20 Episode results for "George Mitchell"

Dust to Dust | Chapter 3

Boomtown

36:54 min | 8 months ago

Dust to Dust | Chapter 3

"In Texas is where hopes and dreams come true David Arrington would know. He's an independent oilman. Dan and something of a legend in the permian a while back. He hired an architect to design the biggest house in Midland which clocks in at some ten thousand square feet. That's where he stores his antique cars. Most of his ansel Adams photography collection. He's actually the largest private collector of ansel Adams in the country. The House also has a few unusual amenities. Well I. It's it's a country French house It's pretty big. It's four stories it has a slide in it so it's got this slide like you haven't McDonald's but it's the it's the lack of tube and goes to the attic and then comes underneath the stairs and the coke laws the slide is like something straight out of a movie like Richie rich or blank. Check a rich kids fantasy. Come to life at forty two in feet tall it starts on the fourth floor and spirals down to the first. Everybody asked me if I build that for the kids and I was like well. No build it for me. But they're more than welcome to use it. Wild catting has always been a magnet for eccentric personalities. And David Harrington is one of the most flamboyant oilman midland has ever seen every year on Easter morning. He Dons Bunny suit and drives around town in his red nineteen sixty four Mustang stopping shopping at his friend's houses to deliver candy to their kids. He actually stole the idea from a friend. I kind of improved on a little bit. I got a really cool rule. Easter bunny suit. His was a little scary and mine was really Kinda friendly fluffy one. I had this nineteen sixty four and a half convertible Mustang and so the Easter Bunny would get up before dawn and the the families. He'd probably see ten or twenty families and I knew he was coming so he would come and eat. He'd have gifts and everything he'd he'd knock on their door and the kids would be there in the mom and dad would be there and we'd take pictures and all that and and You know and he do that for a couple of hours. Tuna come on go to church like the slide in his house. ARRINGTON Easter Bunny visits aren't just for kids are member. There's this one and bank and they were in a conference meeting and they wouldn't. They wouldn't let Easter Bunny and so but Easter bunny pushed through in and opened the doors to every bodies bodies sugar in. And there's this one guy who was kind of the fuddy-duddy and he never smiled in the Easter Bunny went and sat in his lap and everybody everybody in the courtroom fell on the floor laughing that that's one of my better memories of Easter Buddy. I'm not sure that God knows who that was was or if I'm ever going to confess to it but for Arrington and others in the oil industry it wasn't always like this. When Arrington I showed up in midland the Permian was in the midst of what many considered to be the worst bust of all time a bus so bad? The many of the richest folks in town lost almost everything overnight. The financial fallout routinely made national headlines. There have been oil bust but never anything like this. American consumers are enjoying the benefits over supply and lower prices. The oil business in this country is hurting. The only people in Gustav making money were bankruptcy of all your. Your buildings are unoccupied states. Boom has gone bust I'm crucial Wallis in. This've boom podcast about the ordinary people behind the historic old boom splaying hang out in the Permian Basin right now. Last week we explored the rise of the Permian how the people in that dusty desolate patch of West Texas came to shape American can politics culture and the economy this week we explore the region's biggest bust and take a look at how he went from utter devastation into the biggest old boom Texas has ever seen this is episode three dust to dust The Permian Basin has always been vulnerable to the boom and bust cycles of the oil industry. But in the early eighties times were good. Really good. Lead prices had shot up in the late seventies and midland the financial capital of the Permian quickly became one of the richest cities per capita in the country. There is a river of money flowing through town and plenty of folks who are dying to flaunted high end department stores bought space at the Mall and a Rolls Royce dealership. Ship opened near the airport. In nineteen eighty two eight midland oilman were included in the very first Forbes. Four hundred list of richest Americans which is pretty incredible. Given the fact that the town's population was only seventy thousand at the time but soon after that issue of Forbes hit newsstands the high times is came to a screeching halt Saudis. Get restless and they decide. Hey we don't want other people taking market share this. This is Dr Dianna Hinton the Midland Base historian. You probably remember from the last episode. Dr Hinton says that in the early eighties a sudden influx of all from a new reserves around the world including Mexico in the North Sea began to enter the market. This glut threatened to disrupt OPEC's grip on the oil economy. The OPEC countries responded by ramping up their own production. There's more and more Saudi oil. On the market. The market rapidly gets overloaded. Loaded OPEC hoped that by flooding the market it would drive the price of oil down and knock other global competitors out of the old business so in other the words. The Saudis say. We're going to allow our oil to become cheaper than other people's by giving rebates on what people buy from us it works WCHS. The price of oil did plummet as a result. The previously high flying Midland was on the brink of collapse on October fourteenth. Nineteen eighty-three the three Midland's first national bank. which had been dishing out loans to all men candy on Halloween? Shut its doors. It was the second largest independent bank failure while you're in the country. The Rolls Royce dealership closed down to there were so many oil companies that went out of business. The Midland's downtown buildings were said to be see through a common joke in the eighties. Was What do you call a geologist and midland. Hey waiter on things began to turn down. There were any number of jokes. It's about that situation. The first one to surface was when you owe your banker a hundred thousand dollars you stay awake at night when you owe your banker million dollars. Your banker stays awake. At night. The banks would foreclose on drilling companies and repossess the equipment. Both no holes to drill. All those expensive rigs were worthless and more banks folded and were taken over by the FDIC. Another joke cropped up. WHO's the biggest drilling company in Texas the FDIC? Dr Ryan Remembers having to keep cash on hand as one bank after another was shut down. You go down to the bank and you'd get enough money to last you five days or a week you put it in another bank. That isn't going belly up yet. And then when your bank is shutdown so the FDIC can takeover You have money to get along until the FDIC can allow you access to the money you had in back number what we did this two or three times. Some folks in the Permian turn to a higher source. The bumper sticker appeared on cars. Please God please let there be another oil boom. I promise I won't Piss everything away. This time. I was the way it was and a lot. A lot of people had to find jobs outside the industry. Many more people just tried to find jobs in Houston Moved to Dallas move to anywhere. A few almond managed to scrape a living together and make it work. One of those was Dave Harrington Harrington was an energetic sandy-haired Andy haired former high school cheerleader from Dallas. He was a student at Texas Tech University. When the bust I hit the Permian? But the region sudden dire straits straights only amplified his fascination with all business. He'd seen the movie giant and was enthralled by Jett rink the swaggering wildcatter played lead by James Dean. Miana on you ever thought of having took Arrington was determined to make his way into the industry his senior in your year at tech he applied to dozens of all companies. But I had twenty seven job interviews and I twenty. Eight rejections I I've got to rejection letters from getty oil us like we really don't want source any rejection letters. He finally managed to snag a job as a rookie key. Landman for a tiny oil company. He arrived in Midland in the summer of Nineteen eighty-four right about the time the crisis reached. Its Apex Yes nineteen eighty-four. It was bad First National Bank had had failed a few years earlier Always kind of joke. The people loved loved me. Come into town and it was a little unusual. Because I didn't know anybody figured out real quick I had the only u-haul was coming in and they wanted didn't selected Lee Errington began spinning spare time in Midland subsurface library researching all prospects. That's where he found some promising acreage near the tiny town of kermit about an hour west of Midland. And I put together my own prospect. Jake now I'm not a geologist but but I just read the books talked. Geology is not that easy because it's not But I just use a little common sense and I put together a prospect over south the current and then tried to sell the deal. An acquaintance told him how to go about securing an investment. He explained to me by third for corner. and which means you get three people to put up a third of the cost of drilling a well and then they each in a quarter of it and I get a free quarter for putting together the idea. Of course nobody was buying any deals. I always joke that I was turned man so many times I felt like a bitch brand. He eventually knocked on enough doors to lineup. The investors he needed to move forward on the deal and out remember call. Oh Mom and dad and then I sold the Alaso sad and then on the way out of town because I was actually living in Lubbock and midland at the time zones to him and now is kind of that time I and Hannah did so stop by the Church's Fried Chicken. That's still here on big spring street in there's homeless man there and I on he's begging said we'll give you money but I'll I'll give dinner so I had my first celebratory dinner from I old alive or solve with the homeless man. Church's fried chicken their own. Big Springs one of my good memories from there. He contracted with another other company to drill a well. To the surprise of many he actually struck oil Arrington stood by the will leaped into the air shouted and did Turkey. The classic chillier movie probably seen it every high school football game. ARRINGTON soon became Midland's boy wonder but times were. It's still hard. Even for him he reinvested all of his money back into drilling new wells and buying up more leases Unfortunately there weren't all successful and so but you just hope that the good ones outweigh the beds and so they don't call me drought day for nothing so I drove my share travels You know a and I'm always asked about that. My Wife's always gonNA comments on that I don't like growls. But but they sure don't have state me and is not the end of the world and and they don't really get me down you just have to distress yourself off and keep on going because counterpart of so if if a drawl get you down. You're in the wrong all business in the mid eighties. Another devastating bust ravaged the permian. This time around Arrington almost lost his shirt so every bust is different. It's different for different reasons. And they've always been that way. The one in eighty eight was price. You know that bust the process owner now like eight dollars and seventy five cents so so nothing was economic to go drill. Well if I'm not going to go you know be able to go drill. Any wells will the drilling company. Can't hire anybody because they're drilling rigs not running all the buildings at that these different companies are renting all of a sudden. They can't pay the rent anymore or so now than I am and it just it just really has a domino effect somehow arrington managed to hang on. You know it was Kinda scary. I remember at that the Tom how many employees are probably four or five years and I do remember specific every morning it was must have been a psychological deal but every morning running when I would grab the handle for the shower in the book is always take share in the morning. When I grabbed the handle I would feel like throwing up every morning? How going to make payroll? How Speaker County? Golly it was a lot of pressure for a young man while Arrington Antony eked out a living for himself and small company. Those around him weren't so lucky. Here's Dr Hinton again. I had never seen anything like this. During the boom people had put in a new country club big golf course and there were expensive homes out there. They were multi-storey. And you you drove up in that area and on nearly every block there would be a foreclosure site for sale foreclosure for sale for closure for sale for closure but the thing that sticks in my mind most is land. We went up to a new shopping center on North Big Spring. It was called mission in square in one thousand nine hundred eighty seven in March and the tumbleweeds were up to the EAVES. Now I had never seen anything like that before in my life for one thing I had never seen that many tumbleweeds in one place in life but it was absolutely unbelievable. This is the Permian Basin. I grew up in. I never knew the good old days of gushers extravagant wealth I was a child at the bust lost. My Dad was born in nineteen sixty four and grew up on a small ranch near Andrews like many of his peers. He started working in the oil field while he was still in high high school but after he graduated the bus in Nineteen eighty-four forced him to look elsewhere for work. He went west to Arizona later to California drawing a paycheck H.. Check by working on construction sites. The months after I was born in nineteen eighty eight my parents returned to Andrews. My Dad took a job with the city. One of the few employers in town steady work as I grew up in Andrews the oil fields that surround. The town became an extension of my playgrounds. My my friends and I would shoot coke bottles. In those fields. We dug elaborate trenches between the mesquite trees through dirt claws at rattlesnakes. We rode our a bike for hours. Down Dusty Rhodes and ate our sandwiches in the shade of Fiberglass tanks my elementary school and other schools in Andrews were renamed after the various rock formations that blessed the town with crew. During the summer we watch Midland's Minor League baseball team. Their Mascot Ascott was Iraq counts West Texas sling for the geologist to hunt for crude. When I was a kid people were more likely to leave of Andrew's than to move in a few visitors who came to town wrinkle their noses at this hour stench of gas but the smell really didn't offend in Minos I'd grown accustomed to it when there is a strong whiff of it on the win I just mimicked? The elders and take an exaggerated sniff. Smells like money. In High School. We heard the city kids had house barks. We did things a little differently. We had pump Jack parties on a Friday night. Someone would say meet me after the game at the Bush machine and everyone knew exactly which pump Jack they were talking about on one of these weekend nights. A buddy of mine decided to ride the Bush machine he straddled the pump Jack like it was a bucking bull and like a real the pump Jack Buck democracy. He sprained his wrist. Pretty bad from the fall but most nights passed without incident. Just a few bored. Teenagers are trucks parked Arctic circle around a pump. Jack Drinking Beer we had stolen from ice chests left in the beds of company trucks. Listening to George Strait or Tom Petty Smoking Marlboro Twenty Sevens and talking about what we were going to do when we left this town. Of course back when I was still a kid I had no notion of how geopolitics uh-huh politics affected the fortunes of Andrews. How the economic principles of Supply and demand could make it harder for a local family to put food on the table? But my friends and I got used to hearing the dolts discussed the price of West Texas crude. The Way folks in other places talk about the weather. It didn't take long for us to understand. Understand what those figures mint. We grew up on stories about former boom times and heard plenty of horror tells about previous busts stories stories of men killing themselves on the patch after losing everything. There's one story that stuck with me. A friend's Dad told us that he wants drove to drilling location location in a remote part of the patch when he pulled up a white company truck was parked there. He noticed a hose running from the exhaust pipe into the CAP. There was a man slumped over in the driver's seat. The trucks speakers were still blasting aerosmith's dream all the dead man had put the song on repeat for the fumes made him pass out throughout the nineties. Midland's independent companies. He's had just plotted along many of them getting by on the oil coming up from wells. They'd already drilled by nineteen ninety nine. Most of the major companies like Exxon sonning Gulf had vacated their West Texas offices. They'd given up on the Permian. Just forty three rigs were left working across the region. Even David Arrington Barrington decided to sell most of his perm properties. But by the mid two thousand there was a major paradigm shift in the industry. Ever heard of fracking working. Well it all started with a quiet unassuming Texas oilman named George Mitchell. George Mitchell didn't invent hydraulic fracturing drink or fracking. It was first attempted in the late forties. The Permian Basin Petroleum Museum in Midland is a multi million dollar owed to the history of the Texas Zoll. Business it even has its own hall of fame a place to enshrine those who've made the most profound contributions to the oil and gas industry. I've spent a a good deal of time at the museum and often passed the portrait of George Mitchell. We'll talk about Mitchell more in a later episode but for now. Here's the most important thing to go about him. Combined with horizontal drilling George Mitchell's fracturing technique caused a new boom in the industry and has been called this century's biggest and most important Korten energy innovation which is quite a claim but in the annals of famous oilman George. Mitchell doesn't quite fit the stereotype. I don't actually know where he is physically in the hall of fame But I would imagine he's kind of off you know in a quiet corner somewhere. Ramming that's author Lorne. Steffi who recently published a biography of Mitchell's. It's kind of by the way Lauren was joking. Mitchell's legacy is presented center stage at the Petroleum Museum right alongside the other classic Boisterous Texas oil at least figuratively speaking. You know he didn't have this kind of larger than life personality. He wasn't Glenn McCarthy. He was an Oscar. Wyatt or Boone pickens or any of these guys is. He didn't have that kind of swaggering image. You know big hats big boots you know money flying out the window as you drive down the road. That wasn't him at all. But what Mitchell acton swagger swagger he made up for envision Mitchell is often called the father of fracking fracking was basically a process of just cracking open rock to so you get more oil gas out of it. I'm sure you've heard the term thrown around. But fracking differs from conventional drilling in a couple of key ways. It's just briefly. Describe that process I will. I will do so with a disclaimer that I am not a petroleum engineer or geologist. So I will tell you by understanding of it in you know from interviewing those people but basically you know with a conventional well you. You've drill vertically down into a reservoir which is sort of like puncturing underground balloon almost and oil the pressure forces you allow with fracking. You're trying to open up shale formations. which are it's kind of like drilling into a blackboard? It's very dense rock. And once you drill the hole then you inject water sand and and various chemicals into the well bore and an and that then causes tiny fractures to occur in the shale the water sheets into those fractures to sand the grains of sand actually propped them open. That's how small they are and oil gas is able to to come out right one. One thing I hear repeated out in West Texas a lot is the concrete in your driveway. Way Is is more porous than what we're getting oil out of these days fracking itself wasn't new technology. It had been used in some primitive capacities all all the way back to the late. Eighteen hundreds but George Mitchell believes that with fracking. You could unlock those stingy. Shell formations beginning in nineteen eighty one Mitchell's company. Mitchell energy began experimenting with fracking formulas. In Barnet Shell which is a natural gas producing region west of Fort Worth at the time. I'm a lot of the folks in the industry. Thought he was crazy. And you know there are a lot of skeptics. Even within the company they just didn't think it was going to work but they they kept at it because because Mitchell energy was a unique company was publicly traded but George Mitchell had Basically overriding voting stock. So he had the final say on everything. Everything that happened you know. Most public companies would have to keep their shareholders happy but in his case if you bought a commonly traded share of Mitchell energy you were basically we buy into Georgia vision and and you better like it. Because you know he wasn't GonNa Waiver and so he was determined to keep this going because he felt like if we can find gas where we already we have all this infrastructure that our problems are solved right. We can keep this whole thing going for a long time. It looked like Mitchell's doubters. Right years passed without promising using results. It really took like a lot of trial and error and the company had almost given up. Actually the company was going through tough times they had layoffs. The pressure on Mitchell will was mounting was big conflict within the company by that point that they wanted to just shut down the whole project because it was just a waste of money. Engineers and Mitchell's company dreaded getting getting stuck on the fracking project. They called it Mitchell Siberia. But one of the engineers a soft-spoken thirty one year old name Nick. Stein's Burger decided decided to make the best of it up to that point. Mitchell energy had been using inexpensive jill to blast into the shell along with sand but Stein's burgers started questioning the basic ingredients. That's when he happened to attend a Texas Rangers Baseball game with a few friends from the industry and they told him. Oh yeah they had done this fracking job in East Texas where they use water instead of gels cycle. That's kind of crazy. Water is not supposed to work because it won't hold the sand in place I can work. Stein's Burger Convinced Mitchell energy to let him try something new on three wells he'd use a water based concoction instead of jail. All three wells were failures but he started thinking about it and he he realized what if you tweak the recipe what if you don't put all the sand and it wants if you know and so he convinced them to give them three more and they basically said okay but this is it. It was a true Hill Mary and so he tried to the the last three. And one of them Just was off the charts so they realized they had something. After almost twenty years of trying and failing Mitchell's project project finally paid off and it paid off in a very big way in two thousand one. Mitchell sold his company to Devon Energy for three point one a billion dollars soon other companies were applying the same fracking techniques to wells in the Permian Basin. We we always knew there was oil on gas in shale but nobody knew how to get it out and so the fact that it was there. It didn't matter you had to sort of wait for it to migrate into softer more. Porous rock like limestone and and that took thousands of years so Once once it played out it was played out and everybody was thinking in the mid two thousand by two thousand seven owner. So we'll the premiums pretty much done I mean we've taken all weekend from it. And then fracking enabled companies to go in and find a whole new level of reserves. I that that are even bigger than what was before so it was really unbelievable. It's really that the innovation of fracking combined with Donald Drilling of course which is what enables tale to become commercially. Viable horizontal. Drilling was yet another game changer. On the hills of the fracking innovation. Lauren explains it like this. Think think of the oil producing rock formations underground as a form of layer cake. You actually drill down and find L. Era frosting and then you angle the dro bed and you just go along it as you drill horizontally into that layer of frosting you can now suck the frosting from the entire layer. Add this technique to fracking. And you get more oil a lot more oil. It just so happened that at the time all prices were high and remember. It's two thousand eight by now. All the financial crisis was in full swing which meant that interest rates had been pushed. Historically low. All companies could send Li Afford to borrow tons of money to try out these new fracking drilling techniques. The shell boom was on in two thousand twelve stories of the boom reached. Chm Me while I was attending Grad School in Ireland. I had racked up some student debt while abroad so I decided to return home and earn some money in the patch. A spent two thousand and thirteen working for a small independent oil company Andrews. My duties included hauling parts too far flung locations and rough necking on a workover rig. I think if you don't know what a workover rig is don't worry we'll get into that in the next episode but by the end of that year I'd made a pretty good dent in my student loans. But after a few close calls on the rig and too many eighty hour workweeks out in the elements. I decided to retire from the old patch. It turned out to be a good time to get out of the oil industry OPEC responded to the US. Shell boom much like they had responded in the eighties. By flooding. The market with Middle Eastern oil in January two thousand fifteen the price of West Texas crude Sancta less than half of what it had been a year before purse-strings across West Texas Titan and by a December two thousand sixteen more than one hundred American oil and gas companies almost half of them based in Texas had filed for bankruptcy some workers. Who would come to to the region seeking their fortune abandoned their vehicles at the Midland airport before they boarded their flight back home is seemed as if the Permian Basin had finally only seen its last big HURRAH? Then something happened that had never been seen in the region's long history of booms and busts. Despite the low price of oil drilling in the Permian began to pick back up for one thing fracking and horizontal drilling became even more efficient in fact some estimates tomat- that all could drop to his lowest thirty three dollars per barrel and sinking new wells and certain parts of the Permian would still be profitable a scenario. That would have been pretty much unimaginable. Maginal just a few years ago. Another key factor was the lifting of a forty year embargo on crude oil exports. The order was signed by President. President Obama in December two thousand fifteen. Remember this clip from episode one. That whole suddenly America's like the biggest oil producer. That was me people. I just want you to so just say thank you please. Permian production has since rocketed from two million barrels. A day in two thousand in sixteen to more than four point five million barrels per day this November over the next four years industry experts expect the output to double again You know we're producing more oil that Saudi Arabia. Now I mean who would have thought that was possible especially in an area where we've been producing since we you know. What the Nineteen Thirties thirty? I mean You know everybody kind of thought that that department was done and now it's back bigger than the Permian now has a legitimate claim to being being the world's most productive oilfield even industry experts such as. Dr Hinton are stunned by the magnitude of this boom it really is true. The United States is now a bigger producer of oil and gas than any other country in the world. Our energy future changed one hundred eighty degrees the last two decades. We're in the position of actually being the global swing producer. We're actually in a position of doing. What the Saudis have been able to to do for a half century last November marked the first time in seventy five years that the country exported more crude oil and other petroleum liquids than imported a milestone? That's been lauded by officials across the country as an important step toward energy independence. Here's David Arrington. America has has been so successful and particularly here in the Permian Basin. We've been so successful in. Our wells are so good that we've actually rocked the world economy enemy one Windy Day last April Vice President Mike Pence torch drilling rig outside of Midland with an American flag whipping in the wind behind behind him hints stepped up to a podium and address. The small crowd assembled around to be West. Texas harm. mm-hmm energy renaissance. It's really kind of upended everything. Because we're now in a position in where we don't have to be at least as beholden to Middle East oil producers as we were in the past the way business is done in the Permian has also changed forever. Gone honor the days of wildcatters like Dave Harrington and his predecessors many of the younger big money guys are more akin to Silicon Valley Tech brose young a young Shell annuals as they've been called are more like realtors and hedge fund capitalist than the old school swashbuckling wildcatters relying on guts and grit it to make their fortunes today. ARRINGTON keeps an office in the chase building in downtown midland which overlooks the city. smattering of other tall buildings. His company which takes up the fourth-floor looks more like an art gallery than an oil business. Massive black and white ansel Adams prince line the walls in the floors gleam like Polish Mar Arrington explained that his current boom is different from any. He's seen in the past. He says the drilling for all these days is more more like a mining operation than the hit or miss crap. Shoot it used to be companies have been buying up as much land in the region is possible knowing they can drill horizontally. Get all one way or another that mostly eliminates the risk of drilling dry hole in plenty of operators have been emboldened by this. I would have people come to my office and show me at Dale and I would explain to them. That was a little more risky and cost more money than I would be willing on doing. And and then inevitably it was a young person and I would ask them if they've ever done a bad deal and they look at me like this is crazy and I wish shaw had speaker and a camera in the elevator. Because I'm sure when they got Alabama. They were laughing at me about that crazy. Oh man doesn't know what he's talking about. In most. At the time I was wrong and they ride. They made money on. It went down the road. It was bizarre because of the recent innovations in drilling officials in the permian like to say that busts are thing of the past but there are plenty of risks that have to be accounted for. We'll talk more about this shaky financial ground of the industry three in the later episode but the truth is there's a lot more to the old business than what's buried in the earth and today there are some signs that the hottest boom in history is beginning to cool off both independence. A major oil companies have already slashed their spending budgets for the next year So you're seeing the rigs being dropped which means there's less work so that means there's more pressure on all the service companies to make up for glossed prophet. We're going to get laid off. And so that really does make difficult for the market in general so there are a lot of people to spend a lot of money that we're GONNA actually lose while technology may have decreased the risk of drilling a dry hole. There still no guarantees in the oil business Improv side there is of course increasing pressure to move away from fossil fuels. Renewable energy is increasingly competitive. It's possible that the world will turn. Its back on all long before the last the drop is sucked from the Permian one truth. That's held steady for nearly one hundred bridge years. Is this in the Permian. The next bust is always around the corner next week on. Boomtown a heartbreaking tragedy and the patch and banging on the door and then I heard my brother it voice and he's saying they said there was an accident out there where junior and then working in it's not like what do you mean the rig exploded Boomtown is a CO production of imperative tired of entertainment and Texas monthly executive producer. Is Jason Hope produced engineered by Brian Standard. who also wrote the score? Boomtown on is edited by J K Nickel and Megan. CRY AND CO reported by Leaf reeks dead our theme song is written and performed by Paik. Rossi I'm your host and writer. Kershaw's Texas monthly is owned by enterprise products a midstream oil and gas company based in Houston Enterprise has no bearing on her editorial content. Don't forget to tell your friends about boomtown and leave a review on Apple. podcast if you like the show. Boomtown is a ten episode series with new episodes available every Tuesday sir follow us on social media and visit Texas monthly dot com slash. Boomtown for more on this story.

Permian Midland Texas David Arrington George Mitchell The Permian Basin West Texas midland geologist ansel Adams Dr Hinton Arrington Antony OPEC Andrews Dave Harrington Harrington
Cults Daily: The Holy Rollers Franz Edmund Creffield

Cults

06:52 min | 3 months ago

Cults Daily: The Holy Rollers Franz Edmund Creffield

"You're listening to cull staley throughout the month of April. We're just seeing the manifestoes and ideologies of some of history's most infamous cult leader Franz Edmund Crutchfield was the leader of the brides of Christ. Church often referred to as the holy rollers members. Were known to roll on the floor. Pleading for God's forgiveness if you like this episode be sure to come back tomorrow for a brand new edition of cults daily. Listen free on spotify or wherever you get your podcasts in nineteen oh six. Franz Edward Crutchfield a thirty six year old German immigrant was released from prison. Crutchfield was convinced he had now been reborn and his resurrection was his release from jail now. He was ready to rejoin his followers at the brides of Christ church in Corvallis Oregon soon after his release on April. Eighteenth nineteen th six. The San Francisco earthquake caused massive devastation terrifying the nation. Five hundred seventy two miles away. Crutchfield claim that he was the one who had dammed the city of San Francisco and God had heard his prayers and if his followers didn't do exactly as he said the city of corvallis would be next. Hi I'm Vanessa. Richardson and this is colts. Podcast original this is the twenty-fifth episode in our Daily Series on the strange prophecies made by different cults and their leaders throughout this month. Were taking a daily look at the myriad of apocalyptic predictions to try and uncover. What makes these revelations so appealing? I'm here with my co host. Greg Colson everyone. Today we're discussing Franz Edmund Crutchfield. The leader of a holy rollers cult called the brides of Christ. Church in one thousand nine hundred. Three crutchfield moved from Portland to the town of Corvallis or he claimed that God had chosen him to be his profit. He gained a following mostly consisting of women and promised they too could have the same connection with God they just needed a separate themselves from the material possessions of Earth and all of their preconceived notions of right and wrong Franz Edmund Crutchfield was a German immigrant. Although it's unclear when or why he decided to establish a life in Oregon unassuming at five foot six inches. He worked for the Salvation Army in Portland but decided to leave the organization when he felt the people weren't entirely of God crutchfield relocated corvallis eighty miles south and captivated the town with his charming hypnotic. Personality the evangelists was quick to convince the townsfolk that God revealed himself and selected Crutchfield as his prophet here on Earth after Krefeld gained recognition in the community. He began operating his church from the home of Local Citizen O. V. Hurt Krefeld had his followers convinced. They no longer needed their earthly possessions and by Destroying Them. They could be a prophet like him. The services would last all day and night. His followers mostly women and young girls burned possessions and Bonfires hurts. Front Yard. Crutchfield cleanse them by laying his hands on their naked bodies as they rolled on the floor. They loudly begged for God's forgiveness sometimes even speaking in tongues crutchfield used sleep and food deprivation as a means of breaking these women down. He convinced many of them to become estranged from their families. He then began seducing and having affairs with them in an effort to find the second mother of Christ in one thousand. Nine hundred. Four crutchfield was accused of adultery. Then a criminal offence but before he could be arrested crutchfield vanished. Authorities finally discovered him four months later hiding in a hole under hurts home. Naked and starving. Shortly after Crutchfield was sentenced to two years in prison. During crutchfield's time away many of his followers were committed to asylums to cleanse them of his spell. He was then released sometime in nineteen. Oh six but upon returning to Corvallis. He proclaimed that he had been resurrected from the dead and was going by the name of Elijah. He then singlehandedly claimed responsibility for the Nineteen O. Six San Francisco earthquake. He capitalized on the devastating event convincing his followers that this was the world's punishment for putting him in jail Coral Hartley. One of his disciples fell victim to his lies and said he condemned the city of San Francisco and brought the earthquake. He has condemned the city of Corvallis and an earthquake will destroy this place. Crutchfield then ordered all of his followers to evacuate to the coast and leave their lives behind. They did a month later on. May Seventh Nineteen O six. A man named George Mitchell took matters into his own hands. He had two sisters both victims of Crutchfield salacious prophecies and he had had enough. Mitchell found crutchfield on the streets of Sandal. That morning he shot crutchfield dead in cold blood. When Mitchell's case entered the courtroom. He was found not guilty under the circumstances but a few days after his release Mitchell met up with a sister. Esther a follower of crutchfield's out of revenge. She killed her brother for murdering her prophet. Esther Mitchell believed she had brought Justice Franz Edmund Crutchfield. She too was ruled by the court. Not guilty by reason of insanity she was admitted to a mental asylum where she remained until nineteen o nine in August of twenty nineteen a six point. Three earthquake hit just off the coast of Oregon about two hundred miles away from corvallis. Perhaps crutchfield's prediction was just one hundred thirteen years too soon but as far as we can tell the world is still standing. Thanks for listening. We'll be back tomorrow to examine the predictions of another cult. You can catch our other episodes of cults for free on spotify or wherever you listen to podcasts.

Franz Edmund Crutchfield crutchfield Crutchfield Justice Franz Edmund Crutchfie corvallis San Francisco Oregon Esther Mitchell George Mitchell spotify earthquake staley Greg Colson Krefeld Daily Series Krefeld Salvation Army Elijah Richardson
The Mitchell Paradox | Chapter 10

Boomtown

45:39 min | 6 months ago

The Mitchell Paradox | Chapter 10

"Andrew Aydin here host of the brand new podcast from H. L. N. down the hill. The Delphi murders. This is the story of teens. Abby Williams and Libby German in in February two thousand seventeen they went for a hike in Delphi. Indiana and vanished. Nearly twenty four hours later their bodies are found also found Libya's phone which has video and audio of the killer who remains on the loose down the hill the Delphi murders subscribe and listen now on Apple podcasts. It's IT's around noon. On a Tuesday January Patrick Peyton the newly sworn in mayor of Midland Stroz up to a podium beneath an arch of red and white balloons the bush convention center in the heart of downtown midland is packed with Peyton supporters. He's dressed in a dark gray suit with his hair slicked back before is Mayo run. And he spent nearly two decades working as a pasture at a local mega church when he speaks. You can still hear the fervor none of us would be wasn't to the foundations of those who've gone before us all of us and she said thanks loose does she said but now she's just realizing community calls now. We stand here to that because of the foundation for us we are the most important cities in the world. No it's not just fly walk. You realize it's not I think. Washington DC most awesome emporer sitting worlds the ones driving world. The race for Midland mayor had been one of the city's as most talked about elections in years. And for good reason as you've heard throughout the podcast the oil boom has brought unprecedented challenges to the Permian Basin Jason from the roads to the schools to crime and pollution. Even the region's biggest boosters admit that the quality of life for residents has suffered a while there is some skepticism about the longevity of this boom there plenty of experts who predict that oil and gas production will continue to grow for years to come to reap the the rewards cities across the region will have to make some major changes to exemplify this kind of bold visionary thinking Peyton Invokes folks in name. You're no doubt familiar with by now. George Mitchell often called the father of fracking people will take risks. Who else takes the West Texas? Who else take ceres to poke holes in the ground that you still can't see what's underneath there and do something great happens and we stand on the shoulders? George Soared Michigan. figure out what we do. George Mitchell is credited with innovating the fracking techniques that have turned the Permian Basin into the center of the Energy Universe and Peyton is right without George Mitchell the region would likely be a very different place but for those who know much much about Georgia's life hearing midland's new mayor invoke. His name in this way is a little jolting. Payne envisions a bright future for the Permian built built on the riches that can come from fracking. But George Mitchell did not he had a much more complicated relationship with the technology he helped to create. But that's a side of the story you don't hear so often in the Permian Basin allies with God. Bless you you are is list listen. I'm Chris Wallace and this is boomtown a podcast about the historical soon playing out right now in the Permian Basin way back in episode three. We told you the story of how George Mitchell's company. Innovated fracking racking in the late. Nineteen nineties in this episode. We take a closer look at the life of George Mitchell. He's arguably one of the most important figures of the last century knoll man since John D. Rockefeller has had a greater in back. We consider what his legacy says about the future of energy and the plan. I was this week by reporter. Mitch borden one of our friends. MARFA public radio. You'll hear Mitch Voids timer to this is so so tin the Mitchell Paradox George. Mitchell wasn't your classic swaggering wildcatter. In fact at first first glance. He was kind of boring when I started doing the book. I wondered if if I was going to actually be able to have a book there you know this. Does this guy have enough of a personality to really carry carry it through. That's Lauren. Steffi a journalist who recently published a biography called George P Mitchell fracking sustainability in an unorthodox quest us to save the planet. You might remember hearing from Lauren back in episode three. Lauren says that George was straight laced compared to other Texas wildcatters but the more or Lauren learned about George the more he realized that. This bookish mild-mannered man was actually fascinating But when you start looking into into you know this. Intellectual curiosity had on so many fronts. It's really kind of captivating. I mean he found so many things interesting when he found something interesting he would just start you. You know putting resources towards it to see what he could do which is really kind of not something you see a lot these days In the business world he could have had a private jet if he wanted it he could have had a fancy. It's a yacht But instead he put his money into you know solving really big problems trying to stand really big issues and thinking fifty years down the road. What the world going to be you like? How are we going to? How are we going to solve the problem with with population growth on a planet of finite resources? Those are the things he spent his time thinking about. As opposed to you. Know How do I make my next million. That mindset grew in part from a difficult childhood. His parents Mike and Katina were Greek immigrants. Both were illiterate it before making their way to America Mike had been a goat herder in Greece Father it actually emigrated from Greece when when he was about. Nineteen years old and came into New York can actually went to work for the railroads. His name was Savar paraskevas apples and and so you wonder how did how did this. Greek family get you know today Mitchell. he was working on the railroad. There are several variations of the story. But the gist of it is he. He went to get his first paycheck. The paymaster asked his name and he said Savant Paris Capellas and the pay bathrooms like no. I can't say I can't spell it and if you don't do something I'm GonNa fire you. And so he said well what's your name and the guy said well. My Name's Mike Mitchell. He's like hey that's my name too. What a coincidence with his newly adopted name Mike and Katina Tina moved to Galveston Texas? The city is located on a barrier island in the Gulf coast about an hour south of Houston George was born there in nineteen nineteen. The same year prohibition was passed. He was the third of four kids at the time Galveston was still recovering from the great storm of nineteen hundred a hurricane. It remains the deadliest natural disaster in American history. It had also developed a reputation for being a rowdy port town. This was kind of the wild old. You know rough and tumble days of Galveston. It was known as the Free State of Galveston gambling. Prostitution and organized crime flourished in Fact Act Galveston was a lot like the old patch boom towns of that era during prohibition it became a haven for rum runners ships loaded with liquor from Caribbean. Caribbean ports would sneak into uncontrolled peers along Galveston Bay. Tusa Cillian brother's named Salmon Rodeo Moscow were among the most notorious mobsters lobsters of their time. They ran their listen empire from Galveston. They're infamous lounge. The BALANESE room attracted well heeled patrons like Frank Sinatra Entre Howard Hughes and plenty of old earns so the macy's were a couple of Sicilian immigrants who came to galveston early nineteen hundreds about the same time Mike dead and they started out Ah Barbers In fact they cut the Mitchell boys hair. Sam As you cut their hair at Murdoch's pier and they just Grew to a lot of influence. Let's say they ran Some nightclubs and eventually the valley's ballroom which is a famous Site is not there anymore wiped out in Hurricane Ike but if you're Z. Z.. Top Fan they wrote a song about it. The Moscow's were eventually busted by the Texas Rangers in the fifties but at the time they were community. Heroes Rose they donated money to build churches and passed out presence at Christmas. Mike Mitchell got to know the Moscow's well and he was a regular presence in their gambling parlors or lease though he was uneducated. Mike was resourceful in charismatic. He was really a character. I mean he kind of got by his wits Had never had any formal schooling schooling But he started closed pressing business and and you know kind of did little little businesses going here and there to make money he and he. He was very likable guy. And he knew a lot of people in town Including a Lotta lawyers and bankers still. The family was often barely scraping gaping. Bhai he was not well off. I mean you know they they sort of got by but it was. It was always a struggle and I I think that growing up as a child he was very aware of the financial national struggles with the family. I mean you know. He would oftentimes get up when his when he was eight or nine years old he would get up and go to the the seawall and catch some fish and bring them home. Give them to his mom And then she would you know that that would be dinner. And then he'd he'd go off to school and if you're catching fish for dinner Before you go to school you're probably pretty tuned into the fact that that you you know maybe in the French right. George wasn't like his gregarious father. He tended to keep to himself. The legend goes that he had read all the books in the city library by the time us fourteen but he also spent a lot of time outside exploring the islands lagoons and beaches and also when he who was a child. He told all of us that at one point he wanted to be an astronomer. He just would look up at the stars and wonder what is going on out there. That's meredith it. Drives the second oldest of Mitchell's tin children. She remembers her father as a loving but perplexing figure he was kind of like Mr Magoo round the house and one time really this crazy story but we were talking about dark energy and And some astronomy subjects My Dad why are you interested in dark energy and he said well if we can figure out what it is. We can harness it for energy. Oh my God Dad. You're just out you're out of your mind but that's the way he thought it was always like. Well what is this inlet safe. We use it. It can be an alternative to fossil fuels when George was thirteen tragedy struck. His mother passed away after suffering a sudden stroke so After his mother died You know the the two older boys John and Kristy world enough. They kind of fend for themselves but George and his sister Maria were still pretty young and Mike. You know wasn't really really prepared to to care for two little kids by himself. And he was also soon after he was hit by a car and broke his leg supposedly in twenty two places. Maybe not quite that many but but That's the way he tells the story. George went to live with an aunt uncle on the mainland in a tiny town outside of Houston called Dickinson. His younger sister Maria was sent away to live with relatives and San Antonio. Here's his daughter Meredith again and I think that affected them just terribly because the family was divided Vita that that point and he went to live with the knuckle and his younger sister. My Aunt Maria went live with another set of Aunts and uncles and it just really broke up the family at that point and I don't think he ever quite recovered from that that grief frankly in a letter to assist her Maria a few years later George wrote words cannot describe the feeling I have in me now I to fill the longing for mother someone I can go to some place second call home. Keeping family close would become a driving factor for the rest of Georgia's alive in even after the death of his mother. Her influence on George was profound. She wanted him to become a doctor so he he actually he graduated from high school early. he was sixteen years old and he applied to Rice Ace and got accepted But they told him you know you're you're too young you you need to take a year and grow up a little bit and then come back now that we're well past the start of the New Year it's easy to fall back into old habits and forget our resolutions especially when it comes to money as most most of us have found out the hard way getting into debt is easy and getting out of debt is hard especially if your credit score is great. UPSTART DOT COM is here to help. Health upstart is the revolutionary lending platform. The knows you're more than just your credit score. They offer smart interest rates. Help you pay off. High interest credit card debt upstart goes beyond the traditional credit score when evaluating your credit worthiness and they actually reward you based on other factors like your education and job history you in the form of a smarter interest rate plus they make it fast and easy to check your rate since it's a softball it won't affect your credit score for yourself so from the burden of high interest credit card debt by consolidating everything into one monthly payment with upstart. See why start is ranked number one in their category with over for three hundred businesses on trust pilot and hurried up start dot com slash boomtown to find out how low Europe start rate is checking your it only takes a few minutes. That's upstart dot com slash boomtown Andrew Aydin here host the brand new podcast from H. L. N. down the hill the Delphi murders. This is the story of teens. Abby Williams and Libby German in February two thousand seventeen they went for a hike in Delphi. Indiana and vanished nearly twenty four hours later. Their bodies are found also found lease phone which has video and audio of the killer who remains on the loose down the hill Delphi. Murders subscribe and listen now on Apple. PODCASTS George took the year as an opportunity unity to see a bit more of the world. He went east to Louisiana to live with his older brother. Johnny Johnny was working on rigs and the swampy Gulf coast oilfields at the time and it was there. The George got his first taste of the patch working as a roused about moving pipe and doing grunt work. And just you know fell in. I love the oil business and he started thinking about medical school. He'd also always had a love of astronomy but he. I think you know the that childhood. The financial hardships of his childhood hood really kind of made them focus on. How do I make a living? And he always said he decided to go go into oil gas because he wanted to be in a field where he could. He earned some money at the end of the year. Mitchell decided it in not enroll at rice. After all instead he went to Texas A. and M. to become an aggie there he studied geology and was part of the first wave of true group petroleum engineers. The Rock counts had been sniffing for crude for over a century binding and extracting all was just becoming its own academic field field of study. George was the top of his class. He also served as a cadet in the schools military core amd played on the tennis team but he he was constantly wracked with worry over money. It was a constant struggle. He was always threatened with with being kicked out because he couldn't pay his bills. He would call his dad and he'd send his dad his grades and he'd say you know data. I'm really they're about to kick me out. I need I need you know forty dollars. Whatever twenty five dollars and So his father would go go to Sam missio and he would say you. Look my son's at the top of his class but he's going to get kicked out. He needs some help. Can you give me a hundred dollars in San would give them Mike. One hundred dollars Mike said fifty onto the George and keep fifty for himself after trying to make money in a variety of ways from selling candy to operating his own laundry business. He finally hit on a successful scheme his senior year. He started selling embossed stationary which he realized the freshman would buy no matter what pricey put on it because they would right they were they who home second they would write their girlfriends back home. That how much they miss them. And so you're selling the stationary turned into kind of a booming. Busy started making about three hundred bucks a month selling stationery so so from then on his money. Problems got a lot better. The stationery business became the first in a long line of profitable enterprises for George. He graduated in nineteen forty eighty and spent the next four years serving in the Army Corps of Engineers during World War. Two after the war ended he moved to Houston to work in wool. It was a good time. I'm to be striking into the business. The decade following the war was the heyday of the Texas woman. All across the state newly rich wildcatters were building temples of wealth from art museums to lavish hotels and Houston was the booming financial capital of the industry. This was a time when all men were putting tigers hikers in their backyards and steamboats and they're swimming pools as stunts. There were several outsized personalities in Houston but there are a few in particular killer who came to embody the stereotype of the wildcatter often found strutting through books TV and film one. Was Glenn McCarthy the hard drinking old man who inspired the character Jett rink giant McCarthy poured a ton of his own money into a massive new hotel outside of downtown Houston the opening of the shamrock hotel in nineteen forty nine is still considered by many historians to be the biggest social event in the city's history McCarthy had it decorated in sixty three shades of green as a no mosh native Ireland but not everyone was impressed when famed architect architect Frank Lloyd Wright visited. He reportedly pointed at the lobby ceiling and said to one of his apprentices. That young man is an example of the effects of venereal nereo disease on architecture. Of course McCarthy wasn't the only big name in town there is also red. Smith be was very wealthy. Leave very well known and he actually helped bring the Colt forty five's to Houston. They became the Astros and he actually had a hand building the astrodome. A hell helping get. That process started. The astrodome would become known as the eighth wonder of the world shape of things to come. Our National Sport as baseball season gets underway eighty spanking new astrodome. The new thirty one million dollar home of the Houston Astros a Dome Stadium. Nearly fifty thousand for a baseball game and more conventions and meetings Mitchell didn't have the personality to match some of the other woman in the city in fact quite the opposite he was kind of quiet almost shy in a lot in cases but he became clear right away that he had a knack for reading rock and sniffing out oil. What you see early on his in his career is that a a lot of big names in the business guys gene McCarthy Red Smith? They learned pretty quickly. This guy can find oil at one point. Red Smith had an IFFY prospect prospect in the Texas panhandle. And he wasn't quite sure what to make of it so he farmed it out to some geologists just to see what they would think and most ovum said. Oh don't bother. It's going to be a dry hole. George said No. I think you should drill. I think she drill despite or whatever and so did and and it turned out to be a pretty significant find aligned and so from that moment on Red Smith was like okay. I want you looking at my stuff george and his brother Johnny eventually decided to start their own business. Together and Smith became one of their biggest investors that company later grew into the Mitchell Energy and Development Corporation while other oilmen partied at McCarthy's shamrock. Am Rock Hotel. George would spend his nights pouring over drilling logs looking for potential strikes. He'd passed those funds onto his brother. Johnny who is is a lot like their father charismatic outgoing Johnny would head down to the Espersen. Buildings drugstore a hub for a woman under thick clouds of smoke can over countless cups of black coffee. Johnny built their fledgling company one handshake at a time. The brothers business was touching. Go for a while. Here's George describing it years later to the Houston oral history project for May the well would go to the bank and bar. Someone against we loved rile with just back Cry And if the business his big break came from a Chicago bookie in the early fifties who claim to have a hot deal. George was skeptical but agreed to take a look. It turned out that what the book he had was a collection of seemingly worthless leases near Fort Worth and so so George looked at it and there have been thirteen. Dry Holes drilled on it in fact did kind of been known in the areas the frustration fields. There was a landowner their name Hughes his And he really believed that there was oil under his land but nobody could find and So he kept Tom. Just keep drilling boys. You'll find it you know. And they never ever did and so George looked at it and he realized that that he was pretty sure that they had actually missed it. They drilled right through the deposit the right through the the gas deposits and they were drilling too deep. Basically they reopen those thirteen wells and George turned out to be right. Ten of them produce news in fact they're still producing natural gas to this day. That was their big fight and once they realized what they had they had about three hundred acres that they at least with that project check and they immediately went out. At least I think it was three hundred thousand acres so they took this huge chunk land Before anybody really knew what was going on which is of course what you do to get a good price and so that really became the crown jewel a company that carried them through the nineteen nineties at the time. Natural gas wasn't worth much but George so it's potential hebr addicted. It would become the fuel of the future. He struck a deal with the natural gas pipeline company which was selling gas to Chicago go for heating because Chicago was such a huge market. The company needed a major guaranteed supply. George could promise them that and in return you fetch a high price for the gas so he was selling this gas to Chicago at above market prices and it was a thirty year contract or something like that so we locked in these these really high prices for very long time and then because he had his own gas plant he would strip out a lot of these byproducts. Fa and things like that and sell them to the chemical companies on on the Gulf coast near Houston so he really kind of you know maximized what you could do with this one property. This deal was the bedrock for all of Georgia's future success. Lauren calls it Mitchell energies. ATM as you might remember from episode three. It was there that the Mitchell actual engineers spent almost twenty years trying to crack the code of how to use fracking to open up shell formations when they finally succeeded in nineteen ninety eight that same region that was once called. The frustration fields became known as the prolific Barnett Shale. It's one of the largest natural gas this deposits in the United States and its enlarge part. Why in two thousand and two George was able to sell his company for over three billion dollars others? But we're other oiling. Gas Tycoons might have immediately jumped into their next big money venture. George went in a different direction. We choose to go to the moon and this decayed and do the other things. Not because they are easy but because they are hard because that goal well-served to organize and measure the best of our energies and skills when President Kennedy gave his famous Moonshot speech in nineteen sixty two. John was standing inside a packed stadium at Rice. University smack DAB in the middle of Houston. George Mitchell's adopted hometown. I don't know if George Orange was there that day but throughout the sixties as NASA was broadcasting the first pictures from the Apollo missions of what Earth looked like from outer space people. The world world over began to think about sustainability with the newfound urgency. You I'm all for man. Seeing the planet from that distant vantage inspired people including George. He began attending the Aspen Institute and International Gathering for the wealthy and powerful to debate solutions to the world's biggest problems albums sort of like a pro Ted Conference only more elite. The story goes that wall. Aspen Hebrew ended the famous inventor and futurist Chris Buckminster Fuller. George had many famous friends throughout his life. From Jimmy Carter to Stephen Hawking but fuller's influence might have loomed largest gist fuller is probably best known for inventing geodesic domes in coining the term spaceship Earth which inspired the golf ball. Looking sphere. Ebb caught in Disneyworld anchored by eighteen. Stories Speier called spaceship Earth Epcot futuristic for billions display the neon and laser technology of tomorrow Orel spaceship Earth was fuller's vision for the kind of comprehensive global planning needed to make sure Earth's rapidly growing population could live comfortably without destroying our most essential ecosystems fuller was an optimist. He believed humanity could do it. But it was going take a massive coordinated effort to pull it off. George became convinced of the same thing in the sixties George decided to launch his own many spaceship earth experiment by attempting to create a sustainable community outside of Houston called the woodland's to lead the project. He hired a a leading environmental designer from the University of Pennsylvania. He looked at everything from flooding issues. Drainage he studied all the different species of trees Animal Life you know how do we. How do we build a city with as little impact as possible? And so you know they would. For example study the soils us. And where the soils were more porous. Those would be the residential neighborhoods. Where you had the harder soils as it'd be the commercial areas because that would minimize runoff? And you know just just a million million little details like that but it was really It became a quite an undertaking. Obviously but something that George was very very committed to wind. Wind up calling the woodland's his eleventh child. There are some employees at his energy company that grew concerned by the amount of money. George was diverting into his suburb herb. What happened was Mitchell energy would would be generating all these profits and George was basically taking them on funneling all into the woodland's so the energy you guys were getting a little frustrated because they're like we're making all this money and you're putting into this real estate deal? You know what what's happening with this. They didn't quite understand it. George moved the company's headquarters there there and today it's home to many of Houston's energy executives though George didn't quite achieve utopia he dreamed of where people of all social classes asses lived in harmony. The Woodland's did become a global model for sustainable suburbs. In nineteen seventy eight George and his his wife created the Cynthia and George Mitchell Foundation which they use to support programs to preserve land and limit the impacts of oil and gas drilling since it began. The foundation has given away over seven hundred and fifty million dollars of the family's personal fortune Georgia's daughter Meredith ran the Mitchell Foundation for some two decades when she stepped down in two thousand eleven George's granddaughter. Catherine Laurens took over when I called her her. Catherine told me that George was constantly evangelizing about whatever. Big Idea had last peaked his interest. I mean I remember every time I see him throughout college and afterward he would hand like whatever the book was he was reading. You GotTa read this Book About Sustainability About the planet or it was always been talking when I saw him always without you know the environment and and and she she would always say you know he by I literally like two hundred bucks or whatever that because in mail to all of his friends especially those in leadership positions at companies. So I would remember you know go into possessing boxes at these books in a car that he was spending around the world and give me five. You gotta give it to all your friends to and And you know this wasn't just one book. It was kind of whatever the off what he ends you at the moment. Talking about sustainability in the planet and the need to take care of it. When George I began trying to crack the code on fracking in the eighties he surely knew it had the potential to make him and his company a lot of money but he also believed that if we could access the vast reservoirs and natural gas trapped in shale it could benefit the planet one of the things that George? Mitchell really believed that if we're going to have you know a growing population and we not only have to have environmental sustainability economic sustainability. We had to find a way to provide for all these people you know using these finite resources and so so you know the reason. He believed natural gas. Fuel of the future was because sooner or later we're GONNA need a cleaner fuel than oil or call or whatever and so while he was not he didn't really see renewables taking off in his lifetime. He definitely believed that they should he. He said in the nineteen nineties. We need alternatives. But they're too expensive. We're going to have to do something I think so. He's all natural gas as a way of getting there. In some ways. Georgia's been proven right. Natural Gas produces about half the carbon dioxide night is coal for comparable price since the fracking. Boom the rise of natural gas has led to a major decline in the use of coal and because of that. US Carbon Emissions recently hit at twenty five year low. The boom also lead to lower energy costs for consumers to a tune of some two thousand dollars is per household and it's been a boon for some parts of the economy with an estimated four million jobs tied fracking but no one could have predicted. Just just how much fracking would take off in two thousand. There were twenty six thousand gas wells in the entire. US fifteen years later there were more than three hundred thousand gas wells today some sixty percent of all US crude oil comes from wells but the record breaking waking levels of production comes at a cost. fracking requires far more resources than a conventional well especially water which is already a scarce commodity in West Texas a fracture well might require between two and eight million gallons of water and in the Permian a single fact. Well can require twelve hundred truckloads of sand water and equipment and even natural gas Mitchell's fuel of the future has a downside while natural gas. That's produces less carbon emissions. It also contains methane a potent greenhouse gas when companies burn off natural gas using flares or allow wells wells to leak methane then the climate advantages of natural gas or wiped out when fracking really started to take off in the early two. Thousands Lawrence says it didn't take long for George to see how the industry was going to exploit the technology. He knew he told his son in law. You know these cowboys are GonNa ruin everything and you know. He knew what the business was like and he knew that people were going to. We're going to basically abuse desk and you know as you see the the footprint from fracking growing as as the number of wells increases and whatnot. you know. I think he would have become increasingly concerned about that. The earthquake issue The the methane leaks but he would also I say these are fixable problems right we can solve this. We need to not rather than just abandon the whole process. We need to find a better way of doing it. In Two thousand twelve the year before his death George Famously Co op Ed. In The Washington Post with now presidential candidate Michael Bloomberg the two main called on drilling companies to be more socially conscious and asked the government to put stricter regulations on fracking. They wrote mostly. It's the loud voices at the extremes who are dominating the debate debate those who want either no fracking or no additional regulation of it as usual. The voices in the sensible center are getting drowned out with was serious repercussions for our country's future. The rapid expansion of fracking has invited legitimate concerns about its impact on water air air and climate concerns. The industry has attempted to gloss over. In fact he used to admonish not just other oil executives but business leaders in general that they weren't thinking enough about the importance of their role in the community. And the sort of you know that he believed that. There are a lot of big problems. That only business could solve George's daughter. Meredith errative actually lives part time in West Texas in the town of MARFA. She's watched the boom unfold in the permian basin over the past decade. Mitch spoke to her. Recently Elliott Morphou public radio. I think my father would be horrified by the what's going on in the Permian Basin because a lot of it is absolutely unnecessary. It it it's just it feels to me just looking and hearing about it. That is just the Greek on wild. And I'm I'm not even sure we need all that oil and gas right now especially the gas and fracking. That's going on and we've ruined environment and I think my father would be horrified by. Frankly how do you react to that. That people who are so pro drilling and fracking in the Permian would invoke your father's name as as someone who helped them get to where they are. Today it's kind of For me it's kind of embarrassing. Frankly and I feel feel like that. They the people who invoke his name don't really quite understand what he was all about and I think he would not like it either or if he were alive. George P Mitchell chairman of the board and President of the Mitchell Energy and Development Corporation in one thousand nine hundred eighty four George and his wife. Cynthia attended an honorary dinner. Were George was presented with the Horatio Alger Award the annual award recognizes a figure that embodies to classic rags to riches story other inductees have included Buzz Aldrin. Maya Angelou and reba MacIntyre the typically reserved. George was in a jovial mood that night. He even cracked a joke to start things off war. They don't have happy hair on this. Hit Hair you shouldn't get along well. My my wife just reminded me that before I met her. I was nothing and since I met her. I did pretty well so I want to give her a tax. He could've talked about. Anything mentioned most attendees probably expected him to talk about his accomplishments and oil and gas instead. He sounded a lot like his old friend. Buckminster Fuller in this country we have the economic environment in which to the pursuit of success can really be honorable and enjoyable game and if we play the game Preferably everybody wins by properly and preferably. I mean that we must work hard and be fair. We must be compassionate and decent and we must return to society as much as or more than we got out of it. It's clear that George wanted to leave a legacy beyond being known as the father of fracking. But it's less clear what his legacy. The actually is in George's later years after his wife Cynthia died in two thousand nine. He left the woodland's moved back to his boyhood town of Galveston. He lived for a time in the tournament house a hotel that he and Cynthia had bought in the early eighties as part of the historic preservation. Program that your mom continued to operate eight is a working hotel. Even as George lived there you know they had reserved tables in the restaurant and in the lobby and he would come down from his sweet and just sort of sit there in the lobby and You know the time was their former governor mark white just happened to be coming through Galveston and came up and said hello to him and they chatted for a few minutes. That's Russell missile gold a senior energy reporter for the Wall Street Journal. Russell is the author of two books including the boom. How fracking ignited the American Energy Revolution? Shen and changed the world. Russell met George at the hotel a few years before George died he was kind of enjoying the the the sunset of his life Just Holding Court In in the lobby of tremont hotel in downtown Galveston and it wasn't just governors. You know anyone who came by he you would try to engage with them and talk with them and you sitting there and his He had a little Motorized wheelchair of sorts and remember it had a bumper sticker on it right Say Informing everyone that he was he was nagy. There were certain things he would engage with certain stories. You would love to tell but there were certain things when you really kind of tried to drill down and try to understand a little bit about what he thought of his legacy and unleashing so much new oil and gas drilling in the United States dates and elsewhere That he didn't want to engage with He my sense was he had closed the book on that and and didn't WanNa talk about it anymore. This is part part of what came to be known as the Mitchell Paradox. Here's Lauren Steffi Ya son Todd Actually dubbed at the Mitchell Paradox And while while nobody remembers George actually talking about it in fact even when he was asked about it he would just kind of wouldn't answer He had two parts of his life. He had the business part he had the Mitchell energy part where he was drilling gas and figuring out ways to draw gas and then he had this other part and it wasn't listen just it wasn't just in in oil and gas. I mean here's someone who was genuinely worried about overpopulation. And he had ten kids You know it it there were just complexities to life. That that at the end of the day you you just. You couldn't resolve George's daughter. Meredith remembers giving him a hard time when he'd Fred about the planet's growing population. Oh Yeah we always taste about that. So what are you talking about this dad. You had ten kids. He said Yeah I know. Now I'm not gonNA worry about that. He just said it's true Georgia's life is filled with all sorts of contradictions. Plenty of people have pointed and out that Georgia's pleased for more regulation and more corporate responsibility really only intensified after he'd sold his business and after after he'd made his billions and that that concern about the environment did not spill over into his company and he did not create a company Benny Alternately and oil and gas company that showed us a new way of both getting oil and gas out of the ground while being an environmental steward. He showed us a new way to get oil and gas out off the ground and it really is left to to the current generation into new people to figure out how to be an environmental steward at the same time. In the mid nineties Georgia's Georgia's own company was marred and lawsuits over questionable drilling practices and water contamination. At one point Mitchell Energy and development lost a lawsuit route. There would have cost the company over two hundred million dollars. The case was later appealed and thrown out by the Texas Supreme Court but Russell says that the state still oh found. The Mitchell energy had quote deliberately misreported the way the company was building their wells. It stain his reputation. I've a lot of admirations for George Mitchell His legacy is one of being a stubborn inventor and someone who was willing to keep trying to do something because he I just had a a deep seated belief that he be able to fear out how to open up these incredibly thick rocks. And you know that's that's an incredible legacy and maybe do you know. Is it fair to also ask him to to have a second legacy of of being an environmental steward and figuring out how to oil and gas Production in an environmentally Faithful way for the future generations. That might be too much to ask anyone person He certainly failed in that. But Lauren on the other hand believes Georgia's legacy was much bigger than fracking. So I think that that ultimately when you take all of these things you know fracking sustainability. You know the the big science stuff you know what you see. His real legacy is a celebration of big ideas you know. He was a primary funder early on the giant Magellan Telescope. which you know when it comes online in a few years you know might just attacked you know intelligent life often the universe which would be kind of an interesting way to kappa a really unusual Legacies here's George's granddaughter. Catherine literally had had ten times every time you for the last twenty year life. If you can't make the world work with six billion people how you make her with nine billion people and what are you GonNa do about it and he would like what are you about. George believed the world needed to eventually move away from oil. Instead his technology she has helped make America into the largest oil producing country in the world. Despite this Lawrence Steffi says George would have been undaunted if he were still around I think he he was always an undying optimism. I mean that's kind of what drove him forward. was you know he didn't believe in some sort of dystopia future. I mean he really believe. We're GONNA figure all this out and in fact no less than Stephen Hawking at his memorial service said you know not many people can say they changed the world but George Mitchell was one of them. So that's from a guy who knows right next week on the final episode of boomtown we look back on our journey and look ahead to what the future might hold for the Permian Basin. Boomtown is a CO production of imperative. Entertainment and Texas monthly executive producer. Is Jason Hoke produced and engineered by Brian Stanford who also wrote the score. Boomtown is edited by J K Nickel and Megan cry and Co reported by Lee Freak Stat or theme song is written and performed by Paik Rossi. I'm your host and writer Christian walls. This episode was made with help from the crew at Marfa public radio. Thanks again to Mitch. Borden for his work reporting and Co writing this episode. If you're outside West Texas you can follow them and Marfa public radio DOT ORG special special thanks to the Houston Public Library Houston Metropolitan Research. Center and the Horatio Alger Association for allowing us to use recordings of George Mitchell. The full interview and other talks with influential. Texans can be found on the Houston Public Library Digital Archive. Texas monthly's parent company also owns interest in the midstream oil and gas ass. Industry among other diversified investments are editorial judgments are made independently of any such investments. Don't forget to tell your friends about boomtown on and leave a review on apple podcast if you like the show. Boomtown is so series with new episodes available. Every Tuesday follow us on social media and visit a Texas monthly dot com slash. Boomtown for more on this story.

George George P Mitchell Houston Georgia Mike Mitchell Mitchell Texas Lauren Steffi Meredith errative Permian Basin Mitchell Energy Mike Mitch borden John D. Rockefeller Johnny Johnny Galveston Apple MARFA
A Dark Horizon | Chapter 9

Boomtown

36:33 min | 6 months ago

A Dark Horizon | Chapter 9

"I've spent a lot of time driving around the Permian Basin over the last year. There were times I put over a thousand miles away truck in a single week. Signs of the boom were everywhere but over the last six months things have taken a slight turn. Most of the patch remains a busy. But there are some indications that the boom is cooling. The recount has declined about twenty percent over the past year and facebook pages dedicated woeful. Oh job postings have recently shifted in tone instead of companies reaching out to anyone with a pulse you see folks posting things like diesel mechanic. Nek Six years experience looking for anything unemployment and midland. Odessa is still lower than almost anywhere else in the country. But some companies companies have recently announced layoffs for one journalist. This slowdown wasn't surprising. It was just a matter of time. I'm Chris Wallace. And this is boon town a podcast cast about the historical boomed unfolding right now in the Permian Basin this week. We're mixing things up. We've actually decided to bring you. An extra episode will release the final two chapters or the next couple of weeks but today we're devoting the entire episode to a fascinating conversation about the wild eld shaky finances a fracking with one of the most acclaimed business reporters of our time. So I'm Bethany McLean. I'm a longtime journalist and contributing meeting editor at Vanity Fair and the author of a few bucks among other things. Bethany is being modest here. She started her career as an investment banking analyst for Goldman Sachs ax later. She became one of the first journalists to predict the fall of Enron one of the biggest scandals in history of American business. She's the CO author of the bestselling rolling book. The smartest guys in the room which was turned into an award. Winning documentary thirty eight counts of fraud and conspiracy guilty verdicts in the biggest case of corporate fradin history. Recently Bethany raise the alarm again this time in a book about the oil industry Saudi America the Truth About fracking and how. It's is changing the world while researching the book. She discovered that even during the height of today's massive boom much of the oil industry was actually losing money in this interview. She explains why and what it would mean for this boom to go bust not just for West Texas but for the country in the world you'll recall from episode three. Today's historic boom was made possible by innovations and fracking and horizontal villain. That's where our conversation begins and this is episode nine a dark horizon so we'll just start back in nineteen eighty eight of when George Mitchell will finally figures out fracking shale. Natural gas in the Barnett Shale You talk about in Saudi. America Parkway played a role in actually giving rise so the shell boom was the two thousand eight financial crisis and how the interest rates were so low that these companies could actually take on more debt. Absolutely so one of the things that has always struck me about. fracking is that it unquestionably has changed the world. We've gone from these hand-wringing hearings about Congressional hearings about impending shortages of US oil and natural gas a decade ago. To this idea that that these are free to molecules as the the the trump administration calls them that the US is now this prolific producer of oil and natural gas such that we never have to worry again but what really interested me about. This was was that that was the juxtaposition between that and the fact that the industry actually doesn't make any money and so while you've talked a lot about the technological games that have enabled both fracking and those are real and really impressive. The other key component of fracking is capital because it costs so many billions of dollars to drill drill all these wells and get the stuff out of the ground and that capital still hasn't come back up out of the ground and so there's an argument that if it hadn't been for the two thousand eight financial official crisis When the Federal Reserve cut interest rates to record low levels in order to spur the economy that may debt really cheap so it enabled trackers to go out and raise the the hundreds of billions of dollars that they needed in order to to go drill if the data ben twice as expensive They went to been able to drill nearly as much and the shale. Al Revolution would not be nearly as prolific as it has been so I guess what was terrible for a lot of people was actually great of for oiling. Gas In that way and in kind of the most fascinating character in your book is already mcclendon. And you kind of say like what George Mitchell did for fracking technologically mcclendon mcclendon did for raising capital You Call Him America's most reckless billionaire and he's a tragic metaphor for the industry in some ways. Could you Tell me just a little bit more. About what drew you to mcclendon stories specifically so I started paying attention to Aubrey. mcclendon back in two thousand and ten and a longtime source of mine said and it was a little bit apocryphal. But he said mcclendon was the most important man in America and what he meant by that. was that if if mcclendon ended was right in the US. could could produce cheap oil and natural gas for the foreseeable future that was going to change everything about our economy about the kinds of businesses. Is that were located here. The kinds of jobs that were available and it was going to change geopolitics to because our geopolitics are still driven in large part by energy. Supplies is and so at that moment. I just I started watching Aubrey. And he's one of those amazing characters that come along every so often in business one of those just larger than life figures that you. You couldn't make him up if you if you had to the or trying to imagine a fictional character from scratch you wouldn't. You wouldn't be able to come up with Aubrey mcclendon. He was really a renaissance man with this passionate interest in an antique map collection and just a wine guide to to the hill to at one point I think he had the biggest wine collection in the world. The most valuable wine collection in the world had collection of antique boats. I mean he just rowboats I mean. He had homes all over the world including house on Lake Michigan and he was just just he was just a guy who was passionately interested in a lot of things and people really people really liked him. He was an incredible salesman because he believed that the thing that distinguishes distinguishes Aubrey mcclendon from swindlers who have been at work in in this industry as that mcclendon didn't just put other people's money to work. He put his own money to work. He risked everything she had. And then some and most people think he died broke As a result of this and this is a guy who could have walked away with billions. Had he been the more Senechal sort but he wasn't. He was a believer right. Yeah he believed in what he was doing and wasn't trying to scam anyone. I mean he's putting his own money into it so oh and he. He went down with the ship. Not once not twice but really three times. People think he went broke in two thousand eight. When natural gas prices assists fell and Chesapeake stock collapsed and Aubrey had margin his shares to go out and borrow more In in order to to fund a drilling program and Goldman Sachs had lent him. The money sold his stock up from under him and he was he was left with nothing and he rebuilt and then he got kicked out of Chesapeake in two thousand twelve or two two thousand thirteen And he started again with this collection of companies put together called American energy partners And he leveraged everything he had in order to fund on that he signed personal guarantees ownership in the Oklahoma thunder and his Wine Collection His map collection he used all those things as collateral for for loans so that he could he could fund this again so this was a guy who was completely reckless with other people's money but but also with with his own and there is something romantic and even admirable about that versus the more calculating character. Who might have you know? Taken a billion off the table here and there are just to make sure he he was out fine even if everybody else got screwed rain right. Yeah when I started reporting my book a Guy went to talk to said. He was skeptical of mcclendon skeptical optical the industry but that he never let Aubrey into the room for a meeting because if he had he knew they would have ended up buying a lot of stock in. It wouldn't have ended well. And so you guys you guys talk about George Mitchell who really gets must of the credit for pioneering the technology that enabled fracking but Aubrey's the guy who sold it to the world. He's the one who went out to investors literally around the Globe and got them to turn over tens of billions of dollars to fund. US fracking and if it hadn't been for that Influx of capital. The industry would be what what what it is today. So in many ways the capital was every bit as important as the technology or the capital was the other side side of the technology. Roy What do you think that that aspect of the oil and gas and the shell rise hasn't been covered as much People aren't accustomed him to thinking in terms of of cash flow as a way of measuring profitability. And there's Justification for that this last decade has been the era of coming out of Silicon Valley's the Uber's the lifts and the host of other companies. We work where they don't make money and the ideas they're going to in the future and if you just invest now than the prophets are going to be there. And that's been the story that the crackers have told which is were not making money now but we will. Technology is getting better and better and and soon even though we don't make money at this price will be able to to make money soon. I think another part of the reason why that narrative didn't get played as much as because because some of it is dependent on oil prices. Although I think less than you might think so people would say it's not making money and believers would say we'll just wait 'til oil prices go up right. The thing is if you look historically. That didn't actually play out in two thousand fourteen. Oil was above one hundred dollars a barrel for part of the year. And the fracking industry still didn't make money because so many of the costs which you know well had having worked on rag. These costs are variable costs. And when everybody's really busy and the drilling's going crazy it costs a lot more money right so that then cuts into the the extra profits that are coming out of The well I think the third reason is that people have been pretty mono maniacally focused on the environmental issues. And that's obviously the environmental issues are real. In the water usage in the Permian basin is a is a huge issue. I think but because of that when people criticize fracking they've tended to criticize it through the Environmental Latins rather than criticising the financial lens right. No that makes sense district. Go back to what you said. Earlier I pulled a quote from your book that you already nailed a part of it. There's a hedge fund firm found that from two thousand six to two two thousand fourteen. The fracking firms had spent eighty billion dollars more than they had received from selling oil and gas. Even when oil was at one hundred dollars dollars a barrel. None of them generated excess cash flow in fact in two thousand fourteen. When was at one hundred dollars for part of the year the group burned learned through twenty billion? I mean that's that's just kind of unbelievable to be honest. The numbers are pretty staggering. The extent of the capital that has gone into the ground and has not come back up and thus far although the fracking industry has always promised sort of like Tesla that profits are just around the corner. Those prophets have yet to materialize And the much-hyped technological advances that we're supposed to enable for Akers to make money thus far have been less than they have been cracked up to be literally cracked up to be. They haven't quite materialized. So the idea. Was You know you could drill longer laterals and just put more props into the ground and more sand into the ground and thus far art. What appears to be happening is that you're getting more oil and gas up more quickly but you're not extending the life of the well in fact the well is wearing out more quickly than it used to right so once you FRAC? Oh well it has these great returns and you're producing all this oil but then after that first year or so depending on where you are say for instance in the Balkan eighty five percent of that production declined after the first year in parts of the Balkan and to maintain that level of production. And you have. You've got to spend a lot more money just to FRAC new wells in the. I've heard you describe it as kind of like being on a treadmill exactly. So that's that's the core of the economic problem with fracking as the decline rates are much steeper than they are with vertical wells so with old vertical wells are with a big offshore drilling willing project. You might put a lot of capital into getting it going. But then you'd have a well that would produce pretty consistently for a decently long period of time with fracking. The decline rates are are astronomical so in year in year. Two you may be getting fifteen to twenty percent of the oil that you did in year one and so that means if you WANNA keep producing oil oil at at the same rate that you were then you have to keep putting more capital into the ground there. Is this great quote from a guy at something called the The the Post Carbon Institute and he wrote In order to meet the forecast that had been put forward about how much oil the US is going to produce that. It's going to require drilling Almost one point five million John Wells at a cost of nine point five trillion dollars over the period from two thousand seventeen to two thousand fifty. Because you need to keep drilling new wells well the also pointed out the The that the. US Shale industry has drilled eighty-five thousand wells over the past decade and is still over three hundred billion dollars in long-term debt in other words it hasn't even even paid for what it's already drilled now that we're well past the hour the new year. It's easy to fall back into old habits and forget our resolutions especially especially when it comes to money as most of us have found out the hard way getting into debt is easy and getting out of debt is hard especially if your credit score is a great UPSTART DOT COM is here to help. Upstart is the revolutionary lending platform. The knows you're more than just your credit score. They offer smart interest rates to help pay off credit card. Debt upstart goes beyond the traditional credit scores when evaluating your credit worthiness and they actually reward you based on other factors. He's like your education and job history in the form of a smarter interest rate. Plus they make it fast and easy to check your rate since it's a softball it won't affect your credit score for yourself from the burden of high interest credit card debt by consolidating everything into one monthly payment with upstart see why upstart star is ranked number one in their category with over three hundred businesses on trust pilot and hurry to upstart dot com slash. Boomtown to find out how low your upstart rate is checking. Your rate only takes a few minutes. That's upstart dot com slash boomtown. One of the things that struck me After I read your book one of the earlier episodes we have on this. PODCAST talks about the history of oiling. Gas Us in West Texas and we go into the story of the Santa Rita number one which was kind of like the the spindle top of West Texan away the the one that kicked everything off and so for like the Santa Rita Number One. You had this guy named frank t pickerel and he bought all this land all the the rights to drill this this land in West Texas that was basically deemed worthless at the time. There never been any production out of this area and he acquired the drilling leases. And then you want around America for two years. Basically trying to sell certificates of interest to anyone who would bind to his scheme so he went around like all all the way up to New York and some Catholic nuns invested in these certificates. And all these other folks and like I said Historian did. Did any of these people ever see any returns on their investment and and Dr Hinton is her name she's like no like and most likely none of the Mavericks did and so it's kind of this incredible Return to something. That was kind of a norman industry almost a century ago. Oh fascinating that's fascinating and so true. This is an industry that has always been filled with promoters and stock scams and swindlers handlers and people have made billions wine. Investors have lost their shirts. One of the other things that happened at that time On December eighteenth eighteen th two thousand fifteen. President Obama approved the lifting of a four-year-old ban on the export of crude oil out of America. And you actually began in Saudi America describing this huge tanker leaving the port of Corpus Christi on New Year's Eve with the very first load of exported the American crude in four decades. Can you talk a little bit about how that actually has changed the game and oil and gas so it really has. It's such a big moment and it's funny that at the time it wasn't even recognized as such you know for four decades. We have had this export ban in place. Flying in the face of our supposed- is it free market principles it goes. It goes back to the nineteen seventies when the politicians were just freaked out about our dependence on Middle Eastern oil. And so the idea. Yeah was This is a scarce resource. Whatever we have we better keep it close but amid this idea that we actually have abundance in that because of fracking talking? We have more than we'll ever need. There was immense political pressure from the industry to overturn the ban on on fracking. There's a lot of pushback from environmentalists but I think the Obama Administration had two issues one is that it did see him. On a certain economic level there was a lot of pressure to fund jobs. CBS Fund investment in America and another is weak economy and in the wake of the financial crisis and saying no to this was was tricky. Even the economists in the Administration Ministration Democratic economists were very much in favor of turning over the the export ban. I think the other issue was that president. Obama had lost a lot of political capital in passing healthcare reform and didn't have it left to fight the export ban and so it basically got tucked into this year. End Spending bill at the end of two thousand fifteen and sort of slipped upped through and The lobbyists who worked on it actually told me a funny story because he was like you know. I thought this was a really big deal. I'd worked on this for my entire life and it gets signed signed. Everybody just left town. I had to go have a stake in a Manhattan by myself. 'cause there was nobody left to celebrate with this big dramatic moment that he thinks he thinks changes this everything and it it it really does. It's an absolutely dramatic change and I'm sure if you go to Corpus Christi you can see just a huge amount of building of infrastructure. That's been a result aalto. Having this having this ban returned will because of that because of the export ban being lifted and now all of a sudden you have access to global global markets for not just crude oil but natural gas liquids and other hydrocarbon products A kind of just completely flips the the table of our geopolitical position Were less beholden to the Saudis for certain things and for instance like a couple of months ago when five percent percent of the world's oil supply just suddenly was literally gone up in smoke the price of all just kind of shrugged and continued on as if almost nothing in happened in if the production levels weren't so high for instance in the Permian that would have been a very different reality for everyone on the ground. I think that's a really good point. And it comes back to this idea that the production levels have been disassociated with the economics. Six of it right people had had been willing to fund it and so the question is what happens if people if investor stop being willing to fund it in there some signs that they're they are. There's a lot of pressure now for companies to produce prophets and not to just drill baby drill and so the question is then what happens to To production reduction growth. Does it remain as robust as it was and if it doesn't if it falls dramatically what does that do to predictions about it to to the price of oil and that's not an easy question to answer because as you know they're million other factors that go into this but that to me is a big one. What a fracking isn't all? It's cracked up to be because because the capital dries up and investor start Start wanting to see a prophet and you have these questions arising a really interesting time. Geopolitically because the trump trump administration is quite Aggressive about using energy as geopolitical weapon in a way that well past administrations couldn't we didn't have it but the Obama administration ministration as we started to shift from scarcity to abundance. They were also pretty determined not to use energy as a geopolitical weapon. Because we'd been running around preaching to other countries that they couldn't do that Trump has van quite a bit more aggressive about it His administration calls at Freedom Molecules. it's really interesting and aggressive approach given the Financially Shaky Foundation of fracking I think more broadly writ you do have these these real questions about how the world is changing I was just talking with Liam Denning Bloomberg Energy Colin the stunt my own podcast and he was talking about how this whole us lead order of the world that was the had oil really is the centerpiece of economic and political. Order is breaking down Mainly because of of the advent of renewables that it's just going to be a decade a very different world than it than at once was so it's sort of it's given those factors. It's really interesting to see the stance that the current administration has taken yet. It's not American energy independence which every he president since even before. Reagan has been touting its now this narrative American Energy Dominance S. The whole concept of energy independence's senses is somewhat fraudulent. And what I mean by that is the back in the seventies when politicians I started talking about it the US could be energy independent or our economy was as much more isolated. The price of a barrel of oil was set by the Texas Railroad Commission. There it was a concept that actually made sense on some level but today the price of a barrel of oil is set on global markets. It's GonNa be victim to the events you just described almost regardless of how much oil the US's producing that still going to have some the some effect and nobody is saying that the US is going to be able to supply the world with oil right. And so even the best case scenario even. A fracking is as robust bust as its biggest proponents. Say It is. China is still Asian. Economies are still dependent on the Middle East for their oil supplies and we are in turn are dependent on China for a lot of the imports. That fuel our economy. So it's not as if we can look away from the Middle East just because we don't need their oil right so to me that that's that's the the fatal flaw in this hyping. This concept of energy independence. I just don't know what it means in a global economy right right. Could you just talk a little bit about The role roll. The Permian Basin has played in this show boom. So it's really fascinating. I never got a good answer to this question. Maybe you have one. But the Permian was was last of the major basins for the technology of fracking. To be brought to it. And it's funny because it's no secret that the Permian is a prolific prolific oil-and oil-and right. I mean that dates back to the nineteen twenties or even earlier where the bulk of American supply was was coming out of the Permian. But for some reason as fracking took off nobody looked to the permian an old time oil man in Midland. When I asked him that question he said it's a little bit like the girl next door you just don't you know we'd been drilling here for so long long? We just you know we just we didn't we didn't look at it differently So the Bachan Bait people began drilling for oil in the Balkan in the Eagle Ford and then came the Permian and it turned out to be this just miracle of geology. One geologist I spoke to described it to me as a at least certain parts of the Permian are like these stacked layers the carpet so you can get a lot more oil and gas out much more efficiently than in other parts of than other geology is because you can do drill a lot more with just one well you can reach all these different layers of of the carpets. So you had all this height coming out of the Permian and you had this idea that because of the unique formations nations in the Permian that the break even cost was going to be much much lower so companies would say that be able to break even at twenty twenty five dollars a barrel so would no longer be hostage hostage to something that OPEC might do. Because the Permian was going to enable this miracle of much much cheaper oil and I think at the time of your writing the Permian Mian was projected to maybe hit four million barrels per day by the end of two thousand twenty twenty actually and an right now our sitting as we speak on nearly four point six million barrels per day coming out of the Permian and now by some estimates it's considered to be the most prolific oilfield in the world right. Now it is. It's been a monster. And it's provided a lot of ammunition for people who say fracking is always going to do more be better be bigger Irby more powerful than than anybody anticipates that said. The Permian has fallen short. Even some of the people who were previously the biggest bowls about it have pulled. Hold back a little and so it's actually been interesting just as that. Narrative has really taken hold their Benson little signs of skepticism. Bubbling up through. Hey the cracks Some of the things that you talk about in Saudi America about. There's GonNa come a day of reckoning that these investors here's are going to want to see their returns and you see that happening in real time right now some of that skepticism. You were just talking about The recounts have been sliding across the US for the last three months. or so. You know as the majors are are starting to report their budget spending for next cheer their slashing their budgets over and over again and you know we don't really know what the production is GonNa look like in the year to come after all. These walls have been fact so you see some of these indicators that a lot of what you predicted is coming true. Sometimes I feel like I wasn't quite skeptical enough in in my book because because the news the news in the past year has been decidedly more on the negative side than than on the positive side. I mean that said if I were to play devil's advocate to may own argument. I'd say that just because the technological gains haven't much promise technological gains haven't appeared yet don't don't mean they won't right we're still even with fracking. And you probably know the numbers better than I do. But getting what nine percent of the available oil of the estimated oil out of the ground. I mean it's a tiny amount and so the idea. Is You come up with some way to improve that. Even a couple of percentage of points and you change the dynamics entirely and end. Suddenly what didn't make economic sense does. So they're always could that that breakthrough just like with what George Mitchell that breakthrough could be right around the corner right it absolutely. Yeah will I just wanted to highlight some of the technological changes that have either come to bear Since sure book came out that are happening right now but basically we're just seeing a lot of automation come to the patch. You know apple and Microsoft and Google are now monitoring pipelines and storage tanks and. I'm sure you've seen this but the rigs that can walk from one location to another There's it's just all these things that are almost like science fiction in a way that are happening now One of the big changes from the time you wrote your book until now is most of the sand that was being shipped into FRAC. These wells was coming in from Wisconsin in the Midwest and now just since the beginning of twenty two thousand eighteen. There's been something like twenty San mining facilities open up in West Texas and so those shipping costs has pushed the price per barrel of oil extraction down way further and it really is kind of like who who knows what it's going to look like in in the years to come it is is and so I think making predictions about it or at least making predictions that you say are set in. Stone is a fool's errand but I'd I'll play devil's advocate here argument now and I'd advise a couple of points. One is that companies have long hyped. These break even numbers. They say we can break even at twenty five dollars a barrel. We can break even at twenty dollars a barrel Sarah. And then you look at their consolidated financial statements. And they're losing money and something's going wrong from the people called it to me Corporate math or investor stirred economics. Because they were trying to put together these pitch decks that would show investor's set of economics that weren't real so that show you that they could break even on a well at twenty five dollars a barrel oil and yet then you'd you'd go to the corporate financial statements and they were losing money right And there's also the political risk right to tolling gas as far as like you've got the green new deal which would seriously change the oil and gas industry and candidates like Elizabeth Warren talking about Banning fracking on her first office We see the earthquakes in West Texas. I mean I think the term you used in your book was demand destruction. Yeah and what people mean by demand destruction as the idea that renewables and other things are gonNA fill the gap and so we may not. We may not need as much as we think. But you're right about the political risk and that's it's one of the really fascinating things about the oil industry as that. It isn't just economic or even primarily economic. It's very very very political right. So it's one of the things that makes it so hard to predict. Is that everything we're saying about fracking. Could everything I'm arguing could be a relevant. It could turn Out that the industry is incredibly profitable that there's new technological breakthrough makes it incredibly profitable and that there's the. US has more oil than than we ever knew. Because of this technological breakthrough but then Elizabeth Warren could become president and banned fracking right now. So there's this wild card of politics particularly in the very very volatile political times. I'm so that that we live in right and and with the rise of renewables I I've heard you talk on other podcasts or in other interviews about how the rise in Natural Gas Kinda helped signify the end of the era of coal and while it's still hanging on its on its last gasp. And if if you have a way of storing renewables a battery that can change the way our grid operates that could also signify the need for oil and gas in a world world. That's increasingly getting warm. Well that my Liam Denning who is I was talking to earlier from my podcast Made a point that I hadn't heard before that I thought was really interesting. was that oil balls point to India and China and say demand from their developing economies. As GONNA keep oil demand skyrocketing rocketing for it for decades to come but he said India and China are quite determined not to repeat the mistakes of the US and make their economies dependent on volatile tall regions of the world like the Middle East and so they are actively working on on renewables because you. They're moving ahead on all fronts. They're trying to secure China's especially as trying to secure access to all the oil and gas possibly can but they're also really pushing forward on on renewables because they don't want to repeat mistakes they saw the US make so Liam raise the interesting question. What if the demand that everybody thinks is going to keep coming from India and China actually doesn't what does that mean right? On the other hand you have of some industries like agriculture for instance. That will still need hydrocarbons in in various forms for decades into the foreseeable future again. Technology's could come along that we don't have right now. That could make that a very obsolete statement. But we're going to need some level of hydrocarbon in production for some time. But as you say in the book oils specifically as it's called a non-renewable for a reason it it was really compelling to me. People told me that Charlie monger who is Warren Buffett's famous ninety something year old sidekick and sharp ever was had view about all of this and I thought not. Well if you can get a chance to talk Charlie Munger. You'd better you'd better take it. And so I called him up and he kindly agreed to talk to me and his point was was that we we all think about energy. Security right is very critical to to modern countries but food security is really important to a nation has to be able to feed its people and our ability to feed. Ah growing populations has been because of the use of hydrocarbons in fertilizers and his point was thus far. There's no substitute for those. There may be one. There may be technology we don't don't know yet to get the stuff from the sun or whatever but we're not there yet and so by drilling the stuff out of the ground this frenetic pace as fast as we can or making a big bet on our ability to feed our population and in the future and so his point was. Why are we doing this? Why not just conserve it until we know we have another option? What's what's this whole push to flex our muscles and show that we can produce more oil than but then Russia and Saudi Arabia? Why aren't we? Why aren't we importing it buying it from them while we can? And conserving being our own. And I thought that was it was a really interesting and compelling argument if I could just read another quote from your book there at the very end you say for the first time in perhaps forever. At least some long-term investors are aligned with conservationists. And they're trying to send a message that isn't drill baby drill but rather drill thoughtfully awfully and profitably so the more people benefit from America's resources for longer and it is an only executives getting payday. Yep that about sums it up on the next episode of boomtown we take a deep dive into the complicated legacy of the father of fracking George Mitchell and just just as everything else is bigger in Texas. We didn't feel like we could do justice to this story and Tim Parts. So we're working hard on an eleventh episode series finale. See y'all next week. Boomtown is a CO production of imperative. Entertainment and Texas monthly executive producer is Jason Jason. Hope produced an engineered by Bryanston. who also wrote the score? Boomtown is edited by J Nickel and Meghan cry and Co reported reported by lethal ecstatic. Our theme song is written and performed by Paik. Ross I'm your host and writer Christian Walls Texas monthly's parent company also John's interest in the midstream oil and gas industry. Among other diversified investments are editorial judgments are made independently of any such investments. Don't don't forget to tell your friends about boomtown and Lieber Review on Apple podcast if you like the ship. Boomtown is a ten episode series with new episodes available every Tuesday and follow us on social media and visit Texas monthly dot com slash. Boomtown the more on the story.

US mcclendon mcclendon George Mitchell America Permian Basin West Texas president Boomtown Aubrey China Goldman Sachs Obama Bethany McLean midland Middle East
Burning Questions: Jeffrey Epstein, Russian Missiles, Endangered Species

Skimm This

12:29 min | 1 year ago

Burning Questions: Jeffrey Epstein, Russian Missiles, Endangered Species

"It it's monday august twelfth. Welcome to skim this where breaking down the most complex stories of the day and giving you the context on why they matter today they were diving into the controversial circumstances surrounding jeffrey epstein's apparent suicide. We'll connect the dots on why there's a public outcry over it and what this means for bringing justice to who is many alleged victims then a nuclear accident in russia is raising eyebrows. We'll give you the details and finally wildlife might be getting even harder for for endangered species. We're here to make your evening smarter. Let's skim this. The most complicated that story today is about jeffrey epstein. The well connected multimillionaire charged with sex trafficking minors. He died of an apparent suicide on saturday morning. Epstein sudden-death has sparked a lot of questions conspiracy theories and anger in part because he was a powerful figure who many say has gotten away with criminal behavior behavior for years but also because epstein was taken off suicide watch days before he died now. His accusers won't be able to confront him <unk> at trial said today. We're going to get into why the fact that epstein wasn't on suicide. Watch is an issue how people are responding and what epstein's death means for the case against him. Part of the reason people are upset about epstein's death is because of the circumstances under which it happened. Epstein had been in custody custody since early july when he was arrested and charged by federal prosecutors with sex trafficking for having quote sexually exploited and abused dozens of minor girls at his homes in new york and florida among other places these allegations had followed epstein for a while he actually spent just over a year in county jail for soliciting soliciting prostitution back in the late two thousands roughly two weeks after his arrest. This time around epstein was discovered injured in his cell prison officials. Those were investigating it as a possible suicide attempt so the justice department has rules for people who show suicidal behavior. They're supposed to be put on suicide. Watch meaning their place in special rooms and potentially harmful objects are removed and at the very least prison guards are also supposed to visually check in on prisoners a nurse on a regular basis like every fifteen to thirty minutes. The federal facility were obscene was held reportedly put him on suicide watch but then they took him off of it. After just six days then they put up seen on special observation status meaning the prison staff was supposed to check in on him every half half hour but according to news reports that didn't happen he was also supposed to have a cellmate to monitor and report on his behavior that something studies show oh can help lessen the risk of suicide but then epsteins former roommate was transferred elsewhere leaving epstein alot now. The facility is under scrutiny the a._p. Reports that epstein's unit was staffed by just one prison guard. Who's working a fifth consecutive day of overtime the f._b._i. Says it's investigating what happened here. So is the justice department inspector general. Here's attorney general bill bar earlier. Today we are now learning of serious reassure regularities at this facility that are deeply concerning and demand a thorough investigation d._o._j.'s taking heat for this because they were the ones in charge of housing epstein and remember he was famous for being extremely well-connected the day before his death hundreds of documents were revealed in federal court detailing allegations of abuse made by one of epstein's victims. The documents came from from a lawsuit. She filed in two thousand fifteen in which she accused epstein of not only abusing her himself but also of instructing her to have sex with other men powerful felman including former new mexico governor bill richardson and former u._s. Senator george mitchell both men deny any ties to the victim but the timing naming of that release an obscene history of being chummy with well-connected people has fueled speculation online about whether his death was a hit job ordered by people in high places. This president trump even re tweeted a conspiracy theory tying epstein's death to former president bill clinton who was linked to epstein because he flew on epsteins planes after three left the oval office. That's significant because one of epstein's planes was reportedly used to ferry underage girls to epstein's house in the u._s. Virgin islands it was nicknamed named the lalita express clinton had tonight. He knew anything about the crimes. Epstein was accused of and to be clear. There is no indication that clinton or or anyone else is responsible for epstein's death and there were a bunch of other powerful people who flew with partied with or connected to epstein including president trump once called him quote. A terrific guy like we said officials are calling this. An apparent suicide in an autopsy autopsy into epstein's death has reportedly been completed. The medical examiner is reportedly confident that this is a suicide but his waiting for more info before releasing the final determination nation in the meantime f- scenes alleged victims have concerns about what happens for them. Spencer kuban is a lawyer who has represented three of epstein's accusers he you told c._b._s. News that one of his clients had mixed emotions after hearing of epstein's death. There's a relief obviously because now he can't do this to other victims but on the same <hes> vein you've got this emptiness and inability to really answer all the questions the u._s. attorney for manhattan said over the weekend that even though epstein epstein won't be able to face trial the case against him is going forward in part because he was charged with conspiracy which typically includes other people co-conspirators conspirators so what's the skin investigators are reportedly still interested in how epstein made all of his money something. That's been a source of mystery for years. Whether or not seen is actually as rich as he claimed whatever's left in his bank accounts could be used to pay off his growing list of accusers and given up scenes high flying global lifestyle. This case could go international today to french. Ministers called on their country to open a separate epstein investigation citing citing reports that several of epstein's victims were french so in some ways the case against obscene could get bigger even after his death in a mysterious explosion in russia has people saying the words turnover and an entire town rushing out to buy tablets so what happened last week and explosion was reported in northern russia near the white sea at first russia said it began when a rocket caught fire and exploded at military test site and that only two people people died but then the death toll grew to seven and russia's story kept changing officials at the state controlled nuclear agency said actually what happened is a small nuclear reactor exploded at sea russia said there's no need for alarm but the government shutdown down the court near the explosion and now is it landing ships come in or out suv. You've seen the h._b._o. Show chernobyl you know that when it comes to nuclear explosions russia doesn't have a great track record with honesty that accident back in the eighties is believed to have led to the deaths of thousands of people. This one doesn't come in close to that scale but with russia being sketchy about what exactly happened here. Some people are still stressed. After the explosion a city twenty five miles away reported a spike in radiation up to twenty times their normal levels hours later the city's web pages about the spike were taken down and towns near the explosion had been and stocking up on iodine pills which may help prevent radiation sick. This winter noble happened the soviet union only admitted needed to it when sweden spoke up after seeing radiation levels rise this time everyone's relying on info from nearby norway and finland norway says they we haven't detected anything yet while experts in finland say the wind is blowing in the wrong direction to get a good reading. Both countries say they're keeping an eye on it. The accident senate also has people wondering what exactly russia was testing since it happened at many think it may be tied to a nuclear powered cruise missile russia was believed to be working on a missile prototype called sky fall. Yes like the james bond movie. Russia claims the sky fall missile can be powered by nuclear the energy and go anywhere in the world without having to refuel allegedly it can also avoid detection because at bob's williams along an unpredictable path breath. This is high stakes for russian president vladimir putin. It russia got this missile. It would be a major military propaganda win in the u._s. Russia arms race ace at a time when relations are already tense and domestically the missile could help putin push back against recent protests of his administration by playing hang up russia's military mike so win win win for russia if it works but there's no sign yet that does and some analysts say day. This latest accident could mean that the entire sky fall project is a fail. If you're having a bad case as of the mondays just be glad you're not a florida panther or wyoming toad today. The trump administration announced changes to the endangered species act which could mean fewer protections since for sixteen hundred plants and animals including those guys so what's the endangered species act like it says it's the nineteen seventy-three a law that protects endangered and threatened species and their habitats. It's credited with saving a bunch of animals from extinction including the bald eagle but the trump administration says the law is too hard on landowners and businesses near these habitats right now businesses can't build in the habitats of endangered species even if they say they can bring more jobs and money to the community. The administration says that economics should be a consideration for permits on the flip side. The administration also says other things should not be considered like the effects of climate change on wildlife and their habitats big surprise environmentalists and democrats strongly disagree. They worry companies will be able to mind drill and build in areas where endangered species live which could lead to more extinctions and would worsen climate change. One environmental group has already told president trump. We'll see you in court before we go today. We've got a fun fact coming to you from egypt. A team of researchers from the university of hawaii manoa helped create a perfume they say could would have been worn by cleopatra aka the last queen of ancient egypt before the romans took control. Here's how did it. The researchers found what bathing our old old perfume bottles during an archaeological dig and through chemical analysis were reportedly able to identify some of the ingredients and the bottles then they took their findings two two experts in ancient egyptian perfumes yup. That's thing and recreated the sentence with ingredients like mur- cardamom and cinnamon. You can catch whip of the final product right now at the queens of egypt exhibition at the national geographic museum in d._c. And that's all for skim. This thinks listening and be sure to hit subscribes. We'd also love for you to rate and review us. Wherever you get your podcast for more skim sign up for free morning the newsletter the daily skip right on our website at the skin dot com. It's everything you need to notice. Start your day right in your in box.

jeffrey epstein Epstein sudden-death russia president russia russia bill clinton egypt attorney florida Senator george mitchell bill richardson justice department university of hawaii manoa Spencer kuban prostitution
Open Mic at the White House Correspondents' Dinner 2019

The Takeout

47:42 min | 1 year ago

Open Mic at the White House Correspondents' Dinner 2019

"From CBS news. This is the takeout with major Garrett here at the White House correspondent's dinner. I major Garrett. This is the takeout. All that. Happy noise. You hear around us. That's the crowd assembling for the White House correspondent's dinner in man, do we have someone we've plucked out of the crowd that is a super big newsmaker and guests Larry HOGAN, Republican governor state of Maryland governor, it's great to see major great to be with you. Thank you for joining us. Listen ninety red. You got take the party with me everywhere. I go. Yeah. So tell me what you're thinking about at this dinner. You're just here to have fun. You're here to make a statement. You're here what I'm just here to spend a little time with my friends in the media and enjoy the evening. You know, there aren't very many Republicans here. So trying to show the colors accent Torah got one other guy that showed up saying former Senator from the great state of the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania. Sometimes no, that's all right. Just get right up on that. Michael don't be shy. Don't be shy. There we go we had to adjust that speaking bricks into go right ahead while it's good to be here could be here with governor HOGAN who is a great Republican governor from religious doing an amazing job in a deep blue state. And you know, he's fighting the battles. He's not one of them. All but he's fighting Amar where we're trying what you're winning more than you're losing the right? That's the Oregon some things done. Yeah. Absolutely. So when you think about what you're doing in Maryland. And you think about where you are politically what does that mean for twenty twenty and you personally. Well, I'm not sure what that means for me personally. But I'm just really right now focused on Maryland and enjoying myself here tonight. I don't have much to say about twenty. We're just the looking have some fun. You went up to New Hampshire though, you went up to New Hampshire. When people go to New Hampshire that by definition makes people like me more than mildly curious, you know, it's a beautiful time of year. We got New Hampshire all the cliches sounds very familiar to me. Spend their look at my point. Is you don't show up there accidents, you show up there to make a point what China point when you're trying to make look they're twenty some Democrats there visiting New Hampshire, and I just wanted to show a little political diversity, and they had invited me up back in January, and I are legislative session was finally over. And I decided to go up and just talk about some of the things that I thought were right. So what is important to you right now in politics right now is it President Trump is at the Republican agenda is it. What is what is important? You look I care about the future of the Republican party the future of the country. And quite frankly, I think we're setting an example in Maryland, just our state houses thirty miles down the road from Washington about how about how it is possible to actually work in a bipartisan fashion and get things done and solve big problems by working together in a bipartisan way. And that's unfortunately, it's frustrating, but that's not happening in Washington. We're not we're not really addressing a lot of the pro whose fault is that I think it's everybody's fault. I think there's. Plenty of blame to go around on both sides of the aisle. Does the president play a role in your blame certainly does? But so does the congress about the Republicans and the Democrats in Connor's votes in both house Ricky eager to jump in on this to? I just want to. Isa? He said some great leadership on healthcare did some waivers at the state of Maryland and dramatically reduced premiums. Just last year. I mean, it shows the innovation that can happen. If you let the privates let the states do some work and do some innovation. We can get away from this one-size-fits-all ObamaCare and have have a system that actually can work. And so, you know, governor HOGAN, actually, one of the guys go out and tell you I've done it. I'm really impressed. That Senator Santorum knows anything about my record live in Maryland is for the rest of the neighbor. I guess, you know, but. We'd lowered insurance premium for everyone for the first time in a decade, and we covered hundreds of thousands of people. So it can be done. We're the most it was the most innovative solution in the country. When you think about the future of the Republican party, which you just mentioned is something you think about is Donald Trump good or bad for that future. Well, I'm not here to just criticize the president. But I'm concerned about the future about the tone. And the fact that I believe made big ten Republican party and a return to more Reagan-esque Republican party where we reach out and try to attract more people. I am concerned that we're alienating folks. Look, I won the women vote. I got one third of the African American vote a one the Asian vote and split the Spanich vote. That's the kind of Republican party that can win national elections and win. Do you believe that's the Republican party of the future that has to be able to appear appeal rather across demographic groups, I think if we continue to shrink the party down to where we're feeling to a certain percentage of. White males. We're going to continue to see Senator Santorum. Give me a scholarship thoughts say about governor home, and this is really important, and this is a contrast between him and and and Donald Trump in that tone. Governor Hogan's tone is not confrontational. And it's it focuses on the issues. If it focuses on where we can agree what we can do together. And and he's proven to be very very successful with that. So. Look, I mean, I agreed by Lawrence is with the president taking us on on on most of the policies, but I have problem with tone and governor governor HOGAN show that tone does matter and getting things done you've run for president. You know, what it's like, you know, how hard it is. You know, how formidable Donald Trump was last time. We saw spend any time together. It was in Iowa. And it was a tough grow for you tough gopher lottery recommend anybody running against Donald Trump. But that's that's my thought it's not fun. The voice of experience. Right. Let me ask you center center as someone who participated in that process in two thousand sixteen evaluated your keenly involved. You comment on politics. All the time is Donald Trump. Good or bad for the Republican party. Yes, or no. Yes. Yes. And no. He's still got. But that's the politician. Look, I I've got no electoral future that I'm that. I'm worried about he's good at he's good. Because I think a lot of the policies put forward on tickly economic policies and very very strong. He's been great with dating very solid. Judges. Some from Maryland is a matter of fact, and and the reality is he has a problem in in intone as problem with connect with with certain groups of the governor identified so it just said, no and can that. Yes. And no, I think you're absolutely right. That's the true answer. But is that a long-term answer that Republicans and growing party can live with can live with the? No, well, that's a very, you know, look in the end. I believe that the president's going to get nominated again, that's what I believe. And and a we'll find out whether he can be successful. But to me that all the pens just like did two years ago. It all depends on to the other side nominates, and and may enough signed nominate someone who wasn't electable in my opinion. And they may do it. Again, this time, I think that's probably true. I think you know, the the Democrats might have an opportunity here. But it looks like they could also make a huge mistake by nominate somebody too far to the left. But look there's going to be a future for the party of beyond Trump, regardless of whether he's going to be president for just for the first term or another term. And I, and I just think we ought to talk about you know, what that future looks like. And I think there's room for diversity of opinion in our party in both parties. And I think it's worth having that discussion governor, I take you at your word. You didn't come here to trash the president anything like that at a want you to have fun. My wife is white around wondering while still talking to you right lined up here. So you could really have fun and say say definitively, you're not gonna run at twenty twenty. Look, I number one rule that out a number of people have been asking me to give it serious consideration. And what I said on Tuesday in New Hampshire was I it to them to to do just that. And that's what I'm doing. That's what you're doing. The filing deadline is November fifteenth. So we got plenty of time to think about that. Great governor, it's been a great pleasure. Thanks. Rick sent to stop and by the open, Mike, White House, correspondent's dinner. Jay Johnson back again Garrett who years in a row same time this year, either either I'm just in the same place, or I have a lot of video on me you to show a lot of pity. You can stand here for the last three hundred sixty five waiting. I never let right right. So let me ask you this is this has been since the year. We last talked at our open mic a tumultuous period of time for the department of homeland security, which you lead under President Obama. You heard about ending credibly tumultuous period of time the last two months. Yes. Is it dangerous to have that much turmoil? At the department of homeland security's it just dangerous. Well, I'm not. I'm not gonna say it's dangerous. I do know the Boehner abilities that are created by having so many bacon sees at senior most level of the department. My my issue is. When I was in office with three years. I constantly reminded the public that homeland security is aviation skirting border security, cyber security maritime security all the different ways in which we need to keeping the homeland safe. It's not just immigration. It's not just border security lately in their mission. And in the public mind, they're overwhelmed by the immigration issue. And I worry that the leadership of DHS such as it is right now is focused so much on the immigration mission. It could be to the exclusion others were laying on their back right about that by wreck. Let me go back to your tenure because the mullahs report has some indications that there were warning signs in twenty fourteen about malignant efforts by the Russians, and there's now a talking point coming from this White House that the department of homeland security Obama administration wasn't aggressive enough about respond. To that threat. I wanna give you a chance to respond. There were warning signs. And we saw one who signs there was an emerging rep picture and twenty six teen, and I should know less than I think seven public statements about the threats. We were seeing to election infrastructure in the summer of fall of twenty sixteen. I spoke to state secretaries of state about what they needed to be doing. They were reluctant they were reluctant. But the good news is that by election day. We had something like thirty three or thirty six states that actually came in and sought our help. Now. That's the good news bad news is that the Russian effort at fake news and leap publishing extremist views was something that we are still trying to understand the full extent of and the Russian government without a doubt. Undermine our democracy twenty cents when you hear the phrase uttered, sometimes by the president or people who are allies of him that the Obama administration on this question dropped the ball. You say what I say? That's absolutely incorrect. Priority one was informed. The American public which we did on October seventh regrettably lot going on that day because of your colleagues in the media did not get the attention that it deserved might of the access Hollywood video game day because the DNC hack same day. Same day isn't until December at the national media came back to to say, hey, the Russians interfered, so we'll be told you that tower seven now we had this issue in the last weeks of the Obama administration. Misset ministration has had this responsibility. Now for more than two years. Is it dropping the ball? They own the responsibility, my successor said democracy is in the crosshairs, very good. At is. No, less true. Now. Now than it was when she said it so preserving our democracy from foreign influence has to be proud number one for my old apartment and for the administration, March Johnson, always a great pleasure to see if they can stop. You have a great time Tom Perez, Tom Perez, the DNC chairman. He's right here. He's he's he's working the crowd. Come on get this cut. You you work in the crowd. You gotta work the, Mike. You can't work the crowd. You got it yet hog? Okay. Get on the mic again. America. Having breakfast with you. Remember, I pod casts. Not one of my I only want well. Well, I'm doing exit Tom Perez, ladies and gentlemen, the open mics White House correspondents dinner, pre party wa-, politico and CBS news, Tom Perez Democratic National Committee, chairman an exalted guest. Let me tell you. This is heavyweight stuff for the takeout. So you've been on the show before you're here. Now. Larry HOGAN, Republican governor governor from Maryland just said, President Trump. I don't know he's gonna get reelected, but Democrats may nominate someone so extreme he's going to win respond to Helga Democrats are gonna nominate someone who's gonna fight for health care because we believe if you have a pre existing condition you ought to be able to keep your coverage Republicans are trying to undo the Affordable Care Act. Democrats are going to nominate someone who understands that. It's unconscionable to have to make a choice between your insulin or your kids meals and Republicans are different Democrats understand that we need to build an America that works for everyone. A few at the top and major we ran the table in two thousand eighteen and made historic gains because we had a unity of purpose. We focused on the issues that people cared most about and we were able to win across the table. We we have a member of congress from Oklahoma. We have a governor of Kansas. We have a new member of congress from south. Carolina. We are winning up and down the ballot. Because I believe we continue to focus on the issues that matter most in the culture of corruption from this administration is is off the charts and people want a president that they can be proud of you said culture of corruption. That's a phrase Washington is used before is it a culture so corrupted it must be impeached. I believe that the house has an absolute responsibility to conduct the oversight. The the report is a beginning. It's not the end we have to investigate the numerous allegations that he tried to fire Mueller that he tried to ask sessions to unrig used himself all of the things that are outlined in. That report. Make no mistake about it. They have an undeniable obligation to conduct that oversight. But make mistake about an equally. Major the way we will remove Donald Trump from office will be at the ballot box on November the. Third twenty twenty and we will do so by going state by state talking about healthcare talking about an America that works for everyone talking about a democracy that includes everyone so you're for impeachment just on election day the best way to remove Donald Trump will be on November the third twenty twenty. Let me ask you about your field of candidates twenty. Now, you have Democratic National Committee sanctioned debates. How do you put that forward to the country in a coherent way in a way that doesn't favor one or the how are you going to let my aunt? It's no how they're going to see all these candidates and get a chance to hear them with the DNC process. Fairness is our north star and goal from the fine then to make sure everyone gets a fair shake. Here's how we define that. Let's say we have twenty people that qualify for our first debate in the end of June down in Miami. Right. We will have it two nights in a row ten and ten and we will draw. Allots randomly or we will have some sort of random assignment you televised though. Dave I wanna get dick by there. I'm begging begging will you tell the NBA draft little balls that come out of a hopper or something that would be that's ratings gold. Mr. I'd like to get dick by talent or someone else. Oh, baby. Look at this region. Why are we doing it? That way is the front runner doesn't have centerstage necessarily and could happen. But it would happen by ran right? So and we're going to do that in June. And we're going to do the same thing in July because I know three quarters the field, I've had the privilege of working with major. They're spectacular people. They have unity of values. And and what I wanna make sure happens is they all get a fair shake to share their vision with the American people. And then let's let the voters decide. That's why we're doing this. This is unprecedented. We've never had a structure that enables us to have no JV varsity and in order to get on the debate stage. It's not just polling. We've created a different threshold of grassroots fundraising because we want to bring in violence what that threshold what that threshold is two as to get on the debate states for Jew for June, July. Polling. One percent one percent and three three poll among a list of polls that we have outlined or alternatively sixty five thousand unique donors, meaning the can't be it can't be thirty thousand twice. It has to be sixty five thousand people right in an including at least two hundred in twenty states and people might ask the question. How did you figure that? Right. And the answer is. Like the campaign finance laws that were passed by congress in the early seventies. For public financing of presidential campaigns set forth thresholds in in one of the thresholds was having a at least two hundred donors and twenty days. So we took that, and then we modernized a little bit for to account for the fact that nineteen seventy-one in twenty twenty. We don't have John Travolta and bell bottoms and saying fever, we we're a little bit different. Now major and so we modernized it. But again, our north star was we wanna give everyone affair shop because twenty people in the field. Nineteen are gonna make the mountaintop before let you go. The president says you are leading party of socialists. Are you we're leading party that's fighting to make sure that everybody has access to healthcare that we save Medicare that we save Medicaid that we save social security and when Medicare, Medicaid and social security in the Affordable Care Act being debated. What they all had in common is Republicans called that socialism. I call that making capitalism work, the Trump campaign says the Democratic Party the national level is for this is their quote infanticide. It is for socialized medicine that would deny private insurance coverage to any American who wants it. They wanna give felons and terrorists the rights of votes, and they want open borders those of the floor. Most potent. Arguments, culturally wedge issue arguments against your party. We're for an America that works for everyone. We are in America in let me be clear when Medicare and Medicaid were being debated in nineteen sixty to nineteen sixty three nineteen sixty four. The Republicans were saying that Medicare will lead to socialism in America when social security was being debated in the nineteen thirties. Republican said social security will lead to socialism in America. What the Democrats believe is that capitalism needs to ensure that we have a thriving middle class. That's why we fight for healthcare. That's why we fight for quality education. That's why we fight for the fact that if you work a fulltime job, you should be able to feed your family, this Republican party wants to repeal the minimum wage, they think seven and a quarter is too much so ridiculous. When I hear you as I just did I hear you a sense. Saying bring it on the socialism argument, the socialism debate, which is what this campaign the president wants this campaign to be about. I hear you say bring it on. We what I'm saying is we want a capitalism that works for everyone when they don't when they're not right on the issues and they're wrong on Medicare. They're wrong to try to repeal Medicaid. They're wrong to try to repeal the Affordable Care Act. What they do is they try to distract the voters in two thousand eighteen the distraction was caravans caravans. They were talking about caravans. We were talking about healthcare. We won overwhelmingly in twenty twenty. We will be talking about making capitalism work for everyone. We will be talking about preserving healthcare. We will be talking about don't take your hands anywhere near Medicare or Medicaid or social security. They want to undo that. That's not America. It's best comper as always a pleasure with the Joe the dinner have care fun. I see will hurt the congressman the famous congressman from Texas will heard a feature guest at the takeout podcast microphones. But also weeds Jiang is here. My White House correspondent colleague AC. You're doing great. We hello. Bring your bring your my my other better your equipment, half equivalent half. How do we work will? We please introduce as my husband use looser low. Hello loser. Please come up to do. Not be bashful. No, get all the way up. You can have a microphone all of your own. There you go. There you go there's headphones. Yeah. You gotta have Luther you got this this. This is your whole initiation. All right. So the the news folks is we just back from eternity. Leave tell us all about Frankie, Frankie is, you know, by the way, major in our very teeny tiny White House. Booed virginia. Tiny me so many pep talk about parenthood, and he was right about everything all the cliches, right everything we imagined in more. And it really is the very best thing today thing, it's the very the most stressful thing because you're trying to keep another human alive, but she's wonderful. Luther very stressful. But also, really great, right? I'm a little bit awestruck right now, his big takeout listener. So I'm sort of speechless. That's okay. That's okay. It happens in my presence. All the time next. Actually, never happens. It never ever ever ever ever ever happens through this. Thank you for letting me have some sense of what might be like to to render someone speech. We also have the microphones will heard Republican congressman from Texas. Reelection winner narrowly won reelection, very tough. You retarget the Democrats Democrats swept all sorts of competitive races. But not yours. Correct. So your back, and you one of the few Republicans here will hurt you go to dangerous places, don't shoot. Well. I did live in Pakistan for two years and Afghanistan for year and a half government mission, by the way. The Central Intelligence Agency. I can handle the White House correspondent. So but now it's good to be looking for a good cause right? It's scholarships for aspiring journalists. Thank you for that. Congressman because I used to be on the board of directors of the White House correspondent association this dinner gets a lot of static and hassle this dinners, essentially a fundraiser for one goal one overarching goal scholarships for college journalists and the money that we raise here goes to fun though scholarships. So it's all about that. It's about a glitz a lot of other things. Yes. Indeed. But that's under lying and Johnson reason and your job is getting harder and harder right to be able to educate the American the world on issues of the day. And the different formats doing a podcast today. He didn't know this when you were going through college. Congressman I didn't know what a podcast three years ago. Was there lecture? Did you have trysofi? None. The White House move this impression to cut the try to cut the electrically all the time. That's just a joke. Let his Jillian Hello stranger. Hold on the Arsim Bassett's United States and this grace pastor. Thank you. Thanks for finding me to take part. I really appreciate it. Tell me why you're here. And what an ambassador does that an event like this while I'm here because there are a lot of people I know here as well. And I'm a big fan of the media. I was a press spokesman for the Irish government for all of eight years, and I still have another media friends. So I'm very good friend of the media industry. Generally, how many months would say how can you still have friends in media fewer a spokesman for eight years? Let you go. I. Case Inle about always nice to make up with them afterwards on since coming to Washington. I made a lot of friends in the media on really enjoy connecting with the Washington. Press corps. So chance tonight to see them all and also to pay tribute to the work. They do on behalf of the people of the world. Mr besser. Thank you for saying that what's the impression in Ireland of President Trump. And what do you think the European impression of this very different American president is we're all fascinated. Of course, spy what we see happening in America. But of course, remember their things happening in Europe as well that are that are represent a change. I mean, you know, the mainstream when I was, you know, starting off as diplomats there was a certain kind of center political world, which which prevailed for many many years and the question is whether recent developments in America, and then Europe suggests that there's been a sea-change and that we're in a new era now, I'm not sure we are. I think we might see a reversion back to more conventional traditional politics. In course. But I think we're going through a period of turbulence in politics both in America. Also in Ireland, your Mr. investor when I was on the campaign trail in Brexit passed I wondered if that was not a foreshadowing of President Trump's election when there are certain similarities because clearly people in Britain were affected by a feeling of being left out by Bill that is Asian and by developments in Europe, distant bureaucrats, etcetera cetera, of course, that was all on fair, and I always get and I was in Basseterre in Britain joined the referendum campaign. They always made the point that actually Europe it's quite a democratic entity. And in fact, it has brought peace and prosperity to Europe for the last seventy years. But unfortunately, it was didn't really wash with with enough people, and therefore the referendum narrowly went in favour, all Val, even EU. But since that time, it's become very apparent how difficult how complex leaving the U is. But Menards point of view. Our main concern is to avoid damaging the. Peace process in Northern Ireland. And that's a name we share with the British common with the American administration, frankly and give my audience and update on where that is the White House. Put a statement out very recently. I think just yesterday what was her Jing? Some new steps agent was a tragic killing of young journeys. Twenty nine year old Northern Irish journalist was killed in some violence in Derry last week, and that is really galvanized people in Ireland on people have realized that this vacuums political vacuum that's existed for two years needs to be broken. So the two governments have decided to stock a new talks process to try and broker a new agreement between unionist and nationalist northern. So that the government of Northern Ireland Ken Starr to function again hasn't been functioned now for more than two years. And the hope is that that would help to resolve the problems of Northern Ireland and to ensure that the won't be returned to violence. The problem with Brexit is the there's always a risk of a hot. Hard border being established. And that would also provide opportunities for people violence to to to assert themselves. And the last thing we want in Ireland or Britain is to see the violent people who it so much trouble over thirty years. We don't wanna see them coming back into action. Again, you're so well-versed Innis, and one of the things I love to do with my show is help people understand things. They may see a headline about they may read one story about, but they can learn from somebody who's deeply involved. What's actually happening? You talk about the heart border. You talked about Brexit. You talked about this atmosphere. Go little bit deeper feel free to get granular with my audience. Let them know what that means. You see in our Lund's the border is it's not like the border between say American Canada, which is a straight line across the forty nine parallel is not even the border between Mexico and the United States, which is again, a fairly straight line the border and Arden's goes through houseful phones, it goes. Through farms. It goes through villages. It has no physical basis and for the last twenty five years since peace was established in Northern Ireland, and because the European Union this been no need have any board or controls on the island of the fear is that if Britain leaves the European Union and leaves the customs union customs control as Libby require between north and south. Airland and the rest of them. You mean that would be physical infrastructure which would just throw the move into people across the border today. There are people cross that border half dozen times a day to go to the nearest shop. Whatever might be on the other side of the border farmers who deuce milk in northern out and send it to the south far at processing ours farmer pharmacist out send their animals to the north you slaughtered and exported to Britain. So so the economic links and the people the people are really quite vital. We don't wanna see those in any way affected by having a hard border. And in fairness the British government also wants to avoid the hard border. But the problem is how do you do that if Britain leaves the customs union right leaves the same the customs union is part of the European Union order, right? So it means that if you have two different customs authorities in Serey, you need some kind of chores right to ensure that the customs rules are applied. And how does that in any way affect the fear of violence? You mentioned. Zere the fear is that the political uncertainty give scope to the there are small number of people in northern out and who have never accepted the peace agreements agreement. Right. Those are the hard line. Those are the people kill journalist last week on the fear is that if you wrecked any kind of border posts that those border post would be attacked and that could lead to a spiral that creates a resumption violence. Now, I'm not saying that we definitely happen. But the risk is there on as far as we're concerned that risk is too big to shake, right? And when the British occupied those poster in the troubles they were attacked. I mean that was attacking, of course, you had to be security apparatus put there, and then you have an escalation the last twenty years has been a wonderful time in Arlon because people have been able to move back and forth. But I was going up, for example in the south of I never went to northern. Nobody ever went down. The trouble is put people off. Now. People go freely open down this a a wonderful road between Belfast Derry. Is wonderful playing when you were child. Yeah. We couldn't do that. No, one would go. It was and we don't see it back to what it was like before. Because what it means? We have open borders people can talk to each other. They can realize what they have in common, and they can get around the differences that divide dividing before. I let you go because I knew him when he was a Senate majority leader he became a crucial negotiator George Mitchell in the process same opener to about George Mitchell. George Mitchell is regarded as a secular saints, right? He is seen an I know myself. I was there twenty years ago. I was on the Irish delegation for the Good Friday negotiations, and I was there for on an offer year more and I saw George Mitchell in action and what he had was patience, wisdom and ability to keep going, endurance. And I remember times it looked the whole gonna collapse. George Mitchell, KOMO journalists and he's on distinctive way. He would reassure everyone that all was not at an end. And that we could come back a week later and resumed the talks and the happen. Eventually he got these parties to agree to a very complex, but very powerful agreement which has brought peace in other for twenty years. That's the piece we want to preserve all costs. And that's why is so vitally. We avoid any damage that peace process coming from Brexit's before he became into shooter over there. He was very effective legislative negotiator here in America. And I covered stories which he was involved, and he was a central figure, and it was always said he had the iron. But yeah, he would not get up. He would not get up from the chair. He would sit longer than anyone. No one could sit longer than George Mitchell could complement. It was it was it was a he was adversaries didn't think of it necessarily as a benefit every time, but his endurance. Use your word made a difference here. And I hear your voice amid a difference there. Absolutely. I mean as can remember times when he was being hill. Hurried on attacked from different sides of the negotiations. And he just sort of sat there on the had the the wisdom to realize that these things would pass. And I always liked the quotes aligned with my favorite is port. William butler. Yeats peace comes dropping slow and George Mitchell. Understood that he understood that you couldn't have peace overnight. You have to be there for the long haul and twenty years after the Good Friday agreement. You still have a way to go. You still have work to do. But the inspiration. I take is from the work that joys Mitch did. And the the belief. I have that work was so vital that we cannot afford ever to jeopardize Mr. Vassar. Thank you so much. Thank you for all that. That was really great fantastic. Okay. Now, we have CBS royalty approaching the open mics here at the pre party, White House correspondents dinner. I major Garrett. This the takeout CBS news. Of course, it's collaborative partner here. Politico. The CBS royalty approaching the microphones Jeff glor- anchor evening news. Hello, jeff. Hello major. How we doing? I walked. And I heard the mate and iron butts was the first thing I write. It was the first words I heard that's how we roll, here takeout. We go straight street here out, the takeout. Okay. And pull the read my colleague at the White House. Paula you look spectacular. Also, look spectacular being sexy, or sexist you. Both look fantastic. Thank you. Great to have you with us. How the vest major investors tremendous. Yes. Yes. I'm styling a paisley black Cheeto best. Yes. Pigging it. Yes. Twenty two dollars Amazon. That's also how I roll. Okay. Amazon basis twenty two dollars and. That's right. You can have one they make literally in barrels that are like biggest houses. I love it. Jeff. How are you willing to I'm well, it's my first time on the takeout. Hi, paula. Person. Talk on television, all the time. Facedly fucking. But so rarely person. So rare on the radio, exactly. So the funny story about the radio is I I do the the hourly at five pm every weekday, and they always make fun of me when I get back to the fishbowl, which is where we coordinate stories freezing news every night because I'm always bragging literal fishbowl. No, no, no. And it's no longer in case in glass. So it's not even a fish all anymore. Very open. Very hit is in broken down, those silos where like everyone else folks, and we have the sun, but I come back and I- brag about radio. So they say I like it more than than TV, which is not true. But I do enjoy we have a saying here at the takeout radio. It's the future of television. Portnoy. Oh, my speaking of radio. Hayes is the takeout. Exactly. The radio, voice course dinner. That's right. The voice, the radio voice of the takeout. Steven Portnoy, get up on the microphone here. Now. It's going to be with you. And you how. We all CVS royalties assembled. All CBS royalty has off lack horns represented the exact major swag. Here. Is this insult those those are the world, famous takeout. Can I? Oh, yes. Absolutely using. Oh, yes. As their new coasters coasters podcast toasters. Yes. Like, the so you can take those home they work very well. They're very durable. Very durable. I've had my same on the best six months. Not even a ring. I'm using mine right now. There you go. As you like to say here at the takeout these podcast stickers signed by me, suitable for every application in your life and your afterlife. Those are my those two jokes now done I'm finished. That's it. That's all I've got. But someone here might be able to get me a drink. I don't know. But maybe maybe maybe not weakened surly. And we should I'm gonna use the coaster tomorrow night's with a beer while watching the battle winter comb. Here we go. Here we go. Everyone onic. Everybody's going to everyone is going. Well, maybe but who's gonna live is the question not many people. What shows this? I think one or two Starks. Everybody in this Home Box Office. We're talking about came at ever heard of it. A major take down out the first game of thrones. I'm not a fan. Why are you a fan major? I watched the first episode. I clearly not a Representative sample. Look, I oftentimes him out of step with my countrymen on lots of things. Clearly, I'm out of step in my country with the world on this. But I watched that first episode like I said, not a Representative sample, but I couldn't carry on. Why? Because I thought it was so racked with the stale list cliches of modern storytelling. Okay. Ouch. And things that are also just unbelievable Olek. So watching David Benny off in Devi y. Or listening. Excuse me. Sorry. What actually I don't disagree with major? I want to know what's going to happen with former congressman John Ryan on veep which follows follows. Salita taken over by game. Thrones. I don't have time for. Here's what happened. So people people. I it's interesting with major says because I've heard multiple evil say what major said is that they watched the first episode. They just weren't into it. What happened with me was I watched for I watch for four seasons and like bad stuff just kept happening and kept happening there weren't payoffs. And then in one of something particularly bad happen to a little girl. Polly. You'll know what I'm talking about in season four five. And I said I'm done. I'm not watching this any more. I it's it's so horrible. And but I got sucked back in because people are talking about it. So I returned back the dragons the death zombies. That's not the point the point is political family power. Sure. Those those are the most epic and original and longstanding stories in all of literature and all of human kind of go back to the Greeks. Godfather is based on that the board is is based on that all the great series are based on that dynamic of family power the application thereof and the savage use when it's necessary to preserve power one. Other thing. This is one of the only shows I've ever seen in my lifetime or you have female billons who are three hundred sixty degree characters and female heroes who are right up there where the guys and doing just as well, the arcs into the shows of the scale and of this type where you have that. And I will say that was not in any way apparent or even foreshadowed episode. Victim. That was a thing that bothered him. They all kill their their victimisers soil, very careful to not give anything away. But the first the first season that first step Assode, women and children who are the victims in the snow. Oh own the how clever is this? The dwarf is the one who's well in down. Okay. Great L that. So freaking originally come on. Wait a minute. Wait a minute. Wait a minute. The prostitutes will win in their old gorgeous await a minute. How often does that happen? Majors watch the show one episode at least the weighing and our sensors back to. I love winter fell. Yes, I'm very much looking forward to today as a high tomorrow, emotional low. We'll have to have we'll talk tomorrow night or we'll talk on Monday morning. But so the last four episodes, basically, they're all lake are they all going to be like eighty or ninety minutes. Now is that I think. The longest one the batter battle of winter foul, and then they're going to be a little bit longer. But I I think this is a long since eighteen minutes within my only here's my my thing right now, we've been talking about this week in the bull is that. So once you're past this, you still have three episodes to go. Really tight lipped, but you have all these people on islands threatens. There's also a fourth dragon in the credits. In the in the sword. The predicted the right way east. Yeah. She's crossover. Yes. No. It's a really like t- what just happened. Most popular part. Collagen, you resist hours. Yeah. What what just happened that fourth dragon, whatever you're talking? I haven't Rican clue, but it is going to be. Grown our podcast platform one. It's like forty thousand hollering. Thank you. I. That's great. So have you been to this dinner before Jeff? Yeah. By tatan. Do you think it says odious and contemptuous and contemptible mostly fighters from Washington, it's different? It's different now. Oh, yeah. I bet that he ain't here popping out here. Well, big you have a big daddy's not here. Also like my colloquial reference to the forty fifth president gets. Okay. I can do it at the open, Mike. We're little bit lax. But it's but it's a different. There's been a resets, right? Yeah. To to say, the least. Yes. And so I think that probably takes a couple years to settle out fully in terms of resetting that, but to the extent that it's, you know, nerd prom to the extent that it said that can and should be series event while people are having fun. Yep. I I don't think that's a bad notion. If you want to full on Hollywood palooza, that's a different issue. Right. Very much. What was more in the Obama era and the Clinton era is tends to be less Hollywood during Republican administrations and certainly zero. Hollywood now. Yeah. But everything can move with the times as game of thrones has has has we go down to. Down down. And so that's okay. It doesn't mean it can't shift back the other way at some point. But, but it's part of the culture it is. It is definitely part of the White House culture. And just audience knows not always the president here. But an edict went out from the White House. Nobody from the administration was essentially given a green light to attend this. We've CBS had agreements people had within the White House. And with the administration writ large had said, yes, we will go. We will be your guests me will sit with you. We will have a conversation to a person by yesterday afternoon every single person under duress withdrew from this dinner under orders under and that's very different thing. And is it the biggest crisis ever to affect American democracy? No, clearly, it isn't. But it this is a place where people can get to know each other establish a kind of repore that is slightly informal. But it's also professional, and I will tell you this when I was younger porter in the city back in the. Nineties this dinner. I worked at for six hours. Why to get sources to meet people a hand on my card and tell people I was covering stories. They were involved in when people who are in powerful positions. Don't come to this. That's something. That's missed. I thought huge crisis. But it's different as different in kind. And it's different in measure anything is this is a part of Washington's traditions, right? This dinners been held every year since nineteen twenty one. So nearly one hundred years we've been meeting like this donning tuxedos. Women weren't even allowed to attend this dinner until nineteen sixty two when Helen Thomas prevailed on John F Kennedy. He said he wouldn't come and less women were actually allowed inside. Good on right, Kim. So we're gonna keep having this dinner because it's for the people who on a daily basis all in me. And you major walk behind those gates and present the story of the American presidency. Not just the any individual president, but president presidency to the American people and all the free peoples of the world. So we're gonna you know, I've I've read a lot of criticism that we should stop having dinner. I don't believe I don't agree. I fundamentally guess what this dinner will exist in twenty twenty one and twenty thirty one and twenty forty for another hundred years got just so everyone on the snows. We're not having a comedian tonight. We're having Ron churn out distinguish presidential historian, and author if you know anything about Hamilton, and I bet you do he wrote the underlying text that became the Hollywood sensation and musical that it is. And he's just finished an amazing by Phoebe of grant. So he will give short talk tonight decide of take the comedic age out of the evening because it was decided. By people who I agree with that. It was getting to edgy and too confrontational and Washington and White House correspondent suddenly had to become arbiters of comedy. And that's not a position to be very good. There's an argument to be made in that favor that that one if it does get to edgy into what I can swing. That's right. You can either way. Exact exact, and we have so Jeff Lor always a pleasure. See my user for being here. Hollering? Thanks. Trag thing. Figure out what that means. I'm not a nine pm HBO. Kim HBO different topics are Houston, your shirt you. Stay here toss to break. This is the take. I just want to say the only reason stays say thank you for our audience all that you do to help the show all that. You did for us in Vietnam at the end of the summer when I declined back on Air Force One. You are a stalwart supporter, a dear friend, a cherished asset of the takeout. And I just wanna say, thank you. Thank you. I appreciate it. Where's my baseball team? It's right for year. It's right here. I'm dispensing baseball tickets right now. Hey, so here's your ticket for tomorrow's gay and task today game after a night game. All right. You get out of here fun. All right. There's nothing like an open, Mike extravaganza or pre party. I like them both. Thanks for joining us. I major Garrett at the White House correspondents dinner pre party. We'll see next week. New episodes of the takeout her available Friday mornings rever, you get your podcasts. Takeout produced by Arden, far Katana crescendo and Jamie Benson CBS end production by Alexander moment, and Eric SU summit follow us on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram takeout podcast. That's at takeout podcast and for more, visit takeout podcast dot com. The takeout is a production of CBS News Radio.

president President Trump America White House Washington White House correspondent Republican party White House governor HOGAN Garrett Maryland CBS New Hampshire congressman twenty twenty March Johnson George Mitchell Mike Republican party congress
The Last Frontier | Chapter 11

Boomtown

52:49 min | 6 months ago

The Last Frontier | Chapter 11

"Support comes from ramblers sparkling water. The one and only Texas limestone filtered sparkling water. Rambler is a proud supporter of Texas parks. Wildlife Foundation helping to conserve Texas lands and waters for future generations visit ramblers sparkling water dot com to find a six pack near You. Hashtag get rambling okay. The the light detracting from and Yeltsin shape colour. It's like Kinda gets ready to trade at knock. I'm standing in a moonlit pasture on a ranch outside of Marfa Texas. It's nearly midnight. In the middle of July I'm squinting into the darkness looking at well. I'm not sure exactly what I'm looking at his Alanon. That's a car coming from out find. That's where that's Mike. Surely He's giving me and a few friends has personal or of the famous Marfa Lights for the uninitiated folks have been observing strange glowing orbs in this area since the eighteen hundreds though there are theories ranging from the scientific to the supernatural. No one knows exactly what they are. These mystery lights are just wanted the mini features of this area of West Texas. That makes it different. And when we're sitting right here and a week ago one flew. I was sitting right by the front of my truck and then flew right to to us to the front of my truck went over the hood to the windshield. The windshield out the back over the car that was parked by us. Then it disappeared. If I'd known it was coming I could lactic McCain. There's a lot more than strange lights that distinguish this region of West Texas known as the Trans Pages or the big bend. It lies just to the south of the Permian Basin and while much of the Permian is flat as a sheet cake. The Big Ben country is marked by striking mountain ranges. The break-up the Horizon Big Sky in Grassy plains the red cliffs of the Davis Mountains Markets Northern Boundary while the thin brown ribbon of the Rio Guerande forms it southern border with Mexico. And it's definitely moving. It's like dude. It's quite a bit. That's no and this rivalry over. Y'All see that really really Yeah Okay Raptors read. Yes that is. That's the Big Daddy. That's the Big Daddy. The big the big daddy named Barbara. Okay can be named say. Why can't he be named Barbara? Now you're absolutely right. Like the Permian Basin. This region relies on the land for much of its economy. But they're not drilling for oil and gas here. The beauty and solitude is the draw. There's the hikers at big been National Park Artists Marfa Stargazers and Fort Davis Rodeo cowboys and Alpine honeymooners and Marathan adventures enter Lingua and hunters on the sprawling ranch is scattered throughout this wide. Open country at night. There's nothing but velvety black sky. Overhead and the occasional Phantom orb. Here there are no pump. Jacks no flares no wind turbines at least not yet. I'm Chris Wallace. And this is Boon town in our final episode. We spend some time exploring the rugged big been region of Far West. Texas wildcatters have poked around for oil and gas in this area before but the record breaking production and the Permian Basin has push companies to explore areas further out in a big fine near the Davis. Mountains has brought the boom to the big vins doorstep for the first time we talk with those who are grappling with how to make a living and still keep the beauty of the big bend intact. This is episode eleven the last frontier. So here's some horses for you to look at their winter coat on don't they? They do and and like these these particular three here. Some older horses. So they're not gonNA quiet look pretty to the eye but they have been helping me make a living for a long time. That's Craig Carter. He's introducing me to some of his horses that have been featured in films and TV. We're on his ranch. Deep in the heart of the big bend country over twenty miles from the nearest small town. Names you And Rico is twenty. Nine years old retired it was in the remake of the Alamo lots of commercials. Cisco if you go and he's probably been in thirty pictures. Tread Carter is a horseman though he's hesitant to call himself that for Craig and others like him. The term carries an almost spiritual heft a title that has to be earned but Craig's modest earnings. He spent most of his fifty seven years making a living on horseback and his skills have made him a sought after animal ringler for Hollywood productions and then again a bunch out here that we're in twelve strong as far as something recent no country for old men. Oh the remake of the magnificent seven. Most of these most of these were in the whole we put together two hundred fifty head of horses for that show. It was absolutely crazy. Mind Boggling. Last year of these Craig's spent seven months away from his family working on movie sets in Virginia elsewhere around the country. I've got some horses that That were born in Mexico. And they're tough not always real big and not beautiful confirmation Rico on his best day would be left out of a horse show in our great state of Texas but when it comes to traversing this rough country and and as I say pretty is pretty does. When I shook Craig's hand the first time I met him earlier that morning I noticed he had the same calloused hands as a roughneck when we stepped inside his home to talk he removed a sweat stained silver belly hat and didn't put it back on until he stepped out. Later to pee off the Front Porch Craig was raised in the big bend his routes. They're run deep. His Mom's side of the family were among the first white settlers in the region over a century ago. Back when the region's population was largely made up of Mexican immigrants who worked at QUICKSILVER MINDS. Craig's family settled in the basin of the Cheetah's mountains near the center of Big Bend National Park. The carters ran the only horse riding outfit in the park. Craig took to the work. Even as a young boy when he was twelve and faced with the prospect of spending six hours shuttling back and forth to the nearest middle school. He convinced his parents to let him home school so he could spend more time riding. Show back then. I was horseback every day. You know of the parkway eleven hundred square miles so I felt that was my backyard and then we had the family history there so I would go visit places that I'd heard stories about from Ansett new my great grandparents so the the the the whole parks is phenomenal. There's some oasis out in the desert or not a lot. A lot of them are not written about known about the budget spectacular classes based on the records his dad kept Craig estimates. He's ridden the South Rim trail through the mountains. Some seven hundred times the the chisels basin is like an island of of mountains jutting up surrounded by desert. It's undescribable is spectacular. The South Rim is seventy six seventy eight hundred feet and it breaks off and you can see hundred twelve miles of the Rio Grande making the Big Ben on a clear day. They can see two hundred sixty miles in the distance Our horse left from the Chitose Base. And that about five thousand feet in the first three and a half miles. We climbed eighteen hundred feet is. It's a drastic for a kid who loved riding horses and was fascinated. By the Western novels of Louis l'amour the setting was practically heaven. The surrounding desert is one of the most ecologically diverse regions in North America. Craig would spot deer mountain lines. Black bears coyotes. Foxes Bob Cats in plenty of rattlesnakes. There are people too though they were spread out and relatively few about one person for every square mile You know as a kid growing up out here. I drive sixty eighty miles just to go find a a party you know. What were the parties? Like out of curiosity. I can remember two hundred people being at the park entrance on the west side of cars. All parked got together. Pl- jam session and hanging out in the desert. We'd all go home. We had work. Yeah Bonfires. Somebody's Little Caserta. You know not not in the park. Nope no open fires there but truly late. This dancing in the dirt. While his mom gave him school lessons. Craig's Dad taught him acoustic guitar on weekends. Craig and his dad would drive over to the tourist hotspot of lettuce a tiny village on the banks of the Rio `Grande they'd start their Gig at noon and play country music for ten or twelve hour straight. Craig's love for Music Vinci grew as big as his passion for horses. He started dreaming about moving to Nashville to be a songwriter but not even in his wildest daydream could he have imagined his big break would end up coming from Switzerland. Yep One day while working at the family's dude ranch. He met a Swiss country singer. He's like George Strait of Europe. Wow what's his name George? Who'd agers Yuji almost rolls off? The tongue dislike George Strait Georgia flown in Nashville to record album and afterward he jumped in an RV and drove down to big bend. He came to ride horses at the park. And that's where he bumped into Craig. They quickly became friends and he wrote me a letter. A few months later Would you be interested in coming to play in Switzerland in August and I wrote so there would be no misunderstanding? I just wrote back. Hi George Thank you. August open so about seventy five trips later to to Europe of headcount of a career over there. Oh Craig did eventually move to. Nashville tries hand as a songwriter. The plan was to make some money so he could help his father who is still leading trail rides in the park by their own piece of land in West Texas in the mid nineties after years of scraping their savings together they finally managed to fulfil their dream of owning their own ranch. The name of the place when we came here was Buro flacco which means skinny dunking in the creek. That you crossed right before you turn. It comes through part of the north west of our on. Our property is called Spring Creek so we named the Ranch Spring Creek but I tell everybody is still a little bit flocco. Sometimes only a year and a half. After they bought the place. Craig's father passed away. Suddenly money got tight. Craig was still living in Nashville at the time but decided to return home to make things work financially and keep the land. Craig had to get creative. In addition to his work as a touring musician he acted in a couple of small commercials. He quickly realized that there was a lot more work behind the camera than in front of it. He guys first Gig as a Horse Wrangler on a movie called Dancer Texas. He's been working on movie sets with animals ever since the used to call him head wrangler. Now they're kind of gravitating to animal trainer animal coordinator but if I'm your animal coordinator and it's your show. I'm GONNA handle all the animals or all the reptiles or whatever so even though I'm not Alayan handler or don't work with bears. I know who to call to facilitate it for you. My boss Craig has figured out a way to make it work but like other landowners in the region. He still has to make tough decisions to keep afloat. Several years ago he was approached by major oil company looking to develop some leases on his land. And the way that we would get a letter asking if we'd be interested in talking and we we said No. Thank you not at this time. We didn't say no contact us left the door cracked and and they send you a letter saying that they think at least for this amount of mountain. It wasn't enough to make a difference within all of a sudden it turned into enough to make a difference so that's when we actually met with them and talk like I said it never did develop and come to pass but it's back to paying the bills the in in that regards. I don't judge people so harshly about what they might have on their place. Maybe they needed at the time. Maybe maybe they're not happy about the decision. But that's where I think. Respect Big Ben come in respect. Big Ben is an initiative launched in two thousand nineteen with support from the Cynthia and George Mitchell Foundation. It was formed in part to give landowners access to research and legal support when they're approached by energy companies looking to develop on their land crag was approached by respect big Ben to join their stakeholders group. And so I was asked to come attend meeting with this group and was honored to go. Listen and my biggest positive thought about them. Doing this is that they're having the conversation where it leads and how it goes. It's going to be different situations for every situation that comes but I just love the fact that they're having the conversation about the small towns about the land about how how this might change that and what we could do how we could be smart here. The idea behind respect big Ben came from Mary Lou. Hastings Hi Mary Lou Hastings on the vice president of sustainability programs at the Cynthia George Mitchell Foundation in Austin Texas. She's worked for the Mitchell family in various roles for twenty four years. She started in the woodland's working on a sustainable communities project that George Mitchell funded along with the National Academy of Sciences. She met her husband Mitch while working there. Today Mary Lou run several programs at the Mitchell Foundation which focused on topics ranging from clean energy to water conservation and sustainable education but the respect big bend initiative is closest to her heart for one thing Mary Lou is from West Texas so I grew up in Midland. My Dad was a petroleum engineer. And we also have a family ranch in the panhandle and by grew up driving up and down. State Highway Three. Eighty five with my dad and my mom of course and as you know highway. Three eighty-five goes from the big bend way up North but it runs near Odessa right to our family ranch Mary. Lou and Mitch Spent Their Honeymoon Big Bend National Park in one of the cabins nestled in the basin of cheetos mountains were Craig Carter's family wants ran their dude ranch. It was December nineteen ninety eight an epic ice storm swept through the roads were closed and the power went out so they had to hole up in the room for four days eating by the light of a Coleman Leaner when we finally went down we went to Santillana Canyon that that overlook on the east side and my husband was an economist and he study water but specifically he did a lot of work he was doing a lot of work into time on the Rio Grande. He'd never seen the Rio Grande he was from Kansas and He did a lot of work in Latin America and Brazil. But he'd never been to the park before so the one and only place I got to take him. On our honeymoon was Santa Elena Canyon Flanking both sides of the Rio Guerande? The Kenyan is formed by sheer walls of pink and cream colored limestone rising up to fifteen hundred feet above the water. It's a place I know. Well my friends and I have spent days paddling through Santa Elena Canyon above you bighorn. Sheep scaled a steep walls. Canyon wrens glide like paper airplanes as you wind through the Canyon there hidden fern field valleys to explore and when the river bins the stony banks that have formed their make for ideal picnicker camping spots. It's a humbling experience at one of the most beautiful places. I've ever been for Mary Lou. The Canyon has become deeply significant. She and Mitch made regular trips to the national park and would often return to Santa Elena to admire the winding Rio. `Grande six years. After the honeymoon there Mary Lou found out she was pregnant with their first child but on the same day the couple got the best news of their life. They also received the worst. Mitch was diagnosed with Colon Cancer. Mary Lou gave birth to their daughter in June of two thousand five. Her husband died three weeks later before he passed. They settled on a name. They called their daughter Elena. After the Kenyan they had loved Was around this time that the shell boom took off impart thanks to the fracking. Innovations of her employer George Mitchell a decade later the boom had expanded into places that had never been developed before. The southern periphery of the Permian Basin. Right on the doorstep of the Big Ben Country and so my two world started colliding so I became very interested in asking the question. To what extent will there be development out here and if there is going to be development. What is it GONNA look like? And if it's GonNa look bad what do we do? Because landowners have and mineral owners have rights to develop their land and extract resources but are they fully informed about the impact that will have and what science can we provide them? What information can we provide them so that they're making the best possible decisions or arrangements that they can? An Texas is the only state in the country that produces oil and gas. That does not have what we call a surface in eastern surface damage protection for landowners. There's some requirements of things but In general when oil and Gas Company has done with piece of land. Then there's no obligation to restore that piece of land. But when landowners decide to lease their land they can negotiate with energy companies to develop the infrastructure in ways that will minimize damage to their property and when production stopped require them to restore land but even then a place. Like the Chihuahua. Desert takes an extremely long time to heal Mary. Lou points out that the impact on the land isn't limited to oil and gas solar requires a lot of acreage to produce energy on a commercial scale. It's not just that they come out and pulls in the ground and put a solar panel on it. They scrape the ground and level that they take out the vegetation and then there are certain impacts from that woman desert or any desert ecosystem is very slow to regrow hundreds of years sometimes publicly respect. Big Ben is not seeking any changes in policy. They're not even seeking any specific outcomes. Much of the energy develop in the region is still speculative but based on the research the group has funded West Texas is likely to be quote the most energy intensive area in the world for decades to come Mary Lou has seen the devastation in parts of the Permian and she knows a similar cycle has played out with booms all over the world. I've lived through it. Many people have lived through it and it's the legacy of what oil and gas firms do when they move in their Manak. They get depressed and they move out leaving a devastated town behind is part of the worst of the legacy of the industry and they don't just do it here they do it. Globally Mary. Lou is working hard to try and ensure that some of the mistakes she seen in the Permian aren't repeated in the TRANSPAC is region. She's not really optimistic about the future. Well I have a fourteen year old daughter and I held her tight and thank God help you and I'm not a climate crisis person but based on science we're way behind the curve and thirty years from now or forty years from now or however. Many years isn't good enough and I just don't think human nature is capable of that level of cooperation. I don't think we're smart enough to figure out the technology and I don't think we have enough money to deploy in ten years as someone who works on behalf of an organization that made its billions from fracking and natural gas. Mary Lou says that it's not their mission to stop energy from being developed in the region. But she does hope to at least protect certain beloved corners of the Big Bang. Every time I drive here driving into the park driving from the park to lingua and then back at night with a full moon it's mystical. It's haunting its majestic. It's not like any other place now that we're well past the start of the New Year. 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Why upstart is ranked number one in their category with over three hundred businesses on trust pilot and hurried up start dot com slash boomtown to find out. How low your upstart rate is checking? Your rate only takes a few minutes. That's upstart dot com slash boomtown. One recent Saturday morning I woke up early to meet with Coin Gibson. We met at Marfa public radio on the town's Main Street if I had to judge the book by its cover. I'd have pegged coin as a farmer. He wore rang. Lurs 's an insulated work jacket. His hair was clipped into a buzz cut and his face was ruddy from the sun. But coin is a scientist with a deep history oil and gas I was born in Midland Texas and the Permian Basin and have been I've lived everywhere in Texas. That has an air force. Base is one way to look at things. My family comes from oil and gas background Over the last Straw for generations. So it's been part of my life forever. Coin was also frank about the fact that he receives oil and gas royalties from his family's mineral rights though he's hoping to divest soon today coin is a member of a local group called the Big Ben Conservation Alliance as a young man coin went to work in the oil and gas industry like three generations of his family before him but one day in nineteen eighty two. Everything changed he was working a Gig in Wyoming at sour gas processing facility. Sour gas is a natural gas that contain significant amounts of hydrogen sulfide a poisonous gas. It smells like rotten eggs. It can be deadly. Even in small doses. One day coin was on his way to the facility when something struck him as odd. We're on a bus house sitting next to the site safety manager and it struck me as odd that there were cows where there shouldn't have been any cows and about every fifty to seventy five yards bamboo pole with a wind sock on it so. I asked the guy said what's this all that and he said well. If you ever see a down cow look at the wind sock and run upstream and because he said those cows are going to be down from us our gasoline so we use them like the Canary in the coal mine and that just it was some profound thing for me and we got to the site. I worked today out at the end of the day. I said I'm going home tomorrow. I'm done I left the industry that day. There is a small town nearby and he was haunted by the thought that something might happen to the folks living there by walked away from the industry itself. But I've stayed. I the sound strange but I followed that project pretty much on a weekly basis are over mind higher life to make sure that nothing was going wrong with that plant You know the the notion that that could happen just almost unbearable after leaving. Oil and gas coin got a job in the semiconductor industry working as an engineer. And since then he's helped run a few different tech companies about eight years ago. He moved to the Fort Davis area in Far West Texas today. He lives and works at a university research facility in the Davis Mountains just north of MARFA. The Davis Mountains are probably best known for being the home of the McDonald Observatory a world renowned astronomy centre with several powerful telescopes. The site was chosen for its spectacularly dark skies so. I live on top of the sixty seven hundred foot tall mountain. That's got the three hundred sixty degree view from horizon to horizon so my horizon distances ninety two and a half miles when he used to look north toward the Permian Basin. He'd seen nothing but natural dark sky today. I look out in that same direction over that same west to east rising and I see what looks like sunrise so we all know that the sun doesn't rise on the North Coin. I notice new hints of light on the horizon in two thousand twelve and no. This wasn't the famous Marfa Lights. He was curious so he started taking measurements of the sky's brightness. Then he dug deeper. I began to do research and I found no with National Oceanographic and Atmospheric Agency maintains a network of Polar orbiting satellites. That look down at the earth. They have what's called veers infrared imaging system on them. And so these are satellites in orbit. They look down at the ground and they can see in the infrared. They can see flares. And so you can. You can get a coordinate on the ground. You can spectrum analyze. What's coming from the white from those flares and you can tell the flare intensity its temperature. You can tell if it's a flare as opposed to exhaust stack from something else. Were Street light so you can clearly identify what this is. While mapping and analyzing the data he noticed a major uptick around two thousand fourteen the number of flares increased as did their duration. Flares aren't allowed to burn for more than ten consecutive days but companies can apply for extensions coin says the mini exceeded the ten day window. I would actually drive out to some of these sites and photographs and video record and we would send them to certain company executives. Say this appears to be a flare operating at your your pets I ki- would you like to comment on that? And they would tell us things like no. We're not flooding. You know you have the video evidence you have the night fire evidence. You have all the you know you here. Here's a picture of your your flare stack operation. Oh No we're not flair that has made an you know we've had interesting encounters where I'm on the right of way of a public highway and to be accosted and threatened and told you can't photograph this you know and I know my rights under the law and you know but to have to be challenged by that and then to have. Someone denied that it's actually taking place with the evidence you know right in. Front of them is pretty astonishing and very disingenuous You know they have a right to to make money and profit. I'm not denying that but not necessarily at our expense coin says that over eighteen months there was a forty percent increase in sky brightness. The first time that I remember looking up at the night sky out here. I couldn't recognize a single constellation. The vast number of stars overwhelmed the the sky. That's the city voice guy that I was you know had been seeing most of my life to look up and see the the Milky Way. Stretch from horizon to horizon is a moving tank to have a friend come out to visit and they look up and say what are those clouds clad slater starch. And that's a moving experience to be particularly at the new moon to be out in the the sounds that go with that night sky. So Birds They're all kinds of species that need that. Dark Sky to to thrive have to hear the Saudis how to hear the the birds of prey either operating at night and as the sky gets brighter. One of the things I've noticed is a decrease and those kinds of natural sounds. Fewer sounds of crickets fewer. Cicadas fewer firefly's. The dark skies. Aren't the only part of coins life. That's been affected growing up. Midland coin remembers visiting bow. May State Park home of the world's largest spring fed swimming pool. The place is beloved by Texans across the state going there for the first time. It almost seems like you're seeing a mirage. We're all realize I think that we're living in a desert. We're in the middle of July on desert so the first thing was was this. Excuse me beautiful I mean I remember it being just you know it takes my breath away to talk about you know that whole area I drove. Would you know as a kid and what you would see? Was Cotton Alfalfa melons. You know beautiful irrigated cropland and now it's a wasteland their flares burning at ground level You drive at night. It looks like you're driving through mortar. Despite this coin is careful not to condemn the entire industry as someone who's grown up here and worked in oil and gas. His concerns are nuanced. I don't want to paint with the broad brush that says that everybody that works in oil and gas as bad You know people are are doing the best they can. They've got a job. They're trying to feed their family. Pedder mortgage all that good stuff In it's also not the case that we can just leave all of it in the ground. There are some products that we produce from. Hydrocarbons that are are needed. And I'm not advocating nor my silly enough to claim that we you know we don't need those things so it's not it's not as if we can all make choices and just walk away from oil and gas today and everything is better tomorrow. That's ridiculous but the the way we're doing it now without any regard for stewarding the resources without any regard for the the harm that we're doing to people and the environment you know I disagree with that while plenty of people have pointed out. The environmental problems caused by the industry coin argues that transitioning to renewable energy is essential to the economic stability of the region the potential for wind and solar in the Permian Basin is huge. Though both solar and wind require far fewer workers in oil and gas the jobs would be consistent and the long-term less prone to boom-and-bust right. Now there's an ongoing debate about how long will continue using hydrocarbons and at what rate there's probably a twenty five to fifty year horizon For this kind of activity and really that's it and so you know if from an investor perspective if I were early in my investing activity would I be heavily? Invested in oil and gas despite big returns today answers now. Because there's there's an end to that coin doesn't see development in the TRANSPAC has has inevitable. He's fighting every way he can. Coins focused a lot of his efforts on reforming eminent domain laws in Texas if an oil or gas company declares their pipeline is a quote public. Utility companies can basically use eminent domain to take any land for their project. No matter how land owners feel. That's what happened in the big bend a few years ago when ranch land was seized to build a natural gas pipeline going from the Permian to Mexico coin as lobbying the Texas state legislature to make changes. Do you see any political appetite for some of that reform like his that building any steam or are we still pretty. Is it pretty pill battle with pretty uphill battle you know? I had a conversation with somebody that I'm not going to name them Somebody I respect deeply The conversation went something like can you help us in the Ledge and the answer was going. You know the one thing you can do to commit political suicide in Texas as opposed gas for coin. This guy is about more than protecting the beauty of Far West. Texas so with a background in science. I'm I'm terrified Climate change is real. I have direct access to a continuous data set from one micro-climate environment for the last eighty six years. So I can see that in the data and we all ought to be terrified of you know. We're we're going to at some point. Reach a tipping point and we already have and when we talk about the consequences Of seven hundred million cubic feet of day of methane being burned and converted into c o two and then no telling how much of that vented directly to the atmosphere through other fugitive emissions. Along with everything else. That goes along with You know it's like we we've set ourselves on fire and and are somehow enjoying it. It's crazy I asked. Coin where he gets the motivation to keep fighting despite the obstacles. I don't know exactly how to say this. It'll be an eloquent. If you come out here either. Love this place or you hate it. There's just something about it. There's something about the ground the air the sky. You know that you get it and most people that are out here are out here because they have to be because they WANNA be. There's there's other places people could go. And most folks that meet they came here purposely and they came here because they love this place the day after my conversation coin a headed north through the Davis mountains toward the Permian Basin as I neared boundary. The familiar signs of the boom came into view. And by the time I hit Kaya Nossa. The horizon was strong on all sides with black smoke rising from flares. The sides of the roads were lined with shredded tires and Oldfield trash. San haulers and rigs were packed onto the roads. I had hardly left the big been but it was like I was in a different world. I thought back to the Song Craig played for his ranch. No this a new YOU GOTTA. Watch your troubles. Ooh tween good burn. There's a La Crosse just to serve back in the Permian Basin. I stopped in at a place. I Know Pretty Well Dad. You're older so you get to go. I just going to have a conversation all we are but I have to ask you a few questions. Set it up. I'm sitting at the kitchen table with my mom and dad at their Homini. Andrew's mom made dinner and we were just finishing up our chocolate Meringue Pie. I wanted to talk to them about their lives. In the Permian Basin. My parents were born and raised here. The story goes that before they got together. They were both engaged to different people. My mom was at the Midland Mall looking for a wedding dress when she ran into my uncle skeet. Mom asked him about my dad and they wound up meeting up. The rest is history on always tell my parents. I'm going to marry him so what? I'm hearing a weird like boom boom heartbeat. We're talking of our love your payer. The Permian was in the midst of a terrible bust so after getting married they took off west to Phoenix and later California. There were chasing dreams and paychecks. They didn't want to return to their dusty hometown but they eventually did because they thought it was the best thing for my brothers and I and they've ended up spending their entire lives here. They talk a lot about the kind of work ethic you learn growing up in West Texas and the lifelong relationships. You have with friends and family at the same time. They didn't necessarily want us to stick around forever. So it's like multifaceted right you. You wanted to move here to raise kids. But you also said that you're glad that we all left and so that's seems kind of like a bittersweet scenario with like our kids we realize that there is there's so much beyond West Texas and of course being all of you guys are so artistic and we saw that you had such desires and dreams and things that were so far beyond what you would ever be able to experience or or really fulfilled here that he arrives very dangerously the Permian Basin is a place of stark contradictions despite growing up here despite returning here after college to work in the wool patch despite doing an eleven episode podcast here. I still struggle to fully wrap my mind around the place. The Permian made me who I am but like mom and dad has said I had to leave to become who I wanted to be but I still carry West Texas with me. I care about what happens to this region and I understand that changes in the industry. Not only affect the bigwigs in Houston. They affect my friends. My family I think you understand because you've heard this before is that you know people talk about big oil and they start talking about. Oh well we're glad like process felt because big oil is like suffering but big oil is all of us. It's a smog is. That's not what people most people think of as big oil and for us out here. That's what we think of as oil. We're the worker. Bees are cut. I mean we get our code but at the same time we've got actually realize that you know. Carbon fuels are going to be here forever. That's not what's going to. It's not forever. I mean says forever. The witness forever will never get away from those things and so we've got to invest in those things we really really have got to Come to a place where we're realistic and we're honest with each other. We say you know we've got we've got marry all of these things. We've got the renewables. We've we've got a petroleum energy. We've got all these things we've got to marry them. We've got to be very a systematic in how we move forward and find the best solution. Mom's way of thinking isn't all that unusual in the Permian in all my time reporting out here besides Coyne. I'm not sure I ever heard anyone used the phrase climate change but I found the Permian folks are much more thoughtful about our energy future than most. It's easy to believe that our world should be powered by renewable energy. But people out here. No our reliance on crew runs deep so much of our daily lives are affected by all but they see it up close every day. What happens here affects the world both economically and environmentally but Permian residents experience the consequences. Much more directly into the extreme. You know because we do we do this home. We do on our property here. We do plan. I guess plan to stay here at least make this our homebase for a very long time. You do hope that there are we. Water Air quality will be good. That things will be okay and that the economy will be good. Because if it's not then everything that we've invested in is no. This is where we are. Were Chosen The bay where we will roy be ended up and I guess will die by it so it is what it is never heard that one for not one. Is there anything else you WANNA add? Is there anything else you want to ask? How do I end this Rican podcasts? So on leaving the Permian Basin for the last time on this reporting trip For My last time reporting Boon town and Just south of mckanie kind of on the southeastern edge of the Permian Basin. It's a place. Where the flatten is gives rise to these plateaus of limestone and scrub brush. Mesquite this place that I'm at right now. I can count one two three four. Five six seven eight nine ten eleven twelve. Twelve pump. Jacks in about a hundred yards radius. I'm in Upton County right now not far from where the first oil will the Santa Rita number one. The first commercial will was drilled out. Here that started this whole thing and also the same county where the Martinez men were killed. In a blowout on their rig. This place is so vitally important to the rest of the world and yet so few people understand it where no it you know when I tell people where I'm from a lot of times people say oh I'm sorry and I know they're just joking or whatever but at the same time it's my home and it's there's a lot to be proud about here and honestly so much of the world would be different for better and for worse if this place did not exist and if the people out here didn't work as hard and we're as innovative as they have been and there's a lot of complicated things and in some ways. I have more questions now. Eight months after we first started really a year after we first started. Then I did going in. You know I feel even more conflicted in some ways. You know it's kind of funny. I'm surrounded by all these pontiacs but there's also windmills on on the ridge line all around me in every direction but seeing these windmills turning on the horizon watching these pump. Jacks Bob up and down I have to say does give me some a little bit of hell and while there is a storm to the west and to the north bearing down on me right now. Promising all kinds of bad bad weather. It's and I'm not even making this up for a good metaphor there's sunny sky head and that's Thankfully that's the direction I'm headed all Miss You west Texas Chris. Wallace in this was boomtown. A Boomtown is a CO production of imperative. Entertainment and Texas monthly executive producer. Is Jason Hope produced and engineered by Brian? Sanfer who also wrote the score. Boomtown is edited by J K Nickel and Megan. Cry Co reporter is Lee Freak Stat. Our theme song is written and performed by Paparazzi pedal steel played throughout the series by Jeff. Queen thank you to Emily Kimbrough and Nick Simon night for the amazing artwork and photographs. Thanks to our as intern as candy. I'm your host and writer Christian Walz special thanks to all. Our partners loved ones children and generally anyone who not only tolerated our schedules. But were our biggest cheerleader. Over the past eight months this episode was made with help from the crew at Marfa public radio. Thanks to Mitch. Borden for his work reporting and researching this episode. If you're outside of West Texas you can follow them at Marfa. Public Radio DOT ORG. Texas monthly's parent company also owns interest in the midstream oil and gas industry. Among other diversified investments are editorial judgments are made independently of any such investments and finally a special thanks to all of you who've tuned in left review in told your friends about boomtown. We hope you've enjoyed the journey. That night I went home. I got into the sea and I was looking at a gallon of vinegar. I went to the shower too raw. Been so anyway. I've been a garage than I was good the next day. It was just everything healed up the next day.

Permian Basin Texas Craig Carter West Texas big bend Permian Mary Lou Davis Mountains MARFA Marfa Lights Rio Grande Ben Country Far West Chris Wallace Mitch Mexico Rio Guerande George Mitchell
CAFE Insider Sample 08/12: The Death of Jeffery Epstein

Stay Tuned with Preet

11:00 min | 1 year ago

CAFE Insider Sample 08/12: The Death of Jeffery Epstein

"Hey folks another week of news to make sense of jeffrey epstein. The disgraced financier who is facing federal sex trafficking charges die by apparent suicide early saturday in his jail cell in downtown manhattan to former f._b._i. Officials andrew mccabe peter struck are suing the justice department and the f._b._i. For unlawful termination claiming they were fired for political retaliation and ice agents have arrested hundreds of workers in raids conducted food processing plants in mississippi. I talk about all this and more with with an milligram and the cafe insider podcast each week. We break down the news and take stock of what's happening today. We are declassifying clip from the most recent episode and making it available in the stay tuned feet to listen to our conversation and access all other kathy insider content become a member cafe dot com slash insider. That's cafe dot com slash insider so let's indulge for a moment some some of these conspiracy theories either to just sort of assess them were debunk them. If it wasn't factfile play in milligram was the was the death ordered by bill clinton didn't or by donald donald trump's tweet. I saw i was like wait and let me see if i can find it to read it. People are going going out of their minds with respect to these conspiracy theories that there's lots of people who were saying well there were there were rich and powerful men who had something to lose and by the way the one thing we haven't mentioned <hes> is a fact that feeds conspiracy theories but also feeds sort of you know more sanguine theory also in that is <hes> jepson died or was found dead the morning after all these documents were made public that named particular men many of them famous and formerly powerful <hes> who maybe would've had more revelations come out against them if jeffrey epstein were to live and testify and cooperate so that on the one hand may may explain why he decided into end his life at that time and to the conspiracy theorists explains why people decided we've had enough of this guy and we can't let him live on. It's it's a really important point and we know for certain that lasts friday a federal appellate court new york unsealed around two thousand pages of documents from a civil defamation case that has been settled and that case was between a woman named virginia roberts <hes> goo frei who was an alleged victim of jeffrey epstein and the british socialite <hes> just lay in maxwell who has been reported. She's a longtime epstein associate. She was reported as one of the individuals who would go out the find young girls for jeffrey epstein as part of sort of epstein's criminal enterprise and so the allegations from virginia roberts goo frei alleged that epstein and maxwell together directed her to have sex with prince andrew alan dershowitz former new mexico governor bill richardson former senator george mitchell well <hes> a well-known prime minister who wasn't named a foreign man who is introduced to her as a prince and remember these are just allegations that were the case never went to trial all the allegations were never tested in court and so they may be true and they may be false but it is a level of sort of finger pointing as to specific individuals who may have been part of epstein's rang that it definitely raises questions and was a big part of the media story on friday that these allegations were coming coming out and again they're untested but there's no question that you know they're being made against against not just epstein but the woman who has not been charged again who's actually not been charged in connection either in the federal case or in the florida case in connection with epstein and so i think they're definitely questions that are surrounding that and you're right that it could be it could go to either point. It could go to epstein's motive to basically say look. I'm going to spend the rest of my life in prison and i'm also gonna end up taking down a lot of people with me. <hes> there'll be a lot of collateral damage and so that could be a big motive for him to end his life. There's also the possibility that there are this argument which which i don't i don't credit yet but again i mean there's a lot of facts and information we don't have and so i think you and i are both always his. You know you always go with the most simple explanation until you learn more <hes> but you know it does add fuel to the fire of this question of you know. There are a lot of people who what have suffered. If epstein went to trial or who could have been criminally implicated look conspiracy theories are awful and they can do a lot of damage in can be ludicrous. This is a circumstance in which there's so much craziness here as often said if this has been a hollywood script it would have been rejected because it was not believable enough and you have the timing and you have the powerful men and you have politics involved and you also have i think a point in time in our country where conspiracy theories are easy to feed and lots of people have access to social media where people are putting out things and people are not focusing on facts that it's a perfect storm for conspiracy theorists the one thing i will say with respect to people. Who were you know suggesting testing as someone did that. The president tweeted this has something to do with the clintons <hes> the f._c._c. as you pointed out right at the beginning of this show is within the bureau of prisons which is in the department of justice which is led by the handbook attorney general president united states in that institution is under direct control of of the trump administration so you have to take into account questions you think about crazy conspiracy theories question pre which i sort of had in my head. A little bit is that obviously trump has also been implicated. He was a close friend of epstein's for many years than they had a falling out but obviously we've all seen in the media a lot of pictures with <hes> trump the epsteins with wives and girlfriends <hes> you know that have surfaced since epstein has been charged again. I do sort of feel like back in my mind. It's a fair question to ask whether bill bar. I mean the f._b._i. Reports to bill bar the inspector general is independent by statute but worked within the department of justice with bill bar and i do think inspectors general have been largely independent but i still think if trump is and has been implicated as potentially really being a part of you know jeffrey seen circle. I do think there's a fair question of whether the department of justice should be in charge of this investigation and i'm not sure there's a great answer but i i sort of i think in today's world there's such a dose of skepticism around everything that i it doesn't mean. I don't think that the f._b._i. Could conduct a fair investigation. I actually actually do but i it did. Raise a question in my mind. If thinking you know trump appoint spill bar bill bar is clearly a you know a trump. He plays for trump's team. We've seen that in a number of different ways and he oversees b._o._p. And so epstein is associated with trump and so there is a level aval of connection here that i think gives rise to a fair gives rise to questions at least about how should be handled so i'll come across as either measured or naive with my answer as bill bar sits in washington d._c. Atop an institution of one hundred or one hundred and ten thousand men and women. The investigation is going to happen locally with local another head of the of the ideas office <hes> in new york for me also and the f._b._i. Agents and the local prosecutors who will do the mundane work of looking at the footage of looking at the documents interviewing the witnesses looking at the protocols that that is something that i find very hard to micromanage <hes> at the us attorney level much less at the attorney general of the united states level now at the end of the day with the mullahs report as we've seen if there's a lengthy report that comes out bill bar was able i think to distort it and plot a summary and their ways in which bill bark and can change the <hes> the news a little bit when it comes out but if there is a definitive meticulous investigation done by both inspector general and local f._b._i. Hi agents that can be seen to be full thorough complete conclusive. It's really hard to put a gloss on that. It's really hard to twisted listed. If you're the attorney general i think still in modern america will were lots of doubts linger and swirl on what happened in that case and the problem will be if it's not conclusive or unable to be conclusive because there's no conclusive videotape <hes> there's no definitive explanation given what happened and you see lots of <hes> you know not not every every crime scene and every death can be fully explained them. You know think of the kennedy assassination for starters most famously and in that circumstance then i think lots of people will be wondering was the fix in <hes> or something go awry or with someone trying to protect someone. <hes> you know whether it's <hes> some of the people were mentioned in the documents on friday or some of these famous current and former presidents that we're talking about. I still have faith and confidence that this doesn't seem to be so complex but they can't get to the bottom of it but that remains to be seen the one thing that's maybe worth saying <hes> probably doesn't need to be set in. Someways shouldn't need to be said but the investigation should be made public in some form inspector. General reports are often released publicly and this is this is one of the areas where i think it's critically important that the public get the opportunity to see the results of this kind of investigation. <hes> i totally agree with that and i also think by the way i do some criticism for the for the o pee <hes>. They don't like to make statements they talk about what's going on behind prison walls. They did make a statement on saturday afternoon but i think they would have done themselves a favor if they were more transparent and i know you wanna make sure you have all your ducks in a row and the is dotted and the t's crossed and everything else but there's another circumstances to <hes> when things happen at the m._c._c. another the other prisons where speculation is rampant and conspiracy theories begin to swirl around and they would do themselves a favor especially when they have you know facts that can calm people down to make them public and not wait eighteen months match with that yeah okay so now people are asking what happens with the case with respect to jeffrey epstein. There's no such thing in this country tree and the federal system that i'm aware of continue to prosecute someone after their death what will happen is they will find something. That's called a nollie which is a dismissal of the united against her. If we update news on for the prosecution pepsi would expect to assets respecting the essence of me and i i hope you've enjoyed this sample of the kathy they insider podcast to listen to the full episode head to cafe dot com slash insider and become a member. That's cafe dot com slash insider to the many of you who have chosen to join the inside community. Thank you for supporting our work.

jeffrey epstein donald donald trump bill bar bill clinton attorney department of justice bill richardson manhattan andrew mccabe peter justice department mississippi kathy jepson virginia roberts george mitchell pepsi prince andrew alan dershowitz hollywood united states
There Will Be Fraud: Amid the Pandemic Free-for-All, Unlit Flares at Texas Shale Refineries Are Dumping "Unimaginable" Amounts of Methane into the Atmosphere

Drilled

14:23 min | 4 months ago

There Will Be Fraud: Amid the Pandemic Free-for-All, Unlit Flares at Texas Shale Refineries Are Dumping "Unimaginable" Amounts of Methane into the Atmosphere

"Welcome back to drilled. We're calling this surprise season there will be fraud and we're doing it. Because the fossil fuel industry is trying to leverage the hell out of a pandemic of course they are reporting has released started to pick up on. What's happening on this story at the national level? I highly recommend you. Follow the reporting that Alex Kaufman and Christie Angelo or doing huffpost. Emily at Kennedy Heated Kate aaronow at the new republic and just in the COCA AT D. Smog were covering the national stuff on this podcast and on the drilled news website too but one of the things I wanted to try to do with this series is make sure people know about everything that's happening at the state level and even the local level in the last week gotten emails from folks in Pennsylvania Texas Massachusetts and California each with a different story. About what the fossil fuel industry is trying to use corona virus to get away with in their backyards. Today we're headed to Texas so I'm Sharon Wilson and I'm senior field advocate for earthworks and further back than that. I worked for the oil and gas industry and I was uncomfortable with the ethics of the industry as a whole and that was before I knew about any of the environmental impacts so eventually despite the fact that they paid very very high salary I left the oil and gas industry and moved to Wise County. I bought forty two acres next to the LBJ. National Grasslands. And I didn't know that that's where George Mitchell. The father of fracking was experimenting with how to economically FRAC oil and gas from shale. And so I had a ringside seat to that adventure and my air turned brown. And My well-water turned black so yeah That that made me mad now. Years Later Sheeran takes her optical gas imaging equipment around the Permian Basin to document emissions from oil and gas companies. She's GonNa tell us what she's been seeing since this January and why the current a virus might end up resulting in more methane emissions even if it temporarily reduces co two emissions. That's coming up right after a quick message from today's sponsor. I'm Amy Westervelt. And this is drilled. This episode is brought to you in part by better help DOT com. That's better help with a P. An online professional counseling service at an about you but I am certainly having more anxiety and worries these days. It's certainly not easy to get to therapist appointment so I have been finding better. Help absolutely critical crisis line. It's not self help. It's therapy online. The offer a broad range of expertise and it's available worldwide. What I like about it most is. I can send messages to my therapist and get responses. I don't have to do phone or video conferences although I could if I wanted to. I liked to write things. Sometimes they can express things better in writing. I also find that you know I have time at like two. Am or three. You know before homeschooling and then we're starts so it's very handy to have twenty four seven access and my therapist might not get back to me at three am but she does get back very quickly which is great if you. WanNa try to visit better. Help Dot com slash critical. That's better help. Dot Com slash critical. Enjoying the over seven hundred thousand people taking charge of their mental health with the help of an experienced professional special offer for all critical frequency. Podcast you get ten percent off your first month at better help dot com slash critical again. That's better help with a P. H. E. L. P. dot com slash critical. Okay now back to the show so when you look at it without an optical gas imaging instrument you just see tanks and pipes but when you look at it with the optical gas imaging camera that I use you see big clouds of pollution coming from these sites Sheeran's been tracking that pollution for years. And she says it's gone from bad to worse in twenty twenty. I've done easily over a thousand individual investigations at oil and gas facilities and I have never seen anything that even comes close to the levels of pollution coming from facilities in the Permian Basin. So I thought things were really bad prior to about November two thousand nineteen which is when I saw an increase than it it just it's kept increasing until the last time I was there was march. Sixth and it was unimaginable unimaginable. What was happening okay? We need to do a quick over-simplified oil and gas lesson here so shale companies started out using method called hydraulic fracturing fracking to get natural gas out of shale rock in really broad strokes. Fracking works by injecting water and chemicals into shale rock to bust it open and extract gas. There's a whole bunch of treatment and refining happens after that which is where water and soil contamination can happen but those are the basics around twenty ten shale companies realize. They could access a type of oil in these rocks to they. Call it tight oil. And that's what really positioned the US as top supplier instead of just a customer in the global energy market when that oil is being refined natural gas is burned off in a process called flaring. The idea is to reduce the amount of methane that would otherwise be released into the air during this process. But there's a wrinkle. A strong wind blow out the flare an unlit flare means methane and various volatile. Organic compounds are just Kinda belched into the air if this was just happening very occasionally at one plant or another. Maybe it wouldn't be that big of a deal but it happens a lot. According to research that came out last year unlit flares are the biggest contributors to global methane emissions and just reminder methane is a greenhouse gas. It's eighty six times more potent than co two okay back to Sharon. Flares are not let and so it becomes a vent pipe that vents uncontested hydrocarbons into the atmosphere in huge quantities. The tanks and the tanks are venting it's just Methane volatile organic compounds blasting from everywhere. What are the restrictions are regulations in place? We'll Texas does have regulations that are supposed to prevent a lot of this not entirely prevent it because this system the oil and gas design is it is designed to vent intentionally so at this point they cannot completely stop all of the methane emissions because they have to have pressure releases so but we do have regulations in place to lessen that and unlit flares are not legal but the problem with regulations is they are words on paper and in Texas. They're not enforced and especially in the Permian Basin the oversight same's especially lacks. Sharon says the problem with unlit flares and excess. Venting tends to get worse when natural gas and oil prices are low right now. They're at rock bottom as the prices. Go down the amount of venting and the number of unlit flares goes up we HA- do have some data for for that That we've collected since two thousand seventeen to show that there is an uptick in unlit flares and this year. It's really gone up so even as emissions might be going down in general methane emissions could actually increase during the pandemic which not only exacerbates climate. Change it also creates a big public health problem right now. People are being told to shelter at home and I've had so many calls from people who are having you know they previously. They could at least get some relief when they went to school and to work and now they are there all day and they're breathing these hydrocarbons that are crossing defense line onto their property and their toxic load in their body will be increasing. I contacted the two agencies that are tasked with regulating the oil and gas industry in Texas the Texas Railroad Commission and the Texas Commission on Environmental Quality. The railroad commission are the ones that would oversee flaring as of March Thirteenth. Oil and gas operators could request to have all regulatory requirements waived that came almost two weeks before the EPA announced that it would grant various industries including oil and gas regulatory relief during the pandemic. So basically they won't find you four pollution infractions. The Texas Commission on Environmental Quality is the body that would deal with complaints about toxic fumes and emissions that residents are experiencing. They're considering both administrative for paperwork. Violations and enforcement discretion on an as needed basis the commission's press person. Andrew Kice told me residents who are being impacted by another property and are concerned about their health should contact T. C. Cues complaint hotline or regional office. Tc Q. Takes all complains. Impacting human health very seriously but Wilson's getting calls from residents who feel otherwise. She says that from what she's on her last trip out in the field since at least early. March operators seem to know that no one would really be watching there has never been a system in place to adequately regulate the oil and gas industry. What we have in the United States is a voluntary regulatory system. Wear they have a spill and they call up the regulator and report themselves and if they have an invisible release of methane. Voc's they call up the regulator or they fill out a form and report that themselves. So that's kind of like the last time I got to go anywhere which was about three weeks ago and and maybe I was speeding so I called up the GPS and asked him to come and give me a ticket. That's it for this time. If you've spotted the fossil fuel industry using the covert nineteen pandemic as an excuse to avoid regulation or get some other kinds of benefit. Give me a shout. I'm amy at drilled. News Dot Com again. This season wasn't really planned or budgeted for it just seems necessary so if you agree and want to support our efforts we'd really appreciate it. Our patriotic is patriot. Dot Com slash drilled. And we've got some new supporters this week that I wanNA thank the rude pundit carry Jim mcelroy Jennifer Crou- l- Karen goal. Jane Patton Amy Brady and Huck Brock. Thank you guys so much. Your support is really really. Appreciated drilled is produced and distributed by critical frequency. The show is reported written and produced by me. Amy Westervelt this season's music is by Martin. Wissembourg our editor is Emily Gertz. Our editorial adviser is Rica. Murthy you can find drilled on Apple. Podcasts stitcher spotify Google podcast or wherever you get your podcast you can also listen on. Our website drilled news dot com where you'll also find additional reporting and document. You can follow us on twitter at we are drilled or catch me on their at a me Westervelt. Thanks for listening. And we'll see you next time.

Sharon Wilson Texas Permian Basin Dot Com Amy Westervelt Texas Commission on Environmen United States Emily Gertz Sheeran fraud National Grasslands Wise County George Mitchell Alex Kaufman P. An Pennsylvania Texas
Former Mayor Of Rochester Bill Johnson

Bob Lonsberry

30:47 min | Last week

Former Mayor Of Rochester Bill Johnson

"Saint tallest not the same thing I've seen it at the Fisher House. The Fisher House I know is a huge part of recovery for somebody like my husband for them to know that their family members are being taken care of that's a huge burden off of them so they can concentrate on their therapies. Just. Having that assurance that no matter what as long as we were there for, Anson, that someone would be there to take care of us. It took so much offer shoulders. How can you help go to fisherhouse Dot Org Downtown Sunny and seventy four, todd holiday newsradio whammo of eighty next news at ten thirty breaking news when it happens anytime another hour with Bob Laws Bury starts now on newsradio. WAM eliminating. Thank you very much. I appreciate that troops I appreciate you showing up for Muster Paul is Cooling co-pathetic on your end. Of course, their passed away. Wednesday I believe it was a man who served and Baptist, Church missionary, Baptist Church, and Rochester, for some thirty three years the Reverend James L. Cherry, a senior Nineteen eighty-one to twenty fourteen in service to his Lord this community. A man of knew him well, joins us now the former mayor, the city of Rochester the Honorable Bill Johnson. Good Morning Sir, and welcome to the broadcast for the morning. Bob. Thank you sir, you're doing well life's okay. Slang. Strain on every inch my house and than that palms. Outstanding Sir who was? Reverend. Jerry please. Well first, and foremost, he was a servant of God. And Ordain, minister? Who? Came into this community and. Really, got acclimated to river. quickly. And transformed inch from one that served it's It's it's against its members to win. That was can't really a church of the community. In so many ways he opened up in two people or events meetings. and he became a counselor to so many. Young People Spang ministers, community leaders who valued his advice and input. even just a unique. Day. In in those early years sir, you were at the Urban League and and you're able to to partner your efforts often is that correct? Sir? That's right. I joined the board Appease after he gains a town, we invited them to serve on the board. And then I, we came up with this idea for fundraising Sunrays, we'd always had a membership grab. It was really kind of pass it. Were, you know people would. Allow of out of senator, check in or something like that we decided to. Go to the base community. So we set up. A kind of friendly competition. with church is Reverend. Jerry actually took idea on how convinced his? Clergy colleagues that this would be valuable. I think for them to do to work to help the urban league support his programs. So, we ended up with thirty or forty churches that annually setup campaigns where they would solicit within their churches that membership. and. Then we were actually recognize them based on you know with the batter them up to slide sturgis small churches. And So there was There was always a spirit of competition. as to which. You know could be the most helpful to the League and he he blessed that He. Keeps he chaired. He had the first. Pop punks and that his church And And he you know. In. So many ways steer was just so wonderful. Now he might not. He might not appreciate me saying this about him. But he was a Baptist minister. In the nineteen eighties. When women were not really welcome. In the pulled in. So you to grapple with that. Because A lot of these smaller churches, hat female passes. And I watched him really just sort of. His own. His Own approach you welcome those those female pastors into this event. And let them come up and just talked which was really it might seem like a a manner thing but it was a huge thing. Back then and and so I saw him. Welcome. female as his colleagues. So he's he just, but he did it in a way. It was so quiet. He didn't make a big. ATLANTA. If he didn't say today is the first day I'm going to allow women that come from my pulpit makes you know you you go there they're sitting there. Okay. Wow. He he broke down that barrier. And he did that across the denominational lance gives a lot of competition among them the nominations. One of his best friends in this town is Bishop James Right. At the Church of God in Christ, the cost of the nomination there's. been a lot of of Again a play. Between the traditional. Denominations, baptist methods. The like with the costal he reverend Levin Cherry ambitious ranked struck up a great friendship and they worked together on a lot of projects. So so his legacy. Is is really. Great, in this community, it's being course of Mayor Bill Johnson about a the passing of the Reverend James L. Cherry a senior it what's his spirit and you touched on this earlier sir. But what do you think is spiritual legacy is please. Why Bank that he left this the city? whip. Those foundations that he put in place. Key let them in place he had enough people who subscribed. His approach who wanted to carry on his work. You know he left Sun here to run another large church. there. There's really distinct difference between the two James L. Tear it But the fact of the matter is You know he felt that Keaton he could leave here comfortably. knowing that that here the city was in good hands and there was still a lot of his so-called disciples people who really subscribe. To that ecumenical approach that he he was so upon of of advancing he knew that that work continue and it still does speaking course to Bill Johnson and a young reference at Antioch Baptist in this is impossible to know or maybe to say. But if if he had a a message, he'd give people today. What do you think you would be sir? I think in his in his ear where there's so much division and I think he would be present. How do we get together? What can we find a common ground? What can we approach each other? Even without differences, there's gotta be some area commonality and that would be. The message that that reverend sure would be would would be pushing it preaching today. This. Is Bill Johnson. Of course I'd be remiss this week not to ask you this question this week that that America pays its respects to congressman John. Lewis? I your thoughts relative to him in his contributions please Sir. I think that it would be redundant for me to say this man was a giant at and said repeatedly. But. I just sight to this one experience that I happen to have last summer. Really solidified in my mind. John. Lewis. So. There is something that call the US civil rights trail that's being developed ironically. In that movement is at hall who used to have to let just a visit as events and bureau here for a number of years. At home I went back to Alabama. and. They're leading this and they're trying to create these sites. And maybe working them world tourist attraction. So. Going into these cities that were that between now and during the Civil Rights Era Selma Birmingham. Montgomery. MEMPHIS places like that. and. These communities have begun to bill monuments so. It adds direction I had stumbled upon. One of these sites. The previous summer. When I was down in south. Carolina. Place. In school which my group King. Had used as a training site So I I mentioned that took a lot of ads at all. Since you on that drain, let me point out some other things anyway last summer I spent eight days. In late June and early July on the Alabama civil rights trail and there I can't tell you by number reminded that they have created a number. Of of part sites and everything. Every one of them. and. That was when in the first place I went to. With Anniston Alabama which was the site. Of the first. freedom ride bust being her. And I spent almost two hours. They're just standing there reading the story. John Lewis was not on one of those this John Lewis and actually somebody city the general yesterday. Taking his own freedom ride a year before he and one of his colleagues But it was there that I understand really not only what the nation had gone through back in the sixties, which is the time I was growing up as a teenager. In the fifties how was in college in the sixties? I I was part of that. A A movement. So but I got a great understanding of what people like John Lewis contribute. To make these things happen and it is he's just. I never met him in life. I I regret to say I didn't realize how small his stature was, but he was a giant. And anytime, anybody could could subject that body. How to advance cause that he has he did on a number of case, you can only be a tremendous. pride and had a person like that tennis strength and he lived he lived creed. He lived the street and I. think that's the best thing. He man speaking to a a mayor Bill Johnson in you. There's a there's a generation that's passing we of course have you know racism at today but in your younger years and the people of your age, there was actual statutory Jim, Crow Stuff drinking fountain. The lunch counter the buses all that was real and their people still alive who face that now part of their life but that generations going away, is there an understanding that that people younger? WHO. Didn't see that should have or or what what should we know about those days please Sir. I I think you're absolutely right. There's a generation had got children and grandchildren. my oldest daughter was born four months. Martin Luther King was assassinated. In nineteen sixty eight. they didn't live through wet their parents and grandparents lived through. Only know. These experiences if they read it at all in the textbook cords sorta grandma tanks. In the movies. the current movement of young people. black lives matter, and all of the people that support them. I think now is really beginning to understand not just. What these people like John Lewis Went through, but they understand that takes more than just protests and take strategy. You know John Lewis could have gotten beaten dozens of times on the Edmund rich and it would not have meant anything. Except that. Action filed the Congress of the United States the president of the United States. To the voting rights. Legislation and there was broad support for. What they have to learn what they should be learning and hopefully what I learned today. Is that yes, you can dramatize a caused by causing calling attention to and they've done an a second job doing the. But ultimately, it's GonNa. Take a change in policy and you're GONNA take a change in hearts. And that's the hardest of Clark to get people. To really understand things that are are. A fact of life within never thought about before. It take it for granted and they say, Oh, I don't I don't contribute to this problem but yes way. You. Do if you don't try to disrupt it if you don't try to dismantle it. I think John Lewis Greatness turnout yesterday. We have when he had the vision and the courage and the insight. To leave a parting word it was just like when they took his body into the capital Rotunda. And they played that commencement speech that he gave a few years ago. All right I mean how? Is Anti here you standing in front of a man's Cask. And you hear his voice so loud and clear. So he played that that was grammatically here him damp summarizes philosophy but yesterday when he had that letter released on the. So he he has somebody said President Clinton somebody that he has given us I'm watching. So I, hope that the young people who who succeed him. We'll look at that closely understand what it means that that's not words you know this is just rhetoric. But this is a man saying, here's how did it and passing this mantle onto you you have to do it justice effectively as we did. Spend the bill, Johnson it an unrelated question last bother you with. But since I've got you and I know you have knowledge on this night, long had curiosity I think yesterday referenced it. It real relative to Congressman Lewis Harris. His parents are as his grandparents or great grandparents had been had been slaves and I know that the been interested in in family history and stuff like that. Is it and I know records. Often didn't exist. But how how how does our free me? How often are African Americans able to trace their family history back to specific individuals who are in slavery I? You know I know my people into the like the into that era. So a others must I mean to be a black person and say this name, this person, this place my blood was a slave, our records available make that happen and again a dumb question. But what is that like? How does that inform the feel the feelings and thought of person? pleaser. Well, you know because you wanna pass along some information. I it said my sister had really become a family genealogist. And I can say that she has effectively traced back. To our great grandparents and who were children of slaves other words. One. At four great grandparents on on out. But I guess it would be eight canal. Mother and Father Sang When you get back, they were born shortly after. Emancipation okay. So, you can go to the eighteen sixty census records, and if you've got the right plan and they, you can find a now it takes a Lotta dog research in order to do that. I. Remember my sister I who does not glad she asked me is asked me to take her to court houses in Georgia and in Virginia. So. She didn't meticulously search through these records I happened to be. Waiting for her one day because I mean, that's interest. I love her as a sibling. Glad to help her. But I wasn't GonNa pour through these rats and I remember. Hair her shout out I found it. Wish she had found was on our great grandmother's marriage license. He found her family name. Now every time she researched that May. She found. She came she thought she came upon a dead end because they were white. Okay. and. What she found out was that this talent they on her birth certificate in eighteen, fifty eight. Heard. It was entered slave girl and I forget with her family name was okay. So he was able to go back can't go back much further than that, and that's where the dad in. Now maybe there are people who are more skilled and genealogy than me. Who can say that way but I know the Matt Mass Sister Has Doggedly identified. By name. Six thousand relatives from both sides of the family she has. This huge database. But they only made and and only other pieces of information she can prevent. is their birth and death dates. Okay. So, it's a seven incomplete story in the people who can help us sell it in. For example, I now have two cousins, my mother's first cousins. Who are over one hundred years? Old One of them is one, hundred seven. And even when I try to and she was born she one hundred and she, she'll be one, hundred and eight. Two weeks okay. and. So she was born in Nineteen. Point something like that. Okay. So I try to talk to her cousin Virginia. What about this? What about even her memory is dim she can't go back too far. Okay. She's lying beg something like this. That's the issue that many of us fine and then of course, people change their last name. Sure people. So Somme be read our e Adea of sudden they changed it. They just changed one vow R. E. D. R. E. N. D. E. You can hit. You can hit Gordon Mestre. STONEWALL trying to trace people back but there are people like her. WHO had no formal training in genealogy but who have taken this up with with with great passion? She's retired she spent. Oliver. wigging out she'll call me by. I'm another cousin. I mean call me when you hit the lottery. she she this is just a thing of excited for her. To, keep adding to that list but is a sense that it is a one dimensional a research because we can find a name. We can't find much else about how they live their lives. Crisis the Mayor Bill Johnson thank you so much for speaking with. It's always delight. I. I would like that my friend it God bless you sir have a wonderful day. Mayor Bill Johnson forgive me Sam. We blew off the break probably it's time for news or something like that on newsradio Ham eleven eighty. From the West Virginia Coal Mines on the rock game mouth and then the West. And Western skies welcome back droops it's open lines Friday. The number is four to one check that to two to eleven eighty or one, eight, hundred, two, nine, five, eleven eighty had George Mattress on the other day He's the Republican running for Congress against Joe Morelli and Osama I thought I did pretty good when he was on the show a caller Andrew. Metrics here the other day circuit morning. Welcome to the broadcast. Good morning, Bob thanks I appreciate that you betcha. So how did you meet George Mitchell? was outside into my yard just the spending limit reading some books and the guy walks by and it goes up to my neighbor's house and very put something in their mailbox. They went home and Hey, I talked to you for a minute I met. Sure. Names drug which just running for Congress and I want to tell you about little things. Okay. Sure. And he wanted to speak about what he wants to do, and I was really impressed. With some very easy to talk as very common sense ideas about safety for the strength, both on a local level national level, and he's only the work with blood with the governor, for Mayor Warren, to help us the schools and it just seemed to be where it's necessary talk Democrats. He wants to do that and he has very common sense idea. What He me exactly the opposite of haughty politician much more wants to hear with you and much different than how does rally And he's very mature, very smart well thought out as opposed to C.. I think it'd be great. Just. Has a lot of common sense. You know he's intelligent. I happen to agree with most of us but but just seems very easy to talk to these very personal. I. Supporting to you the single person not just have the title congressman and I main part hit me. The most is that he really loves America. He came because he was eight years old from Greece. This and then he has. A gratitude to America and what his philosophy is, you can have America's great. And you can still improve. Versus the idea where wildlife there was some racism, two years ago American number was great and that I think is very important idea. He's humble. He wants to pay back when America this for his family he wants to open up for people like that, and that's really I think that's such a foreign concept that yeah, okay. We are country people doing fantastic here. Here. But are we perfect? No, and we can improve and that's improved together but we don't have to say terrible to say we have to improve. So that was really I. was like, Hey, this guy's right on target really right up there. He's cares about safety he's not against improving I just think he'd be a great congressman outstanding outstanding I appreciate that Sir. Thank you so much and again it. It's it's tough to be challenger to you know a giant political power like Joe Morelli. Joe Morelli owns the county executive chair. He owns the county clerk chair You know he may be just about to take over the chair of the Monroe County Democratic Party I think he just got his person on the Monroe County Democratic Elections Commissioner Job. He's very, very powerful person in its and again, you know maybe like he may be powerful for is maybe eleven but There's George Mitchell out there and he's GonNa long he's trying to do his thing and will listen challengers to incumbents in Monroe County. Don't win. All right. I don't know if the last two centuries that's ever been thing but there ought to be choice softens it, and that gentleman there seems to like him pretty well Keith. Glad. You called Sir you're on Newsradio wham eleven eighty. Hi. Bob Thank you. So the call. I'm just curious. would be open once the public libraries going to be open again, gyms are close Jewish. Nothing about the libraries. I check almost every day as I'm coming in from Iran and and the signs you're up there still closed. And and here's the thing. I call them, they put me on hold and then they finally answered. They said, they don't know when they're going to be open. The thing is that public libraries wh- I love libraries. The public libraries also have come to serve another purpose especially like in in like in downtown Rochester. There a place people can get out of the elements and they're also a bathroom you know. What's good. Only, thing I like about it could I don't have any outside source except radios so I go in there on a computer the computer check on. Emails and everything like that, and then family history on facebook. What other than that I don't know what's going on out here every day turn onto US station or On TV if I'm somebody's house other than that, I don't know what's going on out there all the time. Do you have? So you you go there to get a get an Internet connection. Yes do you take your laptop or do you use their? Laptop. To computers, right at the library. I got emails are signed up, and of course. Since beginning everything happened way back at the beginning of March I. Have Not Been On. As. I said a lot of things that don't get on the news like some people passing rate. You said a few minutes ago we haven't Sherry passed away. I would never known that. I don't even get to look at the newspaper came get a newspaper. Cheap enough. I'm trying to think I. I don't know any place else where you would do it. All. Right. Well, I'm just wondering anything Bob has any Paul yet if he's still waiting to see what governor Cuomo is going to do whatever I don't know that the Duffy is I think that it's everything everybody's responding to the State is how? Yeah. I again to be cut off from the Internet since March is a huge thing imagined personal emails family or again. On facebook, my brother had a comic. George. Told me about my sister in law passed away. So I would never known that. Yeah. I'm sorry if anybody knows in call it but I yeah I I don't know any place else. There are other places you can get Wi fi if you've got, you know a phone or a laptop, you can go off and go to McDonald's or something like that. I understand that but I, don't computer. Yea. I'm so sorry buddy. Quickly to get emails all the time. So yeah. Yeah I'm sorry, Keith. I'm sorry. I don't have a better answer for you it to two to eleven the number back in your on the going to the bathroom thing and I I hate to bring this up again. But because the other day had my stupid rant on where people urinate in public. But there aren't public restrooms. You know it. The municipalities don't do. That means nothing because you know human beings to have bladders and they do have kidneys and they produce urine it's a biological thing. But if you don't have some office to go into used to be believe it or not downtown Rochester used to have to McDonald's eight. Of course now has done and and very, very other little food service but there. are places you can go and for many people you know and some people are you know they have time to fill in the day maybe they're homeless or whatever I don't know but you know the the library if if nothing else was a place to go to the bathroom and you know I just right now if you are a person who has no place to go during the day Where do you go to the bathroom? There aren't any public restrooms and to go into the other some maybe people can go into like the county office building or City Hall but for both those especially City Hall you have to go through security thing and I I don't know how it works and why bothers me but I just think you know there's somebody out there has got to go to the bathroom and where they do anyway, I'll shut up and try to think of things that may be more interesting to discuss in half a moment on Newsradio wham eleven eighty. Buckle BAC welcome back Bob. I'm glad you phoned sir. This is newsradio eleven eighty good morning Good Morning Bob. We've got an we were sitting around. We had an idea for a fundraiser to raise. A lot of money to purchase just thousands of black lives matter. T shirts and we would have former. President Obama. Rich won the Nobel Peace Prize. As we know go back to his hometown and distribute them in a peaceful manner. Do all you in the known violent areas of Chicago? Therefore, we would have no more violence if anybody WHO's wearing that shirt now If. T shirts saved lives we'd have far fewer funerals my friend Andy this is newsradio eleven eighty welcome sir. Hey. Bob. I got a question for you. Yeah. They took away that six hundred dollars federal unemployment payment today. Yup and they're saying that they're going to give you a seventy percent of your original weight. Okay. That means I probably won't be returning to my job that I'm on furlough from. I'm going to be looking for another one. But again. If. You refused employment terminate here, unemployment payment almost immediately well But that's not the reality and the giving you seventy percent is what the Republicans propose. There has been no deal reach. So right now at the end of the day you got unemployment, we'll be the half of your base pay that New York pays you and nothing extra until there's federal legislation news with a great Todd Halliday. Then you're on the air on Newsradio wham eleven eighty saying. It's not the same thing I say not at the Fisher asked the Fisher House I know is a huge part of recovery for somebody like my husband for them to know that their family members are being taken care of that's a huge burden off of them so they can concentrate on their therapies. Just, having assurance that no matter what as long as we were there for Anson, that someone would be there to take care of us. You took so much weight off our shoulders. How can you help go to fisherhouse dot? Org?

Bob Laws John Lewis Bill Johnson Bill Johnson Rochester United States America Fisher House Congress Jerry Anson James L. Cherry Todd Halliday Joe Morelli Edmund rich George Mitchell Virginia Urban League Muster Paul
Bob Lonsberry Show Wednesday 7-29-20 Hr 3

Bob Lonsberry

28:36 min | Last week

Bob Lonsberry Show Wednesday 7-29-20 Hr 3

"Eleven eighty downtown overcast and seventy two, I'm top holiday newsradio WAM eleven eighty next news at ten thirty breaking news when it happens anytime, another hour with Bob. Laws Bury starts now on newsradio WAM of Eight. Thank sir, I appreciate that and troops. I, appreciate you showing up. Muster. Paula's cool and co-pathetic on your end rb joined a the Republican candidate for Congress in the twenty Fifth District. Of New York that which represents most of Monroe County Mr George Mattress Kuoni. Sir. Welcome to the broadcast. Good Morning Bob. Thank you for having me on again. How are you? Good. How's your summer been going? So far so good. Call. Has put a damper on things for all of us. But now the things that are opening up out in the community talking to people things that I enjoy learning a lot. To their concerns, it's all good outstanding Jomon. You're running against Joe Morelli in the news, the last couple of days, you have any thoughts on all of that, please. Sir. Well. Think those are very serious allegations by. The allegations are abuse of power at Saddens me. I'm very concerned about it. the job of congressman is to help his constituents. And not victimized them. Then, if goes are borne out. I believe Mr Morality has serious problems. As, you have spoken to people What do they talk about? What are the on People's minds please? Well. People are concerned about Colbert. Obviously. they want to get back to their lives and they WANNA get back to life safely. They're concerned about the economy education now that school's getting closer They They're concerned about that as well. How to get back to to your point. To your initial question. You know. I. I, I saw some of the responses. about from Mr Morality about the screen shots. And those are actually very disturbing to me because. They raised much more. Questions than they answer, they allude to other conversations. Even, the response from Mr Darty. is an unsolicited response about. Some sort of action. that I was supposed to have been taken so. these these concern me a lot. You know that. Was So. Important. That apparently the public relations officer. Majority. Felt. that it would should be taken up the chain of command, not one, but two levels up all the way up to the dean. The fact that. Mr Rally fell. That, he had to make a telephone call. Personally is also bothersome. I listened to the Robin will interview. you'll be a thorough. Person Yourself I'm sure you'll listen to it as well. Not. A single sentence, not a single word. was political, the only connection that I could make. when that interview was that she happened to be a primary political opponent of Mr Moralities. So Magic Pelosi. Field if she, I hope by the way, she doesn't Berry this. So sweep it under the rug, I hope this is investigated. If it is the congressional ethics committee, Shelby issuing subpoenas, all likelihood. and show the truth will eventually come out. but I I hope that our district and I hope that our it is put through all of this I. Hope they all come forward. And a forthcoming in. In their answers and exactly what happened here. Are just should not be put through this. Do you Again, we can't know another person's mind or thought, but do you think this goes on does does the does the speaker look at this? Does it die after today or what do think about that? Well. You know when you run for Congress, they give you a an entire handbook on congressional ethics but Having said that I can tell you that. from my understanding is that there is a committee that's made up of Republicans and Democrats. in the lesson speaker berries that that will probably go forward into an investigation in the should happen sooner rather than later because. Far, from being exculpatory. they screen shots To me. They give us the end of the the end of a string. Attached to the other strength. So they are very, very disturbing. The office of. Congressman, the any public office is in office of trust. And to abused public office. to victimized rather than. Help a constituent is is very, very serious if I were to make a phone call to anyone hundred circumstances, I would have been making a phone call to Ms Lamar and I would've said, thank you. God. Bless you. You Deter Mendes work. You're the director of served during Vice Chair of lock against Gun violence. I. Don't know where you find the time. What can I do to help you? In your job instead of calling her employer and trying to get a fired, that's reprehensible. Able that should never ever happen what it does exhibit. There's a level of moral turpitude that would render one onset, not only Congress before any public office well said. speaking of George interest who's running for Congress in the twenty Fifth District Against Joe Morelli about the situation of recent days where in a member of the Monroe. County legislature says, she believes Joe Morelli tried to get her fired and the in his initial tax released. The one that we have is his initial text. He says something about I I hate to bring these annoyances to you, but he defined what the entire thing is it is. Is An annoyance. It's not a violation of law. It's not a violation of a contract He's annoyed and that in his mind he's so absorbed with his own importance that if he's annoyed, other people need to be concerned in this needs to be looked into i. find the fact that again, he thinks the power of his office, the influence of his standing can be brought to bear to assuage his annoyance. That's he's pretty full of himself. Well. You know the the worst and I think one of the worst of any. Leader is self-importance in the lack of humility. And you're absolutely right on that. But when when I read these. Tax, they go far beyond that. mister morale talks about when she was questioned about it. Dwell who questioned her one they questioned or who was there? You know already has a lot to answer on this. mist and Guardians Response was we felt. That, if we asked her to have taken down. That'll lose too much more in the conversation. But who has four, what to be taken down? What else was the if anything was demanded? Needs raise much much more. Questions are very disturbing far from being sculpted flory Are they are damning screen shots and I? Really lovely. warned of you know. Ms Lamar is a treasure in our community. She helps people. I'll tell you what Bob. Of. I. Was out in the community the other day and one of the people that I met carried a a baby carriage in her hand, and she was putting all of her worldly belongings in the trunk of a twenty five year old car. She had tears in her eyes was out Henrietta. and. I said what's going on and this was a young single woman. She said I'm being vic. Does I duNNo, where I'M GONNA go. So. To victimize. A woman, a single mother who goes out in the community, and she lives black lives. Matter. This isn't just a slogan to her if you look at her resume and what she's done as Lamar. And every single mother to to the man if these allegations are true that she'd be fire. For nothing along because I listened to that interview. There was nothing political about it. This is reprehensible. Then, this is I don't even know if I can find a word for it but. There's certainly is not deserving of a congressional representatives into twenty. Th Congressional district is being to George. Mattress, could you hold on a moment? Please serve I take a break. Sure I. Appreciate that again, George Mitchell is running for. Congress, he's a Republican he's running against Joe Morelli back with you just a moment on Newsradio ham eleven, eighty efforts we're speaking with George Mattress, who's the Republican candidate for Congress in the Twenty Fifth District? That's the one that covers pretty much all of Monroe. County he's running against a Joe Morelli. Also I. You know there are in use her longtime attorney and such like that. Self made man. There are different power gradients in society, and sometimes if you're high up the ladder and you contact an organization and say I'm annoyed by this person over here, that there are things that are implied there. You know I see in the text fire, this lady, but. That could easily have been an outcome of this matter. Out Live you know and I know that If Mr Morality has staff, he has a lot of money. If this was just an inquiry, a staff member could have called her. Written a ladder. people make telephone calls personally because. Whether. By words tone or inflection, they messages intended to be conveyed personally. and. This was there was a message sure that we can. Glean. From. The allegations and from Mr, morale response because they lose too much more. than the text of the sponsors in the screen shots. And according to them as Lamar. Shield edges that missed the GARDY. Contacted the dean of the college and her direct supervisor. asking them to fire. So her allegations are very specific. So we know that the Dean has information, we know that the department had has information. We know that the screen shots allude to more information. And, you don't have to be a lawyer figure this out. I didn't. I. Didn't realize this as as an attorney. I realized this and someone with a brainwave. You look at these taxes and they raise troubling troubling questions. Why the cell phone call was made personally and why was. It was felt necessary to move it up the chain of command and to talk about. Action on the part of t whether it was to take down. The interview with an Oculus in perfectly proper and contained well within the scope of Ms Lamar's. Job. Is Served Director of why that was felt necessary We know there's a lot more to it and I, hope it's investigated I hope. People, that really and truly care. About the issues in the society? that care about equity that care about law and order that care about equal protection of the law, rather than political lip service to all of these. By the way, this is the reason why I'm running I. It's you know Bob. I am not a political person. I haven't run for office before I am running here because fifty years ago when I came to this country, we were talking about. Were talking about equal rights, and we are still talking about it. Fifty years later under the watch of career politicians that have been government for thirty forty years like Mr Morelli. Show. If you really care if you're a voter, then you'll need to pay attention to what's going on. Because lip service and putting on a mask and having a photo op at A. Meeting doesn't do it quite frankly the real people that care about equity at. All the other issues that plagued us as a society or people who was MS, Lamar that are out there every single day. And those are the people that we should applaud. Those people should encourage than help in the office of. Congress. Again, this is an office of public trust and to flex your political muscle. For, no other reason than because someone went on a program that was hosted by primary opponent is reprehensible. I hope the speaker acts on this. if she does that will be investigated, there will be. Subpoenas issue in the truth will eventually come out But I I hope not only that. The parties as the right thing and the power structure of the Party does the right thing. But I hope the voters do more. Than simply tag onto a party label and they look at the issues that they look at a substance that they look at the content and. Determine for themselves which selection our society article recall. Outstanding, outstanding George Mitchell. Thank you so much. Sir, real quick is their campaign website or any place people learn more. Serious thank you the. The the website is mattress for Congress twenty twenty, dot Com any support, any anything. Y- of because we're out there for the people I am not a politician I, I'm out there to give us a voice. I'm just one of us. I hope to change businesses you stay. Thank you so much. Sir, you could donate a volunteer learn more about George interest at the website your reaction. You just heard the man I think maybe for the first time to two to eleven eighty truly, and powerfully, what did you think like teacher 'cause right after the news, which is up next with Todd holiday on newsradio wham eleven eighty. All land his dog him to be a business. I, let's go to Sam Schreier agenda. Listener What did you think of George metress? Sam Schreier I believe the voice of five yesser. Proud son of of Rhonda, quite What did you think of George Mattress? I thought he was very vocal about his opinions today the this this is. So it was like one of those things where you hear him speak and you go. Oh so this is why he's the candidate, right? The all of a sudden was he he was filling the shoes. Yeah. I. Thought he stated his opinion and backed it up and I thought you did a good job smart powerful direct anyways hidden really hard and not just with political claptrap. But with valid arguments against him, agree, yeah, I was I was I was pleased as the Great Sam Schreier there. Be, but here's the deal. We'll. Monroe. County is a county that has a majority of Democrats and The reason for that is because the city of Rochester has such a a wonderful abundance of Democrats. And and the the significant, the most significant portion of those happen to be African Americans. Now. Yes. There Alive Democrats, a lot of places. It clearly is a party on the grow in our region is specifically in Monroe. County. Will a Democrat vote for a Republican even if they're put off by what Marelli's actions may or may not have been? You know I. I, guess, that's the big. Question. You know the Horse on four ninety on the east side. Back, some several years ago. Dixon squabble, the legendary advertising agency came up with a campaign in, it wasn't new or unique to us. But there was a time where every town across America had some big white fiberglass animal and then you could raise money for charity somehow some way and paint the animal and put it on display right You remember in Buffalo, they had a ostriches. Is that right? No do for say had buffalo's okay. My Gosh and and in Dixville what did they have? The. I don't know I really don't know and I don't WanNa. Go there to find out I. Think I'd be frightened. But Anyway, my point is in Rochester we had horses. We had. We also had benches, I can't remember. Sam or are you old enough to remember? I. Work Forced the Horse of the bench I. Believe the benches were before the horses. The horses are they still have a bunch of you. Put, you put the bench before the Horse. Because, you don't put the carpets. My mother taught me. That's right. Okay. I, Remember One specifically horse. At frontier field, they, have the horse with all the baseball mitts. There you go. Look at that. You're making a pop culture connect. Yeah. That's very Nice Ham. Is a big step for. Gracious. Mom Is. Like a tall building says Kodak on the top. There is Sam two thumbs up on that as well. But? Yeah. Exactly. and there's a very nice bench. If I could say honoring a Rochester's veterans and military people out at the Greater Rochester International Airport two thumbs up on that. But One of the horse and this, they're all the creativity was wonderful and they were so fun to see, and you know you go around Oh look at that one and and a deal is that there has been. Out By the American flag on four, ninety on the east side of downtown in Rochester there has been rampant a horse, a Sam Schreier yesterday's voices section. Five. True senator around quite. Do you know what the word rampant means? It means like it a lot of it a lot like it keeps going and going and going going. Okay. Like running rampant. Okay. That's the energizer bunny. But rampant means standing up on your back feet with your with the with the little hooks in the air. Why wasn't even close? There's not a lot of call for having a horse vocabulary. These days Sam don't worry about it. You know don't worry about it. Let me ask you this. You know horse balls are. Is it like I don't know part part of their reproductive system. Maybe one thing that's that's a different phrase. It's something like a horse, that's what you're thinking. The Laws Berry, law, but they actually horse balls contrary. What people like you think Sam is a reference to the manure of equine. Are you familiar with Cao Cao Flop Jamf now? Never, you never gone South Henrietta. You've never seen cows whatever like that and I've seen cow. Okay. I. Don't really. You've never asked yourself. How do they go to the bathroom? No, you never or in the back of the car, your mom and dad when you're a kid driving through the country and look over into the pasture and see a cow, raise its tail into its business. I have never seen that. Let's see if that's on Youtube Sam. Are you familiar with Utah, very familiar with Youtube? Very good. Yes. Here's the thing. Sadly, we pay a million dollars for like every kind of TV thing there is in my my brain, dead kids, watch? Youtube. And typically they watch other idiots talking about stupid things, I'm sure you're gonNA find this because Youtube has everything. You can imagine. I. Can Imagine. We need to work together longer. You're guessing I can imagine. You're aiming little low. A little. Low. It's. What would it be? Cow defecating. Sure. All right. I'll try that D e F oh, of course. It's right right here. It's the. Third, suggestion. My Gosh, you know, screw the cow, go directly to the White Rhino my goodness. Gracious. I'm sorry. Here's the thing Sam. ipod don't anybody look at cow defecating on Youtube I was about to damn. It's clear that people like you and I have a natural in wholesome interesting cow defecation. Sorry. But there are some people's interests may not be wholesome and natural. It maybe recreational and unfortunately, they're posting videos. Gary. But a cow flops like this semi liquid, he stuff comes out and it's like nasty right But. A Horse, very neat about it. It's typically like a rough. It's not exactly a sphere, but a a rounded of a piece of very lot of cellulose in IT product will fall to the ground that's called a horse ball okay okay. Do. You know what a Horsh long is. Again part of the reproductive system I think you're closer. Have you ever heard the phrase used? Long. I mean, you can obviously I've got children listening in. By the way. Things. Okay. Okay. At the House. Yeah. They're doing. They got to get this thing going on this weekend, which is actually this week, which is really cool. It's called soccer shots. It's. When when, when Jackson my older son went to daycare? Okay. Had A program where they would come in and they would you pay like I don't know fifty dollars whatever story Sam, anyway, they play these. They play these. They come once a week and they do soccer. They learn soccer skills, play soccer, right? Nice. Shots. Is like, what's that? Are they? Well, I think they. Just. Their name. That's what they. That says soccer shots. They have a chance yeah. Nice? Yeah. It is. I. Think. It's like one two three soccer shots or something like that. You. How much fat? That's good My kids went to this thing was raw. Kick him in the knee. Oh. Yeah. Yeah, the other knee. Thank you. So anyway, this week is soccer shot. Well, the cool thing is because of covid and what they're not able to obviously go to the daycares and do all that stuff. So they're doing a backyard host, your own soccer shots So you can get several of your friends or whatever to sign up. So we got a bunch of the kids that went to the daycare and some. Some friends of ours and their kids they came, they do it from like ten fifteen to like ten, forty five, and they come four days. Charge I think it's like fifty bucks or something, and they stay here for the whole force and and they do the skills they come in the backyard our backyard. Pretty big. So it's a good spot for it. But yeah, he gets to see his friends your wife. Is. There are no while I mean, she does. Okay. Okay. She. Like, a big backyard, private soccer tutor and a nanny. No. Right, the village, the village does your family have some like Kodak Patents from back in the day? They're paying off for? No. No, but he loves it. So this week is soccer week. Yeah. Outstanding. Our kids are just finishing up a swim lessons. That's cool. Yeah, and we've it's the this lady and and the town of Monday give swimming lessons and our kids have been in them now for eleven straight years, and they'll take a week or two in the summer and it's wonderful. It doesn't so much good. Opted out. Do you do it like the younger kids? Obser- to do it with? No. When they're like a certain age and like swim, you do that and you know we've just had one after the Gosh I think right now, we got three that are taking swimming lessons. GOTCHA improve at whatever level of develops. Great. Great. To recap in the segment, I said Sean. Dead. Now, three times don't forget to put that in the federal paperwork that Sam Schreier. He's got a nanny This is Newsradio wham eleven eighty. Back. As. I was trying to say before Sam Schreier started talking about long whenever that's four times right there. I was mentioned that four, ninety. Horse. with is on the east side of town, there's a flag and behind it is the. Horse, which is painted something, red, white, and blue. It looks like a a flag was the general motif that the artist put on their. Real Pretty of if if each fixture. was out there because it's a powerful message was so nicely done well. This has been. You know this way unfortunately since our black lives matter of protests start him, but somebody went out there and vandalized that horse. And they have spray painted over it and you. You may not notice it unless you look over it as you pass. But you know that's the way it's been for some time now. The question then becomes. Can Be repaired and who had repair it. Anything theoretically can be repaired, but I, don't think there's anybody who has a stake in that who has the money to do it or anything along those lines. So to be honest with you, my thought would be and I believe that that property is maintained by the New York State Department of Transportation. I, hope that they would take the horse down. Because though as the artist intended it, it is beautiful and a a powerful statement defaced as someone has left it now. It is instead a slap across the face as you are coming into or going out of downtown Rochester from you know the east. So again. I the. It's that little island there. Has Been a place where issues of of patriotism have have come up different times. There's a flagpole there in a flag at different times. The flag hasn't been all that well cared for I. Think one time Todd Baxter went out there. With a new flag and took down the old tattered one in of his own volition, a put a a new a pristine one up. But again, the horse unless the Department of Transportation can get that squared away so that it once again is what it was intended to be a statement and inspiring statement about our country. If it's going to be Co. opted. And turned into a visual image of. The hatred that some have for the United States of America and a desecration of who we are and where we come from that some others aspire to having. Probably the horse should be taken down. We will stop We've got todd Haldane with the newscast, and we'll be back after that soliciting your calls, a lot of stuff yet to get to on Newsradio wham eleven eighty.

Sam Schreier Joe Morelli Congress Ms Lamar soccer Rochester Bob Mr Morality George Youtube Monroe congressman George Mitchell Twenty Fifth District George Mattress Mr George Mattress Kuoni director America Paula

Wednesday, June 24, 2020 - The Christian Science Monitor Daily

The Christian Science Monitor Daily

12:45 min | Last month

Wednesday, June 24, 2020 - The Christian Science Monitor Daily

"Welcome to the Monitor daily Podcast, it's Wednesday June twenty-fourth. Thanks, for joining US I'm mark. Sapping bill and I'm Kendra Bianco. The search for life elsewhere in the solar system has officially gotten weird. Until this week, no one dared utter. The phrase life on Pluto because well, that would be just playing nuts, a surface temperature of minus three hundred and eighty degrees Fahrenheit on a world forty times farther away from the Sun. The Earth doesn't exactly conjure images of ET. Yet attention life on though is exactly the implication of a new study this week. Pluto could very well have an underground ocean. Exploration of the Outer Solar System has revealed many marvels, oceans and rivers and rainstorms of liquid methane on Saturn's Moon Titan and surprisingly haunting landscape of clue itself. But perhaps most interesting. has been the discovery of subsurface oceans I on Jupiter's Moon Europa then on Saturn's tiny moon enceladus. Like a kid running through a summer sprinkler Nasr's Cassini spacecraft even flew through the geysers that erupt from enceladus. We don't know the conditions for organic life beyond Earth because we haven't found any yet, but liquid water is thought to be essential. In, the discovery of it in places never imagined, says Allen Stern had of Nasr's twenty fifteen mission to Pluto. Is a fundamental see change in the way we view the solar system. Hon probably intend. Now today's stories. Are First Story. The downturn has hit black communities disproportionately hard. Those affected see the pandemic worsening a chronic lack of opportunity. But cities like Baltimore, are taking steps help. The coronavirus lockdowns have magnified inequalities in US society with higher unemployment rates among women, young workers and those without a college degree. The gap looms especially large along racial lines a fact now amplified by nationwide protests in support of the black lives matter movement. Even before the pandemic related spike in joblessness, the average black household had just one tenth the wealth of the average white household, according to Federal Reserve data. The legacy of slavery has not been resolved, says economist. We Cook at Michigan State University. Addressing racial and other inequalities is vital, she says to fulfil the goal of shared prosperity and a strong overall economy. Ideas for new federal action or servicing such as for. Jobs guarantee or baby bonds that young people could use for college or other goals as they enter adulthood. In Baltimore People like George Mitchell are taking local action running a food bank. That's now busier than ever as well as job skill programs. Mr Mitchell is keenly aware of both the promise and the challenges in his community. All we got to do is change one block at a time. He says, but we're running out of time. The story was reported by Mark Trumbull in Baltimore for the Monitor. The pandemic has made clear. We will change our lifestyles in an emergency. For many in Europe that realization offers hope for climate change. Six months ago, climate change was a top global priority, and then covid nineteen happened, but although the pandemic has eclipsed global warming the habits we have adopted during lockdown could help deal with the carbon crisis to. That is the hope of the climate. Assembly a citizen's panel appointed by the UK parliament to come up with ways to meet the government's target of making Britain carbon neutral by twenty fifty. Its report this week. Urge the authorities to ensure that their post corona virus economic recovery plan matches the zero emission goal. It also suggests as does a similar French citizens convention that also reported this week that lockdowns could have a positive legacy if they have taught us to work at home, sometimes rather than drive to work or to think three times before taking a plane. Most of the actions needed to get to net zero emissions will mean lifestyle changes in opinion polls. People are generally reluctant to embrace them. In Real Life Kobe nineteen lockdowns have revealed that in a national emergency citizens are indeed ready to make abrupt lifestyle changes. That could be good news for the world's climate. The story was reported by Simon Montlake for the Monitor. COVID nineteen is on the rise in countries that have reopened their economies. For Democracies Trust could play a central role in making any reimposed restrictions stick. As governments worldwide open up their economies and loosen restrictions on daily life. The number of new covid nineteen cases is rising. The authorities are counting on one of two factors to keep the rise under control, trust or fear. Some democracies whose leaders have built up a cushion of public trust can hope with some confidence that people will accept reimposed restrictions. Authoritarian governments know citizens fear the consequences of disobedience. What about Democratic leaders who don't enjoy much public trust? On one end of the spectrum new, Zealand's premier just there our dern won enough confidence from the handling of the first wave, not to have suffered much from its reappearance after the country was declared virus free. At the other end, the Chinese government knows that it can enforce hermetic lockdowns on whole neighborhoods of the capital now that the virus has sprung up again only days after Beijing was declared free of Covid. Inbetween in countries, such as it states, and Britain were trust has declined. A big question is looming. If the authorities feel the need to reimpose lockdowns handy, make them stick. The story was reported by Ned Tomko in London for the Monitor? Survivors of the coronavirus should be immune. Scientists say. Some have proposed capitalizing on that immunity, but that could open an ethical quagmire. If covid nineteen behaves like other diseases. At least some portion of those who have fought it off should now have immunity against contracting it again, which means there should be hundreds of thousands if not millions of people who are to be capable of returning to normal life without putting themselves or others at risk. Medical researchers and tech companies propose taking advantage of that population by granting them immunity passports, which would allow them to bypass restrictions. But ethicists warn that granting special status to those who are immune opens up moral questions about obligations that might follow. I shouldn't have to stay in my home in socially distance and not go to my office. If I'm immune from infection, that doesn't make any sense. Says Jeffrey Kahn. Of the Johns Hopkins Berman Institute of Bioethics, but it's not just freedom, but rather what responsibilities might be imposed on the individual and employer could say well your immune so now you should work in this area that you didn't before because we need people in this essential area and you are immune and safe. This story was reported by Dominique so gal in Basel Switzerland for the Monitor. Humans are fundamentally good. Longfellow deserves a reappraisal and butterflies. Levels of aerodynamics. These topics make for sparkling June reading. That's historian. Rutger Bregman Fourth of medical idea in his new book humankind. That most people deep down are pretty decent. Other books that monitored critics chose as June's best include a gripping novel, looking at race identity, and the meaning of home, an exploration of the language of butterflies and how America crafts its own history. You can find her curated list in today's issue or at CS US monitor dot com slash daily. Now commentary on the compassion shown by the world's mayors from the Monitor's editorial board. Cities have been at the epicentre of the pandemic, both in the number of lives lost and in being closely watched for the quality of governance. Mayors who governed closest to the people had to show high levels of compassion along with a firmness and wisdom in enforcing social distancing shelter in place and mask wearing. One of the most common words they use is kindness. The virus has hit the most vulnerable people in urban areas, and as it recedes. Matters want to focus on inclusive recovery. Let's make kindness contagious temp as mayor Jane. Castor often tells residents in April. She had the highest approval rating seventy eight percent among Florida's big city mayors. One reason kindness has been so necessary is that the crisis has sewn disunity? This is a virus that thrives off of division says. Mayor Eric Garcetti. We can also respect and be respected and appeal to our better angels. Kindness is not written into any city laws as far as we know, but a law of kindness now seems evident in many cities. And, it's spreading. Iraq for the news you can find the full length versions of these stories in today's issue, or at CS Monster. Dot Com slash daily. Thank you for joining us today. Tomorrow Peter? Four takes an indepth look at how America's step back from a leading role in global affairs is reshaping the world. Today's Christian Science Spiritual Perspective contributor writes that more often than not. The News of day gives rise to fear division anger. But we can challenge this poll and instead remained calm clear and focused on what God is knowing. which enables us to be a part of the solution? Instead of the problem. You can find the column in today's issue or at CS monitor dot. com slash Dave. We want to give a quick. Thanks to our staff including today's audio. Production Team Jeff. And Rebecca assuming. This podcast is produced by the Christian Science Monitor Copyright Twenty Twenty.

Baltimore US lockdowns Britain America George Mitchell Christian Science Monitor Federal Reserve Johns Hopkins Berman Institute Democracies Trust Covid bill Europe Twenty Twenty Kendra Bianco Eric Garcetti
Death behind bars

Today, Explained

21:45 min | 1 year ago

Death behind bars

"I took the outset once and now i'm the host of a podcast so if you want to have better luck than i did magoo dot com m. a. g. o. Oh s. h. Dot com they wanna help you with your test prep and they're offering fifteen percent off today. Explain listeners right now. The promo code is today. The north senior reporter vox jeffrey epstein is dead. What do we know so. There's a lot that we don't know but there is a little that we know he. He was found dead on saturday morning in the jail in manhattan where he was being held awaiting trial he was facing up to forty eighty five years in federal prison if he was convicted on the sex trafficking charges and from reports that we're getting so far it appears that he had hanged named himself. Can you tell me a little bit more about this facility. He was being held the metropolitan correctional center in manhattan. Yes so it's in lower manhattan. It's actually kind kind of a notorious facility. It's also where infamous drug lord el chapo guzman was held on. He referred to being held there as torture so the conditions are are notoriously not great. It's had problems with staffing. It's had problems with overcrowding. It's had problems with violence with unsanitary conditions so as you know by all accounts not a pleasant place to be in that was in the same facility. I believe that reports came out several weeks ago. That epstein had tried to end his life. Is that right. That's correct correct so few weeks ago. Jail authorities found epstein injured in his cell and it was a little unclear from initial reports whether he had tried to harm himself zolfo. Maybe someone else had tried to harm him. Whatever the case the authorities did put him on suicide watch and so for a time he was being specifically monitored to make sure or he didn't try to harm himself and do we know if he was still on suicide. Watch this weekend. When he took his own life. He'd actually been taken off suicide watch. This was of course the big question that a lot. A lot of people had following his death. This is someone who had maybe tried to harm himself. Wasn't he on suicide watch. How could this happen but in fact a few days prior to his death. He'd been taken off suicide. Watch you know details about this or still kind of coming out but it appears that he actually had been taken off at the request of his attorneys some sources retelling the wall street journal turn all the day his lawyers had actually asked him to be taken off boat over. The casey wasn't on formal suicide watch when he died. Was there any kind of monitoring going on at the time <hes> he did this. Were there cameras. Were there guards coming by anything like that. He was supposed to be monitored so even though he wasn't formally on suicide watch jail policies would dictate dictate that for a prisoner who'd been on suicide watch. There were a couple of safeguards that we're supposed to be in place. He was supposed to have a cellmate. The theory there is that someone who may have have been suicidal should have companionship and it's also someone who can frankly just watch that person but his cellmate had left the cell at the time of his death apparently for some kind of appointment guards were also supposed to be checking on epstein believe every half hour but it appears they hadn't done so in the hours leading up to his death and the little bit unclear unclear. Why but you know they're staffing problems. Some of the guards were supposed to be checking on him. You know we're working overtime. One of them had worked overtime for for four or five days in a row so it's possible that some of these jail staffing issues may have contributed to the fact that he wasn't necessarily checked on the way he was supposed to be attorney. General william bar appears to be very upset about this we will get to at the bottom of what happened and there will be accountability but let me assure you that this case will continue on against anyone who was complicit with epstein any co conspirators should not rest easy. The victims deserve the justice and they will get it. Do we know if there's going to be an investigation into how such a high profile prisoner was left to his own devices aces. Oh yes there's multiple investigations that are going to happen the f._b._i. Is investigating the attorney. General has called on the department of justice to investigate several members of congress brisa called for a congressional investigation and it's really like bipartisan calls for this so everybody from representative of cossio cortez new york of course is a democrat to republicans guns in florida. Really everybody wants congress. Look into this and this happened. Soon after documents were unsealed on friday that connected a lot more people to epstein. That sort sort of revealed a lot more details what we're in those documents. These documents had been really <hes> keenly-anticipated for days. Everybody kind of knew that they were about to be released. It's too and they have to do with a defamation case filed in two thousand fifteen by a woman named virginia roberts jofre and she's claimed the jeffrey epstein kept her enslaved saved as a teenager and sexually abused her along with other girls. All you do is obey. That's it and eventually led to well now. We're going to experiment experiment and we're gonna try with another guy and see how you go so they sent me to an island with a professor and i basically had to do what i it did for jeffrey for him so it's very private. It's the perfect world for a billionaire getting away with what he was doing. There was so much anticipation around these documents. People were saying oh you know they're going to implicate president trump. They're going to implicate bill clinton. They're going to implicate every powerful man in the entire country country and they weren't quite as explosive as i think some people had expected they did include some allegations by the women in question that she was instructed acted by gillan maxwell who has epstein sort of associate to have sex with former new mexico governor bill richardson former u._s. Senator george mitchell will there were some allegations in the documents concerning prince andrew the duke of york. All of these prominent men have denied these allegations. It wasn't quite to the level of revelation that i think some people were expecting. It's more deepening the case around epstein deepening the case around this woman john maxwell and really showing you know the level will end specificity of allegations that women have brought really against both these people. I guess considering the proximity to win. These documents were released though it's no surprise that the internet was teeming with conspiracy theories since the news broke that he was dead and then you couple the fact that he had connections to the current president former president the bill clinton is more information going to come out about exactly how vast epsteins operation was what his connections were to these other men or does his death mean that people will never know you know his death will complicate matters certainly to some degree. The most basic thing that will happen is obviously. He can't stand trial l. anymore so some of the women who say that he abused them. They're not going to have the chance to face them in court and they're not going to see him sentenced but that doesn't mean that we can't can't as the american public still find out a lot about what happened a lot about people who might have been involved other than epstein a lot about people who might have looked the other way. There's is a criminal investigation in new york. That's still ongoing even though epstein instead the u._s. Attorney in manhattan jeffrey berman put out a statement on saturday really letting everyone know that his office is going to keep working on the case he said our investigation of the conduct charged in the indictment which includes a conspiracy count remains ongoing and it's significant that he kinda mentioned conspiracy counts so when epstein was arrested earlier this summer when he was charged he was charged with sex trafficking and then he was also charged urged with conspiracy to engage in straffing <hes> not conspiracy count implies there are other people involved and so i wouldn't be surprised to see charges and certainly only to see ongoing investigation in the coming months. Have you spoken to any of epstein's accusers. Do you know how they feel right now so i haven't spoken to his accusers personally but i actually just this morning <hes> spoke with lisa bloom who is an attorney representing two women who say they were abused by jeffrey epstein on the asked her. How are these women feeling right now now that he's dead and she said they had two very different reactions. One of them was really angry. She wanted to see epstein. Epstein brought to justice and it's not gonna happen now but the other one she said was actually relieved because even though obscene was in jail. This woman was still really worried. He could somehow hurt her and now she knows he can't hurt her anymore and he can't hurt anyone else so there was for that woman just sort of a sense of relief and find out about staff <music> <music> <music> while some jeffrey scenes accusers feel like they just lost their shot at justice. His death is unexpectedly shining a light on a totally different issue <music> conditions in america's jails. That's an minute onto explained <music>. <music> <music> studying for standardized tests doesn't have to be stressful expensive or boring. Just take a look magoo's for starters. They're called magoo magoo. Sh like m. a. g. o. s. h. mugu. How boring could it be. Magoo's offers a score improvement mint guarantee. If you don't improve you'll get your money back. While we're on the subject of money you get fifteen percent off right now with magoche. When you go to magoo dot dot com and enter the promo code today study materials over at magoche are always up to date and super relevant to the questions you'll see on the actual tests tests and students who've used magoo turns out. They love it. One student who used to improve his jeanette verbal score by six point said something like back mike wants skills were already good canadian to improve my verbal score to question sets an explanations are amazing. Negoti mm-hmm andrew cohn editor at the marshall project covering criminal justice. How common are suicides in america's jails. Suicides suicides in jail are the most common form of deaths in american jails. Believe it or not part of the problem here is that jails and prisons do such a lousy job of reporting reporting the information. The latest we have is that it is a huge problem especially in jails which are of course more transitory than prisons and typically typically jails. Don't have the sort of mental health infrastructures that you really need if you're going to prevent people who may be suicidal from actually acting on their impulses. Do we have any numbers from any recent year. I think the most recent numbers are from two thousand fourteen believe it or not there have been a number of media reports. It's an academic studies done but there are people who die basically every day in jails from suicides. It's an enormous problem at the state level to alabama obama recently in the past year so the enormity of the problem with suicides dare has come to light only because of a lawsuit. That's now in federal court the e._s._p._n. Alleged the department of corrections is still not meeting the basic mental health needs of vulnerable prisoners despite a federal court order to take accent just just in the past week or so there are new reports about the extent of the problem in georgia at the local jail level and at the state level the georgia. The department of corrections is investigating inmates death at valdosta state prison. This is the second inmate death about state prison in the past two months and it obviously obviously as we saw over the weekend is a problem is well in the federal bureau of prisons which has a terrible track record of dealing with suicidal prisoners. Do you have any numbers from two thousand fourteen eighteen inch after the number in jails anyway was somewhere between three fifty and four hundred which is a lot. Why don't we have up to date numbers. I think gets for the same reason that we don't really have adequate official numbers about police shootings. The incentives are just not there. I'm sure that every jail official all in a local jail knows precisely how many men and women have committed suicide in particular facility but it's embarrassing information right. It doesn't make anyone look good. A lot of the reporting of these sorts of events is voluntary and so you get numbers that are <hes> late in coming and is it happening in one place more more than another like. We have epstein case where it's happening in the heart of manhattan. Is it also happening in rural kansas in prisons there it is it's happening all over over the country. I remember the story in ohio where this really truly hated. Serial rapists was basically left to kill himself miserable years. They survived three young women summoning every ounce of strength in that house of horrors but ariel castro lasted just one month in one day in prison before apparently taking his own life and then they said oh geez we better it just doesn't look good and everyone was expecting this man to live to be tried and now he's dead and we're going to basically fudge the records. A report released today a also says to prison guards falsified logs documenting their observation of castro in the hours before he killed himself. The report says video indicates that guards failed failed to check on castro at least eight times before he died. That's the sort of attitude that should never happen. There was a case of a young man named billy slagelse will never ever forget who committed suicide hours before prosecutors in his case found evidence that might have exonerated aided him records on a computerized logbook may have been falsified on august fourth the night billy slagle killed himself on death row in the chillicothe correctional institution solution and it was almost like a shakespearean tragedy where had he held on for a few more days might have become aware of the good news essentially and might have <unk> at some point been released from prison so yes it is a nationwide problem and i'm not sure that there are many jurisdictions that have figured out a way to solve it. I remember when whitey bulger's showed up to his prison. I think in west virginia and he was there for like twelve hours before he was brutally beaten and so quickly executed essentially but then i read articles you know where people had spoken to those affected by his crimes in in boston and outside boston and they were happy and i i just wonder. Is there a sense that as a society as a country. We just don't really care what happens to the incarcerated once they're incarcerated law aw i think that there have been books written in the past decade or so about american exceptionalism in terms of punitive feelings punishment what happened to whitey bulger is also part of the same problem here. It was also a federal penitentiary. It was also a scenario where prison officials knew or should have known that there could be trouble. It was a penitentiary. I think in west virginia was notorious for problems and there has been sort of a scandal in the wake of it. I think the same thing's going to happen here. You have a lot of the same elements but i don't think that the bureau prison suddenly as a result of this this episode is going to turn around and spend a ton of money making sure that mental health treatment is better for inmates or that you know the prisons are are fully staffed and operational although that should happen. I think that there's gonna be an investigation and i think maybe a head or two is going to roll somebody's going to get fired ardo resigned and and then you're going to sort of move on with life what's standing in the way of actually fixing this well. It seems to me okay that if the political will to ensure the safety of prisoners whether they're high profile prisoners like jeffrey epstein or prisoners that no one is going hear about or ever heard of then you make sure that your jails are fully staffed that your prisons are fully staffed that the mental health professionals who are in charge of these prisoners evaluating their mental health are adequately paid and compensated that there are enough of them so that when there is a suicide that should i take place. Two guards who fail to monitor properly are held accountable. If those things were to happen then you wouldn't have the hundreds of inmates suicide besides that you have in prisons and local jails across the country but it has been that way even as people have become more familiar with the problem seems to me that there just isn't the political article will at this point to solve it part of that. I think is americans are particularly punitive when it comes to inmates part of it i think is an attitude among prison staff and jail staff of animosity towards inmates and part of it is just the nature of politics incarceration which even though it's maybe turning around a little bit in the last couple of years still is is as a regressive. It has been for quite some time. Do you think there ever will be that. Political will in america to take better care of its inmates to make sure they serve toll terms instead of being murdered or ending their own lives. I don't know i think one of the open questions here going forward is whether this death which really has shocked people into understanding more about how prisons zain's jails really operate whether it is enough to jolt congress into demanding that the bureau of prisons does a better job and whether it's enough to jolt local jails into using more of the funding they get to prevent these sorts of things from happening. It would seem like an incredible irony of the upshot of jeffrey epstein's case and death death and life is improving prison conditions across america. I agree and i am not sure it's gonna make a difference in the in the end you know one. One of the things that i find fascinating about the reaction to his death is the reaction by the attorney general. I'm shocked shocked to find the gambling is going on. You know right out of casablanca. Casablanca on monday declared that he was shocked shocked at this stuff was happening. I was called and indeed the whole department was and frankly hungry to learn of the m._c._c.'s failure to adequately secure this prisoner. We are now learning of serious irregular at this facility. They're deeply concerning and demand a thorough investigation. If he's paid any attention to congressional testimony over the past decade or two hundreds of news articles about the problem then he would have known that the bureau of prisons has a terrible morale problem and as a terrible problem of under-staffing. It has a terrible problem of people swallowed up in overtime this. This should not be news to the attorney. General janet is news to the attorney general then he's been negligent as well <music> <music> <music> andrew cohn is a senior editor at the marshall project and a fellow at the brennan center for justice. I'm sean robbins firm tom. This is today explained <music> <music> <music> <music> before we go just a reminder that magoo's would like to help you with your upcoming standardized tests. They've got online test. Prep that provides leads you with the tools. You need to get a great score. Study schedules up to date practice questions video lessons support from expert tutors. Check it out at magoo dot com m._a._g._a. o._s._h. Enter the promo code today for fifteen percent off discount.

vox jeffrey epstein attorney manhattan magoo magoo bureau of prisons america el chapo guzman andrew cohn Dot congress reporter valdosta state prison bill clinton whitey bulger department of justice new york Senator george mitchell lisa bloom ariel castro
Hard Factor 8/12: Jeffrey Epstein's Curtain Call, Flat-Earth Rocket Man, and the Russian Night Wolves

Hard Factor

26:06 min | 1 year ago

Hard Factor 8/12: Jeffrey Epstein's Curtain Call, Flat-Earth Rocket Man, and the Russian Night Wolves

"Would it is joe man randy savage. This factor in there is no one that does it better now but it does it better myself. Go ahead. Tell me something right down. <music> <music> welcome to another episode of hard-backed art factor. It is monday august twelfth top stories for the day. Mark is gonna tell us about jeffrey epstein. He's dead or is he. He's dead pretty sure he's dead. He's dead by suicide. They say they say so. They say that that's bullshit. They okay say it all right and then pat west myself. We'll take us through a news buffet of other headlines. Take it away mark all right. It was a rough weekend for opponents of sex trafficking in pedophilia and that's because everyone's least favorite human. Jeffrey epstein killed himself this weekend or someone did it for him or told him to do it or whatever i mean. The scumbag is dead. Ding doc brick is debt which is not good because it'd be great if he was dead later right not now make it the trial very very good point have been would have been good so i thought about giving a george for this one allow west style. He's done for john. Mccain and bush senior or pat has also done one for ross perot so some great diversity there with our eulogies guys know women we respective have died or people of color great not at all. No women presidents at least yeah she's yeah. It's a good point dublin. Mostly almost presidents well actually not at all. One of them was forced the joke per old white guys. We're we're gonna we're rolling. It would have been a sarcastic eulogy but i don't even want to give him that so what happened with epstein well. He's dead that much we know or everyone thinks he allegedly hong no. Oh no no i saw i saw on twitter the truth which is that's a fake body in the jail cell. He's actually on a plane to the middle east to get facial facial reconstruction surgery as we speak okay. I like that that's possibility he allegedly hung himself on friday night in his jail cell and was found dead at six thirty a._m. Saturday morning conveniently there was no video footage of what happened in epstein sell as although there are tons of cameras in the nine south wing of the m._c._c. manhattan prison epstein was holed up in none of the cameras must face into the cells. They all just outside of them. Somehow i guess they don't want to have <hes> nonstop footage of prisoners aggressively jerking off while staring into the camera all right so we all marks getting out of something something weird's going here. I'm going to play devil's advocate through this story just so we're coming boasts. It's possible that there weren't cameras pay facing jail so because that's that's against protocol so we should find that out. I'm sure the whole situation is a bit fishy though devil's advocate something doesn't smell right and it's not as dead body brooklyn borough president eric. Adam said the good news is the f._b._i. Justice department are investigating the incident and those guys find everything that's true. They're so good at really good rates especially actually recently. You should trust the federal government with everything. You should give them all your stuff. You should just you should let them do everything for you because they know best. They went to the mall mall the other day and i saw the f._b._i. Had a booth next the army sign up. They did not want to sign up for the f._b._i. They're hiring anyone these days another mall the mall i'm joking. They've been mark another piece to this story is that the court papers from the scene investigation were released on friday and contain the names of other men including former maine senator george mitchell and ex new mexico governor bill richardson who allegedly slept with an obscene teenage sex slave yikes new york attorney general leader james who said she toured the m._c._c. The prison said she found it very difficult to understand how something like this could have happened. My understanding is that he should have been on suicide. Watch and the people on suicide suicide watch our police in a typical type of jumpsuit that wouldn't allow them to hurt themselves or others. She went on to say he was on suicide. Watch after the july twenty third suicide suicide incident alleged incident but epstein was taken off suicide watch six days later on july twenty ninth and return to the m._c._c. special housing unit after after after a after a psychiatric evaluation nailed. It was no longer at risk long himself. It is not yet clear who made that evaluation and judgment could it have been former epstein epstein cellmate and part-time prison doctor nicholas tartaric lino possibly could have been maybe joe biden. He's just like i you know well. I think i i can't remember if he tried to do anything before. It's all this guy should clinton. This guy should not dead from suicide in his cell no fucking way. He's probably probably the highest profile prisoner in america right. Now everyone at works in the prison should be investigated. Epstein has been had been without a soulmate for the last two weeks and according to that at some late ex-cop and accused quadruple homicide psychopath nicholas star trek lino. He said that he actually helps save up scenes life on july twenty third so maybe nicholas and apology for insinuating waiting than could have been a hitman hired by the off tawfiq's definitely nursing him back to health for sure just like i said we know turnover new leaf. Do we have turtle was in the cell. What i've seen tried to kill him. So yeah yeah on july. Twenty thirty was the last two weeks. He's been without a summit epstein without anyone watching them. You're talking about a witness yeah yeah. It looks fine to me ain't going to kill himself. Looks good to me back tire. I i want to go down to the bar. Have some beggars exactly <hes> boston. We should all go. Epstein was not only without a cellmate but he was also left alone and not not monitored as we're referencing by guards who were supposed to buy protocol check in on him. Every thirty minutes twenty four seven in the lobby watching bill clinton played the folks chapo. He's like the pied. Piper wasn't el chapo in fucking manhattan or he was in brooklyn jail. El chapo apple was there and didn't kill himself or escape for that matter so like somehow someone was watching all chapo close enough to where nothing weird happened but epstein dies in a week we can half yeah. It's it's it's i think we're we're joking about the clinton stuff for the most part but trump did re tweet like clinton conspiracy which is dangerous senators. The governor's could have been clinton could have been any the quinn's could've been in spain and wherever else could've been everyone. You just hope that enough information has been recorded from his interviews that will get out that needs to get out like it socks because yeah i mean it's going to be watered down. No matter what maybe they find the madam it santa procedure for guards and the special housing unit look inside inmate cell every thirty minutes so it's unclear why why the hell epstein wasn't checked on the metropolitan. The metropolitan correctional center has been short staff for some time so we'll give him that apparently the two guards on duty where epstein stayed were both working overtime and one of them was on his fifth straight day overtime according to officials and maybe they just you know like we said just went home okay. Let's play devil's advocate here. There's no devil's advocacy sir. I'm sorry to have these people. What are you doing guy. What a fucking prison system. Everyone wants overtime this profile of of a of a. I wouldn't even call us a conspiracy theory. I would say this is the most likely theory time to blue collar workers water to someone walking in the desert like they. They crave it they want. It's the best thing ever when your hourly drop you get over these. These these guys might not need it though maybe right. Someone should have been there hitting on their pay level so i don't know we don't know exactly what happened but we do know this is not great news for all epsteins victims and is great news for all the people that partook in upstate sex parties party's let's take it to the internet where we are lucky enough today to have one of facebook's biggest jokesters as hard as a factor correspondent. James mcdowell says i hear joe cocker will perform with a little help from my friends at the funeral so james mcdowell is on fire like always and we were lucky enough to have him on the show today. Thank thanks jim thank you just. What do you think happened. I think either someone put a gun to them and said either. You do it or you know. We're gonna fucking do it or we'll. We'll sit still be alive if we didn't do it on his own. If a guy like epstein has anyone else cares about besides themselves which which is doubtful they threaten to kill anyone. He cared about your main girl his main prostitute who's now twenty one if the incident before was really him just getting crushed by tar typically early on in in the cell and then the guy may have told them like look you better do it to yourself before like or your life's gonna be horrible. Yeah i mean i think that's what there was. One funny report fourth. I read that epstein lived like a sloth in the past two weeks and he couldn't handle prison life and he would constantly dump his plates of food onto the ground and eat them with his hands off the prison floor and that he just requested more toilet paper at like a five times rate of other inmates so he was just eating off the floor and getting sick and shitting everyone. Who's trying to get the trying to get in san. It's all so he could either disappear which by the way is not behavior of someone who wants to die. Maybe he's going to hang himself. Who's acting insane can get sent to a hospital. Not a prison is not someone else you don't you. Don't eat off the floor. You just don't yeah. We'll probably never know how that really went down. All right. Anyways has taken over to the news buffet. This episode heart factors brought to you by we. The people holsters who offer custom-made holsters all produced in the u._s._a. Las vegas aga's nevada baby. We the people holsters even have their own three d design team who measure every micro millimeter of every gun to ensure the perfect fit they really are are spot on. My pistol fits snug insecure as possible in mind inside the waste outside the waste. It doesn't matter we the people holsters has a clip design that allows you to easily adjust how it sits for easy insecure access they also have adjustable retention signal with the click letting you know that your pistol is safe and secure in your holster ready to go custom imprinted designs if you want one of those every holster comes with a lifetime guarantee every holster ships free if it's not a perfect fit send it back for refund and right now listeners of heart factor go to we the people holsters dot com slash factor and enter promo code factor at checkout to get ten bucks off their first holster. That's as low as thirty. Seven bucks and shipping shipping is free with an additional ten bucks off using promo code again that's we the people holsters dot com slash factor promo code factor at checkout for an extra ten bucks off new jersey. I up a sixty three year old limo driver in the mojave desert mike hughes who happens to be a flat earth or and also a self made rocket scientist was scheduled to launch himself five thousand feet into the air on sunday night all right yeah but since the event was not televised or covered at all in any way that i could find on the internet we're going to have to just introduce the story today and then give you update update again tomorrow on how the launch went the update is he's going to be dead right like my cues could very well be dead. We hope not. We hope to continue this story on yeah yeah what mike right exactly well. Here's the funny part hughes claims that his desire desire to eventually launch himself into space from a homemade rocket from his front yard has nothing to do with his flat earth beliefs at all which is really hard to believe. I don't believe that's going to bring up. Properties is wrong with that. One is successfully launched himself in two thousand feet of space this time last year after the the first rodeo and when he landed he crash landed like compressed vertebrae was in the hospital for a while so now going two and a half times that height wasn't using steam power. Yes steam yes hydrogen in practice to eventually go one hundred thousand feet into the air at the the where like you can't outer space. It's carmine house the cop standing around watching this guy shoot himself into space and he can stop darwinism he wants soon earth is flat land on earth <unk> until you like thirty five to forty thousand feet in the air and he he's saying this one obviously isn't to do that. He walk into space that he doesn't believe exists right. That's what i'm saying doesn't believe that space exists. If you've got one hundred thousand feet in the air he's gonna hit some sort of magic glass walls right catch up up like what are you doing. He clearly doesn't believe in flatter. If he really wants to stop this guy does. He have family like ah shut up. He doesn't even have another like a client next week. The needs a limo ride like if it was that they wanna know if he has a family because i'm pretty sure he you know maybe a coupla because again. We don't know how it went. His clients are like mike. I'm not doubting. I think gear to get there but i have a backup limo driver next week. If that's okay just pulled us lawn chairs knocking sure mike's core all all right look brandy yakima laster lassiter of georgia isn't type of lady you bring home to mom mostly because she's the type of lady who makes a facebook video where she's walking down the street listing off all the men. She banged who are now subsequently h._i._v. Positive what yeah yeah. Here's an abbreviated transcript from the video that <hes> lassiter posted last week. I'm h._i._v. Positive roy d. roger anders you h._i._v. Positive jared ferguson you h._i._v. Positive diamante ballard bitch which you h._i._v. Positive bitch little bits you fucking bitch. She gonna have h._i._v. Positive too because you fucking bitch raw. Oh god damn baby baby demo. Tony would baby daddy you h hurry positive and four alert boiler dorsey u._h. Boiler he's like yeah. I know the end of the video. I'm always getting laid. Bitch always get the last laugh now. Y'all sick. It's fucking. She turns out she's not h._i._v. Positive oh just crazy just vindictive yes and she's now facing charges for harassing communications so there you go and what's the punishment for that should be pretty bad or knows but i will say to this talk to roy d. Roger jared demonte and your lady tony would and four little boiler dorsey. This is your second chance guys start wearing condoms and use greater discretion wearing four boilers oiling door. He's allergic to all right <hes> democratic presidential so candidate andrew yang who recently surpassed bet so a work in the latest iowa poll so sorry bet though <hes> and was attending a gun safety form in des moines with <hes> some of his fellow candidates showed his supporters and the world that he is very capable of empathy <hes> so after a woman in the audience described how her four-year-old daughter was struck and killed by a stray bullet yang the father of three. You're an six year old boys <hes> himself asked if he could go hug the woman and upon returning to the stage after consoling the woman yang needed some consoling himself as he broke into bumbling tears real crying the kind you can't fake or hold back or talk through the kind of crime that makes you look like a child. Are you insinuating that beethoven did cry. It certainly wasn't yang crying. Okay <hes> <hes> <hes> so it was in the crime was brought up brought on upon <hes> him imagining one of his own children suffering the same fate so he he would start sending <hes> and as you wor yeah it's hard it's hard to figure and as the only member of art factor that has cried on national t._v. t._v. I want andrew yank to know that i'm here for him and then i'm proud of him for showing that real emotion when it mattered. I also want you to know that the regretted embarrassment never leaves and we'll always be are there for your friends to knock you down a few pegs whenever the fuck they feel like it. You're you're probably going to gain. Some points for this. Andrew certainly did with me but you just officially lost the race. You big pussy yeah. What what show was number when the show yeah okay we won't say this show though gary about your <hes> the the deepening of crying making it worse for your image like so soft cry is a big win but like a deep cries like long presidential candidate ended it. Yes yeah was he. What is he gonna cries way into pushing the red button for i think yeah jimmy kimmel's tears about the mass shootings. Things absolutely put him for an ratings. We'll say he's running for president. Jimmy kimmel's thing is pretty awesome but he's he's also not in charge of the entire military like he's. He's gonna speaking of switching up ratings for pulling numbers. We're about to talk about something that involves president trump friend's friend of the pardon my take program anthony. Anthony scaramucci has found himself back on the front page. After president donald trump called him quote incapable on twitter the trouble in paradise former the white house and capable of doing stuff yeah all right capable of every do it right ah the trouble in paradise between the former white house communications director scare mucci in the president started when the mooch said that trump speeches in dayton el paso last week where a catastrophe castrophe on the bill maher show which somehow trump heard the ratings god as i like to call him. He doesn't miss a fucking mention. Like how the hell did. You hear mooch talking about him on. Bill maher is in the adding us hate trump. You'll let little mushroom dick according to what's her name stormy daniels a stormy yes. He didn't even have a fucking speech in dayton but yeah whatever l. right well. He said that his trip to the cities anyways after the much criticized trump bill l. maher said that he'd rather another economic recession than president trump winning another election which sounds like something a human yorkshire terrier like bill marr would say shit quote book bill. You don't really wanna recession said scaramucci quote. I really do mar insisted listed. We have survived. Many recessions can't survive another donald trump term strong mark bill maher who's worth dozens who is route fifty his money trump yeah bill maher who's guy probably twenty five foot one hundred thousand dollar oil give a flying fuck. If regular people lose their head of these this shit bill maher loves the smell of his own farts guys on speaking of own farts miley cyrus and liam hemsworth have called it quits after one in europe marriage sad relaxing. Are they going to land on their feet deep tops. We'll see a shocking story hung himself and this marriage didn't workout shocking but as you guys imagine as you could imagine. It's probably hard to be married when your wife is constantly posting photos overby hole on social media yeah rep for the couple came out and said quote ever evolving changing his partners individuals. They've decided that this is what's best while they both focus guess on themselves and their careers which is code for there are too many picks of my wife's be whole and breasts that were intentionally leaked by my wife on the internet it it was really more of a flood than a leak in what he was getting into liam's deepen and other stuff too. I think they were just kind of both thing. I mean this is this well. They were in and nicholas sparks movie together which is really hard to not fall unless saw liam hemsworth mess around no way no no miley who who would wanna do uh-huh not me i did see that's molly seems like she works at your local coyote ugly like he's going to stay in marriages extreme relationship within a year i did see i mean oklahoma with wayne coyne snorting g._m._t. Rep rep for the for the couple wanted to. Everyone know that was very important. I read the sentence that they will still be co-parenting. Adam and i was like oh shit. They're gonna be compared to this. It's they're fucking pets. They want the public to know that they're still going to be in touch so they can co parent their pets together fucking break. That's awesome a patent go. I will say this guy's miley she <hes> she celebrated the news by making out with brody jenner caitlyn carter on a yacht somewhere out there so i'm sure that liam's having an awesome week she's back back to scissor and say why couldn't you it is what we were married good for her. I think they did that to your guest and guest on the show. You know what i'm all right. Moving on vladimir putin was doing his thing only vladimir putin ken when he and his right-wing nationalist motorcycle gang the night wolves. No god called the night wolves took a ride through the high-tension peninsula of crimea vying name and bruising on a high tension vanessa. Who's not wearing a shirt while he's riding cycling. He asked leather down. That is the absolute last group of people you want to mess with you. Don't wanna cut off the fucking night. Wolves lead by putin dano. Thanks that's like the cartels are frying gangs the roosevelt hala. It's like fucking mad max. No thanks so <hes> and move on the move <hes> which ukraine's foreign ministry was quoted as saying was a blatant violation of ukraine's sovereignty ukraine also said the attempts by the russian media to to make these visits look routine pathetic and that putin is quote being a total dick again didn't really i don't know just dick. I bet what they went on. Says put the night. Wolves can go wherever they want. You should see you should see. We don't attack me. You guys are totally breaking the rules but it's okay honey. I'm sorry you're gonna have to sleep with the night wolves today. You just you just gotta do it. Yeah so meanwhile back in russia more than sixty thousand sixty thousand protesters chester gathered at the capital moscow demand fair municipal elections september normally what's going on that but probably just wants him some fair elections. All sixty thousand will scatter if the night wolves turnaround turnaround from crimp crimea and go straight protesting. We got about forty eight hours before they need to get the it should settle with russia is getting the night wolves over the united states to ride against our most bad ass like the band of angels or the hells angels yeah that'd be a showdown for the ages yeah so putin didn't care. He was hanging out tonight. We'll meet up at a hooters ordering them to kill journalists and <music> and whatever else so that's that's it putin's twins donuts thing putina males big time doing his thing and that's gonna for hard factor day. Thank you so much for listening as always if you haven't already make sure to follow at heart factor news on twitter and instagram andropov five-star review on itunes if you like the show but most importantly have yourself so a great fucking day dude solid could use a few pounds and tight pants points all the now the backup and police sudden way up high. Um well out the back seat him sixty share miss produced without an aclu's donovan nine trying to make some front page drive ins were again on. I nine on a summer man search search some had john arrests listen trustee stock. Neither one care share aw aw now more on on and <music> saw.

jeffrey epstein president bill l. maher bill clinton twitter mike hughes epstein epstein senator george mitchell donald trump liam hemsworth john facebook nicholas sparks Anthony scaramucci manhattan dublin Adam vladimir putin epstein
LIVE: What Happened to Conservatism with Sen. Ted Cruz

Why Is This Happening? with Chris Hayes

1:10:43 hr | 11 months ago

LIVE: What Happened to Conservatism with Sen. Ted Cruz

"In the legal world their principles of conflict of interest and there's also a question of an appearance of impropriety I would have wished the president had not gone down that road because at the very minimum there there's an appearance that that that I would rather he not not have opened the door to I gotTa tell you Donald Trump says things frequently that that I wish he wouldn't say hello and welcome to wise is happening with me your host Chris as well today. Hey we're doing something new and different which is exciting. It's exciting. If you are listening this you've probably have read who today's guest is. That's in the title of the show and you're probably thinking I really would like to listen to a little Ted Cruz on my commute so you're in luck because is that is what we are living today more seriously this is the first of this falls live with pod tour. We're doing four different dates this the first one where I do a live podcast one on one conversation in front of a audience the next one is coming up in October and ticks that are available cool but going very quickly. It's going to Los Angeles Ace Hotel Monday October twenty first at seven thirty. If you go to ticketmaster dot com search Chris Hayes you can find it takes that I'm talking to the amazing at Mackay who is the genius behind everything from Anchorman two vice to the big short and an incredible Sifi author Omar Khadr Todd Incredible Book American War About Future Civil War that happens under conditions of climate change so that's the next one that's happening. It's going to be very different than this one which you're about to listen to which is a conversation with. Ted Cruz and I've seen people say to me like why did you do a conversation with Ted Cruz and my feeling about it. Is You know he is. He's an interesting guy. He is the United States senator. We don't really agree on anything we have spoken to people across all different kinds of ideologies and political valances is an backgrounds and forms of expertise. We've done freshman democratic members of Congress. I don't think that with pod is a podcast that I would turn into a a weekly talk with a Republican senator but I also felt like this'll be interesting to try to see basically went into his. Here's a very obviously a very smart guy by who to me is sort of fascinating figuring these times for this reason what conservatism is in the era of trump is incredibly up for grabs. There was a sense in which when Ted Cruz ran against Donald trump in that primary. Ted Cruz is argument was I'm the real conservative and I thought and many thought that he'd sort of a better right or claim to it. He was much more a movement conservative. He had been you know a campus right winger and then he clerked for conservative judge injustice he was Federal Federalist Society member. You can't all the kind of Bona feet is all of the check marks of like this is a conservative dude a movement conservative dude and then he lost Donald Trump and his argument about Donald Trump was donald trump's not really conservative and conservatives like oh no no no. That's what we want like build the wall. The guy that threatens violence at the rallies who says like just knocked the hell out of them. If someone starts to protest the guy who says we should ban a billion Muslims worldwide who the judges judging me. WHO's an American can't judge me because he's a Mexican descent that guy the guy who is the bigoted offensive showman con artist. That's what it's conservative and that's what we want. Not You ted Cruz and then so ted Cruz had to figure out like how is he a conservative in the era of Donald Trump and so the conversation they shouldn't have it was like what exactly does conservatives look like in the era of Donald Trump Ted Cruz for instance a big trade war that includes massively jacked up tariffs that are according to one thing tank the largest tax increase in recent memory and then to deal with the cost of that twenty billion dollars in direct welfare L. Fair subsidies to farmers to take the sting out all done through unilateral executive action and with the power of the purse and the Article One Congress wingin- is at. I guess that's conservatism in the era of trump. Now I think that the conversation as you'll see like I had Lek varying degrees of success sort of like substantive engagement on this question I I think the foreign policy sections actually pretty interesting. We talk about some of the cleavages around isolationism as he puts it in a interventionism which are sort of caricatures both of them. There are other sections where I'm less successful. I think one thing that I would note here. Is that like there's a section in here on climate change that was Kinda rough and the reason it was Kinda rough offers that I did not expect Ted Cruz to go full climate denial. I expected him to do what most Republican politicians these days are doing a saying yes look the the planet is clearly warming. Carbon is playing a role in that and then do a lot of sort of like three card monty with like China and India and jobs and well. We can't really do anything we don't know the models but instead he just like went like way super old school the kind of thing you hear like fifteen years ago about like the satellite data is incomplete and actually there's more. Arctic ice now in like there's just like a a bunch of stuff being thrown around all of which is not really worth kind of like debating like the the the sort of scientific consensus on the basic facts of the fact that the world old is warming or is so robust and the product of literally and I say this without exaggeration trillions of points of data anyway. You'll you'll hear that section but I guess what would you say about that. Section is like he does not think the world is warming is basically the takeaway there which to me is an another interesting moment to think about what conservatism eh but it's also interesting to hear him disavowed. Iraq war which he says he didn't support. It's interesting to hear him talk about trump's diplomacy end at the very end we get to talk about the crane scandal and what that means and he does concede some things about how bad it all looks on the Ukraine scandal we talk about the Ukraine scandal. We both use the word transcript script shorthand for what is the call notes. It's not an actual word for word transcript. It is unclear whether it word for word transcript actually exists although it suggested that one does exist Diane Financing Housing has actually asked for it to be released but just don't tear your hair out while we use the word transcript okay I hear you. That's not the actual transcript so it is I think both an interesting just in conversation on its own and also I think an interesting artifact in thinking about where the conservative movement conservatism and the Republican Party is precisely at this extremely fraught and perilous moment so so I was thinking about how we were going to have this conversation and I thought I would start in a place where I think we agree and that's about okay. My job here is done so I think there's a belief among a lot of liberals that the public protestations of people the Republican Party about Donald Trump or essentially implicit in two-faced right that Lindsey Graham or yourself are saying one thing in public and saying another thing in private and you see folks like just in a mosh says this is true drew and I I'm of the belief that that's not true. I'm of the belief that I take Lindsey Graham his word I take you at your word and other conservatives that conservative Republicans think Donald Trump is a great conservative president they like and Admire Donald Trump. They think think what he does is good that he is a great leader and that they would be happy with Americans determining how they felt about conservatives in the Republican Party by determining turning how they feel about Donald Trump. Do you agree. I actually think it's more complicated than that. what what I hear from Texans frequently early is that they like the policy. That's being enacted. They like the substantive policy victories the country's doing well. The economy is is booming incomes arising that they like. I hear from Texans all the time you know I I wish someone would take away his twitter right. You know my sentiment limit. a a as you know. Donald Trump was not my first choice for president but he won and when he won I had a job to do which was represent twenty eight million Texans and work with him and I think on the substance we've accomplished an enormous enormous amount I mean this is the way primaries work right. I mean sure Barack Obama Ran Against Hillary Clinton largely on our foreign policy judgment and then US secretary of state so but I am interested in like in conservatism awesome because I think that like the argument against Donald Trump to me wasn't just tactical argument. It was actually a persuasive won. The argument was he's not a conservative I I am. I have the better claim to the term. Were you wrong. How'd you come to realize that he is a conservative. The three years ago there was good reason to doubt to say. I don't know what Donald Trump will do as president because his record on a lot of issues had been in more than one place I expressed those doubts vigorously. I will say the performance. The actual substantive performance. We've seen gene has been more conservative as produce better results than I think. Almost anyone had a right to expect and I think there are a couple of things driving that one I and other conservative work with very closely I mean I view a big part of my job as trying to encourage him to move in a positive direction and discourage him for moving in a negative direction on a lot of issues not everything but on a lot of issues. He's been listening to me. He's been listening to other conservatives. I think that's a good thing I think it is also so the case I have said more than once. This might surprise you. Thank God for Nancy Pelosi and thank God for Chuck Schumer and let me tell you why look trump job at a fundamental level is not complicated to figure out he likes people who praise him and he hates people criticize presidents. Zelinski had that figuring out to I mean he did if Chuck Schumer and Nancy See Pelosi had come in and said Mr President. Let's work with you by the way I'm pretty sure. Trump had been a donor to both of them in the past. This was not a crazy concept that they might work together. I shudder to think what would have happened to the country so you don't you don't think he fundamentally does have an ideological bearing. Oh look I think he makes decisions decisions. I think he has backbone. I think he has boldness a point to for example to foreign policy decisions that I think critically important number one moving moving our embassy in Israel to Jerusalem. I think that was hugely important decision. It was also a decision presidents. Both Republicans and Democrats had promised promised to do that is true and both Republicans and Democrats had broken that promise to back to your point. Chuck Schumer did applaud that decision yes but but he also didn't attend the opening. I was there in Jerusalem for the opening. No Democrats attended the opening which is a separate issue. I mean look when it comes to Israel. I'm very worried about the sentiments that are rising the Democratic Party but but let me for a moment focused on different aspects you were asking about trump's decision making on moving the embassy both the State Department Defense Department argued vigorously against danced moving the embassy a number of folks including me weighed in with the president vigorously on the other side and he had the backbone to move. I think that was an incredibly important decision and I don't think it was coincidental that the very same week we opened the embassy is also the week that he pulled out of the Iran Obama nuclear deal which I think is the most important national security decisions in the last three years so so I I think you and I disagree strongly on the merits of that deal so just to table that I can mm-hmm but to talk about this disposition inclination which I think there is a kernel of it that I think people particularly. I'm left admire or want to see in their own leader. Which is the establishment? Whatever it is whichever part of the Party will always come in and tell you here's why you can't do acts. I know that you told all these people that you were going to cancel student in debt but now you're the president and you can't do this thing and I think there was a similar argument me to him about moving the embassy and he said screw it. I'm doing it but there is a flip side to that too because there's also times where people in the establishment people in the civil service and the people who are the experts say you shouldn't do this and it's kind of important to listen to them. I think it's important to know how to get things done and and understanding Washington understanding the swap up helps to get things done but I do think disposition Ronald Reagan famously said paint and bold colors not Pale pastels. I think elections answer about choices. I understand why Democrats are drawn to candidates who who have a bold vision now so happens that I think the vision they're advancing doesn't work that it's bad policy ideas but I think a president having strength and boldness is a really good characteristic. I also think the fact that that because the far left has such animosity for trump Schumer and Pelosi started the administration just savaging savaging him yeah and I think it resulted in a much more conservative set of policies being implemented. I think as a description of the president's behavior I think that's probably likely true. I think in some ways I I would say it was more than the far left in terms of the people that didn't like I mean sure a lot of people are them selves moderates who are in The Dallas. Listen Houston suburbs for instance who are pretty worked up about him but on foreign policy. Let's start there in sort of I wanNA pivot away from the president and talk about conservatism and debates within conservatives unsure so there's a really one place there's a really interesting debate and conservatism is about the neo cons as the sort of folks like Rand Paul kind of derisively call them and folks who were extremely wary about additional foreign military intervention by the United States. Where do you come down on that debate right now and to me. It looks like the tide is shifting away from the Boltons and towards the Rand Paul's in the Republican base when you think that's accurate so this is an issue. I've talked about a lot I thought about a lot and and the short of it is I think both of those polls are wrong so traditionally. Republican foreign policy has been divided on a spectrum with with on one side interventionist and people like John McCain or Lindsey Graham or or maybe a Marco Rubio Tom Cotton falling into that camp and then on the other side what has been characterizes isolationist people like Rand Paul most notably typify that but going all the way to react to Robert Taft I mean this is a very long tradition sure I've always described my view as a third point on the triangle and I consider myself a non interventionist hawk. What does that mean that confounds the sort of easy stereotypes. Let me explain that with with some detail so that it has has more clarity. I think the sunshine central touchstone for all. US foreign policy and for any military action should be defending the vital title national security interests of the United States. I think we should be laser focused on that so let's put that in in applications so it's not abstract when it came to military action action against Syria that President Obama proposed I oppose that the reason I opposed initially kept it open mind. I said let me hear the commander-in-chief explain why this defends our national security keeps Americans safe. I listened to the arguments and they couldn't present any clear objective. That was making safer. I oppose that I likewise think it was a mistake stake when the Obama administration led a coalition of countries toppling Qaddafi in Libya when we did that coffee was a bad guy but into that void stabbed stabbed radical Islamic warlords who made it a much worse place. I think the Iraq war was a mistake for the same reason as bad as Saddam Hussein was. Did you come out against your at the time time I didn't. I wasn't engaged in foreign policy fights on the time. I was engaged on domestic policy. I mean I was twenty five and in the streets yes I mean I mean you're a grownup citizen. Yeah you're pundit. I was lawyer right so I was not we were doing I wasn't I was just a freelancer. I guess my point is that it's easier to say now. That Iraq was a mistake yeah but let's be clear and it wasn't the time. I've said Iraq was a mistake for a long time. In the twenty sixteen presidential elections. I said Iraq was a mistake over and over and over again. I believe believe if you look at what happened as horrific as Saddam Hussein was and I'm not naive to think he was a nice guy has a terrible guy but toppling. Saddam opened the door to Isis ACIS. My point is on all of those the policy positions I hold are in agreement with rand and some of the isolationist however however Iran I look at fundamentally differently and the reason is the Ayatollah Khamenei is a theocratic zealot who pledges death to America and long short. I believe him. I think that is a real religiously driven fervor. That is profoundly dangerous. That's why oppose the Iran deal so vociferiously. I think we should do whatever is necessary to stop. Iran from getting a nuclear weapon including military action if needed if necessary and it would be so bombing them if we got military intelligence if we got credible intelligence that they were at all close host to getting nuclear weapons and military force was the only way to stop it absolutely yes but look. I have no interest in invading Iran and trying to turn them into Switzerland and I would be perfectly happy to let it out. I mean it. You know it doesn't stop with the bomb so you say I don't want to invade them in tournament and Switzerland but if we have have to intervene militarily I actually have you looked at like how Israel defends itself. It often does stop with the bomb when you build a facility. Israel bombs the hell out of it and leaves like that has happened a few your time's s and part of my view when I say you cannot. The enemy gets a vote. You don't get to control the reaction of your intervention so but here here's a point where actually I think the assumptions are counter to what a lot of folks particularly in the media world understand. Reagan referred referred to it as peace through strength. I think weakness I think the dovish now of the left invites conflict. I think it increases the chance of military terry conflict and Reagan. It's worth remembering in eight years. The biggest country Reagan ever invaded was Grenada. So he rebuilt our military. He took on the Soviet Union. He won the Cold War but he was very reluctant. As am I to send our sons and daughters in harm's way and there was there's only one reason to do that and that is to protect the lives of Americans are allies but he also and we'll move on from this but he also did a one eighty on a nuclear deal. I mean he came in viewing Russia as essentially an implacable foe that can only be browbeat and I know what you're going to say well piece her strength and he got them to the bargaining table but he also changed his mind. I mean what happens with start and what happens with the bilateral deals that he strikes ultimately with Gorbachev sign a wreck is that he comes in with one position comes comes out being essentially a nuclear arms dealmaker undoubtedly it it's one of the great legacies but but yes I would agree with that as a liberal but peace this comes through strength so if you look at the Carter Administration when we dealt with the Soviets we dealt from a position of weakness Reagan number one revive survived the American economy cut taxes repeal job killing regulations the economy sword that economic strength and we're GONNA talk about a few minutes which I'm happy to do that. Economic Mix strength in turn helped fund rebuilding the military but then he also took on making the clear ideological case so so when Reagan said the Soviet a union an evil empire the intelligence he was horrified that this ignorant cowboy would say such a thing when he said marxism-leninism lend up on the ash heap of History Austria again. DC was horrified in my office if you come to my office in DC Jack gigantic painting of Reagan standing in front of the Brandenburg Gate saying what I think the most important words any leaders said modern times Mister Gorbachev tear down this wall that clear leadership from strength is what helped wait wait a second yeah. That's the exact opposite what is happening with North Korea right now right now the president real concerns about our policy in North Korea so I I I mean what what's happening is in some ways. It's every way every bit the opposite the president isn't just saying. I want to deal with them. which again I I would favor? He's he's actually saying. He's a great leader. I literally love him. He writes me these beautiful notes and I think and I think he is a a great leader for his country. It is a gulag state that every part of the American spectrum of political ideology agrees is one of the most ghastly slee mad scientists experiments in human subjugation that exists on the globe so Chris after this. I'M GONNA do my very best to write you a beautiful letter it. It has sticking power look. I believe the most powerful tool in politics and in diplomacy is the bully pulpit the presidency. I wish this president used differently when it comes to North Korea although I will say this look I think there has been strengthened dealing with North Korea compared to where the Obama Administration was and I will say if you go back go back to the North Korea deal that Bill Clinton led the North Korea deal deal at the time was we had sanctions in place against North Korea Kim Jong. Il Kim Jong UN's father was the dictator and we negotiated a deal the United States led we lifted the sanctions we let billions of dollars flow in in exchange for a promise not to build nuclear weapons also monitoring well okay also hammers we'd cameras in the factories and we had an inspector inspection regime agreed and it was an absolute failure Kim Jong. Il took the billions built nuclear weapons built. ICBM'S CBS has targeted the united push pull out of the deal in the first six months. It was an absolute failure. It didn't work and he'll never happened of course the deal. What what happened was out of the deal with what happened. Sanctions were relaxed and the money flowed in when you have someone billions ends of dollars look. There's a reason there's a reason nobody goes on your studies at the Neville Chamberlain School of foreign policy but I totally agree on billions of dollars to the dictators and tyrants is a profoundly foolish move. I think I think there's moments where it might not be foolish but putting that aside tater subtype tyrant. Should we fund there. I I think everything is a cost benefit analysis of the possibility of military engagement to cost a military engagement and the possibility of peace and I think that often the bias of Washington. DC and I think actually you would agree with this the bias of Washington DC is to undercount the cost of war. We have been we have spent it by some estimates and it's hard because it's a dynamic situation. There's both the Treasury and there's other related cascading costs four six trillion dollars us on permanent worse since two thousand one six trillion dollars. There are proposals coming from Democratic candidates for people say well. That's crazy. That's going to cost a trillion dollars. We spent six trillion dollars. We're spending money right now. In Afghanistan in the longest word in the history of this republic so my my baseline assumption about foreign policy is and I think in some ways you agree with this that the bias of Washington is action the bias of Washington intervention and the bias of Washington to discount the cost a military engagement. I I agree but I'll tell you part of the reason so if you look at the interventionist which have been the dominant stream of foreign policy in in Republican thought for some time now they have a view that we can go and Vindicate Democracy and caused these-these Gardens of Eden to spring up where dictatorships had rained. I think that's hopelessly naive now. I believe there's a powerful role for America to speak out for freedom to encourage democracy to use the bully pulpit completely leaguer Reagan in front of the Brandenburg Gate Right now. China's got a million people in concentration camps in western China absolutely and you know what's interesting about when Reagan said Mr Gorbachev the Trough Tear down this wall three times the State Department crossed that out of the speech three times Reagan wrote it back with his own hand and the State Department argued Mr President. You can't say this. It's unrealistic. It's too belligerent and most importantly it will never work. It will never happen. Reagan wrote it back and he said this is the whole point of the speech. Here's the powerful thing within three years of that speech that wall was torn to the ground and it wasn't torn to the ground by American tanks. We didn't bomb it with American. Missiles does it was American strength and clarity and sunshine and light but but that is again that is the opposite of what is happening now. The president goes around talking talking about how much he likes every dictator. I have said more than once. I wished the rhetoric from the president were different that being said Ed I think compared to the Obama Administration. We are much stronger dealing with our enemies than we should be. Our language isn't but our substantive actions are so I would like our language language to match our actions. That would make me happier so I let let's table that for a second because I I think fundamentally I disagree but I feel like I have a good sense of where you're coming from and let me make it very very just quick point on this also whether North Korea or China or Venezuela or the Saudis one of the things that I I think is important doing so. I'm happy to get to the Saudis. I think the Saudis is a more complicated question. I think there is an important value in highlighting dissidents and shining a light on people being persecuted so whether you talk about the week in concentration camps whether you talk about Tibetans bit being slaughtered. I mean I mean mean I repeatedly try to shine a light by name on dissidents being persecuted because there's a power to that and I think we ought to be doing doing more of that now. That doesn't mean that I'm prepared to send in the Marines Brat guess unless it is necessary to keeping Americans safe. I think that's the justification for military for. I think that division of Labor there is one that I broadly agree with that. It's really important for both civil society and for leader to speak out and apply pressure on things things like the concentration camps of the workers but it is very dangerous to think of military intervention as being the solution to that. I think that's generally a correct framework. I I WANNA if we can. I want to talk about some domestic policy issue okay so it's me again hi. I'm in the recording studio. You hear my voice is different than in that that in that auditorium warm we're here that discussion about domestic policies which of course includes client policy and impeachment. I think you can guess there are some disagreements between the two of us. We'll hear that right after this break hey. MSNBC MESS NBC listeners. It's me Chuck Rosenberg this week on the oath. I sit down with Kathy Remler. The lead Enron prosecutor who later served as White House counsel to President Barack Obama when you are the White House counsel. You are representing the office holder the office itself. You're you're not representing an individual person as White House counsel muscle to President Obama Cathy was instrumental in passing the affordable care act her work on the Enron Task Force led to the conviction of Enron CEO and chairman. It was one of the biggest white-collar our prosecutions in history thing I've always said about juries is that they may not necessarily understand exactly all of the nuance and complexity but they know who's getting the better of the other. Please join me for that. Conversation with former White House counsel Kathy Remler available now. Wherever you get your podcasts I thought it was really interesting. So there's climate strike happening and a lot of Fox folks you know ridiculing Greta Sumberg in the climate strikers and Dan Crenshaw who of course Texas Congressman sort of freshman freshman star and very much in a valid conservative. It was very interesting. He tweeted something basically saying look again. These these people wrong their ideas are woolly headed socialism ball Blah but we do need to reduce carbon emissions which I thought so I just want to start with the basics like do you accept that human activity is putting carbon the atmosphere the carbon is warming the earth and we need to reduce carbon emissions all right so you had three statements their statement number one is unequivocally correct state number two or three the data mixed and they're not and let me stubby start with just just aren't next guy's got seriously so this is what's known as a as sort of telling scientific discussion but actually look. Arab how that screaming says something. I am the son of two scientists. My parents parents are mathematicians and computer programmers. I believe in science I believe in data I believe in following science and data. I think what is dangerous about the climate movement movement is it has become an emotional primal scream rather than being driven by science and data. I'm perfectly happy and I think we should have conversation station but data let me let me say more about that but we ask you there. How much time have you spent with climate scientists. I've chaired multiple hearings hearing testimony being from multiple climate scientists across the spectrum. I've heard people who were both just not a spectrum though as a spectrum here let me say this. I'll tell you what I'll tell you. What Chris let me encourage you to watch so I chaired a hearing in the Commerce Committee. I I I used to chair the Science Space Subcommittee. I chaired a hearing on the data behind global warming. The number of witnesses on Kirk should read the testimony these these are respected professors academics and they had a range of us. I can tell you the climate alarmist if you go back go back to the sixties in the sixties. There were a series of predictions. The world is ending in ten years in the seventies. The world is ending in ten years in the eighties. World is ending and ten years in the nineties. The world is ending ten years. Their predictions fiction keep being proven wrong and dramatically wrong not even a little bit but that's first of all. Let's just talk about. Let's go to those three points of contention. We're putting carbon. The atmosphere agreed undoubtedly. That's that's a statement of fact carbon warms. The atmosphere is a statement of fact well that they're actually mixed data so if you look at the data so let's actually talk about what today's don't roll your eyes and say oh goodness don't have disputes. It'll be oh for example. Sir Not on the physical impact of carbon on the atmosphere really yes okay so let's actually talk about their their two sources of two principal sources of data on temperatures there number one. The ground level believes that are measuring temperatures. They're number two the satellites that are measuring temperatures the satellite the satellite data for eighteen years have shown zero statistically significant warming and here's the problem you think the earth is warming right right now. So did you notice a few years. Do you think the earth is not warming. The last two years what happened to to trs temperatures we've had nine of the ten hottest years on record in last year's the earth's average temperatures according to NASA dropped point five degrees in the last two years those facts now. There's a that's not art you. Oh you can speak and then also we don't need to know. I just my question is I'm just asking for the general trend so I mean I think we've come to the answer. You do not think the earth is warming. I think we should follow follow the data and so here's the testimony the Senate heard in terms of the clients of the computer models for climate show that the earth should be warming dramatically. Remember the hockey stick that it should be going up really fast the satellite data that have thermometers that are actually measuring the temperature. Don't show that there's a term for that. It's called the pause and the reason it's called the pause is because the satellite data don't match the computer projections and did you notice a few years ago. The terminology changed actually people. Don't let's say global warming anymore. Wait a second. They say climate change and that was driven because the data didn't match the projection so just to be clear. I just WanNa be clear on your stance you do you think the data does not show the earth warming and that we're not warming right now. I think the data are mixed. I think there have been years periods where there's been warming their years in periods where they'd been cooling and the data are mixed. Give me another example. You don't agree with let me finish the sentence. Al Gore in two thousand and eight said within five five years there will be no ice on the North Pole. Now the interesting thing is you can go and test that prediction that was twenty thirteen and it is totally laughably laughably entirely false. There have been wrong predictions but there have also been a million right predictions. I mean you have seen what's happening glacier national park you have seen what's happened across the corn belt so let me ask you a question. Polar ice caps today is there more polarized less polarized than there was ten years about the same actually slightly more and actually the phenomenon were saying it's decreasing psalm on the Antarctic. It's increased but the sum total of this and it's it's sort of a strange enj- dance. We're doing because again. I'm not a US senator you are. I'm just asking is the earth warming and what you're giving me. Back is an argument that it's not and then you're saying well. I believe in the data what you say is. You're saying the data shows. The world is not warming so so Chris what I'm saying. The data are mixed which by the way look the problem with this debate. Is your demanding a religious. No I'm not you are even the language of this debate a climate denier. That's the language of theology. That's a heretic. You're a denier. You know throughout science data so here's my second question and I've spent a lot of time a climate scientist so I would like a theory of why it is that ninety nine percent of climate scientists is your people that are working in the bowels of different universities people. I've met them. I've gone out to Nebraska. I've talked to them in Texas in Austin. There's actually some great clients as what is the theory for how they're all collectively getting it wrong and by the way that stat which the stat that gets recited recited almost like a mantra. It's not ninety nine ninety. Seven percent is based on one one ridiculous and bogus study. You guys can laugh where they emailed. A bunch of people describe scribe. Most of them didn't respond. They came out with that stat and it gets responded as don't discuss yours facts or evidence but hold on let me let me stop for a second. What's the theory here is let me let me stop for a second. The theory is we should respond to data and evidence and actual facts but let's talk about the environment more broadly. I believe Steve. We have a responsibility to clean up the environment. I want clean air. I want clean water. My children breath and drink water. I'd like my grandchildren to be able to debris uh-huh drink clean water. I think we ought to talk about part of the zealotry of this issue. Is it shifts away so just this past week. I'm on the Senate. Foreign Relations Committee Betty we passed a bill of which I'm a cosponsor called the save our species legislation if you look at plastic waste in our seas ninety percent scent of the waste the plastic waste our oceans comes from ten rivers eight of which are in Asia two of which are in Africa if you WANNA reduce plastics in our ocean. They're killing turtles that are killing fish. That's unambiguously good relief reducing that pollution save our seas legislation that we just passed out of committee. I hope we get signed into law soon. Has the government has the United States leaning in working with those governments to clean up that pollution to reduce it. Let me say something else. Economic Prosperity state of Texas carbon monoxide in the state of Texas since two thousand carbon monoxide emissions have dropped seventy five percent in the state of Texas. That's great in Texas has a tremendous record and here's where I've got to wait a second. Wait a second a second. Go ahead I just I I get all this and that's great I just I just want to just mark this because I think I thought I would come into this particular because I saw it Dan Crenshaw. I've season more conservative saying this like I thought you I thought were you. GonNa say is yes. All of that's true but modeling is incredibly unreliable. We don't know what the future holds. We should be extremely circumspect. Prudential Chill about actions we take that may affect the prosperity of our government et. CETERA right but what I'm hearing from you and I think I guess I wonder how curious hold it's like you just aren't sold on the basic connection the basic platform belief of the IPC and basically every major democratic party already in the entire OECD end scientific community. You are not sold on that basic story about what is happening between carbon warming and what we need to do politically a large percentage of the political leaders who are advocating this are also advocating massive zip government control of the economy and socialism. I think much of what's going on politically is that you have politicians who are socialist whether they admit it or not and climbing climbing is a good excuse to say you've got to have socialism morale's all of humanity's going to die so it it it it has a way to frame it as I'm saving the world taught and anyone who disagrees once once every person on earth to live when you put it in those bold moral terms by the way we should always be a little scared et politicians who hold themselves out as the savior of the world that has not worked out well historically but I think what you're saying there which I think is actually a crucial insight here because I I do think that a lot of conservatives are kind of reasoning in that exactly that way which is I don't like socialism. I don't like state control. I don't like large regulatory state. I don't want there to be cracked down on oil companies and bans on fracking and things like that Arrigo in this sort of like retroactive reasoning way they gotta be wrong about what the thing they're saying is the problem but like we could just have like a carbon fee and dividend. There's a bunch of things that like conservatives could say and there are some conservatives who support once wants. You say look the basic story. Here is just unavoidable so KRESA. Let me ask you something. Do you know what person in modern times has had the single greatest impact reducing carbon emissions of any human being alive. I don't there's a cleared objective answer to that right and the answer to that is a fellow named George Mitchell. George Mitchell is a Texas oil man. I thought against Ronald Reagan now although that's always a good yes for me. Reagan is it's pretty much the answer to everything so I walked across the water. He must taking the carbon out of the I. I take that down this carbon I'd I. I have a giant bust of Reagan in my office. I readily you look at George. Mitchell George Mitchell was the son of Greek goat herders he came to Texas came to Galveston founded the woodland's and George Mitchell pioneered fracking no fracking has become demonized but but fracking unlocked massive shale deposits of both natural gas and oil totally transformed the geopolitical world and in particular held off in an incredible double shift from coal power production the natural gas power production there is nothing no socialist regulator no Paris deal nothing. Nothing has had anywhere close to a big impact on carbon emissions as has a Texas oilman innovating fracking and moving away from cold natural gas. I think that's how we should the the environment through innovation that also produce jobs so I will say the last point on this and I think we can move to other stuff is that I actually actually agree so I actually think that my job here is done for producing the framework for innovation that innovates us away from fossil fuel is absolutely lead the most vital thing we can do. They're already amazing explosion and wind and solar there could be all kinds of things that we don't even realize at this point that are carbon-free fossil free the forms of energy and that it's extremely exciting to imagine a world in which we create the conditions for that innovation happen create lots of new jobs boost the American economy me distribute power which we don't have right now. We have an incredibly concentrated power system by the way distributing power scares the hell out of me to be honest. Maui Stalin talked about distributing power distributing power is inevitably in Houston. I mean the electrons no no. I just mean like I I. I physically mean I got actual powers that we're talking about different things thoroughly amusing so let me. I thought you were saying power to the people and I'm like well. I believe in that too but in this case I I just mean literally though I do too. I just don't want government to take the power and then claim it's going to give it back. I just WANNA leave it with the people let let me just very briefly before relieved this topic on a little a bit of substance and specifics several weeks ago you know. CNN did I dunno seven hundred hours of climate debate with with all four hundred Democratic candidates candidates. It was nine okay I only watched snippets of it. Afterwards I saw one snippet where Elizabeth Warren was asked and she was asked about energy and she said she was asked look. Nuclear power doesn't have carbon emissions if you care about carbon emissions. Shouldn't you be for nuclear power in this idea a and her answer she said I hear what you're saying but no if I'm elected president there will be zero nuclear plants okay and I actually engaged in this a little a bit because it's if you actually are trying to have a serious public policy position her position as I understand it. She said categorically no nukes she he also believed no coal she also is. He doesn't have to do anything thanks to George Mitchell. There's very little she has to do to kill off all they're still substantial coal. Though the it is it is dramatically but by by natural gas but she also has has talked about banning fracking so I guess electric is is okay although electricity comes principally from natural gas and coal if you have no fracking and no Cole I dunno where the electricity comes from and so my question is where do you like planes run on jet fuel. If you have no gasoline and no jet fuel I mean you're literally planes are flying on Pixie dust and and we put windmills on our cars that I mean that's not that's not anything resembling a serious energy policy and by the way Texas leads the nation and win production. I'm all for alternatives ABS. You can't run an airplane right on wind. It doesn't work that way. You go gliding hot air balloon but it'll take you I mean you can't right now but this is more computing getting power that fitting entire building thirty years ago so God bless American innovation. Let's hope we get to the point where planes don't eat fossil fuel good okay so here's here's some common ground or maybe we could end up that. I absolutely believe there will come a time and it may be relatively soon where we move away from fossil fuel. I don't know if it's ten years or fifty years or hundred ears. I don't know what I do know is is that I don't think it's going to be a Washington bureaucrats. Figure it out. I think they're almost certain to get it wrong and I think it it will come from private sector innovation. Nobody saw fracking coming until George Mitchell just began experimenting with a Technological Marvel that that transformed formed the energy picture. I'll make a prediction when we moved to whatever alternative energy source becomes the next one and much of humanity's progress has been from one energy source to another whether steam whether burning wood whether Cole I mean we've been stuck on fossil fuels for about one hundred eighty years well although I will say actually moving adding so even moving into coal moving to coal actually saved millions of lives and cleaned up the total because before that people had woodstoves and the the the pollution they were breathing in was much worse so we have been steadily improving now moving from coal natural gas is an improvement. Here's my prediction whatever the next energy sources that becomes the dominant one. I think it's actually going to be Texas. Entrepreneurs driving it because what I think Texas is good at is being energy entrepreneurs and I wanted a business environment environment and economic environment where those small businesses are innovating and creating those new opportunity yeah and I think I would agree with that and I think that the subsidies we give to oil companies or stand the way that I think that that and I and we give a lot so I'm curious. Look against subsidies and I've advocated. We should have no subsidies and energy the across the board. We shouldn't pick winners and losers. I will say though it is a common talking point about all the subsidies we give oil and gas. Let let me ask you what stuff on the tax depreciation appreciation and capital sides that they take special advantage of it is capital intensive but if you look at the analysis of where the breakdown of those cuts go they go primarily primarily an overwhelmingly to fossil fuel extractions so so I will point out the rhetoric that goes into this because I'm all for ending subsidies but the rhetoric that goes behind this the the depletion allowance is in any other business. If you invest in a factory you're allowed to take depreciation on that factory. That's how business accounting works and the rhetoric catterick of this as they say you know what the same accounting every other business does when when an oil and gas operator does it it's suddenly a subsidy am not allowing them to take business deductions Chins. Everyone takes which is another words measuring real prophets that that's not a subsidy. I disagree because I think extraction is fundamentally different than what a factory does but let's just leave that aside. Let me let me ask you that. I will agree on ending subsidies now would you would you end all energy subsidies. The government should put the thumb on the scale because I I'd end them all but ah we're halfway there. Well I mean partly because we don't agree on what the underlying problem is right. I mean that's I mean. I think that the science is extremely clear on climate and I think that all right because of that there's a prudential need to act very quickly and I think the prudential lead act very quickly shows that there's a few things one government could do basic research. We've seen a decline in basic research research year-over-year right. It's not good we can also do a lot of things to create the conditions to price externalities like the price of carbon pollution. We can do do things to promote the production of televisual property and in energy innovation put people to work export that to the rest of the world like there's a lot of good stuff to do as we move from fossil fuel extraction to the next energy economy so let me ask a simple. Yes no question. Do you think if a Democrat is elected in twenty twenty twenty that he or she should implement policies to ban fracking in the United States. I'm not sure they can actually assumed they can I eat. You're right they. I don't I think they can so I don't either but I also think the odds are high that a number of the Democrats were running with try anyway. I it'd be tied up in litigation so for for a second it I mean I. I don't have a policy of it but I would say. Would you support the policy of banning for I think not immediate but I think you would have to do some sort of plottings writings cowman. You'd have to put it on some sort of three to five years six years seventy or something like that so look. I have to say I think in a I'm I'm glad for that clarity. I hope all the twenty twenty Democratic candidates additives have that degree of clarity snore day. One and Sanders says he wouldn't do what they want and doing it day one the projections are would cost fourteen eighteen million jobs nationally in the state of Texas would cost one and a half million jobs. I think it is hard to find something that would be more economically devastating then doing that and I think that's an example of how look the democratic again. Wait a second wait a second. I just don't WanNa. Keep going around in circles on this but what what that does is. It's only looking at one part of the ledger because if you don't think there's any cost the world warming at the rate. It's warming all you look out as you say well. The one million jobs are gone but if temperatures temperatures are going through the roof if El Paso has more hundred degree days than it ever has in history as it did this summer. If heat borne illness starts creeping up north if if droughts and flooding and natural storms creep billions of dollars of both human loss and economic loss then you have to look at the totality of it if you hand wave away one side of it and say that isn't happening. It isn't getting warming. All you farmers out there that are changing crops. You're crazy. You don't know what you're talking about. The data is modeled then you have gotten rid of one side of the ledger when you evaluate the efficacy of whatever policy you're doing so we got lots of people sharing here in Austin but you know I'm reminded of actually something that that Reagan said the nineteen eighty campaign and I did that on purpose which is he said recession is when your neighbor loses his job depression is when you lose your. That's very easy for you to say that. Are you willing to lose your job. In twenty twenty. One is the result of it look it's easy and Travis County for people who are wealthy and college educated and doing well Oh. I don't want anyone to lose their job. Let's let's take away one and a half million jobs in Texas. I encourage you come down to south Texas and meet meet households meet meet meet Hispanic Panik men in single moms who are providing for their families whose incomes are out sir. Please don't just scream that. This is meant to be a discussion. I think it is foolish and wrong for democratic. Nick presidential candidates to cavalierly be prepared to tell fourteen million people who are predominantly middle income or low income. You guys are all out of I. I think that's wrong. I think we ought to be fighting for. Let me let me respond to as one is there's a bunch of minors down Harlan County right now who haven't been paid their my line shutdown. They've been standing thwart the railroad into that mind for several weeks. There's miners out in. Ym Meiomi would just lost their job. As far as I can tell no one mm-hmm is doing anything for them. We did a story. We sent a reporter out to that mine in Wyoming. I want those people to be taken care of. I want them to have jobs. I want them to have healthcare. I want them to have pensions nations and in fact I think the Democrat candidate and I think we agree that people shouldn't just be tossed on the Ashen. I want to turn to the news of the week because we haven't talked about it. I understand a few things I think of the psychology of folks who are viewing. What's happening this week and I've heard you talk about it. which which is the? Democrats have wanted him gone from day. One essentially all this pretextual their roving around they've come to the conclusion and they're looking for the facts backfill. They are succumbing to pressure from their far left etc.. Get all that but I just want to focus on the transcript and the call I was going back and watching folks on the Democratic side react to Bill Clinton back in ninety eight and basically everyone was like yeah dude. That's not cool like it's just not cool. Now you can say it's not impeachable but it's not okay like you shouldn't. How do you feel that way about the exchange with Celeski that it's not okay like I'm not telling you. I'm not saying you support impeachment. He should be run off. I'm just saying evaluated on its terms of the president of the the United States. He brings up the military aid. He says I want you to do me a favor though when he makes to asks. I think that's inappropriate. I think a lot of people think it's an appropriate and has been weird to me to Nazi. More Republicans say he shouldn't have done that. So let's break down. I've read the entire transcript to I've also read what's being referred to as the whistleblower complaint and I've read in both cover to cover as you noted there to ask the transcript the script you know I have to say first of all what was said about the transcript when I picked it up to read it. I expected it to be much worse than it was because for days all of the discussion on TV we had been that it was alleged to be an illegal quid pro quo so when I picked up the transcript look. I didn't know what I would see as you noted there were to ask the I ask was was was the president ask Ukraine to assist in investigating interference into the two thousand sixteen presidential election. I think that ask is unequivocally proper and it cannot be the case that it is inappropriate as a law enforcement matter for the Federal Government to investigate foreign interference Chris in our elections given that we've been doing this one and a half year okay. Let's take let's stop right there. He says crowd strike the server. I think a rich Ukrainian has it. Can you look into that. Do you understand what he saying there. I had no idea okay. Wait what I want to be clear about it because the president of states crowd strike is the firm the DNC the higher to do their forensics after the breach there is a conspiracy theory that is completely completely unsupported by the evidence that crowd strike colluded with Ukrainian Ukrainian interests and the DNC to frame Russia for the hack and that it wasn't Russia when he says crowd strike. I think they had the server a rich Ukrainian what the president the United States is saying Russia didn't do the hack. Please look into the con job that was done by this firm to make it look like Russia. Did it get now now. Of course that's not what he said. You're you're doing a little bit like Adam Schiff and sort of put on that. He didn't actually say oh. He's at crowd strike. Look here's crowd strike and enriched Ukrainian house. I know what happened or not. My point is that asking for an investigation into foreign interference into our elections is a perfectly appropriate law enforcement collection and you believe that because for two years on MSNBC that the only topic of discussion has been Russia Russia Russia in interfering in our or elections wait a second. It's perfectly appropriate if there was other interference to say investigate to that's not an illegitimate purpose totally crew but there has to be a product for investigations allegations as you would agree. You're a lawyer. We don't just do investigation based on nothing. I won't say I'm investigating Ted Cruz today or investing rampal investigating Adam Schiff. There's a factual predicate look it in the case of Russia. The factual predicate was and I think you agree with this. Russia hacked into the DNC servers and they hacked to death as emails and Russia attempted to interfere in our election action. We agree with on absolutely absolutely I know of Ladder Putin. No I just WANNA. Make sure that we're we're in agreement on that. In that case the factual predicate is that we Russia did like we saw the email someone hacked the DNC but in that case factual predicate for an investigation the fact that Russia did it doesn't mean nobody else was attempting to interfere in our election. In fact we have had a long history of other countries. I'm interfering are less to be investigations have to be based on factual products in the case of Russia. The factual predicate is that Russia hacked act the servers in the case of this crowd strike Ukraine stuff. There's no factual credit because it's a queasy fury look. I don't know what the factual predicate is or not. I don't thank you I I think it is a legitimate law enforcement purpose to investigate whether there was foreign interference now the second part is the Biden part and I will readily acknowledge. The Biden part is more troubling it is not on the face of the transcript a quid pro quo and it's certainly not illegal quid pro quo but look in in in the legal world their principles of conflict of interest and there's also a question of an appearance of impropriety. I would have wished the president had not gone down that road because at the very minimum there's an appearance that that that that I would rather he not not have opened the door to I got to tell you Donald. Trump says things frequently that I wish he wouldn't say I don't. I don't have control over that the fact that he shouldn't have gone down that road is a long way hey from saying therefore he should be impeached and forcibly removed from office. After the American people voted presidential election that is a big threshold and there are a lot of Democrats who I think and this is where you started. They're not focused on the fact they want him. Impeach and whatever the facts are fine whether that's the case as or not and I think that might be true in some cases in some cases are folks like Al Green who would readily agree because he's been calling for impeachment from the first week right so that's like a matter of fact yeah right. maxine waters waters as well but just tomb in here right like it's not what you say. There's a presence has a lot of things. I don't like. This is a little different than like a tweet or are sick. It's it's a head of state. He represents the American people in that phone. Call all of us. It's a public trust. He's talking to a head of state. He's not tweeting. He's not saying little Adam Schiff. Whatever dumb thing he tweets he's making an ask as the head of state and it's an ask. He says you should do this thing. That is an official act. I just WANNA be clear. That's not him saying he is acting when he gets on a call the head of state in the same way that Barack Obama got on the the call with Ronnie and said I'd like you to do us disfavor. You would recognize immediately that that's an act so look government leaders have conversations with other government leaders and they say all sorts of things I will say I'm very glad that the president and the administration released the transcript. I think it was the right thing to do and I think it's a dangerous precedent when when you have heads of state speaking to each other if they fear that it'll be released publicly you do want them to be able to speak with a degree of candor but I think it's good that the transcript was released because the the the sort of fever conspiracy theories about what in fact said we now have the actual transcript of what he said but but point out also you know you know look part part of the the allegations concern Vice President Biden look I think it would also make sense for the administration released transcripts of any conversations -tations Biden had with Ukraine the same standard released Biden's transcripts and trump's transcript and and we can see if I if there was anything illegitimate or not see see those conversations as well so two things about that one is on the trump part of this because he's he's the president right now. Don't you think I've seen a lot of people say this is hearsay. The whistleblower complaint ain't in the same light of the transparency the whistleblower complaint and don't you think we should just hear from the principals the people directly Kurt Volker Masha Ivanovich who is the embassador recalled from Ukraine about what they know. We should just hear from them and do fact finding to figure out what exactly happened here. Look I think there there should be an investigation and and this week I've voted in every member of the Senate voted unanimously to refer this matter to the Senate Intelligence Committee to investigate the Senate Intelligence Committee is Republican and Democrat both sides nell investigate an I assume they'll talk to those they will talk to the relevant. PEOP- people yes I agree. It should be the investigating but I'll point out there are a lot of Democrats who are saying impeach him now before anything's investigated before they know any facts their starting point is impeach him so so. I can promise you once. An investigation happens there. endpoint is still going to be impeaching. They've they've made up their mind. Here's A. and they're telling us by the way you're right talk about that. They are doing fact finding but let me just end here because we're sort of running up against time but I'm GonNa tell you what they're thinking is about the facts success. We know them and then we could you could respond so we know it's not disputed. The president personally ordered four hundred million dollars in military aid to Ukraine to be paused ause or stopped in fact this was troubling to you and your colleagues including Lindsey Graham who at one point threatened to join Dick Durbin and withholding five billion dollars in Pentagon unless the money was released Mitch McConnell ask questions about where he'd gone because you guys in both houses wanted them to have this aid because Russia's occupying their country so we know the president ordered the aid stopped one week before the phone call established we know that he got on the phone with Celeski and he said like you to do me a favor and he made those two asks as as you said one of them is investigate my rival and his son we know that he told him to work with his personal attorney Guiliani and the Department of Justice Attorney General the chief law enforcement of the country on that investigation. We know that the president's personal attorney Rudy Giuliani has both publicly and privately said he wants to and I'm quoting I'm here metal in the investigation in Ukraine and has met with up to five prosecutors sometimes coordinated through the State Department with the express intent as he says all the time all day on Fox News with getting them to reopen investigation into Vice President Biden and his son there are people that think that is itself self and impeachable abuse of power and I have not mentioned anything that is factually disputed well. Let's go through that a little bit because that there are several pieces of it first of all in terms of delaying or withholding Ukrainian aid listen. The president has been skeptical of all sorts of foreign aid so he's been holding back four ornate from a lot of countries. He's much more skeptical than Congress and when it comes to Ukraine aid by the way I was vigorously skeptical of President Obama who was unwilling to provide lethal offensive offensive weapons for Ukraine to defend itself against Russia and high advocated for Obama to do it. I advocated for trump to do it and in fact again going on substance to Ukraine and Russia Russia just a few weeks ago the Senate Foreign Relations Committee passed my legislation to sanction the company's building Nordstrom to the pipeline line from Russia to Germany natural gas pipeline that skips Ukraine That's that bill that I introduced passed Foreign Relations Committee by a vote of twenty two to a to an overwhelming bipartisan legislation that will hurt Russia and help Europe on the rest of it. Listen to stop there so you believe leave that your interpretation of his sudden halt on this money which everyone agreed on this is not a controversial thing was was because of a skepticism about all all foreign aid or Ukraine so here's where you said it's an established fact that I think you said established fact that precisely one week before before he personally ordered it. I don't know that that's established abolition. Look all sorts of things that that's actually what an investigation we aggregate and so on established. We should establish it. It's it's I have. I've heard that alleged on twitter. That's that's different from being an established fact Rudy Giuliani with regards to what Rudy said to anyone. I have no idea area and you're going to have to ask Rudy that I. That's a safe position to take with respect originally on. I'm just saying that one. You'RE GONNA have half but he is but he is acting on the president's presents behalf and it is a little weird not great to have him running around doing that and listen. Rudy says he was coordinating with the State Department. I don't know what the facts are. I think that's perfectly legitimate intimate to investigate figure out what the facts are in terms of the Department of Justice so you said he asked that it talked to the Department of Justice on all of this. I don't think it's clear from the transcript it is on all of this and I will say he says bar though he says talk to bar heed says talked to bar so I will say having been in many conversations with Donald Trump. You'll be sitting there and the topics can vary very quickly and you'll be sitting there and he'll say hey talk to so and so on and it's not like he's got a list of here. The four people are executing as he thinks of something else out top to so and so and so I know the Department of Justice has put out a statement that bar said he's never had a conversation with trump trump about Ukraine. He's never had any conversation with Ukraine and so they've been unequivocal. They did so far as Ukraine. They were not involved. I find that entirely plausible that having been in enough of conversations with the president he'll mention particularly. He's talking about election interference. He knows the Department of Justice has an investigation into that. I think it's a fairly natural thing to say talk to bar because DOJ leading that investigation you can build up all sorts of inferences and I think we should look and see what the facts are but I also think what's driving. The fury in the House is not the specific facts of this allegation it was it was something else a month ago. It'll be something different in another month and it is it is that they cannot stand donald trump and they want him removed then and I get that that they're they don't want people applauding that sentiment or the description but but look elections I believe in the Democratic Democrat process and I I think I do not think we should be subverting the result of a democratic election. If you don't like Donald Trump go out and campaign to win in twenty twenty. I mean the thing I would say about that is the House couldn't impeach Donald Trump if they didn't win the twenty eighteen election store th they they have the power in fact when you when you came in in two thousand thirteen right I mean the big shutdown that happened right. When you first came in was the combination of the House having the power it had because elections don't stop after two thousand eight. There is a public house very clear so I was elected in two thousand thirteen. I served four years when Barack Obama in two thousand twelve and twenty thirteen. I served four years with Barack Obama's president. I disagreed on with President Obama on a lot of issues. I didn't call for his impeachment. I didn't think he should be impeached. Just because I disagreed with him I agree the remedy unwanted is implementing bad policies and I think the policies under Obama did enormous harm. The remedy is to go and win collection which in two thousand sixteen the Republicans didn't win an election. That's how our democratic process work. I will say yeah. Let me just make a final point just not to lose sight up because I know you're we're. We're running out of time if you set aside all of the crazy circus because I'll say there's a disconnect in Washington every question this week is Ukraine Russia Ukraine Ukraine Ukraine. I ten minutes congratulate you for not not starting there that was. I'm glad we talk substance. I can tell you outside of Washington. What I hear from people in Texas they care about. Is They care about jobs. They care about their family. They care about their kids. Health Care Week. They care about healthcare. Absolutely healthcare premiums under obamacare have skyrocketed did and people can't afford health insurance under obamacare by the way hissing doesn't solve the fact that the average family's premiums have risen over five thousand dollars a year but here are some facts. We have today the lowest unemployment in fifty years. We've got the lowest African American unemployment that has ever been recorded award in the history of our country. We have the lowest Hispanic unemployment that has ever been recorded. We have six million people who've come off food stamps. We have the lowest African American Eric Poverty ever record in the history of the country of the lowest Hispanic poverty ever recorded in the history of the country and so at least some of the discussion even if politically quickly. You're angry and worked up. I think some of the discussion ought to be looked. People's lives are being benefited by having good jobs by the way incomes arising in the number one state in the country for income increases at the state of Texas. People's lives are being made better by economic prosperity and that's that is my number one priority. Let me say this. Economic growth is great. We've started to see a little bit of movement on the wages although they're still that's still a lagging indicator. I think because of the structural power that Labour has but I don't disagree that I think tight labor markets and economic growth are great. I think they do great things. They bring people off the sidelines. I would like to see that continue. I happen to think that if you you look at the trend line from Barack Obama in terms of job growth it goes straight there were more jobs created under Barack Obama's first three years and there have been in the same amount of time. It's just just facts but that said I would like to see the economy. Go along at this pace for as long as possible. I hope we don't have a recession. I hope the Fed is accommodating the dating and policy which is something that Donald Trump and I agree about and it was great to talk to you Senator Ted Cruz. Thank you very much. Thank you Chris. I enjoyed it. Thank you everybody thanks to Senator Ted Cruz and his staffer for agreeing to do this conversation credit to them for agreeing to do it and you know who's an hour just me on stage. There's no nothing out of bounds No you know a real conversation. Not all politicians are willing to do that. In fact it's a great frustration. Minded more aren't so thank you senator and to staff for for facilitating that like I said this was with pod live with pod number one of this fall aw the next one's GonNa be coming up October twenty first in Los Angeles you can still get tickets but tiffany our checking today and the best available seats keep marching back in the auditorium. Torian which suggests that they're they're going quickly and pretty soon you won't be able to get tickets and I would love for the people to be there to people that are with pod listeners and fans and we love hearing from you guys when you email us at with pod at gmail.com or tweet us with a Hashtag with pod. We love the kind of conversation that we've established with you guys. I'd love to kind of meet some of you at this event so I hope that we can come out in Los Angeles and we can all be a part of this together. Why is this happening is presented by MSNBC ABC News News produced by the all in team and features music by Eddie Cooper. You can see more of our work including links to things we mentioned here by going. ABC News Dot com slash wisest happening what happened when a true crime show becomes part of the story. Hold onto your seats. The thing about pam is the chart topping podcast series from dateline and Keith Morris and this is a strange story a strange story and the career of strange stories things became personal. All episodes are available. Now wherever you get your podcasts join us for the ride on the thing about path.

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Bob Lonsberry Show Hr 2 Tuesday 7-14-20

Bob Lonsberry

35:02 min | Last month

Bob Lonsberry Show Hr 2 Tuesday 7-14-20

"Really Sunny Sixty nine I'm todd Halliday Newsradio Wamel of eighty next news at nine thirty breaking news when it happens anytime another hour with Bob. Lawns Bury starts now on newsradio WAM eliminating you, sir, I appreciate that Good Morning Americans in hello, my friend real quick on that a word that Jackie Ortiz of city council would like to be the Democrat Elections Commissioner. There's a whole big fight going on governor check that Mayor Warren. Like crazy wants Leshan Busse to be that position is. She wants that patronage job for her close friend. Does the mayor in and she wants that a close friend to be able to dispense other patronage to other close friends, and there has been a big fight going on if Jackie Ortiz has been developed by folks in the Democratic Party as a candidate who can win or as an alternative candidate or something like that. I think that's tremendous. Jackie Ortiz a person of very significant intelligence, integrity capability. She's honest as the day is long. She's kind to everybody. works hard in support of everybody and she would be. A return to what the board of elections has always been just hardworking decent people, helping everybody, and not some deep political game and I'm not trying to put down the Leshan Booze, or the current re of Republicans in there, but it. Jackie Ortiz is a natural leader and a good person in be an outstanding. Situation for her and I think she'd be a great. a great blessing to the community in that position. It last night. TV, you turn on their bunch of coaches, standing look like the field at East Tie Jabber John About they didn't get paid this that or the other to give it a little bit of insight into that. One of those coaches joins us now. Mister Kyle crandall morning. Sir, welcome to the broadcast. A Good Morning Bob. Thanks so much for having me you bet you what's the problem? So you know about really our issue. Yesterday is not is not about what we were not paid. is the district is indicated that the collective bargaining unit issue the the heart of the issue. Here is not collective bargaining. It's a policy decision that the Rochester City School district made on May twentieth when they decided that coaches and the work that we do with athletes is only considered to be in season work because the Rochester City School district in in well. It did kind of have an effect on our pay We were the only district in all of Monroe. County coaches got paid six seventy first of their salary. For Spring Sports which ultimately met. That's Our salaries are only considered in season as opposed to year round expectations, and we've always viewed our our work to be year round with athletes, and our coaches work so hard to give our athletes comparable experiences to their suburban peers by doing things year, round, but unfortunately someone at central office made a decision policy decision that we were not year round, salaried employees, but only seasonal for our coaching responsibilities which then. had a had a union attorney jealous. Bits we no longer going off season workouts with our with our student athletes. Because if something were to happen to them, they were to get injured We would likely not be covered by the district's insurance policy so. This is affected our work with our student athletes. That's why. What you just call Jib jabbering. That's like we chose to speak out yesterday. Because this in section, five have rules like the there's a season come a false. Season's coming up that didn't they have rules like practice for fall? Season can begin on a certain date. Right. Yeah after Iraq's about that was considered your in season time so you have you have fall coaches? You have winter coaches, and you have spring coaches in your actual season begins on a certain date. Back thing and it ends whenever you're season Shuki Luke fractious before that date. Is that allowed by section five? absolutely the only differences. You're not allowed to do it. as a as a as a formal team you have to. You have to have an open to any kid in your school. That would like to participate you know so for example is A. Is a basketball coach and as a as a baseball coach in the district I will hold workouts in out on the baseball fields in September on Saturdays any kid who's interested in coming doing a baseball workout can show up to the field and and and we provide extra opportunities in workouts same thing. If a youngster gets injured at one of those practices that you have in September for a spring sport is. Is he covered by the the district's insurance? We were always under the impression. Yes, because our executive director of athletics his asked coaches before all of our. Meetings we meet with our executive director of athletics for the District Carlos Coto before every single sports season. He always shares that the expectation is for coaches to be doing work with their athletes in the off season, not just in the in season, so we've always done that because we think it's what's best for kids and we were always under the impression that yes, the district would cover if something happened to an athlete, but now the district just Aronie Asli made this change in policy. That now makes it indicate that that now, Bob. Perhaps we would not be covered, and that's why coaches have been yeah. I don't I. Don't think that they would be covered I think. The Guy told you that you were might have been in error. because. That's not a sanctioned practice. Right it's not a truly school activity. If! You're outside the season the sport. So I can tell you. That's coaches. In suburban schools, coaches and private schools and coaches in city schools rural schools that like I'm sure all coaches try to take opportunities to be able to give kids. A whole row row well rounded experience both. There's you know I. You know I I don't know if. It, I'm sure that the practice varies from district to district and I'm not expert on for example where I live, but I I have had kids playing sports there for three straight years his it comes down to it and we we practice in season, and that's it the the school. They the the lift you can go in in the morning. Lift weights before school and after school. If you're out of season, there's a gym teacher there, but we don't have at Mount. Morris, we don't have practices out of season. Well again, we consider these to be more workouts. know workouts. camps you know leagues I mean the the Roster City School. District has today a summer league where they have. allowed schools as well as suburban schools to come over to East High School in in play basketball in the summer in the summer league again our coaches would gather up our players and bring them into. Allow them to participate in that Summer Leagues. Because again, we were considered to be full year salaried employees. I'd be curious policy. How things yeah, when when you when you're hired as a coach does happy presented to the board and they vote on it. That's how it is in suburban and rural districts in suburban rural districts. My wife was on the school board you the in in in suburban rural districts, at least the ones that I familiar with you are a coach, and there is a begin and end date him saying, it's not me. It's not a year round thing. Sure so so they, basically we sign what's called a continuation form as coaches, which are allows you to continue as a coach in that sport for the upcoming year it will, then of course goes to the board of Education. The Board of Education does vote in approve on the coaches for each season. but athletic directors are are. Rick are required to with their coaches? Sign a continuation form, which is good for for one year. Very good well, so, where does this stand? So we're yeah. I I know that the district response. You know, unfortunately they. They've pin this. As a collective bargaining issue, it's not a collective bargaining issue. you know this is? This is a policy issue and initiatives affecting our kids. Because what you have now is, we have a pandemic going on right, so you've got coaches all across. The state and the country and the world I would assume that you know would like to do things with their with their athletes independent is is getting in the way however in the city, not only do. We have to clear the hurdle of being able to be safe to return to. Work outs and stuff with our athletes. We don't have to clear this hurdle of whether or not a legally. We can even continue to do that and you know Bob I just I want to say that our coaches. you know we we've you coaching as much more than just going out on the court and in the field and trying to win games I. mean everybody's that way. Everybody's and I I I. Think we all understand that COC crandall. Thanks so much I appreciate that It got to take a run. I apologize late for the break and I'm sure you know it. You know I? Know it's a big deal. Those folks in such, but the bottom line is that they were spring a coaches. There was no spring season There were no practices or no games, and I also think that. It's been a long time since I've covered high school sports but when I did I was knowledgeable about them, and you know I, think I understand what my children do at school, but there's a beginning and end of the season. I know that in our district. In any rate, coaches are hired for a season and they of course probably be rehired next year, but the. The season begins and ends, and I think that section five, the organizing body a has beginning in dates, four seasons, specifically beginning dates and again it's been a while, but I didn't know you could do practices before start date. He would seem to give one team an unfair advantage, so the year round thing and all that I think basically the city of Rochester School district is going broke. There were no springs sports to insist upon being paid your complete amount of money for a season. That didn't happen is probably not going to. Get a lot of sympathy from a lot of people we appreciate coaches, and all they do, but you know plagues and stuff like that have have consequences and taking a hit in the paycheck is probably one of them back in a moment with you on newsradio GAM eleven eighty. Back my friend. Welcome back, Roseland. Waterpark Announced yesterday that it will not open this year at all course, Friday. Thursday night, you and I watched brother Al Heart. Tell us what was going on in the world and His people said row sparked going to be tomorrow. Roseland. I'm sorry. Because Roseland thought it was going to be tomorrow. it had permits and. a little bit of clarification. When we spoke to the gentleman on Friday from Roseland. he thought that they had gotten approval of the Ontario County Health Department actually what they did was they had approval from Bob Duffy's group and they had approval from the Geneva Office of the State Department of Health, right they, they did not work with the county department of Health on this, but they had the a thumbs up and a permit from the State Department of Health Office in Geneva, so they thought they were cleaning green, and with good cause through the day Friday after the appearance here. there a and word came that they had been shut down by the state that they couldn't open on Friday. There was a possibility that they might be able to open on Saturday. It looked like maybe something can work out. Whatever the deal was! We heard yesterday that They're not going to open They've given up this season so employees who thought they are going to work last Friday? will now be out of work all summer in this family. Fuller's I think it is. That owns that facility. That thought he would get some cash flow to say help pay property taxes on the facility He's GONNA have no cash flow out of that facility all year. It we found a heard also. Bad news out of del Lago del Lago his notified. Is that is that it is laying them off. now you say well, of course they're laid off their shutdown. Well, here's the thing you've got furlough. Right Furlough see laid off has changed used to be when we were young. Laid off. MANT, you're not fired We're just a little low on work right now. When we give more work, we're going to bring you back laid off used to mean that you came back. You know your brother worked construction. Whatever else like that? Yeah, our our firm. We don't have a job this week. We'll have one next week or at the end of the month and will bring you back then when we have the work that was laid off now laid off, means fired. Right and The del Lago people had been furloughed meaning. Okay, you're you're off but we are still an employee and we are in anticipation and hoping to bring you back but this move. Says two things. One they don't expect to reopen at any time in the foreseeable future. Right because you would just continue people on Furlough, or you know as something along those lines, but when you officially separate those people from Your Business. That means you don't expect to bring them back. And so you know one wonders if del Lago will reopen, and I'm not trying to spa spread. Bad Bad poop on everything else like that Sam has reached out to them. We got I. Think a word from them last week, or whatever that they are watching and waiting and were were completely prepared. But if now they're at the point where they are, you know where staff is being. Let go. well, so if you were to reopen, what would you do? Would you retrain which you go through that grey difficulty so? What's going to happen is. You and I as consumers we see. Oh, it's shut down for a while whatever it is our favorite restaurant or store, business or whatever? or lock Lago, but you know. The there will be many that won't reopen. Right and and you just fear that this massive investment this huge a possibility for that region over there it might be sleeping with the fishes I hope not I pray not, but this of course is not a good sign for reopening by any means. We'll be back with you right after the news which is up next with George Mitchell is GonNa talk about push ups by the ways running for Congress to we ought to start paying attention to that. Coming up on newsradio eleven eighty. Back Friends a press release comes out of Adam. Bellows Office, saying that at ten o'clock he will press conference to announce a piece of legislation. Todd Halliday tells us that channel eight has just said that he will call for the renaming of the Rochester airport in honor of Frederick. Douglass certainly a a great American integrate Republican A. A but I would just politely like to say on the subject of deliberative government where we talk about things and think them through You had an online a petition that went up over the weekend. It has twenty four hundred signatures. It's been forty eight hours and now the county executive wants to change the name of the airport and again I mean. Maybe Rochester is a name that were embarrassed of now, and should be embarrassed, or whatever may be all things should be named after Douglas of course, it seems disrespectful to Susan. B Anthony or to Austin Steward awarded George Eastman. But it typically you know when we have representative government, we have conversations and not just the shouting kind like we've had. Recently where where there actually are are different viewpoints, a- expressed but any rate. Never one to Mrs Chance To Jump On a bandwagon guess Frederick Douglass Airport and again. Here's thing poor. Douglas's caught in the middle on this. He's a truly great figure. A wonderful man I would urge you an F. set for years. You should read things. He wrote a read the things. He said you should study his life. Here's a deal Annabella was going to. To announce that he wants to name the air of a port after a Republican, who is a law enforcement officer just to? He was the United States. Marshal Frederick I tweet that out and I will in the second I. Though it's a Republican congressional candidate, and as we learned today on social media push up. Champion Mr George Mitchell this morning. Sir, how're you doing? Sorry, it is Mr Mitchell Serie there. Bob I'm here good morning. How are you I'm well sir? We'll welcome to the broadcast. Thank you for having me Christiane the opportunity. You Betcha so I, you know there's this gentleman's going out there like so many. It's been a thing for a couple years now. The twenty two pushups every day. a number supposedly representing a veterans commit suicide, but he. He tapped UNI guy. You do the push ups and you did. You did very fine pushups. Well you know I I am the camera and twenty pounds. Bob You know that okay. I'm really I'm really a lot more fit. Than that video shows well. Here's the deal you did the push ups. You had good form. You are fit. Those are I'm not kidding. Those are excellent. Push Sir. You know my father used to say when when they asked him how how tall you are! He was five eight, but he would always say. My license says five ten. So I'm a lot more fit than that video shows. Well, no I think it speaks well of you. Real quick or in the middle of the summer a very unusual summer for campaigning house, the congressional campaign going. Oh my goodness. I, it's unbelievable. Honestly, it's a I. I have no words for it. The response from people. is absolutely tremendous and off people from all political background. The. Folks just can't believe someone can speak. To their hearts into their minds. And It's going great. people are looking for someone that. Is Responsive and and not a party person necessarily. And so you know we're. We're out there in the community out there. Now that things are opening up. We're. We're out in the community talking to people listening to people. And where we're going to do some great things come November! Outstanding. The There there are a lot you know they're out there parades. There aren't the festivals. There are meetings your one last night. Community discussions and stuff like that, are you? How do you reach join Betty voter to make your case to them sir? All. You know what we're out in the names. Different neighborhoods were out in the communities We talked to You know people that are. Business owners. We talk. Folks are just. Apprehensive at this time they they don't know what's going to happen. we have talks about dismantling the police so I. GO I start with my friends. I start with people that I know. and. Last week, we were out on Thurston road. Talking to folks In the local businesses over there. What you know, folks are scared. They don't want their police to be dismantled. Changes. But everyone is worried about safe communities. People worried about the schools. What's going to happen with the schools? So we go out and we talked to teachers and mothers and. Parents, I I suspect that defunding the police is. Some people find that insane. I imagined that. I imagine you can run a whole campaign on. Not to defend the police. Look. There's a fine blue line. Between chaos in civilization between safety and violence. And we all need safety We have to reform wait. We have to change things. So, but the answer isn't to defunding dismantle. The answers to get back to the future. where? Police represent the community where they know their community. They're part of the community. they? They know the people that live there. And there has to be some trust between the community and police and when I talk to people. Both, from the community. And from the police departments. Such as m catchy people sample. Everybody is on the same page. Everybody wants reform. and. Everybody wants a community. Do you think disagreement speaking Jordan matured Schmidt who's Republican running for Congress against a Joe Morelli any discussion yet between you and Mr Morell as people about possible debates this fall. well. I I haven't heard anything. I would be happy to debate him. anytime anywhere. I don't know what we can possibly debate. I don't know you know. Our positions are positions of the people say communities good schools jobs. That they're. Not Party position. but I would be happy to debate him anytime anywhere. I haven't heard any. Standing us any George Mitchell snacks visiting with us this morning. We'll speak again soon at length time for a break back in a moment on Newsradio Cam. and. Welcome back. My friend a welcome back again, Adam Bellow is holding a press conference at eleven, and that's great He's probably GONNA. Talk about how he's going to try to go to the governor's office and knock on his door and see if he can't get permission for seabreeze to open and try to save that fixture of our region. He's probably going to get on that same throughway Dry d the the Frederick Douglass throughway drive it up to Albany and knock-on Cuomo's door and say a big Andy. Andy we got you clearly you're buffier jacked whatever you're shooting is working buddy in by the way here those new nipple studs. They promised to you, but but we got a lot of people back in Iraq. Who'd like to go to the gym and you've accidentally left. Them closed I. Wonder if you could open the gyms force. Would that be okay I mean I. It's probably what Adam Bell is going to announce 'cause. He's been working so hard. Advancing your reopening interests with the governor, but instead. According to channel eight todd how they seize of the. He's GonNa. Call for renaming the Rochester airport after a Frederick Douglass. And you know to me, strikes I. IT comes off as Little Jerk Ni as a it, which is good, and of course, the county legislature is controlled by Republicans but maybe this is just a political game to say the Republicans I dare you to vote no to rename the airport for Frederick Douglass. Proving to all that you are racists. Maybe Frederick Douglass being used here just as a a political ploy. I don't know but renaming. Renaming the airport is something that probably should occur as part of a community discussion, not a community, harangue or a shout down or another march or a threat of you know who knows what, but as a community discussion as an earnest effort, and and move by the The county also think that you know it's worth pointing out that Frederick. Douglass was a Republican, and he spent a few years in law enforcement. He was the United States Marshal. For the District of Columbia is dead at so in a in an era when we certainly aren't showing respect for police. I'm grateful that this law man could receive this honor. And Frederick Douglass is honestly worthy of about all the praise you give him. He was a person of great achievement, but here's an end of crate intellect, but I just honestly think that a lot of these folks who are ring in the Frederick Douglas Bell. You just want to say to them. Okay, listen. Here's what I'd like you to do. It's just take six months. And why don't you truly read and learn and understand what this man said because what he said in his day is not what you're saying today. Right, which is fine. But like he, you know, here's your I. Hate to say it, but Frederick Douglass if he were alive today he might be pretty good friends with Clarence Thomas just an FYI I don't mean that as a negative thing, but but just the the this may well be a noble in good idea. Because you know the the bridge and the through way it may not be enough, and and you know the airport may be a idea. But probably it should be done in a sincere and thoughtful fashion that represents the desire of the entire community, and not merely either some kind of fearful recoil from activists, or as they jump on the bandwagon. Kind, of thing, or some effort to create some kind of political pressure on the Republicans in the legislature. You know I, you know. We've at that, but the deal is. It's like all of these reforms, and not the reforms, but all the statements right and I hate to beat on poor doorly but you know when she came out with her, you know her Ernest Statement of there's wrong and we've got to fix it. It's like well, hold it. You've been in this business for thirty years. Where where were you the other? You know twenty nine point nine nine years right? Why didn't you do or say anything about it? Say you know. Two months ago or six months ago or five years ago, you know we've got banks and businesses in town which are leading out these massive horrific wildly woke anti-racist, completely politically correct statements and you just WanNa. Say Okay well. This is good. I'm glad you feel this way, but like. Where were you six months ago, right? Because like six months ago, you were you were the white power structure. I mean if if if this is the way the world if it's the world is the way you say you guys were like lead the parade six months ago. What's changed? Right and not I'm not arguing against I'm just saying we've got a lot of woke. People who really worked that woke back at Christmas time. And so you wonder where that came from. Right is it. Has has the mind of the community truly changed, or are we afraid or intimidated, or or what exactly is going on this this? This may well be an excellent idea being we are no longer the Kodak town. Kodak is a thing of the past. George Eastman a great man you in history. with no impact on today other than his well I take back the his massive nonprofit investments from the University of Rochester you know to you know. Yeah, that's a pretty good right. There are huge, but like this isn't Kodak town anymore. Do you want to rebrand as Frederick Douglass town? Back could be a great thing I mean literally that could be a great thing, but shouldn't. It shouldn't there be. Of discussion about that or you know it, should we talk about it? Wants it or or or do? Do we govern ourselves by? Somebody puts up an online a petition. You get a number of votes. That is you know I I can put a poll on twitter in have as many people respond to. That is signed this petition, not a big deal, but like there's not a massive number of people and we you know. After two days of deliberation, we launch out on it. When you want to do something right? Do it the right way. Right and say you know what what what role do we want? This great heritage of Frederick Douglass to play an in our in our presentation, and also would that diminish the role of Susan B. Anthony Right I. Don't know, but it do. We want our message to the world now to be Frederick Douglass, that'd be a very good message. He would be worthy of it, but if that's our direction. Then, you know it ought to be something a little deeper and more profound and sincere, then a last minute press release. pull out your behind Charlie. Glad you called welcome to Newsradio wham eleven eighty. You know this guy nicknamed should be Mr Pandering. First of all if he can't spell George, maybe you can sell Joe Wilson. He's probably not bright enough to know who we was. There's lots of people that are have a name on the airport to rebrand, but as pandering is almost comedic, he's certainly not to be taken Terry. When you're the county executive get taken seriously. Here's the thing. If. If you came to me and said, we have to name the airport after somebody, I would say why you know they're. All of them are geographic right? They should be geographic name, but if you say no, we have name somebody okay, and you go someone from raw from Rochester history. Of Frederick Douglass is is the one right I hate to say this Susan B.. Anthony was very important, but she was part of a group of people who are all working on a cause and you know. She was a CO leader of that group. and and we're very proud of her Frederick Douglass was an essential person in his era Mr Wilson and Mr Eastman. Great contributions to companies that are now essentially dead and technologies that have passed us by Frederick Douglass if you read what he said, and what he wrote, and you truly understand it. There are principles there. That would benefit us in any people almost in perpetuity into the future of course again. The deal is just want to say you guys honestly should read Frederick. Douglass saying you should probably read and you know it. 'cause here's the deal he he was a republican that meant something. Maybe you say well Miss Ali different back then but the issue the principles of self reliance. And individual liberty and be honest with you. A fairly limited role for government were all things that he believed in taught and You know I I have any will be quite about this, but we'll see how it goes, and it would be, they'd still be. ROTC would be the letters on your luggage tag. But, what would it be? Would it be? Rochester Frederick. Douglass because it's Chicago O'hare, whoever Oh, here was. What's that one where John? F. Kennedy flew out of Louis in Dallas. There are cities, the like Hartsfield. Whatever's Atlanta it, but that's Atlanta Hartsfield so would it be Rochester Douglas? Airport probably would that be the former style that other towns do. It would be the todd well. It depends I mean. The the petition calls for Frederick Douglas International Airport. I don't know if could ultimately be worked out that way according to regulations because right now we don't have any international flights. In Baltimore the Baltimore Washington International Airport when they renamed it for Thurgood Marshall Now it's Baltimore Washington, Thurgood. Marshall International Airport. I did not know his name for. About ten years ago, Yang as a memorial that may not be completely effective, yet very good. That's the great todd. How is going to newscast next on Newsradio? WHAM eleven eighty.

Frederick Douglass Todd Halliday Rochester Frederick Mr George Mitchell Bob Rochester City School district George Eastman Susan B. Anthony Iraq Jackie Ortiz Frederick Douglass United States Frederick Douglass Airport Bob You executive Douglas Frederick Douglas Internationa
Monday, August 12th, 2019

Up First

13:38 min | 1 year ago

Monday, August 12th, 2019

"On jeffrey epstein the financier accused of sex trafficking underage girls died in jail by apparent suicide on saturday. Why was he not being watched watched closely after a possible suicide attempt just three weeks ago. I'm david greene with rachel martin and the sub i from n._p._r. News democratic the presidential candidates at the iowa state fair over the weekend and they all seem to have one thing on their minds commonsense gun safety responsible gun owners gun lobbyists and the n._r._a. Will again debate galvanize voters across the spectrum in twenty twenty plus hong kong airport cancel all departing and arriving flights because of pro democracy protests tale much worse can clashes between protesters and the government. They're get they with us. We'll guide you through the day's news support for up first the following message come from simply safe wireless home security with video verification technology to help police get on the scene faster. Get free shipping on your system and a sixty day money back guarantee at simplisafe dot com slash up. I support also comes from sun basket making it easy to cook delicious meal plans lands full of organic produce with plans like paleo gluten free and vegan easily put healthy eating on autopilot go to sun basket dot com slash up first to get up to sixty dollars off jeffrey epstein. The wealthy financier awaiting trial on sex trafficking charges was found dead inside in manhattan jail cell saturday from an apparent suicide. It's not yet clear why obscene wasn't being monitored more closely just a few weeks ago. He was found unconscious in his jail cell with marks on his neck suggesting a possible suicide attempt the day before i've seen stuff thousands of court documents from a civil suit where released detailing <unk> how he lured girls as young as fourteen years old into a sex trafficking ring that operated from two thousand and two to two thousand five all right. Let's learn more about what happened here. From n._p._r.'s ryan ryan lucas who covers the justice department has been reporting on iran good morning so give us the latest. What what do we know about how epstein ended up dead wall in custody while they're still aren't a lot of answers to the questions that we have really we do know as you mentioned. Epstein was founded about six thirty a._m. On saturday morning in his cell at the metropolitan correctional center in new york city <hes> his death is raised so many questions in part because as you mentioned earlier in july epstein had been put on suicide watch after this apparent suicide attempts now a source tells me that he was taken off of that suicide watching late july <hes> he was only on it for a couple of days <hes> he was put instead <hes> into a cell along with a cellmate in prison staff was to check on him every thirty minutes. I'm told that in the hours leading up to his death the cellmate was not there in epstein was not being checked checked on the cellmate had been transferred out. No one had been brought back in to replace him so that there was someone in the cell at all times with epstein. That's what should have happened in a protocol. I'm told <hes> so still a lot of questions on that now. The new york city's chief medical examiner said yesterday that her office had conducted an autopsy but they said that they hadn't reached a determination as to the because death <hes> pending further information but tell me about the hours and days leading up to his death because as a lot was happening in in in the case right well i mean this case is generated an enormous amount of publicity and media attention in the u._s. Here in in in over the world on friday though a big thing happened and that's these hundreds words in hundreds of court documents related epstein were made public. That's by court order. <hes> these were related to a defamation case <hes> to a lawsuit that was brought by one of the women who says that she was sexually abused and traffic epstein. Some of the court records were sworn depositions. You've got a whole host of of documents that were in there but there are new allegations of how epstein brought underage girls into this <hes> alleged sex trafficking ring there are also new allegations against other prominent men who allegedly had sex with girls through epstein <hes> they include former new the new mexico governor bill richardson and former u._s. Senator george mitchell they both have <hes> have denied the allegations okay so so this goes forward. Now i mean you have the justice this department inspector general who's going to be looking into this attorney general william bar said in a statement that the death rate serious questions but then you have. I mean just these allegations nations. I mean that's dean accused of sex crimes against minors. I'm just thinking about the the the alleged victims here and their search for some kind of justice but what options are still left them well. You have the u._s. Attorney for the southern district of new york has said that his investigation will continue <hes> the case in obscene in his done but one of the charges was conspiracy <hes> sex trafficking conspiracy so that investigation will go forward. There's the possibility of conspirators being prosecuted in that case and then there's also the possibility of civil cases that <hes> that victims can bring and they can pursue that avenue as well and here's ryan lucas covering the story for us ryan. Thanks thanks so much thank you. We're gonna go to hong kong where authorities are saying. They are suspending ending all flights. At this time this comes as pro democracy protesters. They've been out demonstrating on the streets for ten straight weeks now and this transpired again this past weekend. Police were clashing with protesters in several downtown districts and things got violent because of the demonstrations at the airport in hong kong officials have have now cancelled all fights all right. N._p._r.'s anthony kuhn observed these events as they played out over the weekend and joins us now from hong kong any either david. Let's start with the situation at the airport airport. What do we know about the suspended flights and what this could mean well. This is one of the busiest airports in asia. Police said they're now about five thousand thousand protesters there and now because flights have been canceled. Protesters are worried that the police may try to flush them out by force and <hes>. It's not clear whether this was a government strategy or not but it certainly inconveniences a lot of people in it. Could it could be part of a strategy to pin it on the protesters is and make it make. It seem like they're disrupting. People's lives so how how violent were these clashes over the weekend. I mean you were out there to take me to the streets. And what did it feel feel like as as you were watching this well what happens in these sort of hit and run guerrilla style protests is the protesters get out there and they barricade the streets they throw stones and molotov cocktails at police then the police come in firing tear gas and rubber bullets. They beat protestors with batons. They arrest some of them. <hes> they clear the streets and then they reopen them to traffic and then they're remaining protestors move onto the next district in this repeated itself over and over again in many downtown areas yeah about four of them yesterday so it just keeps on going very fast and fluid <hes> so so the police response you're describing i mean it. It sounds like potentially police brutality. How how are people handling that question. A lot of people here sure see it that way. They feel that the police did a lot of unnecessary beating firing of rubber bullets and tear gas at close range. They even fired tear gas into the subway where it's hard for those gases to disperse there were also allegations that undercover recaps dressed as protesters were stirring up violence which riot police then moved in to quell now. The police say they're just you know responding to threats to their safety fifty. They use minimum force to disperse the protesters. There have been scores of injuries. We hear about over the weekend. They've not been fatalities but people perceive this. This is brutality in this fueled a big turn out of protestors at the airport. Can you just talk broadly about where this is all headed the role all of mainland china what these protesters want. I mean what what what are we expecting in the days and weeks ahead well. Let me see something about the role of the mainland. I was in this neighborhood yesterday. Jay called the north point in a lot of people who live there are pro beijing. They're they're immigrants from mainland china and there's been a lot of fights there and they seem to be spoiling for a fight in warning that if the protesters came they would they would. They let him have it but the police managed to keep them apart. They blocked off the streets and there were no big fights right but the the perception is is that these are gangs in hong kong to do beijing's bidding and as far as you know where things are headed the police could do mass arrests that would shut things down beijing could send in the military that would shut things down but neither of these looks like they're about to happen so it. It looks like this could grind on for quite a long time and what is the new normal is in fact very difficult for people to live a normal life in <hes> <hes> all right n._p._r.'s anthony kuhn speaking to us from hong kong about the recent protests there anthony. Thanks so much for your reporting. We appreciate it. You're welcome david <music> all right. The iowa state fair traditionally has been kind of a more easygoing campaign event for presidential candidates right. You know this david. I mean you go there. You see candidates. It's challenge down on deep fried foods taking a lot of selfish with voters this weekend. Though the whole thing had a different kind of tone days after the mass shootings in texas and ohio many of the the democratic candidates just set aside all the fun and games and released their plans for reducing gun violence political correspondents got detro- spent the weekend with the candidates in i won at the fair and joins us either scott good morning okay so what are the democratic candidates saying in terms of what their plans would be if elected to confront in front gun violence in america a lot of consensus on policies like universal expanded background checks <hes> senator elizabeth warren rolled out a new plan this weekend proposing raising taxes on guns and ammunition also holding firearms manufacturers and ceos liable for gun violence former vice president joe biden wrote an op ed in the new york times this morning arguing for a new assault weapon ban and talking about how that was a key part of that nineteen ninety four crime bill that he's really been on the defensive over so far a lot of candidates are like <hes> <hes> senator kamala harris as well. They say executive action would be a big part of their approach given the decades of congressional gridlock on this but what i've heard from the candidates candidates in utah closer that this conversation has not just been about guns. I mean after dayton after el paso i it seems like a much broader conversation absolutely absolutely and that's so striking because as porton as gun control is for democrats. It's really taken a back seat and a big focus is on the rise in white nationalism the kind that allegedly actually sparked the el paso shooting the candidates are all saying that president trump's words and actions have emboldened white nationalism. I interviewed kamala harris on her campaign bus us and i asked her. How is president. She would fix this. These are acts and expressions that are born out of hate which under this administration has received new fuel and part of the role and that's the power of the president of the united states is to use her microphone in a way that is about elevating public discourse. Anu is away in a way that is about lifting people up net beating them down. That's not what we've seen. In this president scott i mean dealing with such weighty subjects but this this fair and being an iowa's also opportunity for for commonly harrison others to distinguish themselves right and and kind of to show their fun side moments <hes> as a as a a potential president like how did they strike that balance a lot of the conversation about gun violence in white nationalism happened at a at a forum that had been set up <hes> elsewhere in iowa at the last minute after this violence but at fair there still was a lot of room for the retail politics in in the approaches to the fair you know there were different styles on display harris warned biden had this big presents presents a ton of supporters and media a lot of the other candidates got to do a lot more one on one retailing and get a chance to actually enjoy fairly normal people ride the rides even one striking talking about biden early in this trip. He looked very strong. He gave a powerful speech about trump and white nationalism had a big reception of the fair but over the weekend he had several verbal slip-ups including including mistakenly saying the parkland shooting happened when he was vice president and that opened the door to some questions about his performance. Did you get time to enjoy the fair. Do you like eating <hes> i they had the maple glazed pork belly on a stick and the bacon wrapped corn dog and both were excellent okay so the answer's yes. Yes n._p._r.'s scott detro- on the campaign trail scott. Thanks so much. Thank you all right. That's up. I for monday august twelfth. I'm david greene martin. Come back tomorrow. We'll be right here. You can also subscribe to us. Wherever you listen to podcast you can also rate us and we're on apple podcasts and we appreciate your listening to first and if you want more indepth coverage of the stories we talked talked about today and a bunch of other stories and a bunch of other stuff n._p._r.'s morning edition. Is there for you. That is the radio show that rachel host along with noel king and steve inskeep. You can find morning edition addition and your n._p._r. Station you can find it all by going stations dot org dot org <music>. There's a multivitamin that can make our lives instantly better. All we need to get its benefits is to step outside nature and parks and greenery. The helps us be better solves the miracle of environment in the latest episode of you two point. Oh series on hidden brain from n._p._r.

jeffrey epstein hong kong iowa scott detro vice president ryan lucas new york kamala harris rachel martin president david greene Attorney david joe biden anthony kuhn n._p._r. Senator george mitchell manhattan
20181026 Nicole Sandler Show - Bombs and Baseball

The Nicole Sandler Show

1:00:03 hr | 1 year ago

20181026 Nicole Sandler Show - Bombs and Baseball

"The following program contents graphic material, including offensive language, if you're this question is advised without bringing democratic form of government could examine switching out spending on. Spending on looking overland. But I like good evening from our CBS news room in New York and DC presents Chet Huntley and David Brinkley from ABC, this is world news tonight, Peter Jennings in London Benton in Chicago and from our desk in Washington Frank rebel to this historic legislation to Tele-Communications law, create dot. And berry last when the press is free of people of a country are when the press is free people of a country are endanger of flavor. Informed. We information you and the views of people making the news insulin. Ecole Sandler, y'all on the goals. Handler dot com and the progressive Boise's met word. Especially package was also central Robert deniro. No, one knows who sent the packages. But deniro did have a defiant message for the bomber. I will bring you down. Baby. I will bring you down to Chinatown now. Deniro? Addresses the monopoly man for some reason to near is not even a government official. He just criticized Trump at award shows. We're getting pretty far down the list of Trump's enemies at this point. What's your backs? And. So we're learning more about the bombs themselves. For instance, the explosive device centers CNN featured a parody ISIS flag with a gator done inscription. Sounds odd. But that flag is a right wing mean on the internet say what you will about the unit bomber. But at least that guy had a manifesto. He wasn't sending his victims. The distracted boyfriend. Plus get her done is Larry the cable guy come on. If you're gonna put a comedians catchphrase on an explosive device. Dino might is right there. Missing jimmy. After yesterday's bombs were discovered. Don't Trump held a rally in Wisconsin. And he had a simple message those engaged in the political arena must stop treating political opponents as being morally defective. So you're deleting your Twitter account. Yeah. Throughout his speech. Trump kept reminding the audience how civil he was being the Democrats are for higher taxes, more regulation and more top down government control. And by the way, see how nice somebody behaving. This is like have you ever seen? Yes. I used to see presidents, dude. All the time before we elected a guy who's more afraid of Jake tapper than Kim Jong known. Jake. There then Trump singled out who he believes is responsible for all the incivility in America as part of a larger national effort to bridge divides and bring people together the media also has a responsibility to set a civil tone and to stop the endless hus- to the and constant negative and oftentimes false attacks and stores. It's the media's fault things had gotten so bad. In fact, did you see when they reported on me calling Mexican people, rapists, and criminals, just the worst. He's got. And if you can't report them the things, I say. And be nice at the same time. Of course. Not. Well, thank you, Stephen Colbert. But there's big news. Welcome to the Friday show. I'm Nicole Sandler here, Nicole, Sandler dot com. The progressive voices network and a podcast near you. It's been a busy eventful day. It's so funny because you know, I do what's news I produce, right? It and produce it and everything early in the morning and just as I finished walk out to the living room, turn on the news. And I see. Well, I there was yet. Another couple of packages allegedly found today it just kept developing. And then the news that they arrested somebody. Yes, they arrested a guy named Caesar. Hold on. I gotta here somewhere. Savak Caesar's Savak of avenue, Shera, Florida. Didn't you just know it was going to be a Florida man because it is Florida? I expected nothing different. So so just a few minutes ago. Actually, it's probably still going on a press conference at the department of Justice and little Jefferson's Jefferson Beauregard sessions ambled up to the microphone I am pleased to participate in this announcement that a suspect is in the custody of the FBI. I want to remind everyone that the defendant in this case as in every case is innocent until proven guilty. He's been charged today with five federal crimes, including interstate transportation of an explosive illegal mailing of explosives threats against former presidents and certain other persons threatening interstate communications and assaulting current and former federal officers for these charges the defendant faces up to fifty eight years in all these charges may change or expand as the investigation. Proceeds this is a law and order. Administration. We will not tolerate such lawlessness. Specially not political. But political violence is exactly what this was. And this guy was arrested here in south Florida about about twenty minutes away from where I live boy, it's been an eventful year here in Florida. Anyway, I'll tell you what we've got a busy show today. It's a Friday. The World Series is underway. You know? And it's funny. I'm not I'm not a sports fan. But I got the Los Angeles Dodgers versus the the Boston Red Sox two cities that I lived in. But if I had to root for one I'd probably root for LA because I liked LA better. I did I lived there for fifteen years. Anyway, I am not a sports person. But my husband, you might know is somebody who's represented professional baseball players as their agent for his entire adult life. And there's a new book out about the the the the dark side of baseball called baseball cop. And so so a little later on David's going to join me in here to speak with two of the co authors of this book because it's really fascinating. And there is a a an intersection between sports and politics, especially when you start talking about the the CD side of baseball. So. So we'll do that. Yeah. I know I see the chatrooms laughing at the law and order administration part of. Statement from sessions anyway, so I'll tell you what let's just start with what's news since it's a busy day. Obviously, the news is changed since I first recorded. The what's news this morning that runs all day on me. Progressive oysters network. So we'll do it live. It's time for Nicole Sandler's. What's news from the coal, Sandler dot com and the progressive voices network. All right, as I told you a suspect has been identified and arrested in a string of mail bomb sent to critics of Donald Trump senior law enforcement officials identified the suspect as fifty six year old Caesar Savak junior of avenue, a Florida. Investigators us forensic evidence to trae cya to a mail processing facility in plantation and he was arrested in nearby auto zone. Where some reports that he worked video showed his white van covered with photos of Trump and other right wing paraphernalia and Twitter user, shared photos of the ban. They shot recent days in south Florida, all the windows were covered by these stickers. It's it's it's nuts. Other sticker showed prominent liberals with both is over them haven't we already been through this with Sarah Palin, right and a sticker that says CNN's ox boy. He's originalism Savak UIs originally from New Jersey has a lengthy criminal record dating back at least twenty years and cluding arrests for terrorist threats against judges. Go figure public records show Savak is a registered Republican who appears to have owned a dry cleaning business and a catering business at some points. Donald Trump announced the arrest at a an unrelated event in the White House. It was a meeting with the young black leadership summit where this happened. I am pleased to inform you that law enforcement has apprehended the suspect and taken him into custody. Credible job by log force. We've carried out a far reaching federal state and local investigation to find the person or persons responsible for these events these terrorizing acts despicable and have no place in our country. All right. What fiber enough of him? I just I he gives me the creeps as he should any thinking breathing human being so later on at this event. Of course, you know, Trump made his scripted remarks. And then of course, he starts going off about globalism, and you know, so much for for political niceties. So so so this happened. Every citizen benefits where we stop foreign countries from cheating our workers. That's what they've been doing. You know, the called Blois they like buzz for June, the globe globe, dude. Globes somebody yelled out. We have to loveless. Oh, it's so funny Trump so so somebody in the room there. Shouts out glut Soros, and then he says lock them up and Trump laughs, and you wonder why we have some a Trump follower sending out bomb threats or bombs. All right. That's all the Trump. I'm gonna play for you today. Don't worry. Let me tell you. What else is going on? So that was after Trump took to Twitter this morning to complain about Twitter removing bots that were following him. And about all of the as he put it quote bomb stuff slowing his alleged campaign momentum. He didn't he didn't tweet about the fact that some crazy person is sending out bombs to his political opponents political critics, but but he he bitched about Twitter taking away some of his followers. They were fake. He he's he's so quick to call out fake news. But he doesn't admit that. He's got most of his Twitter followers are fake their bought. I lost about I don't know if you hundred Twitter followers because they were box, and then he complains about the bombs stuff. Thank you. Keith. I needed to get that out. Anyway, there is other Trump news today. Trump is weighing an executive order to close the southern border to migrants, including asylum seekers as part of a push to rally supporter. Sources say the details are still being worked out. But if Trump goes ahead with it. He will invoke the same part of immigration law. Use in last year's travel ban to bar foreigners from entering the US on national security grounds. Three sources cited in the report said Trump may issue a proclamation on the executive action on Tuesday a week before the midterm elections. Boy, that's not pandering for votes or anything is it reports of the plan came shortly after Trump declared on Twitter that he was quote, bringing out the military to deal with a migrant caravan headed for the US border, which he described as a national emergency, by the way, people who are watching this caravan say, it's at least at least. Away. Trump wants to get here by election, data give him more votes. Anyway, homeland security secretary Kirstin Nielsen yesterday spoke with FOX so-called news there any scenario under which if people forced their way across the border. They could be shot at we do not have any intention right now to shade of people. They will apprehended, however. But I also take my officer and agent their own personal safety extraordinarily seriously. They have a building, of course to defend themselves. So if shot at they would shoot back now, I just I think we'd have to work through that. But I wanna make it very clearly we'll absolutely not tolerate violence against border patrol in this situation. All right. So I just wanna make sure you heard that she qualified the statement, we have no intention right now of shooting people in case you missed it. Here's again that part. We do not have any intention right now to share with people, but then may change because we're gonna happy. Yeah. 'cause we like. Shooting them immigrants them illegal aliens. Sorry, just it's frustrating for some reason you'll soon went on FOX yesterday to talk about the caravan as the investigation into at the time ten pipebombs sent a prominent Trump critics was ongoing. Can you say priorities are fucked up in other news? Megan Kelly is out at NBC's today show as NBC announced today that other today anchors will replace her in the nine AM our bringing an end to Meghan Kelly today. Deserves some applause a following months of missteps awkward moments in racially insensitive defense of black face, Halloween, costumes. This isn't the same idiotic woman who insisted that Santa Claus and Jesus Christ or white. With just over a week left until election day. Republicans are changing their message on ObamaCare. Suddenly they seem to be touting its most important feature covering pre-existing conditions funny. How that works, right? A Phoenix TV station called out senatorial candidate Martha mcsally for the blatant had for for her blatant hypocrisy. Republican Senate candidate Martha mcsally is now claiming that she is fighting to protect people with preexisting conditions. Does that match up with Nick Sally's record in congress are political editor Dennis Welsh looked at a record? Dennis. Can we please talk about the things that matter to most voters instead of repeating the democrat party press releases less than two weeks left in this election, and Martha mcsally clearly showing her frustration. Visit us honestly, do you have anything to talk about like the caravan? The reason reporters were asking Republican congresswoman Martha mcsally about healthcare. And that instance, which frustrated her to no end is because her latest ad says she's leading the fight to force insurance companies to cover pre existing conditions, which is amazing. So, of course, reporters are asking her about it, of course, is happening all over the country, ObamaCare, you may recall is what forced insurance companies to guarantee coverage for people who have preexisting conditions because of ObamaCare. That's why insurance companies now can't turn you down for coverage because you've got a pre existing condition, and they can't charge you more money. If you've got a pre existing condition. That's what ObamaCare did Republicans in congress have voted at least seventy times seven Bill that the top Senate Republican Mitch McConnell says. Yeah. In the Senate, they'll do it. Again, if Republicans are able to hold onto the Senate twenty Republican led states right now are suing to kill ObamaCare. Including specifically that part that makes insurance cover preexisting conditions. That lawsuit is supported overtly by the Trump administration and to put the icing on all of it. The Trump administration just three days ago unilaterally changed the rules set by ObamaCare. So that now insurance companies will be allowed to turn you go a pre existing condition, or they'll be allowed to charge you more because of literally just this week the Trump administration took that action. So that people with preexisting conditions will no longer be protected. What they've decided to do is just lie about it to the president is doing it with tweets like this Republicans will totally protect people with preexisting conditions. Democrats will not. Yeah. And if you wanna believe Trump, I've got some swampy land not too far from here. I can sell you in the latest example of today in GOP voter suppression news, Rachel Maddow, takes us to dodge City Kansas this year, they've decided to move that one. Single polling place for thirteen thousand voters in majority Hispanic dodge City, Kansas they've decided to move the one polling location for thirteen thousand voters completely outside the city limits now it turns out the getting to dodge city's one out of town single polling place for thirteen thousand voters is going to be even harder because the elections office has been sending people to the wrong address. Nice. Not kidding. The reports tonight that local officials sent newly registered voters an official registration notice telling them to vote at an old polling place that is no longer being used in dodge city, chairman of a local Democratic Party saying tonight, quote, I didn't know this could get worse, but it did supposedly officials are sending a new notice to voters with the correct information. Now, Kansas secretary of state is responsible for running elections in that state. His name is Chris Khobar as the Republican candidate for governor in this year's elections, which means if any of the majority. Hispanic voters in dodge city, ever do get to see a ballot this year or cast one Chris Koby right at the top of the ticket in this election. That's being run in the state by his office. So dirty tricks being played all over the place. All I can tell you is election day is a week from Tuesday. It is the most important thing that you get out and vote. All right. We're gonna take a break. We'll check in with Brad. And does in the green news report will come back with my husband, David, and we'll talk with a couple of the co authors of the new book baseball cop the dark side of America's national pastime. Yeah. We'll talk baseball. It's Friday, and I'm just sick of Trump. So a you know, they caught the the bomber was going to say the Yuna bomber. They caught the the letter bomber. And. I guess it's time for some baseball. Don't go away. We'll be right back. A hundred and eighty mile per hour winds category. Five super typhoon U2. slams into Mariana Islands and other US. Territories. As the two thousand eighteen hurricane season is now the most powerful ever recorded could open Exxon Mobil to further lawsuit. New York state sues Exxon Mobil for defrauding investors about climate change. Plus, we are the first generation that has known how to fix this problem. But we are the last generation that will actually be able to do something about Canada places a price on pollution with a national carbon tag, all of those really big stories and more straight ahead from Brad block dot com. I'm Brad Friedman. Does he stand by for six minutes of independent green news politics analysis and snarky comment? That is true. There are scientists on both sides on one side all the scientists on the other one guy who runs a blog called real true. American science eagle Jesus. This is your renews report forecast rapture. Okay. Does he doing pick? You got about three or four top stories to fit into today's report. So I'll just shut up. Okay. Well, up first hurricane willa made landfall on Mexico's Pacific coast as a powerful category three on Tuesday, and then super typhoon U2. one of the strongest cyclones in history rapidly intensified into a category five before slamming into the US territory Marianna islands on Wednesday with gusts up to two hundred and twenty miles per hour. Yes. It was the strongest hyphen to pass near the US. Territories of Sipe pan and ten now if it seems to you like we've had more major hurricanes than usual this year. You are right in twenty eighteen both the Atlantic and Pacific, hurricane seasons are the most powerful ever recorded in the accumulated cyclone energy index which measures that combined intensity and duration of all tropical storms and hurricanes. Form in any given year. Twenty eighteen shattered the previous record set in nineteen ninety Ninety-two one of those storms category. Four hurricane will Lakha as obliterated a tiny island in the Hawaiian archipelago. Federal scientists confirmed this week that will lock washed away eleven acre east island this month, which was a critical habitat for endangered. Hawaiian monk seals sea turtles and birds scientists called it's loss a huge blow to conservation efforts. Unfortunately, it's not the last of the islands that are likely to disappear. Meanwhile, the US supreme court this week handed a temporary victory to the Trump administration issuing a temporary administrative stay on a landmark climate liability lawsuit. Brought by twenty one young people against the federal government in the lawsuit. Twenty-one young people aged twenty two and younger alleged that the federal government has filed aided their constitutional rights by failing to act on man made climate change and protect their life. Liberty and property. Since they and all of today's children will be forced to deal with the consequences of climate change for the rest of their lives. The trial had been scheduled to begin on Monday. And it's unclear if it will be allowed to proceed, but there is some good news, New York state attorney general Barbara Underwood on Wednesday filed a lawsuit against oil giant Exxon Mobil for deceiving. Investors by downplaying the expected financial risks of climate change. But what took you so long the suit alleges that Exxon defrauded shareholders deceiving them into believing. The company was managing the risk that stricter emissions regulations might post with bottom line in reality Underwood says it was quote intentionally and systematically underestimating or ignoring those risks. So they pretended. I the climate change didn't exist, then they pretended that they gotta take care of and the whole time they were lying to investors about all of it. Exactly. The center for international environmental law called the suit, quote, a wakeup call for investors who. Continue to bet on fossil fuels and pretends a new wave of climate litigation. This could cost Exxon Mobil, hundreds of millions of dollars even billions of dollars unless the supreme court kills it. All finally, Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau this week announced that his administration will implement a national carbon tax beginning next year to put a price on the pollution that causes dangerous. Global warming. It is free to pollute. So we have too much pollution in a press conference Trudeau listed the multiple billion dollar extreme weather events wildfires and floods hitting candidate in recent years and called action on climate change, a moral and economic imperative and also it is common sense that if you put a price on something you don't want pollution, people will pollute less, and if there are costs associated for average families, we will more than compensate those families. For those costs Trudeau's new climate action incentive plan will return all carbon tax revenue directly to households to support families in making the transition away from fossil fuels he says most families will get back more than they pay in higher energy costs. I pot for the entire country and now a carbon tax I am moving to Canada for much more on all of these stories and the ones we couldn't get to today. Please check out our website at green news, doc Brad, blog dot com. I'm Brad Friedman Desi doing and this has been your green news report on. This is a huge huge issue. We're talking about it, Kohls and Lucho progressive voices and the cold Sadler dot com. All right. We're back and we've got a different shot setup here because there's two of us in the studio listeners meet David David Sloan. My husband David say hi to the listeners listeners. How you doing? They can't talk back to you. You're not gonna hear I understand. All right. So I I asked David to come in here today to join us because we're going to talk a little bit about baseball. As I mentioned earlier. There's a new book out called baseball cop the dark side of America's national pastime. And it's written by Eddie Dominguez with Christian red and Terry Thompson. Now, you know, Christian red, correct? Well, not because he wrote a story about you. But he did write a recent story in the new York Daily News about something that we've been dealing with for the last few years here that I will put a link to that story. The new York Daily News, we're talking about on my blog along with today's podcast, Nicole, Sandler dot com, should you care to because to read it because it would be too long to go into detail about it. Now. Correct. But I I wanna thank you for doing this. I I met Christian redback believe it was two thousand four when he crashed the wedding of my client Carlos still gotta in Puerto Rico and Carlos was thrilled with it. But I pretty much impressed on him. Hey, this is no big deal. Don't let it were in your wedding day. And that was the beginning of my relationship with Christian as you say he was kind enough to do a extensive piece in the new York Daily News about the shit storm that I have been involved in for the last what three years old with the state of Tennessee because I had a piece of garbage as a client who stabbed me in the back. But putting that to the side for the moment again, thank you for allowing me to in a small way repay his kindness by giving the book that he's involved with some exposure here Christian is a great writer. I followed him even before he crashed Carlos is weathered. But nonetheless, he he has done a lot of really fine work and recently was cut. During the trial that took place for the past couple of weeks in New York City, where in several people involved in the shoe business who were caught up in bribing college athletes in order to get them to attend certain schools to play basketball, they charged several people with crimes, which is highly unusual because most of the time the corruption in professional sports rarely if ever gets brought to the surface, and even if it does the punishment generally amounts to a slap on the wrist. These guys are guilty of serious shit. And there are more people being tried in Christian was covering that. So that's why this whole way into this book works because the government's involved now they have been involved before. But not in a way that really affected the overall arena of sports if you will now they're getting involved with this. And I'm hoping that it creates a positive change as opposed to some of the things that the government gets involved in. They make worse rather than better. So with that said how about getting Christian and Terry, let's do it. All right there on the line Christian red and Terry Thompson are co-authors along with Eddie bingos of baseball cop the dark side of America's national pastime. Now, I know Christian and Terry worked together at the daily news. And the daily news has had a few downsizings in recent years, Terry and Christian. Hello. All right. We're all here. Oh, it's it's it's my pleasure. I just to to let people know Terry. You were the managing editor of sports at the daily news until about three years ago when the daily news did their first big round of of cutting off heads over there. Yes, that's right and Christian just we remember it was just a month or so ago that they did it again. And you were let go in along with what at least half of the daily news writing staff, I think it was pretty much the the bulk of the sports department and there were cuts across the newsroom, but the sports department July was downsized from thirty four I believe thirty five down to eight people out. So that's how many people used to send regular regularly to Yankees Red Sox game. So can imagine what a New York sports department in that side has to. Could contend with the pulping always different sports teams. In addition to all the stuff that goes on in New York on a regular basis anyway so daunting. Yeah. That's a really shame. Because there's there's a lot of that kind of stuff going on at newspapers around the country where staffs are being cut and and newspapers are going out of business just at a time when we really need real journalism. So that's a shame. But we're hearing the other I was gonna say the other interesting thing is that Terry. Before she became the managing. Editors started an investigative really. You know, original new kind of idea where she started in investigative team within the sports department, and the design was to go and find the interesting stories, whether they be legal or corruption or crime or something out by the box rather than the day to day coverage, which by all means is very important. But this was an interesting concept and just like you said with these downsizings at newsrooms across the country, especially newspapers, those kinds of stories are harder to do and in in most cases with newsrooms. I would think in Terry concertedly. Echo, or or not the feeling is that there's no time or or resources to do them. So that's that's a big shame too. Because the there's a lot of of maybe under the belly. Or of sinister thing that are going on there won't be reported. Because there are people there to do it. Yeah. And from the consumer side, it appears they not only downsized the personnel. They downsized the paper. We recently I've been a subscriber to USA for thirty some years since the paper starts today. USA today. What to say USA sorry USA today for thirty some years at any rate recently. The paper has devolved to the point where each section is one folded page and one page in the middle for news sports business in their life section. So a and they raised the price for the subscription. I called him up. I said if this is what we're getting we're getting less than your ass. To pay more. You can keep it. And unfortunately, that's the same route that the local papers have taken as well. But at least they're not as expensive. So we have subscribed to one of them. And it's turned out to be okay. But nonetheless, as I said, originally, they're not only downsizing the personnel. There. Downsizing, the news, and that's unfortunate. But let's jump into the book. First of all, my curiosity was piqued in Eddie's. Bio. Eddie Dominguez who whose name is. Actually, it says by Eddie Dominguez with Christian red, Terry Thompson. So he's he's the lead author on the book. Well, his story and it and by that I mean in Terry again, certainly add her perspective as well. But the thing that intrigued us about Eddie story was how comprehensive it was. Here's a person that his family fled Castro's Cuba in the sixties with Lyndon Johnson spree plate he came to the US with as he says in the book would nothing. I mean, if family his mom brother dad, nothing they land in Florida the eventually made their way to Boston. He became a decorated Boston police detective was in the force for more than twenty nine years and had a variety of different roles. But one of those was working with an FBI drug task force. He got involved. With baseball starting in nineteen ninety nine and became a resident security agent, which those listeners that don't know. It's basically again spelled out in the book, but the eyes and the years of a major league baseball team, and he was still working within the Boston police department because the security agents are logged force members who are contract by baseball to carry out those jobs, but I- years, basically means you're looking out for every security aspect of the team both at home. And in Eddie case, he often traveled with the team, especially when they went to play in New York against the Yankees. But while he was a resin security agent. Of course, there were the congressional hearings. I in two thousand five and then later thousand eight although that was civically Bob the Clinton. And his as former trainer Brian McNamee. But the two thousand five hearings really cast a spotlight on baseball. And what it was doing to rectify its problems, particularly the the before its hands drug issue which had exploded by that. What Eddie would that players? Take performance enhancing drugs Christian. Yeah. No, I'm sorry. You're. Hinting. No. But if. If if listeners to get on with the fallout of those hearings, George Mitchell, the former Senator was appointed by then Commissioner, but C-league to compile report about baseball's doping past doping history, which he did was a I can't remember the exact amount of months, they carry a war member. But I think eighteen months or so before he released the final product in December of two thousand seven, but one of the recommendations about report was baseball should develop or implement a investigative unit. And here's the key part, which is again spelled out in the book. But it Mitchell's report he said this unit if it's formed should be completely separate in autonomous from the labor side of baseball. Labor's responsibility should be. And continued to be maintaining its relationship with the union and all the issues surrounding the collective bargaining agreement. And so Eddie Dominquez was intrigued by that idea that there would be this autonomous unit. He still had his reservations because he had been asked several times while he was a to be a part of the security force full-time working for baseball. And he was had seen a number of issues, including the PD performance me drug issue, come up and baseball's turn a blind eye or trying to cover it up. And so he was hesitant about joining such a a unit, but what it was spelled out that it would be autonomous and the head of the unit. Dan Mullen, who was a four brand YTD told him, listen, we could do a lot of great things if if you come aboard. And so he did and one of the lowest enlightening, I think parts about the book is right at the beginning of the DO. I two thousand eight when it was established and Eddie Domingo's had joined it. He was told by baseball executive literally within the first couple of days of joining the unit. You're you're not wanted at all this unit is not this was only done to. Appease bud feeling because George Mitchell recommended it, but you should know that this unit nobody in baseball once you guys digging up or doing this job. And he could imagine what Eddie felt like hearing that within days of joining this unit where he thought that this would be this great next chapter of his professional career. And that's what he was greeted with. So that's a little bit of of certainly Tara. Talked a little bit too long. But Terry can definitely will tell me that I'm in. The more crystal. You know, for both Christian myself, a real pleasure to work with daddy told me, tell me this because this was one of the things that I was curious about how did you come across Idi to begin with? I mean, and let's not leave out. In addition to everything that you just mentioned fact that. Eddie is a survivor of pancreatic cancer. In the reason that I want to bring that to the attention of the listeners is this show, Nicole in myself lost a very good friend just a few months ago, Joel Silverman who unfortunately was not able to beat pancreatic cancer. It is a particularly tough not that any form is good. But particularly tough diagnosis and for him to beaten it. He must be quite a person to to reckon with. And I was just wondering how it was that you guys had come across him to begin with. Really? Yeah. Go ahead. Yeah. We had done. A lot of coverage has biogenesis. As well as all kinds of reporting to route the years with our sports investigative team that Christian mentioned beginning of two thousand and lasting all the whites twenty thirteen which quite a run of the issues facing baseball, including performance enhancing, drugs and are reporting Christian. Matt Eddie Eddie was never a a source for us during our newspaper work at long as he worked for major league baseball. He was not immediate friendly person that Christian managed to. And has a great bedside manner. He managed to to form of friendship, Patty. And then once he left or was fired for major league baseball, basically along with the entire group. Then we Chris reconnected with him. And and the story kind of goes on from there. I see so so he he ran this was in this investigative unit that was part of MLB. I mean, they they were self policing. Well, you know that always. Government government invest themselves, and that always turns out, right? So so in that case since the this department of investigation is wrapped up their investigations baseballs all clean now. Right. Course, of course. And. And the word for the end of the biogenesis investigation that Terry was looting to of course, if the nut show version for the readers, I mean for the listeners is that biogenesis was an anti aging clinic in Florida in Miami area. And it was run by me Bosch, it became sort of an epi center for distributing performances drugs to professional athletes, primarily in baseball. And it got caught up in both a baseball and then further federal investigation. And the end result. Was that outs? Rodriguez formally of the Yankees was the biggest name in the group of players that was suspended openly. And of course, his was the longest it was a season wrong suspension. But after the biogenesis case ended at least for baseball they immediately within a couple months after a-rod accepted his bam for this season of twenty fourteen. They gutted the DO I the department investigations by firing. Not only Eddie but his two supervisors and another investigator. And that was, you know, a head scratcher of for lack of a better word because here they had carried out this year's long investigation into this clinic and had delivered information that resulted in these suspensions of players, but there were ward was okay. Here's your pink slip. Well, the Christian now, let's be real about this don't they know at this point that even without that department of investigation. They have the ever vigilant bulldog like investigative capacity. That the major league Baseball Players Association exerts on all of its members. Because you, and I both know how strongly they clamped down on anybody that commits even the slightest type of offense. Correct. I mean, there were only what was it thirteen players that were represented by one agency in this biogenesis scandal and the Baseball Players Association looked at that. And they saw no coincidence there whatsoever. So they just let the the agents involved off with a reprimand. But oh, my God, the harshness of a reprimand it has completely devastated their business. I think they've only gotten a couple of your diet since then and made a few tens of millions of dollars. So with that type of harsh vigilant oversight. What do they need a department of investigation for right? Very true. Head terry. Going to say, I you're saying that. Just correctly too. I think I think one of the most interesting parts of odds of baseball cop, in my opinion is a department of investigations Atty. Screws relationship with the DA and sort of to your point David baseball, major league baseball reaction to that. Which was basically to hell the D ally. Stop sharing from Asian with the DA and the investigative people out of the summit district of Miami. What the department of Justice they went ahead and died several people and who accepted que- agreements for convictions. But I it's amazing to me. The the sort of inside story of how that all came down. Correct. Well baseball baseball has a long history with drugs. Okay. Before I ever was born players were taking Greenies, which are speed it because you're talking about in the old days. It was one hundred fifty four game schedule plus spring training, and they play every day with a few days off and the the wear and tear on their bodies made it in their minds impossible to get up for every game. So they got up and after Greenies the next big scandal in baseball came in the seventies. When a bunch of players happen to be using recreational drugs at that point more than performance enhancing drugs. Then after that there was the beginning of the performance enhancing drugs euro, and I have a personal story in regard to that in approximately two thousand the players association holds meetings at least a couple times a year with agent, so they can make believe they're actually doing something. And they're. During one of those meetings down fear who was the leader of the players association at that point got up and gave his his speech about what the state of the game and the Union's involvement in it. And after he got done. There was a break where we could get some, sandwiches and stuff. And while everybody else was eating I approached on fear. And I said done I have a client who will remain anonymous who has told me that he is one of the few players on his team that is not taking steroids. Now. This is something that is going to become very serious if you don't take care of it and take care of it right away. His response to me was this is not an issue for the union to deal with. And I said why is that he said because it's a privacy issue. And I said this is a union one of the prime functions of a union is to see to the well being of its members. There is reams and reams and reams of evidence showing that taking steroids for an extended period of time is very damaging to people's health. So this is a healthy. Hugh more than a privacy issue in you need to do something about it. The reaction. There was very similar to the scene in jaws where ROY Scheider is on the beach telling the mayor that you're not gonna do anything until shark swims up on the beach invite somebody in the ass, and it was a short while later Jose Conceico wrote his book about everybody in baseball being on steroids that morphed into the later investigations that you mentioned where in the government once again got involved and put George Mitchell in charge of an investigation and the result of that investigation was let's be honest about it a collective yawn. Nothing really happened. A few players caught some shit about it. Somebody lost it endorsement here. A few people got outed for having actually done steroids. But in terms of the actual impact on it. It was very minor. It wasn't really until what a couple of years after that that the instituted the joint drug greement, or whatever it was. And even that beginning was a joke. They were sensually letting the players know when they were coming to test them. So it wasn't until after biogenesis that they got a little bit more serious about it and really cracked down. But this is about more than just drugs because one of the most interesting things to me in Eddie's. Eddie's past if you will was what you had mentioned in regard to the barbershop scandal that to me is hilarious borderline keystone. Cops sort of thing. Can you? Give us the details on that, please. Because I think everybody will be interested in what happened there. Sure. What to say or? Well, the one thing that Eddie one of the things that Eddie encountered when he was the RSA prior to joining the DO I in two thousand eight was that there was a group of barbershops around the Boston area that eventually Boston PD started looking into because they had had tips in Eddie head informants. And sources Kelly him that these were facades for gambling operations undergrad gaming operations in the basement or some back room where as you would walk in and not think anything of it because it was the barbershop but eventually hid sources and the investigation and the leads lead to one of David Ortiz is inner. Circle. And the the entire episode is detailed in in baseball Cobb, but one of the exchanges, maybe David that. You're referring to is that. Eventually it came to a head where Eddie as the RSA and Dan Hailom. That's not the Jalan Jalan Kevin in who was the head of security for him. Oh, be at the time. So Kevin how any Dominquez Terry Francona who's the manager of the Red Sox at the time? And of course, we're tees off the team they all met in Francona -'s office, and it was laid out on the table. This is what we know. David ortiz. Can you say anything about it? He denied having any kind of connection to this individual in his alleged gambling habits. But no sooner had that meeting taking place. Then Eddie after leaving the meeting and going to next best nation. He got a call from his informant thing. Hey. What happened the the barbershop where this person who was in the entourage of David Ortiz has shut down and not uprated anymore, and they had gotten a call to see operations. Right. You know, right after that meeting had taken place that way park. So ultimately that individual was was deported and caught up in the in, you know, some serious beagle situation. But it was something where Eddie brought it to the attention of him OB. And it was not really addressed at all. And this is a gin before he joined the investigative unit in two thousand eight so already he was getting a sense of here's something I'm presenting to baseball as maybe an issue or something that they need to look into. And it was not done. Swept it under the rug and David Ortiz who was mentioned in the Mitchell report as well or he he may not have been made this Mitchell that one of the he was one of the that it was tested, and they were supposed to keep the urine specimen the secret. But it got leaked out no pun intended that he had tested positive. But yet David Ortiz is an icon in Boston. And no one ever mentioned his involvement with that. Also, speaking of deportations Eddie was also involved in player trafficking issue as well. Correct. Correct terrier if you what? Yeah. Sound off on that. Well, yeah, Eddie helping inside story of how players make their way to the US and intimate league baseball. It's quite all the, you know, a lot of the details. Very harrowing about how that works. So you know, he has a lot to say about the issues like permeate baseball on that issue. And how players end up getting to become free agents coming from Cuba as refugees, basically. And the facts fats are required to gain residency through third country in bulk goes on with that whole mass. Interestingly after our book was published stories began to emerge I from yahu, and then Sports Illustrated get a very good story on the Cur-. Current department of Justice investigation into this very issue. Well, there was a grand jury has been convened to look into baseball on that. And. You know, I think there I think that investigation is proceeding fairly quickly, and I'm managing cutting. A lot of angst among a lot of people in baseball. Also, would you? We also deal with the book was he was a government witness in a trafficking case that concluded last year and ended up with convictions of both defendants, but Eddie was called as a government witness. And it was again, some of the some of the issues issues that he had encountered while he was an investigator for baseball. And it was just interesting that after he was terminated from the department investigations that was the next sort of chapter. And again, it was happening while he was dealing with is health issues with cancer. But again, he he testified on stand in that case that involved. I don't know if that's some of that you ever came across David, but it was agents name bartered indis. In another dependent that was involved a train of type of job that that case resulted again in those two convictions, but domain and in many ways to what's been before does the, you know, the current federal grand jury investigating baseball. If you're just tuning in. You're probably going what the hell is going on. This is the nothing ever show. My husband David Sloan is here, and we're talking with a with Christian red and Terry Thomson two of the co authors of a new book called baseball cop the dark side of America's national pastime. So David is is handling most of the interview here because I know nothing about baseball other than. You know, they they hit the ball and they run around the bases run out and buy this book. So. Now is there an investigative unit within MLB anymore, or is anybody looking into all the the shady things that are going on today. Let's should ask that that the BU is still exists within baseball in after they commanded Eddie and the other members in twenty four teen they hired a four motor prosecutor federal prosecutor to take over the unit, but. We spell out the book, not only that that's a place. But it's interesting going back again to what Mitchell said in his original port that this unit will be this autonomous force within baseball to look under the rug to try and meet out wrongdoing or about fee since and once that started to happen when Eddie was a part of the unit baseball got very worried. So. The the interesting thing about it being gutted in twenty fourteen six years after it started. Is that baseball seems at least that presents in the book is that they didn't want their the very thing that deal. I was established do was not at all what base, but what to happen. So we feel like in Eddie again presents the book is that it was a unique experience it one of one of its kind in probably will be seen in that kind of composition again at any any professional sports league. Well, let's be honest about it. They didn't wanna cop. They wanted a janitor to sweep this under the rug and and get rid of it. And one thing I can tell you baseball certainly is not investigating at this point is the legal use of medical marijuana by its players in order to deal. Oh with the various pain that they have to deal with. It's the same in every other sport. There is some concerns about it. Because you've got teams in California. You've got teams in Washington you've got teams in Colorado all of which have recreational marijuana as well as medical marijuana and along with the other states where there is medical marijuana as well. But they would rather give a player a shot or have him take some sort of painkillers rather than do something. That is natural not habit forming and very effective as well. I I wish there was some way of getting through to these Neanderthals. But it just doesn't seem like they're like they're liable to hire Jeff Sessions to run the next investigation. Go with anybody might actually good. So. Harry. Thank you very much. I I've enjoyed this greatly to the audience. I hope you enjoyed your somewhat. It's a nice changeup. From all of this bullshit that cadet bone Spurs is making us go through at the current moment. Chris and Terry Thompson book is called baseball cop. The dark side of America's national pastime. I'm sorry, Terry. What are you saying? I wanted to one thing about Eddie is that you had mentioned the pancreatic cancer, and the the very huge problem that is, but he's a big advocate of finding at your pants cryonic cancer and is participating in a couple of advance in Boston one member third one on number eight to raise awareness and son rights for research. You know, he's been lucky, and he no one is a bigger Amtrak for that than you have my Email address if you have any. Mation on those events in them to me, and I can see to it that they'll get into the Facebook group that followed Joel Silverman in his fight. And I'll see if I can get my wife to put it on her website. I think I can do that. All right. We're just about out Christian ran in Terry Thompson. Thank you so much for joining us and to the listeners, thanks for indulging us of you. Thank you have a great weekend. Everyone.

baseball Matt Eddie Eddie Donald Trump US David David Sloan America Terry Nicole Sandler New York Twitter Terry Thompson Eddie Dominguez department of Justice Florida Trump Union Boston Yankees George Mitchell investigator
Episode 334: Patrick Radden Keefe

Longform Podcast

1:01:34 hr | 1 year ago

Episode 334: Patrick Radden Keefe

"Hey before we get going. I want to tell you about our sponsor this week. It's a podcast called breach. So breach is a podcast that takes you inside the world's biggest hacks. How they were done why they were done what's at stake. Other second season is about the biggest breach of all time the equifax hack on which they lost over one hundred and forty five million social security numbers. If this sounds like a scandal that you would find entertaining listen to season two of breach the equifax story. This time it's personal on the podcast app of your choice. Just search for breach. B R E A C H also bringing you the show this week. It's squarespace. They're the only place to take your idea into a reality. They make it easier than ever to launch a passion project. Even if you're selling something or a blog. Whatever it is. They've got a beautiful template for that allows you to customize just about anything. And if you get stuck there twenty four seven Ord winning customer support will be there to help go to squarespace dot com slash long form, and you will get a free trial. And if you do end up launching the site use the offer code long form and you'll save ten percent off of your first purchase of a website or Demane. Here's the show. Hello and welcome to the long foreign podcast. I'm Evan Ratliff. Here's max linski. Here's Aaron Lamour. I hate you guys. Hey, hey. Repeat guest, repeat guests, our old friend Patrick Radin, Keefe who was on a pretty early show. I would say I I wanna say episode seven, but that could be wrong while sounds earlier than I even was thinking talking. I'll look it up. He is he's out of the New Yorker he has a book out right now called say nothing, which is about the troubles in Northern Ireland. But as we talked about at some length, it's not actually a book just about the troubles. It's also murder mystery of sorts. It's an amazing book. I wanted him back to talk about it. And he had a lot of fascinating. Because to say as always he previously wrote as the snakehead, which is incredible book about a human smuggling ring based in New York City's own Chinatown. And he's also had a really great run of New Yorker stories that we dropped in on those as well. Incredible run pro like a prolific run. Yes. Episode twenty for the record of episode twenty you know, who's been supporting this show since before. Episode twenty mail chimp? I think they were at that point. I'm advertising tiny letter. Now, they are encouraging you to go full-size letter with an Email newsletter from male champ won't even cost you anything up until you reach a certain number of subscribers. So there's no reason not to start one today. Thank you mail chip. Here's Evan Patrick Keith. Welcome back to the long-term podcasts. Great to do back. I think it was seven years ago. Was it that law was twenty twelve. I don't know if we've reached the seven year, Mark. It was everything was different as ran. It was like a lifetime ago. But you you've been busy just a name a couple of things you basically for someone to resign from their position in the Trump administration for one thing you've written a ton of stories and send an too many for us to cover. But also, you have this book out called say nothing, which I have to say I would read this book anyway, 'cause I know you, but if you had told me in the abstract there's a book about the troubles. And it covers you know, this historical period. I think I would have I don't think it would read it. You know, like, I know enough about this. I know Gerry Adams like, I know George Mitchell. Like, I know what happened. Yeah. Probably could not get me to read history of the troubles. And so when I did start reading it it blew my mind because it was it just showed me like if you can get close enough to something, and you can get close enough to the characters that you can just complete. Was completely wrapped into the story. So gone that way. So I want to talk with the book first. And then there are some articles that I want to talk about, but you don't sort of show up in the book until the end. And when you do talk about, you know, having Irish heritage, but not really being tied to Ireland and sort of getting into the story. And I I kinda wanted to start there. Like what made you pick up the story from a reporter's perspective in the first place. Yeah. So I mean, part of the reason I did that at the end says thirty chapters in the book and the first twenty nine or kind of historical omniscient, I'm not in there at all. You don't even get the New Yorker style. You know, Evan told me and then chapter thirty starts in the first person. And there are a couple of reasons for that. I mean was that I I had made a discovery had to describe a first person which we can talk about. But but part of it was actually weirdly that my British publisher had said, you gotta talk about your name. And she just said, you know, she. Yeah. She said a book about the troubles by. A guy named Patrick kief? If you don't address it people will will draw conclusions one way or the other. And so on some level. I what I wanted to do is just deal with it and set it aside, and essentially say my father's grandparents came over, you know, in the nineteenth century. So that's the extent of my connection to Ireland. And you don't have a side. I don't have aside. And that was important for me. I mean for variety of reasons in part because I think that the the sort of outsider perspective actually ends up being important to the book. So I wanted to make that clear and hers of how I came to it got. I mean, I came to it in the context of my day job. I was looking around for pieces in the New Yorker in twenty thirteen this woman died her name was Dolores price on her face on the cover of the book, and she'd had this completely over the top life. She grew up in unto kind of IRA family, going back generations and. In the late nineteen sixties she sort of rebelled against her parents who were these big IRA supporters, and she wanted to peacefully protest and bring about change in Ireland through peaceful protest. But when she went out to do that, she went on this big peaceful March and she got beaten up in an ambush. She joins the IRA and becomes the first woman to be the sort of like a real frontline soldier in the group and leads the bombing mission to London and get caught and goes to prison and goes on hunger strike and comes out of prison in Mary's a movie snobbery, just Yash and became this kind of. Yeah. Real almost a kind of pinup for a certain type of radical politics at that time. And then the thing that was most appealing to me was that in two thousand thirteen marina Fituri, and in her final years, she had looked back and started to reconsider some of the things she did when she was young, and she was very traumatized. And so that was kind of an appealing idea the notion that you could track somebody's life. You can sort of look at the whole sweep of the troubles through a handful of lives. Not just her. Mothers. But also, I had just kind of wondered, you know, you're twenty years old, and you're out there on the frontlines fighting a what you perceive to be a righteous fight. But how do you feel about those things you did when you're forty and you're married, and you've got kids how do you feel when you're in your fifties? And you're looking back so the opportunity to sort of track a handful of lives over decades seemed appealing and when we talked so many years ago, you know, we talked about getting into the stories where it's difficult to get people to talk and these networks, whether it's inside the government or or criminal networks, but this one seemed to offer this particular challenge, it seemed to me from reporting perspective where I mean, these are people who there's a whole culture of not not just not speaking to the press but being killed for being accused of being tout of an informant, and there's a lot in the book about, you know, people who are in fact murdered. For that. And so when you started what kind of approach did you have in terms of now, you're gonna show up an Ireland's, and you're going to go to former revolutionaries are even some of them, you know, still still involved in the struggle and say, okay, I'm I'm here from America with an Irish name. Do you mind if I record this? Yes, where did how did you find your way into that world? Slowly, I mean, look on some level. I. This was probably true. Last time we talked in its if anything more true now, I do right around all the time. I like doing them, I think magazines shoot assign more of them. So I'm not daunted by the prospect of doing a big piece of writing in which the central figure or figures won't talk to me or as in the kids in this book. Some of them are dead. The reporting process, and this was weird just because at the heart of the book, it's really about two women. So there's Delors price who had described and then this woman Jean McConnell who was a mother of ten and a widow in Belfast living in a housing project and in nineteen seventy two she disappeared and the gang of people came into replacement. They dragged her out in front of her children. They said she would be back that they just wanted to talk to her, but she never came back. And it was the IRA the took her and killed her. And part of what happens in the book is that she meet these two different women, and you realize that their fates are intertwined Dolores prices went up having something to do with that murder. And what was strange for me is that this happened before I was born it happened almost half a century ago. And I would go to Belfast and start asking people about it. And you could see the fear on people's faces. And so this notion that this event that's older than I am still felt so radioactive in the present day. Was challenging from a reporting point of view. But also at every step along the way made me feel as though it was good that I was doing this project that this was not a kind of inert stale history story, I was telling it was a story about something that was kind of vivid and palpable and menacing even now and did you have access to her family her kids from the beginning? Or is that something you had to work into as you went along to hit some time. Some of them did some of them didn't some of them wanted to talk at the beginning. And then not subsequently her kids are incredibly traumatize. These are ten children who were orphaned with one squeeze of the trigger back in nineteen seventy two and they ended up in orphanages awful things happen to some of them and some of those orphanages some of wrestle with drugs, alcohol PTSD, you know, the best I can do is try and go in and be as sensitive as possible and tell them what I tell everyone, which is that I want to get the truth. Of the story and as much as I can keep coming back. You know, that I I'm sort of the the shoe leather reporting thing means a lot to me, and I'll try and do the story Justice. So in any culture where there's kind of an ambition of talking. This intensive the case with me, it's all sideways, right? So I got to know some people who knew them. And I made the case to these friends of theirs, and they then pass it along. And then there was a slow process of feeling me out. There's an unbelievable scene with one of the kids getting into it. I think a tax have is driven by one of the people that he recognizes was one of those people that took his mother way when he was a kid. It's just like I had to put down at that moment and gathering those types of stories. I mean, did you feel that you were things came pouring out when you got people to talk like they'd been waiting to talk about this for years, or you're prying loose. No mean things came out. It's very I mean, look the. Some of this is quite specific Northern Ireland, and maybe even to Belfast, but looks called say nothing the title is from ashamed. Teeny palm, whatever you say say nothing and on the one hand, it's true that there's this culture of silence on the other hand, everybody talks, and they often talk beautifully. You know, there is definitely a poetry in the language over there, which has reporters kind of amazing because you sit there with your notebook and. People say these things that in your wildest dreams, you wish that that the people you normally interview and your day job could be particularly. But you know, it's funny when I went over there the first time, I talk to David remnant, my boss, and he had gone. He had gone twenty years earlier to write a piece about the peace process and Gerry Adams for the New Yorker, and as I was leaving Belfast that first time said you're gonna love it. It's reporters dream. It's just like Israel, everybody talks talks talks talks to and it wasn't quite that. Straightforward. I mean, I often had to it often took. Fairmont coaxing, get people to sit down and talk to me. But when they did those surreal details like that scene in the taxi did come tumbling out. And that I think is a feature of just the kind of place Belfast is that it's so small, and so you have you have a place where there was this three decade war, basically. And then piece came and everybody's still lives right next door to each other. And so inevitably you get these kind of surreal, and counters, and and you you grappled a something that I I have struggled with recently, which is just you obviously have an incredible depth of reporting in here. But you also have people's memories, and you're dealing with memories of people who sometimes, you know, in the case of the sort of like revolutionaries in winter, they get older and they appear St. and they misremembered things or they they're drinking. There's all these complexities. In terms of how you figure out what really happened, and I felt like you sort of dealt with that in the text a little bit. But I'm interested in as a broader view. How do you solve the problem? You can't solve it. But like how do you approach the problem of you've got all these memories? And oftentimes they conflict, right? Yeah. So I mean, this was a big that I thought about this all the time. So part of what I was trying to do with the book is right, something that's. A great read. And I think about this with my pieces to like, I don't take for granted for a second the attention of any reader, and I feel always wanting to work for that. And one oddity of the troubles is that there's this vast literature. There's so many books it's so daunting your bibliography. I mean, it's ridiculed test is. Yeah. And I've read them all and, but the strange thing is there aren't that many great books, and I think there's a bunch of reasons for that a lot of which come down to kind of craft questions, and how you tell the story. So part of what I was trying to was keep the narrative, very fluid and lean and the hard thing is you're in a situation in which a there's exactly what you're talking about. Which is. People remember things differently. There's differences opinions. And then be it's this incredibly vexed political situations. He tell the story of any given incident. And if you tell the Republican point of view while the loyalists of an entirely different take, everyone has their own facts. Yeah, exactly they do. And so the challenge for me was how you deal that. Because if you start introducing all those caveats in the text itself you kill the book. The benign is being will not read it and. Where I came out was that I occasionally will introduce differing interpretations or Bilden small qualifications in there. A lot of them are kind of almost hidden in the tax. You'll see them if you're reading closely some people would later recall, if I'm saying that it's implicit that others might have a difference of opinion. And then in the notes all those qualifications are are there. So what I had to do is kind of pick. What seemed like the most plausible version of the truth tell that? And then there's one hundred pages of end notes. So if you're inclined to a more scholarly approach, it's all there. It's just in the back. But I've just been thinking about this a lot because I feel like the Pat answer to that is always some little say will you just check it. You check it. If your mother says, she loves you check it. But these types of stories, and you're talking to people about things they did twenty years ago or even ten years ago, and the what we know about memory like some things are not possible. Jack in the question is should you not use it at all? Because you can't check that this person was in this meeting at this date at this time. Yeah. I mean, I could give you a boy there's so many specific examples of that dilemma, but I'll give you one. There's a guy who's a minor character in the book name, Francine, mcguigan and Francy was an IRA member. He was a friend of that woman to Laura's price. And he was one of about a dozen guys who got picked up in nineteen seventy one by the British and basically taken away and tortured. These guys it's became famous case, they're known as the hooded, man. And it's kind of eerily reminiscent of what happened actually with the US torture program. But basically, they the British army targeted these guys they put hoods over their heads. They put them in helicopters. They brought them to kind of undisclosed location, and then they subjected them to a whole series of techniques, which look a lot like what we were doing to people in places like a gray and black sites and Afghanistan. So I interviewed Francey his one guy still around sweet. Older man, and I interviewed other people who were among the hooded man with him. But I also looked back at all the interviews at he's given over the decades. And there's this moment where he's in the helicopter with a hood of his head, and he doesn't know where they're going, and here's the helicopter door open and the helicopter still moving. It's in the air, and suddenly he's pushed out, and you've got holdovers heads who does know how high they are turns out helicopters hovering just over the ground. And in some accounts, Francine McGregor talks about falling out and bouncing off the ground and others. He talks about falling out and getting caught almost immediately by people who were there and. It's hard right because that's an incredibly vivid moment. And I want it to sing on the page. But I need to kind of pick version, you know, it's not gonna work at all. If I say, that's how it could have happened. But it might have also happened like this. And so what I did not instances. And there's a bunch of these is I tell you about him coming out and getting caught. And then you go to the end notes, and I say he has told the story, you know, multiple different ways over the years. Not to me that doesn't mean he's on reliable. This was an incredibly traumatic experience in their studies on this. You know, memory is complicated. When you have these types of moments. So I think the most truthful approach that I could come up with is I'm gonna tell it the way that it seems to me most likely had happened and then build on all those qualifications in the box. Erin, you're cohost I'm gonna pause things here briefly to tell you a little bit about this week sponsor, squarespace scarfs. Based makes it easier than ever to launch a project that you are passionate about could be a new business a showcase for your work place to publish content, sell stuff, whatever it doesn't really matter. Squarespace is the right tool for just about everything they've got beautiful templates by world-class designers. They let you customize them e commerce analytics optimized for mobile, and if any of it is unclear to they have twenty four seven award winning customer support. They have empowered millions of people from designers to lawyers to artists. Gamers restaurants, gyms all of them have used squarespace to turn a great idea into something. Real so go to squarespace dot com slash long for. For a free trial. And we ready to launch us the offer code long form and you'll save ten percent off your first purchase of a website or Demane again. Squarespace dot com slash long form offer code long-form. Thank you to squarespace. They've supported the show for a long time. And we appreciate it. Here is Evan back with Patrick Ravin chief. How many times did you? Go seven. How do you make time for that as someone who has entered and now, and I know that you have children, I'm interested in the just the basic logistics of going to Ireland severed times over how long was the warriors over four years complicated. I mean, 'cause I have two kids I will wife who's got a busy dob and actually until recently she had a job until the live travel for her. So we sort of joked that you know, we'd. Like pass each other JFK and the children back and forth. I don't know. I mean, it was a challenge, but I- squeezed in trips that would be you know, I did trips that were short as four days and then trips that were as long as almost two weeks numb. And yet, I don't really know how I did it to be honest with you because I was juggling the money order pizzas as well. But I would just occasionally have to kind of carve out something and there were moments where there were court hearings or the re people who suddenly agreed to talk to me after long periods of time. So there were these decisive points on the calendar where I just knew and just, you know, my wife understood and accommodated the idea that you know, if I say, oh, jeez. This thing just happened six weeks from now, I gotta be in Belfast. And I would generally have that kind of notice not someone calling up and saying okay now tomorrow, I'm ready to talk to. Yeah. That hap- that happened. I think once maybe twice over. The four years where I had a very short the thing that happened. That's funny. I mean, these are the things that nobody ever talks about they matter so much really late in the game. When I had already been when I was almost done with the book. Norwegian air started flying this incredibly cheap flight direct to Belfast from from the airport of Newburgh, New York, and it's like two hundred and fifty bucks roundtrip. Incredible. It's very no-frills about Newburgh. I did. No. I know it was the all roads come back to Newburgh. But it was one of those this is like a year ago. They started doing this in completely changed my life because it was so cheap and terrific and convenient than them Newburgh had an airport much less than national Stewart airport. It's the new Norwegian hub. They're gonna sponsor the podcast week to squash him. I would tell everybody. It's fantastic. If you're going to Ireland they have flights to different locations on in both the north and the south. So there's there's a certain level of ambition to the book in terms of it's what it's trying to do. So it's trying to capture the lives of these revolutionaries and sort of how they moved through really their whole lives. And it's also got this kind of murder murder mystery OEMs makes light of it. But it has a murder at the center of it. And I'm curious at what point you knew did, you know from the beginning that you wanted to try to capture both of those strands, and then there's also the sort of there's the politics and the IRA and everything else, which is more woven in it's not like separated out into expository sections on chapters. But all of that is in there that sort of raises the risk of like it not working. You know, like when you go that big. And I'm curious if you knew from the beginning, that's what you wanted to do, and you were always driving towards that. Or that came along in the process that was always the ambition. I mean, it was helpful that this prog. Started as a fifteen thousand word New Yorker article. And when I started the piece, I didn't know I wanted to a book. But by the end of the piece, I knew I did. And that was a bit of a proof of concept and the idea from the beginning had done. I don't want to write a history of the troubles. I want to approach this the way you would approach novel. So you have really kind of behalf a dozen characters and their lives all intersect, and we're going to follow them, you know, really over four decades. And that was a there was a there was a high risk of failure in that. But I thought that if you could do it, right? You would get a lot of the history of the troubles. And you would get a the story of a murder and the way in which it kind of ties together these different people. So that you'd have something that was gave you political history and a certain amount of pulpy true crime. And there's a lot of spy-versus-spy kind of espionage and intrigue in there. And that if you could we've all this today. Gather they might be satisfying. And I'm glad to hear you say that you wouldn't have picked up a book about the troubles. Because in a way the thing. I kept telling myself was the last thing you want to do is read a book for somebody who's already rent ten books about the troubles. You were running this repeal who have never had a book about the troubles. And may never another one. And if you can do it in an accessible way, you might have something. Yeah. I'm I feel bad for the whoever the biographer varies by refers of Gerry Adams, like I would not read a biography Gerry Adams, but especially it would not ruin after reading this book because I feel like I understand something about Gerry Adams through this book that I might not learn from of sort of potted biography of him, even though you never talk to him. Right. That was part of it was to try and get close enough to these people even the one. So I didn't talk to and see them in. It's not that. I I'm not judgmental, but come in with an openness to try to see things from their point of view that would allow for different readings of the book. So I did a reading two nights ago and somebody who's been reading the book such Gerry Adams is clearly just a villain here. He comes across as this almost satanic figure, and then I did a podcast yesterday with David plots. And he was like it's impossible to read this book and not come out thinking that Gerry Adams, fundamentally did the right thing. And that ROY shark quality was very much what I was aiming for. Did you feel like you needed an answer in terms of the murder in order for the book to work? No, not at all. And this was both the most exhilarating experience of Herat as a reporter. But also just a huge surprise for me. So I. I wanted to know more about the circumstances in the murder, and I got to a point where I'd worked out Delors prices involvement. And I had a sense of another person who is involved, and I knew there was a third individual. And I knew the third individual was the shooter. And that wasn't a huge holy grail for me. Because I always assumed that that third person was just anonymous IRA gunmen number three and just some. Slay the random person to go back to what I was saying what approaching it like a novel. So the test for me in terms of weather, something went into the book was did one of my characters experience. It has all kinds of really interesting and important things about the troubles that aren't in the book very much because they didn't impact in a very kind of first order way the characters that I'm writing about. So for me, if it turned out that the person who shot g McConnell was some random dude, who you know, whose name I might have heard him passing. But who wasn't one of the people I was focusing on. I didn't really care as much. And the big surprise was when I did make this discovery almost by accident. Just because we're two different sources had given me these two different puzzle pieces, and they happen to fit together. And the person who had turned out to be with somebody who actually was already a character book. Very much to my surprise. What was the moment of realization like? I mean, I was at home alone in my home office reading a transcript of an unpublished interview. This was the craziest thing as reporter. I'm sure you've had this to were you. I got in this interview which had wanted to get for years and had never been published, and it was Lord price talking in great detail about her life thirty pages, single spaced or something. Yeah. With this journalist who. Yes. And you get it in your so hungry for it's why immediately went through. And I kind of I was zooming in on all the stuff that seemed great, and I had highlight or something. And then after dental my highlighting the next day. I went back and with a pen went through looking only at the highlighted sections. And so I'm drilling even further down on the stuff. And then I'm going through a little stars an exclamation points. And deciding what's going to go in the book, and it all goes in the book and was only at the very very end when I thought God, did I miss anything on that? I pass. So the book was finished. And I went back, and I looked at this one section of the transcript that I had just kind of glossed over before. And right there was I mean, all all the analogies are pretty hackneyed. But it was as if somebody else had given me a lock and then suddenly I see the key. It's the an it perfectly fits. Yes. This fact pattern that this other person had given me. So I I think I started shouting I myself. It never happens. A we're in the moment with the people are always like St. sitting at the computer without associated writers acting. I sort of looked around. And you know, my my dog looks up at me, just you know, wondering what's happening. There is nobody to to share it with. Well, that's both that's exhilarating to hear. But also terrifying. Because I think about that a lot where you go through something you find some, especially document. And then you oftentimes don't go through at another time or you are you you are just pulling out this stuff. And then you know, I would get the end when I was working on my own book sort of be like a lot of this shit. Like, no one's ever gonna look at it. Again. I'm the I might be the last person to like look at this in this detail. And what did I there's no time for me to go read it all again that is now lost will this is. Did you read that you probably read that the Robert Caro thing in the New Yorker recently haven't seen yacht about the the archives, but he has his admonition is he says turn every damn page. And that's. I mean in his case, it's an archive with millions of pages. So you do wonder I was I literally managed miss something in a thirty page document. So thank God. I went back to it. I mean, the one thing I would say as much as I just want to emphasize because tone was a tricky thing in this book. And so look, obviously, I was tremendously excited, but I was also finding out the identity of a person who killed the mother of these people who have come to know in my reporting, and at a certain point, I was going to have to tell them. And so I don't wanna as a reporter. I felt a certain amount of glee, but at the same time, there was also this sense that you know, the a sense of gravity set. It right. Yeah. And I I would think throughout the reporting process you're holding sort of those those emotions near head at immunization. It is exciting to uncover things. But at the same time, you're in covering things that are horrible for some of the people that are involved. Yeah. And look into the writing with the book, this was tricky too because the nature of some of the. Genres that I like to play around with mean to crime, and there's a whole series of pretty seductive narrative techniques that that you can employ. And I'm a big believer in those. But you wanna do it in a way that you don't lose sight of the human cost associated with these things. There's also this archive which I when I was got to the end in the last third. I felt that the the archive was like the first time and archives ever been used as a cut of like Chekhov's gun like archive appears of the very beginning. Like, oh, look at this this nice archive. But I also at first I thought, oh, this is where he got that. He must have gotten so much reporting out of this. And then you get a little bit further. And you realize you didn't how frustrating was it did not get access to the archive. Yeah. Here's the frustrating. I mean, it was is very much the the final scene of the raiders of less dark, right? And yeah, I did have. Access to one complete unredacted interview from the archive Skype. Brendon Hughes is a big character in the book. And it's an amazing. You know, it's three hundred pages of him talking about many of the events and characters in the book. But of course, having that and seeing how precious resource that was I think to myself my God, what if I could have gotten these others. But on the way, you could have been drowning. I mean, you never you always want to have too much actually it was realistic to when we talk last time we talked about over reporting stories, but it could make for a different book and not necessarily a better book in some ways. Well, yeah, look, I would always rather have too much in. Then have me be the one that makes the choice about what goes into, and what doesn't but to go back to what I was saying earlier about the the weakness of some of the literature on the troubles. I think I think there's an embarrassment of riches problem, which is that these stories are so dramatic, and you have these strange qualities because the places so small where everybody connects in some way, she performed so you have different. Characters but they all bounce off each other. And I think there's been a tendency in the literature to get a little bit encyclopedic. Because there's so many great stories to tell and for me the trick. Here was actually cutting things out. So I do think if I had had access to the whole archive that would have been there would have been attempting to say, particularly if I had exclusive access to it. There would have been a temptation to say will boy, there's this amazing stuff about this historical event, which actually is kind of only tangentially to what I'm doing here. And I would have had to fight that the owes an obligation to use every great tale that was that's in those archives yet. But I look I've so I've been working with the same magazine editor for thirteen fourteen years and downs Leschi the New Yorker, and I think one thing that I learned from him along the way to a point where it's internalized. Now, I feel like I have. As a less in my head is. You go out, and you do a ton of reporting or there's some concept in a story that seems hard to get your mind around and you spend three or four days talking to experts and reading up on the literature. And then you've got it. And I think for a long time, I had a tendency to want to on some level to say to the reader like, look, my did my homework, you know, I've gotten this and now so can you and he's always just been merciless about asking. If we really need that stuff. Do we need five hundred words of exposition here? Or can you do this in a sentence or two and the better I've gotten at cutting that stuff out the more surprised I am by how well things work without it. I had one more question about the archives sort of about a question. But one of the fascinating things about the archives as they appear in the book is that just to give a little background. You can correct me in by gets in the garage. But they basically had this archive of Boston College where they they went and interviewed people from both sides of the troubles. And they used people who had been involved to sort of conduct the interviews. And that he said that these interviews would not come to light until after the people died, right? And then there's this incredible moment where they start to realize that they have not thought through even what that means that is it after everyone dies, or is it after that person dies. And it seemed to me there were I don't know if you meant to convey this, but they were actually just lessons there about how you tell people stories, and how you capture people's stories, and the sort of thought that needs to go into what you're doing when you do that which they clearly did not spend enough time thinking through and I'm wondering if that if you also think through that process like the process of collecting the stories for this book. And what it means for these people or you try to keep out of your mind, how they're going to respond to what this is going to mean for them so alive and question. Yeah. Glen, the murder that you identify. Yes. Still alive? Yes. I think it would be responsible not to be mindful of that sort of thing. And certainly, you know other resources I had to protect head to think about. It's hard right because I went back and forth back and forth. And I spent a lot of time over there. But at the same time, I don't live there. I don't have to go back and live in Belfast. And and these people do so that doesn't mean I'm not going to name the person who murdered gene Makonde Bill, whatever discomfort that may cause for that person. But it does mean that there's all kinds of instances in which there were certain punches that I pulled because I realized that putting something in the book would expose the person who gave it to me, which would create. A terrible situation for them there other instances in which people I mean, there's a guy Anthony McIntyre who was a big source for me in the book, and he's a character in the book. And when I mentioned, the lock and the key ethnic McIntyre gave me the law, and you know, he he said, I know who murdered gene McConnell, and I won't tell you the name ever. But here's a clue about that person's identity. And after I made that discovery I told you about I flew back to meet with Anthony and his wife, and we had dinner, and I said, okay, you gave me that lock while I have this key, and I put them together, and I figured this out, and we had a strange conversation, right? Because I would I said was I'm going to publish this name. And if there's reason why shouldn't you need to tell me, why should and he gave me all kinds of reasons. But none of them were that I was wrong. And he never acknowledged. He would never say to me. Yes. It is this person. But he also is an honest guy who wasn't going to lie to me about something. That is true. I probably created a lot of discomfort for him. I'm sure there are people who are not happy about the fact that he gave me the first piece, but I wasn't gonna hold that back. And he knew what you were doing he Demi. He was fully informed of what you're going to do. Yeah. Well, I wanna go back. Once I can says, something you said you had source you need to protect and that sometimes you would hold information back that would identify them or or caused them some difficulty. And my question is is that information that they identified or that you identified because my struggle is always people will say don't burn me. But they will then give you information that you actually can't necessarily tell if it will burn them or not they're not being careful in the question is your responsibility to be careful on their behalf. And how do you even know what will get man I deal with this all the time? I just dealt with this big way on a recent piece for the New Yorker, but the. It's hard. I mean, I I don't think there's any one size fits all thing. And I I tend to feel differently about. People in Belfast. A lot of people are dealing with people who don't have a ton of experience dealing with the press, and I often will build in a little bit of a handicap there, I just recently did a piece I don't wanna go into too much detail. But where there were some people who were taking risks telling me certain things, but they were people who were much more sophisticated players, and you know, people who have lawyers have money and have dealt with the press. And and I was less inclined to make allowances for them and sort of feel like, hey helped me, protect you. Because you're obviously not protecting yourself that. I would be with somebody who is less savvy the game. I mean at the end of the day. I don't what I always tell people is the recorders rolling. I'm taking notes here. If he wants to be off the record tell me it's off the record. But you have to know that when I sit down to read the piece, I'm not going to be point punches on your. Yeah. I bet that we talked about this before actually at our previous conversation than they forget they do. They forget fifteen minutes later. They forget. Yeah. And then you're stuck with how often to remind them. Like, what is the response for reminding them? You know, what this is this is funny? We're getting a little meta here. But before we sat down, I was saying I thought that when we did that last podcast I had been working on the Bishop peace while we you know, I was working on it hadn't come out yet. And if I talked about that on that podcast. That's what I was thinking about any of the ships parents because I had had this experience where I went and spent a lot of time with them. She was a she was a we should say. So she was a professor at the university of Alabama who in twenty ten shot. She was mass shooter she shot series of her colleagues. And after that happened it emerged that when she was a teenager. She had shot and killed her own brother at the family home in Massachusetts. And there had been one witness to this. It was her mother Judy Bishop, and she came in and immediately set us all the whole thing. It was an accident. And for this piece. I was writing a lot about the parents of any Bishop would lost one son. And then, you know, their daughter had become this mass shooter later in their requests in my mind about what they knew about the circumstances and from brother's death, and whether it had been covered up, but I was spending all this time with them, and they would. Speak in this very raw and personal way. And I would say to them. I would remind them if you wanna go off the record you just say off the record because otherwise. This could go in and they would say, yes, yes. We know we know and we would talk for another twenty minutes, and then they would stray back into that terrain. And so some of those moments in the piece that are very very raw where they're not just talking to me, but they're talking between the two of them or moments that I'm sure were painful for them later to see in print, but I don't know what more I can do like at the end of the day might at the point where my duty is to them and not to the truth. I'm not really a journalist anymore, right? Well, let's talk about I want to talk about a couple of other stories says being of writer rounds this Mark Burnett story was wild to me because I feel like it's one of those that so Mark Burnett being the the person who started the apprentice. And it's like been out there since Trump started running much, less got elected. And no one did it because he won't talk like that. Yeah. It's literally why that story has not been told he he's no wanna talk to anyone about. And so what made you decide that you could be the person who could go do it. Hubris? I mean, I don't know. That'd be. Yeah. Fi. I just felt as though he would I saw was somebody who had quite cleverly and deliberately he's written himself out of the picture and the more I dug into it the more. I felt like this guy is sort of the author of the Trump presidency in a strange way. I mean, there's Trump before the apprentice and Trump after pre you make a very good case that pre apprentice Trump is not running for anything much less being elected to well. He would periodically announced that he was running for president. But he wasn't going to yet. But the notion of Trump as a and you talk to people who were out on the campaign trail, and they will tell you all across the country that there are millions of Americans who by the notion of Trump as a tremendously successful business genius. And that was a an idea that really entered the cultural mainstream outside the tristate area with with the apprentice. So look, I mean on some of all. I wrote a big piece of the Sackler family, and Oxycontin, and that was somewhat analogous in the sense that they're again, you had prominent figures in society, kind of representing themselves as one thing which in the case of the Sackler is was this big philanthropic dynasty whose name, you know, his all over art, museums and universities and they're known for their giving. And in fact, most of their money comes from their company Purdue pharma, which priest Oxycontin and was responsible for helping spark the opioid crisis. And they assiduously kept their name in the former realm of Ghana's and. Art world museum academic type circles and off of the ladder, which is overdoses and death. And I feel like with Burnett was a similar thing that once Trump got elected Burnett and Trump remained close, but he carefully was you know, you sort of distancing himself without disowning Trump. And when you start one of these pieces, and you're talking to Daniel your editor, are you saying from the beginning that he's not gonna talk is going to be right around. Are you saying hopefully, we can get him? But if we can't I can still do it, or what are the sort of parameters at which you enter that piece was Daniel's idea. So he suggested it, and I think we both thought it was pretty unlikely that Burnet would talk I made the I made the case. And it's a funny thing, I always I have a whole little spiel about why people should talk to me. And there's often. A moment where they clearly think I'm being insincere. I'll say look, here's why I think it's actually in your interest to talk to me, and they always come back with some version of all. Of course, you're gonna say that. Because all you want is the interview and on some level at this point. I'm like read my stuff. I honestly I don't care like you can you can show up or not show up. I'm gonna write the piece, and you know, you saying no is not going to stop this. And so truly it is better for you to come in and talk. I would think I mean, I don't and so somebody like Mark burnett's case ride. It's very often the case that these people will try and stage managing interview as much as they can. They'll say, oh, we want to do this on background here. The areas you can talk about an I wouldn't have agreed to an interview with him in which he said, I'll talk to you about anything, but Donald Trump. I would have just said forget it there with Tom the and those are the ground rules. Anytime you read an interview with Mark Burnett. You need to know. And he gives them all the time about his shows that those journalists have submitted to those rules when they go in to me, the idea that it's like, okay. So there's only so much real estate in a piece and any place where I'm quoting you today, telling me, whatever your messages is someplace where I'm not going to be looking back at other things you've said in the past or interviewing other people talking about you, I two anyway, you could push out even if you don't convince me you can actually just take up space. Yeah. But some people make Carl I can't did Tartu. You did for like one dollars. Yes. Yes. Yeah. I don't I think it's almost. Always people's interests to talk, and they they never believe me when I tell them that. But it's you know, it's fine nights too. I should say I mean, I still it's not that I would ever hit anybody any harder because they didn't participate. I still try and give them as fair shit because I can I don't wanna draw to stark contrast. But I mean, it is the case that I feel like the Carl I can piece it was fairly well established that like he resigned his unpaid adviser position or was pushed out or whatever happened. Like right before the story came out probably because he knew the story was coming out and the Burnett one it's not the opposite. But it's like that guy seems untouchable like you can drop all that on him. And he just sort of like us along at forgets about it. Then interested in what especially with those types of stories. Are you going for that impact? I mean, I don't these are interesting days for journalism, right? Because on the one hand you do have a kind of high impact journalism. And you look at Jane Mayer, and Ronan Farrow and their slaying giants left and right. I mean, Harvey Weinstein les Moonves Schneiderman, you know, and yet at the same time, you have all these journalists writing these stories about Donald Trump, and these things that are pretty flagrantly grim inal and nothing happens, and it doesn't actually Monto much. So for me, I don't think of myself as a certainly as an activist. What I wanna do is go out there and write the peace. And so an icon case, it was satisfying that he first I the White House kind of fired him as we were closing. But he didn't know it. And then he and he did this kind of snooker mover. He waited until he thought the piece was closed to put out his press release resigning the job. So that he could essentially scoop me, but and I was I was in Poland on vacation with my family. It was in the middle of the night. And I got a call and we reopened the peace, and we're able to get his resignation in at the last minute. So it's try, you know. Yeah. So. I took some satisfaction in that. But that wasn't why set out to write the piece. I don't I don't I want to tell good stories, and and to the extent that there. There is. Corruption or injustice or some kind of perfidy that deals like it should be exposed. I want to expose it and the rest is out of my hands. It's really for others. I wanted to ask about a different kind of story. I feel like you've done a number of stories over the last few years that have ended up sort of touching the news in unexpected ways. In one of them was the Anthony bourdain profile, which was was very long, very in depth profile that was wonderful at the time. But then it felt like when he died. Suddenly people were may be coming to you as a person who knew, you know, knew about Anthony morning. I'm curious what that felt like sort of being asked in some ways not to represent him. But yes, okay. Now, I'm going to go talk about this person's life because I spent a year. Yeah. Profiling him. Yeah. It was strange to get those calls after he died, and I did do a couple of radio things. But I didn't as her when I just started saying no to things Martin because there's a strange intimacy develop somebody who need profile them. And on the one hand I spent a ton of time with him we traveled together we talked about. A lot of really deep stuff and a lot of have twenty four hours of recordings of the two of us talking, and we stayed in touch, and we you know, we the New Yorker festival, and he had been come and moderate another thing that he did after that. And we continue to hang out and an Email. And but but I didn't ultimately know him all that. Well, you know, and he was enough of a pro that. Even in the incredibly intimate moments that we had talked for that piece. I felt that he was showing me exactly what he wanted to be showing me. So there's a moment in that piece. I mean, what one thing I'll say is that peace was supposed to be fun lark for me. I had just done a piece about the Boston marathon bombing. And he's about the Lockerbie bombing. And they said like what? Why don't you give you one through you? Yeah. Why don't we when we give them a bond bond? And I said I wanna read about I wanna travel Anthony bourdain right about it anymore and about halfway through. I remember having this conversation was Leschi where I said this is getting really dark. I mean, he's I had no inkling obviously that he was deeply depressed. But I mean, these questions of sort of happiness, and why is it that he kept going at the pace that he did all that stuff threaded through all our conversations and insert. When he told me this story about how he had passed out and had this kind of near death experience in dramatic in the in the piece itself, but it was one of those funny things where you're reporting somebody tells you the story like that. And of course, the little meta voice in your head is thinking, this is gold. This is amazing. Nobody else has this and. I'm a relieving the dinner that night and thinking you didn't coax that out of him. Like, he he made a very conscious decision to. Tell you this story which will go in this profile, which isn't to say that it's not, you know, obviously, it's true. But you see what I'm saying? It's a difference. Like, there's somebody who has given a million interviews. Right. And I I mentioned that just to say I had a in some ways I feel like a good grasp of who he was as a person. But I never lost track of the fact that I was journalists. They're profiling him. You know, we were we weren't actually bosom pals have you ever fallen on the other side of that where you felt you have gotten close so close to someone that you couldn't do the story or that the story fundamentally changed. No. I mean, the the. It is very strange too. Right about someone who so like, Ken Dorn Stein has a guy wrote a piece about the Lockerbie bombing. And this guy whose brother had been on the plane, and he then spent the next twenty five years obsessed with the Lockerbie owing try and figure out who had done it. And the amazing ending of the story is that he does and Ken with somebody. I'd known for years in a kind of arm's reach professional way because he'd been a producer at frontline and we'd become friendly. And like that's somebody. I had real feeling for and actually developed great feelings for when I was writing about him. And it wasn't the kind of story where I felt like there was any conflict of interest on my part, and in a strange way enters the so the pathos in the peace like, I there was a kind of empathy. I felt for him that I feel it comes across on the page. And but no, look, I mean, I'm I tend to subscribe to the frog and scorpion thing, and I'm on the scorpion. Every time. Well, I wanna talk second about your next targets. I guess we could say first of all it said this acclimate, you mentioned the Sackler piece. And I think it's public now that you're gonna write a book about the Sackler and all of that I had few questions about that. One. Was I feel like there was an old Chapo book out there for for you. If you wanted it, and I'm curious why you didn't write it because he'd written this big last time, we talked you'd written this big piece about similar cartel, and here's El Chapo and the trial. And and then after that, I guess so we probably talked after the times magazine piece. But before I did the twenty fourteen piece. Yeah. So you had you had all the markers there to to do a book put those together and go sell book. Yeah. I mean, never say never may be. It'll happen someday. I don't what when I was talking earlier about the struggle to reconcile tone and the gravity of the content. That's often tricky for me again because. I. I like a little dry humor and a piece I like, cliffhangers alike twists and. I feel good about both of the big pieces that I wrote about chop. Oh, I think in a book, I would really struggle with the imperative to make it entertaining. And. This dislikes the stomach churning gravity of the consequences of that business in the war on drugs, and I sat in a bit on the trial in part because I felt I mean literally because there are people I've written about who testifying. But even there that tonal dissonance between the idea that on the internet Chapo is a mean, you know, there are people wearing chop t shirts and on some of old inadvertently by may have contributed to this. But then you get in there, and you realize that it's true that there's this kind of the ballad version of Joe, and it is crazy, and there are hijinks and everybody has these crazy names. And there's this kind of outsized telenovela quality to it. But at the same time, you've got one hundred thousand dead people. Right. I mean, I just I just don't know that I could have figured out how to threat the needle away could live with. But you so instead you're doing the stack not instead because you may run out of everyone to do that. But the Sackler book, and that one's interesting because I feel like in maybe slight contrast to the troubles of look there are some very good books about the opioid epidemic. Writ large are his berry Myers book and they're betting on so yes and can Yoenis. And so what made you feel like I don't want to go too far into the book because I feel like will wanna talk about it some some years down the line. But what makes you feel like there's a space for this particular book at this time there? Well, look it remains to be seen. The do you have to be optimistic this point at this point? No, I am. And look I mean, I'll tell you why. So after my piece came out, so Barry mired, a great deal of credit because he really early on. I mean, very very early days identified the fallout from Oxycontin and identified Purdue pharma and the Sackler family and his book painkiller and send can Yoenis than move that ball along. And both of those books were out there at the point where I started to do the Sackler piece. So I wouldn't have known about the Sackler had it not been for those guys having said that they both and almost all of the books about the opioid crisis. Have followed a certain pattern, which is it's the sort of traffic or Syrian model in which you're cutting back and forth between multiple characters not necessarily know each other. And in that respect, you see the farmers out of the story. You see the addicts had his stories the treatments out of the story, you he drug dealer tons. And I think it's. A great model. And and I'm glad that people are doing that. That was not what I want to do the peace with a piece I said, I don't want the Sackler family to be one strand in a multi strat narrative wanna look at them, very directly. And after the piece came out there. I think probably would have been the possibility to a book, then this is about eighteen months ago. But my concern, then was from a reporting point of view as much as I thought that that book would be a worthy book, and a useful addition to the literature from reporting point of view, this Akers were kind of a black box in terms of their relationship with the company. Yeah. Privately held company tough to find your way on Jada wanna talk me out of there. They don't wanna talk about it. And then the attorney general in Massachusetts who unlike me has subpoena power subpoenaed million documents and started doing these filings with a huge amount of stuff. And then there was a deposition Richard Sackler did that I've been trying to get my hands on the Republika got a hold of and. Certain people had come out of the woodwork since my piece came out and had reached out to me with stories to tell. And so at a certain point, I thought that the reporting is there, and you could do a book that looks quite closely at the Sackler, so it's not to discount the other elements of the opioid crisis. But in my book will not be a book that spends a great deal of time. Like, for instance, tracking the trajectories of individual addicts and their families, and it'll be like the origin story for the opioid crisis. So where we're living with the outcome every day and just complete carnage of it. But what happens when you go back where did this? What were the conditions that made this possible? And you've also set yourself up for another significant right around situation. I can't imagine you're gonna get a lot of those. I mean, maybe you will they will burn down under your your standard. Spiel I'm gonna go on record right now. I think it would make more sense for them to talk. But I I don't. Anticipate that they will. All right. Well, good luck with it. Thank you. Thank you for coming back on the show to be back. All right. We'll see you. Thanks so much. That's it for this week's long podcast. Thanks to Patrick kief for coming into the studio. Check out the book, it's called say nothing. I cannot recommend it more highly. I'm Evan Ratliff. Your co host. Thanks to my other co hosts maximum ski and Aaron Lamour, thanks to our editor, Geno. Pifer our intern Tyler McCloskey and as always our sponsors pit writers and mail chimp. We'll see you next week.

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Mason and Ireland

Mason & Ireland

1:00:14 hr | 7 months ago

Mason and Ireland

"It is for what I do recreationally and And I encourage Morales funding. It's it's better for the ship so Hey just this is a This is big news I need. Somebody's help I've got a thousand dollar mythical ethical money not have to go to dinner at Nobu in Malibu. What did we agree this Saturday? What is our time from five thirty to eight? Five thirty to eight AK reservation at Nobu in Malibu. If any of you know boo people are listening. You'll get a lot of love. It sounds like you really need the advertising advertising if you're a if you're a hostess or a host or a waiter somebody in the inside or a famous person listen who can pull strings. Whatever you can do Nobu Malibu Saturday Mason? You Got Ninety minutes. I got ninety minutes to get done. You can. Dm Me you blew it last night. You could've just talk to Kim Kardashian. And every day for me chazan account there should have talked to Kim The yeah that would have been see. Here's I wanted to say. So you think she'd consider me for her. Fourth husband do not true but she seemed very happy with Connie last night. So here's the weird thing about one asked me this question. It's a really good question People say that stars have a certain glow about them. Like I remember years ago I met Ewan McGregor. Yep and and when I met you and McGregor thought you know he could be nothing except a movie star. He had a glow I think personally we Our friend Michelle beedle She showed up at my house for Christmas party one year and I thought Michelle Beatles got a glow. She stood out from everybody else. Kim Kardashian has a glow stardom has aglow. I don't think anything could happen. Except Kim Kardashian be becoming a star because she has a glow you you know there are people. Don't come back at you that she that she is a star she is a star. That's what I'm saying. No she does he blow disagree with that no she lives she famous. Why is she famous? What is she famous for She's while she was originally famous for a sex tape where she had a glow But later later I mean she's she's very smart. You Know I. I watched her was going to join a loss. I watch her with Van Jones on CNN talking about criminal justice reform. Yeah She's known for. She's capitalized on On her level of fame and she's trying to do something good with. I've always liked her all right so let me. He's got a glow. Let me go back to the gotTa glow when you got something. Let let me go back to the discussion. Raymond the passing. Because I think you're being a a little bit hypocritical. Here you said during the conversation with Jeff. Yeah that you feel he asked You you first of all your way. All this came up as you would like to see the major league baseball. Vacate the twenty seventeen and twenty eight. Yeah just take it away take it away and then Jeff said okay. Well how far do you want to go with this would would you. Do you want to vacate the all time home. Run record the single season homerun record and you said what I said. Yes okay so now. You're vacating why would you vacate those records. The home run record for all time and single season because they cheated because Barry Bonds to cheat it. Right okay yes. So I'm this is. This is an original thought but but the level of cheating barry bonds exhibited by using steroids meets whatever standard android. You've set for vacating right okay. So this isn't original. I took this from a column that Bill Shaken wrote in the La Times. This morning. I want to give him credit. Got It by the way subscribe to the La Times. Support your local paper okay. So bill points out. When the angels won the two thousand two world series they were celebrated for vanquishing the evil bonds and the rest of the San Francisco giants in two thousand seven? When Senator George Mitchell's investigation into baseball steroid era was released right? Three members of the two thousand and two angels turned up among the alleged users including world series. MVP Troy Gloss right so now. Based on the Steve Mason Standard. That has already been set. Do we vacate the two thousand two title. I think what the Astros did is significantly worse. I then play. But you've already vacated bonds who benefited from Star. Wait a minute. I'm just going back to your vacated Bacon so does you have to vacate the angels title. No he did did the same thing. No when troy glasses the same thing. How many people on that angels team benefited from steroids? Three how many people on the Houston Astros benefited benefited from cheating. All of them as many as one in two. We don't know if all of them did it but as many as one in to all of them. How do you know all you think there are people ignoring the trash can banging do heading took advantage of that? Who didn't like somebody said yesterday? Some hitters. Don't WanNa be bothered at all. They I by the way I think that's Baloney. Thank you the difference between knowing if you're getting fastball. You're getting a break ball is a gigantic shift right Houston hitters that wanted it benefited from that. That three angels benefited from. PD's there's an as far as well as as all including that's all the evidence we have including the MVP of the world series so if you're going to vacate very bonds. The any lawyer would tear you to shreds. If you're going to vacate Barry Bonds for for for Homerun record saying is that you have the entire twenty-five they're only three players of two thousand five to the best of our knowledge. The Houston Astros had a a player driven system to cheat. It was a player driven system according to Rob Manfred. Yeah I agree I agree with passing once. Once you start vacating things. You're going down a rabbit hole that you can't really get out of and so I have no problem with exactly what they've done. And now all these guys are scarlet ladder forever Cora Hint they bregman one hundred years when people back at the record for the Houston. Astros won the world series. That's all they're gonNA know okay so years from now you think anybody's GonNa remember this know who won the world series in nineteen nineteen. I don't know Cincinnati Right. It's Cincinnati Atty. No one knows because that's remembered for the team that cheat wait a minute so you think this will be remembered in the same way that the black socks schedule I do. They cheat what happened. The black socks they all get thrown out. Okay Penalty. Well you don't WanNA throw him out. You don't WanNa throw all day and Brian everybody out. I think there should be some penalty the players. Yeah your rib injury suggesting that. They they do what they did the wax now. I am suggesting that there'd be some penalty on the players that were involved in this. Okay let me do this. USC Story. Because I didn't notice until I saw you re tweet. Yeah and is it. How do you pronounce the guy's name that you re tweeted? Ryan Carter G. Ryan Karchi. Yeah okay he says breaking. USC has fired three senior officials in in its athletic department. COO CFO CFO. Steve lobes Yep Trojan Athletic Fund Senior Associate Athletic Director Ron or an associate athletic director. Scott Jakobsen now. I don't know anything about Jacobsen but Lopes and or have been mainstays in the US. Back to fourteen years ago. When I was doing game as long as Mason and I have been on the air? These guys have been affiliated and we've been on the air forever have been affiliated alienated was USC a matter of fact both or and loped have been mentioned every time they've changed the A. D. as a possible candidate to do it for these three people to be fired clearly indicates to me that Carol full is cleaning house and my and Mike Bone given a clean slate. Right he gets to build an athletic department from the ground up this this actually shed some light I think on the Clay Helton higher or Rehire in the fact that what she wants is anybody that had anything to do with this academic scandal or with any of the past Laughlin and Maasim awesome all right back to the got him put on probation and I think anybody who's tainted with any type of scandal is GonNa to get pushed out over. They are literally turning the page. The only that survives is clay right clay about clay and we've ripped him and we don't think you should be the coach the approach lately in terms of character. He's football faith family. Yeah he's he's top the top of the pile but the the the family football the fund the Trojan Athletic Fund is a phenomenal success. Yes generates millions and and and now the guy. The Guy who was in charge of it has been fired. Yup Steve Lopes. Who was there under Mike Garrett who was there under Pat Haden And who we assumed was going to be kind of the intellectual knowledge in that department has now been completely fired. The guys who raised three hundred and fifteen million dollars dollars three hundred and fifty completely renovate the coliseum. Those guys are all gone. Who got the McKay center? Bill Mckay Center bill. Yes so that that is in at least in my opinion pretty surprising news. And and not but not unexpected. It is not me is it. Those guys were been untouchable because of what you said. Three hundred and three. Yeah but you know what it's it's a brand new day. They've got to clean house I like Steve's Guy Ron never really worked with. I worked with Steve Lot. But you've got to at some point. There's got to be accountability for what's gone on in that athletic today that day because now it doesn't matter how how much you know this. What what this tells me is how many times we say when clay was rehired? We don't know anybody and this goes for keyshawn to All the fat cat donors that I know in Manhattan beach. We don't know anybody who liked that. Move Right this today. Is careful and Mike Bone saying we don't care care what you think. We're doing it our way. We're getting rid of whoever we want. Yup and we don't care how big your checkbook is matter of fact is is it. Brian Kennedy who who wrote for the product Kennedy. You notice that he was down with coach. Oh Yep at the national championship game. He's the his name is on the practice field right so so it's a new day. USC If you're somebody who donated one hundred million dollars and we're used to it. It was well documented in the La Times that the guy who owned owned public storage Wayne Hughes was the guy who got lynn. Swann hired. Yep those days are over. Yeah that's for sure at higher from the guy that has all right in a garage. Well we used to say follow the money or money talks not at USC anymore. It real quick it's TACO Tuesday officially and we're GONNA do a little game for a fifty fifty dollars gift certificate El Torito coming up next eight seven seven seven ten. Espn Greg Gimme Six caller six callers. It's going to be a real easy game. all right and it's eight seven seven seven ten. ESPN that's the number eight. Seven seven seven ten three seven seven six if you went fifty bucks worth of Tacos and who doesn't frankly given away a fifty dollar gift certificate necks and fast track in fifteen minutes Mason Ireland. ESPN LA okay. This just in Brian Nelson. DM ME he says. My Dad goes to Nobuo all the time. And if he doesn't have a reservation tips the host eighty to a hundred bucks to get in. Then they find a way doesn't count not ideal but if you really want to deal as you would have a reservation. That doesn't count. If we need an arbiter the deal was he would have a reservation At Nobu this Saturday Greece in the dealer. I mean Greece in the host is is not gonNA do a kickstarter campaign to raise the money to be able to to tip the host a lot of money to give me a table. I've been saying this way too often but I agree with Ireland. Yeah you gotta get a reservation. What's wrong with you you've got to to get a resolution is apparently not been smarter recently? it comes with age all right now mace you have. I don't even know what this game is. You have some crazy game to give away fifty bucks worth of Taco gifts. Yeah I do have that I do have that as a matter of fact Okay so do this need any explanation. Yeah it does take so it's TACO Tuesday fifty dollar gift card to El Torito. We're GONNA play El Torito prices right. So I've got got an order that someone would make at El Torito. Okay you've gotta give me the total without going over so here are the items. No I don't give out yet gets a because then people can google. Just wait waiting to bring a guy up. Yeah bring a guy it'll be tough to do. OKAY HERE'S ERNEST IN LA HERE ON ESPN La. Hi guys good to go okay. So the order is Nachos supremos a bowl of tortilla soup and an order of the steak Dake Street Taco. What is the total of that order without going over all right Without going over right without going over eleven fifty old school order okay. All right Adam Europe next atom in Whittier Adam. What's your total for the order? I'm GonNa say twenty four dollars dollars could yes Sam in Anaheim Sam closest without going going over. What's your price for that order? Twenty five twenty John Just kneecap data mart. Okay Oh yeah there's a way to really kneecap everybody air just in recede just in that order Let's go Seventeen Ninety five ninety I five and then the last one greg who's online at Ted in Fullerton. Hey Ted you're on. ESPN la Ted. And how much for all that food. Nineteen Ninety five nine hundred ninety five. I put everyone on hold. Who is the winner? Congratulations to WHO SAM in Anaheim says some weight. I go sound embiid. Twenty five dollars. The correct answer is thirty-three dollars ninety he six cents. You were the highest of everybody so you win the fifty dollar Gift Card to El Torito adulation. Sam Most I think most impressive is is that Ted The last guy didn't go twenty six. I know and knock you out of the way it works for me. Yes Sir Hanging Maligning shorttimer greg get your INFO okay. All right and he's corporate though. Yeah he's cornered. Don't say anything inappropriate. Why hang up Bagna by the way got fast? Track coming up Lakers look fantastic. Last night. They absolutely blew the doors off the Cleveland Cavaliers. Yeah was there was their biggest margin of victory all a year and One thing about this Laker team. It really doesn't matter who's out last night. Anthony Davidson region. Rondo didn't play the Lakers roll. Anyway night before that Lebron Danny Green anti-d out didn't matter anyway tomorrow night. They'll try and extend in their winning streak to nine games in a row and if they do they head on the road for the next five and Mesa on the road. The Lakers are seventeen eighteen. And three you have the best road record in the NBA and the stat. I keep throwing out. There is the thing that I'm most impressed by in back to back games. This season the Lakers are Tannin. Oh five zero in the first game. Five zero in the second game and many of those games have been on the road so they and you may have mentioned earlier that against teams below five hundred. They've won every game twenty two. Yeah Yup so they don't mess around nope and yeah. Last night they just steamrolled they steamrolled By the way game was close at Halftime one point. They were down one at halftime and they were down as many as I think teen fourteen. I'm glad you're right that up. Here's a tip if you listen to the Games on. ESPN LA or if you watch the Games Games on TV. If the Lakers fall behind even if they fall behind by a lot do not do not do not turn the game off. Do not give up. Yup last night was the ninth time this year. They've come not just back from a deficit but back from a double digit deficit. Yeah nine times coming back from a double digit deficit. Last night it was fourteen they were down. Fourteen eighteen in the first half came back and won by thirty. I mean they they just. I've covered seven finals teams. And this just has the look of one of them. I'm not guaranteeing anything not saying. It's for sure there's other good teams out there but this is going to be a very fun ride and if you're not watching or listening to the game you're blowing it in the other thing. I wanted to get in before we get to fast fast. Track is officially Alex. Cora fired by the Boston Red Sox. He was the ringleader. According to Rob Manfred Report Major League Baseball's report on the the Houston Astros scandal. It was player driven along with Alex. Cora He of course brought that whole system to Boston in two thousand eighteen. They won the world series. He has now gone as manager of the Boston. Red sox alright fasttrack coming up next for you Mason Ireland. ESPN LA. Let's a C. It's time for fast track. John Ireland one side of the coin. I hit another three team. NBA Parlay tonight. The other side of the coin I my luck has run out called in the air. Your Luck has run out my friend tales. Your luck is run out buddy. Bet against trae young score. Let's ask jet see all right. Connor Aguirre is a writer for a website named Saturday's down south. It's a college football website. When Mike Leach was named the new coach at Mississippi State Aguirre wrote a column called ten non football things? I'd like to talk about with Mike Leach Leach's famous for giving having opinions on anything anything pirates to whether or not you should get married pretty much anything else. Yup I read the column and I'm going to ask you about four of those things enough time for ten but I'm going to ask you about four ago. What are the best kinds of French fries? Skinny Fried Steak fries wedges. Something else what's the best kind of French skinny fries. McDonald's skinny fries. No right steak fries are fantastic steak fries like money. They're like mini potatoes. If they're cooked it gets a art Bergmann and break the tie skinny fraser steak fry donating. Choose my own yes. Chris Cut Chris Chris. Oh no those are even say risk. Let Chris cut what is that's that's why I say I wanted to have the lines cross. No it's called Chris. Cut Chris Cut Fries. Those are the best fries. That's right but if the other two is the steak fries all right number two. It's cut Chris does. He can't even pronounce Chris. Chris Cut Right Mace. Yes do you believe that Lee Harvey Oswald acted alone in the Kennedy assess. I do absolutely believe he did to the contract. You GotTa go to the Sixth Six Ford Museum in Dallas. tyrod out that window far Sean. No is head went back into the left. It's not thirty nine on the Grassy knoll and there may have bring somebody up on the other side of the craven. Do you believe he acted alone. No absolutely not crazy back into the crazy people that did the Warren Commission or lion. They're currently looking out that window. Is You realized that was not very much distance between that window right where you feel like you've had a baseball and some guy was coming down that hill. You could throw the baseball head him. Yeah okay number. Three Leach is on twitter but not on instagram. Now that's it's the same as me. Yeah I don't understand why you need both you are on both. Why do you need both twitter and instagram? Well they do two different things. That's right I mean instagram pictures on twitter. You you can. It's just not it's not the same. You GotTa do things for the Graham John. You need to do things for the Grand I. Hey don't take an instagram. I'm on it but I never post to search no now on twitter either. Do Some No. If you went back and looked at my country probably be twenty instagram's instagram's a great way to an to be more personal and to share things in your life. That's what I use instagram for. The last one in this is a really good one. Do you tip by an instagram. You can follow me at Venice. macy especially can give them a reservation. Do you tip when you pick up takeout or if you're having food delivered they have this screen option when you order to add a tip yet when you're already paying for delivery charge for when do you tip and when do you not tip. This came up today lease and I went to this new restaurant around the corner from a house called urban plates very good okay all right but it's cafeteria style. Yeah you walk in you order. They hand you the Buzzer with a number. You walk over your table and win the Buzzer goes off your food's ready and you go pick it up. I didn't have any silverware I said. Where's the civil war they said? You gotta go over there and pick it up but I gave a fifteen percent tip anyway. When do you tip and not tip on a takeout slash cafeteria style restaurant? Okay so will. I don't tip on pickup K.. Lira right Kara's so if I order something at sea. PK right and one of those where they give you. Do you want to tip. You just say zero zero. Now when it's delivery when I use GRUB you're already paying a delivery charge always tip ten dollars okay new regardless the decides on the size of the order I always to. I don't do ten percent but I'll do ten dollar. Okay so here's what. I'm wondering what I ordered donuts. You're not you're you're you're losing weight your day order no zone they gotta ten dollar tip you gave that up. I thought very well I did I. I'm getting smell okay. But how are you not worried about. This is what I'm worried about. That guy shows up to your door yup or you go to pick it up you walk into to pick it up just zero. Aren't you afraid to tweet. Hey Steve Mason. I listen to you my day. Then don't you feel like a loser. I don't believe that's a place where tips are required. If I'm at a table you know it's GonNa get out and he's going to go on social meeting. Go Steve Mason just came in here and picked up food and gave me nasty. It's pick up. Nobody's grading pickup cup. You tip on every tip. Yes no claims is standing next to Clinton win on this. Do you tip on everything for two reasons. One one of which stated in two everybody's working hard man. Yeah I just. I'm tippecanoe food right. I'm GonNa Totally Generous Taber when I'm interested when they're tearing dinner. I arguing with Michael. Michael is the most generous guy in the world but he doesn't always tip. I always say you know. I don't count on a typical just because they're not the only chance you're not the only to go order everything. I'm afraid of Busta so social media police. I'm afraid of getting cancelled. I'm doing pick-up. They'll cancel me tip and New England Patriots Star Wide Receiver. Julian Edelman in trouble report. I heard about this the eleven year. NFL veteran was arrested in La over the weekend for misdemeanor vandalism according to a report from TMZ the thirty three year old was arrested around nine pm on Saturday night in Beverly Hills after allegedly hopped up on a car and damaged law enforcement sources. Tell us it went down this way Julian in Beverly Hills US walking around about nine. PM then for some unknown reason he just jumped on a car causing damage the bad news for Julian cops in the area working robbery case someone flagged him down. Law Enforcement said it was apparent to them that Julian had been drinking. There have not been charges filed yet. So does it mention at any point. What kind of of car? He not. Not but here's the question if it was your car would you press charges. I would try and solve it would. Would it be amicably. I would try. I would try and reach out. Get money out of them. I've had reached out to element and say this just happened to me happen to me this past year about so somebody jumped on your car. No I ran into a guy I was going to pick something up and I wasn't paying attention. You sound like me now. I bumped into somebody got out and I said are you. Ok said yeah it was very slow and and I said here's my number. Here's here's my license. Take picture on my license. Call me and we'll try and just settle. Ah If you have to pay anything to get this fixed it and that's what I did. I just paid him. Nobody else got involved. That's what I would do for element I would try and reach out and say. Hey it cost me four hundred dollars to fix this you give me the four hundred bucks. Where good if I got? No response then impressing charges. How about you? He's a patriot. I'm pressing charter plane. Simple are you trying to shake him down. He beat us in the go to. Do you go to a body shop that will give you a friendly estimate. I expect spectrum to pay for the car. Obviously but I'm also pressing charges and by the way how old is it to get a re- how old is too old to get arrested for vandalism. He's thirty three three years old. Why do people come to? La and think they can do anything people come to La and pull all kinds of land of dreams people you can do oh anything show up in LA versus Larry Flint. He came to California and he said I have a dream right and he started. What was it Penthouse Hustler Tessler Hustler? Don't kill his dreams Jazz Day. All Right Ken. Rosenthal from Fox is reporting that the cubs have have made every player on the roster available for trade this season. Chicago's thinking is that they need to get younger and create a new core for new manager. Manager David Ross. Here's a rumor that could affect the dodgers Chicago trades for Nolan Aeronautical which makes Kris Bryant available. Bryant is twenty-seven Yep was the rookie of the year in two thousand fifteen the MVP in two thousand sixteen and after an injury in two thousand eighteen. He rebounded to be an all star our last year with thirty one homers and a nine hundred S. He just agreed to a one year price. So you know what you were getting. And then he's in a grievance that he has one year or two years left of control that'll be settled the cubs desperately need young pitching every starter in the rotation is over thirty ready. Let's say you're Andrew Friedman. Would you put together a package around destined. May Julio Aureus or Tony Tony Gone to trade for Kris Bryant. The you've got to wait for that grievance to find out a but he's getting hot nineteen million and you'RE GONNA have to pay him soon if your ideas to keep them he either comes up for Free Agency at the end of twenty any twenty or at the end of two thousand twenty one. Would you take one of those young pitching prospects and trade for Kris Bryant. He's he's all right. It was a yes or no question. I mean thirty. One home runs. He's Never Zoe twenty-seven he's and he's topped one hundred. Rbi once in his MVP season. Something's not quite right as MVP season thirty nine homers. One hundred and two rb got hurt right after that next year. Twenty nine homers seventy three then thirteen and fifty year thirteen home and how many games he played that year he played he had four hundred and fifty fifty seven plate appearance. Yeah and he said he played most of that. Greg Bergman would you trade for Kris Bryant do anything for you I mean he's he's all right. I mean he is kind of an Yeah he's a good third baseman. I played all around the Infield. I call it well. I'm Gonna I think you can lock in Turner for twenty two and eighty right now. I Am Radio Epstein Bergman Your Indra Friedman. Hey Andrew was hey listen I gotta get rid of Kris Bryant work where we need to get younger and I'm not going to pay him. Give me dust in May and one of your top fifteen prospects you can take your pick does amaze already a top fifteen. No but I want him in one prospect Kris Bryant. Something I'll give you Dustin May and the top thirty prospects surena minute done. I just got the other of Justin Turner at Third Base Than Kris Bryant. Now I would rather have now. You can move turn into second by the I. Turner twenty-seven homers and sixty seven. RBI's in a to ninety batting average with an eighty one opium. Wait a minute. He goes to I. What are you doing? Max Muncie. Next month he goes the second. Lux what are you doing Lux. Well it's because the outfield or he plays. Jackie Mason off of Chris. I'M GONNA Juggle the line up around but not for Kris Bryant. You're out Bergman in the outfield. You're maybe in. I'll do it from. I'll do it for Aaron auto not going to do it for Kris Bryant. I don't think I would sure that. Is it really hurts to do it. That was about Beta lease enthusiastic. Yes I've ever got. I'm not in Fred. Hey would you ever consider going out with me on a date. Yeah yeah around. There have Justin Turner at Third Base Than Thirty Four. And he's not GonNa be there for a long all right Saints Wide Receiver. Michael Thomas has been doing a lot of tweeting after his team got eliminated from the playoffs. Yeah during the Vikings Forty Niners Game Thompson or Thomas. Mock the Vikings who beat the saints. Last week he was called out by Seitz. Beat reporter Andrew Doke for talking trash. The writer tweeted if your team was was eliminated from the playoffs. That's usually not the best idea to talk smack all day on twitter to the team. That's sent you to your couch for the rest of the season. Michael Thomas tweeted back same name couch. I sat on every week after leading the league in every category weekend and week out while you searched for goofy story. I don't tweeted back. Be Respectable move on get them next season your stat speak for themselves deal with it in a better way. Be well Mike Michael. Thomas tweeted nope. This is my platform. You follow me and watch me know your place like I said you know me and you ain't never played sports so keep your advice for your intramural team it. It ended up with Thomas threatening to punch this writer in the face. So who's in the right. WHO's in the wrong here until that very last sentence sentence when you said he threatened to punch him in the face with Thomas but the minute you go to the the you never played the game albeit you up argument? Yeah what kind of loss. Yeah but until then I was with Thomas I thought it was clever and well argued and until he until he crossed the physical violence line. Then he lost. I don't understand. Take away from the beat writer. I don't think I don't engage in this. You won't see you see Dave mcmanamon going back and forth with Lebron on twitter. Have you ever been in a twitter argument. That's a great question. I don't think so maybe goofing on you like the last. I'll I'll read the last the last tweet I sent out. Okay so you use Inada tweet about half an hour ago. Oh and your tweet said if you can get me a reservation at Nobu Malibu for this Saturday. Dm Me. I'm literally begging. Yup My response was. Here's the truth truth. I bet him a thousand dollars mythical money that he couldn't get in this bit is much funnier if he doesn't get in. Don't ruin the bit. I'm on Nobu comes always remain. I think that's a that's a war between me. There are people working at this and there are people closed good they have forty seven forty seven minutes to get it done Ireland. We'll let's see we'll see how close more fasttrack two minutes Mason and Ireland. ESPN LA all right Rolling on with fast-track Ireland. It's too you false chatter. I may see. USC See Played Ucla Basketball on Saturday. USC One by eleven We used to make a big deal out of that and we would know at least five guys who played on each each team. It would be a big deal to the audience. Now even though Pauley Pavilion is renovated and Galen Center is Great. Nobody cares how did that happen. How did we go from Baron? Davison Damore Rosen two games that nobody watches when. And how did we stop caring about college basketball. Did you even know they played this past Saturday. No Clue Great. Did you know you follow it. A little closer. Yeah I did know what you know what I'm saying like like we used to have fun with that talk about it and and now I can't tell ya three players total that played in that game and and I'm guessing and you guys can't either it just what happened. College basketball has just drifted to irrelevant in the regular season literally. No one in ninety cares. Why I think that's part of it? I don't think guys are there long enough to build any sort of equity in terms of being a star. If you're a star you go there for one one year in your gone. I think that's part of it. But Baron Davis only played two years to Marta. Rose only played one. We cared about those guys. I also think the only thing anybody cares about his tournament. It's all all like a warm up for the tournament. They're basically playing for seating It's we're so tournaments centered and we'll we'll have fun with the tournament and I won't be able to tell you a single player that's in it by the time we get there right. But we'll all become fans and we'll all know playoff bracket we'll fill out a bracket but the regular season really has has become in essence meaningless. Yeah and and it it. It doesn't seem and you know that really stinks. For is the fact that they went out and spend all this this money on these two facilities you know they did one hundred million dollar renovation of Pauley pavilion. Galen Center is spectacular. Yup nobody cares nope. There's empty the seats at all these games and I don't think it's changing at college. Basketball has for whatever reason and I can't tell you exactly why fallen into exactly talked about what game sport. What Games matter in college football all of them right because there are so few right? That's the difference. That's why I've always been anti expanding. The playoffs every game is a play in game. If you're in college football even when. USC plays a stiff. And they're pretty good about not scheduling scheduling patsies but even on those rare occasions. Where they do we care? We still talk about the Games and we pay attention and we watch him. That's not true in college basketball. UCLA UCLA played Notre Dame earlier this year in a tournament. I didn't watch any of it. They played North Carolina. I didn't see no. I can't remember the last time I watched the regular season game. Don't get it yeah fast. Track all right cam see chiefs absolutely exploded offensively in their win over the Houston Texans on Sunday it. It appears even they did not predict. The team would find the end zone so many times after falling into a shocking twenty four nothing hole in the first half chiefs scored touchdowns on seven straight straight possessions. They win fifty one thirty one. They scored so many touchdowns that they ran out of fireworks at Arrowhead Stadium which the team announced on the video board but in the fourth quarter in other words the chiefs were so explosive they ran out of explosives. The team had to put out a PSA As the game was ending chiefs fans. We are sorry. Sorry to report. But due to your support and the chiefs continually finding the end zone. We have run out of touchdown. Fireworks should the fireworks works guy or girl be fired for not being prepared for a big score one game suspension. Yeah I you can't run out of fireworks firework can't if you know what pops into my head. You had one job. You're the Kansas City chiefs of course are going to score. Had One job. Yeah I mean you can't get not no you gotta do something right. Yeah you need somebody acid a briefcase that yeah you can't rented fireworks in the NBA. Use firework known doors never often maybe a couple of a couple of times. You'll see that fire the fire out of the top of the A. Ah of the stanchion right while they were banned in outdoor because of a fire. FAA regulation or something. It takes 'em everything. Anything burned down like the concussion tent. Right because they were using those fire cannons I love the fireworks. Even in the daytime they Yeah I think somebody should pay a price for that. I Guess Chapel right last one for me. It's time to hop in the cash cab. Oh ask you guys a series of questions if you miss one you get kicked out of the cab. It's basically an Nike. If you make it to the end we'll give you twenty bucks and the chance to go double or nothing now. The only person who has ever taken actual money out of my pocket is Michael. Are you you ready. Okay here. We go The if you miss your out if you get it right you keep going Bergman you have not fared well in this game now I have made it a little easier in the hopes that you will not go out in the first round. Are you ready now. Ready Greg Okay. International Channel Star Wars Day. Greg is held on May fourth. That alludes to what famous Jeddah greeting. I'm going to get one right. And may the force be with you. That is correct. Hey Fudge founded in nineteen thirty one. What sports car companies models include the Carreira and the boxster boxster Porsche? Porsche is correct. Mace with thirty four letters. What is the atrociously? Long Song title from. Mary poppins Super Cala Fragile Listrik. Xp Alad absolutely correct in. Well done all right. Greg caused by swollen. Glands chipmunk cheeks are a classic symptom of what Childhood Illness The mumps correct waiver anyways wavering futch in downhill skiing. What is the term for the mounds of snow? That give racers of bumpy. Ride man mounds ends of snow. Need an answer. Five four three two one great you know what right do modal moguls. Sorry I found out makes us of what famed. FBI Director was it said quote. He always got his man but never or found a woman. End Quote gotta be Jagger. Hoover is absolutely correct. Well done all right greg. I'm nervous never gone this far. You're you're doing fine. There's only a few rounds left. The home of Apple Amazon. What High Tech Stock Market was shut down by pesky squirrels the home of Regan? Yeah the home of Apple and Amazon. What High Tech Stock Market was once shutdown by pesky squirrels world's New York Stock Exchange? Yeah Stack Yeah. You did better this time. Okay smarter than usual. Well he's going to get it as right right. I think you know this okay. All all right on what date did both Thomas. Jefferson and John Adams die in eighteen twenty six July. The fourth you live a fourth is right all right your three away from getting to the actual money right. Yep made with Bourbon Sugar and water. What is the traditional drink of the Kentucky Derby the Mint Mint juleps mint juleps correct? What TV chef popularize the exclamation Bam Emerald Lagat? Emerald Gossip is right. You get this and you're into the bonus round the New York stadium that hosts the annual. US Open is named. After what tennis legend I five Arthur Ash. All right now I can hand you twenty or you can go for the forty. What do you WANNA do? I'm going for forty. I like all right. You can get this to. I think you are going to get this. Okay the Irishman Yep Cape Fear and casino are three of the movies directed by Martin. Scorsese that star Robert Deniro named four four of the six others. You have thirty seconds. Raging bull is one taxi driver is to mean. Streets is three and King King of comedy four and didn't even get the best one get goodfellas goodfellas. Yeah Forty Bucks. I'm handing it right now. That was impressive. Impresses it is my night greg. That makes you the only person ever to win money. I'm never going to win. This is forty thirty nine forty forty because you knew easy thing yeah. He walked away but yeah he knew what you call the When they meet at the pope's the pope's what they call it when the new concrete very impressed by the way underrated movie king of comedy? If you've never never seen the king of comedy it has by the way the movie joker yeah is a lot. Li- it's sort of a cross between the King of comedy and taxi driver. You really should see Joklik. It's have you know they send it to me for screen. Yeah feels school. Scorsese moving movin a Lotta way. Todd Phillips directed it but there's a lot of of King of comedy in the joker very good. I thought you'd never. I thought for sure in order to win that you would have to get goodfellas and you did it without good. Yes Yeah The New York New York. Yeah Anti You No Yeah New York right the six okay so goodfellas mean streets. New York New York raging bull taxi driver in the King of comedy King. You knew him all right very good all right coming up next for you we are going to electrify you with some purgatory. Leslie was coming up. We Lisa Dunno I am shocked is not here Allen's off Hor No no no. There's no Jonah. Today this is the day for ever. Does the show on Mondays will today's Tuesday. Oh we had a Laker game on Monday. So laker talk got moved Tuesday Tuesday. Okay so this is George is back on well. He's not this week Georgia's back not on this week next week. He'll ask back next week. Yeah sooner or later you know him you love him. You Wonder Correa's George Sodano Alright. Purgatory is coming up next for you Mason in Ireland. ESPN LA if Morales was to take Lisa. Ireland did Nobu. I would just tell him three things. Six three words bring your money. Yeah show run up a serious Tabah that enjoyed by the way the whole talk of Nobu is because I've never been there and I'm I'm I'm like outsider Guy Twenty four twenty minutes to try to get a reservation to the most exclusive restaurant in all of Los Angeles thousanddollars money. You're here you're good now correct. Yeah you're dressed appropriately ready to go. That's like a grown. Should ask him and Kanye man got in your right there. I'm getting close. You could ask getting getting close in what sense. I've got to people that are working on her face in those people. Yeah Mason doesn't know any people it's just not confirmed yet. Okay Mace. That was interesting yesterday. In the meteoroid. It's like why. Why are we using the same restroom kind of don't news? This is so weird to have them roaming around the media room. I almost want to say help yourself popped agree with me that with Kim Kardashian. There's just there's kind of aglow around her on no question she's you can tell she's a star just because she's got this glow so I saw Connie I and by the time I saw him she was is walking. Adam Meteorologist Mace. You're onto something that right like there. Is this a Mike just staring at him. Like what what's is going on here. Why are we mixing in the same room with Kim does pull folk? Well I just all I could think was what life is. Surreal like I. I grew up in Toledo Ohio and right now I'm standing ten feet away from came carnell. She's been on the show. I don't remember I don't remember that. Yeah she came on when they were doing keeping up in the get her back on well we we just need to call the keeping up. Public- yeah connect yesterday. You could. You could have done it right there. I was so intimidated. There were security people walking up excite. Yeah Nice to meet you. She could not have been nicer. Anybody that walked up to. She's wearing that gigantic puffy coat. Yeah so allen a back in the days when we took phone calls before. Bergman Bergman was our producer and decided he hates all callers and listeners oh they just callers he likes to listen the A they were always upset over something. You are manning. The phones for the Lakers postgame show. I can't imagine that that the Laker fans could be upset with anything are they. You know it's funny. There's always something what could it be could be won eight games in a row. They're thirty thirty three and seven. Did you get any complaints last night last night. Not Complaints. Actually last night it was. It was very positive after the win against Oklahoma City. Thunder people ready to a parade down Figueroa big as well. They should be but a lot of the chatter in the conversation is all right Where are we against the clippers if we take on? The Clippers Lakers off C.. Two and against the clippers. What does that match up? Look like or they'll find something to complain about when it comes to the bench or some of the role players coups. My has been Atar. It sometimes the targets change. It was Casey p early in the season. Obviously coups my little but as of let me tell you something back. He's been a key contributor to all these winds he's been really really good. Can't you make the argument out of all the role players and the bench players. KCPT might be the most consistent out of all of them. which in the beginning? Maybe Dwight as I would argue to white but in the beginning would you have ever thought that that was gonna be a conversation always liked. He's gone now. He knew that in the beginning he was just missing and Chats Mason is feverish best texting to try and make this nobu thing happened in the next twenty one making making fun. I'm actually talking to people good to know but just pay me the thousand dollars. Now No graven. What grade would if you call them right now and just said we're on live and see if that that's going to help at all? I'm not trying to get into the middle of this. I'm not sure you're not allowed to do that anymore. Rate in the old days we could you ask for permission and they say yes. You're allowed to do it. You're not allowed to call. Somebody called like back in the day I used to. Do you know how dis used to do his thing Soosai to do that in Toledo we call the Mason Izing and man. I messed with people ridiculously. That was before they made the rule that you have to get permission for somebody to be on the phone on On the air before you actually start recording so the David Singer story with Albert Bell. I'm assuming that wasn't that was pre no. That was yeah that he was doing something the different altogether. He was in the hallway with a cell phone and he Albert Bell was in town to play the angels and Dave woke him up at like five in the morning. Yes doc any knocked on the door he said I have an amenity here and and then amenity and then handed him the phone. What a random word and which is code in hotel for? You're getting in some free and handed him the phone and he you know what's great about that. We did that to George. Karl who was the coach of the signings. And Yeah. Yeah that's right we mason. I used to own a horse. A racehorse we're like might we don't two point five percent of a horse and we'd almost took us to the poor almost bankrupted Dan we literally owned less than five five percent toe less San Diego days. The horse was in Hollywood part. You when you win or race. Yeah they put a giant wreath of flowers around the horse's necks. So we had singer the Lakers cours. Were up three one on the Sonics in a year that the sonics were overwhelming favorites. Like the Sonics. One seed the Lakers were the five. This is in the early nineties when they had nick. Panics and Eddie Jones and so we had singer take we. We had a horse. Wreath made up. That said beloved coach. wjr Sia yeah. Yeah and because it was it was the day morning of game. Five and the Lakers three two one. And so you're was at five o'clock in the morning and knocks on his door. We had all these insights sources where people more so maximum door any answers and you can tell he's gotten out out of bed and then he goes Coach Ivan Gift and he just starts fussed enough laugh beloved coach. See Yeah here these Steven John Coaches. I'll tell you what this is. The most flowers I've received from anybody in five years most of the stuff. They're sending me or day. He talked to us for ten minutes. Couldn't we had heard all these stories about how he was a crank hothead yeah he could not have been nicer and his wife cares. GROSVENOR was I can't even got some gifts. Yeah right right we should have before greg becomes management. Have great go down and do that shouldn't have greg do that. Tak- take about this. Yeah he's trying to WHO. WHO's the next Lakers opponent in town Orlando Orlando okay. Steve Clifford their coaches. Which is the nicest guy in the world? So we're GONNA find out what Hotel Steve Clifford staying and by the way it's really easy. Yeah you're going to Indiana hater. I hate me ever said to you. Yeah I'll know I hate to ruin it for Ya. Clifford might be the nicest head coach in the League. He wouldn't be perfect. Yeah Yeah we could probably take some and have them come on come on anyway but that those were the types of things you are allowed to do way back in the day but you can't you can pull that crap anymore and they get mad at another year. We put singer on the singer had a unique distinction of he's finally had it surgically removed but he had hair all over his back. He looked like part monkey and so the day. The sports illustrated swimsuit issue issue came out. We put him in a Bettini and had him stand on Santa Monica Boulevard. We used to do the show from Fox sports west on a little Santa Monica and we had singer standing out there handing out copies of the swimsuit issue and then we had to make in cold calls to people's houses. You have them go to college and she was great what do you think what do you think back. And he had a crazy. See you know what I call that I call that producing. No that's all about whatever it is. And then the and then the other guy producers are the other so we can tell somebody what to do. Member member Mace the other house we sent him to was Bubba Smith the late great dismay and Bubba just couldn't stop laughing he said. Do you know how this man is dressed. And and he was he could not stop laughing. I could think of singer when that idea came across the desk was like yeah. That's a great idea. Had A great attitude he would do anything. Oh but that. That isn't even the best one of the best one ever. I'll tell you about coming up next all right. Don't forget fifth row Friday's going on right now. WE'VE GOT fifth row seats to Lakers acres spurs on Feb four plus an autograph basketball and pay attention to everything. We say every day. This week will be quizzed on Friday at five o'clock for the big prize price package. I'm getting so close on a reservation for Nobu Mao sixty minutes so close it might happen. Mason Ireland ESPN panel Update Mason is amazing. Just one forty bucks off me out the cash cab game if you get into Nobu that oh by you one drink. Is it expensive. Yeah low here you're wearing you're gonNA fit right in. I'M GONNA fit right about that now. You have your your not mattis five minutes because we're off at six twenty five there's a guy named Robbie Clifford who's really close on this thing. Robbie take your time at six twenty five and and the other guy that's working at is Leo Chu. Who owns the bicycle casino? Wow that's friends with Nobu Matt. Say He's okay. So Alan the best bit we ever had singer. Do we played this. At Mason's roast was reviewed Mason's roaster mind. I think we waited mine. Mason came of the the idea. And this was a brilliant lenny. DYKSTRA had purchased a car wash and they asked it was way may remember where it was it was like way out in the inland way. Way Ask Lenny gambled it away at some. Yeah until one of the sales guys on a game or something like that. One of the sales came to us. It goes can you guys think of a promotion we could do for Lenny Dykstra car wash and Mason goes. I've got it and we bought. This was before mobile phones or before everybody had mobile refunds. We bought a cordless phone and we installed it at the car wash and we gave it to singer and we told him to go through the car. Wash on the outside of the car right and just describe it just play by play goes okay going through he goes. Wow this water is really cold. He goes no I said no tax and then they hit him with the wax. I got sopa by. You're basically gave him like the full simonize. Lyman is whatever it is and it was one of the great bits of all. It was really fun. Singer ever say no. Do you guys know no not allowed to say notable that he knew that He he was his job depended on his willingness. He was everything producers. Should be any calls and now we took guests. We've got corporate greg. Yeah much better show if I must say so yeah he Singer although sense show is legendary that version of the show is legendary that roast with singer. Oh that guy that came out of nowhere he is he drinks. I was on. He'd been holding onto some stuff. Yeah and we'll close to the you're not making it. Sorry sorry to let you know like. Hey here's a little singer from the from the road I from the bottom of my heart. I want to thank you. My family wants to thank you the five live therapists and the first ten years. I was working. You WanNa thank you voice. They got paid a pretty penny hell. I'm still having residual a jewel effects of being masons producer right now it's like post traumatic mason disorder. Yup Do you have that Yeah Yeah I'm trying to get out. Here's fast tell you this next this next Person Guy Girl. Whoever it is I hope they're I? I hope that they've learned from Dave Singer. Yeah if if you don't know what we're talking about Bergman got promoted everybody around here got promoted a man is now the program director. Bergman is he's corporate corporate now a man diesel job of assistant. PD and he's running things around here and got a minute and a half. Yeah you're you're well although okay if I asked you before the show show. Yeah you're GONNA win forty dollars in actual money or you're GONNA lose a thousand dollars in myth across me. It's the mythical money replace mythical think money is worse. Did the bicycle guy. Did you text him yeah. I texted him completely out of the back. Yeah he texted back okay. He said I will help you to make the reservation. Tell me who you are. What did you say I said? Steve Mason Mason Ireland the ESPN seven ten. And he said he said give me dates. And how many going. It's not going to happen in time. You got less than a minute Alan. What's coming up on Laker talk? Ah Jared Dudley will be hopping on the show at seven fifteen. We'll talk a little bit about Boone. Melanie could code the last time I was in there. I sat next to Chris. Bosh did you. Yeah you hang out with all the cool people bobby look you yesterday. I mean John was in and out with Kim and Kanye yesterday just in the press room grizzled media types. I see I told him earlier. I thought I was Kinda hanging onto the hope I could be Kim's fourth husband but He says that he thinks the kind of thing that's GonNa last all right. So you get deadly deadly coming on how they come down and we'll talk about actually going to take phone calls unlike Mason and Ireland definitely takes phone call. Yeah got a lot of lake offense to have their the voice. Alright Mesa hate to break it to you. Five four three two one. It's six twenty five and you owe me a thousand dollars in mythical money now. Having said that now I've I still think you're going to do. I'm going to read it. Very slowly yeah. Yeah No. That's not going to help you but very slow but I think you're GONNA get in. I think that now you know there's no question I'm going to get in. It's just it's just a a I can't get a confirmed him for a breakdown. There you go all right. You're not man all right. See You tomorrow folks. Laker talk coming up next an interesting creature in the flat plains of many and automobile dashboard trouble the bobblehead. It's most agreeable and will not along to anything despite having no brain function but when the bobble head. Here's how Gyco not only saves people money but also gives them access to licensed agents twenty four seven online and over the phone you'll not even more vigorously because he knows you should switch because yes switching to gyco is a no brainer easy public easy you can get whiplash.

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