18 Burst results for "Jeff Coyle"
B2B Marketers on a Mission
"jeff coyle" Discussed on B2B Marketers on a Mission
"Go check amount and broke off to go pursue a career in private equity soon after my now co founder. Reach back out to me and said Do you wanna You're one of few people who really understand these workflows in this process. You want to join me as a late co founder. And i said what's that mean he because you're not gonna get paid like eighteen months and i'm like sweet. Let's do that can either work at this awesome. Private equity firm like where they're throwing money around or i could go do this. Total leap of faith on this belief that i had that we can make content high quality content sexy and we have And that's really my journey to kids two and a half and four and a half year old and I gosh did. Jeffrey underscore coil on twitter at the up link dan. I answer everything if you've got a question checkout page People are usually shocked at that. I will record them. Video of me like walking through their page and being like i just did actually it was residual guy said the note to A person who to send me Stage and i'm like was eighteen minutes long. They rented like five in the morning last night. And i can imagine they were like wow. He looked at this team. It's either i just. I just love this stuff. And i try to make that shine through in everything. Marcus mazing and the rest is as they say. History right now. You're now you're here making a dental universe. Hope to one day. People believe that. I want the bar for content quality to have risen so high. And there's no market for crap. If i can rid the world of content that would be amazing. Amazing jeff coil. It's been an absolute pleasure so Thanks for coming on take care. Stay safe and keep in touch jess. Thanks so much for having me..
B2B Marketers on a Mission
"jeff coyle" Discussed on B2B Marketers on a Mission
"Really okay. No absolutely and just wrapped up like you'll be advised that you would give people out there. What's the one thing that you would say. People need to start stop when it comes to content marketing for first thing they need to start is a more consistent. Internal inventory or auditing process. They need to start trying to understand where they have. Strengths and weaknesses and where they have You know gaps in authority. They need to stop trying to the search engines with their content. Anything they've got this low quality that punches above its weight it might as well have a ticking time bomb top of it stopped trying to trick trick stuff Anything you do. This just feels yucky. Stop i mean 'cause it just it just is not gonna stay up forever. You may get away with it for a while And those are kind of that second part is going to be really hard Especially if you're in an organization where somebody's like we've gone away with this for this loan. Why would we make like harder on ourselves. And it's like his life's gonna end up being made harder for you. Even if you're the best in the game it's gonna end up being heart made harborview And go look at a publisher that's had a tumultuous history and you even believe is amazing. Go watch you know row washed away. Imagine if you had to go through one of those waves at your own what would happen. Put yourself in the shoes of having just taken a- of a sixty percent traffic haircut on your site and what you do get the get yourself. That's the case you make. I really think that we're you know. Were paper lions right here. We are on top of of of cracks foundation You might have to be this change instigator internally especially if you're in a big org That we've rested on laurels of page for too long. This page get sixty percent of our traffic..
B2B Marketers on a Mission
"jeff coyle" Discussed on B2B Marketers on a Mission
"Work I would like i. I'll take what other people have said. my friend noah Noah learner you can look them up. He's wonderful person The other day he said to me he said i've been around. I've talked to hundreds of people on this end. Is you know this more than anyone. And i said. I don't know a fraction of it. But i do know probably as good as the you know a couple of dozen in the world who don't work at a in on those teams at those organizations and i can comfortably name who those. Those dozens of people are The biggest belief in my in our space from the search engine optimization perspective is that there are truly a lot of experts in the field. There really aren't There's a very very small number and you don't have to be an expert about how everything works to be successful at this job. You can think critically in have good standards in guardrails for yourself and focus on what you're good at focus on that and be successful on. I think a big belief is that you have to either think that you are the ultimate expert or not. I mean i. I laughed because i build out. I have like one hundred. Fifty really really cool. Examples of things that people say are true about search. And it's the debunk. it's a d. bunker hand you know when i just kind of keep that because it reminds me that you know anyone can say they're the expert. It's like come on you know. Give me this money. And i will give you my secrets. It's like i'll give you all my secrets nothing. It doesn't mean that you're gonna know exactly what to do with them or how to use. If that's not the key the key is can you set yourself up for success but don't believe everything you hear In this because there's a lot of conjecture on the nurse who will die on a hill on something they believe in fact that is not true. And just be aware of that and that that's the It's like a And i passionately disagree with anyone. Who believes that. They have it all figured out. 'cause i certainly don't. I'm amazed at what i learn every day every week from my own research and through the research of my peers in this space and And even then people will say gosh like the way you think about the the five years from now. You had told me that. I wouldn't have never thought about it that way. Not i was talking to somebody about query in richmond. Which is we you type a.
B2B Marketers on a Mission
"jeff coyle" Discussed on B2B Marketers on a Mission
"That's toxins that's how the toxins occur because they are the demand gen person. They say. I'm gonna go do this. Ppc campaign and it's going to drive eighty leads that's easy justification for money. The other one isn't when one person uses their directness of their attribution to make themselves make their time and their contribution more important than other members of the team they create a toxic work environment and that's where product management failures occur that's where content strategy failures occur that's why when marketing budgets free when when marketing budgets go down and everybody looks around and tries to protect their teams right. It's why the indirect attribution teams get white. Content is always on that list because content is harder to quantify value about any also works as a team. Okay using ai to say. Hey joey joey joey you know. You're the lead flow through this page on this topic. A lot of happens as a result of the authority. We've built with this entire contract without that entire package. We're not there for the entire life cycle. There's the brand isn't as successful and the people over time. It may not happen overnight but they're gonna slide and is going to go down and then all of a sudden look around but poets supplement. Bbc campaign maybe we should buy to. And we should look it out brian. Because that's easy to justify and then over time we have a site ineffective on so silo..
B2B Marketers on a Mission
"jeff coyle" Discussed on B2B Marketers on a Mission
"Boj you ask them to. Do you find those right find the manual processes and find the cross team mismatching that you expect this person to be the jack-of-all-trades There's the second part of the jack-of-all-trades sentence master of none. If you find the master of everything hold onto that person give them a bear hugs. I've had a few of them in my career. they're typically all vp's of marketing cmo's at amazing orbs right now but hold onto him as long as you can't but you're not going to be the norm for us to set that up and literally tell everybody the thing that you want you desire dream to take off their plate. Don't take the thing off their plate. They're good at a new sense. Take the thing off replace. they're bad at. they hate. guess what that does break silence recitals. Those were some really excellent points and that was perfect. Segue into the next question because it's talking about some ways that a fractured b2b marketing team can effectively. And and and again. This is quoting you. Talk suffi- the organization using an ai powered approach and it at least from what you've been saying the past couple of minutes at strikes me as you are you and your organization are using data to turn potential pushbacks muscle much politics but like.
B2B Marketers on a Mission
"jeff coyle" Discussed on B2B Marketers on a Mission
"To take those risks. You can't afford to take the advice of the house. And that's the biggest issue in seo right now people who learned from tout's yep absolutely thinking about like especially third point about last point you made on. It reminded me of conversation i had with. Another gentleman was on the show and he talked about you. Know he's doing podcasting. He produces them and he said he had clients come to him or one client rather that said we want to have something that's funny and viral like the dollar shave club to when she said.
B2B Marketers on a Mission
"jeff coyle" Discussed on B2B Marketers on a Mission
"Just wrapping up every piece of my team in by making less mistakes by making writing less content doesn't perform on that stage one stage two is speeding up processes. And then when you keep doing that everybody everybody's just like feels like they're on the same page versus you know like i'm really good at my job. I'm going to do that. And then i'm going to do that again and do that again. And hope everybody else figures it out. It's just not. It's not a not in concert and unfortunately most midmarket to enterprise publishing org b to b b to see ecommerce I mean i still got an email. This morning said but but jeff. I'm not allowed to touch those two parts of the site right and i'm like we.
B2B Marketers on a Mission
"jeff coyle" Discussed on B2B Marketers on a Mission
"Which has helped a i can be used to optimize. Content marketing for beater. Beat so talk to us about what you think the. Ai component is so important and so powerful. Yeah not that's a great question and and thanks for a. It's really think that people rushed to judgment about what they think. Artificial intelligence is way too quickly and not to go on. You know what is what isn't they. I regarding this but it's really there. They think that it's just a thing that's going to write. Content and while natural language generation is a thing and it is our data. Science team is based in montreal. The market news Four lab and we are innovating in that field and we have our own natural language. Generation platform natural language processing in artificial intelligence has impacts across the content life cycle all the way from early stage research to planning and prioritization of building. Kind of sources of truth for Things processes like project breaks or content breaks on giving your writers insights while they write a much like they'd expect to get with spellcheck right or grammar a grammar checking or but giving them insights that. Tell them how to make this more. Comprehensive or written from more of a lens of an expert would right and then going into publishing in promotion and then post published assessment. The biggest thing that i can bring for a the kind of a full stack marketer full stack content. Marketer is kind of clarity clarity in their mirrors. I always like to say as you probably have a bit of fun house mirror if you work in a mid market enterprise company. Because you're like there's a lot of bias there's internal stuff. There's a lot of brainstorming a lot of subjectivity. So the big thing that artificial official tells can bring you is objective measures of things. You only ever thought would ever be subjective. And that's the brain breaker right because it saying wait wait you can tell me you can try to set a standard for a concept like contact quality or contact comprehensive this guy or subject matter expertise and that's where i've spent You know the last seven plus years is trying to build objective measures for things that people only ever thought would be subjective in. Come out of you know great ideas or subject matter experts brains. What that does is it makes. Subject matter experts and editorial strategists in content strategists and great writers into super powered writers into do superpower. Strategist because you can say. Hey i want to go write this article or build this content plant now instead of saying someone goes why you say because i'm smart. You're not. I know this you don't you now say i've got these metrics. I am able to predict the outcomes of this plan. And that empowers editorial leader to not just have to sit on their expertise as the bar for people enable their decisions so then they can ask for more money. They.
B2B Marketers on a Mission
"jeff coyle" Discussed on B2B Marketers on a Mission
"Welcome to be to be marketers in the mission. A podcast for be marketers. That helps you to question. The conventional think differently. Trumpcare your industry and take your marketing to new heights. Each week we talked to be to be marketing. Experts share inspirational stories disgusted often topics and provide useful marketing tips and recommendations. And now here's your host and co founder of like insulting christian clip. Welcome everyone to this episode of the bbc marketers in the mission. Podcast where you get your weekly dose of bb marketing insights. So this is your host christian club and today it's an absolute pleasure to welcome guest and do the show who is on a mission to raise the bar for content quality so the b. b. marketers can't as he rightfully books published more and published fearlessly. So mr jeff coil. Welcome the schlosser out. Thanks so much. I look forward to this today. We know we had a really great conversation previously jeff. About when. I'll remember her quite a while. Look set this up a little bit for the listeners. Okay because know we've had a few talented folks like yourself on the show who talked about content marketing. But i think today's conversation comes interesting twists and agree So just to get things started. You are the co founder and chief product officer of a company called market muse and their you combine advanced they. I natural language processing and machine learning algorithms to produce actionable insights for nba marketers. So let's zero in on Today's topic of conversation..
Voices of Search by Searchmetrics
"jeff coyle" Discussed on Voices of Search by Searchmetrics
"You're winning what you should be writing in. It can even get as far as writing. Let's call them drafts of your content and strategy at the end of the day. It's all meant to help. The humans be more successful in writing their content. We go from essentially content creators to being more in an editorial function at some point. Here we get to the you can run a content strategy by paying for it and just turning the machines on or you know they're always going to be human component. I believe there's always human component cra merely because of the legal component but it is also the situation where you will have really specific intense that can be serviced by generation yard. See you we. You might not know it. But it's been around for five plus years six plus years washington post. for example. it's olympic. Season is by the time this will be the end of the olympics but washington post more than five years ago. Launched an analogy platform called heliotrope braff with an app and lg being natural language craft correct natural language generation generation. Okay and it inspired me to really focus on and algae at the products. They were doing template based and rule based and algae one of the examples by the olympics. Is they previous two. With the two thousand sixteen olympics. They were only able to cover about eight twelve. I think the number was percent of the games is it was manually written. But they wrote these programmatic solutions such that they were able to cover all the games. That's natural language generation which is a different branch of artificial intelligence. Natural language processing natural regeneration is building a language model that can right based on having been trained on reading and understanding. Biddle pool of pages is and so. Then you can tune into right like benjamin for example. So what they did they were doing. Basically like mad libs but a smarter madeline right so it would say in this event. The gold went to x. And silver wednesday but they realized that that wasn't going to be uniformly correct. And this is what blew my mind when i heard this washington post was. The event of judo has two bronze medals. So if you programmed all of your mad lives only gold. Silver bronze yudo would be wrong so they had to write basically a rule system in so then their output would be right at the same thing on election coverage they were able to cover one hundred percent of local state and national elections. They used to cover about five percent. It was crazy win on financial sites. They're able to use this type of technology to cover every stock instead of five percent of the stocks so you there's wins in analogy that our template driven at tammy temperature rich but it was never able to be applied to creative writing to content marketing until very recently at the level of of value. That would be needed to perform. Well we are in age now of infinite bad content and that scariest how we are in the age of infant back on. Will we get to age of infinite. Good i don't know right now. The ponies in being able to see it for what it is and understand where you have strengths and weaknesses. The people who can do that and use this livelier gonna win. He blew us. This brazenly and disrespectfully are going to have serious. Armageddon is going to be a disaster. I can already elliott. I can already see it happening. And i already see impacting people in a bad way. It's it's yet another example of too much of a good thing or you can't give people good toys for those of you who are fan of the terminator series. We have some people that are bad actors that are essentially using their blog. Post to develop skynet effectively. Really you see it. Though it's people they see anything is a shortcut. It's not it's a amplifier. You have to differentiate in in product development for this solution on. This is an inside baseball thing. But i think it's really relevant here when we showed people this is the was immature workflow which means people don't get it right only showed people finished content in google. Docs that was generated. Their brains don't work. They look at the content and they judge it is good or bad is just how frameworks right. That isn't a product because if people it's bad with so many people say it's bad it's not gonna work you got to say you're out how to use that as like building blocks or plato to craft something beautiful and until you get that workflow down. It's never going to be able to be adopted by the masses and right now we're in the middle state. They got editor views. You've got dinner editor views and what you have is the really smart people are seeing how they can use this to their advantage in the masses right now on fortunately are using it to build low quality content which doesn't work well look. There's a lot of room to grow when it comes to artificial intelligence created content. I think it is a powerful tool and something that could really amplify like you said with the good search teams are doing. But you know you're if you're copying the behaviors of a good writer. Your artificial intelligence will probably come out with better content as opposed to if you're just copying strategy that doesn't work you're gonna get a bunch more content that doesn't work the end of the day. Jeff you work in an incredibly interesting field. I appreciate you coming in here and talking us through how artificial intelligent is impacting content creation teams. And what some of us can expect down the road. Thanks for being my guest so much. And i give you one little dip frank in considering this. Don't copy the top three search results all right and that wraps up this episode of the voices of search podcast. Thanks for listening to my conversation with jeff. Coyle co founder and chief strategy officer at market abuse. If you'd like to contact. Jeff you can find a link to his linked in profile in our show notes in contact him on twitter where his handle is. Jeffrey underscore coiled. That's j. e. f. f. r. e. y. Underscore co y. L. e. or. You can visit his company's website which is market news dot com a special thanks to search metrics for sponsoring this podcast. Don't forget about their new twenty twenty one offer where you can get twenty percent off of search metrics sweet and supported services until you grow your website by twenty one percent to check out the details of their twenty percents offer go to search metrics dot co slash twenty twenty one offer an especial thanks to address for sponsoring this podcast monitoring. Your website used to require multiple expensive tools. But that's not the case anymore. Thanks to h rifts because they just launched their h. refs webmaster tools product which monitors your seo health helps you keep track of your back links and gives you the insight into what keywords are performing for free so check out. Eight trips webmaster tools at hss dot com slash awt. That's h. h. R. e. f. s. dot com slash a. w. t. Just one more lincoln our show notes. I'd like to tell you about if you didn't have a chance to take notes while you're listening to this podcast head over voices of search dot com where we have summaries of all of our episodes and contact information for our guests. You can also send us your topic suggestions or your seo questions and you can even apply to be a guest speaker on the voices of search podcast. Of course you can always reach out on social media or handle is voices of search on twitter and my personal handle is benjy shop. B and j. j. p. and if you haven't subscribed yet and you wanna daily stream of seo and content strategy insights in your podcast feed. We're gonna publish an episode every day during the workweek so at the subscribe button on your podcast app and we'll be back in your feet in the next business day all right. That's it for today but until next time.
Voices of Search by Searchmetrics
"jeff coyle" Discussed on Voices of Search by Searchmetrics
"And now those teams work together. So there's a couple of different problems here that are being solved. One is evaluating the site. Seems like there's some technology that can be applied there. What do we have where the content gaps to figuring out all right. Well here's what we're missing now. What's the topic and keywords. We run a write about in three. How do we evaluate the actual content for performance. Those are tasks that can be done manually. Painfully talked to me about you where the technology is today through those three phases evaluation research and production. I mean you're saying jones story market. It's right there so we'll speedy begin about a minute ago was age level analysis. Because it's what most people are so comfortable with is the most mature in product management. Call it a mature workflow. It's the end of the road though. It's updating existing page a. Why is because the seo's of the world were only allowed to touch content during their seo. Edit or post publish optimization what i like to do is drag it back earlier. It's because we're not jesse osan being relegated to only having that value on most mature organizations. They need to influence. What happens before you even decide what you're going to write about so that research in that planning our position on and so to do that you have to both understand the topic and understand who you are. Today you've gotta analyze your entire site analyze everything you're performing for any david get your hands on but also eventually looking at competitors looking at competitive landscapes entertaining. Maybe what they're renting for because we go barking. We have to do it so that it works with the site that doesn't even exist. You is a site implanting or it can work with the largest sites in the world so it's about who you are today. Who do you wanna be. So i would say you can bring your own topics. Bya okay bring your own keyword lists. I can throw it in. And we'll tell you where you have authority where you have a competitive advantage where you had gaps. How much content you need to write. And by the way all of this is automated. I can analyze your site. Tell you where you have authority. Tell you how much competitive advantage. How much constant you need to write all with the understanding that when you write that content it had better be great and then we take that to the next year where we're looking at building out. Ideal minimum viable outlines that content. So we build out comprehensive content briefs for writing teams that gives you a guardrail or guide rails for a possible outline questions dancer topics to include subheadings to consider internal and external lincoln recommendations. And what we can say is as long as you cover that at least and maybe you do more. Because you're looks at that. They don't have to do the painful research and how to do the keyword research the seo the writing expert the you know the right or the subject matter expert and the editorial leader all on the same page. You're not going to have a feedback loop that says. Oh you forgot this section because we all got line before you even put pen to pay them. We've got a line with that single source of truth so we've done his both taking the research. The gap analysis content inventory process given people ways that they can prioritize what to write or what to update and then the next day's helping them build outlines quicker and get on the same page. And then like you said taking it to that final part where you're starting to write. There's lots of artificial intelligence or machine learning focused on understanding and interpreting your rankings. There's also a lot of tools that are meant to help you with the content production process. I've seen everywhere from while you're writing. Here's what your score is which dictates how your content should rank in a vacuum. I've seen you know the post evaluation. Here's the content. I'm evaluating. Here's how you should modify the sort of post production type tools and even seen ads intestine as platforms but that are basically like. Why would you write it. The machines will write it for you. What are the tools that actually work and please tell me that. The machines aren't starting to write content for us. Oh the means. Machines are absolutely starting to write for us. So that's all right. I'm buying my bunker. Degeneration wars are on right now open. Ai created. i've been working on natural language generation for many years. We have a product in market. That's better than open which is always great to say it's better than gt three. Who knows what else they're going to build. Google has amazing language models as well but the reason why these things are good. Some of them are general models. Some of them are not edge a lot details but basically you can train language models to write and tune to write really really well now and it's only gonna get better but the key there is it's the same as sourcing it through like a content at work when you receive that draft tax is still have to make sure that you wanna put your name on it or your businesses name on if it's a low quality or you're doing something on max that's going to be problematic. You're gonna run in the major major problems not only with liability. But there's other problems. I'm not gonna tell everybody all the other problems because i've gone through them and i know definitely what they are solve them but really yeah it is and what we find is the teams that look at those types of solutions outlined generation draft examples. If they look at those things as ways to amplify their expertise and ways to give them to speed themselves up and still build content of better. We're finding those teams are just crushing. Because they're seeing these things as ways to supplement. Their experts is joke around. My goal at market is one of them. We set the standard for contact. Quality is our tagline. The my job tagline is. I wanna rid the world of bad constant and so one of the things that i'm going to getting rid of the humans. I always future del. fourteen years. The market for ad content is almost dead because of these things is no longer function to write low quality content like get aid for and over time that market goes away and frankly i love the other parts of they eye understanding content understanding a search results gauge understanding concept to give me ideas of ways that i can be distinguished or differentiated. That's where i think the months. I would say like the money is in the red lines because we have an application called compete of looks at my competitors and it cross-references it against the ideal topic model and shows me stuff. Nobody's talking about. That's how i differentiate my page and it's an instant winner for concise with thirty. So i'm always looking for ways to make sure that my teams no that's about differentiation quality comprehensiveness and ensuring that your angle needs favourite intents or at least is one of the candidate.
Voices of Search by Searchmetrics
"jeff coyle" Discussed on Voices of Search by Searchmetrics
"Bridge toll california customer service number highway miles to the gallon. Ford focus highland cave rescue operation s fest wine bars in san carlos california best western hotels out oldest rinaldi. What happened with the engagement for wedding. Should i said what he needed to be the first series. I'm avenue to check on other email clients. Identify fonts from where apply where the world ride style. Welcome to the voices of search podcast. I'm your host benjamin shapiro today. We're gonna talk a little. Seo strategy joining us is jeff coil. Who's the co founder and chief strategy officer at market news. Which is an ai platform that transforms how you research plan and create your content market muse platform uses a i to accelerate content planning creation and optimization by identifying content quality issues on your site and building blueprints that show how to write to cover a topic comprehensively so far this week jeff and i have talked about. Seo content strategy and also yesterday we continue the conversation talking about the difference between keywords and topics and today we're going to continue the conversation talking about how to bring humans and search pots together to improve your seo rankings. This podcast is brought to you by search metrics. You know last year was rough in. Seo ended life for a lot of people and now that we're more than halfway through twenty twenty one. Most of us are just starting to shake the rust off from twenty twenty. So if you or your seo. Performance need a boost search. Metrics has a new offer for you. If you sign up a search metrics now you can get twenty percent off not just a search metric sweet but the whole range of search metrics is supported services until you your performance by twenty one percent as an industry leading seo software solutions partner. Search metrics is confident that their platform an expert support will help you reach your seo targets before the end of twenty twenty one. They're performance based off or we'll help you. Strengthen your sides visibility outpaced your competitors and reach your optimal rank positions so put their offer to the test and save twenty percent on search metrics as software and services until your website has grown by twenty one percent in twenty twenty one to check out the details of this offer go to search metrics dot co slash. Twenty twenty one offer. Miss podcast is also sponsored by h refs. What if i told you that you could monitor your websites. Seo health back links and organic rankings at no costs sounds too good to be true. Well it's not because my friends at address just launched a traffic's webmaster tools. Actress new webmaster tools product quickly. Helps you improve your sights visibility by pointing solutions to over one hundred technical issues that might be holding your search performance down plus. Awt monitors for back links. So you'll know the most linked to pages and how those links are affecting your rankings and awt shares what keywords your website ranks for and compares how you stack up against competitors for key metrics like search volume keyword difficulty and traffic value. Look monitoring your website used to require multiple expensive tools and now. Thanks to eight drafts. That's not the case anymore because. Awt will help you. Monitor your seo. Health back links and keywords four free and no. It's not one of those fourteen day. Free trial offers. It's a powerful sight audit tool that will keep working for you for free so check out. Hfs webmaster tools at hhs dot com slash a. w. t. That's a h. R. e. f. s. dot com slash a. w. t. all right on with the show. Here's the last of my conversation with jeff. Coil co founder and chief strategy officer at market muse. Jeff welcome back to the voices of search podcast. Thanks benjamin is just excited to continue our conversation and yesterday we left off talking about the difference between keywords and topics and in a part of the challenge is you know you got a ton of keywords words that you're optimizing for individual strings your long tail those build into topics but you have to understand the user intent at the same time all that gets together in a big fund soup of your seo rankings and hopefully gets you some domain authority and helps you get to the head terms that you're trying to get to. It ends up being really complicated today. You have to understand intent. You have to understand topics you have to understand. Keywords drew evaluating those across multiple pages potentially even multiple different sites. It's overwhelming for a human to actually think about how to do this at large scale. And that's where you and market news comes in you know you. You bring the the machines that the robots sky net you know whatever it artificial intelligence which is probably taking over the world. But we're enjoying at least for now. talk to me about how you know. Humans and the search pots are living together in harmony now about the basics of the way that a lot of folks learn as you go right is the way that he will initially learn. Things like competitive cohort. Analysis is kinda naturally. Go look at the search results. Go right something. That's better than what you see right. And so that was something that we want to tackle with technology. We realized that that wasn't good. Enough cava meaningful impact on most businesses. We knew we had to do was analyzed the concepts and really understand it so we had to analyze not just ten ages because there are so many problems can come up if that can cover that but we want to analyze this word. This concept that you're up we might need to read hundreds of thousands of pages we might need to look at natural language databases that we own or manage to understand what it means to be an expert on this topic and then we wanna overlay that with what ranking. That's where we have kind of changed marketers ability to understand what it would actually need to be an expert on topic with technology is. We're taking this huge. Collect the romans building the golden model this act. We call the topic expert or the topic universe so underneath this topic. There's thousands hundreds of thousands of concepts consider. We can tell you which ones are most relevant which ones are most likely to be included in a speech by the most amazing expert because we analyze this content. We can tell the difference between a bad. Seo we can tell. The difference between seo who is learning from google ad words keyword planner when they were the article. We can tell the difference between its jets fun or it's actually run run by expert and that's real different than just looking at the top three pages and saying do better and so. That's the first way we look to tackle the most frequent challenge for seo's and why seo's were so misunderstood. Seo's really misunderstood.
Voices of Search by Searchmetrics
"jeff coyle" Discussed on Voices of Search by Searchmetrics
"Because i got people coming in and they leave unhappy. I'm so my pool of pages represents not only the mass that allows me to unlock head terms unlock topic performance but it also represents the infrastructure that can drive plans based on like surgical striking and one of those ways is intent mismatch. The other one is if i'm ranking for head terms and not ranking for lower competition variance. Because i'm not satisfied. That tells me a lot about me right. It could tell me. I don't have anything in the middle of the fun is working with the large publisher of ever alert. Those i was working with a large publisher who just realized that they had no traffic coming from the middle. And i'm like yeah. You don't have any that does that. And they're like. Yeah but can. I just like rank work because like i owned the main topic and like no. You've never written content. That tells the story that you know comparison. You're not a comparison shopping engine. You have never ridden concept for someone in the middle of the foul. You've only ridden early. Stage awareness is the gosh darn name of the site right and so if you think you can just go right in a versus b. Arbel because you own the head and you own google stated attempt which adds to wearing your sorely mistaken. You've got to build sometimes even when you own the head. You don't own details so you need the jaw. You need the teeth. And you need to understand where you have the wins because if you just go out and try to knock out long tail they call it the old techniques two thousand five coins long tailing right. You just go right belong tail and hope that unlocks your invitation to the party so that you can write for the pillar or the middle of the head. It doesn't work anymore. it doesn't work. You can go do that and get lucky. 'cause as low competition but you really need to be thinking about the entire user journey. I just saw it happen with the june july up. Is i've done some extensive multi million site analyses and one major thing is the way to google allows intense to be evaluated and the biggest finding that i had was sites that dropped in authority on their topics can no longer ranch or non. The nose intent so give me an example of that yet short so an example of that would be which is used crm. 'cause i don't wanna give exact examples. It's a hot topic for us today for us today. let's say. I was ranking for customer relationship management before and i was also reading for best customer relation management software also ranking for customer relationship management. Free and i was making for best. Crm tools and compare crm tools. And they were all. I was very high authority for that top clearly. A my site right but my page that was performing. Maybe i was told i should only have one h right and i just got into my authority. Goes down on this concept. This concept site section pair. My page never really followed through with comparing software. It was a what is type article right. it never really got into comparing so previously. I had so much authority. And i could get away with non on the nose satisfaction for users but now my authority drops now. I don't get away with being able to rank with a what is page on a comparison query. The only people that can get away with that are the ultra high thorn because they actually cover. They're getting more credit credibility. So when i see a third one signal of authority drop or game is that you're able to rank for off not on the nose intense when you're lower thirty you've got to be right on the nose specifically and then if you're even lower you can't even get invited to the party. I'm in this. Those are the ways that i think about this. The problem becomes is really complex to not only think about ranking for individual keywords which hopefully have a lot of but also topics and then thinking about domain authority in your head terms. So we're gonna talk a little bit more about how to bring all of those together and how you can use technology to tackle your seo strategy in tomorrow's episode so that wraps up this episode of the voices of search podcasts. Thanks for listening to my conversation with jeff. Coyle co founder and chief strategy officer at market muse in the third part of this conversation which will publish tomorrow. Jeff and i are going to talk about how to bring humans and search costs together to improve your rankings. If you can't wait until the next episode and you'd like to contact jeff you could find a link to his linked in profile on our show notes. You can contact him on twitter where his handle. Is jeffrey underscore coil. That's j. e. f. f. r. e. y. Underscore co y. L. e. or. You could visit his company's website which is market muse dot com a special thanks to search metrics for sponsoring this podcast. Don't forget about their new twenty twenty one offer where you can get twenty percents off of search metrics sweet and supported services until you grow your website by twenty one percent to check out the details of their twenty percents off offer to search metrics dot co slash twenty twenty one offer and a special thanks to h rafts for sponsoring this podcast monitoring. Your website used to require multiple expensive tools. But that's not the case anymore. Thanks to h rifts because they just launched their h. refs webmaster tools product which monitors your seo health helps you keep track of your back links and gives you the insight into what keywords are performing for free so check out. Eight trips webmaster tools at h. Dot com slash. Awt that's eight drafts. h. r. e. f. s. dot com slash a. w. t. Just one more lincoln. Our show notes. I'd like to tell you about if you didn't have a chance to take notes while you're listening to this podcast head over to voices of search dot com where we have summaries of all of our episodes and contact information for our guests. You can also send us your topic suggestions or your seo questions and you can even apply to be a guest speaker on the voices of search podcast. Of course you can always reach out on social media or handle is voices of search on twitter and my personal handle is benjy shop. Be j. s. h. a. p. And if you haven't subscribed jet and you wanna daily stream of marketing and technology knowledge in your podcast feed in addition to the third part of our conversation with jeff coyle co founder and chief strategy officer upmarket music. We're gonna publish episode every day during the workweek so at the subscribe button on your podcast app. And we'll be back in interfered tomorrow morning. All right that's it for today but until next time remember. The answers are always in the data..
Voices of Search by Searchmetrics
"jeff coyle" Discussed on Voices of Search by Searchmetrics
"Favored intent can grow so i need this mountain of content. That's all coverage and building up power and building up authority to enable my page that needs the favored intent to go to the party. And that's the part that people miss is you do need this fortress in order to allow the whatever that pages and the mistake able make is they look at the search result in isolation and they say oh there's nine definitions on this search results page. I just need to go write a better definition. That's a piece of but if you don't have that foundation of content you don't have the invitations of the party and that invitation to the part is required so that favorite is handed shot. Yeah nobody fracture in the sirte google favored. So if you see pay. Google has some pages from a some pages from office. See this surpr- features whether knowledge crap wizards shopping fi local. But if there's other intense on you have a list ical and you have a definition and you have you know you've got to be thinking about your real estate that you can enable with this one power page the page that you except iraq for this. You have a smaller pool right now. And google can change that favored in overtime to. They could say tomorrow that all listed goals should perform for this particular weary right. The important part is to collect the entire pool of words that make up the pool of topics that then click to that head topic. When you're doing this now asus and understand you. Do you have the power to rank with a page. That isn't on the nose intent and most of the time answered that question to be not so you need to write content a satisfies the user intent and also provides information gain that your competitor now. So it tells they actually come to your site. You make them happy and they feel like they've learned of it right. Oh shocking right and you can't just get away with this formula and they're the only reason why people make this mistake of just building the one big page. It's because that's the way they were trained how to do seo but guess what doesn't work it only works. You already have the authority and you have this auxiliary bias and that bias is that you say i already right about this stuff so then i can write this wonderful page and it will perform the biases. You don't actually know your true authority ends of knowing that is very empowering. Here's what i think is interesting. I'm actually looking at the search results for crm. And i have an incognito browser session and a a non incognito a regular browser session and the search results are different. I don't think that should be too surprising to everybody. In the incognito window i get wikipedia a definition of what crm is i followed by top rated sierra imbizo ho- what it looks like cricchio with a what is a crm system more of a definition and then a similar page from hub spot. And there's a a yahoo page down there as well which is also a definition of it. Looks like it's yahoo finance now in the non incognito the regular browser session do you know what comes up. I hubs by off which was the fourth result from before. And the reason why i bring this up is i have a relationship with hub. Spot there the sponsor of the lead sponsor of the mar tech podcast. I'm on their properties very often. I look at their content regularly and we've been featured on their content as well. So google knows that i have some sort of a relationship and trust with hub spot because of how much i'm going to their site most likely and so that pushes their content up in the search results and said the reason i bring this up as we're talking about topics versus keywords if i want to rank for crm. If i'm hub spot. And i want to show up. I for crm. The first thing i need to do is get people onto my website in probably tail terms instead of just thinking about the head term so you need to be finding broader coverage so to me. This is the exact example of why does a topic matter more than an individual keywords. Why do you need to think about casting a wide net to what you wanna rank for as opposed to specifically focus on keywords. Now that's really hard to monitor. It's really hard to evaluate so when you're thinking about well all right. I've got these broad topics and people look for key words. How do i figure out if i'm ranking for. The topic talked me about evaluating a topic as opposed to keyword for seo performance. That's a great thing and two of the pieces to backpedaling through what you had stated one example you know. Crm salesforce that's their stock symbol as well. She can get an even a unique dynamic there that adds color to that particular search result hump sponsor great example of cluster development of illegal contact. Plus i like to say you got its jaw with t. Sometimes people go out and they just right teeth when they don't have the job sometimes. That's gonna work sometimes. It's not it's like throwing dice. It's going to work when you have some existing authority on semantically related things. You have a low competition zone. You can go right back. Read articles satisfies the intent. And it's gonna work house by is a great example of that where they've taken shots at explicit intent use cases and they've done well but they also built grape clusters and when they get one when they get one working throughout by the way. I'm going to answer your questions then. Is it working throughout that entire pool of pages all represents this massive power than they can channel power. They'll often channel. Those pounds does power sources landing digits on fact. But you can only do that when you're really powerful and if you wanna go check out really great example. Check out web dot archive dot org for humps by for all of their topic. Gloucester's contents and go back in time and wash how that's developed a really oil use case i with homespun but basically. How do you monitor this. You've got to monitor these things as individual pages. And you've got a monitor them as collectives both understanding the pages based on the user patterns the pages that users who enter a that they will likely see based on your internal linking structures but also the ones that all connect to the same semantic about nestor about -ness of the topic. So i need to know all the pages on my site that connect to crm. And then i need to go into my second year. It's contact center. Maybe it's customer service. Customer success maybe. It's some other topics. And i need to know alligators. I have that specifically focus on contact center or call center then and he didn't know my specific intent aids right gets. How do you get bs at your garage is. Is this really really specific question. Sounds like something that you've searched for. Recently my customer read article recently so you get a sense for the pool. Now treat that as a mass that you want to report on and then also you wanna know the standout agents. You also want to know the pages that have characteristics. That will drive new plants and the new plans. Maybe because it wins right if you get a a page trying to target head term or trying to target a topic and his ranking that the page doesn't follow through with right we reference that as an intent mismatch. I want to report on this pool. Because i can say i have no pages in my pool that answer this question or satisfied this intent however i got traffic from an it s the easiest sale for budget to go. Write that article..
Voices of Search by Searchmetrics
The Difference Between Keywords and Topics With MarketMuse Co-Founder Jeff Coyle
"Talk to me a little bit about the the difference between keywords topics and wire breath depth important in the both of those or so. A topic is more like a concept so it can be an entity. It's a group of concepts and a keyword will typically live inside that pool of topics right so good way to think about a somewhat higher. But i like to connect key words to intent as well in addition to talking about topics keywords so semantic relatedness typically relates to the saying if you are going to cover this one topic. It's highly likely or these are other related topics to that core topic and keywords can live at it within those like. I always joke around. It's like there's keywords that a live within a topic it's the square rectangle thing. There's sometimes you don't know the difference between a keyword as how great Approach all of those things similarly to say. I want to cover this really well. I want to achieve goals for the user. That i'm gonna write against and if i'm going to build on a topic that is general right. I one hundred. Are there different meanings for this specific topic. How fractured is the specific topic for intense. So if people are searching for this specific topic are they at different stages of the funnel that's intent fracture but they also could be meaning descended. Uation i mean right. So if it's an acronym if somebody's typing in crm a might be talking about customer like you should management. That might be talking about you. Know some other for that thing in your case. When you're talking about ben shapiro versus benjamin shapiro. We're talking about two person entities. That have different needs right so it's a little bit different there but the topics that you cover you wanna be covering them so that it tells the story that you actually know what you're talking about so you have all the intense covers. You have all those keyword variants covered. But you're telling that story the same way
Voices of Search by Searchmetrics
"jeff coyle" Discussed on Voices of Search by Searchmetrics
"That really harnessed that. You have editorial control only when you have authority so good view just writing something. You don't know how well it's going to perform. This is something that i vote. isn't that mark. Each vote was designed. It's i want confidence among content confidence. I want to know that if i publish a great article on this topic will it perform. Can i predict the performance. Or will i know that. Hey i not only need this one page. But i need to build an entire cluster on this topic in order to move the needle for my teed that lack of confidence plagues content because then they go out if big is just about looking at their competitors and writing. A better article is not just about that. You do need to do that but you also have to have expectations set of where you currently stand. Do you need coverage of these fifteen other intents within this topic or these other stages of funnel in order to make that that monster that tiller aged that our page star to grow we'd find a so many people think that they can just go along great peace and it's going to work on gonna just not reality. It's like if you go build. Benjamin shapiro's blog and you go right. The highest the most amazing consummated. You've ever seen about plastic. They're still a political podcast her. That's going to outrank me. For my own name. I'll guide diet should years. Is that such a terrible example. But if you're the most the best article ever about your new iphone your review it's ten thousand words. It's the most beautiful imagery lock but if you're on c. Net number one. Why my It's funny i used. it's not lace. Search metrics is content explorer which probably a little competitive with market mused. But it's a service that helps you understand how your content should rank and for my other podcast mar tech podcast when people are looking for the term martic. The most commonly searched for query is. What is martin so we wrote the what is mar tech page with a ninety nine percent rating on this content experience tool and we're ranking in the thirties and a big part of that is we're competing against martic today and you know brands that have a larger and a better reputation and so you know it brings me to this concept of breath and depth right often. Seo's thank all. I need is depth. All i need is one great piece of content and that i will rank in reality. You need great content for the topic that you wanna cover but you also need breath and other topics that you could build your domain reputation and that's what we're going to talk about as we continue this conversation tomorrow. So that wraps up this episode of the voices of search podcast. Thanks for listening to my conversation with jeff. Coyle co founder and chief strategy officer at market muse and partout this interview which will publish tomorrow. Jeff and i are going to talk about the difference between keywords and topics if you can't wait until the next episode and you'd like to contact jeff you could find a link to his linked in profile on our show notes. You can contact him on twitter where his handle is jeffrey underscore coil at j. e. f. f. r. e. y. Underscore co y. l. e. or. You can visit his company's website which is market muse dot com a special thanks to search metrics for sponsoring this podcast. Don't forget about their new twenty twenty one offer where you can get twenty percent off of search metrics sweet and supported services until you grow your website by twenty one percent to check out the details of their twenty percents offer good a search metrics dot co slash. Twenty twenty one offer and especial thanks to h rafts for sponsoring this podcast monitoring. Your website used to require multiple expensive tools. But that's not the case anymore. Thanks to h refs because they just launched their h. Refs webmaster tools product which monitors your seo health helps you keep track of your back links and gives you the insight into what keywords are performing for free so check out. Eight trips webmaster tools at h. Refs dot com slash. Awt that's eight drafts. h. r. e. f. s. dot com slash a. w. just one more lincoln. Our show notes. I'd like to tell you about if you didn't have a chance to take notes while you're listening to this podcast head over to voices of search dot com where we have summaries of all of our episodes and contact information for our guests. You can also send us your topic suggestions or your seo questions and you can even apply to be a guest speaker on the voices of search podcast. Of course you can always reach out on social media or handle is voices of search on twitter and my personal handle is benjy shop. Be and j. s. h. a. p. And if you haven't subscribed yet and you wanna daily stream of marketing and technology knowledge in your podcast feed in addition to part two of my conversation with jeff coyle co founder and chief strategy officer upmarket mused. We're gonna publish an episode every day during the workweek so at the subscribe button on your podcast app. And we'll be back in her feet tomorrow morning. All right that's it for today but until next time remember. The answers are always in the data..
Voices of Search by Searchmetrics
"jeff coyle" Discussed on Voices of Search by Searchmetrics
"You know whatever course they take in and a lot of times. It's sort descend by search volume for how they decide what they're going to write and what we found is just a doesn't work makes you susceptible to competitive factors and it doesn't really cover the whole journey that you're trying to cover with content so there's three ways to think about your content strategy. There is the. Let's call it the awareness driving. Maybe your pr team looking at traffic. Your seo teams looking at rankings and trying to figure out how to optimize for google in your demand gen team is thinking about. Well what's getting across the finish line in reality. You need all three of those to be effective driving organic traffic in the drive awareness in the to nurture your leads and obviously you want to drive revenue. You need to think about the bottom of the funnel you mentioned sorting by will. What's driving traffic or sorting by ranking. What's the kpi that you should be looking at to figure out effective content strategies yen. And that's a beautiful question because it's that's the difficult divide on these seats and one of the core reasons why we mark abuse was to get all those teams working together and focused on what it means like. We want to represent our business really. Well we want to become authorities on topics we care about and when everybody can get aligned on the fact that it's not just one page two one word it's about a collective of content crosses you may need early stage awareness contents. That's ziprecruiter bill. So that it's attractive to a total novice. You may need it for a particular industry. You may need early-stage awareness content for experts in your field. Depending on how novel your approaches or knobbly solution services. And then the zine thing for middle of on-scene thing for bottom of the falls and the days of one word to one page as a process have frankly. They've never been legit for at least ten years. But would you often find is people could so afraid of letting the team coverage topic comprehensively. Ross lots of agents the myth of cannibalization. This glitch that you get these sites that don't cover the talk at all or they don't have a big chunks of intense missing the big jumps of the funnel and or they're fighting over the you know which side so basically the practical application of this is to say if we want to cover this comprehensively. We need to have early. Stage awareness content middle of funnel. Late-stage remaining industry specific or persona specific we may need beginner intermediate novice. We like any type of women you could slice it to be able to compete on a particular topic. We may need a huge foundation of content. The covers everything underneath it based on the competitive landscape and based on existing gardens so the kpi that everybody needs to get connected. Who is that. They're providing a package of content that exhibits companies expertise and tells the world that they know what they're talking about. And then everyone that's gonna come to. That site can make their way throughout that journey whether they're early-stage awareness and plus the forgotten part of the journey which this is the part you didn't mention and a lot of teams struggle with is post purchase trouble-shooting or post purchase champion development. People that have already bought your products. You need to cultivate those experiences to because what are they want to know. How do they want. It's endlessly learn at anytime your company you need to be there on both the troubleshooting and the post purchase i call it. Emboldening or champion development onset. That's the way you cover the top accomplishments. Let's lead generation and more customer nurturing but does that an seo strategy once somebody has become a customer. They still looking on google for a resource to understand how to use your products or services or is that more of kind of a retention and email marketing type thing. It's absolutely jimmy. Is both of those things. But it is absolutely a surgeon. John visitation strategy so many teams have cordoned off help sections of their site and they don't know what to do with them. I mean i've worked with teams extensively is one of the most if you wanna hot tip. If you're value websites a lot of times. We love hot tips. Fire away completely. Devalued forums are completely devalued because their click through rates on ads are typically very low so their contribution to evaluation of website is very low a. forums and high-quality online help sections or user generated content. Sections could can be major value sources of fuel sources for editorial content. Because if you're forum is a expert on a particular style of laptop let's say you inlet say your editorial team doesn't right about that will you're gonna have a lot easier time building a cluster of content relates to that. Maybe it's going from. What is this. Comparison reviews all the way down the funnel. You can have a huge power source from those types of offerings also. It's a way to make sure you can't control the journ if you are a beat tech for example and you don't people go to g. to crowd you're sorely mistaken if you don't think they go to capterra you're sorely mistaken right not read intech target. You can't control the whole funnel and so you wanna be in as many places as you can. And that's where a lot of people fall short with trouble-shooting champion development. And what the people who are doing champion development really well tend to jokes on everybody and be affiliates for the products that they're using and people are reading about other people who are creating having the successful experience but it's also people who are in early early stage awareness the same content that can embolden a recent user. That's navy struggling to adopt can be very powerful for early stage awareness as well so we i. It's the hold on the cool part about that is when the search engines are calculating authoritativeness. They're looking at your entire site. They're also looking at it incite sections to understand the topic site session combinations and where you have strengths and where you have we insist and so having that coverage both across the channel specific topic specific industries tells the story that you've got the breads and the depth of coverage which is an important part of the story for. We're gangsters performance. Yeah you know. I think of what you're talking about specifically ready to what will call customer marketing as opposed to lead marketing or customer. Seo for some reason that the site that comes to mind is go daddy right. Lots of forums. Lots of examples lots of content. That's user generated. They've got a great community all of that's credible and searchable and so when you're thinking about well we're sti- by domain or what are the services will go daddy shows up a ton in seo for all of that content of monday dot com a tool that we use pretty regularly. Also you know. They've got some help sections but often their users are writing in trying to solve people's problems. How do i use this type of formula or this tool creates user generated content and it serves both purposes. If i'm trying to figure out if the tool can do you know abyan z. Function you know. When i'm searching as a prospect or is it a customer that content's relevant and so google sees that looks at the click through rates and then all of a sudden they start to pick up some ranking into market share. Just look at the search engine optimization profile of a site like stack exchange how. They done what they've done with the capterra ritchie to at target to some extent which is the company iran in house for almost eight years two hundred sixty websites full gamut coverage cross the by cycle aggravates early stage. What is all the way down to trouble shooting center teams..
Voices of Search by Searchmetrics
"jeff coyle" Discussed on Voices of Search by Searchmetrics
"Most of us are just starting to shake the rust off from twenty twenty. So if you or your seo. Performance need a boost. Search metrics has a new offer for you. If you sign up a search metrics now you can get twenty percent off not just a search metric sweet but the whole range of search metrics is supported services until you grow your performance by twenty one percent as an industry leading seo software solutions partner. Search metrics is confident that their platform an expert support will help you reach your seo targets before the end of twenty twenty one. They're performance based offer will help you. Strengthen your sides visibility outpaced your competitors and reach your optimal rank positions so put their offer to the test and save twenty percent on search metrics as software and services until your website has grown by twenty one percent in twenty twenty one to check out the details of this offer go to search metrics dot co slash twenty twenty one offer. Miss podcast is also sponsored by h refs. What if i told you that you could monitor your websites. Seo health back links and organic rankings at no costs. Sounds too good to be true. Well that's not because my friends at address just launched a refs webmaster tools atroush new webmaster tools product quickly helps you improve your sights visibility by pointing solutions to over one hundred technical issues that might be holding your search performance down plus eight monitors for back links. So you'll know the most linked to pages and how those links are affecting your rankings and awt shares what keywords. Your website ranks for and compares. How you stack up against competitors for key metrics like search volume keyword difficulty and traffic value. Look monitoring your website used to require multiple expensive tools and now. Thanks to eight drafts. That's not the case anymore because. Awt will help you monitor seo health back links and keywords for free and no. It's not one of those fourteen day. Free trial offers. It's a powerful sight audit tool that will keep working for you for free so check out. Hfs webmaster tools at hhs dot com slash a. w. t. That's a h. R. e. f. s. dot com slash a. w. t. all right. Here's the first part of my conversation with jeff. Coyle co founder and chief strategy officer at market muse. Jeff welcome to the voices of search podcast. Thanks dan great beards excited to have you as my guest excited to talk a little. Seo strategy you know. You're a man of many talents You've been doing some lead generation previously in your career at an obviously a talented seo and content strategist gives a little background on. You know your work and what you're doing market news. Yes you're so as you mentioned we're artificial intelligence platform that really sets the standard for content. Quality really focused on identifying what we should be creating. What we should be updating. Where do we have strengths and weaknesses gaps and opportunities where we have authority more. Do we need to grow. And but then going all the way down to execution. No building comprehensive content briggs creating kind of point solutions for specific. Workflows that as. Seo's you do all the time whether it's competitive analysis comparison of search engine results topic modeling. Whatever but my background now doing this for steroids. It might sound about twenty two ish years. I went said the georgia tech computer science and while it was still there started with my first startup knowledge storm where we were doing content marketing in trying to get beat that companies to know that they should have content on the web so we are actually convincing them to digitize brochures white papers and get them online so that we could generate leads with those on. I did that need for twenty seven. We were fired by major tech publisher. Where i worked in managed in house but throughout that time as a product manager ran all the traffic through that large website network in really built my skills in all ranges that kind of connect to what it means to be a search optimization professional today but most notably the tail end of that working with editorial and content teams and realizing just how manual and painful those processes were in. How a lot of. It was very subjective and i had manual processes took thirty forty hours of time still would get subjectively rejected by editorials enes. And that's when i met my co founder and he has the first person to really speed up and use artificial intelligence automate one process or topic modeling. That says basically. If i'm an expert and i'm covering a topic comprehensively. How would i do that with one page. However i do that on my site within context of my site or my network. If i'm a publishing publishing gets many sides and from that we've built all the solutions that we now manifest as mark. Abe's so you've been working in. Seo and content marketing in some capacity since the white text on a white background days. Oh yes ninety nine my first audit. I would say what. I'm going to probably album. Albert was ninety nine for sure. I you gotta find the text and then you have to figure out whether it's relevant and how the search engines are going to interpret the good old days a little easier to do content marketing and content strategy back. Then because it was about digitizing what you'd already produced now in a much more competitive landscape and you mentioned that you had some processes that were very manual taking thirty forty hours and and we're starting to see you know the bots and the machines take over some of those processes talk to me a little bit about the strategy of content marketing as you see it in a. What's the general process. You follow to figure out what a site should be. Writing what what assets a site has an where they're content gaps. Are i think that one thing. I commonly will ask gene is. How frequently are you performing what you see as being content inventory or a content audit. I think the biggest challenge the medium to large sized teams have is there not frequently assessing the tuning their own mirrors as to what they term it has when they're doing it often kind of doing a sort descend by traffic or they're doing sort descend by. What gets you the most lease. They're not thinking politically as to what it means to be about a concept and are they covering that topic comprehensively across their entire site so they don't know the collection of content as contributing to for example their authority on some topics. It really often looking at them as one page to value connections and. That's where one thing that. I talked teams. That's commonly something that's a problem with often leads to his team's not getting along just to be blind. The folks in charge of traffic as their kpi or released age awareness content aren't jiving with demand. Gen folks there. Nobody's jogging with the editorial team in really there are not connected to the thirteen mile so i like to talk to about funke's about that process and new market news. We automated in online content inventory audit. That's always available so you can always see. Higher pages are doing how they're performing all the topics that the pages connect to do you answer the users coming to your page that are searching for x. Does your page follow through and satisfy the intent that was expected or is it a mismatch so we cover all these things. And it's really getting. Your question connects to. How do you plan. How do you prioritize on. I think the will we often will see as the teams that are just getting started have learned from who whatever.