17 Burst results for "Hildale"
860AM The Answer
"hildale" Discussed on 860AM The Answer
"Back. Americans shoot you it with Dr Larry R. And the President Hildale College That was David Strathairn, three creation of Abraham Lincoln in the seventh Lincoln Douglas debate all of those 21 hours and by the way, you'll listen to them and you will be Captured by both the art of Stratford and Dreyfus. But the eloquence of Lincoln and Douglas and the Passion of the time you listen to them transfixed and doctor on. I don't think anyone denies that. Well, it's uh it really is remarkable performance by both of them. And by now, you know, one should do you know, I think one should have some sympathy for Stephen Douglas. Because he was he did die trying to keep the union together. And according to his lights, he had a plan to do it. And Lincoln is putting very heavy pressure on him here. And that you know this this idea that you know it. So it's amazing how emphatic Lincoln becomes, and it's an art that so seldom practice in politics. It's hard to be adamant in principle and flexible and moderate in practice. And so what? What The mind does what politicians do all the time not so much Barack Obama by the way, but what they do is they fudge up the principles because they don't want to do the things that the principles demand them to do and think of the distinction that Lincoln is making all the time. This is a cancer. And we have to stop it from spreading and to endorse it is to endorse the things that will kill us. And that's as strong as one can possibly talk for the next quote, which is maybe the best quote, Lincoln said in the whole Lincoln Douglas debate and that you just set it up. I wanted to make sure we got into this segment. This is A powerful bit of David Strathairn as Abraham Lincoln cut number seven. That is the real issue. That is the issue that will continue in this country. When these poor tongues of Judge Douglas and myself shall be silent. It is the eternal struggle between these two principles right and wrong throughout the world. They are the two principles that have stood face to face from the beginning of time and will ever continue to struggle. The one is the common right of humanity and the other the divine right of kings. It is the same principle in whatever shape it develops itself. It is the same spirit that says you work and toil and earn bread and I'll eat it. No matter in what shape it comes, whether from the mouth of the king, who seeks to bestride the people of his own nation and live by the fruit of their labor. Or from one race of men as an apology for enslaving another race. It is the same tyrannical principal Dr Larry are in. If I could advise all of those 16 Republicans to memorize one thing, I'd have to memorize this. It's perfect seat and see it. It shows his response to Douglas. His point that we just have to consult our interest is that we have our ultimate interests. In our principles. And if we accept this principle, then we are accepting the claims of King George the third and we are. We are rebelling against the people who rebelled against him and his principal. And so finally he's saying your own servitude is being written and what and what Douglas is proclaiming. When we come back from break, there is one last sword play a bit of sword play in which Douglas tries to turn that blade aside, and we will play that for you When we return. In.
860AM The Answer
"hildale" Discussed on 860AM The Answer
"Uh, in about 17 88 and he says in there That for most of our history, most people have just accepted slavery is a fact and not thought much about it. But because of the revolution, people began to see that it was wrong. And that sentiment has grown continuously since the steps toward the revolution began. And so Lincoln is tracing from 17 63. When the first arguments came up and remember what those arguments are about, just because you're born a king doesn't mean you get to give us a law without our consent, and they could begin to see See that those arguments applied to all the people around them, including the black ones. That's Jay's account. And so so Lincoln is going back to that sentiment, which grew under the under the principles of Freedom that led to the decrease of independence and from the Declaration of Independence. He's going back to that. And he's drawing a continuous chain of all of the statesman in American history, including Henry Clay and not including only Roger Tony and Stephen Douglas and pointing to what will become the ultimate extinction of slavery. Cut number four Strathairn, his Lincoln continues there again. There is no mention of the word Negro or of slavery and all three of these places being the only illusions to slavery in the instrument. Covert languages. Used language is used, not suggesting that slavery existed or that the black race were among us. And I understand the contemporaneous history of those times to be that covert language was used with a purpose. And that purpose was that in our constitution, which it was hoped and is still hoped will endure forever when it should be read by intelligent and patriotic men. After the institution of slavery had passed from among us There should be nothing on the face of the Great Charter of Liberty, suggesting that such a thing as Negro slavery had ever existed among us. This is part of the evidence that the fathers of the government expected and intended the institution of slavery to come to an end. They expected and intended that it should be in the course of ultimate extinction. That was David Strathairn playing Lincoln again. The Lincoln Douglas debates. This is the seventh of them. I'll be right back on the Hildale dialogue with Dr Larry aren't all things Hill Taylor founded Hill.
860AM The Answer
"hildale" Discussed on 860AM The Answer
"It inside the Beltway Live today. Tomorrow is the 20th anniversary of 9 11 In the first hour. I played excerpts from my show My live show 20 years ago when the attacks were underway. That is posted over at the interview with you here at the entire show. I'll be on first look later, day after the Hildale dialogue, But right now I'm joined by Hotline Josh Josh Kraushaar with the national journal. Follow him at Twitter at Hotline, Josh. Good morning, Josh. You're a young man. Where were you 20 years ago tomorrow. Yes, I was starting my sophomore year in college and I was actually actually home for the for the for the week had read getting ready to go back to school in D. C. And watching the news that morning. Just Stunned, shocked for the country it really with changed my life, remember whether it was politically and then the political environment or just the You know how we view national security? Um, it was something that really just shaped my career and my final few years in college. Were you at GW? Georgetown. American? Where were you going to school? I was an American University graduate. So it was my second year started. Certainly year at a you. And so that meant that was you saw those pictures. You saw people fleeing the White House running north. They wouldn't quite have been able to Sprint to AU, but they would have gotten there eventually. It's pretty traumatic for people live in the city. I'm sure your mom and dad were too thrilled with the idea of you going back to D. C. No, I didn't go back. I think I remember correctly for a couple days. Schools closed. Um, you know you how did shape me specifically? I mean, I remember being interested in taking almost every foreign policy class. Um, originally was a journalism major ended up becoming a history Major. But, you know, I remember being intensely interested in taking courses on the Middle East National Security International Affairs really shaped my worldview and frankly interested in politics and global affairs. After that moment, you know time compresses history into paragraphs, and eventually, the paragraph on America and Afghanistan will say. A 20 year, fruitless effort by America to root out Islamicist fanaticism in Afghanistan ended in defeat and retreat. In the fall in the late summer involve 2021. Am I right about that? Yeah, I mean, I remember being in politics covering politics led pretty much 2004 presidential election Two years later, it was one of the few that was defined by by by foreign policy and national Security and even into 2000 and eight um, for different reasons. Um, yeah, I mean, if even 20 years later, you know And it's surprising that mathematics it's been quite some time is a generation that doesn't remember those Syrian images live like I did. And like like, we all did. But it is just such a, you know. It's one of the most significant historical event certainly in my own life. In 2000 and two George Bush fought back and historical currents, the typically cripple a first term president, and he won seats in the United States Senate that year as losses in the House. For a few. I believe I think the opposite tide is going to flow against Joe Biden. The defeat in Afghanistan will double the out current The tide's really going to go out on the Democrats next year because of the catastrophe felt in the fall of this year. What do you think, Josh? Well, I think a good political lesson is to do the right thing and the politics will will fall. If you do the right thing. Politics will fall as they may and you know, As far as Biden goes, I think his administration got kind of Sucked into these poll that showed widespread support for withdrawal from Afghanistan, but didn't really even think or over game out the second order effects. The third order effects of what would happen if if the Taliban takes over the country. What would happen with Al Qaeda? Well, the public reaction be it. Withdrawal goes chaotically in a military your military servicemen that are killed. Um and and you know the hubris of Planning to celebrate as a mission accomplished moment, the withdrawal of troops in Afghanistan on 9 11 and now in reality, seeing how it's the lowest point of his presidency, with his job approval, dipping Into the into the you know, low to mid 40 range. So, yes, I mean, I mean, but Bush was very much following his views on foreign policy. He was very much a guy by the gods, and he certainly there was strong support initially for going to war in Iraq, certainly for the war in Afghanistan. But even when things went south, he you know you surged the troops in Iraq when things that even though public opinion, said otherwise. And it turns out that actually improved his political standing for a little bit at the end, So in 2000 and six He gave a very famous speech in the library room in the basement after he got walloped. As he said, We got walloped her. We got skunked. I can't remember what the term is. And then he fired Rumsfeld and brought in Robert Gates and sent Petraeus to do the surge because he doubled down and he won. And although he lost in 2000 and eight wasn't because of Afghanistan and Iraq, Italy because of the economic collapse, I am curious Josh my view of last night's speeches that it was a cynical attempt to turn attention away from the collapse in Afghanistan in an unconstitutional overreach. What do you think? You know, then what I will say is that Biden's political standing on the pandemic has been dropping almost as much as his his and we love Afghanistan, which is even lower, but Biden Biden's political strength for the first six months. Of his presidency was the belief that were things were getting better with the pandemic. Things were going were the light was at the end of the title. And we're just about there like July 4th speech, um, that that hasn't been the case lately. Um, so I think he did need a sort of a political reset on What? Where he stands on the pandemic. I'm a little for his political fortunes. I'm a little skeptical of this is going to work. I think when you have such.
WCBM 680 AM
"hildale" Discussed on WCBM 680 AM
"I'm Dr Bob Parana, miss our guests, Ted, nor and we're ready with this question. Where you surprise date last year when Commissioner Manfred Announced that the Negro leagues were being considered a major league. And how did you feel about it? Okay, well, I was surprised by the timing and when I woke up that day, it was not on the top of my mind, especially during this terrible year we were having with pandemic. However. I didn't know of the thought. And one major league baseball announced which they did an opinion. Lindbergh COLUMN earlier that year. Uh Is that it was thinking about it. A e don't think it would have been possible, particularly in 2020 for them not to follow through with the right thing. So I wasn't surprised that it happened. I was surprised that it happened on that marvelous day and December 16th was definitely the The best day of 2020. That's the way I felt any way too. Yep, it's been, and it's taken such a long time. But it came so quickly after iftar looked like we We're going to get there for one reason or other. And so What? Where do we move from there? Well, first, it wasn't universally, uh, a potted, of course. But I was very happy that most That to my ears of the disagreement came from Negro League supporters. Oh, criticizing it thing for late being late. But of course The alternative was for it. Not happening. Oh, yeah? Yeah, And they criticized by whether authority does Major league have to declare the Negro. There was a major league and I I'm in sympathy with that thinking, but it was the same authority that 50 years earlier. The major leagues designated six Thank you gated white leaks as the major leagues and did not even consider because I've asked officials Do not even considered the Negro leagues. 1969 So whether you like it or not. They not only had the authority but they used it to the detriment of the Negro leagues. So I don't think they're redeemed yet, but I hope they get there. The Negro League players. They already knew they were major league, but it's nice to get the AKA pack a lot. And it doesn't forgive the sins. I don't think that was the intent of the Negro leagues. So where do we go from here? Well, there were three announcements Well, two announcements that day and a third left hanging. Number one. They know that the Negro leagues were indeed a major league. That meant that six White segregated legs were going to be joined by 77 Negro leagues. Now there's 13 major leagues, and that's That's great if the whole fame is going to be an educational institution. This helps them educate what was going on in baseball and and in the country. In the first half of the 20th century. Blood and the second thing and I don't mean coop of this. The integration of the stats into the major league Baseball cannon is also a good thing. And because of the work of Larry Lester, Dick Clark and the Saber Negro League Committee and seem head And in the future, Really? Life sports Bureau is the iron the stats up. We're gonna be able to compare not just the stars, but Mark Blanchard is a good example. We're gonna be able to notice Jakey Stevens of Hildale with the Mark Palander of the Negro leagues. Spectacular glove. Uh, I am not much of a bet. Although They both could come through under pressure situations. But this is part of what we've missed with Negro Leagues. Legends are wonderful. Uh, but, uh, being told that someone staffed is in the speed of light on only goes so far, and it actually served in my opinion caricature than a Negro leagues. Allowed thunder guns. I cleaned that up there a little bit, Bob, but sunder guns tol to dismiss it. We're now when you see that Josh Gibson might not. It is many home runs of the base. Because of the number of games they play in league games. But it is great is faster than nobody has Ah, higher rate of home runs during the segregated era. Then Josh Gibson, other than the paper. I was surprised when I looked at that because I thought Jamie Foxx probably would have been number two. But he's not know skips and Josh Gibson is second. 5.9% of his plate. Appearances are home runs, and these are the kind of things also Leon Day he will now become the second picture. Uh, I have no inner on opening day. Way already talked about rap. He's gonna be The record holder if he passes muster and because they are going to scrutinize these things. With 14 straight hits, Vic Hair's going to be the winningest manager percentage wife. The guys with more than 900 gangs managed So That's that's a big thing. But the third announcement that didn't happen. And this is frustrating because it's about what I spent the last two hours talking about On December 16th major leagues were joined by their historian John Thorne, by Bob Kendrick of the Negro League Baseball Museum. By the Life Sports Bureau by Team Heads by baseball reference, calm At the National Baseball Hall of Fame was not represented. At least I'm certainly not aware if they were at that announcement, and that's the third announcement that has to happen. Or Negro League Baseball players need to be put into the baseball Hall of Fame if they're gonna do their job of educating the public about baseball between 1900. In 1946 well, when they certainly have the material. The Negro leagues certainly have the material toe. Put in another 10 or 15. Yep. And I respect that answer, but I would double it. Okay, Well, you want to take 30 or 40? Yes. Okay. Why 18% of the players in the hall under segregation or Negro Leaguers? Oh 43% of the hall Since since Jackie Or would it had been Negro leagues or non white? I'm not saying you gotta match. It would take 70 some players the match. I'm not requiring that there's other factors involved. In fact, maybe it should be 80 or 90. I don't want to be limited by that number, but I know 15% certainly needs to go in and if they want to take a short cut, there's 22. Person who's on the ballot. From 2006. They could put all in That they don't like that. There's four players on the all set the centennial team picked by the Negro League Museum in conjunction with a private sector group, and I can't call the name but Jake Odd Well, does an excellent job piling it. And before I just want to name these four names They're on the all century team that are not in the home is only four. Pick reading and John down from his pictures. Bucko knew the manager Mark O'Neil. Yeah, and there's one position player, Bob, and I think you know who that was. One position player When position player I didn't the whole on the centennial team. I hope you've been listening to me for two hours. Oh, grab diction. Is that the guy you're talking about?.
Eric & Gord What If We're Right?
"hildale" Discussed on Eric & Gord What If We're Right?
"You all the best in science and yet that guy could get asthma. Fucking sounds like damn get the guy. A better suited obviously doesn't work. Jesus christ man. I know people smoke three packs a day breathe better can build a fucking death star. You can't get this guy in inhaler. What the fuck. They're bad movies. I don't care what anybody says. I wonder if roger nygaard has an opinion on star wars. Because there is obviously. You can't like the baltic after either. Be a trickier star wars guy. If you like the ball just blow up into a puff of logic. Science origin story suck. I'm not telling you mine. I was born now. i'm nobody. My origin. story will be epic for the record. See if i had grown up in your circumstances my life would be tremendously difference. If i grew up in a cemetery i think. Probably the town of milton wouldn't exist a trust me. I tried to burn it down Would have been very very different. Had i grown up in the adorable town of milton. Which is my favorite town. I feel such a kinship with the people of milton based only on their facebook page. I've never been there. I can't even picture this down in my head but it's amazing. The picture i ever milton in my head. If it doesn't look like it does in my head right now. I'm going to be devastated. I'm telling you right now. Twenty five years ago it did look like exactly what you're thinking. I'm telling you that straight up. I have very only on. Is the episode of this show called proudly sponsored by mad. Where gore does dick tour for us on air. I just go on that and mixed images from rt books and gilmore girls and i- piece them all together to make the perfect town in my head. And that's what melton is. And i love it but we had a grown up there. It would look like the bad town in back to the future to the bad version of hildale..
Good Seats Still Available
"hildale" Discussed on Good Seats Still Available
"I mean he'll just had very very solid players from year after year. They had frank war feel second base. It was excellent player. They had jake stevens at short Fairly consistent from year to year and again occasionally augmented by these big stars. We build in brooklyn lloyd for one year. John henry lloyd and that didn't work out very well I just think he didn't get along with bowl. The only played a year with hill But they always had a very solid core players and they had locals to. I think that was important. They always had a few local players. They bring in even talk about that and we're running out of time but interesting and then eagerly leagues those days they would do their own little crew scouting and they'd watch african american amateur teams and they might pull someone in and bring them onto the team that way. Jimmy johnson hall of famer started that way they told him off. The sandlot stuck him with hillsdale. He didn't make it the first year. Really and then a couple of years later he became a permanent fixture on the team so a lot of great players on hildale great stars and they deserve to be better remembered. I think one quickey on that one. And then i'll get to my final question Of your from your research you know of the quote unquote white media or white newspapers How much acknowledgment and or understanding would you say there was of hildale and the the quality player that was playing for hildale and the negro league play in general or or was there a lack of it. Was anybody.
Good Seats Still Available
"hildale" Discussed on Good Seats Still Available
"These people including an ed bolden maybe on overlooked on a number of different levels for because when you bring up sort of the the the great depression right i mean. I think it's pretty. You know most most people sort of had this sort of naive thinking that you know twenty nine stock market crash in the early and mid thirties. Worse just you know. It was a lot more sophisticated and or slower motion than that right. I mean you're you're hinting. At at some of the issues in the african american community where a lot of those issues were actually more pronounced before this stock market crash on wall street right and the the rest of the country. Essentially sort of seeing it on a grander scale as the thirties. So i you know to me this particular time hildale specifically but negro leagues and all of sports. generally right. this is this is this is like a huge chasm. that's all foist upon something fledgling. I mean the nfl relatively new at the time in football right you know gritted teeth figured out ways to kind of survive major league baseball kinda did too but know the negro leagues which were relatively hodgepodge not sort of paradigm of stability. At least not yet. Didn't sort of have those resources and couldn't absorb such a significant shock. But i you wonder what would have happened. I mean there was no problem. It seemed with hilda playing baseball right. I mean there were pretty damn good team. I mean six count them. You know major league all stars. And that's you know that's even before major league baseball sort of if you will modern day recognition right so maybe send me some more to come. I guess i've just i it's a head scratcher as to. It seems like it's relatively easy to put the blame on on the great depression. But i wonder how hildale could have been successful should had it have been either more stronger organization that they were part of or had the depression not been as severe. But i guess that's a question you could ask about a lot of teams in and around that time. That didn't sort of wind up getting up off the canvas. Well here's the thing to your listeners. Might find interesting. The negro leagues their home games were virtually african american supported. I mean survey did not get blocks fans in the seat. They just could not survive Yes there were some white fans who would go at various times in the history of negro leagues. But i mean the bread and butter for the year elite teams worthy black fans and in the thirties early thirties. Particularly i mean the fans just just completely disappeared as as i have some figures in my book. I mean it's almost unbelievable and you see you know the the attendance for some of their their final games. It's like one hundred and thirty four people showing up to twenty nine people i mean and and only a few years earlier to rejoin two and three thousand in the in the in the twenties so they just cannot afford to to go to games and one thing that i got into in the second book. I did negro league baseball in the thirties. It's it's almost a miracle..
Good Seats Still Available
"hildale" Discussed on Good Seats Still Available
"It was actually one of the better eastern leagues. But i think the depression prevented that leak from going more than one season. The start a fairly stable. I if i think of as start another time they might have gone further and then in thirty bolden himself was forced out It may issues because of his. He's still trying to work fulltime. And i think i something i mentioned. The book i mean actually was able to get a hold of his his employee records. Is you know. He worked for the feds so that he had hit a federal federal Employment records working the post office. He kinda see year to year. I mean he's. He worked two fulltime job trying to run a league and run his team. And i think probably just got to be too much to him and hildale corporation pushed him out in nineteen. Thirty and lloyd thompson ran the team. In nineteen thirty they operate as independent And that was really the end of a bold in connection with the hilty because what happened in thirty one which was interesting. is that A wealthy african american entrepreneur named john drew Seemed to be a godsend. He came in. He bought the team He bought the team. He invested money. He put money into the park And he put them in a new league in nineteen thirty to the east west league. Which another talk about the wrong time to start a league. Because nineteen thirty to the entire economy. The united states had cratered and the african american community was was really really. Tough shape That league did not last. Long and john drew himself. Pull the plug on hildale that year and that was the end of under the hildale club so the depression killed hildale ultimately Bolden returned in thirty three with a brand new team. Philadelphia stars As i said eddie gottlieb behind him you know putting up a lot of money. In that case bolden pretty much ran the stars. He was sort of the general manager of the philadelphia stars. But the money would come from eddie gottlieb so the film stars would never the same as they'll nor were they as strong a team as hildale But bowling continued in baseball with the stars until his death. I mean one thing. I would say about at bolton and he was in baseball for forty years almost had mack length of service in the game of baseball. And i think almost sometimes if there's a place in the hall of fame for him but he doesn't seem to get the recognition times have changed right. I mean just the fact that the major league baseball has just incredibly finally allowed. The a bunch of these Negro league statistics and players to be essentially equated long overdue right Into the totality of of major league baseball's standings and statistics and stuff. I mean i. You know i may. Perhaps it's even yet another sort of deeper. Look into some of this history and how elemental contributions of some of these..
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"hildale" Discussed on Good Seats Still Available
"And they did pretty well like from out of the gate right. So we haven't really talked about. This is their play on the field. we'll get to some of their stars that are more memorable in a few minutes but You know this is a team. That's quickly if not already gaining some good reputation for being a pretty strong quality franchise for a lot of reasons. They were very strong team. And i i think they were the dominant team I think there needlessly overlooked today You know when people talk about the negro leagues. I think the average person can name the kansas city. Monarchs homestead grays pittsburgh crawford. Those are the threes and hildale was consistently probably in the twenty s probably the most dominant teams in the nineteen twenties. But there are just not not remembered today and they should be The league itself and it was put together and twenty three as you said it was it was it was compact So they had teams. It was just right up the east coast. They had a team in new york. They have the new york lincoln. Lincoln giants They had the baltimore blocks socks. They had the Brooklyn royal giants and that was strong's team and there was controversy putting them in there because strong own that team and also do the booking for for for the other league teams foster and foster like but we'll get. It seems to par for the course around that time Yes and let's only one two three four human star thank you. The cuban stars are interesting and they were another controversial aspect of the negro leagues. The cuban stars you know they were. They were from cuba and they were cuban africa african of african descent players But they tended not to have their own playing field so the cuban stars would be a travel team they would. They would simply travel from place to place and that that would lead to controversy because other league teams would say well. They have no expenses at all. They just come to other people's parks and take money because you know that's it So they were that that was an issue there were. There were various times when cuban stars. Some weeks tried to get them apart to play in like when you go way into the forties and we'd be jumping ahead They put them at the polo grounds because the polo grounds were. Not you know when the new york times where it using the polo grounds. The cuban giants started using the polo grounds as their home field. But in the twenties the cuban giants tended not to have a park of their own and they were just travel so they were another part of part of this of this league. So that's sixty six now to new york three to new york giants one three hildale four blocks five and the six six.
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"hildale" Discussed on Good Seats Still Available
"So i'm guessing bolden then is is starting to recognize that you know we got to be more control of our own destiny so to speak and if we can't sort of sort of get over the current process then perhaps maybe we should. We should perhaps take our marbles and go elsewhere with them right. So i i guess. How would you describe the team in the negro national league in those early years. And then the i guess what. It was the buildup to a more dedicated eastern league that they jumped to or help create and nineteen. Twenty-three i mean i'm guessing that bolden saw that foster had put something together. I mean ear. National inc was flawed. Don't get me wrong But the early years of the ingraham. We're probably some of the best run. Negro leagues ever as far as the number of games played the attention to the schedule and statistics and things like bad and they did relatively well. I mean the twenties fairly strong twenties fairly strong period financially for negro league baseball so i think bowling probably saw that. There's there is more money to be made and something else was happening to which we can touch on. His semi professional baseball was slowly starting to fade as far as it being able to pay Hildale had made its money as we talked earlier by playing all white teams during the week. He's white semi pro teams and they could make a decent amount of money doing that but by the early twenties they're starting to die off. There's many complex reasons for why it was having people say radio was part of the reason why these local teams start stayed So i think bolden probably said okay. We can't totally survive on the way we were before with with the reliance on these wight semi pros have to replace that with more games played against professional teams in league situation. So i think that's what pushed him to form the eastern colored league at the end of nineteen twenty to nineteen twenty three season and some your listeners might find it interesting the the choice of words you know you have the negro national league and the eastern colored league..
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"hildale" Discussed on Good Seats Still Available
"Yeah The negro national league was formed in nineteen twenty the eastern teams were not included. I believe after the nineteen twenty one season or perhaps for the nineteen twenty one season The backer iraq's and there were made associate members so they were not actually part of the league. And i think the associate status. I believe you know gave them some degree of protection whereby they could play negro national league teams and they also there players would not be poached by eager nationally teams. I think it's really about all it. Did the associate membership. I'm a i'm guessing. They probably have to pay something in to do that again. If i recall correctly Possibly hildale may have only done it for one year because they felt they weren't getting much out of it again. A hard percents sure it seems like at least it would guarantee him a bunch of games right. It's almost you know from from a business and financial ledger. Perspective right at say. Hey here are some of the better teams or best. If you will teams in this fledgling league and we're gonna get to play them even hosting and stuff and whether they're exhibitions or for an actual competition column scoring all that kind of stuff. It's still it's still some paydays right that you can at least circle and guarantee on schedule while you're trying to fill in with the rest of it in theory. Yes but here's the here's the problem. And this is why. The eastern teams always a giant advantage to the mid western teams Been washington too far so a and the twenties the time we're told my right now. They weren't traveling by bus traveling by train to take your your team. We'll see posters american giants..
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"hildale" Discussed on Good Seats Still Available
"Not. Yeah definitely i mean. I tried to explain this in the book. I mean hildale started in nineteen ten and they were. They were based out of darby which is outside of philly And in those days it's it's a world that no longer exists and hasn't existed a long time and those as they were just tons and tons in philadelphia and the surroundings of amateur teams amateur. African american teams amateur white teams. And they were self organized. I mean some of them were in leagues but a lot of them were just independence. Who would play each other In a very informal way sort of just for bragging rights And you see in the newspapers at the time you leave and advertisements for like Let's say even hildale advertising hildale field club We're looking for games against other strong fifteen and sixteen year old teams in the area right to this individual. So that was the mill you in which hildale started out. There were just a boys team They were self organized in delaware county. You know philly area but what put them in a different stratosphere with the involvement of gentleman. Ed bolden who i write about in the book i mean was very interesting guy. He was a postal worker and postal worker in those days was a fairly privileged job for african americans and desirable jobs. Good solid civil service job you get into it you kind of a guaranteed employment for a long time so you had a good good job but he was very interested in baseball and he saw this little you know teenage boys team and got involved with and he had ambition so from year to year. He started to make the team a little bit. Better start to have him play stronger teams in the local area. No league affiliation at all independent Wrote up a constitution had them get better. Uniforms got better playing grounds for them. And that will repeat about four or five six years such that my did he just like take this on himself or was he kind of egged on to do. This was it was. I don't know there is no. I don't have actual documentation we we. We do know that. By the t. The earliest mention of the team i could find. I did the research for this was nineteen ten summer of nineteen ten. There was a a box score in the philadelphia inquirer By nineteen twelve which is when the philadelphia tribune's Documentation on microfilm starts. Unfortunately there's no pre nineteen twelve issues available. Was that would probably shed light on it and maybe discover them some day He is involved with t. by nineteen twelve. i think he was evolved. Nineteen eleven so we can only speculate but he probably knew someone because they were mostly kids. You know in in the darby the area of of delaware county outside of philly Emboldened himself from lived in darby so they probably knew him or he was interested in watching them play and just got involved with them. That's that's what we think. And he basically was at least putting some administrative rigor. I guess around The club and i'm guessing probably got involved in a whole bunch of stuff like scheduling and finances. And and i think even if i'm not mistaken even sort of conduct and how how to play the game and had a carry themselves as they were travelling.
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"hildale" Discussed on Good Seats Still Available
"I think i was the first to really use it. I think he was known to be out there. 'cause i believe someone directed me to it the the documents at the american music. But i don't think anyone actually really gone in there and try to you know. Try to put them together. So yes it really was a coup It allows you to a couple of things for one thing in the ledger books. You could see their day-to-day schedule. So every you know you could see okay. From may to october may fifteenth. They played here. They received one hundred dollars for playing because he did actually see where they played Day after day and that actually made it easier for me to try to track down and box scores. So let's they played may seventeenth in wilmington delaware. I could go look into wilmington. Del papers okay. There box score there. Yeah they did. They did play there Because again the black newspapers you know once a week they didn't cover every single one of their games. So then you gotta turn to the daily papers so you could follow their schedules with the Ledgers and then you could try to follow their grosses because you could see if they weren't playing at home they play usually a semi pro team hildale. So they'd go say somewhere in philly somewhere say south philly place some hotshot Semi pro team and they have what we call. It was called a guarantee. So you know you show up. You're guaranteed one hundred bucks so they play for one hundred dollars that night On the weekends their their financials will be based on how much they would grow at their own home park and you could actually see attendance. You could see okay. They sell two thousand and fifty cents seats. They sold one hundred and fifty dollars. You could actually see it. Broken down Very precisely which was interesting to me to see what they were. Drawing in those days The biggest days for hillsdale as far as their attendance for home games where the holidays. It was july fourth album. Oriel day and labor day have doubleheaders at home and they would. They would usually bring a six seven eight thousand people. So that's those were. There are probably their big money days During the year in those in those seasons. And i i'm guessing. The the financials kind of Fairly quickly Also pointed to their relative success and or their their needs when it came to quote unquote being pro. Right being part of a league or not right. And we've we've learned a lot of of the the early teams That populated what became then Honest to goodness leagues right in. And we also know how relatively shaky some of those leagues were too but independence right to barnstorming a putting their own schedules together. Right which you know. I it seems to me. The hildale kind of an amateur and then into a semi or fully pro kind of thing was kind of a traveling team so to speak even without a league or as leagues came and went decided to either be part of or affiliated or not. I'm guessing based on the financials that kind of told them whether it.
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"hildale" Discussed on Good Seats Still Available
"To me there. And i'm an armchair historian so p- fair disclosure right but to me. There are like three books that are essential for anybody's negro leagues understanding. If you wanna call them primers or whatever right We had dan rogerson on a couple of months back with his book. And and certainly robert peterson's book only the ball was white Is is up there too. But i think yours is absolutely Something that should be sandwiched in between those books. Because i can't i for the life of we have not found anything that has been as comprehensive and as detailed in one compact package than your book negro league baseball the rise and ruin of a black institution. And knowing that as you're. I guess you're calling card on this topic. I was pleasantly surprised to find that. You've you've actually did a book on one of these particular teams that hildale club and that's the that's the kind of topic i wanted to kind of get into this conversation but but maybe as a starting point maybe you can kind of give our audience. Maybe a little bit of a road of of who you are how you got to That essential thome number one and just the negro leagues hit your radar. And and why it's such a you know a big deal in your professional life has been so far first of all. It's very kind of you to put me on the mount rushmore of negro league books. I would say only probably 'cause i made crazy person who who was Researching to such a degree. When i put together negro league baseball because when i look at it myself now i'm like i really dig up all this stuff. This is like obsessive. And i think when i wrote the book it was sort of a desire to put together You know the background of a story that had not been told i think in that details i think that was my my own desire at the time but coming back to my own history at how how i got into the negro leagues. I mean i grew up in new england as a very big baseball fan. I'm still a huge baseball fan today. And i was a red sox fan. So i was always interested in baseball and i was always interested in history. And that kind of led me into my. You know my undergraduate path. English major but then i ended up majoring in history and graduate school But in between my undergraduate and graduate career. I was kind of looking for something to do and i saw an ad by john hollway name. That might mean something to your listeners. Sean hallway was one of the first to really do negro league work. He did a wonderful a batch of interviews in the sixties and seventies and preserve the lobbies voices. That had never been a record before. See a lot of negro league. People but hallway was also doing statistics so he was having people you know. Various parts of the country go into their local libraries. And sort of look for negro league games. Just kinda documentum. So he could. Do you know he could assemble statistics..
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"hildale" Discussed on Good Seats Still Available
"And we're talking not only for great sports teams and leagues of your But all kinds of collections in and around the rim pop culture We're talking about You know halloween memories dead malls beer from various cities and regions in the country amusement parks you may have remembered that are no longer with us. Nightclubs radio stations and restaurants. Tv shows of local interest and memories stadiums and all those kinds of things and not just of of cities and regions but national as well but of course tons of great stuff in the rav sports. Luckily for us this week negro league baseball. There's an entire collection of a few dozen great shirts with great logos of lots of different teams From the various Negro leagues out there. And they're all fully licensed by the negro league baseball museum. So you're doing good by supporting that museum when you make a purchase of one or hopefully many more of these great shirts from old school shirts dot com and again in the negro league baseball collection. And they're just they're just i can. I'm scrolling now and they're just all kinds of great teams now. Interestingly not one for hildale the hildale club. Now we're going to get into maybe some of the reasons to why that's the case not conveniently a logo. Is this hildale club team. Yeah they wore uniforms. That were distinct and and use the h. logo or asia letter in their in their But there really wasn't much of a logo per se perhaps like some of these other clubs a did so maybe at some point. The negro league Baseball museum an old school shirts. Dot com can put their heads together and maybe create one a lovingly crafted one Commemorating the hill club. But look if you're If you wanna see tons of other great teams and commemorate those or some of the league's you know for example the east west league or the a negro national league or the negro american league. Some of these were leased that he'll dell did play in. So you can commemorate them in that their eastern color league for example. They're all.
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"hildale" Discussed on Good Seats Still Available
"Pop lloyd martin daego All of these players are enshrined baseball's of fame and arguably perhaps some other other players. That could come now. That major league baseball has a raised Negro leagues test into equality finally and long overdue Neal's Book that talks about the particular topic of the hildale club is a fascinating read. It's called fair dealing and clean playing the hildale club and the development of black professional baseball from nineteen ten and nineteen thirty two And that is The the bulk of what will be Sort of delving into in our conversation this week but kneels in the negro league thome And category is probably You know the probably the top two or three books out there. If you are just even remotely interested in negro league history one of those books Of course We talked about with. Don rogerson that being the titled Book invisible men. That's absolutely crucial for your introductory negro league library. The other one is only. The ball was white by rob peterson. Robert peterson please. Let's before about it but the other book you need to have in that sort of troika of your necessary collection is neal's other book. It is probably the most comprehensive And and Meticulously researched compendium. And there are a lot of books at nikolic's don't get me wrong but this one's probably an essential reference and Introductory read it's negro league baseball. The rise in ruin of a black institutions will here in our conversation with neil coming up a lot of that book and the hildale club exploration that will be talking about. was rooted in neal's research around the economics of this team and these teams and leagues and uniquely neal was able to sort of dig up in his research. about Some of the the records of this hildale club which were luckily preserved We're talking about like gate receipts and The the finances and all that kind of stuff. And it's a real real dig into the realities of running club like hildale in those days and not very many back office records for these teams are really out there. Yeah there's some you know. Obviously there's a decent amount of of coverage of the games in the african american newspapers of day and that kind of stuff and the field play statistics and that kind of stuff and even those are not necessarily well organized and easily found but even harder to find our actual records of the bookkeeping and the finances and and how how these teams were literally run. And that's sort of the basis from which neil grew not only is interested in the negro leagues generally but In particular this hildale club which is fascinating not only on the field exploits but frankly some off-field wants to We get some very interesting topics like ed..
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"hildale" Discussed on Good Seats Still Available
"Actually they changed the name briefly to quakers which you know was kind of funny because there had been other teams called the quakers. In addition to penn there's some Pro teams called the quakers to the the the spas and then the warriors were called briefly. The quakers somebody wanted to change their named phillies. Which would have been kinda stupid. I think since there was already a team called that but yeah they they They had a lot of the good players from the city on it. And you know. I interviewed some of these guys because they were still around and they had they had great stories to tell about those years and Like i say some one. Onto the warriors in played there but you know and just godly was just so so tightly wound into these things and the you know the stars or the philadelphia stars. That was another area that he was really in deep into and Time to be that involved with with the the the negro national league the second version of that And the stars franchise. I'm guessing that had something to do with what you alluded to earlier. Sort of that. Sunday blue law thing because you know a lot of the negro league teams obviously needed to play or we're playing in major league stadiums when they're quote unquote home tenants. Were on the road right so we can dates mattered. In sunday's were half of those dates right well. The philly teams and philadelphia actually has had negro league team since the early nineteen hundreds and a at one point along. The way team called hildale was formed and They were formed in nineteen ten and later We're part of the several leagues actually But we're Very substantial team that played in delaware county near Field was not too far from where i live and they as well as the stars who were formed a couple years after the hildale team folded they would play on mondays and the Philadelphia ballparks whether it was the as part of the phillies pork They would often play a doubleheaders on mondays. Because back then. Monday was a day off for major league. Baseball teams mostly and so the stadiums were open and the owners would run them out and typically The teams The games would would draw good. Chunk fans ten. Fifteen thousand fans would come to their games which they couldn't get any other time because their first of all stadiums weren't large enough and secondly they had they had to play You know during during the week or during a day people were working and so forth so they can play.