Aired Last week 4:51
Serena Williams Sports Gatorade Dehydration Patch
Business Wars Daily
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Aired Last week 4:51
Serena Williams Sports Gatorade Dehydration Patch
Business wars daily is brought to you by Pitney Bowes, and send pro online shipping can be complex with the uncertainty over costs and deciding which carrier to use plus tracking your packages things can get confusing. Stay tuned to the end of the show to find out how Pitney Bowes and send pro online can save you time and money and to get a special offer just for listeners of the show. From wondering, I'm David Brown. And this is business wars daily on this Friday January eleventh. Serena Williams is analyzing her sweat while playing tennis in the latest ad from Gatorade. The tennis star sports. A patch that passes sweat through food coloring giving an instant easy to read picture of hydration or lack thereof when colors on the patch change. They signal levels of dehydration sort of like a mood ring for electrolyte loss. Williams told fast company, she was excited by the promise of the new wearable technology to extend athletes careers, the patch invented at Northwestern University and developed with Gatorade sports Science Institute has been tested by professional, athletes and college swim teams. It's also being used to test babies for cystic fibrosis. The patch is the latest volume Gatorade attempt to rebrand itself. From a sports drink to a spa. Ports fuel from something. You might want to something you have to have Gatorade holds about three quarters of the eight billion dollars sports drank market. So why go to the trouble inexpensive developing sophisticated wearable technology. Well, Gatorade needs some fuel of its own. The brand sales have been slowing lately as consumers turn away from sugary drinks in favor of more natural beverages. That trend has also hurt. Gatorade rival Coca-Cola which owns PowerAde last year. Trying to solve that problem. Coke took a stake in body armor, the up and coming sports drinks startup is backed by basketball star Kobe Bryant body armor uses coconut water, which the company argues is not only more natural than its chemical heavy competitors. But also lower in calories the brands market shares tiny, but it's been growing faster than either Gatorade or power aid for Coca-Cola investing in body. Armor represented a move into the future for Gatorade. It's packed system is also seizing on the opportunity to evolve Gatorade says a retail version of Serena's sweat patch costing three to five dollars will be on the market soon. And that may signal even more about Gatorade future as a brand marketing health technology that just happens to come with sweet drinks, the think about that. The next time. You're practicing your serve. From one to read this business wars daily pay fascinated by the long running battle between coke and Pepsi. Check out the whole story in our six part series on business wars, this week's episodes were written edited and produced by lane Appleton grant, Ginny lower is our editor and producer our executive producer is Marshall Louis reated by or non repes- for one. I'm David Brown. We'll see next. Shipping can be complex with the uncertainty over costs and deciding which carrier to use plus tracking your packages things can get confusing. Now, there's a better way to ship central online by Pitney Bowes with simple online. You can easily compare USPS and other shipping options in an all in one online tool, you can print shipping, labels and stamps on your own printer and track all of your shipments as well. Plus when the US postal rates increase on January twenty seventh you'll still be able to access savings of up to forty percent off USPS priority, mail shipping and five cents off. Every letter you send just by using central online. Simple online is only fourteen dollars ninety nine a month, and you can get a free thirty day trial. When you visit PBA dot com slash b w daily. You'll also receive a free ten pound scale to help. You weigh your packages and accurately calculate the cost of shipping. That's PB dot com slash. WD early and big thanks to Pitney Bowes in central online for sponsoring this show.
Business Wars Daily
Aired 11 months ago 188:20
#1176 - Dom D'Agostino & Layne Norton
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Slash Rogan. See why movement keeps growing checkout. They're expanding collection. Go to m v Mt dot com. Slash Rogan and join the movement. All right folks. We've been having these debates and these discussions about diet yesterday was a discussion between vegans and people can soon meet between Chris, Chris, her, and Dr Joel Khan, and today we're doing it. Between lane Norton and Dom to Augustino to scientists who actually agree about a lot of things, but we're gonna talk about high carb versus low carb. The pros and cons of Kita. Genyk diets. Just sort of sometimes it's difficult when one experts on they say things and other experts listening. I disagree. Well, I wanted to get people together in the room and just fucking figure this out, and it's not easy to figure out this is it's dependent a lot on the individual on your own biological needs your lifestyle, how much energy expand during the day, so many variables. But I think the more we do of these kind of podcasts in the more information we get out there, the more the surface area of ignorance get sort of cleaned up, the more more you get illuminated as to what's necessary and not necessary, and what's beneficial and not beneficial and. Diet and health. You know, I mean without it, you fucked. Right. I agree. Okay. Without any further delays and gentlemen, please welcome. Les Norton and Dom de Augustine. The Joe Rogan experience. So. Podcast by. And we're live, gentlemen, thanks for being here. Preciado she'd it. Let everybody know who you are lane. The meathead who like science got no bodybuilding when I was young and then the BS in biochemistry, PHD nutritional science kept lifting did powerlifting won two national championships, got silver medal at worlds said, then world squat record, and it also bodybuilding and won a natural pro card. They actually have natural bodybuilding, believe it or not. And throughout that time just you know, when I first got into it one magazine said one thing, and even in the same magazine, they have article one month next month contradict. And so I was like, I'm just going to try and figure this shit out for myself. So which is the place that a lot of people listening are at right now. Yeah, it's it's tough because it's kind of like, who do you trust? Because Nope, not everybody has the time or the energy to go and do it agree in the stuff so. But that was me. I kind of got down the rabbit hole of all right. Let's try and figure this nutrition stuff out. And of course the more I learned the more I realized I didn't know. But yeah, it just became a passion for me to into the day. I'm so very, I love the stuff. This is what gets me up. Gets me going guys like you are very important guys who actually trained very hard and really understand the science. This is because it's usually one or the other. Absolutely. Yeah. And I like when I was doing it, I graduate my PHD in two thousand ten. When we started, we actually both knew each other from the bodybuilding dot com message boards. So it was back before social media trained together back in two thousand six or seven, seven and experimental biology. So this big, there's a big symposium every year for science geeks and we were both going to it and we found out about each other on the forums and we went and trained together and he's a, he's a beast. And yeah, we really hit it off and we've been friends since then. So everybody's looking for a fight. So sorry, we're probably going to be pretty friendly. Well, it's going to be a conversation. We don't need to have a fight and Dom. You've been on the podcast before, but for people didn't listen to that. At one, please tell them who you are, what you do? Yeah, I'm keep the sucker. Sure I will go getting back. I, I majored in nutrition actually as an undergrad, but didn't actually see a career in it that much so went into neuroscience. The ninety s was a decade of the brain, and my formal training is a neuroscience and it got steered towards basically changing the neuropharmacology of the brain with nutrition, and that's what the ketogenic diet does and has tremendous benefits. I think for military personnel which is funded by the office of navy research and the department of defense to develop Kita genyk strategies to enhance readiness, resilience and performance, and safety and military personnel. And what? What? Why specifically does the Keita genyk died helped military people. I know there's a thing with navy seals with preventing Allison. Yeah. So central nervous system oxygen toxicity elimination of that is or limitation of navy, seal diving is oxygen toxicity seizures and anti epileptic drugs are not really a viable option because they can their side effects. They can decrease cognitive resilience, physical resilience. Kita Jang strategy is something that's being studied now from basic science mechanistic perspective to animal work to now human studies. So it's not, you know, out in the field yet, but some guys are actually doing it and I studied the science of that and over people don't understand what we're saying for some folks who have epilepsy too key. Genyk dine has been shown to stop seizures. Absolutely go Google the Charlie foundation, so that's how actually got linked in. And actually I met a natural drugfree bodybuilder. His name was Mike dancer, and he had severe terminal epilepsy, Google, Mike dancer, Kita, genyk diet, and you'll find an amazing story about a guy who used nutrition to manage his epilepsy when drugs failed. And he used it to prep and win bodybuilding shows and compete in vaudeville. And the re breeders sometimes caused seizures with some of the soldiers. They can. So for example, just fifty feet of seawater using a closer kit Br. Breather, like Drager Rebrith fifty feet of seawater. Your potential for getting auction toxicity. Seizure can occur in just ten minutes, so that's a little bit of time. And that's not very deep. So there's no way to predict that. And there's no way as of now to prevent that. So we study physiological biomarkers that could warn people have an impending seizure, and we also develop a counter measures to mitigate oxygen toxicity seizures. I focus mostly on drugs. I'm in a pharmacology and physiology department, but I realized that people with epilepsy, the key jank diet was more effective than drugs. So I got steered into, you know, nutrition, which was my undergrad. And then that kicked off about ten years ago, and I've just been deep into probably a dozen or more different applications of nutritional ketosis. Awesome. And lane of paying attention to online for longtime. One of the things to a great job with is just calling bullshit on. I mean, you loved call bullshit clearly, but whenever people are overstating claims or people get ridiculous and. I think this is one of the things that is a problem with any diet where people get really enthusiastic about it. That becomes an ideology, whether it's the ketogenic diet or the carnivore died or the, you know, fill in the blanks, vegan diet. People decide this is the end all be all. It's going to cure cancer. Make you smarter Dick's gonna grow a foot. All these things are going to happen and you do great job of calling bull shit on that kind of stuff. Yeah. I mean, I, I'm not anti Kito. I'm not anti vegan. I'm anti bullshit. And one of the problems we have is nutritious, replacing religion for a lot of people. So you find something that you identify with. And then people start to try to say because they identify with that movement or like for example, vegans, identify with many of them protection of animals, not my job to judge their ethics on that sort of thing. But then they kind of try to backtrack to find the science to support them as well. And they pick and choose, and this is. Guilty of all groups, not just vegans. This is also a lot of kinetic diet sell. It's carnivore diet, whatever have you. If it has the word diet, there's zealots out there who are going after it and I will stick up for. I've stuck up at a scientific conference for the Keita genyk diet you were. We were having roundtable about something different and somebody said, well, we know that the Keita genetic diet impairs exercise performance and endurance athletes. And I said, I don't think that's necessarily true. You know the, it's pretty ambivalent the ambiguous as to whether or not it does. It seems to be kind of individual, but on the whole on the average, it doesn't seem to impair exercise performance. So it's kind of what you like. But when you have people who you know like like Gary tabs who says, well calories don't matter. It's all carbohydrates that sort of thing on the carbohydrate, insulin model obesity. I mean, the researchers, you're able to do a lot of hand waving about insulin, and you know, will you burn so much fat when you're on a high fat. Diet, which is true by the way you, you burn a lot of fat. But what they don't talk about is that it's it's overall fat balance how much fat you store for how much fat you burn. And when you're on a high-fat diet, you store a lot of fat. You also burn a lot of fat. The overall caloric balance is what determines whether or not you have net storage or net deposition this same thing for high carb diet as well. You know this idea that with high insulin, it just completely shut down all fat-burning everywhere. That's just not true. Now, if you have high carbohydrate, you will burn less fat, but you're also storing less fat as well. And again, the net caloric balance is going to be what determines how much you store because you don't really store Cobra hydrate as fat for most people, they did a study overfeeding win where they over fed them, fifty percent above their caloric maintenance, and they found that of two hundred eighty two grams of fat that they store during a day and adipose only four grams came from carbohydrate, two hundred seventy eight came from fat. So glucose. What about fructose? So fructose causes, we thank you know, non alcoholic, fatty liver disease. So that could be, you know, that's de Novo of de Novo, let Genesis is higher with fructose and you're thinking about people, consuming it in liquid drinks, a hundred two hundred grams a day, which is not uncommon even for my wife, not uncommon. So I does does seem to have a little bit of different paddock yet metabolism, but others actually across the hall from a professor who was doing a lot of the research on for dose and obesity and fatty liver disease. And even he came to the conclusion that if you overfeed for dose and it creates a caloric power is our and your overfeeding for does, then you can have some walkie stuff start to go on relative to other microbes die, trying to keep this right next to your face. Sorry, got it. Because that's when she says so powerful. I talked about a lot good. So I, if you're if you're doing that, if you're creating that caloric surplus, what you find is when you're in net storage, when you're driving more. Nutrients into adipose and sometimes liver depending on metabolism, but it takes it takes a lot of fructose to do that and caloric surplus. You start to create a lot of walkie stuff going on. The modern Qendra starts to become dysfunctional and people make a big deal about, oh, well, you have. We have claimed now that everything causes. Obesity and type two diabetes. For I, it was fats then carbohydrates, and there's actually professors out there who actually will claim the protein gives you diabetes nice dot com. I mean, the mitochondria becomes dysfunctional how does the mitochondria how how does that happen? Okay, so I'm going to state for everybody. I'm going out on a limb. This is my opinion. Okay. If you look at the research on obesity and diabetes. What happens is you have everything start to elevate in the bloodstream. So if you measure like there was a professor who thought that branch chain amino acids, we're causing obesity because they were elevated in the bloodstream during. Sorry, during type two diabetes? Well, yeah, brench amino acids are elevated, so fatty acids. So try so glycerin. It's so as glucose. So is it really those things causing it, or is it possible that when you are overfeeding relative to what you burn relative to that turnover? That MC Qendra start to become dysfunctional probably a lot due to inactivity and the Monica Andrea is as we call the powerhouse of the cell is probably learned in high school biology or whatever. They taught it to you as. That is where everything fluxes through. So that is where you creating ATP. That's where you're burning through lipids carbohydrates, that sort of thing. If that becomes dysfunctional and you're not getting enough flux enough, pull through that might of Qendra. What happens is you start to back up every part of metabolism. So all the metabolic byproducts, almost all them in hit everything within the cell's metabolism signature for that and epi phenomenon. If you wanna call it that the elevated brands jam, you know acids because consequence of that and some people. Yeah. So these things start these byproducts, these metabolic byproducts because you're not flexing enough through the cell. They start accumulating within the cell and start to inhibit the Krebs cycle glycolysis. And so everything starts backing up to the point where you also start inhibiting the insulin receptor, and now you have glucose fatty acids. And I mean, it's also backing up to the point where they start to overspill into the bloodstream. And you see these, this accumulation. Of all of them in the bloodstream and type two diabetes. And I actually think that again, Migo limb that obesity doesn't call type two diabetes and type. Two diabetes doesn't cause obesity that they develop in concert from the same problem, which is overfeeding under activity. So a lot of it is about how much nutrients your flexing into cells versus how much energy you're creating, flexing them through the sellin out. So when you're overfeeding, whether it be Cobra hydrate, fat, you're flexing more energy in than you can dispose of and now you have to do something with it. Well, when you run out of when you do that much to it and might start to become dysfunction dysfunctional you start to not have enough places to put it away and it starts spilling into the bloodstream and now you 'cause all kinds of problems. So one of the things that we really wanted to talk about here is high carb versus low carb, because this is a just a giant point of contention today, nutrition. Especially in terms of athletes with performance in mind. That's it's a big factor whether or not high carb low carb is way to go. And there's a lot of zealots on both sides, and there's a lot of bullshit and there's a lot of, you know, online experts and one of the great thing about bringing you two guys in here is because you could really actually explain the science behind it. Now you've been great lane at pointing out that there's it's not a magic bullet and you know, and so many people like to sort of stress it that way. They like to portray Kita genyk diet as this is this is the end all be all figured out what to do. This is the way everyone should be eating. You don't think so. I don't think so because if you look at the the weight loss problem in our society and I'm writing a book called fat loss forever, will I talk about this in detail? We don't have a weight loss problem, six out of every seven people were able to lose a significant amount of body weight in their life who are obese or overweight. The problem is the weight regain statistics are absolutely terrifying within one year, seventy percent will put it all back on within two years. It's eighty five percent within three years. It's ninety five percent. So that means diets have ninety five percent failure rate and of those people. One third to two thirds added more than they originally lost. And this gets kind of into yo-yo, dieting, and I talk about that as well. But the the real problem is that people don't stick to pick something that's sustainable for them all the research. If there's one bit of research out there that that we have that shows how to create lasting weight loss. And you look at the people who are the five. Percent who actually keep it off. It's that they pick something that's sustainable, whether it be to genyk, whether it be low carb high or low fat, whatever it is vegan, something that they can sustain and make a lifestyle. If because if you look at meta-analyses for our listeners, mid analyses are kind of a study of studies. So they take researchers take studies that have similar parameters, and they kind of lump them together and they look at, okay, what's the consensus amongst these studies? And they have advanced, the ticks. They used to run this. If you look at low carb versus low fat. There's no difference in adherence overall on the whole, there's no difference and there's no difference in weight loss. There's no difference in blood lipids, even glycemic control. So there was a study where they met analysis of, I think it was twenty three studies over three thousand people where they looked at, okay, if you control calories. So calories are acquainted, does low carb versus low fat. Make a difference on weight loss glycemic control. Those necessarily the Keita genyk diet. So by definition, we have an objective biomarker that defines the key to genyk die is the only diet that actually has something that you. You can measure your blood, say you're on this diet, and when you're key tuned levels are elevated, that can firs many different benefits that I believe can enhance adherence to the diet. Before we get into the woods here, I want to clarify one thing. The difference between someone being on a diet and being able to sustain it and not being able to stand in getting all the way back. Isn't that a. Discipline issue. Well, partly, but we kind of have to start looking at, okay, if we, if we go in, we maybe circle. We have to find what requires the least amount of discipline for somebody to stick to. Because discipline is is while some people have more, some people have less. It is a finite resource. So when do we only find that people like kind of drop off whatever they're doing, it's when they're stressed out, work stress in the mount, going through a divorce, those kinds of things, right. That's where our disciplined kind of Wayne's because we're trying to be so disciplined for this other thing and it's draining us. So what happens with with diet is in people who are busy people who have a lot of stress in their life. That's what they really start over eating. So we have to find something that require I look at his. Let's find something that requires the minimum amount of of discipline for a person so that when your life goes to absolute shit. You can still stick to it. And so for some people that is a very, very individual thing. And they see this in the dietary studies that what works for one person to create a deficit and sustainable isn't the same way for another person and Dom even commented on this about his wife Chila. She does much better on a higher ratio of carbohydrates fats yet. I mean, early on it was obvious that she wasn't going to change your diet. I the time that we met like ten years ago most we, I was really getting into this and I really fell that for me at least. But she would stop at Chequers and you don't get a burger and sugary drinks, and she's tremendously carbon tolerance. She was very skinny as a kid, and she me. Carbohydrate. She's very carbohydrate, tolerant. Did I say dollar? Yeah, so and you know, if the diet low carb, I feel and maybe in Kita genyk putting under- that umbrella works, I think for up to twenty five to thirty percent of people, especially at their carbohydrate intolerant. And I believe that it does that by virtue of elevating tones shifting your the neuropharmacology of the brain. For example, it works through Grell in it works through those new science emerging right now, showing that appetite regulation is influenced positively by nutritional ketosis in ways that we're just starting to learn now, but you can certainly feel it. It's one of the things about the genyk diet. When you're in that state all of a sudden you're just not hungry. The is is not a an overwhelming need for food. Yeah, I'm I haven't had anything to eat today. I mean when I was eating massive plates. Of pasta twenty five years ago. And I went to this this long without food. I would start getting shaky I would. I would have a hypoglycemic response and I'm completely resilient to that. And that has major implications for military personnel being Kito adapted, not just for performance preventing seizures, and I think for cognitive function to, but you, it's very liberating. So meal frequency is not an issue. So if you're in austere environments where you have limited food availability, that becomes a major issue. And if you're working as a scientist and you can't, you know, you're working with animals, you're doing experiments. You don't have time to eat. I need to maintain that cognitive functioning to be sharp, you know, with limited food. So it worked very good for me throughout my professorship, getting tenure and things like that, where I could just put more time and energy into my work without having to stop prepare a meal, eat a meal, clean up. Like I think I wasted a lot of time doing that when I was eating five to six meals a day. He said something. I think you've called bullshit on before the phrase carb intolerant. So yes. So that was actually going to be one of the things because, hey, we have something we could disagree about his carb tolerance car pro would you would say how we define that? Yes. So define it by blood marker, your glucose response to a meal. Okay. So a couple of things I wanna come right out and frame this whole discussion real quick. So we both agree that in terms of weight loss and body composition that your total calorie intake per day is the most important thing, correct? Yes. I believe that Kita genyk strategy is a way to regulate that, right? So with with carbon tolerance, if if you look at the benefits of like on blood glucose blood lipids, it is almost ninety to ninety five percent explained by weight loss. So beauty, you can take people put them on a high carb, very low, fat diet, their blood glucose, and they're both lipids will drop. E- even with like higher insulin levels than people who are on a low carb diet, if they're gonna calorie restriction after calorie restricted. Now, again that that becomes a very individual thing. I, you know, if somebody says, hey, I like Akita genetic diet. Because for me, it helps me to create a calorie deficit. I can stick to it. Hey, knock yourself out. That is no problem, but that is not always going to work. Some people don't feel that say she on the key to genyk diet. There are people who do feel hungrier on that. So that is a very individual response. And again, who we look at studies, we're looking at means right, so we're talking about averages and there are outliers, like if you look at any galaxy and distribution chart, which is kind of how populations distribute based on a certain treatment, you have about sixty to seventy percent that fall into the the average. Then you have another ten twenty percent that are kind of do a little bit better one way versus the other. And then you have five percent on either end that are sorry. Two and a half percent on either ended are outliers, right? So. Just to frame this again, let's take weightlifting, we know weightlifting makes you bigger and stronger, right? Like that is not up for debate. We agree on that. There are studies that have shown that some people who are beginners, where you should be gaining a lot of muscle very quickly. Some people will go from the first time they walk in the gym squat. Ninety five, twelve weeks there squatting four hundred pounds. Some people don't get stronger. They've actually been studies where over twelve weeks, there's a few individuals who did not get stronger. So those are outliers right there. So we circle this back to kinetic diet. I'm not sitting here and saying that somebody may actually physiologically do better on Akita genyk diet versus a lower fat diet. That's a very individual response. But when we start making recommendations for people, what we should start with is okay, created calorie deficit that allows you to lose some weight because if we look at the studies and we look at if we acquaint for protein because that's a big thing. So if you look at some of the studies where Volk did where he compared like. You're kind of food guide pyramid type diet to a ketogenic diet. The ketogenic diets were a little bit higher protein that protein has Thermo genyk effect, and also an appetite suppression effect. When you acquaint for those. And there's been thirty two studies. There was a recent mid analysis done a thirty two studies of the Quaker for calories and protein. Absolutely no difference in fat loss when you quit for those two calories and protein because proteins a big one because protein has a big benefit on Thermo Genesis and weight loss also lean body mass retention, which is huge because one of the reasons people regain weight is because when they lose weight, they tend to lose fat and muscle when they regain it, it's almost all fat in the initial phase. As far as that did, it may not have included data with the to genyk diet. So I know you know, when I did the Di, I've seen a lot of blood work. So for example, my hemoglobin h one c triglycerides h. s. p. goes down, insulin goes down, blood pressure goes down and that that. All those all those changes happened without my body weight changing. So that would kind of argue against that you needed a calorie deficit, and I've seen it many times. But once you could, I could be eating eighty to ninety percent carbs and reduced my body way and get changes and all that I could actually increase my carbs. And if I create a calorie deficit, you know, my hemoglobin h one, we'll go down my sugar. We'll go down and things like that. So that is really the dry. That's like that trumps everything that calorie so that that's an important thing. But so that's what that's what I think a lot of people miss. Okay. I think that that what I'll say is, sorry, I'll just saying like, I think that's very powerful to that. These changes that I just mentioned can occur without with without changing your body weight. So they are just your fundamentally changing your metabolism when you do that from car. And that has pretty wide-ranging implications. So I, I think that what I'm going to say is. That if you, if we're going to talk about people getting healthier, the first thing we need to start with is, let's not lose fifty percent argon about five percent, right? So if I tell somebody, hey fund tonight, you can stick to that sustainable. And if you can lose ten percent, you can lose ten percent of your body weight even for obese people. They almost all the health benefits in the first ten percent now. Now maybe some people like you or people who respond really well to a ketogenic diet. I'm not again, there's outliers or people on the other sides of the galaxy and curve. If you do a little bit better on their than great. But if you find a key, Ginny diet is completely unsustainable for you, and you're not, you're not able to stick to it, but you're trying to do it because you're trying to get a little bit better blood glucose regulation. You're you're, you know, you're shooting yourself in the foot because if you could stick to, like, let's say for the individual, a higher carb diet was easier for them to stick to. They could lose weight on that. Then that's the bulk of their health benefits they're going to get from it. I'm having a hard time with these terms easier because don't know exactly why it would be easier, wouldn't be easier. And I always wonder again, is this a discipline issue? Because that's that's your experience? Yeah, it comes for sure who'd preference, but I believe that by when you follow low carb, not even Kita genyk diet, the variability of the fluctuations in your insulin and blood glucose, the postprandial dip and blood glucose that you get after that's virtually abolished or significantly attenuated. And then you have a, you know, he tones are working through gremlin. For example. You could just, you could eat a normal diet and drink tones, and it's actually suppressing your appetite through Grellet. So we know that these changes reductions and girl and you're saying, yeah, so to these changes, sort of are happening, but there my sister, for example, you know, followed the ketogenic diet and found it easy to. Follow, but she gained weight because she was eating all these fat bombs that she was making. So she. And a lot of people don't necessarily need a nutritionist, tell them what they need, like nutritional psychotherapist or something. You know, their relationship with food is really, and I think that's what lane has a firm grasp on. There's no substitute for experience lane has worked with so many different clients and knows that, you know, you could probably fall the huge ain't dot your listeners. Probably fans accuse yanked. I can do it. I love fatty food. You know, I've food low carb, but generally speaking, it's, you know, you have to approach it from the perspective sort of eating behavior, and that's, that's really people want to go off the diet. It's just a natural human trait. Yeah, it's a weird psychological trait, right? Yes. What cheat you wanted to stuff your face with cupcakes every now and then and then you just you feel like it's too much torture to keep yourself on the narrow path of high fat, low carb, moderate protein, but you know, five years ago, ten years ago, that was the case. But now there's Kita genyk brownies or key. Eugenic cookies. There's many different food check out, check it. I've tried tried so hard. Go to Kito. We have a real one, an Akito cookie fucking gets eaten every time. Yeah. Well, they, they are evolving just food technology. All some of them have no food. Make some good stuff. Go go to Kito nutrition dot ORG, and there's some things there that are. I would say about ten or twenty percent pass the test, meaning that they taste. Okay. And they actually do what they say. They actually elevate key tunes or don't cause a glycemic response. Some of those key to cookies seem like they have no foundation like you Biden. They like the go away. Like as you're eating them, it's like they dissolve, you know, they're not like you have a good toll house cookie, a good real chocolate chip cookie bite into that sucker, you know, it's bad for you, but God damn, it feels good while it's be tried the quest protein cookies. Yes, they're dead pretty pretty good. Yeah, they can't fuck with real cookies. Well, I dip, I dip them in like sour cream, eat them coconut cream. So then it becomes Gita Jay. It's a commitment that you bring that up interesting though. If you look at people think they're addicted to sugar sugar's a lot. If you look at things like cookies and cakes, it's actually they have more calories from fats than they do sugars. It's sugar and fat together is hyper palatable mud. So we now, one of the things I was going to bring up is, you know this, I, the sugar is so inherently bad, and you said the cookie, you know, we've you that as an inherently bad thing. But what if I told you that certain people not everybody, everybody's different, but there are certain people who if you tell them, hey, you can have that cookie every once in a while if you track, we're going into your macro nutrient intake that that's fine that that actually improve their adherence to diet. So because you give them a reward, no, not a reward system. You're not a dog, don't reward yourself. Okay. Because because increase flexibility actually usually improves it here. It's so we see this actually with training to athletes are when you do a flexible training model where they have to get in the certain amount of training, but they can pick. And choose their self, which days are hard, which days are a little bit. They actually do better. Diet is very similar to that. So now you always have to sacrifice something in order to if you want to lose weight. Right? So if you're doing ketogenic diet, which are sacrificing say, well, I liked the spontaneous reductions and appetite, so I don't mind eating not these foods so I can get that if you're doing like kind of what I don't want to say 'i popularized it, but myself and some other people on the message boards popular is something called flexible, dieting where you can eat, essentially, whatever you want. As long as you hit your protein, Kobe hydrating fat targets. Now what you're sacrificing is, okay, you're tracking every day. Do you ended up through an app through what an app? No, I'm old school. I actually just do it through excel. I've my girlfriend Holly. She has an app on her phone like she. She has me like if she's driving saying, oh, we put it when I just ate. I'm like, babe. I don't even know no idea how to work this thing. You know. So because. When I went to do my graduate studies. I mean, I wanted to find magic foods. I wanted to find something that would because how else can you make a living? You have to set yourself apart. I mean, if I'm over here saying it's hard for me to sell what I what I do because I'm saying, well, everything in moderation, and you've gotta be diligent and you've got to have these behaviors that doesn't sound sexy when there's another guy over here saying now, bro. It's just carbs. I know what tablets, complicated and everything, but it's just carbs. You know when I started working with people that I've worked with over fifteen hundred people coaching in nutritional line over the past thirteen years, which actually probably taught me more than my the my PHD did. What I found was is that people were so different individually in terms of what, what made them tick. You know now I feel like I should probably go back and get someone to biologically what makes them tick or psychologically both both. So I can't sit here and say by the research that that Cobra hydrate versus fat makes a difference on fat loss. But what I can't tell you is that some people just seem to do better on lower carb, higher fat. But also some people I worked with just seem to do better with higher carb, lower fat. Now, whether that's a psychological thing or physiological thing, it's hard to tease out Neta too. I think we all have different snips. You know that some people have suppressed fatty acid, oxidation pathways, other or screaming, fat, metabolize IRS, you know, or fat or sugar metabolisers. Yeah, so, but if you look at. I remember I had a conversation with with the the researcher Dr nakimora Illinois, who was doing some of that. I does stuff when I was when I was a first year grad suit. I said, what's this? This high fructose corn syrup. This is what's causing obesity, right? And he's like, well, it's easy to over consume. You know, like if you take a soda and you drink it, you not less hungry than you were stop very satiated. He said, but if you're if you're controlling your calories, it doesn't seem to be more like a genetic than comparable carbohydrate. And I thought, remember thinking that can't be right. I all these people say that high fructose corn syrup is like the worst thing in the world for you. There was there was a few studies that really changed by opinion on sugar. Now the listeners are going to hear this and think that I'm advocating for sugar. I'm not you're not talking about in the in the context of a calorie surplus. Coast can, which is kind of explains the state of the United States. You know. Yardley. So if you look at sugar intake does so this kind of gets back to the carbohydrate, insulin obesity model. If you look at sugar and take over the last fifty years or less hundred years, it went up very steadily with obesity until around the mid nineties, and then it took a sharp dip while the continued to climb. Again, that's just correlation data. But if you do look at the overall calorie intake versus obesity rates, it's like an r. square two point nine four, which is really the sugar include high fructose corn syrup. Is that lumped into. So this was added sugars. This was out sugars, but there was a study done by a metabolic ward study. So stop you there. Are you saying that this is added sugars, not high fructose corn syrup. So when you talk about the graph of consumption, that sugar dropped off, but high fructose corn syrup did not. Is that because that took over many of the products. So this increase in abusively, but a decrease in sugar consumption. But you're not saying decrease in high fructose corn syrup consumption. So I don't know that I'd have to look that up. So here, here's here's me being a scientist and saying the three words, I don't know. Last conscious I went to show that like the rise of the last ten to fifteen years like skyrocketing with high fructose corn syrup. And because sugar was taken out, hyper towards corn syrup is subsidized but farmers a lot cheaper. And would you agree that it's essentially your body? The way processes is essentially the same sugar versus high fructose corn syrup. Callo coury well, so sugar sucrose is fifty percent. Glucose fifty percent fructose hovered is going up is fifty. Five percent fructose Forty-five percent glucose. But if you're saying that that five percent is what's creating obesity. Now again, psychologically some people just down sodas, like it's their job if you're doing that, especially as children, that's a big big no-no. Whether it's the Mexican kind with the cane sugar, we have kids now with high with non alcoholic, fatty liver disease, and that did not exist. But I would say because we got a little kids and I think that's from corn syrup. I think it's it's due to an excess surplus calories and those surplus calories being high fructose corn syrup. So if you're if you're used to eat a certain amount of calories and you may and we back when we were actually maintaining your weight back in before the sixties. We reading about twenty two hundred calories a day. That was the average. And now it's like twenty. Eight hundred is the the average consumption. The United States amongst adults. I think I eat a lot more than that. What would you train? You train, you have a higher lean body mass, so that's that's. That's fine. Now, some people we, that's a whole other rabbit hole. The if you if you start adding sodas in which art satiated at all, they don't positively affect your hunger hormones, but you continue your same normal food intake, boom. I mean, you can start to store, right? So, but I can't tell somebody, hey, there's no way you can lose weight and drink soda because that's not true. There was a study done by a Surwitt and they looked at hypoglycemic diet versus low glycemic. And I mean extreme. They did a one group had over one hundred grams of sugar day. Another group had ten grams or less per day are. Sorry. I was eleven grams or less per day, and they looked at the differences in weight loss, blood, lipids, all that kind of stuff. Edit carbohydrate. So the group that eight, ten grams of sugar less today the day, eat the same amount of total carbohydrates same. Oh, toll carbs. Okay. So. Yeah, process carb can spike your glucose more than Jaeger. Right? So they did have a fire, higher fiber intake, but what what they did find that they had higher insulin responses to the meal. The high sugar group did, but no differences the weight loss. So they'll both both groups lost weight. The only real difference was the lower glycemic group had a little bit better. Both groups improve improve cholesterol. The lower glycemic group had just a little bit better improvement probably because they were eating higher fiber, which can bind cholesterol excreted. I would like to see what happened if they acquitted. So again, it's it's creating that calorie deficit, both groups lost weight now, is it more difficult to create a calorie deficit if you're eating a lot of sugar? Yes. Okay. So I always tell people your diet is like a budget if you're practicing something like flexible, dieting, right? So if I've got somebody like myself who has above average muscle mass, hope that can say that and people on the internet. Probably going to do. A shirt with his name older. So. Okay. I'll say you have above average muscle mass. Thank you. Welcome. So so if you have both vegetables semes- you train hard. You have a faster metabolism naturally. I mean, I've seen people who could maintain their body weight on six, seven thousand calories a day. You have a higher metabolic rate. You have a really big budget. So if you make one hundred million dollars a year, is it a big deal for you to go out and buy a five hundred thousand dollar sports car? If you can still pay your mortgage and pale other requirements to have? No, it's fine. But if you make eighty grand a year, she'd you go out and buy a five hundred thousand dollar sports car, probably not right. And if you make thirty should be on the keyboard. If you well, you have increased meditation, see. So it's the same thing. So like people. So pop tart somehow became the the model of the flexible dieting movement because people were, here's why it's kind of like counterculture. So pop tart zealots out there. It's like whatever you have. So clean eating, became a thing amongst bodybuilding. We we see e clean, even though there's no objective chicken bay. There's no objective definition that so people were like, oh yeah. Well, I'm getting shredded pop tart every day, right? So a lot of your followers do that. They do now. I don't even pop tarts. Did you start this. I don't know who else? Let me let me put to this. So it's more about people saying, hey, I can still eat these foods. I enjoy it. I'm still losing weight because I'm with I'm gonna calorie deficit and I'm hitting my protein carbon fat targets. But if you're somebody with a slow metabolism and exercising very much and maybe all your eating is one hundred grams of carbs a day. Should you spend seventy five grams of those carbs on to pop tarts? Hell no, that's a terrible idea because you're not going to be able to hit your micronutrients in those sorts of things. But if you're eating four thousand calories like an Albert, oh, Nunez friend of ours. If you're eating four thousand calories and losing weight, is it a big deal if he has to pop tarts? Not really because he, I actually had one competitor. Again, a competitor who had such a fast metabolism that he was actually having a lot of GI dysfunction because he he, he was eating like seven hundred grams of carbs in two hundred grams of fat per day just to maintain his weight. And he said, I feel. Floated all the time. And I said, well, what are you eating? Like? What are your foods as chicken? Rice and broccoli? And I said, a peanut butter for fats and I'm like, well, no wonder, do you're having one hundred and fifty grams of fiber a day? You're you're literally full of shit. Like your shit is like lily backed up to yourself against. Okay. So I said, do me a favor, eat some pizza, eat some pop tarts, eat some more caloric dense foods and fell to three days. He told me after three days he was like, I feel so much better. I dropped like three pounds. I feel amazing because seems to make any sense on reservoir, the pop tart generation. He also inspired and I watched this play out online. You sound really bad. Well, lane actually inspired a generation of drugfree bodybuilders to go and do their knees, you know? And actually when one's in my lab right now, meander, Andrew, Kootenai, yeah, amazing student. And I think he he learned a lot just from watching. So I think. You know that it was amazing to see these guys eating that amount of pop tarts and junk foods and Bill. And I learned a lot from that, but I think they could do it with with better carbohydrates. So. So what works for performance? What works for bodybuilding may not be is probably not optimal for long jetty and health so that that's an important point. You know, lane wins. I, yeah, I audio this high. Okay. So I I know where he's coming from, but you know, I'd like to hear his opinion so to before you do that, why do you think that it would be an issue? What? What would be the issue with sugar and with pop tarts and junk food? What would be the negative effects? Biolog-? I think the accumulation of the post-prandial spikes in glucose and insulin overtime, especially in the context of calorie surplus could be about thing. If you are doing a calorie surplus to examp-, for example, to gain weight and mass over time which body. Do you know, following contest in the off season? I think it's even more important almost to actually stick with foods, carbohydrate, sources that are lower glycemic. You know, you can only tolerate so much fiber, but I think if you are running a calories or if you are doing Jennings diet and you have calories or plus, that could be a bad thing, you're trigly- your this rise will go up. So you are. You're putting too much fat in the system and that it would go up on a higher Corp diet. It higher carb diet, too. So I mean, I kind of would stay along the lines of maybe protein, but you just you titrate it in in a reasonable amount. But I, I just think that the negative, you know, that could come out of that is that you're you. You know, I'm following a blood glucose curve, right and insulin curve. And I see this very dramatically. For example, in my my student who's a type one diabetic Andrew Kootenai who's in and he wears the decks com a continuous glucose monitoring system and. And his insulin requirements dramatically dropped with low carb and his glucose fluctuations dramatically improved. And that's gonna pay big dividends probably if you have type one diabetes ever, you know the ten top things on how humans die. You have a greater risk for everyone of those, you know, dramatic cuts, ten years off your life. If the tighter, you can keep your glucose levels, your blood glucose in your insulin levels. That in the long run, I feel it's gonna pay. The science still has to show that. I think it's not totally clear, but I think we can for type one diabetics, which I think we can apply that data to to the population if they control their glucose levels that pays big dividends in the long run lane. So a couple of days? Yes. She touched on a couple of points I was going to bring up, but I want to just one thing I, which is the higher postprandial insulin and those the negative effects on. Health. So if you have they've done studies on this on BMI versus insulin. Now by as we can debate about how useful measure it is, but in general, reflects body fat in the average population, not in lifters, but in the average BMI by the way for people who are listening is a ratio of your height versus your weight that generally reflects obesity and you're obese. Yeah. So if you lift weights. Morbidly obese. It seems so silly it is. But if you look at the general population who doesn't exercise, it's actually pretty darn accurate. Get factored into your insurance though, which is not as it relates yours. That's diarrhea. So you look at you and say, don't Bs. Some insurances will do a waste chest measurement which which helps. But anyway, so postprandial insulin, they've looked at the relationship between people who have their BMI's and postprandial insulin. They find the people with higher BMI have higher postprandial insulin. But the opposite relationship does not hold true people who have higher insulin do not necessarily have higher BMI and they've done this meta analysis. So what that says again, that if you are obese type two diabetic metabolic syndrome profile that you have elevated levels of insulin because your body's becoming insensitive to it because of all the dysfunction that we talked about. But just because you secrete higher insulin doesn't mean that you're going to have more body fat, and there was a study done actually by one of the proponents of the carbohydrate, insulin hypothesis that looked at what's called mentally in random position where basically the idea is you have different gene. It's like we were talking about and if for example, like they've done this with LDL cholesterol are yes, LDL cholesterol. We believe most people believe LDL cholesterol has some contribution towards heart disease. It's a pretty, I would say it's a pretty strong now. People can over controversial. Okay, context, dependent and individual who they look at these. These gene variants people who have gene variants, where they run lower LDL, have lower rates of of heart disease. People who were higher higher gene bench. If you look at that with insulin at best insulin, explains ten percent of obesity at at absolute best. And that study actually showed a high level of bias. It was between one to ten percent, so we're not. I'm not putting out the the idea that maybe insulin has some tells you about fasting insulin or postprandial Linson overall, overall, I I'm guessing probably more so fasting had measure. Enslin. I mean, we, we have hemoglobin hba one c for like a, you know. There was another meta analysis where they looked at higher carb versus lower carb diets. Equating calories looking at hba one c and saw that. So the the, the differences in weight loss different. Like we've discussed when calories are acquainted, but also the differences in HP. Once he reduction, we're different. They were the same. Now you asked about health and you know consuming some of these quote, unquote, bad foods if you do it in the, but you you said in the context of a caloric surplus, right? Which is the important thing because they helped to create a surplus, but in a deficit, what? What's the downside? Because kind of when you talk to people who are not not key to genetic necessarily proponents of quote, unquote, clean eating, which again has no real objective definition when you say, okay, well, a pop tart, maybe you can lose weight, but it can't be good for you. Okay. Well, then we have to have some objective measurement to show this by right? Like, because otherwise it's do you believe in magic. Okay. So if you look at processed foods, what they have found with processed foods is that you have a lower energy expenditure from them. Okay. So you have a certain amount of what we call t.f thermic affective food. Higher protein has a higher t.f than carbohydrate and fat. Okay. So we know the higher protein diets actually caused more weight loss and better lean body mass petition. Part of that is through the the increase them Genesis of of the food. Well, with processed foods, you have a lower TANF. Okay. But that doesn't mean you can't eat any processed foods and lose weight. You can you just need? You might have to eat a little bit lower calories overall. Does that make sense? If there was a Kita genyk pop tart and it was made with with selection. We know that if we almonds were probably, you know, other nuts or things is giving me an example. You know, we don't fully. Digest assimilate and utilize those calories. They pass through us. So with a pop tart, I think it's pretty high, like raw like like a salad and with nuts and things like that. Like it becomes significant overtime with pop tart like you can basically a one hundred percent of that is going into your system and it's causing a hormonal response. So the food that we eat creates is not only calories but creates a hormonal response, and also from the brain perspective can change the neuropharmacology of your brain. I mean, that's how I got into the Keita genyk diet because it fundamentally changes neurotransmitter systems and reward systems and things like that, right? But hormones people get so hung up on hormones. And if you look at the research, they just doesn't support it like with insulin. What now in terms of like losing weight and you're, you're what happens with lepton and Gretl in and all those kinds of things. That is a huge one of the one of the things we talked about before. The podcast started we had about thirty minute. Podcast. You know, people say things like one of the reasons people are really mistrustful of kind of the calories in calories out model is because it is viewed as a two isolated variables calories in and calories out our separate. That's not true calories in affects calories out. Okay, there are moving target. So people will say, well, I eight and a calorie deficit and I didn't lose weight. No, you eight in what you thought was a calorie deficit and you didn't lose weight, but if you didn't lose weight, it was not a calorie deficit by definition. So you're retaining water or something? Yeah. Who's we look at dieting like just dieting in general over time lowers your metabolic rate, right? So if you take somebody, they actually did a rat study again, rats, but rats tend to respond pretty similar to humans. And would you agree with that in terms of blood, you do a lot of rats is a lotta rats in mouse studies. Yeah, I think there's a lot of overlap there. Yeah. So. But we have to put that out there because we want to. We don't want to oversell it. They did a depends on the context of what you're studying. Of course. Yeah. Like answer. Animal studies can be helpful, but you don't want to do an insulin study and cows room ruminants and they're, they don't care about insulin anyway. They took rats, they took him through to diet cycles. Okay. So this is kind of back to the yo dieting thing and they looked at, okay, and they took obese rats, died them down to a kind of normal level. Then they let them, they basically gave him as much as they wanted. Let them eat back to the original obese level died down again to the previous level, and then let them read back up what they felt was absolutely astonishing their food efficiency with so far up because their metabolic rate became suppressed. Every time they died down your body. Has this self defense system that you activate time, you diet? I talk about this in my shameless plug book, so the first time they died. If that's the kind of one times rate that they lost fat, when they let them regain it, they regained it twice as fast as they lost it. Then the second time they tried to lose it. Lost it at half the original rate. Then when they regained the second time, they regained it three times as fast the food efficiency way up there -bility to lose it. Have you noticed this? Well, what's that? Lose it. Get. Eventually faster as well? No, no. They're doing it took him twice as long to lose the same weight. So I probably didn't explain it very well. Yeah, it took him twice as long to lose the same amount of weight and they regained a third, the time of the original. So your body's getting accustomed to famine? Exactly because every time you diet and we see this with yo-yo dieters who spend, how many people do you know that seem to be perpetually on a diet? Yeah, but they just had that short overfeeding period in between diets and. It really does because every time you died, you're activating your body self defense system. How many fighters do you know that every time they died, it gets harder and harder for them to make weight while they're doing more than that, they're cutting weight. The cutting weight is ruthless, essentially almost dying, right? The part of that is they're, they're having to crash diet super-low. So what does the savior you're telling your body? Because you have to always think about things from it evolutionary perspective, my PHD advisor was great about this. He'd always ask his name was Dr Don Lehman, brilliant guy. And he would say, why do you think the body did this? Well, if you think about what of the regulatory mechanisms on becoming fat versus becoming too thin? Right. So one one danger is you starve to death, the other dangerous. You get so fat that predator can come get you which is more dangerous in the last twenty thousand years. It's famine. It's famine, so your body creates much tighter self defense system there. So when you diet, your metabolic rate slows way down. I mean, if you've you've ever these guys who cut wait. So by the time they're ready to get fight. For example, their metabolic rates really slow. Then what happens after they fight, they eat a crap ton of food because they're, they're, they're Gretl in his way up left in his way down insulin, his way down and they regain it really fast. Now, what happened safe to assume just energetic that if you diet for sixteen weeks for a show, for example, or contest what you actually educated me in like ten years ago, and I thought there was this like post-contest rebound and in two weeks, it'd be this anabolic window or whatever, edible fat, mid. Actually, if you die hard for sixteen weeks to make way it takes an equal amount of time to get your metabolism actually to that level. Again, maybe so lane coined a term reverse dieting river. I don't know if I call pointed, we wanted in coin with metabolic chambers in rats and use a variety of different approaches to determine how fast it it actually takes to to bring your metabolism backup. If different strategies can be used to ramp up your metabolism because when you regain it, you regain fat really quickly, but your metabolic rate is more sluggish to return. So they actually did a study with the the biggest loser participants. And this is why I'm so big, what is sustainable, the that has to be sustainable, they looked at so they lost on average like quite a bit of weight. I can't remember the exact numbers, but they lost a bunch weight over the thirty weeks because they starve them and they exercise the crap out of them and they saw that their metabolic rate. Dropped five hundred calories more than you would predict just by the amount of body fat and lean body mass. They lose. This is what's called metabolic tation when when you define metabolic rate dropping within, but that was the so so you have so we can calculate all this stuff. So your overall total daily energy expenditure, your TD is made up of your basil metabolic rate, which is what you burn. Like what we're doing right now, just sitting around doing knock surgeon consumption, c, o two production actually, actually due to be mocked to be real. It's just laying down doing nothing. So basically the energy burn keeping the lights on, right? That's one component. It's about fifty to sixty percent in most people. Then you have your meat which is like this, like I'm moving my hands ambulatory movement, non voluntary movement. This stuff will actually go down when you die. It. Like if you've ever been around even go down, yes, you stop. Fidget spontaneous goes down a huge modifier. So like if you look at identity VDI when I was prepping for show back in two thousand ten. I believe slower. I'm not kidding. You and I talk slower. I mind were like on valium and you're, you're all hyped up on in the life of lane as of dummies. Oh, absolutely. Like your, so your body, this is your body genyk diet would help you. So so when you think about, so there's neat that's that. Then you exercise activity, which is intuitive. That's how many calories Uber, exercising in the news, what's called the thermic effective food, which you already discussed, how much energy required to get energy out of food and all those add up to your total daily energy expenditure. And we can predict based on questions how what your metabolic rate should be. So these people, their metabolic rate was five hundred calories a day lower than it should have been just based off the weight they lost because if you lose muscle and you lose fat, you have less weight to carry around, right? So your metabolic rate goes down just from that, but it goes down way more than it should. That is you're the first prong of your body's self. Defense system to stop you from starving yourself is to become more efficient. We hear the word efficiency and we think, wow, that's that's a good thing. Think about if your body fat levels where gas tank and you you had a car, okay. You would not want to be efficient, right? You wouldn't have one of the old Suburbans. It was like half a mile per gallon, right? You don't want the Prius because you can go way longer. So going back to that study on rats, they became so much more efficient with their food. And this is the second of your body's self defense system is to not only slow down your metabolic rate while you're dieting, but to start activating systems that deal with restorage. Once you actually start overeating again, have you ever done a long diet or known somebody who did it and then they start eating again, it's like everything sticks to you. It's like you just it's like you like, how did I gained five pounds from one day and people like, oh, it's water. Well, what does it stay around for six months? So it's not water. That is your body, preparing all these systems. So even like enzymes that deal with fat storage while you're dieting actually go up because it's preparing your body for restorage and then even probably the most interesting thing is all falls back on the importance of tracking macro with completely ignored with guys coming off of a fight or fitness competitor. You will let yourself blow up really quickly. It's it's a myth that your body is set up to be anabolic or to gain muscle, your your setup for that. But the point of trying to make is that the way most people diet, which is kind of mean, you know, you've probably been around people who do this yoyo stuff. It's a lot of people. They pick the next fad diet, whatever's popular. They do it. They lose some weight and then every game at my dad lost twenty pounds and Akita. Genetic diet regained fifty right now. The real problem is in track as macrumors now he does, but the real problem and he's down thirty pounds again. But the. The real problem is. If we used to think adipose tissue is like a sponge, right? So if you ate too much you just through more in their right soaked up extra nutrients. And then if you started, if you're in a caloric deficit, you're losing weight. It just gave up some of its nutrients. You know, like the guy in faster for three hundred sixty five days and didn't die because he had so much so much fat. We know that body fat fits every definition of in the Indian system. It's tissue, it is an actual organ because it sends out hormonal signals, integrates hormonal signals. It talks to the brain behind brain argument nucleus. It is integrated and all of metabolism in a big way. And typically you have the way we gain fat or lose fat is based on the fat cell size. So you have a set number of fat cells and the other expand or this shrink pretty intuitive, unless now you can create more fat cells if you become so OB's that you literally can't stuff anymore fat in there. Right? So obese people have fat cell hyperplasia. A lot of times what's really interesting is people at the end of a diet. When you're when your thyroid hormone is lower your sympathetic nervous. System tone is lower. This unique hormonal may Lou if you overfeed too rapidly, there's a researcher named McLean out of Colorado. Actually the show that you can actually increase your fat cell number. If you overfeed too rapidly right after a diet. Now this was in rats full disclosure, but it was nothing stuff. You're insulting the total now you're increasing your body's, but it makes sense from an evolutionary perspective, your body's like shit. We had this famine. We don't want to deal with this shitty and we wanna make sure that we can store as much stuff as possible. So we're going to create some new. This dude is rapidly. Overfeeding, we're gonna create some new fat cells to make sure we're not going to miss any of this energy. We're going to capture every single bit of it. I'd like what you're saying and it makes a lot of sense you're, you're talking about weight loss and weight gain, but you were specifically discussing hormonal changes in the body due to the Keita genyk died that are beneficial and that these hormonal changes and the changes to the way the brain functions would be a benefit of following that diet versus just working on cowers. Yeah. I mean that book I gave you the complete book of key tones by Dr Mary. So so that won't. I don't think it's actually out yet. God get jacked. So key tones are handsome based on their a. There are sort of by definition have a metabolic superiority as a as a fuel source, you know, and they readily crossed blood brain barrier. They can largely replace glucose as a primary energy source in your brain under periods of fasting or ketogenic diet. So that that offers a lot of advantages to someone dieting because it makes you resilient like the guy that fast at three hundred eighty two days his glucose was was like thirty and dip down the twenty that would be universally fatal for most people, but as key tones were elevated. So he did not feel hunger so that that is true. Like the Kahlil studies, George k hill studies at Harvard Medical School, where they fasted subjects for forty days. They injected insulin to increase. What did that get? I remember presenting this lanes camp while back and I when I, you know, read the study. I had to call him on the phone. He was living. He passed away in two thousand twelve, but we had a number. Conversations before he passed away. And I was amazed that he got ethics approval do that because it's basically like killing someone injecting twenty. I use of insulin, but what was fascinating that they were ASEM dramatic for hypoglycemia at a level of hypoglycemia that's typically universally fatal, and they were also very cognitively lucid. And that was a dramatic demonstration at the time. It was thought that you know the brain could only use glucose. So this is a paradigm shift in the way we understand could sort of fuel utilization, particularly in the brain said that has major in I can go kinda on and talking about the different applications that cures yanked I, which I did on the first podcast, but from a perspective of someone dieting to lose weight, dieting as a lifestyle, doing intermittent fasting. Kita genyk diet makes intermittent fasting much easier because your brains adapted to it. That for me had tremendous practical applications at allowed me. I. Feel to excel through academe. Yeah, I was able to do a lot more work, not get hungry and and you know, we haven't trained in a while, but when we train last night we did. I mean, we were both deadly shooting, six seventy five for reps and I was on actually I was on the the the classical ketogenic diet. And then that's when I was just doing it and it out versus like eighty to ninety percent fat. I was doing that for about a year and you know, dead lifting like three times my bodyweight for for reps, you know and it didn't hurt me. I can't say that would be the case for everyone, but I also titrate the calories in. I wasn't really at a calorie deficit. I lost a little bit of ways. So I guess by definition I was at a calorie deficit now for people to think about gains trying to gain weight, they would think that the Keita genyk Dr that eighty ninety percent fat would not be enough protein. I believe that the Keita genyk diet shines when you are in a calorie deficit. I. My mentor for the cancer work Tom safer. It had published a study showing an unrestricted ketogenic diet can actually promote cancer growth in a in a brain tumor model. Unrestricted meaning too much calories. Yeah, they were feeding mice, a sugary Kita genyk formula that was on the market at the time. Well, it was a sweetened. I'm sorry. Sweet and ketogenic formula with hydrogenated fats and other things. Yeah, it was as we would maybe with aspartame or something like that, so they might tend to overeat it. And when they over eat it, you know, it creates a plethora of metabolic abnormalities and. You also get those same in rallies. When you overeat carbs, you didn't see. Here's me being just as a side. Note how much does it drive you guys crazy. When you hear about this fat acceptance thing or fat is healthy. Fat is much of this going around massively over obese people. They're trying to say it's okay. It's fine. Your football players, right. I mean by definition they're pretty healthy. I mean, they they live, they train metabolic, neither bloodwork kind of looks okay. So you have guts, but there. Surprise you with my answer. Okay. So we talked about this earlier. I'll take the heat, I'm a libertarian. So if somebody says, I'm fat and I'm happy and I like my life and I know what the risks are that I say, knock yourself out. I know not me for the judge what makes somebody else happy. But now the problem is if you complain about being fat than you gotta do something about it, otherwise you're not gonna have any patients. It goes back to the discipline, but you can be fit but fat yet you is because you have morbidly obese people. Like I said, if you lose ten percent of your body weight, there's there's overweight people who run marathons pressure. Yeah, you can't tell me they're not in shape. Yeah. Okay. I know for show just you're just carrying extra weight. I mean, look at Daniel cormier. He's not. He's he's not obese, but he has some of these fat. Don't come get me. Dan listening. I fought steep Amyot chick. He was more than forty pounds over his fighting weight as a light heavyweight champion. And he was actually heavier than St. pay, but and serve. The friend of mine. That is the performance is not the same thing as steps. Let me tell you what I look like that I looked amazing. You've felt shed felt like shit ready to pass out right. Literally for me to stand up was I remember being on the couch and there was a stupid, some show on. By lean dot com. There was a stupid show on TV in the remote was like, this is goes back to neat. There's a remote over there like five feet away. I sat and watched the whole show 'cause I just didn't feel like getting the fucking remote. So ironic, because you look so good. Like when you jacked like that, you look like you just fucking Ralph around breakthrough walls. Now there is a threshold, like, you know, some of the like Ray Williams who is the world's best powerlifter. I mean, he looks obese dude, squats legit. A thousand eighty pounds. Isn't that an issue with powerlifter? So a good percentage of them carry around a lot of body fat. It's not as much as you would think anymore. Like in the super heavyweights. Yes. Because like for example, the IPF which is kind of the recognized powerlifting federation than I competed their cut off for super heavyweights to sixty five. So if you're going to be super heavyweight, be three fifty, you know, was that dude Jamie? That's right. That's bets. Ray rated the bar bending, dude, that's he's he's a b. Gentlemen, super nice guy, blamed Sumner another one, but like when I sit my squat record of sixty eight at two, five pounds. I mean, I was in pretty good shape for that, but for me to get to like eight percent, body fat. No problem for me to get from eight percent, and I'm calibrating. So for me to get from eight percent to three percent. So fucking nightmare. Your body really get down to three on callup Casler. Yes, that would be if you floated, there are no actual accurate measures of body fat. That's the that's not really like the relatively within themselves. They're depend upon hydration factors, yes. So people not to make too much of a side tangent, but people look at Dexsa do x Ray absorption technology and they say, oh, that's the gold standard decks is actually really finicky. Like I remember Dexing rats in studies that we do it in duplicate. So we do it twice. And sometimes you have like differences just Dexing the same. Twice. It depends on the machine hydration status because water, if you wanna game, you know what the best way to gain eight pounds of lean body mass within five minutes go to a Dexsa than drinking water. Go back to another deck. So you'll be eight pounds, lean body, mass heavier. You can press your friends because it to to apartment model, more, lean body mass. It's a two compartment model. Same thing with calipers it's only measuring your amount of fat tissue. So anything that's not fat is lean body mass. So if you guys are using that to track progress, if anybody uses to track progress, it's all the accurate relative to the measurement. So your calipers me nothing for what your measurements going to be vice versa. I see. But the change, like if I'm Dexing calibrating. Consistently at ten percent, and then it drops to eight and seven, and I can be relatively confident that I'm losing body fat same thing for Dexsa, but you have to do at the same time of day same hydration status, all that kind of stuff. And I don't really use Dexsa because people in order to get accurate, you'd have to use it like every day for it to be actual relative views pictures. Right? So when he was dieting and got tweet certain point, hinge it here, like I looked at him. Okay. Yeah, like stop there. But then he would go for another and get to a level where he looked very gaunt. I mean, you looked what looks good. They're like seeing him in person like personality with was changing. I mean, it was kind of freaky disgusting looking towards the end and many people who maybe follow the sport, but don't compete. Don't really realize what the difference between five percent or six percent and three percents, so that separates the competitors from the the nets you Bros. online really fighting Aleutian at that point because your body is. You're close to starvation literally, your body's trying to keep you from doing that. So like you think about food all the time you actually become. So a friend of mine, Chris FOSS, who he's a professor now he was doing his PHD at the same time as me and him. My other friend, Dr, Jeremy leneke and Dr Lindy Russo Chris's wife, Chris was doing a contest prep. I prepped him for the show and it was a six month study of he's a natural bodybuilder. So drug free and they looked at the hormonal responses, his weight, his body, fat, and even like measures of mood. Chris's like the guy was a beast like to sixty or something. I mean, droid free Bajour to twenty in the off season about one nine. Okay. He did look like he, he's big guy, but he's a very mellow dude, but the in his mood measurements remeasuring like that of a psychopath. Yeah, it just changes your mood, his basal, metabolic fighters who like they get when they get that lean, it's just like barely talk to you. Yeah, yeah. And think about think about like they're actually like trying to peek for a fight at the same time, they feel the most shit. It's ridiculous. They're so focused on cardio, they can't. I'm not a wanna make to send to. They're focused on just dehydrate. Yeah. And and making that way, I've seen some of the the protocols. I've there's some good ones out there, but some of the stuff I've seen them like God, I wish I could talk to somebody in that in that realm because it's so it's so pro science, it's so dangerous to and it's it's really you can only do it three or four times, and then your body starts to reject it and guys have to go up and wait, like you were talking about explain to you. Yeah. And some global wait. Sometimes we start pushing it. Yeah, they do. They do much better. So it's testosterone right at when limited, but his his basil requirements. Calorie farm was like twelve hundred. The crazy thing is. So there've been some critics of my mic kind of view of metabolic adaptation, the body self defense system full full disclosure, some people criticize you, they say, well, if you look at metabolic adaptation, it only explains it's only fifteen percent relative to the the whole nation. And but if you look at Chris numbers, I think on average, that's probably right on average diet with an average person, you take somebody trying to get really lean or somebody who yoyo diets or somebody who crash diets. And now you know, if again is proportionate if you challenge your body with something extreme, it's going to respond in an extreme fashion. So every case study we have on natural bodybuilders and there's about ten of them now who look at their contest preparation and coming out of it. And I use them to just because this is the. Oh, my grew up in. Shows that their Hypo Nadal by the time that they're at stage. So high Bogin. That'll mean the testosterone. The testosterone is clinically low? Yeah, naturally in these are guys like me. I actually, I actually like have a pretty naturally high testosterone level every every time ever since I'm sixteen years old, I've got tested. I've been like over eight hundred with I'm eating enough when I was a contest I was under three hundred. This is part of how your body fights you. Your body does not want you to be that lean. But if you're kind of raining this back into the discussion, this is why talk about why it's so important to pick something that's sustainable for you as an individual. Because if you do this shit, we're yo, yo diet or you don't come out of it appropriately. It will fuck you up. I mean, we've, we've all I think females, especially in track record. I I've worked with a lot of females now because especially in physique sports, there's a lot of really bad coaching starvation diets than for women. It's it just messes with reproductive cycle to having. Yeah, yeah, which Maria innovate. Self doesn't seem to have what does that? No mental cycle? Yeah. So doesn't necessarily in of itself seem to be a. Have negative health consequences in terms of longevity or disease, or anything like that. But yeah, if you can't get pregnant, I mean that's Bill for some women. But what what the women don't want to hear is you may have to gain some body fat to get that back. You know, they don't hear that, but this is why I really start with sustainability. And then from there I go to. Okay. What so if we've got what's the stable for you now, can we get a little better? Can we do a little bit more fiber? Like I think in general, you know, I criticize paleo diets because I think they're validation for their model is absolutely fucking stupid. What stations? Oh, the kind of evolutionary validation and the fact that we didn't drink milk and we didn't eat beans in this kind of thing, but coffee, but, but the question shouldn't be what we were doing. The question should be what makes sense in what is healthy now, like if you look at studies on dairy, almost all studies show people who take in dairy are healthier, better bone density more lean body, mass, lower body, fat. But there are a lot of people that think the deer is bad for you. Yeah. Caused formation begins, but is it really some some some clean eaters to think that somehow causes the research data? Yeah, protein in dairy, various proteins that alpha albumen or that can basically initiate a immune response in the body. So I know when I'm okay with Derry fat, I can get like one hundred grams a day dairy fat. But if I'm if I drink away protein shakes, especially at night, I wake up all congested and you know, like I haven't way concentrate way. Yeah, way concentrate or just like a yogurt or and I think it's a spectrum, right? So it's not like you have it or you don't think, you know, there's this dispel trim and bovine protein is kind of you'd foreign body anyone's enters the bloodstream. It can only if it enters the bloodstream because if digest is working properly. You're not gonna get any of that in the bloodstream. It's all going to be chewed up into some try. Some of it makes insulin's of fifty amino acid. And if you take enough insulin like you can basically go hypoglycemic if you orally unit, that's why you inject fifty eighty one anyway. Well, it doesn't matter short. I told me, yeah. Yeah, yeah. So even something that's a fifty amino acids can get through. So this term lactose intolerance. You think that's different something that's actually a sugar. Yeah. So this is an issue with people's individual. Dietary says, people have awful like album insensitive since the tippety where they, if they've got some kind of leaky gut. So normally you're, you're, you're injunctions are tight. Okay. So your, your small intestine, your testings are like kind of fingers and they pick up nutrients is a really general apathy ourselves. The tight junction is a little little anchor that holds them loose dysfunctional with that that can allow certain nutrients through the wall, and that will initiate a bodies. In lieu response Holly is silly AC and she. So if she has gluten it like you will know it because she will have a huge response. But in people who have normal digestion that just doesn't happen going back to the paleo thing. What I was gonna say is, even though I disagree with their relevance, if you told me, okay, you take their general recommendations. Eat limit sugar, eat more whole foods, eat higher protein. I think in general, that's pretty good recommendations for most people. I just as you said, I'm anti bullshit. So I'm not gonna let you make claims about why something works when that's not why it works. Right? So we look at like the differences in diets. Like, I think what I would say generally to people is to, here's the great news as far as fat loss goes and health markers. If you wanna lose weight, if you eat, if you control your calories calorie deficit, you eat enough protein because protein helps spare lean body mass and is Thermo genetic so increases your energy output. Then you can kind of do whatever you want, carbs fats and whatever you prefer, and you'll still lose the same on the weight and get about all the health benefits, but it has to be something that you can sustain because if you can't sustain it, you're gonna put all that weight back on. That's what the research data shows so does love sustaining it meaning balanced diet that you could stick with life some sort of coward deficit. It's really only temporary thing to lose weight, right? So now obviously you don't eat deficit forever, right? Because then you would starve yourself to death. Right? But the body corrects that like you as you draw bodyweight, your metabolic rate slows down. You're not in calorie deficit forever when we talk about losing weight and then maintaining it right. So eating in a maintenance. So eating basically the behavior you use in the style of dieting, you use, you have to continue that if you wanna maintain it. So if you like, Kita Jin like you like you like you genetic MO, and I think you're a big fan of meat. If you can sustain that, you know, like people out there. So my God, people probably that you're going to get cancer and you're going to do this and you're gonna do that. Most of those health benefits are just from not having excess body fat, excess body, fat, and the metabolic dysregulation of a metabolic type syndrome. That's what cause ninety percent of these problems. Okay. Now which is why I get crazy when people say that fat is healthy. Well, well, here's the problem. It's like we, we have like reactionary culture. So we have been through your set point is to right, we have. We have reaction culture, so you see this all the time. So we had, okay, you're going to eliminate saturated, fat. You got eliminate dietary fat, and just eat grains and limit your proteins. And we got fatter. And so the reaction to that was don't eat any carbs saturated? Fat isn't bad for you. In fact, eat as much saturated fat as you can. It's great. Put butter in your coffee like, no, there's good data to show that. The research that I've seen in my opinion shows that saturated fat absolutely was demonized. It's not as bad as we thought, but it's if you eat too much of it, it's not great either, especially with carbohydrates. Oh, absolutely. That's increasing. Now you're increasing your liver production of saturated fats as well, right? When your body gets you a fat-burning stage, and then on top of that, you pile on carbohydrates, then your body wants to store those carbohydrates way. The calories are plus actually, technically you store the fats because carbohydrate, you burn the carbohydrates, right? So Cobra hydrate, if you say, well, why does if you don't store Cobo? So I talk about this in my book because people will go too far each direction that say, well, you said you don't. You'll only use you hardly store any carbohydrate as actual fat. What are we eat? Zero fat and mostly carbohydrate. Well, then your body, your body's not dumb your body we didn't. You didn't get here today and get through evolution, tens of thousand. Years of hard living by your body being stupid. So your body can ramp up to Nova Leiper Genesis so that you can create fat from carbohydrate. If that gets low and carbohydrate intake, it's high enough essential, fatty acid. There was a research study or meta analysis done by Kevin hall who's in h. researcher and they showed that if you quit calories, you get a small extra benefit from fat restriction versus carbon section on fat loss. So you get about twenty six grams extra fat loss per day, calories equated protein equated if you restrict fat versus carp. Now, before everybody goes crazy, that's probably due to a little bit of inefficiencies in ramping up to Nova Leiper Genesis because there's it takes energy to move that system, but twenty six grams of fat loss per day to me is not a physiological like I don't care about that. That's nothing compared to, okay. If you like low car better. Don't worry about losing extra twenty six grams of fat. If you like glow car better, and you can sustain that didn't do low carb. One of the things that we've seem to be getting into here is the difference between losing weight and optimal performance, and then optimal performance mentally and hormonally versus optimal performance physically in terms of like athletic Affleck pursuits. So here's here's something and the type of person whether it's, you know, you don't want to put a teenager that's playing football on a ketogenic diet necessarily. Why would that be? Well, maybe if they're overweight, that could be beneficial. But I think it would decrease his performance unless he goes through the Kito adaptation face, but there's a lot of the at when you're a teenager you're, I would say, you're carbohydrate tolerance is very high. I wanna I wanna Justice in my mind was very high. I could eat huge plates of pasta that I could not eat. Now. I just simply couldn't. So I think as we age, I would say, are carbohydrate tolerance decreases with age because our metabolic machinery is not as hungry for for glucose. I mean, we're set up and hormonally are insulin. Sensitivity is not as high, like leading pathways or reduced things like that. That happens as a consequence of age. So it makes sense that as we transition into age for longevity and for health span, maybe not spam health span carbohydrate restriction makes sense. And even in some cases, Akita, genyk diet makes sense. You know, but if you look at, okay, so I'll have to pushbacks on that. I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you. Kind of. If you look at longevity data, the actual data people who've restrict fat versus car live longer like that's what a new study that came out showed. But again, there's there's describing as also a means of because people put on weight as age with a low carbon with Jiang diet. That becomes a practical strategy to create a sustainable calorie deficit for losing weight sustaining that. And also if you elevate key tones over time, a lot of the new research that's coming out over the last five years. Key tones is not just a superior source of energy metabolic Louis, but it also has epigenetics effects on the body. It activates gene pathways that can confer resistance against oxidative stress that longevity pathways anti-inflammatory pathways in the context of a deficit. No, not in the context of deficit. You could feed key tones take Akito supplement and activates just simply elevating beta hydroxybutyrate functions as a hit. Tonia subtleties inhibitor and can activate if you will gene programs that can confer resistance against many different things. Oxidative stress pathways and also activate or suppress an inflammatory pathway that's linked with many age related chronic diseases and auto immune pathways. It decreases the activation of the NFL RPI three inflammation. So you're talking about people Li living longer. You're talking about that epidemiology study that was like a questionnaire people what the aid over a long period of time, highly criticized studies. And there's a lot of co-founders which is why it's hard to say. It's hard to say that the study shows that if you eat carbs vs fat, the you live didn't say one was causing effect. I sorta cited a piece of evidence because I don't cherry pick because if we're going to give the argument, I wanna give the whole argument is playing devil's advocate. I don't think that necessarily if you eat a low carb diet, it's gonna cause you live shorter life. I don't believe that. Okay. But I think it's important to put all the data out there because what I see a lot of people just cherry picking and those studies they get, they become founders and everybody was say, eat carbs, you live longer. Diets are going to kill you, and then it just gets crazier some of the animal work. I mean, leaning, I both did animal work. I think some of the animal work is almost more reliable because you have an inbred strain of animal and you have berry tight control. If genetically identical freely living human, you know, he's doing many different things and there's genetic variability, but with animals, it may not always be predictive. It's informative, but not always predictive. And I think some of the the data I read some of the human studies in become more confused, but going back to the animal data, I almost more comfortable with some of these outcomes for animal studies. So once they I want to bring up that I think is really important is we have. I think we're all getting to this point people out there. I think that there's like this perfect diet that's going to cure everything over heels. The fact the uncomfortable truth in the fact of the matter is that if one diet is an, I don't know this specifically, but my guess is if one diet is a better for cancer MIT worse for heart disease or if one night is better for insulin resistance, maybe it's worse for cancer. It's better for cognitive performance might be worse for athletic performance. We don't. We don't know. Yes. So that's kind of where as your space at and this is why go back to those big picture, things of most of the health benefits just come from having more muscle lift weights, people to lift weights you. If you're if you're debating about diets and you're not lifting weights, you are fucking missing the point. Okay. Because that is sorry, I curse so that. Yeah, I do it on Twitter. You've seen me, so it's very good emphasizing your point. Yes. So I'm a fan of it. Awesome. Fucking awesome. So somebody criticized me for one day. I was like, you know what's great about my job. I can say, fuck as much as I want, nobody's going to fire me. So that is great. But the big picture things, lift weights, create more lean body, mass, be active. That's a huge thing. Even if you're overweight, if you're active, you're, you're gonna live five on the whole. You're gonna live longer than than person who's inactive and then control your weight. So if you can, even if you can get to a normal weight and maintain it or noble body, fat, and maintain it, or if you're a high body fat, if you can get to a lower body fat and maintain it night, that's ninety. That's ninety five percent of the battle. All this other stuff is five percent. We're worrying about that. We're going back and forth about, and that's why I don't want to miss the context because when people like a pick on him because he who ask for his Gary Talibs, but I'm, I'm happier. We got dumb for this, but I'm going to energy, hey, on every. When people like Gary say, things like carbs are are causing obesity. Just carbs, you create this problem where if people don't like eating high-fat diet or a low carb diet, and they can't sustain it, they just feel like they're a big failure and they just quit because what's the point of carbs are causing fat? And I can't stop eating carbs. What am I going to have a real hard problem with? I know what you're saying. Discipline is important nonsense, but I think my point is that if you give people flexibility, it usually improves adherence. Right? And you're talking about from what I point of view coaching people, right? What I would like to see is I would like to see diet that's protein and calorie study protein calorie controlled. If anybody knows of one that's done this, let me know protein and calorie controlled, and then let people self select higher carb or higher fat. What do you prefer? Let them self select and see how well they do. And I bet you would see improvements in adherence. In both groups Dom you're going to well, I think diet strategy that controls your appetite and does not have your appetite controlling you, which I think is accomplished with Kita genyk diet. That's also you know, one that's well-formulated. One that's controls that has fiber and adequate protein is a strategy that allows you to be far less fixated on food because you're not as hungry and you could decrease your meal frequency. So if there's I know there's people out there that are probably busy people CEO's accompanies students or whatever that simply do not have time to prepare an eat meals to when they get hungry. So by reducing meal frequency, you can increase your productivity. And I think you're kind of coaching your body to be a better fat burning. I think there's carefully benefits. So when you are on Akita, genyk diet, your store. More fat, but you are burning more fast. So think about your adipose tissue as little bags, which have fat coming into them and fat, leaving them and the fat oxidation pathways or elevated. And when I eat a ton of fat at night before I go to bed, I am like some people carb load. I'm like, fat hooding at night and employing off those fat stores during the day through my sorts. I think about it like that. So instead of just, you know, carving up at nighttime, I tend to, I would wake up hungry. I would probably dump insulin and then wake up with a hypoglycemic cravings in the middle of the night. If I did that time, restricted eating. Yeah. Like today I'm fasting and most eight that I want to be as productive as possible. I will not have my first meal, which will be typically Akita genyk meal around four PM. And so what time to eat at night I will start. I'll do a small meal like at work. And then I my big meal at about seven o'clock, maybe seven o'clock and then snack throughout the night and maybe eat within. You know, I started eating at four PM and I finished eating in about ten pm. So you basically start eating at the end of your day? Yeah. So. And that's very liberating for me so, and I didn't even know this was possible, but that's like back ten years ago. I didn't know it was possible to have that amount of control over my appetite and actually feel as lucid and as energetic and be able to, you know, get with lane and doodad left with him and actually maintain my my performance and my strength in the gym. I don't feel like I'm an outlier either possible. So I think that anecdotes are good because like dotes calls us to look at things I but I can tell you like, so for example, eight usually four times a day and I- protein right now I'm in a gaining face, so I'm trying to purposely gain weight, hopefully some lean body mass. I'm coming back from an injury. So trying to regain some lean body, I media about four hundred to four hundred fifty grabs a Cobra hydra today. There were times when I'll go seven, eight hours. I won't eat and I don't really get hungry. So I mean, they're sixteen hours. I don't. I don't know. I don't know, but I, I don't think I would. I go some some nights I'll sleep in. I'll wake up and I'll go twelve thirteen hours like I'll go in sometimes and and I don't usually get hungry now. But again, this is thing tennis just well. If you look at some of the things that I'll disagree with our or the idea that insulin has he's big fluctuations and you become hypoglycemic, and that causes overfeeding in some people that's the case. But most people, if they're eating a, especially with a higher protein diet, that doesn't usually happen. Add that the population, most people are not bodybuilders and the population of of people that lean mostly communicates with our on the border of being metabolic Lee elite and also have a very high carb tolerance. And you're a body builder with a a large amount of lean body mass. You are pretty much metabolic. These set up to be very, have a high carb tolerant. So to general population is not like that. Let's talk about Clark tolerance because I, that's one thing that will disagree on. I don't think the people are more or less carb tolerant. I think that people have slot floor and faster metabolic rates. So if you have festive metabolic rate, you'll be more tolerant by default because you could just alright more calories. I agree, but inaudible there. That's two hundred shirt. One. Yep. Now, if you look at somebody who's on to diet, they're actually by definition of tolerance there. Cobra hydrate intolerant. Because if you challenge them with a bowl of glucose, they can't. They can't clear it so, but that that doesn't. That's that's just because what they're adapted to write, but they're fat adapted. Yeah, agreed. Agreed. So I actually the first experimental biology we ever went to. This is why you know even scientists get this shit so wrong sometimes because they get so in their echo chamber, they don't bother to look outside of it going to the gym when we first met and lane stopped and had a huge meal, which to me, I was like, you feel about doing we're, we're going to stop an e all go school. It's a real heavy. Fatty meal. Hombre is the bathroom about five. I didn't. I forget. I think I did eat, but it was very abnormal for me to go eat totally meal, heavy meal on the way the gym holidays like you, she, she hates training fed. She wants to be fasted. She feels better that way, but that's the vitual different. Right? That individual differences of it. Part of it may be just adapted to that as well what you're used to. So maybe a psychological thing, but some people may just do better that we're blood is diverted to your digestive system in processes, and that's less blood for the muscles. So you're, you're expending energy to digest breakdown assembly that there has been pretty debunked, really? Yeah. But something happened since a fundamental biological concept that you are diverting blood resource to particular Java scientists to question, even those theories we hold most to be true Bill digress, Tyson's, yeah, but it's, I think, a small meal. Actually. It can be beneficial, but it's not like you're using no. Kandal hydrates during the meal. You're not using the press. How is it been debunked that they see that performance isn't worse and that you don't like is the whatever form it specifically. Box, there's limitation of blood flow because you've eat something to the muscle. There's a limitation of blood flow to the muscle. Okay. But again, some people just do better if they're faster, have small meals. I again, it may be a psychological thing, but I like to feel like I've had a lot of food and I'm fully fueled for a long training session, but some people will what kind of training know if you doing something like that in a very controlled. But if you were doing something like might be different. Yeah. If you were doing jujitsu, but I don't know, you would probably throw. Maybe I did it very briefly awesome sport, like I did it very briefly informally. All's really can't have a big meal and then go train and get fucked up. I'd probably have gone to the bathroom every few. I can't work on a grant. I can't. We're not supposed to talk about guns, but if I go to the range. My talk. We talked a lot before. My groups are tighter. I got better control. If I go in and fed stay. I'm just not as focused as my vision. My vision is not as acute in right after a big meal as if I'm fasted, sixteen hours, but this is this is the hard thing with anecdote because we can't tease out whether or not that's that is an actual physiological thing or whether you just feel better and you think you'll do better. So you do better because the brain is unbelievably powerful. There was a study in a may butcher it because I can't remember exactly, but they took people who had legit algae problems and they gave them a sugar pill and they said, this will improve your allergies. It should not have done anything over half. The people reported symptoms got better and thirty percent actually, physiologically got better because their brain was telling them get better like it's pretty crazy. So that's part of probably the best diet for you might be the diet you can stick to and just feel real positive about right, because you feel. This might be someone what's going on with a lot of this low carb stuff that people say they feel so fantastic because there's some sort of a placebo effect that's possible. I think part of it is to is that's why animals studies are give me more confident when I can look at rats or mice on Akita, genyk diet and see an object -able objective increase or decrease in a parameter. Then I gained confidence, but here's the thing. I'm not saying that the bad thing, if you feel good about it, that's great, but just don't try to get on Twitter and tell everybody all you're going to gain deficit because you're eating carbs right up. If you go to witchdoctor and you really believe it might actually help you? Yes. One of the one of the number one characteristics of cancer survivors is that there are actually they have a belief in God. They believe that they're gonna make it through that. Now, some people 'cause affect some people will argue religious argue, well, they believe in God, and so God is helping them. The other argument to that is they believe that they are gonna. Make it through there. And so they have a moral better likelihood of doing it. So your brains believe in the Keita genyk die and believe in God. And I think that's a great thing and they, they, they have remarkable, I believe that, you know, well, I, I'm a person of faith, but I also believe that if you have faith in the methodology to the patients that have communicated with me that actually believe that this approach is going to work, and then they reached that actual therapeutic state of Kita. Jank diet have results that kind of defy what you would expect scientifically. So I believe it's working physiologically, and also psychologically there's immuno psycho therapy rate or immunology. So our brain can actually control many different physiological processes, including our immune system, and that that is something that's under appreciated and under studied. And that really needs to be studied term in terms of eating a large meal. For training. Surely your body has to use up some of the resources to digest. You don't think that it's blood flow to the muscles. She thinks in debunked. They show that the blood flow to the muscle is not limiting if you've had a meal before you train. Okay. Now. The thing, but some people don't like that. It's a very individual thing. It probably it may be a psychological thing with beyond not anot. I understand that I'm idiot, like everybody else out there. Right. So I'm subject to bias and psychological influence like anybody else, but I just use that to my advantage if I feel good about it, I would not do it. Now if you train in the morning, do you do that like heading to the gym? First thing in the morning holiday tries to stop me because I usually go to the bathroom for like five times, but. All eat a little bit less than the morning. If if I'm going to go straight in and train, but one of the things that that going back that so many scientists missed is that context like most people miss context, but scientists even miss context. So the first experimental biology study, first experimental biology symposia we ever went to. There was a poster where they fed people, Akita, genyk diet, or they fed them. I high carb diet. And then at the end of six weeks, they challenge them with a hundred grams of glucose and looked how long it took for them to clear that glucose. The kitty jank died. People would have been worse than like type two diabetics at clearing glucose. Okay. Whereas people eating a high carb diet, crude just fine right now, if you if you just looked at these numbers as doctor you, oh my God, you're diabetic. No, that's what they were adapted to. And I challenge the person with the poster. I said for all you genyk night, people who hate me on Twitter. I defend the in diet when it is time to be defended. I said, the girl. Will. If you had fed a high fat meal to these people, you would have seen the same thing in reverse. If you would've fed a high fat meals, people who are out of the ketogenic diet in the high carb diet, you would have seen really elevated trestle, glycerin ads, LDL cholesterol, veal the l. cholesterol, Columbine Crohn's, and people who were carpet acted because it wasn't being cleared because that's not what you're too, but people missed that whole context. They has a good analogy in his book that book where if you have a factory military factory, that's making planes, and then it has a switchover to making ships, right. So you, it takes a lot of time to change sort of all the processes that take place and the same thing sort of happening. You're giving your body a different fuel source. So it has to ramp up the enzymatic machinery, the pathways, the regulatory pathways and the transporters, even to basically use those fuels, misunderstanding that or at least an ignorance as one of the more. Strating things online. When a here like nonsense people, the these internet. Air quote experts talking about the negative aspects of the Keita genyk died that they tried it and they felt weak. Like what do you mean? You tried it, you got it for a day. Did you try for three days from month? Like at the fuck outta here you go. Station? Yeah, it's important like when when you review a study and. I think you have a study in your book actually that shows in the gym. You basically say the Keita genyk diet can hurt your performance in the gym, so and you reference a race walking study where I think they did the Keita genyk diet for like three weeks. There's only like that. So I think we came back around and said that it's probably fine once. You're too. Yeah. Yeah. What's the time period we're talking about for me, I did not feel myself after took me about three to four months, but then you gotta realize that there's a learning curve to doing the Keita genyk diet. Right? So if I go back to my notes. I mean, my performance in the gym and just general wellbeing took about three to four months, do use an app to or anything. I did my fitness pounds off, but I just know a creature of habit. So we basically just by the same food all the time and I can. I measured things on scales and stuff just as a scientist. So I can look at some powder on a scale and do two hundred and fifty milligrams plus or minus, you know, ten ten milligrams. So I I've measured things out to where I can look at a plate and basically give you the macro is pretty tight, and that's I don't know if you do that Kito for long periods of time. I've done it before. Yeah, and he hasn't been Kito adapted though. I would argue keep Jones. Thank you. But, but I just do it for about eight weeks. So you could argue that I didn't do it long enough, but my thing is like, oh, my blood markers are healthy. I didn't see. So I did Kito at maintenance and I didn't see really much improvement in anything. Everything kind of stayed the same now, what what they'll different energy went win was what year was this would have been probably. After my bodybuilding show before I got back in the powerlifting it would have been sometime in two thousand twelve, which did you like post about it? And I want to go because I didn't. I didn't want to really like get the wrath of anybody on me at the time now old and can take us. I just don't care that much anymore, but I didn't buy performance. Didn't go down that in the first few weeks. It did, but then it was fine. I just like the flexibility of having some carbs. Yeah, I like to having that flexibility because popcorn. If you're if you know popcorns great, they'll be this higher protein in higher fibre, but. You know if. If I was going to commit to it as a lifestyle, then that would be fine. But unless you're willing to, again, if that's not something you're willing to stick to for life. You have to rethink if you wanna do it or not, but benefiting going on and off key genyk diets. Correct. I. So if you do Akita, genyk diet and you want to stay in a state Akito says the days that I do intermittent fasting now, which I didn't do like five years ago. I don't necessarily do the key do a high protein, low carb, but my macro are not key to genyk typically not all the time. Sometimes they are, but there are different like you could do intermittent fasting with a car based diet and still get key tones. You know, by the end of your your fast, you could do low-carbon. You could do ketogenic. I actually think it's it's a little bit better to be miserable flexible. So I'll throw in. I tend to eat a lot of vegetables and then throw in some fruits to a few days a week where it may kick me out Akito sus. But during the middle of the day, when I need to be at my best, I pretty much always running low to moderate key tones during the day, and I can do that with different strategies now with my body because kick you out. Ketosis nighttime. Half of a dark chocolate one or two things of dark chocolate and which is maybe fifteen twenty grams of carbs and maybe a half Cup of blueberries. And then a big salad and some vegetables typically Greenville, which would you say, kick you out of this? So if you measure your blood, your key tillage dropped below. What level point? Five. And I typically don't even measure it night, but I wake up in the morning and it might be about point five. And then that goes up throughout the day. So middle part of the day, I'm typically running one between one to two, sometimes three. The the urine strips are only effective in the early stages of ketosis. Correct? Yeah. Because in the beginning you spill out a lot of key tones in your urine, but as you increase Kito transport and utilization over time, less of them end up in your urine, how much time is that? Depends on the person. But after about two or three weeks, you may see less of a color change on the urine strips even if you didn't change your diet, is there another affective method other than the pricking the finger? Yeah. Well, I think the blood, you know, Abbott labs makes the precision Xtra. There's the Kito Mojo, which I also use we use in the lab Kito Mojo is a blood measurement and glucose measurement device. That's essentially because Abby cornered the market, they, they basically allow you to check your key tones for a dollar a strip instead of three or four dollars or five dollars, but it's still pricking your finger. It's it's pricking your finger. Don't use the. I actually use a syringe and just take a running start and Javed my finger now because it doesn't. I got calluses like you do when your fingers so annoying. Yeah, I'm kind of used to it, but the the urine strip is actually pretty good relative marker and the Seaman's multi-state s g will measure key tones and then nine other things like that measure kidney function and, and you know your blood glucose and things like that. So I recommend twenty five cents a strip. And then there's the breath, key tonics meter. You blow into it and measures breath acetone. And the level is also another breath acetone measurements. So yeah, and you know, breath acetone highly correlates the fat oxidation. So if you're breath, acetone is high. You are burning a lot of fat. So he's in there an issue with people that are key in the state of ketosis. They get pulled over for drunk driving a couple of lawyers contacting, and there are some cases going on right now, and they wanted me to weigh in breathalyzers. Breathalysers because of the, would you say acetone with is it uses the same technology breath acetone. And if you I know that if you drink alcohol and do a breath, Kitone meter, you can kind of pin it depending on what meter you're using. If you're using a breath that's a for breath, Kito meter, if you if you have a breath, alcohol, measurement in your inner state Akito Sa's I've not seen that depending on the device that you'll have a false positive. If that's your question, some devices can it depends on the device. So one day I'll bring up because you said, well, you work with these kinds of metabolic -ly elite people. So what are the problem? I say what you're doing where you kind of take yourself up to the point where you're sort of getting out of ketosis and then going back in, that's probably fun, but most people aren't going to do it that way. They're going to be like, oh, I had a cheesecake or all I couldn't take it anymore to Pete. Or whatever. That's really bad. So you see probably people who intermittent fast decreased that window time and over-consume on. Yeah, so that that's a big problem. So I wanted to bring up intermittent fasting too, because I think again, like if you saw the studies fasting show that you lose same calories are the same same same by the fat, maybe be at risk for a little bit more. Lean body mass loss just because you're triggering protein synthesis left less often. But you do have a little bit lower insulin levels. It seems like now whether or not that's again beneficial based on the the research that we talked about unlikely insulin, sensitivity insulin sensitivity was a little bit better again, so there some techniques you could do, but people bring up things like a tough Aji and inflammation. And again, I kind of get. The song, if you if you just caloric restrict you increase g. and you increase decrease inflammation? Yeah. When you don't get an top Adji is dependent upon the decrease in certain amino acids, glucose and insulin, and you achieve those biomarker states a more significant level doing intermittent fasting than you would and they are the autopay g. regulate it used to be the the the reason for Logan. Okay. Amdur amp kinase, you know, losing. So if you're eating various meals throughout the day, three times a day, like you know, your blood losing levels will be always got to keep it in context of twenty four hours people. People do this with with fat storage and oxidation is well. They say, well, if you're if you're fasting all this time, you're burning so much body fat. Well, yeah, but then by definition, if you're eating less these times, you have to eat more at this time if you're keeping calories the same. And so during that time post meal, you're going to store a lot. More fat. You're going to have much higher insulin now, maybe not maybe lower. Overall, you have a fast metabolism, this, your overshooting and those calories have to go somewhere. So that'd be over twenty four hours. You don't see differences in fat loss or fat gain intermittent fasting versus Mellon. I would be interested in the inflammation stuff and the toffee stuff because again, caloric restriction in of itself increase or decreases, inflammation increases a tough to interestingly enough, one of the sugar studies they did with with higher sugar with still caloric restricted. They showed decreases inflammation. So it's inflammation is largely an issue of caloric restriction or excess at you guys think that that's what's going on with this carnivore diet. Yeah, the people it's hard now. I think its calorie restriction effect. Oh, it's hard elimination effect. Elimination effect. Look at if I give you a French fries, like two hundred grams of French fries. You can get a lot of calories from that. If I give you two hundred grams of meat, even a real fatty meat, it's not nearly the same like you. You're going to be much more satiated from the protein like you can only eat so much meat, you know, and again, like if you, I don't want to go too far down the carnival diet hole, but. The stuff I see with people to, I think you can eat meat and improve your blood markers. Absolutely. Absolutely. Of course you can eat pop tarts and yeah, but but the point is is like when we get into the cuddling zealot of only eat meat, you don't need vegetables. There's there's. I mean, again, it's EPA theology, but there's some really tight min analyses that have been done looking at colorectalcancer and low fiber intake, and I would not be comfortable recommending people not eat enough vegetables and fiber, but I feel uncomfortable eating a steak or a burger without like something like broccoli or salad. I think you negate many of the potentially carcinogenic compounds that are in red meat. And that's a whole nother debate. But I think he's actually, yeah, he might earn and polio medic Heidrick. Chris cross rashly brought that up yesterday talking about meat consumption with vegetables, get like. With brought cruciferous vegetables, broccolis and salads, like I don't personally would not eat red meat. So full disclosure, I mean, I was because I get accused on Twitter of being a carb guy, and I'm not. I was my research was funded by the f. board, the beef beef national beef something another. Sorry guys and in the national dairy council. So you know, full by the way, all you guys out there who, again, you're just taking my word for it. But who think that like industry is evil thing that comes into controls everything. I met one person the my entire PHD from the funding sources, and I met them for literally thirty seconds. They were at a. Experiment biology, and they said, hi, thanks. Thank you for the grant. Oh, great. Great, great job. Thank you. That was it. Now. I'm not saying there isn't nefarious things that can happen. But like when I heard when I like the show with Nina, everything was about who funded it and this and that, but that's why they have to disclose those things on papers. Also, this is why scientists science is self regulating because somebody is going to repeat your study and if they don't find the same thing you found you're going to be in trouble. So I get criticized for conflict of interests. I, I've seen on social media and so I would probably say I am not a medical doctor or even a registered dietitian, the peachy scientists. So don't take my word is medical or nutrition. Advice we do. Our research is funded not only by the department of defense and office of navy research, but also by companies that actually develop Kitone food products and also keeping supplements and our university owns the. Rights to those patents. I don't have any products myself are we have a company keystone technologies and Kito nutrition as the information website. But at this time we have no products, but the university licenses are intellectual property and products are made out of that, and I get patent royalties and I put the patent royalties back into research. So buying various exemptions, key tones products that are on the market can come back and help support the science and the application of Justice for him. I don't. I, you know, I tend not to state that, but I get called out for not stating that. So I think it's important because he's actually writing a chapter in my new book. So we're gonna have a chapter about the kitchen. He died if you're going to do it, this is how to do it right. So new book fellows forever shameless plug. And he said, I just want all the money that I make from the book to go back into the lab. So that's like that's an Walter Longo has a similar with pro lawn with his line to I know his prophets. He, you know, the prophets that he takes. He puts back into knows nobody's unbiased anybody that says, there are is full of crap. We all have our biases. All things that we think we're another sure, but I think the fundamental, if you if you meet a scientist and hopefully I quit myself. Well in this and I think Dom does as well is that one you have open mind, but not so open that your brain falls out and to you care more about getting the right answer than being right. When I went to do my PHD I was eating eight meals a day. I was eating three hundred grams of protein a day. I was looking for more reasons to eat more protein in need it more frequently when I left my PHD four meals a day and a little bit less protein and less frequently and your because fracturing to the rectory phenomenally I was eating five hundred grams of protein a day. I was eating like two or three, two pound London broil in washing. It down with the product metrics with h. MBNA like between meals, like back in the mid ninety, four thousand. That was the coolest I just did it well, actually, that was the cool thing about my research was it changed the way I actually changed the way or small, but I, that was my bias coming in, but I, I looked at the research data. I'm like, either I believe this or I don't. And if I believe this, I can't justify XYZ. Right. Can I can I go back to the CD Miala studies with when in regards to cone rectal cancer, there really haven't been any studies on people that just eat meat though. Right? You're talking about people who eat meat on a regular basis and that usually is a standard American diet. A lot of other bullshit and their sugar bun. And there's tons of since fast absolately right. The I would be fascinated to see some sort of long term studies on someone who's on a very strict carnivore diet. I'm really fascinated by this because I'm seeing all these people have all these benefits, but I am. I've got skeptical hippo face every step of the way I'm like, I'm not know again, if it's allowing them to create a caloric restriction s and somebody says, you know what? I've tried. Every other died out there. I tried high fiber. I've tried eating the festivals I kept, but I can stick to this. Right, and I can. I can lose some fat. That I want to say. Okay, well, maybe that's the best diet for you just know so many people that are benefiting from it, like, you know, and not just the part of the on the podcast for I know a lot of other people and if olive by Dr in collecting bloodwork along the way, I mean, those doctors can write case reports. So I'd be glad to assist in a in a case report of people are tracking all their blood markers and doing their most people aren't, though that's going on most of these knuckleheads just eating meat and saying they feel great and well, there's a war on vegetables like fucking very strange. Remember that people don't discount psychology people are very positively about it because it's the flavor of the month. Yeah, like no hate towards carnivore. I don't know who the, I think, Dr Baker Sean Baker. But you know, like if I even dogs eat grass, I mean my dog in heat around the great. You know, to get some cats are obligate carnivores. Yeah. So cats. Interestingly are one thing that they don't. There is a car toilets within they don't tolerate. Them will become obese, but. So the. I think the thing is that I'm not. I don't believe in any one diet. I'm not trying to sell anyone. I would like to sell you on Akita genyk diet. I really wanna see you do it for like four or five months to see if you're experiencing the same benefits as him pretty obvious. You really haven't done it like whole hog. I agree with that totally, and I think I could probably put together a meal plan, Kito cookies and things like that. In cookies. Cookies. I checked. Hang on. I didn't genetic diet and it was fine. I felt fun. A two months, didn't stuff suffer that much. What was your blood markers? They didn't really change a whole lot like I had. I think I would consider them insignificant changes. I maintained. I. My Millan. All you do urine key tones or Blakey towns, or did you watch it? I didn't. I didn't measure those. I don't even know. Really. Okay. Buren. Six. Buren. Six. And what stage were you in for moderate to high. Been the modified Kita, genetic diet. So I would have been not super, but I would have been to barely Chitose. Yeah, I would've been above point, we think so he's eight weeks into it, and that's about the point. I was kind of feeling crummy and stuff, but so about three. Well, not crummy, but I gotta typically it was kicking in. Yeah, but I was flat in the gym and then started to fill out and then to learning curve to. Right. See why thing was if I can get the, if I can get the same benefits just by restricting calories and keeping her approach to benefits in terms of cognitive function in terms of. Okay. Well, that's science. I would say. I mean, we study you could look at PubMed, everything from polycystic ovary syndrome to acne type two diabetes type one diabetes. Now that's a little bit controversial. Genetic meta migraines. You know a whole host of neurological disorders simply because beta hydroxybutyrate. It is, I believe, sort of from there's an objective truth that it's a superior metabolic fuel. And if. Millie Moeller levels in your blood. That's a significant amount of energy in your blood that your tissues can you? How are you defining severe about fuel object. The delta g. of ATP hydrolysis in the heart is enhanced. So essentially you're making more ATP for given amount of oxygen. Metabolic rate could be slower. Maybe you are more efficient? Yes. So you're more metabolically efficient, potentially, but I don't think in the context of fat loss, but it's also enhancing insulin sensitivity and simply feeding key tones, independent of carbohydrate, restriction increases, fat oxidation in the most. Those have been posed, there's bits. There's been studies to look like Kita genetic diet versus a dog eugenic higher carb diet, and they show that basically by going, you reduce overall insulin area under the curve by twenty percent. That was the the number. They got. If I was type one diabetic, I would hundred percent of the ketogenic diet hundred percent. Absolutely. Okay. This is very controversial. This is not medical. This is not medical advice. I actually when I used to give talks, I would say for these things, but if you're typing diabetic, you want void the Keita genyk diet as much as possible because there's diabetic, something called diabetic acidosis. But like my student, Andrew Kootenai at USF. If you've also got a lot of he has a blog on Kito nutrition dot ORG go to and it's very detailed description about carbohydrate restriction and managing your blood glucose. And it goes into really into the weeds if you wanna resell it. So can I stop you there? Could you elaborate on that? So you used to say that if you were type one diabetic, you wouldn't? I did because it was very controversial but diabetic US doses? Yes. So if your type one diabetic you make little or no insulin at all. Right. And I guess maybe. Just going back to a normal person when they fast or they do the ketogenic diet, it increases fat, oxidation the liver, and that fat oxidation actually accumulates. You'll Koei, and that creates key tones seato acetate and beta hydroxybutyrate and it Kerr's in the context of insulin suppression. But you're still normal insulin, but it's very low, right? And then when you're keystones get elevated, you spill some out in the urine, and that's how you eliminate them, your muscles, your brain burns them. And if they get really high, you have an increase in a small increase in insulin release when you're keystones get real high and that insulin ramps down fat, oxidation the liver and decreases ketone production. So, and there's other things too, but I don't wanna get too much into the weeds, but you you're a very normal person is finely tuned to create to maintain physiological key tones within a certain range with nutritional ketosis. We'd diabetic type one diabetes that's completely thrown out the window. So without insulin being there, the absence. Of insulin essentially creates runaway kid Genesis in your key tones become very, very high in the context of very high glucose. Exactly. So you have high glucose and Heike tones. It creates a metabolic disruption. It creates an acid Dodig state and electrolyte imbalances and coma and death, which is going to happen in people who are healthy, who are just doing ketogenic diet, right? But, but it's what is the type one diabetes. If you, for example, my student using his example. I think maybe he was using twenty or thirty. I use of insulin a day, right? And then starts carbohydrate restriction and even modified, Kita, genyk diet, and can reduce that insulin requirement to four, five, six. I use a day, so literally knocking it down to twenty percent of what changed your perception when you did not recommend? Well, there's a Harvard study that basically looked at a group called type one grit on face. Spoke, there's a group called type one grit, and it's got thousands of people who use a low carbohydrate approach, not necessarily Akita, genyk diet approach some are, but it's it's very carbohydrate, restricted in terms of what a doctor an endocrinologist would prescribe for type one diabetic. It would almost maybe look like suicide to some people and low carbohydrate dramatically decreases your insulin requirements. And if you look at your continuous glucose recordings over the course of a week, those numbers are much much tighter, and that's gonna pay huge dividends in the long run when it comes to longevity and health span, and you know the potential for going blind or decreasing your kidney function. You know, by these huge post-prandial spikes essentially, if you're type when you're always chasing your glucose with insulin injections or an insulin pump, if you're carbohydrate restricted, you're basically not. It's very liberating because you're not you're. Pendants on insulin is far far less, you know, some controversy. Lee, some people have gotten completely off of insulin. I would not recommend that some people are actually doing that. So the the, I think, highly not recommended this from Chris critics of the key genetic diet, and this is a BS criticism. The again, here's defending the genetic diet is, will you you'll be, you'll become people who are healthy. You have, you have to key to us those that is not going to happen because by definition, if you're key tones are high in your in your relatively healthy nut type diabetic, your blood glucose is low. It's when both are elevated that it's dangerous. Okay. And if you're a type one diabetic like Andrew, who are just using a little bit of insulin to get that baseline to get your glucose levels down to a baseline level, and then you're using a carber strict diet that creates key tones. While your blood glucose is at an all basil level. That again, not a doctor dot medical advice that should be danger. Right now over the years because he's a power lifter, and he's a super big dude. He's like two hundred and fifty pounds. Like when he goes to the gym, he has learned that he can pulse a little bit of insulin and maybe ramp up is protein, or maybe even take a little bit of carbohydrates. But you know the next day he's still doing low carb throughout the day, but he's learned to leverage, you know, as a type one diabetic you you have that advantage, right? Because you can manipulate insulin for body composition alterations and things like that. So he he has learned to adjust as protein to maximize his sort of gains and performance in the gym. And but nonetheless, he goes from a, he went from a strategy. He transitioned to a strategy that would be would look to be almost suicidal from the perspective of an endocrinologist Dr managing to do that level of carbohydrate. Restriction would be an now. We actually have hard science to show that that can not only can be done that gets that dramatic. Decreases the variability of your blood glucose fluctuation throughout the day from a weekly perspective and your requirements for insulin. Whenever you could use less insulin to manage your blood glucose. That's a good thing. I would. It's very hard for a doctor to argue against in type what I'm using less insulin and keeping tighter numbers. There's no way to argue against that. So if you can fall diet so that this gets back to it here, right. It's one of those things you say. I'd like to see you try and do it whatnot, and you know what? I would probably be fine, but I enjoy having a variety of foods and I enjoy having a variety of fuels as well. Now, I'm sure you do, but I'd still like to see you try it. Those two are mutually exclusive. You're right. But I like how I have a chapter in his book that's coming out that we worked, you know together and just took some of the concepts that I've don't. You find your preferences changes. Well, you hunger pangs. You're not. You don't crave sugary carbohydrates. Yeah. Are you do you like them? Yeah. Look at you like him. Getting hungry. Oh my God. Give me the sugar, whereas the pizza. No, I don't. If you have for breakfast this morning, we're gonna have for breakfast ball. I had steak and eggs. There you go and. Oh, you son of a bitch, bread, stab them in the face is wrong with you. Don't, you know spiked my head of what you make serving of nothing. I saw lots of energy. Again, it's it's, it's it's individual and I want to to point out that if somebody likes kids, I've had people do to genyk diet. I've had people, you know, get ready for shows on the key to time that why did you put them on occasion because that's what they liked. They were. They were. They had that preference for that, and it got to a point where for some people their calories get so low, they've slow metabolic rates that the level of fat restriction it would take them to is probably not great for hormone levels. So I tended to pull a little bit more carb relative to fat. And so we didn't start out targeted mosquitogenic. But by the end they were. So you know, so you had to resort to something that actually works. Oh. Stays lamentable because biddable creek declines to point. You get to a point, especially to get that lean. I mean, somebody who's. Like again, more average muscle mass, pretty fast, but Tabas I'm usually I get down to like under two thousand calories a day to get to get ready for a show. So for me, I was I had my call hydrates for briefly under one hundred grams of carbs per day. In that show prep I was sober. I was sticking your fingers and measuring your glucose in the bathroom. I forget where, yeah. Theories it when you do that and you carber strict and you will you you calorie restrict rather and get down. Once that shit's over, you just want to reward yourself as often as possible. So when someone comes along with something like a key to genyk diet and go, no bread, Nope. Oh, fuck you. You just you just don't wanna do it. You get, but you get the same. The adherence in the relapse is the same, whether it's to genetic or another diet relay like regaining wait. Yeah. Conrad. It's again disaffiliation like pasta and bread because what is it? There's no, no foods actually create. They sent. They have great off. Their waffles are excellent. They have like hamburger buns. Yeah, it's good. I really like I've made sandwiches with their stuff. Well, knocks me out more than anything of ketosis is just too much meat. Yes, agenices. Yeah, that's the one that gets me. Again, I, I kind of go back to. That the data is very mixed. Again, if we look at the overall day to set very mixed and all diets have terrible adherence. Right? But a lot of then that's disciplined. Yeah, but we also now as me crazy, I don't wanna talk about people aren't discipline, really, really. I really have a giant heart problem, but how does I know so many disciplined people? And I just feel their momentum and vibration, and I'm like, I just want to concentrate on what they're doing because all these people that can't do it. I feel like that's contagious. You start thinking about people that can't adhere to diet at fall. I get it for you because it's something that you do, but especially, but I'm gonna. I'm gonna make so for you, the ketogenic diet clicks or eating more meat clicks that that's something that you really enjoy you like the St. Jude. I love pasta. It makes makes discipline easier because it regulates. But it doesn't support it. It makes discipline easier in terms of your at hearings or in terms of your long term in here? Both. Both. So, but but hang on, hang on for some people for some people. This works better because they feel better. They have better adherents for other people. If you say, now you've got some people. If you say, hey, you can have a cookie, they would. It would screw them because they would. They would just go crazy. But for other people, if you allow them more flexibility, their adherents improves. What I'm saying is we need to give people all the options on the table, not demonize anyone diet and say, hey, maybe you try to figure out what we're for lack of sounding bro. What works for you at what you can sustain go from there, but see this totally in agreement I am as well, but you keep saying Ken sustain, you definitely can sustain more than you do that. The the real problem is a giant percentage of the people are weak. Oh, I would agree with that. Like it's in the three forty percent. People just quit give up, don't do what they're supposed to do. Don't do as many reps is supposed to do. Don't work out take days off just because they're lazy, and those are the people that get off the diet. It's a discipline issue for the market for is really big. So I think various foods that are emerging on the market right now at bay systems. Verte health actually has great app bay system that actually coaches you through that. And I think that's very helpful. So I think new technologies foods and will make it increase at here. It's also when you have a person who knows and understands all the health benefits associated with nutritional ketosis or just low carb. I think that can be a motivating factor to make them stick to the diet, but for a guy like you who's rational and disciplined, but people are self destructive in week. They're going to listen more. Need a burger need fries and need to share. Choice? What's the point of the whole conversation then? Well, the part of the conversation to avoid those mother fuckers because they're going to drag it down to their mediocre level, but you able. I think you need to sympathize with them a little bit because I think the market and I think this is a fruitful area for entrepreneurs to create technologies and foods that can actually enhance adherence source advantages. We know about that too. So feel like so much of it is what you're willing to accept from yourself. If you're if you're willing to accept the see-saw obesity thing that so many people get on on and off as yo, yo effect, if you're willing to accept that, that's fine. But I just feel like it's a mental state, a really do us. Once you leave a certain amount of success. People start sabotaging themselves. They start, they start dwelling on the fact that they're doing well, but how long can they sustain? This starts being a big fat mind, fuck. And that's when you say like what? Sustainable, what's the state a lot more than you're willing to do? What's the stain? -able Stoyel a bit personnel here this list. But you know what I mean? It's like there's. The thing like we're giving people these fucking escape clauses, we're giving them these, these, these parachutes they can pull, don't pull the parachute, motherfucker just have it sheet day. That's fine, but don't get off your diet, have a cheat meal, you know, fucking giant Sunday, throw some syrup on that. Bitch, get that whip cream going do it once, but don't live your life like that. That's nonsense. And I think that for. Yeah, I wouldn't have anything. You said. I think people need to hear not this like this like, well, you can't sustain Kito giant Johnson saying, stay. USA stay with their control. If you do, if you found for three days that will give you a lot of confidence that you have control over food fasting for three dates. Diet is sustainable. It's not sustainable over if you live general population and you get a bunch of weak bitches and you get them together. How many of them are going to keep it together? How many going to run everyday? How many you know work very, very, very few. You're dealing with outliers in particular just by virtue of what you do, how many people are willing to put the work in to achieve this. How many, how many people can achieve this physique? Very, very few right here. So we're talking about outliers. We're talking about how that's what I like. I like, outliers. I don't like people to. I can't hear that. I'm not. That's dangerous. So you like that shit is worse than carbs. That's why we talk a lot in the book about behaviors because if you change your behavior, that's what we. I think there's enough research focused on is, let's look at the people who actually achieve weight loss. And if you lose people with Chievo and keep it off, they do it through many different methods, whether it's low carb, low fat, whatever it is. But let's look at the behaviors that they make in those behaviors can tell us a lot about people. One thing we know is they practiced they, they weigh themselves very often, they so they're accountable. They they fact some form of cognitive straight, whether it's weighing food recording, macro, 's, Kita, genetic fat restriction, whatever it is, and also they exercise regularly. And one, there's physiological benefits to that exercise lowers the body fat set point that your body will defend. So it actually has physiological benefit, but also just mentally, like you said, I mean, I never took me back thirty years ago and you told me when I was ten years old, you said, hey, when I was like bullied and picked on had no phone self esteem, you're going to fucking squat six hundred and sixty eight pounds one day on your back at two hundred one pounds and sent a. It's been broken since then, but a world record out have been like there's no fucking way. There's no way. But when you have disciplined like you said and you, that doesn't just people say you should have more confidence. That's that's fucking shit. Advice. Confidence is built through you set a goal and you achieved, yes. You said you cheap and you don't start out to say, I'm going to set a world record and that's your first goal, right? You I like what Will Smith say? So you lay brick is perfectly as you can lay it. He do it again and you do it again and you do it again and you talked to any. Anybody who's successful in anything. They didn't start out saying, I'm gonna do this earth shattering thing, right? They started out and built that confidence over years and years of achieving small goals, which then led them to their big. Now, we're onto something because I think that the mental state in which you approach anything, a workout routine, a lifestyle, the we decided to live your life that is critical. And here's one of the things that people are cynical about. That's probably one of the best sources of fuel is inspiration from other motivated people go to David, Goggin, Instagram, everyday. Watch that fucking savage. Watch what he has. And yeah, he's awesome. But go to people like him. Cameron Hanes, go to go to go to people to the rock. These fucking people just do it. There's no scape. There's no acute sustain that. That's not. I don't wanna hear that shit. That's nonsense. Failing is good. It's okay. Can sail like shale and you're not going to get back on the horse. You're not pushing yourself. Would I say sustainability? I mean, if if it's because everybody has stuff that they find again, you find a corporate strict diet to be easier to stick to feels better for feels better for you? Yeah, and that's. But if but if somebody is over here and says, you know what? I'm eating a low fat diet. I feel great. My blood markers are good. I have plenty of energy. We'll talk with that. Does things wrong with that exact DAL unquestionably exists, right. There's a, there's a giant difference between all this. Some people peanuts and they die. Right? There's just the body's just very, very different. They vary exactly the caloric requirements, the the nutritional requirements you. That's what's hard about this right is finding this one thing that is best for you and objectively and and being really analyzing your your actual physical performance, which very, very few people do. They kind of say, well, I feel pretty good, but by what marker. Right. What what's your personal best? What are you trying to accomplish? Are you monitoring your heart rate? Are you monitoring your work output? Like what are you doing to show that this diet is optimal for you? Yeah. Well, import of that is like, you know, it's hard to get a lot of money that's going to be spent to to get that data for an individual. So part of it is going to have to be, what do you feel good on and what do you feel like is. Again, most sustainable for you because no matter what the people want to diet, but people really want is they want. I don't want to have to track and I don't want have to sacrifice anything in. I want to get to my goal. Well, tough shit. That's not going to happen. You have to pick what you're going to sacrifice, right? So if you say I hate tracking calories, so I'm just not gonna eat carbs because I can regulate my body weight that way. Fuck. Yeah. Do that. I had a post on Twitter. That was like one of my most popular Twitter posts. I said, you know, health improvements are largely driven by caloric restriction and weight loss. But if if you like vegan, if you like Kito if you like carnivore, if you just listed a bunch of different diets and they help you create a restriction and it keeps you at a healthy weight then, fuck. Yeah. Hell, yeah. Like if somebody says I like vegan, I'm not interested in losing weight, but Keita genyk. Intermittent fasting is very, very easy for me. I love the food and I feel better, and I think all. My markers are improving. Any other reasoning for why you should do it with him? It works no cascades. When you say diets, aren't sustainable, the data doesn't show that you talking about calorie restricted diets over weight loss diets. Are you talking about dietary choices in terms of like, Kita, genyk dialects question. So it's that if you lose weight, we cannot keep it off. That is that is the big problem is that most people are able to lose weight and they cannot keep it off because one that the self defense system that we talked about is really is way too quickly. Their body gets into the state where it's always trying to regain that weight back part of part of it. Yeah, like losing it more quickly. There's debate about this, but I would say that it's, you have to create a more stream deficit to do that. And so you are activating your body self defense system more intensely if I had to say it that way. So the rebound is usually bigger as well. So it's it's trying to find a way of cake. Can we get this weight off? And then let's really emphasize to people that the diet after the diet, nobody talks about this except for us. The book. Nobody talks about this. Co writer for the the book Peter Baker, and I, we, we're spent chapters talking about when you go in transition into, okay, we've lost the weight. We wanna lose. We're healthier. You have to have the same amount of discipline and intensity to then maintain that loss. Because if you let up, if you let your foot off the gas now you don't necessarily have to be at the same caloric restriction level. But if you just let yourself come out and go to the Katia I'm going to eat, I'm going to eat what boop gained ten pounds. And everybody knows people like this, who they go and they, they do this and you've just you've literally just undid months of hard work right in one week would say if you could maintain that for a set amount of time, say six months. So I think that if someone can maintain that weight loss for six months, that's like sort of like the tipping point where they can go on. We'll house right here, so so that's a great point. So leptin is you, I'm sure you've heard of people talking about leptin. So when you lose fat, leptin subscribe. Secretion goes down because fat cells secrete it, and it's kind of like your body's thermostat in body fat. Everybody has like a set point their body likes to be. So if you lose body fat, he secrete less leptin hunger goes up. Metabolic rate goes down Crillon tries, yes and girl is in opposition to Lipton, so you, this is your body like thermostat. So if on a thermostat, if you said it seventy, five goes to low kicked heat on the backup, goes to high kick the Julio and go back down, left an ex that way with your metabolic rate in your hunger. When you get down to a low body, fat leptons, low your body, you have a drive to regain that weight, your hungers higher, your your metabolic rate is lower. Leptin still stays low even years after a diet and people who have kept the weight off. So there's do think they're still be abolished drive to regain the weight. That said, and I'm going to go out on a limb here. So any of my scientists listened in on this, feel free to call me out on the carpet if you think I'm wrong, but just like obese people, obese people actually have high levels of leptin. They have high levels of leptin, but they become left and resistant, but then insensitive, right? If you stay a re, there is evidence that if you stay reduced body weight for one or two years that can become your new set point that your body defense, I think what can happen even if you're leptin and doesn't go two years, not six months. Yeah, it's a little bit longer. That's a little bit longer. So good. Doc in as them what's happening. I think it was one tears. Well, I think it's probably multifaceted because nothing your body's so redundant. Usually nothing is ever. One thing typically our set point. I think one of the things that happens is probably your body becomes more sensitive to the left and you have because you're leaner. Now I wanna talk about performance because this is a big thing with athletes and particularly in my field with fighters. Many of them were reluctant to try Kita genyk diet initially because of the the first few weeks are pretty rough, and it really inhibits training. And you know, you get that Kito flu feeling and I've experienced that too. But overall is the Cato genyk diet, a good strategy for someone that's involved in some sort of a brutal athletic pursuit, like football or wrestling, it can be absolutely, and it will be dependent upon being Kito adapted over time and actually training in. State of ketosis. So you force those adept -tations over time. We know the ain't diet is glycogen sparing overtime. Gleich lick pathways will be decreased over time. So that may impair anaerobic power output initially. But I think that some most people, some I think a good amount of people could adapt back, especially if they're taking things like creatine monohydrate and taking various supplements that can kind of fill that gap to me. The Gleich Olympic anaerobic energy demands Zetter yeah. Yeah. Zach bitter who holds the American record for the fastest twenty four hour run or twenty four a fast one hundred mile run. You did it in an eleven hours and forty minutes insane. He ran one hundred miles. It's fucking just nonsense. She corresponded with him on Twitter one time, not not as by the way. All very smart. Blake, I think, brought him to my attention and actually we're. Looking at some of the, you know, muscle biopsies from various athletes that are doing similar thing. He's on Akita. Genyk died essentially. But when he does these long races, he takes a considerable amount of glucose. Yeah, he uses those gels and you know, hundreds and hundred relatively sparingly compared to a person that's already like very carbon dab did. So, right. So you just you just want to especially one hundred mile race, you titrate and small instead of drinking fifty or one hundred grams of carbs, twenty grams of carbs, every hour or two maybe more than enough to say. Correct. Us Zach has a podcast that he also does with Sean Baker, and he basically eats mostly meat. I mean, Zack's diet consists of most like rib is so he's fully Kito de knees using glucose. I think glucose and this may aggravate some of the Kito people out. I think glucose is one of the most powerful performance enhancing substances out there real Luos Jared. For that, especially in the context of that where your glycogen levels are being depleted over time, even from a training perspective, very small amounts of glucose are anti Cada, Bali, maybe argue anabolic in the context of certain scenario. So Lloyd may whether drinks Coca-Cola small right after he trains. Well, is there any benefit to that? Well, I mean, you're gonna get glycogen replenishment, right? And actually there's there's research out of layman's lab years ago that showed that actually sucrose replenishes like gin and muscle faster than pure glucose, which is interesting probably because the the fructose gets taken up by the liver. So the glucose you do eat deliver, doesn't steel steal any of it and it goes your glucose going to muscle. But. I would too. So if the science new but executives key tones, especially in the in the context of Arabic performing like key jenex or like keys. Keystone, Esther key jenex products is great Kitone esters most of the science of behind Tony esters, but there are, you know, valid applications for the keystone salts that are emerging on the market to like he gen-x. I think that the science just over the last couple of years has been incredible emerging on that. And I think it's something to watch over time. It's a new fuel source. It's like the fourth macaroni Trent, right? We have carbs proteins, so that's all that's at alcohol. Yeah, arguably a community. So I've Yuki tones as they are a calorie containing energy source, so they are a fourth macaroni. Now let me ask you this. If you were doing nutritional consultant for say someone who's UFC champion and they said, you know, I want to get on the optimal diet for performance. You don't think that Akita genyk diet is the optimal diet. For performances that's eight to say, or you would have to explicitly for a long period. I wanted to be individual. You certainly wouldn't do it in the midst of a camp, right? If someone who saw two month Canada the, it's such a new onset season thing to it's such a nuanced question. But the problem is is you don't necessarily getting off season the they call you with a fight, is dot? Yeah, look nicely upon if you turned down. So. I think based on the research I've seen, I think you're hard pressed to convince me that Akita Janek diet is worse than a non ketogenic diet on endurance. I think that's pretty clear, and there may actually be some benefits depending on the individual. As far as repeated sprints or things were you need that anaerobic system. I am not ready to say that the Jiang dot, it's going to be as good. I think that a non-kill genyk diet offers you. Now, this is where Kitone supplements may be actually the best thing possible because you could be using glucose. So you're getting that fuel source and taking a Kitone supplement where you're getting that fuel as well. Not on Akita. Genyk died, but taking Kitone supplements that will again, I don't like it's, you know, I think better. See more research. So let's see where he's fats carbohydrates, maybe amino acids, creatine. I mean, you know, just basically trying to leverage all the various substrates that your body can use specially under. If we're talking about anaerobic. So you want to have a suite of different fuel sources, you know, and non rely like met about determine about flexibility, which is kind of us quite often. But I think if you train and get your body fat and Kito adapted that provides benefits for recovery, it provides benefits if you're getting, what are the best for recovery enhanced, you know, lower inflammation, lower chronic inflammation over time. Chronic inflammation can contribute to insulin resistance. Poor, like neuro inflammation. If you're getting concussions or even sub concussive events over time can actually cause a lot of damage and the mechanism that decreases inflammation with the kid genyk diet as opposed to a non a number of mechanisms. I mean, just simply lowering insulin spikes in glucose, but the NFL our p three and flam zome is something that we looked at it. There was a study where actually we used the keystone, Esther, and it was published in the journal nature medicine showing that. In response to l. p. s. which is kind of like. Implant, very powerful, inflammatory stimulant that it reduces that and suppresses inflammatory pathways for particular pathway compared to compared to you mean? So we'll would you study always comparing two things? Yeah. So so what were you? What was the control group? The control group for the inflammation or it was just compared to know like things. So it's just like Jesus. Okay. Yeah, yeah. So in the context of being in a state of ketosis, it reduces an inflammatory pathway. Think of it as a hub. And when that's activated, you have a host of inflammatory cytokines that flow throughout your body and your brain and causes persistent, low grade neural inflammation, inflammation in the body that can impede a recovery processes over time. I think that really contributes to to brain health too. So I might be getting little far ahead. Of myself because that is it's animal work, but it's convincing animal work looking at a particular pathway that's pretty well defined before you get to. This is their one zero variation between a low carb versus ketosis and elevations of ketone levels in your blood. Right. But I mean, in terms of, is there a benefit to Kita genyk to being stated Kito says with this reduction of inflammation versus low carb. I believe there is just by elevating the metabolite beta hydroxybutyrate, but I do think even low carb has some anti inflammatory effect, but Optima would be Kito sus. I, like I said, I, I don't think it's going to be optimal for everybody, but I, I know there's going to be benefits to maintaining low to moderate levels of key tones for neurological health and also for for recovery and maybe performance lane. You're wincing at the mention of inflammation. More so that. So we mentioned recovery from exercise. Inflammation and calorie deficit is a very powerful anti anti-inflammatory. So I mean, lane lane addresses that context, scientists, Lonzo appreciate that. So one thing I would have because people get it's easy to get into black into white thinking. We hear inflammation and we think that's bad. That's bad. So there's some studies that tell us quite a bit about inflammation. Your body actually has an optimal level of insulation to little inflammation is actually bad as well. So if you first chronic, I was talking about chronic, yes, this is a lot of scientists miss to acute. We can talk about emperor and cancer and acute vs quantity and how scientists even mess the stuff up, but you. So if you, if you look at studies of recovery from exercise and muscle growth, I'm focusing on this, but I'll I'll bring it back around. If you give IB proven to healthy people who have normal levels of inflammation, ibuprofen, inhibits muscle growth. If you give it to elderly people with high levels of installation, they grow more muscle. So this means that the body for recovery has an optimal level of inflammation. It likes to be in. There is a kind of a curve here. It's a Cox, two inhibitor and beta hydroxybutyrate is also a costume. Right? And so the part of growing muscle in recovery is actually inflammation macrophages and all these sorts of things are involved in that process. Now, if it gets runaway if it's too much, it's not a good thing. But if it's too little, it's also not a good thing and he did a great job on your show of talking about a recovery versus adaptation. Right? So one of the things he said, if you do ice Bassey, do these sorts of things your in the short term allowing yourself to recover faster, but you're also limiting how much at a table and you're going to incur, and I love that because it was people miss this. They say, if you're if you're somebody in the off season, if you're trying to grow, get more lean body mass or trying to get better at something, it's probably could deliver. Your body like for like about term, have some inflammation and not in a long term, but in response to that training session. But if you're in a camp again, this words, context permanent or like on the Powell, if they're getting ready for meat, and I'm supposed to be squatting four times a week. I've done that before and I'm so sore that I can't squat my four session than ice bath or something. I'm not worried about growing Muslim. The time I'm worried about getting recovered enough that I can go next training session because that is a lot more important for my competition coming up. Then having that little bit extra muscle. So in camp, probably a good idea. Postseason. Not a good idea. Yeah. I mean, again, it's all context dependent, right? Like if you start getting so sore that you can only train like twice a week, then maybe a certain level, but that points back to that, there's an optimal range of inflammation that your body probably should be in that's optimal for health as well. Now, I don't think like doing a ketogenic diet for somebody. It's going to take him out of that necessarily, but I. Always want to give context because people hear these things and they always think it's as a positive, like in terms of recovery, I believe that it can enhance the adaptive process associated with recovery. And I also believe that being an Akita genyk state will enhance your readiness, your resilience and your recovery. So from a military perspective too, I believe that and that needs to be validated in study, but something that that we study when you, I'm sorry to interrupt you. But when you advise us to the military did, do they do you put them on a specific meal plan to, or do they have? It's more like that grants where this is being studied at a very fundamental very controlled level from cells to animal models to you know, human clinical trials going on and where the data's being collected now, and some of it is taken empirically, anecdotally from the field or just from various exclusive channels. I guess I would say so that I am coming at it as a biased. And I'm kind of. Speaking head of the science. But I do think that science already exists showing that you have a greater adaptive effect of just by virtue of lowering inflammation overtime in athletes, especially this probably pertains more to endurance athletes. So it really needs to be studied in in resistance fighters and things like that. So there was a recent study at I can't remember the researchers day. I'll send it to you. I had a lot of criticisms of it, but they did show that Kita, Jennifer, synon-, Kita, genyk diet, and people who were lifting weights trying to get bigger that there was actually slightly less muscle mass. Using the genetic diet, you think that'd be because of the less protein? No, they quoted protein. I'm pretty sure I want to say they acquitted protein. I don't know for sure. So I don't want to say Thornton today, but I stay in Kito says you're gonna have is today just for calories. I believe they did. So again, I could be wrong, and so I'll go back and look. And I'll, I'll send it to you if you want it. But it is possible, like again for every give me, there's Gotcha in certain things. Right? So like these things that activate different pathways will port of what key tones may signal is a deficit because usually you don't have them in a surplus, right? So, you know, we don't know if you can like, for example, like a tough Aji. Right? Like we're talking about performance and muscle everybody. Here's a tough g. and that's a very, by the way that's such a weird way to pronounce that because it's auto and Fago Saito so shouldn't be autophagy. But anyway, it's very rapidly emerging science and Naomi tell wrote a book about this and it just it's like a New York Times and that really covers a science. So license last two or three years? Yeah, remodeling and proteins, but very hot. Then what gets me is like people who are big on intermittent fasting, they'll save increases tough Aji, but you'll see. They're also saying, you can grow this muscle and it's going to be best for, you know. Building muscle, but that's not true because a tougher tougher part of protein degradation. So if you're increasing that system by definition that's less muscle. So there's always a give me an Gotcha for one benefit. There might be a drawback. Now, depending on your individual situation, maybe it makes more sense, right? Like having the most muscle mass possible may not be the best thing for health. Now, we know that having having more muscle mass than normal is good for health, but maybe having like absolute peak muscle mass may not be the best thing for, you know. So it's like, that's why I was trying to say earlier. There's never going to be one diet that just fixes all of our problems. It depends on the individual and what they're trying to get out of it. Just like if I went to an again, I'm not have much. I watched MA for years. Love your commentary. That's why I learned a lot of stuff about imminent in may. But if I went to a Brazilian jujitsu instructor and I said, what's the best technique? He's gonna look at me like I'm an idiot, right? Because you're not. He's not gonna say, arm bar everytime that's the best technique for you. And that's when people say, what's the best? I, it's the same thing. It's completely contextual dependent. Right depends on you. And in the case of inmate, depends on your opponent as well what your goals are and strategies and your tactics. I think we were trying to really imprecise that individuality dependent, but also really wanted to emphasize that they show as calories matter, you know, calories matter, even even if you're eating low carb, you can't just eat as much as you want and low carb is a very viable option. Yes, you induce and sustain a calorie deficit that can contribute to body composition, but he like you brought up a floor may whether earlier which I thought was great because you said he drinks a coke after training. Well, it's hard to argue with his results. But then again, sometimes elite athletes can get away with a lot of really dumb shit because they're so genetically superior that they were going to do well, no matter what didn't. Michael Jordan need a Big Mac for every game. No, not true steak and baked potato steak and baked potato. Whereas the Big Mac myth come from fucking by McDonald's mother. Steak and baked potato. Sounds like my wife can eat two or three big Macs and a sitting and wash it down with a full sugar coke still gain nothing cringe, but she some people can do that. Some people do, but. But, but this. So it's did he become this great because he ate this way or can he eat this way? Because he's this great athlete, it's probably the latter, right? So we wouldn't recommend like somebody like if somebody's sitting at home and they want to become the greatest boxer ever don't go Provo, probably drinking coke isn't the first step right? But this is what we do with detraction because we pick out people that we follow. We go. I'm just going to do that and it so individuals on the sidelines of marathons, like they'll hand off cokes to people on scene because people just want it for fuel. People just want it for fuel tasted. It is not a bad idea when you're doing something that's grueling as don't want to say it's a bad I I don't. Yeah, I'm not against it either if you're harboring makes sense. Yeah, dense, right? Yeah, but you what calorie stuff when you're saying bad thing again, context is so right because we don't ever drink a coke. Well, if you were starving to death, I promise you drink a coke, right? You know. So it's if you need quick energy, it's probably not the worst thing that Floyd Mayweather could possibly do pose a tradition, but not optimal. Yeah, those Honey waffles, you know, like when they're doing hikes and stuff. But again, at the end of the day, if he his Cobra hydrate intake and I don't know what it is, but if he's eating five, six hundred grams of carbohydrate a day is it really hurting him to have forty grams of sugar from a coke if he's like maintains bodyweight performing optimally, probably probably Nestle. When you think about the kind of grueling workouts guy puts his, maybe maybe that's the only way he can maybe. I don't know. Again, I'm I am fear rising. Maybe that's the only way he could get enough food in is to eat really energy sources of food to maintain his body weight. And if you start saying, well, we need you to eat chicken breast, and broccoli, and you know this organic rice and all this. He he might start dropping weight like a stone and his performance in the tank. So this is why context is so important. And again, like when we talk about people think how many times have you seen two guys in the Arctic on and just looked at their bodies and gun. This one guy is gonna smash. This other guy like. Just in the primal part of your brain because he was built like a tank. And then the other guy who looks like nothing just goes out and completely obliterates happens all the time all the time. Right? So it's completely context dependent. The biggest thing is to make sure that you don't run out of fuel during these things right or whatever, whatever your your sport is. I mean, again, I'm known as a carb guy and I had this powerlifter one time telling me, he's like, don't you think you should carb load the night before Palestine. I was like, dude, you do in nine reps like you're, you're doing so you get three attempts on each lift, squat bench, pressing lift. You're not depleting harbor limited. He likes what really amazing even like you can fast for a week which I did and deadly, and it's not a significant. Inhibitor of your of your performance. Whereas like running would be hills or something like that, or doing rowing prolonged resistance training to three three hours on, it's probably not optimal to go and fasted a string of it. But you know, it's it's, you have to pick the context the individual and honestly, at people play gonna wanna hear this from a scientist, but we don't know enough about this stuff yet to really say for each individual person what's best for them. And that's why we kinda gotta go by feel. We know you don't have to go drinking Gatorade throughout your one hour, workout gym. Typically, you know, I'm I'm drinking tones, but it's you don't. It's not going to offer you any advantage. It's not. And I did that for many years. Actually, I think guys still do it. Now we see it all the time. They gotta make your your shake in the gym and drink it into work. Drove me nuts was I kind of gotten a little back and forth with Tim Noakes on Twitter, and he kind of made it out to seem that you know people were dismissing some of his research because people in academia or that peer review is broken, who's Tim Nokes? Oh, sorry. He's a big a low car proponent. He's a professor in South Africa. I want to say, yeah, yeah, and very knowledgeable and opinionated, but very knowledgeable. He said to me like, well, that's because you've never challenged convention because I was an eye, Domino's. I have challenged every convention in the fitness industry that there ever was, but it's just, you know, when when people ask me he's vocal about it. Yeah, certif-. But you're also open minded. I'm very open minded. I just don't like if you can't show me a hard evidence, you know, like there was a great quote from Thomas soul that I saw today. It said you could ask these and science and go a long way in terms of sorting out bullshit compared to. What. Where's your heart evidence? You know, and what is the cost? Right? So it's well, low. Carb is better compared to what and what's the cost on performance or any of these other things? And then where's your hard evidence? Right? So this is why, like I said, science overtime, yes, you can have industry influences. You can have muddled data and some scientists fake data. We've we've both come across this scientists who have fake data, how frustrating. Oh, it it makes me so incensed. In fact, I won't say anybody by name, but I used to be in business with somebody who I found out that I had no hard evidence, but I had a lot of circumstantial evidence that they were faking data and even happens in cancer research. It's a huge meal even in cancer. And I took this person out to dinner, and I told them was like, we're done like this thing we're doing is done and, and thank goodness I did because it came out. Later, people start replicating trying to replicate data and nobody could replicate this data and and the still had a pretty big following even now. But you know, it's, it's one of those things that it makes me so mad because then people get so frustrated because they feel like if they feel like scientists are just an industry's pocket, why are they going to believe anything any of us say, you know, it's so frustrating and that's why motivation, money, power, ego, if elapse, it's a company's funding you for a particular supplement and you come out with consistently with negative data, what's the incentive for them to keep funding you? But if you, if you're always showing positive results on supplement studies, supplements companies fund you of course now, but it's so so dangerous. Also what people keep in mind that that it's got to be done in a very controlled blinded fashion. That's the only way around I keep reminding people like people who say things like we found the cure for cancer and the government is suppressing it. And like, and. All the scientists are just in the what you're saying is you're saying that every scientist on the planet who does cancer research is an immoral unethical piece of shit. That's what you're saying. Because you just told me they don't have friends and family who are dealing with cancer, and they're suppressing this research. Come on now, you know. And that's, that's the other big, almost small government guy. And I'm like I said libertarian, but one of the things that makes me cringe about libertarian sometimes is these big elaborate conspiracy theories that come up around science and whatnot, like you realize like a Senator can't even text a dick pic to his his side chick without like at winding up all over Twitter, you'd think they could start to these big elaborate theories? I can't even tie their shoes in the morning without spinning ten thousand dollars, you know? So the idea that like all this research is being suppressed by the government. I'm not saying it's never happened, but I think it's pretty darn rare. Well, gentlemen, we just did three plus hours. Thank you thought like six. Blue by shit. You giving us, especially. Thank you. Thanks for eliminating the stuff which is still it's so complex. It's part of the problem. And I think you hundred shows and we'd never cover all the topics are all issues are all the details. And I think in so incredibly difficult for people to find the right diet and program that works for them. I'd like to add one thing that the science is rapidly emerging and the metabolic health summit which is happening in the end of January, beginning of February. Next year, two thousand nineteen will be bringing in the leading scientists that are talking about all the different topics right now, weight loss, and that's going to be in LA. It's actually there's a flyer on your book there. If you look inside, they're giving you a flyer a right l. a. January thirty first to February third in Long Beach, metabolic health summit dot com. It's going to be very comprehensive group of of basic scientists, clinical scientists, entrepreneurs, and people every people that are just interested in the space you going to. I will be at, I'm helping to sort of organize and promote it, but also moderating some of the things we're gonna hit on. Basically, every topic that was discussed in my last podcast and this podcast, the leading scientists on the show up and Hickel. So we definitely went laying there too, and I think it would be great to have a panel discussion that addresses this with a couple more experts and personalities in that. I think it's just it's amazing how much information you have to absorb. It's really done so many diet podcasts and I'm still a moron. Well, that's why like you'll, I always tell say, people, you know, it's hard because if you're not going to do a degree yourself or do research yourself, it's so hard to know who like you have to pick people that you trust. Yeah, right. And it's so hard to know who to trust because there was something that. Greg, knuckles, really spark. I said that I think kind of ties things together nicely. He said people are really good at knowing when somebody has more knowledge than them about a subject. Like you talked to somebody for a little bit and you, you really can get an impression pretty quickly if they know more or less than you are about the same. What they're really bad at doing is figuring out amongst to people who know more than them, who is the more knowledgeable on the two. They are very bad at picking that out. So you kinda got pick people who trust. Now, if you're looking for people to trust, notice the three magic words that me and him both on here today. At one point, I don't know. Well, usually experts. They don't make broad claims. They don't use the Perla gives they don't say things like best. Worst, never always. They're usually putting context everything and they're providing you with information that helps eliminate you that everything is nuanced. And that's why like, I'm sure you know, related to may if you talk to anybody who's an expert in any different discipline and you ask them abroad question, you're going to get a really broad answer. And if you ask them a specific question, give a lot of context, then they'll give you a specific answer, but I would you agree with that? Yes, definitely. So I think someone's really strong on one side dig kind of deep and look for complex of interest too. So. So that's kind of an important thing. I try to be transparent. It's as much as possible on on sort of things we're involved in. So I think that super important. I'm not unlike without bias to sell stuff. I've got a book out. I've got another book coming out, have a website, you know. So it's. Yeah, but you're not actually well by not advocating but approach. You're kind of approaching it from. Is it really sexy complete contest prep guide, and this is available on all those places by Elaine dot com by dot com. And your Twitter bio lane, Instagram, bio lane and Dom Kito nutrition dot ORG, and keystone technologies as our company. It's an information website. I don't have any products per se, at least not yet, but I put products on there that I personally use kind of edit out that I think could be helpful. And just a lot of information like your your prior podcast with me is on their awesome and Tim Ferriss and Rhonda Patrick to right on the front page. Your Twitter and Instagram? Yeah. Dominic dot Dagestan. Oh, dot KT I think is Instagram not a huge integrating back, but Dega St.? No, d. a. g. t. i. to is my Twitter handle and Dominic Davis Dino for Facebook to so three gentlemen. I think we got a lot of complex today. Thank you. Really appreciate, appreciate, Thanks, Joe. Thank you. Everybody for tuning into the podcast and thank you to our sponsors. Thank you to movement. Watches get fifteen percent off today with free shipping and free returns by going to m v Mt dot com. Slash Rogan. See why the movement keeps growing. Check out their expanding collection of dope watches sunglasses, and now bracelets for the ladies. Go to m v Mt dot com. Slash Rogan and join the movement. Thank you also to athletic greens folks. Athletic greens is offering you a special deal listeners this podcast or giving away twenty free travel packs valued at one hundred dollars or ninety nine dollars. Why I they? Why don't they just charge a hundred? I never understood that trend. I guess you save with all ninety nine dollars. It's valued at nine, nine dollars. So get into a daily routine with let it greens. It's one of the best things you can do for your health and success. I cannot stress this enough head over to athletic greens dot com. Forward slash. Rogan and claim your special offer today. That's athletic greens dot com. Forward slash Rogan, do not miss this, and thank you also to policy. Genius, ladies and gentlemen, go get yourself, fuck and covered to it for yourself. Do it for your loved ones. National life insurance awareness month is right now and. Policy. Genius has quotes. You can apply in minutes. You get the whole thing done on your phone stuff. Going around. Prices are at a twenty year low and policy genius makes it easy to get the right policy for you policy genius. The easy way to compare and buy life insurance. We're done. Thank you. Everybody. Thanks for tuning in Toronto. See people tomorrow night. Thank you, love you. Bye.
The Joe Rogan Experience
Aired 2 months ago 55:56
The Jimmy Butler Trade, Patriot Games, Danger Mayfield and More
It getting knocked down on the football field makes you tough. But getting back up makes you tougher at Goodyear, we call that determination a willingness to put in more hours more reps and more of heart to reach a bar that sky high because the Goodyear blimp doesn't show up for just anybody. So don't be just anybody the blimp worthy. Good here. More driven. And now Jalen and Jacoby on ESPN radio. Where he shop because if we ever do y'all pop the strokes. Sweet. He is Jalen rose. What up del? I'm david. The cool check in. Sinister age on my putting it on wax. It's the new vigor. We are Jalen and Jacoby. What do we do? We. What they want? One day. I'm so excited for this show. There is so much to discuss the number one thing to discuss Jalen rose in finally happened. Jimmy Butler, no longer on the Minnesota Timberwolves. He wasn't traded to the clippers. He wasn't traded to the heat in a surprise twist. He was traded to the Philadelphia seventy Sixers. The Sixers traded him for Covington search and a future second round pick. Jalen rose. How does she changed? The Sixers a few ways the Philadelphia seventy Sixers now are a legitimate Eastern Conference contender. But adding Jimmy Butler, they're not the favorite. However. But it gets them closer. When you don't draft will just they hit home runs with them in Simmons. Let's not forget they also took Michael Carter Williams Okafor just say his name just say his name. Our Kilfoyle are Celts. Okay. And when you lose in the asset department, and then you not only draft marquees oil, but you gave up a first round pick to get him. It hampers what you can do going forward versus a team in your same conference in the Boston Celtics that have drafted will and created asset. So as I watch Philadelphia they got three of the best six players in the east. Let me think about just take about it. And I'm speaking and other guys in the conversation kyri Greek freaking coli, they got three of a best six players in east. But you know, what I love about basketball. That's still make them the favorite. Why is that they've got a legitimate big three? They got a legitimate. Big three. Probably only go stay worse can both that we talked about this show. I think there are only two big threes in basketball, right and the only to legitimate big three and that's fair to say. So now, Philip Philadelphia's catapulted themselves not only back in contention conversation. But also the. Of next big team. That's going to get people to come play with them conversation. I like this angle, no doubt about it. Because now you look at Ben Simmons whose unselfish and a point guard at sixteen and Joel Embiid who's gonna get me twenty and ten and a couple of blocks and make threes and Jimmy Butler. A lockdown defender that's going to also be clutching. Gimme twenty plus points players Nago one to play with this. So here's the thing though. I Jimmy Butler has to convince the Sixers that the Sixers wanna play with him. So what's happening? Now is he's a free agent at the end of this year. He has a history of having say trouble. But having concerns about some of his young teammates and voicing those concerns. He has a history of being just not the warmest friendliest fell in the locker room. So the Sixers can give him the max at the end of this year. And it is expected that they gave away Sarge and comington because they plan to do. So is he going to be on his best? 'have you is Jimmy Butler gonna I don't know maybe swallow real thoughts about his young teammate get the max, I have the feeling at the end of this year. He's going to sign the deal, and he's gonna tell everybody thinks about him. That's the deal. Joel be deleting Twitter account. Jim the second contract. I see it playing out. Like, oh, this is like an audition here for him. And he's gonna be on his best behavior shelter Elton brand who got this deal done. So early in his first year as the GM I understand what you mean about Butler. But look at it like this M, B and Simmons are better than current towns. And no question about it to no one's gonna review time. He gets to play with them in east. I know that's the conference that doesn't have the golden stay warriors. Which has you look on a piece of paper say, okay, the Celtics legit, the raptors legit the bucks are playing. Well. But now they're legitimately apart of that conversation. Now, just like any team. This is why love about the game. They have weaknesses. Oh, yeah. Big gave away two of their shooters. And you know, they got Jimmy Butler back. But there's there they need a shooter. Yes. I don't think they're done. Anchoring with their team. And I got a wild car here. We'll to number one JJ Redick is going to start to play better. Get more minutes him definitely deserves to be in the starting lineup. But you know, when they're trying to feature guys. So clearly they were featuring Saric featuring Covington trying to feature false, but they realize they're stuck with him. No one's taking. But here's a while. They could've added full to that trade Minnesota big number number Zoe about Wilson Chandler hall gonna be a wild card. Nobody talks about in this dynamic. They're going to be able to put five five four players on the floor that switch everything with JJ rid. That's what happening when things get tough for Philadelphia. And it's crunch time. Their best lineup on paper already for me. JJ? It. Simmons m b Butler Wilson Chandler interesting. He's gonna play well with them. He has really gotten the opportunity dealt with some injuries earlier in the year. I think he's going to now elevate his game and be a rotation player. Do you think that they add another shooter you said they're not done touring with the lineup because JJ Rettig knockdown shooter, obviously Jimmy Bullock shoot three's. Ben Simmons not shooter like literally doesn't shoot threes. So here's my hate law for the league as a player that was once bought up when Tyson Shailer still in uniform for Phoenix. And we already know he's going to LA. Oh, yeah. So what's going to happen is what's happening? Cow Korver start to look at all of the teams that are struggling the have veterans with not so favorable deals to the team those guys now become buyout cannons. And so there will be people there will be shooters. There will be opportunities to fill your roster. If you're the Philadelphia. Seventy six and again, big shot to L andbranch. There's nothing like just he's just just getting the office set up things on the wall in his office. And he's already got a big win. It's a great way to start at new position. So let's now move the conversation away from the Sixers to the Eastern Conference a whole now, I'm gonna show you how to east coast had the Sixers as the fourth team in the Eastern Conference, and that changes now, how do you have the pecking order of the top four teams in the Eastern Conference Mike condolences to all Pacers fans all blank canvas. I still have to say the Boston Celtics because I did make it to the conference finals without Kyrie Irving last year. And he's back. According Hayward still struggles struggling the Toronto. Raptors look great. How lorries improve this playmaking getting me double figures ever said about calories wrong. And obviously they have Leonard. The Sixers are third based on what we just discussed and don't dismiss the Milwaukee books. It probably have the best player not only in the conference. But. A front runner gonna be one of the top players as it relates to like all NBA considerations in the Greek free. Appreciate how Lopez has reinvented himself as a player that wouldn't shoot threes that can now really as we saw over the weekend in quietly talked about this Malcolm Brogdon is really improve from last year. Yes, Malcolm Brogdon has been playing really. Well, this obviously Chris Middleton is having a little breakout you're going to be an all stars. Absolutely. So those are the teams Indiana's going to be in the conversation beyond that. But those are the top four teams in the conference. So when I look at this. I just think are the seventy Sixers going to give Jimmy Butler this deal. Now when you when you see Paul George in a contract year is you're gonna stay his Anthony Davis gonna stay what's going to happen. K D like those are kind of obvious questions. But this was a little different. It's like are the Sixers going to want to give him five years one hundred and ninety million dollars. You think that's a done deal? I'm gonna give you a different way to look at it. Yes is. The answer to that question. Because of what I said to begin this conversation there in the same conference as the Boston Celtics who when you look at their roster. They're set now when you look at their assets their set for the future. Oh, yeah. And they're going to be able to continue to have what it takes to bring in other great players that they see have potential to build on what they've done. So if you're going to be in a conference with them, you gotta now go after the best players. And so that's what Phillies able to do we have Simmons. We have in be. We have Butler we have three and a top six players in this conference that makes us a legitimate contender. Now building out the roster. Supplementing your weaknesses getting shooters all of that type of thing is going to come with it. But you definitely play Butler because you already pay Covington seventy you trade him, you wasn't going to give a big deal Billy to Saric. So you you save that money, and you give it to Jimmy Butler. And that's what Minnesota. I was thinking now, I don't think Minnesota good in this trait. But let me tell you this what they were thinking was we're not a destination spot for free agents. No. So I wanna get got us already under contract Covington covington's a three Indian. He's a prototypical two thousand eighteen NBA role player. Like exactly what you want right now in the NBA. You can't have five stars to stub your starting five. I love Covington as your fourth best player in your tips. Kinda Goss self may like Jimmy Butler was came out of the delete. And in Saric is a big shoot. The reasons stretched a floor. You put him alongside car. The towns. He's still on the rookie deal. I have assets as the coach that's also the GM decade put players out there. And Minnesota's actually going to be better. You have you seen Minnesota play this season? I've seen him play with Jimmy Butler. Okay. They're going to be better without Buller. These guys going to give you more points. They're gonna give you more three pointers, and they're gonna give you the opportunity to allow Karl Anthony towns and weekends to flourish. What would they want to build a Karl Anthony towns text Andrew Wiggins when he found out that Jimmy bowlers officially traded. He's I still getting the max I'm still getting max he go to. So much to discuss today. I love putting the show together on days like today. Jimmy butler. Nice mine is in the patriots lost nice lights rate where my home is so much happening Zion. Like this. I was watching John over the football game. Raindrop would fall. You're not our by Herbie's classic. We need to get like we need to get you on Spotify. Doing some DJ Motown club playlists for James. Let's do do that. With the radio show. We pick the music for the radio show really gets the string. You know? Like show, your your range, your musical range or rough too. I remember I was in charge of the music on the radio show for a little bit. Tell the people what happened to that by four five years ago Olympic liberal stones day. How about that? Artist? He just said. Thick and then he saying live biscuit, I snuck that passed but Rolling Stones days when it was when you registered text. Good reason. Good reason. To be honest. I was like, oh, this ain't gonna last because he came prepare for every single kiss. What shelter you deliver? The show Reggie with zero percent one hundred percent vested in it. Got the job done. Bigshots my family who's here. We're gonna get into everything in a second. But shots my joke. A lot on this program. And that's what family members teammates do. But you have a beautiful family. Very proud of them. I'm glad they're here today to Veterans Day of school. And I'm determined to get the most show. I know you are somehow, someway, I told Harland earlier I talked to general thing. Trying to drag them on the show. Somehow we got to get him on the show. Okay. It's love our program. Okay. You have kids that can offer. Great insight into what it's like to be their age. What they're watching on TV the music that they like come cute on do it as an out show for the TV's. Okay. We'll do we'll tape a little queuing wax a little bit you going to do this. I know you're gonna do. I don't want this. I know. That's why that's why. Uncle consensual guest. Yes. Come on cue have some non consensual guests. Come on ladies, come on, y'all. All right. Yes, quits. Yes. What are you doing brother chain? What are you watching TV these days? Television. Really what happens squad you come over here. Mysteries. Like like, if there's this greed octopus feed that strive to this. And then and in the end their brothers and sisters in this in this industry, one as it like. Things in the broader one doesn't like yellow things. And then they made and then and then they shoot a d. The the brother and sister in the eight them in the baby aged scare the ba- way because he had growing power. Wow. That's better than I could do any movie review ever. What do you think about Jalen and Jacoby q? In any notes for the show. Where's it could be better? Can make the baby shoes under roof. I wanna thank you for joining us Quincy Margot khloe. Hey, anything I want. Octopus the same ouster and Monte. I. This is my favorite. Editors. Cool. Thank you so much, ladies and gentlemen. Thank you. Thank you happy now. Jalen, yes. Thank you. Let's get the pay. Getting knocked down on the football field makes you. But getting back up makes you tougher at Goodyear, we call that determination a willingness to put in more hours more reps and more heart to reach a bar that sky high because the Goodyear blimp doesn't show up for just anybody. So don't just anybody. Worthy. Good hear more driven. Jalen rose was very interesting weekend in the NFL the most shocking result. And I kept waiting for the patriots to come back against the titans. I just kept waiting for happen. They're down a couple of scores. And this wasn't just the patriots losing to the titans. The patriots kinda got whooped by the titans right here. You see Marcus mariota rolling to his right hooking up. Nice pass. They kind of did whatever they wanted on offense against the patriots defense and the patriots had trouble moving the ball and scoring. Jalen, what did you see from this result? Order to perennial all pro players. That play for different teams that are really successful on really famous that I've come on this program and said that their respective teams should trade them years ago. Gronk. And they'll beco- Odell Beckham Brooklyn plan yesterday hasn't really played. Well, I'll say ain't paying attention. He missed a game or soil Goto, and he's accomplished so very much injuries catch up to you. And that's what I see when I'm talking about. The patriots gronk isn't the performance that used to be and that's Tom security blanket. He's one of the best to do it. Now if somebody ever said into a microphone. The Josh gore was gonna be Randy moss. You should put those clips up and that person should wipe their my five or so. Okay. There are people saying that right? Josh Gordon is going to be. It's the deep threat to pay brain. He. Yeah. Yeah. He hasn't hasn't had a weapon. Like, this is Randy moss. I've watched the patriots game. He's been fine. Well, I'll take Brandin cooks over gourd. So that illustration was off anyway. And if you're talking about some of the personnel moves at the patriots have and haven't made which has been interesting, but you know, who this isn't lost upon filling by the name of Dan Lewis shouldn't be because he was playing on the titans and previously. He was playing on the patriots. And he noted that the patriots were frugal. He had something to say about it after the game. Bruce, we wear especially when used to be there, and they wanna bring you back. So definitely will just having my teammates came out and played a little person. Personally, go get you asking you. Oh, oh, tell me how you really feel Mr Lewis. Do you think that this was personal for variable who was coach for the patriots and Lewis who was running back? So it's always personal when you playing against your former team, but here's the distinction upon which way, you're exit began. Did you upgrade or were you released? It all of these cases, John Robertson their GM. It was never gonna be that New England because that's Bill Bella checks job might able definitely wasn't going to be the head coach. No, okay. Maybe twenty thirty five if you stuck around and he played for them. And then he play he coast on the Bill O'Brien in Houston. So he navigated around the patriot coaching tree, Malcolm Butler, who's been benched this year because of his performance at different times got a thirty million guaranteed contracts. Patriots didn't even play him in the SuperBowl. Okay. Dion Lewis who. Here's a terrific young. Who did well with Henry yesterday change of pace Bax type of thing, but they drafted Sony Michelle in the this past season only had thirty one yards rushing. So when you go into gets that form of squat course, there's going to be a little animosity filling certain type away type of thing. But all of these people came up because of the patriot two point moving on to another game. The other big game yesterday. The last time the Seahawks and the Rams played it came down to the final seconds. They played again on Sunday. And guess what came down to the final seconds. The Rams look good. They were moving the ball as you see here. And at the end, they had a nice comfortable lead that kinda disappeared right now. You see them look at the time. There's five fifty left and they're up by a couple of scores. And then it came down the Seahawks scored touchdown. They're moving the ball. It's looking like maybe it's going to be some Russell Wilson magic. They have four th and ten brussel floats it over the receivers head in the Rams win the game. Jalen rose. The Rams lost the saints last week. They had another good win this week. How do you feel about this bounce back win for the rain? It's a quality win. You look at it on paper and be like, oh, they should be Seattle. But the one thing that stood out to me is while they have Aaron Donald on the defensive line in Dhamma can and this brought in follow who's going to be able to rush to quarterback they struggle against wrong. They were getting Gow's by Seattle. And as the weather starts to change a team that plays in Los Angeles is going to be going against teams that play outside possibly in the playoffs. That's gotta be something that they shore up eventually will get to leave but on offense of side Todd Gurley three down back. You know, how much you love. No doubt about it. And then they employ their weapons with cool getting them involved when they need to get in the mist touches. So that he could be successful. Same with the woods Cup got injured during the game. Los of. But how? Jerry golf has continued to mature as a quarterback is really taking this team to a whole 'nother stratosphere anyone is a good win. The way that the Seahawks were able to move the ball and get kind of you know, score on them and kinda push them at the end of the games a little concerning. But look the Rams might not have to play anybody outside in the playoffs. They're gonna have better record than most people in the in the only team in the NFC, it's going to have a better record than them the saints home. So like maybe that won't be so much concern as we get down the seat. I'll sleep teams like the bears, I'm sleeping on. But here's the thing. You guess you don't have to worry about it when you have home field advantage. So they'll be playing one playoff games moving onto the Cowboys. We'll see if they'll be playing a playoff team. The Cowboys has always seemed to be tough every loves talk about the Cowboys. And they had a big Sunday night matchup division game against the eagles. And you're making that hand gesture because you remember when they were criticized for verse six touches in the second half. Ezekiel Elliott Zeke Elliot had no trouble getting touch in this game. And had no trouble getting yards is the cowboy. Season rejuvinated by this performance against the division rival, you I wanna be a gentleman at this network because they get bashed. So very often. But yet we still try to talk about the Cowboys because they rate to give them credit in two departments. Okay. Shop to Jason Gary. Let me say that again what shall to Jason Gerry, Jerry. Let me tell you. Some the hardest thing to do is to get your football team or any team to play it consistently compete when everybody's against them. What everybody's counting them out. And they're in a situation where people feel like they're going to go to Philly get thumped, and everybody's gonna pile them. I was ready to do it. Okay. Everybody. So that's the hardest time with things are most difficult to get your team's spirit of to Guam for four. Okay. And they thought Philly the defending Super Bowl champion to play in their division. So for him to get that football team to perform the way it did. Of course was equal Elliott's Russia's four hundred eleven time eleven yards. Every time the ball. No doubt about it. But again, what that allows is playing ball control saying this for years like the Dallas Cowboys defense has improved and this really good on third down paying attention to that. But when they're controlling the ball with the run having back play are PEOs do ingest sweeps doing short passes. Now, all of a sudden the defense gets the chance to rest over there with the Gatorade. They wanna get out on the field. They're more effective. That's what they've been able to do. That's the form of success that they use. A couple of seasons ago when they were playing a lot better. Jason Gary another show. I think he needs it shall to Jason Gerry. Because teams I needs it. How about this? When I look at a team like the giants on paper. We'll be like they got more talented in Washington. They got more talent giant to the skill positions. Briars? So so what's the difference between the talent and productivity usually is the coaching and a quarterback and in line. Lowered in an office of line. Of course. Well. This is something that's coming to a resolution the national resolution got a resolution the National Football League levian bell. All reports are that he is not going to report to the Steelers this no, which means Levy on bell will not play professional football this entire season long. I do not think this was the plan all along for Levy on bell bell was gonna hold out for a little bit. Then they're gonna finally, you know, come around and give me a big contract that never happened. I'm hold out for a couple of games. And they're gonna finally realized that they can't win without me. Then they're gonna get a big contract. I didn't happen. And then it was reported the ends to make sure that I get some bread this year that didn't happen. What will happen now with Levy on bell? I'll give you four reasons. Why it didn't go initially the way it was planned? Okay. Look no further than the leadership. Mike Tomlin who came out and said, we won't participants not hostages volunteers. Not houses. I'm never good. I was confused by that. But we can move on number two. It's one thing to be criticized from the locker room. It's another thing when the offense align when foster policy are speaking who happened to be leaders on the team, never good. You ready for the other domino James Connor more yards and more touchdowns in the same age. So you're telling me, I can get a much the same production much cheaper without the headache. Okay. Enjoy Miami Levy on. And so when you leave in tweet by Miami, I felt like that was gonna be him going back to the Pittsburgh Steelers to why else would you even tweet that because he's back in Pittsburgh. He went to Pittsburgh, who's playing pickup basketball. That's an odd decision. What's even doing Pittsburgh? If he's not gonna report, that's what that that's why I'm validating and supporting what you said like the plan seemed to continue to change because he probably wouldn't have left Miami to go to Pittsburgh. If the goal wasn't to be a Steeler, Pittsburgh underrated fund city shout to Pittsburgh now Miami, though, if you're spending time. Like, not Miami. If you're spending time underrating fund city now, however, this will all be water under the bridge over the next few months when we pick up a newspaper and see sad team Levy bell X amount of years X amount of millions of dollars play football with your next year. It's going to happen for you. He's probably like, you know, what I'm not gonna do this year get injured, but guess what he is going to do. Get more guaranteed money next year than he would have gotten this year. That's a great point Jalen rose. You know, what things don't look great for him? Now for some tells me any signs that contract he'll be back in Miami. And things will. The college football season is starting to clarify itself. We know who the top four teams are we know that some team control their own destinies. They just have to win out. We know what needs to happen for the other teams to leap into those top four teams and make the playoffs. It's getting really interesting and right now you can see as we get deep into the season. Just who's put the work in who hasn't who's put the hours in the off season who's done the hours in the film room, who's really prepared in these games and who's not prepared who's physically and mentally ready to play you have to put the work in the hardy work, the further you go, do, you know who else knows that do who else puts the the hours in two studies? The science could your tires. Goodyear knows all about that kind of focus in preparation that you need to be successful. They put in the hard work to make sure that your tires are ready to go when you need them because when you're driving on the road every single day is game day. So when it comes to choosing tires could a good your dot com. And that good your help you choose the best way to help you go further to who knows how are your favorite college teams gonna go, but you will go your furthest. If you make the decision to put Goodyear tires on your car could dot com. The chiefs and the cardinals the cheese one homeys thing. But it was closing thought. It was. I gotta give props to Larry FitzGerald second all time in yards for receiver. Awesome. I wish he would have had the cardinals trade him. I just hate to see him waste away career. But this again is all about the explosiveness of the Kansas City Chiefs yesterday was hills turn up, and then let's take a look at hills. Touchdown and especially the aftermath because that's something that I really enjoyed. He scored his touch now. We'll see right here with a nice pass from where Moe. And then this was like what do you do when he grabs the camera and then films, his teammates, celebrating first of all not the greatest framing of the shot there hill. I don't think he's going to take the cameraman's job. I'll think he what you think about this. Do you think he deserved a penalty to find? He deserved a penalty. He will get fine. He's gonna laugh about it. It's well worth it. They're having a really good time living their best laws. Right. And the saints won a great game against the Rams last week. This time they're faced up against the Cincinnati Bengals who've been up and down this year. But I didn't think the game we're gonna go like this this saints west the Bengals they put up fifty one points on the Bengals Jalen rose are the saints the best team football. They're playing like they are out there playing like I was still have to go with Casey probably because they're going to get Eric berry back put man the Rams have. So many weapons yesterday. Mark Ingram got a chance to get going. I was happy to see the Flint native carry four hundred yards Comoros still getting his nose. The sky's the limit for their for Michael Thompson, don't look now. But the Cleveland Browns are hot they fired. Everybody's I'm Michael Thomas. I dunno. They fired everybody and they were playing the falcons the chance to turn their season around with this game. And they might have even just kind of like looked past the Browns a little bit because the Browns look good the Browns hung up twenty eight points on the falcons weren't really in this game. Jalen rose win. Baker Mayfield was asked about his performance in how he felt pre-game. Here's what Mr. Mayfield had this. Thirty. Not really. But when I woke up this morning, I was feeling pretty dangerous. I kinda love me. I love when of the more than I was feeling pretty dangerous. Do you feel dangerous up this morning every morning? That's the goal. Before I get out of the bed is one thing. We're mafi hit that floor. On the fall. Absolutely. I was gonna correct you earlier. But I'm glad we go through every game for this exact reason, this was the worst loss not. Oh, that's good point. This was the worst loss. That's a good point moving on to a team who's challenging the patriots in the AFC. The chargers beat up on the raiders, the raiders, the raiders are just a mess. What do you think about this game? I think that the raiders have lost by fourteen in like the last five or six game. Not even Indian never happened. Not even in history of that franchise. It's hard to be Jon Gruden to get tenure deal and this is year. One. Like, this is this is this is where we're going to do after game you talking about what we're gonna we're gonna work hard. And we're gonna look at the film when you prepare for next week his hardworking and be the foundation of this franchise because any players right now once they lost MAC, and then obviously losing Cooper. But they have some draft picks. I guess next year the Packers beat the dolphins. They dominated the dolphins. The Packers are sneaky four four and one in you know, the lines division. Anything can happen is a pack of season more hopeful or hopeless at this. We talked about it the last couple of weeks pull up the tape. What will unlock the Packers offense would be running back Aaron Jones like they were doing this thing by committee. And I understand you're trying to get so many people involved and coaches do this when they have a young talented player like they don't wanna give him too much too fast. Now all of a sudden Aaron Jones running a balance two touchdowns. Aaron and Eric can actually the Rams two weeks ago. There was an air Jones should be their future back. It was pretty clear that point. Oh, wait. I'm sorry. The lines had games we and Migita risky going into the game had never beaten a division opponent. So maybe they got that going for him. Jalen the lions looked awful builds awful against the bears. Give any any words or sounds could make about. The same. Let's move. Let's not even talk about. I can tell you getting emotional talking about moving on. Thank you. The colts beat the Jaguars Jaguars. The Jacksonville Jaguars are now three and six Jalen rose this team that went to the AFC championship last year knowing that they lead the patriots in the AFC champs. If they were just a quarter away from the Super Bowl. What happened with the Jacksonville Jaguars? The Jacksonville Jaguars. Don't have the level of. Autonomy to make mistakes ofensive -ly. They don't have into days game. What's considered a number one receiver? They dig it. Leonard fournette BAC which gives you a level of balance, but they're not getting quality quarterback play from Blake Bortles, not think that is affected the defense to a point where they're not performing to their capability and they're making Mr. Ramsey unhappy. And you know, I don't like to see a Jalen upset. I you don't like to see Jim said, I don't like to see jail said either I'm gonna break my promise. We're not gonna really talking about every game. I'm going to recognize that the Redskins beat the bucks and the bills wax the jet. And now our fought from Geico motorcycle took fifteen minutes to purchase the gas station, eggs, solid. The gas station exuded. And regret the gas station exiled as you presented numbers to the board. Insult to injury. You could've used those fifteen exile minutes, which your motorcycle insurance to gyco. Geigo fifteen minutes could save you fifteen percent or more on motorcycle insurance. We always talk about when we were right about things. I was wrong about something. I really thought come Anthony was going to be additive for the Houston Rockets. I thought he was going to be great for them offensively and hurt them a little bit defensively. Well, there's been a lot of conflicting reports over the weekend about what exactly is happening between Carmella in the Houston Rockets. But one thing very clear, it's not going. Well, and it really doesn't look like it's going to continue. There's been a lot of reports from inside and outside the organization that will no longer be playing together. Carmelo Anthony has played his last game as a Houston rocket. I've so many questions for you. But first, let's just listen to Chris Paul discuss it been great here. You know what? I mean. That's that's like a brother. You know what I mean? So I don't know what's being said or whatnot mellow has been great working hard every day. You know what I mean? So man mellow is a future hall of fame. That's me saying that knowing that. So what's going to happen next? Jalen, so any? Time you hear ormer players or current players broach. This topic it's really sensitive. Explain this is a really obsessive. Yes. Because in order to become a veteran, you have to reinvent yourself, which means changing this is why some of your favorite artists that have been in a game for a really long time have had multiple nicknames book, Sean Carter, Sean combs like these guys have so many different nicknames because they continue to reinvent themselves. Carmelo a nickname players do this exact same thing. Now, everybody ages different. He was in the same draft class as LeBron James who still the best player on his team. And one of the best players not playing day. Okay. Dwayne way play more years in college in both of them who's in his final season and already not to he's gonna retire. So right now his career could go either way. Okay. When you go to okay, see, he scoffed at the notion of coming off the bench, right? There. Those years of bad sign you go into that season career lows in so many different categories. Yes, they get the first you get bounce in the first round. I'm not going to be here anymore. You and the team agree to just not a good. Look it trades to Alanta. That's not gonna happen. You align you land in Houston. The first thing we ask is what does he go to finally come off the bench for the first time in his career? And anyone who's followed? The NBA knows that might dantonio Carmelo Anthony have a history. Correct. And so we're asking how he's going to adjust to coming off the bench. His answer was I'm doing I'm willing to do whatever it takes for the team as long as we're winning. That's the underlying part. I think a low moment happened, and I had to remote control in my hand doom Oklahoma City when he was struggling didn't get a field goal. The only basket he got credit for was actually a goal. He was unhappy. After that game. Clearly like all of us would have been, but he was more distraught because you start to now think of your journey. I was in Denver got out of divert went to New York me, and the Mari was going to be able to do work. I did put up numbers I'm one of the best players in Nick history. But I didn't get the goal accomplish. Then I go to okay, see, we don't hit our Mark. I ain't going to a land. Not the way they look that was never the plan. So what happens now what team does he play for? Now. What's the next chapter in his journey because it's not over. And so now when you end up in Houston, you're put in a position to be the scapegoat, regardless. Here's what we know. They're not going to best record which they had last year. We know they're not going to be better defensively. So when they take those steps back, you're one of the people that is going to get credit for that decline. So you gotta be lighting it up on the offensive in Chris Paul guy suspended that didn't help James harden got hurt that in help. So now you on the floor. And you're not as a -ffective as you would like to be the coach sees it that you have a history with so the same coast feels like you got fired in New York. He thinking about holds grudges. I know I play from my dad Tony my final season. He holds grudge. Do you think a little bit of this not one hundred percent? But not zero percent was Mike dantonio revenge. I'm not saying that it was the plan. I'm I'm saying this is how it plays out. They weren't going to have the best record. They weren't going to be as good defensively. The only Carmelo can do is come in and ball, it whatever role. He did was given if he's not doing that consistently. They cannot look to him. And be like, oh, that's was different. We add Carmelo of. So he's going to be the scapegoat in this situation. And now he's gonna end up in theory plan for five eight, where's he going to? The name a team or a couple teams got a rock body. You gotta ride the wave when you get a little bit older muzzle. See Philly talking about do you think? Elden brands gonna give them the veteran. Minimum go out there and do what he did in Houston. Go back to the east coast. Where you're familiar familiar. You don't have to the best play at a second player to third best player shooters. That we talk about where Carmelo Anthony is gonna play next. There'll be some rumors coming out in the next couple of days or Miami would away way go full circle play with one of his brothers and Chris Paul Houston, typically latch on Miami. But the Miami gig is dressed in overalls. That's work. That sounds like we're ready for that talk about each talk. No that they play. Well, some tells me he won't end up in the purple and gold with LeBron either be at the Lakers they've been quietly pretty good lately that ties Chandler. They've won three games the road. They beat the kings and last night against the hawks. It got a little close for comfort at the end here. See LeBron trying to take the lead. And then goes the line. He'll hit one of two at least. Right. You miss the first one. You never missed the second. When he was made the adjustments. Oh calculus was working hard on the offensive rebounds. In that though. You know, why he knows it might not go in. And then we get LeBron James dunking, of course, had a chance to win. And the new addition to the team Tyson Chandler gets the block Jalen big win for the Lakers. What you think shop to Tyson Chandler, California kids getting getting a chance to play in purple and gold and being impact player versus being in Phoenix where he was a relevant, regardless of what's to the was putting up the last couple of seasons any feel the weakness that they needed another big besides film was that could block shots, rebounding. The basketball and be a force down low. However when LeBron James has the ball will less than two minutes to go in the games undecided. I'm following him. I've been saying this for the last two or three years. You got the best player in basketball. If you allow I can't believe we've gotten here if you go to allow him to cross half court and put you're on your heels and. Initiate his offense and be a playmaker indoor finisher enclosure team out. That's on you. I would put him on the free throw line distort. Their time distort their office and force them to now make a decision authenticity objectively pretty awful from the line from three at the end of the game. So we actually had the bronze as was asked about this. And here's what he had to say about his late game free throw shooting on garbage. Oh, I'm sorry. And when he was someone asked him also about his late game three point shooting. Here. We had to say on garbage. And then someone asked him about his performance in trainwreck. And this is what he had to say. I'm line on the last one. But for real I can't believe we're at a point where the best player on the planet. The strategy is two thousand him and put him on the line garbage. I've said this for the last two seasons in particular in the postseason, and that's paying how much to him. That's paying the percentages. That's an I know once she's kind of Corey you're going to get a buck. Somebody. So I rather be where I'd rather you be where I can see at the free throw garbage. It isn't away the ultimate it's it sounds respectful. But it's the ultimate compliment to his game garbage the Duke basketball game in the NFL games. Also at the same time. What was I watching Zay on ESPN all my God. What are we coming into the season? We knew he was a great dunker. We knew it was a great leap per athlete. But he does so much more than that watch this game, the rebounds the effort he had six blocks, sixteen rebounds, he had twenty one points. Now the game at the end of the first half. Jalen, I'm hundred percent sold not just on sign. But on this entire freshmen class. What have you seen from them in these first two games? I on is a Lion King Chunga l-. But I tell you my take away from the game other than the obvious. Armies kind of their six at the half army was a little bit eight ball. And I wanna give problem shell shock to all of the veterans. My brother actually was in the army with that being said the thing I appreciate about Zion. Besides his personality in his just on court generalship like I watched for that. He's unselfish he has a big team personality and he tries to check the game at off facets. He was diving on the ground for loose balls. He gets the rebound. He's not looking for a guard. He dribbles up and looks for his teammates in the first few possessions. He said up RJ Barrett for three wide open threes, the only hit one, but he said for three wide open threes, no doubt. And I respectfully call him a bowling ball. Because you think about the power you put behind it. When you throw it down the lane, you ain't gonna get in front of it and everything else just become pins. People just bouncing off early. Do go towards the basket. And it's not out of control is not wild is not undisciplined. It's so very power. For so very athletic that his combination of height. Embark is something that the game hasn't seen to go with a level of athleticism. That's to risk just like so freakish up a prospect that you find yourself not even focused on RJ Barrett. Who might be a better basketball player has scored more points than he has. But it's just when you see just like something you've never seen before. Jalen rose, very quickly K D. We've been talking about him. Maybe leaving the words in the end of the year and a lot of people been talking about that there's been rumors. So what did they do? They put Katie and construction outfit. Check them out. Here's K D And they brought him over to the construction site for the brand new arena. Jalen rose wall. He was truly looking outfit, by the way, the boots the socks everything is best while he's looking at that arena. Do you think he's thinking to himself? This is where I'm gonna play basketball next year. That's a boss move out of team. Yup. No doubt about it. Because a couple of things you getting front of the chase, folks. Who a sponsor you? Get him in front of the warriors brash. You put them in the new building. And you sell him on the fact that this could be your home going. You put reporters there too like Nick Redel who works for us. There's it wasn't a mistake. He did just happen to be there that same day. And all of that is not going to matter when it's time to choose because once k d decided to leave Oklahoma City, he let everybody know he was controlling his own destiny. Two championships. Two finals MVP's if he's able to secure three and three I think he may bones Zairan. So we also get the people they want. Jaylen really wanted to have my kids in the program. So there you go you got their their television. Critics apparently you got the latest on odds quad. I believe khloe was trying to explain to you about often. Don't know if you know about that. Discussed later there scientific underwater marine scientists and learn a lot about different species underwater, we can watch together. That's why answer important because sometimes parents want you to be disciplined and responsible bring you to work much to behave in a restaurant. I do I don't want them. I don't want them. Tearing around. We were we were we were recording the b-block the TV show. I could hear my kids screaming in the office. That's why souls they saw me they came straight to the death. I gave Cheeto or you know, I go on. Yes. Yes. No kids are being on the show. I'm have your lovely y agent reach out to the ESPN. Because now that they're officially on air talent. I believe that they are some sort of compensation. There are three of them. So three x whatever you make. We always say, we're the people that want. So we had to answer that eligible voicemail got at least one voice mail out on the show. Joy edge upset bigshots. Joe Jacobi thread. What's going on Kobe off? I want to. And the whole crew on my throat from all of. Got a quick van coming up playing ball in house. The whole or here behind having a call Bank. When you hit a shot like a lot of commentators crater. Never really bad it. I don't care. What it off the backboard, whatever. In banking on that. That's the same thing is fatter is wrong. Still cook to on that one get on saying. Always hobby. How comfortable again. Yeah haircut. So after close at that, I could I know when I get after I get ahead. Gotta watch my hair. Hairs out of my ears. Comfortable, I aircraft to every man home. Keep giving on keeping people what they want big shout to Mike. So I'll take the first question. Mike Zo something thought about a lot. Jalen, I want you think about this. How many times have you been playing pickup in someone unintentionally scored a Bank shot in that Bank shot actually actually actually factually did not count towards the score this happened to me before? But I'll tell you the circumstances under which happens. Everybody's friends. It's not you're not just at a court where you don't know people in the strangers there when I'm at a court, and we're all friends we've all played together for a long time. Then you can institute this rule that you cannot unintentionally Bank shot in or you need to call Bank to Bank it in. But if you are you're UFO out of town or your playing at a court where you don't know everybody or you only know the people on your team that's not gonna fly. I'm with you shout. The Mike Zoll pre sheet the support shout out. Jacoby is exactly right. When you have an exclusive run to make it tougher and just to make it more fun. Of course, you try to do whatever you can to tighten the rules. Yes. And this is one of them. But it got to be amongst friends and family. That's also including another rule that you should institute. No anyone's if you call foul, and you make the shot you check it up. Well couple of days if plan RIC ball and calling an was I ain't run. I hate that. Like since I was a youngster like I hate that. So. Would want Iraq hall and you get the bucket. It's either or it's either or you have to. Yes. And you can't wait. You can't watch. And wait for all abound around the Ramadorai side. You've got right. That's that's that's poor. Now as it relates to him cooking somebody in feeling like it's the same. Whether it's a swish or a Bank shop all book is created. No, just like when you're playing pool there times when you call the shot, depending on the competition out, you don't do it doesn't count. Correct. And so the skill level of calling the Bank is just showing a level of domination. Not only I'm about to make this fifteen foot or this eighteen footer I'm really good on the left side of the hoop as a lefty shooting that left wing shot as a Bank nice to get people every time with that bang bang glasses. I it sounds cool. When you call it, you know, the rain. Ads those confidence builder. It's a confidence builder. I didn't shoot a lot of Bank shots because sue's missed one off of this guy. Got mad at me once when I shot to banks out to the game, I said board, and I think he thought I meant B O R E D like I'm so bored by gets right? Yeah. So that's what he thought. I was. Oh, no. I was calling the or. Backboard. Well, he should've just horror followed you did half questions later. So second question from Mike. So from Harlem. How are you comfortable getting so many haircuts and putting clothes on? And how do you not deal with the issue? Loose little cut hairs all up on your shoulders neck area. So it works more simple for me. In my lifestyle than it does people who need to get a cut in actually function. When you see me in this pot exclusive. I'm pulling you guys behind the curtain. Okay. This this is one of my trade secrets. Okay. This is like telling you study for my job. Okay. Most people when they get a cut they need that cut to last all day. I just really need my cut to last me while I'm on TV. That's different. That's way, different. So I'm able to do I'm able to cheat it when I sit in the chair, I'm already wearing a shirt if it needs to come over my head once I get a cut. I ain't pulling nothing over my head. This is one of the more insane things. I always wear zip onto to you. But here's a question is always have those itchy hairs on your shoulder all day. Then if you don't change the shirt afterwards itchy hairs on your shoulder. That's a reflection of you having really long hair and poor preparation from your barber or your barber. Not grooming. You properly. Yeah. I feel like if they put the little the napkin down, and they they tighten up that thing around your neck tight enough. And they they brush it off afterwards. You shouldn't really have too much problem. One thing I'm not afraid to do go to the barber. Take off my sweatshirt where undershirt give him a haircut and undershirt on because I don't care about post up over my head. I don't have curly hair doesn't change. If I put us up ahead. But I I get naked as possible before the barber haircut. Have it all over my clothes, the I'm just trying to get a cut for an event, which I get it before I go and or four TV like, no and door for countdown or get up. Okay. That's. You don't get your haircut for this show. We saw you last week with the half backward. We saw last night with the go-to creeping out towards your ear afro. The mustache connected to your nose. I love that. Jalen. Thanks so much feel so good to have you back in the studio. We'll be back. Tomorrow wise cares. My little guys. I love speaking at Harvard. Diane. From our whisking to our music in New Orleans, every note matters. That's why every Sipa southern comfort dances to the same vibe is our birthplace. They can be strong and smooth all the ones, and no matter what it's always offending. Go ahead. Take a big ship southern comfort the spirit of New Orleans. Discover more at southern comfort dot com.
Jalen and Jacoby