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What To Do After You Lose It All (And An Honest Conversation About Steroids) w/ Ryan Niddel
It had to be the truth in everything. Not just not just in like, the quiet dark recesses of our home where I'm confiding in Lindsay where I'm just telling the truth there. I have to adopt. This mindset that even when it's uncomfortable half tell the truth everyone. So how I'm doing the one thing with Lindsey of telling the truth is how I have to do it with every it takes one free person create change this this show for them. We are the creators of the free world. This is capitalism dot com. We on the one percent. A few months ago. I was browsing the top I tunes podcasts in the world. And number one was Malcolm glad well number two was Joe Rogan number three was Ryan Neidl number four was revisionist. His wait a second. Who the heck is Ryan idell? Well, if you were anyone else, you might not care or be surprised by this. But Ryan idol was an old buddy of mine that I grew up with kind of when we were cutting our teeth in this world of entrepreneurship back in Akron, Ohio and back then Ryan's life was not put together Ryan was up to no good. We might say hanging out with the wrong crowd in Ryan was not the person that he is today. So my perception of Ryan when I see that he had the number three podcasts in the world was kind of like you might. Expect. If you're screw up buddy who was betting on sports games. All of a sudden became a millionaire in business now. That's not Ryan story. It's just an analogy. But it was kind of like what my experience was. So I called up Ryan and was like I need to hear about your transformation. Because if you look at his life on social media today, he's married and has a beautiful family. He is a thriving business with a huge audience. He is in tremendous health. But that was not the case three years ago. And it was even worse when I knew him growing up in Akron, Ohio. He talks a lot about that about being in the gutter if you will several years ago about being caught in multiple relationships. Now, I have friends who have multiple relationships with their honest about it that was not the life. Ryan was living. He was on steroids. He was not healthy he was broke. And so we talk all about that. But we talk about this transformation of having nothing of losing it all. Of being found out to building a life. That is really the envy of a lot of his peer group. Now. Now, the original title for this episode was an honest conversation about steroids because the social media posts that inspired me to win vite Ryan onto the one percent was where he opened up about steroid use. And I wanted to talk about that. Because I have friends who take steroids and things the greatest thing in the world, and I have other peers who say that it is incredibly damaging to long term health. And I wanted to hear the perspective of someone who was on it as an abuser and somebody who no longer takes them, but has kind of a well rounded view of them. So it's a topic that I find interesting just selfishly, but we spent most of the conversation talking about Ryan's turnaround. And this is really the perfect episode. If any of you feel like you are rebuilding your life, or you know, somebody who is going through a transformation or. We address the issue of who's ready to combust who is about to lose it. All spoiler alert. It's the person who is building their house on sand. The person who is building on lies. And so I ask Ryan who's lying unconsciously because of that was him. So this is a story of turnaround. And it's a story of some controversial topics and is going to be entertaining. Either way. Enjoy this chat with Ryan. Welcome to the one percents excited to hang out with you. But man, it's truly an honor to be this is such a wild ride. We're on it is a wild ride. And I want to give you my perspective here ride. And I'm forgive me for if I'm being hard on you publicly. But when we last spoke literally the last time, we spoke besides if you face what messages, your your life was like kind of in shambles you are. I don't know if you were restarting. But I mean like you were hiding a lot for sure you're not on the path that you're on. Now, you didn't have a following. And then all of a sudden, I'm scrolling the itunes feed one day, and it's like Joe Rogan Malcolm glide, well, Ryan idell revisionists, dramatic, wait. What what in the world is like my buddy from Ohio who doesn't have his life together. And all of a sudden it was like, oh my goodness. He's a different person than he was when he grew up. So yeah, how is the Ryan today different than three years ago? Amend? Ryan. It's night, damn unrecognizable man that I once was a man that you would have known I came into I have known each other from Josh way back in the drunk response world, an acronym the hosting world and all that stuff. But then I believe last time you spoke of I remember, it was you had that Amazon based Southern Company share strength. Yeah. Yeah. And just were killing and looking for people to help it that message out in the brand out. And when I came to humble, like, look, I had created some level of wealth or success or the aura of this at the hosting auto from market Vinnie. And I wandered everything. I had you know, from lying and cheating and manipulating in multiple girlfriends and paying for cars and trips and bottle service and name something, you know, here. I'd had this opportunity to align myself with people that would have helped catapult me to the next evolution of life. But I was too young dumb and headstrong to realize the greatness house in front of it. So I thought I could do everything myself. And is the wall sort of imploding, crashing down. And I'm left with you know, a truck getting repossessed and no money in the Bank and being caught cheating, and all these things, you're literally just barely extending your hand just enough sailing. But he like, here's you know, we got a little spot you might be able to help us out with super passively. And that was the last time. I remember you, and I really catching up was back then and it was even then you're like supremely focused locked in just growing that thing to no end. And it was really almost like I was having to beg or borrow time from which I completely get from where I sit it not an attack at any acid. Just like, you know to get you on the phone. You were growing it. What was an eight figure business, right? Yeah. That takes a certain level of dedication in focus that most people aren't familiar with. And all you're doing was exhibiting that I could see that from where I sit now for the moment on my shit. Even Ryan Maranhao our buddy from up and accurate. He doesn't even have time for. Which just went into this vortex of negative, emotions and self deprecation. All these things that you know, really have limited Mike rose from far back as I can remember up until three years ago. Really that Ryan your life is totally different. Now. I mean, we've been on a touch since that time and you've built a following. That is huge. You've you have completely turned your life around your life is completely transparent in public. You're married if it beautiful family, what the hell happened to you. I would love to say was I woke up and realized that I was going to be a better person. But that just be a lie. And that's that's really the start of this whole journey is just to stop line like stop lying to myself. Stop lying. Everybody else. Just fight through some of that pain in some of those tough conversations. I'd ran from so many years. And so what happened was my wife now Lindsey gotten just started dating gosh, July. August doesn't even matter the date time really but three to four months into a relationship. She spent the night of my house a wake up Saturday morning. She needs a Cup of coffee. I have never had a liking the coffee has never been my thing. Never cared to try really. So I hop in my car, go to the local to importance grabber couple, become home. I'm fooling into my neighborhood and seen my house just down the road. I see my now ex girlfriend's car parked in my driveway the same car that I paid for for her. Oh, boy, my stomach sinks, man. What is was? It was gonna turn out to be so slow. L E Cree pass. And I don't notice the front door open. There's not too outside yelling. So I can talk this story my mind, the maybe she's just like walking around the house because she thinks I'm out of town the ex girlfriend now who at that given moment Ryan was fully convinced that I was her one and only and windy the same. My wife wanted only they never met each other before. And he here what ends up happening is. I'm driving around the corner man may get away with is still and I don't get away with it. Lindsey calls me and says, hey, you need to come here. So and so's at the house, we need to have a conversation in that moment, I had a gated courtyard in my house opened the gate in the extra for now. Runs to me. It's pretty verbal and aggressive like physical. I'd put her through a number of things over three years together. All rightfully so. You know, I'm not I don't take this platforms who certainly degrade what somebody else's raw emotions were in that moment. She was acting out of passion and pain things that were driving her in that moment, but on the other side of this who's sitting the steps to my front door. Just look at me in disbelief like almost like this was. A low light rail playing out I can't go on to highlight reel because I would of course, not be true. But you know, here's a situation playing out. My just knew in that moment, and she's not freaking out. She's not crying. She's not yelling. I'm gonna go over and talk to her. And so eventually ex left and have a few our spend with Lindsay, then she left the house, and I thought okay for the first time in longer than I can remember I just felt white again. I wasn't having to light anybody all the stories were out the open at seventy free. And so as this truth, what abode sets me free. I'm still a slow learner and Lindsey comes back to my house oddly enough. She calls me eight or nine o'clock at night that same name says, look, I don't know why I wanna come back. But I have some more answers, I need from you you care if I stop back over sure she came over, and we continue to progress relationship with Mattie. She never fully walked out on. She kept instilling me that I was capable of doing more in being. But this path I had been on these lies news stories of, you know, things for my upbringing of my mother told me at fourteen. Now based on my own that I could raise myself now or needed to raise myself that she's been the past fourteen years raising me, and she'd had enough, you know, my father walking out chasing a career versus pouring into me cheering love and affection with me and some of the physical interactions between him, and I and some mental. Gosh. Just also say debauchery that he put me through those were all I can see. Now, we're limiting the way that I was able to communicate and exists as a as adult, man. And so these aren't necessarily justifications or reasons just things that were present that I never spent the time to focus on and so Lindsey starting to open up this Pandora's box of all these old emotions that stuff and certain solar Bill in the back, and neither one of us were of course, really equipped with how to navigate those waters. Really? It was just these things were coming out. But again as I made mention I'm still slow learner. So I had this really twisted view in my head that I could somehow still be friends with my ex because she had a few children that I had become obviously friendly with in three or time period that the people I care about. And I thought I could kind of tiptoe and tap dance and make all this work the right way, and I couldn't. So by November Lyndon, I'm moving in the same house together, if she had just went through divorce on the backside voice she was looking for. Place to live. This is making sense. There's something different with you than anybody else at least for the time being moving together. So really pretty quickly about six months nor relationship, but in that second night in our house, come home. It's a definite Ryan, I had a merchant processing like an ice. Oh business that I'd start off for the really high risk base. Really the crazy stuff the wild west off. And we're just convinced that I had this math figured out oddly enough. Go figure I didn't at that point have figured out at all and ended up just the company basically capsized I didn't have enough money in reserve to offset chargebacks refunds, and we go down that rabbit hole another time. But I'm coming home knowing that I'm shut down this business knowing that the funds, and I had saved up from my previously excessive were pretty much depleted vulne driveways, a cold, especially in Ohio, you know, colds November's day dark out at like, five o'clock or truck in the driveway hop out walking when she's sitting on the couch by yourself just deadpan looking one of her friends had seen me with this now ex girlfriend walking around the mall just past weekend and had called her to tell her and she looked at me and says look. This is it this not automate him. This isn't something we can't figure out. But this acid stop what what's the store, you've concocted this to why you're still having communication and communication was just like I might have been walking with her at the mall. But there wasn't intimacy. There wasn't that feeling wasn't. There was more trying to stable the water stabilize the water. So in my mind, I could ever friendship to need one. My mind admits myself I did. And so that was the start of the new Ryan was back in, and I was pretty close to the same time that you were, you know, really diving deep into sheer strength. And so, you know, I'm I'm starting to recalibrate put together those pieces starting to establish the new operating system, which I'm gonna live my life by and it's a painful process like I remember all the way until February March that next year still having thoughts in just things cross my mind of my ex the one that was before Lindsey like what she doing is a good move. Should I go back and choose much older than I was when she was twenty years my senior Ryan. So of course, I can probably even older maybe twenty three twenty four years when I see. Like, I can see now from where I sit than I had this really. Strange mother complex if you will. And it wasn't that. I could see that in the moment, we her night shared our time together. I think she's for who she is. And what she was able to provide me in the growth of my relationship. She's a wonderful person who sins been remarried my truck, she's doing incredibly, well, but it wasn't like this door. Just swung open. And I saw this new opportunity. It's been consistent work in progress. Okay. So let's go there because you what you're basically outlining is you got caught red-handed. And you you had also you basically you had a country song played out where you lost your money. You lost your you'll lost all of the surface level stuff that you had based your ego is attached to multiple relationships money status the truck. And so now, you're basically starting over if we fast forward three years or life is completely different. But it's not as though the door. Swung open. Like you said. And you got an life. You had to go build that sucker. So what what habits did you start focusing on to then build the successful business? You're much healthier now from what I understand. And we're definitely going to go there, and you have an amazing family. You live a completely different life than you did three years ago, and it started when you stopped lying. He said, so I I want to address how is your life different now. And then I have some other clarifying questions for you. Of course. My my life's different now Ryan where I myself years that I was night out that I couldn't get up in the morning that Jim happened after work. And I was the guy that was NFL two or three in the morning, and I want to get work done. And that was my story and then this interim period between digital marketing success lash failure. And then current digital marketing was custom clothing like I knew I itself things. I knew I had the ability begin from people. I certainly didn't have any issue going up and talking to strangers so got into custom suits and apparel all handmade stuff out of England. And for that. I almost got to be my own version of Napoleon hill, where I'm dealing with these Uber successful people, you know, typically, you know, some of the income level of three or four hundred grand a year or more seems to be that type of shopper. And I'm getting this Ben quality intimate time with them. And I'm able to just ask them questions and just honest questions. Once I earn their trust in just openly say like, look, I'm trying to better my life right now. I used to have. Some successes I I've had some pitfalls like I'm owning the fact that selling custom clothing, not my end all be all ends its in do you mind sharing to some things that you do every day? And it wasn't at that point. I hadn't even read Napoleon Hill's book as crazy as that sounds. And so I'm just asking these wealthy individuals. What's your habits? What are your success habits and most of them had some sort of the same methodologies of reading something impactful everyday and reading some they could apply to their life. Whether it's a marketing Booker business Booker self-help book, a personal element. Maybe wasn't reading it was consuming a podcast like this. It was making sure they sweat. You know, worked out at some capacity in the morning their endorphins running in and did something that way, it was make sure they fed themselves. High quality foods, you know, things that made them feel better on the inside. And then it was focusing on business almost doing some sort of say time blind time chunky where when you're at work. You you make it about work when you leave work, you try to make about your family or whatever's next and some of these things started to click. I've been that guy that after college I was convinced I never had to reading it. Like, why not on a magazine, or if it's not something that you know, has a half naked woman on the front. Probably not all that interested in it. And man was at just a complete fallacy. Like Ryan, I've read a book week for the past going on almost two years. Now, a little bit of everything what I found is just the fact of being able to condense time down and learn lessons. Other people learned before I have to learn them is massively impactful and not only that like reading is all well and good. And it just so happens that I allow enough time in the morning in the quietness of our house that I can read it that rate. It's not like I said out like I have to read a book a week in some weeks. I'm reading a heavier book, and it takes two or three weeks. But the application of what I read is. What's important it keep journal next my books? I I take out a read for that nugget of information that I can apply to that day. And then I don't really believe in the twenty-seven days secreta habit. I'm much more than. Ninety days pre to lifestyle guy now. So I'll journal something if I can implement it for ninety days in a row will now it was something of value. Like now, something I'm holding onto that sure. I might have read from a book, but now becomes my own. I can make it massage it into what fits my life. What serves me the best? So Ryan, you said something interesting there, which was you believe in what we might call time. Collapsing learning from other people getting amazing results in shorter amount of time. I like the quote that everyone's life is either an example or a warning. And what I'm hearing is that you've lived both before your life was a warning. And now your life as an example. And the transit point was when you got caught in your lies, and then you're exposed I've had experiences like this before maybe a business deal doesn't go. So well, a break-up happened. Something exposes you. And it makes you feel you said lighter. There's like you all the things that you were holding onto that you were. Defending you can't defend anymore. And so you're just left with you which hurts and then you're kind of freed from them. So I want to know from your perspective. What are most people men in particular since that's going to be our bias? What are they lying about that? They are also lying to themselves and covering up. What are they unconsciously blind themselves about? All ryan. This is the one is you talk to come up with one thing. But I'll say the biggest lie that I believe has been told to men for generations is to naturally emotions. And I believe in something that we've all held onto like if I go back. And uncover the things that truly believe between the ages of four and fourteen as we go through that developmental period in our lives as men were sponges, we're consuming everything that's around us. And where it's good or bad. You don't have that choice of that age. No, your parents are pushing that upon us societies pushing that up on you, really the tribalism starts, then the things that we believe in form, our belief systems will and so in that if your father figure song you consistently don't show emotions like to be quote, unquote, man is to keep a stiff upper lip and don't cry these stoic and don't show emotion. What emotion exists for all of us like in every aspect of life? There's an emotional response. And if men were told to swallow it up and just hold onto in our soul that energy has to go somewhere. It has to push out in one direction or another. And so that lie for me, the lie was the fact that I was okay with basically moving out at seventeen and living in my car. Putting myself. I graduated high school by myself. I'm putting myself through college like that was lie that I had told myself like, oh it made me tougher. Will know really what happened is? I never forgave. My parents were the decisions I made during that time, and I didn't realize until really not all that long ago that the tools and structures that they had in place in their life weren't built in such a way that they could combat what was going on the demons. They were fighting in their own mind where so much larger than they have the capacity to handle that their way was to handle. It was the way that the Hamilton. And it can't be good or bad for so long run. I gave credit or detriment all the negativity that I could carry around was able towards my parents, but I never stopped to position that the other way and view it from the back side really of the screen like I can't give them credit for the good or for the bad. If I don't also give them credit for the good because that same drive that. Now, I have to be successful the same relentless ability to work, you know, sixty seventy eight hours a week ninety hours a week pick a time where doesn't faze me is because what I moved out. I had no choice, but to do that. In order to put food in my mouth. You don't say Ying and Yang principle. I think truly that energy balances itself out across universe. But I was so hellbent on just focusing on the negatives. And it just kept kind of repeating themselves. Like, I never broke free from those negative emotions in the past. And as I know the sun. Woo, you know, all types of metaphysics or whatever you want to say, yes, I believe in all that. But at some point it just been the most freeing thing in the world to start really reevaluating what happened in my childhood, which I use example, the time, and I don't know if it's best or the worst. But as an example on the less, my childhood trauma is just my some sort of just hold Ryan the biggest that could happen in your life. Was your mom could have yelled at you at six years old don't touch stove it's hot. But she said it in such a way that like it's stuck in your memory will still until you can make peace with that exact moment. I have a firm belief that it eventually ties into how you operate as an adult, man. It doesn't mean that that was the my trauma is more or less than yours. We just had different dramas. We had different things that formed us. And as my buddy remarka- says, it's like a little piece of software code gets in there, and it starts to become a virus? And it changes the whole system, and it could have started as a perfectly benign piece of software code that was made to do good. But it got in there in the whole system. And what I'm hearing. You say is that you were in denial about the things that were keeping you in that place and not processing them both emotionally and just mentally in being able to reframe them in a way that served. You is that right as the right? I mean, Ryan's everything from the stuff of childhood to developing late throughout high school and being the laughingstock because I was skinny didn't go through puberty till really my junior senior year. So I did not my way with women. And so I did finally get attention of women. I didn't put a lot of value in it. Because I thought it was all. Taken away because my mother had walked out my father, had wound mentor ahead walked out. So there's this perfect storm where again, please take this. If you're listening not as a justification just as neither standing of the actions. I was taking it's like man, I could have just stopped and someone could have sat down and said you realize there's a slightly better way to operate. You'll just listen to it. There's some habits you're exhibiting that could be broken. If you want them it's like man, I pissed away literally from nineteen Ryan until thirty Bisley thirty like multiple girlfriends at the same time. Just lying cheat. Like the stories that you, and I could go into which I'm happy to share again. That's part of. I'm sure we'll get into his success the podcast and all that good. Happy stuff is because now there's no filter like how you do. One thing is truly how you do everything. I've been so go go let let's go there because this is always a phrase, I have kind of pushed back against I just don't feel like maybe I'm in denial about being true for me. So I wanna hear you comment on on this. Because you seem to be smashing it in all areas of life. Now, you seem to have it all you have the family. You have the successful business. You have the body. People are starting to really admire you, and yet this this phrase of how you do anything is how you do everything. I kinda why do you think that is the case in house it showing up for you? Is romy. Ryan I've been my own best case like when I stopped lying or we can flip that around. So when I started on the truth had to be the truth in everything not just situation. Not just the quiet dark recesses of our home where I'm confiding in Lindsay where I'm just telling the truth there. I have to adopt. This mindset that even when it's uncomfortable. I have to tell the truth everyone. So how I'm doing the one thing with Lindsey of telling the truth is how I have to do it with every and that can be said for the extreme nature in which I live my mornings. I get up like clockwork in between really the alarm goes off a four zero seven every morning. There's no justification for oh seven it. Just where I swiped in the I I. And I've never changed it. So, you know, especially when I start really looking at time is something that we created than exists. But only because we made it exist like who really cares. What four zero seven four zero three like, whatever. So you know, the alarm clock goes off four of seven I get up. I hop on the shower right away some gratitude in the shower, I'm truly grateful for all the things that I have because I have experienced the opposite. I have had and just as of the warm water on my back. I haven't had the house that we have. Now, they haven't had the wife in the bed and the daughter in the bedroom across the hall, and so I'm truly in that moment expressing immense gratitude for what I have is what I used to have. But also being grateful things are about to come because why not be grateful for the future. What why not give that a shop? And so in that I leave that drink a green smoothie of some capacity every day, whether it's a freshman or I put powder Shakur and drink it up. From there. I meditate for at least twenty minutes most time as thirty five or forty from that meditation on journal a little bit get out, the thoughts and self-defeating things over my head spin that into making sure that Lindsey, and Gina my wife, and my daughter know, how much I love honour appreciate them that they truly are a value. So I take something that they did the day before that especial to just them. And I let them know through text message written note, like how valuable they aren't. But is from the heart. It's not because I feel like I need to it's because there's some gift to be had it every day. And I truly believe this. Now, there is something if I'm open to receiving it that it could be the fact of Lindsey looking at me with that glowing loving looker the the sexual energy issue walks up the stairs. And a touches me. So I wanna share that with it more than and then from there, I go into the reading, and I read that book for for the message every day John down the message, and I you know, then I do something about applied to my day. And so I started practicing that extreme ownership of the morning like that truly like that is my time you. Cannot fuck with me from four o'clock in the morning until seven. Time my cell. Phone's not on it's not around me like everything that you might see on social media because I standard the poster or have somebody else doing it like that is my time to clear my head. And I never made that time before I always felt like I was on somebody else's schedule. And now that I have not negotiable time blocks, I feel like I've applied that every other aspect of my life. And so I'm no longer operating. The mindset of scarcity I'm operating from fact of being on my toes of my heels, I was ready for our phone call or our interview here like thirty five minutes ago because I leave half hour before and a half hour after every phone call. So I'm never rushed. I leave the house half hour earlier than I should for any appointment because I don't want that that negative energy that quarters. All spike is we give them the body know, we're gonna cover I wanna just live a very happy fulfilled life, but all starts from my morning. Hey, podcast listeners real fast. I wanna draw your attention to January twenty first the twenty third in Dallas, Texas is the next capitalism conference this event absolutely will sell out. So I want to draw your attention to it. This is the event where you're gonna make the connections. You're going to get the insight, and you are going to get the strategies that are going to allow you to make more money. Invest it. Well, and keep it. 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When you are at the event, so the capitalism conference dot com go there and come to the event, I will see their. Here is what I'm taking away from what you're saying. You have moved from a reactive waive being to a intent based being you are now doing everything that you do on purpose. There is no more reactivity to it. There is intense in there is choice behind each piece of it. Now, Ryan, you mentioned that it all changed when you started telling the truth in what am I mentor is Dan Sullivan will say that all progress starts when you tell the truth, and I'm curious from your vantage point that doesn't mean conflict doesn't come up or conflicting values don't come up. And this has been difficult for me as I consider myself to be a fairly honest person. But there are times that I feel very conflicted. And I don't know what's true for me. I don't know what the right thing to do is. I don't know what I really want. How do you? Evaluate that. Or how do you make decisions when you're in that mode of being? And Ryan this up polarizing topic. I have shed the whole life from wrong on fine that we all live under you know, our entire lives. We've been taught you know, something's writing something's wrong. What was right for me? In this moment might be wrong for you in the same. So that's the case we're forced to have conflicting opinions on any given top when I'm operating every day under what serving neighbors is what is not serving then things become much more clear. So if it serves me to wake up at four o'clock, I know that for me that makes me happy. I can't really impress upon you Ryan your life shit. If you don't wake up before. That might not be your sweet spot that might not be your thing. I would encourage you to consider the possibility of trying, but it doesn't necessarily have to be and so some of this conflict and conflict resolution, so my pendulum is still swinging very aggressively in towards conflict because for so many years Ryan, especially with my my father being in a rather aggressive as young man like someone physically definitely mentally verbally abusive. I was so against conflict that I would physically run from. I just would not have any tough conversations. It was like really the that was a story of my life of until you know, twenty nine thirty. And so in that the pendulum is still swung the other way where would pretty quick and pretty blatant to have some uncomfortable conversations, not ineffective one in for myself to be right from wrong just knowing that that time under tension to only gonna make me better. Just like with you saying how you do one thing is high do everything you having that karnal response. You don't agree with that? I love having the conflicting opinions. So I can expand my. Pass like being mind. It's not gonna help any like I lived close minded for a long time. I want that expansive mindset will gosh, why is it Ryan that you believe what you believe? Can I take off my social blinders and just listening receive what you're giving me? And then maybe it's gonna shift. My viewpoint holding onto these rules will call the bullshit rules of life. Now, take a germ out of mind Bally's book. Rene mine those limit our growth in my pin? So why not have the tough conversations than healthy debates and and figure out what really makes you tick. And as you said riding human being a little confused or not knowing what you want some situations, man. I would have said, especially as I've known you when you went through, you know, your religious pilgrimage Oncologic. That's a great word. I might still that from me. Thank you, Ryan, or the anti religious builder midge, whatever you wanna call the path you've been on, you know, I'm in this current path where when I meditate, and I do it consistently my intuition increases and some say that's not depending on your viewpoint. Sure. Maybe it's God communicating with me. Maybe it's a higher power. Or maybe for all. I know it's a unicorn somewhere in the world. I don't know what's coming in to me when I know when I can quite my mind consistently. I can receive that. And I take action on it. My life has gotten consistently better consistently. It has not changed at all since I've made at a practice. And so my religion my religious belief right now is is more of one of. That were all unified that we all have a one this about us. And I'll say there's a God. I don't believe he's in the white Rovan up a beard waiting for us to arrive somewhere. I just believe that we're all connected in some capacity. And if we're all connected them. Why would you wanna do something bad to somebody else? Why would you want them to feel pain? Ensure this is we can I'm sure you, and I could go on for three hours on this particular. Oh, yeah. So what you've done. So I want to summarize what you set up into this point, which is know what I was really fascinated by your transformation was I knew you when you were when he had lost everything when you were covering up a lot of things when you were managing multiple lives when you did not have things together. And I have watched you the lose it, and then create a beautiful family to create an abundant business to have an audience to having health, basically having it all and the thing that changed for you is when you started telling the truth in that came forcibly because you got found out and you replace your bad habits with good habits, which meant living life on purpose carving out intentional time to practice. The habits that you knew would create success based on what you learned in previous occupations. You started doing the things that came natural to you which were leading an audience which were speaking in front of a microphone, and you started tell. The truth in all areas of life. And that leads me to my next question, which is gonna take us down a different rabbit hole. Because in kind of your quest of telling the truth in all areas, you put up a social media post that was basically a picture of you while injecting steroids. I think it was an injection gone horribly wrong. And this opened up kind of a can of worms of questions of me, both in I really fascinated to know what led you to take some any chemicals. And I'm really really curious to know, your perspective on steroids on the other side of things because I know like you have I think intentionally lost mass at this point in search of health. So from a health perspective, I'm very curious. If you think steroids are positive negative. I have a little bit of skinny kid syndrome. Probably not as bad as you because I've never injected steroid. But I still I still think about that a lot. And so selfishly I'm curious to hear the mental racket around this topic. Of course, as we're having this interview right now, I'm down from I was three hundred and five pounds of my heaviest and still had abdominal finish not so much that know, I would have had a washboard six pack, but enough that I had taken off my shirt. All right. That guy is not a beer belly cert-, you know, as we have this this recording. Now this interview down to sixty to sixty five on chemical free in every capacity. The reason I originally jumped on the chemical bandwagon is again Ryan as I was a late bloomer. You know, I was the guy didn't high school football would work out in Lifton. I graduated high school my high which is about six one maybe six two and one hundred seventy pounds. I just couldn't gain weight. And maybe that's a story that I'm telling because I didn't know the nutritional protocols. I know now, I didn't know how to exercise right away. There was certainly a disconnect and information, and I wasn't even really willing to search out. Go to college my freshman year university Cincinnati, I get a meal plan that allows for unlimited eating essentially, which is a blessing especially from a central living in my car ISM on really just four or five months prior super exciting for me that way, and then a guy that I knew loosely just said, hey, you know, seeming the gym consistence, I didn't want you try some Cyril testosterone. I try some Wynstrol one's a world ones. Injectable man. I'm afraid of death at needles. I can't do that only junkies inject absolves like I'm not ready for that. So it gives me a bottle of wind strong whence rouse them on oral oral supplement. And I take it. I can't say admittedly, Ryan than I saw that much of a difference back. Then no this one little thirty days Cyclo of wind that was back with fro hormones were still on the market. Yeah. Pro hormones come to find out really what you know, one one or two miles away from a steroid. And we're probably more toxic on your liver and kidneys than anything else. So most hateful. But at the time, nobody who that's why switch over and when you know, the m one zero method testosterone, and then all of a sudden, it's like, wow, I'm one from one seventy to one ninety five and I bought this GNC, and I'm like the holy grail. Like, I'm in. I'm now like I feel good now. Some of this body this Moorefield, or maybe, you know, the small man syndrome as you call it was slowly being unraveled. Like, I'm starting to not sure it's a little bit. I'm not the tall skinny Lahey guy anymore. And this prompts me going into the second half of my freshman year to talk to the same guy that talked about cigarettes. Look, I'm ready for the needle regular zoo. This. So it gives me s went doesn't give me act in force. But just Ostro and Decca in Diana able. And those resources together are Ruben to add a lot of mass mature period of time, or at least a lot of sites. And so I start this process. Probably one ninety one ninety five by the time. I go home my freshman year. I'm up to two fifty literally put on fifty five pounds in the course of four months. Five months now, this was not called away. Like, this red-faced puffy probably could've put a needle in me. Like a pin in minute. Look like what a deflate, and I come home. And I think I'm king should at this point. And I'm not like I don't have the discipline. I don't understand how to work out the right way. Certainly don't anything about dietary requirements or how to optimize utilization of anything putting my body food or otherwise. And so I tend to give up liftings goes back and forth all the way through college in my professional career where you know summers. I would lift and involving school in the morning steroid. And unfortunate Ron I didn't break that cycle until really last November last October. Why was consistently taken? I competed Amtra bodybuilding contests. And I had created the story that I needed to win. I need to become a professional body Bill. He's I don't really have that mid switch in my life. Like, I'm an extremist by nature. I realized that now so I try to use as my benefit or detriment. But I don't know how to do something halfway. So if I'm going to use anabolics by when I use every abolished I could find by when I get as big as possible, why would not want to be a competitor than why would I want to win the national show? And then become a pro it just the logical path. And so I went down that path until I'm out on an event in California, actually, invented we don't think you, and I both the guy guarantee white from Waco warrior out there in it's a big event. It's a five hundred person event, and we do some physical training in the morning and the has bear crawling across thirty yard field miracle on thirty three-year-old. Bam Ivan bear called since high school football, and I don't make it ten yards amount of brand. I almost earned. My Richard everything is shot. And I'm like asking for what is going on here. Try to continue to PT. And I'm I'm struggling in every capacity, literally get done with this physical training. Call my fiance that now my wife gem done like this story that I can talk to my head doesn't serve me in any capacity. I don't really want to be a pro bodybuilders nothing about my real actions on a day-to-day basis. My consistency is not there. My enjoyments not there. This is some will should store. I've told myself for years if I do this. I'll be. More than I am today. But more to who like not more to me. I'm still the same man. I had been convinced the outside adulation from the world of upholding his little sheet of paper that says I'm an IFP be pro the business will make me more of who. I am and it doesn't and so I call until like I'm over him done. No, more and she's happy. Because of course, she's got her own concerned with my health and things like that. So I get home, and you know, throw away whatever supplies. I haven't throw away things that I have sitting around and for those of you that don't know much about the antibiotic world, there's typically a protocol to come off of animals, you do some certain things to read jumps are your natural testosterone production, get your testicles to fall back down to the normal place. It's just some things you do. I didn't do any of those. Part headed whatever you want to say and so come December. My sex drive is zero a very beautiful wife, and I'm biased, of course. But. I'm very track. You're our sex life is very healthy. And it goes from healthy to nonexistent and having my past life of lies and deceit. Her mind starts racing not necessarily I'm cheating on her. But like could this be having? Why aren't you attract me awesome? I'm attracted just my utility belts. Not working. Things are winding should. And so that's Ryan on the backside of that picture. I decided in early January. Look, I'm to take a shot. Accessorize can get a volatile saucer on I don't wanna be a steroid junkie. I just want to be able to function like a normal Thirty-three-year-old, man. But of course, I do in such a way that I'm just don't really need to go to Dr like understand hormones at this point in a very very finite level. I'm really had optimize most parts of my body. And so interesting how much it should take the two hundred fifty milliliters week one season of along Esser testosterone. So take the first shop take my shoulder week one no issue. Bam by the week sexualize back on start feeling better have more energy. Yes. Finally, getting back to my old self do. I put that shot on my outer left thigh, and it hurts going Nobile sometimes that happens and so as the week progresses. I start feeling I'm getting the flu let street time. Yeah. January. So you know, whatever fight it off. Ops Wentz cold sweats, the whole deal. What progress into the weekend and Lindsey asked to go to Washington DC to see your brother, do some Saint things there. Some at home alone on the couch and now look at my shorts. A my leg is in a normally that went semi lecturer probably thirty inches pretty close or of muscle on my leg. This what my left is probably thirty three thirty four inches. Like swan. I was can't lift on my shorts, and it's red, and there's big I mean, I've a very decent sized hand in it's bigger than my hand from engine and it's hot to the touch. Like oh, gosh. I have an abscess like, I know this is not enough research. No hop on. Doctor Wickham pedia self diagnose myself sitting on the couch. And fortunately or unfortunately, Lindsay used to be a very specialized mentioned writers. And then that's specialized veterinary nursing practice. She had access to all types of different things to help transfer blunt something like I'll get a pick line, and I'll get some big eighteen gauge needles that was put him in the abscessed. Dear God drag out all the stuff. That's in there this great relief for me. And for that. You know, we have some amoxicillin penicillin sitting around like old prescriptions and stuff they're sitting there. I'm like complete meet head out. Like, I got this figure this out. And so I go through eighteen different needles. Like tips of needles eighteen eighteen gauge needles pooling out the stop that's supposed on my social media age. Ryan was this you I to Tupperware's full abyss posse fluid obviously infection, and then like all these holes in my leg in. It's when it's done. I can't pull anymore poss- out. I can't massage and getting more out. I feel good. I have mobility back. It's not swollen anymore. Yes. I finally beat this. Well, kind of. So that's Friday evening as we get on a Saturday and Sunday all that happens at affection comes back worse than it. Come back with a vengeance. It's literally two or three times bad. As of was. I can't bend my leg. It's down to my knee its upcoming to my groin. I consistently feel like I have the flu. So you get a hold of my local doctors a very specialized sports medicine, doctor here Joma pitch them. Like what you want me to do? It's like you get into my office tomorrow morning, six AM immediately. Like don't do anything else. So get there. He looks at any, you know, horse called me dumb asshole the things. I mean, he's notable super guy, but you know, gregarious but understand what's going on. Probably hostile Faulk. I don't I don't want to go to the hospital is like all right. So he puts a little bit of light in spots takes a surgical scalpel sticks. The my leg and just pulls a back towards my hip, a good four and a half or five minutes incision, and then goes back at a makes a wider. So here I have this now, really ugly. It's about a five by two inch wide scar. Ryan, it's a it's a big ugly purple star on my left leg where they him and his internal mentally a pool all the pus out of my leg in amp to leave it open. So they put packing Gaza. I was having to go back to this outskirt. You would notice Pickering's in this outskirt of Columbus about a fifteen minute drive twice a week. Is they were taking out the packing tape. It's in it, no surgical tape and repacking it with more 'cause I've gone for two or three weeks where I have, you know, my body's not healing quickly enough from the inside because of how massive this infection really was off to the races. I go with big ass car, which is now the permanent reminder that I don't ever have to go down that path again where it's funny. I went on for a normal blood panel ten days ago, maybe two weeks, and my testosterone levels are little bit lower than they should be for healthy, man. That's thirty four year old guy. But plaque levels are good on my plate, lizard, good cholesterol. Good and bad is like I've had the best blood panel. At this moment that I've had in my entire life on the back of my testosterone. Now is too low. So the doctor actually wants me to prescribe me I shot at testosterone wants me to come in like literally put the needle in me. Do it for me. And I'm still on the fence where it's really weird with this old story that I told myself I would have forced one optimize. How I feel like I would. Not think twice a wanting to feel like a twenty year old man every day that lead Julie's up to here. Now how far down the rabbit hole. You want me to get into actually using antibiotics in the NF? It's and detriments. Well, in what I'm curious about is is you just made a statement of, you know, of course, you would want to optimize to feel as best as possible. Of course, you would want to optimize to feel like a twenty year old all the time. You went to the opposite extreme I mean, taking Wynstrol testy and Diana ball, all at the same time is well a lot right? I mean, so it's so far in the other extreme, and I've heard the opinions of some who say there's steroids are a really not nearly as detrimental as some people would say, and then there's some people say if you're going to take them be prepared to have your hormones out of whack for the rest of your life. And so as someone who has been openly honest about this conversation, I just wanted to hear somebody who has gone down the rabbit hole on both sides. Both. Now being away from them. And also being completely in them. When is your take my opinion on that is much like alcohol? I choose right now not to drink good. I have a glass of wine or maybe a, you know, a cocktail dinner, of course, alcoholic, you know, doesn't have any control over me. But if I were to have a six Packer, twelve back pack of some sort of beer every evening that would eventually lead to negative ramifications. Not only my health, you know, inside my body, but probably the extra factors in my life. Like that accessories. I think we'd all agree. Probably not healthy for anybody. The same plays Truitt into in the way, I've used steroids. Seattle. You said I'm not taking testosterone every ester obtained SaaS on all four Ezra's obsessed. Ostro tremble acetate tremble and inundate Wynstrol deca de ball nandrolone feudal probate, growth hormone, insulin name, something, and I've been a human Guinea pig and or Petri dish. That level excess is completely nonsensical. The majority of us. Never get to the level that we need that money substances to optimize. How we look. So some of this comes down to my opinion. Ryan is the steroid use or you going to be or for a listener vanity based or health base because there are two dramatically different paths. Like right now, the path that I would be on the path that I think every man should be on is to optimize your hormone levels, by the fact of the plastics that we ingest during our during our time on this planet by the stress factors are to Sasha accesses are always trying to find equilibrium. And then give them point one could be higher than the other which our bodies are always fighting for some level home, Yose tastes. So we need to be able to have that balance and sometimes from external environmental factors, divorce drinking bad food. You're estrogen levels are so high until you can start to pull those estrogen levels down. And start to slowly increase your testosterone. Whether it be from a product like h c g that's going to increase your natural testosterone production or whether it from an intramuscular injection of testosterone. There's big benefit there to me. Because again, I believe more in that Dave Asprey like biohacking like how do I become the best version of myself? Now all the time like what can I do to think the most clearly have the most energy get the best sleep in? If it's out there, and I can do it on his not a detriment to my health. Why would I do that? And then that puts us into that detriments items. What is a detriment like they're still the debate is red meat good or bad for you know, that I really know that I know my personal experience with steroids had blood panels done at least once a year for the past certainly five or six years, my twenties, I was not diligent about all the negative ramifications of anabolic use were pretty negligible course, high blood pressure absolutely increased police role. But there's debate on whether that was because of anabolics. Or that was the mass amount of protein is eating every day. But you can't have you not meeting four to five hundred grams of protein every day every day that taxes your body a lot. There's a lot of digestion the goes on there. Same thing that I'll probably only process that because you were on a bunch of chemicals at the same time. Correct. Absolutely. And that men Ryan I was the guy that was towards the end setting alarm clock. So it wasn't getting over the Bill the night, but I was eating seventy eight meals a day every two hours apart taking digestive enzymes consistently trying to really constantly chew, my food depending on the time of day versus how much sleep I'd gotten versus where I was at my workout schedule was determining what type of protein source is eating for the maximum digest ability. There's a lot that goes into this. As again as nineteen year old kid in college. I had no idea is I wouldn't taken that path. Certainly had I delayed taking any sort of anabolic had I've been as naturals. I could have been for as long as I could have been to gain. All this is I could have gained the results I would have had most arrow from the second half of my twenty s would. Been twofold, as significant said, do you do you think that you will revisit use now that you're not using them? But you feel like you can be smarter about them. Do you think that you would revisit use as a way to optimize health in the future? Yes. So I have a support. Now when I when I make decisions like this. I run the past my wife minute. It's a whole different methodology for me. And it's yes, under extreme doctor supervision with blood panels scheduled every thirty days with how my mind words, I would want to keep my testosterone level at an eight hundred or so, and there's no FDA approved level like visible, your testosterone should be because from birth. I Ryan have different levels of testosterone. Like, it just we all have our own level. That's rope. Root for us. The big thing for me is. Yes, Jen rebound. You start really looking at some of the cancer causing agents inside of men, it's high levels of estrogen over a long period of time, which also creates that, you know, we're stomach fat. The love handle fab the saggy ran. We get his men. That's actually an overabundance of free estrogen in your body, which best the part. I'm more concerned about is. How do I optimize my estrin levels funny as that sounds? But how do I keep that in such a range that I'm healthy for the? Long run by the nature, my Astra being suppressed or baseline or stable my natural testosterone should raise to the peak level that it's able to now that doesn't give me to that, you know, seven or eight hundred level, that's an arbitrary level. But only so much because that just a healthy below sports performance level for someone RH racket, your is age thirty three to thirty five bridge. The answer is yes, I definitely will consider it just something that I'll have to go to someone to do the injections and Midgley now that I've had so long off of having to stick myself with a needle I really don't ever want to get back. It's just not fun. Like, it's you know, it was it was sexy for a while. And then I thought it was funny. And then it was like, I'm just a pin cushion like I don't wanna do this anymore. So for someone who does not want to be injecting themselves of needles who has kind of I have friends who take steroids and think they're the greatest thing ever and think I had one friend say man, people do don't take steroids. Don't realize how. Great life can be like that kind of thing where it's just they see it as almost like a like a bio hack, and so I'm curious as someone who would like to not go down that route myself, what do you focus on now that you are off chemicals in order to optimize your hormone levels and to stay in the shape that you want when you do. Instead this coming times, I if I recall yesterday or two days, you had a post about mushrooms guess in adapted Jin's and the duct Generale lifestyle or a lot of that mindset methodology goes into those believe there's so much especially being friends with Aubrey. There's so much that comes from plants so much medicine so much medicinal benefit from things that we kind of brushed past every day that there's some really easy ways. Like Ashwell Gonda is a big thing, you know, to balance your thyroid production things like that which has a trickle down effect into that whole system of your body. He's getting into greens, and we can call it. Offers screams, but really looking radical dim DAM think you're familiar with him in some capacity right now largely dim to help your body. Find its natural hormone actually found in most women sections of grocery stores now women's need sections because it helps your body processors. More efficient, should certainly you can have copious amounts of broccoli with every meal and you'll get the same benefit, but I'd like to I would like broccoli so much. So I try to have a pretty healthy honored phrases say what it really is. I don't eat any fried food. I haven't had fast food and more than a year. If it's not something that I really pretty much know where it came from. I tend to stay away from them. Of course, there's occasional like pizza meal and stuff like that with the family, and I'm not in retentive to the point of like, I just won't go out to dinner. If I don't know where the food comes from. But given the fact make a healthy choice. I live more of that Kito genyk ask lifestyle where I know carbs, Gaza inflammation for me. I know when inflammation happens estrogen deposits increase on own estrogen increases, this astronaut decreases. I know those are both recourses to long-term cancer. I know if I have lower testosterone my energy levels are lower my sex drive's lower accumulate more fat. So when I backtrack in started the in work my way to the front I can stop that. By just not having a shitload of carbs, not eating like an asshole is really what it comes down to like putting your body filled with greens opera supplements, proper nutrition, a whole plethora of different adaptions that we can certainly dive into and really just eat for what feels good in. We'll take pretty down the rabbit hole. I consciously look at my stool every day if you're foundries skipped go run. But no think about I mean, if you're stool is not consistent if you're eating give or take the same things and some days, it's more difficult to use the restroom Sundays. It's will say a little more quick a little more easy. What are the reasons as to why how conscious can you be in the moment of what happened the day before? And how your body's responding to? It is going to truly believe in. If you have the same stimulus towards your body in every seventy two no more. Than ninety six hours. Your body's struggling in always pushing for that home basis that base level. So just because what works three days ago where the same timetable reference points amounts might not work the same way today. So it's a lot of conscious awareness and trial and error. So Ryan, I want to ask you one more question to conclude because you have been I'm just going to call you a student of life at this point of like a lot of research and development that has led you to the point at thirty three or so really starting to consciously build your life. There are people listening who feel like they are you a few years ago where their life is in shambles or they're afraid of being found out or they feel like they're living a lie or they're just not getting the results that they would want as somebody who has come full circle on this. How would you coach an adviser that person? A two fold answer. Ryan, I fold is. You're not alone. Especially as a man, I believe that we have or sells for years of. We're all like, I truly believe I was the only person that was lying. Anybody only multiple relations, Joe only person taking steroids. Of course, I knew I wasn't at some level. I had built this shield in this wall around me that I had to be the only person on the planet doing so in that I felt compelled the height of everybody might that whole pain shared his pain divided concept. I didn't have anybody to share. The painless didn't know who to communicate which leads me to the next part, honest with that I always had a mentor of some capacity MS Nelson shameless plug for coaching or any of that stuff. This is true, honest, heartfelt like go back to when I was running car dealerships. I found the best sales guy or the best manager or the general manager of the store and I wanted to become friends with him. I wanted to learn from him. I wanted him to be able to answer my questions as we jumped in digital marketing world are Jenny you Ryan, I was around some really incredible people that had I fully utilize them have answered any question possible. That's when I got that egotistical side of me that didn't think I needed it by and then is it's worked into this. Evolution of life paying for for coaches and mentors in a personal Velma people to to bounce ideas off from a higher perspective than I'm able to see no magin this arbitrary lab of the world climate someone that's had more success than you. That's at a different on the ladder can just see the game being played from a different perspective. So why not ask him? Do. You know, toss you. On a wire inflatable telephone game, we play as kids rape with the company the wire like why not have that one on one line to him or her? So they can help you navigate the water for up. And again, it doesn't have to be tens of thousands of dollars in this light transformation thing usually somebody to understand that you're not alone help into the questions. You don't know where to find answers to? I think it's really almost just as simple as had like we over complicate all the chili shirt read every day will rape. But if you don't have to share the reading with and you don't implement it. Old. Fuck good is reading we are social creatures who become like those that we hang out with. And as a result. We are biologically wired to become like the tribes. And so the fastest way to literally hack who you want to become is to change when you surround yourself with. And I think what you are doing in sharing this transformation is helping make it easier for other people to have their own transformation. It's why I wanted to highlight your story. I'm so impressed with the transformation that you've had. It's something that has made me want to be a better person to make me be more relentless in my focus and just wanna publicly at a fi what you have done and what you're doing. And I'm excited to share this with so where can people follow along and working people start to awaken their own transformation by following you? Thank ryan. So every social media handles the same. It's Ryan Neidl, and I d d e l was like middle typing. Instagram is Twitter. It's really everywhere on composting. I've ridell dot com where have some free content that I give out from there. I have a podcast as reminded mentioned that that's fifteen minutes of freedom. I'm saying that laughing leads knighthoods south twenty overall couple million people. Listen to just a little fifteen minute increments of these types of stories like the real true of the Vagit. That's went on every day, and stopping running from an addition those life stories in and how they can affect you the listener how you can games amount trauman. So those places Reina great places to start. Ryan. Thanks so much for hanging out with us. I can't wait to watch growth over the next couple of years because I know you are just getting started my man excited to watcher journey. Thanks, ron. I appreciate the time. Would you always break? All progress starts by telling the truth. And when you are exposed or he finally do tell the truth. You realize how true that statement is we really can't grow until we are really honest about where we are for Ryan that was being found out. My hope in highlighting his story is that some of us don't have to be found out before we realize that we're lying to ourselves in certain areas. Sometimes it takes an outside perspective to highlight where we are missing. The Mark where we are ignoring our health where we are ignoring the deficiencies in our business where we are lying to ourselves about what we can accomplish. Or what we're focusing on? Once we've lost that crutch all of a sudden clarity comes in. And we can start moving forward. It's why I say that freedom comes on the other side of k. Haas. Because once there's chaos we realize what's true once we allow the structure to crumble once we allow the facade to fall away we can start to trudge our way through the mud we decide. What's important the reason for that is because intent is what builds momentum true clarity, followed by intentional action is how we create that momentum to have lives that we won, you know, previously. We had Craig Valentine on the show, you might wanna dial back and listen to that episode if you missed it, but he talked about reverse engineering the goals, and the visions that we want. If you want to have a fifty million dollar company in three years. You can absolutely have that we just need to reverse engineer that in intentionally build the habits that will allow us to have that. And so often we just say that as a goal, but we're lying to ourselves. Are we really committed to that? Are we really structuring our lives to have that? Or are we lying to ourselves just to make ourselves? Feel good. I think that has alternately been Gary v's greatest contribution to our little world is that idea of self awareness and being really clear and honest about what it is that you want. If you wanna sit on the beach, go for it. You can do it. You can sit on the beach into whatever you want as long as you're not beating yourself up for comparing yourself to everybody else's measure of success. We also recently had Loretta Bruening on the show or we talked about the different happy chemicals. That are fired. When we compare ourselves to other people were constantly comparing ourselves in different areas of life to social media to those around us, either, positively or negatively to get territory kick or to get a quarter salt kick near the thing that says we need to get our butts in gear and get moving, but we're using different measuring sticks in all of these different areas in you could be making five million dollars a year ten million dollars year, but not have. A six pack and feel bad about yourself asked me how I know or you could have the opposite. You could have the perfect body in the perfect family. But I'm making the money that you want and compare yourself to those people the panacea to all of this is knowing exactly where you want to go in reverse engineering. What habits it takes to get there? And to stop lying about the things that you don't want that was Ryan's experience. And I think the opposite experience is to be very very clear on what it is you want which takes an immense amount of self awareness practice and intent in order to get clear on at something that I have to revisit about once a quarter in order to ensure that I'm being honest with myself my experience, which I've shared here on the podcast has been that I often have fallen into the temptation of structuring goals and habits based on what I think it will give me in terms of my comparison to other people. That's not honest it. Might give me a feeling for short amount of time. But ultimately, it's built on sand. Ultimately that is threatened. If somebody else is doing better than me. Our goals have to be self motivating. They have to be for what we want not how we want others to perceive us. And so it's something that I have to be very honest and get away from the noise into revisit frequently. If I'm going to do it in a way that is sustainable, and my hope for you is that by hearing Ryan story, you're hearing both a warning. And an example, a warning of how your life might turn out. If you continue down a path of the built on lies versus the example of building unintended based life. Hope you enjoyed today's podcast. Let me know what you thought on that Instagram at Ryan, Daniel Moran. Shoot me message. Let me know your thoughts. Thank you for listening. Guys, you know that my financial strategy is to build businesses and to invest the prophets. And when it comes to investing the prophets. I look for cash flow. I look forward to be backed by something real. And I look for tax efficiency. It's why when I recently sold a business I called the good folks over at four peaks capital partners. And today's episode is brought to buy them. You've heard him on the podcast before when I interviewed Maurici, oh Raould on the topic of mailbox money, and why investment funds could be a source of passive cashflow for some entrepreneurs, I use investment funds like four peaks as part of my long term strategy and encourage you to go listen to the episode called how rich people generate mailbox money, and you might wanna check them out. If you're looking for opportunities right now with asset prices as high as they are, I am mostly. Looking at cash flopportunity. He's which is why I had them on the podcast. So make sure you check out that episode on mailbox money with Marie CO rebelled.
Freedom Fast Lane with Ryan Daniel Moran
Aired 4 months ago 50:28
44. David Hasslehoff, The Friend Zone and Diversity in Hollywood (with Michael Yo)
You're listening to comedy central. Bye. Welcome to the Jim Jefferies show podcast. It's the Jayme Jeffrey shut podcast doo-doo-doo. Look, I do a pre roll thing of dishing the tide of late night shows that do nothing with political Chuck's. You may to me to thank God her on a hiatus Zing, then checkout matter the people with Pat, how do you say that trauma? Sue good friend of mine. A different kind of comedy show streaming on any device Saturday nights at eleven eighth. Ten central at WGN, TV dot com slash live. You can also find man of the people on YouTube at man of the people TV that's man of the people. You did it did do it. I did a good job to and now you can start the show. So we doing the jiffy said podcast as we do every week to do a song. I did this song. I didn't. I did a fucking song did that. And it didn't feel you hot there. Get some primaries. I guess I guess to this is how I find out where I'm going to be okay. I'm going to be tie pie. What the foxhole that about January tenth the reason? We're doing these Asian dates is because we going to film, some Philp is out there. So I thought slap some shows on one, so Johnny awesome. I never been any. It's gonna be amazing. Maybe you know, they we get hand jobs in the brothels. It's all what goes. Johnny. Was thinking, you know, like cool airports, the big different thing. Jerry the convention center in Taipei Taiwan generation Levin at yes. Twenty four live whole Seoul, South Korea. I'll be North Korea. But we're not we're not advertising that shy little private one Rodman's. Got me in January thirteen at Neesa niece. Ho vol- in Tokyo, Japan January eighteenth at the scholar theater Bangkok Thailand. January twenty first at the. Hole in Kuala Lumpur. Malaysia go on the web page figured out most about serious stripe. I think he's trying all but sold out. So I if you're in a straight you wanna see me, I'll be doing shit. You know, I'll be talking to you cats. Now. I can't before we introduced our guests before before we introduce him with intro. Yep. Tangent. You bring an inch. Oh, no. Yes. Hold on a second. Here. We go. Plus your fantasy guys out there. What's your fantasy guy fantasy Ryan Gosling, I like Nick's rice, half Asian half black guy with Avs? The rock. Mike. Yeah. He's going to be on our podcast plus your fantasy fantasy. Black man. Did I do this several times? Yeah. Yeah. Two times different attitudes. What's his name from queer? What's I thought we decided on Michael yell? Yeah. He's gotta beat Asian. So I feel like you'll be gentle loving. I would I got my beautiful gopher ties. Daisy. This is my fantasy, man. This is my fantasy taking them home tonight. I hope you don't mind, Michael. Yo. He's welcome Michael. Yes. Welcome to the show. I'm glad we have a desk right now. The hot the erection. I'm honored. I'm on. I'm not guy. In many ways. Okay. If I was to be your you on my guy, you know, my guy I wish I could say the same for you. But you know, fantasy guy Orion run gov. Ryan Reynolds is my fantasy guy really run rental. He's so attractive. What you just keep watching the notebook. Thinking they're going to get together. No, I just I'm going to do the best. So you would say he's you're first, man. Stop stop anyways. As a proper introduction. Bursch? What's your fantasy men? My fantasy Matt I said Ryan Gosling, did I your Gosling? I like them and drive. I'm I'm good friends with Russell Crowe Hino's Ryan Gosling now I can get you in with. I can get you to meet Ryan unify can entertainment reporter, you know, I've interviewed him several times and it several times. How sleep always great put the best best is the rock Kevin Hart in Tom Cruise and tell you like Kevin hot you wanted to sleep with Kevin. I know you said who like the interview like to interview. Yes, Tom Hanks is the best you want. So you so you give the property and chauffeur's injuring Michael ios our guest today, you can hear him on Sirius XM channel one. Oh, five Michael yo show from eleven to one Monday through Friday, also hits one Hollywood that's four to seven two seven. And November twenty seventh his special blazin will be coming out on I tunes and Amazon's. Yes. Yes. If want come right now. I don't know if you remember this can you? But I was in a you could call it a movie I was in a film with David hassle. Code killing house love, please. Like, I watch these I interviewed you. If you don't know the backstory of this I had to do an American accent. From the only reason I did American accent was a sign up to this film and had another part to do. And then one of my best friends. I said, you should get reached AVI, you get reached IBM for this film. And they said, well, we love that guy and they brought raise Dhabi, and and then they went we can't have an strike in New Zealand in your doing an American accent. And I was so cocky that I went I'll give it a guy. I did this American accent? So I'm fucking tanking everyday. I'm tanking. I wasn't a bad actor in legit because I was playing myself. But it when I have to play anyone else. I'm just terrible. But I think Louise you watched it, right? He said he just watching. It says your accent gets better or worse gets better. If there's changes, I'll tell you what happens at the beginning of the movie, we filmed like four days, and then all of a sudden accident coach shows up. I'm sick because they like Faulk days let you know, you're doing bad. Did I say, you know? Yeah. Hey, you're doing great every good. But we think we got so anyways. Anyway, you come down. And you interview me write these, and you've interviewed people that you don't know the story y'all the center of the story, but you don't know this really. So what happened was you interview? Everyone UNLV you may you, and if you raise you interview, Ken, John, you David Hasselhoff, you got around now on the day that you showed up and said there was Justin Bieber was doing a cameo, and you interviewed everybody else, and you went because I'm not movie savvy, nor nor do I know how to keep a secret. So so your gang around, and you got to go. Hey, can you tell me what's Justin Bieber doing in this film, and every single one of the went I can't I can't say it's a big secret have to watch the movie and find out go out to the movie and find out actually, my American accents awesome. So you go to find out. And then like, Ken, John. I can't tell you. I got it. And then reach he's like, oh, it's a big secret make sacred. Let's watch the film. What's the film, which the film? And then you it'd be me. And I got the voice of Kitt from not Ron. That's right. And it ran all over the place. I didn't know that. This is a big reveal. I like seven asked me a question. And then I got oh is. Yeah. H he he's always hanging with just a baby dight. He's doing the voice. Remember, and I didn't think it was a big deal. So I turn it in. So I show up the next day Hasselhoff is fury. Has it left into like me the met me? And he goes come here. I need to talk to you. You blew a hole thing, you blew it. You blew it kid. You told everyone Bieber was doing just how do you get it for mation here? Telephone teleport. Tell Jim Jefferies tell you that was his line. Something really funny like telephone teller Teluk. Oh, tell us. What's another thing that Utah telephone tone? Who's telephone telegram Jeffries? He did not say. Oh, God us off. I I would tell you. I'll tell you. My other David has say, so. So I shop and say I've been cast like two days earlier show for some reason, I'm playing like a handsome guy in the movie, I'm like, FOX on miscast. I'm normally play ugly. But it's Ken Joan Reese Dhabi, and so I just Trump them anyway. So fucking shove this movie meant to be the hot throw the Fugger. Phil diamond has love is in a karate gate, right? You'll know about that. I'm I'm Asia Asian. Yeah. So he's he's in a karate gay next to the not rata I walk in. He's an he's doing fucking tied shea by himself. Right. And then it bit of shadow boxing by the car by the cut. It's all by himself. I've just walked onto the lot all I see is hassle up each shadow boxing and doing fucking tight writer next to not rutta next to kit. He's next they're not filming filming. He's sticking around by himself. This is my first any already heights me. So say, this is my first conversation with David Hasselhoff, right? Hi, david. I'm Jim I'm in the film. He goes. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I heard about you, Jim Jefferies comedian right here. You're very funny. Very funny. I'm producing this film. We're gonna do some great things from Australia from a stray Madame provost drive. He goes, I tell you what I know. I know about a strange you all like to go to barley. Right. You go to barley. Right. I'm investing in this vacation lot in barley. And it's like at the moment and getting at five thousand dollars a square meter. It's gonna go through the fuck and roof. Do you want to invest? Within three fucking minutes. Two minutes of meeting David hassle if he's trying to do a fucking property deal with me anyway. Folly in Indonesia. Bali apologize say that bar meets. That's why that's why I an American say Farley else. Yeah. I thought I'm going to win barley in Google. And then came up came up. He tried to make me invest in a Bali fuckin- resort. And then minutes didn't do. Well. No. I haven't checked on David Hasselhoff doing fine. Yeah. He is. It says here I just put up an article Hasselhoff makes ten million dollars of Bali investments. Jeez. You fucking that was a slow price. Here's a here. The Roger as a professional player. The slowest play of I wanna say the problem has does. Well. When when Jamie. The problem is the problem is is once I said ten I couldn't say billion because that wouldn't have been believable already locked down like five I should have said forty. Really just fucked up and into picking hustle of makes. Tens of dollars lots of money, and I like to he tried to type it in. He tried to make the sound effects like shit. I like, that's the headline. Any article any audit goes outta go? James Jeffries, get syphilis, not wait. There's this is a real article though. Oh. Oh. Each front villa on Geely minnow nine homes. So he did do it. We did didn't make much money. But I get that wrong. If you may. Ten. Villian? Like I back. Getting fifty minutes he gets through to jokes. Hello shit. Jim. There's another movie that people are talking about in the podcast group that you did. I know people don't really like shut up this only what other movies. I mean, do you have any good store? I mean like what is this? It's me and my mates vs zombie. What was legit cans? You interview them for that? Now. No. What happened was legit Kane? So and so I didn't have any bookings in the Dari because we thought it was going to get renewed. So I had like these open sort of four months in my life. I didn't know what to do with me. So I was down about the show being cancelled. And then this is striking movie. I swear to go the budgets like four hundred thousand bucks, and they spent one hundred thousand of it on. It's also a special effects movie. There's like zombies and chins. A lot of money his yeah. Yeah. It was. It was have you watched it. No, okay. Watch the killing hassle. I've never watched anything. I've in pop from the job because always involved in the editing of legit. So but a pop and that I've never once anything about him. But yes, it's it's always good appetites. There was funny comedians now, I don't want to sell you one of the ribbon because these are still might but one of the actors was going through a severe coke addiction. Was it? You know? Checking I got through I'm in the middle of the people in the movie zombie. So it's not gonna be that hard to figure out who had a coke addiction. Oh, no, no, no, no. The the other actor is a guy called Greg fleet who's a renowned heroine addict size through the math. I just love that the cover is you in a yellow neon yellow bowling shirt with a power drill in hand. Killing zombies or the power. I was in a worst movie than that. You probably don't even know what it was. It was just Kelly blazing. Come number six. Yes. That one to Justin and Kelly, just Kelly, Kelly Clarkson and guests. I American idol. I was DJ number two. Hey, it's a credit there. It's a credit. I don't know who was DJ number one. I don't know. But I was so bad. They didn't even I didn't even. Yeah. Exactly. I didn't even make it into the movie. I made it on extras. It has just from Justin the Kelly as two point one out of ten. Generous. How how does the wage zombies? A puck. Yeah. Let's see right into the podcast group at the ten. So just love you never table. News on that has it's not oh four point nine. That's pretty good is any other Bayless movies. You want me to you really are a five. Jim I'm near five. I'm not a picky go. I when it comes to acting. I want to act just put me in something and I'll do killing hassle half four point three, right? All right. Your movie apocalypse is your most successful. What what is the what is the legitimate chits? It's gonna have a seven come on. It was a good show seven point five. Is a eight point two. That head of FX John Lang graph who cancelled it ninety five percent on rotten tomatoes percents around tomatoes. Yeah. A good show the critics and the public liked. It was just the problem was that one of the executives really hated. Or hated may. Or how you did the guy ran the shows. I there was other issues, but everyone who watched the show Connell rate. We got moved to f x x the first thing. And we would find this with the we were the only bit of original programming for a week. And then they brought like sunny over, but we would nubby that stage. I hadn't moved the channel. It was the ALDE primarily soccer channel he was in the fuck and four hundred but then you have to buy that to you had to. Yeah. Qualls who's is from outside of Memphis, right or whatever wherever the hometown is that he's from. They couldn't even get the channel. They're like one of the stars of the show launch it affects still it's the Simpsons gentlemen. Okay. But my my girlfriend's saw watching the show that was very sweet about what I saw you up to tie. He's got getting the fine come on. Good. How long have been dating an actress too long too long dis? What episode are you up to? Started season two. It is the duck the jurors. I want everyone to hear how partial. Yeah. A Z. Tell you what ethnicity are you? Didn't know that. I just thought you attain. No, we haven't. We haven't checked in lightly without good friend, Jack Hackett, Jack Elvis Jenkins. I gotta tell you somebody that caq. It is gyms assistant. Okay. Sparring comedian a very nice we gave him a catchphrase when jugs don't go. Well, you guys can you hack it, right? That's a good catchphrase kinda how can you? Now, this is the thing is Julia who does my hey, who obviously he's a magician because I have done little smoking fucking pumped into my fucking head anyway, Jack had a shitty haircut. And Julia has started after you know, I'm trying to these check by the way, but you don't know this. I slip some money Jack's hair. So Jack has been getting his head done by. Julia who does my head and Jack it's a game Jain jet. Look at you que- if you look like a young Elvis if he was eating all the food. He was aiding when he's an old. Your face literally looks like a paint butter and banana sandwich has it been helping you in the world of dating sorry has your hair been helping you in the world dating no robot. Jack hoffitz is still the big problem confidence. No you need. You can't have that here with no confidence. The competence is seeping down at star with the haircut. Yeah. It'll work wants the last date you've been on. The the hardest subject is wins. The I I if. Was it doesn't even know. Oh my God. He knows the date. Holy shit. Weeks ago? He went on three dates with a girl and. You're the only person I know in L A, and I don't want to Jack kits frame is owned on intend to what he looks like a friend zone type of guy. Just has that look I'm king of the French because he doesn't look rough only guy a reliable guy until he snaps and kills people. Yeah. Gosh about I want to talk about the show that I I you have to do that. And I I've been thinking to myself. You have could Jack get money power and a great pair boots. That's not how they address. How you doing? If you want to be like, Jack, we'll better than Jack go to the nearest computer. Open your internet browser and type in the following Thursday, boots dot com. That's t h you as a Y B O T S dot com. Pick out your favorite pair of beautiful handcrafted goods at until you click checkout feeling all your relation. I like everything else on the genetic all your personal information. It's that easy money power. And a great pair of boots will be yours while results by Mary married. My very you might be Jack or a Michael yo, I'm from Texas. What's your up to go? Money power to gripe boots will all be yours. Why results may vary particularly regarding the money and the power. You would definitely have a great pair of boots this year. Get a pair of boots that will last season after season. Get a pair of boots crafted with the highest quality materials and sold at honest prices. Get a pair of Thursday boots head on Thursday, boots dot com. Money power and a great pair boots around the Clinton White House votes. Jim, great, the dukes. Somebody in the podcast group just posted that they bought their own pair of this is working. They sent me boots. And I I mean, I know we're supposed to give this sounds fake. So you have a pair or call the captains. But last time, I call them the L copy towns, I don't know why I said that's that was. So. But they're really they're really already those those shoes already worn out when you get them. But their brand new kind of thing you go to pair, LA bubbas. Maybe somebody worn them before me. Do you get free one? Maybe they were pretty well. They're a little warm did Jack get some. No, no. He's not getting lanes Kelly Kelly, Jim, and I got him and not Jack. Yes. Your shoes up on the table. What does fate you? I've looked like. Look. I'm a ten we can become shoot shoot about east. Ruined sale. You just made that sound do just yells out. You're on. Is that what you do you're on a diet? And she goes you do. Do you want an appetizer? And she goes show. And then you go. And then they go friends. No, you can't. Even that check. Maybe just no sound. Tony Capri tummy Capri. I was cutting injury. Like don't talk to him. Put the Margaret find down there early Barrasso. You don't understand these jank you sitting next to a seven or a night? He knows. You're you're giving them. Rated himself seven I told me Levi's best life. I think he'd been gorgeous, Tom, right? Since we since we have your artists. It's really bad. Jim sense. We have your fantasy man studio. What do you rate Michael yo in real life? There's no honestly on his e you me. Got a little faddish. He had a kid. We saw the bowl the day. And I went oh us looking really good. But the kids really packed it on foot. The other as gained gain that much weight danger. We saw each other gripe about. Yeah. We were like dad you obeying, Dan anyway. But like a. No, no back in the day. Yo. Yeah. Back in the day. I was rent back in the day. And I'm not talking a long time ago months ago. Change your eleven. But you know, you'd let yourself. You're still so I point five bitch. Okay. Beautiful. Thank you, five solid. Let's guy would show you off anywhere. I fucking. Okay. Thank you. I just eleven to an eight point five. In eight months. Mike, Mike, Mike. I'm very upset. Hey, you're accessible now. Forgot to mention that we bring people on this podcast making. Shittier fives. Good. Told that to me I would be, but you come on used to be perfection, man. Like like black people don't age Asia. People don't as you had everything going for you. What is it? Fucking math. Yes. You know, black don't crack Asian. No raising you've heard that before Asian. I heard that. I never heard of. The whole thing that I should be will join I till age, and then all of a sudden they can futures right. They go they go nothing. Nothing nothing and then the fucking like reading tarot cards. The next day. They wake up like they go from looking twenty two like one hundred twenty in like a night. I want to talk about diversity in Hollywood. Right. And it's important that we have it. And I'm very angry about something in particular. What I watched the movie crazy rich Eisen lease diverse film. I've ever seen guys. With roy. For a watch. Sure. Well, white people. Was three white people at the beginning at the hotel where they said, they couldn't stay there. And then they bought with villains. What am I people have to be Costas billing? I'd say the movie yet. No, no, crazy, rich Asian. I like I like crazy at Joe's. Great, dad. Yeah. Jimmy. Tell you what they show many is is that film. If you're an Asian it's called crazy shit. I'm all for it. It anyway. There are so many is equal coming out. So many Asians in that film. I'm telling you what. Mine if you're an actor in Hollywood that feel feel sad careers going. No it I'm trying to get in part two. I wanna be a number two blazing blazers place. Jessica Kelly or no. See I would be the diversity somehow. I eight. Chinese food. I had eight and sim medical marijuana. Mike Mike on the defensive now Chinese. Really? So I m edible marijuana before. I watched crazy rich is probably may with marijuana more than any other drug is very suggestive on it. So I'm watching that film is he's like intense saying where they play Mahjong. Tend to my going. I should learn Mahjong. I thought that'd be a good game for les now by getting the MAs John. The old Asian ladies. Bigoted, man, I would made other fucking. I like a black companion guy and like someone from Taiwan. I would have like a group mode. Be like, your tore. I would have that. I would I would have a multicultural group Mahjan frame. And we would play for money. And then I would say I could've gotten Michael. Yo yo by didn't go fat. Eight point five now, you know, taking these shoes should because. Used to be so. Right up for that one. Oh my goodness. That's my thing. Come on, man. Not. Just just weren't here. And you weren't on the show. Remember k you were mentioning wise as his fantasy guy. Michael, I'm Nagin yet nagging. Yes. To want him. But now you want me. Do you want me? I was too needy. But yeah, someone. How can I Jim? How can I get into gyms? Well, I'm gonna go home and work out, you you and I point five but with your personality must six. I'm going lower and lower. I've got a leave pretty fluid. So I could say at six. I love you, Mike. I love you too. Oh, there's going to be we'd. It's about man love. Well, we did a show today. Do you wanna talk about this show? Okay. Watch it. Oh, fifty fifty episodes. Congratulations. Jay, we're not meant to mention, Nick. Okay. Okay. Well, what are you? Forty nine. Congratulations on episodes. I still can't read a teleprompter. When I saw you did get I'm alright shockingly good at the teleprompter in a southern accent, though. Oh, I find. If you read in like if I do anything like Alan poetry. I can read all die. Or if I raid something is Michael Caine? I'll never money power a pair of boots. Well, that's a great parapets attract you. How if you read it? Shuba is like is like people who stutter right when people and then they can sing perfectly. If I do an act saying they used to be the singer in Britain called guys Gareth gates Gareth gates went on like the x factor. A UK alu. And he came and he was like he's like he's like. And they went what. Sing a song. And then he sang good. He wasn't the best thing on the show. But everyone's like good for him. Absolutely started and tie that was your hot throat when you were growing up. What it you're really young? You still young I sixteen I should get you back to your parents. Yeah. He sold three point five million records and really he's known for having a stutter. Talked about Japan. Depressing. The album was two hours long one. He's a good looking guy. I guess. He wasn't. He wasn't good thing. I'm gonna tell you anything, but he had a little. So what do you rate this guy house kind of all over the map some pictures? He looks good looks like what he looks like. Oh, what he looks like it's being that's not a good pick. No. It's been a little tummy. Over he's lost. He's he's the when he was young good looking. Yeah. I would give him. If Michael yo is an eight five five, I would give this guy night point six. Oh, Jesus the stutter extra point. It makes it makes you feel any better Jim and Joe coy or Jim you rated yourself what a five and Joe quake gave himself a six. Because. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You gotta be better. Like one hundred percent when we. Great personality. You guys must hang up playing Mahjong. We looked down the street from each other. Oh, yeah. He should. He should he. Yeah. Are we city shut up? Maroma? I'm now going to become a sex offender. The site. That's how you go to sex offender six you can find me, I I would be in your Bush's wanking and pissing. For a long time the pissing doesn't get me off. But you have to go to the bathroom occasionally. Okay. Okay. Interesting. We should hang Michael yellow hangman. I love you. I love you too. And we have sons we do. Yeah. We leave the room. Get outta here. Like, we can get we babysit or the kids have to hang out. Got a hot tub. Tell backs are going on, you know, whatever. Yeah. We'll get some food. Yeah. We'll go to aroma, what type of food. Do you like like all types of food like oh ties? The place. I don't mind paying really, but it's not a gentleman for me to let you pay. So we know we dot okay. We'll do that. In a stray that means, I know. Wow. Screen. Yeah. Something to sued the woods. Ice-cream? Always does the trick. I don't even know what the point of this podcast is well, let's just run out of things real quick. You don't make. We talked about Mars bam act to Sean Spicer, April. Ryan interview. Oh, I love this Jones buzz. Okay. There we go. So I was gonna keep reading stuff to you. Jay thing. So I'm Sean Spicer, an EMMY potty one side, and he was very nice. You like them. I I'll tell you this about Sean Spicer. I don't hate him. I don't like what he did like where he put his morals. But I look man have you ever been the fat kid at school who wasn't accepted into groups? And then all of a sudden you're in the coup group. And then you're doing things that you don't particularly law. Now, we have established stopping gone backwards. Mark Mark, Mike, Michael you'll experience about I'm looking at maybe eight months. Then you'll know what it's like. So do you want to get the backstory to the whole and everything I can do it? So I mean, it doesn't matter right there. Okay. Okay. So we were flying to DC to do some other field pieces than ever use those fell through and then you had met Sean Spicer previously. And so was this a tax you just texted him and say, hey. So then you end up doing interviews. Sean Spicer on grind. The White House press room spray, and we saw major Garrett there, a friend. Now, you gotta give you go use spicy credit. My we were meant to guy over there to talk to Anderson Bernie Sanders Bernie Sanders pulled out while I was on the plane which was weird because I was on me for a second just about to come. Keep going and he stopped. He was like I should come for everyone. Everyone should be able to have com. I know you're anal bleeding should be paid for by the people. It should be free for everyone. All the people on the plane. Anyway. Anyway. So so he didn't. And then we got to Washington I is very angry. Andrew one talk who's about production guys who providing producers and then. Thirty mostly claimed that anyways. So I was I was angry at him. And I was angry at Scott for other reasons, right Scott, who's the show runner out of the show is Scott how you you drinking a shot at night three get fucking shod tonight. I am I don't have an assistant wait a sec. Wait a sec. Okay. I tell you I I'm always made about Scott. And I say that they may be a chance to these guy. But I believe him when he says he's not he's married with kids, and he has a boyfriend that says, he's not. So I did pull you out today. Because we in the episode we filmed the thing that we're going to have in the next step aside. The gym Jeff Retz came back the the drill later. Hired and paid more money than NFL. So we had the twenty five then say. Yeah. More. So they were all dancing in the in the outside of Scott's windows, and he'd shut the blinds. I've always had I didn't see them. And then shut my blind. Yes. I didn't. I didn't go girls. There was there was there was goes like like tops like hot pads dancing around and you went into these noodles, and he was fucking noodles like a fucking caveman. Anyway. So we went to Bernie Sanders cancelled we get there. And I this is like one of the more regrettable things about I went. I know sure spots. I'd say Sean to his credit did get us into the White House. Did give us any of you. We went softening we guide out pinions on holiday, but we still didn't necessarily know if we were just gonna run that by itself. We had that pay sitting in the can for maybe five six months wasn't doing anything. We thought it was going to do nothing. And then we bought in Neil from ninja toady movie. April. Ryan it was right after we. Oh, all right. Throw the new the new boy new is back. Is nicer city in Hollywood, nor the original April. I knew was a redhead in any am I kid watches the ninja turtle when the new is I Rice's for pointing out that. Race facts. You're good. Yeah. In south. Hey, but they still keep the turtles grain. What does that tell you? Say interviewed April Ryan, and you know, we knew. We interviewed Sean, it was a good interview. But then I think it was like we can use this because Jim was tough on him. But then two years later was like the kids in cages, and Sean Spicer is all over the news saying like, I think this is fine. Trump's doing great. Yeah. We of buried it. Like fungi showing you shouldn't say that about the kids in the cage is he actually came to one of our coding show news and just showed up now on notice. He's very smoke. Anyway. So so then we we interviewed I pro-. And are I'm gonna say this on the back hit it off. Yeah. April had a very good report where they and so every time I talked to tasers little bit. She would laugh, but then she'd be like, what do you think about fake news? And then she turned into like savvy like when you hear the term fake news. It really does repress what happened. And then I was like what happened to that guy in the Saudi Arabia embassy? You got kids a colleague of mine was like she she knew and to be serious, and she knew when they have fun. Yes. You have fun. Logged your look good. And then I think we still made the fun part about the pieces where you're going back and forth away. Sean Spicer about Trump's weight and how we knew it was a lie, and he still wouldn't admit it. He's not working for money. You still wouldn't have met like. Yeah. Zion is on the right now, I will give. Let's go million. I would give him David Hasselhoff. I would I would give him a million dollars. No, no. No. No. No, no. That's too much too much. No. I I will give him a million dollars within the next month. Donald Trump stands on a scale, and he's with in three pounds of the white that he says that he is. So if Donald Trump is listening, and he jumped on a scale, you would be fine. Donald Trump staff listens to this all the time. So so if Donald Trump is listening as he is the white that he says he is and jumps in a sky. Oh, I will give a million dollars to Donald Trump to to any charity of Donald Trump's choose. Okay. Okay. I like that. Well, let's hope he doesn't wear that much. And other than that to either way. Publicity. Anyone's like, he's heavy. He's not like what Margot's done. Because I'm like three fifty or something right now. But I think he made a good point that you made was like, basically like if you're willing to lie about your something that we can see that. He's clearly about everything. What did he say? He was to thirty five to thirty five thirty seven. He's three inches told me to ten how how tall ten he's like six four six six say that he's lying about his height to because he goes pictures. Listen, he's the same. Let's say six eight these three inches total than me, right and twenty five pounds of all. Are you fucking Tibo is six four to thirty seven. They just take a look. Take a look. They started pulling up things that album pull holes had the same dimensions allegedly as don't try. Athletes. Have you out of your fucking tell you, Jim? I'm six foot six. Okay. I'm six three. Twenty god. I've just fell in love with you three to you. You really are specimen though. You really like I wanna I wanna have more of a friendship, right? I want us to hang out. And then obviously, we come to my house. We watch a movie some bean theater now that Martin's got more money than me. You know? Theater room to know. I got a kid a baby spend it all on that. He's not gonna be able to hang after the podcast, you're gonna have to make another. I think that someone wants to stay. So my my mic, right? Are we going to be friends? Jim I wanna be I do to have always gotten along. Absolutely. Joined fuck me. I've rented a baby thing I want to I didn't know big pile. I gotta tell you my baby story. Are you mad at me nine? Oh, okay. Okay. I'm gonna I'm gonna tell you baby story back in the day. When George Lopez tonight, I did live tonight. It was the only time in America that I did any stand up on television that wasn't a special, and I would never do it. Again. It wasn't a good fit for me. I just gotten here. And I thought if I could do. And so the other rights stage was a sixteen year old Justin Bieber, and he was there with his mother. And he's mother into is the same age as me. Oh, yeah. And he's mother was kinda hitting on me other in his mother's. Good looking. Good looking good. Look at Kearney hitting me. Right. So I'm sitting in the dressing room. It's me, Justin, babe and Justin babies mala. Right. And I'm sitting there going off. Fuck me. This is this is weird right sitting there, and like my Naser that stage, and she will hate me for saying as I nineteen now. Anyway state. She was an eleven year old ten year old go in a strident who's a huge Justin Bieber fan. And I never did this celebrities I've met celebrities. I've I know take I tried to take photos trying to be cool. And then I said look Johnston. I said he's a deal. I have a nascent Australia viruses to call the now. And you spike, two seconds. I'll be the greatest Dunkel in the world. Could you for me? And he did say the words anything for a belieber. Right. Good. Look Justice, not a bad guard. No Johnston's a great garner story. Right. So I ring up my niece on speaker fine. And I got higher they semi edgy Ronco. Jim now, I wanna speak. If I got now on my what a big Justin Bieber fan, you I and she goes lock you many are like one direction. Speaker lock him anymore. I like one direction I went. Anyway. 'cause megan. Oh my God. Catch up later. I I have a story about me and Katy Perry on the set of Sesame Street with Elmo where she wore a threesome. Yeah. She wore this revealing top. She just broke up with Russell brand. I thought she was beautiful. We were flirting. She asked me if the cameras were off, and I said, yes. And then she farted like I never heard a one. It was just a. Sure, it wasn't Elmer. No Elmo looked at me. They'll fuck is going. It was in that. She just looks at me laughs and runs away. Then I go gold. Katy perry. Farting. Yeah. It's the things she does. Fun like in front of random they'd Ross. It was like she used to finally two months. I I was happy in the beginning. It was filed in the beginning. But then the flatulence became too much. There was a wind in my city. I would be lying in bed, and then the sheets would ruffle up onto my face. I'll be doing. Pretty good. Yeah. You love it. That was your instinct to Google Katy Perry far because I was like you got to be more of this thing. Argo for a white. No, I I go back six months ago. Eight months. But I like you when he was just on the way down. Ten point one before I wanna make sure we get us where the pockets of over. We we earlier in the season mentioned in, you know, t five transit for everybody to follow them. And we got their Twitter followers up. I don't know fifty thousand percent hood ever to almost eight thousand two thousand eight hundred sixty the first day that we did that it was one thirty. And now, they're almost eight thousand everyday you go there, it's the we're we're still tagged and post like wrote it today, smooth ride as always and Bubba. So throughout the season when we've had guests here, we've we've had them say lines. We had Bill Burr Dr drew Bob saga. Gabriel glazes Molin and Ackerman, Brian Cowen, Kerry or memory scandal. Tommy, John again, and we had a couple of people that we we film up. Come out. Yeah. I might be. So we lost ginger Gonzaga who's afraid of of mine, and we lost come out. So he's lost. Like, I. We all have our guy. He was in there. God, we still got mall. The fuck it blood swayed anyways. So we each had them say like kinda random line about five and piece together an action movie trailer called t five t furious, and it came out pretty good. It was funny. It was like it's like, so it's just like really doesn't make sense. If you don't if you just watched it in a vacuum. But for fans of the show, I think that'll be up later this week. I'm sure it was like a digital thing. But if you watched the show t five transit trailers so wanted to make sure to follow that. And so Michaels got ahead out. So we're wrapping up anyway. Okay. About to start eating already. End of the podcast, meaning a protein style. And I wanted to mention one more time, Michael yo you can hear him on Sirius XM channel one. Oh, five the Michael yo eleven to one Monday through Fridays hits one Hollywood four to seven Monday through Fridays on Sirius XM and November twenty seventh go on Amazon, and I tunes checkout. Blazin his special. Michael. Thank you for being on the ship. Eight point five. Yeah. Not not a ten point five and. Oh, I loved it. It was so fun. It's no politics. It's all about feeling. It's going to be itunes and Amazon. I'm gonna watch you. All right. Thank you, November twenty six and then we'll we'll go out on our date. Jim. You don't run away? I'll still be covered in come. Okay. For a for me, please. If you would anyone out there that was in the Tampa area. I'm going to be at side splitters November twenty third to the twenty fifth. If you're in Tampa, please go there there's ticket links on my website. That's like next week. So book. Yep. We know that. And then one more thing we were going to have a guest on today. Phil Nichol, but we couldn't they run out here. But he was going to promote some shows that he's weakened lyric Hyperion this weekend Thursday, Friday, Saturday nickel. Yeah. He's going to be on the podcast next week because he's coming in to do that. So, but I just wanted to give Michelle for a show this week. So if you're in LA, and you wanna see a really really good comic when you say. So Jim one of the best combing. Yeah. Ever lived Phil Nichol is going to be at the lyric on this Thursday through Saturday, eight pm Thursday, Friday and ten pm Saturday and other than that, you know, the normal thing that I say that I don't even know where it's at. Oh, please subscribe and views on apple podcasts about if I Google play Stitcher. We've had a lot of this memorized by now it's different every week. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Wherever you listen to podcasts. All right. That's it. Thank you, Michael. All right. Good. This has been a comedy central podcast.
The Jim Jefferies Show Podcast
Aired 3 weeks ago 82:49
Jonestown - The Murder | 126
You know, people say necessity is the mother of invention. But that's not always true. Sometimes the mother of invention is advertising. Yeah. Or pure accident. How about ego maniacal delusion? Absolutely. Or just a desperate longing. To be cool. I'm Robert lamb, and I'm Joe McCormick. You're the host of the science podcasts stuff to blow your mind. And now we're branching off into the exploration of invention. Invention is the story of human history told one piece of technology at a time the things we made and how they made us invention publishes every Monday, listen and subscribe to invention on apple podcasts the iheartradio app or wherever you find your podcasts. He'd evening. Here's what's happening. We're interrupting special broadcasting to bring you the special report a new C news break on the peoples. Temple mass suicides and Jonah and the murder of congressman Leo Ryan. I would mention the bodies of at least four hundred nine men women and children some shot to death. Most apparently self poisoned have been found that the Guyana jungle camp of people stem to aim was to build a utopian society. The peace to beauty the sense of accomplishment, and responsibility and comrades here. We are making a place of refuge for all of you here. None of this would have been possible. Had it not been for Jim Jones. Even a lot of hard news people reacted in horror and disbelief the word on everybody's lips was shades of offshoots. John still missing. Elation that many of them may have been marched out into John shot. How does the church go so astray how does one man hold so much power over nine hundred plus people that they will lay down their lives in the lives of their children for them tonight. We talked the Jonestown mass murder and its legacy on hysteria. Fifty one. The shaef. I'm disturbed. Credible. Historical panic. I think we're getting into a weird area. Hysteria. You can't handle the truth through. This is stereo fifty one. The truth is out. A two one find a tear coming for you. Look that has one of them now. Welcome into stereo to the podcast never met him. Jones. What we know agai who knows the guy who knows Jim Belushi this. This is Terry fifty-one speak for yourself. I met him. You weren't even around when he was around. I literally three years ago. Whatever lets you sleep at night, Jim Belushi. He's also from lower fourth is. And you went to carbon. Oh, he did. Yep. We're just step behind that. We could get him. Canny way broadcasting from the lower for it to mention otherwise known as Chicago, we're your hosts and head investigators in this twisted tale Brent hand in jungle for the third voice. You're here. He is our resident drunk also robot. I built make our pockets better who instead just gets drunk and kills cats. He is the one and the only thing the Lord conspiracy. But don't forget also screw up the show on purpose. If you were giving my resume get it, right anyway, speaking of drunk, I need your help. What? Now, dude, we told you we're not help you with your new booze business. It's a startup. Thank you. And I know you won't you're an idiot. But I know someone who will I'm going on shark tank, your what did I stutter I'm going on shark tank? How in the world are you getting on there? Pretty simple gonna take a new down there. Pay the entrance fee and go on entrance fee to be on. What are you talking about? Well, it costs money to get in. You should know. It's your money whole hold on. Hold on. I think. Got this one see, but you're taking a new era where exactly are you going to be on shark tank? The shed aquarium think I'm starting the pieces together. So you heard that you could get startup investment from shark tank. So I'm gonna guess here a wild, guess you googled shark tank. Chicago's is that right? And you're going to the shit aquarium to beyond a shark tank. Got it. I think it's great idea, buddy. I'll even pay for the you already. Did it's on the way. And I'm really let's finish into our topic. And guests last week, we told you about the monster. Jim Jones this week. We're going to get into what actually happened at Jonestown Guyana. And if you listen to our last episode, you'll know our guests did such a mediocre job. I kid that we invited them back this week. I back in the lower for at the mention like he never left because he likely never left, Mr. Joe pack. His name is pecker back sit near waiting for re-gather. I turn the light on here. Yeah. I didn't. Well, we got other bumper to play. Chris. His competition for space in your hearts here again and Lavan, Chris I'm just here for the socialist paradise. And last, but not least back in the lower forthr- only the second time, but likely already more respected than either of the other two. Oh, I believe it to Mr. Christopher Markham. Thank you very much. And I'm here for the Monkees if you have any for sale. Yeah. Heard the monkeys for sale. Hey, you know, you only have to pay me. Just let me tell you will story thing, I'm running you keep this going. You're gonna you're gonna get another BJ and the bear reference. So last week, we told you about Jim Jones, the monce responsible for this horrific tragedy. We're getting the meat of it. The actual Jonestown the murders the massacre, whatever you wanna call it. We're going to break down. Just what happened how it happened and it's legacies. But first let's start off. I think the best places started some cold hard facts and stats, you know, what kind of tragedy were actually dealing with in case. You're not familiar, and even if you've heard of it, you might not know exactly what went down. So on November eighteenth of nineteen seventy eight the mass murder suicide of members of the California people still call took place at the urging of their leader Jim Jones in that's play spoiler here. But that's what this is all leading to and it happened in the Jonestown agricultural commune in Jonah and the death toll exceeded nine hundred including in this is disgusting. Three hundred people aged seventeen and under many of which were infants or toddlers, and this is the largest mass death suicide in American history. Like, we said in the intro to last week's episode. Before nine eleven was the largest civilian casualty of event, and then after nine eleven second largest, we're going to talk about this these hindsight's twenty twenty but how does averse church group who sit out to build as they said. And they thought they were really doing paradise on earth, a utopian society free of racism and hatred in unleashing fro intents and purposes hell on earth that culminated in one of the greatest crimes that are mind time, we're going to try to answer that I don't know how well we're going to do, but we're going to try, and it is it's a disgusting story. So how does one man I think let's start by going John? How does one man steer so many so far stray I think we need to start with just a cult. And so let's define what a cult. Right. Cult noun a system of religious veneration and devotion directed toward a particular figure or object. Schick we actually went over this in our Heaven's Gate episode. But it's a good refresher. Or? Relatively small group of people having religious beliefs or practices, regarded by others as strange or sinister finally a misplaced or excessive admiration for a particular person or thing. Sweet. And you know, it's funny. I think the key word there is excessive and you know, of course, that's a that's an objective word. Right. But it is certainly the keyword third. One is the one that fits the most in this whole Jim Jones, and the Jonestown story one that fits in most colts. Exactly, exactly. So I tried to say this last time. I don't know how if I got my point across how eloquent you're no one sits out to join a cult. I hope you might start out to try to build one. But no one sits join one. But some of us do have plans to build them with so many find themselves in one and Jonestown of the people simply will it was no different. These people found themselves in a Colt. Do you think they knew it at least towards the end, or do you think the reply I think some of them, of course, knew it? And I think they. They fell for this guy for his quote authenticity. And and saying what's on his mind. But also the 'cause that's that the 'cause I think there's so many of them that knew what Jim was doing was wrong knew that Jim is probably bad person yet the cause was what they really cared about. And they saw Jim as person that was going to make that happen or they were truly just frightened. You know, mama. Don't like tattle. He got out people along that line stitches, right alum at one of questioning, I I'm always curious to hear you guys feedback on this of like one of the things that strikes me as unusual with the Jim Jones story is typically when you think of some sort of whether it's an old religious group, a, quote, unquote, Kalt, whatever or even just a bad person doing bad things, you think of recently, you know, like something like the Jerry Sandusky situation in recent years or even on a larger scale in older skill. You think? Of Scientology most people don't look at that and say, Jerry Sandusky acted alone. And there was no one involved could enable him we all know like lots of people are in prison because of that or you look at Scientology like no one says, everyone is following the deceased leader L Ron Hubbard. There's this group of people that sort of run things I never hear or read or see anything about that. With Jim Jones. It's sort of like there's him, and there's the followers. Do you guys know of any evidence was there sort of an ill? Yes. Greer was absolutely Ebeling the called the planning commission and at first planet commission was a small number. But a group about one hundred at one point, and it became if you were part of the planning commission, you are part of the chosen group, it became a kind of a higher class a caste system within the temple and those planet commission members were able to mete out punishments and do gyms benefit especially when he got really bad with drugs. Then most some of those people really came. Before and later on when we're at Jonestown, we can talk more about Rick Sarasin and Carolyn Layton and more. Now, I don't know if this is true of every member of the planning commission, but certainly a lot of them being the planning commission was kind of like being chief of staff at the White House. You're not going to be there. The whole time the leaders there like e burn out and a lot of the planet commission did a lot of them eventually left and turned and turned on Jones. And we're one of the reasons that eventually the congressman congressman Ryan win to Jonestown because of some of the information that the former plan commission members and relatives, right? So so is the thought that some of them ended up becoming so ensconced in it that they are equally culpable to him. Or is the thought that no they were the blind Lou. Well, I think that if I may sorry, I think the thought is they got a taste of the same. Same sort of power. And they saw through Jim as his faculties are diminishing because of the drugs they could start to step up and take the place of some of that power. Right. The thing about it is we're looking at these people. How do you follow a Munster? How do these people that are these planning commission? How do you follow? These people will the temple was very active in humanitarian causes in its community in a time of prejudice. And hate it was a welcome escape a very, welcome escape and escape was the actual plan of intially. And when I mean that is for over three years Jones and all the people worked with the iana government to create Jonestown. And so in the fall of seventy three after this critical newspaper articles by Lester consulting, and the defection of eight timbale members Jones and the temple attorney, Tim stone prepared an immediate action content. Agency plan for responding to a police are media crackdown. He knew it was coming at one point. They were going to have something put down. So the plan listed varies options. We we talked about, you know, they were they were looking at places in Brazil included, maybe fleeing the candidate or the Caribbean. Missionary post they looked at Barbados Trinidad places like that. They actually quickly chose Ganda a lot of it had to do with his extradition treaties with the US. So he knew it was a place that he was going to be able to stay meaning the US could not demand him back. Right. It was also one of the few countries in South America. That was all ready socialist. Yes. Yeah. They embraced it in Georgetown, the capital Russia had their own consulate there. It was very much. It was a very pro communist in socialist place. So by October Seventy-three, the directors of the temple Jones in his in his cronies pass a resolution to establish an agricultural mission there. Why guillano well? We kind of said that because its own soul spouted, whose they were moving further left during the selection process, but former temple member Tim Carter who plays into a lot of these stories about Tim Carter was a key figure in some people questioned a lot of the things he says, but you know, he comes forward with a lot say that reasons for choosing the temple views of perceived dominance of racism and multinational corporations in the US government. They wanna get away Carter said the temple concluded the Jonah, an English speaking socialist country with a predominantly indigenous population and with a government, including prominent black leaders would afford black tipple members, a peaceful place to live a paper. That's great English. Viki is is key as well. Let's be honest, not a very powerful government. So you you have to know that they perceived that and knew that they could kind of get away with what they wanted as long as there is some money degree some poems. When you see that when you are. A person who likes to take advantage of situations as Jim Jones has proven to be obviously Gannon's gonna look attractive. So he kept injecting himself into politics everywhere. He wasn't a politician, but he got behind these politicians with and also there were times when he would send temple members to forge relationships like romantic relationships with the government. I didn't know that was the name for they they had a name women that provide like literally were there to provide these services Ma what's the? The children got the same thing. And they were floor flirty. Fishers was children of God. Yes. Yeah. He uses. Yes. He looked Yana. He saw it as small poor in independent enough for him to easily obtain influence and official protection, which he got from the prime minister because they aligned in their views. And it's something he in their pocket books. Usage is typically the prime minister that one of the women like was specifically assigned to him. And this is what kind of differentiates him from a lot of other cult leaders is he enjoyed public support, and he had contact with some of the highest level politicians the United States, especially when he's in San Francisco, we talked about he was with Rosalyn Carter in the mayor's in on nail government. Since you know, he was probably the most powerful person in the history of America. Walter mondale. Yeah. So in seventy four Jones and the temple negotiated lease of over thirty eight hundred acres of land in the jungle it's about fifty miles west of the capital of Georgia house also northwest really bringing down the dumb choice. It was such a it's isolated it had terrible soil. So it couldn't really grow much the nearest body of water was seven fuck and miles or eleven kilometers away on mud roads and keep things. Interesting. Jonestown location wasn't too far from the Guineas disputed border with Venezuela. And the actual one of the reasons prime minister was yet take this is thought if he put an American presence in American citizens there, it might deter military incursion that they thought was coming at anytime Joe crossed on that. What year was it that we is collective humanity decided that it might be smarter to build our encampments are our cities. Are living quarters close to water. I can tell you with absolute certainty. There is no year because it literally forever wasn't that with. When was the first year them home? The light sparks in the mind of the first man, what was together around something water, literally say, it wasn't Iraq. It wasn't a tree hip late. But there was probably one group that gathered around a rock. We haven't heard called Atlanta. Atlanta where the coolest thing about the city is it's about an hour and a half away from savannah, you're gonna say our half away from the George guide stone. Oh, so they decide this is the perfect place. Let's build fifty members begin the construction Jonestown. And that say it was rough. Oh talking. This showed up there built a shack to to sleep in. And they had to clear out the jungle Viann. The videos and pictures and advertisements to convince the people that go there. It was like literally straight outta lake in nineteen seventies timeshare scam. Oh, look at this paradise. That's a waiting you. And then it was none of those. I fifty they literally they said they had to work, you know, eight hour days they were clearing out by his what was Kim Kim Jong or Kim Jong Il's father. I came over to. Yeah. He used his his principle of eight hours of work, eight hours of study, eight hours of sleep. And that was how they Jones envisioned that this would the best day that they ever had after months of work was when they got a bulldozer. Right. I mean, why does videos are amazing? They're just such a testament to the fortitude, and the will of those people they call them high nears, the first people that the red Jonestown if you look later, if you never knew that story, and you just looked at the buildings the clearings, and you find out that they did that all themselves and that they did get some heavy machinery later on. And that they worked with some locals to figure out what kind of crops that what they had to do. Right. Oil to grow anything at all anything. Right, right. But the fact that they were able to have what they head right? So they cleared most of that out without bulldozer by. Very I it was like machetes and hand fucking hang. Then later, the the Ray fat some that that those are some strong people, but the whole of the doing this. He's spinning this yarn of the socialist paradise sanctuary, and he's also working with the the officials the government, and they were getting granted permission important certain things duty free. That was another thing you can bring things plus later, payoffs helped him safeguard shipments of other things like firearms and all the drugs. He was using the end you can bring things preferably guns and drugs. Whichever you bring a lot of those. And if you're not familiar territory, it's it's worth noting. Chooses at no point when any of the the certain build up was going on was Jim Jones actively living. There was not right. No. So there are all of these people living there, and they say that once they got established once they had a schoolhouse once they had multiple living quarters once they had a big utility kitchen and off ball field was actually had a they had softball field. Yeah. A long day a laundry behind the kitchen because you could dry your clothes from the heat from the oven. I mean, but they said it was kind of like paradise to them. It was it was laid back breakfast would be this leisurely breakfast of biscuits and coffee, and everyone was just really happy and they worked they worked tails off, but they were all friends it was kind of communal living, and they were building something together. They were building something together. And then Jim Jones would visit he visited wants to make one of these propaganda videos that you were talking about and the atmosphere would completely chain, right? What you would go from this amazing happy place to this dark cloud looming over in these are the tips that they use about their leader's visit and but up until then it was a completely different place in in. They would use people's experiences as propaganda to get others to come there. But then they kept sending more people there. Right. And he's using this as go there. Go there go there for a reason things are going to stray in the US for him times. Not great. And we talked about this in the last one tipple members were being regularly humiliated. Beaten blackmailed coarser brainwashed into sunning over their possessions, including their homes to the church black members. And members of other minority groups were convinced that if they left the people's temple, they would be rounded up by government concentration camps and exterminated that some that he'd preached them. They believe in family members were kept apart in courage to inform on one another. That sounds like another religion that's out there. But we're going to leave a nameless right now. And this did not go unnoticed. That's a big thing. Pass members in family members of people that were active in the people's temple began to protest and the people that were past members were really good at protesting mirror. We learn that. Yeah. Exactly. They were rounded up on buses until the protests. They knew how to do it. And so they begin to ask questions to reach out to thirties to do it in a way that actually got results, and it did so in seventy seven after members of the press begin to ask questions about Jones operation, he kinda realize it's time to cut and run the writing was on the wall. And I think that this wasn't just a gradual thing, you know, we're John making good point about how the people were at Jonestown at first once they got kind of stabilized. Right. And I think that goes to a point where it wasn't just about Jim wasn't about religion. It was about the cause. And it was about socialism. And is about the political aims that they had because they acted a certain way. In Jones's absence. There wasn't any of the punishments. There wasn't any of this that Ryan nights about that stuff. When he wasn't there. And it literally sounds like Cisco in the sixties all missing or some Allman brothers and their hair. Yeah. And also that they were working towards having enough acidity and and infrastructure support to have as many of the people has wanted to come. But as we're going to find everything happened in a much accelerated way, and that so it was it was meant to. Yeah. Right. It was meant to be holding one hundred or two hundred people at that time nineteen seventy seven, and then all of a sudden and got accelerated we keep talking about media attention. But there's one specific article that got it done, and it was an article in new west magazine. Interesting story, this came from another member of his inner circle the publisher of new west magazine called Jones and said, I just want you to be where we're going to publish this tomorrow. This is an expose in. It's not exactly. Gratifying on on your on your church, and it says her Begum, and he read them. He read them the article there speakerphone Jim is looking around and people in the room say he's looking more and more stricken as they go on visually, Jim rights note. And and pass it around to all the people in the room. And all the note says we leave tonight and leaves night him and several hundred people left with the six fucking hours. That's how much poli hat the article calls out almost everything that we talked about in the first episode from his beating of members his extortion plans every and hadn't all of these people are most of them given all of their money and their possessions to him by then anyway, have what he says relieving like, okay? So boom, he takes several hundred people to Jonestown, and it's up and running for for better for worse. Like, you said, we're ready for a few hundred people will guess what two hundred now we're bringing a lot more than that. So you know, what let's. Head to break when we come back. Let's talk what life was like there when this huge influx came in. Because he was scared. I think that's best way to put it coming up next on hysteria. If you want scared. Doubt. Tell you live your life sales. Yep. But not this. Are we alone aliens really exist the existence of extraterrestrial life is captured our collective imagination for generations, those who claim to have had a counters believe what they saw. But what does the evidence show, John? Well, our listeners will know that it shows aliens are real, no, I'm kidding. Actually, there's a new show from the park cast network that explores this exact phenomenon in detail. It's called extraterrestrial in exam is these stories with a critical eye analyzing possible scientific explanations and determine what really might have happened, and whether or not we are really alone spent over one hundred million dollars researching UFO's that we know of and have nothing to show for it. 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But I also don't know how to and well guess what there's someone's going to teach you, and they're gonna teach you in the jungles Agana because Jones going to take you to paradise and YouTube, and you know, how you know, it was or utopia Jim said other than that bananas. I can't tell you how many videos I. Hannah's so many bananas and somebody mentions of bananas small ones large ones. There's just bananas everywhere. Well, he was playing maybe. His new monkey business. The head have bananas. So question does Mr. mugs. Does Jim bring Mr. mugs the sky or where did Mr. mugs come from throwing bubbles because I didn't see any wasn't. I think you and then he went down. Mr. Mr. mugs was given dose of catharsis. And he's like this. He's outta here. I'm I'm fucked a lot of comedy in Jonestown what with all the banana peels. Hey, pretty great. Just like, Chris, Ed? This is a big thing. He comes and the showed the arrival he's coming in. And they were talking about it in boom. This dark cloud looms over them and Suzy gets there, and they said life just changed overnight. People said the atmosphere Kabila changed morale dipped as it would movie night, you're talking about cancelled in favor of Soviet propaganda shorts. He would play an documentaries on American social problems also movies, by the way. So let's not get too crazy. What are the chances? Actually, it just happened to be that what? Right when he came. It was when the seasons we're turning to winter like, no. It's like the dark. It was cold the atmosphere changed or from my guy. He just shows. So last week we had movie night. Would we watch Butch and Sundance? Oh, what are we going to show? What are we going this week Marxism in you has? Why you don't want your own property? Documentary on the long March the other thing of it. The other thing that really changed when he got there is he had all these bureaucratic requirements, so labor sept- for other resources in nicely bureaucratic. It's not even there outside of it. It's also this huge infrastructure inside Jonestown buildings started bawling into disrepair weeds growing like shit was just getting overgrown, right? And we have to say this to that when we were talking about the pioneers, and that they had it stabilized, and they had it going on. And they felt pretty good about things. That's because there were one hundred people there and all one hundred of them could work once the eight hundred nine hundred thousand people are there. I large portion of them are elderly cannot work. A large portion of them are children cannot work. So all the work has to be done by just a small number of people. Yeah. And you take the the the workforce in the new divided up to a lot of them are also taking care of the elderly take the sick children the children. And even the children they're talking about the you're in like one room like shacks thirty three kids to a person. Right. Well, the. Not to mention the dysentery the broke out that bowl that only shitting like crazy out literally dysentery and fever was breaking out rampant. The Oregon trail was a paradise quarters. Were my oxen died the quarters were basic four walled structures five. All we got him. The lower the mention. Of all the things I've said you decided zone in on that one. Yep. You're right. I meant meant to house like four people, and they would have ten or twenty people in one of these same these same shacks? They always say we'll Jones lived with other people doing he did. But not like that any also in his shack. He had was called the house he'd sodas and snacks and. Meet which was a blessing. If you could get meat while you were there things like that. School and study time they were there. There was that there was night lectures for dolts. And but they turned before it was a good thing. They were learning. They were doing what they're doing. It turns discussions about revolution in enemies with lessons focus on Soviet alliances Jones crisis, and he talks about these mercenaries going to be sent by Tim stow, and who had defected from the people's temple and turned against the group Easton in these mercenaries. They're gonna kill everyone caravan of mercenaries. Yes. And the horrible Tigers all these animals these camps describing if you go out into the jungle you will be eaten immediately. Right. The telling the kids kids are being told these horrible stories about don't go anywhere near the jungle. Choose going to run into the jungle. They just got off a sixteen hour work day. They said if you worked at twelve hour that was like, whoa. What did you do? That was awesome. Like, you're in favor. You know, that's crazy too thin. And we said earlier that. Yeah, it sucks. Because you couldn't build or excuse me growing from the soil. But that was is located. And I think it was isolated for reason. Because Jim didn't like when that one boy left that barn when he was given his preacher when he was young. This is now he's like, well, we're going to clear this out. And then right in the middle of this thick asks jungle, which there were Tigers. There were all these things that are something that million. Well, and the other thing is when you're you're out there, and you're you're you're working six days. Then you got to sit through these lectures, and not only that lectures, he had a system, and he would record these lectures or just be on the PA because he's hopped up on drugs all night long screaming in these these Marxist, social doctrines all night long. It's like my Hardaway. He just played them on repeat and those drug problems. We are talking about have gotten even worse at this point. And so most of these rambling lectures, are incoherent. And and that's the fun part. Because then he might randomly come find you the next day or the next time they get togethers and quiz you on the lecture. And if you couldn't get his quiz, correct his questions. Correct. You got about of catharsis catharsis got worse off you. I couldn't I couldn't run a cult like this. Because that's the only reason I had access to figure system twenty four seven. I would just be doing comedy routines. And also saying you are all appreciated your hard work is going unnoticed your weight or and now everybody put your hands together. And welcome to the stage Porsche these questions. No. No. Partially are strip club has higher standards William to the main stage doors foul enough on the side as we got me because they're used their real names. The catharsis got worse before I mean, it sound bad before they with humiliate you. They'd beat you now for kids, for instance, if they're going to be if they were going to go through catharsis, they might just get thrown into a box. They had they had buried a storage container. They called the box or something like that. And with throw them in there, and they would have the in the complete darkness. They would have someone whisper things like you're going. We're I'm after you. I'm gonna get you. And then adults would be stripped naked might be beaten while they're walking through the crowd. They would do all sorts of horrible thing with the kids the next interrelation of that was then they started putting them at the bottom of a well and doing that. And the next generation was they hung them in that. Well, upside down for twenty hours most disturbing thing that I heard was actually audio of this a guy who survived and his friend try. To get away. When they were he was about twelve years old and they ran into the jungle and they were eventually hunted down by the security team. And brought back in they had the entire Jonestown people there, and this is all on audio documented, and they're like, what do you think we should do and the guy's mothers? I think we should kill him. She's like, I think you should allow me to shoot him because it will mean more in front of everyone when I'm the one who kills them. And this is his mother, of course, he wasn't killed. But he was like we didn't know and people were always assuming that if they did run away. They would be killed. That was just a fair assumption to Jones had a history of being associated with deaths of temple members. There were at least eight deaths before they even went to Guyana in in California that were suspicious. Ultimately, we mentioned how finish. Doc on Trump's twice in back of the head. Who hasn't had that nightmare? We mentioned how congressman Ryan eventually comes. That's at the behest of a father of a former temple member, and we'll get we'll get to his visit and a bit. But it is well known amongst the temple that death is not necessarily off the table. And that's the way the Jones wanted it. Yeah. He absolutely did. A cable comes from the US embassy Yana to the US department of state in June seventy eight and it characterizes the Tommy Jones something founded on is this. This is a quote during the consular visits. It has been observed the local Guineas administration exercise little or no control over the Jonestown community. And that the settlements atonomy seems virtually total that is due to a variety of reasons, which include the fact that the area in questions remote. And thus. The government's rather primitive administrative machinery is already overstrained by its obligations to the Guinea citizens living in the region as well as. Understandable disinterest in the part of the local officials to bother with an apparently self sufficient community of non Guineas who obviously are not actively seeking inexpensive contact with the Guineas environment to which their settlement is located. What we have there for is a community of American citizens existing as a self contained and self governing unit in a foreign land of which for all intents and purposes is furnishing to the residents all of the community services such as civil administration police and fire protection education health care excetera normally provided by central government within its territory. That's was the report on it. And that sounds like the beginnings of dictatorship or. Or? Yeah. Right. That was alarming to people back home. That was the report though, it sounds kind of a noxious other often their own they're off on their own. And he the knew what he was maybe capable of. So that was scary. If problems started creeping in very fast, we talked about how bad though, the the soil was we'll guess what? Foods started running short bad soil. Jones was not self sufficient ahead, import large quantities of commodities such as we things. The problem is they had money to do it. He just wasn't doing it. Right. He had something like a tapped twenty some twenty three million dollars. When it was said and done which would have went astronomically far in housing and taking care of these people. He was just stockpiling for into times, you said food was running short. So eventually it went from having the biscuits and coffee and everything else in the morning. I referenced before to everyone was eating rice, and they'd get smaller small. Portions of rice. There was also a big problem with bugs there. They didn't have enough screens didn't pay for enough screens. And they didn't have a lot of food cleanliness. It got to the point where they would all try to eat in the dark. So they couldn't see what they were eating in their rice. Well, and that's the point to the population of Jonestown exploding so quickly. And you we see that, you know, jumps down. I guys I pry nears went there and seventy three everybody showed up in seventy seven. So for four years they've been working stuff out. Right. Trying to get it going. And from the time Jim shows up seventy seven we're going to find that that there's not much time left. Everything else happens right in less than one year's time. It's a it's a good point. It was just it's a good point. I hadn't really thought about that way. That if you look at the entirety of the time line of Jonestown, all of this horrible nece that you read about or that we're talking about today have been pretty much from the moment. He got there on. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Right. And so for that one year must have been just a hell honor those people. Tinier out how much every. The problem is to their way of communication with the outside world was ham radio. And they would talk and people were finding out what was going on there. And it was leaving the outside world kind of bewildered, and they were taking note in family members of the people that were starting were there were starting to really worry about what was happening and that kind of spilled the beginning of the end. I told you up to sixty five thousand dollars a month in welfare payments were going to the temple just being written over children were surrended communal care, and they were only allowed to see their biological. Parents briefly at night not every day. That's crazy. They had their own way of policing people methods. We talked about, you know, we already went to the torture hole and the well and things like that. These things start really adding up that's a drug some of their people. Brent they they would use drugs like Thorazine, which I'm going to need. After this episode, sodium pentothal, I keep it on hand. Don't as he truth. Claro hydrate Demirel and valium would be administered in the quote extended care units and ended cares. Like, yeah. That's real the armed guards patrol the area to enforce Jonestown rules Brenston rule. Somebody's got info. Didn't have an empire. So me on. And then I told you the shit like that mother, you know, shoot them shoot them the outside world is finding out. It's so funny. They're so remote they're so far away. And yet it's still being picked up on. Well, and and not only that. But we we've talked continually about him managing and him ruling through fear. But he did so many things we talked earlier we talked last episode about how you know was that stick of dynamite on the burn pile actually him doing it. Well, there's some things he did in Jonestown that were definitively him doing it, for instance, at one of their big meeting said that there are there are bad people out there, and they wanna get us fast forward. He had some his own people go out into the out into the jungle and shoot at his west house while he was in it. But he knew when they were doing it 'cause he sent them out there, and he just hit on against a wall and everything they shot with. Real bullets too. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And then of course, he called an emergency meeting and said, see see these fascists are out there. And they wanna take away what we've built and also don't forget this bloody shirt from a couple years ago. Those meetings to you go to church, and when I was in church, the meeting the sermon proper would start at maybe ten thirty in the morning, and by eleven thirty or noon, you go and have, you know, Sunday dinner somewhere ship, these meetings and the pavilion at Jonestown. They would be six hours, eight hours, ten hours long. Everybody just in the pavilion, and you could not leave. Pollock was well, and he's talking about communist leaders and things like that. He's he's spewing this eight speech and things like that towards them in. He would just take breaks take a mouthful ice in crunch on it or a mouthful of like barbecue. It's not a amphetamines, and he was just crunching between one or the other all just just leading leaning this building up to a peak, and it's got to break. And it does in the beginning of the end and Senator freefall was a visit from this congressman Ryan, we're gonna talk about that when we get back from the break on hysteria fifty one everything's gone about sales. L one fear doubt like. Joe, you know, he was a salesman actually. No, no, not theoretically, actually was he sold monkeys. Remember the monkey? Yeah. Come on. Now, i'm. All right, good. I was I was going with you cut it off at exactly right. Oh boy. Thing that we should probably. Level. Oh levels right there. One thing we should probably touch on before we before we get into what happened next is the concept of white nights. And what went along with that? We mentioned that he ruled through fear and one of the ways in which he ruled through fear was he kept telling people that they're after us. They're after us, and whenever he wanted that emergency to happen that the they were coming. He he was getting them already by by having a white Knight. And the it was called a white Knight. Because there was originally a term called a black day, and I guess a black day reference somehow emergency, and he he said, well, that's racist. So let's call it a white Knight. So whenever he would get on the PA and yell white Knight white Knight white night, all of the people of Jonestown were required to go to the main center pavilion and come listen to him. And at these white nights, not only would he go on and on and on and on not only would they do. Some of the punishment. We talked about, but he also would say, you know, what it's not worth it anymore. Fuck it. We're all going to die tonight. And he would bring out Kool aid flavor aid way. Hunch. Have everyone drink it. I don't think it was drank purple. And he would have everyone drink it and say and say this. Aw. The black eyed peas did not play. They so he would he would say okay now is everyone okay with dying tonight, and you know, one or two people raise their hand, and he'd lecture them for hours as to why they're they should all be raising their hand, and they do it again. And then they'd have another white night a few days later, another it's going to be a wide. And then eventually eventually folks were so folks were so tired of this in so mentally drained and only one hour of sleep. And they're so used to it too. Because they've been they keep getting handed these cups that they're told her poison, but aren't poison that eventually they all raise their hand and resignation say I'm ready to die tonight and that happened over and over and over a false confession as someone. Right. Well, and the idea to that the the white nights they I like from the first one to the second one maybe a couple of weeks. Eventually they were almost every night. Right. Did he was he? Rogue green lantern that just had it wrong. Tonight. New Louisville shells Cape. May just added a little. Evils mind. Okay. You wear his power. Joan your fire. Joe bring up Greenland seriously. Yeah. Yeah. Sometimes I forget this. So we're talking about this spelling the beginning of the end does in November of seventy eight US. Congressman Leo, Ryan traveled Agana to inspect people's simple. And what was going on the whole grounds? The the compound everything he was investigating rumors that some members of the cult were being held against their will. Correct me on this one. Did he also was part of this that custody issue? Yes. With John Greystone so girl boy, signed, right, Tim and grace stone. Yeah. Their son, John Victor stone, Tim as we know Jim will make people signed things that aren't true. He had Tim signed the document that said that Jim Jones was actually the father of that child and not Tim himself. Yeah. And so they're pushing back on that sixty families came forward to Leo Ryan and said, we need your help. So he went there on behalf of them to check on their family members. Heroes in Jonestown November seventeenth, but he actually arrived Yana few days prior Jones was known to play games. And he he made them waiting made them wait like three days in Georgetown before we let them come on the seventeenth. They come in. What's crazy? And everything about this. Crazy people there when he got there were telling them how great it was about the life. They actually had a huge party everyone to be good spirits. He even remarked in. We're actually we're going to play clip of this. Questions raised about your operation right now. If you have as the folks here, or whatever the comments are people here who believe this is the best on the whole lot. It's so sad watch. How long the doesn't to how long the responses to the applause three ten minutes long? Veterans Day, though, things change in the big takeaway. And I'll bring this up later, the big takeaway is it didn't need to even from the crazy aspects of it. When Leo is leaving things weren't that bad. The next day though is the day's going to return home of the sixty families that he interviewed. None of them wanted to leave. People did come forward though, and saving the family members. Yeah. Of the of the people laying families they were all like, we're we're we're good about fifteen people did come forward and say they were wanting to leave. Hey were passing notes as well. One of the main members of the concerned relatives group is amend James could Sarah's and he was one of the big drivers of Ryan's. Visit his daughter Maria. Could Sarah's had become Jim Jones's main mistress at this time along with Carolyn Layton, and and more, and it was very good. Sarah's who kept sending letters back to her dad say leave us alone, leave us alone. I love it here. This is great. But what's really going on is Maria Qatar is assuming assuming and assuming more and more control and power over not just Jim. But then by extent, right? The whole operation and those three women that really are calling the shots and may. Making things happen towards the end because gyms almost just incapacitated. And where was Marceline during this because she was mother for so long as they are. She was in bad health, and okay, well, she was in bad health. And then she also just accepted, the story of Marsh lane is just almost tragic in the sense that she accepted, all this all the women all the other things all the other relationships that German have as part of her duty. She had to do it in her mind, she she was doing the right thing. And staying with him a lot of the supposition is that she really just did all of this for her kids, which is not an excuse. Anyway, she do there's nine hundred people along with you, you know, yet. Right. But the, you know, the other thing you mentioned how win the congressman got their how they all said how great it was. They were quizzed because they they had well, they they had much advance notice. It'll not including the three days of the made them. Wait. Right. All right. They had a lot more than that advance notice that the congressman would becoming and so he would quiz the people at these white nights. He would say, okay, he comes up to you. And he says how do you like it here? What's your response? He comes up to you. And he says are there are there? Terrible things happening here. What's your response? And if he didn't like the answer he'd say, you know, it's just not a good answer. You know, what you're going to have to avoid them. You can't talk to them. And by the way, I'm going to have to sign you some homework, and and in his what his version of homework with anything. He called him classes. It wasn't good. It was it was just another 'nother punishment. And so these people were as if they hadn't been conditioned enough. They were conditioned to say exactly what they were supposed to the moment. They were asked those questions by the congressman. That's why he was so. Why he was so astonishing that the next day on the eighteenth ruin the congress is going to leave these people like you said surpassing notes are saying things. You got nine hundred people fifteen people's all it was that came forward and said, hey, we want to leave in that shook them so much that someone pulled a knife on the congressman and tried to kill him and other other Jonestown members actually jumped on him with with a help, and they subdued this guy. They tried to kill him right there because he was going to take these way. And here's the thing. He sat down and had a long like forty four minute conversation with Jones in Jones was like, you know, these people are liars, whatever the tell you lying in congressman was like this. This is the gist of it. For all intents and purposes, I'm happy with what's going on here. Everyone seems to be happy. And most of the people that are upset. He goes, I'm Chucky up to you're in the middle of nowhere, and they feel trapped not trapped by you right up by a jungle, and they're just things -iety. He goes I'm going to go back and really give you a favorable report. And those sixty families has sent me here everyone, we're going to know your loved one is an adult. They're happy to be where they are. There's nothing you can do about it. You mentioned the note that they that they pass to the congressman actually wasn't passed. The congressman the guy who passed it didn't know who was congressman who was a who was a news anchor it cetera. Pass. It's one of the news guys. And it said, you know, help get us out of here Joan Jonestown forgetting gentleman's name at the moment. Vern Ghazni thanked ver- in when he left he's one of the people that left he left his son at Jonestown. And that's one of the thing on the tape. And he says, and he says, you know, it was confused at the time. My son was black. This is the white guy. And I just thought he'd be better off Jonestown because of all the racism in America. So we left him there. And that's what Jim Jones was using as a detraction. If you listen to the tape. He's like this guys. It's so terrible. And he's leaving the sunnier. What's what's that say about him? And he was using that against them. And after they were gonna leave and the congressman told him, you're good for you. Everything's fine. He turned to his people. It's a total loss. That's what he was. We failed at the total loss before the congressman left Jonestown. He was actually going to stay another night. Right to go around in question. The rest of the folks there and just make sure there's no one else that actually wanted to leave. And as they were sitting there talking he was literally talking to Jim Jones and a few subordinates one of the members of Jonestown run up behind him with a knife, put it to his neck and said, you're going to die motherfucker and a couple of people jump on that guy and the congressman is not hurt in any way. There's blood on his shirt and assured his torn, but the the blood is actually from the knife-wielder who cut his own hand in the scuff, the funny part was funny right after that people like you really do need to leave Vernon Ghazni said that to him before the and he's like, no, I'm fine. And then after that happened is like, maybe I should go. Yup. Thing about Leo Ryan is to you know, he knew he was well known to be this kind of guy who you might wonder what he was just about to be attacked. And then the next day is still going to be like, okay, good. Good report for you. Why would he do that? Right. But Leo Ryan was kind of known for being this kind of. Dude, you know, he'd done this thing with a prison investigation where he spent a week in jail as an inmate as an inmate. Nobody else knew it like all the other inmates. Didn't know who he really was ill. So Leo Ryan would do these kinds of things it's not odd. That Leo Ryan was the one that went they make their way to the plane and like Christmas looting to there was more of them. They needed the second plane while they were followed people from Jonestown tractor pull up trailer behind it. They get out and literally opened fire and to be clear, Jane, Jim Jones told them to fall them. Right. Absolutely. They opened fire on this group of the people that are trying to leave and the news crew that was there filming it and congressman. And there was there was a mole from Jonestown. There was a guy who was one hundred percent on Jim Jones's side. He ran up at the last minute as they're pulling away from Jonestown. I wanna leave too. I wanna leaving. And they said, okay. So they get to the airstrip and and the congressman himself pads the guy. Down doesn't find anything that he gets on one of the first planes that's going to leave? And as they're about to take off as those other gunmen pull up he starts shooting people inside the plane, right all told five people including Ryan and three members of the press were shot and killed eleven others were wounded it's a miracle survived and they laid their bleeding for twenty two hours before anyone got to them the guy that jumped in on the tractor. There's some reports later that the people that were on the truck when they saw him get on. They knew things were going to Jake was up. Right. And that man was Larry Layton and his sister. Caroline late now. Yes, originalmattress of Jim Jones. I'm one of the original like one of the main with her Maria. Sarah's at the end who were the real drivers of the end game Larry late and was the one that lit the fuse. You know, like started off with right killing the congressman, right and Carolyn Laden herbage idea. It wasn't the flavor. She was her thing was that she wanted to take small groups out at a time and shoot them just the whole the whole while go through all nine hundred plus people do that what was going to choose you won't try to kill him. But then and more who was in kind of in charge of the, you know, where the medicines and the drugs and all that stuff. She was the one that kind of mixed up the brew they'd been practicing. And so they knew what they were going to do and the other side notice they'd been receiving packages every month of cyanide because Jim Jones has jeweler license, and they're using it to work with gold. So he's getting these shipments of pounds every month of cyanide. So they have it there. And they find out he comes back. There's audio of all this. He's like the congressman has been killed. Pretty much. It's time to it's funny. Not certainly not funny. It's interesting. They call it the death tape. It's when he has gathered everyone together for the final white Knight. And he's saying, you know, it's pretty much the end it. There's nothing else. We can do. It's time for us to die. And this is before they know that anything has been carried out towards the congressmen. But he says, I know for a fact that someone while they're in the air is going to shoot the pilot of that lane and that plane is going to go down, and then the American fascists will paratroop in here, and they will take your kids in torture them. And this is this is all before they'd come back actually said the congressman is dead. And so he's getting them already because he's the one who issued the order, and he says it's time children commit revolutionary suicide, and his theory was you can go down in history saying you chose your own way to go. And it's your commits refused. Capitalism and in support of socialism. If you kill yourself people tried to plead with him and eat a man of the deaths of everyone man woman child, and and that's important people were poisoned, and if you didn't take it they did autopsies only of the I two hundred bodies, and they stopped seventy of them had injection wins. So they figure those people were murdered the most vocal dissenter. Her name is Christine Miller, and she is on long back and forth. Jones about we go. Yeah. I mean, you know, one point maybe it's just her idealism. But it also kind of feels like she'll say anything just like, hey, how about we not kill thousand people right now, you know, and and she's trying to be a it's amazing that one person speaking up doesn't lead to a second and third you most of the time in general settings. You know, the what is it? The pebble starts the avalanche or whatever I it's just one after another. And a cast cascading effect, and it does not have that cascading effect because these people have been so ingrained indoctrinated into them. And also, I think the thing that's worth two point. You were talking about the syringes, you know, first they pull out the poison, and it's time. Okay. They start with the children. And this is this is the hardest part of this. I don't know why it is why why children are more difficult than adults. But I guess maybe children just for one hundred percent have no choice, and they're taking the kind of syringes that aren't needles, but just shoot liquid like if you're getting giving a kid medicine, and they start taking infants and babies and two year olds and three year olds and put it in this in them, and and you can hear Jones sane in that tape. It doesn't hurt. They're they're just giving you that face because it doesn't taste great. It's a little bitter says bidder, and you know, that right, then they're poisoning three hundred children. And then it goes onto the adults and you've got Christine. Millard dissenting. But we don't know is the other six hundred plus adults. What exactly was having with them? Certainly you can hear few clapping and applauding in that tape. But the line between I want to do this, and I have a gun to my head. So I better drink this with the hope that this is the three hundred seventh time that he's faking. It is is thin one. So said they were interviewed one of the guys he said that that hope went out in about five minutes when people started foaming at the mouth, and dying is a lot of people that wanna know part of it, then we're just defeated. And just said fuck it. I'll die in that is another hard thing to swallow. These more than three hundred children died people were just doing mothers are killing their babies holding him. So then kill themselves. You know, it was the look of of the bodies is when you see for five people laying right next to each other and some of them have their arms around. Yes. Is still on the PA system. Still die with a degree of doing the layer life down with dignity don't lay down with tears, nagging mother mother mother mother, please mother, please these haunting things that he's saying die with a little dignity mother. Please die as hard. As this episode. Probably is to listen to if you are listening to this just, you know, just of the gist of the story from us don't go listen to the death tape. It is disturbing and it's not worth says on there. And this is what this is his outlook said, I tell you. I don't care. How many streams you here? I don't care how many anguished cries death is a million times for Fergal to ten more days of this life. If you knew what was ahead of you. You'd be glad to be stepping over tonight. Are you talking to yourself you fucking asshole? And it was he kept telling him how not bad the flavor aid was and and it was such an easy thing. But yet he himself did not take. No, he they figure. Was self inflicted it. They said Carolyn, Layton shoot. Well, they think he shot himself the placement of his body, and they do believe he shot himself. He laid his head on a pillow and killed himself that way, he didn't take the poison there were survivors three high ranking timbale members they claim they were given assignment and the thereby escaped death. Tim carter. He's the one. We talked about before his brother, Mike, they were thirty and twenty and Mike who was thirty one. We're giving luggage containing five hundred fifty thousand dollars in US currency one hundred and thirty thousand dollars in Guineas, currency and envelope. Which was they were told to deliver the Soviet embassy in Georgetown and the envelope contained two passports and three instruction letters the first of stating. Dear comrade, and the guy that was there at the embassy. The following is a letter of instructions regarding all of our assets that we want to leave to the communist party of the union of Soviet socialist Republic. Enclosed in. This letter are letters with instructs to banks to send the cashier's checks to you. I am doing this on behalf of the peoples temple. Because we as communist want our money to be of benefit to help our oppressed peoples all over the world or in any way that your decision making body sees fit. Now, he says he's people to live. He also there was a basketball tournament going on in Georgetown, the capital, his son, Jim Jones junior and others were there. He actually called them three of time to kill yourself. And some of them did Jim Jones junior son was like, no, no. This is stupid a woman who took her children into a VAT. Yeah, killed them. There were so the woman was with two small children and her teenage daughter, the father, the former husband who was not a part of the people's temple had flown to Jonah, but he was not one that was allowed to come to Jonestown. So he. Went to the the people's temple house, Georgetown. Yeah. And he was there. He had a nice day the day before with the wife, the daughter the kids it cetera. And then they got the call. They said, okay. Well, why don't you come back tomorrow? We'll talk about our future plans, blah, blah, blah. But that was just to get rid of him. Because then the mother brought in the two babies and the teenage daughter, and it's thought that the teenage daughter and the mother slit each other's. Also, you mentioned the basketball tournament. There's actually three of his sons, his natural son Jim Jones junior which was the first African American adopted son that we talked about before and then one other son that I'm forgetting the name of right now, we're all part of this basketball team. But it's not like, my my wife, and I were watching Stacey. We're watching a documentary about this. And she said, what do you think he knew and like sent them away to try to, you know, save them. No, no. In fact, the phone rang, and they're like, yeah. You need to come home right now. And when they refused they said find kill yourself there. Who's the opposite of let's let's show some grace and compassion. So this happened some mass murder some called mass suicide, I think both are true. And a lot of levels. You know, it depends some of it's case by case, but he really had power over these people. And that's why I think that's the big thing. So I'm gonna ask you guys. What's Jones legacy to you? Like where does it leave? You. What what what does that leave the world? I would put it in a bit of a comparison in the -nology. I recently saw a Showtime documentary on g g Allen and me and my wife were watching it. And she said I've never heard of him before. And I never want to hear of him again, and I investigated by Alan because Jalen a punk rocker in the eighties, and he would do things like bashes own mouth with the microphone. He'd be. Stripped naked on stage, smearing his own shit all over his body people. He would have sex with his brother on state drummer would stick the drumsticks up his ass and then start playing with them. It was just the most extreme. And I always fascinated when you find what the limit is. What is the example of the farthest you can take something a lot of people don't realize to started that far back. But. I just think jobs down is an example of the, you know, there's been the Bogwang there's been other colts and other religious groups of this sort. But I think that Jones is that that's why that story indoors is. Because it is so. Extreme it is. I think it is almost to the limit of what it is such gusting tail and to see these people just go. All right. Well, I'm going to be part of it. It's crazy Tim right Amon road is book. This is kind of a lot of people say like the definitive story raven. The untold story of Jim Jones was one of the NBC reporter was there. Yeah. So he's here's a couple of quotes. It is impossible to separate Jonestown from his political and social context the peoples. Temple was binney, communist, colts, churches, and social movements are and alternative to the established social order a nation unto itself, and I agree with that. That's how they wanted to be the temple. I know was not populated by masochists and halfwits. So it followed that the members who gave years of labor life savings homes children. And in some cases, their own lives had been getting something in return. That's why they went there. I think is they saw something we're going to get someone write him and added when outsiders took the attitude that they or their children would never be crazy enough to join such an organisation such complaints self delusional. I think that ties into what we said. People don't realize when they're gonna call a lotta times, you don't realize Intel hope hopefully before it's too late. But in even if it's not too late. You maybe realize it when there's no way to get the fuck out of it. Right. You've given all your things away, amber own mind. What costs does it? I mean, it costs people their lives everything. People lost whole families were wiped out because of this. I. Hey, there's really lots of banter because it's so terrible. But what's your takeaways guys? Like, do you have any closing thoughts on this? I just wanna throw in raven is wonderful document in terms of and I say wonderful, but one has in very eliminating, and is a very a great description and record of what happened I would throw in one other recommendation for anybody who wants to to really dig in Jeff Gwynn's book the road to Jonestown at once great. It's a wonderful nonfiction piece where he his point of view isn't just about the power structures and the things that Jim does it really takes his entire history. The first couple of chapters are just about Llaneta and Lynette is history. And that you find out that Jim's family on the father's side was actually pillars of the community and very wealthy and the gyms families even that comes from that. I mean, it really goes into such deep by graphical context that really brings home the point to me that I don't believe in just a person being born evil. I think. Jim Jones is an example of what can happen when Aristotle says give me boy until he's seven I'll give you the man and what happened to Jim Jones in his childhood and the things that he ended up glomming onto he took to the extreme. And he took it to his whole life. And and this is what came of it. So be to your kits. John go to their best. Some say, oh, I've always got something to say. I think I think Jim Jones. Was. I don't know if we'll say Borna monster. I'm definitely in disagreement a little bit with Chris though, I think there's choice in life. I think you could be born a bad person. But still choose not to pursue it to one extent or another. I think that Jim Jones chose to be a monster. And I think from very very early age he was planning maybe not the exact outcome, but something similar he was going to have massive control over group of people. And ultimately was the ultimate ultimate ultimate sign of control that you could get someone to kill themselves on on your behalf. And it's the question about what kind of the power, though, the power to control others or the power to make them love you. I think that's what Jim was after. But I think to Jim power was love and love was power. Right. And and to the them being one in the same. I think this to one extent or another. He succeeded in his life's goal. And I think everything he did from opening soup kitchens to integrating communities that weren't integrated. We're all in that pursuit. I don't think that a lot of people paint him as a you know, humanist and while things went bad at the end because he took too many drugs and wasn't seeing things. Clearly, he didn't always have bad intentions. I'm the opposite. I think he always had bad intentions, and I think he just he knew that he had to build from point a to point. I think it was a smart guy from point A to point beat appointed. Look how he took his church for a church based on religion to something where it was basically an atheist organization based in Marxism in communist was met by applause by those people who are the same people that were that were applauding when he would hold up the bible and say this is our God. They of course, I'm not saying that there is no culpability for everyone that went along for the ride, but men when you think about all the tax you could literally there are books written on how you manipulate people. And he took every bullet point out of those books, and he beat them down. And he got them to a point where they felt there was no alternative. And frankly, we don't know how many of those nine hundred plus people were forced to drink that drink or you know, they say only seventy were injected how the only the only inspected two hundred bodies, and they gave up. Even better seventy two hundred were injected for all we know one hundred people drank in eight hundred where either injected or forced to like, we don't know the numbers. And I think that this guy was murderous prick. I'm glad he's dead, and I feel bad for the families and all the people that lost their lives that day. It is a fine line agree with that of he knew what he was doing along the way was it because he was just in internally in eight leva from the beginning. Or was it something he was choosing? It was since in gross in the point of it is. Where do you draw? The like, Chris is he is he a product of society was he born evil that's a hard one. And I think that's philosopher still debate that not even outside of him day in and day out with everything. So. I'm not going to to to be able to say on that. But I think whatever he was it started very young. And I agree with John. I think he was on a path from a very young age to be what he was now he might not of always thought, it was going to be death and everything, but he sure made that early on an option, and there are there are things when he was preaching when you're still in Indiana where he actually says no one should ever take their own life. No one should ever if someone wants you to take your life. They are leaning away from God. And this it's funny because these are sermons and he gave and then within a year later he's preaching. And no one ever said, maybe that's not the way to be. I e you know, picking up on them. What we've all said. I think I think we all have good points about this. I I think the way I'd say it is nothing is ever one thing. Right. I don't think that Jim Jones was just evil. I think a lot of it has to do with his childhood has do this mother has to do with his father how he was raised how he was neglected, but I think it also had to do with that probably created some sort of mental instability, and then he was leading these people. And as we said earlier is love power power love he needed to adulation to have self worth. And that that at the beginning is it's harmful for sure. But it's it's relatively benign. But what happened was and then the drugs come in. And then the probably the part of him that is with the, you know, Shakespeare said the better angels of our nature. But what's what's the? Opposite the demons, right? The demons won and they won big time. And that that part of him is evil, and he was an evil in the end and evil person. The point I'm trying to make is that he was so selfish. And so self obsessed that it came to a point where he had a bunch of hundreds of people kill themselves because he had painted himself into a box, and he had no way out. And so he said we're all gonna die in. And it's it's disgusting box that if the cinder hadn't been killed probably wouldn't have mattered. That's that's conjecture. But there is a lot where the governor. The governor the Carters was saying, I'm okay with most of this. And he was just like, Nope. It's total loss. So the one other variable I would add because I agree with with Kevin's concept of theirs. It's just complex the one that real variable. I would add that I always think of when I read stories like this, and certainly think of every time. Watching reading anything about this one that you guys I'm sure have all seen to we've all seen people who when they're given an audience of some kind react differently in the way that they revel in that audience. It can be a preacher. It could be a professor at college. Who thinks he is the biggest deal in the room because he gets to have twenty kids a semester who come and listened every word and get tested on it. It can be someone with like a minor social media following who everything that they talk about in pop culture has to be what everyone on that social media following is like oh my God. This guy is seeing the coolest things I've ever heard of. But I think I think that's a major contributor something like this. And that's where you get to you have the choice, and I don't know it goes into that choice. You know, the nature versus nurture and all that stuff. But somewhere along the line. There's a once in a great many people that when they find themselves in that position their choices to exploit it as opposed to have fun with it. And just enjoy the concept of. Instead, they get some sort of strange in eight power trip over this thing. Like somehow, they're big deal. Fifty people on you know, on a Twitter feed re tweeted them with a thumbs up. And it's no, no, that's not you're not powerful. But the other thing say is considering them never invited back every week. This might be the one that I take you guys up on that on because my God this was. Yes. I do this. Usually by these episodes. I'm like man, I wish wouldn't end and nothing gets anybody on this panel. But I was like God. It's just terrible. Ruins, unfortunately, this is such a big name Jonestown has become you know, almost, you know, a noun verb. You know, you use it out of context people. Do it's such an event in. I think is important though for people to not forget what happened. So that it doesn't happen again. Because there's always somebody willing to take advantage literally quote that sat behind his throne in the pavilion. I'm not going to get the quote. Exactly, right. But remember history. So you're not doomed to re-. Yeah. It was worded oddly. But that's what it was. We hope your take away from this as monsters, whether they're made born they exist and watch your loved ones watch the people around, you know, what's happening in your life their life, everything if you can help help if you can't distance yourself before it's too late. What do you guys think though? That's that's kind of our takes on it. How can they list? No, John out. They can hop on hysteria nation where I promised. There will be a lot more UFO talk, maybe anal probes. But play in general, I was missing. But william. No, the fun kind. All right, kids, just go to hysteria nation. Facebook dot com slash group slash stereo, nation tour, we talk about all this stuff and a lot more. Wow. Back of the year ad bought on Twitter, patriot dot com slash extra episodes up all things like that on their leaves a voicemail if you want to hear your voice on the show seven seven three six six nine seven two seven seven again, seven three six nine seven two seven seven. If you forget any of this. You can find it all on our website. What's that site? John stereo, fifty one dot com. We are not gonna play any voicemails today because textually feel and I need a beer little gross and a little yicky. So with that said, I've been Brent I've been Kevin I've been Chris I've enjo- I've been John's been conspiracy about stay woke meet sex. That's it for a number of of hysteria. Fifty one Joan Brentwood be back next week. We've yet more of the unexplained the unexplored and the unheard of. Oh, if it's unheard of what they know about it. Anyway, if you want to suggest Toby give us your thoughts or just my fun of conspiracy votes. That's my favorite. Join us in our Facebook discussion group hysteria nation, just log onto Facebook and search hysteria nation, all you can always tweet us at hysteria. Fifty one pot. You've been listening to fourth Huns joins. Everyone. I'm doctor ause. I love getting the talk with you on my show every single day when the cameras stopped rolling. The conversation is over decided to start a podcast in order to dive deeper into the issues, and ideas that I love sharing with you. It's health, unfiltered, my wife, Lisa will be joining me together. We're taking wellness to the next level and having a little fun along the way. Listen subscribe at apple podcasts or on the I heart radio app or wherever you listen to podcasts.