20 Episode results for "International Whaling Commission"

Different Humpback Whale Groups Meet To Jam

60-Second Science

03:30 min | 2 years ago

Different Humpback Whale Groups Meet To Jam

"This is scientific Americans sixty seconds science. I'm Jason Goldman. Male humpback whales are the concert singers of the marine world these ocean giants belt out tunes that can be heard perhaps hundreds of miles away the songs attract, friends and lovers and maybe keep rivals at bay. And now we learned that humpbacks in different ocean basins, the south Atlantic and the Indian on opposite sides of the African continent. Share melodies that song that my lunch between individuals folk today, the best example of cars onto cultural transition from peer to peer rather than from parent offering Melinda rectal marine conservation, scientists with the wildlife. Conservation society's ocean giants program. The International Whaling Commission has identified seven distinct humpback whale breeding populations in the southern hemisphere. These are whales that meet up in the same warm tropical waters each year to mate and give birth. But when mating season is over. Whales migrate to Chile polar regions to gorge on krill using genetics and photographic surveys of migrating humpbacks, researchers know that males in these colder feeding areas interact with other males from different breeding populations. But scientists did not know this meet up provides the whales with the opportunity to have vocal jam sessions where they trade melodies and the amount of song overlap between the whales that breed off 'gabon in the Atlantic. And those that breed near Madagascar in the Indian Ocean varies year to year. That's according to a study of more than fifteen hundred individual sounds that were recorded between two thousand one and two thousand five the results are in the journal, Royal Society opened science that might sense that in some years that may be different Asian graphic conditions. Patchily distributed pry that my name populations individuals have to move the to find food and that might bring them into classic context with neighboring populations and Philip song exchange. The fundings present researchers with new opportunities to understand how culture is transmitted among animals, but it also allows even greater insight into the workings of populations of humpback whales it shines the connectivity potentially on the times go, which is what genetic information doesn't genetic data can show the different populations had historical interactions but songs can reveal how to populations interact on a much faster time scale. But combine. Ending song information from these populations with Wales. That breed off the Atlantic coast of Brazil rectal, says researchers can gain more comprehensive understanding the dynamics of global humpback whale culture back while it's an incredibly in a complex display. It quite amazing. How complex it is. And how it that shooting? Amazing example of culture in in animals. Thanks for listening for scientific Americans. Sixty seconds science. I'm Jason Goldman.

Jason Goldman Atlantic Indian Ocean International Whaling Commissi gabon Royal Society Chile Melinda Brazil Madagascar Patchily Wales Philip Sixty seconds sixty seconds
A surprising truth about whaling

The Signal

13:32 min | 1 year ago

A surprising truth about whaling

"This is an A._B._C.. PODCAST good. Okay doesn't taste like fish at all. It's like a mental in textures like I'm like beef and textures like this is now hi. I'm Stephen Stockwell Manch Love Wipe and today's episode of the signal begins at a restaurant in Tokyo Jio where I've convinced my little brother to eight some while you did this because Japan restarted commercial whaling this week doing away with the pretense of its old scientific program and hitting out to fish off its own coasts right and when we started making this episode we had one question engine and that was what Japanese wailing is doing to wild populations on the basis that it's probably unsustainable yeah and in challenging that assumption we ended up in unexpected place okay. We are coming to the shop now. It's cold may know something. I can't read the country so this is my little brother Mark who leaves in Tokyo and I've been hustling him all week to try some wail hotly his cultural enrichment and partly because I want to review but mainly if I'm honest for this episode it's kind of like it's a chain restaurant. It's not it's called Kyle kind of chain basically repub going so going into his friends. Yes they mock his taken to mates to this deserted restaurant quite late at night for his first ever taste of whale so they sit down and chatting to the white <hes> and there's a whole menu there with heaps of options that are not well by the way just like you know chips and fried chicken and stuff but then this one page in the menu of Wyoming which you can order as Shimi role or a rest stake all something. And Korean style they actually mean you guys want the role of Dick wt now so they get the stakes and beer yet you can't have without via obviously and at this point having authored the while they all seem to have this brief Pang of guilt the strange thing seems strange. It seems to be the first time second time I really it was coated unless obviously I can't remember nine because unlike Australians in general morally seems wrong tomato. I don't even know why because they're endangered species right yeah which is what a moment for the bees he's to arrive right and that whole endangered question we will get to later in the but I I am so Cain for this review okay so before you eat supposed to say you said okay. Moss thank the animal sacrifice in this case base. It seems very good. Okay okay doesn't taste like fish all his sons as like seafood. It's like a memo in texture is like you know like beef textures like beef. You actually could not that bad yeah. It's not even grisly it's like a good steak and by the way we literally the only people but you know Wales not the main thing they so so what's the price is probably chiefly she yeah it costs seven hundred yen. Each an extra those would be like eight or nine dollars for like a fifteen centimeters long like maybe little cut cut up into bite size pieces mistake. I don't want dollars. That's nothing I mean at that point their almost paying you to eight a majestic secret CIA seems like pretty into it right yeah they are but the final verdict is a bit more complicated yeah. We probably not yeah I feel like the taste is fine if like after night of drinking and someone these in front of me myself media tonight but if someone said hey you want some wail and I was like completely like in the right state of mind be like yeah I'd take the take more is the taste. Were eating an endangered animal yeah. No you're crying joy eating yeah delicious thing in the world. Maybe it's good but it's not okay so it's a thumbs up but none of the price of the Civil Spacey's yeah which is a pretty reasonable conclusion but then we started asking questions about exactly how bad wiling ease for global whale populations Japan mostly took not always but mostly took and Norway and Iceland have always taken the minke whale which is a small whale and those populations have been and remain relatively healthy. That's Peter Bridgwater. He is an adjunct professor at the University of camera and former chair of international whaling commission so it's been a long tradition over centuries. <hes> Japan has done wailing but not the kind of railing at the the intensive <hes> almost industrial stat scale whaling which Japan and other countries were engaged in both before the Second World War and certain bay in the immediate decades after it so what other countries are we talking talking about the which which countries in the world have have traditionally been <hes> into wiling well the countries of of Norway and Iceland of course have done it the U._k.. has done the Netherlands France the U._S._A.. And of course Australia we were Wailing Nation until nineteen seventy eight. It's really no most people don't know that or tend to forget it. I actually can't believe that we used is too wild for the for the charming reason that we would boil down while fat into oil which would be used as machinery lubricates right hypocrites but while he did start become a real problem through the seventies and eighties. It looked like some species these were heading for extinction particularly the blue right so the international whaling commission introduces a ban and it comes into effect in Nineteen eighty-six the whale populations <hes> biolog- start to recover at some <hes> really quite significantly family for example the humpback whales that come up East and west coast of Australia have recovered and continue to recover quite well they as in the North Atlantic <hes> as a species called the northern right whale and the northern them right whale does appear to be still suffering and it may in fact be on the faster extension but but it's not being railed since nineteen eighty-six the thing is not everybody stops. Norway and Iceland dined sign up the band so they keep going and Japan does sign up but keeps going under the guise of a scientific program which is a loophole in the moratorium did their practices pose a significant challenge to these rebound in the population numbers really no because the whales VAT <hes> Japan mostly took not always but mostly took and <hes> Norway and Iceland have always taken the minke whale which is a small whale and those populations have been and remain relatively healthy. Thank you so just recently. You've got Japan saying okay. We're out. We're not going to be doing scientific whaling anymore. We're just doing commercial whaling. We're doing what what we used to do. So does that. represent a significant shift in anything other than language. Does that mean that they're going to be wiling more or is it really just semantics. Antics now they're gonNA be waiting less. They're not gonNA be whaling in the southern ocean at all because they can't under the I._W._C.. The only place they can wail without being members of the international whaling commission is in their own territorial waters. That's according to the law of the sea. It's very specific on this and I think for this year. They were targeting <hes> two hundred twenty odd <hes> whilst somewhat main key some species called bridges while and are very few who <hes> cold sales which slightly larger whales that have just come up endangered. It'll not endangered but there's a really there's a really interesting twist to this in that they the minke whale population <hes> <hes> in the area is that Japan will be mostly wailing is considered to be genetically distinct. There's been quite a bit of work done on it but quite a bit more needs to be done on that and it's not as it does not appear it to be frankly as robust as some of the other while populations so one of the perks of what has happened is that by the pressure that's been exerted on Japan may have finally given up there wailing on a robust population in the southern ocean and now going to take sales from a much less robust population in around their own shores but again they are in possession have a good deal of knowledge about how many twelve populations how many take etc and and the pressure points so it is extremely unlikely that they would put those well populations at risk from Wailing Okay so just despite all the High Japan's whaling program is broadly sustainable in your view. Yes it is as as far as we know the population levels <hes> what we don't know and and this is increasingly a problem for anything that's going on in the sea is we don't know what the compounding effects of of climate and other global changes are for example the issue pollution <hes>. The general effects of climate change which we don't fully know we think we know but we don't fully know all of these compounding effects so while the wailing itself might might be seen to be sustainable if you put aside all the other issues shoes then there are these other problems that could actually calls effects on the wealth population and I'm sure that that the Japan <hes> Japan ministry that's responsible for this is fully aware of all of that and we'll be looking at that but it isn't just a simple issue anymore. Of How many wells can you take him or not so the anti-whaling movement has always kind of been sold on of conservation grounds but in a way we've been looking at all all the wrong areas. I think it's one of the big problems that that it has been weighing has been portrayed as conservation and certainly there is no denying the fact that the well PA- globally well oh populations within severe problems as a result of of other wailing and probably <hes> and in some cases. I think we know almost certainly there. Were if not outright deception <hes> they was inadvertent misreporting of which species of whales were being taken. That's changed and that's you know we've we've gone be a man and the argument about conservation is now not a sensible one of the arguments wants that held up if they do hold up our about welfare animal welfare and about the moral and ethical position of targeting extremely made large crotches like <hes> like Wales. I think I have to call my brother now and tell him that late night while isn't as unethical as he thinks well not on ethical in exactly the way that he was imagining if the signal tonight if you would like to interview us on Apple podcast that really helps other people can find us. If you enjoy US help other people enjoy us as well back in your fade on.

Japan international whaling commissi Tokyo Iceland Norway Wales Australia Stephen Stockwell Wyoming Dick wt Kyle High Japan Moss Mark Apple adjunct professor CIA Peter Bridgwater Shimi
Science News Briefs from Around the World

60-Second Science

02:46 min | 1 year ago

Science News Briefs from Around the World

"At Toyota we believe that American veterans have the strongest credentials on earth especially when you consider that they spend years gaining valuable experience by putting their lives on the line to protect the country they love and the people that live here but that doesn't always mean finding a career path is easy. That's why Toyota has partnered with hiring our as Europe's to help over one hundred fifty thousand veterans and military spouses connect with employment opportunities. We are Toyota. USA Hi. I'm scientific American podcast editor. Steve Mirsky and here's a short piece from the September two thousand nineteen issue of the magazine in the section called advances dispatches from the frontiers of science technology and medicine. The article is titled Quick Hits. It's a rundown of some science and technology stories from around the globe compiled by editorial intern Jennifer Leeman from Hungary despite large unscaled protests from scientists about academic freedom. The country's parliament passed a law granting the government control of more than forty institutes within the Hungarian Academy of Sciences from Japan. The country has withdrawn from the International Whaling Commission and resumed commercial whaling operations after a thirty eighty one year hiatus in the first official hunt after the withdrawal to minke whales were killed for their meat from Nepal newly declassified in Cold War era. US satellite images revealed that since the year two thousand Himalayan glaciers have lost ice at twice the rate they did during the twenty five five years before two thousand from India all four reservoirs in Chennai India's six largest city have gone dry forcing more than nine million people in the region to conserve water and rely on government rations the drought was spurred by low rainfall and unregulated water use from the US officials unanimously voted to ban e cigarette sales in San Francisco the first major US city to take this step step like traditional tobacco. E cigarettes can cause lung damage disease and their uses skyrocketing in young people in two thousand eighteen one in five five. US high school students reported e cigarette use and from France grape seeds found an ancient refuse pile in the Jura mountains orrin exact genetic match with type of grape harvested there today. Meaning local winegrowers have been cultivating the same vintage for roughly nine hundred years. There's that was quick hits by Jennifer Leeman.

Toyota Jennifer Leeman USA International Whaling Commissi Steve Mirsky Europe Hungarian Academy of Sciences lung damage editor Hungary intern India San Francisco Chennai India France Nepal official thirty eighty one year twenty five five years
NPR News: 06-30-2019 2PM ET

NPR News Now

04:58 min | 1 year ago

NPR News: 06-30-2019 2PM ET

"Support for this podcast and the following message come from frame bridge. They make custom framing easy and affordable frame year. Art in photos at frame bridge dot com or visit their new stores located on fourteenth street and Bethesda row. Get fifteen percent off your first frame bridge. Order with code NPR live from NPR news in Washington. I'm Barbara Kline. President Trump met North Korean leader Kim Jong UN in the demilitarized zone today and briefly stepped over the line into North Korea. He asked me, would you like to do that? Then I said, it would be my honor and we did we went over the line and turned around at everybody was so happy. Trump is the first sitting US president to step foot in North Korea. He tweeted an invitation to meet with Kim in the demilitarized zone for a handshake yesterday. Kim accepted the invitation and the two ended up talking for an unexpected fifty minutes. They've agreed to restart nuclear talks U S peace envoy, Zalmay Khalilzad, and Taliban leaders are meeting for a second day of talks and cutter aimed at ending the war in Afghanistan and withdrawing over twenty thousand US and NATO troops. The negotiations are expected to continue for days. Secretary of state. Mike Pompeo says the US is hoping for an agreement by September, first days after a primary debate that laid bare the age divide between democratic presidential candidates. Vermont Senator Bernie Sanders is rejecting the idea of generational. Change is a factor for voters NPR's, Scott detro- has more from New Hampshire Sanders wanted to respond in Miami. When California congressman Eric swallow urged voters to pass the torch to a new generation of democratic leaders, he never got called on. But the independent Senator tells the NPR politics podcast, that age isn't everything. Look at the totality of the person. Do you trust that person? Is that person honest, you agree with that person? What is the wreckage of that person? But just the say you know, I'm gonna vote for somebody goes to the thirty five forty and I'm not gonna vote for somebody was in their seventies. I think that's a pretty superficial incident Sanders and former vice president Joe Biden are both in their seventies, as his President Trump Scott that tro, NPR news. Nashua New Hampshire in Japan ships, and their crews are preparing today for their first admittedly commercial whale hunt, and some three decades NPR's Amy held reports Japan announced last year. It was quitting the International Whaling Commission and resuming, commercial whaling, effective July. First the commission imposed a moratorium back in the eighties in a bid to restore the animals population Japan, however, skirted, the rules continuing whaling for what it called scientific purposes. Now the government is issuing commercial whale hunting permits limited to Japanese waters. Will consumption has long been a part of Japanese culture? Although in recent years, it's become less popular as a food source on Sunday. Reuters reports several whaling ships will moored at a northern Japanese port harpoon guns at the ready along their decks, Amy held NPR news. This is in PR in Sudan. Tens of thousands of pro democracy demonstrators are in the streets of the capital, Khartoum demanding an end to military rule the military overthrew. Long-ruling autocrat, O'Meara Bashir in April and was only supposed to serve as a transitional government European Union leaders are deadlocked over choosing their next top executives Teri Schultz reports from Brussels, where the twenty eight heads of state and government are trying to resolve the impasse e you leaders have been hobnobbing on the margins of the g twenty in Osaka. Trying to work out a compromise candidate to replace Jacques Claude, you. Anchor as president of the European Commission. Other positions being negotiated after Europe wide elections in may include president of the European parliament, and of the European Central Bank, all of which are informally part of a package that aims to balance political groups gender and geography, but those elections took power away from the two largest political groups, which are accustomed to being able to install their chosen candidate into the European Commission slot. Now, none of the nominees are guaranteed to be able to gather enough support. You leaders have already failed wants to come to agreement making this extra meeting necessary for NPR news. I'm Teri Schultz in Brussels in soccer, the semi finals in the women's World Cup or now. Set Sweden upset, Germany and yesterday's quarterfinal and will play the Netherlands on Wednesday the US faces England Tuesday for the right to compete in the championship July. Seventh, I'm Barbara Klein NPR news.

NPR president NPR Trump Scott Senator Bernie Sanders Kim Jong UN US frame bridge International Whaling Commissi North Korea Japan Teri Schultz Brussels European Commission Amy Mike Pompeo Barbara Kline European parliament Washington Zalmay Khalilzad
EOC 194: Bathsheba Demuth

Eyes on Conservation Podcast

47:33 min | 1 year ago

EOC 194: Bathsheba Demuth

"Welcome to the is on conservation. Podcast episode one ninety four. I'm producer Gregory. Hack before we get into today's episode. I would like to take a moment to remind you to. Please consider making a donation for our patriotic pledge at Patriot dot com slash wildlands collective. You have the chance to truly support the show in a very fundamental real world way and we're really hoping that if we meet our goal that will be able to increase the production value and the breadth and depth of the way that we analyze different topics on this podcast. We're already one of the top contenders for conservation. Podcasts that are available with some additional funding. We would be able to do incredible stuff. So I'd just like to remind you once more patriotic dot com slash wildlands collective. Your gift means all the world. Thank you if you haven't yet please consider sending us a voice note to Info at Wildlands Inc dot org super easy. Just pull up your APP on your phone you record that message and then you just go ahead and share it with an e mail correspondent Info at Wildlands Inc Dot Org. We really want to hear what you have to say and we will definitely listen to and respond to every single one of those. You're also welcome to send us a regular email to that address as well on this episode of is on Conservation I spoke with author and environmental historian Bethsheba. Demuth Demuth is an assistant professor at Brown University who specializes in the intersection between humans. Ecosystems ideas in history the work that I do as an environmental historian is broadly focused on the North American and Russian Arctic and particularly the relationships between people and animals and people in Ecosystems. More broadly over the past two hundred years or so. We talked over. Skype demuth was in fairbanks as the professor was performing research for her new book. Her first book is titled Floating Coast and Environmental History of the Bering Straits. Npr called it. A quote deeply studied deeply felt book that lays out a devastating complex history of change notes. What faces us now and dares us to imagine better in quote as we proceed and get into this interview. I will note that I spoke with Professor Demuth while she was at the university library so it can be a little loud in the background at times. It's a busy place. I can promise you however that this will be one of the most compelling and interesting accounts of the history of whaling that you had ever you look so cold yes. It's a little chilly up here. What's the what's the weather like right? Now it's actually a pretty Balmy day today. It's about twenty degrees. It was about fifty degrees colder here last week. You've you've draw the line pretty much anything around ten. Just can't do it for me of all the things that makes this whole conversation. That much more interesting demuth was actually drawn to the Arctic in her young adult life and even lived in the Yukon for two years. And yes doing all the things that you're imagining right now tracking bears hunting. Caribou FISHING SALMON. And yes even. Husky Mushin Dog sledding and no. I'm not making that up. She's that for real your your first journeys out there. If I understand right was your running dog sled yes so when I was eighteen I decided to take a gap year as we. Now call them although they weren't really called then And went to a little community north of the Arctic Circle in the Yukon territory to be a dog handler which is basically an apprentice to somebody who has a dog team and I knew nothing about sled dogs. When I moved up there I was eighteen so I thought I knew something about things but I really didn't. And that was my first introduction to the Arctic. Okay and how long you said you do that for two years. Yes do you. Do you still remember how to do it? I mean I. It's kind of like riding a bicycle except in this particular case. You're working with dogs so you can remember how to do the physical pieces of it but you also need to have a relationship with animals. You're working with so. I'm sure that if I had a team and I spent a lot of time with them would would all come back because I would be making that relationship with dogs but I'd like a bicycle. You can't just grab one and go right right. Yeah that makes sense You don't have to get to know your bike. I right I probably ended up working appear because my dad read me too much Jack London when I was a kid. So there's definitely a literary connection in there now. I could do a really poor job of basically giving it a synopsis of the Book. Or I'm sure it would be much more articulate coming from you Tell us a little bit more about the Soviet whaling And more specifically what you found so fascinating a about that topic. Yes the book that I published. Just this past fall called floating coast looks at basically the the past two hundred years or so along the Bering Strait both the Russian Arctic and in the US Arctic. It's a it's a two country history but because it's an environmental history in some ways it's a history of no country because it's looking at processes an an animals that don't really matched onto nation state borders and the the the project is kind book ended no Pun intended by could have two episodes of large scale whaling the first one being in the nineteenth century for market whalers capitalist wailers most of them coming from New England in fact some of them from where I now live in Providence. Who were coming up to kill bowhead. Whales for oil for lamp oil mostly and then the book closes with a couple of chapters about Soviet whaling in the twentieth century. Which in many ways is just the socialist analog to the to the capitalist wailing in that it is Quite excessive it kills whales far outside their capacity to to reproduce. And keep keep up with the demand and those kind of frames of the book in some ways. Show the things that I found really interesting about this part of the world as a historian. Who's interested in the ways that people's ideas influence the environments? They live in and vice versa. Which is that. It's a it's a place that has a very similar ecology on both sides of the Bering Strait. If you drop down on the peninsula or the seward Peninsula Chukchi Peninsulas in Russia and the seward Peninsula's in Alaska. He can't really tell one from the other right. And let's you know the place extremely well. Because the the flora and the fauna in geology are really comparable but of course in the twentieth century. It gets split by these two big economic ideologies that imagine each other in opposition. Which is you know. Capitalism and socialism. So it's kind of a natural experiment to see how these two ways of managing environments in some sense that the Soviet Union the United States brought with them interact with Arctic species and in the case of Wales they do it very similarly which is more or less trying to kill everywhere they possibly can ya. It's like it's kind of shocking especially when you talk about like as a concern of how many whales are being impacted or what that's doing to the ecosystem comes up that the answer kind of always came back to will. Don't worry. Technology will save us from. That will deliver a positive outcome. Okay can you elaborate on that? Yes this was one of the really interesting commonalities I found between two groups of whalers who were operating hundred years apart from each other or more and in two extremely different cultural and economic contexts is at the end of nineteenth century moby. Dick STYLE TALL SHIP. Whalers call me. Ishmael an ordinary seaman before the mast on the good ship check. What found out a man on Christmas Day of the year? Eighteen forty four on a thousand days. Voight very aware that when they entered a new population of Wales and a piece of the ocean that they hadn't been hunting in before that they would they called. Wailing it out or fishing it out that they would kill off an enormous number of the animals that were that were available locally and that they were doing this and getting further and further from home. So they're aware and using the word extinction by the end of the nineteenth century but at the same time as they're talking about extinction they're basically saying well if we put in place some technological Improvements if our ships get faster. If we're more able to navigate around the sea ice will be able to still catch these whales and there was this kind of belief that because Wales were really intelligent. And all of the whalers nudists and talk about this in detail that there were more whales. They were just shy or had gotten smart and were hiding in new places. So there's actually a couple of lines in Moby Dick Melville talks about you know the whales are just hiding behind the Arctic Sea ice and then after the Second World War the Soviet Union sort of follows the same pattern in that they have very sophisticated marine biology by that point in many ways the the research that so the marine biologist or doing is ahead of what's happening in the United States particularly when it comes to studying ways that whales are social animals and able to communicate vocally with each other They're they're way ahead of what's happening in English. Speaking Countries but at the same time as an aware that that the populations of wheels are dropping but at the same time. They're convinced that as long as they just kind of keep putting more technology online. They're going to be able to keep killing whales. But what is the logic behind that that that's the part I don't understand is that if they're they're already being removed from the ocean at such an alarming rate. Wha what is the? What was the argument? That technology would somehow fix that or prolong or allow that to continue. I think some of it came not from direct observation because the direct observation of whalers and biologists like was telling them that the whale populations were going down but it really came from a kind of faith in the leading economic doctrine of the day. I think it's something that you can see influence. Not just wailing but but other ways in which human societies make choices is that the ways that we imagine economies working also are ways that we imagine the future working and they're kind of faith statements that if we're organizing your economy the right way everything can just keep growing and growing kind of infinitely and particularly human consumption can keep growing. And I think that for both the kind of Yankee whalers in the nineteenth century in a in a slightly different way for Soviet whalers in the twentieth century there was a lot of faith put in the system in which they operated. So even if they're getting kind of direct feedback from the world that they're operating in saying you know you're killing too many whales at the end of the day it was. It was easier to imagine that that wasn't true. Yeah Yeah I can imagine. Imagine so did you. What was starkest contrast that you encountered when comparing Soviet whaling to market wailing or the capless whaling the biggest contrast? Yeah or like. What were some of the stark differences in culture around wailing? Yeah some of it is is technological that the the nineteenth century whaling is done mostly in wooden ships and is done by crews that are often gone for years at a time with very little knowledge as to whether or not they're going to earn any money at all from from the work that they're doing which is really hard and kind of nasty work often and the Soviet ships by the time they're wailing in the later part of the twentieth century in the nineteen fifties and sixties and seventies there on these very technologically sophisticated factory whaling fleets where you have sort of a central factory ship and a bunch of catcher boats that that actually do the killing of the whales and then the factory ship picks them up and pulls them to pieces and those were kind of much more comfortable places to live. They had heating and air conditioning and refrigerators than we're putting in. At sometimes. When the Soviet fleet was going to Antarctica they would stop in New Zealand places like that that were interesting in exotic so it was a different kind of social role often for the whalers between the two countries. But I think another big difference. Is that the the way. In which Soviet whaling one of the rewards of Soviet whaling for Soviet whalers was the ability to participate in the socialist system. And feel like you're really building this larger important communal world that that communism was supposed to be when the Soviet Union actually kind of brought it into into existence. And that's that's less the case every now and then I'll run into an American whaler. Who Talks about doing something for the glory of his country and they're almost all he but not so often right. They're doing it because it's a decent way to earn some money. They think when they start. They're doing it sometimes to run away from situations that are really unpleasant. But it's it's a little less tied to kind of national spirits than the the Soviet version was. Yeah did you. Do you think that that was unique? To wailing within Soviet culture or was that just Sylvia culture reflecting through whaling. I think it was. It's a little bit of both. I think that there is a way I came to really appreciate when I was doing the research for this book. The degree to which many people in the Soviet Union particularly in the early years were deeply committed to the kind of ethical principles. That were supposed to underwrite the Soviet project. The the idea that you were really going to make a world that was more equal for people One that was because it was more equal was going to allow much more freedom than people had when they were working under capitalism and of course this dream goes awry in many obvious and well-known ways but there was a sense that this was a country that was trying to build a completely new and morally superior way of life. And it's not that there aren't elements of that in the US. But I think the degree to which that project is not visited completely upon all citizens is also something that has been very clear in the US for a long time partly because of the history of enslaving people partly because of the history of expropriating land from indigenous people and that the Soviet Union was attempting to transcend all of those systems in a way that people really believed at the beginning and in in some ways the whalers were holdouts in that they believed in somewhat longer than than other folks did it. Sounds like Maybe some part of that at least had to do with the the way whalers were very well compensated within Soviet Russia. Do you think that was the case at all or that was one of those reasons that it may be held onto that spirit a little bit longer than maybe some other Types of worker or lines of labor. I think so one of the the wailers that I quote in the book. Actually you know he in his in his memoirs after the Soviet Union has collapsed. Someone asks him you know. Why did you keep wailing? And he said well you know it was communism like actually existed on those whale ships because people were well paid it was wailing. You know if you're a small human being trying to kill a whale even if you have a lot of technology. It's almost automatically communal endeavor. You have to work with a bunch of other people so it kind of lent itself very nicely to Vladimir Lenin's ideas about what works should be that it should be something that you do with others for the uplift of everyone and you know wailers tended to be really well Fed compared to other folks in the Soviet Union and had lots more consumer opportunities because of ports that they were visiting so I think in in many ways it did look more like the socialist dream than if you were working in a factory somewhere just in central Russia or something like that right. Okay Yeah I can imagine I mean because the way you you describe it really is a lot of glory to be that person in fact you say that the person who actually ran the Harpoon gun really had like a huge plan that are really had more of like a hero status among even though the ship right. Yeah you could win win medals and be on the front page of the national newspaper. No Yeah Yeah that's interesting. Can you speak a little bit more to how the Soviet plan involved wailing like why? Why Wailing What you do talk about the crisis of calories during World War Two but was there other than other factors that allowed wailing to really take off the waited so this question is one that that really haunted me as I was reading the book. An in some ways I don't fully satisfactorily answered it in part because I think a lot of the the real answers is where you know folks who are high up in the Soviet political system would answer. These questions are are classified Or or labeled in somewhere that I have not been able to find them and in part that's because the Soviet whaling program at some point after the Second World War and after the founding of the International Whaling Commission Starts Wailing essentially illegally it starts breaking its its quota with the international whaling commission and so that the whole program becomes somewhat administered by the KGB is somewhat secret so there. There are files about this. That I know that I haven't seen and probably will never see that. Get into some of the nitty gritty of this. But the things that I can kind of put together from the files that I have been able to to look at I think. One of the appeals of whaling. Was that it was a place. Where by the sixties and seventies as the Soviet economy is starting to slow down and not look as robust in comparison to economies in the West. It's a place where they really are. Ascendant they're good at wailing their whaling more than than Western countries and so it kind of enables a sort of national pride about besting besting the capitalist at their own game in many ways because wailing had not been a Russian activity really until the nineteen thirties. So I think that's some of the motivation. I think for some of the whalers who are in the Pacific in particular it actually is associated with the really long history of Americans wailing in Russian waters. And that it's almost a way of taking back what folks who grew up in the Far East size having been robbed from them. So the the Yankee whalers who were often wailing in Russian imperial territorial waters were gone by that point in America wasn't wailing at all but it was a way of kind of taking over the space that had been so firmly capitalist. I think that's part of it and I think it was also a place where you know. The kind of ecological impacts of wailing were not something that's Soviet citizens have to deal with directly and this is an era when the Soviet Union is really starting to grapple with what it means to live in an advanced Industrial Society. Where you don't move the worst and dirtiest parts of industry into other countries so in the sixties and seventies just as the United States is passing the Clean Air Act the clean water act and really starting to regulate industrial production. It's also moving a lot of the really environmentally dangerous industry to Southeast Asia. China other places around the world and the Soviet Union doesn't do that so most of their industrial dirt is at home essentially and wailing where they can sort of do it without having to deal with the repercussions and of course that that is very much conjecture on my part as a historian because I don't have a document that says you know the great because we don't have to deal with the fact that this is really changing ecosystems the world over but it must have been nice to have an industry where that was not becoming a pressing concern and wasn't causing citizens to be concerned about the world that they were living in as was increasingly happening by the seventies and eighties. That yeah that's a really interesting way to look at it that I hadn't never crossed my mind before but like really A detachment from the the bad byproducts or the terrible culture subculture that decorates you talk about the Alien Nation of Labor. I don't know if I don't know. Is there anything you'd like to talk about the alienated of Labor or anything? You'd like to speak to on that behalf. I think we kind of answered some of that But maybe not in those terms. Yeah I think one of the things I found. There's a lot of ironies often when you write about the Soviet Union and I think one of the ones I found the most. Poignant in this book is that you know the whole idea behind creating the Soviet Union was to transcend this alien nation of labor. The fact that when you do work you're not doing it on your own terms that the the value of your labor is taken by someone else for the most part and you're not able to decide the kind of work that you WANNA do. These are the conditions of capitalism that Marx critiqued in that Lennon said the Soviet Union is going to overcome them. And you know the the Soviet whalers there's this aspect in which they are national heroes and are earning great salaries. But there's also this undercurrent in a lot of their memoirs and accounts and log books and things like that that they are also really disturbed by the kind of work. They're doing because they are killing these large animals with with which they become very familiar. They learned that they are social beings that they are relating to each other that they try to protect each other when they're under threat. That mother whales will go to enormous lengths to try to protect their infants. And so they're you know they're disturbed. They find the work difficult. There's kind of a a moral wound aspect to to what they're doing is alienating and doesn't have any space in the kind official. Soviet doctrine to be expressed right. It's kind of under the surface of all the hair amend the production so deeply alienating and it's you know there's the sort of sad irony that the state that set itself up for exactly. The purpose of getting rid of that kind of alien nation was so focused on production for human purposes that it ignored the places where the people kind of on the frontlines of that production were actually having experiences. That might have caused them to draw back and say you know we shouldn't be doing this will Yan The comment you make from one of the whalers that it's a good thing that whales don't scream because I couldn't do this work how. How does what was that quote? Yeah he said something. I'd have to to read it directly but it was something along the lines of you know if if Wales screamed it would have been impossible to carry on Because you know the it was bad enough as it was but if there had been an auditory piece to it wouldn't unbearable. Yeah Yeah. That's that's a pretty chilling quote. Now you've had a chance you've gone to Russia to look at some of these archives and dig through some of this information you've unearthed and and looked at materials that haven't surfaced probably in decades and decades certainly things they haven't been seen since the fall of the Soviet Union relating back and discussing Some of the ledgers the different ledgers. That were held by some of these ships Regarding counts What were some of them are shocking things that you found in some ways that you you personally uncovered that you saw the if not the KGB at least the the government of the Soviet Union had tried to cover up. Is there anything that you can point to specifically the part of what I found shocking about it? And in some ways. I'm not the only researcher to have uncovered this that. There's there's other folks who were kind of simultaneously working on this Soviet whaling question and what the scale of it was was part of what I found shocking was just how many Wales they killed in excess of the International Whaling Commission rules and the International Whaling Commission. Rules were essentially standard set by the industry. So these were not conservative estimates about how many whales could be killed and there were a lot of discussions within the international whaling commission by biologists about the fact that the the whale quotas were too high but if they were lowered too much fear was that everyone would leave the. Wc In there would be no control at all. So it's kind of that classic you know. How do you get a bunch of people to to to manage themselves? If there's not actually some sort of outside pressure and so the union just sort of ignored the quotas and falsified their records pretty pretty freely in order to to keep killing whales in excess. And that was you know there was just something so calculated about that piece of it. It wasn't sort of. We accidentally sleet into killing more whales. You had to keep another set of logbooks you had to make sure that the KGB were handing the right set of books to the to the international whaling commission versus the ones that that ended up in an archive inviting Bostock. So that was that was really kind of a surprise and it was surprising in part. Because it's not. This wasn't kind of universally the case with Soviet environmental policy like more or less simultaneously with the whaling program ramping up the Soviet Union is is actually signing onto and helping to develop protections for polar bears for Pacific walruses for Atlantic walruses. Kind of other marine species in particular. So it's not. It's not a unilateral thing. It's kind of a particular one that I found surprising. We want to hear from you. We make these shows because we're passionate about the subject matter. We care about what happens to these animals. We care about what happens to these ecosystems. What happens to the planet and each other too? But we know that you do too we also make these shows because of you the eyes on conservation. Podcast truly is about connecting all of us. I think she's talking to you so the next time you hear something that makes you laugh out loud or make you cry. Has You questioned the world a little bit or just makes you go Let us know we want to include your voice in your thoughts on future episodes. Here's how take out your smartphone. An open the recording APP on it on an iphone. It's called voice memos on an android you can download smart voice recorder or something similar. Hit the record button and hold the phone just like you would if you were talking to us on the other end or hold it about four inches from your face. Just don't get too close to the MIC. You'll notes recording because the wave form will start dance around and the timer will start ticking. Here's the good part. Tell us whatever you want to tell us. Tell us who you are what you do all day. What your story is the point. Is We want to hear you when you hit. Stop Save the file with something descriptive like your name and date then opened file right there on the same APP and look for Little Square with an Arrow poking out the top. This is how you share the file from there. You can select the email APP on your device. And if there's something specific you want to to us about just jot a little note down forced then e mail it to Info at wildlands INC dot org boom. It's that easy look comes one now. Does that Matt Gregory Hat on? Just the most charming math pallor. Shucks thank you kind lady we hope to hear from UCLA when was the WC formed and who consisted of its governing members. So the I. W. C. is formed right after the Second World War and it has the. Us is part of it and Norway. Great Britain the Soviet Union kind of shows up unexpectedly at the meeting because they have decided that they're going to become a major whaling company or country. And there's several other countries involves a as they get in and out of commercial whaling over the course of the twentieth century and the goal is really to try to prevent what had happened during the nineteenth century wailing boom and what was already coming to pass. Since the advent of modern whaling factory ships in the nineteen twenties Norway had really been at the forefront of these these factory ships in the neighbor picked up by a number of other countries to the point where you know if you had margarine as a kid when you were in Britain in the nineteen thirties and forties. You were probably eating whale fat. It was a pretty regular piece of of feeding some of those countries but the the conclusion basically was that these industries were going to wail themselves out of business and the United States was involved because essentially coming out of the Second World War. They were a world power And also because there was a recognition on the part of the United States that part of the the cause of the Second World War came from countries being impoverished and wanting to prevent that and using Wales and kind of the the correct management of whales as a way to to help feed countries that were recovering from the Second World War but did not hunt in such excess that there was a danger of slipping back into some sort of impoverishment and that that was part of a much broader policy in Japan and in Western Europe where they were sort of assisting with rebuilding efforts to the Marshall Plan and from the very beginning it was a it. Has these kind of national delegates but the the national delegates in basically every case except for the United States which has no whaling industry were pretty fully captured by the various national industries so Norway with coming to try to get the quota to be as large as possible for Norwegian whalers and Great Britain was coming trying to get the quota as large as possible for British whalers in Japan was coming trying to get the quota largest possible for Japan. And that that's part of what kind of forces the the estimates of Wales kind of above what? Many biologists at the time was sustainable. In in as you say to Certainly not something. I really was aware of how many different products maybe not by today. But but by the fifties sixties how many different products actually have whale biproduct in them. You Margarine as you said. I think I also heard you say automotive lube. Yeah what are what are their products? Can you think of? It was in a lot of cosmetics. So actually the what is now the big kind of homegoods conglomerate. Unilever started off as a Wailing Company and whale fat was used in soap and lipstick and face cream and things like that so it kind of works its way into all kinds of consumer markets and even in the US after the after the Second World War. It's often dog food and in transmission oil. So there's actually you can go in the New York Times website and use their their kind of archive function. If you search for whale oil you'll see some op-eds from the nineteen seventies from automakers in Detroit who are really worried about the The Marine Mammal Protection Act which is going to ban the use of whale products imported from abroad in the US. And whether they're going to do about their transmissions because that's making people's cars go and it was used to lubricate Intercontinental ballistic missiles particularly the oil. That's in the heads of sperm whales. That's called spring because it has extremely low friction so the it had kind of bizarre set of uses well into the twentieth century killing whales and making bombs out of them. That's bizarre really young star in terms of the the research that you and other researchers Had done on the scene in in In Russia can you think of an anecdote or a day or a specific time where something happened or something That you uncovered. That really shocked you. I think some of it was actually more cumulative than it. Was You know here? Is this this one moment where it all it all crystallizes realizing just the scale the scale of the whaling program to begin with and the scale of the knowledge about the damage? It was doing it. Wasn't you know it's one thing to run into an industry and be reading through their reports and have a sense that they're really oblivious to kind of what what it is that they're doing and then it's another thing to run into an industry where it's quite clear from what people are talking about pretty openly that they're aware that the numbers of whales in the Pacific and off Antarctica are in decline? And that they're not going to be able to keep going back to the same places over and over again and still make the Soviet plan work and so that the level of self awareness combined with the kind of continuation to do it. I think that was the most haunting thing about it for me. Because that's the thing it was shocking but it was also not shocking because it made me think about the ways in which we're all capable of doing that to various degrees that continue to participate in something even if you know that it is in some way doing exactly the opposite of what in an ideal world you would be part of and that that was much more. Just sort of cumulative sense from spending time in these archives in watching it watching it build up so the International Whaling Commission is is formed. I'm sorry did you say post World War? Two or in the fifties nineteen forty eight. I think it's formed then and the. Ussr comes and joins kind of. Sounds like everybody's surprise shows up wants to have a stake in. This commission does In all these despite all these best efforts to try to curb wailing in it or at least to do it in a responsible and sustainable manner still leads to an eighties ban on all whaling. Is that right yes? How's that possible? Did the did the whaling commission not have Enough power they have control. Or what do you attribute to that? So I think by the nineteen eighty s and this is this is kind of a funny point as a historian where it starts to overlap with the thing that I lived through and I remember being like a very eager waiver of save the whales banners as a kid that by the nineteen eighties the sense that Wales globally were were in peril had become so cute and the major western whaling companies had left the industry and most of them left by the nineteen sixties because they found cheaper ways of getting fat so they moved to palm oil they moved to soy then moved to other kinds of of ways of producing large quantities of lipids So industry opposition to whaling has gone down and the real holdouts at this point or Japan and the Soviet Union and the global awareness. That whales are imperilled has gone up. It's gone up particularly in the United States and Western Europe with a real surge in publicity around. Wales are so this is the point at which you can buy a record that has humpback whale songs on it. There's all sorts of wheel themed media all over the place so people kind of know Wales in a different way. They're not consuming them or they're not consuming them informs that are visible except as you know charismatic mega-fauna that are beautiful and intelligent and kind of known for a different different set of attributes. So I think the combination of the real crisis of whales in the world and at that point the kind of combination of Soviet whaling and capitalist Wailing in the twentieth century his killed three million Wales Globally Wa combines. We're kind of you. Global upsurge in in understanding of whales in a really different way and so this leads to the complete ban which includes indigenous wailing as well as kind of mass commercial whaling in the nineteen eighties. Won this international cooperation around. Saving the whale leads to some unlikely marriages. It sounds like a describe the relationship between Greenpeace and the Pentagon at this time yet. That was that was a really surprising thing. I it's very strange. Doesn't make a lot of sense. 'cause Greenpeace gets it. Start as an anti-nuclear outfits and that it's it's when they discover the the way in which sperm oil is used Intercontinental ballistic missiles that they decide to to kind of turn their attention to Wales. So they start very much. It's kind of a a against the Military Industrial Complex Organization and then end up taking coordinates of where Soviet whaling vessels were and they would wail at that point. They were often whaling right off of US territorial waters and California and sometimes in Alaska and they would get those coordinates from the Pentagon and the Pentagon assumed at this point at the Soviet whaling program was actually just a spy front and that they were hanging out you know they were wailing pretense essentially despite in the US so it it was a very strange marriage of interests that the the Pentagon would like this Soviet whaling ships driven away and the Greenpeace activists wanted to to know where the worship were in order to get between the whalers and the whales that they were killing. Yeah it's like this VIN diagram to giant giant circles. And just this tiny little sliver of overlap. It's bizarre very bizarre. Yeah during during that that international whaling ban you even said that indigenous communities. That have been doing this for ages and ages. Nature's no longer allowed to do that It feels like when we have these conversations. It's really easy to talk about You know what capitalist Structures did what you know. communist-run But what has been the overall or the lasting impact on indigenous societies because of this obsession and pretty much unhealthy reliance on whaling has has had. It's had a couple of different impacts there. There were very kind of acute impacts particularly with the nineteenth century commercial whaling for indigenous folks living all around the bering strait because so many bowhead whales which are the species that have been critical to And Yupik and Shuki Societies for thousands of years now that particular population was drawn down from somewhere between twenty and thirty thousand animals to about three thousand so the ability for these communities to hunt the whales that they depended on went way way down and this coincided with a bunch of other population crashes and cutting pressures coming in from the outside in the eighteen. Eighties caused real waves of starvation and often that combined with diseases that were imported by outside wailers so some community has lost fifty or seventy percent of their populations within a decade or two so really just kind of massive If you can imagine losing fifty percent of the people that you know within a decade and so that was kind of the acute shock that that wailing brought in but obviously it was the beginning of much longer kind of trajectory of both the United States and Russia paying attention to the land that it had claimed to around the Bering Strait so in the wake of the whalers in different ways on the on the Russian in US sides come state structures new legal orders. Compulsory schooling kind of all of the things that you associate with A nation trying to kind of turn people who had their own systems of governance and rearing their children and languages and everything else and making them into citizens like everybody else so kind of radical processes of assimilation and so the Communities have have gone through both the kind of acute. And then these. Kind of more protracted processes of colonization over the last hundred fifty years and in many ways. Wales have remained a real place to practice. Yupik a Nubia on Shuki culture outside of those pressures To kind of continue and hold the space for you know being Yupik or being Shuki outside of whatever the state is trying to come in and change the way of your life so this ban on on wailing in the nineteen eighties was was really quite severe for for these communities because it wasn't just sort of demanding people not eat whale so taking away a real form of food but also was cutting off a real cultural tie. The whole story is really overwhelming and the impacts are astounding any idea. What kind of like long term impact all of this is going to have just on planet earth or the ecosystem? Yeah this is a place where I think some of the kind of marine biology around Wales and what. They do is really fascinating. Because Wales have such a Some some marine biologists call them ecosystem engineers because of the way in which their presence in a particular ecosystem is so impactful and so the oceans that you and I grew up knowing are in some ways impoverished because they have never had the number of whales that they would have you know three hundred years ago or two hundred years ago even and certainly not four hundred years ago that we're we're operating way under the norm for CETACEAN populations worldwide and they do all sorts of things from they move nutrients from the the ocean floor up the water column and because they do that they actually make photosynthetic life more abundant because they have more access to iron and phosphorus and nitrogen that comes from the seafloor and there was a recent work has been done about the ways in which whale species because they are so huge. Actually sequester carbon. 'cause they build these sort of giant bodies over you know in the case of bowhead whales. They live for a couple of hundred years and then when they die they fall to the sea floor and take all that carbon with them in essentially take it out of circulation so that commercial whaling does exactly the opposite of that right. It takes the carbon out of the ocean and puts it into atmospheric circulation rather than sequestering it so having an ocean with more whales in it and trying to somehow recoup that three million animals that were killed over the course of the twentieth century would have all sorts of impacts on the on the oceans that that are around us and the and the good news is I mean there's there's such plentiful bad news in the environmental realms but some wheels species are actually doing really quite well and bowhead. Whales are one of them. I'll take it yeah. It can be bleak healthcare for all of it all take it. I'll take what I can get was. That's a positive note. Maybe maybe we'll leave it right there. Bethsheba is is there anything else that you want to add to this anything that I haven't asked you that you're you're dying to let listeners know about Or or anything along those lines. I don't think so. These were really great questions though. That was all on accident. So how can people reach you? You can find me all over the Internet's my handle on twitter is at biard demuth. That's also my website and my instagram. If you want lots of photos of Alaska that's all that's on my instagram. These days and my book is called. Floating coast an environmental history of the Bering Strait. And it is a history but it's also written for everybody so it's not a super technical helpfully. There's there's lots of interesting narrative in their kind of regardless of what your your usual history. Reading Diet is awesome. Awesome Bethsheba Demuth. Thank you so much for making time for conservation today. I really appreciate. Its and I wish you all the best in the launch of this next book thank you. I appreciate it to your best wishes end. Try to stay warm. Yes I will all right. Talk to you later. Okay I you've been listening to the is on conservation. Podcast SPECIAL THANKS TO SHEBA. Demuth for taking the time to share with us about her experiences and research from her book coast and recounting her findings around Soviet whaling in the Bering Straits for information about professor to visit her website at www dot b. or demuth dot com and for some seriously stunning images from the Arctic. Check out her instagram. Also at birth. And she's also on twitter at biard demuth for full list of this episode's links and contributors including music used in this show. Please visit the show notes page at. Www DOT wildlands inc dot org slash EEOC. One nine four. I'm Gregory Haddock reminding you. There is no planet beat. Take Care

Soviet Union United States Wales international whaling commissi Bering Straits Russia Professor Demuth Arctic Environmental History Soviet Russia Alaska Ussr Wildlands Inc KGB Wildlands Inc Dot Org Matt Gregory Hat Npr professor Patriot dot
Weekend Edn: Julia Roberts fell for Mahjong went viral in China

World News Analysis

53:25 min | 1 year ago

Weekend Edn: Julia Roberts fell for Mahjong went viral in China

"Today provide you with indepth news and expert analysis tell the story in the news you want to know welcome to today a news program from a different perspective on you're headed the good anna coming up this weekend edition japan resume commercial whaling after thirty years julia roberts fell far maggio went to my wrote in china people get creative way the shanghai garbage regulation in parts of filial stories bring more intimidation that is gration to the public to hear this episode again or to catch up on previous episodes please download our podcast it by surging wrote today or find us on easy fm or china plus in your app store today in the studio we have harming voting senior fellow at the center for china anna globalization and my colleague mulling cr ice english commentator welcome thank you saw japan reviewed a commercial whale hunting all these monday after more than three decades less than a day after east withdraw from the international whaling commission came into effect to pass decision to leave wc has drawn widespread condemnation around the road but japan's of fishery agency said he has a cap on numbers this year's coda for the commercial whaling is two hundred and twenty seven japan has refrained from commercial whaling since nineteen eighty eight all the weli has continued willing first scientific research in the north pacific an antarctic although some people suspected it was commercial whaling in disguise as well which showed on the market in september two thousand king japan's submitted a proposal at w c four resuming commercial whaling which was turned down any any meeting in december japanese government announced his decision to withdraw from the commission japanese prime minister shinzo obey said in two thousand eighteen he is determined to explore every possibility to resume commercial whaling addy earliest the date why do you think he's king to revive well hunting was the significance of the well hunting to japan party i think it boils down to one word votes the v a prime minister is a has an election coming up in upper house of the parliament which is called the diet and he wants to look very strong a lot of the support of his party are these unrepentant a right wing militarist who are upset that japan lost world war two and the the old way of life is vanished and wailing is part of that life so they may not be able to win a world war two but they may be able to win the war against wales and so that's why i think they've taken this aggressive stand just revoked i agree that to a certain extent he's using a people's nostalgia and you're right they owed a way of life and to get votes but i don't think the majority of the japanese are not really much very much into will meet now button having said that a friend of mine told me that if you go to japan in the supermarket it's very easy to get will meet you're curious enough to have a taste of that having said that there's another reason if it's not strong enough then then you know winning the votes it should be you know he is a well me loves us himself roller i don't think there's that many of them man because i believe in the intervening years a lot of the japanese people are very environmentally conscious they've been through a lot they had the atomic bomb a they've had a hooker shimon nuclear disaster they've had natural disasters with the weather and i believe that they now see wales is just fellow travelers on are earth and so i think the japanese people are much more attuned to these kind of environmental issues and while it's easy to be a tree hugger it's not so easy to be a whale hugger but biden wales deserve to be hug there mammals they're intelligent man we all we the world almost fish them to to extinction and so the whole purpose of this the international whaling commission is to bring back wales so the population can be self sustaining when they're unprotected tolsey meat is also also available in the japanese supermarkets this is just another thing you have these are the smarts you know intelligent animals it's like friends right there assistant animal communication bills get human being it actually early demographer will has been stagnant for more than a decade at roughly five thousand pounds a year about forty grams per person the year that's about a weight of have an apple right but that's a good yeah but the thing is the japanese politicians they're using these kids that willing he's a japanese tradition so do you have any background information about their traditions hearty well they you know they're fishing nation there and island nation so they they ate wales and used whale oil will fat for a long time but that's another year another age with another sensitivity and a a the japanese have moved on from a kind of dependence at one point now to being more modern more logical and i think it's a great sign but i do think there's this political layer that's their among certain people there the way leaders not not not the kids you see who were in hip closing downtown tokyo no let's talk about tradition tradition becomes tradition because people are fighting for survival when we leave or in the scarcity of food you know icelanders right people and then northern they kind of be eskimos they don't know the things you've emma's 'em kendall oil burning oil light and also to gain a protest yes end the scheme to keep warms all these but we have already surpassed that period of time you know we have been domesticating a lot of animals for the meat supply for the proteins apply so when you talk about the protein supply and talk about nutrition nutrition talk about tradition it's really obselete already only that i call us nostalgic because traditions of your identity so these things are the hardest a full a group of people before their ethnicity to cost you know to say goodbye because that's our logo that's our labor and this is our first look at all the comments the japanese people are making our territory our policy our wales and we are hunting you know why why should we listen to other people other countries to tell us stop doing something but then there are other arguments said wells is a migrant children not burns animal animals it's not it's not you know actually pushing them to the extinction right compared to they thinking of well is it really worth of keeping in passing on their traditions hearty well i think you look at tradition against the the fact that there may be an extinction of certain kinds of wales the tradition is not as important especially when you look at the consumption the figure that you gave is miniscule when you look at it so that means there's there's a handful of people people who are eating whale meat so if it was ever a tradition and it was a tradition now it's a tradition among very very few nazi people then is it worth it is it worth it to to lose this bio diversity and also this is a near the top of the food chain in it's a mad huge mammals is it worth losing bio diversity just to satisfy the hunger of of a few people whether they're hungry for whale meat or for tradition it's wrong yeah you know i have to be a little bit extreme human beings evolved we have being cussing away the old traditional traditions and picking up new ones in you know forming new habits of lifestyle for example if i say that in the good times when we were still in the forest and we used this film delays right we we don't have all the tools so shall we go back and you systems laced cutting meet all you go in progress that's called evolution so when you know that we are actually pushing the wildlife so all of them all of them into the verge of extinction i used to you willing to consume you're no longer hungry i you know i think still the bottom line is at the end of the day this is a political decision because this exemption for scientific research in wales was really the slippery slope because i think the kind of research that was done by japan and japan did kill a lot of wales under this exemption that was not about saving the whale or making them genetically stronger whatever the variables are i think it was about having whale meat and deciding which soy sauce or a which kind of preparation made the whales better so to me this is not relevant research that they i wc ended legal under peeling paintings were designed to address so in one sense the japanese are being more legally pure by changing this to the whales only within their territorial waters and they're also exclusive economic zone but like you pointed out the whales don't stay within later or the bone regarding their their free animals knows no boundaries and no rationality animals belongs to the whole world right and also her you mentioned about and he's a political move and we know that's the decision they made looting supporting all they're willing nations including norway in iceland where a willer have cut back on catches in recent years a major criticism in commercial show hounds because they are bad for their national inmate gentry them do you see any seemingly worries the from japan if it is a political decision should see japanese government is think about their major they should but the japanese government has many faces and many constituencies so there are several constituencies the people who fish or hunting whales is one of them that supports this wailing and then these old fashion people for whom this was a tradition and also don't wanna be pushed around by the international community those or others have to balance all that off but i think the bottom line still is about politics that a prime minister avi wants to not only get a more control of upper house of parliament he wants to you know you can't throw a bone whales have bones you're there you can throw away all bone to the whole population would you could throw some bones to the population that supports this and that's probably a very old and very cranky and very established a group of these militarist this the same ones that created so many atrocities against china and against america and other countries in world war two international images not that important for japanese politicians i think so this one that i'm withdrawing from the organization and i'm going to you know do it my way yeah in my way by the way a scientific sitter wailing in my eyes used to be the same sort of commercial equals to the commercial waiting because there's not much meat is needed for the scientific study and it must be put to other the eu's but this one you know by by doing such a thing you say hey i don't want to be seen as a liar animal you know i am doing what i'm doing you know this is like a statement made by the japanese polish fishing why can't you do i think a lot of this comes from japan's heritage as for hundreds of years being a closed country country they purposely wall itself off from the rest of the world and was basically pried open by commodore perry in the eighteen fifties because before that japan was closed and it was really dragged kicking and screaming into the international arena but i think they maintain this kind of old world view and i think because of that like whales they have six skins and so i think that it's kind of like public opinion per certain people in japan be damned mm thanks harvey and irma lean just now we've been talking about japan's commercial whaling coming up julia roberts fell from my jones went viral in china state way the new book you know i'm dorothy see first secretary of the embassy of to let the china it's been a no not taking part on george troll i'm telling you about the relationship between julia trying wishing you all the best welcome back you're listening to the weekend edition of today i'm gonna wait mulling over english commentator end harvey voting senior fellow at the center for china and globalization mahjong uptown game originated in china over thousands years ago is becoming a hit in new york city with the rules is simply fight for america's magellan looks sort of like domino but a place like a card game dear is to accumulate like sense either by joined the right tone or taking it from another player the game with this six biggest export from china in the nineteen twenties and has played an important role in v in reaching of morton american culture we simply a video of interview with julia roberts the famous famous hollywood movie start discussing how americans love the game went viral on chinese social media so harvey as an american telling us more about how popular if my johnny united states will you know ice a poster once that said that mahjong was a game that was played by confucius two thousand years ago i believe that it became popular in the twentieth century in america in chinatowns first because it was a a chinese tradition also would i found we've we've talked about this on this program before the affinity for jewish people and chinese and this is another one mahjong is definitely eight sinoe jewish things some say sinoe jewish bridge because jewish people have taken up mahjong with a vengeance and why have they taken it up because like chinese people in the late nineteenth and early twentieth century jewish people were looked down on were discriminated against as were chinese so in many ways both of are people all were looked at is almost subhuman end so i believe that we turned inward into are group's for social communication enjoyment and cooperation because interesting thing about mahjong is it's not a zero sum game it's a game that requires or an art art form it requires cooperation by team members in order to win in order to bring order is julia roberts had to bring order from chaos and so i believe that something the ties us together and it's something that got us through a very difficult period end for both jews an for chinese these people in america when we made a lot of money in started moving out of the central cities to the suburbs these impersonal suburbs where a few people knew each other and so on that mahjong for both groups who's really in a way racist and a waste is for people to get together and to cooperate and have fun and work together and i think it was a salvation for both the chinese people and for jewish people who move to these kind of antiseptic suburbs and it's not unusual to find people who played mahjong for thirty or forty years if you talk about china's soft power mirage definitely a huge part of chinese soft power at least the jewish people tell me whether julia roberts is a jewish lady i'm wondering if i i don't know do you know as the hari said as much influence not only rich people that also other groups but we play this game all the time we okay so and so jewish or or not and then we also play the game is that good for the jews are bad name not tell you why because at this point also struck me as it's the most interesting because the jewish community in the chinese community claim they they love macho most right although we can't include some other people from other groups right but why i think it's because i think we may in shanghai in the thirties and forties we we actually provided 'em yeah you you arrest that you gave robot yeah yeah then because they have to leave in in closed in a dangerous situation and maybe this isn't that you would social like a two things i am impressed the julia roberts was a seeing that you seek older right from chaos this is the wisdom right there there is that the lady who is the margin had whatever clash john lee angie america said i'm buying escape with the social interaction macho is the thing that i don't want to be merging with the greater society there's some people that don't i want escape but then de human nature of us is that we are social animals we still need to friendship love everything so this seems to me that kind of fulfill exclusive lifestyle you know how do you see hermit lifestyle we be only to the loved ones or the like mindedness people at the same time we enjoy friendship lasting friendship macho is like you need to be a smart and unique to be good at calculating mhm money in there and i bring in a yeah in brain thing and communication cooperation but one thing out of the commonality of the jewish between chinese is that i think some people cannot have fun without money so they are playing with money itself put a very small sum of money it has to put money in it to have fun to increase from you know me and my friend way putu humiliation units because we don't know about you lose that game any we will look like a slice of paper already faced in the waffle lost a demotion will like go out and have a tour oh i mean i'm or a cruel on the floor sometimes the reason that you continue just crawl you'll find some chinese if you las affi in it too when you're playing well i think it is the order from chaos thing chinese society in jewish society and many others for that matter have had a lot of chaos in their ancient and sometimes more recent history so mahjong is an attempt tempt to bring order from the chaos and i think that's very important and i think mahjong it's a game it's almost a religion for some people but it's a game that helps you sharpens certain skills that enable you to liv a better more fulfilling life and again i think it's a a chinese culture ends a chinese soft power writ large to the people who perform it so now were in a trade war but i i bet you of i did a survey of people who play mahjong there'll be more favorable americans there'll be more favorable to china than the general population power you're talking about suggests the negotiators starkly mahjong first phone call very good my philosophy chinese philosophy i can see from this margin game is a balance because we are a nation our philosophy if he's always trying to seek a balance between everything what is the balance the balance is that no one wins forever in the macho no a turn a winner you know sometimes you wing sometimes me weighing in sometimes we wings wings and we're talking about the second is that brain is important skill is important but luck is also very important so it's a balance of everything this actually mahjong tells me that is quite like ing andrea yes annual mind in their young yes yeah include telling us more about chinese people devotion to the maggio how much do i love my jail in china well i think we love to the extent that it's going to be a social problem alrighty in a in a sometimes i visited my relatives in suburban shanghai and some of them like fucking brother in law you know these they just eat sleep in after all this kind of routine thing they go back and devotes every minute of their life too much this actually put us worrying definitely think god when i go deeper into whether they borrowed you know sometimes sometimes it's addiction that is going to bring bankruptcy thank god that these people have on you know controlled it to the limit that they're not borrowing money from other is not an addiction get it but it's almost that margin is if you treated as and it's entertainment team and as a game without gambling that is so healthy there are people who are talking about the elderly people right they lost some of their of their mobility so they play cards and pay my gym so besides that sedentary lifestyle everything about margin is a nice thing a lot of laughter in fact he my family i remember during these spring festival we play much you always all were a senior relatives because he helps them to keep their mind shark yes end also make them to just llerena middle lanes you just six rain stimulation socializing laughing and then generation gap is narrowing because there is my parents were already very feeble but then on such occasions you know the youngest like ten year old joined the cart playing it's almost at the scene because you really need this bond funding very good thing in america actually it's also a status symbol to play mahjong there's in new york for example a very high level mahjong club and you can't just be anybody to get in there and play you have to be like a captain of industry or somebody who's well known in order to joined the club so in terms of social status mahjong is has a very high status in america and yeah i do agree that mahjong maybe one of the bridges that helps helps us get over this a train or you know i try to search very hard for the westerners the especially americans do you have similar like majid maybe playing bridge is one of them this letter other hobbies bees and the indoor games for the americans they go to the gym they go to you know all these sort of things and billy is playing these are all competitive fighting a rivalry too much you wanna watch hostility in one oh one but this one is a kind of you know i cannot leave without you you cannot leave without me this is another philosophy so from macho we can learn a lot of things actually we actually into dependent on each other i either it's an economy meal in survival in environmental protection in everything actually indeed sang smelling ziara english commentator ann harvey voting senior fellow at the center for china and globalization were just talking about my g l a heated to united states and japan commercial whaling after the break people get creative way the shanghai garbage regulation and the park is a field story spring more intimidation that inspiration to the public you are listening now it's our weekly edition of today we to the weekend edition of today on ghana and i'm joined in studio by harvey voting senior fellow at the center for china anna globalization animal links pr ice english commentator starting july the first shanghai has begun to enforcing is the first a regulation on domestic a waste management joining other large chinese cities piloting a shift to make garbage classification compulsory instead of voluntary the regulation requires people to search trash into four categories dry garbage garbage or kitchen waste recyclables in hazardous waste india mediums who fell to do so may be fined up to two hundred one that's about thirty usa dollars well company sunday institutions face fines of up to fifteen thousand do end that's about seven thousand u s dollars now garbage has become hottest topics things all kind of services jokes and even songs about it emerging spreading like crazy on chinese social media i have to give credit to are people we could always find sweet from bitterness and it makes it very hard right so milling telling us more about v garbage being craze in shanghai your hometown right what are the highlights of the new regulation i think is so complicated like you said how much pain we are suffering then how much fun we are bringing it in making the main to jokes you know you know it's something sonia an everyday i would send pictures and the drugs from from there it's really a headache to people and a long queues in the community people carrying a garbage in my inlaws over there telling me that even if they thought it carefully in the kitchen already bring this to the garbage station and they still need to sort it again because not up to standard and this very strict there if you're not properly sold at garbage of was not properly sorted the garbage collectors refused to collect them and now they mobilized volunteers in every neighborhood and i tried to do the volunteer jobs but then there are closed out they said please you know put your heart into doing it because we don't have enough volunteers because they're retired people when they so it's something people are not used to once the habits is formed then they should feel more comfortable but the rationality behind it i think most the majority of the shanghai locals they understand it because this should be happening loan loan time ago but it's never too late so hardly anything interesting you know just what's see point of doing this in china in your opinion i think that when i was in osaka for the g twenty who's very obvious to me that japan has been into this kind of recycling liver a long time yeah in new york we did something less similar and did a less yeah let's good job right and it was a real pain to sort this stuff because it's not so obvious about thee cost and ben 'cause you don't see the benefits you only experienced the cost of having the some sort in its laborious and all this kind of thing but there is a benefit to doing it one benefit is a avoiding a negative that is not being fined or in the future in china not getting a bad social credit score and a another benefit is less it's the you're doing things for the planet you're doing things for the environment so here in beijing a lot of the garbage is still burned an that burning clauses dioxins this chemical dioxins are carcinogen they cause cancer so it's estimated when beijing comes on line soon with this sorting that the amount of dioxins in the air will be reduced by twentyfive percent so maybe goes back also to the saying no pain no gain it is a pain yeah but it is a game when we do the hell actually starting from two thousand nineteen cities at annabel would be her factual level will start to classify hotel to waste by the end of twenty twenty t the forty six cities will have basically completed their ways declassification and treatment system and the by the end of twenty twenty five cities at about eighty prefecture levels will have basically foreign the such systems i china has other celebrated the implementation of a waste of sorting system nationwide it's very short period of time actually look at you know the timetable and i'm a little bit worried about how we can win in such a short period of time come up a whiz building good a recycling factories because salting a house court ever in the household is the only the first step there are a lot of others you know falling we have the capacity to recycle them and a modern factories should be beard and we even have problems when we are choosing where to butte such some factories there are protests people don't like it no long believed to know the fun out of action yes so so hopefully by chinese chinese government as being or china as a as a country has been known as a voice efficiency to if once we have a talk it's a hat i think we can fulfill it so it's a very good news extra to own i think is terrific in the in the long run as well in this is one of those things where you do need a strong government to encourage people with carrots and sticks to implement these kinds of policies because like you said it's not obvious the the the gain is over time it's not instant gratification in right now china is just at the beginning of the curve because a it has not a done the sorting yet it's beginning to as you point out and this will be the standard operating procedure but you have other things like the collection the transport ford in ultimate treatment of this stuff there's large issues involved here as well i mean at one point china was receiving garbage from many other countries leash i stole it from the united states yeah liar garbage to know exactly exactly and so that has to be addressed but china with the so many consumers now with consumers really consuming and it's running a lot of money it's a problem the china needs to solve not only for itself but frazier and the rest of the world so i believe this is a very a good step and i believe that a people in time will do this naturally when the first couple of times people are gonna grumble about it but they're either gonna realize that it's good for the environment they're gonna realize oh be in trouble if they don't source so i think that they'll take the path of least resistance and and do it and do it will it'll become part of what patriotism is all about actually 'em both of you mentioned that some people have doubt about this garbage starting a study shows wing comes to starting trash twenty to thirty five year old are the least a cooperative end they don't do a good job either end the older they are the bad her they do so how movement convinced the same same these affects heady young chinese currently dumping on the track sorting regulations on lie to get on board in real life well it's karen stewart here i said yes carrots and sticks so for young people of course young people i have a instant and disposable lifestyle everything is easy and a less responsibility than maybe for older people but this could be changed quickly and it could mean a doing this by by a rewards for people to give them coupons points or about purchasing things are giving them gifts when they recycle it for those who don't it could mean finds who are bad social credit score so i believe that those young people fall into line quite quickly maybe not happily so but you also have to realize that it's young people who were the most concerned about the environment interview link the garbage and the consequences to the environment but i think bill quickly get on board i think it's a i agree with their less responsible actually because the responsibility is not yet on their shoulders to run this country we don't have enough time to start oh no not me i will save time he's fighting the protesters conscious honor that starting i'm studying the twenty to thirty five usually after city five you become parents and parents when i turned into a mother i was thinking you know with long sort of broadened and it's a perspective all prospect effective and then vision i'm thinking about the future when my child is growing up you know smelling a breathing pollution in in in austria and then these things come to your horizon but now you're more self centered like you said i have no time you know i want to focus on my work no but when you were saying he's not i don't have time to sort of the garbage i'm saying status offered to non saw him yeah i don't but i believe that you love child we call it the milk to you people you know these young go and said i'm by how much effort you have to put in india i know arden key but when it becomes your habits when it becomes you're habits because when i was in australia it was really painful but then after you get this consciousness is just did the same thing when you you several things were there right you put the catheter it's early yet and start before the bins you ashley consumers are short these things at home you know when you get to the bend the work is already done you have this my best first home vince first i'm gonna yes on the table right now you have four boxes you have those but you know i think it's also very interesting because humans are so inventive and chinese people are so entrepreneurial that now there are people in shanghai who are renting their services is out for doing they're doing the sorting and it varies by how big the family is and what floor they are in a building and those kinds of things but i think this is very clever but i think it's socially responsible but i think it does provide employment for people and i think if people are willing and have the money to pay for it why not because then you're not only helping society you maybe helming zanu workers and create you're creating jobs where people so i think this is a a nice byproduct of this month they create a door to door service and also apps to teach people what kind of a double shooting to the ride garbage category so what's your idea about this new created jobs mommy i think it's they're not going to last very long because you know by oh yeah you know i also say you don't know but also send you a garbage daily sort of a you know garbage is it's just too complex you hire somebody else you can do it within just a few minutes but it's because you're reluctance you're not using to use it you lose it you hate it you don't like the smell your sorting it out you're also seeing them to other people but in the long run you know these kind of apps these kind of education because it's become part of your life part and parcel of your lifestyle then it will be shrunk button some may exist for example those who helped the older you know seniors who cannot do such a thing i think they're going to stay but to me you know i think a this painful things is grumpiness you will be gone in the long run hoffy year one year let's talk about it again but i but i think that people who are rich enough to hire these people right but but not rich enough to have a several i easer whatever wherever you go their own khyber the people in the middle are gonna keep hiring these people but yeah some people will do it themselves when they realize it's not that burdensome but the fact that it's garbage may make it a little less tasteful then if it were something else so you have that kind yuck thanks malian harvey just now being talking about garbage starting in china later parks affiliates story spring more intimidation that inspiration to the public state way does develop expert represented by were today keeping you will and warmed up to do the head of the new welcome back you're listening to you today a news program from different perspective on the anna with harvey voting senior fellow at the center for china and globalization animal links are ice english commentator beijing park is sparking controversy recently after using statues to tell ancient filial stories such as the sun tasting he's the father is the fifth to judge his eunice and the men who buried his own son three years old alive to say food for his mother in show t park which means part of feel piety english stone statues were placed in the garden each way the story from asia and the chinese food could that collects the twenty four filial stories of from the past the statue were intended to educate people about filial duty t however instead of being adaptation no they scared people and not even a like so milling could you please give us a brief introduction about twenty four filial stories i think the stories of being this full thousands of years already out and actually every generation has been mentioned it to us you know a generation after generation but some the specific details of these stories that's definitely out of a time i could is out of baked obselete it can be scary but with people who know the history and the culture depths of it a we know that it happened in the past and is part of the confusion ism is part of the mall row teachings he's of confusion there's some but making them into sculptures and 'em sheltie parks not only in beijing nine gene you know many other places it's actually a florist in many cities it's a concern today you know ask a modern our own people who kind of were not properly educated with the past hour legacies how could you understand in order mosquitoes were not buying your father the son the little one would keep his own body naked and feed the mosquitoes first such kind of things and also if you want to catch a fish you lie on ice river surface to melt the surface ice so that'd be official come up so that you can catch it to you know for your parents to eat and also you cry at the wrong season when the bamboos bamboos only come out in spring right now by the way when when it is one of the lifesaving ingredients in one of the chinese madison sort of a recipe then you go and cry to be old bamboos to your eyes boards out and then all of a sudden the heavenly sort of something were touched in then you've been booze was growing so these stories are really out of date and it's not suitable for today's propagation i hardly have you heard any of those twenty four stories no higher but i mean obviously we know about filial heidi martier society and your culture going back thousands of years but i found those stories quite gruesome in thinking about how would a child except those and i think that they would accept them with a huge yuck yuck factor and they get factor would overcome see ability or to teach children the values and things there ancient values but they have to be communicated in a twenty first century way and i think that this is great shortcoming if you're just gonna repeat field stuff because it doesn't work anymore in fact it may work in exactly the opposite direction you're society obviously for thousands of years has had filial piety and these confusion values because it promotes a social order and promotes a a society of a lot of people and get along with each other but we living in the twenty first century unity's twentyfirstcentury twentyfirstcentury tools whether it's a animation or a rap songs or whatever cheech these kinds of values if you want them to be inculcated internalized by young people a specially so i think they should sort those statues and put him in the right been getting rid of the good i hear good things because we're not tossing away our old tradition of practice of buffalo pyre no no no but they have to appear in a new form of you or being acceptable to the young people and if he original stories i mean these blue some story in your eyes they can be made into you know offensive see movies right things like that you know people would say oh he and the thousands of years ago you know we believed in that but then bring them to the reality philo pilots he means a new relationship between parents and children because india confucius time they required absolute abedian even my father once i had a coral isn't my mother my father tried to comfort a little crying girl like me by saying by shell boot you should remember this is our oh teaching means one abedian is better than you say orally say that i feel i feel at one hundred times when i was little i was really convinced but then after i out grow this i started to challenge in my father know when she was wrong why should i pay her completely entirely but i think they're important values and i don't think these stories and i teach people how to behave and we have so many tools these children are so good with computers and with photo shop and with all these kinds of things in which they could create their own story their own right images litter maybe ancient maybe modern maybe something combination of the two but i think when you do something on your own and are proud of it in show people i think that helps internalize these values much more than these stories and it's almost impossible to really see little pilot is one of the values that it used to be so effective in a centralized the management of the kingdom definitely very useful because there is a book that i read older book it's called the spirit of the chinese people by homing written a hundred years ago he was talking about how the chinese way the values is a higher moral the highest immoral disciplining that you you folio father i think there's a deeper understanding about the filial piety in china i think hard of confucius affil also be is that you understand your place in the hierarchy of the universe ideal ladies whizzing the family that end devito's learn how to leave well it'd become members of the wider community so you learned this from having fellow piety towards her parents ended this also the key elements of the social harmony in china you know which comes from recognizing hierarchy is an honoring it's how it's very idealistic there is only one preconditions if these people above you is always right to make the right decisions but but the reality is no it's not perfect world but in terms of your own family in terms of the whole society actually as easer there pervasive values here and as we know confucius these values will prevail because the social order is valued above most everything else and because of that i think it's important to teach these values but to teach them in a way the right way understood right the right way and i think that's something we could learn from the western countries like in united states we all know the grimm's fairytales ray talking about horror stories these not fairy tale at all at the beginning cutting walls the belly who ate the girls grandma or kidnapped and prison a young girl and drink her blood to keep youth actually grains hotel and now they have new versions united states other new urgency is changed up based on the current political preference for example they change it at some words in it like a jungle jungle because jungle is considered too dark and a could have bad influence to kids so he's a change it to forest and also this repeat exander the wolf end up become friends yeah i was sexually when i was doing research on these topics i was thinking if we really want to teach the little piracy twenty four stories to our young jen younger generation why don't we make them into good movies you know on or and then these movies will have today's reality let's see being inclusive and then movies of the best to come into into influence people so definitely we should use our wisdom i don't want to see that these a tradition of no value is up being for boston no we need to keep the good part and teach kids in the right proper except the you know i i'm told in a few weeks i'm gonna be a judge in a short movie contest and i have a review a bunch of movies and whittled down to a certain number well i think cr i would perform a great public service if you had a contest then henry people write some stories about the phil piety at the confusion value like i said about the western way to modify the or is it once were reflections on the political correctness in a star is well yeah i dunno it's a matter of political correctness i just think it's a matter of them being obsolete not understandable and are times is ancient history streets archaic and if it is ancient history then why does it apply to me or to us so i think it needs to be modernizing yeah relevant to the present and i i believe some of the reasons of those stories where modified in america some his political correctness i'm not a fan of political correctness but some are to make them more palatable easier to understand and to go along with the psychology modern psychology in pedagogical research in this kind of thing so it's not just just one factor harvey we see reviver chinese traditional cultures nowadays the for example there revival of high school and you're talking about ing ctn nylon rang and also the culture dos how do you assess the karma nita in china for our thousand year old counters i wouldn't say it's a need i'd say it's a pride pride of you're a long history of pride of the fact that you had in the in the case of his hunt food you had these beautiful objects closed for so many thousands of years that are being rediscovered now so i think when you look at the china i came to in nineteen eighty eight and everybody was drafted mouse suits and grey or blue and so a sea of of people who were not individuals now people can be individuals making express themselves they can also expressed their pride in the culture i think this is a wonderful thing some jemma all used to say let tundra flowers bloom you know i'm not against any of the phenomenons nostalgic one i think some people are trying so hard to look for their own identity in history because there's identity crisis see who i am you who am i o y n these kind of a fundamental questions so allow people to do whatever they want to do 'em as long as they're not violating laws and you know it's it's okay i think it's also very interesting as a kind of contradiction the things like hans who is hans who is allows people to express their individuality but it's also individuality of a mass culture in in many ways 'cause everybody dressed like like this at one time but i think it shows that china has reached a stage of development where people can express themselves as to you know who they are but at the same same time they're expressing a pride of their your country you're tradition and so on and so it's a win win now sense of belonging to accommodate retina yeah this group and indeed but unfortunately we ran out of time for today thanks to my colleagues mulling cr i think at least commentator in harvey voting senior fellow at the center for china an globalization that's it for this weekend addition up to date on a quick recap of today's headlines japan resume commercial whaling after thirty years july real versus fell for maggio went viral in china people get creative with sean highs garbage regulation in parks filial stories spring more intimidating than inspiration to the public

senior fellow international whaling commissi japan julia roberts china antarctic thirty years five thousand pounds twentyfive percent two thousand years thirty five year hundred years thousand year three decades forty grams forty years three years one year ten year
Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home w/ Brad Sulnitzer, Joey Orton, and Trace Dominguez

Bad Science

1:00:05 hr | 1 year ago

Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home w/ Brad Sulnitzer, Joey Orton, and Trace Dominguez

"Okay today on the show. We're talking about star trek for the voyage home and our guests. Brad and Joey wrote a song about the movie which you'll hear at the end of the episode so I thought the least I could do do is grab the Ukulele here and improvise a quick song about the film now. It's not a competition. It's not about who's song is better. You know they wrote. There's and I'm improvising mine and so they're different and they're going to be different. Obviously just wanted to kind of match their energy and come in with the song so here we go. Let's do it right down. Let's go everybody would think star trek four shit that did not didn't go the way that I I thought that it might but that's the that's the nature of of of Improv. Sometimes you never know. Let's get to the let's get to the so did the movie get it right or will we have to fight Hi everybody welcome to bad signs. I'm Ethan Edinburgh and today we are talking about star trek for the voyage home a movie. That's unbelievably about Wales which I did not see coming I don't know if the Star Trek Fan base did but we'll. We'll ask our resident trekkie. Can I call you a tricky. Is that her yeah. I'm I'm big trek. That's what I thought we have science communicator and creator of dose of Trace Trace Dominquez. How's it going to trace really really well. You were on a previous podcast which we also talked about Star Trek. I was yeah we did that one with a physicist from the Lawrence livermore labs yes. I can't recall her name because I may superb xl schmuck but she was like a laser specialist who was super cool. She was awesome. Yeah we talked about like the newer star Trek and we talk. We've talked about Star Trek Two thousand nine which was filmed in part at Lawrence livermore lab. That's correct. That's correct but today we're going old school. Super Old School school and we have such wonderful guests here today. One you already know you're on what part guess where we did Sunshine Sunshine with the NASA Guy Right Nasty guy the Mohawk guy that's correct yes about who I also door but anyways the voice you're hearing is bred singlets inlets. Are you have a question already. I'll get into the second okay and he is joined by Joy John Together. They have created a fast and the furious musical musical. Is that correct yeah. That's that's exactly it. You've been performing it here in. La So people live close by or they're taking a trip. Maybe there tourist they should come see you fast and furious a musical parody playing a theater near me in Los Angeles California on September Twenty Eighth Dynasty Typewriter Dot Com yes. I'm I'm seeing on the twenty eighth. All I've heard from my friends is that it's an incredible show so go check it. If you've ever been desperate to meet the man behind the voice within fin under the musical at the crowd really they probably desperate to hear the man behind your voice. Yes if you want to hear if you WanNa hear me I want to hear you. Thank you your other question the last time you did the podcast you were the dumb guy a smart guy yeah. That sounds so dumb the last time we could make the other guy aw I have friends the dumb guy the down with way far yeah so joe. You're a musician is correct. That's right and so. How did you inbred get together together. I used I used to look up to Brad in college. It was like a mentor of mine and then I got to know him and yeah and it's kind of I. Would you say it's reverse Brad. No no absolutely not every time. He says he used to look up to me. It hurts really a part of my soul dies. Why does it hurt because he used just to look up to me anymore. Camp counselors together now. He thinks you guys are reverse. If anything so I can see okay cool well I. I very glad you guys came for this very ridiculous podcast episode because I had no idea going into this what the movie was about. I didn't see star Trek two or three. I don't even know I think maybe I saw the first one what was the first one the first one was star trek the motion picture okay and that one was. I think objectively terrible objectively tear them. The second one's good the second one was great that Star Trek to wrath of Con. Okay mazing that one on the pod and I remember I did like that one a lot yeah that one was really cool mind control bugs. I mean we got super. That was way more star trek nameless one. This one is a little this one is is surprise for everybody. Let's have in in case. People haven't seen star trek for the voyage home could you maybe just sum up. What the plot of this film is. The plot of the film of Star Trek for their in in space as you would expect you expect them to be in space and do space things together again space enemies right no that is not what happens when Evans is is apparently spock has recently been resurrected into a new body and they're about to be tried for war crimes on earth by the KLINGONS. Apparently they've done some sort of genocide and but are good guys from genocide. That's where the movie starts the good guys have genocide not explains because I had no idea what was going on and then and then what happens is a giant Space Dick comes in and signed up birth and they realized that this thing that's what they really want to do is talk to whales. These aliens are killing Earth because they can't talk to whales and then they're like go my God. We don't have whales anymore. They take there's like an audio signal being sent out by this alien craft but it just sounds like weird laser slow-motion shit and they're like well what would it sound like underwater water and what it sounds like underwater somehow they figure out through computational programming is a Wales call out in minutes very the whole the planet earth is like Oh God. Everything's terrible like wait. What have we just put it under water yes or heroes of course figuring out pretty quickly. Yep Like you idiots there. There are more living forms on earth that they could try to talk to what about Wales that having existed for hundreds of years yeah because they are extinct in the future which does make sense. There is environmental overtones in this film what we were talking about a little bit before the okay so brad. What do we do now now that we figured out that they're trying to talk to whales clearly clearly what we need to do is go back in time find some whales and save the Motherfucking Planet Yeah Bring Back Wales to the future and have them somehow talk. Do these aliens so instead of it. Being a space a space a space like caper instead. They just go to earth and bumble around trying to kidnap kidnap. These Wales very little guns no space in like eighty SYSCO right yeah so that's most of the film is our beloved Star Trek cast. I kind of just being schmugge running around the city trying to figure out how to get these Wales. He's GonNa. There's been a buster. Keaton movie easy So Oh eventually they do spoiler alert they they get with the help of a woman who works at a aquarium. It's Station Institute in the movie but in reality. It's the Monterey Bay aquarium okay this weekend. It's aquarium exhibit is it's amazing lovely Otterman. They're so cute I love it. I love me daughter. You're not a man. I'm an outer man or are you an automatic. I I am definitely man. Wow Okay are you more of a river Otterman AC- Alderman. Oh man now that's a good question. I know it's controversial and circle certainly both types of rumour of Seattle type. A guy you like both of your Nodar. Man People Be God this is that he doesn't have to tell yeah. This guy is full of Shit. They're very different yeah penguin man if I had to choose just throwing that out. I'm a cheater man. Oh man what a loser you're going with jungle cat hack man offer little basic what can I eh did the bay in real life stand up to the incredible feature it had in this film film all this. This woman was is such a hot marine biologist and she was so lonely her only friend for Wales issues very mad at her co worker. C- getting this isn't about science but I do like like that. William Shatner was no longer hot by the time this movie was made and he was still like she was still like charmed by this. Oh man very quickly charmed by Shatner who's wearing weird weird futures may stuff. She trust him and he's with spock. The whole time WHO's wearing arguably w-we weirder attire he's wearing these huge food sleeves and like karate. Terry cloth robe like he walked out of his hotel room and was like oh well. This is what I'm wearing. I guess he's like we're in a weird cult but she she's down with both of them. She wants to hang out terry cloth TUNIC. What he's wearing is walking around modern. San Francisco Yeah so I mean it is San Francisco people where weirder stuff yeah give it to them. I live there. It's the people were some weird stuff. People are walking around yeah. Tunics came down from San Francisco to do this podcast now. I'm here now. Yeah just checking not talking as I said yes in silent would the end of the podcast well. It's all the time we have no bread. You can solve the entire time. You're like a mentor to me. I look up to you. I always have thanks college. You know go away one day. Thank all right. We'll see okay so yeah. Spoiler alert they get the frigging Wales onto their ship using teleportation report support them yeah okay but they had a lot of trouble doing it. They had to have like radio which I didn't really understand. I gotta be honest. Slow so right now if we want to track a wild animal well. I'm GONNA say now but I mean in the eighties. Okay you want to track wild animal. You need a tag. They do this all over for conservation circles. 'cause it's easy to say that animal is say the serial number and then you have a radio frequency that would be very specific that you could follow and Eh and track down that animal they do it in Griffith Park here in Los Angeles California edge with the jungle cats city cats. Yeah that's right. That's cool yeah. They do it with a lot. Ah Conservation Animals because that way it's minimally invasive for the animal and it allows us to kind of follow them around their environment without having to literally put cameras around and watch them walk. Gotcha drive it when they start tracking minimally invasive yet no big deal up your decor. It's the only way I'm so glad you said is exactly what I was thinking. Maybe I won't say that. Brad took it home. They needed the megahertz. Four hundred four hundred megahertz is not specific enough radio talk radio three decimals because otherwise you're getting a whole bunch of stuff. That's so funny. Yeah I wrote down four hundred megahertz is the Radio Frequency of Wales. I guess that's wrong in this fictional all scenario yeah you you'd be one hundred percent right radio frequency of Wales cool like album name. Oh yeah thanks maybe okay well. I'll contact and you're right. After eh music. You guys supposedly wrote a star Trek for the voyage home song that we're GonNa Song this morning about. The movie greats the movie the at six. Am wrote the Song Day. Damn ten forty five. Maybe less somehow not exhausted really impressive so yeah a little tease for or later stay tuned for the incredible Brad and Joey hit Star Trek for the voyage home song title not yet okay like Wales. Maybe a little bit of a stretch to be like we wrote it also titled that makes the most sense yeah. The wheels were by far the most surprising part part of this movie. I so every time that they were mentioning it. I would laugh to myself because I couldn't dawn on me like it's still star trek movie though but it's all about these Wales feels everything is about how did they decide on this not laugh and say like well. We can come up with something totally shocking remember the Ninja turtles movie where they just randomly went to old China yeah clearly we're making infinite number of these movies so each one can just be its own thing. I mean I love that movie. We gotta do that went on to rocks a lot. It's a martial arts probably get like a turtle specialist integrated ride a horse. Yeah sure we've never just specifically talked about turtles so I'm down with that. I Love Turtle Science Yeah. They're so weird stuff. There's living there anyways back to Wales so they frigging save the the earth. I guess they save the Galaxy or whatever they get the whales back in their ship. They successfully time travel which we can get into. They come back and then I. I don't know if you guys got this. I feel like I missed it. Somehow I re. I rewound I watched it. Twice still didn't get it. The whales just start talking to the alien ship. Is that would happen yeah. That's what happened. Okay Aliens Elliot's. Actually we are the whales aliens or the aliens. We never saw right. That's a great question. The aliens just worried about Earth's yeah. Why why were they killing earth. I didn't get it. I'm googling it. Okay thank God if you think about it. That's a really big. PROB- like they sort of have some. It's bigger than a all star base. Maybe it's piloted by giant Whale Alien Walian Dude. If that's the case I want to see that shit guys the numbers on his Ueli uh-huh Walian Zahra. Go Damn also a good band name. How much can no whale say when a whale just normally go back and is it just sex we saying other things. We know a lot about whale language more than we did in the eighties not like we can say oh. They're saying hello here. They're saying saying goodbye here. They do know that I'm going to switch species to go into something a little more about but porpoises the dolphins they've recognized make certain sounds for certain humans can recognize that person and that's they will make a specific sound and whale song his. I think more complicated you know it's like Thai. Its tonal and they do change it. They say in the movie so they're constantly kind of changing their language. We don't know if it's like Birdsong or but we assume that there's more complex changing their language and every few years they learn it from each other so they're constantly constantly updating their whales or maybe they're trying to keep us off their humans catching up. We gotta change it. I did not know that I thought they were just what show it was say. I'm ready. I'm ready to I'm not I'm not curse you just said F no. It's cool sometimes. F is just funnier but no we can curse. I've it's funny because people usually ask that before we start recording and the truth is we shouldn't curse. I should have made the decision before we even started pot of like let's not curse this is for everyone but I never thought about it until the ninth episode of it was like Oh well. We've been cursing the whole Okay so anyways are you. What what were you looking at something Wales. What was I looking at. You don't know now if you don't know we have a Google play candy crush playing candy crush binge over here yeah yeah. I just thought it was so weird that we didn't. I waited the whole movie to find out okay. They're gonNA come back to the future and we're going to get some answers as to WHO who the aliens are what did they actually want and why Wales and none of that was answered. Also you would think the whales would tell the other whales get. These mother fuckers like they've been getting nuts. Yeah somehow the whales come in they convince the other whales the Alien Wellesley absolutely I if we are extinct now because because of these assholes save them yeah. I guess they have Super Compassionate. Maybe that's the thing is like Wales. Are you know what what's the Classic Bible. Well forgive them. They know not what they do or they just have Stockholm Syndrome in captivity for too long yeah and they fall in love with their captor. WHO's also lonely okay so we have no idea there's no tricky blah? According to the Star Trek kind of wicky on Phantom they were talking about what it is and how it was built. We talked a lot about how they had had trouble making it because in the movie this is a giant cylinder. It's like five miles long and it's got this little basketball hanging out at the bottom of it right yes and they made it that way on purpose to make it more ominous the has no antenna has no like right discernible front back and the idea was to make it scary yeah yeah it's like a big monolith with a little door handle right exactly actually and then the door handle has like according to their wikipedia pages changed in size in different like. Oh our designs over time but they ended up with this one because it was the easiest to animate they literally never talk about what's inside of it though yeah yeah so. We don't really know anything about not a fans fate of that decision. I the whole climax of the movie is based on what these whales are saying these aliens but they just leave we just here. We'll noises and the aliens lead over in terms of science. They spend more time figuring out how to build a whale tank do figuring out how to time travel by flinging themselves around the sun one hundred percent agree with you there that was like out of nowhere and this is this is a funnily enough the first time in the Star Trek Universe that anyone time travel wow and so they were all the TV I guess yeah the at at least in the movies for sure but in the TV in TV shows so that's fine because this was came out in eighty six and the next generation was either just starting I think it start an eighty eight and so like they hadn't gotten to this kind of stuff yet and the fact that they came up with the concept in literally thirty seconds. They're like well. These things are extinct time travel then. We're going to go time travel yeah. We're GONNA get some more and if they if it was that easy wind. They just do that a bunch. They've been doing this for years now granted. I have have not watched a lot of the Star Trek Universe here but if the your first reason your first excuse to time travel is because you have to go back and save whales like that's pretty crap. I'm sure they had a bunch of better. Reasons in the past is about to be totally destroyed because of the lack of whale song right that is true they could have just like played through a speaker. Wale Song and not do the whole time travel thing but anyways. Let's get to how they did this because it was br very briefly fleet decided upon and discussed. They were just like well. If we're going to time travel I guess we're GONNA have to go around the sun and then that way will slingshot and we'll be back in time to the appropriate time arm that we need so what the hell was that so in the movie spock does some calculations and they kind of science gobbledygook look at you a little bit about how much mass of the spaceship and specifically what calculation it would take to get you to a specific period in time and then after all of that they're like like probably the latter half of the twentieth century. We think maybe somewhere so yeah. They didn't know exactly where they were headed. Yeah fury like is there any validity city to going around the sun to time travel 'cause isn't there like yes and no so yes superman flu around I think he flew around the opposite way. The Earth rotating somehow Al went back in time this makes I would say a lot more sense than that. Neither of them make any sense but that makes more sense only because essentially if you think of the the theory of relativity that Einstein came up with equals. MC squared is the simplified version of it the the faster you go. The slower time is going to go. They they have done this. We know this works because of even. GPS satellites have to be adjusted regularly otherwise they will be incorrect because they're going so fast relative to the people on the ground so they adjusted by nanoseconds. You know every week or so you know right to keep them up to time because their time is actually moving eddie different rate than ours is okay moving at a different speed. GPS Satellites Joe they are now and so are S. astronauts and so will anyone who goes to Mars. They will all have slightly different amounts of time okay because time moves slower the faster. You're going so in their Klingon bird of prey that they stole in the previous movie they can go maximum speed about warp eight and in the movie they show them going about work nine point seven or something one is the speed of light so there and it's it's a as I understand it. A cubic increase so warped too is like eight times the speed of Light Dan and Warp three twenty seven times the speed of light so by the time you're getting to like. They don't even shake yeah. The little severe pass out yeah yeah no why they pass out work nine to IPAD it out well. If you go by the Star Trek Warp nine a lot a few billion. It definitely seemed to have like like forgot what was going on each time. The war was over there like what happened. Did we stop. I wonder if they have like a plan and then they just couldn't execute the like the special effects of that plan plants they said Okay we'll just dip to white and then have mall wakeup yeah yeah that's fine. We can job that. Take a bunch put red lights on and people will get yeah. It's no big deal yeah yeah but so if you think of that principle of the faster you go the slower time goes if you've got to warp ten which is allegedly impossible that would be infinite speed so so there are like nine point six. There's also a thing that satellites us all the time we use it with the voyager probes in the seventies to make them go a little faster and that's it's called gravity assist so you launch something off of the planet you can get it going so fast and then you kind of whip it around another planet in the solar system to speed it up. What's essentially Ashley happening. Is You're stealing momentum from that planet. Gosh it's no big deal. It's not gonNa like mess with the planet. It's they do that. Apollo thirteen as well right did the whole going around the sun. Thing was literally just to get enough speed travel to time travel so if you think about it they're thinking okay if you go past this certain threshold hold of speed and time can't go any slower time must then go backwards. I mean this does not make that much more sense than the super. It doesn't make that much more safer but if there's like a basis understanding of the theory of special relativity and relativity so that's I think they don't explain it in the movie at all yeah. I was kind of. Put that framework onto them. They're combining what they knew about space travel at the time because the voyager probes had been launched fairly recently at that point and they were doing. Ns with various probes that are are still in existence like new horizons that just past Pluto did this so it's pretty common so it's well known space fact. I well known space back. What's another space fact. It's called Okay Yeah. That's a good which isn't actually true. It's not really cold because you can't. That's a well known space fallacy as you can't feel. There's no cold is is air touching your skin. You're feeling the air that is cold. If if there's no air you can't actually feel cold about. No one can hear you scream. That's true because there's nothing to convey the sound but if you have a radio you know and you're in an atmosphere screaming and there have a radio they could hear you through the radio so you could you could be heard screaming but not directly. I kind of liked it. They don't really explain it versus like vendors and game where they spend an hour explaining time found me and I'm like alien yeah we gotta do. You're GonNa find some Wales problem. Endgame actually has a lot in common with split up into a team they go out and they had to get this thing not very avengers. It's mostly this them running around their old movies being like okay. Don't be seen right. Iraq with this person. Flirt with that person may go to dinner then come back. I will say guises movies start with the note to the challenge about the Challenger. Yes No look copy of the movie that I had a star trek note to the Challenger and then the movie within a minute a spaceship explodes offensive. I didn't even think about that. Maybe just allender note challenger under exploded in the same year that this movie was January of eighty six or whatever and this would have come out sometime. I guess later in that year. The crazy thing is there's also teachers. Here's on the spaceship that exploded in the movie. Oh my God getting there weren't GonNa say I was like Damn. I really did not pay attention all right. We're GONNA take a quick break and we'll be right back. Oh you know what time it is. I like to Moldova Mova. I like to mobile move. I'm talking about Mova Globes because they're supporting the show today. Mova Globes turn all on their own with or without a base in any setting with ambient lighting. There's no batteries. There's no sloppy cords instead. It's all about magnets. There's hidden magnets that I provide the movement. There's forty different designs. They have world maps outer space famous artworks like the one that I have. I have the Van Gogh Globe. That sits on my desk spins is on its own like a magic trick that never stops and everybody comes over and they're like hey what's up this globe and I'm like hey go. Do your work and they're like. You're not my boss and I'm like yeah. That's true through. I'm sorry I said that I'm just a little hungry haven't eaten. Let's talk about this. Globe and then we talk about the globe and then they get their own. One of my co workers got the Moon Globe and it's it's awesome. I might even like that one more than my own. I'm not saying I'm jealous anyways. It's a perfect gift. I think that they are really really cool so go to. WWW dot mova globes dot com slash bad science and use the code bedsides for ten percents off your purchase okay that's Mova Globes dot com slash bad science and use the offer code bad science for ten percent off your purchase and you might find yourself saying I'd like to Mauve. That's not their slogan. I just think that that's a very silly thing to say say okay. That's all thank you Moba. Love Your Globes. Send Me More Globes. I want to attach these Globes to the outside of my car. So my car is a moving globe artwork over here. We go actually okay so on a different nonscientific note because you are a star Trek Guy. I don't know how deep you guys are into the new ones and then I watched some of the ones with Patrick Stewart Jerry. I like the next generation and I watched. All the movies seems like we're about on the same page here but you have watched a lot of the older star you watch the movies. I watch the movies I've seen seen almost all of the original series. I get bored so old. Yes so slow. I totally are going to hate me for that but I was A. TNG voyager deep space nine nine select the ninety s okay. I watched a lot of that and I've watched discovery as well which is the newest one and of course the new movies which are awesome well my question to you and I'm sure I'm going to be also ripped apart by Star Trek fans and I apologize Did this hit you sideways. When did you see this movie and when you did were you like what in the hell is going on here where you're like okay this make sense of Star Trek when I was a kid and I thought I didn't hit me sideways at all. I thought it was like Oh cool. They're going to go save the whales like I'm into that. I want to save the whales all want to save the whales like I think it yeah I I was talking. I wash it with a friend and she said wouldn't it be great to watch this movie at the time it came out like to experience it at that moment because we can talk about this in a minute but the international whaling mm consortium or whatever essentially this group that came together the IWC and their idea was they were going to ban commercial whaling and commercial that was supposed to happen by the a year that this movie came out and obviously was not happening so when they made this movie had this environmental overtones but also think about like. Wouldn't you WANNA see star wars without knowing what special effects could be. You know it's the same kind of idea right right. I would love to have watched this movie at a time where there are all of these environmental issues going on and the special effects x were still felt like a very special episode of felt like the random episode of like family matters for this one's about we'd talk to you about weed yeah. I've I have a question about whaling yeah. So what do they use the whale like. Let's say you murderer whale Charlotte. What what can you use that for. It's like I can't go buy some wail and they're like why did everyone. I know guys. Don't I can hook you up thank you that's a great question. Wailing has existed since before there was history like antiquity they think the earliest some of the earliest stuff they found that has to do with commercial well commercial or wailing as a profession. I guess dates to six thousand so humans have been doing this forever. They prostitution's the oldest job but they found the first prostitutes inside a Murdered Very Jerry Jones or Pinocchio now John. We'll go joan hustle. I'm so wailing. Is You get the resources of the whale and it's like any animal hunting. You can use their skin. You can use their bones for things you can eat the meat but also a big part of it is the blubber itself which is like wail fat can be turned into oil used for lighting lamps and lanterns and so that until we discovered oil under the ground and kerosene and other like synthetic oils oils this was the main source of a lot of light so you could make you can make light and candles and things out of all sorts of different animal fats like pig. Tallow candles are pretty big. You can use those in. They were popular even into the nineteenth century. 'cause it was like an easy way to get a candle out of pig fat which if you're going to eat the pig why not use the fat for that right so this was is a way to get a large amount of resource out of what would be a lesser effort huge candle and even and even then like the the populations that would hunt whales con would do it similarly into if you think moby. Dick into the ninth until the eighteen fifties when that came out they were essentially throwing harpoons by hand added giant animal as its surface crazy and then they would keep doing that until they killed it and where did you come up to the two breath so there are a variety brighty of different ways to do it but the one that I was reading about that was maybe the weirdest that I think they would take seals that they could kill because they were close to the to the shore so they would kill the seal then they would inflate the seal like a balloon. I don't know how lengthy blowing up like a pool to put their mouth over the butthole yeah yeah and so once they had this thing. It was like a float they would attach it to a rope. Throw the Harpoon on the other end of that rope and and then just like in jaws where it had to drag all of those barrels this is the same idea it would tire out the whale and since they breathe oxygen they would float to the top and like so they could breathe calm down and that's when they would kill them and they could do you know housing years ago like hundreds and hundreds of years ago least that'd be so nuts pitching that idea to your friends yeah all right. Here's the deal and I know it's going to sound gooky. I'd feel Jerry you're kind of in the doghouse. You've got to blow this. Oh I'll keep cleaning the bathroom so wait. Where are we now. I mean whale. Hunting is still a thing. It's illegal. I would assume yeah so I w you see I had wrong. It's the International Whaling Commission and the International Whaling Commission was put together by a bunch of countries that already were whaling and then they decided we're going to end commercial whaling by I essentially reduced it by eighty-six ended by eight. It's not going to be commercial anymore. It'll be indy whaling derailing. They said you could still wail. Under this group this this groups like I guess rules you could still whale for scientific research so countries like Japan continued to do a lot of wailing and they're claiming scientific research searches the reason but I know Japan is a lot of candles. Did you go over there. It's crazy. I don't use electricity so they say about thirty two thousand whales have been killed sense the IWC moratorium on whaling which would have been in the eighties so it's it's pretty much universally considered a failed project to him but we now have all of these other ways to make heat in lights. We don't need whale oil. So so what are they. We've moved on from that to other things that destroy our atmosphere instead of destroy this animal populations yeah. I really did think this was. This was like a cute movie hearkens back to like when environmentalism used to be yeah and now it is I mean I was like Oh. This feels so nice to think that the biggest problem was Wales males yeah. I don't think we should murder them. You sound like on pro-whaling a little bit. I haven't done never tried it. Did you like camels. Emily might be a rush to throw a spear into Awale. Blow up a seal. I don't know No. We shouldn't do it do it. Everyone stopped wearing their probably in danger I do I'm against whaling commission anti-whaling okay very cool so so I mean I have so much stupid crappier trace so I'm already college is the cloak their spaceship yeah and they they do the I made me laugh so hard. I can't remember her name. What's the woman's name that Williams junior think I thought out of the loop spatial love that seat. It's so funny to me. There's like the ship really big yes. He's like really far away but she's just doing like a mime job. Yes Do Really L. always putting up her hands like I'm like the classic impersonation of a mind doing among which I thought was so funny but anyway so that was their ship. That is their ship yeah so this there's something that is part of the Klingon kind of shipbuilding system Klingon Tech Yeah Klingon Tech and while and other races have it as well but at this point in in the Star Trek Universe we pretty much know of the klingons are Clo- are have cloaked ships which I think is not species yeah they would be racist. I guess but but they are technically different species. I think Joey's pro-clinton. I'm proclaiming on the KLINGONS are great well. I I've never seen any other movies in the human seemed like a bunch of Dick Holes they do in this movie the Klingon. I don't know that one Klingon who's just like got a weird kind of British accent in Harlem. I agree on our ten minutes is angry at everyone and he's like you guys murdered. All of my family and friends and they're like yes. Yes and it's like if you haven't seen the previous movies. It's like this guy seems right and murder whales. It's like fuck. That does sound pretty. legit doesn't set up humans to be particularly whatever the Klingons done that's even even though there are there are a warrior race that pretty much just destroys everything that you know that isn't the Klingons are sort of like what you would think of his vikings right they show up they destroy everything they pillage and then they leave their warrior based race they also then become more political and they get more involved into the other parts of the Star Trek the universe which then also creates a bunch of conflict within the Klingon Empire. There's a whole hog has like enter. Political issues issues in Klingon home. World was a little quick to to support the cling. Maybe not come around to become part of the federation and like like end up being a much more helpful ally that you have problematic issues with especially if you think of like the next generation with warf- being a like a pretty high level guy on the ship. That's that's a big deal but since we're on this topic really quick huge the interesting thing about star trek is it's always been pluralistic and diverse and I had completely forgotten that the first captain you see on screen in the show. The first captain to interact with the probe is a black woman yeah in Nineteen eighty-six Eighty six awesome great but Klingons have that same kind of interaction throughout the Star Trek Universe where this this other group that has this warrior race kind of past yeah yeah okay. What does he crazy rich klingons good. I would love the title I would go with my friends. That movie sounds awesome awesome marrying Klingon and and hilarity ensues. I forget what the original question. We were talking about the cloaking right now yeah yeah so now in real life. They're working very hard on cloaking. You can do it with very small things where you bend light around stuff essentially it only works mostly in in the lab and it takes a lot of different laser optics to do. I'm going to explain how because he's standards but essentially you're bending light around stuff. The other version I've seen is like using screens screens where it basically merge acting like on a car or something yeah screens to basically screaming cameras so it will project like one. Si- like what absolutely and they're doing that with airplanes you see it a a lot in marvel movie was actually if you watch the Spiderman homecoming movie right where he fights the the flying Michael Keaton having seen it so they're they have screens ends on the underside of the plane to make it hidden and they do that with the giant hello carriers as well and it's just that's a simpler way to technology. There's something with this where it's not not only is it cloaking at visit visually like from visible light. It's clicking at from sensors of all sorts of this thermal cloaking it. You're doing everything you can to hide it. Inch is interesting so earlier you said science gobbledygook right yeah yeah so in this because a lot of movies now when a science fiction movie comes out the higher actual. PhD's the higher scientists the higher the experts parts to be on the movie in order to make sure the science holds up star. Trek never cared about that did it or did they have scientists working on it and that's a great question for this movie. I don't know who who the science adviser was. It looks like they probably had one based on a quick google. Search but star Trek in general and the Star Wars people are going to hate me more so than star wars kind of issues magical thinking so in Star Wars you've got wizards and you've got like magic things that people can move stuff without any and then they sort of bring the science into it in the ones that everybody hates from the nineties medical ruins yeah exactly but in Star Trek. They're pretty good about sticking to the science. I'll give you an example. The teleport or the transporter is a teleportation device right and move things from one place to another the schematics of that make sense in that. You're taking Adams Adams. You're converting them into energy. This is entirely doable. We know that this is a thing that you can do based again on Einstein's theories. You could take an atom converted to energy then converted back to matter again because all of that would be conserved. You'd lose nothing in that transfer. The problem is there are so many Ma- There's so many bits of you. There's so many trillions and trillions and trillions of atoms atoms involved that to predict every single one is going to be at any given moment based on what we know of quantum mechanics is impossible. There's it's the Heisenberg uncertainty he principal and so inside of the teleport schematics is something called the Heisenberg compensator that the people who created this thing in the Star Trek Universe put in knowing that that was a mathematical pool so he thought about it yeah yeah yeah so they thought about it and they said cool well. We know this is going to be an issue so let's just put this black box in here that makes it work. Okay very cool so they're usually pretty good about their science. I wouldn't say that perfect. Obviously it's still science fiction but I think we'll get there like in small increments like if we can do and Adam now. Can we do a dog soon. We can do some small bits of teleportation can teleport atoms from one place to another. It's through like spooky action. Distances Einstein called quantum entanglement. You can move information around in that way but we're really really far from anything. Larger larger than particles also let me let me let me counter that with another question please if I put you on a transporter and I take you apart atom by atom very very quickly. You don't feel it okay then I put those atoms through a computer program convert them into digital information and energy beam him somewhere else and rebuild you are you still you wow 'cause you're made of of energy for a while. I would hope that is no you me like you could arguably ably put you into a computer program for a year and then put you back out and the other side a year later but are you still you. I don't know I guess not did we kill you on the on the transporter pad and then reconstruct a copy of you is really what I'm asking. It sounds like it right. How much did you smoke before Ah Dude. It's freeing early to quit waking in baking. Just 'cause you're in. La for a month doesn't mean you have to make it work dive into the culture that deep Jesus Christ okay so yeah. I was GONNA ask about teleportation so I'm glad that we're talking. We're just GonNa let that you're not gonna even an answer. If it's a copy of me I do think it's a copy of me. I think that you you are kind of killing yourself and then recreating yourself. I think that's the theory at least I don't know twelve. It's up to you because the question is then are they. Are they transporting your soul with to you assuming you believe that that's there and so if you don't believe that that's there there there are two camps right. There's the no we've killed you died. This is a copy of you with no soul well well What's the proof that we have the proof of that number but you could also say you are exactly the same as that moment that you left similar every capacity like every single little piece of you. Is there so you're still you're now yeah. Someone's you are listening to this to have a good time and we're talking about how they don't they really are. We killing ourselves in our supporters of the future well. I don't believe in Seoul's so yeah I I don't know I'm great. I'm great I got I got you know I got supported. You're good to go yeah. I feel like I kill myself in Maribor and every time I go to yoga actually so what your soul out hot goat yoga or have you done yoga scientific oh yoga's great but it seems like a fat Joe saying I've seen the videos that it looks ridiculous. I don't want a goat on me. When I'm trying to yoga. It's hard enough but anyway uh-huh tha- that's a crazy for this. They do a lot of beaming as beaming. They're beaming everywhere everywhere so that's a lot of killing in yeah and usually it's all cool with them but then when Jillian does it. She like freaks out freaks out yeah. I wonder if there's a sound must feel weird because she starts screaming before it happened so she must be able to know that something's going he. He sought the effect would start earlier. Maybe I have a question if you would you take the power of teleportation like they do it. You could do it now but anytime you end up where you're going. You're naked and covered in your own poop why you do it yes. How physically can you choose where you're going you edit. It's going to be the most public version we're GONNA go to the mall bathrooms. You're in the middle aged. You're actually in the found well without without the POOP. Sands is boop. It's like the Terminator or so then I was like oh that's fucking sick. That's cool but then yeah you know a little more embarrassing. You'd be so famous. It would be pretty awesome. Yeah that's also true yeah and you don't have to pay for gas anymore or a plane which would be really great and not annoying okay so another one they they talked talked about a what was it called a solar You know what I'm talking about solar sail. Oh yes generate power. Solar sails are real. They're they're. They're real thing. It's a a solar. Sale is the same as the ship sail okay right. It's a giant piece of linen or cotton right. It's a giant piece of material. That's very thin thin and it catches literally the what's called the solar wind The Sun is constantly sending out charged particles of variety of different types because it's a giant ball of radioactive amazingness keeps us all alive. Thank you son. He's got up redhead. I disagree in in the Sun have beef. Yeah makes good bandit. That'd be tonight. I mean no I do not. I'm good too hot for that. Yeah so yeah it so the solar wind is constantly being if you think of it blown out of the sun and we we can catch that solar wind and it's very very very small amount of force but it's enough that if you have a large enough solar sail enough time you can accelerate probes mostly mostly things that are very lightweight and they're talking about doing this for for a variety of different spacecraft that they want to send far out into the solar system or even out past the the end of the solar system because it's a way to to accelerate them essentially forever right without any fuel onboard because the sun is doing it the same as a ship sailing on the ocean is using. They don't have to carry fuel they have to do is let the wind blow them around Oakridge. If you know where the wind is coming from the case of the Sun. It's not like it's going around in circles are going to change or anything yeah so we had those even back in eighty six. We knew that they existed. I don't think they've been proven enough that people have used them for large-scale missions. Che's yet but they know that they work and they've tested them out just figuring out a mission that they can do that with Gotcha cool part of the other Science Gobbledygook if if we're calling it that was the difference science. I'm just too dumb to know that no not at all There's a really funny scene where they go to this plant. I don't even know what they do. In this plan because again I forgot her was to surprised by everything in this movie but they're talking to some scientists and they offer him this like advanced tack back and they're like could you like how thick could your polymer a survive the pressure of this amount of water and he's like you know six inches like like what if I told you that we could do it with one inch thick and the guy's like well that's impossible and then they show him they like type on a computer budge at a bunch of windows come up and and then it's like this weird formula that says transparent aluminum and the guy like flips out and he's like this is priceless so a what the hell is transparent aluminum if that's a real thing and be which. I think that's pretty funny right. I love that scene. I love the that. He tried to talk to the computer barrels. You Talk to compete there yet. It's an iconic scene in that respect also that dude actually didn't invent event that new elementary do go onto invent Siri speech recognition that make sense transparent aluminum at the time time was not real okay now Israel Whoa so predicted by Star Trek in a fun kind of funny way well. It was discovered fairly recently or created. It's aluminum. It's called aluminum oxide and it's it's a fairly new thing and we can't build giant sheets. and I don't know that much about transparent aluminum. I have a paper open and it says there was a paper in nature physics and they created this along with a bunch of international colleagues and they can build this stuff now but it's not what it is in the film so in the film they were using plexiglas and they say it had to be six inches thick to hold this much stuff the thing that bothered me about that as they kept switching between English units and metric units like the like. I didn't get that at all. They were like Oh. We're going to go two hundred kilometers in this direction and when we get there we're GONNA grab eighteen hundred red tons of stuff and I'm like why did you do that makes no sense anyway. That's the thing that made me mad about it but transparent. Aluminum is now thing it's they can't use it for large scale projects. Yeah okay but I do think it's really cool that. It exists yeah at the time. It predicted it. Just it it. It was like a kind of meet up thing that sounded cool yeah aluminum's it was easy 'cause it's so the Washington Monument in DC at the very top. There's a tiny little pyramid that that is the tip of the Washington Monument and they put it with one of the most valuable metals at the time when it was completed in the world aluminum okay now we see it everywhere right yeah because we figured out about how to isolate it from other elements but at the time it was so hard to make an aluminum is much wasn't like a a rare medal by the eighties but it's just a fun element to think about because it's so useful for so many different things it's light. It's absolutely wrapping avocado in it. It's awesome yeah okay. He stuns adore and it automatically locks the door. He like lasers. Beltsville out say. Can we do that or what's the deal all right yes yeah. I just thought you literally just ask. Can we melt metal. I might might win thing was as irs which aren't real but lasers are my thinking was. If a door is locked you you could laser the door and it would become open because you would melt the locking mechanisms whatever but to the to lock the door. I've found like I don't know how does that wear. How did he use it together with the wall or what's going on here. I mean you'd have to ask a locksmith. I think science in this Wail Caper of a movie I I laser the door shut but did that to lock the doctors that were about to cut open which is pretty cool I because so Dr McCoy is pissed off at all of the hospital because they're all using these like medieval technologies which if you think about it if medicine continues to advance at the level. It did now imagine if you were at a hospital in seventeen hundred seventeen nineteen. You really want to go to that hospital. I would not WanNa go to that hospital. Dr McCoy is like running around his nightmare which is awesome to think about cutting people open left and right and he gives that lady a pill pill and she feels much better kidney dialysis and he's like Ma monsters like it's the best. I would watch that movie that I would watch then. I knew I was GONNA love it. There's a reverse of that. Mr Bean were Mr Bean ends up being a doctor remembered that that recently or you just camp who loved Mr Bean and I told her I didn't like it and then she didn't like me anymore. Highlight ause kidding. I love it and then I watched a bunch of Mr Bean Yeah and did you change your mind and she did not like me. That really happened. There was like a fifteen year old in Dallas who pretended to be a doctor for over a year. I don't know if you you guys saw that and Oh yeah. His patients loved them. Let them keep going. It wasn't duty Hauser and like it wasn't all also the real thing I knew in what's it. GonNa Catch me. If you can yeah yeah. He did that to a little bit but he was a genius probably helping people with other people. Do you concur yeah yeah. I love that okay. Hey guys any other questions for trace before we get into the whale song the Whelan's hit the aliens had his new banger would do so in the Pantheon of Star Trek movies. This is a non science question tricky question. Was this one considered good if people like this one. It's a great question so I I looked it up. Before four. We did the pod to see kind of where it sits and it seems like it does about average like it's not people's favourite but I think people like this one because of the environmental overtones and I would say subtle environmental overtones. They were not subtle. There was like a three minute scene of Wales being butchered skin this. I was like this is really gross isn't violent. I was really upset by it was real graphic upsetting. It really does show you though it did. Remind me sincerely like the A journey that we've gone on in terms of what environmental means environmentalism means in our lifetime yeah. I think people are generally environmentalist now like if you say hey we need to protect the environment people yeah yeah yeah actually do true people might agree that we have to. They might not agree with how they might not vote for someone who feels the same way. I I do yeah generally kinda think the environments valuable and I did while looking up how this movie did there was an interesting thing that the blue whale AOL is the largest animal to ever have existed on the planet ever and getting that information to the public changed a lot of people's minds because they realize is oh wait you mean like nothing that has ever existed is amazing as that we should save these things and it changed how people felt and that's where you remember and bill and Ted when he he does that like slow kind of move up through the through the phone booth and and Ted has a save the whales patch on his jeans that movement comes from the blue whales and like saving the whales ideal and so that this was all happening at this period in American history. Yeah awesome wells very big. Yeah I remember in Free Willy because we did that at some point on the podcasts that they had a message at the end of the movie that was like go to this website and donate to help save the whales and it raised like millions of dollars so I don't know maybe they should have done in this movie also. I'm not trying to accuse them. They did a great job. It was very environmental. was that what do you think Nimoy because it was directed by letter Nimoy but written by someone else yeah so. I don't know who I was the environmental question. I don't know either. I wondered the same thing I know that like Nimoy was into the environment like user. He's dislike that Kinda guy and it was always a progressive series even what you're talking about average like race and representation representation and gender it always has been even the political like undertones of the whole thing. We're all about diplomacy yeah for sure except of course at the end he gets off without any. They're like Oh yeah. We're GONNA bust you from Admiral. We're going to dismiss all these charges of murdering people. He did say a lot of other people. That's true but it was a really funny switch right like to turn the tables like that. Yeah it's like such as serious scene and they're like just laying it on silk broke this law all you broke the law. This is unacceptable. You are promoted to star captain. okay so without further ado we're going to have the Premier Whelan's baby of Williams Baby Walian dried up is Carquinez team twenty third century just taken a cruise through the twelfth galaxy see when all of the sudden they hear blue blue the distress call from birth says guys. Oh my God we are so fucking bugged or waters ionized and it's turned against us our Arkham Unification's are no longer up Yup. It's a red alert so on up to the giant sky what could cause this. Oh my God. It's a spaceship. That looks like a Dick. Let's listen to me. in the spaceship says Oh my God I've got it says Oh that sounds like a way what the fuck is is a well. It's a fish from the twentieth century not officialdom. Am Oh either way. It's gone extinct think none of us could speak well so we will need a wail if we're. GonNa Communicate with them. Where can we find a wail wrong question now where but when so we ourselves around the sun in travel back to the twenty first century thanks what wait. Oh my God why things this is the main plot that is fucking crazy moving on boop boop bound Spock Yes sir. Can we find a way there's a harboring biologist and she has to Wales L. Stats good luck good luck understatement of the century the twentieth century ha ha moving on. We convinced the hot on lady to bring US sales and bring them back to space up to me. Alien Wales Embiid A uh-huh Um We did a tale a tale about well. It's crazy. This movie's nine base base. Sometimes you've got to kidnap them. Wales to save the Human Race wait if you kill all the wealth they become killer whales thirty a years and we still have learned that if you fuck with the humpback whales one day they're. GonNa come back well. Chorus world is has done being extending shown who's coming for Listen that is so cute like fuck. fantastic job loved the song unbelievable. Malians baby cannot believe he wrote that this morning. I think it's hit. What's the other word? Nash Underground is going to do the second. I oh my God Oriana `Grande Unbelievable Shaggy's is with different shaggy. No seriously really loved the to you. Thank you guys so much for for coming besides the fast and furious musical obviously we've got to plug that people gotta come see that show is there stuff. How can people find you online the fast and furious musical parody you just search it. We got an instagram or at Brad lives dreams for me great and at Joe. We is Okay A. Y. Joey is okay for me. Okay awesome. I'm glad to hear you're okay not superbe getting along address. Where can people find you. Yeah you can find me trace Dominguez on Youtube instagram twitter. I'm all over the place just making science in Steph. Teaching people thinks it's great love it well. Thank you guys again for for joining us. see you next time bye bye. Bad Signs is hosted and produced by me. The East Edinburgh are associated producers. Emily Feld our editor is Lucas Bolinger and the executive is brought. Kushner falls on Instagram at bad signs show. That's at bed science show or feel free to send an email bad signs at secret dot com. That's bad signs at secret secret DOT COM. Let us know what you think about the show any movies we should do in the future. I always appreciate getting your emails and of course leave us and I tunes review that let the other people here about the show and I'll see see you all next week bye.

Wales Brad Joey Los Angeles google San Francisco Michael Keaton Einstein Patrick Stewart Jerry NASA Dick Holes International Whaling Commissi Super Old School school Lawrence livermore lab Ethan Edinburgh Joy John Sunshine Sunshine basketball physicist
Episode 161: Stories to Wash Hands By

the memory palace

15:58 min | 1 year ago

Episode 161: Stories to Wash Hands By

"This episode of the Memory Palace brought by friends at ever lane. This time of year is just the best forever land especially here in L. A. Because you could wear a whole year's wardrobe in one weekend could start the morning in my Chore Jacket. An hour later I am in my perfectly cut. Every and t shirt my premium Japanese denim jeans. Next Dan might be in the air shorts. Maybe head out to the mountains throwing my Evelyn. Parka eveline makes only premium essentials. But they do it without charging a premium price. And right now you can check out our personalized collection and Evelyn Dot com slash memory. Plus you're going to get free shipping on your first order that has ever lean dot com slash memory evergreen dot com slash memory this amendment palaces brought to you by the Library Company of Philadelphia which just released his first graphic novel created and published by native American artists. Ghost river the fall and rise of the novel reimagined event that transformed colonial Pennsylvania. Read it now. It Goes River Dot Org. This is the Memory Palace. I'm naked male. This episode was recorded on April second. Two Thousand Twenty in my home in Los Angeles Wall sheltering in place per the order of state and local officials. I mentioned that for the benefit of those listening to this in the future whether that is decades from now somehow or merely next week when things may very well be very different than they are right now as of this date the Centers for Disease Control recommend that everyone wash their hands frequently and do so for at least twenty seconds. What follows twenty stories each twenty seconds long to assist you in that task one in Chicago and the teens in the nightclubs when there was nothing sexier nothing that said more about status and power about the thrill of being alive right. Dan In there than the automobile to dancers in the call. Girls doubt new perfume behind their ears and the street gasoline to the poet was sure he was dying a heart attack then several strokes in steering oblivion in the face. You had to confess. So William Carlos Williams told his wife everything about the affairs about how he had done her so wrong so often confessed all of it and then he lived for another fourteen years three. The civil war came to Wilmer McLean house. When Union soldiers came and took over his kitchen before the battle of bull run at the beginning of the war and he was forced to move. He found a lovely new home in Apple. Matic's Virginia where five years later soldiers came and kicked him out of that house. So Lee could surrender to grant in his living room for when Roger Payne her this the first recording of the song of Humpback Whale. He was sure it was the thing that would save them. If only the world could hear these creatures he would stop the slaughter that had put most whale species to the brink of extinction. He released an album of songs which directly inspired the save the Whales Movement a decade later the International Whaling Commission banned Deepwater Wailing. Five if the first film version of titanic released just a month after the sinking were lost. We could see Dorothy Gibson in the same way dress. Insane White Cardigan. She wore on the night. The ship struck an iceberg. And she was put into a lifeboat. But we could know how it felt to be in those same clothes pretending to be in that same lifeboat. Watching THE TITANIC. Sick blow the cold waves six. The used to be three legged races at every track. Meet think of the skill the intimacy either rhythmic genius of two sprinters. They set the still unbroken world record in April nineteen o nine or jointly running one hundred yards in the time between the closing bell in right now seven after Lincoln was killed and his successor was impeached. North and south shifted their conflicts to Congress known in government had an appetite for powerful. Executive Presidency was pointedly diminished. The staff budget was cut so much and so often that if you rang the doorbell at the White House during the presidency of Grover Cleveland. Man himself would often have to get up from his desk and go downstairs to open the door. Eight friend of mine once found customs form from eighteen forty five which provides all we know of this story an American sailor named James Stirling died of unknown causes while it see when his ship arrived in Brazil. The colonial government refused to bury him so he arrived home. After months and months see spent floating in a barrel of rum nine. Nine Fifty Nikita Khrushchev fell in love with Pepsi Cola which started a decades long illicit affair between the elites of the Soviet state. And sorry to editorialize here. The were soda the eighties the USSR Wanted Pepsi. Trade restrictions meant that. They couldn't pay cash so they gave. Pepsico Three Billion Dollars Worth of decommissioned military equipment which the company then sold off to scrap metal companies. But until they did Pepsi had the sixth largest military in the world. Ten the red of the redcoats that projected British powers. They patrolled the cobblestone streets with the American colonies that Washington's men could see dotting the snow row after row as they marched. The battlefields of Trenton. Came from dime made by the subjects of another colonial power Mexican interros in the Desert Sun. Crushing the insects that live on the nopal. Cactus for the Prophet of their Spanish Masters Eleven. The room was too small and so many of the women had to sit in the floor two days after her husband's first presidential inauguration. Eleanor Roosevelt called. The first of what would do three hundred and forty-eight press conferences open only to female writers. It was the height of the depression newspapers cutting staff and often the first reporters to go where women so the first lady gave them exclusive access to information to help keep them employed twelve in the nineteen twenty s before radio was dominated by major broadcasters and big corporations there were smaller players were their own visions of what radio should be. This program is designed to try to help you with your dental problems in the home to give such advice and assistance. Such information as we will believe we'll be conducive to better teeth and better health thirteen in Oregon. During the Great Depression. Destitute men having wandered West for work in finding none waiting forest fires and the desperate hope that they would be paid to help. Put fourteen more than a year. After Lewis and Clark set out from Saint Louis. Having lost men having navigated treacherous falls having nearly starved to death in the snow the reach the end of the Missouri River stirred up at a wall of mountains new. They had failed. There was no northwest passage. They abandoned their boat in sit down toward the mountains. Fifteen July nineteen sixty in a marsh beside Cape Canaveral as the nation's first weather satellite launched not long before circled unseen. Somewhere above. Two naturalists made this recording a Dusky. Seaside sparrow species went extinct in nineteen sixteen having lost the race to launch satellites into space. The United States wanted to demonstrate to the world. Just what they were capable left so they launched a plan. That would send a rocket to the moon armed with a nuclear warhead explosion. Which would be bright enough to be visible from Earth with the naked eye? They spent a year working on it for scrapping. The idea afraid that it was a bad look for America and could cause problems for the Moon. Colonists there were sure would living there by the nineteen seventy s seventeen seventeen eighty six hopped up on the whole defeating the British in starting their own country thing. Thomas Jefferson John Adams are in England taking meetings and just basically feeling themselves and then one day. They're giving formal tour of Shakespeare's house. At stratford-upon-avon those two jackasses goofing around teenage grows in a field trip and other guide isn't looking adams chips off a piece of Shakespeare's chair for a souvenir eighteen Nearly one hundred years until one of his fellow. Magicians figured out. How David Devon did his greatest trick so can we? At least hold the wonder for the seconds we have left of a magician on a darkened stage holding a candle a beautiful woman dressed as a moth with flowing wings entering as if drawn to him John to the flame embracing him in folding him in her silken wings Vanishing Nineteen. He had given the parrot to his wife. Rachel as a present a companion in in when she died. Andrew Jackson kept the Barrett taught him to swear like a sailor and thought it was funny and when Jackson died having outlived his wife but not her parrot. The president's funeral was stopped when a cursing? Parrot had to be escorted from the chapel. Twenty thirty million people lost power in the eastern seaboard of the United States in November Ninth. Nineteen sixty five more than eight. Hundred Thousand New Yorkers. Learn this when they're subway cars went dark screech to a halt in pitch black tunnels untold. Thousands walked home to the boroughs to New Jersey over Manhattan's five bridges as night fell in. Who knows how many people looked up in who knows how many stars visible for the first time that night and who knows how long this episode of the Memory Palace was written and produced by me. Nate demeo with engineering assistance from Elizabeth. Oberg the show gets research assistance from lies McGraw. The Memory Palace is a proud proud member of Radio. Topa from PRI. The collective of independently owned and operated podcasts kept strong by our mutual support from financial support of listeners. Like you I've a couple of recommendations for you. That might help you through these strange days. I there is a new season. One of my favorite shows is called. This is love the perfect inside project from phoebe Lauren. From the show criminal it is a show with stories about love in all its forms. This season I feel like just in time. It's all about animals and you're GONNA love it. Good Radio Topi DOT. Fm to learn more about it and all the other radio shows and one more thing I'm excited to tell you that I have just released a new podcast with my friend. Karina Longworth of the show. You must remember this. It is a movie club for the stuck at home. It's called. It's the pictures that got small and each week for as long as it feels right. We are going to be reaching out. Our respective shelters to a friend will watch one of those big screen classics. We've never found the time to see and watch it now that we have nothing but time the first episode is up now joined by Ryan Johnson. The writer Director of Nice out last Jedi and brick and looper and the brothers Bloom talking about the movie castaway Tom Hanks Place Trivia Games and we recommend movies that you might want to watch as wait this whole thing out. We are also going to be raising money to support independent theaters and movie societies. During this very difficult time for them again it is called. It's the pictures that got small. You can search for it and subscribe and rate and review in all the regular places. You find podcasts. Or you can go to small picture. Show Dot Com as always there will be a new memory palace in a couple of weeks and in the meantime please be well. These be safe to care of each other. I promise I'll do him torch again. Talk Radio X.

Memory Palace Thomas Jefferson John Adams Dan United States Evelyn Dot Philadelphia Pepsi Pennsylvania Ghost river William Carlos Williams Japanese International Whaling Commissi Centers for Disease Control Dorothy Gibson Nikita Khrushchev Shakespeare Congress Eleanor Roosevelt Pepsico Cape Canaveral
50 Shades of Gray Whales

Sidedoor

27:24 min | 2 years ago

50 Shades of Gray Whales

"Hey side, our listeners, it's Halima first of all a very belated happy new year. Now that the government shutdown is over we're working on a new batch of cider episodes. I'm actually out of DC right now. And I just finished an interview for a story that you'll hear soon. A new episode of side door is coming your wait two weeks from today. But while you wait we wanted to re share a story that we love from the fall. Just in case you missed it the first time around so here it is. This is side door a podcast from the Smithsonian with support from PR X for the first time. I'm your host Halima Shaw. So I've never seen a whale in the wild. I grew up in the midwest. And I guess it's one of those out of sight out of mind things the only contact I've actually ever had with a whale has been through pop culture. So from the monsters of Moby, Dick and Pinocchio to the really sad whales and whale rider and Free Willy and also Free Willy two and Free Willy three. But when I heard Nick pints and talk about them a few weeks ago. I could not stop thinking about Wales. But I should also add that the only person who's more curious about Wales than I am is side doors producer, Justin O'Neill. Hey, Justin Haleema, Andrew flatter me. Well, I know you went to the whale garage. Justin, tell me what it was like. Yeah. So the Smithsonian's whale garage. It's part of this Massoni ins behind the scenes what people call the museum support center. It's where the museums keep all of their millions of objects that aren't on public display in the museum's and you need to put them somewhere. And you know, downtown DC, there's no extra space. So I was brought here by Nick pints. And okay, let's take a second to describe what Nick pints in is like, I think of him as sort of like a globe trotting Indiana Jones type of guy like I get emails from from Alaska. And then next time we talk he'll be heading to Oman. So he's just everywhere at once. I should also mention here that Nick is the curator of fossil marine mammals. That's why he travels a lot and he works at the national museum of natural history. And he studies marine mammals around the world like ancient whales and dolphins. Mostly. And let's just say he's very passionate about his work. Yeah. That's an understatement. So what was the whale garage? Like. Well, the first thing you see when you walk into the building are these two huge, blue whale bones. And here's Nick telling me about those. Yes. So here we are walking up to US M to six eight seven three one, and these are the largest blue whale jawbones any museum collection on the planet that are about twenty three feet long way, some twelve thousand pounds these belong to a ninety two foot long female, but there's all kinds of other bones in there to here check this. That's blue stone. Holy smokes. That's like this buildings. I don't know forty feet tall. Probably can't roll that skull standing up into this building. So Wales are big I've got that. But I've never actually seen a blue whale or skeleton. So gimme a point of reference yet. They're like borderline. Overwhelming and size. But since I don't really know like a useful size comparison. Here's Nick explaining that to me. So I asked him about the size of a blue whales eyeballs for that blue L probably be size grapefruit, and how big is their heart other heart. So there's a great plastination blue whale heart. That's on display at the Royal Ontario museum from blue Elsa just collected few years ago off the coast of Newfoundland that heart waisome four hundred pounds. It's got vessels that at their largest or the diameter dinner plates. It probably looks like gigantic couch. Like, yeah. So when you live down on catch at home, you can think about the size of blue L heart. That'd be a big couch in we should also say that the importance of this place isn't just about Wales. And you know, how big they are. It's an act of research center for neck and other researchers basically to watch early whales evolve into modern wells because you can go line up. Gray, well, skull a humpback skull fin whale skull Luella skull that kind of side by side comparison is kind of gold standard in natural history. Studies. So that's the wheel rush. Thanks, justin. So we know that whales are mammals they give live birth. They nurse their young and they breathe oxygen which also means that they can drown which is very surprising. They first of all on land, and they can learn complex behaviors from one another, and we have such a complicated relationship with them because for centuries we hunted them relentlessly. They went from like everywhere to pretty much nowhere. And now, we're in a moment where many types of Wales in a lot of places are protected, but that's just in time for a new pressure to test their resilience. So this time on side door. We'll tell the story of all Wales through the eyes of one particular species the gray whale. It was once thought to be extinct, but gray whales. Had some surprises in store and they keep surprising today. There is success story with the twist. One more side door get even more behind the scenes access by joining our Email list for new episode notifications and exclusive behind the scene content from side door episodes directly from Tony. You'll also get to hear about news and updates across the Smithsonian including new exhibit and discoveries the Smithsonian powered by people like you sign up today. At sl that EDU slash side door to hear more. That's as I that EDU slash side door. After Justin's trip to the whale garage. I sat down with Nick pints in for a chat. He's a Smithsonian paleobiologist in ancient will curator, but we like to call him the whale yo biologist, Nick recently wrote a book, titled spying on Wales the past present and future of earth's most awesome creatures and I wanted to start with some hard questions. What is a whale Wales? A lineage of hoofed mammal many tens millions years ago that went in different direction and adapted over the course of geologic time to life completely divorced from land. But in the water, and yeah, you just heard him, right? He just called Wales descendants of hoofed mammals they used to live on land and their closest living relatives are actually hippos. Some fifty odd million years ago, Wales had four limbs and blade like teeth. And probably had for, but that's a very different beast from the whales today. Nick said that these land welling pre wells, probably lived near water, and like Wales, they probably ate fish. But yet it's very different from what people actually think of as a wail. I'm trying to picture what animal the prehistoric will look like because right now, I'm imagining like a golden retriever something it was probably a very weird. I don't think he could really just pick one up fifty million years ago, and you know, pet it probably wouldn't enjoy that might snap at you. But yeah, they they looked weird. I mean, there's some some of these early species of whales, and there's a lot of different stripes. These early whales. Some look more like authors with long snouts others. Maybe looked more like sea lions. There's a whole variety two pints and says it's hard to know what I pushed Wales from land into the water full-time. Maybe they were good at hunting food in the water. Maybe there were land predators that they were avoiding or maybe their habitat suddenly changed so over the course of tens of millions of years evolution's transformed Wales from animals that splashed about rivers to animals that range from pulled Opole. And I think that's remarkable. For millions of years Wales. Kept evolving from land mammals into really good ocean creatures their finger bones flattened and were wrapped into broad paddles nostrils shifted from the tip of their nose back between their eyes, and they got really really big. The blue whale is the largest animal that's ever lived on the planet. The biggest estimated to be one hundred and ten feet long and over three hundred eighty thousand pounds. That's as long as a basketball court and has heavy as thirty elephants. And in addition to blue whales, their eighty seven other species of whales their humpback whales. Say whales, minke whales, right whales. Sperm whales. Narwhal dolphins. Twenty two kinds of beat Wales and many more their diverse, but the Wailua of Wales and an excellent example to understand the story of all Wales is the gray whale grey whales are different from many of the other big whales that they have very. Postal lifestyle hanging out migrating, not more than a few kilometers off the coastline gray whales live in the north Pacific, and they're known to be very easy going almost friendly and a lot of videos on YouTube show whales approaching tourists in boats. The council comeback. The even bring their babies with them, and they're curious. So I think a gray whale. They probably don't get the credit. They deserve. You know? The Rodney Dangerfield of of Wales. I mean, they they have gun metal grey kinda modeled skin. They have kind of a blunt beak like face. It can be really friendly. Their blows are heart shaped size-wise gray wills are kind of Goldilocks wail, not too big not too small and too scientists. They're basically medium sized. But I think what makes them really interesting is is the scales of their lives. They migrate ten thousand miles every year, and they do that across incredible latitudes. And they're clearly able to do things that other whales aren't. So the way that gray whales live their lives is that in the summer. They fatten up along Alaska's coast scarfing critters along the seafloor. And then in fall, they swim all the way down to Baja California, we're pregnant females give birth and the rest, they pretty much made and frolic gray whales shelter. All winter in these shallow Pacific lagoons. On the coast. They wait until the babies are strong enough to make the swim back north in the spring. This is one of the longest mammal migrations on earth. But it's in these same picturesque lagoons where the gray whale story. Takes a turn in the place that friendly gray whales turn for safety. They were ambushed and they were slaughtered by us. They were hunted in the nineteenth century. But because they're breeding grounds the one place where they would migrate from and back Baja California they were nearly systematically wiped out because Wailers in the Pacific figured out where they were moving. Humans have been killing whales for meat for thousands of years. The earliest depictions of people hunting whales came from Korea and data's far back as six thousand c Wales have gigantic sizes, and that's kind of on Spiring itself. And also a source of food and nutrition sustenance, and that's still true today for Arctic peoples throughout the world in many indigenous cultures even in the tropics. They still hunt whales, but their size and ocean-going nature. Kept them safe from going the way of the woolly mammoth or the dodo they were hard to kill. But large scale whaling really got going in the seventeen hundreds. Hunters killed whales for their oil, which was used for soap lamb, fuel their meat was sold in markets and bones used as fertilizer wailing was obviously dangerous for whales. But anyone who's read Moby? Dick knows that it could be dangerous for whalers as well. The killing was done from small boats that were road until they were right next to a sixty thousand pound gray whale. Then the boat's crew would drive their harpoons deep into its flesh at this point whales usually dove deep trying to get away. The harpoons were attached to lines tied to the boat often men were tossed overboard when Wales pulled these small boats under. Wailers called gray whales devil fish for their ill-temper after they'd been harpooned. It also tells you something about just how lucrative the oil and other products had to have been for people undertake this incredibly risky approach to killing a large mammal at sea. And if they successfully killed Awale they had to strip wide sheets of blubber from the whale as floated next to the ship and boil it down in giant pots, so you had to have some kind of fire aboard the ship to render that tissue down to its oily components. That's risky all the way through. I probably would not sign up for it. But I think many of the people didn't have the choice to do. That was an economic reality for them, hunting, different Wales. Two different strategies in the mid eighteen hundreds. There was a crucial invention that let whalers kill at wildly unsustainable. Rates and explosive harpoon was shot from ship bound cannon exploding on impact. And so that led to a scale of slaughter that we now knows over two million. Maybe three million whales were killed in the twentieth century. And I think it speaks something to the abundance of whales that were out there that we were able to kill so many. No one today remembers what it was like to have billions of passenger pigeons flying around in these flocks that reportedly blotted out the sun. And in that way. I don't think we really understand what the oceans were like before whaling really got got to be the way it was. If you missed it two to three million whales were killed in the twentieth century by the end of the nineteen twenties. There were so few gray whales left that people thought they might be extinct. So what changed we'll find out after a quick break? What would it look like if we all listened more listening to audio books can inspire and motivate us and even bring people closer together. There's no better place to listen than audible and with audible originals, there's custom content that's made just for members since audible has the largest selection of audio books on the planet. You'll have plenty of audio book options right now, I'm listening to a book called sapiens, a brief history of humankind charts, the last seventy thousand years of biology in history to make sense of the evolution of us, homo sapiens. You can get your first audiobook free along with two audible original titles. And when you start a thirty day trial. He'll even get access to fitness programs. Just Bizet audible dot com slash side door. That's audible dot com. Com slash side door. You can also text side door to five hundred five hundred to get started. That's S I D E D O R take the time to listen on audible. Okay. So when we left off things weren't looking so good for gray whales or any wheels. For that matter in the eighteen and nineteen hundreds whaling was big business around the world whales, especially the largest species were being killed by the million without giving much thought to how many of these are we killing in. How many are there left? One of the first people to take that question seriously was Remington Kellogg. He was the Smithsonian paleontologist in the nineteen thirties. And he has a surprise in store for our gray whale friends. He's a complicated. Figure for me. Because one I never met him. He died in nineteen sixty nine and Secondly Kellogg had the same job as Nick Pien sin separated by more than half a century. If you do a literature search on him, you're gonna find a lot of papers about fossil Wales which appeals to me professionally, but what's really really interesting about him. I think is that he was a diplomat as much as he was the scientist is one of the first what I'd call science diplomat. Kellogg wasn't the type of guy who kept a journal about his hopes and dreams we don't really know much about what he thought. But here's what we do know he recognized that whales weren't going to be around much longer. If we kept killing them as quickly as we were. But how could he make the public care about Wales? When we didn't know they live in close knit family units. And that they grieve they're dead people just saw Wales. Huge monsters kind of like the way people saw sharks. After the movie jaws came out. It's safe to say that when Wales were slaughtered. The public wasn't too worried about it. So he and other like minded scientists help create a series of organizations that became known as the International Whaling Commission on. So I describe in the book is kind of like a gentleman's hunting club. I mean, it's a very different way to think about conservation than we do today and Kellogg presided over it for decades. Now, they didn't just say, hey, everyone. Stop killing whales. It was a powerful industry all they managed with some catch limits on how many whales country might kill. And at the time these limits weren't really taken seriously. But even so in nineteen thirty six Kellogg and his crew created a ban on killing gray whales. And right whales. There were very few gray wills left, but it was easier to create protections for a whale that people couldn't find during this time in of the mid twentieth century. I think most wailing wasn't really focused on gray whales there. So few left. Nobody really knew how many there were pints and says that for him it's hard to sort out Kellogg's legacy. Sure, he tried to save the whales, but he definitely didn't succeed in creating meaningful protections. It was the first step though. I think he watched the decimation of many populations species pushed to the brink of extinction. And he was doing his best. But the real outcomes that you think a scientists might care about largely didn't happen. You know, he died not knowing if Wales made it through the twentieth century or not in the eighteen years. Remington Kellogg served on the International Whaling Commission, roughly one million big whales were killed. But in the fifteen years after Kellogg step down from the I w c two things happened because we had killed so many whales whale oil was harder to get as the twentieth. Century war on whale oils, commercial use was increasingly replaced by petroleum oil the stuff from the ground. But the main reason we stopped killing whales was a social shift. We knew more about Will's by the nineteen seventies people cared. So we discovered WALE song or discovery knee, biological sonar, the toothed whales used although scientific discoveries were happening at a time of the emerging environmental movement, and so nineteen seventy two with the US marine mammal Protection Act that really set a course for how we approach marine mammals and Wales are included in that that now today I'd say it's much more about protecting coastal environments, people get that that protect the whales. Protect our our the entire ecosystem in which they belong to in the seventy one years since gray whales were first officially protected their numbers have slowly rebounded. It's not that there are about twenty thousand of them off the US Pacific coast. So that's good. Right. But as usual, it's not that simple because Wales have other pressures to and guess who those. Pressures are caused by. Yeah, us the biggest of those challenges boils down to our impact on the planet. Humans live all over the planet, including the oceans, and wherever our fishing lines, or international ships, are that's a point of conflict for whales are switched to patrol Eum based oil is also causing a major climate shift, which has a lot of environmental impacts. This leaves the future uncertain for many, Wales and pretty much everything else. Right. Clementines is going to affect different species in different ways that we know that there's traits that are going to probably be important for different species of whales to make it through the humans that includes having a broad geographic range, probably not being too big or too small having a broad diet is probably pretty important. And for those of us keeping score at home, a broad geographic range, medium size and flexible diet. Basically describes our good friend, the great will they're probably going to be the winners in. Planet IRS in the ages humans, but it's not going to be just this wild success story. They have to live long side us the consequences for Wales for an ice remark decker, probably not so bad increased biological productivity with less ice more. Sunlight, but you can bet the humans are also gonna use those freeways too. So for gray whales climate change might not be such a big deal. So let's say a gray whale that has trawled up and down the Pacific coast gets curious and ventures into the newly ice free Arctic. She might thank a whole new ocean. Let's check it out. Our curious will finds a lot of fish and a relatively uncrowded environment at least for now. And then suppose that whale keeps going this curious gray whale might soon find themselves in a -nother entire ocean that currently has no gray whales in it. There were Atlantic gray will centuries ago, but it's that they might have been some of the earliest casualties of whale hunting. This little hypothetical might seem a bit fanciful a nice what if? Until you find out that it's already happened. Gray whales have now been spotted in the Atlantic actually in the Mediterranean. There's a little loss gray whale that was spotted in twenty twelve and then two years later, another gray will spotted off the coast Namibia different gray whale. So think about that two separate whales swim thousands of miles out of their way into an ocean that they hadn't been in in centuries. And those are just the two we've seen it's entirely possible. That others have also made that journey. Maybe that's not so crazy. If you routinely migrate ten thousand miles. I mean, those are huge huge vast numbers for us. So you know, some biologists would say, well, these are just a little lost Wales. But the most likely route that they got there was through an ice free northwest passage in the Canadian Arctic. So we will not be surprising to me. And I read about this in the book, if we see more and more gray whales and at a certain point in the next fifty one hundred years where wheels. Come back and recolonize. The Atlantic might not be surprising to see them off our own Atlantic seaboard. And so there are a million things that we should worry about in the age of climate change. I mean, all science is very clear that things have been changing and sudden change is bad for most species, which tend to adapt slowly. But maybe it's nice to think that at least for one species. I'm talking about the medium sized gray whale that could it might just be okay. It reminds us that even when things seemed daunting for nature, it takes passionate people who care about Wales like Remington Kellogg and Nick Pyan sin, and if there's any lesson to take from gray whales, it's that if you just leave the door open, a crack nature will sometimes prize you and do what these whales have done for the past fifty million years, adapt, evolve and survive. You've been listening to side door a podcast from the Smithsonian with support from PR X, if you're curious about Nick pints book and learning more about Will's, the title is once again spying on wills the past present and future of earth's most awesome creatures. You can find it wherever you buy your books while you can't visit next garage. There are whale skeletons and even a life size model of North Atlantic right whale that you can go. See it's at the national museum of natural history. Cider is made possible by funding from the secretary of the Smithsonian as well as the Smithsonian national board and the Smithsonian is funded in part, thanks to listeners like you. And if you've been enjoying side door, let other people know by writing a review apple podcasts or give us a follow on Twitter. Our account is at side door pod. Our podcast team is Justin O'Neill Jason or fannin just saw dick Greg Fisk, Elizabeth Pilger and Larry Koch editorial guidance from Andrea mistaken extra support comes from John Barth, and Genevieve sponsor our show is mixed by tar Fuda. Our theme song and other episode music or by brake master cylinder. And if you want to sponsor show, please Email sponsorship at PR x dot org. I'm your host, Helene muschamp. Thanks for listening. We can go look at a skull kind of put our fist inside the orbit. Besides.

Wales Remington Kellogg Nick Smithsonian Nick pints Alaska scientist Justin Justin O'Neill Gray International Whaling Commissi Moby national museum of natural Oman Halima Shaw DC Justin Haleema Royal Ontario museum Wailua of Wales
Why is Japan still slaughtering whales?

RNZ: The Detail

20:26 min | 1 year ago

Why is Japan still slaughtering whales?

"Japanese tourists out while watching Ching and Japan's own waters lease than toe hundred kilometers away still in Japan's waters wireless are hunting commissioner for the first time in thirty years a few hours ago. This 10-meter-long whale was harpooned off the Pacific coast of Japan now he's being pull ashore and the little wailing town of one of the wailers here a delighted that after thirty three years they're finally free taunt again. I'm Sharon Kelly and on the detail today hardly any one eight hundred tons of at a stockpiled and freezes so why is Japan instill slaughtering Wales really doesn't make a whole lot of seeks to me from an economic point of view from a biological point of view you almost take to come up with something or the cultural political because it sure doesn't make any kind of rational saints is gone from Antarctica to its own interior tree and slash the numbers but whale conservationist and Ataka University professor Lewis Luton sees. It's no bitter the mic where else they were hunting in the southern ocean iron reasonably good shape there is good numbers of those but in Japanese waters there are far smaller wild populations so if it's a straight swap off taking a few hundred wells and the Antarctic waterson mainly making wells and then switching to whole mix of species in Japanese waters that would be a very bad thing sick backwards for well consultation layout plan to take two hundred twenty seven wells in Japanese waters this year and from what I've Seen sci-fi this includes several species including minke whales beaked whales and other species so this is a move away from hunting latch. Well populations like some action making that are relatively closer to the original pre whaling population SARS towards awards hunting whale populations that Italy depleted and some of which for example one of the Cybele populations Japanese waters is so a depleted that it may in fact go to people think this is not as bad as going to the top two to hunt whales. Why a these not such a big deal as being made of it that Japan is sticking to its own territorial waters or is it the fact that it's actually what it's doing is not illegal echo from a biological point of view what they're doing now as wis- so they have moved from hunting relatively large relatively a k well population to now hunting civil much slower populations that are heavily depleted and so from a biological point of view? This is much worse possibly from a diplomatic point of view. This is Beta so they Webuye wiling minky whales to the south of New Zealand that we could argue these files they on coming through museum quarters to go north to woma water in winter to breed and going back to the Antarctic waters and summer to feed so perhaps what's going on is that this is affecting the Japanese people and Japanese well populations Sion's rather them this affecting well populations that if you like belong to the world so internationally there is less of an argument because people are at least pleased that they are no longer carrying out scientific whaling so one of the several loopholes recalls for whaling has now been closed the years. New Zealand and Australia have lead the way in condemning Japan for its so called cooled scientific whaling we've worked for years. I've the prediction of wiles getting Jew engaging with Japan to get them to change the way change what they do. Ooh and the hasn't been hasn't been successful here so it's disappointing law overall a good relationship Japan but were opposed to the Assan tiffin wailing wailing in the Southern Ocean Japan slashed its annual quarter in the Antarctic by about a food to six hundred that's after the International Court of Justice ruled in two thousand fourteen that the country's research whaling program wasn't as scientific as it had argued there calls for New Zealand to send a navy ship to stop Japan Dan from resuming its wild hunt on the tactic and violating an International Court of Justice ruling just when you thought high clashes like this one in February twenty fourteen had it ended see sheep and activists and Japanese wireless could be waging war again after Japan announced its to resume well hunting and and the tactic it's not unexpected. I mean we've seen how stubborn they've been in the past but what what is really changing right. This is potentially going to be international criminals. Both both parties have been at each other for decades but last year sea shepherd got its biggest catch when the most powerful you in court revoked Japan's permit to hunt wiles in the southern the notion then outrage and 2018 more than one hundred twenty pregnant whales were killed during Japan's annual hunt last summer. A report report has revealed prompting outrage among conservationists last December Japan announced that it was quitting the international whaling commission so it could resume Jim commercial hunting if they do this in Japan will return back on the world. Japan argues that it's wailing commercially for cultural reasons. It's legal legal just like it is in Norway and Iceland but what doesn't stick up is that whale meat consumption and Japan has dropped from two hundred thousand tons in the one thousand nine hundred sixty s to around five thousand tonnes now the people who grew happen postwar Japan and the couple of decades after the war game Asian awful lot of whale and their school lunches laid on the schools in Japan often fried Panko breadcrumbs news or sort of lightly dusted in flour and deep fried and like mice things that you get feared at school or borden in school kind of got a bad name and has those memories for people know who've had their experience so you you know people don't want to eat whale Penny Shane or lectures and Japanese studies at Mesa University. She lived there for several years in the eighties and returns. It's every year to see her. Japanese husband's family penny. Tell me have you ever eaten while mate yes. Have I ate a sort of cook at the table. Well meets casserole. Actually this was many years ago and it was quite as simple casserole with united the Leeza. It's quite popular initial. Now is a salad leaf and you knew that you were eating whale meat at the time. He has no attempt to disguise the fact that it was perfectly acceptable that seemed over the whale meat. There was no I mean it was rather unusual. Oh I must say it was the first and the last time I've ever eaten whalemeat because was a luxury item and it still a luxury the item it costs more than two hundred New Zealand dollars per kilo taste. The quite oily was very tender was like beef. We've kind of fishy fishy fish oily taste or did you feel weird at all about eating it. I sort of felt whole sort of Frisson. I suppose that I was eating something which was that morty from the point of view of New Zealand at least Um that's decent quite a lot of strange things in Japan and it was just one yet another strange kind of while it was no and I don't know where it came from either what ordinary Japanese people think about wailing in terms of public issues. It's pretty low on the radio. I don't think Japanese people are thinking very much about the pros and cons of Wayland and there's all actually affair asked about do support whaling apparently according to a recent survey by a university in Japan seventy percent civil zero two Japanese support Wailing Gosh this hi Oy is but the irony is say don't eat well very often at all. It's very very small quantities per-capita about forty grams per year which is about the size of a slice of him and why don't they eat it because say lots of other things which are much nicer tweet like really nice beef really Nice Sushi. It's not something that Japanese people will say all young whale. Oh but some some people do but there are still people who are eating it. There are people who are eating it but more as kind of a novelty actually I'd say lease and you see it in supermarkets they still way or bacon as well as well meet apparently wind Japan Standard commercial whaling they hit I to commit themselves to a certain kosher say of one hundred Wales per year and because they said they needed that number for research purposes they actually had to catch that number so the hit to keep on catching quite a high number of wells per year and that meant that of the years of the stockpile fit to considerable stockpile has built up in Japan apparently three three thousand seven hundred tonnes of stockpiled phrased as well as of the year in Japan. Why are they still l. Doing commercial whaling then it really doesn't make sense under something deeply irrational about the way Japan's pursue issue in windows does not demand when the rest of the world is very clearly against her. That seems to be pigheadedness kind of nationalism. I think a national prize that the Japanese well as Susan Trae in the Japanese personality whim if you tell Japanese awesome to do something and I have to be a little bit gingered here and say particularly Japanese males do the exact opposite oh they must be frustrating for your anyway. They just won't listen to you. They will say I understand keep undoing exactly the same thing and the more the outside world insists on some of the Japanese resist at seems that the Japanese it reached the point where are they saying well wailing and eating Japanese thing it's passive of our history and culture nat tradition. We're not going to be bossed around by the rest of the world and told what to do. Domestically even though that sort of attitude isn't isn't particularly popular outside Japan to lots of people have a very strong national spirit and want to see Japan standing up to the rest of the world with more backbone and I think their attitude kind of fuels this reaction to to whaling and they surmise and saw the suggestion that the whale hunting industry is dying one and will be finished contain years. Does that make sense to you. Will it could in terms of market forces because there isn't. There isn't the demand to eat well. This has had to see how commercially it can be sustained in Japan and the government itself is pouring huge amounts of money into wailing apparently fifty million American dollars spent am this year to promote wailing set right yeah so you know it's not as people buying well supporting industry industry at see. I think it's the government and has rather astounded to say in the cafeteria of the the Japanese Liberal Democratic Party which is the current ruling party in Japan. They have well carry on the menu being specially promotion as delicious and a high stem nola calorie so vet that sort of a symbol of the fence that the government is right behind wailing so that's the sound that's that's the sound of Wales pointing to each other little far away so there was this inconsistency in Japan's positions basically hunting because it spotted culture or are you willing for scientific purposes. Alex Book is an expert on Japan Japan Victoria University. He says commercial whaling is more logical and legal so this resumption of commercial whaling actually brought Japan's position in the argument made by the Japanese government ensued again. I've made it more consistent and logic so we are engaging engaging in commercial whaling because of culture so in this sense it's much more much more logical and makes much more sense now than it was before four it remains to be seen whether this culture will continue to exist this idea of whale meat consumption is father of Japanese culture. It's a relatively new idea it ends up because there will obviously whaling communities in Japan from by the dating back to twelfth century. I think Buchan function of whale meat was limited to certain communities Scottsdale communities and it was only after World War Two rail meat consumption became introduced nationally nationally mostly efforts by the occupation occupation authorities or by the American occupation authorities as Mrs Defeat the Japanese Japanese population which starving and you need a fraud team so how much does Japan Keel to the Japanese people care about chiefs the condemnation that has been going on for years about them wailing so two arguments so while needs yes. Yes Basically we agree with those that criticize US whaling is it's inhumane a Wales beautiful beautiful animals. We should be killing should beating them. Yes so this is one position which actually exists in Japan it does exist in Japan and and certain certain people disappointed but I think the majority are they basically they see this as another way of another instance of a father's misunderstanding on behalf of the International Society of Japan misunderstanding of Japanese culture disregard out of Japanese culture. you know some kind of discrimination against sculpture so I think the letter position is probably more providence in Japan than the so spoke activists said they were expecting calls for a boycott of Japan's two biggest intenational sporting events the twenty nine thousand nine Rugby World Cup and the twenty between T- Tokyo Olympic Games others on social media vowed to boycott both events and urged fans to follow suit and Louis Lucien thinks the debate Asian Japan will heat up. I think it's highly likely that protests will occur casino not really the right person to ask but it would be surprising if it acted on because the Japanese people seem quite divided on this issue so well watching tourism has become more and more a popular in Japan and my Japanese sea whales as wildlife not as food so it's possible that there even be sung debate discussion protests between these whale-watching companies and while hunting companies that sometimes so operating within a quite close proximity like a hundred or two hundred clones from each other so strange drain. Doesn't it yeah so there's quite a bit of video footage online where you can see Japan Japanese families going on while watching coaching bowed going well jumps handled the water and saying what magnificent creatures these are and how they could not imagine anybody eating it certainly not they had no intention whatsoever of eating so it seems it's a very small proportion of Japanese and Finnish finish elderly section of the public that are still interested than eating. Well mate certainly the economics. Don't stack the cup. This has been heavily subsidized while may just not very popular and certainly pulling it away from and tactic wars where would would bring very expensive to take these ships away down to the Antarctic and bring them back to Japan so by doing it more likely that will be slightly more profitable and while there are predictions that commercial whaling will die and five fifteen years solutions is it's not soon enough. I think if you're going to eat peaked made it mammals which I do I lamb and beef various thanks that it makes sense to choose a common species in unto choose something blink at the ribot end of the mental spectrum round than at the elephants and it also makes sense to choose a species that can be killed humanely whilst can take half an Arrow more to kill and obviously this would be completely unacceptable for any other animal like a cow or or shape so from a strictly biological point of view these are very long lift slow reproducing animals that just not a good bit for hunting and obviously they have highly complex social systems. They're very intelligent animals so it it. It's pretty rare for people to even want to eat. They saddles. That's the deep Talpur today. I'm Sharon brick. Kelly the child is brought to you by newsroom dot Kodaly and seed made possible by the seed inside on Innovation Fund hit the subscribe baton to stay across the detail every day and if you're on April please leave a rating as it helps other listeners find us. This episode was engineered by Rung Poetic and introduced by Alexia Russell Cakir.

Japan Japan Japan Japan Victoria Universit Wales Japanese Liberal Democratic Pa International Society of Japan Antarctic New Zealand Antarctic Sharon Kelly Italy Ching International Court of Justice commissioner Ataka University Lewis Luton Antarctica woma professor
50 Shades of Gray Whales

Sidedoor

26:21 min | 2 years ago

50 Shades of Gray Whales

"This is side door. A podcast from the Smithsonian with support from PR x. for the first time I'm your host Halima Shaw. So I've never seen a whale in the wild. I grew up in the mid west, and I guess it's one of those out of sight out of mind things. The only contact I've actually ever had with a whale has been through pop culture's so from the monsters of Moby Dick and Pinocchio to the release sad Wales and whale rider and Free Willy, and also Free Willy two and Free Willy three. But when I heard Nick pints and talk about them a few weeks ago, I could not stop thinking about Wales, but I should also add that the only person who's more curious about Wales than I am is side doors producer, Justin O'Neill, Justin Haleema, and you flatter me. Well, I know you went to the whale garage Justin. Tell me what it was like. Yeah, so the Smithsonian's Wilga Raj. It's part of the Smithsonian's behind the scenes what people call the museum support center. It's where the museums keep all of their millions of objects that aren't on public display in the museum's, and you need to put them somewhere and downtown DC. There's no extra space. So I was brought here by Nick pints, and. Okay. Let's take a second to describe what Nick pints in is like, I think of him as sort of like a globe trotting Indiana Jones type of guy, like I get emails from from Alaska. And then next time we talk, he'll be heading to Oman. So he's just everywhere at once. I should also mention here that Nick is the curator of fossil marine mammals. That's why he travels a lot and he works at the national museum of natural history, and he studies marine mammals around the world like ancient whales dolphins mostly. And let's say he's very passionate about his work. That's an understatement. So what was the whale garage like? Well, the first thing you see when you walk into the building, are these two huge blue whale job owns and here's Nick telling me about those. Yeah. So here we are walking up to US 'em to six, eight, seven, three one. And these are the largest blue l. job owns any museum collection on the planet that are about twenty three feet long way. Some twelve thousand pounds. These belong to a ninety, two foot long female, but there's all kinds of other bones in there to check this. That's a blue stone. Hold lease smokes. That's like this buildings. I don't know. Forty feet tall, probably can't roll that skull standing up into this building. So whales are big. I've got that, but I've never actually seen a blue whale or skeleton. So gimme a point of reference yet. They're like borderline. Overwhelming inside, but since I don't really know, like a useful size comparison, here's Nick explaining that to me. So I asked him about the size of blue whales, eyeballs for that blue l. probably size grapefruit. And how big is their heart other heart? So there's a great plastination blue whale heart on display at the Royal Antero museum from blue. ELS collected few years ago off the coast Newfoundland that heart weighs four hundred pounds got vessels that at their largest are the diameter dinner plates. It probably looks like a gigantic couch. Yeah. So when you lie down on catch at home, you can think about the size of blue l. heart. That'd be a big couch, and we should also say that the importance of this place isn't just about Wales and you know how big they are. It's an act of research center for neck and other researchers basically to watch early whales evolve into modern wells because you can go lineup gray, well, skull, a humpback skull in Wales skull blue, whale skull, that kind of side by side comparison is kind of the gold standard in natural history studies. So that's the Wilga rush. Thanks Justin. So we know that whales are mammals. They give live birth, they nurse their young and they breathe oxygen, which also means that they can drown, which is very surprising. They first of all on land and they can learn complex behaviors from one another. And we have such a complicated relationship with them because for centuries, we hunted them, relentlessly, they went from like everywhere. To pretty much nowhere. And now we're in a moment where many types of Wales in a lot of places are protected, but that's just in time for a new pressure to test the resilience. So this time on side door will tell the story of all Wales through the eyes of one particular species. The gray whale. It was once thought to be extinct. But gray whales had some surprises in store and they keep surprising us today there a success story with a twist. How would you like even more side door access? Join our Email list for bonus content from our episodes directly from Tony, you'll even get to hear from the Smithsonian school network of experts conducting critical research, making a stunning discoveries and designing all inspiring exhibitions. It's like having a VIP badge to our podcast. Perfect for curious, passionate people like you, visit sl that eighty use lash side door to sign up today. That's s. i. that eighty you slash side or. After Justin's trip to the whale garage. I sat down with Nick pints in for a chat. He's a Smithsonian paleobiologist in ancient will curator, but we like to call him the William biologist. Nick recently wrote a book titled spying on Wales the past present and future of earth's most awesome creatures. And I wanted to start with some hard questions. What is Awale Wales lineage of hoofed mammal, many tens millions years ago that went in different direction and adapted over the course of geologic time to life completely divorced from land, but in the water. And yeah, you just heard him, right? He just called Wales descendants of hoofed mammals. They used to live on land and their closest living relatives are actually hippos. Some fifty odd million years ago. Wales had four limbs. And blade like teeth and probably had for, but that's a very different beast from the whales today. Nick said that these land welling pre wells probably lived near water and like Wales. They probably ate fish, but yet it's very different from what people actually think of as a way all I'm trying to picture what animal the prehistoric will look like. Because right now I'm imagining like a golden retriever something. It was probably a very weird look. I don't think he could really just pick one up fifty million years ago and you know pet. It probably wouldn't enjoy that might snap at you. But yeah, they, they looked weird. I mean, there's some some of these early species of whales, and there's a lot of different stripes. These early whales. Some look more like authors with long snouts. Others maybe looked more like sea lions. There's a whole variety, two pints and says, it's hard to know what I pushed Wales from land into the water full-time. Maybe they were good at hunting food in the water. Maybe there were land predators that they were avoiding or maybe their habitat suddenly changed. So over the course of tens of millions of years, evolution's transformed Wales from animals that splashed about rivers to animals that range from pulled Opole. And I think that's remarkable. For millions of years Wales kept evolving from land mammals into really good ocean creatures, their finger bones flattened and were wrapped into broad paddles nostrils shifted from the tip of their nose back between their eyes, and they got really, really big. The blue whale is the largest animal that's ever lived on the planet. The biggest are estimated to be a hundred and ten feet long and over three hundred eighty thousand pounds. That's as long as a basketball court and as heavy as thirty elephants. And in addition to blue whales, their eighty seven other species of whales, their humpback whales say whales minke whales, right whales. Sperm whales NAR walls. Dolphins twenty two kinds of beat Wales and many more their diverse, but the Wailua of Wales and an excellent example to understand. The story of all Wales is the gray, whale grey. Whales are different from many of the other big whales that they have very Costa. Oh, lifestyle hanging out migrating not more than a few kilometers off the coastline grails live in the north Pacific, and they're known to be very easy going, almost friendly, and a lot of videos on YouTube show Wales approaching tourists and boats. The council comeback or the other. The even bring their babies with them and they're curious. So I think a gray whale. They probably don't get the credit they deserve, you know. The Rodney Dangerfield of of Wales. I mean, they they have gun metal grey kinda modeled skin have kind of a blunt beak like face. They can be really friendly. Their blows are heart shaped, size-wise, gray, wills are kind of Goldilocks will not too big, not too small and too scientists. They're basically medium sized, but I think what makes them really interesting is, is the scales of their lives. They migrate ten thousand miles every year, and they do that across incredible latitudes and they're clearly able to do things that other whales aren't. So the way that gray whales live, their lives is that in the summer and they fatten up along Alaska's coast, scarfing critters along the seafloor. And then in fall, they swim all the way down to Baja California. We're pregnant, females give birth and the rest. They pretty much made and frolic gray whales shelter all winter in these shallow Pacific lagoons. The coast, they wait until the babies are strong enough to make the swim back north in the spring. This is one of the longest mammal migrations on earth, but it's in these same picturesque lagoons where the gray whale story takes a turn in the place that friendly gray whales turn for safety. They were ambushed and they were slaughtered by us. They were hunted in the nineteenth century, but because they're breeding grounds the one place where they would migrate from and back the hawk, California, they were nearly systematically wiped out because Wailers in the Pacific figured out where they were moving humans have been killing whales for meat for thousands of years. The earliest depictions of people hunting whales came from Korea and data's far back as six thousand c whales have gigantic sizes, and that's kind of on Spiring self and also a source of food and nutrition sustenance. And that's still true today for Arctic peoples throughout the world in many indigenous cultures, even in the tropics they still hunt whales, but their size and ocean-going nature kept them safe from going the way of the woolly mammoth or the dodo they were hard to kill, but large scale whaling really got going in the seventeen hundreds. Hunters killed whales for their oil which was used for soap lamb, fuel. Their meat was sold in markets, and bones used as fertilizer wailing was obviously dangerous for Wales, but anyone who's read Moby Dick knows that it could be dangerous for whalers as well. The killing was done from small boats that were road until they were right next to a sixty thousand pound gray, whale. Then the bugs crew would drive their harpoons deep into its flesh. At this point Wales usually dove deep trying to get away. The harpoons were attached to lines tied to the boat. Often, men were tossed overboard. When Wales pulled these small boats under. Wailers called gray whales, devil fish for their ill-temper after they'd been harpooned. It also tells you something about just how lucrative the oil and other products had to have been for people undertake this incredibly risky. Approach to killing a large mammal at sea. And if they successfully killed a while, they had to strip wide sheets of blubber from the whale as floated next to the ship and boil it down in giant pots. So you had to have some kind of fire aboard the ship to render that tissue down to its oil e components that's risky all the way through. I probably would not sign up for it, but I think many of the people didn't have the choice to do that was an economic reality for them hunting different Wales, two different strategies in the mid eighteen hundreds. There was a crucial invention that let whalers kill at wildly unsustainable rates and explosive harpoon was shot from ship bound cannon exploding on impact. And so that led to a scale slaughter that we now knows over two million, maybe three million whales were killed in the twentieth century. And I think it speaks something to the abundance of whales that were out there that we were able to kill so many. No one today remembers what it was like to have billions of passenger pigeons flying around in these flocks that reportedly blotted out the sun. And in that way, I don't think we really understand what the oceans were like before. Whaling really got got to be the way it was. If you missed it, two to three million whales were killed in the twentieth century. By the end of the nineteen twenties, there were so few gray whales left that people thought they might be extinct. So what changed we'll find out after a quick break. What's an Olin Gaito how do you preserve talk? Let's culture did big bird really almost go into space. If you have a question that you'd like answered by the Smithsonian now's your time to be heard. No, actually your voice may end up on the show. All you have to do is leave a voicemail at the side or hotline, which is two, two, six, three, three, four, one, two out of eight. Again, that's two, two, six, three, three, four. One two gives your first name where you're calling from and what you want to know more about. Who knows? It may even be our next door episode. Okay. So when we left off, things weren't looking so good for gray whales or any wheels. For that matter in the eighteen and nineteen. Hundreds wailing was big business around the world wills, especially the largest species were being killed by the million without giving much thought to how many of these are we killing in? How many are there left? One of the first people to take that question seriously was Remington Kellogg. He was a Smithsonian paleontologist in the nineteen thirties, and he has a surprise in store for our gray, whale friends. He's a complicated figure for me because one, I never met him. He died nineteen sixty nine. And Secondly, Kellogg had the same job as Nick Pien sin separated by more than half a century. If you do a literature search on 'em, you're gonna find a lot of papers about fossil Wales which appeals to me professionally. But what's really, really interesting about him, I think is that he was a diplomat as much as he was scientist is one of the first what I'd call science diplomat. Kellogg wasn't the type of guy who kept a journal about his hopes and dreams. We don't really know much about what he thought, but here's what we do know he recognized that whales weren't going to be around much longer if we kept killing them as quickly as we were, but how could he make the public care about Wales when we didn't know they live in close knit family units and that they grieve dead. People just saw Wales, huge monsters. Kind of like the way people saw sharks after the movie jaws came out. It's safe to say that when Wales were slaughtered the public wasn't too worried about it. So he and other like minded scientists help create a series of organizations that became known as the International Whaling Commission. So I describe in the book is kind of like a gentleman's hunting club. I mean, it's a very different way to think about conservation than we do today and Kellogg presided over it for decades. Now they didn't just say, hey, everyone stop killing whales. It was a powerful industry. All they managed with some catch limits on how many whales country might kill. And at the time these limits weren't really taken seriously, but even so in nineteen thirty six, Kellogg in his crew created a ban on killing gray whales and right whales. There were very few gray wills left, but it was easier to create protections for a whale that people couldn't find during this time in of the mid twentieth century. I think most wailing wasn't really focused on gray whales there. So few left, nobody really knew how many there were pints and says that for him, it's hard to sort out Kellogg's legacy. Sure. He tried to save the whales, but he definitely didn't succeed in creating meaningful protections. It was the first step though. I think he watched the decimation of many populations species pushed to the brink of extinction. And he was doing his best, but the real outcomes that you think a scientist might care about largely didn't happen. You know, he died not knowing if Wales made it through the twentieth century or not. In the eighteen years Remington Kellogg served on the International Whaling Commission. Roughly one million big wheels were killed, but in the fifteen years after Kellogg, step down from the i. w. c. two things happened because we had killed so many whales whale oil was harder to get as the twentieth century war on whale oils. Commercial use was increasingly replaced by petroleum oil, the stuff from the ground. But the main reason we stopped killing whales was a social shift. We knew more about Will's by the nineteen seventies people cared. So we discovered WALE song or discovery, the biological sonar that toothed whales used. Although scientific discoveries were happening at a time of the emerging environmental movement and so nineteen seventy two with the US marine mammal Protection Act that really set a course for how we approach marine mammals and Wales are included in that that now today I'd say it's much more about protecting coastal environments. People get that that protect the whales protect our our the entire ecosystem in which they belong to in the seventy one years since gray whales were first officially protected. Their numbers have slowly rebounded. It's that there are about twenty thousand of them off the US Pacific coast, so that's good, right? But as usual, it's not that simple because Wales have other pressures to and guess who those. Pressures are caused by. Yeah. The biggest of those challenges boils down to our impact on the planet. Humans live all over the planet, including the oceans and wherever our fishing lines or international ships are. That's a point of conflict for whales are switched to patrol Eum based oil is also causing a major climate shift which has a lot of environmental impacts. This leaves the future, uncertain for many Wales and pretty much everything else, right. Climate change is going to affect different species in different ways that we know that there's traits that are going to probably be important for different species of whales to make it through the humans that includes having a broad geographic range probably not being too big or too small. Having a broad diet is probably pretty important. And for those of us keeping score at home, a broad geographic range, medium size and flexible diet basically describes our good friend. The great will they're probably going to be the winners in planet IRS in the ages humans, but it's not. To be just this wild success story. They have to live long side us the consequences for whales for an ice Arctic, probably not so bad, increased biological productivity with less ice more sunlight, but you can bet the humans are also gonna use those freeways too. So for gray whales, climate change might not be such a big deal. So let's say a gray whale that has trawled up and down the Pacific coast, curious and ventures into the newly ice free Arctic. She might thank woah a whole new ocean. Let's check it out. Our curious will finds a lot of fish and a relatively uncrowded environment, at least for now and then suppose that whale keeps going this curious, gray whale. Might soon find themselves in a -nother entire ocean that currently has no gray whales in it. There were Atlantic gray whales centuries ago, but it's that they might have been some of the earliest casualties of whale hunting. This little hypothetical might seem fanciful a nice what if until you find out that it's already happened, grew wills have now been spotted in the Atlantic actually in the Mediterranean little loss gray whale. That was spotted in twenty twelve and then two years later, another will spotted off the coast and maybe different groups. Will so think about that two separate whales swim thousands of miles out of their way into an ocean that they hadn't been in in centuries. And those are just the two we've seen. It's entirely possible that others have also made that journey. Maybe that's not so crazy if you routinely migrate ten thousand miles. I mean, those are huge, huge, vast numbers for us. So you know, some biologists would say, well, these are just little lost Wales, but the most likely route that they got there was through an ice ice-free northwest passage in the Canadian Arctic. So we will not be surprising to me. And I read about this in the book if we see more and more gray whales and at a certain point in the next fifty one hundred years where wheels might come back and recolonize the Atlantic might not be so surprising. See them off our own Atlantic seaboard. And so there are a million things that we should worry about in the age of climate change. I mean, all science is very clear that things have been changing and sudden change is bad for most species which tend to adapt slowly, but maybe it's nice to think that at least for one species I'm talking about the medium sized gray whale. That could it might just be okay. It reminds us that even when things seemed daunting for nature, it takes passionate people who care about Wales like Remington Kellogg and Nick Pyan. And if there's any lesson to take from gray whales, it's that if you just leave the door open, a crack nature will sometimes prize you and do what these whales have done for the past fifty million years, adapt evolve and survive. You've been listening to side door a podcast from the Smithsonian with support from PR x. if you're curious about Nick pints book and learning more about Will's, the title is once again spying on wills the past present and future of earth's most awesome creatures. You can find it wherever you buy your books. While you can't visit next wail garage, there are whales skeletons and even a life size model of North Atlantic. Right? Whale that you can go see, it's at the national museum of natural history. Cider is made possible by funding from the secretary of the Smithsonian as well as the Smithsonian national board, and the Smithsonian is funded in part. Thanks to listeners like you and if you've been enjoying door, let other people know by writing a review apple podcasts or give us a follow on Twitter. Our account is at side door pod. Our podcast team is Justin O'Neill, Jason fannin just saw dick, Greg, Fisk, Elizabeth Pilger, and Larry Koch editorial guidance from Andrea mistaken. Extra support comes from John Barth and Genevieve sponsor. Our show is mixed by targe Fuda our theme song and other episode music or by brake master cylinder. And if you want to sponsor show, please Email sponsorship at PR, x dot org. I'm your host Hulley muschamp. Thanks for listening. We can go look at a skull kind of put our fist inside the orbit besides. Ex-.

Wales Nick Smithsonian Remington Kellogg Nick pints Moby Dick scientist Alaska Justin O'Neill Awale Wales national museum of natural his Wailers Oman Wailua of Wales DC Wilga Raj Halima Shaw Justin Costa
Episode of the Year 2020

the memory palace

18:09 min | 5 months ago

Episode of the Year 2020

"The memory palace is brought to you by progressive saving money on car. Insurance is easy with progressive. It's an average savings of seven hundred ninety six dollars for customers who switch and save the fact customers can qualify for an average six month discount on their auto policy with progressive discount. Just for starting a quote online or having multiple vehicles on the policy get your online at progressive dot com and see how much you could be saving national average annual car insurance savings by new customer surveyed to save with progressive in two thousand nineteen discounts berry or not available in all states and situation this episode of memory palaces sponsored by middle of everywhere a brand new podcast from dubuque ams and pure x. middle of everywhere shares big stories from the small places. We call home rich with examples of tribalism and kinship skepticism. Idealism defeat and triumph posts in austin carter. Tell stories of life. In rural america provide a connection for those who have left but still identify with small towns explored the growing appeal of rural life. First season will feature stories from across kentucky from a magic healing stone to a ninth generation farmer battling an insurance company for his beliefs. Airline austin will export history. The bluegrass state bus. Stereotypes and share what motivates people in these communities. Listen subscribe to middle of everywhere wherever you get your podcast. And the strangest of years. I've decided to mix things up a bit every year in december right before i shut things down to accommodate some holiday travel in into tie off the year. Just past with a bit of a bo. I released my favorite episode than they did during the previous twelve months this year. I've decided not to wait now. May well be that. The next three episodes i'll be releasing here in. Twenty twenty are in fact better than the one you're about to hear i'm ever the optimist any one of them could well become my actual favorite. But i'm certain that i will not regret the choice. I released this now for two reasons first To kind of pull the curtain back a little bit. I'll be totally honest with you. I have found these past two weeks around the. Us election utterly exhausting. I found every attempt to write my way through it and deliver something that feels it all relevant to me the strange days to be kind of a fool's errand rather half-hearted i have simply decided to take a breath and i hope you don't mind we'll be back with a new episode and a couple of weeks as usual but here's the real thing part of why this moment has been so exhausting is directly related to the story. You're about year to read day after day about astronomical rises in infections and hospitalizations here in the united states about more unnecessary death. It has been heartbreaking and it has been crazy making so here is my episode of the year to accompany you as you take care of yourself and the people you love stay. Well we'll talk to you again very soon. This is the memory palace. I'm nate the mail. This episode was recorded on april. Second two thousand and twenty in my home in los angeles while sheltering in place per the order of state and local officials. I mention that for the benefit of those listening to this in the future whether that is decades from now somehow or next week when things may very well be very different than they are right now as of this date the centers for disease control recommend that everyone washed their hands frequently in do so for at least twenty seconds. What follows are twenty stories. Each twenty seconds long to assist you in that task. One in chicago mateen's in the nightclubs. When there is nothing sexier nothing that said more about status and power about the thrill of being alive rate. Dan in there than the automobile to dancers in the call. Girls doubt the new perfume behind their ears and their next street. Gasoline to the poet was sure he was dying a heart attack and then several strokes in steering oblivion in the face he had to confess. So william carlos williams told his wife everything about the affairs about how he had done her so wrong so often confessed all of it and then he lived for another fourteen years three. The civil war came to woman mcleans house. When union soldiers came and took over his kitchen before the battle of bull run at the beginning of the war and he was forced to move. He found a lovely new home in apple. Matic's virginia where five years later soldiers came and kicked him out of that house. So lee could surrender to grant in his living room for when roger payne her this the first recording of the song of a humpback whale he was sure it was the thing that would save. If only the world could hear these features. He would stop the slaughter that had put most whale species to the brink of extinction. He released an album of whale songs which directly inspired the save the whales movement a decade later the international whaling commission banned deepwater whaling five if the first film version of titanic released just a month after the sinking were lost. We could see dorothy gibson and the same white dress in same cardigan. She wore on the night. The ship struck an iceberg. And she was put into a lifeboat. We could know how it felt to be in those same clothes pretending to be in that same lifeboat. Watching the titanic sick blow. The cold waves six three legged races at every track. Meet think of the skill the intimacy the rhythmic genius two sprinters as they set the still unbroken world record in april hundred ninety nine jointly running one hundred yards in the time between the closing bell in writing off seven after lincoln was killed and his successor was impeached. North and south had shifted their conflicts to congress. No one in government had an appetite for powerful executive presidency was pointedly diminished. The staff budget was cut so much and so often that if you rang the front doorbell at the white house during the presidency of grover cleveland. The man himself would often have to get up from his desk and go downstairs to open the door aid. A friend of mine once found to customs form from eighteen forty five which provides all we know of the story. An american sailor named james stirling died of unknown causes while it sea when his ship arrived in brazil the colonial government refused to bury him so he arrived home after months and months at sea spent floating in a barrel of rum. Nine nine hundred fifty. Nine nikita khrushchev fell in love with pepsi. Cola started a decades long illicit affair between the elites of the soviet state. And sorry to editorialize here the worst soda the eighties. The ussr wanted hep c. Trade restrictions meant that they couldn't pay cash so they gave pepsico three billion dollars worth of decommissioned military equipment which the company then sold off to scrap metal companies but until they did pepsi had the sixth largest military in the world. Ten the red of the redcoats that projected british powers patrolled the cobblestone streets with the american colonies. Washington's men could see dotting the snow row after row as they marched to. The battlefields of trenton. Came from die made by the subjects of another colonial power mexican taros in the desert sun crushing the insects that live on the nepal. Cactus for the prophet of their spanish masters eleven. The room was too small and so many of the women had to sit in the floor two days after her husband's first presidential inauguration eleanor roosevelt called the first of what would be three hundred and forty press. Conferences open only to female writers height of the depression. Newspapers were cutting staff and often the first reporters to go where women so the lady gave them exclusive access to information to help keep them employed twelve in the nineteen twenties before radio was dominated by major broadcasters and big corporations there were smaller players were their own visions of what radio should be. This program is designed to try to help you with your problems in the home to give you such a vice and assistance. Such information as we will believe we'll be conducive to better and better health. Thirteen in oregon. During the great depression. Destitute men having wandered west for work in finding none waiting set forest fires and the desperate hope that they would be paid helped. Put fourteen more than a year. After lewis and clark set out from saint louis lost men having navigated treacherous falls. Having nearly starved to death in the snow the reached the end of the missouri river stirred up at a wall of mountains. New they had failed was no northwest passage. The abandoned their boats and set out toward the mountains. Fifteen july nine hundred sixty in a marsh beside cape canaveral as the nation's first weather satellite launched not long before circled unseen somewhere above. Two naturalists made this recording of dusky seaside. Sparrows this species went extinct and ninety s sixteen having lost the race to launch a satellite into space. The united states wanted to demonstrate to the world. Just what they were capable of so they launched a plan that would send a rocket to the moon. Armed with nuclear warhead. The explosion which would be bright enough to be visible from earth with the naked eye despite a year working on it before scrapping. The idea afraid that it was a bad look for america and could cause problems for the moon colonists there were sure would be living there by the nineteen seventies. Seventeen seventeen eighty six hopped up on the whole defeating the british in starting their own country thing. Thomas jefferson and john adams are in england. Take meetings and just basically feeling themselves in one day. They're given a formal tour of shakespeare's house at stratford-upon-avon those to jackasses are goofing around like teenage grows in a field trip. Whether guide isn't looking adams chips off a piece of shakespeare's chair for a souvenir eighteen. It took nearly one hundred years until one of his fellow. Magicians figured out. How david devon did his greatest trick so can we. At least hold the wonder for the seconds we have left magician on a darkened stage holding a candle. A beautiful woman dressed as a moth with flowing wings entering if drawn to him to the flame embracing him in folding him in her silken wings and vanishing nineteen he had given the parrot to his wife rachel his present companion in her own this and when she died. Andrew jackson kept the barrett taught him to swear like sailor thought. It was funny and when jackson died having outlived his wife but not her parrot. The president's funeral was stopped when a cursing. Parrot had to be escorted from the chapel. Twenty thirty million people lost power in the eastern seaboard of the united states. November ninth nineteen sixty five more than eight. Hundred thousand new yorkers learn. This when they're subway cars went dark screech to a halt in pitch black tunnels untold. Thousands walked home to the boroughs to new jersey over manhattan. Five bridges as night fell in. Who knows how. Many people looked up at who knows how many stars visible for the first time that night. And who knows how. Long This episode of the memory palace was written and produced by me nate to male with engineering assistance from elizabeth. Oh bear the show gets research assistance from allies mcgraw. The memory palace is a proud proud member of radio. Toby from pierre x. The collective of independently owned and operated. Podcasts kept strong by our mutual support from financial support of listeners. Like you have a couple of recommendations for you. That might help you through these strange days. I there is a new season. One of my favorite shows is called. This is love the perfect side project. From phoebe and lauren from the show criminal is a show with stories about love. All its forms this season. I feel like just in time. It's all about animals and you're gonna love it. Good radio piedad dot. Fm to learn more about it. And all the other radio shows and one more thing I'm excited to tell you that i've just released a new podcast with my friend. Karina longworth of the show. You must remember. This is a movie club for the stuck at home. it's called. it's the pictures that got small in each week for as long as it feels right. We are going to be reaching out former. Our respective shelters to a friend will watch one of those big screen classics. We've never found the time to see and watch it now that we have nothing but time the first episode is up. Now corinna and i are joined by ryan johnson. The writer director of nights. Out in the last jedi i brick and looper in the brothers bloom talking about the movie castaway. Hanks plays some trivia games. And we recommend some movies that you might want to watch as wait this whole thing out. We are also going to be raising money to support independent theaters and movie societies. During this very difficult time for them again it is called. It's the pictures that got small. You can search for it and subscribe in rate in review in all the regular places. You find podcasts. Or you can go to small picture. Show dot com as always. There will be a new memory palace and a couple of weeks in the meantime please be well. He's be safe to care of each other. Promise will do the same talk to you again.

memory palace seven hundred ninety six dolla six month austin carter twenty seconds Us mateen mcleans house roger payne dorothy gibson one hundred yards james stirling dubuque three billion dollars pepsi william carlos williams twelve months Matic fourteen years kentucky
Hard Factor 7/2: Whaling is Back, Uber Eats with Guns, Florida Man Eats Meth Burger

Hard Factor

20:31 min | 1 year ago

Hard Factor 7/2: Whaling is Back, Uber Eats with Guns, Florida Man Eats Meth Burger

"Would it is somewhat joe man randy savage this factor in new rules no one does it better right now yeah pretty tough the better we still don't tell me something right down murder rate to own a good morning and welcome to another episode of hearts and today is tuesday july second will is off tonight but you got hard factor pat hard factor mark hard factor west the big story today has to do with wailing mark wailing is back baby can't wait a an aftermarket does that story west and are gonna give you the hottest headlines from today getting the story mark so good news for everyone hates wales and that's because the for the first time in more than thirty years japan is resuming commercial whaling despite all the blubbering from international community oh yeah a chorus of captains with missing limbs they're celebrating right contractor how much of a low hearts on e cigarettes are being smoked on those boats oh my god 'cause you you give no shit you you're life is a all you care about is that day well today we just have to kill one whale that's it so absurd that loved the smoke everyone knows wales were brought to the brink of extinction by hunting in the nineteenth and early twenties twentieth centuries so back in nineteen eighty six all members of the international whaling commission awry wc agreed to a temporary hunting down to allow we'll numbers to recover makes sense japan kept saying a hey guys one is this temporary ban gotta be lifted a every year basically and they were ignored by that it'd be see so they lefty i wc effective july nineteenth they're like all are people got hooked on that good whale meat right now there's no will mean for them i'm pretty sure there's a lot of whales that have been populating the past thirty years coming killed him there's a lot of old school japanese did there so psyched right now yes oh absolutely and that's that's in fact the japanese fisheries ministry said it would start issuing permits were hans on july first her yesterday yesterday so just the first day they possibly could they couldn't wait and people are lining up overnight for permits it was like a new playstation was released over there they were cited please enjoy i i liked waiting in line for places i did it and i waited in line for ps three with commenter waited in line for two and a half days got in there got like a target credit card to get the get the ps three got back and then a newsflash broke where they they released ten thousand more yeah you sold it for like fifty bucks proper job there the minister of japan the fisheries fisheries ministry will allow for the hunting of three species the mink brides and the sales i probably didn't pronounce those correctly but then again i'm not hunting them so go fuck right off according to the i you see a red list of threatened species the making brad's whales are not and day jets good while the whales are you out of three and not so bad but no one likes to say well no i guess not a say what so what you're saying what you say the whole story is a bit misleading though as since nineteen eighty seven japan has killed killed between two hundred and twelve hunting whales under the guise of scientific research so you know it's like if i killer whale how much does it way dead or if i kill a calf in front of its mother does the mother make incredibly sad center sound so we can hear that type of risk or how does it taste yeah how does it taste that how's it tastes that thirty minutes later and i say served in a restaurant did read one did murderers know about research killing 'cause it seems like that would be a great defensive you murder wife i was doing it for research doc yeah i don't think you're gonna get what's the what's the research there i dunno okay what is she sound like not yelling i make a problem with the research killings was though they couldn't sell any the whales like in japan 'em so in order to get around that they just lefty i wc now they're hunting actually also it's important to note that norway hunter more wales in japan does an iceland also hunt the shit out of wales including endangered fin whales surprised not just japan you have a say look more like a so we don't care but are we were still matter pearl harbor so we like to make fun of japan for i'll never forget 'em apparently within its twelve mile coastal waters japan canoe wherever the fuck it one so this is loud and i'm sure they would be on that in the two hundred miles exclusive economic zone in of course out further in the high seas the country is bound by the u n convention on the laws of the sea so i guess the plan will be just lower the whales toward that twelve mile coastline while the greenpeace in sea shepherd boats are just crying and tried to block the whales their little boats a and then they just watches the whales get into the coastline and get murdered it's a bunch of people are putting on celebrating i feel like wells should have learned by now to be afraid of japanese they should have all how's thinking the same thing right it's kinda like if you get a not twelve mile coastal range you're pretty stu cats note and not be around on me they're involved to you're not you're not allowed at my house and my heart is overflowing with happiness and i'm deeply moved so josephine mci a head of the japan small type wailing association people have honeywell's for more than four hundred years my hometown and i don't think young people you know how to cook and he will meet anymore i want more people to try to taste it at least once so come on down at away at yoshi for me how so well i don't sound like a whale of a good time to consider she says conservation groups like greenpeace in sea shepherd when i mentioned earlier are not happy about yeah oh one of the one of them's endangered yes this is a sad day for well protection globally said nickel opinion of humane saturday international i accused accusing japan of being beginning ainu and shocking era of pirate wailing and it's just it's just wailing but they they have been pyre willing right now pirate wearing this is justified ronco stone off its part yeah they're bringing it back to themselves why do they hate well so much over there and they i think they just think they're delicious their culture they look like native americans and buffalo's i mean love 'em we saw the cows in some cultures think their secrets so much true but they're so delicious well that's what the japan japanese were saying well i know it makes sense now they know i'm switching sides don't that's how i would definitely go subpoenas house will at least one out bring the whole pot besides the question of decreasing well communities a key argument against hunting whales is that are put in wales leads to slow and painful death so it's very like inhumane basically the whales just so big that little harpoons just yet there are put in like a hundred and fifty times and then ended up just like drowning in their own blood the old school guys going out with harpoons like like other traditional that's a great question and apparently they're saying they have new modern hunting methods call don's yeah that killer whales instantly well i'm not sure what they argue they might be guns but if if it can kill away it looks like it's probably pretty effective my guess is that they're just gonna throw a couple of cheap bottles the dominican liquor down their throat yeah they put it comes out some of what what's tasty do a welder but then we'll wrap it in rob rob a piece of dynamite threaten their i don't know but you're gonna hear why why said god dammit you're gonna realize why got a little later on hungary fellow take it to the internet where anna marie davey says i'd go to war over this buggered shoulders and also henry's got to bump shoulders annoying but she's willing the shaker fists at the japanese well it's kind of like oh you're so right shoulder hills well how much you're on their shoulders shit bring her shoulders shoulders in this is big the big florida actually tell you what happened to her show lake and they don't care emory in an energy company graduation i dunno she's not doing long car rides shoulders deirdre harper says a i was planning a trip to japan next year but won't be now not until they stop wailing that is a only one person here but you gotta start somewhere yeah deirdre i'm pretty sure that their entire economy based on wailing isn't gonna be a little upset that you're working spend a couple of hundred bucks at the coastline that's that's why play x box set a playstation when you know that oh yeah one person at a time alright alright guy wants back let's take it to a lightning round of other headlines we have a chance to get to in debt you're wiping both wichita falls texas walmart's back in the news yeah no no identified woman has been banned from the retail giant after she ate half of a cake while shopping at checkout ripping refused to pay for the full price because quote half the cats missing and that's mike what do you have evidence there's still you total shock what did you do she's taken by a shorter half off which is understandable because there is only half the cake police were called and she was forced to pay full price unfortunately a lucky for wichita falls has to walmart's so these other one was made famous back in january when a woman was arrested for driving an electric shopping cart well drunk on wine that she drank from pringles you're sitting at the same time same town baby pringles can wind lady the party town all i know is i wanna spend the fourth of july with the brings can wind lady 'cause no one loves freedom more then she all i know is i wanna do the double and go both walmart's in that town that's like bar hopping that's like playing eighteen holes board you might get above all merchandiser all right moving on secretary of state mike pompeo is in some hot water after is being claimed used taxpayer funded diplomatic security guards a like interns sending them on aaron such as picking up on payers family dog an chinese takeout a so agents working under palm pale apparently sometimes joke amongst themselves and they were quote ubereats with guns sounds like exactly what you know what they were were so diplomatic security are just that secret service do we know or like sounds like it sounds like jv secret service yeah yeah i'm not really sure do you think he was like he was kinda like planet up like i can't go get that chinese food there's some there's a guy there is giving me and i and you care about my my safety right yeah i'm you know i think he just like he's lazy i'm lazy lazy and you're in you're employed kind of i would say though i know you would you mistreat in terms all the time i don't miss reno parents had become secretary of state you send them on the stupidest nonsensical errands all the time yeah well hold on deliver here i am the lessons that they need to learn how okay you would have been great in a fraternity you guys remember did he runs the city or a making of the band in brooklyn the get me going on in the story also apparently it's it wouldn't have been a big not as big of a deal dealer from pay was actually in the car when these agents were doing this but he wasn't going out on their own doing this yeah he's just making durant and according to the code of federal regulations federal employee quote show not in courage direct coerced or request they subordinates use official time to form activities devotees other than those required and a performance blah blah blah blah blah who gives a shit a little investigation is underway i don't give a shit i would do the same exact thing yeah but you guys know how sweet it is when you have a job that you hate and then you get the you get sent on and errand which would you rather hang out with pompeo pay and his wife or going a fucking aaron smokes definitely volunteer to pick up the dog all the time taken extra thirty minutes listen some good news all day long all right guys a group of taliban terrorists with micro penises and never before trimmed cubes expressed their frustrations shins yesterday by killing more than forty people and injuring more than fifty one school children nice yeah some of us have still not discovered internet porn because if they add well this wouldn't have happened we'd be on certainly what happened a lot less oh yeah they discovered internet porn why haven't i mean they here's here's one factual concrete thing you could say about internet porn and suicide bombers if they were if their culture with internet porn they would realize that if they went out and did a suicide bomb they wouldn't get to see internet porn again right future yeah that that's just that's the motivation also every time i'm getting mad at my neighbor a i'm angry but it also makes me horny so get on the internet was some internet porn and then afterwards i'm like oh my name is fine i i'm serious this is like a sort of like a stand up you joke but i just don't understand why people get upset for longer than it takes them to realize that internet port exist like once you remember that in a point exist whatever you're mad about you walk to nearest door shuts the door and jerk off that's what you do and then you're better then you're back yeah these men whose journals looked like a cash you that got stuck in a brillo pad set up a car bomb that was during rush hour what their target being the ministry of defence the blast also damaged to schools a private war museum a television station in sports agency this is in the capital city of kabul a yeah which brings me another piece of news there's a sports agency in afghanistan for some reason cricket and soccer shop yeah right yeah that's the saddest sports agency of all time a the terrorist made their way inside the ministry of defence compound were an eight hour long gunfight between the virgins an afghan security ensued all five insurgents were killed an absolutely no one is morning their deaths i hope they got shot in the stomach some blood out if porn hub is blocked in that country could do something about that let's unblock porn up there just chill now just saying absolutely right if you're bored and you audit and just a number of why would you ever get upset or board like there's always something fun to do behind closed doors yup yup any fetish west will tell you about it you will do we have on your on your idea directly half the cover this one after hundreds of are loyal fans for of which party popovich t shirts of thinks that the clutch a sinister stores the tips of florida man named patrick benson who is apparently discover the secret to taking tons of met and still being hungry sexual wendy's in jensen beach florida ended similar issues at first he fired at the famous a flame broiling grill wait a minute you got to wendy's wendy's flame broil flame broiled florida hurricane not famous yeah no wendy's is fresh never frozen yeah yeah mistake fight here yes grill you fucking idiot and what the fuck is wrong with you are i should know that better stuff that i am a pond scum so what is it first wendy's around hamburgers burger and then just before one wandering around looking for the source safe and upon discovering the good this then tried to crack the code of the safer several minutes scratching his head glad somebody what's greasy fingers and no idea what the total that's the math the math makes you think even crack the say if i could do a thousand combinations and the minute he got so stoked when he saw the safe bet you anything off on crack this now he realized he was a monster on math and could lift safe and that's what it is picked it up and and you know walk wreck on the front door a following a snack and grab he broke into another restaurant and jensen beach and it's after the break into a gas station also but the mets strength was wearing off so we quit a he was a quickly found and arrested he's of course being dubbed the hamburglar which is pretty stupid and i i feel pretty stupid argument this joke because we all know the hamburglar prefers mcdonald's hamburgers do we do we do we all know that you fucking idiot burglar yeah oh you knew that when those mcdonnell now he knows what chick place logan a more eat more chicken we didn't invent the chicken mark how you might be just the chicken sandwich but it is ford and they were pretty proud of himself that little clip nonetheless sorry that was and we all know wendy's the better they walk out the food to you in a car with a roller skate nice sunny all right guys a north carolina animal rescue group is asking for an unusual donation yeah kevin carolina waterfowl rescue has put out a call for bra as as they've discovered that the bra straps the book clasps are 'perfect replacing crack turtle shells oh man i got a bunch of crack turtles tonight i mean they brought i love it yeah the request went viral with thousands offering up there bronc clasps much to the chagrin of old fashioned father's with daughters everyone let's take it internet real quick carolina waterfowl rescue says here's a picture of how we used the bra class to repair a turtle shell it's like a staple or or stitch exact we've had a lot of inquiries so here is a few of the questions we only need class boss we don't want you to mail the whole brought to which my burner count jason davies replied high also i'd be happy to take them browse off your hands after you take them class out just saying i give a good home no no lights on that kind of yet but i'm hoping like i'm hoping where's dab the demand man reno reno 'cause she could add this to hurt used pennies business is sending brock laughs yeah i i there's an intern at the carolina waterfowl rescue that is so stoked like a fourteen you're all doing community service practicing all there's gonna be like a bunch of environmentalist like going to victoria's secrets and taking the class here's all you hear from the intern room yesterday mark the anniversary of hong kong's giving back china and hong kong celebrate this van which they really resent that by continuing their protests over the extradition build at china's pushing the previous discovered the one that would allow china to extradite hong kong hong kong is back to the mainland a centrally disappear and how their organs harvested on the black market probably likely a yesterday whoever the protests turned violent as protesters stormed and smashed through the government headquarters inside but that's not good not good it sounds like these guys also don't have internet porn they might have been some plants who knows inside petrified police defended the building from the mob were not able to use the same tactics they might use on the streets because of the confined quarters and you're guessing stuff cancer doctor so now you can sign didn't have any masked i guess i dunno yeah that's what they have that fucking matthew ever been on the airplane all those hong kong here's rockin massive don't get sorry i don't think you're thinking the same come on you know what i'm saying i get what you're saying not seeing that on a police would enforce the retreat because the protesters were cutting electricity off in there and it got really scary at night protesters eventually got hungry in exited the building at which time police then used the classics you guys castles disperse them a thirteen officers were taken to the hospital after was found the protesters were highly multiple cocktails made from dominican republican anymore liquor and then who are better who wore the dominican liquor joke but i gotta admit let us know that i'll admit to using marshall's better yeah yeah marks is better but west still good my mind was in the right place yeah you're heartless there well then you don't have to gms i'll take that i'll take victory yeah yeah so the protesters will be the first to be extradited when that bill eventually passes in their livers will be sold as i like adopting a pet a celebrity once held on tv sweats when you when you go to wendy's do you get a whopper usually or a whopper junior a chick fillet a wolf nice quick on his feet now he's getting they learned his lesson and that's gonna do it for hard factor today hey we have some new merged out including are a dude twenty twenty shirt thanks ordering so many of the public clutch t shirts so money they were taking and down the borders of the sherman her put out and i'm not even sure if i'm gonna get the one i ordered the bump the numbers up a as always we kid and genuinely really do appreciate the support all you have shown keep the reviews and five star ratings on i tunes coming follow us on social media at at hard factor the news make sure to pop the clutch at least once on this thursday and as always have yourselves a great fucking day everything baby blue get together in the two and three and four ram bom my mother made in the league in wins so then when we have and then all may be more young when they zuma the only lose a way where you die your wings tonight and then you know you're both they both joe biden should be no you

randy savage wales murder mark wailing japan thirty minutes thirty years four hundred years eight hour
High-risk lending caused the Great Recession. Could it happen again?

Post Reports

21:58 min | 2 years ago

High-risk lending caused the Great Recession. Could it happen again?

"From the newsroom of the Washington Post. I this is Tracey Jim Kelly from the post. Are you? Washington Post reports Martinez powers. It's Monday, April eighth. Today lucrative, but risky corporate loans. Israel's upcoming election. And why Japan is bringing back commercial whaling? In two thousand seventeen when we were hearing all these reports about how strong the economy was I started to get a little suspicious. It was almost like Spidey sense. You know, like when things are too quiet in your house. You know, where's the dog? You know, the kids. This is Damien polenta are covered the White House. Congress regulatory agencies finance money anything having to do with the economy, Damian reported on the financial crisis in two thousand eight in two thousand nine and recently, he started notice an eerie similarity between what happened then and what's happening now, obviously the circumstances are different. But a lot of the same things are happening in terms of loosening the standards on what the regulator scrutinize, you know, a huge kind of snowball of risky loans. And no one really looking to see what would happen if everything goes bad at once MacIntosh and six in two thousand seven that snowball of risky loans with the subprime mortgage crisis. Now, Damian says that he seeing something similar with banks and financial institutions issuing more than h Willion dollars to businesses. And what are called leveraged loans? A leveraged loan is a loan made to accompany that is over leveraged. And by over leveraged. It means the company has way more debt than it brings in through income. So a leverage loan is a loan that a company might not have the capacity to repay. It's risky. It's not like a company that has a tremendous amount of income coming in. It's a company a lot of times that's on the rocks financially and on the brink of going out of business. So it's kind of like a hail Mary loan. Exactly. Do you have examples of what this company's? I mean, we're talking about company's name brands, you know, J crew PetSmart a lot of retail companies, but also healthcare companies and energy companies that you might not have heard of Buffalo Wild Wings arby's. There's a lot of companies that you shop at or pass by every day that have these loan of -solutely. Yeah. Why would banks want to give loans to companies that are kind of struggling companies that are struggling you can charge more money too because it's a riskier loan and at a time. Like now when interest rates are low banks are doing what's called chasing yield. They're trying to get more income more return on their investment. So if they can make a mortgage and get one percent back or make a leverage loan and try to get ten percent back. They're going to sort of chase after that money. But what happens if these companies that these banks are giving loans to if they can't pay back, those loans, the loans go into default and then the banks in trouble. But what the banks have done is. They make the. Alone, and they are selling the loan off. So they've originated the loan like sort of like a mortgage, they make the mortgage, and then they kick it off to some investor hedge fund insurance fund pension fund. So they have kind of wiped their hands of the loan. They don't have the risk. They've made it in gotten rid of it. So some banks will say, well, what's the big deal? Even if the loan goes bad, it's not my problem. But if the thing that we found a decade ago is that if a lot of these loans, go bad, then it does become a problem. Absolutely. And who's to say that if the loan goes bad, it's not the banks problem. Who's to say the person who bought the loan isn't going to try to sue the Bank or try to push the loan back on the Bank. There's all sorts of domino effects that happen. We've found the default rate on these loans is really low right now because the economy is doing well and businesses are are getting the income. They need to be able to pay the loans back, but what happens is we've seen is interest rates. Go up the economy slows down, it becomes harder ones. One company can pay the loan back. You know, there's kind of this like contagious affect and. A lot of companies can't pay it back together. And we've never been in a situation like that before with these loans. So right now banks are just allowed to give as many of these loans out as they want. So in two thousand thirteen regulators started to get pretty concerned about this. They thought regulators what the federal government the Federal Reserve the FDIC in the office of the comptroller of the currency. They regulate the big US banks CitiBank Bank of America, JP, Morgan Wells Fargo trillion dollar banks, and they started to get concerned because they saw banks we're sort of chasing this yield. They were making loans that in past times would have been considered pretty dicey. And so they sent a warning to the banks and said, you know, we're watching you guys, we're watching the sector closely. Here's some parameters we want you to follow. And there's going to be times where we're gonna tell you to knock it off. And sure enough they told a couple of banks to knock it off and the banks got spooked they pulled back day. They the quantity of these loans fell. Oh, quite a bit in two thousand fourteen two thousand fifteen because the federal regulators basically like this is too risky. You guys are doing this too much. We don't want to get into any any problems down the road. Like, we get to tell you. You're not allowed to give out many of these loans. Exactly. So the member of this is just five years after the financial crisis. There's a lot of still open scars and the regulators have the ability the Bank regulars have the ability to go into banks say, okay, show me your loan. We'll see you're making and they found through review of these loans that a lot of them. They call them weak. But really the garbage. I mean, the borrowers would come in with like a pamphlet. Oh, look like, I'm making a new amusement park. It's going to all the kids can beaten candy the banks like shared, okay? That sounds good. We'll give you like ten dollars. And and some of these loans are for like two billion dollars, and so and not necessarily with much evidence that they're going to eventually be able to pay back. Exactly, exactly. So regulators tried to crack down the bankers went bananas because they don't like regulators breathing down their neck. So there was this real tension. They're building up ahead of the two thousand sixteen. Election. So twenty sixteen the election happens, and then what starts happening to these loans. So there's a big seachange in Washington regarding these loans, first Republicans in congress made clear that they want the leveraged lending guidance to be nullified and at the same time, you have President Trump putting in new regulators at these agencies who believe that the leverage lending rules are making it harder for the economy to grow, and they also want to sort of back off. And so Simon caney the two big institutions the executive branch in the legislative branch are kind of in alignment that these guidelines are hurting the economy, and they back off, and then the bank's really start pumping out billions and billions of dollars these loans without any review or scrutiny about what it might mean to the economy once the loan start to turn, and you've been talking to a lot of the people who were behind the scenes when a lot of this has been happening people bankers and congressional aides and federal regulators. What do they? They say about what they were seeing at this time. Here's what struck me especially having covered the banking industry before. And during the last crisis. They have no idea what will happen when these lone start to go bad. Okay. In the economy. There's these things called credit cycles the doing well, you're able to get access to loans than the economy. Turns people start falling behind on their auto loans or their credit cards in the credit cycle. Turns the credit cycle turns it becomes harder to get an auto loan, right because people think you might not be able to repay it that same thing happens with lending to corporations to, but it can be even worse because those loans can default at a higher rate, and I talked to congressional aides regulators all these different people, and they have no idea what will happen. One thing that happens after the last crisis is that a lot of these big banks were bailed out that even though they're risky decision. Making had had. Lead in large part to the crisis that that taxpayer money help keep them a float. Is there a concern that that his kind of help them continue to use the same risky practices? One of the big question marks from the financial crisis of two thousand eight two thousand nine is what would happen. The next time. The economy turns because there was a tremendous amount of taxpayer support that bailed out the banks billions and billions of dollars when into very troubled companies and helped prevent a collapse of the US academy. And there was a fear then, and I think there's a fear now that this kind of moral hazard is baked into the economy. This idea that if something really bad happens, you know, someone will bail us out again will have congress rushed to the rescue or the fed will change the rules or the White House. Will you know, kind of break the glass and. And come writing in and stop it. And so there's this fear that it has incentivized risky behavior on the on the part of banks and other investors. As much as people say, they won't let it happen as much as regulators and lawmakers say they're not going to be there to catch you. I think a lot of bankers don't believe it. And we won't know, unfortunately, until happens. Dean politic covers finance and economic policy for the post. On Tuesday Isreaeli head to the election. Polls phonetics Neil who everything is steak. Loveday Morris is the Jerusalem bureau chief for the post if Prime Minister Benjamin BB Netanyahu is reelected. He's expected to become the country's longest running prime minister. But it's not clear that that's going to happen. No one really knows. What might happen? Benjamin Netanyahu, who's Israel's longtime prime minister. He's been prime minister now for toast with more than seventeen years. He's fighting for fifth time in office. He's doing that from under a cloud of corruption allegations and against new candidate. He's a political newcomer, but he's not a total newcomer Netanyahu's challenger is Benny Gaunt's a former chief of staff for the Israeli military in a country. Everyone's children go into the military. He's already known figure, but he's not known in politics. And he's the main contender? Levy says that one thing that Netanyahu has his relationship with the US and specifically his relationship with President Trump under the Obama administration. You could maybe say that Isreaeli US relations were possibly all time low that was very fractious relationship these Aw, be going to the US and speaking against the Iran deal. Huge ten around with trum Netanyahu says this is most pro Israel administration ever been he's never had a better friend in the White House over the us. Israel has been blessed to have many friends who sat in the Oval Office. But Israel has never had a better friend than you. The fact that Netanyahu end from have such a good relationship. How has that played out for Israeli voters? I think it seemed pretty positively here. I mean, the most right as they look at the US is relationship on the Trump, and they see of the pro-israel decisions that was the u s decision to recognize Jerusalem much recently that was the US recognition of Israeli sovereignty over the Golan Heights. Now that came by recently in the middle of an election campaign was seen a little bit as possibly the Trump administration giving boost to Netanyahu like the fact that Trump made this announcement was basically to help his friend out. Yeah. Fish oil, and even before that people looking at White House statements and the decision Sem Pompeo will so just before elections and Trump is poppy. Day. I was talking to one is rarely poster actually who's just on seven of Israeli attitudes would Trump in. Hey seen very favorably here really's. Really's really like for than Donald Trump. He has two very kind of Isreaeli characteristics and Israel, respecting feel home at and that's of course, versus quit spa. He's very brazen. And what he does. And he doesn't here, you know, whether someone is insulted, not insulted. He says that you know, like, he sees it. And there are issues of his see on the Israeli Electric's mind that they see that strong relationship with the US as positive and it something beebees ready been pushing joying his campaign. Also that campaign priced in Jerusalem of Trump pen Netanyahu to get the summit's definitely something that he's been trying to highlight. And showcase that that. He is the person that can win win these concessions from the US. And he's the only person that can do that. What is your sense of what Isreaeli voters are looking for in this election? I think this time that's actually. Early. Maybe some indecisiveness than previously thought of his Railly's. I think do want to change from Netanyahu. If you look at if you look at the surveys, but then I know of his Riley's also see him as the best candidate to be prime minister. So there's a bit of contradiction there. I mean, I think that's one of Netanyahu's quite strengths is to have been able to portray himself as this person. Who is so essential Israel. If you look at the polls there are some questions about how accurate the polls gowns is coming out ahead on a lot of them. Although that's still the question as to who can actually form a government and the coalition, but maybe given all the controversy surrounding nothing who it's probably more surprising. The gown says in further ahead. So you mentioned that Netanyahu is facing allegations of corruption. What is he facing Netanyahu? Has been dumped by corruption allegations releases since he first came to office. I mean, the hip he was investigated back in nineteen ninety seven. So it's not really something new. But this time they have progressed further than before in February the attorney general recommended that Netanyahu be in dieted in three corruption cases to those deal with Netanyahu's dealings with the media, actually, basic eight cutting deals full favorable media coverage changing regulations to benefit newspaper Ona's the other one involves gifts political favors in return pa- gifts cigars in champagne that kind of thing you've reported that a lot of people have described in. Yahoo is something of a political Houdini. Even though he is seen these allegations. Of corruption come up against him again. And again, yahu always seems to survive them and has this ability to get voters to look past that and think that he is this kind of essential leader for the country. Well, ever the years, he's just headed amazing amazing ability to be able to bounce back. When people people have written him off back. She don't forget that. He's also he has lost elections. He's most as many elections is he's one he just keeps coming back. He lost in nineteen ninety nine he lost against zippy Livni. But actually, she couldn't form a coalition. So he became prime minister that but he's been out of office twice in the post. I think people forget that when they talk about Netanyahu's staying power that he's he's actually, you know, he's suddenly selections in the post one of the statistical shows portrays Netanyahu is this Houdini like character was being I'm to slip houses chain. But we'll have to wait and see if he manages that this time. Loveday Morris is the Jerusalem bureau chief for the post in the election on Tuesday is Railly's will cast ballots for political parties to fill parliament after those results were announced the prime minister will be selected based on which parties come together to form immaturity coalition. and now one more thing Japan lost December pulled out of the International Whaling Commission and said it was going to restart commercial well hunting the decision with deeply unpopular because it broke a thirty year global moratorium on whaling, but the big caveat of that decision was that Japan would no longer the able to hunt for whales in the antibiotic. It would hunt commercially for Wales, but only within its own waters only two hundred miles off Japan's coast Simon is the posts bureau chief for Japan in the Koreas Japan had been hunting them in the name of research, which means it would kill away. Lls measure the whales in various ways. And then it would chop up the whales. And so. Well, the meat to help fund the research with a view to eventually start commercial whaling win wellstone's recovered. But in the end the rest of the world or not of other countries weren't prepared to do that says, you pan just went his own way. So I traveled to Shimonoseki which is a wailing city in western Japan. And the reason I went that was the whaling fleet was returning from its lost ever wailing trip to the Anton. We spoke to family Toro Asaka. He told us how crews had reacted when they heard the news. This was lost Antarctic well hunt. And they don't know if the whaling industry has a future, they worry that livelihoods will be affected because they're on many Wales in Japan's own which is as there are in the end top take. But I had to say there is another side to the wailing story that you prep stand who is hair in the west. I think that it feels the sense of nationalism here probably makes old re people think well, why then west tending to do most Japanese people don't eight oil mate, most young people don't take. Well, meet the wailing industry would like to see. Well, meet reintroduced into school lunches, so young people get the taste the whale mates. But not to yourself to what puppets. Why are they keeping it alive? Why they started to keep it alive when the rest of the world has moved on. That is something that conservatives in Japan, really. To keep the Cup. Simon is the bureau chief for Japan and the Koreas. That's it. For post reports. Thanks for listening. You can learn more about the stories in today's show at post reports dot com and join the conversation online using the hashtag post reports. I'm Marteen powers. We'll be back tomorrow with more stories from the Washington Post.

Prime Minister Benjamin BB Net Bank Israel US Japan prime minister Washington Post White House Congress Simon caney bureau chief Jerusalem Wales President Trump Tracey Jim Kelly Federal Reserve Damian
Jan. 11, 2019: Ghosn Fever, Easy College Sex Ranking, LDPTQ, Naked in Mie and Justin-2-Shinzo.

Japan This Week

17:50 min | 2 years ago

Jan. 11, 2019: Ghosn Fever, Easy College Sex Ranking, LDPTQ, Naked in Mie and Justin-2-Shinzo.

"Well, it's not a happy new year four former Nissan EEO Carlos gone who is still in detention here in Japan will bring you all of the latest updates in our first story, a tabloid magazine just ranked the top five Japanese universities for the ease with which guys can pick up and score. With chicks all the way university in a few minutes. A veteran ruling party politician made some crazy remarks about LGBT people and the consequences of Japan going gay. Yep. You heard me right L tell you what he said coming up a man was found naked on a stranger's third-floor apartment balcony in near freezing weather this week. Stay tuned. You're gonna wanna hear this one and Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau called Shinzo obey directly this week to discuss a very important economic issue. Now, he didn't not really it was about wailing that coming up at the end of the show. So stay tuned. Hi, and welcome to Japan this week a quick recap of stories we've been following on the Japan today website. It's January eleventh two thousand and nineteen welcome to the new year. I'm Jeff Richards. Thanks for joining us. I hope the New Year's off to a great start for you. And let's get right to this week's news. Well, as we mentioned at the top of show the new year has not gotten off to a good start for Nissan Motor company's ousted chairman Carlos gone. You'll remember that he was dominating our headlines for over a month as we headed into the Christmas break, and as we return in two thousand nineteen his is still our top story, though. It may quiet down for a few months at least before it breaks. Again, this week in his first public appearance since his arrest on November nineteenth gone told a Tokyo court that he was wrongly accused of financial misconduct. He said I have been wrongly accused and unfairly detained based on meritless and unsubstantiated accusations, contrary to the accusations made by the prosecutors I never received any compensation from Nissan that was not disclosed nor did I ever enter into any binding contract with Nissan to be paid fixed amount that was not disclosed now prior to his widely covered court appearance. Over one thousand people lined up for just fourteen available court seats that are assigned by lottery, highlighting the high level of public interest. In the case here in Japan, gone entered the courtroom in handcuffs with a rope around his waist, and he wore a suit without a tie and plastic slippers, which are common in Japan. The hearing was requested by his lawyers, and it was held for the court to explain the reasons for his prolonged detention presiding judge. You Todd said gone was being detained Duda. Flight risk and the possibility he may conceal evidence now to recap yet again gone has been formally charged with under reporting his income. The sixty five year old executive has also been arrested, but not yet indicted on allegations of aggravated breach of trust in shifting personal investment. Losses worth one point eight five billion yen or just over seventeen million US dollars to the carmaker in his. Twenty minutes statement gone maintain that he had done nothing wrong. But to no avail bail has been denied and his detention is almost certain to be extended no date for trial has been set. But it could be at least another six months before that happens guns arrest is also put Japan's criminal Justice system under international scrutiny and sparked criticism for some of its practices, including keeping suspects in detention for long periods and prohibiting defense lawyers from being present during interogations that can last eight hours a day to make matters worse. It's reported that gone has a high fever and questioning has been suspended, according to the prosecutors, what do Japan today readers think Daito hack rights, what it is grace a man like his being treated as a psychopath murderer tied with a rope around his waist like an animal. None of the Japanese executives involved and found guilty in the bigger scandals at Olympus and Toshiba or for the many other scandals. Japanese companies slept a single night in prison. Let alone where they humiliated like this disillusioned ads. The judge says gone is being detained due to flight risk and the possibility he may conceal evidence. After a month, the prosecutor should have gathered all their evidence. And if they keep his passports, he cannot leave Japan, it's just more malarkey from the kangaroo court. The Japanese courts just seemed to make this crap up as they go along to suit themselves and from tackle they have no evidence Japan is under the microscope in world opinion, right now with no way out. They need a confession, and they are not going to get one. Well, it's funny. I usually try to present comments from both sides of a story or issue, but at this point in Goan gays, it's hard to find anyone commenting in support of the Japanese courts position. Unfortunately for gone, I guess we're going to have to wait until he finally gets to present his case and the truth comes out, let us know what you think at podcast at Japan today dot com. Tom. From gone to getting it on the weekly tabloid magazine spa has been under fire here in Japan for the past weeks after it published an article in late December ranking the top five Japanese universities, and how easy it is to pick up female students at drinking parties, the article is about something called yada, Nomi, a Japanese expression that means drinking parties that male participants pay women to attend. Now, I know what you're thinking. It's it's not a prostitution like situation. It said the parties are popular among female college students. The magazine published in apology after one woman's online petition objecting to the article went viral after being picked up by the BBC and time the petition by twenty one year old Kazuya Yamamoto, she's an international relations student at the international Christian university in Tokyo, which is not one of the five on the list received over forty thousand signatures in six days. Yamamoto said she did not accept the apology. And wanted the article to be retracted they are missing the point. She said they are saying sorry for using misleading words, but they're not apologizing for the main idea itself, how they are objectify women in Japan, objectify, ING and sexualizing women still so normal that people don't really understand why it is a problem now spa magazine, which has. A weekly circulation of almost a hundred and ten thousand said it was trying to highlight a trend where men pay female students to take part in drinking parties the five universities listed. Have also blasted the story Japan today. Readers were divided on subject. You Bado praises Yamamoto. She is right on the money. It's not just about women. It's about men learning to treat women as equals and not just a piece of meat the person. I am now writes, I agree that Japan, really objectify women and treats them poorly. I do not agree that women at these parties are victims Japanese women play men like fiddle just like any smart hot lady anywhere around the world while blah, blah, blah to to to put this way. Japanese women are the ones trying to hook men into becoming their wallets. So sad for Japanese men. Well, unfortunately, the reality of modern day Japan is that it's still very much choice club sexism runs deep here. And even the CJ. Change of the metoo movement has been very slow to gain some traction, just as a stat Japan ranks one hundred tenth out of one hundred and forty four countries on the world economic forms, global gender gap index and as we've reported here numerous times last year government investigations found prominent medical schools were even systematically rigging exam scores to limit female, admissions that being said I can understand the commenter taking issue with gather Nomi parties and the girls accepting money to take part except for one thing that cash is just to take part in a social event not for anything else tabloid story. Hot button issue. What do you think? Well, from tabloid boys club fodder to government representatives foot and mouth disease. Hardly a week goes by in Japan without a politician, saying something outrageous. Well, this week it was cut to a hit Asala a veteran lawmaker of the ruling liberal Democratic Party hit us said during a speech in Yamanashi prefecture that and I quote, if everyone became like LGBT than a nation would collapse bow. And of course, his remarks went viral from replays across TV, stations and social media channels. He also said he didn't understand moves in Tokyo's should be award and other local areas to recognize same sex marriage here Asala like many Japanese politicians was lamenting the country's low birth rate last year. Another ruling-party lawmaker meal Skikda came under fire after she said in a magazine that the government shouldn't use tax money for LGBT rights because. Because same sex couples weren't quote unquote, productive will here's what Japan today. Readers think so called here to Saleh an utter idiot. They say not everyone is going to become gay just because a relatively small. Number are incredible. That such fools can get elected toasted heretic says the L P is out of touch and out of their minds as ever on the other hand Kenneth day points out whether you like his statement or not what he said is actually true. If everyone became gay the entire nation would eventually collapse. In fact, the entire world would eventually collapse under that scenario, but the chances of everyone becoming gay is zero though. So the statement is moot. Yes, I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say it there is zero percent chance that in humankind's future. The entire population will become gay and stop reproducing. Now that being said hit a cell may have a big few. Future in large budget gay porn writing. I mean, come on. Combine his remarks with our current fascination with zombies. And I think he's got a real pitch on his hands. Yes. We just got back. We're starting off the year. And we already have our first weirdo story of the week for two thousand nineteen a disturbing incident occurred in Suzuka city in may prefecture in the late evening of January third a call came into police that a naked man was hitting the balcony window of a twenty three year old male residents apartment. They don't specify with what he was hitting the window. Exactly. Officers rushed to the scene and spotted the nude intruder up on the third floor of the building in three degrees celsius weather. The man believed to be in his twenties was promptly taken into custody and is currently facing charges of trespassing. However, he's not cooperated with investigators and has refused to give his identity or his motive for taking off all his clothes and scaling three stories to knock on the window of strangers home. Japanese netizens were full of theories ranging from. He sounds like the term. Later to he was probably hoping for a woman in the -partment to he was trying to surprise his girlfriend, but couldn't find the right place from the outside. Okay. A little pause here. My logic deduces that he would have left his clothes with perhaps in my D in it in a pile somewhere close by or he lives in the building and climbed around the outside balconies or the person reporting is an unreliable witness and perhaps locked fellow out. I'll leave it up to our Japan today readers because they have their own theories speed suggests what happened was he was with another man's woman. Just next door and husband came home since two five eight recounts a similar experience shortly after we moved into our mansion two years ago. The person writes a naked drunk man was pounding at people's doors. Trying to get in note when people mentioned mentioned in Japanese, it means an apartment complex and not a huge estate, Allah. Mar-a-lago? And although we don't know who this man is in the story Japan today reader Albaladejo is sure of one thing he's not a British man who would have at least kept his socks on. And finally wailing usually that's all I have to say and comment boards. Go nuts. This week wailing back in the news. When Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau took issue with Japan's plan to resume commercial whaling in a telephone call to his Japanese counterpart Shinzo audit. According to a statement from his office Trudeau said he raised the important issue of whale conservation. And that he is committed to working with international partners to protect whale species. Now Japan announced last month that it was withdrawing from the International Whaling Commission. The I w c and would resume commercial hunts this year sparking criticism from activists and anti-whaling countries. Surprisingly, no other details of this conversation between Abay and Trudeau were revealed which puzzled Japan today readers zone to surf asks. Are we supposed to believe that these two world leaders spoke by phone and this? This was the only thing they discussed. How exactly did this conversation happen did Trudeau say yo since oh, I wanted to call you to specifically discuss this whole Japanese wailing issue and Ave, you're calling to discuss just that Justin not trade in general not anything other than that. Okay. Nice script. Big in says, if I were Ave I'd be asking Trudeau some pretty pointed questions about the annual harp seal club fest Touche, though, in fact, the new it actually do consume the seals. They haunt. And in fact, us every single part of the animal as barbaric as it may seem to modern city dwellers who also go to McDonald's and KFC fast food joints on mass while wantin- de ads as a Canadian I really wish Trudeau would focus on important issues that affect Canadians instead of trying to prove that he's Alterra progressive of very diplomatic comment. Wanton de let cooler heads, prevail. Any other Canadians care to share their opinions, Email me directly at podcast. Stat to pan today dot com, and I'll get it on the next episode. And that was a quick recap of the news from Japan this week for January eleventh two thousand nineteen I do hope the years off to a great start for everyone. I'm still getting used to writing the numbers two thousand nineteen on things when dating them right now. But I'll get out get a hang of it very quickly. We'll be back again next week. And since it is in new year. We'll be adding some new features to Japan this week podcast this year. Quick interviews with people involved in reporting. Some of the stories we feature and some special mid week episodes focusing on specific issues story or or person I'd like to ask if you have any suggestions or things you'd like to hear on the show. Please drop me a line at podcast at Japan today dot com. Thanks to the Japan today editors for curing this week stories, and thanks to you all of our listeners for tuning back in you can find links to all of the news mentioned in this podcast in the show notes since the news from Japan never stops. And because you just can't get enough. You can and you should visit the Japan today website at anytime at Japan today dot com or follow us on Twitter at pan today for all the breaking stories or follow our Instagram feed at two pan today. News help us out won't you? Help us by sharing the JT W podcast with others who are interested in current event Japan. You can get Japan this week wherever you get your podcast from if you're listening on an iphone simply say, hey, Siri subscribed to Japan this week podcast. If that's not too creepy for you one last request. If you've made it this far if you liked the show, please go to apple podcasts and leave us a five star review and a comment about why you listen to us that would really help us out, and I would be really thankful if you did from Japan today newsroom at g plus media. In Tokyo, I'm Jeff Richards and join us again next week with a quick recap of Japan's biggest and smallest stories. Cya folks.

Japan Tokyo Justin Trudeau Jeff Richards Japan Prime Minister Carlos prosecutor Nissan Nomi Nissan Motor company US Saleh prostitution fever executive Todd Kazuya Yamamoto
Trump veto keeps US involved in Yemen war

PRI's The World

47:11 min | 2 years ago

Trump veto keeps US involved in Yemen war

"Support for the world's podcast in the following message. Come from legalzoom nearly two million Americans have used legal zoom to start their businesses with LLC's, Inc and more. But even after your business is set up. Legalzoom can still help you out things like lease agreements changing tax laws and contract reviews are all part of running your own business in these are precisely the kinds of costly hurdles that can take time away from growing your business. That's why legalzoom created their business legal plan checkout. Legalzoom's business legal plan at legalzoom dot com now and get special savings when you enter the word world at checkout. Legalzoom where life meets legal legalzoom dot com. Before we start the show. We have some news today is the first day of our spring fundraiser. We need a hundred and fifty listeners like you to make a gift in any amount to help us unlock thirty thousand dollars in challenge funds. Visit the world dot ORG slash gift to make your gift and thanks for your support. War Powers today on the world. I'm Marco werman. A presidential veto keeps the US supporting the war in Yemen and Yemenis wondering when it will end this war as the US is Warren their country as much as it is Saudis in the UAE's also as we wait for the Mola report. What makes a secret worthy of redaction most of the classified universe? Does not deserve to say secret more than a couple of years plus Japan wrestles with its attachment to well-made. There's a stand up front that sells wail cooked all sorts of ways fried, grilled bacon, style and gasping for oxygen at the top of Everest to put it simple buke probably start dying. Slowly, just imagine like having a lasting bag over your head. And your time is limited. Those stores are more today on the world. I'm Marco werman. You're with the world in one country. Ten million people are on the brink of famine today more than fifty thousand have been killed since two thousand fifteen those are just two of the many ways to describe the human costs of the war in Yemen, a conflict that involves US support for a Saudi led coalition. A rare bipartisan pushing congress produced a resolution to end American involvement in the Yemen war, President Trump has now vetoed it Trump called the resolution an unnecessary attempt to weaken his constitutional authority is I wouldn't say that it was unexpected Charene Daime was born in Yemen. She's now an assistant professor at Michigan State University. Many of us have expected Trump to continue to support the Saudis in this brutal war in Yemen. But I think it's still devastating given the impact of US involvement in Yemen. And this lost opportunity. I think for the US to finally take some positive steps toward ending this war. So it's certainly devastating and disappointing. But not unexpected. What have you heard from your friends and your family back home in Yemen? Well, I don't think I think Yemenis have gone through multiple rounds of disappointment with different bills in the Senate trying to build support for those. And then then falling through it took at least two years for this Bill to even get through congress, which is seems to have been a huge feet. I think you know, family and friends were excited at first, but they seem to have not been paying too much attention. Now, they see this war many of them see this war as the US is Warren their country as much as it is Saudis in the US's inside. I don't think anybody who's really holding their breath. But certainly there's disappointment because people are still living under miserable conditions. They are still experiencing the devastation of this war as effecting their daily lives end. This is just one more step that as preventing them from hoping in living in a country where things might get better for them. Born serene day may at Michigan State University. David Miller band heads the International Rescue Committee. He's also a former British Foreign Secretary band says the failed congressional resolution had a simple point the point was that the wall strategy America's backing some nineteen thousand bullying rates being low round by the Saudi led coalition with Americans all that wall. Starches failing failing in humanitarian terms I sold myself with widespread malnutrition, the world's second largest cholera outbreak. But it's also failing in political terms in the precisely the people who President Trump wants to take on the Iranians the radicals, they're actually gaining from the wool strategy. And that's why the decision of President Trump too sick with this failed strategy is so significant and so damaging what is this going to change on the ground as a complication in dangerous tinderbox really the result of the decision is to give a green light for a strategy that has been shown fail. Now, it's important to knowledge. Register that in January of this year, the different Ponte's came to talks on the UN specific to agree. A ceasefire agreement for parts of the country for the port of Hudeda, which is in the northwest of the treats under whose control, and it's an absolutely vital lifeline for humanitarian night eighty percent of the aid going into the country goes through the data. But it's it's a situation where this triangulation because because of the war that's going on around. There is an inability to get the aid in never mind the bureaucratic obstacles put in place by both the Saudis, Adam the who thinks I'm so the prospect now is that the ceasefire agreement doesn't hold we seeing increasing numbers of people losing their lives a hundred civilian casualties PO week in Yemen. Most Yemenis being killed at home than in any other place because they have honorable to this wall. The narrative out of Washington looks like. This a lot of lawmakers from both sides of the aisle came together to try and end US participation in this terrible Yemen war, and it looks like Trump wants this war to go on. But is it possible that maybe the war will accelerate and get to peace sooner is that even part of Trump's calculation? This is the wall that isn't going to be sold by mole bowling. It's not going to be sold by greater alms supplies. Not going to be sold by more refueling, which is precisely what the resolution was trying to tackle President Trump's determination that the most potent finished impeach support Saudi Arabia because they're opposed by the Iranian. I'm afraid leaves leaves Yemen to the precipice I mentioned the fine. But it's already had the second largest cholera outbreak in the world. It's the risk that ten million people will full from mount -ment into famine and the danger of this decision by President Trump is that it gives a green light to a failed strategy, and it gives such those almost sounded side who would say that it's possible to. Negotiate a settlement and therefore doubled down on the wall strategy, David Miller band heads the International Rescue Committee. He's also a former British Foreign Secretary. Thank you very much. Thank you so much. It took just a couple of days for nearly a billion dollars to get pledged internationally to help rebuild Notre Dom in Paris. Meanwhile, the United Nations is struggling to meet its goal of raising about three hundred million dollars for countries like Mozambique that were devastated by cyclone. It di- last month the storm left more than a thousand people dead and hundreds of thousands of people in need of aid. So what drives good Samaritans to donate to certain causes over others. I asked Michael Sanders. A behavioral economists in London who's written about this donate to charity is it's not a rational action says psychological and emotional asocial act. So when we see a Kohl's we have to make a decision to other tonight to end a lot of the time that comes down to we call social distance. So how can I relate to the thing that the causes trend? Saith unto support. So in the case of the Notre Dame fire. We can all imagine what I'm certainly most of his time when we've been inside a very impressive cathedral in a western city on how grand how amazing that was. And how much that gives you a sense of history. Whereas the victims of a natural disaster half a world away. Even if you know, we can all say rationally in mind that is much worse much larger tragedy more deserving of donation support. Even though we know that ration late, psychologically, it's harder for us to to make that leap and that kind of decision to donate. It's ironic, isn't it that a so many heart strings were pulled about a pile of bricks not to put it bluntly? But Notre Dame is a building. And in Mozambique. We're talking about a thousand people dead. So wouldn't you think people would find the suffering of other people more salient than a burn building? So under normal circumstances all else being who we would expect to see more money donated to Mozambique, then to some bricks and mortar. Wooden some loss being set fire to in Paris. I guess the point around the salience that was the old house in equal. So I I watched the news the other thing when the fire was happening. And there wasn't six hours of wool coverage of the tragedy be not speak ill of of you want. I mean to feed by you. But the that that was one's ability studied lies with the nedia. How much does one dollar donated to Notre Dom in Paris fair versus one dollar given to Mozambique or any place in southern Africa. Right now, can you parse that out certainly a dollar spent in Paris will not go anywhere near as far as dollar spent in Mozambique, and send me what you're thinking about doing with that dollar. So investing in saving artwork or brick so much building some sort of monument than what the plan is in certainly not going to achieve. We wouldn't expect the same amount of human guy tightness in and benefit society. As one dollar spent on food or medication the best money you can spend in. Jim Wilson's on day today basis as on D worming bednets as de worming bednets both been shown to have really really huge effects on the being the health of people in the developing world, and to have huge spillover effects de worming in particular, Michael, how do you think we could start paying attention and giving to charities helping countries like Mozambique recover from natural disasters. I mean, I accept that. Some of that is on our shoulders we in the media. So I think as you say, so if is under shoulders, I think what we recognize the we shouldn't just buy candy or chocolate when we get to the checkout in the store, just based on our motions, we don't really seem to get that. We should do the same kind of liberty presence far charitable donations in the same way. He wouldn't think about investing your life savings in fund without taking advice. Independent financial adviser. Michael Sanders a behavioral researcher in the UK who's written about the science behind. Why people give money to charity? Thanks very much. Michael. Thank you very much a US attack on Cuba. That's what. Vanna is calling Washington's decision to allow Americans including Cuban-born US citizens to sue foreign companies doing business in Cuba business that involves assets and property seized by the communist government decades ago. It's a provision in a US law that passed in nineteen Ninety-six, but that every president since has blocked not Trump secretary state, Mike Pompeo made the announcement today any person or company doing business in Cuba. Should he this announcement those doing business in Cuba should fully investigate? Whether they're connected to property, stolen and service of a failed, communist experiment. A lot of European companies do business in Cuba. Chris Bennett in London advises some of them as managing director of the Caribbean council. Here are some of his main concerns won't is the suspension of title, four of Helms-Burton, which effectively means that if there is a claim in the US cooled against a European citizen or a European investor who has presence in keyboard. Activity in Cuba. They would have the visa access to the US prevented. So they wouldn't be allowed to travel to the US the second area in which it will affect UK any you companies is that they may be subject for claims or have claims against them not only by US interests and US corporations US citizens who were expropriated during the Cuban revolution and fifty nine but in Cuban Americans who were Cubans of the time of the revelation, and who before nineteen Ninety-six became US, citizens, which means there is a fast number of people who have claims in Cuba. How expose our European businesses today in these investments are you able to put a dollar amount on what could be claimed. I don't have a dollar amount for you. There are obviously very significant investments, particularly by Spanish investors in the hotel space in Cuba, which is a very signif-. Current economic area of activity there also significant investments in cigars, and in rum, all of which are potentially subject to suits from USO Cuban-American claims. So yes, I think there are some substantial concerns how hard will it be for them to kind of track the chain of custody back to the communist takeover. I think that's a really good question. And I think that that is going to be a significant challenge, actually, but the will be tests that need to be met in terms of mounting that claim in terms of proving ownership of the original assets proving that you were actually ex-propriating proving that no compensation was provided or offered to you and proving that the foreign investor if you're going after a foreign investor. The foreign investor knowingly is trading in a confiscated acid. It is a very loose ambiguous language. That's used in terms of trafficking in confiscated acids, and is not clear, what trafficking means, and it's not clear how the course will interpret that. I do think we're looking at a future where it's just an unsustainable barrage of lawsuits what I would say is that the damage this will do is that a lot of these lawsuits will remain pending over a period of potentially years. And even if there is a policy change and title three entitled four are suspended. Again, those lawsuits will be effectively frozen in aspect, and we'll still be still be there. And they'll be any of those assets will have a claim sitting on them, which will continue to damage the investment environment for Cuba and prevent international esters look. Cuba. Chris Bennett, the managing director of the Caribbean council speaking with us from London about the latest US policy changes toward Cuba. Thanks very much. Chris. Thanks very much. What's really involved in redacting, a document like the Muller report? That's just ahead here on the world. I'm Marco werman, you're with the world tomorrow morning. A redacted version of the Miller report will be released by the attorney general, which means big chunks of the document will be blacked out officially to protect sensitive information. And that's just fine with President Trump grading. Grading confidence in the attorney general. And if that's what he'd like to do I have nothing to hide. But how do we really know what the DOJ is blotting out for some answers. We turn to Tom Blanton. He directs the National Security Archive at George Washington University in C, I s them first off about how the tax is blacked out. It's done on computers. These days they actually highlight texts that they think are still sensitive and they zap him and they have to under the freedom of information act. They have to put out to the side. What exactly they're citing? What exemptions do know of cases where two censors disagreed? Hell. What happens then on the wall at the National Security Archive office, Dan at George Washington University. We have a piece of White House E mail that was sent to Colin Powell when he worked in the White House high levels and the two versions are almost mirror images in the sense that the top and bottom of. Inversion or blackout the middle of the second version or blacked out the top and bottom or released, and they were declassified ten days apart the punchline it was the same reviewer both times I called him up. His name was on the document. What were you thinking? He says, well, there was probably something in the Washington Post sensitive about Libya the first week, so I had to cut that paragraph out. But the next week it wasn't Libya was the Saudis or something. So I had to cut that paragraph out. And so you get completely opposite views. My point is just that so much of the secrecy really is subjective. Even the sources and methods of intelligence that are so well-known in the world today. They're not real secrets, but the government's point of view is it makes a difference. If we acknowledge it therefore, you can have it on the front page of the New York Times. But that doesn't mean we can't still black it out when we want. So with the mullahs report what would have happened if there had been disagreement about what to include and whatnot. My bet is that the attorney general would not have had the folks in the room who would disagree with him. There's a kind of a self selection process. Among groups of sensors what we've found over two decades of fighting the the subjective. Secrecy is the key to getting the most open version of a document. His having multiple pairs of is from multiple bureaucratic locations. Take a look at it. There's an appeals panel that is of multiple agencies, and they overrule the original agency saying it was secret. They overrule him seventy seventy five percent of the time. It's so subjective. What about the rules or standards for reductions that we're using today? Have they been in place for a long time? They change from administration to administration the standards we have now in national security. I have been in place since Obama did an executive order and his order overturned and earlier order that George W Bush had diamond dramatically opened up a lot of the national security world on the standards for withholding informant material and law enforcement immaterial those of really been developed by the courts over many years. So there's multiple court decisions that lay out pretty rigorous procedures for what can be protected. I think the F B I has even won a court case saying that informants name from seventy years ago could still be censored from today document because the plaintiffs couldn't prove the person was dead. There was an obituary there wasn't a death notice. And if you can prove they were dead, then they are still protected. They still get redacted if the standards though change in future administrations as possible that years down the line, some of these redacted passages in the Bulla report could be revealed to the general. Public. Absolutely. It's like peeling an onion, we've gotten copies of high level documents over the years through freedom of information cases, where I version comes out half of its withheld gradually over time. I think the entire text will come out, and when people are doing the anniversaries decades down the road, they were more likely to have a complete copy than Muller reported than we're going to get do you think most of these documents deserve to be classified in the first place, though, a lot of them do in the first place. The big argument is over how long they stay secret. How long they stay in the vault, and that'll that's the big argument. I think even with the reductions in the Muller report, how really secret are they in how long are they going to have to stay secret pretty much everybody. Even in the security business would say that most classified documents can be released within a period five ten fifteen years only if it's like design of a weapon system that would. Empower some thug and some foreign country to really create danger for American citizens, then I think they have a basis for classifying that same thing with a, you know, some brave Irani and who walks into our embassy and wants to give us the low down on the IOT succession but asked for anonymity. You probably want to protect that person's identity for as long as you know, there's some danger to them. So there are some real secrets, and that's where I differ from people like Assange, and even Chelsea Manning new just wanted to throw it all up against the wall. Nothing should be secret. I disagree things. That would really hurt people. They can be they should be secrets things that are our bottom lines in diplomatic negotiation. Probably until that negotiations done that can be a real secret. But most of the classified universe does not deserve to say secret more than a couple years, and we should point out that sloppy reductions have created a lot of problems, right? I mean, I think of the ability to lift up the black bars if you don't know what you're doing putting the black. Bars in the first place. I think that's going to be that that's attorney general bars worst nightmare a couple years back. The Justice department under duress of a lawsuit had to release. This internal consultants report people had heard about it on the outside expose racism problems discrimination problems within the Justice department, the office at Justice redacted it using a computer program. Putting black blotch is on it comes out in the public somebody realizes. Oh, that's just an adobe acrobat. Oh, I can peel that often they peeled off the black and what was under. There was all this embarrassing stuff about Justice department employees complaining to their supervisors and never getting any Justice out of it. So that's their worst nightmare at the Central Intelligence Agency today, they print out the document with the black blotch is and then rescan the hard copy to send it to us electrically. So you can see they're worried about that many people. Will will cry foul? Given the reductions in the mullahs report. Will there be lawsuits challenging some of the black dot sections? He think I think they're already are lawsuits. A number of freedom of information cases that are already in court and those plaintiffs have some tools at their disposal. Judges have the right to look at a redacted document in camera as they say in their chambers, and that judge can can decide for him or herself was that redaction justified or not a lot of times. Judges don't directly overturn a government decision. They just order the government to do another review. And then when you do another review a lot of times, you get a different result. The judges do have the power to push back dramatically. The judge just has to have a backbone. Tom Blanton directs the National Security Archive. Thanks for talking redaction with Tom pushy, it a pleasure to be with you Marco tomorrow on the world will be all over the molar report with a review of what's in the redacted version, plus reaction from Russia and. Much more. A quick note before we get back to the show. This is the first day of our spring fundraiser here at the world listener donations help us meet the cost of sending our reporters all over the globe from Saudi Arabia to Antarctica to the US Mexico border. We need the support of a hundred and fifty listeners like you to help us unlock thirty thousand dollars in challenge funds that will help us to be on the ground wherever the next story takes us. Visit the world dot ORG slash gift to make your gift and thanks for your support. mortgage werman before the chinaman square massacre thirty years ago, there was a season in China went freedom scene possible that win ta ta ta two nine was trumped ably. One of the freest winters in China, remembering how the gentlemen protests began. That's coming up ahead on the world. I'm Marco werman. And you're with the world where co production of the BBC World Service PRI and w h here in Boston, dramatic news. At of Peru today, a two-time former president of the country. Alan Garcia is dead. Peruvian? Authorities say he committed suicide rather than face arrest on corruption charges Simeon Taegu's a reporter based in Lima. He says it was a startling seen earlier today at Garcia's house in the Peruvian capital. So police showed up at six thirty this morning to issue on arrest warrants. He initially appeared cooperative and also to go to his bedroom to cool his lawyer. He went to Ned not will offer a few minutes. A gunshot was hood police then full way in unfound Garcia sitting with apparently a gunshot wound to his head. How were Peruvians reacting to this news? I think it's to say that this news has really rocked. Peru. Unindo SIA is or at least was a towering political figure here. He was twice president from one thousand nine hundred five nine hundred ninety and then from two thousand six to two thousand eleven and was probably the most able politician of recent Reuven history. But he's also been in the last few years of reviled figure he ran for reelection in two thousand sixteen just six percent of the vote on the reason for that is this widespread widespread perception that he was corrupt his first presidency ended in hyper-inflation and all kinds of graft allegations against him Garcia, then left the country on was living in Paris while the statute of limitations ran out. He was reelected in two thousand and six but he set was mauled by. The Odebrecht mega-scandal. Oh, the breakfast is Brazilian construction company that has admitted paying more than a billion dollars in bribes to politicians across Latin America in return for public contracts on and go see presided ova mole contracts for Odebrecht than any other president in recent proof in history. There was an arrest warrant this morning before he killed himself. Does that suggest that Alan Garcia would have gone to trial, and maybe even served time? That's what seemed to be on the cards, basically prove him. Prosecutors have just reached this agreement with Odebrecht in Brazil that allows the company to turn over what it knows about. It's corrupt acts in Peru to the prosecutors hit without fear of Odebrecht executives being themselves prosecuted by the latest count, the company admitted to paying something like twenty nine million dollars in bribes within Peru. And from the leaks coming out in the Peruvian press seem that Garcia was. Heavily implicated just over the weekend. One of the big revelations was the Louis. Nada Garcia's personal secretary had received full million dollars from Odebrecht. I guess the obvious question is how much of that money was actually meant for haven. How much of it was meant his boss. But it did seem that the net was closing in on Garcia reported table in Lima. Peru. Thank you. Thank you Marco on his spring night in the Chinese capital thirty years ago. College students started walking out of their dormitories. They were marching chanting slogans nothing terribly extrordinary except in China in nineteen eighty nine. It was very extraordinary soon. A massive protests was underway in gentlemen square. And we now know how it all ended a massacre with unknown hundreds of people killed by Chinese soldiers. When the protests started, though, there was a sense of hope Ilaria Maria Sala was an exchange student in Beijing of the time she's on the line with us from Hong Kong where she's base as a journalist frequently writing for courts how. How did these student protests began remind us if you would allow. They started spontaneously when students heard that Hu Yaobang had died of a heart attack. He was a full moon party Dida had been disgraced in eight seven because he had supported the student demonstrations that happened in eighty six eighty seven he was very well known in China for being a reformist. So one of the worries that this shoot at hunt was that the party was gonna give him a subdued small funeral. And they wanted him to have a state funeral. So the students were simply wanting to honor who Yeong because he supported them. What were your Chinese classmates saying about this protests? Well, it wasn't just all wheel on. It was also a way to tell the leaders at the time. Time that they were not as popular as who we all down had been. There was a feeling of discontent. The feeling that party loyalty counted mall than loyalty to socialist principles. And also corruption was starting to be more widespread than it had been previously and political reforms were stollings. So it was so much freer than it is today control was much less intense. So if I think back on those days, some of the grievances of the students were expressing, especially in terms of political reforms seem now quite impossible to replicate. What was happening then was way more open than what we have today. I want to get back to that in a moment. Because hindsight is really important here. When did you go actually Ilaria to see the protest agenda? The square yourself. And what did you think what were your first impressions because protests of this sort were a rally the previous ones had been more than two years before? And a major leader had been punished for supporting them, the students were very careful to know who they were with. So they may show that everyone would March with their classmates which were then divided by department and divided by university. So that every moment you could look around you and only seen known faces. And if someone who wasn't a familiar face, you could say who is the person is a plainclothes policemen. Who's following odds of something like this? So there was quite a heightened sense of security and then through the night. They didn't nobody knew whether there was going to be some violence would have sold the students made show that myself. In a few of the foreigners that were there were in a safe place. So we were put around the monument to the People's Heroes. So that from the funny thing would have happened. We would have been protected by our Chinese classmates do that make you worried were you scared. I guess we were too naive to be scared. But I felt very grateful that people were so concerned about my safety the same time. My Chinese classmates all seem to think that it was going to be okay that this was so important. Maybe the wars little people had feared was maybe some someone might have been roughed up, but not much more than that. We think of China today, and we do not think democracy, and I'm surprised now to learn of a slow emergence of freer expression in China on the eve of gentlemen, do you ever wonder aloud area kind of what if what if there hadn't been this violence each of the central government had allowed a steady growth of pluralism? Of course, I do the on the on the to this is that if they had given what the students were asking or what was in the air before April may and especially June. We wouldn't have a one party state in China that winter ata two nine was probably one of the freest winters ever in China. There were a lot of different publications even the state channel was broadcasting programs. That were quite critical of the government, quite critical off social problems people. Among themselves were speaking in a way that has never replicated itself since professors the school would be super critical. We would read newspaper articles that were even raising the possibility the malls don't have been wrong. So how'd that continued that way? I don't see the communist party would manage to stay power. What about now? Because today, we see this unprecedented level of control by the Chinese communist party connect the historical dots for me. At least personally one of the greatest lessons of this is how much propaganda works throughout these thirty years the level of propaganda the level of control the level off convincing people at a different kind of reality place has been three D successful in a way that can be scary because we'll want to think that we are independent thinkers, and yet we are. So is manipulated. And one of the things that I see now is how much people believe that without controls without this a an hamster facial recognition etcetera. Life would be really dangerous, but such a large. Country can only be controlled through that. I am surprised how much people truly have gone this themselves of this. Loria Maria Sala is journalist from Italy based in Hong Kong today. She's been recalling her time in Beijing as an exchange student thirty years ago during the gentleman square student uprising Ilaria, thank you very much for your thoughts. This coming July Japan plans to resume commercial whaling, even as the country's appetite for whale meat is at an all time low. So what is Japan's attachment to whaling all about Abigail? Leonard reports from Tokyo. Key fish market in Tokyo sells just about every kind of seafood imaginable, including whale. There's a standout front that sells wail cooked all sorts of ways fried, grilled bacon style. Most of the customers here today remember eating whale as kids. Like this man in his fifties. Who says he aided in schools stir fried with ketchup? I asked him if he liked it. No. And like the Japanese have wilt for centuries, but consumption, really peaked after World War Two the country was devastated and food was scarce. So American occupation authorities urge them to eat more whale as a cheap source of protein. Me. This is an American newsreel from the time on will help alleviate Japan's food shortage and ultimately save over twenty billion dollars for American taxpayers. Just after the war half of all protein in the Japanese diet was whalemeat today. It's much much less people here. Eat only about forty grams a year per capita about the size of a slice of ham. At the wheel restaurant. I asked a woman how often she eats it. Never under international rules. Japan. Can hunt whales that aren't endangered for scientific research, but the media sold commercially, and there's a huge surplus of it stored frozen and warehouses across the country in January, the stockpile reached thirty seven hundred tons still prime minister Shinzo Abe's government continues to support willing to the tune of fifty million dollars in this year's budget. The secretary general of Abe's party Toshihiro Nikai, even gave interviews from the government cafeteria while dining on whale curry. I know my Bill. He saying it was excellent. I've never eaten such delicious. Curry we must spread the idea throughout Japan. That whalemeat is something we can't do without then late last year. The government announced Japan would pull out of the International Whaling Commission, the body that regulates wailing and resume commercial whaling in July. So at this point it's fair to ask with all the criticism Japan gets for hunting whales, and it gets a lot. Plus, the fact that very few people here, even eat it. Why is this country so committed to whaling I went to see Joji Morishita who negotiated Japan's upcoming withdrawal from the International Whaling Commission. Shoot us a symbol will respect for different culture and many people in Japan executive smell, right? We'll people from outside to impose food culture to other places. There's something else going on here, though, don't go Sukumar. A researcher Rikio university says Japan originally designed its research program back in the eighties. And it had to tell the Whaling Commission ahead of time. How many whales it would catch up? I'm in the Hogen up coots budgeting with us, you're gonna do this Japan. Go to international well income is shown with a long-term target like day say Dell catch a hundred wells a year by because it supposedly for research. They can't reduce the number Wednesday catch even consumption declines. But now that they're resuming commercial whaling. They're actually expected to kill fewer whales. In fact, the anti-whaling group Sea Shepherd called it a positive development. The group's boats have actively tried to block Japan's whale hunts and sequoia says that may have had an unintended effect must've say homes, you how could you like? Guyana that though, why did I mustn't extent? He does all the key much in home. Come up Baker. The ironic thing is that sea shepherd's activities actually seem to increase Japanese support full whaling. There's this feeling about them like here. Adi's westerners coming to Japan and telling us agriculture is wrong. In a survey found seventy percent of Japanese are pro-whaling. It's a point of national pride when Japan announced it would leave the international commission. Sekula says politicians were all over the news hailing it as a victory for whaling culture. At sukey market almost every customer. I talked to tells me they hardly ever eat whale. But they still want to protect Japan's willing culture. Koichi Matsumoto who owns the whale restaurant welcomes that but he doesn't expect the change to commercial whaling to make much of an impact on people's eating habits. Susic you boombox don't know vision is consumption is already so low it's not suddenly going to skyrocket. But he is hopeful that with the right kind of marketing people might even double their consumption of whale. In other words, going from the size of roughly one slice of deli meat a year to two for the world Abigail. Leonard Tokyo is that time of year when it's relatively safe to climb Mount Everest hundreds of people will attempt to reach the summit ninety nine percent of them. We'll take one of two standard routes, but to climbers American Corey Richards, and Ecuadorian Esa von topa Minna will be attempting to chart a brand new route up the world's tallest mountain. If they succeed it'll be. The first new lineup. Everest in at least ten years Corey and Tokyo actually met on Everest in two thousand sixteen. They told me that they'd sit at base camp stare at the rock passageway that bisects the northeast face of the mountain and think someone should definitely try going up that way, you know, the first time we we both went and was just on my God that is so beautiful. And it's amazing that nobody has done yet. So yeah. Team went to attempt it in two thousand fifteen and very strong team of climbers. And that was the that tragic earthquake that year, so the mount sort of closed down, and they left and nobody's been back since. So it's not going to stay on climb. Forever. People might be familiar with the idea of hiring guides to plan a climb up Everest and the the sherpas to carry their stuff, but for people who don't know the climbing world, you guys are professional climbers and a totally different league. How are you planning this ascent? What else is unique about this one? Well, the the uniqueness. About these claim is will a you know that we are trying to climb something that hasn't been climbed yet. We're not going to use oxygen supplemented logs Dejan. That's the next thing and the level of support like you will describe we won't have that support. It's the two of us. So a new untried and path no-shirt has no oxygen like what is happening to your body when you're not on oxygen on a mountain like Everest. So to put it simple probably start dying. Slowly, it just imagine like having a plastic bag over your head and your vital body functions. Start to fail like Zoli as you know. I maybe you remind on then, you know, your hard stomach give everybody just sort of shuts down slowly. Thing to do this now. Right. Exactly oxygen is the ultimate dope. Right. It's like that's what our body that is the ultimate doping. They just makes everything so much easier. Are you concerned about fatality, of course? Yeah. That's possible gone sequence. That's a possible price to pay. You know, if if things go wrong, but is there a certain point on the ascent where you just have to put that out of your mind. I don't know that there's actually a certain inflection point or turning point. If you get to a turning point where you have to make a decision to put death out of your mind, you're probably in a pretty bad situation. Oftentimes, people are like, oh, you're an adrenaline junkie and the truth is if I'm feeling adrenaline. I've probably already screwed up. Yeah. Oh, really? So, you know, it's like, that's that's not what we're going to do you sound like old hands at this? Because basically you are. So what was the first time? You tried something. Everest. Let me start with you, Cory. Oh. Yes. So the for the first time, I tried to climb ever was a tragic failure. I mean, it was it was a horrific mess. I just went in with a lot of hubris and unwarranted ego. And I got really put in my place, and rightfully so. I mean, I I went there with Konrad anchor, and it was in the north face in two thousand twelve and we were on a National Geographic expedition, and I had had some PTSD from being buried in an avalanche on on gash approach to in Pakistan in winter. I just was not ready to be there. And it was you know, it was a really spectacular in public failure. But to know that you're not equipped as also experienced to topa what about you. My first time was in two thousand thirteen was twenty three years old at the time. What makes you guys a good team like how you're climbing styles mesh first of all, you know, the old sort of style of climbing was that we there was a you know, sort of a lot of. Matiz mo- wasn't a lot of communication toe phone. I talk about everything we talk about our strengths. We talk about a weakness. We talk about what's bothering us. We talk about where I'm going to need help where he's going to need help. And beyond that, you know, Toboso a he's a beast. And I am more of like, I'm not. So there's you know, we have different strengths in the mountain. And I mean, what do you think about that Tokyo for me really the mitre of trust in other? Like, I really know that I'm going to climbed Israel with someone that I can trust my life on you know. And that's what makes you know, team team will be made like, you know, the goal is big enough to make our hands sweat. You know, like, we we know that we need each other's abilities to make it happen. We wouldn't be able to do it alone. But also we can really trust each other. And that's just the bays of of any good team. Best case scenario, you make the summit by setting a new course, what is the second best scenario. We just don't die. I mean, we always there's these three sort of tenants of climbing, which is you know, in order, come home, come home, friends, go to the top. And so if you do those three things, you're that's successful. You know? So you're both raising funds for this assent to the Everest summit on new routes. No ropes. No oxygen. It is expensive. I mean, tens of thousands of dollars expensive. I do struggle. But to understand why spend all this money. Why take the enormous personal risk? What actually drives you at the end of the day? Well, first and foremost, it's important to understand that climbing comes from a place of privilege, and we are in a time right now where it's important to look at privilege own it and talk openly about it. The other piece of that those that we can't necessarily take back where we come from or the sort of the careers that we've fallen into and climbing his personally helped me build a small, but but somewhat potent platform to talk. Things that are really meaningful to me. And what is your platform what I'm very very passionate about? Because of my own history is is mental health. I do struggle personally with bipolar disorder and major depression, and climbing has been away to find some sort of meaning in my in my own life, especially when I was younger and searching for that topa. What about you? What what drives you what drives you up mountain like Everest. You know, sometimes we even we climb, and it's cloudy, and you know, you don't really see. But it's all about the connection with the Monthan. I guess the tins ancient times people's been getting into the double things. Right. So it's just this filling of unity and driven to go somewhere. That's wild. That's hard. You know, it's going to record the best out of you. And, you know, be connected with something that you don't really understand. But just Bush's you to give the best you have as Topol Minna and Corey Richards on their way. To another. Everest summit this time on a new route with no oxygen ropes or guides. Thank you. Both very much for being with us. Thanks for having Bank. You it was fun. Yes. Dealing only get back -absolutely plan. All right did. But that was great take care Corey and topa have now reached base camp on the Tibetan side of Mount Everest their expedition to the summit could take up to two months, depending on the weather. We look forward to hearing their stories when they get back that is the world on this Wednesday from the NAN and Bill Harris studios at W H here in Boston. I'm Marco werman will be back with you tomorrow. He our public radio international.

US Marco werman Japan government president Yemen Secretary China President Trump Everest David Miller Cuba Tokyo attorney Alan Garcia United Nations Peru Yemenis Paris Odebrecht
April 8, 2019: Hour 1

Here & Now

42:33 min | 2 years ago

April 8, 2019: Hour 1

"Support for here. And now comes from ember wave presenting this message ember wave the new personal thermostat designed to help you feel cooler or warmer, anywhere. Learn more at ember wave dot com and use code NPR to save fifty dollars at checkout ember wave a breakthrough in temperature from NPR and WR. I'm Robin young and Peter O'Dowd. This is here. Now, cure Ston. Nielsen is out as secretary of homeland security effective Wednesday. She announced her resignation yesterday after White House meeting with the president who was unhappy about the surge of migrants crossing the US Mexico border, one person who is responsible for pressuring the president to make personnel changes. And to take a harder line on immigration is his aide and speechwriter, Stephen Miller Gabby or is the White House reporter for politico, and she's been writing about Nielsen's resignation and Miller's influence inside the administration. Gabby welcome to here. Now. Thanks for having me. So neil. Sohn went into this meeting with the president on Sunday not expecting to resign. What happened? So I was told by a few people close to Nielsen that she went into this meeting to sort of set the agenda on immigration going forward. The president has been not so pleased with what's happening down at the southern border. He's been expressing frustrations to aids both inside the White House, and at the various agencies that are overseeing border enforcement and Nielsen just wanted to go in there, and sort of work through what their plan is in the coming months, but also to address the situation that we saw unfold last week with the nominee to lead immigration and customs enforcement, Ronald vilo. He was withdrawn as the nominee last week, President Trump announced via Twitter that he wanted somebody to be a bit tougher in that position. And that was something that Nielsen was not looped in on beforehand. And so she wanted to sort of go in there. For me with the president talk about those concerns, but not alternately resigned. I mean, this was something that caught a lot of people off guard yesterday, including some White House officials and staffers at the homeland security department, so what to the scales against her your reporting suggests that perhaps Stephen Miller had something to do with it. We're not completely sure. Whether or not Stephen Miller was pushing for Nielsen's ouster specifically, we do know that he has been talking to a number of different mid to high level officials across the administration. These are people who work at homeland security department, the Labor Department state an elsewhere inside, you know, some of the agencies within D H S like ice and USCIS, and he's been talking to them about other individuals who he would like to ultimately push out of the administration. These are people who he doesn't feel tough enough on border security or on implementing the president's immigration agenda. But. We're not sure that Stephen Miller played a role in Nielsen's outsor- that we do know that he has been fairly critical of her both publicly and privately in in past months. So we do know that the president wanted somebody who would be tougher on this issue of immigration, and this what I don't fully understand about this because Nielsen was responsible for carrying out the administration's most controversial immigration policy, the one that was seen as the most hardline, and that of course is the family separation policy. I mean, how much more hardline does does the president, and perhaps his adviser want people to be they want somebody alternately who is going to carry themselves. Like, Stephen Miller does. I mean, he has a loyal soldier in the president's efforts to essentially shut down the border close it off to both on authorized an legal immigration. And yes secretary Nielsen certainly stood and defended and number. Of contentious policies that this administration does president put forward including family separation and and other policies related to asylum and whatnot at the border. But she didn't do it. You know happily. It was sort of begrudgingly supporting and defending these things in order to keep her job. And that was no secret to those closest to her. She felt as though she was one of the, you know, quote, unquote adults in the room, which is what I've just heard from from White House officials previously and that in order to ensure that the president didn't go even further to the right with his immigration policies that she needed to remain in place. And so that's why you did see her defending some of these controversial actions, despite you know, simultaneously, telling people behind the scenes that she didn't necessarily agree with the president's approach. Now is the Trump administration moves through people with operating will experience. At the border at the department of homeland security is there a concern that there is not very many people left on the bench to do the work. There is definitely a concern about the personnel situation at homeland security department, and who they can install permanently to lead that agency. A few of the names that have already been tossed around would have an extremely difficult time getting through the Senate confirmation process, and these are people like Ken Kuch Nellie and Chris co BAC the hard, right? You know, immigration activists who have definitely impressed the president. But at the same time would have an extremely difficult time answering some of the questions that they would face from from Senate Democrats, if they did get to the point where they were the nominee. Let's Gabby or White House reporter for politico. Thanks very much for speaking with us. Thank you so much, Peter. Well, Isreaeli go to the polls tomorrow. Oh, what a fact will prime minister Netanyahu's pledged to annex Jewish settlements in the occupied. West Bank have on voters. This is land Palestinians, NPS makers hope will be a future Palestinian state and the promise from Netanyahu has been widely condemned around the world as one that may win him last minute votes in his tight race for re-election, but will jeopardize a term peace agreement with Palestinians, Aaron David Miller is here a Middle East program director at the Wilson center in past adviser to democratic and Republican ministrations. Hi, Erin, I Robert how are you? I'm good. But how is this settling in Israel? I'm who is Netanyahu wooing sort of give us the context of you know, what's on the ground politically in Israel right now. The context is Benjamin Netanyahu is in the fight for his political his legal and his politically existential life Lee cooed has ruled the forty two years since banal come begging league claim to the party in nineteen seventy seven thirty one of those years has been dominated by Liku governments only. Price has Likud lost to to former Israeli chiefs of staff a Barack on one hand, and you talk Rabin on the other. And now Netanyahu was facing. And Benny Ganz. A man who is the Quinta central Israeli deep military experience, decorated war hero trial of holocaust survivors, grew up on his radio is rarely agricultual sediment, so Netanyahu. Now, I think is prepared to do just about anything in order to win. He's appealing to small right wing parties on the grounds that only he can predict protect protect the integrity and unity of the land of Israel and promising to a next not just the settlement blocks, which I might add the previous two or even three administrations in Washington have basically agreed with some how attached Israel through a peace negotiation with the Palestinians. He's also he's also promising to annex. Israeli settlements beyond the barrier, which probably another hundred and five thousand Isreaeli. So whether this is political expediency direction of things to come is unclear. You mentioned many games, he leads the centrist a blue and white alliance. A his coalition slightly head in the polls as you said, this is just a squeaker for Netanyahu who is facing corruption and bribery charges not expected until the end of the year. But that cloud is hanging over him as well. But what is the thinking in Israel? What is the sympathy towards future negotiations for the two state solution? I mean, I think the in theory, the idea of a of separation from the Palestinians in theory, and on paper still generates a credible degree of support. But simply not as much momentum and as much steam as as it used to. I think most Israelis the polls suggest don't believe such a solution and sell them. It is possible with the right leadership Isreaeli and Palestinian, perhaps movement towards such an outcome is possible. But I think momentum has been replaced by a nurse ya. And the reality is these Railly's control since Oslo sixty percent of the West Bank. Now, they control sixty percent of the West Bank. And that reality frankly, has not only proven to be manageable for most Israelis with respect to the security situation. But both economically in dip diplomatically there. Have simply been very few consequences Israel now has relations with over one hundred and sixty countries in the world. This prime minister has personal relationships with lider Putin and Donald Trump. So the notion that somehow these rallies can't proceed with retention of these. Territories. Otherwise, they're going to be become some sort of pariah simply has now proven proven the case. The reality Robin is the future of a democratic Jewish state is is on the table. That's the real danger. And I think that's a danger that some almost Israel. Lisa rationalized is out there somewhere. But it's simply not now just in a minute. We have what do you mean by that? Because Israelis have seen themselves as Jew, a Jewish and democratic country. You're what are you saying about the second part of that? Well, I'm suggesting that the occupation NATs. Exactly what it is not that the Palestinians partly responsible for the dysfunction that exists in the absence of of of a credible peace process. But the reality is if in fact, you move to a situation, which there's no separation from the Palestinians the Israelis maintain control over two point six million Palestinians in the West Bank a day. Facto control in the sense that they control what comes in and out of Gaza. That's another one point six million quarter of a million Palestinians in east Jerusalem. We have to we have to wrap, but your options are are pretty bleak. That doesn't look like a democratic solution. Aaron David Miller of the Wilson center. We'll be watching tomorrow. Thank you so much. Thank you. We're going to take some time now to look at two stories about indigenous people trying to reclaim their traditional relationship with wildlife. I the fort peck as cinnabon and Sioux tribes of northeastern Montana, they're set to receive a lot of buffalo meat as Yellowstone National Park conducts its annual bison, call it's meant to keep the parks bison population below four thousand but leaders from the fort peck, tribes say they would rather take in those animals while they're still alive. They spent more than half a million dollars building a bison quarantine facility. So that someday they can establish new herds on the reservation, but this year Yellowstone gave them only five of the surplus bison all of them bowls. Robert Magnin is director of the fish and game department for the fort peck, a cinnabon and Sioux tribes, and he joins us now from poplar Montana. Robert. Hi, good afternoon. Now, you say the national. Park service assured, the fort peck, tribes that they would be getting extra bison more bison than you've gotten so far. What is your big picture vision for what you'd like to do what we really want to do is available to get all sexes of buffalo on zoo. According project here in our ultimate goal is restoring buffalo onto Indian country all over the United States. Now, let's talk about why you have to quarantine them in the first place. There is a disease called Bruce alot sus in ranchers in your area. They're terrified of it. They say the Yellowstone bison carry this disease. It could affect their herds of cattle wipe them out and cost. The ranchers a lot of money is it smart to be cautious here because you aren't getting a lot of pushback from these ranchers. Yes, it's a lot of that is based on fear. We've been trying to educate the state of Montana for the last seven years that when they make decisions you base. Sit on science, not politics and reality is a very small opportunity or an animal can affect other animal was versus and that's during calving time when they're females are letting go there after birth and the rest of the time, it's you can't get contact with another animal that way, and that's why you have a year long quarantine process. That's what you built that facility for. So those animals go in they stay sequestered for at least a year. So they go through that process, and you can then certify that they don't have that disease at which point then what you would release them out into the wild. Yes. And upon graduation of the one year than we could even turn out to our existing herds are give to other tribes. Yeah. Now, you don't need me to tell you that bison where once a very important part of your culture there nearly thirty million Rome to the American west. But by the end of the nineteenth century, white settlers. Had all but a radically did them, and it was intentional politicians and generals thought that if they could wipe out the bison, they could put native Americans into submission. How personal is this project for you? It's a very personal year. Right. Government house use terrorist tactics somebody getting and they wipe out the nation's economy. That's how they brought native American down to their knees. But fortunately didn't do good enough job. Because native American end the buffalo are still here. And we're trying to build herds back to where they could be part of our economy once again, and what would it be like on the reservation to have a free? Roaming herd of buffalo. Okay. That's a misunderstanding that phrase, free, roaming, even in Yellowstone National Park, they have a visible barrier. But we like to us here are phrase. Is wide ranging hurts above all will I take your point. But what would it mean to have that situation return to your land? It would re connect a lot of our native people to our culture a lot of our culture is being lost. Because Buffalo's always been the center of our culture, and we reconnect them through the buffalo. How are the five both that you've got they're in quarantine? Now. How are they doing are? They happy. Yes. Actually, I'll the twenty second of April will do our first test and are just her just outside of the quarantine. They come by a kind of is it the other bowls. Yeah, they're a little lonely. I guess. In time by October. They'll be turned out with hurt. So they they'll eventually get to be with our or that's Robert magnet. He's director of the fish and game department for the fort peck, cinnabon and Sioux tribes, Robert, thanks for speaking with us. Yeah. You have the day now to Washington state where the McCaw tribe has the support of the federal government in its long quest to resume wail hunts off the coast last week. The National Oceanic and atmosphere administration announced a proposal to allow the tribe to hunt a limited number of gray whales over a ten year period. Environmentalists like DJ Schubert have been fighting that hunt for decades. He's a wildlife biologist for the animal welfare institute. DJ welcome. Thank you. And are you making the point that the tribe should not be allowed to resume this hunt? Yeah. Absolutely. We think there are you know, legal ethical scientific humane reasons why this should not go forward. We think the national. Rian fishery services aired in its preliminary determination of granting this waiver to the McCaw tribe. And we intend to continue to advocate for the whales and against this hunt going forward. What's your environmental reasoning? The US government says that up to six hundred of these whales can be taken each year without harming the animals population. And they were taken off the endangered species list all the way back in nineteen Ninety-four while that's correct that they're not listed under the Esa anymore, Endangered Species Act anymore in our mind. It's not a matter of Ken. We hunt these whales at should we hunt these whales and the reality is that there is a large population of eastern, north Pacific, gray whales. But then there are these two smaller populations of grey whales. One is the western north Pacific gray whales where current population. Estimates are proximity two hundred animals these animals spend most of the year off the coast of Russia, but some of them do swim over and join their eastern cousins as they migrate. From Alaska down to Mexico. There's also a group of whales. Call the Pacific coast feeding aggregation or Pacific coast feeding group which numbers currently around two hundred and forty three animals and both of these small populations could be a haunted under the proposal issued by nips. Now, it may not be as likely that they would be killed as the Wales from the larger population. But from our perspective, not a single whale should be killed. However, the tribe might say there are ethical issues here from their perspective as well. Because this was something that the federal government agreed to in a treaty with the tribe all the way back in eighteen fifty five, and I'm sure you know, that the history of the US government reneging on treaties with native people is a is a long insensitive topic. Yeah, it is. And we certainly feel for the there is tribes that have been adversaries affected by the government reneging on the various treaty and specific treaty rights in this case, however, the treaty language in regards, the macaw indicates. That they can whale in common with other citizens. The treaty was adopted at a time when gray wills weren't protected. In addition. We're not convinced that that particular treaty right remains in place because we think it's been abrogated by the passage of the marine mammal Protection Act in nineteen seventy two that very issue has been raised in two previous lawsuits about this hunt. But in both cases, the court never had the rule on the abrogation issue. So we think it's still a valid claim that needs to be a judicata by by the courts, but we're also not talking about that many animals under this agreement. The tribe would be allowed to kill no more than three whales a year during even numbered years and one whale for every odd number year. Not that many animals in the over. The course of a decade. That's true. I I'm not going to argue against that. Because those are the numbers. But again, it's not can we kill the whales. At should we kill the whales? And the reality is in our opinion, particularly given the history of the gray whale and how commercial whaling drove that species to the brink of extinction. And the fact that the McCaw don't need to kill the whales. They don't have a nutritional a requirement. They don't have a subsistence a need. Our question is should we kill them? And we don't think we should we think there are some animals that don't require to be something to lethal control. And at in this case, we don't think the McCaw hunt is is a wise wise future for these animals. You say they don't have a subsistence need to kill the whales, but they used to and the tribe is trying to make the point that that was very important part of his lifestyle. That is now gone. So you. You know, you could say they don't need to do it. But, but if they want to isn't that enough while the International Whaling Commission requires that an aboriginal group demonstrate a nutritional need, a subsistence need and a cultural need, they have to meet all three standards. Now, the McCaw would argue that they have a cultural need because they they claim that they've maintained their sort of cultural practices regards to their history of whale hunting through their rituals, and dances, and so on and so forth. But the reality is that they have gone without wailing since like nineteen twenty six with the exception of one wheel killed legally in nineteen ninety nine and another will killed illegally in two thousand seven. So it's very hard to to understand how they could possibly meet the standards of having a nutritional subsistence need to well. Well that period of time when they weren't hunting the whales since the nineteen twenties was sort of mandated that they stopped not entirely. I mean, yes, they did stop because they claim the number of gray whales was so. Diminished that it just wasn't effective for them to go out and hunt. But if you look at the historical record, including a lot of information that the McCaw themselves have submitted to the government, they really stopped whaling in the mid eighteen hundreds and by eighteen ninety one the McCaw were so in demand by sealing vessels as navigators, and as seal hunters that most of them gave up whaling because they could make more profit as as sealers on the vessels that plied the waters off of the west coast of the US and off the west coast of Canada killing sales. That's DJ Schubert a wildlife biologist for the animal welfare institute. DJ thanks for your time. Thanks for speaking with us. Thank you, Peter. Appreciate it. This message comes from here. And now sponsor ember way ember wave the revolutionary personal thermostat. That is designed to help you feel cooler or warmer at the press of a button ember wave can put you in control in places like you're freezing office uncomfortable. Airplanes restaurants, trains, cafes and more named one of time magazine's best inventions of two thousand eighteen learn more at ember wave dot com and use code NPR to save fifty dollars at checkout ember wave control your comfort. April is financial literacy month put on your party hat because according to a recent survey from the business school at George Washington University. We need a lot of help because US adults are scoring an F in personal financial literacy, the survey measured everything from knowledge of borrowing to comprehending risk the section Americans, by the way, perform the worst on. So Jill Schlesinger is wondering should more high schools, teach financial literacy, she's of course, our business analysts and analysts with CBS news and host of Jilan money. Jill first of all start with this survey and the questions that were asked that apparently we didn't get I mean, look some of these questions were probably pretty easy, but not every single one of them. I wanna give you an example one of the questions because you may not find it totally easy either. So you're ready robbing ready for your s and I'm sure I won't go ahead. Okay. Investment? A will deliver a return. Of either ten percent or six percent with each outcome. Equally likely investment be will deliver a return of either twelve percent or four percent with each outcome. Equally likely you can expect to earn more by investing in which tier your options investment a investment. Be it does not matter. The expected return is the same with each don't know. No response. Hold on don't answer. I don't want you to embarrass yourself. No. I'm thank you. What's the answer? The answer. Is it doesn't matter because the question is not asking which could give you a better return. It's what's more likely? So it says a return of either ten or six with each outcome equally likely. So you then say ten plus six is sixteen right divided by two. It's kind of like the average of that would be what your most likely scenario is the meet somewhere in the middle. You meet somewhere in the middle of four and twelve get the exact same place got it. And this gets into understanding the concept of statistics number one and probability number two. Right. That's what's a very hard leap for Americans. It's also why comprehending risk scored the lowest of every single type of question on this test. So here's what it is. It's fascinating. It's not that we need some higher level math. We need math studies to include examples of personal finance, and that's really the key. That the study of math is not something esoteric of such a math had some sorry that I'm going on a very passionate. But it we want the kids to understand the connection between being able to problem solve and make better decisions for themselves and the way to do that is to use these kinds of real life examples in math class. What if you're an adult? And you want to sharpen your financial literacy, you know, I would say that there's a great answer to that one thing that you can do is through the consumer financial protection bureau. There is a wonderful part of the website called money as you grow this came as a result after the financial crisis, and it was really intended to help you talk to your kid about money. But what's really neat about? It is if you do that with your kids or he just do it in the privacy of your own home. It will talk about really interesting rudimentary and next level concepts that you need to master. So I think that this is a really easy free website. And it's consumer finance dot gov again money as you grow gills lessons your business analysts with CPS news host of Jill on money. Jill thanks as always, my pleasure. Five hundred runners from more than fifty countries gathered in Denmark recently for the world cross country championships, the setting was picturesque, but the athletes didn't have much time to send postcards home. That's because they had to conquer hills mud and water as they ran across the Danish countryside. Oh, and we should point out. The also Vikings here. Now's Alex Ashok was in Denmark for the racist. And brought back. This report cross country is nothing like doing laps around a track when you run cross country, you're covering the landscape jumping fences crossing streams crusting hills. And that was certainly the case in Denmark, Sebastian Coe was there. He's president of the international association of athletics federation's. The I AA f the sports governing body. He won two Olympic gold medals on the track, but says cross country remains the essence of running on. I love trust com- shave because I think eight as quintessentially that element of all. Spoil the soda sums up the human condition, endurance. It's focused strategy the roots of cross country stretch all the way back to England in the eighteen hundreds it started as an imitation of FOX hunting. Broughton? Well. That was a ceremonial start of these world cross country championships which were held outside our who's a coastal city. Founded by Vikings twelve hundred years ago, Yaacob Larson is director of the Danish athletics federation this has from day one been about turning people's hits. So whatever we could come up with that would make people turn their heads. Yes. Let's do this Larsen and his team designed a course runners described as the most difficult they never seen. Besides the mud and water. There were legged busting hills won't up the grassy roof of the most guard museum, which hosted the event American. Stephanie Bruce runs marathons, but she said this six mile race was the hardest. She'd ever done. People thought it was very gimmicky. It was not it was true cost country, but beat everything up clods up. If you're calved up, it'd be heart up and decide to do out in studio to speak out. If you hurt writing bet with spectator friendly and ten thousand people showed up to watch part of the course ran through the beer tent. And yes there were Vikings. Anna Sophia bay was one of the Viking re-enactors cheering on the runners. It's really cool. It's a great event. And it seems like the the people here really happy and enjoying it. And the run us a really really really talented and good. And we we enjoy being out of it. And I see a kettle boiling what's in their coffee. We need that coffee. African runners dominated this event as I have in most years, but beyond the results this was really about generating interest in a sport that has lost some of its luster, Mike ARCHE Ola made the trip from Massachusetts sedan Mark to help celebrate cross country. I hope that people realize that if you put on a really good event, it will eliminate some of the mystique in the people think it's just a school age thing that people do, but it's not it's a it's a lifelong thing that people can do I mean if the Spartan races and the color races can make it cross country is as tougher tougher than any of those things, and I think people would be wise to give it a try one hope from Denmark is that the Olympics will give cross country. Try again, there's a campaign underway now to add it to the Olympic program in Paris in twenty twenty four that would be one hundred years after the last Olympic cross country race for here. Now, I'm Alex Ashok and leave it to Alex to plan a vacation around a running race. Well, there was no snow. Oh, they're in Denmark, but back here in the state some late season storms buried mountain states in the stuff and some ski resorts extended their seasons. Good news for skiers and ski bums ski boming is as much term of endearment as it is an aspiration to live them out in life. But decades of corporate mergers and tourism have turned scrappy ski towns in a high end resort making it harder for these low wage workers to live that dream Duri, brisk Karen, visited the crested Butte ski resort in Colorado and has this report in crested Butte. Colorado ski bums are still living the dream. Roll out of bed pack up the car and drive up a snow covered road and into the back country there five people packed into a Chevy Silverado. Which is a good thing because the car fish tails a bit on the high mountain roads. We come to a small clearing with a terrain park off to the side a place for skiers and snowboarders to do their tricks. Irwin park. Twenty year old Ben Haden says locals built this park scavenging old skateboard rails and pieces of wood. There's no ski lift just a well worn path for hiking up like it snows and everything else about, but the way it's position at a whole snow, and you can drive right up to it. So that's purposeful. To support this lifestyle. The ski bums work construction as skin structures bartenders in short all of the jobs that make up the backbone of a mountain resort economy, but wages for these jobs are often low or unpredictable or the work is seasonal still ski bums find ways to make it work snowboarder, Joe dab moved out here from California eight years ago when he was eighteen. Glamour's cheeseburgers. But the first for years, I was out here. I was just would camp all summer long life. Here is getting more expensive these days this year corporate behemoth Vail resorts announced it would purchase crested Butte and to mountains on the east coast in seventy four million dollar deal. Local say they hope Vale has the money to make improvements to ski lifts and a long-awaited trail expansion at the same time. They worry that an influx of tourists will take all of the factors that make it hard to afford life here and shift them into overdrive the mountain town there we were significantly hit by the recession. Frank Consol is a realtor for a firm called signature properties. People were going to default on their second home before the first since the country's economic recovery. He says the price of a lower end condo. Here has almost doubled the veil by could make prices, spike, even more, but we won't know for for other. Six twelve twenty four months. It'll be hard to say not good news for ski bums like Josh painter when he's not snowboarding. He serves tamales and burrito said a cafe downtown. He says, he'll leave crested Butte. If he has to why there's gotta be some small undiscovered ski town in Montana or something to keep workers like painter in town. Some resorts are building employee housing and boosting the minimum wage. They'll just raised its minimum from eleven dollars an hour to twelve twenty five resorts are also sponsoring foreign workers on special visas, although that program has been cut back under the Trump administration. So the future of crested Butte worries Thirty-one-year-old, Katie Thomas. She says her parents were ski bums and now so she I was living in a city. I was dating a lawyer. I was looking at the prospect of marriage and children and a white picket fence, and I realized I didn't want that. I wanted to. To ski and work in the same day. And I wanted to be back in my mountains. So I came home during the day. She works behind the desk. Get a construction firm and works nights at rom distillery that selves craft cocktails and steaming bowls of fancy Rahman. She worries that crested Butte will go the way of Aspen or telluride but the elite living in town. She says and the workers commuting in an hour or more. You know, one of the saddest things I do as a walk through town in April and ninety percent of the houses are dark because their second homeowners. The glitzy transition may bring jobs Thomas says and also deep pangs of loss for here. Now, I'm very scared and dirty story comes to us from the mountain west news bureau. And this quick note. How about those Baylor women? Denied by ten. Twenty. No. Baylor's lady bears beat the Notre Dame fighting Irish eighty to eighty one in Tampa last night. Lots of John along the way including Valer star Lauren Cox's horrifying, injury the bear second highest score. She went up for a rebound and came down in a pile on the floor with a buckled. Knee Lauren Cox's fellow superstar kalani Brown and the rest of the bears. Look like, they might not recover they gave up a double digit lead. But they ward back in the final moments. So congratulations Baylor. And all yeah. What else? Oh men play. That's right men. Play to tonight. The men's tournament comes to an end as Virginia takes on Texas Tech in Minneapolis. Some new twenty twenty polling shows that in a few key states. Former vice president Joe Biden is still at the front of the pack among Democrats seeking to unseat President Trump Biden still hasn't officially launched a campaign. He's been dogged by questions about his unwanted touching of women over the years. But our next guest is interested in another question altogether. Derek Thompson wants to know who is running in second place. Derek is a senior editor at the Atlantic. And he joins us now from New York, Derrick. Welcome y second-place. What does it matter? Right. Yeah. Why obsessive about second-place since this is obviously you've got to win a campaign to win. I'm really interested in the psychology of decision making. And this is one big decision making experiment. So there's two reasons to care about second choices number one. First choices are really important to obsess over when consumers or voters aren't going to get any. More information. But who are so early in the primary the next eight months, we're going to give a so much more information. And so it's important to look at okay. When voters learn more where might they adjust their preferences. Number two, second choices give us a clearer picture of what voters really want. If I tell you that my favorite candidate is Joe Biden that could mean Biden specifically it could mean I trust age and experience it could mean a moderate. But if I'm a voter who says my top choices Biden. But after that, I like Bernie than Beethoven mayor Pete than Hickenlooper will those are all guys. And maybe what I'm saying is voter is I just don't want to vote for a woman. So it's really important to listen to voters say they want not only for their first choice at this level. But also their second and even third choice. Okay. Also, another issue is that peaking too early. For the candidates is always a concern. I'm thinking back to twenty sixteen. Remember this time of year, Jeb Bush was the Republican presumptive front runner at that point. It did not work out for him. What are some other examples you can think of? Where it actually is very important to make sure who's running to take a look at who's running behind the person at the front of the pack. Yeah. In the GOP primary before the twenty sixteen election, the front running was Jeb Bush. He didn't win a single primary in the Republican primary before the twenty two thousand eight election the presumed front runner if you can remember was Rudy Giuliani. He didn't want a single primary for most of two thousand and three Howard Dean was the apparent front runner. I believe he only one Vermont. And then you look at Barack Obama. He was a famous second place runner behind Hillary Clinton for most of two thousand seven he was a two term president. So in general, I think it's very important to look at not just who is the presumptive front runner this far out. But also who is eking behind them in second and third place. And with this many candidates this year. I mean, it's got to be very difficult to do polling as well. So let's keep that in mind as we have this conversation. But there was also a recent morning console pull that looked at people's first and second choices that I know you're interested in what did you take away from it? Well, the political media is so obsessed with lanes. We say there's a left lane in a moderate lane a white guy lane and identity politics lane. It's just lanes and lanes. But when the polling firm morning consult asked voters who their second choice was the answer was the same across the board. It was Biden or it was burning. In fact, Biden voters said their second choice was Bernie and the Bernie voters said their second choice was Biden. And this tells me this early in the campaign at the most important signal for voters isn't as a -sarily gender or race or policy or style. I think it's familiarity. These are the two most familiar candidates in the race. If you look at how the morning causal also asked people, do you have a favorable opinion. Or have you never heard of these people the people the two candidates who would most been heard of we're Biden, and Bernie, so in many ways, I think you early voters this early in the primary are essentially telling pollster. Not who they're eventually going to settle on. But who they've heard of? And so it's dangerous to attach too much weight to those early predicted decision. What? Derek those two candidates are very different. There's Joe Biden who tries to sell himself as a moderate. And there's Bernie Sanders who you know, doesn't at all. And yet you're saying that that those two men could be the second choice for people that that's very interesting. Yeah. And the reason why I think it's happening. And some people are going to say that doesn't make any sense. Why would it Bernie person? Like, Joe Biden, if the reason they like Bernie is that he's a leftist revolutionary, and why would someone who's Abidin fan one of haute for Bernie's since Bernie's like a pro a lifelong protested voter while Biden has been so historically in the mainstream of the Democratic Party will the only answer, I think is you could you could say that a lot of voters just trust old white men. It's it's a possibility. I haven't looked that deeply into it. But another possibility that thing that I think is more in keeping with the cycle. Logical principles that I'm most familiar with is the power of familiarity voters, really really trust. Familiarity. And I think that it's really important to look at the fact that the two candidates who lead in the share of voters who have heard of them are also leading in the polls that tells me that a lot of other candidates have a chance to catch up with them. Once they are exposed on the national state and quickly. What about people who voters a candidate who voters might be familiar with say, Elizabeth Warren, but aren't doing very well in the polls briefly, I think it's just bad news for Elizabeth Warren? If you're that familiar with voters, and you're still not polling. Well, that does not speak highly of your chances that said, it's still very very early. It is very very early. And that is probably why these candidates they've already done three hundred plus events across twenty four states. According to the Associated Press, and that is only going to get higher. Derek Thompson senior editor at the Atlantic. Thanks so much for joining us. Thank you hear. Now's the production of NPR and WVU are in association with the BBC world. Service. I'm Peter road out and Robin young. This is here now.

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Ep. 28   Bathsheba Demuth on Capitalism, Communism and Arctic Ecology

When We Talk About Animals

49:35 min | 1 year ago

Ep. 28 Bathsheba Demuth on Capitalism, Communism and Arctic Ecology

"We ended up using these awkward Portmanteau 's like non human or other than human or non on human beings not human persons but all of those are about a lack rate if you put non in front of human. You're already implying that there's something missing which is not actually the way that I understand a whale to be. It's not a not person. It's a different kind of person. Welcome welcome to when we talk about animals a Yale University podcast. I'm Lindsay Stern and MVP Morris. Were you to pass under a streetlamp at night. In New England in the nineteenth century chances are good that you would find your path illuminated by substance that originated in the Arctic Sea Whale Oil. The waxy matter found in the skulls and blubber lover of these aquatic giants let the West during the industrial revolution producing a bright odorless flame. It houses roads and factories guided ships toward land and lubricated the water wheels in looms that helped drive the industrial revolution. It was the hunger for this substance rights. Our guest historian Bethsheba Demuth that nearly wiped these Leviathans off the planet and brought to warring world powers into contact with another way of relating nature commercial whaling ships rates Timothe sailed into a place where whales were not for sale. But we're understood as souls by the INUPIAT Yupik into people's who hunted them with expectations of a world world constantly reincarnating and never easy to survive in and there were the wheels themselves. She writes animals. Who in the first years of this revolution learned the danger of American and ships and chose with their behavior to frustrate the desires of commerce in floating coast demuth explores how capitalism Communism and Ecology Gee have clashed for over one hundred fifty years in the remote region of Brinda the Arctic lands and waters stretching between Russia and Canada long before Americans and Europeans arrived to recruit it's creatures into their economic programs? Indigenous peoples living in these territories have practiced drastically different modes of association with the elements colonist honest regarded as natural resources in reconstructing the confrontation between these practices and the rituals of early industrialization. Demuth remakes the possibilities. Virginia what is the nature of history she asks when nature is part of what makes history Bethsheba Demuth is an environmental historian at Brown University diversity specializing in the Russian. North American Arctic her interest in northern Environments and cultures began at the age of eighteen when she moved to the Yukon where she mushed. huskies hunted Caribou fished for Salmon tracked bears and otherwise learn to survive in the Tiger and Tundra her explorations of how the histories of people ideas the places. In non human species intersect have appeared in the New Yorker Yon the Atlantic and in her acclaimed first book floating coast and Environmental History of the Bering. Strait eight it was hailed as the best book. Twenty nine thousand nine by Nature Bethsheba Demuth welcome talk about animals. Thank you so much for having me. This is such a treat for someone and who has never been to Brinda. How would you describe the landscape? And what were your first encounters there. That's a great question. I think the first thing to think about or when I think about the landscape bridge is that it's actually incredibly varied. I think for folks who haven't spent a lot of time in the Arctic. There's a sense that when you get that far north. It's very very monotonous. It's a lot of sort of frozen wasteland but in fact it's a really dynamic landscape that changes from Mile Two mile some of its mountainous Some of it's kind of flat open boggy terrain Some of it's very dramatic coastlines. Some of it's more sort of settled beaches. So when I think about about it it's very specific to given locations because it's so variable and indeed changeable some of these are places that are Changing in almost real time because has of the ways that tides work Arctic rivers move pretty radically over time. They they sort of changed their riverbeds pretty quickly in the Hebrew rivers. They changed them quickly. So that's part of what I think about when I think about Brinda is that it's it's not a frozen wasteland and I really learn to think about it that way when I moved up there On something of a wild hair when I was eighteen and spent several years training sled dogs up north and it was was it was an education in many things but one of them was really in how alive and dynamic this landscape is and how that dynamism is really part of shaping everyday life. How did you come to focus on Wales in particular so I did not start writing this project thinking I was going to write about Wales at all it was a it it was a happy accident? and it was an accident that really emerged out of the archives in the sources that I was using to try to understand the history of human environment firemen relationships in this part of the world over the last two hundred years or so and when I first started writing this project I was planning on concentrating on the Russian side of the Bering during straight I was trained as a Russian historian and then I realized that the nation state boundaries didn't really make any sense they're they're very very recent they really only were operational after nineteen forty eight and even to this day when you're up in Ngo there's really a sense that this is a place that has far more to connect it than to divide it. So I sort of dispensed with the nation state particularity and realize that I needed to talk about both. What is now the United States? What is now the Russian Federation and then I also realized that the standard political Time points that I had imagined setting the tempo for this story that I wanted to write particularly the Russian Revolution was important. But it didn't actually make sense as a starting point because in thinking about the ways in which Different European ideas ideas about how we should interact with. Nature have come into contact with Brynjar in nature and with Yupik Shuki New People in Brinda. The Russian revolution comes after a series of other revolutions. And the first one and this came up in the oral histories. It came up in the archive documents that I found was really with commercial whaling in the nineteenth century and I figured this out and I was sitting in an archive in Vladivostok. which is very very far are from the whaling archives that are actually here in New England and so it was a with a bit of panic that I realized that I needed to draw the story back long before the Russian revolution and that it wasn't even a Russian story really at all because the Russian empire was not a whaling country and it was one that was going to kind of start at the confluence influence of indigenous wailing and this kind of commercial whaling that emerges out of New England in the book? You describe how the first New England whalers arrived in this region in the late eighteen forty s prior to their arrival. What would the interaction have looked like between the bow head and other whales in the region that you focus on? That's a great question. So Wales and bowhead whales and gray whales in particular have been absolutely critical to human life in the Bering Strait for Millennia for for at least two thousand years and in part this is because this is a a region of the world where the ways in which we if you're living in temperate place like we are here in new haven get our day to day. Energy doesn't really work so specifically agriculture. It's not really a going concern if you're living in a sub Arctic and Arctic Bering Strait it. There's just not enough day. Late soils aren't great. So people made livings from other kinds of materials that they found in the world and Wales have an enormous concentration of energy in their bodies bowhead. Whales are over forty percent fat by volume. So they're kind of a floating stick of butter and people learned how to hunt them from open boats millennia ago and this has become kind of a critical Michael anchoring point for villages all along the Bering Strait both on the Russian in the US side and some illustration of how kind of critical and also so how rich these animals were People along the Bering Strait could live in settled villages so not following migratory animals not changing their own place in space in order to find food but actually just had an food coming to them in the form of Wales so absolutely critical to material survival. If if you just kind of boil it down to the the calories that come in a whale but beyond that whales were understood and remain a really critical piece of the ways in which people understood their relationship with the world at large so beyond being a material resource wheels were a constituent part of the sort of social fabric of human life and in life more generally in the bering strait and that that kind of relationship the understanding of Wales as being sentient beings that were able to make moral judgments if people to understand that people That hunted them as being dependent on Wales behavior in order to continue existing assisting led to kind of a relationship between wheels and people in which maybe a hundred bowhead whales a year were killed for food And and then that's out of a population of about twenty thousand between twenty and thirty thousand animals so for the majority of human and Wail Coexistence assistance in the Arctic. That's really been the main experience. Is that a few. Whales are hunted per year From a relatively robust population and then what happened in eighteen forty eight and eighteen forty nine so in eighteen forty eight ship. Captain named Thomas. Roy's who was shipping out of new Bedford Massachusetts. It's Makes his way up to the Bering Strait At this point if you think about the map of the world this is a pretty desperate voyage for a new England wailer. He's a long long way from from home On voyages. By that point we're lasting eighteen months or more and the reason that Roy's pushes as far as the Bering Strait is because the whale species that were easy to hunt from tall ships so right whales and sperm whales gray whales. We're growing rare enough all through the Atlantic and then also through the Pacific That he was willing to try sailing up into what were to commercial whalers completely unknown waters and he arrives and discovers that this was a really good choice because the seas around the Bering Strait In June when he sales in just a live with both Wales and they're very easy to hunt. So you you know. He very quickly fills up the hold of his ship with bowhead whale oil to to bring back to new Bedford and then also brings news of this kind of bonanza of of new whaling grounds back to Hawaii which at that time was a major stopover point for the Yankee Whaling Fleet in the Pacific And so by eighteen forty nine hundred undress ships or more head North because they've heard rumors of this or and also read it in the newspapers that there's this new whaling ground in the course of your research you describe bribe a lot of the the journals and various sources that you found from these whalers which was one of one of many very fascinating sources that you used for the book and you see in in these journals that the wailers interacting with the whales like the indigenous people saw that saw the whales as having agency and being able to learn and See them protecting their young and a working very hard to try to avoid being killed in this way There's no means for them to have that emotional response matter in. Of course this capitalist system and I'm curious What how did the whales than respond to this? This change which is something you write about very beautifully in fascinating way in footing coast so one of the things that I was hoping to be able to talk about as I read this book were instances in which you could really really see the environment or nature or an animal species or something something else in the Arctic really exerting agency over for human history And I had this sort of broad thing that I was hoping would emerge out of the research But I realized it was going to be pretty hard to pin down and then it turns out that in the case of Wales meals. It wasn't hard to pin down at all. It was just leaping out of the sources all the time and in particular The case of this Yankee whaling fleet bit arrives in the Bering Strait enforce in eighteen forty nine and has several just banana seasons. They're able to kill whales you you know. Almost every day they see them in large numbers. The whales are not afraid of the whalers at all. The logs kind of repeatedly discussed the ways in which the whales which are sort of swim up to ships ships. And so. It's an incredibly easy place to hunt. But within a couple of years of the the Yankee fleet arriving this behavior changes ages completely and instead of swimming up to the ships BOWHEAD whales start actively avoiding them in particular starts swimming into the edge of the pack ice which if you're imagining yourself in a wooden tall ship of the Moby Dick Variety? If you're up around the Bering Strait you do not want to have an and an altercation with the They will founder your ship potentially so the ship's captains would try to keep a distance and the bow had Wales seemed to have learned this pretty quickly A. and would would flee into the sea ice when they saw ships approaching and to such an extent that in the middle of the eighteen fifties the Yankee Anki ships stopped coming to the Bering Strait at all. They conclude that it's actually too dangerous. It's too hard to hunt these bowhead whales because they have become as the whalers put it so canny or so shy or so wild. Those are the words that they tend to use the most And it's not really until the fleet is absolutely desperate to fill up their holds as with oil that they attempt going back up Actually ended up losing a lot of ships in the in the process. I WanNa return to this idea of of how the wheels are actually approaching the Harpoon ships steered by the Indigenous People. How did why did they do that? And according to the indigenous people so the the U bit understanding And the new back understanding of bowhead whale behavior and this is something that appears in the oral history records and it appears in ethnographic records and and it appears in present practice So it's a really robust archive of Understanding will behavior this way. Is that bowhead. Whales Our animals with extraordinary moral sentiment An observational capacity. who spend much of their life at sea distant from people but observing what human beings are doing on land and so they will notice if a particular hunter is for example not generous with the the people in his community? They will notice if he is mean to the people in his family or if the wife of the hunter who has a very critical role in calling hauling in the whales is not respectful in these actions if people are not keeping their wheel boots clean if they're not keeping their community tidy. There's a whole set of rules about the ways in which people should relate to each other and relate to the land that they're on and relate to other animals that whales are observing when they spend time away from the community and and this means that if when the whales are migrating past. They come near a hunter who has not behaved in appropriate way. is somehow out of sync cope with his community. And I mean community in a very capricious sense not just with people Then the whales will keep a distance from those hunters and there's a a particular kind of way in which hunters describe this happening when they go out and whale boats where they'll see bowhead from shore they'll get in the whale boats they'll go go out and approach And the bowheads will often keep at a distance sort of out of Harpoon range and usually on the left side of the boat and the Harpoon usually sits on the right right side of the boat. And we'll just observe the whalers for a while and then we'll either dive and disappear or die and come up on the right hand side of the boat where they're close enough to the Harpoon or to be struck and the Yupik Nubia understanding of this is that the whales are making a choice in that moment That they will sacrifice themselves for the good of this human community. In order that people can eat An order that people kind of will maintain this relationship with the ocean and with the whale species through this active. Active death So it's not a moment of human supremacy or human kind of overcoming the whales natural abilities. It's a moment of the whale deciding that these people are worthy so it's deeply sunk into this Kind of moral worldview in which people are only one kind of being that makes the rules about what good action is. That's fascinating to extend the wheels play such a stabilizing force on society and the culture and you describe in the book likewise what what a stabilizing force they're playing On the environment and all sorts of ways as as ecological forces in their own right often. It seems in history Telling humans humans are the ones shaping the environment and are the main agents in that regard. And you make clear in this book to that you know. Even interactions with people aside. The wheels are playing an absolutely the extraordinary role In as ecological for. Could you explain how they do that. Yes a wheels do. Many things that are really critical to uh-huh system function One of which is just in the kind of mechanical process of rising to the surface to breathe and then diving and swimming. They move water through the water water column And in ocean ecosystems the water. That's closer to the bottom of the ocean floor tends to have more nutrients in it. It's heavier so that's where You know iron and phosphorus And those kinds of elements are collecting and then as Wales or diving and surfacing. They're moving that toward the surface and that's really important because photosynthetic life needs those nutrients to build cells so if you bring it up Algae diatoms and other things that are photosynthesis being able to get a hold of those nutrients and turn it it into more life So it's really critical. It's sort of they're able to fertilize And then they're also literally fertilizing because they're pooing in the water column all the time and these are large animals so you can imagine what that does. There's a term that kind of ecological term for this is being a whale pump. That they're actually kind of pumping water through the water. Water column but another thing is that whales can do is that because they are really large and bowhead whales in particular are so fatty their long lived served is that in seasons when the Arctic Ocean is somewhat less productive They're able to just eat less and then they absolutely gorge in seasons when it's very abundant And this means that you know because they are a major consumers in an ocean ecosystem because they can modulate this way. It means that the energy available for other species remains more consistent And so this has kind of an evening out effect that they will draw down their consumption lean years meaning that there is still nutrients trance available for other species and that that you know one of the hypothesis is about what whales do in an ecosystem is that they actually provide kind of tempering to the fact that these systems terms are often pretty statistic in terms of good years and bad years. What differences did you encounter in your research around the communist I system and the capitalist system as crystallized by wailing and the practices of of killing the whales? That's a really interesting question. And one where I expected to find many more differences than I did in some ways and the book is kind of book ended by these stories of industrial whaling alling starting with the capitalist wailing in the nineteenth century and then talking about Soviet whaling in the twentieth century and one of the things I found interesting was in the case of the Soviet tailing. The Soviet Union Starts Wailing in the nineteen thirties in the bering strait. And they do so very much aware And actually having inherited a great deal of of knowledge about what capitalist over Exploitation of Wales had done they understood that had caused widespread famine on the Russian coast because indigenous peoples no longer had enough Wales to hunt they understood that it was detrimental to the whales and they really sort of start their whaling program thinking that they can do it better and initially really start off with some real kind of desire to keep wailing within something like a sustainable ecological yield limit. That's not the terms they're using but it's it's roughly that idea that we're going to do this. In accordance to kind of what the ocean can give us. And they're doing this very much in service of a different idea than motivates capitalist wailing also which is instead of having Wales become commodities that make somebody rich through selling them they are supposed to enrich society at large. And it's really kind of using Wales just like you would a collective farm that was producing wheat or a collective farm that was making any other good in the Soviet Union that it's there in order to make people more free right to liberate them from the kind of terrible capitalist Labor. That actually did happen. But on those whaling ships in the nineteenth century that was so alienated. And you know so degrading in some sense so you know. The Soviet Union starts with the sense that they need to be more kind of cognizant of Wale biology and they also need to be more cognizant of the Labor conditions through which whales killed and not reproduce this capitalist system so this all looks great at the beginning and then it it unfortunately takes this kind of terrible course into really radical exploitation in an over exploitation Particularly after the Second World War in part this is I think a consequence of the conditions of the Second World War in the Soviet Union which were so materially dire It was a country that Fought that war with really every last person and every last good in every last sort of capacity that the country could muster. It was a truly an existential operation. There were thirty million casualties and it was something that really decimated the agricultural agriculture and industrial sector in the country to the degree that there was real concern about hunger within the Soviet Union during an after the war and out of this The captain of the whaling fleet in the Russian Pacific actually rights to stall and says look you know one of the ways that we can deal with this crisis in this country is we can wail more. You know. There's this huge supply of fat in particular. That's just off our coastal waters out here in the Pacific Fleet to Antarctica. We could have even more And so that was coming from a real place of human extremity and need And kind of prompts. The upswing in the Soviet whaling program into the nineteen fifties but then even after that kind of direct material crisis abates. The Soviet Union just keeps wailing They waylay outside the international whaling commission limits even though other a member of the WC. And you know my sense is that by the nineteen sixties and the early nineteen seventies when the Soviets are still wailing at this massive industrial level. They're doing so because it fulfils. Certain kind of ideological goals within the country It it fulfils does the sense that the Soviet Union is still kind of expanding its capacity to produce. And it's in this case doing so with whale bodies And it's happening happening at a time when the Soviets production is not as consistent on land in many ways and there are other kinds of issues that are starting to show up like environmental degradation But if you're whaling internationally and you can always fill the plan year after year and you can overfill the plan so it looks like you're you're not just a good communist. You're an excellent communist and you're winning awards for your Labor at sea and also all the negative things that are happening to the environment because of that are not happening on shore. They're being off shored literally there in the ocean. I think it it you know. It's kind of those confluence of events that sort of push. The Soviet willing programmed actually look really very similar to the American program that it was supposed to supersede and be better than in the nineteenth century. You've called that in writing. The logic of the slaughterhouse which I thought was a brilliant connection to make with regards to how this death and how all life being dependent on death in this way too but this very violent way of consuming is concealed in this in both the communist meanest setup and the capitalist American approach to wailing and I'm wondering what is lost. What is being lost by that approach and that logic check? That's a really great question and it's one that I again. I think really unites some of the environmental issues on both the Socialist Soviet Soviet side and the American capitalist side is the distance between the people who do the production of you know in this case Wales but it could also be I mean why alluded to the slaughterhouse. Could also be pigs or cows or chickens or some other kind of animal the people who are really intimately involved in that work Who Do not have have an option of imagining that you can consume something without having to kill it right that? That's that's just sort of fundamental rules of the human engagement with the world. If you're eating animals is that you have to kill them. First and a fundamental rule of engagement with plants is also often that you have to kill them in order to eat them. Unless you're an orchard Ester something There are some exceptions in the plant world and I think that that capacity to separate the site of production in the site of consumption allows this sense that we we can float above that kind of dirty business of actually being dependent on other kinds of life which is so present in the hunting ethics that emerge out of you pick and Shuki and a new PEAC Traditions where the sense of dependence on other animals who will choose to die in order for a person to live are so intimate and so kind of carefully articulated In those traditions versus when where you can go to a store and buy a piece of meat and have no sense either of the person who killed it or if the animal that was killed and so those relationships the life that was lived before the animal died the life conditions of the person. Who did the killing are completely we invisible and therefore can be completely terrible Without being factored into the cost In a in a monetary sense or in a moral sense of that act of consumption Asian and then likewise with slaughter houses as well then. It's often the person doing the killing. WHO's the person demonized for the result of a much bigger system bigger than themselves and you have included number quotes in the book including one from one of the I believe communist Russian whalers? Who says if Wales could scream out in pain like people we would all have gone gone mad but you're right? How the fact that he feels that way or with the observe just doesn't matter when you're stuck in this economic system and I think you likewise see this with Slaughterhouse Workers here's often sometimes it's demonized by various groups and are really Among the abused cogs in this industrial machine and you tell them the book a story of a group of in addition addition to the indigenous wheelers approach to the question of what is a whale and how they value it and the American capitalists approach and the Russian Communists you also describe In environmental activists group with Greenpeace and a fellow named Paul Watson. Can you describe that incident and what happened. And what your approach. What your take on? It is yeah so Greenpeace comes up at the very end of this book In part because Greenpeace was one of the the forcing functions that helped Soviet whaling And in the in the nineteen seventies And it's it's really kind of one of those. The the kind of historical story by which Greenpeace becomes part of this wailing. The story is really lovely in that Greenpeace starts anti-nuclear organization that's organized in order to prevent mass human slaughter due to nuclear weapons and then read at some point that Soviet and American intercontinental ballistic missiles were lubricated with the oil that's found in the heads of sperm whales because it has extraordinary little friction. It's one of the lowest friction wheels on the planet and so it was needed for these really technically precise Applications warheads and so the kind of initial activists in Greenpeace decide that you know the fates of Wales and the face of people are actually really intertwined because Wales are being and killed make these weapons that will kill all of humanity and so this turns the organization toward preventing industrial whaling and by the nineteen seventies when Greenpeace Greenpeace comes together. Basically the only countries really practicing mass industrial whaling at sea are the Soviets and to some extent the Japanese Through most of the twentieth century the Norwegians and the British and then some other countries had also been participant indirectly in terms of numbers of whales. killed killed far more than the Soviet Union did but the Soviets kind of keep doing it far past. When most capitalist countries have dropped out so Greenpeace ends up organizing against Soviet whaling pretty directly would try to run interference and disrupt Soviet whaling activities off the coast of the US in particular They would get the coordinates from the the Department of Defense which was worried that the Soviets were using their whaling fleets to spy on the US And then these Greenpeace activists in acts of real courage. would would go put themselves between Soviet industrial harpoons and the bodies of Wales. So this is kind of where it starts and I think has his contributes in some ways to the Soviets deciding that wailing is just not worth the cost anymore amongst other things that are going on But but the the kind of emphasis that Greenpeace has on. anti-whaling is not restricted simply to industrial whaling after the Soviet sort of start to reduce their program and eventually abandon it By the early eighties Greenpeace really turns to thinking about preventing the deaths of Wales by people. Oh anywhere at any time. And this includes indigenous whalers in the Arctic And so the the relationship between Greenpeace and you pick a new Biak wheelers dealers is really fraught as a result of this Because Greenpeace often falling into a very unreflective kind of colonialist mode owed of behaving would say. Well you just need to give up this practice right. It's barbaric it's You know it's not modern. The the language they would use was often really loaded And I think also emerged out of kind of an ironic way a similar level of detachment from the the realities of being a human being particularly in an Arctic environment. Where you can't just detach right if if you don't hunt whales? It's really difficult to find enough food to eat unless you're shipping it all in from somewhere else which comes with enormous environmental consequence also so to me Greenpeace on the one hand. Does this really important work of kind of making clear. What industrial whaling looks like what the cost of it are they you you know the the photographs that emerge out of these altercations with Soviet whaling ships are really critical in the anti-whaling movement and in the kind of drilling down into just the the kind of terrible circumstances in which these wheels die But the lack of ability to separate industrial killing from the kind of indigenous subsistence hunting in which emerges out of the sense that well we. We're kind of above consuming at all as human beings right were special in some fundamental way. We don't actually need to depend spend on animals or ecology in in a direct sense. We can kind of coast above it all And I think it's similar in some ways. It's just the inverse of The kind of if industrial killing wants to kill every last wheel than the solution to it is to just not kill any whales at all and what they're missing in the in the middle there is that kind of actually complicated business of being a person in the world that has to consume something in order to keep alive. We need to eat things. Maybe they're whales if you live in the Arctic they're probably not Wales if you don't live in the Arctic it's it's actually depends on the ecosystem that you live in And it's going going to look different in those different places and that that kind of level of particularity just sort of fell out of the story in the nineteen eighties. And I think at that impulse to universalize a set of rules regardless of the the ecosystem of the animals that people would be in relationship with comes from a very similar place as both the kind of Soviet so the desire to make everyone a communist or the American colonial desire to make everybody. You know a nice American capitalist. It's so ironic too that in in this practice that you describe as the concealment of death where the relationship toward the whale the the violence gets expressed through the development of missiles. Yes I was wondering. There's a passage that I was going to ask you to read a little before. Midway through the book that speaks to the different attitudes toward time that you discuss that the Communists had versus the capitalists and then the people the instinct of capitalism and communism is to ignore more loss to assume that change will bring improvement to cover over death with expanded consumption. Such modernist visions are telescopic from the present. Each leaps leaps into a distant world. A future place of freedom and plenty. The present must accelerate to reach that far country speed is quantified in what can be converted needed to material value for sale for the state. What exists in between the mess of lives lived in shifting concert with tides and winds and the never fixed mark ecological complexity slides from focus? I thought that was beautiful passage and I was struck in your analysis. US By what you call this kind of circular yet teleological conception of time that the capitalist ethic and the Communist shared verses what you had been touching on before as the more embedded cyclical way of understanding the human relationship with the environment and I was wondering if you could speak to that a bit. Yeah so another thing that. I didn't think I was reading about when I started. This book was time And it actually took getting multiple drafts into into realize that part of what what was coming out of the descriptions of the landscape that I was engaging in and the understandings of history as told through indigenous histories and the understandings of history as kind of presented in the the capitalist and socialist kind of trajectories. We're actually see all thinking about time and doing really different ways and it made me think about the ways in which for booth kind of American American American capitalist and Soviet socialist conceptions of time. It's very much in a line. Do you have a past. You have a president and you have a future and and the understanding is is that the future is going to be better than the present right that that's kind of the hopeful dream and that's not a bad thing we don't necessarily want to live in a world where we can't imagine better better futures and you can see I think particularly in the early Bolshevik understandings of time which are so invested in this idea that with revolution you can radically he transform and improve human life and really tangible ways and those are not you know not things to laugh off it turns out however that when you start bringing in aspects of history that are not just humans and even if you really take human beings seriously as kind of physical beings in the world old not just as ideas that float through on the page in your archive that there's also this kind of cyclical or sets of cyclical time that are in operation. And and and I saw this particular when I was writing about walruses and Arctic Foxes I tended to do the reading about them at the same time because they're both animals that live out on the CIS and Arctic Foxes. Have these very kind of distinct cyclical lives in which sometimes there are huge numbers of Arctic foxes. Sometimes there are smaller the numbers they go up and down and these these relatively predictable cycles and it looks very different than the life cycle of walruses which are somewhat more consistent over time. So if you're trying to make a living off a Fox's off of walruses those are two very different projects simply because of the time kind of the time worlds in which these animals exist and if you think about people we of course also have time worlds. That are quite cyclic. Because we're born at some point and then we get older and more productive through our lives and then eventually we were much older and less productive during our lives and that that is also kind of a cyclic thing. That's often challenging for these ideologies that think of time as close to deal with right and the Soviet Union had some real struggles dealing with things like birth and death. And what you do about the fact that it takes a lot of time to raise a young person and that's very different than factory work. This was a real challenge for the Bolsheviks And I don't think it's any less of a challenge for capitalist countries threes. Frankly right we're not particularly good in this country of thinking about those cyclical pieces of our lives. We want to reduce them economic terms and then discover that. That reduction is actually not good for people so that kind of Trying to think about writing history which is you know it emerges out of a real obsession session with teleology right. The the tradition which I write is in an you know without much exaggeration rates inherited pretty directly from Hegel who was pretty interested in teleology and pretty interested in lines. That have you know some back and forth in them with the idea of the synthesis and the antithesis are the sorry. I can ever get those right in order. The thesis antithesis synthesis. But really it's about going forward right and you know marks also very much engaged in this project of thinking about a theory of history. In order to create a new political order available very kind of teleological understanding adding and many kind of American theorists of capitalism similarly have ideas about the ways in which you know productivity and efficiency are going to produce you know a new and better ways of being in which the past is the past And we're not really bound to biological time in any really fundamental way and you you know those those kinds of obsessions with deals overlook. The ways in which natural systems are not just teleological. They are partly teleological. Do Change In the earth is obviously changed in ways that make it radically different now than it was several million years ago or several billion years ago but at the same time other kinds of time operating simultaneously Asli and then when I realized that I realized that I had to find some way of writing about it where I had all of these different kinds of time kind of floating in and out of the story which proved to be something of a challenge just sort of technical level because I think at least I am quite conditioned to write to reading stories have beginnings Middles and ends right and that the story form itself kind of lends itself to a T. Laos And that finding away within the chapter structure or within a paragraph structure to introduce the idea that some of these things beginning end and some of them continue Is I I found that an interesting interesting kind of technical challenge within the writing itself. I found it fascinating that you chose to begin the book with chapter called on names where you juxtapose the names of these regions the people of these regions call themselves with the the names colonists brought up and then you talk about how you sort have defined yourself as a foreigner as the narrative voice. You were coming in there so as you were on the ground exploring. Did you find that there. There were aspects of the narrative that proved especially difficult to the narrative is and make sense of on the page that that felt untranslatable to you as a function of that foreigner position or for some other reason. That's a really good question. I think there are many things and I think to me one of the things that I hope. This book does open space for people to be generally interested in this region and therefore go read and encourage the people from Burundi who are writing their own histories. There's many out there that are very worth reading and then there are more coming. There's like a whole generation of young scholars and writers who are Buchanan ups whose work is amazing and I think it for if people WANNA starting place the poet Joe Nabi Kane who wrote the The epigraph for this book Just has a year. She has a way of understanding the place because she's from King Island in the Bering Strait. That is fundamentally really different than mine. And it should be read right. It should be read widely and by everyone And I I wanted to emphasize from the beginning that I ah claim. No you know kind of overarching sense that I am from this place or have any particularly special voice about it In in many ways writing being about Brinda was away of wrestling with my own intellectual patrimony. Right which is coming from this world of obsessive teleology and sense of progress and the kind of mechanized agricultural existence that I grew up with And then because I moved to the Arctic when I was eighteen gene began to the limits of pretty early in my life and have been kind of wrestling with and trying to to think through what it what these ideas that I grew up with mean when they're actually put into practice so to me. It's in many ways a reckoning with those ideas In some really fundamental ways and in terms of things things that I found difficult to express that Mike continued an ongoing frustration. Really one with the English language which is that? There's not a great set of words or word for talking about things that are not people in ways that endow them with Sentence and moral capacity and a kind of being hood right we ended up using these awkward Portmanteau is like non human or other than human or non human beings non human persons but all of those are about a lack rate if you put non in front of human. You're already implying that there's something thing missing which is not actually the way that I understand you know wail to be. It's not a not person. It's a different kind of person and English is just. I really clunky with that concept for all over the amazing words that we have in this incredibly rich crazy language That that concept me is one that does not have a good noun Or set of nouns and I I often just ended up writing around it and sort of trying to describe Wales in a way that hopefully endowed them with some sense of personhood or Walrus or Arctic foxes. Because the the actual concept isn't really there in in a clear form you can use the word soul maybe but that also comes with such baggage about salvation and it you know. It's has a complicated intersection section with religious trajectories that I don't also want to necessarily get into So I would say that as a place where I was frustrated in this book and and being frustrated for many to come I recently watched talk where you also talked about your eternal disappointment at not being able to talk to Wales directly. How is you discussed? How all of us of course except for the plants among US perhaps in some MHM cases are dependent on to be alive to consume something else and to be dependent on the death of something else and that even if you're a Vegan in Iowa or something where you grew up that still still through the impact of climate change and and other industrial processes? You're having an impact on the lives of preachers like these bowhead. Whales and I'm curious how has Brinda experiencing climate change today. Yeah this is a question that comes up a lot. I think because the Arctic in the last couple of years and maybe just in the last eighteen months has has really emerged in the the news and kind of public discourse around climate change and for good reason because it's a place that's experiencing warming at about twice the rate of temperate places so it's frequently two degrees Celsius above average warmer And in some places more than that depending on the year in the season and the results of this are really quite astounding There are places that I I visited when I was up in the Arctic Arctic. Twenty years ago. You know lakes that I would go mush. My dog team across that don't exist anymore. Because the permafrost geology beneath them has changed and they've drained and now they're filled with willows and other kinds of growth and the growth is more intense because the summers are warmer And so places that you know I just assumed would always be there right because lakes usually are around for longer than a person is have ceased to be And that's just sort of one small example if the kinds of shifts that are really very visible in present If you're in communities that are close to the ocean and therefore have a long relationship with the sea ice The profile the profile of the sea ice win it forms and how deep it is and How long it's present has changed really radically You know it's changed from a place where the season is eight or nine months to a place where the dependable. Ci Season for some communities is more like three or four. Because it's thinner it comes a lot later and it leaves a lot earlier and of course has all sorts of impacts on those communities that has impact on the animal communities that depend on the ice so I would say in someplace implant in some ways. Brinda is a place that you can look to and imagine a set of changes that I think we just as temperate dwelling people all started to see happen in two thousand eighteen and twenty nineteen That you can have really massive rapid Kind of changes to landscapes and how they behave and interact with human societies pretty rapidly. Some nations have responded to to climate change and the ecological ecological catastrophes that were potentially going to face a species by extending the concept of rights and person to the natural entities that were trying to to protect. And I'm curious in light of what you were talking about with regard to the differences in language and the kind of concepts that might not be available to us by virtue of of English in the baggage that it's absorbed. Did you encounter styles of thinking about the natural world by the indigenous communities that bear any resemblance to what we might think of in the European tradition as writes. This is a really good question. And I'm I'm in the very early days of thinking about this so I I actually don't have an answer and part of the reason that I'm spending my second book project thinking through this because I find it both intriguing and a thing that I am somewhat skeptical of the kind of turn to giving a body of water or river system the rights of a person so that you can take someone to court for are damaging Lake Erie for example because on the one hand it seems like perhaps this is a really kind of radical way to break open a system that has been completely anthropocentric centric for its entire existence in the kind of Western Law Canon or at least most of its existence. There are some really interesting cases of bears being taken to court in France. And you know they're they're places in the kind of pre French revolutionary past and in other kind of early enlightenment and Pre Enlightenment in places in Europe where animals did actually participate in the legal system in ways. That are kind of interesting And I need to do more research about to speak anymore on them than that But but I think in the kind of nineteenth and twentieth century the way in which rights have been practiced is as a thing that people possess and can be taken from or granted to depending on your national national status. The the passport you hold depending on your position in society and those sorts of things.

Wales Bering Strait Arctic Soviet Union United States Indigenous People Brinda Arctic Ocean Brinda Greenpeace New England Bethsheba Demuth Yale University Atlantic Brinda the Arctic INUPIAT Yupik Russian Federation Brown University Arctic Bering Strait Greenpeace
1982. It Was An Awesome Year. | AM Show

The Michael Berry Show

1:50:06 hr | 4 months ago

1982. It Was An Awesome Year. | AM Show

"Right now command the season at hirszon's kia if you're looking for a new kia persons. Zero percent financing and leases starting at one thousand nine per month. Check them out at hirszon's kia dot com. Did that time mocking load. Michael very show is on the air on this day. In nineteen thirty seven failed texas waylon jennings down the mississippi through known to have a vehicle. Don't do with. I had breast ninety river. Have to live your stand. Do close ball. No mess around. Lamb burn old down and the man of steel chance this morning and he said well we were bemoaning the fact that the everything has to be either the greatest thing ever or the worst thing ever part of that is the social media. Craze in people lacking any sophistication or subtlety. Everything has to just be one or the other when that's not really realistic. And we were talking about the fact that if my printer law give it another way jay's my printer went wrong on needed my printer to be able to make this point home towns in texas. I said going home where you can to the babies and the rooms of san antonio. This was user error. Sorry this was user error. I got it fixed here. We don't matter who's coming the printer so we were saying. Can you imagine if every song or band had either be the greatest thing ever or the worst thing ever. so i was talking about the year. We went through each of the each of the songs for that year. So i decided it would be useful activity sort of academic exercise. Ramon would if no not exercise. We're not exercise. Don't worry i didn't mean that. I meant like it'd be we would have to think about it. We'd had to think about it if we took a year and we went through the songs of that year. That don't mean anything and every song had to either be awesome or that's the only standard because that requires a lot of discipline because there are a lot of songs you go. Well i mean you know but you would have to defend that song as being awesome when you religious think. Well it's okay or as being awful when it's not really awful is just not good. But that's the requirement ramon so we landed on the year nineteen eighty to eighty. What do you think that's not curious. What are you eating. Who brought you that. Who brought you that no. That's you didn't get that downstairs so ramone. I'm just going to pick a couple of random songs from the year and you just nineteen eighty two and you decide if it is. All full are all. Som- i'm going to do a legend here off to the side. F will be f equals all full w. equals all some. The year is nineteen eighty to occur. So we're halfway. Through ronald reagan's term. Who wins the world series. That year was at the cardinals. I think it was the the no one royals at think. Yeah they beat the royals. That's right i think. Eighty to the cardinals hundred eighty two or eighty three. I'm not sure. can you tell what it is. The cardinals that was a great was a great team. Fantastic team they had ozzie. they had They had willie mcgee. I know they had lonnie smith. I think they had Who would they have had see. I get the. I get the reds and the cardinals of that year confused. Okay ramon. i'm going to start at one hundred out. Just pick a few at random. You give me awful are all some. Are you ready. Stevie nicks edge of seventeen. You don't believe that you don't believe it's no i won't be mad at you. You think gets awful. That's the reason. So you're gonna go awful on stevie nicks well. No i mean. Do what you need to do. Of course she was high on coat. All right number ninety. Nine kenny rogers. Yes yes. Nineteen eighty-two starting off will ninety eight christopher cross arthur's theme yes that would be awesome correct again. Ninety seven going down by greg gigiri give us a little taste of that. So we case people can't remember some people can't remember. I'm going to give you ninety six while we're doing that. Lover boys working for the weekend. That would have three awesome. Yes good call four out of five of the worst songs of the not top one hundred. I mean of the not. Top top of nineteen eighty-two are already awesome or at least not awful. You got gregory's going down. Have the faint sound of the eye of the tiger in back of my head which was number two for that year by the way what it was number two. Two's going to end up irritating. But we'll say that. Because i don't want to ruin on the show you got greg. Injuries going down. Which was the ninety seventh top song of the year. How does this beat arthur. Steam could've come at the end. The end didn't have its full run. I don't even remember this onto you. You're gonna make awful. The michael berry show The number forty eight on the billboard year in hot one hundred singles of nine eighty two ramone by the way somebody posted instead of having just awful and awesome. You should have not awful. That's the whole point. You have to pick. That is the point of our politics today. Everything can't be wonderful are terrible. Some things actually have some middle ground and we're proving the point using music. This little tune called young turks by rod stewart. Ramon is this awful are awesome thank you what was also W was for awesome hon. Who made dinner for the navajo. Code talkers the only one figure out our system. You never you never know ramona. Far show is being intercepted like an swallow pass. You have to have codes. You have to have things ready for. Okay where were we were we. Did you ever get greg galleries going down. Yeah did you give that awful lot of four out of five awesome. So far last one hundred of the year all right number ninety five stevie wonder's do i do what you got ramon all. Wow okay okay. Number ninety four the rolling stones waiting on a friend. What's awesome about it. play it you. Don't you don't have to say that. A rolling stone song awful. Okay tell me one. This steel wheels tour. Whatever the lose one with the the tongue hanging out which was tourism. What it is europe. They went on tour in eighty two. This album's the tourist supported this album. There was a parody. Made of this from shirley q liquor did a parody of this to get. I just realized. That's what this is all dawn. Oh my goodness. I never realized what to seize getting out of prison. Turn it up and you're gonna it's gonna blow your mind. Okay now listen to. This is shirley q liquor live from the prison yard. I've been here. i'll spoke to get here for clack. I'm standing at these. Prison gates both the to the out today to me. She just not some The yen may see is also acted. Free is the heart bidding a third and third day aga- they eat at the judge had found her extra guilty the heart the she could still always be math. And everybody need a friend by you when you get out of. They gain weight off the man. She loves comb out. Lincoln so lewd drive to the nearest phone. Get new parts degree in it. Thanks for my free. I love watching. The should stick with me. She'd say making license plates with hard but not as hard as working at burger. I know that's right. See looking pretty good little rain. Come on are you. I'm just glad that you with my bad need a friend. Come on coal co. kkob outlive. That'd be good for malaitans lifting about a slim. Gm bless your heart. I have listened to that bit for fifteen years and did not know that that was a take off on waiting on a friend so waiting on a friend by the stones is awesome are awful also all right. What's forever four michael murphy. What you're gonna give that on awful. I needed come on either ruling dude. You can't just sit there was you. Don't know it if you don't know why are you gonna give it an awful okay number ninety two from the little river band. I think their australia man on your mind. You can give out an awful by kids in america. Kim wilde you gotta give an awful komo man known. It's you continous. what are you giving the unit. Also it sounds like something debbie gibson with saying. You don't want to give that an awesome ever all right number nine. It sounds like mall mall zones number ninety hot in the city by billy idol. You given an awful okay good now. You're finally showing that you're a cynic critic. What about number eighty nine. I do it. The pointer sisters awful. Oh number. eight. Man halen's oh pretty woman here. Yeah let's hear what do you mean. Yeah yeah you gotta get the guitar solo before that. Yeah you go with some okay. Look w there. I wouldn't want a lot of people covering that song but van halen. What year does david. David lee roth leave. Thought i was closer to eighty eight. But you might be right all right medication go-goes you can go with awesome on that. Okay that's all right you in touch with your mirror mirror diana ross nineteen eighty-two all foale okay as berry gordy baby mama but all right how about cooling the gangs. You can have it if you want it all full. Wow stomach team wong. Some team must be right. You're listening to michael berry Number thirty two in nineteen eighty two. The alan parsons project ramone. How do you rate that sir. All soon poor sets w you can print this out by the way. I've posted it to our facebook page in our twitter page and play along. If you want to score before we get to the song were at song. Number eighty four the choices are all full are also some you should be required to cast your vote before we cast our vote in. You should be required to pass it around the office and live with the consequences. Remember is for all w is awesome. If you don't score the correctly than your ballot is invalidated. Yes no hanging chads. No hanging chads. Butterfly ballot number eighty four. Ramon make a move on me by livia newton. John was that awesome. Let's hear it. I'm sorry i thought you'd be prepared because you had to know. That was the next song up. You got the list. Well i'd like to skip it. I don't know why that got awesome. I'm put an asterisk in case you wanna come back later. Please play this. Because it's great number eighty three but number one in your heart any day. Now ronnie mill sal up now i said any day. Now what is wrong with you. Give us any day now. Running nelson also go ahead on any day now. I will hear you say good goodbye. You be on new. Where are you been voting. Suppress a stand up for joyce's my next door neighbor keith. Mccullough who's like a big brother to me and my brother. He was from johnston bayou louisiana real good basketball player pistol. Pete marriage was his hero in line. And we would we would. If we didn't have anything going on my parents would let us hop in his. What was the chevy version of the bronco. Chevy he had the one that was black and silver with the red stripe down. What was that. it's honest silverado frame. Bronco was the ford blazer. Yes and we'd hop in that chevy blazer and we'd stop at mcdonald's. I didn't know any better back then. And we stop at mcdonald's and he loved to eat and he would he would buy us like a couple big macs. Large fries shake. He's getting his energy ready for the big game and he had a millsaps greatest hits cassette and we wore that thing out all right. I'm gonna assume you got the good sense. to know. runny. Millsap is awesome. Yeah next one. Get down on cooling. The game awesome on that. Then michael mcdonald. I keep forgetting the gang. They don't get the credit they deserve. They get marginalized because they put them in commercials. That's why down. Let me tell you something. They sold some malt liquor back day. Rose malt liquor commercials. I guarantee you. They sold malt liquor. Oh i forgot that. Yeah would you go with my coming down. You're going to give awesome you. Give everybody else really defeats the purpose but air supply here. I am you think this is awesome. You said that That's awesome on ramone's list in with those see that to me. That's all full. Give it awesome because your list not mine. How about every little thing. She does is magic. So if you're gonna make that awesome you drag it down by air supply being awesome. Because you can't say something's awful. Oh you gotta have. This is awesome. Crimson and clover give me some crimson and clover. That's good right there. That's a good song right there. You hear that woman call in a day say joan jett was a lesbian. Did you know that. I had no idea. Can i get crimson and clover and move on to police from. Oh maybe my mic is not not working here any little crimson and clover in my life. We move onto the next. And while you're doing that neil diamond's yesterday's songs ramon what you got you go all full awesome all full because you hate jewish people. Okay elton john's empty garden. Hey hey johnny. Oh wow off okay. I'm impressed with you. How about laura branagan's gloria you going all full now. A whole new. This is all saw. I'll scape everybody on the floor. I'm gonna ask christie daily on a couple skate with me. I can't skate backwards. So we'll just hold hands and skateboard act. Like that's how i wanted to do anyway. Oh yeah this. Takes me back to brown's roller rink right here. All right what about coming in and out of your life by barbra streisand. I'm assuming that we can mark that as an awful. Because she's awful. Oh don't stop believing journey. Gotta give them an awesome. Oh yeah that stadium rocket. it's best right there. How about Kenny rogers love turn you around. That's not awful off right now. Command the season persons. Kia if you're looking for a new kia. Persons has zero percent financing and leases starting at one twenty nine per month check them out at hirszon's kia dot com fall savings and sale is happening now. Mattress warehouse save up to one thousand dollars. Plus get zero percent interest financing for sixty months unsure of which mattress is right for you lose. People are put mattress. Warehouse is home to bed match the diagnostic system. That recommends the best mattresses for your individual support needs. Try it for yourself today and the mattress warehouse one year. Price guarantee means you know you're getting the best price wise shop anywhere else. Visit sleep happens dot com for a location near you. Some awesome talk. Okay thanks hall and oates. I can't go for that coming in at number fifteen in nineteen eighty two. Ramon could i should. I assume that's an all some good all right at number seventy one in nineteen eighty to remember if you're late to the show every song must be adjudged awesome are all. There is no middle ground. Third rail no well. I'm not sure you have to be able to defend one or the other on the scale. It's like our politics number seventy one. It's gonna take a miracle denise williams you don't even remember it you do all right. That's f for all full number. Seventy now be bold. Ramon take it away by paul mccartney. Thank you awful. Terrible number sixty nine. Oh no by the commodores. Why you knew that awful. It's not awful. Okay okay. now that's not being both all right this next one. He's got a play for y'all because this is one of the greatest songs one thousand nine hundred right here. Yesterday come on. Jackson browne up. He's got to be so stand back sale out. If you know what movie the song was featured in it out loud if you know it don't never look at it dug out the same again food. Yes we'll go ahead and mark that down as a job blais awesome. That's spanish shimon. Double also all right number sixty seven so far away a flock of seagulls coming in at ramon. You didn't do iran instead of iraq. You're going to give that an awesome all right. What about it number sixty six hall and oates did it in a minute awful. I will agree with your choice there. What about number sixty five. You can do magic i america. That's not a helpful. How can be awful. America's great. try it out. I don't think you heard it in a while. This is before you were born. You don't know this song to see. Let's leave this. Put this to a public vote. Yes very ninety. Eight eighty two. You see a set of out good be assault. Coudn't it's got a good core. Soho gotta hang tight patience nineteen ninety-two you didn't have a cell phone so you had you wait around and to get to it so fast yoga what you say which is still awful you. That song was more worthy of awful than anything else so far. Wow okay all right. What about you could have been with me sheena. Easton you don't remember it so it's be awful. What about our lips are sealed. The go-goes giving them awesome. Diddy bop music right here. Just sounds like bette midler to me. I mean not bette midler Who that little girl with the shaved hand just a little bit an cindy lauper. This feels like cindy law persona me all right number. Sixty two blue eyes elton john. Wow you're going awful on elton. John quincy jones featuring james ingram at number sixty one james ingram ltd. I think he was one hundred ways. No you're going awful on quincy jones and james ingram. I don't think you've given a black artists a good review yet. Ramon just saying. Actually there's hardly been does not lie. You gave cool and the gang. Awful you diana ross. Awful pointer sisters awful. You gave stevie wonder awful. I was just looking at your list. Send her roles in. I'm just. I'm not saying throw in a black person. That list is the list. I'm just saying ever saw when there's a black person fifty throw him a bone all right. Listen to the voice. James being okay. No i'm thinking jeffrey osborne. When would would wou was james ingram. He was in a ban. Do smooth just so you have a defense in case you see. That's make that us know you're taking his way too seriously. If oh you gave get down on it ago. Okay you got. You got one in that. Yeah i i personally carla bon off. You're going to give that awful. Love is in control finger. On the trigger donna summer. You know she'd be nasty. Think i'm in love eddie. Money wasted on the way. Crosby stills and nash you giving them an awful you give it one two three four you give and six offals in a row in the go-goes before that got a awesome. We are all the way up to number fifty six on the nineteen eighty-two awful or awesome scale that time time lord phil michael berry show is on air if you just tuned in. I was having a conversation with a friend of mine by phone. this morning. As drove in and the conversation revolved around the fact that there is no middle ground anymore. Everything has to be the greatest thing ever or the worst thing ever in that. It's just too much it's too much. You have to find myself turning away from it. I watched a video this morning. Ramon of a newborn walrus and the momma walrus was licking down the little baby walrus baby walruses born with a full blown set of whiskers. That doesn't come in you. Stop nodding your head. How would you know the core. You don't know the office with their mustache. You don't know that babies are not born with their hair anyway. yes they It turns out that the born with his full that he can opened his eyes yet but his mama's loving all over him and it just beat the hell out of anything in politics. So we were saying. Can you imagine if you had to decide as we do in politics today that everything was either the best thing ever or the worst thing ever so. We decided to pick a year a good year. May i say nineteen and eighty two. We chose nineteen eighty two as our year and we decided that you have to tell for a ramone has to tell for every song where it is awful or all some. There is no middle ground. Third rail no independent party. You have to choose one or the other and be able to defend it okay. We are at song number. Fifty six by the royal philharmonic. Orchestra hooked on classics. Ramon give us a little taste. Give us law. Then you got the list. I don't know what is her to do. Do do do to to to to know you don't have it. What are you voting. What are you giving it all fuller all some him my website. My google's broke and my bank ain't even working. I don't know what's happened. Dr internet so i can't help you. What do you do. royal philharmonic orchestra hooked all. Because you don't know our number fifty five fifty five big number but a hannah's hals alabama's love and the first degree which you got. Ramon you give an awful to love in the first degree play. She didn't even want to be a mess. Good tunes asian advanced free. Oh what you did awful for love. And i agree. Those students diana ross. Why do fools the right now. Command the season at hirszon's kia if you're looking for a new kia persons has zero percent financing and leases starting at one twenty nine per month. Check them out at hearses. Kia dot com. What is a fisher house. If i had a chance to talk to the fisher family. I would start crying. Because i can't articulate how much it meant to us fisher. House is to comfort home for military and veteran families staying at no charge allowing the family to be together to support their loved one during medicine. Prices it's enough to help you thrive through these hard situation. Go to fisherhouse dot org for more info and how you might help. That's fisherhouse dot org. Remain give it off. We get off fifty. Three one of the vans ants. Thirty eight special caught up in you get let that play. People love song. Yeah hold on. Don't don't do this do better than dan. And it's all inputs. Little girl in the middle of song should get extra consideration all right. What'd you give what you give caught up in you awful okay. Cool night by. Paul davis awful. Do you believe in love you lewis and the news and you don't have to play it to the side. All keep the fire burning. Reo speedwagon good awful freeze frame j. gals ban. This is nineteen eighty-two right here at home s on where you buddies trying to tell you a story while they're eating She's out of a can nachos like star dude. I gotta go skate. I'll be back gotta skate on this. The high-speed hokey pokey right here. Yes that would definitely get an awesome all right. You gave young. Turks awesome by rod stewart at forty eight juice. Newton's laws been a little bit hard on me at forty seven. What are you given. That we don't give that up f- making love. Roberta flack would you like to make level. Roberta flack are. You gave that up an f. What about trouble by lindsey buckingham poor fella got kicked out of the bed by stevie. What would you give him no. I don't know that i do know that. So not right off the top of my head. Let's see what you forgot. It had to be hard for him after that was number. Forty five good grief. What an awful year then number forty four private eyes hall and oates which you're going give them you're gonna give them an awesome. What about stevie wonder forty-three would that girl would you know awful. We'll buy pacman fever. Buckner and garcia. You don't remember the players. You can't do that own. Districts designed guests paklin. I remember this song coming out. I remember the evening news. Kfi am beaumont channel six said. There's a new song. Out about the hottest rage in arcades and then they played this song and i remember thinking. Gosh that's cool. And i probably haven't heard it since then i'd forgotten how awful that's terrible. We'll take it easy on me. Little river band. Would you got for them. No awful what about last one for this segment. Heat of the moment asia. You give them an awful. Wow you give a lot of fs on this page michael berry show great tune. Now i'm not even letting you vote on mercer. I neither number nine in nineteen eighty. Two w written the year is nineteen eighty two. You must choose out of the billboard top one hundred songs whether the song is awesome. Awful you must choose in one thousand nine hundred eighty two ramon. The inflation rate was six point one six percent the year end dow jones industrial average closed at ten forty six one thousand forty six interest rate year in fed eleven point five percent. Sh- average cost of a new house. Eighty two to average income. Twenty-one thousand and fifty dollars. us dollars average monthly rent. Three hundred twenty dollars cost of a gallon of gas was ninety one cents a new car. Average price was seven thousand nine hundred eighty three dollars a us. Postage stamp cost twenty sense. Tomatoes cost thirty nine cents a pound. Big bag of cheese puffs eighty nine cents. A loaf of white sliced bread bitty sent a commodore vic twenty two hundred ninety nine dollars. Ninety five cents. Get you three hundred. But you don't know. Satellite receiver was to was two forty five dollars and ninety five cents. A walking jogging machine was one hundred ninety nine dollars and ninety five cents a gmc. Fifteen hundred pickup was five thousand. Four hundred dollars a sony. Nineteen inch color. Tv was four hundred ninety nine dollars an outdoor gas grill with one ninety nine ninety There was a wave of terror attacks. in france. Nine hundred eighty two by carlos the jackal argentina invaded the falklands. Are the maldives. Been in on how you want to call it. Israeli forces invaded lebanon. Israel return sinai to egypt. The largest cash robbery in history occurred in new york when nine million eight hundred thousand dollars was stolen from an armored car. At and t. Was ordered to break up. Nineteen eighty two also wanted to the first issue of usa. Today was published disney's futuristic park epcot experimental community of tomorrow opens in nineteen into the. Ira continued its bombing campaign in london and mainland britain laker airways folded The international whaling commission decided to end wailing. That was the year that tylenol capsules laced with potassium cyanide killed seven in chicago ramon liquid. Lhasa was released after eleven months in jail. Yasser arafat was elected the president of the palestinian national council. The veterans absurd. The vietnam veterans memorial in washington. Dc was dedicated in nineteen eighty two. Okay ramone we're at song number thirty nine sixty five. Love affair by paul davis. Is that awesome awful awful. I've never been to me by charlene. Charlene tilton is charlene. What you got. Even the nights are better by air supply. That's not also. It's your stupid list. Whatever leather and lace stevie nicks and don henley dot is awesome. Not leaving that to you as you know. They did it right after the last week. You know they did Wait till he comes Dying to get in bush pay at this point the second chorus you you sleep. E man Some sometimes go. That's on this album hearn. Tom petty wow. What's the name of the album. Bella donna well what else is on edges seventeen which you didn't like She did both of those duets on this one album. Wow she was a had. One lindsey buckingham was doing trouble which we didn't even remember all right. That's awesome thirty-five of the band. Dan fogelberg you got that as all full open arms by journey. You got to do that as awesome. Let's groove by earth wind and fire the elements gotta do. That is awesome. I in this guy. We already said alan parsons project. Awesome hold me fleetwood mac. Did you decide if it's awful. It's awful who can it be now minute work. You gotta make that awesome. Thank you only lonely by the motels. Play a little bit of it. That's that's a good song. I mean. I don't it's it's a tough call. That's all it's right. There in the middle sure does so nine right now. Command the season at hirszon's kia if you're looking for a new kia persons has zero financing and leases starting at one twenty nine per month. Check them out at kia dot com. What is a fisher house. If i had a chance to talk to the fisher family. I would start crying. Because i can't articulate how much it meant to us. House is to comfort. Home for military veteran families saying don't charge allowing the family to be together to support their loved one during medicine prices. It's enough to help. You thrive through these hard situation. Go to fisherhouse dot org for more info and how you might help. That's fisherhouse dot org to lease. You got awful on. That aren't then we are at number twenty eight sweet dreams by air supply. You'd rather have been any lenny's turn your love around george benson awful awful The other woman. Ray parker junior awful. We got the beat by the go. Go's you gotta think for the go. Go's you're going awesome on the go. Go's are not gonna be mad at you. Let it whip by the das- band you got them as awful that number twenty three shake it up the cars. I'm surprised i would have thought you'd say awesome on that all bull if you're playing at home put an f. down there all full way to the next song we gotta willie nelson has. Its you even nikki. Been told you they're going from one gig to the next in their tour van recorded himself singing all right back to it. The area's nineteen eighty eighty-two ramon and earthquake at l. shown in southern mexico kills thousands. The first cd player was sold in japan. The weather channel airs on cable. Tv for the first time in nineteen ninety two and they were mostly wrong. Twenty million elm trees die in the uk through dutch elm disease the first commercial use of genetic engineering launched when human insulin produced by bacteria is marketed. Time's man of the year in nineteen eighty to the computer a popular items in women's fashion the jumpsuit striped mag and belt orchid jewelry. The braided belt the shoulder clutch. The ankle boot which looks to be a predecessor to the ugh ramon and the bow. Pump the quilted boot. That's not a to these string ties slip on. The boat shoot was popular in men's fashion for the year. The odyssey video game system was about forty nine ninety nine. The tape recorder by fisher price was forty four ninety nine. The tommy tron game was forty nine ninety nine. The houseboat was thirteen ninety. Four pinball eight ninety nine au these were these were hand held. Yeah the rag. Doll was four. Ninety nine by by diapers was sixteen. Ninety nine free freeware was i used by andrew and jim knopf to distribute their application which allowed programs to be copied in nineteen eighty-four the distribution of this type of software changed from being freeware to shareware michael jackson releases. His second adult solo album thriller. Graceland opens to the public a popular films of eighty-two et rocky. Three on golden pond porkies officer and a gentleman goodyear for film best little whorehouse in texas star trek to the wrath of khan poltergeist anne chariots of fire and the epic gandhi tv programs of eighty two magnum. Pi the other are in the uk. Dynasty falcon falcon crest hill street blues and knight rider. A good year there all right so number. Twenty two in nineteen eighty two on the year in hot one hundred singles willie. Nelson's always oma. I'm gonna assume that it'd be awesome on your list. Romo number twenty one juice newton. The sweetest thing i've ever known do don't say no. That was one of our wedding song. Say yes as awesome song. I like juice new. You no not me and juice. Newton eighty yet. Just turn it out. So then why i read your own all laughter. Sin pick version down awesome. Thank you yes yes yeah. There's a good version. You ask number twenty. Don't talk to strangers rick springfield. You're going to do that as awful waiting for a girl like you foreigner. Well wait a minute. It wasn't going to be off. I know it's aren't as he goes. All pitched is pretty good. It's pretty good. You going up on that all right. You should hear how she talks about you. Melissa manchester on that all right this next one you gotta have you got to have is awesome. Because i love it birdie higgins key largo this video. Imagine myself that long hair. He got old black wrapped around each black hair down to his shoulder smokeless cigarettes. I can envision myself for school into two bogie in this one too many buttons on but which maybe is gold nugget necklace. Falling to the attune. Right here was you. He is might be the greatest. All time underrated song. He missing just slightly That's good all right coming in at number sixteen by tommy tone. Eight six seven five three zero nine. Genie would you with this awful dude. I'm gonna ask you to reconsider during the break. That's one of the most memorable songs you here is. How go dry hands. She's got bad day. The sass surname hard to send pure as newly small. She's got bette davis. You want to come back. The song taylor swift can't new the sony. She needs to smoke three packs a day for ten years and comeback taught to me. She's not raspy enough on this version. Who's this should be able to do have harlow go lip sweets. Pratt kim karstadt topmasts and choose a one nine hundred operator. I don't wanna hear him. think twice jarvis. New york's now she got mad. Eighty one hundred eighty one. It was number one and all right. Can we get another ruling on tommy to tones. Eight six seven five three nine all full. Make this awesome. This play it real quick. Let's make this one also come on saguntum. Come on come on. Come on come on play. See you already have happy. Hey kinda got a garage band field too. Earn see really good right now you from them and by bad bay good. That's part of the era man. All right so we went on that. I can't go for that. Got an awesome rosanna by toto. Which rosanna but you know you. You gotta decide. No you're not doing not genton so you got an awful on this all right next martin. Heart quarter flash. you're going off on that chariots of fire insurance going awesome. Okay good call tainted love soft sale gotta do that is hard to say. I'm sorry about chicago. please do awful on that. You do an awesome on that. That's a stupid song abracadabra. We agreed was awesome heart. So good john cougar. You doing awful. Wow okay what. About jack and diane. You jackson is awful. An app emphasized jack nyein my god. What if this ends up in a time capsule and somebody thinks i thought jackson was awful on your being weird. Jacket diana's awesome. I can't believe you it doesn't help this. No doesn't know it doesn't. You're stupid serious right now. It's number thanks. Please turn that down number six being weird. I do not need you crooning to me number six. Don't you want me the human league. I'm gonna give out an awful also good cau- j. gals pan. Dirt centerfold is nineteen eighty two. Thank you. yes gimme that one. Three sol's left out that we gotta get yeah. This is good here. We go here. We go here. We go man. Asked these honestly. This is hundred. Eighty two song even more than i attack matt number four so centerfold gets an awesome number four ebony and avary an awful. Wow wow me oh. The paul mccartney part is awesome but not the stevie wonder part. Okay epic collaboration but okay number. Three joan jett and the blackhawks. I love rock and roll. Which you're gonna do you give them an awful own ninety pissed off the blacks and the lesbians n. Black lesbian all right number. Two eye of the tiger survivor. Why would you do awful as craig. Levarty said awful. He's stupid credibility. Said awful for survive for. I have the tiger. Do this is rocky. This is america. Okay yeah thank you. Very good argument. Yeah all right then. Physical olivia newton. John you would give that an awesome. How why would you give that offs. Oh my god you really not joking. She's coming back to stanford center. She canceled because she had the cancer. It wasn't like she got drawn. She's coming she's going to make good on that. They offered to have her in studio to put some blinds. Put your shirt back on the blinds. Olivia in the same. The same time. She's back seventy now but he was still known. I'm gonna ask her to dress. Nineteen eighty to do a flash dance for me. It's not creepy. A real real nasty thing for old old woman if a woman is more than twenty years older than you. You say things like that without being creepy. That time times i mocking load full. Michael berry. show is on the air. Five then. used to be alone on c. k. The dodd side of me Did you know that lennox my become the live at the to show this. If you are a massive corey hard fan you know everything. There is to know about corey. Hart call the show. I have a question for you. Not like yukon alike him but you know everything about corey. Hart what do you mean cast in a small net. You don't know remote. Don't judge other people so harshly. Don't be so quick to judge. Be like me full of grace. Several one three two one two five eight seven four. That's forgiveness there's a difference seven one three two one two five eight seven four. somebody out. there knows everything. There is to know about corey. Hart and i want to ask you a question. All right you said it was tween. There were two songs that were the. Did i ask you the biggest or your favorite your favorite for the summer after you graduate biggest okay. The biggest for the summer you graduated high school. So you're out of school kind of that. What are you doing this summer. After you graduate you started drop off. Cbs album community college. Doing what do you mean the second song i. She said there were two songs that were competing kiss from a rose seal mushrooms corey hart van online check. Line two three. Let's go to guy who knows everything about corey. Hart somebody knows a little about four yard. Corey hart anyone. Somewhat interested in corey. Hart anyone who just awesome okay. Anyone who's heard the name. Corey hart caller. You're on the Tara against corey hart is aware of corey. Hart is word. Heart has a cousin named corey dean. I know what this is is my. I had it bad chili truth. This still do she still fine. she's still fine. Didn't she get usher. She'd know the one that was lisa left eye. Lopez that was andrei rosins house houses. She earned out to it was tebas. Chilly and lisa left eye lopez. She's one died under us. I believe oh. We got a corey. Hart man brian you win. Yes sir. I wear my sunglasses at night all right well. Here's my question for you. Are you a big corey. Hart fan no. I'm not oh well you're the only one that called in so you'll do hold on. Hold on we got. We got somebody else. We might have another choreography. Caller yes sir. What's your name. gm tim him. Yes tim is a two syllable words like that. Are you corey hartman. My neighbor's name is cory. Nobody like are you serious. Fellow state. yeah do you know anything about corey. hart's music knows. Well that's all right. What is your day was your neighbor do for living as welder a welder. Nice enough guy. Yeah he's good that if somebody on the street was too need to borrow sugar would he be borrowing from you or would you be borrowing from him would be ball. When has he ever borrowed anything. All elite eater. Did he bring it back. Eightieth eighty split new line. Well i was gonna ask because that's that's kind of what kind of we did you have. So yes kind leader. Do you have kind of work. That i've got a steel steel. I choose echo minute steel. That's nice yes. How many times does he borrowed it all. He just bawled at one time. And i guess he went out and bought. He never came back bog one anymore. So you know but but we're pretty. Good little tyke nick. I live in bader where. I live off east railroad owais ninety and railroad. It xy date sixty. Well think i know about where you are were. The railroad tracks are right in front of my house. Got home and you know acre. Elaine de beaumont. No sir not working. You remember the hush puppy yes. I went to high school with a guy that owned the hush puppy. Yeah it. I think it's still he madison long. But yeah they're on one five. Yeah what's your name again walmart. Okay hold on him. Wait right there. Bryan yes sir. All right so. I got a question for you on corey hart okay. He gave three different reasons. He worries sunglasses at night. Okay do you remember. Oh man so. I can't so can No sir. i don't worry man. I'll be curious to know how many people could call up and give me the three different reasons that he his sunglasses at night. He spells them out three. You know what are you know. I'm all what went in. That's one okay. Turn it down and turn them and don't cheat several one three two one two five eight seven four. Don't cheat everybody could look it up. I wanna know who knows the three reasons. He wore his sunglasses at night. He gives three different reasons number two. Let's see if you can get the third right now. Command the season at hirszon's kia if you're looking for a new kia. Persons has zero percent financing. And lisa's starting at one twenty nine per month. Check them out at hirszon's kia dot com. What is fisher house. If i chance to talk to the fisher family. I would start crying. Because i can't articulate how much it meant to us. house is to comfort. Home burnell terry and veteran families saying no charge allowing the family to be together to support their loved one during medicine prices enough to help. You thrive through these hard situation to fisherhouse dot org for more info and how you might help. That's fisherhouse dot org. Thank on the michael berry. Show continues I'm working on a date. This is metal archie. By the way you gotta list actually covers. Give give the people a touch you. You're gonna love them. You gonna absolutely love them. Medals mariachi band. What's not to love tab. S do Hanging more alive searching for nuking tunein threads off the brass and the acoustic perfect. They did eighteen in line. No i'm just another hard in need over. should do eighteen. What else you got more breath. Last us all runs. The hills exceed their four reasons. He works one last night by the way sandy pointed out. I missed one. Human ohio vigor. To cure harry. Changelings are going and got these ones working. Don different instruments playing those same sounds is what makes it fantastic a hot for teacher and then we'll go to our caller go ahead evening another day guerrillas. German wait to get get my education. A are you guys coming through the mic meeting after school. Helium man i'm there there's gonna. Vr writer. I got detention again. Aim is it third time. This tuesday's buddies with my favorite cougar. Men both side. I think she had a mendonca man. But she's bringing riders detention the law writers in the no talking about. Gt's that ride in no took man. It's one part cheech and chong one part tribute band scary. Part is actually have great vocals. All vincent in tom ball. I'm michael yes this wanted to say. I'm a big fan. I'm the best Blackberry smoke kerio cariocas singer in town. Oh wow okay all right. Do you know the answer to the the four reasons. Corey hart wears his sunglasses at night. Absolutely and this will let you know that. I'm not cheating because this listen my answers and you'll see that i didn't cheat watch you read. Read see my name while you collect your claim. See the light before my eyes. And i didn't know there was a four but when you said that i went through my mind. So let's see if this that keep track of visions in my mind. Yes close enough. We'll give you credit. The four reasons are so. I can watch you leave. Then breathe your storylines. The second is so. I can keep track of the visions in is the third is so i can forget my name while you collect your claim and finally so i can see the light. That's right before my eyes. Good enough we'll give you credit because you were the only one. Halfway shared still opus on calming. Don't know me must. I've never heard anything cuter than ramones. Mom calls it can hear it back. Toss what you want me to give for. You knew what does she called appendix prince panther schuessel from pendlebury. Keep oriole cookies. What we've had dan on. We never had we had. Mom'll martha steve steve. Yeah you got through on our busy lines as sean. Thank you trying too hard. You got through on our school busy phone live a busy busy busy busy. You got through. Go ahead michael berry. I wanted to tell you about This would have been the summer of ninety nine. I was nineteen and a pretty good size group of friends and i Backup i i grew up in arizona and We decided that we were gonna go to tijuana for the weekend and So tijuana has a hard rock cafe or at least they did back then and we We went and get the hard rock. I guess after stopping at several bars along the way and At our meal and then a band came on stage. And when you were just playing that hard rock mariachi it kind of triggered my memory and this band just on stage and they started playing rage against the machine and the music was just perfectly on point and then they started singing in spanish and We we all had to do a little bit of a drunk check in and make sure that we knew where we were. Is this really happening right now. Yeah well we are going to have a meta laci to the redneck country club. Which just a matter of we're just trying to get it worked out right now as we speak where we're working on caller you're on the michael berry show. Hey michael man. I was just one. And maybe get a plug in for a new business in tombaugh. We'll let poland. Let's let's do the background check before we applaud. Okay right what kind of business food truck park. What do they serve They've got six trucks from cousins maine lobster to A couple of local trucks taco truck They've got a snow cone truck. What kind of people are they. They're really good. People actually kind of people are there Their You know like human human people try again man. My they're not like if they went into a bar and there was a football game on one in and a soccer game on the other. Which one would they be most likely to go watch. Does that give you a better idea. They wouldn't no no. There'd be football people for sure family. Yeah that's right and so. They got six different concepts. Yeah so what is. It's a They're they're the The facilitator so they serve all the drinks and by the way we're underrepresented on the hispanic front right now so that actually helps us out. Yeah football day americana man. So where are they in tombaugh. They gotta do. They have like a a food truck park. Yeah it's called a four zero three. Eat and they're right off a main street near the railroad tracks and sombo where that is. And i'm going to go by their for lunch today at a location for a second redneck country club. That looks promising. And i will be. I will be out in that area Early afternoon so i will check in on that. It's on may run off a main street sir at the tracks. Yeah a little over the railroad tracks We did all the construction on the facility and Like i said there's some good people and the official grand openings tomorrow. Actually but i think they are going to be open today. They've got all six trucks out there as we speak and it's a fan all the family works in it It's it's it's a husband and wife that owns it in and they've got They do have some family that works there and they've hired some other folks to help out. How old is the husband wife Oh man i hope he's not listening. He's probably he's probably mid fifties late fifties. Okay have you eaten at all of the concepts. not all of them but i have eaten at a at a couple of is the snow cone shaved ice or what. What's going on with that. I've actually never that but I think they are the. They're they're more shaved. Ice a really fine shaved is opposed to though you know the the sonic you know. I love a good snow cone. Stand there used to be one and orange off Lachey start boulevard. Right in in the parking lot of what used to be the gibson's when i was growing up and our know what happened but i think it went away but the other one i tell you there was a really. I'm gonna stop in on so thank you for that There was a really really good It's called new orleans. New orleans cones new orleans. No cones did. I not bring you one ramon. It was over in. The heights was lesbian couple and they had amazing snow cones but it was in an actual. It was in a standalone little house and they had more space than they needed. And that's probably what dragged down with your my guests. If they had just done a truck they probably still be in business. But there's was fantastic. Man i love this no control ours. Cigars and a few thoughts from this are very ratio. Sir how are you so far with. Dr straits most underrated band of the eighties. Oh my good roches is better. I said underrated sit down. I mean i don't know. I it making that claim. It's the first time i've made that claim out loud but i will tell you. Ramona spent time thinking about the fact that dire straits is a better band. Then they get credit for being. And i can't think of any ban for which there is a bigger distance between how good they are and the credit they get mostly because get no credit like you can have one hundred percent growth in your company if you only made a thousand dollars last year rather easily. Sorta hard for apple to do that i mean. Is there anything that comes to mind. That is a more underrated band. A band for which there is a greater distance of how good they actually are in the credit they get. You mean a tour de force of of dire straits seven one three two one two five eight seven four to tell me of a band would ready for that that fast. Start that over. Start that over seven one. Three two five eight seven four seven one three two two five eight seven four one radio seven one three two one two five eight seven four if you have a band. That is more underrated than how good. They are for the eighties. I'd like to hear what it is now started because that opening like simple Mark for would you take him Would bring it down a little dalby. Lightning round music will be dr straits two hundred four. Jeff here's an eighty s band called the call. Get almost no airplay but excellent band. I can't comment dennis. Go right box. Masters billy bob thornton. Billy bob thornton. The fox masters as long as he's been acton he's been playing i'm gonna dare say that if he wasn't billy bob thornton you wouldn't say that Maybe i confused some of you. I didn't say Find the band that no one has heard of. It's actually kind of halfway good and call into the show with them. That's not this segment. We'll do that another day. Tom go yeah. I might have. I met a jump the gun a little bit but I thought rhythm section was a pretty good band that never got their their do. I will agree. I mean i. Don't i think there yeah. They're not as underrated as dire straits. But i will agree with you. Yes with that brian. Go the hooters again. I don't know any of these bands mike. i know. Atlanta rhythm might go in excess. Because they're not underrated might go. Bob go electric light orchestra. Jeff land von awesome users That might outdo dr straits. Yeah i think of them morris seventies but yeah karen go. I was gonna say the car. And i think the cars get about as much credit as they deserve. Ben go cars Same brian go here primarily you know. We had the chance to book to pure prairie league. We do often. They travel through and they're not that much. But i'm i don't know how big a a following they have. It's funny you say that. Because i've what will happen in a situation like that is i'll go back and i'll listen to everything they have. And now that they're probab- they should sell more tickets than they cost but generally the cost is related to how well aban ban will sell not always at the rc. but I don't have an answer for you on that but interesting troy go cold michael. The who owe the cult say they get about as much credit as they deserve. Fact they're probably a tad overrated. Joe go minute work. Yeah a little underrated but but they had such commercial such commercial success. That i don't know that john go weren't they win the australian one to one listening of making movies. We'll change most people's minds who you're talking about dire straits. Oh yeah thank you august. Go i i wanted to ask the question about your iheart podcast. I can't get it anymore is are you. Are you think kicked off of iheart radio. No they're in the process of upgrading. The technology it's going to be on speaker. But i think that it's i don't know if it's i thought it was fixed. But they're supposed to be upgrading it And they're they're changing technology. Do me a fantastic well. I appreciate that. Do me a favor and send me an email through the website at michael berry dot com and i'll have our it department. I've asked him to draft something up as to how 'cause we're getting a lot of Emails from our podcast listeners. And i will try to find out exactly how to get it. It's supposed to be working again. I'm not a technology gas. So i don't know but thank you. Mike go oh. Md not on the dark one. Hit wonder i mean. I i yeah scott. Amazing rhythm aces yeah. I think they're they're not at the dire straits level but that is an underrated band With with some good quality music caller go. i don't know any of the super bands. I don't think you can ever call Underrated and they are matt. Go the scorpions. New york. Long island matt german. Maybe their ancestry. But i think the leasing were learning. He's got a great board. Yeah no that's an you know in that in that rat motley crue whole category. The scorpions don't get their due and they do have some really good songs. I'm gonna give i'm gonna i'm gonna grant an exemption on this. Yes because they're they're somewhat well known but they probably are underrated. I think that's that's fair to say good call right now. Command the season hirszon's kia if you're looking for a new kia persons has zero percent financing and leases starting at one twenty nine per month. Check them out at hirszon's kia dot com.

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Democracy Now! 2019-07-02 Tuesday

Democracy Now! Audio

59:02 min | 1 year ago

Democracy Now! 2019-07-02 Tuesday

"To in brooklyn new york this is democracy now protester storm hong kong legislative legislative council and the latest round of protests that have rocked tom com will speak with leading pro democracy activist joshua long recently were released from prison in hong kong it's time for talk to her throwing extradition who had been written on the south end to how to me an evil already joined the fight an urge her to bear a political reporter she then as senator pamela harris psoriasis and the presidential polls will look at how she's being targeted with a string of grace the conspiracy theories angle look at her record as a prosecutor in san francisco and attorney general of california when i became a prosecutor and when i was elected district attorney and also attorney general california i implemented some of the most significant reforms to date during those years that had been implemented we'll speak to university of san francisco law professor a law passed along to the new york times op ed she contends comma harris what's not a progressive prosecutor all that and more coming up welcome to democracy now democracy now dot or the warren peace report i'm amy goodman as president trump signed the four point six billion dollar our border bill approved by congress last week a delegation led by the congressional hispanic caucus visited to immigrant prisons monday amid growing outrage reports of inhumane conditions do the trump's border policies texas congressman joaquin castro described the conditions that in adult facility as being a king to a prison where women were held in seoul's without access to running water and proper medical care some had been held for over fifty days others reported they had no information on the whereabouts of they're separated children the congressional delegation also visited the clintons border patrol station that has come under fire after recent reports of overcrowding and inhumane conditions for the children being locked up there congress member alexandro cossio cortez tweeted after yesterday's visits it's not just the kids it's everyone people drinking out of toilets officers laughing in front of members of congress i brought it up to this year period as they said officers are under stress and act out some times a cossio cortez tweeted no accountability congress members held a press conference outside the children's person in clinton it's booze and racist cheers from protesters mrs massachusetts congress member i on a presley please you know she was on friday a federal judge ordered customs and border protection that cb p gillette independent health monitors into detention facilities in texas holding migrant children to insure conditions are safe unsanitary last week lawyers asked u s district judge dolly g a whole the trump administration in contempt over conditions in the facility sent a mandate immediate improvements in related news nbc news is reporting a federal watchdog warned in may that border agents arm themselves and feared possible riots due to the conditions that in el paso texas immigration detention facility be associated press has released a video showing a twelve year old girl speaking to to a lawyer about her and her six year old sisters experience at the border patrol station clint texas which is been called a child jail the two young girls were taken to the jail after being separated from their aunt when they arrived in the usa you s and may the clinton border patrol station recently came under intense scrutiny after reports of widespread neglecting inhumane living conditions including lack of food water sanitation and medical care this extra little girl from the eighteen video now don bull they gave us little food some children did not be and i didn't based dum dum they treated as badly are we where they were known to us so phone shut he's on the writing his feet or bad me our they slept on just the floor cbd blankets or not it would only give us one blanket he asked his there wasn't enough to understand the cold no no some children were sick they said they'd taken to hospitals but they wouldn't take them young girl also told the lawyer children would cry out for their parents another separated did family members customs and border protection has opened an investigation into a social media post by border agents belonging to a racist zena phobic facebook group investigation follows the publication of a new piece and propublica uncovering the secret facebook group in which current and former cbp employees post race six homophobic anti immigrant and massaging mystic content about migrants says while some lawmakers another high profile file people one post contained a photo shopped image of congress member alexandria cossio cortez being sexually assaulted by president trump in another thread members of the group made fun of a video of a man trying to carry a child file through rapid river and a plastic bag someone commented at least it's already in a trash bag asked by a reporter yesterday to respond to her depiction in a facebook post congress member a cossio cortez said it was indicative the culture she observed inside the migrant person she adjusts visited and said she did not feel safe around the officers congressman joaquin castro added that some cbp agents have quote become desensitized to the point of being dangerous drift to the migrants in their care posts were also uncovered that mocked the salvadoran father and twenty three month old young daughter who drowned last month while attempting to cross the rio grande to get to the uss border my grandfather father oscar oh belcher walking martinez ramirez and his young daughter of alaria were buried yesterday in their hometown in el salvador in a private ceremony a photo of their drowned bodies and the rio grande river calls both widespread outrage at the humanitarian mandatory in crisis at the southern border and raised questions about the ethics of exploiting such images and the press journalists were not permitted to attend the funeral el salvador's precedent naive kelly said sunday that they're tragic deaths were caused by flawed immigration policies and unsustainable situations and all the countries implicated uss mexico and el salvador in more immigrant rights news a coalition of human rights and other groups are holding closed the camps demonstrations around the country today calling on lawmakers to shutdown immigrant jails defund detention and deportation and reunite separated families meanwhile mexico's newly forum national guard officially began operations sunday deploying seventy thousand national guard across mexico the force was set up by president andres manuel lopez over door to combat violence from organized crime but critics have called doubt recent incident showing members detaining central american migrants at the border in related news mexican immigration officials said they recently deported over hate eighty haitian migrants amid mounting pressure from the usda's stem the flow of northbound migrants in hong kong riot police used teargassed forcibly remove hundreds of protesters occupying the legislature building early tuesday morning be active it's began their occupation and monday when they stormed hong kong's legislative council and smashed the glass to gain entry tearing down portraits of officials and spray painting the wall reaction took place says hundreds of thousands flooded the streets monday to markley aaniversary of hong kong's returned to chinese control twenty two years ago it's the latest in massive civil unrest that started last month one millions took to the streets to protest a bill that would allow the extradition of hong kong residents and visitors to mainland china the vice chair of hong kong's pro democracy labor party fernandes chung said the protests will continue until the government completely withdraws they extradition bill i think this is going to go on for a really long time he's gotten the snow with the bill completely and brass had any actual plan to rebuild communication shouldn't reading three people in hong kong is to in unrest we much north seventy five was the the government and not allowing incomplete extradition bill and also urged him to establish an independent will have more on hong kong after headlines iran announced its surpass the limit on uranium enrichment permitted under the terms of the two thousand fifteen nuclear deal and said it would continue increase it stockpile trump responded to the news by saying iran was playing with fire the iranian foreign minister mohammad javad zarif said they would not about to west pressure but would engage in dialogue with any parties the demonstrate respect last week france germany and united kingdom said that in stacks and alternative financial mechanism that would circumvent you us sanctions what's operational iran said the system which a positive development but that europe was not buying iranian oil i needed to do more to uphold its commitment to keeping the landmark two thousand fifteen agreement alive in the face of precedent trump withdrawing last year and crippling sanctions japan has resumed commercial whaling after more than thirty years of hearing to global ban on the practice japan which has argued wailing as part of its culture continued hot wells during the band for what claimed was scientific research the critics say that was merely avail us at continued selling whale meat for profit last december japan announced it was leaving the international whaling commission greenpeace japan cold that decision out of step with the international community adding quote japan must urgently actor conserve marine ecosystems back in the united states the department of agriculture is in turmoil as he agency prepares to move hundreds of jobs from the capitol to kansas city last month agriculture secretary sonny perdue announced the relocation of two key research agencies prompting a dramatic silent protests by over a dozen employees who stood up and turn their backstage to the stage purdue is speaking from employees must now choose whether to move or lose their jobs politico is reporting a survey shows that four out of five employees may decide to quit rather than relocate numerous scientists lawmakers agricultural environmental groups have called out the move by purdue which they warn will harm employees of the agency and farmers in this part of the trump administration's agenda to suppress climate research last month politico reported the agency stop promoting dozens of publicly funded scientific studies about the impacts of climate change democrats have dust far been unsuccessful in their attempts to stop the move through legislative on other measures many of those who are being forced to move or economist and scientists responsible front for some of the cutting age climate change research in this country and president trump has requested a military terry spectacle including tanks and fighter jets upcoming fourth of july parade and has addressed the nation officials have raised concerns about the ballooning cost of the event as well as the potential for physical damage to the mall all due to the massive military hardware a plan military parade for last year proposed by president trump was scuttled after it was revealed it would cost up to ninety two million dollars including fifty million dollars in pentagon koss on monday the dc council expressed its opposition tapping tanks drive down and washington dc streets tweeting we have said it before and will say it again tanks but no tanks and those are some of the headlines this is democracy now democracy now dot or the warren peace report i'm amy goodman and i'm wondering solace welcome to all of our listeners and viewers across the country and around the world we begin today's show with massive so civil unrest in hong kong where riot police used tear gas to forcibly removed hundreds of protesters occupying the legislature building early tuesday morning they activists began their occupation on monday when they stormed hong kong's legislative council and smashed the glass doors to gain entry tearing down portraits of officials and spray painting the walls some demonstrators held a sign reading there are no violent riot is only a violent regime they action to places hundreds of thousands flooded the streets mundane mark the anniversary of the city's return the chinese control twenty two years ago it was just the latest mass demonstrations since millions took to the streets in series marches last month to protest a contested bill that would allow for extra additions of hong kong residents and visitors to mainland china activists say the law and infringement on their legal rights and i'll be independence of hong kong protesters are calling for hong kong chief executive kerry lamb just step down over the legislation she postponed the bill under public pressure but if not yet fully withdrawn it this is keri lamb speaking at a news conference earlier today we have not responded to every dean martin house because of reasons first of all if a close off the social tensions that we have seen is the bills bills to amend the fugitive offenders ordinance on the fifteenth of june i have announced the suspension and subsequently we have explained elaborated by suspending the bill at this point time with no timetable and no plans to resume the fate of the bill in the legislature comes so that was hong kong chief executive kerry len walter more we go to hong kong were joined by pro democracy lawmaker claudia mo she's a member of the hong kong legislative council welcome to democracy now it's great to have you with us cardia mobile can you talk about what took place yesterday now the pitch is you see all actually radha shopping a the the they were devastating and the the possibly unexpected but then behind all this i hope the whole world will try to understand stunned and sympathize with hong kong young people they go and they let me send me the frustration that's been parents hang up ortiz he is the sort of environment the growing up and so a of the they might have the become a the probably unnecessarily militant but they they're trying to get their voice says it's not just in hong kong but hopefully across the world can you talk about where you were yesterday cardio i said the milling around the basically the the sometime in the afternoon i tried i eat too much to apparent leaders of their more militant protesters to reach think about the plan to stall and the legislative building but the reply i got were so we knew you were very concerned but then don't worry about us we are okay with puffing knew what we're doing the sad thing is that seems to be a tiny bit of a this mob mentality among our young that they would die they don't mind dying for this a democracy fight in hong kong watch their voice basically it's democracy now and a home a quarter mile like the more i like to ask you in terms of v of the existing so called democratic structure in hong kong obviously under china's one country two systems policy how is the legislature chosen a in hong kong and what is the impact of v o v people's republic of china government off over hong kong yes exactly that's a quick question to be on foot young center a particular anger at their the legislature it's mainly mainly stems from the the fact that it listen ferry legislature that would go into a pause dot com perverse show a china extradition bell why because they've got enough beijing votes in and it's all because of our very twisted and convoluted kind of election system they make sure that the pro beijing votes will occupy at least top off off of our seats that's a total number of seventy they make sure that they would have enough votes to pass just anything any policy any bill any funding application from the government and democrats are always out numbers we nominate not because we were were popular but because the way we just don't get the seats we have more votes but fewer seats and that sums up and they hong kong legislative elections and the young new wit's end from the last election back in twenty sixteen right off to that because also says some old taking ceremony a it's a political stunt said on the part of a field they the hong kong government men aged to twist and ben rules and laws without breaking them of course and successfully totally cake out altogether six of our elected democratic lawmakers and the young grew up with threats to this news they knew perfectly and what's going on in hong kong that anger is justified may not be that action that anger and needs to be understood i wanna ask you though about a hunt congress relatively prosperous as as i mentioned to you in the world is got but it's rated with the highest level of economic freedom from business in the world very low taxes it's got the seventh highest human development index of any country in the world and its gdp is per capita gdp is almost as high as united states at fifty six thousand so it has prospered economically or under chinese rule but could you talk about the impact of economic prosperity versus the lack of political democracy now that you have to but a hong kong's genie conversations and it's also among the highest in the world and they said well divide and the sunsets hey if it's just incredible at the end of the it's preposterous really and that's very free to businesses right a business problem a problem spot businessmen and make money but then they will provide is getting worse and worse and i just hope that this afternoon from all over the driver but of course we need to come in billions in hong kong we're all very mundane minded in hong kong because political protest where do they take us the government's simply pay attention to you beijing tells you to just restore order so we try to an f much money as we can so that we can leave hong kong mcrae's great are you calling for kerry lamb to resign end be specific bill that she put forward if you could briefly explain it a carry lem has been saying that she would suspend it is a particular confer show bill no suspension is always temporary hadn't come back anytime why couldn't share you just use the word west troll scrap right i so that's a it's a face problem as face issue in chinese politics that she has done a climb down she has agreed to suspended and she's not going to make any further climbed down so let's take great answer but but i'm quite to the convinced that shooting back to the bring back that issue but the thing is it boils down to trust among the people people which she has completely lost by today can you explain what happened inside the hong kong legislature yesterday a livia the the militant a more mostly young protests to the store and the legislative complex and a bite it would they they are they would genuine students said they're not the interview prices so protocol to sign that said of the other things and they were so angry they did everything they could to a more damage the chamber obviously but one julia saying this but just before they storming the police which who have been at the station inside to guard the building something they sort of what's tune treated police chief subsequently said they had to me they claudia of the other teams at the police teams for a deal to very flynn say race and so he couldn't help thinking that it's possible they were trying to be a protester protesters into their at the compound the building and do their evangelism expected and so that the whole world well see those shocking photos and pictures and footage is and the young will get the blame for and vandalism in hong kong and the the course they're trying to fight for will be forgotten a so far it's been be hong kong police have basically been dealing with the demonstrators do you have any fears that if this of the protests continues with the possibility of actually military from china coming into hong kong were not of the gifts so that's the fundamental or a scare about a home calling the security situation last night i had a the other young says a talking about them needing to stay on outside of their legislative building because they need to our number the police force as long as we have enough people they come possibly arrest us all and we we have to protect those who have already gone ten now i have i've had similar lying's from young protesters two years ago on ten on square a in beijing and they were saying just the same things that so many of us they just cannot a gripe all of us that kind of mentality and under hong kong so many constitution toossion the government s as the as the allowed to be class hong kong to be under some emergency state and the people's liberation army with beer ascend to the streets of hong calling to retain a social order what have you that that was a very scary told but then it didn't happen and i hope it will never get to the good for situation again again are you asking for a carry lamb to resign calls of coast basin numbers as far as i could see in many of us in hong kong i mean the the beijing has tried to distance itself from carry lyme suggesting that she's the one who started oldest consultancy unsal go in hong kong and is assuming that's the case kevin nealon sucked that has proved herself to be completely inefficient and she's been accountable almost to hong kong people you saw the footage of her speaking at some press conference in the middle of the night yesterday and she was put him on this bureaucratic face on a complete with a bureaucratic voice attending hong kong people yes i will only listen to you again wednesday humidity he never got tickets and the thing if the shoe will be sticking around a bit stu because i understand well many of us who understand that there's no replacement that's acceptable to beijing jim yet at the moment and it would be also unlawful face to beijing if they would have to let her go now is too soon right it's like vowing to the people vowing to public pressure so i wouldn't be surprised if she would meet to go off to rule a say this time next year connie mo we wanna thank you for being with us democratic lawmaker in hong kong attended the protests on sunday this is democracy see now we were speaking to her in hong kong state what do you hear the some a bang rain in the meuse they probably will not be chilly again when we they know we'll take goes the be hanging around there at the i talked to win tomorrow calm and you joy in a row saying oh well strongman nine win may be on the well so i like that you'll go right to be a man of the overwhelmed brain that just don't know by saying well no one thought they say no no no that is not by by sunday low here the people things in the soundtrack of lame is around la protesters and how kind of adopted the broadway show tune as their anthem this is democracy now i'm amy goodman with one and solace california's senator and presidential candidate comma harris is writing a new wave of momentum following her debate performance last week when she challenge joe biden's past history of working with segregation is lawmakers in his proposition to bussing to integrate schools in nineteen seventies well harris's jumped in several opinion polls there's been also i right wing backlash online on thursday the president's son donald trump junior tweeted a message from unauthorized personality analogy that read quote comma harris is not an american black she's have indian and have jamaican i'm so sick of people robbing american blacks like myself or history it's disgusting harris's family were actually slave owners so the tweet said donald trump junior riposted the tweet adding is this true while trump junior then deleted the tweet later that night after coming under fire from several other twenty twenty presidential candidates states including joe biden who tweeted quote the same forces of hatred rooted in birtherism that question brock obama's american citizenship and even as racial identity are now being used against senator kamla harris unquote twenty twenty democratic presidential hopeful julian castro trump told cnn donald trump junior behave like a coward this is a game with these folks play they put something out there you noticed what he did he tweeted it out and then he deleted it like a coward so he could say oh that was just a mistake steak but he knows what he's doing he's giving voice to these racist 'em a you know utterances about senator harris a you know we needed dispelled immediately and condemn them and then given any more life because they're just goes through so that's presidential candidate who leon castro from more we go to washington dc where we're joined by shrink metro founder of the group stop online violence against women tree mitchell welcome to democracy now can you respond to this tweet and delete of donald trump junior and talk about this in the tradition of the trump family really president trump himself a justice a private new york developer leading v a birth there are certain movement against precedent brock obama questioning where he was born yes this is not just a pattern of of this this family the trump family please remember trump is so the one that tried to get five brown and black boys executed in central park so let's not forget that this is a history but then this family of racism other parts of this is that we also need to remind ourselves and also they they they participated it in in housing discrimination there were there were all kinds of legal ramifications about them targeting black and brown communities so this isn't new so this is not a surprise to me or any should not be a surprise to anyone else the ways in which they used are identity as a weapon to rally their their base is very problematic in very consistent phil comma love being a woman of color is it in running for office and running against a who's go you donald trump's tone going maybe going forward a this is not a surprise that they would start this this early but also be clear that on this online harassment of black and brown and limit has been going on a as a part of the election election process and it's been going on since twenty thirteen as we tracked many of these behaviors of pretending to be black women trying to defame or just a discredit black women and and this this example is exactly that to say that comma mullah is not in american black when she was born in oakland is ridiculous but this hearkens back to what what's happening with obama as well that his father was kenyan so somehow that made him not black enough not born here well he had to prove that he was and that's the part of the birtherism that was being expanded upon win on when donald trump himself started on on promoting promoting that campaign that brock obama had explained his existence in this country i would say there is no other group but it's constantly ask to identify as american because we have the term african american and that somehow we're choosing african first and that example is in the example that happens in our community but also it's a very much a used as a weapon against us ensuring a mature a water we know bob three person who actually posted the tweet this ali alexander so what we've found what i found out or as some of us were still dig in a little bit deeper this this gentleman happens to be connected to some of the other right wing groups and the all right groups a un associations with lori little or 'em jacob wall hall a these are so he is associated with it so it wasn't surprised that the on donald trump tweeted him because he's he's been a part of that community and finally year response to well this one fee for the tweet and delete of donald trump junior in february senator kamla harris spoke to the breakfast club this is radio host charlemagne the gods questioning harris about means circulating online about her so another mean says or kamala harris is not african american her parents were immigrants from india in jamaica issues raised in canada not united states and it's a it's a solid born in oakland yeah and raised in the united states except for the years that i was in high school in montreal canada an look this is the same thing they did to brock yeah this is this is not new the us and so i think that we know what they're trying to they're trying to do what has been happening over the last two years which is powerful voices china so hate and division among some and so we need to recognize more band played i'm glad you're miserable rocket a lot of black people question if brock who's black enough i see them doing the same thing you said what do you say to people questioning the legitimacy of blackness i think they don't understand why people are because if you do if you watch on hamptons students campus or howard's campus or morehouse or spelman are fisk you would have a much better appreciation for the diaspora for these diversity for the beauty in the diversity city of who we are as black people so i'm not gonna spend my time trying to educate people about who black people that was senator comma harris speaking on breakfast club the radio show on sri metro your response yeah i mean she's absolutely right in one thing's for sure i'm also a graduate of hp cu an is once you have that experience you would never questioned why black identity is they only people who make those who who who's question us like that those are from outside of the community and other parts of that is within are commuting we yes we do have people coming from different walks of life but that's the same of any other community there is nothing different about our community than others but somehow it's it's it's a it's being used as a weapon it's being is that as a way to discredit us it's it's it's a use case in a black identity being used as a weapon for not only to polarize the black vote but also to to try to get other people to quote unquote on hey you know i i hate you hate but to make it look like we're the ones who were the threats versus the threats that are upon us so the so the ignorance of what's actually happening to us and how were being targeted how how how the example of what donald junior did a is an example of hate the example of what trump did to those boys in central park a i you know from when when they see us was a documentary about that those a prime example of ways in which we're not only 'em question about who we are but question about i loyalty to this country and we were born here so there's no question about that that's ensuring mitchell the president trump is also ridiculed and a of senator elizabeth warren and accused of not being truly a native american now his son junior raises questions students about kamala harris the whole issue of a online attacks on women in your organization stop online violence against women and you talk about that and be impact that is happening on the national discourse yes i mean again we we have a report that we have a second report this coming out but i first report revealed that on the russian interference that was in the muller report that has been documented by seventeen agencies were literally a an intense in unfocused target get on black identity used as a weapon for voter suppression and that example is what we're seeing right now and you have to understand even with elizabeth warren on aspect that was a target to us so discord within the native american community so if you if you look at this pattern there is eight ice targeted pattern of going after a brown and black voters to interfere in the ways in which they decide to choose who they want to vote for and that's the oath that in itself is is one of the focus problems that we need to be paying attention to fireworks show the black women were being targeted as early as twenty thirteen this what's well before before everyone understood what was happening i in twenty sixteen and yet and yet we still are having this conversation as if it's this is new this is not new it's been going on for years what we're learning is there's a different way we needs approach digital voter suppression and we need to pay attention to what's happening to women of color because they are the targets black women are trusted voters in an arch immunity and if and if we're not paying attention to what's happening to them or how they're being targeted i we will have a problem though and showing is when he's when sharing the children a thank you for being with us founder of the group stop on line violence against women joining us from washington dc this is democracy now when we come back we look at senator kamala harris is record's as a san francisco dna and then california's attorney general stay with that's why men lamb you don't know me news blind the dow jumped one i wonder or by brittany howard and were they say this is democracy now democracy now dot or the warren peace report i'm amy goodman with one gonzales well a sudden nicole harris rises in nearly presidential polls he's facing increased scrutiny over her rickard as a prosecutor in california in two thousand four harris became district attorney of san francisco she held the post until two thousand eleven whereupon she became de attorney general of california we're joined now by allowed by they professor at the university of san francisco school of law in january she wrote a widely read article in the new york times titled kamla harris was not eight progressive prosecutor faslane wrote quote time after time when progressive russia's urged her to embrace criminal justice reforms as a district attorney and then the state's attorney general miss harris oppose them or states silent most troubling miss harris fought tooth and nail to uphold wrongful convictions pictures that have been secured through official misconduct that included evidence tampering false testimony and the suppression of crucial information by prosecutors are investigating joins us now from san francisco thank you for joining us professor by salon can you start off by going through on senator harris says record's starting with her being dna of san francisco sure so she was elected in two thousand and four and she took a pretty creative stance initially in that she didn't seek the death penalty against a man who had been accused of murdering a police officer and she did get a lot of blowback from that subsequently she moved much more towards the center and many of her positions on two things happened in her tenure as did i think are worth mentioning one is that there was a big crime lab scandal whereby there was a lot technician who is using the drugs rather than testing them and as a result many many convictions became tainted and it turned out that her office had known for months top attorneys had i did not disclose that information to the defense and win a judge found out she became quite incensed inward and opinion castigating harris for allowing this to happen harris's reaction to that was to try to get the judge disqualified but by saying that she had a conflict of interest because her husband was a defense lawyer that failed and six hundred cases were thrown out the second piece of her tenure that i think is important but not a lot of people know about it's a case involving a man named jim all true love that case was tried by linda allen who is one of harris's deputies ends the case against true love turned against a single witness turned on one is it was a one eyewitness identification case he was convicted and sentenced to fifty years to life in court of appeals throughout that conviction castigating forgetting what allen had done as gross and agree just prosecutorial misconduct they said that her closing argument with the yarn made out of whole cloth recently true love sued the city account of california excuse me city of san francisco in one eight thirteen point one million dollar judgment now you've also written about another patient george gauge could you talk about that as well yes this is what prompted being really to write this piece it's harris this record on wrongful convictions so after true love there was gauge age and there were johnny bhakta on daniel larson anna men in whole jose luis d as in these cases what happened was that harris was at that point they aj they top official in the state of california the top prosecutor and when these convictions came up they had been handled by lower deejays and it was her job to decide whether or not defend them in george gauges case he had been convicted again based on a single witness what's his stepdaughter marian who accused her accused him of sexually abusing her on the case turned on marion's testimony it turned out after the verdict but the prosecutor had suppressed a lot of material about marian including medical records and a note from her own mother saying my daughter is a pathological liar who lives her life and rather than acknowledge that this really terrible thing had happened and at this prosecutor held back information that might have swayed the verdict what harris's attorneys went into court and did was say look george gauge would have been forced to his own lawyer didn't raise his claim in exactly the right way and suffer this technical reason you should a firm conviction it went to oral argument and the judges were very concerned about that position told the deputy go back and talk to a supervisor is to try to resolve the case which was a signal to really get rid of it and do the right thing and instead harris his office doubled down and george gauge is a currently eighty years old his surveying eight affective death in prison sentence i wanna go to interview a comma harris did last month on face the nation with correspondent at o'keefe you take care prosecutorial recurring against the pushing you're part of a criminal justice reform there's a lot of concern among especially more liberal and younger parts of the party you might not be the best person do that given the he were implementing those tough on crime initiative which prosecutors they trust you do that well here's the thing when i became a prosecutor and when i was elected district attorney and also attorney general california i implemented some of the most significant reforms forms to date during those years that had been implemented like i said i created one of the first reentry initiatives it became a model it was designated as a model in the united states for what law enforcement should do to be as i call it smart on crime i was the first in the nation leading the state department of justice in california which by the way is the second largest department of justice in the united states to require my agents to wear body cameras i created as attorney general the first in the nation implicit bias and procedural justice training for law enforcement knowing that had to be addressed which is they implicit bias that exists in law enforcement and the potentially lethal outcomes becomes that occur from that so the concerns were blown the concerns are overblown yeah no question so that is senator kamla harris on face the nation speaking correspondent eto kief if you could respond to this a a learn about salon short so you couldn't hear her struggling to come up with a list and she starts with her back on track program that she implemented his dna this is a program that did help certain very select non violent offenders rancher society it affected a very small group of people she then talks about body worn cameras she was asked by the california state legislature to support built a mandate all police officers wearing body worn cameras and she declined to do that with respect to implicit bias training that is important what's also important and i would say more important is investigating officer involved shootings she was called upon by the legislature to do that and once again she declined and then when you go down the list of the issues that we think about when we think about a progressive prosecutor on every single one of those issues she was on the wrong side and in some cases her opponents ran shut her left the for example with marijuana legalization in her run for reelection as attorney general her opponent ran to legalize she was against it she's since changed her position now that the vast majority of the democratic party has moved in that direction there are other examples it well her failure to support legislation that will reduce certain felonies to misdemeanors going after parents criminally for having sure when children so there's a lengthy list of policy positions where there were the progressive pass and there was the center right path and she did not take the progressive path i wanna know specifically about this whole issue of of parents were true in children in her power a policy of trying to prosecute them i wanna go to come comma harris is two thousand eleven inaugural speech as california attorney general as she touted the insurance policy during her tenure as district attorney of san francisco this is what she said we know chronic truancy leads to dropping out which dramatically increases the odds that young person will either become perpetrator or is a victim of crime folks it's it's time to get serious about the problem of chronic truancy in california last year alone we had six hundred thousand true in students in elementary schools which roughly matches the number of inmates in are state prison system and is it a coincidence of course not an does unacceptable as this problem is i know we can fix six in san francisco we threatened the parents of trolling with prosecution insurance they dropped thirty two percent so we are footing parents on notice if you fail to take responsibility for your kids we are going and make sure that you face the full force and consequences of the law so that was comma harris in two thousand eleven what exactly did she do is be prosecuted parents so what ended up happening that and this actually took effect after she left and became attorney general prosecutors then had the power under this law to prosecute parents for a misdemeanor for being essentially responsible for their children missing numerous days of school the idea of being the bay would be scared in making sure that their kids actually did attend school and some parents were in fact prosecuted and the pushback about this i think what's on two fronts one proportionally impacted communities of color and parents of color who were basically more often and targeted by the law than people who are white and to this idea that removing apparent from the home or subject to criminal prosecution would be a tool to really sort of rena family which i think is is very questionable there a lot of things going on when they're true and children including poverty drug use different issues with kids and it's just not cleared and many people who work in the juvenile face the right answer to that is to criminalize the parents conduct and she responded sense i mean that was a clip in two thousand eleven now that she is running for president antar rickard is being questioned on a number of these issues well i mean that to me has been what's been frustrating is that i don't find her responses to be responsive to the questions but she's being asked and i don't feel oftentimes it she's being ask the hard questions so the face the nation clip is kind of the perfect example where she's throwing what i think is sort of a softball and then responds by kicking off a couple of accomplishments and so when you look at them and the bigger context actually aren't that progressive and so part of it is that she hasn't been pushed directly the answer for truancy for george gauge for jamal true love for marijuana for opposing testing in kevin cooper case i mean she's not getting those questions i think directly in forcefully enough but then also disappointingly i think she hasn't reckoned with and said look i am responsible for those decisions she had said more broadly the buck stops with me i had in my office but she needs to take that next step at acknowledged these specific things that she did i'm rocking without record's i wanna go senator kamla harris speaking to reporters in january as she announced her candidacy for president senator harris was asked about her role in defending the california department of corrections efforts to prevent transgender prisoners from getting gender reassignment surgery i was says usages your rightly pointing out be attorney general california for two terms and i had host of clients that i was obligated to defend and represent and i couldn't find my clients and there were unfortunately situations that occurred where my clients took positions that more contrary my beliefs and on end there it was in office of a lot of people who would do the work on a daily basis and do i wish that sometimes they would have personally consulted made before they wrote the things that they wrote yes i do but the bottom line is the buck stops with me and i take full responsibility for what my office of dead but on that issue i will tell you i vehemently disagree and in fact works behind the scenes to ensure that the the department of corrections would allow transitioning inmates to receive the medical attention that they required they needed undeserved so that was senator harris when she was announcing sinker president's speaking at howard university professor ler above salon your response well i think what is important to do it's a backup and talk about what the job of the prosecutor is so many people think that it is about convicting people and it is not it's actually about doing justice and that means that if you see something that is wrong not just against you're core principles but violates for example the equal protection clause the due process clause you are required as the top prosecutor in your state just stand up and so i won't enforce this law and in fact that's what she did in proposition eight so say i had these clients and i had no choice but to take these positions is not correct so i'll give you this example proposition eight was passed by california voters banning same sex marriage when she was is basically told that she needed to defend the sla she refused to defend it because it violates the equal protection law in her opinion actually as a supreme court later decided so she had that option when it came to this transgender surgery she had that option when it came to the death penalty when that came up and a judge found it was unconstitutional she defended it and her response has always been well these are my clients but in fact no you're job is to uphold the constitution and if you think these laws violate the constitution then you should not defend them i wanna ask you in you're op ed piece you you say that's a term progressive prosecutor has become a trendy a subject these days what do you see as what marks a will be some of the hallmarks of a truly progressive prosecutor in america in twenty nineteen so you're right it has become this real buzzword and we just saw last week with this insurgent campaign of tiffany combined in queens this is someone who's thirty one a queer latino tina lifelong public defender never prosecuted a case and she ran on a platform of dismantling are system of mass incarceration decriminalizing certain crimes not prosecuting certain crimes ending cash money bail which is essentially criminalization of poverty because it says two people people whether you can get outer not doesn't really depend on anything other than your ability to pay which means a wealthy person can be free and a poor person has to stay in languish in jail other case goes forward so perhaps the prosecutors they run on those platforms and they also run most importantly portland me on a platform of we're going to correct wrongful convictions and when people are suffering and dying in prison and they're innocent there wrongfully convicted because of corrupt official misconduct we're gonna uncovered that we're gonna go to court and we're gonna do the right thing and do those convictions so it's a laundry list of policy positions and they are brave and they are new and are system because we've had for so many decades people running on who can be the toughest on crime but a lot of americans are getting really fed up with that because it's expensive it's ineffective and it's unjust and racist and so these new prosecutors are embracing reforming they're running and they're winning on that platform learn bacelona thank you for being with us professor at university of san francisco school of law director the schools criminal and juvenile

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