick up this book. I. Think I think that you will I don't think that you'll regret it. Now I can flick could hurt can't hurt anything can only help you and just look at where we've come to. Since one thousand, nine, hundred, eighty, three you know like people who've been readers for a long time like us. An older you know things were different books were different in the nineties and the eighties in the seventies, and especially as someone like me who's other favorite authors Stephen. King Anne Rice you know you see cultural shifts and it's a little bit of time capsule when you read books that by authors that stretch such a huge period of time. But if you like paranormal supernatural creatures at all and especially when I was gonna say it was with the with the like throats the where people there's better words for this I mean th th rope Syrian throats is now the politically correct term we use in the books. There's all the different big cats, lions there's hanging is there's rats there's there's a wear animal for you. There's a wear animal for you are maybe being an animators more your styling, you WanNa, raise the dead perhaps you vampires fuel of Vampires why the hell have you not read any Anita Blake books. Alright. So I think without further ado, we've got to get into this very, very exciting interview with Laurel K. Hamilton. The we are so humbled that she graciously did a little call with, US. Scott. What talk a little bit about there's some tech stuff if why we had a few technical difficulties with this interview, you will notice a change in audio about halfway through. The audio quality is still good but I apologize for the for the degradation in audio in the second half I mean the world's an imperfect place and you know sometimes it just is what it is. But like we said, it's still as good in the content is frigging fire. So that's all that matters. Without much more further further ado the Johner junkies are proud to present Laurel K Hamilton. Enjoying, the show leave us a review. You can find us on Instagram at johner junkies will as genre junkies don't calm. And now back to the show. With us today needing really no introduction is Laurel K Hamilton author of the Anita Blake series good. Morning. Hello. Hey. Good Morning. Hi Scott Hi Sandra it's good to be here. Oh my gosh. This is amazing to have you. This is so exciting. So I wanted to go ahead and start as a first time reader of the series I was surprised by how little previous knowledge I actually needed to become invested in your characters and your world what is your method to making your books approachable to those who are just coming in? Well I try to treat every book as much as possible where you can pick it up and come in and that you know. That gets harder harder with more books more background you build up, but I really do set down and I think you know all right the first draft because you don't edit as you do for staff that that's that'll stop in your tracks every time but then subsequent drafts I look at it and go Kay I had never picked the series up this was a brand new book if I was in a bookstore or in the airport and honest picking this book up and I was reading it would this draw me in in would this be enough information so that I didn't feel loss I really do I really do try to bear that in mind It is it is quite a challenge at this point but I really do think about I because I still hear from people that say just that like you said your first Ruder I actually do still get a lot of people and I just found you. I'm so excited so many books and people are reading at home in he in doing more books now as things gone on 'cause you know. Online has become harder everybody's kind of hunkering down so. I get. I'm getting lots of Preston, readers. and. They say the same thing. They usually get back to the beginning after they they read up to but but I really do try because I know that in the airport there's going to be delayed That's it. They just don't have shelf room for everybody's whole series. That's that's awesome and I mean I'm so happy like that. Scott found that to be so true for your books all All have gone into more detail on this, but I am not a first time reader. I. Am a long reader. So it was really really exciting to get to have a different. From him as a longtime reader versus new reader. That is really cool. Yeah. It's you know we do what we can hear. Jonah Junkies. Anita is a strong assertive female character just like me. How does it make you feel when your readers talk to you about how much Anita has inspired them it. When it first started a low these. I started out. I was puzzled by how many people said you know she helps me strong because honestly my grandmother race, there were no. and. So I was Rai- I. I wasn't raised to be the girl because that wasn't an option is made heavy had to be lifted when I got big enough. You're talking to it. Wasn't like we had help from anybody else to go to. So I didn't know the Anita was so strong. I didn't know that wasn't option to be anything else it took me quite a few years to go. Okay I understand it now I love the fact that so many people tell me needed has inspired them to be stronger and that it's okay to be stronger, it's okay to stand up for themselves I. Was Not socialized to be to be the girl not in any way I I, was not I was I was told to I had to take care of myself. No Man is conducive for me and that if I wasn't stronger to take care of myself, my way I was at that was how I was raised though. So that's how neat is. That's how I am. I honestly did not there was another option. In and but I'm meet so many women that I really thought would be passed us to be honest. We are still socializing or girls boys so differently. and. And girls are still being socialized to be nice and I love hearing from women saying you know I spoke up I listened to that little voice in the back of my head. I knew it wasn't a good idea. So I said no, because I knew Anita wouldn't do it. I had women that have left abusive relationships and they stay is put up and I I mean that is that is such such a gift to be able to share strength. In a way I, get to share my own upbringing. I share the strength that I was taught and raised with everybody I you know I also get I also get min. The also say that needs help them be strong in a different way that that that they're all different kinds of strength. And just like gives me chills. It is a really. Holy unlooked for on my part and it's been a real gift to share with everybody that was. That must be why like rings so true is it's just what it is is just natural. Yes. I I grew up with my grandma for a lot of my years too. So I always like to hear another raised by grandma type of person, and of course, she was old school old schools. Oh Yeah. Very old school and. An. People's Graham was not all the same but. I do not think my grandmother ever were makeup day in her life. She was raised in farm country. So she didn't have any time. She had no patience radio that followed the all stop that that you know nobody cared what I looked like it was. Could you list this? Can you do this for me? And so I really I. Really you know people will say you know early interviewer said you know and love she said this off camera I love Anita but I bet her closer so awful what made you think to dress like that? In the early. In the this this woman is dressed, this woman was dressed in in very high enclosed top to bottom. I mean, she looked abuse and I I dressed up for the interview but I just didn't have the heart teller of that I just look down at what I was wearing. Eh, needed wear that right Didn't occur to me. The more I, the more I go out and meet people that are more into fashion in more into the whole indoctrination I didn't get about appearance is so important the more I realized that I'm really have no since bashes I really off and I, I that's not a bad thing. It's just it's just I just don't think about it. It's it's just I'm gonNA go Amnuay cupboard. Is By. 'em I covered is everything covered is worried shoes appropriate to the day? Can I walk the dogs in these guy? I. Go outside without tripping on something is it raining or these waterproof do I need? To the practical list that's how I. Joked John is the one who taught me how to wear high heels. because. I couldn't I didn't know how to wear high heels. I. Really. Didn't and. Rightish on Claude his great fashion sense. He's the one who got me watching fashion TV and things like that trying to figure out how to dress him and and so for John Call that I were the really high heels and learn how to rock in because I I wanted to know how that feel felt. Sometimes I write very much like a method actor I will get into the. Of the character in that kind of thing and so. It was only half joking Sean Claude taught me how to wear high heels. Oh, I love that so vital all doesn't awesome sir. I've noticed that one of the things when you introduced characters a lot of times you do describe a lot of what they're wearing where do you get the inspiration for those outfits then? I don't think about close. But what I've learned is that I do I can't design clothes I can't. So but I I can look at things together I I can design clothing. And I didn't know the everybody could do this until. So many people asked I. Know I. DO I get inspiration from different things and Oh, my goodness like the the I have to say that that instagram is wonderful for visuals. You can go through and see things. But also by the time I found instagram to the degree I have. Now I don't even dressing him for years. So I really wasn't in fact I begin to go their dressing election Claude not the other way. I think part of his inspiration came from. Some of the early. Early Hammer Vampire films not the Chris. Really ones but like a One that I saw I was saddened inverse time. His creature feature late, our and my uncle fell asleep staying with those kids. So you know you get to watch anything new adults was awake. And I did not seat again until I was in my twenties I didn't realize that the lead vampire has the long flow blood flowing white shirt and he's got long curly black hair and I went. Oh, Jeez only. He was there in your early childhood memory just of waiting here apparently so that that movie. Back by subconscious and just waited. and. You never know you never know is a child. What's going to stay with you and what's not? And I've learned from my own childhood and now is a is never know what's going to make a lasting impression. Who Know that one viewing of one movie when I was seven point who of all this year slavery go here I am yeah. Exactly. But I didn't know that until after right and I saw the movie later and I just went. How so that's we used to seed of physical I love that you referenced Hammer Horror I'll I love love me some hammer horror fantastic only to absolutely I actually I. loved it with that actually brings me to question. I've been kind of dying to know for a long time. Now, what is your favorite character to write other than a Anita if she is your absolute favorite? Well she's easiest her her voice in after writing her so long it's like it's just instantaneous I can like. Go right into her revolt favorite character right It's really going to depend on the day. Edward is one of my favorites too right because he's dysfunction. Cool. Cooler he's cooler than now I'm sorry. He just he just comes in in Stop I love the repartee between and John is is strangely not where my favorite right because he he is so far from my voice that sometimes it's hard and that's one of the reasons I will get into close. Feel Soak feel waste will help me in a channel. On, better acre Jason Jason favorite character, right? He's just fun. Paper. So. There's so many I mean I I really enjoying really enjoy the large cast though sometimes it's burdensome as a writer has everybody's in my head going I wanNA turn I wanNA paper and I'm I'm starting to feel like a conductor going note that car. have. I have to say that there is a couple of in the middle. I tried to get everybody way tried to give everybody in stage in. It's just it's just too much. You can't do justice to them. So my new role is that you can be on stage, but if if you can't stay in a meaningful way, you just have to wait I'm sorry I can't everybody on stage and do them justice his. There's so many great characters and I want to explore them on. But I'm hoping to do more short novels like I did Mike Adjacent but I, I'm hoping to do more short novels were some of the characters that are not getting either as much time on stage or they're not getting all their stories told can have side books so that I can explore them without having is much. Pressure. Of the main plot of a book machine at me I like that that sounds really cool. I'd be down for more at those. So several of your characters are sociopaths and some of your fans like the one sitting across from me seem to love and be fascinated by them. Why do you think that is and what makes them so compelling to right? I. Think one of the things that. One of the reason I started writing Sydney sociopaths is one it interested me? The other thing is that I truly believe there are a lot more socio has out there than than we think because a lot of people that are sociopath actually don't know they are because what sociopaths are really really good at these high functioning says he pads that. Blend in. Is that they think everybody else doesn't feel empathy either they don't know that it's a thing. So they entertain everybody socially and they can be brilliant imitate socially because they're just entertain the outward manifestation of about all the depth of it. They are some of the best akers because they have to be because they don't feel the emotions that go with what they're doing. So I, I honestly, more research done more. I. Think that there are a lot of people out there. That actually are well behaved not because they will empathy but because the role socialize but that doesn't make them not sociopaths they just this is just Palais are. I was. I was really lucky enough to meet someone was about to be able to talk. At late and it was very interesting to me because this person was the first person to give you a Kleenex. If you're crying candy if your mouth is dry, they were very generous. You would never no never known but their mother's brother resolve this issue. She grown up with, and so she sought an early age is able to explain your different most people and this is why how you hide it. How Yeah Yeah it was it was fascinating to me absolutely fascinating and so fascinating that I knew I put onstage I knew ahead to, and then I also meet other people that. You know with Anita and Edward worry about the sociopaths help are are they but they're to touch their more. First and then there were made if you around of violence, it's not that you really become assistant that's not really not really the race but to my knowledge, there is no phrase for someone that is trained up in sent out to round enough violence where they have to fight for life in they are doing the balance of rules. It's okay to go kill somebody trying to kill you in war, and then you come home and suddenly you're supposed to genie back in the bottle. It. There is just such a disconnect between the two that it doesn't. It actually doesn't puzzlement RN, people have trouble coming back in putting themselves into society because it is just so different I mean really light normal society is so is so artificial in some ways compared to the district of being in a place where life or death on the war that that there's no pretense there you know what you're supposed to be doing and everything, and then you come back here and they release all these rules, all these things that bound you around that that really have nothing to do with greed. And a sociopath because they don't. It strays something in you. It doesn't always work her back and they function just fine. Let me just say that zero people from the from the social forces community said, would you please write somebody? Who has his background? Isn't associate pat on I have. That's actually why there are. Now some some former seals in other special forces in the body guards in the book to have families and talk about the fact that that their wives, the wives really happy that they're now working for some arm. A NIETA because they stay in one place, the money's good danger levels burly low and gets home at night. And one of the reasons they exist is because so many people special forces could you please write one percent are background that isn't the sociopath and so guys this one's for you and that's that's why we have a lot of. Military that are just really regular guys with special special But so sweet a fan service a little bit. Yeah. I I've been really lucky in how many people who from these kinds of had talked over the years in told me stuff that that didn't go in the books of course, just to background had I not talked to real police officers had I not talked military Anita would not have had a trajectory of a character that she did because I wouldn't have known to to get it to her. She's easy about ten about ten years in between ten and fifteen years in mostly officers gets the court where they know where they know they're not going to be able to save the world anymore. They know that that's not how it works and you just get to where you want to go home. You want at the end of the day, and if you get out alive in and get to go home, then that's that's your victory and and. Socio. But I am fascinated with the fact that that someone who finished so well and not be you wouldn't pick them out because they just they just imitate what they see. Really really well, and then you have of course characters. Edward. Edward is the perfect actor. Now, most people his background or not he really could oscar-winner warning performance there. Between his alter ego. Ted Forced her US Marshal. Edward. A assassin to anything more dangerous than he is. But. I I love Edward in his growth as a character because honestly he was greatest sort of a bad guy. I had no idea. You would become a new best friend. I had no idea that that he had that kind of growth in him is a character So I in rituals characters it goes off does his own thing than shows up with done? I don't even know what he's doing. He goes. Oh. What really? Okay. Like like. I did not know he'd gotten engaged you anybody until like one page low needed coming down the escalator airport in meeting Donna. Oh my and then we both we both went. Oh I mean it was just like my mind was blown is like this can't be real I'll like. I love that I love that so much and. Well Edward is my favorite character in the series. South I love that he is still surprising you throughout the book still that Little Devil Oh my God Edward surprises me a lot of Edwards always been like that he's been one of the characters that goes off does his own thing comes back in it's a done deal. Yeah he doesn't ask permission. Debate you just like claw. This is what I've been doing. Well, I've been gone. How are you? Oh I love it, and that actually that brings me to our next question to you kind of touched on this a little bit. But in this book especially I talks about the importance of mental health and therapy is that a message that you're kinda trying to convey to readers these days? Absolutely. Absolutely. I started it started with a certain with annual going into therapy and talking about his time where he was he was running away and he got on the streets and he was addictive drugs and got claim because where leopards put let him in and we'll see got off drugs. And then even after became that, he's still not healthy not and he's been going to therapy and getting better in finding a happiness that works for him and I have so many readers. So many readers that have said that faneuil going to therapy had led them to go to therapy solves. The annual thought a clean stay. Clean had their sobriety. and. Once I heard that from the fans I thought you know I'm a big believer in therapy I've been in therapy. Often on by twenties I honestly you know every says, oh I wish I was my twenties again. Why do you offer? was like a man I barely survived my twist. What I want to go back. On. Your lucky. So in thirty two, begin to figure out who in what you are in or your forties done your work. Then suddenly you're new, you subtle in forties is was my favorite decade and so you begin to fill out your owner's manual each decade. And I love it. I love knowing myself more. I love not sitting around going I have no idea what's going on and you have to fake your grownup. Nobody tells you how to be a UP. there. So few rules I mean I am led the things have moved on. I, really am researching the past I do especially as a woman but at the same time I, think we throwing the baby out back bathwater and we have reached this thing where is to black and white everything's gray and You know a little bit of like here's how you be a grownup. Here's what you do. These are the things you do things you don't do it all agree on it but of course, we can't you know. I like. Brennan talking to her daughter and about a boy, she was seeing high school before last year. Said said Oh. You're going steady and she says what action a new study was just. That's when your exclusive each other and they usually extend your pin or did your classroom and you know you weren't gauge but you were steady were each other's and it was you know she says, introduces that would be so great. All I. Wish we had something like that. Because you know. Because I'm. Because I'm poly-amorous that means I dated across decades much more than most people and May. I say that the people in their twenties and thirties now it's it's much harder today it's easier to hook up than it was when. I was there I was in college out of college, but it is it is much harder to date i. think now especially, if you want a permanent relationship because they're so few rules of how view right now that's a really good point. Actually I really feel for people in the in the younger decades because it is it is there fewer rules and though one-handed screen on the other his confusing and and because are no rules. You don't know what rules the other person's using. So if you're talking to your your your your kids and trying to tell them how you dated, I, it is changed a great deal and. The advice may not be as good as you think it is. It's it's kind of the wild west out there is to help people are doing it beginning of how much things have changed, and he struggles through the book to come to grips with new terminology for the. Supernatural creatures in the book can you talk about that? Yes I did the new terminology for Anita I. decided that. I do politically correct speech to the book. and. Because cancer really just means technically just means being wearable it's just wolf face the Canterbury that's it. So somebody decided somewhere that you needed to be socially correct and have a term that is for old wearables and I did have a lot of fun coming up with different names and I thought. Is there a term that means shape change in general and by Golly they're is It is not fair in floppy T. H. E. R. I. A. N. T. H. R. O. P. Y. They're not there and off. Really. Just. Tongue. Oh my God I'm so tongue twister. It's much harder to say it's harder to spell and but but it does encompass all turning shape from human to animal does cover it all and you get to hear the words or cat which in and you have to use it correctly and people are these already gotten written up once by another Marshall because she didn't use the. Later. For the correct terms. It is it was it was fun to go back or in have needed who's very old school trying to remember all the new socially conscious vocabulary and know eat even some of the other marshals go back with it and by form for you know you can't say where you can't say Wolfman or lead that's for sexist right and so to be gender neutral, it's it's by form one of the alternatives. To they're saying. Polite term or half man half. Happy's. And it was it was. It was really fun and one of the things that led me to do it. Was the fact that that we are trying to read our vocabulary socially conscious it I kind of a little ahead of the curve I did not know how much vocabulary we would have to be changing watching in. So it was really fun to do it on paper and also. Need, just having to change the times or the other marshals because you don't WanNa see sexist and you don't WanNa be species. Any I guess theseus. Speech of yeah all right. It was it was very fun to have her go back and forth it is really fun to watch her. Change and adapt to the current times as a longtime reader. So that was super super enjoyable of it's kind of a silly question but I just wanted to know if you could have any of your character supernatural abilities such as vampirism shape shifting, reenacting, etc. What would you pick and why I wouldn't be a damn? I wouldn't be vampire because of Miss Daylight too much. and. I don't know I would miss sued. I speed able to me and and I hope to do more than on stage where neither can. Were Sean contaced through other people and we also haven't gotten to show that that Damien is also gained that ability through Through the annual end and Anita so I write about the fact that how much they miss you know food and drinking wine and things like that. So it had to be some shake shifter. I I. Don't know I I because I write so much available with annual in Mica and if I lived in a world where I wouldn't be ended down with guns because I changed the animal I would go with wear leopard if I had to adapt to animal that might possibly be not reported to the police ran around the neighborhood, it would be full years. Most people don't know the difference minute coyote wool. Most people down it's the closest I could come to into my environment quote unquote and we definitely have nothing that looks like a leopard around here. The you know we get an occasional cougar sightings and forty miles or so of me probably juvenile of Gwinnett looking zone territory but. So my head to blend, it would have to be wearable 'cause I would pretend there was a coyote but in the coyotes, right here we go. All Hell we're out of here. You smell that GONNA lead us. But if it was just I don't know. It would be weren't probably one of the Catholic anthropoids. There are not other the where rule. So there aren't a lot of dog basically cancerous. Will. Will. Because, we'll are are pretty much some kind of wool is the pinnacle of of Canine Creditor trail. and. You know every place you go in the world if they have hunted them to extinction, there is a lord predatory cap of some kind. So No. Eggs No. No well, that was clearly Scott's choice. Most of the La- can't mostly shifting to dogs is actually not a type of disease from the phone or that I can find it is not a Whit, some witches dogs, but that's rare lately two cats rabbits has gotten but dogs are usually inherited for the hanthropy are shape shifting and they are gardens like family guardians most of the dogs that I could go back to nas factor logs, totally different animal. condescended. They are more. Almost haunting and they also can be a family guardians over the centuries or they guard piece of road or whatever. Usually they're black with blazing eyes or something, and then of course, the wild hunt has the dogs the spectrum house that's more married Anita. So, you've been writing I needed for a long time. But before all of that, what's the first story you ever remember writing complete completed beginning to end maybe even even before that? Yes. Okay well, my first attempts at stories I was I tried to imitate a Louisa May, alcott little women little. They has. and. People go. The. Louise may offer surprised by that, and I say, well, she's the first woman that I read that. I found through dark in the library had supported for Entira family extended family and from her writing and just knowing that a woman in that time period could do that. Made me admire her even more I would not find out until decades later, the she actually wrote ghost stories and horror stories and made some of her money before the more homey stories took off a writing for pulp fiction magazines. So I look. So my early attempts were. Attempts like that. Very. Louise May alcott baby. Ireland that kind of thing, and then I walked into a drugstore versus store Combo near near my home whereas raised and they had on the little tern. Wire timetable where the paperbacks were. they had a short story Pacheco Pigeons from Hell. Robert E Howard short story by Robert Our creator Conan's which I'd never heard of at that time and it was first. Dark fantasy wrote fancy in horror. I ever read I was like thirteen fourteen it was the first outright that kind of dark stuff I never read, and from the moment I read those short stories I is a writer knew that not only did I want to be a writer for sure I wanted this I Hey I wanted to write I wouldn't rank four I wanted to write fostering. This is what I wanted to write and so before of team. So the euros fourteen I finished by for short story after reading this and I also found Edgar Allan Poe and lovecraft and. Andrea Norton for science fiction and. This was line gateway drug are gateway whatever to the genres, and so at fourteen finished first stories beginning to end it was it was completely were completely like almost splatter pump. It was. It was a family in a monster killed everybody. The only person survived was the baby kroll to the forest with implication would never be uninsured die. Era finished everyone died it was complete bloodbath and one of the best things that my my uncle. Uncle monk did for me is a is a writer in an artist. Is he read the story and he didn't want he didn't tell me I needed a psychiatrist. Pat Me on the head. So that's really good. Could have gone so much more pear-shaped you know. Do other parents that kind of story they go. Oh my God. What have we done? Wrong. But I love. My family just took it in stride and patted me on the Henson as. On an end because they didn't tell me, it was horrible. I was able to consider pursue in right the dark stories and. A horror straight horror for for years of I fifteen I'm raining vampire vampire story by and by seventeen I was submitting. Stories to professional publications to try to get them published and fat in for the Internet I was using writers, digest writers of in the writer to get addresses in things. To, send out and that helped teach me how to do professionally. I A wonderful teacher of. In. High School whose name I have now blanked on the love of God. Right. But she she. Library would get rid of magazines like for a penny a pop. When they were the throw them out while she got back copies of the Ryder and writer's Digest. She brought me an arm. Love. And that was how I learned what I needed to do professionally. Managers say that I realize as decades later, she may have meant for me to use them and bring the map or other students, but I didn't take. and. She didn't have the heart to ask for them back. Bless her heart. So either way you know really she she that's why I'm upset I can't I'm blanking on the name is A. I. Don't WanNa give the wrong name because that's I think I'm I'm I'm really bad. I'm only bad on names always have been a good on faces. On, remembering details a visit of face hair. If you change your here, I will not know you the next time I see. If you cut it too short if you cut short a wrote really long are colored differently or even a haircut that's too extreme for the last time I saw you. I will not know you until you introduce yourself to me Oh my Gosh Scott is feeling very seen. That's you guys have that same very, very much. that. Is. It's embarrassing. It's embarrassing especially somebody that he should know and they're talking to you and is somebody okay. I'm on the back of my books. So people will come up and talk to me that I really don't know right and and. talked me into of term I know I do this so Them for well because I don't know if I know them and they just changed their mirror. I love that a so great I love it. We're living in this strange pandemic. How has it affected your creativity and writing process? Will initially I just I finished sucker punch just before lockdown like a week we can happen for lockdown and so. I've been as the question for months doing the book, but I finally finished it enough to send to draft since New York. And then about a week later. So we were in lockdown we I ended this book while all the beginning the stuff is going on in this was before. The tragedy George Floyd this is before the protests. All says editing was done and it was a done deal for the year even weirder an awful. So The big on the editor was for my I think my editor in my in my managing editor probably had more of a problem in that because they could no longer be at their job into the publishing house 'cause close. They couldn't go they still can't go. And working from home working remotely. Thank. God for technology but for them I'm I'm pretty sure they had a hard time at least I was still in my office still where I normally work and they were on their own just isolated at home. They didn't have the staff they didn't have all the things around them that they normally do. So I would think the editing process was probably harder in weird on. On me after that. African has emails, people calling me texting me. So the got attention then I tried to go back to riding in that was when the news and everything else really muscled man I had trouble focusing. I had trouble hearing through you know I think we've all gone. We're all doing the grief process together where agree grieving what not just what's happening the news we're grieving what are ordinary lies were like and with her is good better indifferent. It is a change in changes perceived by most of us. In fact, we're all hardware that change equals grief that you that's what so many people will stay a massive. Change is actually sometimes more painful initially than a positive change. Our mind. So perceive it is is negative. There is on that One is any change in your environment back on our ancestors were were Helen around fire at night and short instead for than anything else to save them from the things that would eat them the change in your environment usually equal danger. So we're still hardwired as if you know the tires GonNa Jeff Out in. Even in Suburbia, and so any change kind of hits the visceral level. I had to make a rule rule is this I do not get on the Internet I do not get online I do not trust the news I do not. The only thing I'm allowed to check before I. Go to my desk is the weather. The weather. In because it messes with me, there's no way to look at these headlines and over these last few months and this down in get into a mindset to create there's just no way to do it. So I had to relieve eastern strict with myself ago. Have you made pages today than you cannot get online know took the news. You just can't a it's because it's twenty, four, seven, three, sixty, five I mean amid never stops thanks to the Internet. There's always news and thanks to six to or global news. There's always something wrong somewhere. It's it's insane, you. Can't touch a break even when things were normal, it's hard. But during this absolutely, not just just say stay off of the same way from it there's nothing I can do it doesn't. If I had a regular job, this support, my family, my job supports my entire Obama. As my for my daughter to go to college the whole thing if I had a regular job, I wouldn't get on the news and let that stop me from working the differences that if I had a regular job I probably go into see people I would have people asking me to do my job I would have customers I would have other people I would have other people to help me focus on the job at hand is lighter. Your office by yourself there's nothing but you to discipline yourself. There's nothing but you and your personal demons and your music to do get out, and if you bring in the outside world too much than it fuels the negative side, the point where there's no way we're past it. So yeah the big thing is that I've even gotten more off line. Is The book has come closer of you know I've gotten world twitter and started some threads. Asking about characters and stuff a survivor character thing because I am going to do more smaller novels. And it's interesting to see that the people that I had decided needed smalls. Their cells are the same people that fans are asking for and saying they would like to see them get more stage time which has been very fun. But yeah, that's the big thing. I really tried ivory tower myself. Once I step into my office even more than I normally do because otherwise it's very rare to create in and do my job. I is a writer on the weird thing about my job is that is that I take. I don't even know if it's just inspiration, but it's like is is a writer. You Soak a things around you and you never know what's going to hit you. Right or wrong or Burgundian or people were you writing is in your book's going will. Sit It's too soon I'm not a nonfiction writer I'm a fiction writer. So this year go in will perk the my subconscious I've got one short story idea that may come sooner in. If I do do that one, it will be directly from this year, but I got to let it. Through and make sure that I am is short story not just my emotional in paper his people are putting enough emotion out there I do not need to add. while I have something to kind of bring up the mood about your ivory tower. As you go your office, we love to visualize people's workspaces when they're creating what is your favorite item that you keep in your office in God one favorite. or or or or talk about just how how you how you build your office to surround yourself with things that inspire you and make you happy. We'll. Most for working is a good view. Eager Expansive Gray or I. You know I keep swearing. I'M GONNA. You know we we gone to the ocean and I've a couple of books with the oceans view and that's my favorite dude right to mountains. A good view having said that on days that I'm having trouble concentrating I have one computer. My may compete looks at wall because on days when my concentration is not good I can't even look outside and riot because I go Burr Oud. An world, there's I care not if the concentration is bad. If somebody walks past my view I'm thrown out of my book so. Any one blank wall. And then I won New Independent on my level concentration I will go back and forth I am blessed and I've worked really hard to have an office that I was able to help the architect design I had input on it. And I personally base my office on pictures of Roger Tory Peterson's. Or Studio I don't have a slate gout here but but I have skylights that have shades it can come and go up and down the mountain, which is Dallas. I have skylights this I like a lot of light everybody you know so many people may fans think I write in the dungeons, I like like, I'm. I'm a hawk I want to be on top of everything I. Want to end the best possible I want to seize many miles around I can I like to see people come in? And I want as much. Light is possible. That's really that's really a I. I'm kind of a light junkie when I create. Now, if the muses running good and horror I can write anywhere I really can but but to get into that mindset to slip into that mindset light do. I write really well around blue or green walls. and. That may be because the my childhood bedroom was pale-blue. So I, right. Well, around the collar that I was originally raised the first place I learned to read the first place. I wrote ever was blue blue walls, and so I really do pay attention to the color of my surroundings. I write better I tremendously better in a Pale Blue Room I I've lived in places rented we couldn't use color and it really does it really does impact me. So for me for me it is. It is I I need at least a blank wall interview if possible but. cluttering kind of person. Which means I like his Are I, like Erlich Cop Chalk Trust, Chomsky's. I. Like I like stones and crystals pretty things trending things. I'm a big fan of Likely Statues Stone Aminals so It is it is not a a niece process, Irish people that I know it's an all my stacks the only time I feel like I have to clean my office is when I look around stacks dust in I don't know what's in them. If lost traffic of insects this time to clean up the way I knew everything is don't touch my stuff. Love that's the litmus test. So this is I have to tell you. This is absolutely hilarious because you and Scott are sounding like the same person more with like everything you say like it is so funny you guys are cut from the same cloth. Well, you know I take take a compliment. We we. I don't know maybe it is. You know we don't faces while we know faces that he changed the outer appearance you know there actually the more studies I do in how how mine truly works Neuro Neuroscience I actually am beginning to believe that certain characteristics like that. Really do go together well, and obviously you guys are my type of people because I adore you both. So this is perfect. Will you know we are going to go ahead and let you go but thank you so much for joining us. We are humbled has been an absolute honor Oh so much. Thank you so much. So Much Scott it has been really fun. To to be on with you and. In just just talk and share. The view. This wonderful. Technology Park. Welcome to the spoiler section who, okay let's get into this book I'm. I'm excited because I had a lot of fun with it. I have a lot of things to say about it too. That sounds ominous. It's not ominous at all. You know when being dropped in the middle of a series like this. You know not having had conversations about a for what twenty years yeah I. You know I feel like there's so much stuff that I have to like get off my chest in disgust with people. You've got to go through that for so long. I haven't. Yeah. I've had a lot of friends that read these books and and we've talked about them over the years and yeah no, it's very true. Well I I. Don't know I. Feel like I should let you start. Well. Okay. First of all I. Love Anita Blake. I was not expecting her to be the I don't I. Don't know what I was expecting with her honestly maybe you had no expectations maybe that's was good I didn't really have expectations. I guess like I said reading through some of the wikipedia things I feel like it was a mistake i. had this I had this image in my head of this this image that I had was. Know a shallow bad, ass. Maybe a little bit vapid but strong character. That's the way that it Kinda made her sound. Oh No. That is not what she is. She is now readily smart, incredibly vulnerable but just absolutely so good at her job she's a complete complete bad ass, and she is good at her job and she's good at working the cases and all that cool stuff that you want in this kind detective eat you know sort of novel? and. She's just an absolute bad, ass very capable and now she has all of these enhanced Cana supernatural abilities to which just makes her character even richer as the years have gone on. I appreciate that twenty seven books in she still able to introduce a A moral dilemma. There's a lot like this book twenty seven. Books in. Introducing New Lord to the world new questions on how things work as well as introducing new moral quandaries to Anita and where she has to ask herself she doing the right thing absolutely because we have this whole issue with the warrant of execution and you know how she and Newman, and everybody you're supposed to handle this. And that's I mean it's it's kind of some stuff that's uncharted territory and Anita talks about that in here and is speaking on keeping it fresh to we brought this up in the interview and I really really applaud her for putting in. Some nods to mental health the importance of mental health with the characters in this book, the males and the females alike, the the tough bad ass people you know being like hey. It's okay to have feelings and to have to work through things really cool where all about normalizing mental health and it's really nice to see that Anita is still in therapy and the still working on herself to the writing is incredibly emotionally mature. The characters are not necessarily emotionally mature share by is approached from a from a from a level where the author is clearly very experienced in in navigating some of these these. Questions in these emotions. Yeah, and I think that's you know that's okay that we're feeling things with her and you know, Kinda going through all all those motions with her makes her very relatable I've forgotten how much I love the woman for the amount of cursing I feel so seen. So see because we all know that I curse just very naturally. It's not be trying to sound any sort of way I'm just. A salty old sailor and Sosa Nita and isn't it good news that they're swearing in the interview so that this is an explicit episode and you can say whatever you want. Yes, I love it. I. Love It. So I want talk all of the characters that are in this book because that is the one thing that there is a little bit of me feeling a little over my head I I, definitely felt for Duke because. Okay. So obviously, Duke is not a series regular. There's some other characters in here that that aren't part of the series. So so here's this this sheriff and he has a basically a murder suspect who is supposed to be executed. He can't do it. So you know the call on the marshals and then the marshal calls in another Marshall who calls in somebody else and eventually there's just this this clown car of where animals entering this town like all of a sudden the population has tripled because all of her friends that have showed up to help her out well, the collision boy yet. I'm being a little funny about it made sense and it was a lot of fun to introduce all the different all that different character dynamic. It's an especially important when it gets to the point when she's you know communicating with Olaf. About her sexual desires with a lot of her other partners I wanna talk about that scene. My point is there was a lot of there was a lot of introduction of characters that I wanted to know more about and I feel I did not feel any emotional attachment to because they didn't have a lot to do well, not in this burke began. That's kind of like I think the idea and I hope the idea is that they caught your attention and you want to know more they were just. They had something to do in this story, but they like a lot of the. Characters Anita's life are not a huge part of this particular story to be told I. Appreciate. Something that Laurel said in our interview about the cares wanting to be on stage and her basically having to tell him no, tell me no, this is not your time. There's not enough room in the car. There's so many points in this book as soon as she said, I realized where they have to be driving A. Car Only, so many people can fit in the car or duke says, Hey, they do not have badges they are not police they cannot be involved in this investigation. They can't be in this scene and I thought that was really smart. It was almost late in hindsight very funny. It's almost like Duke was helping her control, all these characters and their Luke Duke is an interesting. He is a bit of a bigot. But at the same time, a was able to have empathy for him which I appreciate. This is a really cool way that she wrote him like that I, like to Duke a lot because there are definitely a lot of points when you just really dislike him. Off So bad. But I actually do believe just like Anita kind of suspected that we not seeing him on his best day I think so too and that's always important and an exercise in compassion for us all. About the situations we meet people in. So I do kind of like I, want to kind of jump to that like a little bit of the relationship stuff. So off is one of my favorite characters in this series another sociopath sociopath, he's not he's not dead but I. Know Edward Ed. Ted Yeah you know you're in the spoiler section. So you know what we're talking about but. He is fascinating and I love that he is a fan favorite because I mean I. He's so bad and problematic and not a good person, and now he's also part lion. But I find him on ending Lee Fascinating and I just love reading the books where he shows up in it but I mean for girl like me that's not too surprising. But I love that all these other fans are like more of and she's like, okay. It's interesting to me the way that he was introduced in this book because I really disliked him from the very beginning and I was your of him from the very beginning, oh. Yeah and I still don't know how I feel about where I feel like their relationship is going because he seems even though he's trying so hard and apparently his word truly is that good yes he's so. I don't WanNa say evil because the the hard part about him is because he does not have the capability of having those like seeing the moral the he doesn't have empathy for other people. He doesn't have that capability so I. Of Not really a term that fits him. Here's the thing is sometimes sometimes in books, children sometimes in books, people, characters, situations are problematic. They're weird they're troubling. There's something that you would not engage in or promote in real life and everybody has to find their comfort level with characters and plots in situations like that for me I know all those things about Olaf and I still really adore reading about the character and I'm just kinda strapped in and down for the ride of wherever it takes us but it's Important to remember is sometimes you have to suspend the disbelief certain and and enjoy the ride, and just because there is a lot of like in this novels a great example, there's a lot of wonderful high points of morality and ethics doesn't mean that everything has to be perfectly clean cut. Am I making sounds like with what I'm saying I do relationships emotions are messy. Yeah and nothing is perfect and he is far from perfect. He is very, very far from perfect but is Magnetic. He's interesting Oh definitely, and attraction is obvious and now we have this side to his character since he's become a lion where he has something that he can give a Nieta that is beneficial and that doesn't mean that like all the sudden it's like, wow, all off all your sins are forgiven like and I don't think that anybody has painted it. That way everybody is really aware of how problematic he is. But again, this is not a situation that anybody's ever going to run into in real life. So it's okay. It's okay to have a little bit of of time with it and enjoy the journey at the ending of the book when it's clear that he is he's killed Jocelyn. I. Oh well, okay. He he does care about something. He does actually have a sense of justice and then I mean like kind of thought about it was like, well, no he. He's just kind of like a house cat bringing the mouse that they just killed their. To their to their person's feet like, Hey, I did this for you. Just like he has his you know they've imposed these sets of rules on him for who he can kill in staff. This is one of those cases where he kind of goes out on a high note for you because everybody loves a little step of vigilante justice when we know that somebody really really done wrong and Oh my God I was seething at Jocelyn I was seething at that character and I was look. Good somebody needs to take her out and thank God I love. Let's. Jump into a little bit of the relationships staff. So this book was not as heavy on the sexy erotic times as some of the other ones where there's a lot of sensuality in this book, which sometimes her are more about the sensuality than like. depictions of people actually having sex So you know that I. Guess We all know that you're the spoiler section. So there is more graphic sex and some of the other books. Yes. Okay. For sure. So that scene in the hotel room was. Like my favorite scene in the book. It was at times. Funny. It was at times intense. It was just it was all over the place in the best possible way a need is absolute humiliation. But like it not in a way where you felt anybody was like bullying or berating her. Ordering her and her inner dialogue was just completely like kill me. Like. It was so such a great example of all of that stuff in her writing playing off of each other. It's a balancing act because they're all talking about her in a way almost like she's not there but they're doing it to support her. This is a conversation that that she needs to be having that that they need to be having and she has the support group around her who know her and are helping her have that conversation that she is. Way Too uncomfortable to be having in that moments. That's it exactly, and these are all people that love her and care about her and a get into talking about kink a little bit because that is a part of the books as she probably picked up at a part of rata is Kinda like a little bit kinky be DSM type of stuff which is much more interesting than just to Hetero characters boringly going at it. I mean any of the League I Love I love the them trying to define vanilla. Oh. My God. I don't I, don't know if you know what my version of vanilla sex is. So we should probably define that tall my gosh. Perfect and kind of not even on the sex side. There was a part that I highlighted that just really touched me and it's when she's near the beginning of the book and she says I was marrying John Claude and Mica was married Nathaniel. They would be my intended forever and I would be there as we would intend to marry one indefinitely while we waited for the law to catch up with our hearts. And is like. Sue Sweet, and there's lots of depictions of how her poly group and her her people, how much they love and care for each other and it's just really it's just really really sweet. So I I have had some experience with poly-amorous people. We do not yet Paul em and I think that the idea of that is is the idea that when it's pure and win, it's and win. It's practiced is actually very beautiful and and is a wonderful thing for a lot of people not for me. I mean. Yeah and that's because everybody's different. Yes. But when it's done right when it's done honestly and truthfully it's beautiful. It really is well, of course it's I think that's exactly what she's trying to say it's just like monogamy is you know it's a beautiful thing. And It makes these characters a lot more interesting and it makes. The stakes a lot higher in some cases because there is multiple hearts and feelings involved So that's really really interesting stuff too. So there's some great like I mentioned the candidate vigilante thing. There's some great stuff where she talks about and I highlighted them you know with like people not getting their justice not getting you know served how they needed to be and I appreciated that it's a little bit of Canada a real world check in at points to not just makes all of those you know makes you feel much more passionate for Anita and everybody trying to do the. Right, thing, by Bobby Yeah, we've talked a lot of a lot about the relationships the plot itself is really exciting I. I was I was left guessing the entire time and not and not because it was too. It's like I definitely had some guesses and I don't know about three quarters of the way through I. Felt I guessed right on who was involved we we had a little conversation. You had a little conversation we were definitely on the same page. With Canada cracking this mystery and that's I mean that's not because it's a poorly written mystery. It's just gone. I have read so much mystery in our lives that were good at sloughing out clues and motivations was it was a good Mr gots a sign in my opinion of a good mystery. If you if you are able you, you don't necessarily have to. But if you're able to put the pieces together before the reveal I, think that that is a satisfying mystery. Crafted yes. Exactly and with like then leaving clues for us in the detectives to solve along with each other. And that's yeah. No, that's important because they have to be written in such a way that they're subtle or you know you catch somebody lying or whatever the situation is, and you know when Rico was just so sullen and really just like he was involved when when the aunts and uncle broke into the house, they called him to see if there was a deer up in the tree and he probably looked and saw that it was there and hit it. You know I was like some things up with that dude yeah. There was some there was stuff about him from the beginning that raises your hackles a little bit and it just Kinda keeps your going and going and going. We kinda talked about it just a second ago. I do want to circle back around to it. The justice for Bobby and bobby as a character just being someone that you feel a lot of sympathy for and that was I mean it was hard. It was hard summit to read some of the stuff he was going through. Wasn't it was a little it was heart wrenching. It was I really wanted bobby survive I was I was terrified for. Him I was sad for him because he was just so heartbroken his range of emotions when when you know at first, he thought it was him and then he started believe it wasn't him but he was still just. So desperately afraid that he was going to die will and he's the he's the only shifter around for miles and miles and miles and miles and miles and everybody knows that he's a you know that he's Leopard and everything and. There's something about that. That's like makes you feel already compassion for him because he's an outsider. And that he is living in this small town and in this area where everybody knows everybody and everybody's in each other's business and he how's this thing about him? That makes him really different from everyone else and it's something it's something he can't control. It's something that just is who he is. I was kind of torn on how I felt the way that his family even treated him. Outside of you know. Well now, Jocelyn was working him for years. Yeah. But the way he was kind of treated like a house cat will he even says in the pictures I look like the Family Dog, right? Yeah he's he wasn't. Like. He was never. Fully fully into it because I don't know like I don't question it all that his uncle ray loved him dearly and did this and did the best that he could and you know maybe that's the best way to embrace the leper that's inside of him as is when the Leopard is forward is that's the best way knew how to treat. Yeah. To treat him as as family no excuse for Jocelyn she's not included in this conversation, but something about that just seemed sad. Yeah. Yeah you feel pity you feel empathy we feel you feel sad. You know his leopard. Well, it quote unquote not that powerful his lippard is a strong beautiful creature that's been reduced to a house cat. It is something about that. Just made me feel very sad for him. He was just never able to be fully strong. Yeah. To be fully himself and I mean obviously that can be applied to I think a lot of people have felt that way about many different aspects of themselves in their family life and I think that people could really see themselves in that character that kind of being ostracized. And especially, you know it's like we all know from the beginning as the reader we know that bobby didn't do this. We know it did anyway I was like totally did not do this I was I felt pretty sure but I was not I was not not expecting a twist where he was really behind it all I was thinking there's a possibility that this could be him and Jocelyn together and he just got it kind of got swept up in it somehow but then again, he was the one who is caught so I felt like Y-. The red herring kind of he wouldn't. He wouldn't have been able to rely on Newman being the out now, the Marshall that's assigned to them I just came across this one highlight that I had that I love so much and it's Anita's inner dialogue that said, I was not less just because you could out lift me in the weight room. We all had our strengths and weaknesses. Some people could do the math for astrophysics other people could drive. A stick shift no one person could do it all I love that there's a lot of that kind of vibe and hear about you know Cana being you and embracing you and like what your strengths are and stuff i. love that I love that kind of that kind of vibe and that was a perfect quote for it. She may not be able to do anything, but she can certainly beat the shit out of a wear leopard that says was so. Chance to subdue bobby. Yeah. Of course, it was horrible for Bobby and I was afraid he may have been dead for a while there. But so was she the imagery of him changing and her just just wailing on him even Duke says it's got a hell of a haymaker something along those lines. Yeah. No she can definitely, she has a lot of physical hand to hand combat training that's a ground throughout the books. So can I ask kind of a fun question kind of the floral as well? Oh, I know exactly what's coming go for it if you could be. A supernatural creature in this world for what you know of them right now and I know you don't know everything but would you want to be a vampire some sort of a shape shifter and of so what animal a animator? What are you think? So it's a little bit hard because I really haven't been introduced to the vampires in this world. They're they're very late Jean Claude is the king. They're very kind of like area hierarchy. Yeah I, definitely get. Just, say Yeah I get the impression that it's very much like the camera in the world of Darkness Sha. Yes. Ansa said a good similarly and that's the case I actually don't want to be a vampire because there's a whole lot about stabbing chickens. Yeah. Vampires come with politicking. Everybody always forgets that they want the funds sexy romantic. Children of the night vibe in it's like you know you're GonNa have to politic here. So I would have to be aware octopus. Stop I don't know if they exist but that's me. I would just go out to the ocean every full moon and just go swim around and catch fish and collect coconut shells and then. Well. You know. Let you gave me an honest answer. I can't fault you for that. Be a great where octopus. Great and I don't know maybe some will I mean you're not out of the politics could still end up as somebody's animal to call you know. But what are they going to have? You do slow you might they might have you steal things because octopuses are very sneaky. Now that's that's just analyst. At certain grief it's. Just an idea. Who says if I was aware octopus that I would have to be part of the coalition or they might. They might Cana Maki. Roll you if that's the case I, probably would like to be like Edward. Prior. To the end of this book I think I would just like to be a bad ass human. I feel you on that I would have no problem being yeah. Is that is that one of the creatures of this book a sociopath because there's a lot of them. For. True. Yeah. No. I would definitely be kind of a bad as human I. Think would be my preference as well. I've always loved the idea of the animators stuff and you know that goes into some epic places and some other books. But considering I'm you know like a vegetarian I'm not going to be sacrificing an animal every time I need to raise the dead. So that's like straight out for me. Unfortunately, I speaking of epic stuff. Apparently, there's a book where she raises a Zombie Army I wanna read that one absolutely a deal. But I mean of course I. Love Cats I. Love Shaped Shifter's I love like and terms of all strokes. So I would be down to be any sort of liken throat because I'm all about that life Pity Ya, I think. I. JUST WANNA kill bad people with Edward. 'cause love him. Well, I guess it's time to say good night good night. Yes. Sir. It is I I will say I think a lot of people who are listening to this section already love and adore these books. I would think so I I, just WANNA say at least with this one I'm with you now I get you now I understand you get this worldwide millions of copy sold phenomena. It's a lot of fun and it's also really meaningful and powerful it is and You know I kind of outlined it a little bit earlier. But I, of course, want to end on a little bit of a sappy note. You know that I just really appreciate the character of Anita and what? Laurel K Hamilton has done with that I'm the type of girl who speaks her mind and I mean I am very polite and I'm very considered of people's emotions Lisa try to be but you know I've been definitely called a ball buster bitch all all that stuff so many times and I don't mind because if that means I'm on the same caliber as Anita, then she sister will take it. All right, everybody. Obviously, we love this book. I don't think we're going to give it a star rating because it's a little little different than our normal flavors since it's part of a series like this but we obviously bolt had a tremendous time reading this book. Thank you Laurel for being on the show. Thank you for writing Sucker Punch. Fantastic read goodnight Scott good night Sandra. Please keep reading pasture bedtime. So Sandra was so nervous to talk to Laurel K Hamilton. She was so nervous. So I get nervous before every single interview and Sandra is so professional and so calm and she teases me. Nervous Bene- thing she gets nervous about nothing and Sandra was just so nervous to talk to her and I think I would be curious to hear why specifically. I think for me it's just because I've been reading these books for so long and I've been invested in the characters and in the world I don't want to not be anymore and if this author that I've been reading since I was a teenager. Was Mean Rude to? flippant not that any author has ever ever been that way that I've met on this show in verson every author I've ever met has been fricken lovely and at least professional if not warm and fuzzy, which most of them are just warm and fuzzy lovely to talk to. But I was worried that like what if she's awful and I have to throw in the towel of this? Incredible. Investment of. Books and characters emotional investment, not financial of since I, I mean for like twenty years or whatever. Okay. Not Quite twenty years that I've been reading the bugs but damn near you know and I was like what if I have to throw in that Tau because if somebody is awful I? mean. To me I would never wanna read their books again I'd be like, fuck you you know. And so it was like Oh God don't be a bad person that I have to give up now because I don't WanNa give it up. Give it up. It's so funny because you're right. Every author we've talked to has been wonderful and lovely. I in fact, this this this show in my mind has kind of evolved over time to be a celebration of the author's so much because I have fallen in love with authors so much I'm so fascinated and delighted by what they do and I'm so excited to to learn about them and and hear about them and talk to them. But This is kind of the first time where it someone that we that that one of us has. So. Much history with right like it's you know again, this is authors that I've been reading a long time are it's not a huge list. It's you know been reading her books for a long time been reading Stephen King and Rice for very very long time. At this point, I've been reading Joe Hill for a long time. You know it's it's not a huge huge list of authors an especially one that reaches this far back into my teens like that. It's like heart don't fuck this up. Don't fuck this up and make me have to throw out this. Characters and I didn't think that Laurel K Hamilton repeat lake that I really didn't. But you know it's like the stakes were high that I didn't want to be let down and I wasn't.

Anita Anita Blake Scott mislocate Hamilton writer WanNa US Edward Laurel K Hamilton Anita Blake Vampire Hunter instagram Anita kind Jonah Junkies Sandra Sean Claude Edwards John Laurel Anita job Cova
99 | Fantasy | Monkey King: Journey to the West by Wu Chengen

Genre Junkies | Book Reviews

38:25 min | Last month

99 | Fantasy | Monkey King: Journey to the West by Wu Chengen

"Weirdo bookworm unite. We want to share our love of genre fiction with you. Some readers out there may look down on you for your love of sci fi and fantasy but not us stop by as we discuss what we've been reading. Hey john junkies. Sandra and this is scott and stitches is here too. So that must mean. It's time for an episode. Tom for jonah junkie so we have something a little bit different on the show. Tonight we are doing will. It's it's to see it's not a new release so much something that's at least five hundred years right. Yeah okay tonight. We are going to be talking about monkey king or journey to the west. Now this is a new translation. A new adaptation. Yeah and i really wanna talk about that. Because i think it's we'll we'll get into kind of the history of the monkey king in a minute. i guess we should start out though by talking a little bit about ourselves will scott. We have shared fun thing to talk about finished one division. Oh yes we did. No spoilers no spoilers. But i've been thinking about this for a little bit now yes and i feel like one. Division is in a way kind of Marvel's empire strikes back. I don think is fantastic. It's one of my favorite. mcu properties this point. It took two characters who i liked a lot and turn them into my absolute favorite writer. Die i care about them more than anybody else ever ever ever. And it sets up kind of where everything is going. I feel like yes. So i i love it. I think that there's a lot of conversation out there amongst people who aren't even. Mcu fans about it. I don't i don't know if ultimately it really appeals to non mcu fans. I don't know if it introduces people to the universe from a fresh start but nah but if you have any kind of connection to the mcast the mcu if you've watched any of the avengers y- this is absolutely a must watch. I agree with you. And i think said on spooky slumber party that we're might have been the culture we've talked about it a little bit on both but that you have to have like conversational. Mcu like you don't you don't have to like a lot of marvel stuff you don't have to be the biggest most absolutely obsessed fan. Read all the comic books or anything like that but you have to at least seen the movies thus far especially you know your endgame your ventures. I think you need to have seen the avengers series particularly starting from a to see all of the events. You should see all of the avengers. But really i think it's important to see the second one. Yeah and then go on into into the final ones right so you'll at least have a basis for these characters and do a pretty good job of catching you up. 'cause there's some repeat characters and stuff like this and it's nice because they're like they kind of tell you like because they were he remember so yeah. We're both feeling a little bit. Lost out another marvel or star wars show so disney plus could you. Could you actually get on that. Just a little bit here for some more Because we're excited for all of them. I think all of them. I am so my exciting thing to share and i know you liked this too but i i. I'm very happy. I finally saw maude. It's been two years people. It's been two years waiting for this longtime masterpiece from rose gloss. And you know always always always. Oh the over hype. Oh the over hype you blue. It's no secret that we're fans of eight. Twenty four specially me huge traffic twenty four and this is their latest piece. it is religious horror. it is pretty intense. It exceeded my expectations. I was so happy waiting two years for this film. And i just was so not let down and it brought me a lot of joy like most eight twenty four movies when it ended had this painful smile on my face because i was smiling so hard made me feel moved and uncomfortable and oil. I i can't wait to talk to more people about it. So if you have an opportunity to watch saint maude streaming do so and then talk to me about it. And i'll just say i have watched the film twice and coming from me if that doesn't say something especially religious horror which is notoriously can scarce our scott uncomfortable. I think it's it's very well. Done film yea okay. So without further ado. Let's talk about the monkey king. So this is like scott said. This is a recent translation a release from penguin classic. Who they do a lot of cool. Classic books penguin classic. If you've ever if you are interested in checking out some classics so This book is wilton epic really and it is largely attributed to been written by liucheng n bought it was. We don't really know who wrote it. We don't really know it's at the time that it was originally released in the fifteen. Hundreds of that kind of fiction wasn't really Wasn't really a glorious thing. So people didn't really attribute their names to it. Yeah which is really something to think about kind of a trip and you have to imagine. I'm not like putting myself like next to these people. But it's almost like the people who were reading fiction since it was on savory and writing it they were kind of like john reid jonky predecessors yes like it's okay to like fiction and of course. This version was translated by julia. Louis which i think she had great job so a little background and kind of synopses of the monkey king The monkey king was as we said kind of written down in the fifteen hundreds not sure by who but largely that. It's that gentleman But it was based on very old stories so the monkey king and it's a little hard different scholars say different. Things were kind of inspiration for the legends. But that's also kind of a little bit shrouded in mystery. We don't know exactly how the monkey king in the journey west kind of came to be You can see it compared to other seminal works of its time in the culture I mean more. Contemporary kind of lord of the rings five the canterbury tales don quixote. It is one of the pieces of chinese literature. That is just absolutely defining. It's considered one of the masterworks. I think there's four or five masterworks of chinese literature and it is about a wonderful monkey a monkey of stone at named sue kong. Who yes he's born of stoneys not born of like a mortal body and this is basically his journeys in the journeys of the people he meets at through his life through all of his trials and tribulations. He's he becomes immortal. He is a trickster of sorts. And then he ends up on this pilgrimage to go get some scriptures with some other pilgrims and he has to help out along the way and Go through a major major growing spurt and he is hundreds upon hundreds of years old thousands. I believe in. Yeah son will. Kong is just a fun. Loveable a trickster. He's very. He's very impulsive. Does whatever he wants to you know to make himself happy at any given moment and it's it's so much fun to follow him. I have to say. I've become completely obsessed with the monkey king. I become completely obsessed with this book. And that's split. That's my that's my experience scott. I'm completely obsessed. I a monkey king tattoo. I love him. I love him so so much and we are different. Sue and son. I but we are also very much the same. I very much identified with him in funny ways including his use of humor in situations his kind of like he wants to do good and sometimes he does really good and sometimes he's just two mischievous and he comes up with crazy ideas and he just he has so many quips. I mean my god. I but he's also this bad ass superhero but also adorable but also like fierce. I don't i just i'm obsessed. I love him. I love love. Love that ak julia level did a really good job of of bringing this story condensing it in a way to to what's interesting but but also Taking some of these these jokes and humor and puns that are clearly in the original taxed and bringing out in a way that is That is understandable by a western audience. Yes so that you know. I i felt like i really understood like okay. Yes some of these. Phrases are probably not exactly as they were written in the original text. Show but i understand what the kind of idea of what was originally there. Yes and really captures the humor. Yeah and the satire of the story. Oh my gosh there is a wonderful kind of introductory section of this book for like a huge chunk of the beginning. And i actually read it. Read the book and then went back and read it again. Because i kind of wanted to like sandwich. It like that and kind of have it in my mind. And there's a great forward in there as well but And it really paints some of the you know the history like we've talked about like you know of the monkey king in its cultural significance in china And different ways that people have interpreted over the years It is very satirical. And it's been used like pro. Certain things and anti certain things kind of whoever was like popular at the time used their whim. It talks a lot about obviously. Buddhism is a huge part of the story in the buddha is a character but buddhism confucianism tau ism. They're all talked about and also made fun of and like it really smart ways to the point. Where all three of those groups at different time have banned this book So that immediately makes you like wait. What buddhism comes out the most favorably. Certainly when when it's all done in the wash but it's not without some criticism. There's a really great partha. I'll talk about in the spoiler section having to do a satire as well but i don't want to ruin it. It's so funny it's like don't let me spoil a five hundred western right but i feel like that. There's a lot of readers out there. I'm sure that a lot of you are very familiar with the monkey king and her saying how could you not have known about this in the past and you know i'm a little i'm a little ashamed of it myself but i also know that there's a lot of you out there who probably have not been exposed to this or at least say don't know that you've been exposed to this because there are some very popular Series in movies and stories that have kind of taken inspiration from the story. And i was surprised to really recognize some of these scenes and even some of these characters from these that. I've share your favorite. Go ahead okay. I don't wanna say it's my favorite. But i cannot believe how much was aped from the story. He by dragon ball. It's not the same story but the characters are very clearly based on these characters. It's not the monkey king but it's not not the monkey king son. Goku who which is a japanese like basically the same name. Japanese has a monkey tail. He has a stick that changes sizes that he fights with and he flies nimbus cloud. One of his friends is a pig. It's it is. It is very much. And i've done some research than since then since reading this and realized that that yes. It's not even hidden inspiration. But i digress. I heavily encourage you if you have not been exposed to the monkey king. This is a great introduction. And i think you'll find yourself falling down a rabbit hole where you'll be wanting to know more about the things that were not included in this book fund stories that i think that the translator probably rightfully did not include in this book to make it much shorter than the original text. Yeah it'd be. Thousands of pitches or something. I'm sure if she put in every colloquial story of the magi gang but one other thing. And we don't have an official score for this experience but this feel so episodic that it doesn't really fit into one of those categories for me because this is a kind of that it would be really fun to just read an episode in the life and come back to it later you can binge read it as one long story or you can just like read it a chapter a time. And here's here's the latest tale of adventure and misadventure of and his companions chip ataka pigs e. Sandy stole my name. But it's fine. No they're all. They're all great in their own. I liked all the characters a Did wanna hit with something a lot of the times. But you're supposed to but a monkey is one hundred percent my favorite and even though we've read fantasy epics and different fantasy classics and stuff. This really stands out for being so funny it is it is really very uneven. I was lulling late crazy and like yet real outlawed last came from both all's beautiful cover of this penguin classic addition to you by the way The forward i had mentioned briefly is written by jean Liu gang who is a comic person from the comic book world and he does a really beautiful introduction where he talks about how his mother who is from china would tell him stories of the monkey king and these are these were like his bedtime stories and he talks about the influence of the monkey king and his powers and compares them to some of our more contemporary comic book. Heroes speaking of marvel universe and also dc he and other properties and howled. The monkey king completely fits right in with that. Different pantheon of superheroes. It's a lot of a lot of action. There's a lot of fights as a lot of battles. There's a lot of magic neil. Gaiman has also talked about this book and you know how it's was influential to him and if you take nothing else away from you know this rerelease from from penguin classic is that people and i'm now count myself totally among them. Do not want the monkey king to die. We don't want it to pass from popular culture and memory. It's a hugely significant story and character but it's also one that brings a lot of joy and deserves to be celebrated for so many reasons culturally stuff but most importantly because it brings a lot a lot of joy. And i heard about the monkey king a little bit different background than scott had heard about the monkey king. I was aware of it. But i thought that he wasn't for me. And i was calm and then when we had this opportunity really. Hey let's read this book. And i was like the monkey king is for me. He's not only for me. I feel like he's like my soulmate. I feel like he's very very much for me. So i only said it was an obsession. I mean i think this is absolutely the the mass mass appeal like. There's a reason when something's been around for like we said it written down for five hundred years and the stories are older than that. You can't get more. This is for everybody then that i fully agree. This is one hundred percent of mass appeal book. It's a mass appeal translation. It's it everyone if you if you are familiar with the monkey king already and read other translations i encourage you to read this and and talk to us and let us know what you think about this translation. If you have if you have not been introduced to the monkey king i would say. This is a fantastic introduction. Alright so again. It's kinda funny to talk about this book in terms of spoilers because it's ancient we will just kind of leave you about that and move into the spoiler section and get a little bit more involved in talk about some of our favorite and funniest parts Though of course you know this book sometimes goes to some little bit scary in dark places. I think you could definitely if you have kids in your life. You could read this to them. It's it's for all ages for sure. Yeah there's there are some adult themes there are this. Jd latian steps this translation. At least makes it pretty A wholesome i would say like enough for readers of all ages. I feel that way as well. Yeah and like. I said the jonah junkies telling you if you think oh. This isn't for me. Trust us it is for you enjoying the show. Please like in subscribe on tunes. You can find us on twitter and instagram at john junkies and don't forget to visit the website genre junkies dot com look back to the spoiler section or we spoil books so old that our great great grandparents didn't read the original texts. They're like there's everybody's ancestors read this not their great grandparents so okay. I just want to do before i lose the thread and wanted to talk about one of my favorite satirical parts at the boot of the movie of the story. There are movies or tv. Shows that are like directly picked up the monkey king. We haven't watched them yet. But we're going to let you know when we dale now set okay so this satire of the land of women was apart. I absolutely loved from the very beginning to the very end of that. Entire to chapter section bra. Something like that. I loved the characters that we meet. I love that chip yakuza in pigs fall pregnant. It's fricken how laureus i i love. That talks about this in the in the sort of the history the beginning of the book that this was a time in china when this was written that was very male dominated and so we have the tables being turned on these guys which i mean. It's you know the world is still unfortunately run by the patriarchy and we need a little more may jerky in their welcome to women's history month by the way But they fall pregnant. They're walking through this town where there's no men and so they're being googled and like you know they feel very exposed and on display their looked at a sexual objects. They're forced into a marriage they don't want to be in triple takas case and it's just it's so perfectly funny. I them become then. Becoming pregnant by drinking from that stream was so unexpected and so hysterical. I they can't stand the pain even five seconds and i mean chip ataka complaints in bitches about everything but It's kind of his character his thing but you kind of expect some some you know winding from pigs to but still alice. Obviously monkey is my favorite character is. Here's was somebody else. Your favorite character monkeys my favorite character but pigs. He made me laugh. The most pay they have this frenemies thing going on and i love how they could be in the middle of one of the most like a terrifying situation heroin and they just start like sniping at each other start competing against each other and yeah and in tripping each other up just because they can. That's the kind of relationship that they have. They're so very few moments of this book where monkey feels like. Actually scared like it. There's there's so many so many moments book where it's just like. I know everything's gonna turn out. I'm the best. Yeah i'm i am the greatest so i'm going to have a little bit of fun on the way and he's he's basically becomes impervious to everything. Yes i mean. Even the journey itself which is outlined in the book. Monkey could've accomplished this pilgrimage on his own. One hundred percent would have been easy. He could have done it in literally. Moments but monkey wouldn't have learned a lesson so and oliver other characters. When of linda lesson in the reader's wouldn't have gotten the story so it's kind of you know the kind of work it in there that you know monkey has to grow a little bit just like we all do monkey and i both still have lessons to learn and i. I'm big enough to admit that. So i want to live in his kingdom of monkeys. Absolutely adorable it's precious for those. Who don't know i'm i'm obsessed with all animals all living things but monkeys have a special place in my heart. Any sort of monkey ape old world new world doesn't matter. I'm absolutely in love with them. The only thing that like most have any sort of biological clock is the idea of having a baby monkey. I don't like that all the monkeys became warriors and soldiers. Though i know i liked. I liked their happy life in the cave with the didn't need to be a little better prepared though. Because you know like if you just play all day then you're not prepared for hardships. So that's that's important I'm just looking i. I've so many so many freaking notes about this book. Just my i one. A monkey stands and falls by his work. There is actually a lot of kind of proverbs that that you know clearly the your providence. Because they've been around for a very very long time but that are changed a little in a very funny way like that. Most of my highlights. I do a lot of funny highlights. But i think we're switching. Were switching the tables on each other a little bit here because most of my highlights like they're really dark and disturbing parts of this. I have both. I have funny things highlighted and planning things highlighted. Oh no but mine are not minor amount. Funnier poignant terrifying. Oh okay for example. A liebau was nailed to a wooden frame and cut to pieces in the marketplace after which his head was displayed on a pole. Right it's got that fairytale folklore stuff that can be kinda dark and disturbing but the thing is is like it's not there's no heaviness to it. There's nothing in here. It's really heavier than any any. You know original fairy tales. I accept that. Yeah yeah i mean bad. They like it's kind of funny to read it like oh chopped into pieces. Gotcha because most of them are are said so offhand. There's that whole chapter about you know about double fratricide and all this and at the end as for one gel when quietly committed suicide after all yeah and chap turn actors look well. We're just gonna it's just a fad out there just a fact. Yeah and i was like okay after all through with that plan. One poignant quote that. I have highlighted here that because i definitely want to share some funny ones some dark ones and some can use those are jumping off points but is what you described as fiendishly. Hard nothing in this world is hard. It's only the mind that makes it so. Brilliant are have that highlighted as well Oh i love. I love i. Love monkey goes to heaven and or until he goes to hell and he crosses his name in every other monkey out of the ledger. Just a racist them from the book of of life and death and it's it's a fun little lay to explain why monkeys live so long. They're not actually immortal but they can live a long time. But it's also like you know sometimes monkey even before his transformation does nice things. Yes yeah monkey he is not a he's not he doesn't really have an evil bone in body he's just mischievous and selfish. But when i feel like you're talking about monkey affiliate you're just talking about me and i'm like i'm not selfish. I mean i'm no more selfish than any other monkey but at low how towards the and he really does become a very caring will he saves all those little guys just because he he should yeah. There's some parts that alice wonderland fives especially the first kingdom under the sea where we visit general fish belly. And there's all these like little crabs soldiers all these things and it's like we are big fans of anthropomorphized thing animals around here. Chandra junkies and this did not disappoint with the animals on parade. I mean the commander of spirits to maintain troop morale a little creatures under the sea precious precious. There's no other word but precious you're talking about all of the creatures in the ocean. There's a few there was a few times when that happened. Is just like imagining these. These perch courtesans just like okay. Sure start it's just too cute things about this translation that I don't know if it's a westernization or if it's if it's just that same kind of thing but there's there are characters. There's points in this book. When i read it in almost like a posh british accent in a weird way like there's this whole thing where we're character is he's about to be brought back to life mustache about garnett that is. There's one of those things where i want to know more about what it's like kind of in a direct translation right but i again. I feel like there was care to be taken. Where that that that paragraph of that character talking i sounds like it. It really is kind of a tongue in cheek and a little bit of a satirical Joyous joke and whether it translates exactly like that or not. I love the way that that kind of thing comes off. And i get the intention there. I totally agree with you Maybe this is something we should have said in the before section. But if we're all here now is that even though the translations are fun and at westernized in ways so that we as english readers from western countries can accept it. This is very much in eastern tale. This is very much a tale from china. This very much taylor buddhism and as such you don't get a lot of the What what do. I wanna call this. Abraham religion hangups and abraham religion things like when they talk about how that is different than the you know abrahama versions of hell especially the christian when when they talk about abortion in the abortion. Water is a portion is as much as evans. Bellicose would like you to think as a new central thing is very very old tell and from different cultures. Different people had different views about it. We still do to this day. And there's that word has become very loaded. But i mean there's probably not better word for unprecedented. You know what i mean like just kind of is so sometimes things in concepts or you know the ways they talk about. You know being like you know they're unworthy their undeserving servants. All these different things are sometimes stuff that we maybe haven't come across as western readers and it's always good to walk in someone else's shoes whole point of books and see what this culture and what this author meant by things Oh one of my favorite quotes. If you don't help chip ataka or learn to work hard and accept criticism you'll always be more of a demon than and mortal. Oh my monkey learn so many lessons. Take some of her a long time to do. It took him five years. It took him five hundred years to to learn. You know restraint naming horrible. He's so funny when they get him out of there too. I just i i mean i do like that. Monkey learns his lessons and he needs to settle down. I don't like to think of monkeying completely domestic sized by the end of this as another quote. I love monkeys heart however still plotted rebellion. Like i bought monkey to forever be adversarial character and rebellious character. And i think a lot of people from what. I've gathered love that about monkey that he kind of bucks the status quo and messes with things. He's he's a little bit of a revolutionary guy. Oh and he's great. He's a great connor. Does he's a good gifter. To one of my other favorite parts is when they had to do the exorcism of the son-in-law and so they're trying to cheat get your luck has turned said monkey. It just so happens. We are doctors. Indeed -nology he has a great turn of phrase for a lot of things. Like the bureau of racy reincarnation. Yes he just has. He's so quick on his feet and ways to think of things and you can just kinda see him slipping into these different characters when he is in different situations to kind of con people and he. He sometimes has names for his little plans. Like cycle this escaping the net through a sham marriage invented name my friend. Because that is exactly what you're doing. I love this turn of phrase right here but as the saying goes a large mountain must have a monster. I'm fine with that. And i love. Oh my gosh. So many great monsters and demons and creatures and davies and spirits. It's absolutely beautifully rich. Cast and i'm you know. I know no adaptations to film or tv will ever ever fully capture. Just this beautiful magical world. But i'm still gonna watch them Another just fun little part. That reminded me of myself is when monkeys talking about you can torture me. Can chop me into pieces. Split me a couch out my heart. Don't ask me to sit still. That was that was such a great character moment for him. It feels like if felt like the whole book was setting up to that joke. And then you know there's another part were there. There's a scene in here and and win. The visitor flew off without a courteous. Leave taking well. That finally confirmed to them. They're they're supposition that he was no gentleman right the the audacity of at all. They knew it was an impostor because he didn't say goodbye. There are rules here I love love history. And i like i said you know. Not just two books but learning about history. Books is one of my favorite ways to see how people were in the manners of the times and the traditions of the times and you know religious beliefs and spiritual countenances. And i think this is such a wonderful glimpse into you. These snapshots of china. Which has this absolutely amazing. Amazing history. That i've personally been interested in ever since i was a little kid and i watched big bird goes to china s. One of my favorite childhood films fakery goes to japan. Great china china was first for me though. So that's my one in my heart. Well that's really beautiful about. This book is goes through through many different cultures. Certainly china is celebrated especially towards the end but china is also denigrated but there's kind of an acceptance and a kind of a bit of a like they're kind of blase about these other people and other cultures and and frankly other races right because they're in china and going to end up in india go through nepal. They go through tibet through these other. Parts of china. Yeah and and there's no like these other cultures are not senate are not made sinister. In fact they're making a pilgrimage to india to bring back to china and there's no because that were there. It's it's kind of nice. Yeah it's so fun so so fun so many stories absolutely action packed so it is hard to give this a grade in you know because it's an old old story it's a classic but i think it goes without saying that for me this is i can give it a letter grade and i would give it an a plus i would give it an absolute absolute a plus highly highly. Endorse and celebrate the monkey king. And i'm so happy that there's a new wonderful translation out there so myself and other people can fall in love with him. I'm going to give this a rank s just to beat you know i think it's rank s.'s. Above a plus ever heard of that. Yeah it's wonderful and fun and inspiring Both creatively as well as spiritually. I think it's i i. I had a lot of fun. I'm really glad that i've been introduced to the story. It it re colors and colors a lot of my experiences In ways that i was not anticipating well said there you have it. The jonah junkies were pro monkey king. We hope you are too Let us know if your plan to read this if you've read other versions or maybe you're from a family that told stories about the monkey king. We'd love to hear about it because as newly baptized monkey enthusi- s. I mean. I'm right high on that somersault cloud and i just want to hear all about it. Thank you so much for being here with us. Thank you scott. Thank you sandra. Please keep reading the monkey king past your bedtime

scott john junkies jonah junkie saint maude penguin classic liucheng n sue kong china julia level jean Liu gang Mcu john reid Jd latian maude don quixote wilton Sandra Marvel Goku
85 | YA | The Insomniacs by Marit Weisenberg  With Interview!

Genre Junkies | Book Reviews

1:17:53 hr | 8 months ago

85 | YA | The Insomniacs by Marit Weisenberg With Interview!

"Weirdo bookworm unite. We want to share our love of genre fiction with you. Some readers out there may look down on your for your love of horror sci fi and fantasy, but not us so stop by as we discuss what we've been reading. Jonah Junkies at Sandra. This is Scott welcome to genre junkies. Have come to John NRA junkies. This is awesome Oh. Just, sounded like Jonah Junkies Jonah Junkies if he said a third time, we appear in your house like beetlejuice. Please do we'd like to get out. Let us out. Let us out how low welcome. Welcome tonight we have a very special episode for you. It's been a very special episode for just months at this point because we've had so many great author interviews. Yes. No I mean I'm proud of it, and I mean every one of our episodes a special every one of our authors talk to you a special. And it's just such a proud thing to get to talk to these folks and have that you know that to share with our audience and so then if you guys want to read their books or you just like hearing authors talk, we can provide that for you. It's a service that we can provide. So, on tonight's. Very very special episode. Now, I'm kind of saying that like it's like an after school special. Episode now. That's the drug episode Janisch everybody. Charlie. On tonight's episode we talk once again with our friend author Margaret Wisenberg who we have talked to you before but about two years ago yeah I can't believe that it has been that long since we talked to her could she. So we talked to her about her new novel, the insomniacs and I think this is going to be quite an interesting interesting topic to. Discuss for this book a little different than some stuff that we've read before but it is It is adjacent to our wheelhouse for sure. Yeah. We've been kind of branching out a little bit recently you know going a little bit outside of just just strictly horror scifi fantasy and kind of been going into a little bit more of as you may have seen thrillers straight young adult contemporary. We have some true crime coming up. Yeah, I mean like I said, there's there's an adjacent nece to it that I think is is is relevant but. A lot of it is just kind of finding these stories that we don't want to fly under people's radars to that we think the author or the story itself has something to say, if you can hear crunching in the background, the producer stitches is crawling into a bag as cats are want to do her favorite thing in the world. If you know, that's how she wants to produce this episode that's her process, and we're going to let her do that some fully work some fully work be at. I mean always horror fantasy Scifi is like her church. That's our. Father Subtle Spirit it. We always go that to that but sometimes you find little bird paths off there. So tonight's kind of like that tonight's book is kind of a way I was calling it a y a mystery psychological contemporary. I. Think that that is a very long but very apt category. Yeah and I mean you can break down however you want. But those ones really come to mind to me to to a place where I'm like I can't get rid of one of those descriptors like all of them. It's going to be a very long episode title in that case. Come up with some sort of an. anachronism a wop if you. Will. See. Look relevant. We are here at John Junkies. Yeah we know what that is. So. For our fun fact, I actually want to do a little plugging. Okay. Plug away. So we are I mean it's always spooky season in the trauma junkies household and this year Halloween is GonNa look a little different. But as we talked about some of my other shows on the colts show in Spooky Somber party, you know Halloween if you love it, that's an all year round thing and October thirty first is just for the Taurus. So even though Halloween's GonNa look different for all of us in a pandemic it's still going to happen still going to be a lot of fun and. You know if you're new round here, maybe maybe you don't know the month of October, we completely dedicated to horror. It's all horror all the time we usually squeeze in a couple of extra episodes while we're at it try man we try So I'm really really excited because that's of my Halloween season is is doing that with you guys is really horrible with you guys and if I can get my act together I, really WANNA put out a reading list of what we're going to do all October seat can follow along will that on social media and stuff? That's that's Anti Sandy School. That's my fun fact for the week. Can I sign your fun fact for you? Go Go for it. I guess. Yes. So Scott's phone fat is he got a bag of warhead candy and and trying to eat them. So that was going to be my fun Oh my God. I feel like. To be perhaps I think we need to do a reels in Tiktok of you eating a warhead. Hilarious. I actually have like a little bit of a like a A. Sure. Yes IT S. Like, like. A lock in my jaw from having one like you know that the way you tense up when you have that superstar power beginning like by John hurt from it now, I have not had a warhead in a very, very, very long time. Do you think if he rinsed it off it would not be sour is thing if I rinsed it off, it would just be pure sugar. After the after the the the citric acid on the top. There's technically different flavors. It's basically just a hard candy, Corn Syrup and sugar. So the sour is, what's what it's all about. It's all about. Oh my Gosh hilarious. But I mean, if you want to see that if you wanna see actual life furniture Scott eating a warhead I I know you do. So I think you should let let that be no. I don't think anyone wants to see me life but but thank. Exactly, call it eating. It's more like I don't know what it is wiggling. squirming. WORMINGTON. kind of painful ought to be honest with you but it's like you don't stop it makes it even funnier I don't know warheads are hilarious. So let's see episode with Margaret is spoiler freeze it is it a spoiler free so we will include that whole interview and then you can join the spoiler section if you're ready if you're ready for that and there may be a spoiler from Mar as well and they`re Okay okay. So let me get the description here. So can I also just point out anybody who hasn't seen this? The insomniacs is one of the most beautiful book covers I've seen in a long time. That's funny I. Read this book I don't know if I paid attention to the cover. Oh, it's so pretty it looks like it's like a twilight like kind of you know early early morning seen over a neighborhood overlake, some suburban houses, which is very relevant and there's lights on because that's of course are two characters. Who have their lights on but is just like a little tiny sliver of moon and the title is kind of Fuzzy and ads just I don't know it's just beautiful colors I just really am feeling it is actually a very cool cover and that that absolutely would pique my interest in the store same now that there's a whole lot of going to the store right now but no, it's a it's a it's a it's a good cover. Your right. All right. So here's the story of the insomniacs by Margaret Wisenberg. Injured can't sleep. She can't remember either a competitive diver seventeen year old ingrid is haunted by what she saw at the pool at a routine meet before falling off the high dive and waking up just the only thing she remembers about the moment before her dive is locking eyes with Van. Former best friend and forever crush kissing his girlfriend on the sidelines that that can't be all. Then one sleepless night she sees van out her window looking back at her did begin not sleeping together by night still ignoring each other at school by day Ingrid tolls herself this just temporary. But soon, she and banner up every night piecing her memory back together as van. Works. Through his own reasons for not being able to sleep both pulled into a mystery that threatens to turn their quiet neighborhood into a darker place than they realized. So intriguing on that it's rape premise and I mean it lives up a totally lives up. So let's just get right into it. Okay. So I've had doubts and different times in my life where I've had insomnia and. Back two years ago when we talked to market, we talked a little bit about that in those two years since I've had more of insomnia at times, and there is a kind of weird magic about that time and I mean, it's like it's haunting because you can't sleep you want sleep and it's allusive but then you find all these other things that are happening in the night when you think everybody's asleep, right? We kind of have this idea everybody's asleep and everybody is not asleep and there's this whole other thing that's going on while the rest of your household is asleep and people do start to lead the kind of double lives. It's interesting I have very rarely suffered from insomnia. But few times that I have. There are things that you notice it. Four o'clock in the morning you know. It could be little things like, Oh, I guess my neighbor goes to work pretty early in the morning or oh, there's a really weird exactly. I read this book however, while I was camping and I really do suffer from insomnia while I'm camping I I you know sleep and. Fits and starts and I usually end up reading to get myself more tired and this was the book I was reading. Apt. It was if you suffer from insomnia and he read this book while you're currently exhausted because of insomnia, it will kind of do things to you. Scott got what was your experience with this? This book is an absolute page Turner. I was so excited to read every single minute of it It's it is. It's very tense at no. I didn't know where this book was going. Yes, and that kind of that kind of added to that tension for me. There's there's points in this book where it could go in any direction, there can be just a it can just be a an issue of mental health. It can be incredibly dark with you know something really sinister happening and then everything in between and waiting for that that shoe to drop waiting for that that emotional payoff was stressful but I couldn't wait to get to it I guess I should say there is there's a trigger morning in this book and I think that we will put that before the spoiler section because it does lead to some SPLUR- questions with Margaret to so we'll. We'll put that in there, but will keep this part all. Trigger free and hence spoiler free. So you'll be able to knock it all the spoilers but here that at the beginning of the slow section, that's how we do it here on Chandra. Justify I. That's how we do it new. Yes. So for my experience I, think this landed for me at just a really solid good read I'm very happy with this book I was very satisfied with this book. I think it's well written. I loved Margaret's earlier works that we read selected select few and I feel like she is in even petr writer if always she leveled up yes and really like her character work I've always admired but ingrid for me I just I love Ingrid how so much are leave Turtur in this book she is so incredibly believable to me I feel like she's my neighbor she's my cousin she's she's like family to me her and her mom I just really really loved them both and we'll talk a little bit more about that as we go on but she just made the book absolutely sing for me. I was so invested in her I was so proud of her. You know she is she doesn't have everything figured out she doesn't have her whole life together. Obviously she's a teenager not that adults every either. But she has a good head on her shoulders and she has pride and she just has those those Kinda smarts where she street smart and she's also just a smart cookie I just I just really really how such a soft spot. In my heart for my cousin Ingrid, it's not just ingrid that I love as well. Angered looks at the other characters in this book with such this level of of love that you end up falling in love with all of the characters. In this book, her her mother is incredibly sympathetic and strong van is a wonderful kind person with a with a beautifully complicated family. Dynamic and this book you know there's really two strong themes that drives this book. One is the mystery of what what is causing this this insomnia what happened that? She can't remember but the other side is her relationships and her her learning who she is and who she wants to be with people. Yeah and that's a very complicated in kind of a lifelong journey and I. Think. People change that as as because we all change our whole lives and I think that people change that that outlook and that's this is kind of where you start that process of kind of figuring out who you who you really want to be and what your values in your morals are and kind of your first reflection of that is kind of like an older teenager there. I love, of course, everybody loves flawed characters and. That's what makes life interesting is ourself being flawed characters where attracted to other ones. But in here she does a great job of humanizing just about everybody talk about that in the interview like she lets the parents be real people so I I asked her to like if she's Scandinavian 'cause Ingrid and Elsa that's. Ingrained in her mom, their Scandinavian injured stabbed was black and her mom is white and her family is from Sweden in the book and there's something that I really saw in myself and kind of in my family members in the two of them especially in Elsa and so I kind of like it's always fun when you see a kind of that representation a little bit. You know it's It's not something that I don't know I don't see a whole lot in books and like my family being from Finland. There's a concept they're called see sue and I know I'm not pronouncing that right? I'm sorry I didn't ever get to learn finish from my grandma but where it's candid this this grit this determination this stoicism. And I think that that's a very scandinavian concept in general of this kind of like you know I don't WanNa, say pull yourself up by your bootstraps but like just really this and we go on and we go on and we go on type of thing and I get that so much from the two of them and there's pros and cons to that attitude and you see that in the book too. So I'M GONNA go ahead and give my appeal score on this book. I i. think that this. Really. I've been going back and forth on it. So hard I'm GonNa give this a broad appeal I think that this book has you know has has a lot. It's hard for me to give an appeal score to a book that doesn't fall into our normal categories of of our normal John Categories because you know I feel like our scoring system was kind of built for it. I like this book a lot I think this really is for. A slightly younger audience I think that this is definitely relevant to to those who read Young Adult Marvel's. It's a little bit thicker than than that. So I. Think Broad. You're right when you just kind of had the broad part of it I think that there's something that can be gained from people with maybe teenagers and their lives, nieces or nephews or MOMS and DADS can of reading this book to I. Think There's some things that are universal that has nothing. To. Do with age and there's some great family dynamics as well as a mystery that is it's not a thriller. It's the type of mystery that really kind of pains your hearts are right. So I think it's time for the spoiler free section of our interview with Margaret. Wisenberg, right. So excited for her to join us again, and we'll see you in the sports section. Enjoying the show please like in subscribe on I tunes you can find us on twitter and Instagram at John Junkies and don't forget to visit the website genre junkies dot. com. He Johnny Junkies. Scott here. Well, we're talking with Mara in our pre interview conversation some things came up that we really wanted to touch on and on the interview. Anyway. So with Marthe permission, we started recording about halfway through our pre show conversation and we're going to just go ahead and jump right into it. this started when mart- asked us about our experience talking to other authors about their experience writing and publishing through covid. So we're going to jump right in and please welcome Margaret Wisenberg author of the insomniacs. This is actually one of the questions we ever. Awesome. But yeah, most like it's really been a gamut as far authors some authors have really said that you know this is inspired them. They've had a chance to write five six books in this period, which is insane. And then there's a lot who said you know this is there's there's nothing there's nothing in the tank right now with everything going on and releasing books has been you know people are doing online releases people are trying to just do interviews like this. Little lack luster for some of the debut authors we've talked you but yeah yeah. No I'm glad it's not my debut 'cause. Then I. Know what what the old normal was going to conferences and doing a launch, a bookstore and Yeah. Yeah. Because I mean in everything was so much was online anyway Yeah. Digital Media and podcasts and instagram and but you know there was still so much in person. So it is. So. Yeah. It does feel like a bit is missing. A piece MMA thing there's a piece missing. Yeah. I mean the one nice thing is for. Just getting to go to as A. Audience member now I can go to book launches anyone's book launch I can go to any kind of China the book festival I can see so many authors where you know before that was. To pick and choose and go when you could go. So there are some there are some few silver linings there there is and I appreciate that. So so what are your plans for for your birthday tomorrow with everything has changed L. my gosh. Well, I don't even know I was thinking about that. Tomorrow not too much is different and I think mostly you know I originally, I would've gone to bookstores and science and bucks but that GonNa do that later about people with an appointment and So the actual Austin Book launch is going to be on September. Nights. Through but people. So in Lila sales, who's an awesome editor and author is going to interview me and she has a book coming out later in the month to and so yeah everything is there. That'll be my first virtual events in that'll be really interesting because I think you know inviting all kinds of people but I think the way it's set up, it's a webinar see can't see anyone so it'll be. Armed Delilah so I mean in a way relaxing also you know I will. It's it's it's different. So. Yeah. So we'll see. Yeah. The last time we talked to you about selected slight few. You explain that you written the first novel while you are taking a class with Amanda Air, Ward and you follow it up with sequel, which was different experience in and of itself because it wasn't in that class. So this is your first published novel completely outside of that experience how is it different for you? I. I think it was funny because when I've finished I just kind of did what I did the first two times it was like a new year and It's seemingly I always start books in January and so I just kind of stayed on the same schedule and I think I was so scared of what happens when I'm done with these two books that had a couple a few years planned out and then you know, okay now what and I just hit the ground running and stayed on a schedule and took. A lot of what I learned from Amandas class plotted out five main scenes and then Finished my first draft and Yeah. It was funny like I learned sort of The way I work in my method and whether or not You know maybe are making adjustments to it, but it's worked for me to stick to this crazy rigid way bucks. Well, first of all, it sounds like that class really stuck which is awesome. Yeah what. I'll just go ahead and spoil it for you for the episode it's working. Thank you. Thank you so much. You know every time I've no idea you know. Is this working? Every author feels that way. Yeah. I believe that actually it works. It works so well. So Ingrid feels so real to me. I feel like I could go to Texas and find her right now is based on a real person. I probably shouldn't say this but one of one of my daughters is. You know she's just very I. Don't know what the word is like Heart herself and much more of a closed book. I mean she's young she's not known. You're being teenager yet but I it's very different from me. I'm more open and verbal, and so I'm really fascinated by these closed book types. You know who are really precise and hard on themselves and perfectionist. So you know really wanted. To write that kind of character. Oh I I think that's so cool because I'm probably more on your side two of like you know I'm not I'm not like a super vulnerable person I guess, but I am a lot more open and so I just I just wanted to get to know Ingrid and like yeah no, that's so cool that your daughters wanted those types of people and is so different from you know because I do. You know what? I am really fascinated by that question of you know when you hold, there is a lot of power when you hold your cards close to the vest, you know and people can't read you and you I think there's a line in the book of You do really win when your people don't perceive you as vulnerable and I think in our society that's very true in a lot of ways. So I mean that was a question You know I'm just interested in and so. I think that from the very beginning the book I I decided to explore that in I don't think I. Yes. I I signed on I want inger to open up and be vulnerable. And to not be so loan. But I, do think it's a really interesting question of how people respond to people who seem like they have it all together 'cause everyone. No one has everything together. No. No but it's like the bridget. Jones. Today's going to be different. I'm going to have happen hold together. So, insomnia is such a departure from the select books. How did the psychological mystery contemporary story come to be? I think I always had the idea of in high school. I had a friend who she just always just insomniac and she at some point I realized she had this whole second life at night. I mean she was friends with. People who I didn't even know she knew and boys and you should be on the phone all night and so. You it's like you have two different lines during high school you know and. So I always have out in the back of my head and then I think too that setup of rear window of You know somebody who is never idle and all of a sudden they're stuck and and they're at home and they're never really at home and they're looking out their their window. And and what they see and what's what is right there, and if you're looking hard enough eventually, some actions go by your window so. I think I kind of married those two ideas together I am a big fan of that. That device that your window device of you know kind of that voyeur and what she sees sort of thing and I love that this has a really contemporary feel to to that device. Yeah I mean it was I think the one hard thing was there's no You know it's not a murderer it's a mystery and it's not it's not quite a thriller it's not a thriller. So. So kind of making that work. You know using the window with having a more subtle. Yes. Perhaps, a little more realistic than. And that whole block is Doing themselves at the same time, it's a very Everybody's in everybody else's business. Have you been in a situation like that before? Yeah. That's suburban mirror. I think not. So my neighborhood is Star quite like that but But know I can see when you're in a community everybody you know you started people know other people and I can see how especially on a cold Issac. In when kids grew up to each with each other in a lot of the parents out on the street watching the kids I think everybody I'm guessing everyone you know we'll begin to people's business right and also, but also this nice way of looking at after each other to and I think that's a real mixed bag. You know some people really want community other people you know would rather are. More introverted and I think too. You know for Ingrid it's like well, what? You've sort of decided that this community you just WanNa get away, but you know what value is there in community for you after all. So a really good way of looking at it. Yeah. Finding a little bit of positively to it. Yeah I. DO I love there's there's pluses and minuses come with that Kinda fishbowl you know and I thought Cova, did I think with Kobe shoe and we've all appreciated our neighbors a lot more Yes and you know I think probably I'm sure some people see their neighbors a lot more than they used to. Be a problem but I known you know like my parents, their neighbors asking them if they needed grocery is and you know the there is such a nice kind of there's been some nice. That have nice things that have come out of it. So on the subject of Covid. This is kind of where we almost jumped into our interview for those listening at home. This is such a crazy and strange time to be alive in our history and how has the pandemic affected you as a writer. Gosh it's been well just from a working standpoint. It's been really hard. I. I'm pretty open about it with my family. Oh I love. Probably my favorite thing in the world is writing in house that's empty and having that that space and that quiet and so just from a pure working standpoint people being around even if I have a door closed, it's just a little different So that's so I feel like I'm working fewer hours which is frustrating. In way it's kind of off the hook in some ways, but it's also it's hard. And but I'm trying to think if I, I, just finished draft of something new and so I was like having to be creative during the beginning I finished the draft in early May and then I did a revision. So it really had to be creative in that beginning of Kovin and that was really hard I'd wake up and I I. ENDED UP spending probably. So kind of the way I get around the working situation as wake up really early before everybody got up but I found that I. wasted some of that time looking at the news and so I'd spend go from the New York Times Washington Post local news to looking at the numbers and Austin and it wasted so much time. So, then I try and use it as a carrot like, okay. Worked for a couple of hours then you can luck. And that it was really it was. Yeah, it was it was so tough in that real beginning period of uncertainty, right? It's it's unprecedented and a lot of our writers who we talked to they have a lot of ritual around their writing and yes. So you're you're not alone in trying to find this new way to to do your job. Yeah. Yeah. I mean I know it's a lot of us have. Many. People are having you know. Work, with other people around in an in different spaces that aren't quite comfortable and it's not like any of us can easily go to a coffee shop or anything like that. So we'll and you never know what that might inspire to. For some of you. Writer types I know I wonder if everybody has coped idea at this point. POST APOCALYPTIC AS CANOPY LIVING OFF OF PEOPLE So, family dynamics play a really big role in the store in the story and the fuel incredibly authentic. What made you include that theme in this book? I think you know some of my favorite books are near really about family is like like little fires everywhere you know kids and parents and You know the by love I was just thinking about it this morning that book tell the wolves I'm home and You know were you maybe it's mostly it's why considered why and mostly about the kids but there's there's some family dynamics in there and I love that and so i. Think with Ingrid I I mean it just sort of appeared I knew her family was I. think that was one of the earliest things I knew who could see this dad even though he's absent a whole book like I feel like I can see him and I knew who he was and your dad he was and then her mom you know they sort of they really came early and so I think the trick was not having You, know, how do you have these characters who plays a big role? Not Take up too much space but be be a part of it. Yeah. No I love I. Love those things that you reference to family drama. It can play so many different genres and it's such a powerful tool. I think there's endlessly fascinating dynamics with families. So you actually a reference to couple of books but I think we'd all love to know what have you been reading watching during this Weird shut in time. Oh, I think all the big normal people was the big winner for me during Cova which. You Know Sally Rooney. Read. The book back in the fall and a M passionately adore that book and and then the WHO series came out a ny was not you know prepare to watch a show about one of my favorite books of modern my favorite bucks but it turned it did not disappoint a so intense and beautiful and I could only watch one episode time because it was intense. And I don't know if you guys have seen it but essentially, you know these. Teens and then they go in their early twenties and their relationship, which that is right up my alley. So I loved it and then I think the other I've been reading why I've been reading trying to think Thrillers. It's been such a long crazy hall that. A lot of The last dance that was a huge family winner of the Michael Jordan documentary. Series Yeah. Yeah, it feels like it's all been a blur. Ferret, ferret up just absorbing so much I learned a lot about the sport of diving turned this book. It's so amazing like I. We're big proponents of read anything. You will always learn something and I had no idea about what it was like to be a diver. Are you which I for? Family. Goes another crazy thing I did was I don't know why I mean Ingrid a diver and. You know, not the biggest fan of I like I would rather write than do research where I have a few writer friends who just love research and Yeah and so I was like, okay, you know now I need a now I need to figure this out So I talked to a few people and I went to a couple diving practices and but was mostly from talking to people of hearing about the different types of people who you know approaches basically and What a coach can do for you and yes how I mean it's crazy watching someone die from. I would never I mean you really have to be so fearless. So as I was pretty fascinated by that oh yeah. No, I can't. I cannot imagine I guess you have to start when you're young and fearless because. You don't know any better. To and I think also I was reading Remember what skier was, but she had this moment where you know she is this amazing skier and she for whatever reason kind of twenty s had this moment. where she kind of developed an awareness kind of like anger does and at that point I mean it just messed with her mental state. Your you know, and they're definitely there've been a for me. It was also skiing when I was little. I didn't think too much about it and then you know it's got to be a teenager I was. Scary. And so that moment of awareness and how that can mess with you in it is kind of his coming of age of moment of I'm not. Completely you know Things can happen to me This is almost a statement more than a question, but I just wanted to say thank you for including such a diverse cast of characters. The neighborhood feels real and we love reading books like that and promoting that diversity. Thank you for doing that. Oh. Good. Yea, it's important. Yeah. No it is. It is. Yeah. It was really important for me. The van. Be Different from the rest of his family. A really thought was dynamic that interesting to me. All my gosh and Sach an interesting character van is where I just wanted to know like how's he gonNA turn out how I'm going to be okay and it's funny because like I was so so attached Ingrid and I found myself just getting more and more attached to van throughout the story now. It's So sad you know. I really. Am I actually know someone that happened to of when the like. For small their their father was hit on the side of the road changing entire. And you know they've never really knew their dad and so yeah. So I think because I knew that had happened to someone like I. Really felt that for Van. Of like this huge and you kind of have your mother to have this before you know and then kind of the the second life after that. Maybe you know moved on but you know he never came diddly. He still struggles with it I think this will definitely be something that we talk about in our recap of the book but I, think it's really important why to have these adults that are human too and you do a great job of humanizing the parents don't maybe because I am one. So I know like how tricky it is. Now you're never really remember thinking my parents were just perfect I never thought they're perfect but they were just adults you know and then when you are when you realize you're just this person you know doing your best your best buy your kids. I wanted to talk about your approach towards. Y. A or or whatever you want to title your books because you've definitely shown a history of pudding young adult characters into adult situations reacting in adult ways. What is what is what is your view about you know writing? Teenagers and young adults truthfully and honestly I look I know I think that's an interesting question. I hate just You know I love Romance. I. Love that You know I think it'd be hard for me not to write some kind of teen romance at sort of my favorite things right in the world but I think I that moment that kind of coming of age moment. A realizing Y- adults in your life or people you know they're not. They're not on the other level than you and they're not they're not maybe even totally save. You don't think there's that moment that maybe most people can't point to that moment that it happens but some of us can you know and I think I. I'm interested in that moment, and so I think that that maybe that's what I'm trying to get to in in what writing a two quick questions one how is your doorbell dog? He's adorable. As. Doing? Good. He's doing he's doing great and Yes it's yeah he is just. The most spoiled dog with his good dog food and yes. Yeah he is durable and he doesn't bark and he doesn't jump and so he actually he's such a good So scared about getting a dog that's writing at home, and so he's he's turned out to be a really good. If as long as he gets some the big run in the morning, he's pretty leaves me alone. So I can write. I love. You need to post just like a daily picture of him. He's just I know Oh and the longest eyelashes the entire world. So sweet and second question and I hope you don't mind me asking this are you and I know because he our name are you Scandinavian Lake? Ingredient Elsa yes. So Am I. Yes so my mom is partner region. So yeah. That's where that's where I got the name and then my is funny has I did not really want to write my exact dynamic but I ended up sort of I did my mom is part even not totally like Elsa and then my dad is Jewish. So cuts the that's how that's the dynamic I grew up. I love it you for answering that 'cause I'm. Hella skin. Tell you and I love reading about Scandinavian American characters and I'm I'm GonNa talk more about that in the episode to, but it was just a lot of your. Country Finland. Yeah And a lot of like I've sat I'll I'll get into it. It's more like Kinda gushing questions but I see so much of Elsa and myself and my family so that's awesome that it's just that it's kind of good and bad Yeah Yeah. No that. Yeah. I my MOM's family. Got I've been backing away and yeah they're they're Yes I won't say more. Right. Just. Scandinavians have kind of a way kind of a way about us and I saw that and I felt that in myself and Elsa I'm like Oh that could be my cousin Elsa and that's One of my daughters her name is asteroid. So she kind of has the you know follows the Scandinavian name tradition and love it. All right more. So to close off the last time we spoke with you, you let us out with a great hint in t the book that you are working on which turned out to be the insomniacs. Miracle That's. What are you working on now? I just finished a draft of a another young adult contemporary about family on the run and The parents the parents won't just to kind of protect their identity. They will tell their their daughter told her daughters, their actual real identity, but then it all. Their oldest daughter takes a DNA test and pieces it altogether so. Oh my gosh that's a good elevator elevator pitch. Need to work on it but that's that's. So. Yeah, it's kind of because I'm fascinated by the golden state killer thing and how I mean this is not a thriller it's not a thriller it's another family mystery, but it your chest you can't hide anymore. You know no one can you in that book inheritance by Danny? Shapiro was. Amazing and essentially like people you can find out so many secrets just like that. It's just data now I mean technology is it's arrived. So that sounds very us and it sounds very Scott in particular I. Think he's GonNa have some feelings, Yoga? US So. so much where can everybody finds you Margaret Wisenberg Dot com but mostly in on instagram at Mar Wisenberg. Absolutely linking to you so that all of our listeners who probably already know you at this point, but we'll be able to find you if they're new to the show. Thank you so much for joining us. Thank you so much. You guys so nice to talk to you. How Fun thank you again, Mart for that. So before we get into the spoilers. Let me just quickly give you a couple of trigger warnings that could be considered spoiler content. So one. is a teenagers using and becoming addicted to drugs? Yes. The other one is someone in a position of power. Abusing that power using that power in predatory manner A. So let's do it. Okay. So now that we have all read the book and had some time to digest this, let's jump into it. So of course, the big big thing on everybody's mind is probably coach Mike Yeah it broke my heart, I my my stomach just dropped when I found out that coach Mike was. Taking. Advantage of his position and also had a history of it and had a history of Tang and of course. So my fear through this book was that he had had an inappropriate relationship with ingrid that was kind of what I was working with through like what her traumatic thing could you know her traumatic triggering event was I mean of course it's justice awful that it was a teammate, but it's an interesting point of view to have it not be from that team might caroline. But from the person who that was her hero, her father figure, a family member person in her life and it's in, it's framed. As a troop, a trail in the way that it truly is let's yes because when I first started the book in in coach Mike was introduced I was thinking to myself the same thing Oh you know this could go. This could go there because we are talking about someone in you know a man in his thirties who has a lot of interaction with teen girls and mart does a really good job of setting the seeds where you were. That is absolutely where it does end up going in it. And it hate to say pays off but it definitely is is earned but ingrid talking about her coach to us the reader made me feel like she was almost saying like, hey, reader don't worry this book is about some stuff, but it's not about that right kind of a different story kind of trusted Ingrid's take on that I wasn't expecting her to be you know in a way an unreliable narrator when it came to coach Mike because she wasn't being honest herself right and win these scandals happen. It's like there's so much fallout and there's so much to think about and there's so much to like handle and you know the the effects of its psychologically on so many people and I mean, of course, the the victims directly involve as is incredibly important but there's more than that because people are complicated and they have more relationships than that and it was very interesting to see how are how are Ingrid you know how she combines the trauma of what Mike did with the trauma of what her dad did. A lot of ways she has been. Betrayed by the father figures in her life. Yeah. Yeah When did Mike Betrayal really become the main hook of the story? that was really hard I. You know that that came after I had the characters and I kind of knew I wanted this rear window thing and I was like, okay where am I had with this? and. Finally, you know where in the story is or something you know where's the drama the story? Where's the potential betrayal and I think finally I landed on both kind of betrayal I wanted it to be an I resisted at first but I think I was talking to a friend and and to sing like, well, you know the the interesting story or the kind of the big flashy story is about the girl who has the fair we're kind of in a way. The more interesting is how it affects the person who on you know who witnesses at his on the side and who really trusted this adult figure, and then I was like, okay, done I love that idea. Because I, think you know all of us. Whether. It's like a big. You know celebrity figure like bill cosby or someone you know we looked up to you know they're those moments of total disappointment. and. So then it became interesting but it did come later and I was. Like. Okay. This is this is the path. And it's it's. It's so heartbreaking and Yeah I love that examination of somebody who was so close to this Predator, but didn't have that relationship with them. And how you deal without and how you want pack that it's a very brave thing to write about. Yeah. I. I remember having. Somebody I knew like I think the minister from the Church had an affair with somebody. Who is that age and really for my friends who didn't happen to her but I mean really shed some. Went off to college I get. Really. Turned her off from the church it really like there's some definite ramifications for. The betrayal that happens even if it's not you who's involved so yeah it's it's sad and I think about to myself because I'm I'm coach Mike Sage. Thirty four and it's like you have that just like Oh, my God, what I mean aside from being. Like how could you have any interest in somebody who's in high school like what's wrong with you? It's like a different species almost. Yeah. But don't you know those people who are You know kind of like King of the kids you know. Yeah and who? That glory day back or something yeah. They're awkward with parents but they're like they do. They're so great in their realm you know and they get accolades but they can kind of create their own cold of celebrity. The I feel like you know it's a personality type. Yeah. You can see you know you know that archetype that yeah like I spit on his name coach Mike Yeah. One of the first things that that came to mind for me when I was reading this book is Oh. You know this could be a coach Mike situation and you do a really strong job of steering the reader away from that and like instilling the strong level of trust in. Mike, where you just don't even think about him anymore how how did you like what was the process to create that that feeling? was actually really really hard it. So I think I started I. Think the draft was like I think he was much more of a jerk. He was much more conclusive. He's controlling still but and he was her father figure, but he was not a great Guy, and then it was like in Ano- finally, it was kind of a relief in landed on He needs to be someone like we all love everybody loves him but he still needs to be that coach. He's like ordering her around and like you've got this and like paint as weakness leaving the body like that kind of thing it was hard and also how to make it You know not out of nowhere to lay down enough track. Did you know that you can see it later IOS tricky. But Mike was Super duper tricky for me and I think I, kind of ended up filling him in later in the process because my shop I wasn't sure he you know he wasn't coming through for me at all I. think that's Great. I. Think you totally nailed it because it didn't come completely out of you know the blue that he you know had something alterior going on but yeah. But it was a good misdirection to when it hit it hurt Oh, good. Good I. Mean you know it's sad but Yeah. My agent, my agent I think before we submitted it to. My editor. I think it was that you know like I. Think we put a couple scenes that made him a little heinous. I think that was missing before. Like I think we put in she suggested it was a great suggestion that scene were angered imagines how it how it all happened? Yeah there is a lot the it was a long process with him. Challenge Yeah. Yeah. We like you on your toes. No it's funny with every book. It's with every project. You just don't know what's going to end up giving you trouble in what you know. We're there's always a couple of things that you're that I get stuck and so that was one of them for this. It's devastating and you just you feel for her so much. Luckily, she has this incredibly awesome mom and community around her but especially mom. He's like you know we're GonNa fix this and we're going to get through this and is so incredibly there for her even though she has to physically not be there for her sometimes because that's reality of parents working and you know when they they make a point that her mom wants to spend that quality time with her and you know Kinda thinks her for the things. She does all of that. They love each other they're very bonded and. Committed, but it's complicated because they you know her mom doesn't Cook. They have TV. Dinners you know and they see each other at these kind of odd hours but it's it's because that's life and that's how they have to to do this right now it's really difficult to be a it's really difficult for somebody who is growing up themselves and learning who they are and learning who they want to be, and at the same time be very worried about. Their own parents happiness and I appreciate how their relationship is presented in a complicated manner where her mother is not doing something wrong. She is making sacrifices and working very hard for Ingrid. You know very strictly for Ingrid and because of that, she is not around very much and that is very difficult and recognizes the sacrifices that her mother has to make and therefore. Makes decisions around that. That's an unfortunate position to be in as a child at the same time. There's nothing wrong with their relationship, and in fact, in a lot of ways, it's very beautiful and part of that is because you know especially after Ingrid, you know make some realizations about herself and finally get some sleep they're able to communicate willing. You know it's important to remember to see that not everybody's rich and that's complicated I grew up poor and I get I get that and I got so much of of that setting in that feeling and kind of this this guilt in this obligation that Ingrid fields to. Do her do her best and do her utmost to make things easy on her mom and she sees the bills and she sees the House needs repair and all of that stuff and and that it's a complicated way to fuel because you know you feel proud and you you know you know that your parents doing the best. But of course, it's like, no, she doesn't necessarily more friends to come over and stuff because she feels a little embarrassed and it's like that's totally fine. That's that's totally understandable and I feel like so many people are in that. You know kind of lower middle class. You know in quotes I'm saying boat where. You know you're not rich and you do see what your neighbors have and how they live and you have complicated feelings about it. When the moment when you are aware of the the house and have not sincere, you're one of the have nots that can be very difficult I'll absolutely very very difficult and it puts a lot of pressure on on the child and the parent no doubt Said earlier that think this is a good book to read if you have teens in your life whether you're a parent or your, maybe you're a big sister or an uncle or whatever. Your thing is because I mean I feel like in a lot of ways, their stuff I I vividly remember about being a teenager but at the same time, there's stuff that. I don't remember. And so you got what I mean. So there's times where it's like Oh. Yeah. Gosh that was weird and oh Like this fog of like I, remember how he feelings like that and I remember feeling complicated about these things and you know nothing is new under the sun and kids of all ages are are still going through traumas and weird things and I loves and worries and anxieties, and it just kind of helps to you know have a little check in some time to remember that you know they're they're people too. Yeah. Because I can say you know even as we get older sometimes, we you know we make some jokes about you know the younger generation, the kids what did they have to worry about? That's because where millennials we're being abused by Jesse on a daily basis. So it's a little bit of a of a striking back but no, it is important to remember the struggles and very unique pressures that are on teenagers, and this is a really this is a really real representation of that even mature Teenagers Liking Grid and like how in a lot of ways I was you know kind of amateur team kind of going through some stuff to is you're still a teen. And you know there's times the teen feels I've gotTA take dishonor. I've got a shoulder this burden and it's like, no, you don't. And it's. It's hard for them to say it. So sometimes as the adult in a situation, you have to remind them that her there for that stuff. So the drug thing was sad and hard to read about with the kids going through that very realistic though I mean a lot of people that's where they start to experiment with drugs and some people that's where they get really hooked. And you know it's interesting to look at it from that viewpoint of kids you grew up with kids who grew up together and you know kind of like, okay. How are we going to get through this and as kind of like an community in a way they're kind of figuring out how to get through a few different really tough problems. I have to say in real talk for a minute I had experiences that were. Similar to what they were going through in the house as far as drugs alcohol uses teenagers and that that was probably one of the most realistic parts of this for me is because it does really it starts as Oh, it's couple of your friends that you know and you're just experimenting and having a good time and you're in a quote unquote safe place with your friends but it spirals out of control it becomes A. It becomes a coping mechanism. It becomes a routine, which is which is very dangerous and can lead to a true addiction and and just completely losing control of your situation and it's It falls really into this Nisha of where these kids are where you're not an adults by he don't really feel like a little kid anymore and you know you kind of start to think like. Handle this whatever the situation is the drugs, the insomnia, the the coach Mike, Whatever it is you're like, Oh, I can handle this I can handle this and just quickly things get out of your control because that happens to you know grownups. So why wouldn't it happen to a teen as well? Yeah, and and teens you know like I said, they're struggling with these new. Responsibilities both both. Actual like getting into college and as well as emotional with between their friends, their parents expectations that are laid upon them, and there's a communication that while you're just kids. Yeah, and so it's not really that hard for you but you know in contrast with like well, actually there's a lot on my plate in everyone's experience is their own everyone has their own struggles and how do you you know? I it can lead to a bit of a rebellion against any of that. Absolutely. It's like well, okay. If I'm just a kid, then this is my time to just do what I want to do but I'm also I'm also feeling these adult things. So I'm going to use this to numb them and and it's hard because when you're a kid to you're not fully thinking through about consequences. Well, that's a huge part of this book is consequences of People's actions, adults or teenagers. So. Let's talk a little bit about van. So. Van is a great character and he's another one that I'm like all aunt sandy just. Such affection for them and you're like you're GONNA be okay. Van and there was so many times where I was really proud of him and I mean and there was times like he's being dumb. But again, he's a teenager he's gotta be dumb and it's okay. But you know things like when he has ingrid help him, get the dog put down and that ends up being released symbolic of you know his in his mom's you know this thing that binds them together. There was just moments like that where I was so proud of him and I felt such compassion for him and just like honey you don't have. To go through this alone like this isn't a thing that you're supposed to do without your mom and it's he so always trying to protect his mom you know even when he finds out about the that Kevin is cheating on his mom, you know he he wants to protect her I mean she and that's not your job do your kid. Yes and that exactly because he wants, he doesn't want her to have to you know her second marriage to fail and overall he is Kevin is a kind person. He does care about his mom. He does care about the family even though he's a problem, he's got problems. But yeah. That's kind of that's kind of very strong or overarching theme of the entire book is like it's not your responsibility to protect your parents right and to hide everything and fix everything. There is actually a moment that really struck me in the book and. It's when Kevin who's vans stepped out. You know he kind of has this moment where he really steps up and he goes into like this full angry protector mode and Ingrid's like, wow I i. really am kind of feeling this five. Obviously paraphrasing and she's like I. I get why Lisa likes this and stuff and it's like, yeah, because sometimes you know for whatever reason these people have you know sometimes big problems but no one's. No one's always completely evil or completely bad. You know because they have complicated dynamics or because they're having something extramarital it doesn't mean that they're evil and that's that's stuff that we're reminded of constantly in our lives not just when you're a teenager but as you get older too and they really do step up for Ingrid I really like how much how much love they have for her and how much you know. What's the word I'm looking for? They're just very parental towards her. They're very protective of her because she needs that in that moment i WanNa talk just a little bit about caroline for a minute. So Caroline is, of course very complicated like we all are and there's a big moment where, of course, from Caroline's writing her letter and Ingrid has kind of a moment of realization she'd been going through life thinking of Carolyn. So adult and so sophisticated and so polished, and then she remembers her kind of crying and freaking out and looking very much like scared little girl when Mike's getting, you know busted and you know and even in her letter, she's coming off kind of coy and aloof, but she's being very sweet and sincere in what she says to Ingrid and as a as a grownup her send you can just really see that and it just really made my heart really open towards caroline because you can see she's in that mode of I wanna be. Eighteen. I'm an adult and it's like technically. It's exactly it's like, yes, technically. However, that doesn't mean that you're ready to make adult decisions and having a relationship with somebody is like almost old enough to be your. Is Kind of an adult decision to me, and of course, the fact that he is your coach, it's hard to see that it's like, oh, caroline. That's really not okay because he should know better in this situation and. She has such sincerity in the things she sang for Ingrid and you just like I don't know I just really hope she's doing. Okay. She's okay to do it. Okay. The the the ending of this troubled me with her and with coach Mike I, it was it was very hard to you know. I, wanted. I wanted the police to come in and just destroy everything and coach Mike I never want to I never wanna see you again you know go off don't live in a ditch like I really wanted like this demonization, but that's not realistic. That's not realistic and I. It is difficult because you know there are choices that people make and things are complicated. But I I really feel for Caroline who doesn't see what happened really she doesn't see yet and I and I hope she does that she gets into relationships with people more like van. You know people who are good and people who care and have good hearts and I thought that was so cool to that moment when Ingrid tells that too we set and Kevin She just blurts out vans a good person and it's like because you know they're all dealing with all my God vans doing drugs the kids are doing drugs and it's like Oh, my God they're sneaking. Into this house and not. So I imagine scary for them but it's like, but he's a good person. He has a really good heart and same thing with my with maxine Wilson they're good people. They're nice boys. They're really nice boys I wanted more of them because they made a stupid stupid decision by not speaking out about Caroline and coach Mike, but it was because of you know. Kind of this addiction and this scariness that they were facing. So you can you can see and you can have compassion towards that of important in their situation as they didn't recognize that it was coach Mike then it was an older dude he knew it was an older dude which you're one hundred percent, right they still should have spoken up but you know they're afraid from themselves. Because it's going to they learned a lesson. It's GonNa throw everything that they're doing in the things that they currently want to do just into shambles. They're basically going to have to explain why there at the house, what they're doing at the house and and that kind of ends that whole chapter I have faith that if they knew that it was coach Mike, they would've oh. Yeah. Thing is, is that even good people make mistakes and have lessons to learn so there's nothing wrong with that and I have no doubt that they learned a lesson and I like that I think I think Ingrid's right I think that those boys are going to be friends forever and I think that Ingrid, kind of re cements herself into the group they're a little bit at the end and of course, she's going to be dating van and you know I hope that's endgame for those. For I mean maybe that's kind of a lot to put on to sixteen. But I like them together so much of that. I think it's important. I think that it was cool to read about amd art therapy and book as well. 'cause that's something that's gaining a lot of popularity and. Plenty of people who've done em Dr and this really helped them. Yeah. I was GonNa ask you actually if that was the same therapy that that we've talked about that other people have done. Really interesting. I. I really appreciated her basically you know this attitude about like, no, I don't I don't WanNa I. Don't WanNa. Dreads that stuff up? No thank you. Yeah. She was I mean, and that's part of a process for some people dealing with with trauma to it's difficult and it's not always like a a straight road, right? Like there's lots of twists and turns and thing she you take time to sometime sluts out. It's yeah it's different and it's important for her because she I mean, she always recognizes that that was a very difficult. Time in her life but she doesn't she doesn't see herself as someone who is dealing with trauma. What she very much is right which I feel like is very accurate. Portrayal of somebody going through trauma is I'm fine. This is fine and it's like well, you know it's not fine. Why do you have insomnia lake? Why do you have you know vis XYZ but takes time takes time children oh coach, Mike Heat that. Diana Fire Diana fire coach make you and your man Bun which I don't think he has any more, but that's not the point he's ever mayhem. Max's father who had a man Bun no, he coach Mike Caveney was younger or was it. which well, he did have one year, right? When he when he you know is his second wife is it weird that like I'm? In the movie of this I, picturing like to years ago Dean Cain playing coach Mike. Watt's like back like during like that I never watched it. But when we were kids, he had a superman show and I'm like, Oh my God it's that it's start guy okay. Sorry. Dean Cain I don't mean to three into the bus like that. That's not what I pictured at all but I'm okay to get into that bus. Funny Enough I pictured. Oh No. I can't think of his name from modern family and from from Pitch Perfect L. Adam Levine is that hood is way one of the same Adam. Devine Adam Devine Yeah Adam Levine merged Is. The is the dude for Maroon five his I don't like which also. Yes But no Adam. Devine. That's who I pictured as coach Mike O. Like so like looks like dude next door. Yes. Yeah. Spaghetti's a serpent. Right. So thank you guys so so much for joining us. Let's put a bow on this, and this is going to be a hard one to give a reading for but for me I'm going to give this I'm I'm just GonNa go classic and I'm going to say four hearts out of five for this novel You know I think it's an important read I. Think it's a beautifully written read. We talked a little bit but there's more I mean obviously you got this far. There's more diversity with the characters with the neighborhood represent and represented and I think that's so cool and this is an important message and it's a mystery but there's a lot of heart to it and that's why I want to give heartrending I'm GonNa score this based on. March, ability to create completely complex characters and even more complex relationships with their families she so strong at it, I'm giving it four and a half. Twists in a dive out of five days I suppose. I think she makes me cry every time I read her. She finds a way to pull it off when it comes to her character's relationship with their families and with their loved ones it because I care about them so much and she does that to me she super super good at it. Good Job Mar- It, and thank you again for being on the show, you're an absolute delight to talk to. And just such a such a nice presents with so much darkness going on in the world today to get to speak to you. So thank you mar it. Thank you, Scott. Thank you Sandra. Thank you readers and please keep reading past your bedtime.

ingrid Scott insomnia Margaret Wisenberg Margaret writer Heart Mike Yeah Elsa Van Finland Mike NRA editor John Junkies covid Charlie
91 | A Fireside Chat

Genre Junkies | Book Reviews

46:41 min | 5 months ago

91 | A Fireside Chat

"Weirdo bookworm unite. We want to share our love of genre fiction with you. Some readers out. There may look down on you for your love of horror sci-fi fantasy but not us so stop by discuss what we've been reading. Jonah junkies sandra and this is scott and we're back. We took a little teeny tiny mini. Not quite break kind of brace sort of a break we really kind of kind of. It's just been a lot. We've just been doing a lot. Oh my god. I mean to say that twenty twenty has been fully loaded and ups and downs. Is i mean just i rolling at this point because it's been a year for everybody but Yeah i some was. You may have known scott neier quote unquote essential. We've never stopped working during the shutdown and we're thankful to have jobs but you know when you're working through crisis a lot of stuff happens and it all just compounds and it's just been and then the election alma cut so much here in america so much so november has been a little bit of a vacation for us in some respects yet. We're still doing. Our other shows still doing spooky summer parties still during the cult. Show still doing this show but just taking a little bit more time to not have rash some deadlines i guess as way to put it but we want to check in and chat with you guys because we miss you all so terribly and we thought we were just kind of hang out. Where here on the couch. Pretend you're here on our large sectional couch with us. We're just going to chat chat books a little bit and just kind of i dunno some funny question the some serious questions. I went through a whole bunch of different book tags on youtube and on people's blogs and whatnot and just kind of came up with a smattering of questions to just talk books for the love of books. Please play along at home with us. We want to hear from you. Yeah i mean you can also like on social media do some sort of a post or something and you cannot tell us some of your answers. You can email i. I don't know what twitter whatever whatever you wanna do. Tell us your answer would be fun to hear some of them. So this'll be a minimally edited episodes. So you know you just have to put up with some less than perfect annunciation whatnot from us tonight. And let's try to stay away from the monster. Hey i i can't do swear let's not do swear i'm going to try. It's not like i ever do it like on purpose. You know what i mean. It's just how i talk. Also we'll see we'll see we'll see i who knows the i wear could come from me. Yeah so you mean just not the f. word because knows swears. Oh my gosh was just let us. Okay i'm just going to do my best. I can't promise i'm not. I'm not promising anything. I'm not promising anything okay. So here's our first little question for all of us at home. What is popular book series. You didn't like or will never read well for me. Yeah this is easy. It's a game of thrones i You would think it'd be something that would be right up my alley and i did read. I don't know the first quarter maybe of the first book many many years ago and it never grabbed me. You did and there's things about the show that i appreciated but it's just it doesn't really grab me. It's not doesn't really interest me. It's a lot and i just dumb. I've never been able to bring myself to to dig into that interesting interesting. I love the game of thrones series. I know love those books. Yeah that's right and could never quite get into it and there's a lot going on. There's a lot of political court intrigue. Which i think you like more. These days are absolute. Like i think that's kind of grown on you a little bit and there's many different characters. I have to take notes like when i read these books. There's a lot of different characters. There's a lot of different civilizations in towns and stuff. It's a lot to keep track of that kind of deep epic fantasy You know i really liked it. When i was a kid like when i first read the lord of the rings and yeah so really and all that kind of stuff yes that that level of deep fantasy and world building. I don't know if it's really for me anymore. And i love fantasy but you and you love world building i do. There's a certain level though where it just gets too much for me. Okay so this may be tied into my answer for this question. Which is the wheel of time books. Oh here's the thing. sorry sorry. Mr jordan arrested power. I know these books made a lot a lot of people i will. I've never tried. But i have no intention of ever reading this series. I hope one day it does get made into like a tv thing. Because i like to watch it. I know one of the kind of conceits. I don't know if it's a twist. I know a thing about it like a plot thing. That seems really cool to me. Seems relevant to my interest but You know. I think. I'm kind of out a weird point with epic high fantasy. Where you know. It's kind of like the lord of the rings. We have the band and we go on these adventures over twenty seven books. And i don't know that i'm there anymore. I love lord of the rings scoring of to when i was a teenager of at all of those. It's funny you mentioned that because the wheel of time is something. I've always been interested in picking up. That's something that's kind of on my. It's it's weird to say bucket list for a book series. But yeah i've been targeting that for a series to read through that okay so you just went on this rant about and now you're like oh except this. There's things about the wheel of time though that. That seems like it's a little bit more up my alley the way that magic works. Yeah i want a little bit of magic in epic fantasy. I think you just want those early nineties. Fantasy book covers. I love them and you know it a lot of people. Do i like them too. I totally got it okay. Let's be honest here. We're being honest here on the couch. You know so. You guys be honest to tulsa. You're gonna read the next question. I'm going to read the next question doorbell. Okay so what is booked trope that you are a sick of reading. Oh man this one is hard for me to word. Because i don't want to get myself in trouble with this. Okay okay. i am a little sick of the quote unquote tough girl okay. It's so funny. Because i'm not that character because i have a lot of sense of humor but i'm kind of a tough girl like i'm not super league vulnerable. You know so in a way. It's like i'm saying. I'm sick of myself but only i have a lot of humor. I'm like the court jester. And not the tough girl. But i don't know maybe gays going saying but you know because i feel like we swung so far on the pendulum where you know girls were to wishy washy into princess and so then it's like this overcompensation of like you know forged by the sword from toddler age and you know our romance is not for me and frivolity is not for me and it's kind of like okay can we. Can we find the middle ground again of you know. You can't say. I do have a sense of humor and have a lightness to you and have maybe some hope or or have no hope but i mean just like some kind of balance anymore. I think for me in that in that realm. It kinda comes down to one dimensional characters. Because i've read a lot of male characters that are like that. Were totally used to be a male character thing where i think of the the. What's what's that book series of dark raw. You know what i'm talking about i love. I appreciate the series sort of true so chase series. The main i think is gonna come up again. I think it's too the main character of that of that story. His only real weakness is his love. You know what i mean but at the end of the day he's he's a very one dimensional tough perfect character and i think you're right. It depended him swing swing. Pretty pretty strongly in that direction towards female characters. Which i think was important but i agree. I like characters in general who are multidimensional. Yeah is that your answer to. It's actually not. Oh what's your answer mine is. I don't want to sit. I'm sick of it. But i'm kind of done with it for a while. And that's the reluctant hero. I want to read so classic. Though i know and i'm not saying that's right but i mean it's just it's so something that is fallen back upon again. Exactly which is why. I'm kind of done with it. Fernando wanna read somebody that's like i am the ing here xactly okay and you know what i just tried really hard to remember to say effing. I appreciate that a our listeners do to. I think it's going to be very funny to swears. I want kids to be able to listen to it. Not have to market explicit when their parents have said no. You can't listen to explicit address. The child who swore but you also didn't have parents who put restrictions on your phone saying no. You can't download any explicit podcasts. I'll now my parents didn't didn't care about that doesn't i know. And most of the people we know. Don't care about that stuff either but okay that everyone gets to listen like this is what i have to deal with people. This is what you don't hear on the special behind the scenes appearing behind the curtain episode of john junkies. I'm so you want somebody that just wants to be. Just be the darn hero. I mean absolutely at the beginning hero can be surprised. Like i'm not so sure. I want to do this. But you know once they pick up the sword as it were like be the hero you're meant to be and there's a lot of books that are that are like that like the war cross series yet. She absolutely falls into this position. She finds herself in but she's like this is kind of what i want to be doing. So yeah there's no reluctance there. I really appreciated stories that have gone down that road and people like really coming into their power earlier on in the book and just being the hero. Right right right. I think i think i understand what you're saying. Okay what's or. I should say who who is a popular and or leading character from a book. The you didn't like don't like i want to say don't like for this. Because i remembered liking him at the time but the main character from the source of truth. I can't think of his name for some reason. Gosh that man goes through so much. It's almost like it's hard to say you don't like him because i'm sure there's books were portions of books. Were you really like him. And then later in that book or in the next book. He's like different dude. That's kind of the problem i liked. I liked him in sort of truth. The first one. Yeah he was. He was a fun character. The second one. He's dislike being basically tortured the whole book. So it's like okay. Can't really judge his character on this and then it just it just goes into some some weird very Male centric places. That i you know. I don't really appreciate it or look back fondly on Mine is and i feel bad. Because i only read the first book in this series popular. Serious manda my sister. Good friend of the shows on the show been on the show many times is she loves this series but it's diana from a discovery of witches by deborah harkness. I know that i will. If i ever get around to. It will love all the books in this series. I love the subject matter of the books But i hate to not like diana and i had such a hard time reading that first book years ago and to love it and i remember because my momma. That's you and i was like. Why don't i love this book more. This is full of vampires and witches and like grim wars and stuff. The is so me and she's like well. I'm sure you hate the lead character. Because i do and i was like. Oh my god. you're right. I don't i don't like her in. It is so hard to get into a series or a book if you do not feel any sort of connection to the lead character and we've talked about this many times before doesn't mean have to be like you doesn't mean they have to have anything in common with you but they have to have something that attracts you to them and makes you want to learn about them or you know. Continue with their story. See i find this question interesting for you because there's a lot of horror books that come to mind where it's like the lead character. No i don't like the lead character at all. I don't i mean. I'm totally fine with unlikeable characters. But i mean this. She's not written to be an unlikeable character. she's written to be our heroine. And i don't have any sort of connection with her taut. You yeah well okay. The next question is what is a hugely impactful book in your life. I love this question. And i mean you could really just go on and on and on. It's almost like what's your favorite book question. Which is impossible. I know but. I like the way that that this question was written. Because it doesn't mean favorite just something that means a lot. You know. I'm kind of i'm gonna cheat i'm gonna cheat but this one and i'm going to say An races vampire chronicles her stand alone. Stories of vampires and also the mayfair witches really just an rice in general Those are my you know kind of favorites. But that she's one of those people that when i think about and i say this a lot i know people are probably sick of it but i really don't know if i would have made it through my use without her. I really don't like her. Books gave me a lot of reason to get up into something in the morning. You know and it was the first time. I'd read books where i couldn't put it down. I thought about it. You know until the minute. I went to sleep so i was reading it. I wake up early so that had time to read it just really incredible characters and stories that just means so much to me and they still do and i love her books and i love rereading them. It's kind of like. I always have an an reis book going now because i just i just love her words and her characters in her worlds and they just they just mean so much to me and i know that they're not always perfect and there some stuff that if you're not familiar you know this is a really different time. When she started writing a lot of these things seventies eighties nineties early. Two thousands when we put up with a lot of more problematic stuff and it's also gothic literature which by nature house problematic elements to it But i love it. I love it so much. My answer actually went to cheat too. Because i have to but my answer is my first answer is for a lot of the same reasons as an races for you. And that's the golden compass that series came at a very important and fragile time of my young life. It it got me through a very difficult time and really it's part of how i progressed on a spiritual level as well You know moving on from a catholic upbringing. It made me think of spirituality and the universe in a very different light. I'm not saying that. I've built my own belief structure around it. But it's what opened the door. Oh yeah and the things he explores are wonderful. Thought provoking humanise science. Who'll staff. I must said another word. It was a very important series for me. And then the second i would say most impactful book is. The heart is a heart shaped box. It's the first horror he exactly. It's the first horror novel. That i read that i loved. Yeah it's the first horror novel. That i read that i said okay. You know what maybe i do like horror. Maybe maybe this is. John wrote that i enjoy. I think if it wasn't for that book. I'm not sure that genre junkies would exist in the way that it does because you know we primarily focus on horror scifi and fantasy and horror part was not a part of my My experience intil. Whenever it was that we read that he ten years ago. God i mean got it when it came out. Yeah it's wonderful. I mean horror. You know i'm a. I'm a huge fan. I'm so glad that you feel that way about a box I mean you know kind of along the same lines. There are so many so many impactful books in life. But i just was thinking of one that was like the first that really really came to mind What is a book that you could devour in the day or you have devoured in like one sitting and would do again enders game. I have done it many times. I would do it again i would. I probably read that book once every two or three years and it is a read in one day. Sort of book. Cia access a very long as it to It's not terribly long remember. It's it's it's normal book sized. But i know it so well and yes. It's there's there's lots of problems in it. It's problematic recognize all of those things but talk about impactful books. The first novel. I've ever read the thing that introduced me to sifi thing that introduced me to being a reader really You know that book means a lot to me. And i do still enjoy it to this day. I think there's so many people that fall into that camp of that's a piece of art that even though you know the creator is not somebody that wanted. Myers i'm looking a certain wizard ing turf. I'm looking at a few authors where you know and over time in history and stuff because you're with an author they're good and they're bad parts does influence their writing. Eight does like you can't deny that there some of their beliefs that for better and for worse influence the books. And when you go back especially with orson scott card there's other series that i have very fond memories of that i've gone back to read and i see some of those beliefs. Sure i see some of that influence. That i hadn't seen before oh dickens i mean there's two ihop lovecraft there's tons of that you can see some of the weird they were flicking by you know. It also can be in a way very influential in the book. Yeah i dunno it's steep So my answer for that would be headful of ghosts by paul tremblay. Just my first. Paul tremblay book. I read before we started doing this. Podcast and i love that book so much. And i really devoured it. When i read it and i could absolutely devour it again even though i know how it ends thing too. I was thinking of a book that i devoured number of years ago. And that'd be the demon. Allah gist by andrew. Pyper i've kind of. I don't know why i'm so. Sorry andrew pyper. I haven't read your books in a while. But i was going strong there ago and i really liked his work and he writes cool. Crime thriller horror books and the demon. Gist is cool. Book about this guy. Who's a professor. And he's a big college on. i don't remember. And he's like an expert on milton's paradise lost and some one or something that seems to be a demon has kidnapped his young daughter in venice. And it's like he can has to use his knowledge of paradise lost and demon -nology to get her. And when i read it almost completely in one sitting was when my mom had open heart surgery and we were in the hospital all day and it was such a wonderful thing to read for me like with the way i process things at that time. 'cause i'm not a major. One sitting book devour. That will come up later. Yeah anyway i actually. I'm going to go ahead and jump to that around. I'm gonna jump to that wind. Chill because we're i'm gonna get thrown on. I know i know so. Do you like to read books over several days or do you like to them fast. I like to read books over several days. I like having a good session of reading where i can read quite a bit at one time and big chunks but no i i like to take my time and not feel rushed arm. A huge injure. Yeah and i think probably guessed that from the show. yeah I don't like i don't like it when i get myself into a situation where i'm binging on a deadline which has happened to me a few times on this show before a few a couple of times. But i really. I'm the kind of person that i would like a book to be through in two to three days. Dang yep you heard it here by. That's how i like to enjoy it. Okay i love this question then. It's because i some of these. I mean i'm not gonna like to my own horn and i don't remember which ones but i kind of adopted them from tags in. This was one of them. Is there a john raya that you would be fine with nefer reading again. Light way to put it. It's like someone's offering you like or would you like some tea. No thank you. And someone offers you the sean john mara book like not thank you. Thank you thank you. I can't think of of an entire. John nra that i would completely avoid just right now even in this moment i want to hold you to it forever. Her right this moment. i'm kind of. I'm kind of good on horror for you. Say these things to loon Well you said you wouldn't hold it against me. Yeah but you said that. On purpose i did. No there's no. There's no overarching genre. That i would completely avoid. The bible offered me the bible on a thank. You thank you thank you. You know that. I appreciate you know i. I appreciate religious history taxed. i do. We're having fun here. People know my. I guess for me it would be not an entire genre but a something that happens within a genre. I'm kind of done reading about sexual assault and you know. And that's that is in. Fantasy horror sci fi any of the other genres it's used in a. It's used a lot of times as shock as character development a yeast to be. Anyway i i still come across it sometimes and it's still used well in in some of the ways that i've read it but i'm kind of done reading about it now very interesting that you say that because i mean i feel like the conversation around sexual assault has an ano is become a lot better in the way people write about it has become a lot better yes and i think that it's very important to a lot of stories and will continue to be but it is incredibly difficult to read about incredibly because it hot died should be incredibly difficult to read about yes and I think i like this trend. We have be respectful conversations. Yeah and it just i. It's fair to say. I'm not saying that there is there's inherently something wrong but if we're about that trigger warning you would have to kind of exactly. Yeah it's a trigger is a trigger. Same i i totally get that a. Lighten the mood minus romcom as funny. When i was in high school. I read a lot of romcom i get. I get that people like romcom. My sister lakes come lot of people. Do i totally respect that. You know you're genre junkies. We never never writing off. John really are disrespecting chandra's or anything like that. But i get that people like the lightness and they like the predictability and they like it sometimes when they can surprise them but they get a happy ending and they kinda get boxes checked and needs met hand. I just. i don't like it in movies. I don't like it in books. I think something would have to be really really special in romcom. I would probably want it to be queer quite honestly. Yeah and i would probably want it to be basically erotica not writing off veronica. I'm writing on comes. you know. it's funny it's funny. What you just said at the end about about it being queer eye. It's no secret. That i love rahm comes jill but i actually. I'm kind of. I don't know i think i kind of am interested in reading or watching more queer rom coms to have different stories being told you know i'll just because i'm sure a lot of it is the same because there's tons of queer rom comes out there in books while i was tons. I there's there there. But i think i'm sure it checks a lot of those boxes but there's gotta be something about it that is refreshing to hear another walk of life stories so to speak where it's not just this or i mean some people from wildly divergent cultures or something like that. Like i can't just have straight boring white person meets straight boring white person anymore. I that i yeah. I actually think you convinced me a discussion to convince but i think you actually convinced me. Thank y'all see myself out all right. This one's pretty simple. Yes hardcover paperback trade e book or audio book all valid forms. I left off the graphic novel. I kept it a little. I think that's a. That's i think graphic novels belong actually in their own genre. Almost i got you. We love them. We love graphic novels. I get what you're saying for me. If i have the option laid out like a buffet before me i would pick the trade every time. Trade like trade like trade size like the feel like the type face a lot of times on a day-to-day basis for me. It is an e book is my favorite. But i love trades to. Yeah they fit well. They fit well in your hand. Yeah i i love that feel of trade like it's just a good size and a good feel and it has that book smell and all of these are totally valid. There is certainly places and walks of life. And everything. Where i mean really. We've said before on junkies just white shoes like there's some all are great ways to absorb book absolutely. Can you read while listening to music or background noise. No this is actually kind of a little for fun question for for all of our john junkies at home no. I can't sometimes sandra ira reading together at the same time will have like a little bit of like electronic music very quiet in the background and i told her rate it may but either silence or the sound of nature right. I get so distracted with with things around me. Yeah i just. I being a binge eater myself. I really liked to just put on blinders on. Just this is the book and lose hours to it. With with no other distractions. Well if you couldn't tell them like. I said this is a another little fun. Little little behind the scenes peek. I enjoy background noise. When i read music listening to music a lot when i read. I do kind of prefer music without lyrics. So or kind of Lyrics very distracting. So i like my ambient techno Some chile tron ika classical Jack i can listen with lyrics to but i mean that's kind of my thing tv on in the background. I'm definitely one of those people. And i think part of that is just a lot of. It is how. I grew up. Because i grew up with you know if we watching a show or something on tv. We'd all be watching during the story. And then during the commercials we all reach for our books and you re during the commercial can't one hundred percent raised from a small child that way reading. Is you know it's something you used to fill the the blank spaces of life. Yeah well are there any writing styles and or writing cliches that you really don't like this is funny. I was traumatized as a young child by the anamour. I've i've i've talked about this before. I can't stand it when a character turns into something and we'll get stuck in something and they're that way for several books in or the entire rest of the series spoiler alert to bias as a hawk forever. I could not handle that. Could handle that. And there's sometimes in fantasy books where it's like someone's going to be in a jar for three bucks. Exactly what's theory sure. I can't do it. i can't do it. I can't do that I i need it to be. I needed to be that. People aren't stuck in jars. People aren't stuck as an animal like i can't. I don't even know what. How do you describe this. I don't know i. I don't like it. I like people being rude supposed to be not just say that the party kid get split up but not like that where someone is just like really weirdly removed from the action if the like the active losing agency others don't know what it is by can't handle it i also unless it is existential. Or nihilistic writing. I don't like vague. Writing at don't lake stripped down vague writing. I like a flowery pretty sentence so mine is a entire tents and its first person present. Tense i have. I have read it in horror novel. Yeah significantly it to very strong effect. It is so difficult for me to read it though. I don't know why it's just there's this immediacy to it that also doesn't immediacy to it that the present tense give give you that. I already am a little already a little bit difficult for me and then putting it into first person where you're inside of the person's head it's very much i i pick up the cup. I drink from the cup. There's something about it that it's it. Makes it very hard for me to to absorb that that information and it makes me so nervous a shows i it makes me anxious why that's like me with with people. Turning things are getting stuck in things for too long. I remember i tried. I tried to read the sort of true series. And i actually read. I don't know like four book. Senators something and i remember. There was a part where i started to get that feeling creeping up the back of my neck and i told scott i'm like it's got to be in a jar for this or i think it was more like it was a party being split thing and i was like. How long are they going to be split. Because i also don't like it at the parties split over two long. Yeah i'm like my cat. I like people in things where they're supposed to be thank you very much. What's your favorite reading spot. Well my favorite reading spot in the world is in a hammock next to a lake. That's fine you can say that. I can't do that every day. Sadly but that is my favorite place to read as in a hammock next to a lake. Let's second choice second choice. Today would be curled up on the couch. Yes card giant couch. Cheyenne couch curl up on. The giant couch is my favorite place street. Definitely one hundred percent I also like reading not always but there's something special to me about reading horror late at night in the dark kind of by yourself. That's really special to me. Takes me back to childhood Yeah i fall asleep. If i read in the dark i will eventually. I actually really like reading outside. I read outside at work. I read outside here when it's warmer but there's something about this couch and you've you've heard us talk about this catch before when we say giant couch. I don't think we've ever really bad there's couches fifteen feet long. It isn't really. It is the biggest couch you could ever imagine. It's pretty big. Yeah it can fit a lot of friends on it. Yes it can hit me. Go necks okay. Do you have a funny book related story that you can share. I do. I do funny book related story so as i said I come from a bibliophile family. Massive readers love to read always have books always have books to read. You don't have a book to read. Panic will set in so we were poor and as poor people want to do. We went camping a lot talk and one time we were camping out in the middle of nowhere and i was a young child. So it's like the ninety s and we were like out on the lake and we came back to our campsite and chipmunks had devoured our books. Oh they'd been left outside. And chipmunks had come an eaton. The books leaving bits of paper hither and thither jus- cha cha torn decimated books. And this is like out in the middle of nowhere and we still had. I mean it was going to be like a day's journey back to civilization. And like i dunno where obviously camping for a few more days and so we set out to find books and i was probably like maybe six or seven and we found in a tiny tiny. Like you know like a place you stop out. In the middle of nowhere town dislike general store that had some used books and we like fell upon them. Whatever we could. And i remember. I talked about my parents. Talk to this with my parents recently and i remember like looking around and was very displeased like is there more children's section not happy with a lot of my options. I think i got a scary stories book. Something like that And i got a weird book about like a girl who was a fricken like abused child. Shed lakes horrible abuse child life. It was one of those abused kid. Books you know and i was like so thing and yeah it was like i mean. That's what we had to do back then kids. That's what we had to do. We couldn't just get on your phone and download a new book. No no and chipmunks at least the last time i checked won't eat my my kindle. They'll try but they won't be successful about funny book it will. I don't have a specific story. I have more of a setting a long form story so where i used to work I used to go read out at a table in front of starbucks and then co worker started to to come hang out at the table with me now. I'm reading and would talk to me now. And then random people would see the uniform that i was wearing and start asking me questions about things that were related to the business that i worked for now so four about five six years i would go i would. I would grab one of those used for crates. Those black milk crates from starbucks. And i would drag it over behind the buildings and hide behind a dumpster sitting on a milk crate so i could read on my our long lunch without anyone bothering me. Yes yes that is an amateur. Has that. there's nothing worse than being interrupted. Your way read it. I saw tiktok the other day and it was the guy and it was like how to you. Talk to girls who have in ear buds reading a book. Don't leave her alone and it was like yes. Thank you every reader. Noses leaderless this. Oh my god and when. I remember when you told me that it's like in my mind. I'm picturing like dripping dank alleyway that you dread your little milk carton behind like sirens going off and a rat skittering over your foot. It's like one of the alley alleyways from any eighties new york. Babies needles everywhere. There's is there a type of book that puts you into a ratings slump. Well no there isn't. But i would say the most common is usually psychological. Horror will usually kinda just stop. And i'll and all i want to do is watch disney film. Yeah and just you know and just realize that's probably the closest thing that puts the closest like common thing that will put me into a reading slump. But i you know john are. Junkies has beaten this out of me. But i've kind of a weird reader. Prior to this. I was really the kind of person i would read. Seven eight nine books in a row over the course of a month Week i mean really quickly and then i would honestly go a couple of months without reading a book. That was kind of my a was kind of the way i always was even when i was in my teens and jonah junkies has beaten out of me. Now i am. I am definitely a book a week to book every two weeks kind of a reader but yes but you know sometimes a really scary or emotionally affecting book. We'll we'll put me in a little bit of slump. That's a really good really good answer. Mine is i mean. There are books that just by reading them puts me in a slump. Not necessarily genre thing. But when i ve kind of like come to find this if i'm in the mood for horror than reading a different genre will put me in a slump or if i'm in the mood for fantasy whatever it is that i'm in the mood for if i don't get like have that then i will be slumpy and i will take a long time to read a book because it's not what i want to be reading. It's not always john specific to sometimes it could be like. I want to read that book. And if i can't read that book it's like eating your your porridge eating gruel. Well you have one good thing working in your favor that i cannot do was that you couldn't read two books at once. I can read more than two books at once. I cannot do that. Yeah i can't. I can't flip between books. Yes so at least you can read that book that you really want to read while you're reading something else but then it's sometimes backfires because then i just really like no no this. I want to read this right. Yes yeah all right. We got one more question. This is it. Oh this is a deep deep deep dive. How do you honestly feel about non-readers our pity them. I agree. I feel sad for them. You know. I don't. I don't want to put too much judgement on people who don't read. There's a whole lot of reasons why people don't read read anything and i want to clarify audio audiobooks count. Yes the one hundred percent do. They're so much. Creativity uniqueness and intelligence when it comes to what authors are writing out there that can't be duplicated in any other medium and i feel like people who don't read who won't read are really missing out on a whole world of knowledge and entertainment. I agree You know. I kinda thought of it that like for those of us who are readers. It's like when you read. It's like it's like watching a movie in your head. And i think maybe i'm wrong but for non-readers they can't make the movie happen in their head. Is candidate. best way to think about it. Because i'm like what else could it be because it's you know you can see it and you can feel it and you can smell it and you can taste it at. It comes alive in your mind. So i would have to think that if you don't like reading it's because it doesn't come alive in your mind. Set it before too. And it's kind of bastardising. That's not a swear. Stephen king quote that you know like how else do you fill the blink moments in life too. You know. you're watching baseball pitching change. Grab your book. You're waiting for a prescription. Your book like i mean i mean we all go through times where we're feel kind of or whatever but i ve very rarely in my life ever been bored because i'm a reader and you'll never be lonely with a book. No books are good friends. farmers only dot com. Thankfully all of you our listeners. Don't fall into that category. Oh i'm sure you're all book to people. Thank you guys very much for hanging out and just chatting having just this little fireside chat moment with us we'll be back to our normal book reviewing schedule very very soon. Got some fun stuff plan for the end of the year. So must my birthday. Which is a hollered time it is. It's the most wonderful time of the year halloween and my birthday. Yeah that's it. Second most wonderful time of the stop all right everybody being key so much for joining us. Thank you scott. Thank you sandra. Please keep reading pasture bedtime

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58 | Fantasy | Five Dark Fates by Kendare Blake with Interview!

Genre Junkies | Book Reviews

1:24:13 hr | 1 year ago

58 | Fantasy | Five Dark Fates by Kendare Blake with Interview!

"Weirdo bookworm unite. We want to share our love of genre fiction with you. Some readers leaders out there may look down on you for your love of horror sci fi and fantasy but not us so stop by as we discuss what we've been reading. I johnny junkies. This is sandra scott l. Welcome to another installment of john junkies tonight. We are discussing singing a highly highly anticipated fantasy conclusion. Call it call seller tori episode. Call it a week. We don't be don't be sad that it's over be happy that it happened. Yeah okay. I'm going to be very soon. I'm going to be very sad for a long time. <hes> <hes> of course we're talking about five dark fates can dara blake's conclusion to a series that you and i and amanda have have loved so much three dark crowns saga and it's coming to a close. The sun is setting on this story. These characters is our queens and their friends and foes horrible. It really is difficult. I this is going to be a little bit live a different episode because a lot of you have experienced the series with us and some of you have not fight. We're going to talk about the story thus far get you prepared to say goodbye to our favourite. Queens defend burn <hes>. I'm just going to go ahead and say right now. <hes> our scores are up in the air. You all know how much we love the series but i'm gonna say this book was a struggle for me. So ah now this is not at all. Oh yeah in a good way i plowed through this book for a good portion of it and then about two thirds of the way through a closed the book and i just i couldn't bring myself to finish i think in the spoiler sections we will address what that part was. Yes mangy meiji stop but even even without the events of the book itself. I was not prepared for this series to end. I love it so much. It's means so much to me and i just i knew when i picked up the book again after that point. I knew that would be probably the last time i knew that that would be see the point where i would finish it and it would be over and it would be done and it was really hard for me i can't i think the last time that i had this experience experience with a book was the final book of harry potter just i i wasn't ready for it to be over a relate very strongly to that <hes>. I absolutely loved this series. I adored the series. It means a lot to me as well. It just fits in so much of my. I idea of you know kind of like a fantasy world. How i kind of sort of wish things were like if i had to pick a fantasy world to live in there is like i can see myself into a lot of facets of fen burn now. Obviously we're not gonna spoiled this book until the spoiler section which warn you about but i mean at this point like hello like you have to read the other books in the series to even be interested so i guess light spoilers for the the rest of the books you know this is a story of a matriarchial on a goddess worshipping island called fen burn. There are three major factions sion's on this island. There is the elemental which control the elements and that's where queen mirabella comes from there is the naturalists which work with the natural world and plants and animals particularly they have their animal's familiar along with them and then there is also the poisoners which are right people which are the healers but also the killers and they have an affinity for working with potions and poisons uh-huh and concoctions and they're a little wicked just a little little wicked dork yeah there little dark and <hes> kind of lake lake buji and ornate and okay final. Stop talking about the poisoners where the best people now. There's a couple of other types one can be and we've learned about it thus far in the book but those are the three like big ones you can also be war gifted which is obviously you have an affinity for fighting and telling helsinki yeah strength and then you can also be an oracle which there's like four oracle's left. There's not many sierra because because they are typically around at birth because they are thought to have this horrible gift which is actually curse sell at this point in the book we we have our group of gals. They have not done what they're supposed to do. Which is fight to the last girl. They're all three still ooh but you know we got my poor katharina i can. I just call her cat because that is hard for me to say that. I can say to my head but i can't. I can't say it out loud. I don't i don't know if i can if i say cattering in my head either but yeah cats find selley have cat who is just full of ghostly queens. I've gone on record as saying she's a clown car. Full of ghosts just packed packed to the broncos and they call her the queen but people don't even know the half of it. There's very few people that know that she's full of these queens. That were the ones that died at the hands of their sisters sisters. Yeah the whole. The whole hook of the series is that there are three triplets that are born every generation of the queen and a and each one has a different gift and they are destined to fight each other to the death till there is one queen who will rule and give birth to the next set of triplets so at this point in the book we got the dead queens over here that we got some other dead queens that are going on to their kind of in the midst and then there's queen ilian who likes to make appearances in arsonist dreams and shows arsenault like things from the past to kind of help them with the future and then there is another queen on top of that which is of course jewels who is a naturalist who we've had since the beginning. That's arsenals like little protector her b._f._f. Off her and her cougar camden <hes> but now jewels was born legion cursed where she has multiple gifts and in this case she's a naturalist and war gifted and she's kinda really supposed to be the queen yeah. There's there's been there's been a prophecy that the that a legion jin cursed queen will either be the the the salvation offend burn or the destruction of burn right so that's kind of a problem with oracle with oracle. Kohl gift is that you don't necessarily know which direction that's going to go and we've lost some friends along the way when we come into this book. We're in a very dire position to so already sort of launching into this book. It's like we have so much to wrap up and let me just start by saying gene may think she tied up. Everything very nicely in this book are blake did she did this. Is this is one of those series where where you'll never be happy the way that it ends but you'll always be satisfied. The way that ends she does a really good job of of taking you to. It's inevitable conclusion asian and it is it is satisfying and idea. I i totally agree with that so good word for it. It's satisfying and it's hard because we all love these characters actors in the story so much were super invested in it so yeah and it's like you know that it's not all going to work out so perfectly and neatly because that's just not her writing style. That's not the character she makes. She makes very realistic. Characters who are going through very very hard things things and there's something happening on this island where the goddess is really like. I need to change things and there's going to be an upheaval of this world so already going into it. You're like while anything could really happen. There's like this crazy. Divine intervention going on. 'cause you know something is wrong. This is this is a land and where the goddess absolutely exists the magic absolutely exists both because of the gifts and because that's the only way that the queen always gives birth to three triplets triplets but somewhere along the way things have gotten perverted yeah diluted exactly you have these different factions who are controlling the queen's means and and making up their own rules and and turning it into legend. Oh this is known this is this is ancient laws and it's not there making it up as they go along and it's yeah it's kinda like how a lot of organized religions liked to change the narrative to suit political machinations sion's machinations. I can't say that word but it's very much the same thing and if you love books where political maneuverings what's going on then you must have been super happy with the series. That's one of my favorite parts of it is all of the shifting moving parts too big cast of characters as there's all these shady alliances being formed behind the scenes. What i love about this series is the character work. She does with her character's every single book. I feel like i've had different favorite character and those characters have existed since the very beginning everyone has such strong growth rose while also maintaining being themselves throughout the series the the <hes> the arsenault from book one is the same arsenault from book four but she has taken a journey that has turned her into a different person and made her experiences different. Every character has how's the strong growth they don't end the same but they're consistent right and i really appreciate how much growth goes on realistically when and you look at this. This series has taken place over like a year. I mean besides the the flashback books the novellas that kind of fill in some back story and stuff but it's not been like a long time. It's been a lot going on absolute. Chaos in these characters lives but it's been pretty quick. I believe it's been two maybe three years since the beginning of the book or you sure saw because because the initial quickening and and that whole event that is a year long okay that's true so let's say two years yeah i think i think it's about two years because we could be wrong. Somebody screaming at us right now in their car as an listening linked to this. I'm trying to do the time on my head because there is a reference in a way to how long it's been yeah and without going back i wanna say it's three three years almost to the day from the beginning. I'm going more like two years okay so anyway. It's not been a lifetime's worth of stuff in this series but it's been a lot crammed into because it's so important and everything that's going on is such an upheaval and and so so incredibly monumental these characters lives so i guess we kind of gave an experience or you said struggle though this is a little bit different than unusual for me. It was an absolute obsession absolute obsession. Yeah absolutely yeah yeah. There is no point when i struggled through this book even some hard hard stuff that happens. I could not stop not only turning the pages but devouring and hanging on every word and there's not on a lot of series that i love like this. There's not a lot of authors of that. I think her slow amazingly this and in case you couldn't tell from clicking into this episode we have another interview with the author the woman herself the queen of queens kendra blake and we are so incredibly humbled and thankful to have her sit down with us via skype again and let us into her world and her thought process us and allow us to you know kind of laud her with praise because we love her books as we said at the last time she's kind of r. J. k. rowling of this decade kate kind of is for these two jonah junkies anyway alright so i guess s. without much further ado cisco right and with the right into the interview and when we come back we're gonna talk. Spoilers for the end is nigh. Five dr traits <music> welcome back to jonah junkies for the second time. We're so excited cited to be speaking with can dara blake dora. Welcome back to the show. Thanks thanks for having me. Lou applause applause. We are always happy to have you and <hes> yeah we miss. We miss you. You know like before we get started. I have to tell you guys. Yes just something from last time you remember we like you gave me all those great horror recommendations. Yes jotted down my list and everything and then one of them was a book called the good a demon which you guys had just read. I think yes the time yup and the weirdest thing. I ran into the author of the demon on tour like two weeks later. Yeah we were just both happening to be <unk> like we were both passing through square books on the same night he was doing something completely unrelated like queued recorded a a radio interview and then he did it another event at a separate venue and we were doing ours at a different venue but randomly all of the bookstore owners took took us all out to drinks at the same place and so we got chatting and he told me what his book was like no frigging way. John junkies just told me i needed to read this. It's on the top of my list like my mom when my phone and i showed him like you're right at the top there see i'm not why i bought audit but as usual its on the pile yup the ever-growing pile but no he's really cool and i'm really excited to read it but as usual you know oh i fall behind. I'm a really slow reader. Actually you know what you had the best of intentions we all do when we do these. T._r.'s and it's the thought cow. Let's the we'll get to it eventually and i find the height of my t._b. Are a little bit soothing. I know some people find it very daunting but when i look at it i i almost just get like a warm excited feeling just knowing that there's so much yet for me to read you know seeing food in your cupboard. We will make it through this winter. Yeah exactly we actually just got a one of those library cards at these push around with with books on it. I guess yes they still do. We painted it purple. It's our to be our shelf and we're a little worried that it's not big enough. Oh gosh yeah. I'm sure you'll grow out of it very quickly. You might need a couple. You might need a fleet elite pushcart a barge yet. No it's eight. I like that feeling too is like that feeling of like you know. The books are just like they're they're. They're friends. They're waiting for you. They're waiting for your embrace. I love that feeling like if something was to happen and i could not make it to a bookstore for an extended period the time i'd be okay i'd have stuff. Yes exactly what's with us readers. We have this weird fear of running out of books. It's absurd. I i have a weird. If you're running out of everything. I like the extra bags of dog food. My cats are stocked up for several months. You have a little bit of a proper streak. Just i do you just in case. You're not so much for me. I guess it's mostly for the pets so i'll be attitude but reading books i suppose natural bester. That's also spoken like a true pet. Mom yeah us too so you were talking about your t._b. Are what does your library look like. Oh well. There's a reason i don't post like cute pictures of it on its. I have several different stacks in my closet like in the closet of my office. My office closet has beautiful shelves that i utilize and most it is my car and then if i buy something new like i'll go to the bookstore and you inevitably come out with at least a stack of four. I think that's my minimum or i'll put those on prominent display on my display shelves in my living room and eventually they will get moved to the convicts. It's like look okay. These are my pretty fancy new girls and then into the closet they go into the closet. They go when the next new stat comes so yeah. I know you guys are making me. I feel like abuser user abuser or no. No no believe me. We understand we all have the same relationship so so of course your newest book came out which is also the last spoken this saga yeah adam exist recording. It's coming out tomorrow. This recording is also coming out tomorrow. Okay well. I'm highly <music>. I'm like very very caffeinated also sedated. I don't know how that works right. Well i mean this is is going to be an emotional episode of chandra turkeys when we review this book. How difficult has it been for you to say goodbye. Defend burn and the queens or are so you kind of happy to be saying. Oh no no. I'm i'm late. Almost i'm almost physically sick. It's it's a real kind of breath funk than finding myself in and i've got a perk myself up because i've got <hes> the book launch tomorrow and we're doing it in seattle and i've got all these swag wragg prices set out i ordered fancy treats and you know my friend katie mcgee who writes thousands floor series yeah and and she's just launching her new series called american royals about an alternate history where george washington became king instead of the first president and now we've pat a monarchy of washington's ever since yes. I've heard about this. Yes yes yeah oh yeah yeah. It's good it's delightful and twisty but she's coming up and we're gonna do joint launch party it kind of like farewell to one series hello to her new series and i've got to be all smiles in perky but really just want to curl up in a blanket and like cocoa. Oh and marshmallows grumble forty eight hours right. You like give me my weighted blanket and my animals. I'm in mourning mourning. I'm going to be really i really i'm really sad to say goodbye to this island so you talked about on the last episode with us that your characters kind of dictate the story to you as you're in writing it but this fourth book feels like it's just a continuous march towards the inevitable. Did you have an idea in this book where it was going at the the end or did this happen organically as well. I mean it all happened organically. It was mostly the difference was it was mostly them dragging me dragging me like a plow and 'cause i didn't. I like you guys. No no just don't do that and they're like. What are we going to do so <hes>. I wrote it really slowly. It went very slowly. <hes> we went very late. I was working on the book at the end of may which is this ridiculous when like i should have been done ages and ages before that but <hes> i just i was dawdling honestly <hes> <hes> no but i mean it was the end and the only thing that i hoped was that the character would meet ends that worthy of them and you know we're we're suited to them and as usual they did whatever the heck they wanted to <hes> even though it didn't please me sometimes there were definitely some things. There are often things in my book that i would characters. I wanna save. I really wanted to save natalia aaron <unk> too <hes> but i tried and it didn't work work so i've just learned to let them do what they want yeah. I and i think it works. I think it's for the best. Do your character's make you cry while you're writing. No no i'm. I'm a hard hearted bitch but i will get very sad a sad feeling and a sad face but i kind of know what's coming about <unk> even sometimes by the time the series ends. I kind of know maybe even up to half a book in advance. What might might come now. There are still things that surprised me. A few twists and turns in the final battle happened that i did not see coming at all. It was like you don't say so. I've had a lot by the time writing it. I've had time to process it so i'm not just like we being in front of my computer. Thankfully you know it's still yeah. It's still upsetting. There's enough tears between the two of us and the rest of the readers to make up for it speaking of characters. Do you have house favorite characters of your own books ordeal of all your children equally. I would say that i would love them all equally but for different reasons. Some of them are more fun to write than others. Arsenault has always been more fun to write than mirabella. Although mirabella has had her moments now that she's kind of come out of her shell and and found her own way of things. Um jewels has become less fun to write as the series went on just because she has to go through some stuff. There's a lot on her shoulders and her her. Her arc is very difficult difficult to watch and it's difficult to to get through. I always loved writing the poisoners just because they're delightfully wicked did and yet. They don't think of themselves as wicked at all. I love that and they have that great aesthetic. They have the boys food that got the fancy clothes. They're very yeah. They're they're local isn't poisoner things like a poisoner mood. You know which is going to you and you know. The poisoners are my favorite. That's my people and i think that's one reason i love them because they are truly the heroes of their own story and yet they're aesthetics are their goals their goals for for life yeah yeah my editor said at one point you don't you think cats being a little mean. She's poisoner man. She's not but she was raised that way. It's it's nurture over nature right now you know right though <hes> and according to the poisoners like if you poison someone they don't die then there's really nothing even to to boo who about we didn't kill him. It barely left a mark. What are you crying for right. That late comes up a lot in this book too. I was like yeah just poisoners being poisoners man man there. You know i would think it'd being poisoned is almost like a brand of honor. They almost envy it. I think because they that's something within that can never happen to them. Yes as a poisoner. I agree. I'm like look at all this time and attention i put into you i made this great concoction and i dipped these ropes ropes and poison and lucky you enjoy my painful art. You ungrateful troll. Yes yes the last time you were here and i don't mean to put you spot and of course if you can't say anything i understand but you got. My little hopes up quite high when he not in edgar allan poe project. Oh yeah it comes out in october. What's the name of it again everybody at home it's his hideous heart and it is an easy. I think thirteen of us got together and reimagined one of our favorite edgar. Allan poe stories like updated it gave it a twist the there are being published side by side with the original story so if you're not familiar with the stories that we chose and you can go and read the original edgar allan apoe tail interesting note they asked us to record our own audiobook what so i had to go to a studio in in seattle and do the audio recording for the first time and i have so much more respect voice actors than i did even before because man that is hard ard all kinds of things like you're making too. Many mouth noises too many noises with your mouth. I'm knocking making noises. This is my mouth your self conscious and like enough the editor's job yeah. I like okay. I'm gonna need some water water and i don't know i don't know what i can do to quiet my mouth. Oh my gosh rough and then i didn't know they wanted me to also record do the audio recording for the original edgar allan poe story which had some latin in it and some french. I don't know how to pronounce any of that. Oh yeah that's like something they just can't a spring on you and you're like yes about that latin and she coached me through it and she was really great. <hes> the producer was really great and i think i think we did ok just doing it in short bursts where she would just phonetically teach egypt to me and i would repeat it <hes> and then she'll edit it all together but edgar allan poe. It was one of my favorite stories that we did but when i was reading it like i'd never read it before. Oh my god i've never noticed the weird asked. Sentence structure that you use roll was hard at one point. I'm just like i'm just reading word now. I don't even know where i'm supposed to pause for effect. I've just reading the words right after the other to get to a period right you need to call upon upon his ghost and be like guide me through this ed like where did you want me to. The sentence is all over the place but yeah so fun right go and so much of that time period a lot of the sentences and i love him. You know i'm obsessed but it's like and then me thinks i did this thing. Oh yes i did this thing and uh-huh yeah yup i o in the story that i tell us was met. Send gerstein which is about it's i think it's one of his first published stories if not the first most of his and it's about a horse like a an obsession with a horse in kind of a family occurs but i have always said it in my head maxine gerstein so oh when we went to record it i said okay so is this steiner steen. Let me google it and try to find a consensus and she's like looks like it's stein. I'm like well. We had a fifty fifty shot. Get in this room. I i am going to try to <unk> steen every single time we hit that word will yeah yeah yeah. You may detect in the audio. Some brief pauses where i just met senator stein really hard of getting some young frankenstein frankenstein vibes with that yeah. So how long were you in the studio for that. Oh not very long. I think it was like an hour and a half. Oh yeah oh very cool. Hey that's really cool. You know you've got to challenge yourself and get out of your element. That's that's very admirable. Yeah i mean when they asked us was like will they know that we don't have any professional experience right and the editor diet ad there was like yeah. They don't seem at all concerned. Hey signed signed me up. I love it just jump in with confidence. It'll workout would yeah so i i'm. I'm holding off on reading. Everybody else's stories until i can grab some of the audio tube because i would. I'm looking forward to seeing how it all turned out nice well. We will definitely be listening to it so election. Nell so when you're when you're writing. Do you have a particular space or or a routine that you go through to set yourself up to writer. Can you just rate anywhere. There's usually a doberman under my feet and a hairless cat on my lap sometimes or just snaking through across my screen gene so i have to crane my neck or a look under his belly depending <hes> when i need to see what i'm actually writing but i just went on my very first writers retreat last month and i wasn't sure how that was going to go because okay so i'm just going to write in a room full of other writers as we like ignore each other and stare at our screens and try to get word counts up. I don't know how this is gonna work but don't want find. It went fine. I had by far the lowest word count of the weekend like by far it was. I was ashamed at the end of it. They're like let's let's total word count so we can see how many total words that we got in over the course of this retreat eight and after they told everything up it was like collectively we had written an entire fantasy novel and i contributed six thousand words the fat you you wrote chapter four. I was very proud of my six thousand words. That's with the book that i'm working on right now. That's actually about two weeks worth of work so that's great but i it when everybody else said there is. I don't want to say all. They told me i was working right. I wasn't slacking off but i don't wanna say. Don't pay shame me. Yeah don't do it. Was this a new story that you were working on there like like workshop or was this an existing existing project well. It's it's my twenty twenty one book so it's not due until june so i guess i'm ahead because i'm about halfway all right good for you. That's what i was working on so one thing that i love that you do on your social media. Is your fan art friday which i guess this is more of a comment less than a question but how cool is that that people make fan art of your her characters. That must be just a really surreal feeling it is it is i am the fanar is so gorgeous like these are i know a lot of their professionals <hes> and the they do the fan art to kind of get it out there and then hopefully be commissioned for their original paid work and so the quality of it is astounding. It's just like i can't believe i just i can't believe a lot of it just absolutely beautiful so yeah. I'm always excited but i'm always excited to see any kind of fan art like you. Draw me stick people and i'm excited. I'm excited about it that you put put in the effort and major will stick people hopefully with some some dialogue bubbles. Those are my favorite stick. People talking <hes> yeah yeah yeah and there's a lot of three crowns. <hes> fan are out there and so many different depictions of the queen's that's my favorite part when it comes to three hundred crowns seeing so many any different interpretations of the characters oh yeah it's incredible and it seems to be like all over the world people and i like to think especially females els but people in general just really connect with these characters in these stories. That's always so cool when it can just really you know transcend and be something something that a lot of people share yeah yeah. It is really neat. Sometimes i creep on the fandom and you should this see what's going on in there. Uh-huh what's going on in their fandom. Do you ever find your your own personal head cannon on on how your queens look change from the fan art no no not really. I don't honestly i don't really have a head cannon the queen's in my head our shadows movements invoices like i can. I know the way that arsenault arsenault moves. I know the way that jules moves. I know the sound of their voice. The tilted their head. I don't know what their faces look like. I really don't i can see they're like silhouettes. Honestly you kinda like shadows which i don't know that sound weird assassinate. It's fascinating. Does that does does that. Make it difficult to describe your characters. No <hes> i describe them in i give i call her a give our caller i if they if that's necessary sometimes i don't give those things. I don't know if nicholas martell has a hair colour. Actually now that you bring it up so then i just described their mannerisms so i never say like i usually don't go as far as crooked noses or and six wrinkled is or that'd be weird. Nobody has six wrinkled is but yeah so no. No i guess it it doesn't <hes> <hes> i like people to form their own. <hes> you know imaginings of what what the queen's look like. That's something that actually scares me about the movies like if anything ever becomes it comes film <hes> then my queens in my head will disappear and they will become the actors like one hundred percent. I know that will it kind of scares me yeah because that does happen. It does happen yeah when they cast cameron. Monaghan is kasim addressed in blood very briefly in the movie that never came to pass <hes> even that short just seeing him read the lines from the screen test. That's almost too much for me like okay. We'll now your cats now. Casas gone and you are him and so yeah. I'm very susceptible. Yeah i think i think a lot of us. Are that's relatable. You know this is a fun question. I left at talk about horror with you. Because since you love horror <hes> have you read any good horror books as years seen any movies or tv review shows that really stand out and i guess it doesn't have to be just horror but you know kind of some favorites from two thousand eighteen misfire. Oh yeah <hes> got you know. The ears bleed together so i can't remember when exactly but about two weeks ago i i watched <hes> ready or not ready or not. I haven't seen it yet. That can't wait. Look so good it gave me. Did you see that movie a couple years ago your next yes of course it gave me serious your next vibes like the whole time i was like <hes> this is like your next except a little bit snarky her a little bit funnier more cheek at times but but yeah yeah it was it was really good. It was clever. It was well done <hes>. It was fun which i always. I always like a little fun with my hor not always i guess but it could be the movie rookie yeah. We're gonna go see chapter two next weekend so i'm very excited for that as far his books shoot no. I don't know if i have written. I know i have to have. I don't not read horror for a whole year. That just doesn't happen but nothing. It's it's not spring to mind. I i watched the new the a._m._c. adaptation of analyst for to nocera to oh. Yes you guys watch that. We have not gotten all the way through it but we are huge show hill fans and we love the book but you haven't started the series now <hes> <hes> there are so many i mean. I really liked a lot of aspects of it. I was unprepared for <hes> charlie makes and his depiction <unk> zachary canto isn't it do they got spock from the yeah yeah and it's almost like he's too good looking when when he's young you know like i don't wanna. I don't wanna see you this way. Charlie manx like it's not yeah yeah. You're not a heartthrob charlie minks. You're a gross old soul sucking thing but no sometimes is just spock that is too funny and that's another really really good example of like it. Kinda bleeds the character that you had in your head with the actor yeah but i did love. I love the young actress that they got to play vic. She's just great absolutely great so yeah. I hope you enjoy the series when you when you binge it. It's inevitable yeah yeah. It's an inevitable. It's inevitable that we all eventually binge all the stuff that we want to benge. They're actually does seem to be a lot of translations of genre fiction into a t._v. Shows and into movies these days do you do. You think that that one of those mediums is you know better than the other or or more true than the other. I think this the short form series on t._v. That you know like ten episodes of an in our or less you know ten forty minute episodes has done a really good job with some of the source material. I don't know why it's just like you have just that much extra time uh for character development but not so much time that you're stretching anything. It's just it seems very suited. I don't know if it's better though i know they're doing the netflix series of libor dugas grecia vers rajon berry area excited for you and that seems like the perfect format for that just just just enough to explore and really dig in take time with the character but films can be done extremely well so i think it just it just differ it differs by project. I think i'm with you. I do like the short form tv series to kind of tell a story yeah. It can be a really good pace for it so so yeah. I'm i'm into it too. I gotta say the other thing. I'm super excited for this year. Is the joker movie the new one with joaquin a keen phoenix. I'll you know i have not seen. I saw that the preview the first preview came out a couple of like last week and i was like oh i got to watch that and i still haven't went okay yeah like the is he doing a strange take on it. What do you think i you know i'm a huge batman fan in the joker particularly and and they are doing a new origin story of the joker i love walking to i think he's amazing but he lost like fifty or sixty pounds for for this role set in the seventies. He's kind of like a failed clown and stand up comic francis conroy places mother. I think they're taking can into a cool place. Yeah yeah okay yeah. I get behind that. I'm excited for that and i'm excited for dr sleep to of course the sequel to the shining. Yes i just saw the they ran that preview ahead of ready or not last weekend and i thought well that actually looks good now. I understand that they a lot of my excitement for this is just tugging very hard on my shining nostalgia strings which are very firmly rooted in my you know my my wallet. You just pull on those strings and there goes my money. It's like magic yeah. It's like magic but like the minute they had the clip of <hes> the elevator blood and they pulled out the twins and they pulled out the song. A minute red rum showed up on the mirror was like okay. We'll all see this yep great book too yeah. You know i read it almost concurrently with nosferatu. I think it suffered a little in comparison yet. I can start happens. We do that as readers yeah and it it felt because they had such a similar vibe. Yeah i've kind of a random question for you so we know you like some scary stuff and you like fantasy and you like a blend of the two <hes> which you ever right just a straight up slasher or have you were. There's no supernatural element mma. Is that your yeah. I kinda know i wanna say i'm working on one now but it's not like it's not i'm getting like flashes of like when you say slasher you're meaning like the nineteen eighty-four upcoming season of american horror story right yeah like there's it's nothing it's nothing supernatural. It's just like a crazy dude or girl 'cause. I don't know like the there's a there. There is a supernatural for natural question at the heart of my twenty twenty twenty one book <hes>. It's about a spree killing. Will there's been a spree killing but it's a very strange re killing in nineteen fifty-eight. It's based on the clutter murders from in cold blood and the stark weather fugate murder spree okay ripped through the heartland in that year. You're so i'm treating it. It's very it's set in a world where the supernatural does not exist but what does that mean when the only kind of reasonable explanation seems to be supernatural it'll be like is it supernatural. Is it not supernatural. That can't possibly be what it seems to be. You know like question but i wouldn't say yes so i don't know maybe i'll head to go back to horror or eventually so i guess if i'm living in writing long enough i could do a slasher. I enjoy i like watching them. Yeah <hes> okay. That's really cool because i love supernatural stuff more than non supernatural. I have to admit but i would love have to see your take on yet kind of a traditional slasher so that makes me excited. Thank you thank you well. When the twenty twenty one book comes out. I'll be interested at the c. What side you fall on since you like supernatural be interested to see if you're of the camp that thanks oh yeah that was supernatural like i don't know that's not real uh-huh i do tend to side with the this the paranormal part almost always it's always it's always me thinking oh. There's nothing weird about this. Sandra drew likes to likes to think that there's something super now. I am older. I love him. He's usually right yup. Sure is oh my gosh. Thank you so much for joining us. We really appreciate you stopping and taking some time out of your day for us now. You said you're doing the launch. You're doing canada little mini tours well yes. Where can people find you a. I'm going on on the epic reads to her. Starting on september tenth will be in in connecticut. I can't remember the city but it's a small state will be there. It'll be me <hes> sarah rauch with these divided added shores the sequel to these rebel waves about pirates and then to debuts shelby muharan here in i i can't remember how to pronounce her last name but she wrote serpent and dove about which hunter and a witch and rena baron who wrote kingdom kingdom of souls and they all also come out the day of this podcast september third and yet will be hitting the road together. Connecticut is our first stop and then i think it is north carolina virginia florida and san diego okay san diego. I might make that drive yeah. Where are you guys. Were you guys low. We're in northern california where in cinema county okay we went to northern california. You and i think last year but nothing nothing up there this year okay aren't it. Well you know if you <hes> do you can sleep on our wonderful sectional couch and you could bring your husband sleeps. Two adults very comfortably. Oh very nice very nice is is the cat. Is she friendly or do you wake up with her like all curled in on your chest just staring in the face little column little columbine is that not is that not the definition of friendly and it'll be a surprise you know. Maybe maybe it'll be my husband. Maybe it'll be me. We'll get the love that gaels. Thank you so much again for joining us. We appreciate it. Everybody go out and read this book. I mean if you're listening to this. You're already probably super addicted like we are. Thank thank you so much. Thank you guys. Thanks for having me back a well there. You have it. Thank you again dr blake for sitting down with us talking with us. She's awesome. Follow her on all social media. She's coming to your city. Go see her. Of course i mean why wasn't she. Oh if you're this far this episode. There's no way you're missing can't are blake having her in your home digitally chile or heavy space physically. If you're so darn lucky we would have her on. We would talk to her on off the record every day for could we consider sitter her a friend. He's a powell we have offered her and her husband to sleep on our couch if they broke up to our neck of the woods like he didn't even need scotty. It'll be keep breakfast every day that in breakfast but it's our couch. It's a it's a sectional. It's big couch. It's a really big out anyway. Let's talk spoilers now. This episode is coming out the day that the book releases. I know that there is some of our jonah junkies have gotten to read early like we did <hes> if you didn't i highly encourage you to finish the series read the book you'll probably do it in a day and come back and listen to with us because we want to we want to share in the struggle and the sadness and the joy with you and i mean who knows what's happened. I mean we're probably gonna probably gonna talk about this book for a long time to come this series. We're probably going to reference it a lot. You know put little like oh and then i remember remember this thing that i loved him in this series and like peppered in two other episodes because it like means that much to us so here we are i mean she she means when bother with an appeal score i you know i've gone back and forth with different appeals scores over the episodes with these books i still still i mean i think at this point with putting a bow on it. I'm still feeling that it's a mass appeal series. I think people who are not generally unruly into fantasy could still get a lot out of this series and i think that people who love fantasy will enjoy this take on the scotus worshiping matriarch easy and political maneuverings and the really interesting magic <hes> space. I i don't know what i've given this series in the past but after reading all four books. I think that i have to call this a mass appeal as well. I think this says the kind of story that anyone would enjoy reading and everyone should enjoy reading and for the people who don't read and wait for things to be translated it onto one either the large screen or the small screen. This is something that would be game of thrones level popular if it was ever turned into a t._v. Show or a series of movies. This is so good and original and inventive and exciting and meaningful. It's a mass appeal story so she did it. I knew she was going to kill people. I knew the people were not going to get out of this book alive. I have talked about in the past that i wasn't sure that cat was going to be able to survive this series because of going through so much and her possession shen and the delusion of her but you know i was holding on hope that her and peter could kinda like once the queen's were exercise that she he could go and maybe they could go live somewhere else and be happy and in love together now cat had had to go. I'm <music>. I'm really didn't feel like there is going to be a true redemption ark a happy ending. I should say for cat because her redemption ark happened the third book her hearse her. You know her rescue happening in the third book and she denied it and partially is because the queen's komo beat her she would have never she would have never heard peter on her own the queen's one in that case but she wouldn't have been able to tell that story again in the fourth worth book. That was her chance that was our opportunity and she lost it. Let's talk a little bit about each kind of queen and the plots that affected them in their characters so obviously let's see we kind of started with cats. Let's keep that going so cat are quote unquote poisoner queen really unnaturalness shoutout to sweetheart. I hope that peter took care sweetheart. After cat passed away <hes> i love cat. She's like my favorite because i feel like her. Character is so fascinating waiting she went from being the one that did not stand a snowball's chance in hell of getting the crown to be possessed by a legion of undoubted code queens having sick dark crown tattoo and having all this power but like being so conflicted afflicted because when she's her she's still her but she so poisoned by these queens. I'm so so happy happy with her. I was sad to see her go but i knew it was like sixty forty that she was gonna die. I love that. She saved her sisters. Sleep both both of them and i really liked her and peter's relationship and the fact that peter loved her so much in knew that this wasn't his cat doing all the bad things but he had to make it really clear to her like i contact on the battlefield clear to her that i can't support you in this sir but he also had to be there. No matter what happened he had to support her in a way whether whether arsenault was successful in exercising using those demons or if she did have to die because he still loved her and he wanted to be there with her. There's a part that i really liked in the book where <hes> well the several parts. I should say one reference in particular is when a cat talks about how she's really bonded with pepper the little woodpecker creek fond of him and she she makes a little loaf of bread for him which i thought was so sweet because she is a naturalist but <hes> i loved that she kind of has a friendship with brie and elizabeth like that for once in her life she got to have a little bit of girlfriend time and girlfriends who weren't trying to manipulate her or control her or even train her they. They really did become friends. I they really did and i think that was really important to her when she was herself and she was in control to have some true joy in her life. Shed some joy from peter and stuff to you because she got to experience. It's love and of course alternately. She got to experience the love of her sister's. Sake reciprocate that but i like that she got to have like some actual friends there for a little bit too <hes> there's also like okay this is kind of like surface level i know but you know we love to talk about conditions beautiful descriptive writing winging pros and when she describes cats armor which is gold and black which is like a lovebird art and it's engraved with a skull and snakes i die. I die so good there. There's a moment in our interview with kandara the second time that really opened my eyes to her writing style that i had never really noticed before and now that i think about it i get it. She's incredibly descriptive descriptive when it comes to clothing when it comes to food when it comes to setting and she's not actually very descriptive when it comes to the looks of the characters themselves chiefs and i guess that's something i never really noticed is that because she's so descriptive and she's so detailed in so wonderful in describing all of these things in the world the fact that our visions of the characters our own is something kind of magical yeah. It's really really cool insight into how she thinks of of characters so yeah i was very happy with the treatment of cat and the conclusion of cat story util yeah i was cat hat was the one of the three queens that i was satisfied and happy for her in a way she found herself she she lived for herself in the end and and she saved her sisters so beautiful so let's talk about queen arsenault next arsenal is the one in personality who who is the most lake me in real life and she sarcastic and she's funny and she's kind of headstrong sometimes and kind of jumps i without looking sometimes <hes> her humor. I think this was probably her funniest book. She had lots of little zingers and also like little little mental thoughts. That were like super funny too. I appreciate how in the darkest of times she has humor because that's what gets me and i i think most of us through anything i love her beautiful scarred face. There's actually one point when amelia tells her like the scars that you hide is like the best part tired of you so. Let's go get you some more but a million's and other subject. We're gonna. We're gonna do a million jewels subject. It's going to be its own down section yeah i. I was super happy with our snows journey <hes> throughout the books. I was happy with her conclusion that her and billy have some stuff to work thrill but she wants to go. Get her boy back at the end. I loved that so much. <hes> you know she's got her. Her braddock herb tempur lovett braddock. He's gotta go go be a bear. He's been through enough but so she's gonna. Obviously you know i see this in my mind like they're gonna live on on the mainland for like a few weeks time and then they're gonna come back and move on then burn for a few weeks at a time and i just like totally see this life with her and billy louis where they have some independence and they are part of both worlds the super super happy about that. I knew of the three queens if there was going to be any any of them survived arsenault would be the one hundred percent. She is of both worlds now. She doesn't belong in either and yet she is a part of both and and she's a way to find herself yeah and she's definitely the most uninvolved in the whole the whole queen struggle. It affects her probably the hardest artist because she never really wanted to be a part of any of this. She's the one who is dragged kicking and screaming into this. She wasn't trained for it. She didn't want did yeah oh and then aside from finding out that she's actually this incredibly brilliant poisoner like she so good and for her because she wasn't raised <unk> by the poisoners by the errands she focuses more on the healer tincture side of it which i think is really cool kind of being like this wise is woman which figure which is really beautiful and also sort of embracing the low magic she comes to a good place faced with it. I felt where she's not going to be addicted to it like magical which by the way shannon tomorrow go so glad she got a redemption. She got a lot of praise and a beautiful funeral this book but she's at a comfortable place where it's like. This is who i am and i'm really really effing good at it. I'm good at it. I'm going to use it. This is the one thing that i've always always been good at. I shall use it. Shut us me. Yes okay so let's talk about creating mirabella. We mirabella mirabella. Perhaps the biggest. I guess cherney a fall. I don't know in the weirdest way. I mean i really cats is probably the biggest journey fall but mirabella went from being so the favorite and so perfect and so incredibly strong to being allowed to be flawed and to go against against the grain of what she was bred to be expected outcome and i think it's really really powerful. She becomes uh-huh so like the ultimate big sister. She sees the best in both of her sisters she wants. She won't stand against either them and she's gonna. She's gonna fix this her her goal her death was the point when i closed the book not out of anger not out of exasperation just out of <unk> sadness and said i have to put this down. I finished this book right now. It was really powerful and it was really hard because not only did cat hat save. Her butt. Mirabella knew she kinda had to die because she was too powerful in those queens. Were never gonna let her be. If the queen's had gone into mirabella it would have been all over. They would have unlimited power because mirabella is probably the strongest gifted female in a millennia. Her death was rough for a few reasons for me. Though i just i it came very suddenly from me came more suddenly than i would have liked which is part of i think part of what makes that scene so powerful. I had to read that scene and the chapters before. Were it a few times. I read. I read her death chapter twice because as i was starting to move into the next chapter i was like no no she's fine. She's going to be fine. It's she's fine somehow. The elements are going to knit her back together and then it's like okay missing the back of her head at some. It's curtains curtains for she's gone. She is true well and truly gone and it was prophesied in a way that she would be thrown from the rocks herself. <hes> it was part of it's part of the cycle. It just happened so suddenly for me that i don't. I didn't feel like i really got to say goodbye. It's like okay. She's she's getting things done and they find that the temple and they figure out oh my god this is this is this is actually the history of bird and then she died. She was dead but the way she he died in the reason she died. Is what's powerful. Yeah cat saved her by killing her wretched. It's it's this wretched prophecy in a way a that in order for the island to move forward like the most power full queen in an argument the most powerful queen had hi to go but but but she united the fam- but mirabella knew she was weakened and and they were going to the dead queens. We're gonna take over and she begged catherine. Don't don't let them take me yeah and killing mirabella was the only way could save her. It was a big sacrifice that shut a lot of love. It showed a lot of prefer on cats point like it was in her last letter to arsenault to mirabella's was like her the final act of knitting family together and it took our snow a little bit to get there understandably but it was like mirabella new like i've got to to do this because she remembered everything. Mirabella always remembered their times together that was really important like when they were little she never got any effort. Remember what i do and that was that was what what brought the the sisters together in the end <hes> their their weakness and unwillingness to fight is what started this but their their love for each chimera bellas memory of them is what held them together. She was the peacemaker yeah <hes>. Let's put a little bow on tools and amelia not to lump them but we're gonna lump them a little bit because their stories are so intertwined in these last two books. I really grew to love amelia. I thought she was like just really awesome. So kick ass. I love that like her. Vulnerable side comes out because of her feelings for jewels on that that she's kinda like get she one day like you're gonna be mine. I know this like but i love that their relationship was realistic in in the span of time because jewels from losing the love of her life to then like okay like i do have feelings for this person this girl i i knew what i was like skimpy her world wife but i mean she kinda hinted out it but yeah but that she was like but i need some thai a._m. Chip process this like she wasn't ready to just one hundred percent like just jump right in there. Amelia was like giving her the signs and you know like i wanted to kiss her and stuff and be like this is real and like when you're ready i'm ready but she respected jewels space and like let her take her time to get there because it's like you're going through this huge crazy battle thing. You can't expect. I mean a lot of fantasy books. That isn't the characters just oh. I love you and they like embracing rayson. They become like so passionate but it's like really in the time of war. Would that be when i started relationship. I don't know no probably not although hello gifted our special bunch when it comes to that that probably is the most romantic thing in the world. Jewels is only part work gifted. Yes i loved that. They took the tether for her. Amelia and arsenault took the tether for <hes> jewels yeah which which complicated their relationship quite a bit. I i mean you have this blossoming romance this kind of this kind of complicated relationship and now you throw on the fact that she's tethered to this woman yeah she's she's. She's in in as strong away as you could. Possibly even imagine basically been wetted to this woman when she hasn't even really truly fallen in love with her yet. That's that makes things complicated a does and i mean that could be a whole book and enough itself just that relationship between them <hes> like i said i love amelia and there was like a a line familiar that i loved and like totally highlighted in the book which is when she goes to rescue ability. She promises arsenault. She's gonna look after billy which was a good way to kinda. Give her an occupation for some other parts of the book to play out without interference but the mainlander of course they're not like us there from the real world and he gets picked up by her after he's been stabbed on on the battlefield and he says amelia thank god and he's like china what happened and she's like thank god in your own country so lobby in this country blais like now i was so cute. She has a lot of good little zingy lines like that. That was actually the point what i really appreciated amelia elliot the most when she was forced to promise arsenault okay fine. I'll look after billy. I can't promise anything but fine i will i will watch after him and then as she sees that billy is about to get slaughtered. It's like dammit arsenal and so she charges in to save him that was like okay she really truly is is a a strong and and loyal person. I liked that there was a lot of kind of redemption in this book and by the end of the series we got redemption for magical like i mentioned earlier which i thought was really important to not let her go out civilian and even though she was is a problematic mom she did have an addiction to the low magic but i mean like you know like she had a husband in the end and a baby and and she did the most crazy ultimate sacrifice for her daughter and like this when she says she was born and lake has carried this huge burden which is probably why and she's been a little bit of a problematic mom you know because she just had this thing going on that made their relationship really complicated you know tying her blood to her and everything there was a great redemption for luca the high priestess 'cause i was mad at that that be for a long time but but i'm glad that that like it was like she had her slap on the wrist but i don't think she deserved to be punished any more for it than what happened everything that she ever or did she always truly did feel was in the best interests of the island. That's why i've always respected luca. She didn't make all of the best choices but she she she more than anyone else truly felt. This is the right thing for the island. There was some good poisoner love. I wanna talk about a little bit and that is this kind of our final scene which vive because genevieve she's very much a product of her time and please you know she's cruel kind of the <hes> you know to tell you was the one that had the kindness and of course she kind of has to step up and do something in honor of her family family and especially in honor of natalia and i know that this was totally can dr being like this is a salute to natalia when you know the battles going on and genevieve gets back and you know this is like chaos going on and the other errands are like sacking the place and like running for the hills and she has like this real momentary struggle. I'm going to paraphrase this. No i cannot go you are right and tune. The errands must must survive but at least one error must remain also with the queen and you know they're like they're gonna burn us in the square and she's like then i will burn and she swings off for horses. I said our hands are trembling says she is not brave by nature not like her sister but she hands over the reins and she's like no. I'm going to stay and it's not only powerful but it's like in such a place of this where it is a matriarch and it is so girl power it was really nice to see her her woman up and have her strong poisoner and female pride and sisterly loyalty to that means a lot to me. Obviously i kind of like committed ed memory i the the final battle was was powerful for me for a number of reasons but one thing that that really really affected me and this is not this has nothing to do with the book itself has to do with with the setting and preconceived notions whenever you whenever you talk about when you think about a large fantasy war a large battle you always picture these men in armor who who are fighting each other. I think the three hundred think braveheart think all of this stuff and i have to admit my first mental image was of of that and can dora made multiple points stating that these were women. There were farms of women. I'm like there's still or there our men there but it's a woman's army as like i like the word gifted and i do like that kind of passion and fervor for battle but i like that they're not just blood lusty in like a like a da mass way like they we know full well the price of war and the cost of it and it wasn't glorified in like a way that i feel like other fantasy books say for the past are like there's like you said there's lots of times when it's like these women guards this woman soldier like so that you can really see and at one point it says it is young women now who bleed upon the battlefield young women who will lead them no matter which side side prevails there will be no more puppet queens and it's really important that it was like you know it's not like some weird romanticized sized version of war. There's some ugly stuff we see and hear in this book and of course after row goes fricken bonkers. Why did you do that to roku broke dr. Why don't you do that to her. Hey you know what some blend needs to be. Shed and i mean at least all those kids survived but it's like touching like oh. My gosh like the a baby's like it's so sad but i really appreciate that. That treatment of this battle and of the war gifted in general is that it's a passion. It's it's a bloodless. Yes but it's not it's not all glory the war gifted don't want to just go to war at all times. That's the important important part they're not warmongering but if they're going to go to war they're going to enjoy it while they're gonna revel in it. He has time this is. This says this is when this is in some respects what they exist for well. A powerful staff with the battle is written first of all very well. It's very hard hard to write battles like that. <hes> there's a lot of very famous books at do a poor job. I i don't think for example lord of the rings does a great job with its with which is look with its large battle scenes and writing it but kadora writes this battle scene in a way that is consistent with genre which is why i found it so powerful that it was was all women the she didn't have to change the way that it was written. She didn't have to change the way that she created it. Because at the end of the day doesn't matter if it was women or men were worst hell and that's that's that's that's the reality one hundred percents agree and obviously that's one of the reasons here one of the many reasons why you are my co so host on genre junkies is because you are good feminist and i really appreciate it and i really appreciate how much you love all the feminists details of the story because it's so important and for all the hobbits out there. Please direct your hate mail to scott. He's the one that just said that thing about when normally i'm the one that <unk> says unpopular incendiary opinions about things in pop culture that other people like but this time it's all hobbit fisher enemy lord of the brings is brilliant jesse late now. There's that battle scenes the large battle scenes leave me wanting. Where do you think thank the island is. Now headed trade is now completely open. It's not so much of a dicey little thing <hes> we know the mainland has kind of moved moved on. The're not goddess worshipping. They're more <hes>. I don't wanna say progressive but i guess technologically advanced because they're not progressive islands more progressive. They're more like advanced in their tack in their society. They're moving more towards that kinda judeo-christian masculine overtone thing thing <hes>. Where do you think the future offend. Burn is because joel says stuff's going to change. I'm sadly not optimistic for fend burn. They're they're going to be <music> overtaken. I think they're going to be overhaul and i i don't know if it'll necessarily be colonized by the outsiders but the the culture of the outsiders is so poisonous to fend burns way of life not in the unpoisoned <unk> no it's it's anaesthetic in a lot of ways yes and end toxic. Masculinity is very destructive and i worry i hate that shit. It's like battery acid and i worry i worry that the attitude like billy's father will have a place to thrive and grow on the island and i i think the next big battle for fan burn will really be the battle of the sexes in a way i think in <hes> in part i agree with you. I i kind of see fen burn hanging on very true to its identity as a matriarch easy. <hes> i think it will be less you you know. Rulers and more of a democracy will spring forth is kind of where i see this going <hes> i do think that it's good that they have have some of the modern things of the mainland come in they need to lose a little bit of the dogma they do and you know i love offend burn but they gotta loosen up on that stuff and it needs to be less about faction versus faction versus faction and i think the people offend burn need to stay strong to not be absorbed by mainland or culture and i'd like to see some people from fen burn going to live on the mainland in some mainlanders is come into live on fan. Burn you know like who's ideologies kind of match. We can kind of cross pollinate and get these this open kind of like how billy the and are gonna do like. We need to share the good sides of both locations. I think there will be a bit of a battle for the sexes. X.'s thing going on but i i'm a little bit more optimistic than you because i think that fen bernas gonna teach the mainlanders a thing or two. That's what's the other opportunity. That's the other side of the coin is my most optimistic. Take is maybe the missed wasn't keeping the mainland <music> out. Maybe the mist was keeping the gifts the goddess in condensed maybe the missed being gone means the the magic doc both literally and figuratively of fen burn can now propagate yes into the mainland. We talked to ken dara last last year about you know how this all started with bees for her yarn. I'm seeing this is like our little pollinators going out into the world and pulsating over here and they can send some pollinators for their and we'll we'll cross. Pollinate and lakers can really work. I have a prediction that should can dara right other books in this this universe these stories are put to bed but i would save this gonna if any fend burn adjacent things were going to keep going because she wrote to great eight novellas. That are the first ones about the queen's and they're little so. It's kind of not really beth queens so she can. There's a lot of subject material in this this universe i would like this to be in the future not contemporary but in the future where amelia controls his daughter is lake kind of the president prime minister of fen burn and she's he's trying to stay out of the bad politics like maybe this'll be like like world war two kind of is happening on the mainland and she's trying to keep lake the poison out of fen burn while also leading fend burn have some modernity my prediction but the magic's gotta gotta stay out of flurries and we gotta get the we gotta get them. We've got to preach the gospel of the goddess out there to these lame mainlanders. I'll i just say this. I for myself hope that can dr rights many many more novellas and books that take place in bern. I don't care if it takes place as before the events of the future yeah. I hope that she writes just oodles noodles. I also hope that she feels when she feels done with and burn iron that she's able to walk away from it will still love you. We're still going to read everything else you ever right girlfriend. It's it's so beautiful as it is and it's so meaningful aw and i don't ever i hope that she never feels like she has to dip back into this. Well just because just to make us happy and it will make us happy every single time we will be pleased every single time we'll read every single one will love it it. We can't even really be. We can't even give reviews future. Fen burn books if they exist because at this point all of objectivity is out yeah. It's just going to be a love love-fest. Love fest straight up. I guess let's kind of give our final little thing here before we go cry going cry in the corner about about this series i giving score to this book and the conclusion or giving our score to the series. Give it to the series as a whole. Okay mm socialist kind of kind of wrap this up now. We hope there will be more infant burned. Were open to it. We'd love it but let's act as right now. As if this is can at the end of offend burn. I have sung the praises of this book since before we had podcast. That's when i read the first one i loved it so much. I told scott qadri this book. I told them you've got to read this at told my friend molly got rebus and they all read it and they've all loved. It and it's taken up a huge space in our lives. This book means a lot to us as we said it means a lot to me you know kind of a i'm i follow kind of a goddess worshipping path ish in my life spiritually and so i really like seeing that in books books. That's kind of like you know kind of where i am so i really like seeing that reflection. I loved the darkness the brutality the the horror of this dark fantasy. It's dripping delicious decadent dark fantasy. I loved the humor in it. I loved the way her characters are so tied into the natural and the supernatural world in their way of lives <hes>. I've loved devouring every piece of this rich history. She's written for this world and i mean in this series. I've found an author that a chest admire her work so much and dan. I mean she's she's beyond instant by like i mean anything she writes. I'm just gonna devour love every book as much as i love every book but it's okay because i trust her opinion in her words so much and for a reader there's nothing better than to have have that relationship with books that it makes it so hard to say goodbye and i know in my heart and in my mind these characters are alive and well. They're living in this alternate universe. They're doing just fine and everything's going swimmingly. I intend to completely read these books throughout my entire life boom. That's it mic drop score their screw it well i mean it's if i know it's ours. It's ten stars. It's fades five dark fate stars. I agree wow no i i i try to learn more about feminism and women everyday i i will always be growing with that. I will always be learning a new experiences and trying to understand more and can dara is the first author that i've read that really spoke to me and and made me think about feminism in a genre related i in a way that relates to me. These books don't just about women. They're not just for women there relatable to everyone and they're meaningful and their powerful because of it on top of that all of that. It's just a rippin good series. It's great story. It's incredibly inventive. There's really nothing else quite like it out there we we we made comparisons when we first read three dr crowns to the hunger games to a number of different print stories and it's and it's actually different and surpasses all of those things. It's a beautiful series. It's a brilliant set of characters. I written by a brilliant author. It's it is is in the f. is in the top echelon of fantasy novels and series i've ever ever read and i'm really sad to see it go. There's gonna be a lot of tears shed from series but it still is so worth it. It's that love that you invest in a series like this is just totally worth it and that's what makes you a bookworm. You know brooke. Hangovers are real. Y'all i'm gonna china. The good thing is is that there's no rest for the wicked and we got to keep on keeping on because we gotta show to produce we got people and we got books and we gotta keep it going so we're going to you know going to cry into our beers for a little bit and pick ourselves up by our bootstraps uh-huh and somehow go on after this all right so in conclusion thank you to everybody who's been on this journey with these books with us. There's an awesome mm community of sands out there for the series <hes>. I'm so glad that it's done so well in his so beloved. It's very well earned and and member two year part and if you know anybody that hasn't read these books. Please encourage them to to give them a try and 'and help us spread the good word and just keep this <hes> keep conductors work flourishing and getting to new hands and thank you can dara for being so wonderful to your fans so wonderful to us <hes> joining us twice on the show. There tends to charm you you are you are a treasure to our community and we appreciate you and thank you all right. Everybody encourage you to crawl into abed hide away from the world. Cuddle your cuddle your cougar claw back and forth hugging your legs sobbing your cougar your rooster you're snake named sweetheart which by the way sweetheart the true unsung hero of the story to you mean well yes well. The spirit sweetheart remains keep the spirit of sweetheart and anger life every day all year long yeah all year long. Thank you guys and please keep reading pass ship at time nine <music>.

queen arsenault queen mirabella John junkies oracle broncos sandra scott seattle editor johnny junkies fen burn dara blake tori harry potter katharina peter edgar allan poe amanda lake lake buji
92 | Fantasy | Circe by Madeline Miller

Genre Junkies | Book Reviews

42:15 min | 4 months ago

92 | Fantasy | Circe by Madeline Miller

"Weirdo book worms unite. We want to share our love of genre fiction with you. Some readers out there may look down on your for your love of horror sci fi and fantasy but not us so. Stop by as we discuss. What we've been reading i- jonah junkies at sandra and this is scott our back with another book review and i'm very proud to present the title this week because this is my birthday we be birthday. Thank you everyone scott. Being everyone kind of cat is cheering and the snake is cheering. I was really really excited to pick this book Surprisingly not a horror book for my birthday but you know we do love our fantasy and this was just really really calling to me to be read and to be discussed and sometimes you just gotta listen to that intuition especially rennert. Yeah so this week we are going to be talking about sursee by madeline miller And of course. I know there's different ways to pronounce her see. We're going with certainty. Because that's the way i learned it. And that's the way like as much as i tried to do different pronunciations. I just can't make it stick. I've heard searcy as well. Yeah yeah hard for me to say goodbye. That's what i know. He s silla view done or watched anything cool or read. Anything played anything that you want to share with the papers. I mean actually yeah. I guess we're just not gonna talk about the fact that we didn't review a book and the entire month about that though. Yeah absolutely yes. I have actually I've been playing a game from two thousand sixteen twenty seventeen called horizon zero dawn older. It's been out for a while. It came out at the same time as a breath of the wild zelda. Actually and i've owned it since then. And i have never played it until now. That game is so good. It's like a scifi fantasy. Mix up with like you know spiritualism as well as a giant robots it's post apocalyptic is post apocalyptic. Yeah it's kind of post post apocalyptic back so many apocalypse feels like twenty twenty right. I'm changing but the game has beautiful. The story is fantastic ashley. Birch vote acting as the main character is outstanding. And even sandra overhearing noticed another voice actor in there. My god is my beloved. My beloved pup legba american horror story. And i'm like i know emit twenty paces. It's papa legba. I thought i thought it was probably. Oh okay that makes sense. I thought that it was touch faciliate. It's hard to keep up with all of my colt boyfriend fiction. That's fair that's very fair. Now i just and they even animated it to look like him to look like the actor too and it was very like. Oh my god. That's like totes him. Yeah it's really. It's a really good game. I highly recommend it if you have the opportunity to play it on a ps four or the brand new ps five. If you've got your hands on one of them has not please send him one. Please send me one of those xbox. i'll settle for either one. Let's see i've been keeping busy watching stuff for the coal show and for spooky summer party a little bit trying to think if there's anything a particular that i haven't haven't yeah well i can say that i'm coming up on the colts show episode. Which is of course podcasts. A youtube channel that we're going to be doing my birthday celebration and talking about the eighties. Classic or film waxwork which is one of my favorite eighties horror movies. It's like it's high up there It's so funny it's so silly. It's weird and quirky and it kind of embraces that about itself but it actually has some really cool gore and make up. Yeah so is really fun to talk about that movie. I've loved since. I was a young teen and then it also has like some really over roddick scenes as well. I couldn't believe that it's been fourteen years fifteen years and i just saw this movie for the first time. You just showed it to me for the for. I don't know why i didn't think about. There's so many movies that you still have to see. I don't like i saw this recently. I certainly think to like invite him in on it. I i don't know. I don't know someone helped me anyway. So very excited. I think personally birthdays or something to be celebrated. I love celebrating other people's birthdays with them too because Being alive is a gift and aging is a gift that not everybody gets and unfortunately in scary time. Slake pandemic were really reminded of that sending. It's really important to to celebrate those milestones your trip around the sun. I really appreciate that optimism and positivity. Why do you think you know. This is good about birthdays fund. Thirty cake fun thirty case. I miss things that like are from like the early nineties like our child had birthdays. Like fun feddie cake. Balloons remember balloons before we all realized how horrible blades helium anymore will end. There is none. And i mean just the the balloon itself. I mean you eat them wherever dopp like there's so many things like man that ignorance was bliss. I wish someone could make a permanent mylar balloon. One with absolutely no leaks whatsoever and you could just keep your helium balloon forever. Yes and not have to feel guilty and then you just get buried with it or burned with to send me. Send me up into the sky. When i look like some of things that i really liked. That are plastic. And like i just stare at them. Sometimes and i'm like yeah. I think i've got with me when i die because otherwise this pisa plastics is going to travel the earth for forty million years lay. That's the twenty first century version of a of a mummy in. Its pyramid me with all my plastic. I'm sorry just. I'm sorry i'll just take it with me. I'll just nobody else's to worry about it. I'm just gonna take it okay. Let's talk about this wonderful wonderful novel spoiler alert. I'm calling it wonderful wonderful. And that would be by madeline miller in the house of helius. God of the sun and mightiest said the titans. A daughter is born but sir is a strange child. Not powerful like her father nor viciously alerting. Her mother turning to the world of mortals for companionship. She discovers that she does possess power. The power witchcraft which can transform rivals into monsters and menace the gods themselves. I call even at that. I'm gonna leave it at that but we're gonna talk a little bit more about the plot as we go but basically what you need to know about this novel is it is a rea- machination Miller did you some source materials But it's a reimagined nation of this character from greek mythology this goddess. Sursee who. I believe they stayed in here. Is like one of the first accounts in lake western civilization of witchcraft which is like so freaking cool and about her life and because she pops up in a lot of those you know a lot of those old stories the odyssey in like that and i was surprised by how much i remembered about those stories when reading this book. Okay well maybe we'll talk a little bit more about that in a minute. We'll we'll put a pin in that Let me just say my experience reading. This book was an absolute unabashed obsession. I coming as no surprise to me. Yeah i i absolutely adored it. I am a huge huge fan of greek mythology. It means a lot to me. I hold very dear to my heart. Maybe i'll say my my sursee story. For the spoiler section make people make people stay around for it. But ever since i was like a gosh may be in fourth grade and i read dual aries book of greek myth for the first time which is a beautiful book of greek myths. Pretty watered down for kids and beautifully illustrated and it just like set my heart on fire with falling in love with this pantheon. So i and then her writing is astounding. This book is incredibly well written. And i just loved the way that crc's just in entire like the wait her thought process and the way that she moves through life as it were. I'm this book was a good read. And i want to clarify what i mean by that. this was like stepping into a cool shower on a sweltering hot day. This was like this is like a specific. This is like a hot chocolate on a winter. Snow it was just like so soothing and friendly and calming and lovely that it just. I didn't want it to end. Because it just it soothes the soul. Yes and that's why. I'm calling it a good read. It was just just so nice. I think i get what you're saying in the last like hundred pages was really hard for me to face and then like the last seventy pages and then the last thirty pages you know. Because i really didn't want the story to end and i was so so emotionally invested in it that it was like painful to like end but you know at the same time. It's like half to know how it ends. Yeah this is a reread book for shell. My god absolutely. This will be reread many times many times for me and something that i find really nice about this book as well as the chapters are set up in such a way where i feel like i could just read a chapter. Sometimes i want to read about this point in her life. Yes yes yes yes. It's not setup where each chapter is. Its own book. It's not like that but each chapter is kind of its own period. If that makes sense right. And i yeah and i think it's you know it's kind of like bolts mythology right where you're like. There's these stories and these lessons or whatever and for these immortal beings that are live for you know in the story thousands of years and so yeah it is kind of naturally like this is when sir c does this thing or meets that person and Miller has this beautiful way of taking those connections of what we know about sursee and her family and other myths and stuff and you know bringing all these other beloved characters from greek mythology into the story. It's really really cool. It's almost like you reading it. You're getting so excited about who's gonna cut. He's gonna come by next. It's rare that. I read a book that has such an alien experience like this as well. There's lots of books were where the characters are very. You know abnormal have strange strange desires and designs. But it's very rare with the whole experience. The whole idea of how life is lived in how they think is so alien from us and this really captures that that experience of what it would be like to be immortal. Yeah i think so too. I think As far as a lot of other things. i've read that have a similar vibe. Her interpretation is very different and is very unique. Of course it being me. I got a lot of shades and a lot of feelings of aunt and rice. Oh because anytime something is just the salaciously beautiful descriptive painter lee words set in a period and especially about you know magical beings like. That's obviously like that's going to feel very an to me. But at the same time like balance totally her own person like totally her own writer. These these guys are their own characters to Gosh me if you have any If you have any knowledge of roman or greek mythology some of these stories are going to be very familiar. But they're told that is very personal and from the perspective of searcy and it really brings a lot of these characters that you know about their adventures and you know about their you know their conquests and and their defeats in a totally different light. Yes i totally totally see that. And i agree. Previous was especially poignant and her meeting him happens early in the book when she's still Like a kid basically didn't explain exactly how god's age but i think it takes like it takes a couple thousand years before you even get like a year older. I don't know exactly what i mean. It goes by in in like a different. They measure in a different passage of time than we do. So there's not really a way. I think we can equate it. There isn't and that's that kind of comes into some of the the alias of it in a lot of respects. It's also it's kind of presented where you're never really a child like you are but then suddenly you're not you're not way and that's kind of true two different mythologies as well But yeah i liked all of the different inter weavings of meeting these characters and seeing it through servcies gays. Because she's not like her family she is not like the other gods and titans and but she's not like totally like a mortal either she. She's very much kind of touching all these different worlds and it's really. The novel is about her finding her place in the scheme of things but Yeah i think seeing prometheus through is really set a tone for me with this book of like. Oh i see what we're doing here all right. I think we're going to give our appeal score. And then hop over to the spoiler section. So this novel is very popular was number one new york times bestseller and is very beloved. This is one hundred percent an absolute mass-appeal without question. Yeah no it's not going to work for every single person who tries it on but it is. It is a mass appeal because it has such beautiful poignant things to say about life it has everything in it hasn't venture it has romance scary stuff a little. Yeah yeah and and at the end of the day it's very philosophical which. I think really sell greek. Hell agree. I think that that appeals. To a lot of people to is a philosophy that's presented in stories such as this cool. I'm glad i'm glad we we agree on that. So we're going to dissect the novel a little bit more and i will tell you all uae. I love searcy enjoying the show. Please like in subscribe online tools. You can find us on twitter and instagram at john junkies and don't forget to visit the website john ritter junkies dot com. Okay welcome back to the spoiler section birthday addition. So you said you had a story for all of us about your experiences with syria. I do and this is a little a little corny but bear with me. So i i mentioned how greek mythology is something very near and dear to my heart Greco roman culture ancient greco roman. culture is. huge to me is something. I love and hold very dearly on so many different levels You may or may not know. I have vinnie. V the v chief which is of course roman caesar augustus tattooed on my arm. I got it after. I did my first half marathon And now i'm not saying i agree with everything. The man did or all the policies of ancient greek in greece and rome. But it's always been something that i have really strongly identified and felt called to so most of us have a unit or two in high school and middle school where you learn about greek mythology because that stuff is very important to the world of literature and storytelling and then to philosophy and stuff as well so i already went into my eighth grade unit knowing quite a lot because i was already so into it for many years at that point and we did this thing where everybody like in the entire eighth grade practically like got assigned a character from greek mythology and it was Not quite like a pageant but like you were assigned that character and you had to research them and you had to like towel like the story if them to the class. Amanda my sister. Of course it's on the show a lot back when it was. She's a few years older than me couple years back when she did. They actually did a pageant where they had like to dress up and they had to like be characteristic ren fest and like they have little boobs in games and like your family and friends come. And i was really bummed that we didn't do it that way but anyway so when i was in eighth grade i was a horrible time to be alive forever for everyone. I mean there's times in that middle school age that is just. It's it's most people you talk to you. It's like yeah that was awful. That was awful And i'm no exception. And it was really bad. And i was really really struggling and i didn't even know how to say i was struggling and i was very different than the other children and in my english class. I had no friends. No friends and i have friends but none of them were in. That class with me and i was teased because i was different. You know weird. Little greenwich goth kid very bookish and it was very very hard for me and my teacher assigned me searcy for my character. Learn about and she said that searcy is like this feminist icon. She's a very powerful. Which he woman who you know can like owns a lot of her power and her sensuality and you know like her confidence and stuff and i was like obviously she probably gave me that character for a reason and so i was so excited to learn about her and i really fell in love with her and Earlier this year. I found a company called common era An outpost a picture on instagram and tag them and they make these beautiful sustainable Pieces of jewelry that depict different goddesses especially from the greco roman pantheon and other i know i don other cool jewelry like for fem identifying people and they're made very ethically and you know responsibly and there was a little quiz where it was like. Oh which you know which one matches your personality like for fun. And i didn't know much about the company it was like well. I love every greek goddess person. So i'll just take it. And i got sursee. I didn't even know she was an option. And i they are not cheap. These are really nice pieces of jewelry. But i had some money set aside and they take payments and i was items is not an advertisement. It's not come out. And i told scott i have a have to have this. This and i were a lot so sursee came preloaded to me this novel as like it would have to be really bad for me to not like it. But i'm so happy for this to be my birthday episode. And that i get to share this with you guys this character that i love so much and getting to see her really in this light and getting to have so much of the spotlight so i'm curious since we're in the spoiler section. I wanna talk about the parts of this. That i did not have a frame of reference for and i'm curious if this was a 'cause you know a little bit more than i do my knowledge of searcy. I mean it was fairly light but was pretty much from Pretty much from odysseus. And then i felt like i remember it a couple of other things about about her son. That maybe Maybe it was presented differently in the book. That i maybe remembering correctly. Or maybe miss remembering. But i don't remember a lot of the stuff from the beginning is that is their stuff in there that have been written in some of those lessons or yes so okay let me kind of explain it and this is actually something i have to refer to madeline miller for this because she's a better person at Wording if then. I she had four major sources for this. She had homer's odyssey which covered thursay's meeting with their dishes. She heads ovid's Metamorphosis which gave the love triangle with sir seek glucose and skill appalachia of roads are godiva which provided the jason a media episode and the lost epic of telephony which we have only in summary so she took kind of these pieces and wove allot and she took some things that homer said about the dread goddess who speaks like immortal which has searcy and she kind of literally moving my hand she wold this tapestry so it was kind of like there was crumbs there for hard to follow and she she fleshed it out because it's a beautiful story it all of the myths and all of the characters coming together is seamless to me. Be right because you have a character that is set on a deserted island for the most part and that is a fricken challenge for a writer and yet somehow she manages to have a full character arc as alien as it is because she's starting from from just complete ignorance of the world. Yeah and yeah and what she wants and she should even want. Oh absolutely i totally agree and you know the relationship she has with her family really really sets the tone from the beginning of how different she is than them And like i said in the first part this is really her struggle to find herself and to not be living for anyone but herself and finding that okay. She's not like the olympians. She's not like the titans. She's not like the mortals and you know kind of finding all of the the good things the pros and cons about all of those races. There was some fun things. I told you. I laughed out loud. When i i read when her siblings are kind of all scattering to the wins and purses says something they give like. I hear they have these things called demons. I think i'd like to see one. It just made me like. I don't know just one of those trivial funny things that god would say like that. I love love love. There's an honest feel to this book too. Which is ominous to put it really. It's a new word for me. You never heard the word ominous. That's what you believe in everything. Okay this week. I believe everything and i don't mean that a bad way and that's a simplified way of putting it but it's like you can believe that multiple divinities pantheon. Some things can exist at one. Time which i think is really cool. Lot of My fellow witches and practitioners are ominous. And there's actually even a point when when they refer to one of brothers. I believe falling in love with a with an ethiopian ethiopian. God i think it was. yeah They talk about a little bit of that. Like with The and they're talking about the gods in the north and like you know kind of this. I mean it's basically the or boris. A snake devour its tail. And they're they're making a like you know Norse counteract prince and stuff but yeah and then there's like these people over here that are working with demons egyptians and all this stuff and i love this idea ellen. Later in the book to when they travel there under the like basically going under these other pantheon's who have no idea about her. And i love that. So much that like all of these pantheon's are just existing simultaneously and things are so unchangeable in their realm. You know but it's like there's world's going on around you but they're all just kind of blind to it you know. It's very centric. Wore a specially with the gods who are so selfish. Like those they're very self-centered they care about their own little world and their own little existence and care very little for anything else as they manipulate you so like the way they come like. Oh no it surprised how much the mortar will beg but you can. You can absolutely understand where if all of the other pantheon's exists. Why they don't even really care to even talk about them like not important to them. They're they're moving their own little pollens across the board. I have to say. I was completely delighted with the betrayal of athena was great loved her so much. Hermes is a favourite god of mine. And you know he's he's not painted in the best light in this. But that's okay i mean they're you know one of the points is that these infernal beings are neither good nor evil. They have a lot of selfishness but there they do their win said they do what they wanna do. But i really did enjoy the portrayal of hermes a lot because a lot of fun and like i said prometheus was really huge to me. Because i mean i i like the concept of a permit paean figure that gives knowledge to the people. You know like a lucifer. Burien sort of like vied and that she gave him comfort and sustenance. It was her it was. It was her first act of defiance. Even though she didn't recognize it as such yes she. She excused herself as being. Okay yeah but but it was her first act of defiance her first a moment of becoming her own person. Absolutely i mean. There's her interaction with him shapes her entire experience. Right it's really. It's really really beautiful passage. That's revisited bit throughout the novel This is such a beautiful beautiful feminist taxed to and so so many ways Dealing with sexual assault was so i feel powerfully and gracefully handled. I agree as we discussed just a few weeks ago. That is a trigger for me. Yeah i feel that it was triggering in this book in a way it was so what i what i appreciate about. Is it something that happened. And she did do things because it happened. Yes but it was not a point in her character progression. It didn't shape who she was. I think i see what you mean. And there's always something about taking a trauma and using it like a lot of people really identify these days with medusa for some of the same reasons of you know kind of like she had to you know get done or be victimized by men and I think that. That's you know like i had to learn that the with these mortals that she has a lot of fascination and love for their. They're not to be fully trusted. And you have to keep your guard. You have to know when to know when the whole of no win the fold. You know what i mean so i told you i knew who your favorite character was in this book that he and i make my prediction. I would like to hear your prediction. Data lewis okay. You're right. i really wasn't sure who you referring to. At that point. I wanted more data louis. There wasn't a lot of data data. He was gray was a really great. I consider him to be true. Love in this book. I agree guardless of what happened at the end which was was beautiful and nice and she she she lived her mortal life yet but i feel like was her one true love. I agree and i think it was because they were too beans. That really needed each other when they found each other and had a connection without any pretense They were really can equals yes. Yeah and he was so he was presented so lovingly as this incredibly brilliant engineer a hardworking person a good person but valuable. Yeah and i was like oh. This just has scott just dripping off of it you know. I'm not even interested in making fabric. And i want that loom i i actually. I do wanna loom wanted one for a while Wear put it so yet. But i want a little in. This did not help. Speaking of the loom yes I wanna talk about the things that she had on her island in her house in her garden. This was my favorite by far depiction of a witch ever in a story. It's so real. It's very cottage core in like this is so scottish. Oh yes but you. I could picture her like garden on the side of her cabin. And i wanted to be out there pulling weeds with her making america making pharmacopoeia. I learned a lot of new words. That i didn't realize were of greek origin. In this black so cool. I mean i know. A lot of our language is of greek origin. But it's so interesting. How much of our language is pretty much directly greek. I think it's probably farmer k. To again i don't. I'll never actually how to pronounce the pharmacy pharma k. Like the there's actually like four or five different. Yes ways ways to say whether it was plural or was what it was referring to. It's just really interesting. I agree this is a great depiction of a wedge somebody working with nature and you know kind of really good league. It's witchcraft is a raft worked at and practice upon and I think this was such a beautiful depiction of that and working with the land and the animals and having a hard balance and as a witch myself i thought it was like for grandma witch like perfect she's describing it perfectly and she passed it on which was one of my favorites who another woman which is so important. She passed on to another woman who had the ability to pass it onto others as well. Yes i love the idea lake. She said you know if you get lonely just told the gods to send the bad because i liked sursee had that role She she disliked the entire time he wasn't built for no but it was a good. It was a good device. Gave me a lot to think about about why a girl would be sent there and that is because they are obstinate and headstrong basically and so. It's kind of light and so like penelope's along more geared towards dealing with that vibe. But i like the idea of. It's like yeah because you're bad ass fem. You gotta go here also love anything. That doesn't have abraham ick homophobic shaming. There was a little bit of talk of achilles because marlin miller wrote a book about achilles. And we'll her son is gay and like that people have different lovers and stuff. And i just love that so much because it's normalizing i from what i understand. It was pretty normalized in greek culture. Yes greet roman culture many other many other cultures you know and it's really cool and important to you say this is necessarily in in my interpretation like gay literature but it is nice to have that reminder of that normalization that actually reminds me. Did you get. Did you get a little bit of the hint that her son might be gay. At the end of the book he tells me is what i got is well. He didn't want to have children and he had his his bodyguard. Who was with him all the time. I wasn't sure if i was reading too much into that. Or he's one of the references to a few different people with same gender lovers in the book who i hate that word lover but there's no blue whether way to put it one passage that i thought was very interesting and it's related to. This was the mentor. That the miniature made me giggle a lot because we'll scott torres and we talk about like the he's the minute or sometimes so it was kind of your hands so it was kind of like i was like really kind of projecting little creature on the scott. A said. it's like you know my love of monsters. I was like. Oh they it. I really. I have trouble pronouncing her siblings names. Yes but her sister. The mother of the miniature. Say sure i. There's very little swear words in this book. But i like how when she was talking to searcy like that was the most like colloquial conversation was like she was she was throwing the f bomb and like she's in the throes of breath mandatory still. It's very it was important. Yeah mortals in. The book had much more of a hottie. Talk to them. Then the immortals did yeah they they were really just more like like s saying things without all of the pretext. I found that interesting. Very poignant all voice. All of very poignant her relationships with her sibling and of course. That's a big turning point in the way. She views her sister. You know a lot to be said about family about parents about found family about cutting out toxic people from your life of course i was. You know i knew where. It was going with glucose but i was like this guy after all she did for you. Any friends zoolander in the end so not cool. Even though he's candidate awesome octopus creature. I the way that he was described. It made me very sad that his true self was just so self centered and yeah but then again that is. She was unique amongst the gods. Yeah it turns you into like your opposite when you use like the m- the moly it doesn't turn you into the opposite. That's one of the things i liked about it. It really was a true self sort of thing. I guess when. I say your opposite is that makes you divine if you're not divine and well he meant if you are divine as she takes it And i think that was you know as a journey to get her to that point to deciding to be immortal and all the wonderful. I didn't ecstasy. That comes with mortality. And kind of like you know. Because she'd been so it's this transformative thing to take this substance and i made these monsters and i did you know i made these gods and all of this stuff and it's like really at her heart. She wanted to be true to herself so then she becomes judah herself when she takes it. Very poignant it is so poignant madeline miller wright fifty million more books this absolutely fabulous story. Absolutely fabulously done beautiful. I i want to like i. Don i i have never read through all of the odyssey one go. I don't want to now. I want to read this. I want this to be my my my true experience. And the way i think of you stories i love it. Read the odyssey. That's wonderful but i is. A lot is a lot anyway. I'm so so happy. I read the spoke. This book is just so poignant and powerful and beloved to me now. One hundred percent hundred and ten percent. I don't know what to give it out of ten out of ten pigs. I wouldn't change a thing about it. I found it incredibly. Poignant an every time. I reread it. I know i'm going to take more and more away from it and have more and more to think about. I am also giving it ten out of ten pigs. fill the sti-. This is a beautiful perfect book. This is going to be a re read is going to be one of those rare rereads. Like i said i will just pick up and read a chapter just to let it wash over me because it's it's a very very good book. I'd love it. Thank you guys so much for celebrating my birthday with me. Happy birthday to you. Happy unbirthday to you Thank you scott. Thank you sandra. Happy birthday oh thanks everyone. Please keep reading pasture bedtime off

madeline miller searcy rennert papa legba scott dopp forty million years house of helius sandra Sursee sir c Miller titans Little greenwich jonah fourteen years thursay Birch colts fifteen years
69 | Sci-Fi | Sleeping Giants by Sylvain Neuvel

Genre Junkies | Book Reviews

35:35 min | 1 year ago

69 | Sci-Fi | Sleeping Giants by Sylvain Neuvel

"Weirdo Book Worms Unite. We want to share our love of genre fiction with you some MHM readers out there may look down on you for your love of horror sci fi and fantasy but not us so stop by as we discuss. What we've been reading? Johner junkies at Sandra. This Scott got stitches year to alone says thank you to everybody who gave for some well wishes as a few weeks ago when she was sick and she's all better now. He seems to be doing much much better. Yeah she had to have her medicine. She's all all good just here overseeing the podcast odd cast per usual. Hey you know. Wells was sick. That would be Scott. Hanson this episode is a weekly. It was it was real bad. y'All it was really. I had no voice I had no energy was really on a massive insane ear infection Kenneth Out of nowhere but yeah and then like yeah no voice voice and it was just. It was a whole thing sell you know. Sometimes the start of the year can be a little rough. This is one of those times. One of those times was a long ear. And Gal. We've been a little remiss in lake our social media posting and like telling everybody what's coming up up so we were going to get better at that again but I can tell you right now after this book. Were doing a some women in horror staff off for February which is very very exciting. We're doing a compilation called strange women. And that was kind of mostly composed by I assure a knox and that's going to be a fun little horror short story collection by. I think they're all women authors or at least Mostly Yeah I don't know. I think they're all women authors though are believe they are yes yes yes yes that'd be fantastic and then after that. We have the babysitters coven. And that's going to be a crossover event. With one of my other shows those bookie slumber party there's GonNa be so many of yes and then and we also The cold show another one of my shows where doing some limited hor month stuff too. So there's just there's so much so much awesomeness for women in horror and you know the Jonah Junkies. We like to participate so because I am a woman in horror and I am married to a woman in horror. He lives a pretty horrifying in life. So tonight we're talking about it's fiction science fiction pretty hard core science fiction. A novel cold old sleeping giants. This is the first of a trilogy from the famous files and it's written by Sylvan. Neuville who is a will this whole trilogy. I should say is really popular. It's been read by many many many people. It is a pretty well regarded. Did pretty well loved science fiction trilogy not older anything but recent Sifi stuff and it is told through a series of interviews. It's one of those. That's non traditional format. It's similar in some respects to World War Z.. Yeah he kind of from one perspective in a way well. It's not from one perspective. No but it's it's it's more because all the characters get interviewing even in this is like their interviews yes it's definitely about multiple characters but it's compiled from one perspective whereas World War Z.. Reads more like a a Like a smattering of different stories. Right and this is actually lake in the blurb. It's like if you're a fan of Michael CRICHTON World War Z.. And the Martian Shen. Then you'll like this. So that's that's pretty exciting stuff in one of the reasons this company this series has been on my radar for long long time. And I've always thought Scott would enjoy this but especially once. I saw that blurb in those are like a few of his favorite things right there I was like okay. I think we gotta try this so I'm going to read you guys the description again. This is sleeping giants but one of the themes files. A girl named rose. Rose is writing her new bike near her home. In deadwood South Dakota when she falls through the earth she wakes up at the bottom of a square hole. It's walls glowing with intricate carvings things but the firemen who come to save her peer down upon something even stranger a little girl in the palm of a giant metal hand. Seventeen years later the mystery history of the bizarre artifact remains unsolved its origins architects and purpose. Unknown it's carbon. Dating defies belief military reports are redacted theories or floated then rejected but some can never stop searching for answers. Rose Franklin is now a highly trained physicist leading a top secret team to crack the hands code and along with her her colleagues. She is being interviewed by nameless interrogator. He's power and purview or is enigmatic as the providence of the relic. What is clear is that rose? In her compatriots are on the edge of unraveling history's most perplexing discovery and figuring out what it portends for humanity but once the piece of the puzzle in place will the result proved to be an instrument instrument of lasting peace or weapon of mass destruction. So it's interesting the it doesn't really go into details on the hand is so I guess we should be careful with our non spoiler section discussing what what the hand leads to. Yeah okay so we'll kind of dance around that I think from the description like you kinda get in the something a giant metal hand but we'll we'll keep it vague so first of all One of our friends one of my really good friends. Molly is from South Dakota. So Hey South Dakota deadwood yes she says like awesome awesome I wonder if all of all y'all in South Dakota big fans of this book specially around that area so yes so let's just kind of right off the bat talk about our our scores on this so I felt I found this book to be a good read. I really enjoyed did it. I found myself coming back to it fairly easily. It wasn't it wasn't a page Turner. It wasn't something I just absolutely couldn't put it down but I really enjoyed the writing in the the the decision that was made in in the styling of the book I really enjoyed it. So here's the thing I'm I'm I'm in good re too but I would say there was parts of it that were page Turner. I wouldn't say it was just a solidly good read I would say it's kind of in between those two. Yeah of course you're going to like certain people's perspectives more than other people's that does happen in any sort of like multi perspective book but there is some just really cool things about how this book was written. So that's GONNA be Kinda my my my launching doing my launching into that if you don't mind launch your way launch away off so as we mentioned this book is told through a series of interviews views. And it's really interesting because we've had lengthy discussions on this show about how Scott and I are really care to driven readers and and I was very nervous like how is this going to be character-driven when it's kind of Almost exposition and lake. How how is this all going to work? And like with the plot and for this being a not traditionally character driven narrative. You still get a lot of character stuff and really distinctive voices an ear characters and kind of an interesting intimacy with them an insight into them but also just a lot of cool plot staff and I think that in the hands of a less skilled writer this entire structure would have been horrible. So this is I really Commend Nouvelle for his style and his execution education. Well what the author does to bring you the characters and actually bring you that that feeling of them into the story is it's actually two different types. Yeah well it's there there's three. There's three different types of X. Positional story types in the book. There's the classic interview between the Project Project leader and these different characters. There's confessionals that are basically transcriptions of things that the characters are putting into their own personal diaries stories and then there's also X. Positional reports that are written by Organizations about what has happened. And that's and and that's the part that's a little bit drier to give you some setting but the combination of both the confessional and interviewed as a really good job of of bringing you into the the struggles in the personal thoughts of the characters I think that's a really really good way of putting it cell. I was overall overall very pleased with the characters and the development of this. Of course the story. And the mystery of what their unraveling and you know these this absolutely insane. Gene scientific discovery that is rewriting humankind and has these far reaching. Oh just huge concept things that are being put on humanity and making us change as a culture and making religions have to adapt to this artifact and so so much It's interesting that some of the characters voices were still just really Gosh I can't think of a great word for it but just you did feel a connection connection and it felt humble even with all the really big stuff going on. I wasn't crazy about one male characters perspective. which is it's actually not a huge one in the book And I didn't really care for him and that was me. I mean the characters not super likable but he was the only one that at times felt that it was a little male Gezi. I know what you're talking about. And he is not a great character. Yeah but at the same time from a male perspective he is somewhat relatable and so I I totally don't I don't disagree at all that he's not like a like a like a fabulous character but at the same time supposed to. Yeah but but at the same time. He's not he's not gross. He's not he's not all that assuras and he is. He is somewhat relatable from a male perspective. Okay I appreciate that. Yeah he was the only one that like that kind of took coming out of the story at times and made me roll my eyes and be like you know like just let sound and again the rolling of the eyes you You can probably hear my is willing from space during some things. This character said but there's other meals perspective. That did not do that. And I. I really enjoyed the female characters in this book. I really enjoyed how rose and Kara are like super different. And you can tell when you're reading it those are humane female perspectives. We get and that was really cool. Because they have their own way of talking and thinking and reacting and it didn't it didn't feel copy paster Easter. Anything like that. You agree I do agree. I I like the female perspective in this book. Probably more than any male except for possibly the project director. Although I'm not sure do they is it. Explicitly stated the project director is male. Yes okay he is my favorite character. The the interrogator easily I love him. He is so funny and so ambiguous so true to his motives and and you love him and you hate him and he's funny. He's my favorite for sure. He's he's kind of a actually. Here's a fun game. Who would you cast as as the project director? Who did you visualize as the project director? I don't know if I really have like a person person but it would be light. Light White cisgender like early sixties male soaring Cox. Sure are we saw. Anthony Cox non descript White Dude who works for the government that has a lot going on under the surface. I would. I'd say this is as far as appeal. I would say this is pretty. Mass appeal this book. I don't know if I'll join you on that but I'm curious why you feel that way I I think that it's you know we kind of finally me. Shes in pockets in genres. And I feel like this is a really cool concept. Talk and it's one of those words like if you're new to Sifi it's not super intimidating and you don't feel stupid because some of the characters in the book are not scientists and so like they have to put things in legally layman's terms which I appreciate because when things get to science he SCIENC- Mumbo jumbo we words. I get turned off but at the same time. If you've read a lot of science fiction this is still this is still gonNa let me some kind of novel and I think the interesting perspective would get a lot of readers who read any type of genre any type of fiction to be like. Oh this is kind of different way to tell a story. I agree with you that this is incredibly approachable science fiction and for and for that for that reason. Yeah I think it appeals to a much broader audience. Which is why I'm going to give it a broad appeal The concept itself is very common within a knee eash it's not a unique idea and it takes two. Oh yeah and it takes an idea and and broadens it and makes it more approachable. But there's a specificity city to what is happening and why it's happening. That's missing from the book that I feel still keeps it in a range that is not going to be widely widely accepted by the masses. Interesting interesting I guess everybody's just GonNa have to read for themselves and see what they think i. I think we've got to go to the spoilers so we can talk about this artifact and get down get down to it all right. We'll see all in the spoiler section enjoying the show. Please lake and subscribe on Itunes. You can find us on twitter and Instagram at John. Ritter Junkies and don't forget to visit the website John Junkies Dot Com. Welcome back to this player. Section this is Sandra and I want I want to tell you something about our friends. Scott here Scott loves MEX- loves thanks. I don't know why I just swore on the show and then I had to do it again. I'm GonNa have myself at yourself. Don't edit it because all bleep deeper. He is passionate you guys because not only discussed just love a giant robot any day of the week but when people are inside piloting it and Kristin if if I'm wrong but I think especially tandem pilots situation that's a newer concept but this becomes just catnip for Scott Catnip and I love God. Don't get me wrong. I love Max I love Jain robots. I'm all about this life but I was just like. Oh this is so like Scott like porn right now this okay. So this is what I really appreciated about this book and I wanted to talk about this in the spoiler free section but I just after after we read had that description again. I didn't feel like doing it. This book is Neon Genesis Evangelium on me. It's Pacific Rim But written in a style that is That is more World War Z.. I appreciate that. It's interesting because a lot of these concepts for someone who's coming out this. Who is a big fan of mech fiction? There is not a lot of originality to the story or to the setting church share There's a lot of very you know very very off done themes in this. What is unique is the style in which it's written and I really did enjoy? Ah I I love Max. He loves them he really loves the merely does. Is this Kinda Kinda Gunda me to not not really calm film millier with gun them about Lehtonen jug no no the other one they go EXO exa force Yes yes so exa force and okay. We'll go into this excellent touches. A little bit is is a is. The man man made a war machine style of Max where the military or an independent organization has created robots in order order to fight in wars in. There are pilots who are often times. have conflicted emotions about being pilots of these Max Giulini Society and then the other side is these Mex- were created by someone else. I typically aliens are or in the case of neon on Neon Genesis. Even Kellyanne spoiler alert. Lor Aliens in this falls into that category much more. It does not appear that these were made by humans. These were made by a by an alien race. Oh definitely leaving a whole story about it and their motives are still still not quite unclear. There's questions there is A. There's a legend that he tells about how they were there to protect us originally and they were left behind. But it's it's not actually clear that that is really whites there. I took that to be pretty clear. Oh I read too much fiction to take that for face value on the first. There's book of a trilogy. I mean. Obviously there's GonNa be moored uncover. Yes because we know now for absolute certainty. We're you're not alone in the universe so obviously and we're as the Guy Kinda says his second meeting with the interrogator well he kind of got on their radar a little bit now so we can expect a visit. I'm thinking thanks. Mom and dad are gonNA come home. The the idea in the book of how they find these and how they're activated which is from the side effects of nuclear. Study is really ingenious. That was really cool and that was again some of that as I said Mumbo Jumbo language that I'm intimidates me but it was at the same time I was like. Okay okay. I'm with you. I'm understanding I don't feel stupid. I get what we're saying. This is cool. I feel like there's this. This is one of those science fiction books were there are little things of of real slightly deeper science in there for the people in the know to go. Oh yeah I know but does a really but but doesn't that knowledge is not required of you know but okay. Mr Mr Mech SNOB over here. Have you ever had one where the lake AAC pilot had to have little goldies. That's a new one. That is a new one and that was not expected. I love that whole little side trip up down mad science. And that whole let the the Guy GonNA performance and all of this. That was like one of the most page. Turney parts of the book luck for me because it was like this is in the sanity. I mean there are. There are stories where the pilot does have to go through usually quite a a mental transformation if not physical to has a physical toll on the body. This is the first one where where the pilot unknowingly willingly willingly undergoes a medical a medical transformation to change his biology completely so that his sneeze bend backwards. I mean he didn't really have anything to lose. No I mean I guess he could've died. MAYBE THEY WANNA lend die though. But anyway no Vincent I like it's Ryan in case you can tell annoyed me and I. I'm glad that his storyline comes around to redemptive arc and I was really rooting for him in those moments when they go to save car and everything I was totally fine with all of that but yeah she it just ooh he just annoyed with the Jesus enemy. I I really like Vincent. I thought he was very funny in very interesting. It's funny you say that because I I thought Vincent was fine. He didn't offend me at all. I never really found him interesting. Realizing find anything about his character. That really drew me in. In fact I don't really like the two of them together at all but you know I do. Because they're so different. I appreciate that. Yeah I just he. There's there's there's things about him that comes off as fairly cold to me and Seattle and a little bit disconnected which I don't really love in my a male romantic leads. Yeah and that's just me. That's fine yeah I identified more with Ryan even though he is kind of a Dick. Well I like I said I really liked car and I really liked Dr rose but the thing that I liked about then senator card together is that they were so different and I like that You know she trained him because she's the one that you know has been in the military and has like this athletic training training and it's like yeah you're super genius. But she's got a lake. Get him into the physical shape. The power dynamic is refreshing. Yeah definitely really refreshing. And I admired his determination to get on this level. I found it like yeah. Come on Little Vincent Johnson You keep going you keep going man. I really appreciated that. And that he was so like game with like Benny his legs back. And then you know after Denver when it's like okay. Well he's got a real long beer now and he just paints models makes them interrogators gets impressive but then when he says you. You don't understand all of this stuff. He's been doing on whose retreat was to make him be better and worthy of this project. That was really really cool character. Stop it was like when he reveals that. It's like a sentence and it's like wow a whole lot of insight in should this man's mind just like summed up in like a few words like if you blink or you weren't being an astute reader you have missed it But I love that that all of them are so dedicated and obsessed with this project. Because how could you not be. Oh it's it's one of a kind. It's other worldly and of course I love love the moral questions that they're forced to face. And that you know we as the reader and the interrogator and the members of the government and everything or like okay. Hey you can't make an omelet without breaking some eggs for eggs are human lives very like you said a lot of the time I'm the MEC. Fiction gets into like some like psychological stuff and suddenly morality things very much and I feel like the story is going more towards the direction of especially in the second book I feel I can be more psychological based like what are the. What are the psychological problems that come along with holding this kind of power and being responsible for this kind of power and being the only ones who can use that power? Oh Yeah I have a part highlighted here and This had to have been from. Rose I mean giving a lot of thought to Oppenheimer in the Manhattan project these past few days I. It's kind of the same same thing of like okay so not only do we. Now know that basically we're not alone in the universe where not even sort of the most intelligent legit things in the universe. Something is kind of keeping tabs on us and we are part of a narrative that we have no written history and a and a shaky oral history of at best. And how do we all fit into this and what are going to be. The repercussions of our science has advanced advanced. To the point where we can find the robot build it get into the thing and now it's like okay. This is huge like and the book kind end of builds towards that in all its ways. That's like this is us as earth coming together and it can't be about you know ethnicity or language quit or politics orders. No this is us as a planet and I really appreciate that that planet centric message MHM that spoke to my heart a lot. 'cause I'm a huge fan of earth. Totally my favorite planet. It's the best. It's the easiest one tariff on them That wasn't going to be like on my list of why it's my favorite planet. But you know that's that's good to probably start tear forming earth before you go to Mars. Oh My Lourdes love that. The robots a female yes. I'm curious did you. Read the snippet from book to at the end of this book. Didn't I did not thought I restrained myself. I read his knowledge moments and then I was like okay. I'm GonNa stop there because I let me just put it this way. I I need to know how this trilogy Jat. Yeah we'll be reading these. Yeah why what did you feel why what happened in slip in the very beginning. The very first thing that happens in the snippet for the second book is suddenly a male robot appears no Yup Yup Yup Yup Yup. I I come from. How did you disappear? He literally just appears. Oh my God like in the middle of one. I think that just just all of a sudden these there. There's some stuff and this is all theorising now because again we've not read the other two books yet but let's just use that as a launching point. Talk about rose. Yeah there's some I think it was his back roses back but she doesn't remember anything that happened from her. Starting the project kind of fourth this dimension. Let's happen thing here where I mean. I don't know if maybe I feel like when I was like okay is she. Some sort of clone was she she abducted and then replaced. But I'm getting more more of a more of a Being being placed outside of time and then coming back kind of a vibe almost like for her safety yes was removed. That's that's kind of the kind of the the the field that I'm getting. Yes and ultimately I. I think that that's the if I had a complaint about this book it's that it really did feel you like a whole lot of setup for ideas and questions that they're that that's going to be gotten into in the second in the third book it's a first in a series fine. Yeah it's just I in and I think that this goes towards it. Being more of a broad mass appeal book where a lot of the a lot of the ideas that are introduced in in this book are ones that are very well known to those of us who are into Max and Max stories where now I feel like it's going to go into more of a unique direction right. It definitely got me hooked. But I'm excited. I'm excited for more original ideas in the second in the third book. Yeah so I think kind of on the same page especially where roses concerned see. My thing is I love. I books in series. And I love being peppered Hubbard with questions and confusion and ambiguity. It's very exciting for me and I'm totally fine with. Just keep my brain not knowing what's going on enthrone all the questions at me but I think you and I are on the same page. Something about rose here for protection. Maybe what's removed but at the same time. I think she's going to get those memories back. I think it's again you know just because we are humans maybe that technology of moving through space time name still has some kinks to be ironed out. Our brains aren't quite where they should be speaking of which well we. We don't know all the story of the oral history story but I loved those scenes in the Chinese restaurant. Yes okay what was that characters name. He said. Call Mr Berg Mr Burns. Because he has a burn phase. Yeah I pictured Alfred Molina by the way Oh sure. Why just kind of describe him like I? It's it's refreshing to have this character of the project director who is seemingly all knowing all places at once and here's his character comes along who's just completely just throws him for a loop and throws him on the back foot is just really nice to see. Yeah he's five steps ahead as he says he plans for every eventuality but there is no way he or by proxy as the reader could have been prepared haired for that occurrence in story. I think that I think that this gentleman is part of some sort of Colts Colt old secret society. He's we're kind of being led to believe that perhaps he's one of those descendants and that you know he's got some alien in blood and him and that's been lake past down this way. We're sort of Kirk Cara and anybody that can pilot it yet. But like we're they've really They never lost the through line of the story and whatnot Speaking of the interrogator who he loves so much. It's always really Nice Lake. You see him being this absolute sociopathic asshole but then he also has a heart and I found that so wonderful that he has different layers to him like bat. I love a character. That's really really complicated. and not good or bad. But he's just all about this mission and like favorite kind of Sherlock Holmes in like as he's going through and being so far have everybody is the end of the book talking about Dr Under pump and Tonio and how they've basically set this woman up. Oh Oh my God. She's just she's going to live the the rest of her life in prison. Basically Bush because she's she's talk about sociopath she she just wants power so badly. Almost more megalomaniac maybe maybe I don't even get the I. I don't even get the feeling that it's the power that she wants. She just wants the knowledge she wants to the progress soon. And she's just like the credit and she doesn't see she doesn't see people as people she describes it up the huskies. That was his big talk when she talks about doing experiments puppies that was his realization. It's like insane. You like literally puppies puppies the example. Okay we're going to get ready you. Even though he is so calculating he's like you are not the right type of person to have this calculating leading mind he's compartmentalized but he's still human. Yeah that comes through in in in a few points of the story and you can tell how much he really we love Kara. Yes and like yeah. He's just really like They have a kindred nece to them in a way and they have some great banter. Sure between the two of them but so so good I really. I really think I'm going to be happy with the rest of this. This trilogy is certainly very merry happy with I buck should we give it A. Let's give her our final score. They give this book for robot hands hands out of five for all the reasons we've been talking about. I think it's smart. It's clever it took me. By surprise how much I liked it and how easy it was for me to get into the nontraditional storytelling and how Palezzo surprised at how much characters stuff I was able to absorb and Dan just like this really really cool world that is our world and adjust expanded and it just blows my mind cause this type of stuff ELP is true. I'm going to give this three robot hands out of five. I think it's a really good introduction to the MEC world and the MEK MEK ideas I think think that there's some there's a lot of originality when it comes to the writing style But not a lot of regionality when it comes to the ideas that are presented when you look look at it from a MEK perspective I guess you have to have a little bit of a harsher grade. 'cause you're the mechanism I'm scoring it as someone who is familiar with with Max. I think it's a three out of five and I think that's a great score. I I really do it. Just so happens. We review very many books. That that we would score under three rebe but this you know three is very good score especially for this and I feel I had this. I have the suspicion that the rest of the series is just going to be going. You know going going up from here and I'm very excited for it and I'm here for it. This was a book that required a set up a little bit of a world building sort of situation and it did that with APLOMB APLOMB. That's a great word aplomb not a plum which are which are delicious aplomb. It's it's really fun now stuck in my head. You know how words could send your head plum plum aplomb since looking at me like I've lost my my plum mind all right. Everybody ready to take a tiny little break from the world is Scifi to get into the world world of women in horror. I know y'all are just down for that. It's going to be good times all times. Yeah Scott thank you for weighing in with your MAC criticism you. You're welcome. Thank you Sandra for discovering this series and bringing it to it because I am very happy that I've read it. Yeah all right right everybody. Please keep reading pasture at time.

Scott Catnip Max director Vincent Johnson South Dakota Turner Sandra Ryan Kenneth Out Rose Franklin Hanson Wells Neuville Michael CRICHTON APLOMB APLOMB MEC twitter mad science
88 | Horror | Maggies Grave by David Sodergren

Genre Junkies | Book Reviews

38:23 min | 6 months ago

88 | Horror | Maggies Grave by David Sodergren

"Weirdo bookworms unite we want to share our love of genre Fiction with you some readers out there may look down on me for your love of horror sci-fi and fantasy, but not us. So stop by as we discuss what we've been reading. Hi genre. Junkies. Happy Halloween. Happy Halloween. Spooky October. Woohoo! Best time of the year. Thank you for joining us yet again for another scary episode where we're really into the thick of it. Now of of Halloween season, this is wonderful and very happy things are looking up. We're not on fire water. Yeah, and we have so many exciting books to talk about this spooky October month. Oh, we really do suck. You know, I don't have a whole lot of fun spooky things to share with you right now. I've been doing a lot of re watches for the Colts show, but I will say I watched a good movie on the shutter Channel called spiral. It's a shudder original highly recommended. It's very smart has social commentary pretty creepy wage. Diversity it is definitely Chandra junkies approved. I think I think is that the one that I walked in on you watching? Yes. Yes, that did look very good. I'd love to watch it again. So that's my review it off. Really good. Good. Well tonight. We are very very honored and excited to present you with a book review from r d e r friend David's Otakon and don't worry just cuz he's our friend if we didn't like his book, we would find a nice way to say it. But I mean that is assuming that we like the book that is assuming that we like the book. But anyway, I just didn't want anybody think like Boris Boris. The Pug is not paying us under the table on David's behalf for a positive review. Jonah junkies cannot be bought. Well, we can be bought with with pug kisses we can yeah, if a pug was like willing to come visit us get on a plane from Scotland and like home Deliver us a book think we would give it a good review no matter what we'd certainly give a good review to the Pug. Yes. The book was terrible but this pug, oh my God manners of a saint. Oh, by the way, I guess we should say sweetheart is doing great adjusting nicely. We play peek-a-boo from the time we get to hang out a little bit and he's eating he's being a very good boy doing lots of spores and snuggles and we're very honored that Cathy Blake was honored that sounds weird to say but she was so happy when we posted about sweetheart and you know, of course she wrote his namesake so and right now he's holding cables together right now for our show is doing a great job just being a little cable tie until he can promote up to some other technology work in the studio. All right, let's get into it. Maggie's grave a horror novel by David sadhukhan the small Scottish town of aachen Milan is dead and has been for years. It's it's in the shadow of a mountain forgotten and birth. Roofing in the Perpetual Gloom 47 residents are all that remain. There's nothing to do there. Nothing to see except for a solitary grave near the top of the mountain Maggie wall buried here as a witch wage needs The Faded inscription, but sometimes the dead don't stay buried especially when they have unfinished business and that's where we'll leave you in the description that sprung said there's just some blurbs and stuff to which I I I'm excited. Let's talk about it. Let's do it. And so I want to point out first and foremost David explains that this is based on a real monument in Scotland real grave, you know, there's there's definitely differences and they don't really know where it came from but there's a real grave that stands that that says Maggie burned here as a witch. Yeah, Maggie wall and that's he includes a picture of it actually at the end of the novel so very very dead. Mysterious sad interesting and as somebody who loves to read or write you could just see that monument and your imagination just runs wild. So, we're big fans of David's Auto Grand here. We've said that we've reviewed all his books and we've liked all his books loved all his books is more active adored Edward off. He's fabulous. I've said it once I will say it again. He writes horror books for people who love horror every single one is a love letter to horror fans doubles in different sub-genres always expertly and with a very Deft hand and very Deft understanding for that sub-genre having loved all of his books. I have to say Maggie's grave is my favorite. It is my favorite to date. It is my favorite. I love folk or and I love everything about this poem. I have to agree with you. I mean, it's it's not a secret that you and I are absolute David Sauter grandstands. Yeah, but this book is Just A step above and and and and that is incredible for how much we love his other. Yes from the very first two sentences of the book right to the very end. I was absolutely obsessed with this novel which would be my experience score pure Obsession. I have to say my my personal experience reading this was absolutely Obsession Obsession with my favorite David Sauter green book to date and that is saying something that is hard to do because I feel like you know, I I go back and forth so much on which of his books are my favorites. But with this one for me is the one to beat is the one to top this'll this'll be the one to top. It's only downhill from here David write books that cater directly to them. And will be fine. I don't want to clarify we do consider David to be a friend. We met him through this show with you know, Instagram first page and then and then we reviewed his first book but we've had him on the show so many times we're so sorry David that we didn't have time to get you on this one. It's a bummer but we we love him so much and we love his books so much. Yeah and support, you know authors like David that need your support. We got to help spread the word for our dog died hard wonderful writers in the horror Community. Can we talk about the cover? Yes, the return of the what I consider the David Sauter didn't come out for yes. I know what you mean. Yeah. I mean, I loved the cover for his last book as well and absolutely fit the theme but there's just something about that that that cultish imagery wage. That he that he has on his covers. That's just it's like retro but yeah, it's retro. There's a rustic nastu it. Yeah, it just brings its parts Joy spurts. It's joyful. Yes, totally agree. Welcome back cover. I am definitely huge into folklore. It's a favorite game genre of mine. And this is it's just a beautiful exploration of that. It's not only creepy with this wonderful, you know, kind of woman scorned folk hero not hero those very very bad. It does bad things. But then it's also got these great young adults characters. I think they're 19 in the book Nineteen Ninety Nine somewhere around there and they're just kind of coming into their own in this weird Port sucky town of aachen Millan dead. And trying to figure out their lives and there's so much humor in this book to not only is it absolutely disgusting Liguori. Like there's just blood and broken bones oozing out of every page but it is legit hilarious. It's very funny right less so funny and considering, you know, David has a penchant for the the the absolutely horrendous and pokes fun at it in such a refreshing way in this novel. Oh, there's always some humor Gallows humor some dark humor to be found in his books and this certainly is but it also is like it's not only those deliciously fun little dark humor moments. There's some lulls like there's some lulls. Absolutely. Yeah and you stop saying legit, but well, I'm Too Legit to Quit. Okay. So first of all, this book very much has you know a folk song. Or theme that's what it's built on and that's what really like dug its nails into me right from the get-go. It's a really fun story of these, you know, young adults kind of walk in this Ghost Town coming to grips with the fact that there may be some sort of evil curse. But all of that is actually kind of a sneaky way to lead you into the horrifying things that happen. Yeah. I mean there are scenes in this book that are there living rent-free in my head. Oh, absolutely. I have a very clear picture of of Maggie of the the quote unquote which and it's so funny because she's kind of comedic looking in my head because she's something like you see her and she doesn't quite make sense. Like she doesn't quite add up and that's to the benefit wage. She needs to be this imposing otherworldly figure but she is also still humanoid. Yeah, so I agree and and and she is described in a very creepy horrifying way. But in the spoiler section, yes, I'm going to tell you what the what what the funny image that came to my head of a little bit of one too. I think it might be the exact same that would be hilarious the color it might be exactly. I don't know. I don't know so I'm curious cuz this book, you know, like I said really rides a line between full Courtney and just horrendous body horror. What was what did you kind of lean towards more in this book? What what really grabbed you well, I mean, I love both. I love that David Moss is generally very gory in his writing and so descriptively. So there's like like there's a little like bone crunchy sort of thing. I mean, there's plenty of juice. Of fluid but it's a lot. It's a crunchy one. I think for me it it is more folk Horry because there's this girl legend and this story and you know kind of this ancestral lineage. So for me, it's it's David's take on folklore. Yes, and I want to say first of all the folklore is definitely what what grabbed me but if the bone crunchiness was the worse most horrifying moments, it would be a pretty tame as tame book. Okay. David has a level of depraved creativity. Yes. I may never be able to recover from it's very very unique and the the best way that I can encapsulate it is when I say that he is dead. Is writing Love Letters to horror fans because he is such a horror fan because we do like the depravity but there's always substance and there's always a dressing takes and originality that you know, even the most jaded of us can pick up and be like, oh that is a new take on that. I like that. Yeah, but how about your appeal score for this? Okay. I am going for the second episode in a row have kind of a surprising appeal score for a book that's horrifying and I'm gon not give it General appeal. That is my appeal as well. You know when it gets gruesome it gets real gruesome. And those those are definitely for the the the the horror initiated if you will, yes, but it puts that in there as just as strong moments to a a birth. Cocktail history story that I actually think will will appeal to a much broader audience than just horror fans. I see totally what you mean. Yeah, and I mean I'm kind of I pick up a lot of that very much the same I think that people especially this time of year that don't normally read horror horror or scary things. You know, they want something horrible their radar. This is a totally good suggestion. I mean, yeah, it's definitely more for the horror initiate than the word obvious. But at the same time I think some of those themes some of the humor some of just the interesting World building that he's done. I think it would appeal to a lot of readers but just where fans however do not say we didn't warn you if you want to be scared and Disturbed and grossed out. You've come to the right place. You've come to Maggie's grave. Yeah. Yep. Well, we are going to give you a trigger warning at the beginning of the spoiler section, but I'll write I think we're going to pop into the spoiler section. I cannot wait to talk about and because and if you've read it will see you there or you can also join us in here that trigger warning that we want you to be aware of see you soon off enjoying the show, please like And subscribe on iTunes. You can find us on Twitter and Instagram at John Young and don't forget to visit the website genre Junkies. Welcome back genres. Junkies. This is the spoiler section for Maggie's grave. So we did promise you a concept of earning Please be aware that this book does depict some sexual assault and we just want our readers to know that going in. Yes on with the show. Okay. Let's just start with a list of Maggie's description then yeah. Okay. Okay, so and I mean this with the highest praise, this is one of the things my I painted her as she remember the cartoon Rugrats on Nickelodeon off. I do you remember Angelica? I do remember her dolls Cynthia my God, I do Cynthia. She has this like she has these big guys with like a tiny little people down and like, you know, they just kind of stare and then she has all this crazy hair like clumps and strands of hair just sticking out. Maggie wall kept leaning towards very Cynthia Vibes for me off. Okay, we did not have the same thing in mind you are correct. Any way that I should clarify my mind wanted to paint her that way and I cut being like that's very funny and that is part of it but also very birch tree because that was something he said a couple of times which I'm a huge fan of birch trees and so I could really see that and kind of almost like a mummified. Yeah. Yeah. So so the imagery that I got from from Maggie for you know from his actual writing and for the majority of the book was really like the kind of imagery that you find in Pan's Labyrinth that kind of like nature slash slash like creepies horrifying imagery, but the point in the book when when her abdomen is actually described and from then on I had this this little bit of an image of in my head from a movie. I just watched for the phone number. First time very recently and that would be mother from Dead Alive. Oh my God, I guarantee you David has seen that movie and David made that connection because there was absolutely that kind of theme of like wait 1 trailer is get in my belly sort of yes, when fear is the big mother monster towards the end. That way you'll see practical effect that those folks made. I totally get that. I totally can pick that up which you know in Dead Alive, it's it's hilarious and yet still horrifying thought so and so when that popped into my head, I it did make me laugh. Oh my God, does that mean that Eric is the baby from Dead Alive? I think so. Yeah like God just wish wage. If you haven't seen Dead Alive you you must it's a classic. That's what Peter Jackson was doing before Hobbits. I digress so mag. First of all, I guess since this is the spoiler section. We should just go all-in. I adored Maggie. I loved her so much. Of course, as you know, a horror fan we often do have a lot of empathy and sympathy for the villain for the quote unquote monster. And Maggie is a perfect example of that. I mean she does these grotesque or horrifying things, but it's like something Beyond terrible was done to her and at the hands of these so-called good people. So that makes you say you really care about her and then especially at the end of the book when she touches Eric so gently and lays him down as it says so motherly is it's like it just rips your heart out because she really just wants her child. Yeah, and opening this book with the actual death of Maggie was a brilliant stroke. Absolutely because that's immediately planted in your mind from the beginning of wage. What this lovely woman has gone through she is not even technically a witch in the way that you know, we would think of a which he's a cunning woman and age, you know, that is definitely the type of woman that the ignorant humans turned on at that time was to live her Cottage corelife live in that Cottage, but she's making tinctures. She's doing her thing growing her own vegetables. Yeah off the land when she's ready. No, man, she's different and that scares people and that especially when she becomes pregnant by a prominent person in the village then you know, he really had to lead the hysteria to make sure that that illegitimate child didn't get born. Yeah. It's just so unfair the the victimization and the humiliation she indoors. There's something that kept coming to mind for me about wage. Going going deep going deep as I like to do about, you know inheritance and sins of ancestors type of thing off today in America as we record this it is indigenous people's day, which is also unfortunately still known as in Columbus Day of all things and there is they, you know, like in the many other nations, there's blood on the hands of those who quote-unquote discovered and colonized this place where people are already freaking living wage. So you can't really discover and move into a place where there was already people and there's so much of that when we think about these things these days about you know, what people who came before us did that now, you know, we're still suffering the repercussions of that as a staunch environmentalist to you know, I think about that a lot. With global warming and the things we do to our planet and it's like, you know, these these horrible Deeds of those who come before us, you know, the the bill comes due at the end and it's a generational way of paying for things even when you didn't do it. You're still stuck with it, you know, absolutely I mean wage. Yes, the the town did completely fall apart eventually, but you know people these families stayed in this town they continue to profit off of the land they continued to walk and even 34 years prior. They all did it again. So, I mean, it's not even just Generations that time is forgotten. It's been a continuing process what I found really fascinating and and and hilarious especially the way that it's created is that you have these this group of of birth. Jin's yeah who who, you know kill a witch and their their children's children as children are now doing these bastardized a cultist of God rituals to keep away the witch. Yeah. It's like who was thought up that idea because pervert dude because I don't I thought she seemed okay that orgy scene is like the best thing it is. Okay know the best thing is the thing is what comes right after the origins. Yeah. Well, it's like who who's idea? Okay. Yeah the way to get rid of the the the which is we're just all going to have a mass orgy then sacrifice that is that is not a thing. That is not a birthday do it's got together and they're like, this is perfect. It's probably those first group of guys to be honest the kilter describes like all of the different sexual wage. In the middle of oh my God, first of all, no, no no the funniest the funniest part is James Blunt You're Beautiful. Yes, and the fact that they have these yoga mats out on the phone and he gave them a stimulant in the apple juice to loosen them all up a little bit. It's so absurd. It's just it's absolutely absurd and that of cake is Marvin Gaye's you're my first last whatever plays after but nothing is funnier than James Blunt You're Beautiful cuz that song is such like a just I know I thought someone it came out and it's a curse. The song has occurred image imagery of James Blunt buying in the background while and what specifically specifically comes to my mind of, you know, a woman being dead. What what do they call it? Like like like on a spit? He called it spit roasting a woman thing spit-roasted on the stage and another woman has man's wage. Member in her mouth everything. I mean everything is just like hilarious do it and the one is like, you know, I'm too old for this is like now you're gonna do it. Yeah, and then oh speaking of too old for this mr. Lamb who tried to escape but he really obviously in his heart knew that there was no Escape. Yeah, and he did try to save them which I appreciate dirty. Larry was hilarious such a difference from America and our law enforcement just seeing their police. I mean, they're police, you know, I know a lot of people have issues with policing the world over but it was just very funny like it was cops don't have guns. What batons was actually it was kind of weird for This American Life to to picture that it's like the first time I watched the British Law and Order was the same thing when that first started. I don't believe they had guns. Yeah, and it's like wow. And then the fact that they all made fun of Larry for having one. Yes, when in the fact that like this kind of story written in the US there would be a lot more guns involved in it, but most likely I mean not out in the middle of nowhere pretty much everyone would probably be armed. It's very possible in in America. That's very possible. I mean there is literally forty seven people wage, which does make it all even more hilarious what but going back to to the townspeople that you know past the mass orgy wage mass murder manslaughter was one of the okay read it like I am not a huge horror person and and like exactly I I enjoy some horror but reading that scene. I feel like I felt for the first time that that Glee that big horror fans like you said, Have you know watching or reading horror movies? Absolutely, and I think that that's just Amplified by the fact that these people have sacrificed wage a baby at least one baby in the past and they're about to sacrifice Alice and her baby and they're so like just resolved about it. There was like one person that felt bath and that just makes it even more like, oh just kill kill them all and just in the most creative and and yes horrifying way own especially the ones that are like, you know, like going over the top of each other to get out of the way. It's like my God, they really just want to save themselves at any cost. Don't they get a Maggie get in there girl, although I have to say this is a word this this is this is a phrase that I would never go over in the US and and maybe doesn't go over in Scotland either. But but I really that realistic no no, I've heard that before. No I highlighted because yep. He likes Piquant for some reason. I don't know why it got me. I mean, it's pretty funny. It is pretty is pretty funny to be calling this eighty year old woman is Becky cont. Yeah. I mean I know over there are friends across the pond they they use konta lot differently than we do not everybody is a part of it. I I understand over there but they use it definitely different than we do. So I think reading it is like kind of like it's like kind of like foreboding. Well, this was also the first book that I've read by David that from the very beginning every sentence with the exception of one character. I read in a Scottish accent. It's very it's it's dripping with it and you can't get away from it. Not only because there's like the foki legend, but you know, they just keep referencing talking Milan and like how wage A dumb and the sucky it is and like you really get the sense of this is a forgotten almost ghost Scottish town and he really leans into the song playing and he leans into the just the language and I really loved that. I really did cuz it's very contemporary. It's young people characters. Also David, you know Wheel of Life references and Easter eggs, highly approve of Spring-heeled Jack. That is a Cryptid that I love. I'm very familiar with and I appreciated Springhill Jack being home in this book, even you know, as a bowling alley. Yeah, I think Springhill Jack would like that very much. I loved that character as well. So I loved him. I mean his death was horrific Lee Epic. Yeah. So now going to 2 we're going to go up in levels as far as horrific deaths and and and Jack would be would be the next one up from New Jersey. Entire town dying that that hurts me that hurt David that physically hurt because it's a combination of both of like all sensible. Yes, you have you have just the the feeling of pain of of imagining that happening to me and then you have you have like her slipping and falling in the blood. Yeah, and you have the smells that you can just imagine and just sounds in the David. Why do you do this to me? Why do you do this off your hand if you've ever been personally victimized by David's. Again, my hand is raised really inventive. Yes, and and that one also was like horribly disgusting. But but so creative that that I just I like thinking about it now, I smile a little yeah because it is so crazy. If that's it, exactly I don't know if we're kind of skipping around or how we're doing this but my favorite death is 100% Courtney's death. Okay, so this would be so yeah. Oh definitely going in escalating levels of death. This would be this takes the cake. I have never read anything like so not only is there the Primal Fear of most penis owners of something grabbing your penis and not letting go. Okay. It's a thing. I know it's a thing. Okay small spoiler alert for American Gods the scene where someone is eating by someone's vagina was the point when I actually put that book down and I'm a little embarrassed to say that everybody. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. It's a brilliant book this month having literally like a hand inside of France grabbing and pulling him in. Yes, and then him putting two hands inside of her to try and get it to let God. Oh and then it tearing off is the most is the worst thing I've ever read. It's the worst and happiness tearing up. I'm sorry, that's just say it. It's like hilarious the whole thing and and and he threw in some really great humor end of that scene as well to to keep it light which I appreciate when again I also wasn't exactly sure what was grabbing him. So it was very much like what's it there? I didn't know if it was like a route from the grave. I didn't know but now it's just two hands and then she just like pops out of Courtney like a ripping. Well, yeah because okay. So that's the horrible thing for men. Yeah. That's the horrible thing for men. Yeah, but then what happens next she comes rip-roaring out of there. Yeah. Yeah. She's her in Twain. Yeah from her between me down there. Yeah, it's hilarious dead. And also horrifying but it's hilarious because you're like no no this can't be happening. So he managed in one chapter to do home buying things to both penises and vaginas. Yes, and to the people that own them. Oh it was so so good David so she goes and so funny and then that's the same that I mean is is living rent-free in my head. Yes, by the way, and it just imagining Imagining the split open desiccated corpse of Courtney. I have such a visual for that. I've heard a stepping out of her like a pair of pants. It's brilliant. It's brilliant how she was kind of possessing Courtney beforehand cuz my mom was like seeing the glean of someone else and then yeah, and then she just had to physically emerge through it. It's like I've always loved a good werewolf transformation. This was like that type of ten. Yeah. It was it's similar to that type of werewolf trans. Were you like shedding? Yes a suit a meat suit, you said. Oh well done David. Well, well well done. So I really want to just talk for a second about the brilliant twists. That is the End of This Book. Yeah. So you really think you've got it figured out you really think you've got it Beth snaps. She finally snaps. She's like just take off. Make this baby take it and you're kind of like your little bummed to see it. But that was a possibility that she could snap. Right certainly if that was still a Twist though. And then of course the bigger twist is that the baby is inside of her. No wonder Maggie was relentless and her pursue love baths. Yep. It had it had nothing to do with Alice. Yeah, those stupid townspeople were going to sacrifice Alison her baby. Well, the same thing would have happened. She would have said not my baby. Hm. Yeah. Wow. Yeah and also townspeople if what she wants is a baby. Oh, that's why would you get another thing? Why would you kill the baby? I mean if you're already going to kill the baby? Why don't you just give her the baby? Why are you all going to Blinky Chupa all night? We sat her a baby we've settled on that that is like something that students originated for no reason. Absolutely. I am agree. I I am I settled that first thought Ring that I guess they feel it's like they're better than Maggie. So it's like if they kill the baby it's because they're they're kind of better than her. That's what I take away from it. Yeah, you know what actually come to think of it it? Okay. I'm actually thinking even more I I might know where David's inspiration for that idea might have come from but I already got a little bit of it vibes from the story. Yes. Yeah, you know and this is happening starting 85 and is it happening? You know twenty thirty five years later God Saga. Yeah. I mean that is kind that is how they escaped when they were children from it in the book is basically kind of it's complicated but having a little bit of a of a orgy situation, I think that might be where he got a little bit of the inspiration for this. Well, that's what worked last time so I'm back. So we all have to do that again. I I could see that I think that I think it was what do you call it? Some opportunistic dudes taking advantage, but you're actually I'm just I I wonder if maybe that's where he grabbed a little bit of his inspiration talk to us today that tell us tell us what happened. Dang it. We should I wish I wish we had the time to interview for you this for this. Well, well, we'll Reach Out separately. Yes. We'll Reach Out separately. Yeah. I mean I'm kind of at the end of my rope here. I feel a split open as Courtney or or off or even bath long-lived Maggie wall long. May she Reign I left her so so so much I forgive her for all the bad stuff. She did some you're good in my book Maggie and thank you David for writing this fun novel with such twists and turns and discuss but a.m. Lots of heart and gave us lots of things to think about as well. All right. I mean, it's almost a little gilding the Lily I'm giving it ten birch trees wage to say like, obviously my my favorite of the books he's written and I love all his work. So ten out of ten. I am going to also give this book ten bowling pins out of ten. It is a strike strike. No, no, no spares here. This book was just gleefully horrifically. Well done another month a great accomplishment David. Sorry to put the pressure on you. But when you're this good of a writer we expect big things my man every time and thus far we have not been disappointed. You are worthy. You are worthy, sir. Thank you all for joining us. I hope you all were as equally delighted and disgusted by Maggie's grave as we were. We will see you very very soon. For more horror filled fun in this jam-packed month of October the high. Holy season. Thank you Scott. Thank you Sandra. Please keep reading past your bedtime. off

David Maggie wall Courtney Scotland David Sauter Instagram US America David sadhukhan Boris Boris Colts Cathy Blake David Moss aachen Milan James Blunt Nickelodeon Nineteen Ninety Peter Jackson
062 | Horror | Unbury Carol by Josh Malerman

Genre Junkies | Book Reviews

44:47 min | 1 year ago

062 | Horror | Unbury Carol by Josh Malerman

"Weirdo bookworm unite. We want to share our love of genre fiction with you leaders out there may look down on you for your love of horror sci fi and fantasy but not us so stop by as we discuss what we've been reading and it's just real it's not a high budget film which I often really like so yes I'm getting ready to watch the interesting I don't know if it's really up my alley I think it might scare Scott too much but thus far I'm really enjoying it and of course I don't watch anything Canal Herman but before we get into that we'll have our little round table discussion Scott what things have you been taking in and slumber party and that's going just amazingly I have been watching some horror movies that seem before one of them was live 'cause I can't manage to do that but I'm like recording and like storing up the episodes and it's like about this lady skeptic it gives me like X. files vibes right effective yeah no it was really fun to see it on the big screen and the sound was redone and it was actually like a revamped soundtrack as well it was like it was a whole rush which I love and it's got a lot of like people be talking or there's something that's not the main focus of the shot but there's like something creepy behind them you've got some other scary shows to catch up on I started watching a show that's on. CBS called Evil Have you guys heard of this show it looks really experiencing we went and saw the evil dead on the big screen yes the original evil dead it was the first time I'd seen the first one I've seen the second one it was really loud yeah and we went and saw that for the Colt show series which is akin to the cult show rocks that one of the other the thing is demonic possession or a miracle or something else that the Vatican should throw its weight and money presumably and it's for like podcasts slash youtube shoe shoes youtube shows that I do so don't forget to look me up and to find that and of course I also have the spooky it's like it's found footage which I know isn't for everybody I kind of found footage it really doesn't bother me and sometimes I really really like it and this one has it's kind of like slow burn the evenings but it's been like in the high eighties and it's nonsense is it's nonsense to warm and now they're talking about turning off power again so we're looking forward to that I'm pretty sure and I've definitely seen rem darkness a million times but this is the first time I really saw that that terribly Corny but actually scary movie it's faith second one which again I've seen before and then the third one which is new so that is pretty exciting I'm a shutter exclusive right I believe so yes and then time of the year it's depressingly hot here in California where we are and it was nice because it felt like fall for a while and it kind of does which I love so she's a skeptic and she's a forensic psychologist and she's teaming up with this guy who is a what you WanNa Call Exact Hell House Llc Franchise and recent really rewatch the first one because I remembered how it ended but I didn't remember anything in it and it's league he's like an assessor for the Vatican and then there's another dude on their team that does like the tech staff and they basically go out on these calls for the Vatican to see wins it's fine it's fine it's fine it's fine so tonight we're going to be talking about unburied Carol a novel by John Oh for the horror month to spooky horror fans Yay and all you spooky will John Junkies out there so welcome back it's the most wonderful it's just it's just a whole thing you guys but we're trying to not let that get us down we're lending are are seasonal candles were putting out our ghostly decoration Jimmy Need Anita fix does have a monster of the week sort of vibe you know I think it's it's overall plot a network TV show. I'm really digging it like I said those X. Files Vibes I love X. files so much so wherever I can get that I you know I'm like give give it is going to be pretty easy for people to follow though unlike a lot of shows like X. Files and other ones that I've loved where the big overarching like plots Kinda lose people I think this one is going to be are easier for people to keep up with okay so now that all that good stuff is out of the way let's talk a little bit about this you get to this book because I've been like waiting for I've been Jonesing for it to get my little hands on it so without further ado let me just tell you a little bit about the plot here book so you may have remembered we've talked about a Josh Melman book before on this podcast with amy from the bloodlust who we love bird box I but we haven't read them all so were slowly making our way through our Josh Mallard Mint collection and I was beyond thrilled opt Carol Evers is a woman with dark secret she has died many times but her many deaths are not final they are comas awaking slumber indistinguished word of curls dreadful fate reaches him moxie rides the trail again to save his beloved from an early unnatural grave and all the while awake and aware o'byrne Western horror yeah which I mean all of those things are very very appealing to me very very mccarroll fights to free herself from the gripping darkness that binds her summoning her own fierce will to survive I'm going to kind of cut off there's a little bit more to the description appealing to me so I know we kinda just had a little southern Gothic situation with a minor prophets this is not southern Gothic this is like western another coma plots to seize it proclaiming her dead and quickly burying her alive the other is her lost love the infamous outlawed James Moxie when else psychological spiritual emotional I little supernatural and of course the primal fear of most living bucks and we love bird box and this is not at all labored box not even a little bit and we actually own I think every Josh Mallard man is public bowl from death each lasting days only two people know of Carroll's Erie Condition One is her husband Dwight married Carol for her fortune and when she lapsed essentially the old western this is like the American old west and it's kind of a re-imagined West it's not our West but 'cause there's your old and I think part of that's probably because they've had female presidents and the West is kind of like this one strip of towns that are all connected by the trail which is in caps that trail which I love stuff like that and how often do you get horror books with a map in the front not often enough not often some differences like he's been female presidents and there's a lot more kind of female like equality kind of Imas Western and I know Scott's GonNa say one of them but some of the names people throw out when they're talking about this is Cormac McCarthy flannery O'Connor and I will bloom into obsession I immediately when I closed the book I just wanted to pick it up and read it again from the beginning I really you know what let's so worse things on the trail they like to say and then of course in the towns there's bad people there's a lot of comparisons on the back of the book adding is still him but it's not him he has some of the most beautiful grotesque turns of phrase in this book that he uses so for me this book was page Turner bordering on obsession I think that this will be one that when it sits with me for a little bit longer but I think that's why you need to know pretty good pretty good place to cut it I think it's a really good description really good teaser book sell this is a slow off and it just it sets you up to to kind of get that fantasy feel of it right from the beginning to yeah and this is a horror that works on a few different and it just made my heart sing and I love the simplicity of the horror in this book I loved the characters I loved I love that I I'm already like those two are like really perfect comparisons and the other two while the other two I'm GONNA get into to my shoved over the line and let's just call it obsession because I know it's going to get there so let's just say it is I love his writing I loved it in bird box and this and it's like super accurate and we all know I love I grow there is definitely parts of it that are very Edgar Allan Poe might experience I had a little bit different but it varies from chapter to chapter when you're talking about the writing styles you have a you have a story that's out of a Po- novel book absolutely would fit in one of his stories he's crazy and scary weird and kind of funny yeah and so story I really enjoyed his reading of it I this doesn't say anything of the writing a book but I I I would be happy to read the whole book in Audio Book Format because of his narration but I'm GonNa give it a page Turner the book does trudge along it is a slow burn just I don't know the weird way in which this world operates around the trail and there's bad men and women out on the trail but there's things were just being buried alive Cisco Publisher Experience With this well or do you want me to go I I think what you go first Okay Yeah Coltie really pegging it part of it's because half of it I listened to it on audio book and half of it I actually read it by the way the audio book is narrated by Dan John Miller really great female feminist character it's not all about James Moxie out on the trail lake there stephanie like a kind of alternate spur respective back and forth between them and a couple of different characters bad guys basically can we just talk about this book for a minute though it is sixty two pages it's not a super long book one thing that I really liked about reading at least this edition I'm assuming they're all the same yeah you have a hero that comes out of the dark tower while you have a villain who is written by Carl Hiaasen Oh in Scotland's Carl hiaasen really fresh and interesting and ultimately I wanted to know what would happen and how it would happen and so that really kept me very interested in it so I have to give it Kinda photograph easy thing where there's like a lady covering her face there's what I assume are Al flies these little like fly things four and then there's also like a forest scape on the front and around the back of just like black trees it's really pretty it's a very striking book it's Funny Really Pretty Book the hardcover edition we have it's catalysts like orangey red vermilion color it's got a really cool is this book was a note about the type in the back this book was set in Cassen a typeface I designed in seventeen twenty two you mentioned that because there's there's things about the jacket of the book it's kind of very old style like the bordering but we've had a series of really great by William Casselman it's widespread use by most English printers in the early eighteenth century soon supplanted the Dutch typefaces that are formally veiled the Roman is considered a workhorse typeface due to its place in open appearance while the Italic is exceedingly decorative and I Sudani now I've not read his work I mean there's so I mean I'm not saying that he got inspiration from Carl Hiaasen but but the the main like the villain of the one of the one of the more fascinating conversations that followed on twitter before I kind of kind of disappeared from that platform was authors talking about the reach chapter kind of feels like it's being it almost feels like it's written or created by a different author the mindsets of the character are so different that it keeps something that like with a physical book always helps me when there's a really deliberate typeface and there's also these wonderful little AH title cards at every chapter and they're like little black sign with some scroll work and they just look like your meaning loved the typeface for this book I felt it was obviously deliberate and it was just really well thought out to put the book in this typeface and I think that it's a very nice typeface very I feel like we've talked a lot about the type of the book which is very sad because the book is is and he does an incredible jaw really since I love this so much I should probably do it on audio at some point two yeah he does a really good job with the voices and with the tension of the it's Oh it's okay naked and we said it's a slow burn but this isn't really going to take a lot of your time it's like three hundred fifty something pages some sort of pulp western from like back in the day like from way back in the day I wish more books did that were they explained their choice for the typeface I recently yeah and I found this to be a little bit forgettable to be honest I really like and I think part of it is just because I really like the color of it it's not very pretty naked deliberately thought out but I love this data cards they're great title chapters to again fray pulpy and I have to say just like I listened to half the book and that's all the noise okay what more can I kinda say an Anon- spoiler capacity for the spoke I just I think that if you're if you assertions yeah it's cool art form and it just really helps enrich the book like if you're reading a physical book like to know like Wow this is all soda interesting discussion itself it's great it definitely you know you need spoilers so we're going to get to that pretty quick pretty and this book is not I'm assuming Paul and Stephen King Yeah Yeah especially at growl impelled this is basically an Edgar Allan Poe story set in the last and that is blurb on the back always have to be brand brand new it can be just you know you're finally getting around to it and I know some of our listeners like to get books used from their library which is wonderful and and read half the book I when I read the book half of it was with the physical copy half of it was on the kindle all over the place I was all over the place I have to say like interesting and Quirky characters put in very unnatural situations in a in a sense of dread yeah then this is a good sort of novel but at the same time it feels very fresh and it's very much his own thing even though we're referencing kind of older books and you know like like I said typeface that they that they type in that the edit in that they print in and the reasons why they do it I really I really like that that deeper that deeper study into the different sub genres and it has a really just beautiful bleak but at the same time descriptive poetic kind page Turner for that reason there are some like I said there's some great feminists stuff happening in Spokane we're GonNa talk about that more in the spoiler section by carol is really just a genre book and I think for that reason it has a broad appeal I agree actually I think broad is pretty good 'cause it dips its toes until empowerment than a lot of those authors that we named in love have done in the past two absolutely yeah I'm all about those female presidents and that there's bad women out on the train all right everybody welcome back to the spoilers section so here we go oh my God I love this book and I forgot to say on the Super Neil so some of you may have read it you could probably find this like used pretty cheap too if you need to go that route so it's a little bit nice you know everything appeal I think there's a lot to be interested in here it's western mystery supernatural horror it's a little weird and I mean that in a good way but pros like I said there's just there some turns of phrase that he's in this book that just like sticking your mind and most of them are book for You Scott does not have a huge huge fear burying buried alive like his kind of like like everybody counted us in their lizard brain if you're a small space and then come talk to us enjoying the show please like in subscribe on itunes leaders and things like that now you don't like any at all no beautiful characters wonderfully written kind of a throwback ish can be off putting for some people which is why I'm not going mass I don't think this is the bird box level of appeal but I think it's really much more than hope Western and all these other authors it is decidedly his own voice though it's very unique it incredibly unique again a lot more female task morbid phrases and there's also some dark humor too so yeah I'm GonNa agree broad broad appeal right that further you don't always want to get Lake Brand New Book Scott Senior Chair make anymore is could just make a little bit more noise oh I don't think more noise if I think I think that's it you can find us on twitter and Instagram at John Junkies and don't forget to visit the website John Junkies Dot COM 'cause I wanNA say slightly it's on sale I have some similarities for this book and some of them you will not expect it can at least say the ones that we both know we agree on who we think this book appeals to and then move onto despoilers yeah let's do it so I'll let you go first okay I think that this has a broad Gacek I love magic you guys like if there is someplace I think I've said this on this show before and there's like a strolling magician doing tricks I lose my mind L. Bad women bad men and being a dad beings creatures let us say so I guess we'll talk about which and there's some fun prestige tation going on here I mean there's some supernatural stuff but I mean there's some fun magic super-natural pretty supernatural and you don't really live breathing one one time a minute that's not something that you can actually live with so it has a supernatural element to it as well so I needed to know I needed to know had to know at one point I was GONNA at some point in the book I made peace with it and I was like Sandra you might not know how the tricks I really liked that like the trick in general and then of course we learn how did the trick in adverse town when he does it to Dwight even better we do learn about that I Jonah Junkies this is Sandra this is Scott and welcome to another Halloween episode it's another horror novel we do we're GonNa take a little break thank you for joining us we hope that you've read unburied Carol and you'll stick around for the spoilers if not go read this book it makes the legend of him even better now I love to it was like the supernatural stuff in the real thing I thought we're watching one of those stupid reality shows where people have talents and there's a magician I'm like enwrapped as loved them loveridge issue soon afraid of of hostile called claustrophobic yeah yeah so very much so I was like oh I wonder how this book will feel for him side-by-side but the fantasy magic lake people don't really experience that on the day to day so so I felt confused by the book in having so much of it be parlor tricks and explained away as that and also having the supernatural in it gossip no no I totally disagree about inconsistent I think that's what made the book rich is that this world those things oh magic it's parlor tricks and then you have the rot and you all natural being and you also have her how how town in her Komo's which are I don but then I was like no I need to know because it wasn't real magic and he's very much like not a big deal just a thing I did see for me we'll just go straight into that did you feel that that cheap and did a little bit no because I needed to know how the trick was stunned I kinda didn't I kinda didn't WanNa know now I was thinking it was real magic because there are this book this book it's kind of confusing in that there's so much of it it's like it's not real there's part there's magic there's stage Mash Age magic a lot of stage magic seemed kind of a theme which I really love I love more about crowds though viewing I can't get out of a crowd that's my real thing I don't know what might be some small spaces and you don't love it I'm a fan of that it to exact revenge on to white Oh my God so poetically just awesome the bell and he twice you idiot I do like that was brilliant and I thought that was so fun because I've spent so lawn thinking about how he pulled off the trick in town and then when he uses it uh-huh written saw blood like baby's bib covered in lobster sauce like she just lit that woman's throat so quick because she's and it's definitely implied in the book but in the audiobook he reads him with this hilarious like Irish brogue ish very much Edgar Allan Poe that kind of while this is just not a good person yes who has a very simple and seemingly they were Lafayette is interesting because she's kind of like a gangster in a way and she has her you know her fingers in so many pies all you know she's little and she's cowering and it's like Oh my God fair she's a sweetheart she's not GonNa do this and those Lafayette thoughts issues I'm anti like how he couldn't smother her and stem Lafayette Lafayette was a good character I taught Lafayette might be wrought for Awhile I'm not I didn't think the book knows talking about this poetic grotesque lines so the blade shimmered in the sunlight and Lafayette gasped believe fair Mr she opened her mouth to see we seemingly just just basic in an unrealistic view of how he should be treated or how he should be seen that he married this woman for her money she in here's looks insane and he's on these legs that are not real and they're probably not great quality and he's just kind of rickety along the trail and it's like you want something dirty deeds tenter cheap like you go to her and what a great death when Faira God they both utilize tricks to get away with things and I mean who would have thought of having a person who has no and walking around the strangely and people are like what is this guy a bow and he's not a rapist and he's not like a lot of the typical kind because she underestimated Faira I was glad to see Farah actually gets another kick ass girl yeah and that's actually one of my favorite lines below the knees to fill them with oil and is an arsonist like that is insane ah he is a crazy character great I would never have been able to come up with him and he and he is the one I referenced earlier that a straight out of a Carl hiaasen novel because he's nuts in a very funny way yeah as something like your quick but her throat when led her she brought her hands to her neck and observed in wide shock is the color red ran down the length of her fingers shut down at her beloved and he hates that she's beloved and that she has money and it's like it's so it's so weird because it's like you shouldn't have married her then because those are in just his descriptions and especially in the dialogue some of the Paris just very verbose so we're GonNa talk about the good guys in a minute the rock gets us into like some most magical realism kind of territory I love Rot Iheart Rot like one more villains talk about which is wrought yeah I think I'm GonNa have to let you kind of take over 'cause I'll be honest I don't understand okay great villain dwight is more your like Edgar Allan Poe's his parts were were the parts that were this little song yes and he sings them and it's like you're you're crazy love for most of the book he's running around with his hair half Kai wrought so rot wants you to know your mortality wants you to feel paranoid afraid hopeless the sense it's a thing it's an elemental being yes eldridge almost yeah and it's out there on the trail likes to mess with people and then somehow if finds its way into Carol situation and is like Oh this is great this is like a field day for things you'd think as the firebugs he he's just an arson we'll end associated patty is no regard for living things but they get this girl and now she grabbed out razor blade to care things Melbourne had a lot of fun writing grandiose language yeah both really important things as we're going through the villains to I'm really happy seat wake it has come up so I thought it was so disgusting and a coward at the the situation you're in is beyond reprieve because you know all living things we die rod and you can't escape rot a chaos sky to in a way like he just wants to ruin things literally his rottenness and he wants to ruin people because I feel like to use a death is like a little it's done I'm not like opposed to like death being a character or a bad guy and he wants to break their spirit and there's one point you know in the carriage where Carol sees him and he thinks no one's looking and he just looks depressed and it's like the sad broken creature like everything else but he goes to quite some links to make a specially Moxie feel absolutely horrible a book but you don't think of rot as much because rot can get into you in so many ways like it does in this story because rod is not just death worship instead iheart Ron he's horrifying he's they the mostly call him he but it's like rod is not like a guy in a traditional in many of his monologues he talks about how he's the he's just he's just he's just he's just he's morals he's the kind of a quotes lettings done but you know wrought doesn't work out for you buddy there's something about rot having its fingers in around character decisions and motivations but at the end of the data supernatural force is really what drove so much of what really happened in this oh that's what things like route look like when they think no one's looking as a really deep thought of like this is why this thing exists is to do this but deep down it's probably L. in how town that's kind of what I mean where I'm a little bit confused by the purpose of rot because there's so many parts of the story that's built upped I just felt that the concept of rot and the concept of this story didn't necessarily Mesh together as well decisions starting from moxie leaving Carol yet that was Raj yet he had a hand in the decisions that Dwight made to bury carol and he talks to care so much of what what has happened both the past doctor what is currently happening after Alex will well yes yeah but you know he had a hand in a lot of the character mind slowly especially when he's like I made this character up how did it come how did it come who or what did it like same thing you did well she wasn't like really uh sleep oh I see what you're saying yeah yeah and yes so I thought that was really really fascinating and I love that she didn't always call her mom she called her hatty stuff like that I don't know and that that letter that was from howdy swell and that she perfected it she I love all of the other characters so much that that it just seemed like a distraction poor little robot I liked rock fa find in look at it felt it felt inconsistent as far as what Maller Mun intended our man and I I guess I just don't get why it's confusing for you L. Because I I love it so much I know you do and I knew you would and I love the idea of rot I love that that concert it was my booth that's like the best part but in her friend John Bowie who was a great character though we met him in flashbacks that how is a place book jacket as well that it's not gonna be the prince writing and save her though she does yes but she saved herself and Faira helped low-fare thing and it's like no no this is right and it because it just wanted to keep this going it was really like ooh it's not it's a wonderful concept of like it's this place where carol goes without going anywhere and it's a big concept and in a different story you know it's okay route you can come sit next to me I like you I thought I thought the supernatural elements were great rot you can sit with me Tom that she did this for her kid and it made me cry I loved it I thought it was so brilliant and a wonderful trick it was a really neat trick and those she's tried so hard her whole life it wasn't until she's a grown lady in this situation that she is finally able loser but I like that she was like a calm strong presence she was admired in the town and I don't know lilly like I was thinking exactly yes exactly and it was really just a split second like oh well this is actually this makes sense exactly just affected the box the trick as she said she was going to do and you know if she does that is what she has to be buried and she set that up and it's and had he helped her mother kind of saved her to see did but at the same time I don't think Carol would have kept her wherewithal and gotten to the point where there's just something about Carol and as we go with her on the journey that we learn her strength along with her and throughout the book like a reference on her she's a cool chick sheep she went for the wrong guy after and James was a fool and a coward but she ended up marrying this guy is really it says at the bottom of the description the book jacket this is a reimagining of sleeping beauty oh and you can kind of see that CA- sleeping beauty candidate and I realized there's so much of this book that's built around tricks in engineering and and surprises and when I thought of it that way like it was fun because we know that rots messed around a little bit so we think Oh this coughing could be from wrought and is not an is from her mother and it's like one last love letter from her mom Howell town wonderful scary place and I love all of her conversations with Hattie her mom and all which we'll get to Hattie later the simplest things are the solution and really liked that I thought that was brilliant so let's talk a little bit about Carol we already spoke a little bit book you get more of a feel for what how town is so of course there's James Moxy I would read a whole series about James Moxy I want to hear about how wonderful archetypal you know cowboy singer strong silent stoic type but at the same time hi like all of those characters probably did he has a soft underbelly it was kind of implied that he had only really ever killed the one person intelligence a lot which I thought was really cool but yeah so that by the

Scott Carol Evers Canal Herman California youtube CBS Josh Mallard John Junkies John Oh Josh Melman Hell House Llc Jimmy o'byrne Anita
95 | Psychological Thriller | The Push by Ashley Audrain

Genre Junkies | Book Reviews

49:59 min | 3 months ago

95 | Psychological Thriller | The Push by Ashley Audrain

"Weirdo bookworm worms unite. We want to share our love of genre fiction with you. Some readers out there may look down on you for your love of horror sci fi fantasy but not us stop by as we discuss what we've been reading. Hey happy new year halfway through january. No hello everyone. Sorry about the really Unintentional like week off schedule thing. That was completely not planned. One hundred percent absolutely. We had some Someone foreseen but pretty much unforeseen destruction of our entire studio and life that Made it pretty impossible to record an episode last week. Due to some some was standing flood damage for lack of a better way to put it. We had to repair our walls and our floor and it was very noisy and we were basically crammed into one room with like all of her belongings at a wish is not an ideal place for recording a podcast. So we're back first episode of the year. But we're back and you're gonna get to episodes in a row one this week one next week so i guess i should start out by saying it's the new year we're doing all the new year fun things pot really. I did watch one. Cool thing i wanted to share with everybody about was i watched the night. Stocker docu series on net flakes for five episodes. Long fantastic. I really like. I cannot recommend it enough if you are a fan of true crime Yeah i mean it's like if you're familiar with the case you'll learn some stuff and it's also just really compelling it's very moving and It's from the perspective of the detectives that worked the case the night stalker retired ramirez horrendous. Things he did to people and the don't sugar coat it but at the same time nothing about it feels like exploitive and the detectives have a lot of charisma and they have a lot of like Respect for the people he killed and victimized. It's really good. It's really really good. I have not been ingesting. Anything really john related outside of what we've outside of preparing for the show. I definitely have been watching. A lot of slime tutorials on youtube not broadway bootlegs slime tutorial right. That's a code name but that that's pretty much been my my twenty twenty one experience and a whole lot of watching the news. Only we watch a lot of the news these days. You know what you did see. You saw the fly. The nineteen eighty-six the fly for the first time i did. I enjoyed it. i mean. of course. I've watched a lot of things that you've watched for your other shows. Yes yeah but that was kinda fun. Because that's like a mad science thing and lake relevant to your interests and you know i remember. I liked it first. Timer so for our kickoff episode for twenty twenty one we are reviewing ashley. Audrain the polish. And what a push. This book has been okay. Would you talk about the synopsis. For the book i do i. I just wanted to give a little peek behind the curtain on this book. You know we get. We get publishers. Who talked to us about books that we might be interested in reviewing and there's a lot of stuff that we nobody takes us or anything. I think we must have received about approximately three thousand emails about this book from a whole lot of different people There's there's been a lot of push a behind this book. And i'm just going to say maybe for good reason. Oh okay so let me tell you about the push by ashley audrain blyth. Connor is determined that she will be the warm comforting mother to her new baby violet. The way she herself never had but in the thick of exhausting early days blyth becomes convinced that something is wrong with her daughter. She doesn't behave like most children do or is it all in blyth's head. Her husband fox says she's imagining things. The more fox dismisses her fears the more blythe begins to question her own sanity. And the more we begin to question what life is telling us about her life as well. I kinda don't want to say too much more than that. i agree. yeah. I mean you could read a little bit more than that. Not be spoiled. But we'll just we'll just can't leave you. There can leave it there so scott. What was your experience reading the push. This book Is a very difficult book to read and yet remained a solid page turner for me throughout think. Maybe even a better word for it would be crippling. I was just grabbed me and just would not let me go and tell i finished it and considering it's written in a weird mix of first person and second person perspective. Yes which is something that kinda hurts my brain a little bit but she writes it so well that it just makes sense and it grabs you and it makes you kind of feel like you're reading something you shouldn't be. Yes yes i have to say. This is like three hundred and twenty pages of like a word wasted not a page waste and not a word wasted griffin. I loved that tense. Chilling difficult emotional in a lot of ways. This book reminds me of what hole in the woods by jennifer grazer. George bush that we read last year was of the year reminds me of like what that book did for true crime fiction. This kinda does for psychological thriller because it kind of twists it. It kinda puts a new look on it it puts a new spin on it and it makes it like you know it's like this thing that you think you know and then it kind of explode set. It's unique in in the genre. Where a lot of psychological thrillers. They tend to revolve around either a murder or some other like single heraldic event. Yes and this doesn't it. I don't wanna call it a slow burn but it but it's almost written like it like to be a slow burn where it's like you. There's just lots of things happening throughout. Yes that just adds to that level of unease. I should say my my experience has definitely page turner so toback that up to ashley's writing is she knows how to write a page turner. That is exactly like you know there's books that are page-turners and then there's people that write a page and that is totally her. She knows exactly how to write to compel you to keep going and ashiq. Kennedy's is things a little bit. And she kind of suggests things. I don't just something about her writing style. It feels urgent. It feels immediate even when she's talking about muendane everyday things How my gosh this book. It almost hurts my head. It's so good. And it's so complicated. The main conceit of her writing style in this book is that it's written from the perspective of of blythe the main character writing a letter to else right and it's and it's a letter explaining everything that has happened. Everything that has happened In three different time periods that it just between constantly to keep you engaged to keep you on the edge of your seat to to continually reveal more and more information to you the reader as well as to the person. She's writing this letter to. It's a really interesting conceit that works really well and would be very difficult to pull off. If you did not have absolute mastery of your craft. Yes and i want to talk about. I want to talk about characters. More in the spoiler section. Yes but i should say You know we love a complicated character. We love a character where you love them. You're angry at them confused by them. You're hurt by that. You know all at once and she nails that with her characters. She absolutely nails that i challenge you to not have this book honshu after he read it. I have thought about it so much so many times. This is a wonderful piece of themm. Inist fiction as well looking at a woman's place in society how we're kind of forced and pigeonholed and generational trauma and mental illness. And really really complicated themes i keep using that word complicated but it is. Because there's no eight there's layers. There's no right or wrong. There's no black or white. I think it's important to point out and there will be a there will be a trigger warning at the beginning of the spoiler section. But i wanna point out right here that this is a difficult book. Yeah he can be a very triggering book. It deals with some very complicated dark emotional places. Yeah i have recommended this to a couple of people. I know who have kids a couple of mothers and and Who like challenging read because the thing is is like i don't wanna make it sound like reading this book as a punishment because it's not known enjoy. You're absolutely right. Yeah it's a triumph of writing. And it's so interesting. But i think a lot of people of parents i don't know maybe this is like a millennial parents Gen z are not gen z parents. A little young but parents and gen-x parents. They are interested in reading about people having challenges with parenting at about the horrifying stuff. That people don't like to talk about that happen. I talked to about an absolutely can't like like post-partum you know. You know you think of it like that where people just they ignore it. They want to pretend that. Oh everything's fine. And and this book really addresses the weight of being a parent especially a mother and you are right. I don't want to. I don't want to make it sound at all like this is just really hard to get through. Because that's why. I gave it a page turner score. I have no problem giving a great book. A struggle win and and there are books that are meant to be that way. And that's the whole point. This is absolute like thrilling page turner with some very complicated to use the word again messages. Yeah it's hard. I can't think of another word for it but it's just it's like the best way i can put it where you have a lot of thoughts you have a lot of feelings You're very challenged with things that you might have believed or things you might think to be true. I am a big fan. As a lot of people are of contemplating nature versus nurture. And there's my gosh That is like that is one of the things that sticks with me about. This book is a nature versus nurture argument. And i don't know. I don't know which wanted his with this book. I am but it makes you think about both sites that a lot. I don't know if it'll come as any surprise. Based on what i have been saying but i think that this is a massive. He'll book s it's terrifying in a very real and human way which to me is very rare in this Space yes it. Because it's so universal in human in its themes that. I think that this appeals to a mass audience whether man or woman parent or not a parent. I totally agree. Definitely mass-appeal book We're not parents. And i felt so engaged in so compelled. And it's you know we always say you should read books outside of your walk of life always because that is how high become educated a compassionate person. That's bookstore will be really boring if you only read things that's like i can relate to this. I mean you need to see yourself in books but you don't want to just read the same thing over and over again right definitely all different sorts of people. I think could get into this book. Feel moved by this book. Feel sickened and heartened and also you know maybe heard may be seen by some of the stuff in this book spoke. Did make me cry. I'm not. I'm not opposed to cry. Two books that is like probably the thing i cry at the most is books and it made me cry and i will talk about that because it is like. It's triggering in ways that i didn't expect it to be i. I do not cry in this book but it did put me in a state of shock at one point okay. I can't wait to hear at that. Point is well. I mean this book is hard to discuss without getting a spoiler territory so we kind of have to just jump there. I'm so excited. But i mean if you need any convincing. I don't know what more to tell you. I think that if you're looking to be a little challenged and just really compelled swept away and swept up into somebody's life. You should read this book. One hundred percent right. We'll see you over in the spoiler section enjoying the show. Please like in subscribe on twos. You can find us on twitter and instagram at john. Ritter junkies and don't forget to visit the website. John junkies dot com. God where to begin. Let's start with the trigger warning. Hit it all right so this book features not necessarily violence but bad things happening to children features postpartum depression to picture of suicide and self harm and just dealing with somebody in a several people's and very challenged mental state. Yes that you know. it's like eight. That is a trigger warning but at the same time a lot of book still at that. But there's something about the very realistic way which depicted here think about. You've been ward okay. We're moving on. How my gentle jesus. Where to where to even start with this book. We have to start the story of the spoiler section of live and her by their and her grandmother. Three generations of women with mental health challenges. Who are forced into situations by society and by their culture essentially that they are supposed to be xyz way and even though the time changes and those expectations change a little bit. They are still not a one-size-fits-all solution and they all end of doing really up things. Because they are limited in their choices in the way that they can get help with their mental illness and still have to be you know quote unquote perfect for their time. And that's my favorite thing about this book. I think is that is is the treatment of mental illness. You know going down through a family whether it's because you know they didn't actually have their mother figure in their life and didn't learn ways to deal with their mental health or because it was genetic it's set up in the beginning of the book almost like it's this family curse and i was half expecting it to kind of go that direction not necessarily in a supernatural route right but but in like there's just something wrong with his family especially the women. I appreciate that it didn't go to a place that was not real in that way it really was a true story of of mental struggles and both nature and nurture. That's it that's the first time we're kind of confronted with the nature versus nurture is looking at the women in blyth's family You know are they. Are they all bad. Moms because external factors or the bad moms and all are they bad moms because of chemical imbalance all three of them have moments that are very shining and that they are good and that they're not rotten or evil especially ply especially blythe but then it kind of becomes more apparent when we start talking about. Which is we're gonna save her. She's kind of own little nugget little nuggets our own little nugget. I think in the case of her grandmother who starts this whole chain if you will. She heard life her. Her story doesn't start with any like a whole lot. Like any real negative things no no real signs of mental distress until her fiance dies and her fiance dies in a way because he decided to do what her father wanted him to do. A societal pressure a societal pressure which then sent her into a spiral of just kind of doing what she needed to to get by. But she was no but she was not happy and that is something that was created by her environment and she wasn't an attentive parent because of because of that that spiral that she sent herself into. So then that leaves bligh's mother who really had did not have the love of her own mother Which then created kind of a pass down of that of that issue to her daughter blythe right who has a very idealized image of what a mother is. Yes and that's very complicated. And i i feel like that's gosh it's in some ways. I don't know what i was going to say. It's worse than other generations. And that's hard to quantify which generation of women had certain things worse than others. But i feel like bleieved has inherited like you have to make up for two generations yes of crappy parents like you know what i mean obsolete. You have to be better for some reason. Yeah and you know especially her mom. She didn't have a choice. Ish she had to have a kid had to be the which is awful. It's fricken awful and it's like that's exactly what happens when people don't have the choice and they're forced to be parents like that is what happens. It backfires horrendously. But what i love about the way that she set this up with both the combination of the nature and nurture and this kind of almost threat to bligh that. There's something wrong with the women in his family. Which is something wrong with you at your is that you don't really know. Is her relationship with violet because of her because of a a mental health chemical chemical imbalance due to this you know due to her genetics and her her blood line. If you will is it or is it. Because and therefore that's why violent is different right or is all of that kind of just put on her put in her brain by her the way that she was raised in this this line of pressure that was put down on her where she's pushed this. It's all tation. Yeah violet being bad because of what her mother has told her right or does she blame violet because she doesn't take to parenting very well right away. So okay so hold on. Let's can we put a pen inviolate real quick before we even get to violet. There's also there's fox in his family. Which i feel like is a really important part of blood story because besides the crap from her generational trauma fox has a perfect mom. Who is you know. Sometimes i only know it so hard honey and she's a good person and a compassionate person but she's one of those perfect perfect moms and she looks very different than the women implies family and then you have fox fox i feel like is e is a good but ignorant person. I think willfully ignorant is especially important. Yeah that's fair. I think that they both did themselves a little bit of a disservice in this and some people are in love Where you want to be that person's idealized version of something so he really wants to be dad this all leaky wants and she does want to be a mom but she's trying to fit into his mold of family and what he wants and what he thinks family should look like and he is so doggedly determined that he can't see her suffering for what it is. There's definitely choices that he makes as far as you know not. Wanting to give her you know some extra time without violet by not listening to her struggles or encouraging that she seeks help right. That are huge. Red flags and inexcusable will end he also. He cheats on her. He does and which is big not. Okay no it's again. It's because he's trying to find his mommy. He's tried to make you know what i mean. He's trying to be like You are quite right. I'm gonna need someone who's a little bit more like my mom now. I know i'm kind of. I don't have fox but yeah part of my opinion on fox especially right. Now when i'm about is a little devils advocate easy. And i'll tell you why okay because i'm kind of describing my feelings towards fox that i had prior to the last page of the book so i wanna i wanna frame that okay. This whole book creates blythe as an unreliable narrator absolute or at least makes you question if she's unreliable narrator right. Yes yeah. I mean either. Six of one half their questionable. Yeah there is a lot of question. Is this her putting this on. Violet is is violent. Fine but this is this is just what she the how she treats her and how she sees her in the damage that she's causing and maybe this is the way that her mother also kind of viewed things and maybe that's quote unquote. What's wrong with the women in this family are quotes and so and therefore and again. He should have had her get help. He should have been more supportive. But but may but there's there's a there's strong evidence throughout a lot of the book that you know. Maybe this is has nothing to do with violet. And it's not violence fault that she can't connect with her and if that's the case then some of what he does is more understandable like look. There's nothing wrong with violet. Violet is fine. she's great there's on you well. Here's here's the thing. Violet is not fine. Violet is not fine and she does a couple of things that are unquestionably. She did bad. the razor blade and the end of the book. But i don't blame violet. Because the argument is did she inherit mental illness or life. Kind of ruin her see. That's interesting because know blake. That's not in the same way that some things aren't blyth's fall. There's something that we're her mother's fault. The weren't her mother's fault. You know what i mean. It makes you look at because we're used to in thrillers. Things are pretty clear. Somebody is severely mentally ill or somebody is kind of forced to be that way. You know what. I mean like through nature and this does not give you a simple answer. What i what i find interesting about that though is is curious. Did you ever question whether or not violet actually did those things. Yeah i definitely questioned some things from violent questioned how malicious it really was because there were there were points especially like there was a point of the book was hundred percent with blythe and i and i trusted everything that she was saying and she was putting down on paper about violet and then when she started to do the kind of creepy stalker he stuff for. She's pretending to be someone else which is creating this whole relationship with her ex husband's new wife and a girlfriend girlfriend is it made me think okay. There is something like she is. She's starting to believe these things that she's doing like she starting to believe she's this person which which speaks to again more of a writing history a little bit differently than how it works like okay. Maybe she put the razor blade in the bag and just hoped that you know the kid would fight it. Maybe you know maybe she really did not put push the stroller and that was just something that happened or maybe she did it herself. I don't. I didn't believe that. But i was expecting to be something. This big like none of this is true moment. It really was only the very last. That's what she exactly. Yeah it's really only the last line of the book that completely changed like complete cemented and changed my opinion of everybody in the book. And so knowing what i know at the very end that there's something not right with violet. So all of these things that she was seeing and she was noticing were real definitely paints everybody else in a much worse light. I feel like you kind of through a whole bunch of questions at me. And now i have to like find them again so so so hold on okay. I stopped trusting blythe. Pretty much as soon as violent was born. That's first and foremost because live was so disappointed with not connecting. Immediately to her child. She started to really say things that made me upset with her blaming violet as an infant And i know. That's a postpartum thing. And i heard i have a lot of compassion for people who go through that but it is hard to read. Because i'm like put. Yeah but that's a baby this infant as a child that's innocent. You know what i mean. So it's like you have to get a little starting to feel distrustful of her because it's like well she didn't do any she's just she's just a she's just a glow worm right now. So that's when. I started to not fully trust her so then violet starts to kind of do some things like she's a. She's getting older. She's not connecting with blythe. Blyth's fault because life is not convinced that there's like not a relationship there. She loves her and she wants to be her mom sometimes but she's also like she can't get over this. That motherhood is not what she thought. It was going to be so. Of course. that's gonna make violent violet distant. That's gonna make her like weird around her because kids do pick up on that stuff now again. We know something is wrong with violet. But we don't know when exactly it started and how much alive is to blame. Or if it's all chemical imbalance right. I think blade is to blame at least for violet. I think she kind of ruined her a little bit. And and i like live a lot and is still a good person and there's times her when the tooth have really moments in there's time when blythe is really good moments with sam says i'm not anti life. I'm not mad at her. But i mean we have violet weird relationship with her mom southbound fall then. We have the little boy who's hair she takes. That was weird. I forgot about that. Yeah that was weird but kids do kind of weird stuff. That doesn't necessarily mean they're going to be associate path. Those a little weird know. She was a little sociopath but go. Then there's the boy who falls. I still have no idea if islet did that or not. I feel like she did. I don't know i'm six. I'm six one half dozen the. Why do you think she did it. Because i believe that she did all of the things that bligh witnessed because light the tour our. I don't know because because of the last line of the book. Yeah well no. I know she okay so we know she does some bad things. Cutting the hair was weird. That was weird. I feel like everything that blythe witnessed violent do uh-huh and suspected violet of doing i feel like violet. Did so you think that violet did push yesler absolutely. I'm not sure that she did because again. I'm just not certain because we can't fully trust blyth implied thus and even fully trust herself in some moments. She starts to backtrack it. You know and that makes it really really hard because again. If let's say violent didn't push the stroller the way her mother treats her lake criminal is arguably going to turn her into a criminal because the she treats her like. You're a little ticking time bomb waiting to go off. Then that's how she will become. That's interesting enough. But i mean at least that's with the push and by the way i love that. Double triple quadruple meetings. Suck too by the way. It's like push of labor. Push this so then. We have the razor blades. Thick goes to the new brother that is definitely like violet. Went into her room and got them. Yes says a little weird and then of course there's the ending where it but you know there's that whole complicated part like on the fuel trip when we really get a picture into poor little violets mind. No one really likes her and and she's she's so she's so complicated and it's like is. She has a mom that's convinced that she's bad. Did she ever have a chance. I don't know so you so what you're saying. What you're implying is that there is a possibility that most if not all of the things that blythe suspected violet of doing were not true but at the end she ended up becoming who bligh thought she was. Yes that is a really interesting take. Yeah i that's my that's my take and again it or i mean that's a wonderful thing about this book. Yeah very open to interpret. It really is because you can also say we'll violet was bad whether she was made that way air for that way. That's just it's so i ll. It's not because there's lots of nice things about violet to that. Makes me so happy because i you know i loved the way. This book ended just sort of like hammering it home like. Oh guess what you're questioning. It just like everything was true. That's what i took from the ending. Yes and like to have to have you kind of opened up this whole other idea in like deeper reading to it actually makes me love this book even more i know i love i love to and i love it. It could also be that you know blythe knew from the beginning that something was off again and it could be because there was just a trail of mental illness waiting to to come to this conclusion. Also yeah there. So somebody ways to take it and again i i feel like i'm saying mean things about life and i do like blythe i have so so much compassion for her especially when she is. She's trying to fit this mold of this. Mommy like with a capital m right and it's so hard and she's she's putting herself second. Which is what you know. Parenting is kind of like the thing of it is supposed to like give to your children. There's a part of the book that i highlighted in this before sam dies and is where she's looking in the mirror and she realizes that her body is not her own. Her body exists to serve her family though was a brilliantly powerful scene and she could details how her body looks how it's changed and how it serves each member of the family. That's really. I mean that's like the stuff that likes knocks yourself socks up your way because women's bodies are such commodities and at different stages in our lives they don't feel like they belong to us for a variety of different reasons and the mother hood one. Yeah that's big and that's what's even more gross like with that framing in that scene. That's what makes it even more just unacceptable in an wrong that he cheated on her because it is just. It's it's saying all right. Your body gave me these children. Your body takes care of the house and all this kind of stuff and you know weans the children and you know but your body doesn't you know really serve me in that way. The body doesn't serve me that way where you're not quite the mom. I wanted you to beat him. My kids it's hard. You know it does make you not like look at fox in a very good light. You know My gosh is it's so much to unpack. This book is a lot to unpack in every single way and you had mentioned when ply starts to lead that double life. Oh my god first of all it was. It's so unhinged that it's really scary. She bought a wig shh pathway. But it's also heartbreaking and eight because it's like she's desperate for this connection and she actually even though she's not being honest she is being honest. Oh god it just it just. It makes my heart crunch. It makes me uncomfortable and and it makes me mourn four the relationship that the even healthy relationship that she could have had because realistically she was friends with her. Yes shannon on french and they could have you know they could have just been like all right. This marriage didn't work out. You know there's a lottery reasons why You know you how you how you got. There is unacceptable. But you have this. You have this new woman who is helping to raise our you know our child and but we can actually be friends because we actually get along well. We have similar experiences. And what can help each other. And it's a sad. But i mean they were never going to be able to be friends though because fox is already told you know and to be fair like you know. He probably told her. she's not well. She thinks that her daughter killed our son. That's a hard person to then befriends way of is to be like. Oh yeah you think that. 'cause inviolate loves the girlfriend gets along really well with sheep did kill your son she killed. You know that though. I'm sorry i. I feel like i feel like it's i feel like she. Just how fox. Now you can see how he would look at it and be like i know you went there to be a reason you wanted to be a cause that something happens somebody to blame. But you can't just make there be somebody to blame and also you know her whole time if there's something wrong with her there's something with her dow would start placing him against her see. And that's why fox is so complicated all a lot of really bad choices especially towards the beginning of this whole situation. He is not very important good partner. He's not a good partner. He expects her to just take care of reason the children and and and really dude say. Hey let's get you some help. Yes and like the whole getting rid of the the nanny. The babysitter was the point. When i actually really turned him like this is something she needs will but at the same time i got the impression and she kind of said it herself. She also didn't speak up for herself very often. She didn't which i'm not blaming her with that is a it is a societal pressure. And it's a product of her of her mental struggles like that that is actually one of her symptoms. Rate is that she's not comfortable. Speaking up for herself advocating for herself a one hundred percent but that can be very. I can also see why things got to a point where it was broken. I think i think that if blythe had just been able to have a therapist right away right as soon as violet came home or maybe like right as soon as her mother left. But i yeah i really at least for the plot of this book a lot of things would have been very different for this family but kind of saying that is like a joke. It's a little bit of you. Know a cheat. But i mean it's true though because you know. Maybe then she would have been able to advocate for herself. She would have been able to look at violet and be like. I'm sorry this because she she tells violet later in life. I'm sorry i wasn't good enough to you. She apologize and it shouldn't have had to happen that further down the road so the i cried at this book was a weird part. I cried when she and fox have that moment toward the end where they're reconnecting a little. That's the part. I cried in this book. Because i i felt so bad for blyth that her life turned out nothing like how she planned it or wanted to in any way and she lost everything and i just felt so bad for her in that moment That was the part. That really got me and i just like a and in subsequent moments i think i cried again when she was apologizing to violet was the when she was apologizing to violet. That was one of the parts that got me. I'm oh that got me. The most emotionally gummy the closest to tears. The the moment on the porch actually made me kind of angry. We'll and that's you know valid because fox's like oh yeah so yeah i did notice something weird. I didn't tell you about it. That's true about lake crew. You dude yeah like seriously you mean. We could have been talking about this the whole time. Like actually yeah. There is something different about violet. Let's talk about that and figure out what's going on but you know you're just pretending that nothing is wrong and even if he thought that there's only something wrong with violent because of what blight is doing. That's still a great time to. Hey let's do some family therapy. Take this apart like he should have been like okay. That's fine therapy. I feel like i'm kidding. When i say this i feel like this is going to be our new like our new thing where it used to be. Wow this whole plot could have been solved if people just talk to each other but now it's like this whole thing could have been solved if you just talked to at their pets. My gosh but she a lot of people who who for various region yeah not only internally but externally and this is a perfect example of both. She has no. She has no encouragement from outside. Yeah or any experience from inside of seeking help right and he's like just be more like my mom it's fine and then there's oh when she takes violet to go see her surrogate mom her neighbor. Mom i mean we could have a whole other. Podcast is talking about her relationship with the neighbor. Mom at really poignant beautiful stuff and she's so guarded she so guarded for variety of reasons. And that's again. It's not a blame thing but it's a reason thing. Do you think she ever even told fox about that woman. I don't think so no. I don't think she didn't. I don't think she did either. She kind of made she's kind of made a point of saying in the beginning like i didn't introduce you to my family. I didn't introduce you to nearly knows how all of my friends like. I did like everything was you. Yes and it's again. It's a reason and it makes you feel for her because it's like in. She didn't give herself a chance but nobody else gave her a chance. Either so you can't really blame up so you blame everybody. I think one of the one of the powerful messages to take out of this book is that blame is not helpful or important in s. Yes there's a lot of blame. And i'm using air quotes that can go around and at the end of the day if everyone is to blame then no one is to blame. It's just it's just awful and at the and really who to blame. Is societal pressures. Yes one hundred percent is the things we do to ourselves and each other one of the things too with the you know when she kind of goes back to the the stop sign. Stop light and she tries to like recreate it and she can't quite do it quietly guy in the cafes like yeah was a terrible accident you know what i mean is. It's like no. I mean like he might not have necessarily have been able to see. Violet pushed the stroller if she did push the stroller She did she did the stroller. But it's like she she wouldn't adult. It's i can't even. I don't even know where i'm going with this. But you know what i mean like. It opens up that window again of like. Maybe there's not somebody to blame me. Bad things happen because life. Sometimes bad things happen. Yes but you know maybe five. It was jealous. Maybe wasn't happy and she pushed that that stroller. She was asking all kinds of questions about traffic. And all that but you know sometimes kids also just do stuff to see what happens. And that's not like a good thing. You know what i mean but you know like you tell him. Don't touch the stove nausea so touch the stove or they stick of fork in a socket. They eat the tide pot here. Five years older shareholder old. She was like you don't understand what what death is. You don't understand right that kind of stuff. You don't understand a consequences. Yes exactly and that happens. I mean if watched a lot of true crime things about killer kids and stuff too and sometimes they know what they're doing and sometimes they don't quite know what they're doing like i mean she could have been totally finally tripping that kid good. I don't like how gets hurt. But she meant for it to be this cataclysmic event. It's very interesting very interesting. And i mean poor. I mean poor poor everybody or everyone board violet. Now she's going to be. We need to talk about kevin. I think violet belongs in prison. Personally i hope that her step mom advocates for her to get health and maybe fox finally somebody your haters to women in your life now hussein. There's maybe something wrong with violence. Maybe there's something wrong with violet just saying and maybe there's something me fox be nice to moms it's hard takeaway be nice to everybody. Life is hard when you're human beings to moms. Believe them listen to them. Get them help or even if you think that. What they're saying is not normal behavior even more reason to just get them help. Make them feel heard and get help for yourself when you need it. S if there's if there's anything we can tell you on on a daily basis if you need help please seek it out just your jonah junkies get help. We can help gets help okay. So how many sleepless nights out of five. Oh my goodness which he give this book Gonna go i go i i give this book. Four and a half. Sleepless nights had a five. I appreciate and i love how open to interpretation. Everything about this is and yes. We said nature versus nurture lot. We've complicated a lot. We said challenge a lot shot. Yeah and it's because you know sometimes spokes have to come along that really push push you out of your comfort zone and push you to think about things on not just an intellectual level but an emotional level Ashley is an incredibly talented writer. That really gets how to write humans to really gets how to write women that really gets had right compelling compelling work. I can't wait to see what else she does. This book made me think so much and this episode has made me think so much more. The book is written a writing style. That i never thought i would be able to wrap my head around and i did and i loved it and i want to see more examples of it I m giving this five sleepless nights out of five. I want to break the rules and give it more and give it six because it came as such a surprise to me and it did things that i have never read before myself and did it in a way that that felt perfect perfect tomato. Let you convince me. And we'll going to give her the rest of the sleepless night five out of five sleepless nights there is no sleep ususally michelle sleep and that's just gonna make your mental state even worse. 'cause you're not getting good rats. I hope you all are ok after this episode in reading this book But if you're not turn on your little nightlight and please just keep reading past your bedtime. Thank you scott. Thank you sandra wall.

blythe blyth turner Violet Audrain fox ashley audrain blyth jennifer grazer toback ashiq ashley John junkies fox bligh fox fox Stocker ramirez john Connor
75 | Fantasy | The Night Country by Melissa Albert  A Hazelwood Novel

Genre Junkies | Book Reviews

49:44 min | 1 year ago

75 | Fantasy | The Night Country by Melissa Albert A Hazelwood Novel

"Weirdo Book Worms Unite. We want to share our love of genre fiction with you. Some readers out there may look down on your for your love of horror sci fi and fantasy but not us so stop by as we discuss what we've been reading. Hi everybody this is Sandra this is Scott and where the John Ritter Junkies and we are joined tonight by a very special guest. Who's been on the show numerous times but it's been a minute. Amanda E. Elo Celcom back to the show. Thank you so much. Been away for too long misty guys. All we miss you do and I know you've read some of the books we have We picked this one tonight to talk about because it was a highly anticipated Follow up we all read. The first book suggest celestial no like we're we're socially distancing still Silla Manda Zonda on the call so If she sounds like she's not in the same s because she's not no no no no but we wish you were were was well okay enough with the sad chat. So tonight we are discussing the sequel to the Hazelwood by Melissa Albert and it is called the night country so if you have not read the Hazelwood you cannot read the night country. I think we all agree on that. Completely pretty NECESSAR- I mean. Yeah I mean I guess if you were stranded at an airport and that was the only book you can read like she will catch you up on the events of the first book but it would be weird and I don't think he'd be invested. I actually think that I wanNA pop in before we get any further and talk a little bit more about that. I think not only. Is it important? That you've read the Hazelwood. I think it's easier if you've recently read the Hazel. Would I think that I think that it's worth re-reading it for this novel? I I completely agree. I got started on it and then I was like Ooh. We'll we'll wait a second Who Do I know this from this? Do I? And I had to definitely go back. And just revisited just because it is a whole new world nation in there. Yeah no definitely so. We've all said you can't read the night country without reading the Hazelwood. So spoiler alert. We cannot talk about the night country without talking about the Hazelwood. So get our spoiler. Free section will be filled with spoilers from the Hazelwood. You have been warned. And if you like fantasy and you haven't read the Hazel lead you need to rethink your life? Really need to read it. Go listen to our episode about it. Join in with us and then come on back to the night country. So as a as a quick recap the Hazelwood is about Alice and her mother. Hulu love who lead a nomadic life. Her mother moves her from town to town. Running away from strange happenings. That happened around Alice and it turns out that Alice was a story in a fairy tale world doomed to loop in this horrible story that she was written into over and over and her mother stole her from that storybook land and the whole story is about her being drawn back in and escaping again. Her Grandma was the one that Kind of perpetuated all of this She stole the stories from what they call a spinner. Yeah so so in a typical portal fantasy style. Her grandmother was sucked into this storybook world from our world and stole all of these stories and wrote them into books into our world so we know about this world in that world much like lion witch and the wardrobe that kind of thing so when the books starts we've got. Alice is back home Her and her friend Finch Had defeated the spinner. If you will and all the stories are free but not everybody's happy about that that's right and that is what leads us into the night country which let me give you a bit of the Synopsis. With ellery. Finch's help alice escape the hinterland and her reclusive grandmothers dark legacy now she and the rest of the dregs of the fairy tale world have washed up in New York City where Alice's trying to make a new unmatchable life but when Alice learns something is stalking the hinterland survivors. She suspects their deaths may heavy darker purpose. Meanwhile I actually don't want to read this next part because I feel spoiled. I am not going to read the next part of this synopsis. Because I feel it spoiler. That is surprised about halfway through the book but there is some cool other stuff happening as well so manda yes you recently. Reread the HAZLITT. Prior to reading the night country said right to be fair. I kind of read skim debt because I remember things I was like. Oh that's right now. I'm more expected to me. How excited were you to get back into the world of the Hazelwood I was. I was totally excited. I mean we. We all love our fairytales. Anyway but of course this one this this particular world. These are not the scrubbed up very shiny fairytales of a shirt nineties childhood. These are kind of old school. Lots of Gore. Plenty of death and violence darkened cruelty and beauty right which you don't you don't really get enough of but yet it was just so delightful and original with these stories that the author had come up with That populated this lovely his would world and so I was really excited to revisit that 'cause this book The first one the Hazelwood was like Scott and I absolutely loved it. Love Love Love that book hard and not you know. It's it's kind of scary when the next outing is is upon you. And you're like am I gonNA love this. Do I have to like compare this to the other one. Do I just linked together as an expert in the story you know because you WANNA give it. It's fair shake but at the same time. It's hard when you love the first book in the series so much absolutely. It's it's really hard for each stripe twice as they say. Yeah and has she says in the afterward second books are hard only imagine I actually. Yeah it's you know so many times in movies and in books they call it the sophomore slump and I think it's partially because people have such expectations and then it's like okay like we got up. We gotta be fair here but yet the same time. It's like you know they've got a catch lightning in a bottle twice for you. Yeah and I think oftentimes you see this happening with TV. Shows a lot too is like there's a story that they wanna tell maybe in the first season and it's that person who that small group of people have been writing that story for years and years by the time we get to it. You know like she. I don't think she just came up with the hazelwood on a whim decided to go ahead and start writing it three weeks later. The novel has done something she'd been working on. I would assume for quite some time. It was so lovingly. Thoughtfully put together So you know so. Where do you take the story after that? Exactly it's a love of a lifetime than you know what you do next so keeping it splurge free. Should we just share experience scores with the night country? I think we should and I'd like to go. I if I may to our listeners. Who HAVE MESSAGED US? You may notice that. We are a week late on our episode. And that's because before even starting this book I have been in a bit of a book. Slump is mainly my fault. So I'm just GONNA put it out there so I came into this with a little bit of a struggle but once I really started this book. This was a pure page Turner for me. I really enjoyed going back into Melissa. Albert's world I was really excited to see what was next for these characters in this world and where it was going to go and once I really started it I I loved being that experience. I think that's a really really wall said how about you. Amanda what's your spoiler free experience I mean I I loved it I would almost say I liked it even better than the first one It's possibly because the first one was so good. It left so much content in my head it didn't have to rebuild itself but Guy Loved it. You know this one takes place mainly in our world which was a just a whole different kind of dynamic for me from the first one and I really really enjoyed that. Ooh I like that. You had that experience and that it was almost like better than the first book for you. That's like that. That is shocking. I mean not like anything content wise. But just like. Wow Yeah okay I always like I books better too so adding on it in going in slightly different directions with it. I really appreciated. That was very much along for the ride. I agree on that. I think it was really smart. How she told the story and I really listened to our Jonah Junkies episode that Scott and I did about this book Recently to and Scott had been really nervous about a sequel or more books in the series. Because he's like oh it's just so you know so good and you know you don't WanNa ruin it and I think that she approached it in such a smart way that it was almost like impossible for the first book to be ruined like she did just enough of like different stuff. You know what I mean. Yeah I completely agree so for me I would say this was a solid page. Turner not quite the full-on Obsession. I had with the first book but that might have just been like head space or maybe being nervous about where this book was going. You know just because it is a follow up to book. I love so much but definitely a solid solid page Turner. I have to say that that the first book a and I and I realized some of this stuff as I've talked to friends who have read it. Since we recorded our episode it starts as a kind of traditional you know y a fantasy novel and goes into a very dark unique kind of twisted confusing place and it's very unique in the way that it goes that route this this book. She does a good job of taking from that dark place and making it kind of a more like realizing okay. This is kind of a dark and kind of a grungy world going on from that but but creating a story. That is very different. The tone overall starts from where the Hazelwood let leaves off but it the whole book feels like a very different story and I think that that as you said works very well for it to not try and really be the exactly the same. Yeah I one hundred percent agree with that and I think she gave the characters a lot of room to breathe and That that was something that was really to the to praise this book. And like how much How it was even better than I could have anticipated that you know. The characters are main characters finch and Alice. They're not together for most of the book. And you know but like there's like this way they're kind of communicating which I don't spoil anything and of course we're getting to follow each of their adventures so we're seeing them grow. Were seeing them change. We're seeing them develop as people and it's not like the two of them were like I don't know fighting for airtime or something like it just never felt crowded. The book felt like it had a lot of room. I completely agree. I think it was just very very tactful of her to I felt like she put in the The second perspective chapters in really good places. Yeah it's really the whole story out in a way that was timeline made sense but didn't didn't spoil itself like you didn't see all stuff coming or at least. I didn't know yes so I thought that was artful and also just really well executed. I like that too. There was a lot in this book that I didn't quite see coming and I really appreciate that especially with Finch's story. That was the one where I was really like. Oh okay so that's okay. We're doing that and that's what's happening. Yeah I can say that coming out of this. My favorite characteristic FINCH I. I can't say that finch was my favorite character in the first book but the I was just fantastic in this one I liked the believability of of how his character grew and developed He definitely has gone on a journey since the beginning of the first book and And I bought it matters and somehow he ends up being just so human you know you have all these you have all these perspectives and people that you're meeting and talking to and you know they seem very normal and then when you actually get when you actually hear from him and the way that he talks in the way that he reacts to things like. Oh no no. That's how a human would actually be in this situation. I know what you're saying so I think we're all probably really really itching to get to the spoiler section so we're going to give our appeal scores and I was going to kick it off. If that's okay with you guys go for it. Kick so for me. I'm actually. I'm kind of still looping this in with the Hazelwood and I can't remember if this is the score. I gave it last time but I really want to say mass appeal on these books. I mean and they are kind of massively marketed. I know that sounds stupid but I mean like you can get this at target and that kind of says something. It says that like the first one was such a hit that you can get it like really really easily assessable early and I just think that it's such a great book for people who Love Fantasy for people who fantasy is not their thing like it's not high fantasy it's not you know lots of court Napkin. Nations and families to follow or anything like that. is portal fantasy. It's dark fantasy as I said it's cruel and beautiful She has this way with words. That is incredibly luscious luscious luscious and if you like that she is definitely the the writer for you. I have to say I agree that this is a mass appeal book I think that the that both books in the world are I find this one to be even more satisfying altogether than the Hazelwood? And and that's not that's not a knock on the Hazelwood at all. I felt the Hazelwood was perfect. In the way that it was done. But this one is even more for the masses. If that's possible I think that the way that she she you know expands the universe that she's created and explorers even more adult. Themes in this is is brilliant and really Will will will reach out to a lot of people. I I agree I B. Let's call it what it is folks. It's massacre massively appealing. But I also yeah. I think that she She pulled off an empire strikes. Back on this on my is I think if you like the first one you're gonNA love the second one I agreed that the satisfaction factor is there. They kind of made sense to Just based on where we left the first one you know the details of it definitely gets tied off but she left this beautiful door open for more story in this one There's still a lot more stories of you told here even about these central characters but There's just a really good get when he sylvia aside at least I felt there was so yeah. I'm giving it a massive appeal for Sir. Perfect all right. So we're going to go to the spoiler section but just one last thing before we do. How cool is it that works in a bookstore? Cool PRETTY COOL. Are we'll see you in the spoiler section enjoying the show. Please like in subscribe online tools. You can find us on twitter and Instagram at John Junkies and don't forget to visit the website. John Junkies Dot Com. Okay welcome back to the spoilers section of the night country a hazelwood novel as it says at the top Samantha. Did you read this in kindle or did you have a physical copy? I read on Kindle Which are some? I'm always a big fan of Kendall for your I. One thing I really wanted to call out is how frigging awesome. The artwork is in this Handle screens like looking at the looking at the covers of the books in of just the little call out notes for each chapter is just a delight. This is so gorgeous just like the first one was. We actually do have a physical copy and it's kind of really pretty like dark navy blue and then it has this coralie orange for all of illustrations around the book. And then of course it has beautiful end pages that are like vines with white flowers and bright orange and then it has all the beautiful little chapter. Headers yeah this is such a well designed book. Do Do did the kindle edition. Did they find some way to put borders around the stories Well I'm reading it on the kindle APP on my iphone just to call out all the brands okay I think I remember any boarders no of just as just a little illustrations at the start of each chapter and then of course looking at the cover and stuff when it goes into a story Lake Sophia Story. It has been pretty little steph around the corners which that was one of my favorite parts of the book was so furious story. Oh yeah she was great as a character absolutely. She was a great foil but almost like a foil for Alice. You know somebody that's like she she doesn't. Alice is so uniquely of both worlds and she's never gonNA fill fully fit in either one and there's kind of like she's really struggling with that through this whole book and Sophie was a good example of like. Yeah Alice you're you're not like these these guys I would say one of the one of the main real real points of of these books and of this one released specifically sort of that question. What does it mean to be human and that having the juxtaposition of characters just really illustrates that in a lovely way you know ultimately I think it's it's about this ability to change like we talked about finch in the first part of this You know where he starts from into where he goes like ignite said he's the most human one the book will. He is the one who has sort of vote the longest to go and manages to get their guests their compassion and gets there with being honest with himself and being honest with. I'm this person that he cares about I think that's really lovely The stories unfortunately because of the way that they are written by the center. They are locked in this luke. There's no they can't really grow. They're sort of stuck in whatever Point of view that they were in the thing with Alice. Straddling Bolt those worlds is because she was written to be that way but then she was taken out of that environment in raised in the human world and taught to think differently I I love that question. Love the journey of exploring without as Scott Are Huge fans of the theme of what it means to be human and normally you see that in Saifi so it was you know with like ai and staff so this was like really cool to see it in these books especially in this one from a. You know a book lovers view and it's giving me these whole new kind of ideas about. Naidoo believe you can D- NFL book if it's really not for you but like. Oh my gosh. Don't D. and F. it they're stuck to get to the end. You have to find out how the story finishes so they don't just stop. There is a really funny way of anthropomorphic sizing. I can't say that word right now. Works works for you get what I'm saying. I'm worse the worse books. It's just like the Anna Works. I have to also say spoiler wise. I really really loved. Finch's story line. I thought it was so cool. Oh Yeah for sure. Finches story could have been a book in and of itself. I would've been happy I would have been very happy. Did anybody else love that? Like he was kind of like for a little bit of time there. He was traveling around with these two. Other dudes like they're backpacking through Brazil or something. Just a just backpacking their way through all these dark Lord Fairytales Sale. Yeah these other too humid guys. You Might WanNa be like cheese like how do you refu chase? Get into these places and then it up and then the world opens up even more and you're like there's refugees and transplants all over the place. It's like this ultimate Yappier. Yeah I know they're just. They're turned out to be a lot more. Humans knocking around in the Hazel. Then I think we expected hinterland stands and then how do you say her name Empha- According to internet which has to be true of your lengthy? You'll lampey I had a hard time with that but I love that name. It's really pretty written out but I just can't fit it in my mouth really well. Yeah well there's a character with a really similar name in court of Thorns and roses. Yeah and I kept in my head first envisioning her. I was like no. I'm going to stop it. Ron Fantasy series. What an interesting character that girl is. Yeah I. I like that almost like an unreliable narrator situation there. Yeah and no honor among thieves. Yeah and In in Fantasy as in life You you don't necessarily know if someone's lying to you. You have to make this decision to trust them or not but he did make her promised the last part of of their agreement so that part I think he was sort of hedging his. That's a little bit their shit. Bit of honor. Yeah Yeah like there. There's something here I don't know if it's just you can't really break an oath If you made it I don't know if some but that's inside baseball with yet to be fulfilled her commitments. She fulfilled her commitments on one hundred percent. She just didn't tell the whole story lies of I love this game of telephone of what the night country is two different people to yet. That was fun it was also just it was fun to kind of how like at original. Grimm's fairy tale can get watered down because I like the fun Chinese versions of Varied Hills. Un's that I know But to kind of see how it can more from something you know deeper in Warsaw sinister. Perhaps into something that's a little easier to take with the bedtime story of. I liked it. She kind of created that model within itself. Yeah that's death really interesting. It's like a macrocosm microcosm for like fairy tales and then fairytales within a fairytale essentially I just enjoyed the travels of finch and listen. You'll empty. I just I loved where they went and what they did and their interactions and that Finci no took these little artifacts to Hawk and I loved Grandma outlet it was so cool. I don't know I it makes me. Kinda gushy like I was super anxious and I mean anxious for finch and Alice to be reunited. I was stressed for the whole book. But at the same time I loved the method with which she was able to write to her so magical and so cool and I loved it. They were so you know like they just love each other so much and they were so excited to be reunited along with me as a reader. I was definitely nervous in this book that that he might not be in it. I did not read the jacket because I knew it was going to read the book I I was nervous that they weren't going to be getting back together. Because they're they're like relationship to each other was so complicated and at times problematic in the first book that they lie to each other level. I do a lot. They used each other which she would she straight up. You know talks about in this book and I was afraid that there wasn't gonNA be any closure to their relationship. I was really really happy that there was there just admitted that they loved each other. And like all right. We're GONNA WE'RE GONNA we're and she said okay. We're going to get them back together. They deserve to be back together. Yeah I liked that part. That's let's get that I was hoping for P. Yeah they've been through so much you know. They really done a lot for each other. Yeah and like I mean just like how much he helped her and like we kind of know this from the first book but we get more of a picture of it in a second book like he was playing the lawn game to get her out of her story and like the diligence and everything that that took. It's like he's just such a hero. Yeah I mean she's a hero to but you know like he doesn't disappoint are. Are we not GonNa talk about the fact that he's like in his forties now though he's not his is it okay? It didn't he get like yeah he is because he was like nineteen when they went there and then he then he waited for her to grow up in the hinterlands to save her. He didn't really age that much. It was when she saw him she. He wasn't the boy from her prep school. She had become a man. But I think it's more like in a emotional and spiritual sends than like in an aged sense right. Yeah I actually. I think they actually caught up to each other. 'cause when she breaks out of her story in the first one. That's the first time I think she notices that well. Some time went by while I was in there. Yes she's not now. Yeah and it was a couple of years on the outside am. She's nineteen by the end of the book and then They mentioned to that like it's been two years on the outside for her and he thinks it's just a matter of weeks or months. That's right so I think they're both nineteen now. I mean there's an argument to be made that when like it was like pulling out. His life force in his hair was going gray and stuff maybe he looks a little haggard now looks like a really haggard twenty year old but I might my calculations were around the same age still could be wrong. But that's that's what I got. They kind of Benjamin. Button met in the middle. Sure you gotTA. Sometimes I guess to be fair by my math. I guess I'm a little bit Miss Remembering it. But by by my by my math he'd be in his late thirties. But maybe that's I don't think so I think it's the time passes quite differently in the story kind of my idea and also I mean I'd like to think like what what her mom comes home. At the end of season she says. Is this the boy that saved you? Yeah true mccown GonNa tell. Is this the Boys Dad? Boys GRANDPA. That saved you. Yeah that doesn't quite the same ring to it does it. I just feel like even though L. is pretty loose on roles she would've balked bit. L. is so cool. I loved her in the first book. And she just she. She continues to be a bad ass Yup but a doubts adapts in her human and she didn't exactly get a fair shake a child that either growing up where she did know she. She grew up Kinda between worlds to lecture. I appreciated the relationship that they had in this novel. There's a lot more honesty between them. I mean Alison still not telling her everything. And she's being kind of I mean. She's kind of separating herself as an adult in a way and think natural though. Yeah but there is th. There is much more honesty than the relationship that they had in the first book. Obviously because stuff is out in the open and the truth is out there and and you know they're calling each other on their bulletin and I appreciate that that's I think the only lie that I remember her telling her was that she was staying at the Best Western. Yeah Hell Elk but other other than that. I think it was just a matter of her. Not Saying things which isn't exactly better but at least it's not outright lies right and some of that like you said that can unnatural growing up and then that's all such as part of I think Allison's discovery of which world she belongs to and then she's also really trying to keep her mom safe to. Yes she is. She definitely relocates in order to try them Save Ella from further exposure. But you know Scott and I've said this to many book characters over the years and I'm sure you have to Amanda and that is you cannot decide what other people get WanNa be in your life. You can't decide. And if book characters were just listened to us readers and just let people make their own decisions and not try to protect them. Were omit them or save them. It's like y'all could save yourself. Big Headache Yeah. You gotta be more rice. Lower Hamlin. Was that another call. Back was a called that but yeah that that's what I appreciate about. The relationship in this one is exactly that like she chooses to save to like you know. Try to protect her mother but not in a disingenuous way. Which is what often happens. You know she's not lying to her to keep her out of it. She's just she's She she tells her straight up. I don't want you involved in this. I want to protect you. I'm going to do it. I don't you don't want me to but I am going to do it. And that's just that's just what it is because stone-cold said so so. Let's talk a little bit about Alice's story. Line I okay. I'm not trying to cheat my own horn here by any means any means but I knew. Daphne was bad. I knew it was her but I did not know that her master assassin will small Alice. That was a good twist that that was a good twist in A. That's what made me realize I'm like wait a second. What is als three times? What is that story? I only remember getting as far as like killing the brothers and then turning her is back on the castle for birth for voting and that was like wait a second. I don't think we got the whole story did we. There's a short story that came out between these. It was like a short story that came out in the paperback version of the Hazelwood. That we have not read yet. I wonder if that goes into more detail of Ellis three times. Oh that would be good. We should look out. We've got to get on that people did you. Guys all suceed Daphne. Coming as the as the bad or does she full you. I knew she wouldn't good but what nobody is. Good from there i. It seemed like she was making some kind of power play. I did not see the big reveal of her. I actually thought you'll lathi was the spinner in disguise. I didn't think that that's a good theory. Though it was barking up the wrong tree on that one. I didn't see a a bad though so that was a big shock to me. No I did not see you. Alanthea's bad either. But I definitely saw. Daphne is bad I was just prepared for like a severance nape situation or something along those lines but I was. I was pretty certain. Yeah yeah she's she's the she's a fun character. Though needle she was caps. I love the hotel and I love. It's creepy dilapidation. And all of the creepy creeps that live inside of it and meet there. I thought that was so cool. What a cool setting. Since we can't be you know all the way in the hinterland like let's just make a really spooky beautiful fairyland hotel. Can I get a consensus here? I'm trying to summon a ghost. Do I go down the hallway old? I'm just I'm it's not it does. It wouldn't have been my instincts but hats off to alice the I probably would have. Just done it in my room. I don't know why maybe she was like I can't sleep in their. If it goes in my room like I just can't I just can't I would. Maybe go to a different room. There's clearly a vacancy so I I don't know it just needs to with that. I mean I loved it. I loved that she would do that and didn't really think twice about it. I loved the ghost. I was getting haunted. Mansion Constance Hatch Away Vibes. I was very pleased with the goes depiction worked with just great. That was so funny. Yeah I felt a little moaning. Myrtle in Maryland. Kate Bush she on a pretty good sense of perspective. I felt really. Will you know there's not a lot to do so this is kind of like this is a big deal for her? Yeah likes to her comment about monstrosity of her dress. I was the first one before they figured out. Stop wasting delays on my God I yes. She has a good gallows humor that I really related to. I did like that. There was a whodunit aspect to this. Because you know it's like okay. I knew Daphne was bad I knew she somehow involved in this pulling the strings but I couldn't figure out like who else could be involved Like who that main hench person was and I was like. They haven't given US enough tools that it's another character so I was. I was really kinda confounded. You know but it was smart that it was so no. They gave us the character. She just did a really good job of obfuscating right thought. It might've been Sofia to be honest. I thought she might have been like the person I really did. I considered her because I mean I felt like she was being set up like her her wanting to be able to die. I felt like it was a setup for someone giving her a promise of you know if you if you get this done you will be able to die and you were right because that that is kind of true that is true but it was not in the direction that how is expecting. Elson reminded me of is the movie cabin in the woods with the willing sacrifice where you have to kind of trick people into Bima willing sacrifice cabin in the woods. She has she loves it. Oh a love it yeah sure. It's like favorite horror movie. It's her only I was GONNA say. That's that's probably of the three horror movies that she's allowed herself to watch these real Bradley Whitford into it. I'M GONNA watching. Yes you soga good in that Soga. So good is so funny yes so how much should we love the three little triplets young? That was cool. It was at your take the trio. Yes the trio. Thank you They were really creepy. Made more so by being in a Catholic Church. I can imagine that would be the case particularly well in especially as these little tourists in there. They're like out this weird religion they have is so great like I don't like what they're doing but I must imagine they're like taking pictures and eating popcorn and like we're hanging out with Jesus with this bloody cheeses. We like blood. No you know that church must have had one of the most like depending on your perspective. Either beautiful or grotesque crucifixes. Ever a very bloody Jesus. He would it would seem to appeal to their bloodlust. Bloodlust pincher landers. Aren't we all dying to go back to that library and just go into every book and see what's happening? Oh Yeah I mean. There was at one place with all the goats. No that was fun. Okay Tunnel Skin Cape. I love how. Oh my God I know I love how much that I- Lanta today. I love how much mastery she had over the travel. She was Cadillac. Hold on I'M GONNA pop over here for a second pop in there and okay now back. Yeah a lot of questions about her character. How long has she been bebopping around the world and earth spell and all that kind of stuff? Yeah like her real story her true story. I'm dying to know dying to know. I love the imagery of book being portal to another world like a world being being wrapped up in a book. And that's how you get into it. I I've always loved imagery probably since I I played missed as a child And so yeah just having a library of books each books takes you to a different world is kind of my crack to its pagemaster vibe. Yeah exactly yes totally an I love that and I also just loved the The great away that she described and set up the dead world where the library is just that sense of decay and nine S. That's left yeah. It's like it's sad but it's like really beautiful and you can just like you feel like you can smell it and you can see it. Yeah it's quite something and you know what I also want to say too. Is I love when books are written for book people you know like. It's like a book for Bookworm. So I feel like it's a total love letter to book worms and book people not just fantasy fans but definitely fairy tale and fantasy fans. And you know I said like what else do you guys want to add. But I think we'd be remiss if we didn't play out like you know finch became a spinner that one time. Yeah that's pretty cool. That he really did get to be the hero of his own story for a little while. It was like his dream. Come true but kind of a twisted way He got what he always wanted but it what he really wanted. Tell somebody wants what he really really wants. Yeah then in the end he gave it up. Yeah because it was it was a lot. Yep even even though it giving that up he'd thought there was a real good chance that he would lose the thing that turned out to actually be the most important part of his life which will be Alice. Yeah it shows like You know his bravery to win. It's like you know. She yells to him like to not let. Daphne be the first one in and it's just like really selfless you know that he just rushes in there and I love him. I mean he really. I mean at this point. He really will do anything for Alice any and he just trusts her implicitly still human. I love that. He made amends with his dad. Yeah that was really great to Can you remind me what the problem was having with his father? Because I don't remember I think a lot of it stemmed from his mom not being around anymore and it was like he was kind of an absentee father Yang He had that horrible stepmother. Who had just an rub him out of his father's life replace him with whatever child she was going to bring out. That's right that's right. I remember now so I think ellery and his father just kind of completely distanced themselves and ultimately with him being gone for like four years. I think what it would be And then coming back together and they're both clearly in different places in their lives now That it was a really nice edition. Yeah is out. Missed HIM HE. He loved him. He did miss him for like two years. He was gone. Yeah because his finch was convinced that he wouldn't that he really wouldn't miss him so silly. It's like of course shadow misses. You Bro. Yeah which sounds like an angry sixteen year old sort of approach to a problem exactly exactly so Does anybody know if there's GonNa be more hazelwood books? I know that she's coming out with short stories. Tales from the hinterland. Oh Yeah Yeah Yeah. I saw that. That's really cool. I don't know I haven't heard one way or the other means we certainly could pick it back up. There's there's always a possibility of another big bad or you know spinner could wake up or maybe it turns out spin. It doesn't have to be awake to really cause some Russ I appreciate and I feel like this is kind of a new thing because this isn't the first time I've seen this that she calls it a Hazelwood novel because I think a lot of room in this world to write more stories. That aren't that don't even necessarily have to feature Alice and finch. Yeah no I think. If there's a next book it could and I think it should be about you'll lampy and I will try to learn to pronounce her name in those cabins again. That's just what I've found. Maybe maybe there's different pronunciation out there. They that's not even her real name at the heck. I don't know it's really just like Susan B. And she was like now I wanna be like you know this mysterious creature that crawls through the different worlds. Yeah so I have kind of one. Final question do you. Do you get the impression that the the spinner was. The was. The May Jr was the wizards. Oh Yeah I thought that was pretty explicit by the end of it same. Yeah Yeah I at first I was Kinda thinking. It was just a story of one person who created their own world but when I thought back in it was like she filled. She filled it with fairy tales. It's like oh I think that I think that really is the spinner. Yeah he atlas She I WANNA say retrograded. He went back to her original like super beautiful visage which she wouldn't normally have been able to do with that kind of magic. I think that that kind of really put the nail in the coffin there right. This is who this is an. She's she's mad as hell and she wants her little world back. I liked her a lot better after that story. Like if I think like I liked the character in that story. I liked her and I felt for her. Like and so you know combining that story with who we know as the spinner kind of makes me feel for her a little bit more. Absolutely I mean. She only loved one thing in her life and it was horribly taken from her her father and it's not like they had a great relationship so happens she's like okay so I'm done now. I yeah no I agree. And there's something about like her. Motivation is really strong. I appreciate that. She has a lot of conviction. You basically you get to be a God and then you get that taken away from you. I can't imagine that would be maybe upsetting absolutely. I understand why she went to like she did to blame. Ls Or put outlets at the center of the whole thing. I can't even say blame Alice. She actually Changli did do all those things. Yup but yeah. I can't blame her for being a little miffed that means since I also loved that L. A. Got To tell a story that was really cool that she got into you know give her version of she knew of night country and I love that little tidbit. That Alpha Aka Grandma and the spinner when meet for tea about once a year. There was something about that that just it to me. It was like an evolution of a wizard stool and I. I love that that they were like they're not friends. They're not enemies but they're the only people that could even kind of understand what the other one is going through. The I agree that was that was neat. And it said something about Alpha and where she had been like where where she sort of went towards the end of her life emotionally. It was interesting. I'd like to think they were also hooking up but that was not. They didn't say that but I think it was implied. Yeah Very Control. Center had no more room left in her heart for a man but maybe maybe was a queer woman. So there you go I love it. Oh my gosh you guys. I had so much fun discussing this book with you so we have to close this out with our final execution scores. I have it all right. Manda how many fairy feet out of five which you give this book. I would give this book five feet out of five. Very sorry for the little fairy lost. It's over full of up but you know the the for me it's always You know do I feel like the author hit what they were aiming for the? It was delightful. She I really thought she shot it out of the park. She did such a great job as a follow up to a book that I really really enjoyed the first time in. That's not easy to do. Yeah I I'm all in all the feet all the fee I have to say. This book was not what I was expecting. It wasn't what I was afraid. It was going to be and it wasn't what I was excited for it to be either. It ended up being better than what I was excited for. I have to agree. I have to give it five fairy feet out of five. I think I think it exceeded expectations by being different while still capturing that same magic. I agree with both of you guys. I think people said it really perfectly. I love that idea. Amanda of like who wanted the author set out to accomplish. And did they do it? And I think that Melissa Albert really did and along with Scott like it really exceeded my expectations and threw me for a loop few times and went directions that I was not anticipating it going. I have so much face faith who I have so much bait and Melissa Short as for what you said that time you still can't say faith right. My fault were okay. They've made it this far full disclosure. I'm on some really heavy rotation right now for pain and I can't speak I can't you're you're doing great though really you. I just want to say how much I love Melissa Albert and I think she's amazing. I have complete trust in her as an author in no ferries were actually harmed in the making of giving this episode. Five out of five feet. Okay varies magical. They can have one feet. They can have five feet. They can have any number fleet that they want their ferries. I'll go out and leave a little offering to make amends to the folk. I think it's probably a good idea. I'M GONNA go. I don't have much. Give them a talkie. We are in lockdown here. No I never WANNA be on the wrong side of history when it comes to the good people. That's straight Manda. Thank you so much for being here. This episode would not have been the same without you. Thank you so much for inviting me on you guys. It's always great to talk to you about. The staff is a pleasure. It was so crate. The pleasure was all ours. Alright everybody without further ado. Let's say good night I'm Sandra I'm Scott. And please keep reading past your bedtime. Are you holding up I okay? I missed the opportunity to say it's as cold as ice and I really really really PA- Matron also good little silver here. Earth juice sent me wine. You people call it water.

Alice Finch Hazelwood Hazelwood Scott Amanda E. Melissa Albert Daphne TA Sandra I ellery WanNa Hazel Hulu New York City baseball Turner stalking John Ritter kindle
67 | Favorites of 2019

Genre Junkies | Book Reviews

45:05 min | 1 year ago

67 | Favorites of 2019

"Weirdo bookworm unite. We want to share our love of genre fiction with you. Some readers readers out there may look down on you for your love of horror sci fi and fantasy but not us so stop by as we discuss what we've been reading happy new year. John Junkie Spe- New Year that Sandra That Scott and we're back we're back to talk about how our favorite books of the year. Certainly the most notable to us probably the ones that are going to stick with us the most for me. It's a reread ability. Makes a book like a favourite for me but I mean we read so many good books this year. Yeah it very hard to the narrow it down to our own individual lists you know. It's almost impossible. That's why we kind of just do this kind of in a fun way and like pear cocktails ahead. Yeah because really. It's like I mean if especially if you've been listening all year we're very careful with the books we select and we don't pick up anything that we know is just GonNa be like a dumpster fire so it's like really a lot of good books and some of them end up being kind of middle of the pack and others of them. It's like you really love but it's like am I gonNa are- read this that's kind of my my litmus test and going over the list of books that we've read this year I cannot believe like how law how how many books we got in. There is some books at the beginning of the year that I couldn't believe that it's only been I mean less than a year since I read them. This year has been in weird like that. Yeah it's it's a trip. It's a total trip so I guess we'll just kinda get into it so as I kind of said before this is a little bit of the tradition here at Chandra Junkies and we've done some variations on this theme as well like Scotts birthday where we pick some books and then we pair a cocktail. That We're not making and drinking cocktails right now. But it's more like an inspiration and we always say that if you are somebody that doesn't drink that's totally fine. Used this as inspiration for a mock tail and you know you can get a little bit of comedy out of the idea of these drinks as well. Oh well yes yes yes yes Like last year my top books was cabinet the end of the world by Paul. Tremblay love that book so much and I picked an audio smother. AMF because it's the apocalypse funny honey funding games. That's it whereabout here John Junkies. I still think that that was a fantastic book. That yes fantastic fantastic drink. It was my magnum opus. So Sandra and I agreed that we're not sticking to it exact number although we're around five each but there is that round around their the neighborhood but not included in that. There is one that both of us need to talk about because this book is just means so so much to the both of us right. Oh Yeah it's more than just the book it's kind of a I guess we're we're counting. This is like the conclusion and also the whole series in a way five fates by Dr Blake. We love her friend of the show fabulous fabulous Gal who we've had on the show a couple of times because because we are lucky lucky. SOB's and she can come on any time income she wants. We have this lovely couch for her that she can come and sleep on pitch. She's on our coast. It's not that far. Can I mean you could just come sleep on our couch and hang out with us and watch them star wars please. Yes I mean that's just all we're asking much just little thing it's just your voice. I'm anyway this book series and especially this conclusion. Legion means a lot to Scott. Ni- my sister has been guest on some of the episodes for this series. It's like it's a family affair and it's it's so tied up in our hearts and our minds that it didn't feel right to just put it on our favorites list so we decided we're going to give it a sendoff with this cocktail toast post to it and so the cocktail we've chosen for this. There's so many good choices for this series. We've had these books on the list before. Yeah but the final book is five dark fates and what better cocktail than something with five dark fates in it. And that's the classic Long Island iced. He he Jesus five liquors Vodka Tequila Rum. Gin and a triple sec and I had hurts just thinking about it and of course you add half part of sweet and sour to that and a splash of coke and what you get is a drink that tastes like a sweet iced tea but it is alcoholic. A F- Jeff. I have to say I've not had a lot of good long island's in my day. You say that I like it when has more Kokin it cuts. What's the secret for you? Yeah I've had some in there just like I don't know like the the dirtiest nastiest leaders together and then like a cloying sweetness leanness but I know that a lot of people love long islets. You'll love long. I'd love there's could long island's out there you just have to. You just have to hunt. Where a perfect thing and also Brinson is an island? So it's an island. I think it's I I personally think it's perfectly appropriate for the series. Now that's a great pick so kind of in no particular order. We're going to go down the list but we know we have the same number one buck so we'll save that for a while we'll save that for last all right. Why don't you go first? So Oh another one of my most favorite books. This year was lock every door by Riley say Riley Sager our dear friend who we had on the show. Oh yes I absolutely adore this book S. I have found that I I like books. That are kind of spooky colty kind of thing that makes my heart real happy. I it's this is a new discovery for me particularly this year and this book does such a great twist on the ideas that are brought from Rosemary's baby which that movie disturbs me a lot but but and having recently rewatch East Yeah. There's some things that I think that I miss remembered. And so I had a very similar muller reaction to this re-watch but lock every door to such a good job of subverting that story and building upon it and creating. Its its own canoe original idea. I just I love the book so much I mean I loved it too and it's a love letter to Rosemary's baby and it's absolutely a fabulous three by fabulous author and I have a drink for this as well. Oh okay I I would like to hear your drink mine I well. We talked talked about it in the episode with Riley. We also talked about Rosemary's baby in my birthday episode of Jonah Junkies. What you're drinking with Chevy and then for the cult show the cult film series was actually screened for my birthday by my co host over there? Neil so like we've had a very rosemary's baby heavy year. I'm very happy about so I if odd could blush and extra tall of course right absolutely so vodka. Blush is a drink that they have in the film Rosemary's baby They don't have it in the book. I'm aware of but it's like a very simple old school drink. And it's vodka lime juice and Grenadine. So you just put. Yeah so the little little touchy grinding. Ending gives a little blush and it's kind of like joke in the movie. When Roman makes them he pours it like really strongly? It's basically a huge glass fought cut and and I just can't help it I mean. Of course I'd be up there in that beautiful apartment building looking out with the GARGOYLES. Shrinking Vodka blush. How about you? Well my drink is called the lock. Pick so the lock pick is a fairly simple drink. It is one part Bourbon A half part of pomegranate. I'm a granite liqueur. A half of lemon juice and two parts iced tea sounds a little tart It's actually have had this drink. It is a little tart It's also rich because of the ice tea. It's kind of along the same lines of a long island. ICED tea with less alcohol It's a really a good drink. It is pretty strong. Okay okay. But it's called lot pick so they have it. There's a couple options for you. There are no doors that are locked for for me. What's the next what's next pick you go? You'll meet a go go okay. So my next pick speaking of Jimmy is minor profits fits by Jimmy Coleus. Could Julius CAJOLES. Gosh I can never say I love him and I love his books. He's so fricking awesome awesome and has become our friend. We've gotten to interview him. which is an absolute wonderful thing? And if you haven't read his works. Minor prophets are just the one that we talk about now. Or we're the good demon. You are doing yourself a big damn to service. Oh it to yourself to pick those books up their fabulous sell sense. A big part of the book takes place place at Grandma's farm in Benign Louisiana. I chose a cocktail called cocktail. Allah Louisian- great name is a great name so oh so it was named for a restaurant of the same name around the turn of the century where it was invented. It's one of those and it's got Ri- Benedictine addicting Vermouth. And you can either do herbs saint or absence and patience bidders. Oh yeah that's it sounds. That sounds almost almost like a cesare. Eight is very similar which assessor believed was invented in Louisiana. And there's a lot of cocktails that are kind of like takeoffs of sows Iraq but I thought that sounded just Kinda dark swampy Louisiana perfect. If you're just curling up this book to to to set down one of those I want one of those drinks just aside from the book that sounds delicious I thank you thank you next all right. Well the next one on my a-list We're going to go with another horror novel for me and this one is brother brother brother by Anya. alborn Yes sir her. This book disturbed me so much It's pretty bad. I mean there's a great book it's so disturbing a so good and it it. It surprises you every every page and there's things that that are expected but even when they happen they're just terrifying and horrifying defying and they make you dislike one throw up. Yeah it's like you're just watching this person. The main character in that book just go through so much pain so this is a book that that is along. The lines of say hills have eyes meets the deliverance. Maybe something like that or sure but but the characters are much more human than in both of those stories like they're they're. They're believable while still being horrible. Oh they're just they're absolutely insidious and yet there is strains of compassion especially for lead. Yeah so my cocktail for this book is is a Moonshine Bloody Mary with a Bacon Garnish. Oh God can I can. I have fake Bacon Online. No it is very important in this book. You have real bigan okay. Well then I'm going to have to skip this cocktail. But why don't you tell us about it. So I mean you know you know the bloody bloody Mary of course share but this is made with instead of vodka made with moonshine particularly a stronger spirit than what you would have have in a in a vodka so you definitely taste that that spirit a lot stronger but moonshine is something that is typically Originally made made in a bathtub by people in the boonies. And now it's become a big thing and I actually quite like moonshine. But that's kind of its history and and then of course the Bacon Garnish is very important for this book for reasons that are so maybe all of us are disturbed so great great great. Yeah you know who would like that is Amanda. Yeah absolutely Nando. Be Down to drink one of those. You have to make that for Amanda. It's always. It's a shocker to everyone including myself that I don't like bloody Marys. I'm hoping that one day I I will grow into it but like the last time I was with Amanda somewhere we're for Brunch and she ordered one and I still try to sip and I was like it's like it's we're getting closer but I I couldn't drink a whole one. I think maybe you need more spice Senate for you. I don't burn more Tabasco. I don't know what I need but we're not there yet and it's I mean it's high bloody is in the title what is in it. They are typically quite spicy. But you not a big fan of tomato so I can maybe understand. I mean that's it it's like we have this hill to get over and I'm just asking the bloody Mary data meet me halfway. We'll have to invent a new body married. It's made with something other than tomatoes. Okay well you know anybody. How many suggestions spur send them in? I love beets I shall I go for it okay. So I'm just going to kind of go off in a little bit of a different direction here and I'm actually going to pick the wicked king king by Holly Black so technically we also read the darkest part of the Forest Amanda and I did by Holly Black and I did read the Queen of nothing this year. And hopefully man and we'll have a review in twenty twenty About the queen of nothing but Specifically I chose to focus on the wicked king because big significant part of the book takes place in the undersea court so you know opening under the sea sort of under the skirt by which I think think of all the books in the funk affair series Scott that would appeal to you since you love ocean e. stuff so much in the undersea is a is a wicked court. And so I felt like I should just kind of pay honor to that really. This is kind of just a wink. Wink nudge nudge. I love you so much Tali black cocktail as well. Because she's got us and this cartel when match her beautiful blue hair that she has. Oh so this is an ocean blue cocktail cocktail and its ocean blue blue cartel so you take your vodka take hypnotic liqueur. Okay my I my dear friend Bluecher Akao white CRAN juice will white cranberry ages and some lime juice and you have your cell phone under the party. I can't imagine this drink. I think sounds fantastic. Will we all know. It's another running joke. Blue Kirk Howen. I A fricken love fluker cow. Yeah we keep a bottle in the house at all times. I Love Lucre cal and I don't know I just thought it's such a dark kind of scary part of the book with the Undersea Court so so I thought we needed something a little little furry and a little refreshing. You want one. I I want all of these drinks right now. Some pretty good so I have a question about that book when you said that this would probably be the one that I would be interested in. Can these books be read out of order now. No now it's very deliberate trilogy with a Novella Okay. Between the first and second can bug poker and it's so so so good. This series is just painfully good. I love it so much. I think I might finally have to read Holly Black Books. Yeah it's getting to that point. I love her. Amanda Love Zer- come on get on our holly black ferry very lovable. Here go on go for it. What do you got next all right? Well the next one on my list is a song for a new day. Oh I this that this book really meant a lot to me. I have given this book as a gift to a few people in my life who are musicians musicians and suggested it to a few others. You know who you are. You don't need to be a musician to enjoy this book but man is at powerful if you are one it's such a great story of hope and drive and creativity That it just I- ban Dan. I think that this was maybe the most memorable for me. I think that this is one that I'm going to be giving out regularly because I think it's just so powerful my cocktail is not a cocktail so much When is the cocktail not a cocktail win? It's a beer and and a come on. We're talking about we're talking about you know punk musicians and rock musicians I gotta go with the classic. PABST blue ribbon. Oh my God shut shot up. Yeah Yeah it's hipster yet but you just gotTa go straight with this book this this this would chase real good with a with the canopy. VR eating maybe like a shot and. Oh certainly yeah but the shot is probably GONNA be Taka. We're talking about poor musicians musicians. Lord help us going to wall had talked but it can't be worse than this year off. Swilling we've been drinking on my. Gosh yes it's like drinking the Smirnov that we have. I'm sorry smear enough. You have a lot of good products but for some reason. This one that we're drinking is just not working for us. A punishment drinking this is a punishment I had a sip of my actual ever clear and it went down smoother than this. It's not a good. It's it's really not I feel like yeah. It's almost like it's almost like drinking like rubbing alcohol. Yeah it has that scene like less fun though and it's more serious third less less less okay. Did we clear syrupy. Because it's in the freezer cod. I can only imagine what it would be like warm it would you. So you'll be like drinking a little bit death. No I think we I think you and I need to stick to like the flavor off if we're GONNA SMEAR IF we're GONNA do SMIRNOFF. Yeah I think we might just have to upgrade something like grey goose or. There's a lot of good ones out there. I don't respect with this night. Shoot in my next book. Oh I love this book by David. Sonogram it's Another chess real real real real up the book it's horror and I always say that David writes for horror fans and it's always a love letter and it's it's always inspiring and brilliant and fun and funny and poignant and all this stuff that you want a good horror to be like he house. Have you know some social or societal commentary in there he has characters that you do have compassion for. They're not just like meat. And this one has a lot of love for like an eighty slasher type of vibe and it's about some students in film homeschool which David went to film school which we learned we interviewed for this piece. And they're filming something in a really really creepy be giant Manor House on the coast in England but exists that exists and Well they run afoul of some things. David does a really good job of taking classic horror ideas and and taking it for a spin in a really new dark direction. mm-hmm yes that's stays campy but original. Yeah it's inspiring like I love reading his books I she's two for two with me. So far are fantastic. And of course the pug which I mean really minute for Boris Boris. So we feel that we need to support his father and you you know so far. We've had that little pug shoutout in both books though. I want it to be same as I said I wanted to be. skink I want it to be the same pug and every revoke NATO David. Are you listening. How many times we have to tell you Sell my drink for night. Shoot is blood Red Sangria. Oh Oh good. I could definitely see a group of students film people drinking this. I do love a Sangria myself This one one is red wine club. Soda Cognac warm. Honey figs Red Or Black Grapes and Cherries. I I've never had a century with figs in it. I'm I'm Daniel I do too. I never I don't know why I never really thought to have that Sangria but that sounds good. It sounds really good. It sounds bloody pretty good time just like this novel or it so the next one on mine is surprisingly. Well no I guess not true the the next one on my list she keeps us. Keep this then probably not so the next one on my list is resistant by Rachel sparks. Oh Yes oh great great author another one God. We've had so many this year. It's it's sickening. I'm so so excited. When I discover an author who reminds me of Michael Crichton in that style in that that in that science fiction style of taking in a real thing and just expanding on it she does a really good job I liked characters I I it it still frightens me? The idea Of You know being completely you know like all. All of the antibacterial drugs out. There are gone. They're they don't do anything anymore. You can die from the paper cut. It's terrifying and she takes it on a path that I really enjoyed and I think about her in that novel anytime. I read a story about new new medicine or old medicine. No longer working. I think about it constantly. No I absolutely agree book and I will forever be indebted to Rachel because because you have nieces sade. Mice Port Vitamin C.. I take vitamin C everyday. Okay and my Damn Life and you make fun before until Rachel said no you you do need to take vitamin C. Yeah I thought I was being real smart. I tweeted Rachel about the vitamin C.. and Said Hey basically trying to prove myself right so no actually Sandra's right. It's not a it does help and sent me a couple of articles and like no she sent receipts. Thank you Rachel. Rachel set receipts Fred. So what what did you pick. Well this one I picked kicked two different cocktails and neither of them do you drink. Oh okay because I see cocktail specifically I thought for racial. You picked peer. She she makes you yeah. Yeah that's true before Rachel. That would be the Rachel and offer the book. Hey Rachel if you haven't had pliny the elder good stuff but no I actually chose Either an Mr or a de tap vaccine co on these are these are quite simply that the main in vaccines that you received to protect against diphtheria measles mumps rubella the Mr. You recommended booster shots shots. Vaccines Are you kidding. Yeah I thought you hear a backseat cocktails. Oh my God. I thought you were going to think of something with at like orange or something and you put it in one of those. You know syringe shooters you get the. MR IS S Gal. Mary Chino and that sounds awful already. Let's stop this madness instead of cocktails. You want us aalto. Go Get our booster shots vaccine cocktail. Yes okay I mean. There's no rules here. Rules Genre Junkies. Apparently wow how yeah I thought when you said you don't drink it you meant like it was liquor. I don't like no you literally literally. Don't you don't want to drink this okay so so instead of cocktail party if there is a way to take these vaccines orally. Don't ask me actually do at me. I'm very fascinated by that. But it's still so basically we're GONNA throw a cocktail party and people think they'll come over the the where like local cocktail attire. And we'll be okay. Roll up your sleeve. uh-huh we're going to give you an injection at home while there you have that well if you have not listened to the podcast. Here's a little unpaid plug of Saab owns marital tour of misguided medicine. Some of these vaccines may have started as a cocktail. I'll just say that it's pretty gross. Yeah another take it as a shot. Okay so I have one more picked before my final pick okay and again. This is like I sound so apologetic. But it's because I mean I really read so many books I who loved take a loved but again my my key here was reread ability for me and also once I've actively recommended to people. Aw So okay my last book before my final pick and all you books. You're all beautiful. Books drop catches look at the list of books that we reviewed this year you regional. They're great they're all good. Is Little Heaven by Nick Cutter. That's my next one too. Yep Yep list So this book is just phenomenal and I will continue to read it I will recommend it to other. People House was gorgeous illustrations in it and we do a pretty good a deep dive episode on this book but it was just so cinematic so beautiful I fell in love with the characters With our our motley crue of heroes and it's one of those if you like Kinda getting the band back together type thing and assassins and it's also supernatural and isn't it cutters so there's some gross l. body as just it's just a scary scary sentimental western contemporary time So so my drink or would you want to talk about their drinks. I just WANNA say like this book is so good and I really. I actually want to reread this again very very soon. He's probably one of the reasons why this really made it on my list. If you like cults like gunslinger style stories and cowboy cowboy things. Yes yeah it just it has so much and it has that nick cutter superstar spin bodywork work. Yes so good so good and and hard and it took me by surprise. I was not expecting it to be the book that it was. It does not like if you've read the jacket and you chose not to read this book. Take another look at it is not what you think it is first of all I. I found a great from the jacket. Yeah but it's even better. I mean listen listen to your aunt sandy and Uncle Scott here people like it's just damn good. It's just really damn good drink do so. Uh Sense the book takes place in New Mexico. I decided to go with a hatch. Watch chilly raspberry meal. ooh So the hatch Chile is our big staple of New Mexico there's festivals also lake fairs and stuff for the Hatch Chile and. I love things that are spicy. I Love Chili's so I thought this sounded so good. So you got a hat chilly you've got raspberry very syrup and vodka ginger beer and lime juice come on. Doesn't that sound real good to your out there in the desert at you know the cult compound is drink in the town and hopefully don't run it any elder gods well. I have to cocktails for this. I hope you're just breaking the law breaking the law now good. That was a sad sad. That was not quite right right so I have one for the three best characters ever and I have one for the concept of the book so I I have the three musketeers muskateers. Oh this is actually a really good drink. I don't know if you'd like Sandra because it's a lot of creams. Oh you know. I'm not in half but it's a really Lee really good drink. It's hey let's hear it is. It is one part cramped coffee like Colusa one part criminal cocoa and a one part cream uh-huh and it's I mean that kind of describes right there. It's it's like a chocolate mocha cold. Drink yes. It's called three musketeers tears because it has the three and I like I mean. It's called Three Musketeers. 'cause it's supposed to also tastes a little bit like a three musketeers bar. Shish doesn't in my experience but I I like see eight had that one before I have had that one and it is good and the other one I have also had this and it sounds gross. ooh Did tell L.. But it's actually really good. Okay so this is A. This is a story about colts. Yes and so late is involved in this drink. I love love it specifically warned kool-aid and whiskey actually a really good drink girl. I mean okay. Say it's really good might be going going too far. Let's call it a poor man's old-fashioned can we call it a crazy persons. Now I recommend if you make this drink make make the orange kool-aid a little bit weaker than you normally would weaker than on the package. You want to be a little bit more watery than than just like Bam Orange Orange kool-aid cherish but to actually go well together. Orange and whiskey is a good pairing. Yeah Yeah I'm just saying no it crazy. No it's a good airing. It's that's the thing so orange Kool aid in whiskey. Is You know same idea. Which one would you rather have of those two drinks on a daily basis? Yeah while you're eating little heaven George rather rather drink drink a whole lot more orange Kuwait and whiskey feel. I can drink a whole lot more of as you. My friend are a class act you you are a classy classy sob. What can I say I drink? The KOOL aid. Surprised at all. I knew you were gonna say that those Sir really great picks and I can actually see like our territories drinking that ladder drink. You're sure that your first one you'd put that Ice Diaz that'd be good for the desert. Oh absolutely we've gotta stay up on watch all night so you're gonNA probably want that coffee so you have another another one before the top pick. No it's time for the top. Oh my gosh. This is a shared favorite final countdown. Okay subtle we'll just say it on three all right right one. Two three recurs Jim. Five Light Crouch if you've been following along. I called this back back over the summer when we did this book. My book to be I was like twenty nineteen. Bring it on. Try To beat this book you cannot I. It was is not surpass of the books. We reviewed on the show I. It was not surpassed. Blake crouch is genius. That's really really. Oh aw he. He has a strong grasp on the subject matter that he's presenting and that he's creating this story based on and does such a good job of explaining it in a way that is understandable to those who don't necessarily have that same grass delay persons terms and words. Yeah I totally totally agree. And he has wonderful people that like. He always shouts out in his books. That help him with this stuff. And it's so digestible and it's so thrilling rolling and it's so scary. We absolutely loved dark matter. That was a favorite and recurring is just no exception so as a refresher it's about `bout you know in our future near future. Where where's it even I? It might even be like set in two thousand eighteen. I can't remember. There's kind of like current times current and Dan people are suffering from this disease co false memory syndrome where they're starting to be confused about reality because they feel like wait. This is is in right. This isn't my life have multiple sets of memory right and so of course from their. The LID just gets blown off of this and were off to the races. It's another one. That is scary. suspenseful thrilling SCIENC- but it's also got so much hard. It's got so much sentimentality. Beautiful introspection and relationships with its characters. I mean what more can let me say about this ridiculously phenomenal book. That I I mean like when people say they like to read and they haven't read this. I'm just I'm shocked. I'm like unlike O oh can you. I'm not I mean we're Kirsch is the definition the textbook example of a mass appeal book. Yes everyone everyone I really. I cannot think of anyone who would not appreciate it. Enjoy recurs and it is just that well done and it's scary and it's it's it's exciting. It's funny yeah but it's fun just so good I'll just so disturbing. There's a specially part of that book Doc. That a really scary part that I think about all the time because it was like real real real possible Salaam. I know exactly what you're talking about. And and that was a sailor Siam's the hour. We'll just say that was the start of me realizing that that particular killer kind of thing is a little bit of a a real like trigger fear of mine and then Joe Hill ended up putting cement. Yep this is actually something. I'm terrified of. I mean like Joe held in our salute to Joe Hill. I he didn't make it onto this list for me. I mean it's so fricking hard because of course I love it like you guys. This is so impossible to pick favorites. It's impossible I mean come on. I'm just let me just say some. Some of the books that are on that are on our list from this year overall. Why don't you just read them all off before we tell our drinks okay? We had deepest blue which is a beautiful. NFL really really good fantasy book like again. I could say with every single one of these books really hard not to put him in my top five. Yeah we had in addition to other ones that we've done we had severance with all my God. What if I want that book and that was again really? We really close the Tesla legacy. Can you save one more thing about severance real quick. You know there's a lot of books that are very like trying trying to right now. Captured the millennial experience. And you and I are millennials and that is one of those books that I think really really captures. Yeah it really does it does it. In a really speculative kind of SCIFI. Sorry sorry Oh yeah. No one hundred percent agree the Tesla legacy which I really want to retain the book is it out yet because that probably not yet since has been less than a year since we read it. That was a really good book. Really good start to a series series brilliant brilliant author. Yup We have creatures of wanton ruin talk about moonshine. Oh about your mood. Shying that was a great read wildcard we lose so do and there was nothing wrong about the book. I think the story just for us and what we got US feedback to for a lot of folks wasn't what we were expecting. It just was not what what it wasn't the same feeling as the first right. Yeah I think you know looking back at that book I feel like if if it existed in a vacuum I probably it pro- I probably would've enjoyed it even more it just I I wanted more. I wanted more of the first book and I think we all wanted more of the game. Yes yeah so then we have gods of Jade and shadow which bought let me let me go ahead and tell you that it was real hard. Not that was real real hard it kept coming on and off and on off the list phenomenal book C.. Which rising sea which which riser beloved Sino? Sarah Haning is so good and CICADA. We have again. We've we've gifted that book as well as her as as well as the first book too many people and it is. If you like fairytale retailing's got a raise. You GotTa Read Sea Witch and got a cert- with the sequel and I actually think the two can be can be read out of order. I believe I said that on our review I do believe they can be read out of order but yeah I personally personally think you should start with C.. which because that's the way I did it? Then we have betty bites back. Oh that was a fun when we Kelly on for that yes we did and I. I think it's a great feminist Short Story Collection Monitor Philanthropy Collection. There is a couple of individual stories in there that really stick stick with me. I'll probably on their own deserve to be on this list but a really good and you're into short if you if you like short story collections elections at all. This is one to pick up. Oh yeah unburied Carol. That was a really really tough one for me because man. That book had such an impression on me. Unburied Cheryl is a book that actually suffered as far as getting placed in the top five by being more recent. I still need a little bit more distance distance from that book to really really nail down. How I feel about the M- the how memorable it is to me? I'm still thinking about it but it's still. Oh very fresh to me. God I love that book. Walk the darkness down a really uniquely written novella yet. No that book. Look I think more than picking cocktail. You'd pick a psychedelic drugs to pair with you. Know that's just such an experience and I'm so glad. Yeah I read it and then finally we have feeding the wolf the last book that we reviewed so last week we reviewed and we interviewed the author. Yes and it was great. Read really could could read very very original concept in my experience of fantasy novel that revolves around mental health. Nothing but praise for it so good. There's I mean look I mean look at the list. There's so many we're gonNA need to do a bar menu next time and just everybody gets a cocktail because you're all all beautiful beautiful wonderful dogs. We love you so much. So what's your cocktail for recurs again with the spice so I kind of went with a book that is I mean a cocktail. That is kind of opposites attract. 'cause the split custody with false memories right so it's kind of like I wanted to conflicting flavors is coming out. She'll so I found the Serano. Spiced paloma cocktail lime juice. A golfing actor thinly sliced Serrano round grapefruit juice who's silver or Blanco Tequila Club soda and Assault Rim and Associates. kind of like. I was thinking you jinking. You're like oh this is kinda sweet Kenneth citrusy it just kind of Tangy eneg hit with the Ceron on the salt. And you're like Oh. This is kind of abrasive spicy way. which way do I feel? Which one is the truth? That's Kinda my idea. I like it a lot I it I like it a lot. Mine is not a cocktail. You all you do drink it. It is Alcoholic Galon. That's one ingredient so mike okay. I think a riddle I know right. Okay listeners. This cocktail is a spoiler for the book. I am going to set a timer. I sixty seconds. So if you're listening on apple just hit that thirty second. Skip twice if you haven't listened to it and oh not fifty nine minutes. I need fifty nine seconds and so all right so my cocktail is Krug Champagne. If you are familiar with Stephen Hawking being a great scientist he threw a party once a cocktail party with crew. Champagne the only thing is no one showed up and the reason why is because he sent out his invitations -Oday after the party happened it was a party thrown for time travellers and the only people who would have known that it existed and would have I've known to show up. Were people from the future lend us. They didn't want blur cover will exactly but krug champagne come on. We're talking about like three four thousand dollars the bottle. I would like some of that. Yes and I would have liked to have had some with Stephen Hawking. 'cause I adore that man. I know that would have been a really fun. Parted ready to entertain. Could you imagine the look on his face. If you showed up to his time traveler party eliminate it would have been fantastic. He would have had a strong reaction. And that's time right all right. Now you are spoiler safe everybody really job of keeping this really spoiler free. Yes Very Scott went and threw a wrench in it. I guess we gotta go. We celebrate the New Year to jump right into twenty twenty. Boom we got some great books lined up for you all in twenty twenty any and if you have some suggestions maybe some books they. You're looking forward to reading in twenty twenty. I mean the bar is just set really really a high. Two thousand eighteen was a pretty good reading year. I did read some extracurricular books that are not on this list. Actually kind of plug accelerate the cold show. Never play both all my shows in everything. I do Four Spooky Slumber Party. We're going to do an end of the year. Recap and books is going to be included on that and I actually picked different books new specifically Books that we did not review on the show that I read were to that. Yeah Yeah Yeah. Yeah Yeah I look forward to sharing to all right everybody. Let's get ready for twenty twenty and even though you know every year is good in bad every year is ups and downs but your year and your life is not something to be gotten through. It should be enjoy. It should be free concelebrated because any day above above ground is a good day unless you are a ghost in which it is a great day. That's my parting. Wisdom for you. Be Alive or be a ghost my personal motto for Twenty Twenty Twenty is going to be hindsight. It doesn't have to be hindsight to be twenty twenty. Look forward with hope. This very macaroni brothers. I know yeah. I don't know if they've actually come up with twenty twenty. Now listen to yet but I always love it but if they have and they stole my idea. I'm going to be very mad with coming in for you. mcelroy's I I'm here I I'm here I'm here to say it I liked it. It's ours. Episode probably comes out today thwarted again by the brothers others mcelroy. All Right Scott thank you for great. Twenty nineteen great reading year. Sandra thank you for Great Twenty nineteen excited to spend twenty twenty the other. Oh I love it so I would normally say. Please keep reading past your bedtime. But it's new year's so instead I'm going to say have a drink and then turn off. Cheer night late and go to bed.

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64 | Fantasy | The Darkest Part of the Forest by Holly Black

Genre Junkies | Book Reviews

44:55 min | 1 year ago

64 | Fantasy | The Darkest Part of the Forest by Holly Black

"Weirdo bookworm unite. We want to share our love of genre fiction with you. Some readers out there may look down on you for your love of horror sci fi and fantasy but not us so stop by as we discuss what we've been reading John Junkies. I'm Sandra and I'm Amanda. Wait whoa wait Wa special guest. Amanda is back. It's been so long it has been it's been a long sojourn. Yeah we'll welcome back. So Scott here is Scott but he did not read this book very deliberately. We are doing a Scot free episode. Bill Scott Light the episode. A Scott Light episode your for the darkest part of the forest by Hawley Blah Blah. So this is kind of of a little bit of a support group because when this episode goes live. We're all going to be able to read the last in the trilogy of of the focus of air by holly me. This is good. which is the queen of nothing? And we're all GONNA die by the way that title. I mean come on amazing the main thing is so good. Oh my God so everything is so. We're all going to die because we're in this book. And she's kind of like said in hinted that she's not done with the focus of air world but obviously these characters are going to be like the lead characters and conclude a story that's is the point of telling a story. Yeah but how are we going to live. I I don't know what that really looks like. I mean it was bad enough that we had to say goodbye to three DART. prome krones three art great on three girls a lot of providers but no three crowns. We had to say goodbye at That though I know exist and be beautifully perfect the way they are. Yeah it thinks should end but it still has painful. Haven't hurts every day so we decided to kind of go back and read an older Holly Black Book which is a standalone called the darkest as part of the forest so this is like going to help us all get through the end of the focus of air. Yeah it's a it's a support drug. It's a support drug. It's a support group talking about the actual queensberry holly black. She's amazing we go down. We've done Komo's and episode where we talked about about the books that have come out so far on the focus of air. That's a while back. You can definitely find that. Listened to that episode first-half spoiler free as a first half of this. This is GONNA be spoiler free to of course but before we start talking about the darkest part of the forest. Let's talk about some John The things we've been enjoying mayorga. Oh we haven't seen you in a long time. No and I mean as opposed to going through months. You've been enjoying enjoying what something lately John Junkies adjacent okay. So this is not new. I was a little bit late to the party on this but so there are. Are these things called audible originals. I've heard is them. Yes okay. I've tried one out of one and I think they're fantastic. But this one's called heads we'll roll. This is the thing yeah. It's Kate McKinnon and Emily Lynn. There sisters which is obviously dear to my heart. Yeah 'cause we're sisters because we're sisters we're sisters stors But anyway so. This is hilarious. It's a little run. She folks don't don't necessarily around the kids but fine but Freddie you know normal normal thinking feeling adults. It's a delight I can't even really Genera it but it but it is Jon Rao like fantasy comedy. Yeah it's fantasy comedy comedy. It's very Oh I was like an acronym stick it. Don't worry about it not being really medieval because it's fantasy realm so anything. Goes you got your Tim. Tim Guns in their love hand. Love him he's got your Meryl Streep's you get just a whole host of excellent comedians innocent tires. It's it's definitely worth Tolleson. If you like to laugh or feel joy idea like those yeah if you feel those than listen to heads will roll audible original. I love this and I loved that this this is a thing they're doing and it's going to get so many people into reading. I think were really cool Yeah so in. The past has been on here when we've had star wars upsets sits and she reasserts as of airtime has not launched. Don't the man worrying letting the people know they outage you you. But here's the thing she's GonNa love it. You'RE GONNA love it Scott and I love it. It's amazing and it's all I wanNA watch every day for the rest excellent life so not oversell not oversell but if you don't watch it again right now you're just going to disconnect curl up into a ball and take a depression freshen up which is nothing new. Hey Scott how about you. Anything to share Mandal Laurean well Scott also also endorses the Middle Orien-. Yeah he he also fully endorses. The men literature and thumbs way up his star wars episode. We're we're really behind on it on the stars. It was up to ask please a right. But for now we're GONNA talk about ferries ferries ferries. But not like. They're not pretty kind a leather beautiful. That's they're not delicate now. Not all of them. Some of them in the dark is part of the forest by Holly Black. Give you all a little synopsis. Here in the woods is a glass coffin and in it sleeps a boy with horns on his head and ears as pointed as knives. He's her brother. Ben Live in fairfield where humans and the folk exists side by side since they were children Hazel and Ben Happen telling each other stories about the boy in the glass coffin that he is a prince and their valiant valiant lights but as Hazel grows up she puts aside those stories. He's on those. The horned boy will never wake until one day he does so as always the the first half of this episode is going to be spoiler free which is going to kind of talk about it in general terms man. What did you think of the darkest his part of the forest Well I mean I loved it yeah to loved it from moment one I actually felt like the way that that Holly Black painted these characters. They all feel very real yes. They're all imperfect which I love. I Love I love that. We're big fans of that here. Jonah Chunk. Yeah I'd like to see a whole person. It doesn't mean that they're bad or anything like that it just means that there's there's flaws to them then there's like room for them to grow. which is the whole all point of reading a story? In my opinion I love that she does that I love the setting of it. I love it it takes you like a second. As soon as she kind of reveals. This is within the first few pages ages Everybody in Fairfield completely knows and acknowledges that fairies are absolutely real. Yeah they have for generations right but but they exist sort of within our modern today world that says of course. That's not true but they just they just kind of exist with that reality and I love that this crazy easy quirky idea that they know it's all factual even if they don't talk about it and the knowledge it in everyday life they all like walk around with charms in their pockets gets and knowing. Hey you don't go into for example. The darkest part of the forest at night right or really any part of the forest forest. Really you never go there alone. And there's like things you there's they're saying it's just feels very old worldy in just a really delicious way. One hundred percent agree absolutely loved this book. I'm a sucker for anything center forest especially dark forest and I'm a sucker for anything. Holly Black does forever and always it. Apparently me too. Yeah we love love her. We're like hi welcome to the Church of Holly Black. Can I just say that. She is so good at naming characters tres. She's so good at our main Gal in this one. That's Hazel. Yeah love that Hazel High. fricken love that name. Yeah it evokes something. She's she's great at running character. She's at writing female characters and this book has something that I know you. And I both love and crave in our John Restriction. which is diversity diversity at Bennett on? Yeah he's just he's got a brother brother and it's not a thing. Yeah I love. It's not a plot point. It's important to his character. Of course yeah But it's not a device it's not anything tricky or like using I using him and it feels dirty. That's kind of Achey like really early on in nineteen. I mean this was whatever twenty sixteen or something but who cares. Yeah Yeah exactly. It just shows that she's like this is who I am and this is how I write my characters and I'm never gonNA use them bad like that and his best friend. Jack Jack is not white. He's a person of color and it's also just so wonderful and refreshing and it just is what it is it is. It's just nice to fold things in there where it's like. Oh these are actual people. I could know it but jack is a changeling many chain. Well I don't know any admitted changeling remitted changeling. But that's fine. I would also be fine with anybody being a changeling changeling. This is a safe space for you. You just be not the best thing you can be anyway so aside from all that stuff we love about holly black. I mean dear we even say our experience score. Because I feel like mind's going to be kind of Avi me too. It's it's obsessions obsession. Sean Obsession Yeah. This book is a page Turner like. That's an autre score too. Low too low on your on your scale but yeah no I just like eight. This book up. Yeah it's not a super prolong book. It's less than four hundred pages but it's like one of those that if you are not careful you would probably read in late two sittings like because you're not gonNA beyond reveal this. I wasn't careful you weren't i read it in two things really. Oh my gosh we our way. Late Way Way. Ah Far past my bedtime. Yeah absolutely I was reading No it was delightful to the point where I was like. Oh I have to go back and read that again. Maybe we able to talk about all also reports sometimes books. Just that way where you're like. I just need to like be in this world. Did you read it again. I read parts of it again. Oh my gosh like back to back. Yeah Yeah I sure So Manta this is not your first foray into holly black nor is it mine as we've indicated and holly black is not afraid afraid to get dark and we've talked about that before. She really troops into dark. Fantasy territory. more so in the focus of air trilogy the jury but in this one too and as a scaredy cat How were you with the scary stuff? Famous book As this is a card carrying scaredy Kat I just wanted to say that this is a very scaredy. Cat Friendly Actually the majority of the book as opposed to the folk of Error Trilogy Ajay or well the first two books commercial and the Novella. Yeah This one takes place so much more in the mortal realm that yeah. There's yeah I mean. They're spooky e creepy things happening. There's a there's a bit of a monster comes in there But it's not. It's not scary right. It's spooky creepy fun unnecess- but it's it's there's nothing in there that's really going to. I don't know for me. It didn't trigger any of my. My goodness like concisely. Yeah exactly which which I get very very easily so there's none of that. It's more of a mood thing. Yeah which I really appreciate. Okay Fair enough just WANNA put it out there for the scaredy indicate listeners and the audience. Yeah we appreciate it. We've talked at length about how Holly Black Rights Fe. And how does this really wonderful job job. I mean it's so it's so hard to like. Not over hyper in Gosh. But I don't care because it is. She is that good but she writes these characters that are likes. You'll have these beautiful what we think of as like Elvin humanoid characters and then she'll also have what's basically a small piece of bark that walks surround and plays tricks on people and like make sure milk goes sour the milk tragedy that was gross and she also has like big hairy troll creatures and like everything in between and it's so wonderful it is because they all play together so well exactly and I I think part of that is the fact that none of her characters are only one thing which is back to what I was going to talk about at the beginning. When the that's where it feels real like these these characters feel like someone you could meet because yeah okay? I Piccoli Beautiful. You know cheekbones that could cut glass whatever the thing is in this case ears. Yeah ears like knives. I'll socal so cool so cool but then then it's like the behavior isn't what you'd expect the person to be elven or otherwise essentially essentially in this book I think she refers to them as elves quite often. She does actually she. She doesn't do that much at all in the folk of error books In fact I think the only time they're referred to his elves as when somebody from completely outside the story ends up going into sort of the world of ferry and in trying to make sense of it says so these elves that are walking around. They're real like yeah that's like the only time she does this time. I think she refers to them as elves. Pretty liberally and I don't know this is just kind of an older holly black style thing or whatever she was just trying to evoke or by the time she got to focus of air. She's like They get they get it. Everybody I we love things set can temporarily next to ferry like we talked about with this. It's also really fun. How like it's kind of a tourist trap town because people like to come see the boy? They probably think he's a wax figure. He's kind of like a giant ball of yarn. You know it's just like a side show kind of thing but like it like it makes me think of like how Salem Massachusetts would be like where it's you know like you can get your skis and your souvenirs in years and you're trinkets all kind of like centered around this Sir fairy thing. I don't know very key very clever. I refuse to believe that fair airfoil dismount exist. Well that's because it does does exist. It does he's surfer real thing but that also makes sense that there would be people coming from far and wide and then they will reconcile in their own brains whatever they need to To convince themselves that their world story their narrative is still true. You like yeah whatever. That's exactly what we would do. As people if there was an actual real life Elvin creature in like magical coma in like a super super spectacular glass coffin. We would all be like probably animatronic Yay whatever he's just he's again he's sleep. The giant ball of yarn. There's something he's just a thing attraction just an attraction Manda though we worship Holly Black clearly we should try to be objective. And what would you give the appeal. I think maybe broad is that is that right well. It's your things right greeted because it again. It right edited No I think a broad I think it would. It would be appealing to anybody. Who even kind of likes fantasy stories? Because I mean if you don't like fantasy very much then you're not gonNa really get what's to be gotten out of this But if you're like even okay with fantasy like hey I did see that Lord of the rings movie then and I liked it like absolutely going to like this. I agree this is probably a good gateway gateway drug for people. I mean if you're already into fantasy I think you're just GonNa have a lot of fun with this book in this world if you're new to holly black. It's probably probably a good place to start. We started with the focus of air and clearly were tighter tracing our way backwards now but it's widely seeded needed. The this book is good. 'cause girl and cold town is good and then the focus of air trilogy and she has some other that other trilogy. That people aren't like as crazy about now that other one with theives and stuff and it we haven't read it we have it so I can't see I mean but here's the thing I think at this point we're so washed in the hall. He black lack blood. That we're GONNA love it. We'll just love it more or less than our other thing. I I in -ticipant loving it real quick before we jump to spoilers Because you are my sibling I would like to talk about the sibling. Bond in this book just a little bit. I found a TIPI very true. I did too. I found it to be very realistic. I assume she must have a sibling. She must she she gets it like it's you and the other person against the world even when you're not completely one hundred percent on the same page about things. Yeah that part doesn't really matter. It's like a it's a bond that you can't cut. Even sibling stopped talking talking to each other. For whatever reason like it's still always there right. It's it's the longest relationship you'll ever have in your life. Yes parents go before you do. Generally speaking Other loved ones that come and go in your life come and go in your life. Yeah the one thing is absolutely true is like if you grow up with a sister or a brother or whatever so you're going to have that relationship until you until until you that there's something about that so truthful in so indelible and she just captured that in a totally elderly lovely way. Actually if this isn't splattering one more question for the spoiler section for you. Who was your favorite character in this book? Ultimately Jack is is my favorite character in the book. But I mean that's not too. Yeah that's not to deter anything to make anybody thing anything else about character. The ban was fantastic. There was something that Ben does. That really reminded me of myself. which was he's very sarcastic and he is constantly instantly making jokes under stressful situations? That's true it is so me like I make jokes about. Everything sowed stressful. Not but like especially. There's some times where it's like not the time for show and like just slides one America and I was like. Oh my Gosh Ben you and I are cut from the same beautiful ceautiful ferry woven if you say so yourself and you're a lot like Jack because you're changing. We're not supposed to talk about that and we're not okay. Well then I guess we better take a quick break. Go to the spoiler section and we'll be back enjoying the show. Please like in subscribe on Itunes. You can find us on twitter and Instagram at John Junkies and don't forget visit the website. JONAH JUNKIES DOT COM. Welcome back to the spoiler section. Okay let's get into it get into it So he wakes up he wakes wakes up. How how does that unfold? Sandra Sandra beautifully does it. Does it well does. That's kind of like the biggest thing that takes until almost the end of the book to reveal. Yeah it's like maybe like trapper three or something like that. They realized that the boy is not in the glass coffin anymore. And that's a big deal. Yeah but I mean how he caught out and why as our and who sprung him out Hazel but Hazel though so we all love how the fate twist things. Yeah Yeah and when it's revealed that she's been living a double life. Can I just say I've fricken love those slow reveals that holly black dozen is in less so smart. She does it so nicely. And I'm I'm I'm really good like seeing the plot twists. Say where they got the I know you are to. They watched a lot of mysteries. Mom thanks grandma. Thank you both But I actually didn't see the final twist in this not Coming at all well. It was one of those things where you're running out of characters that it can be. Yeah you'd like who else is who else can be like also brought in at this point in the book. When you're like well I thought maybe it was this person? Maybe it was sovereign. Yeah no no and at once it turns out like Oh oh it was so satisfied and the devastation of she's been magic to weigh in night. So there's this grand grand reveal that for the past five years because at the deal. She made she's her jess that she made. She is magicked away every night to be a night with a K.. In the older kings service and she's done horrible things. Yeah because she you know kind of had to kind of Houston. He's an evil fairy king. Yeah so anything. That's Kinda done in. His name is bad. Will I mean but she clearly doesn't really have a choice like she like. She's like like no she's like hold onto him how we didn't talk about that the fact that as it is revealed the reason that she is beholden to him and has to Keep serving him is because has she made a deal with him right in order to get her brother Ben into this fancy fancy musical school I think in Philadelphia. Yeah and she does selfishly admit it was for herself to it was absolutely. It was because Again back to back. Fill for anybody. WHO's listening to us for the first time and hasn't read read the book that he was blessed Lash cursed little boy? Yeah because mom. I'm for some reason in her stupor. took him and she's like pregnant with Hazel and got her little boy and takes them out to dark part out of the forest and lays him out on a blanket and let him do his like baby thing while she's painting stuff and A ferry lady appears and she's like who let me paint. You lay paint this picture and it was like I. And so then she pays the lady and its course this beautiful and fantastic and so she gives it to the ferry lady and very ladies like Oh in repayment of you giving me this fantastic picture of me. I am going to give your child child this ability to create excellent music that a lake bewitch as I. It's like he will be drawn to it. He will absolutely have to do it whether he wants to or not. A- At least at that point moms like women do. It's such a ferry thing to do to give you this gift. That's like not really a gift but in their weird the way they think it's a gift I love when Hazel ran into her at the rebel. Too I mean she said. Didn't you draw me. And she said that was my mom and she's like Oh my gosh is it been that long along like they just don't think about time the same mortal time is not not time. That was fun. Oh my gosh. The revel under the hill was good. That was mm-hmm that evoked for me some Sergio Sarah J Mosley I. I was almost going to say her. Name Run Some some serious vibe. That's my part ask. A war. Is Stoutly under the hill at that Evil Labia Lover. The older king nodded Nice Guy. No L. NO definitely He's got a through line. WHO's young very true to his objectives? It's very true his objectives so one one thing that I really really loved about this and I can see a lot of people being critical about it but just bear with me on this thinking maybe on the same page as me is the fact that when they were like nine ten years old her and her brother killed ferries. Because isn't that like something we would do do like if we were in this world. We would have done that we did do that. We did do that he did do. I mean like one hundred percent. He's playing the music and she lops off the head attack. Which one would you which I feel like for us we would swap? We would swap would swap because I can see us both doing lobbing because for you. You'RE GONNA sit passively by. It'd be like pants loop pamphlet shield like give me that siler turn. Yeah but at the same time if we if we were doing it equally as often did haven't different upbringing than insulin Ben. But we much though right. We didn't have very white picket fence suburban upbringing. Like no so I can see us escaping into the the frigging woods and like let's kill fairies now and that's fine I agree. That's exactly the first thing he's like but I'll maybe well no because she would have wanted to lop two. I don't know if we all three played it or take. Maybe one of them one of US could have been like all. Hey Hey fairy or look this insist playing like basically be the gifter. Yeah and then you got your Pan Flute Player I man and you got the assassins swooping them up and we'll take a turn. Yeah no that's perfect. I'm so glad you agree because it's just something strange. Children in strange range upbringings would do and at home if you're listening and you're like Saeb like just know you're among friends. I know there are many people being like same same. Same Yeah Let's talk a little bit more about my favorite character. Ben So tell you about Ben though so I think about this the thing about that. I love the journey. I need that Ben goes on and I love him and severance relationship me too. I Miss Cana- tied into talking about Severin to is Severin's very complicated character. Because he's an immortal prints and he's been through a lot but you're seeing some things I love to real conversations when that happened especially kind of at the climactic ending when Severin tells him. I've loved you since like the third time you ever talked to me because because I love how you talked to me like and you would pause for me and I just have loved you for so long. That part felt very. Oh my gosh. It ahead really is lovely because like yeah in most most of the fantasy Eh. Books that I'm going to read I know or are going to be Kinda is Kinda Hetero normative share and so you can absolutely see in in your mind the version of the book where it's our girl Hazel and seven saying it to her Ben thinks that even Ben things yeah absolutely and so I love that it's it's just so it's so delightfully fantasy fulfilled. Yeah that it's you know it's and I love to. I love it so big. He loves Ben. And just it's like we don't know who severin's Ben live in the past. We don't know how he orientates himself. If people in ferry even really do that I mean if some people walking around is mostly tree. It doesn't seem to me like you'd be really hung up by gender like what I have other things to worry. We have other things to worry about. We're alive forever. Yeah and that's Kinda like how an race rates Vampires that I love to is that you just you just love who you love and I like the reasons. He likes Ben and I like that. He's seen all these ugly embarrassing side of Ben and he still loves him. It's so sweet all the reasons that you love then yeah and I like this rich complicated funny sweet occasionally scared and maybe you say cowardly like individual like. That's what people people are. Yes yeah he loves him for all that richness that he is I there's that part to where it's like you know. Hazel has been carrying around this whole thing. That happened with Haram all those years ago. And it's fine. Isn't it Kareem. Am I wrong. Corinne usually seen spelled with a K.. Okay well so so. Let's take friends. I Boy Korean or Khurram. I didn't look up in a pronunciation on it and it's not spelled away. I've seen cream spelled but we'll say Karim visit whatever you want. But he's like he's all he's fine he's out. We're friends on. FACEBOOK is a ball. She's been carried. Let's hold like the reason that she's like like has to kiss. These boys have various shallow relationships with all of them ruins people or yeah like she's got the that also feels very real. Because it's once you find out something how about yourself that you thought was absolutely true and it's like no actually you're like you're a bad storyteller when it comes to this partner for life and I like that. She likes Vikes that she discovered flirting. And that that was like a source of like something that works for because I think that does happen. The people absolutely and there's nothing nothing you know on paper wrong with that and I mean she. She wasn't outer hurt people or crush people or anything like that but nobody yeah because wants. It's revealed that like Dude Hazel. You're fine it's all fine. Everything's fine here now. I love a really good Use Use of an unreliable narrator course Scott. Yeah I just WH- yeah when it's believable when you look back at it yeah and you listen to kind of the the story as told just in your head of what that person was saying about themselves the whole time and what. It's believable to be like. Oh actually now that you know the truth. I see why you thought that but but it's not what's up. It's not the whole story right. I love that absolutely exactly Let's talk about your favorite character. which would be Jack so kind of Jack? Yeah I can. He's in their relationship. Yeah how often do you really get to see a change link represented in store. Not Very they're usually of kind of villain. Yeah generally speaking thing and trying to get back the real version of the person I love that his adoptive mom slash Carter's Carter's mom. She was not going to give him up nope she was not. She was like standing her ground. She figured out like Oh they changed my baby. I'm going to employ everything. I know to be true about how to fix the situation. Call her she gets all these women together right and they get this whole ceremony thing happening and she puts like a white hot ember to the baby's shoulder which is horrible but calls back the ferry mom thing and she's like all here's your baby you know like can I just have mine back like no. Oh she's like no. You can't have anybody. That does that to their kid. No you don't get kind of a king. Solomon thing she's like no. I'm keeping them both and you know what you did did and you know what you did. And it's this wonderful revealed that he has actually been in touch with that part of his life. He couldn't he would be unreliable narrator because Hazel doesn't know the whole story. Ben knows him better Bennis actual best friend. Yeah like he knows. They've revealed to each other. How weird it is to have flake flake very magic in the real world? Because both have it yeah And it turns out like yeah no actually for the past two three years. He's been going to ferry at least once a month us the full moon rival. He knows his birth mother. He does and he knows how to kind of speak very speak because turns out. He's just Franken Berry. Yeah he's doing he can out here the quote unquote real world. Yeah but it's A. It's a sojourn again. That kind of brings me a little bit to the end of the book which I was very very happy with the conclusion inclusion of this book Mitch. I am happy that Jack is going to live his human life for as long as he has it. And that's a stipulation that he has to to his ferry mom once we got through all the stuff and he's like let me have this. Let me have these six decades or whatever it is these people I love and let doing the normal stuff have the full human experience because this is the only opportunity I will ever get to have it and I want it and then and then like obviously he's GonNa go back tipperary though. I think he might be one of those creatures that spends time in both worlds even after Ben never gone because he just seems like you. I know but we'll be gone. 'cause it's revealed at some point in here that this is the same universe as the focus of air. Yeah and it says in the Fokker but if mortals are living in fairyland l. fame or whatever yeah That they they'll grow to maturity but they never age after that they don't grow old as long as there is true but yeah and Ben Ben is clearly decided to be there. That's not to say that he won't ever come back. And maybe at some point he'll decide you too. Yeah but it seems that he's GonNa be with severn for the rest of his life. It seems it seems like they're gonna be doing that but I was mostly a happy that not only is ben going to be with the person he loves in who loves him but that he's there to understand his gift. Yeah because he he is special just west there for. Yeah yeah no no exactly. And that's what makes it much more interesting and makes them more believable than a realistic character. Like yeah he has this thing on having this a blessing curse that's he's been shouldered with his entire life and it's extremely powerful and he has no idea how to use it not really last but not least one thing I I want to touch on is sorrow in Sevren. Another great sibling. relatio- Cy loved sorrows whole back story. 'cause it's sorrel right was who was her name originally originally that was his sister she and Jo Han. Yeah and then she Bob Broken human from stupid because he was is being stupid human and kind of like a seventeen o one sort of way. I guess it was normal. Ish Win for him to be basically just very abusive. Yeah it's true. We set it before on this show and John Junkies though we love history it was not good to be a woman or a person of color. So don't answer cise it you you wouldn't you wouldn't pick it again no you wouldn't. That's no place for a woman but so but she was in love with Johann she was in love and wanted to just be with the people because she was actually like a super champion of mortals. Anyway like she loved people and make sense then that she would fall in love with immortal and so she went to go live mortal life and it wasn't really going so well her pops is like you make her cry three times. It's all done and he's like oh no big. You never make crabbing daddy because this is Kentucky income but then he does and so Big Daddy Alder King saying it was like I'll take you and I'm GonNa have my son Guilio edges. Exactly what he did. So sovereign killed him. He's a good brother like that. Yeah because you gotta do. Oh and then Sorrel then becomes like completely inconsolable. Like her heart is busted into a thousand pieces various left differently they do love differently and her grief becomes like real and is manifested in her turning into the swamp monster. Yeah a petri three months monster who like a dementia for in Harry Potter. Sucks the joy and any will to live out of the people that she comes around flex. She's just walking around in this cloud of deprivation but she's also trae so it's more awesome. Yeah so she's sort of I guess she's she's crawling along. What did trees do what I'd like a route? It's like a it's it's a creep. She creates she scrapes though. Yeah Yeah so anyway. So she creeped. US keeping deepened through keeping people through the world and she gets kind of out of fairyland out of the CAN I say it. The dark part of the forest gets worse. She should. That's where she lets her. She lives in until she gets out and she's like just causing havoc and she's making people go into like comatose states and with like weird green stuff coming out of their mouths like an Austin a vine. Yeah Yeah and like the all the walls like split. And they start like emitting moss. I love those gracious visually. The whole thing's very cinematic whenever her sorrows around because that's the name that she then ends up taking on is is sorrow. I love to that at the end. She hasn't changed back to pretty fairy princess. No she's still tree monster. which is the dance monster? And why is she the dancing. Happy Tree Monster because of Ben Because as has been saying her with his magical blessed cursed gift of music saying her back to herself which sounds incredibly cheesy. When I say it but it's not cheesy when it happens pits not as he takes her through the stages of grief in a way that nobody else has like? She's sort of frozen in this Torment in her own mind and he takes her all all the way through it through the five stages of grief basically to the point where she can then sort of kind of begin to heal. Yeah and I like that. That's that's the point. That's the pause point on on her story at the end of it that part love and who knows what could happen to her. I actually feel very much like this. The story is begging for a sequel. Like nothing is completely the finished. Were in a lovely place and if that's all that holly black of a writes about these characters in the story line that's fine. That's absolutely good but let's at least your imagination. The nation wander onto so now everybody's in this new place they do they do not kill the Alder King. It's not only turns into a dragging get slain or anything no no no severin. The boy in the coffin puts his father the elder king into a new glass coffin. Yeah which was crafted crafted by WHO Grimacing Grimsson. That's where I was like okay. I know I'm one hundred percent. Sure absolutely big Fan of GRIMM's this is the same university spoke look of air and actually then having read the folk of air Books I and then coming back to this I didn't know that But now going back in my brain to the folk of air stories. That whole story of Grimsson. Oh yeah he followed some What's the word when you're exiled exiled Bit of nobility off because he was like he picked the wrong horse in some kind of a political thing happened with within fairyland off for a while and now he's come back in that one. It's like Oh okay. He's he's off on his adventure right now. We have this nobility person who's this guy who's decided to call himself the Alder King which is apparently a big overreach h I mean like this thing ferries to rate they are nobility they decide they're like royalty or somehow supreme beings rulers and they split off and people like random court members to the lowliest Fuca will them Lowest Buca and then tame form of society and then they move on again. This is what they do. It is what they do clearly. But so I I love that little tie-in yeah the Grimsson. I know Grimson work after you mean reams Yohannes the name last name. That's his last name We've gotTA give this a execution Gore and it's got to be something out of some some something out of this many swamp monsters of won't five out of five coffins five out of five. And what did he ever five. I don't want my cards but I've got it bad. Sandra can call Sandra. Call me. Ishmael Ishmail oh no call me Sandra Sandra we have to get used. We have to put an execution score on this thing with you. So I'm going to ask you I really. It's a silly question. How many out of five bull? Fake Magic Fortune Walnuts. Would you give at the start of five out of five out of five out of five. Was it Bush fortress fake magic four magic fortune. Well Yeah I would give. I would give five of those. Yeah those nuts do a full five. I agree and when I give a book doc five out of five which is rare. It's because there's nothing I would change agreed and that's really the best way to put it. Is I enjoyed it immensely asleep. I had a great time. I will have a great time talking about this book the other times I reread it. I love supporting Holly Black. And there's just nothing ever changed about it. I agree completely not only would I not change. I really applaud her storytelling in this I think she does a really fantastic job of taking something. That's you know a gender fiction often often gets short shrift anyway short but there are plenty of examples where it's like yeah sits kind of a single layer cake you know. You're GONNA yummy cake. It might be delicious. I will consume any of them but she she takes it to a different level. She makes it much more. Interesting gives it more depth than I. I so so loud that I think she's she's fantastic. She makes beautiful worlds and rich characters. And she she writes in this Pweto Vic magical folk tales voice waste but at the same time. It's still funny and it still feels real and it still feels relevant completely agree. Yeah and we love you. Holly Block colleague Call US income sleep on my sectional couch. It's really really excellent. People talk about fairies with Amanda and I and Louis Probably get our ears surgically pointed forty isolates. Likely it's like if she if she would come on your show. I would do it Meteo. Yeah even though. I'd like a Vulcan as previously discussed. You will look like a curious little welcome in the forest. Kill so what you want all right. Thank you so much for being here Amanda next time. Don't stay away so oh law. Thank you for having me liked to talk about the stories all right everybody for John Reid Junkies. This has been Sandra. This this has been Amanda Scott. All right that's been Scott. Thank you all for joining us and please keep reading pasture bedtime. Hey here's a fun fact. So Green Onions scallions. So you get your day. She makeup to dish cut off the Greens of the scallions. And then you're like oh I'll just throw away this as little white part with the root on it and because it doesn't call for it in a recipe. No no no what you do. Is You take those like two little routes you put them into a glass of water and put let them like on your window. So we're there sunlight. They will re grow the green stocks in the loss of water. I know I'm a frigging gardening savant. I gene in my kitchen right now. I'm like I grow plants in water which you know we would have to grow it outside. 'cause stitches she's eat everything for sure but I I will snap a pick when I get home and send it to you. Guys be has all my gosh. You can regrow them because it's just a route now granted it's not gonNA. They're not gonNA be as hardy already as the previous Greens were weak right. They don't have any other nutrients giving their way but the little white route part of it like the roots Kinda grow which is a little bit weird looking but it's fine to delicious roots revisions Mariah.

Ben Ben Amanda Scott Hazel Holly Black Jack Jack Sandra Sandra John Junkies Tim Guns US Bill Scott Light krones queensberry Church of Holly Black Kate McKinnon Hawley Wa Komo John Meryl Streep
70 | Horror | Strange Girls: Women in Horror Anthology Stories Selected by Azzurra Nox

Genre Junkies | Book Reviews

1:13:23 hr | 1 year ago

70 | Horror | Strange Girls: Women in Horror Anthology Stories Selected by Azzurra Nox

"Weirdo bookworm unite. We want to share our love of genre fiction with you. Some readers out there may look down on you for your love of horror sci fi and fantasy but not us so stop by as we discuss what we've been reading. I- junkies at Sandra. This is Scott and we got stitches here to see you know what that means. It's time for another episode of Genre Junkie and even better. It's time for a women in horror. Mum J. Women Horror Mine. Yes we're doing some fun limited horror stuff over here. John Junkies. We did some fun. Limit Horror Steph over on May court show show on Youtube and a podcast and also over on Spooky Slumber Party show. We're going to have a very special. Loenen or episode coming up soon. What the Spooky Slumber Party? This is very important month for us and so we want to celebrate it with you with He. Anybody get that pet cemetery. Reference from the movie just gave away the reference. So everyone's going to know when people here he used they know what that means here so we got to read a book that is coming out really really soon coming out the date of this episode releases single byte right now. What the hell you waiting for like. What's even your excuse. And it is called strange girls women in Horror Anthology and it Kinda I guess edited and compiled by Azzurra Knox who we have had the privilege to review one of her short stories before so this is a great compilation of horror stories written by Female Authors and some Non Binary folks and just a wonderful celebration so if you guys have ever listened to one of our short story episodes we kind of have a way. We do this where we're GonNa talk and kind of broad strokes about you know Our feelings on the book. We would normal episode. And of course we're going to save really the nitty gritty a breakdown of a lot of the stories in the spoilers section. So of course. This is always spoiler free in the first half but it's really hard to talk about short stories and not spoil up. I mean it's almost impossible the best way that I can phrase. This is in comparison to the last short story collection that we read that he bites back. I think that this one does definitely read a lot. Different Than Betty Bites back. I would say oh. Yeah this is Pretty much straight horror. Yeah but in addition to that Betty Bites back is very. It's very strong women's issues. Were this has more more female celebration. Yeah I think I see what you mean. There's definitely some hard hitting issues absolutely and I think that that's that's natural in a short story collection like this but I think just the collection of stories just overall tells a different emotion than buddy bites back did and in one of the stories in this collection in strange women. There is a story that I know. I'm going to have to talk about but it does come with a trigger warning at the start of the chapter but I mean you know kind of if you need to go into like a deep dive and look into trigger warning stuff there there. Is You know there are some hard stuff to read about in this book. There's some rape stuff there some abuse all different kinds of abuse. Yeah it can be really really hard and we goes there for some of these stories and I love. I love horth like I talked about so much. Obviously love horror. I'm obsessed. It's my favorite. But I love when horror makes you feel like every emotion and like every range of motion and I love when there's like a tied to domestic life. Real life issues like ages makes the horse so much more profound. I mean I like silly fun too but yeah like it goes there and it's cool. When horror is not afraid to go there I would say the other observation. I would make from this book from my own perspective from from from one males perspective. Betty Bites back definitely get like it. Engrossed me in a way that where it's like okay. I'm I'm learning a lot of things about the female experience from this. This book has a bit more stuff that is just kind of four females and some of it specifically for I I shouldn't even say for females for people with vaginas. Yeah that is not relatable at all to to this SIS gendered male right here share and I appreciate it. I think that's important and this is not a complaint at all. Oh Yeah we'll things don't I mean sometimes when when we as readers read like you know I'd diverse experience away from her own. It's like no you're you're never gonNA be walking exactly that person's shoes and being able to relate to it that way but that's like the whole point of reading right. You're learning someone else's story in someone else's perspective on something and that's why it's always important to when you can and of course we try to and it's always a work in progress but try to re diversely always different authors of different walks of life with characters of different walks of life from your own like that's the fun of reading right so. I guess if it's all right with you I'd like to start with my experience score but the book go for it and for me. This book was a good read. I really enjoyed a lot of the stories in it. I I found myself coming back to it. Regularly short stories are very hard for it to be a page. Turner for me. It's it's not how I tell story how you digest short story. You should speak on that for anybody. That doesn't remember. Yes so when I read a short story collection I typically like to read one sometimes two stories and then take a break. It sometimes five minutes. It's sometimes a couple of hours. That's how I liked to digest it. I like to experience the story and then in process it just like I would a book. I'm not the kind of person who finishes a book and immediately starts reading the first page of the next book and I'm the same way with short stories that said there were there were stories in this. That did not resonate with me as much I would have liked and a lot of that is because I I am assist gender male and there are some stories in here. I don't feel I don't feel we're written for me right. It's for you to get a glimpse into that life. Yes there's one story in particular Very very short that is specifically about menstruation that I really appreciated but it did not have an effect on me and that's okay. I don't feel that it was written for me and and I. I have no problem with that but this book in particular. I do think there is. There is much more for the female experience than there is for me. Yeah and that's good and I. I'm just happy that you I mean Obviously like we review books. But I'm just really happy that you and I'm sure so. Many other CISGENDERS gender and heterosexual dudes would be like. Yeah I I can get into this because you wanna hear those stories you WanNa hear like this perspective and what these authors have to say. Even though it's different than you and as really important to respect the difference but still enjoy it I will say off man I. I'm I'm a little more in the page. Turner world with this one I loved it. Of course I mean it's horror horror is just such a wonderful Yummy Yummy. It's my favorite. And then especially these you know these really female. Fem centered stories and celebrating some characters that are non binary and some writers are non binary to is just really cool and it makes me so proud to be part of this horror community and to be a female in horror and you know horror folks like we're we're pretty awesome were just were accepting and we're wonderful people book book people to it's It's so nice to get to have stories being told by a tight first range of people and you know it's always can be better and there's still a lot to be done but you know letting these authors who are not you know a white heterosexual dude you. Kinda have the spotlight all the time and it. Kinda share and there was some stuff in here that we're all friends here right. We're all friends here. Girlfriends raw friends here that like for me as as a female as a non ner typical person and as someone who you know kind of has that experience that it just made me feel like a this is awesome. This is a celebration so yeah loved it and I guess we're appeal to like. Yeah it's Hor. It's a horror collection for sure. So you gotta be you know kind of a horror person but I mean I would still say this is a pretty broad appeal I'M GONNA go with a broad appeal because I think if you're into like women's fiction and or you're into You know kind of diversifying your reading just a horror fan but this is a great collection for horror fans. This one is complicated for me to score I think you'll be surprised by my score but it's complicated because I am going to give my score based on those with a non male experience. I do think that this is. I do think this is enjoyable by many people with a with a with a male experience and there's a lot of stuff in here that is that is very very enjoyable and was very enjoyable to me But I do think that their stuff that that is not written for me however I if I have a feeling in the female in the non I should say in the non male experience. I'm actually give it a mass appeal. I love it. I think that there is definitely. I mean this is. This is absolutely one hundred percent horror but in a world where one of the most popular television shows ever is law and order special victims unit. I think that that there is really very little in this collection. That goes so far as to just completely turn off anybody. I think that there's really deep powerful stuff in in every story and even the ones that are really creepy are are approachable. So so I'm giving it a mass appeal book for that reason. I love it. I think that's fantastic. So yeah in case. You couldn't tell we're really singing. Canada praises of this Of this collection and kind of the whole thing with when you read a short story collection sometimes you know. It's such a mixed bag of strong stories week stories. And Yeah there's GonNa be some in here that we're just not my favorite though author style wasn't my favorite 'cause you're gonNA get such a sampling of different writers but really very few Mrs for me. I was actually surprised me. I felt that there were no true Mrs in this story right because there was still something to be like garnered from. That didn't hit me but we're still just just excellent and I appreciated. I feel that there was not a single miss in the front from from cover to cover and that's really impressive. Yeah now I I hear you like Essa Great Great Celebration Great Celebration of horror and highly highly endorsed by the Jonah. Junkies clearly is out today. February eighteenth Go pick it up. If you haven't read it already yes Read every single one in there and then come join us for the spoiler. Section is this is good. You guys are GonNa love this Absolutely dive in celebrate females and non binary people writing and being in horror and. Just open your heart if you having. But we know you how we know John. Rankings are really open and accepting folk before we jump to the spoilers section just to kind of put a little more little more more flavor in this part of the episode. Just jump into our roundtable real quick. Have you been having any cool genre experiences lately? I I have to tell. I finally watched the sort art online movie. And let as you think I cried so it is i. If you've watched I mean if you've watched sorta online than you know what I'm talking about. It's it's a really kind of up and down roller coaster of a show but the good parts are very very good and I feel like that movie just collected all of the good parts of that of of the show and just acted as great fan service and continuation of those parts and it just made me really really happy to finally watch it. That's really that's really special. I'm let's see I can speak for both of us. WanNa say that were all cut up on a TV show which never happens and that is evil which is a CBS joint. And it's I have. We talked about it on the show. I think we talked about it a little bit. Yeah it's That show is anxiety. Inducing for me it is. It is one of the most anxious. I felt on a TV. Show I can I can think of. Its is cuts cuts such a great cast. Great writing wonderful characters. Incredibly well acted the you know. It's hard to kind of describe it but it's kind of X. files vibes but it's about this team of three that investigate miracles and possessions for the Vatican to see if like they're like assessors basically and there's one dude who is trying to be a priest dude. Who's kind of a lapsed Muslim? Who is there like Tech Person? And he's very skeptical and very funny and then there's a forensic psychologist I think she is. And she is a lapsed Catholic. And it's very much a non-belief very much believer so it's like you kinda get those X. files evolves but at the same time not really don't like let that fool you because it's like a totally different show and it's airs pretty late at night. I think it's like atomic clocks shell and it can be really scary it is. It is very scary and their Christmas episode. Which which is not just a small little special. It has important notes that are continue on. Yes. It is one of the most effective episodes of television. There is a song that will be stuck in your head. I hope not for the rest of my life but I think it might be that that song stick with me for the rest of my life and when you wash it episode. You'll know what I mean so I've been just kinda watching some movies. That are repeat or viewings for me for all my different shows like the Colt show at everything But I watched blood diner again. I watched some different ones by Jackie. Hong Kong. We're going to interview her on the cold. Show 'cause yeah just a few other cattery watches not like super. The one new thing I've watched was on shudder. Which is I believe. The shutter exclusive and it's called bliss. That was very interesting movie that I'm still kind of digesting exactly how I felt about it. The pacing was really off for me but I mean how to really strong finish and some really interesting points of it It's about a lady is an artist and she takes drugs to kind of help her create and she starts taking this drug that does not have the typical reactions though it is helping her create art and it's Super Violent Super Gory. Kind of body horror Lots of nudity. If you're into that sort of thing if you're shy about it you know just know that Yes so interesting interesting movie then. I'm still digesting. How I feel and we must say also we suburbs Apprai- family both loved it towards Apprai- was fantastic. Yeah and there's You know it's it's one of those movies it's like it's not getting good quote unquote reviews but real people love it. I think that it's the best. Dc movie since since the Dark Knight. I Yeah I think that it's like really GonNa save DC that and wonder woman like they've kind of saved the DC cinematic universe. I am excited for the Roberts. Robert Pattinson the Edward Cullen and lighthouse among other things Turn of that man. I am excited for that. I'm a huge Batman. I don't really talk about it a whole lot on here but I love that man so I was. I'm all about it. I think that he is an incredible actor to despite all of the things that happened with twilight and everything. I think that he's a great actor and I'm very excited to see what he has to bring to the to the character of Bruce Wayne Batman but especially in this kind of limited horror episode. If you haven't seen per to pray all my Gosh. She just absolutely must. It's so much fun. It is find fun. It's fine and it's surreal and it's bizarre and it's cartoony and pop arty at lots of swear words which fricken love you guys know that. Hello VIOLENT BEAUTIFUL COLLARS AWESOME FEMALE BAD ASSERY. Come on land very funny hope. You're not sleeping number to pray because it is legit. Good okay. Everybody. We're going to hop into the spoiler section. So go read strange girls and then come back and talk to. Us enjoying the show. Please like in subscribe online tools. You can find us on twitter and instagram at Genre Junkies and don't forget to visit the website John Ritter Junkies Dot Com. Welcome back to the spoiler section for strange girls so we're going to go through a large chunk of the stories and talk about them and talk about our feelings with them and let's get into get started so the first story twenty four hour diner by Charlotte Platz author that uses she her pronouns to bias. The psycho waiter vampire girl with blue hair. This one was a great way to start off a story. Short story collection. Yes what a great like. It had such a good bill to it because I hated he'll bias and I thought he was awful. And then you realize yeah he is truly awful and he is as bad as you think he is but he's also the victim good which is perfect starting off a short story collection with with a story that subverts expectations is just always the right way to go. Yes it was just fun. It was just fun. And that's what you're supposed to be. I like the way that the vampire girl is described to unless she wears like kind of like ratty tights and lake vintage looking t dresses and stuff. I don't know I just have such a clear vision of her and I love how angry she got at the end Yeah just let A. Yeah what a great fund way to start off this collection. I love descriptions of what women are wearing when written by women. Yeah has much better than when we're in by men. Oh my God. Of course that's always. That's always the thing. Isn't it The next story is sideshow by Jude. Read Judy's is she her pronouns. The snake lady eats the abusive boyfriend. As you can imagine. I loved this story. So y'all know we are animal lovers in the wrong chunkys household. I love snakes. I- fricken love snakes. And let me just cannot just go through this a little bit more. This is in one way. It's it's one of my favorite stories in the collection. Definitely because of the cool snake thing but I love how like the snake lady seeks out abusers and you know there's that scene where she's devouring him and she like makes eye contact with the girlfriend to be like all of you want. Yeah like like I'm GonNa give choice in this like it's like it's your choice. Yeah and consent to this. Yeah and there's just something really cool this female solidarity like I got your girl like type of thing that it just made me feel super proud because he was a really just absolutely crummy dude in a realistic way. Yeah Yeah and she you know she was. She was having trouble deciding how she felt about. How crummy he was supposed to be so thankful because to everybody else. He so perfect and popular Hanson. He's the one that that everyone wants to be with like. He's doing her favor in all. Yeah and like you know. He's he's raping her to and it's like you know she's like but an in vocalizing no and everything like yeah it's just like. Oh and the snake lady just some Mel's that our she's like You're going down I'm hungry. You don't need any you don't need this in your life. This is perfect. This is exactly what I need. Eat Right now Yup and she's like let it happen really really cool Then excellent was the doll's house by Alison Fe. Alison she her pronouns Sophie. And her Dali's led by Fanny. Kill bad man okay. So I'm I have a theory about this story. Yes basically two ways to read this one that the dolls are are sentient alive and are doing things. And the second thing is is that You know insanity. Murderous thoughts intense runs in that family. Well right and that it's the girl girl who's doing all of this stuff. She is the one who killed her father. Maybe her mother did it. But she's the one who's hurting and hurting and hurting the animals in the neighborhood and not her dolls love that and I. I love both readings of it. It's really well. Well done because you can. You really can decide on what you feel. It is and it's totally there for you. There's nothing that contradicts either reading of it Yeah this is great short story. I love ambiguity. I love an interpretation And I love to sluice it out either way with these lake. I and I think there's something about why love love dolls. Super Nidal's obsessed with dolls. And I love this idea of this doll house. Family heirloom passed down to the females. And there's like this kind of this idealized version of like a household but it's run by this matriarchal psycho and it's just it says so much there's just so many layers to interpret in this and it's like you know it's not good if this little girl is a budding psychopath you know. Killing animals hate that if killing the bad man. No feel about about that one. But it's like Oh that's not good. That's not a good look but at the same time there's a powerfulness to it and then if it's the dolls doing it. I love it because the dolls are serving as a protector and has served as protectors for this family for generations. Either way. It's it's a win win. It's a great story. It was it was really. I knew that you'd love it and of course to speaking of love this next one. I read this story three times. I just finished it. Read it again. Finished up read it again and I think that's making my notes. I read it again. So it's definitely one of my favorites blood by Claire Hamilton. Russell and I should say for most of these Preferred pronouns I used the authors BIOS at the end of each story. But there's something really cool in this book and that is all of the little interview snippets with the authors including like Song Recommendations and some personal recommendations from some of them on like books and authors and stuff like that. I got a lot of great ideas for some stuff. I haven't read and in the interview. Claire is gender. Queer gender fluid is how they identify themselves so princess grandmother a daughter of darkness. She kneels beneath the crucified. Winged SKELETON DOWNED IN CHAINS AND THORNS. I mean it was basically written for me like I feel like Claire gave me a gift wrapped it in paper and left it for me absolutely powerful striking. I want books in this world with these cultures and I. I'm so captivated. There's something about the grandmother and the passing it down. And then at the end the author starts to feel a twitch beneath their shoulder blades. And my Gosh what. Just what just an absolute tease of a story. That I I must have more. I really happy that you liked it and and I thought that you might this this one. Actually I remember reading it now. It's one that didn't stick with me because I actually had a lot of trouble understanding it. Kinda part of like agreed and I remember when I read like. Oh Okay Sandra loved this I I. It was a little bit too obtuse for me. Just because that's the kind of it's not the kind of Southern kind of story that grabs me. It's a it's it's a lot it's a lot it's a love story and and I think that it's real. I can tell that it's a story that's GonNa Ring for a lot of people. It wasn't for me well. I'm glad I think I have a passion for the both of I think so. The next story was self portrait with Pairs by Rachel Bolton. Rachel uses she her pronouns. I'm this is from the perspective of Adam. The stocker hardesty see. I don't really have this one didn't grab me. I mean it wasn't poorly written. I think that there are people who will get a lot out of this but it just it just didn't resonate for me so this one actually I think it. I think it does a frighteningly. Good job of jumping into the mind of a entitled Mail Perspective when when when people talk of talks ick Masculinity and entitlement of men. This is what they're talking about where you know he starts off as being kind of okay just you know. He has a crush on this girl. And there's a few problematic things to the way that he thinks he's Canada will judgy at the very beginning. He's a little bit judgy but he's a teenager and it's like you know you know we're all Kinda we're all kind of crummy when we're teenagers but then it just like slowly at first. It's a short story so it's not very long but but slowly at first he starts to become a little bit more problematic and you start to realize more and more that no he just. He feels like well. He likes her so she he deserves to be met in kind and reciprocated with the attention that he is giving her to the point where he just becomes completely unhinged and an awful and is just does not recognize what is actually happening around him because he's so self centered. This is a very real thing. Oh yes very real. And you know it's scary. It's scary for in my perspective. I I'll just say that this is the one that actually probably affected me the most because these are the things that you know. I look at myself when I was a teenager and before I was you know quote unquote woke. You know there was there was crummy things about me. I was never this dude. I mean this is there. Are People like this dude. I was never that but you know there's there's a self-centeredness to to the male experience. In general I on a spectrum and there's things in this that are sadly relatable and and for that reason I did feel it was actually very powerful. This was the one story in there that I think would be the most important for someone who identifies as male to read right. Yeah and just kind of not only check yourself there. You probably are not a stalker psychopath but kind of check the attitude of guys around you and and you know like how they treat you know a female interested in and you know just to kind of like take a good look it the the the people the men. You're spending time with and be like you know. This is not like okay. It's not okay. And the most the most important thing is in this is that he has people around him who are communicating to him. That it's not okay. And he's not listening he's also like he's obviously a little psychopathic or something like I'm no psychologist. But there's something going on like he's not just an asshole. Yeah he's on the extreme end of the spectrum. Yes certainly but There is there is like you said it's kind of the the slow build of it. Yes it is but up until about three quarters of the way through. I've known people like that personally up and things that he does up to three quarters of the way through the story. I know people who have thought like that in the past. I've known people personally and when you really recognize it for what it is. It's sobering next story is personal. Demons by Angelique Funds. Angelique is she pronouns This is the adventures of Sam and Lilith to teens one identifies as not binary N. One is a scientist. I will say I I appreciate these characters. I appreciate The the story of them and who they are and what the message of this one is for me to style is just not for me. It wasn't one that Held my heart. It was hard. It was hard for me to balance the fact that I am looking for more for more stories. That are written using They then pronouns and for people who are gender fluid yeah. I love that because I'm trying to. I'm trying to learn and wrap my head around that style because it does not come naturally to me reading style. Well let's because I think we've all been trained from childhood with these pronouns. Yeah so I read the story twice because the first time I read it I had the I had the same feeling that you did Mike. You know yeah I liked it. I liked the concept. But you know it wasn't really my style of writing but I wanted to read it again because I wanted to make sure that I wasn't just being Accidentally discriminatory based on the fact that it was day then pronouns and honestly they didn't bother me. Oh No not at all and I mean I think we are here for it. We are here for an on minor characters we are here for. I think Lilith is not white like from the description. I didn't get a white person Here for all of it and just more psychologists in general but yeah just wasn't my style there was just a there was a the concept was strong but there was a lack of character. Build for me It was it just. It just didn't grab me. That much next is friends with benefits by e F schrader and I did not pick up a pronoun that e f uses from the Bio. This is the story of daughter Liza mark by their dead mother with the the thing on the arm. I really liked this story but there is something. I don't understand at the end that I hope that you can maybe explain to me Just specifically like I don't I don't really understand how her father and her friend got involved and and specifically where the double heat where the double turn like really like what are they doing to the father at the. Yeah there's clearly. The girls are ganging up on the data. Like it looks like the friend is in League with the dad but it actually the front is in league with a with Liza. I know that this had to be written to be somewhat interpretive. But I also was kind of left non conclusive results. Okay so you know I have a problem. I generally have a problem with with Vega endings. You know as we've discussed in the past but this one did seem like almost too vague right. It's not just me like it didn't really explain. Where like they had the conversation or why or really what was happening right. Yeah yeah and it's a again. I Like I love. I love ambiguity and I do like an amount of Keno. Just interpret it and trust your off the Tushar authors trashy readers to be smart. But I don't yeah I was left non-conclusive with the end of this story. Okay that makes me feel a lot better. I mean it does because I know it's hard for me when it comes to ambiguity to really recognize if it's just kind of like you know personal preferences for it or if I really am just not getting it. I really did. Like e style. Though I liked the story your ruins. Yeah I just yeah. I just couldn't condruct inclusion at the end of that one next is. I think this is going to be one of your favorites prediction. Night Tears by Angeles Sylvain. Angela uses she pronouns. This is the story of the I. This story was so good story was killer so good so we both Have talked about that we like. Ai Stuff we like The struggle with sentient S- and what makes something alive and what makes something person and this was just a really cool perfectly sized short story snapshot of this a. Yeah it makes me very hell man. It's a very sad story of what they're doing to her and they're doing to these and there's so many this is one where there are so many questions yet unanswered but not in the best way but not because it's not because it's you know ambiguous. It's because I just want to know everything about this world. I want to know everything about what they're doing. Why they're doing it. How they do things towel. And how many people in this town are actually I? How many are actually handlers? Attorney has a chip. I want so much more of this world like yeah it was. It was the perfect. Kind of like teaser. Exactly give me more. I want to know everything. Yeah and the way that ends e exact. The exact same way that it starts is a brilliant beautiful as just the most that heartbreaking painful Sifi. I can't even describe it. It's just you know it when you see it and when you find it and it moves you. I have a question. That's that's related to the story but off topic when you read stories that take place in high school. Do you picture it being your high school. When you're picturing it in your head not always not always but but every for their school. I didn't and I think part of that is because they they mentioned the snow and stuff so for me. It just took me to another place. Okay I I'm just curious 'cause when I read stories like this I almost always picture some version although it may be different based on you know like in this case where a parking lot is but yeah I always. I always picture like my high school. I just wonder if that's something that That other people do too. Yeah it just really depends. There's definitely something set in high school that I seem a high school for sure. The next story. We talked about this a little bit. We teased it. I loved the story. The girl who never stopped bleeding by Sam Lawrence Sam uses her pronouns This is the story of Barb. Who Bleeds and gets revenge? And you can't really talk about this story without the quote from the Christian Bible. The Bible says a bleeding woman is unclean. I love the story. I get what you're saying that you're GonNa you're never gonNA fully be able to be like oh I just I feel that in my bones but that's okay because that's what you read. Things that are different from your life is short. It's sweet so poignant a loved it I just love. I can't I can't really say much more about it than I loved the way it was written and I love the subject matter. This is the one that I was talking about earlier that I was using as an example of you know I appreciated it. It didn't it didn't register with me. It didn't ring with me. It's not supposed to ring with me and it's totally okay that it didn't it. Did you feel like the ride? I short and sweet I like defined defined. It's very short up next. We have you say led our leader. I say leader law go with Lita. I'm next we have leader in the fly by Marnie as a rally marking uses she pronouns. Lita Addicted to drugs kills. A fly has murderous intentions to her girlfriend and this is the story of her recovery and journey into wellness because she is possessed. That's like such a weird way to summarize this story. Let me also just say I never know. If I'm supposed to say lead out or Leda but I was super. No mythologies specially like I was like Greek mythology was my favorite for when I was a kid and as a reminder Lita and the Swan is a Greek myth In as the story of the God Zeus who takes the form of a swan and quote Unquote Seduces Leader Seduce might be a gentle. But y'all remember now. This story has the good demon vibe Jimmy friend friend of the show. I it really gives me those vibes of you know things were better when I was possessed and I just was never like. I didn't feel anything until I had with me. I was well. I was making my art. I was inspired. I was loving towards my girlfriend. Taurean I I you know everything was going right and then you know I didn't have my demon anymore and everything started takes a fly to do it see. I got cough vibes when I read this Franz Kafka Vibes which is cool love Kafka. I thought this was a cool story. A really cool story I get a Jimmy. Feel from it as well The I love things like this where you know. You're you're not sure how you feel. You're not sure how you're supposed to feel Obviously there's a supernatural element to this going on but this was such an interesting depiction of depression as well. Just a really powerful interesting story next up. We have Jenny's Bobo by Hilary Lyon. Hillary uses she her pronouns. Both pet demon Absolutely love Bobo. I love that he's bad and sinister and murderous but then he also likes pets and to sleep on a little pile of laundry. I I love bubble. I love him so much to think of Bobo. As bad boy bad boy found in a cave. Picturing more of a kind of drag any trip did thing and I like how. The parents are very protective in scared. And like you can't let him out you know he's never gonNA come back and she the one who didn't even summon him as like no he's like he's GonNa come back like it's okay. We don't know if they summoned him or they somehow Kinda got stuck with him. I loved that like kind of you know. It's obviously this teens. Kind of weird interpretation of the events. She doesn't even really understand what was going on other singing weird like monotonous songs. Downstate agreed to something. I don't know they always just like clean up after they're gone but they just do these weird things and it's like okay. Well they're doing something. They're doing ritual swinging demonic rituals here. And you don't realize that it's not normal or that it's exactly what it is but clearly they made some sort of pact to have. Bobo show up. Yeah they either made a pact or they got tricked into something. I don't know what happened but wishes fine. I don't need to know because what I need to know is that I love Bobo. Yes and I want to pet his scaly head. Oh Okay the school story all stories even the ones that didn't resonate with me. They're cool extinguishing firefly's by rebecca round and Roland Roland. Sorry Rebecca Rebecca. She her pronouns This is the story of Arielle Slash me. The where cat murderer girl in case you didn't know we stand cats. I have three cats tattoos. I am obsessed with cats cats rule my world. I like this one. Okay I I mean I think something that really grabbed me about this story is it was a really new concept for me. I'm not used to a cat. Where creature and I have come across those a little bit in like urban fantasy and stuff but especially not a kid and this acceptance by the mother and I really loved that there was something really beautiful about that that she wasn't trying to change her and she wasn't trying to find a cure or anything like that it was like no. This is my little. We're cat child. And I I don't know I just. It was really cool. I think this is one of those stories where you can go. You can take face value. Which for the most part I do and enjoy it but you can dive really deep into this and maybe pull out things that the author did or did not intend. I'll just say I think this is a story that for the most part I just take on. Its face because I think it is meant to be literal yes. I think that there is some deeper things you can tell that you can interpret from this story that I would be interested if they were intended. It's one of those things where I don't want to over analyze a story when things are not supposed to be there but I feel like that I I would be really interested to hear if there was some allegory. Yeah that that that that was in the story more than what's on the surface and first of all I don't think you as a reader ever need to interpret reading into something too much as a bad thing because once the art once out there once the piece is out there people are going to interpret it and they're going to see allegory and they're going to see meaning and it might be things that the author didn't even realize they were putting out there. Maybe it was. But that's hey that's art. Art should be interpreted south. Never apologize for that so I'm going to take a little bit of point on this just for a minute. The eyes of the dead by Danielle Are Bailey. We'll just lean back here in which you takeover I Danielle us. She her permits. This is the one that comes with the visible trigger. Warning at the start of it. This is the story of Jesse being raped and murdered and mutilated and then basically a ghost or somehow in their bodies still going through this as they rot and decompose This story was absolutely the most affecting. This'll be the one that sticks with me I read this one. It made me feel super emotional Made me feel a little sick little lucy. Which as a jade old horror fan is something that does not happen a whole lot and it was hard to read haunting. You would not want to read this before you go to bed and in the back of the book in that interview with the author section and I don't feel like we can talk about this without reading this verbatim and Daniels words when asked what was the inspiration behind your story. I would say the inspiration behind. My story is survivors of sexual assault. And the idea that we can feel as though we are dead even after we have lived that we can be trapped by our own thoughts and how we choose as women to carry past This is definitely up to interpretation. That is this you know girl is she. Stock is Jesse. Stuck in her body consciously. She haunted there some sort of a ghoul or did she in fact get away when it seems that she did but as that survivor and as someone processing the experience that they are still there in a way and it is profound. I cannot think of another way to put it. Besides this stuff is profound. I appreciate that. She said women survivors. But I think it wouldn't matter what your gender was. I have found that this particular subject matter can be a difficult for me. I I don't want to go so far as to say it is triggering but is difficult l. Yeah I almost skipped this story and I said I'm not GONNA do it. I don't think it is fair for me to do it. despite that with the trigger warning and fairly soon into the story realizing it was going to be very hard yeah This was the story in the book that I had to act. I had to I as I said walkaway from stories for a while I had to walk away. Yeah this one was hard Oh it's hard I think Daniel is a really rave data's woman for writing the story And telling this story and I think that in a way you could think of it if if maybe you've gone through some other trauma or some other violent trauma in your life and that same notion of being stock he had just like Damn Danielle like you're good. You heard good this is I think I mean this. This made me sick to the same level as your chuck. Pailin Away Palahniuk short story but this one had meaning where more than that one did whereas that was designed just to discussed this was disgusting while being powerful. I mean really I cannot. I cannot commend Danielle enough for writing such a powerful moving piece. This was the superstar of of the entire collection. Yeah this is. This is the best in shows is the cornerstone. Yeah Yeah Harrowing Heroin Stuff and I just want to seek out everything else. Daniel has written. Because I'm like you're good. We shall move on. I mean I will say I think. Honestly if you're listening through this this Spoiler section and you haven't read the book. This is the story that you should just go ahead and buy this book for. Yeah and hard to say it's hard to read and if it in this kind of subject matter really is too hard for you then by all means all means do not but if you can it is worth it. Yeah we shall move on. I really interested to hear what you thought of this story. The muir wife by Ash Tudor Ashes. Sheepherder downs OLIVER TRIES TO HAVE HIS WIFE. Emilia Kin- killed and this ends up making her happy dub for me this. This just wasn't quite my jam style. Wise just just wasn't quite there but there's cool thriller. Gone Girl Vibes to this where I read millions like. She's kind of horrible. Which is also kind of about. I interested to see how this story worked for you. The I liked the ending a lot. The kind of her being happy that he you know he finally stood up and dealt with his own issues like that that I really liked and I didn't. I didn't actually think of a time but yeah it is very gone girl. She was. Yeah there's other stuff about this story. Though that I have ideas about what the author might have meant by but is a little bit hard to parse through like the whole mirror. Experience is there. Is it just a a metaphor For two different sides of a person is actually a is it. Is it them distancing themselves from the decisions that they're making or or the person that they're hiding that they see in the mirror I it's it's again a very obtuse choice. Yeah I wasn't really able to Parse. Yeah is interesting very interesting. Okay Yeah I see. I see exactly where you're coming from on that. Oh I had so much fun with this next story patterns fairytales by Azer knocks the she her pronouns. Lydia is a Selke a scaredy Selke and her husband. Killian joins her. I loved this story. We obviously love fantasy. I have a personal love of Sulky. And they don't go quite out and say she is this okay but like there's for of and there's like a long task to fit like goes down pass her breasts and stuff she's scary and bloodthirsty and wonderful and what a great twist on the story because the girl is always changing for the frigging guy in the fairytale and in this one. He's like I'll ever. I can't live without her. I got a joy I feel like the message of the story in. Correct me if I'm wrong or you don't agree with me but I feel the message of this. Is You know she has been? She has been one person who has her entire life because she's been told by everybody who she should be and what her actual true potential is has been hidden from her whole life. Truth has been hidden from her. Yes and when she finds out the truth realizes who she really is and who she wants to be and the happy ending of the story is her husband who was complicit in was in limiting who. She was still loved and accepted her and realized that he was wrong. And you know you almost can't totally blame him because he was really thrown something and I think that even all of us on our best days hard time with so I do give him a little bit of a wide berth. You know like because I think what's more important is that he loves her and he will adapt to her lifestyle and her truth and I think that is just beautiful and romantic and like it was just really sweet. No I loved it. I loved it. Yeah I did like the story. There's there's it's adequately deep while just being a good a good tale as well. Yeah and there's so many ways you can definitely interpret and read into all of that stuff of that stuff about his role in it a her family's role in it. You know leg just different. Things happen to people when they realize you know that they they were not getting to live there. Truth live there full oprah and but that you know the the joy in the freedom that comes with that yeah good good. Good Job. Good job girl. Homerun This is such a fun rednecks Campfire Tales. The bloody rings by Emma Johnson River Dri wizardry. I can't my God. I can't even read my own writing. Goto Emma Johnson Rev. Arty a uses she her pronounce. This is the folly of Cassidy Day and men who forced the hand of women. We have the beautiful image of the hanging. Tree knives. Halloween dismemberment a lot of my favorite words right there. What a wonderful Campfire Tale I. I love the The writing conceit of writing a story like it's being told to you very specifically I and this is done particularly well. where it's almost like you know. Davy Crockett like it's a tall tale. We tell yeah. It's really well done in that way. Story overall is just a lot of fun of and that's just really what I have to say about a lot of fun. It's just a good interesting read and story and Yeah it just has this campfire tall tale. Folks balloted vibe to it that Oh what a just a wonderful little flavor to put in a short story collection that narrative style. I'm next we have cracked by Regan. More Regan uses her pronounce Adults TAKES THE APPEARANCE OF. A lady robber. That's kind of a really. You know kind of funny way to put it. But she gets the stall and then it slowly becomes her and I was happy to have another dull story. This one didn't ring as much for me as the other dull story in the collection but I thought it was interesting. I am actually surprised that that was your reaction to the story. I mean I I have to say I agree with you. I enjoyed it. It was a fine ride but it didn't you know it was just it was fine. You know what I mean. Yeah I think that it is a cool concept. It kind of reminded me in the best way of one of my favorite. Tv shows from the nineties beyond belief factor fiction like a kind of had that sort of cautionary tale sort of Feeling to it. This is a story that I felt was missing. A little. Bit of a y for me. a little bit a little bit of of the Lore dumpty crime but it's not just criminals who are affected by this dolls true and there's just In a short story I am typically more satisfied. If it either is a beginning middle end compressed short story or if it is a introducing you to an idea or or world this kind of doesn. Neither I mean it's it's it's a story that's happening is just a repeating story of adult taking on the image of these people and driving them insane in the in the end their own lives. And that's all so the last five stories for me like now again. There is nothing in this book that ascended me that made me feel like this was a waste of time at this one resonate for me or whatever totally fine. I feel like the last five for me. Were all just boom boom boom. Boom boom like super You know I didn't have any tips. No Depp's it's kind of like the the of a fireworks show finale angel of death by phoebe. Jane Johnson. Phoebe is she pronounced a queen from another world sends her best soldier to Earth and they end up finding humans lacking so twilight zone. Grace Gusting. I'm here for everything about this story was great and I really appreciated the writing style. I appreciate the creativity I appreciated the fantasy and Cata science fiction elements are. There is a beautiful monologue that the soldier has an here about. Wow I saw just some really cool stuff some heartfelt some love some capacity that these earthlings have and yet I don't think they're great so let's do it you just gotTa end here. Let's come in with. Yeah yeah cut reminds me of having chess read the first book of the Yes. Yeah it was kind of like that like okay like the files. Yeah Yeah like. It's kind of this more sophisticated powerful intelligent advanced species kind of you've been judged and you have been found like yeah really cool concept staff you thought so too. I did. I really liked it again. The best thing I can say is like especially that monologue at the end was so old school twilight zone. I can see the I can see that episode. Yes I can hear that monologue being read by you know by a black and white actor like just with early exactly. We just ernest this with his cigarette. Oh okay this is another one. That felt like a gift for me. This is another one that felt like it was wrapped up in a little package and left for me. It's like my Valentine I would like to say that maxine. Kohler is my Valentine this year and she wrote a story called. Her Garden grows narrated by a cat. This is a story of a cat and some chickens. Two of my favorite things that are accomplices to a lady who kills her husband. We're GONNA say she's GonNa kill other badminton to not only to be get too dull stories. We got to cat- stories. This one was from the perspective of a cat and the chickens little and I just felt like this is so how a cat would talk and I loved it. I loved that they were all this family. Oh my gosh. What a fun story I love. I love reading it from the perspective of a cat. Who's just like loving and protective and kind of aloof and laze really good. And and how they're so I don't know it's like not only because their animals but they don't have like any. I don't know human or judeo-christian judgement over this woman of any kind and they're just like I better get the earth all nice for mom. This body and happy was so much fun revival by Madison. Essy's Madison uses. She pronouns all I God. I love this mad science story. This is a reimagined version of leg area by PLO by beloved Edgar Allan Poe brother who relates a cadaver to his murdered sister and who boy great story great reinterpretation of Classic Tale Moving Emotional and just really well written to this one actually lead just didn't say my appetite much. Believe she's crazy. You Love Bats. I do of mad science but I didn't really get a mad science so much as just a little mad from this which is fine It just it just didn't really scratch an issue for me. Oh yeah that's okay. That's okay I really dug it. I thought it was beautiful and heartbreaking and thick and oath loved it a son only she can hear by Wandera Veniamin Wander USA. She her pronounce. We have an awesome friend. Name One da and so this is like a cool name. I took it a little bit by surprise I like. Oh my God this story. This is another one that just oh deep. Deep deep deep deep stuff Jewel thermometer's Teenage Mermaid No purpose not on purpose. Certain deliberately no. But I mean that's just putting it on you know in a succinct phrase who boy man. This one was really powerful to me. This was Deep Again really open to a lot of allegory and interpretation this Who knew that mermaids are killed their mates after meeting they also get pregnant really easily have an incredibly short period. And there's something about this to me where it's like okay. This is who she is and her family knows and she different than them. She's other and then she finds a person who has also other but she has been raised in a world. That's not her own and so when she sees what she's done though it's no fault of her own she has to reject it reject her true nature. True Self Because it's not her culture. She's been raised in and she in fact rejects her child offspring. Because it's other as ooh it's just a lotta deep stuff in it and he. Yeah it just it really goes there and I really cared about jewel a lot. I really cared about her. I liked the story a lot and you touched on a lot of the reasons why I like is that I feel that. There's there's a lot of There's a lot of topics that this touches on that really makes you think about them My only my only observation on the story that I'll give is that there's a lot of those things that are lightly touched on like an and some that aren't even touched on so much as just. Oh that makes me think about this. I think it's important not to be spoon fed. You know exactly what? The intention of something is but a little bit of direction on what the author was intending for me to actually think about what have been welcomed. That makes sense. It does and it's just really like an agree to disagree because obviously like from my wrap up and interpretation of it I got so much out of it but for you when you're reading through it it doesn't sound like you were quite picking up how. I was picking up the story. Okay so let me let me talk about the themes that I picked up from this The feeling of what it is to be a opted and being Amongst people who are not exactly the same as you the feeling of a feeling other to the people around you the feeling of accepting or rejecting your the culture that you That which culture are you going to join the one that you raised with or the one that that Perhaps is your culture from birth a nature versus nurture argument to you certainly. Yeah I I just I was big stuff and it's also a cool reinterpretation reimagining of a mermaid as well. Yes it is yeah. I'll let it. We've come to the end. Come to the very end This one gosh you know I'm only very you do and for all of these stories we've been very like oh that didn't resonate with me all this one in a work with me. I am sorry I would have a hard time. Anybody not being in raptured and just here for this damn story and that is tribal influenced by Erica Reu R. U. H. E. I'm so sorry Eric Eric USA she her pronouns and I'm just not sure is your last name. R U H E bell. And look it up. I want to read everything. She's written. Is the story of Joaquina. Little girl who is clear sentient an M. Path and an influence ser and she also happens to be a Guatemalan refugee in a detainment camp. How absolutely timely on the noses this story without being pandering? I mean we try to say pretty neutral on stuff in genre junkies. You can obviously interpreter politics pretty easily. We are keeping babies in cages in this country and we are treating people less than human. And what happens when you make such stupid choices and you bite off more than you can chew and I love Joaquina. I love her so much. I love this story. This story is a modern day. Relevant origin story of an ex-man. Yes person will yeah but marvel exit. Yes marvel expert is origin story of Mutant of a superhero and you know marvel has typically done a good job of trying to stay relevant to the Times especially when it comes to the X. men and some of those an every I feel like decade it becomes it becomes relevant for that decade again. And you can go back and find plenty of problematic things and all the comic books but I don't. This isn't this isn't a podcast. Discussing the politics love comic books in where we're really into that but this falls under the category of. Hey this is. This is an origin story that is relevant for the politics of today the end. I love and I want to read more of where this goes. This is this is the this situation is having to happen and be a basis for a story. But it's yeah it's I can't put it any other way than it's not claiming it's not pandering and this is not the first time ever in the history of the world or even of America that we have people in detainment camps so there is an unfortunate at timelessness to this as well but if you are not moved if you are not like shook in this does not resonate with you and I really think you need to check your pulse and your conscience and not to mention just a really well written like super well done. I mean what a great way and this collection to absolutely with a bang and I just I have to say it because I'm I'm going to jump into it right now. This is a five out of five collection for me. Just STRAIGHT UP. Five strange girls out five strange girls out of five at Save. Five bad ass. Strange wonderful girls out of five. This is so well curated even the ones. That just didn't really do it for me. Yes weren't bad. They weren't like they weren't my thing as you did an amazing job putting this collection the huge huge applause because every single story. It's going to work for somebody. Yeah it's going to mean something to somebody and you know. Of course it's like when you have these ones that were so stellar and so powerful to us and then there's the ones that don't resonate for you eight GonNa dip and it's going to happen but that's okay because one of the ones didn't resonate with us could resonate with you. One of things. I appreciate about the compilation of this as well as I feel like short story. Collections usually fall into one of two categories. They either have like a big peak at the beginning. It kind of like goes down in the Middle Online. Has Its filler stories. And then closes off with a bang or it tries to stay at a high level and just has breaks here. And they're like okay. This is just like a pallet cleanser. Okay this is just a little bit of filler. This just felt steady. Yes throughout. There's definitely someone's ones that hit me personally harder than others. But just because they were just specifically Relevant to my tastes but the collection felt constant it felt consistent and that is very difficult to do. Yeah absolutely a homerun. I'm so proud of this collection. I'm so honored to of read it into experienced it and it makes me very proud to be a strange girl. I love that. I love in a strange girl won't be the first time won't be the last time I've been called that or worse. And Are you proud to be married to a strange crime? Very proud to be married to a strange girl. Strange girl ally over here people all right. Thank you guys so much for joining us. We'd love to hear your favorite stories where I'm so happy that we got so many new authors out of this new to US authors. So cool all right. Thank you Scott. Thank you Sandra and thank you a xerox. Yes thank you authors. Thank you listeners. Thank you cats. Thank you dolls and as always. Please keep reading past your bedtime.

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87 | Horror | Shadowy Natures Anthology and Interview With the Editor, Rebecca Rowland!

Genre Junkies | Book Reviews

1:43:51 hr | 6 months ago

87 | Horror | Shadowy Natures Anthology and Interview With the Editor, Rebecca Rowland!

"Hey everybody, this is Sandra. This is Scott and well, you might have noticed, and especially if you follow us on social media that tonight's episode is late, it wasn't originally intended to be part of horror October but it certainly fits in I mean, it's wonderful and we're gonNA take that. Take that lemon make lemonade. That this is a great part to add to our spooky season month. In all seriousness, we are once again besieged by fires in northern California very, very, very close to homeless time are. Surrounding neighborhoods lot of folks lost their homes lot of animals lost their lives in some people as well. Thank you to all of the amazing amazing first responders. Keep US safe. We love you. You're the best we love you your. Your true heroes and sorry guys at this episode was a little late but ended up actually being even better because this is going to open up or October are TB are is still in effect. We're just GONNA have four episodes this month where safe where healthy our home is still standing the studio stands we've got sweetheart and stitches everybody's doing. Okay. So without further ADO, here's the show. Weirdo Book Worms Unite We want to share our love of genre fiction with you. Some readers out there may look down on you for your love of horror, sci fi and fantasy, but not us. So stop by as we discuss what we've been reading. Hey Chandra junkies it's Sandra. Scott and before we get started talking about the Super Super Awesome episode, we have for you today we must introduce you to a new member, the crew. Yes. We have a new employee. A new employee what his title? He is currently kind of like a groupie he's in charge of cable management he's He's a studio technician is interning as a cable rap cable tie guts, right? Yes. Without further ado and we will, of course, post a picture we've kind of been saving him. We have a baby corn snake in our house now and he is so cumia. So cute. So I have always always been majorly into every reptile herp especially snakes and frogs. Those are kind of my thing and lizards everything and I've just always like I pretended that I had snakes growing up and and like one thing that I would do is I had this little rubber snake it was yellow and black, and I kept hitting a little little cardboard shoebox filled with you know. League leaves and stuff and that was like my little pet snake and my mom totally afraid of snakes would never let me have one and then I grew up. Scott. Okay hold on to jump in here really quickly share that that little rubber snake in a shoebox. The first time I heard that story from you was probably a month and a half ago. This my snow and it's very sweet and as someone who who's a little freight of snakes myself just like not like terrified just a little uncomfortable. That was kind of like well, okay. I guess I guess we have to start looking at stay. Yes. Because it was like one of those things where it's like I, don't WanNa, go the rest of my life without having snakes in. The Life Anyway so We did a lot of research lake official research and we fell in love with corns and we adopted our little baby, and now in case you're wondering Scott is not afraid of our snake Scott has become a huge herp enthusiast I. I have learned so much about snakes in the past two three weeks I know all about morphology DNA and how to raise them and the difference between different types of snakes. I've just I've fallen just down to the deep end Cassini. Using. They're pretty cool. So for those of you who are fans of a certain book series we Will there was only one name that I wanted for my snake and that would be sweetheart named in honor of Queen Catering's snake from, of course, the Dr Blake series. The Queen's offend burn series es by our beloved beloved Kendra. Blake one of our favorite authors who had the The pleasure of having on this show sell Candar Sweetheart says thank you. Alright. So tonight, that's about a sweet as this episode's going to get. That's about a Sweden. Har. So. Tonight, we are reviewing a psychological horror short collection and not only are we reviewing this but we have the honor, the privilege you know some days I just like I can't believe I can't believe our life and our show, and how lucky we are. We get to talk to the amazing author who does not have a work in this, but she is an amazing authored by the editor. Of. This collection Rebecca Roland. So look forward to that as usual. We will have that between our non spoiler section, which is coming up right now and our spoiler section where we're GonNa talk about very specifically you know the different stories in this in his collection sell without further ado, we present shadow eat nature's a horror short story collection. So we're gonNA just kind of really briefly talk about. Our feelings and whatnot because they're so so much to unpack in this collection, and of course, we have that you know super super sexy hot interview. With Rebecca Roland to so we want to get into it. I mean, I, feel like I should go last so Scott what was your my my experience post periods I would say that this book was an experienced indeed Okay, every time I think that you know what? I'm a horror fan. Now I'm a horror Aficionado I enjoy horror something like this comes along and slaps in the face and says, no, you're not prepared for true horror. I really enjoyed and appreciated this collection, but it was a lot for me. I would call it a struggle just because I had to like I had to like check in on myself every every story or so. Are you doing. Okay. I. Mean. I mean, this is already been just an emotional roller coaster of a year and this definitely feeds into some of the anxieties and and I think that I think that it's wonderful because of that but man was I not prepared. So super effective. Yes. So it's almost like you're saying struggle I am saying struggle and they loved it again for me particularly when it comes to horror novels a struggle experience for me but maybe the best score that I can give it. That's really that's a really good. That's really good point. It's Kinda like when people are like Oh, this horror movie people walked out of it people cried it's like that right? Exactly. That's exactly right. Yeah. So I. Found this to be you know somewhere healthily between obsession and page Turner This collection was absolutely fantastic. I talked about it a little bit over on the coach show which we do go hey, there's a little plug youtube in podcast but anyway which we talked about horror lot and you know I I love horror movies. That is you know I can't live without horror movies is my thing horror books though and horror shorts will always be number one in my heart because. Things a movie. So few movies out there that are even nearly as extreme frightening, disgusting disturbing nightmare inducing as half the we read and it's like. You think yourself tough you think you're such a big horror fan. You need to read some of the workout there because it will make your hair turn to silver and. You will never ever sleep again I want to say this per. We've read a few horror short story collections in the past both for the show and outside of the shuttle after meeting on my whole life. This one I feel really takes the cake for me as being kind of the most disturbing it's not deranged now I've read some more deranged things although there are some stories that are pretty. Nuts. But. It's very disturbing because it is very psychological. Yeah. That's the whole point yet nature's yeah exactly. This is the kind of collection stories that puts you in the mind of bad p some bad people and explores that at every story. I mean I guess it goes without saying to gosh. It's always so hard to give triggers especially for short stories, but these short stories do explore. Some really dark. Themes. Suicide is explored. self-harm death of animals. Some bad stuff happening to kids explored I mean it it's really hard to give I mean you could give a long list of specific trigger warnings. I'm just going to say if there are things if you're feeling a little. A little need to protect yourself right now. Then maybe this isn't the collection for you might not be the time we save it for when you have more spoons. You know. But otherwise if you're ready to kind of explore some of your own shadowy nature's Buckle in, do it because this collection is phenomenal it really is it. It is a triumph it is. There's not a lot wasted in this. Every story is not GonNa hit you. You know as much as you know, some of the other ones that's just the way short story collections are know about, but I think they pretty much all hit real hard on you. What I mean like you'll you're GONNA have favorites of slow. But there's there's not a lot of there's nothing that feels like Filler to me in this collection, which was nice it a very complete cover to cover just a excellent writing excellent writing. Yeah. So what do we do? Should we? I mean, she we give. A recommendation before we get into the and review in spoilers. Yeah and I I'm GonNa go first because I think you're GONNA be surprised by my my appeals core for this. Oh, I don't want to hear it. I'm going to give this general appeal. I love that which is surprising to me even for how just horror psychologically disturbing this this collection is. Yes but it's disturbing in a way not like, oh, just there's all lots of blood and Gore and like traditional like real big Hoorah fans into this psychological part really kind of it digs into that that joy that people find even a little bit in true crime. And an psychological thrillers, and so I think that you do have to have a little bit of a strong stomach and being A. Good head space to read this I think it goes beyond just horror fans I see what you mean, and I really appreciate that and I actually really really see what you are going with their. I'm I'm thinking that's fair and thinking general's Pretty Fair. I will say you know there's all different types of horror and that's Kinda the nice thing about short story collections because you'll have some body horror and some you know, maybe some folklore, some different things and you can often find authors and styles that you really like 'cause everybody's not the same in in their horror tastes This is a great collection chew expose us all to some different authors and Really Really Jess disturbance scared the bejesus out of yourself. I think the hardest task that you will find after reading this collection is deciding which of these authors to look deeper into yeah, and you want to. Right now, I'm just kidding. Leykis, you're scared of them all of them. But horror people are some of the most wonderful people you'll ever meet in your life We are amazing. We are amazing horror people don't be don't be scared of these authors. I'm sure they don't bite hard sell without further Ado, I? Think we've gotTA TALK TO REBECCA Roland. I, think we gotta get into this thing. Let's go. Enjoying the show please like in subscribe on Itunes you can find us on twitter and Instagram at. John. Ridge. And don't forget visit the website John Junkies Dot Com. Welcome to the show John Junkies Rebecca Roland editor of tonight's short story collection shadowy nature's. Welcome Rebecca. I'm so excited to be here. I'm a big fan of genre junkies. So yeah, very excited. Thank you. Oh my God you humble and embarrassed us. We will take the compliment. Let's see. Let's get right into it I. Guess I'm fascinated by the short story and the idea of short story collections. How do you even go about starting to choose stories for a collection? Oh my gosh. So this is a long explanation I. Do have to tell you. This is the second anthology that dark ink has put out there actually primarily known for what they've done a lot of horror but they also have some very big name horror. Memoirs and biographies in so but they decided to branch out into anthropology and this is the second Thalji that they've done. So when we put the call out, I thought well, you know maybe we'll get we wanna fill you know about eighty thousand words may be fifteen to twenty stories. Hopefully, fingers crossed will get fifty or seventy five stories and we put it out with a three month window and we were just del used. We ended up having to your clothes at early. We got over three hundred stories. And or and they were fan tastic stories I mean I I was as someone that's a writer herself. I read these and I thought Oh God I just need to pack it in some of the people that are out there writing. There is no way I'm ever GonNa get to this caliber just fantastic stories is and so right off the bat, we were sort of a little overwhelmed. So our process was we take in the stories and then we read each one once all the way through. and. I would say of of that pile about seventy five percent of them. Fits the call it was psychological horror fit the the word count was something that kind of was very well written. We didn't have to worry about excessive editing something that was sort of an original voice, and then we then had to whittle the pile from there and as far as how we ended up with twenty one stories, I have to tell you that. So many of these stories like I said were so good they were just so good. There's so many really solid talented short story writers out there that it was difficult we had to turn away. Quite a few but the twenty one that are in this collection the way that we chose them, it's an I kid you not. It was I read the story and if two or three days later I was thinking about that story I said I have to have it. I have to have it and it was for one reason or another, and these stories are so different. You've read them you know that there are. Different. Styles, different voices, a lot of times you know different focus completely, but there is something about it. I, mean I even I can remember one or two of them saying to people that have. Nothing to do with this anthology just saying I need to tell you about the story that Iraq days back and just sort of you know rehashing and then I knew I knew I just we had to have it and so each one of these, it's not an because I don't want some of the writers that we had to turn away. I mean absolutely just incredibly talented. But. It was just it was these twenty one it was one extra thing. There is something about them that we just we need to have them. So we're really fortunate that able to get these twenty one. My she had that would be just I can't even imagine how many good ones there are, and then it's like once you have to be like, Oh, not quite for this the vibe of this collection. Yeah, right? Yeah. Yeah, and there are even a few that. And it just was one of these luck of the draw things where I'd already fallen in love with one story and a similar story came down the Pike and I remember there was one in particular that I had read and I said you know I really take this but I've already fallen in love with Brian Miller's you know heart skull heart and it was so similar to what I said. No I can't I've got I've got to keep you have to sleep. You know what? I mean we want something a little bit different because all of them are are just they're different. They're all different spoilers. That's one of my favorites in the election. As someone that's from New England I'm from New England and we are the home of that horrible horrible case where the girl yes. talked the boy into committing suicide. And so right off the bat we read this and I'm like, Hey, this rings a bell and but the way he goes about it is so original is so neat. Yeah. Not at all what you think Oh, I can't wait accolade. Yeah. Yeah. Have you did you get to know these authors after they were selected? Did you know some of them beforehand? What's what's that like? So I did no one of them. So one of them is from a previous collection that we did few years ago. That was Halloween based and he saw our call and he immediately submitted on and that's Louis Stevenson he is, and he is he's such a good writer because he's able to do pretty much any sub-genre. Much. Chameleon when he writes and so he submitted it. So right off the bat we had that which is our sort of our body horror. Yes. And but he was the only one that I knew previous to this the rest of them I've gotten to know since then because the open call was last fall. So it's been almost an entire year getting to know he's writers and a lot of my have gotten to know very well, and so I yeah, yeah but no, no, it was. It was for the most part very new very new. So there seems to be kind of a time honored tradition especially in horror of the short story, what do you think it is about short stories that have such a lasting appeal for these impala policies. I mean for me, I'm a short story person. I really especially with horror or anything suspenseful, and maybe it's because horror and thriller and anything that's going to sort of evoke that intense emotion of being on the edge and and being frightened we can't sustain that for an entire novel. So it's it's sort of Nice to have it in the short BITs I don't know I mean I but I also think that there are different triggers for different people. So when you have an anthology, you're gonNA find that there's going to be something that you read it and you're like, well, you know that's fine but it doesn't really freak me out and then you read the next one and you thank. God like what's under my bed I don't even. Kind of a thing. So I think that's the appeal at least for me for horror anthologies because I will by I will buy them myself because I do like the fact that there is such there's something for everyone. Yeah. Yeah. May May I ask what your lake kind of trigger is 'cause Scott Okay definitely he bought or gets to him I can say that I am I have no soul. So nothing gets to me. At all. I ever since I was a kid and I don't know what this is about 'cause I no one's ever been me. I've never had any sort of weird traumatic experience with teeth. I never had braces. I was very blessed that way. But even since I was a child, my aunt can tell me when I was very little. She gave me a doll and the first thing I said was please don't bite me which she thought was Ashley Hilarious Use The doll to kind of scary meet any opportunity that she had. But I guess I've had this weird trigger about biting. So when the Zombie phenomenon started I thought a lime in for a treat but I Get over it but even so that's why I think mandibular fixation really triggered with me because it's all about the teeth in the kind of adjust this whole idea of. So that's I I feel like I've gotten over it. I still don't want anyone's Mao anyone anywhere near me is but I yet I think fighting. But now as I've gotten older I, think the idea of losing control of. One's mind and the ability to distinguish what is real and was not really very frightening to me. So psychological horror has always been a favorite of mine for that reason because that is kind of a trope that does appear over and over again and so yeah I. So I guess that's something body horror doesn't really freak me out although I can see I can understand I can understand why does Some people are, I'm not crazy about parasites I gotta say. That my my other favorite thing and just like sub-genre is any sort of secret society or colts and things that really normal. But underneath it's it's not normal at all. US My. Yeah. Yeah. So it's not every day that we get to talk to somebody who has been so involved with compiling a story collection. So I really wanted to know how you go about ordering the stories in the collection. And the follow up was going to be why was mandibular fixation I but I think we've got the answer. He's Maybe. That's that's probably. I'm really it's almost like you're my therapist. Forty and the list of some kind. I couldn't. Be. I I would say okay so I do the way that I go about ordering anthology is for me. There are three or four major spots in an anthology that are very important to schedule, and it's the first story the second story, the last story in what's called the tent pole story, which is sort of smack in the middle. and. So the way that I know I've chosen them is for a first story you want it to be something that is going to give the reader. An idea of what the rest of the collection is going to look like sort of the feel the mood of it and for me beyond the biting issue behind the Bitish. Their. mandibular fixation was just this sort of progressively creepy story in the something simmering right under the surface for me when I read it that really made me uncomfortable and I I think that that is the best type of psychological or buts out there, and so I wanted to put that first. The second story should be at that same sort of level, but it might be something that is shorter or is a little quirkier and so drifter in. It's so funny would right at the beginning of drifter blackwell establishes that it's this it's takes place in the old West Wild West eighteen hundreds and I am not a fan of historical fiction absolutely do not like it. So I, remember when I sat down to read this I thought. Okay well, let's just see how this goes and he just pulled me right into that world and I was so uncomfortable by the end I just it was one of those that I thought this is so good so good. So we ended up putting that second. Yeah. The the the last story and then theology I. So my favorite short story I think of all time would probably have to be Charlotte Perkins Gilman's the Yellow Wallpaper oh. Yeah. I adore that story and I was an English teacher for a long time I taught it over and over again and usually when you teach something after a while you're like, I, please just stop talking about the story I don't WanNa live in. It's just you just don't even want to but I still really I love story and when I read Christina daleas story, that's all I could think of was that voice and so with the closing story with an anthology, you always want it to be something that's going to reiterate the theme of the Anthology, but also close up the mood and leave the reader feeling satisfied but still thinking about the rest of the stories and I felt like Delia story really did. That because it was so strong and and so uncomfortable, and then the pulls stories were hard. Usually with Tent Pole, you want it to be something that's going to be as strong as the first or second story but with these twenty one because we were so choosy there really wasn't a story in here that I felt like was a week choice and I say that honestly because I have read in colleges where I've been the writer in an anthology where I'm like. I can see where my story is like Whoa. We link here, but it's but I really did not have one of these in this anthology. So it was more of I tried to think of what was something that was really going to stand out for readers and there were a few so I kind of you know shoved them towards the middle and they included uncle in Orleans on who is becoming very fast. One of my favorite short story writers and Cayenne Johnson's accessory, which is about the girl who befriends kind of cool girl in the. Wall and Andrew Puns does in a mother's is about the Military official that has to a let mother know that his that her son has been has passed away and I thought the three of them. I'm going to push them towards the tadpole but I to be honest looking back. Now, I really could've taken any of the other, the remaining nineteen stories, eighteenth stories, and kind of shoved them towards that tent pole. But that's just me. I'm not sure how other anthology editors to it but when I, when I do find that a story of mine. Ends up in one of those positions I think to myself. Yes. Done. Done at it's like sports. It's like being a starter or something or lead in a play or yeah really as it is it is. That's a really good point because I mean, I, think I think we've all read collections where you it's impossible. You're not going to resonate completely with every story, but you know, yeah, there is definitely an art, the arrangement. Oh my God I just never thought about it. My Mind's kind of blown kind of feel like you just gave me the blue pill in the matrix or something. No going back now? No no going back now well, I had a question because you you are a writer and we are a fan of your writing, and so we wanted to talk to you a little bit about that, and since as an editor of an anthology, you understand a little bit the mind of a writer. I think. Well, one of my first questions is what challenges have you had to overcome as a woman in the Hor- community or or have you found challenges? Oh my goodness. Yes. I can tell you I could tell you so many stories. I think the one that actually is freshest in my mind is so last year my writing partner and I my Louis C. WE released a book together we released a a novel called pieces and it's about a serial killer that cuts a woman into pieces and then mails the pieces to random people around America, and so we did a whole promotional tour for this book and we sat right next to each other at all these tables and time after time even though my name is on the sign, my name is on the book were right next to each other. I was asked things like Oh are you Michael's wife? Are you? Are you helping out? Are you helping? How? No no, it was almost I mean it and at first I thought well, maybe it's just there I I mean, I don't know I don't have an excuse for it because what I did notice is no one said to Michael our are you her husband happing out like that never happened so I mean that's it's it just is what it is I mean if you look at the primary reader for horror, it tends. To, be males ages twenty to thirty five and I am neither so it's it's one of those. Now I get it right you gotta what comes to mind but it's it's like this ingrained nece Ns that yeah that they would approach you as like or you the why for you the Helper Oh, that's right. Yeah, and it is infuriating but at the same time, it's like you gotta guess rise above it I guess. Yeah. I did when I first started sending my pieces in to be published, I did consider writing under initials and a lot of women do that. Yeah. But and I get I absolutely get it. You know when I I would say ninety nine percent of the time when we received a submission. That we're initials it was there are women, but I guess in the end I thought you know what? I'm just I'm not gonNA play the game like if you don't want to read this because I don't have a Y chromosome. Well, that's. That's your baggage. That's not mine and I do think I think that I can play with the boys I. Think I can be just as disgusting and frightening and and not you you. Really you know after reading some things I hope that you're not comfortable being alone with me. Object I. Feel good about that. That makes me feel good. It is what it is all I love that as as somebody with a background in education to. Just want to ask you this question. Maybe it's kind of a dumb question but here at John. Rogen keys, we're a big fan of in this kind of how we started read anything. They cash your attention just read and it's okay if it's not what everybody thinks is what you should be reading have you been able to Canada get people into reading V A horror? while I work with teenagers and the majority of what I. I have edited or written is Really cannot in good conscious say. That's okay. Bring this home. Your parents will be fine with. Said I've said to kids where they've brought my short story collection and they picked it up at Barnes and noble or whatever, and which is. So it's so nice like I'm like, oh Look and I said Oh my God. Where did you get this book? Where did you get this book? I I. Think. I. I think with the kids are going to like what they're gonNa like you know when you're a teenager you kind of stick to what is comfortable because you enough crap going on that you. You know you don't really want to have to explore things if you don't have to. But I yeah I mean I think that it's it's it's a nice starting point. Or? Like. Okay. So you're not like in this. You're not liking that. Have you tried horror. Right. Well, I mean I think with the the walking dead and in sort of this huge rise of Zombie movies and television shows. I think bat has been kind of the gateway drug to reading for some of these reluctant readers which is. Great, great. I mean I I'm a big proponent of reading helping writing. I don't think that we can teach kids how to write well unless they start to read well. It's just like speaking I, love that. Actually that's a great. That's another mind blowing us and Oprah Aha moment right there. And you get a horrible. Under, your chair. So for authors who are aspiring to be included in a short story anthology, how how authors get get introduced and find out about them so that they can submit their works. Well, I will tell you because I am a huge fan of this site. So I don't do not feel weird promoting them at all I absolutely adore them. horror tree dot com horror tree is. I mean, they are absolutely fabulous about they post open calls. They're very clear about you know what? Though they'll put all the details there they. An aspiring writer can go on and organize the open calls by they only wanted Thala Giese. They don't care if they're paid, they want something paid they want something with deadlines. They want something with a rolling deadline. They're fantastic. I. Think that aspiring writers just go peruse what's out there. There are open calls up for everything you can possibly think of, I. Tell people who are thinking about submitting just submit it. Yeah. It's not no one comes to your house and cuts off like a hand. If you don't it taken and it's twenty you why not and I? You really also have to have the experience of getting that rejection email I hate to say it, but it's true. I mean Stephen King tells the story of how when he was just starting out back when he was the nineteen seventies. So all the rejection letters actually came as physical letters and he would take them and he would put them on one of those diner's spikes where they would put sort of the the orders that are done. He had the spikes and he just put another rejection letter until this. Enormous pile had accrued and look at him. Today S I think that it builds character I think it also makes you a better writer because if you're submitting a story twenty times and Twenty Times, the the editors are saying now it's not really for us. It really forces you to go back hopefully into that story and say, what am I not doing correctly what I need to tweak or maybe this maybe I just need to put this aside and look at it another time just you know just to there's not that you cannot lose anything the only thing you can possibly gain. Is Insight and and possibly to getting that that story accepted which feels absolutely incredible. Oh I love that. Yeah. It's not like the some guy's GonNa show up with like you know you press this button and somebody's GonNa die but we'll take your stores. Exactly exactly. I would love to hear some of your recommendations for people for horror novels and books or short stories. Big Small just anything that you can help turn our reader our readers listeners onto oh my gosh. So it's so funny you should say that because I actually made a point this summer to go ahead and try to read as many independent horror pieces as I could only because I'm also a big believer in Karma and dark ink is a small independent press that I don't have I. Don't own but I am employed by them and I know that they really do their best to try to promote independent newer authors. So I thought. Well, I'm going to go ahead and I'm going to look at other presses, new stuff, and so the few things that I saw. So the very first thing I, just read this collection by Frederick Panic born and it was I wish I could think of the press and I can't think of it but the name of it is nightmares of the damned. It is a comic. It's got a little bit of psychological horror horror. A little bit of supernatural horry really runs the gamut. So there's something in there for everyone. It's definitely one of these books where you're going to find something that you are going to really like. But beyond that, he's a very good solid writer. So reading his stories, even if it was something where I thought, well, let's not really the kind of horror that I'm in love with I still liked. The story because he really is a good storyteller and he incorporates a lot of mythology that maybe we aren't aware of. So that was really solid. Another piece that I read that I really liked was a short story collection by Robert Tone called her infernal name and other nightmares ou in asked. So I got to know this writer because he happens to be in an upcoming collection and in theology that we're doing that's going to be releasing in the spring. And I really liked his writing. So I saw it out this collection that I knew was coming out this summer in. It's really neat because the title story is this horror satire on our obsession with social media and influencers. Yes. So good it's so solid So He's phenomenal and I did take the leap and I'm not a huge fan of splatter porn. I'm just not. You know it is what it is but I did know of this writer John Stephens who I've I've liked his short work and he released Novella called the God in the hills. And it is so creative. So gory. So if you are a gore fan, you will eat this up because his imagery is just above and beyond it's absolutely just phenomenal. So you go on and on Sandra is furiously taking no, I, don't have an audit record. I'm excited I. WanNa Start. Now there are so many newer independent writers that I think are coming up I mean we're so used to seeing the old standbys like Stephen. King kind of you know he just search shells out but it's Now. There are so many of these new writers that we don't see a lot of light shone on and I think it's because they do come from smaller presses and I wish there were because even the. So this is just my little soapbox moment so. The the brick and mortar store stores like Barnes and noble. They are not fans of caring independent press books right or a lot of reasons, and that's a shame. That's really a shame because I think that it just reinforces this this glass ceiling that independent newer writers are trapped under a newer presses and independent presses are trapped under and it's to its streets really too bad because there really is there's so many antastic fantastic writers out there right and it's Kinda like unless you're Kinda tuned into this other side of it it's like you're missing out on a lot of wonderful horrifying nightmare inducing content but. Yeah. It's so good. I have to say to you, you guys, you editor she writers how'd you come up with the names for these anthologies in short stories because they're also Grad love shadowy nature's I mean there's so many it's like, do you guys have a like one of those? Internet named generators they you coach Of God if you ever come across one, please give it to me because we actually had a lot of difficulty coming up with the name for this one because we knew it was going to be psychological horror. And in. So even when we were advertising the open call, it was sort of Oh an untitled psychological horror and wasn't until we had the collection together and you know the owner of the press could you got to come up with a title I have no idea and I saw pitched just a ton of them and he's like, no, no that. Doesn't work and I'm a huge huge fan of of Paul and I can remember reading this essay where he does talk about you know the psychological aspect of scary stories and so I went back and I reread the essay I saw this quotation and I thought this is this is a I pitched it, and so we we ended up with shadowy natures. and. That was US honestly it was just the like the luck of the draw that we stumbled across that. I wish I had a magical machine like you were saying because it is up, it's time it's got grab people, but it also has to like be indicative of the collection right and the other issue you also have to think of is. On? Amazon because that's where everyone goes now to buy a book if you hype in a title that is too similar to one, that is a very popular title, your book is going to end up at the bottom of the list. So you also have to think of title that's going to you know if someone does a search, it's going to pop up. So it's it's just it's yeah it's tough. Oh my gosh this has been awesome. So insightful and interesting and delightful rebekah. Thank you so so much forgetting this book into our hands in on our radar and for talking to us today Oh thank you so so much for having me like I said, I am a huge fan of this podcast. Already I have to tell you that there are a couple of books that you have recently reviewed that are already in my wishlist and so no. Thank you. So much because I also do notice you do pick these independent press books that maybe people would have best Had you not drawn attention to them? So thank you so much especially behalf of of these twenty one writers who are just some of the most talented writers that I think I I've worked with and So to give them this this hour where you can talk about them is really Fendt. It's phenomenal. Thank you so much. Thank. You Rebecca. You were an absolute rockstar. How cool is she? She's awesome and I feel like I feel like we've got some inside baseball in that one too. There is some good info, I. It's the first time that I've really gotten the chance to ask questions of someone who's edited and compiled a short story collections. I. Learned a lot and I love having it from her point of view since she is a phenomenal writer and she's an educator and she's editor. So it's like she really understands I feel how this works how her Short Story World Works and how to put it together. So that was a really really cool insightful person have on the show. Absolutely she's lovely. She is lovely inch and She said, you know this is this is a collection where as she calls there really isn't a tent pole. I will be very interested to discuss with you what you feel. Your Tent Pole was because I'm having trouble I am having a lot of trouble. I mean I really don't think there was there's kind of a mid point. which I can identify, but it's not like you know things change after that story I I don't know we'll see we'll comes into it. So for those of you who've not joined us for short story collection before kind of what we do here is we go basically style a story by story. Sometimes, we don't have time to talk about every story or sometimes you have time to talk about restarting at depth. So don't be you know don't. Be offended don't be worried. We're not saying a states bad. We just might not have as much to say about each one, but we basically just go boom boom boom boom boom boom any reviews of every story? Yeah, and sense these are by multiple authors I did use we always do this the guide in the back of the book about the authors to say which pronouns that author prefers. So that's how we do it over here John Jonah. Junkies. I can't wait to talk about the first story. So Sandra let's let's hear. Synopsis. As, Rebecca Kinda. said air really starts out with a Bang mandibular fixation by leave Roselle lease. He him pronouns a Christian guy has weird nightmares and well, we're tooth stuff happens. This story first of all a big applause for this being the first story because it really does set the tone, but I am so confused. I read this story three times the first time immediately after I read it, I read it again, and then as soon as I finish the short story collection I read this immediately upon ending the last story F. I am just I am confused. Honey did you write this after you'd had dental work and you were kind of like tripping a little and I mean that in the best way possible because that's how I felt. I felt like, I. Just had to work done and I was like you know is this real life flow let's. This was written as the fever dream by current orthodontist former. WWe Star Hulk Hogan. It's it's crazy. Yeah it's it's an it's wonderfully crazy and it touches on the themes of religion and Christianity, which I love exploring in horror and cannabis this weird patriarchal bulletin that I hate and you you do not like the lead character you're very compelled were this story is going fever dream perfect way to put it. Yeah. Do you did you understand the references to wrestling moves a little bit? Yeah. I mean I mean I, I understood. Moves are I. Didn't understand how like how all that kind of rolled into the universe that was being created. I think it was just it was such a exploration of this. What's going on in this man's mind it's like it just. It doesn't make sense in a good way. I'm not saying I. Loved The story I thought it was. Absolutely yeah. But it's just like you feel like you're dreaming because the way it moves from Canada vignettes, Vignette Vignette and I will just say as well the description of all of the teeth in the stall. I did not catch at first that there was something weird about it because I don't know if you've ever seen the X. ray of a child's skull issue how I love t horrifying have a thing about teeth kinda like we are frightening creature says we are we are scary. It's grossing actually have some teeth and I have a mandible in my sleeve Tatchio. Because teeth are weird and spooky bones outside your body. Yeah. I guess. So there's just teeth are just inherently a little weird and amazing. Next. Up Next we have drifter by CW. Blackwell. CW IS HE HIM PRONOUNS? This is the story of takes place in central California in eighteen fifty, a drifter and his companions. I have a soft spot in my heart for historical horror. I love historical horror. You guys know that we've talked about it on the show I thought this story was inspired just fantastic because you know there was a certain point in time where we didn't like to talk about. Things and Oh, it's the good old days I was talking about the good old days and there was never good old days. People have always been horrible murderous and awful to each other and thank you C. C. W blog wolfer reminding US I. Think you I like this. A lot of this is this is kind of the story in this book that I feel like could be made into an HBO series. L.. Guy Who just keeps picking up a new. A. Project if you will likely would have to have like the law person that's like hunting him down. Oh this could also be a Quentin Tarantino. This one was was fun in a way. About, it was to think about like what happened before what's happening in the future just him having a new acquaintance every episode offline like the way he obviously feels like he's not doing anything that bad. You know like a hits such a warped worldview he has of how he collects his companions. It is just it's a fun spooky little story like that. But disturbing sorry kids. Taking out the garbage by Thomas. Von Thomas is he him pronouns a convenience store employees reflects on the state of his neighborhood. Wow. This one was really something. This was something I am conflicted on how I feel about this one. We don't live in an area that is. That is quite that affected by drugs and Crime Luckily we're very very fortunate. There's a part of me. And this may be the white privilege part of me that. Feels like that's kind of been quote unquote done but I really liked the way that the story was told that makes sense. Yes I. Think what you're saying is because there's some kind of taxi driver you know sort of dirty a hairy field story a little bit without there being as much vigilanteism I guess overt Vigil Antietam. I felt I felt empathy Ford, the convenience store clerk and you know how he just needed to keep working at this point just a couple more years and he could be out of there. But at the same time, he was an insidious type of person himself. Yeah and so it was hard for me to like him I don't know I, hope I where I want the Sergio a little open and dead I want him to start killing people and to kill cool and you know all all in really be the one taking out the trash taking out the garbage I guess I was I guess maybe I'm confused by the story because I felt like at the end it was suggested that he was the one taking out the garbage I? Think he's GonNa Start I. Don't think he started yet. Okay. That's kind of like the indication I got is I think he got to maybe a breaking point I don't know and I don't know if he's going to recruit people in the neighborhood the the other still good quote unquote good people I don't know. I'd be very curious to see and it makes my mind think about like where this character would go and where he would take his vigilantism to the next step. Up Next, we have seven days of dog walking by Scotty Miller. Sorry. I'm of course I'm very sorry if I pronounced anybody's names. So Scotty uses he him pronouns Scott he's still your name. God walks his dog and kills a girl he's left. Oh. My My synopsys crack me up. Short. This is a I mean Oh my God this guy hate him so much for lusting after this young girl but I thought the way that this was written and unfolded was fantastic. I don't know how he just fell into this cycle of complete madness. He was clearly just not a great person. At the way that I think suburban ISM and trying to live everyday life is a little bit of a theme with some of the stories in this collection and like how it's like Scotty sick of the Scotty. Honestly. Saudi. Like he's the narrator spoke he's sick of saying the same things the same people every day and doing the same things with his wife every day it's like why he wants to tell people like what is it find as an octopus or whatever? Like he just is he's just gone mad from the monotony yet, but there's there's better ways to go through a midlife crisis then by lusting after a sixteen year old and then murdering her for really no reason. Saying I support the guy I, don't like him but. I think the way the story unfolded was so smart. Yes, it was. Yeah. Oh next up this is. This one's a little hard. In control by Joseph Rubas Joseph uses he pronouns. Troubled Frankie kills his horrible abusive mom. Okay. This was the first story that really got under my skin. Yeah. This one was hard to read. It was hard to read because it was a good way and a good way it was. Yeah I. This is this is you could consider a compliment to the story but I consider. The way that he talked about the like he thought about his mother disturbed me the way that his mother was disturbed. Me Treated him. Upset me. So greatly it's just it's it's so unhealthy on both sides. The way that he's just almost in a in a in a in a Norman Bates sort of way just loves his mother and wants to love his mother but also like cannot handle just how horrible and abusive. To him, I mean. This is I think this one's particularly hard because this is a type of relationship that happens every day and does happen in your neighborhood and you might not even know it and. It's sad. It's IT'S A. Chicken in the egg argument of like you know Frankie. So disturbed but as he so disturbed because his mother was so completely awful. I was sad to see her go. I. I definitely I didn't like Frankie of course, but I had empathy towards him I. Really. I'm just surprised. He did knock his mom off earlier I'm surprised. Yelled out that lawn. But yeah, the the this one this one here this one hurt I heard I had to take take a really long break after this one and by really long break I mean days. Well, well done just fantastic disturbing. You're writing about, which is important. Up Next, we have maternal bond by Casey Griffen. Casey's uses she her pronounce I knew mom meets coyotes. Oh. My God I love your Synopsys. I thought this story was just great I. Absolutely. One of these you know this is the the slice of life domestic horror that I think really is important right now. Absolutely. So one exports to kind of themes when it comes to. Parenthood Motherhood in particular one, it does explore a bit of of. Uh Pardon Hose pardom depression, and the end, the mania that can come from that. As well, as that maternal instinct to do anything for your child I mean, you would feed yourself to coyotes for stitches already done it. It's just a great story, my snack. It's just that was actually that was that was just a great story. It was. It's I. Think those voices especially from women. You know writing this stuff I think it's important. It's so important because there's We've known a few people, our age who've gone through postpartum issues and it's it's huge and it's carry and it's something that deserves to be explored in every different capacity and literature, and it makes for very compelling stuff to write about two but she didn't have to feed her pet to them. I you know what? Scott Ni-, of course, having a snake and a cat where a little bit more like feed. The human. Feet the. I'd probably be better if she just fed the baby to them, then fed the pet. And just kept the. Was it her cat or dog I'm trying to remember. I think it was a cat. ooh, we're twisted twisted ise say you're not aware person just look at you. Up Next, we have ring rock by James. Edward O'Brien James uses he him pronouns. On a rural property. A couple meets a murderous neighbor. So this one, this one rides, the line between being fun and being really disturbing I had a feeling. I had a prediction did this was actually going to be one of your favorites? It's. It was one of the more effective I wouldn't say it's one of my favorites I. Okay. Let me start were saying I don't know if I can pick a favorite. Okay. I have a couple. Yeah. Because because none of them, what I say we're like, oh I, love this and I want to read it again and again and again. So the biggest the biggest thing about this that disturbed me was not so much even just oh, there's a murderer across the field or whatever his mindset and his resentment of being in the situation that he's in. It's like you know you have the ability to speak up you have the ability to make yourself happy you put yourself in the situation. And yes. Your wife maybe could be you know a little bit more there but you know these this these are agreements that you make with people that you love and you make new and you marry like you come into agreements and you make compromises and just like with relationships it's what you do and if you did that yeah, figure it out man. This one was it's there's a lot unpack in this story. There is that awesome again, kind of domestic relationship marriage stuff going on that makes you think and makes me think a lot about like how you're describing and and then there's also kind of this killer next door thing. You know when it's one of those things where. It's you kind of like you see it coming and you're like Oh God how is this GonNa go and I was like so I was like so mad that like the guy found south that like he called the cops on him and I I. Just. Like is really an attention building story to and the idea that photo showing up in the phone was incredibly creepy Oh my God that was really creepy that was a great device should be used more often showed up in our house pack we would be begun. No prayed out of there. That would that would be the one thing that would probably get me to to leave this. House. Something like that happening. Next step. ooh. We have uncle by Ellen Lawson Ellen uses she pronouns, sorry, my fellow skin navy and I don't think pronounce your last name right this is about a kid being raised by a murderous uncle in their motel. Yeah this one was probably for me the hardest to read I have a weakness many people do for when kids are in abusive living situations. It gets under my skin a little bit in the and that's in a good way I mean obviously like hello. Proof that I'm human right I loved the twist of the older lady that lived in the hotel too that had killed her family. Yeah. What in insidious horrible horrible man clips. So it's I agree with you that this one is incredibly disturbing but this you know I so I can't really pick a favorite. This might be one of my favorites. There's a lot going on. There's a lot new nuance going on in the story and there's something about the the idea of this kid being raised basically to follow in his uncle's footsteps. Yeah he's. He's raising a serial killer. That's that's really like fancy like like. Having trouble. It's fascinating. It really is fascinating fascinating and the boy is written. So interestingly, like there's moments in there in this very disturbing at first I was thinking to myself is the twist come going to be that? This is actually like the uncles dog L. is young because there was kind of like he is kind of treated and acts kind of dog what he's found a place to hide he's found and he's treated kind of a little subhuman which again yes. Totally. Disturbing. I think maybe that thought at the beginning shielded me from some of that in the beginning and shielded me from being too disturbed by it. Right and just just the way that like it. This kid thinks that this is normal right there's something that has happened in this child's life where they are still naive there's a Naievety, there's an innocence, but the grooming has begun. Yes. The seeds have been planted which yeah. The more I. Think about it the more disturbed I am by it even more and I think about the story again but. On reading it I. It was probably one of my favorites. Yeah. It's certainly gives you a lot to think about up next we have in a mother's eyes by Andrew Punzo Andrews is he him pronouns a Lieutenant Colonel who tells people their family has been killed overseas goes to visit an unbalanced mother. I have to say, this was one of those stories where I read it and I was like Andrew. Where did you even come up with this concept in the best way? Like that's kind of one of the fun things about short stories is you get a snippet so people come up with these wild concepts and there's so much that is unexplained that does not need to be explained for the story like this like this. Other brother like who who she hates. You have no idea really why you have no idea what his story is where he is if he is still alive what the situation is actually kind of do find out he is still alive. You don't know any of that. You just know that you know she had the good son and she had the bad son for whatever that means and she also like I guess she's murderous. To our them's yeah. This. Is another example of a story in this book where I don't know how like this is not something I can do I don't know how the authors create these characters and then create the way that they think the way that they see the world around them way is so foreign as just to be absolutely fascinating well, and like I said just like the idea like where does this come from I? Mean I guess there's Something about you know I. Guess having a job where you go into people's homes, there's an intimacy and there's a risk and you think, oh, he's he's military. There's the military guy outside the do this every day it's GonNa be fine. It's going to be hard but it's business as usual and it's like, no, he really gets more than he bargained for in this house and it shows like that. You know that nobody's safe taboo. Up. Next is one of my favorites in the collection almost want to call it like fourth runner up. And that would be a Cesary Bhai. Cayenne Johnson Kayan uses she her pronouns Krissy finds herself. To murder with mean girl bff channy. Okay. This is probably my other favorite. This story is fantastic I. mean they're all great. They're all great everybody is Beautiful Beautiful Snowflake in the story we love them but man was this. Cool. So we talked a little bit about the in the beginning about what kind of re felt might be the unofficial tent. Pole of the of this collection I feel like this. Really this really was for me. Yeah, this is cool. It's a it's a good long story. There's a whole lot of possibilities were. This can go you know there's there's there's kind of playing around with witchcraft and other and other things of that nature. There's there is that me under end chef funeral friendships. Like yes. I. Love All of those things explain those and while it does go to one of those places that I expected it doesn't go there in the way that I was expecting. All Chrissy it turns out is a murderer. She was the whole time. Yes. She's now at the end of the story, she's murdered two people including a little girl all to get close to Jenny and then to get rid of Jenny. Jenny who's murderer not smart enough. She's not calculating enough. She's just kind of like a bitch. Know everything about this story to the the way unfurled second beautiful flower is Great. It was really really really smart. I, think that that's I. think that's a short story. It was perfect. Lincoln. It was. I could have seen that story actually fleshed out into an entire book or at least Novello as well. Totally. Totally of those, like what's great about short stories you really get that sense of dread and discussed and just like being disturbed throughout the entire story this is something where I could see like actually being able to draw even further this would be this would be a really good movie this what net flicks come into Netflix's or shutter. Hulu. This story was so I don't want to say fun, but I found this story very fun. This is the type of story I. Feel like the the way this made me feel is something that I haven't got to feel in a long time and that is the Wolfgang by buried dark berry uses he him pronouns? A, white collar co spends the night at another one's house and see some creepy ass pictures. So now we're going back to a completely like unexplained crazy situation. I, have felt this way from stories before but it's been a while since I've felt this way and it is a very welcome feeling of disturbed fear that I really like where it is unexplained, it is unapologetic. You're just coming across something really. Disturbing it's really disturbing and what actually makes it even weirder is the narrator, the protagonist whatever you WANNA call him. He's talking to them like there's nothing actually weird about it. Well, he's trying he's like something snapped in his little brain a little and he's like ha ha you know like us fix. and. They're all just kind of glaring at him at the table how? I should do a picture like maybe I should do a picture like that. Maybe I should hire a photographer. Frowning on now that's a great idea. I. Just. Just like And the readings here everything's fine. You know. I. Wouldn't have liked this as much if it was just the the mayhem, the dad of he will the husband who is being a. Strain the photos, but it's the wife and the little boy to the whole family. Whole family is just twist and it's like it's so wonderful. And you don't know if that is really just kind of like an inside joke they have as a family. Is that something that that the family those those pictures actually didn't look like that at all and the and the narrator is just snapped for some reason and sees the Matt Way happening. It's a very weird story and it is, but I appreciate it that this story didn't have like. A murderous ending or Horny the never again Okay Yeah we our presentation and then we left the company and that was it. Okay cool story. Bro He's like I WANNA forget these people I'm deleting him out of my phone. I think one of the things this really goes to show this collection in this story is these white collar, rich upper middle class suburban types are the ones you gotta to look out for these are the people that snap and are crazy disturbed. It's not US normal poor folk. It is these guys they're the they're the sick ones I. Love It. how this story all man I loved the story his death brings no respite by Thomas. Kerns Thomas uses he pronounce a man gets revenge on the dying guy who spurned his late love. This one painted such a picture I felt like I was watching a movie like I was watching an absurdity wishes delay books stories always are, but it just was full of color and it came alive before my eyes I cannot believe that this group of men are not real in this was not a real story I was reading, and of course, anytime there is queer representation and books you know your honor junkies are here for it and Wonderful Stories. So I agree this is this is one of those stories that I guarantee you two years from now when I say what was that weird movie that we watched where like I don't even I don't even WanNa say some of these things out loud on the show. It is really like graphic in a in a way. That's not like. It's not like. Okay the bathroom scene L. Yet Athar was so go something you. You will never see in any like you know normal on net flix film. Let's put it that way But yeah, I feel like we watched a really really crazy horror short will in it's one of those two were I. Don't want to say I rooting for the main character I wouldn't put it that way but I was very much like I was feeling his pain a lot and I was feeling like I have to do this for for him. I have to do this for him and then you get, you know the guy who's dying perspective and it's like dude, what are you doing? Here wasting. Ridiculous. Don't you see how this guy treated you? Like a really kind of flips it on its head a little bit yes. I agree that I definitely felt for him but I, you know I it's fed to us the reader very early on that something is something doesn't add up because he's talking about like he died because he loved this guy but but but he the narrator that was his partner that was his partner. So wait what is going on here because and I say partner not out of because gay but because we don't really know the full extent of what their relationship was defined as. and. That was like very like you devoted yourself to this man he was ready to leave you. I put it this way I got from the very beginning that he was an unreliable narrator. Yes. Yes. Yes which we love. Yes. I'm so sorry. Sorry. All these nice people had to die. Something else that. The parts that disturbed me the most in the story is just kind of my own thing is all the things he ends up kind of doing four cayden while he's planning to kill to kill him or at least get this this confession. And but I also found it really fascinating that there's kind of this like there's this there's this hatred in his bitterness towards Cayden. But really throughout the course of the story, what he ends up doing is caring for him right and doing the best job of it mind you. He ends up killing his boyfriend because he really wants to make him suffer but he does all these kind of Nice things for him throughout the story. There so much nuanced in this. Like I said, I, feel like this is so real and I wanna read a book about this group of men and their lives and when they lived in the Rehab together and the misadventures and the conversations got into to have them all form these really complicated ties to one another. Yeah. This is just some brilliant writing very excited and. I. Mean All of these authors are prolific and I looked at Thomas, currency has quite a catalog to read through, which is Great. My father's house by Jeremy Billingsley Jeremy Uses he pronouns. An adult son who was a police officer this is the neighborhood where his serial killer father lives and interviews one of his survivors. So this is another one that is that what the reason why he's doing these things is not clear. This story is so open. It's wonderful. This is so open to interpretation I mean. He could just be doing this to satisfy his own conscious. He could actually I mean it is obviously a little bit of an unhealthy obsession share but. He could be really just doing this so that he can talk to the people right? Is he trying to prove that he's not like his father? Is he trying to prove that he is like his father? What what what is his goal with this? What is what is he trying to get out of this move and this new job and knowing these survivors and you can take it so many different ways? Yes. Now, I am a firm believer that he is planning on. Finishing his father's work. Sure I. Really Don't know which I am. So fifty fifty about this. Yeah. But I would totally be okay with the other with the other. Outcome because it really is so open ended and it's like, Oh, I I love him big US endings and very open to interpretation endings and I don't in novels but I do insurance stories. I love it and it's actually hard to write well and. Jessica did a great job of it. Oh Man. Here we go each by Louis Stevenson. Lewis uses he him pronounce this is the other potential tent pole. Sister grossed out by brother and his skin mania. So I feel like I need to take the first crack at this. So I have OCD. Diagnosed. As one of my cocktail of. Mental health struggles as we all have and. My OCD does lean to self harm and it does lean into some of the things that manifest in this book. So I felt. Tapley. Visceral Involved in this story. and. Man was so well written absolutely gross but I Really I mean I don't. WanNa. Say I feel called out but this is one of those types of stories where it's like I feel a bit exposed because this is very close to home does make sense I'm not as crazy as these people no. No it does make sense and I think you'll be surprised to hear that I had a really visceral reaction to this as well. I don't think that's a by think anybody. Four different parts of it but similar similar reasons in a way. So first of all I have and Sandra will attest very dry skin particularly in the winter and if I don't take very good care of my face in particular I look and peel like an alligator on a daily basis. Now, with my problems I've described and Scott's problem he's not scraping think this was a recipe for disaster but this is why we're not the characters and edge. Yes. Setting it up to make it sound like this. Life Story I. Yeah. I know. There's I'll just say that there is something else in regards to like dry skin that that really. Got To me as well. So like yours I know had to do with part of it. Mine really focused on like the dry skin and the way it was described as being clogged drain floating through the air and Owen, the all the carpet bugs. Oh. My God. Sandra and I both have a thing for infestations in general and carpet bugs definitely are. Right above silver fish. It was. This was a hard a hard one. I've also you know we're aunties and uncles, and some of the little in our lives have had cradle cap in it is weird. I mean, it happens and it goes away and it's fine. But cradle cap is weird. It's gross. Is that the fungus thing Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's weird and the baby how's it at the end? Supposedly, no, the mom knows the baby has it, but it's fine. It should be fine. It shouldn't be as you think the baby just has cradle cap or do you think the baby has the same thing as the brother probably just cradled cat I know Anyway, anyway This is definitely the most body horror and it also made me feel kind of the other thing that. Made, me really sad it actually made me sad and it made me feel very conflicted in myself because you know the brother really he just has a condition. Yeah. He's still a purrs still a portion I mean, she tweets him like garbage. She's awful she is awful and and at first I mean I'll fully admit my I like my first and honestly last thought was fear and disgust, and that's not fair. It's not fair and that sucks of me sucks just in general I think that that's kind of maybe what the author was kind of I mean the thing is, is that if we knew that individual in real life, he would not treat him any differently and you know we would be compassionate and everything. It's the way it's described by by the sister and it's that kind of you know that creeping dread. That's really what it is. Up Next is one of my favorites in the collection like. One of my favorites, which is heart SCO heart by Brian Miller Brian uses he him pronouns dad finds out the teen daughter. Convinced while at least one boyfriend to complete suicide, and this is, of course, very very vaguely based off of a real life case ripped. From the headlines, but it's it's not it's totally different but you know this is what got this mindset on all of our readers. What did I say to you Sandra when I finished this story I think he moaned. I said Holy. Yeah. This one goes there. I mean that real life case is very it's disturbance own it is it's compelling. It's you know it's kind of like a, it's not new I know people were doing this before the Internet before social media and message and all that. But with the way our technology works and especially the way our youth uses it. It's now become something we actually have to actively think about. I love also the DADS conflict. Because most people who do bad things not all but they are complicated and they do how layers and those close to them. Sometimes they're like, oh, I, never would have thought or whatever because they see different parts of this person yes they see what they wanted in the way that he describes like has trouble like like making these two people be the same person in his mind the person in the photograph versus the person in front of him I also really like the the conceit of the story that it is a final letter, it's an explanation letter. Suggested at the very beginning in the way that it's written like one thing you need to know before you open the door, don't don't open the door because you're gonNA find your husband and your daughter Dead Yeah and it's one of those things I read that those two lines a couple of times. Yeah. I don't I don't I don't get it get it, and then when it closes with the same thing, you realize that. You Know Love Daddy Oh and there's the emojis which is also the title Skull Heart Skull is there something so every day there's something so innocent about those emojis and but it's becomes kind of her calling card. I make that that horrible story, the horrible real-life realize story, and then make it pathological Oh and I mean the fact that like she kind of you know protest but then she really is just Kinda like okay. jigs up like she's not anything innocent kind sweet. Childlike about no, she's PSYCHOPATHIC. Yeah. She's sociopathic. Yeah. No, she's PSYCHOPATHIC. She's all the Pathak. Yeah Yeah. Why I'm not a doctor I just play one on TV Pau. De Deeply disturbing greatly written. This is a fun story. Kuku by Liam Hogan. We amuses he him pronouns changeling with a twist. I thought this story was a great amount of fun. I loved that it had that great twist ending where the brother is just setting this all up and he has the vague memory. No, he's the one that was switched. Yeah. Although I have to agree with his father there's no way that you can remember that but he's not quite human I think is. The thing here Kerry well, who who, who makes that offer who's the one that approaches the family to be like leave out this to form kidding I'll leave. You do one who does that nobody does that that's weird. There's something supernatural going on and also awful let's completely awful but there's something a little bit supernatural going on there has to be right I. I do feel like there's something supernatural and I I love changing story. So I thought that was cool. Oh, here we are old. My other favorite story in the collection riddick twice lemonade by Paul Stansfield Paul uses he him pronouns great uncle and his book of pain This is this is this is in my top stories as well. Somehow, this author created a completely rare fascinating one of a or at least three of a kind book that I would not want in my possession. Like. We've talked about it before if we had the opportunity to own a book that was the happened to be bound in human skin, we probably would depends on the book it depends on the book but I mean like that is a thing. Humans, we do have a collector streak in us. You know what? I mean and it's like. People. We had like we would collect strange oddities and Curios. Yes. This is a step too far and it's like, yeah, the author said, what is the absolute? Just worst combination of things these books could be made out of to just make them as horrendously apprehensible as possible will and he's you know obviously, this is a this isn't a book. So it's four book people and it's like he saying kind of this challenge two-book people and there's a lot of moral dilemma around what do you do with this book and you know think the family actually handles it pretty well. There's a lot to unpack about the evil that men do. And how we torture and hurt one another and when it societally acceptable and when it's quote unquote not societally acceptable to do it. Aka Me just a ton of food for thought and ones it. Okay. To make money off of something. When is it not? When is something historically relevant and needs to be preserved when it's not something? That is a good thing. You know it just it opens up a lot of avenues and it explores the idea of you know you can have both opinions and neither opinions really wrong. Now, there's things very complicated. The IT opened up a lot of thought for me like that and in ways that I can't even fully articulate that I thought was really cool. Would you keep it sell it or burn it? I think I would do kind of how the family did I. Think. I WANNA keep somebody maybe late to pay off my car. You know maybe like some things like that. But for the most part I would want it to go towards good causes if I couldn't feel comfortable with the blood money profit of. I mean a little bit a little bit selfishly like I said loved down my carpet off. But you know for the most part I would think that it needs to go to good causes. What do you think I think what I would do is I would quote unquote loan it to to a museum. Forever. Like I wouldn't give it to them because I don't. Want anyone else to have control or ownership of it for free like you can keep it forever I know. But I also don't want to keep it. Got It in my house. Oh, I think I would say, Hey Smithsonian or whatever. You have this book on loan and just go ahead and hold onto it on I also interpreted the title lemonade as kind of a life gives you lemons you make lemonade. Sort of them. Next story Roger by Holly Nelson Holly Uses she her pronounce a sister narrates disturbed brother grows up and kills parents. Okay. Can You read that Synopsis Again For me? Roger sister narrates disturbed brother grows up kills parents. I did not get that. He killed their parents Oh. Yeah. He definitely did I'm not saying you're wrong right? I didn't. I. Didn't get that. He did. A second. Pretty. Sure. He did I. have to read that again I mean I remember there's that there's that part about. The the empty glass staring back at something I share it. Again. Not Not saying you're wrong I got more of it just like. Realizing that the family did this to him. Yeah okay, I'm a little bit of a Sucker for sibling stories as we've talked about my sister and has been on the show many times and there was something about the sibling ball and even though she knew Roger wasn't okay a that I found very. pulled. On My heartstrings a lot. But I, mean, the fact of the matter is is, when do you have to be like you've done unforgivable? Staff good story good story or anything. I'm just going to say as a side note, I actually did not get that the. That the narrator was female. At someplace talks about like her soccer team and the girls loaded into the van that I remember the soccer team but I don't so technically. We don't know that it is a sister and a brother that was just the the energy I picked up on. Yeah and see I definitely went the other direction I got kind of a a male energy I. Don't know if regarding the gender I think regardless it's a it's a sibling relationship certainly absolutely that makes it complicated and that line of forgiveness and second chances and compassion. Yeah. Up. Next we have walking on knives by Matthew Are Davis Map you uses he him pronouns a role. Couple accidentally Murder. Oh. Man. An accidental murder I guess I should say because only one person gets routed. Am I the only one between us, and maybe I'M NOT I. Who Thought of Phil and Claire? Family. Yeah look. Like. That is exactly no you know I mean, yeah. He he described her as having Red Hair I. don't care I pictured. Yes. Phil and Claire In this situation because it's almost like kind of a situation they would get themselves in. Yeah. Only much bloodier and more horrifying guys. I thought it was really cool like I against a short story it's okay if you kind of see where it's going. Like. I pretty much got the idea that. Yeah she. She killed her husband. And then to hear his side of the story and the the weird. The weird stuff that he ended up going through Elmich like like a part of me wanted to say, do just just turn around and be like, Hey, you know this crazy thing happened in like just like like just let it go and let. The other hand. I. Also understood what he was saying she will absolutely not believe me. Like. Oh, but I mean, he becomes like really like a rage monster and really gross and he's like the whole art. He does he does have a nasty neo attorney like him. But it's it's a cool way to structure story yesterday. Very cool up next, we have Christmas shopper Rudy Cronenberg Rudy uses he him pronouns. Manslaughter leads to a haunted. Alexa. Like device. Now, of course, the concede of this is, is it really haunted? Is this her guilty conscience? This is a psychological collection after all. Yup. But this woman as is kind of implied in this story is in a hell. In a hell in a health. Like last minute Christmas shopping is horrifying. Yes. I hate it I hate busy parking lots. I hate busy parking lot I like I. Don't want to go to any store. Starting about like mid November pretty much pretty much the day after Halloween when I'm out. I don't WanNa go to anything. There's very little things that we shop in person except for small because actually this year because we just we we are online shoppers for a lot of reasons everybody gets books and that's all anybody ever getting again for the rest of your life so that Yeah. I was of are really really well written compelling story. You know get some Edgar Allen Poe vibes going on. You've really is kind of a modern post story, their sixth guarantee nothing lake guilty conscience to road a human being and Device in which this unfurled you know kind of with this modern twist, very, very clever and her husband can go throw himself into a river too because ever like she's right like, hey okay. Yeah it's not my legally my faults. No but if he will die or get seriously injured, you must come for it must it will eat you alive absolutely it will each alive and even if it doesn't eat you alive because you just don't care it's still the right thing to do. Yes. Now he deserves it I just want to say clearly she. Deserved, she built around yeah last but certainly, certainly, not least another fantastic story in a great way to end the collection like Abigail Winchell by Christina. Deal. Yep Christina uses she her pronounce a suburban mom under pressure befriends a stick figure lady on the wall. Again I know I'm sound like a broken record and we talked a little bit with Rebecca about it this domestic. Suburban horror is rare. So much scary scary fodder can be found. This is a great story again about a woman written by a woman that is about that horror of conformity and the mundane and living your life for other people. Okay. It sounds like you're on the same page is I am is that the the most horrifying thing in this story was actually just the interrelationship of that Book Club Right Oh it's horrible like just the way they all treated each other. Was City at terrifying? Yeah. Use that word a lot today. I love the Title I. Love that. Show lover. She's a crazy stick figure way. Okay. I don't think she's really described as a stick figure, but the way I picture maybe we've done this before I think you and I should both draw our interpretation of Abigail. Doing. We're doing it absolutely. I Love Abigail I love her mean she's awful but she's this woman's subconscious. She's this woman's is or whatever her shadow self her like way to rebel and have the dark bad thoughts that she wants to have. But she's not allowed quote unquote to have brilliant story. There's there's. A lot of this is very much a story of at least I. Don't know if this is a real thing that happens but like. A short term schizophrenia if you will. The loss? The Paranoia of. No one loves you mean, no one understands you. But me no one is your friend and can be trusted. But me and this me is this other person that doesn't actually exist that it is you but but it's actually you actually just you. And what a great way to close out this collection with the story that is that is the the main character deciding not to follow through and like well, the brownies were normal. Of course, our normal is hurt anybody spider crawled on me and I just didn't move and let it do its thing. It's very Norman Bates mother at the end there wouldn't hurt a fly and just a great way to end the collection with ends very much as we talked about with Rebecca carrying on this story and others in that wonderful tradition of the yellow wallpaper just kind of this legacy. Everyone in this collection should be so proud of themselves. It is such a solid solid work and I think everyone should be themselves a favor and check this out. Great Great Job Rebecca and all of your authors. It is a really truly excellent collection. One of the strongest I've ever come across. And and just thank you so much in big applause. All right everybody I think that does it for now. Now you know we have posted are TB are and the High Holy Season is upon us think thank the Gods we've made it to October. So everybody thank you for joining us. Thank you again. Rebecca for sharing your wisdom and your humor. Thank you authors for your talent. Thank you Scott. Thank you Sandra and please keep reading pasture bedtime. Burn. Won't.

writer Scott Ni editor Sandra Rebecca Roland California Scotty Miller official Gore Barnes Canada Dr Blake technician Sweden Queen Catering Candar Sweetheart Kendra rebekah baseball
101 | Mystery | The Lamplighters by Emma Stonex  With Interview!

Genre Junkies | Book Reviews

1:09:01 hr | 3 weeks ago

101 | Mystery | The Lamplighters by Emma Stonex With Interview!

"Weirdo book worms unite. Do your reading tastes range from two pm scifi to middle grade fantasy dark psychological thrillers to gory body horror from why a paranormal swords and sorcery extraterrestrials murder beyond. Then we want to share our love of reading with you. Welcome home john junkies. this is sandra. This is scott. Welcome to a book episode. Thank you for being so kind and all of the nice things you guys had to say about our one hundred episode. That was a really cool thing to get to celebrate with. Everybody wish we could have had a big john junkies party altogether but it's a huge milestone. We're very proud of it and we're very proud of being here with you and back to our normal programming back to your scheduled programming so scott. I suppose we should share any roundtable items. We have. we've been really busy. The last three weeks But especially the last couple of weeks. I have to say the thing that i have been able to indulge in a little bit is getting caught back up again on the walking dead and i've actually been joining you a little bit on that too right. You probably joined me like every other time. I'm able to tune in. I think that's a good way to to ingest the walking dead personally. Have someone to explain what happened. The last three episodes watch an episode or two. Yeah so originally. Like i said on some of my other shows i. I've always been a huge diehard walking dead fan since the beginning to ups and downs and good her episodes and wurster episodes. And what have you and In season nine rate at the early partisan in the halfway point or whatever. When rick is gone i needed a break. I think it was the mid season hiatus than to. I could be wrong. Don't out me and rubber. But either way i needed a break because that was a lot to take in I was very like shook with an emotional center of the show. I in so many ways he was and then also you not long before. That is when i lost morgan. My favorite character to the other show and i know i was like i don't know i don't wanna watch the other show. Don't want to get into it and so it was just like my my love with my love affair with morgan kind of fizzled out and it was just hard and i just i just needed a break. So then the break became unintentionally long and i didn't mean to and i was kind of like am i breaking up with the walking dead. I not and i'm so confused at this point house to what's going on with spinoffs and movies and tv shows. I don't know. And i don't know where i'm going with it. Whatever direction it does. But i'm like. I need to finish this out. I need to finish this story line because it's coming to a close. Yeah and so. That's exactly what i did. And i'm so happy i did and i think i. I just needed that respite. I used to write a weekly column about the walking dead. Like i mean i was so hard core into this phantom and i still am but it was like i needed a little bit of a break and i'm greatly looking forward to enjoying the sh the show in i mean i guess i want to say syndication but like being able to revisit it and watch episodes and have it play in the background for me and maybe i will. Maybe i will find love in a hopeless place in one of the spin offs or something. But i'm just not quite counting on it. Yeah you know. What was the eleventh season at this point. I mean it's hard with a show that that's ten eleven who knows a whole bunch of seasons. You know it's kind of natural to even if it's not the fault of the show to fall off a little bit. Buffy the vampire slayer. I enjoyed the first three seasons and kind of fell off of it from there. I think yeah. I think it's natural to kind of take a break or even you know retire from a show before it's actually done. Yeah yeah it's i mean. Yeah i think we are in season eleven with. I'm so confused. i'm so confused. i'm just. I'm just doing the best. They can enjoying the ride. Join the here. And now with it. But i agree and i mean i did stick with buffy till the end i don't want a ric read it but for it wasn't the same show. It was for me. Same thing with my beloved x. files my favorite. Tv show. Ever you know. I didn't love it as much. Especially after molar laughed. It was hard for me to get into the doggett era. Then mulligans back then. We had the movies and which i enjoyed. But it's like it's hard you know it seems like shows you really loves. Sometimes they they take this extra curtis route and it makes it kind of like. It's a little exhausting. Well the other piece of news that we have this week is a very exciting for us. Oh my gosh we have. We have a new employee. He doesn't have a job yet. he still getting to know his personality l. Saturday no skill set. Yeah but we very a very suddenly suddenly but not suddenly. I mean we definitely had we. Okay well let me let me stop. Burying the leaders we rescued a chameleon we found a chameleon who is an older gentleman and he was surrendered by the people who had them for you know the first years of his life and he needed place crash and we have been researching chameleon talking about chameleons for. Yo i've always wanted a chameleons eight or nine years just like you guys know about me and snakes and frogs especially snakes always wanting one that was scott with chameleons ever since he was endorsed grade and he did a report on chameleons so so we had been doing a lot of research already. We kind of we. We really knew what we wanted. There was some things that we definitely had to make final decisions on in a very in a matter of days before we brought him home but yet we have. We have pascal quieting hanger while he's a while we're recording. He's listening in learning the ropes. He's absolutely gorgeous fully grown obviously because he's older veiled chameleon he looks like a mosaic art. He's just beautiful you know and he we. He hasn't actually been with this weekend. So we're all still really getting to know each other and he's adapting to his new home and you know he might not like us handling him. He might be okay with it. We don't know yet but you know we're just kind of enjoying each other's presence. We're just happy he's here. We're happy to have happy. We can give him a lovely rest of his life is golden years. You're going to be. He's going go out in a blaze of glory. Let's put it that way they're cool. They're really cool so on tonight's episode. We have something even cool maybe cooler. I don't know. would you call it a very special episode. aisher would so many in a row. Well you know at least two in a row. We are reviewing the book tonight. The lamp ladders and we got to interview the author herself. Emma stone ix and look forward to that interview because she is a delight all authors to light of course. Yeah of course we are people guys especially me. We have a ton in common. Yeah sandra sandra and she definitely had a very strong connection. And yeah we're just. She's a spooky spooky babe so cool so so cool so that was a huge honor and you guys are going to hear her talk. The interview spoiler free so feel free to listen to this boiler section and the interview and then if you need to take a break to read the book please do so. Let me tell you a little bit about this novel. The lamp lighters inspired by a haunting true story. It's new year's eve. Nineteen seventy two when a boat pulls up to the maiden rock lighthouse with relief for the keepers but no one greets them when the entrance door locked from the inside is battered down. Rescuers find an empty tower. A table is laid for meal not eaten. The principal keeper's weather log describes a storm raging round the tower but the skies have been clear all week and the clocks of all stopped at eight forty five two decades later. The wives who were left behind are visited by a writer who is determined to find the truth about the men's disappearance moving between the women's stories and the men's last week's together in the lighthouse long held secrets surface and truths twist into lies as we piece together. What happened why and who to believe. This is very interestingly written book. This is very interesting. Okay before you even get into that. There's some great people blurb ing this and some great blurbs in general ashley audrain who wrote the push that we review she blurb it She said transported me. Really haunting harrowing and heartbreaking. This is an awful that will stay with you. And i really like this quote i think. This is from the publisher. There are two kinds of people the ones who are creek in a dark lonely house in shut the windows because it must have been the wind and the ones who hear creek in the dark lonely house light a candle and go take a look high. Hot high yeah. You have our attention. I particularly like the word haunting used. This is a very haunting book. It's very hard to quantify. Exactly what genre i would put this in. I would say creepy mysterious mystery. Yeah yeah yeah. Those are some great words to describe it haunting mystery. This book is written in really unique point of view it jumps around between being like letters between being interviews first person like all the things and It's an interesting way to tell the story. This is i mean technically true crime. Because this was i mean or true weirdness. This mystery is unsolved thou originally. This happened you know in the turn of the last century and Emma took some creative licensing with moving the story to the seventy s and the ninety s. But this is a real mystery that is still not solved. Yeah so she uses that as agree and basis and jumping off point. This novel is so much about loss and grief specially loss and so much about the situations that happen to you in life where you don't get a clean resolution where you don't get the nice tidy ending you want or we all feel we're entitled to For me this was a solid solid page turner. Absolutely because i wanted to know. And i swept up in the romance of it. And i mean that in the true true use of the where in not like. They'll you know the romance. Don't like in the true romantic notion of this story. I like that word. There's a romanticism. To this novel. I have to point towards like you said is a it's a compilation of both Traditional first person storytelling as well as interviews letters. It almost feels like there's a like a case file laid out on a on a table and he just scoop it up and just start reading it in the way the piecing at a time. Yeah so i agree. This was absolutely a page turner for me but a little bit of a different style of page turn of and i normally put into that category. Okay when i started reading this book i started reading it a little bit more In pieces and for those of you who listen to our last episode. I am capable of reading a book. That way But i was having trouble with it like that It wasn't until i literally started the book over again when i had You know. I had an hour and a half to myself all right. I'm sitting down. And i am just going to get into this book that it grabbed me and i really understood the tone. The mood is a mood to this book. that's moody. yes and it and that mood is part of the experience of the book. And and that's why once i actually dedicated time to it. I i couldn't put it down. Because i didn't. I didn't want to lose that feeling. I didn't want to lose that. That experience and scott has he kind of just said this. But it's come up on the show before scott some times not always but sometimes has a struggle getting into books that are non traditional formats. I in it's eight. It's worked for me in the past with books where it hasn't worked for me the past with books and i'm glad to hear that this ended up working out for you. It was just like you need a kind of a reset but it kind of helps like talking to you about it. If you are like scott then you know. Oh okay. I can be prepared for that. Yeah this is not. If you're like me this is not a oh read for fifteen minutes on your break or read for twenty minutes before bed kind of book for someone like me and for for you readers out there who are like me. This is a this. Is your the book your reading and and you know sink into it. It's such a smart way to tell a mystery. It really really is. It's very smart. Way to tell mr it really is it has touches of true crime All lower dateline. Yes but with a with a creepy edge more than just terrifying one. Yeah so let's talk about kind of lighthouses in some of the vibe of of this book so we like lighthouses. I've talked about this in the interview to i've always had a little bit of a romantic notion toward lighthouses and a fascination. There's been some books that we've read. Were lighthouses were a part of it. And i'm thinking of the forest of hands and teeth series that zombie series million years ago. Yeah i loved that. I loved the idea for myself of spending this zombie apocalypse and a lighthouse on the beach on a coastal area. I really like that for me. Would love that journey for me But before that i i got into lighthouses with reading rainbow book and i think it was one that we read the school iberian read to us. Keep the lights burning abbie. It's an old book lake. We used to have like once a month. All the classes got to take turns going on a little field trip to the tiny school library and mrs ankle. The librarian hank was thinki- sorry. Sorry sorry pal. But she would read out loud and she was really good at reading. Very slowly singly. And showing the pictures very important very important. And i think that's where i read abby and then it was reading rainbow joint as well. There's also a song by a now. Defunct bluegrass cananea bluegrass band. Who we've gotten to see nickel creek and like when i was in like high school i think middle school and remember that album came out and they have a song on it called on the lighthouse. And it's like this story from the point of view of the lighthouse. Seeing this romance play out between the keeper and like the lady falls in love with and yeah i mean it's just their a thing lighthouses are and they're symbolically. They mean hope. There's a sadness to them. The kept people from dying. They had like a purpose. There's a lot of me those i did not. I think lighthouses are beautiful. But i didn't have a strong attachment towards lighthouses. And part of that is because i had not read that book as a child and part of that is also because it never occurred to me what it was like before automation in the first time i was really introduced to that. I mean besides pete's dragon. Oh yeah that's an early lados issue. Is the movie the lighthouse. But that is that. It's so tower and and dark and and and dirty in a way that it just seems so it seems so foreign and alien and like something that you know you ship off people to do who you know. You just can't exactly this book actually makes me really love lighthouses. Yeah for how for for how creepy and dark mysterious. This book is there is a to go back to a word. You use romanticism. Yes and there's a respected profession. That i had not experienced before in media. That really just makes me so impressed and respectful of the people who did that one hundred percent hundred percent. I so second that so first of all I love the lighthouse. One of the most brilliant homes have ever seen. I thought it was genius. I thought it was beautiful. Yeah there's a loneliness two lighthouses and this book is. This book is a mood. This book is especially the seventy stuff. This is time. This is a place of slice of life. A glimpse into this time it and you know kind of before probably very long before they started to get automated and it kinda makes you think of like trains and street lamp lighters and things like that. These kind of antiquated positions. That don't really exist anymore. I know those things all do exist. People work on them. But you know what i mean like. You're kind of seeing an end of an era. The closers romanticism to that. The closest thing that i can think of that still exists. Today are people who work on shipping on shipping boats. I i knew someone once who used to be a cook and he would be gone for months at a time. Yes same thing. People who work like in logging. Yes yeah yeah. That's that's the closest thing that i can think of. That still exists. That's like that. Do you think that you could work on a light. How are you kidding me. No no no. No i feel like i could. You'd be fine. it's air. You're basically a hermit. It's eight weeks every eight weeks before we saw has a very good slice of hermitage and him. The only problem for me. Though is i wouldn't some sort of internet and i would miss you. I mean yes. I would miss. You would miss in pascal know. Give me give me a pile of books and and some jobs to do around the white house. I would be happy. I think if he didn't have us. I mean yeah if i did it. Have you like if i didn't have you in our animal family and stuff. I don't know if somebody fritz. Though i to see my friends but i mean i think there's something about the romanticism of what would make me at least wanna try it like at least wants to try rate. I would love to visit late houses. And as i said it's a solid zombie planned for me but i yeah i jest who i. It's it's not the way. I would want to live my life. And it you see in this book the repercussions of this life style to there's a blowback there's a ripple effect and it goes through so many people in so many lives Living this way. And it's cool and metaxas about you know why they started putting three men and a lighthouse. There's i think with the pandemic. I think a lot of a scottish taste for isolation and a lot of us do not like the flavor offense and i'm not saying it's the same thing but people who are like. Oh my god. I can't i can't handle it. It's like well. You would not have been able to handle this sort of life. The thing that i will say Going into this book is that feeling of isolation is not actually the strongest the strongest emotion the strongest undercurrent of this book There is definitely themes of it. And i'll go into more detail on what i mean in the spoiler section but Don't shy away from this book if what we said about isolation and the idea of isolation maybe turns you off from the book at this year. It's a different isolation than you know right now but i think that maybe some of us can kind of relate but it's it's isolation in the same way that cottage core is isolated. You know when you fell reality of of cottage corps life like oh you mean i don't see anybody and i have to grow my own food and i can't go out to dinner. That doesn't sound very fun. But yeah but it is romanticized in a way that makes it seem very appealing. Yeah yeah yeah oh okay. That's that's a whole other subject really is One of the things that before we go to the split section before we go to the interview. that i really wanted to also is. There is really cool. Message in this book about learning to be alone in learning to be kind of okay being alone I think that is a huge huge important step in becoming a human. I really do and that was something. My dad taught me when i was a teenager. Is you have to learn. Should be alone and be comfortable with it to find comfort in your solitude in your thoughts and your reflection in enjoying your time alone and I've really come to value that. And you know. Of course you know. I love the people i love and i want to spend time with them but it is. I just think it's a huge part of being human. Is you have to learn that. They're they're still. There are certainly some people who feel like they are not fulfilled unless they are doing something and seeing someone every single day and there are there. Are those of us like you and i who very much treasure alone time and our private time and our off time you need to. You really need to so in regards to appeal. i'm gonna go with. I'm gonna go the broad appeal on this book. I think and i'm you know. I'm tempted to go even higher than that. I think. I think that this is a great book for anybody who loves mysteries. Who who loves literature. Yeah i don't know if it's the kind of book that's going to pick up people who aren't readers which is kind of what i'm thinking for mass at but but at the same time like i think anyone who is a reader will like this book. So i'm really torn between the two i hear you. I'm kind of like. I see it as kind of like a bridge between those two as well. We just broke down the categories. And now we're waffling on what they mean. No no no. No no not waffling and all. It's just to give a fair appeal silly. But i i am inclined to go towards mass I mean they. I think the argument could be made either way but I guess for just the sake of keeping it simple. I would say broad. Because i do think that people need to be someone of a reader you know because masses like we talked about. It's like that harry potter. Yeah one book every two years. Yeah yeah exactly. Want to read this and it's the literary equivalent of a bit of a slow burn. I think and i mean it's a page turner but it's a slow burn in the sense that she doesn't just dump everything reveals. Its secret slow. It's like a flower winning right. Like you get pedal you get a pedal you get these little parts of a whole and i think it is exciting. Like i said it's a page turner for me but it's it's an unfolding. I can't i. I could not agree more okay so i think we're ready for the interview. What do you think scott. I am so ready. Alright we are so humbled honored that we were able to get this interview with this amazing author. Such a lovely incredible incredible person and she lives in england. So this was you know. It's always a little bit of a feat schedule but we made it work and she made it work and i had a blast. Scott did too so. I hope you all enjoy our conversation with emma stone axe. Hey bookworm buddy. Don't forget subscribe rate and review. And while you're at it is on instagram at jonah junkies with us today author of the lamp lighters. Emma stone axe. Hello welcome thank you for having me all. Thank you for being here. This is so exciting for us where the uncultured colonials over here in california but get to talk to someone across the pond. So right off the bat. I i wanted to ask you What interested you in this story at this lighthouse. Both the true story and the story that you wanted to tell to create this book. Well the lamplight is based on the real life. Disappearance of three lighthouse keepers from the fan and isles in scotland. Nine thousand nine hundred. And soon as i read about this mystery. This is going back several years now. It just combined everything that i love. as reader. the atmosphere of the c- the atmosphere of the lighthouse. And of course the fact that the mystery itself is unsold one hundred and twenty years later. It really got my creative imagination going. And i knew that i wanted to reimagine it in an awful. That's so cool. I i i noticed in your thank. You's you shouted out aired main key so must yes must be fan as i am huge. Such a huge such a huge fan of anything like that and and i listened to his his His episode on the lighthouse at the smallest lighthouse. Which is off the coast of wales weather. Was this really horrendous. Episode of to keep her out on a tower light and one of whom died during the day and the other one was so terrified of being accused of foul play. He ended up keeping the coops with him for the whole of the rest of his spell of duty You can imagine was just so grim and he ended up having to put body out on the gallery rail and the wind removing the dead bodies. Say ships passing is man with waving and didn't think anything the matter really creepy stuff and actually since that. I know it's just finding it. Yeah and then since then they upgraded the cruise to three men on the lighthouse. Any one time and that was the reason why to avoid something like that happening again. Oh my god that's fascinating and you kind of touch on that story in the novel to a little bit. Yeah have you always had a fascination with lighthouses or is that now. You're kind of a lighthouse expert. Oh thank you very much. I've always had a fascination with lighthouses. But i think i think a lot of us have everyone that i've spoken to join the process of writing this book and then publishing it has some kind of connection emotional connection with lighthouses. I think something really special about standing on the headland and looking out to see. I don't know if you guys have lots of tower lights in the us. Are you familiar with tower light. We have we do have them. Not as many on the west coast feel east coast. But i mean we've definitely seen them. Yeah i mean. I think in the uk particularly off the southwest coast we have really treacherous reefs. The aw the needed needed lights built on them to avoid so many shipwrecks and this was going back hundreds of years when they sought the f. to build them. And there's something about standing. I was and then. Down in cornwall. A few years ago and you can just see about a minute and lighthouse called the long ships lighthouse but then beyond that fifteen miles away is the wolf rock. Which is the inspiration for my fictional maiden rockin in the lamp lighters. And that's all the wolf ron. Because of the howling sound the wind makes it tunnels through the rocks. And i just love that. It's just it really speak to me lighthouses. And i think they connect with people. That is like really beautiful. i. I'm the same i have a. I have a bit of a fascination with lighthouses. I love how. Say that about the west coast. And now everybody who's an enthusiast is gonna write in like sandra you know nothing about the west coast but that's fine. Just send all your hate mail to me But i've had a fascination with lighthouses since i was a little kid and i read the book by Think it's peter rupe. Keep the lights burning abbie. I don't if you did. You read out light. Like i know of it because other people told me about it but i haven't read it myself. I'll now yeah. It's like a reading rainbow production all And i remember getting the book and just there's something very romantic about them and and of course it's kind of obviously something we still have but it's so different than than how it used to be. That's right and i mean. I think i think we do have a slightly stahl jit romantic idea about lighthouses. Partly because they're all automated now so in the uk that they're all electric I think the last one to go with nine hundred ninety eight quite a long time ago. I this idea that they used to be lived on a now now. Their energy and so they have to slightly ghostly abandoned melancholy air as well which just adds to how captivating they all he have a ghostly. I think that's perfect. Perfect in the afterward of the book you mentioned a just a large number of source material that you read through. How did you go about researching Topic that you did not have necessarily knowledge about i had known on edge a tool of lighthouses other than loving them on. I knew nothing about them. I don't have any light housekeepers in my family. Much the shame of. That's i. I wish i did but i i was just so passionate about this subject and i think that's where where all writers start and i know the advices to write what you know but i also think if you can write what you're passionate about that that's the key and that meant that all research. I did for the landline is. It didn't feel like work. It didn't feel like research with the capital are just felt like something. I was desperate to about and read about what really interests me about light housekeeping the keepers themselves on the families of the keepers and what kind of mindset. It took to do that job. And what it was like for the people who were left behind on the shore. So the more i read these first person memoirs i read interviews with lighthouse keepers. That's when the the form of the story really clicked into place because they wanted the first person voices talos rather than me also as it were to tell a story that actually leads into my next question. Is you have a very creative way of telling the story that kind of flips between traditional storytelling methods interview letters. Wh where did that come from. And how did that develop. Well i wanted to get it from multiple perspectives. And mainly. Because i wanted the the coal mystery to remain intact. I wanted the so as face on it on unsolved real life mystery part of the euro. That is that it still is unsolved. And they're still aren't onces. So i was wary of telling something in a conventional chronological way that ended up with me going. This is the answer and asked yet right. I i wanted readers to get to the end and still have questions and the best way of me. Doing not thought was to tell it for multiple perspectives. So that the reader is of buffeted between different versions of events a little bit like being on the see almost at your swept in one direction on one characters recollections and then you'll buffeted in another direction thinking oh maybe then right about that and the nozzle is is very much about miscommunication misunderstanding. And and how the importance of listening and communicating. So that very early on. I decided that was how i wanted to tell it. And it also gives these contests at charles to relate a story in their own voice and there was an element of sensitivity to the original event. I wanted to keep so these were real men who presumably lost their lives back in one thousand nine hundred. Real foundries had to live without answers. So i didn't want to impose myself too heavily into that. I wanted to let these people relate themselves really beautiful and very sensitive and i think that's like when when true crime essentially i don't know how else to put this. True mystery really shines is kinda showcase. The people who you know were affected by the tragedy. Yeah and you know. I think you're going to be so careful when you re imagining a historical episode to to be sensitive and to relay it is typically as you can And i didn't want as one of the reasons why i distance myself from the place and time in which the real event happened. I mean i also just couldn't fathom scottish dialect ninety nine hundred. I didn't trust myself to get that in any way. Shape or form rife. But that's one of the reasons. I moved it to nine hundred seventy s and down to cold will. Because i feel. I don't want to attempt to retell the specific madden and put thoughts in their heads and words in that now because i felt a little bit disrespectful one of the really cool things that i learned educationally from your novelty was this concept. I never thought of that light keepers there basically in quote unquote the service. It's kind of like how people talk about the military and you know that there's like these little different branches of being a light keeper and there's kind of this honor to it and i thought that was really cool. Yeah i mean it. It's one of is a bit like being in the army. I suppose and the families and the keepers would be given provisional accommodation so they'd be sent to alight and they would be given somewhere to live and once you were in you were in. It was a tremendous security for life. You in and it was a very reliable climbed to the top so you would enter as supernumerary keith. you would be promoted to an assistant. Keep and then you would become a principal keeper and that was based on purely on the hours and the time that you pretend so. It was a very sort of honest promotion based career trajectory which people appreciated But yeah i mean it was. It's definitely a family. I think the lighthouse service and therefore it had Slight secretive feeling around it. Very you have very fascinating. I have a question. I'm sorry you're probably so sick of people asking us but have you seen the lighthouse by. What did you think of the phil g no. I'm not sick of it. Because i love. I love talking about things that they would lighthouses. I'm afraid i have not seen it. And the reason that is. I've been too afraid to. I feel like i can watch it now. But when i was writing this novel i was. You know like when you're doing something creative and you feel like you have almost created dibs on it and then someone else says something about a similar topic and you've been reading your diary who go into your head and using and of course the lighthouse is completely different to my bur can set in may not stink and it said longtime ago it's in black and white and i think it looks and sounds right on my street so i make it my business to what they sweet. That's so exciting. I feel oh my gosh. I feel weirdly honored that i asked the question and got to have that on there expected. Follow up from us because know what you thought. Well we'll just we'll just hit start at the same time we'll watch together. It's either no. I i have seen it I it's a polarizing film. I absolutely adore it. I absolutely adore it. Scott was a little w t.f. But i know people who've been wtn. And i know people who've been like oh my god it's amazing and i have to say i love like because it's shot in a small frame. Isn't it make you feel claustrophobic. I love the ear of accelerating madness in a confined space. I think it looks really awfully shots. I think i'm gonna love it. Oh my gosh you are so our type of person. I mean that's like that's like music to my ears. I love that too. I love i love anything. That's like paranoia. That's like you know kind of conspiratorial. Feeling definitely. I know. I was looking at your website. Actually when we made a date to this and i yes where in the same boat. My people faithful my. Gosh the very flattered that you thank you for looking at our website. Appreciate that so emma. I was wondering. I understand that you have written many novel novels under a pseudonym. What was it about lamp lighters. That made you decide to publish it under your own name. And i started books about ten years ago. Unbelievably and i've written under three different pen. Nines When i first met my in two thousand ten and she agreed to represent me for one of my books. I said to her at the time. I have a book about lighthouse. So i really want to write. I have the idea. i just don't know how to get into it out a hand on the research yet. I didn't know how to present it. So i knew i wanted to keep my name that i said to her. I want to students other ones. But the the idea for the lighthouse for the lamp. Lighters never left me. It was always a shining light. My shoulder through autophagy. As i always knew it was the one i wanted to attach my real name too because it's my heart and soul that who i am as a writer whereas the also books i've written have been a very proud of him but they always emotional. This is it's very much may through in three so always had to be my ninth of this. That's cool. I can't believe how long this has been rolling around in. Your brain has been a long time and it's funny because i really don't think i could written it before. I don't think i would have had the confidence. I wouldn't have known as much like just wouldn't have had the time to read the i've had but i also i think i needed to exercise my writing muscle and to gain the confidence and i dropped the lamp lighters. Oh my goodness oh ten. Eleven twelve times mold. Probably i mean it really. Put me through the mill. And i think if i hadn't had the experience i've gone to know that it's it's okay to draft a book that many times. It's okay to completely freak out about what you're doing things that is complete rubbish and then pick yourself up and carry on because this is this. What is writing a novel. And you'd think that ten bucks in i would have got it down pat. I haven't because every its own beast in presents. Its own problems. So i think that really helped me with the landlines and i was very grateful to lean on that experience. I've had with my other books. So this is a very personal project for you. What has it been like putting it out there in the world and being you know releasing it to everyone else and being done with it. Oh it's been really marvelous. Actually launching can lockdown has been strange for many ova round but actually when the book came out in the uk none three weeks ago. It really felt celebrate really felt great and was and we had some brilliant reviews and i just felt fantastic and actually i feel like i've come out. I feel like this is such as i do. It's me yeah last year and i. It's a more vulnerable. Feeling than i've had in the past because with my books as i say they was that distance. So you and you hiding behind a name. That wasn't yours as well so there was. There was a bit of protection in that whereas with the lump leija's it's a much more vulnerable feeling but then with that comes a greater sense of worth in a greater sense of value. It's lovely to have out there now off to such a long time and i say glad with the warm reception answer fall oh cool. That's great to hear that is really good to hear. We're so happy for you. Thank you and it's so exciting that it's out in the states as well. I mean it's such. It's weird because the light is to me is a really kind of british book. Is these conventionally lighthouse papers on a tower and there's also british references and i iran the my wonderful american copy editor. Had all these questions about tv. Shows i reference and foodstuffs you a and it was just. It's amazing that it's been in picked up internationally. Sold into lots of translations. And i just think again i think that comes back to the lighthouse fascination. I think that we will have that connection and we just we get it with lighthouses that They speak to us a pass away. No matter who we all where we are absolutely and i it. There's very much feeling of you know kind of being in another time and place in someone else's shoes and i think a lot of readers love that and love learning about you know lake. These quiz shows you talk about. I'm like i don't know what that is. But i can google it. You know it's it's good. It's good some of them. I didn't know. Because i i was born to eighteen seventy s. I'm like oh and there were a couple of things where i reference the copy. Editors that just fantastic. I love how precise they are. And of course they have to be but and she was saying she. The first episode of this was add a week before you're saying it was wasn't oldest wonderful information but yes i mean i had to feel my way into that as well. Oh that's so funny. That is incredibly precise Because people will not. I know and it's amazing when as an also when these things come out of your head and somebody's treating it with such care and attention and going through it with such a fine tooth comb. It's it's really wonderful. Yeah wonderful experience. So speaking of have you always been a writer. Did you write as a kid. And and if so what was the first story you ever wrote. Oh whoa great question yes. I have always risen. And i mean all of this scene to say i've only ever wanted to be writer but that's just because true. Have you ever wanted to be a writer. And it's all any good crack. And yes when i was right from day dot i remember scripting notebooks. And you do not think Right on pieces of paper and then staple in together and maybe joining a barcode on the back. You'll like this. Sandra the first the first story i wrote with called the nightmare house and at a picture on the front of a big big house looking for boating and ghouls going around the things i mean. That was about seven eight. Yeah i mean it's it's terrible but no it's her but i think that's actually quite telling because the books i've written in the past have been very mainstream commercial fiction without really a doc hedge but certainly the dog had just where where i find. The most thrills interests right. So i've been able to explore that fully with the land lighter so in a way it's like coming back to the night mouse. That's what i was gonna say. Exactly you're kind of returning to your roots because this book has a. It has a spooky nece to it. It has a spooky mystery you know. That's that's definitely at its core. I mean i have to know. Are we going to get more spooky books from you more mysteries. Yes so the unsolved mystery is where my heart's at this reimagining an episode. I find fascinating and about which perhaps aunt concrete answers because it just invites the imagination right in such a brilliant way and about the isles vanishing the three key vanished in nineteen hundred visitors to the island claim to the scene also to supernatural things. Three large birds cling the tower lights in the sky above above the night house. We'd little details like that. Just make you think watch if you know what if something else was at play and i definitely wanted to bring that into the landlines and give enough oxygen to to keep the reader's imagination going. Oh yes anytime. I can have the logical answer or a supernatural and i shall choose supernatural. It's way more fun exactly. That's kind of what the wives talk about a little bit in the ninth because jenny. Bill's wife is more open to the super. Not fool side of life whereas helen his wife is more pragmatic and more rooted in the us isn't cheap but but they talk about you. Know what do i decide on the prosaic version of the truth. Do i decide that. It's it's see washed away. Or do i think what if something else was going on. And i didn't want to fall too heavily on one side or the other So i i try to inject the novel with that feeling of eeriness throughout. I think you nailed it. I really do one thing. We always like to ask is. Do you have some some books. I know you've been busy but some books that you would like to recommend to our listeners. Some books that you love or something. You've read lately that you love. Oh i've got to say one of the best books i've read lately which you may have heard of. Is a book called the last house on. Needless street by joan award. I think you would absolutely love it. It's a it's a masterclass in the in the kind of horror that is so the rely so much on the readers private fears so it's not. It's very softly very done. It's absolutely wonderful and that came out in the uk last week. I think it's coming out in the us in autumn. But that's definitely worth looking out. Oh my god. i'm. I'm like adding it to cart john. I i'd love to know what you think. I love it gothic masterpiece. Yeah yeah yeah. Yeah we like that we do. Oh my gosh i. It's so funny. 'cause we're not far apart in age but you're the exact same age as my sister. So is this very much like feel like. I'm talking to my sister right now. I think she has similar tastes to you. You know she's been on this show a few times with us. She loves fantasy as she can go dark she loves she loves sifi but she's kind of she's kind of a scaredy cat with horror. Push your little the horror. Such a broad term isn't it because it's like is when i watch horror i think i mean i i take mine. Gory horror like i enjoy for. Its own reasons but will i. Love is the spooky psychological. What's in the shadow is ralph's than somebody wielding. A weapon wasn't a shot as it's really interesting absolutely in the possibilities are endless. Then yes exactly exactly. We have a horror night. Oh my god but stopped yet. Don't tease we'll do it. You'll get a plane over when you allow enough. Find your my does. That was the popcorn. Yeah we'll bring you. Some american treats well. Halloween is my favorite time of year. And i know that you guys in the states celebrate halloween in a big way and we only do overhead but not quite in the same way is my favorite festival. I just know. Oh i was so glad we yeah. We love halloween and before covid. We like to throw big halloween parties but hopefully will see how things shape up this year. They might be back. And i have some halloween tattoos as well. Yeah nice. what kind of tattoos. Oh my gosh i have. I had a law. But i've linked to leave my legs. My back like everything. But i have a have a jack lantern. I have a little cutesy doll. That looks like a little black cat with a little witch broom. i haven't tombstone. I have tons of bats spider webs. Which aren't necessarily just halloween. But you need a lighthouse. Now i do need a lighthouse now. I do spanish lighthouse. I need the need the maiden yes one hundred percent. I fully endorse that decision. Got sick. I wanna lighthouse. Well thank you so much for joining us today and spending time with us and talking about your book. We're can our listeners. Find you and follow you. So i'm on twitter. And i'd love to hear from from Apt style necks. Ama- irony On yeah i'd love to be in touch I'm in the process of building a website. But it's not ready yet. Websites are never ready. They're just released. Thank you so much for having me. It's been such a joy to talk to you and thank you so much for your pool of lamplight as as well. I really appreciate it. Hey bookworm buddy. Don't forget subscribe rate and review. And while you're at it. Find us on instagram at john region. I'll come to the spoiler section roco. Let's talk about the book in a more unguarded fashioned. Did you wanna start. Yeah i wanna talk about what. I what i referenced. To in the non spoiler section in regards to the The feelings of isolation. Yeah what. I something that. I didn't really. I didn't really like like put together in my mind until i had finished the book and looked back on. It is that the isolation wasn't really focused around the the men who were lighthouse keepers. Yes the people who were having these feelings of isolation were their wives back on the mainland and that was a really interesting. Take any change to to what you would normally expect in a book that features lighthouse. Kiefer's really right. no. I totally agree and We've get glimpses of what it's like for their kids you know and just kind of how this affects the relationship in the family dynamic And how you know. It's one of those things that sounded so good on paper for these wives. You know for their husbands to join up into this service but is very complicated. It's complicated because you know in particular these three women. They did not have the same ties or desires amongst. Like you know the other women in the in this town that that at least one thing i find interesting is probably none of those women really wanted to do all of that stuff that they were kind of like societally expected to do yes fight it was but when you have these three men on the lighthouse they have their own sort of come rotary almost their own kind of language and sense of family respect where the people that they've left at home their wives and their children. They don't have that same thing and so there's a there's a feeling of being all alone and being left alone for all of this time and made even worse by the fact that this person who they've chosen to spend their life with there is zero communication the only thing that they that they see of them is they can look off into the distance and they see the light of the lighthouse which almost makes it worse bright and because of where their station you like live in like this little like founded area basically. And there's you know there's kind of like you can right. It's kind of weird to right and it's kind of unreliable You know to kinda send letters that way. So yeah. And i mean there's no social cell tower on there and this was the seventies and i think it was really smart to of emma to modernize this just enough but this is could still be hard in so many different ways but especially in the seventies were there was just such an expectation an attitude from women and from husbands and wives and i mean all of that stuff. You know. it's like that's maybe what people saw on the surface but everybody of course has issues and things going on underneath the surface and those issues lead into the other thing that i really liked about this book. And and there's all of the mystery and you're trying to figure out what's going on and ray or waiting for that shoe to drop but at the end of the day it's really a character study right of these six people. Yeah and you learn things about someone through through you know. Their partners is or their friends is and you learn so much about them. And then you hear from their own mind or from their letters or from their interviews. That they're vietnam shandor reception of the relationship and the existence totally different different. Nothing is more evident than that. Than the fact i mean with helen and the quote unquote affair. Yeah you know. The he said she said of that is to vastly different interpretations and That's rough that's really rough end. Nobody really wins in that situation. By the way. I can see you taking up sushil curving i in fact i kind of wanted to look into what that was all about to be honest with you. I think i think that is something i might. You know. put my hand in a little bit and learn a little bit more about. I can see it. I can totally see it. Even even their relationships Arthur and helen. The two of them is so tragic because the two of them love each other so strongly right and they have so many fond memories of each of each other and they're so happy with how they met and how they created this life but both of them don't see the other person. Helen feels like arthur doesn't love her anymore. Because you know he hasn't even touched her. Meanwhile arthur's over here just absolutely head over heels thinking about how you know. He wishes he could ride home on the bow of a boat and jump in and swim towards her and and you know sweeper up into his arms like he's a hopeless romantic at the same time. It's like that he can't communicate exactly and it's so sad to see this relationship like that. Yeah it kinda roads and then they have this tragedy of you know losing their son. And i don't know what the statistics exactly. But that's something that really breaks up. Marriages and relationships is the loss of a child. And i mean even more. So we have this old school guy in the seventies. And he's got that you know. British stiff upper lip don't show emotions and so then it's like you know you have these. Two people who've kind of their marriage is kind of a road and then you have bill. Hugh has so many issues from his childhood and his life and you know in his in his wife she's got all these struggles of trying to keep everything together at home and manage the unimaginable stress of having all those kids by yourself most of the time. And then you have then sue how troubled life and he's trying to turn things around and then he becomes like the scapegoat for the thing and then you have his relationship with michelle and they're kind of like really like a new love super super in love with each other and they're not kind of going through the traditional motions of a new relationship there's just so much nuance in into every character. And they're they're very layered complicated and very realistic people. even bill. Who at the end of the day is probably the least likable decisions and choices in the book He has a real strong oedipus complex which his father kind of put in him by. You know what they did. Yeah but even you understand. And you you empathize see him. Yeah yeah. I see what. You'd feel that way i see where you're coming from And then there is of course She has these greek kind of conclusions. That one can draw from what happened But it's still a mystery. It's a bit of a mystery. But i do i appreciate that. She decided to put to put her spin on what happened in their right and i liked it. I liked that. Yeah i i appreciate it. And i appreciated that while the characters who were still alive they were not privy to the knowledge that we as readers. I appreciate like there's two there's two different ways to write an ending like this right you can have. You can have the ending where you know where when the may when when the when the characters who are live at the end of the book you know at the conclusion if they don't really have an answer then you're left wondering as well which we read a lot of books like that and sandra loves a good dose of ambiguity i on the other hand imperfectly. Happy with being very sad for for the characters to not have resolution. And and i do feel that but at least i have some said i. At least i got some answer. No and not only. Did i appreciate like what she did. I appreciate it how she did. I appreciated the story. She told to wrap up that mystery. I think it was a good story. much more satisfying than. Oh vince is a criminal and he got criminal on everybody. It's like oh come on. No i do like that. That her theory at the very beginning of the book that i mean the wind could have just slammed the door closed and knocked. the lockdown ended up being held. A door locked. You could see that happening absolutely. That'd be bad that'd be real bad. Been the only bad thing that he ever did in this whole story after all of a sudden done was steal chocolate exactly. Yeah being the scapegoat. Like i said you know in the woman who loved him so much. She has to live with that. Being his legacy. Is that people relate. You know some people. Just don't change is criminal is bad dude so messed up and it turns out that trident was absolutely right to hire him because he would have been excellent. Pk in your sad lake. There's so much of loss in this book. Like i said in so many different kinds of loss and her loss resonated with me a lot. Because she's in this. You know kind of groggy marriage to this kind of loser guy. She likes her kids. Which is really cool. But i mean you can see what their life would have been and they probably would have had a really good. Pk and life relationship. I pay anybody. Could i think it could be them. I think that she would have liked that kind of. I remember when traditional but also like i think she would have liked being a little bit the the organizer of the activities. There's kind of a responsibility that comes from being the pk's wife for better or for worse. But i think that she would have embraced. That there is a certain. There's a certain power she was. There's a certain strength that she felt like she was looking forward to that. She was building towards. That was stalled when all of this happened. Yeah and there's like. I said everybody's got this nice complicated journey. And i like everybody's journey and story but hers and vinci's was really the one that made me like the most emotionally invested. I guess it may be the most invested in it. Also when it comes down to it was for vince. The the saddest thing in regards to you know why they ended up going with three keepers and lighthouse and at the end of the day. It was just the two that caused all the problems and the third one was for all intents and purposes an innocent bystander. right. And i'm i'm glad his his death was relatively clean. He kind of just died in a haze of confusion. Yeah he was really sick for a couple of days yet. No i mean like. He wasn't viciously murdered. I mean arthur's body kinda did not get a lot of dignity from From bill their pills pills spill he was a nut And arthur was a bit of a nut. You know the whole thing with the storm and the germans. What's going on there. Oh yeah i. I didn't think you're. I think that arthur i shouldn't say arthur bills nut arthur. Still rational nutley. You can still rationalize how bill got to that point not without sympathy like we said but arthur. I think just nine had a breakdown. I think he really did ready for retirement. He he got to that point where with his son with his wife with his life in service and so much time alone and even though he did like the alone time You know maybe there's some sort of regret looking back on your life that he just had a little bit of a disconnect with reality for firm and a he had a breakdown all right. We've got a score this book. This book took me by surprise because of the rough start that i had with it. You know at first. I was i was concerned and so my score does come from a little bit of a area of surprise This is five foghorns out of five. I think that this book is brilliantly. Written it is clearly written with so much love and passion for the subject. The characters are rich detailed human individuals. That i i th i think about and fell in love with and cared deeply for. I think that's awesome. I'm going to give her. I'm gonna give the maiden four fug horns five was fogbound god those but i like the sound of it Beautiful beautifully written book wonderfully told story by an intelligent who super cool. And i can't wait to read more of her staff So so happy for this journey. She spent on with this story. And i love what she stands for in her mysteries and i am so excited to be reader of hers. Okay everybody thank you scott. Thank you sandra. Got two things for you first of all. Please keep reading pasture bedtime. and lastly. It's bad luck tequila seabird

scott emma stone turner john junkies john junkies party wurster sandra sandra ashley audrain morgan abbie sandra west coast feel east coast southwest coast peter rupe pascal west coast uk rick