19 Episode results for "Jamieson"

Ep. #139 - Brett Baugh, Kathy Delbalzo and Paula Smith

Beach Talk Radio

1:02:47 hr | 2 months ago

Ep. #139 - Brett Baugh, Kathy Delbalzo and Paula Smith

"Talk radio he's beach. Talk radio Mrs america and all ships at sea. This is your captain. Bean gene gene. The falling test shit saw a sonar lar- cable and atomic attack longer live from peach timeout in the heart of times square. You're listening to talk. Radio with kim. And ed ryan and everybody welcome to beach. Talk radio episode number one hundred and thirty nine coming to you. Live from fort myers beach in the state of florida. We are lucky. The last name of our governor is dishonest and very lucky. The last name of our governor is not cuomo and we're also lucky that we'd all live in portland where they encouraged looting. And we live in florida where you're encouraged to shoot. Looters we are in our home studio with. He's pushing out all the words like that today. I can't get through one introduction of the show without you interrupting practice. It was gonna be smooth because you have to emphasize the looting you have to emphasize the shooting. It says sensational stop. We are at our home studio at peach timeout where we've been broadcasting the show every saturday since august the fifth two thousand and two and you missed one two thousand and eighteen and eleven o'clock today we're going to be down at hoosiers in paradise for another listener viewer appreciation party. So if you're around fort myers beach. We encourage you to stop by and spend some of your hard earned money with the folks at hoosiers after you have breakfast here. At pete's time out it's a lovely day on the beach. Nice and cool a nice breeze and we wanna give a shout out to all of our great sponsors and supporters has always island oils. Llc fort myers tiki tours nervous. Natalie's wave tally state insurance. Usa son pals vacation all the restaurant took away cafe and blue ribbon events. Wow please sign up for a biweekly newsletter. Where you get all the news on the beach. Every tuesday and friday at seven o'clock and you put so much work into the newsletter this week i just wanna say thank you very much did a locally later in the show today. I'm being very sarcastic later in the show today We're gonna talk a little bit about the mass. Because i want you to give your opinion on the mask that'll be later on. After our guests we're going to talk about the world's toughest mater which is a coming up in november in nevada in two thousand and twenty one. That's eight twenty four race that you signed up for and hopefully we can cajole kim into talking about the story from two weeks ago. Not going to happen. I do want to say though. I do wanna say i wanna i wanna have out to peggy. Who came down a from dr bouchard's as she won the trunk truckers trumpsters. Trunk are right. What is it trucker. Is that cover. Your trunk of your car. Is that what that is now. I think it's like a man's rap. Oh she's gonna come on and listen for folks who won somebody won the mug and because of your disorganization considering. I have a new camera so go ahead show. We're going to show it off so please. Whoever won the mug. Let me know. go look at that. Bronx you wrap that around man for some reason. Why do why do you wrap around in its it. Looks like it'd be pocket on the front of that pocket might be something we hang out in the back or something like that Yeah very nice. Is that nice guy. And peggy works at dr bouchard's office and dr bouchard is like the only dentist on the beach right. Hope we're pronouncing that correctly sean. What trunk nice. It is very nice and that was courtesy of at the mermaid. That's right that's where we got it from blue ribbon events late so much and coming down to thank you for coming down and also thank you for modeling that it's a lovely color. I appreciate her coming down and loves to show you. I apologize to people profusely. It's been a little rough with the weather and schedules to get the gifts out but we are doing the best we can and i'm gonna make some deliveries today again. Whoever won the mug. Please get ahold of head. Because i don't know who it is all right so now we're bringing on our next guest. I guessed year. We say. I guess to our i guess we says store second-guessed and right now folks this is a brett ball. I say that right brecciated brad. Scott radio voice. Everybody notice an austin ears. That's right and the reason bread is here is because he's representing jim and sharon jamieson and jim and sharon a run the foundation spirit of christmas. And you can check them out on facebook we We attach the facebook page. Try and give you guys an idea. And i'll let you go into the history but from what i understand from talking to jim. Who was a resident here. Part time i think and then he goes to canada he. He raises like seventy five thousand dollars and then finds families that have kids. That probably won't get any gifts or a lot of gifts. And he gives the money away. He gives it to them to go to walmart. They go shopping and And him explain why. I wanted to make to make it clear that people understand that. I know what. I'm talking about every once in a while. Thank you can thank you first for having do appreciate it Spirit of christmas was founded. Your real hair down here is if it's my real hair. I've never dyed my hair. There is kind have to try. Walmart brand is not very slick here like this move at all. I try just jealous. Because he doesn't have a self. I've been self her cut it out. I swear haircut that. I just do was scissors or their own with with clippers clippers. I know a hidden town. Continue that i didn't know that i had with the pandemic right now. An excellent to well overheard your conversational. I know actually. The dry cleaner is I was talking about you know the young lady was over. Your wife does a great job ironing. My wife is never ironed. One item of clothing. I to chef school way back today and so we had to be pressed ourselves close had to be pressed creases in. So i'm the iron now so you iron and cut your cut your wife's hair to iron her clothes she's no fun. Yeah so how. Do you know. Jim and sharon so i bought a house on here in two thousand and ten and so their office was actually kind of the people and their made front that Took care of me as far as getting my house purchased. So that's where i originally met jim and sharon and joe and whole clan So they knew. I was an auctioneer and they asked me for years to get involved at spirit of christmas. Hey we've got the silent auction. It's held at the american legion post american And so that's where it has been so the you guys go around to businesses get donations from the business and then you auction those off. And it's the money that comes in from that that they use to then do what. Where do they go and they go to. Basically jim and sharon have a bunch of organizations that they work with. So they'll get calls and say. Hey we have these children or families in need. So they vet the process so khazanah. Children's hospital of southwest. Florida is one of the the the contact them They also have Teachers a lot of teachers in lee county social workers and other organizations that there's a women's shelter that they help so basically They have calls. And so we raise the money and then they Distributed to all of those children and families and organizations that they vet and Make them or give them a christmas. That they otherwise wouldn't have and so do they. Are they sticking with walmart every year. Do they go to walmart. Is that how it works. And then i was reading that walmart does some donation to but they also set up two lanes just for the fam- their families come and bay just shop and that has been the way we anticipated working. We're still working through the details. You know we're trying to do some form of socially distanced shopping process and and And check out and again. I'm jim carey one of the reasons why they're not here. I'm here and i'm so thankful to be here with you guys That they share in his head some health issues this this past year so it's very important to them that they say safe with the current state of our world and our new new norm and So but they're working on that but it will be at walmart again. So how did this whole organization star. What was jim's thinking behind getting this rolling with doing charity work around. Southwest florida prior to founding the spirit of christmas He like one of the things that i've talked a lot with him about the week is is he wanted to make a change in children's lives truly and sharon and there's there's so many stories again and i'm gonna look down at this number six thousand children in and over twelve hundred families That they have helped. And so every time i talked to him. He chokes up you know he chokes up and and again it's so meaningful to them as far as just making a difference in in giving kids a christmas that otherwise would not have him. And there's this year. I i feel fear that there's going to be a lot of struggling family out there early because of it went our shocking to him on the fall last week about Having you come on he he lost it twice just talking about the kids. Which is incredible. It's it's a. It's a great thing that that they do and Do you worry that you're going to be able to find enough money this year. Because it's it's going to be online or you think everybody will come through here. Here's the thing with being on a show like your guys is. We won first and foremost we appreciate it I i have a company that we had to pivot to a lot of virtual fundraising this year. I i own an auction. Company called benevolent and So people have been very generous this year. You know just as far as we do. We've done a lot of virtual events. Were still figuring out the details as far as what our production will in fact be at our initial thought is we are going to again. Give these local businesses here on. Fort myers beach supportive. For so many years the love in the love that they rightly deserve and they they've supported us in so we're gonna give shots because a lot of these businesses. It's been a down year for them. And so we're going to celebration of fort myers beach and so just to transition for one second. But i'll tell you how giving speeches. I was walking here a parked at promote a friend of mine house and And walking and i see andrea from silver san and she's like You know you look official. And i was like thanks. I'm going to do you know been on the show. Guests enter is terrific and she's like You know and as i'm going down to promote spirit of christmas one person. I passed on the street. You know here and she was like make sure the jim stops in and d- do they want two nights day or one. I'd say i talked to him about it. But that's the type of computer that supports and that's the love that we want to give back in our broadcast. I encourage everyone to donate and listen and watch and again because it's a celebration. Fort myers beach. The community is very resilient to look at this place on on what was once afternoon with six feet of sand and front end loaders. It's amazing so the auction is going to be when when it's going to be held december eighth. We're still working on time. So if they follow us on facebook Will have that and make sure that everyone is well. We're we're going to start doing post This is kind of just been our initial stages. Jim was like. I don't know if we can do this bread. And i was like we can do this. Show as you know. We had that issue the show on everybody's going virtual and so people will be used to it as as is always. The technology doesn't crap out but is that how. How will it kind of work for people if like for me. I'm not so tech savvy. So how are people going to participate in the auction. So our initial thing is we're still working out platforms because there's also platform that we may use in utilized because they can actually donate if they don't want to purchase an auction item so we're going to be updating onto platforms. It's either going to be a online only auction on hybrid dot com so high bid dot com is is a site that my company uses and they have have you know i. It's more so for every type of auction but it can also be utilized so it'll be a silent auction where people can register bid and there's gonna be no buyers premium. There's not going to be anything like that. But they're just going to bid on these items and so it'll be online only auction that will time out where We'll space them out so we can talk about. Hey you know. Our next item up is fifty dollars. Silver or i'm sorry united states. You wanna make it as simple as possible for people to donate one. Click and take their money or you're having donate their money on a second hold on a second gym wants to know the facebook page and i wanna make sure that anybody jumping on late because there are few people jumping on late. We're talking about jim. And sharon jameson charities. The right word turn organization called the spirit of christmas and You go on the facebook page and look up spirit of christmas. You'll see their pictures there and they they kind of collect money they have donations and then they use the money to help kids out so go ahead and so so the the link is in in facebook. It's at spirit of christmas foundations. So that's where they can find it so you know if if they're on so it's at in this kind of new to me too this year as far social media i've been kind of You know. I wasn't on for a long time but now i've started so if you sign spirit of christmas foundation and it will show right up. What are some of the items that people will be bidding on well. We're still working. Jim is going and he is going to reach out to all the organizations so working on those but we every year we have hotel stays From gull winged diamond head. We have golf packages. We have dining gift certificates to hooters. let's see other ones that i can think of Stick by berea. Marina always donate something there's so many organizations and local businesses that donate. That's that's kind of. There's a little bit of something for everyone. So those will do they business or any local businesses. You know a county or the country if somebody calls us and says hey we want to to be a part of this you know. We appreciate their support. So it's It's all good and a lot of snowbirds that that are part time residents that you always seem to come out and want to support stuff that we did which were so gracious to. Because they're not always here but they're like now go ahead and take this use it for the beach. They love the beach. They wanna support the beach. Things that are going on at the beach ca. I didn't want to talk about some of the did talk to jim for quite a while the other day. And there's a couple things. I wanted to mention him in sharon. I've been married for fifty six years. Fifty six. Yeah which is kinda cool and jack lacquer. I saw a picture of to no. Let's see they they They re twenty five thousand dollars or they try and raise twenty five thousand dollars every year and he mentioned that Two hundred fifty kids a year that they try and help and in the kids going to the walmart. I don't know if they use walmart every but it seems like walmart also contributes financially to up that money for them which is which is kind of cool. So and i know there's been a lot of donors and and i don't know how you feel that me mentioning but like the family has always been a big supporter that there's been a ton of of you know local support and families and foundations That have done. I will tell you the auxiliary at post to seven four. they've always given generously and We appreciate their support has been you know a really fun. You know evening when we had it in person and this year. It's just you know it's going to be what you gotta do. So do you have a A pay pal account or van mo- or all that setup now so people while this while it's on the top of their mind they can start giving money. Well we technically don't so if they like to Donate they can call sharon. We will have it set up around the the auction as far as when people are are are paying as far as the auction in the donate donation site so we are working through that again this transition. We've had to pivot heart so you know it was literally last week. We're jim should be having the show must go on. So that's why i'm here today but we will have all that setup if people like to donate. I'm going to give a phone number here. If you with your permission. Do not ask me for for for for me to go right ahead. My wife talks about my stutter. And you sounded exactly like me. He's going to give this phone number but he mentioned his wife. He just congratulations. He just got married for the first time like two months ago. You forty eight you. Why'd you wait so long. I i a left interrupting me. Was i would like to hear this. These are the kinds of questions that people wanna know the answer to. Why did your forty eight. You still live with your parents then. No thirty nine. I did what you'd probably saved a lot of money then. Yeah i'm the reason why. I never found the right person. Kim how do you like that i. It took me forty eight years to find the right one so she can put up with you cutting your own hair and using gel absolute saint diet so who is a few more years. What were you gonna here man. Come on i. i did have this when i was writing this letter so i could see it you know. Do you remember when you we used to memorize phone numbers. Do you know like i never. I don't know. I probably just know my wife's number i don't know any other like just tell the phone now to call whoever whoever so before you go ahead. The phone number is two three nine hundred numbers given out by the way is sharing gyms home phone. Are you sure you should be doing that. I asked the same question but they said yes. That's the phone that they use for spirit of christmas so it's two three nine four six three two seven one seven two three nine nine four zero the cell phone number so we we've got to so ago two three nine three two seven one seven. That's one number. If you wanna call it. Jim jamieson for donations indirectly. You can call him it. Two three nine nine four zero four two three six sorry. So let's hear this is your first broadcast. By the way there's there's no touching i'm sorry. Know touching the co host You know you guys I was actually a little nervy not pacing around the place chenier. I'm like the guy much nervous auctioneer. Let's hear some Let's hear some calls. Now gotta have that. You want to hear calling everybody who actually it feels. Good to actually hold the mic. I've been holding lab. Mikes so lacks the lapel mics so it feels good. Because i've actually get to hold a true mike and so we actually say words so one of the things that we do in our sharing is is you. Start with the phrase. i'm b- i'm made one would a gift to you. How many teeth. Four in four six hundred six nasa and in tables out seven to nine nine thousand nine thousand dollars here thousand offer the spirit of christmas and thousand nine eleven and guy's got a bid for me. That's why i love him kim's in now all all through twelve twelve that's all been bit stands hair in kim's in limited twelve inland. We're selling the trumpster. That's what's going riot going once. Going twice certain call. And i have sold right here. Eleven hundred dollars came congratulations. You are the winter that'll be buyer number in four five. Five is the learn to talk that fast. It's been or is it just a distraction. And you're just really gone you have to get through items quickly and i. It would be very boring if i would one one two two three three three four four four four. It's so it's asking. I have been dollar. Would you give to. I'm back to a dollar now. would you give three dollars dollar here. Would it get five dollars five here now. Six hundred eighty seven. There's a lot of words that flow well with other words and you can take one dollar now. Eight hundred and eleven non. Now when they'll here now one dollar here dollar here now to into department with with doing auctions for the charity now because of latency each stream has its own latency so to close them out and say sold. When we're doing it down it's problematic wi with the livestreams so we're working on doing it that there's programs you can do it do with so we may do an element of that. We'll we'll see how things progress for the spirit of christmas. But that's kind of to confuse people as much as possible when you do that. Absolutely not a year. it comes from You know time. Where the curls. In the south commissioned to sell all or i'm sorry the the colonel's in the south were commissioned sell all the assets of the south way back in the day and we're not going to go there but i'm just giving lesson but so i'm an honorary colonel because i'm an engineer and so the aspect of it. They had a lot of items to get through a dollar to in dollars the next night. I'm find out here ten. Is there any other bad santa. i'm still dollars and and so it's not confused. It's just to build speed momentum and timing to sell an item so that's kind of what's the most expensive item you've ever sold. Well worked with a team that was was at barrett jackson. So i did barak's so you've seen it back in the day. It's it's on speed channel. i was a part of the team has sold a five million dollar carroll shelby super cobra so that was the highest thing because you need a team of auctioneers to sell something because they'll be four thousand five thousand people in attendance. Sicker tend to end so in a venue like that. You want to get that right with that kind of money you definitely. It's one of the premier know televised auctions in the world. Along with me. Come get giving our gifts away right. I can't imagine the stress of that. The other shows a lot about you. It's about the spirit of christmas. So is banks eubanks. A real person is banks banks. A real person you're talking about the graffiti artist mckay. I would one. I've had the opportunity to witness. You don random. It is random but but super cool. So i think i know where you might be going with it and we haven't talked about this. I had the fortunate my wife and i. She turned fifty last year so we took a trip to london and one of our missions was we went and saw original banks art inland. And so i think he is a real person. I think he's probably the robin cunningham. I do believe is how you pronounce his last name. But we still have pictures of the pictures and super cool and interesting and his were his work of art sold at auction. Have you seen that. Yeah absolutely i laugh at every time just to think because it's a piece of commentary on on art and its value. You know again. He was selling you know. He did a deal in new york city where he was selling his own art. You know that was for forty bucks and then you know the people had no idea that was his and so very very interesting. Google it later. How can you gotta get with the culture. You are the culture one in this girl. this year. it of christmas. Jim sharon jamison in december. And we'll we'll make sure that people Are in informed on our facebook page about when you guys will be ready with the donation page. And if you can send us the items that you'll be bidding on that'd be great. We'll do all that for you. So thank you so very much. I don't know if you're you're me yet. But i'll take the thank you so much for having you know where you're getting ready for the hook Thank you guys so much for having me. It's like again fascinating. I was out of the area. We were up in chicago for a couple years for work. And i learned about practice. But i'm told when i i talked to him as like i'm a huge fan. I loved the aspect of it and we talked about it. Being grassroots started with the tape recorder and talking with you know. I know you don't want to like your followers It's super cool. It's a super cool story. And it's an inspiring story. It was all her. It was all. I'm just writing for. That was very nice of you to say. Thank you so much for coming and please tell jim and sharon that We hope that at some point in the future we can have them on or interview them or anything we can do to help. That's such a great idea. Love helping the kids and they're doing a great thing before you go. He mentioned something about a house. Do you know the story about the angel house before we let you go. Tell us about the angels. Those angel house is going to be. What's going to happen here very shortly. So we're working on doing at angel house so it's going to be a a house that is going to be basically in. Jim can speak to this. Speak to a little bit. But the house is a house that will be basically even away giving away and working on that with pandemic. It's been a little challenge. We thought we would have it up and done by by spirit of christmas. Two thousand and twenty and has taken a little extra time but is still on the plan again help a family to to to have housing and it's just so people know i don't think it's like he buys the house and he gives it away. I think what it is. It's like it's a step up. yes you know. Here's a house if you can pay the mortgage if you can if you can afford this and you own it you own it but you have to be able to afford the mortgage payments you. Can't you can't just move in and and you know it's unclear right right which is a great way to do things. It's giving somebody some help. And some responsibility to to to make the payments. I agree one hundred percent and it's happening With with our and transition. I haven't talked to him about that. Because we've been you know just figuring out. Hey show must go on what what that is going to look like. So so i will certainly have and maybe we'll have updates By december eighth with the spirit of christmas. And you know by the way that it's okay to shoot looters now just in the state of florida. You're okay to shoot looters. Is that something you're thinking about doing negative. That is the most interesting segue so i. I don't know if that actually pass. But when i saw that at all that's an interesting way to maybe try to scare them from looting because you know in certain states in the country are encouraged to loot. I am going to say. I'm going to say yes that's true that's true you take. The election was rigged Me personally while now. I'm i will say that. I think the democracy happened and the people spoke. We had a record turnout how it turns out who knows and not answer. I've ever heard in my life. But that's perfect. Yeah yeah the dog park right here at the dog park sometimes. Sometimes there's a dog. I have to bring with you right. Absolute thousand a lot of people. Who's that guy sitting on the bench by. Yeah so all right. Well i didn't mean to throw you a. I mean it so i can't have that my not political which is good because you know if your political you piss off fifty percent of the phoenix for the kids. I don't want to do so kids. Don't need to be political and we're gonna choke these people when we have the opportunity to grab their money so you make sure that when when it's ready we're gonna go out and choke them for you absolutely. You can come and help me broadcast i. If you want your option we can have fun. You know and where is it. Are you going to be doing it from your house. You think we we're still figuring out what it will be broadcast from somewhere though. So we're that's going to be I've got a little studio. We can pass you in and make it happen and and all that so guys thank you so much everybody for the spirit of christmas. Jim and sharon jamison. We thank him so much for coming on and we will keep you up to date on how that program is coming along so we can all help the kids and let the kids go shopping for the holidays especially this year with such a crazy crazy year. All right let me tell you about island. Oils dot com and that's island oils. Llc you want to keep the bugs off you you want to keep the nets off your the no see'ums of the the The tree frogs anything that jumps on you. You want to spray with the magnificent smelling spray from island oils. Llc too because you know. It's getting kind of chilly out. You're gonna wanna sit out in the back with the with the fireplace. Going and the netflix and and keep the bugs away so go to island a oils. Llc dot com and place your order today. They're right here on the beach. Everybody they're not Some eight hundred number. That i went fishing for an ad. They've been with us a long time. And we have a bunch of a bunch of the sprays everywhere at home because They do a super fantastic job of keeping all that stuff off of you so island. Llc's dot com is other than oil to place your order and also fort myers tiki tours. You know the fort. Marcy kaptur folks have been great to us for so many months now since we started to show and they are up rolling and you want to check them out. If you have like a five friends it was kind of hard for me to wrestle up a couple of friends to get on it but we went on it. We went out and we saw monica with the with the dolphins because she's always out there and Searching for dolphins and keeping boats on the straight narrow so that they're not driving too fast or whatever you do with the vote the four myers tiki. Tours is a fun time. They bring the cooler full of ice. And you bring whatever you wanna bring. And they the certified captain and you get all the life jackets and you get great. Stories the captain's tell great stories about their lives and it's two three nine eight seven zero zero four two two three nine eight eight seven zero zero four to throw them some business folks. It's a it's a nice half a day kind of thing you know you want to a few hours to kill and still have fun and maybe have an adult beverage or two and see what's going on out on the water there give them a call mars tiki tours dot com and just like that our second set of guests are ready to rock and roll and thank you ladies so much for coming in. We appreciate your time and now we're gonna talk about. I wanna make sure. I get it right. The tree is that right. We're gonna talk about the angel tree so who wants to take it off. We have kathy. Yes kathy. I don't want to screw up your last name bosley. I work at the fort. Myer speech libraries and this is paula smith. And i'm president of the estero island garden club and we're doing a joint effort this year for children in the area. So what is the angel trie. Well i'll let. I let paula talk first because the garden club on the third floor of the library this past year. Set up a beautiful holiday tree. And so i'll let her kind of talked about the holiday tree. Pop end has to have we got started turning. The garden slopes holiday tree into an angel and then of course we must talk about gardening. Because that's my favorite hobby of all time gardening. Yes oh wow yeah well we all love. It love gardening. And that's why we're in the club but Is there openings in the club cost so we're very much like me. You don't have a green thumb absolutely numbers of the garden club. now there are sixty three members. Yeah all beach. Residents know everywhere. We have members that live in canada. live in all over the country may might only just come down here for a couple of months during season But they really enjoy participating in all of our activities. Have you been doing zoom garden meetings. We have done some zoom meetings. Like from our district from the fort myers garden council But our particular club. We have only met twice. We had outdoor meetings and we've had field trips so we're not planning anything indoors this year At some point we're thinking in january. We're going to start meeting at the library but going to be meeting in the garage which is very open air And so we're hoping to have some speakers there because what we wanna do is really bring a lot of Members of the community that aren't garden club members or people that are visiting to learn about florida friendly landscaping and native plants. And so we're trying to promote a lot of knowledge about florida gardening and we want to really expand our our base when the florida garden club goes or the is it. The fort myers guard. Cleverest of florida garden club. Well we have a fort meyers garden council and were part of the florida. Wow garden party and national guard club go on a field trip to well to garden is absolutely well this This year we had our first trip was to Echo farm global farm in north fort myers and that was a wonderful experience We really had a great tour and learned a lot. About how how they are expanding. You know the learning of of global gardening and organic gardening all across the world. So that was a great trip. our second trip was cancelled because of the storm. We had on monday breezy. But we were going to The cutting horse aeko center been there. Yes now what was the name of it against the cutting horse aeko center. It's nita and it is the The native plant society. It's their demonstration. Garden wild so we were going to have our field trip there. But we've rescheduled for december. You ever try and goof on people. Sarah everybody get on the bus. We're going to hooters. Our cardmembers would go along with that now. They're pretty sharp. Recommend to somebody who who has no green like. What are the easiest guarding or one. That require no care down here. There's a lot really. Oh yeah like a lot of the succulents. The newly ads You know i've started doing a lot of orchids and literally just buying them sticking in my tree and they. I mean there's if you're looking at native plants there's basically they're set up to be fokker-f once they get establish now seriously now. It's planting season like is gear. You can plant any time florida. I think there are certain times of the year that you know like Like orchids g really well when you plant them prior to the rainy season because then they can get established in the trees But i think you know. I i think most of us just put things in whenever we find them and they tend to do very well again once you get things established by the way mitt says hello to both of you. Mitch is doing so Actually this is a fun conversation. We probably should do a whole show sean gardening but the angel tree the tree a real tree or a know. It is an artificial tree and been up all year and we had last year. It was decided that we would just keep it up and change it with every holiday so we start valentine's tree and a saint patrick's day an easter then. We did a patriotic team tree. That was pretty much through the holidays for the july up until veterans. Okay so for people that don't know what the angel tree is kind of. Give us a rundown at cathy's going to die cast. you're on. The holiday tray sits on the third floor of the library and as paulo assane Each season they change it out. And i saw it in october and it was beautiful decorated or the fall and i knew that they would be changing that out and making it into a christmas tree and so i actually heard on wync radio that the salvation army was looking for hosts to host angel trees in the area because people who previously the angel trees their businesses either gone under because of the co ed or They're in office. Buildings and many people are working from home. And so there were less and less people's nipping up to the plate to host these angel trees. And so when. I heard that i said oh. Jeez i want the library to host an angel free because we have all kinds of patrons that come in but i don't want to compete against the beautiful holiday tree that the garden club has on the third floor so i contacted paula and i said paula. What do you think of turning your holidays. Really into an angel tree for the salvation army and She agreed and so we got in touch with the salvation army and they sent us We requested To start off with forty angel ornaments and what that is is we have them on the tree they are angels and they're actually ornaments and on the back of the ornament is a child's name. First name how old they are if they're male or female and then it has a christmas wish something that they're wanting for christmas and then there's also where their parents add What they need and mostly the needs in the area of clothing and so it gives you the child's sizes and then what we do. Is we ask the people come into the library. Take one of the angel ornaments off the tree and let whoever is in the bookstore. No the angels name of the ornament. They've taken and then when they bring it back with the president and i emphasize when they bring it back with the present present needs to be unwrapped and the tag turned in from angel ornament to an angel gift tag so the same tag goes on your bag with whatever you've purchased for your angel and you drop it off at the library we ask that. The gifts dropped off by december. The first because we have to cut them up to the salvation army's warehouse by the end of that week which is friday december. The fourth. i believe so very easy to do is very. It's a wonderful way to help out the community and help children during these times. Have a very wonderful christmas and the tree up and running now so people can come today. It is and have and take an ornament. Yes and you can kind of if you're looking for male or female or looking for something that you know something about. I took a child that was. He's into parked patrol and so my grandchildren are into pop patrols. Anyway it's a cartoon kids cartoons shell. Yes so i- marshall but nine one had a new girls bite and so we found a little girl that was her wish was to get a bicycle. So people can come in and peru's the s cornerback angels and the one that resonates with them or just randomly. Now you have forty. You said we have forty one. Those are gone with the salvation. Army supply you more Yes once those disappear off our tree which were hoping will happen We have a contact and we can get either. They'll send them to us in bunches of threes or a bunch of ten and so we started off small with forty because we wanted to make sure that we were taken forty presents back army and so we're hoping to fill all forty plus dancer chris question. The tree is on the third floor of the library. Here on fort myers beach. Go up to the library during the hours in which it's open so check. The fort myers library website for mars beach library website. And go up to thirty four and you can see the tree up there and it has ornaments on it. You have a rough idea how many have been taken care of so far i would say probably in the neighborhood about fifteen nine. Yeah i think we have about that. Many left fifteen left. Yeah okay so if we don't take care that this weekend folks i'm gonna be pissed off so come on fifteen kids and that gives you time to come in next week. Right comes. Select an angel. Go shopping for that angel whether you do the shopping online and have it delivered to your home and then bring it back to the library but remember bring it back on wrapped and the third floor of the library. That's where the bookstore is. And that's where you can set. It is so pretty up there you can say all. The view is gorgeous during the holiday. Spirit puzzles no. That's on the second club. Puzzles will tell you what is up on. The third floor is we feature every month An artist of the month a local harness. We have this month adorable. Nate's paintings are up there and they're beautiful ones of the everglades and so when you come up. Do enjoy the holiday tree and take your angel. Checkout her pictures and we kind of have a voting thing for the artists of the month that pick your favorite picture and that picture at the end of the month is awarded a blue ribbon to buried ice yeah. I can't say enough about that library. I mean there's many things about this speech. That are great but that i have come down here and spent time over the summer there and it. Just there's so much there to look at. The people are so nice there. Yes you know helping me get my account set up and it's just it's a beautiful building for any. I don't know who but for anybody. That doesn't know where the library is going down to sarah boulevard and you think you've passed the castle. It's the library. It's the nicest library on planet earth and. that's thanks. I think in large part to dr hamad. So it's really a wonderful facility and this is a great Great thing that you guys are joining forces to do Which is kinda cool so we hope to get gifts for those other fifteen kids and is there anything that you want to make sure that. What is the library. Elkin on. Sunday is larry. Obama libraries only open monday through friday from nine to five and then on saturday today it is open from nine to one arm to get down there from ten to one. You got time to grab the The angel by gift and you know it. It's not like you have a ton of time. I mean crease. Christmas creeps up on. You wouldn't believe because thanksgiving's coming and you don't want to wait last minute when there's no toys left anywhere exactly and these need to come back as i said to the library By december the. I i yes. So there you can get them delivered to the salvation army. Their deadline to us is december four you. This is a process people. There are things that need to get done in order for the kids to get their gifts so stop wasting time and get down to the library today or monday amazon. They or walmart or mary area easy to do. But if your home you can still. You know still run into the library. Grab it and go home and order some stuff for the somebody. Let's say somebody wants to call the library and say can you favor. Can you go up to the tree and read one of the angels into the phone for me. So i can order it right now online. Maybe they absolutely know the whole cova thing. I've done that for several friends and and garden club members. That are not down here. They just emailed get me a chat. I took a picture of it told them what the easy as good for my audience. Easiest good so. They're very lazy sometimes absolutely out of town. They say if you're town there number for the library two three nine seven six five eight one. Six two seven six five eight one six to make the library phone ring right now folks and have a heart by a gift for a kid. Come on let's do it. That's fine thank you so why is first meeting for the garden club. Our next meeting is we're doing a back bay boat tour on the twenty third the remember november. Yeah yeah back bay. What's your goal with going out on the tour there. It's an echo so just talking about the mangroves and everything that's out there And just making people more aware and also gives us a chance to to do something enjoyable and be outdoors so next okay and people can find you on. You have a website. Facebook island art club. Yeah we have a website It lists all our programs everything coming up Through january said. I wanna put you on the spot. How long has the garden club been in existence. Yup i should know that it's been a while it's been existence along has yeah. It has a long history here on the membership is how much is thirty dollars. Thirty dollars per year. Very easy. peasy right you want to anything else. We want to make sure you don't don't leave anything out for this sort. Everything we thank you guys are coming on and whatever we can do this wonderful call overthrow the phone number up there for the library and reiterate that people can call and ask people and they'll send our picture straight. Well thank you guys coming on can stay safe out there all right. Everybody now remember. Call the library. I'm gonna write the number down again. It was seven six five seven six five eight one. Six two is the number four. The fort myers beach library. And and you can call you can call and you can ask for an angel on the tree. And they'll take a picture of the angel right they'll take a picture of the angel and you can buy a gift for one of the The kiddos lovely thing. They're doing it so nice to see everybody helping out all the kids full day of of nothing helping and is that what you were right and we have. Yeah i wanted you to say you know. Say goodbye to them. Give give them a hug or something or hugging. And so and then jim jamieson sharon james senator during the During the auction which is going to be kind of cool and britt was a good guess. So he's a good guest he said to me as i'm as we were switching out guests that he's going to go get his wife and meet us down at Hoosiers imperative get to meet his wife. Yeah he waited until he was forty. Nine forty seven forty seven forty eight forty nine. I mean that's a long time. The weight he was. He's waiting for the right person. Now that getting used to wearing the wedding ban thing. I bet age what do you think in. What are you thinking about kids at that age. Probably a little late on the scale there right. The eggs are all cooked in Oh no sorry. I didn't mean that. I mean he had older. It gets harder right is that isn't that what happens. I don't know the whole biology thing but thanks to bread for coming on and by the way hoosiers is that eleven o'clock today we're gonna be down there for we call it a thank you to you kind of get together. We want you to come down and and kim signs autographs and and i I buy beers for everybody. So come on down and and we're going to be at hoosiers from eleven to maybe one o'clock because we love captain mark and jackie and they've got a cool view of estero boulevard. I think almost at castle library from from the upper deck who's yours. We're gonna be there from eleven o'clock one o'clock and we also wanted to tell a quick story you know because always story about things that do you have any stories. You want a telephone story. No please tell the. I wanna you tell the story and you don't have to say the word fart you already signed an and people will get the impression of what has already told it. Did i tell on the show. Yeah you did. I don't remember telling it but if you say so. I bought a new bicycle. This past week Not a not a speedy road bike. That issue spent three thousand dollars on or whatever of bicycles. A ride with you guys when you go out at night for your little. What is it like a stroll though right for exercise it's tickets. Thank you katie. It's two bits and just chit chat and enjoy at a slower pace right right so i needed to have a bike with bigger wheels and something. I wasn't host over to be sitting there going. Come on come on. Never do that so i bought. The bike on wednesday went to the store. And i said yeah. Give me that one. And he said well. I want sold one in a box so he had to put it together. And i had to come back the next day. We'll jillian daughter came home instead. Our air conditioning isn't working in her car in her car so she needs to borrow the truck so it i had to Get the bite. The next day. And i didn't have a vehicle to get it in so i had to run all the way to the store which are seven miles and the reason i'm bringing this up was is because we were talking about last week and going maybe going back to the world's toughest mater in twenty hundred now is an obstacle course rates twenty four hour obstacle course race that we've done four or five times in new jersey and a las vegas atlanta and so they're going back to las vegas in two thousand twenty one. Hopefully i mean they had to get a virtual one this year and so we were talking last week about going back and you know because you know it gets late at night and you think that you're in great shape when you're really not so i was using yesterday as a test like can run seven miles. That's a good way to start. Because i haven't running and it was like i can't my legs right now. It's like you cheer me over to hoosiers marwick and you were just like those walkers because i had the rundown the seven miles then get the bike and bike back to the house which biking back seven miles is a big deal and i was like okay. Well that answered the question because it costs four hundred fifty dollars to sign up per person for the race and that's meant that meant that answered the question of us going to that i mean jesus the're where fifty five fifty six years old. What the hell are you thinking that we're going to be doing like you brought it up all right so anyway. I don't think we'll be going to that. Nelson you wanna talk about. Did you wanna talk about the masks. At all or your your. Your explanation of the masks is perfect. Now i don't think it's but i don't think it's based in science and i don't wanna get any fact. Let's let's do it this way. It's not based on science but your opinion on it makes perfect sense so go ahead and explain my my thoughts on the mask. People wanna wear a mask if they want me to wear masks go mix and feel comfortable. I'm not. I'm not a crazy person. That thinks i'm not gonna wear a mask. I don't think the government should tell you to wear masks. Because i don't think that they they. They have the kind of facts that they think they do about the mask and the whole thing. But that's just my opinion. I'm at home. Most of the time. So i'm not around anybody and by the way we hope they analysis feeling better. He's got the did and he said he feels kind of fine but he's quarantining so you are saying about the mess. Go ahead now. You take 'cause you're the expert. No no i'm not. Oh please we know how that conversation went a couple of weeks ago. Nobody's i don't. I am not the expert. I am wondering a couple of weeks ago. What happened we're fighting about. Who's a health expert and whatever true exiting. That's what i was talking about. So i wonder if there's a a point that you need to get to of compliance with the masks where it's gonna be effect where it if you don't get to that compliance. It's not going to be effective. So do you need. Like eighty percent compliance. I mean because. I don't think it's realistic to think you're going to get one hundred percent compliance across the boards. I feel like. I see people wearing the masks more now than than ever before. And we're still having numbers. Go up the numbers go down. And yes i do believe it slows the head here my theory on it. I don't think less people are wearing masks now than we were three months ago when the numbers were going down when the numbers were going down people that were the mask warriors. The mass nazis were saying the reason. The numbers are going down is. Because you're wearing a mask well. People just didn't start ripping their masks off at that point and and running around spitting on people in rubbing up against people. I don't. I think people were still being vigilant. I know that the mask words are going to say. That's not true. That's not true. People were getting complacent but then the number star going. So what. I think happens when the numbers start to go up people kind of freak out and go test it and then obviously the more people that get tested. The more people are going to. The numbers are going to go up. And i think that's what's happening. More people are getting tested going up but the people are still wearing their masks. I don't think people are still i mean. I don't know some people are still wearing their masks. Not everybody's wearing their masks. And i think that people did start to get. I mean. obviously people started to gather more as time went on. And i don't wanna even go back to you. Know limiting to the extent that we were get togethers and gatherings and all of that will now. They're trying to kill can spitting on us. Did you see what they're they're trying to cancel thanksgiving. I don't think they're trying to cancel thanksgiving. But they're trying to limit the number of people you have in your home. And i the only a my opinion people should do what they have to do to keep themselves say yes they can do the best. They can do to keep themselves safe if you feel sick. Don't go out if you're afraid that you're gonna catch something figure out how to live in alternative lifestyle. So you're not around people that you think are not obeying the rules and if you wanna have your family over for thanksgiving. I don't think that you should listen to any government official. Tell you that you can have people over your house. it's thanksgiving it's your family and just the best that you can camp to take personal responsibility. I mean if you're out and about you probably shouldn't go visit someone who's in the category that's at more risk for having a bad outcome if they get covid and you know you have to. You have to use sense. And i don't know it's it's complicated if let me ask you this doc. If a hundred percent of the population wore a mask would eliminate covert from passing around. I don't know the the you think anybody has the is the answer to that. Yes you would you guess. I don't think it's i think it's a multi prong approach and i don't think it's one thing that's going to get it over the goal line again and same with the vaccination because there's going to be people are not going to get the vaccination. I don't wanna get political at all. But i just want to mention one thing i did. Watch the trump press conference about the vaccine. And i don't wanna get into a conversation about who's gonna take the vaccine or not but what i did notice was that it looked to me like they're pretty far along the vaccine if you listen to the the the medical guy there and the other guy there that i'd never seen before in a press conference usually who who didn't see a camera he didn't love or a podcast. Hey while that's different put. It looked like a lot of progress. Was going to be made. And that the vaccine if you wanna take it it's going to be available like next month and nobody really gives him any credit for that. They just want to say that he's the reason why people are dying and that's pretty far along in six or seven months and he you know if you're going to blame for everything at least give him some credit for something if the vaccine is going to be ready in december this operation warp speed work. So i wanna to say or everybody. Thank you so much and we hope to see you down at. Who's yours at eleven o'clock we're going to sprint benjamin's around the bringing benjamin's now i have to go spread some gifts around some guns right in people's houses that's right you're you're you're giving out what gifts that we Yes somebody's gotta let me know. Let him know if they won the mug. We just we lost track of that. And i i apologize because next time we do if we do gift giveaways. You're going to let me know more than at the moment that you decided to do it so that we have a system in place for people to get their information to us. Because you're snippety snapped off the cuff. We just do things you have giveaways we have. Then you're gonna have to give it away to people that are here and i don't wanna limit it like that because we had wonderful people i think i think people enjoyed it but i want them to get what they want. Thank you so much for being my wife for so many years and we have an anniversary coming up this month. That's going to be so much fun to be around each other by more than we around and we have. Greg knee is going to be filling in for a couple of weeks. Know you're saying you're going somewhere. It's a week from today. Where are you going. I'm going to with lachey forest with the hell is. It's about fifty miles. North of tampa gordon club there while there probably is because it's a huge forest I'm going with a friend of mine. We're gonna backpack into the forest camp in a primitive site and then backpack out but we're running into a little glitch because it's just hunting season. Oh so they've told us to orange. So i'm gonna be looking to purchase some orange gear so that i don't that story when we come back is going to be all. This is going to be a story inca. You've never looked so happy over. That has the show starts all right. Everybody will see it down at hoosiers at eleven o'clock and we'll be back here next saturday. Godwilling with our masks on and ready to rock and roll hall. Kristen thank you.

dr bouchard walmart jim sharon facebook twenty five thousand dollars kim florida Jim fort myers beach Mrs america ed ryan Fort myers beach sharon jamieson seventy five thousand dollars khazanah Children's hospital of southwe clippers silver san jim jamieson
3235: Plug It In w/ Don Jamieson

Keith and the Girl Comedy Talk Show

49:12 min | 11 months ago

3235: Plug It In w/ Don Jamieson

"The walking Keith. And the girl. I'm Keith Malley. If you're a Wendy starling fan and you know Wendy. She was just on the girl with the boots. You should listen to free podcasts. Only in New York. She hosts it with your favorites Andrea. Alan Tracy Karna Zero. And this week. They released Wendy starlings episode. She was so much fun as always choose to live by the old Keith. And the girl studio right. Yeah yeah she had to move out of there and we find out why Julius died. Yeah check it out free wherever you're listening to this show it's called only in New York guys. Give us a five star rating today's guest. I'm very excited. Ladies and Gentlemen Former Co host of vh one's that metal show featured in Rolling Stone Comedy Central Emmy Award winner for his work on HBO's inside the NFL. The new album is denim and laughter. Don Jameson Oh what. A sweet potato. You are mentioning all those wonderful accomplishments. Where's your emmy I used to have it like on a rope chain around my neck like a flame with the clock helps with women. I mean this guy might have something going on. But now it's a it's at. My house prominently displayed on the nightstand. Frequent Flyer Miles right there right. You take ladies from behind the era right up in my office man. It was a great honor to get one of those Chula from Jersey. Where do you have this? Incredible rock voice did it. Did Your Voice. Change up here to like. I don't know I'm kind of transition was that I duNno. It's just a weird voice. I don't it's did it. Require beer and cigarettes or do you just Kinda grow into that. Yeah I think I just yeah grew into a and I never smoked a cigarette in my life. So maybe it's all the clubs and stuff. Yeah maybe I'm not sure and maybe talk loudly so probably probably the concerts and that kind of stuff. Yeah my voice kind of falls into metal music and my voice like Lemme so i WanNa talk rock and roll of course First off do you speaking of Football? Do you watch the XFL? Rick started fairly recently. I haven't watched it yet. I'll give it a shot. Have you seen no and XFL? It's not as good as the NFL porn NFL with puppy. Vince McMahon from the WWE. He started a league in two thousand one that lasted about a year. He still in charge of it and they brought it back and there's only eight teams and the xfl owns all the teams as opposed to the NFL. Which is franchised out. So it's sort of and I don't want to be mean to anybody but like the clown version of that NFL. Like I'm only saying that. Because like will they go like beat the broncos and what's exciting about? It is that when the reps aren't looking they can use bats and barbed wire. Well they might as well. I mean if you're GonNa do it seriously. Vince McMahon. It's like why are you going to take you know how many tens or hundreds of millions of dollars for league that probably is only going to last year. I mean really is just flushing. Money down the toilet however I noticed like Keith. You know you're a a pretty decent football fan. You're more fanatical than you know me. Let's say I think you're looking for football for the rest of the time. So if even gets this part right he'll have fan. I can't watch Preseason NFL NO. It bores me. That's what I picture. Xfl As yet but that how many people are watching preseason onto saying that doesn't excite me unless there are suplexes during the game I went to arena football once person. That is so fun because you can yell at the players they hear you. They look over and they they have brain damage to and they look over their ten th to jump the stands and kick your ass. You know. They're not going to. That's why the game was fine because you could yell at seventeen seventeen looks over the conversation and then they because they're trying to get fans because they're struggling. They have to wait after the game so you could yawn during the game and they have to shake your hand after the game on. That's comedy shows. You could be in the nosebleeds at an arena league game right and literally be having a conversation with somebody. Seventeen should've done a post route right there. Oh cool hey thanks man. I'll let me guess. Another cash psych hockey too. Because it's got the right the glass but the barrier around. Yeah and you can check people into the barrier and stuff so it was kind of cool. What's that Renaissance thing that you can go and you pretend to be medieval times keith treated medieval times like that too like they can hear me come on right yellow red night. Sucks your fucking. I just want to go there so I could call women winches and get in trouble now get hash tagged on social media. And there's there's a teams in the xfl Dallas renegades Houston roughnecks L. A. Wildcats New York Guardians. Dc defending champions New York guardians them temp typically vapors Seattle dragons and Saint Louis Battle Hawks. They're going to make sure that there's no controversy down the road. There's no Indian names Viper. Vipers okay nowadays the snake while for Houston they were considering. The Sign. Steelers took the rough roughnecks the roughnecks. That could. That's seems like it could be getting some scary territory. Did you hear the story about the NFL player? Cleveland Browns player. He's been playing since twenty. Fourteen rams lines and then browns Gregory Robinson twenty seven years old. He got caught with one hundred fifty seven pounds of marijuana in his car at the border at Mexican border. Fifty seven has been working out a hundred fifty seven pounds. He had it in the car and he of course he you know he's busted by a dogs that can smell that smell like cheech and Chong's man what's his name who is this Gregory Robinson. He's a. He's a offensive tackle so one of the Big Fat Sauce. Free Gregory on that measly. Nfl salary. How do you expect the guy to make ends meet? You GotTa Sell Weed on the side like to get out of defense. Can you just show the x ray of your brain? Why did you do this? The Ohio state to go. Try Not to do it too much. I would just tell them I look. I worked for. Snoop DOGG. He told me. Put these cases in the back. I didn't know what was in them. I just pumped it one hundred and fifty seven guy this big. That's what punting means right. Let's see Robinson twenty seven and the Wa- kwan break. Twenty-six charging a federal complaint with conspiracy to possess with intent to distribute marijuana and possession intent to distribute. But if you start like would've smoke at all. I'm a big fucking guy. What a stupid time to get caught and convicted for marijuana right. It's just a bad time. 'cause in five minutes they're gonNA let everybody out but your your whole life is already a hundred a hundred yards down the road where the border is. It was legal there. And that's the border. I wasn't even saying the Mexican border but like you know like you're driving from state to state with and for five hundred miles you're fine and then all of a sudden but does he say what are the laws like the laws are when you get to one hundred fifty seven. Anything checks the signs. That's hard that's hard to swallow in the lean. The COP coming out and getting your window right if I go from. I go from Pennsylvania to Ohio and I have one hundred fifty seven apples. I expect it to be not. I didn't know the rule status thing I you know what you're right hundred fifty seven apples. I would look up the rules of like orchards and whatever it is dietsch even look up how to stop the odor from league. Because you can. You can pack well. Have you heard of coffee? Grinds have you heard of special like plastic. That goes around that you had one of those trees hang in office review. Get get three of those one hundred and fifty seven of those now. We played this fairly recently Clip from that seventy show back in the day. Maybe remember what what year this is. You're talking to the Great Mick Mars of Motley crue. Oh you mean that metal show that seventies show. I'll shoot sorry you know what the show was on in the seventies it's been on fourteen seasons right. That model show was unfortunate seasons. Yeah Yeah and literally made hundreds of dollars in that. Seventy shows are multi multimillionaire scientologists in Hollywood. Took the W train out to Long Island city. So what year was this that Molly Crusade? We're going to do our final tour. I don't know if it's The saints saints of Los Angeles tour. Not but you didn't believe it and I'll play this clip but you say it nicely you got. Let's say it is the last tour? I'll go there and when it's not because we all know these artists their bullshitters. I'll go to the next one. I'll just keep going. Mcmorris goes no. It's the last one I don't care like he's doing your favorite like okay. You don't have to lie. I don't care you did give him a lot but I also don't think any of them ever lying. I think that they think that done. But it's just you know what happens because they're not athletes when an athlete is done. They're done because they can't do anymore. They're too old. It's a physical game if you can play and you can get on stages still do it. Why are you sitting home you sitting home for a year and you go? Nobody's paying attention to me. I'm sitting on the sidelines here. It'd be Billy Fun to play for twenty thousand people again and then an offer comes to you. Yeah I think you're right. I think it seems like when you're on the road for so long. I think if feels like you know it would be good just sitting and then forget that. This is what you like. And you're into rock and roll so you're probably not into Taylor swift and you hear what's number one and you're like now. I I could do another. You know whatever you know. Shout at the devil. I think it's a problem of gratitude because you forget to be grateful that you're road you forget that this is the life that you wanted because now it comes with the work that comes with that and they don't they some of them don't like each other at all and so when you're on the road for two years doing this farewells or write quote unquote you just like. Oh I gotta get away from these guys fucking hate them and then you know a year goes by actually. That's crazy access you like. She wasn't that bad actually. She was a little fussy. But yeah I mean maybe I maybe I'll give her a call on facebook. You know what I'm starting to hate my Weipa running. Hey Vince I wanNA love my wife again. Let's go on the road. Let me. Hey you here. It is from that Middle. Show but if it's not the final tour I'll go see the next one too so I don't really care doesn't matter reform. I have a contract break the CON way. How funny is that Stupid Molly crew? Contra we wrote a contract and why does not come with the conscious uncoupling key? Who's the basis for Molecule Nikki? Nikki six goes and he wrote all the songs and he goes. We did a contract where we can't work together legally even if we wanted to press who keeps trying to trick us with words. We can't even if we wanted to. We can't get back together and I don't know how they got back together. Now I guess they blew it up with dynamite and that's legal right so one quint Nevada. That's legal. They had to go to Nevada to do it. They took the contract out to the desert. They put dynamite on it and then they buried it obstacle copy. It's your the four hassles. Signed it no one else signed. It just agree those speaking about Vince. Mcmahon Vince McMahon tactics. They made such a big deal about it. That was cracking apply. Elbow dropped the contract. We suplex that we took into the steel cage. Show like a chainsaw. Can't cut the contract with all the thing gets gets and installs out the can't it cannot be broken so rocket launcher mcmorris. Four ten more times. I'll see all tend towards doesn't put it this way. If that happens I will invite the world to come for free. You Guys Don's like I'm trying to favor. Fuck it so. Obviously he can't give out free tickets. He didn't work it out with the other three guys but do you at least get a free front row ticket at the this upcoming clip to give. No I put the clip out right so I I and I 'cause that costs a lot of problems for mcmorris on social media because then everybody from all over the world started hitting you know tweet with comment Mick where I pick up my tickets for Boise Idaho. Where do we go pick up my tickets for Tokyo Japan South America everywhere and after two days he finally had to put out a statement? Saying all right. Clearly I was joking around and I was on that metal. Show you specifically you don. Jamieson should be given a ticket at this new city field concert. I think I'll probably be the only one who doesn't get one for me putting that clip out there and reminding everybody that they broke their word is molly. I'd seen the signs like who's on this tour. You Know Molly. Croup is literally on the posters. The biggest name DEF LEPPARD and a poison. I thought DEF LEPPARD was big motley crue because of this movie or is it always been that way? pretty equal. I think as far as they're drawn stuff but you're putting the most into it you know like the most money or the most I guess maybe it's because of netflix movie. Did you see that you know what got US something? That's GonNa ruin my street cred but I didn't because I am afraid is going to. Yeah by the way I saw it. This show. This movie had to go on. Netflix is the band again. Just move on Netflix. It's so fucking dirty theaters. Couldn't handle it. We should we should women scoring the first five minutes. Okay but that's not enough weeks for forty fifty years old so but you know people do love the movie and so it served its purpose and like I said you know all these now. They're on the clock now to come back again. So I'm predicting them for twenty twenty two and then slayer that just finished their farewell for twenty twenty-five on the record when they do the they do the farewell tour and they go thanks. We'll see you next year. What all right. Good buying right when they say of course. Never meet your heroes during that metal. Show anybody down. Oh always meet your heroes at their hard rock and metal people. 'cause yeah there. Ninety nine percent of our way cool Now nobody was ever like a Dick. You know I mean only only guy that was ever Aso and which you know. He wasn't being a jerk just being himself as Marilyn Manson. Okay because you know He. He showed up eleven in the morning. A slugging from a bottle of absinthe I mean he was doing the Rockstar thing for real and and I always tell people look I mean. It was definitely made the interview. Tough like China babysit a five year old. But I'd rather have that than the Shiny Happy Manson come in. And then you know like at the same time it'd be it'd be like remember when you took CNN seriously. Can you do something like that hair? And then it was like. Maybe he's putting on an act vase swigging from the bottle you know. It's kind of a cliche thing. But at one point the interview he in the commercial break. He asked one of our P. As if she could get a cup so he could pour a drink of the cup to get classy. Yeah I gave another class. And she brought him a Styrofoam Coffee Cup and he poured the absent and the thing disintegrated in my. That's the real deal dude. Now think about your liver as the Styrofoam Cup right. It's Gone Holy Shit. He doesn't have liver. He's actually a ghost right. I see in the paper. You seem to be like. Hey you say you're claiming your bad ass you're coming in here bad ass. That's why I wanted to interview. And that was fine but honestly no people to find out who the Dick is really hasn't been any and I thought as soon as we went the air all the guys I had made friends with over the years of doing the show friends. I was like okay. I ninety percent of them are going to drop out of my world but actually the opposite's true make more friends and stayed friends with all. The people. Were just on the train with Ozzy I was. That's right knee and Ozzy and Sharon right. Yeah we had a little picnic today in Central Park. Does he do? They Dub Ozzy's voice. This is like almost two decades ago. I saw him live and he's mumbling. He did that. Tv Show but then when he sang. It's crystal clear saying Yeah. He is he is. He does his own singing for better for worse. Because I mean like if you've seen Ozzy as many times as I have you'll see those shows where his voice sounds amazing and then you know you'll see other shows you just like. Oh my God you know this is not this is not good right and then they announced recently has Parkinson's you know of course right then. He looked like he's been taking he did. Yeah I'll Yeah I. It's hard to tell what it was from. You know whether he's detoxing or whatever but it's Parkinson's now so yeah you know. I don't think they think he's going to be able to get back on tour. I don't know you know five thousand GonNa die but I guess Sharon won that contract. Does it look like abuse at a certain point right? Know he wants to do it. Yeah how come. He's not saying that. Yeah how old is he? Now seventy one. Yeah I know that he's he's out there. Yeah for rock and roll yes. That's running for president. Yeah he's a young man right. I I love all the stories about this Sharon Osborne she. She'd go on a tour and the band with Piss off so she unplug them during the show. She had someone throw eggs. Iron Maiden is fast once a like how do which was actually funny. 'cause how juvenile is that send somebody down with a dozen eggs because what you know? They took too much of the meats. Backstage right you're you're in catering way too long. You didn't leave any all of low for Ozzy. Hey Hey I'm reading in the paper reading. It's a picture. It's Adele giving the Middle Finger to Paparazzi and screaming. Adam in her carseat. They're doing it. You know these pictures through the window and the paper says Adele went off on the Paparazzi in London flipping the bird with a perfectly manicured finger. Mike God they can't stop. The British rolling in the deep singer was ambushed by the shutterbugs. Well leaving a friend's wedding celebration. Poor thing you paid for these pictures you pay the Paparazzi now. You're you're you're going off the Paparazzi won't leave him alone. Oh You mi Mike Day. Call and let them know where they're going to be. And then the Paparazzi goes. Hey I got pictures of Adel crying. Yeah here's money for the pictures. Then they go. Poor thing is crying over the proper you mean. The newspaper sent the pop or the founder. Artsy went alone and so two the newspapers. It sounds like you were saying. Hey she wanted this and she paid for them until all. No no yeah. It's interesting. How the news is like. Can you believe these These cameras can't stop taking these pictures. Anyway we bought it from them for a few thousand dollars as she made her way into a car. Outside the Mason's arms pub on Saturday the thirty two story do you know that you are describing. Nothing as she made her way as you went into car. The thirty two year old superstar tried to cover her face with a bouquet of flowers. But that didn't start. The swore that we pay. She was then pictured throwing up a middle finger in the photograph and appeared to be near tears. Oh my own tears. That's the one they chose to to get a newspaper. Said it's supposed to have some sort of. It was a very different look from earlier in the evening when she performed several hit songs at the wedding and she appeared to be in good. What made her cry last week. The fifteen time. Grammy winner was also spotted yelling. `Paparazzi amid what looked like a tense phone call. It looked But we wouldn't leave her alone. My God but you understand what what what happens here. That have they feed on themselves. She she has her publicist call the Paparazzi and say Adele's going to be coming out of the back exit You know Of this particular place in in about thirty minutes so be there but the Puck Brauzzi. Don't understand only ten pictures in. That's it when I'M IN MY CAR. You leave me alone well. I think that's true. You think that's everybody not everybody but a lot of people do it. Then they pretend to be mad so everybody wins the Paparazzi. They like to get those shots of the Middle Finger. Whatever put your hand in the camera and then and then they get the press on it and you imagine that your job though and you gotta say that on a first date like what. What do you do for a living newspapers? Why you write for the newspapers newspaper Your newspaper. I do the reports you do reporting for newspapers journalists. Well just the pictures. You take the picture. Talk refer well for like Offer like politics or like Weinstein TRALONCA. I make adult car tried to mccrone. You're in the middle figure. They don't have friends and family right. They can't well. Yeah well you dating anybody under thirty. They wouldn't newspapers anyway I'm a pedophile. What the writing on it. What is that this? What is that thing? No the other thing other news papers and the thing you know the this. How a micro analysis of of the first paragraph of that is yes like the thing that would upset me. The most is not a picture of me. Losing my temper or anything like that. It's the fact that they just. They mentioned just one hit song that she has rolling in the deep comedian. Don Jamieson you know from the live and hilarious album. That's four albums ago. Put the new stuff on giving give me a new credit. Give me a plug. You gotTa keep an eye on what's out there. You don't want people bothering you and that's why I recommend ring. I haven't I love it. I love it I wanNA marry. At Ring's mission is to make neighborhoods safer whether you're a Dell irregulars SCHMO. You might already know about smart video doorbells and cameras that protect millions of people everywhere ring helps you stay connected to your home anywhere in the world. So if there's a package or a surprise visitor you get an alert that you can see here and speak to them all from your phone. Here's a true story. Don I see on my phone that the one of these ups guys going to drop off a package but they do that trick where they don't want to carry the package because it's heavy so they sneak and put that sign. All we missed you pops up. I see him coming to my place. I go to do that. I GO LINDA PACKAGE THEY GOES. I hear him. They go sorry that. Go back and leave. The packets paid for itself. Right away as a subscriber. You have a special offer on a ring. Welcome Kit available right now at ring dot com slash K. A. T. G. Now I know I've said this before but I have this and this is one of those things where I think it's such big technology because I'm a little bit older and I'm like who can afford this and then you go on the site and you're like right. Technology is so affordable and these guys make it like a no brainer to buy. The camera is in focus. It's not like these. You know subway cameras. Were meeting could find the person you see a clear picture and you don't have to get the door if you don't want I love it. I've I've had in my house for the last couple of years super easy to set up an effective. It's almost WANNA get broken into right. Got Ya got Ya. The kit includes video doorbell any chime. Pro which is just we need to start building a ring of security. Run Your Home. Go to ring dot com slash. Kt that's ring dot com slash K T G breaking news Harvey Weinstein has been found guilty of rape. Wow breaking news. Breaking News. Weinstein Sixty seven third degree rape against former sixty seven right. Yeah we're GonNa talk about this whole put on with the Walker. He's going to be fine when he's in jail somehow cosby can see again. You WanNa go to jail if you're falling apart. I'm GONNA do your favor send you to jail for two decades so that you get healed somehow. This guy has been drinking the blood of the youth for a long time. This is what he looks like right but is it the which which council because there was to not so serious and then two very serious Z. Not so not as serious ones Weinstein. Sixty seven convicted of third degree rape. Wars dead. How many do what are the? There's I think there's three First degree rape is the worst. That's some kind of forcible thing and I it's a little convoluted afterwards like They they didn't give consent that I don't know but I is. The worst. Third is a little more lenient. Okay Weinstein Sixty seven note is like did I do that? Only have one degree of rape in my mind right is it is. It is Yeah Sixty. Seven convicted of third degree rape against former aspiring actress. Just command as well as account of Criminal Sexual Act former criminal sexual act in the first degree against former production. Assistant Mimi Haley. But the jury found him not guilty. On the two most serious counts predatory sexual assault as well as a count of first degree rape against man so he faces right now. A minimum of five years a maximum of twenty years. So I don't know five years means. That's your minimum. You'll get that. But then that seems to always be cut in half but he will be in jail for a bit for what it's worth and that whole thing with the walk and the Ab- Garrick I mean that was the most offensive thing about the whole trial guys. Got One hundred million dollars in the bank. He's got that that Walker from CVs with with the tennis balls. Cut Out on the bottom and then he goes. He looks like yeah. It looks like you just got run over by a garbage truck ause. He's like the folks wrong with Ozzy. Laugh at him and all more than eighty women have accused the producer of sexual assault and harassment going back decades and more than a month inside a Manhattan court. Prosecutors called four other accusers as witnesses. Who could testify about Weinstein's alleged pattern of Syria abuse? One of the bigger ones was Annabel skewer who accused of raping her in in the early nineties. I'm curious what kind of jail cell he'll be. Him is going to be in general population. They're gonNA put him aside because there's such a big trial and also sexual convictions. I think are like You can get completely fucked up by the other inmates. They look down on it. Yeah even the worst of the worst but then again you know we still millionaire through you. WanNa keep them safe and believe his promises in a couple of years that you know. Maybe he'll get throw me a hundred bucks a thousand bucks a hundred thousand bucks. I saved his life. I think it's more like maybe he'll give me a role at something you know but I wanna be your next. I'm working on a jail movie. All you guys attention cellblock age. You're all in right. Remember how Johnny cash played in my upbringing. Cameras do that nowadays. Actually we're filming this right. Now they're all hidden cameras cameras. You see this is holly weird man broke down sobbing as she said. Weinstein raped tournament in Hotel Room in two thousand thirteen. She told her she believed he injected his penis to induce an erection before you salted her. He's like can you straight that for the record so he has. He injected his Dick to get hard. He squished his neck into her taking hard He. He injected like like a syringe like liquid Viagra before yeah before we had the pill the Bright Blue Green Pill. So he's so why did he? He checked his peanut into his Dick to get hard because he sits her fat. Fuck Zero Five. He might be out of she. I don't WanNa be rude to me. He's in such bad. You believe me. His first day in prison he'll be like banging the weights with with all the gang members and stuff like we're having to the guy with the Walker. It's like cosby. It's like yeah the minute your cellmates. This is coming towards your ass right. You're not you'll have your side back. Don't worry about it but that should be extra. There's something like when you get if you get mugged on the street. It's worse and worse. What the guy if they pointed the gun at your face that's worse than the body if they said something threatening. That's worse than that if it was racial. It's a hate crime. That's even worse. There should be something that's even worse than rape. It's when you have to inject yourself and make your card so you can rape you know what I mean it's like being a pedophile. But you don't really feel it until you take a pill then don't take the pill right. That's that's when they say rapes about power the net. That's what it is in this case. You couldn't even get hard. I think that is the point of rape is about power right. Yeah believe it but to me. That's to me that's premeditated that's like right. So that's like first degree. Murders means you. You premeditated Ri-. You thought it out in advance. You Plan in advance him. Yeah getting as an injection in his penis to get an erection interesting. Get Out of control. Premeditate you did that and then it's like well I gotta do something with this thing now. The end of the New York trial does not spell the end of legal action against Weinstein also faces sex crimes in Los Angeles. Reese charged with raping one woman one woman and sexually assaulting another in separate incidents on two consecutive days in two thousand thirteen. He's not interestingly. You have to go to another state. Yeah other charges. He has yet to enter a plea in that case. Well let me see how this goes. And it's probably based on that okay. If I'm found guilty I say guilty air because that's all in Jersey. Now he's now he's got priors right. Yeah what what finally convicted him like. How do you prove this beyond a doubt? It's so different that I don't because there weren't cameras in there. I gotta go by the cartoon drawings and I can get a you gotta wait for the books to come out but you know. I'll say it again. These these juries again that you're so stupid that you can't get out of jury duty but you're intelligent enough to take in facts like yeah. I would be bummed out if I got picked up for a jury in a major case as a jury member. It'd be like you really think I have no thoughts of my own. I don't know like meaning that the ones that got into the press. How did you become a jury member when they're asking you if you have any right thought about it? Non Non like though premeditated thoughts about Harvey Weinstein. Now I see Hashtag me too but I also see Hashtag. What was she wearing? I think I'll just wait for the fact that it's pretty convoluted out there. And once again she the woman does even get a proper plug former actress de got some other projects. I don't know should he? Should he have to put her in projects when he gets out? I hope he never gets out. You hope you hope. Did you hear the story about the comedian? That killed me a doctor. Don't kill the doctor. Dr Amy Har- wig as it made the news because she happened to be an ex of drew carey and Sex Therapist and author. Dr Amy Horwick. Thirty eight died after police found her gravely injured outside or Hollywood hills. Home on Tuesday the La County Coroner's office released a report that clearing the cause of death. A homicide he also said she had fallen from third story balcony. Are we use today? Price rate host drew Carrey BEC- but because of tragic frustrating details surrounding the murder Harbach had reportedly filed to restraining orders against ex boyfriend. Gareth Purse House forty one years old the most recent most recent of which had just expired. Why why do restraining orders expire I? Well maybe one day you guys work things out. I'll put you down for two years now. He's I'm really really scared of this fucking guy. And here's the voice messages threatening notes like three years I think every relationship can workout. Yeah friends report that a chance encounter between percents and Hartwig at a party. January-may of setup the violence against Harwich motion and now the court documents unearthed from the restraining order filed by Harvard shows that she suffered horrific abuse at the hands of perseus. By the way. This this Guy. He's a comedian. He was on the kill Tony. Show in La. Oh Yeah Tony Hinchcliffe has this show where he says. Okay you WANNA come up and do stand up your new to stand up to anybody. It's an open mic but professionally. Done you come up. And if you're going good and if you're not good we're gonNA bust your balls and this guy about a month ago. The killer the killer was before the murder yeah was that the show and he was horrible and so this is after. Set them talking to you. You're a fan of the show. You ever watch it or with a couple of times but of course I could help your the date. I like give us an example of a joke. You were going to say before. We all lost respect for you. One one normal. I don't have your best joke. My Best Awesome fucking joke. That doesn't have to do with me or Red van or whatever you know. I had one today where I've been told by talking to an extra long time ago. And she told me that before talking to what I was talking to an ex and she told me that when we first met she thought I had she thought my personality meant I had a small Dick and I talked to another accident. You told me the same exact thing and there's WanNa make it perfectly here right now. The Mike Dick size is private why he should have flung himself balcony that Joe. I think it should be a murder because of this should be the death penalty. You took on. Don't boo him. I don't have any member. Yeah what a wild swing you took bringing up hot date for the first time to this just like. I HOPE. I'm any good at stand up comedy. Oh she's a real hot date now because she just let herself on fire and the way. Let's make sure this date is okay? The hottest state. Well I'm really glad you came up here because I didn't think it was possible for me to hate a man as much as I hate. My husband did this. This woman's joking. I hate my husband so you Gareth Gave it a shot? I would love to see you come back sometime. If this is something that you actually think that you might enjoy doing it goes well. I write literally constantly. I just don't memorize it all right. I'm pretty sure it's not a copy. It's not a comedian. And that's that they're calling him a C- he he's getting over plugged comedian Gareth. Whatever now you know. He did an open MIC to. Were you literally do one minute? Yeah that's all you do. You do one minute and then you get interviewed and like you said if you do good then it's fun to get interviewed after if you don't get your balls busted so he's not a Canadian right. Somebody's he's a murderer. Somebody tripped outside. They help pick them up. I'm not a doctor really him what he does you. Well you know fulltime murderer. But on the open mic seen when comedy. He murdered humans more than he murdered jokes. You seek another comedian was murdered out there. And he's like we're maybe okay to constantly. I just don't memorize it right. I'm pretty sure the first the first kid use the phrase. I'm waiting line. Stein was a bully on the playground. Einstein Liangelo playground. But why but why? Why would put a bully around in eighteen eighty? Okay so that makes. That's so important to this. I mean I don't think it would have made it work but it would have made it makes sense. Is there this guy? Has IT in him to kill? And he's on stage like to do. I just kill these people. Now what's he? There's got to be such rage behind that fake smile scare everybody. We're going to keep moving. There goes scare there. We go. He's going to you. GotTa be careful here people. Yeah with you gotta be careful. This is not a game. Show you go purse. House in Harwich allegedly dated several years ago. Live together for a short time before. The relationship deteriorated. A friend of mine said that purse house quote was a constant thing that she talked about that she was afraid this particular guy and it was always something that kind of followed her. It scared her enough to tell friends that she I think I should get some macer pepper spray. The New York Daily News Obtained Court Documents Detailing Harks twenty eleven in two thousand twelve restraining orders which she alleged that there were multiple arguments in which Garrett purse choke me suffocated me. Push me against walls. Kick me drive me to the ground. With Force Force restrain me. Send my head to the ground with a closed fist yeah. I don't think that restraining order should expire right. It's not like she's guessing he might be. What if there's a new coffee shop in L. A? And like we're both into it right. Yeah right yeah well. Yeah exactly. Harvard block somebody from twitter for the rest of your life for. Oh your comedy sucks. There's no it doesn't like after a year they're unblocked twitter and they can start commenting again. It's like a restraining order after been thrown stairs. It's like a now. Let's just let's let's let this thing run away right you guys. It's going to be a funny story. Later harvick filed the first order after. She claimed he pushed her from a car. She wrote that. He broke into her apartment multiple times including one occasion in which he quotes smash ten picture frames on her door. Told her quote. Things will get worse than they after purse house returned to apologize taping about four dozen roses to the entrance of Hardwick. Roses are expensive especially for an upcoming comedian. Right and when you're at a flower shop and you go. I need four dozen roses Gary Four dozen troubles right and you can tell your desperate. They don't give you a deal because you bought walk you pay extra. If anything got he went to the store and then her house in long if I if I if I work at a flower shop and a guy comes in orders. Four dozen roses calling the police first of all. Buy Me Ten picture frames. How `bout that that's what you broke. I didn't have a flower. Probably need some new hinges on my front door. Can you stop at the hardware store on the way over? Did you guys see like Valentine's Day? If you just like on Mother's Day all of a sudden everyone's at Brunch on Valentine's Day you see everyone in line at flower shops. You know the people who didn't think about it ahead of time and they all look miserable. They're just like this better work to see. I don't understand why she wanted but here I am and I'm like Oh that's so sentimental didn't even put it in water so that it's a job for me. My Dad for Valentine's Day would that take soap and draw on the for my mom from my mother's birthday or Valentine's Day and go you know I love you happy Valentine's Day and there's always my mom's job at the end the day to clean it on full. Yeah my dad would. My mom was a house mom so she would do all the cooking cleaning stuff like that but every once in a while. My Dad would make this elaborate meal. She could have cooked in a half an hour. No job you know. She chalked it up for him and she got she got him the sous chef and he just put it in stirred it around a little bit. And everyone's like. Oh what a big day. And then she had to clean and and he got all this credit for it but it was literally a stir fry it tasted really good but it him four hours of my mom's work the La Times reports that Hernandez Chavez a friend of Horowitz and a fellow sex therapist claims hurricane run into an at an event in January February. Now it was the absolutely worst possible luck. He said. It reignited his obsessive preoccupation with her. Another friend said that hurric- had recounted when per house personnel saw her. He just went ballistic. He lost it. He made a scene thirties. Say the police went to Harvard and early hours of the morning in response to calls about a woman screaming. They found her roommate outside. Who said they had jumped? They had jumped the wall to escape the home and call for help because her work was being assaulted in sought officers then found hardwick lying on the ground under her third story balcony with blunt injuries consistent. With a fault she died later in a hospital. Purse was arrested on suspicion of murder was released on two million dollars. Bond was soon after picked back up at arrested with no bail so I wonder like. Did they get one? More piece of evidence was a mistake that he shouldn't have got bail. Or was it a trick? You're free to go and they tailed him to see if he was like going to hide some evidence. I don't know that some clever movie shit. You know you're free to go like okay. Let me go to my storage locker and I've got you again. Bill de Blasio mayor of Los Angeles for one day and said. Oh no no no bell anymore. He didn't New York City's working really well letting people are getting their hundred fortieth conviction but they can't set bail anything under a thousand dollars. So if you rob rob a bank for nine hundred ninety nine dollars you bury the money you get arrested in your out within two hours no bail and then you go rob another bank for nine hundred ninety nine. Criminals tried to give the dollar back to the bank. No You keep you WANNA fuck with the dollar back. I ain't going to jail right. I mean I don't know the details of this but this sounds like a stupid way to clean up stupid system by the way going back a little bit easy 'em who's listening live on twitter right now. My parents own a flower shop and we had to institute a policy of no anonymous deliveries because we had a crazy ass stocker. Send someone flower. So you can't from their flower shops sending honestly interesting smart. This is what flowers have come to the murder package. I'm ruling thought. Though that's four dozen Gareth per house again. Forty one was released. Let's see released. The two million dollars bond than arrested. His freedom was short lived. The district attorney announced process was charged with murder as well as first degree residential burglary. He's like the weekend at burglary can just be. Murder is Murder Burglary. Not being nice to somebody having an attitude. I guess you ain't walking brain littering your honor. The defendant faces the death penalty or life in prison without the possibility of parole if convicted as charged and looks like he will be a decision on whether to seek capital punishment will be made at a later date Los Angeles County. Coroner officials determined that Harvard died of blunt force injuries to the head and torso. I feel like this will be a death penalty because people are embarrassed by allowing this to happen. You know I feel like they're going to feel like it retroactively. Pay for what he did because they're giving him a higher center like a. You know the death penalty which is the worst. But they should've known this was a violent person. Why is he out on the street at all? After all of that you multiple times on multiple dates he fucked up and why even calling. It fucked up. He hit an brutally assaulted a one several times enough to get a restraining order. That's not fun. You got to go to court a bunch of times well you know how imprison people fuck with people. So now that they know he's a WanNa be comedian. Tell me that like. Can you just punch the shit out of me? I mean guy. Can you shank me into a corner and even professional don does what people tell me a joke? This poor guy day in day out. I can't even do Thanksgiving with family around. I'm like I can't think of one all right. Let's I've made that. I suffer the same fate as Jeffrey Epstein. Yeah piece of Shit. I don't questions around it. You know clear cut Jeffrey Epstein Awful. Here's a fun new store. Let's come on Quentin Tarantino's dad for the first time me react natural. I don't know that. Instead of the childbirth the pregnancy lasting nine months it lasted fourteen months because he had to do an for an hour in the middle by the way I bet he has this foot fetish but he makes sure the booties on this kid. All the time like do not show those feed. I've learned a lot having my own daughter. How old is he? He is fifty six. What are we doing his girlfriend? Danielle pick is thirty six. Oh twenty years difference about right does this okay. Does it set like if he wanted a kid? He's fifty six years old. I you know I'm pretty close to that age. You know that you want a kid by then and you're very capable of doing it. Don't you think it's like this thirty six year old? That has always wanted a kid. And he can't be with her unless he he gives her the family she always wanted. She is a Israeli singer actress. Do you know her come do. She's my sister didn't know she was still out. There was great. Her father is prominent Israeli. Pop Star speak pick. My God appeared in Tarantino's once upon a time in Hollywood share portraying the wife of Leonardo DiCaprio ISIC calf so smaller as a calf. And say. She's in she gets a good plug because she's married to Qatar in Tino. I figured Al Allow. Don't share send you can follow on live and got one plug yet out there murdering people and all of a sudden. They're professional comedians album. That we've the twitter account. Israel Don Jamieson. The instagram with his thirst traps is John. Don Jamieson official and the website is his name. Don Jamieson DOT COM. You can see all the details there. The new album holding in my hands right now. His pure rock denim and laughter. And you can own it and you can play it. You can laugh your shit ass off. Yeah tell me I'm right. Tell me I'm wrong. Laugh your shit ass right off that thing then. Was there anything about the timing of putting this new album out are you would? Just you know the material was there you know. And because some of its topical so because I gotTa talk about the Bizarro world that we live in between all the trump derangement syndrome and in all this woke kind of rhetoric that we have to say look. You know I'm not woke. I wake that that's where I am in my life. You know and I don't understand these words and stuff so but I also try not to be like the old man. Yell and get off my lawn there you know so. I hope I do in a semi humorous way for people. But kind of you know. It's Kinda got a little bit of everything for everybody on there so fine line that you have to walk as a white man electric. It's true it's true. And of course you talk about that metal. Show Ozzy Alice Cooper meeting all these people and There you go congratulations. Yeah thanks man. We went to number six on itunes. And you maybe we'll give it one more push here to the top but Yeah That's the big place to get the music now. Apple Music. I tunes spotify but I do have the physical CDs at the gigs and I'm GonNa do Vinyl. So that'll be in a couple of months that crackling sound of the comet really left and shit. You're not the vinyl when you hear those Dick Jokes that warm tones a fireplace. What's you're holding your lover. Don doesn't rose. It's very nice to meet you too. Thanks so much. All right see parasite. We'll talk about it tomorrow. By DOT COM.

Don Jamieson NFL rape murder New York Vince McMahon XFL Harvey Weinstein twitter Los Angeles Dub Ozzy Keith Malley Middle Finger Mike Dick Adele Jersey Mick Mars Wendy starling Netflix
Kyle Jamieson goes into bat for mental health

RNZ: The Detail

23:17 min | 11 months ago

Kyle Jamieson goes into bat for mental health

"Jameson he's playing upholstery. Straight up in the water leans GONNA tight this one running around to his life to heads and Chara Goes Jameson. Has now that got too big on him full and Saudi onto the stumps out. He is gone bold Jameson. Twelve China Simone short outside. H Tycoon Biwott. Link Regulation. Down Four for Jameson. Whose onto the back foot pulling the bow down to the long league. Boundary dive has taken a catch. Five-wicket Sport Jameson teammates applaud. Colin Jamieson is the main of the moment and cricket. He's been a PR drain for the black caps. Since only two plus meters of him boost into the team at Christmas force and the man in question is the black caps hero. From the Second Teasing Cross chairman of the match performance with forty-nine with Vietnam stick letter. Wickets Call Jameson Claw. Welcome to the program. How you doing very good. Thanks thanks for having that good. Thanks wasn't the whole story. And when he said this at a press conference was this is my career. Rose wasn't really enjoy it And wasn't locking the person that I wasn't a field sometimes as well so The shift that I need to make and Most importantly I need to be happening. Money to enjoy my crooked and. Um You know wherever that might tighten so look at Sydney payoff per million very hip among the PR. People and the media were well coached out if if you feel comfortable liberating what what didn't you like about your home like the planet ear-. On the field. What what what economy Or pretty far CAITLIN. Yeah on the field and pretty aggressive and I think to just sort of came Adam wise on your certainly Lakhan with iota. I'm Sharon Break Kelly today on the detail. How Top sports people are opening up about the mental health battles and taint? That's a media on endings for example. If it's if it's rugby every training everything that they do every game is filmed by at least three or four cameras and a droid. So every detail of the job as videoed. It's clipped as played back. That critiqued David Galbraith. Former psychologists to the sports stars from the chiefs to the white foods more from shortly. But I I visited Kyle at his home just before. He headed to Sydney for the first one day international against Australia. Today I asked him what made him talk about his mental health at that press conference in February. It was awkward. Did you plan to talk about Deja to look? It was caused? Even though he's the press conference was talking to a media go into that kind of took a turn around the knowledge go and the move from Kennedy Tolkien on. You did bain some stuff behind and at some point in time that someone is GonNa ask me about that. Move and probably something. I'm trying to work out. How do I articulate the story behind that the mental side of things and mental health and that sort of thing is very important? The Look at took a ten where I didn't necessarily think was going to go but the fact is opened up. A small conversation now continues because it felt like the way they were asking you questions. They didn't know how to push it. You know they were interested. It was awkward because they went to about sport. Greening with I. It's a delicate talking. I think because it's probably not spoken about as much people don't know how to broach the subject or how far to push or what and like you said it was sports journalists talking about sports in the test and that sort of thing so probably not a whole lot of experience to seal in the kind of topics so there's a little bit off the cuff but lucky so it was kind of not sure how you know you wanted to push talk about what happened. I think you know I'd probably had some stuff a few years previously from a bit of a a relationship breakdown and experienced stuff over the course of the year two years and that was a work in progress Through saying different people and you had some counseling from that. Yeah Yeah Yeah so dragged on for months and it was outside crooked at that point. We're always a slot. Anita talked with someone in the kind of guy on I guess in the thought pattern that was an and that was just a constant battle for a period of time. And the something. They're always looking to continue to work on and put myself in his space and probably the last last year or so of my Tom Cross. It should just the environment that I kind of found myself was quite negative and for want of a better phrase talk sue and I'd go through days and weeks and that sort of thing bottling stop and in kind of comes a hidden away in What I mentioned an initial interview was sometimes. My outlet was on the career field. So you know whether it's talking to God or my motion. Maybe in the at times angry on the field is probably played. The game in a passionate way which I think people saying the last few weeks as well. But it's kind of a good thing when you get a wicked dampen. Yeah Yeah that's a positive outlook for and probably reflects part of the spice on now. Um whereas at that time the celebrations would go fraction too far or push aside in the people close to you kind of want sheets for the god down tight the brunt of it but it's just low energy communist inside just got to a point where I was like. I'm not enjoying the moment. And this is kind of not really the Y I. My journey to involve was lead me to to moving up to walk when you say it was toxic environment was toxic. Was that the crooked hang environment or was that your home environment and Christ cheech more saw I think the credit side of things and talk for a little bit of a harsh way of of freising about this thing probably the relationship. You know when you're relationship with someone that just wasn't we're onto different wavelengths and between you and your I think just just in general stuff. Yeah just just with the whole group as I don't want to single when he went out and that and look at also looking at myself as well and you very eloquent in the way talk about it so will you talking to somebody about your situation then or was that just figured all this out for yourself all boys junior Jim really been pretty good at reflecting and laws and beyond the Pacers to get if myself Jameson. Hasn't been afraid to seek help. He says professionals in that area have been pivotal including New Zealand. Cricket MENTAL SKILLS EXPERT. Pete Sanford Rock and talk about what's gone on my life and Vice Versa. And through the the twelve months also leading up to to me moving and just kind of being a bit of a sounding board. It's like well sometimes it's cooling me out look. It's probably not the right way to go about things and look. This is maybe a way to manage things and just working through the thoughts and feelings that I had through that period during the press conference. You see you didn't like yourself is probably the context around from cricketing standpoint. I reflected on why I wanted to look like through Kirk how to put try myself and I mean sometimes you know the celebrations or whatever may be Would happen and then it come off the field and it's like Kinda why Y.'s. I need to go to that extent. We doing what exactly I mean. How would just it's just celebrations? I says I think probably like in the environment. Twelve always being outside of you know was try wick hot and push myself and I guess they have value pace around while I was trying to Achieve AND PUTS IT IN MARY. Up Probably Bottle it up just a little bit angry or and it's not GonNa get it. It's not to the extent that it's really affecting other people but this kind of just let war. Is there a better way of actually handling things? I just want to enjoy Kirk and I WANNA play the game. Hard to be passionate what I'm doing and But also in the day just enjoy whatever. This journey gives me over the Knicks. Have many years. Do you think they ask the he'd space and I suppose the way you were feeling and Christ church was stopping you from being the base quicker. You could be thanks. I think it'd be in the situation on now if I hadn't shifted at the same time I think that's how disciple I just know him a lot happier now and so to said that perspective around Pliny Fisk game and banging the group and just enjoy and being grateful for the upper change I've been given these last few weeks wither. I would have been the hit space to be able to say the same thing. I'm not quite sure so much. Well rounded place now with crooked laugh when the headlines started coming out in the story started coming out. One headline was something like into battles or mental struggles. Black Cats Newcomer Kyle. Jamieson has opened up about his mental health. Struggles at missing. It hasn't all been rosie in his rise to the New Zealand team. How did that make you feel? I mean we're happy with it or short it's A conversation. I think that needs to happen more. And it's a conversation that all want to be a pot of ends them so trying to probably work through how. I want to articulate Moss story and to what extent I want to delve into it and probably not GonNa get there right all the time. And it's GonNa get reported or Rephrased pushed out in different in different ways. The nature of the industry can open up more doors around that conversation in on my story and the people close to me. No Ginnie that paint on and that to me all that matters. What sort of reaction did you get from your Ukraine mates or detained members? All it wasn't a whole lot doesn't haven't really delve too much more into a yacht with a sword. Or what but I mean. I guess it's becoming more typical because there are some top sports people like John. Coup but really. The image of staunch doesn't talk about his feelings so I think that's been the steamer ran for such a long period of time and some of the old best great job at the moment Iran coming inbound talking around that vulnerability pace. And which is I think could also them like from job to opening that door and hopefully throw? That just breaks down the stigma for for everyone. Jameson may have felt alone. But he isn't his a couple of former. All Blacks in the mud. Sorta had a little talk often Came back wasn't wasn't really. Enjoying regular say biggest. Make the most of season. Why wouldn't you enjoying your everything? I guess trying too hard to push throwing people say now you can see what people really take breaks. Muesli Mitzner I only record twenty deny all's down I I shouldn't feel this like people often walking down the street. Look people in the eye and I'm and I'm just thinking for myself a lot. He's looking at me going. You're a pussy. You'll saw useless this Akita Yanni end Israel dagg opening up about their own struggles last year. Some all blacks including ATI SALVIA and TJ. Here Nahra set up an informal support group to talk about mental health. It started off as just socializing during the season but evolved into opening up about a range of topics such as fatherhood family and wellbeing. And it's not just rugby starting to acknowledge the issues. His mixed martial arts fighter. Shane young so I know it sounds bed to be saying after fought like a big win. We have the highest suicide rates. But I'M GONNA keep saying until it's the opposite. It's not true to have the highest rates of kids helping each other. The most quoted almost the strongest community as a whole so I think because New Zealand is like where bunch of lorries is all just enjoy fighting culture and for someone to come out like as a fighter and be like Yo. I cry and I look after my mental health and I talk to people. I talk to men and we talk about emotions and stuff to know that. That's all good psychologists. David Galbraith has written a book called unleashing greatness spoke to him in the Hamilton Studio before he hit it off to talk to some top cyclists at the Cambridge Valley the prevalence of mental health and elite athletes as no different in the prevalence mental health in the general population. What's different as the context in which someone who has a mental health struggle has to operate every day when they go to the work and what I mean by that. Is that the late sport. Context is very special place. We're a feedback as an taint. It's immediate on endings. For example of its rugby every training everything that they do every game is filmed by at least three or four cameras and a dry so every detail of the job as videoed clipped as plight back that critiqued. They sit down and talk to somebody about how well they're doing. How will they weren't doing so if you can consider that context as a day to day employment environment? It's really rear. That's not very often. You find you made the military may have that as well because the team's details tell us about life but in general the population doesn't have that degree of scrutiny or expectation of performance and yet and sport they do. That's extreme. That's the pressure is very real and add into that. The performance on the world stage is directly related to the financial support whereas mother general population again. That's that's not the norm you know. You're not critique that way you're you're paid each week or what have your salary goes through and it's not the same thing that is intense. I'd items will realize that it was the level of scrutiny and that is something that's developed over time. I mean delete sport now. It's that said right. This year we live sports. Become this this thing and debated whole know what they're getting themselves on for when they get to that level. I mean they prepared for which is a good question. I think once people start moving through the levels of sport whatever sport. They ran a very early age now. They're introduced to coach of high performance. So I'm saying that you know if we'd go back to rugby hop performances now part of UC system you know first fifteen rugby is televised on TV. They have strengthened conditioners. They have a gym program. They have video reviews so they in many ways they are miniature proficient rugby league's Are they prepared for it? I think rugby does a wonderful job of portraying to Pierre meaningful. The professional game in this great things that happened within that space mental health and helping the most so create live plans as well as rugby plans and sign it. I think you can really prepare someone for what we talked about this. They actually have to experience it to really understand what's coming out the particular sports I mean I'm thinking of cricket where it's tougher than other sports. You have the sledging and then you're part of a team but these almost hours that you spending on your own as well especially if you feel. Ding and then. When you get out you have that long walk off the field and national you know you got thousands millions of you count for TV watching you as you walk off the field. It's sort of you know the shame of us. Use the particular sports where it's tougher. Do you think on on mental health. You're spot on. Each sport has a very different context. So if you take go for example you know you're out there for four hours you by yourself. You have a kitty you could be on the other side of the world. You could be nineteen years so first year as a rookie professional Having to put money on your Visa Card Visa cards getting close to being Limited You're not sure whether you're gonNA make the cut if you don't make this. Cut Your Visa cards bounce. You not going to. We're going to be staying and hey you're gonna get back so you can get a bit of an idea about what that must be like. And then you're in the for four hours and you got another two days or three days or four days of competition so the sports very long hold somebody in that and teen space. So they're out variations across the sports. And you talked cricket Iraq and opening the better and cricket or if you're in the field and you better poorly neighbor gun field and you got to carry the old days of how you performed and you know it can hold you and the washing machine of emotional upset for a very long time. How people deal with that as a real relevance because the respect of of a context within it's thirty five seconds whether it's four hours the variable about how you experience that space is your perspectives. How you say what successes for example how you see yourself in relation to sport and your identity and those variables have a massive influence on the experience of success and failing and sport. And that's that perspective for me which is something that is incredibly important for coaches and appearance. And you know. We talked about skulls earlier for teachers to understand. We're resilient sets and resilience as a cool able resilience is about your perspective of the context in which you're experiencing or and influences everything that the inflows from that moment so if you have a speed of that has that that context is directly related to yourself worth and then you haven't performed now. You're in a really risky position of feeling pretty bad about yourself. And if that's four hours we have to be out on the golf course on cricket pitch it can be pretty horrible place to be in so when you're working with people and these situations what do you say to them. These layers here. We think about human development. I'm healthy human development boats layers of natural resilience anyway so if we think about raising healthy children that's really relevant for thinking how we support athletes to function well as well so the discussions with an adult athlete. Moore the same liars that we want to evolve in our children to embrace school and embrace challenges and stipend to opportunities and to see those moments in time on directly related to their own identity or integrity. So the outcome of Wien doesn't influence whether I feel good about myself and so that is lies that we WANNA stop voting with a child or the same as you want to start voting with an athlete and so the perspectives. For me. Which are really important. You know if we think about labeling people to understand them the discussions with an athlete helped them understand that -ironically as simple as it sounds that they are human bane they have an identity attached to a history and ancestry that choosing to be in that sport and choosing to be doing their thing and then off really moving was stunned moved. Discussions of maturity would maturity is realizing that sometimes things work and sometimes they died and if we can keep those discussions going with him we can have a discussion about perspective about what success really is and what I find. Is that the athletes that have perspective that success is related to if it an pro deeply attached to the way that they do what they do how they do what they do versus outcome and numbers and world rankings and what people were saying about them. Social media have a very different relationship with pressure a very different relationship with performance in the moment of pressure. There's a scene of embracing the moment that. Contribute to the throw and the competitiveness that makes elite sport that very unique thing and so they end up like an adventure and space rather than someone who is disparate for that space to be successful when outcome seen because it helps them feel with while and it helps them feel that what they've contributed autun invested in was with wile enough. We think about how we want teenagers to consider the world at the moment with Isis and tear attacks. And all of these threats. It's no different. We still want them to embrace the reality of the world that we live in but we still want them to go through the airport eighteen years old and embracing on some sort of angel somewhere in the world with confidence in ambition. We want athletes to be the same. We want them to go to a world class of with confidence and emission and seems curiosity. Wonder how fast I can run. I wonder how many runs. I wonder how fast Aachen Bola one so. There's a wonderment in that space. Now if we can get into someone's psychology the moment of pressure becomes a thrill to Kyle Jamison and what it's like to go from obscurity to the hotshot cricketer. Everybody wants to talk about. We have been of a bit of a crazy ride last few weeks and probably still looking for a way to take bacon have bracing actually Sarka What's unfolded something your choice. Since YOU'RE A kid Play one game for New Zealand and Just obeying the gruppen up in lucky enough to achieve that now and I think is kind of from where I'm at is applied kirk and try and get better and just enjoy it sir today. I'm Sharon Kelly. The detail is brought to you by newsroom. Dot Co dot insead made possible by ironside and inside on air. You can get the detail downloaded free to your mobile phone every weekday from any podcast platform. And if you're using it will give us a rating so other people can find us to. This episode was engineered by Jeremy Ansell and produced by Alexia Russell. And thanks to Kyle Jameson and David Galbraith Cockatiel.

Kyle Jameson rugby David Galbraith New Zealand Colin Jamieson Kirk Sharon Break Kelly Sydney Jameson Claw long league China Simone Rose Cricket Second Teasing Cross chairman Chara Knicks Christ church Kyle
Are You Smart or Just Cynical? With Kathleen Hall Jamieson and Jay Rosen

With Friends Like These

1:35:15 hr | 1 year ago

Are You Smart or Just Cynical? With Kathleen Hall Jamieson and Jay Rosen

"The. Hi, I'm Ana Marie Cox and welcome to with friends like these. It may not surprise listeners to hear that when I was in school. I was something of a nerd a studious child. And also pretty socially awkward. And I couldn't quite figure out. Why I had this disconnect with the other kids because see I I was smart was real smart. I knew I was smart. I love studying loved reading. And I thought that was cool. I thought reading and studying and knowing stuff was really like hip, not hip. I guess I didn't hip was. But I thought it was meet there was neat to know stuff. And I wasn't shy. When I knew things in classes, like if I knew the answer to a question from teacher would raise my hand. And I raised my hand a lot. Because I thought you know, I liked other people that raise their hands. I thought when you knew a lot of things that made you cool. Again, probably don't have to explain this is not the way that the other kids seemed to see me, and I couldn't quite get my head around it, really. Honestly like I did. I mean, like, I got it that I wasn't cool, and I sort of put together that maybe it was the reasoning my handle the time that did it. But I didn't understand like why it isn't a cool. Good thing to know stuff. I still think it's cool and good staff. In a while back. I read a study that blue was left of my mind about this. But then a while ago. I read a study that just put all of that into crystal clear perspective. It was a field study field, psychological study, and they took a real class, and they put to undercover research assistance in it. I think it was a college class. That's where they do most of this stuff. And one of the students was a an Ana type person who knew the answers and raised their hand and got real excited about about class, and the other student was more, you know. Sardonic individual. Let's say that person is person sat back class made fun of the teacher made fun of the person who was answering all the questions kind of said, you know, smart ass things under their breath. I am sure you're familiar with this type as well. And what the researchers found they asked the other students afterwards about their classmates there, they asked who do you think is the smartest most capable person in the class. I guess probably a series of questions that were more subtle than that. But what they discovered is the. The other students thought that it was the smart ass that was the more intelligent person. This sort of road off the person who actually knew all the answers in favor of the cynic. Cynicism is oppose that can make. You seem really smart. And sometimes cynics are smart the original cynics don't seem to be lacking in intelligence. But today show is about cynicism as oppose cynicism as an attitude and what happens when we get cynical about the institutions that service. Our guest today are Kathleen hall Jamieson. She's an American professor creek, Asians, and the director of the end Berg public policy center at the university of Pennsylvania. She's the author of the spiral of cynicism and most currently the author of Cyprus wore our second guest is Jay Rosen. He is a journalism professor at York University, and the author of press, think dot org, one of my favorite blogs, where he writes about the American press, and it's more deals. Jay rosen. Kathleen hall Jamieson cynicism. Coming right up. I'd like to welcome to the show Kathleen hall Jamieson. Hi there. Hi. Hi. So wouldn't talk by your book the spiral of cynicism. Do you think you could briefly explain what that spiral is? I it's a book co author Joe Capella who is my colleague at the Annenberg school at the university of Pennsylvania and the spiral is one in which press coverage of political content. Focuses on the tactics that are involved the political advantage or disadvantage that is gained or or is lost. But not on the substance. And as a result creates an environment in which voters don't hear about the substance. And they think that the candidates are engaging in pandering because all they're doing is engaging in tactical manipulation. And then voters thinking that the here more media counts of polls that suggest that the public is cynical having made the public cynical. The polls document the cynicism of the public which reinforces the idea in polls that the public is cynical. And you get a self fulfilling prophecy, which is a political environment in which. The public is needlessly cynical about politics. Doesn't mean some cynicism isn't warranted. But rather that substantive alternatives and the substance that candidates are offering and the the differences they actually plan to make an will make if they've given the chance to govern are obscured because the tactical frame the frame that focuses on horse race on appearance on who gains advantage and loses it without the substance activate cynicism, and in the process, it depresses learning, and that means in campaigning. We divorce campaigning from governance and on policy. We minimize the likelihood that the public understands how somebody's trying to address a real problem, and there's two of more than two, but at least two interesting things, and what you just said that kinda wanna divan on one of them is that if you tell the public there cynical, they'll get more cynical is that what you're saying in there if you act as if the public is cynical, and when you pull the public you ask questions that are base. Based on the assumption that what the public is doing is making a Cessna it's based on their cynical assumptions you feed a cycle in which there's less substance inside, the news cycle for them to engage with. And as a result. You increase the likelihood that they see politics cynically. Right. You're kind of training them to look for horse race coverage. Right. We're training them to be political consultants instead of voters and so in the process what we're doing is telling them how a candidate is tactically adapting to try to win votes. And not what the candidate will do if the candidate is elected and will govern and candidates are doing tactical things to win votes in. It's not irrelevant to know that. But it should not be the primary thing that we learned from reporters it should. In fact, be a distant distant secondary thing. And I do think this is a self-fulfilling prophecy. And I saw that when I was doing research to talk to you because it was hard to find current numbers about this because they write about it so much like we right constantly. About cynicism and lack of trust. It's literally like an overflow of articles about at and in the process, we are training the electorate to think that it's normal to behave this way, and and to decry the normality of it while we're doing nothing to put in place, the kinds of problem based discussion that would help a see we do all agree about some things, and that they are problematic and the solutions that are being offered and understanding them to increase the likelihood politicians can actually act to produce those solutions, even when they might have costs, and so one of the byproducts of this is a pattern of governance in which candidates are less likely to take the chance of explaining the trade offs and the costs, and as a result, don't take those risks and problems going solved, and then they get criticized for not explaining their policy to write play good naked criticized for having policies that the public understands nothing about right? Let me let me give. A concrete example, if you go back over say the last month, and you read and watch everything with search being green new deal. So your search frame to find things you simply going to search green new deal. Now, read everything and watch everything and tell me how often someone takes the time to explain the key elements in that proposal as opposed to how many times someone talks about the tactical advantage or disadvantage of favoring or opposing it. And so we have a great deal of commentary. That says this is quite a fracture of the Democratic Party. This is creating a problem for democratic contenders. They're having to say, it's aspirational. What what does that mean? That means it looks as if they're pandering to the left when in fact, they're trying to do is this difficult political situation in the process of all that talk and all that writing you don't know that there are very specific proposals. There that would actually be consequential their trade offs involved that are very real. And there's a vision of a future that this legislation could advance toward even if not every element, and it was adopted. But if the public doesn't have any idea that it's there the public can't even tell us, I might like some of those ideas, maybe rebuilding the infrastructure and increasing the amount of clean energy would be good idea. I ho- severe like with this, particular example, it's like doing design critique of the fire truck while there's a fire happening. You know, like. It's a little like like saying it appears to be a fire truck. It's probably not, you know, they have those fire truck kits. It probably isn't really a fire truck. Do you think it's a fire truck? John will. No, jane. I don't think it's really a firetruck. Well, it may be noticed that it's red. In the meantime, you've burned the house across the street because you haven't mobilized the ladders, Moses, right? The other thing I'm going to add is that you're saying, you're know, we the media turning voters until like a nation of political consultants. I I noticed this on my first presidential campaign when I travelled John McCain in two thousand eight like I would I quickly discovered. It was somewhat pointless to talk to voters at rallies. Because all they would do is just repeat back to the analysis that you just did kind of right? So Sarah Palin is authentic, and John McCain is a maverick and Obamas' chance for hope, and it was like it was maddening. And so that was in two thousand eight and now I feel like right to do the big reveal which is that as as as current as your Nelson feels today. You actually started making this analysis. You wrote this book in nineteen Ninety-three. Yeah. This this phenomenon and people often look at this and assume that political coverage all was had a tactical focus, and it didn't go back and read through the news transcript from nineteen sixty and nineteen sixty four and nineteen sixty eight you do not see this. They're practically all you see it occasionally. But we basically have created whole generations of reporters. Now who don't remember that time and place and in fairness to reporters who are in a very difficult situation where the news cycle is very rapid in which the level of expertise. They're expected to hold his very broad. It's easier. Engage in this kind of coverage because you don't need any knowledge to do it. You can simply say whatever someone said must beginning tactical advantage. Somehow, what would that reasonably be, and that's anybody's opinion. And in the process, you haven't had to say, well is that a plausible foreign policy position? What is the problem being addressed? How do the candidates differ from each other? What can we learn from an analysis of how these kinds of proposals have worked in the past when implemented so we displace a whole set of questions that the public could intelligently engage and are more relevant to the actual public's well-being. Because for practical purposes, these are the policies win and acted or not enacted Willer will not affect their lives. And I'm as as concerned about the policies, we don't enact because the public ever gets onto the same page to say, yes, there is a problem here of the alternatives. And here's how we can get to a best solution that we can agree to across the aisle and with the green deal. It would be nice to. Would these actually work? Right. I guess it would be nice to know. If you ask the public after describing each of the elements in the green new deal. Do you adopt. The do you want us to adopt that or not because what we often find is that when we take the political coverage back and just strip it back to the details that underlying it in policy. There's a high level of public embrace of ideas that are never even being discussed. The public doesn't even know they're on the table. They've just made their judgment of for example, the green new deal based on the political tactical discussion, which means depending on where you are ideologically. You think you know, about you oppose it our favorite? But you can't tell anybody. What's in it? Taxing the rich is another one that I think comes up on those surveys with most people tend to embrace, but is just sort of written off like you can't actually talk about that. 'cause then that's class warfare than at the tactical analysis. Right. Not just the the the move is to what is the disadvantage of ever saying that you favour this politically as opposed to asking what are the problems that one needs to address with revenue, and how are the available means of getting revenue because you could also cut spending. Although we are loath to do that you also increase taxes. Would we which we are also loath to do? But you could have a completely different discussion. If you center this not in whether or not was going to raise taxes or lower taxes, but what is going to be accomplished by doing that? I what's the economic theory behind the increase or decrease in taxation because there is one when was increased or decreased in the past. What do we know about the actual outcome? That is what? Happened to the economy because they're theories they're that are proven or disproven by our history. And then what are you going to give up if you take the revenue out of the revenue stream by gauging tax cut? What are you going to get if you increase taxes now all of that would be a substantive discussion about the desirability of doing X Reva than y or doing X at all? Instead, we simply say raising taxes will you can't win saying you're going to do that. And as a result. That's not tactically useful for anybody to promise. Now, you've got sound bites back and forth about it. And we've never helped the public to understand why there might be something we could need revenue four. But there might be alternative ways to get the revenue are they desirable such as cutting spending. And speaking of pulling back I actually wanna to pull back a little bit to nineteen ninety three. Did this seem like a new phenomenon at the time is that why you were interested in writing a book about it because you know, you've spoken of the Halcion eighties. As a time when there is some more substance coverage and also even in the sixties. So in nineteen Ninety-three were you looking at this and thinking, oh, no, we better this. This is something we need to alert people to we were seeing an increase in the amount of tactical coverage as we move through the nineteen eighties. So we began to see a rise of it in eighty four by eight. There was a lot more of it. Remember epidemic Sorolla slow by the time. We figure something's happened. It's probably been around for pretty long period of time. So it wasn't simply that Ninety-two was raising the issue because we were seeing it there. But that we were seeing it as a pattern of coverage that had differed from what we've seen in the past. And we're testing in the book the book is actually an appearance book. It's not simply in historical book, we were testing the hypothesis that I actually advanced in an earlier book called Jerry politics, which was about the eighty eight campaign that when you engage in tactical framing tactical coverage structure that you are likely to be. Activating cynicism. A depressing learning. It was I pod uscis. We didn't have pourquoi evidence for until we put in place the experiments that are reported spiral of cynicism. And in that case, we tested the effect of actually taking real coverage of a mayoral election was the Philadelphia mayoral election. And having the reporters who had done the tactical coverage both in broadcast and print that race was overwhelmingly tactical in coverage had them rewrite and redo their stories to be problems solution took the tactics out. And instead, talk and included in the same stories. What was there in terms of the substance, and it was out of that test done across the nation in what are called controlled field experiments, very tight way of knowing that when people who nothing about our mayoral race. Watch the tactical coverage there cynicism was activated. Their they're learning was depressed. And they projected that the candidate who won would not keep his promises. He had just been pandering people. Who are in the solution structure problem solution didn't project that at all? They're at their cynicism was not activated their learning was higher. And when they saw a debate among the candidates after they've been exposed to this tactical coverage over a week long period. They were more likely to see that the candidate was offering solutions that the candidate would implement and some people have said to dwell we were putting the process together. Well, but since candidates don't keep their promises. Of course, the cynics were being realistic will know, they weren't the mayor who was elected was Ed Rendell. He kept his promises and was considered a very successful mayor. So because we were testing a real election. But after the fact we were able to say, no, the inference he was keep his promises was wrong. Robin Hood is an investing app that lets you buy and sell stocks E T Fs options cryptos all commission free. 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I've been doing some reading about cynicism in general and one of the interesting through lines through a lot of research. Is that people assume the negative take is right? That's like, our it's it's negativity bias, right? So as soon as you introduce cynicism that's going to be people's preference moving forward. Like, it's also even before you've introduced it. We have negativity bias, so we're more likely to grab hold of the negative information. That is out there. That's why attack ads producer more effective than advocacy at. We're more likely to remember it quickly. It's more likely to be able to anchor our attitudes as more quickly recalled so that human disposition, which is probably there. Because if you're wary about negative information, if you're aware of it, you're more likely to be vigilant near environment about things that are a threat. So you're probably more likely to live long enough to procreate. Hence, our ancestors had a negativity bias. Into that, you drop the coverage structure with that human bias already sitting there, and you activate it. It gives it has a priority. It doesn't otherwise have. Because we have a second priority is humans. We pay attention to things that are sailing to us. So if you if you tell me, what issues matter to you and then separately, I pull up coverage. Either has that issue in it that matters to you or has a different issue. I can predict the issues that you told me weeks ago matter to you are more likely if I just spread it all out on the table to be the ones that you pick up. That's a salience bias, and it matters. Because obviously things that are sailing to your things you care about. So in elections, they should matter. Well that buys should be sitting there too. So when you hear about a problem at a solution that are relevant to you that should have attentional value as well. And so it's not simply that the cynical structure has attention value. It does. But so does the alternative structure if? Journalists could find a way to tap into things we care about and we should care about clean water clean air, having bridges that don't fall down having nuclear power plants that are safe. You know, having a Connie that provides all things we things we reasonably should care about articles that tap into that should be able to successfully compete in the marketplace as they tell us how the candidates are going to try to deliver in those areas and what the alternatives are. And that's what we found with our problem solution structure. We didn't have any trouble getting people to read or pay attention to it. You just had to structure the story. So that people saw the relevance. So what happened? Just kept happening. Right. So why can you do you have any theories as to why the spiral just kept going down? Like if it's not actually that it. It's what the audience demands. Like if the audience who I think a lot of journalists will tell you. Oh, we'll policy stuff is boring. People want to read about you know, personalities and tactics. That's like more exciting right part of the thing, we've managed to do across time is we've managed to teach the electorate that these are the things that are important, and we haven't managed to teach the electorate by putting forward kinds of journalism that will involve them in the problem solution structure have managed to teach that that's what they should be looking for and giving them the satisfaction of having consumed it, so they're so little of it. We haven't any practice in getting used to it or finding out that we like it. And when people say, well, we do the great big takeout stories people don't pay attention. If they're talking about really fine pieces of extended journalism, what we need to find is shorter form journalism that sets up problems and solutions on a routine basis. So that you don't have to invest your entire morning in reading the big long. Elliot journalistic piece and the journal pieces, by the way are wonderful journalists. The question is can we start the public out with a digest that has the elements, and then tease the public into more extended encounters with the deeper form of journalism. And I think the answer is we have a whole group journalists right now who are so pressured that they don't have time to think about how they translate campaigns into the problem solution structure on a routine basis, and if we could take this huge amount of talent that is out there and increase the likelihood that we got some of those shorter form stories that did it across time. We could develop the same kind of attitude that we aptitude for it and the attitude toward it that we have toward making folks at a campaign consultants and having the feedback consulting tips instead of inciteful reasons for voting when we talk to them about citizenship. I've often observed on the show that I think. A universal basic income one of the ways that it would help democracy is that it might allow more people to pursue journalism and pursue journalism out of passion, rather than like just needing to get a paycheck unions might help to journalism unions as well because I do think that there is a labor issue here. Right. Just what can you turn out? How fast can you turn it out? How many people will click on it it? That's the structure that we've now created for journalists to to do their work in in that doesn't doesn't easily translate to the kind of thing you're talking about. I mean, I think it could. But doesn't doesn't really doesn't seem to be happening? We also are sending environment right now in which the old journalism models are failing and the commercial pressures to find a new model are very real and innovating in that environment to try to move to a more substantive structure is risk risk-taking. But you are actually seeing journalists do it. So if you take a look at the kinds of things now that you're able to read an access, for example, that's the kind of short form journalism that overtime can teach people about what a problem solution structure looks like and why it matters. And I love the idea that you're giving a little note that says there are two hundred and fifty three more words, do you want to read them or not because it essentially says, and it's using the digital capacity. I get to make a choice. I get to choose to read more in more depth and the stories are being structured so that I can either take the shorter form. And it's what I need to know is there or I can learn even more consistent with that structure. That's. How alternately you create the appetite for that way of knowing that way of learning. So you're seeing innovation. You're also seeing blood forms that are specializing in trying to make things graphically real to us the masterful graphic which telegraphs something that's really important in very very digestive form and potentially. Also, an interactive for them is another way of breaking through the traditional story structure to telegraph the importance of problem, it's nature particularly across time and the place of interactive graphics. So you're starting to see innovative journalism try to develop an appetite for this alternative. And the question is can't get take hold. Can it become profitable? Very talented. People are making the bet that the answer is. Yes, I hope they're right of all the things I expected to hear you say today praise of axios is not one of them. Why not because I see them as the practitioners of one of the most cynical forms of political analysis. Really tell me the be smart analysis. Oh, I love these more. Oh my God. Currently I wanted. I wanted us to agree on everything. With the reason I love it is because it's an invitation for you to say, this is the voice of these people telling me, something that matters. Now, does it matter. If what you're asking is it is it a smart thing to know. So I like that way of framing people looking at something, but they're actual political coverage when they use the beast mart framework is all tactics. I know so, but it's it's separate from the rest of the story. So if you would are you getting to that point the the traditional journalists structure would make the whole narrative that now it's sitting on the back end. And if I want to indulge, my political junkie part of my identity, I can take it there and say, okay, this is their view of that being smart fun. Now, I have that conversational tidbit if I actually wanted, but I haven't lost what they've laid up before that which on average is more likely to be laying up an issue with some. Depth, then in many other places and doing it in a relatively short form. I'm I'm telling myself that I just haven't read a lot of accesses like issue coverage that is that is missing thing here that I only read their political coverage in their political coverage is is really I promise it is pretty tactical in nature like the infamously Jonathan Swanson out a tweet telephone how he was excited to share the fact that Trump was going to be with considering revoking birthright citizenship like Bhagat a lot of pushback on that because he made getting that piece of news. The thing that we he was paying attention to that we should pay attention to rather than ending birthright citizenship as thing even if it could be done. Okay. But they'll look at axios AM April camp big thing. How your care would change under Medicare for all right? Okay. That's a problem with an identifiable solution. And then they talk about brace. Anders. So the I'm not saying, it's the ideal journalistic forum was that and be approved. But rather that in a world in which so much starts with the tactic. And then drops whatever substance into that frame starting with something. That says, oh, here's a proposal. There's a problem being addressed. Here's how the prescription dress. It is for me refreshing K. All right. Okay. Let's let's actually talk a little bit more about what's changed in in. What you think about where we are today? 'cause you've named the know some things that you think are promising but in the scope of history looking back to where you I wrote this book, and then where we are today, and how your book and your thesis still feel so current are there big differences between the media environment of of back then and today in terms of this spiral of cynicism. I mean, I know yes, the media has changed. But. And the the changes in the media of all worked in the direction of tactical coverage. So we didn't have twenty four hour cable talk focused on politics across multiple mass outlets at that point multiple like-minded communities in gauging feeding us, you know, quays, I news content through clear, ideological points of view. So we were writing especially in an environment, which you still had a mass media structure, and we were seeing it being infected by this. Now, what we have is a whole industry that is built around it and in part because it's so inexpensive. So if you wanna put four people on a set, you don't have to actually go out and do any reporting just throw a topic in the air, and let them fight put a couple on each side. Put somebody who's us density neutral in the middle or not and see the extent to which you're gonna get conflict. And now you've got a definition of much cable news. Which on most days. I wouldn't call news. I would just call it cable opinion talk. And if you say, what is it that they are using as the dominant way of seeing its tactics talk. And so that we have more of it now in more places, and we have a second phenomenon when we wrote that book, you weren't a partisan twenty four hours a day in your media world because you couldn't Avella yourself in a partisan media world twenty four hours a day. It just the media structures. Didn't let you do it. Now, we are more likely to be getting cues that we are partisans all day inside our media structures. We pick up our cell phone there. We've got the cues the feed is coming to us. We open our computer there. We've got we turn on cable there. We've got it. We're in meshed a world in which we've got a partisan frame and attacted frame coming at us twenty four seven. And so if the worry is that were too partisan too much of the time we need to think about being citizens of the same country sharing the same goals and trying to. Accomplish the same objects for at least part of our lives. So many cues are telling us, no, you're a partisan and polarized partisan. And you put the tactical frame on top of that. And you make it even less likely that we're going to focus on problems that we share that we need to find a way to address with ideology being away of looking at different ways of addressing it. But nonetheless ways that are substantively important and can be advant can be looked at in terms of their substance not their tactical advantage. You brought up to that. I definitely wanted to get to one of them is the role that partisanship plays, and this and the other is actually something you kind of acted out in talking just there, which is that you said CNN isn't really news. People are now cynical about media. Right. Like, not only are we cynical about the government and about politicians in about, you know, why policies enacted the cynicism has now become pervasive. At I feel like one of the things that's happened. Is that in doing everything through tactical frame, we have trained readers and listeners in watchers to assume that the media has a tactical interest as well. I agree with you it declining trust in media as an institution is deeply problematic because we have protected our media structures constitutionally with the first amendment to ensure that they can hold government accountable. And that's government. Group broadly construed and the assumption in doing that is that there's important information and the -portant accountability function that is carried by these people who wear the the label press as they enter our body politic and you want trust. In them to be high. And you want them to be focusing us on things that matter and the press still has a capacity to set an agenda. So the fact that we have not dealt with. What is usually called infrastructure in awkward, we need to find a way to say bridges roads, water piping, et cetera to make it clear to people that that actually consists of things that matter in their lives. But the fact that we haven't dealt with that even though both Republicans and Democrats agree that there is a need the candidates on both sides twenty sixteen agreed that there was a need people in the Senate and house agrees. There was an eight and we haven't dealt with it. Well, part of that responsibility as those politicians, but part of it is the press not using agenda setting function to remind us of the nature of the problem and to say that it's not simply Flint Michigan. It wasn't simply bridge that collapsed in Minnesota and number of years ago. It is in fact, a pervasive problem across country that affects our economy affects us. So when the press is doing something else. The important thing is something isn't. Getting done that could be getting done with that time. And I'd like more time with the press setting the agenda to say these problems, we need to we need to address and then holding politicians accountable for addressing them when they promise they're going to and they don't they shouldn't get to show up on the on the talk shows and not be asked. Why haven't you delivered on that promise? But I feel like there's a problem here this tactical framing all the way down kind of problem, which is that I wonder if journalists started doing more coverage along lines suggesting issues policies etcetera. We have trained the public. So well to look for tactical advantage would would they not just maybe see that? As like, oh, you're covering that. For this reason. Like, I feel like we've reached a point where I don't know what cynicism is circular firing squad looks like, but. Agree with you. The problem is we school the public into thinking. It's knowledgeable about things that matter when it's now which -able about something that largely doesn't and the process haven't schooled the public in in focusing on things that matter and getting ways of seeing these things that lend themselves to legislation as an arena for solutions and executive action as an arena for solutions. And so the the the big challenge is finding away right now in an environment in which there's not the trust that we once had in media to have that as an institution perform that role again. But if you look at for example, viewership of the news hour, you've got extended substantive exchanges inside the news hour on policy issues. How does the news hour managed to hold those audiences? Now, it's not a big wide national audience, but it's a respectably sized audience. There is some appetite for. For this. And there are ways to do it. Well. You also mentioned partisanship, which we cannot in the conversation without talking about that because as much as I agree with the structural criticism of media coverage and how we've kind of shot ourselves in the foot. There has also been a concerted effort by some members of society to encourage people to distrust government into encourage people to distrust, the media, the conservative movement has was that's one of its basic tenants. How much of a role? Do you think that plays? It clearly plays a role. At some distrust is good. I mean, you you don't want players who are powerful to be uncritically trusted. The question is when have we crossed the line from having a healthy skepticism to being cynical, and as a result, not able to see substance when substances there and not be able to act on it. But is that a problem? Yes. It is and looking to alternative ways of constructing audiences rather than working simply within the existing structures is I think part of the ways way we're going to find a way back out and blogs are among among this podcast among this menu in their their alternative media venues now that are emerging that do deal with policy issues with audiences that care about them can one that expand their reach out becomes an important question. And how can one on issues that do matter increase the likelihood that they are presented inside the structures about which people are cynical? In a way that decreases the likelihood that they are seeing cynically, I'm a big believer in finding ways in which narratives that are Representative can be used as a news vehicle to get us to see big picture and one of the problems with the Flint Michigan narrative is that news did not successfully situated into the broader problem of securing access to water that is as drinkable in a healthy fashion on a reliable basis across all of our systems, including those in cities that was infrastructure was built more than one hundred years ago. So they did a good job covering the instance, they did not do a good job generalizing to get to see that. It's a wider scale problem not of a scope of Flint, but none the less within the domain of a concern of Flint elsewhere. And as a result, something that governments at some level need to be addressing thank you so much. I really appreciate you spending some time with me, it's a pleasure to be with you. So article sponsors the show. 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I've just the wedding season is coming up birthdays and special events. Go to framers dot com. Aid from could friends to save an additional fifteen percent off your first order again, that's frame bridge dot com, promo code fronts. Jay Rosen is a journalism professor at New York University and the author of press think dot org, or he writes about the American press, and it's ordeals welcome to the show. Jay, thank you so much. So I'm excited to talk to you. I've been reading press thank for a long time. And you have made quite a name for yourself as a media critic. I would guess most of my colleagues. No and are often annoyed by you. But I feel like the thing that you've talked about that's been the most salient for me, the thing they've talked about the has been the most helpful for me in terms of thinking about the relationship between the media, and politics, and the media and its readers watchers, yours is the idea of the cult of the savvy. Can you explain that for people? Well, this began when I realized I didn't agree with anyone on the question of media bias. I I didn't agree with the right that the that the performance of the news media was overwhelmingly tilted towards liberals. I didn't agree with the left that the corporate media didn't allow for any real freedom of the press, and I didn't agree with journalists that they were nonpartisan creatures who just told you the way it was and. And because I felt as I observed political journalism that there was definitely a point of view there and a and a kind of a slant, but it didn't necessarily map onto left right politics. And so I developed this critique of the savvy style and political journalism, which I think is the dominant style and to me it represents a kind of a a wrong turn in in journalism taken some vague point in the nineteen seventies or eighties, and the savvy style is very familiar to people who consume a lot of political news. It's about winners and losers. It focuses on strategy and tactics. It myers. What is smart and ruthless? And most of it it Myers people who are winners and a lot of it is about. Winning. What is a winning move? What is the winning appeal? What's a clever way of marketing, your ideas? And I felt that when you see political pundits and political journalist taking apart a recent development, mostly what they're doing is performing their savviness and not only is this a ubiquitous style. But there's something extremely insidious about it. So perhaps we can talk about that too. We spent some time talking to Kathleen hall Jamieson about be spiral of cynicism. And to me, the cult of the savvy is a more kind of textured may be more critical description of what she calls tactical framing. Because so tactical framing I feel like she sort of talks about in other. She has opinions about she talks about it sort of like a value neutral way almost like it's it's when you talk about strategy right now. And I think the cult of the savvy adds another layer to that description. Well, right. Yes, I feel it does and it's related to cynicism. Because for me cynicism is is a deep-seated feeling that what's true doesn't really matter and in the savvy style, what's true doesn't matter. What's just doesn't matter? What's right? Doesn't matter. What's what's a fact of and winning is what really counts, and what's insidious about to me is that it kind of severs the journalists solidarity with citizens in this sense. The people that we're. Envited to identify with in a savvy analysis are the professionals in politics whose job is to win elections or advise candidates or read the polls and figure out what works, and I felt that the the savvy style is a natural result of the the fact that political journalists like to hang with, and they learn how to think like the professionals in politics whose job is to manipulate the electorate and win elections. And when you're done with people like that, you begin to look at the world through their eyes and even more consequentially, you Cheech the audience to look at the world through the eyes of the political professionals rather than feeling like a citizen voter yourself. And to me, that's the most insidious thing about the savvy style, and I feel like this. Differs a little bit from just talking about tactical framing because you're positing and for what it's worth agree with you that not only are people doing tactical framing, but they're putting a value on winning like, there's a sort of active bias towards portraying the winner sympathetically towards portraying winning as being like the thing that matters Wayne admiring winners, you know, like and you're right. Like, the not bias also gets transmitted to consumers of the news. As why like for instance, we can we talk about two thousand sixteen probably for hours and hours and hours. But you definitely see there. Right. Like, I think because because it's almost like the pre existing condition of the cult of the savvy was fertile ground for Trump. Right. Yeah. Because yeah. I mean this all of this help to prepare. The ground for Trump in part because journalists I think lost the sense that they have something they have to defend, and they're recovering it somewhat since Trump's election. But when you're when you see your job as just analyzing spin figuring out who's winning describing what a winning strategy is criticizing those who who aren't savvy enough to win. It's almost like you are inside a game. And that's another term that I have for the sensibility at the game schema and closely related to like ESPN's college football Saturday where there is an an analysis of each game and who's likely to win and what the Alabama has to do to. Feet crimson. And there are a lot of links between sports and contests like that which are essentially meaningless to our future and politics discussed that same way, and it's more than just a focus on tactics. It's it's it's a whole world unto itself, and it is the the mail you of the political journalist, but they've also taught audiences how to be savvy and lots of people who are not journalists take the same kind of attitude towards politics now. Well, it's the federalization of winning right? Like, it's not just like looking for the winter. But again, putting value in that. And I feel like when I look back at two thousand sixteen what I saw was journalists admiring Trump's savvy like even when they criticized him, even when they talked about the awful things he said, and did it was sort of in the context of. But look at how look at how he's playing this. Right. Right. And then. Hillary Clinton on the other hand, her her tactics were always kind of discussed discussed as like, oh, she doesn't do this very well. Right. She's trying so hard. She doesn't actually do it. Very well, but she's not a mass. The way reporters are right. Another thing. That's going on here is. I don't think journalists are totally aware of this part. And this is one of the reasons why I'm knowing to them because I try to point out things that they're not necessarily thinking about don't don't see as important, but another another reason for this style is that I think journalists are always trying to separate themselves from closely related, but different actors and interpreters and politics. And so they they have to for example, separate themselves from political activists on all sides and also from academics who sometimes overlap with their territory, and one of the ways that they separate themselves from activists people with a declared ideology is by saying, well, you know, that's very nice. What you believe? And maybe you're right in the in the abstract, but it's just isn't smart politics. It's not a winning strategy. And this is. How they try to build their authority as experts in politics without having explicit political commitments on the one hand like activists do or without having sophisticated bodies of knowledge in years and years of study the way a political scientist or a sociologist political systems might have. And this is where the college football metaphor really breaks down for me. Like, I'm a huge college football fan, by the way, real big difference. Here is that in college football. You have a very specific number of people that are actually on the field. Right. Right. They are. We know who they are. They have numbers of names. Yeah. Yeah. And also there's a real winner lose right about like. Well, he won the morning like Alabama won the morning rain. No. There's a game has rules. And either winner you lose. And also, we the commenters are commenters are situated as and they're not on the field. Right. And and so it's terrible. What's happened? Here is that like to try to make the metaphor work a little bit. But the thing is in society were all on the field. Right. That's right. There is no off the field and journalists keep pretending that there is and another point along the same lines as. When the game is over the next day. The world is pretty much the same. Yes. And in Bala ticks, it may not be at All People's lives are at stake. There are there are wars fought there. Are there are crashes there are there are social problems that go on dressed, and it's it's not a game. But it can be treated like a game and then to to develop one of your other points, which which is very sound about who's on the field. One of the problems with journalists standing back and taking a savvy outlook towards the winners and losers that very often they are creating the conditions of politics. So recently, we we had this very strange dynamic where journalists are remarking on how the narrative of the bar letter has already been formed without acknowledging that they are themselves the ones who formed it, right? And that's another problem with the savvy style is that in a way the actions that journalists take lose. As their name in and lose their owners in this style of analysis. Is this weird way that whenever journalists talk about who on the morning or like how a narrative is playing out. It's actually to skip two different sport. It's an own goal, right? You're admitting. We got played if you talk about who on the narrative like you're saying like and we played exactly into their hands. Exactly. What's the while? You'll get a strange sentence that that comments on this phenomenon when they'll say like are we going to be talking about this tomorrow? Something like that. In which they're trying to reflect on the fact that what they're talking about is itself proof of political strategies wisdom or something and they get caught in like a Moebius strip or like a loop where they're trying to reflect on actions of their own that they control as if they're naturally occurring events. 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To have to do. This is get people to charge less for women's products makes sense. I mean, we get paid less. Right. So what can we do about? This part of me would like you do the radical thing of just refusing to pay it like at the store, but you'll probably get in trouble. So instead European wax center is giving tools to do something about the pink tax. They are known for impounding confident women in their tools available online at acts the pink tax dot com. It will give you things to do and people to write to help make this less of an everyday headache for all of us safer self at acts the pink tax dot com. To use another family of metaphors. I wonder did you happen to see political playbook game of thrones playbook, the west roasts playboy? Sorry now. So for those that don't follow either. Although I if you're not watching game of thrones. I mean, who are you so Politico's playbook is the one of the best examples in the field of savviness, right? It's the name book playbook right is the defining article in a lot of ways if you want to know what the cult of the savvy looks like you look at Politico's playbook. So what they did. To celebrate the final season of game of thrones. Is they did a west roasts playbook? It was like, you know, what sir she last are doing and like who's going to be the, you know, who is the Knight king and like watch out for Tyrian. You never know what he's gonna do and like a half funny. But I found it in fury aiding because because for me what it did it wasn't like haha look at how easily we can apply the tropes of clinical journalism to a piece of entertainment. It was admitting. Look how we've all along than applying the tropes of literary criticism or film criticism to politics. That's right. And I think a big reason for this is. That our political. Journalists are pledged to a kind of nonpartisan style of discourse about politics, and they have to constantly assure us and themselves that they are not on this team. And they are not on that team. And this isn't something that they can say once or twice it has to be continuously demonstrated in the way that they conduct themselves and part of the attraction of the savvy style is that it sounds and feels like it is neither nor who's going to win is not an ideological question. And so when you ask it you are advertising how on ideological you are and the same is true for a what's a smart tactic. And what's a sound strategy? And what are the poll say all? These questions are by their nature, non ideological, and that is why they appeal to political journalist so much. And they are about style. Right. And they're about like what narrative appeals to us. Which is why it totally makes sense to apply it to game of thrones the natural place for it is to apply to a piece of art. You know, that's an invented world that we're not a part of again, we're not the players on the field. That's also there is no health care crisis in west coast. Right. Like there there's not whether is, but you know, it's because winter is coming in if the infrastructure in as far as an infrastructure crisis was there's one big infrastructure crisis, which is the wall. But so the author has created the three limited world, we had these specific problems for the people in charge to address, right? That's right. We don't have to think about like, the serfs and the pets. I'm sorry to I'm sorry to go off on this. But like it just infuriates me. It's a world without consequences. Whereas, and it's fun. It's supposed to be. It's supposed to be the thing. We care about who wins and the good guy in the bad guy. And it's completely inadequate for time about politics. And but I I you sort of alluded this in sort of get back to good guys and bad guys and players in on the field because Trump has somewhat disrupted that race. Like Trump has forcibly pulled or tried to pull some of those players onto the field or made them realize they're on the field. I think so I think I think in many ways the three years so far of Trump have been kind of like a crisis for the savvy style in a variety of ways one is the sheer volume of lying which has forced journalists to not only describe lies lies or simply say president said this ended is untrue which happens pretty much every day. Now. But they've they've realized that if he can get away with these this volume of line it kind of makes what they do irrelevant. So they're they're dimly grasping that that they have to almost make a stand in some ways against this. The other thing that's happening is that he's attacking not just the press as enemies of the people, which we hear about all the time he's attacking and trying to undermine trust in all the democratic institutions. And I think journalists DM Lee aware that what they do won't matter. If if all elections are rigged, if there is no real Justice system. If everybody in the intelligence community is corrupt if everything special prosecutor says is really ally. If the if the entire world is fake. And phony and rigged, and and and false than a why would you pay any attention to the news? I think these kinds of connections are starting to be made. And I think even though they don't say this way. Journalists kind of realized there in the fight of their lives. Which is why I was so fascinated by this sentence from Marty baron, which I've written about several times, we're not at war where at work. In some ways that true, I understand the popularity of that idea that we're not gonna let him throw us off our game. And we can't react everything. He does. And we're not going to be positioned as the political opponents that Trump all that I understand and I agree with. But in some ways, they are at war. And I think they know that. Yeah. I don't I don't know. Sometimes I wonder because. Like, I said this shows loosely organized around the idea of cynicism. This particular episode. I should say maybe the whole show is I don't know. And I had been thinking of the cult of the savvy as as a kind of cynicism. But I wonder actually if the practitioners of it the worshippers at the cult of savvy aren't actually kind of naive. Yeah. There's a deep connection between sort of surface cynicism. And I ve attain you can have both to -ssume that things are going to be. Okay. Actually, exactly. Yeah. That that's what it is. It's like you can you can practice the savvy style. As long as you're confident that we'll still have our democratic institutions. You know, will you'll still have a job when the election is over if the reds are in this time, then the blues habit next time and the system works, and it's relatively stable. And so we can we can analyze the game. Because we kind of know were always going to be. Okay. Well, what if we don't know that then the savvy style starts to look like an obscenity not just an affect tation? And I feel like I see that obscenity happening. I mean. In. Maybe it's because they can't even cover the war on democratic institutions without it being a savvy take. Yeah. Like, they they talk about Trump's war on the press as a tactic, right? This is what is base wants to hear. Right. It's for him. So far things like that. Yeah. Yeah. So it means like do you really understand the urgency here if you're still critiquing the bullet as it comes towards us. You know, like. Where where do you? How can we communicate? Like, this isn't just a style. This isn't like attack. This is okay. Sure. It is a tactic. I guess. Yes. His his base does wanna see that. But it also means like we have this incredible increase in violence. Right. Like. Yup. I feel melodramatic saying this in perhaps that's because still have some savviness left to me. But like the only time I have felt frightened for my personal safety as a working journalist has been at Trump rallies. Yeah. Yeah. I never expected to feel that as a journalist working covering US politics. Totally. And where you really see this come to the surface is when savvy journalists like the most recent one was John Harrison politico, tell us about the actual relationships between Trump and reporters, and they they they report on this with a kind of note of irony seeking to inform us that what looks true isn't the actual situation. So it looks like Trump is attacking the press all the time. And that he guards journalists as his adversaries and his hatred for them is projected at them and whips up his his. His supporters, but the savage analysts say, actually, he loves journalists. And he's he's obsessed with his image in the press. And then Harris went one step further and said, and he calls them all the time. And he's always on the phone with them. And he wants to know what they think and the actually have this friendly intimate relationship with him. And and wow, high isn't that funny? He's attacking us. But really he loves us. I almost puked when I'm at them. Not that I'm saying this on true. But that it's delivered in this kind of tone of well, it looks this way. But let me tell you the inside secrets actually he's on the phone with us all the time. Also, a really good dramatization of something that we talk about on the sugar once which is the knife Hayes actually privilege, right because he's talking about privilege, a very specific kind of privileges that I know that president, but in general journalists who who are able to treat this as though everything is going to be okay. Said this with Kathleen, they're probably white probably men, they're probably straight probably Christian, or at least come from a from a sort of centered, you know, community educated. And yeah, and they don't have any. They don't have any sense of precariousness. They've never felt a precarious moment in their lives. I think that's true. I think that's why the game metaphor in that atmosphere of a game. Is so offensive to so many people. Yeah. It is. It is a -fensive. I'm thinking about something else. I'm annoyed by which is maybe it's just the flip side of the knife Tae, which is that I hate democracy dies in darkness as a slogan so much alike. Because I feel like it's a performance thing. Like, it's melodramatic is melodramatic sort of. But also like it's it's situating like the Washington Post. Good paper. Let's put that out description. I love it friends who work there, but is positioning it as like as the post is the defender democracy as journalists are the defender democracy. And they're not. I mean, they're part of it. Yeah. It's an us. Not a you like we're all defenders of democracy. We have the potential to be right. Yeah. That's a very good point. And that's what I meant by the that that the savvy wears away at at any sort of solidarity. Because what what that style is really doing is. It's it's taking the the highly attentive public, and separating it from the the rest of the the people out there, and then tutoring that small portion of the electorate in the ways of the political professionals and getting them to admire those who are the best at the game. And when you do that, you are are Savary in these bonds that connect citizen to citizen and that include the journalist in the political community. And I think I think that's what you're saying. Is that they sort of lost that a connection? This is why the the savvy style is so frequently said to appeal to political junkies that phrase political junkies tells us a lot, right? That's that. Chris Eliza, for example, called his blog the fix. Why was it the because it's for the junkies who need it, right and the political junkies. Other people who who pay sort of excessive attention to politics who follow it as a game who know all the players and who loved this sort of inside. And now says, but what is that? That's five percent. Of the electorate, and and we have ninety five percent of political journalism is pitched at five percent of the electorate and as someone in recovery. Kind of almost wanted quibble with using the metaphor of addiction here too. You know, like, well, he did call it the fix. I know. I know it's not you. It's just like I have a lot of loved ones who've been affected by the opioid epidemic in the thing is what I want to say. Like what I almost want to say is that you recover from that. Right. Like in also like that is Munis not like it's human failing. But it's like acknowledged like we don't want to have a dictionary two things. Right. Like, that's thing. Yeah. Right. Autonomy that way, exactly. It's not a bad. Just make you bad person firmly believe that, but we seek to evolve to our higher self without the aid of addictions, right addictions. Keep us from experiencing the world totally a screen that we we don't have to deal with the world because we have the screen. Yeah. Yeah. New there is a reason. I really didn't like Chris Eliza. I mean, there's many reasons, but I hadn't really connected the drug metaphor. Well, the very common reaction to solicit shows that people do see through the savvy style. They do. Although I feel like that's a five percent of the five percent. Maybe you know. People who probably everyone listening to this podcast hates Chris, cillizza? But that's because we're we're sub setting out like a very particular audience, and he is popular that that is why he is on the air. He he does draw viewers, and he draws numbers CNN in the I'm sure he did at the Washington Post as well. Yeah. It's like, it's a cliche. You know, a joke to the point of cliche other political journalists and other like savvy people don't like Christmas criticism. But yeah, he's the one point down six figures. Right. Like, he he saw a lot of people must like it. And Amy this gets us to a place where we can start to to look to the future or in for alternatives alternatives. What what are what is there like what what is a good citizen to-do? Well, I have an alternative for the way elections covered that I that I wanna mention because it very much opposes this this style. And I have been talking about it for years of talking about it since I realized that twenty twenty coverage was probably going to be as bad as twenty sixteen and it's called the citizens agenda style in election coverage. So here's how it works. I you have to identify the the community are part of the public that you're trying to inform in your election coverage. The second thing you do is you go out and ask those people. What do you want the candidates to be discussing as they compete for boats? That's the key question. What do you want the candidates to be discussing as they compete for builds? And if you can ask that question enough enough ways to enough people not just relying on the first answers, but going on and and making sure that you've you've heard people in in that you're right in developing the authoritative answers to that question, then you can synthesize from their answers, a kind of Genda, which is simply a priority list of what people want to candidates to be discussing. Then you take that list, and that becomes the template for your election coverage and the mission of your election coverage is to get the candidates to address the issues on the citizens agenda. And it also provides a way for the press. No. If it's doing a good job if it's winning because if you can get and the Thawra Tatum answer to what he wanted candidates discussing they compete for votes. And you're right, then those things are gonna start show up in the candidates polling as well. And they're gonna have to start addressing them. And this method citizens agenda method is not new it was tried in the nineteen nineties in Charlotte, North Carolina. It's it's it's a known thing. It was it was kind of lost to press a practice in. I think because the kinds of people who cover elections preferred the savvy style didn't want to do it this way. But it it's a it is definitely an alternative. And I think someone should try it in twenty twenty. And if I had my way someone will. That's very much like the. Kind of coverage that Kathleen is suggesting very much centered on what do people want and also what are the real problems? Yeah. Can find out what the real problems are like that's actually something that we can do. We have the tools, right? Definitely. We can find out if there is an opioid crisis. We can find out there's a healthcare prices in general. Yeah. And then we can find out emit can tell people to care about this. Maybe you should care about this. Try candidates to talk about the things that you know, people care about it kind of happened a little bit half of it happened in twenty eight teen where people in the field found that the biggest issue on the minds of voters in two thousand eighteen was healthcare. Not trump. And they learned it by talking to voters, and I'm just saying that a little bit more systematic use of that insight could provide a different template because you can't defeat the focus on winning. You can't defeat that the hidden or let's say implicit agenda of the savvy style without having a better agenda to replace it with and that's what the citizens Jenna style or coaches about. You started out our conversation in talking about the cult of the savvy by saying, you didn't agree with either the left or the rights criticism of media bias. And I I'm with you on that. But I also feel like there's an ideological piece to how this played out in our culture, which is that the right? I think successfully convinced a lot of journalists that they need to be overly, you know. You know, this that side. There is a concerted effort. There was like a specific agenda. Yes. To to do that. Right. Yes. And this working still working where do you see it? I'm curious in your experience. Like, I'm thinking of just like how happened like, you know, I I started covering politics underbush in there. It was kind of a soft power thing. Right. It was just like drinks and dinners and reminding people that like, you know, you need to can't listen, you know, to to everything that the liberal say like gotta listen to us too. We're we're we're the other side here. Like literally like playing it like that. But that can't. But that's not it is it. Well, that only goes so far, I think several things are going on here. One is Eric ultimate really coined a very useful phrase for this which was working the refs. Yes. And but yes, well, the working posits that the journalists are sort of like the the rest of the the cops in the in the in the political dialogue, right? And and you work the rafts like a basketball coach, you complain to the officials that you're not getting the calls, and you're just trying to introduce a note of doubt in their minds. That's the that's the strategy of working the Rams and that has been successful. No doubt about it. But underneath that. There's something even d. For going on which is. Republican party has used media bias and the idea of elites in the media distorting the picture of politics that most Americans get since at least nineteen sixty four and berry gold waters nomination. But that way of doing politics in which you positive existence of a corrupt elite that is preventing the real people from getting their voice heard has has grown from sort of like, a tone or style in Republican party's politics to the heart of Republican politics to the heart and the soul of and as that has grown the attack on journalists as biased has become centr. To how the Republican party does politics now. And in a way, it's sort of detached itself from press performance, and is is simply a pillar of the Republican approach and with Trump, he supercharge that are weaponized that even more. And so by this is no longer even a statement really about political journalism. It's it's central to the political appeal that Republican party makes to its voters. It is it is essential to keeping the Republican coalition together. And so even if the if the press completely overhauled, its performance, and and and somehow like hired fifty percent conservatives, and and transformed itself into like a across between, Fox News and MSNBC or something it wouldn't change because media maya's is now a structural feature of what the democrat Republican party is. I feel like in a weird way. Journalists were receptive. To the message of you're not really representing America. They were they're definitely they still are there. Still this weird. Willingness to hear from conservative person in have had the accusation be like, you don't really know real America in it in it, actually sort of gets into what is often an insecurity. I think among these like good white liberal straight men. Are who are who ideologically probably are aware of the fact that they're white men, right? And also aware of their wealth. And it's like an insecurity of like, you're right. I don't really know the rest of the country. Yes. Yeah. I guess I I've detected that I don't know exactly how to describe it. But it some sort of anxiety about being out of touch or an anxiety about being. Lucky or fortunate or something, but they are definitely susceptible to that message. And the other thing I was thinking about as far as positing this corrupted lead and having it be foundational. Pillar of belief for the conservative movement is that. I was reading about psychological. Studies of cynicism and one of the interesting things about it. Is that cynicism is appealing to people who don't know very much. There it it finds a much more fertile ground and people who are who are ignorant of actual facts. Right. Like it. And I think that's because it's sort of like this visionary thing. Right. Which is that when we don't know we should assume negative that keeps us from getting eaten by the sabertooth. Tiger. Right. We know the tiger is there, which is soon the Tigris there. But it also makes us feel smart. Yeah. Because it works for all situations. It's telling like the base Republican voter, you're smarter. Like, you don't really need to understand everything that's happening there. We're letting you in we're telling you corrupt, and that's an that puts you one up on everybody else. Yeah. And this is worked his way into cynical descriptions in the conservative movement about about what journalists are it's routine within the conservative movement now to describe journalists as democrat operatives with bylines. Or party strategists with press cards where the attempt is to completely erase any distinction between journalists and a political opponents and that is now routine among the conservative movement into a raise the need to find out. You don't need to know anything about them, you know, need to look at their performance. You don't need to read their work. You know, by definition, they are political opponents. Yeah. And aren't you smart for realizing that you're, you know, you're you're in your? Yeah. It's a weird. It's a cult of the savvy. It's an ideological cult of the savvy, right? As kind of abbey thing for conservatives. Yeah. Like, the real the really smart people know that these people are journalists at all their party operatives with the press cards. Yeah. The really smart people. No, you can't trust anybody. Yeah. But if you don't trust anybody don't find anything out, so. Me mining tearing my hair out. It's frustrating. It's frustrating depressing. It is and that brings me to my final question for you. Are you cynical? Well, I'm getting more and more cynical. Yes. And I this is something I struggle with every day, and I've been struggling with it a lot lately because I feel in so many ways that we can discover and work hard to try and bring to other people. What's true? But increasingly it feels like it doesn't matter and in a democracy. This feeling of what's true doesn't matter. I think is closely related to another fact about our times, which is there's almost no accountability in our system. There wasn't accountability. For what happened in the run-up today, rack war? There's been almost no accountability for the financial crisis. So many actors in the Trump regime are getting away with stuff with no accountability. And the more you see that the harder it is to to believe in reading the news and discussing what is found and and trying to figure out who's responsible. So cynicism is something that I I struggle with lately, I feel I'm kind of losing the struggle. What does that mean for you? It means for the first time in my career. I'm measuring the years until my retirement. Well, that's not so bad compared to the the predicament. Others have no, it's right. And I'm also thinking like I get I mean, I honestly. Gipp scared about kind of distortion nightmare, which is is happening now, it's just a unequally distributed. Right. Like, we're already in a dystopia nightmare is just not everyone is experiencing it. That's right. It's evenly distributed. Yeah. I I worry. I I'll I grew up. It took me a long time to understand like it took me until nineteen Ninety-one for me to realize I live my whole life in the shadow of the Cold War about the Cold War. But the fact that it lifted showed me that I sort of like normalized that. Now, I'm realizing I lived my whole life, assuming that American democracy would just go on. And I don't assume that. See that's what we're being cynical means for me is that I also feel like I assumed for a long time. We don't even think about the assumption. That's what hits. You know, like my country's basically good like there's some flaws, but we keep trucking along the tuitions are solid they endure. Right. Who believes that? Now. I don't. Yeah. And I will say, you know, I speak for myself, maybe free, which is relatively privileged upbringing. So I that naive belief. You know is factor of that. Yeah. But I've feel like one of I've said this before and other context, which is that that can be gift to have that naievety ripped away. Right. It is a gift to realize that your circumstances and your institutions are fragile. Yeah. Because then you take more responsibility for them. So that is a gift. But yes, this this whole conversation is a product of my. Privilege. I'm an educated person who can who's financially. Okay. And I'm going to be okay. And so it's probably taking me longer to see when emergency we are in. But we are in a civic emergency. Thank you again. I'm sure we will speak again. Our I d. And that's it for the show. I was gonna leave the hell show on the beat that Sheahan. I ended on but I decided that was unfair. Because. Well, things are dark. There are reasons to hope. Even though hope is really hard. Cynicism is easy cynicism is seductive. Hope is a muscle, and you can train it working that muscle working to realize the hopeful vision that you have is the hardest thing of all. But that's what I try to do. And I know if you're listening to the show, especially if you listen to this point. You're working too. So let's walk this road together. And remember keep your strength up. Remember to take care of yourselves?

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Alex Jamieson & Bob Gower | How to Have Hard Conversations

Good Life Project

1:15:29 hr | 3 months ago

Alex Jamieson & Bob Gower | How to Have Hard Conversations

"So How do you talk to friends family colleagues and acquaintances about things that matter hard things in a way that leads to each person being seen heard acknowledged and treated with dignity? How do you get a resolution and sidestep the hurt the wounding the rates, the reactivity? How do you have conversations in work and life that lead to genuine understanding and change and leave you feeling respected and at peace even when you still disagree well, that's where we're going in today's conversation with my guess Alex Jamieson and Bob Cower partners in business and life and Co authors of radical alignment how to have game changing conversations that will transform your. Business Life Alex is a bestselling author of five books co-creator Co Star of the Oscar nominated documentary super size me. She's a seriously highly sought after success mentor motivational. I'd for thousands and has pretty much made it her mission to empower women to create epic lives. Bob Is a near base consultant writer speaker. He contributes to INC magazine has lectured at Columbia Nyu the Berlin school worked with leaders at companies like Chanel Erickson for GE and all the way to nonprofits like the Newark Public Radio Studio, Museum and Wigan Media Foundation and they have spent years deconstructing how to have healthy positive conversations. We need these insights right now. Like never before really excited to share this conversation with you I'm Jonathan fields and this is good life project. Good light project is supported by Monday dot Com. Our team is spread across the country and getting everyone on the same page can sometimes be kind of hard which is why I'm really excited to partner with Monday dot com Monday dot COM is an easy to use customizable visual teamwork platform that's designed to manage any team organization or process online. In one centralized place, you can customize it to fit your team's specific workflow super intuitive, and even have these ready to. Go templates for everything from marketing sales and CRM TO HR media production pretty much anything you can imagine with this podcast alone we often have over forty episodes and production at any given time with fifteen to twenty stages just in one part of that. So I am super excited to explore how dot Com can help us streamline and automate our workflow. If you want your team to be more effective than ever visit Monday dot Com for your free two week trial. Streaming on October sixteen only on Disney plus clouds and original movie based on the incredible true story of seventeen year old Zach. Soviet. It's an inspirational and Journey as he follows his dreams with family and friends at his side and leaves behind a musical legacy from the director of five feet apart and starring in August Sabrina Carpenter and Neve Campbell clouds rated pg thirteen may be inappropriate for children under thirteen. Movie Streaming October sixteenth only on Disney plus. I feel like in the last year. I've done a lot of dietary experiments in my life and I've always had like. Trying to gain muscle or lose fat or heal my gut. And I've been I've been gluten free. I've been Kito you know I I've gone through all the and now I I I'm not really anything anymore but I'm very happy with myself and I'm very happy with my diet and I don't know that I would have gotten here without having gone through all of those very definitive three-step processes and all the things that I learned about myself in learned about my my body along the way because Oh yeah. Sort of I understand Kito and now I understand kind of why it doesn't work for me I understand I understand all of these little pieces and so part of the journey maybe. Things that feel definitive for a while try them on. You know it's like there's the form shoe right? Like you. you crawl walk run in martial arts right you work the Kata over and over again like these these regular forms. So you can eventually break free of the forms like jazz musicians play. Scales over and over again. So they can be fully three and and bring free from the form and I think maybe a lot of life is like that. So there is value in creating these forms I, mean. We just wrote a whole book on a four step. Okay but. Let's talk about that actually because what was popping into my head also is I'm much more saying here's a framework for discernment that I found to be really useful in a lot of scenarios that can guide behavior for you to play with. Rather than like this is the one way to do this one thing and I feel that's more what you're talking about. Yeah. That's like dating. You have to date a lot of different people to find your person but then once you find your person, you both change and become different people along the way too. And it's the same diet or frameworks like you have to try a lot of them out, and then eventually you find your version of it or you dance back and forth between different things at work at different times for you. There's a difference between Dogma and approach or patterns or frameworks I think one of the things like writing the book for us you know it's a framework that we've been using. For, close to a decade now. Like we didn't write about it for the longest time because he just felt so simple you know it just was like, oh, it's just too simple into obvious and so why would you bother writing about something that says simple and so obvious and it wasn't until we would be talking to people who are going through something we would offer it to them and they'd be like, wow, that's amazing and it was hard for us i. think it was hard for me to see that something. So simple and so obvious actually could be value but other people but in many ways, that's all that's valuable. Right like me talking to you about what simple and obvious for you like I know like you're such an amazing marketer, an amazing audience builder and and even like an audio technician like I've talked to so many different things over the years and I have the sense. Sometimes at the things you're telling me seem very simple and obvious to you and yet to me they're kind of. They're just not in my realm and they and they really they really have revolutionized the way I've thought about different things. It's interesting. Also, the as we are having this conversation I'm working on my next book about the spark types and was literally just working on the chapter about Advisors where the impulse is. To advise to mentor to Guide and one of the things I learned along the way is that sort of an entry level advisor in the early years it's all about telling people what to do. You know once you graduate into, Ninja level advisors do just shut up. It's all about the powers of awareness and observation and appropriate questions and prompts and frameworks. And you don't give answers anymore. So it's fascinating to kind of see the evolution of like of all of that, and by the way that wasn't just a an. Cutler. That makes me think of my dad actually in a high school principal for twenty five years. I think he is that Ninja level adviser like he doesn't tell any of those four siblings he has four kids. He doesn't tell any of us what to do or how to think or how to be only asks questions, but he would be so perfect for this chapter but it's honestly as a child had like to just tell me what you. Just just tell me your was does is give me the stuff. Yeah I mean that's what we're talking about. We all crave certainty and just want the answers but you know along with that comes dependence, which at the end is a disservice. As thinking about Dolly Parton, she says that she never offer advice to people who are coming into the music industry. She just sort of says, Hey, this was my experience and you might learn from any might not, and that was kind of a big light bulb went off for me, and then recently I've kind of closed down sort of an aspect of my business, which was much more about strategy and actually the last client I had really expressed some dissatisfaction at the end because they were like we really thought you were going to tell us what to do. You know like we really thought we were going to analyze the market. For us and I have no idea how they thought that because nothing my contract said that that was what I was going to do or the team that I had was going to do. We did say that we had experienced in their vertical, and so we could bring that to the conversation. We could have opinions but that the conversation was really there there's and what we were there to do is to lead them through and then she also said the client also said at the end and I think we had the exactly the conversation we really need to have but I can't help being disappointed and I was like, okay like. It was a great experience on the one hand because I felt like, okay we got them where they needed to have because it was really about them having they really had like a very fundamental difficult conversation they needed to have that they just weren't having and frankly market analysis was going to lead them away from that conversation rather than towards it you know it was going to allow them to kind of pretend that they were aligned. Without actually having the conversation about power and authority and ownership, and where cash was going in this organization, which was all messed up and all out of alignment. Yeah. They needed to know who are we as a team Megan can how are we working together? Not What are we GONNA do out there that will happen eventually but. The team conversation had to happen I. It was almost all about intention really like one person's intention was to make sure cash flowed in one direction. Another person's intention was to disrupt the market who by the way had been hired by the first person you know like, but but you know like, so they all had like different they couldn't kept bumping into each other they would make plans and then not do them and it was because there they were were each thought the company was had a different purpose than than than the other one. Yet so I guess this kind of gets us into our topic of conversation also, which conversations often hard conversations, but really really necessary conversations like you guys shared you sort of developed the framework that you've been using with each other for the last decade or so as well as you both have your own independent businesses with clients colleagues, we certainly are in a moment now culture wise where people are finding it harder to have any conversation alone hard conversations even people that we you know care about deeply sometimes it's family and. I'm curious. Actually how would you distinguish between? Conversation and argument. Just talking about this or where we arguing about. Yeah Yeah, we talk about discourse and debate kind of distinction that we've been making recently and debate is really. You know you're you're you're there to kind of prove the other person. Wrong. It's very common and social media is one of the reasons I'm not really on social media. Now, because I found myself participating in debate with people that I was never going to convince and it was sort of inconsequential even if I did convince them, I didn't even know them very well. So why was I spending time trying to convince them of things but really I was trying to disprove the wrong I wasn't trying to learn anything I wasn't there to to be changed by it and I think when it comes to discourse or maybe just sort of you know positive argument or good argument you come in willing to learn because you understand that you don't have the full picture. Of what's the topic like that? We're all viewing the world to like really like Pinhole of a perception and that if we're going to really understand something that we need that we need other people, we need you know people who to kind of share that thinking with us am I capturing the spirit of our conversation. And we are also talking about. What makes a conversation or what makes communication hard? What makes it tough? And for. US We came down to kind of two main things, which is you know, is it highly emotional? Like are you? Already in a no feeling a lot. Some people will say triggered but I feel like. That doesn't give the respect that we deserve as humans that we are emotional physical creatures. And besides being emotionally, is it a high stakes topic? Do you feel like something really fundamentally important is on the line like is somebody gonNA lose something. Is some big in a win something. So emotions and high stakes those felt like to really important parts of what makes a conversation tough the makes sense to me. You know when you we've that into relate the distinction between. Discourse and debate I. Think you can have. Those two things, right immersion high stakes can be president whether it's a debating. You're just trying to prove the other person wrong or whether it's a discourse and you really want have an open conversation and see if there's a possibility of resolution and yet it can get really emotional and the stakes are high. What pops into my mind is either there will be some people listening to this or there was some people listening to this who know people all who? Love to debate it's their sport. and this is so you get into a scenario where It's emotional but one person, this is their sport there an athlete. And all they WANNA do is provoke emotion and create that in the name of winning and but on their side. They are completely emotionally detached. It's just fun. It's one hundred percent sport I, I have. A friend of mine who is in the practice of law. It was a litigator very successful loves loves loves what they do. And part of it is because they have found a professional outlet for this thing where there's no, there's no emotional investment yet part of their, their love is to provoke emotion on the other side especially. When the stakes are really really really high in the name of winning. and I wonder what what you do when you find yourself. Interacting with someone where you're you're in it from a deeply emotionally involved state and the other person. It really is just sport we talked about in good faith. Joe. Sure. Yeah. Honestly I didn't join the debate team for a reason because I don't enjoy. That kind of sport I do get very emotional or it feels very import like important conversations feel deeply important to me and so to trigger someone purposefully doesn't feel like fun. To me so we. We've gotten really into the idea of. Are we both in this conversation in good faith. Are we coming together for? A clear outcome that serves both of us. Are, we really willing to listen to each other be changed maybe even by each other like. Are you that open willing to really be present? So I had an experience a few months ago. where it was a very emotional topic with an old friend. And I realized Oh she's not coming to this in good faith. And I ask for a timeout. And That was really appropriate to ask for it to like hold on. Let's let's examine how we're communicating here and that required a pause. Yours thinking about it's sort of like the relationship to truth as you you're as you're both talking. One, I've sort of stepped out of relationships with people that you're describing Jonathan. WHO JUST WANT TO ARGUE? And I think this may be two different reasons. One is I know people who are just contrarian and really they just kind of enjoy the game and they enjoy the there's they sort of just take pleasure in things getting kind of stirred up up which I don't and. And I think there's another side which sort of when you look at our legal system. The idea is that Is Going to beat the hell out of each other side and then one side is going to win. And be happy and one side is going to lose and suffer, and that's how we find the truth of the matter. That's how justices serve. That's how I mean that seems to be sort of the underlying the in the in litigation. That's like the underlying philosophy. But I think what we're talking about and I think the kinds of relation to the kinds of conversations that I prefer maybe. We may come from very very different angles, very strong, different opinions and very strong different mindsets and ideologies. But the goal is to have a relationship with the person on the other side and actually do something with them to reach some kind of sense of alignment whether or not. We disagree now it could be that we're going to disagree and commit because we work with a lot of. Business teams that you have one person loses in feels really bad. They can sabotage the project in a variety of very subtle ways which we've seen I've seen over and over again, they can quit which you have to bring somebody else back in. And also, they may be bringing some really vital perspective. that. If we just shut that person down shut that person up, keep that person from, and we then miss out on. We just don't. We don't get their brain we don't get there being. On the problem anymore. So I think. When I think about difficult conversations are the kind that I care about. Because there's so many different kinds of conversations I've classify difficult but the ones that I want to engage in are the ones that have purpose to them like Alex and I may argue about. Everything from personal to professional to unify the direction of the business to direction of the family to where you know. But we're committed to each other you know like we're going to be together. So we have to figure this thing out and we have to come to some kind of agreement, and so it's okay to lose in quotation marks from time to time. You know I don't have to get everything everything. I want because what I want ultimately is for the relationship to be vital and healthy and for the relationship to move forward. Yeah I think having that melons is something that sometimes is not the easiest thing to access is. Say like. What's really going on here and at the end of the day? Who who had the coach who I want to be right or do I want to be happy? I and it's probably not the exact quote, but it's it's. Part of the idea also and I wonder you know in the context of meeting up with somebody who just loves to argue or debate for the sport of it, and there's no malice they're also it's just they're fun whether one of the things if you're not that person, you know if you WanNa have hard conversations for the purpose of true resolution weather being able to identify whether the person the other side of the conversation as quickly as possible is in it for using your language debate or discourse becomes a pretty mission critical skill. That, sometimes, you don't figure out until you're in the conversation to you know. I recently. Actually I won't name the person that you know somebody who I've known for years who I've tried different times to do professional. We just you know we we share a love of each other we share love certain ideas. And then after a while, I realized that they liked to destabilize everything that we were doing on a very regular basis that was kind of fun and I was like that's you know and they're very successful like it's like they create things just realize like I don't think we are going to create anything either I'm not going to. Create something great. But I'm not going to have fun doing it and that's important to me. Or we're just never going to create anything together because I keep trying to create form and you keep trying to create discord or chaos. Yeah we've got these basic ground rules that we discovered. We were using with each other that we have found. So important in those conversations out there in the world and we we shorthand is setting the stage. But. It's like, when are we going to talk and what are we talking about an what state are we showing up to the conversation and to what end are we talking white like why is it important to both of us to have this conversation and most people aren't used to having that level of clarity before you get into a topic Like Hey, can we talk about this topic on Saturday? One we've both eaten. When we've got some quiet. You know were both sober and fed and awake. And we're GONNA talk about X. Like that level of specificity. Is. Really unusual but has been a huge. Huge. Calming Sedative to my nervous system when it comes to toughed up and mean rather than arguing about something in in the middle of the night and in a desperate way to resolve before we go to sleep. Yeah. Not After not after we share a bottle of wine not right before bed. Never. Really, important right now it's so important, right? That also brings up one of the classic instructions for you and loved ones, which is never go to bed. Angry. Do not believe in that rule we do not I used to believe that I really did and then I realized in our relationship actually it was like, oh This why would I even tried to talk to you at midnight like I am not my best self I am not. We're okay with going to bed angry. Yeah. Yeah. Because I think there's another really important relationship skill which has taken me a long time to learn that self soothing because I, think often when I was an argument. I was seeking solace. Through my partner in some way I was saying like you like when you agree with me, I will feel okay or when we reach agreement maybe even to be a little more generous but really it's no it's more like when you see things my way like that's the that's the mindset I'm in. then. I will be okay. But learning how to to kind of lie in bed and be. Okay with things feeling a little bit. A little bit unsure a little bit and soothe myself, I'd be like, okay I'm going to be it's actually a to me. It's it's something I've learned better late in life. I. Am I'm embarrassed to say but it's it's I. think an important adulting skill. Right, I think it really only took a couple of time a couple of instances for us to realize. Oh, we just go to bed tomorrow there won't be a problem like whatever was up for us, pretty much wasn't a problem we were tired and cranky. Now. All right. Maybe we have a simple clarifying conversation and that happens like two or three times. Right? You let the conversation go you wake up in the morning or like what was i. so upset about that seems so important last night but now that I'm having breakfast whatever I, love you, I, love you. China. Yeah it's still funny say that because I I noticed that about myself also and I and I attribute I think part of it to a long-standing meditation practice is that Times on just. Not Fun. There are times where you I'm just I'm I can tell I have a short fuse on not near like interactive not kind I may not like I don't create space for people that I absolutely love in your conversations aren't what I want and I've gotten to a point where. You know I will not always, but most often notice I'm like. I'm being an idiot What's actually going on here? I'm like. Is it the topic? No I don't really care about it. That much like. Is it the person now? They're being cool I'm like. Oh It's me. I haven't slept well for three days or I'm really stressed because I'm under dead lie and this is being internally generated. It's not an it's not an inter relationship thing. It's an internal relational thing. This is actually one of the points about tough conversations right now in this climate that keeps coming up for me and I think social media is an amplifier of this problem. It's so hard for us as humans to admit when we're wrong. It's so hard for many many reasons but I think social media. Makes it hard because you're GonNa? Get slammed. Even if you're apology or change of mind is is very honest and real like you feel like you can't win. So a lot of people just double down on whatever their initial assumption or opinion was. Yeah, we're we're in a time. And also I. I think social media is interesting in that. I think about Rubber Chelsea is sort of seminal work on influence in what he talked about this thing called the consistency principle where. We feel compelled US human beings to act and say things that are consistent with our prior actions and things that we've said. So we make a little statement. You know if it's in passing and conversation than it's out there in the ether and we can pretty quickly change your mind and have conversation, but we don't even like to do that. But if we make a graphic or a video or something, and then we put it on the socials and then. There's all people who are like then it's almost like I feel like that makes you feel like you're more dug in and that unconscious sorta like bias towards consistency makes us wanNA keep saying and doing the same things. Even if our thought evolution is different because we wanted to be seen as certain way certainly complicates things. It's almost like consistency of identity or ego right? Like we want we want to be like, Oh, I'm still the same person. That I was before. I don't know I think about this a lot with them. We we actually had a long conversation about Ego Hubbard dinner last night about about some of these topics and. And how? You know I've been on your podcast before and talked about my experience of being in a cult for a couple of years in watching the vow, which is about the next game called, which is on HBO. And it I'm watching that. Now sort of reminding me I'm bringing up a lot of stuff in one of the things that I really remember about it was watching my own mind adopt. Opinions or thoughts or feelings that I now don't identify with it. All right. We are highly influenced by the people where around often and that's kind of one of the things that called Syrup prey upon and I highly recommend the valley kind of goes into this in some some detail and one of the filmmakers talks about this experience a lot and so it was it's hard to leave these groups even when there's a part of you that sees wait this doesn't make any sense. Wait this is kind of. There's some BS going on here and Maybe, I would be happier doing something else one you have a community of people around you who are kind of supporting you and kind of keeping in this in this thought pattern but to it's really it's your own desire to be consistent I said this thing and the longer you're anti some ways, the harder it becomes to turn away I now I was an only for two years which you know is both the longtime and a short time in some ways compared to others. But when I look back on it like leaving after two years, it's kind of hard because I have to admit that that previous two years was something of mistake. And that I have now evolved I've now I'm so glad that I was actually in this group before social media was thing because. I hate to think what you know. I would hate to have those facebook messages you know in an archive somewhere. came out of that kind of thinking and at the same time I think in the moment you're thinking to yourself well, I, would have to admit these two years had been a mistake and yet reflecting on your conversation about having. Tried a dozen different approaches to eating over the last couple of years and that actually not being mistake because it's giving you these data points to drop you into a place where you are now is really healthy and I think with a lot of times with the benefit of time we gain perspective and say. It was two years at probably would have done something different with, but it also informed me away that dropped me into a place where I am in some way. Able to pull some benefit from the experience and bring foward into my life. Regret in many ways, this isn't really terribly useful because you know whatever it is you've experienced gotten to where you are now sure if I had this perspective that I have now having had that experience. If I had this perspective before I had that experience I might have made some different decisions he has. By the way we are not making an argument for everyone to run out and join cults. That is not the. Life project is sort of. Staying fit when spending a lot of time at home is a pretty big challenge will tempo is this beautiful at home fitness studio that comes with a forty two inch touchscreen studio style classes, plus a set of real Olympic weights with dumbbells, barbells, and plates to get you an amazing workout with weights without leaving home. The tempo membership includes over five, hundred live and. 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Covers everyone in your household owning your own Jim has never been easier check him out tempo dot fit or just clicked in Lincoln our show notes and use the code good life for one hundred dollars off. That's T. e. m. p.. O. Dot F.. It can be sure to use the Promo code good life to save one hundred dollars Timbo dot fit code good life. Project is supported by COM so safe to say we're all feeling like twenty twenty has been a lot and we could benefit from less stress and more sleep allies. It is so important to take care of ourselves and invest in our wellbeing during times of anxiety. That is why we're excited to partner with COM-, the APP that is designed to help you e stress and get the best leap of your life and when you relieve anxiety and improve your sleep, you feel better in every part of your life. So calm has a whole library programs designed for healthy sleep like soundscape guided meditations, and over one hundred sleep stories narrated by soothing voices. Like. Stephen Fry Kelly Rowland and Laura dern over eighty five, million people around the world us come to take care of their minds and get better sleep. So get started today at com dot com slash good life. That's calm. Dot Com slash good life or just click the link in the show notes for listeners of this show COM is offering a special limited time promotion of forty percent off a premium subscription adt com dot com slash good life that's forty percent off unlimited access to Com's entire library, which includes hundreds of hours of programming and new content is added every week get the COM APP and experience transformation in the way you sleep. Alex you. You brought up this idea setting the stage which I think is really interesting. Just saying instead of you know if there's an issue that you know you need to address instead of just doing it right then and there. Do it in a way where the setting is constructive. You guys also talked about really creating some sort of structure for the conversation itself. When it happens, it's idea of intentions concerns, boundaries, dreams. You can talk to me about that structure. Yeah. We'll even before you go into those four pieces of a conversation, which by the way, most people don't have structured conversations so to even bring it up or by somebody intuit, it can feel a little. Strange the first couple times, but how you invite someone into a conversation Can really be so transformative in. It's like the last thing anybody wants to hear as we need to talk, we need to talk now right? Nothing good is coming after that sentence. And it really is, Hey, can we coin talk about X.? Later this weekend. I'd like to talk about this with you. At a later date or do you have time now to talk about this? Do you have space and capacity for this? That's actually something that my some of my friends and I have agreed to in our text chain and we don't use it as an emotional dumping ground. Because people are real. Their lives are full and they have stresses and but we ask Permission First I K- Does anybody have space for me to to hop on a phone call or can we have a private text about this thing I extremely respectful like immediately sets the tone. Instead of in me invading your space with the topic where you come into a space together about something. And then for the steps themselves in one of the ways we think about it is missing conversations that. Often when there's conflict and persistent conflict among people. That it's because there's some either information missing. Is. Sometimes. Missing Conversation is. Good by you know like that, this is not we're just not aligned and we never will be but more often than not there's some sort of missing nuance to the. Or some missing information. So when we talk about intentions, concerns boundaries in dreams. What we're really trying to do is get out all of the it's called the sort of high stakes thinking or the high impact name quite saying it's more like the emotional like like the stuff that feels really important to us. So for instance. When we started to write the book together we had the conversation about forgetting because we never done business together. We only been in a you know romantic and intimate partnership, and we'd really both had bad experience in the past. combining the two and we were like, let's let's not do this, and then when the book became sort of the next thing to do it sort of came up as like, oh, it seems like this is really the wisest thing to do. We wanted to do it very deliberately. So, we sat down and we were talking about our intentions. Intentions were really easy. You know we want to. Write. A book because it's it's good for business and it helps us get our thinking. It might be fun to create something together. You know that's really really simple but then concerns you know that's where we all get crazy right like. Humans, we just have such a strong negativity bias is certainly raised in a household where worry was kind of one of the one of the predominant activities Say like fifty to eighty percent of the conversation around the dinner table was worry of some kind and so worry where I go very very quickly and what was really kind of fun is we just sort of got our worries out and we both had the same way which was that this was going to lead to divorce and which end divorce was going to lead to. You know dying alone under a bridge you know living in a van maybe not living van but like like some sort of all, my fears end up there by the way. On dying under a bridge that's where every year end yeah and then, but it was really. To make space for that without having. Because like that, that kind of fear will come up in burnt in a mind. And as soon as it comes up, you're like, well, I can't say that because that sounds because it makes me sound like an idiot but it was really really when you create space to say that to say that to each other then you can kind of celebrated you can kind of dissipate it. You know a friend of ours neuroscientist talks about when we speak things and. Then, there's something about our brain hearing them, which actually changes the way changes our mission in a significant way. It actually sues that thing that there is something about bringing it out and so when we talk about intentions, concerns, boundaries and dreams, we're just gathering information we're not saying, Oh, I, had this concerning. We'd better do something about it. When I'm saying is I have this concern. That's all I'm saying one of the things we've come to see is so important and anytime we share this, we offer this as such a we hope it such a gift well received that when you share your fears with each. Even if my fear involves you. I'm not like blaming you were we agree to not take our fears personally. Like I'm not saying you're going to do this or that you're fundamentally flawed because I have a fear about you in some way like our brains come up with bizarre fears and worries. And it's not your fault that I have a fear about you or that somehow involves you. And so it really does create this sense of what's called Psychological Safety I. Oh, I have a safe place with my partner with not more I can share my fears. And then I feel so much calmer because my fears have been witnessed, my brain can now like check that off. And I'm still a part of the group and still loved I'm still accepted data so. That so different from the first thirty, five years of my life. Yeah I mean the the notion of safety because when I first read those four things, intentions, concerns, boundaries, dreams, and immediately membrane just translated that a safety lake. It wasn't even a conscious just like, oh, so you create safety because in my mind nothing happens without that or nothing valuable happens without that plenty of destructive things happen without it. But if something valuable happens without I, think it's Kinda dumb luck and fairly rare. But with it. It's sort of like you created the the container, the context for really powerful and often really hard things to happen simultaneously that that have a net positive outcome. Yeah. The the beauty of this conversation, a structure conversation like this where you feel safe that you're developing empathy for each other. Even with someone or you are diametrically opposed on something that feels emotional and high stakes you can reconnect and feel like I understand where you're coming I. Don't have to agree with how you feel what you think but I I see you. I feel you as a person again, and that's what allows us to maintain relationships even if we are disagreeing about something. In that sense of safety, right? Feeling witnessed feeling seen feeling like I can share my authentic self like what I, what I really feel and what I really think. US thinking also about the the next piece, which is boundaries. You know the way boundaries I think have shown for the first like thirty thirty or forty years of my life. It was I have a boundary and you better respect it. You know like it was sort of like almost like petulant child you know like I have a boundary you know and it was usually only expressed after somebody had violated across it shown like they were going to and I needed to somehow prove that I was like it was almost like. A Macho petulant child Macho Nina stance like I'm GONNA show you. I'm strong by showing you that I have this boundary and instead we really try to frame the conversation of what do you need. You know like what do you need to feel safe? What do you need to feel at your best and it becomes an exploration and I think in personal relationships this is really powerful. The we do this, we do a lot of this work with professional groups to. And it's it's amazing. How often that question has just never been asked you know here you are on a on a team, which is which is supposed to be high performing, and yet you've never really asked each other. What do you need? To perform at your best like an acknowledging, the different people need different things to perform at their best and different people have different stages. Their career have different temperaments come from different backgrounds have different goals. So everybody you know some people working fourteen hours, a day may be fine, and then some people like me may have like four at best it seems these days than my fifties. And boundaries the such an interesting topic you say that you had that relationship of being a petulant child I didn't have any I didn't have any boundaries for the first thirty years. I didn't know what they were. I didn't know it was okay to have them. And those two questions. What do you need to feel safe and what you need to be at your best Are Two different ways to help you find different ends of the spectrum. And when we ask this of people we do say look you know you might not get everything you want it's not like you're ordering off a menu especially in relationship. You know we have a child's Jonathan. You have a child like you know that like rules rules and boundaries like there has to be some flexibility in there sometimes and things change. and. If I, ask him on what he need to feel safe. And I don't respect that. Or I have said what I need to feel safe. And it's not respected then. And my my sense of safety and my ability to be an honest empathetic relationship has greatly changed. So I can't just tell you. You're safe here and then you automatically feel safe. Right. Yeah. The individuals the only one who can determine if they feel safe it's not being told by somebody else that you are safe. This is space. So you can't literally yell at somebody and say look you're say pair just open. I mean, it's it's it's interesting to that question. What do you need to feel safe? I wonder if some people immediately now and they they love the fact that they've been asked because they've never been able to actually share but then I also wonder if so many people have actually never even considered the question and have no idea what they need to feel safe. And I'll give myself as an example in many contexts I feel safe having a conversation about tough topics you know in real time on the phone or in person. But. For other topics with certain people, I feel safe communicating via the written word. I have written back and forth with family members about certain topics. and. That helped me feel safe and lead to incredible outcomes. But having to speak the words out loud didn't feel safe to me. So interesting. So sometimes even it's it's the mode of communication that plays a role So it's really you really have to expand what you think about then. Yeah, and you know one of the things we recommend this as may be another setting the scene thing but a something that helps me feel safe as we actually time each other. It's the no crosstalk. Equal speaking time rule. Is One of the things that's been studied and shown to create. Safety and create more indicative that it exists. In some ways, we're trying to reverse engineer by using the timer. And you may know from like Amy Edmund since work on on teamwork. The team. Psychological Safety. That in her work was used by Google all these other people. But essentially that you can, you know a team has psychological safety when everybody's contributing about the same amount so they could be universally. It could be very boisterous team or it could be a very quiet team as long as not one to people aren't like dominating the whole thing and it's not you know it's not universal necessarily often went one or two people are dominating the conversation everybody. Else's feeling a little constrained in what they might contribute for some reason, right? So they're feeling a lack of safety. In contributing. So it's even asking the question. Even. Prioritizing safety as a thing because a lot of people on the also macho thing often in business often with men. But like no, we're just GONNA like. Spit out any idea here the you know and I think there's value in it and I the book radical candor comes to mind and I loved the book. But when I first heard about it, it just sounded like it was going to be an excuse for these jerks that I worked with to. Yell more rather than less. I'm just being I'm just having candor here I. Think you're terrible. So I think adding. Adding in the sense of safety or valuing safety to me, it seems to be somewhat of a new concept in a lot of the places we go to. Yeah I think that. Research really fascinating too when you look at the best functioning teams and you could expand that to personal relationships to organizations really do have a fairly equal amount of contribution. Because what what that tells me also so I lie very much on the introverted side of the spectrum I'm in my head a lot. There's a ton of stuff going on my head all the time even when asleep. and. So I'm always processing. I'm sort of hyper aware of what's going on around me for a lot of the time even though I'm in my head, which is a weird thing to say. So. There's a lot of data spending in my head and when it comes out either as spoken word or written word, it's usually because I've reached the point where I have some type of synthesis that I'm ready to share but I also am not quick. A not the person in the room who's really fast with a line or response or on a Mike you know much more uncertainly slow burn. And I wonder new when when you think about that e, what would it take for me to be in a room with five other people around the table who are fast or loud or extroverted and feel like I have contributed what I need to contribute and I think it's really interesting to think about like what would it take if one of the measures are really high function is equal time what would it take for me in that room to feel like I could contribute equal time I actually don't know the answer to that. But now I I want to spend some time thinking about it I'm the same I need to. I need to think things through and we we both have pretty strong morning journaling practices. And part of why I do that it helps me get clear it helps me sift through but I actually use the intentions, concerns, boundaries and dreams myself. By myself before I have a conversation with somebody else. Recommend that a lot with clients like. You know you wanNA, talk about X. With so and so. Think about these four things for yourself about the topic, and then share the intentions, concerned boundaries and remains with them. And think about it in advance if you sell some time with these four buckets yearly one thing they'll do with teams especially now that we're everything is remote you know like all of our work is remote We've been using more digital tools for this, but we'll get people give them two minutes or three minutes to journal on the just to get the ideas out, and we'll use a virtual post it note board and just all the ideas go up and even anonymous we just did it with a team of like. Sixty people doing in national sales team, and so they got you know so they were able to get all the ideas out, and then what happens is people see that other people actually have the same as they. They see themselves reflected in what's coming out, and then they begin to feel a little more comfortable as you were. You're talking about that Jonathan. I realized like identify and I don't identify with how you what you're saying because like when I first come into a group. I tend to be extremely quiet and it can go on for months sometimes can go on for a very very long time and I've and I'm remembered happening on a few occasions where people were then all of a sudden something click in I don't know what it is exactly but also only feel comfortable and then I'll start joking I'll start making right comment know like my personality like people actually have described as the my personality has suddenly changed like no actually I'm just I think I just felt safe enough now to bring out a certain part of myself and now I just had this hypothesis I'd love to to prove it or loved I'm not pay attention to it. That I think going through this intentions, concerns, boundaries and dreams exercise may speed that up for me right because all because now I'm hearing from other people day feel safer because I know more about them I have more data. and. I see myself reflected in some of that data I'm like Oh they share my concerns, share my dreams we share our intentions so I identify with them a little bit more. And I've also been able to get some of my own some of myself out. Could you know there's nagging thoughts that I've been just to myself all that time I've been quiet. Instead of keeping to the myself now out and now I can move on. Now I can kind of let myself calling up the I love that I mean if it's if it becomes a tool to or process that allows you to show up more quickly authentic way I mean that's a win for everybody unless you are authentic way is really offensive but let's work on these Gillette it's not for now. We haven't related the idea of the dream side of it also, I think is really interesting because a lot of times where you come into conversation and you kind of have a sense, it may be an argument it may be hard. There's there's a topic that that one of the fears is very lightly and I'm curious because you guys have now experiences both personally and with so many different groups that one. Of the big fears is that one person's dream, the other person's dream is basically to win and that doesn't mean when you over necessarily, it just means to dominate or maybe it's to lever maybe it's to end the relationship or the project or whatever may be whereas they may actually show up and like what they really want is like, can we just get this behind us so that we can like we can. Get back on a harmonize page and really do good work again. But if you never, if you're not explicit about that, I would imagine a wreaks havoc. So much I'm so much agreeing with you right. That's gotta the missing conversation that one of the the potential missing conversations that we're talking about. It yeah. You you might discover that you're not in alignment. Or this should we shouldn't move forward on this relationship or this project but ultimately, why dreams is so important and what we see most of the time. Is that. I mean we we put dreams at the end because it brings you back together. We encourage people like share your dreams for you and for the other person and for each other, and it's almost like a meta meditation. You start moving it out for the world that will be impacted by this decision for our family et Cetera, and when you hear somebody else's dreams unless their dreams. Are Really Dark which I've never experienced personally. You, what the other person's dreams for them like Oh, I want you to have that too. And then you want my dreams to happen for me, and then we release oxytocin together and then we're connected again, we've gotten through the concerns we got through the tough stuff. But I'll like there there are these generative gross filled energies that we can then like attached to to move forward together. It's it's really inspiring to hear each other's dreams. The dreams can even be. For us you know like I dream that our relationship is deeper through this experience or that we come out stronger team or better as thinking about when I think one of the first time we were really using this was we live in New York. City where there are a lot of like cocktail parties that you can go to and we have our introverted moments, we have our extroverted moments. And sometimes they coincide and sometimes they don't. Sometimes they lined up and sometimes you know you're at an event and one person wants to go and the other person doesn't, and so that happened enough times that on the way to events, we would start talking like well, I have a dream that will be. There will be happier as a couple on the other side of this, which has resulted in a new boundary or a new agreement, which is you can go home without me and that's total. He finds like nobody needs to get impatient with anybody else and tomorrow morning we will feel like now now, my dream is the tomorrow morning when we wake up a really good or we're in the cab going home and we feel really good but maybe we're going separately maybe that's fine. I love that little symbol things like that. Feel like, Oh, well, that's kind of silly. But then you're like, you know what but you add them up over the course of a day or a week or dozens of times in different different types of things and it ends up. Leading up to the big fractures and very often it ends up all coming out in one explosive laundry list of every wrong. That has ever been done and every violation that's ever been made, and whereas if you sort of and maybe that's something to touch down on here is the notion that where on the one hand you're saying set the stage Yelich, create the time like say, okay, make sure that it's an appropriate time for you. All parties involved actually have this conversation and that you're ready you're prepared but at the same time have it you know. Don't just because it's not the right time you know if somebody's like well, it's never gonNa be right time where they keep blowing it off it benesch piles into like a big night explosive mess. That's one of the reasons why I avoided tough conversations from most of my life because in my family of origin tough conversations or important topics meant it was going to evolve into a fight that you then had to be prepared to relitigate every past. Wrong. So like everything was on the table and what we're asking people to do in this structure conversation is we're GonNa talk about this topic. It really clear when you set the stage I, WanNa talk about this thing together and it's something that you can keep coming back. Right? It's like it's like a conversation of meditation like. We're talking about this. That's an important topic like let's have that conversation. Another time we agreed we're going to talk about this thing here, and that is so calming. Like Oh, I don't have to somehow defend my entire. Since in the space of this one conversation, I know what we're talking about here. And and talking about entering a conversation, prioritizing the relationship over or at least equal to the topic under discussion. Like saying that we want that I want to come out of this with a good relationship whether or not maybe even decide that. Oh. This thing that we were getting together, we really shouldn't do it because you know we're our goals are relatively different our attitudes arelatively different but preserves the relate that can preserve the relationship potentially as well. But we all one of the things we think about is got men's four horsemen of the relationship apocalypse right and I think what you're describing Jonathan is like when I'm pent up. You know like I'm much more likely to if I if I haven't expressed a boundary, it's much more likely to come out expressed as criticism of the other person, right? You know like if I have expressed boundary of. Say I you know I want to go to bed at a certain time. You know and I, I don't know like. And somebody else kind of violates that or calls me late all the time. You always call me late. You're always the kind of person who you know rather than expressing the boundary. Front. then. It's much more likely to be expressed in a way that the other person can kind of hear. Friday is supported by ship station. So it's hard to believe but the holidays are right around the corner and this year we know that people will be buying more online than ever before. 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When you use the code good life, make sure your business is ready to meet the demands of a massive online shopping season get started at ship station. Dot Com today click on the microphone at the top of the homepage and type good life that ship station dot com and enter the code good life ship stationed dot com make ship happened. have to share a huge parenting when with Jonathan. Thank you appreciate this. over the summer our now thirteen year olds said out of nowhere at the dinner table. I'm really glad I'm being raised learning to care about other people's feelings like. We've been using this style of communication with him for six or seven years since he was little. and. Because you know I, feel like I've been re parenting myself as much as I am like parenting him to have tough conversations in a way where there's and respect and clarity like dude I'm really glad you're being raised to learn to care about other people's feelings too. And he's just got into high school. So we'll see what the next couple. Of next year we'll see have. Time. On Your Voice Mimicking and just say that one more time. I. I, need to be able to remember this moment. we've been talking a lot about the container and we've talked a little bit about. What you consider the rules of engagement we talked about arguing good faith brought up men's four horsemen. We actually had Julie and John on the podcast in the past, which was a fantastic conversation I them both the it's an it's funny to see I think I recall I commented during our conversation on the podcast and for those who don't know Julia Don Godman running colloquially called the love lab but they've been researching love and partnership in conversation for forty years and I think it was about a forty five minutes into the conversation and I said I noticed I was like you know. You, and they've been together I think forty or fifty years that and like you guys are doing a really interesting dance even in the studio. You know because they were really it was like they were handing the baton between each other. In the conversation and you could, if you were in the studio, you could sense like I could watch them and see the physical towels. One somebody who was not speaking had something they wanted to contribute. But they were waiting. And it was interesting to see how they were embodying the ground rules at you're talking about their own observations about healthy relationships. You know the their whole bunch of other very specific rules of engagement that you guys write about. But one of the things I actually Kinda wanted to explore on more of a Meta level is. The. Maybe, two things is the idea of awareness and self care because in a way I think they kind of go together. Because I you we're we are talking about. Things that you do sort of in the moment you know or up to the moment here's how we're going to set the stage for the moment, and here's why here's here's how we interact in the moment. But you know before you ever get to the moment what you bring the state of being the state of mind that you bring into that moment, a half imagine is equally important to constructive outcomes. Hundred percent mind is going into like three different directions as you're as you're talking about this one is. One of the gift sexually of spending all of my time at home for the last six months. 'cause I used to travel a lot and I used to work on multiple projects all at the same time I. Still do that but you know that I would be changing context a lot and I was actually under a lot more stress. My Diet wasn't as good. And when we talk about sort of emotional presence or the presence that I bring to something. I know you're imitator and the Buddhist will say that. It goes back to bodily sensation. Right in many ways like your emotion is is an expression of your interpretation of bodily sensation and actually reading a book by a neuroscientists now and he basically says neuroscientists no. The same thing you know like that we have a bodily sensation in that bodily and one of the things I notice with self care. This kind of goes back to our rules of engagement where we talk about alcohol let's be fed is that let's pay attention to the bodily sensations were having like how we feel coming into something? And it really changes and I think actually I have no idea whether you enter whether you've noticed this Alex but I actually feel like a much more stable. person. Over the last six months I was before like I get you know I identify with some things you were saying earlier, Jonathan felt like I just get in a bad mood or I'm short and I've just noticed that happening less and less because I've been much more control. And self aware because I had this daily meditation and practice. And I know how I feel and I can change. You know I have kind of strict retains I wake up I drink two bottles of water because I know that if not taking care of myself and I'm just not going to bring my best self to the situation. Yeah. My on I, mean I have the same self care rules that you do but we're also really aware that. How we take care of our physical bodies is going to impact the quality of our conversations. and. So we have a lot of compassion for each other like if one of us isn't feeling great. Or like you know what I understand like you're nervous retired are anxious maybe like let's talk another time. And I've actually. I've done a lot of work around rewiring my own nervous system in early childhood traumas. I would dissociate during certain really tough conversations because they reminded me of childhood I. think that's really common. It's really common and just. I just I love that the idea that we hold trauma in our bodies becoming more well known so that we can have more compassion for ourselves and each other in these tough conversations like all you might like a the word triggered like you might actually be triggered in your nervous system right now. And that is not the time to have a tough conversation where important decisions need to be made its lake raising children right? Like you don't try to teach them anything when they're having a meltdown. You help them get calm. They take a nap and maybe then you talk about what happened like nothing good happens in the intellectual brain when we're emotionally lit up stuff. Like that. But we take. A much deeper greater responsibility for. How. We're showing up physically to these conversations so I think actually like having these intentional conversations over the last several years has helped me in some ways rewire my nervous system over time it's become like a new rewiring. So it's almost like you start to realize that the inevitable outcome. Of. These things that you might have experienced as doom and gloom before is like, Oh, I can go to that place. But it with a different context and it's it's actually going to be okay. which may it's it's almost like a form of exposure therapy. You live through something and you're like, Oh, I can live through that again. That's. That's And I guess when you approach it with like okay. So with a set of rules or or framework with the natural approach. Where you you understand that the the core of the dynamic is replicable. It probably gives you a certain amount of service psychological bedrock. To Go back to that place morale as well. Yeah I. Think you've both actually said the same thing in different ways you were just mentioning it Alex and we're talking about the you help the child calm down and then you have the conversation later. Yet you have the conversation later right? You know because I think the tendency is like Oh the child's calm now. So now, I don't have to deal with now and now I'm not gonNA deal with anything and so there is a part of self care and awareness, which is that in that enlightened piece, which is you know it's like going to the gym I know if I exercise three times a week that my life is better even though I don't necessarily WanNa go an exercise three times a week right like and just like the the difficult conversations I know that my and this is something I mean from we've got together In let's say I was in middle age you weren't quite there yet but. We're late we all we ted significant relationships and one of our sort of early rules was we can talk about anything. and. There were several conversations especially early on as we were getting to know each other in the first couple of years of relationship where. I was like this might end. This little thing that I'm feeling this thing that I'm having and my tendency had been in other relationships to actually just bury that thing. Well, it's not upright now. So I'm just not going to worry about you know it's sort of like this nagging little thing. So it's not really worth bringing out. And I think what I, what I learned, and maybe some of hopefully we've captured in this book is no it's actually now is the time like I m feeling calm. And there is this thing that was nagging me before I. Know Enough about myself to know that when I'm low blood sugar and have had a glass of wine and tired later on that this is gonNA come out and it's going to come out in some kind of nasty way or something from less than kind way. Some way that I don't intend. So now is the time to bring this up and now it's time to have that conversation and I. Think a lot of our intent with this book. One of the reasons 'cause clearly, we're creating this like structured linear four step process for a very non linear, very organic thing which is you know emotional resonance with another human being essentially. And so one of the reasons we have this is because when you have steps is just more likely to happen. If going back to the Jim Metaphor, if I have a trainer and a spreadsheet who's told me that you know one day a week, I'm going to be doing upper body and it's GonNa consist of these exercises. In this many Reps. I'm far more likely to make it to the gym when I look at that spreadsheet than I am because I have sort of linear process rather than saying, Oh, you should move more you should exercise some. which kind raised around to the question that I wanted to ask, and then we'll. We'll kind of come full circle, which is an and I think bobby usurp planted that seed, which is you wrote this book when he shared originally you both had an intention when you decide to sit down and write desert baton rouge project together do something cool. It's good for marketing it'll help people but that that last thing you know when you create effectively a toolbox for conversation and you offer it out to the world at this moment in time, do you both have a bigger in? Around what you would love It to enable I'M GONNA point to a few real world examples from friends and clients and raiders that. I mean, this might be the first time in might the slick a twenty twenty year my career here this might be the first time where people keep saying oh my gosh. This is really helping me with some really tough stuff. And people are having. Conversations that they otherwise would never have had or would lead to more problems. In marriages and on business teams and in families. And just hearing their feedback. that. Oh. My Gosh I I actually have a great adult relationship now because now, I know how to have an adult conversation about tough topics or I wrote a letter to my father in law. And now, we're finally communicating about something that keeps evolving into fights. When of our family gets together, it was not planned that the book would come out at this perfect moment. That was kind of the divine luck that you mentioned before like that. It really was kind of. Lucky timing in some ways that it's so useful right now. Yeah. I mean I'll say. I really I've I've had let's say I've had sort of a rough time with personal relationships through a lot of my life. You know intimated Alex's my fourth wife like my end. And the best I'm just very happy with the relationship I have, and you know people talk about marrying the right person being for your personal happiness and success and having the right, and I would just say not just marrying the right person. But having the right relationship at home is one of the most impactful things you can do for personal happiness really echoing what you're saying Alex. and. Then there's another component to this tool can be used in personal relationships in. Private relationships are and it can also be used in professional that we use in a professional context quite a bit. My background and my interest has always been in you know sort of sustainability and social justice and creating more equitable, creating a more sustainable world. and. So I've worked on climate I've worked I have an MBA that's focused on sustainable systems. And I've always been a little perplexed because these problems to seem so big and so fast and I know they're going to be here after I'm gone you know like we're not going to solve them in our generation, but I want to but I would like to solve. You know at least contribute to solve them in our generation. And I, feel like one thing that I'm seeing are one contribution that I can make is helping leadership teams of organizations make better decisions and part of the making better decisions is hearing from everybody you know like welcoming everybody welcoming. Diversity of voices and one of the things that's often missed in the diversity conversation is that when people come from different backgrounds, we see the world in different ways and that almost by definition will introduce more conflict potential or more or more potential for conflict right? Because homogeneous teams just like Oh yeah. I get you get me and we're just going to move forward and so when you look at sort of the Team performance metrics imagine teams can perform pretty well, but diverse teams tend to be more creative and have more divergent thinking about them, and so part of my personal mission is to help teams develop what I call the healthy emotional landscape. So they can welcome voices, and so they can have they can make better sort of shared decisions rather than this, you know commanded. Control top down smart highest paid guy in the room makes all the decisions and everybody else run scared and does what they say because I think that model of organizational development visual design has kind of run its course and I think we really need a new model if we're going to tackle problems like climate change like poverty like racial equity in this world So Good time for us to come full circle here. So hanging out in this container of good life project if I offer up the phrase to live a good life for each of you what comes up I'm with people that I love. Getting to make stuff. That's fun. and. Feeling like I'm contributing and helping more people than just myself and my immediate circle. Yet, I, don't know that I can add in. It's it's relationships and being in spending time with people who fill me up rather than deplete me and is feeling like my work is good like I'm on the edge both like I'm scaring myself a little bit. You know like trying new stuff making things a little bit harder stepping into situations where I feel a little unsure I really love that because it forces me to grow. And then feeling that work is there for a good reason like it is contributing to this project of creating more equitable and sustainable world. Thank you thank you Jonathan Lovely to see you. Thank you so much for listening and thanks also to our fantastic sponsors who help make this show possible. You can check them out in the links we have included in today's show notes, and while you're added if you've ever asked yourself watch I do with my life we have created a really cool online assessment that will help you discover the source code for the work that you're here to do. You can find it at sparkle type DOT COM that's S. P. A. R. K. E. T. Y.. P. E. DOT com, or just click a link in the show notes, and of course, if you haven't already done, so be sure to click on the subscribe button in your listening APP. So you never miss an episode and then share share the love if there's something that you've heard in this episode that you would love to turn into a conversation, share it with people and have that conversation because when ideas become conversations that lead to action, that's one real change takes hold see you next time.

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Learning, Leadership and Empathy with Carrie Webber

Nobody Told Me That! with Teresa Duncan

54:42 min | 2 months ago

Learning, Leadership and Empathy with Carrie Webber

"Welcome to the. Nobody told me that podcast. My name is teresa dunkin and my goal is to share information. That you probably weren't thinking about. I love preparing my friends for situations that may come completely out of the blue. I also want to share with you. Many of the tidbits picked up over the years. If you absolutely have to tune out before the end of the show make sure you check out the show notes for more details and information on today's topic and thank you so much for making me a part of your day. We are back for another episode of. Nobody told me that and again i love having my friends on harry weber from jameson management here. Hey kerry right series that thank you so much for having me my friend. It's so good to be with you. Well it's nice to see your face and again you know. Nobody's hugging nobody seeing each other. So it's it's nice to see your face i kinda live vicariously through my webcam. That's just how it's going has jameson. Manage the distance from the clients. How has that been between you. You know it's been as everybody can agree. It has been a really wild and crazy year for the good news was we were no strangers. To virtual to virtual tools. There was no real learning curve for us in terms of how we could connect with our our teams and our clients that we're working with so we really amped up that virtual support and made ourselves readily present even more than ever before for our clients in the various stages of need and urgency in emergency. That that everybody was going through. You know it just felt like you would like chapters of some kind of dramatic book brain. What is it ever going to end up with warranties. That was a real fortunate thing on our side that our team was familiar with zoom. We just amped up our own training internal Become even more competent with the tools that that brought to the table and that's that's how we adjusted and adapted to how we could help our clients and you know good news is they were in the same boat and that's not really not good news but they adapted very quickly. Everybody on the planet now has a pretty good understanding about zoom. So right off. I think we're zoom experts at this point. Yes it's one thing when we're the helpers so dentists being the helpers of their patients but we are the helpers of dent so when this had been not only were they shell shock but we were shell shocked but still we had be there for the clients and of course you you in a different capacity. I was just doing small strategy. Hospit- that you it's a whole different thing with jameson. You had to be ready with solutions with almost like therapy with a lot of therapy sessions. Yeah there was so much in his preaching to the choir of a conversation for a minute and everybody. Listening gonna agree there. Were so much that everyone in dentistry is being faced with that. Was that unprecedented type thing. Never has anyone ever to know what to do. In those types of scenarios has just like in any kind of crisis someone has to step up and take the lead and help to figure things out in help people move forward and trees i had to. I just wanna take a moment and give you credit. Where credit's due. You were such a phenomenal mentor. In leader in dentistry through these lasts months Just helping people navigate everything from insurance to you know to all of the regulations that were coming through a you were very president and doing the work and doing the research and you were a guide for us on a couple of occasions in you. Were so gracious to our team in helping us find solutions for our clients. So i just wanna say thank you from dentistry. Because you're just you're brilliant. And i really respect you and i'm grateful for what you've done this year and always but it was that kind of collaboration with other passionate leaders in our profession in experts in their realm that we were able to tap into. And it's like he said theresa rest for us because people were knocking on our door. What i do that. What what do i do for my team. What do i do with the practice. How do i get the loan. How do i know. Where do i get the p. p. e. word i get the ppp and all that people were trying to figure out every step of the way and we were really fortunate to have some tremendous leaders and experts organizations that it wasn't just s figuring it out. We were collaborating with people reaching out. Saying why are you saying about this sharing resources from other companies and doing whatever we could to help the dentists that were out there trying to figure out what to do. Next year firm provides full service consulting but also marketing. is you see a big hole back from marketing. Were dentists like wait a second with this on hold. Did you see that at all you know. Interestingly no good the interesting thing about market the marketing side was we were actually still having conversations with practices in the midst of it. All about how do i market this. How do i do this better. And we were having conversations with doctors about coaching an- marketing not not to a significant degree. But there were still people calling in. And i think the reason was issues. Would i like to say are the cracks in your foundations that maybe you were just covering up with a rug before really became magnified amplified this year. Because you needed to be running got well oiled machine. You needed to have things working well. And the practices that were at the ready and didn't have those foundations or didn't have that patient flow or didn't have that presence in their community that lack of preparation that lack of this foundational support systems. They really felt it this year so i think they saw okay. I put this off. And i'm known i needed to work on this or i've known i needed to do something different in my marketing and while it may take some time to make those decisions. They were ready in the pause. They had time to explore who also had time to look at what they were doing. Maybe on the marketing front and realizing i'm not getting anything out of this. I'm i'm sitting out here and getting zero result. So they were starting to look for alternatives because they had the time to do so i know. A lot of doctors looked at their monthly statements recurring balances recurring charges for the first time in a long time and realize they were paying for double services and the reason i asked about. Marketing is i'm i'm part of different masterminds in this one mastermind one of the girls brought up. The her clients are very very busy. And it's because the dentists that shutdown never left any kind of message or their patients patients. Were actually or out there. You know they. They will leave messages. Not gonna call back. And she found that a lot of her clients getting busier and busier because of bad marketing. Right or no more ad and that made incas. That's just our area because it's a local mastermind. Is it just our area. And so i've started asking other consultants interest other colleagues. And i wanted to wait and ask you this question because you know you're you're all across the country and i was wondering if that's something your clients are like. Ooh look at all these patients that don't have a dental home anymore. Are you seeing that with your your clients. Yes another interesting thing that's happening is our clients. That were really proactive. Through it all and staying on top of how they were scheduling still on some foundational scheduling. Approach they were still holding blocks for new patients where others just like we're just cramming them in and couldn't see a new a new patient when a reopened so because they were still honoring some pre blocks for for new patient opportunities that his new patients with come to them because they were the one that could soon what about the philoxenia empty right now because we keep hearing about this october november. The sucked timber. I heard called so many different things. Are you seeing empty blocks with some of your clients. And how are you. Coaching them through that. If you're saying well so again. Interestingly the funny thing is it's not funny. That was a terrible word. But you know. Very early on in the shutdown. I own jamison with my husband jess jeff and he was saying early on with our team saying you know. Make sure everybody's watching out make sure everybody's watching six months out because when there's a gap here there's naturally going to be a gap somewhere else. So everybody's gonna have the natural desire to just focus on the immediate in the urgent and not looking ahead and they could be at risk of a gap again at the end of the year will sure enough here we are and here comes the gap some clients that really continued to honor and do some very intentional scheduling efforts in the reopening phase are still busy today and they're still booking out because they were working on that even then moving patients ahead doing all the things that they can do to balance out their schedule and then others that may be. Don't have that opportunity. I do a lot of our. I do all of our initial conversations with people calling in to talk about their practice and see what kind of solutions are available to them and yes they are like. Yeah well we could We can do some work in the fall. We got on our podcast reason. We did a whole thing on this. Because said you know you're either feeling feast or famine and you're overwhelmed by either one. What do you do in either scenario to try and balance the scales a little bit more so for those that are feeling that famine. You know you've just gotta dig in. Do the proactive work. Just like we had to shut down big question to always ask yourself in these kinds of situations. What is one thing. I can do right now to get us closer to whatever that goal is you know we can be so overwhelmed by the big picture but if we just do the work one step at a time you can make progress. So what have you not done or what what needs to be done today. Who do you need to call. Let patients you need your reach out to what reports you need to be running through. They need to try to reactivate where those opportunities just like we teach in in huddle and everything else you know. Are you really doing the work to stay on top of where the opportunities are within your own practice with your patients and being proactive on that so important what you just said about the pick one thing because right now i know. A lot of managers are feeling so overwhelmed. Because they've had all this other stuff added and dentists who are managing the practice themselves. Don't have a true. I guess administrator manager so sound horton pick one thing or else. You're going to go take a nap or you're gonna go watch netflix. It's very overwhelming. So give yourself permission. Listen to what. Harry says do what he says. One thing one thing. Can i ask you about consultant tactic. That's out there. Because i'm sure other insults are going to do this tactic. I guess some planning as part of full service consulting. You're looking at annual planning. You're looking at goals. You're setting numbers right when you're setting goals for twenty twenty one. Do you chop out most of the year and stick with what the were for. Say a twelve month span of two thousand one thousand nine hundred twenty or do you or cast with these covid months in mind. How are you coaching your clients through that. I mean it's so hard there's we don't know yet. Yeah and that's a really good question. I think you have to have awareness of what your trends were pre covid. Let's not ignore the reality of what the year was. You know. I mean. I think having an awareness of what that was you know yeah. You're you're interviewer. This year is not going to be what it was gonna be thing. We just need to accept this. But what we need to do is start looking at the trends of since you've reopened whatever your trends been What are you looking. What are you forecasting forward towards know. And what were you ramping up for and use that as goals. What your capacity at this point you know those practices that have a big gap right now. They're going to be really hurting because they had zero production for two months or more and now they're how they have low production again so that's gonna be really painful so they have to figure out. Guess what guess what's coming in six months if you don't remedy this issue again with the one thing you know we can get really overwhelmed. What's the goal. What what do you need. You know you can even go back to basics really going back to basics in terms of planning out your your goals from twelve. What do you need for the next twelve months to be achieving. Keep the doors open to pay you. What what you need to pay what you want to pay your team and all of that pair that back and then get your trends going again. Three months trends for you to add and grow and get back on track filled on that. Because you were saying you mentioned team and so when you have all this time to think you start to look again at your overhead right. How your teams have. They stayed together. Doctors realizing their overhead is higher. Because they got turnover. Did they lose a lot of people being how how are your teams. The strength of the team's turnover may i. This is like my favorite. This didn't you off. Corn letourneau the facebook groups and be like l. coon spin. Who's been leading strong and you. You can almost see it right. I mean you only tell me all the stories right. We probably will have similar insights on. This are the doctors and leaders. That were upfront proactive staying connected communicating with thirteen involving their team through the entire process whether they had to furlough or layoff or not if they were staying connected those teams have been rallying for the most part they come back they feel heard they feel supported the doctors that were doing the work in getting what they needed and being compliant and shoring up the cracks in their foundation and keeping the team connected having meeting doing planning clearly communicating making sure based on the same page. Those teams were a part of the solution and they're doing great the doctors at ignored it. That shutdown laid off and then talk to their team again until the week before they are about to reopen. How romblon. I knew it is what it is. You cannot as a leader. Avoid especially in a crisis leaders has to be present and they have to be heard and you may not be able you may not be having easy conversations and it may not be good news but when we stay connected with our team and communicate with them it can help us navigate those painful waters and come back together healthier. And that's what you see. You know the teams that are afraid. The teams that don't feel supported the teams that feel in the dark the teams that don't feel like the necessary steps have been taken to be protected. That is a sign that there's not communication healthy communication taking place. I believe that. Oh i agree with you and the leadership issue. I mean i know that. That's a big part of any. Coaching really is how to be a good leader. These doctors maybe that was the next phase of your coaching. Or maybe you had even gotten to that yet. All of a sudden they're being asked to you know. Fill a bus getting everybody on the right seats on the bus passes like falling apart around them so when you are facing faced with that is there kind of hand holding goes on to help them pivot into that leadership role. Did you go into emergency hand holding or you know how did that go. There is there. Were some emergency hand holding. Here's the thing that i've always felt about dentistry. A danger zone for dentists is how isolating it can feel as an owner as the leader Especially when you're having a make decisions you can feel very isolated in you know. Who can i even talk about. This really understands and so there was a lot of that type of worship in terms of really helping to keep a clear head keeping emotion as best in check as possible and helping them make the best decision. They could with what they knew at the time. And that's what i kept saying was. We did a lot in terms of decision making in crisis in terms of do your research and make the best decision that you can with what you know right now and be transparent and open in your communication because again like we said earlier doctors and practice owners were having to make very unfortunate decisions at the beginning very painful decision. People love their teams. People love their patients. They love their practices. The last thing they to do is anything that would cause pain right right gate confrontation and they don't like people to be unhappy and not like them and wait. That's a news flash dentist. You're breaking news. We were more of a support group or group. And it's it's you know facing change at anytime is difficult Had changed forced upon you. It makes it even even more challenging to lead through. I had a few former clients reach out to me. We're still good friends. And i think the most heartbreaking thing was to see that what they thought were long-term team members who had been with them for a long time decided to not come back for you know in that even batteries and they're worried about their health and childcare all that stuff. It's really i mean it's like having the rug pulled out from under you again. That's what how one would it. you know. I i have to shutdown. I didn't even think my team wasn't coming back. And all of a sudden my team's not coming back so you know that's a whole different level of no w. t. f. Are you helping them with hiring people. Is that something you guys do or is it more of the interviewing coaching how much that came into play during this last month's we we've always supported in hiring. It's a challenge for a lot of people right now in finding the team finding new team and that the the turnover is just extraordinary. And you know to a degree you gotta understand the environment in which turnovers happening right. There's a lot that is beyond the control of the practice owner know fear and being in dentistry than there's no p e. in the world that's gonna make you know the decision. I don't wanna do this anymore. And so be it. It always just staying focused on. What's your vision. What are the values. Was the dna of your practice and being ford focus on Continuing to build a healthy practice culture. Where your attracting people that are aligned and believe in what you do i. We're gonna get through this but you got higher smart and ask the right questions. Put out the right information about the who that you are. Just like when you're communicating trying to reach the right types of patients for your practice howard communicating to reach the right type of team members for your practice. You sound like everybody else. You're gonna get whatever and it's it's not the same thing and we also found through this. You know we are not an hr firm and there's a lot about hiring and firing and all of that that is not just about getting the right person but being compliant and my goodness. Yeah you know being compliant in protecting yourself. So i can't tell you how many times we would say do you work with an hr company. Maybe that you should do. Is dental school buddies office manual. He sent it to me. Can you help me reworded now. No but you know that brings up something else when you have team members being hired managers and of course i go to managers. Because they're my heart. We have brand new accidental managers right looming on board. They don't know that you need all this stuff they don't know you need that yearly. Hipaa the They don't know stephan. I'm getting questions from people that are saying. How do i get a copy of the code. I tell them look. This is where and then you have to budget every year. Because you're going to need another book. Why do they change every year going. Yeah so there's a level of like complete newness and the shyness coming off because they have to learn all of this. But but that's what sears me is. We're coming up on a lot of new team side right and you know to speak to that historically. Let's just say. There are some dental practices that joan and haven't historically allotted the appropriate type of time to train up a team member to set him up for success. You know throw a big old heap in help in of covid on top of that and be really be extraordinarily busy or stressed and you're bringing a team member in two to that. Were you have very little time. Or perhaps very little mental capacity to fully get a person oriented to your practice in your systems and how they could do it well and do it right. That is going to be a big risk and the question is. Do you want to invest in the time of prioritize time now to set them up to be successful in the future. Or do you want to spend a lotta time cleaning it up later because the cleanup is not only expensive than painful painful. Now in my in my classes. I would usually say something like. Don't expect very much from your new employees or about three months because they're learning your culture. They're learning your rules are getting along with everyone. Yes they're producing but Don't expect phenomenal results. Because they're still learning. We can't afford that now so i can't do them. Don't expect much in three months because there's nobody else doing been really really tough or make with i wanna ask you because i know you've been working on a project so you took a lot online is used to do you. Were on the road almost as much. I was really probably and you are speaking on it. You meeting with clients all your teens meeting clients but you took everything and threw it online mind. Is that something that dentists can use to cut down that learning curve because now we can't you know fly to oklahoma to see you. What are we doing with the online classes. Because i'm i'm so curious to get in there. I don't have access yet. But i'm i'm gonna get it. I'm gonna dig around first of all. Let me let me break it down. You have a whole bunch of virtual classes for your team members to take. Tell me why you through. Everything online was in progress before. And is this. Did you suddenly realize okay. This is a really good way to do it and pleased. Ignore the snorts of my dog so that came through the reporting love. Jameson could be any dental practice story in terms of facing adversity in this year and making decisions to stay to agile and a dat to the disruption. That's that's really what we're asking practices to do is to be agile and be prepared in forward thinking make a plan of how are you going to be better on the other side of this. Yes we are recovering from crisis right now in it uncomfortable. Some of it's frustrating. Some of it's painful. It's expensive but if we weren't to be more agile make innovation instead of excuses. I like that and ask yourself the question of. What could we do right now to be better. How can we use this as an opportunity to adapt for the better on the other side of this when we were in the the massive pause at jameson as coincidence would have it. We had pieces of online learning already available to us. As i told you we were already utilizing zoom as a team with our clients to some degree and then we had already invested in some video technology and we had started a framework of an online learning platform because it had been visions that we would bring even more to what we're already doing value ways that we could teach some of our foundational things through self guided learning. That could be a supportive tool that our advisers would use when they're with our client so we already have these pieces but we didn't have the prioritization of it as you said. Our team was all traveling. I was traveling was going to be on the shoulders of our leadership team which are already kind of spending a lot of plate and we just couldn't get it off the back burner and we didn't really know how to execute it. We knew the why the what the who the where the wind. But we didn't know how to do the how really we already had these pieces and then in the spring we in the in mass distress we finally like. Okay okay. we can either panic and be overwhelmed. And wonder how are we gonna help our clients. How are we going to keep doing this arrogant adapt or we can do something is you have. You can either move forward. Move back or just stay still and let things come down around you writing for you. My my mother kathy jamieson founder and she always says almost exactly like that three said. There's no such thing as status quo. You're either going up or you're going down and you wanna make a decision to be moving forward always a continuous path of learning. It just so happens in it just happens. We had some of the technology we needed. Just so happens. We had invested in started building out some kind of skeletal framework. Just so happens. We had members of our team that were like sparks houses for us. That and this is a lesson for dental practices to we. Were so open in conversation in getting ideas from everyone. What could we do. How could we do this. How can we do differently. How can we do a better and ideas and talents and skills from other people that were on. Our team really brought this to lie. So yeah from about april We started recording video content organizing pathways of learning if some of the foundational systems. That jameson teaches. How's it gonna work. How are we going to structure it writing out content to support it and it went live october. I it's exciting. It's called grow. Yeah i'm going to put a link in the show notes of course for it and so you've got a couple of different trashy said the southeast and then you have the whole hidden caboodle and i think even tears to that. I don't want to lose his train of thought that your mother i don't even i mean i'm sure she knows but she should always here has been such an inspiration so many dental consultants in offices. So for those of you who are not familiar with her. Collect what you produce that. She just had her second printing. That was the second edition right. So and i read the first one when it came out. I was brand new doing so. I read that book and it was. It was great in. I've had it recommended. It and then she met with a second hot. Dang so i got a copy of that and i all i highly recommend collect which you prodi's cathy jamieson. You can get on the jameson cider amazon. Or wherever okay. And then the the other money book i recommend is susan guns money and money out so if you're into numbers anybody who's listening those two bucks. I think you have to have if you want to really get things done. I'm gonna assume y'all have a copy of my book. No that's some. I so with the learning heart when you said the foundation on my ears perked up because one of the classes that i took with your mother years and years ago was very long class and it was about you had like nine or ten systems and maybe you have more now but there were like nine or ten systems on a slide and she put them all up there and i thought oh lord she's gonna go through all nine of those and they're like big media systems and then i'm like. Oh gosh this is an all class and sure enough. She went through all nine. But it flew by. And i really felt like that was like a crash course in business and i did. I did what i tell everybody not to do. I went back and i tried everything. Hold on mistake. I know better now. But i wish i could go back in time. Listened to her. Give those courses but now it sounds like you have those foundational messages on your site. Yeah we're going to be continuing to build out in pathways so we're building out different pathways on all the systems in business hygiene that we work on with clients A lot of those foundational systems. And they're in in bites so you can go slow as you want. We're giving c credit for it. The thing is that it's gonna be great. It can be utilized in team meetings. Teams can go through it together. Doctors can go through it. People that really. That's the way they want to learn and work on their practice could just do that. And that's it or they can use it in collaboration with working with us with our with an adviser. It's also i think going to be a really powerful tool for people that have new team. Yes yes and you can't. You cannot skim on this. You have to put some money towards training union members. You sign your team members based on what they need to learn and go through and because we have clients all the time that have said this is why we have little frameworks already in place. You just had some like fast track. Put a new team member through and get them up to speed. that'd be great rod. wouldn't it here. You go slow. The the goal is that it really can be either a valuable additional resource for clients or it can be something that anyone at any level in their dental professional career could use to to grow and develop with. Let's talk about that track. So i'm hiring a new receptionist. Where am i sending them like. What if i say carey. I need to give her four videos to watch. What am i. What am i showing her brand new receptions. So there's there's a couple of tracks there's a couple of levels of investments you can either do individual memberships. So let's say you're a new young doctor in your wanting something just a teacher yourself for your primary purchase right and you buy individual membership and go through the content as you desire. Let's say you have team. You want access for your team. You can buy a program that gives you ten to fifteen memberships and you can sign your team members what you want them to go through. Reprioritised order So let's say you wanna get them through the patient. You know the five star patient experience and everything from telephones acne to patient check in and out to that patient journey scheduling is a whole track track. And you can start going in there. It's really easy to navigate in. You can see very quickly where you'd want to start and you also see really lines out. How many lessons there are how much time you can expect it to take to go through it all completely your quizzed on the content. So that helps do as you go through it. You're going to be taking shots. Small short quizzes that helps with retention making sure where he listening or whatever and then again if you needed. Cd credit practice management ce is kind of dependent upon your state available. I'm so glad that you're including that. Because the new thing with adult learning is this gamification lastest and so listeners. If you're not sure what that means. It's because we are so used to sitting in front of somebody's speaking for three hours. That's the typical lecture right. And i remember sitting in classes. Even though i loved whomever was speaking there were times when i was trying so hard to keep my eyes from closing because i was exhausted. Or whatever right not so bad but when you game five the presentation you're keeping people engaged whether it's viable poll whether it's by letting them achieved some rewards in this is on the virtual side and i remember reading it and thinking this is how my son plays. Experts in at rewards is little tracks. It's little quests. And that's when it clicked what this game of occasion mac thousand. What are they talking about like jeopardy. I don't know what you're talking but now it makes sense so i'm glad to see you have that because i think even myself as a learner a professional learner why board sometimes and you know online learning. It's just different. It's different than than in person and it doesn't mean that it has to be less effective. It just is different in so you have to do your homework in understand what the trends are what those kind of successes are what works in what is working and how that's changing again. We're very fortunate to have members of our team that really dug in and did research on what seems to be the successful approaches to online learning because for us the risk. Is you know when you're a company. That's been around for thirty years when your practice has been practicing for thirty years you can easily be afraid of the unknown of doing something completely new because what we what we done before has worked and so just like with our practices you have to be able to explore. Otherwise you're going to get stuck in the rut in the cheese is going to move in which were difficult to catch up and so for us to. It doesn't mean that we're throwing away the things that people have come to know and love how we teach but we needed to adapt and this this disruption really forced that hand and move quickly along but the with the learning the quizzing. Lots of fun little video snippets little five minute videos here in there so it's a little bit more community a little. There's a lot of variety variety of instructors. So you're not just watch and music Just get sick of that. That's what i'm worried about with my insurance courses. I'm working on right now. Is like flirting. Talk trust me you cannot pass offsets gotta be you know i just maybe i can make a cartoon or caricature but yeah. I mean. there's only so much you can take me saying you can do it. It's it's just not fun after a while. I mean my son tells me that. So i know it must be true if our kids alison. Oh my goodness and that's been hard to you. Have young kids you there. What ten eleven eleven and. Let's talk about the mommies side. Daddy's justice i'm sure helping out to like are they. Are they home schooled. Are they schooling from home. What do they do. You know number one. I'm i'm very fortunate to have as very an incredible husband in a incredible father to our kids and it has definitely been a team approach to running the business and help the kids right so in the midst of the quarantine especially they were both. We were running from meetings to helping them get their online course stuff taken care of and fortunately they are able to do some some school in person here in oklahoma's that's good that's good you know it's it's different everywhere i know but it's crazy it's a it's a crazy time. It all lends itself to empathy empathy for our clients empathy for doctors and the teams This uncertainty of what am i gonna take kids. You know again. The solutions are very muddy. Just having empathy for that in trying to help people find solutions is really the best you can do and that that yeah from a mommy standpoint again i i kind of keep jumping back into leadership but you ha- it really was a matter of maintaining your well. This always says like maintain your well began checking in with people having people that you can't that can't support you that you can talk to that you can brainstorm with and look forward to and think about the what's the what's one thing i can do. Not be beating yourself up when the day just kinda went down the drain doing whatever you can't keep your cupful. And that's that's really what doctors have to do right now to you know. It's exhausting to lead a business on any. It's really exhausting to lead a business the crisis so make your surrounding yourself with positive people giving your mind. Positive information is being grateful for the simple things were surrounded by a lot of negativity right now and it doesn't do you any good. You've got it been more time on the things that helped build yet. Keep you healthy and energetic and focused. Let's rabbit home on that the serious rabbit hole though because this is something. I am really concerned about. There are lots of studies that this loneliness isolation whatever. A lot of people are having. They're having real issues real difficulty with day to day. And all that kinda stuff when you're coaching doctor. And you see this kind of sadness. Despair going on. How do you react to that as an coach. Because i have seen it and before covid i saw. I lost a dear friend to this. It's been something that's sorta shorter mind but at the same time are close to mind but it's hard to spot. How do you spot that in have you. And what do you do all i think. There's there's a responsibility to just listen are in distress more than ever. And we as human beings thrive on connection. And so having the wherewithal to be the one that listens. And i've been put in this position to be a support. You don't have to have the answers sometimes. People aren't looking for answers. They're looking for support and really helping to point them in directions. Of where where. The positivity is even in the distressful times. We have to think about the good things too so what can easily happen for a dental practice owner. For example. the dentists is thinking constantly about everything is going wrong and focusing on that with your team that can be very draining and morale can just take a nosedive so to remember that even as we do need to problem solve in work through the issues we also need to recognize when things go right and that helps ourselves to write you know starting your day ending your day with the things that that went right or the things that are good in your life and helping helping doctors recognize that as well and helping them find solutions and helping them connect the dots and talk through their business struggles. you know. We're not psychologists and we're not air and that can be dangerous as well if there's someone that really is an emotional distress they may need to find a professional. And that's okay what i would hope for any dental leader. That's listening to this. Said that if they are feeling to a point of despair the right thing to do is to reach out and find somebody to help you get healthy and the has resources to and i only that the ada has raised. Nurses is eating gibson. Still working with you know. She's not she's a dear dear friend. I'm anne to get her on. He's she's great. She does a lot of courses on addiction. Yes and that sort of thing. So i might need to get her on here and i'm not trying to go really morbid. But this is probably the most stressful times in dentistry. I think even ever. I mean the recession. Hiv has nothing on this like you had said to reset the mindset piece. I think you'd said that either earlier before we started. It's a it's kind of a battle in our own minds. How do we navigate this in new. It is can just being intentional. Maybe even noticing. When you're red flags in your triggers occur and recognizing what can help you in the reducing. Your stress stress control is an can eliminate it and you. There's no way you could eliminate it right now but to do what you can keep yourself and keep your mind. Healthy surround yourself with people that that can build you up. Turn off the news and positive what writing down a plan ahead being action oriented getting yourself re centered on what your purpose is your vision for your practice. You can start creating a vision. For what next year looks like right now and give him yourself something to work forward to instead of really hovering in this we have to be looking outward and i think the doctors that are doing that they have team members that appreciate it and they can get through it. But there's going to be dips in. It's interesting when you talk about change. There's there's a change curve that a psychologist in the sixties introducing. It was actually introduced dealing with people that were had received the report of a terminal illness but then it has shifted over time to be a study of how people emotionally deal with change in it when they're faced with any type of crisis. It's like this weird like has a big dip in the bottom and it starts with the shock remember. The shock of in happened has shocked. We were an denial of how we're we're like in denial of what this was and then you go into anger and it's also kind of a lot of dealing with loss right before you come up to the other side is depression so if you're in the debt that may be the feelings and emotions that you're dealing with but on the other side of that debt is acceptance in problem solving and fresh air. Fresh air up there you know. So it's it's a total way you fill your lungs with help. I know that that sounds silly. But you feel your lungs with hope and you look around and you realize that this is how you can go whatever direction you want. S yes. i'm glad you were willing to go down that road with me and talk about that. I just feel like it's very important. And i know you see so many yet doesn't talk to so many team members so i was sure you and had experience gonna listen to them be present in lean into that conversation them don't dismiss it. Let them get through those emotions. So that they're logic can return. And you know i'm no psychologist either. My mother studied psychology. And so i had a great mentor in that i have a great mentor in that then also helping them with a plan. You know sometimes we're just stuck as we feel like we've exhausted all of our options. We don't know what else to do. And we're in the muck of our own. Were the one with the with the trek stuck in the muddy ruts and yeah we need somebody to come and look at it and say i can get you out of this or or have. You tried this plan. And let's talk to these people in having those kinds of conversations that it you thinking like you said trees kinda shows you like. It's a crack in the windows. Like oh oh there's there's a light. There's fresh air that i would meeting because i'm just spinning in my in my overwhelm and i can tell you about a month and a half ago. I was in that real death and thank god for the masterminds part of their my dear friends i count them as very dear friends just hearing from them that they were going through similar. I hate to see misery loves company because that's not quite what it was but it was like okay. I only somebody understands. The we talked to our spouses. Houses are wonderful. But we're strong business people. We're entrepreneurs you try shoulder it all on ourselves and even team members the manage. I know there's a lot of managers to listen to this. You guys are running a practice and you're taking off on yourself too so it's okay you know it's okay to to stop raven. Get yourself right again fright. Here's the thing you probably feel this to theresa. If you allow it you can sit in. You can go down your own rabbit hole of what's to come the unknown and or we're in right now can be suffocating if we allow it but if we know recognize okay just i can't go there. What can hit it right so pivot. What can i do right now to feel like i'm making progress. What can do right now to get us one baby step. Even if it's just a baby step closer to something that to what right looks like for us for me and like you said teresa For the office managers for the doctors. The leaders that are just exhausting. Yourself day in and day out. It's also okay this weekend to just turn it off and do something. That's good for you and take that deep breath rest because you can't do any good for anyone. If you are healthy as the best version of yourself that you can be and that goes for parents or business leaders that goes for all of us that we have to give ourselves permission to take care of ourselves so that we can step into our battlezone on monday and it the best that we can. We have listened to this. You just gave me like a whole like like a taste leadership here. And i knew i was going to get this. 'cause i've talked to you before you just always have something good for for me to take away for people who want more of that. I want you guys if you're listening checkout grow because i just know the quality coaching that her firm knowing so many of your coaches and former coaches i know there's quality in the coaching. The leadership is real. 'cause you talk the talk and walk the walk so we talked about the systems being on growl but there's leadership intensive too so they can get kind of this mindset in and then be able to convey to the team. There's that too. We're also going to be as as we get things rolling. We're also going to be implementing regular live in a community sessions where we can gather as mastermind type groups like you have theresa where people can ask their questions. Have jameson team members. There and have other members of the grow community Online as well. And we're gonna every month we're going to be adding more and more and more in a variety of lay's so and really trying to bring this to life as something that helps people in the end be better in the work that they do in our profession. That's that's the goal and that it's accessible to anyone like if you wake up at three in the morning i wanna take leadership class there. It is well and the thing is is if you want your practice better. I don't want you to be limited by your by finances or whatever the case may be time money all those things that could be a limiting factor for you to get the kind of health and coaching. you need. That was another big goal for us is to be accessible to the people that really need it the most. So that's what this is for for people. Their systems their own personal skill sets and their ability to lead from wherever they are the practice clearly. There's a demand. Because every time i see you and kathy and amy amy paris when i see you guys on the road. Your classes are huge. They're like your huge. So there's obviously demand for what you have to say. And what i really love is when we are close there was one. I think it was yankee last year. Where rooms right next to each other so we were able to see each other. 'cause usually at these meetings it's like might see you getting lunch way to get a chance to talk to. That was really nice. How did they find you. I wanna definitely invite you to visit the grow platform. It's grow dot j. s. n. dot com. So it's jameson with with no bowels grow in dot com but then also our main website is simply j. m. s. n. dot com. So you can find both of those places and love to connect with any anyone. That's a friend. And fan. Of theresa is a friend to me. And you have a podcast to the james which sounds like a true crime. Podcast that the title is actually a nod to my father. Dr john jameson is a retired in. It's also used to be on the speaking circuit. And when he was speaking he's retired now in very happily out to pasture when he was a speaking he also had a call him and dental economics called the jameson files where he movers and shakers in trail-blazing dentists at the time. And so i thought it would be a name our podcast. After his his the i love it i did not know that i didn't put that connection together. My goodness and that was when dental economics was in every office imprint. Right now digital's so yeah my goodness so. That's just bringing back so many dental magazines that by boston i and he never read him. He would like wait. And see if i pull something out crammed read but they made such a. Because i'm sure they made such a good foot rest next to my chair. And i know that's not what they wanna hear. I know what it is. What it is. I think thankfully. Now everything is digital's to have we all want to learn so carey is been a pleasure and i wanna have you come back in your baby. You said is two weeks all so when we have another milestone birthday. We're having back on and we'll talk again about this I wanna thank you for being open about some very sensitive topics and for just giving so much of yourself really this up on this knowledge that you dropped on me. I always enjoy it reset. I'm really honored to be with young. Podcast thank you for having me do it again again. Dear listeners always always. i'm so appreciative. Of the time that you spend with me. Thank you world super busy. So thank you for making time for me today. The show notes. We'll have any links that we referenced in this episode you can also find links for my book and for my live events and webinars schedule. I speak often around the country on management and insurance issues. Come hang out with me and one of my classes. I promise you'll laugh and learn

jameson teresa dunkin harry weber jess jeff twelve month Corn letourneau romblon six months theresa kathy jamieson cathy jamieson susan guns jamison three months kerry horton twelve months netflix five minute oklahoma
Special Preview: Cyberwar - Russian Hackers & the 2016 Election

Words Matter

12:10 min | 1 year ago

Special Preview: Cyberwar - Russian Hackers & the 2016 Election

"And. Welcome to words matter with Katie Barlow and Joe Lockhart. Let me begin where the appointment order begins, and that is interference in the two thousand sixteen presidential election. As alleged by the grand jury in an indictment, Russian intelligence officers who were part of the Russian military launched a concerted attack on our political system. The indictment alleges that they use Fistican at cyber techniques to hack into computers and networks used by the Clinton campaign. They stole private information, and then release that information through fake online and identities. And through the organization, Wiki leaks, the releases were designed and timed to interfere with our election, and to damage a presidential candidate. And at the same time as the grand jury alleged in a separate indictment, a private Russian entity engaged in a social media operation where Russian citizens, posed as Americans in order to influence an election, and I will close by reiterating, the central allegation of our indictments that there were multiple. Systematic efforts to interfere in our election. And that allegation deserves the attention of every American. Joe and I are honored to welcome our next guest to the show. Kathleen hall Jamieson is the Elizabeth where Packard professor of communication, at the university of Pennsylvania's Annenberg school for communication, the director of the Annenberg public policy center and program director of the Annenberg retreat at sunny lands professor Jameson has authored or co authored sixteen books and her most recent title is cyber war Howell, Russian hackers and trolls helped elect a president professor Jameson welcome to words matter. They could be with you. Fresher, Jameson, I'm gonna do what some authors hate. But I I'm gonna go like to the back page of the book and start at the back and ask you a simple question did the concerted Russian effort across all fronts, and we'll get into each of the fronts that you talk about in your book. Did it turn the election to push one way or the other, and I'm asking in the context of as a political operative? I've looked at this. Been highly suspicious, but had no data to. So it was an argument between me and my Republican prince, you've actually dug into this the way you have on so many other subjects. How would you answer that question? The answer to the question is that it probably did? But we don't have the evidence to say that it certainly did. And the level of certainty of the various answers differs. So I got the trolls and cyberspace pretending to be us. And the we have a theory of the election underlying their messaging that suggests that they were pretty smart. They were targeting the voters, the Trump need to mobilize de mobilize and shift. They had enough messaging out there. And the messaging was well calibrated it was consistent with Trump's messages. In other words, so they weren't so much supplementing, as they were amplifying, but we don't know is did they reach the right voters in the right swing states. So the case there is if it's a might have been, but we don't really know hackers case much stronger because they're the impact is able to. Seen all over the media Genda, mainstream news. Alternates media gender response to content in particular, when, when you say the hackers you mean, the, the DNC emails, the John Podesta emails, Russian operatives hacked the Democrats, and then released through three front groups, ultimately WikiLeaks is the one that has the greatest impact at in the process at one key moment. If you remember the access Hollywood tape, which introduced new vulgarities into the news, stream and raise questions for reporters, but should we use those words in print, some did some didn't on that day? You had the confirmation from our talent services that the Russians hacked not that they were trying to help Trump or hurt Clinton, just something that they'd have then the access Hollywood tape breaks. And the Washington Post story that accompanied it and within an hour, the pedaza hat content is dropped into the media stream that of itself created a change that was dramatic and you've been a political operative for a long time. Think about the news agenda on that Friday. You've got the Russians did it an access Hollywood going into that weekend that Sunday and those two things happened on fry. That Sunday is the second debate October night. The news agenda would have been dramatically anti-trump the Russians did it. Why did they why did they do it? What do we know what's the disadvantage for, you know, Hillary Clinton what's the advantage for Trump and then? Secondly access Hollywood is his campaign going to survive. We know from the Woodward book, that there was talk, a neighbor publican, high command about the possibility that they would submit try to move Trump off the top of the ticket move. Pat move Condie rice in as VP nominee. It was that serious into that environment what the hat content did was counterbalanced the news narrative, so now there was a problem for Trump and problem for Clinton and the news, reporters largely talked about in tactical terms, what would their campaigns do with the Trump campaign survive? How would Clinton cope not did the Russians do the hacking? We lost the Russians as a result. We lost. The sourcing and change the news agenda, in a way that may have saved the Trump's candidacy, and we lost the moral in character argument that access Hollywood raised, and it became a political tactical argument over, which of these things hurt the candidacy more something that Donald Trump had said, and which reflected his values or something that was hacked by the Russians stolen and dumped on the Democrats in order to hurt Hillary Clinton and helped Donald Trump. It's at one of the questions you ask when you look at just that weekend is had the hat, content not been released. What would the effects have been? Now, you gotta counterfactual basically you're saying, well, what if, but I can tell you happened is the news agenda was different than it, otherwise would have been, and I can tell you, as well as all the other scholars of looked at it that in the intervening days between that lactobacillus seventh first release in the election. The news agenda was tilted against Hillary Clinton in ways. It would not have been had it not been for the red. Regular release of the content some other things they access Hollywood straight pretty much disappeared from news. But that regular release kept it in public awareness. So there's an effect there and changes in media gender change. What we think about when we vote, people think when they think about voting, they're thinking about everything, but they're not they're thinking about a limited number of considerations. And if I can make one more salient, and it hurts Hillary Clinton. I the likelihood that's there when you think about voting and remember in this election, three things were true. We had more independence than usual. That means they're less anchor departy. We had high disaffection with both candidates. That means if you can increase the negatives about one, you're giving it default vote base coming to vote against that person, even though I don't like them both and as a result coming into election day, we had a high number of undecided in those last weeks in which all that Russian continents, making some difference in news. So higher likelihood, we could actually persuade people. And then in that environment, we have early voting, which means a cross that month forty five million ballots cast while those. Streams are in their potentially influencing. Did that make a difference? More than probably you're now moving toward, it's getting pretty likely. And then finally, you've got the possibility that, James, combing made public his decision by telling congress that he was reopening, the Clinton Email investigation, because there may have been Russian disinformation, sitting in the background that he was afraid would be released and would discredit the Justice department, and because he thought Hillary Clinton was going to be elected might discredit her as president may ask one other broad question, which, I think you've answered a little bit. But I wanna put it in turn it over to Katie. What was it about two thousand sixteen that made the cyber attacks on the Russian attacks, so effective, we know that other countries have attacked our system. Have it tried to interfere before, but I'm not aware of time where that interference was so effective and so pervasive, what was it about what was going on here at home that made this once? Such a difference maker. The Russians got lucky the highly polarized environment. Lots of divisions already played. They didn't create them. They exploited them. And when you exploited those divisions and you increase the sense that we're at odds against each other that anxiety works against the incumbent party in the incumbent party's era, parent, Hillary Clinton. So some people argue, well, the Russians were just tried to so discord for much of this, and they were for much of this trying to so discord, but whose advantaged and disadvantaged by the sewing of discord is a really important question my assumption is, it's the incumbent party. Why were they able to do what they were able to do? The platforms were sitting ducks the platforms weren't set up to handle political content. They were set up to sell us to advertisers, and as a result, they aggregate, like-minded people in groups in which you can amplify content. Really readily. We know negative content shares more rapidly. It's also more persuasive. And that's why we see so much more attack than we see per dollar spent politics. Oh, we also know that they had targeting capacities that were set up. Help advertisers, reach us, that didn't require that, you know, a lot about how to reach electric. I wanna go back to Joe's original point and touch on one thing from the book before before we let you go. We know you say in the book, we can't know for certain if the cyber war changed the outcome of the two thousand sixteen election, but what about who did it, can we be certain about how high up this went within the Russian government those two different questions. I think one of the things it's interesting talking about levels of certainty as most of our life. We make most of our decisions based on far less than certain evidence. So right now, what we have is confirmation from our intelligence agencies, that the Russians did it, and there's no dissent inside our intelligence agencies. Secondly, we have the platforms tracking this material back to Russian, computer. So there's a second independent form of corroboration and third. You have Pulitzer hungry reporters who, if it wasn't Russia probably would have figured that out by now. And as a result would have told us that my presumption. Yes, Russia, did it Roger stone to the contrary. But we do not with that same level of confirmation, certainty know that Putin personally directed it. There's an inferences says given the way Russia operates the likelihood that this was approved at the top, and that it could not have happened were it not is what we're dealing with. I'm perfectly comfortable saying it's highly likely that Putin approved of this, but there's a difference in levels earning. What I put at the beginning of the book where some quotes include some quotes from flat brand Putin. I think he's having a lot of fun with us. He's hinted broadly that the Russians actually did it even as he's denied it. He suggested at one point, and I love this moment because a reporter asked two part question at Putin in the answer to the question might have been answering one part might have been answering the other part depending. What you think he was answering that quick, depending on whether you thinking understands English. In other words, the English the question we know he's answering both of them either admitted that they were deliberately. Trying to do this in order to elect Donald Trump or he didn't admit that, at that point. So the question becomes listening to flatter. My Putin, who's a KGB agent when do you trust him? Wendy, Wendy, you not. And it's a little like doing three dimensional puzzle. My assumption is there's very little Vladimir Putin in public that said that he hasn't thought out carefully. And I think he's got somewhat amount to confessions in the public record that say, yeah. I knew. Yeah. I did it. Yeah, I got away with it. Thank you for listening to words matter. Please rate and review words matter on apple podcasts and other Todd cast providers.

Hillary Clinton Donald Trump Hollywood Vladimir Putin Trump professor Jameson Joe Lockhart reporter Russia Katie Barlow Kathleen hall Jamieson president Russian government Fistican Washington Post Packard professor of communica university of Pennsylvania
#160  Emmure

DJ Force X in Conversation

26:07 min | 7 months ago

#160 Emmure

"They. ARE WELCOME TO DJ force ten in, conversation. Episode One, hundred and sixty, and my very special guest today show is frank from the band Imola. They are about to release a brand new album on shop tone records on Friday. And it's great. I'm really enjoying it is you've got to get a preview copy to listen to and Yeah I've been. Listening to it quite solidly since the could hindsight. Aleka said it is out on Friday but D- check out if you've been found the bind. Then you'll love it and if anyone. In. Any way kind of. Curious about it, they've got four songs out now. Uncontrollable descent pigs. Gypsy disco and I've seen got four tracks from the album that really does give you a great kind of taste of the whole thing and Yeah. No, it was a great chats with Frank. Up In a lot of my sopa carbon, a fan of the band for a while and it, it just falls into place that got promotions going on and of lockdown and stuff like that speaking of down this kind of signals. Well, this is the one after myself down Ron surprise because he's not come out on that Monday But yeah, over the quarantine season allowed to call it. I'm a recorded and released fifty five podcasts, which is outside. Fantastic includes my first ever live video poker started with Mike Amazing. So big child to them and shed universe back open. Now ever in jazzy say if you're ever in the States Union code cost and you haven't got the equipment, they're great place to happen and get rid. Of have my interviews featured on sites like Blabbermouth, which is given mass exposure to the podcast while Cy bigshots the people by mouth twelve keeping an eye on actually listing through interviews and obviously picking out bits of news that they can. They can share with the. With whoever subscribes to them lamb of God's I'm featured on their pop evil's into you on there before the lockdown simple Torah actually that one got massive hits on Miam- Youtube. Channel. By gained as far as I can see, stats over fifteen hundred listeners to on various platforms. So thank you and welcome if you're still sticking around is awesome the streams have gone up like five hundred percent or something downloads up two hundred percent all these statistics have been absolutely mannequin is Finally, starting my DJ series, which I've been wanting to do for a while and we just had. On Friday trying to line up this Friday's one at the moment and Yeah that's going well on that front I've crossed off a few of my one to interview list which has also been amazing Amaz time of taking full advantage of them behind but. The fact that they actually wanted to talk to me for over ten minutes or twenty minutes or even like a full hour and a half some of them was absolutely amazing. Spoke to many people around the world as well. I think I tie it up like eleven or twelve different countries talk more on mental health subjects as well which is. An aim of mine I had. and. That's that's that came to fruition with the did kind of really especially this time it's very tough on everyone and he came easier than it would normally. Yeah I that's that's on hundred four episodes or sorry episode hundred and four started, which was don Jamieson, and almost from there we add on I'm not going to allow all the names but also a big shout out online to everyone on there. Just like looking at it fifty five episodes absolute madness especially over the space of three months and and their long interviews as well. They're not not really sure I'm in the shortest one of did was. I think it was twelve minutes and that was just a straight up primary shop but most of them have been at least half an hour plus long. and. Yes it's been absolutely amazing. Thank everyone for downloading and. Listening in an. Letting, me be a part of your lockdown experience. What does the future hold a here? You say one, eight I but the poku will continue to say. It's just going to be not as frequent probably once or twice a week. And then DJ specials Once I've got those interviews done and. Yeah I mean ask for the radio show that's being replaced with crossing the streams some bringing that back some back into mix music. So I've been doing now of like in my spare time just brushing up on the mixing. Intends to the Bisi live mixes or I should say record live mixes Alan They are on Sunday six PM on total stop the fifth January July. Got These dates Roy. Is Madness. My brain is all over the place right now But yeah, I just want to give a like a love ends and thanks to everyone that's a really and Yeah dipping Shyla online. Kind of talking everything up and whatnot. But for now, I'm going to give you frank from IMO. Enjoy. took. Shug today I have a very special guest. I have frank from the band Moore welcome Frank. How're you doing man? Alive Buddy hey life. Just about. Back, at work and I'm absolutely. Crazy out there. So I'm so yeah, we hit took about your. New Album today as good hindsight. Is. Out On the twenty sixth of June. For shop type. And Yeah, I've heard I've actually heard the album. And I really really like it. And so yeah, I mean from the singles how this is just for the people that haven't had that was like A. Good like sampler of the album. I. Hope. So I mean obviously the intention rumors aren't to pick out singles for people here we want people to get excited about the record hopefully the things that were able to kind of give it a little sleepy go get people excited enough check out the entire thing when all of a sudden done so. Yeah I. Mean they're the record is so many different like feelings and like ideas on it, it's not any song is comparable to the other. Every single tracking I think is kind of stand out it has its own personality so. Yeah I mean. If people enjoy any thing that happens and another might be something else in the record that they will take away from but yeah, I don't know it's a stall. Angle you know say litter yeah not definitely. I mean like I said I've I've heard the entire album. Just through getting a stream of a sampler and. I just I like I love like I'm the of light new met layer like when I was. So myself late teens early twenties that was when that was huge. Cone Biscuit. Abandoned that on death tines, things like that you seem to cover those stars is that the same va? Well. Yeah I am a fan of those dance. You mentioned You know I pull influence from all different kinds of places I think that. Definitely, I definitely pulled from a major illnesses like you know like you mentioned like Korn, limp biscuit and stuff, and there's just so many other bands that. you know fall into that fold of a inspiration. So if you mirror somehow like a reflection of that era or those bands and Exeter compliment yeah, the nine th say date this album particularly just like a south that listening to it and I was like. Yeah this this hardly kind of took me back to the era when when it was like sort of like. Full By in the beginning of the era, if you will and you, you catch it that real kind of like. By anger that it had. As well of C- with your. Perspective on it. Test about a couple of the songs because it was a couple reading job at the opening track. Is The acronym is fun? Song name in front of me, which is really bad. But no I fucking because it had. Its Dj scratching in it and stuff like that, which is something that I'm Italian tablist I. It, really fly the opening track jumped at me. Finally, understanding nothing that we found it. Now. She's wearing what like starring like like that. So of element into their like so was that did you get dj in or was more so so stuff? Oh. No no, that's that's that's a process. A thing. That might my. Producer drew a Nassar when it comes to like adding those kind of like extra layers in lead lead instruments and kind of like taking into that space. Um. So that's all he is doing Yeah. It's definitely an afterthought. We're just kind of like building the songs as we go along and then we feel like someone would make sense there. But now there's no DJ in the band. So unfortunately, we don't have any who wants to perform. Ours I kind of figure that was the that was the case but just like that. So violent in Kazaa back in the. New by myself in the UK and I was the DJ in that bands I. Kind of kind of in stop bracket, and I always have an affinity for bands are the US that kind of sound or how even have a DJ. And that which is very rare. These days have a DJ ranks. Will now you gotTa send me a youtube link or something you're don't care. Worry I'll send it to you. Yeah couple of couplets often now, we got a couple of albums out back in. Two Thousand and stuff so. If you. We'll find out. But now just like there's a couple of tracks I, think thunder. Thunder now sorry was another one of my favorites. Which is made me run in the album. Cover seventy different styles with it as well. unless I each song kind of stands out as its own. Entity was that was that a predetermined kind of thing when you came to sort of like putting together an album that you want to eat song iron fail rather than the sort of like not so much a concept but by concert running through the whole thing. Just, having I each song having A. Personality I guess. Yeah Yeah I mean I I mean I'm personally just a fan of that myself. You know. I. Like Poon on now of woman. It's like it's fucking journey. You know what I'm saying like every song is a different place. So there's definitely that kind of conscious decision that like. We're running a bunch of songs but like. If I. Hear Two songs at like sound too familiar to Kinda give me too much of the same failing. I'll just pick the one of the two I. Think is better. All right well, like this song Julie Cool, but this song sounds too much like this song. So scoreless other track you. WanNa be already have like this. Base Four. So yeah, I don't want I. Don't want people to put an album on and then feel like. Track a dare like like what song is this? Really follow along every every Song Judy I know exactly what this is the moment you know it starts up you know. So I mean not not to say that like the other people are attempting the same thing but I just I think an aggressive music. Become sort like this. Like vague like cloud of sound while you don't even know what track is what? So I don't want that to ever feeling goes your album. Yeah. Mean You keep the songs like. While which is another thing on nights he's like before I sort of like was getting into a kind of ended. But that was that another predetermining because obviously allowance kind of aim for that kind of like. Being in a musician is different for each track. Some people I can for like three and a half minutes four minutes five minutes I. Mean You guys like you keeping it. So tight I think the longest track you've got like three and a half minutes. Yeah and then you've got a couple of make a one that's even a minute just ever minute long as well. How many I think we'll come go Boston Rachel that was it. But. What? Was that look another? You just wanted to kind of like straight to the point Robinson. Structure in in such a way that way you extend it. I mean, I don't really really understand like the cost of of. Trying to take something to stretch it out for the sake of like adding just adding more time to something I. Don't think that adding time to something makes us on better I think that. Generally. As, long than ideas accomplished and feeling has been successful lead gotten across the song is done. That's just my approach in general You know you can listen to bands like minor threat. Early hardcore bands, punk bands and their songs all pretty much end of the two minute mark and so it's all about just kind of getting out the idea. The aggression, the feeling, and a having the fans decide whether or not. They're gonNA replay. What I'm saying I'm really worry about too much like about it not being disliked that link whatever and it's funny. Then I've had this conversation way more often recently. or that has been more of a topic. People discussed the new material and I find it fascinating because it's it seems to be only in like the hardcore metal realm or like aggressive music round where people even have that kind of comment. But like you look at a song like fifty million with the rapper. Sex Yep. So he has a song, Cope? Anini the song is a be. At most two minutes and ten seconds long but you don't see anyone talking about why song longer is this? How come to his I've no one ever. Offers. So I don't know what it is about aggressive music that people have this. Weird. Like. It's almost like people are looking for something to criticize about it or analyze and people think it's too short. I consider that to be a good thing that just means that you heard something that you wish you could have more of and not necessarily a bad thing. So. So, that's just my approach in general I don't really care about other people's. Expectations of what a song should or shouldn't be as long as I think the emotion has been successfully achieved and the energy has been delivered than the song is done. You know yeah. No I totally agree I mean. I'm from the Soviet hardcore background as well. That was a big SOPO myself like teenage if you will and. Say I like that kind of straight to the point there's a lot of songs can listen to that kind of have that. They wonder around the point of it was he united Stretch out extend the hook if you will but now with your. Are. In there and it makes you wanNA play again. That's what he does. Like a hero track on getting into it, and then obviously it's finished, but I just hit replay. And I've I've had. Quite, a few times since I've got say it's during the trick. Yeah Yeah for sure I mean that part is in to like premeditated. It's not like I'm like I I you know we albums go. Oh Yeah. People are going to replay that it's more just like we just make it and we listen to it and fulfills good to listen to. Then we keep moving village article next song not even like. I felt really good. But like there should be more like Nali, felt good to listen to that and adding, and usually when we add more to it or he tried to inject things into it, it starts to take away from of actual feeling that we initially had so. In my opinion sometimes less is more. I think that. The reason we get away with that is. Generally because I don't have any again reservations about making something new shorter I don't it doesn't bother me at all on a creative level. I think that maybe like A. Like A. An an average musician or guitar player or anybody like that would be like. A hundred more ideas it's like, yeah but that one idea is the best idea. That's the best one. So let's just do that and I'm a big believer in having that line so. Cool across. Nice. Get to hear. What have you found lost a few musicians this behalf you found like promoting an album during this time because a lot of people like pie by in things and some people have kept it going. But what were you kinda done during this time to sort of keep the momentum up if you will. Is a band we need music were entertainment. You know like that's our thing. We we're not gonNA ever deviate from that. Yeah. So it's not like anything that happens in the world is GonNa make us adjusts our business model, which again is to entertain people create something that fans can enjoy. and give some give some noise or some you know some distraction or whenever we describe it as to the world as it is you know which is. The best part about music is were offering escape in a way. Yup. So yeah I mean, I know obviously, the world is kind of like. In this sensitive place right now, and we're all dealing with all kinds of. Health issues, social issues, shit going on but. You know to be steadfast and all of that is important thing. So for a mirror as an entity, we're just still doing what we've been doing you know. Obviously check change of plans. We can't be on the road and stuff. So since we can't do that, we're just GONNA continue to you know. Adapt to the situation we're doing now that's why I realized the. I've always maintained the that when when, when I was in abandoning I've always maintained like that mentality that I'm an entertainer. And the as choose like you Kinda, get stuck with. You. Guys were point where you have a big song and you constantly have to play that. Big. Song. This over remind myself I had to sort of like we had a song ever wanted to hear every time. We got bored of absolute at Fuck. Alvin but. Once, you play is not for us. Is when you plant show applying to these other people, you're entertaining them, you'll the entertainment and then that that's why like A. Starting hear enough of that in the music industry. I know is an art form Bray and people express their and sometimes. You get back kind of like you want to express your new you want to be as popular as you're up. But, sometimes, it just doesn't happen. You always go back to the classics. The. Law Bans. You had that through that point and. Like I say I've always kind of maintain that kind of like whenever against that mindset it's like. I'm an entertainer and that's what they want to hear. It's not here necessarily to hear. I want them to hear make sense. Yeah I mean there there's always that kind of like a attitude we had to have where here you're you're you're offering a service? Yeah. Like in these people, they're paying money to get that level of joy -ment that they expect from you and if his hearing it's hearing that one song discography, you'd better play. You can play your other ten songs that you want to play. But you know why people are there. You'd better given that one thing you know so. It's a, it's a it's kind of like a blessing to to have any success like that. If you have one grand song, you know you're if you're a one hit wonder band go player other twenty songs and no one likes but then you make sure you play that one song. As long as you play that one song. Everyone's GonNa leave. Happy. So yeah I mean to me I think as a net positive. You know if if people are only drawn to one particular album, that's fine. Come. See US live. You're probably going to hear one of those songs and that's what's good about. Having a discography. Your has that we'd be decided any point like Irish and a focus on these. You know this section of our discography for now or play these songs or whatever and. You know you're always GonNa get people who are like all. You didn't get to that one song I like but like. You know obviously, it's like you gotta understand that truly matter what you're not going to please everybody. But if you have a way to somehow get everyone excited about one point of the set, you know one song then I guess around positive as long as people are stoked and that's all that really matters and I don't know if I don't know if I've extrapolating too far the concept. As Fine Take the same mentality 'cause ITT clubs here in the UK site. There's certain points. In the night, I can get away replying new stuff. People haven't heard yet or you know stuff I want to kind of out there. But then later on once people who had a few drinks and they want they want the classics they want and to sign and they want disturbed they want. They won't call and they want them biscuit all from twenty years ago now. Music is a music is very much a time and place and everyone attached to it in that way where when you hear something until they bring you back particular place in feeling. Give you an emotion that you can't get any other way except reentering that space you know. Music. So it's only I'm I'm a fan too. So I. Understand the whole Salmon Tally. Yeah. Yeah. Well couple of questions left for you frank. And then I'll let you the rest of. These of my generic. So questions if you will by ask everyone this in that sense, but I wanna find out your most your three mice, pivotal albums that have shaped the person or the the musician that you are today. So the one that kind of makes you want to pick up a mark, find the you WanNa make. Music. Those if you can narrow down while those three albums. That would be limb biscuit through our billy. All Nice. Hey, breed satisfaction is a deaf desire. And then the last one would probably be. An easy answer speech you eichhorn s last one I would say those three albums. Or like the headstones of A. Everything I've ever done if saw. The. Those those are nature. The the. Hype rate for one. In the choices, which is a love hate breed. Big Fan of his liberties of the three dollar bill that that's another one because this is like I I know. Everyone on the chocolate starfish so Significant other that they did and and no one like at a lot of people look at first album. But he's got some great tracks on that. I mean, I guess to be a masterpiece. Great. Yeah and then life speech by Cohen. A great album. I love corn Way Back in ninety six I think it was in England. Early, on when they had their first album out and stuff, it was great. is an absolute fucking great album or Sir I'm finally man what your hobbies away from music. So when you doing things when Ryan producing, what what kind of what do you do still get away from it? I, mean there's not really very extreme of my lifestyle. On used to form, writing or listening to music and reading or doing something that. You know he's my brain occupied pretty much I was. Trying to experiment with new hobbies like I was getting into a training white cake bulk ever since the pan. Had No chance strain so. that was gonNA. Bomb out. But yeah, I mean life is not too different just a key myself preoccupied and try to stay creative and constantly right and just kind of get myself prepared for. whatever the future may hold you know. Okay. No that's absolutely fine man. That's okay. Well, thank you for your time. I really appreciate do really appreciate because Alex is a fine and. I'm really like this. This new album is great I'm going to pick up when it comes out. So I actually have it rather than streaming it. Thank you know I really enjoy? Thank you very much. I'm going to be planning on my club as well once everything happens. There's a couple of tracks on there that will definitely get people down since I which is why I always look for. Going to be. In Good luck with it. Thank you. Yeah. No ours you have a good. Luck I said thank you and good luck. Thanks but.

Frank UK US States Union Mike Amazing Imola Aleka don Jamieson Ron Blabbermouth DJ Cy bigshots Boston Producer Shyla Bisi Korn Exeter Kazaa
Jay and Silent Bob's New Game - Kinda Funny Games Daily 07.12.19

Kinda Funny Games Daily

1:04:31 hr | 1 year ago

Jay and Silent Bob's New Game - Kinda Funny Games Daily 07.12.19

"What's up everybody? Welcome to kind of Funny Games daily for Friday July twelve twenty nineteen. I'm one of her hosts Greg Miller alongside alongside Justin Woodward creative director in Tara Bang Bobbin not much problem with you. Everything's gravy yeah. We've so much talk about Justin. Because of course you're wearing the hat you run mix rock in the media indy exchange media. I always I always when I was called the indie mix which is the thing I talk about a game show totally. Do we had a whole bunch of games there any three you do. The thing are going to be my favorite event of course because it's coming up yeah yeah no no big deal. Here's it's getting around doing anything but that's not what you're here for today. Instead you're here because you're all you are a video game developer. You just run this. Where do you work? What do you run? What is so? I am the Creative Director C._E._O.. Of Interior Being Entertainment <hes> we've been currently working on a game called chronic punch yeah we morgan on that situation for minute. We <hes> it's been great. It's been an amazing experience like Kevin. Smith and Jason Mewes have been amazed chronic and blunt man right <hes>. It's chronic point. We're going to have some reveals in the game okay but yeah that's the whole they are words smash people in the face. It's a it's a beat them up. Versus Capcom meets final fi share juggling all these different kind of COMBOS. It's like is a hand-drawn animation and stuff so it's very much a labor of love and you've been working on that for a while. This isn't it up <music> when I want to video barrel ask for the radio. This is bad as Kevin out understanding email today. It's not that sucks. That's going to segue though so that's the thing is to me. You're here because you've announced yet another other video game so we can't talk too much about it okay but we have an amazing reveal happening pretty soon. We want to reward all the people who've been following us all the people who contributed to our fate campaign which is our crowdfunding campaign sure because for so long and we want to give them something another labor of love so we're going to be I mean this is I mean think bloodstain shh you got some cool stuff coming up so this is like a short little reveal of mall brawl and yeah we got some popping off bear. Show me show me this show me the review what is Kevin do and see here to try to defend the email steph. No L. Crash for some reason. Okay that's fine. Can we play the video for the people I always tell them. If the live thing goes down who cares keep going. This is the trailer we revealed today. Can we take me a offscreen. We don't need to be on the fourth area. Good movie saw good use the movies so there it is James on the Bob Mall brawl teaser trailer the teaser yeah. When did they get the full trailer? Get the full trailer next next week. Okay and we're going to be announcing some really cool stuff when it comes to that so the way is what you just described of course. How long have you been working on the other one so we started we connect so trevor firm and he was a character in clerks? Two you know and I remember good movie. Yeah Lord of the Rings Yeah that's that's the same character and we connected and then he he was working with us on developing the design idea behind chronic blunt panch and then we connected with Kevin. It's green light yeah. Let's get this thing pop in and then I like to say poverty line. Don't worry about that. Yes one hundred percent one hundred zero so we got going and we're like we need to figure out a way to fund this because Kevin was like look. I don't know too much about video games sure I know the movie industry. We're going to let you have the license. Do you want with it and raise the funds however you want so we ended up raising it through a crowd funding platform the thing yeah how long is this. I remember it hasn't he was in two thousand sixteen. We started spend a minute yeah so we we developed a game called super common actually that's that's going limited run today. <hes> version is is going up <hes> for P._S.. Four but anyway we were developing MAG game for P._S.. Four and Xbox one and then at that time we were prepping for the Jay and silent Bob game so we were doing all the back end design work <hes> for that game while we're doing that and then I was working at a so we were working at a double fine. This is like a long story but you know it gets even more deep in there because we've known each other for years. We were doing Super Combo man. You were doing that out of Aegean when I did that. What do they call it? I wasn't incubator but like in the house indio exactly so that's how we met in the incubator and it was like four of us drove up with all our shit from sandy and gist <hes> four of us yeah we rented a place in Emoryville and we were all there working like crazy hours and going Aegean every day you know just rocking out <hes> development of it so we like we gotta deal with Adult Swim Games kind of went from there and then we just kept kept everything just kept going on the up and up right. There's always like ups and downs and that's where I created the indie mix because at that point we were having we're having issues getting visibility and sure so hard to showcase game so that kind of came out of that which is a blessing I met so many people but then you know so we develop we were developed developing it there. We launched with adult Swim Games. It didn't do so hot and then we got another deal another publishing pushing deal and at that time we were working at a double fine so we worked at a double fine Tim Schafer what a piece of garbage yeah yeah such an asshole Hughes fucking cool like in we we're in that space for three years to and it was like so amazing so out out of that space. That's where we were finishing up the P._S.. Four xbox one versions of Superman some other projects running the media and the exchange and then we're really ramping up for this chronic blunt change sound Bob Jamieson Bob chronic blunt punch and that all came about really randomly it was actually you know buddy. Oh Yeah yes so buddy was at L. and we met met each other and then when that kind of collapsed he went to warner brothers and he's like Yo. I got this friend that wants to make this game and it was trevor and he's like can I introduce you and he was like yeah so he hit me up. He's like I was like Oh yeah. I'll give him advice sure he's like yeah. I got this thing or whatever and I'm thinking of making you WanNa meet. I'm in Berkeley and I live in that area and so we met and it was like you know trevor from <hes> I can't remember right now his name in clerks to Elias Yeah a young guy right history phillipines Berkeley Shit really and he he's friends with Kevin and he was like he asked him a long time ago. During that clerks to air maybe two thousand nine two thousand ten like AAC we make. Can I make a game out of your thing so he said yeah sure that's how I like so really re- that's awesome. The ratios how it works right video games just know people and then I know knew for years we did the you know the showcase at at e three really cool and yeah. That's just how how things work but also how it worked was in at double fine I met the C._E._O.. Of Dove Line which is Justin and Justin was he was starting this company called fig and so it was really really interesting thing <hes> where they they took investment and you know pledges all point of it right where kickstarter years giving someone or patriots give somebody the money they do it and they build a business whereas fig lets you if you get to a certain level right become an investor. Were you start getting percentage points yeah exactly so you can you could pledge just for rewards or you can pledge as an investor <hes> but unfortunately we were kind of like early on project share and so it wasn't fully developed at that time so we weren't able all to collect all of the funding that we needed for the yeah because we we wanted to kind of do it on our own without a publisher at that point yeah and so took the money and ran you said money's the fans were ripping you off no but we know we worked really really diligently very hard on the on the project and it's like I mean everything looks just really amazing and we take pride in the game play mechanics and the artwork like I said it's all what starts off hand drawn from you know that kind of are like pen and paper takes time it takes a lot of effort and so like during that time it was just a little bit difficult because we weren't able to collect on the those investment unsure funds so we were like after that I mean was cool because they they actually find it out of pocket as much as they could of that and then we are just bootstrapping from then on so like folks. Don't really quite grasp that as we're you know developing their like what the fuck is it takes a long what's happening gaming ever coming out but we it is coming out eventually right yeah hell yeah. We're constantly posting to every week. We have an update of the animation and like what were the design is going and we'll do we do bi monthly updates for backers in that kind of thing but like so we have these opportunities <hes> and Marlborough will be another opportunity for folks to jump in this is the bloodstain <hes> allegory rider comparison the ritual the night took so long eventually inti creates came in it was like here's this other blood-stained games so it's kind of yeah exactly that yeah bloodstain was. I think they're they're kickstart was two thousand fifteen right now. They're releasing twenty nine thousand nine hundred and they raised a shit ton of money. Yeah we raised like a sport like a small fraction of the money and we're still grinding on it so it just Kinda goes to show and hopefully like fans will love this our updates and like the thing that we have the mall brawl with. We're GONNA be announcing and what we're going to be doing that. Well sure yeah you know. I'm a huge Kevin. Smith Fan View Ski Fan obviously grew up that way so obviously when you guys announced <hes> Jason Bob Chronic blunt shows like all right cool that sounds awesome seeing this like clearly any eight bit inspired right the thing of them walking through Eden Prairie Mall beaten up these fight movie there right like you already see where it's going to go in terms of all the classic Kevin Smith stuff you stuff we're going to be there better be better recent fighting. You know what I mean like. Oh yeah yeah yeah so. We'll like just to show you like so <hes> chronic blunt punches is basically contemporary share and this this other Paul is going to be going back. See that's what I like and that's where it'll it'll have a lot of referential treatment you know as far as like going back to the old man. I'm like I mean that's why we're doing this like I love. I love Kevin's movies. I love the cast and like I when I was so when we started in San Diego I was grinding out of my apartment starting the business and we're just doing in a mobile games or whatever <unk> asleep on the floor and shit and I remember how we were going through a really rough time and I would watch a watch Jay. Bob Strikes back yeah every day. When I was down I would tell you so like all the things I would watch those movies and it was just Kinda? Give me upper upper got such a high off of it yeah yeah it was just like boosts me up so I really resin those really resonated and also like the whole indie factor of yeah. We're doing this because we love it and we're doing this like you know from our heart one hundred percent yeah <hes> before we get of course into the news of the day I do have one question for patriots dot com slash Kinda Funny Games Ames where Magnus Apeland wrote in and said hey there. I was wondering if Jay and silent Bob Chronic Blunt Punch will make its way to the Nintendo switch parentheses and that the FIG backers could change their P._c.. Code for this P._S.. View Askew and review it'd be nice. Thanks for the content Magnus Dennis yes. I'm looking at the Ground Shit Magnus no soul no so yeah for sure. We're we're working on our Nintendo. We're we are. We'll be having kids for Nintendo switch so we will be releasing on that. <hes> I'll say that now I don't know how the everything will work as far as like trading that in <hes> just because like the the logistics of that but we will have like an upgrade your pledge in those kind of things and we'll be announcing more stuff like that <hes> I mean of that nature <hes> next week as well. Oh really okay cool so next week is a big <hes> update on everything the release date for her chronic push the not yet what are you targeting is. It just isn't it when it's done situation. I mean at this point. It's so we're I will just say this. We are going to be opening up a slacker backer. You know which is like <hes> anyone who missed the original campaign never did that at all. They wanted to just make sure that we were moving in the right direction and work with what we have so we'll we will be doing that next week and when we have that we'll have you know we're. We're trying to figure out like how this is going to move forward because like I said we're bootstrapping sure at this point so we need to figure out like it just takes a little bit longer. You don't have a huge publisher that kind of when you have to do all yourself sure fewer resources. I understand that well <hes> yeah. That's right independent true exactly. I'm all brought more information next week kamikaze next week. That's interesting but lazy German. Let's talk about other stuff like what's going on with V._R.. And the future split tuned wound being sunset in the fortnight numbers because this is kind of funny games daily each and every week Dan a variety of platforms we run you through the nerdy video game news need to know about if you like that you can be part of the show Patriot dot com slash trying to funny games with your questions comments it's concerns and everything else under the video game son then tune in to watch us record it live with everything works on twitch dot TV slash kind of funny games if you're watching live you've a special job. Go to Kinda funny dot com slash your wrong. It tells what we screw up as we screwed up so we can set the record straight for everybody watching later on youtube dot com slash kind of funny Games Rooster Teeth Dot Com and listening to podcasts ever since around the globe housekeeping for you. Thank you are patriotic producers Coton Yoder blackjack Mohammed Mohammed today. We're brought to you by hymns but I'll tell you about that later. For now. Let's begin the show with what is and forever will be the rope reports it did it. Did it did it for a dozen. I guess five if you count the fact there's a new stories. Kevin doesn't know how to use email number. A facebook exact says you ain't seen nothing yet when it comes to V._R.. This is David Dini over at Upload V._R.. Head of V._R. and A._R. Design at Facebook John Lack stated on twitter that oculus quest is quote in the end of our first Chapter V._R. and that quote what's next is where things get really interesting. The full tweet reads like this from John Lax again. I appreciate Fred Wilson's measure. Take on building technology over the long haul. Quest is the end of our first chapter of V._R.. What's next is where things get really interesting? Lacks is tweet was liked by two other high level facebook. execs Andrew Andrew boss worth the V._p.. Of A._R. V._R.. And Maria Fernandez Zardo head of Enterprise A._R. V._R.. FACEBOOK considers the quest go rift and rift s to all be first generation V._R.. Headsets the recently released quest is not considered to be a new generation rather it simply brings the first generation experience to a standalone factor. The company has regularly showed glimpses of its research towards next generation V._R.. Carr's jobs listing for reference working on our next generation consumer product platforms that will provide breakthrough simulated reality user experiences Justin. What is the current revere? You're you're out there. You're developing yourself. You run in the mix. You're at their present flesh talking about these etfs what pressing the flesh handshakes yeah sounds hugs hugs all. I'm still in the present flush part. Don't rush me to the babies. What what is the temperature right right now I think I think it's hot right now? I think yeah I mean there. It's a weird it's a it's a weird space to be in if you're a developer because <hes> with V._R.. There's not a huge audience as far as making the money and I think that's why you don't see triple A.. Companies going in and making these amazing you know comparatively right such a small user base for P._C.. So what what how it helps developers in the spaces that like they're looking for Oculus is look environment and all these companies Samsung they're looking for really cool content so they're willing to shell out a bunch of money to the developers which will help them get to their next project or have something in the pipeline so they could keep eating and <hes> and they're also you know making really cool content really cool games and also helping to build their experience as well so it is very helpful <hes> within <hes> <hes> what is it called like just in the industry and container smaller developers right yeah exactly and and so I think with the the go I have oculus go okay. I'm saying like <hes> oculus goes. I think is great like I'm. It's one of those. Let me show it to my uncle to my you know my mom or my girlfriend. Whatnot check out this V._R.? Checkout Jurassic Park check out this porn or something like that Shit in there. I mean that is definitely. I mean it'll be something that moves it for for definitely a porn machine but like if you look at the the quest it like the capacity for what it can do. It's not as you know. It's not as powerful as the visor or the OCULUS. What does it matter? That's right. We always talk about on this show and like it. It is good enough. It's successful because it was good enough not expensive. The quest is the one where I put it on and yeah sure I know the rift ESA rift or whatever the hell is going to be like weighs yeah it's going to be amazing and way mobile but like having that quest on having no nothing heather's yeah and it's like so fucking light yeah and going around and having that experience Real Chris Yeah. It's like the right direction and people are like when they you try that I was like Oh shit. This is real this is this is a good experience for sure like I you know I do a lot of stuff with playstation V._R.. Because that's my you know what I know and what I love and so I've always used quest or used a five in streams or Demos Camila alright. It's cool not cool enough that I would ever like want this at home when we when I did quest the first time at G._D._p.. Right before I came to the mix I left there like I've seen God where I was like. I want this. I need this right as soon as they got review units and I got it and brought it home. I was challenge about it making her try. It and it's like you see that over and over again now with people getting it on the sub read at every day it seems like more and more people are jumping in with quest and showing their spaces and just the ability to play anywhere in draw the boundaries anywhere and I you know our friend job who worked to tell you probably the his instagram is full of him playing on beaches and out in these giant parks in like yeah vader immortal and beat sabre and all these amazing games that are happening. It's for them to say publicly that that's the end of wave one. I hadn't even thought about it in terms of like how what are we talking about the you know ongoing V._r.. Technology and how fast it's going but for them to be like none of that's the that's that's still jen one like we see what you're about to get like fuck yeah. I can't wait to see I totally the <hes>. I believe him when I think there's a lot of people who you know are doubting where things are going but I think they're exactly they. They hit the nail on the head ever gets mainstream enough where people are making money on it when they have the like my whole thing is you have have to combine A._R.. And V._R.. Together and be able to flip the switch and when they have that it's just going to be totally mainstream when it's like on some like blackbeard's ship but yeah when you have just glasses or yeah and it's it's getting there well that was always my thing when Google glass got announced that sounds awesome and then when I saw you with Google glasses like non you fucking life but I'm glad you're supporting it so that in twenty years I can have a regular pair. Glasses that look like this but I charge at night and do all the suds up to swear yeah. It's going to be minority report or <hes> what it far from home yeah yeah. I think that's where it's going to I. I think it'll be there before we get to the point. Where it's that small yeah it just needs to be a little bit tighter and then you need to be able to flip you know be able to see reality and then I'll show that's even with quest right like that's one of the most exciting two things I have people do with it is okay cool? Draw the boundary and we took it over and you can see the Russo right thank granted. It's black and white like Predator vision but it's like what you're talking about. I think one of the problems with V._R.. Is being isolated so when handy yeah honey and you know what you look over and you can see them and it's not like you're just in another world like I sat next to Jenin played a astronaut this week weekend. Oh this week and so I'm just sitting there with my v._r.. headset on one ear bud out so I can have vague conversation with her. Listen Stranger things listen. I think it's I think the thing is that's. That's the issue. Is that when you when you're playing Mario Odyssey whatever like even if it's a one player game it doesn't matter your significant forget other. Your friends can watch you play. They're entertained by fucking up or whatever but when you're isolated you you don't get to share that experience because you kind of want to Kinda show off right and they don't get to share that experience with you unless you have this crazy display. I can't imagine having kids right because all sit there and punch quarterbacks and my dog right like this thing about like like what if the kid comes on meet someone gets boot in the you know what I mean I can't I can't I can't deal with it or they'll be fucking with you while you're well that's for sure. I think we all know that Barrett progress support. How are we doing on Microphone Justin Lena too far back saying in the right range everything good when he leans back he comes back in progress report card number two fortnight night? Streaming numbers are dropping this Brinson Claire over games industry is stream elements latest quarterly state of the Stream report shows declining streaming viewership across the industry's biggest battle Royale Games the report released by the streamer production platform in conjunction with which stats that's slash analytic sites selling gnome showed declines from April through June for hours washed a fortnight apex legends and player Unknowns Battle <hes> paranoids battlegrounds across streaming platforms twitch you to live facebook gaming and mixer four nights hours. Watch were down three point six six percent to just over three hundred million hours watched. It was the fourth consecutive quarter of declines for the game. Even though it remains the most wash game on streaming platforms for nine is more than double the hours wash them any game outside of the top four and gap between the League of Legends Brucie's the next most watched game actually increase this quarter because of riots hits because of because riots hit saw a larger decline in viewership. E._A.'S APEX legends saw the most precipitous drop of any game in the second quarter going from third place to almost with almost one hundred eighty three million dollars watched in q one two out of the top ten entirely parentheses less than sixty five point four million watched in Q.. Two last battle Royale game in the top ten player unknowns battlegrounds also soclean's quarter over quarter dropping four point three percent to sixty five point four million hours washed and sliding from ninth place tenth where a Super Combo man in the most streamed hours point zero zero zero one percent but we'll we'll get up there. I think this is interesting. Though I think it has two years left Battle Royale for night okay okay around two years before it declines and I think that's why what nothing happens in two years like they're going to have to graduate to something else. Mile thing is I feel that the kid it's generational share so minecraft kids were jumping into fortnight because they wanted to play you know they wanted to play a battle royale. They wanted to shoot shit build shit at the same time graduated from the block. He you know that kind of thing and then they're going to graduate but then also people are going to get tired. Obviously I mean like just people get tired of the same thing and that is why I feel epoch is snapping up all these studios and stuff. They gotta get ready for the next shift right yeah no that that is right future proofing. They understand that right now. They're making money hand over fist with four night but that can't last forever so yeah. Let's take that money. Turn it around and build it into a business black yeah and then have more games that have that same integrity right now. When you are making your you know an indie developer on your part of the industry? How much attention are you paying the trends like this and what you've seen with not only streaming but then also obviously battle royale and stuff I mean we're I'm paying close attention to all this stuff? I need number one because I have to have my ear to the street because of the the the media and the exchange right and I wanna see what trends are you know are moving forward and also I'm working with a lot of the platform holders themselves you know because they're sponsors and stuff but as a developer I'm paying close attention to see what maybe next but since you know I mean we're indie developers are very agile in being able to make something quick but at the same time mm-hmm we can't compete on the level that these guys like for like fortnight pivoted right the big time it was a completely obviously everyone knows as a totally different game so they already had all the tech there make this thing this amazing using thing move to where things were going right so what I what was interesting with any developers any developers we'll have this cool idea that maybe five or six years out because they don't have the resources to make that happen been and then it takes them eight years and by that time they're not on the leading edge yeah so what I've seen that works a lot more properly as like understanding like serving what's happening seeing what's next and then figuring out what we can build within two years or three years that may not have the fidelity of something crazy like fortnight or battlegrounds or whatever it is the next big thing we've heard of that wave right of like or be ahead of the curve and then maybe you get snapped up yeah. You know what I mean like like. You're saying beat say we're now. There's a thousand you know clones that right <hes> but I definitely think what's happening is. I'm interested to see what the next wave of. I can only imagine that question. People always writing like what's what's what's going to happen in five years. You don't even know yeah yeah what started with daisy right like well yeah kind of funny dot com slash you're wrong. I want to say yeah right but that was that WH- daisy was the army to moderate yeah they got it all going yeah and then rushed was in there too there are so many different weird things that and then it just evolved staying but that was like six years ago I remember Mitch Dyer Aegean playing rust and stuff like that yeah. I remember the first time I walked by Fucking Charles on Desk Guy John and I was like what is this thing called minecraft. I'm like this looks like garbage that was like what is this shit. Look so Jank okay phenomenon you now you mentioned it when we were talking about the epic looking at the next thing and how they're smashing up games doing these exclusive stuff <hes>. Where are you in? What what's the thermometer from India Devos's on what's going on with EPA game store versus steam versus? This seems like a lot of money. Get thrown around. That's I think it's really yeah. I think it's really interesting <hes> right now. Developers have to diversify you have to do it so like because of steam is very complicated. It's very complicated to sell stuff there. The visibility is not they're much right. There's just too much shit there and then like the curation is is kind of odd right now. That's changing but <hes> I think what's what's interesting. Also there's a shift in the you know the major console platforms. They're getting ready ready for the next generation that's obvious so they're going to make probably be making their announcements next year right. So what happens at the beginning of those is a lot of money is thrown around to get content because the AAA content won't be ready. It won't be ready so they need a lot of indie content sent so developers know that and they're they're trying to figure out okay so if if epic gives you a million dollars or two million dollars or something like that and that will cover what you may get on these other platforms. It's worth exclusively deal so they're they're always the desert always looking for that. <hes> looking for those types of just like the oculus deal any type of new platform that comes up. They're going to be tossing around money because they're trying to get content on their their platform to kind of build it out you know for the their investors or whoever disconnect between Gamers I know such a General Maine's whatever swath everything but at least some gamers and the realities of being have because it seems like I signed this deal with epic your fucking sell out. Why would you do like I don't want to? I don't you hear the thing worked out really well for 'EM D. H.. Mortgage Your House to make this game happened great. Does it work out forever. No no I mean I would say ninety percent. I should does not work out. You don't have a house. Eh You know <hes> yet. I think it's the people do not understand. I think people are getting smarter understanding because there are interested in like what what's happening behind the scenes and like there's there's more visibility ready behind the scenes and transparency but yeah I think I mean even with our like I'm just going to use our circumstances for instance like with with our fig campaign like it's shows that we made like four hundred forty seven thousand dollars but like how much did we actually receive the people don't understand. They're like what the fuck is that you know like we have all this money. What do you just be now? It's like we didn't necessarily get all that and we're trying to explain that but they don't understand what it costs to develop. You know like take those kinds of things and then when you have something where like say a developer made three previous games and then this one is better and you get attention from you know epic or whatever and they're gonNA give you a million dollars or five five hundred thousand or whatever it is and you can feed your team. You're going to take that you know what I mean because the studio going right he the studio going because it's a marathon. Not you know what I mean. You're not doing this one. You know I mean you're going one game at a time but you're not I wanted done. Shut down everything with I mean with our with our studio. It's like I know we released a one game. We release super common didn't do super well. We're going to be worth releasing Jane's. That's not where it stops yeah so if I could find. Line different you know things to help us get to that point then. We're going to be partnering with people and if you think it selling out then you don't understand that you know we're people or these developers are people. They need to live. We're not we're not bankrolled like E._A.. Or whatnot term saying good and I think the hope is sometimes like like double fine just got you know snapped up right like contemptuous for l. out definitely but I mean I I feel that they need that support. Were you know creatives need that financial support at times and that you can't say they're selling out if they can still make their dream possible with their creativity with help and then also support others in the creative space as well and there's also the argument suv like right and I think you know not. I don't think it works here because we're supposed to clowns but like I talked about it. I gene right of doing so well my job at I g and that I got promoted to being a manager which I was not good at and didn't really want to do right like I imagined inside have double fine to some extent that's team. I'm sure he's not like managing the books but in terms of like cool you're in charge of the studio and now you have to worry about all this and all these like share bringing Microsoft have them by you and then they take over all that bullshit work right and put it over here and get back to doing the things you really want to do inside your studio yeah yeah. I think that's that happens quite a bit like people want like they blow up and they want someone else to handle shit. I'm not gonNA say is like necessarily double fine but I think that some other smaller India's fucking blow up and it's like three guys like Oh shit. Look at all this stuff yeah. I don't want to deal with this so like yeah. We'll let you handle it. As long as we get a cut. Yeah you know what I mean and I think it's those are great. Opportunities number number three on the Roper Report ubisoft is banning the X. P. farming assassin's creed Odyssey mission. This is James Bachelor Games Industry Dot Biz UBISOFT has forbidden players from using a new mission making tool to rapidly level up characters and assassin's creed odyssey see the story creator mode was quietly announce during the pre show stream for the publishers e three twenty one thousand nine press conference it released shortly after it enables players to create their own quests in assassin's creed odyssey in share them with other players inevitably. Some players have been using this to exploit the games. He's leveling system creating easy quests that yield significant amounts of X._p.. But you ease off is now banned the tools users from making. Let me try that again has now banned the tools users from something's missing the tools users for making the X._p.. Farming quest is not me in a post on the publisher's official forums assassin's creed team said it is changing the terms of us to prevent such quests from being published and is working on a way to ensure those that exist do not appear in any recommendation system users who quote continually or continue to willingly and intentionally misused the tool will be sanctioned. The team claims that this is to maintain the creative integrity of the original intent of the tool saying quote these exploits risk jeopardizing the overall quality integrity and purpose of story creator and results in less visibility visit ability for the creative interesting and frankly fantastic community stories that have been published we want to focus on rewarding creativity by highlighting quality quests and we are working on fixes and adjustments to reduce the impact of such farming on the player experience back to James However is important to note that you saw ubisoft offers its own solution for accelerating your progress in the form of Permanent X._P.. Boosters these are sold in the in game store alongside a number of other micro transactions they give players in advantage such as extra currency in and stronger weapons come on don't give a shit about essence creed. What Odyssey's great odyssey is fucking fantastic really? I loved it. I plan to me and I have one hundred thirty hours in this great big big game. Maybe I'm I'm Mel after try it. I am not I'm tired of on sequel is sequel. ITIS CASSANDRA CASSANDRA shot by the time the splash screen happens you're not into which is like an hour and a half more though isn't Eh Odyssey fan like come on I the one thing I get is when they're talking about these exploits and less visibility for creative interesting and frankly fantastic stories we'll get so. Can you explain like you told me a little bit earlier but I understand like those extra addy three. They announced base go into the game. You're playing your game. You run over to people you. They give you a quest you run off and get what you kill thirty pigs you come back to your they. They added three announced that hey you can make your own quest now. So you can write your own dialogue. You can put in your own objectives and you go on your computer. You set it all up right the dialogue if this then that you know Blah Blah Blah and then you publish them and then people can download them and go do <unk> in their game and then get the X. P.. I see I've been I want. I've been new right one about how much K. if sucks and I wanted you know make fun of Nick and amy haven't done it yet but I will but it's the idea that people are making really cool things. That's really interesting things. Go Save Socrates okay great and then there's people who are doing the ones that are like cool. Walk over there and get that thing and bring it back. You get a million X._p.. Or whatever okay and so it's like I get I I I off to James. This is a not not accusation at the end. There is important to point out that Yousof again. I always thought the double X. P. The X._p.. Booster thing totally overblown. I did buy with looks or whatever because it's takes more X._p.. From but it doesn't is in effect anyone else's game play one hundred percent right just I if you ask me the same way these don't affect Nabeel cares. If you want to cheat yeah I mean remember Chico's not to mention that I think are we really overlooking the fact that the games been out for how long what year last that's right yeah it was Tober October of last year right so I mean like half a year almost a full year like if you're if you're going to hear assassin's creed great your and you pick it up now and go play awesome. I think we're down to such a small percentage of people who are going to do this like meanwhile me of like they keep adding level caps to it. There's no way in the world I'm ever going to play enough more assassin's creed the new level cap so if I really wanted to why not let me go in there isolated like and there's gotta be a way in terms of share ability of promoting in this is the things you talked about it with steam but at the same P._S._N.. Right for games it's the same thing with xbox live in terms of discover ability. I also can't imagine there's so many being uploaded in the absence creed community right now in Odyssey that it gets such a hot thing that you can't have it be that somebody goes in every day and flags the seven great quests they've seen that they want to put up that would be and then there is it's just like if you want to search for X._p.. You gave them the tools. You let him do it. I don't understand the sanctions business. You're talking about yeah. I was talking Shit but that's pretty intuitive that allowing people to create their own generated content like like infamous really yeah interesting. What do they call it kind of funny dot com slash around you see G user generated user created Yuji U._G._C. User generated content where they let you make little stuff like that interesting yeah? It's a cool idea and I think that again what what I've always said. Even if you don't like offcier assassin's creed period I appreciate that Ubisoft took their foot off the gas and like we're not annualising it's going to be this game's going to breathe an entire year so that's what they say so then continue to support it with D._l._C.. They're still doing the Atlantis deal see they're putting this in there. They do like monthly drops of new things. I like how the how these teams are are lengthening. Yeah told me because it's like I mean yeah. I see such an amazing world that they made for Ancient Greece that yeah I want to I will eventually eventually go back to it. Even I don't. I'm not somebody who sits there and goes man. I need to get more X. P.. I need someone to grind up these stupid missions but in the same breath like the game already I feel is pretty easy when I'm Max level and I have my my poison damage is off the charts and stuff like just let them be. Let it be Ubisoft Barrett. Let him be spared. I've said news for you. It's really sad news for amy but he's not here so it's free number four. It's time to say goodbye S- platoon events Kevin Gamespot ears tuned to final SPLAT fest event will take place next week marking the end of the Games monthly competitions because he can can to allow to contempt to to commemorate amount of water. I can't try to commemorate commemorate. The occasion Nintendo's hosting platoon themed events I in two first party switch games this weekend. First Tetris Ninety Nine v Maximus Cup which runs from now until July fifteenth like previous maximums cups the event is points based. You learn a certain a number of points depending on what number you place in the round and if you managed to rack up at least one hundred points before the event ends y'all unlock a SP- cools platoon to for the game you can see the theme in the video game about in addition attendance ninety nine Super Smash Brothers ultimate is is Holding Platoon Team Spirit and board event this weekend which likewise runs from July twelfth through the fifteenth throughout the event various characters from series will appear on the spirits board every hour including the legend class squid sisters wow you also earn twice as many spirit points each time you bet on one of these characters during the event final SPLAT Fest Kicks Off July Eighteenth and runs for an extended seventy two hours concluding on July twenty first the theme this time is apocalyptic one asking players to choose whether they'd like the world to be ruled by order or chaos what what a note to go out on the first forty eight hours of the event all twenty-three shifty station stages from previous flat fest will return to the rotation while a brand new shifty station featuring appearances by Pearl in marina will be featured the final twenty four hours following the final spot. I flew to will receive one more content update patch five point. Oh arrive in late July and ADD SWEAT FEST TURF war option to private battles this mode what you play on any of the stages twenty four shifty station maps and transform other stages into their nighttime version just as they appeared during SPLAT fests rest in peace tune two years that was a good run for like Nintendo and stuff. What do you think about <hes> Nintendo's venture into sports? I think it's pretty cool what they're doing. It's cool but it's still just Nintendo I._B._M.. Nintendo right where they're doing the marsh and their own be doing their own thing. Here's how we're going to do it like I you know their support of the smashed me and he's been great. This platoon supports me great like it's cool to see them out there doing it. I think two years of supports men well enough. You know what I mean. I ain't he doesn't play it anymore and he dressed up as one of these kids for inkling Andy. They're gearing towards another one another. Oh they'll make another team. I think yeah and then they're going to. Ramp it up <hes> yeah what it'll be another probably two years maybe before we get a E. Three logo I dunno micro J.. Exactly two three is coming Justin but it's so far away if I wanted something more immediate say what came to the mom and pop shops where would I go the official lists of upcoming software across each and every platform as listed by the kind of Funny Games daily show host each and every weekday Doo Doo do do do do do do out today. Dragon Quest Builders to on P._S.. Four switch lethal league blaze playstation four xbox one switch P._S.. Four and xbox One god eater three on switch streets of rogue xbox one. That's got to be illegal as you know what I mean like it was named pretty much one thousand money sign at the polly mole and Mac neon slashers on royal life hard to be Queen on P._C.. Man Clear Download Turbo Tax and royal live weekend spy tactics and Mac eyeso- tiles to P._C.. and Mac Suber mutant alien assault on switch mad bullets on switch distrust switch new dates for you. A new generation of call off-duty multi player is coming Mark Your calendars for Thursday August first when activision aliens affinity ward will reveal the multi-player universe of call of duty modern warfare then pokemon go this is from gamespot and up there for you like Pokemon goes monthly Community Day events ends the Interior Anti Anti Anti Ray Day. We'll be held around the world but it will only run for three hours from four to seven PM local time Dermot crap Sunday. It's Sunday. What's the date on Sunday I remember today is the twelve fourteen to okay so only run from four to seven PM local time on Sunday the fourteenth during that window you'll be able to encounter anti in five-star AIDS once the event ends however N._T.? Will leave Pokemon go once again so you only have a couple of hours to battle and catch some before the legendary departs parts. We both fucked up. It's an and Tay Yeah. I think this is jen three and I'm my my knowledge of Gen. Three is so very loose. You're a fake pokemon Fan <hes> all right. I'm going to be out there. Jake catching the thing what is it. I don't know one other pokemon decides Pori Gone Homerun off Maki okay all right all right okay chart. What does Pika to evolve into? I'm never gonNA evolve my peekapoos so I don't WanNa know he's too cute. Here's the other thing that a week ago I started playing pokemon. Go really hard with my wife really yeah we were walking talking about. It was very newsy. We've how good pokemon go is in terms of it being here three years later and all the while I was talking about I busted out and started doing it and she busted her is out and started doing it and then we started playing and now here we are a week later we wake up in the morning and walk around and get a cup of coffee. Walk around plan. Yeah okay so let's just a stupid thing to do all right. I fucked up again the chess yelling antigen to fuck off God. What a fake pokemon fan over there? You don't even know how to say Chad and people talking Shit in the Oh yeah. We're GONNA look at it. He only sees the chat okay. This is a Polish new show. You're wrong pops up here and then yeah homeless people are young at when you're on shadow real chill whose all over dome name Neil Grilled Chill Pokemon Fan. I tell you what Barry even barest me for last time. <hes> final new date for you is my craft earth closed Beta invites are going out in the next two weeks you you can go sign up right now. Four at Earth Dot minecraft dot net. That's for the minecraft Earth a our phone game. They're all over the place really stop making all these games. Just make a are mobile games. You make a million dollars. Apparently it's time for reader mail but I am going to tell you about our sponsor. It's hymns you've heard US talking about him and how they're helping guys look their best and if you haven't it's time to see what they're all about naked andy use him because they noticed their hair hair was thinning and so they went to forums dot com a one stop shop for hair loss skin care sexual wellness and more for men thanks to science ball in this can be optional. Hymns is helping guys the best version of themselves with licensed positions in F._D._A.. Approved products to help treat hair loss hames was created. Hi guys that know some men's health conversations are easier online than in person. What I hate about that is right there? That was my best read of it in that. 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We'll start with Fendi Fendi writes in the Patriot dot com slash kind of funny games just like you can't says hey guys every summer. There's a period you have time. We're almost no good games drop and it looks like that's what we're in the middle of right now. I finally found the time to dig into my backlog and start persona five. My question is what are some of the Games in your backlog that you're planning on playing just. Do you ever have time to go to your backlog anymore. There's I don't know I by so many fucking game and they're not opened. It's ridiculous the amount of games I have the rap. The rap yeah stacked up laying. I I went back. This is nuts metal. Oh gear solid five. Oh my God really so far back and Oh my God this is amazing. I'm telling everybody I'm playing. I'm playing POKEMON. Go and breaking news every yeah yeah. I'll tell you one though <hes> Mario Maker to yeah. I just got that last week and I can't wait to to fuck around but I think it's slower than it often is but it's still going like you know what I mean like Mar immigrant he just came out right. <hes> ultimate lines three is next week or two that I remember in the old days when I started I g in the story always like it used to be the real dead times where it was like you got to fall and that's when things kicked off and I remember moving here in having just my we in sitting in the spare room when I was renting from Mica playing a paper Maury on the whichever one that was I can't remember and being like nowadays that would never happen because I was like. I got nothing else to play. The seems interesting and I enjoyed it fine. I didn't love it or anything. I can't remember the full name of the game but I remember playing it because it it's like I gotta play something. There's actually nothing to play whereas now it's like every day. There's nine hundred games. We were down here. Yeah Yeah my friend Pedro Yup looking forward to that yeah well see I I'm late but like I played it Edgy D._C.. And I was like I don't know and then Bayer played and he didn't like it and I was like London not even worry about it unfortunate yeah. I'm trying to think of any of the anything else that I mean. That's look forward or them. Somebody tells me about a game like moonlighters. That's from last year and I'm like Oh. That's great. He's awesome. I haven't played blood-stained yea. We jumped. I jumped in tasted it I know and he's been playing a lot of it. Jump in and play that one. I'll put on your radar Catania Zero Zero. I know I know I know yeah. I played it back in the day when they they'll swim games yeah and then now they're at Volver fucking bad ass awesome yeah I got. I got a job with this. This is what we're talking about. The backlog we're talking about is the from two months ago where he's reaching a persona five. At least that should call on. That's so far gone down so much stuff coming out yeah. That's that's that's rough and like you. I mean I don't have tons of time. You're making the Games then making mix happen you going on here comes question from the NATO biologist again Patriots accomplished kind of Funny Games and I want your take on adjusting so google is putting their A._i.. Again starcraft two players soon for some test matches and it reminded me of E._A.'s plan to add a out of their multi-player Games if Ghouls A._I.. Does well and make smart. Play slash passes passes. I'll make sports play slash passes the turing test. Do you think this will become a new feature of stadium as in developers can choose to add Google's a out of their games to match making more full slash compelling to people or will possibly have it added to more than just stadium icky as more of a reality I think it's interesting concept but I think that when so are they like saying that they would have bought like a I bought that you would play against as opposed to players and then they they would basically say that players. I don't think they'd say their players. I think points is our A._I.. So good is so fine tune that can beat real players that makes more calls. I think we'll be really fucking cool. What if they if they utilize it this way like they have they? I you played on Stadia Right. You play through stadium and what stadium basically promising is. You can go back and take snapshots. Go back and play those experiences review it then there's like a tutorial or a strategy placed upon upon that shit that'd be awesome fucking cool. You're you're there you play against a buy and then when you lose or you make a wrong move or whatever it since it has a I knowing what's happening with the best like it'll like have an <unk> overlay after your match and tell you how to beat that opponent because they already have recorded everything seat Audi so much more helpful than how games usually do stuff like that. I was thinking madden. We're like everytime matting it's more and more complex and I play it and I'd run the Satori on. It's like all right well. If you see the defensive offensive in lift his leg like this I mean forget all of that right whereas in also too boring very specific situation than Ueno two hours later when I'm in the Middle Game I don't remember where it would be awesome right if after the fact even after the play like they do in real football that you were looking at film and things were getting circle yeah exactly I mean they have heat maps and all that stuff already where you traveled whereas the best routes if they utilize that it would not only like make it more engaging for the for the player but also make competition addition a lot better for player versus player Hell Yeah the other great answer use fucking knockout apart. That's why we should have developers on this. Show more. You know what I mean. We're out here act like Morons Stadium do you do you believe in streaming. I I know people well. Hey on stadiums so hard but I think the white that's snapshot thing like imagine if you're playing a game right and you're like against the boss or you're in this particular situation and then you could share it with your audience that snapshot <hes> or as. Has a strategy a look. How I I beat this <hes> boss in what is that game called the Oh Dr Yeah yes exactly I didn't get hit once and you're doing crazy shit and then you put that person in that situation Asia or you put them in that situation just as an observer to see how you can do whatever they want? That is such a cool like tool like that's really cool to play around with because a lot of people don't really have the twitch corny twitch muscle fiber they don't. They don't have the reaction time. They're not a NITRO rifle. I understand yeah so they are like if they're able to see in real real time at work. Oh Wow that's that's that's cool. They'll they'll respected more. They could do videos and it's really smart. That kind of stuff is really intriguing yeah. Do you think the actual streaming part of it's GonNa work like in general I mean. Is there a future there. I think I mean they've been trying with <hes> Kokai and with what is it called go <hes>. I can't remember on live. These type of things like I think that they they're gonna hit it but I don't i. It's Kinda like V._R.. Right now like how far is it going to like how much <hes> how many <hes> what is it servers. Do you have to have yeah. It's actually make it make sense and make it make sense and work but I saw <hes>. One of my friends is a techno file so he was playing on his like. What is the Google yeah chromebook playing odyssey on like a fifty inch T._v. and it was it was flawless and I was like wow yeah? It's dope but obviously we're. We're in the bay. So obviously you know saying like I'm excited for it right but I also understand that yeah like the Internet isn't is like that everywhere yeah. If I'm in Ohio I was last week and I'm trying to do that. She's like Ohio says no Sommese. We talked what you're from Cleveland. Columbus Columbus might be cool Cleveland says of Cleveland Fox way you like it you wrap it. Though two and six in doubles era gets a final question of the day says Good Morning Greg and special guests. There's been a lot of talk about how a Games deal sea comes out too far after the game has come out and I will I always felt people were just complaining about nothing but I will be silent. No longer the messenger deal so you came out yesterday and not only did it not remember that I beat the game on the safe so I have I have to do as the kids would say get good again and beat the game again but then in the Diaz hit a brick wall where I feel to win. You have to be some sort of God like command over the controls and mechanics I get this is an indie studio and I offer difficult games but but am I crazy to say maybe a deal see should not be the hardest challenge to the game unless advertised that way or am I just complaining. I am not able to rush through this deal seat parentheses B._Z._W.. The deal is fantastic and I'm being super nit-picky here. Everyone should go by the Messenger and play it bores and double zero zero sabotage right. You're all over the map there so you love the deal see what you meant and then you like also like his thing here. He's like it didn't remember I beat on this save so I had to get good wait a second. You said you already planned the D._N._C.. So what you were like saved little level before you beat the boss like your buddy all right you come down on you. I bet any bar always free yeah. You have to have a same for the DNC. You have to have already beaten the game because there's all post stuff content yeah yeah and I've heard great things about. It seems like it'd be Love's Messenger Yeah and I love that studio. They worked their asses off as I'm confused about the question I think the main question is something we've talked about before and I always use horizons. Your dawn is my example not really difficulty but kind of of I love games and an deals he'll come months later and jumping and you've played ninety games since then and you're like wait. What the fuck do I do in this game like you know what I mean like like horizon when they dropped frozen wiles from me it was awesome and then immediately I was like getting a thunder jaw was slamming mccaw? Fuck what I it was like fifteen minutes of trying to remember how to play get back to that most breath the wild totally right yeah exactly cook yeah yeah so like there is going to be said for that and I think that's what boards is talking about especially the game like Messenger where you're even before then right it was very much inspired by image guidance or simply unite and stuff like that if like platforming and using all your different skills in mechanics to get through stuff I I can see where that would be jarring to jump back into that world and have the deal C._B.. Super Heart so he's saying like it came out way too late and it's difficult he saying that the game he loved the game when it came out and now jumping back into it and the deal seems harder than the base game in some ways ask kicked because he no longer has that muscle memory or the twitch skills as you were talking about which I love that yeah well I think the thing is they may not have been aware. How difficult is because if you think about it like this small studio? They're playing this shit at it all the time so there'd be like Oh yeah you. Can you see me do this all this bullshit like and then when it comes to the public maybe they tested a certain amount of time and those people are good yeah so the general audience they don't they didn't they. Maybe they didn't get that feet. There's also I think well especially for these Retro Inspired Games that I think there is a yeah we want it to be hard right. That seems to be an audience that does crave repels me from a lot of games but like so many people do want to be on yeah yeah and I I could see that with a message I mean I played Ninja Guidon recently again the O._G.. Won that game is just like punch as our enemies are just keep responding and he the fuck out of you. You don't play this but even like we we. We just did a party mode that isn't up yet for Mario Maker too and it's the same thing on my level in the two clears and five hundred people that's a bad level but people are like no. It's the challenge of it right like the Barrett did Andy's level right of slamming your head into the wall over and over and over and over again so you finally finally get it and I don't know why you do that yourself fair to say to Andy Cortez to his fucking face when he hits home fuck you. I'm on your level. That's why that's why you don't do that to a developer. If you'd be really hard developer game a and you meet them you say hey game. I love it but if you see anti Cortez newbies level you say fuck you andy I beat your lungs man but only three people can say that there's been like seventy clears on no yeah we're. We were just really bad when we AH Justin stem squad up. This is where one of you writes in the Patriot dot com slash kind of funny games. Give me your name username platform choice in why you need help in a video game. I really hear the best friends come and find you and everybody plays games miss together today farmer. Josh and he's helping the playstation four farmer Josh's P._S._N.. Name is the farmer Josh All one word the farmer. Josh Says Hey y'all I've been playing dying lightly and would love to earn the co-op trophies in order to inch closer to the platinum. I'm hoping to get a crew of four people together to play. The game for a few hours earned these trophies. If you WANNA play dying light with the farmer Josh hit up the farmer Josh on E._S._p._N.. All one word and get them Dang trophies. We asked people watching live on twitch dot TV slash kind of games to go to kind of dot com slash. You're wrong and tell us what we screw up. As we screwed up so we can set the record straight for everybody washing later on youtube dot com slash kind of funny games rooster teeth dot com and podcast services around the globe. Ill Chill says the first battle royale mode for Armagh and minecraft in the first battle royale was mods. I'm sorry for arm an minecraft in the early twenty tens. There's also Japanese mobile game called B Tomb online that was inspired by the Japanese movie around Twenty Sixteen <music> Lord of poem writes in and says only thing wrong about today's show has been Greg not asking Justin where he got that cool jacket. I got this cool jacket in Argentina. It was tailored so they did a money. No so people don't know that Argentina is one of the most <hes> they they consume the most cows they love steak right and they have a lot yeah and so what I'm thinking of Brazilian steakhouse fucked well. I mean yes South America but they have they export their their meat also all across South America so I was when I was there I was like yo the got cows the the Eli cows. They must have leather leather so I was like where can I find ways to get a leather jacket and I found this place and I was asking people and they this little hole in the wall shop like were they were <hes> they put together jackets for you know what I went in there got fitted and it was like it was like two hundred bucks yeah wow okay. I was GONNA say right because they have like they and I couldn't. I can't speak Spanish. Worth Shit goes like Google Yar. I like this. I want this side and then this but yeah that's awesome so if anyone goes Argentina look for the whole new washout Yeah Double Zero Zero says also don't forget about the Kebabs Lego. Thank you kebabs email me started. I put an actual the housekeeping remember kinda funny dot com slash Lego. We have the podcast studio in Lego creative right now this whole studio into the legal thing and if it gets enough votes they have to actually look at it and see if they want to go to Kinda funny dot com slash leg vote for kebabs thing you do have to register but it takes two seconds grow chills back to say the paper Mario Game on the was Super Paper Mario thank you very much and then Omni Vision says currently in a suburb of Cleveland getting five hundred megabits down fifty up. See Me Find for stadium there okay. That's all I'm saying you know what the ladies and gentlemen. Let's go onto your host for next week. It's a Banger of a week Monday me and Tricia Hirsch Burger Tuesday. It's me and Jacob Decker from gamespot Wednesday. It's me and Gary Thursday. I had to COMECON so was injury and Fran Friday then it's free and Andrea Justin boom going to be a big week for you next week. Jay Silent Bob Marlborough Mall is happening on the foot. Maybe a full announcement something happen next week. Some things some other stuff with the other game to bionic one punch where can people keep up with you. <hes> you could follow us at <hes> at Interior Banging T. on instagram and twitter what other platforms are pretty much facebook. If you're like thirty six is plus. There's no kinda funny games daily each and every weekday antibiotic platforms we run you through the video game news. You need to know about if you like that. Be Part of the show Patriot Dot com slash kinda funny game watch twitch dot TV slash kind of Funny Games Watch.

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Week Seventeen NFL DFS Picks (Ep. 647)

Sports Gambling Podcast

00:00 sec | 2 years ago

Week Seventeen NFL DFS Picks (Ep. 647)

"The sports gambling podcast is brought to you. By my bookie dot AG. The official online sports wick of the sports gambling podcasts. Use the promo code S. G P fifty for a fifty percent deposit bonus today. We're also brought to you by odds shark. They have the latest Beden sets and trends, you won't find anywhere else. Plus free picks from their supercomputer and expert writing staff, follow them on Twitter at odds, shark and WWW dot odds, shark duck. Welcome everyone to the sports gambling pack has Sean stack in that money with partner and picks. Right. Real money. Kramer, what's happening cream dog? Crame dog that a while everything man Christmas holiday is over is. Is it a is it a bad opinion say that you're not a big fan of Christmas? Should I keep that to myself is that like is that like kneeling during the national anthem should avoid that grant. Why don't you like Christmas? No, no, not a Grinch. It's just a lot of stress for for one day. And then it's over and everything goes back to normal. I don't understand it. Like, I'm guessing you you've traveled all over the country. I'm sure you're stoked on that. You know, I didn't travel anywhere yet. But I'm dreading the fact that I'm traveling and I'd much rather just be sitting around doing nothing in my house. Right. I think part of this. I'm here. It's it's less anti Christmas. More pro hermit lifestyle. Right. I think that maybe. Maybe that's why I don't have to go outside or do anything separate? I'd just rather be my garage watching NFL action on my four TV's, which I built those TV. So I didn't have to leave the house. Exactly, you're hermit cave. Yeah. No. I I enjoy Christmas. Right. I'm not a Grinch like you. It's fun. Good catholic. Yeah. It's fun to get out there and kind of. Yeah. Do the Christmas things see some lights exchange from gifts. Get some stuff. Stop Sean stop. I'm throwing a challenge flag that you like to go look at Christmas lights. That's well. I don't I I enjoy looking at them. But I don't like Jesse my schedule to go look at Christmas lights, if is your wife, and or mother like within earshot of you right now is that what's no. I listen lights are fun. But I'm not gonna make a separate trip to go. Look at lights, you can you see lights, you know. Like when I go over to your house, and I see you're nice lights up on your roof from like. Wow. That's a really thank you put me in the holidays. Go over to your garage. All right. Well, I'm glad I'm doing your nail in it. Ryan, you know, who else is nailed it. My bookie dot AG the official online sports because the sports gambling podcasts season. Tis the season to reload. Redeposit if you're a first time depositor, so you got that fifty percent deposit bonus. My bookie dot AG get paid play win and get paid as she fifty is the deposit code. Lots of gambling opportunities Ken Ryan, you're going to be traveling. Is there anything sweeter than firing up the old in-flight TV and watching a game that you got a little action on it? Feels like you're not feels like you're not flying at all anytime. I can fly n watching game. The ideal scenario is like one or two bowl games on for a cross country flight the NFL Sunday, not quite ideal because you got multiple games. It's hard to keep track. But one or two primetime isolated games. That is a perfect ball. Bedding season, and we got tons of bedding. Content got our coupla Casco. And, but of course, the college experience will be hitting on all the games college playoff Kobe D And that crew, but all that courtesy of my book dot AG, promo code S. GP fifty. Okay. Kramer. It's just you. And I this week especial. Couples addition of the Jeff kings are daily fantasy podcast right because Pino had some technical issues. It's always tough doing these remote pods. Honestly, maybe for the best because the three-man where no one's in the same room. Is is never a good situation. So stuff. As you can hear right there with with poor timing and everything we're timing. What Sean, but hey, it's always great timing to talk about daily fantasy football. Ryan kick things off gives your quarterback how much applying. Nope. Not yet. Sean we have to start with with a baby. Well, okay. A baby Epping. Well update the F FCC has concluded, Sean. Oh, and when the dust settles I started the championship in ninth place did not look good suffered some injuries. Emmanuel Sanders James Connor some bad fortunes starting the wrong quarterback. And yet when when the dust settles I ended up in nineteenth place, Sean. So a for those keeping track at home that that brings the the cash total to a whopping ten thousand dollars this season. So actually, I'm sorry eleven thousand dollars. So not a bad year. Sean not a bad year for the baby effing wells. There may be too babe. Maybe effing wells in the FCC. Stay tuned for that. Of course, there will be multiple baby. Having is it bad that I showed my I was wearing the baby effing well t shirt and the kids were asking about it. So I showed them the video and the older one goes why why does why does the man say wheel when he saying when he's trying to say well. I explained people. Skills, but aren't the girls a little young to be exposed to that heavy of Boston accent? They have access to you. Yeah. They have access to YouTube. I'm sure it's happened already stumbling. Earls? Horrible Boston accents this age. And they're very they're very impressionable. You don't want them. It's it's a tricky situation. Well, it it is because how do I censor the internet? I'm not one for censoring. But then then all of a sudden, though, they'll show me some video they came across of. And I'm like oh shit. I got. Bad way way too much Boston in this. We know. So I showed him the by the baby effing well video. They thought it was pretty funny. Once I explain the fact they can't talk right up there. And yeah. So that was my Christmas. Also, I don't know where I was going with this. But I've also been wearing the baby f t shirt around, and it it's always a conversation starter. And then it's a win win. You get a show him the baby f in whale video. And then you get to you know, explain that. It's the thing in the podcast, and that they should be listening to. Yeah. And that's the main thing though, the she goes so back to the daughter. She goes who created this me? And I'm like, well, we did. She's like, what do you mean? It blew her mind that that we created based on an internet video. She's like, well, you didn't make the video. I'm like, no, no. But we made the video funny. Yes. And so yeah that that was. That. And I said all of that to say there will be a a baby effing. Well, entry in the F F P C playoff s Ryan which will. Of our sweet playoff run, which we had Nick foles at the F F P C QB that was a pretty great run, right? Well, yeah, you always dream scenario. Is you catch a quarterback playing four games? And of course, the Super Bowl is double. But being able to get a quarterback playing in the wildcard divisional championship and Super Bowl or any player. Really? But the quarterback is key. Bryce wildcard. But now, you're right. We only got three, but we still did get a it was more of a contrarian play anything. We'll be back. It's real fun. And you roster and real quick just for. Yeah. Little Rosser baiting. But to get people excited for talking about the F F P C playoff playoff set up. The the deal is what you get one guy from each team or what what's the exact format? So you have it's it's the exact same scoring and roster construction as the F F P. So you have a quarterback two running backs too wide receivers to flex which can be any position quarterback or I'm sorry any position but the quarterback so tight end wide receiver or running back. You have one tight end one kicker. One defense kicker tight end. Of course is one and a half p p r everything else is p p r and you see of ten roster spots. There are twelve playoff team, Sean there. There's basically one rule you can't have more than one player from team. So you will you will play ten ten teams essentially ten players from ten different teams and two teams you will leave out. So the strategy is basically figuring out which teams the leave off which teams will be eliminated quickly because the roster is the same for the entirety of the playoffs. And you know, of course, Super Bowl points are doubled or or maybe multiplied by one and a half. So either way you want the goal is to get the most, you know, minutes played or whatever you wanna say. So it's a fun. It's it's fun. It's simple. There will be teams with the same roster. But it is and part of the reason myself, and Sean did well last year is we had a nice contrarian play of Nick foles. So. Now we can start on now who's your quarterback? Why picking them how much opin? Sean while while you were talking there. I was trying to figure out how to construct a w out of my fingers. So I could eat that w Jamieson Winston. I don't know if you saw the cowboy mocking him during the game trying trying to eat the w but James Winston not not a ton of tennis situations this weekend. We're guys are going to be playing super hard. But Jamie's Winstons one of them. I will zoom ahead to the future and site. The the way that he hustled on that pick six as we talk about the NFL show. That's coming up. So stay tuned for that subscribe to the feed at at sports gaming podcast dot com. Get sure, but but why was actually trying to think what are short? I think it's tunes sports gambling podcast dot com. Washy she gets you directly to the feed James Winston is playing hard. He's got a juicy matchup against Atlanta. He sixty one hundred dollars. So I started by noticing that he is he is in. Insanely cheap. There are about ten or eleven quarterbacks more expensive than Jameis Winston. And every week. It's just him throwing for yards. I mean, what did he do last year the last week three thirty six and a touchdown. Okay. So yeah. Only twenty points still this price point is good. He's got a great match up. I I like the stock options. Jameis winston. I mean, I don't know if you were called last week's has podcast rhyme. But I gave you guys the NFC offense of player of the week Nick big dick fulls four touchdowns four hundred yards. Craig came by the old full Stor. I'm not I don't to. I don't think things with foale's. So I'm not going to pick him this week. But I'm also going low price point like the matchup. I like the way he's been playing as of late. Gimme Sammy darnold. Fifty two hundred bucks coming off three touchdowns era. Antique game. So there's always a regression factor. But I think it's more. He's kind of finding a rhythm here late. The patriots need to win the game. But they their defense is really struggled at times. I think there's going to be some opportunities for this jets team. If not in when it matters certainly some garbage time opportunity, if the pets get up big so gimme Darnell of fifty two hundred bucks. Remembering the past? I had I had the darnold Robbie Anderson. Skied sag that was not a bad stat out of bed stack. Indeed. Right. Okay. Who's your who's your first running back? I running back a guy we we were discussing off air I believe, but this jets team sticking with it. Elisha McGuire has looked like a very competent running back. And now let zoom ahead to a match up that he certainly going to see continue to see pass targets. He seen four four and five and had three catches over his last three games. But it's more. I'm looking at these carries. He's had seventeen eighteen and fourteen. He's put up panacea points each of the last three weeks last week being his highest total of twenty three point five because he scored two touchdowns. I don't see how he doesn't find the endzone again for a fourth straight week. So at the pri- granted his price point has come up a bit at fifty three hundred I still like it. He still playing for a team. That's trying. They're going to be down. He's going to be involved in the game plan, and I expect them to find the end zone. One more time, so fifty three hundred allies McGuire. Ooh, right. I I have to do a little updating here on the old lineup because I just. Initially like Christian McCaffrey, just because of all the. All the opportunities gonna get theoretically is he bowl game. Yeah. What the fuck guys? I didn't even think the didn't even cross my mind that he may be sitting out inste- in his place. I will play a team that it's going to be fighting for their playoff lives there at home. Give me a Jalen Samuels. What's not to like about what he's done? Come in. The you know, he's is receiving the ball. He's getting touchdowns. He's running the ball. Jalen Samuels at sixty eight hundred. And it sounds it. Sounds like Connor though, the Connor is listed as questionable does sound like Connor will nappy playing. So. I if I if I were the Steelers why need why do you need them? Right. You don't need a running back. Just just Lea leave him on the sideline here. Here's Jalen Samuels. Or do I go like Chris Carson? You know, what this is one of those fucked up weeks where I want I want to get guys. I know we're gonna play the whole game when I worry about Carson is that they rest him up because he's been a like they have so many running. I'll go J worry that they're going to. All right. Kramer, who's your second running back? Ovation motivation is a key. When playing guys we haven't teen, and you kinda I want I want to get a guy who might not be playing for any team accolades right now but saquon Barkley he's a big game away from winning the rookie of the year. He's going against the Cowboys. The giants have nothing to play for. They have been scrappy of late. And I'll tell you this ten times at a ten they would love to beat the Cowboys, regardless of if it means nothing so eighty two hundred give me saquon Barkley coming off his worst game of the year, great spots by relatively low. He's now the fourth fourth-highest most expensive running back. So good value. Their gimme saquon Barkley last week is worse week. I thought it was the week before last. You could be right. Let me look. Yes. It was the week. So last year, right? He had eighteen points. That's still below his above twenty average. I'm with you. Ryan give me can you say quads eighty two hundred maybe Linda quad dole the Odal Beckham who's been it was supposed to be a three day tour. But he's he's been lost at sea on a. Oh, you're just full upon holiday season up the vote joke man over here. All right, Kramer, who's your who's your first receiver? All right. Let's stack it up. Mike Evans ten targets last week. Great matchup coming up. I thought about going for one of the cheaper options. But I Mike Evans has been he's been doing. Well, like, I said he's getting a nice nice chunk of the target share. And I think I think there's going to be ample opportunities to throw here. Mike Evans, his prices way up this week. It's a juicy matchup seventy seven hundred. Yeah, I'm going. I'm going Tyler Lockett Doug Baldwin had the huge game last week. I think Tyler Lockett could have a big game this week. He's kinda the deep threat, and you know, he had five catches for five targets for catches ninety nine yards against the chiefs. This cardinals team, you know, I don't know the Seahawks don't have a ton to play for. But I think the Aaron Jonas, oh, they're bound to get a couple of big place giving Tyler Lockett fifty nine hundred. Yes, Sean, you don't even have to throw it to me. I'm excited about this next guy because he's coming off a game where he had fifteen targets. Kenny golladay again. Sure, you might argue. Hey, are they really going to be motivated to play in cold ask Green Bay where the temperature is expected to be twenty three degrees with fifteen mile an hour winds at gametime? Well, I don't know how to move the ball, Sean. So I think they force feed golladay again, I think Green Bay clearly has some inefficiencies in the defensive backfield sixty six hundred Kenny golladay, get it going. I'm going to I'm going back to this. Well last week, I had a al-shabaab Jeffrey little disappointing as far as DFS. He had a great game though, caught a huge third and ten catch from Nick foles. Nick foles still is his number one target. He left the game for a period because of cramping. He was dealing with a flu during. In the week. So I think that may be limited some of his production. But clearly the guy that Al, you know, clearly, the number one target as far as receiver, although Erz had a really big game too. So Washington's Cornerbacks have had issues covering. I think I'll Sean has good matchup. They're gonna be playing for a potential playoff bid. Give me Al Sean Jeffrey for fifty seven hundred bucks. Who's your third receiver Kramer? Again, I'm coming back to the target game. And I know it's against my normal rules to take a white guy playing wide receiver. I did it last week with dealing well. And I didn't Jordy Nelson to a couple of weeks ago. I'm going back to the Jordy Nelson. Well, Sean, you wouldn't believe this. But this motherfucker he's got thirty six targets over the last four weeks coming off a seven catch ten target game. Where he he busted out for a solid solid fourteen point five points. You're you know, I don't think the ceiling is tremendously high here. But in a situation where they're playing the chiefs. They will certainly be down. And he's already getting this crazy target share? I I'm I'm blown away by the production. But I absolutely could see another seven catch for seventy five yard day for one Jordy Nelson in at forty nine hundred dollars. I'm great I'm really good with that price point. So let's let's do Jordy Nelson. Forty nine hundred the seem they're coming off a loss. They have a chance to get be in the mix for possible by for the playoffs there road warriors. They're going up against the Broncos team, which seemingly has packed it in. Give me Keenan Allen. You only had eight targets for five fifty eight no touchdowns. He's been pretty reliable in this chargers offense. I think I think Phillip will definitely get him. The rocks. The the chargers going up against the Broncos and Kimmy and Allen for seventy nine hundred. Sweet right before we here, you're less three positions. Here. Gotta give a quick shout out to odds. Shark dot com. Chuck dot com. The leader in sports. Odds information, betting trends, news, data whatever you need to make those right picks. You gotta check in over out shark dot com. Before you do good pals longtime partner of the podcast fund fallen Twitter as well. At odds, shark, they really, you know, it's just good content over at odd. Shark dot com. Jealous of some of the stuff they hit on in-depth articles cover a bunch of sports hockey, boxing stuff that we don't really seem to hit on his much. So give him a follow and check out the site odd shark dot com. Free picks from their supercomputer. Right. Give us your pick for tight end. Showing I'm gonna I'm gonna be honest. I think everyone I'm going to give a shout out here. Everyone needs to go. If you've not seen the catch that Chris Herndon had last week for the jets against the Packers across the middle. Degree difficulty very high there one handed extended catch as he's getting popped in the right before he gets popped in the ribs kind of brings the ball down. Just in time. One of the best catches that. I I don't know if they show not a lot of the highlight packages. I feel showed this catch which is crazy. So if you haven't seen it go check it out Chris Hernan against the Packers last week amazing catch. He's clearly a focal point of that offense with Sam darnold granted not a ton of per catch production but six catches for eighty two yards seven targets. He did score. Touchdown which is part of the reason his prices up from thirty one hundred thirty four hundred thirty four hundred is just not high enough. There will be opportunities. The patriots and outside a Robbie Anderson and Jemaine Kerr's. I am going with a rare stack here tight end tight end runningback stack. But I I think there's going to be opportunity here. And this Chris Hernan dude is one of the more impressive guys on the jets. So I'm gonna go with him for my. Tight end thirty four hundred. All right, right. Listen, I'm listening. I'm gonna use thirty eight hundred dollars for my tight end selection. Ryan and listen, the listen, listen, listen, listen the bears. They they need to help the eagles get into playoffs. And this man he helped the eagles win a Super Bowl with his Phillies special special player. Indeed, Trey Burton. He's just a cheap price point. I think I I don't know I kind of like the matchup against Vikings. But really it's just a number one tight end and a team that needs this game. Gimme Trey Burton for thirty eight hundred bucks. He's new for a touchdown as well. I was gonna say you gotta be playing the do card if you're playing you're playing him. Well, I mean who else do you like at that price point tight, end wise. I I think there's a it's a crapshoot you're playing your that's what you're planning your you're playing the he's only had one down in the past like seven games. I kind of think he's do, you know, his target shares pretty consistent at like five or six, but I think he could get a touch out against Minnesota. Gimme trae Burton who's your flex play around. I'm actually going to a match up that you highlighted earlier. And I think that's how Sean Jeffrey I think Jeffrey has generally has good chemistry with Nick foles. Didn't have it last week. I'll trust your your judgment on the cramping or whatever. The fuck was going on with his pussy ass. All of that being said he still put up eighty two yards on three catches. I think he'll be more involved this week as I think they're going to want to take some shots early against this Redskins team, which to which you know, that that is kind of in a bit of their weakness. I feel like this team has been pretty stout upfront. So all of that being said, I had fifty seven hundred dollars left alshon, Jeffery is fifty seven hundred dollars. So perfection. Sean perfection. Indeed Ryan going back to that eagles skins game. Kimmy Darren sproles. He's only forty four hundred dollars. He's gotten a touchdown in to the last three games. He's he's really been a nice key in this offense. He's getting around eight ten run. Ning? Kerry's. I mean, he had nine for thirty two. But he also had three catches for seventy six yards and a touchdown Dallas game. He also had a receiving touchdown and Josh Adams possibly in the doghouse for that. That late fumble. I think could you could see some more. This is the most when game for the eagles. So I wouldn't be surprised if they give the ball more to veteran guy like sproles and they've gotten the screen game going. I could see he seems to be the go-to guy for that as well. So a lot of opportunity here for Darren sproles, and he's only forty four hundred dollars. Gimme gimme spur. How is he still good, man? How is he still affective? He's old. He he's he's taking many hits. He it's the same thing with Adrian Peterson. I thought Adrian Peterson was done a million times. But Adrian Peterson is having a career year. It's crazy. He's going to get like doubt. I mean firs age he's going to get a I think if he hasn't gotten into righty. He's gonna rush thousand yards. That's insane his age, and especially like not only is age, but his Kerry total like he's just the guys had insane amount of work sproles. It's been unfortunate. He's kind of been pretty injured the past two seasons. And he just comes in late. The Dallas game was his first game in the season. Basically. You know, he played little in the opener. But yeah, it's great to see him play and the guys just a workout machine and especially at his size. It's it's crazy still he's still playing at a high level. Well, the Peterson thing is way more impressive though. Because he he's the only bit of offense. They have on that team. So it's God. I mean, but he was always a free. That was always the book on Peterson. Right. Like, he's a he's a freak. And he's showing it right? Like, he's he's old shit. And he's still one of the best running backs in the NFL. Indeed. All right. Where's your d at? Let's so I had twenty one hundred dollars so here my option. Sean Tampa home against Atlanta jets on the road against the patriots lions on the road against the Packers giants home against the Cowboys Niners or bangles both on the road. The giants because like we. They look if this team if Dallas sits people down they can become a real trash team. I mean Dakota Prescott is not that good. And he's light years ahead of back. If Zeke Elliott comes out of this game. I mean, I who knows right. If if they sit Cooper down like they they don't have anything else. So I certainly liked the idea of potentially getting this this Dallas b squad for a half with a defense for twenty one hundred dollars. Yep. I I got one of those defense. You talked about the Tampa Bay bucks Atlanta. I mean, I just don't see them putting up a decent offensive game back toback road games outdoors that Carolina game was maybe they're like, hey show up. I like your angle on the bucks being motivated and Jamison home. Yeah. He's playing in a contract year. He's he's got to figure it out. I and they're only twenty one hundred dollars. This Atlanta defense on the road is just something you wanna fade, and you're not you're getting a home defense or twenty one hundred dollars. Pretty good opportunity there. So give me the Tampa Bay bucks. Will Tampa exercise the option that's interesting man because he's e as as on that border of like just playing good enough that give you some hope about like, well, if we bring in a different core coach and its players around. But then like, I is option just a one year thing. Yeah. I think they do because any someone to play quarterback. And I don't think they're going to be in a position to draft someone in the in the first round that's going to be an easy replacement. I think what you do is you probably just draft or, you know, exercise Winstons option keep them around for another year traffic. I wait. Did we do? We miss this. They exercise this option earlier this year. How did we all miss this? Oh, wait. But was is the option this year? Oh, yeah. I know. No, no. They've already picked up the two thousand nineteen option. God damn it all year talking about James Winston come into the. But I think there's a I think there's a way you can get out of it though. I think that's what it is. Because the guaranteed money on that fifth year option is in like, I don't know you'd have to look into it. But I think there's an easy enough way out of it. Because I've heard a lot of people talking about him going to other spots or he could he can be traded to if he really is under contract. All that being said, I think you're right. It out for with Winston for one more year. The buccaneers picked up, blah, blah, blah. Here's the catch. It is guaranteed. Only for injury. If Winston gets seriously hurt over the next two weeks, the bugs have to pay him. Yeah. If he's healthy. But they decide they that. They don't want want him. They can cut him without concept. Yeah. So it's like it's they picked it up. But not I mean, but they really could get rid of them in a win be big deal. But for a quarterback like is paying a guy like that twenty million dollars. I mean, I feel like where you can't really get a quarterback for less than fifteen right? Yeah. I mean, that's the thing you don't draft. So it's like you're in a weird spot is Winston better than. You know, twenty quarterbacks in the or better than ten quarterbacks in the NFL. Probably that's the sad. So it's are you going to? I mean who is a free agent this year and the quarterback class that you would you would definitely take over them. I mean, if you're if you like foles enough to give one hundred million guaranteed, you know, I don't know. And I don't know if I the way folds is with the eagles now closely is with the city. I'd be surprised if he signs with an NFC team. I think he's really going to focus on if he does recite somewhere else he's going to look to go to the AFC. So it doesn't have to play the eagles. There's there's a lot that could happen. But I think there's a box. You just kind of kick the can down the road all of it and see what more you can get out of Winston, right? I think the bucks will end up cut it like letting Winston go and trading for Carson Wentz. All right. Well, what's this potential? Carson Wentz straight. Let's see. I don't know. I don't know. Maybe you get Mike Evans in return. Maybe Gerald Gerald McCoy has to be in there. I don't know. Just doesn't have a man. He can't stay healthy. He's not he's not ater or winter. Like, Nick foles. I just you know, try to help you out putting all the arguments on on a platter. You just gotta take that fat head dude down to just trade it for a Nick foles one. I do regret giving away. My Nick foles jersey when chip Kelly fuck and traded him away. I've talked about a couple of times on the podcast. But I went to drop it off at the Salvation Army. And you know, my now wife says what are you doing? Why are you getting rid of your foles jersey, you love foles Geos? What if he's going to come back on the team? I'm like, there's no scenario. In which Nick foles comes back to the team. If he does come back to the team it'll be years later, and it'll be some like third or fourth, you know, option his career here is done. And then lo and behold big dick Nick SuperBowl MVP taken out Tom Brady. So where does he sit on the Philly pantheon right now? Of quarterbacks no athletes. Oh, where does Nick Nick is Nick foles, the number one Philly athlete right now. Or is that? It's well, I mean football's always bigger than anything and Nick foles won the Super Bowl. So I don't know. It's a weird dynamic. But I think yeah, I mean foles yet. I mean, people are getting into basketball because now that they're competitive, but football is just so much bigger. If you're saying foles Embiid, I would say falls all day. Okay. But I think people realize he's not gonna be around forever. So maybe they're not binding long-term full foles in wins walk into a bar hot girl at the bar who's who's taking her home foles. Neither because both married and super religious Jesus Christ. Good luck with that, Sean. All right. Let's get out of here on that. All right. Thank you. As always for participating in this sports gaming pass rate review and share on I tunes come on guys. We've had a good year throws couple bones and the elder tunes for sports gaming back Hess. I'm Shawn second the money green. And he has Ryan. Congratulations. Once again to the baby f- in Wales for finishing in nineteenth place. Kramer, let it ride.

Al Sean Jeffrey Nick foles Ken Ryan Kramer NFL Jamieson Winston eagles patriots Cowboys Sean stack Boston Twitter official Mike Evans giants Atlanta partner Jordy Nelson
How O Magazines Arianna Davis Made It, on Her Own Terms

Latina to Latina

27:08 min | Last month

How O Magazines Arianna Davis Made It, on Her Own Terms

"Connect your little ones to their latino greatness with dumpty goes they're bilingual learning out books and toys teach kids phonics math and even emotional intelligence in english and spanish visit on world dot com slash latina to try and start their bilingual journey. Watch out world over a big part of this. Podcast is finding inspiration in the lives. Journeys of other latinos and that is exactly what arianna davis does in her new book. What would free to do a guy to living boldly. there's no doubt that. Frida kahlo is a good source for that inspiration. Arianna is to talk about the risky move. That helped her get her foot. In the door at omega zine her decision to leave and then come back and how you cultivate enduring relationships when you work with some of the most powerful women in media you're right anyone yearning for more creatively fulfilling life. Shouldn't strive to emulate or be. Frida the most impactful art is created when you tell your own story. What is the story. Then that you would want to tell me one of my goals in one of the stories. I want to tell through my career as a journalist and a writer is inspiring other women particularly women of color. And i think that. That's that's my point here in drawing from fritos life is not to say. Here's a blueprint of how to live your life. But it's more here's the story of a woman who lived her life boldly very far ahead of her time. And hopefully just by reading restoring gets no her. You'll be inspired to live your own life your own way but boldly treated a mascot a different way. Which is if you were telling your own story. Where would you want that story to begin with being a little girl. I grew up in outside of baltimore. Data's black my mom's puerto rican to grew up by racial. Ed grew up in the suburbs around the white kids and with the private school. So identity for me was always a very complicated thing especially as a kid. And i was also really shy kid and i was the kid who always heather nose in a book so i think my story would probably start with being a little girl and just finding such solace in such escape in the pages of a book. And that's really what i think kick started my love of writing and reading and storytelling and it would then kind of take me through. This journey of wanted to be a writer. Going to penn state in setting journalism thinking that i had to go down the newspaper track because that was what was accessible at the time versus magazines. What i really want always wanted to do. But the road of magazines so inaccessible. It was this glamorous world that only to be frank women who had access privilege and could pay to move to new york city in intern. Not make much money but it was. Thanks to I was a scholarship student at penn state in at a dinner that we had the publisher of seventeen magazine spokane. She gave this really inspirational speech. And afterwards you know this was either crazier genius. But i basically would follow her to the bathroom and told her i would love to break in journalism. I would love to be magazines. I asked her business card her name. Is jane jamieson. And once i moved to new york. I reached out. Should we had coffee. She was super helpful and she basically long story short helped me to get my foot in the door and get my resume to apply for postgraduate entertainment oprah magazine and that's really. What kind of kicked off my career you all know. I did not grow up speaking spanish. My husband did and it's really important to us that our girls have exposure to the language when i interviewed susie had a meal the creator of county. Course she gives me a book for my girls and they love it like we read it all the time and now the older one is using. They're bilingual learning app. The use the same nursery rhymes from our childhood think narrow and if on rows and arrows to teach kids concepts like phonics letters math and emotional intelligence through song and play the games songs alternate between english and spanish so it's super easy to learn languages plus the characters are adorable by ethos and if those we can't get enough to squeeze their little cheeks they've also got books games and toys the just bring the lessons and fun from the app full circle. If you wanna learn more about bringing language and culture to life for your little one visit gun. Tikos world dot com slash latina. That's because world dot com slash latina start their bilingual journey today and watched their latino greatness. It is one of the boldest moves. I have ever heard to follow someone into that. 'cause you say that could only go ways it really couldn't honestly if you ask me now. I don't know what overcame at the time. I don't know i. It wasn't something that i planned. I remember it. It just kind of kicked in and i was like i cannot lead relief this dinner without at least introducing myself and getting some face time with harassing her for card and i just went for it. Were both sort of in love with formats for you magazines for me. Working cable television that we keep being warned dying. How have you adjusted your career and your work accordingly for me. After i was at overmatched for six years in it was asked. I love to say that oprah magazine raised me abbas gilkissons assistant for four years is the best possible first job growth could ask for in the in the media industry and then going from that. So then i was an editor at oprah mag but i realized i really wanted to get digital experience and also to spread my wings so i left and went to us weekly and then i went to refinery. Twenty nine refining Was really where. I really kind of homemade digital chops and i realize that was where i got to learn really what it was like writing for digital and the difference between writing for print magazine and like writing in the voice of this magazine to being able to write for my own perspective and writing for social media understanding. Seo things. and. I also got to do some on camera work in hosting and i really realized i think during my time at refinery like this is the future this is where things are headed and so that was what really started in and that was what eventually led me to come back to automatic to launch over magazine's website overman dot com as the digital director. So kind of went again a little circle in coming back to. Oh but also literally starting there at print and then coming back to launch this digital team right. It's like back to the future. So i do think for me. It wasn't a tight left. I got all this experience elsewhere that i became known as like digital wonder kinsey. You know after my time at refinery that then it was like okay. I could come back to oprah mag in a new light in with a new level of experience in respect where people could say like okay. She's the right person. Because i know this brand no the magazine but i also have the experience in the background to say like. Here's how can make a digital. What did you do that made known inside the industry as digital one. Pretend i mean. I don't wanna say digital wonder. Can i think that sound very. I should say freed up i would say i. I wouldn't necessarily say it was known in the industry. But i will say that. I think one thing that i did really well was understanding the types of stories that i think millennial women but also specifically women of color were really interested in. I think i became really had a good instinct for just what does well on the internet and what people were interested in reading. And i think especially like i wrote a lot refinery a lot of personal essays features about topics that were specifically interesting to women of color. I think i just had a really good instinct for things that were like in the invoice. And that was something. What was your metric. There was your metric like if i am interested in this that i know that other women of color will be interested in this. How did you develop that sense of what it was that would really resonate with the audience as we think it was just instinct. I think it was also just someone as someone who just constantly plugged in. And i'm always reading. And i'm always reading. What is on the internet. And i think that i was at refineries specifically during a time when it was i think the perspective of women of color was something that we were seeing more digitally and it was during kind of a prime time where i was like. I'm seeing the stories. That are out there that i'm seeing a lot of buzz. That do well. I know what stories i click on. I know what stories i wanna read. And so i think i just had a good sense from literally just as a reader of someone who just loves pop culture media than turning into okay. Well if i were writing story on you know beyond his grammy loss. Would i wanna just write about beyond his dreams Maybe wanna think about how this's signifier of a bigger problem of how black women aren't valued compared to white women at work and so it was things like that where i was literally thinking about what i would want to read and how i would want to take a story to the next level versus just like the straight up news in a started to get a really sharp sense of that. I wanted to try to bring to the oprah magazine audience. Is there something. That's getting in the way of your happiness or that's preventing you from achieving your goals. I have found in my own life talking with someone can make a big difference but sometimes the logistics finding the right person. The time to connect makes things complicated. Better help online. Counseling connects you with a professional counselor in a safe and private online environment. You can get help on your own time at your own pace you can schedule secure video phone sessions plus chattan text with your therapist better helps licensed professional counselors specialize in everything from depression to relationships to self esteem. In fact so many people have been using better help that they're recruiting additional counselors in all fifty states festival. It's an affordable option the teen until the tino listeners. Get ten percent off your first month with the discount code latina so why not join. one million. People were taking charge of their mental health. Go to better. Health dot com slash latina. That's better help. H. e. l. p. dot com slash. Latina it just really struck me as i was reading. What would free to do that. Freedom never painted with the public in mind and yet your work as a writer as an editor just a must by necessity be crafted with the audience in mind in your current role as digital director of over magazine or you oversee all of ober mag dot com editorials. Social video strategy is a huge job. How do you sort of assess each piece that you assign you. Add it against your sense of who the audiences and what that audience wants one of the most important things that i think i established for our saint john was. We have as imaginer reminded. Her name is janet and we talk a lot about jan. She's probably in her early forties. She isn't coming to us for parenting contact because like she. She's a mom but she is probably coming to us more for an escape. She's coming to us for that. Live your best life. Content that oprah so known for. She's coming to us for the service in four a dose of acitivity. She's coming for us for advice on how to live her best life on how to have a better outlook on life on. Maybe with a side of royals news a little thin. It's gonna pick her up in in make her better. I think a lot. And i wrote a lot in my book. The likability trump about mentor shed and sponsorship. And how critical mentorship and sponsorship are is in general but especially for women of color and also how delicate those relationships are so when you have worked with someone like gayle king when you've been in proximity to someone like oprah. How do you maintain those relationships. And how do you leverage those relationships. It's funny because Is not a fan of the word mentor but you know. She has a huge mentor. I feel like a lot of it is just because gil goodhearted. And i'm also the same ages her kids so that in a way when i was her sister and i was like this like twenty two year old. Who was in new york with. No family She also kind of dislike notre. She really took me under her wing. And i think what has been key for our relationship also my relationships with other women who have helped me along the way as i think just almost treating those relationships our friend and realizing that you can't just go to people when you need something like you said it's it's really just checking in its paying attention to what they're doing if guilt as a really big interview or something that she does. It makes me proud. I reach out to her and her know that keeping up on communication open. And making sure that you're not only reaching out to them when you need something but that you're also just showing them love and being there for them to. I think that that's really important. Especially i think for women of color. It's just having that relationship. That almost feels like familial in it's not just like a transactional thing where it's only when one person needs something or the other. I think that's really key. It's such good advice. In some ways it should not be that hard to deploy and yet it is a lot of the nuance of maintaining those relationships that a realizes is hard to teach for a lot of people right like that the way we talk about mentorship and sponsorship ends up sounding really transactional and yet what you said is really like what creates a sticky relationship. You right of writing the book. Which i realize it's very meta. I imagined freda shaking her head at the silly girl who is forcing creativity upon herself instead of letting it happen. Naturally how did you your square that truth. Which is that creativity Needs time and space to happen with the realities of being against a bad line. I am one of those writers. I think who does thrive best under pressure and under deadlines. Like i think that i'm definitely a procrastinator. So i think i read. I write about this in the book. I definitely had moments where i was like. I know that. Like i have to write twenty thousand word by the end of this month but let's let's go to bridge. I think for me. It was remembering also i think a lot of a lot of celebrities and raiders. Say this it's like sometimes you have to live life in order to get that creativity and inspiration so there would be some times where i would unexpectedly. Just be out whether i was like. I walk out getting drinks with friends where i was at the movies. Or whatever where. I would unexpectedly find inspiration or something would occur to me or come to me in a way. That was very organic very natural. I did try to think about that and think about the fact that like frito wasn't ever a deadline. She was never on any under any specific pressure. She was just creating what came to her. And what felt right unnecessary necessary to her. In that moment we all start producer. Paulina to try out the new summit in tarsus sweater from fiery. She is the youngest and the hippest among us her response. It is the most delicious softest sweater. The whole fiery collection gives me watching the sunset on the beach vibes wearing fire. D- pieces feels like the cosio ever been outdoors telling stories or on the bonfire taking long walk hand in hand on a moonlit night looking up at the stars on the porch. And that is by design. I want to invite you to use the code. Latino latina for twenty five percent off your purchase on thirty brand dot com. That's latino latina for twenty five percent off at faraday brand dot com. We've got a special page for our listeners. Already brand dot com slash latino latina. That's f. a. H. e. r. t. y. brand dot com slash latina to latina. Which autumn gets you a twenty five percent discount happy shopping. Frieda had extreme confidence at the same time. She wasn't uncritical of herself. Which i really relate to. I wonder if you do too. And if so israel where that. Duality shows up in your own life one hundred percent. Listen writing this book. I had my own doses of imposter syndrome. You know it sounds amazing like direct for brush like that's an accomplishment and something i'm proud of and i know that like you know it's pretty bad ass really think about it. I'm like i'm confident in my career in where gotten to be but then at the same time the idea of writing a book and writing a book about one of the most famous woman in history and the fact that you know as i said like i'm not mexican so there was that piece of in there was a lot of elements of this. That had me wondering like am i. The right person to write. This book should be writing this book. What if people hate the book people might not understand my voice. Maybe they'll think i'm a crazy person for like writing about this imaginary free at all of those doubts in those. Those criticisms definitely came to mind while working on this specifically and sometimes also in my day job at over maggots. Sometimes when the weight of it hits me that you know. I'm thirty three years old. And i'm leading this this amazing brands and that's incredible and something to be proud of to be confident about but sometimes there are times where i mean meetings with people who are more than twice my age and have been in journalism for a very long time and i can recognize that. They're looking at me as a young person or they're looking at me as the only brown person in the room and i've had a lot of moments in my career being the only or the other and that's also something that can make you doubt yourself were feel critical but i think that in the end i just mostly tried to just trust the journey and transfer. I'm going recognized that. I think everything happens for a reason. So the fact that the opportunity is book came about in that i was given us opportunity. I just had to go for it. And if i was gonna write a book about living authentically and living boldly. I have to do the same in my writing of it. And i couldn't try to write it or be someone that i wasn't because i was doubting myself where i was worried or had insecurities that have to just go for my book. Agents said to me. And i thought this was a good piece of advice when i saw bore out in. What would free to do. Which is it's much interesting to read about someone who is on a journey themselves and someone who is a little bit unresolved then to read a book about someone who is a finished product impart because there's more honest right like there's like no one who's one hundred percent fully aligned and fully baked and how uninteresting would it be if someone was just like had arrived at their destination especially at thirty three. It is more interesting to be with someone in process right to be a person who wants to live boldly and is on your own journey to get there. Yeah i think. I think that one of the reasons why i'm i'm starting to embrace my social media presence more lean into it more because i realized like what you said. I think that people enjoy the fact that you know they can follow along on the journey and that they can be that can feel a part of it. And i try to be as authentic as possible be honest i try my best to tell my story and say like listen. I am director for mad but there were times when i was an intern making minimum wage eating peanut butter and jelly sandwiches for lunch. While like you know the glamorous girls in her high heels were like going to get sushi. Whatever it like. Just remembering those moments where i was just like. I'm never gonna make it in this industry or i like to talk as much as possible about the mini knows that i got there. Was this like this dream job. That i went forward at that i made it to. The final edits has phase of analysis. This is it. I'm getting in then. I didn't get it in. I'm pretty frank about my time at us. weekly. I did not. I had a pretty negative experience Ten months and that was that was hard after being at the dream job of and loving it so much in having grown up there and then taking this risk leaving and then going to a place where i immediately realize this was not the right fit and trying to navigate that and it was. It was rough. How did you realize that. What was it that happened. That made it clear was a feeling of realizing i. I'm really big energy and vibes person. And i think the one thing that i've really realized from that experience is who you work with so important and i think that the people who worked at a place really at least immediate will say i think the people who work in a place can really represent what the what that outlet in that in that that publication is all about and i think that's why i loved my time at overmach so much because every single person who works at Really embodies that kind of spirit of like living. Your best life from really is like a positive person in it feels right for the publication refinery. It was all like you know. Young millennial women who had really wanted to empower people. And then i think it s weekly it. It did almost feel i could fit in that. It was a lot of like kind of i. Don't wanna talk badly about them. But i will just sit. There was there was just an energy there that i felt like was not a fit for my spirit and who i was what kind of storyteller i wanted to be end. I realized that pretty early on. So i say all that to say that i think that for me i i try to be as open as possible with those things just make people realize like yes when i tell my story of let s started as an intern and on the digital director. I'm only thirty three like it. Sounds amazing it sounds great in it is but they're also were a lot of down moments. There were a lot of obstacles along the way and so. I think that that's part of going back to your point of following. The journey i think is so interesting because also like i don't know how my journey's to end a nobody else says but i think that's part of what makes it interesting. You write in your dedication to what would free to do to frida kahlo. Who taught me the most important lesson of all. Viva la vida. What has that come to mean to you. I mean it's that. I think of everything has really stuck with me. The most during this pandemic in that frito on the last painting that she painted not long before she died it was a painting of a really vibrant painting of watermelons and she wrote at the bottom of it. Viva la vida. And now you know kind of her. Her mantra in this was someone who she had just had her leg implicated. She was literally in pain. Twenty four seven she. Her husband had cheated on her with her sister. Not that many years before it was looking like her days were numbered and yet still all those things that she had gone through her last message to the world was viva la vida and to me. That was just so inspiring. Because it's just like no matter. What on the days during this pandemic. when. I'm just never gonna leave the house again like it's just you know like i get very like i get very i can have a very negative outlook can get down on myself where it can be like. You know just thinking about all the negative things in just feeling like we're going to be trapped houses forever dislike going into the spiral of doom. But then i do think about frieda in. It's like this was a woman who would just spend months at a time in bed and didn't know she could ever walk again. Didn't know she was going to die. The next day didn't know if you know her husband really loved her and there's just so many different things and when i think about the fact that all that she was still able to channel this positive message of just like liberal life like what's most important and you only get one of. It is what i take from that. It just reminds me that no matter how bad things get her. How bad of a day of having. I can also channel that same energy. Afrita could ask you one more question because you said something very early on about growing up and being half puerto rican half black growing up in the burbs going to private school predominantly white Identity was always complicated. Was there a moment. Wer- became uncomplicated. To be completely honest with you. I think i've only really felt less complicated about identity. Maybe like the last two years like it might look now that i'm in my early thirties. I grew up. You know growing up in a place where being other like being non white was just like that was in itself not the norm but then it was if anything was black and white. There weren't very many latinos in maryland. Or at least the part of maryland where. I'm from elegant city but outside of baltimore so there was a lot of jokes. My black friends would say. Oh so okay. So you're mexican right. And i'm like no i'm lacking quarter. I'm like yeah same or you talk white girl. you're not. you're not even really black. Then my latino family would make fun of me. 'cause i don't speak spanish or they would. There would always be whispers because there was a lot of drama when my parents got married about the fact that my mom to black man that was that was always kind of like the secret thing that was in my family. And so all those things affect you when you're growing up in especially when you're kidding all you want more than anything is just fit in to have friends and you know the kids at school with tease about my hair. All of those are things that stick with you even as an adult in. Even even i think in my twenties and trying to find my way there were there. Were times where. I would find the people that i thought were even my friends in adult with question my identity will be like well like since you're not really a black girl or like they would say things that were i would just be like. Wow like you know and so. It's something that. I think. Unless i think a lot of people unless you did grow up with some type of duality. It's not necessarily always easy for people to understand. And i think for me even sometimes when people will say like what side you identify with more and i'm like both i feel like if i picked one of the other that's picking one over the other like i'm a black woman. I'm very proud to be black woman. I'm also very proud to be puerto rican women you know. This is who i am. And i think that i can now really stand for land that and stand firm the identity and an open up about much struggles with that and how that journey has has come along. Now feel more confident in myself but it did. It took a very long time it. There's a lot of pieces that go into it. Embracing my hair embracing how i look conversing how i speak. All of those are things that are part of the journey. So i think that it's it's still complicated. It probably will always be complicated but at a point. Now where the little uncomplicated. so all. That is things that i've carried inside me also carried. I think into rooms that. I've walked into my career where i feel like i have to explain and make things clear or help people understand that. Duality of who am i. Thank you so much for doing this for taking the time or is this was such a great conversation. I could talk to you all day. You were great. Thanks for joining us. Latino latina is executive produced and owned. Baiju lak- latigo williams and me alicia menendez but in your laura is our managing producer. Cedric wilson is our producer. Gardellin out rodriguez mixed this road. Manoa is our social media editor. We love hearing from you. Email us at orla at latina to latino dot com and remember to subscribe or follow us on radio apple. Podcasts google podcasts. Wherever you are listening please. Please leave a review. It is the fastest easiest ways to help us grow as a community.

oprah magazine oprah arianna davis heather nose jane jamieson abbas gilkissons Frida kahlo imaginer Arianna Frida cosio susie spokane frank kinsey baltimore frito new york
Cathy Jamison

The Toxin Terminator

46:54 min | 1 year ago

Cathy Jamison

"Hey everyone my next guest. Is Cathy. Jamieson from British Columbia. She is the host of live. Your best life podcast. She has a phenomenal. Stir story that she's going to be sharing with us about how food and her food sensitivities have really been something she's dealt with her entire life from an early early age where she had truly meltdowns and Stuttering issues and our mom was really tying that into noticing a pattern with that win. There were certain foods that she was eating so she learned early on that. Hey there might not be some really great ingredients in our food and fast forward to becoming an adult where that all kind of flat but she really got hit saw upside the head where she had a lot of issues just screaming at her. Saying listen to me. And she's GonNa tell you what those symptoms word that she was faced with where she really started thinking about a. Don't just want to go on a diet and lose weight. I truly want to live a healthier lifestyle and that don't her in to really removing toxins from her life and it is a powerful story. Welcome to the Toxin Terminator Helping People to restore and renew their health by removing toxins from the home and their lives joining in as industry. Thought leaders help you understand the physical and emotional effects each product can have on you and your family and a safe alternative you can use to remove the hidden toxins for renewed health. Now please welcome your host the toxin. Terminator Herself Amy. Carlson and welcome to today's episode. Everybody's I have got Cathy Jamieson with me. She is so much fun. We met actually online of all places. She's another podcast host and I think once you kind of get into that podcast. World get entered into this whole other arena. Don't you think caffeine? It's been so much fun. All the connections and all the people that I'm meeting I I'm really looking forward to the journey. And all the people to meet swiped really fun it is so much fun and we're so glad that you're here I The opportunities just abound we get to meet people from all over the place. I've been interviewing people from the UK from Australia. Young I it just is is I it just mind blowing to me so I'm so grateful for these opportunities. Thank you so Kathy's podcast is called. You live your best life so i WanNa make sure that you guys are finding her podcast. Because I've listened to her episodes is she's really bring people on talking all about how we do that. How do we live our best life? And can you tell us a little bit of bought Behind what your creation for the podcast was stir so beginning of two thousand eighteen. I really started being serious about my health. And we'll talk more but my whole health journey in a bit but over that process. I I lost fifty pounds. I got rid of a lot of help. Chronic health conditions that were plaguing me and then I just felt like I needed to share this wealth and knowledge with the world and I just felt this passion like okay. How can I help? People get healthy because I want everyone to feel as good as I'm feeling right now and it started with. Maybe all start an instagram account. That is just health focused. And I'll try to get people tips and ideas on how they could be healthier and that spiraled a little bit and I thought well you know I really love listening to podcasts. And listening to health experts on podcast. I'm personally learned a lot on podcast. It's actually where I got a lot of my tips and ideas for my own health journey and I thought well. Gee Why couldn't I do that? Why could I find people to interview? And I really just jumped in with speech. And I started contacting people for interviews and soon as I got one. Yes the ball was rolling and I just started doing podcasts. It was a ton of fun and really. Yeah my goal is just to help educate people to empower people to be advocates for their own health. And I think of health is all encompassing. It's not just about wait. It's not just about the food we eat. It really is holistic and whole health and so to me it really is about living your best life and that was the name for the podcast Abso. I love it I love you. Know giving the voice giving a voice to the community and like you said when when you get into podcasting and you get the opportunity to interview so many different people it just really opens up a whole new world to you and Kathy are correct me if I'm wrong. Are you in British Columbia? Is that correct? That's right. I'm in Vancouver. Bc nother Canadian earlier. Today I love our neighbors up north so you have a really powerful journey I Know I love to share the stories with my my listeners because I think stories are what touch us so much and As I researched and learn more about you I saw that you really started kind of paying attention and learning all about some food sensitivities at really a a young age was that kind of the beginning of the House journey for you. Well I have to give credit to my mom for that and in a way it was the beginning and then things kind of turned around. Full Circle I so we wanted to start at the beginning so when I'm was about three years old my started to notice that I was having extreme and I honestly have to give her a lot of credit and this is no slight against her but my mom was young he was nineteen when I was born and not a lot of education like as far as health or medical community. Anything like that but she was very observant and she noticed that after I would eat certain things I would have. These horrific meltdowns horrific tantrums. I would be an emotional rack beside myself. And some people would just take that as a toddler Tantrum that for heads just act that way sometimes but she noticed the connection with food she noticed it was usually within thirty minutes of me eating something and I would go away after a few hours and some of the things that were going on while as I was extremely hyperactive. I had these meltdown Tantrum. In fact I remember my childhood pretty young and I remember three years old sitting under the kitchen table holding onto the table. A scream at the top of my lungs and have no idea why no idea why I was acting like that and I also stuttered in my early childhood and I even remember in my brain as I'm stuttering thanking. My words just can't keep up with how fast I'm talking. I was talking so fast. My brain just couldn't keep up so my mom took me to our regular family doctor and this was back in the eighties. This is before. Adhd had label and she didn't even take which the doctor saying she's hyperactive or she's acting out she went in saying I think she has food sensitivities. I'm seeing this connection between her eating and these reactions and I think that's what set in motion for heading on the right path. The family doctor said okay. I'm going to recommend you see this natural allergy specialists now. He's a little Kooky a little Doodoo but he has some good ideas so I think it's worth seeing him so we went to see the doctor and he basically gave a list of foods that he said. Okay she should avoid all of these foods and then my mom trotted a little bit further instead. Well what about these particular food? What you noticed in particular was breakfast. If she made me OATMEAL for breakfast. And we're talking not instant oatmeal with the flavorings. Just regular slow. Cook oats back then. I would be fine. But if she gave me a cereal I like strategies I would be off the wall off the rails uncontrollable unconsolable. So as soon as she said back to him he said Oh okay she needs to go on a diet call faingold diets and any of your listeners can could google that diet but what made him make. The connection was when she talked about. The shredded cheese traits has a preservative in it called. Ht and Fagel Diet. Will you look at the list of foods to avoid artificial flavorings the preservatives the food coloring basically every chemical that has been put into our food to make it? Franken food and not food anymore right and the really interesting thing about B. H. T. in particular at so it's put Fresh USUALLY CEREALS I. It's to prevent the oils from oxidizing or going rancid quickly. And it's a chemical that gives the food a longer shelf life so of course the manufacturers think this is fantastic but big tea is also used as an ingredient in jet fuel and cosmetics rubber petroleum products and embalming fluid all great innings to have in our body right. And so if you just like let that thing in from it why would you wanna put this ingredient in your body and who said it was safe and the thing that I really think about? My childhood is okay so I was having severe reactions to these food additives. So we quickly took an out. Somebody who's not having severe reactions to these food additives. What's to say they're not affecting them. Well it's to say that they're safe. I believe that they're safe for anybody. I just happened to be reacting more severely than somebody else might right. So we We followed the Diet and my mom started doing everything from scratch basically so there no processed foods. There's nothing coming out of a box. We didn't even by starbuck dread because a lot of the bread hads hydrogenated oil which was also on the list with one of those terrible things l. Should be eating anyways so mom started making bread from scratch and Baker. But she learned how to do it a lot of effort into it and what will go through as as a parent for our child. You know to make sure that they have everything that they need to have. Absolutely and I told my mom many times that that is the one thing that I am just so grateful for. We can all look back at our childhoods and thank you know. Oh Bitch things. My parents should have done differently. I mean I grew up in the eighties. I'm was surrounded by secondhand smoke by extended relatives at. There's less than antibiotics. Doctors were handing out antibiotics. Like Candy of course commenced even conventional doctors. They know better now. They're much more cautious with the antibiotics. So there's a lot of things that could have been done differently but the one thing. I'm really grateful that my mum somehow had the insight and intuition to see what was going on with their child. And I wasn't one of these kids who ended up on a screen medication like Ritalin for hyperactivity which sadly so many are and the numbers are rising all the time right the kids that are being diagnosed that way and I don't think it's a coincidence that that number is going up. I really think it has to do with the Frankenfoods and the processed foods that are out there. Everyone assumes safe because nobody has proven to them otherwise right well I've got a really good friend. That purdue are produced it program called wiggles away and one of the things that she says and she gets a little bit more rigid even than what the Feingold Diet is but she recommends that definitely is something that all parents went to take a look at if they have a child with focus issues or on the spectrum whether it's you know low are hi? This is certainly something that they're going to want to take a look at because there's so many foods that were putting in our body that are neuro toxin and spectrum as a neuro toxic disease. So you know we certainly do not want compound that So that so you you through early childhood on N. Like you said Kudos to your mother for putting the connection together then as you went through You got a little bit lax. We were talking in between recordings here about you have a teenage daughter now and how difficult that is when our children get to the teen years that they're not young enough where we can kind of. I hate to say the Word Control Them. But but you did your own thing you know you started eating out more. You started kind of going into A more lax state of what you were in you know as an as an early child And you talked about you know really. You talked about struggling with some of the mental attitudes within a family. Can you kind of share a little bit about that because your history really was more focused on food in food being the source of some of your issues and you had family members that were like you guys are crazy? That's true that's true so so yeah as I got a little bit older. I think we we all got a little bit more lax. My mom thought that perhaps my these sensitivities were something that I could grow out of and so we started not be as strict and then. Yeah when I when I got into my team years. There wasn't really much control. My mom could could have we. Would we would go out to eat and do whatever but as far as family members go. Yeah you know So my mom's side of the family and my Dad's side of the family were pretty much polar opposites as far as food and food relationship. My My my dad was was morbidly obese and unfortunately he did pass away at the age of fifty four and I saw him struggle. I saw him struggle with all the health complications. And I think it's hard my motivation for wanting to help people get healthy today but on my dad's side of the Family. They showed love with food for sure. And so it was really disappointing for my grandma. If she wanted to give me a treats and my mom would have to be. The bad guy knows sorry. She can't have that she's honored. We used to say I was allergic to it or its food sensitivity and my grandma would be like well. What do you what do you mean? I don't see her acting weird. Do Anything Weird. Yeah because she's following that we put her on your. It costs them. Some grief and some conflict for sure. I and even a child in school I can remember. You know not being able to participate in the traits that were happening or if there was snacks or Sunday night. The kids even be like well. What do you mean you? Can't you can't eat that what what's wrong with that. And so but still so grateful that I was put on the Diet and I. There was a solution. I think I think that's the most important thing but as I got older. I really wanted to believe that I could just eat whatever I wanted. I wanted to just not worry and not care and eat the macaroni and cheese out of the box and eat the processed foods and so I really did start to put it by the wayside and into my twenties into adulthood. I I would try to eat healthy ish because I always wanted to watch my weight but it was really only a concern about my weight. I didn't thinks was acting in any other way. I thought that my Moody nist and my really bad. Pms every month was just normal for me. I thought that The occasional bouts of asthma that I would get just normal for me and then fast forward into I've turned forty and at this point. I'm really overweight. I am the same weight as I was nine months pregnant with my daughter. And it's not even so much about the size but I had all these health problems that when I've just couldn't ignore anymore and I don't mean to interrupt but you said something that I want to really kind of hone in on and I want people to hear this. Is You said you know? I HAVE MY MOODY. Nece MY PMS. Mike cramping my occasional asthma. This that it was just normal in. I think especially as women. Sometimes we go through feeling crappy and you know for me like I had menopause for what fifteen years and it's not normal but but we accept things as being normal and that just blows me away that we all you know well. It's just normal just normal absolutely absolutely in fact. That's my mantra now. Is that what you think is normal is does not have to be your normal rusher and I think we are all especially about anything to do with women cycles. I think we are taught that that that time of your month is supposed to be a horrible time and that you're going to be a raving lunatic and there's nothing that can be done about it wrong so wrong so it's funny because here you are at a time alive and you've got your body speaking so loudly to you right. You're you're talking about you. Know you. Also talk about having heartburn and acid reflux. And so you've got where your your body saying. Hey pay attention to me know Kathy. I'm talking to you here but sometimes we ignored that And it takes getting cancer getting an autoimmune disease. Getting you know something before. We're absolutely willing to listen but you you said wait a minute. Wait a minute right. Thankfully I didn't get to the point where it was as bad as as cancer or one of those things but my body was definitely yelling at me that I needed to make some changes so so yeah all the things that were going on. So I had really bad heartburn acid reflux. I would go through a bottle of Maalox a week and that is not solving anything. In fact what I've learned is taking and acids affects your gut microbiome and your gut health so severely. So I'm taking a bad situation and making it even worse. So there was the heartburn. There was the acid reflux I had symptoms of of I B s where all said. My stomach would just be in nuts. I'd be at work and have to leave a couple of hours early and just go home and lay down flat on the couch. And just wait for it to pass Some of the milder things that I didn't think problems were by. I'd Eczema on my face and you know I used to wake up in the morning and my legs would be kind of stiff and sore and walking downstairs. That first time in the morning I be holding onto the railing and thinking. Okay I'm in my forties now. I guess this is normal. Call this episode. I guess this is normal and I think one of the things that was most frustrating for me and was really the driving force in trying to get healthy and this may not be something that women may want to talk about. Was I was having some real issues with Candida. My was having chronic yeast infections. Which may not sound that bad. It can really affect your life horribly and a yes couldn't help. They would. Give me prescriptions for Antifungal medications. That wouldn't help. And so I got it into my head that you know what if I lose weight? Maybe all of these problems will go away. This extra weight can't be good for my health and out of all of the things. My number one concern was getting rid of the Kendeda and I knew that yeast feed off sugar and carbs. So I I I was adopting a low carb. No sugar diet and one of the things I soon discovered and where things started to come full circle from my childhood and the preservatives and food additives. I started making placements okay. I can't have sugar but they still want to treat Oh there's a sugar free ice cream. I would have thought by the sugar free ice cream with artificial sweeteners in it and I gorge myself on the ice cream and then I still remember this clearly. My husband and I were just going for a nice walk in. The park is beautiful sunny day and he looked at me and he said what's wrong and I said I wasn't acting strange that I thought or said that anything was wrong. He just saw look on my face and as an opening my mouth about to tell him absolutely nothing is wrong. I started bawling my eyes out and I could not understand why. And he was a little freaked out. He was like what is wrong with you. Yeah I told him I. I made the connection that you know. I've had a lot about ice cream this weekend. And maybe the artificial sweeteners are not agreeing with me. And I started to notice section a few other things with with artificial flavourings preservative. I- extra drinking a lot of tea coffee to my diet because I was having so many digestive issues that might system just couldn't handle coffee more so as a way to reward myself since I couldn't drink coffee bar to try all the different flavors of t that I that I could and there's a particular chain of tea that's very well known in all the balls. Sorry David Steve But There somebody gave me this tea and it was so delicious and I drank a lot of it one day. I made me myself like ten cups and again I found myself in a similar situation where I ended up like curled up in a ball bawling my eyes out thinking what is wrong with you crazy person. You have nothing to be upset about. And I grabbed the box of tea and I flip it over and I looked at the ingredients after drinking tons of it of sure sure enough there was artificial flavoring in the and then I said okay. That's IT I can't. I can't drink tea anymore. And maybe there's something to when I was a kid and needed to avoid all of these artificial things. It ain't food ask. I like though how when you're going through the journey though was it. Was it a book your bread or podcasts that you listened to or there something that tuned you in to it. It truly wasn't just about the weight it was it was something else. I don't know if you were heading. There are not but I'm gonNA take you there. You read my mind. That was the next step in my story so it did start out just being about the wage. I it was about the health but I thought if I just lost the pounds really no matter how I did it. That would fix everything and the light bulb moment for me. I read a book called Genius Foods by Max Loubier and Kelso has a podcast called genius life which I love and started listening to you now. The premise of his book is about brain health. He had a mother who had passed away but she got dementia very young so he needed him very concerned with. How do we keep our brains healthy and not develop Alzheimer's Dementia for different things? Will the big about brain health is? It's your whole body health if you're keeping your brain healthier keeping your whole body healthy and because I had also started to develop what I thought were some Peri. Menopausal symptoms the booty nece and cycles. Were getting a little bit irregular. I thought well let's get this book. A try undermines read it loved it recommended it and as I was reading the book everything just made sense to me. And when he talked about the book was taking out the talks in our food and some lifestyle changes so he talked about vegetable oil canola oil. It's an inflammatory oil and it can really cause some problems for us when we consume it now. The problem it is everywhere. It's cheap and restaurants. Use it everyone is it was. It was the main oil in our house that we cooked with sure and so that was one of the first things I was. I told my husband. I'm like okay. We're not buying oil anymore gone. And he's like but I like it it's cheap and it's neutral tasting. I said I know. But we're making this change olive oil or coconut oil or avocado oil. No more of these vegetable oils and canola wells and there was a few more things he talked about in the book a talked about sugar was the big thing cut out the sugar and cut out grains and so. I made those changes for me. I really had to make changes slowly one step at a time. I felt like I would be overwhelmed if I tried to do everything at once. So I read the book and there is so many recommendations he made but didn't necessarily adopt everything all at once so at first it was cutting up the grains and sugar and then he talked about not eating conventional produce conventional meat but making the switch to organic produce grass fed beef organic chicken and that took a lot longer for me to make the switch and to convince my husband who That it wouldn't cost us an arm and a leg to do that. Or that will cost might be worth it and so we looked at the budget and I said you know what I want to make some changes. I want to buy better quality meat. Maybe we can less meat in our meals but it's a better quality meat and offset some of that cost. We bought frozen vegetables which I actually learned not terrible for you. In fact Rosen. Vegetables can have just as many nutrients and I can even better in some ways. Because they're not traveling long distances if you're not buying local produce right so I've really started to change my mindset from just losing the way to okay. I'm going to eat food. That nourishes my body. I'm going to take out the processed food and when my mindset changed I started focusing less on the weight and the weight started falling off and I kind of started to believe that once. We're doing what we need to do for our bodies our bodies do what they're supposed to do. Our bodies have an amazing ability to heal. Yes it's we give it the right which ingredients the right environments absolutely absolutely so so you may kind of this transformation from. I'm going to die it too. I'm really looking at what's best for my body as a whole right so as you go through this transformation. I know you had you know some significant weight loss which is huge You know for for overall wellness. Mattamy he you know we. We went through all those signs that were slapping you upside the head that the body was shouting out you so number one is. How long did this? Transformation take for you as your work because you talked about star was starting back in January of two thousand eighteen. And how do you feel today? Okay so one of the first things to go away was the digestive issues and the heartburn. When I stopped eating grains I that really just went away quickly and then it was about six months or a year end. I'd lost a considerable amount of weight but some things were still hanging around. I thought okay. I'm I'm eating healthy. I'm doing everything I should be doing. Why do I still have ECZEMA my face? Why am I still having issues with Kendeda and so I went to visit a naturopathic doctor and what she suggested is that I probably had subdued sensitivities shocker? Yeah and she wanted to go on an elimination diet to rule out foods were actively she what she the way she explained. It was I- foods that my body was reacting to which was causing inflammation Sherman. Then my body was too busy fighting. That impact chronic daily inflammation to deal with the other issues. That were going on so I once I did the elimination diet. I quickly learned. That dairy was a huge issue for me. And it was the source to the EXZEMA on my face that I had daily and the vegetable oils and canola oils. I had tried to limit them as much as possible. But I wasn't super strict about it if I thought if I have a little bit once in a while. It's not that big a deal. But when I got really strict about those oils it also affected my Zima. Other things about okay. We're onto something here. We're heading on the right pass right now to be completely on this. I'm I'm still dealing with the Candida. Okay with that being fed what I was a child and a teenager I was on antibiotics probably almost yearly for different conditions. I had bronchitis often I had. Ut is often and like I said doctors headed out antibiotics like candy. There was a long while where I was using Like I said I was going through a bottle of Maalox a week. And acids from from my heartburn which again affects your gut health. So the way I look at it is. It's not going to be a quick fix. It's not going to be an instant checks. And so I'm incorporating things all the time and making changes all the time Different supplements I take very good probiotic every day and in fact one of your podcast episodes told me about the best kind of probiotics to to take That was really helpful and I also just diving in further into my journey so I try not to expose yourself to as many hawks ins in your food in your environment. But it's also about removing toxins in N. detoxing so I take supplements that are Antifungal to rid of the candidate. But then I also take other supplements like activated charcoal which help detox and remove those toxins from your body. And I'm still making daily changes like I said it wasn't something I did overnight so I've started switching over occasion. I instead of storing food in plastic containers were getting a glass containers to store food and because plastic is terrible and could have a lot of endocrine disruptors or on the go into our body. And there's something they haven't done yet. I'm still going to do. I are frying. Pans are nonstick Teflon. Which I know is horrible. And so that's next on the list to get Some some better pans that be iron-cast hands or things like that and just really looking at the environment in our home. I started looking at laundry. Detergent man cleaners and going back to basics. I I went to just using a bottle of I replaced with index and started using a bottle of vinegar and water and spraying that all purpose cleaner in cleaning windows with that. And if something really to deep clean sprinkling baking soda on first and then the vinegar I found easy recipes online to make laundry detergent as my family. Kind of looks at me like I'm crazy and I'm going a little bit too far up but if you were me and they're along for the ride so well and I just love that you're taking a look at all the different areas your you know your you've looked at the the food toxins in in removing those and continuing to work with that and continuing to figure out what needs to come out and then you know looking at the environmental toxins because it know. I'm six years into my journey. And it's always continuing you know I can't even remember what I learned just here a week ago. About you know the mattresses that were sleeping on and think about that. We spend a third of our life sleeping. And I know I have good sheets and good matches pads and and good comforters. And that type chamber the mattress itself. You know there's always something you know to look at but you look. I'm no people will see you if they come to my youtube page and if they come to the you know the facebook community because your face is just vibrant and I know it's because of the changes that you've made you know I don't know Kathy of you see people a look in their face and you look in their eyes and you can see the vibrancy the stars coming out when we start removing those toxins out of our lives and I love CNN. You will thank you. And it's it's so true what he said about always continuing to learn because I think that's what the real differences for me between a diet to lose weight and health journey because health journey just doesn't end it's not like oh. I hit my goal weight and now I'm done when it's overall health and overall wellness. There's always something else for us to learn and that's become my real passion now is. I just want to continue learning and I don't ever WanNa stop so rather than feeling overwhelmed like oh my goodness there's so many toxins how are going to get rid of all of them. It's more of a okay. I've done this one now now. Let's try and move onto the next thing the next step. And what else can I learn? What else can do to improve my health. And it's it's not even about being sick and wanting to get better. It's just we can always be better. There's always a better out there that I love that. Absolutely so tell us so. We want our listeners to obviously check out your podcast which is called the live best life. Podcast IT'S BEAUTIFUL. Is Pink background with all? These stone stacked up on top of each other. How else can our listeners? Get a hold of you Kathy. Yes though I'm really active on instagram. Okay and my instagram handle. Is Kathy underscore? Live your best life and I also have a facebook page for the podcast and that is a live. Your best life podcasts. Okay and is there anything that you want to promote out to the listeners Do you do anything in terms of helping people coaching people or just really come on and listened to the podcast so right now? My main focus is the podcast and That's how I'm trying to reach out to people and help people but with that being said I feel. There's always going to be more. What I see on horizons very soon is a facebook support group. I do get friends and people messaging me sometimes with questions so right. Now I'm talking to people went on one through those private messages. If they have questions for me but I think a group environment where we can all be encouraging each other and helping each other would be really exciting. So that is something. I'm thinking of the New Year. Perhaps is a facebook health support group. I love that I love that so I really. I love to end our podcast with a question and I'll ask it to fold and you can answer it kind of the same question but you're gonNA answer in any way that you want that it's it's either. What brings you to tears. You can answer that or are you could do both are what is it that you just it this is what makes you get up in the morning. It's what keeps you awake at night because you're so excited about something that you're doing something that you're learning about something that you you know are out there doing you know. I think everybody has that. And if they don't have that in their life I really felt that for them in their life okay. I think that's a great question. So what really brings me tears? I is children coup. For whatever reason do not have access to good quality healthy food it could be because of income circumstance education. I think is a huge one. What I would just love is for people who are lower income to have access to better quality food. I know that food is provided by a food. Bank is usually packaged food. Because it has to have a shelf life and I'm not saying I have any answers without problem but it's definitely a problem at I is very Jimmy Hart and I would love to somehow get involved with any kind of organization that is doing something to improve health education and general health lower income children and families and then for. What gets me excited right now. It really is a podcast. The podcast is still in its beginning stages so it's been so new and I've been able to meet so many incredible people and it's quite interesting because my whole motivation frustration. The podcast was to help others and educate others but learning myself so much in the process. Some guests are interviewed. Have had just a wealth of knowledge that I've been able to take in and it definitely gets me excited. There's days that I get up super early. Because I'm on the West Coast and some of the people. I interview are three hours ahead. And maybe they're not available to and I have a Monday to Friday job so I'm available usually from five pm until nine pm but there are times. That is like eight. Pm until eleven and it's too late for them so there are days. I will get up at four thirty in the morning so that I can interview somebody that I really want to interview him because that's nine. Am for them or this morning. I had another episode launch. I was really excited about so. I started work at seven. Am I got up an hour early so I could do all of my instagram posts? Promoting the episode. And just telling everyone about it so I guess it really is. What gets me going right now and just hope that somehow. I'm able to even just reach one person and either help them decide to start making some positive changes in their health or wherever they are on their health journey. If they can just get another push in the right direction I love that. I absolutely love love that. It's it's no excuses you know you're doing a fulltime job with a family and you're finding ways to get things done and I just absolutely love that Kathy. I am so glad that you came on to share your story with us and were open and vulnerable and I know that there are people out there. They're going to be going me too so I so appreciate you thank you. Well thank you so much for having me and listening to my story absolutely. That's all for this episode of the Toxin Terminator and we hope we've helped you remove the hidden toxins in your life or renew health. If you're looking to continue your journey towards full rejuvenation reach out to amy directly by visiting Amy Carlson Dot Com or your own one on one chat session as well as your free toxic risk assessment. That's a I m e pulp and DOT COM and remember. You are just one small. Change away from renewed help.

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BTS #31 The Doctors Knox on the Endocannabinoid System and Revolutionizing Healthcare

The Curious About Cannabis Podcast

1:19:33 hr | 6 months ago

BTS #31 The Doctors Knox on the Endocannabinoid System and Revolutionizing Healthcare

"I am Dr Rachel knocks. Dr David Knox and that could Janet's knocks. Dr Jessica knocks, and we are doctors knocks. You're listening to the curious about podcasts. Everybody Jason Wilson with the curious about spot. Thanks so much for tuning in once again. So today I am superstock to finally cross paths with a group of people I've been following in wanting to talk to for a really long time I'm with the doctors knocks. You might know as Knox Docs but I'm with Rachel David Jamieson and Jessica walks thanks so much everybody for being willing to carve out the time to all come together and talk to me today. Yeah totally, it's I. Think we're going to have a a lot of exciting things to talk about me. One reason I wanted to get the four of us together. Is that one of the things throughout this conversation I wanted to explore our how your perspectives on the cabinet system cannabis science you know the clinical use of cannabis how it varies slightly and overlaps as well but I thought it would be a very unique experience to kind of you know. I was call these interviews. We're really it's more of a conversation that just talk through some of these critical ideas that float around in cannabis science in the cannabis industry, a lot and just hear what your perspectives are in kind of ideas evolved over time, and in sort of what you're looking forward to the future, says kind of my my grand goal here and to start us off. the first question I want to post to all of you. Is. One of the main things that you will talk about is the Indo cannabinoid system, and that's something that you've become kind of popular for talking a lot about so the first question I. WanNa Post to you is how do each of you individually conceptualize what the window can? Avenue system is and I guess Dr David Will Start with you, and then just kind of kind of go around and see how the conversation leads. The endocrine system is kind of the the Maestro in Bullet with that show many other individual systems in. It's kind of conducting them all to A. Now. We feel remained purpose A. System keeping everything else? Balance Tomio stasis. Joe Whether. We're talking about neurotransmitters immune system. The gastrointestinal system you. You System. The Endo can avenue system is really quite essential as part of the feedback mechanism that keeps on this other shingling activity in balance. The conductor of the mall. but it's also interesting. It's not like it a master sitting up in some spy. You know trying to make. It comes down is like you. You got a an engineer. Our doctrine, every location in the fight, because the underpin avenue system overall. It works locally renown now every shell. Local response to in the. Show is really kind of an intriguing and complex just a minute ships. But the inaugural. Landed jealousy that. Category, breakdown initial medicines wapping us. You know neurology. Garrick. Specialties. That blinds all. Yeah definitely and his, and are the rest of you kind of ingredient with that that general description of Indo can avoid system, being this sort of conductor of the symphonies of all of these these different processes going on in the body. I think so the basic It's different components. That's pretty basic. What I am more excited about is plainly figuring out that it's just bigger than ECS in how many ads? That are interacting at the same time are in parallel. Each system of the body actually has its own Indianapolis weight system, and they're communicating with each other to keep the body in balance, but with that being said that system is just a pint of a bigger lipid signaling system, and I think when we really figure out what the heck is, and how complexity get through. Then, we really got to be able to change health. When you think about THC doesn't just work on. That wants to receptor right? It's working on other things as well as our the endogenous cannabinoid. It's things as well so it's a much more complicated pitcher than we realize in that DIJK. Try to understand more than than what we see what we know at this point. Is What's going GONNA lead us to make more affective drugs in therapy novel things that really will answer questions, even more just addressing the conventional description at the indicating arbitrate system. That's my relation of what I'm finding biggest bigger than that even. Yes I love hearing that. Something that has me excited is thinking about how one you know one thing I. Like to point out to people. Is that our basic conception that we often hear shared a lot in the cannabis industry of what the noise system is? It really started to come about in the late nineties or so, and it's rapidly evolving and just looking at the fact that you have cabinet receptors that form complexes with. With other receptor types, Sarah Serotonin receptors dopamine receptors all these different things it it it up ends the way we think about all of these signaling systems end, and realized how they're all connected, and that just has me very very excited, because it goes way beyond cannabis way beyond what we conventionally think of as the Indo, can avenue system some very very happy to hear you to talk about that. Prime example of that is all the tension and be searched. That's now going toward the gut. ACS axes, that is just it's profound, because that gut actually helps to create some of those when that system is working properly renewing thought about that or so all these things becoming to realization that is just bigger than CD ONC- to end mine. Enjoy Jay I mean. Are You understand your at the starting line, right? Guy. Go beyond that 'cause it's huge bat. Knicks aside limit as far as what we can create endure with wellness. And it ties in very deeply to this concept of. Systems, theory and personalized medicine in of one medicine, which I know, at least in at least one archive. I've seen that that you've done before. You've talked some about this. sort of innovation revolution that's coming especially as we're able to understand things like nutrigenomics, and also sorts of other things, and we understand you know like. You're pointing out earlier Dr David of. Different sub specialties, and how we tend to box, all these things in kind of have tunnel vision sometimes about. What a diseases and how it's affecting the body, but it seems like this expanding conception of the navigate is really highlighting this broader movement in Healthcare at large of rethinking medicine and health, and how we approach that on an individual level. which is also expanding our understanding the outside of Medical Clinic Hospital? Actually growing tired of how he used healthcare and medical care synonymous, because they don't missing. That's a good point, yeah! Happens in the clinic or in the hospital. That's where we're applying medical knowledge or applying mental. One of those are. Mama your drugs or procedures and surgeries to addressing a diagnosis with an attack I think at times you address underlying. Causes but we don't go deep enough and we're healthcare. Actually. This is outside writing end avenue. Decem new collaborate. Dome has taught us that this mechanism. Constantly reacting in adapting to our mattress, our internal, but external stimuli in twenty, four seven. We are encountering external stimuli in ecosystems, in which we live right, so it's forcing us to recognize how we interact with one another both have under navigate systems that responding now to auburn activity with other other organisms that have ended indicates the sons as well as to are literal environment. Howie engage in Iraq with. Other animals in nature nature itself. Can Avenue, it systems almost screaming at us to reincorporate botanical medicine. And High Quality Foods back. into our lifestyles. and I think that's for me. What is most fascinating about? This? Journey is back that many of us are waiting at recognizing again to repeat myself that health care encompasses so much more. We received in the medical system. Yet I think that is an excellent point and Jessica I noticed you nodding your head a lot there that something that resonates strongly with you as well. She was just going to say I thought Chris. Chris actually put it really well and one of his newsletters this week Chris. Rachel wrong. He's a Chinese medicine. Doc I. Think but he out newsletters once or twice a week to folks and he put it. Healthcare is actually self care. And it's this idea that as Rachel was getting at. We are with ourselves out in the world, and with our families, our friends, all of the time, and we spend maybe ten minutes like every quarter with a doctor at most but but we've been sort of conditioned to expect that art, Our interactions with the medical system or wasn't supposed to make us healthy, but if you take forty minutes out of your year with a doctor, how is that going to make you healthy? But that's conditioned to expect, and we're really trying to split this paradigm of no the actual work of being healthy. Of taking care of yourself happens. Twenty four seven everyday. You're right, and so healthcare really does become self care. And I think for the for the most part is individuals whether it's patients, definitely patients for the most part, but some clinicians like ourselves as well who are really pushing the medical system to recognize that we really can't be broken down into individual pieces of immune system versus my cardiovascular system. All of these things work together. Medicine likes to break it down to China. Simplify it. At the end of the day we as individuals, that system really hasn't done a great job for us, so we're pushing the system to be more holistic and to think about health a little bit differently but even you know yet instill always individuals duty to recognize that healthcare is self care. So. What am I doing? Every day are doing every day to promote my own health and wellness, and I'm going to add one of the things that understanding the interconnectivity on I think it screams at us to obey. The law of the universe that. Understanding your spirituality, which is a key part is as far as I'm concerned of being well and I've gotten. Patient's doctor doesn't ask you about your spirituality and I'm not talking religion I'm happy about your next season. Then he hasn't done that, are she? Hasn't done that complete assessment because one thing that indicate nominate system best manifest exactly. You know what we're thinking how responding at we. Ring back into the wellness. Fear and I've gotten some talking about stick gang healthy again to let's talk about just being well. Let the writing into people's brain so bad is what gets manifested, because we're obeying the laws of the universe you now what you think and believe will manifest eventuate. So how can we push over back to thinking and Incan System points that out to me clearly, in my opinion. Yeah! You know what this raises for me is I imagine this is maybe a little hard for people because it ties in this issue of. Taking back responsibility for yourself that you've thrust outward to other people, and sometimes I think people feel like taking on responsibility for their own wellness and you know. Being in check with all of these variables that are influencing their being sometimes they find that overwhelming and part of that is because of the way. We're taught to think about nothing things I. You know I. Think about the way that I learned conceptualize medicine, and food and diet growing up as A. In Elementary School in high school and everything in you. You just think that you eat to sustain yourself and be full and live, and you get sick. You go to the doctor you take medicine. You get better, you know and that's that's the paradigm that a lot of us get carved into into our brains, and it can be challenging and I so I guess a follow up question now to this is what has been your experience when. You work with patients and you present these dynamics know that tech by stepping into this world of herbal medicine cabinet medicine, staying in ADENOID system you know which ties into things like exercise and meditation all these other things you know that it does bring up this concept of self care, self responsibility for wellness, and what has been the general patient response to that sort of shift in perspective. Whether they also most patients who come to or coming to us because they have failed conventional medicine, so they're ready to listen for something different right writer. They're looking for better answers, and I have everything working together is the best answer, but with that being said when I explained to them in terms. They understand that they have in their by. That's working to keep them healthy and explain to. To them that their health really belongs to them, not the doctor or any way out I. Really on the bulb go off in their brain. They get it as long as we put in terms that they can understand so I'm not gonNA. Talk with them and talking to another doctor, but I can't explain to them. In terms, they understand in people. Get it. They're looking for that help they. They WanNa know what's different. Can you compare someone coming to you with on pages and pages of drugs? They're trying to get off. It makes them feel horrible, and they can't communicate with. Their family can't hold their grandchildren's can't interrupted their friends. They are ready to hear. How can this plant helped? Helped me We should be able to answer those questions. I think our jobs as clinicians is. Is Not to them what to do given the information that they can't process to make better decisions for themselves once again back to snap care responsibility, and if you are not don't wait for the doctor, the DA or anybody else's alphabet to tell you what to do, get the right information and they really do i. mean they are so enlightened in could see the light bulb just off. They're ready to hear it. That's why. You're speaking my language. Yeah, go ahead. Sorry, no necessarily. Say You know then? Being ready doesn't mean that it's not still work. A lot of time to say you know what we teach. Very simple really right where teaching nutrition like natural whole foods exercise deep breathing. These things are very simple. That doesn't necessarily mean they're easy. Especially when we're talking about people who have gone through their entire lives with this sort of mindset that you described. Know I. Think some sometimes. We have people who. You know they come to Wasn. They'd gone through this journey with a conventional medical system over a long time and up in the are very ready for something different other times we have people who are coming to us where they had some kind of catastrophic diagnosis and they they haven't really had time to process all of this just sort of desperate in. They're doing anything they can and. If for them, it's like a giant mindset shift I like. I can't like. I need to be in Kyoto. Status or cancers can't eat bananas anymore. Like what are you talking about right so sometimes. There is still a lot of work that needs to be done but as my mom was saying, people are ready for for something, different but it it. It has still take work to get to that next step. Yeah absolutely and you know. This this whole concept of taking on the role of educating for the sake of people being able to make mindful conscious decisions to support what they actually are after in life is something that resonates with me so profoundly because it's one of the reasons that I am passionate about science education in general of like raising awareness, trying to get information into the hands of people that need it to empower them. You know is is something that is is hugely needed in in general. Were in our country are public? Scientific Literacy ratings are are abysmal There is this profound work to be done of education so absolutely. I love hearing that that piece to that sort of empowerment piece in. One thing I'm interested in hearing about. And something I really want to hear from each of you. How did you first learn about the concept of the Indo? CAN AVENUE IT system? And what was it that excited you about that? And then I'm interested to see how that excitement spread to all of you. Right she started at the started with me I spent most of my my my career. Bananas Ecologist in when I retired. I was invited to working Clinics and I surprised at the kind of people who showed up to the clinics I was just shocked. They were people who I never would have expected. We're looking for marijuana. With that being said you know I wanted been understand why. They spinning their last dollar to get these cards in obvious to me, they wanted me as clinician, and some of these were new people coming in ranked US cannabis for various reasons. made explain to them how to use canvas I mean. We didn't even know what candace was I had. No idea about Pranab annoys her chirping plant. I knew napping absolutely us here. It was anesthesiologist, nine theology and pharmacology. I could not answer a single question so I did a dive into. What is it about this plant that these people are searching? And when I found out them this no benefits I was shocked. Then, I thought okay now. Why is it not American? Because I know. Now, that so I went and read the congressional records got rid. It got rid of it and then, I Dive into the science and that really blew me away. I'm a very techy person I love that snap and the more I read to read and I was shocked when quickly came to the realization. This wasn't about campus at all, but it was about this physiology. The Ashley knew about in nineteen nineties tonight the whole decade with your brain. They knew about this. People are not allowed to use this. You know I lost a mother to breast cancer in Santa Knoxville brain damage I couldn't help, but think I was cheated as a clinician. Are as a consumer well. I have not helped my people and so. I was dispatched. WHO still fascinated? Read everything I can get my hands on in the more I read more. I want know about it. Might get involved in it. SORTA spread to the rest of them. Now tell you their stories. Next was following. Solar both behind. You know she's always so to him. which he shot she got invited to staff plenty now. I looked at her sideways. We've spent thirty five years in conventional medicine in the only bunks you had for cannabis. drugs you know. Even though in the Murray. True issue online medical, marijuana A-OK A. Move onto the problem your airport in. The. The. By you know again the opportunity to start seeing some of these patients in the clinic. Resume she was working with and and and. Again it was astounding. Introduction that debt she relate, you know these people were serious. Medical problems complex medical histories. Just this the. Things that they can diagnose whether through for tron align everything. We're just astounding. The stories patient telling you about the succession of benefit. They were getting cannabis I opened. Again an emergency room out with so much focus on pain, control and medication problems opiates problems. And everything and when you get a few thousand people are more telling you know. I was able to get off my opiates management being cannabis. Your eyes are open you, you've gotTA listen to that. You know whether there's you know these control, the double blind studies or not. Listen to what you at telling. and. So that was. My shut again. You know revived nearest conventional medicine. We didn't know anything about the physiology and show. It was almost a reawakening enjoyment of medicine to have this whole new area. Open up to, and it's just so fascinating The the more we learn about it, the receivers, so many reasons that it should help can help now raptor realize it's not a panacea, not one hundred percent for. Your we're all different. Our own indoor nominate systems tone cannibalism now these are all factors that play into it so now. It's just a wonderful fascinating. Relief experience. Excellent and Rachel and Jessica. How did how did your exposure come into play with that? WAS IT I? Mean obviously you were seeing what your parents were doing and and hearing. You know about what they were studying and all of that, but what did that that look like for you. I always been suspicious of our. Secular, conventional medical education from outset Justin. I went to task for a duel degree in business, medicine. studio business medicine. Recognized that. into. Your system on that did not have a whole lot of solution were helping US help patients. He'll which. Chiming in back. Just the reason why I wanted doctors in the first place, we wanted to learn how to help. You feel Waiting the educated into becoming just causing a wheel of a conventional. Again? and. I would ask attending in myrtle school widely. Why why? We did not learn nutrition? Why? Why are we performing surgeries on diabetics? Heart disease, but not having the conversation with them about how they can attempt to reverse diseases. Mattress natural whole foods and Questions always dismissed I think. The last time I took any their responses as in fact was when a surgical attending told me at when. We. Don't have enough time to talk to them about last night. nutrition into. They're not gonNA LISTEN TO US ANYWAY! ATLA. Most dispiriting comments. The date. I! I was so disappointed that I consider not going into residency after graduate medical. Finding alternative career get greedy. Conversations with my parents ingest in decided that I would go into family medicine residency. I chose in residency program also exposed me to integrative medicines. I went to a residency that was part of the Andrew. integrative medicine residency pilots got some. Some education into the natural sciences natural medicine in when these you started talking to us about their experiences, I would go to my attending yet again in North Carolina so their state, but I had asked them. About hypnosis his medicine in Ra knew the answer has really just changed like you'll how? Out. The medical potential cannabis in it was always meant hundred percent of the time with the same old response Here is not an research. I knew there was a net research validated as. The chain had been legalized in several seats new by this time. So, you know. Already to respect the natural natural. Methods to healing. Home after residency started working in the same clinic Maritz working in and was happy to learn about the science of cannabis, the pharmacology Mannix Avenue actual compensation with these patients who are trying to make sense of the products on the market place so I had to learn something to your them girl recommendations, and then on top of that. At that time we started getting involved in. Organizations in the industry and so I be asked to articles about Endo. Cabinets is his. So No academically speaking, I had learned that information. Intelligence a newsletters. Essentially that then. You know for the most part I think for all of us. We had overwhelming awakening. To our own health in command to our own helping. All four of us have have. Your. Degree next the entire degree is always saying really really healthy I'm. A styles our own personal philosophies Peter King with the help of our own economic systems in your into art. That was them on patient so when we're educating patients or anybody else. We are discussing with them what we practice ourselves. Yeah for for Myself Rachel. Did describe a lot of my experience Rachel I went to medical school together, which was good fun. It was nice to have A. Van. A built in ally I'm going through medical and business school together. And Light Rachel I initially went into training for family. Medicine and I chosen family medicine because. All the specialties that I've been exposed tune was aware of I thought Family Medicine was the wind that? Was the most versatile, but also the one that might be closest. To. What I sort of conceived of as healthcare right lake from birth to it can care of people in a primary care setting, and we're gonNA talk about lifestyle. We don't do that, you know. Eighty percent of its I was juggling diabetics, laundry lists of vacations or your pizza COPD and your heart, or whatever it was right most of the time I was still managing chronic disease. And Not really getting to talk to my patients about lifestyle and so. About Midway through my intern year in in medicine I made the decision to actually transition to preventive medicine, and so that's what I completed aiding, and so I'm I'm a board certified preventive medicine physicians than I transitioned to preventive medicine. Because like Oh this is being. This is even more inventive than family medicine. Maybe this looking for all along. which come to find out it's not really is really more preventative focused than family medicine, but it's really a primary care in public health specialty. Found myself in family, medicine clinics, feeling like I was just sort of banging my head against the wall, managing lists, but not actually telling talking to patients about how arise. And how to live well and how to improve quality of life, so I just found myself really restrated. And as I was completing residency. This was really starting to pick up more more. My mom was starting to pick up more en marche candidates clinics. US, telling us about her patients in the cannabis clinics. And full disclosure at first I would like mom's lost it like. What she's talking about right because in medical school, we only. has a drug of abuse or a gateway. We don't learn that there's anything redeeming beneficial about it, and so I was like mom's been like cat caught by these crazy people and you the cult. And But. But Lee, Sorta, beach, my attention and when I left residency, I actually to Rachel went directly into work and cannabis clinics I was in California. Canvas clinics. And the reason. Why was because my parents were both sharing stories of the patients right so they're telling stories of patients and their candidates clinics. who were? Either they were having great remission or turnaround of whatever conditions they were seeking candidates for or like worst case scenario. Maybe they weren't. You know getting better from Ikea. Theology perspective, but Life was improving right and. They can engage more families or friends, or whatever and I was like I. Don't see any of that in my clinic right. I don't see any patients better or feeling better. They're just getting sicker. They're getting more medications. Feeling crummier and that's not what I signed up for when. You're so it was really the patient stories for me were very compelling and encouraged me to follow him a hammer. Stats learn more about it. And as we as I got into the clinics. I think I experienced a lot of what you experience. Mom, but I had the benefit of having learned something from you in data already, so patients were coming to candidates clinics, knowing they wanted to try cannabis, but not necessarily knowing how to use it or. To use what they should be looking for. I so I had to learn how to guide them. In this is usually a CD. You can use them together and this. Is GonNa work your body and I had to learn about the economic system as part of that and so so yeah, really it was the patients out at drew me to that space and then trying to help fill their needs really spurred me to learn more and more. Yeah. Definitely, that's you know this. There's a pattern here of stories that I'm hearing from a lot of. Health, care, physicians and nurses that have kind of been. I guess kind of disenfranchised with the traditional. Know healthcare model. And it's it's fascinating. The more healthcare professionals that I talked to how similar those stories are of wanting to do what it is you sign up to a doctor for you want to help. People heal and improve their life, and you know all these things, and you try to navigate the system to try to figure out where your place is in that system to actually be able to do that work, and then you kind of discover well. There's not a good place, or you know like. The system has gotten in such a way that it hasn't carved out the right place for someone to do the type of work you're actually trying to do, and then you end up. Having to kind of totally rethink this whole concept. Of Health and wellness and kind of piece together on your own, and among the community of people better going through the same thing, and the Nice thing is, there are a lot of you out there. That are going through that same experience of trying to figure out how to shift. A healthcare career towards doing what it is you signed up to do in the first place. I think they're going to be books written about this phenomenon you know coming out that are going to describe you know the past couple of decades the next decade or so is this time period where there was this big? This of very talented healthcare professionals from the traditional model and this this new integrative holistic kind of focused lifestyle, focused south medicine. So that's hundred. It's super fascinating. That'll be patient. Are. They are pushing US I mean they earn for something different, and if anything, What's interesting about our story? Is that none of us? We weren't sick. There's no reason for us to go to canvas. We were not sick. People looking for that had it was really understanding. Be Fascinating by the pharmacology of canvas, and then the physiology. That's cannabis. And I think quickly realized that there's more to life or to existing than just candidates, which what thousands of years younger than in. Stem and there was some things in society that we can yet be late and it's almost like a puzzle doing that puzzle. Together and getting the joy from completing puzzle you now you think about the Rubik's cube, typically turning green. kind of totally right back the pieces of correctly and I think we as health vitamins somewhere. Somehow we lost that we lot dry. You know to and to solve and create and manipulate for with. As now I call Checkbook Medicine checks box medicine we've given. Rachel? Earn into a professional development. Miller's. Anchors and doctors of all were pursuing truth, always pursuing knowledge on seeking at all costs seeking process improvements at all costs. You don't do that anymore. Yeah, right, we're like. Earlier about just the. Beginning the paradigm. Is Not. So Health Care Right? That is the dependent on me systems. Are Medical Profession is bitten into the same me right now we're told to. By News that our. Our funding medical schools in our hospital systems right. We're being told what to do. By Big Business Big Pharma. By, be exclude. Our Health Associations Medical Associations are funded by Big Agriculture Raya being. Conglomerates that are controlling our food supply. We have. You know the the American Diabetes Association being funded by new. Companies that process high-fructose Corn Syrup. Pump that into our food, which is which is ironic because? We know high-fructose, Corn Sir other highly processed foods do our body respect your causing inflammation inflammation being a root cause hundred. Diabetes and heart disease, et Cetera We don't do a good job. Critically appraising the research that is telling us which pharmaceutical drugs we should be using you know to solve for some of these disease processes in there are a lot of conflicts of interest. Interest Presents them. I don't think we spend within medicine. Spend enough time critically appraising. We're finding. It's coming from where the recommendations are coming from. We are so busy trying to see a patient every seven to fifteen minutes that in some way renowned, relying on the efficiencies that. you know Emr's practice management systems in protocols provide us, but it's happening at the expense of our own integrity at the expense of our patients. You're just A. Little Bit. In the retron medical records and everything. Hope is good intention I. Think Physicians Tat Good Tension when it comes down to redoing your protocol. No decisions gang. You have a patient in they kind of fit in this box. Okay, we'RE GONNA follow this protocol. That's not always the best for that patient. Bannon makes you Kinda. When you're pressed for time. You know you're not gonNA. Spend a little more time to listen to this patient than. You even when you look at conventional pharmaceutical grade great for maybe forty percent of the people. Don't people. Nothing for and others have adverse affects onto that sixty percent. Everyone up put in that box. Again, it comes back to what I said about mixture listening to. Your stories I'll let you know. We don't need a controlled scientific, double blind Chevy to. Hear regulations counts. Right That he's with. Studies aren't needed at suited for validate allegation. The patients eight for it. They're just not. Yeah well in this, this actually relates to something else. I wanted to ask you about. You know as clinicians working with when it comes to the new. System we have a limited tools to actually measure that system. But you've touched on a critical point in that that doesn't necessarily matter in that. If if you're working closely with a patient and focusing on lifestyle changes and overall quality of life outcomes in the sort of things, you don't necessarily need to know all of the exact mechanisms right now to help somebody but one of one of. The problems that. Are Or questions that I've encountered in the healthcare community is how do you work with the Indo Canadian way system when you can't measure it outside of a spinal tap or something, which is still only going to give you this narrow snapshot, you know because Endo can avenue are built on demand in that sort of thing. So how would you reply to to that sort of I guess reservation about Indo cannabinoid system science or medicine in general. I, you know marathons for a long time now that we have enough information. Seeking were clinicians who aren't trained in an To had matt decision for practical decisions along with them. About what they should using, it's actually a lot simpler that recognize the. Marijuana people can no longer computes. No longer. Near years and years near of education in an ability to critically think and I think that's where the biggest problems right now on. on the science quality of cannabis in the physiology of endocrine system both when it's functioning. Normally and when dysfunctional to make. Decisions we do Think Jason hat me. Don't necessarily need more as will benefit. Right well Becker. We're GONNA be holy formative, but any dope. My opinion is he. Most important data quaint. You can no longer continue to shine anecdotal evidence as though it's not as important as. The data Glean from these Meta analyses of school standard trials. If something does not refer occasion, it does not matter how many studies have demonstrated THAN THE PLACEBO? That's when we're getting into the end of one. ATIONS Hersal story, Inter personal history. The most valuable data honorable level. That we can use to help make changes to manding. That will directness. Help them make sense all products that are out marketplace by have not been made to make sense like they have not been made. Using science to inform them in, so you know it's GonNa. Take those who asked who who who recognize that. Got And we have enough information to confidently do that and and get it not not all of our our peers in the medical system. No have asked me or Or one of in air or the courage. Do it, but business consumers are using candidates now. Onset weeding. Alphabet Organization Stadium Awards utilized it even as as legalize legalized. I knit and eventually they're gonNA come in to a clinic or emergency room or you know. Surgeons Office. Or surgery and we help. Your providers are going to need to understand something underground. In the pharmacology canvas without bias. Yeah, you know the. jetsons do we have to have that foundational knowledge? You do so in in Myanmar. Mom, by and large. We're weaning with the pharmaceutical drugs that have been FDA. And I say that's one of the reason. Jason we always lead off with a history of of the whole journey. Cannabis has traveled from. You know being used for thousands of years, demonization tobacco disrupting. That history is so important because there was no studies than and thousands of thousand people used for various reasons in got relief from it. There is no blaze blood studies done or double blind studies done and those animals stories do become just as important I'm not saying that we don't need a double blind studies, but the research now just helps us defined tune how to use it not every weeks to know it to that degree, but some of us do and I do think people are creating products. Baidu or I help you create the products that would be more efficacious. But my answer is you know? When you took off the Merican. They did. It out and so now. Use It for our health. Where you studies you know is such a contradiction hypocrisy. They are, but just think about the thousands of years people used. Herbal medicine before it got labeled a quack medicine had or whatever they start labeling net. You don't thousands of years and it brought relief without killing anyone without killing. Anyone can lease. Jets and I'm not seeing where get address. We need to learn how to use them just as appropriately as we. Used Cannabis. Money all selected say. Not until we had understanding of Endo Canaveral as eating now you'll be understand how somebody's former student will drugs were. Approved we do not know how the workout you might have a steady were to like. Some of these drives only had couple studies that have demonstrated. Advocacy! There's some drugs actually have no idea how. At the cellular level or pharmacological level they just do and. Prescribing them off label meaning. There are no studies that demonstrated. Beneficial for condition where we're at. Prescribing four right that is meaning it. As what we call medicine practiced medicine knee. Happy Breeze because we earned the agency. The help with patients in in determine what made me back? And we need those patients to come back and provide a stir feedback so that we can make tweaks adjustments. This is A. We're never going to have. The recipe were never going. To do even with all the gold standard ladies in the world, every individual is different in, so we're GONNA have to take the time to listen to our patients and ourselves right in patients thereby. Ourselves as as lesions, our bodies in determining your West best friends, the instrument timing and that's GonNa be processed one hundred percent of us. Yeah, we knowing everything absolutely. Yeah, and this leads into we've we've kind of touched on a couple of things here, but one thing I wanted to make sure to ask all of you, or what are some of the the most significant prevalent conceptions that you encounter about? Either Cannabis or the Indo can navigate system. That just sort of keep coming up for you that you're having to address frequently. Still Minced Society. Leading. Systematic wrist really. Interesting, and that's not I. Mean you know the end up? Nominated system is primary components are all identified when nineteen ninety five. Graduated Permits Medical School in Boston Twenty twelve. Almost twenty years later, not one word of the. Is Done. Was Talk to us and you know they say it takes seventeen years for. The findings of research to trickle down into application. But you know it's been well past seventeen years at this point and most recently, I heard that something like thirteen percent of medical schools are. Medical will also nursing schools. Starting to mention, there might be. Might be medicinal, so yeah, you know. When you have clinicians who you are well into their careers, and they never heard of this thing and the only context in which they have heard about. It is what cannabis is dangerous, and it's a drug of abuse to gateway drug, and it makes people lazy and stupid like it's. It's hard to undo some of that Some of that that education right like I will sometimes say that the war on drugs. And specifically on cannabis with some of the most effective propaganda that we'd have right people. We've seen patients who are who are on their deathbeds, and literally will still not try cannabis because all of the things they know about it. Is Mind Boggling to me. Because even thought you know, cannabis really wasn't the devils. Lettuce might be willing to try it if I thought it was way to save my life. There's a lot stigma and fear and just missed and this. has to be. Unprocessed deep process deprogrammed, and it's at work, which is why we do always start with this history and science. because. Once? They understand that odor isn't a system mayor. Then they'll then they'll. They'll get on board, but there are still some. Don't even want to accept that. Apology. System Yeah I heard. We Croak intimate. Pro Canvas relate. And if the science overwhelmingly speaks to the benefit of cannabis. I mean that doesn't make us I s right. The science of from college at candidates speaks for itself. The physiology speaks for itself in. We're just excited to talk about it because we believe that it is. Is! or should be the target of all therapeutic. We're galleys as far as the now until bigger bigger than end of Natalie Dome and Adenoid always it. So how can we you know about entity dome? especially with respect to this function which leads to disease, how can we apply our knowledge of plant pharmacology, even modern molecular drug from ecology to modulate working with it to reverse disease to do not taking grow cannabis approach. That's not what we're advocating it inherently. Yes, we this is pro cannabis. I will say I'm not ashamed that I advocate for cannabis legalization. And for Science and medical informed regulation. I'm proud to say that, but we're not. You. Know shooting in the dark here, right? recognized. Cannabis can be used as a tool to do for health. has been able to do thus far envy. Believe that we should be taking. A, very intentional chance on this almost commodity on this wellness that's. Not Lost on us that. Need to mitigate risks. Are Risks that come with using Hannah's Kennedy misuse and abuse. Yes, it. But yeah, but how do we also provide opportunity to optimize consumer patients variance with cannabis ray, so kimmy find that sweet spot in the middle. Where were protecting people but also helping the? Doctor mentioned before. Now. We want to shoot that paradigm. because. Cannabis has been considered a drug abuse day in Conventional Medicine is star well, maybe a hassle mic uses. We want shit that I know Dizzy Medicine I. You. Properly you know in in all different forms. You know whenever you're treating. You can get a good result. The problem? Is it just like a lot of medical? Opiates for example. They do have a potential for abuse misuse. Overuse! Allah things. But you know when you read the literature. Concerned about everything from addiction. To. Particularly Children, you know what's the damage to the developing brain rain all the? Negative things. That when we're talking about appropriate medical use of cannabis. Those really are not a big issue because you're using it in a way with a purpose in dosages that we just don't see snow saints are only Sneezing Bay related about. Damaging to the. Jenner, changes in Nike. A motivational central addiction. Those I'll, he's on long term high dose laughers the. Inch. Is Not Medicinal show. When you're. Just like everything in medicine, it's a risk benefit ratio. And Wigan at the risk, profile cannabis. It is safer than ninety nine percent of the pharmaceuticals on the mark. Again if we just change that that different focuses a medicine I, yes, you know the hand reason to use it or abuse it. But. Just like. Non. Pack of Beer on weekend in all of people using it recreationally. That's not really bad, either. You know if their intention is intoxicated. You can do. The non. L. It's a matter of different perspective. Yeah totally. In related to what you just said I know we're getting close to time here. Promise will start wrapping it up soon by one or to got a couple more questions and one thing I wanted to ask, is ye? You touched on some of the? One the safety profile cannabis. That's one thing I've talked about in multiple interviews that. I find frustrating. Is that the safety profile? Cannabis can be so well known yet. The use in clinical experimentation with cannabis can be so prohibited like it's. It's just a weird funny. Paradigm there, but beyond that there are. There are some risks to cannabis since I wanted to ask you. What are what are some? Contra indications or situations where you. would. Kind of have a little more caution with a patient. Are there certain conditions that it tends to really not jive well with each other, or you know co administered with other medications that sort of thing I, know we, we know now how I mean all these can affect the enzymes in different ways, but you know CD's become. Well known as is exhibiting that grapefruit effect, and so we know a little bit about that, but can you spend just a couple of minutes talking about some of the you know the actual risks around cannabis, and how they can be mitigated, said that You don't have to worry about them so much. I think it starts with the whole concept of what we call the minimum effective dose. Yes, in a word. You know we just start with a logo. She hurt. In a gradual patriation. Trial and error always say. Way To, ART! reading time. An Jelly GonNA. Keep you in that range where you're not gonNA. She side. I would say you the adverse effects of. Related to the because I can have a stimulatory effect the. Guinea Grew Same Zion. Paranoia! Even. Psychosis on many high doses again. Usually inedible product because I pass metabolize lever higher rebuttal to that first metabolite eleven hydroxy TMC. room. We sign anybody any enemy. The Jesse Jackson was edible were impatient or just didn't know that it which A. Brownie in. Advance Affect physiologically. It'll give you your racing parts Studies do show that there is a potential increase risk for a relation the negative my experience. I had one guy who came classic crushing the Annual Chess Game. attack. It was just an agenda. But you was. dabbing eighty percent the to see how much you could do. I mean you really got to of work for them? Even naive useless. The he'll give you rapid heart rate, so there may be some Asian to harsh issued art disease. You have engineering raise at heart rate now. Maybe it'll date. Short related proud especially when Grupo shifted, be cautious with. Like appetite AC-, that's active you now you have. A what THC will do to the liver versus eighty were good to us that clever so so on who has active enzymes increasing our caution them. Maybe they should stay thc in new CD. He'll that. There are certain patients that you want WanNa be more careful, and I think that's where educated and understanding the individual rights can, or will do are the patient who is In. Anxiety reactions well. You'RE NOT GONNA. Let me have THC. Maybe you, WanNa have be an opposite patient his down depressed. Maybe they need L. Thc, so this is where you start to get into nuances of what the Canaveral real deal and certainly elderly people on pages and pages of medications. Or some are even cantillon in multiple injuries, medications I think we have to make their clinicians a rare these things because they do affect the static home p. system in how those other things metabolized anyone at risk of folly. You gotta be a little bit careful mind by at meal counseling in the take THC or anything else that may increase the risk of folly, so there's certain patients that we do. Look at look at everything before we recommend. What's the best canal night profile and that could be either a cadaver note. Did you take canal annoyed or how? You can have annoy? All those medical issues can change the way way to suggest in now an approach to these different patients because of their medical history diabetics or another one you this what you want us. It's going to improve their system so really. Do take a serious look at medical histories and try to provide the best canal chirping approach medical. And so it's not just throwing G. HDD people. I know one does the media we need to do with a slight those sorts of things. I think the takeaway is. There's very little risk to using cannabis when you have appropriate medical guidance. I think that's what's really important for people to know And you know frankly I believe there is nobody there's probably somebody there's almost nobody on this planet who could not benefit from using cannabis in some way, shape or form. Whether, it's children or elderly folks, pregnant women who have mental health disorders there is some way shape or Hornbeck at all of us likely would benefit from cannabis, said what children with joining US ACS Studio. Now! Who is no evidence to date? That has demonstrated true hundred indication. To using canvas now, leaning to be specific about we're talking about handed. Is a genus right? It is a genus of plant of thousands of local variations so when it comes down to. Risk benefit ratios. You can't just say that we're praising canvas hack. You appraise products, chemical profiles in help and help mash that right chemical profile to a condition. Right that that patient might have so you have to get into the weeds. I think we should always proceed with caution right now. Where doctors recommending were doctor recommends of being precautions because we are decisions on behalf of another life. Right in other is trusting us to then goods now expert so I think. Angry and recomendations Dr. regardless of what's being recommended on. Should it be arrived at with caution through precaution when it comes to applying medicine of cannabis, any getting condition? Hairs a happy given to. Crew recommending the right chemical profile Rabat! Me Chemical Profile is devoid of THC or Berry. media present for various reasons. MINI CD is not recommended to be a part of that chemical profile. For whatever reason It might not be so that's another reason why we saw lots of industry to. Baiters in processors at about using the best that we have right the best scientists order us to create products that are going to be meaningful that are gonNA. Be broadly available you. Not all people need rix incident. Whale back high teed off. People need be rich products. The we need to have bio availability in bio-diversity in our mental antidote. Marketplace's conserve. Patients. We're really you know I I am concerned about. being farmer get involved because the way they always done beings, is you? The target isolates in an or Only provide us with you auctions. Understand Natalie dumb and you understand media a rat. Auctions. Help patients navigate through. You know revealing. Options variety. That's what precision medicine isn't were not going. There is not going to be a one size fits all approach with respect to hear paradoxical obstacle oxymoron. They don't go. Rain. Is in order for us. You get more precise action. Need more variety to choose from right. Canada's medicine. It's helping US providing more precise care. We Need I. Remind you supply and demand network to understand that. Yeah I mean it's about having. A diversity of tools to work with. If you're only given a hammer and you're told to, you know, go fix this crack in a window. You're probably going to break the window. So. Yeah, you need a diversity of tools, I. It's something that. It. Diverts from canvas, but there's a conversation that I like a lot between Alexander Schulkin who used to do a lot of work with developing psychedelics researching psychedelics. He's passed away now, but he has a really good interview where. Terence McKenna asked him. What do you think the point is all of these chemicals? Are you know that you're making? And he's like I don't know their tools. Like other people's society, civilization has to figure out what to do with these tools I just am producing tools to throw in the tool chest, you know. For the future. And I really like that idea that all of these these products these cannabinoid ratios turpin profiles all these different things. It's about providing. People with tools. And you know going back to you know. Yeah, we don't have good tools to non invasive ways to measure than can avenue system, but we have a lot of tools to manipulate the Indo avenue system in different ways to work with and through working with folks like yourselves that are thinking in this way of okay, I wanNA. Listen to the patient. I want to understand their experiences. We WanNA. Try these tools get feedback. Dial this dial all of this in and get this person going in a direction I think that's that's absolutely the weight needs to be an absolutely. The the FDA approval model pharmaceuticals is not favourable to that approach of having lots of tools. For many many reasons. To play, but that's why we call ourselves in our knowledge. It's exactly yeah. Yeah it really is a pay to play game running for president. I've got to be a millionaire. And so it's always going to bias the field towards a certain. Type of way that. Actually doesn't really necessarily benefit. US A lot. I've got one more question for you, and then we'll be done. This is a question that comes from the curious about canvas Patriot so I try to give our supporters a chance to questions and one of those two to ask. Our guests to allow them a chance to interact with you so our patriot. Question that we have is. How does the cabinet system relate to FIBROMYALGIA and neuropathic pain? I know it's it's kind of a big one. I think that a lot of these these product ancient drums. You know FIBROMYALGIA has been misunderstood for year. Under other afternoons you know for. Years. At least it was totally in your mind. It's not real. But A. Really. It more. Apt Miltie, an are the. signaling system. Talk about the complexity of. Ping Shakily. No refunders to this file or up to interpretation the central nervous system now the neurotransmitters that are involved in day. Meister was involved in the. Mechanism. Across the answer's no, but also in other areas shea. sputters modulated. The. GPA and. The other Glutamate Neural include. Thank you You know so. It's all a matter of balance out of balance. You know then you get uncontrolled. The single that do Manana. chain-link pain, even though you can't demonstrate the obvious. Shoulder inflammation in tissues. Or can't show you a structural abnormality or like to call it. Structure, aiding battle. Like the. Original there's something out of balance. Continues you've. Patient now sometimes you're identifiable. Caution like neuropathic pain or a ripple rapidly with that. Were you know they're just gamage done to those performers? Patrol, headache Neuralgia when you add that. Lynn infection that caused damage to the nerve. Results in this persistent pain shakily. Where we feel it up central. Joe. It's a matter that there's something. Broken down in that feedback mechanism and bringing yet the. Endo can eminently. To improve the signaling whether NASA? or The kitten? John Genus Can Avenue Age. May give some relief of those. Two, I actually went area. I'm still kind of astounded at. We were diabetic, takeover internal nervous system. A Great Leap Topical Products Yeah You know whether that's just you get enough. Penetration ended the tissues in those nerves. Are that you shut? Not that Shaimaa at that point. Other Rapid Asian may be more file cord. Intrinsic Back Mechanism Noah Traction and take. Joe. they are you know if you ingest it, you know we get the. More. Vomited to don't levels. and. Kind of all. Connected Hillary absolutely. That he, she asked now we can get relief. Allocation. We don't already. Has Been considered clinical can operate deficiency, too. So. Very simply quit right. There are some disease processes that have. That have no through preclinical study demonstrated neutral deficiency so. I always like to use the example vitamin D deficiency. Where you have a deficiency, you can supplement that improvement without respect. You can't really shy. When you have a true Kanada deficiency, can we look to dodging cab noise to fill that void? I think it's been demonstrated to ask matters through studies in clinics clinically that people do. A supplement with endogenous adenoids in such a way, the street pain, but Are that that is helping. Modulate selling Restore some balance. Endo can avoid a system feedback loop feedback loop. Yeah. Awesome I think that's a perfect answer so. Those Patriot on that one at that question answered they go. I know there's a lot more dive into their, but yeah, the gavel glutamate saying that you know I'm familiar with that and you know it's something that listeners might not be familiar with. Is that can avenue it's. Do this thing called retro retrograde signaling, moving backwards across a synapse in the way I describe how this relates to pain. Sometimes, it's like cabinets are able to modulate the volume knob of. The experience of pain. It doesn't tend to and I. I know this from personal experience I've had multiple spinal injuries and things and been down this road, but it doesn't necessarily make the pain. Go Away doesn't Mute it, but it certainly seems to be able to turn the volume knob one direction to make it more manageable. And it did, and that's just my personal experience but. That's one of my favorite like. Metaphors or explaining to people, the activity of the NABET system is. Thinking about an apartment building within walls, and your neighbors might be too loud, and you want to turn the music down. You might send them a text which that could be your endo can avoid going across the hall, knocking on the door and saying hey, we heard you music down now and they. That's that's exactly analogy I use to describe the activity of these es. That's perfect, yeah! And it it does seem like something that clicks for people. They seem to intuitively understand. That idea, but that's cool. Yeah and. I know we've gone almost an hour and fifteen minutes here. I want to be sensitive to you. Know your time and and and everything and We're coming up on the weekend everything so i. don't WanNa. Keep you too long, but I WANNA say. I really really appreciate. All of you being willing to sit here and chat with me for the past hour and fifteen minutes I've really enjoyed. Enjoyed it as I knew that I would I know we could sit here and talk for hours probably about all the stuff and I've and all sorts of different areas that probably be very interesting, but I appreciate having this time and I really hope that especially as I mean. We're sort of in this this brave new world of trying to figure out with coronavirus and. Just, all of the things, all of the things that are coming together at once in our culture we'll see how things process but this year was supposed to be a year of traveling and seminars. All sorts of things like that that didn't happen, but I do hope that our paths cross physically at some point in the near future and that we we get to hang out at some point in person but in the last. Last couple of minutes here I want to hand over the platform to each of you or one of you. However you want to handle it, but let people know how to learn more about the work. You're doing about your clinics anything you might have coming up. I wanted to give you the platform to a plug, anything and everything you want to share any last bits of any comments or anything that we haven't gone into The podcast is. Until you want to end it. Was a pleasure we we could geek out on this all day long and all week long, so we having? A fellow Geek to the Jesuit. The easiest way for people to follow us, they can follow us on instagram at the Knox stocks racial on their at Rachel at just knock knocks at our website. Is Doctors knocks dot com will, and we try to keep an updated calendar mayor of where we're speaking or a in this day and age on what we're seeking. And we have blog a blog that we try to add to somewhat regularly less when. On heat learning about this Rachel has an amazing Ted Talk. Talk from twenty nineteen about the UCS. What am I leaving out of the way, find us. Oh, the clinic! Thank you the clinics. You can find clinics online at the A C clinics dot com as well an interracial other projects. You'd be happy to share. Her gram. We want one big piece of our work is educating on. We're making a big push to educate other healthcare professionals, but also the general public and industry at large and policymakers literally everybody. INTO ABBOT ACADEMY IS OUR EDUCATION programs provided. Ivan Academy Dot Com. And we have monthly cannabis rounds. Where there is a presentation of topics of this month was cannabis in autism last month. We did this environment diseases. Coming up in July will have candidates and cancer. There's a presentation that can be watched on demand and then at the end of each month. There's a live human a session, so people can ask questions learn more. So, you can find out all about those programs at Academy, Dot Com. Awesome anything to add. David Rachel for Whigham. As far as clinic and Redo held a Ola oppor space REC- folks in also. GROWNUP, racist Hangul, more and more telemedicine and. Working, site. In the locker those options for. Patients. and. Awesome well, that's great, so everybody listening Go check them out I. mean there's yeah. You're all doing so many things all the time, so it's always fun keeping track of you. There's plenty to digest and learn from. So so go check all that out. And if you WANNA learn more about curious about canvas, you can find us at C.. A. C. PODCAST DOT, com Gaza. Find us on Instagram, facebook and twitter. And we also have a channel on Youtube. So check that out, and then also, if you want to support the show in general, we don't deal with advertisers sponsors so that we can explore the topics we want you in. Say the things we want to say and not worry about upsetting somebody that we are financially dependent on. So, if if you WANNA support the show, you can become a supporter at patriotic at Patriotair Dot. com slash curious about cannabis Thanks so much for tuning in stay. Curious in take it easy. If you, WANNA learn more about cannabis. You can check out the curious about Canada's book. Available now, Amazon Dot com and other online retailers. The curious about canvas podcast is presented by natural learning enterprises, a science education company dedicated to the enhancement of public scientific literacy through education about the natural world. Curious about cannabis is just one of several earning initiatives produced by natural learning enterprises to learn more go to www dot, natural learning enterprises dot, com or connect with me on facebook instagram twitter.

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Spiders: How Many Can There Be?

Every Little Thing

27:44 min | 1 year ago

Spiders: How Many Can There Be?

"This episode of every little thing is brought to you by Google domains if you have an idea google domains can help bring it to life with a unique you are l. for your website it starts with a name it becomes real with domain to get started go to domains dot google slash. You're not on a scale of ten eight or nine probably I I don't have any use for spiders eight or nine almost gave me a heart attack what level of Arachnophobia are you would you say on the hallway and it's not just one spider but several spiders like drop down from the ceiling yeah okay well we just sent you a video and just don't watch it into the new season of wire frame to find out subscribe on spotify or wherever you get your podcasts and you have reached the every little thing helpline please leave your itsy-bitsy message after the tone factual emergency here well days ago it happened again are you an accountant for a fly factory no no it's it's just a normal Russian I would love to do that your spider show tell me about the incident so it was just a normal day at work I was walking you know office full of accountants but I was sitting in the air talk sitting in my office talking with a coworker when all of a sudden a spider drop down from the ceiling it they just kept appearing in in the span of about ten minutes we probably killed fifty spiders then we look outside and there's all these experience design and how design shapes the way technology fits into our lives like in dating Adams can better design help users find better matches over to one of my coworkers offices and I almost ran right into spider so you know I jumped back and I start to look at and it just got me thinking okay I've I've seen one hundred spiders and the course of ten or fifteen minutes almonds oh it's one of the the drop ceilings with the tiles at pop up and then we start looking up on the tiles and we start seeing all these other little tiny spiders walking down the hall in my office building and threes fighters were hanging from the ceiling and then we start looking around there's fighters everywhere Stephen Hey Steven it's floor from AOL T. Today I'm good so this is a casual show feel free to call me what my friends call me your spine hadn't open it okay finer video what are you seeing how many spiders there possibly the fighters are there is one of those situations where we need to like burn the building down because we're invested you know how how many fighters are we dealing with they were falling faster than we can kill them the question is is phenomenon and spiders on our cars as well had you ever seen anything like this before no never in my life I've seen anything like this is the most exciting thing to happen on the job until August two thousand seven it had been an unusually ray yeah well with that I think we are ready to march into spider town the other ascione ranger talking state park it's about an hour east of Dallas Texas it has a big league campsites fishing Scott I don't remember how many you because now that I know that you were eight or nine on the arachnophobia scale do not watch that video no come on it'll be fun I'll be okay let's let's go okay you called about mass spider events you had an encounter work and you asked has this happened before Yup yeah well you can probably picture the landscape I can you know it's very green oak trees and things like that it's a really Nice Nice Florida Texas okay I'm not I haven't looked at the video okay grease let me know when I need to pull it up don't ever watch the video deleted the email this is a courtesy he needs to thrive what you're seeing rape over the trees Mo- yes and there will slough of spiders in it and it has hello saving that's Freddy going and a bunch of fighters dropped into his place of work to a war servile years as part it's going is trying to escape the lab I'm sorta wreak havoc on the whole world got out the largest spider ever erupted out of a astronaut maybe spewing whims may not feel that way after the story gosh so Freddie at a lot of jobs as a ranger he mowed the trails he looked after cam love covered you know covering entire tree that that's a no for me it actually wasn't just one tree oh my gosh it was burs he came to the rescue when a kid hooked a water snake on his fishing line they were screaming and yelling the parents thought out some kind of hero that's naked it's not really that I'm not really that Arachnophobia unplanned enough just a little bit okay well let's just see okay let's see where you are rainy summer and that meant a lot of bugs that year was the worst year of they were saying Firma -squitoes they will just horrible like how bad that doesn't even look like spiders you can barely even tell that it's trees I mean on spotify you can see this terror curtain on the episode page or on our instagram at Yale t show oh my gosh upped the way of just a solid home just solid medicine are you still with me barely sixty foot spider ORC encounter seem oh my counter is nothing compared to an acre of an Acre of spiders and like and one hundred thousand might be an underestimate one scientific report estimated millions of spiders in this web which means Freddie his left onto the doctors were there's the mouth oh the top of them all way down the other side to the ground covered all the Bush's like a sixty foot ahead on a probably combat sixty foot tall trees completely engulf spiderweb from the ground out in the woods hunt and fish in that kind of stuff and I never seen anything like that he'd never heard anything like it either a kill the more how do a gazillion spiders decide to form the world's scariest flash MOB OREGON UNTANGLE that web of questions after the break back in their back in back in the Timber Wolves Aachen trails were so Freddie hopped on his riding mower and headed to the trails and come around this one being right on while listening I think I've ever heard or their fixtures there are pictures check your email okay let me and if you're listening an acre of trees I have never seen anything like it before and I spent most of my life this episode of every little thing is brought to you by Ziprecruiter ziprecruiter helps growing businesses connect to qualified candidates. How do you do for Work I'm GonNa Count and what do you do for work now that you had to quit your job I'm still there? Although just cramming when Gretchen needed to hire a game artist she posted the job on Ziprecruiter ziprecruiter technology finds people with the right experience and invites them to apply that was great what new classic spiders how many spiders did did the scientists estimate were in this Web uh-huh and walked into one of the largest spider cons ever recorded a while Oh my gosh here you have a website idea yes I love movies and I want to start a website all about horror movies one stop shop for your horror needs yes com slash dlt ziprecruiter the smartest way to hire and this episode of every little thing is brought to you by google domain hiking much are GonNa see I go hiking a fair amount I've never seen anything like this I know that's what I wanted to has this happened before and Jamieson and dried up all the rain dried up enough I thought I can mow when was the last time you had mode Burlington two three months since when sales of hiking trails through the Timber Stephen Have you been to this area actually I I grew up in east Texas so yeah that's my neighborhood Google domains helps you take an idea and make it real with a unique url for Your Business or Passion Project I'm here with Max Gibson Gimblett producer and very north end of the park in by the left bacteria yard will be the light and come round a corner and I could see this tree that's all Gretchen found a new game artist in less than two weeks ziprecruiter says four out of five employers get a quality candidate through the site within the first day you can you can find for shadow pizza in the Freezer Aisle Okay Stephen to learn more about Spider Palu says oh I'd say hundred thousand or more two hundred thousand too many accepted they're killing -squitoes we talk to Cornell Iraq knowledge EST and Web md Dr Linda Rare Hi Steven how you doing good. Linda is a spider pro and she's pro spider like so pro spider that when she walked into our Gimblett studio. She plopped a medium-sized floral tote bag it was a shoebox full of live baby spiders in small vials small is this I mean how common is this I mean is this just one of those things that people who live out in the city are live in the city and don't you know don't go and this will just like it wasn't really detail though just overlaying each other and stuff the Whitman Steven how is this making and let the Swore me that care in mosquito repellent witty yeah that sounds about right so one day out it starts to the name it becomes real with domain to get started go to domains dot google slash Lt. This episode of every little thing is lost same but it's like okay hold off on the red pepper flakes for Shutt- made better taste better wither without red pepper flakes tarantula a baby Tarantula Brazilian blue tarantulas my voice cracking that's a surprise I don't think I've ever seen brought to you by for shadow frozen pizza made with premium ingredients the other day or Hey Estrada Aguirre producer baked up for shadow pizza here in the office Remiss Fast Stephen I thought you hung up why would you do that to you flora a live specimen it was hundreds of live specimens no oh yes tony little spider beds you know like I'm GonNa need two thousand small pillows plastic wheels sealed files in a will sealed plastic bag in a well sealed shoebox and each vial is filled with a dot com available. I'm trying to think how would sound it'd be like scream you know something like that dot com yeah I like it and I don't think anybody totally understands what's going on with it but from what I understand it's mostly in what branch and he used to grow her business she's the CO founder of Kogel and Education Tech Company that strives to teach kids the basics of Computer Angela. Irl I this is amazing do you actually take just one more time because I I am kind of odd and when they're locked up in a small plastic build webs that are directly above the water especially to catch a emerging insects and this is more or less the name so long jaws those are super creepy looking spiders and these spiders are traditionally loners they usually build a web for one these guys tool event I believe it's been seen in Texas Pakistan and a number of other places but it's a big deal because it's not happening all over we're live you're asking for slices of pizza but for all his baking or he never actually got to taste the pizza until now willing to build their webs in close proximity that's really interesting so one way to attract spiders in large numbers is to set container I feel like I can really interact with them in a way that I can't course more than happy to look just don't open anything everyone you're in is probably fifteen yards from this starting of the way on in you could hear the mosquitoes thousand that was her so this kind of adds up with Freddie's account of it being a bad mosquito year absolutely yeah I think I think that's what's happening it's what's that's my spider personality too so this might help explain what happened in Texas but I don't think it explains what happened in your office yes there are a few other times when spiders congregate some spiders are born social both to these are in the COBWEBS fighter family occurring near water and the dominance spiders that seems to be in these groups are long Jhad spiders family Tetra Nathe Day Long Jawed spiders you've probably seen them before they have these extra long legs and these really really big jaws and rare about this is that so many spiders or building their webs together but you know if there is enough food spiders I was so surprised this wasn't like oh I'm GonNa bring you stuff and we can look at it she was just like I had them with me of course as one to hotel I mean that's something that you have to disclose I mean if you're going to bring thousands of spiders I mean is that also something to disclose do you ask for Dan Large Sheet webs and when I say sheet webs I'm talking more or less a continual sheet kind of like our grasp and even see the sky there's there are so many spire wilms exactly I mean it wasn't like you walk around you see spider webs you can see the details collines I know and here's the big advantage of colony living the big deal about living in a social spider web is that so it's a big deal I like the woolly mammoth example that's wild out above buffet solitary spiders will endure others win tons of food is involved I know I'm the guy that never misses the buffet spiders injecting venom in gnawing on it they're able to take down far for larger prey than they can on their own and then they share that food they specialize on and from what I fred these are spiders that are building in areas that are having big flushes of insects coming up primarily out of war here's but lots lots bigger and these can easily have tens of thousands of spiders in them I did not know that there were spires living in so we have solitary spiders that commune when there's massive amounts of food and then there are social spiders that live in colonies and e massive food is a precursor for free just go to ziprecruiter dot com slash E. L. T. that's ziprecruiter dot com slash e. l. t. once again ziprecruiter dot and then the velvet spiders and family reese today they're rare only about three percent of all spiders are social and the thing that makes them socialist that they live communally and our co workers swarmed him everybody was asking me they're like pizza for lunch nothing no I wish it's actually that and then they were like oh like can I have some this is when the thrill seeking adrenaline junkie spider takes to the air and balloons ballooning his is awesome actually atmosphere and then evidently they are able to turn their body in different ways and choose to come down most of these spiders they're about the size of my little finger nail and they're able to catch really big prey so big grasshoppers big and then there's at least one more circumstance where you get a lot of spiders in one place and I think this might shine some light on your experience I'm running do you WanNa guess what Wendy had whether I can only imagine was it a live spider live specimen it wasn't the Pepperonis a lot spicier than I thought it would be I like spicy topping me too I'm usually the person who has to have a bottle releasing silk the silk gets wafted up into the air as though it was a kite and pulls the spider up into the or or needs or so domain names what she thinking how like scream and shout scream shout it is tune in together I mean should we imagine them being like everyone's like down there and how do they know where to go no idea and nobody has any idea yeah the same day oh wow but I am a little curious as to how they got in to the office well the other option Linda said because of the spiders five hundred spiders living above you I'm actually really sorry he is a behavior where small spiders mostly put their abdomen up in the air they're essentially putting their but up in the air does that mean people spiders Outta my bag like she had them in a new car in a hotel you know if you're going to bring like a dog or cat so that's Linda and she knew all about the Texas Spider Bash it's a really unusual says Stephen Spider long distance migration have you heard of this I've never heard of such a thing I mean I I've heard of ballooning because I've read big moths or butterflies Go Willy Mammoth for us a yeah yeah much more like a woolly mammoth and if you've got thirty or more dance Oh spiders are able to spurs crazy long distances how far many many hundreds of miles so do they for you spiders spiders now I've never heard that it's actually the original wasn't baby spiders it sounds to me like they've got a lot of insects and leaks into their building because spiders go where there's food maybe you don't have a spider problem you have ridership thank you so much that's the best compliment I've ever gotten if you have a burning question down on the table and pulled out a special surprise feel very nervous about what's coming out of this hopefully my car just for that reason thank you for enduring this year spider ship thank you you know you are the ultimate spiders anyway back to your office building ballooning could be the reason why you saw them all over the car that day yes yes I'm just they killed them all I am a firm Believer in Delhi cups as a way to deal with spiders in your home will next time we arnold's were but I've never heard of hundreds and hundreds of miles there's actually a song about this about spider ballooning events really yeah I'll play it bad forelegs bad eight legs good goodbye every little thing is produced by Gabby Bull Garelli phoebe Flanagan a net heist and flora licnen off the entire season drops October sixteenth following listen for free on spotify or wherever this episode of every little thing is brought to you by the second season of wire frame a podcast from Gimblett creative and adobe it's a show about you X. or user with help from Nicole pursued Aqsa Doug Baron and George Hale our consulting editors are caitlyn Kenny in Hor hey just our food problem you know you say that but I don't we don't have bugs everywhere I don't know you probably you know why you don't the twisted urban legend from Gimblett Continues Daphne Rubin Vega is back for the second season of the horror of Delors Roach pulsars nickname their first discovery the very first polls are just a radio signal coming from the sky and extremely regular the region yes there's some pictures of like an ATM covered with hundreds of spiders it was they were everywhere at that same time record by Dara Hirsch Alia and Bobby Lord mixed by Marcus Bu gala two legs get your podcasts thanks to our sponsors ziprecruiter where growing businesses can connect to qualified candidates Stephen next time you see fifty spiders dropping from the ceiling or spiders carpeting your car take a picture for US altogether picture out all keep a daily Cup later on we we saw some pictures on the local news of you know this wasn't just an isolated event it was they were everywhere across try it for free at ZIPRECRUITER DOT com slash. Ut Ziprecruiter the smartest way to hire thanks to our sponsor for Shehata for that an egg sac hatched in your sailing the cobweb spider can have as many as three to four hundred eggs per egg sac. But I've gotTa say if Rosen pizza made with premium ingredients like scratch made sauce and Zesty Pepperoni it's frozen pizza that's made better to taste better for Shutt- pre get to the bottom of give us a call eight three three rings Yell Eight Three Three Ring Yeltsi if I must survive underground for a while that it'd be hunter because I am a animal Everything I wanted to bring up about little man is

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Episode 36 Olivia Green gets a message from Space

BunnyRanch Podcast

28:26 min | 9 months ago

Episode 36 Olivia Green gets a message from Space

"Daddy D if it ain't going down at the bunny ranch it ain't going down at all. Stolen we interrupt your broadcast. Oh Alan Jamieson. This is the badge gas. We are coming from you from our space station. Opping by one up here in space at hang on. I think I got transmission coming from the planet low. Is there someone there love got it? It's Olympic Green. Oh Man Libya how you doing? Good how are you oh not too bad way? Is that sagebrush ranch right there? Yes it is. I am so stoked to be here. Oh my goodness K. So you're at Sagebrush now. Yes okay I had the opportunity. It's so awesome but I had the opportunity to move over here to Sagebrush ranch so I am now going to be a starlet. Oh well I mean that's a good thing. Yeah Sagebrush is honestly really fun house and such a large property to it's awesome. It's really really. It's beautiful I love my room. I'm getting on in. It's pretty awesome. Yeah Yeah Jeez. Yeah where are you? Yeah I'm up here in space. Actually we we came up here to humping one space station that we have. Did you say that you're in Spain? Weird enough I am in space. You gotta be kidding. Hit the goggles. And everything I was fixing some like reactor thing and communications array. It's really technical things. The flux capacitor was way off. Yeah I had to do like some like phaser two photon. Its way over your head and I mean I don't. I don't really know exactly. All I know is like the communications array flower system was down. I had adjusted with that flux capacitor. And now we're here. You know I finally got a hold of you. Yeah really complicated of their super complicated. I mean we flew out here a little while ago so that way we can keep broadcasting down to the planet hit the get up you know Plus the shirts shirts kind of like Star Trek. You know where you shirts represent different like positions in the ship. I Guess Yeah Pink See it it is it is. This is the humping bunny pink or a Cotton Candy Pink. If you're actually shopping on stored up bunny ranch. Dot Com online store is up there and you can even get some of the sagebrush gear. Who knows I mean? Maybe I'll fly down and we'll go down to the wild west and have our little sagebrush teacher. It's you know with our stars on them also. Yeah I mean you're GonNa have one now that you're at sage. Oh Heck Yeah. I can't wait to get a siege shirt and a hoodie and we have so much and I also heard that you were going to like in a few months that we're going to be getting new gear for Sagebrush to actually sagebrush will be getting some new clothing probably later on this year we were kind of delayed in our rollout because Bunny ranch actually got the little bit of a good roll out and then you know obviously the quarantine happened right so move a little closer to your Mike or move to the microphone close to you a little bit there you go there go. I can hear you now. Yeah Yeah it was. It was a little quiet. Don't worry so for all of you listeners. Out there you know. We have a lot of technical computer generated well craziness welcome to the Bunny ranch network to point out. Actually I think this is like this is so much fun as might be like three or four or five or twenty at this point with my rollouts because I tend to change things a lot but with that being said though. Livia what are why are you still at Sagebrush? Why aren't you like home or relaxing and like the beach on Mars or something? Well when we close close march nineteenth right. I had the awesome opportunity because Madame Souza. She gave us the option to be able to stay here and to stay safe and to stay quarantined. And it's just I mean how could I possibly pass up just the awesome opportunity to stay safe and not have to like go out in the world so that way all you know? I get to stay quarantined. Yeah definitely yeah. That's that that's a huge opportunity. Right there because not many people especially. I can't speak for every brothel company or hotel industry or anything but I definitely know that like not many people will be able to light you. Stay at the police business right. Just is that what you feel more safe? I mean we're we're behind giant gates. And you know you guys. I know you're allowed to go to the grocery store. You're allowed to do pretty much anything as long as you. Don't go party out and go crazy right hell. Yeah and I have a car so able to you know like you said go to the grocery store get some things. I've been baking a lot. I've been cooking dinner. It's just been truly like just a godsend. I really have to say that. Feels like an awesome privilege to be here and then on top that to get the awesome opportunity to move over to Sagebrush on top of it in so I get to set up all my room now and I'm hitting the microphone and as long as you know the people can hear you down at on the same planet. You're on earth right now. We're just floating around here in space. So it's okay my goodness into space. Cloaks right I took this off a Martian like I don't even know if he's marsh and he was just a little gray Leeann. I mean it wasn't little he was like six something. How'd you tackle them? Oh man actually. He came and visited. And we're drinking out drinking James He brought some things with them and said they were like space. Jews yeah I have no idea space juices you know there are a lot of juices everywhere right. I'm kidding. We're all quarantined. You know we`re. We're making sure that everyone is tested. Make sure everything is fully secure Lysol everywhere you know. Even space can break so all sterilized up there. Yeah exactly we. We just like you guys down there. We're making sure everything is good to go up here to write like our. I have to say like Sagebrush is totally serialised. It's amazing we have Lysol everywhere. We have clocks waves making sure that staying ahead of anything you know just want to make sure that we all stay safe year. So it's been it's been pretty amazing. I have to say really really happy to be here. Yeah definitely Can Imagine I mean it's you know what? What exactly are you doing to keep yourself busy down there at sage though? Are you simply just sitting around you know? Are you playing with sex toys all day? Getting some practice getting ideas for like you're crazy parties coming up. You know things like that right so I have to say like I said grocery stores have gotten a few things as far as like cooking and baking and I was putting my stuff away as far as in the kitchen and Really been putting my room together and so it's going to be you know exactly the way I want it for when we do open because it's just so exciting for when we do open and I've also been reading a lot which is a great. There's a book that I actually. I went by and Walmart the other day which. I'm just glad that they've stayed open to but it's A prequel it's George. R R Martin. Prequel to game of thrones and it's called the night of seven kingdom so I've been really stoked about that okay. So how far are you in the book? Not Very far. Never I I have. You read all the other series of that book. Oh yes okay actually read the first four bucks okay. So you know that like the first whole book is like ours and months and years of walking. Yeah just like the first movie and walking. It's just yeah you can tell resentment there. Three hours of walking in a movie right. Why quickly fly winter coming? I'm kidding Microphone keeps dipping then flip it like funnier. I Lo- it. You know just trying to get good on earth here at the gravity is much different there. You know. We have clearly much better and our hair is much better right Couple of other things so I a lot of you guys know that I broke my glasses a few months ago so I got my new glasses. So really excited about that So it's been nice that I have been able to read and also you asked me about sex. Yeah Yeah so. One of my favorite sex toys. is called a tango and it's by we vibe and it kind of is about A looks like a lipstick. Honestly to It's blue or pink or there's two different colors and it's supposed to be like the highest. It's like the strongest vibration in a wireless sex toy. Okay Yeah so. Earn A rechargeable or wireless waterproof and. It's pretty awesome. So yeah the keeping myself busy with that too so so reading. Do you do at the same time reading? And then I don't offer the reading some of those. Game of thrones books. You're so awesome James. You're hilarious so you know I know that you bake what's so obviously you haven't done a cooking show yet we're getting there. You know. Have to make sure adhere to all the beautiful rules. Also make sure we have all the ingredients right and then don't change the recipe. That's the other thing is so apple. Crisp is one of my favorite things to make. It's actually in my bio so I tell you guys they come and spend an overnight with me and I would love to make you apple crisp of also made a ton of cakes and things like that for you. Gentlemen and ladies to actually But Apple Crisp is probably one of my favorite things to make because you can have a recipe but then if you kinda like move it around a little bit. It's not too drastic of a change as far as you know if you'd prefer a little less sugar a little more sugar but you do need sugar in it. I'm hitting the mark and so if With the sugar you need the sugar to actually caramelizes with the butter. So that's one thing you do need but you can also just adapt and change things up. You don't have to put it as much sugar in your apples. Things like that so okay so we're going to break off topic. Well it's on topic with this but it's off topic you said caramelizes. Yeah is a Caramel or Caramel. Well that's the age old question here. What is it exactly? So I'm from about twenty five hundred miles away. I'm from Boston and Nantucket Massachusetts so because of that. I've always said Caramel. Okay Yeah I have some friends that are from Texas and Pennsylvania and things like that in so I have said Carl okay. It's generally caramelized. So is it soda or pop then for you so coke most definitely soda okay. Yeah I I mean I don't know. Sometimes people have weird things that they do know. Been stuff yeah so with that too you know. What else are you doing down there? I I mean I know used to do a bunch of hikes and stuff. There's a bunch of trails and I know Miss Kim who was the manager for all the The red light district area right sage. Love ranch cat that she plans a lot. I'm her in Serena. They plan a lot of the actual like little events like we had a Easter dinner. That you guys went to the store. Wait a movie night or we wouldn't want him to watch movies. We were well under the nine people actually supposed. I think we were at an eight people. Total that were there which are just the people physically here and we've all been quarantined. Jim Exactly you're all together so it's very easy. Yeah a little bit different all right. So what about those hikes? Though are you like I. I know it's been cold so obviously can't do a bunch of hikes right now but. Are you getting ready because I mean tomorrow? I think it's GonNa be like over seventy. I think it's going to be about seventy here down there definitely. I've been looking at whether bug and that's my weather APP and I've been looking at today. It said that it was going to rain a little bit. So actually didn't go hiking today but There's some just beautiful trails here in Nevada and I love to go hiking and it's just a great way to get outside and it's just it's awesome. Been having a great time. Yeah well yesterday I mean I went actually teleport down there. Pardon you know we went down. I did our little blue Yeah I went down to Fort Churchill. Which is a Old Army like a wild west army base fort. The mud for you know. It's all the ruins that are left and I walked around there. There was really no one. Actually there was no one out there until I was leaving but I took a bunch of photos. A bunch of different things out there to kind of showcase the beauty of Nevada especially because it was such a beautiful morning yesterday so I think I got home around twelve so I was out there pretty early my good but it's a very far secluded area away from like all of space. We've teleport's I teleported down recorded. Yeah I mean it's like an hour or so away from you but I tell from space station which takes me like not even a second you blink and I'm there. Oh Margaret Awesome and we gotta wear like catchy space gear like these humping bunny shirts. They come in multiple colors seriously. Like that is a great humping bunny. That is so fun I mean I really like it. I actually did the main design. I know it's really basic humping bunnies. It's our logo. But you know it makes sense right. Yeah our logo and to have a normal well shirt right so we had an all different colors all prepared for fabulous spring and Easter. And we're not open so you can get them online. Help support. The company and key buzz productions actually stored up bunny ranch dot COM. And you can actually pick up that. I know I plugged this earlier and I apologize. If you're listening on the apple podcasts. Spotify Google stitcher tune in and Youtube as well any of those fabulous things or if you're just watching on Youtube you can see my outfit. Don't worry myself. It'll be everywhere. Don't worry we'll maybe I'll tell down and we'll put you in a biohazard suit or something and I can take with you. We'll see are wrapping garbage-bag contaminating ship. I know you're not sick but no no contamination. Yeah Stupid Rolling Chair laughing space. Yeah you know the chair a plan for everything you know and we. We came up here. Pretty Quick Space Station. I was GONNA say gravity issues up there too. Yeah I mean we weren't really planning on being up here this long or at all. This was supposed to be just like a quick like. Hey partisan space. I got a question for you. James Bright so we're talking about the game of thrones earlier right and so you're talking about three hours of walking and then I was thinking through and I'm sticking to my fantasy books and I do love my fantasy. You in general so it was like maybe as he talking about. Lord of the Rings Because Winter is coming in game of thrones. I think we're having some technical difficulties. Oh yeah transmission new transmission. Yeah yeah yeah the visions of protons. Yeah yeah the flux. Capacitor is a little loose and Yeah I mean Et and those Zeno morphs from alien attacking. Oh shoot hilarious going on up there. Yeah Aliens Aliens Aliens. You're going to have to tackle some more of those James Aliens. Oh yes I mean. Hey there's some pretty cute ones I mean. I was watching Star Trek Card last night. Not Not to digress mistake. Two different medieval Middle Earth stories that Lord of the Rings Middle Earth. You know two things I mean. Game of thrones. Okay I'll put it this way before I break off into star Trek to I. I've never read the Lord of the Rings or game of thrones. I've only seen the movies in the show now. Both of them are really good. I tried reading Lord of the rings and I got really bored just like the first movie and I Apologize For Lord of the Rings Fans Out There. I really am. And Game of thrones game of thrones. It was a good show. Hbo Did a Great Job Law. Total nudity and sex. Hbo Here for sure. But anyway back to star Trek Yes Star Trek is good. I watched the new series Star Trek Card. It was really cool but picard. He meets us like a little Romulus kid who actually load later on. He grows up obviously because he's not a kid anymore. He's like thirty or twenty something. He is gorgeous as an adult curious. Yeah Yeah Watch the show. It's it's called his concubine or cock you buying or whatever it's I don't know anyways. That's a dude. He runs around with swords and he's got twenty years in cool eyebrows and he's gorgeous. He's Australian because he has Australian accent and right. There is the perfect in my heart. 'cause you know. I have a huge crush on choice of on from Australia. Who is a singer? So I don't know who that is. Okay I'll send you a few songs saying no coming in. It's coming in. Okay sorry I told you to make sure you had your little. Antennas up with your Tinfoil things but apparently you didn't get that email so that's okay no tinfoil. I'll have to wear it next time. James you know. Not to digress on too much of myself because this is not about me. It's about you since you WanNa make fun of me but this is just awesome. You're bin Space Fun. We have to be up in space. I mean come on there's viruses and crazy things down there and protests and tons of crazy stuff going on. I'm just happy to be quarantined. That's all I have. It's really am feel very fortunate. I know that I'm saying that again but it's really really true. It's pretty awesome So yes I actually do. Have a question queued up for you. What is your most favorite memory so far from working for the company night? Oh you've been here for a little while right because you came from Alien Cat House originally right Yep and then moved up here and you went to love ranch. We'll actually can't that's right. Yeah that's right 'cause that's where it was filmed right so I was so I was at. Ilene Cat House for about a month and then I went to kick cat and it was there for about a year and one of my favorite memories. My goodness just like the most amazing thing so my birthday is February. Sixth and that week is also very busy It's a very busy week in general as far as the ranches in so that week it was absolutely my pleasure. Like I can't even tell you how much this meant to me. But it was my birthday and Madame Suzanne and Dennis actually played Bingo with all of the ladies at the ranch. It was so much fun like back. I'm Suzanne turned into little wheel. Bingo awesome man. It was so cool. It like we're all doing. Be One like just tell you. It's so cool. So it's one of my most fond memories for sure other than client experiences like. That's totally different story. I have all kinds of fun clan experiences too so like all kinds right deep into their and like all different types of stop right there. What if my sue as far as one of my favorite client memories. There is a gentleman and he took me on an outdated lake. Tahoe and I had already been to lake. Tahoe with A couple and we rented a cabin sort of done like that type of experience as far as like heavy a cabinet and we all cook together actually made them matching will. The three of us were matching aprons and put each of our initials on the front of the Apron which was way cool So we did that and then this gentleman he actually brought me out to dinner and then we went to sightseeing on the Nevada. Side of Lake. Tahoe and it was just so beautiful and you know he was really awesome just so sexy and cute and he took pictures of me in the background with like having all of the beautiful Blue Lake. Tahoe behind me. It was just it was all right. Well a Livia if someone wants to get hold of you what are some of the different ways your online that we can do that. Well so I'm now going to be under the Sagebrush form on the Bunny Ranch Message Board. Okay so I will be over there on that side of things now which is a little bit different and so really excited about that but also my email so you guys can get to know me. I would love to get to know you guys before we open so please feel free to reach out to me and my email is Olivia Green at Sagebrush ranch dot com okay. How about twitter? Do you have a twitter? I do my twitter is at Olivia Green and I am the girl next door and so much more and you guys are going to be seeing even more from me here at Sagebrush so I'm going to be a lot more than just the girl next door. Okay yeah all right all right all right. I can dig that excited. Well with that being said though Make sure to get a hold of her. It's a four bunny ranch dot com slash forum. It'll be somewhere in the bottom there. Pops up growing things you can also reach her or email and everything and make sure you get a hold of her and also stored up Bunny Ranji DOT COM. I know I can say this. Probably Way too many times and I'm going to make sure you go on there. It helps support all the different productions. We do and also helps support the company and get the word out there. 'cause we're all? Can you get the cool logo? Like the humping Bunnies Sagebrush. Starlet the KITTIES. And then also those the lovers for my lover's God. That's why I just came from Jay. No I okay. We're having transmission issues. It's okay already. Put My goggles back on. Oh my goodness we got leaks up here and thing right so I'm just really. I'm so excited that you had me on. I love all of those. I mean this is just so wonderful and I really really appreciate it. Thank you for finding me and you know. I'm just so glad to be here. Well it's a pleasure always having you here so again. My name is James and this is the bunny ranch. Podcast if you have any questions of things you want to be like any questions that you have you WanNa tell these girls and get answers from James at Bunny ranch dot com. You can also tweet us all the information down there. Make sure you log on there at sagebrush ranch at Kit. Kat Brothel at love ranch north and at Bunny ranch and then at Bunny ranch. Net W K which is money wrench network or you can reach us on YouTube dot com slash money wrench network or give us a five star rating and subscribe on all major podcast platforms. James and I'm still off. I'll hang on. We're GONNA transmissions all right Olivia. We're we're going to disconnect from up here. Don't worry I'll I'll try and tell the poor down later three yes I'm cool. Food Food's been replicated you bring those goggles. Who got no right there? Special space goggles allow us to be around with the aliens. Because I have a date with another Alien Zealand's are great. I can't wait till I can go on a date again. What you can soon. It's going to be wonderful. I didn't mean to wine right now but I've got to say like I can't wait until we're open. We were full definitely. I trust me. I miss all the noises and the allowed promotions and you always have company Ladies Company because we have the intercom system to the bells. All the other ranches. So it's a way different mentality of having a dead silent building here so different but again make sure you like comment subscribe tells your favorite moment and remember. Thank you for listening and continuing on your support of the Bunny Ranch podcasts. And all of the Red Light district by thank you.

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Strange News: Derechos Ravage the US, the Okinawan Sleeping Epidemic, and Someone May Have Solved the Mystery of 'CROATOAN.'

Stuff They Don't Want You To Know Audio

1:01:45 hr | 5 months ago

Strange News: Derechos Ravage the US, the Okinawan Sleeping Epidemic, and Someone May Have Solved the Mystery of 'CROATOAN.'

"Did you know GEICO's now offering an extra fifteen percent credit on car and motorcycle policies. That's fifteen percent on top of what guy could already save you. So what are you waiting for your dentist to actually believe you and your flashing every day? Absolutely great and you're cutting down on your sweets of course. Wonderful. Then I don't even need to look in their great see in six months. There's never been a better time to switch to geico save an extra fifteen percent when you switch by October seventh limitations apply visit GEICO DOT COM for details. In nineteen eighty-three, Diane downs, shot her three children killing one and severely injuring the others she showed up for her trial pregnant. Now, nearly forty years later that child Becky Babcock, is on a journey to explore her connection with her mother's violent past listened to happy face present to face on the iheartradio APP apple podcasts or wherever you find your favorite shows. UFO's psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now. or learn the stuff they don't want you to know. A production of IHEART breeding. Hello welcome back to the show. My name is Matt. My name is Noel they call me Ben we're joined as always with our super producer Alexis Cope named Doc Holliday Jackson most importantly you are you you are here and that makes this stuff. They don't want you to know it's the top of the week, which means we are diving into our weekly strange news segment, all the hits, all the weird ones that we wanted to examine. It gives them a little bit of a closer look maybe and today we're traveling around the world. We've got a bit of hidden history. We've got a Japanese mystery we've got the. How would you? What would you call it? Matt. The weather in Iowa seems to be. A little bit dismissive because this is a big deal. L. It's it's whether saying, I don't care who you are where you are what you think's going on what your weather person says I'm just GonNa blow a hundred mile wins at you and and I don't G F. Text message received loud and clear. Yes. So with all these stories, you'll one thing back that we have been running into is the difficulty with narrowing down our choices to a single thing I even eight-year-old pitch to you guys on air that maybe when time and interest allows, we spend a little time at the end of an episode just laundry listing stuff we didn't get to I don't know what do you think we could do down to we could make it a thing. There's just make a six episode that's just listener listener mail the hit the floor if you guys want us to maybe seven who cares we'll just make him eight days a week. Boy nobody tell our boss that. So you know we didn't talk about where we WANNA travel I. Anybody anybody feeling particularly fired up. What a hop hop on Mike I or weaken? Why don't we keep it? In the US in the heartland of the United States, we're going to begin with a story that you likely heard about. Perhaps you lived through this event. If you are out in the midwest of the United States does something happened last week this is This is the headline of the articles from USA Today from August, Fourteenth Twenty twenty. Islands grapple with aftermath of Monday's deadly Directo a disaster that we have never seen. Now if you go through this article. In is highlighting something called a Dorito Storm D. e.. R. E. C. H. O.. Yes. If you speak Spanish or you took Spanish in class at some point in your life, Directo is a word that you've likely heard it means a variety of things can mean a variety of things from the right from the center there couple other. strap believe from straightforward something like that. It bit odd to have that word when describing a storm. But let's talk about what one of these things is. What is Directo? Let's jump to article called a what is retro from Forbes This writer Marshall Sheppard is taking a lot of information from the Noaa the national. Oceanic. Atmospheric. Administration okay so A DORITO as described by the NOAA. Tough to get through. Let's just let's say what it is according to them. It is defined as a widespread long-lived wind storm. That's pretty simple. Right? Why spread long-lived windstorm they're typically associated with organized bands of rapidly moving thunderstorms or rainstorms like squall lines or bunch of other terms. Or you probably wouldn't understand all of these systems are classified as mezro scale convective systems. So MCS is a term you may see thrown around with a lot of these articles. So. What does that actually mean? That means you're GONNA get winds of seventy five miles per hour. Sometimes, and as in the case of this most recent retro, there were wind gusts recorded at one hundred, twelve miles per hour, which if you're imagining a tornado or a hurricane, that's the kind of strength you're GONNA see with a I believe it is a category, three hurricane the you will see winds at that speed. Intense stuff here's the scary thing about direct us. They come out of nowhere when when you're imagining okay, there's a storm coming to storms coming that could form together to create tornadoes. Right? We've got winds coming from one one way winds coming from the opposite direction and as they hit the those, those two systems can churn together in create a tornado and meteorologists can look at something like that and say, okay, it's likely that you're going to get tornadoes forming from these two storm systems converging. With show. Is Very different. It's much more difficult to predict and that's what makes them so scary. That combined with the fact that the wind gusts can happen. Literally with zero warning. You will all the sudden get wind gusts coming through of fifty, two, hundred miles per hour. So in order to illustrate this and what recently happened out in Iowa before even get to what occurred in Iowa I want to read you a story. From the Noaa in it's about a director that occurred in nineteen, ninety nine in Maine that's in the if you're not from the US or perhaps you are in the US, Maine is in the north easternmost part of our country. There's a woman named Sarah Jamieson she at the time in one thousand, nine National Weather, service, meteorologist she was up in Maine she was hanging out there with friends and family going camping for the fourth of July. Now it's her and several family members and it was very hot and humid on that day in one, thousand, nine, hundred, nine. There's a temperature high of around ninety degrees Fahrenheit, and the family was going to sleep that night right they spent the day like boating swimming doing all the things you do out on the lake they decided they were going to go to sleep one person was sleeping in. An SUV that was parked nearby and I'm going to read directly from the article here as the Independence Day celebration came to an end sleeping arrangements were made for the night at the campsite near the shore of the Lake where they staying Sarah's mother and father would sleep on their boat near the docks. Her brother would sleep in the sports utility vehicle and Sarah and her friends would share a tent. As the night progressed, Sarah mentioned that the quote air was very stagnant with no wind making it very uncomfortable in that hot tent Sarah in friends were having trouble sleeping. So at about three, a m she and a friend left the tent to get some fresh air and they noticed lightning out in the distance. Now we're talking pretty far away on the distance, right? They went back to the tent, zipped up the flaps because they thought. Okay there's a rain storm coming. We're in a tent we don't want to get soaked in the meantime Sarah's mother had also woken up and Sarah's mother became really concerned because there's A storm approaching seesaw, the amount of lightning something told her that she needed to act. So she left the boat to go warned in her friends member there in the tent that they need to get out of that tent. So she ran about twenty to thirty yards. That's not very far twenty to thirty yards from the boat to where that tent was, and once she reached the tent and she began to yell for Sarah and her friends, Zor daughter and her friends hey, get out of this tent the roar of the winds there were coming through were so loud that the kids couldn't hear her like imagine that. Winds there were so loud going through the trees and across the the water and the waves is so loud that you can't even hear your mom right outside your tent. So thankfully once she actually got to the tent, she was able to get attention get them out. They went back to the SUV the big heavy car, which is probably safer than being an attempt or on a boat in a situation like that. Almost immediately after they got into SUV, a tree fell down right near the campsite and then another giant tree was completely operated fell onto that tent where they where the kids were sleeping. And, it only lasted twenty minutes. I think thirty minutes and the storm was completely gone. There was hardly any rain there was associated. They said, there were trees falling all around them and it happened with almost zero warning and the only reason that they were saved was because the mother had experience with something like this before and she was aware of it. So imagine this entire scenario occurring all across. Iowa across South Dakota across Ohio a ton of the Midwest. That is what just happened in the United States and there's so much other stuff occurring. In the world from a new standpoint from all the headline grabbers that are out right now that this is kind of just occurred and left. So. You know I understand just a little bit about Rachel's I know that for many of us, this may have been the first time we ever heard about it but this is a known phenomenon correct like this has been a route. Yes it's it's been around it's been recorded for hundreds of years actually love people have been talking about this since I know the eighteen hundreds and they've been recording instances of it and it's a seasonal too I believe they're in that. There are four months August being one where two radios are much more likely to occur. This is you know when when you were first telling me about this Matt At least on my end I assumed it was more crazy disastrous weather from overall climate change. But I thought the same thing about that fire tornado that just happened in northern. California A. So, this is not a product of the euro global warming or anything like that. This is a sneak attack by the climate that can just happen. This, I mean this sounds to me like no pun intended maybe put into nano a perfect storm kind of situation where these things are coming together in such a way to create this larger than life situation is that accurate I? Mean it's definitely conditions that are kind of coalescing to create this rather than just a bigger picture climate change issue. Yeah. Guys I can't speak to whether or not. This has anything to do with climate change unfortunately whether or not I know Yeah Yeah Yeah But but I do know that if you look at a map of the US in the Midwest, there's a very large area. You can find maps of this if you if you search for it and your favorite browser. You will find maps where. In the larger area there's around one of these. In any given time I think it's usually in a year and then you get a little smaller there's two riches in a year and get even smaller. There's four three or four over the course of. Two years I believe it's a bit odd the way it's kind of a sham there. But yes, the these things do happen on a fairly frequent basis but the amount of damage. That occurred in this previous one, the one that occurred last week. That's really what's putting this kind of making a newsworthy for me at least. There were hundreds of thousands of across the Midwest that were out of power and there are still people right now as we're recording this on August seventeenth, they are still without power because there was such intense damaged onto the infrastructure and you know again I have to stress. It's not a hurricane that you can prepare for. It's not a tornado that you get. Maybe you've experienced this, you're listening a large warning in your town in your. City wherever you are where you actually hear a siren and you know there's a tornado coming and you can prepare even if it's just short term prepared, you know duck and cover if you will. But you know take shelter within your home or whatever building you're near This kind of thing just if feels like, oh, there's probably a storm coming and then all of a sudden fifty to one hundred mile per hour winds are smashing you. It's really it's really scary. So the the amount of damage let's go back to this original article from USA Today. As of midday Friday, as I said, we're recording this on the seventeenth. Just three days prior, there were still one hundred, forty, thousand customers in Iowa that didn't have power. there were sixty thousand in Illinois didn't have power again this is like across all of these states. The state of Iowa has declared a disaster. They are hoping to get powerfully restored by tomorrow as recording this, and there is a quote here be oh, by the way I didn't even say Cedar rapids is the city within Iowa that was hit the worst, and you can find other articles that are specifically talking about what happened in Linn County and Cedar Rapids Iowa and I recommend you do that. If I'm not mistaken I, think they're requesting something like four billion dollars in almost Yeah almost. It makes total sense. You know the other big thing here to talk about is that there's a lot of property damage. Obviously, there's a lot of damage to infrastructure. There's also damage to to humans that need to go to the hospital. And we're in a time when you know the corona virus and and the precautions that have to be taken for that, our overriding everything else and this only piles on and think about hospitals that are attempting to treat someone who has covid nineteen and then losing power you know hopefully, there are backup systems in most of the major hospitals there. But you know that that can't be true for all of them. I'd like to point out one other thing here a knock on effect that maybe people aren't thinking about just yet. I ah w-was. A huge agricultural state, and we're talking about millions, millions of acres of farmland in some of the most fertile soil in the world be knocked out of commission. So that is going to meal without knowing the time line of win that. Particular ripple hits the rest of the nation We know what's on the way As for true that is it's a scary thought and you're absolutely right. Of Damage to crops, it's interesting. I was asking kind of like. When you started this one about you know, what is this like is, is it a product of climate change is just sort of like a perfect kind of scenario that leads to this rare event and that kind of is the case there's a really great article in National Geographic about everything you've ever wanted to know about what a ritual is the way it's formed as warm air rising from the surface of the earth and then colliding with colder air in the upper atmosphere, and then that cools to its do point and then That's the temperature that in which water. Vapor condenses into drops which causes clouds, and then the cooled air drops back to the surface where it warms up again and starts this process all over again creating this crazy like feedback loop that just whips this up into a crazy. You know fervor and becomes this incredibly damaging storm that while a tornado kind of blast through an area and sort of you know works itself out this one just just this lack pummeling kind of straight line of just absolute carnage that just keeps going and I I believe it takes longer for it to kind of wind down. You're absolutely right now all of this is the way the morning call put it in another article they just released. The quote is when you're in a show, you can have these winds lasting for much longer than you had seen a tornado. So the damage that can be caused by one hundred miles per hour wind blowing on you for ten minutes is going to be different than one hundred miles per hour wind blowing on you for two minutes like with a tornado. So you can kind of picture if you've ever lived through one or if you've seen images of them when a tornado passes through, it is moving very very rapidly and depending on. The number of that Tornado, the essentially the diameter of it of how large that Tornado is. You can imagine that it's going. So quickly only has such a diameter that it's only on your. You're only experiencing the true power of Tornado for a short period with the STRETO I mean ten minutes to experience that power your. That's why so many buildings so much infrastructure just gets decimated I can't imagine it just sounds like a hell on earth just an absolute nightmare and I'm really not trying to make light when I bring this up. I recently watched the movie twister of I believe Joel Schumacher was a jolt Schumacher. Oregon Demont I always confuse them. But I really thought that that was pretty clever movie as much as it probably gets ragged on because it really does like turn weather into like a monster kind of and that's what I think of when I when I hear stories like this as silly as that movie is it absolutely D- Now does a decent job of showing you like this is a force that is coming for you and it feel it cares not for your feelings or you know your stuff like it's just absolutely. Literally Force of nature and you can't stop it. That's right. We're going to continue to watch this story, watch the recovery efforts and. Let us know if you lived through this what you experienced you can you. We'll tell you how to connect to us at the end of this, but just keep that in mind we love to hear from. You love to know you're okay in just what you experienced stay safe. Yeah. Please stay safe. Quick word from our sponsor and we'll be right back. I like a bed that's really firm. I mean something a little softer than that rest easy with the sleep number three, sixty smart bet both gesture your comfort with your sleep number setting. It really helped me fall asleep faster. Yes. By gently warming your but can help keep us asleep it senses your movements automatically adjusts to keep you effortlessly comfortable sleepnumber proven quality sleep is life changing sleep. It's our biggest sale of the year. We're all beds are on sale save fifty percent on the sleep number three, sixty limited edition smart bet only for a limited time the learn go to sleepnumber DOT COM. You Dan with black hair you down with abolishing the prison industrial complex. Down with puppies who is it del with puppy? You'd be surprised. Where the comedy group Obama's other daughters and we're inviting you to come kick it with us on our podcast called you down. We're bringing you the same fun vibe we serve during our Improv, shows in La only in podcast form. Check in with us as we discussed everything going on in the culture and have the nerve to give our unexpurgated opinions to a lucky listener whether it's embarrassing hair stories or comedy fails. Might even talk about those. Listen to you now the iheartradio APP apple podcasts or wherever you get your pocket. You. All right and we're back with some more strange news fellas decay. If I go in the middle here, I'll be the the meat and the news sandwich. Yes. Not Not not not to imply the mine is more substantial than any way more median. You guys are in some way relegated to the lesser bread portions of the. Sandwich. But really, it's all y'all all the parts of the sandwich. Equal. Can we make it a meat alternative? Absolutely what do you think are you at impossible type guy? You like the beyond or or maybe a Tofu? Jewish plant I'll God I love Eggplant I actually have some eggplant in the fridge ethic. I WanNa Cook for dinner in some sort of stir fry or a stew. But my my story is not about any of that stuff. It's not about me bread or stir FRY. It's about human beings sleeping in the street and I'm not talking about homelessness I'm talking about mainly gainfully employed human beings literally falling asleep in the street specifically in Okinawa Japan and I couldn't help. But my you know the the the Lizard brain part of me the immediately looks for like sinister meaning in in in. In. Seemingly benign events really started kind of firing on all cylinders. When I saw this story the headline of the article that kind of set me on this path is from the Mainichi, which is Japan's national daily papers since nineteen, twenty two, I was not familiar with this but I found it on read it the headline is Okinawa police scramble to stop people from sleeping on road over seven thousand cases in twenty nineteen. What yeah. And again when I say sleeping on the road I, mean it folks are actually using like the curb as a pillow and it's causing some real problems. People are getting run over by taxis there. It's just really becoming a hazard and it's They even have a name for they referred to them as Rosia Bay which literally translates to sleeping on the road. And it's almost like becoming this weird kind of it's like a cultural phenomenon and and it seems to be at least somewhat. Limited to Okinawa. But that could well be just because they're the ones doing most of the reporting on it. But Okinawa Prefecture Police are according to this article likely the only kind of government body Japan that is actually keeping stats on this particular phenomenon. Yes. Florida man it's it's the floor phenomenon because there is more record keeping. Yeah. It seems like there's maybe something anomalous but one thing that startled me in Japan is it's socially acceptable to sleep. In the street more. So than the US, that's right and I found another article from several years ago that indicates just that. But this one is super interesting because you're you're right Ben about the reporting aspect of it, but they do seem pretty baffled because officials are started like why are people doing this? What they're trying to come up with like answers and one of them was well, the climate is Kinda warm here in residents are pretty chill. But also a big part of this is folks are really into drinking lot in Okinawa there's apparently a an alcoholic beverage that is super popular and super-strong that's that's native to Okinawa and it is called. Oh Maury which is in Okinawa. liqueur that's very potent and very, very popular There's there's some interesting speculation around this but it's it's a a lot of it has to do with people a seemingly being too drunk and falling asleep in the middle of the street some. Positions. And that's the thing that got me is like Whoa whoa how Dr You ever been drunk enough where you would just pass out in the middle of the street like I've definitely been my cups and I would at least find a bench early you know a an alley or something but in the street like I'm seeing these images on this article that you can find yourself, there's a human being as Lang directly in the middle of a lane of traffic I. think that's that's the big difference it looks like. Because there are a lot of people sleeping in public maybe alley or they're waiting for the trains to resume service but they're not sleeping out in the road usually you'll see like a you'll see like an office worker who's had a night out cracking several cold winds with boys and he's leaned up against the seven eleven and yeah he might be there to morning you know what I mean maybe as a spare tire in his pocket. So it looks like it went home and changed, but this seems unusual in that. These, people are in roadways instead of pedestrian areas or sidewalks. Yeah. You're right. Ben I found an article from twenty nineteen it was a really great kind of photo essay from this particular photographer who splits his time between Warsaw and Japan by the name of Oh it's a tough one. It's like a Polish last name Jazz Jazz Ook Jay Z. Ceesay UK I'm not a Powell Powell Jessica I'm GonNa go with that and he has made a you know art project I guess out of documenting these these. Sleeping on their feet salarymen oftentimes, they are sleeping on their feet. They're literally upright holding their briefcase, and there's their their heads are slumped over there either leaning against a building or like you said, a seven eleven or something or one of those little traffic like the little kind of those kind of little stone cropping things that you'll see along pedestrian walkways you know, and it's very, very different They're not sleeping in the actual roadway and I put this in our little document or we keep track of the articles. WE'RE GONNA discuss. I I wrote why are so many people falling asleep in the middle of the street in Okinawa Japan is that the warm climate too much partying or something more sinister. I have no evidence that something more sinister but does not seem like the beginning of like a Stephen King story or like some kind of like colty. Film where all of a sudden people start falling asleep in the middle of the street and getting run over by like cars. It seems like a good setup could premise I would I would agree with you however with your proposition that there is something more sinister going on I in this is something maybe familiar to a lot of people. It's Japan's murderous working culture. We're talking for a lot of these office workers traditionally, it's sixty hours a week easy because you are not allowed to leave even if you're done for the day until you're the senior above you leaves and. You're also when you leave, you don't really leave at least. Pretty often you are required to go out like you have to go to hang out with people and go drinking or sing okay for your career, and then the thing is you don't get a breakout after that like even if your boss knows that you guys were out until two am. Use still have to be in the office at eight or whatever. Totally you still have to stay until your boss says, it's time to call it a night by going to the Karaoke a place again, it's a vicious cycle. You're absolutely right an and I think the point maybe neither one of US mentioned quite yet is the reason they ended up having to sleep in the street in this situation. Lot of times is that they've missed the last train because oftentimes folks don't live. In the city you know it could be a long commute, and if you miss that train that goes back out to the area where you live, you're stuck but you're right. It is more socially acceptable but I still really perplexed at this specifically sleeping in the middle of the road aspect of this phenomenon people putting their heads on straight curbs and actually getting killed there have been deaths associated with this and and you know all kinds of disturbances and travel matt you've been you've been a little quiet on this one I'm interested to see what your Lizard Brain does with this particular story. Yeah I'm trying to figure out. How much of this is actually people. Sleeping in the road. I was looking at the article share and it was trying to find a few more things. About it, there's not a lot of reporting on this. It's specifically out of Okinawa seems like an ESA one other. Little Blurb on not particularly reputable looking sites. So I don't know I'm interested to know what you found. Yeah. I I really haven't found much else referring to the act of sleeping in the road the. I guess they're calling it Rosana here Just have to agree. I agree with you guys at the biggest issue here is the work life that is meant to be maintained not just in Okinawa of terror I. Mean It's Intense there. Right. But that kind of pressure for working people I would say exists across the planet where you feel that need to both impress your. Higher ups to be seen. To be there for functions right now, it's perhaps a little lessened. Because we don't have to be physically in a lot of places if especially if your superiors whoever they are aware. Of World, events endangers to your health in their health. But It is a real situation. We're work life balances. A is a tough thing to to keep and one thing I think that compounds it is like when I originally mentioned having to sleep in the streets because of the train cutoff which I believe is at one am a it's at least in the US in major cities it's relatively inexpensive to get a ride home from an uber or something like that. But in Japan, the taxis are are going to be more expensive Now I I'm not. I get an hoover I'm not familiar with how it works how the Uber The lift works in. Japan whether it's as big witness as it is in large cities here. But yeah, it's you can be Sol and it's a very debilitating. Lifestyle over time I would say like especially and you know what's brilliant about your appointment and terrifying about your point is that it's absolutely correct and this pattern is growing you can you know you can associated with capitalism and demonized that if you want but the fact of the matter is that in many many places, a world people are working much more for less and less and less like go back look at the. Look at the increase in minimum wage from you know a five year period and then look at the increase in rent and then look at the increase in. Expected off work duties that are still worked for many many people I don't know man I would. It makes me think of all the all the people we've seen arguing recently for like four hour era. Sorry a four day workweek four, our yeah. No it's true and just just a little bit of perspective. Japan has a population of around one hundred and twenty, six, million as of two, thousand, eighteen and Okinawa is just a little over one. And we only have about seven thousand of these cases reported. So it's not like some sort of epidemic not a abuse at term during an actual pandemic but yes, I thought it was interesting. It did made me I don't know it. Made me give it a second look. So I thought I thought I'd bring out for today I don't really have much else to add, but I'm interested to see if. If anything else comes with this these numbers start to go up or taper offer I. Don't know. I'm also interested to all your points about the workweek how quarantine has effected that culture. In Japan, you know like our people working from home in Japan as much as we are here are people expected to return back to the office because of that? Very. Militaristic attitude towards you know office life in that absolutely non-existent work life balance in any I don't know that we have a whole lot of listeners. But if anyone spent time, there has family there Let us know I I'd I'd be very interested to to know Ben have you seen anything about how they're dealing with this aspect of quarantine. Yes so Japan Lake many many other countries. Did realistically fantastic job addressing the spread of covid nineteen, and because of the again you know we're outsiders to this culture. We've seen it. We've read about it, but we are not Japanese more of as far as I know any of us live there for an extended time but you'll see a lot of reporting especially around June maybe April about how the pandemic. Actually. Provided this fundamental shift in Japanese work culture. Specifically, I'm thinking of the reports that say more than sixty percent of Japanese workers who worked from home during COVID. Now say they want to keep doing that after the pandemic has passed and honestly there are probably a lot of people in Europe in other parts of Asia in north and south. America? Who thought the same thing you know what I mean like just imagine all the time you're saving on a commute if you work from home. I can picture I. I. You know here the last thing I just want to say guys. I. Am going back to your thoughts on whether this was. Something creepy happening something bigger play I'm imagining the cortisone fungus. And the way it acts on ants and how this could be for humans in what if There was some kind of fungal infection that was occurring. I, don't believe this. But what if there was some kind of fungus that was affecting humans that was causing us all to go out into the streets and lay down and go to sleep because he would spread more fungus via automobile right? Just splattering Yeah Oh. Gosh. Okay. You know what's funny. Made me think of this film Suicide Club I don't know if you guys are seen this, but it's about this a spate of very inexplicable suicides in Japan or Japanese or Korean film. Now that I'm thinking about it like schoolgirls jumping in front of subway trains and things like that like holding hands like. The creep level this made me think of I have one thing You know he keeps saying we're going to move on but I've one thing here that this reminded me of my first question was actually going to be a I assumed it would be the dangerous were culture and the traditional expectations. But my first question was going to be about the age of the people who are found asleep in the road because Okinawa has a very, very rare distinction. It's one of the few places in the world known as what's called a blues zone a blue zone in you can read some great articles or videos about this from how stuff works DOT COM Remember if I make video on this one, but a balloon anyway is a place in the world where people have a much much higher chance of becoming centenarians and retaining their mental and physical health people tend to live longer in blue zones for a number of reasons that are pretty well understood, but maybe not fully explained. So I was wondering I remembered when you set this, remember the Okinawa is one of those rare blue zones and I was thinking. Are The people falling asleep because they're overworked and maybe over served earthy falling asleep because ghetto. They're in their hundreds but looking at the photos you're showing you're showing here. No, it looks like these are mostly middle aged maybe younger people would you say? Yeah it seems like mainly there's I've seen a few folks who looked maybe a little bit older but not not not to that degree and There's an interesting stat here. Basically, all this is led to is This kind of you know discussion about how do we prevent this phenomenon but also a pretty reasonable fine fifty, thousand yen, which is around. Four hundred and seventy dollars and I mean there's a ton of these pictures on instagram. There's videos There have been examples of women taking off their clothes and the article can know sort of speculates that they think they're home. They think they've gotten home So it does appear that alcohol is a big part of this but absolutely bend I mean this crushing work situation really is has to be the culprit but I don't know let's keep an eye on this one and there you have it. No. I think you made a great call to action for everyone in Japan who is listening to the show. We do have a few of our fellow listeners located there. Let us. Know you know because we're half a world away. So it can sometimes be tough to tell whether this is a new phenomenon or whether it's a new report on an existing phenomenon, you know what I mean. And with that, we're going to pause we're going to return to the US in our next segment. But maybe not away you were expecting what are we talking about? We'll tell you if everyone is still awake after this. Break. What if you could learn from one hundred of the world's most inspiring women now, you can introducing Senecas one hundred women to hear a new podcast brought to you by Seneca, women and iheartradio. I'm Kim as a rally in celebration of the hundredth anniversary of American women getting the vote where bringing you the voices of a hundred groundbreaking and history-making women listen to Seneca's one hundred women to here on the iheartradio APP apple podcasts wherever you get your podcasts. It was may nineteenth nineteen eighty-three in Springfield. Ohio. In the middle of an otherwise peaceful cool spring night a car arrived at Mackenzie will hospital diane downs and her three children had been shot. Cheryl seven was dead and Danny three and Christie eight life threatening injuries a year later. Diane herself was found guilty for the shootings. In the eighties, this was a shocking headline story of fatal attraction. Authorities believed Diane's infatuation with a married man who said he had no interest in being a father to anyone's children was the possible motive behind her shooting her three kids one year later at her trial she was pregnant. That child was Becky Babcock for years, Becky has tried to come to terms with who were mother is but one mystery has haunted her Who is her biological father? She's what I call Jackpot match. Did you find Becky's biological father join me as we search for the answer and explore Becky's mother's passed on this season of happy face presents to face listen on the iheartradio APP apple podcasts or wherever you find your favorite shows. We have returned. This is a story about hidden history. I'm very excited about this I. Want to see what you guys think. We all remember the famous lost colony of Roanoke, right? It's it's conspiracy lore. It's a it's not quite the top tier stuff like JFK or Roswell or bigfoot. Close Yeah, I would say it's pretty well no, you know even outside of the US. So here is the quick and dirty Lau going too deep into it. I'm sure we've done some sort of episode touched on this in the past whether it was on video or audio but this is one of North America's oldest unsolved mysteries in August fifteen, eighty, seven, a group of a little more than a hundred settlers arrived on roanoke island. These were English settlers they were off the coast of what is today known as North Carolina. They were having a tough time. They were not prepared for the hardship in this was a new land and they quickly. Quickly learned the hard way that this would be a difficult existence. Later in the year, still in fifteen, eighty, seven, they sent John White the governor of their colony back to England to get more supplies. But as he arrived in Europe a huge war broke out between England and Spain as they see and Seinfeld get Yada. Yada every available ship has to confront the Spanish Armada. John White Long Story Short doesn't get back to roanoke until fifteen ninety. He's left his wife and his daughter, their infant granddaughter. She finds no trace according to the story of the colony no trace of those English settlers. Doesn't really have any clues about what happened except for one thing one word carved into a tree I. Think we all know what that word is. Right was red drum. was close close. Yeah. It was a crotone. Yes. Yes, and this this single mystery became the focus point of so many investigations ranging from serious academic endeavors to maybe stuff a little more on this insitutional. Listrik, side I, think we grew up you know hearing these various stories, allegations, some of which ended up being true. But just recently in the Virginian pilot's. Journalists Jeff Hampton spoken with an author named Scott Dawson Scott. Dawson is the creator of a book that was published just this past June called the lost colony and Hatteras islands he has. He is correlated the work of archaeologists, historians, botanist geologist, and other people who have been digging in this area for more than a decade. And according to him the mystery has been solved. He says they meaning the colonists in question were never lost instead he says it was made up and the mystery is over. He believes that all the records he's found all the artifacts the people have excavated from these various sites to digs in particular proved that the colonists ultimately. To survive, joined up with the local native American community there in the sixteenth century and his evidence is pretty solid. Some people might say that this is a a boring answer, but it's something that I think we talked about at least in speculative terms in our earlier episodes on this they they found so many things that were indicative of a mix of native American and English communities. They found parts of swords and guns in the same layer of soil as Indian pottery and arrowheads, and these are not spaced far enough away for there to be a plausible argument that they were left at different times according to Henry Right, anthropology professor at the University of Michigan and an expert on native history in a spot, the size of two parking spaces they could find as many. As ten thousand different pieces and artifacts. So so they left roanoke island with the Croton community like I said the word Croton carved there and they settled on nearby Hatteras island and the communities assimilated. This is something that you know I personally test happens a lot in the eastern seaboard early North America, and then they lived there for generations. It wasn't until more than one hundred years later, explorer named John Lawson found what he thought was a native community which was native community and he remarked that it was odd to him that members of the community had blue eyes and some even told him this is from his contemporaneous account that they had ancestors who could. Speak Out of a Book Aka Literacy fascinating is fascinating So basically, a abandoned the site is that the idea and they just kind of assimilated with these native people. Yeah Yeah. There was no sign of distress win governor white returned three years later to the site. There were no light signs of violence. There were signs of privation, right and starvation, very difficult times. But. If you look at it basically, what they did was they tried to. Indicate what happened to them by literally making a sign Croatia means we went with these people. and. You know this mystery would have been solved centuries ago by governor white himself had not a bad storm and then unrest domestic unrest pretty much mutiny on his ship prevented him from reaching that second island. So eventually he gave up and he just went back to England leaving the mystery on solved and people have been. Digging for it ever since of. So I think that we had in the past again speculated about this, but we didn't have. Full proof right and for centuries, one of the theories was that the native population had attacked the people of this colony at Roanoke island but it appears that the Croton community. Was Pretty can down with the English settlers they liked that they had guns and armor and the colony that was run by governor. Whites also welcomed the Cretans because they were much better than a another community in the area, the secret towns who had attacked and killed one of the English colonists. Sort I remember from our episode earlier this year was A. Speculation on those two tribes that were opposing I believe or they're the groups indigenous groups. Because in the past been wasn't I seem to remember and I don't know if this is correct. Something about. The. What is the group? The SECO Seco towns? Yeah. They were weren't they are at least isn't it? Thought that that group was very aggressive. And threatens were maybe a little more peaceful or even been. There they are enslaved WanNa say the Croton were enslaved by the seeker tens at some point and then the English actually helped. The Kroto INS. It's been a while but but they're the story that we. Hypothesized at the time when we made that episode, it sounds like we're pretty much finding out that it's true. Yeah. Yeah. It turns out that the historical mystery has probably been solved at least according to Dawson, but also going back to some of our previous examinations of forensic DNA research. We're we're receiving in have been receiving regular revelations that prove if you think about it. That the untold history of early North America is a history that is alive and it is in some of us today and I especially love the point that Dawson makes. When he says the mystery is solved, he seems somewhat offended he says. Quote your robbing an entire nation of people of their history by pretending Croton is a mystery on a tree. These were people that mattered a lot. And emits you think you know I mean did you guys grow up with this mystery as well? I did but I have to be completely candid. I. Absolutely. conflated it with Jamestown, in my head, it was another like you know colony misery mystery kind of situation So Yeah I. Definitely. Definitely remember Roanoke End Jamestown but just a my adult brain is kind of pushing them together which I know a lot of history out they're going to say that is inexcusable sir. That's where I am yeah, it's been. With me for a long time you always conjures images of a ghost town or you know that masks disappearance stands at least for me as the example of a mass disappearance event. And there aren't many of them. In in the history of the world where just an entire town and entire city or area or group just is gone. in. You know admittedly, it has a lot to do with the number, the number of people traveling to and from roanoke who were actually writing down. Recording history right. In some way that would be understood and kept and passed down by at least largely English speaking people who invaded. Came over to these lands But. Yeah. It's it's always been. The image is always conjured in my mind like mists somewhere there where the colony of roanoke once stood in just the remnants of some longhouses or or something or some some type of homes that were built by colonists and perhaps by indigenous peoples. And it makes it makes perfect sense to attempt to assimilate right you're a stranger in a strange land. You may not be able to grow the crops which your custom you are not familiar with the flora nor the fauna. Right? You don't know what's poisonous. There's that that's always a surprise who would who would imagine that mushroom risotto could kill you I it more than makes sense. It does not make sense to avoid those people who know what they're doing and have you know have ancestry dating back thousands of years there, and this put me in a rabbit hole that we don't have time to discuss today but I I've been reading. I've been reading more and more about DNA research into early populations of people, and this was on my mind because of a previous episode that we did very recently the one in which we explore when the human species actually reached North and South America and this you know it sounds like they're two very different stories. But they're similar in that. We still have a myth making going on and we still have. Mysteries that we insist on echoing despite the fact that we have the technological tools to solve them it's just. Humanity. Can Be very, very stubborn when the truth of something doesn't match the narrative with which we are all so comfortable. So, again, it's it's relatively rare for us to be able to do this but. Check one off the box. There is one. One strange story that has been solved and I know we just do one story a day. But I wanted to share a funny listener mail saw earlier today with you guys are not gonNa mail someone joined. Here's where it gets crazy on facebook. Send us a message and they said they're not great with puns. But they said the the the joke. Let. Enjoy it. Are you ready? Three. Conspiracy theorists walk into a bar. You can't tell me that's a coincidence. Great. I love it. Way. To wrap up that's awesome. Those are so ephemeral when you click except they disappear some glad that you lay at least grabbed a screen shot or or a mental snapshot of this some of them are really fun. And, this is our show for today everybody in the path of the red chosen the path of fire NATO's please be safe out there everybody in Okinawa especially Okinawa. Let us know what's going on or how many people are really falling asleep in roadways, and why do you think they are, and of course, if you have a theory on the disappearance of anyone from the crew of the Mary Celeste which I think is also solved by the way to the Anna Sasi tribe in late twelve hundreds or If you disagree with Scott Dawson about what happened to the colony roanoke island we want to hear from you. You can find us we're all over the Internet. It's hard not to find us at this point like I don't know if we ever told me one on air but back in the day, we had a lot of pressure internally to start pinterest which looking back. So weird do you remember that it's never too late to start a pinterest people? Even still pinterest anymore cost a valid social media platform. I still don't understand what it even is guys can someone explain to me? What exist is pin things lines of things in why There's right. Hey, can't disrespect are our PINTER's doing that I just wanted? To understand, help me understand. Are they called? Or they yes trumpeters. Let us go. Let us know also your pinterest visual board like we always say we do want to hear from you. You are the most important part of the show. where on facebook or twitter where on instagram not just as a show. But as individuals yes. As a show, we are conspiracy stuff or conspiracy stuff show. If you're instagram if you want to find Knoll, his personal instagram is oh my Gosh Matt what a throw it's at how now On on the INSTAGRAM's where I lurk and that's pretty much it I have a twitter, it's embryos. Or something like that and about early tweet have more of a lurker there and Benjamin Wollen. Yes. If you'd like to see some weird things than visit me an instagram where I am at Ben Bullen I if you are a twitter person than you can follow me on twitter at and Bolan Hsa w what about you met Frederick Oh I am busy starting my pinterest account but. We'll get back to you. Know I'm on Instagram Matt Frederick, underscore IHEART. It's the longest one you'll you'll have and there will be no posts, but you can still find it. But what happens if people hate social media? What happens for everyone who's listening to our previous episodes on social media and big data and why? Why everything is terrible? What wicked they do what if they just want to give a phone call guys you can always give us a call. Tell us about the reader's digest article. You recently read that was all about how the Internet is spying on you and your phone and your car and your Alexa, and all the other things Tell us about that Reader's digest article because I read it because I happen to drop by my folks place and they had it. and. I got to talk conspiracies with my parents and it was totally fine. Cool So tell us about that. Tell us about all the other stuff we talked about today. Give us a caller number is one, eight, three, three, S., T., DWI, k.. To leave a message, we will hear it and you may end up on one of our listener mail episodes. If you don't WanNa do that. Then guess what you can still reach us. We have an email address it is conspiracy at iheartradio Dot Com. Stuff they don't want you to know is a production of iheartradio for more podcasts from iheartradio visit the iheartradio APP apple podcasts or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. In nineteen, eighty three diane downs shot her three children killing one and severely injuring the others she showed up for her trial pregnant. Now, nearly forty years later that child Becky Babcock is on a journey to explore her connection with her mother's violent past listened to happy face present to face on the iheartradio APP apple podcasts wherever you find your favorite shows. WHAT'S UP EVERYBODY WE'RE LA comedy group Obama's other daughters, and on our podcast you down we're discussing what's going on in the culture. Everything from dating to their be look y'all got dumps. So facetime so Together tank. So Come Kiki. With US enjoying the kinds of candy conversations you only have with your girls, listen to you down on the iheartradio APP apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

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ET - Luke Spiller // Bret Michaels

The Eddie Trunk Podcast

1:26:37 hr | 1 year ago

ET - Luke Spiller // Bret Michaels

"Thank you for listening to this. podcast one production available on Apple podcasts. And podcast one thousand nine hundred eighty three Eddie trunk has been the voice for fans of rock hard rock and heavy metal of bestselling author host of. TV's that metal. Shell and seven national radio. Radio shows including trunk nation daily on Sirius. Xm Interesting Eddie. Offers the world is news making interviews passionate analysis honest commentary and who who knows what else so. Welcome to the trunk podcast. Any welcome to another episode trump podcast which is new every Thursday via podcast one dot com. And of course Apple podcast thank you for listening subscribing checking out the podcast each and every week. It is greatly appreciated as I always tell you guys this. This podcast is only a tiny tiny little sample of what I do on a daily basis on Sirius. XM Satellite Radio so if you are in the US us or Canada where you can get Sirius. Xm please join me each and every day for trunk mission which is Heard Live on volume Channel One oh six from two two to four. PM Eastern time and it replays every night ten to midnight eastern and full shows and video on demand on the SIRIUSXM APP for the cost of a couple of cups of coffee. Affi you can get a month of all sorts of entertainment including my show trunk nation on volume channel. One Oh six and here on this podcast you get a tiny tiny ninety little taste just like one interview of the many things that I do on that show each and every day of course if you're outside of the US and Canada listening you get a little sample what I do here in the US. On Radio and I appreciate your listening no matter what the case may be cope. Everybody had a great week. I of Well since I recorded ended a podcast open. It's been a little while because I've been traveling all over the place. I was in Switzerland with my family for a vacation about got a week ago and spent about four five days in Zurich. Beautiful City had a great time. Expensive won't lie. It's expensive but but it was really a a cool thing to do and I really really had a good time with the family there and then from that I went right over to Los Angeles and had the latest trunk nation L. A. Invasion and this one a holiday themed party from the Rainbow and I mean it was a WHO's who of the Los Angeles Rock Doc seen that came out to the rainbow a week ago exactly for this huge broadcast and so much fun and we stayed till the wee hours long after the radio show ended again if you have Sirius. XM and you miss that show. You can hear it on demand right now on the APP it was also shot so they'll be video up there. I cannot bring you you the La invasion shows to the podcast. So you have to make sure you listen on the radio. And that's really the only way to to hear those to become siriusxm subscribers but so much fun we had there at the rainbow and I'll be doing another one coming up in January so here we are folks and I mean what are we have a week or two left to go and twenty nineteen as we slam straight into the holidays. Now coming up I'll be here with you. Of course every Thursday for new episodes. The Eddie Trunk podcast. I will be doing my trunk nation show on volume pretty much every day. Live so you'll be able to hear me every day if you are in the. US and Canada and listen on one. Oh six won't be really taking all that much time off through the holidays and right into the new year and it'll be doing my best to get you new podcast as always do every Thursday as well and then as we peak into January a lot of stuff going on including the hall of Heavy Metal History Awards that I host every year. That's on the fifteenth in Anaheim. I'll be doing that once again. Some other stuff around the big NAMM show and then right out of that we have We have a great Crew's coming up with the latest monsters of rock cruise hosted everyone of those since it started. I'll also be broadcasting from that once again and sooner than all of that tomorrow. If you're listening to this on posted the twentieth of December will be the the annual that metal show Christmas party which is a lot of fun I- reunite with my TMS Co host on Jamieson Jim Florentine and we have a little party at a Great Club in in New Jersey. Not far from where we all live called Ding bats and Clifton and it's something we started doing God nine ten years ago and people have so much fun at this thing and all we do is show up and hang out and have some drinks with everybody and the promoter puts on some covered tribute acts. It's just a fun fun. Time time. Give away a bunch of stuff. So if you're in New Jersey we'll see you tomorrow night for the annual that metal show reunion Christmas party and I ask still about that metal show almost every day. I appreciate that who knows what twenty twenty holds. You know brand new decade. You never know what's around the corner. Keep up with everything going on on twitter. Instagram at Eddie Trunk twitter where I most active. He got any trunk dot com the official online home and of course. There is a fan page on facebook that I post on from from time to time but that's about it for my involvement on facebook but by all means Be Sure to follow on twitter for up to the second news info updates and instagram as well simply at my name at Eddie Trunk. There's going to be other stuff coming up on the west coast in January that it can announce yet. There's just a lot going on as we close out. What's been a tremendous Amandus year for me of twenty nineteen and teeing up to be another great twenty twenty and I thank you all for your tremendous support and I wish each and every one of you a very very happy holiday season wherever you are in this world let me remind you right now about Pluto? TV BECAUSE PLUTO TV is the leading being free streaming television service you can watch over one hundred. TV channels and thousands of movies on demand all completely free Pluto. TV never asked for a credit card. How rare is that? And you don't even need to sign up to watch for Free Pluto. TV is the easy and completely legal way to watch your favorite TV shows and hit movies completely free. What are you waiting for? Never pay for TV again by downloading Pluto. TV You can download Pluto TV for free on all your favorite devices today including your phone Roku Amazon Fire TV apple TV smart TVs playstation and anywhere. Else you stream so oh the interview I have for you. This week is with the lead singer from a band. I have a tremendous amount of respect for and I'm extremely extremely excited for the future for and that is Luke's pillar. Who is the lead singer of the band the struts if you've listened to me for any period of time hi you know that for me? And I'm very encouraged about this wave of rock that is coming and happening and I really hope some of it really really breaks through but to me. My two favorite bands of this wave without a doubt are the struts and rival sons neither band it is new both have been around for awhile. Struts two full lengths out rival son South like six foot lengths out but they're still not exactly household names although they built great fan followings and are good for like you know thousand two thousand people as a headliner anywhere in the world. So that's a pretty great accomplishment Schmidt right there but neither of them have become massive household names yet but of all the bands that I've seen and heard out there. Those are the two that that I have the most love for personally. and they're very different bands arrival sons much more of an organic sort of guitar bass drums ban where the streets. Let's have a lot of pop elements lot of early British glam elements in but both bands tremendous live. So Luke I was doing this You Know La invasion show last Thursday. And I hang from time to time with the guys in the streets when I'm in La when they happen to be in La because they don't don't live there. Although you're about to hear Luke is about to move there and it just turned out that I just missed them to be a part of the L. A. invasion because they were leaving l. a.. The day the last L. A. Invasion took place. So I said to Luke Air. Why don't you come in to the studio and do my show show with me? And he did and he basically did he originally told me he was going to have to leave early but he did the almost an entire to our show with me that condensed here on the podcast will come in it somewhere little over an hour fascinating guy to talk to one of the things I think we are. Sorely sorely missing is rockstars people who walk it and talk it dress. It acted and this guy checks every box and he's a tremendous amandus. Talent writer singer musician plays piano and as as an as is as flamboyant as they come if you've ever seen the way he dresses and acts and we talked about all that during this fascinating interview about where he wants to go with this band and he unabashedly says hey I want to be a Rockstar. I want to be one of the biggest bands in the world and that's really refreshing and we need that we need need that sort of bravado and that sort of confidence moving rock forward so so this was a really fascinating conversation that I think are going to enjoy. It's it's pretty long because again like did like almost the whole show with me and we had a great time. I didn't expect it to get this in detailed in this in depth now during the conversation Bret michaels calls in Brett was running around Talaih and he called in and wanted to be Wanted to plug a few things and you will hear during the conversation. Brett join us. Who is also a struts fan for like five six minutes so a little bit of Bret Michaels a lot of Luke's pillar of the struts and that's the interview on this week Eddie Trunk podcast? I enjoyed the hell a lot of this and I really love this band and I've heard some of the new things they're working on and if you like what they've done before. There's no reason why you wouldn't like what they have coming sometime in the next year here and they still have some live shows coming up towards the end of the year so keep an eye on their website. There's some stuff a couple in philly couple places so get a chance to see him by by all means be sure to do so. So that's what we have for you this week on the podcast and get ready because Luke and a cameo from Bret Michaels is right after this. The trunk podcast it so we are deep into this year's NFL season and everyone wants to know who will be coming out on top. Am I right. Well then you need to check out the one podcast. They can get you everything you need to know about the biggest. NFL Games and analysis on the postseason. Listen I'm talking about the Ross Tucker. Football podcast Ross played seven years in the NFL before retiring. See No. He's got the insider knowledge Ukraine. It sure to check out the Ross Tucker football podcast every week on podcast one apple podcast in many of your favorite podcast listening ups. This is the Eddie Trunk. podcast breath welcome back to the trunk. podcast thank you for tuning in great interview for you this week. Luke spillers lead singer of the struts with a drop by from Bret Michaels goals. That's what we have for you and we'll get into it right now on this week's Eddie Trunk podcast enjoy this guy just came in here looking fresh daisy for eleven in twenty in the morning. I'm always fresh looks pillar of the struts. Good to see you man and you may you are you doing. It's we're both standing. I now identified to sit down and interview. Jeez I said to Luke I said. Do you want to because I like to stand and then I thought about us like I'm GonNa stay into Alex's standing always we're all stay I liked the Stanford I never this console so low. I never feel like for me the board. It's just perfect waist level so for you I understand that yeah. I just had to shake my ass on my tiptoes. There's more you got more energy right a little more alert together so listen man I We've run teach unfortunately you're leaving l.. A. Tomorrow because during our big rainbow thing tomorrow otherwise I would have been that would have been all over that the last couple months. I've done it the irony was I've done it the last two months in a row and you've walked in just as we were ending and you're like what are you doing. Man What's been going on. I think you just missed the whole deal that we out here. I had no idea it was going so basically while I've been here we've been Me and Adam Guitar Player from the struts we've been working on new material and and just kind of like working up demos not tractor tractor anything and Yeah I spend the whole day in my apartment just writing lyrics also I just need to get out for a drink and the bow as I call it. The ball is kinda become my my new local so it was quite funny. I'll just I'll come down for cheeky of quite drinks and then it turned into a night. Yeah it did. It was a good time. So you you. You really don't like you still live in England I was actually moving here. You I knew that was gonNA happen. Yeah I felt that the inevitable was happening. I felt you being pulled into the city because the last few times I've asked you about that I or all the guys in the band actually because I see here all the time I said. Do you live here to know. We actually live on the road and we live actually still living in England. But you're making the move. I'm making the move. I'm of the four I am I am and you know. I guess we'll see what kind have happens but I honestly made the last three weeks of really opened up my eyes to what can be achieved when of someone has downtime. And let's be real. It's AH everything happens here and I should have done it quite a while ago but I'm also a big believer that things happen at the right time. The right reason and I agree. Recently things have just been really falling into place and I've just you know the universe is speaking to me and I'm just you know. Try Listening to it and acting upon it so I am making the move probably late January. Say did you find a place I did rent or buy. I'm just renting. I'm just reading smart. You know just to just to Just to see how it goes whatnot. Now what are the. What's the cost of living like in Los Angeles in the US versus in the UK? It depends where you live. I guess it's like it would be similar to to London. I mean it's ridiculous London London's and say I was just. I was just telling you I was just in Zurich and that's insane. Yeah that's it's really expensive expensive too but you're in England. Do you live in London. No I I you know. This is quite funny. I literally I mean. Let's let's let's just put in perspective we're doing about a hundred and thirty to fifty shows guaranteed like any year every year and the little time that we do have it could just be like a week or maybe two weeks and in that time I go visit my parents so I stay. Yeah I just say that they have the that which were in England. It's is a little. Seaside town could delicious which is in the South West and it's very fish and chip. What kind of coach down there? And there's like I have my local pub which I take. It takes me like ten minutes to walk to and but I've really enjoyed that and and having that downtime but I've also noticed every time I get off the road creatively. That's when things start to happen for me. It's like when bars writing. Yeah exactly please like when life starts to slow down I start to get reflective and then I start writing a lot more so it just kind of makes sense to me to have that reflective time time here and have of like I've. I've made a lot of great musical friends over the last three or four years since we've been so dipping in and out here Erin and an quite recently including these last three weeks. We've been working on a lot of new stuff you know even and stuff as well that's not quite Even struts related just so again together working just for the sake of it and having fun will you you sent me. If it's okay to say that you can say well you sent me as some of the stuff you're working on to listen to. Yes yes he sent me a buzz like nine ten tracks demos that were really I got back to. You really really cool. And what blew me away about him was when you told me I was going to send me some stuff. I was just like you said. Oh they're just work demos man that just look. I've been in this business us forever. I know what demos sound like and what demos are versus what versus what the final product. But Dude you're demos are pretty fully realized like I'm used to demos like okay. There's no there's no verse here. There's no chorus yet. There's Qatar missing here. I wouldn't send you that I again. I've heard that I understand what that is too. Yeah Yeah but these are like to me. These are of the the what the realization in the quality achieve. These demos are pretty much almost there. Well I mean I think that has to do with the tracks I sent you a ones. I'm kind of just living with at the moment What they will become is is it completely different question but we actually recorded a majority of the stuff I sent you at six? Oh six with of At the FOO fighters studio six or six is Dave's stood. Yes yes so we. We did like six six songs in three days on we just sort of like cut them live and when bang so that when I mean like demos kind of rough and ready than you know right and I'm not quite sure like what to do some of them I know two of them a really really great But like I said like we've also been here and there's this stuff which is still brewing which I'll definitely send you once. Once I start against good things back was GROHL involved in the recording or in any aspect effect of the songs that you did at his place he. He walked in covered in like barbecue. He's the grill master. He is yeah he he. He wasn't involved creatively heat. I think he just wanted to see what the hell we were up to. And we will just working on these tracks because there's a beautiful big live remain and they and they actually built it based on on them. Abbas studio way so. This isn't like a few years ago. He made a foo fighters recognise kept telling people in his garage which of course was probably bigger than most people's houses. This isn't that he actually build a separate facility. Yeah and it's the old nieve of desk as well from Sound Sissy. Okay which is also great. We're recording sitting on it in every now and then and the engine is literally going to bash it too. So you're not doing it. All on tape are none but they do have tape that I I've heard that a a lot of On the previous foods records they would They would do takes. And then bounced that tape and then build on top a couple records ago foo fighters record. I forget get which I forget which title but to to records ago they recorded analog on tape And they put about an inch of the actual tape. Hey in every CD really in the sleeve. Yeah there's the actual tapei cut sections and put a little piece in all the CB's yes you get them all together and then you can play. It's so so you so you an atom had been here because you have very little time with the schedule touring all over over the world to to work on music. And what's interesting that you said to me. Is that a lot of artist telling me. Hey we I do I do all my writing and all my creative creative on the road. Because there's the other twenty two hours of the day to occupy yourself and I go on the back of the bus or in the lounge and I just sit down and whatever you're telling only you need away from all that stuff to get creative really depends. I mean you know unlike other bands like I think my days is filled with with things. That are quite singular to me. You know whether it's like I mean I start getting ready like four hours before the show you know I mean the closer. We'll be right in the makeup saga putting on and make sure everything looks great and I start like running around like forty five minutes before the show and then before that will probably have press will. We'll go in and visit radio stations and stuff like that. Meet and greets sound checks I guess creatively sound checks. We've been working on stuff. There's a few things in rift switch. We've applied to these new ideas which we really saw worked out in jammed as a group which was quite interesting but I I tend to do. It's either for me either off to the show when I'm sat back and showers and I've said hello to the fans and whatnot and I'm just having a cigarette and and everything's kind of calming and then I'll start doing stuff but the majority of the time I I. I have to kind of be off the road too for the for the juices to flow In that process is you atom basically getting together is that where is is that where it starts. It really depends. It's is you know what's really been changing. It's like for the for big majority of the time it was me a an atom getting together exchanging ideas and then we would go in to a stooge wherever we were in the world with a shoe so engineer and then we start feeding back from them as well and so of building things up from the ground. Nothing to premeditate it but this year we've we've we've been so of working on like some of those tracks I sent to you It would start with me in ads and then we got together his agreement and kind of I know this sounds silly but We're not the kind of group who who is who has ever had the time or the luxury to really get into a room and do so pre-production where we actually jamming working the songs Out like a as a group we always tend to lay down the song and then the tracking gets done off that so. That's kind of change but I guess more recently in like in these so in the months that we've been here like lyrically in in in terms of like subject matter. I've always so of like I've always been very cautious. Not Cautious but I haven't been inspired about myself or like anything that I'm particularly going through I. I've always wanted to it. Be someone who can supply like escapism. And I've always enjoyed building characters up in my head and of like having alter-egos and and all this kind of stuff and like like Prima Dona like me and roll up and all these kind of tracks. But I don't know for the first time I've actually been setting sitting sitting down and writing things which I'm actually going through and things like from the haw. Yeah I mean I mean but it's it's it's nice it's upbeat in his personal and there's been a lot of personal so of light changes that have happened to me in the loss of light. Seven or eight months which you know I felt for the first time that I can actually really express it but find that difficult to do to expose outside of you I did. I did assuming you're talking about family. Relationships personal relationships Egypt's whatever is more more like relationships and stuff like that whether it's in a meeting someone new will you know so like getting never things have happened in the past and whatnot but I mean on the whole is quite good. I think the collection attracts that we. We've been working on recently really joyous and upbeat and are about love and and And positively so. It's it's been great. Let me ask you this this ties in all this. There's so much I wanNA talk to you about but and how how are you okay. You're two albums in too deep babies. You you dilatory you build this thing. I mean I mean the the struts went from in Oh i remember God you guys played a Little Club in Jersey in hoboken storm. Will you then. I wanted wanted to go because I was a fan of the band. Then as well where there was two hundred something people that yeah I was crazy. First Time I saw you was a few years ago at the when Craig gas called me to come to see you in New Orleans you played house of Blues while Voodoo was going on that Voodoo with foo fighters. I remember that is to see you guys. At how suppose that was the first time I saw you guys play live but my point is it's building there's radio there's TV commercials dodge commercial dancing in the streets and you're becoming a known person now in terms news of the face of the band. Let's be honest and and and everything it's gone. How are you dealing with that? Because I'M I. I love that this is happening for you but you know that music history is filled with stories of people that handle that all very well and as fame comes in and here you are are getting ready to move to. La like all the traps Haiku. Are you worried like we WANNA make sure Luke doesn't go off the rails like are you good good keeping yourself balanced when you need to or you worried. Are you standing here now. Telling you are worried that you could be a train wreck in six months. It's a beautiful train wreck it would be. I mean I love it I love it. It's here here's what I'm GONNA do. I'M GONNA get further on this with you okay. We need people like you in rock music so I'm not being critical at all right. I'm I'm being the opposite. I think we need people like Luke's Biller. I think what what the world is missing right now in rock music and beyond the great songs distraught have and beyond that much. I love your band to me. I'm just being honest. You you are the great intangible as I see it and I'm going to put extra pressure on you. But among the rock landscape like I'm very encouraged about where things are going with rock. I think you have a million great bands But we have very few personalities people that walk it and talk it And that can be dangerous thing because people people can look at you and say oh. He's full of himself scenario. Dick look at how he acts. Whatever so it's a fine line between that and no this guy's nose you you know he's done a little bravado and we need some fucking rockstars last so I think you're you're walking that line brilliantly and I think you're exactly what we need right now but I'm wondering if you're processing all of that? How much of that is calculated or just? Your Natural Personality is what I've always wanted and the thing is I'm not ashamed to say I I want I want it all and I want to be the biggest and I want to be the best. It's like we got a great festivals. Come in this year and I love the festivals. I suppose because it's like competitive is I find it C- you artists will will admit that. I don't get shit right now. I'm glad you did because it. It's always been competitive tells you it's not is bullshitting whoever says they don't want to be the biggest and the best talking out there right or you know they. Should you just go home. And an jumper some in life. But when we like for the festivals for instance when I walk in there especially on stage is great. Like whether it's whether it's two o'clock in the afternoon or we slot like as the Sun's going down it's all a massive statement for me. It's like yeah I I love the performing performing aspect by more so headed. Show people how it's done and I'm also here to show people what we can do in because that's the only thing I've really got You know it's it's the only thing from the like was he did instilled in you or is it stuff you saw coming up because when I saw you live for that first time and I walked in and I was just like. She's this guy is controlling this whole crowd like this. There's nobody that's doing this right now beyond the song. If you didn't have the songs I wouldn't give a shit honestly to me. It's always about the songs the songs aren't there who gives a fuck. Yeah but when you've got the songs and what you're doing up there her command of the audience and your ability to sing and play everything so great. It's the total package. It's all the check. Your checking all the boxes but where does it come from. Is it a lot of rehearsal and work at it and looking at other bands and putting it all together or is it just instilled in you. I think it's I think it's an instilled in me from come from my idols. I think if if for every behind old at the people that I I I've looked up to admired. I think we've all had the same mentality. It's like even when those people obviously Freddie obviously but even when I was younger Michael Jackson James Brown. I mean Michael Jackson for instance you that guy was constantly projecting to be the biggest and the best and he worked extremely hard to do say James Brown as well like you know cooling himself. The Godfather old father is Sullen. And you know again. One of the greatest showman that evidently Roth yes again. Bon Scott Angus Angus young anger. Among you know I always thought that Angus is is more of the frontman Steven Tyler. It yet again. You know it's it's even even people like Robert Plant that that guy wasn't stood that so of Singing hot out the way that he was an had that so of light presence about him because he was as he was about the music I mean he he wanted to to give a show and and create some sort of atmosphere. So I it's it's just been it's just the way that I've always thought is is the way to do it. It's as simple as that ever since I was fifteen and I did my first show in a tiny tiny tiny little club cooled the Croft in Bristol. And I've made my own outfit. I got this this sweater or jumpers we could in the UK and and I got a sewing machine and night created these bat wings and put like studs on the back of it. I used to cool myself as Phoenix at that point when that was like that was my persona. Yeah and it was a great name by the way I do that as your alias on the road. Yeah that'd be my hotel. You're doing the normal domes of the world and a couple of years. Yeah how can we get two luke. spillers name US ACE PHOENIX. If you're looking you going to be the The stress do one of those Underplay shows like you're an arena at that point but you're going to the city of the night before and do like the tiny little club. Yeah Yeah Bill Yourself. This ace. Phoenix Phoenix the awesome. Hey hold your thought right there because I gotta take a break. We'll come back with more. He's the Eddie Trunk podcast gas. Let's get back to more or my conversation with Luke's pillar of the struts and a cameo from Bret Michaels on this week's Eddie Trunk Podcast Luke spillers in the studio with me and Bret michaels will be joining me. Live coming up at three fifteen eastern twelve fifteen pacific but continuing with Luke all right. So let's get to do the the idea. GimMe some idea or the struts fans if you will of musically where you WanNa go with this this yet uncompleted third record musically where I wanna go to me. The thing about you know. We talked about some of your influences as a performer. And all that. But the struts walk walk a lot of lions musically you really do I mean you have elements of a lot of different things and you see that when people go to struck shows. I've seen people in medal title shirts. I've seen people into pop bands like you're you're checking a lot of boxes there too. So where do you wanna go with the bed. I I want to continue. You have to have the freedom to to do what I want and what we want is a group I I I I mean of course like live. I consider us a rock rock band. It's a rock show. It's it's really in your face it's GonNa blow your is off large crowd participation etc but musically when it comes to creative creative I I want to do what feels good. It's like if I want to do something which is slightly more minimalistic or something. which is ridiculously city bombastic I don't want the struts to ever be boxed in or create a ceiling over our heads you know because for me sky's the limit and we can do anything that we one and I think we're we're dynamic enough like a lot of my favorite bands where we can dip into like these different genres and And make the most of it as long as the songs agree. I don't care you know we could do something which was like Marvin Gaye. or or like Lenny Kravitz example As long as it's is great and as long as I believe in it then that's all that matters but with this new material at an ACCAN- account reveal too much. At the moment I will. Everyone will just have to wait and see is definitely going to surprise some people. There are some things in that people are going to be like. Whoa like did not expect that I can guarantee you that you you know I on on the last record you guys? What are the things I really love? That was I thought a little different for you and was just almost reminded me of something like Jim. Steinman remember almost do was fire or two parts to different parts but that to me was so so kinda grand and epic. Uh well still being. What is it to four minute songs if you put them together so that that was a kind of a cool sort of thing and then You you know there's like funky stuff and there's more straight up rock stuff so that is always going to be the mix of what you WanNa do definitely. I don't think I mean Gordon is what will will happen in the future. But for instance like right now Me and not even so of concentrating on on stuff which is simple and hooky cookie and really trying to ask ourselves like okay. How do we take this Glam thing and put it into twenty twenty twenty and make it something which is unique which does so of light look the past but yet so of accelerates itself into a new year and create something exciting because the the the big arrangement stuff kind of really comes natural? Like I'm. I'm a huge huge Jim Simon Fan. Oh You oh you what is on mark with that. Oh absolutely he is my hero. He's probably one of my biggest music from that Outta hell or I mean I'm a big fan of Bad for good the the solo album that he that he when him and Meatloaf fell out which was meant to be the follow up to Which I think is an incredible album is voices completely terrible on it but I love it I love it I love it to death and I mean I've been working on a musical for like seven years? I can rock musical which is very Tim Steinman and have you ever met him. No I'm never been I think food pieces I think I would evaporate if I've met him. You know that he was supposed to produce DEF leppard hysteria I know and they started and the boarded the whole thing. Yeah Yeah. I'm so glad we met Lang Monday. Upcoming goes but I would have been but it would've they're still like for amongst leopard fans that sort of like well if and if you talk to Joe he's like it ain't nothing you would wanNA. Yeah Yeah yeah he also did an. I'm wearing this guy shirt I love. Billy Squire yeah he did. He did Billy Squire and one of my life. One one of my favorite like everything's like all the spotify stuff and everything and the other streaming sites like you know it's telling you what songs you've been listening a to like them. I just saw that. Everybody on social media's pumping page or whatever. I mean it's quite interesting. I don't do spotify so I don't know but I've seen that like everywhere in the last week. Everybody's like here's my report. I so I was looking at mine and I and I listened to s apply which is that was that you're number one. It was like number two making nothing. Oh which is written by Jim Steinman and I I discovered it. My monitor engineer told me by because we're big league meet like fans and you know he's a he's a room Museo and we exchanged a music together and he was. He was GonNa hit this song and I was like I never heard it before fool because they were huge bond here as far as I'm away meatloaf no S. suppliers around. Yes with that with that song and I listened to it and I was like this. This is you know there's there's tracks it like you just listen to. And you're like plotting total eclipse of the hardware. Is this been like all my life and so like I found this playlist And it was literally everything that Jim Steinman is ever touched ever written produced in everything. I just I just exhaust. I literally lived in in that playlist. Did you like it all pretty much. I'd say like a solid seventy five percent of it I did I did enjoy. But he's he's a hero man and making love. I'm nothing always. Just it's just I love his titles I love is play on words and I love the innuendoes as an and I love. How Brash is this? Just I'd say if anything the world needs a little bit more of that and it's funny like I I have this thing thing where I'm where I really love Sir. Nice and other people like. Yeah but you know. That's their joke. And Cou I mean like like the meat loaf see. I don't believe I don't believe in guilty. Pleasures hate that like why is it makes you happy. I've never given a shit about what people think of my musical physical tastes like. It's what I like. Fuck you if you don't like it like I've thought that since high school man and it makes me nuts when people sort of try to judge you for what you are into or not into. It's a personal thing. I don't believe in guilty pleasure matter. You should never feel guilty about anything that gives you pleasure. You WanNa rock air supply. Luke's pillar you go fucking August twenty times in a row see future future leader of Rock Music Ladies and gentlemen the Guy us to save. The scene is number two. What was number one number one was sixty thousand minutes worth of badlands? By Bruce Springsteen. I've listened to twelve governments that song to set one song. Sixty thousand minutes. Can you believe that why that Song I don't know it's his money. He had other good song. I the trust me man. I'm on my own. I literally I have this way thing. I'm obsessive obsessive. Mind I and I I have to know every single thing to do with that specific song and that track is one of those songs that what's happening in the world. How I'm feeling feeling like how hung over? I am tired or just fed up a literally put on A. I'm just I'm just ready to ready to eat the day off again. Wow every that that amazing all right we got this. This is we have some revealing going on here. Steinman stuff is so fi matic. It's like it's it's crazy and and you said that Total eclipse of the heart was written for Meatloaf too which I didn't realize yeah. Yeah that I mean wouldn't surprise is me. I mean there's so there's there's like a there's a there's an album coup bad for good which was meant to be the following. I know yeah. And then they fell out. Jim Found upon himself to try and do everything and sing. And it's it's a beautiful disaster album. It's like it's one of those albums where I I heard it and I was like. Oh my God this is kind of like a borderline horrific and then it's it's like I fell in love with their. I can't listen to The other versions of those specific songs like there was a track on that which Barbra streisand did meatloaf ended up doing bad for good on With Brian Ama and Jim and then there was loads of people. Loads of people sort of like took songs from this specific album made them their own and rework them but it's his vote is his these ones that I enjoy the most because because he wrote them despite the voice not being you can have feel the ocean. It's just bizarre. You know you know what's interesting about MEATLOAF and then we'll move off of this. Trust me out bret. Michaels is going to call in at some point in this hour. He sent me a long text and he's running all over L. A. But he will call it some point and we'll just pop them on when he does and we'll do something more with him in the tour whenever his schedules loose a little more loose but anyway the whole meatloaf the thing is crazy because and I didn't realize this a good friend of mine has been meets like right hand guy as producer writer. Everything for probably the last fifteen fifteen twenty years Paul Crook. I did not know that Meatloaf in America Bat Outta Hell is massive. You've not sold ten million back in black thriller everything and then. That's really it for Meatloaf in this country country except for I would do anything for love which came way later but one song from that which was the sequel to Bat to but in but in England meatloaf actually has like is my palm is way bigger making you K- in Europe. Replace you know my point is in England they know records beyond that Outta Hell. Yeah Yeah here in America they really don't maybe a song or two but it's all Bat Outta Hell it's one record here right we're in the UK it's like Meatloaf's like Oh we five six seven records. You know why that is no that's me. I'm solely responsible for that but that's Snyman didn't do all that other stuff though I mean are you a meatloaf fan beyond Simon's a controversial question for me. It's like I don't know Yukon kind of have one without the other. If that makes any sense there are. There are songs that the I know. meet his done without him. which which I still you know thoroughly enjoy like The one he did show was that was that done with Jim. I don't know I don't know I'm not sure. What was your first concert? My first concert. Oh my God it really depends depends because I grew up going to church so my first taste of live music was my dad lead in the worship playing his guitar and sing in Church Approach. I had to it was. Were you in the choir and all that and then and then it was more like Jesus lives you in that kind of stuff. So if I wasn't singing I I'd be stood next to my mother obviously and if I didn't she just sort of like glare at me and it was very much Keeping up appearances appearances in. If I wasn't it wasn't in the church where people discovered you as a singer. No no but it wasn't it wasn't I remember I'm am I used to sing. But it wasn't like ironically from the heart and I was doing it because I kind of had to and and so please my my my my my Daham who would have been really embarrassed if I didn't sing But my first concert I never actually made it. I never made my I show. I is set to go see electric six tremor that Ben know what electric electric six from Detroit probably has one of the greatest rock albums entitled fire. Electric six electric's ever heard of in my life. Danger Danger why I voted with Jack White. I don't I don't it. Should Jack White Band giant quite sang duet with them on their debut album and they had some Gabe are they were huge in they. They just broke out in no way in like. When did the record comes to three? I is phenomenal. Got A search out. I'd never I've never heard of it really. That was GONNA be your first show. That was going to be my first show and I was. I was sixteen and we had this amazing idea of it was like it was November in January in the UK. It was freezing cold and I was wearing a cape of course with my chest out and that was it because he would all of their songs are are about. You know sort of like nuclear wars on the dance floor and you know all this kind of stuff so I was just kind of like going along with the same and we pre games aimed as you call it over here. Show Sal tailgate whatever anyway. We bought huge big Butler Volcker and I. It was safe to say that on on an empty stomach after spending my lunch money to put together towards this this horrifically cheap Lee revulsion. I drank the most of it. And then I I got brought to the queue and then on the line as we would call it. Oh the line yet and I was out there and then I sparked a joint and then that was it. It was game Ovalles then collapsed optionality way and then was was throwing up and then the ambulance came and always up. Yeah and then I had I. I ended up getting my stomach like pumped and then 'cause I almost died hypothermia. It was like my friends was so shit scared. They waited like two hours to cool the ambulance ambulance. Because I I couldn't move standard procedure in England like they'll just pump your stomach and then back out you go but yeah they have like all. The pubs are going on. I'll just bring them in and just carry on that's how we on the UK but it was. It was so much to drink will puppy out in Philly up again. No problem and you go. Yeah it was safe to say it was an an all our that was i. Don't remember anything and then I woke up in hospital and my dad was was sat next. How old are you you at this? Point Fifteen. Wow So. It's really young to be that yeah to be that. Yeah and and the first thing I said is I saw my dad in house I did. I Miss Electric. I know even Joe Kidd. I'm not even joking. And despite everything and my friend took a picture CIA of me like who hooked up and why it up and like completely just gone and it said it said leaks pillar ethanol oh poisoning plus plus plus plus or something like that. You weren't as Phoenix yet. No bought my friend was like my friend. Who was the drama in my? Oh banned the ambulance came and they were like what's his name. What's his name is like his name's Luke blue in the state? He probably will respond to the ACE. Phoenix makes you have so. She was like ace. Ace I need you to get up and apparently I go up and I grabbed a boob accidentally. It was it was Yeah she was. She was a female now ambulance worker. And then yeah. They threw me into the ambulance. And I was so cold that They couldn't find any vein so they ripped all of my clothes off which wasn't a lot it was just this huge Disco Cape and they took down my trousers pants as you say around here and then and then yeah they just have like Blue through this like they took this funnel and blue air everywhere and then jabbed like these needles into me to Kinda like get me to to wake up and what not but it was it was it was good. Yeah but that would have been. My show was the first show. You were conscious where Luke That was that was the year. Oh you're kidding I before I did get to see them actually at one point and the electric six the following year and I joined them onstage and was doing press stops and then I then we I met them. We will throwing the singer. Dick Valentine and the ad but might I trump show after that would have been to see the darkness when they headline reading and Leeds Festival. I think it was two thousand and three so it would have been the year after that Why do you think the darkness hasn't been bigger in America? Are they big in England. I had just in on in and Rufus was in as well on the show and I talked to him a little bit about this that I think that in America. There's almost a feeling feeling that there are a bit of a novelty band right which they really aren't. No you know it's not like it's steel panther or something where it's a a spoof. Yeah they they really are but I think because as of the only thing they came close to really hit here was thing called love And I think because of the video and how you know wacky. They weren't it. People almost thought of them as like not serious. I I think it was. It was the same in the UK. But but I do you know what I think when when you back it's like any group There's there's a level of momentum that sort of Im- from what I can gather. That happens a very few times in in any all his career and I think it's like extremely important that that that group will that is has to capitalize on that and go all the way I don't exactly know do a huge amount of detail to comment on Y. You know that Bandon particular isn't bigger which they should be over here. They have their fans. But it's just they can't can't seem to get over that Hump here. I think I think maybe it's the it's the same with the waste as well like you know they. They were Gods Stadium Act in England England in the UK and then they came over here work in the debut. Album definitely May Yeah definitely maybe. And then it's like America. You need a completely different work ethic. It's like an it's becomes a shock to a lot of groups in the UK. And to be honest I can see y e either. If you don't break America it might break you banned Especially for a group like away Cecil the darkness. Weve The country in which they help from his of like embraced them with open arms. And then all this success is thrown at them. And then you you you go across the pond and all all of a sudden you're thrown into this place which let's be real is is fucking huge. Well I was just GonNa say is the biggest obstacle the size. It's massive is like nothing thing out on planet earth right right in terms of a market because it's got countries within itself and that's what it feels like anyway within the states. So you know. Are you sort of like by the time I think band get that there is a exhausted uninspired disenchanted all you know and that that is. That's tough to go from having so much praised to pretty much having to turn a new one and start again is a big challenge for law bans and I do feel extremely lucky that we we've been quite the opposite. It's like who's going to say that. Yeah we've talked about this before but you but America embraced the struts long before England did now it's come around for you in England in a big way. Yeah I saw you. Guys play that show in In Pennsylvania any I saw you do in in Allentown or Bethlehem Pennsylvania when it was the last record and you even said on stage but you you were just. Hey this is our home. You know you guys got us first and you were you pretty at the expense of that Youtube video getting back into England and you were you pretty much. You know almost took a little bit of a shot at your home country although it didn't hurt you because shortly after that why no it was a big deal that Dave Grohl made that comment saying that the structure the Best Opening Act The foo fighters ever had and that really changed the tide for you in England right I I mean yes and I know. It's like an an and to be honest. If I was to make of like any criticism whatsoever it would never be about the people attending the shows. It's it's I mean I used to do a lot. God I was so bitter I got right. That's what I saw on stage. Fuck came plays great in America. Yeah it's true. They do love that. And yes there was a part of me which did play upon that. But it's even to this day the UK never played any of our musical on the radio or any major radio station and every single single that we've presented that we presented in the US. This has been like completely denied straightaway. Even after even after Dave Grohl said what he said. Even that radio station wouldn't play the music really. Yeah it really doesn't I don't change. It has changed because I know you. You've gotten great reviews. I read the British rock magazines scenes Whether it be classic rocker. Whatever Prima Donnas on their number one playlist? And you've you went you play download right and it's definitely changed. But do you think some of the sort of backlash if there is such a thing for the struts in England is because Joe Elliott told me this many the times when deaf leopards first record came out the lead single on it was a song called Hello America yeah and that pissed off. The Brits like you can't believe because they looked at it is DEF leppard. Our boys are British boys. Just reaching for the grail of America so out of the box and what I never knew until Joe told me was that in America. DEF leppard broke enormously pyromaniac But he said that we're here. In America Leopard would play an headline arenas and sold ten million copies of pyro. Mania key would go home. I'm to England and no one in the street would stop them for like to go get a loaf of bread. It didn't happen there till hysteria which I never knew which I found amazing but they they had to keep. It took them three or four albums to punch through because there was this biased that they were a British band catering to America. Do you think that happened here. Your band no no I we. We released the debut album the same one that we released here. Pretty much This everybody wants. Let's came out. Everybody wants came out two years before he released it here. Same tracks same much. It was like there was about three or four honestly. I think I've done something I think I've fucked someone's wife or something the talk I and someone has a grudge against me i England in the UK. I must I must have done something wrong. Like the ticket speak for themselves. It's like the marketplace is pretty much on par with like what we're doing here in terms of The people that are coming the attendance and whatnot. So you know I've been you're seeing. The draw is fine in England. Or absolutely. But you're not getting radio support in tonight. Nothing from the two records nothing not on the major platforms like BBC Radio One to you would not say I've definitely been a bad boy to someone to show. You really believe that I I. It's the only other option left. You know maybe maybe my yeah more so of like promiscuous years. I definitely done something wrong. Maybe not done it. Good enough in we got to get to the bottom of the ACE Phoenix did this. And we don't wait a minute on East Phoenix. Maybe it was the ambulance worker who I indirectly accidentally sexually harassed that night. Maybe she's now the head of the metoo moment at fifteen. I'm not saying it's Kinda now. What are you draw in England when the struts play I mean like we we're doing like anywhere between fifteen hundred to two thousand thousand and when we when we do we we played we played the UK twice this year? We decided to everything twice just because we could so in sort of like the markets like London Manchester and God leads was fantastic. It's averaging between fifteen hundred to two thousand and five hundred a night. What what what? You're probably about the same average trial here in America for us. A headline right. Yeah I mean we've I mean it's it's America's there's always one step ahead like. We did this team which was fantastic. And then the next day you played in Pennsylvania didn't come to that show a parking making lot of a casino or I mean that's the view but it's I mean seventeen was great. I got to ride Harley Davidson out on stage agent and that was sold out I was like all Rob Alfred on that one. I know mine like literally that was the the weirdest thing happened two months before this guy said hey man and like Harley are interested in sort of getting in touch with you would you. Would you ever consider working with Harley Davidson I was Yemenite coup and okay so why you WanNa do like I want to write a fucking highly on the state do you ride. Did you ride before this. No I so this time. This tiny lie did I had spur of the moment when I was when I was drinking coffee and talking to this guy suddenly became okay. Let's do that. It can't be that hard turned into okay. Holly analogous apply you've like training on your days off when you're on tour with a with with an ex police bike aqap right. Who was lovely? Shout case if if you're hearing and he basically trained me for like a month or so and then we went on the road and then it turns out right free days before the bloody show. I found out that I actually technically couldn't put the bike in ignition and it actually sti- up sequin Kowloon giant heels trying to start a Harley onstage aged Jerry Kammer so I'm like I'm fucking kidding me like done all of this training which was fantastic Boston now. Don't even start the fucking bike so what we had was. We got pipe and drape for about eleven feet. Were for pipe and drape where the audience can see me. I had to fucking put the bike in ignition at like no in neutral neutral and then to stunt coordinate is came fucking push me out onto the stage and then I had to. I had to make it to the drum riser and that was a good twenty feet. And if you've ever ridden a bike I don't I it's like if you're not using the clutch touch and you're on the bike and and you etc as soon as you start slowing down you're fucked like you you tipping or you know you gotta come to a stop. It's heaven and it's heavy and it was is a fairly decent sized bike so I was like by. This is only in front of almost four thousand people sold out. We got helicopters right above the audience filming Ming this entrance. And it's going to be a lot fresher may versus know even the word on the song coming out to you on the Harley Prima Dona Hi Prima Donna. Let me say when and then we had lease this scenario. Because I couldn't read the engine we had a fake motorbike like engine engine coming through the PA.. So all I think priest does that too so yeah and I. I've heard you see you can't because you have the United Health and safety you know what but yeah they pushed me and I thank God I I parked the kick stand up properly and stayed. There barely makes any sense because in some peer seventeen a rooftop. It's not like you. You gotta worry about fumes and Shit. So do you know what I was told. That was the way that it was going to happen. And you're right you're right it's not like an arena right because there's it's not a roof on but yeah so I'm sure you looked glorious. Doing it is love it and I'm sure you look it. Look seamless but now we know the the story behind it and you guys all right. Luke spillers here. We're hanging out. We're we're GonNa you know Luke thought ended at three. I Pacific I end at one Pacific for Eastern so we got forty minutes left. have to go. We're waiting on Brett. All right. Bret Michaels is going to call in in twelve thirteen minutes. He's a fan of yours as well. Luke's yes so you'll get to do you. Have your ever ever met him. I never have. We had a tool. Shed a dry virtually a bus driver. I drive bus driver. Who 'cause I I believe rides motorcycles and so did my He knows how to stardom. Yeah I I know how to stop bite. Let's get straight you know what was the best struts rush towards so far the fighters It's so different. Because you've go with the FOO fighters tool it was I mean yeah. It was great to watch them every night. It was fantastic. The sort of like form genuine relationships came out and did under pressure with them that much every night yet yet. which was you know if I if I was to get hit by a bus after this interview then I could say I i? I had a great great time and I had some great experiences in that being. Definitely one of the top dive I've had today but you can't beat your own audience econ when you do your own headline show. Yeah like I playing in front of the food was was was great. But you know you've got it's like you come out. I came out on stage every night. Like a bullet from a gun and it was it was relentless. There was no time to relax even sip a war sometimes. It's just like buying buying buying buying because I gotta get everyone as soon as I can and as soon as I got that engaged with me otherwise you fool off it but just to me what seems like just even fifteen seconds and then we're GONNA lose them. I'm just like that anyway. Like I turned around and I shout the other guys in the band. Like if I feel like the gap is longer than fifteen twenty seconds in between song a to be or whatever you know it's like I like to keep things moving like it to be relentless you know I just realized something you toured you open shows for Motley crue yes on. What was their farewell tour right? I nine and then I saw that post every day. We'll even yes that was like. Oh okay okay. It's all right but so so motley is yeah I was GONNA ask you. What are your thoughts on that because you were part of the whole not that you were part of it but you were the support act for? There's some of that tour the end the contract never coming back and here. We are on this big tour. Did you have any. Did you believe that that was going to be at for Motley. crue did you get to spend time with them. Did you get to know them at all on that tour I mean I was. I was in touch with Nikki. Mostly and we. They admit they were not getting along. which is one of the reasons why ended a really? They've been public about that. I mean I don't know I mean it's I guess it's like any dynamic. It's in each member source. has its own camp if that if that makes any sense even the even the str- soon extent has that But I didn't I didn't really get it to me. Everybody it was mainly Tommy and a Nikki like I actually. We actually spent New Year's Eve with we've told me and that he threw Mandla the summit pump then an and then he did this after show thing at the At the state who sent away they were playing believes staples. Yeah it was the last show. Yeah and that was fun. They had like a You played that show I did. Yeah so the stretch. Lots were the support act on the very last time Motley. Show the New Year's Eve show the loss full shows. We did one in Vegas in three day. How did you guys go down with their crowd? I thought it went down. Great Yeah Yeah went down I I remember it being good and we got it was a while now. I think that was years. I always four years ago. It was well. It was in sixteen to seventeen right. Foyers East pointed out at sixteen to seventeen or fifteen hundred six on google. It was the last Motley show until the the next either way if it was like it feels like a million years ago I mean I remember I remember. I do remember US going down ready. Well I do remember that. Did you ever have a date. You Open for an act and you didn't go down well and yet and the crowd was flipping the bird or you really work or thirty first. Two Thousand Fifteen Fifteen Greg into sixteen. So it's three. It's it's three three almost four years time flies did you ever have a brutal show where the killing Linnea. I know. I've never had a bad bad show. I've never had a show where I haven't been able to win the audience over even if it was twenty people at sort of like these these festivals that we've done in the empathy is and stuff like that. I've always fought right. You know what there have been times in the last couple of years where we will do. mm-hmm a festival in will it will be like one o'clock in the afternoon and Really excited to play it and then the crowd has been quite sparse for whatever. Whatever reason I'm not I'm not quite sure but I still go out then and play exactly the same with exactly saint-anastasie energy as if it was so like four thousand of our own fans? Is this kind of the way we do it. I I did create. I did get mischievous once when we first came over in that year. Two Thousand Fifteen. I was drinking a lot when we were on tour and I used to. I used to get extremely loose before I got on stage in in those days and I remember losing terms of drinking. Yeah Yeah Yeah I just you know it was I I I like to to get a great buzim before before I go on and that was that was the way it was ever since I was sixteen. It was always like that. Are you just said that in the past tense. Do you not do that anymore. Not Not so much no no right now the majority also of like be sober stage now. Because I'm even in. I went up when I'm sober mature cognitive that too. That's part of growing up that you realize is that you've got people out there that paid for the show and you don't want to be a mess and you've got a you've got a lot of it's on you man. You're the front man. You're the singer you've got you've got to be on it. Yeah and I'm proud to say that we haven't consumed a show in five years despite the schedule but that is because sacrifices are made and whatnot. But but what happened this time when you had one too many well we were playing. The show is gone. Where was it I think it was in Detroit? Anyway then nuts. I found the right that Ruby wrought fans and I was sort of like inbetween song stiff drink and this and everyone's this route is how this goes goes like on the front. She's at what are you doing. He League and I'm like why don't you find out and I pulled all over thinking it would be funny but she got her head. Oh it just all over I am just like I was like you know. It's a fan like I got to find. Sometimes I kiss him and then I slapped on the face and then walk off and everyone's dislike it is it was funny. I used to spray my audience like with champagne at the end. And so that didn't seem you know sort of like strange to me. I was like if someone if my if someone who I loved it that to me I would have been like that so cool you know. I'm a rock show. Its way everyone's coveted time anyway. This go did not appreciate. She flipped out she was like I think she was a bit of poser. Don't think she was a real fine. She'd made away to the front. And is it a club Gig. It was a club Gig right on top and she just kicked off like she was like talk and then she was like she come onstage he was trying to get on the stage and then and then like the security came aim off her boyfriend. Ironically laughing his ass off thinking it was the most hilarious thing he'd ever seen she gets dragged off through the audience. She's reaching into a handbag. She's like throwing tampons at me. And I like and then she threw which could have done a very damaged. Could've taken my nashes out was you're what my Nachos Motif. Okay right. She threw nail Polish. And I remember seeing it come into those are saying. She was screaming so anything she could get her hands on. She was grabbing shit and then she goes up to the The merge table on the way out and you guys out there doing a I wasn't we were still on stage midway through set so she goes to our merge table and she just like she grabs all the stuff like tries to flip the table on the way. I like. Ooh t-shirts like all over the floor. And so yeah to South View. Thought you thought you'd be like Oh luke spill throw your drink all over me. I want every drop. That's dodging nail Polish. Drinking does so definitely so blaze your vision between you know probably your judgement. You know for sure one more question before we talked to Brett which is coming up biggest crowd. You've played two so far the biggest crowd you have played too with the streets. Where was it What like opened? Act Never Yeah like when you you walk down on stage in the most amount of people ever saw was out there I think it was Eh eight thousand eight thousand eight thousand fighters. I was with the rolling stones. I forgot you open for the stones and then where was that in Started France in Paki Party and then actually slightly more recent to that would have been In Quebec in Canada opening up for the WHO that was like seventy five thousand. Look to list of bands. You've open for those who are just the foo. Oh Fighters Motley. That isn't real quick. Did you meet the stones. Yeah Yeah met Mick and Keith. We we've opened up from three times so we we had a couple of Sort of like small. You know lovely conversations that I'll definitely cherish forever. which was great we? We saw like set to meet them and bless him like Charlie what was the first guy to come in three minutes early than everyone else. 'cause they they want to say a quick hello and and whatnot and So we ended up so of light shoe in Charlie. Watts is off just about everything and bless him he was he was lovely then. Tony came in and and whatnot. Yeah is is is when making making Keith. Did come in. Oh Yeah Mix Jackie in nine and we have you even do like what are you even say like. I didn't really say a lot man like I. I remember the first time we did it. He walked up to me. And then we had like like I was watching them soundcheck which I knew that you shouldn't really be doing like fuck like this is never going to happen again. But it did. Yeah and he came. He came off stage after they were sound. Check in and then he walked. He clocked me. And I think you recognize me so he walked straight up and his I. You know I A Mick Mick Jagger hi I'm like hey what's up and then I was like yeah man so like yeah thanks for having thanks for having us and and everything. He's I know it's fine and I was like so you know how good and he was like you. The sound sound the sound is going to be great tonight and the show that we play in previously like the sound was very good. And you know it's like in these giant huge stadiums. It's like yeah. It's hard to get like consistent sound every night and I'm just so of like looking in like nodding on like totally know what the fuck you go on about right now I got. We've got a connection right that you know fuck Luke's pillar has dates with the strikes. I did not realized this man. I live in New Jersey. You're playing in Philly. You're like two hours away jam. I may have to come see you come down. Twenty eighth and twenty ninth. The twenty eighth is sold out. The fillmore in Philadelphia. Seems kind of random like just dropping in philly out of nowhere. What's going on Heyman New Year's Eve in Nashville Israel Tennessee Jack Daniels Music City? So there's you knew your show. Yeah see that three three shows there towards just at the end yet. Little Christmas money or post-christmas money. Yeah I'm sorry I'm going back tomorrow and then fly back out on boxing day to come to come here. We twenty seven. Yeah Twenty Six. That means nothing the boxing just when you're coming okay. Okay and then you've got Other dates coming up San Diego and Anaheim. Yes I'll be a tool to California. Yeah which which is going to be fantastic and to be honest. I've been waiting for that kind of toy. It's like five shows all in beautiful wherever Kevin and I thought like touring when it gets cold and these are all headline dates no more dates with the stones. You're not you're not hanging with any time again soon. Now I want to say to him and I was like Kat cost. You Know Mick you know you and your eighty thousand people you just had us open for the stones were kind of over now man we gotta move on over. I'm getting my own eight thousand. That's the right attitude all right. Here's a guy that's played to some people in his life. That's for sure he's about to do it in stadiums uh-huh with his band poison who are also joined by Joan Jett and the black hearts and Motley crue and DEF leppard killed me a week ago that I couldn't be here for the press conferences. I was on vacation but they announced it officially a week ago. And now joining me my old friend Mr Bret michaels one of the hardest work in men in the business rent Edie. Edie my brother how are you doing. I hope I'm wonderful sale. Load a loop from the struts absolute you guys rock you're awesome him and And continue unbelievable. Great songs and music. Incredible thank you so much very kind of you to say sincerely. Brett rocks brats breads post show. Bus Parties are legend. Luke one of these days. If you're around so you would be because you know Brett you prompt sure you weren't able to listen earlier but luke was just talking about what an eclectic mix of music he loves and some of the things he was running down was basically your soundtrack in your bus after a poison or Bret michaels show absolutely. And that's what makes a great still being with them. MM and are still be he was just about to give you a compliment. Phone dropped lifting like. Oh we we lost you you back. Yeah your phone's going in and out but I am so sorry. I'm so sorry. Sorry we got you now go ahead hold on and now I'm over in modern family and I got Eric stonestreet bowling up from water. The telephone number hold on Eric Sale. The trunk he's the best any. Are You mad. They split down screaming. Adam we were the over the on a lot here in la you guys ever. You have a role for him in the shower. What's going on he is? It's an amazing. Hey are amazing down here on the lot with modern family and just talk and and And wanted to tell you again I wanted I want to thank you for all the good years. I know we're going to see each other and talk about Humanitarian Award and talk of the shows on the CW On Friday A and we're down to the arena the seminal and then we're We're on a stadium tour. You and me got lots to talk about. We got a lot to cover them. We really do. And congratulations solutions on that award Brett very well deserved. I can't thank you. Eddie your big part of it. I told you that all we've done with the Bronx we get the rock. We get the party legendary legendary parties and we leave something awesome every single city. I do with my wife. rox would leave a donation behind for some great people and great charitable causes this. Yeah it's awesome man so you've been knocking around. La since the press conference last Wednesday. No no I've been gone. We ride on the road. We run tour and then I just. I'm back here and then tomorrow night. I fly down to Florida and were there for the thirteen fourteen fifteen for the The arena concert and then the boat show so the unbroken tour continues for the Solo thing and then of course you know the big news going out with Motley and Leopard and Joan and you know I. I heard some of the press conference bread. Even I wasn't able to be here for it and the one thing that came off man which is really cool is you. You really genuinely are excited to be out with. These band is bands and excited to be on this tour. I mean poison you guys have been kind of like on an every other year thing and it really came through in in your enthusiasm for this so I know you're pump for it. I am and let me say this. Not Not only that but you know I kept putting that Karma out there to get it done. I just kept doing it over and over again and finally came through when everyone no egos. Everyone's ready to party and put on a good show and and like I say we're gonNA make it amazing. It's going to be an incredible torture. Everyone's fired up all nothing but hits all night long and you know Joan Jett's incredible and of course with Motley and the Leopard guys. It's amazing you know. I was thinking too quick things. I know we're short on time. Couple things that strike me about this tour of the one thing that jumped out at me immediately was the fact that as far as the three Well all the acts. But for you and Motley all original members which is unheard of with bands with history like you guys have and Leopard it is basically as original as they can be so. That's that's crazy when you think about it not only. Do you have three bands still really good and still at the top of their game. But it's actually the band's it's the real deal and it is top of their game and this is what they said you manage hits the history and like I was saying you talk lukens stuff about the stones I mean that is that's legendary them out plane stadiums they'll be plainer own stadiums here soon. These guys are great and like I said that's you you you and me are always pushing the live music rock and roll dream. We've been doing it forever and let's say we can say we've had some legendary parties together. Oh yeah the last thing we have. We have ice at room temperature. Never forget that one. I need ice cubes at room temperature. But here's there's last thing that I thought about a M- only half joking here. It's well documented in music history. That poison has had their dust stops on stage. And and God knows there's been dysfunction. Motley God knows documented dysfunction is Joe Elliott going to be a referee at some point on this tour. Yeah I think Joe Joe already volunteered. He said look. They're all the dysfunction between these two and the price fights pyro the good songs. Joe Let me tell you something I think Joe can throw down. He'll get right in the mix. I know he's big. He's GonNa be dodging shares and Bass Guitars and God knows what flying Brian around halfway flame. Throwers Nicky Byrne. Somebody who know what's going to happen I. I'm still okay. Trying to recover from my hangover from when I went overseas to play H. You're the last face I sold before one over at an Iran that would sleep. Keep thank God. I wasn't the last face you ever saw period man. That would be a bad thing. Hey I gotta run man. It's great to hear we gotta do way more. I know I know you're busy. We when my doors wide open the we've got to do a whole show whenever you're ready you have my number get pass it on to Luton stretch. Tell them congrats if you can hear congrats Rockin. Oh great okay. Good keep keep rocking. Pass my number long. Tell them to give me a call. And and hopefully we'll see each other on the road I will see you soon and again is cw I got humanitarian of the year. War Dare and if they get a chance to check get out I went through live music on TV which is scary so check audio on the CW. That's awesome congrats on that and much respect for are you keeping it live like that. That's the way to do it. Thank you buddy. Thank you love you. My friend Abe okay easing Merry Christmas. Happy Holidays take Here's by goes few minutes with Bret Michaels. I know we got so much more to cover we will. He's running around La and working at like he's always doing it the Solo Latour the show on the CW tickets on sale for the big stadium tour. I think the general on sale is Friday. This Friday believes so Brett's always got a lot going on. We gotta do a Rainbow Show with him sometime soon as well all right we got to wrap this thing up man but this was a blast. Luke I can't thank you enough man. Come sit in with me anytime. There's just too much fun as mines and go to the struts dot com to find out about all the upcoming tour dates and everything the guys have gone on all the dates are there the next one is in Philly soul down on the twenty eight twenty nine. Tickets remained two nights at the fillmore and the rest of the shows are listed there as well and they'll just keep coming and keep coming. You'll see you'll see him be added up there and can't wait for the next ex record man. Well that's going to do it for this week's Eddie Trunk podcast. Thank you guys for listening so much wherever whenever however you do it. Of course it's always free new episodes so every Thursday podcast one dot com and apple. podcast please be sure to subscribe so you. Don't miss an episode of whatever I'm bringing to you each and every Thursday and all these great interviews interviews come to you courtesy of my daily show on Sirius. Xm Satellite Radio Trunk Nation. Hear it live every day Monday through Friday on volume volume. That's Channel One zero. Six airs live two to four. PM Eastern time and there's a nightly replay ten to midnight eastern and you can also get shows on demand and listen to them whenever whenever you want on the Sirius Xm APP. If you're in the New York New Jersey area you can see me Donna Jim. The that metal show Reunion Party is tomorrow tomorrow night the twentieth of December bats in Clifton and then a bunch of stuff coming up as we head into the new year in January get lol up there for you on Eddie Trunk Dot Com and of of course let you know about it on twitter as well as we get ready to close out a year and get into a new year. Happy Holidays everybody. Whatever you're celebrating have fun and don't forget to join me each and every Thursday for a new episode of the Eddie Trunk Podcast as always produce Spike Katie A.? C. You guys next Thursday. Enjoy the holiday holiday season in the madness. Yeah yeah aw

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Should Big Tech be Broken Up?

We The People

1:06:32 hr | 1 year ago

Should Big Tech be Broken Up?

"I'm Jeffrey Rosen. President CEO of the national constitution center and welcome to weed, a people, a weekly show of constitutional debate. The national constitution center is a nonpartisan nonprofit chartered by congress to increase awareness, and understanding of the constitution, among the American people. Lawmakers in congress and in executive branch have recently launched antitrust investigations into several of the leading big tech companies, including Facebook Google apple and Amazon. What are the legal theories underlying these antitrust investigations? And what could they mean for the future of American competition and American freedom. Joining us to explore these crucial questions and more are to America's leading experts on antitrust. Mark Jamieson is visiting scholar at the American Enterprise Institute where he studies telecommunication. The Federal Communications Commission. And how technology affects the economy. He's also the director and Gunter professor of the public utility research center at the university of Florida's Warrington college of business, Dr Jameson served on the FCC transition team for President-elect Trump and especial adviser to the chair of the governor of Florida's internet, taskforce market is wonderful to have you with us. Thank you, God for the opportunity and berry Lynn is executive director of the open markets institute. He previously worked at the new America foundation, researching and writing about monopoly power. He is the author of the I think I'm allowed to say superb because I learned so much superb book cornered the new monopoly capitalism, and the economics of destruction and end the line, the rise and coming fall of the global corporation berry, it's wonderful to have you with us. It's great to be here. Let us jump into the New York Times report at the beginning of June, that the federal government is stepping up its scrutiny of the world's biggest tech companies including apple Google Facebook and Amazon, Barry. What are the legal theories underlying these this increased scrutiny and given the fact that anti-trust law has traditionally in recent years focused on consumer welfare, rather than competition to what degree to these new investigations represent shift in focus, but we actually don't know. We really don't know whether they're going to follow through with any sort of case here. This doesn't mean that they're going to be bringing the corridor rain. According reanimated core. The, you know there's this farmer dealing with some pretty vague information. And so what Serey they might use. If bring a case to court is. Is to be determined. In some ways, the more interesting thing that we're observing right now is the decision by the antitrust subcommittee of the in congress. The judiciary committee, congress to investigate the big tech corporations over the course of the next eighteen months, actually starting tomorrow with a hearing that's looking at the effect of the power that Google and Facebook have over the distribution of information over advertising markets, the power that these two versions have over the news that we hear on the stability in well, sort of the, the viability economic viability of our News, corP's, though. There's lots of determined. It's an exciting moment. We haven't saying this kind of action kind of interest in a really long time. But the we don't know what can happen. Thank you very much for that introduction. Mark. Can you give us a sense of what legal theories if any, the federal government might be invoking to step up its scrutiny of the world's biggest tech companies and do you agree with barrier? Not that the most significant development is the decision by the antitrust, committing congress to look at the power over information and advertising that the platforms have sure, and some sense. I have a lot in common with with berry in. There's a search for theory here. I wish that it was clear that somebody had a coherent theory of of what's the challenge, and I'm not sure in the political arena, really. Have that as I listen to people talk require people. Right. What I hear more is, is a kind of gut reaction to how large some of the companies are, and it concerned that if they become successful than they turn that success into a political. Power, if you will we hear concerns about how they might bias content against one type of person or another, and we have a lot of complaints from rivals. People who really love to be competitors in this space, but find that for one reason another just not gaining traction against some of those that are doing much better. One of the things that really like for people to keep in, in mind here, is that we're in a situation where all of these companies have become successful, not, because someone in government did them a favor or because they were able to leverage something in a corrupt way to, to gain advantage. But what they really did is just made a lot of people very happy, every of two billion, or whatever the number is of people using Facebook. That's their choice. They all chose that. You and I when we use Google for search were choosing that when we buy. From Amazon versus WalMart versus anyone else. We're choosing that. And so, the size isn't about power as much his about Kalat of people being satisfied. I think we want to be cautious in how we interpret that as being something to be a afraid of. That's pulled that the, the, the congress taking a look at it is indeed a significant event. Because in this case, we actually have some bipartisan agreement. I don't think it's, it's massive of green, but at least some where both sides of the aisle have have felt that things haven't kind Kevin gone the way that they would like for them to and that they would like to do something about it. But that very idea there that things haven't gone the way politician might like them to is not a cause for antitrust case. All of us have our preferences filing at some point, as long as rebel to make choices then we can pursue whatever's feasible in the business space. That's how I think about it. I'm concerned that there really isn't equipped here theory, and I agree that we're in a moment. That's, that's really very interesting. And maybe unique. Thank you very much for those introductory thoughts. Will let's. Focus the discussion by beginning with Facebook, Senator Elizabeth Warren, not long ago in March proposed breaking up companies including Facebook, as well as Amazon and Google. And Chris Hughes of former Facebook founder run up in the New York Times recently called it's time to break up Facebook and then finally, there's a great summary article is big tech headed for a big break-up, AP news. Recently published it, which sketches out a potential antitrust case against Facebook, which might include spinning off what's app and Instagram on the grounds that Facebook and squash, competitors by buying them, or using his resources to mimic services. They offer berry, what is the case for breaking up Facebook. What would it look like? And why do you think it might be a good idea? Yeah. We've actually we were the first one here in markets to propose that particular break-up of Facebook, which spinning off Instagram which spinning off. What's, which is making the case that those the enforcer should never have loud Facebook to buy those two corporations in the first place. And the one idea is that it's just providing more platforms for people to communicate with each other more different alternatives or experimentation in terms of privacy settings terms of the tax services organizations, provide in and. You know, in March said it's like a lot of choice while saying is, is that when you have the dominant corporation, this case face vying up. It's up the upstart corporations its rivals before they can actually really going. You actually don't have choice in right there. Those two mergers proof that we really don't have choice when it comes to this kind of service, you know, what people call a social media. You know, but the, you also have to look issue is not to that Facebook is big. Instead Facebook is not neutral in the services that provides Facebook engage discriminates is actually part of this business model gives different people different information. It gives different people information that might lead them to away from the direction. They want go, you know, so the reason. Facebook provides different information, different people because they make a lot of money by selling advertising, the different people. You know, that's, that's all of their their, their revenue country advertise. So they're entire business model is essentially built around of. Hoovering was information about people studying what people do and then using that information to manipulate people into actions, and then some selling the services of manipulating people to advertisers, that want to get you to do something, or, you know, some cases to foreign powers might wanna get you the voting different way. You know, it's like, if proper gamble comes Collins, at hey, we want to advertise high get you divide this new kind of tie. Facebook is there to help you if Latimer? Putin is come along, as I wanna get you vote for this person rather than that person. Well, Facebook's here to help you with that too long as you'll pay bills, you know, you're gonna put money into than they're going to help you out. So the, the issue here is not that simply breaking Facebook up. That's actually this s pretty easy in terms of understanding what to do, because we saw bought the issues, also providing. Imposing the same type of neutrality protections the same type of anti discrimination protections than we have imposed on every previous network. Monopoly in American history, railroads and telegraph telephones in electrical companies in broadcast networks. This is not nothing new about these regulations. No, powerful intermediary should ever delivered different information different services different prices to different people. We never done it before, and we're not gonna continue to going forward market. Just heard berries, strong case, not only for breaking up Facebook by spinning off. What's happened Instagram? But also by imposing discrimination rules that would prohibit it from favoring some competitors over others and imposing different prices rather than others do agree or disagree with his case and why. Well, I. Disagree? What just address the, the bias issue the neutrality issue? Never in our history has an by our history. I'm not including just the United States, you'd go back centuries. Have has marketing has pulled them. The, the, the, the marketing political is marketed products market of political ideas ever been neutral, the platforms for them. Have have never been neutral, neutrality is, is just not an interesting thing. People aren't attracted to, and it's not necessarily viable business model. This is one of the challenges of, of thinking, what if we broke a Facebook would that actually be a viable business model chances are no because what people are finding fiber what they're paying Facebook four. Is that bias is? It's, it's, it's been able to gather and us intelligence in ways that people find valuable. And so if we took the company said you can't do that anymore. We might have a company anymore and since the two. A billion or so. Whatever people around the world that have said, I want to be part of this, if we take that away from them by putting it into a model just isn't financially viable. Have we really made them in better off as one of the studies that, that we to done over the years and weeds, not me personally, but studies done by communists and others? Looking at innovation, we found that ideas. Go to market, only through five will business models. Lots of ideas are introduced lots of them are, are, are toyed with, but not all of them actually succeed because they can't get the business model. Right. And that's one of the things that when we think about what's up. We think about Instagram. We imagine them as having successful business models. But they have a business model now given to them by Facebook. If we take that away on they still then viable businesses, and we don't know. For sure. But my guess is probably not. And so we would not necessarily have competition if we simply tried to break up the companies in, in that particular way. Barry, how would the goals that you've had to keep Kate, both breaking up a parts of Facebook and also imposing and discrimination laws? Be achieved. Could it be done under existing antitrust laws which include the Sherman act, the Clayton antitrust act of nineteen fourteen in the Robinson Pettman active thirty six or would you have to pass new federal statutes or have done judicially? And of course, if you could give our listeners, a sense of what the basic framework of antitrust law is that would be great. But yes, this is a great questions like do, do you need to pass new laws in one of those things that Google Facebook, Amazon, keep saying, oh, you know, maybe there's some problems here? Maybe we have to fix this reflects that a little bit need to do. Law do that. And the fact is you don't need any new long. We have a fantastic rich laws that we developed in the United States, going back to the very beginning of our country. In fact, going back to seventeen seventy three on back to the fight against the British East India company, the Boston tea party, you know what was that fighting about that? Fight was hey, you know in between the citizen as a seller of things in between the citizens, the buyer, things we do not need an intermediary. We don't need a giant, crown corporation and tell us how to do our business. We can make markets all by ourselves and exchange with each other all by ourselves, you know. So what we're dealing with here is that same thing we have is intermediary. That is in between the person who wants to say something, the person who was writing something the reporter, the book, author on one side and then the citizen who's trying to learn something who's trying to understand something he's trying to figure out. How world works on the other side to send radio. That is not neutral then manipulating that information and manipulating information or to make money because their business model selling advertising. So. Over the course two hundred and forty years, we have developed in a huge variety of ways to deal with intermediaries be they railroads or other types of transportation, companies or be they telegraph companies or telephone companies or, or cable companies are all kinds of other kinds of communications firms. We developed a hall in this wide set of tools, and we have used them repeatedly. Most recently in twenty fifteen with the, the net neutrality order, which, you know, in which we impose precisely this thing neutrality, on the cable of corporations on variety on AT and T on Comcast we just did this in Google and Facebook supported that because they said, oh, if we don't have discrimination laws on to, to. To the telecommunications. They're going to discriminate against us. But now was that happened? As soon as the, the, you know, the we look like their power, they're totally against it. Of course, they are because they make money off discrimination again, to make money off manipulation their ability to manipulate is a license to extort. That's what they do. That's what they extort money to, to for people trying to get from one side of the market to the other, and it's a wonderful business model or Facebook, but it's not a business model that we are gonna continue to bide in this this this country, and in our antitrust tool kit, we have every single tool that we can use. They can be applied by a wide variety of different authorities, including congress need be Mark. Facebook has emphasized as you did initially. It has competitors in messaging and digital communications including apple and Google and also that antitrust law focuses on companies that are raise prices too much since Facebook is free. It might be tough to argue that it harms consumers do agree without defense. And do you agree with or disagree with, with berry, that Facebook could be regulated under existing laws? Well, I agree with Facebook in the in the sense that it does compete. Aggressively for people's time and attention. That's one of the main things that it needs to make its business model work as people to pay attention to what's on that screen, and they do they, they compete with a lot of different other types of tech companies, behold on other people as well, because not only do you compete in a sense of, of this time and attention on the screen, which also track people to the screen and compete with other things that they do in their lives. So I agree with Facebook in that regard. I also agree with, with berry that I don't think we need necessarily new laws, if you look at buffer example, the break up of AT and T that was negotiated deal. And if there's going to be a break up in any of these instances, I'm guessing that that's going to be a, a negotiated deal as well. A couple of things that, that berry said, I think are important to, to kinda surface just a little bit more and one is like the net neutrality debate. That was an excellent. Exa-. Sample of Facebook, Google, and some other people on the way call edge providers, people that provide content on the internet making trying to make sure that they did not face competition from people who are in the network space. And so as it was someone asking the government divided the market. Don't don't allow these other types of people compete with us and something else that was shown in the economic research on that. Is that enforcing net neutrality by enforcing having rules, say it has to happen? Lot of people do voluntarily and that's fine. But having rules to say you have to treat everyone exactly. The same actually makes it harder for startups to compete with Facebook or compete with Google. Both of those companies have extensive telecommunication networks of their own 's custom designed for their services. If you want to start up and compete with a Facebook you have to hope that the internet that's out there serves your needs. But it doesn't if it's designed to be neutral across everyone. Facebook has a network designed for Facebook. And so the then neutrality rules, actually would be protecting Facebook and Google and others. From from the types of competition. We would actually like them to, to see very, let's delve in on the free speech implication of this debate in his op Ed Chris used the Facebook, cofounder said, the most problematic aspect of Facebook power is Mark soccer, Bruce unilateral control, over speech, the most extreme example, Facebook, manipulating speech happened in minimum are in twenty seventeen and he describes an example of Facebook favoring one side over another. And I'm delighted that one of our great. We the people listeners Zoppo rutta lot wrote in just recently and asked would it be constitutional for congress to regulate corporations to? Here to the principles of free speech on their platforms such as Facebook YouTube Twitter, and so far as they become now as some of argued a public town square, what do you think? This. Besides the, the case that Chris Hughes mentions in Myanmar case from that from right here in the United States. You know, this is my friend Nickless in as the editor wired magazine and last night last February twenty eighteen he published a cover story in wire about Mark Zuckerberg, and Facebook, and they sort of all of the problems that they got themselves into over the previous year. So and cover a photograph who's actually sort of a painting of Mark Zuckerberg. It made him kind of look like a victim, his face with Bruce, and then the article was basically a pretty positive piece about their struggles or efforts to sort of figure head of run their organization more effectively in the middle of this, this piece right in the middle of this base. Which is a pretty positive about Facebook. Nick Thompson inserted this one paragraph in which he said every journalist now that I'm just paraphrasing here. But in every journalist knows that, that day are just sharecroppers on Facebook's industrial farm. And in this case, the farmer share the master can turn any of number of different switches to manipulate their their, the number of abuse. They have number of the amount of money they get the traffic. They get in ways that can entirely harm that particular business at particular publisher, that particular editor that ticket. A reporter on one side. You got a company with a corporation with all power genocide. He got someone just trying to talk to their fellow American, Nick taps. Just updated that article recently within the last month in, in, in wire and is fifteen months in face. Looks history since that lasts since that happened. So most of the articles about what happened, but in the middle of the new article, there's a little report from Nick from Nick about what happened to wired last year after they publish that I article what happened is that within a week of that article coming out Facebook, shut them down it shut up all traffic to our it shouldn't now for a month, one month. One month. In retribution for article that was relatively positive a coverage of, of Mark Zuckerberg in the rest of the Facebook team. So that's the kind of power this corporation has. That's how they use their power to promote free speech in the United States. They use it to terrify, the enters, and publishers of our news magazines are newspapers. Go talk about us. Don't come after us 'cause we will shut you down. So in terms of what we're gonna do when we need to do it. Well, we need to move pretty fast corporation shows. This is his is willing to do it. Today's in today's world, the American people have no choice but to deal with that, that kind of grotesque abuse of their license immediately. And overwhelmingly, Mark. Do you agree or disagree that Facebook is openly discriminating against its critics by shutting them down as well as engaging in lesser forms of speech discrimination, and could Facebook be regulated under the first amendment? Some have argued that this media sites could be treated like state actors who have to follow the first amendment constrained, by the constitution or feud like common carriers and therefore subject to regulation, or, like news, editors and so forth. Whereas others say that Facebook and Google themselves have free speech rights, that might be violated by attempts to regulate them, what, what's your sense? Well, I don't know why Facebook turns anyone on or off the that's we'd be investigations could be done. Determined get was was eight Facebook's motivation for cutting off wired if they did. I really don't know that could be studied now, but what's important? There is not so much that, that Facebook has the ability to do that. But whether Facebook is up front with people that, that is what it would do if it says to its customers and clients wired and such included that we will turn you off under these conditions. Then that's a free contract that people can enter into or not if it's hiding that if it's doing it arbitrarily, then I think we have issues under our current laws under whether or not that Facebook is dealing honestly or fraudulently with the with the. Customers that if it's violating those kinds of laws than than that should be pursued getting to the other part of your, your question, though. And that is regulated under the first amendment than such should I'm not enough of a legal scholar. Actually, no kind of legal scholar to tell you whether I amendment could be applied to a private company. I'm skeptical of that, but people can disagree with me on that with, with great validity one of the problems that, that Facebook has of particular which I pointed out an a couple of things I've written before is it's taken things that people have typically used separately in the past and trying to combine them all together. So it has these this function that we would normally thought of as common carriage, which is a message, simply transmitted, and that is all done. It's not changed on alternate sits, not. And there's nothing that this changed about it and Facebook that kind of a quality. But then it will turn people off. Or we'll say we don't like this message and cut it out for whatever reason that might be that violates help people think about common carriage insys feels like the post office says deliver melt you anymore. That's those two things don't go. Well together. Also has this aura this work. That's very much like a media company where it actually prioritizes content and says, who's going to see what which is by its nature, the has to do that any Idi one. That's that's involved in distributing information that it's it's limited space. That is going to be displayed is going to prioritize in some way, that's part of the business. But that's what we've seen typically in the mass media where we expect editors to play particular kind of roll with roles that are well understood, and that is something that Facebook has come up to and said, yeah, we're going to separate this outside. I really think the face one of. Facebook's major challenges is that it's taken things that people are used to seeing as separate and trying to put them under one umbrella. And I'm not sure if that's going to be sustainable as the business model as part of run into the political problems at has. So I think indeed, the government could say there, some aspect of Facebook, does it looks like common carriage. But he couldn't do that with all of it for displaying news and such. That's not something we have under common carrier very just because. Paul, right. On added on take one more beat on this question of how specifically you suggest that congress the states in courts could require corporations to adhere to free speech principles, and would it be constitutional as he asked for congress to require that YouTube Twitter, Facebook, and Google respect free speech principles in the case of Twitter Twitter somewhat more complicated question? Is actually market wasn't sure market. I ever to agree on much of anything. But the this last little appeared, Mark sort of, of sort of took his to the crux of the problem, which is that Facebook is two things that we don't normally see together at actually was what I said earlier, which is that you traditionally, you're either comic air or your something else, your publisher union of your your, your seller of something and you depend on common carriers to get to market. And so what we see here is this fundamental conflict between this corporation that seat out both as a content provider manipulator, and they have such become central central facility in connecting people that you can't get around you depend on. And when you get down, that's the thing is like, when they shutting down there, just ain't no way to get market. You just lose half your readership. Overnight all this. You can't. Arrive. That's death sentence for, for, for almost any seller, any publisher when you lose half your audience instantly, so, so have we actually deal with this outta, we ensured that we actually have a system that promotes free expression, and also promotes the sort of robust journalism that we need for our democracy. Well, it's that we clarify, the difference between the common carrier. They connect tour in the system and the provider for mation. And the fact is, is that as as Mark is getting at Facebook can't be both. It cannot be both you know it's gonna be provide a connection and a national joke. Jobless, but it's not gonna be the initiator the publisher of information can't do it, and what we need to ensure that the people who were publishing. And there's all these roles publish. And is like if you're publishing live list material, we can bring cases against you. You know if you're if you're, you know. You know, there's a whole system to regulate speech based on the traditional differentiation between the common carrier in the publisher. And so all we have to do is go back to that system, which has been in place since the founding of the nation. And while the problem of Facebook goes away and people can say whatever they wanna say, and if they break the law of there's ways to deal with it without seeming to shutdown systems, communication, that we all rely market referred earlier to a bipartisan consensus around some of these issues. Can you imagine a bipartisan consensus about requiring the platforms to respect free speech, especially in light of the net neutrality debate, which was initially cast a first amendment issue? The claim was at Comcast was discriminating against its competitors importing free speech in the process, but pretty quickly became polarized. Where it was RS against DS. I think yeah. I think it'd be very hard for us to, to have some legislation that cut that comes out of even whatever consensus. We might have not so much for substantive reasons, but for political reasons, the, the, the politics of while the politics, we see going on in congress Washington to lesser stint around. The country is kind of sucking all the oxygen out of any kind of substantive legislation. It's really hard to do things because of the, the animosities that we see even if there's, there's consensus that at least some Republicans believe that Facebook Twitter at all are biased against conservatives, and on the other side of the aisle, there's, there's a belief that they're just too big. And so maybe that, that brings us together on some substantive issue is still takes political energy to actually do something. I'm not sure that we, we really have that. What, what thing I probably should clarify, though? And in what very and I just been talking about. I, I agree completely that your Facebook has combined things that we've not had combined before. And I would add into it on just the two things we talked about. But also this kind of convener of meeting rooms, if you will, we've always had our clubs at sad, here's who can speak. And, and here's what you can talk about and, and Facebook has kind of taken on that, that kind of role as well, which isn't going real well for it, where I think, he and I might disagree is what to do about that. I'm very happy to let Facebook try and maybe create something none of ever seen before. And people do a da- p- two. Well, but maybe that really is too much for people to get their heads around and Facebook suffers as a business and someone else starts playing those roles quite quite well, what I would hesitate is having the government can come in and say here are the business models. People are allowed to have either. Even because we might have the situation where we haven't seen this before, but it could really be valuable is just it's totally new to us will we've talked about Facebook. Let's now turn to apple and the case for regulating it and the role that the courts might play bury. The supreme court recently decided an antitrust case involving apple by a five to four majority with Justice Cavanaugh joining of the liberals allowing an investigation to proceed. Tell us about that case and what it says about the court's views about antitrust law case, very interesting case in head to with the ways in which apple to manages, it's the app store, and, and the in that case, the. There was a question about whether some of the exercise of power over the Felber's apps, you know, if that affected, the, the quality of service to, to the using the apps who gets the suit and, you know, until it was headed to the chain is, like the there's a antitrusters at a case of somewhile act. It's limited the ability to bring a suit to the person who is most directly affected, and that people further down the chain are not allowed to rank suit. So this, this was a somewhat technical question about who gets Razu and basically, is this really market in the app stores market, or is it system that apple is manipulate it in ways that sort of make it the owner, these actions, chose this attack case, we really happy? To see judge cavenaugh sort of Justice cavenaugh coming out with a decision that he did. But it was like, in general, just to be clear from our point of view oak markets. There's five supergiant corporations in the United States. You Google Facebook, Amazon Apple, Microsoft, and of those five the two, you know, there's, there's three of that sort of routinely. It's actually part of their business model. Engage of the manipulation of interactions between buyers and sellers between speakers listeners, and that's a Google Facebook in Amazon. And the other two apple the apple has never chokepoints controls. It has the ability to manipulate some interactions in certain areas. It has done. So in a couple of cases in the past music industry, seventy Microsoft's they control choke. Points. They have the ability to manipulate a certain, interactions, apple, and Microsoft, do not use that our in the same way that Google Facebook can Adams on so from our point of view. There's three corporations that pose imminent threats to the American American democracy. That's Google Facebook, Amazon, and apple and lack of soft amid there. There's a lot of antitrust problems with both of rations power. They shouldn't have there's a lot of about competition. It should be engineered a to make them function, better serve people better. But nine of them posing in of immediate direct threat to the American Republic. Thank you, for that distinction between ca Facebook and Amazon, and apple Microsoft. Mark. I, I know you're not a lawyer, but any thoughts, you have on the apple suit would be interesting just to summarize a bit. More from the case was this was apple versus pepper. And it turned on interpretation of nineteen seventy seven case called Illinois brick where the supreme court said, triple damages for violations of federal anti-trust law or not available to an indirect purchaser. And the question according to this Cavanaugh was whether the bright line rule in the case, which authorized by direct purchasers, but barred suits by indirect purchasers, covered apple and Justice Cavanaugh said that I phone users word direct purchasers from apple and could bring the antitrust suits because they bought the apps directly from apple and the dissenters led by just a score. Sich said that was overly simplistic, and misreading of the Olympic briquets. So it is indeed technical. But do you have thoughts either about the case or about the divisions of us about antitrust on the US supreme court today? Sure. I think actually described, the case, pretty well, there, it, it wasn't deed a technical issue of who gets to bring the suit and the supreme court decided that even if you did not pay a fee directly to the app, store, your affected by it. And therefore, this just a matter of who's paying the Bill as Hussein Bill, technically I who's Spain, the built in ably. And, and I have no concern with that. What I what I do want us to always think about well is a substantive issue that that is going on, at least with the app store, and that is, is there indeed market power there, because one of the things that we struggle with non as openly as with life to admit as we met is, what does it even mean to have market power in this case, a lot of people will talk about Apple's ability to manipulate things. But that's the essence of doing. Business is to take some basic infants manipulate them into something that people value and then handed off to them sometimes free. Sometimes in exchange for money. All of us are in that business. I'm gonna be late information. That's what scholar Stu, Barry, manipulates information. That's one think tank like his does we all do that. That's how we add value to to customer. So the question is, whether or not we manipulate things the Dewey damage. The customers that, that were supposed to be serving and I think that it's really complicated because if you take the apps store of apple, for example, that is part of what made the iphone and apple very successful was indeed that exact manipulation because we had people in the smartphone business who tried to have stores that did not do that app. Stores did not involve that kind of manipulation and they were not successful customers voted. They voted very clearly that they actually like that and value it. And if they're saying. That's what we want that. I think we're very hard pressed to say you should not have that as a matter of, of antitrust will let us return to the companies that berry said you, very open markets are most concerned about Amazon and Google. The European Union has been conducting a probe into whether Amazon is using it's data to get an edge on third party merchants. And the question is, whether Amazon is identifying its bestselling products elsewhere and steering companies to its own products over those of its rivals, Jeff basis counters that WalMart is much larger than Amazon as Amazon tweeted in response to Elizabeth, Warren proposal that should be broken up. And Jeff Bezos has also said that is a small player in global retail because ninety percent of retail remains offline so berry, what is the case in your view against Amazon, the antitrust case and? It should it be broken up Jimmy into the answer. Yes, it should be broken up. And, and as we were talking about with Facebook, the platform the where people come together to buy sell which has become so dominant like more than half the people who go on by things go straight Amazon, that also has to be made neutral, if we have examples of what a neutral platform looks like it's EBay as neutral platform is the end what that means is that people are selling things they determine their own pricing, and they determined other to within certain pretty rough parameters determine how their products are marketed. Nia actions are pretty much directly between the buyer, the saw in the case of Amazon. They should gather information about every buyer about. Where you've been what you do. Like you know what your what your sins are what your we're? Corks are. What, what books you read and it's not just what they gather from their own website, buying up, data from other folks, MRs routinely by data from the phone Bank things from your car company. And then they use this to create a profile of you so that they can determine how to sell you things that you might not walk or more things than you really want or at different price than what you expected, do the same thing to everyone is on their selling things. They're, they're studying every single thing that they do. And increasingly a. Amazon. Yeah, they, they're not in terms of physical sales are not anywhere near as the dominant in physical world safe for the sale tied as WalMart is. But when it comes to the sale of things online, you know, electron IX, toys, music in film. They become books. They become its cases entirely dominant. It's the main place where certain things result. So, you know, the, the, the idea that you would treat Amazon as, like some kind of whole dislike take all the different categories that go to tell, but into a big blob and say, well, this is the money that they made. That's ridiculous. What you doing antitrust you break things up the markets up, you say, well, how much at Tivoli these people actually control what percentage of the sale books today control what? Percentage of the sale of film. Do they control what percentage of music that they draw what percentage of the sale of on electron control? And you'll say in case educates case after case is that when it comes to online commerce and sometimes general congress, they become the dominant player end. So. What we have is, is a situation in which the, the basic fixes the same here is that you want to separate out of the sale. The, the platform itself where people come together, and went Salta, the product, content, you want have no vertical integration just to get rid of any kind of conflicts of interest. And the second thing you wanna do is when you have these platforms where people like to come if this is the dominant players for businesses done in neutralize it, you make sure to their charging reasonable fee for connecting the buyer seller. And you know, this is really, really simple stuff. This is what we do with our a credit cards. Right. It's like can be credit cards provide the -bility to connect the the buyer seller. They charge really outrageous amount of money. They charge maybe three percent of the deal. They shouldn't turn that much. But when Amazon does that kind of connecting charging thirty forty fifty percent. Sometimes more. So again, it's like solutions of the same Nova integration and neutralization notice cremation, no prices cremation terms, discrimination calming hair, Mark. A strong statement by Barry. He says, when it comes to online sales, Amazon does dominate Amazon is supposed to count for fifty two percent of all online sales in the US this year up from fifty eight percent last year. And he says the solution is no vertical integration. No price. Discrimination do agree or disagree. Why? Well, I disagree. I think the exactly gave really illustrates that because he developed a contrast between EBay, an Amazon, and then a lot of people know, the difference, and we choose we choose Amazon often time over EBay, why. Well, I don't know why other people do but for myself, I find it hard to search for things on EBay. I have to be very active and digging through the details. Whereas Amazon's using its artificial intelligence. It's knowledge of what's going on to serve me better. At saves me what we call an economics kind of the search costs or the transaction costs actually benefits me, and I like that and saw him choosing it. And people do he Amazon, honest of people will use Google or some other other type of bind service to check prices to check a -bility and keep coming back to Amazon because it's doing better. So to think about Amazon is controlling anything isn't quite true. The fact that I choose to buy from Amazon, right? Choose to buy anyone else doesn't mean that control me is that I'm making a choice that I think they're doing better and I do. And most people do occasionally, inspect and see if that the rule of thumb we have by from Amazon is still the right thing. So if we try to step in and fix this situation by making Amazon more like. Ebay. We make a whole lot of people worse off and I don't know what the point of that would be one last round before closing arguments, and it's a large company, but we just have a little bit of time. And that's Google berry, Google is the third company that you said poses the greatest threat to. American democracy. And among the criticisms of Google are that it's dominance and search allows it to destroy its rivals, because it can show its own products about its competitors. And it's also face scrutiny in Europe, over its search practices, and it's use on smartphones including favoring the Android operating system. What is the antitrust case against Google, and what are the solutions? Oh my gosh. Yes. So many potential albatross cases against that. The one thing we should understand that people's Ogle's assert company is no Google's in advertising county could almost every single the they all three hundred plus different company alphabet decorate his alphabet alphabet holding company this, this wilder. You know, like I'm money, almost every dollar they actually earn comes from advertising, you know. So what are they doing? What's their business? Together. It's similar to, to paint book, just like on a bigger and more sophisticated scale that is us always different platforms. They, they control to gather all this information on you so that they can manipulate your choices and then sell their village to manipulate you to advertisers, you know, so last year, we made more than one hundred ten billion dollars by Saen after minute relation machine other, folks, you so the gathering information about you that gather your secrets they, they learn all the bad things about you. Learn to good things. Put it all to. And then they sort of use the fact that they had this licensing, Gaijin discrimination to, to, to give you different information than your neighbor to give different prices than your neighbor, to, to send you on a different route down the street, and then your neighbor, the use this ability to manipulate Jew. To, to manipulate you into binds or things are making certain choices in than they sell that to people willing to pay for. And again, it might be a Proctor gamble or might be Latimer. Putin. We don't know they'll take anybody's money. It's just long green. Right. So, you know, in terms of you know what would we do with, with go, Google is a really phenomenal? They have a whole bunch of different platforms lashed together. They're the dominant search company, but they also have chrome they also have Android. They also have you to, they also dominant mapping company. They're the dominance advertising technology company online because of their control of double click asthma, you just add these, they got at least ten different platform Napoli's. All last together in its way that reinforces each other. So they become more and more powerful every day they got a more information of you. They have more -bility to squeeze out their rivals. They have more believed to squeeze the people that rely on that to get the market squeeze of day after day store more and more money just to get to market. So it's like it's the greatest money-making machine that ever been put together and what the problem was. This is it is also an information manipulation machine. It's news, elation machine, it is a terror delivery. Machine makes people, you know, like with Facebook did with wire, they have related shut people down shift people away. So what we're facing in this giant manipulation machine is a direct threat to our democracy. You know, so it's not just that they're faming out goods, it's that they have the ability to exercise diorite control people to share do what they want to do. You know, this is an old problem in America. It goes back to the British East India company. It goes back to the ginning rule of law, which was established against the, the usual, patents and monopolies by Queen, Elizabeth and King James in the early seventeenth century to manipulate and corrupt. The society around them rule of law means everyone is treated the same anti-discrimination laws are one of the fundamental ways the established rule of WalMart society, Google Facebook, Amazon are destructive of fundamental rule off. We will take them. Thank you for those strong words, Mark, you heard berries, case against Google compared it to the East India company, whose threats to liberty helped spark the American revolution. Do you agree or disagree with his diagnosis of Google's threat to democracy and his claim that violates antitrust laws is a walking antitrust violation agree as described how the market works all get come back to that? I disagree that Google is anything like the East India company, all of those relied on the course of power of the crown, of course, power of government to put them in place and to give them market power, and that and sometimes governments do that. It's happened in our own country. It's happened in other countries as well. That has never happened in the case of Google's never happened in the case of any other tech companies, at least to mine knowledge that the government has used. It's power to say, you must do business here or you do no business. At all now. That's coercion. That's extortion. That's manipulation all of the, the word you could use that, that Jennifer lot of negative emotions, you need that kind of power behind it a business where you engage voluntarily does has none of that. And in the case of Google, all of us, use it or don't use a voluntarily I choose whether or not to use you to choose whether or not to use Google search engine. I choose all those things based upon how valuable are they to me? And I test other services on regular basis. So do a lot of other people if you look at the how the market research is is done. So the, the way that Burkes is essentially, but with a little bit of additional set of additional step to how berry described that Google competes for your time and attention by providing youth things that you find valuable you're willing to spend time online with or service. Because it's doing something for you that then allows him to learn about you that they then go to people who want to send you information and Google charges them for. That's exactly what broadcasters do. It's exactly what newspapers magazines etcetera. But there's this, this anywhere near information rich because of the technology limits of, of yesteryear, if you will what we want to understand, though, as this is the additional step is in Google in doing that. And all of the, the types of platforms try to do this as well. They are setting up a system, where when they learn about you, they have to they try to improve your experience to get you to spend more time with them. So, for example, some of the competitors to Google have complained that, you know, if you are searching for a hotel, Google might put its hotel service up first. But in doing an and that's the competitor say, gee, that's awful. Well, but understand that if Google doing that brings additional brings in additional money. What Google VIN does is say, Aw. It's even more profitable to get people onto my platform than it was before. So they start improving the customer experience. And they can't extort the customers because customers regrettably go someplace else, or click past what Google is presenting in this case of, of hotel room searches. So the that. Essence of the platform that the company has to make it any very impressive service for the customers very impressive. Experience is what's really important, and the vertical integration actually, makes that valuable we've just seen too many examples of neutral platforms that customer simply chose to not use will it is time for closing arguments in this extremely rich in wide ranging debate and bury the first word is to you in just a few sentences do Google, Amazon, and Facebook threaten constitutional values are not Mark said that we have choice all the libertarians essay choice, you know, but just give you one quick example, this is on math, if Uber Uber does wants his scape from the power of goal it wanna to be able to control their own cars. They wanna be able to control the desk. Any of their own company? They want to be able to choose her own halfway through the street. They said in their their before their appeal. You know what we tried? We tried to figure out a way to this game from goals control over match Google control over the streets, and we could do so going forward into. They can shut us down any day of the week. They charge, whatever they want, and they can change that, that they changed that the when the artist any day in week any moment at the day, that's a large company Uber. And you know what? This company is corporation Buber. They said we live in. We die at the whim of pool because they control the mass. And it's like as I said before the Google controls so many other things as well. And that the one of the things that Mark said. Is like you can only have government power if you know, government bestows charter on you if you're monopoly like British India company that is ridiculous. I mean the time and again, we have seen in the United States and other countries is when not believe rises up to the point where has complete control over our nearly complete control over the marketplace. They have that is the power to govern that is the power to determine whether you liver. You know, if you're a corporation of business trying to get to market, if they can block you from market as the power of life and death as power of thriving or being bankrupt. So it was like, what we see here today is the greatest concentration power in private government, in private government, that is entirely outside our control. We have no hold over Google. We have no old over Amazon. We have. No, hold on it eight day basis. Over what face does. But those for rations had actually control over us. And the only thing that we can wheel. The guest is the public that we arrested seventeen seventy six to protect us to protect ourselves against private autocratic government. Now, we could end the thing is we're gonna hear all kinds of libertarian nuts in the coming years, because these guys paying for all these libertarian shops up there apprentice print, and to broadcast these liberties libertarian nonsense about choice, but we do have choice and our choice as we can sit back and say goodbye democracy and say goodbye to our fundamental liberties are weakened fight, that's her choice. And I know that the American people are gonna fight, and one of the things that is gonna fall, besides the power Google Facebook. Amazon is this whole libertarian apparatus. Production and distribution. And Rhode cast of nonsense, Mark the last word is to you do Google Facebook and Amazon, threatened constitutional values or not. I don't think so I tried to, to look up late so ver- over the, the sent with a couple of centuries, we've had this country and, and actually back farther in history as well. And I always I failed to find an instance where an actual monopoly rose that could endure without the government sanctioned in the government playing a role in it. That's just always been true. You need that. Coercive, power, Jim Collins wrote the book Wyatt. Yeah. How the mighty fail and fall and one of the things that this simply true in, in, in a market economy, like ours is companies rise up on our very, very successful. But then they have trouble sustaining that it goes just hard for them to continue to adapt, AT, and T became. Monopoly government set you'll be monopoly but that would happen around the time of the first World War. Standard oil gained one ninety eight percent or so market share at one time, but that was because of its relationship with the railroads which the government had a role in setting up how all that was going to work. It's just been the case over time. I think George Gilder is book life after Google gone. It's right that the way the tech companies are working today that they're probably going to, to falter sometime fairly soon because of the limits in their business models, that they're not using the richest of customers, experiencing gauge -ment of the way that they should. That's a huge open opportunity for the next set of companies that in few years. We'll all be worried about again. It just seems to be true that every generation has the giants at worries about and then they giants fail. The next generation. It wasn't too long ago. We thought about WalMart being this giant, we all had to worry about, and before that it was someone else and before that it was someone else customers do indeed make choices. And when someone offers a better deal they tend to take it as long as the business models. Final thank you so much Mark Jamieson and very Lynn for truly illuminating wide ranging and powerful debate about the question should big tech. Be broken up. Dear we the people listeners by the time you hear this, the House Judiciary committee will held a hearing on online platforms market powers part, one is the free and diverse press. Check out the transcript, and then right to me, and tell me what you think. In the meantime, Mark berry, thank you so much for joining. Thank you for the opportunity. Thank you. They show was engineered by Dave stunts produced by Jackie McDermott research was provided by Lana. Eric and the constitutional content team, please rate review and subscribe to we the people on apple podcasts and recommend the show to friends colleagues or anyone who might enjoy weekly dose of constitutional debate. I think I'd better that you can also subscribe on other platforms as well. Do not favor. One platform over another and always remember to the listeners that the national constitution center is a private nonprofit we rely on the generosity passion and engagement of people from across the country or inspired by discussions like the one you just heard, which was so substantive educational. And I know taught you as much as it taunt me. And that is all fueled by our nonpartisan mission of constitutional education and debate, please support that crucially important mission by becoming a member at constitution center dot org. For slash membership or give it a nation of any amount. Support our work, including this podcast at constitution center dot org slash donate. In the spirit of today's debate. Give a small donation, one dollar just to signal, your support for the national constitution center and for this podcast on behalf of the national custody center. I'm Jeffrey rosel.

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Bonus Episode - Soft Skills Engineering Meets Developer Tea

Developer Tea

34:57 min | 1 year ago

Bonus Episode - Soft Skills Engineering Meets Developer Tea

"The. Today is a special episode of developer t a few weeks ago. I had the pleasure of joining the guys from soft skills engineering on their podcast, and they aired this episode on their feed, and we're gonna air it here on developer t I really enjoyed our conversations we talked about all kinds of questions like for example, looking for a job when you already have job is that okay to do. You know, what are the the different scenarios that might play out in in? So really excited about this. This discussion that I've had with David Jamieson had a blast. If you want to hear more of the soft skills engineering podcast, look for SaaS goes, engineering, whatever podcasting up you use in go ahead. And subscribe, just quick note. This episode is very different from our average episode of developer t it's an question answer format and. Editing is a little bit different. My voice sounds a little bit different than it normally does. So hopefully, doesn't catch you off guard. And hopefully, you enjoy the Sepah, of course, the purpose. As always of the show is to help driven villagers like you find clarity perspective and purpose in your career. And I believe this episode will help you do that. So let's get straight into the special bonus. Episodes cross posted episode of soft skills engineering and developer t. It takes more than reading yet. Another Mona tutorial hoping that this time it will finally make sense to be a great software engineer. This is episode one hundred and forty four of the SaaS goes engineering podcast. And I'm your host Jameson dance. Dave Smith, did you read a momentous toil, and it was really funny. And that's why you're laughing jokes. I know these functional programming ground. They just love their comedy. You can make some pretty epic puns of category theory. We have a special guest today. Do you want to introduce them? Dave. Yeah. Sure. So joining us today is the host of the developer t podcast named Jonathan Cottrell. Welcome Jonathan thank you so much. I appreciate you guys. Let me join you here on the show. Happy to have you. Yeah. I'm I'm excited for couple of reasons we have some overlap in interests, soft skills is something that we talk about a lot on developed. He began very excited. I'm excited again questions and try different show format for once. I feel like I'm a my show-me doing a lot of kind of, you know, God voice in the sky telling everyone how to be in. This is so excited about. Yeah. We're kind of the opposite. It's like voice from underneath telling you what not to be on the shoulder. Yeah. What if you just quit your job, every problem, just quit trail and quitted quit jobs behind you kind of the fall MAG advice at the very end. Right. Oh, yeah. It's actually not the fallback. That's primary. Well, I have you tried to unplugging top exactly turn it off and back on again. Hello skills podcasts. Have you tried turning your back on again? All right. I think we have some patrons to think this month. Thank you, Chris HOGAN, the agile ventures charities that grant David Jackson, Sean Clayton, Nick Kantar, and sonic the hedgehog bringing up the rear. Thank you to those folks for contributing at the level where we say their name or their made up name or maybe they're real name every episode. And thank you everyone else who is contributing has contributed if you want to help out then you can go to soft skills the audience support us on patriots. Let's dive into our questions. Okay. Okay. I'll read our first question. This is from a listener named Andrew. I have been job hunting while employed. Gasp and have a number of opportunities that have advanced to the in person interview. Most of the requests I've seen said they'll be four to five hours in the office, which seems fairly typical. The problem is I don't have unlimited vacation. And I feel dishonest taking so many days off. How can I navigate new opportunities without disrespecting them or completely failing in my current responsibilities? See this is an example of problem that would be solved if you quit you. Can I jump in here? I think the first thing we need to address is the stigma of looking for job while you have a job and the negative stigma there, it's really a bad idea to quit before you look for a bunch of. That's I'm highly Pinon, it'd about that. But if before you start looking, and you, for example, if you don't have much of savings than your hunt is gonna be so drastically affected by that time like the clock that you started fresher. Yeah. Absolutely. So you're very likely to get into another job that you hate and that cycle will never stop. If you keep on saying, well, you know, I I have to quit before even submit a resume somewhere you described my previous four job searches, basically. I don't work here anymore, and then I get home. And then I'm like, well, I guess I need a new job now. Didn't quite think that is closest to my face, right? Yeah. I think that's a good point. Don't quit your job that was tongue in cheek advice. But how do you how do you deal with this conflict? You just get sick. A lot. Unlimited vacation don't have unlimited vacation sounds like it's possible. They've already used all their vacation to not just that. They don't want to use it on this. Yeah. So how do you handle this without just mysteriously disappearing? It also probably depends on if you're are you determined to leave your job. And you're just looking for the next thing are you exploring other options. Yeah. Like, you might approach it differently. I mean one thing you could do is you strategically time your job hunt. So that it happens during a high concentration of company holidays. So like Christmas day New Year's day. These are good interviews. Yeah. Classic in your sheets. I was Christmas. Well, you know, I interviewed a three companies spend the day getting to know new people made some new friends was offered a ten percent raise. To work. I would enjoy more think a another strategy can use here is to to talk to the companies that you're interested in and let them know kind of the situation that you're in because it's possible, for example, that they would plan a late Friday or something to to interview in the interview in person, or even I've even had companies that will do not in in office into where well into the late stages of the interview. But the idea is like if you let them know, hey, I don't wanna disrespect that the company that I'm at now, then that's shows that you're not going to continue a pattern of disrespect when you get to their company. Right. They would want the same respective. You know, you not leaving work for supposedly totally above board reasons. And then suddenly quitting that. That's they would want to do that for them either. Yeah. Yeah. For sure. Yeah. I also feel like that. They argue demonstrated some interesting you've they're trying. To bring you in for an interview. So I'm trying to think of what I would do in this situation. And we just went through some interviews trying to find a candidate. And we're very flexible with people's time line schedules because we wanted to talk to them where remote so it's a little bit of a different setup. But I still feel like they've demonstrated some interest in you. And you're almost giving him a chance to like commit to you a little bit more. I feel like it would work out. Well, if they put in some effort to make it work for your schedule. There might be some some like we've invested in this person. Yeah. Feelings associated with that. I think as a candidate you have to be pretty selective at this point. Like, if you're willing to say yes to any onsite interview. Even the the ones that are a bit of a stretch, or maybe that don't interest you that much it you could end up burning a lot of your work time by doing that. And if you're you know, if you're willing to do like, ten different companies interviews, a ten different companies. You know, you're gonna get stuck I think in this situation. And so I like to spread them out. You know, it's like take your time only go on site to the ones that you're pretty confident and serious. With and don't get into a situation where okay, I've I've done ten interviews. Now. I'm sure this eleventh will be great because I mean that can that can look pretty bad. I've done this where I've interviewed for other companies, but I've never done like ten in a month. I've done maybe three in a month or something. And then it then it's usually easy enough to stagger. It out and disappear for an afternoon without it causing a lot of raised eyebrows. Yeah. You could also depends on what company what your company policies are. And, you know, do you have in office time that's required. You have certain core hours, for example, that are required for an overlap or something like that. If you don't have those things than it's possible to to do fulfill your current responsibilities in the evenings or even over the weekends. When you otherwise wouldn't be able to do those interviews rights. If you go to an interview on a Monday morning than you could work that evening, again that that depends on a lot of other things lining up, of course. But you know, don't think about your current. Job as the most static thing about the interviews as the most static thing in see how that changes in the way, they planning. Yeah. For sure I think I think it's not unfair to say that most developer jobs allow that level of flexibility. It's one of the perks of the industry. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Have we answered the question? It feels like you've given some good suggestions. Yeah. I mean, I I don't want to discount the last phrase here in this question too much, which is how can I navigate new opportunities without completely failing in my current responsibilities. You know, complete failure is on the table. If you are willing to take that I personally you're saying like just completely fail. You know, we we've been to this point we've been very respectful and careful and whatnot but kinda half tongue-in-cheek. It is going to distract you to go interview at other companies. And so I think there's a certain amount of failure. Or at least like performance reduction that you need to be willing to accept if you're going to go and spend twenty hours in a month interviewing it other companies. I would also say there's a there's a, you know, let's say you have three really promising opportunities on the table at some point. You could can roll the dice and go ahead and tell your employer and it's possible if you develop a positive relationship with your manager, or you know, if you if you have been loyal to that company up until that point, you're being honest with them, you know, it's possible that they'll let you go into these. You know, it's normal to change jobs. It's also possible that the cut you right, then and there, but if you have those three promising opportunities in kinda run the odds. Areas here and say, okay, what are the odds that I'm going to truly be out of job for a significant periods Imperia time, if you're going to do this then I recommend having maybe a month at least a month of of your current salaries saved up. If you if you can swing up, so what's the benefit for telling your current employer just to get more flexibility to go interview or to try and see if they can resolve concerns that are making you interview in the first place. What what do you hope to gain out of that? Yeah. So your current employer will probably if they're smart, they will probably try keep you, and you probably shouldn't stay after your employer has tried to keep you upon threatening to quit. That's not good negotiation strategy. If you went to them and ask for them ask for those things before and they said, no. And then you threaten to quit. And they said, yes, that's not a good relationship. Right. So the thing that you gain here is the flexibility of not having to walk around in you. Also are less likely to burn bridges if they were to find out behind your back. Right. So you're like kind of bringing everything above board. There's also an expectation that you're not going to tell them until you have an offer in hand. Right. So that's that's kinda the industry way of handling these things you are expected to look for other jobs on regular basis. The best time to look for another job is while you have your current one. If you'll strongly about this after looking for jobs after having gone through this experience and watching other people feel like they couldn't leave the company until they had a job. You know? I I really do believe that it's all about trying to figure out, you know, what is the what level of safety. Do I need to feel comfortable? So if that safety is all about the money, then save up some money, and then quitting becomes an option being fired becomes an option as well. Oh, that's that's an option. We haven't really explored. If you completely failing at fired oftentimes that comes with severance. Yeah. Maybe a big black, Mark. On your resume. But you get that month of savings automatic. Yeah. It's actually strategy. You know, some people actually get would never do that worked at a dry cleaner in high school with the boss who took that strategy. She decided to get fired and the way that she did it was by just sitting in the counter and smoke cigarettes when customers came in and ignoring them sitting there smoking cigarettes while people were trying to get her attention for a couple hours Allen did he pull that off before? It was I think it was a few days while that's she made a concerted effort to get fired, and it succeeded are you privy to the details of the severance package. I'm pretty sure it was a dry cleaner. So I'm pretty shouldn't severance package was now you qualify for unemployment. Oh, I see. But I'm trying to think of what the equivalent of that in developer worlds would be would it just be like, I don't know commenting on all request reviews with a single thumbs-down. Just ignoring all follow up, and you see how long you can do that. Maybe truncating your production database tables repeatedly right on your local migrations on the production database. Yeah. And then I mean, there's this culture of blameless postmortem. So you'll probably have to do it several times because the first time going cover some organizational, MRs and the putting all these safeguards, and you'll know what all the safeguards are because you're in the post mortem meeting to raise. Yeah. Look you've made our culture better to blow. Prod? You're like not too hard, though, not. All right. I think with that. We've answered the question. All right. We're no more like can be shed on this. Okay. I'll read the next one here K. This one comes from a listener named Chris Chris says, hey, guys great show, though. I think as with all shows could probably use more discussion of badgers. Yes. I said badgers. All right. Chris. That's interesting taste. Okay. We'll take it under advisement. Yes. Chris goes onto say I'm about to start a new job. I took the time honored and hallowed show advice though. I'm leaving on great terms with my old job. Barely didn't take. Our most recent advice. And we'll be coming in as the fanciest of newly invented titles. In software. Staff software engineer, this is only the third time. I've started a new job not counting odd jobs in high school and college, and I've never stepped into a leadership role before what are the most helpful things you've done or seen other engineers do when joining team in a technical leadership role. Thanks, chris. Time to sit on the throne of the staff software engineer. You bring me coffee. You turn up the heat in this building. Is that what senior engineers do? No, senior engineers are the ones running and getting the coffees Daf. No. That's what I'm saying. Yeah. Yes. So as a staff software engineer, your coffee fetters are the senior saying exactly maybe it's worth being explicit about the ladder. So I think I think the world they're talking about has a ladder that looks like junior regular type engineer media. Not seating. Not here. Yeah. Senior staff is usually the next level above senior several to kind of similar to principal. Maybe. Yeah. Some companies go from senior principal some senior staff. Principal yet. My company's principle is a staff, but I don't know there's it's the wild west out there. Yeah. Yeah. Title Franceville could be your coffee better. Yeah. Oh, the good. Good question, though. Right. In the interesting thing about this is it's not a management role or usually it's not it's a purely technical seniority role. So you're not coming in to run the team necessarily, but you are coming into make a bigger technical contribution. So there is some technical. I guess that's the difference between the leadership part in the management part. You're not necessarily just managing. But you are expected to lead. I agree. That's what I interpret from the question here. We're not talking about people management, but there is technical leadership, which is a whole other ball of wax. I have I have stepped into leadership roles at three or four companies now most of them I have come in as a non leader, and then grown into the leadership role, which is a much more comfortable transition. I think but in one case I step straight into technical leadership role. And it's a lot harder because there's so much context. You don't have. Yes. So this is I think this is the most challenging way to do it right here. I feel like an easy mistake. You could make just come and bring all of your good staff software, engineer brain, and and just like, no everything already. Of your position. And like Dave said, there's a ton of context that you don't know. I feel like you have to kind of sit back in uncover the problems that exist instead of just show up and say like I was hired to switch everything to post crest 'cause post-crisis my true love. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's good advice for pretty much all developers really is maybe start whenever you have the kind of the urge to share your opinion. Make sure you've listened. I very often somebody else has something to say that will either adjust your opinion, or, you know, we'll make your opinion not necessary. And even though you're you're you're entire job is to come in. And lead your opinions are going to be important. But the problem is your opinions only as worthwhile as they are heard. And so people can't can't hear what you have to say. And it doesn't matter. How good you are as a matter where your experiences people have discarding what you say, then it becomes useless. So maybe you're you're saying like talk a little louder outing. Can you hear me I said host grass? I think I think that's really good advice. And I think it's more important than more senior role is because you're uninformed opinions can do more damage because you have people for better for worse. People will listen to you more because of the position. And if you don't understand the scope of the problem that you're trying to solve not even the sculptors what the problem is that you're trying to solve it's possible. You will lead people down the wrong path by just talking before you know, what you're talking about. You know, when I when I joined my current company, I came in as a senior role, which might basically means technical lead and the team I joined this context, I didn't know. But prior to my joining they didn't have anyone who is officially designated as the technical lead. And so one of the challenges that they had had was that they didn't have someone to be like a tiebreaker or an authority to be able to say, yeah, we're going to do that. That's great. Let's do it. And so there was kind of like a lot of discussions would just end with shrugs. Like, I dunno like, they just didn't really have a clear path forward a lot of times. So when I showed up. They started asking me my opinion, and I was very much in this humble roll. Like, no, no. I am here to learn from you, and I didn't even realize I was actually breaking ties and causing this logjam to flow just by saying. Yeah. That sounds great. Months later, someone came to me, and they're like the team has been it's been so much better with you here. And I'm like why what happened and they're just like, it's just great you give us clear direction, and I'm like direction. I thought I was just saying like I like that idea, but they they loved it gave them something tangible to latch onto and run with. And I mean, a huge difference for the team dynamic. But again, that's context. I didn't have because I just wasn't there to experience the lack of direction before I showed up. Yeah. I think to talk more about the specifics of the staff software engineer role one way, I've heard it described as the higher up the engineering ladder. You get the more. You're supposed to be defining the technical problems, not just solving the technical problems sear expected to be identifying things that you could then produce solutions for where that's a real. You might not have as much maybe lower down on the ladder. You're kind of just fixing problems that other people if identified, and that's that gets into listening even more where you have to find pain, either customer pain or technical pain, or or some kind of pain to solve. And if you can't find it you got to create it. Oh, it's there. It's their Dory. I think there's a word of caution for all leadership. And I learned this the hard way. So your words last longer the higher you are in the leadership change a chance. So in in. It's kinda like take your words and imagine saying them a hundred times when you're in later because they're going to be repeated number one. So they actually end up being at one hundred times. And Secondly, people are going to the natural way that we see each other is through a static and very seldomly updated picture, especially if we have less interaction, and if you are in a leadership role often, you're gonna have less interaction with teammates than they will have with each other. Right. So so the perspective that we have of other people is difficult to update. And so if you say something that, you know, maybe is is kind of a soft opinion of yours. Like, you don't really have a strong opinion about something that you say it if you do maybe red sock. Something that has convinced you, but it's really something that you're holding loosely, right? The whole strong opinions held loosely thing. Well, the problem is that you get three weeks or even three months down the road. And that's become you know, part of the engineering standard at the company. And it's because somebody said something, and that somebody was you, and because you have some level of thority very few people wanna go against that. So the point being in as you kinda grow up that chain the things that you say tend to matter more, and people will tend to repeat them more. Absolutely. And I would I would say that in exactly that spirit. You must learn to communicate in verbal and written form. So that you can't be misunderstood very easy to say something and have different folks interpret it differently based on context that they bring and so it's just as important to say what you want as it is to say, this is an sorry. Just as important to say what you want as it is to say what you don't. Mean in other words, like I saying this I want you to do this. I don't want you to do this this or this. Yeah. Things that could be conflicted with each other. And to add to that, you know, don't forget that even in technical leadership that people are going to feel whatever it is that you say that that there's a lot of emotion attached to even technical decisions. And that's something that this. This title distinction that we've talked about a few times, you're not exempt from those kind of emotional connections with the people that you're leading. Right. Even though you're not managing people the decisions that you make and even the kind of feedback that you give there are ways to give it where people feel, you know, disparaged they feel like they don't wanna work with you. Right. There are ways that you can come across that ultimately drive people away and drive them apart or in with the same decisions. You can communicate them differently. The same opinions. You can communicate them. Differently and bring those people closer or make them feel safer to work with you. I like what you said earlier Jonathan about. How your words get repeated? And I think one way to maybe knowledge that or even combat it. So they could get repeated and maybe distorted or misunderstood a little bit. I feel like you have to repeat yourself a little bit more. Yeah. Because of this communication gap where you're not spending as much time with each individual person. So and that gets back to being explicit like what they've said about the explicit about what you mean? And what you don't mean. I feel like I often find myself saying feeling like I'm saying the same thing. But people feel like they're hearing it for the first time for the first few times it happened. I was like what is wrong with either me or you. And then then I just realized it's I don't know everyone comes to a conversation with different context. And it just takes awhile to get messages across people's people's communication styles. And everyone has a lot on their plate takes awhile. So I think repeating. Yourself on core important things is pretty valuable and on that on that note one way to make sure that you automatically repeat yourself in a scalable way is to right. And a lot of times it's easy. I thought you were going to say robocalls because I just listened to cast out the. Out of the Royal. A great idea. But it'd be robots lack. Yeah. Okay. Well, like every time you put slack message in it repeats. Your same message in thirty minutes several days. Everyone. But seriously, like, I think I think writing documentation about your vision and direction conserve the reference for people in that people can share that. And so it's like it's less likely to get distorted telephone game style. If it's written down from you from yourself rather than being relayed through oral tradition. You know? Yeah. Becomes mythology or something? Yeah. Sure. Yeah. Becomes less rhetorical. Right. You don't end up. Parsing words. It's more a different kind of thority two words that are written down on screen. That's kind of a win. Anyway. Taking down record. Yes. Exactly. Around your screamed right on there. Race. Yeah. No. But it's it is true that we we parse. The spoken words is very different and for bunch of reasons, you know, one being that when we hear other people's voices. Our brains are totally parsing that differently them when we're reading we're creating the voice when we read right? So there's kind of like this the sense that we actually want to believe what we're reading. And so we we create a little bit more of a an acceptable voice. And we're listening to other people all of our kind of reptile stuff is happening, right. Are lizard responses to competition, for example, are also firing at the same time. And so it's a little bit different than when you're reading something when I read what they've rights I hear it in a British accent. And so I believe it more. Good thing about you. Gosh. Sit there. Wait for it. Wait for it. Perfect. Okay. We both read each other's voice in a written slight amendment. I was going to say that. When I read your words, I hear Kermit, the frog voice. But whatever. Oh, I hear it with like some revert. So it sounds like you're speaking in a large auditorium. Really trustworthy. But warms you at the same time not like dictator, trustworthy, how as a new lead you earned the trust of your team. You can't just come right in and start throwing out edicts and proclamations and expect them to be honored. You have to earn that. How do you do it? I show them my Twitter and say, look how many tweets I have. I tweet a lot. Look how many memes every tweeted. Yeah. That's good turn that around and think about yourself. And why you trust thing about the people that you trust in imagine the moments or like, the experiences that you've had with those people that have either instilled that trust or, you know, have have just made them likable like language is hard because we use these words to categorize all of these various feelings that we have the feeling of trust is very close to and probably often synonymous with the feeling of liking affinity is difficult to have an affinity. To somebody and simultaneously, distrust them. So I would say, you know, a lot of that is as simple as people just enjoying being around. You non being difficult to to be around? So like lots of hugs lots of lots of. That's it. No. You know? I think like, for example, being helpful. It sounds so simple. And unfortunately, it's actually not simple at all. But being helpful to another person is in that's one of the best ways to to gain trust, not having some kind of hidden motive, you know. We're we're your obviously, you know, doing something to get on their goods like if you're to use a bunch of tricks to try to convince them to like, you people have pretty good bullshit radars. Right. And so they're gonna people generally know, if you're being genuine or not I think you could even just come out and say that to like, I'm new to the team. I want to earn your trust. Here's pound gonna try and behave to demonstrate that I'm I'm here to help and just stating that feels like you had helper and some trust right away. But then you have to act on it too. Yeah. There's I think that goes into part of not coming in and just being really heavy handed to I feel like I would have a hard time. Trusting someone who just showed up and felt like all the answers on the first day because I would be skeptical that they did without understanding I trust. Most leadership are the people who have demonstrated good judgment and in order to demonstrate good judgment. You have to actually get your hands dirty and get involved and learn the facts on the ground. I mean that you can only stay in the philosophical realm is a leader so long before you start making bad calls. And so I think one thing I like to do when I joined a new team is take on tasks that will get me exposure to ground truth, usually, it's like non critical path bug fixes or small features or some of the like hard work, not hard. But some of the like more monotonous or frustrating things that other people on the team don't wanna take on take those on. And if you're if you're company will allow it and your business can afford it. Take the time to go deep on some of these issues. And then when you come out you'll be able to speak with more thirty and people trust you because you have firsthand experience. I think a lot of leaders they stay around the perimeter and everything they know. Oh about their software or the systems or the infrastructure is all second hand knowledge from stuff they've heard other people tell them, and I can't think of a worse way to lead a technical team than to have only second-hand information. Yeah. Yeah. I think I think he point you you hit on something really interesting. They're right in the middle of what you're saying of taking on the tasks that other people either are uncomfortable taking on or they just don't want to take on those could be two different types of tasks one is kind of the annoying stuff. Right. But the others like this is dangerous. I if I go into this than I may not come out, you know, this may be the end, I think that's that's a really interesting space to work in some of the like if you were to take on the annoying tasks for example, there's an immediate trust build right off the bat. And then that's that could be easily forgotten right? Whereas with the other piece, you know, that you were discussing of really understanding more. Core. Ground truth in whatever the Soffer is that working on that continues to pay back in people will start coming to you to ask questions. Right. And that's really that's where you wanna be. You wanna be in the place where people view you as a resource rather than just a leader. A leader is not really that's more of a restriction on them until that leaders empowering them in some way, and that leadership is providing them with answers to questions a half. My last suggestion is to suggest a rewrite into a different language or plan. Because then you're just dangling this carrot this promised land of what if all the problems went away and new problems pop up, but you won't know about those until you get into it. So it seems like it could idea it'll be you'll be. Stan. Rush. It yourself consistent messaging that bug would never happen in a functional language. And then if you rewrite so say, you're in a dynamic language you rewrite to static language, then you have to rail against the overhead of the compiler and how much time it wastes. Yeah. Type check all your code and make the compiler pass. You know, if we could do this in a single line of python and just like a, comprehension, and you cycle on pleats the flip flop of increasing trust. Talk about everything should be monolith. And then talk about everything being containers. Yeah. You know? I think if you just follow the industry. You'll end up there naturally. Who have we answered the question? So I think so good luck with your first job as a staff software engineer. Enjoy the throne. I recommend getting some padding. They're usually pretty hard sitting on solid gold softest. Metal is still not very soft. Turns. Yeah. All right. What should people do if they want their own questions answered hit us up on soft skills dot audio and click on ask a question, you can give us as much as little information. As you like thank you so much we've been inundated with questions last week. I don't know what we said or did. But it was probably all those bribes Jamison offered to give more questions, but we'll just harder big wave. More challenge the need answers Jonathan how can people find you on the internet? You can find me on Twitter at Jacob trail at developer t can also find velvety spec outta fem and bunch of other awesome shows of there as well. Thank you so much for joining us. Thank you for letting me take your next week. Thanks, much listening to today's episode. This bonus soda developer t where we cross posted over from soft, skills engineering. I had such a good time and his really thankful to be on the show and really enjoyed our conversation. I hope you enjoyed it and got some value out of it and liked the extra variety for today's episode. We'll be back on tomorrow with a new episode of developer t if you don't wanna miss out on that. Make sure you subscribe, whatever podcasting up Hyun use the one you're using right now is probably a good option. Thanks so much for listening. And until next time. Enjoy your team.

developer software engineer Jonathan Cottrell Dave Smith Twitter engineer Chris Chris SaaS David Jamieson Chris HOGAN principal technical lead Andrew pain Senior staff Mark Allen David Jackson Stan