18 Episode results for "Frederick Banting"

The Keto Diet [S2E11]

Your Doctor�s Orders

25:37 min | 2 years ago

The Keto Diet [S2E11]

"If you're like one fourth of adult Americans you been a how low carb Diet Mike. The Kito Diet the low carb diet story started with a successful self published book called letter on corpulence addressed to the public written way back and eat teen sixty three by a coffee maker. And undertaker named William Banting banting at five foot five inches but weighing in at over two hundred and pounds struggle to manage his weight for his sixty five years of life. Like many of today's Cereal. Dieters panting dried fasting exercise and even trips to the fat farms at times but without much luck but then banting caught wind of a new low carb diet used by some doctors as a treatment for diabetes. Banting didn't have diabetes but he thought he might try it out for himself writing quote the items from which I was advised to abstain as much as possible. Were bread butter milk sugar beer and potatoes which had been the main and I thought innocent elements of my existence and it turned out. This coffin maker had stumbled across his first successful weight loss program. He lost a pound a week for a year and maintain that weight loss until he died. Fifteen years later his program consisted of four meals a day with meat greens fruits and dry online. Mainly it's what he avoided. That made the difference. No sugar no sweet. No potatoes no oats no beer and no butter. After a year of excellent weight loss results. He did what so many self styled influencers do to this day he sell published a book about his new found dietary success to his surprise his self published book was so popular that it was picked up by a standard publisher every self published. Authors dream. Today you can still buy banting spoke and yes all have Lincoln the show notes. It is from bandings. Diet that came many others. It's children and grandchildren of diets. That is our the stillman diet the Atkins Diet the Paleo Diet. The whole thirty diet the carnival diet and the current rage the Kito Diet though each have their own twist all of these diets preached the same concept decrease the amount of carbohydrates sugars and starches. You put into your body heat. Copious amounts of meat using fat as fuel. And you can't help lose weight best of all. You won't be hungry. At least that is what the purveyors of the low carb diets will tell you today. Our conversation is about low carb diets with a focus on the Keto Diet and cutaway learn like most food beds has a fun combination of fact. Food Cons My name is Dr Terry Simpson. And this is culinary medicine where we sort out the crazy from credible about food from its source to its effect on your body. Lusting myths and showing evidence for food can be medicine. The challenge with folks who say things like Euro eating all the salt you want or you should be eating. Only ten percent of your calories from fat. You should be on a complete vegan diet. You should be eating higher. Carbohydrates as a result of that lower fat or the opposite of that which is old style at in Kita genetic because it's all the same atkins you know. South Beach was son of that and keen agenda. Casanova South beach you know. They're all the same diet basically with a little bit different. Maybe a little different twist. But you know this concept of either very low carb diet or very high carb diet you know. It's just quackery. That is a friend of culinary medicine. Doctor Timothy Harlan physician at Tulane University and a chef. He's also a manager of the Culinary Medicine Project. It's through his efforts that culinary medicine is taught in medical schools throughout the country in his view and in the view of many low. Carb diets are not sustainable. Not that you can't lose weight you probably will at least initially. Well Look John. I works for a lot of people if we talk about the low hanging fruit and Genyk Diet. I think that when somebody's trying to you know use this diet to lose weight. One of the easiest things that happens is by cutting out all the hydrates. Most junk food is based on carbohydrates. So when you eliminate all carbohydrates you basically eliminate a lot of junk food you know if you. Stop Drinking Regular Soda. And that's you know five hundred calories or whatever per day of Soda You. The appetite doesn't seem to want to reclaim was five hundred calories somewhere else. So it's SORTA automatically puts you into this energy deficit which allows for weight loss that happening in an ad. Libbed them. Or You know. Just not counting calories when has automatically I think that sort of leads to sustainability in that aspect that would be one of the positive aspects of the Ketogenic Diet one of the negative aspects of it is just adherents not very high in literature and I believe that's due to it's a pretty restrictive diet. It takes away a lot of foods that people have grown up eating some more nuanced. Things is if you're eating a high fat diet which some Ketogenic diets are you could be eating too many omega six fatty acids which in the long run might not do too well. I mean it's arguable. I don't know what's worse than Diet high in sugar or a diet high in making six seventy s Ideally you would be lower in both I guess the take home of this nuance would be requires a certain degree of nutritional awareness. That is bill GEICO's his best selling book. The poor misunderstood calorie is one of the better and well reference books about the biochemistry behind how your body treats different types of calories in different ways. Here's what we know about low. Carb diets information gathered from multiple studies. People do lose weight on low carb diets. It's a legitimate way to lose weight restricting calories from carbohydrates much like banding did to between five and thirty percent of your daily caloric intake will cause noticeable weight loss in most but not all people this restriction isn't limited to highly refined carbohydrates like white sugar and white flour but also to carbohydrates that naturally occur in healthy foods such as whole grains fruits and even legumes. What's wrong with fruits or whole grains you might ask as it turns out. There is nothing wrong with fruits or whole grains studies have very very clear that both fruits and whole grains are part of a healthy diet. A healthy way of living but for most low carb diets does food groups are for Bolton. How do people live longer on Kito Diet? Well that might be an issue. In a recent study of over fifteen thousand people that was recently published in the Lancet. Those who ate a moderate amount of carbs meaning fifty to fifty five percent of their daily intake lived an average of four years longer than those on a low carb diet. That is those who ate less than thirty percent of their total calories and carbs. What about the in between amount like forty percent? They gained an extra two years but still more moderate carbohydrates coral in with two more years of life than that just how low carb diets work anyway. The adherence to the Kito and other low carb diets claim. Insulin is the key to this diet on this diet. New WANNA have low levels of insulin. Insulin is a storage hormone too. Much blood sugar and insulin stores. That is not that great if you have too much dietary fat. Insulin will also store. That has fat that perfect combination of sugar and fat we call it the Donut or household. Bester salone managed to gain forty pounds on this diet. You can eat foods like meat fish. Fats and the body will start to burn fat for fuel. Insulin not only stores dietary fat but it also turns off fat burning Keita. By the way refers to Tetons ketones are a byproduct burn fat. If you lose weight on any diet you will be burning fat. Which in turn produces key tones patient came into my office recently. He had gained some weight so I asked him about his eating habits. He said he ruined his diet by having a slice of bread with his meal a meal that consisted of one. Porterhouse Steak fifteen hundred calories one wedge salad with Blue Cheese and bacon five hundred calories lobster. Bisque two hundred sixty calories and the ninety calories from that slice of bread. That's two thousand three hundred fifty calories but it was the bread. My patient contented that put his body out of Ketosis. I'm skeptical as you should be because math but there's much more going on here eating. That bread added a new taste to his mouth when he hadn't had for a while. Do that and you will eat more steak. Which has more calories no matter? What a low carb aficionado will tell you calories matter. Another example of bringing in a new taste is this. Did you ever remember Farrell's ice cream parlor and they had something called the zoo? The idea was if you could eat those ten plus scoops of ice cream. You didn't have to pay for it. How do you eat that? Well you really can't. Too many sweets your palate gets fatigue from them. But if you eat a saltine cracker between the scoops a new taste in your mouth and you can easily eat more. Let's bring that back to low carb diets a new taste. It changes your mind about the food. You're currently eating. How does that relate? Well if a stake only diet starts to be boring to your taste buds. It's actually boring to your brain. You eat less. How many of you who are on the low CARB. Diet said Ho no stake again but added bitter sweet. And you're now stimulator taste buds and again brain will reward you with a bit of dopamine and you will eat more at that very moment also bet ninety calorie side. A bread did speak as insulin. A bit in turn. That insulin caused the body to store more of those calories. Fat Not just to calories from bread mind but even from the calories in the meat and the fat and the steak you know that meat and Fat Makita pushers would have you believe would not cause weight gain but when you ingest food with high caloric density like fat in the presence of Insulin. Your body will store those fat calories. There are fringe elements of the low carb movement and not surprising. There is a large amount of salesmanship on the side of this diet. There's a lot of money to be made selling you low carb products from their own branded cauliflower pizza crust to coffee bean specially selected for you to put butter in. That's a good way to ruin a cup of coffee. I prefer cream and when it comes to coffee I like major dickerson's from Pete's they don't sponsor me I sponsor them what gives major dickerson's blended distinctive flavor the finest beans carefully selected from the world's premier growing regions hand roasted and artfully blended for an impeccably balanced exceedingly smooth cup rich complex the blend that transcends the sum of its parts of course if you go all in on the Keto Diet you can buy an expensive breath analyzers to confirm that you are in perfect Kito Service or you could ask your significant other if your breath smells bad if that sounds gross to you you can use the not inexpensive urine strips to test for keystones nothing like peeing daily on a strip first thing in the morning just to keep you on your diet right. I'm really amazed people pay for these things. But the guy doesn't just stop with bodily fluids some Kito believers will tell you that the Diet is good for the brain this date but likely comes from the use of the Diet in the nineteen twenties where decreased epileptic seizures among certain children's types of epilepsy. But that's been almost one hundred years and we have much better drugs for seizure control then a low carb drive. It is rare that a neurologist would recommend a low carb diet as therapy even fringe ier advocates. We'll try and convince you that this Diet will cure brain cancer. It doesn't or that the Kito Diet will prevent dementia. It doesn't or that. It's a potential treatment for all cancers because cancer cells only consume sugar and not key tones. Bat is also not true and cancer cells. Grow quite well in Beta Hydroxy. Butte Eric Acid and acetones or commonly known tetons. Here's a fun fact. Cancer cells will actually outgrow normal human cells and a key todic environment. Yes cancer cells. Eat both sugar and key. Tones even better than normal cells. Cancer Sucks if you were paying attention in the nineteen nineties you might have read about the Paleo Diet is another low carbohydrate type of diet one that tries to twist you into believing that quote this is the way humans were meant to eat on quote. Yes heat like those caveman who died at age. Thirty five statement like this are logical fallacy called the Bio Truth Bio truth is something that's presented as an inescapable truth of biology or evolution and almost every diet uses the bio truth logical fallacy when describing their diet as the one way that human beings were meant to eat radical vegans. We'll show you drawings of teeth in the digestive system as evidence of their bio truth claims finding that Paleo types using the same drawings but science has proven the assumption of both Paleo Diet vans and radical. Vegans were wrong. Paleo leaders contend that humans didn't eat grains or legumes before ten thousand years ago and therefore we have not evolved. Eat this way. Or so. They say in fact Paleo Diet claim we were meant to eat mostly meat hence the Carnivore Diet but when you toss out their drawings and look at the actual data from teeth found in archaeological digs and Africa. You will see that our ancestors were eating plenty of starches legumes and a lot of notably non meat foodstuff well over a hundred and fifty thousand years ago. Things that Paleo Diet people say we should not eat because our ancestors did need well it turns out. Those foods have actually been in our diet. Longer than Paleo people imagine in reality. Humans can eat a wide variety of foods at times in our evolutionary past. Some foods repent awful while other foods. Were scarce natural selection enabled early humans to survive on changes because we had a backup plan our teeth at us a turns out can cut through flesh just as well as they can grind nuts beans implants sustain us the logical fallacy. Paleo people fall prey to the incorrect assumption. That people are meant to eat. This way is the same logical fallacy radical vegans use. The fact is humans evolved to eat almost anything in almost any environment. We are adaptable. People in ancient Peru. Eight mostly vegetarian diets. My eskimo cousins eight mostly fat and meets various Walrus and Caribou if you ever. WanNa a fight on the Internet. It's between vegans and Paleo types both touting their bio truth logical fallacies I need to take a moment dimension that for some individuals a high fat or high protein diet is contra indicated. Meaning please beware. You know the warning. I give at the end of the episode about talking to Dr Before venturing on a diet. Well if you have liver Disease Kidney. Disease SOME FORMS OF DIABETES. Or if you had your gallbladder moot low carb is not a diet plan for you and watch out proclaims at your blood tests will get better low carb diets like Makita. Diet changes such as these are not necessarily predictive of disease or disease free states in the long term. Almost any diet from low carb. Too High Tar will show improvements in all sorts of blood test like lipids cholesterol and other markers in bloods. Has You lose weight much. Like episode about are made up beer and sausage diet showed any weight loss is likely to show improvement in. Your blood. Markers of heart. Disease using weight is good for you. Keeping that weight off is even better. We don't have many long term studies beyond five years that affirm the long term value of low carb diets. The only diet that has good long-term died as a Mediterranean Diet. And as you know from our season one episode of the same name. The Mediterranean diet is not low. Carb but I do applaud those who wish to take better control of your health to start a low carb diet and find successive. Oh and back to William. Banting are coffin maker. The Guy who started the low carb Diet Revolution based on the doctors of his day. Who are trying this. Diet as a tool against diabetes William banting died before a cousin of his was born in Canada that distant cousin Frederick banting would in nineteen twenty. Be One of the first people to isolate insulin. In one thousand nine hundred eighty two. He would begin to treat patients with insulin for diabetics. This was a miracle and while low carb diets may have kept some diabetics alive. A few months longer than expected her. Insulin allowed them to live a normal lifespan. Frederick banting would go on to win the Nobel Prize in Nineteen Twenty. Three and he is still the youngest to have won that award. The coincidence coincidence at Frederick would win the prize for disease whose only treatment at the time was diet a diet his distant cousin head down some success with losing weight insulin. That is the true wonder of science based medicine All diets for weight loss work but the real concern in the recent study showing a decrease in the lifespan for those who adhere to a lower carbohydrate diet. Well that's worrisome. The second concern. Can you sustain the Diet like most diets for weight loss? Most can't sustain and sadly many who have been on this diet are left with with the impression that calorie dense food like mutes or fats are diet food? They aren't not diet. They are calorie rich and nutrient dense foods. The good part of this diet is and every nutritionist. And every person trained and culinary medicine in every low-carbon theseus will agree that people should decrease junk food especially highly refined carbohydrates like chips and sodas cookies and most sweets but there is a reason that the low carb diets aren't among the top choices of nutritionists. Or most nutritionist. Today even if you look at the most recommended Diet Lewis like the one put out by. Us News and World Report. You'll see that low carb diets fault. The bottomless that's because the vast majority of nutritionists doctors and studies show that optimal health is tied to a diet. Rich in what is sometimes called complex. Carbohydrates who'd like fruits root vegetables like carrots legumes like beans and lentils those foods are not encouraged by many low carb diets and the majority of nutritionist except the centric or as they call themselves plant. Strong ones know that fish. Poultry and meats are important items. A healthy diet. Fish is an abundant source omega. Three fatty acids which decreased risk of heart disease and strokes meets a great source of nutrients including vitamins. So how'd you lose weight and keep it off me answers changing your lifestyle to one that you can sustain and it often involves eating a diet rich in fruits vegetables legumes? That may be one of the reasons that most nutritionist score low-carbon Keto diets at the bottom of the pack on a scale of one to five. Where one is all on and five is perfect science. Low carb diets are mostly three special thanks to Timothy Harlan and bill doc host. Berlinde their comments to today shows head. Of course thanks to you for listening to this episode of Culinary Medicine with Dr Terry Simpson. Can we go while Emma doctor? I am not your and you should always seek the advice of a trusted licensed medical provider experience in your particular conditioner concerned before taking any action especially before taking on a diet because some diets may not be good for your condition. Culinary medicine is a part of the your doctor's orders networks and is produced and distributed by our friends at simpler media by producer. Is the talented and now meeting. Producer girl from producer girl productions. You can follow me on twitter. Where I'm at Dr Terry Simpson. That's Dr Terry Simpson. And I'll be back next time. We'll have another conversation about food is medicine or unveil another food com till then. Don't drink the water. Drink the one he evil even banning drink wine so it can't be all bad cheers.

Diet Lewis banting Culinary Medicine diabetes Cancer Dr Terry Simpson William Banting banting Timothy Harlan Frederick banting Culinary Medicine Project producer corpulence publisher Tulane University brain cancer Kita Ketosis
The Discovery of Insulin (Part 2)

Stuff You Missed in History Class

43:04 min | 1 year ago

The Discovery of Insulin (Part 2)

"This episode is brought to you by Milano. Cookies look sometimes that long Zen Yoga classes just not in the cards, so maybe a cookie is pepperidge farm. Milano believes you should make some time for yourself. Once in a while I know I have a particular space in my sewing room that I like to just take a few minutes every day I. Sit there. I think about things. It's kind of like meditation and Munching at the same time you can get that. Yemi beautiful cookie flavor makes it luxurious and delightful, and I always feel recharged Milano. Are truly a treat. Worthy of your meantime they are delicate and Krispy with luxuriously rich chocolate in the middle. You really want to keep these just for you, so remember to save something for yourself with pepperidge farm, Milano. It's women's history month, and there's no better way to celebrate than by hearing from amazing women who are making history in changing the world for the better. Learn from leaders like Tory, Burch, Madeleine, Albright Arianna Huffington Katy Kirk, Valerie Jarrett and more listened to Seneca women. Conversations on power and purpose on the iheartradio. APP or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome to stuff. You missed in history class. A production of iheartradio. Hello and welcome to the podcast I'm Tracy. We'll send. I'm currently frying. You're just tuning in today. This is a two parter is on the development of. And last time we talked about how diabetes has been described through history, including how people were being treated with starvation diets in the years, just before the development of insulin and today we are going to tell the insulin part of the story which does build on research that we talked about last time around. We easiest to understand if you've heard part one as was the case last time we're going to be talking about how experiments on animals lead to this discovery as well as how the byproducts of animals that were slaughtered for food. We're used to make insulin. It is not clear who coined the term insulin. It comes from the Latin word, insulin or island as a nod to the islets of Langherhans, as we talked about in part one, the islets of Langer hands are cells in the pancreas that produce insulin and other hormones. John Desire of Belgium used the word insulin with an e. on the end in one, thousand, nine, hundred nine. Apparently independently of that Ernest Henry starling who coined the word hormone also use the word insulin with an e for years later. In the early nineteen, Sir Edward Albert Sharpie. Shaefer also described a hypothetical substance secreted by the islets of Langer, Huns, which controlled the body's glucose levels, and he called Bat Insulin. This time there was not on the end. None of these people are the ones credited with the discovery of insulin, though that story starts with Frederick Grant Banting banting was born on a farm in Ontario Canada and initially he plans to go to divinity school, but after enrolling at the University of Toronto, he's changed his major to medicine when World War One started, he joined the Canadian Army Medical Corps and was placed on an accelerated medical study program during the war, he was wounded in action and awarded the military, Cross in. In nineteen nineteen after the war was over, banting completed a surgical residency and tried to set up a private surgical practice. It did not grow quickly enough for him to make ends meet, so he also took a part time teaching position at the University of Western Ontario now known as Western, university the classes that he was teaching included physiology something that he had studied as part of his own medical education, but also something that he really needed to brush up on in order to teach on October thirty first of nineteen. Twenty banting was brushing up on the pancreas he read. A paper called the relation of the islets of longer Hans to diabetes with special reference to cases of pancreatic lithiasis by Moses. This paper discussed the autopsy of someone who turned out to have a pancreatic stone that had totally blocked their main pancreatic duct. The person's pancreas still had islet cells, but the asking ourselves had atrophied Ms. Paper also noted earlier experiments, in which the main pancreatic ducts of various animals had been partially or totally located, which had caused similar results, and that is research that we talked about some of back in our previous episode, banting was inspired by this idea. He wrote a note in his journal, which read quote Diabetes Lie, Gate. Pancreatic ducts of dog keep. Keep dogs alive till asmi degenerate leaving islets try to isolate the internal secretion of these to relieve glico sharia so a few things to note at this point, one of the bandings note is about or Syria or sugar in urine, rather than blood sugar banding also was not really aware of all those experiments that we talked about in part one. He didn't really realize that researchers had spent more than two decades trying to do basically what he was describing without yielding something that was safe enough to use in human patients. It's also not clear how. That he thought he might quote. Try to isolate the internal secretion of the islets of Langer Huns, or whether he was thinking about preparing a pancreatic extract or thinking he might try to find the secretion itself later on when he told people from memory what he'd written down in his journal that night. He said it was like eight pancreatic duct of dogs. Wait six to eight weeks for degeneration. Remove the residue extract, and that is a lot more specific also part of. Basic idea here was a little bit off. His rationale for causing the cells to atrophy was that they produce digestive enzymes, and he thought those in might destroy whatever vital substance was being produced in the islets of Langer hands. But really. These enzymes are not active until they come into contact with. In the small intestine that relationships between those two different sets of enzymes had been discovered back in nineteen. Oh four, also, it's possible that there's some other explanation, but his misspellings of both diabetes and glucose. Suggest. That banding wasn't all that familiar with what he was writing about so at this point banding went to his boss at the University of Western Ontario about this idea. His boss referred him to John. James Rickard Macleod at the University of Toronto. Macleod was born in Scotland and had studied medicine at the University of Aberdeen. He also taught at several universities and institutes. Institutes in Europe and north. America before becoming professor of physiology at the University of Toronto and also director of its physiological laboratory. Macleod was a leading expert in carbohydrate metabolism at the time in nineteen thirteen, he had published diabetes. It's pathology and physiology. He had been trying to identify which part of the nervous system controlled delivers glycogen storage functions unlike banting McLeod knew all. All about those earlier attempts to make pancreatic extract that could treat diabetes and he's out. There was some kind of pancreatic secretion that could be the key to an effective treatment, but he had his doubts about its ever being isolated in used, and it wasn't just that McLeod had doubts about whether it was possible at all to make a usable pancreatic extract those earlier. Earlier researchers also had training in skills and experience that banting just didn't have McLeod's impression of banning was that he had a very basic textbook level understanding of the pancreas and its role in diabetes, and really this was pretty accurate, so mccloud was reluctant to offer banning the lab space, assistance materials and animals that he was going to need to research his idea. The two men had multiple meetings to talk through the situation, and then when Macleod finally agreed to let banting do some experiments over the summer. banting actually got a little nervous about it. Bam things still thought of his idea might lead to a breakthrough, but he also understood that if he left his practice and his job to pursue an idea that didn't work out. He would basically have to start his career over while also trying to pay off debts from failed project on March eighth. Nineteen, twenty one banting and Macleod finally agreed on the terms of the project. The work would take place over the summer of Nineteen, twenty, one starting in mid May, two students Charles Best and Edward Clark, noble would assist banting. They would divide the summer between the two of them. These two young men flipped a coin to see who would take the. The first shift with banting with best planning to take the first half of the project and noble planning to take the second half best at that point had finished his bachelor's degree in physiology and biochemistry, and was preparing to start medical school for about a month, banting best in McLeod, all worked together in the lab with Macleod, tuning, their plan and process and surgical techniques, and instructing them on how to best prepare an extract, then in mid June, he left for a vacation in Scotland that he had previously arranged. We will talk about how banting and best's work proceeded over the summer, which will have more about their animal experiments after quick sponsor break. When Frederick Banting and Charles Best started their experiments on dogs to try to find a treatment for diabetes. Things did not go well. Their plan was to La- gate the pancreatic ducts of some of the dogs, which would cause the acid ourselves to atrophy, but theoretically at least leave. The islets of are mostly unaffected by that point, banting would have learned that the digestive enzymes were inactive while they were actually in the pancreas, but this atrophy of the ask cells would at least in theory reduce the amount of material that needed to be removed from the extract before it could be safely used once enough time had passed after this leg ation procedure to allow the acid or cells to atrophy they would use an is the dog and remove its pancreas using it to prepare an extract then they'd inject that extract into. into another dog whose pancreas had been removed entirely, however, these surgical procedures could be difficult. It was also summer, so the facilities they were working were hot and uncomfortable, several of the dogs that they were working with died of infections or other complications, and they started buying stray dogs as replacements. It was mid July before they had a deep pancreatitis D- Dog and one with an atrophied pancreas ready to work at the same time, the process of preparing pancreatic extract was also long and complex. It included chopping the pancreas, chilling it, grinding it up, filtering it, and warming it back up to body temperature on July thirtieth nineteen twenty one. They tried injecting their extract for the first time. Although. The sugar levels in dog's urine did drop. They rose again pretty quickly. The dog died the next day most likely from an infection, banting and best kept trying though when Edward Noble came back to the lab to take over his shift is assistant. He found that the two of them had worked out this whole rhythm and flow to their work at that point nobody. Nobody thought that if he tried to take best place, as was previously planned, he would just become a hindrance to the project. He would have to learn everything that best was doing pretty routinely at that point, so he left best to it although he did come back to the project later on which we will get to in August banting and best ran out of So they switched to using the whole pancreas something that as it turned out work just as well they kept refining their work and taking notes, and when Macleod return to the lab on September twenty first they have results. This seemed promising. They were still seeing some complications, but they're extract did seem to be lowering the glucose levels of de pancreatitis dogs McLeod as we said earlier. Earlier was very skeptical about this whole project from the very beginning, and he was surprised enough at these results that he questioned whether they were accurate. Balancing was highly insulted by the suggestion, and the two men butted heads over it ultimately Macleod told them to repeat their experiment apart from taking offence being questioned about the accuracy of his work, banting was also worried about his. His finances he had planned to take the summer to do this research, but he had not planned for it to continue into the next academic year. He also thought the facilities where he'd spent the summer. Working left a lot to be desired for example. He said that they couldn't scrub the floors thoroughly because if they did water leak through the ceiling of the room below. Below he thought that was to blame for some of the infections and the deaths of their research animals, so banting, ask for a salary, and won for best as well as repairs to the floor of the lab and an assistant to take care of the animals banding also asked for a biochemist to be added to the team to help them better refine their pancreatic extract. Macleod didn't think they were ready for that last step yet, but he did give banting and best retroactive salaries. He also hired somebody to take care of the dogs and arrange to have the laboratory floor waterproofing with tar, which was like the least expensive way to deal with this water seepage problem eventually, banting and best tried another source for their pancreas tissue after learning that fetal and newborn calves had proportionally more islet cells than older animals do. They started buying fetal pancreas from? From slaughterhouses, they still had trouble getting enough pancreas for their work. Though so they ultimately started using the whole pancreas of adult animals also purchased from slaughterhouses in November of nineteen, twenty, one banting and best published a paper, the internal secretion of the pancreas balancing also presented the paper publicly that December in new haven, Connecticut this presentation once again caused tension between banting and Macleod banting was just not a very good public speaker and some of the people who were in the audience. Audience on that day were literally at the top of their field. He just didn't have the breadth of knowledge to answer some of the very probing questions that they asked him. When banting had trouble fielding questions, Macleod stepped in, he did have that breadth of knowledge, and he was also polished and well-spoken in his presentation, he also used the word. We allot something that wasn't necessarily unusual. Considering that the work was happening at his lab, ultimately under his supervision, but banting felt like. Like mccloud was taking credit for work that he had not actually done in the audience that day was the research director for Eli Lilly Pharmaceuticals who asked if the company could be involved in this project and McLeod's opinion once again, they were not there yet by the end of nineteen twenty one though Macleod thought the project was promising enough that he finally did bring on a biochemist. James Bertram Khalip who took a sabbatical from the University of Alberta Edmonton to work on it. McLeod also dedicated the whole lab to the project, thinking that they were on the verge of a lifesaving breakthrough, the extraction method that up developed was a lot more effective, but also still very involved. I initially I'd like all of the steps written into this outline and it went on for paragraphs. Realize that different pancreatic materials could be extracted at different strengths of alcohol, and so he developed this method that included multiple extraction steps with the results of those extractions, being concentrated centrifuge precipitated, went on the also discovered that the extracts lowered blood sugar of rabbits, so they no longer needed to work with D. Pancreatitis Dogs Edward. Clark Noble rejoined, joined the project at this point to help with the study on rabbits, running parallel to this work at the University of Toronto were developments in blood sugar testing, which made it easier to test their extracts effects on blood sugar directly rather than relying on how it affected glucose levels in the urine. More efficient and effective blood sugar testing was a huge part of the ongoing development of insulin. In late, December of nineteen twenty one. banting tried one of their extracts on a human subject Dr Joseph, Gilchrist had been one of bandings classmates and had developed diabetes not long after they graduated from medical school. Those extract did not work at all, though and it wasn't because extract, itself was bad, even if they had made completely pure insulin, if taken orally, that would have been digested in the stomach way before it could have been absorbed into the bloodstream in January of Nineteen, twenty two team was ready for their first attempt at injecting their extract in human patients. The patient was. Was Leonard Thompson, who is fourteen years old and critically ill, he weighed only sixty five pounds. That's about thirty kilograms when he was admitted to Toronto General Hospital, he had been on a starvation diet like we talked about in part one, which had taken him down to about four hundred fifty calories per day. His daily urine output was about four leaders. That's a gallon. A. Typical amount is more like eight hundred to two thousand milliliters, and he was also showing signs of Diabetic Kito acidosis, which is when the body starts burning fat instead of sugar for fuel, and as a result acid start to build up in the bloodstream, so this whole time balancing had felt like McLeod had been stealing credit for his work second, guessing him and undermining him every step of the way. Added to all of that balancing could not really control this first human trial at all. He did not have the background or the experience that was needed to run trial on human subjects. He also did not have the authority to work with patients at Toronto General Hospital so when it came to their first human trial, dancing really insisted that they use an extract that he and best had prepared. They did this on January eleventh of nineteen twenty two. This preparation did lower Leonard's blood sugar somewhat, but it did not alleviate any of his outward symptoms of diabetes. Diabetes. The boy also developed an abscess at one of the injections sites. Call up who was still refining as methods for extraction really went into overdrive at this point finally producing an extract he thought was pure enough to use several days later they tried again with this extract on January twenty third of one, thousand, nine, hundred, ninety, two, and this time the results were immediately and dramatically affected Leonard's blood sugar dropped significantly, as did the glucose in his urine, and he also was just visibly improved. It was obvious to other people that he was doing better. In the words of Charles bests notes quote daily injections of the extract from January twenty third to February fourth, accepting January, twenty fifth and February fourth. This resulted in an immediate improvement. The excretion of sugar became much less. The Acetone bodies disappeared from the urine. The boy became brighter, more active looked better and said he felt stronger. Leonard, whose condition had been critical when he was admitted, lived another ten years after the success, though the ongoing backbiting and tested in the lab became even more dramatic, and we will get to that after another sponsor break. In one, thousand, nine, hundred, seventy, eight, after decades of scientific exploration, the US Army are in de la perfected the retort pouch, little bags that allow Civilians Gert and portable tuna, and revolutionized field rations for those in the armed forces, retorts are light and waterproof the pouches, Flash Cook more kinds of food, or so, when hungry for cheese, Tortellini or chocolate cake troops today just to rip open meals ready to eat retort pouch, of course that means nothing to the millions of Americans who served before them. Food is really lousy at. Bars we call poop part. K. Mart where they felt that rations had not up to par. Rashes. They were so good with my added. Throw them writer, Jacqueline Roseau, and we just wrapped our deep dive into world. War Two combat and cuisine on service that are in stories of hunger, and war subscribed to binge the season on the iheartradio APP, apple podcasts, and wherever you find tastiest history podcasts and learn more at service. PODCAST DOT Org. Leonard Thompson was getting his first injections of a working pancreatic extract. The already contentious relationships among the team from the University of Toronto got even worse James Khalip, who had not shared the details of his extraction method with anyone else threatened to quit the project and patent it himself. The details here are a little bit sketchy, but banting was outraged and he and call up, had a physical altercation in the lab with Banting, grabbing call by the color of his coat, and slamming him into a chair and best rating that he had to restrain banding with all of his force. After this on January, Twenty Fifth Nineteen twenty two, banting best and call up all signed the memo that none of them. Them would be seeking a patent for insulin. This was part of a manufacturing agreement with connaught laboratories, which is public pharmaceutical company that had been established in Canada during World War One to make Diptheria antitoxin after that first successful treatment, of Leonard, Thompson six more patients were treated in February of Nineteen, twenty, two from there, they moved quickly into a clinical trial, and at that point, the project largely moved out of banting and best's hands as we said earlier banding just did not have the training or experience to run a clinical trial on human subjects, and he was deeply frustrated by his exclusion, and he tried to cope unfortunately by drinking to excess on March Twenty second of Nineteen, twenty two. was published in the Canadian Medical Association. Journal called pancreatic extracts in the treatment of Diabetes Mellitus. Its authors were FDA banting. Best Jay Callup wr Campbell, a Fletcher, Jj, our cloud E. C noble the two names from that long list of authors that we haven't mentioned specifically before this point are Campbell and Fletcher and those were the doctors who administered the actual injections to the diabetes patients on May Third Nineteen twenty, two McLeod presented a paper called the effects produced on diabetes by extracts of Pancreas. It described that extract as insulin once again from the Latin root for islands, and apparently not related to the earlier uses the same term from the same source both banting and best refused to go to this presentation between roughly these. These stupid between March and May, the clinical trials of insulin had run into a huge stumbling block. When cannot laboratories tried to replicate callups? Extraction methods just didn't work. Multiple sources describe this as call up losing the Knack for making insulin or as problems with translating callups, small-scale batches from the laboratory large scale production they finally did resolve the issues and started production in mid-may of nineteen, twenty, two for bandings part, he believed that column had wanted to keep his methods secret for his own benefit, and that consequently he had not kept good enough records and that that's why they were having so much trouble. One patient died during this shortage and banting and call up had another massive altercation as word started to spread about insulin families started trying to get their children included in the clinical trials. The most famous of these patients was Elizabeth huge. He was daughter of former New York governor Charles Hughes her father Charles later became secretary of state in Nineteen, twenty, one and chief justice of the US Supreme Court Elizabeth had been. been born in nineteen seven, and had developed diabetes in nineteen, Nineteen Elizabeth had been one of Dr Frederick Allen's patients, and had been on a starvation diet before starting insulin therapy Allen saw her at a conference leader in one, thousand, nine, hundred, eighty two, and she was so improved that he literally did not recognize her. She later wrote quote Doctor Allen, said, with his mouth wide open. Oh and that's all he did. After starting insulin therapy Elizabeth lived until the age of seventy three soon there was so much demand for insulin that cannot labs could not produce enough on their own, and that is when Eli Lilly and company was brought on to increase the output. This lead so yet another challenge, which was trying to standardize this treatment across two different drugmakers who were operating in two different countries. It wasn't yet possible to measure the strength of insulin itself. You had to administer a sample of it to rabbits, and then measure the rabbit's blood glucose levels to figure it out. One issue in this whole process turned out to be because the to drug makers were using different sized rabbits with one of them, using rabbits that had been fasted. Fasted and the other using rabbits that had been fed, normally he seemed like such small, but important details very very important detail this standardization process alternately led to the first definition of a unit of insulin, which was the amount that it took to lower the blood sugar of rabbit, weighing two kilograms from zero point one one eight percent, two zero point zero, four five percent with that drop happening over five hours, and the Rabbit having been fasted for twenty four hours. Insulin is still measured in units today, but we can also measure insulin itself now so today one unit is equivalent to thirty four point seven micrograms of crystalline insulin. Throughout the nineteen twenties, connaught laboratories ally Lily and numerous doctors, clinicians, researchers and others were working on standardizing insulin with one of the major contributors being Sir Henry Dale Sometimes, he is described as being the person who did it, but there were a lot of people and entities involved another big project, including most of these same basic entities was refining the extraction process and improving the yield of that process. Over, a few years, drug manufacturers went from being able to extract fifteen units of insulin from kilogram pancreas to extracting almost four hundred units per kilogram. In late, nineteen, twenty, two George Walden at ally. Lily developed a method for oh electric precipitation of insulin, but the relationships among banting best McLeod and call up. We're not nearly as productive in September of nineteen twenty two hoping. Hoping to create a definitive account of the discovery of insulin and put all of the arguing rest, Colonel Albert Gooderham asked Banting Best Macleod to each right up their account of what happened by that point cop had returned to the University of Alberta at Edmonton but Macleod wrote him, and ask for his thoughts on this whole process did not really resolve anything though banting characterized. Characterized McLeod is constantly undermining in criticizing him and taking credit for his work, and he ended his right up with an appendix of six additional instances that he said showed quote, a lack of trust and cooperation. On McLeod's part, McLeod characterized his caution as very reasonable, giving balancings inexperience, and he pointed out that he had frequently taken a lot of care to give credit banting. Banting and best whenever that credit was due bests account was relatively brief and fairly neutral between the two of them, although banting and Macleod had all agreed not to personally apply for patents on insulin as part of their agreement with connaught laboratories, patents were needed to ensure quality and safety. This was a brand new drug that could be life threatening if made incorrectly not. Not, just because of all the side effects that we talked about earlier from poorly made extracts, but because of formulation that was too weak or too strong could be life threatening for patients. At the same time, the goal was to make insulin widely available as quickly as possible, and for it to be affordable. An Insulin Committee had been established in early nineteen, twenty two to. To help coordinate patenting and licensing issues. Numerous patents were issued on insulin and the process for making it in the early nineteen twenty s by nineteen twenty. Six Insulin was patented in twenty six different countries than it had become the standard of care and managing type one diabetes, especially around the world, the relationship among those men who had created it was never smooth though. Though in many ways, banting became the face of the discovery on August. Twenty, seventh, nineteen, twenty-three. He was on the cover of Time magazine. He received numerous awards and honors, and he met King George The V. The banting and best chair of medical research was established at the University of Toronto and Banting was the first person appointed to it. However, none of that seems to. To Outweigh banting feelings about another award, which was the nineteen twenty-three Nobel prize in physiology or Madison, which was awarded to both him, and McLeod, banning was so outraged at McLeod's inclusion and getting the Nobel prize that he threatens to decline the award until somebody pointed out to him how unfortunate it would be for the very first Canadian Nobel laureate to refuse the honor. Banting ultimately decided to give best half of his prize, money and Macleod gave half of his prize money to call it. The team also faced criticism from a number of directions in the Early Nineteen Twenty S anti-vivisectionists objected to the research in general and to bandings admission that they had been buying stray dogs off the streets when they ran out of research animals, some of which may have actually been people's pets. Within the medical community there were people who criticized the whole project, because even though it had a good outcome, it had started with bandings, fundamentally incorrect ideas, and then there was Nicolay Policy Q. who we talked about briefly in part one. He claimed that banting and Macleod had stolen his work, and that they had only become known as the people to discover insulin because they had just made the first commercially viable extract policy had sent banting. banting his papers and nineteen, twenty one, and had asked him to keep correspondence with him, but banting had never answered him, banting and best had also mischaracterized some of policies earlier work in their own writing something that really seems to have been because of a mistranslation of a document that was in French, rather than a deliberate misstatement on their parts like trying to cover something up, and we should also note that there are still people. People who make the argument that policy should be credited as discoverer of insulin, while others point out that he also published multiple antisemitic documents, and that he helped found antisemitic parties that later formed the fascist organization known as the Iron Guard in Romania in a strange turn of events, the one collaborator balancing was actually on good terms with at the end of his life was James Khalip who he had shoved into a chair earlier in the. The story by the time dancing died in nineteen forty. He had fallen out with best to. He'd previously been close to that year. Being Nineteen, forty best was scheduled to travel to Europe to act as a medical liaison during World War Two. He canceled that trip and banting took his place reportedly telling a friend just before leaving quote if they ever give that share of mine to that expletive deleted best I'll rollover in my grave. Having made that statement bandings on this trip crashed after taking off from. Newfoundland on February twentieth of Nineteen Forty banting survived the actual crash, but died of his injuries before he could be rescued in terms of the other three of those first four contributors, Charles Best did succeed banting. Is the chair of the Band Best Department of Medical Research. He continued to do groundbreaking work on insulin, and he was part of the development of the drug Heparin. He died on March thirty, first, nineteen, seventy eight. John Macleod left the University of Toronto for the University of Aberdeen in Nineteen, twenty eight and he died in nineteen, thirty five at the age of fifty nine. James Call Up, ultimately became the dean of Medicine at the University of Western Ontario. He died on June. Nineteenth, nineteen, sixty five, there have been a lot of developments in the worlds of endocrinology diabetes insulin since the nineteen twenties that I preparation made in one, thousand, nine, hundred, ninety, two only lasted for about six hours, and people could have really dramatic spikes in blood. Blood sugar as it were off, it'd be really careful with it. So researchers started trying to develop versions of insulin that would be absorbed or gradually and predictably, and with last longer researchers also worked on isolating insulin itself, and figuring out its exact chemical structure John Jay able crystallized insulin in nineteen twenty six ten years later, insulin was combined with the hormone protein to. To make a version that was absorbed more slowly and consistently in one thousand, nine hundred nine version that combined protein zinc was introduced that could last for up to forty eight hours slow acting buffered. A insulin's were developed in the early nineteen fifties beyond a McLeod and best multiple other researchers have been awarded Nobel Prizes for work that was related to insulin in one. One thousand, nine, Fifty Five Frederick Sanger was awarded the Nobel. Prize in chemistry for his work in identifying amino acids that make up a molecule of insulin in nineteen, sixty four Dorothy Mary, Crawford Hodgkin was awarded the Nobel Prize in Chemistry for her determinations by X. Ray techniques of the structures of important biochemical substances, one of those important by chemical substances was insulin. Then in nineteen, seventy seven rosalind yellow was one of the recipients of the Nobel Prize in physiology or medicine quote for the development of Radio immunoassays of -pected hormones. This was tied to a discovery that people who got injections of hormones. Including Insulin could develop antibodies to that hormone. Those two decades saw a lot of other advances in addition to those Nobel. Prizes Urine Glucose Self Test Strips were introduced in the nineteen sixties in nineteen, sixty, three and nineteen, sixty five two different teams, each synthesized insulin for the first time, the first insulin pump was also developed in nineteen sixty three. Although at the time, it required a pump the size of a backpack. Amy's Diagnostics introduced the first blood glucose meter. In nineteen, sixty nine, the first fully synthetic insulin was introduced in nineteen, seventy five. It was made using recombinant DNA. By extracting insulin from pancreatic. Before this point, it took an estimated twenty steers or eighty hogs to get enough insulin for a patient for one year, and although most people are using synthetic insulin's now, animal sourced insulin is still made today, and there are still people who are using it to manage their diabetes. The ability to synthesize insulin made it possible for researchers to create insulin analogs in the nineteen eighties and nineties. These have slightly different amino acid chains from. From Human Insulin, so they lower blood sugar, the way that insulin does, but they also behave a little bit differently in the body. In most cases, they're made to be absorbed more quickly or more slowly than human insulin. Is this research into ways to improve? Insulin is ongoing including attempts to make insulin that can be administered orally and the United States. There have been a lot of headlines about how expensive insulin has become a big reason for that is that? That all these refinements and synthetic analogs and other developments, their patented, and so drugmakers can set their own price, and especially with these newer versions. There's just not a generic alternative available in general, the lower cost alternatives that are available dilip decades ago, so they haven't had all those tweaks and things like absorption rates that we just talked about using insulin to manage. Diabetes is a lifelong daily process and researchers are still trying to find a way to treat diabetes. Diabetes directly rather than using insulin to manage its effects. This could include pancreatic grafts or transplants or finding a way to prevent the body's immune system from damaging the pancreas in the first place, the introduction of insulin also made it possible for people with diabetes to live much longer. So research is ongoing into ways to treat and prevent the complications that can arise later in life, including retinopathy, neuropathy and foot problems, so that in two parts is insulin yeah. You did some listener Mayola part one. Do you have some more for Partout I? Do I do it is from Ian. Sends a note about Woolworth's lunch counters and Ian says hi ladies. Thank you for your episode on the lunch counter. Sit Ins, although it does feel funny to say, thank you for an episode which essentially involve people being nasty to each other for something? They did not choose like the color of their skin. If you WANNA, have lunch at a Woolworth's lunch counter. You can still do so if you visit Sydney Australia. The woolworth's at townhall station still has a lunch counter on the top floor of its store. It's not quite the same woolworth's. Though many years ago, I got a new work mate who had just moved from South Africa to Australia. He told me his wife had worked as a store manager for woolworths in South Africa, but that it wasn't the same store as the one we had an Australia, so I looked it up out of curiosity. The original worth was founded in eighteen seventy nine and UTICA NEW YORK. By Frank Winfield Woolworth. The store name was either woolworth without an S. on the end or with an Apostrophe S. on the end. It was originally a discount five and dime store, specializing in selling items, five ten cents and grew to become at one time, the largest department store chain in the world. The podcast useless information did a Christmas special last year. That talked about how it popularized Christmas. Tree decorations in the US. Sadly changing times and competition from new stores like Walmart, led to its decline in one, thousand, nine, hundred, seven, the original Woolworth's department stores were closed and the parent company focused on its footlocker brand. Instead Woolworth's did however set up several overseas subsidiaries in Mexico Germany Austria Cyprus Britain etc, the German Mexican subsidiaries still survive, but the British chain went out of business in two thousand nine. This was kind of sad as woolworths was a British. British institution my mom even worked in one when she was in high school. In England in the nineteen sixties, meanwhile back in one, thousand, nine, hundred, eighty, four Australian businessman want to set up their own Woolworth's style store. They had one or two ideas for the name, but they found the name. Woolworth's had not been registered in Australia, so they copied the name note. The spelling has an S. on the end, and no apostrophe will work. Started as a department store, but after World War Two, you started selling groceries and developed its own supermarket chain. Eventually, the department stores were rebranded as big W for big Woolworth's and continued today, competing with the discount department stores like target and Kmart woolworths in its arch-rival. Kohl's are too big supermarket chains in Australia and control something like eighty percent of the market. Continues on from there, but the part about the Australian worth was the part that I really wanted to read because I found that all very interesting. Thank you so much to Ian for writing in about that something that we didn't really mention in the episode or in any of the listener mail at this point is that a lot of the former woolworths buildings have been converted into something like the building is still standing with the original historic woolworth facade on there. And one that I have been see is now. The woolworth walk in Asheville North Carolina which is like an art in studio space. That also has a fifties style lunch counter in there, so if you'd like to write to us about this podcast, history podcast at iheartradio dot, com and then we're all over social media missed in history. That's where you'll find our facebook twitter, pinterest and Instagram, and you can subscribe to our show on Apple. PODCAST, the iheartradio APP and anywhere else in your podcast. 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banting Frederick Banting diabetes McLeod Frederick Grant Banting bantin University of Toronto James Rickard Macleod banting McLeod Macleod banting Woolworth Early Nineteen Twenty Insulin Committee James Bertram Khalip Nobel prize University of Western Ontario Leonard Thompson woolworths
Too Old, Out Of Touch? Too Young, Inexperienced? Ageism In America

On Point with Tom Ashbrook | Podcasts

46:38 min | 2 years ago

Too Old, Out Of Touch? Too Young, Inexperienced? Ageism In America

"From WB. You are Boston and NPR, I'm Meghna, choucroute birdie. And this is on point. We know the harm that all those 'isms can do sexism and racism, and our society is slowly in its own way bending towards Justice. But there's one is I'm we usually overlook, and maybe one that we're actually all a little guilty of ageism, whether you're growing old gracefully or fighting at every step of the way as a major cosmetics maker once put it truth is it's not the bad knees or the reading glasses or forgetting where the keys are that gets people down. It's living in a society that worships youth and squanders wisdom and experience. So what's the pushback to America's last acceptable prejudice this hour point ageism and fighting your prejudice against your future self? You can join us. Do you see are you guilty of it or you guilty of practising ageism? There's those jokes and put downs offering by the elderly themselves about old age. About middle age. What about ageism in the workplace? What are you seeing? And why is it still? Okay. Is it still okay? In America to be biased against the old. And by the way, folks, I wanna let you know that tomorrow in this hour, we'll going to be taking a look at insulin. It's so crucial to lives of millions of diabetics. And we're going to ask why it's become so expensive in what's happening. The lives of people who can't afford insulin. So a little later this hour to set up tomorrow, we're going to learn about the history of insulin. But that's much later this hour. So joining me now for the main part of our conversation is Ashton Applewhite author of the new book just out today. This chair rocks a manifesto against ageism. She's also author of the blog Joe is this ages. You can find an excerpt of her book and a link to her Ted, talk and blog at on point radio dot org. She's with us today from New York Ashton Applewhite. Welcome to on point. Thank you Magna. Great to be here. It's really great to have you. Okay. So first of all I'd I kind of had the urge to to. To whisper what my first question was going to be rude. But since you start off your book with it. I'm just going to ask you proudly not how old are you? Yes. I am a proud. Well, not proud sort of neutral Sixty-six-year-old, you know, it's embarrassing to be called out as older until we quit being a barest about it. And I move for that. So okay. So have you always been overdue who's a process? Oh, gosh. No, no, Arman, I started writing and thinking about all this about twelve thirteen years ago because I was afraid of getting old. And so what changed then? Well, I started a project about people over eighty who work and learning about longevity and was jocks just knocked over in about five minutes by how everything I thought I knew about what it would be like to be eighty or ninety years old was flat out wrong or way less nuanced than it should have been that might it's not that they're not things to worry about and be afraid of about getting old. It's that our fears are so so out of proportion to the reality. Okay. So we're going to talk in a minute about how things got that way. But but I I just wanna get your. As to why is it you think there is so much ageism in America. Now, I mean, part of me all has just kind of presumed that it's always been does that this has been a nation and a culture that from you know, from the beginning has been obsessed with with the cult of youth is that the case is that how you see it not since the beginning. I mean early early America was gerontocracy where believe it or not it rocked it to be old which when I encountered that idea to begin with. I was like, wow at that seemed impossible because people weren't even living that long to begin with there wasn't that much oldness. It's true. So part of it is that more people started living longer and in the really late nineteenth century early. Twentieth. Century age began age became important as a social marker until then a lot of people didn't even Mark their birthdays. Or even know how old they were. But it came to be viewed as a sort of social problem to be to be solved people began marking their birthdays schools began to be. Vied into age cohorts nursery, schools old age homes came into being and along came age segregation, and along with it came ageism, and of course, along with it came the idea that people at either ends of the age spectrum were less valuable in because of the industrial revolution because of jobs, and we became less aware of how people of all ages contribute. Even if they might not continue to be conventionally economically productive. They continue, of course, to contribute to society in all sorts of ways that became less visible endless valued in a hyper capitalist society. Yes. So this is getting the thing. I wanted to ask you is. It was was less of a cultural transformation than an economic one. That led to ageism as you see it in America. I mean, it, you know, it's all wrapped up. I mean, I think I'm I'm a generalist. And I if you had told me ten years ago that I would be fascinated by aging. I would've said why would I want to think about something so yucky? Depressing. And I think I love it. Because it is the biggest canvas there is aging is not just something annoying that old people, and parents, do we are all doing it. When you're all doing it from the day, we are born. I mean, that's how we interact and with with each other and with institutions as we move through life. And you know, this new longevity is a new thing in the American lifespan has increased by thirty years in the twentieth century a slightly deceptive number because more people are surviving to adulthood, but we have gained an average of ten to fifteen healthy years in whatever stage of life. I'm in. I'm sixty six I'll say it again dead center in the baby boom, which we don't even have a name for yet and rolls in institutions have yet to evolve to catch up with that. And that's really probably the biggest reason it's so important to foreground ageism start thinking about it. Because our responses to this new longevity are going to be very different. If we see it as the amazing opportunity, it is to tap into the social capital of millions more healthy, well educated adults than ever before in human history than if we just wring our hands and go, oh my God. What are we gonna do with? All these sad. Useless hopeless old people. Absolutely. I mean, I couldn't agree with you more. But I have to say as a proud member of gen-x, which incl- increasingly feels more and more invisible trapped we're like the middle sibling trapped between boomers and millennials. But, but but I wanted to say it it is kind of refreshing to my ears to hear you so proudly as baby boomers say we got to take on. We got to look at this aging ageism problem we have to figure out how to maximize all the contributions that that boomers can bring because it wasn't it. Also your generation when they were in their twenties were saying don't trust anyone over thirty. Absolutely. And it has come back to bite us in the ass. No question about it. I mean, we sort of invented youth culture. I think it's really important to frame it ageism, not just. As a young person problem, but it's an old person problem. But also as something that affects us across our whole life. Course, we are being ages anytime we make an assumption about someone or a group of people on the basis of how old they are. You know, for example, the trope that you know, millennials are lazy or change jobs. A lot will when I was in my thirties. I changed jobs a lot, right? Those are not age affects those are generational effects and to make a generalization about a generation is obviously patently ridiculous because how could everyone the same age be the same. And by the way, the longer we live the more different from one another we become because we age at different rates physically. Cognitively socially. So the older the person the less their age tells you about what they're capable of what they're thinking about you know, what they're like. Well, we're talking our with Ashton Applewhite. She's author of the new book, this chair rocks manifesto. Against ageism. Let's just get a quick call in here before I break was going to Nina who's calling from Hartford. Connecticut, Nina, you're on the air. Hi, thanks for having me. I just wanna say I'm I just turned twenty four years old, which I'm getting increasingly more and more aware of how young I am the older. I get. I'm looking forward to being older. I'm looking forward to gaining the wisdom that I lack currently. Well, Nina, I want to say congratulations for being one of the people who's willing to say that. So thank you so much for your for your call Ashton. Do you think enough of us see ageing as what was talking about about the opportunity if I wash say if we're lucky enough to get older? To gain wisdom. What one of the paradoxes of of? And there are a lot of them is that everyone is not everyone, but most people are terrified of of getting older. But I haven't found anyone not only no one who wants to die young. But no one who actually wants to be any younger if they think about it because we know that our years are what make us and that it is hard one. I'll make myself unpopular with some of your listeners by saying that I don't love the wisdom trope. You don't know because they're plenty of old people who don't seem to have learned to thing along the way. And there are plenty of children who are wise older people have more experience, and hopefully that leads to wisdom. So I would say if you had a bucket of white people there would be more older people than younger people, but the basic goal is to respect each person, right regardless of their age or race or gender and all of that. And look at who they are as an individual. So isis. Effect that the caller is already wiser than she might give herself credit for and is on the right path. Well, walk me through a couple of the current day misapprehensions that you think are the hallmarks of ageism in America. What is it that we're that we believed about old age or older age that you think just aren't true anymore? I think they were probably never true. But one one is the idea that sort of dementia awaits assaulted if you can't remember where your keys are, you know, oh crap. It's happening. In fact, rates of dementia are going down rates of Alzheimer's have fallen rapidly over the last twenty years. So again, it's not that I'm pollyanna and that Alzheimer's is not a tremendous public health challenge. But the odds of you or I being diagnosed with Alzheimer's have gotten lower and lower and people are being diagnosed at later ages. I was terrified that. I. Would end up spending my last year's drooling and some grim institutional hallway, and then I learned that the percentage of Americans over sixty-five nursing homes was four percent when I started this project has since dropped a two and a half percent. So that's another one. Oh, I thought old people must be depressed because they're old and they're going to die soon. If you Google you curve of happiness, which and I can't tell you how skeptical I was when I learned all this. You will see that people are happiest at the beginnings and the ends of their lives. It's and then I thought, oh, well, you know, must because they're rich or because they're healthy. Not. So the curve is a function of the way aging itself affects the healthy brain in it obtains across cultures and class and marital status. Interesting well, Ashton Applewhite standby for just a second ashes new book is this chair rocks a manifest oh against ageism. This is on point. We'll be right back. This is on point. I'm Meghna Chakrabarti. We're talking with Ashton Applewhite. Her new book is this chair rocks a manifesto against ageism now Ashton before the break you made. I think an excellent case as to why ageism is a problem, and why our conceptions of growing older are especially in this day and age probably entirely wrong. But there's a real tension though, both in the workplace, and I'll just focus on political leadership here for a second between generations that might be one of the reasons why ageism is still popularly acceptable. I have to say in America. So let me just give you the example of as, you know, the the battle that went on over whether or not Nancy Pelosi should be the next speaker of the house, and this is the battle within the Democratic Party. So I wanna play a little bit of tape here. I this is Massachusetts Democrat Seth Moulton after the two thousand eighteen midterms and he was on NS MSNBC calling for a new generation of leadership to repre- replace Pelosi as the head of the Democratic Party. Who the American people send a very clear message of the election last week that they want new approaches to politics in new leaders in Washington, if we answer that call for new leadership by reinstalling the same status quo establishment leadership that we've had in this party since two thousand six then we're letting down the American people and the overwhelming majority of Democrats want new leadership in the house of representatives. It's Massachusetts Democrat Seth Moulton on the other hand. Here's congressman Anthony Brown democrat of Maryland on MSNBC less fall in the run-up to the Democrats picking their speaker here here he is explaining why he's a stalwart supporter of Nancy Pelosi. We need to put our most experienced field. Marshals on the field in one hundred sixteen congress to go Toda to- with Mitch McConnell in the Senate with the president and the administration. We've got a lot of important and will prove to be difficult work to do. So we need our very best are very most experienced. All right so Ashton. This is just a wonderful example of what a of attention. I think isn't a lot of workplaces in in America right now. What's your take? I mean explorer with me this tension between the view of that like that age means a calcification of ideas and perceptions versus all this experience that we heard, you know, in the absence of evidence that an older person is not competent or a younger person is more competent calls for new blood are always ages. It's that simple and Pelosi point at let me point out, obviously faced sexism as well. As ageism women have this double whammy, it is hard to imagine a less experienced politician, handling the shutdown with that kind of skill and equanimity, you know, so and I think there's two points here. This is often framed as the age problem think about that language that the age problem like the race problem like the gender problem, right? The age problem is ageism. The race problem is. Is that they're still discrimination on the basis of race, the gender problem is that women don't have equal rights and equal wages? So it is just as in unacceptable to generalize about the capacity of people on the basis of age as it is on the basis of their race or their gender or anything else about themselves that they cannot change. But period, but this is such a pernicious and powerful line of thinking, I don't give up power without a struggle. We'll that we got backlash against me too. I mean, look at look at the fact that that on the supreme court. They appointed a man who was credibly accused of sexual harassment and hostile to women's rights. But those people hold onto power not because they are old. But because they are politicians and be could is human nature to do. So I'm seeing a lot of comments coming here on lie of online path. Someone comes of path man says at some point older folks do need to perform a little introspection. Are you current? This is this is thing are you current on necessary? Subjects like technology energy Posey in education, are you governing both for now and for the future. Do you have future generations best interests at heart? This is a common refrain. The presumption that that modern day elder leaders, whether it's in the poll in the sphere of politics or other aspects of the workplace are simply self-preservation is looking at the present and not the future but self perfect Preservationists. Again, come in all ages. I think that is a completely reasonable and justifiable request. As is the the the necessity for you to keep in good, physical shape, and to have, you know, have a physical examine make it public. Right. You do need to be current. There's no question about it. But the idea that someone is not current simply because they are older is a cliche like the people that, you know, the cliche that older people are not curious, and I have to say one thing that actually gets my goat. Is that older people do not care about the generations behind them and the world that we? Leave behind that. That is actually I mean, strong strong words, but I think that's hate speech. I think that's hateful. You know, most there's the largest wealth transfer and history is occurring right now for my generation to our children. You know, there are some people who don't care, but there are some some young people who don't care about older people or who don't care about the planet that is not a characteristic of age and to imply that we don't care about the world. We leave behind is is deeply offensive. And I think grossly incorrect to the phones we go. Let's go to Linda who's calling from Boston. Massachusetts, Linda, you're on the air. Hi, thanks for taking the call. I feel like I'm definitely living this age crisis. I am in my early sixties. And I am looking for a new position in a field that I have enormous experience and expertise in not only do I have that. But I have references that span different generations that indicate that I really work. Well across generations. I have a to the point you just raised. I I have a skill set that demonstrates that. Yes, I'm come current with industry specific software application, I removed every element of age for on my resume and my social media platforms. But I get hung up on that online application when they have one. Did you go to call when did you graduate from college? The of. That they ask that in. You can't you can't proceed without answering. And I I simply do not get called back. I'm reading job to grips inside. Go ahead. No, Linda, just wanted to get Ashton's take on on this here because you bring up really important points here Ashton, go go, I didn't even know that that that was a common question. But when did you graduate from the problem is not that they ask you when you graduated from college? The problem is that that is a liability. I mean in an age of world experience has become a liability which is just crazy, frankly, we know that diverse teams make make better play are better places to work diverse companies. We know that they make more money. We know you needed diverse employee base to deal with an incre increasingly diverse client base. So what we are looking at here is a world that has not yet caught up with the I mean all these industries are facing problems because they're. They're gonna have a shortage of older workers as older workers retire or are forced to retire. And believe me, I have no doubt. That your experience is true. Not only because you are older, but because you are female, right? They did this huge experiment where they sound. I think forty thousand resumes and older women got the fewest call backs of all and the human costs and the economic costs are tremendous. If we are forced out of the workplace who's going to support us. We'll taking a lot of institutional knowledge out of the workplace with them. But but just to play devil's advocate here. I mean, aren't older workers also seen as more expensive workers precisely because of all of that experience in that perhaps there are a lot of sectors in which the, you know, hiring managers are just making a basic equation, like younger workers are going to be cheaper. They're going to be perhaps more flexible, they're in a different place in their lives such that they could potentially devote more of themselves to work at a lower cost. And isn't that a lot of older workers? Don't wanna work fulltime. That's one thing we want one one pretty universal character. Mystic is that we would like flex time by now I'm on Medicare, which is pretty fantastic. No one has to pay my healthcare expenses. Right. How about how about a world in which older people transition out of the workforce more gradually and younger people had more time to figure out what they wanted to do and too. So that your career peaked, you know, in your in your fifties instead of in your forties and thirties when you're wrestling with tons of family obligations at both ends. You know, we need to craft a workplace that supports people across the lifespan. One common. Fallacy is that older people take jobs away from younger people that's called the fallacy of the lump of labour, economists have debunked countless times if there's only three jobs in town that may be true older and younger may be competing for it. But that is a labor market problem. Not a too many old people problem. Well, let's go to Kirk who's calling from oriental North Carolina. Kirk you're on the air. Thank you very much. It's quite ironic that I celebrated my eightieth birthday today. Happy birthday birthday. Thank you nineteen thirty nine. And I my only observation is that. The anxiety of approaching eighty was much greater than having arrived there now that I'm here at eighty. I I have a sense great sense of communist and looking towards my ninetieth go that far. Well, it's wonderful to hear. I've make a common a common thought is that people get more depressed as we get older for the most part people. Get happier. We have more equanimity we get better at balancing, negative, emotions like, anger and envy and fear, and you are exemplifying it. Well, we also Kirk I should say, thank you so much for your call and a very happy birthday to you Kirk. We've got a comment here from Terry Fortman who says now in my eighth decade of life. I'm well aware of when I am a victim of ageism young people should back off their stereotypes of aging people. Look at us individually before you conclude we're all the same. Let's go to Megan who's calling from Whitman Massachusetts. Megan you're on the air. Hi, thanks for taking my call. I was just calling because I have not experienced ages of myself, save also my birthday say to you. Fifty five fifty four in my fifth year. But my family went to Italy a few years ago, and with my parents who were in their eighties at the time and both still living and it was shocking in pleasantly shocking. How the difference in the way they were treated while we were there by we encountered. I mean strangers on the street and telling us how wonderful it was that we still had them and how we respect them and take good care of them. It was it was so pleasant, and I just so noticeably different from here and my aunt just turned one hundred in when I think about everything sees experienced just in the last three years. I don't understand why people aren't interested in an older person's perspective. Well, Megan thank you so much for your call. I'm magnetized birdie. This is on. Point astronaut a white pick-up on Megan's Law here. What are well? What are we missing here without having this different attitude towards aging in the United States? But people are always asking me plaintively like, isn't it better somewhere else? And it is better in cultures where old and young people mingle, which of course, is always the case in rural societies in small towns. The US is tremendously age segregated. It is really rare to be in a mixed age group, unless you're at a family gathering or maybe a sporting event. So one of I think the most important things we can do is to reach out towards older and younger people and have friends of all ages, and what is kind of absurd is that that feels like such a big ask. But you know, think of something you'd like to do and find a mixed age group to do it with their only two inevitable bad things about aging people, you've known all your life. We're going to die and some part of your body's gonna fall apart not all of it. But nothing else is inevitable. The most important factor in. Aging will is not how healthy you are. Or how wealthy you are. It is having a robust social network. So we as Americans in particular need to reach across age, which is also incredibly important, if we want to be, you know, effective in the world at whatever the thing is most important to us, obviously, if there are all ages around the table, we are going to be more effective for reasons that are intuitively obvious. And if you're around the table, and everyone is the same age, whether that's older or younger find out if there is no legitimate reason for it just as in the same goes. Of course, everyone is the same race. If everyone, you know is the same gender what's up with that? We'll so let me ask you just to take a little tangent. Here you make the argument in the book that ageism and myths about aging e can even have a negative effect on our brains and bodies as we age. It's really interesting tons of new research is coming out that show that attitudes towards aging have a measure. Effect on how our bodies and our brains function at the cellular level people with more used to say more positive attitudes towards aging now, I say more realistic attitude towards aging because all we hear is the negative. We don't hear both sides of the story they walk faster they heal quicker from severe disability. They live longer. They live an average of seven and a half years longer and the latest research out of jail by the fantastic person psychologists named Becca Levy is that positive attitudes towards aging confer protection against dementia, even in people with the gene for the disease. The idea is that those positive attitudes buffer you from the stress of discrimination. And that is of course, a function of ageism so one of my most fervent appeals is for an anti ageism campaign as a public health initiative. Whether I love old people are hateful people, we whether you wish there were more of us are fewer. Us. No, one wants us to be sick and cost money. And this is one really effective way to help prevent that. Interesting. Let's take another quick call here before the break. Joyce's calling from Niantic, Connecticut Joyce, you're on the air. Thank you. I'm so glad to get this opportunity ageism in travels with me every day of my life. And it's gone. It'll am I do what the speaker said, you know, to keep myself healthy and in physical shape because you've got to do everything you can to face the world as you age to be accepted, and I need to earn a living and I'm in my early seventies. And what happens is you're perceived as a volunteer. It doesn't matter. Your skill your experience, the wealth of your resume and your experience, and that you need to work. I don't need to work as a greeter. That's not gonna pay my bills, I need employment and just. Which happens? Oh, whatever you do we expect that you'll do it as volunteer. Joyce by many points. I'm gonna I'm gonna take the call back from you. And thank you so much because we have to take a break here in about a minute and a half. And thank you for your call here. I mean, Ashton this is going to be a recurring theme in a lot of our callers here. So what what would you what what are one of the two ways to to change this? This is a deep problem. It's a deep problem that requires deep profound cultural change, if you if the topic of today were what what what about the position of women in the world as opposed to the position of older people in the world primarily I mean, again ageism affects young people to think about where we would be without the international women's movement that profoundly changed the way we see women and the way women see ourselves, right? We need a broad based grassroots movement that changes the culture at this underlying level, or we're not gonna we're not going to undo ageism in the workplace or in the bedroom in the boardroom or anywhere else. Without? Out attacking it between our ears and in the culture at large will Ashton Applewhite standby here. Ashton's new book is the chair this chair rocks a manifesto against ageism. We're talking about how to undo America's last acceptable prejudice. As we're calling this hour. This is on point. This is on point. I Magnin taco Bharti. We're talking with Ashton Applewhite this hour. Her new book is this chair rocks a manifesto against ageism and an ashtray. We've got a lot of comments coming in online. Alison Berkowitz says I like to think I do not practice ageism, but I can understand growing acrimony towards older generations for their lack of understanding of millennial struggles, I e uncertain income student loans lack of access to healthcare at cetera. Whereas Hello kitty's zero five eight zero says, I definitely freak out a bit. When I see those grey hairs coming in. Then I say to myself, whatever the system happens. It's not an indication of my worth or whether I'm still capable of being a productive member of society. So little a span of opinions there online but Ashton? Here's one thing. I wanted to ask you specifically about ageism as an ISM that we're all grappling with. It's the one that unifies us. All right because we are all getting older, we're we're we're Vincent a prejudice against our future selves as I put now at the beginning of the why is that what what is it about the way? Human beings work and think that prevents us from seeing that we too, you know, this too shall pass for us. Well, you know, I I mean, no prejudice makes sense. And but an obviously all prejudices are wrong. But you could argue that ageism is particularly irrational because it is indeed a prejudice against our own future self, and when we freak out about those grey hairs, or you know, died in dire hair to cover the gray or leave early accomplishments off our resume, and I really understand. Why people do these things are really effective strategies. But they do the they're not good for us because they're rooted and shame about something that shouldn't be shameful. Right. Like someone, you know, straight person gay person trying to pass for straight person of color trying to pass for white why on earth should waking up a day older. The universal human experience be source of shame and embarrassment. And I think one of the broader issues here is. The way it gets framed in this debate around gerontocracy, or you know, our old people. They don't understand young people. Young people are mean to old people all prejudice fundamentally operates two pit us against each other. So that because otherwise we would join forces to work together for a fairer world. Right. I mean in any of this framing old versus young framing plays right into the hands of the forces that also benefit from gender inequality and racial inequality. It, you know, income inequality does not discriminate by age the same forces that are making it really hard from Eleni else to get a foothold and believe me. I know that that's true. My generation was incredibly lucky to come of age during this era of unheralded prosperity. And I don't blame millennials for being pissed off and resentful. But it is it is foolish to blame us for that. Or hold us accountable because whatever solutions we're going to work towards to. Make a better world involve all of us. We are all in this together. Gerontocracy is not a good idea. We don't want older people to be in charge of everything we want a mix we want to acknowledge that youth and age are different that that people of all different ages. You know, bring different things to the table. And some of the same things that youngsters and olders are hostage to the same macroeconomic trends, a heartless gig economy, you know, unfettered capitalism and work together because we're not going to address the enormous issues and problems the world addresses, unless we join forces across the generations, totally agree. And again as the genetics are at the table. We're still year to. We just got two minutes left in our portion of the conversation nationally. So I'm hearing you call for this massive cultural change, and but that, of course, is a hard work in work of many years, if not generations, what do you make of sort of shorter term, practical or structural changes? That are on the table. I mean, there's legislation that would make it harder to pending legislation that would make it harder to discriminate against age in the workplace. These are the useful steps, right? These are very useful steps indeed. And to to track ageism in the workplace to as the caller just said when you see that first gray hair, where does the voice come from? That says you are, you know, now, useless or unattractive? It is not our friend. It comes from the beauty industry. Right. It comes from the same people that tell you that if you're not thin and blonde and perfect looking, you know, there's something wrong with you think about where those messages come from. And what purpose they serve and the place to start. Of course, is you know, it's a cliche, but like most cliches, it has an element of truth chain starts between our ears. We are all ages. I think ages things all the time. So start with yourself and think about your own attitudes towards age and ageing because it, you know, it's uncomfortable. You're going to have this crap moment or many of them were you go. Oh, oh, I'm part of the problem. But we can't challenge bias unless we're aware of it. These are new ideas to most of us. And once you see it in yourself, you see it in the culture, you understand that what you've been thinking of as a personal problem. Oh, hope you didn't allow yourself to get any wrinkles. You know is not a personal problem. These are widely shared political problems that require collective action. And that moment, I just found the term for it is cognitive liberation where it transitions from the personal to the political. And that is the linchpin of movement building well Ashton Applewhite's new book is this chair rocks a manifesto against ageism. We have an excerpt of it at on point radio dot org and. And shannon. It's been such a great pleasure. Thank you. So very much. Thank you Magna. We'll folks in a moment we're going to get a history of insulin. How it was discovered and how it's changed millions of lives. This is on point. Yesterday. Major drugmaker ally Lilly announced it will sell a half price generic version of insulin. The company will charge a list price of about one hundred thirty five dollars per vial for the generic, but considered that a similar vile cost just thirty dollars in Canada. So yes, the cost of this. Lifesaving drug is extraordinarily high in the United States. And yes, a growing number of people who depend on insulin to survive are cutting their doses because it's so expensive so tomorrow, we're going to spend our talking about what's happening in the lives of these patients how drug makers are justifying their list prices for insulin. And the pushback against big pharma. We heard it on Capitol Hill last week. But right now to set up that our we wanted to devote a little time today to the history of insulin. How it was discovered nearly a century ago? And how we got to where we are now. And for that we turn to Christopher J ruddy. He's a medical historian and a professor at the university of. Toronto's Dala, Lana school of public health. And he joins us from Toronto. Christopher ready. Welcome to on point. Hello. And in in the interest of full disclosure. I should note that you manage the historical archive at Sanofi Pasteur. Toronto lab Sanofi. Of course is one of the makers of insulin drug, but understand you're not involved in any way with their insulin production. No, not produced that site. That's a faxing only site, and it's the the current incarnation of but was laboratories which was a key player in the history of insulin and produced all candidates win from they won to the eighties. So it's kind of complicated, but I'm a historian. And and so it's it's I'm not involved with insulin. Anything happening with insulin today. Okay. Good. We know. We just wanted to be sure to put out that full disclosure there. Okay. So Christopher ready. Let's let's start in the early nineteen twenties. Give us the brief history of how insulin became. Covered as a as a potential drug to treat diabetes. Well, I mean, it comes down to I suppose, Frederick Banting and Charles best Banting was a surgeon and he had an idea kind of struck him on Halloween. Nineteen twenty Spence essentially idea to lie gate the pancreas. I mean, they they knew that the pink. This was the source of of insulin. The islets in the pancreas that was fairly well known. But and there'd been a other attempts to do something similar, but Banting had a fresh approach as a surgeon to how to actually li- gate like a kind of sort of have the Panthers degenerate and experimental dogs, and then and take it out and kind of create diabetes in those dogs. And then extract the the the insulin or the diabetic extract or principal from the pancreas. And so he had that idea kind of he was but different from normal or from what other have otherwise had been to this sort of suggested. Of that time. And so he was encouraged to to go to the university of Toronto he was in London the university of western Ontario. The time teaching a course kind of as as a doctor. He was petted small practice in London Ontario. Any went up to university of Toronto. Matt, Dr John MacLeod, JJ McLeod who was an expert in Cobra hydrates and physiology and sorta to convince them that this was an interesting idea, and and some MacLeod gave him lab and assistance of recent medical student physiology student Charles best and during the summer of nineteen twenty one they they were managed to follow that idea to extract the Titanic principle as our eventually called Isla ten or insulin later and figured out how to do that. And but the interesting thing, though, is that cannot laboratories was was part of the university of Toronto. Right. They're literally downstairs from the lab at Banting and best will work in. And so they had they. Worked very much on that early development right of insulin from beginning. Let me just here for saying because I should note that Frederick grant Banting won the Nobel prize in nineteen Twenty-three. Right. So this was a this was a massive discovery interns from a Canadian perspective. It's the whole issue is has much stronger resonance because it's very much part of our culture here, as you know, being sort of Canadian role on this whole story is very significant. And so and this is a price and the and the whole history of insulin is is more kind of interwoven into our history. Personal level and priced became you know, a sort of an important issue. Solicits blow this a little bit more because yes, Frederick Banting won the Nobel prize in nineteen twenty three. And I mean, so this was a discovery that that Banting and best at least we're bending at all say really recognize the importance of almost instantaneously now had a similar. Discover discovery been made in this day and age those scientists would go on to own a patent or the companies would own a patent on it and make zillions of dollars. But that is not what Banting and his cohort. Did they sold it? They sold what the the patent for insulin or or the technology or the idea of insulin to the university of Toronto for a dollar. Well, that's a bit of a mess. Okay. Essentially signed over the patent idea patents to the university. Toronto. What became insulin committee at university of Toronto? And Eddie was to do this first before a commercial company did the went ahead, and and and started to produce it themselves because and he'll idea was not to monopolize it. But to make sure it was it was handled properly by qualified people and not exploited because at that time there was a lot of pharmaceutical exploitation going on and so on and they actually university of Toronto went cannot labs work very closely with Louis nearly days they had exclusive arrangement to help develop insulin on a large scale. And and ultimately they ended up having sort of a shared patent like that would the idea was to be say anybody develops something new with insulin there'd be shared with any other producer. So there was a real real concern because insulin is a a very unique product in the sense that it's something that a diabetic depends on. On daily for the rest of their life. It's not a one shot, you know, deal Banting discovered a cure for insulin. You know, something that someone could take and they were no longer have diabetes, and that would people would pay, you know, all kinds of money for this was an ongoing issue. And also, the call the quality issue was was very critical to all this as well to make sure that because it's something that's given every day for someone's life that the quality and purity, we're all very high high priority issues. We'll let me just because I need to say I'm making a trucker bardy. This is on point Christopher ready. I mean, we're sort of jumping over a lot long periods of history here. But but the the big question is one of the big questions is so we're talking about an idea this delivery of insulin. That's almost a century old now. And as you said, it's it's discoverers did not want any one particular group or company to monopolize it. And yet here we are in a. Where in the United States now insulin or synthetic insulin's are are hundreds of dollars per vial. I mean when did prices start skyrocketing up as much as they did. Well, there's been several phases of that. I mean, the real Tennessee over most of history of insulin is to keep prices down and compete for each other to have him as low as possible, and that was pretty common really until the seventies. We had inflation in the price of pancreas, the original instantly was based on beef report pancreatic tissue and the prices of that went skyrocketed and early seventies. And one would love everything house at that time. And so there was a lot of pressure. And basically, the the need to rise raise prices was the resistible and that happened here as well because cannot university trying to Seoul cannot labs and seventy two and so it was privatized. And so it face the same pressures. And so and they're the real concern this insolent price for the first of was nearly. Eighties late seventies early eighties. When there was a real shift to the the first generation of a synthetic insolence and a real debate around the purity of insulin. And and there's a real concerned about the future supply of pampers tissue seem to be you're going to be beholden to slaughterhouses and right supply of those sort of tissues, and that was a big problem. And that was what drove a lot of the interest in doing a human synthetic DNA recon, we competent and so. So which is what we we have those in the though synthetics as you said, but we're also at a point now where what ninety nine percent of of insulin sold around the world is is done by three companies. Right. Yeah. Yeah. And I mean, the the issue I suppose for me, I guess looking at this the actual technology. I mean, they've been improved things. But it it is inflammation one hundred years old. So that sort of this rush for the new, and it's not necessarily that greater improvement a -sarily for most diabetics and doesn't really justify the high higher price. But there's a lot of other factors. I mean, the price issue is is largely focused on the US because of the nature of the system there compared to here me, and the prices are going up here too. But our system in Canada, like Ontario, for example, into twenty-five influence free has covered the insurance Republicans Durance when either one so the pressure is not quite as high here per se because opposed to the US situation because there's so many other. Actors going on with insulin with the way the system works there. And it's and I I suppose I mean in light of the the way insulin's developed in the whole concerned about price and quality and Novus story of sort of highlighted is to be in the situation today where the price is becoming such a big problem for diabetics today. And and it's just, you know, it seems to me needs to be, you know, it's nice to see Lilly. Do the half price off, I suppose, but it may not be enough. Because as as we'll talk about tomorrow, there's so many stories that perhaps up to twenty five percent of people in the United States who rely on insulin have to start are starting to cut their doses because they can't afford it. But Christopher ruddy medical historian and professor at the university of Toronto's Delana school of public health. Thank you so much for joining us day for giving us a history of insulin. You're welcome and folks tomorrow as I said, we're going to be talking about what diabetics are. And how they're coping with the high price of insulin. Now, so good on point radio dot org. You'll let us know your story. I'm making a chocolate Bharti. This is on point.

Ashton Applewhite America United States university of Toronto Massachusetts Frederick Banting Toronto Boston Nancy Pelosi Christopher J ruddy diabetes Magna Canada Arman Linda MSNBC Connecticut ally Lilly NPR
August 28: Intermission accomplished

As It Happens from CBC Radio

50:38 min | 1 year ago

August 28: Intermission accomplished

"This is a c._b._c. Podcast hello. I'm helen man hello. I'm roger vein. This is as it happens the podcast edition tonight intermission mission accomplished british prime minister boris johnson says he'll suspend parliament for five weeks leading precious little time for brexit opponents to stop their country entry from crashing out of the e._u. Don't go forth unless you can multiply doesn't matter what you want to teach in ontario. The provincial government insists you'll have to pass a standardized his math test before you're allowed in classroom. Noman was an island but he came close. The late larry doughy knew more about newfoundland and labrador than anyone what else and gladly enlightened anyone who asked history retreats itself the curator of the banting house museum is overjoyed when he's sent reams of documents belonging onto sir frederick banting himself and under -joyed when it gets lost in the mail abeille after a recent experiments suggests our simian ancestors might the key to our understanding of the evolution of language because it showed that a rang attends can play the kazoo and winning with just one hand down a london doctor explains the radical step he took to save a patient's hand after a terrible accident sewing it to the patients growing as it happens the wednesday edition radio that assumes he had mixed feelings about getting one major surgery under his belt protestors chanting stop the coup outside british parliament today after boris johnson pulled the plug on parliament with the queen's permission the u._k. Prime administer has announced that hill suspend parliament for five weeks starting in mid-september many of his westminster colleagues say it's an insult to democracy and it unfairly shorten shorten the already short time they have to work out legislation that would prevent a no deal brexit before the october thirty first deadline. Here's how the prime minister responded to that well. That's that is completely untrue. If you look at what we're doing we're bringing forward a new legislative programme on crime on hospitals and making sure that we have have the education funding that we need and there will be ample time on both sides of that crucial october. The seventeenth summit ample time in in parliament for m._p.'s debate <hes> the e._u. The brexit and oh the other issues appleton. Tom break is a liberal democrat crat m._p. And the party's brexit spokesperson we reached him in london. Tom break the speaker of the house of commons john burke. How is calling this a constitutional outrage outrage. What do you call it well. I always a constitutional outrage as well or snap. Prime minister is pretended he house dog is normal. It is anything but normal. This is not before and parliaments. I believe of george shipments department are going to work up to stop him simply fussing down our parliaments. What do you mean when you say this hasn't happened before. How is this different from any previous. Perot gatien watts per gatien is this is normally useful is when a government has completed the cecil bills that they brought forward in the previous queen speech. Are they tie a few loose ends. Are they clear the decks. Parliament doesn't sit for for a week or two and then parliament is is recalled resumes a new session of parliament with a new set of bills proposed bills in the queen's speech. What this is about is actually shutting down parliament so the pollen isn't sitting the point when the prime minister wants to push through a no deal crashing out the european union brexit something for which he does not have a mandate and and he knows that a majority of members apartment would stop him doing it so his solution to this problem. The solution the dictators around the world adopts it is simply to shutter parliament boris johnson. Does he not have the constitutional right to do this. After all. The queen has approved it. I am just wearing what you and your colleagues can do to stop it. At this point well. The may have the the right to do it but the reason he is doing it is because he knows the majority. Josh m._p.'s have on a number of occasions made it very clear that they will not let him run through no deal causing the social problems that his own government have identified in their analysis thinking such as a mets and food and fuel shortages. We are not prepared to accept that we we made that clear. Majority of us are opposed to it yet. He thinks the solution to his problem. His <hes> democratic dilemma is simply to shut down parliament. Do you think that this is going to trigger a non-confidence vote. In the few days that parliament will actually be back well. There are other things that palman it's <hes> can do and <hes> memphis opposition parties and indeed members of the conservative party have been working together on. We believe that a legislative approach is still still possible one that would make it in effect law that he had to allow no deal so the possibility of those confidence clearly remains <unk> at the moment. So what do you think mister. Johnson strategy is here. Then missile instance trustee is to try to crash the chaos the european opinion without the deal but opposed to it but given how many people are opposed to that both in the general public of course members of parliament in various his party's including as you point out his own conservative party. How is the no deal brexit in mister. Johnson's long-term interests well. Mr johnson has said he was going to do all die by the thirty first of october. He's clearly decided to die or leasees decided to drag the country down with him but is it possible that he is trying to force someone else to trigger on election if he were to try that routes is intent on holding general election would again have the sole purpose of having the country in the middle of jenn election at the point where we passed the thirty first of all tober thereby guaranteeing that men's department on not they're not sitting because when parliaments in election <hes> there is no parliament and thereby guaranteeing again that we would crash south of the european union on the thirty first tober if you manage to succeed lead in passing legislation that prevents the government from leaving the e._u. Without a deal what effect will it actually have him and you haven't been able to come to terms with with a deal so the deadline will still happen. How do you deal with that. We have already been this <hes> this route before and succeeded in getting the government amount to request a and it was granted an extension to osco fifty but the first step is to get get no deal ruled out in law <hes> and then i hope we can move on to things like ensuring that any deal or the prospect of no deal is something that the country has a whole has to go on because they certainly weren't warned this was on the cards for years ago basically want a new referendum. Yes basically wants a new referendum so that everyone in the country now that they can they can read about things like like the impact of no deal medicines few food and fuel shortages on they can determine whether in fact that is something that they want to proceed with or whether in fact they won't pull the plug on this very costly damaging exercise that is brexit those who argue against new referendum point out that that would be anti-democratic given the country voted to leave three years ago well how canadian referendum in which everyone in the country takes pods be anti-democratic. What is anti-democratic in my view is proceeding with something which was won by a small margin which the polls now suggest would people would vote the other way the leave campaigns which all found guilty of breaking the law and find as a result of that the terms of leaving are not as <hes> was on offer three for years ago. That's why i think is perfectly democratic to say to the people look. This is how things stand now if with hindsight you feel well. This isn't what i thought was going to happen and you vote to remain. You should be entitled to do that. The patients heavy you. Leaders appears to be running even thinner than it was before what evidence let's do you have that they would even be willing to give an extension to the u._k. On article fifty indications are is that the e._u. Aw aw reluctance to be seen to be the body that precipitated no deal. I think would be flexible. I think particularly if for instance we table to indicate that the extension was the for stage towards up sorry the <hes> having a people's <hes> people's vote on any deal alternatively the general election in those circumstances. They made it clear that they would <hes> support an extension. Tom break. Thank you for your time today. Thank you all right bye bye. Okay bye tom. Brady is a liberal democrat m._p. For the u._k. And the party's brexit spokesperson for more on this story or website c._b._c. dot c._a. Slash h <music> in saint john's newfoundland a museum called the rooms towers above the city skyline inside you can spend hours roaming the halls reading about the history and culture of newfoundland and labrador or you could just ask larry. Larry doughy was an archivist and at the rooms but today he's being remembered as much more than a museum employee. He was also a master storyteller and unofficial ambassador for the province. Mr doughy died suddenly on tuesday after suffering a brain hemorrhage he was fifty nine. He didn't just recount stories of his home. Province larry doughy also had incredible tales of his own here. He is telling the c._b._c. About his childhood memories of eating fish at christmas time did newfoundland dictionary the dictionary of newfoundland and labrador actually has determined christmas fish deficient our house <unk> alley because my father loved it so much and roasted caitlyn so mind father would take that dry caitlyn he'd put it in a brown paper bag and then he'd put that paper for bag into a panel water or running under distinct onto the bag with salt and then he'd put that into woodstock because growing up we all had woodstoves put lindor and when he looked in any saad at that paper bag was all dried up he would take it out and he would feast through christmas death roasted caitlyn debt permeated the whole house. Mr joey was also the co host of archival moments local radio show in saint john's along with brian o'connell. We reached mister o'connell saint john's newfoundland brian. I'm really sorry for your loss. Thank you so much for that. We're saddened by larry larry passing. It was very sudden and we all extend our condolences to e._s._p._n. To his family he was a wonderful man. What's it like oh you hearing his voice today. There was something very calm about his voice but also he had a knack for storytelling you know he was one of those guys who could spend a tail. The only difference is they weren't tall tales. They were actual tales from history. When you hear larry's voice telling those stories you're hearing the voices says from past he was able to take a piece of history and was able to put a place and a face to it a name in many cases and address in that clip we just heard there's a lot of the personal in it obviously when he's telling the story of a dad and the kaplan did he bring a lot of that to the stories he told yeah well. Oh a tremendous amount oftentimes. When he was telling a story he would <hes> sidestep to something personal recently we do the show about newfoundland's summer garden parties ladies and <hes> he <hes> set off on a story about waiting for the various ladies in the community to bring their coal plates to the community hall and actually referenced a lady by name who made the best potato salad in the community at one point. We had to stop because <hes> the story he was telling was quite funny and and i was just laughing uncontrollably he told it with such gusto and actually put you in the place <hes> an idea of what a larry doughy meant to the people of newfoundland the land you know he was an archivist historian he was a storyteller he started out originally headed into the clergy and then he became an archivist for or the basilica of saint john the baptist here in saint john they have a tremendous archive collection that goes back hundreds of years and from then he went on to university and that became his passion he <hes> worked at the rooms and he was very proud of the work that they did at the rooms. He made the rooms <hes> less of a museum and more of a place that was like your home home. When you went to the rooms there was music there was food we saw everything that we were and he made very proud of it and one of the things that larry really really worked on was the world war one exhibit and he wanted to tell that story of the royal different land regimen and he often told many of those stories names of a young man dan long gone but <hes> the history of the province and how it affected the old colony i gather he wanted to ensure that newfoundland history wasn't ignored or misunderstood good. How did he work to change perceptions that people might have he had a sense of who we were. He wanted us to be proud of <hes> our forebears beers. He wanted us to be proud of how they carved out a life here. He would often say you know when <hes> toronto was just a small community of cabins on the side of lake ontario. Saint john's was city that was practicing british law back in the day. He wanted us to know that <hes> newfoundland was the foothold in north america for everything career came after but he also talked about the humor and he was very proud of our dialect he made us realize that the language that we have here is an incredible the language that comes from many places cluding his hometown of st brides. You can still hear that dialect very clear <hes>. He's a great guy to have a glass the wind with lots of stories. He was the kind of guy who would go and do anything for you. I remember at one time looking at a photograph many times leaving the rooms and i had commented on at several times and then one day it showed up in my mailbox that <hes> he had gotten a copy of it and sent it to me. It was just one of those photographs of the colonial building in saint john's but he was always thinking of other people and the other thing was if you were going to have larry for <hes> dinner you had better book far out because he was involved with so so many charities he also encouraged people to bring their families and their children to the rooms because they developed so many programs for kids here in newfoundland and the rumors it was became a place where children could come and have fun and many times going into record the show on a thursday morning when they were children in school buses outside the sound of children's children's laughter echoing through the room was the most pleasant thing and he loved that looking at social media reaction today to his passing. It seems as if almost everyone no one knew him there. I think everybody did we knew that we had <hes> quite a few listeners to the show and this morning <hes> rick mercer allen doyle l. markets just a few of our local celebrities here and then so many more people in government people from coves and bays people from across saint john's across the province. I'm just gobsmacked at the the outpouring was just fifty nine known as this walking encyclopedia of newfoundland and labrador what has been lost with his death. Oh my we we've lost <hes> probably one of our greatest historians one of our best storytellers. We've lost a man who <hes> gave us <hes> so much pride in this place but i think he set such a huge example. That won't be lost. I'm confident that we will we will continue on to remember our past and and teach it to our children. Is there one particular thought or memory that you will especially cherish as you're thinking about larry. There are two things actually when he would discover a new story like the time joey smallwood took a caravan of cars and and tanker tanker trucks across the island. When they opened up the trans canada highway he had this mischievous grin become across his face and the other thing was when he was starting his story he would always say there was a time and it was almost as if an elder in your family was going to tell you a very important story something that you want to hear i'm brian. I wish i had known him. My mom really happy that you're able to share your memories with us today. Thank you so much. Thank you so much. She was a wonderful person and and he won't be forgotten here all right. That's you brian. O'connell is a friend of larry doughy. We reached reached mister o'connell in saint john's larry doughy. The new finland historian and storyteller died this week. Leakey was fifty nine years old <music> <music> <music>. Sometimes you face a tough choice like whether you lose your hand or habit attached to your groin for two weeks after an undisclosed period of time a patient agent at st george's hospital in london england recently chose the latter roger. I'd large is one of the doctors who did the surgery. We reached him in london and warnings. Some of the details in this interview are quite graphic dr adler. This was a horrific accident. There's really no way of getting around describing it it. Can you take us through what happened. Yes <hes> patient. Mr elliot had been using a circus soul as his job as a carpenter and unfortunately <unk> cooled under the blade and was tokyo amputate his hand. It was hanging inspired. Dorsal skin a little bit bone and the trouble was aided is not just once but he came back down again on his hand a few centimetres further on so you had what we call double level subtitle amputation. He must have lost an awful lot of blood. God a horrific scene. He said he was having announcement. Body experience and it must be an horrific reform involved. What did you think when you first. I heard about the accident and the degree of damage. Actually i wasn't too concerned. We have these sort of abbey hands about once a month. Central just has helped too which is a major trauma center and so we do see these interests i also this is not a big operation but something we can handle and and we'll be feasible. When did you realize the surgery might pose some challenges now while also took him from an from our accident emergency too often mm-hmm onto estate became quickly evident that this was more than just occupation and it was a two different levels and being a swathe of tissue loss. Bush bush made things very complex and besides the tissue. What kind of damage did you see oldest tendons or his alters his nerves to order his fingers on film had gone ammos. I analyse molly hadn't just been cut through the missing. Three fingers was severely damaged in unreconstructed. <hes> it was a severe injury the most complex i've seen in layman's terms describe for us what you did during the actual surgery yeah so the initial operation that night we started seventy evening finished interested not in the morning and we had to reestablish blood supply to all his fingers and this wasn't easy because we can just join the ultras up light we would normally only do so we hosted baynes from his feet a newsies to bridge the gaps between the arteries and the and and each finger and thumb and the same the problem with the nurse hosted nurse four is to preach the gas in the nurse on finding the tendons will star in the same manner. What were you looking for in the days as that followed in terms of recovery yeah so initially we just want the fingers to survive and it quickly became evident that although the five fingers were surviving the middle finger had very little stability too and she was going to become a nuisance to him in life and this was fortunate in some ways because we also saw so there was some skin that was not surviving to the palm of his hand and we were able to kind of allies the parts miss middle finger and use it to reconstruct the that's in adding the hand itself. You mentioned the the palm. There was not enough skin to cover it. How do you address that so the next step that who happened about two weeks after his initial surgery is cool groin flap and this involves burying the hand into his groin just at the top of his leg and we gift some tissue in a sober tanggula flap up from the groin and stitched in place into his hands whose hands actually joined his toughest leg and it remains like this two weeks leaks until that skin grows rootin- takes to hand and they were able to divide the british skin between the hand in the groin and his hand was actually stuck in that position for two weeks indeed it takes you know takes a hattrick sweetness overseas to the patient berkeley and see whether he was able to go through this but it was was possibly the technique we could use to save his hand at this point and he was king that we gave it a go use. I go home. The next day for two weeks had his hand bandaged up in this position pretty the uncomfortable. I think you can imagine unusual is the procedure of this kind is actually a technique that we used to use quite often. Maybe twenty thirty years ago before we had very good microscopic techniques unfortunately because of the nature of his injury the microscopic techniques that we would know us using cool free flaps would not available to us so it's always good so us go back to history in using with wisdom in the past. Were any of your colleagues surprised that you chose this measure not ready. Am <hes> i think initially raised a few eyebrows when when you first describe it because we used to doing more modern methods but once they saw the degree of damage in yeltsin's would read in order in order for us to unite becomes a mattress of saving this chap's hand. How's he doing now. He's doing really well. She's doing better than that. The my expectation would be this. This is always a devastating injury and you're never gonna get you hand back to full function but already he's able to pinch and hold a pen and define control with his index and thumb and a <hes> his hands <unk> skins stable and his sensation slightly returning and he's not having horrible pain that he had in the first few were they holding surgery. I'm saying he's doing really well. Does he have extensive physiotherapy to come. He asked to have lots and lots of physical therapy and this is the other thing you need a good patient and a good physiotherapist to do hansard rely this has he's very determined and he will do well as a result of this dr adler. It's it's fascinating hear all about it. Thank you very much. The chromatography sweetie roger adler is a plastic surgeon at saint george's hospital in london england. That's where we reached him and we have more on this story including some photos of the hand off website c._b._c. dot c._a. Slash h uh-huh <music> <music>. We humans have long believed. We were alone our ability to express herself through kazue's. We also believed believed. We were the only species to have voluntary control over vocal fold oscillation although we don't necessarily think of it in exactly those words we think of it has voice control. The scientific term is active voicing and now new science shows orangutangs can do it to the experiment was ingenious since we know apes can't say words scientists gave them something else that would test their voice control and that's something was a kazoo terrible kazoo playing of course but what's important. Is that in a very short time two of the orangutans learn to change changed vocalisations so the thing would make noise in different ways. That's active voicing and according to the researchers it suggests that quote great apes our closest relatives may hold the key to how language evolved in our lineage on quote. It's an impressive conclusion reached with the help of a simple instrument and like the humble kazue itself. It's generated a fascinating buzz <music>. After two weeks of no showers no plumbing sixteen-year-old climate change activists gra tune berg arrived in new york city today ms tune burg's journey journey began on august fourteenth in england. She sailed across the atlantic on a slick but no-frills zero missions racing yacht to attend u._n. Climate summits and to the highlights and to highlight the urgency of cutting carbon emissions. She waved at crowds waiting for her as she pulled into the harbor today. Here's some of what she had to say. After she got off the boat and spoke to reporters all of this very overwhelming the ground is still shaking me so but i want to thank everyone so much everyone who is here and everyone who who is involved volt in this climate fights because this is pie to cross borders across continent and it it's as you said it is insane that a six year old have to cross the atlantic ocean to to make stan and this of course. It's not something that i want everyone to do. The trip was it was very surprisingly good. I did not feel seek once so there was and i'm very grateful for malaysia and everyone else who has been making this trip possible and of of course for everyone everyone else every activist who fight daily to to save the world basically but to keep the fossil fuel in the ground and to create safe passage to sorry. My brain is not working correctly. The climate and ecological crisis is a global crisis. The biggest crisis assist humanity has ever faced and if we don't manage to work together to cooperate and to to work together despite our differences then we will fail greenwich in berks speaking today in manhattan after wrapping up her journey across the atlantic ocean by boat <music> those who can't do probably shouldn't teach that's apparently the logic behind in ontario government decision to have all teacher candidates candidates in the province undergo a standardized math test before they can enter the classroom. That's all teachers including the ones who plan on teaching kindergarten or drama or english lit. The government says it's responding to the declining math scores on standardized tests for students called <unk> tests in the province. Stephen lecce is the minister of education nation in the province of ontario here. He is speaking to reporters today. I mean at the end of the day. You know i find it very helpful to understand ah use measurements as a way to dictate government invest <hes> i think what we are saying is we care deeply in respect our educators who work hard i think most educators caters like most people in most professions except that professional development is a reality in the marketplace and that in the interests of serving our students we have to constantly be improving living our skills and how we teach what we teach and so the test is informative simply to understand <hes> where we need to improve to allocate more resources orders. I mean many of the questions i'm getting today are premised on data from the show so in the absence of having a metric without knowing the problem and and you know and where we wanna get to we can't really measure it so i think parents in the problems in certainly country government believes in quitting performance metrics. That's a normative way of doing business. Ontario harrow education minister stephen lecce says part of the solution to students falling. Math scores is having their teachers undergo testing to but teachers say the ministries calculations. Don't add up liz. Stewart is an elementary school teacher and the president of the ontario english catholic teachers association. We reached her in toronto ms stewart. Do you think you would need to brush up on your math skills. If you had to take a test like the one that's being proposed was difficult to know because we're not exactly sure what's going to be in the proposed host math test at this point in time. We know there's a plan to bring a test in place for our pre service teachers so teach candidates. I'm before they can become permanent. We're not sure what the content will be. That's our understanding at this point. It would be elementary and secondary. Yes yeah it would apply to everybody. What do you think would you be willing to take such a test. Does the teacher i mean i certainly hope i could do it and pass pass it but i i think the concern we have is evil. I mean it's the entire premise which is flawed because there's no connection between somebody's mass knowledge and how they then a math instruction and student success. I mean there's just no correlation laugh. I fully understand grade six math. It's how i instruct and how my students are able to learn that impacts is there student test scores which is what this is all premised on instructional practice and what happens in a classroom is what enables students to live <hes> <hes> so if if you want to improve schools then we need to look at at you needs look at curriculum and you need to look at curriculum on delivery and those are those are two very different things that are not the same as testing. Somebody's math undestanding. I could have exemplary understanding of math but my teaching practice. I may need some assistance with the the province says it's undertaking this because of the declining math scores it's seeing these standardized tests and the the latest results do show that less than half of ontario students are earning a.'s or b.'s <hes> what is behind this decline does a variety of things come into play. 'em and we've been saying quite some time and it started audits several years ago under the old government but you know the new government is continuing with a looking at the math curriculum and we have been saying. I say quite some time that that would be a good move that we need to take a look at the curriculum. That's being delivered making sure. It's appropriate making sure it's given students the skills that they need. I think we need to look at making sure we're investing in our classrooms and the oldest supports necessary for the students who sitting in front of us in those students have changed over the years. Our demographics have changed over the years. <hes> the divers to within our classrooms has certainly shifted certainly since five. I began teaching. There's also the fact that i have students in my classroom who may have differing needs and need different instructional techniques. Thanks and sometimes i. I need assistance in making sure i'm able to meet the needs of all the students in my classroom so i think we need to fight all of those pieces in as well. How and you know i i will say just today. The minister taught about looking insuring that new teachers have the the skills to teach math and involved in that each moore appropriate and that they will invest something the government saying they're going to invest in professional development educators that would it be a path. We would see you know if if we're looking at investing in professional development i think that's a great opportunity for teachers but taking the money's in spending them on testing people in a small snapshot in time is not the best way. If we're looking at how can we we improve on student achievement. I wanna point out you mentioned the curriculum. The minister seem much says that the province will be embarking on a curriculum kalam rewrite. He's criticizing the discovery math curriculum that was brought in under the previous government. Do you think there's a problem with that curriculum. No i think he should have been taught for quite some time looking at revamping and that's something that we should do anyway right now. This is the <unk> it's good to on a regular basis. Take a look at curriculum as being delivered. I think with anything else that you can't point to any one thing and say well. That's the reason why thanks out great. There are going to be parents out there who are going to look at these math numbers. You're going to be concerned about their own kids math performance and wonder why they shouldn't know that their teacher has the skills the math skills to bring those kids along. What do you say to those parents. I think what we've always said addis <hes> when when you look at standardized tests you have to remember that's literally a snapshot of maybe two or three day period in one one part of the school year major. It does not give you a full picture have how any student is achieving within a classroom and the best way to look at that is a through dialogue with your child's classroom teacher. I'm be through looking at your students report card because that gives the true overview on look a in that progression throughout that time period. It looks at how the students growing up we'll show you whether weaknesses are we are seeing more jurisdictions turning running away from standardized tests. Why do you think the province is is putting so much weight on these test results. I think because it's it's the political move i mean we have been saying for for decades office since the test came in that this was not a good use of time. It's certainly not a good way to assess student progress an <unk> blatantly just a waste of money. Money's that could be better used within the classroom truly supporting students when you have you know real estate agents using it to say which area is best moved to because because that school performs better at never the way it was supposed to be used maginness. You have a school who looks at their grades six task results and says oh you know australians didn't do so well in math this year so we really need to look what we're doing here. In school. Meanwhile the teachers know the during those two days it was a heat wave and they don't have air-conditioning so yes you'll see dips and valleys sometimes but ah to klina how a school is going to address. Curriculum based on two days in may or june is asinine. Mr appreciate you talking talking with us. Thank you know father. Thank you all right. Bye-bye liz stewart is the president of the ontario english catholic teachers association we reached in in toronto and and and and you don't have to go far to find a historic home of the birthplace of someone important but you have to go to adelaide street in london ontario to find the birthplace of insulin. That's what they call. Banting house. Where sir frederick banting was living thing when he had a middle of the night a pitney that led to the discovery of insulin grant maltman is the curators there and a little while back. He was contacted by nancy harding banting the anti british columbia. She's the widow of sir frederick banting son and she said she had some documents that might be of interest to the museum but as mr moulton maltman told the c._b._c.'s afternoon drive yesterday. It wasn't an easy feat getting them from b._c. To london ontario this is every curator's dream and nightmare on all rolled into wine so she'd mentioned you know she had a couple of speeches a couple of signed documents and a couple of photographs so does she thought we might be interested and i said well. That's fantastic. If you're going through the items perhaps there might be something that you're not aware of that would be important but might be important born to us so i offered to help go through the documents and for her and you could hear the the silence through the email ono and she writes back well. I guess it'll take a little longer to get these items to you because most of that stuff you're asking for. I'm getting ready to send off to the shredder. Yeah and i said yes please. Don't don't i understand it's there's a lot of junk as she said that you wouldn't be interested and i said well. Let us make that decision. Help you and then something happened in transit the rain well. There's there's the nightmare so we reached out to a museum in in british columbia to help pack things up into curry it to us. It was one envelope enveloping four boxes and the envelope arrived overnight as we requested is fantastic email with time change and just saying what what are wonderful photograph this was it was beautiful photograph of sir frederick's first wife marion in her wedding gown with her okay and he just emails back way do you you see the rest of the stuff and dagoes by in two days go by and so we tried to the weekend comes still nothing on the monday and so we started to get concerned and realized that it become lost in transit wow okay so what happened next boats so about two three weeks <hes> working in both ends we had one tracking number and they said well you've got it and we have the item and yes but there's four more boxes and apparently only only one packing label was attached the entire grouping and so ended up in the warehouse in queens or the the warehouse of lost packages is <hes> three weeks later then it came to the door and it was it was like christmas in july w- tell me more about these boxes two hundred pounds archives when the when the <hes> delivery arrive in my office upstairs in here just thud and it was a treasure trove of documents and photographs and objects that really source show a personal site to bandings life with with his son bill. <hes> one of the prizes is a letter was written to dr banting from his sister delivered to his house here in london. So it's the only letter i have in our collection and the only one that i'm aware of the survives from his his london period and it's christmas nineteen twenty and he's just broke up with his fiance and so it's a bit of a conciliatory letter from his from his sister and trying to bring up his spirits and and so what will you be doing with this letter now well with the rest of the documents were busy cataloging them and making sure we get them in the database and really they just starting to to do the research on them and feared where they're going to fit into our exhibited. Research program will be celebrating our one hundredth anniversary in twenty twenty money and so this for sure will be going on display. We might put a little tease wrote this letter specifically before that though that was grant maltman curator of the banting in house national historic site in london ontario he was speaking with jonathan pinto guest host f._c._c. radio's afternoon drive. They mine ricketts vegetable garden was her healing place. Ms ricketts was an architect in florida. After health problems forced her to close her firm. In the late ninety s she spent ten to twelve hours a day in her yard tending to her jalapenos and tomatoes so in two thousand thirteen when the village of miami shores changed changed its zoning bylaws to outlaw vegetable gardens in front yards. Ms ricketts wasn't going down without a fight. She and her husband. Tom carroll spent six years challenging the law and finally earlier this year florida legislature finally passed a law inspired by their efforts. It bends local bands on vegetable gardens her mind ricketts ricketts died this week after a long illness. She was sixty three last month as it happens. Guest host susan bonner spoke to ms ricketts just after the law allowing. I heard a plant vegetables again came into effect. What does this day mean to you. It's a relief that is over. Six years of uncertainty and stress is over. Your battle started in two thousand thirteen when the village of miami shores issued ban against vegetable gardens in front yards. What was the reason behind this then unsensitive property value they believe that they should be able to come in by hosts laid on some grass flip it and sell it for more money. That's what they consider value. Why did the village council sink. It was bad for property values to put vegetables in the front yard because they're shortsighted moronic running because they do not understand what value is to them. Value is money not a lifestyle not preserved in butterflies vs in sick the legacy of their children and grandchildren. They don't consider <hes> that offending value. How did this multi year fight against this ruling. How did it affect. Do you personally personally. I became stressed and l. very ill to the point where i couldn't indeed the garden anymore. I spent most of the time in the hospital surgeries just dealing with major health issues you know so it took the fun in the heel in that i get from my garden so the miami shores ban was upheld through through multiple appeals that that you made. Why didn't you just give up. It was making you sick. It was so hard what did you they had no right and it was folly. It was folly. It's nonsense to say something as stupid as you cannot. Have the females land upfront. You can only have a male if it's not that. There's no food you know. It's like having a saudi arabia garden where the woman should female bearer off. The food stays is just folly. I don't like stupid. Did you. Were actually told you can't plant any plants that are considered female in the front of your home. They may in the plot did not print ford fruit. It could stay as long as you can eat something from the garden you cannot how did it in the front yard but you won eventually by helping to get the state law changed because someone i'd higher level realize that is just turn on prevent someone going vegetables and their front yard someone and was wise enough to see the folly of the arguments will by the lower courts and <hes> in the village and i'm very grateful for that so it was just you know patients stressful dacian <music> but patient that's from july interview with florida gardner hermine ricketts at the time a law she inspired which allows florida residents to plant right vegetables in their front yards had just gone into effect. Ms ricketts died this week. She was sixty three. It's a familiar scam. Someone calls and says you're about to be arrested. Turns out without knowing it. You committed a bad crime drug trafficking trafficking. Let's say maybe some money watering laundering to boot and the sierra or if you're in the states the i._r._s. Is onto your in a really tough spot but first things first i could you confirm your name your address and some important details relating to your bank account recently and north carolina women got a call like that the man on the other end of the line claimed to be officer john black from social security administration but it turns out he dialed a wrong number because he was speaking with an actual police officer sir and stevens and so the hunter became the hunted police captain stevens recorded her call with the scammer. Here's how it sounded now. Go ahead and let me know how many how who owned by you have nothing to do with illegal activities has nothing to do with illegal activities. Do i have to give you my. I tell you how many bank accounts are have you. If you do not tell me how many bank accounts you have still go ahead and suspend all the bank mccown's which are connected to your social security the dock play much. If you lose any money out of a year okay well how does understand you're saying we're giving you my i would like to know what the allegations are against me and what you're going to take out a warrant for that criminal charges against you number one drug trafficking and number two logging well. That's better than the twenty five. The first guy told me were out against me and they hung up on me. They're all scammers. Just hang up on them or have a little fun that was part of an exchange between apex ex police captain and stevens and a scam artist claiming to be an officer himself. The north carolina police department posted the video of that call on facebook to draw attention to the tactics <unk> used by scammers. You've been listening to the as it happens podcast. Our show can be heard heard monday to friday on c._b._c. Radio one and on sirius x._m. Following the world at six you can also listen to the whole show on the web. Just go to c._b._c. dot c._a. Slash a._h. H. and click on the daily full episode link. Thank you for listening. I'm helen ma'am and i'm ron rod survey and run take for more c._b._c. Podcasts go to c._b._c. dot c._a. Slash podcasts.

newfoundland london larry doughy sir frederick banting larry larry boris johnson ontario toronto saint john london hermine ricketts prime minister Tom break european union Tom Josh m._p. mister o'connell
Protecting Each Other

In The Thick

33:02 min | 3 months ago

Protecting Each Other

"Hi this is cara swisher. And i wanna talk to you about my new podcast for the new york times called. If you want to know what people who hold power in our world are really all about you need to hear how they answer the tough questions and that is my specialty and although it might get messy as it always does. It's also going to be really fun. You can get swayed wherever you get your podcasts. New episodes are available. Mondays and thursdays. The thing won't folks to appreciate and understand. Is that covid. Nineteen has been a government crisis in the clothes of a health crisis. Welcome to the thick. This is a podcast about politics. Race and culture from a poc perspective. I might gain a wholesome and today. We have a special guest to close out our year. Joining us from my. Gosh i love michigan. Love ann arbor. Dr abdul el-sayed. He's a physician epidemiologist. He's author of the book healing politics and all round fabulous human beings. So welcome to the show. Thank you so much for having me. I'm really excited to be here. I feel like. I'm sitting in the computer version of my grandmother. Salonen alexandria so that's the vibe. I'm going for right here. oh. I love it. That was like perfect respect okay. What is grandma serving. What are we drinking. Tea or coffee or it'd probably be minty. Yes okay awesome. It'd probably be a selection of different cakes that you picked up from the local bakery. And i would always. I'm not a big drinker. And i didn't really discover coffee until after my grandmother had passed so i would always have raw cane juice that you can get freshly squeezed down the street as ought always pick it up and they'd serve it in this little baggie so it wasn't like it was like a bag you with a straw. That's the field we're going for here. We got it right. I'm so there of course. We are recording this in early december. So just take a note on that listeners. You know things might have changed in the news cycle where assuming that democracy will still have survived. But that's just a no for you. So abdul public health expert the former health commissioner for the city of detroit we are going into a winter. That cdc director. Dr robert redfield has worn. The reality is december. January and february are going to be rough times. I actually believe they're going to be the most difficult. I'm in the public health history of this nation. I'm a survivor. I'm public about that. So i have all kinds of feelings about this because at this point now. Early december win. We're recording this. Two hundred seventy six thousand people more than that have been killed by covid. Nineteen the coronavirus has exposed so many tributes in terms of structural poverty. Racism power black and latino working class communities you know have been devastated and yet also been in this country functioning in your book you write quote one of the abiding truisms in epidemiology is that the poor will always suffer more and worse. Yeah so we're clearly seeing this. A lot of us are thinking about the vaccine and what the vaccine looks like when we're thinking of the context of structural inequality and racism. So give us your sense. A lot of people are like okay with there is a light at the end of the tunnel. Yes but i'm more circumspect. We're still in this for the long haul. But i don't know you tell me. How should we be feeling about what's happening right now while i'll tell you this we didn't have to be here. And when we think about an epidemic and what creates an epidemic. I want folks to understand that while a virus is naturally and there's very little you can do to stop the epidemic or the pandemic that follows is a function of the choices we as a society make both before that virus emerges while virus is spreading and after that virus has taken its toll and right now. I'm feeling some kind of way about the choices that we have made the choices and that we are making. And i am optimistic about the potential for a vaccine and what a vaccine could do to halt the near exponential spread of this virus. But at the same time. Right when i look at all that has come before it. And the fact that we could not as a society invest in any sort of collective action right to bring down this virus. We could not come together. We could not see each other as worthy of our protection by doing something as simple as wearing a mask. We could not invest in the means of public health. I'm really quite worried. And i'm really frustrated. And so this virus. I think tells us something about ourselves as a society and what we need to do to be able to truly and deeply empower low income people and people of color and rough and do so in a way that brings us together around stopping the next one because if we don't there's nothing stopping another virus from emerging another pandemic from happening. I mean we think this is sort of a once every century thing. But that's just not how it works. There is literally no reason why any viruses out there like look you know. Corona virus came this year. So we'll wait a century until the next one emerges right and we've got to get some things right before serious about protecting folks there. Was this interesting tweet. That i want to mention from anna press. Loose represents half my town in massachusetts. That's right so she wrote black lives. Matter also means one any vaccine must have efficacy for those with high blood pressure and diabetes to priority distribution to communities hardest hit by covid nineteen three strategy to combat black-americans vaccine fears and skepticism. Because of the ski experiment et cetera. Those are facts. that's for real absolutely in cosign. And we forget that there's a difference between a vaccine and a vaccination right a vaccine is the existence of a thing that can create an immune response in your body that supports you. Then the next time you're exposed to a virus but that's theoretical thing. A vaccine is not a vaccination until someone chooses to put it in their arms and that includes all of the logistics to get it out to communities all the social and cultural work to empower people to understand what the circumstances are why they in their families ought to take it the political work of engaging with validates entrusted folks within certain communities so that they can be understanding the work that went into this and why they should be telling their supporters in the folks around them to take it and then the conversation. That happens around people taking it itself right because it's not just what you hear from folks you see on tv or folks you see a church. It's also what you hear from. You know the the down the street or the guy who just his vaccine because he works as a paramedic at the hospital and what they tell you about their experience and so we've got to get all of those things right. If we want the vaccine to be taken up actually have the efficacy that we know it potentially theoretically can have but only if those vaccines turn into vaccinations. I love the fact that he just said. I wouldn't either just letting you know. Also that now. We understand the difference between vaccine and vaccination. It's a big thank. You go the what a great way to. This is anchoring the end of the year in a letter. We're going to be so smart at the end of the year. I know seriously but abdul one of the things he tweeted about earlier. This month is how. In addition to wearing masks and distancing we federal action which is another covid relief. Bill and in your book you write that vaccines and antibiotics have historically reduced. Infectious disease mortality. But before we had them for example in the early nineteen hundreds it was actually sanitation systems. Laws that support attendants. Large-scale extermination efforts. That provided safety. These are all quote collective public actions and you write in the book quote. They require a competent government. That is well funded and empowered to act for the benefit of all. Okay so we're in two thousand twenty america and we're moving into twenty twenty one. We have witnessed a trump administration that it was just incompetent during this pandemic. There's no other way to put this. We're almost a year in. We're still seeing the undermining of the seriousness of covid nineteen and debates about simple collective action which is wearing masks. And you kind of mentioned already but what hope is there for us as a country when the next public health crisis comes along if we can't even get people to wear a piece of fabric on their face. What type of boll collective action is needed to help us heal from this. Yeah who you're asking the really critical question here. And the thing i want folks to appreciate and understand is that covid. Nineteen has been a government crisis in The close of a health crisis. Yeah it's true and the fact of the matter is that you have this virus. And like i told you. A virus is naturally occurring but a pandemic is a function of human choices and our government. Right is that instrument that we a democratic society and trust to make decisions on behalf of all of us and what we've seen over the past forty years most intensely but frankly over a long period of time is a decline in public trust in government a decline in the capacity for government to take on in marshall public resources to solve big problems and a politics that has almost assaulted the notion of government itself. I want to clarify something here because a lot of folks sort of think of government is politics. Those aren't the same thing right. Politics is the process by which we make decisions about scarce resources. We allocate the leaders of government but government is the entire infrastructure underneath them. And what this moment has shown us is that government cannot operate without a politics that is consistent about a set of very basic things the notion that we should act equitably for everyone The fact that science should be leading us the notion that we should not be dividing people in a moment of national crisis. And so when. I talk about covid. Nineteen is a crisis of government. It's not because the tens of thousands of literally millions of people who work every day making government work it's because our politics is failing to deliver them people who empower them to do the things that we need to do to take collective actions to protect all of us in moments when we cannot protect ourselves right and it's a fallacy to think that in the middle of a pandemic protect yourself. Yes where a mass that does protect you but if all of us wear masks that's all of us protecting each other and the fact that our politics weren't there to recognize that this was a real crisis that we needed to be acting together in this moment that you know going out to bars in restaurants and clubs might be a bad idea when there's a huge pandemic wave hitting us and that we should act responsibly. Because it's really a lot more important that our five year olds and ten year olds. Get to go to school than it is that we get to go and have a drink at a bar. Government is supposed to be a collective resource that empowers those decisions and unfortunately it was not there to do that. And now at this point two hundred seventy six thousand people and the cases and the deaths are climbing and so this is really a crisis of government rather than simply a health crisis. I really appreciate the fact that you as a physician bring such passion to your work. I don't think you know this. My father was from your team. He was a nerdy nerd. Mexican doctor who became an md but then dedicated his life to research. and help to create the cochlear implant. May he rest in peace. Yeah yeah he was deep at the university of chicago. So i'm a mid westerner just like you that's amazing to hear about your father. That's big about how many people can hear. I mean literally. We were doing this podcast. The only way i'm interacting with you is because i hear you and you hear me and there are millions of people literally millions of people who get the benefit. Because your dad did the work that he did. I'll on and can hear something like this taking a moment i've met some of them I appreciate that doctor to doctor. Doctors daughter is so sweet. Love it you know. My dad also in many ways connected medicine with politics. Yeah you did too because in two thousand eighteen. You ran for the governor of michigan. Yeah you didn't win but in your book you write about the stories. That people told you while you're on the campaign trail and you say quote. I love that parallel between medicine and politics. That people unburden themselves to you in hopes that you might help. I would say become a journalist. You can add that to because people unburden themselves. It is in fact a question of vulnerability and empathy in terms of opening up and receiving that you talk about the people that you met who you know had been failed by so many systems. And when you're running for governor of michigan you proposed a statewide single payer healthcare plan and so during this pandemic also. Millions of people have lost their jobs. We can't forget that. And while some have gotten coverage through the affordable care act. Others many of them remain uninsured. So how hopeful are you in terms of the biden harris administration. I mean we're very hopeful. Because they believe in science start that helps but that's a pretty low bar so true. So how do we kind of understand what's going to happen with the biden harris administration when it comes to healthcare when we're doing our jobs well whether it's in politics or in journalism or in medicine it's not just about the technical feet it's about all of the life that opens up to somebody. That's the thing that you think about. What a competent government can do right. In the case of the biden harris administration it means that potentially hundreds of thousands of people look to next thanksgiving or next holiday season and their families are more whole than they might have been without that. And it's those small things that fabric of life that you don't always pay attention to that. I think we don't connect to whether or not you have competent government or great researchers who are looking for new ways to empower people to hear or a politics that brings people together around the things that we can do so when it comes to healthcare we think about this as super hard to understand system and yes it is a very complex system that's challenging and sometimes really hard to understand but the whole goal here is to allow people to get the healthcare that they need when they need it without having to worry about whether or not that would bankrupt them or whether or not they're going to get substandard care and a lot of folks who know my work know that i believe deeply medicare for all. I ran on a single payer system. I've got a book coming out. In a couple of months about medicare for all and at the same time. I don't see medicare for all as being mutually exclusive to other efforts to create more and better and more affordable healthcare and i had the privilege of sitting on the bernie sanders joe biden task force where we came together to think about how to make the now. President elect healthcare platform more robust especially in the context of a pandemic. That had just really hit us in the first wave and so we came together. In june july after he had secured the nomination back in march and between march and june was that first big wave of covid nineteen. And so what we did was. We came forward with a plan that increases the public footprints in healthcare through a public option. That is really quite robust. That reduces the corporate power over our healthcare system by empowering the centers for medicare and medicaid to negotiate prescription drug prices on behalf of every single american and centers equity. Because if you are black or brown in this country you are more likely to be uninsured. You are less likely to get access to the healthcare. You need when you need it. And your life expectancy is liable to be five to ten years shorter than if you weren't black or brown and we need to center that in every discussion that we have in terms of being able to deliver right what it is that we're actually looking to deliver to people which is access to a long healthy life where you can enjoy those basic subtleties the existence of the people around you and the joy that they bring you because in the end. That's what good government and good healthcare should do and i just want to share a little personal side of me. Both my children are type. One diabetics And their biggest advocate. Is you know as their mother and people that have met my wife. She is passionate and she advocates for kids. And i sit here and we always talk about this all the time we say. What about the people. That can't advocate for people with preexisting conditions and have to pay three hundred dollars for a vial of insulin It's so free ferry the stories that we have about my family fighting insurance companies just to get insulin and care for our children and i sit back. And i'm like we have the privilege right. I can't even begin to think about the people that have language issues. Socio economic issues like racism and they don't know the system and it just seems to be like being human about this. This is sarah kane. Host the serial. Podcast i wanna tell you about our new show nice white parents. Reporter hana joffe. Walt spent years looking into this one middle school in her neighborhood. She investigated the school's history and finally realized she could put a name to the unspoken force that kept getting in the way of making the school. Better white parents. How white parents can mess things up for everyone else without even knowing it. Nice white parents made by cyril productions a new york times company. You can find it wherever you get your podcasts. Just to continue on this for a little bit. Do you think that progressives trying to fight for health care that it does get lost in all this and a lot of ways that have to keep fighting abdul like. How do you fight through that to get to that. Healthcare is a human right. I'll tell you two stories that i hope per helpful and the first. Is that the guy who discovered. Insulin was a canadian surgeon. His name is frederick banting and when they went to go sell the patents he sold it for a buck right and you said insulin doesn't belong to me. It belongs to the world exactly and imagine. That's the guy who developed the right shoulder reminds me of your daddy. He's someone who did the work because he wanted to empower people to live their long healthiest lives and now we've assented in our society to a healthcare system that you have to fight rain exactly right that you have to fight to get what you want out of. It shouldn't have to be a fight to get something as simple as the ability to live your life and know that the medicine you fundamentally need to be able to actually stay alive will be there for you in the richest most powerful country in the world. Yes i think. The thing that folks don't wait here is that our system has become so dominated by a number of corporations that tell us that any change to the status quo would make things even worse that in effect the challenges that they've created in our healthcare system they have told us is the best can get. Yeah i think about a woman. I interviewed for my podcast. Her name was lisa. Her husband had had a brain cancer and he was. I think thirty at the time and now he has to get regular is every quarter to make sure that it hasn't recovered and those are really expensive but three years later she had a freak form of art attack a really uncommon in people in their thirties but she had this form of heart attack that tends to hit younger women. It's really uncommon but she almost died and they were already paying the debt from the insurance companies. The quote unquote deductibles. That you have to pay the pay wall. You have to pay to get accident insurance. You already paid for right right. And she was talking about. How the worst part of her experience almost dying in an emergency room was having a fight with the insurance companies to get the payments. They needed was medical bills from eight different hospitals or facilities and everybody wants their money. And even if it's only one hundred dollars a month for each medical facility that's eight hundred dollars a month and that's not something that we plan for and this is someone who is insurers through her husband's employer right. I mean it just a status quo. That is failing so many people and zach lowe. You don't have to live this way. We don't have to take this as normal. We shouldn't have to be in a situation where you got to worry about whether or not you're advocating hard enough against some corporations who ceo makes tens of millions of dollars denying new. The care that you paid for it to have a product called insurance insurance is sure it is absurd. Well it's like when you have with us insurance is supposed to be there when you need it the most. Oh just kidding sorry when we disappear but you know another part that i love about your book is how you take all of what you've observed and you come at it from epidemiological perspective. You dig deeper into the underlying issues like the symptoms and how they spread and what you land on is and i'm quoting the epidemic of insecurity fellow that phrase. This is something you say that both rich and poor americans experience though in different ways right and you experience insecurity in almost every aspect of our lives from health to our finances the water we consume even our ability to vote to determine our future. So can you tell us more about this epidemic of insecurity and how it impacts every aspect of americans lives. I want to tell you how i came to this. I saw epidemiology is a science of contrast and as a third culture kid. I grew up in a house where my father was in egyptian immigrant. And my step. Mom who raised me was the daughter of the american revolution and we talk about code switching all the time right but like i was co translating from a very young age. Just like this is what he means. This is what she means. Right i totally feel you on that definitely. You know exactly where i'm coming from. Yeah and so. It's sort of like. It was a natural thing. When i found out that and i was like this. Science is about contrast it's about understanding what happens on either side of these divides what it tells us about how things happened in the first place and then you know when i ran for office. I thought that the conventional wisdom would be true that if i was traveling and communities like detroit or flint where you have predominantly black communities that the things they'd be talking about would be so different than what you might see in a place like us coda or petoskey role predominantly white parts of the state. When i went to these communities right it turned out that people might use different language but they were talking about the same issues. Why in the richest most powerful country in the world. Do i have to worry about what's going to happen if my kid gets sick. Why does my kids school look exactly like. It did thirty years ago when i went there. Now why is it that in a state that is defined by its freshwater. Can't we get fresh water out to every single person and address this water crisis in flint michigan. Bright like these are the questions people are asking and so my goal with this book was to take down the veil of segregation that has kept us from understanding appreciating that the challenges that we tend to face are the same and that the only way around taking them on is identifying the pathology i corps and when i talk about this epidemic of insecurity what i mean is this objective of anxiety and fear that too. Many americans have about their future right. That is a function of a forty year governing consensus in this country that tells us that basic public goods are better provided by large corporations has led to a chipping away of very systems that we rely upon to provide us the means of a dignified life good schools good housing good healthcare clean air clean water the right to vote the ability to rely on our economy. Deliver you a job that pays a good wage and allows you to afford the basic trappings of life in your community like these things are slipping away from people and it has led us to this anxiety and this anxiety has power because it leaves us thinking that we cannot get any better than it was back then and that the reason we don't have is because someone else mythical other in a place down the road does have and we see how this gets played up by demagogues who fear mongering to retain their power and maintain the system that exists. Let's move on to our final segment which we call seen been they had us or basically no bullshit or as you know. Ho- says no bullshit nobuyoshi of do we've lived through an election with record turnout. Which is amazing. Twenty twenty in the middle of pandemic overall more than a hundred and fifty. Six million americans voted and president-elect biden got more votes than any other candidate in the history of this country and michigan obviously has been in the headlines. The trump campaign has been filing baseless. Not even like the word. I would want to use that comes to my bullshit. Voter fraud lawsuits to disenfranchise. Black voters in detroit even after they have voted when it came to certifying the result. The two republican members on wayne county's board of canvassers. I refused then. they did. Vote to certify then try to resend their votes in one even said she would certify the votes and i'm quoting from communities other than the city of detroit and remember in early december. There was this video of trump campaign witness. Melissa krone yet went viral on social media. And so this is melissa. Row and being questioned by a republican state lawmaker at one of those election hearings. The poll book is completely off completely off. I'd say that poll book is off by over a hundred thousand. That paul book. Why don't you look at the registered voters on there. How many registered voters are on there. Did you do you even know the answer to that. I guess i'm trying to get to the bottom zero zero so my question then is if the many wait. What about what about how. What about the turnout. Rate a hundred and twenty percent. Let's let's representative johnson. Ask plastic question so the poll book number. There's two things that could happen here either. The poll book number if bounce continental multiple times. There's two options option number one. Is that the poll book. Numbers are not going to match. They don the actual not by thousand thousands of boats. That's not what we see right now. Think okay so. You're familiar with michigan politics. I am well. The whole country is really looking and studying michigan. You're super familiar with detroit. You know there's a story in your book about a yemeni grandfather who voted for the first time because he finally saw you running as governor. He said okay. I'm gonna do this. Because i see myself. So people turning out to vote for the first time like. That's a good thing. A great thing in in michigan for sure but cut through all of this trump campaign noise for us with no bullshit. What really happened in michigan during the twenty twenty election we turn out especially in detroit. I mean we had a free and fair election. It went in a way that republicans didn't want and they tried to flip the table right. Like when i was a kid i remember you play a hard game or wargame with a friend right and you'd always have that one kid who just flip the table. If they didn't win you like yo. What are yes and the problem here right. Is that in this case. You've got a situation where these people have been aided and abetted by a president who simply has run the country with his own narcissism front and center. It's just really sad to see. I mean honestly. I got to tour my stay. And they're amazing people out here in this state and unfortunately we've got folks like this joker who are now implicitly representing us in the national eye. Detroiters they care a lot about their democracy and detroit. One of the largest majority black cities in dealers majority black city in the country eighty percent black american and i remember visiting polling places on election day when i ran and you had long lines and i remember talking to an older woman and asking her. Why didn't you vote. Absentee vote absentee. She said son. You know how many people fought for my right to stand in this line. Yeah i'm here to cast my vote for them and he hit me at that moment. You read about these fights for voting rights in the history books and she was reminding me that that history is real and present today and what we're seeing people like melissa corona what. We're seeing a lot of people like donald trump it is voter suppression in twenty twenty. Speak right when you say. I'm not going to certify votes from detroit. What you're saying is. I don't think that it's important to enfranchise black people and we've got to do the work of translating exactly what they're saying for the folks in the back who might be missing it right. This is about twenty twenty or twenty first century voter intimidation and suppression. And we've got to stand up and say that everybody's vote counts that this was a free and fair election that a country that is founded on a notion of democracy that this is what makes america america. You can't say that you believe in america without saying that you believe in a democratic process. That's just that yeah it's insulting to. It's like insulting to anyone that votes this whole notion of like. Why did this happen in detroit. How did this happen in detroit. I mean sorry. I just go off. Ramp they're open your eyes. Open your eyes. And you know what. Dr abdul el-sayed author of the book healing politics. You help to open our eyes so thank you so much for all of your work for being so vogel for being so passionate about the work that you do whether it's in politics or in medicine. Thank you so much for joining me on this episode of in the thick. Well buddy i thank you for your work. Julio thank you. I'm grateful to spend some time with you all. I hope everybody staying warm staying healthy and epidemiologist has to remind everybody please wear a mask socially distance and let's get through to next year and know that we'll have a holiday where everyone is with us because we have lost anyone on the way and twenty twenty one. That's what i wanna do. That would be a goal with you. Remember you wear the mask because you love other people. Yeah that's the point. You wear the mask because you love other people. Thank you so much. Thank you. I really appreciate your wholesome and i'm julia gala. Remember dear listener to go to apple podcasts. To rate and review is because if you didn't do it all year now come on. This is your last chance so it for twenty twenty because it really does help us remember. You can listen to in the on pandora spotify wherever you choose to get your podcast on. Check us out on the web in the dot. Org follow us on twitter and instagram at in the thick show like us on facebook. And tell your friends and family to listen in the biggest produced by nicole rothwell noor saudi and harstad hotta with support eric dill day. Our audio engineering team is stephanie. Loboda julia caruso lia lee eat tube and gabriela says try saying that feinstein are digital editors. Do not thanks to bits for recording me. The music you heard is courtesy of nacional. Kept easy record dear listener. We'll see you on our next episode. Which is going to be in the new year. Yeah let's do it out to what is going to be happening and we're going to be right there with you. Twenty twenty one have a beautiful end of the year. We love you so much basic those seat. Those jeff stay safe. Everybody piece if i'm closing out the year i'm welcoming the next so exactly you are closing out our shit year so this is a very special show. Here we go the opinions expressed by the guests and contributors in this podcast are their own and do not necessarily reflect the views of voter media or its employees.

biden harris administration Dr abdul el michigan cara swisher Salonen alexandria Dr robert redfield detroit medicare Infectious disease mortality new york times bernie sanders joe biden hana joffe ann arbor cyril productions frederick banting cdc abdul high blood pressure
The insane, surprising history behind insulins crazy price (and some hopeful signs in the wild)

An Arm and a Leg

26:36 min | 1 year ago

The insane, surprising history behind insulins crazy price (and some hopeful signs in the wild)

"Adalina <unk> b._a. Went to bed without dinner a few weeks ago. It's the thing she does sometimes not because you can't afford food because she can't afford insulin. She's a type one diabetic and if she skips dinner she can skip a dose and be pretty sure she'll look through the night so that way i can save enough until i get my next paychecks that i could also afford lord my rent my car note this that leads twenty five and she does not have to do this kind of thing as often as she did right after college when she was interning with a startup now she works at a law firm and it's a good job with health insurance but there's a deductible so in june. She is still paying for insulin herself about three hundred and fifty dollars every four weeks. Abilene has known since she was a teenager that the price of insulin was gonna play a major role in her life after dad died. We didn't really have health insurance. You know so oh me and my mom would go to the c._b._s. And they're like you know for her insulin. It's going to be three thousand dollars it. It was so heartbreaking. I think that's when i really realized oh like i'm on my own like this wasn't something her mom could really protect her from not for for the rest for life her mom found the money it was not easy and from then on it was a scramble credit cards help from relatives from nonprofits whatever it took and since adelines been on her own. She's always found a way including skipping doses skipping meals which isn't really safe. People die every year. Insulin for diabetics is like oxygen for us. We need it if we don't have it. We're not going to be able to live until the next day. It's really that simple and that's how i tried to explain it to people and one out of every four type. One diabetics rations their insulin. It is hundreds of of thousands of people <hes> this old school technology insulin was discovered almost one hundred years ago like canadian scientists who didn't even want to patent. It just wanted people to have him. That story is told in an amazing book called the discovery discovery of insulin. Every especially scrappy naive researchers swatting away flies nee sweltering added leading the trail of dead dogs and that story has a ton to tell us about how we got to this point and where we might go from here may not be entirely hopeless. This is an arm and leg show about the cost of healthcare. I'm dan weiss. <music> life before insulin was stark. Here's jeanne lou. He's a doctor and harvard researcher who studies access to insulin through the nineteen twenties type one diabetes with that sentence starvation in the midst of plenty kind of a rough way to die yeah unquenchable thirst constant hunger and rapid wasting frequent <hes> bonus symptoms include blindness itching thing and boyle's boyle's all accompanied by non stop peeing in greek diabetes means pipe like liquid goes in one end and out the other an english surgeon in the sixteen hundreds called it the pissing evil and the urine is full of sugar in addition to having profound thurs drinking a lot of water. You're peeing all the time. Your urine was sweet. So doctors confirmed your diagnosis with a taste test early. Twentieth century medicine had exactly one treatment for extending the lives of diabetics slowly starving them to death. It was unbelievably grim. I find myself pausing in lake wiping away tears reading about <hes> you know for example all small nearly blind boy whose wasting away initiated who they could not figure out despite a very very very very stringent jin starvation diet why he was still having glucose in his urine and it turns out that he was eating the bird feed from his pet. You know that's like crazy. How can we do got to people and that was the state of the art treatment. Yeah and starvation only worked for so long enter a struggling country country doctor frederick banting seeriously struggling. He hung out his shingle in july nineteen twenty and got no patients for weeks months went by he worried his fiancee. They would break up with him. Then one night banting got an idea he hoped could give him his big break finding a treatment for diabetes and he stayed up till two a._m. Thinking about it at the time. Scientists thought something the pancreas might help diabetes but something else in the pancreas they thought interfered and banding had this complicated idea for isolating a good stuff. Take a bunch of dogs make some of them diabetic by removing their pancreases then raid the pancreases cases of the other dogs using a dicey untested surgical protocol that banding or got in mind to isolate the good stuff they made a tv mini series about the discovery coverage of insulin in the nineteen eighties. It shows banting telling a friend about his idea. Make an extract from this pancreas and pop fat into the diabetic doc now if diabetic dogs blood sugar goes down a week after his sleepless night fred banting was at the university of toronto pitching a big time professor of physiology he i said gimme a lab a salary and some dogs the professor thought banning was kind of a rube and his idea was going to half-baked but maybe not entirely worthless bliss so the professor said no salary but come back next summer you can have some dogs and maybe a medical student to help a may seventeenth nineteen twenty one banting banting and that student assistant cut open their first dog in the next two three months and killed a bunch of dogs some from diabetes but mostly incompetent incompetent veterinary surgery the movie does a great job showing them literally sweating it out fans going no shirts flies everywhere and just fumbling butchering another dog. James louis shot cofre sake. No girl dog dies. It'll long long pause. Assistant gets up slowly walks over means against a glass cabinet full app stuff killed anything before so much for that cabinet but for all that they did produce <unk> some blood test results that showed promise hints that the stuff they were getting from dog pancreas might not be a total bust so they got more dogs by hook or by crook going out and i'm buying them on the street from well probably talk napper's and as summer ended they managed to keep a diabetic dog alive for three weeks the game on the university to buy them some more talks and in the next couple of months they learn they've been taking the long way round. There was no no need to get the pancreatic good stuff from surgically treated dogs. You can just go to the stockyard. Get some fresh cow. Pancreas pig could work to grind it up and go the next a more experienced guide joined the team. A biochemist named james column within a couple of months cobb had nailed down a method for making king insulin. It's a big the mini series really plays and then the moment the team try this stuff out on a human subject fourteen year old kid who's down to skin and bones and and it brought the kids blood sugar down to normal levels they tried it on six patients good results and so a few months later less than a year after fred banting canting coat open his first dog they present at a big medical conference and everyone they're completely loses their mind but by then there were some problems for a couple of months. That's bring could not get a decent batch of insulin made call up. The biochemist was beside died himself. You'd think recapturing. It would be easy especially for me. I saw held it in my hands and and there were other problems too behind the scenes banting got convinced that the more experienced scientists on the team trying to hog all the glory he may have beaten up called the biochemist. Maybe twice and meanwhile there's all these diabetics starving themselves to death and a u._s. u._s. Pharma company ally lily had been tracking the insulin research in toronto for months sweet talking the researchers at every opportunity and the toronto scientists had had been putting lilly off all this time they did not want their discovery to become someone's commercial enterprise but they needed someone with resources bigger lapse apps more capital to take insulin over the finish line so reluctantly the researchers called. Eli lillian said let's make a deal and the rest you could say is grim corporate history the deal the toronto researchers made with lily was supposed. Let's be limited way to get some insulin tear. Toronto figured out a way to get more insulin for everybody got an exclusive license to make and sell insulin but just north american just free but a year was enough to give alive every such a headstart no u._s. Company could catch up and i did the the other two companies that sell insulin today or european and they also got the basic science directly from the toronto researchers in that first year lilly made improvements to the insulin making process patentable improvements trade secrets and then over the next few decades. They went on to improve insulin itself these early products are quite rudimentary because you know they were large amounts of volume of liquid. You'd have to inject into into your let's say the fat just <hes> by your by your belly button <hes> or on your thighs and you'd have to do that multiple times a day and and you know because of impurities you might have injection site reactions <hes> inflammation and pain that may come from the fact that <hes> who knows what's in this ground up pancreas you know modern insulin is a completely different thing. We're not going to to stockyards anymore. Looking for animal pancreases these are all synthesized <hes> <hes> these are more like designer insulin's. They've been really modified at a molecular level. It's cool stuff. It's super cool stuff and there there are multiple nobel well prizes in physiology and medicine that have made this happen. The modern insulin is not new anymore. Lillies this product. Huma log came out in nineteen ninety-six. Some modern insulin isn't even under patent protection. So why isn't there generic insulin jing luo says basically they're easier things to knock off. Insulin is harder to make than regular tylenol and it's in a special class of drugs for which the f._d._a. Requires especially stringent and especially expensive testing and then there's this even though the active ingredient of brand name insulin may not have changed there have been big changes and improvements to drug delivery systems like wearable insulin pumps patients like these pumps a lot better than shooting shooting up with a syringe in the belly button and the dosing steadier which means safer and there are a million patents involved in making insulin that works with those devices once you add all these different layers to this thing to the medicine itself companies can stack dozens of patents and on top of each other to try to thwart generic competition because they can say look. We've got three patents on the active ingredient. We've got patents on the medical uses of the active ingredient. We've got patents on a non active excipient associated with this ingredient radiant. We've got multiple patents on the devices and so you who are trying to enter the space. We'll see you for patent infringement on all of them. Jing luo says this is standard with big pharma pretty much everything when you listen to these c._e._o.'s pharma companies being interviewed at c._n._b._c. You know like what about junior competition in for this product and they'll just keep saying no no. We've got this really robust patent portfolio. We can withstand any challenge. We're going to tie in court forever and don't worry about it. We're gonna continue view this gravy boat for a long long time. That's the way they reinsure investors but the upshot is hundreds of thousands of people can't afford the insulin they they need to live which is why jing luo finds the book about insulin's discovery so move. We've come so far and yet we you still have adults dying from ration their insulin because of cost like it's it's it's so disheartening <hes> so this story started with a group of scrappy underresourced researchers searchers and it turns out there is a group of exactly the same kind of people working on the problem of expensive insulin today in oakland california. That's right after this brick. An arm leg is a co production of public road productions and kaiser health news nonprofit newsroom. The covers healthcare in america kaiser health news not not affiliated with a giant healthcare provider kaiser permanente. We'll have a little more on them at the end of this episode. Also i wanna tell you about a new podcast. It's from kirk. It's called by the show explores the hidden stories behind how we design the world we live in and what we learned when those designs fail the first season. It's called utopian and is hosted by avery truffle man. She is one of my personal favorite storytellers and see actually makes a cameo on this show in this episode suit but forty five seconds from right now in nice try every investigate some of the world's most fascinating communities like enclosed bubble of environmentalists and a nineteenth century religious sect became household brandt. I just listened to that one so crazy soak it. These are gripping being forgotten stories on the very human urge to build the perfect place. You can subscribe to nice try for free today on apple podcasts or wherever you get podcasts okay since twenty fifteen volunteer researchers at the open insulin project in oakland had been working on a recipe for insulin with the goal of sharing that recipe as widely as possible. I mean in an age where it's possible to three. D print an actual house. Yeah really google it. Why can't we figure out how to make our own insulin. The project runs out of counter culture labs. That is a micro biology maker space in what sounds sounds like a kind of anarchist community center producer avery trump woman lives and works nearby and she very kindly went to check it out so i just baked liked up from my house to telegraph avenue to shattuck to omni commons which is a collective of collective. It's totally really awesome. It's like a very cool place <hes> and in its in this big beautiful building in the have a theater and <hes> food not bombs is here and and a lot of other organizations and it's pretty funny that this is the place where it goes down avery met the project's founder anthony franco anthony ed. Hey every nice to meet you letting me come crash. Anthony is a type one diabetic. He is not trained as a biochemist. He's a computer science guy and he doesn't have consulting assaulting with those skills to stay afloat and he devotes the rest of his time to open insulin. This is a lab with murals on the walls and a bike rack by the door. One of the other projects here is an effort to make decent vegan cheese and even the fanciest lab equipment like a super cold refrigerator has quirks. It's kind of funny because it does look like a bridge at like <hes>. I don't know house with a lot of people in like there's lots of different link wishlist his handwriting and it's it feels very homey. It doesn't feel like a science fridge but it feels like a communal science fridge either. You don't kind of have to feel like you're. You're on a movie set. That has the ideal of science. You can do real science and just kind of do what you need to do and what anthony he wants to do. In this funky little app is to address the enormous problem profit-driven medicine starting with this and i think there's really broad acknowledgement that something something really terrible is wrong with this system but we just have to have the courage to name it and to propose turnips later. I get to ask anthony some questions about their progress. He says after four years they've got a process. That's producing a little bit of insulin. Next steps refined that process publish it and help other other people learn to do it. It's somewhere in the ballpark of what it takes to brew really good beer so i don't think it's something that most people can't do but it does require are you to put the time in and the attention to get right so this would be a like a homebrew beer kit france. Yeah i mean it might be a little bit more like what you would defined in a microbrewery then like a homebrew kit. He thinks a neighborhood operation. Maybe in a storefront or a clinic or even a pharmacy could serve a local community. You kind of like a craft brewery. They're starting to think about the practicalities. They've recruited some pro bono lawyers. They're forming committees dr bylaws for a tax exempt nonprofit nonprofit jing luo the harvard researcher would expect the craft brewery model to hit a regulatory brick wall. You can't make enough of it in a sterile enough condition chen at capacity in order to get the f._d._a. Who's going to inspect your plan to say okay. I'm going to approve you. This is not homeopathic treatments that you can just sell it the farmers market because of the d. a. and the f._d._a. <hes> they would just shut you down. Here's a different perspective. John petco is a professor at colorado state. Who's written about oakland's open open insulin project. He's kind of a fan claim him as an ally. He's also skeptical about getting f._d._a. Approval for open source craft brewed insulin but he's he's got his own idea bypassing the f._d._a. Just like you don't need the liquor commission's okay to drink the beer you brew at home. You don't need the f._d._a.'s permission to make your own insulin. There is nothing that prevents a patient from manufacturing a drug for himself. You know you can inject yourself which whatever you want what he imagined sounds even simpler at least for the user than a homebrew kit for beer yell level of complexities more bright meshing tool for making incident. I mean that's what's the level of complexity that we're talking about. He tried raising money last year to get a project going. Put out a youtube video but it didn't take off you only collected one hundred ninety seven dollars half of it from his teenage. Kids just gave you money from their allowance to do. It was cool did you. Did you give it back since you're not yeah i asked anthony to franco at the open insulin project how he would deal with the f._d._a. Well that's that's. That's a good question. I mean all of these questions of what this count says in terms of regulation are as far as i know open questions were eagerly awaiting the opinions indians from our legal counsel. I asked him how sure he is. They'll get it working and practical will was the deadline <hes> fair question. Meanwhile diabetics diabetics die rationing their insulin every year and last year. I really took in about three billion dollars insulin so it sounds like the score is e reliability three billion scrappy researchers zero so far as wrapping up season one of the show i i got an email with the subject line. I am part of a movement news from terry lyman. She's a type one diabetic in arizona. He does not make grown insulin but she has hacked together an artificial pancreas panam begin to tell you how different life is with it then it was without i would never wanna be without it. Her pancreas it uses open source software that ties together an insulin pump and glucose monitor together. They monitor her blood sugar and gifford just the right amount of insulin to keep a healthy level. Her rig uses an out of date pump like from two thousand and two and a similarly clearly old glucose monitor. That's tackle and a little thing. She pulls out of what i think is an eye glasses case while we're talking faced. This rig is a computer that little thing there. This is the communication board it looks. This is like this is like a raw motherboard from this is what the inside of my computer if i took it upon exactly that's the brain that little silver thing. That's the communications. That's where all the antennas are because it's got wifi since she put her system together the the company medtronic has come out with a machine that does similar things her doctor keeps asking her if she would like to switch she keeps telling him no so that new pompous hugely expensive and it it doesn't do half what does she has customized her system to give her more information hour by hour day by day about how her body processes glucose glucose insulin and more control. It took a lot of work. I built my system over the course of a year. I was learning how to program computers shooters. I mean that process for me was long and slow. I'm fifty three. I am not a spring chicken and learning to code is tough. She succeeded because the other people out there doing the same thing a community a movement even though it was hard every time ahead question every time i needed help. There was somebody online who could answer my question or could tell me where to read it. No you're on the wrong page. Go to dispatch no. You don't do it that way. You do it this way. She shows me the real time readouts her blood sugar insulin levels all kinds of things i tell her the whole thing seems pretty overwhelming and it is a lot of commitment but diabetes isn't for the week in the community around these tools is bigger than when she started the tools are easier to use. She says the big medical companies haven't taken legal action to stop them. They called us names. The big ones were rogue cowboy hackers. That was one slur which we were around cowboy hackers. That is exactly what anthony franko wants to be for insulin. It's what fred banting woods we need rhode cowboy hackers to combat or at least complement the eli lilly's of the world and there are other ways to be part of a movement. Remember adhaline will be from the beginning of our show. She has started volunteering with group called t. one international the advocates for type one when diabetics around the same time. She talked with me. She told her story to more than a dozen members of congress at an event in washington d._c. And i hope that i can help 'cause sparkin american create a change me to climb on an arm and a leg by medical device is spying on me for for my insurance company so they can deny me coverage now. It's like a bilateral swear on this. <hes> what what are you talking about. You can find links to a bunch of stuff about insulin prices on our website and even more in our newsletter including pictures from the open insulin project and notes from a listener but what she does to make sure she's got enough excellent anthem some other stuff you can sign up an arm and a leg show. Dot cops slash newsletter catch you there so then to carry yourself. This episode was produced by me down weisman. Our editor is whitney. Henry lester are consulting. Managing producer is daisy rosario. Our music is by dave winer and blue sessions. Adam raimondo is our audio wizard. Our intern is daniel fernandez. This season of an arm and a leg is a co production with kaiser health news. It's a nonprofit news service about healthcare in america. That's an editorially really independent program of the kaiser family foundation kaiser health news foundation are not affiliated with kaiser permanente the big healthcare provider. They share an ancestor ancestor. That's it is a fun story. You can check it out at arm and a leg show dot com slash. Diane webber is national editor for broadcast and tanya. The english is senior editor for broadcast innovation kaiser health news. They are editorial liaisons to this show. Finally thank you to some of our new backers unpatriotic. A literally could not make this show without your pledge two bucks a month or more. You get a shout out right here. Thanks this week to richard wine. Meyer claudia and larry frame keke otten helen lobby lisa bernstein enjoys fox david linski william tanner david and no promises but some people full report a lot of satisfaction a feeling of real accomplishment when they pledge their support to an arm and like this guy <music>.

diabetes anthony franco anthony ed researcher banting banting banting professor oakland toronto fred banting eli lilly producer frederick banting seeriously kaiser permanente kaiser family foundation Abilene dan weiss fred banting canting
NEJM This Week  November 7, 2019

NEJM This Week - Audio Summaries

29:27 min | 1 year ago

NEJM This Week November 7, 2019

"Welcome this is the New England Journal of Medicine. I'm Dr Lisa Johnson this week November seventh twenty nineteen we feature articles a neuro degenerative disease. He's informer soccer players triple treatment for cystic fibrosis. HETERO ZYGOTE S- PCI or cabbage for left main coronary disease ventilator later associated pneumonia after cardiac arrest mediators of insulin resistance and health social reform and medical schools a review article on acute severe hypertension a clinical problem solving that describes double trouble and perspective articles on the US insulin crisis on weather other emergency Holt would reduce opioid overdose deaths and on a good physician neuro degenerative disease mortality talapity among former professional soccer players by Daniel McKay from the Hamden Sports Clinic Glasgow the United Kingdom in this study death certificates were used to compare the causes of death among seven thousand six hundred seventy six former professional Scottish Soccer players and twenty three thousand twenty eight matched controls over a median of eighteen years. Fifteen point four percent end of the former soccer players and sixteen point. Five percent of the controls died. All cause mortality was lower among former players then among controls up to the age of seventy years and was higher thereafter mortality from ischemic heart disease was lower are among former players than among controls hazard ratio zero point eight as was mortality from Lung Cancer Hazard Ratio Zero Point Point five three mortality with neuro degenerative disease listed as the primary cause was one point seven percent among former soccer players wires and zero point five percent among controls among former players mortality with neurodegenerative disease listed as the primary or for a contributory cause on the death certificate varied according to disease subtype and was highest among those with Alzheimer's Disease Hazard Ratio uh-huh former players versus controls. Five point zero seven and lowest among those with Parkinson's disease hazard ratio two point one five dementia related medications were prescribed more frequently to former players then to controls odds ratio four point nine mortality with neurodegenerative disease listed as the primary or contributory cause did not differ significantly between goalkeepers and outfield players but dementia denture related. Medications were prescribed less. Frequently two goalkeepers in this retrospective epidemiologic analysis mortality from neuro degenerative generative disease was higher and mortality from other common diseases lower among former Scottish professional soccer players then among matched controls Robert Stern from Boston University. School of Medicine writes in an editorial that this study provides good news and bad news regarding the potential long-term consequences of playing soccer at the professional level. The results are similar to those from a study involving former the national football league players conducted by the Centers for Disease Control and prevention in which all cause mortality was lower among former NFL players then then in the general population but neurodegenerative mortality was higher professional. Soccer players. Do not share the body habits of American football players. There's but they do share the exposure to repetitive head impacts through routine heading of the ball and average player heads the ball six to twelve times per game in addition to heading drills at practice and thousands of times during a career in small case series studies heading has been associated with altered cerebral neuro chemistry diminished white matter integrity and quarter cle thinning in professional soccer players without obvious concussion. The new findings findings by McKay and colleagues should not engender undue fear and panic among soccer players. Parents and coaches as the authors of the current study indicate it is not possible to generalize their findings among male former professional soccer players to participants in recreational amateur or collegiate collegiate level soccer parents of children. Who headed the ball in youth or high school? Soccer should not fear that their children are destined to have cognitive decline and dementia later in life rather they should focus on the substantial health benefits from exercise and participation in a sport that their children enjoy however it is also important that the findings from the current study lead to research and increased awareness of the potential short term and long term consequences. NSA quences of heading the ball in amateur soccer perhaps however there is already adequate evidence that repeated blows to the brain from heading in professional professional. Soccer is an occupational risk that needs to be addressed Alexa Catheter. Teza Catheter Iva Catheter. After for cystic fibrosis with a single P. H. E. Five Zero Eight D. E. L. A.. Lille by Peter Middleton from the University of Sydney Westmead Need New South Wales Australia ineffective to trial involving patients who are heterosexual for the P. H. E. Five Zero Ad L. Cystic Fibrosis Trans Membrane conductors regulator cf tr mutation and minimal function mutation the next generation see FDR corrector Alexa Alexa calf door in combination with Teza Catheter and Ivankov after improved. PHP five zero ad L. C. F. T. R. Function and clinical clinical outcomes. This randomized phase. Three trial was conducted to confirm the efficacy and safety of Alexa. Catheter has occurred after Ivankov. After in four hundred three patients twelve years of age or older with cystic fibrosis with P. H. E. Five Zero Eight D. E. L. minimal function. Gino Gino Types Alexa after Teza. Catheter Ivankov after relative to placebo resulted in a percentage of predicted Efi v one. That was thirteen eighteen. Point eight points higher at four weeks and fourteen point three points. Higher through twenty four weeks a rate of pulmonary exacerbations that that was sixty three percent lower respiratory domain score on the cystic fibrosis questionnaire. Revised that was twenty point. Two points higher and sweat sweat chloride concentration. That was forty one point eight million moles per liter lower Alexa Teza Catheter. Ivankov after was generally safe and had an acceptable side effect profile. Most patients had adverse events that were mild or moderate Alexa after Teza Catheter. Ivankov after was efficacious in patients with cystic fibrosis with P. H. E. Five Zero Eight D. E. L. minimal function Gino types in whom previous previous cf tr modulator regiments were ineffective in an editorial Francis Collins from the National Institutes of Health Bethesda. Maryland writes that the results of a pair of phase three clinical trials in the journal and in a simultaneous publication. In the Lancet document and impressive benefits from triple drug therapy for persons with cystic fibrosis. And at least one copy of the P. H. E. Five Zero Away D. E. L. CF tr mutation who represent approximately ninety percent of persons affected by this life-shortening autosomal recessive disease. The these findings indicate that it may soon be possible to offer safe and effective molecular targeted therapies. To ninety percent of persons with cystic fibrosis. This should be a cause for major celebration yet. We must not abandon the patients with cystic fibrosis. Who have known mutations -tations and will not have a response to these drugs even beyond that the best day ever for all of us traveling down? This long road together will be the day. When the more than seventy thousand persons with cystic fibrosis worldwide? Do not need to take drug therapy at all. And they're finally is a permanent cure for cystic fibrosis. That works for everyone. Although the challenges are substantial one can imagine such an ultimate approach approach involving in Vivo Somatic cell gene editing of Airway epithelial cells shortly after their identification of cf tr. Thirty a years ago Dr Collins wrote a song entitled Dare to Dream. The lyrics expressed hope that the gene discovery would lead to effective treatments for cystic fibrosis. That someday we would see all our brothers and sisters breathing free. Dr Collins writes that it is profoundly. Gratifying edifying to see that this dream is coming. True Five Year outcomes after PCI or cabbage for for left main coronary disease by Greg Stone from the ICAHN School of Medicine at Mount Sinai New York long term outcomes after perky cutaneous coronary intervention. PCI with contemporary drug alluding stance as compared with coronary artery bypass grafting cabbage in patients nations. With left main coronary artery. Disease are not clearly established in this. Study one thousand nine hundred five patients with left main coronary artery disease of low or intermediate anatomical complexity were randomly assigned to undergo either. PCI with ever Alma saluting stents or cabbage at five years a primary outcome event of death stroke or myocardial. Infarction had occurred in twenty eighty two percent of the patients in the P. C. I. Group and in Nineteen Point two percent of those in the cabbage group death from any cause occurred more frequently in the P. C. I. Group then in the cabbage group in thirteen percent versus nine point nine percent in the p. c. i. and cabbage groups the incidences of definite cardiovascular death five percent and four point five percent respectively and myocardial infarction ten point six percent and nine point one percent were not significantly different. All cerebrovascular events were less frequent after p. c. i. than after cabbage. Three point three three percent versus five point two percent although the incidence of stroke was not significantly different between the two groups two point nine percent and three point seven percent send ischemia driven re vascular. Ization was more frequent after PCI sixteen point nine percent versus ten percent in patients with with left main coronary artery disease. There was no significant difference between PC. I and cabbage with respect to the rate of the composite outcome of death. Stroke or myocardial infarction at five years prevention of early ventilator associated pneumonia after cardiac arrest by blue no hosoi from Johnny Mass Young polyvalent Limaj France patients treated with targeted temperature management thirty to thirty four degrees Celsius after cardiac arrest are at increased risk for early ventilator associated. Pneumonia this is trial involved. One hundred ninety four adult patients in intensive care units who were being mechanically ventilated after out of hospital. Cardiac arrest related the two initial shock. -able rhythm and treated with targeted temperature management at thirty two to thirty four degrees Celsius. Either Intravenous Amoxicillin Ceiling Clavier Linate or Placebo was administered three times a day for two days starting less than six hours after the cardiac arrest the incidents it inside of early ventilator associated. Pneumonia was lower with antibiotic prophylaxis than with Placebo. Nineteen percent of patients versus thirty. Thirty four percent no significant between group differences were observed for other key clinical variables such as ventilator free days and mortality at day. Twenty eight at day seven. No increase in resistant. Bacteria was identified serious adverse events did not differ significantly between the two groups. A two day course of antibiotic therapy with Amoxicillin Clavier Linate in patients receiving a thirty two to thirty four degrees Celsius Targeted temperature management strategy. After out of hospital cardiac arrest with initial shock -able rhythm resulted in a lower incidence of early aleve ventilator associated pneumonia than placebo acute severe hypertension a clinical practice article by Aldo Aldo. Push Oto from Yale School of Medicine New Haven Connecticut. Blood pressure elevations. Above one hundred eighty over one hundred ten to one one hundred twenty millimeters mercury can result in acute injury to the heart brain and the micro vascular if acute hypertension mediated target. Arket organ damage is present. The condition is labeled hypertensive emergency and demands immediate and aggressive treatment to limit progressive injury. A hypertensive emergency is associated with substantial morbidity and in hospital mortality acute severe hypertension without acute target target organ damage. Hypertensive urgency is not associated with adverse short term outcomes and can be managed in the ambulatory setting non adherence to previously prescribed. Anti hypertensive. Medications is the most common factor leading to acute severe hypertension chronic hypertension engine shifts the cerebral blood flow auto regulation curve to the right. That is to hire blood pressure levels which confers a predisposition to cerebral cerebral hypo perfusion at relatively high normal blood pressure levels. This principle guides the pace of blood pressure reduction in acute severe severe hypertension hypertensive emergencies are managed with intravenous medications guided by the type of target organ damage. Hypertensive emergencies should be managed with oral medications and arrangements for prompted. Follow up listen to the full text of this article at any. AM DOT ORG double trouble. A clinical problem solving article by Christopher Smith from the Veterans Affairs. Ann Arbor medical all center Michigan a fifty one year old man presented with a four week history of cough associated with fever chills fatigue and aching living in the joints. The cough was initially productive of blood tinged flim but later became dry an x ray of the chest showed a no passively at the right cardio frantic angle but no plural of fusion. His condition did not improve after. Two courses of macrolide antibiotic therapy one month later. His wife brought him to the emergency department where he reported severe weakness Fatigue and frequent muscle spasms his wife noted that he seemed confused. His examination was unchanged from his previous outpatient visit except that he appeared lethargic had mild tenderness over the right anterior anterior chest wall and had asterix's C. T. of the chest revealed small right pleural of fusion. The patient produced no urine despite fight placement of an end. Welling you re throw catheter. And Maria is caused by severe intra-regional injury or complete urinary obstruction obstruction. The most direct test to elucidate the cause of the patient's pulmonary and renal disease would be renal biopsy a biopsy specimen of the kidney showed severe Calamari lightest on light microscopy ancillary testing showed markedly positive anti-proteinase three and anti GBM am antibody levels that indicated a dual positive auto immune phenotype Gla Mario nephritis with coexistent Anka's and anti GBM. Antibodies double antibody positive. Disease was diagnosed non Alcoholic Fatty Liver Disease Insulin resistance and Serra minds a clinical implications of basic research article by Varman Samuel from Yale School of Medicine newhaven insulin resistance is present in most but not all obese and elderly patients and even some young and lean persons it is a precursor cursor to and accelerate of coexisting conditions such as type two diabetes. atherosclerosis non alcoholic fatty liver disease and probably obesity obesity associated cancers. There is broad consensus. That insulin resistance is associated with ectopic lipid deposition in skeletal muscle and liver. However multiple lipid species are implicated and the molecular mechanisms? Impairing the action of insulin are debated in one model an the increase in. SSN One to dice glycerin all impairs insulin signaling. In addition a substantial body of work supports a role for ceremonies in promoting insulin resistance serum needs. Like the dyson Glycerin calls are bioactive lipid intermediates a recent study established. The importance of absurd reminds through the genetic manipulation of Di Hydro Serum I D- saturates. One does one in mice. The recent study implicates locates elevated levels of serum. I'd and their effect. I might owe conrail function in the mediation of cellular insulin resistance the health social reform and medical schools the training of American physicians and the dissenting tradition a medicine society article by Merlin Chow Kwanyan from Columbia University. New York medical schools. Continue to admit low numbers of black and Hispanic students groups that accounted for only five point seven percent in four point six percent respectively of twenty fifteen graduating classes and many medical schools continue to score low on standardized indexes gauging commitment to a broader social mission measured by percentages of graduates. It's who pursue primary care or work in medically underserved geographic areas. What can be done to address these deficits medical schools schools throughout the country? Have hosted white coat Diane's in solidarity with National Movements Against Racism and police brutality medical students the public defended the affordable care act as it faced new political threats most recently an ad hoc group called scrubs addressing. The firearm epidemic convened campus actions. That framed gun violence as an urgent health problem but this activist revival can also be the understood from a longer term perspective in the context of a dissenting tradition in. US medical training. Though never in the mainstream trainee the activists have repeatedly reimagined what the profession could be at. Its best these authors focus on curricular reform expanded did community outreach and the fight against racial exclusion as lead by two little known but influential organizations. The Association of of interns and medical students aims and the Student Health Organizations S. H. O. The US insulin crisis rationing a life saving medication discovered in the nineteen twenties. A Perspective article by Michael Froehlich from Mount Sinai Hospital Toronto on January Twenty Third Nineteen twenty. Two Insulin was successfully injected into a fourteen year. Old Boy with with severe type. One diabetes melodies type one diabetes had been considered a universally fatal disease for their discovery of insulin. Insulin Frederick Banting. And John Macleod were awarded the Nineteen twenty-three Nobel Prize in physiology or medicine. The members of their team sold the patent for insulin to the University of Toronto for one dollar each banting famously stated insulin does not belong to me. It belongs to the world immediately. After Insulin's discovery patients flocked to Toronto for what was being referred to as a Miracle Substance Indi- demand was strong but the supply was limited which led to the initial rationing of insulin in one thousand. Nine hundred twenty three before it was successfully mass produced by. Eli Eli Lilly. And the company that later became Novo Nordisk the price of one hundred units of regular short acting. Insulin was about one dollar in. US US dollars during this period and fell to less than twenty cents in the nineteen forties as manufacturing processes improved over the past two decades cades however the price of insulin in the United States has risen substantially and is now inaccessible to thousands of Americans because of its high cost. The rising costs can be attributed primarily to two phenomena first. US law allows pharmaceutical manufacturers factual errors to price their products at whatever level. They believe the market will bear and to raise prices over time without limit. Second Direct direct competition in the insulin market is lacking will emergency holds reduce OPIOID overdose deaths perspective article by Elizabeth Samuels from Warren Alpert Medical School at Brown University. Providence Rhode Island as part of efforts to reduce deuce overdose deaths and increase enrollment in treatment. Lawmakers in some states are contemplating an acting or expanding emergency hold laws that that permits some patients with severe substance use disorder to be involuntarily detained for short-term observation and in some cases treatment a bill introduced in Rhode Island during the past two legislative sessions. For example would allow physicians to request that a court order a seventy two hour hold for inpatient nation treatment for a person with substance use disorder who presents a danger or threat of danger to self family or others if not treated similar statutes have already been enacted in other states including Minnesota and Washington. Emergency hold laws are modeled. After and often extensions of existing testing measures that permit short term evaluation and treatment of people in mental health crisis using short-term emergency holds in the context of opioid use use disorder presumes that a person's risk of overdose will be mitigated by a brief involuntary hospitalization but the efficacy of emergency holds for substance use. Disorders hasn't been evaluated their use in this context raises ethical legal medical and practical questions that merit careful consideration consideration given the profound effects that holds would have an individual liberty relationships between patients and physicians and the healthcare delivery system them a good physician on complacency and communication a perspective article by Michelle Kitson from the cedars-sinai Medical Center Los Angeles Dr Kitson recently cared for a forty five year old man for over a month and never spoke to him. The patient patient was admitted with Cardio. GENYK shock stabilized and listed for heart transplantation every morning Dr Kilson rounded with her heart failure team. The patient pulmonary artery catheter secured to his neck usually looked up when they entered but then returned his attention immediately to his phone as Dr Kilson spoke to his father. She glanced at her patient. She never knew how much he understood or what he was thinking. After a few months the patient received the magic call aw he sailed through. Transplantation was home within ten days. Dr Kitson should have been proud but an adage from William Ostler nagged at her. The the good physician treats the disease. The great physician treats the patient. WHO has the disease? She knew she had missed the mark. When presented did with the unique challenge of caring for a deaf patient? She took the convenient way out every day for a month half the problem was logistics scheduling a daily real-life asl. Interpreters seemed impossible. The other half was the absurdity of video interpreter. In retrospect she should have used the patient's father as interpreter instead of Messenger but on her first day neither the patient nor his father requested that she speak directly with the patient and after the Second Linden third days past with the same calm acceptance they fell into an easy for Dr kitson inertia. She had failed to comfort a patient in need and she'd missed out on the joy of that relationship are images in clinical medicine features a fifty two year old man who presented to the outpatient clinic with with a bleeding mass on his right great toe. Two months earlier the patient had noticed a pink nargile that was approximately five millimeters in diameter on the door. Some of the to- one month later. His Toe was stepped on after which the Najran grew rapidly and bled intermittently on examination. The lesion was read head and also rated with surrounding hyper pigmentation. He was referred for surgical reception during Surgery Brown. Black Patches were found on the bottom of the mass his logic analysis of both the respected mass and the patch underneath. It showed nests of melanoma cells a diagnosis of acro link. Melanoma with invasion of the reticulation Durmus was made extended section of the lesion and skin grafting were performed the result of sentinel lymph node. Biopsy was negative. The patient received treatment with Interferon Alpha Two B. After surgery at the eighteen month the follow up there was no evidence of recurrence or metastases. A forty year old man presented to the emergency department with fatigue that it had progressively worsened over a period of three months. He had recently emigrated from Mexico where he had worked on a farm and eaten raw watercress laboratory. Laboratory studies showed severe anemia. An alkyl phosphates level of three hundred forty two units per leader and an absolute. Es Nfl Count of one. One thousand four hundred cells per cubic millimetre ultrasonography of the abdomen. Revealed Intra hypnotic Bill Eerie. Ductile Dila tation and Mr Colangelo NGO pancreatitis graffiti revealed a Hyler stricture endoscopic retrograde. Colegio pancreatitis. Griffey was then performed and large flat. Worms arms were visualized emerging from the major Waddell. Pilla see the video at any J. M. Dot org worms were extracted and identified as has the Common Liver Fluke. Fascia Sola have Hadaka Fanciulla eggs. In the feces of host animals commonly sheep contaminate fresh water the larvae mature in snails and attached to vegetation after the parasites are ingested by humans. They penetrate the intestine and invade the hip pat obituary tree after treatment with blood transfusion and try Klabin dissolved.

cystic fibrosis soccer pneumonia Disease US degenerative disease neurodegenerative disease Teza Catheter Iva Catheter New England Journal of Medicin Francis Collins Centers for Disease Control Alexa Catheter Alexa Teza Catheter Yale School of Medicine Alexa Amoxicillin Frederick Banting P. H. E. Daniel McKay Michelle Kitson
Iran threatens to increase its stockpile of enriched uranium as tensions escalate with the U.S.

The Daily 202's Big Idea

08:03 min | 1 year ago

Iran threatens to increase its stockpile of enriched uranium as tensions escalate with the U.S.

"The daily Joe twos. Big idea is sponsored by US Bank, US Bank believes communities thrive. When individuals succeed working together, we can help create economic opportunity for all. Good morning. I'm James Holman from the Washington Post. This is the daily to to for Monday, June seventeenth today's President Trump fires three of his pollsters over the leak of Parisot internal numbers John Roberts tries to show the supreme court is a political, but to very political, decisions, loom, and is the price of insulin source or Americans are caravan to Canada to buy the lifestyle of medicine. But first, the big idea, Iran threat overnight to increase its uranium stockpile. Limit set by the twenty fifteen nuclear deal in the next ten days. The country said it has already sped up its production of low enriched, uranium Tehran, denies claims by the Trump administration that is seeking to build a nuclear bomb, but on Monday, around also announced Richmond targets that would put it in the proximity of the levels needed to build a weapon. The backers of the Iran nuclear deal long argued that, that was the best way to prevent the very scenario threatened on Monday. Despite this Trump announced his withdrawal from the Obama era agreement, last year, China, Russia and three European nations. Germany, France, Britain have stuck with it arguing that, while the deal may not be perfect. It's still the best way to prevent Iran. For getting the bomb Iran initially appeared willing to stick to its its despite the us withdrawal. But more recently has put pressure on the remaining backers of the agreement in early may Iran gave Europe sixty days to comply with number of conditions to save the deal without US back. Checking Tehran threatened do, but otherwise resume uranium-enrichment above the limits agreed to in twenty fifteen Monday's announcement by the spokesman for Iran's nuclear agency, indicates that efforts to resume enrichment could begin even sooner than initially threatened. This is coming against the backdrop of last week's attacks on two oil tankers in the Gulf of Oman. US allies today are pushing the Trump administration for more evidence looking Ron to what happened Japan and Germany have both requested something more than the greenie video released by the Pentagon that appears to show an Iranian patrol boat, removing an item said to be unexploded mine from one of the ship's secretary of state, Mike Pompeo, set an appearances on CBS's face the nation and Fox News Sunday that he spent much of the weekend talking with his counterparts on foreign capitals. It was an implicit acknowledgement that he has worked to do to convince the world that the US accusations against Iran, which has denied responsibility are true bigger picture, though, it lays bare a credibility problem burdening, the Trump administration papaya said some countries would. I like this to go away, but he called it a fundamental right of every country to travel through the international waters of the strait for news, which he said, Iran is attempting to deny, nevertheless, incertainty persists. Some of it is rooted in a suspicion of Trump who has made numerous misleading statements in the past to put it mildly. Some is focused on the national security adviser John Bolton who advocated the two thousand three invasion of a rock on the faulty assertion that Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction. And some of the skepticism is because of Pompeo, it link out a litany of Iran's behavior in recent weeks. Pompeo said Tehran was behind a may thirty first car bomb in Kabul as a US convoy was passing by for US service members were lightly injured. The Taliban claimed responsibility for that. But pump Heo said the Taliban claim should not be believed. This is why credibility counts you need to tell the truth about the little things, so that people believe you on the big things. And that's the big idea here are three other headlines that should be on your rate. Radars? We start the week, number one, the Trump reelection campaign cut ties with three of its pollsters after the leak of internal numbers should the president losing badly to Joe by the campaign has several hits relationships with Brett Lloyd bike Besse lean and Adam Geller while keeping pollsters. Tony for breezy and John McLaughlin, on the payroll data from a seventeenth state internal poll conducted by for breezy showed Trump trailing Joe by, by double digits, Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, Florida and Michigan. Trump won all four of those states in two thousand sixteen privately the president was livid. These numbers got out once eater administration official says he's matter that the numbers are out that the numbers exist, the disclosure of the point data has upended, what has been actually a relatively smooth running reelection operation so far, and it highlights the stark challenges that the president faces in forging a coalition to repeat is twenty sixteen victory tomorrow night, in Florida. The president will formally kick off his twenty twenty campaign number two. Decisions in all of the twenty four remaining cases on the supreme court's. Docket are expected to the next week or two. Some could come as early as today chief Justice John Roberts wants to sure the American people that his supreme court is a political, but the biggest cases of the term involved two of the most politically consequential decisions of the court has made in years. One initiative is whether to include a citizenship question in the twenty twenty cents this, which is filled a parson showdown on Capitol Hill. The other could outlaw partisan gerrymandering techniques that were essential to Republican dominance at the state and congressional level over the past decade. Roberts sits physically at the middle of the bench in the grand corporal, it now for the first time since he joined the court in two thousand five he's at the center of the courts ideological spectrum, too, with the retirement of Anthony Kennedy last summer. The most important Justice on the Roberts court is now Roberts himself Robert to the past issue himself to be far more conservative than Kennedy and juice. Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg suggested during a recent speech that, that has not changed. Number three in the United States insulin can cost hundreds of dollars per vial in Canada. You could buy it without a prescription for a tenth that price. That's why Legia greenside a rule abiding. Mom from Minnesota drives her buzzed on cross-border drug runs her daughter, who's thirteen has type one diabetes. She paid twelve hundred dollars recently for drugs up north, that would have cost twelve thousand dollars in the United States or thirty million Americans have diabetes about seven and a half million including one and a half million with type one diabetes. Rely on insulin between twenty twelve and twenty sixteen. The cost of insulin for treating type one diabetes nearly doubled. It was a Canadian who invented insulin Frederick Banting, began the work that led to the discovery of the drug, nearly a century ago what beating co-discovered insulin in the early nineteen twenty s he balked commercializing it because he thought it was unethical to profit from. Such a critical drug. He eventually sold his share of the pet to the university of Toronto for one dollar and to hope that the drug would remain widely accessible and affordable. The nearly one hundred years since then insulin has become a lifeline for millions. But the price in the United States bizarrely continues to search Farmaceutica companies under pressure from lawmakers both parties have given rebates to some poorer patients, but many who rely on insulin still struggle or numbers resort to rationing a dangerous and sometimes deadly practice increasingly some diabetics, and their families are taking matters into their own hands. They meet in coffee shops, strip mall, parking lots to exchange. Urgency supplies an unknown number travel outside the country to get the drug. None of this is recommended by us officials. Indeed, some of it might be illegal under FDA guidelines. But several parents we've spoken with say they're willing to break the law to save their kids lives. And that's the daily to, to for Monday, June seventeenth, thanks for listening. I'm James helping. I'll talk to you tomorrow. Mm-hmm.

United States Iran Trump president Tehran John Roberts Joe twos Mike Pompeo James Holman US Bank Canada Washington Post Taliban Germany Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg Gulf of Oman FDA Europe Saddam Hussein
Historias de la historia 319  Little Bighorn

Podcast RadioViajera

26:27 min | Last month

Historias de la historia 319 Little Bighorn

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218. Bill Bryson (writer)  the most extraordinary machine

Think Again

53:21 min | 1 year ago

218. Bill Bryson (writer) the most extraordinary machine

"I'm Jason Godsend you're listening to pink again a big thing podcast when my life strategy of living like a Bourbon loving brain in a VAT became increasingly untenable. It's how we experience the world it's much of what we mean by living and for all it's he has been kind enough to demystify it for us to the extent that that's possible and to help us think again thank you. Jason is great to be here with you it's a delight and honor we've got an hour cram Ni the entire human body all of its complexity into four hundred pages is logic dictates that the brain should be a chapter because in important each system is a chapter because all that different from your dogs but your brain certainly is the brain is the thing that makes humans debray I mean you have to you can't pay should have gone on for thousands of pages there've been a couple I that have actually changed my sense of the importance of the body relative to the brainerd everything about the body is that it is all integrated you have thirty seven point two trillion cells with all the other cells all around it anymore this random way I mean they're just they're just things but it's all dependent on what bumps into them what they bump into and that kind of thing it all seems it into pieces I mean you have to facebook to convenience sake but every bit of it is dependent on every and yet to me what is this quintessence of dust we are it's we're both remarkable uh-huh definitely that I think is just the most remarkable fact about life is that is that we live on the periodic table and put them all together and sometimes they just make why do these components here on earth alone as far as we know so far how do right yet but but just to just to contemplate it is fairly mind-blowing didn't it's one of assistance we're talking about the book is full of facts and anecdotes really interesting and one one theme is this like what we know and what we don't know more complex as time goes on the more we learn the more we realized how much we don't know hey there would be a gene that gave you at heavy blue is a gene for that if you were a good run into single thing about your that doesn't involve a multiplicity of genes often in patterns that are handle various tasks which is true to some extent but in fact vastly more plastic but now they're saying that to your memories of what your life was like when you were three say totally unreliable which is you know first of all and you can be very very sincere about having memory I mean it feels like a real to you but or just your imagination has taken over part of it we I mean we all do it and people say that hidden from the moment he was born I haven't memory and there was a patterned and I don't know I just find it very satisfied that the thought that that a lot of what I remember because when I the way I do if it's not quite correct while fairness right right this reminds me of something ah where you were talking about imperfections of the way that so that it's enjoyable for the listener or the reader and I think there's something and that's the definition of dementia and clearly I mean we want to be able to fine whatever it is that I can still remember very clearly things like my childhood telephone today I really would be it would be helpful to be able to recall all the time you know I can not all that long ago recall my son's excitement at announcing to me that he knows don't have you don't have to sporting event right of you've done a lot of travel writing and this is in a way a different kind of travelogue adding that you've played every book is that perhaps heavy nonfiction but but certainly and he comes in a journey of discovery to find out either whether it's about Australia as a country are do it or not but my ideas that is this is for me very much a journey of discovery of learning our readers learning alongside I'm sharing this information hoping that it resonates with the return is as new to this information as you are and also some of the day that the book is the words go printed onto paper just meet the starts to become obsolete elements in I mean I listed for instance the number of exoplanets plan right you know obviously the world moves on science makes new discoveries and and you can you can make corrections but you can't actually rewrite whole chapters and that he's he's lovely and also travel writer travel speaker and right around that time he is also kind of he's interested in starting from a position of openness and in or and I guess when you're dealing with something like the human body and science taking the risk of obviously fact checking but yeah no this completely fair a professor at Harvard I'll be seeing tomorrow he's another great here my Daniel Lieberman and he I stand in awe of that book I mean I'd say as much in my own book I'm learning and and every human being I would argue every human being has a different perspective I would say read that book because this you're going to need this information street because that's what my book is about is is is really how amazing it is how how vite readers in who would be daunted and left out but it is it is a right right and I was always terrified so I guess that's what I'm wondering does that keep you up you know to be vulnerable myself here and say that on this show I speak to people a little bit but I'm speaking as a fellow traveller in the realms of esoterica one is I don't explain the science a lot I mean I really leave that to the Daniels I've talked to him about the when you discover something they want to know about the science they went to new so tell me as it were the at Harvard or Yale or why did this happen in Finland awesome I think most scientists would think of his fairly irrelevant to the things that make my ears he was made and then the world danced around in a circle and rejoice like quite often I'm sure this is wonderful examples of that and they do tend to get glossed over in textbooks and banting this is all happening in Toronto Frederick Banting was just to physician just a general and called it up but how you might distill instant added Panthers Dog pancreases urban and they killed them they died wretched it was horrible horrible disease and a professor at the University of Toronto gave him some lab space and said okay go out of out of dog pancreases and it worked and it and it was a miracle Doug I mean they took you could take with almost overnight it was it was a miracle drug it was one of the greatest medical who refined the production methods because of course is not not enough just to come up with a new whole period that all of the experiments were going on and that banting was coming up with those solution the Nobel Prize when the Nobel Prize awarded because it was his lab there's a lot of that two people the most delightfully Zany story. But what's great about it is there's the story yeah it's it's actually it's weird that we gloss over it but I guess we like our stories you know by the guys who fisticuffs I mean genuinely what were some of the most astonishing so unbelievable that I I really had to just check the over and over just to me was als also took all the DNA in your body made it into a single find strand it was true I can see maybe there'd be enough for me to stress to Chicago Eighty Miles of DNA which is just a reflection of just how amazing can put them and made a single strand out of them that would stretch around the earth two and a half times at some point I was like okay I need to read like five more books to even patient with me but the museum is probably the most complicated part of the human body as a concept is really quite a modern development and it's not anyone paces scattered all the universe that wants to kill your can hurt you from sunlight to do estimate the fact that you don't have an infinite ability to protect yourself but but another ear right and your immune system identifies these proliferating cells before they can grow conventional sentence that you have to go out and have chemotherapy or something you've been really really minds around is really I mean gratitude is the right word but the debt of gratitude that second yeah why don't you can die in in moments I mean just it's pretty precious it pretty remarkable and one of the themes that I bang on about in the book I and really we ought to revel in in that and enjoy it and be grateful for that was the next theme I'm sitting here as a grotesque demonstration of that right now only on the requests four hundred calories of energy day to run I mean this is the most magnificent tendency how far you get and every organ your body really runs unveil though inputs of five and to survive healthily is very much less than almost all of this consume your body thaw early death but the fact is that because you don't have to wonder on relationship between consumption almost all tend to eat too much look after and exercise for two little unraveling list in selling new products and lots of sugar and so forth and so on but modern life Zeno they drink too much because of stress it's absolutely true I mean another I thought it's just get up and move around as as one of the people I quote in the four hours straight which is what most of us do in the evening all the exercise may not compensate the correlation between how much people sit whether the fit and healthy and move around during the commercials which of course often enough to keep you pretty active but but that has the most wonderful beneficial effects one of these and that was very and and and obviously if you arleen you tend to get up and bounce around a bit more anyway so it tends to be yeah I'm sure there is that although that's that becomes very controversial area but he was quite rotund and I just I'm not sure don't hang onto fat more than short others there's got to be lifestyle has got is where there's just a lot of uncertainty that was that was the hardest chapter book Adid or how you should behave I'm just I'm just exploring with authorities say and there was so much contradiction the self evident position is just to do everything in moderation you know not to worry about it too much shouldn't be afraid to have a piece of carrot cake or cheesecake or whatever you shouldn't feel guilty about it just don't eat have a cheeseburger but just don't just eat nothing else but cheeseburgers so you so just always be a little bit hungry I mean life in which you're never quite fall those are the heart the one certainty is somebody will I avak listing of eight thousand different ways and as I point out in the book you escape every one of back at the last second we've all had those experiences where you just go like almost right terrible things would oddity right down the immune system to relax I've got I've got this covered and so that I thought was just again mind-blowing they would just the idea that anything us you know if if I suddenly throw ball at your face you got slow we've been much more respected her so what the brain does and I think this is just never live in the present we're always we're always just a quarter of a second in the future factually ahead of of now it's can be very beneficial for us and it can get us into all who's a cognitive psychologist who studies motion in the brain and she was ball they can tell are they going to throw it are they going to release it or are they going to oh bunch of grandchildren and I'm and I naturally door them but I'm fascinated by really and just when they're trying to work out how to crawl or something and all the processes you can simplistic and yet there's there's still able to work things and they're watching all the time out irregular verbs it's really quite it's magical it's just wonderful they that's a very limited experience of this but you know the fact of two things simultaneously doing them for and to the child and then also the limitations because eh you can fool baby so is they just can't quite they have they for I mean going back to something we said in the beginning and something I think you say in the beginning of this it'd be terrible I I think to live in an age in which they could and which we did understand everything and then they could you have a wonderful but it would also mean that they could probably reach into cells and you right whatever it's not just because what we could do with it but but also just the were can we don't really know what consciousness is that so much is still unknown even basic the only the only apes that have chins and and we we do the job at least they face expense like acidity has come up with and again I think there's something for me this is marvelous sort of should have known this before and maybe somewhere did but I I guess I didn't know if we need to be humble we need that humility and so I mean there's a very real danger in in the idea of thinking that we know two hundred thousand years old and look back on us as being kind of back with the neanderthals this is always possible or more likely to be some self inflicted catastrophe but about what we did was we realized that we were at the very beginning was never thinking those you know I it you don't have to cast my very far into the future to imagine that they're going to look both when they go through the having chemotherapy radiation therapy and presumably one hundred why I mean I'm sure there will be it'll be painless and quick and it'll make our hubris this is actually a perfect segue into what is something who is the whistle blower of Cambridge analytica which actually taught us a official media this episode of think again is brought to you by Mac Walden this personally and enthusiastically I have this problem where no socks are ever comfortable I mean there's of their socks for a few years now and not only are the in stylish patterns but they fit perfectly snug eighties about underwear giving people confidence that is actually kind of true with Mac Waldon's I pair which I think is highly unlikely you can keep it and they will still refund you at Mac Walden Dot Com and enter Promo Code Think Again Vista selects and sends you children's clothes that are right for your kids specifically last we're gonNA find out okay okay so this first one on in which I I'm I already am loving this term this next one looks like super thick it's like relatively breathable which I like it's kind of a good way we told them you liked green by the way it has the word let's Rome or something definitely Mardi like in everything we recorded on from Olympics to enhance and protect him I guess what I'm trying to say is that they feel like they were made for bonus stitch fix will waive the twenty dollar styling fee when you use this shows special you we have literally entrusted our civil discourse or frankly uh of our political discourse the foundations of our American democracy there's old notion of public discourse in the town square right like the Public Forum right you're like in there's some really important things that are happening right you've got people standing there and they're hearing if that candidate lies the opposing candidate can say that's not true or there's more to than say also in the town square everybody knows each other they see each other at the dance listening. I can now become invisible in fact this town square no longer townsquare don't realize that other people are being talked to and actually as this sort of Spanish oh what I am and in that circumstance where different people can see and it's the privatization of public discourse for profit the whole world we're personally I often feel really not making the most of it but one of the things where I think in New York or anywhere in the world and if I want to know you know can even the fact that wikipedia works which seems principal channels of information has been very alarming to me because I'm really still fundamentally but but I when I don't do that I mean I really I really long for the day when the newspaper landed twelve or fourteen hours old if not more Sherry and sometimes that was a frustration if you knew every morning and it was and took them on and it was a feast from the enquirer in the new the Wall Street Journal online because the because the information is kind of limited finding my way around it and I find I'm suspicious of that and I don't like the sensor reality shares in being manipulated all the time and even I I I could tell as good as it can get in terms of user friendliness and utility and all of the newspaper to page six I will see everything that's on page six I will cast go looked at everything there is with a online newspaper you don't know where the beginning in think pieces and read them later and think that's marvelous but but in terms the internet just everything given to you is destroying the paid for world did I grew up is your data the places you go you know it it looks like they're being given you what they want to give you exactly and I just find that I find the sad to me and I just in that world and how much of it is because I'm more experienced than they are that I I know an alternative video games and he's got friends in Australia and you know there is a there is a kind of community part of me that a very big part of me that wants to that is a kind of classical romantic and digital re reality another possible example is is libraries surrounded by books and my physical books and and you know because you go and look for one and to do the research like that and there's something to me there's something wonderful about the physicality but I also think there is something for me anyway I could never make those kinds of discoveries sir there's a lot of education and discovery there on the Internet looking for in the first place so they had asked but I think what is true I mean I think is that you don't necessarily understand that all since kind of crazy sinister true oh but thank you so much for for coming on again bill bryson thank you very much jason there had a it gets bad rap for its appetites and because to care for ourselves and for one another the foundations of any vision worth an go dot com. And I'll be back next week with something very very different there's a chance or local gyco agent laughs the exact way you chance your local gyco agent could help you out with. PADO homeowners renters or Condo insurance or visit yours today.

Jason Godsend gyco PADO two hundred thousand years four hundred calories fourteen hours twenty dollar four hours
78: The Indian Wars Part 2: The Battle of the Little Bighorn (the Greasy Grass)

History That Doesn't Suck

58:02 min | 4 months ago

78: The Indian Wars Part 2: The Battle of the Little Bighorn (the Greasy Grass)

"History that doesn't suck as a bi weekly podcast delivering legit seriously researched hard hitting survey of american history through entertaining stories. If you'd like to support hdfs or enjoy some perks like ad free early. Releases or patron exclusive mini episodes. Please consider giving at patriotic dot com forward slash history that doesn't suck to keep up with. Hdd s news. Follow us on facebook twitter or instagram. It's the afternoon of june twenty fifth. Eighteen seventy six as many as a thousand lakota. Cheyenne and arapaho village sprawl across the prairie. It's six to eight thousand. Inhabitants are enjoying a relaxing day. You're currently at war with the united states. But no one is expecting an attack presently. Us troops should be at least a day's travel out. Women are preparing food and chatting. Young men are watering their ponies. Playing hoop and pole gain still others are sleeping in after a late night of salvatori dancing as the hot afternoon. Sun beats down. Kids are swimming in the river at the villages edge these tribes and many other indigenous peoples of the great plains. Call it the greasy grass. You might know by another name though the little big horn river but the mood of leisure comes to an end around three pm. They're charging the charges are coming. A messenger yells scared and still make it from swimming. Children run back to camp searching for their mothers. The mothers dash around searching for children fathers young man scramble for their opponents and guns approximately one hundred fifty men one hundred thirty or so cavalry by to crow and twenty plus or recruit scouts charged north and downriver toward the lakota cheyenne village. Indigenous scouts are in the league and begin to gather lakota and cheyenne horses to prevent their use in battle at the same time battalion. Commander major marcus. A reno his blue clad troops to stop all prepare to fight on foot. This mount he hollers with every fourth man holding horses the cavalry skirmish line a quarter mile or so short villages southern end. It's a wise choice. They're grossly outnumbered but in truth. The major in his men don't know that yet. So why the caution well some like sergeant charles white will later. Report that marks and other officers have been hit in the flask. Pretty hard so. The decision is more likely born of whiskey than wisdom but whatever the cause the major fears. He's charging into a trap. They'll approach on foot. Multiple things now happened at once to rookie cavalryman who couldn't dismount or control. They're scared galloping. Horses fly into the village. They're pulled down and killed. Meanwhile the cavalry's indigenous scouts find a group of women and children in a wooded area near the river. They killed ten of them. Unaware of this unsure what to make of the cavalry sudden dismount. Lakota spiritual leader sitting bull rides out to see if he can parlay piece bullets ripped through both good bear boys legs and symbols beloved grey horse the bereaved spiritual leader calls to his man. My best horses shot. It is likely they have shot me attack them. The two sides exchanged fire guns crack. More village defenders gathered soon as many as five hundred lakota and cheyenne warriors are engaged in cavalry. They still from the open. Prairie into the trees near the river's western hatch as a three forty five pm fighting's drawn to a stalemate but that's about to change with his body covered in yellow warpaint and dots of light. A lakota leader charges out. He's armed with a stone. Headed war club and winchester carbine. Think short barreled rifle excited. Cry goes through the village crazy. Horse's coming legend in his own right on the battlefield crazy horse rise before his fellow lakota. An allied cheyenne urging them to save their shop. He wants to let the cavalry fire until their guns overheat in jam up with this new strategy they wait as the cavalry continued fire after several minutes crazy horse's satisfied it's time to attack yells out to those with him. Here are some of the soldiers after us do your best and let us kill them all off today that they need trouble us. No more already charge cook ahead. Hundreds of lakota and cheyenne galp forward. Despite having suffered hardly any casualties cavalry still on the prairie. Start to buckle. This includes battalion commander. Marcus reno whom fred gerard watches back while still throwing it back to quote fred. I saw him put a bottle of whiskey to his mouth and drink the whole contents crazy horse. Other leaders and fellow fighters follow the cavalry into the trees. It's a full on malay. According to flying hawk the dust was thick and we could hardly see we got right. Among the soldiers killed a lot with our bows and arrows. Tomahawks crazy horse was ahead of all and he killed a lot of them with his war club amid the fierce fighting the shot rips through the head of an rigorous scout blooding exiting his skull. The bullet showers major marcus reno and the dead scouts blood bone fragments and brains. Any of you men who wish to make your escape. Follow me the shot. Rain and blood splattered inebriated. Beatrix desperately calls out. Those are here mount their horses and follow while others on but crazy. Horse's pushing for decisive. Come on die with me. It's a good day to die. Cowards to the rear he exclaims with renewed effort and is man pursued. The fleeing cavalry firing bullets and arrows alike. The lakota cheyenne pickoff. Cavalry men with ease splash into the little big horn river. After their commander one warrior will lay. Recall and i quote it was like chasing buffalo upon reaching the little bighorn eastern bank. The blue clad soldiers horses slipped and scramble as they send steep clay covered slope. Finally they reached the relative safety of hilltop exhausted. Cavalryman immediately dig rifle pits and fire a few shots some cries. They look down on their dead in the river and woods below. They've lost thirty two troupes three officers. Three civilians and to recruit scouts still more missing and thirteen of the roughly one hundred cavalry men on this hill or wounded. Yeah this didn't go as planned the lakota and cheyenne have their own dead to mourn. Ten women and children and eleven fighting than nine lakota to tucson but at least they have successfully defended their village and families. You've missed the fight. Short bowl says the crazy horse teasing for missing the first twenty minutes of the battle. Sorry to miss the fight crazy horse answers with a laugh then somber tone overtakes pointing north continues. There's a good fight. Come over the hill. Data with a big fight is going to be will not miss that one crazy horse's planning to a large group of caverns miles on the distance. It's led by a call long hair. But you might know the lieutenant colonel by his giving me george armstrong custer Welcome to history. That doesn't suck. I'm you professor. Greg jackson liked to tell you the story today. We have the story of one of the best known battles of the indian wars the battle of the little bighorn also known as the battle of the greasy grass but you may know it by a term that romanticize the last moments of the seventh cavalry's commander custer's last and why did this battle even happen well from treaties to black hills gold. I'll give you that important background as we examine this battle. That is a part of the great sioux war as we go. I'll introduce you to some important indigenous nations as well as key players. George armstrong custer sitting bull crazy horse. Then we'll get to the battle itself and of course contextualized. What happens to george custer in his then finally we get to one last sad chapter the suffering of the lakota cheyenne and arapaho and the battles aftermath. We have a lot to do so. Let's head back nearly a decade to the eighteen sixty eight and later self so we can follow how this fateful battle ever came to be. You know how we do that rewind indigenous groups. On america's great plains live the life many twentieth and twenty first century. americans will mistakenly attribute to all american indians they live. Tv's follow the buffalo and make horse riding art that said you'll find a rich variety of languages cultures friends and enemies here. We're going to interact with at least four such groups meaningfully in this episode. Let me introduce some of them. I'll start with the largest group. The sioux nations lakota people. Do you remember my explanation of the su- during the last episode. No worries if you don't here's a quick refresher in mid nineteenth century. America the su- divided into three major groups going from east to west. They are the dakota originally of minnesota now in eastern dakota territory as you likely recall from last time then comes the nakata who live more centrally in the dakota territory just east of the missouri river and finally the lakota. This group spans the western portion of the dakota territory and continues well into wyoming territory a population of perhaps twenty thousand the lakota. Roughly half of the entire sue population. The lakota also further divided into seven smaller and quite independent subgroups. I won't listen right here. I realized that could get a little overwhelming to remember in a single episode. But when you later hear me describe lakota. Say crazy horse as an oglala lakota. You'll know the adjective is subgroup. Likewise keep in. Mind that when you hear sue that could be him for the lakota or a reference to them coupled with other groups context will be key. Got that locked in sweet. We're golden next. we have the cheyenne the arapaho. The cheyenne or an algorithm speaking people originally from the great lakes region conflict with other indigenous groups and white settlers alike. Push them onto the great plains. Here bumped into the entirely distinct and separate arapahoe people in time. These two peoples developed a unique sign language that came to be used by various great plains tribes to overcome linguistic barriers. The cheyenne and arapaho fought together against the westward. Moving lakota for control of the game filled mountain range located in the western portion of the future state of south dakota. These mountains are known as the black hills but that conflict is well in the past by the mid-nineteenth century. The lakota have enjoyed firm control over the black hills for several decades and consider this mountain range to be sacred. Meanwhile the cheyenne and arapaho have split or are splitting into northern and southern bands the northern cheyenne and northern. Arapaho are. the ones will follow today and by this point. They've allied with their former. Fo- the lakota. But that doesn't mean. Conflict has disappeared from the great plains are fourth and final indigenous nations the crow and they are enemies of the lakota. Both claims seeing territory near the powder river basin and future wyoming otherwise defined the crow west of the lakota and north of the northern shan. Roughly at montana territory southern border. I realize that was a lot of new information. Just remember that. By this point the lakota northern cheyenne and northern arapaho are allied together. And they in the our enemies. If you've got your good so now. Let's start to trace the current conflict between the lakota alliance and the united states. It's april twenty ninth eighteen. Sixty eight leaders from the lakota. Northern arapaho and the united states are gathered at fort laramie and what is just months away from being organized as wyoming territory. They're here sign. A treaty. now leaders from these and several other indigenous tribes allies and enemies alike signed another treaty with the us near this same four back in eighteen fifty one. It said the united states may build forts in native american territory. Guarantee settlers safe passage along the oregon trail and find territory between all parties but it failed miserably. After the discovery of gold and soon to be montana territory by eighteen sixty three droves gold seeking settlers began breaking from the oregon trail at fort laramie to follow the new bozeman trail. Six hundred mile path of urgent city montana right through crow and lakota disputed territory. The crew didn't really mind in american presence as reinforced. The treaty saying this land was. There's the lakota this as a threat. Became all the more real after cavalry. Colonel john shiffman and his men massacred some two hundred of the lakota. Cheyenne and arapaho allies in colorado on november twenty ninth eighteen sixty four. I don't use that word lightly. Sand creek wasn't a battle. Most of those killed were women and children. The army used cheyenne and arapaho toddlers for target practice. Captain silas soule who refuse to participate or lead. His men participate later testified against the colonel and was murdered shortly thereafter. If not a direct factor in oglala lakota leader clouds choice to lead a coalition to war against the us army in not yet formed wyoming territory. The massacre may help explain red cloud's own heavy tactics on twenty first eighteen sixty six that day. Ten indigenous soldiers drew eighty-one. Us troops to ambush. They then slew. Every single man horrified. Us citizens called it. A massacre the lakota. Cheyenne arapaho called it a battle. Whatever you call it. Red cloud not only one day. He won the war so now in eighteen. Sixty eight red. Cloud's war has brought on this new treaty. It establishes the great sioux reservation. Which is roughly the western. Half of what will eventually become. The state of south dakota crucially. It includes lakota. Sacred black hills it also shuts down the bozeman trail. The cuts through which is just west of the newly designated. Great sioux reservation is now dubbed unseeded. Territory it's a bit of a knife in the back to the crow considering that the last treaty designated much of this as theirs and they stood by the united states but to real win for red cloud and his allies finally the treaty says no additional land may be seated to the us by future treaty. Unless and i quote signed by at least three fourths of all the adult male indians close quote although a considerably smaller territory than what the lakota and larger sioux nation have previously claimed many indigenous leaders. See this as their best. Current option. Several lakota nakada and arapahoe leaders sign or make their acts which may or may not indicate a full understanding of the document between april and november. Us dignitaries sign as well. This includes us civil war hero. Well here at the north william tecumseh sherman but not all lakota. Cheyenne and arapaho leaders. Teeth like red cloud some like sitting bull and crazy horse refused to trust the united states reject treaty in its boundaries if. Us leaders want these non treaty lakota to stay on the rez. We'll have to do it by force. it's now eighteen. Seventy four and the non treaty likud and our allies are really frustrating philip sheridan. I know it seems like every time we turn around this. Us civil war hero again. Here to the north is in our post civil war episodes. It's true the short bail chested handlebar moustache. General bounces from reconstructing the south to the any wars. So here we are again with phil now as i said. He's frustrated since non tree. Lakota do not recognize the eighteen. Sixty eight agreement. They're continuing about their life without concern for its boundaries this means rating in fighting against their indigenous enemy the pony as well as white sellers and others and falls with the union pacific railroad on land. These lakota do not recognize a seated. It doesn't help. That phil has no particular love for native americans. The war in general is alleged to have once declared quote. The only good indians i ever saw were dead. Close quote thankfully. His answer to this situation is more measured than that rhetoric. I thought it would be the best policy for the government surround this reservation by large military posts to ultimately keep the indians within its bounds and the white people from encroaching on its limits. Fill likes rules clear. Expectations and compliance using coercive means to keep the lakota in in white settlers. Out sounds great to him he calls on one of his favorite subordinates. From the civil war years to scout out a location for four in the black hills. This is george armstrong custer. We first met george back episode sixty at the eighteen. Sixty three battle of gettysburg. But let me get you up to speed with him. The thin blue eyed long and curly. Haired mustaschioed cavalry. Commander made a name for himself in the civil war. It was one of his men. Mortally wounded the famous and feared confederate. General jeb stuart. At the battle of yellow tavern episode sixty four george gained a reputation for bravery in risk taking that tended to work out an appreciated trait on the battlefield. Though deeply in love none of that lets up when he marries. Elizabeth libbie bacon in february eighteen. Sixty four as phil. Sheridan observed only a few weeks after the ceremony. Custer you're the only man who matrimony has not spoiled for a charge like many successful union commanders and officers. The end of the civil war didn't mean piece for the seemingly always lucky george armstrong custer. It only meant a new theater of war in eighteen. Sixty six georgia sent. West as a newly commissioned lieutenant colonel in the seventh us calorie native americans of the great plains came to know george better than they'd like in eighteen sixty eight while pursuing a war party in indian territory future oklahoma. His osage indian scouts determine that they'd entered the primarily cheyenne village so on the morning of november twenty seventh. George ordered an attack. I can't give you an accurate death. Toll all i can tell you for sure. Is that southern cheyenne leader black kettle and his wife medicine. Woman both die from being shot back. Seven cavalry killed an unspecified number of women and children as well. Six hundred seventy five horses and when neighboring indigenous villages came to help georgia's men retreated by using hostages as human shields. George called to battle the battle of wash atop river. The cheyenne called it. A massacre so now in the summer of eighteen. Seventy four georgia's leading this expedition to sort out a place for four in the black hills. This is no small affair. He's got almost one thousand soldiers. Gatling guns sixty one rick. Ross scouts whose people are sworn enemies of the lakota and like any expedition a handful of newspaper reporters and academics. He's also got to minors dan. That's quite the crew. How many guys does it take to find a suitable location for a fort. And that's where things get a bit. Sketch georgia's official task is to locate a good spot for a fort. But is he looking for gold to afford is arguably legitimate under the eighteen. Sixty treaty looking for gold is not an newspapers across the nation are about the latter. Here's the baltimore sun's july twenty fifth eighteen seventy four headline quote looking for gold. Custer's exploring expedition close quote. The boston advertiser also thinks this expedition is less about a fort and more about wealth but it's writers have sympathy for the lakota. Decries the expedition as quote a continuation of the long course of bad faith which the united states has consistently pursued in its dealings with the redman. Close quote. i can't tell you if it's july thirty first or early august sources conflict but it's during that week that georgia's to minors try panning for gold in the black hills french creek and at some point. Yeah they find gold. One of the original scouts looks on utterly confused. Why are these men's screaming jumpings. Throwing their hats in the air. Even dancing talking to private effort he wonders if the mountain spirits have done something to these guys know the private explains their excitement is of a much more terrestrial or whatever intentions. We do. Don't ascribe to george custer's expedition. The discovery of gold brings on a gold rush already suffering through a severe recession since last year. American citizens flocked to the black hills. Soon general philip. Sheridan can't kick miners out of the black hills half as fast as they arriving that means the united states now failing to uphold the fort laramie treaty of eighteen. Sixty eight president ulysses s. Grant's first reaction is to make this right not surprising. Considering this is the first president to name an american indian. Ely parker as the commissioner of the bureau of indian affairs as we learned in episode seventy four further. His peace policy is predicated upon success of the reservation system. He wants this to work you. Liz offers to buy the black hills from the sioux nation for six million dollars. That's not going to fly. Remember the soup. Consider the black hills to be sacred. This is their faith. Might as well asked by the vatican jerusalem mecca. Some things just aren't for sale. Meanwhile secretary of the interior columbus delano tells the president that while. His office wishes to honor the treaty. It would also quote us every effort possible to extinguish the indian title to the black hills country in open the same to settlement and for minerals at the earliest day. Practicable close quote. Sounds like the grant administration is talking out both sides of it's mouth at least until november third eighteen. Seventy five a meeting with his top brass. Convinces you list that the military is incapable of enforcing the eighteen sixty treaty by keeping white settlers out of the black hills with that bleak perspective list says the military will stop even trying because doing so quote only increased to dare the miners desires and complicated. Troubles close quote. Meanwhile you will enforce the treaty on the sieve. Even those lakota and allied bands that never signed or accepted the treaty. Agents are sent to tell them that if they don't relocate to the great sioux reservation by january thirty first eighteen seventy six they will be considered quote unquote hostile. Well non treaty. Lakota like sitting bull crazy horse and thousands of others won't be reporting to the rise instead frustrated lakota on the reservation begin leaving to join them. The group is still in the treaties. Unseated suit territory. But that isn't the res- which means the united states government dubs them as hostile on february first and so as white sellers continue to violate the eighteen. Sixty eight treaty the. Us army moves out to force this burgeoning band of lakota and allies onto the reservation defined by that same treaty. Thus begins the great sioux war of eighteen. Seventy six strategically the. Us military's plan is simple led by seasoned civil war vets. Three armies will move against the various bands of non treaty indians in a pincer movement that converges on them in unseated territory. General george crook's column will march north from wyoming. Territory's fort fetterman coming from montana territory. Colonel john gibbons column will depart from four ellis marching east and crucially general alfred. Terry's calm will march west from dakota territory's fort abraham lincoln with him as the us seventh. Cavalry its commander as you know is the already famous civil war hero lieutenant colonel george armstrong custer but simple. Plans do not equate execution starting march. First general george crook's nearly seven hundred men move up the bozeman trail little over. Two weeks later cavalry. Donald j j reynolds spot horse tracks near the powder river that lead them to a cheyenne village. On the frigid subzero morning of march seventeenth is men attack. Cheyenne fighter tells us that quote women's screened sheldon cried for their mother's old people tottered away to get out of reach of the bullets singing among the lodges quote with leaders urging them to fight like men two hundred fifty or so warriors attained high grounded. Hold back the almost four hundred cavalryman for hours. As the village escapes the battle of black powder river claims few lives about four cavalryman four american indian warriors it also helps push the non treaty indians together with their camp destroyed. This shyam ban trudges through the freezing temperatures to crazy. Horse's oglala lakota village seeing the his village is too small to take care of so many crazy horse breaks camp and leads both groups to a far larger village of honk. Papa and many kanju lakota. Its leaders sitting bull. Meanwhile more reservation dwelling native americans are deciding to throw in with their non treaty. Brethren remember that combined lakota cheyenne-arapaho village. I told you about in this episode's opening well it's starting to form. Meanwhile general george crook has little choice but to retreat back to fort fetterman in other words all his quickly court martialed colonel manage to do is fill the lakota and their allies with resolved fight. It will be a few months before the next battle says the three columns move and the non treaty indian village swells. Let me officially introduce you to our two. Most famous lakota leaders sitting bull crazy horse born in or around eighteen. Thirty one sitting bull is a. Honk papa lakota. He acquired his name or rather this name as a teenager by counting coup in a battle against the crow in other words he exposed himself to great danger by getting in close quarters touching an enemy warrior than writing off. It's a deadly gamble. But american indians of the great plains value the move as a display of bravery and skill. So that's how he earned the name sitting bull and by the eighteen sixties. This handsome strong george. Straight mouth lakota. Quite the name for himself among his people sitting bull deeply values liberty and freedom to quote him all agency. Indians i have seen are worthless now. We are poor but we are free close quote and now by eighteen seventy six thousands of lakota cheyenne and other allies. Look to the non treaty. Resistor sitting bull for their spiritual political leadership. There are many other important leaders. Working with sitting bull like fellow. Hung pop lakota. Chief gal oglala lakota. Hey dog or the cheyenne leaders. Lame white man and two moons but the most famous figure working with sitting bull at this point is crazy. Horse the details of crazy horse's childhood or than clear. He was born somewhere around eighteen. Forty two parents from two different lakota bands and lived among at least a third nonetheless associated with his. Father's band the oglala lakota. There are a few different accounts of how he acquired his name. But when i find the most convincing is that as a teenager he returned from a battle with another tribal with two scalps overcome with pride at the skill and bravery this displayed his father. Who has already named crazy. Horse gave his own name to his young son. His skill and shrewd battle tactics are proven again and again in battle against enemy tribes and the united states. For instance. remember. When i told you that. Ten warriors lert william fetterman and eighty other. Us troops to their deaths during red cloud's war. Well crazy horse was one of those ten choices off. The battlefield aren't so great a few years ago he ran off with a married woman. Her husband been shot crazy horse in the face. Miraculously he survived. The whole event was scandalous in crazy horse lost status with his people but he's still a leader of sorts. I mean the young looking warrior with a curiously light complexion in hair down to his hips is simply unmatched on the battlefield. No one can overlook that in these perilous times and so in eighteen. seventy six. as winter gives way to spring sitting bull's non treaty village continues to grow as lakota cheyenne and arapaho flock to it soon enough. It consists thousands of people including some two thousand or so warriors and in june. The good spiritual sign with the village camping by the rosebud. Victory over the begins the two day to night ritual sundance on june sixth. This is an annual ritual of purification and common among many of the people in the great plains. But it's especially important this year given the conflict ahead sitting bull purifies in a sweat lodge. He carries out the pipe ceremony. One hundred small pieces of flesh are cut from his arms as he praised to the walkin tonka or as white americans understand it the great spirit. He faints while dancing has a vision of down earless soldiers and their horses falling into the midst of liquidity bees when he comes to sitting bull sacrifices of buffalo and interprets his dream. The village will enjoy great victory but the missing ears mean they're warriors must have stained from taking any prizes off the debt villages elated in victory soon cons after a few smaller skirmishes crazy horse leads some one thousand or so warriors out to meet general george crook. Yes after getting lick retreating this past winter. he's already heading northward into the unseeded territory crazy. Horse's army rides fifty miles through the night of june sixteenth to carry out a sneak attack and it works on the morning of the seventeenth. The lakota cheyenne army descends upon us troops and their crow and shoshoni allies for three hours the approximately equal in size armies ballot out mid the fighting cheyenne man loses his war pony. Right in front of us forces the perilous position is fellow warriors. Assume he's a goner. Well all the his sister that is ready to risk all for her siblings buffalo calf road woman rights straight into enemy fire rabs and pulls him onto her steve gallops off to safety for that act of bravery and display of great plains indian. Horsemanship the lakota. Cheyenne army names. The engagement after her calling it the battle where the young girl saved her brother the. Us will name it. after nearby. the battle of the rosebud the non treaty indian army since general. George crook's column on the retreat. Is this the victory sitting bull for saw. Something so others aren't so sure. Casualties were low on both sides. Shouldn't the victory be a bit more definitive well. There are two things american indian forces. Don't know i just deflected one of three armies ruining the planned three-way pincer movement second a far larger engagement with a different. Us army is only week away. The massive non treaty indian village now includes people from all seven bands of the lakota. And plenty of cheyenne rapa. They've moved as well. They're thousand or so teepees now. Stretch out a full mile along the greasy grass river's western bank or the little bighorns western bank. Kick your name. The dance nightly celebrating their recent victory. The village knows there's another army approaching from the east but few of heart from the prayerful sitting bull are worried about it. They're sure the army still full days march away. At least that's right. We're back to where this episode opened the army approaching. The village is the seventh u s. Cavalry yes lieutenant. Colonel george armstrong custer's unit his commanding officer general. Alfred terry has sent the long curly haired cavalryman down to the little bighorn river's headwaters with hopes he and his roughly six hundred men can pursue the non treaty indian village. Downriver that is north in into the us military's waiting arms now approaching noon on june twenty fifth. The seventh calories crow scouts found the villages path. Last night in georgia's had them on the march since unfortunately for him he's been brought to his attention. That some cheyenne warriors have also found his trail determined not to let this village slip away. George figures he has to attack immediately and to that end he now splits his forces now. Both george top subordinate commanders. Major marcus reno. And captain frederick bending dislike him maybe even hate him especially frederick. He's never forgiven. George relieving a friend of his for dead back ouachita in eighteen sixty eight but personal relations notwithstanding frederic pantene in his hundred fifteen men are to go farther south west and make sure there aren't any other non treaty indian camps down that way. If frederick doesn't find anything he's to hook back up with the rest of the army immediately. The crow scout advises george not to divide his men. But he won't listen. He sends frederick small battalion on their way now about two thirty. George has covered several miles. And they've come upon an abandoned campsite. There's alone teepee left with the dead body of a warrior inside. The dead man passed from wounds at the battle of rosebud. That saint george crook's common retreat. But of course. George custer and his men know nothing about that. All this george knows is the campfire. Embers are still hot so the lakota cheyenne village. Can't be far. He figures he has to move. He splits his forces again. George orders marcus reno to take three companies of a hundred and fifty or so men including crow in a recruit scouts and russia had at the village. George assures marcus that he will be right behind. Sporting mitch boyer a half french canadian. Half santee dakota scout employers lieutenant colonel once more not displayed his forces. It's really is big scouts. Please falling deaf ears. Black friday has come early for this week. Only my new audio course game changers now fifty percent off on himalayan learning in audio learning platform that provides an extensive library of courses from the world's greatest minds like malcolm glad. Well tim ferriss. Seth godin and more take advantage of this discount. And learn something new this year go to himalayas dot com forward slash greg to claim your fifty percent discount. Now i hope to see you there and now back to the story. You know what happens to marcus reno. The alcoholic major liquors up and attacks half an hour later has his men. Dismount gets chased into the trees. By the little big horn river then gets chased across it and up the steep clay hill. That is the river's eastern bank by a little after four pm. His failure is as strong as his buzz but to be fair. Where george custer said. He'd support marcus's attack instead the lakota and cheyenne saw the seventh cavalry commander and his remaining forces farther down river along the hills of the eastern bank. So what's up with that by support. I don't think george custer meant. I'm right behind you. This is a. Oh how should i put this overconfident. Army three pm as marcus reno is charging across the prairie to carry out his attack. George his five companies are indeed on the hills of the river's eastern bank laying. There is on the distant lakota. Cheyenne-arapaho village imagine being one of these just over two hundred men. They look at this village of possibly eight thousand in our intimidated. In the least excited they found the indians. Hold your horses boys. George calls to his cavalryman. There are plenty of them. Down there foresaw. Orders are written for two groups. Georgia's younger brother. Captain tom custer. Nco to call the pack train. That is the hundred or so men with their supplies to come up and provide support. Go to captain. Mcdougal tell him to bring the pack train straight across the country if any pacts come loose cut them and come on quick a big indian camp. You see captain. Ben teen tell him to come quick a big indian camp george custer and his five companies continue south. Oh they are getting close to the village. Looks like there aren't even many defenders. They're all busy fighting. Marcus reno's men who at this point seem to be doing just fine. Excellent george announces. They'll descend on the village if he can make prisoners of the women and children. Well this could play out as well as the success. He had our shida back in eighteen. Sixty eight before the cheyenne got reinforcements. But he gives one more order before they move out. He tells giovanni martini to go. Get captain frederick. Banting tell him he's needed not confident. The italian immigrant turned. Us army trumpeter understands in adjutant writes the order out so he can hand it to the captain. Letter reads ben team. Come on big village. Be quick bring packs. Ps bring packs. Things get harder to recount at this point deadman tell no tales as they say so historians will never know just what george custer and his men are thinking in their final moments by. Can't tell you what the lakota and cheyenne thinking and feeling their account and military investigations. Also give us a glimpse into the calories last moments. So let's do this as best as we can the coda in cheyenne warrior. The cavalry on the bluffs. Just across the little big horn river. it's terrifying and discouraging site. The all figure they're done for sitting bull encourages them the powerfulness him and declares we are here to protect our wives and children and we must not let the soldiers get them. Make up ray fight. It's about this time. That marcus reno's attack is falling apart now in a ravine down cedar. Cooley george custer in his officers likely discuss strategy at this point do they charge the village or do they wait for reinforcements. Seems they try to have the best of both worlds captain myles keogh takes a wing composed of three companies farther north to some hills where they can watch for captain frederick banting meanwhile captain george gates is wing consisting of the other two companies goes west down medicine tail cooley. The are just across the little big horn river from the village for your sea-captain captain eaton's manned a fight. Ensues bullets and arrows fly and soon a few cavalryman drop dead in the river. Historians will later disagree on what gates his wing is doing. Is this fainting. Move or are these soldiers trying to ford the river and hit the village. I can't tell you. Just as i can't tell you which wing george custer is with a cheyenne account later say a buckskin. Clad officer is in this fight and a shot. This is george custer's wearing but it's doubtful this him. His remington rifle uses brass. Cased is not the usual copper. And let's just say we're going to find a lot of brass casings elsewhere. On the field. Either way captain gates his wing retreats sending another ravine called deep cooley. He and his men reunite with myles. Keogh swing just before five pm. Meaning george custer in his five companies are all back together on a hill as i assume considering the next move hundreds of warriors are silently moving toward his unified companies the attack sporadically at first an isolated shot strikes. Us soldier and aero seems to drop from the sky the calorie counting and see them half the time. Been the tactic sop warriors. Aero's seen guns crack. Some three hundred of them have repeating rifles. Superior to that of the cavalry. He's projectiles fall on us as cavalry like bringing they dismount. Form lines and fire back but between the night march long rides and now growing fear there shaking leaves. Were still for them. They make great targets. Stand out in their blue uniforms. On the top of the hill in warriors. Keep it here. I can almost feel the terror rising end up. I can almost hear them screaming. And i can just imagine them thinking god. Damn where is frederick ben team. George custer makes a move with a meager seventy men. He charges toward the river. We can only assume he's still thinking that you can afford it. He can take captives but he did ouachita and get this far larger army to yield. They don't even make it to the water. Cheyenne warriors unleashed more. Bullets and arrows on jordan has been flee back up the slope more than dying as they go. It's not like things are better up here. Myles keogh swing is still getting slaughtered. Captains command includes george. Custer's brother-in-law intended james kelly james and most of his men die on a hill together from now on. The graphical feature will bear his name calvin hill bulletin arrows continued rain. Those few who survived the slaughter on calhoun hill. Fleet to their wing commander. It doesn't good here. On the edge of battle ridge the cavalryman or shot down rapidly as crazy horse and sitting bull's nephew white ball charged back and forth through the blue clad ranks. The overwhelming numbers and work of death is taken reason itself from the. Us soldiers the fire in the air at the ground. Some are just frozen petrified with fear standing bear will later say. I really felt sorry for them. They look so frightened. Many of them lay on the ground with their blue eyes open waiting to be killed not all feels such sympathy more overcome with grief and rachel how they've suffered for years at the hands of the us military or even today chief gall wants blood for his two wives and three children killed just this afternoon no surrender or plea for mercy will be accepted in the words of gauls fellow. Lakota iron hawk. These white men wanted it. They called for it. And i let them have it. Can myles keogh falls dead in a literal pile of bodies. Meanwhile george custer's group is back. On top of battle ridge ban any remaining survivors. Gather on an all the created defensive barrier by shooting horses in using the bodies for cover like desperation numbering less than one hundred surrounded by even more blue-clad corpses in over a thousand code in cheyenne warriors. He's terrified man. Must know there as good as dad. This is it. This is where they'll make their last stand. Bulletin arrows continue to fly. Forty cavalryman decide to make a run for it and plead for the little bighorn. But there's no shortage of warriors to greet them as they did cut off. They run into a gold called deep ravine whether by bullet or club all of them are dead within minutes and it's not long afterward the sound and spoke of firing guns. On the grassy knoll dissipate. A warrior cries out. All of the white men are dead. I can't tell you exactly how. George custer met his end amid his brass casings. He lays on top of others at the null. The corpse has a bullet hole in the chest and left temple. He probably thought wounded for some period of time as the chest. Wound was mortal but not immediate. It may have been inflicted by the cheyenne hero of the battle of rosebud. Buffalo calf road woman the northern cheyenne will keep this under wraps for over a century but in the early twenty first century the publicly share their tradition buffalo calf road woman was the one knock george custer from his horse yet that contradicts accounts that credit spotted antelope or brave bear. So we'll never really know as for the shot through his head. Something it was. A mercy shot fired by his younger brother. Captain thomas custer after all. Tom's body lays here to only fifteen feet away from george. He may have wanted to spare his superior officer and brother from a more gruesome like the when he personally met. Tom's head has been crushed to a thickness of about one inch. He never would have been identified if not for his tattoos as the youngest custer. Brother and nephew late teens boston. Custer and henry read their among the forty who ran down the deep ravine their bodies lay in there with all. The others. Fled the null. There are no survivors. Among george custer's five companies. Of course that isn't the end of the battle or the seventh cavalry. Italian-born giovanni martini. Got the message to frederick benton. Earlier that afternoon as its battalion was coming up though it ran into what was left. Marcus reno's frederick told him about the note. But marcus said he wasn't going anywhere without more ammo which was with the still on route. Pattering unaware of how screwed the lieutenant. Colonel really was by this point. Frederick reinforced the still drinking whisky major. This catches us up to about the time. George custer's five companies are getting wiped out and now the lakota and cheyenne warriors. Come at frederick reno's position for miles. Farther south there to battalion suffered casualties but hold their positions along with the later arriving pantry soldiers until the native americans who see a large army approaching break off the attack the following evening. June twenty sixth that armies. George custer's commander general electric terry. He and his forces arrived the next day. June twenty sabbath. Their arrival may very well have saved the rest in. Us seventh cavalry so the battle of the little bighorn or the greasy grass is over but its impact on the united states and far more so on the lakota. Cheyenne and arapaho. Peoples is only just beginning. Let's unpack all of that. I the united states alfred. -tarian is men are stunned to find george custer and his five companies wiped out. Marcus reno and frederick. Benton are equally stunned when they're generals get to their position and break the news. The days soldiers start to count bodies. Us army has lost two hundred. Fifty eight men including three civilians like boston custer and has another sixty wounded compare that to just over thirty lakota and cheyenne warrior deaths in ten innocent women and children. This was an incredible american indian. Victory in us cavalry defeat yet lost in early death immortalized. George armstrong custer. He becomes a legend. American society already held him as a revered civil war hero in indian fighter a courageous man for whom things always worked out in luck never abandoned until that day georgia's men are romanticized newspapers in school. Primers which bill the fallen lieutenant colonel as a hero and a quote unquote true man within weeks of the battle in montana territory at least five dime novels hit the shelves telling me highly fictionalized glorified story of georgia's death georgia's devoted widow. Libby takes her pen and writes a three volume memoir of her soldier husband buffalo. Bill cody's wild west show. Which will tour the united states in europe at the turn of the century will reenacting glorify custer staff or rather custer's last stand but what of the lakota cheyenne and arapaho. Their decisive victory in a battle. They didn't start and fought protect. Their homelands cost them dearly. Colonel john gibbon who are mind you lead. The montana column had sympathy for the sioux native americans in general just before receiving orders to do his part in the pincer movement. He wrote this in the army and navy journal quote. What would i do if treated as the indian has been in is. I have seen one who hates an indian as he does snake and thinks there is no good indian but a dead one on having the proposition put to him. In this way grind his teeth in rage and exclaim. I would cut the heart out of everyone. I lay my hands on close quote. I think the civil war hero gotta right. It makes sense of the lakota and cheyenne not taking prisoners and frankly being brutal as iron hawk will later say while explaining how he pummeled a cavalry. Man's head with a bo. I was very mad because the women and children had run away. Scared and i was thinking about this when i did this. Killing in other words aren't hawk wasn't to use a term of the era a quote unquote savage. Who enjoyed brutality. He was a man furiously protecting his family in that. Same fury the lakota and cheyenne utah and rob. The dead cavalry now sitting bull's dream for told a great victory which people had but it also contained a warning. A voice had said the fallen soldiers were not to be touched. That's not what happens. Though as revenge is taken by many including widowed women morning their husbands in goods are stolen sitting bull sees this as a failure his nephew one bowl later. Great medicine man been proclaimed. This failure would curse his people to quote covet white people's belongings and starve at the white man's door. Close quote while. I respectfully doubt stolen guns and coffee impacted. Anything it's bit irie to see how on point symbols prophecies continued to be the outcome of the little bighorn galvanizes. Us soldiers politicians back east to crush indians and their leaders specially sitting bull and crazy horse on august fifteenth president ulysses s grant signs the su- appropriation bill though it contains increases in food payments which we should note are less kindness and more necessity. The bill also withholds payment from any indian tribes fighting the us army it further promises to withhold any food or cash payments to the lakota until they give up the unseeded territory and their reservations black hills as the over hunted for sport. Buffalo can no longer sustain them. The likud are basically left choosing between partying with moorland including their sacred black hills or starving to death. That's not much of a choice. But that's not the end of it deeply embarrassed. That indians could beat a cavalry unit so badly. Us pursues the non treaty village many of them including sitting bull flee canada for at least the next few years some stay longer. Those don't make ultimately find themselves pushed reservations. This includes crazy horse who out of options rides with nearly one thousand followers into fort robinson on may six eighteen seventy seven. He says he wants peace but knowing his skill the army actually wants to fight for them against other tribes. It's hard to know what exactly happens. But his words get translated in a meeting. Crazy horse flees but is convinced by friends and other native leaders to return to fort robinson in nebraska. Crazy horse doesn't understand. Though that england back they'll be placed in prison when this finally dons on him. Back at the fort he breaks free from the escorts harms. A fellow lakota. Little big man. He captain kennington and runs for freedom or tries. Little big man manages to grab his wrist crazy pulls hidden knife and cuts his friend stabbed. The son of a bitch stabbed the son of a bitch. Captain kennington screams a soldier bayonets. The legendary warrior moved indoors. He lays in pain for hours. And a one point man just eke out that no white man is to blame for this acclaimed the indians but whether those who convinced him to return to blame or the. Us army is the result is the same that night. September fifth eighteen seventy seven crazy horse passes away with him dies any remaining hope of sue independence but arguably the worst of the fallout from the little bighorn lands on the non treaty shan following their surrender their moved to reservations far from home out in indian territory. A place you. And i knows oklahoma in the process. Sickness and hunger infants the old in the week to the graves. It seems like a death sentence. So dole knife and little wolf lead three hundred in a desperate attempt to escape and return to their homelands. This is exhausting. They live is fugitives. In december eighteen. Seventy eight they split up little wolf continues to elude authorities. Dull knife goes with others to surrender. Taken for robinson they'll be returned to oklahoma. No dole nice group of one hundred forty nine people fuses soldiers at the four answer their refusal by refusing them food water or wood for fire to stay warm if they want any of. These life sustaining assesses. They'll have to agree to go to oklahoma. They still don't cave instead. The group tries to make a run for on january ninth. Eighteen seventy nine few succeed. In the following weeks soldiers killed sixty four of the escapees and recapture most of the rest. This is known as the fort robinson massacre. But there's one redeeming virtue in dole knife and little wolf's flight some of them do make it to their homeland and are finally permitted. Stay that's why there is a northern cheyenne reservation. Twenty-first-century month's southern. Shane will remain along with the rap. Ajo in oklahoma. Cheyenne won't be the last to make a break from a reservation and as these fights continue. Summer asking do you. Native americans have civil rights. Next time we'll see standing bear raising press this very question. They'll do so any. Us federal court. History that doesn't suck is created and hosted by greg jackson researching and writing by greg jackson and sale salazar production by airship audio editing. By molly sound design by derek barons being composed by greg. Jack's arrangement and additional composition by lindsey graham of airship or bibliography of all primary and secondary sources consulted in writing this episode visit. Hdd s podcast. Dot com https is supported by fans at caitriona dot com forward slash history. That doesn't suck seattle and dire beyond great kind souls providing funding to help us keep dainty and a special things to our patrons whose monthly gift puts them at abuser status quo. Jack ashton will call christopher coddle. Jason carson's john. Frugal dougal downer. Bob drazen duped youkilis michael. Rachel burke leany drew hill andrew. Fortunately lee goldman brandon. It bryce handcock brad firm decks jones. John leech chris mendoza. Jeffrey needs sean. Reagan david alexander sharp brandon shaw scott slain maker jay walker meghan award and. Doug would join me in two weeks. Where i'd like to tell you a story.

george armstrong custer Us marcus reno george crook cheyenne twenty fifth black hills dakota wyoming bozeman trail Cheyenne george georgia montana big horn river fort fetterman George salvatori Commander major marcus fred gerard
The End of Rinderpest

Stuff You Missed in History Class

41:38 min | 1 year ago

The End of Rinderpest

"This episode is brought to you by Milano cookies look sometimes that long Zen Yoga classes just not in the cards, so maybe a cookie is pepperidge farm Milano believes you should make some time for yourself once in a while I know I have a particular space in my sewing room. That I like to just take a few minutes every day. I sit there I. Think about things it's kind. Kind of like meditation and Munching at the same time you can get that Yemi. Beautiful Cookie Flavor makes it luxurious and delightful, and I always feel recharged Milano. Cookies are truly a treat worthy of your meantime they are delicate, and Krispy with luxuriously rich chocolate in the middle. You really want to keep these just for you, so remember to save something for yourself with Pepperidge, Farm Milano Hi I'm Laura Vander, Cam, and the host of the before breakfast podcast and the author of several time management books I'm also the host of IHEART media's newest podcast the new corner office in this show we share strategies for thriving in the new world of work one where the location and hours from flexible than in the past listen over that First Cup of coffee and I promise you learn something useful. Listen to the new corner office every weekday on the iheartradio APP apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome to stuff. You missed in history class production of iheartradio. Hello and welcome to the PODCAST, Tracy Wilson and I'm Ali Fry Holly. You and I've been talking recently about how it feels weird. To do topics that aren't. Somehow relevant to what's happening in the world right now. And yet also it feels like it could become really fatiguing for us, and for listeners to just be in a state of dire crisis all the time on the show. Yeah I. It's making subject selection of very weird process for me because I am like on the one hand. Hey, wouldn't it be nice to talk about something else and having escape episode, alright and on the other It's hard. To feel like you're doing justice to the time, we're living in by escaping it. Yeah, it's tricky, so we're in this weird place where we're trying to pick topics. That you know, folks will want to listen to you because we understand people listen to our podcast for fun, but at the same time like the pandemic is influencing our thought process. And, that is bringing us to today's episode, which is another one that's inspired by this pandemic, but not directly related to it, and also if you're just like man, I cannot deal with some more pandemic stuff right now. This is also a story that has some traumatic stuff in the middle, but it's ultimately positive and hopeful, because it involves the total eradication of the disease in question. Back in two thousand thirteen, when we did our episode on Edward Jenner and the smallpox vaccine, we said that smallpox was the only disease to be a radical. Activity, however, just two years before we recorded that episode, a second disease had also been declared eradicated, and that disease was render pest render pests. Eradication was so recent at that point that none of our sources referenced it like there were all these things that just very confidently, even recently published things very confidently, saying smallpox is the only thing to ever be radically needed, and at that point render past also just had. Also Holly and I obviously wrote the live in twenty eleven. This was not something that really stuck with people when it was announced in twenty eleven, unless they had a personal or professional connection to it in some way for the most part. So, this declaration that render past had been eradicated was less than ten years ago. That's way more recent than the history. We typically talk about on the show, but rinderpest history as the disease goes back way farther than that obviously and the process ever radical. The disease really illustrates how it required a very coordinated international effort to do it. Rinderpest is caused by a virus in the genus Bila virus. This genus includes other viruses that you may have heard of including human measles and canine distemper. There are morbilliviruses that can infect marine life as well including dolphins and whales and rinderpest specifically has been around for a long time, perhaps as long as ten thousand years dating back to the first domestication of oryx, which are a now extinct type of wild ox in south, western Asia before its ratification render past infected domestic animals, like cattle, sheep, and goats, as well as at least forty other hoofed mammals, specifically even toed ungulates like wildebeest, antelope, deer, Buffalo, and Giraffe. It did not infect. Infect human beings, although that wasn't necessarily always true, render pasts, nearest relative is human measles, and these two diseases appear to have diverged only about a thousand years ago, so it's possible that before that point there was a strain of rinderpest virus that could infect both humans and hoofed mammals rename. Rinderpest comes from the German word for cattle plague. It's also been known as step Marin, Marin being another word for pestilence and step coming from its prevalence in the steps of Asia and Southeastern Europe. It was known as Sedova in parts of Africa and push ema on the Indian subcontinent, and at various points it has also been named for where affected communities thought the disease had come from for example in parts of seventeenth century. Europe people called it the Russian disease, because it was believed to have been introduced through cattle that were traded from Russia render past was mostly spread through close contact among infected animals with the virus, being present in their nasal, oral ocular and fecal secretions, basically if it. It made a secretion probably rinderpest in their infected Dung could also contaminate food and water sources and spread the disease that way it wasn't as common for things like pasturelands to become infected, because the virus broke down in sunlight, so it was gone from a sunny pasture in about six hours it could last a lot longer in more shady areas, though in terms of how the illness progressed after being exposed, animals went through an eight to eleven day, incubation period, and then they would develop a fever. Early. Symptoms of the acute illness included watery discharges from the eyes and nose, causing the animals to look like they were crying from there. They would develop intense diarrhea that for a day or two. Animals could shed the virus for a couple of days before developing symptoms, but they shed the virus in huge amounts once they had become visibly sick animals that managed to survive this diarrheal stage typically recovered, and they went on have a lifelong immunity to render past, but most of the time it just wasn't survivable. That diarrhea lead to dehydration and death. A typical strain of rinderpest could cause a mortality rate of up to ninety percent in susceptible animals. Worse some exceptions, some strains of the virus weren't thel, but they have other effects for example Kunduz which are antelopes with spiral horns could survive milder forms of rinderpest, but tended to develop blandness because the virus infected. There is the Mongol Empire's Asian Gray step oxen tended to be resistant to the virus, but they were still able to spread it to other animals, although this virus may have existed for as long as ten thousand years, its presence in recorded history isn't quite that long. Cattle plagues of various sorts are documented going back to about three thousand C E in ancient Egypt, but a lot of those earliest descriptions don't match up with the symptoms of rinderpest, the earliest historical accounts of what was probably render past took place in the Roman Empire between the years three, seventy, six, three, eighty six, and then that disease spread through the Empire's war with the. The goths from their rinderpest outbreaks frequently followed in the wake of war as we noted earlier, the Mongol Empire's Oxen's spread, the illness to less resistant animals during the Mongol invasion of Europe starting in the thirteenth century from their armies that used even toed ungulates as pack, animals or food sources carried rinderpest with them or Victoria's armies, unknowingly took infected animals with them as spoils. Spoils of war, the spreading the disease to their own animals when they got home, rinderpest also followed trading routes, both through the trade of food animals, and the use of pack animals to carry other trade goods, the spread, the disease in this way really increased starting in about the seventeenth century, as long distance trade, involving livestock and pack animals became more and more widespread even. Even, though rinderpest didn't directly infect humans, the disease could still cause huge loss of human life. Large rinderpest outbreaks could leave communities without their sources of meat or milk, without the animals that they needed to cultivate the land without the dengue that they needed to fertilize it, and without transportation to try to find other sources of food elsewhere in seventeen o nine a major rinderpest. Started in Europe, an epizootic is basically an epidemic, but involving non human animals this lasted for decades and led to the deaths of as many as to hundred million livestock animals in Europe. It also leads to a lot of people studying the disease and trying to figure out how to stop its spread in seventeen eleven Johan, kenold of Prussia noted that livestock that had survived rinderpest resistant to leader exposure that same year. Year Pope Clinton the eleventh appointed physician Giovanni Marineland Cheesy to study rinderpest and try to find some way to control it in seventeen, Fifteen Lynn cheesy published a treatise based on this work, which was called via pistole in general Lynch easies infection control guidelines still hold up pretty well. He recommended restricting livestock movements, quarantining infected animals, slaughtering animals that had been exposed to reduce the spread of the disease and burying the carcasses. He recommended a number of general sanitation procedures and meet inspections in the seventeen teens. The practice of very elation to prevent smallpox started to be used more frequently in Europe. Ventilation was common in India China and Africa before this point, but it became more widely known in England and other parts of Europe thanks to lady Mary Worley Montague, whose husband had been ambassador to the Ottoman Empire. Variation involved deliberately exposing someone to smallpox, often by inserting smallpox infected material through a puncture in their skin. There is more about this in our prior episode on Edward. Jenner, and the smallpox vaccine as the practice of relations spread in Europe people in both England, and the Netherlands started trying to come up with a similar method to do the same basic thing with rinderpest, they were not successful at doing this, but while doing this research feet, riders and Petrus van. kampen realized that cavs whose mothers had survive rinderpest. Rinderpest were resistant to their attempted inoculations. This is one of the first documented recordings of the idea of turtle immunity in seventeen, sixty one. The world's first veterinary school was established in Leon. France with one of its major objectives involving teaching veterinarians Giovanni Maria Lynch easies methods of preventing rinderpest. We talked about this veterinary school in our episode called a brief history of veterinary medicine throughout all of this public health practices for humans were being developed and refined in response to what people were doing with rinderpest in animals. Aside from idea of slaughtering exposed animals to prevent the spread of the disease, most of the methods for controlling an epizootic, an animal's also applied an epidemic in humans. This included establishing cordon sanitaire or sanitary barriers around infected populations. The fight against render past also involved the first use of thermometers to try to detect fevers as part of an infection control regimen in spite of these advances, though some of the world's most devastating rinderpest outbreaks still to come, and we're going to talk about that after we I have a sponsor break. You've heard me talk about Norton. 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No payment information is required sign up today at Norton. Dot Com slash family. That's Norton Dot. com slash family for six months free. Everyone, Ben Bullet here host of stuff. They don't want you to know in ridiculous history as a podcast does I am constantly reading and researching for upcoming episodes, but even I need an occasional break, so when I feel like I, need some kind of mental pallet cleanser. My go-to refresher is the mobile puzzle game. Best fiends. That's fiends, not friends best. Fiends is a puzzle game. You can play right on your phone. It's pretty cool because you go through all these levels solving challenging puzzles that actually engage your brain bud. It's a casual game that anyone can play and it's actually Super Fun the great thing. Thing about it is that it doesn't take much time, but it's great because it fills up those moments where you wish you had something to do. You don't need an Internet connection to play, so it's cool for when you don't have a connection. This game is also visually stimulating with these bright vivid colors and cute characters and best fiends updates, the gay monthly with new levels and events, so it never gets old. Best beans is a five star rated mobile puzzle game on the Apple. APP store and Google play, and you can download it right now. Four free. That's friends without the our best fiends. Although people had made important advancements in infection control in veterinary medicine, leading up to the nineteenth century, eighteen, hundred saw some really devastating rinderpest outbreaks. We're going to focus on just two of them. In particular, the first in June of eighteen sixty five rinderpest was reintroduced to the island of Great Britain it affected livestock populations all over the island, all of the highlands and islands of Scotland were mostly spared. The most likely source of the infection was cattle that had been imported from Estonia. The British response to this outbreak was really not great. And had been more than a century since rinderpest had been present on the island, so there was nobody there who had firsthand knowledge or memory of what looked like? And even though people knew that render with endemic in parts of continental Europe there was this really weird sense or maybe just wishful thinking that maybe this was some other disease instead and not rinderpest the Anti Contagion Movement that we talked about in our recent episode on Max. Von PENCO was connected to all of this as well as people kinda questioned whether like some pathogen could really causing rinderpest. It wasn't until the end of July eighteen, sixty five. The outbreak was officially confirmed as rinderpest and. Council started to be issued to try to stop its spread. Those orders included ones that required people to quarantine, sick animals, and to call potentially diseased livestock, but some of the orders were also relatively vague and contradictory, and they didn't have much enforcement power built into them. Farmers, cattle, traders, and others who owned livestock, resisted calls to destroy their animals, and there was really not a strong legal. To address this to add another complication British physician Charles Murchison published a paper, suggesting that new crops of affected animals showed signs that were more similar to smallpox than rinderpest, the smallpox vaccine for humans had been introduced in seventeen, ninety six, and the UK had made smallpox vaccination mandatory in eighteen fifty three people just latched arm to the idea that what was happening to the cattle might really be smallpox or something similar instead of rinderpest and a massive vaccination campaign got underway in September of Eighteen fifty-five that same month. Queen Victoria authorized an additional prayer in which congregations of the Church of England would ask for God's. God's mercy and that he quote stay we pray the this plague by word of power. Tens of thousands of cattle in Britain were vaccinated for smallpox between September of eighteen, sixty, five and January of eighteen, sixty six, so many vaccines were administered that health officials ram out of the lymph that was used to make them Murchison, and his supporters offered various explanations for why vaccinated animals continued to get sick and die when the real reason was that the disease that was at work was rinderpest, not smallpox Belgian doctor. Lewis Villains had also developed a method of inoculating cattle against a different disease called contagious bovine pleuropneumonia. Involved threading infected material through the end of the animal's tail, and in the case of Pleuropneumonia, this made the animal immune to the disease with the most serious side effect being. The loss of some or all of the animal's tail, so people try to do the same basic thing with render past. That did not work. It just spread the disease farther in mid February of eighteen sixty six, the cattle plague commission finally announced that the smallpox vaccination effort was not working, and they recommended the infection control in quarantine procedures that have been developed back in the early seventeen hundreds, the cattle disease prevention act was. was passed in February eighteen, sixty six required the culling of infected herds with some financial compensation to people who lost their livestock. As a result, it was not until eighteen sixty seven that this outbreak was controlled. However, there was worse still to come less than twenty years later. What may have been the biggest and most destructive rinderpest outbreak in history started when the disease was introduced into sub Saharan Africa for the first time. This was during the scramble for Africa. When European nations divided the African continent up among themselves establishing and expanding their colonies there in addition to all the political social and human rights issues that we have talked about in a number of other episodes on the show, this also introduced an expanded European style, farming and animal husbandry methods into the African continent. The likely source of this outbreak was probably cattle that Italy had imported into. Africa. From the Indian subcontinent, Africa's indigenous peoples already had their own established methods of animal husbandry and veterinary care, but this was a disease. African people had no prior experience with and there established practices, either weren't effective, or they made the situation worse. Often. White farmers and ranchers didn't have any personal experience with it either, and some of them assume that what was happening was a unique African illness rather than rinderpest in this led some of them to try villains tail inoculation that we talked about a moment ago. Rather than culling, they're exposed hurts. After rinderpest was introduced into sub Saharan Africa as much as ninety percent of the domestic cattle, their died, the disease also spread to domestic sheep and goats in an infected wild buffalo, giraffes, wildebeest and other animals in general, the major source of the disease spread was domestic herd animals, spreading it to wild animals. The population density of wild animals like well to be civically just wasn't. Wasn't enough to really keep the disease going other factors made the situation much worse, including droughts that led large numbers of animals to cluster around watering holes and warfare, African nations, many African herders were nomadic, which both spread the illness to other animal populations and made the disease even harder to track plus colonial governments tried to protect their own interests over those of local Africans, including for example, destroying all the African owned herds, while leaving their own herds, untouched regardless of whether either of these herds, showing signs of exposure, white farmers and ranchers, living in European colonies tried to protect their herds, rather than calling them including doing things like trying to hide evidence of a possible infection. Meanwhile the colonized African peoples distrusted colonial efforts to stop the disease for obvious reasons, basically all the various human populations in Africa as. We're working against one another, and that allowed the disease to spread farther. And then in many places, the devastation brought on by the outbreak made it easier for European powers to exploit African people and Resources. The result of all this was known as the Great African render past Panzer Wok, and a widespread famine followed in its wake. In many parts of sub Saharan Africa between half and two thirds of the human population died of starvation, diseases, animal attacks and many African nations. The entire social order was up ended, both because of the massive death toll, and because the cattle which had represented wealth and status in these societies had all died. The. Rinderpest pancreatic and colonial authorities response to it was also one of the factors that led to the second matter. Be War in what's now Zimbabwe in eighteen, ninety six. The entire ecosystem was disrupted in many parts of the African continent. Grazing animals had kept grass under control without those grazing herds, grass, form thickets, which became breeding grounds for CICI flies, which caused an epidemic of African sleeping sickness, rodents and insects like locusts and caterpillars also flourished as both domestic and wild animals died, predators lost access to their regular prey, and started attacking people in South Africa the de. Beers company invited bacteriologist Robert Coke to Kimberly to study the disease and to try to develop a vaccine. But point it was well known that animals that managed to recover from rinderpest were immune to the disease afterward, so first coke tried to use the blood of recovered animals to make a vaccine. Although that did provide a brief immunity that immunity eventually faded, and the method also had the potential to spread other bloodborne diseases, eventually, coke and veterinarian Arnold Tyler developed a method of using bile from infected animals. They got this idea from a method that farmers in the Orange Free State had developed that involved using sponges soaked in bile implanted under the skin of livestock. Coke and pilates method involved killing an animal that was infected with rinderpest, and then harvesting enough bile to create an injection that could treat about twenty five healthy animals. This method was not totally foolproof, but it did seem to converse some immunity and others in and around south. Africa continued to refine the formula and the method along with the other infection control methods that we've talked about earlier in the episode. This vaccine helps slow the spread of render passed on African continent, however, the pennzoil attic lasted until about eighteen, ninety seven, and then smaller scale epizootics continued afterward. We're going to get to how the disease was eventually eradicated after we take another quick sponsor break. Here's the thing. 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To, anyone who texts me right now to try our new beach body on demand, fitness and nutrition, APP just text the word run to thirty thirty thirty get instant access to all eight thousand dollars of our bestselling fitness programs like twenty one day fix insanity, p., ninety x t twenty five and Pyo. These programs really work, and this is your one chance to try them for free just text the word run to thirty thirty thirty. That's our UN to thirty thirty thirty right now and I'll send you your own free membership. Start of twentieth century render past outbreaks regularly threatened livestock, wild animals and people in various parts of Europe, Africa and Asia many countries where rinderpest was not present head passed laws that banned the import of livestock or meat from the places where render pest was endemic. In some cases, countries also banned cargo ships that had carried livestock from those countries, in spite of these kinds of precautions render. Past was introduced in Brazil in Nineteen, twenty one and in Australia in nineteen twenty-three. In both places it might have been introduced into North America at some point if it was, it was contained so quickly that it's not really clear whether that was really what was happening or if it was something else by this point, we knew a little more about rinderpest than we had in the nineteenth century. Maurice Nicole and Mustafa. Ideal Bay had demonstrated that it was caused by a virus in nineteen. Oh two, previously people had thought that rinderpest bacterial in nineteen twenty render past was accidentally reintroduced into Belgium the most likely source for this was zebras from India that were being sent to Brazil and had passed through Belgium on the way there. From their rinderpest spread to other parts of Europe, that had previously been rinderpest free for decades, and this led to an international effort to try to eradicate the disease entirely in the nineteen twenties. Jt Edwards developed a vaccine. Using technique called serial passage. This was similar to at Louis Pastor and a meal. Ru had done to develop a vaccine for rabies eighteen, eighty five. For Edwards Rinderpest Vaccine. He used goats exposing one to rinderpest, allowing the disease to incubate, and then using that incubated virus to infect the next goat. After doing this repeatedly, he had a strain of the virus that was more adapted to goats than to cattle, and then he used that virus to vaccinate the cows. This method was fairly effective, but it did have some drawbacks. It took a lot of goat's and a lot of time to cultivate a strain of the virus that would work for this purpose, and then sometimes that strain would revert back to being more lethal for the cattle in one, thousand, nine, hundred, eighty, four during a rinderpest outbreak in France, the office Internacional de Bozo Tease or E was established. It would later become the World Organization for Animal Health and it was a major part of the global effort to stop rinderpest in the nineteen fifties, veterinary scientist plow right, and his colleagues developed a new rinderpest vaccine. They used tissue cultures rather than serial passage through living goats to create an attenuated strain of the virus. The patterned their work after research that was being done on a human measles virus vaccine there vaccine gave animals lifelong immunity against all known strains of rinderpest with just one injection. However, vaccine had to be kept cold from the time it was made to win. It was administered and this just wasn't feasible for a large-scale vaccination campaign that was especially true in places that were very hot, very remote, or both in nineteen, fifty four, India started its National Rinderpest Eradication Program, which vaccinated twenty six million cattle every year. India soon went from seeing thousands of outbreaks, a year, which infected hundreds of thousands of animals tomorrow like three hundred outbreaks per year, so this campaign definitely helped control rinderpest, India, but it did not totally eradicate the disease. Their people have been trying to control rinderpest in Africa from the time that it was introduced, but when it came to a coordinated international effort to eradicate it completely that started in nineteen, sixty three. This effort was known as joint projects, fifteen or J. P. Fifteen, and it involved twenty two different, African nations seventeen of which had ongoing rinderpest outbreaks. By the end of Nineteen seventy-nine, Sudan was the only nation involved that was still reporting cases of rinderpest, however, the dramatic reduction in rinderpest had led to a sense of complacency as well as a lack of funding, so the campaign ended without actually radically disease which then of course resurged, that happened dramatically in the nineteen eighties to backtrack just a bit in nineteen, sixty nine a rinderpest outbreak. Outbreak in Afghanistan spread to multiple other nations from there, including Bahrain Iran Jordan Lebanon Syria, Turkey and Yemen the pattern of render pass to being spread through warfare, continued as well including through the Israeli and Syrian armies of the nineteen seventies, and through Indian troops in Sri, Lanka in Nineteen, seventy, eight in the nineteen eighties and nineteen ninety s tests were developed the detected both active rinderpest infections and The disease, it was also established that the antibodies passed from mother to offspring lasted for about eleven months. These discoveries made it possible to confirm whether animals were immune and to establish guidelines for how old and animals should be before it was vaccinated international efforts to eradicate rinderpest continued from there. The Pan African rinderpest campaign began in nineteen, eighty, six under the auspices of the African Union Interafrican Bureau of Animal. Resources and people were also refining the. The rinderpest vaccine at this point, Tufts University School of Veterinary Medicine and the US Department of Agriculture developed. A vaccine called third evac nineteen ninety-two. This vaccine had a thirty day shelf life that did not require refrigeration during that time in one, thousand, nine, hundred, four, the U. N. Food and agricultural. Organisation launched its Global Rinderpest Eradication Program. It's G. R., EP or grip from the beginning. It said a sixteen year timeline for a radical rinderpest. Most of the funding came from European nations most of the countries where rinderpest outbreaks were still occurring, were in Asia, sub, Saharan Africa, and the Middle East. A critical part of the group was working with community based animal health workers, these are people who personally owned livestock, and we're also selected by their communities to be part of this program. They got trained in. Animal Care Program. Program Methods and Vaccine Administration, and then they would take that knowledge back to their own communities. This is a totally different mindset from sending in veterinarians, academics and government officials from outside the community to try to sort of impose axiom program much of this work involved figuring out which animals needed to be vaccinated to have the greatest effect because it wasn't always possible to vaccinate every. Every animal for example in Ethiopia migratory herders moved their cattle between the lowlands and the Highlands, depending on the season, but there were also herds in the highlands that remained there year round as it became clear that the migratory herds were carrying the disease to the Highlands, rather than contracting the disease from the highland herds, animal health workers focused their immunization efforts on eliminating the disease. Disease from the migratory population and Nineteen ninety-six, the Food and agricultural. Organisation identified seven regions of the world that could act as a reservoir for the virus was included parts of Asia the Indian subcontinent, the Middle East and Eastern Africa a radical efforts, were tightly focused in these regions than in one, thousand, ninety nine. The FAO defied the program under the slogan of seek contain eliminate. After a few outbreaks were connected to the weakened form of the virus that was used in the vaccine. The FAO also set standards for went to stop vaccinating animals. Once immunity had been established one by one as nations had no new cases of rinderpest. They were declared rinderpest free. The last rinderpest outbreak on earth was reported in Sudan in two thousand one. The last vaccination programmes ended in two thousand six surveillance to make sure the disease didn't recur continued for the next few years until rinderpest was declared globally eradicated on May. Twenty Fifth Twenty eleven ten years after the last outbreak. The United Nations has estimated that the total cost of a radical rinderpest including all the money spent between nineteen forty. Five and twenty eleven was five billion dollars in articles about the ratification. Dr Peter Rotor the secretary of the FAA global rinderpest eradication. Program was quoted as saying quote. At first I thought. That's quite a lot. Then I thought the last royal wedding cost eight billion dollars. This was cheap. To be clear. I think. The previous royal wedding to this was was William and Kate. It did not cost eight billion dollars. Even if you factor in. The total cost of things like the public holidays that were around the. Like the Super Highest. Estimate that I've seen including all those like intangible side effects was like five billion dollars the actual wedding cost was in the millions with an M, not the billions with a B, but this is still a great quote. Now I'm trying to think about what him. Eight billion dollar wedding would look like and please. Don't anyone spend eight billion dollars on a wedding a? Personal thoughts. In November of twenty eighteen, the e and the FAO announced a global action plan to prevent the reemergence of rinderpest. Basically, there are a lot of labs in the world that still have samples of the virus or old vaccine stock. The organizations have called for safe destruction of these materials or transfer to an approved rinderpest, holding facility to prevent the risk of these viruses, escaping or being released through accident or criminal activity, even though render passed and human measles are really closely related. They have some similar traits. Measles is not anywhere close to being eradicated. It has been declared eliminated in some parts of the world that. That means that it is not being continuously transmitted among the population of those places anymore, but even nations where measles has been eliminated can continue to have outbreaks periodically particularly among unvaccinated people. However, there are two other diseases that are close to eradication drunk Eli assists or Guinea worm disease with fifty four reported cases in two, thousand, nineteen and polio, which had ninety four reported cases in two thousand nineteen, although that is a significant increase over the twenty eighteen total of thirty three cases, so that is a story. How render past was eradicated from the planet. Her Aa House wadded the devastation successful international. Eradication Program Yeah. Do you also have a little bit listener mail for us? I view. It is just a little bit of listener mail. It is from Nick Nick wrote about the discovery of insulin and says hello. Tracy in Holly loved the show. I just wanted to send a quick note. On the two part series on insulin, noted in the show, Frederick banting and Charles Best Canadian researchers in twenty eleven, the Bank of Canada issued its first ever polymer banknotes with the release of the frontier series. The reverse of the hundred dollar note celebrates Canadian doctors and scientists among the contributions depicted on the note is discovery of insulin. And the nick also included a link that gives this three hundred sixty degree view of what this like. You can spin it around in your browser window We don't have a great way to share links on our website currently. but if I bet if you Google Bank of Canada hundred polymer note you. Would get to it because that's the name of the page there anyway, so thank you so much. Had No idea because? You and I don't live in Canada Holly. Money Right now. So anyway, thank you, mick for that and for the link and. We hope everybody is. Doing as well as can be expected in these times living in. If you'd like to write to us about this any other podcast rich history podcast at iheartradio dot com, and then we are also all over social media as missed in history. That's where you'll find her facebook twitter, pinterest and Instagram, and you can subscribe to our show on Apple podcast. The iheartradio APP anywhere else you get your podcast. Stuff you missed in history class, the production of iheartradio for more podcasts. IHEART radio visit the iheartradio, APP, apple, podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. Isn't a country whose name is often associated with hope these days, but when I travelled there, in July of two thousand and nineteen to a place in the northeast, called Rhodesia I didn't just find fear and violence. I found hope a group of brave feminist revolutionaries fighting to establish a more equitable society. You can hear what I learned there on my new podcast series the women's war. Listen to the women's war on the iheartradio APP apple, podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. A is a ghost. Haunting Dave Grohl the FOO fighters. Why does Ron Claim covid nineteen is a US bioweapon? I'm Ben, bullet and and our new show strange news daily shedding light on the most bizarre, disturbing and unusual news of the day everything from the latest exploits of Florida to the mind boggling developments in space exploration, top secret government experiments newly revealed stories of the paranormal and more listen to strange news daily on the iheartradio, APP, apple, podcasts or wherever you find your favorite shows.

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Desperate Measures: The Skyrocketing Price Of Insulin In America

1A

35:15 min | 1 year ago

Desperate Measures: The Skyrocketing Price Of Insulin In America

"Support for this podcast and the following message come from discover with the discovery miles card. They automatically match the miles you earn at the end of your first year. Discover it miles. Limitations apply. Discover match for new card members only learn more at discover dot com slash travel. This is one A. I'm Todd's we'll look in Washington sitting in for Joshua Johnson today. Here's the story of a groundbreaking medical discovery back in nineteen Twenty-three three Canadian inventors discovered insulin to lifesaving hormone produced in the pancreas, that keeps your blood sugar from rising too high or dropping, too low, one of the inventors, a guy named Frederick Banting refuse to put his name on a patent for insulin. He said it was unethical for a doctor to profit from discovery that would save lives. Imagine that his colleagues wound up selling the patent to the university of Toronto for just one Canadian dollar will fast forward to twenty nineteen the price of insulin has skyrocketed in recent decades from roughly twenty dollars for a ten milliliter, vile of the drug and nineteen Ninety-six to as much as two hundred and ninety dollars for a vial today. Some diabetes patients need to take multiple vials -oday to stay alive. And the out of control costs had four some families to ration the drug. By it on the black market, even travel up there to Canada, where it was discovered to be brought back for a fraction of the cost and more than thirty million Americans have diabetes more than seven million of them rely on insulin pretty much every day to stay alive. How could treatment for such a common disease be so expensive? Well, we're here to try to answer that question before we get too far. We should also note that we reached out to all three of the dominant players on the global insulin market. They are some familiar names. They are e lily Sanofi, and Novo Nordisk, none of them provided a Representative to come on this show today. All three sent written statements to read on the air. We will get to those in part a little bit later, but the people who did agree to join our Sarah overall. She covers the pharmaceutical industry for politico. She's here in the studio. Sarah, great to have you. Yeah. I think you're having a doctor Leshan mckeever is the senior vice president of governmental affairs advocacy at the American diabetes association. She's also a physician with more than a decade. Of experience, treating diabetes. Doctor mckeever welcome to you. Thank you for having me. Great to have you a greenside is a consultant in Minneapolis, Minnesota her thirteen year old daughter has type one diabetes, and she's a participant in these caravans going to Canada to get insulin for an affordable price, Leo joins us from Minnesota public radio in Saint Paul Leah welcome to one. I think Senator having Leah. Tell me a little bit about you, especially tell me about your daughter, when was she diagnosed, and what is her every day experience with diabetes look like, yeah, so my daughter was diagnosed with type one diabetes, six years ago when she was seven years old. And she now six years later is thriving diabetes is a very difficult disease to manage with looking constantly at what her blood sugar is and what she's eating and how much activity she has. But after six years of managing the disease it's something that we're able to do fairly well. Ups and downs of course. But really what the biggest challenges for us now is, navigating the healthcare system and figuring how out how to afford to pay for her insulin and medications. Dr mckeever, what does type one diabetes? What is the diagnosis mean? What exactly is this disease? And how does it? How does it differ from other forms of chronic illness, in the in the daily lives of people? So there there's a couple of things I wanted to dress through that question. You know, you noted at the top of the conversation that there's thirty million Americans with diabetes in over as you said, seven point four million rely on insulin. So when you think about diabetes, it is a condition in which the body's ability to produce or respond to this hormone is somehow impaired in this results in the abnormal metabolism of carbohydrates in elevated levels of glucose in the blood. So there's three different types and there's great variation within each type. But in type one, for example, the body destroys the insulin producing cells so people with type one diabetes need insulin to live. And this is a lifelong this lifelong for them in terms of their reliance on insulin for type two diabetes. There are there are people have type two that also require insulin in. But in this case, their body is unable to make enough insulin to meet the needs. So. Over time, they may require insulin, then there's also just station diabetes, which occurs during pregnancy where a woman that previously did not have diabetes develops it during pregnancy and may need insulin during that time. So in type one you know, she said, we with children, you know, we, we know for a lot of families, this is a huge issue. But it really is a lifelong issue for people who require insulin to live Lee. Type one diabetes is a challenge for you and for your daughter on a daily basis under the best of circumstances. But can you talk a little bit about what this disease has meant for your financial health for your ability to get the drugs that your daughter needs? And, and for what that means for you for making ends meet sure. So we've spent as much as seven hundred dollars a month just for my daughter's insulin and beyond that, we have to pay for other sorts of supplies. She is, as an insulin pump, and that excel itself is expensive. Than there, are there monthly costs associated with the insulin pump supplies. Their diabetes testing supplies, like test strips. And then there's also a continuous glucose monitor plus visits the endocrinologist into the doctor this all adds up to what for us. I think every year since diagnosis has been meeting are out of pocket expenses for our health plan. My husband and I are independent consultants and we have our insurance through the Affordable Care Act, and we have a high deductible plan. And so we've reached out of pocket for my daughter of seven thousand dollars a year usually by the middle of the year each year. And you can it sounds like you can count on hitting it every year year after year seven thousand doesn't sound like there's a scenario where you have a good year and it's twelve hundred dollars. No. I mean, the cost of managing type one diabetes is extremely expensive. I think the estimates are around twenty thousand dollars a year, and so it really just depends on your insurance. How much of that you? As a patient or a family will have to pay. You know, we've, we've had other we've had years in which last year, for example, we had another health issue in our family, and between our premiums and our deductibles. We paid a total of twenty seven thousand dollars in healthcare expenses. So as you can imagine, you know, for any family. That's an extraordinary amount of money to try to find, but there are no choices you know with, with my daughter, we know that until hopefully someday, there's a cure, we will be paying those kinds of costs to keep her alive. So sir overall politico, how common usually a story very common. So one of the biggest things like she said, besides these out of pocket costs that they can expect to hit on a regular basis. There's also the pumps the glucose tests and our colleges appointments. There's so many different costs that rack up, and then that's not even you know, she, she mentioned being on an Affordable Care Act plan, there's so many other ones, there's people that are paying out of pocket for the list. Price the quote unquote, you know, the public price of this drug, and there's all these other ways that even on Medicare and Medicaid, people are paying exorbitant amounts on a monthly basis. But we got this from K my mom pays two hundred seventy dollars per month for her insulin. It's highway robbery, no more no less. The company can make it for six dollars. What's with the huge markup, Sarah? It's big. It's not a million dollar question. It's the billion dollar question. Why is insulin so expensive, why why is it shot up so much? Yeah, it is, is some I think it's tripled since the early two thousands and one of the biggest arguments that from a suitable companies will make is that they have been raising the price deadly because of rebates that they have to pay the payers and so not to get too into the weeds here. But this is really big policy issue when they pay like, say eighty percent rebate to pair on a three hundred dollar value insulin. That means that they're getting sixty dollars back, but it's unclear how much. Of that is being paid ultimately by consumer. And so the Trump administration actually wants to eliminate rebates from the system entirely, and then that would mean that a three hundred dollar vile insulin was simply three hundred dollar filed incident but it's very unclear how that will change what pharmaceutical companies will then charge a consumer. So there are federal programs that require, for instance, if you wanna sell the Medicaid where they provide health coverage to poor people in this country that you have to sell it at a discount, because the government has some purchasing power drug companies of biologics companies are saying, gee, sorry we have to sell at a discount to millions. Tens of millions of poor people through Medicaid. So we have no choice but to stick it to people with insurance. Well, what they would say is that they have to offer these big rebates to stay on commercial insurances coverage lists. And so you can see the case made for why a three hundred dollar insulin would have a higher rebate and a payer would prefer that because they're getting more money from that. But again, it's unclear how much. Of that savings has passed down to a consumer that has to buy this every single there's also a lot of suspicion that the out of control prices for insulin and other drugs to our form of subsidy American patients subsidized cheaper prices in other countries, they can't charge two hundred and ninety dollars in Canada, because Canada doesn't stand for it, and Canada, has single payer healthcare. So they charged through the nose here through the needle here to make up the difference, is that true. Yeah. And that's a huge issue in Washington right now. A lot of Democrats in the house. Progressives would really like to see more of those sort of price controls. You're talking about happened in the American system they've cited insulin because joke prices are top of mind, but insulin villas, the poster tiles that is something that progressives want, but it's a complete nonstarter for Republicans. It's not something that they can see getting off of the table with the Senate, or with the president, really. We're going to talk a lot more about how this issue interacts with the lives of everyday patients like you with Sarah overall, a doctor LA Sean, mckeever, and Lee greenside. I'm Todd's will look you're listening to one. A from WMU NPR, stay with us. Support for this podcast and the following message come from home instead senior care gerontologist and caregiver advocate lakeland HOGAN, reflects on home instead, mission to enhance the lives of aging adults and their families. You don't stop living. Once you hit a certain age, you can still live rich meaningful life through your, your later years. And so we are really excited to be celebrating our twenty fifth anniversary at home instead and to be still working towards our mission. To learn more about home. Instead, senior care go to home, instead dot com. Answered truthfully, except for ten room who it was. I did not name no names after Jim Roope was killed in Alabama nineteen sixty five no one was ever held to account. Finally, the full truth comes out. Open my mail when no it's white lies from NPR. Welcome back to one eight. I'm Todd's Willett. We asked you to tell us your own experiences dealing with diabetes and insulin. And here's some of what you left in our inbox. My name is dawn. I live in Indiana. This is Patrick in Atlanta name is Connie I'm calling from Albuquerque New Mexico. My husband is a type one diabetic. My daughter is a type one diabetic. More doctor has prescribed a term influence. And when I the pharmacy to see how much it will be it. Several hundred dollars is always a worry if some reason he should lose his job, whether or not, he'll be able to get his medicines plan. She does not have Medicaid. They will cut her off and the way she gets her insulin is she asks Facebook, friends and family. There are no other options. There's no low cost option for this and this puts me in my health in risk is not his fault that he has a pancreas doesn't work people in pharmaceuticals. Keep prices so high that it seems like they'd rather people die than help them. What about their hypocr critic Oso your voices dealing with the high cost of insulin and diabetes in America Leah greenside take me through a typical day if you would when you have type one diabetes, how many injections does do your does your daughter need. How many blood samples finger sticks? If that's what she does does she have to take. Yes. So my daughter uses an insulin pump and she probably gives herself insulin through that pump. Oh, I don't know on an average day six to eight times based on what she's eating. So when she wakes up in the morning, we check either check her blood sugar by a finger poke. Or we look at her continuous glucose monitor to see where her blood sugar is we then make decisions about how much insulin to give her to correct that blood sugar if necessary we look at her breakfast and figure out how many carbohydrates, she's eating and give her the right amount of insulin there. And then try to make a plan for the day in terms of her activity level and other factors that may affect what she needs. It's a real balancing act to try to manage the disease because our bodies are so dynamic, and what we do various so much, and we need insulin to regulate all of our, our body functions. So, you know, it's, it's, it's all these factors that come together. I just saw somebody post. Something saying that a child with type one diabetes makes twenty-seven decisions related to diabetes in a morning. It's it. I don't know if that's true. But it feels right? To me. It's a it's a constant management issue. It's also overnight, my daughter's blood sugars can drift, high of for a variety of reasons or go low and either and I either situation, we need to assess what's going on and make corrections just last night. It was my my husband's night to, to be on call for her. We switch every other day and he was up last night at two AM, three AM and some other time I don't even know 'cause I was trying to get some sleep correcting her blood sugar because it was high. So just a little snapshot of what it's like to try to manage this disease child. Dr mcgeever where does insurance come into play here in this unique American system that we have is affording insulin? Only in issue. If you don't have insurance, that's not the case for Lia. They have ACA plans with high deductible where. People tend to confront the highest cost center system. So in insurance does play a role, depending on the type of insurance a person has will determine their out of pocket costs. And so some of what you're hearing about people having high deductibles on. You know, they have to pay a lot of money out of pocket before their insurance, actually they actually able to benefit from their insurance. But Todd I do want to take a second to pause and back and just aknowledge those who are writing in and tweeting and sharing their stories. You know, we hear these stories every single day at the American diabetes association and and, you know, a few years ago because of the swell of concern in, in really tragedy that we've, we've heard from our constituents including providers, who also, we haven't mentioned them in the voice of, of people who are dealing with this, you know, a lot of providers are they, they are confronted with this each day, and they see the struggles of their patients and. They wanna see resolution as well, but the association and 2017 commissioned, a working group to look at this issue of insulin affordability, and we met with over twenty into entities from within the insulin supply chain. So from the manufacturers to the point of sale at the pharmacy, and we, we asked them, you know, an array of questions to really try and understand what the issue is. And to Sarah's point the transparency is did rise to the top of the list as one of the major issues. We don't know where the dollars are flowing. You know, a lot of those transactions are confidential, there's rebates that are happening discounts their fees that are involved in this. And so, you know, we've really tried to be laser focused on. How do we bring down the cost of people with die for two people have diabetes at the pharmacy? So in addition to conducting those, those interviews and our. Our research on the issue. We are released a white paper with recommendations, and really what we're some, you know, some of the things that we found as well as policy solutions. So, for example, you know, one of them was increasing price transparency, lowering or removing patient cost sharing. We know that Colorado recently passed a Bill that went into law that limits, the co pay amount for insulin to one hundred dollars per month. But again, as you said, it depends on the type of insurance that a person has document transparency is critical and is notoriously lacking in the pharmaceutical game. This is a great time for disclosure. I think transparency's important for anyone who's involved in this debate, could you disclose to us, any relationships, financial, or otherwise that either you or more importantly, the American diabetes association have with any of these manufacturers whether that's educational grants direct funding or anything else. So the, the American diabetes assoc-. Nation receives funding and support from a number of different stakeholders, including those from the pharmaceutical industry, eighty percent of our, our funds are unrestricted meeting that, you know, the will has the ability to direct how those funds are us. And then there's a portion that on our restricted, so they may impact as you said, educational programs or provider educational programs, but the ADA controls how that, that those programs are, are executed. So thank you. Thank you. Thank you for that disclosure. And I do appreciate it a speaking of the drug manufacturers in question three drugmakers account for eighty percent of the global insulin market. We reached out to all three and here's part of a statement from one of them. The big boys Eli Lilly, too many people with diabetes and other chronic conditions have high deductible insurance plans that force them to pay thousands of dollars before their coverage kicks in because insurers. Including many employers value, lower premiums. Overloaded Ables some people with diabetes, effectively subsidize premiums for the healthy. That's not how it should work. And part of another from Novo Nordisk, while we are accountable for the list price we ultimately do not dictate what most patients pay for their medicines. That's based on how one insurance benefits are structured, but its benefits of evolved, there have been unintended consequences, causing patients to pay more at the pharmacy counter. You can read the full versions of both statements there on our website there long, and you can read all of what the pharmaceutical companies have to say at the one, A dot org. Sarah overall, both Lilly and Novo Nordisk are putting the blame on the insurance system. It's not us. It's not the list place price. It's this wacky terrible system that they all know we hate anyway. How about some transparency is that right to, to put the blame at the feet of insurance? Where should it be? I think it can be put at the feet of both in and actually it's funny as there was a house, congress congressional hearing earlier this year, that put them all literally right next to each other in the same room in front of lawmakers, and said, what is happening, and even when they're sitting right next to each other, you would think insulin prices just dropped from the sky. So. Yeah. And so even as they all argue for some sort of transparency, they say, not too much, because it will make anticompetitive and because then they'll be price-fixing so they all finger pointed each other, but there's also not really a lot of movement on what can happen. And so, like Dr mckeever was saying, besides lack of transparency. It really comes down to out of pocket costs and that's kind of become one of the ways that people are looking at the, the easier fixes, like that's cap out of pocket costs for patients, which we can do more easily than saying, what exactly is happening in these negotiations. What kind of rebates and discounts? Are you giving each other and we can just say, look patients should only pay this amount Lee? I'd like you to respond to this and he's a big juggernaut in the insulin game. So no fee believes that no one should struggle to pay for their insulin. Regardless of their insurance status or income level. We encourage anyone prescribed Asano fy medicine that is having financial challenges, or trouble, navigating the insurance to call this a no fee patient connection where eligible patients can be connected to the medicines. And resources they need lots of drug companies do this. They lobby against any price controls, but they do give away some price some drugs at a discount, or for free to people in financial need a Leah. Have you ever availed yourself of one of these hotlines ally? Lilley has one of you ever reached out and tried to get a discount. I did once call UI lily to try to get a discount, and we actually found out that it was less expensive for us to not use the discount, and to buy it through our insurance. This was a part of a very long conversation that I had at the beginning of this year, we switched insurance plans, and I needed to get my daughter's insulin, re refilled, and it took me fifteen phone calls or emails over an eleven day period to try to get her insulin refilled including one to the hotline. But fortunately for us, we had half of isle of insulin that, you know, got us through that period but eleven days, it's crazy. How complicated the system is. So when I hear these, these calls from the pharmaceutical companies saying we have programs to help I hear stories all the time of people calling the programs and not being eligible or not being able to navigate all the way through to getting the discount at the actual pharmacy counter. We got this tweet from jet. I have type one diabetes. And so did my nephew George in twenty eleven. He lost his job and health insurance, he rationed his insulin, and died two months later, he was twenty one years old, no one should die because they can't afford insulin. Beth tweets. My husband is type has type one diabetes, and he's been that way since he was three he'll be forty one this July type ones cannot live without insulin. Please make sure to talk about the pump in how insurance companies will cover pump equipment but not the insulin or testing materials. We're gonna talk about that issue and so many more, including Americans likely who traveled to Canada or other countries. We're also gonna talk about policy, what the US government can do besides narrow agreements on just insulin to help bring some of these costs down. My three guests will be back with me in just a moment. Stay close on Todd's willik. This is one. In the Trump era. The news moves faster than f-, Nambiar politics podcast is there to keep you informed every time there's a major political story, we get our best correspondence together to sort through the noise, the NPR politics, podcast, what you need to know right after it happens. Well back now to our conversation on the price of insulin. With Dr Sean mckeever reporter Sara overall and activists Leah greenside Leah. Have you ever been tempted to ration your daughter's insulin? Give her a little bit less per day in order to make it stretch. No. That's extremely dangerous to do. We haven't been in the position of needing to do that. Exactly. But we've done many things in terms of rationing and saving supplies. So we've reused insulin from her insulin pump cartridge, which is not advised. But we withdraw it and put it into a new cartridge to help to make sure we don't waste any drop. We do things like her doctor has advised her to change her insulin pump site, every two days, we usually go beyond that to more like three days to be able to just have a little extra supplies. We've done things like with continuous glucose monitor to there's ways to restart it and use it beyond what it's supposed to be used and the list goes on. I mean, there's many creative ways that people diabetes figured out to try to save. And we got this message from Robin. Fortunately, it's not just insulin. The rising cost of diabetes home testing supplies food, alternatives drugs and support care is killing people daily, I'm diabetic, and I'm fortunate enough to have a doctor who's an advocate now. But. I didn't I would ration my drugs, Dr mckeever, and I emphasize doctor there. The dangers of rationing, we've heard from so many people who do it. I know that probably hundreds of thousands of people with type one around America resort to rationing. What are the risks? So it is very dangerous. If people are put him in a position where they have to ration their insulin in as little as a day, a person can undergo metabolic de compensation and you know, it could be, I mean, the ultimate consequence could be death in so rationing is very dangerous. We know that some families have been pushed to that limit. And this is this is why we're so adamant that. No one should go without insulin because they can't afford it. You know, when you talked about the cost, and, you know, when I think one of the things that was mentioned was Leah's cost of being eight hundred dollars a month. I believe we've heard as high as eighteen hundred dollars a month for insulin. And when you add in the supplies, pushing that number up to twenty four hundred dollars a month, and this is, you know, this impacts families of many different economic, you know, from many different economic status. Statuses. And we're just seeing people going to extreme lengths to get insulin. And so this is this is why this conversation is so important today. Leah Americans are getting used to hearing scary stories about caravans in this country. You've been part of a caravan of a completely different kind caravan headed north to Canada for affordable insulin. I mentioned it earlier. Can you talk just a little bit about that experience? And how many trips you've made? Yes, sir. So we use that word caravan pretty intentionally to help to illustrate dude, the dire situation in the United States. So that was a trip that about six of us went on in early may, and we drove from the twin cities here in Minnesota up to fort Francis, Ontario five hours up through Minnesota and cross the border and we bought a total of one thousand two hundred dollars worth of. Insulin in a Canadian pharmacy, which in the United States, we would have paid over twelve thousand dollars for. And I and I'll say it's exactly the same insulin. Actually, my daughter is using it right now in her insulin pump with no problems at all. It's package the same works. The same is just significantly less expensive there. There are some questions about the legality of doing this, which I could talk about if you'd like, oh, we're going to talk about the legality because these types of caravan trips they have a new namely, but they are not new. There were some hearings on Capitol Hill, just a couple of days ago, Republicans and Democrats are joining together to tackle the issue of high insulin prices will will see, here's one member of congress Earl buddy Carter Republican wrapping up his testimony in the committee, I wanna congratulate all of the because you've done something here today that we've been trying to do in congress for ever since the four years, and three months that I've been here, and that is to create bipartisanship because what you've witnessed here today is by partisanship. This is going to in have witnessed it. I have seen what you've done. He's excited, Sarah when I was a younger reporter years ago, there was a congressman called Bernie Sanders, not very well known. He was leading caravans from his home state of Vermont up to Canada. There was bipartisan agreement for something called drug reimportation at even nearly passed the Senate, where prices are too high in America. Let's make it legal for Americans to get cheap drugs in Canada until pharmaceutical companies come correct that never happened. This is an old story. What does the law say about what Lee is doing now? And how many Americans are resorting to that? Well, that is definitely flared up again. Bernie Sanders who is a little bit more. Well now a little bit. He has introduced legislation that would do exactly that on a broader scale what leeann her family are doing, but for for states and even for the federal government, but it's not anywhere closer to passing sir. What about the White House you mentioned that there is agreement because insulin is a poster child here is. Is the president talking about the high cost of prescription drugs and says, something it's something that he wants to tackle. We will have tougher negotiation more competition and much lower prices at the pharmacy counter at it'll start to take effect. Very soon is all of this bipartisan agreement leading to something that's cheaper there few. Well, there's a few things moving there's drug pricing packages in both the house and Senate that becoming any day now that are supposed to be trying to tackle this on a broader scale, what President Trump was talking about there could be any number of things the rebate rule that I mentioned earlier, that would eliminate that sort of weird passed from the system and make it so that, that would have to be a discount, given to patients that could drop any day now. That's, that's actually right about to he's also talked about some things that are very, very traditionally, not Republican ideas and they've made a few people in his party uncomfortable. But one of them is drug importation. He's back. Florida's plan and said that he wants the federal government to work with Florida on figuring this out. Another one is this thing called reference pricing, tying American prices, too much cheaper prices paid by European countries. Again, this is something that Republicans are a little queasy about, it's something that Bernie Sanders loves what about Medicare negotiating for lower drug prices. The president has said in populous speeches that he's for it. Lots of Republicans are not for it. It's not a new debate, the idea here would be that Medicare is so big and strong in the market. I wanna say fifty five million members that might be wrong that, that they can four-stroke companies to lower their prices by negotiating on behalf of the American tax payer is that going anywhere that might help here. Well, it's yeah. Like you said, President Trump has talked about that, but I think the last time he was really definitive on it was on the campaign trail. And I think people in his party were saying, this is not a policy that we back. So he's kind of retreated on that. It's really something. Now, that is progressive democrat. That's mostly in the house who are saying that, look, we're not gonna sign onto a drug pricing package unless it has powers for Medicare to do this, because like you said, it's one of the biggest insure. And so if it's doing that, that could really bring down costs for a lot of people. But there are questions about how much it really would in which drugs would be included on that. So very recently as a kind of way to get progresses on board, speaker Pelosi said, okay, we're not going to only target twenty five drugs on this, which was the original plan. We're going target two hundred and fifty drugs. The problem is that it's really hard to say which drugs go into that bucket. They're talking about rare disease, jugs cancer, therapies that are tens of thousands hundreds of thousands of dollars that were going that bucket insulin is three hundred or so. So it's not if we're just going by price in might not be there, but it is the one that is continually people can't skip on this. They need that they need that negotiation. And what about the states we talked about Colorado's cap one hundred dollars per month. If you have insurance, you said states have different approaches to the reimportation question, what are. States besides Colorado doing directly on insulin prices. Well directly on insulin. It's mostly been things like the cap, but on a broader sort of cutting costs and understanding the lack of transparency in the chain. Multiple states have set looked at their contracts with payers and said, we can't understand why we're getting charged this white consumers getting charged this work going to cancel these contracts and either renegotiate them or like what West Virginia did recently. We're just going to directly manage it ourselves. States may continue to grapple with that. It's going to be interesting to watch congress in whether carving out, this one, little sliver of the healthcare cost crisis in this country can actually help solve this problem, and then the question becomes a Sarah, if they manage to get agreement and bring insulin prices down. What about the rest of the armaments barium that doctors have to treat diseases, diabetes is only one disease insulin is only one drug. Yeah. Exactly. And even even within diabetes, as both leeann inducted mckeever of said, there's so many other aspects of it the pumps, the tests, there's, there's a much broader question about how to manage cost in general, and it's only going to become a bigger one, because when we get to these really expensive, gene, therapies in precise. Medicines out there. We're talking about million dollar therapies launching. We've gotta figure out a better way to pay for them. I want to thank all three of my guests. And the one listeners for chiming in on this, this very important issue across American healthcare, Sarah overall covers the pharmaceutical industry for politico. Sarah, thank you for being here. To be here. Dr Leshan mckeever senior vice president of governmental, affairs and advocacy at the American diabetes association. Also a physician, Dr mckeever. That's why we were so glad to have you here with more than a decade of experience, treating diabetes. Thank you so much for joining us. Dr. Thank you for having me. Leah greenside is a consultant in Minneapolis. Minnesota her thirteen year old daughter has type one diabetes. She's a participant in these caravans to Canada to buy cheaper, insulin Lee. Thank you for joining us, and for sharing your story. And good luck to you. Yes. Thank you so much. Great to have. All three of you with us today show was produced very able Levi page Osborn it was edited by Miranda. Full more. This program comes to you from W AMU part of American University in Washington, it's distributed by NPR until we meet again. I'm Todd's Celeste Headley's here tomorrow. Thank you so much for listening. This is one A.

diabetes Canada Todd Leah greenside Sarah Lee greenside Dr mckeever ADA NPR Minnesota Washington congress Novo Nordisk Leshan mckeever Doctor mckeever US
Wonderful! 109: The Hair-Eating Robot Friend

Rose Buddies

47:00 min | 1 year ago

Wonderful! 109: The Hair-Eating Robot Friend

"Hi this is Rachel mcelroy hello this is Griffin mcelroy. And this is wonderful. I thought my thought 'cause I always come in and I'm like did you go see in the news about the big beef. DEF- shore Jr and then we have to make jokes about the be shortages. No fucking laughing matter. The beef is gone. Where's the beef? made a joke about it. I thought if we were GONNA switch things up beforehand you would be like. Oh Hey Rachel by the way by the way I want you to do stare stare at you until you do a starter thing. Don't do the one about the beef. Short people taking sensitive what Abo- where did the beef go. You know what I mean. Cow Run away with the spoon. You know what I mean or the cow jump over the moon. You're almost doing a slam poem right now. Has this whole episode so far. Yeah this land poem. I don't know I opened up my box. What's inside the key? Not The beef See you're doing I hesitate even for. Yeah you're not doing. No you're not slamming. You GotTa do a lot of like I look into the newspaper. And what do I see the beef shortage so you talk like a robot combat broken robot. I I opened the beef trae Laura where is might be Small wonders it do. It's actually it's a twitter account. Oh Gosh I found this. I don't know y but I found this it's The account is called Wicky title Singable. Two teenage mutant Ninja Turtles. I don't know how I found it But all it is and they tweet almost constantly. He's just eight syllables. Yeah so for example Let me give you on. spiderman the dragons challenge Human Rights Protection Party Senate of the Czech Republic and it's just constant is the right number of posts they post like with the Good Dang. That's it's very very good pleasant Valley Ranger Station Dreaming of Jewish Christmas Smith is a personal favorite of mine. That's a wicky title. I guess what that is. I got a small wonders. New POLKA Got It came out while we were on like a really long tour This past weekend. And what a what a time for that to drop because it was just me and Justin And and our business manager Amanda dislike playing it on the plane and you can see like a ticker like a stock ticker of like what your buds are doing. So like I lean over and yell that was Dope Hulu I bet that one Scott Hi stats site for you dude site for you. I'm really liking it. I've I've got the I've got the bug doug again and I really haven't and explain to me how they vary like the Gabes and it seems to follow the same format in my God. Yes catching catching the POLKA mine. One game it's just a good one of those. I feel like a good one of those. It's got a bunch of quality life the things that would be way too. Granular for me to unpack here. It's still got its problems but I think also just it being on the switch like I love that switch and I carry it with me. I found out that I can slip this new the switch which light into my Pico breast pocket and so that Shit was with me everywhere in the Mid West. And I just pop it out. Catch a few Mon- then you know we'll get back to what I was doing. I got like a hundred and thirty pokemon already out of four hundred in this I I could extensively catch them all this things only been out for a few days folks. I'm might might just be the next year throwing that ball I am do. You don't know if that was the sex thing but it is like how I don't want to see I didn't didn't WanNa make a big deal out of it but you go first. What is your what is your first thing over there? It wasn't it wasn't a sex thing it's just. I have a very limited knowledge of POKEMON. Yeah I know that you throw a ball to catch them you do. Yeah yeah well then my first thing is rosie the riveter. Oh Wow yeah I don't know much about Rosie. I actually actually didn't either turns out Rosie. The riveter was the star of a campaign aimed at recruiting female workers for Defense Industries during World War. Two Bunch of men enlisted did in The war and that meant that if any business is going to continue the women had to start going into the workforce More than three hundred in ten thousand women worked in the aircraft industry alone. Before or after the war I'm guessing after like during yes during So that that represented sixty five percent of the workforce compared to one percent in pre warriors. Shit so rosie the riveter riveter Stressed the patriotic need for women to enter. The workforce She was created by a Pittsburgh artists and was featured on a poster for Westinghouse Electric Corporation. Here's the thing that's interesting about. That's that's what you're picturing right like that woman with the little head scarf orphan whatever she flex in those huge guns there at any at any point nobody said like this is rosie the riveter that actually was assigned find later. WHOA okay retrospect I was GONNA ask because this for an electric company are rivets and important part of electricity and how it is sort of dispersed? Yeah no so it kind of things. We're kind of happening simultaneously so this Pittsburgh Artists Howard Miller created this four the Westinghouse Company and it was displayed for Westinghouse employees during a two week period in nineteen forty three so it wasn't even like a promotional thing. This is like an internal memo. No this this guy was hired to create a series of posters and it was only for existing employees employees to kind of boost. Wow that's wild. Yeah what ended up happening was that there was an another rosie. The riveter bitter that was created by Norman Rockwell. Actually the the actual rosie the riveter like woman holding Lunch pail with the rivet gun and the lunchbox red rosy and this is nineteen forty three so this is like a year later so the thing that the icon that we call Rosie the riveter. Isn't rosie the origin now. Now all this came there was a popular song called Rosie the Riveter for in one thousand nine hundred forty three And so there's there's this this kind of confluence of events where we know it as the like you know we can do it post right. But that poster actually kind of disappeared and didn't resurface until the eighty s as like a feminist icon. Yeah part of what I read the reason that the Norman Rockwell one wasn't used more frequently. Is that the Rockwell. Family family was very proprietary over the bike rockwell. Pieces of art. Oh yeah and so it was less easy to use that yeah icon in going forward. I'm surprised we were there. Like and you'll have to forgive my ignorance about the worst Norman Rockwell but I assume surrounding his version version of Rosie. The riveter there were children laying on a rug. Ned GRANDPA with a hot beverage sitting by a fire plan was a cover of the Saturday evening post And it you know it was in nineteen forty three. It was this kind of that time period. Shaw there was actually a rosie. The riveter film. They came out in one thousand nine hundred forty four based on based on based on the works of Norman Rockwell. I guess I don't know if this was Talki- or not Bagus if it was pre spoken word they could just say like yeah. Look it's the. It's the one from norm. Oh you know. It's the forties paved they had. They had film. Do they have talkies though. Yes what do people start talking to movies. You don't know I don't know for sure. Yeah but I do Know Casablanca Asa Blanca. Probably for some like Jimmy Stewart. You know those you know was making flicks back then. They had talkies. I've definitely heard that man's voice. Yeah so the women that went back and worked specifically as rivers were called Rosie's in that time period like it it really took off. It became like a huge huge piece for that effort to Shir But again the picture that we all identify I five with today is not actually where that came from. You know. It's wild though I was thinking about it and I was going to ask before you started. If Norman Rockwell was the one who yeah drew this rosy the root cause there is something. Yeah so the most credible because everybody's like based on a real person where this come from the most credible claim there is a photo From nineteen forty. Two of this woman named Niamey Parker Fraley who was working in in a machine shop in California and in the photo. She's using ir she's using our like a riveter and she is wearing a Polka etc.. BANDANNA okay so there's a suggestion like oh she must be the inspiration rain I hope. She got some residuals man actually was interesting. She was incorrectly actually identified in that photo so everybody associated did the photo with another was like four layers of us just dropping the fucking ball on this one. Yeah it the. The photo had been like incorrectly attributed to a woman who is actually still in high school when that photo was taken okay so it was only later. She was like looking at an exhibit or something it was like. Hey that's me that's yeah whoops guys So this propaganda campaign about getting women into the workforce was hugely effective. And what was interesting. Is that after. The war ended all the propaganda was suddenly like and now go back home all really. Yeah there were government sponsored efforts to encourage women to basically now now you needed at home again. Ladies and as such the overall percentage of working women fell from thirty six percent to twenty eight percent percent in nineteen forty seven But a lot of women still stuck around The oldest last known riveter her from that time period built airplanes for fifty years and was just laid off at age ninety five and twenty fourteen. Yes are you kidding me The by the time she left she had worked on every single C.. Seventeen plane at the Boeing. Plant she. She's Rosie the riveter now. I feel like if you are a highlander. Like last last woman standing in that career. Probably you you congratulations. Roseanne role in. That's the thing that she didn't I I I read something that she retired ninety five but then I read. She was laid off ninety eight. That does suck although I ninety five fifty years working there. Hopefully the severance was quite choice I thought of this recently because he around Halloween time. Ucla ladies going out there in the in the Rosie. The riveter outfit but it is. There's just kind of a nice reminder of this time when the country really needed women to step up and fill all these positions for the men that were fighting yeah And it really changed things for women fundamentally from there on out it was like hey we showed you all that we can do it and that we're just as dedicated and we're just as important and we're not going anywhere hell yeah So so I feel like any time I see Rosie. The riveter is just a reminder of that really pivotal time point in history. Well jump into my first thing It's not not quite it's a sort of iconic and culturally important is years so I'm feeling again a sort of rough transition here sort of tonal. Whoops doodle if if you because my first thing I have written here good robots good robots a good robot who who is not an evil? A good I wanted I wanted I was originally was like robots are pretty bad ass because I feel like I've been on sort of a star wars kick lately and so I think I've just got droids on the brain. I have a transition for you. Okay okay we we can. Just edit all that out yeah sure and go back to speaking of a rosy that was the jets. Yeah well she a good robe I I guess so Sassy she got it done the yeah she did she got it done she was was a she was a good robot. I shrank if there was ever an episode where she like attempted to thwart or perhaps even terminate the jets family and we say good robot you mean robots. That aren't aren't you know contrarian no I mean couching mostly because I know that eventually robots are either going to destroy the world or the economy and and I don't want this. I don't want people to play this episode back and be like Griffin Griffin was A. He helped this sort of robot. ROBOT CLIPS COME TO PASS I. I don't want that I enjoy good. Robots I'm also not talking about like the iron giant whose an incredibly good robot for sure everybody wants him to be bad and everybody thinks he's he's baboo everybody like this one little boy and maybe Harry connick junior and maybe Jennifer Aniston. We're like okay. You're good robot now. I'm GonNa Start crying now. Now just thinking about iron giant takes the mcelroy's down it is a it's a heavyweight I am talking about actual factual good robots L. Bots and you may be wondering big dog big good robot. Are you kidding me. This big dog is a good robot. Not Not practical. I think big dog breaks the Molt for me because I'm talking talking mostly about good practical robots that help us in our day to day lives. A big dog. Hasn't helped me necessarily but it's hard not to watch this Guy Tran Franklin of some stairs and be like you can do it bid yes big dog. Roomba room was good robot. This little robot goes round eats. It's up all your crumbs in your hair so you don't have to step around in it and get your feet dirty. 'CAUSE Roomba goes in there and eats it just so you can be happy and so you'll be proud of it. Learns Your House stew. He learns where Your House or the stuff go down. The stairs doesn't go down the stairs. He conscientious we just personified Roomba extremely hard and it's hard not to to do that with room but that's the kind of robot I think I'm talking about. The one cannot help but personify because he did such a good job and he's doing his absolute best and sometimes l. bump into the table leg but you moved it and house room was you know. Roomba don't got is room. Maybe got a camera. Some sensors be nice to Roomba. Because we're gonNA wants to do. Its Best I like that anytime I see a house with a Roomba or an off brand Roomba I get so excited and explains why. Recently you've taken to buying mine are three year old son. Robots that he is far too young to well. We got we did the DROID building experience Disneyworld but that was a pickup. He fucking loves aerobic way into that but he picked out. We let him pick out a Toyota toy store. Pick this like very technical dancing robot that he played with for like thirty seconds. So it's like I don't know how the buttons so I WanNa talk about another good robot and this one lives in the Austin airport. This one's maybe a little bit boozier of a robot but I travel a lot these these days and I love the Austin airport but there are there are like three good places in the whole airport to like get not awful coffee Like not complete like I. I am not like a coffee shop. I'm talking about. It's not like Super Super Shitty airport coffee three hundred degrees. Yeah and there's okay so there's like only a small handful of places at the airport good coffee and I like I drink a lot of coffee every morning to get going and those three places always have like a wild headline and I'm always coming in pretty hot when I go to the airport and so most of the time like I just didn't get the coffee. I'm going to have to get the airplane coffee and that's a horse of a different color No it's not. It's the same aim color. It's bad coffee but now there's this robot his name's Brigham. Brigham lives at the airport. There's two of them and I understand how Brito Work Burgos a friendly robot. He's a big box. He's a big big box and he listens to an APP. You have on your phone and you say hey go. I'm on my way to the airport. I'll be there in a couple minutes or hey brig I just got off a plane. I'm walking towards the gate where you live outside of watching and smiling all the airplane reunions Do you think that you could make me a sixteen ounce coffee with two ounces of half and half in a shot of of like vanilla flavoring one packet of Stevia. Thank you Burgo Burgo said sure. Just roll up to me. I got a screen on me. You're GonNa Punch in this secret password. I'm going to tell you the secret three digit password. And then you go to the machine and it's made your coffee inside of Brito. Britto takes the ingredients inside of his by and turns it into water so it's not like it. Sits in a holding containers is sit in a holding. It keeps it warm warms it for you so when you order it yes it does it make it Yeah pushes pushes it out the door for you when you arrive. Yes exactly you can also decide how hot you want to be Brig. Oh you shouldn't have because I'm GONNA get on this plane. I needed to be drinkable now. Thank Q. Break go like I get it. It's incredible it's a tech. It's tech you brand and I know that that raises some people's Hackles Bam rolling up to the airport and my fights going to start boring in five minutes and I would really like a coffee. And here's this bid Robo box. Does it ever tell you like. Hey I ran out of vanilla. Sorry never run on Al.. He's never run out. He's a true friend. Paro the therapeutic baby seal robot that they have in my Kospi's in nursing homes that like provides people sort of like nick social Comfort because it can make eye contact in blink and like Michael Seal noises about this guy. He's a good guy and you don't have like worried about like feeding him or anything like that. He's just a little robot companion if you're lonely. That's very good. I learned about a new one today in a this. Robots menas gene is Geeta. And it's a little cargo robot and it's from the company that makes the VESPA the The scooter and it's just like this little circular helper by not that rolls around behind you and can carry forty pounds of cargo and I'll follow you up to six miles an hour and it can avoid obstacles and it has zero turning radius and just follows you all around like Ooh Ending to get my groceries. I'M GONNA put it in your brain and you're going to carry it for me. Thank you GEETA. And she's like no problem and then you're probably like somebody's going to steal the groceries from Geeta. No it's got a fingerprint sensor. It'll only open up for you. Well you're such a good friend so it's not a shopping cart. No it's a little. It's about the size of a tire. It looks kind of like a tire but it's it isn't just one big rolling Tyre would fuck up. All the cargo has inside of it if that was the case. It's just a little friend that helps you and carries your thinks I love these good robots yeah robots robots we need more of them more good robots And we need to. I don't I don't know how to prevent this. But keep them from being corrupted but bat robots or the militias code made by people. Robots aren't going to be the one that Fox this up for all we're going to start the fire. I agree with you anyway. Hey can I steal your way yes sponsors this time in our first one. It doesn't come in second because its third love. That was great. Thanks thank you. We've talked about third love before. Yes I was trying to find new features that we haven't stressed enough junior those cups are memory foam. No also tangles labels and straps that. Don't slip every customer has sixty days to wear it wash it and put it to the test and if you don't love it return it and third love will wash it and donate it. Two women in need they are bras. They are bras. Probably should've said the lead with that. Because I know we've talked about it before but I think I would appreciate it if we did talk about it again. It actually says here thanks for taking his sponsorship. If you've talked about us before don't sweat barrel on through. They make bras and they have memory foam cups. People were probably like wouldn't this super soggy from all the juice that you put in. Yes they are bras us I wear them undershirts and a lot of times. You can't even see him. As sometimes I forget that I need to mention that their Bras Yep If you are interested in purchasing a third love bre aw You can get fifteen percent off your first order by going to third love dot com slash wonderful to find your perfect fitting Bra and get fifteen percent off off your first purchase. That's third love dot com slash wonderful her fifteen percent off today. It's that time of year again almost kind of for some people it is for some people people. It's not for us. It's getting there but anyway the holidays are coming. The holidays for me is me on these. It's all me undies. Time when I think about the holidays one they make really really radical gifts. Nobody's ever going to open up a pyramides and say ooh. What are these It's so true everyone's going to open them up and actually I'm thinking about this sentence now now and there are probably inappropriate people for you give a gift of underwear to your boss or something anti unless your boss is cool. And you've talked about these undies before in which case they'll probably be like. Oh these are the me uneasy and easy told me about their. Softest how they got that micro modal fabrics. Don't even worry about that. It's great gifts. They got fun prints. They got some fun holiday. Not just underwear anywhere you know. That's the thing I wanted us. That's the thing maybe you don't feel comfortable buying somebody underwear but you do feel comfortable buying somebody a lounge pant if you want a sock if you will what I am. Stoked about is the cold months the though the holiday season. When you don't got work and you're just lounging around the house for like two straight days you throw on that Onesie and you go cruising you throw on that onesie and you can do what ah ever to set up a big holiday photo with the macaroni onesies? All of our Mendis one of these. That is a great Idea we may need to invest in some dance bells because angles. If the light is right they are a little sometimes for the for the people with With Ding dongs. It can be but yes I agree with you. And that's great. They look dope. Everything looks really great. But maybe for a holiday card we want to like you know photoshop some some bumps here and there but anyway if you WanNa get these and you should because you can get fifteen is that right. That can't possibly be right. It is right fifteen percent off your first pair free shipping and a one hundred percent satisfaction guarantee you can just go to mandy dot com slash. Wonderful that's me on dot com slash. Wonderful well did you see a robes. Now what this robes bullsh- yet yet and a baby bodysuit. Everything's coming up me on these. Hey can I read you a personal message. Yes this is. I don't know if you read ahead. This is part of a satin. Okay this message is for Brunch squad. It is from Rachel Brand Brench squad. Meaning you all at the Nashville. Little shows in June was one of my favorite wonderful things to ever happen. Just wanted to say thank you for the unending love and support and the sharing of this inclusive mcquarry community despite us all being states away. Let's keep conquering this distance. See you soon your baby EST Rachel e brand. That is good. I'm glad we can be even a very very small part of helping helping these fine folks come together and find friendship. That is is one of the things that brings me the most joy in the whole world because this next message is also for Brunch squad in this one's from Said who says Brench squad. Thank you for being my Go-to team. Even though we live across five different states. You've made me feel so welcomed and loved at the Nashville Moonbeam and it's been nonstopping current delicious meal swaps and gouves ever since. Thank you for existing. You're all pretty wonderful love SID. It's embarrassing they said the same message. Branch squad has real powerful in this run run. Schwab is unstoppable. This episode it's a it's an absolute avalanche just just realized that that was a play on much squad. Didn't it's a completely separate thing in it so embarrassed I didn't know about. They did their thing. Hi I'm Renee Colbert XS Preston. And we're the host of the smash hit podcasts. Canape your dog Alexis. We got big news. Oh since last we did a promo Our dogs have become famous world. Famous world like stars on the Hollywood walk. Second big news. The reviews are in Take yourself to apple time cashing in what you're gonNA hear we're happy is it's true. We're a delight a great distraction from the world. I like that part a lot. So if that's what you guys are looking for a check out our show but what else can they. We've dog tat dog good news celebrities with their dogs. All dog thing all the dog thinks so. If that interests you will get yourself on over to maximum fun every Tuesday. What's what's your second thing? My second thing is also kind of a heavy heavy hitter. Okay what is it insulin. I just because the thing that happened. Been in the news about people trying to synthesize their own insulin. No totally unrelated. I saw it in the news today. Well I think it was like a verge report or something about the people who who are trying to like fucking hack insulin medicine. So that people don't have to pay fifty five thousand fucking dollars for it anymore. That's incredible I did not. I did not read the article but so I don't know how far along they are but I keep keep at it. y'All you're you're not doing the Lord's work you do in the work the human beings should be doing and not be half about it. Okay Sorry Fair Yeah I. I'm always hesitant to kind of tread into to medical topics one because Dr Sydney mcelroy kind of owns a the skills on that one right but Also there's a Lotta medical stuff out there that's pretty wonderful and it's hard not to talk about it and you. I don't know how much you talk about this. But like it's an issue I think pretty near and dear to yeah I was GonNa talk about got it so My Dad has type one diabetes. And it's interesting because that is a type of diabetes that is typically Discovered when you are a juvenile actually used to be called juvenile diabetes Because it's where the pancreas just doesn't produce insulin So you are dependent on insulin to just function as a human being whereas type two diabetes often individuals will produce insulin just not in sufficient ranting quantities to function well And and all of this happened when I was real little so ever since. I can remember my dad's diabetic But this is not something he had most of his life and I think it was real tough going for a while trying to kind of figure out how to manage it As an adult Ryan you know having been in Houston. Yeah the majority of your life not needing anything and then all of a sudden you have to dramatically change everything And I had known that in my own lifetime if time kind of the technology behind slung advanced pretty dramatically but I didn't realize how recently this all came together So this is like back in the nineteen twenties was when they first discovered that insulin was a thing that would help diabetics For a long time they I didn't really know the cause of diabetes and so people didn't live very long with it The most effective treatment was to put people on Diets But it would only usually extend their life a few years after they were diagnosed and often. The diets were so strict that people were getting as little as like four hundred fifty calories day Christ so they would die of starvation And so as they focus more on the pancreas they discover this very specific. Cluster of cells called the Is Let's of Langer hands. Well that's bad ass is. That sounds so cool. That sounds like the next like George. Martin which is how they came up with the term insulin because because the Latin word insulin means island okay. I didn't this is fun. I'm learning so much so in one thousand nine hundred twenty one Frederick banting and his assistant instant Charles best figured out how to remove insulin. From a dog's pancreas and when they put it into another dog that had severe diabetes. The dog lived lived furniture. Seventy days only pass when there was no more insulin available. How so that's when they realize? Oh this is the key. This is what you know. Creatures creatures with diabetes need And then it just kind of advanced from there. They've moved from dogs to a more pure form of insulin. That could be found in the pancreas of cattle addle and it was in nineteen twenty two. There was a fourteen year old boy in a Toronto Hospital. became the first person to receive insulin and within twenty four hours of receiving Vena Dangerously High Blood Glucose levels drop to near normal levels and they were like here we go. We figured it out and so a year later. They received the Nobel Prize say so and started large scale production Of Insulin from cattle and pigs for many many years the first genetically engineered synthetic human insulin was produced in nineteen seventy eight using E. coli bacteria. Wow it was interesting. Yeah 'cause the problem with the insulin That was coming from cows and pigs. 'cause a lot of allergic reaction well on you have to harvest it from from other animals which I imagine it's like a it is a Fi is a more finite thing than something you can send. This is very difficult and I I would say if I remember knbr correctly it was early in the eighties. A lot of people were still using that Pagan Council. And I think I do not. I would have literally no way of I think including my dad because if I remember correctly it was only after. He'd had for a few years that you could really get this. Synthetic Human Insulin Because it it wasn't until Nineteen eighty-two that Eli Lilly went on to sell the first commercially available human insulin which now comes in many forms From regular regular human insulin identical to what the body produces on its own to ultra-rapid an ultra long acting insulin. Oh see a one point two five five million people have type one diabetes So obviously this is like a significant. Yeah sure people can get it any point in their life. You just find it often in in younger people because if your body isn't producing insulin usually you can catch on pretty quick. Yeah And I just it's just incredible double. It's incredible just within our own lifetime. How much that's advanced? I remember there was a There's a girl that I was in like a all the like talented and gift. Whatever you whatever? Your school called it. That had type one diabetes in like came in one day with like one of these pumps and all of us were like so like kind of like super curious about I mean we were like the science science near kids so we were like we wanted to know everything about it and I feel I kept I pretty much. Everybody thought that she was like the youngest kid ever have a beeper bieber so like she got out of it. Yeah I remember. That was but that wasn't until like sixth grade or something like that. And before that like I hadn't even heard have diabetes before I don't know I maybe. My my bubble was a little bit small. But yeah it's kind of I mean it's kind of an invisible condition you know if if you manage it right which you know is easier or more difficult for some people but you know you can just kind of live your life and it's not particularly noticeable But I I imagine at least my experiences that every every case can be different. Yeah you know And it I mean I know from my my dad's for it took a long time for him to figure out how to manage it and as the drugs advance it only got easier and So yes I'm you know I'm I'm real grateful for right. I think it's it's one of those things that I can't imagine not existing. You know it's like for me. It's it's like penicillin you know it's like this is incredible credible drug that is so necessary daily life now That has fundamentally changed. Our lives And is is just a really wonderful thing. That's fantastic tastic. I'm actually really excited about my second thing. I was trying to figure out the correct but sometimes I struggle like really encapsulated. What I WANNA talk about in like a single single sort of nine raise or something like that because when I started out with the experience of eating German food in a public sort of Beer Hall Beer Garden setting the entire the entire sort of German food eating experience in an established limit like that and like how ah how well everything sort of pairs up and like warm nicer to the Nice warmth and community it gives you but then I learned? There's a German word word for it. Oh good and I'm going to try and pronounce it. I'm going to do a very bad job Gamut lacob it. Roughly translates to like this warm warm friendly feeling of good cheer or coziness and peace of mind. It's an incredibly good word that I will never say again because I pretty sure just embarrassed myself. But it describes experience that I'm talking about and I know that like not everybody's excited about drinking big big glasses of beer and so like I'm not even talking about about like that's not even the the big thing for me. This is not like I'm not thinking about. This is my favorite way hit plastered drunk. It is yeah I mean it's maybe a little bit of a part of that I'm not talking about anything debaucherous to set this up. We had a sort of a day off during this last tour. We're and so Me and just travis and our and Paul. Who's our tour manager in? Amanda who's our our business manager and her husband We went to a German beer ear hall in Milwaukee and we went there and it was holders hell outside and we went in and it was really nice and warm We found a big table. Right away sat down. Got Like leader glasses of like crisp lager and had like some Kurds and big pretzels else and Schnitzel and a bunch of different types of sausages and lake. We drink that and then we played this game where you have to hammer nails into a big log like hand-cut you gotta use this big like five pound Hammer. Tha at your at your table like now like right next to our town okay And so like you have to just get it in and the person with the last nail Stan. There's a lot of different roles for this for nail game. We couldn't figure out what it was actually called but we played that and then this there is a stage age. Where guys are playing Acoustic Guitar? And he's playing a lot of those you know the CGI three Gore accord classics did take us to Margarita. Vel which Justin very much in all of this went hand in hand and like I left that thinking like that was a fucking great night and also is sort of representative of like most. WHO's Times that? I've gone to a place like this and eating food like this If you go somewhere and they serve sausage pretzels and kind of adopt like a like a German airman sensibility like follows a format. I know this does not like encapsulate. All German cooking though it'd be like an incredibly reductionist way of looking at this entire cultures food output but like like the the meals that I've eaten at beer halls beer gardens Hoffbrau house place like that a place that there there is something so so pure about this pairing of. Here's a tall blake outrageously large crisp beer. And here's a bunch of super savory salty food to go go with it and those two together just like it makes also be I mean and you may be about to talk about this but you're kind of your first. International travel title is many residents of being the first time ever left. The country was when I got it was post college Because it was when we were the holy shit so this must have been twenty eleven. I was I you know. I always thought of myself as like not the type of person who could travel internationally that I wouldn't know what to do or that would embarrass myself and I did But the first time I left the country was two games calmness big game conference in Cologne Germany and I I went with some folks that Polygon was pretty new at the time so like I didn't know them especially well and our first night there. You know super jet lagged and like fish out of water and we went to this beer hall and I ate you know yeager Schnitzel for the first time and had all these like tiny like tall cylindrical. Glasses of of like extremely light lager and had a bunch of those and then by the end of the night we were all like I got to know them a lot better than I would at any other kind of sort of have dinner celebration and to because of this game UCLA. Kat I'm telling you guys I just like pretzels with the a big ass. Pretzels that you just can tear apart as a group dip in like some sort of cheesy or mustard soft pretzel. There's some good places for that in Austin which I'm very I'm grateful for and I you know there's even like good beer halls in Austin that have like a fairly authentic German food and it is Paul was talking talking about this like And I I feel sort of on the same page of it is a type of cuisine that I forget that I fucking love like I really like and I really really like going to places like that with groups of friends because it is a it is an experience with such a singular purpose when it like works and it is. Ah I don't know I I. I am again struggling to kind of like put. Put the right words to it but It's just you know going out and having a A tall glass of refreshing beer games spirit behind it you know. Yeah a lot of Food that you find associated did with American culture for example is all about convenience. You know it's not really about the like sure the like me. I don't know I guess I'm I'm thinking about like you know upscale Burger's what I'm thinking about is like a crawfish boil or low country boiler a nice long table with a bunch inch of food on it that it's spicy and salty and you have some drink like yeah man that's really good stuff bid up yet your Schnitzel is also fantastic stake. I would love. I think I've made it before I make sense laforest before with like pork cutlets I for sure yeah. I think that was a long time ago. I will say this the next day day. I wasn't hung over because that is the miracle of all of this like extremely heavy salty fatty German food. I was not hung over but my stomach was confused. My stomach was like that was too much. You know this. We've been working together for thirty two years now. I thought that you you have figured this out by now. That was way too much. You know that right enough working together is really the relationship you have with your stomach. It's more like you work next to each other and occasionally your your interests align. It's sort of like who's the boss here the situation and we that's the that's the first I've only watched a few episodes of it but it's kind of like succession like we're both sort of England for for for like. WHO's the boss? The Popular Sitcom with Tony Ansa is that what the plot of that show's about. Tony Dances trying to wrest control of the household a little bit. How got some submissions here? This one's from Kathy says something I think is wonderful. Is the jeep wave save. Have you heard of the jeep wave. Now I drive a jeep and jeep. Driver's always wave at each other in some way we'll pass each other on the road. The most common is to flash a peace he signed but I've seen people do all sorts of things including excitedly waving their arms out the top of the car or reaching out the side of the car when the door is off and waving with an arm and leg. It's it's a little thing that makes me smile on a daily basis Secret GPS. I know that there are particular models of car. The people feel real kinship like Subaru's for example. Oh yeah there's a lot of a steam room owners. I wasn't aware where the jeep wave but I mean it's delightful as Volkswagen owners. Just have to look ashamed. That we got pulled over is Here's one from a Denali who says A little thing that's always guaranteed to put me in. A good mood is pulling up to a parking meter. That has time left on it even and if it's just a few minutes oh that's good good one point first of all to parking period is good the yeah there is no experience more peer too. I think this may be from owning a car in Chicago. There is no experience. More thrilling dare. I say erotic than parking car. You're in an urban environment and having it not be your fucking problem anymore for even a little of your parking somewhere and it. It is during a time period where there is no charge miraculously get to leave my car here. Hey thanks to Bowen and Augustus for these theme Song Money Won't pay your friend link to that and the episode the description and to maximum fine. Thanks for having us on the On the old network there buddy. Yeah if you haven't checked out. Maximum Fund Dot Org. I think you should because there. There are new episodes of great shows posted every single day. Yeah every single day you will never be hungry for content strew And End GonNA fill you right up and we got other stuff at Mac right out. Family family links to that. Gosh you know. It's weird not having any tour dates to promote we are done with the become the Monster Tour and candle nights. Were very excited for Rachel. We're going to do a holiday or maybe Huntington themed wonderful. What am I I I do think? I think it's funny that you think that I would be able to do one. Huntington themed wonderful. Maybe this'll be a very lopsided episode of wonderful where I just. I could do a whole episode about Flap Jackson. You know what I was thinking of what is whether or not I could find Griffin mcelroy Trivia. That I could I could share to Ooh that I find wonderful. That could be fine. I could be fine. You would have definitely some sources for that day. Some of your high school buds up on stage get some Real Griffin mockery gems. We'll let's not go wild. Yeah but that's it. We're going to head out then tiny get going see you later. Bundling up and now warming Norman up the car and we did the thing where he said by. But we're walking the same direction armor. Oh audience. Why don't you stay right here? We're going to run away. You ran to audience. Hey are you fucking following us. You're gone it Rachel uh-huh Maximum Fund Dot Org comedy and culture artist owned listener supported. Hey Hey cool shirt no this thanks Max. FUNDS STORE DOT com. That's strange I visited Max. FUNDS STORE DOT COM DOT com a few weeks ago and didn't see it because they just launched a ton of new stuff right in time for the holidays Oh cool there's patches mugs totes. Stickers Occurs Z.. Nice those did meet Greek gifts for everyone. I know because already got you something from right now. Excuse me a moment I need to look up. MAXIMUM STORE DOT COM DOT COM on my smartphone. You know to see what's new you can't go wrong with anything from Max. FUNDS STORE DOT com.

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Diabetology (BLOOD SUGAR) Part 2 with Dr. Mike Natter, MD

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1:23:37 hr | 1 year ago

Diabetology (BLOOD SUGAR) Part 2 with Dr. Mike Natter, MD

"Oh Hey it's still your friend who looks at listings of houses. She has no intention to buy alley ward back with another episode of allergies part. Two of a two parter so the book end on the Beatles. And I'M GONNA keep this short. Keep it sweet. But we're back with part to divert algae in which we address all kinds of Christians that patrons had about blood sugar and insulin in pancreatic matters. So if you haven't heard part one I I am here by inviting you. And all of of your glucose molecules to hop over that I for primer and also do you have little ones or grandparents or perhaps curse verse in Your Life who you need to learn more about their blood sugar. Well after I put up the first half I thought what if some people need to listen with kids who have diabetes Abe's so I- rained my potty mouth for this partout and I uploaded a kid friendly and swear free version of diabetes part. One of last week's it's on my website at award dot com slash gs slash diastolic. Jarrett worked extra hours. Get that up quickly. There's a link just right in the episode show notes. Take you right there in case you need to listen with little Kiddos so you're welcome. Thank you to everyone on patriotic. WHO supports a show? It makes that possible for everyone else. Thanks to everyone. One wearing gear from allergies merge DOT COM. Thanks of course to everyone making sure you're subscribed an for rating the show of course reviewing I read all your notes like a creep and this week. Thank you to Queens on foot. Who says you've ever felt afraid of the world or overwhelmed by any facet of it? Listen we fear the unknown but allergies consistently consistently brings me the piece of knowledge and the gift of regular belly laughs. So hot. Damn thank you Queens on foot and also juniper drop special hugs to you and your Fam- okay onward anward diabetes and other such sugary stuff so after our interview for part one. We had to dash off to a friend's dinner so once he was back in New York we recorded the second half and it happened to be on world diabetes day of all things and that day this all just had used his lunch break to speak into a megaphone. On Wall Street advocating advocating for a change in policy to make insulin more affordable and then he went back to the hospital save. Some lives finished up his shift and hopped on a video. Chat to answer. All of your patriarch questions so sit tight for a healthy serving of answers from position type one diabetic and deeply lovely lovely person Dr Mike Matter. MD You ready to dive into dissipate request so excited I know I sound too excited. Okay well let's start with some. That aren't super specific. I okay for example ally. There's GonNa be a lot of scrolling so does part on us at your at your leisure now. Okay so so as I pulled up your questions. Doctor mentioned to say hi to editor Stephen Remorse and Jarrett sleeper and how he wanted to hang out with them. Irl and I love watching cool dudes make pals so I suggested that they go kick it without me. Go get some putting putting in the hospital today. Actually eight white off the tray of my patient. It wasn't yeah. I didn't Miss Lunch today because I want to give that speech got like I don't want this I asked permission and how was it. Dr Matters Blood Glucose on this day while with all that running around it was low. Oh miss dipping into the sixties and the sixties. At least in blood sugar terms are not groovy. Did you find that stress definitely impressed does impacted for most people including myself stress. Usually makes it go. Hi because when you're stressed out you activate your taxes only God we can do one of these Harken back to your neurobiology. Balaji talks with that wonderful woman. Name is escaping me. Oh my doctor is also I love her so yeah. Yeah so when. You have your hypothermic but to Terry adrenal access kicked in. You are spitting out all from your hypothalamus like fighter flight. And then it goes to the Specifically the anterior pituitary intuit. The is the master engine Glenn and In terms of this fight or flight you into your preliminary sitting out the a C T H specifically and that guy goes downstairs to your. There's like this little beret that sits on top of your kidneys called the gland and the Beret has a crusty out apart. Called the CORTEX gooey. Center called the model and the gooey center secretes adrenaline. But we call it. Either nor Apron Ephraim and then in those two hormones spin around the body and make everything goes super fast so they make your heart up and they make your blood flow and all stuff but the other thing they do is they kind of kick in a lot of glycogen breakdown like gin. Is the storage form of sugar and your liver and your skeletal muscle. Most of it most liver and so then you start breaking the the the clogging down which turns into Glucose and glucose is basically sugar and that goes on your blog and for you if you're running away from the bear great because it's good for your muscles for me if I'm stressed out. I don't have insulin to then take that sugar. That's in the blood and put it into the cells so I go. Hi So thank you gentlemen for reaching into our liver and muscles and cracking open. That emergency sugar stash so just think your body heights. glycogen like a snickers in glove compartment and stress essentially screams bus that sucker open. It's freak out time and I need to get juiced up anyway. That was the Messiah we know I loved it. I loved it and so for for you. Because you don't have insulin to two escorted into the cells then it goes high and then it can damage tissues crunches long term damage so in the short term you just feel like hot hot sweaty garbage but Dr Nat reminds us that in the long term. There are complications. Like blood vessel damage. They can impact everything from your eyes is your kidneys to your feet serious stuff but you can't avoid or stay on top of it so let's learn how via your questions just flowers wants to know. Is it pronounced diabetes or diabetes or diabetes. I feel it depends on your mood. I mean Wolfer firmly would go home with. Diabetes feels good to say diabetes. I say diabetes. Sometimes I called the beatty's or affectionately the sugars or the show dogs but it's you know however you WanNa do it okay. PS side note. I always I always figured a pronunciation. Popularized by diabetic actor Legend and Human Walrus Wilford grimly must be southern born in origin. Like some kind of Ozarks lilt but I just read that it might be less regional and more temporal so in the Post War nineteen fifties Americans. Americans apparently pronounced it diabetes and then in the nineteen seventies alongside wide ties and sideburns. It shifted to diabetes. He's so Wilford who was born vintage and has been playing lovable. Geezers since the nineteen eighty-five ripper cocoon is just saying it old old school. But he's a good sport about people getting tattoos of his moustachioed face alongside the word. beat us he re tweets body art in his image Mitch and yes. He has a twitter. It's at Real Wolford and to patrons who asked about his impact. I'm looking at you ruth. Anti for Nanako McCall Edwards Anisa thigh and mm-hmm and just flowers this gentle mocking of his pronunciation has only up the profile of the disease. He's cool with it. and He. He said about diabetes. I would encourage people especially people over fifty years old to be examined to see if they've got and not be afraid of it. He says it's not what's something that needs to scare you. It's not a death sentence necessarily but that's up to you. You can learn about your body if you just pay attention and then keep a log of blood glucose tests and carbohydrate intake like I do and mainly do not be afraid the dudes had for decades. And he's going strong. He's eighty five right now now so follow the walrus shade. Little Page says. My Dad has type one diabetes in wants to know what's the highest and lowest blood sugar ever ever recorded in a living person. He promises not to use this information on the edge to have any idea like yours. When when you were hospitalized was I have to admit ignorance? I don't know what the record holder is for highest and lowest. The problem with Lois is that someone can technically be like typically like in the hospital during what's called a code when someone's like kind of actively dying we get a lot of labs to see what's going wrong with them and so we might get a sugar back. That's like doc in the single digits but technically dead. That's a bummer. So I don't know what the lowest would be that you could still be alive. I mean I've I've I seen people go into the twenties and then kind of recover and then the highest like you said I I think personally when I was diagnosed I was sixteen hundred which is just disgustingly and I think at the time in at the hospital. I was diagnosed in New York City that I held the record at least the pediatric. Er for for some time. I don't know if that's still the case. It's not a proud record to have but yeah I I don't know I've I've seen some one sees where I work so a one. C is a three month average of your blood sugar. Okay a normal person's She is between four and five point five ish and that's a percent and what it really is it's measuring the glick hospitalization of your red blood cells so the sugars sticky and so it's going to stick to your red blood cells and so you can kind of get an average into what that does and the reason it's every few months is because your blood cells turnover about one hundred twenty days or so and so what that does is that kind of gives you an idea of what your blood sugars are throughout those last three month. It's kind of like a report card here here. Are Your grades. So okay. I've seen so when you have diabetes you're usually technically diabetes isn't a one C of above six point five percent Technically quote unquote good control as a diabetic. You're less than seven percent. And if you're not doing so hot you're eight or nine percent even in the tens. It's not good but I've seen folks in the nineteen percent eighteen percent and that kind of correlates to an average average blood sugar of lake. Five hundred all all day. God I had so many patrons Kelly King Heather Dunsmore Deanne Karen Burn Him. Megan Johnson Andrea Marsh. Actually Hamer Shayla page in April Perry also first time question asker. Amanda Mercer who says is diabetes genetic genetic may great grandfather and grandfather were both diagnosed later in life and I was wondering how much of a chance happen being diagnosed so all those people are like. What's the deal? How genetic is it? So it's a really good question and it's not perfectly worked out yet. But the data suggests so there's obviously there's numerous types of diabetes and there's type one and type two and type one diabetes it's most commonly thought like a layman assume that type one is the genetic kind type two because you eat too much crap and it's actually much more complicated than that so what the studies are kind of finding out. Is that in terms of the genetics. There's there's a stronger genetic component with type two surprisingly then type one but it's multifactorial in it's not like an autosomal dominance type thing where you're passing passing you know you're automatically passing on this dominant trait. It's much more complicated. So the database that we pairs out that in type two if you have a first first degree relatives then you just had a higher chance of having type two at some point in your life Not necessarily at all but it's also environmentally kind of triggered. So Oh there's there's this saying that. I learned in Undergrad that genetics will load the gun and environment pulls the trigger and so they're kind of intimately involved in type one and the sucks for me because I'm a dude although I don't have kids yet. So maybe maybe it won't be the case but apparently there's an an interesting correlation with type one fathers who have sons have a higher likelihood of getting type one. But there's no sex linked trait that we know. It's it's not. It's not a sexy but we just happened to see epidemiologically that type. One fathers have more of a chance of having a type one son. Did anyone in your family that you know. No no no no one in my family had it that I know of The other thing is type. One is considered an auto immune disease so auto immune diseases like to come. They get lonely. They come in clusters in in pairs and things so if you have a relative. That has any autoimmune disease. It does put you at a slightly higher risk Of of having an autoimmune disease yourself there's it's an interesting demographic or geographic component to in the Netherlands in certain areas in the in that part of the world. Very hyper dominance of type one diabetes. Yeah so in part one we talked about how folks in cold climates and in cold seasons tend to get diagnosed the type one more often but could there be anything else at play like. Just bad luck or a witch's curse. Do you think that has anything to do with the hygiene hypothesis and end immune systems auto immune issues. It's not known so it's a really interesting theory and just in case you're listening to aren't familiar with it. It's a really fascinating theory. And and the idea is that like you know back in the day you know my mom and dad would eat dirt and like you not roll around in the mud and anytime you introduce pathogens or for any type of of foreign invader in cheers system as a kid your body then has a chance to have its immune system developed so that it creates plenty of antibodies in defense systems. So the theory. Is that US little snowflakes growing up in this very clean world. Where you've never put like a twig in your mouth or a bug in your ear you your immune system has not been trained to be recognizing things that aren't foreign and so then all the sudden it starts looking at your own cells as foreign invaders and so you start having autoimmune auto meaning self immune system attacking things? It's the it's interesting I don't know. Yeah I'm I'm sure in the future. We'll know way more about it and think holy smokes we should have been eating more turnip straight from the ground thinking just like worms and dirt but turnips to and so many people had pre diabetic questions. Like Laura Chrome pens Dominic Deck Christian Bet Ner and Rachel Ames Lauren. Group wants to know at what point does a pre diabetic become a diabetic and Domenico. Wanted to know. How concerned should you be if you can be considered pre diabetic in terms of how to change your Diet? That's that's a hard question. Aspen in general sure prediabetes deficit here here so I am a physician I treat patients. I am a tight better but I cannot give individual medical advice like in this setting so I I will speak in generalities okay. So let's first backup and so. So what is pre diabetes. So prediabetes obviously comes. It's like the before diabetes and what that is kind of like a little bit of a warning sign. It's like hey you're heading in a really not so hot direction let's let's take a Gander Gander. We can possibly do. So what does it mean to be pre diabetic so if you go by the guidelines of the ANC that we mentioned before the Hemoglobin UNC. As I mentioned before a normal range is four to five point six percent so between five point seven and six point four percent in America. We call that the pre diabetic range. Okay that's most commonly how I and I think most clinicians will diagnose a pre diabetic once you get into six point five and above range. You're technically considered diabetic. There are other ways to diagnose diabetes and so for instance like a fasting Blood Glucose look fingers to Glucose of above one. Twenty six is also considered I think it has to be twice though. I think not just one time but twice above one hundred twenty six and a fasting state. I think it's also considered diabetes. Then you can also do like an oral glucose tolerance test where they make you drink. This like like wait too sweet syrupy liquid and then check your Venus blood sugar at at different hours to see if your metabolising everything and making sure that your Dropping your sugar as they should but I think the a one C is the most common in easiest way to do so so once. You're in that five point seven six point four range. You technically pre diabetic. And then what you have to do is you have to look at why and so the first thing I would want to say is is this prediabetes tape two most commonly. That's the case. But if someone's young and otherwise a well or maybe has a family history and just about omb unity or whatever. I'd want to get a couple couple of lab tests to make sure that they're not actually type one diabetics because that's something you can't miss 'cause they can get very sick very quick and you don't WanNa miss that so you might want to get something called an Anti Gad sixty five or c peptide or an anti zinc transporter and what these are basically kind of markers for auto immunity amongst insulin or some of the Beta cells and not every type one will be positive for those but at the very least it's good to screen for them because if they are positive than you know that they were GonNa be insulin dependent and are type one okay. So to Recap Fasting Glucose over one twenty six a hemoglobin urban a one C which counts. How much sugar as sticky of your blood cells over five point? Seven is pre diabetic over six point. Five is diabetic but there are also test to see if your hyperactive immune system is helping you too much and accidentally killing the insulin. Or Beta cells in your pancreas increase. So Dr Nassar has also had to counsel patients who might be most to typically at risk for type two and as a diabetic diastolic. Just he wants to help them. Avoid the beast of the bts alternatively if if a patient has is overweight a little bit older Has Relatives type. Two diabetes is Has What's called the Metabolic Syndrome. where a large way size overweight obese usually hypertensive hyperloop deemak CEMIG high cholesterol? Usually these are folks that are going to be typed and so the first thing to do is you say we need to lose weight. But that's not good enough to tell someone lose weight you have to talk to them and say okay. Let's get granular here. What are you waiting for breakfast? What are you waiting for lunch? What you snacking on? How can we intervene small steps? How can we get you exercising? And then if they are morbidly obese in the can't lose the weight. It's actually been found that weight loss surgery can halt and in many any cases reversed type two diabetes. Wow why how is that. How does that happen? So there's a lot of theories and I I think if someone tells you they know how I think they're lying because I don't think we know percent so part of it certainly has to do with the losing weight for sure and I think part of it has to do with the brain gut gut connection. I think there's a lot of feedback and connections. That are happening there and I think we're still kind of not quite there and understanding all of it But I mean the easy. The easy low hanging fruit is what you just lost one hundred pounds and so therefore it's you've taken off all that way that's going to be easier for you. To kind of regulate glucose but it kind of gets into the idea of the pathogenesis of type two and we all assumed in layman in copy of cultures shirts. Thought that boy you ate too much candy you ate too much. You know carbohydrates but we're learning actually very recently that it has less to do at least the pathogenesis the ideology the beginning stages of type two. Or why we get it have a little bit less to do with the carbohydrates upfront and more to do with the saturated fats and the process basis meats and all the things that are processed and deep fried and I saturated fats and meats. And what's happening is those those needs are causing or those. Those chemicals are causing what's called a lie taxes Labour meaning fat and toxicity meaning toxic. And we're getting this kind of cumulation millation or deposition of this adipose tissue in places that shouldn't be like deliver like the pancreas skeletal muscle and gumming up the works. It's all oh causing myocardial dysfunction oxidative stress and all these fancy words like and what and that's going to intern causing insulin resistance picture and insulin resistance. Essentially is it's kind of three categories it's dysregulation of glucose regulation. It's an impaired postprandial. Absorption so postprandial Postprandial post-meeting after premium meals postprandial. Absorption of sugar into the skeletal muscle and then impaired pancreatic local regulation of the Beta cells. So yes ask those saturated fats and ally toxicity are messing up. How your food is absorbed? And how insulin the hormonal key that. Let's sugar out of the blood and into the cells. Able to work in the locks of those cells. But why do fats fudge up the works. Why are they such glucose goblins so all of this is kind of happening because of inflammation Laibach city and it kind of spirals into this cycle of inflammation Asian and high blood? SUGAR LESS INSULIN SECRETION LESS insulin sensitivity to the secretion and you kind of spiral into two so eating like a deep fried hotdog with Ailey Badia world's delicious. But you know but you know it's funny because like I think about this a lot because I'm actually currently on on on Collagen rotation the hospital. I see a lot of terrible stuff and it makes me think about the quality of life and I think everything in moderation is good because so oh you don't get type two diabetes. You live to one hundred and twenty but like maybe. He didn't really live. If you eat a hot dog with a only once a month. Enjoy it you know do your thing but maybe the rest of the month. You're eating your salads. You know it's kind of like a give and take so. Imagine your pancreas intense negotiations with your mouth offering offering to trade like four thousand Salads for one Luther Burger which is a dish. I just learned about when I googled. What's the least healthy thing you can beat? And the Luther Burger side note. It's named for RB legend with Vandross who loved these cheeseburgers squished between two crispy cream. DONUTS also also not to make this to real but diabetes ran in the vandross family and luther himself perished from stroke related to diabetes at the a very young age of fifty four. So when natter says avoiding insulin resistance and type two is worth the salad balance he means it What the Hell is insulin? Resistance a ton of people have this question including Shane Murphy. Madeline Winter Rose Presby Samantha. Galbraith Moses this bb Lynn Perry rose presby said. Can you explain insulin resistance and how it may differ between type one and type two. What the hell is it? What there's there's insulin receptors? That are typically found on adipose tissue fat cells and skeletal muscle and a few other places. And when the pancreas. The Beta cells of the pancreatic secrete insulin in response to an elevation blood sugar. Those little insulin pieces that kind of they're kind of like keys. I'm oversimplifying but they're kind of like keys. He's and the receptors on the post in the skeletal. Also kind of like the locks they go in and they unlock. The doors of those cells glucose goes in. Everything is wonderful so insulin resistance or insulin sensitivity is broken. Lock Okay and we think this is because of this Fat Deposition this medal conjul dysfunction and his oxygen that a a lot of people lump into the term Labo toxicity again. Type One. You're out of insulin. which acts like a key? So you inject yourself with keys to open the locks six on yourselves and let sugar in now type to your locks wonky and when it comes to advising a patient and it comes to adipose tissue and BMI BMI. There's such a difference between weight and an unhealthy weight. Where do you as a doctor advise people in a way that isn't like moral or judgmental or that actually addresses the physical problem instead of something that we're used to being aesthetic or a certain aesthetic is frowned upon? You know what I mean. Yes I think. That's an excellent question. I think it's I think medicine is getting more and more Press called precision medicine or precise an individual. You know you can't just lump someone into one-size-fits-all anymore and in medicine that's very true and BMI is a great example of how BMI. I mean the way we calculate. BMI is very crude basically. Just look at someone's heightened their weight and the best example of how that doesn't fit into why it makes sense is because if you've got a very fit body builder with a big muscle mass who's maybe not that tall. They would technically be morbidly obese based on a BMI and yet they have no body fat. So you're not taking into account a lot of factors but those those folks aside. BMI can be helpful in studio conversation because sometimes you need the objective data to say you can always tie back in medicine to This is not reflective of a judgment. It's not reflective of an aesthetic. This is me being concerned about what's going on inside and we know oh where you carry. The fat is also important so central atom Positi so the beer belly is far more dangerous than carrying your fat on your or your earth is and that's because the central depositry is actually a surrogate marker for the fat. That's inside and that is when you have your liposuction. Cities Inflammation Your Metabolic Syndrome. And we know from years of data from just seeing patients even in the short term at those folks that fall into those categories have far higher risk of heart attacks strokes hypertension diabetes. And all of those that all the horrible Colmar committees that bring with those things especially diabetes. I've seen terrible things from that and so I'm very keen to help my folks lose the weight but not for any other reason than because I tell them because I want them to live longer and healthier and feel good a lot of folks actually asked about exercise and type if one type to Michelle Phillips Merrill. Stark Munro Elise asked what is a mechanism that lowers the blood. Sugar of type one diabetics when they exercise without without taking exogenous insulin. So how does exercise in blood sugar work. It's a very good question. Very complicated physiology and my understanding of it is a little bit crew. I don't know if it's been fully worked out. But the basic idea is that when you're exercising you're using skeletal L. Muscle and so typically we're going to get we can get really granular. So typically if there's a rising blood glucose the Beta cell sense that they secrete insulin. The insulin sits into the insulin receptor in. It actually stimulates something called a glut. Four transporters to come intercalated into a membrane and ferry glucose across across intracellular early. Okay if you're like what. Just think of glut four as the friend who gets taxed from insulin and insulin is like hey hey can you get my cousin glucose into this party or what and glut four shows up the door and like yeah coming glucose equal now side note skeletal muscles and Adipose Fat Tissue Needs a bunch of glucose and hence needs insulin to text about getting the glucose in but in type one. It's kind of like your phone died but your photos your Beta cells. Insulin can't texted glucose in but in type two. Insulin is like texting and texting but the cell is like. Ah I don't WanNa let more glucose in I'm just over it. Also if you use this flimsy metaphor on any entrance exams and you don't get in. I am truly sorry. I don't know if it's been worked out or not that the four transport actually still integrates the membrane in the absence of insulin. Or more likely what happens is because you're using skeletal muscle while you're exercising and there's a higher demand of glucose because you need to you need the ATP because once the glucose comes into the cell you go through all the glycolysis he break things down ATP which is kind of like the currency of the cell to have energy. There's a need for that energy. Therefore the insulin receptors may just be much more sensitive and therefore whatever circulating insulin however little it is is just going to stimulate the glue force. That's more likely what's going on so I don't know if it's necessarily in the absence of insulin. It might just be in the presence of very little Sloane you're GONNA get a robust response of those receptors so so when you exercise the Glucose Party in your cells thins out so an insulin says hey get my cousin into this party. The cells are really responsive. They're like heck get. This party is dead man will let him in which is why moving our. Booties is great for staying healthy and also just for keeping parties lively. Okay okay so does it kind of retrain your body in terms of how it handles insulin. I took a question I mean. I think retraining would would imply that then in the absence of exercise. You're just going to always be sensitive and I think if you exercise enough then yes you your insulin requirement your exhaustiveness insulin. What we should talk about that exogenous means the stuff? You're injecting in dodge. Means this stuff you make on your own just in case folks don't know so like people that are very fit that marathon runners and extras all the time like their insulin requirements. You're probably a fraction of what you know someone who just sits on the couch. All Day would be as a type one diabetic too. But yeah I think in that sense you can trade in it but I think if you ran a mile today next week. I don't think you're going to need less insulin. The next day you might but not next week. Let's talk about hypoglycemia. Let's do Jordan wants. Wants to know what is the deal with reactive. hypoglycemia and Christian showy says just hyperglycemia menial get diabetes later in life asking for me. I'm also asking for me as someone with reactive hypoglycemia. I've taken that test that five hour insulin test and I was at show so uh started at like seventy rose to maybe ninety one ten and then crashed to forty and I was like shaking crying. Ready Yeah it was not good so in reactive hypoglycemia when you have sugar or carbs you put out too much insulin. And then too much glucose floods into your cells leaving the Glucose Party in your bloodstream. A little sleepy which is why you can feel sleepy or cranky or have blurry vision or have a voracious craving for more carbs. It's not your fault. I'm talking to myself here. So what do you do back so I I think. My understanding for treatment is a lot of frequent small meals that are made up primarily of complex carbohydrates. The you know the the brown rice those things but mixing in vegetables fiber proteins and fats avocado and that kind of love mic showed show. Okay let's talk about how babies can ruin your blood sugar. What about stations diabetes? Let's say you're cooking a baby like Evan Jud Merrin Mosman just chamberlain. Michelle Lee all. Wants to know like Evan Judas. What Causes Justin Diabetes? How is it? Transient will regular diabetes. Is it's not just a diabetes is often kind of CO managed by a lot of the OB gyns as well as into canals super important that when someone has station or just has type one diabetes while they're pregnant to keep their blood sugars in extremely extremely tight control because any kind of unfortunate high or low blood sugar is gonNA Have potential really bad impacts on the child significant If the blood sugars are really out of whack so so the endocrinologist and the begins tend to be very on top of their their diabetic pregnant ladies but The understanding that I have of kind of why this is going on is because the placenta the center is a is a Mojo. It's been just like so much stuff. Hormonal stuff one of which is called placental growth hormone called called LPN and it creates a really hyper glycaemic state in in the mom. And it makes it very difficult for Insulin sensitivity pretty constantly having sugar around the stream because the idea is that my theory or my understanding is that hypo or low blood lead sugar for anyone in the acute setting far more dangerous than a little bit of hyperglycemia so I think the idea that evolutionary you never want the child to be without a source of glucose so. It's really scary. If the MOM were to become hype glycemic so I think that's maybe why they're these hormones mozer being secreted in kind of wreaking havoc. It's not understood exactly why some women are more prone to getting stationed than others if you're diagnosed with diabetes cities that may be transient but you are at a higher significantly higher. Risk of getting type two diabetes later in life. ooh Okay so if you're the person carrying a baby in your body listen to your doctor. Just ational diabetes can become unhealthy for you and your little one and if that that is not incentive enough untreated. It may lead to just a real walker of a huge baby that you have to push out of your groin so no thank you. Also as long as we're talking about children's each week we donate to a cause of the August choosing and for part to this week. Dr Daughter would like donation to go to J.. Eighty R F dot Org formerly known as the Juvenile Diabetes Research Foundation which works with researchers from all over the world to fund more than one hundred grants each year. Sure to reach more new breakthroughs and their mission is very simple to find a cure for type one diabetes. So thank you doctor for pointing us in that direction and allergies Oh Jeez will be making a donation in your name for that and thank you to sponsors of the show that make that donation possible. You may be hearing about them right now. mm-hmm seasonal recipes premeasured ingredients zero trips to the grocery store wandering around and settling on cereal for dinner and then realize that you forgot your topamax. 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So visit linked in dot com slash allergies again that is linked dot com slash allergies to get fifty bucks off your first job post terms and and conditions apply. Okay let's get back to join the fat. What about chewing some fat? A ton of people will not a ton handful people crisper and Michelle Phillips. Wanted to know about the Kito Diet. And if it's good for treating diabetes that's a tough one you can go on any blog and anecdotally. There's going to be people that will swear by that I think right now in terms of the data if I'm GONNA speak kind of from the empirical evidence based side I think the plant based Diet is far. You're better not only for diabetics but I think for everyone. I think any time you do an extreme diet where you kind of cut out one major food group. I do you think that's dangerous. I'm not a big proponent of that I think it's also kind of difficult to sustain doing that and and if you really strict Keto Diet you end up eating or like the the Atkins type diet or the Paleo Diet you end up kind of eating a lot of meat and a lot of saturated fats. And if the data that's come out recently holds true then you could actually be predisposing yourself to type two diabetes so I think a plant based Diet You know if it grows from the ground Greens you want. Salads like all beans and lentils and those things seem to have shown again and again that. They're good for not only your diabetic health but for cardiovascular health and stroke prevention and weight loss and overall healthier. It's also really healthy for the animals. I agree actually speaking of animal diabetes. Sid Derek Allen. Alice mouse and Tara McGee asked is there diabetes in cats and dogs and Taryn. McNeil wants to know how do diabetes service dogs work. What are they smelling? What's happening? Yes dogs and cats get diabetes. I am not a vet so I don't know the details about it. I've heard about a lot of fat cats who get diabetes. I haven't heard of too many dogs scene diabetes and ironically. My sister's poor dog was diagnosed with diabetes research. He's giving him a little influence as the diabetic alert. Dogs are awesome. Have you seen these. I've heard about them. Yeah so I want to get one really bad but I live in New York so my department is the size of a shoebox so probably wouldn't work out I. I'm not entirely sure what they're trained. It's a sent. My best guess is dogs Auxerre. Have these phenomenal factory bulbs. And they're just so amazing at what they can pick up. That is outside the realm of what we can sense. And I think you're breath changes odor when your blood. Sugar is either very high or very low. I know for a fact that when you go into what's called Diabetic Kito acidosis doses. Which means like you're at the other very very high and you're going into a coma state? Your body is breaking down. Because there's no insulin. Your body starts breaking down alternate forms of fuel. which typically as fats and lipids and when those lipids broken down the byproducts are acidic called key tones specifically something called Beta hydroxybutyrate and Acetone and your blood which likes to live in a very neutral ph seven point four with all of these kitone bodies being dumped into the blood it drops down too much less than that to become acidic or acid deemak which is bad? And you don't like that and when your body or your blood is acedemic your enzymes. This is your proteins denatured. Things don't work in New Condi- oh Oh your body tries to compensate by blowing off the acid through your breath so you breed these. What's called coups mom? Breathing breathe very rapidly and shallow and and you're trying to literally exhale AC- to Acetone go to Acetone Nail Polish remover and so it smells like sweet. They call it the sweet breath but it's like fruity sweetness. But it's nail Polish remover. So I would imagine humans smells. I imagine that if you're even just a little bit high maybe you're you're something has changed in your biology where you're breathing something. It may be different whether a little lower little high. Maybe that's what they're smelling. That's my best. Guess I don't really know okay. Two things so your nose has about five million and sent receptors but dogs have up to sixty times that and they use those old factory talents together Info about their environment and their friends and butts now. What are dad's smelling? When they're protecting their owners though? Scientists are totally sure it might be those key tones or they may also be observing. The subtle body cues like sweating or shaking but in a two thousand Sixteen University of Cambridge Study. They found that hypoglycemic hypoglycemic patients exhaled two times. The amount of this compound called Eyeso- Pren- which means that a low sugar breathalyzer could be in the works in the future so we we still need dads while okay. Studies have shown that diabetic alert dogs. Which can cost up to twenty? G's fully trained. Were slower slower and less reliable than a continuous glucose monitor like Dr Nassar has but patients who had diabetic service. Dogs were overwhelmingly Bingley. Happy with the help that they provided even if it means some false positives and being nudged awake when they're glucose was actually fine so CGM's or continuous glucose monitors are cheaper more reliable. They don't require belly rubs but on the downside they are less fuzzy. which sucks what about artificial sweeteners and insulin? Karen Mullins Lynn. Perry and Todd Peterson asked this. Can you explain the dangers of Diet. Soda Todd Peterson said. I heard that aspartame release groups with your insulin levels and Karen mullins wants to know about Stevia and artificial sweeteners. What that duty? Your Insulin Response Response. What's the deal with that well? First of all sodas diet or regular both really terrible for you. There's a lot of like phosphates and carbonation and all of that stuff dies in the synthetics is just bad for you is bad for your bones. it's just bad for everything there's a lot of just not goodness in there Um You deserve a cold refreshing can of not goodness so the most kind of interesting way that people have been hypothesizing Autho sizing that it can cause harm. Is that most people drink diet sodas. Because they're trying to be fit and they don't want the calories so one theory. Is that when your Tung taste the sweetness it then kind of predisposes your brain to expect the caloric impact of that and so when you end up just just like pooping all that out and not actually getting a caloric impact your brains like wait. Hey I need more. I didn't get the calories so give me more. Give me more. Give me more than you end up becoming kind of addicted or looking for more sweetness so you either continue to drink the gallons of diet coke or you go searching for that donut that you told yourself you wouldn't have because you you are now craving it. I think there's something interesting about that. I don't know how that's panned out in the literature. Not so that's one theory in terms of what it does to Your Insulin and glucose it was my understanding that it actually shouldn't have too much of an impact at all If you know in terms of diabetics like technically we shouldn't raise your budget or things that raise your blood sugar or typically carbohydrates or pure sugars so those tech. Technically don't have any shouldn't necessarily affect your blood sugars okay this. This one is tricky Fox because few studies have been done. And it's hard to separate the metabolic factors that cause folks to drink diet soda like a predisposition position to weight gain with the effects of the Diet Soda and there was one twenty Seventeen Oklahoma State Medical Association paper that cited a Meta analysis of of a bunch of other studies and other than causing low blood sugar from the big bamboozle of zero carb sweetness. Nobody knows what the heck artificial sweeteners due to blood sugar. Now what if you don't have blood sugar ish but somebody around you does Langley Bradley. Madeline Dunkel Hannah. uh-huh childers wanted to know. What can you do if someone's in diabetic shock if someone's hypoglycemic or hypoglycemic what if there's a bystander loved one how can you support them? What can you do emergency? That's a really good question. I love like diabetes awareness and obviously just saving lives. It's always a good thing. So there's two real diabetic emergencies emergencies and this is where it can get kind of tricky and you have to kind of tease out. which ones which so first and foremost do call nine one? One that is always always is always first thing. You do call nine one one. My friends diabetic. He's unresponsive and you get the ambulance. That's always the first thing the next thing you can do. Is You have to if you know that. Their blood sugar is low is going to be very low or it's GonNa be very high so if you know which one that is basically if you happen to be with that person and they tell you I don't feel good I think I'm low and then they're not responsive than than we can say. Okay there are low and what you would do in that case as you never ever ever want to like a poor juice down their mouth or any of that until there's really two things most diabetics have something with them. Called the glucose gone kit and what Google gone is it kind of goes back to what we talked about in the papers. So the pancreas is this magical. Oregon wears two hats whereas the endocrine hat and the exit hat. Those excellent excellent cells. Don't make insulin but they make acids and enzymes that break down your salad or Luther Burger. Then there's little islands upsells make Hormones and so there's Alpha cells Beta cells the cells cancels. The I think that's right. The Alpha cells are making Glue Gun Glucose gone is a hormone that is kind of like the opposite the yen to the Yang of insulin. So if you're not eating if you're fasting and you you are in fighter flight or you're starving your glucose gone it's going to be very active in what's doing is it's telling the stores of sugar in your body to say. Hey let's release these. He's and spit some glucose into the bloodstream. Because we need it now and that usually happens in the liver. So if you're going to give executives glucose gone you're trying to Kinda utilize and mobilized that sugar. That's already in the body so you can drop the syringe. Buca gone and give it to that person kind of difficult because you're giving them a pretty big. I am or intramuscular muscular injection and some people not a big fan of the needles. I get it and it might be tricky. They might not have the kid on them. The next best thing and probably even better. If you're a bystander is this cake frosting okay if you can take some cake frosting and you put it on your finger and then you put it on the coastal side inside the cheek and you just rub into their cheek so that your mucosal layer actually is very You can you can really absorb a lot of sugar that way and that might just be enough to kind of keep them alive until the paramedics come and that could save someone's life now any two prefaces. This is only if you're pretty sure that this person is lower hypoglycemic globe if by chance. They've passed out because they have decay or because they have super high blood sugar. And you're certain of that then again. You should not ever really administer insulin to someone in that case you should just get them to the emergency room as fast as possible and now let's talk about how your bionic you have a pump you. You have a meter. You're essentially you have an external pancreas and Jesse's Robertson Merrill Star Tall Elise rubber born. All had questions about monitors is an pumps. What are your thoughts on it? Yes so so. I was diagnosed in nineteen eighty four and nineteen ninety four. The technology for diabetes at the time was like Super Super Eighties like very archaic. I had this what looks like a brick of glue commoner. So when you're diabetic you have to do a few things you have to take your insulin and you have to prick your finger and test your blood sugar on these little meters and at the time. When I was diagnosed the meter was not little all this kind of like the size? Of the Gameboy. Like an old school gameboy and it took like a decent amount of blood from your finger and took a full sixty seconds to count down until you where you were and things pretty big in addition into that you had vials of insulin and you needed to have insulin syringes and you needed to keep the insulin cold. So if you're going somewhere you got a little cooler and you roll with the Cooler and the insulin and syringes and it was a whole mess. Things have come a long way since then and so from there. They have these insulin pens. That are these little disposable pens pens with these little tiny needle caps that you screw on. It's great and it's very convenient and the glue commenters have become really teeny tiny takes five seconds to countdown. It takes a very small all sample but and then things got really cool so then insult and sometimes have always been around. The technology has gotten better and better and better. And so now these insulin pumps uh-huh they kind of look like a little bit of a pager typically. Why have a pager and it makes sense because I actually have a pager for work but now so insulin pumps Only take one kind of insulin is a rapid acting insulin as opposed to what are known as Basal Insulin. which kind of these long acting insulin? With no peak. This is a rapid acting insulin so once it gets into your system works pretty quickly and it peaks and kind of comes out of your system and you load up a reservoir of insulin into into the pump and you basically program what are known as Basil rates into the pump. So you say okay from this hour to this hour. I want you to give me this fracture. Traction the unit and you can get very granular and fine tuning and once has programmed. You're done that will basically pump it into for the twenty four hours as your background insulin. You don't have to think about it and there's a little what's called Kanye that you that you kind of push in under the skin with a needle. The needle comes out and into sub cure subcutaneous just beneath the skin infusion then so you have a little too in some some are two bliss but mine has a little tube and you have a little plastic two candidates kind of sits just under the skin. It doesn't hurt while it's in to put it in a you know a little pinch and that's it. It's really not that bad and it'll give me that kind and of Basal Insulin throughout the day when I go to eat something I have to say to myself. How many carbohydrates am I about to eat? What is my blood sugar right now? Now and how much. Insulin should Bolles or give large amount at once in order to cover the amount of carbohydrates my body's about to see so it's kind of a little guests in check but the technology analogy is gone even better because when you're testing your blood sugar. It's data point in time. It's a fixed data point in time so you could test your blood sugar right now and it could be a hundred but is it a hundred and hanging out and chilling. There are one hundred dropping is one hundred and rising. You know you're in the dark so now we have something called a continuous us. Glucose Monitor C. G. M. and that C. G. M.. Usually I wear my arm. A lot of people like to wear on their arm and it is a small strip of platinum that that said the need the skin and it sits in the interstitial space. which is the space between cells? And what it's doing is it's detecting flux of Glucose so so as the glucose is going across it picks it up and see you're actually picking up a derivative or the rate of change. which is exactly what you aren't getting when you prick your finger so so now you have all of this data so now you know I'm one hundred and there's arrows pointing down I'm dropping or there's arrows pointing up I'm rising? They've taken that data. And and they used like a radio shortwave radio waves and so now at talks to my pump and that's called a closed loop and this is kind of brand new technology now. So what this is doing is this is taking a cognitive load off of me. The patient ended saying Oh your blood. Sugar is rising but it's not quite high technically but it's about to to be. I'm going to give Mike a little bit more insular. I'M GONNA I'M GONNA increase his basil rate on its own so overall when you look at it from like the thousand foot view. You're saying I'm going going to spend more time in range. My blood sugar's going to be less high. Unless low because of this system and what that does overall as it drops many when see into better range WJR and without doesn't turn is. It makes me essentially live a longer healthier life with less likelihood of complications. So let's say you have some activities activities that you'd like to not be wearing a small dangling machine off your body let's just say hot TUB ING or nude racket ball. Dr Nassar says you could feasibly remove it for an hour or so without any dire consequences and you don't have to take them off for airport screening I just checked the TSA website site and found a guideline that attached medical devices in sensitive areas are subject to careful in gentle inspection which sounds awkwardly romantic but a lot of people had this question. Emma Hawker Schneider. Christopher Roadshow Hannah childers Andrea Marsh. Lacy Gilbert Gilbert Monster Cat and Faisal's WanNa know what Andrew Marsh ask. Why can't the US get it together and make insulin affordable? Why why is it so expensive monster cat says? I recently heard a local news story. About how young man died trying to ration his insulin and Faisal said. I've heard that due to the price of insulin. There are loopholes that people can use. And you can get animal insulin for a lot cheaper than the human insulin and use it for yourself. which probably doctors? I don't recommend but what is happening with insulin. Why is it so expensive? It's really a problem. It's really sad and it's actually ironic that we're talking today. Because because today is national weather rather World Diabetes Day. Oh my God by Total happenstance. We recorded this on November fourteenth. which is the birthday of Canadian scientists? Doctor Frederick Banting and its World Diabetes Day because today is when Dr Banting he. He discovered the therapeutic use for instant he was able to kind of distill it from. I believe the dog's pancreas and use it in a young diabetic boy and save his life and he sold the patent to the University of Toronto. Do you know how much he sold the patent for match a single dollar and he. I'd insulin does not belong to me. It belongs to the people that need it diabetics and it should always be that way and so now we've somehow come into this very unfortunate in corrupted place of capitalism where they're in America are only three major pharmaceutical companies that manufacture insulin and they have very proprietary patents in uses on their specific insulin's and through a series of kind of really messed up capitalistic ballistic greedy type situations. Insulin has risen more than four hundred percent inflation over the last decade. Maybe less not too long ago Winston was about maybe thirty five dollars vile something out of pocket cash and it is now closer to three hundred hundred dollars a viable so how many vials does he does. Diabetic person need per month. What's a monthly cost? That people are looking at. Yeah so I mean it depends on their insulin requirements. I'd say on average about one or two a month. Yeah so six hundred dollars a month a month and now you have to understand. Is You know we currently currently are living in a country where I mean. Most young people with type one diabetes or otherwise healthy so these people may not have insurance they may have good insurance and they may that have a job that offers them insurance or a job that pays them enough where they can afford six hundred dollars a month and what we're seeing now is insulin rationing. Were people are taking less insulin. They're supposed to be taking too so that they have at least a little bit on board throughout the month and we've seen people die. We've we've seen significant rises in preventable type one deaths because of this problem and it's horrible so the pork pork insulin. So before the human instance came out I actually used porgy Because that was actually the standard it was to use either pork insulin. or or some other type of animal animal-based insulin and since those are you know no longer in use people are still trying to get those and they're cheaper but as of today in the New York Times the. Who the World Hellenization. Just put out a statement saying they are going to basically somehow allow a generic push to to allow Someone some company to make a cheaper insulin to therefore undercut these these three big Pharma companies in tryon drive the price down by using competition and it needs to happen now or yesterday because There has been a horrible horrible response. I was actually really fortunate. I was able to dip out of the hospital for an hour today in go run downtown to Wall Street or a rally to talk about what it's like. Eighty be patient But also to to be a physician and see family members needing to decide if they're going to feed their family for the month or take the amount of insulin they need and it's sickening is really sickening. What can do the general public do? Who can we yell at? So I think lawmakers I think it needs to come from from a government Kind of intervention at this point. Is I think the the best way to go about it We need to kind of rain in this this This inflation Russian. That's just continues to go up and up and up and up and up and you know when you think about it. It's IT's insulin type. One diabetics did nothing. They didn't smoke cigarettes and get cancer. They didn't Nothing is not anything they did to themselves and very often these. These are children that are diagnosed that just happen to be inflicted for reasons that are outside their own Doing and they are now dependent not on a medication but literally on a hormone that that they would otherwise be making themselves that they don't and so you are restricting. Someone from what. I wouldn't even call medication. I would call replacing the hormone hormone that their body stopped making that we have in know how to make cheaply for over a or about a hundred years and you're making it inaccessible missile and letting people die from that because of money money what about people who are trying to access medications. That would be used for pets. Let's on themselves. I mean I've heard people who've taken literally like fish antibiotics because they don't have insurance to get you know medication for strep throat or are people doing that. I don't know personally if the I mean. I wouldn't be surprised if people do. I mean I would as a physician certainly not recommend doing that Right now the best option is Walmart has probably the cheapest insulin you can get which is very reasonably priced. It's not the top of the line stuff. It's still Initially I think he I believe you'd have to use syringes for it. I believe it's not the most rapid acting or the the Best Basil Insulin's out there but if if nothing else that's probably what you should be going for because it's better than getting black market stuff. Yeah in terms of type two. Do if you're not insulin-dependent yet or if you're type two and maybe you can take some measures. That aren't exogenous. Insulin like Cat Cat Tyler Q.. Colin Croft Lynn. Perry Roxanne Parker Shay Murphy Jessica Davis asked. What can you do to try to reverse type to get? Yeah I mean it's kind of what we spoke about. Basically the idea is diet exercise losing weight. That's key in more extreme cases these these weight loss surgeries do see really dramatic dramatic results. I actually anecdotally. I have a patient who who's like the most amazing human being I saw. I saw him I when I was an intern so Two and a half years ago. This gentleman was wildly overweight. You know he wasn't taking care of himself. He wasn't taking his insulin and one day last year he came to see me and he just looked terrible and I had to admit him to the hospital. I said you really sick. I need to admit to the hospital. And then when it came out of hospital talked to him and I said your kidneys are failing. I I need to put you on dialysis and we had a real kind of come to Jesus moment and I said you know this because the diabetes like we need to figure this out and more recently. I saw him and I saw him on my on my list on the on the computer and I went to go to the waiting room to to grab him and I called his name. I don't see him anywhere. And this guy's walking up to me and I was like. Oh no no sir. You're next on this. He had lost two hundred thirty pounds and he was totally different man and he you saw the life in his eyes and he no longer had diabetes his his age when from sixteen percent which is extremely high to less than six percent which is normal. And that's because he gave up all the things he was eating that he knew were not for him. He exercised and he had a new lease on life granted. He had to be on dialysis which is not easy. But that's the wakeup call. He needed so weight. Loss is huge insignificant amount we lost condemning help. And it's not easy to to do it and this guy is really another level but any kind of weight loss is going to help and exercise is also very helpful. Do you have any strategies suggest that you give to your patients if they have tried weight loss. Try to exercise and they'd they've tried eating differently. It's just really hard. Are there any places to start. It's tough everyone individualistic. I mean there are some medications that have been proven to be somewhat helpful in weight loss. I don't like accusing medications. Ideally for anything you know you can consider what you eat a medication you know like. That's really the first place to start but but you have to kind of find out what about someone's life so what is it that they can't give up you know there's a guy or he needs to have his morning donut no matter what you you can't give that up. He's pre contemplated meaning. He's not even ready to think about giving that up. You say okay so you eat that donut but then where can we turn the Fed elsewhere. Can you not have have the fries with your meal. And can you get rid of you know this Bun and traded out for brown rice and you look for substitution. You look for small things and then you make these small steps upset. Hopefully add up but you WANNA make these small steps because those are the ones that they can continue to do. Can you get off the subway. Stop early and walk. Can you take the stairs instead of the elevator. Can you park your car little farther away from where you need to go so you can walk these things in in folks that are otherwise sedentary and overweight you actually see really really big production from that gold shed pounds and if they give the sweetened drinks and the sodas and in things you'll see a huge difference so those are the first places to start and I think you break a cycle because there's an addictive quality to some of these beverages and sweetened drinks and foods and I've seen it myself. I used to drink a lot of Diet soda when I've read about. How horrible was I? I stopped drinking it and I didn't bring it for years and then I had to drink or a nap does thirsty. And that's all the time so I had some and it tasted terrible terrible. It's just didn't taste good and I realize that like I had an addiction to it and when I stopped drinking it I realized how awful Oh actually I felt when I drink it. It's the same thing with breaking up with people and then you look at them later. And you're like wow what was I thinking. Why did we break up love? I know you're softy. A ton of people wanted to know about importing pancreas essentially Diana us us Bob Carlton and rubber born wants to know and Mandolin. Dunkel will we ever get to a point where we can do. Pancreas transplants. Well so that so we do them now. Yeah but we don't typically do them for diabetes. Because you have to understand when we do these pinkos transplants and and really with any transplant as plant. There's so much anti rejection medication that you need to take which themselves like horrible. So you're in a lot of these steroids you're in a lot of these. Like tacrolimus Lima and all these things that are suppressing your immune system. So you're kind of trading one malady for another oftentimes but we're getting closer. A lot of folks that have pancreatic cancer often times. They're they're starting. A lot of stuff is going on at Hopkins actually. It's actually really amazing thing that they do what they do is when they do something called a whipple bowl procedure. Where they're basically cutting out the pancreas because there's cancer there? But the parts of the pancreas cut up that aren't cancerous. They digest out the Beta cells. Yes and the and the hormone producing cells and the re-inject them through the portal vein in the hope that they'll kind of like take on edge edge in the liver just like kind of hang out in the liver and do their thing. Well what they're doing is they're because otherwise it would have made these people diabetic and they're basically making human cancer free and not diabetic all in one fell swoop which is really impressive. A ton of people had questions about the future Steph Merrill Stark Donald Meghan King Daniel Tipton. Helen Pang David M Williams WanNa know what technology crisper is on the horizon for treatment of type one into into diabetes. Like is there going to cure. What about vaccine as cure trials like what's coming up? There's a lot of real exciting research I. I don't think that there's a silver bullet because I still don't think that we truly understand the multifactorial ideology. But I think we're getting close. We're getting close so right now I would say we have as close to a mechanical cure as you can get with a closed loop system. We're getting closer and closer to fine tuning those. There's something called. The the BIANNIC pancreas project. Where if you think about insulin as the gas pedal an insulin pump only has insulin but pancreas has insulin Guca gone? And there's data to suggest that we as tight diabetics over time. Don't have the same glucose response. So they're making this dual chamber pump. That has both insulin Anglo Gun. That has the gas pedal and brake pedal which is gone and asking to be a lot more physiologic. And I think that's GONNA be coming in the in your future. It's coming out of Boston to the folks working on the islet for Beta -biotics. We see you. We love you. Also Dr Netter asked me to add that that clinical care of diabetes is a team sport. It includes clinical diabetes. Educators nurses Dietitians nutritionists therapists. Let's see what else is on the horizon. There's going to be an implantable. CGM that's coming out soon which is going to be because right now I have to change out the GM every five days at the pump every three or four days there's going to be an implantable. CGM that will last four six months to a year and that is kind of similar to like the next on which is a birth control rod of prejudgment they inject they put in the arm for a period of time very similar procedure That's exciting There's there's always a lot of stem cell research so stem cells or what are known as kind of pluripotent cells. meaning that could become any cell in the body. So if I took a little swath of allie ellie ward stem cells and I put them in a petri dish and I put growth factors around them and kind of coerced them and whispered to them at night and to sound he made us health. And I grew your own Beta cells. Then here we go. We have functional Beta cells. which we've been able to do in the lab? Then the problem becomes if you're type one. Diabetes is because of an auto auto immune disease. Then how do I put back your Beta cells. I just grew in this petri dish. 'em Make sure they don't get attacked by your immune system again so there's a lot of data or research looking into that that there is some research trying to hermetically. Seal them in these like capsules. What I describe as like a Trojan horse? So they're invisible the invisible cloak to the immune system. So there's a lot of really interesting stuff on Crisper is interesting. The problem is we don't have one specific gene or kind of chunk of DNA or protein. That's really kind of breath. effing things up it's multifactorial in some cases it might be mostly environmental so we. We can't really necessarily use crisper per se But I I think we're. I'm optimistic that in my lifetime. I will be put out of business. Because it'll be a cure for diabetes. And then what are you GonNa do outdraw books that there's going to be something on a beach you'll dropbox. On a beach. I often fantasize into size in residency for quit what I do and I think about. Maybe being a mailman in Hawaii you get these little cool shorts with those stripes on this. I'll take it helmet. So what does Dr Taner like the least about being a diabetic diet pathologist. Okay there's a lot plot so let's I'm not going to be real with you diabetes sucks. It really sucks. I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy and what about being a doctor. I don't like how much of it is a business. I don't like treating patients like customers. I don't like rushing them out of my office or in the in the emergency room in the hospital. I don't like discharging them because we have to turn over beds for money. I don't like them. I don't like that most of my day unfortunately is like maybe ten percent of it is done doing real medicine and the rest of it is done doing what feels like bureaucratic nonsense. And I know. I'm a resident but I think a lot of that still the case as an intending and that bothers me a lot so that sucks about medicine as a whole obviously the finances and the business of it. The insurance sucks and the access to insulin and other medications that my patients need and are struggling to get really sucks. Diabetes Sucks so so diabetes sucks because this is a twenty four seven constantly on your mind constantly needing attention thing and at any moment you are worried about. Oh I am going on this date with this girl. Oh my sugars low and when your sugars low you act really Wonky Wonky and you stumble a new study your words and you feel the cold sweats. Well that's not very sexy or you know your blood sugar's high hi and it stays high in no matter what you're doing in doing everything right. It's high and you don't understand it and you know that if it stays high you might get complications and you worry about having in kids and passing it on and you worry about going blind and losing limbs and losing fingers and losing your kidneys. I mean it's a lot to deal with. So so that sucks understood. It's like your pancreas is out to lunch in its place. You have a screaming baby. That needs your attention at all times. uh-huh exactly what it is we were we took out your pancreas. We replaced it with a screaming. Infant are thank. You go about your life. So what is your favorite thing about being a physician or about talking to patients who have diabetes. So this is the flip side. This is why I still do it. And this is why I went into his because I like people and I think when you wake up in the morning to go to work and know that you have the potential all to help someone at the very least at the very best you can save. Someone's life and that's powerful stuff and it makes these long days in than these twenty four hour shifts these all this stuff and all the decades of schooling. It makes you feel like okay. Maybe this is worth it. I like connecting with people and I like connecting with people on a deep. I love I like being able to help people. How do you not cry on job? I cry so often. uh-huh I cry so I mean I am an emotional sensitive man maybe more so than most and as I think we were chatting before you for my. I'm currently on Collie rotation so it's cancer. It is heavy it is really heavy. And it's is this weird dichotomy of you have this weird privilege in this weird honor to be literally nearly at the bedside with someone who's dying in talking to their family and walking them through it and you use met them an hour ago and here you are it kind of guiding him through the most human process that anyone and everyone goes through. So it's really something Special Shaw which I love but then take it home with me which is not healthy and so then you cry so I definitely he cried more this rotation than I think any other but M- usually you learn as an intern. You could become very efficient crying because what you do is used to come home cried and shower then have a drink now. I cry in the shower while having a drink and kind of get it all done at once you learn efficiency. Is there a place in the hospital that you cry like. There's like closet alley intern year. I scoped out all of the cry spots don't you. There is in in one of the hospitals. I work there. Is these great single bathrooms where you can do like the ugly crying because like you have all the time and the space to do it and then when you try and clean yourself up you have avenue all the utensils you need to say any guy. But then there's like the emergency cries where you're like. Oh I didn't think this was going to happen. And it's just coming out like waterworks rex. Then you usually have to go to the top of the stairwell because if you go to the very top the new the likelihood that people coming down from there are slim so you can like but that Echo. Oh so you can't ugly Cry Their Little Most Times I cry. It's not out of pain. It's it's more emotional like it's not really my own either. It's more like seeing other other people. I guess I like Happy cried in the sense of like. If I'm watching something sweet you know. I'll all get like the single Obama's here you know it's very manly one tier stone-faced but more recently I've had the like crumpled crumpled up like you know like heaving heaving cry it's been it's been been there I'm I'm going to cross my fingers for cheaper generic alternatives. And when that happens we will face time and we'll have to cry about it together. AH PLAN BUT DR NAT wanted to leave us on a high note so without diabetes. I don't think I would have gone into medicine so I think there's there's a silver lining in that respect. I think it helped me find my calling so If I could be appreciative diabetes for anything I think is that has it brought you closer to other people who have it. Obviously yes and I think as I kind of alluded to before when when my patients are struggling with any chronic illness but a specially diabetes. I love when they catch a glimpse of my pump and then we have that moment of like. Oh wait a minute like I had A. I had a patient recently. Who was admitted service for an infection? But she happened have type one diabetes and the being in the hospital as she was young. And you know being the hospital is scary and she was minute overnight overnight and happened to have been there Ungodly hours and you know E. She said she you know. She immediately felt comforted knowing because she wore the pomp. And the see Jim that I got it because not everyone in medicine understands how these things work as a diabetic. You're very kind of protective and know your diabetic care better than anyone else. So for you get admitted hospitals and someone who you just met who doesn't really understand diabetes that well saying we're taking off and I'm GonNa give you insulin. How I decide is And joining so we it was. It was really nice to be able to share that with Erin Makerfield. Comfortable Bake redheads. Have the same non. Ah I see you all time. So essentially I've lived your life and I get it. Thank you so much for doing this. So once again asked Nice sweet doctors stupid questions. Because we're all GonNa die eventually but you can delay that by asking questions so to follow Dr Natter. He's at Mike Dot Natter on Instagram or Mike Underscore on twitter are. We are at odds on both alley award with one L. on both links to J. D. R. F. Dot Org and the sponsors are in the show notes and they're also up up at alleyway dot com slash gs slash Dia Batali Allergies merch is at allergies merged dot com or at allie dot com. Thank you to Shannon filters and Bunny Dutch to wonderfully Sassy sisters who run that in host the comedy podcast. You add that to check that out and happy slightly. Belated birthday to Air Talbert. Who runs the allergies facebook group which is a job in and of itself? Thanks so much. Hannah Lippo for all of your volunteer efforts of less several years and to Emily Lee White. Who organizes all the transcriptions? Thank you patrons for allowing me to pay them for that hard work There are links to bleeped episodes including part one of this episode in the this show notes. Jarrett sleeper of mental health. podcast make good. Bad Brain. Did assistant editing. Thanks of course to the man. And the Mustache Steve. Ray Morris who host the kitty themed named per cast and the Dino pod seizure great for putting all the parts of this episode together on Nick Thorburn wrote and performed the theme music. He's in a band called islands islands. Very good band and if you stick around to the end of the episode you know I tell you a secret and this week as long as we're talking hormones I've to take a bunch of hormones because my ovaries are just just like bye-bye were out of here and one of them I take is like a progesterone an it bums me out so much. I'm supposed to take it regularly leap but I just get so your on it and I'm only telling you this because a the first few times I took it I had no idea what was going on and I thought I was losing my marbles pulls fully. It didn't know that can happen to some people when they take it and also because as long as we're talking about the wonders of the American healthcare system. I told my latest doctor about it and she said well I have to put you on it again and feel like you want a crevasse of the earth to open up and swallow you and then your insurance will approve something that doesn't audio anyway. So professor dudes and ladies and everyone. Who's neither thank you for ducking into my secret hut and listening to these things? Okay okay please take care of yourselves. Promise yes okay. All right my pocket. Dermatology those who algae officials meteorology loved him diabetes.

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"Get thirty to fifty percent off. Cuddle betting and they've shark vacuums just to seventy nine ninety night class. Give a little more for your wallet with kohl's cash plus best and free store pickup. Give with all your heart shock. Coles dot com select styles. Fifty percent offer valid november eleventh twenty. I would primarily cheers. Some exclusions apply see store or kohls dot com for details. The usa radio network presents the greatest radio programs of all time. Ladies and gentlemen this about to hear is true. Only the names have been changed to protect the innocent dragnet. This is classic radio theater guy. I was a communist life so everybody. Now here's your host. Why it sunday afternoon drama. The third the second episode. I should say. Dr christian starring renowned actor. Jean hersholt best remembered these days for his humanitarian award. Still graces the academy awards to this date. This episode originally broadcast november fourteenth nineteen thirty seven. It's entitled steve and charlotte hornets presents chapter. Two of a new air. Show the star the show gene hurtful in his greatest of all the title of the show christian showed jesus manufacturing company owners trademark vassili or years. Jean hersholt was one of the outstanding character. Actors picture then came the day that he was assigned to the part of the country doctor in the twentieth century fox production of that name and jean hersholt became one of the foremost stars of hollywood. It gives us great pleasure to be able to bring to you the extraordinary gifts of this great artist in the kind of role that made him famous and that he made him as paul christian. The doctor of rivers and jean hersholt has in store for you. Many hours of absorbing heart warming drama do spot popular sunday afternoons this winter. We take you now without further delay to the doctor's office. Where the irrepressible judy prices. Secretary is typing a dr christian is just returning from his morning. Call any phone calls. Mrs ross said you got the medicine okay. That's fine and shaw dixie. Coming over to see you. Oh did you read what it said about on the enterprise moaning no and listen to this. Local poets wins acclaim. Mrs dave dixon versus appeared from time to time in the enterprise has received national recognition with her poem the nella which appears in the current issue of the new arts magazine. Nice chording to the editor of the new arts magazine. Mrs dixon strikes. A new and unique note in american poetry as part of the poem printed. Here to listen to this and tell me if it gives you a lift the bay with tear dimmed eyes watches the mocking see. No sale appears bringing her loved run back and grey expanse as emptied her a missed field win as bitter as her tears. That's pretty good. Hail dr paul. Hello do you know or hello. Y'all come in just reading your pool. Pretty nice breaking into print this way. Did you like it well. I thought it was wonderful but Don't you think you should have made it. Rhyme all but iraq freeness or. Don't do this if it's good enough to be pointed it's good enough to be paid for. No you see free verse. Doctor is a new form of poetry and modern poetry is an expression of emotion. something which reflects the poet's mind. Oh you mean. It's blank verse. Well then i guess. I don't know much about modern poetry. No one does. It's a transitional state emerging from obsolete decadent forms as a butterfly bursts from its christmas. Yes yeah. I see what i came in for. May i talk to you for a moment in private vice yours. Y'all come on in here or judy. You finish those ladies. Will you leave my matters down john. L. there's nothing wrong. I'm not ill or anything like that. It's not that you are the only man i know well enough to turn to. I want you advice duct christian. I've decided to get a divorce from steve. Well aren't you a little surprised. Or i don't know i wouldn't blame. A woman. divorcing men beater dr christian. You know very well. Steve has never even spoken across word. Me oh not when he's show but when my knees drinking in who he doesn't drink oh i begin to see but it isn't no of course not steve wouldn't look at another woman sometimes. I wish he would really but isn't wine and it isn't women. What does he do singing. Abacha dot christian. I'm serious. I'm only trying to find out what's the matter with steve. There's nothing the matter. Exactly steve's all right please dull so commonplace so an interesting move was needed way when you married him. I don't know. I suppose it was which is the same you love him. I don't think i did. I don't think i ever loved him as paul. This town living here is like living in chains. It's stifling wait. I'll open the window. No no it's my soul. Let's being stifled. Oh your soul. I know i'm different from those people dot christian. But i can't help it. I'm like a bird in a cage here. I want to be free. Free to under the moon undo covid grass to feel the wind. Rustling my hair rain on my cheek. Alright but i'm warning you you'll catch cold. Please don't dr paul. I need help but charlotte you're talking what d- at bras for you steve. Whatever put an idea like that into your head. Because i want to go to the city. I want to write to have a career. I still don't see you have to divorced even order to have a career. Go ahead have you career. And then but that's just the point. I can't have it here. And artist doesn't create simply out of himself stealth. He has to stimulus of other minds contact with people and surroundings which inspired him. Isn't that true where well maybe it is but installation. Can steve give me. What installation can i find in a place like rivers. No i've got to get away writing poetry for a living pretty hard yup charlotte. I know. I expect to have to suffer for my art. Every artists must suffer. I'd rather live in an attic and starve and go on like this or this is all a big shock to me charlotte. I can't believe can't believe that you treat this way. All you do is. Talk of steve steve. But what about me. What about my happiness. I'm entitled to happen. Not suppose all of us on title to all to happen is we can get. Have you talked to steve about by leaving him. only he doesn't understand. Because i have a roof over my head comfort safety. He thinks i should be delighted. You'd be surprised how many women would be. But i'm different. You know i am stephen. I don't talk the same language. I want you to explain to him to tell you no no no. I can't do that but you've got to listen to you. You're the only only you can't drag me into this job all dr christian plea final. Is it asking so much just to talk to him. Charlotte i can't excite you against the you it isn't a matter of taking sides uneven needing steve anyway but if you could only be made to realize why eating it isn't because of some little me heading reason for something glorious. He feel better about. Don't you see that the christian. You'd be helping him not me you positively determine i'm going away charlotte and you're sure you don't love the i'm certain of it. All right. have a talk with him and my opposite six o'clock till then you better think it. All life is a long dark road to walk alone for near. The road is not entirely the endless shadowy eastern hills. The dawn is breaking. Just coming steve. Hello steve down won't you. I guess you know why. I asked to drop in. Charlotte is told you that he wants to get on duck. That's silly. I don't get what it's all about done something. You haven't no need of has done anything except people human beings with emotions and feelings. That don't always behave the way you'd like them to behave but if she started me there must be now. Charlotte is it. Because i play pool on wednesday evenings. If it is i'll give it up. I don't think that you don't be upset. Well then it's simply not spiritually. We're not on the same intellectual kind of a dumbbell but but if you want me to. I'll study up. Get some good books. Oh you haven't the slightest idea what i'm talking about. It's this voice to you. You and i are just ordinary people. All of these different. She has talent wants to career. These that it's the only way you can find happiness. You wanted to be happy don't you. Of course i do doc but it seems to me that she likes to go to the city and he likes to live in an ethic but she doesn't have to go to the city. We've got an attic right in our house. I'll fix it up far. I'll put in some wall board and a radiator. It is an executive that kind of an attic. Geology an artist. She has to suffer for her. She can suffer at home and be a lot more comfortable. Oh what's the use of continuing this steve. I've tried every way. I know how to tell you this without seeing it in so many words. I didn't want to hurt you. But i'm afraid i'll have to. I just don't have any feeling left at all on hunting. Don't touch me please. But charlotte won't you tell me what the trouble is. I just told you. I don't love you. Why why there must be a reason. That doesn't go by reason. You can't argue with your heart. I don't that's all. I get it out one of those things that can be held. Steve jobs want you to give her freedom. I don't think you'll standing away will you now. I won't stand in the way. I think it'd be a good idea was charlotte to see a lawyer not here but but in the city where it can be handled quietly. I'll go tomorrow off and steve you to christian. What is there's been an accident. An accident grill ran off the road in your car. Roy davis names plumber bringing her in my office. Just lean on me. Arthritis don't don't seem to be much damage. Dan but i'm really take it easy. I i can lock all right. That's it come idol on. Do you stay here. Believe and the rest of you wait out. How did it happen. I don't know amos era. I was going along the river. Hold on a motorcycle car off the road up against the stone. Well i took a look in there. She was slumped down seat thing did she must have fainted at the wheel in the stump. Stop the car yeah. Well i picked her up and starbucks off on the way real life. I wonder who she is got. Her name offered driver's license is barbara. She's gonna with money and breeding. Judging from a close look to didn't mind. Gary nunn arms. Did you leave her car there. It'll be all right here through the city. Here's my cursor. Wouldn't find anything in this town to stop from except dump maybe just shaking up. That's all mighty lawgivers worse. I guess. I am doctor and his fainting spell. You say you never had one before no never gonna steinway was in. Oh i plan to stay with every week. it's such a beautiful town good Then i would suggest that you drop to and tried to drive your car anymore evening. We'll take it away going. Say i'm sorry. But i've just gotten a motorcycle. I left my jalopy home in the garage. What about you steve. You're right outside isn't it. Couldn't you see the young lady to a french doc. I'll take her. Well thank you all of you. I'm sorry i've caused trouble spell doc. Good night and thank you again. Good night and try to keep out as mashups will come back for you. Charlotte in needn't i know the way home. Oh charlotte hey steve. You're coming yeah coming. It's also now you'll soon be free. Abby wonderfully happy now at last. I can begin to live. I hope you didn't mind me. Asking steve to drive his powell shooting night. I'm sorry for her. That's all he. A death never fourteenth 1937 dr christian on classic radio theatre america is under attack. And we need you to take action nell our history. Culture constitution and the american way of life are being assaulted. Violent anarchist are rioting and looting in cities across the country. They are demanding the defunding of our police and an end to law and order. There has never been more critical time to defend our right to keep and bear arms. The second amendment foundation created the second amendment first responders program. This program seeks to actively engage americans who want to protect our second amendment rights. Please text protect two eight. Two four seven four seven four seven and become a second amendment first responder now is the time to defend our right to keep and bear arms. Text protect two eight two four seven four seven four seven again text protect two eight two four seven four seven four seven now is the time to defend our right to keep and bear arms text. Protect two eight two four seven four seven four seven for over three years. 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Call one eight hundred two four six eight seven fifty one or go to balanceofnature dot com and use discount code. Usa you're listening to classic radio theater on your favorite station. Now more of dr christian starring. Jean hersholt from november fourteenth nineteen thirty seven and so returned to our story of dr christian livers end which stars jean hersholt in the title role about a week later. Seen the river's annual. Picnic where barbara powell is quite a center of attraction. We find her dancing with steve. I suppose pretty timothy human power. I don't know after you've lived in paris new york and really seeing things the rivers and merchants picnic kind of stuff. I don't think there's anything silly and people enjoying themselves but it's imperative river then certainly different from what i'm being. What did you think. I'd be sorta figured you'd be just natural. Thank gosh no lieutenant. Name the one. They've just put up over the orchestra's damn oh stay that means. I'm lucky. lucky the penance assign at this is a prize dance. And i'm lucky i've got nothing they want me to dance with. You could win a prize. Well for that. How dance very badly on honest. I didn't the fact is i didn't know it was going to be a president when i asked you the fact that you didn't even ask me. You can practically bodily drought fellas iran head. Do gosh no you know. It seems like we've known each other for years less than a week. Hasn't it go last night. That i drove him home in my car. I remember you on a blue dress and a little black hair and my hair was muslim. I know shining. i looked fry remember. You have the most marvelous number in the world. I'm dumb ask anybody. I think we're both a little news and here. We are still dancing. Let's go to the judges stan. I forgot the fried thinking going to get it either. You ought to be dancing. There's the brian dan. Oh no. i'm gonna sit this. One out christian sean. I thought you weren't to city. I just got back. Everything is arranged. Good you're going to be much happier. Charlotte steve to they need on. You're going to be happier. I yes yes. Of course i am. Only i know that steve time to think it. Oh i'm sure he fees much better about yes he must don't think i didn't notice him. Dancing powell gal very interesting each other to. I don't understand what she sees in him. Any attention to what people say about stephen baba what what who says why nobody i. I made abundant dancing together. They probably just met here the picnic. Don't worry i'm not interested. In the ago she means nothing to me. Nothing if he wants to make a fool of himself you can go where your attention please. By the best price but the hands on the floor goes to miss barbara powell and steve dixon and now we take you back. Rivers in. The time is a week later in the afternoon and the scene is laid in dr christians. Office phone calls judy st dixon. He's on his way over to see. Oh look it's none of my business but yes choir you so interested in helping charlotte divorce team. Where judy it's this way shouted these bishops. She wants a career. She wants to go to the city and stopped by dot riding soon enough riding home for money mistaken. Judy charlotte has talent. Who says tau she does. She has something down. Deep inside of that bruins drops. That isn't talent that talk very no. No no you take this too lightly shot at winning to make a big sacrifice always willing to make a big sacrifice along as she sacrificed to someone else but she needs a good spanking would won't be all roses for he's to be too but not in the right place with charlotte and she's not question. I've got to say because he took coach. Yala judy baseball. Norman coming out charlotte charlotte. What are you so excited about. That is going on with the depots wanted to boss. What what's that you don't. It's all gonna mistake terrible mistake. I've been thinking it over now. Here here you're living your emotional way with you. What i'm surprised you're gonna emotion type your intellectual. What's what's happened. I decided i can write home. I don't have to go wait. You discussed that. An artist has to have contact with people and surrounding which can inspire him. You can't get that here and you knew how uninspiring steve is. I don't care. She's not going to get rid of me that way. W we're trying to get rid of you pal. You know perfectly well. He's interested in steve. You can't fool me charlotte policy wealthy sophisticated young woman. Steve wouldn't appeal to her. I tell you. I know what i'm talking about. She's an adventurous november fourteenth. Nineteen thirty seven dr christian on classic radio theater. This episode is sponsored by schwann's dot com. What are you having for dinner tonight. good question schwann's home. Delivery has the solution for you. 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Set the bar more beautifully and set more places at the table so why not settle in together on a new sofa because even though the holidays feel a little bit different this year being at home shouldn't mean having to settle for less right now already furniture can help you create the perfect holiday setting with everything on sale store wide. This is classic radio theater on your favorite station now. The concludes the doctor christian november fourteenth nineteen thirty seven. She came to rivers end and we took her in and then then and then she took you in plus. You won't get away with it. You wait and see. But i'm disappointed in you. Charlotte deeply disappointed to think. You're throwing away your career. Your life in a fatal. Jealousy cast the same not going to divorce team. That's the way you feel or judy as soon as deepfakes. Oh hello steve. In a shahnaz changed the mind steve. It's been mistakes team. I'm not going to divorce you. I i want you to come home. I don't know about that charlotte. You don't know. I've made other plans. Oh you can't live with the copper. Paul you just can't. There's no go by reason charlotte. You can't argue with your hard. Well i wanna say this yelich doesn't want to hurt you but you know he might be as tired of. Us you are joe. I won't let him go. That is what about his happiness. He's entitled to happen. Is the same as you are by anyone else. Are you going to stand in his hair. I've tried to help you. In this way. Turns out. I know it was all i poked. You wrote a poem about penelope. So i suppose you know. Destroy up penelope go away from. She had a hard time getting him back. But i wish you luck you understand to sure. I was a long time getting it till you told me. In one sellable the now i understand perfectly. You don't love me you. I'm hoping that now. I found someone who does and what's more. She doesn't care much for poetry. How can you treat me this way. And she likes rivers and in fact she's crazy about it doesn't stifle their at all and she thinks people here are swell steve alone. They give me another shot but from now on. I'm going my own way along my own road. Yes it's like a redstone will and beyond the shadow eastern hills is breaking by. Charlotte knows steve. I'll watch the us. We can never make a go of it. we're not on the same intellectual plane. We're not when all. I can't keep this game up. I'm no good at it. I don't love blog. Apollo at all. Only you've t- darling darling. St john's looks at that. I am not wanting here. Did you notice the way they went out of here like a pair of cooling. I don't try to help. Charlotte wears a divorce in the first place. All she wanted was a chance to dramatize yourself. she thought i just didn't take by this measure. Sit down get your breath. No i haven't got a minute. I'm going back to town. And i wanted to get there before dark to bed. You're growing a nice having you with us. And i've had loads of fun. I'm glad you're in for me. What do i qualify. Style number london. Dr paul go to the end of the class. You've no idea what a hard time i had getting. Steve dixon to take you to that thick and keeping him with me when he saw charlotte was there and you have no that he would have time. I had getting him to put up this afternoon news. Anyway i love my motor running so goodbye. Goodbye logon thanks. Jj against own you sent for his whole business about steve falling for her a frame up simply to give charlotte something to think about. Oh now i wouldn't exactly call it. The frame up christian europe baker judy. I'm a scientist. And i've just discovered marble anatomical fact what there's more than one place where you can spend a person and thus we conclude chapter two in the story of dr christian of rivers in next sunday at the same time. The makers of estimating preparations will present chapter three in the story of paul christian. The doctor rivers end with jean hersholt in the title role. Jean hersholt appears on this program through the courtesy of twentieth century fox. And by the way if you haven't seen the new twentieth century fox picture. Heidi in which jean hersholt appears shirley temple. You have treat ahead of you. It is now showing in theaters everywhere. This is arthur gilmore. Getting your good afternoon for the makers of lean preparations november fourteenth nineteen thirty seven dr christian on classic radio theater. So right now maybe the perfect time for you to rethink how you pay for healthcare. And here's why not only is it time for open enrollment for a lot of people. It's also when you can join meta share and save even more than usual for the typical family switching to medishare saves about five hundred dollars a month which is a game changer. For a lot of people think what you could do that but if you join right now medishare's waving their new member fees. 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That's eight four. Four three seven seven eight hundred five two or patriotdepot dot com use promo code. Usa if you enjoy our classic radio theater broadcast and want to start building a collection of your own go to classic radio dot stream. That's classic radio dot stream there you'll find links to great classic radio collections. On cd along with links to greet reading on classic radioplus classic radio theater on demand. Check our web page available now at classic radio dot stream. That's classic radio dont stream and enjoy your still degree will believe in your gut school you should. You won't fix this disgusted there little fella are. Us constitution protects. Your right to say these things even if they are driven founders believed in our inalienable rights granted by god not some mafia our bill of rights protects your personal freedoms absolute right to speak to others whether loving and kind or hateful and stupid utopia doesn't exist. It only destroys millions of minutes and slaughtered by the communist in cambodia. China and the union of soviet socialist republics and millions of people were gasify hitler's national socialist party. Where do you stand. Help us save the constitution and restore our american dream. Go to save my freedom dot com. That's save my freedom dot com brought to you by the american media council now on classic radio theater a truly sad yours truly johnny dollar story. This is part. One of the five part broaddrick matter. This was originally broadcast november fourteenth nineteen fifty five from hollywood. It's time now for dollar name. Staleness dollar claims division eastern. Trust insurance company steal. You don't know me mr dollar people. A universal adjustment suggested i contact. You thought you might be interested in helping me pay off a claim. Okay tell me about steal. One of our policy. Holders passed away last month. We can't seem to locate his beneficiary. She just doesn't seem to be around. Maybe he doesn't want the money everybody wants money. Have dollar especially insurance money. Be there in an hour long. And every weekday night bob bailey. The transcribed adventures of the man with the action packed. Expense account america's fabulous freelance insurance investigator. Yours truly johnny dollar expense accounts submitted by special investigator. Johnny dollar to the eastern trust insurance company claims division hartford connecticut. The following is an accounting of expenditures during my investigation of the broddrick expense account item. One twenty five cents bus fare. My apartment to the east interest insurance building in the office of robert steal. It was a big sandy haired man tweet suit. We shook hands looked each other over and then got down to business dollar the deceased policy hold. It was named john. Smith john adams smith age sixty seven died and city hospital charity ward. Twenty second last month that certificate ammonia and other things and what other things the internal side a ticket says smith was pretty rundown evidences of malnutrition. Possible tb istorii. Not noted here. Mr steele doesn't make any difference. Smith was able to stand the exam for the policies they were issued in nineteen forty three him there. Yes fifteen hundred total beneficiary lorraine broderick she the one. You can't locate. She's the one and the other possible heirs family or anyone. Smith was all alone. No problems there any other material that might help to find lorraine broderick here might help you. I don't know. I just don't know you sound a scourge mr stem. Fifteen hundred dollars isn't a lot of money and the chances are lorraine broderick won't even remember. John adam smith when you do find it but i hope you do i. I'm explaining this badly. Look here you see in here and here. it's the same. All through the book. Smith was absolutely religious about his payments. Never missed a one. Never let it slide one day now. But i've got the record at twenty thousand policy buyers but none of them reads like that. I'm impressed wants to steal. Can you tell me why. Smith died in a charity ward. If he was this conscientious he didn't have any money or friends or home. He made his living selling papers. We wouldn't have known about his death except for the fact that the coroner's office called us. Can you tell me about his beneficiary. Lorraine broderick was just someone who stopped and talked to him one day while he was selling papers. She was eleven years old at the time. She what yes. The agent of seoul the policies used by his papers from the old boy. One day smith stopped him and said he wanted to do something. Nice for a nice little girl named lorraine broderick so he began taking out the policies agent have any more background on that part of it. No lorraine broderick met smith that one afternoon and helped him sell his newspapers. Smith never saw again after that nineteen forty-three she must be twenty three or so now. I hope she grew up to be the kind of person he thought she was. Then hardly any of us fill out the promise. We haven't eleven years steel then. That isn't what i mean. I mean if he met her that one day when she was a little girl and he made this gesture torture and it was tough for him to make those payments all those years. I hope she deserves money. Doesn't mean anything. But that kind of endorsement from somebody even an old bird who sells papers on a corner is worth more than all the money in the world. That does that sound foolish. Mr dollar not a bit. Mr steele not a bit expense account item to two dollars cafe lorraine broderick last known address. Fourteen eighty five pushing street a broken down apartment house. That had probably never seen better days been neighbors. The owner and manager of the billing. Recall that paul and mary broddrick parents have lorraine had been killed in an automobile accident in nineteen forty eight. The manager did not know what had become a lorraine she had moved out of the apartment two days after the funeral. No forwarding address expense account item three four bits. More cab fare. This time seven blocks away to pulaski street and dingy cluster of red brick buildings that were yielding slowly. Time and where i arrived at three on the dot. I don't think high schools ever changed my at least this one was no different than the one i've been in way back lineup of assistant smile pencil sharpener zinc discarded lunch a sister. Mary regina albert good afternoon sister. My name's johnny dollar. I wonder if i could talk to you a moment. Dan i you show. You shouldn't be speaking to amadeus in the grade school. I don't believe we have any students named dollar no sister. I don't have any children in school here. I've been hired by eastern trust insurance company to locate a beneficiary on one of their insurance policies. I thought perhaps you might help me. I took a chance and came here because it was the nearest high school to the girls. Address or name is lorraine broderick lorraine. Yes the last trace. I have ever was in nineteen forty eight. She was about seventeen then possibly still in school possibly this school now. Rain sound familiar system in a way. That is so many so many mr. I just met about three thousand. A mountain hong nineteen forty eight grading roderick lorraine mary broader yes mr dalli. Your guest was very good. She was here in saint charles from nineteen forty five to forty eight years. I wonder if there's an address listed there. S and eleven twenty seton place. Oh my that's quite far from here at parents deceased guardian. Oh anything wrong sister. I remember laurey now. Mr dolla parents were killed in an automobile accident in her senior year. Yes and she went to live with her uncle. James broadderick this seat and address. Oh yes yes. I remember that lovely girl. She insisted hilda. God's class up what i know about her so far sister. I remember her so clearly. I can even see her face. Perhaps that was as her face like an angel hose gentle and fresh wonderful remain. Who after insurance money must have thought the same as you do sister. He saw one day when she was eleven. I have an annual from that yet mister dollar. Would you like to see laredo. That's lorraine broderick beautiful. Isn't she sister mary. Regina pointed to a group picture on one of the label. Girls adela rain. broderick was in the first roll. One of thirty or forty self-conscious little girls wearing identical self-conscious expressions are hair appeared to be deep brown or black features soft and slightly arabic undeniably lorraine broderick had been a beautiful young girl. In all probability she was a beautiful young woman. Wherever she was five o'clock i'd been to oracle's address on seton place there. I learned that uncle. James broderick died of a heart attack in nineteen fifty. The people at the address reported that lorraine had lived with him up until the time of his death. She had worked in a dentist office. They told me as far as they knew she still worked there. I'm in a phone call. Esser johnny dollar mr steele. Some help if you got a man. I've got traded up to nineteen fifty steals. She worked for dentists. Here tongue probably got a job in his office right out of high school. That meant she pretty. Well had to get it through a professional agency. Check the agencies in town specializing. Let me know the next day. I was back in saint charles highschool making up a list of names and addresses belonging to students who had been in lorraine broderick graduation place out of the ten names. I chose at random. I was able to locate only to both girls. Both married both remembered lorraine broderick. Neither of them had seen her since graduation. Neither of them was able to furnish any helpful information. Expense account item. Five ten cents one phone call steal again. You wanna take this down dollar david pollard. That's dr david pollard. Twenty nine fifty tremor lane lorraine broderick went to work for him a receptionist nineteen forty nine. Got it what's his office address just about a quarter six. There was no receptionist on duty. As a matter of fact no reception desk a stern looking nurse in a rumble white uniform knew nothing of lorraine broderick who might have worked for doctor. Doctor was working with a patient. If i had to wait for dr yes yes. What is my name's dollar with eastern trust insurance. I don't need any today. Mr dollar looking for sale doctor. Well that's right. I'm trying to find a friend of yours who you're talking about lorraine broderick oh hell is lorraine these days doctor. I'd like to meet her and find out looking in the wrong place. I can't help you. She hasn't been around for a couple of years by awaits. Well what now what. You've got an awful big chip on your shoulder doctor. You won't even let me explain my business. I'm not interested in your business. I can tell you mine has been going on since eight o'clock this morning. I'm pretty tired. you've finish now. Yes can i take downstairs and by drink. Sorry what is it. You want to know where i can get in touch with her. She quit without notice a couple years ago. Just didn't come back to bed to. Do you have any idea where she might have gone. Just what does this. Four two pairs. Some money we are. We can't locate or anywhere. I'm sorry but neither can i. I still trying not anymore. All i know is she just left one day about two years ago. She had a little apartment over in the west side. The manager told me she'd pulled out bag and baggage. And i haven't heard from a sense where you on good terms with a doctor dr. I'll take the drink. Misunderstand me dollars. She was a real sweet girl but there was something about our. I'll hope you find it. Maybe i don't what are you talking about. She had plans overall plan. She never told me look. I was practiced three years when she came to work for me. Fresh out of high school and with all of it she still made me feel like a little boy. Kneepads that smile of hers. You could take two ways. Look that went with it. I'm sure she's met a lot of men since she walked out on me and i'll bet all found out the same thing. What's that they've been taken. You mean money. I wasn't the watch necklace. The loans every now and then it was being taken worse in are being used and knowing you being used. I don't quite get it and make it clear. That sweep fresh beautiful. Little girl was out to do everything and everybody for all she could get. She's rotten you know. Just plain rutten There'll be another intriguing episode of the broddrick matter tomorrow tomorrow. The expense goes way up. Yeah costs money to prove how wrong one man can be join us. Won't you yours truly johnny dollar yours. Truly johnny dollar starring. Bob vela's transcribed in hollywood. Written by john dawson. It is produced and directed by jack. Johnstone be sure to join us tomorrow night. Same time and station for the next exciting episode of yours. Truly johnny dollar roy. Rowland speaking november fourteenth nineteen fifty-five yours truly johnny dollar on classic radio theater with a quick. Thank you to ted over radio memories dot com for providing us this episode in this whole week series of yours truly johnny dollar radio memories dot com ted supplies uncut radio programs on cassette cd or flash drive. Contact him. Radio memories dot com. You can contact me through our web page. Classic radio dot stream that is classic. Radio dot stream. I'm wyatt cox. Thanks much have yourself a great day. 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You know which station is going to tell you the score of the game which one is going to give you a laugh in the morning which one will give you something to sing along with. You know where to turn when the weather gets out and something big happens good or bad you know where to go because radio has been here all along. Radio is part of your community woven into the fabric of what makes home home and now radio has evolved to move with you with the next radio app and your fm enabled phone just plug in your headphones to start experiencing in a whole new way while using way less battery and data than streaming apps. Check out the live guy to see and interact with live radio stations easily. Find your favorites like the one. You're listening to right now and as always it's totally free. Download the nextradio app. Today next the us reaches another record of new daily covid nineteen cases. I'm joe chiro. Fox news that. According to data from johns hopkins university which reports the us have more than one hundred eighty. Four thousand new cases of covid nineteen on friday north dakota one of the states implementing new restrictions status sitting at the top of the list the highest cases and deaths per capita and is really struggling to contain the virus and a complete turnaround. Governor burgum is now and posing a mass mandate restrictions on indoor dining and the suspension of high school sports and activities until december north dakota joins at least thirty four states that have a mask mandate and play hospitals. Fill up in north dakota and other areas around the country charles watson tens of thousands of president trump's supporters participating in what's being called the stop the steel rally in washington. Dc president trump earlier. Today did a motorcade drive via the event while on the way to his virginia golf club. California republican congressman elect. Darrell issa without a doubt. It's the one time in which the story is don't have to close and put over their window because it's been completely Not only violent but a happy event the rally to show solidarity with the president and his legal challenges to the election the president-elect and his advisors continue to work on choosing who will be in his cabinet one of the biggest decisions that president elect. Joe biden is facing right now is who to pick for his secretary of state and fox. News is learning at the top former ambassador. Susan rice who former president obama is pushing as his favourite rice. Not only has the foreign policy chops needed to be secretary of state. Also on that list senators. Chris coons and chris murphy functions hillary von from hobart beach delaware. America is listening to fox. News police in plymouth. Connecticut sale woman shot two children killing one and critically entering the other at a home in the terry ville section of town. Naomi bell was arrested on murder and attempted murder charges and is due for arraignment a monday. Police have not said what relationship if any the forty three year old has to the children new york city schools could be ordered closed as early as monday. Fox's gary bond garden reports from new york that according to me bill de blasio who says if the positive test rate in new york city reaches three percent. He'll close schools telling the brian lehrer show on wnyc radio. We are making preparations as a result. in case that number does exceed three percent and in the event that we do have to temporarily closed our schools this even though the positive rate in the schools is less than one percent but to blasios says he hopes that if it is necessary to close schools it will be for a very short time gary bomb garten fox news world diabetes. Day is today. fox's tonnage powers has more on how the disease is affecting people across the globe. The international diabetes foundation says there are now more than four hundred sixty three million adults with diabetes worldwide. That's one in eleven. it's also one reason. the idea. fuses world diabetes day to underscore the health threat disease poses. This year's theme for world diabetes. Day is the nurse and diabetes to raise awareness of the role. Nurses play the prevention and management of it. The day is marked each year on november fourteenth. Because that's the birthday of sir. Frederick banting who co discovered insulin in nineteen twenty two. The day is also being marked on social media with the hashtag world diabetes day and nurses make the difference tongue powers. Fox news fox news. Today's news got your head spinning. Try head space head. Space offers daily dose of mindfulness with guided meditations in an easy to use app. Go to head space dot com slash fox for a free one-month trial. This is the best deal offered right. Now that's head space dot com slash. Fox you're listening to the heartland news feed radio network lie at hartland. Newsbeat dot com. This stream is supported by advertisers and contributions by you follow us on facebook twitter and instagram. The us reaches another record of new daily covid nineteen cases. I'm joe chiro. Fox news that. According to data from johns hopkins university which reports the us have more than one hundred eighty. Four thousand new cases of covid nineteen on friday north dakota one of the states. Implementing new restrictions. The state is sitting at the top of the list with the highest cases and data per capita in is really struggling to contain the virus and a complete turnaround. Governor burgum is now imposing a mass mandate restrictions on indoor dining and the suspension of high school sports and activities until december. North dakota joined at least thirty. Four other states that have a mask mandate in place as hospitals fill up in north dakota and other areas around the country boxes journals watson tens of thousands of president trump's supporters participating in. What's being called the stuff that steel rally in washington. Dc president trump earlier. Today did a motorcade drive via the event while on the way to his virginia. golf club. California republican congressman elect. Darrell issa doubt It's the one time in which the stores don't have to close put boards over their window because it's been completely Not only violent but happy event the rally to show solidarity with the president and his legal challenges to the election the president-elect and his advisors continue to work on choosing who will be his cabinet one of the biggest decisions that president elect. Joe biden is facing right now is who to pick for his secretary of state and fox. News is learning at the top former ambassador. Susan rice who former president obama is pushing as his favourite rice. Not only has the foreign policy chops needed to be secretary of state. Also on that list senators. Chris coons and chris murphy functions hillary von from rehoboth beach delaware. America is listening to fox. News police in plymouth. Connecticut say a woman shot two children killing one and critically entering the other at a home in the terry ville section of town. Naomi bell was arrested on murder attempted murder charges and is due for arraignment on monday. Police have not said what relationship if any the forty three year old has to the children new york city schools could be ordered closed as early as monday. Fox's gary bombed garden reports from new york that according to mayor bill de blasio who says if the positive test rate in new york city reaches three percent. he'll close schools. Telling the brian lehrer show on wnyc. We are making preparations as a result In case that number does exceed three percent and in the event that we do have to temporarily closed our schools this even though the positive rate in the schools is less than one percent but to blasios says he hopes that if it is necessary to close schools it will be for a very short time. Gary bomb garten fox news world diabetes. Day is today functions tonnage powers has more on how the disease is affecting people across the globe. The international diabetes foundation says there are now more than four hundred sixty three million adults with diabetes worldwide. That's one in eleven. it's also one reason. the idea. fuses world diabetes day to underscore the health threat. The disease poses this year's theme for world diabetes day is the nurse and diabetes to raise awareness of the role nurses play the prevention and management of it. The day is marked each year on november fourteenth. Because that's the birthday of sir. Frederick banting who co discovered insulin in nineteen twenty two. The day is also being marked on social media with the hashtag world diabetes day and nurses make the difference tongue towers fox news fox. Today's news got your head spinning. Try head space head. Space offers a daily dose of mindfulness with guided meditations in an easy to use app. Go to head space dot com slash fox for a free one-month trial. This is the best deal offered right. Now that's head space dot com slash fox. Are you registered to vote. Find out how at vote. Four one. One dot org. Don't miss the deadline. Every state is different. Plan to vote on november third or by your states deadline. If you're voting by mail vote make it. Count go to vote four one one dot org. I know a number of your business owners so you do not need to tell us that running a business as tough. I know this we know this but you might be making it tougher on yourself than it has to be don't let quickbooks and spreadsheets. 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Who started the car when i do for the lion game. Because he had probably like high not the body kong. Because like i love you hear now. What's cracking welcome to episode one hundred and forty nine of the original side-hustle. The jim rome podcast this week. My guest is one of the newest members of the pro football hall of fame. He's also a four time pro bowler a south florida legend. A fiercely proud alumnus of the you. He is edgerrin james. The edge can't tell you how hyped out was for this conversation both to relive some of the glory days of his career and to hear what he's been up to as a father who is on his way to canton. ohio edge. Lives up to all the hype in fact he smashes it. Let's get right to it episode. One hundred and forty nine with edgerrin. James hits you right now. Ed you is so good running down you and i have not spoken in a moment or so. It's great to run you down. We start with this. You wrote a great piece for the players tribune recently. And i love the way when you started the piece you write quote i came out of the womb with a gold teeth mentality. It's such a great line to be. What does that mean to you. A gold teeth mentality. You all you are man. You know you're putting yourself in a situation you understand who you are and you don't really change for nobody else. You're doing what you do. And it's not not focused on nobody else in your world so you are who you are and you're from where you're from sony start right there. You're from a moccoli sell florida. I'm curious what was it like growing up there and also you right. It's like you get it out the mud. what's it mean to get it out the mud so much that you must they. Nothing's giving you know. We never had nobody to give us anything expected anything and i knew i didn't have nobody to turn to a lean so it's one of those things that we have to get it. We have to make it. If we wanna make it. You know going to have somebody. That's coming give anything a lot of places you go. They have people that do things for them. Put them in better position any position that we got. It was pretty much creative. You know it's something because you also write that. Football is easy for me. I'm not gonna lie to you. It ain't complicated game. It's just work. I realized it like wait a minute. You're telling me. All i gotta do is out work this man across from me. That's it shit game over then so when it comes to excelling in the game and you made it to the very top humidity hall of fame. How much it is about pure talent and ability and how much of it is just about grind and want to percents but majority is about the grinding. Want to you know if you can catch us and cats you know if you can run you can run. They do all those things in the test. But the great ones they take that step to a whole other level by the way they do it. You know how they go about doing it. You know and you see a lot of people that have way more talented than others. is that mentality. it's the way they ground the way they sit up there and look at other opponents and say you're not going to beat me and i i took every position that i've that i've played in every time i was on that. It was always about me doing what. I'm supposed to do no matter what no matter. The play nobody situation long. I'm doing what. I'm doing apple on those film and see the beat my man. I took care minded responsibility. Everything has worked yourself up. See nothing is you figured a lot of this out at a pretty young age. Maybe because you had to but you also mentioned that you had a so called cheat code highschool when it came to football. What was your cheat code. I always work everybody. You know what. It's like. If if i know everybody everybody to do. Go with coach. Tell you to do or where somebody's going to do. So i realized that. I you know if i go and i i work here but i'm in better safe than everybody in better condition than when they're getting tired. I'm just getting started. You know so. That was always my band. And i've always taken a very serious. That's super serious. I always outworked everybody from high school all the way up. Because you realize that you know if we're doing the same thing we're getting the same treatment within the same kind of training. You know we. I'm not separating myself so separate you had to do it yourself. you don't need somebody to make you do it. So in other words the separation was in the time that you are putting in i mean. Lay that out for me like were you doing. You were getting work in before school right. You were getting workouts in before you even went to school. Did you tell anybody you did that now. Because we we thought kevin people doing anything on. They're gonna tell you why not why you send you're doing it or they're gonna start trying to do it you know so. It's like hey. Is that me doing what i'm doing. I always wanted always better. When i work out by myself i push myself. I talk to myself and i and i go over your things over and over by myself. 'cause that's what you're really competing with other to try to compete with each other. You know as long as you improve every day you prove yourself no telling where you can go with with Your talent you've versus you and again you figure that out at a pretty early age now. If you're doing that type of thing in high school. I could see where that might create some separation and it. Did it got you to the you but when you get to the nfl then how do you create that separation. Then you're going up against the ultimate offers the best of the best. What's the cheat code. Then for the nfl. This you know. 'cause a lotta time everybody's goal is to get to the nfl and they're gonna have to be bigger than they go has become a hall of famer to become a whole become one of the top players and that was always my goal. Become one of the guy that's gonna end up one of those go jackets. So it's like getting the nfl. It does a lot for you. But i don't want to be there. You know i wanted to really like like put my place or set my put my stamp on the game and so that was really about. Nfl comes down to because you have more than ever. Now you have the freedom you have the money you have. You feel like you've attained thing that you've always set out to do but you have you have to aim higher than that say you didn't have very much growing up and you put in the time and then suddenly you're a young guy and you have a lot. How were you able to steer clear of that when so many guys were not able to do so. I think it comes down to distant a compound your priorities you know like for me. I you know i feel like my mom. My mom my mom's lesson you know you have a praying woman. You don't wanna mess up. Something a person pray. They prayed to come out of third situation. You never know which child or which thing you do is going to be the one and always felt like you know. Hey i'm my mom was prayer. You know i'm the went up up for me and so like i can't mess that up and so you make sure you hold yourself accountable. You make sure that. I'm gonna do what i do. Not put myself in those situations and you know if you look at the history of the game you know. It's the same story no matter how many times you put in front of everybody but it takes the player to take the initiative and say hey man i'm not i'm not going back and i'm not going back to where i come from. And if that's the driving force. That's what i just mccombs in that right now. You mentioned your mom. You said also that first paycheck at first. Nfl paycheck more than anything else. What that did was it allowed you and your mom both to take a deep breath house. Oh and then. What did that feel like to finally. After all that time take that deep breath it was. It was kinda like you get it goes in phases you know goes as phase you get invited to the combined. You know that you're gonna step closer and then all of a sudden draft as come you get a step closer than you got drafted right. But i don't have the money you know s so something happens to be. I don't know what happened. Is something happens to me while. I'm a drafted player and i haven't gotten the money we still we still where we were at all other times. You know and so for me. It's like man. And i ended up holding up everybody else sign. That was one of the hardest things to do. But you had to do what was right. You know it was a you know. I had the contract situation was a little tricky. Because of you know the player behind me that signed a deal and they wanted me to sign a certain deal and so is one of those things where you say man damn do i do. I signed a deal now. Just so i can secure the bag or do i do. What's right for the game and do what's right for my position. You know kind of kind of you know whole whole your position and so it's like going through all of this and then all of a sudden august twelfth we show up go to go to camp you get that sick and now it's like now israel you know on. Cnn is like had me where i was. I mean. i'm not going to the club. I'm not going nowhere because it's something happened. I'm gonna fuck up the whole situation just by being stupid. You know and i wouldn't even go nowhere during my hold out. I did work. I i would call. I talked to pay a lot. I thought everybody offense was holding out. Because i was like man. I'm right there. But i don't wanna get right there and then don't finish the job and once i got once i signed that deal. It's like now this shit real now. You know we really got some money you know we really have one out count you know. And that's that's where that silent leaf comes from like damn we. We really got money now. It's up for me to make sure we always have someone do that. That is amazing. Wages laid that out and the type of things that you were dealing with and which you had to focus on. Are you craving some protein after a good workout. This time do not make a shake rebar instead. Grab a bag of beef jerky from all trapper trapper. Beef jerky is tasty. It's tender it's made with real strips of stake in quality spices that are smoked over wood. Fire andy goes with you wherever you go to the game to the gym to the beach. So look for old trapper in the clearview bag you can see the quality you're buying look for it in major retail stores near you and if you don't see clones make sure you ask for it by name because no other jerky compares. Oh trapper. what's your beef. You were the guy like there were so many people in the family. Maybe you tell me otherwise were. Did you feel a certain burn in a certain pressure that i'm responsible for not just myself but for a lot of people within my family i can change the future of a lot of people the entire generation fact that you feel a pressure or did you like that responsibility. Did you want that on your shoulders. You feel like it's a calling you feel like man. I didn't ask for this position. No but that's how you put this that you have to really accept you know it's like i didn't ask to be the boss of the family or whatever but i know what i'm saying gained and was never home. I like basketball. I always wanted to be a basketball player. But i wasn't good enough. You know what i'm saying. I do know what you're saying. But that's that's twice now as you've said that demand the game's not that heart. The game's really. Not that hard. Ain't the restaurants football. It looks pretty fucking complicated. Is it really not that heart man so much you can look at the game. You know exactly what everybody's do not watch games okay. Yeah if his third and three you know they're gonna the team's gonna goes out of force you hot and they're gonna try to force the place where you can tap your right at the one yard short or you know it's the same thing happens over and over you know the game. Does it say trick play here and there but the game doesn't change any comes down to who the bad others on the field and whose owner stuff you know. Who's gonna jump outside. Who's doing their homework. You know who's been taking up and you can always look at you. say okay. Yeah these guys are getting hurt. Because they didn't train right way these guys you know. They don't know what's going. We'll go to situation of the game so you see all the thing the mistakes that are made their repeat things and they get a chance to do it again. It's oh i forgot you know. But if i get to do it again last time you don't get a second chance that's what you have to prepare. You have to practice. You have to do all the things that you take to be one of the great and once you do it then game as a kid game and it just comes down to knowing what you're supposed to do with train okay. Everybody goes through you. Try and you take your body if you don't take care of your body you're most likely not going to be a healthy player you know. That's not complicated. No you gotta do the work. I understand what you're saying you've got put in the time have to do the work and their separation that now like when i watched the nfl. It seems to me yard. Just a different breed. Like if you get to that level you're at different breed of cat. you're all bad motherfuckers. It seems to me for all of us who've never play the game much less at that level but if you're looking for separation if you're talking about quote a bad mother fucker like who when you look back over your career who the bad guys. Give me a couple of guys. Either you went. You played with or up against this separated themselves from everybody else in terms of how bad and how they were guys that you really respect it man all all my guys come my right and that that we we committed to each other when it's come to somebody else you respect somebody else but you're not grant to grind. You know how hard it was practices. And that's where you really get recognized old dude. That's really bad. You know those guys is really out there doing what they're supposed to be doing. You know doing it in practice and they do it day in day out when nobody's watching. You know those guys that i always like to be surrounded by and that's what i school developed and that's the thing that we were known for my off season where some serious season with serious competition and. That's what i always embrace 'cause when you go back to go back to your job you're like okay. Yeah we we've been doing this you know and we don't wanna never loses mentality and what about guys were five star guys all over the field you reggie wayne santana's had read etc etc. So i can imagine how tough those practices were. You've also made the point that look. I don't care anybody says the. Us is just different. The you is different than every other school. Lay that out for me. How is it different different in. What regard well because when you when you come to the university of my is not you. Don't get your typical college atmosphere. You know small. It's a small tight knit group you know. And it's one of those things where it's like we don't get it has experienced all those college lifestyle thing you. We're there for our job. We're de to handle our business and we're about Sports you know you. Don't see us that. Dan this fraternity end play. Football is football. you know. and that's where is like little things like that and to be at the university of mine and be in the city of miami that that takes a lot of distance. Because you know it's you know it's all night city you know. It's one where everybody comes to have fun so when i got it makes it at the university of messy. Yeah he has some distant about himself or something. Because i know when you walking around that city and you have you can go to this place. Go to that place and it's always fun but just say i'm gonna make sure i go to the weight room and make sure i go to class and do what i'm supposed to do. You know that there's a lot by the person 'cause there's no other city in the country that wide open like us and the school that's right there you know we have to. We have to deal with that day in and day out and then the type of players that come there you know you know you. Gotta you know when you plan with a dog. You know you and knowing that means something to them and all that it's a combination of things there's so many things that make us different it's harder just put one foot thing on one or two things i get. I get that. Let me ask you this then. So like if you gotta have that focus and you have to have that grit and grind and that discipline. What's it like then. When you're like in the heyday at the you and you got you got like trick daddy. After the game you're rolling around with trick daddy around south beach after a game. How hard was it to discipline. And what were those times like fun. But it's like you know that's all that's your reward. You know you say we go out. We bought up. We have a day off is truly a day off. You know we have We do what we supposed to do. You know but we got to represent. You can't get you can't be rolling around partying and kicking it and you're not taking care of your business you're always gonna take care of your business and and the thing about the guys around the city they not gonna let you do nothing wrong. They're not gonna be saying. Hey here take the joint. Hey tom do this right. they're not there's enough not we. We need you for the community for the people. You got to be example. The thing about it you have all do is pulling for you and when you go somewhere they're gonna make sure you never home way you know they don't make sure so you can show the kid man this kid come right where you come from and look at it and he. This is where he's at and it is the pipeline of that so the city and everybody in the city they they they welcome you with open on. And they're going to protect you. They're gonna make sure you're not doing things throwing now. Make sure you're not putting yourself in homes weight and we have a group like that says a lot. You know 'cause some people they're trying to persuade you to do all types of other stuff that person game but when you went into the people gonna make a we need you. We need to be an example for the for the you and you embrace that position goes back at what you're talking about like being about your business you're always about your business even from early age. You also said that payton who you mentioned was the undisputed heavyweight champion of being about his business like what does that mean. What did that look like. What did he look like is the undisputed champion of being about. His business was always about his craft and he always taking care of his business. Always say and and you know. That's one of the things you a different when you come from african american household and you don't have somebody to thirty two way and then you see somebody that come from a good family and they have a father. That's been there. They have a nice family structure. And you say damn that's tight because he's able to focus on football and don't we has to do with any endorse for anything that has to do with with his personal or business or whatever. We're just crap you know with us. We have to deal with different things you know. We have to deal with first. I the first person i had some money. We had to deal with. All these folks at ain't have no money that have all these leads. And what so you can just focus on their business and focus on what they have is pretty impressive man. And that's one thing that you like. I wish i could be like that with my children. You know you don't have to worry about what he's hanging on. You don't have to worry about dealing with these bad people. I'm gonna make sure you just focus on your business. And that's one thing i've always seen. A person is committed to their craft and they just focused on his business and do what he had to do. And you could record shows you know. And that's that's one thing. I always respect by that family way. They went about it. So we how their business sticking about it. They don't have to deal with bullshit. We gotta deal with you. Listen taking nothing away from him or his family. I mean they've earned everything they have but at the same time to your point you had to deal with a whole lot of other bullshit. Maybe he didn't deal with. And then you mentioned your kids for instance you've got a daughter in law school. You have another at an hugh. How much pride you have in your kids killing the way they are in their own right. But but that's the thing starts somewhere has the somewhere and for for me. This is where it starts. It starts with me. You know with other families. You know if i started some where everybody had to go through something to position their sample putting themselves in that position. We just a little bit behind you know. But we see blueprint and we're like following those loop prints and we say okay. Yeah this is the way you have to do it and for me. I think a lot of pride in my kids you know. I want them to be the best that they could possibly be. And i wanted him to do whatever they wanna do. Support them and i want to put myself in position the where i can truly support them. You know. I wanna be where i have to. I gotta go to work and can't do these days. You can't put them in position you know that that's one thing that i wanted to break that. That type of generational pattern that we've had you know i understand you know what. Let me show them the right way. Let me show them that anything they wanna be. We're going gonna try it. We're gonna go at it. My daughter said she wanted to be a lawyer. Guess what school they want to sing. She's singing my son. Wants to play football you sample but my son wants basketball basketball. You know so. It's being about being able to put yourself in that position to do that. And i take pride in. And i'm committed to him. I cannot wait to tell you about this. new product. The stress of daily life ways on all of us whether you're an elite athlete or just a regular person trying to get through the day muscle pain and muscle. Tension is a real thing. This is why. I love thera gun. The hand held progressive therapy device. That releases your deepest muscle tension using a scientifically calibrated combination of depth speed power. And now it's as quiet as an electric toothbrush. And that's because the all new gen four thera- gun has a proprietary brushless motor. That is so quiet. You wonder if it's even on while you soothe your aching muscles with gun. Signature power amplitude and effectiveness. This product is amazing. Listen you've gotta try it. Try therapy gun for thirty days. In fact there is no substitute for the thera- gun gen four with an old screen personalized thera- gun app and quiet empower. You need it. Starts at only one hundred and ninety nine dollars. Go to thera- gun dot com slash rome right now. Get you jen for thera- guns today. That's thera gun dot com slash enemy. Thera- gun dot com slash rome. This product is incredible extending your legacy. Edge i mean you're known a lot more if you get to the hall of fame that's one of the greatest stories ever especially starting in a small town the way you did. But you're about so much more than that now you you in the super bowl but you never one one yet. You have a ring. How did you come to get a ring would relationship. It's one of the things where you know because of the business game. Yes salary cats you have all those things. So it's just the nature of the been but it was. It was a progression. That was doing up the coast. We're going to win a super bowl if you know it was always a progression. Always figuring these things up and so happened. It happened a year that i left but i was always taught to that team. I'm always going to be tied to those teams and that's my family you know. And it's like so the business business. Don't come between families visit them. Come between people that you know. I definitely and that's all that right. There is just a reflection of death so in other words. What you're telling me is like you left the team and it's just business and it's not personal but jim irsay said we would not have won this ring without what you did. Prior to your leaving to go to arizona. He gave you a ring even after you left. Because of what you meant that franchise and that's my man you know and we may and it's all about having news respect for everybody know what i've done it wasn't for if it wasn't for the business out of thing i would have finished my career as a coke but for me it's business when you go into this game you know. There's no surprises when business decisions of may you know that doesn't stop or had nothing to do with the relationship that has been developed from the first step foot on the football field or once you got into your nfl uniform. You know you know you're going to bed but sometimes things go beyond a business you you develop a tight relationship with people and that's been embiid and that's what it really comes down to. I can tell how much respect into kind of affinity and affection. You have for him when you first met him. He started chat. You up about hip pop. Did he know what he was talking about like. What was your first impression when you met him years ago. You know i wasn't even twenty one you got jackson. I was twenty years old. And i don't you know i'm used to being arou- my crew you know i'm just being around my people you know every we kinda staying outlook circle and so when i go up you know. I never met a billionaire. I never met somebody that home. Something i never. I never encountered any of that. You know but you go into things with preconceived had a kind of noticing. Oh man. I don't know what it's going to be like man they might be square or they might but then when you sit up there and you talk to them as earth. He's in the music he's already like down through legit. You know but you don't know all this stuff because you know nobody would ever really put those things on saying so you start having a conversation and getting around people you know once you get around with people you know you know what you you make for yourself. And i'm like man do cool as hell you know and some some from day one. It's been it's been like that judge a book by its cover. Now you went to the super bowl with arizona and that was a lifetime in a culmination are hard work. They're winning to that. So you want to do something special. Prior to that game you went to the dealership or you had a guy on the floor there. And what did you say to that guy at the dealership but what happened next. You know we come in man. I'm making a super bowl. Like i always said if i make it super bowl. I'm gonna do something you know. I'm gonna do something so i went to. I like older school causing you know. I was always wrote like a band or something. I would like to get something that's popping and so i went to went to the dealership and with lamborghini of miami and you know already know much about the sports. 'cause i already know much about that. It wasn't my thing. That's hey kimmy to sit you've got you know and yeah just white with red interior Lamborghini mercer lago. I'm planning for the car news. We read we wait. Everything just matched up and say this say what surprised and price is i and pay forecast that. He's dropping off at the hotel we'll be back in Two weeks have dropped off the hotel. In how good it there and i was it dude except it wasn't quite it like that. That's bad ass. That is bad as you just kind paid cash for it you say give me the most bad ass rig you have and then you stroke a check and you pay cash the thing about that edge. That's a really complicated car. Alright especially if you're not a sports car dude if you're more about the old school in the sedans like what happened when you got into that car and the thing is like you know. They got the car in front of in front of the hotel. We put our bags through coming hotel. Do all that and then like okay. You're over here. I'm like okay. Man being a coupla boys you know we're like okay we're gonna go ride around riding around tampa you know and then and everybody started coming out and started coming around now like you know so. I'm definitely contact and that can deport. You know for the case here. None of that is dead. It's like what the fuck did i just pay for like an empty. There is not much in a car the car with button. Nothing nothing traditional. I'm sitting there. Pat paddles shit. Right like paddles and shit. Yeah they got the paddles on the sand. Where and so. I'm looking forward to shift look bar none of that. I'm like damn what's up you know and after sitting there going through this thing over and over i like this man that then we gotta start this shit man. 'cause i don't i don't know you know i have no idea. No clue and man. Let's let's stop playing around with it. Because i really wanted to try to but i need. Somebody thought that's incredible dude. Who started the car. crime you obviously. You didn't test drive that shit. You just stroke check and said drop it off at the hotel. Who started the car. Who knew how to start that car. Everyone When i didn't even gave and he he knew about the. You're like the bad. Probably like i said about you know but he knew about because i like man i love because like i say then kid me levin you know dude. That's amazing. could he even fit in. That car had to do to get in. I hear you man. It worked out for the most good edge so good. Listen before you go. And i appreciate this conversation so much. You made it. You made it in. It took a few ballots. But you got into the hall of fame. Did you ever at any point. did you think man. Maybe it's not meant to be maybe that call in common like that. This is a matter of time. It's number is number and once once your body of work is their weight on your opportunity because when you sit back and look at it and you say okay damn all you guys all the time. They don't even have the numbers that is had so. It's not one day where you sit there and worry about. If i was worried about it i would continue playing. I would continue playing the game. I need to get december. That i've done enough. You know what i'm saying. I knew i've done enough and it was just a matter of time. Edgy like you run on the right kind of fuel. You know what i mean like i. I respect anybody who feels like. Maybe they've been slighted and they're trying to prove the world wrong the run on different kind of fuel right. You're you're not like that man. You running on positive. Fuel right positively. Where did that come from as we have always been you know like why why. Be negative watson up there hold yourself back you know like say i'm gonna move forward regardless again. I don't get in moving forward. My day goes on and man. I have a blessed life. You know that i know people that that man things they got some bad breaks so i appreciate every day every opportunity to have it back in and rain on no party setting and complaining about nothing you know like the deal around complained pretty much a waste of time right. It's like a bunch of like. I just make whatever happened to have and make it happen. So what about that weekend. The induction ceremony because of the way the world is right now got pushed back the next august. Have you thought much about what that weekend's going to be like. What are you looking forward to. Most of going through the process that finding no go Get back you know. I'm looking forward to my. But you know i can't tell what but to be to no one aid because you know that's my main thing. October is fire prevention month. And we've teamed up with first alert. The most trusted brand in fire safety to help you get prepared for the unexpected and to review some key safety tips as an example smoke and carbon monoxide alarms help provide an early warning in the event of a home emergency and having enough first alert smoke and carbon monoxide. Alarms is one of the best things that you can do for both your home and your family. You want to install alarms on every single level and in every single bedroom of your home. Once those alarms are installed. It is important to maintain them by testing them with regularity. Also remember this alarms do not last forever. They do need to be replaced at least every ten years. If you cannot remember the last time to replace yours it is best to replace the unit completely as an option. My favorite is first alerts combination smoke and carbon monoxide alarm with a ten year sealed battery that way the alarm provides two for one protection against smoke and carbon monoxide and are gonna have to worry about changing the batteries for a decade for more information on fire safety products safety tips and educational activities. That you can do at home with your family. Just go to first alert dot com slash fire prevention month first alert dot com slash fire prevention month. How much pride you talking about the bust. So how much do you take in the fact that you never how you and i started this conversation. You have never changed for anybody. You achieved incredible success by being you and you didn't change the way you look the way you say you didn't change anything. You're always just edge. What does that mean to you. It means a lot because a lot of times you know when you when you were growing up the way people coming and putting your heads they. Hey they're not gonna like you if you're like this they're not gonna accept if you like this and they they kind of poison you or they they kind of put things on your mind and and they're not true you know it's like the game is about you know who can get out and play and perform. We can do things the right way you know. That's what is about. And i've always meant as long as i'm doing things the right way you long as i'm staying out of everybody we're not harming nobody is no way. I'm not going to get what i'm supposed to get you know. It's just a matter of when i get it. Sometimes you know if china apply for a corporate job or something like that and they may not haunt me. But we got my the things that i chose to do. I chose to play football. I had nothing to do with any of that. You know like long as long as i do my job. Everything is working up. Chicote really quickly in terms of your job. You're not just a guy who was like. Give me the ball. Wanna tote the rock. You're an extremely capable. Receiver out of the backfield. An excellent blocker. How much did you take and be able to do. All the things that came along with that gig and that mindset. But that's but that's what it's about. It's step by step by doing what you're supposed to it up that and say. Hey i need somebody to catch the ball. That's what may come available. They need somebody that can Block a linebacker. That's big news. Hey from highly. I wasn't home available. Daddy's the might of run the ball. You know hey. I've been doing that all my life. So that was my thing. Making sure that i'm available for everything that this game entails and i always prepared for that. You don't always get credit for the things that you do but for me. It's like when i get credit. You're not going never get enough credit for locking and taking on those responsibilities. They had nothing to do with when that linebacker sometime when they see me in the club they remember me. You know they remember that. Hey man dan you put. My daddy did this or that. You know what i'm saying. That's with that personal pride comes in and so that's the satisfaction i get. I was doing those things because it's not about them. It's about me when you're gonna see me on the knocking on my ass. And i'm cool and it's all fun and games left. Nah you won't see me handling my business. And if they get me getting going back out and that just a mind. I've always had a love. That when i start edge i could ask you about any teammate from the u. Or even in the nfl. I want to ask you about one dude. One of my favorite. Nfl players ever was bob sanders. I knew you only played a couple of years with stop. This dude was so fierce. Like what you remember about him as a teammate. And what did you think when you saw that guy flying around making plays the way. He did laying the lumber the way he did at that size man boston's out one of the best with injuries. Didn't didn't do it. did two calls boston. He played a game where it's supposed to be played. Not all that talking going and do what you're doing. He lets you know that size matter. Because if you look at bobby's okay. But his presence was felt you know. I was just happy. That was on the right side. 'cause bob come down and you give it to you and it's no fun edge. It's been a minute or so mandated so great to get caught up with you and have this conversation long form and that you made time for me. I know you're out with your fellas doing some being. I appreciate you so much. Thank you so much for doing that. What a great conversation that was right man. I understand how frustrating this might be. Especially if you're in a hurry or you're running late to find yourself stuck at a railway crossing waiting on a train and if the signals are going and the trains not there yet. You might even feel tempted to try to sneak across the tracks. Do not do it. Don't do it ever to the naked eye. Trains often appear to be further away and moving slower than they actually are. They can't stop quickly. Even if the engineer hits the emergency brakes right away it can take a train over a mile to stop over a mile to stop and by that time it's way too late and the result is a potentially deadly crash. The point is this. You can't know how quickly the train is going to arrive. The train can't stop quickly. Even if it does see you. It will end in disaster if the signals are on. The train is on its way in. You need to remember one thing you need to stop. Trains can't huge thanks to edge particular solid half hour atv and rapid me here. I was so good. That was awesome. Great skier caught up here. Some of those legendary stories. And i can't wait to hear what he has to say when he gets to can in the meantime make sure that you are subscribed so you do not miss any future episodes and if you've got a moment go ahead leave review and a rating. It really helps a lot and it's so appreciated next week. We are back with the all important episode number one hundred and fifty but until that milestone pod. Here are your voicemails. I knew message jim. Hey i don't think anyone ever got back with you on the host seven mile hike. Run recovery team. This is what i suggest you grab that cold heineken. Getting a shower start shower off. Hot sip that heineken. It's like having a beer. Hawaii every sip. Turn that shower down a little colder and by the end of the beer you have a cold. Shower that cools off the muscles prevent swelling works every time by message saved next message joe vega on delivering some packages in huntington beach. Listening to your show. You're listening to you or wow twenty years. Timmy goes back part of your show. They probably think bendtsen that was live. And one of those top notch colonies atkins. Forgive line and rattlers. You're awesome do congratulated on the hall of fame. I keep listening. I'm outta here out of this rolling for your man ups. All the way baby must have saved next mess. Ain't a box. This could break from the bay. I just called the tel. You thank you for the jungle car. Mo- carmel because you have my dog jason garrett own show and we go beat down the hoodie and tam and once again the tour stabbing opening was the greatest of the worst jobs you ever had but the best worst i've ever had was in sacramento. The first one not the second one in that cow town peace out when love running nine empire we coming back. You massive saved next message. Romi johnson and melvin. man. I'm back in the gym. Get my reps in on the voice mail now. I know what it's like to be an enforcer in the nhl when you get caught up from the minors you go out on your first shift and get knocked the hell out and get sent back to the minors before you get on that plane. But i'll be back room. I get more reps in in. I'll be ready. Guaranteed message saved next message. Roaming what's up. This is david from buffalo. The dodgers have won the world series. There's one thing we can guarantee math from. La is going to be calling and calling watt. He's going to be calling during interviews. When you have with dodger players. He's gonna be recapping every playoff game. Mad from la. You're going to be taking over the show this might not. It'd be the jim rome show where it might become the that from la show on cbs. Sports radio out next message in the immortal words of hacksaw her the butter knife from pacific beach to mission beach to power to santa zero to l. on to pacific palisades to westminster to huntington beach. React to me. The dodgers won the world series. Run say give me your reaction. Good night now. I can't believe i'm saying this as a padres fan. Al west wind good for you who ratchet relations peace message saved. You have no more messages. Dear john i'm leaving uncontrolled. High blood pressure is serious. And i can quit whenever i want. What can we get back to when you checked on me. I don't wanna leave. But remember when i quit. You quit sincerely your heart. Listen to your heart and don't let it quit on you. High blood pressure can lead to a stroke heart attack or death get yours to a healthy range today for help keeping yours at a healthy range text pressure to nine seven seven seven nine a message from the american heart association the american stroke association and the ad council. Wwe superstar del rio take one behold the angry giant try to get alburto hall angry giant perfect. Good luck tonight. We all that angry giant yea. Remain another one this is. Wwe superstar battery. It only takes a moment to make a moment. Take time to be a dad today. Visit fatherhood dot gov brought to you by the us department of health and human services and the ad council. It may be hard to believe but people just like you are already saving money feedthepig dot. Org makes it easy. Their simple savings plan teaches you how to start saving without going overboard. So you don't need to sell all your belongings and live in a commune. Hungary's belong to all of us now. Tom you don't need to get a second job as a stunt man you just need feed the pig dot org. Don't get left behind. Get tips and tools at feed the pig dot org brought to you by the american institute of cpa's and the ad council. I'm bobby light with today's car clinic. Minute trolls charge the cross bridges banks levy him to use. Atm's but i know and the. That's next best to free and good for the environment. When i come back. I'll tell you all about when your battery goes dead. Everything could come to a stop. Don't take a chance on. Getting stranded stopped by o'reilly. Oh parts and get your battery tested free of charge. If your battery does need to be replaced or reilly auto parts can help you find the exact superstar battery that fits your car. Truck at guaranteed low price o'reilly auto parts better parts. Better prices every day auto parts believe it or not. There's nothing that keeps two things green your wallet and the environment when purchasing a new battery for your vehicle. A core charge levied by the government is collected by retailers. So where's the good news trade in your old battery and the fees waived or if you forget to bring it with you just returned later and the court charge will be cheerfully refunded and environmental bonus. Used batteries kept out of. Landfills are collected from retailers and recycled. I'm bobby like us like us. You'll love us radio. It's been here all along. You know which station is going to tell you the score of the game where to turn when the weather gets something big happens. Good or bad. You know where to go. And now radio has evolved to move with you with the next radio app and your fm enabled phone. 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You're listening to the heartland newsfeed radio network. Mark man newsfeed dot com. This stream is supported by advertisers and contributions by follow us on facebook. Twitter and instagram will not stand for rigged and corrupt election. I'm joe chiro fox news. That's what president. Trump tweeted today about a rally in washington. Dc attended by tens of thousands of his supporters. The president drove by on his way. Go play this afternoon. This trump rally is the product of several groups in hashtags like for trump million maga- march and stop the steel bringing supporters. We've spoken to from florida georgia texas west virginia pennsylvania really all across the country canting four more years. Usa stopped the steel holding signs to count every vote vices. Richardson ten arrests reported for various reasons. President-elect biden spending the day in his delaware beach house meeting with transition advisors on who be his cabinet while taking a bike rider. Reporter asked him about it. Fox news has learned that potential candidates for secretary of state include president obama's former national security adviser. Susan rice delaware senator. Chris coons and connecticut senator. Chris murphy president-elect biden's also reportedly considering pentagon veteran michelle flournoy to head the pentagon the first four a woman. President trump continues to criticize new york governor. Andrew cuomo for setting up an independent state panel to review a coronavirus vaccine. The president saying the vaccine would only be sent to states would use it immediately but cuomo says his state is doing the same thing as seven other states we are ready now to receive the vaccine and then simultaneous with the fda approval our panel. Be looking at it. So there's no delay we're ready now. President trump tweeting cuomo should stop playing politics with a vaccine. America is listening to fox news. The president elect still not receiving a vital piece of daily information. Fox's john decker explains the presidential daily brief or pd the top secret daily briefing of the nation's most sensitive intelligence and is a key part of keeping the president fully informed that pd is coordinated and delivered by the office of the national intelligence director with input from the cia but as president trump continues challenging the election results. That pd is being kept from president. Elect joe biden breaking with tradition republican. Senators chuck grassley. Lindsey graham john thune and james langford have joined in calling for the trump administration to reverse its posture and permit. President elect biden to receive the pdb in washington. John decker fox news pakistan says it were present evidence to the united nations and other international bodies that india is involved with militant organizations in pakistan. Pakistani officials have long claimed that india sponsors violent groups impact. Stan claim that spend long denied by india. Costco is selling memberships to a very exclusive flying club. Fox's carmen roberts explains you're afraid of flying commercial while the pandemic rages. Costco has a solution for you. That is if you can spare seventeen and a half thousand dollars. The wholesale retailer is selling memberships to a private jet charter. Company called wheels up which allows members to book a private jet. The same way others book a ridesharing car. But if you feel. The price tag is too hefty. Some add-ons made persuade you among other things. A one year membership includes a thirty five hundred dollar costco shop card. So as a notre saying carmen roberts fox news. I'm joe chiro fox. If you need to hire you need indeed indeed delivers quality candidates so you can focus on hiring the person who is a good fit claim your seventy five dollars credit for your first post at indeed dot com slash fox terms and conditions apply work especially in these lean times. When many you're competing with will seem desperate in. I'll take anything mode if you convey specific interest in this job at this company. You will be conspicuous. Thus the value of going to school on the company you're applying to before the interview with money and attention so tight now. Effective communication skills have never been more important for more tips for job seekers and everyone else hit survival. Speech dot com. I'm holland cooke our spent volunteering at a local homeless shelter. Truly make her death at the hands of a drunk driver earlier this week. All the heartache. For this school and this community. I never knew amanda but everywhere i went there were touching reminders of the carrying french. She would have been to me. Had i known her. Losing amanda was one of the hardest things i've ever had to deal with but i knew i had to be strong for this community. I couldn't let them go through the funeral without my support and just so much better off so many people to which russell shaw with us right now. That's not quite how i would have recorded. The story seems a bit unprofessional. Its own notional. People are feeling pain. I feel to forget emotionally invested in a story know i had my tear ducts cauterize years ago and i like to keep my emotions stored and especially in my mind where they only come off my nightmares. The onion news network a. Hey it's free talk. Live live saturday edition the show. You can dial in here if you want to join us. Our toll free number is eight fifty five four hundred fifty free like freedom within studio tonight. You've got in the reverend captain here. I like those rolled ours. The i got two of them in their reverend end. Mark all right. We'll talk about whatever you want to discuss. But first up in the news and coming up captain kick ass story about The military quarantine. You wanna talk about an ultimate lockdown. That's what they've done apparently if he does this thing because they they have some important information that i'd like to share within this article about what happened. Yup and this is by the way as other cities and apparently entire states now are ordering reordering re lockdowns. It's back not that it ever really went away in any significant manner. But now it's worse. I believe biden has suggested a national lockdown as his his adviser guy. Yeah so we'll see a lot of fun. I want thank every biden voter out there. Well it's not over yet right. The official numbers haven't come in yet. From the the electoral college trump is certified by however would not like to thank them right. Trump is suing apparently in a few states So i mean i it could be that. They have some sort of hail mary at the very end but well like a solar golfing. Earth is less likely yes. So you're seeing. There's a chance there's a chance. I chance but that's all i'm going to say. Yeah i i don't know which. What do you call them. Old crooked server would be better or worse well anybody who lives under their rule. But i just don't want anybody to rule me me neither. But that's not what they want and get again. It doesn't matter who wins. We will lose. There will be less freedom to be had in the us and hopefully at some point the us will break up. And we'll see secession and all that but in the meanwhile they've got all kinds of rules that won't shut down your throat and this guy. Dr anthony bouchier who i don't know if he's even still working. Does he still worked for the trump administration. Did they fire him or whatever. I don't know i don't know but at one point. This was like the top doctor that the government was saying. You gotta listen and doing how could he only appeared after covert. Where was this guy for the rest of trump's term or whatever if he was trump's hells no but there's still put i mean if the government is going to make it their responsibility to be concerned about every citizen's health in some way shape or form and appoint the entire country fricken. Dr mama de de right. So he isn't the The other one w- there is a a somebody general surgeon general. That's not what he was. Now what the hell was he. He's like the the administration's epidemiologists basically so there's all kinds of doctors for all kinds of jobs. And he's the doctor for that job. And i i don't understand why the world has had this mass hysteria around these lockdowns. Because we've tried this and the best we can tell by looking at them like if you actually look at the numbers and trust the experts. These lockdowns have been of medical effect. How do you trust the experts when experts disagree right exactly. Well i think the article about the quarantine for the military that we've got on deck. Will shed some light on that. Very topic i think so too. So this dr fauci guy. New york post reporting that. He's got new corona virus guidance quote. Do what you're told. Yeah unquote nice in an interview. Thursday the coronavirus task force member and infectious disease. Expert pushed back on the notion that scientists were authoritarian for promoting strict lockdowns and social distancing measures. That is the definition of authoritarianism where they tell you what to do or else you'll be punished. And some scientists are definitely authoritarians others are not there the barrington declaration. The great barrington declaration with thousands of signatures on it. Some of whom are not you know science dr people but many of whom are three hundred of them are. I think there's more than that. Three thousand of them from all around the planet saying we disagree with these lockdowns. We disagree with all these mandates. So of course the ones that worked for the government are going to agree with it. That's how they got the job. There are people who are in search of power. They think they know so much about science or medicine or whatever. Their viewpoints should be inflicted on people with the threat of violence. Because that's what happens with government violence. I learned this at a young age from florida. As are you. Ian and every year would be some kind of tropical storm blow through sure chaplain last week. I think and it didn't matter even wear in the state at happened. That was the time to shine for the weatherman. Right i mean this. You just learned that you just couldn't believe what the predictions were and the weather man was going to get out there and he going to. He was going to push this moment for all that it's worth because his career depends on it. How's he going to go from being a weather. Man in sarasota. Florida to a weatherman in tampa. Or maybe even go crazy maybe houston or possibly new york city or whatever. Move up your ladder. Make more money and do these sorts of things. Well he's got to make a name for himself and he's not going to make a name for himself by going on predicting the weather in a state where it doesn't snow. i mean. Nobody watched the weather in florida. You keep you keep an umbrella your trunk and you're you're covered. You don't need to worry about the weather and so the weatherman would always make a big deal when it was his time to make a big deal. And that's what i see with this pandemic thing the epidemiologist that said you know this. Isn't that big of a deal. And or i wouldn't say that big of a deal. The has said well so far. We've run the numbers and we've been off by more than a factor of ten sometimes as high as a factor of fifty and. I'm beginning to think that maybe these models that we have are broken and perhaps these lockdowns are over prescribed. Maybe a lockdown should only be used in a location where you know. They're they're foreseeing. A problem with icu. Beds and by the way if a city is having a problem with icu beds at this point. that's just bad management. You've had almost a full year to figure it out. That's true. I mean it's not like a bad they. The hospitals are basically empty. Well people aren't going for procedures. In by the government certain governments went and actually found new locations to set up temporary hospitals. Kind of stuff they would set up you know in sports arenas or you know school ships. They'd roller shep into play. Yeah all that kind of stuff and then nothing happened so they tore them all down and went home and pack up the band. You know right. So but what. Your example with the weatherman There are at least that i've ever heard of in the united states. There are no weatherman. That have the so-called authority to force you to stay home right like they. They don't do sort of right like because they get to. If the weatherman manages to whip up the hurricane is it's going to be terrible badly enough then a local sheriff locks down the county or the local police chief locks down the city forces and evacuation of the barrier islands or whatever. It's basically at the word of the weatherman. I guess you could say and then maybe the government weathermen with the national weather service they do have some government whether men out there so the seven a seventy nine year old suggested the american spirit of independence had gotten in the way and the nation needed to follow their orders whether they liked it or not quote. I was talking with my uk colleagues. Who are saying. The uk is similar to where we are now because each of our countries have that independent spirit unquote fat. She said during a panel with other experts in washington. Dc he said as reported by cnbc. Quote i can understand that but now is the time to do what you're told. Man if either england or the united states had the independent spirit that this guy claims yacht in the way a all of these decisions would be being made by individuals. Do you want to lock down. Do you want to stay home. Do you want to isolate yourself until this thing passes over or until a vaccine. Well then you're welcome to that. Do you not want to do that okay. Well you're welcome to do that as well right. These decisions being made on an individual basis if either of those geographic areas had the independent spirit. Which i posit they do not. It's if it does exist. Barely exists there. Only a scant. Few people here in new hampshire and the rest the dates. I don't think i. I mean i think they'd be unwise to do a lockdown right now doing it Well in certain locations but in other locations if people are just breaking the lockdown then they just you know remember when they said that certain places are ungovernable just a few months ago regarding the same issue here your calls and thoughts. Welcome eight fifty five four fifty free. What happened to the independent spirit. It's still there. Do you want more businesses accepting bitcoin. Cash and dash now with any pay you earn passive income for every purchase at those businesses finally financial incentive to spread bitcoin cash dash. You made it happen so you get the rewards download the any pay cash register app at your crypto currency wallet addresses then install it at a real life business and tell us what you did at any pay inc dot com any pay inc dot com so when we brought him home. We didn't realize that bear. The rescue dogs was actually sick. He had very flaky skin. He was dropping a lot a firm. And did you steroid injection dog food. Nothing seemed to work so that was at a dead end v. i t. e. dot com hearing on the radio for years. It never ashley proc my mind and try it until it finally sunk in. Oh you're talking about hair and skin and i'll try well. It took probably six weeks but after we started using died alight. No more flaky. Skin doesn't scratch and make sure to put weight. On gyn of i is attrition. i wish that we would've started the dinovite. Right away would have been so much. Easier won't be lead. How happier dog. We'll be every rescue dog in. America deserves dynamite. For ninety days dot been pretty good investment for free talk live. Their ad campaign started in september. Two thousand nineteen from mid march to mid july. The value soared by ten times. It's not too late davies. New wallet hasn't even released yet and other things are happening that i can't even say on the radio. If you want to invest and potentially do well go to divvy project dot org. I can tell you that f. t. l. is deepening. Its partnership with the guys from divvy project dot. Org past performance is not an indication of future prophet. Divvy project dot org the i. Project dot org free talk. Live is the downsize dc dot org. Yeah system for responding to my congress critters talking to right to the thieves and liars in washington. Dc and in these letters they outline the issue for me and then they flush it down the toilet and it's so demeaning they just don't care what i think i can tell you. Pretend like he cares if he's trying to get elected the only care what you think. If you're giving them a check with five digits on then you might be able to get them to do something. But that's just one senator among the five hundred thirty five disgusting dishonorable thieves. What's a guy to do these lobbying groups they run washington washington has been taken over. It does not belong to the american people. it doesn't do anything for the american people. 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Do you want farm city the burbs or forest. Do you want a duplex or multifamily buildings. So that renter's pay your mortgage their homes in all price ranges in new hampshire and mark and help with financing to invest in liberty and property mark warden can help kids on real estate dot com. Love what we do. Please help support our international satellite channels at patron dot heller n. dot fm that's patriae on that l. Dot fm free. It's free talk. Live dial in toll free. We're not telling you what to do. But that's what the government goons are doing is must dial toll free eight five five three seven three three whether you want to or not. It's your government duty You got this character. Who saying that. He's telling people that the independent spirit has gotten in the way of good health and therefore it's time for americans to do what they're told and obey the state obey their masters in government. Because you know they serve you or something like so. How is it that the person who supposedly serves you get to tell you what to do when you work when you read that bit during the first segment and your tease for this article all i could hear while you were talking about. It was if you drive your the son. Of course right. Yeah it seems like these. I don't. I don't know the reason they hold onto this lockdown thing. There aren't good numbers. If the lockdown our up really irked cases are up. You'd be able to pointed lockdowns and say this worked and it worked by this percentage. Well no he saying it would work if people would just do what they're told back in march people were doing what they were taught enough of them. You need to do everything they tell you to do. You can't go out you. Can't i mean like the the funny thing is is that they left a grocery stores open and people continue to go to grocery stores. I don't know how it all continues. You're going to eat if you don't do that. Well garden 'cause there's not most people don't if if they really wanted a two week like global lockdown and they really made it harsh. That would be interesting to see what those would do to the numbers. Tell you what not eating government cheese again okay. I was a poor kid growing up and there was a a bit of time where my mom's single on the welfare and we had the government cheese. We had frigging powdered milk. Right is a box of kind of looked like instant mashed potatoes. We have as powdered milk. Powdered milk powder. They'll cut at our house too but it was largely in case we didn't get freshman. This was government powdered milk along with the government cheese which were both horrible products. But if you wanna know what. A total lockdown. We'll do mark. Captain has those numbers. We've actually got that because the military did one yet. Complete obedience by right so if you're gonna break those rules if you wanted to find out. Even this is from the american institute for economic research. Hold that thought. We'll get into it but first your own is on the line and bring him on drum in south carolina. You're on free talk. Live go ahead. yeah. I just wanted to bring some retard about the virus skepticism over no have skepticism over the government and i don't really care about the virus. Okay one hundred and thirty Agents secret service agents tested positive or warranty. Put a buyer. Hey the macedonian. Going all of that. Because they didn't know if they died there'd be headlines secret service agent. You know oprah we now know see what trump did there was one headline about the kindergartener who died of covid right to like scare people. One kindergartner hopefully not on Look i i heard a comment. I wouldn't send tears. I heard a comment this week on local radio by cloudy charlie jams. He said colbert nineteen. Who's a blessing to democratic product. 'cause so they could use this to have kids trump out. That's true we had nothing to do with. A blessing doesn't mean that you had something to do with it. A blessing means that the democratic party benefited from it. I've used it for their their agenda. They they were pounding two hundred thousand people. Trump has killed two hundred thousand people. That sounds very much like a blessing. Doesn't it bet a disgusting comments all right for someone to see because they haven't been affected by whatever you're feeling is it disgusting or not is become true. It's not true it's not true. Now look what was it about dirty. What about us by john. Mail ho ho. You will not get me to say that one. One party is less dirty than the others politics and yucky yucky game. And it's only going to get worse by the sounds of it as time goes by. I mean we're we're descending into idiosyncrasy in my very lifetime but but here let me let me just say what's the politicians favorite thing. Never let a good crisis go to waste i. I don't care what side of the aisle you're on. What kind of politician you are. What kind of party you represent. If you're a politician and you let a good crisis go to waste. Then that makes you a bad politician. Look there's all comes from his doorstep. He is the one that had the secret little confab with bob woodward when he said hey bob i know it's really bad okay. I know it's really dangerous. And then he gives up front. Oh maybe three hundred million people or television depending on who's watching. Who's a rider. The guy who wrote the book about him remember. Yeah ok okay. Well trump being in office and he gets up in front of everybody. Just don't worry about the democratic hoax is going to the. I mean look. Trump is putting on a mask. He's jumping through the hoops. He's telling people to you know follow orders recall a lot. That's why would he put on a mask if he if he actually believes. Don't worry about it. Look harder and thirty secret service agents tested to european yourself at this point who cares great together. I don't care if secret service. Agents tested positive. Everybody's gonna patient patient. Zero covid trump. Got it from somebody to presumably a secret service agent. No he got it from listening to those. Eighty doctors have savers movable life when he had to go to the hospital. How about all the people who've been staying home jerome and have gotten the covid any way in fact we're gonna get into that up here and thank you for the call tonight because there are a lot of people that have had spread to them even though they'd been locked down and like it's my opinion that pretty much everybody's gonna test positive for it at some point. I don't intend to take the because even if they do develop a vaccine. Show me appoint history. Where like a vaccine eradicated a disease. Well the smallpox okay. Did it radically the disease or did did humans develop an immunity. It eradicated the disease. Yeah outside of that. I i would challenge. The vaccine would be as is that. Where is the vaccine for the common cold. So cold is a corona virus or at least so there's several things that are called the flu virus or the flu vaccine you know. Kill the flu virus. No there's so many images. Yeah there's also. Flew flew fluent. Also a corona virus not not coronavirus now Flu vaccines different but The common cold isn't corona virus at one of one of the things called the common cold is corona virus so far we haven't seen a vaccine for that at all and we have really no evidence that vaccine at this point is anything but a but a sugar water shot where they say circle circle dot dot. Now you've got you. Could he shot and they patch on the the fan and saint john home. I make you feel that you've gone through your religious ritual for the state and now you're okay. Yeah you're gonna be okay. Citizen toll free numbers eight fifty five four fifty free. 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Free talk live. Live saturday show. Dial in toll free you bring up whatever you want our numbers fifty five four fifty free and we have our matrix chat server you can go and interact with other free talk live listeners. They're over at chat dot. Fm actually not the server itself. It's a webpage gives you instructions on how to connect to the server in fact on the matrix survey just made a new room Called federated chat. What does that mean. It means that people from the rest of the matrix. There's all these different servers out there running the same server software and they are federated together. Meaning that you can connect from one to the next if the server allows you to. Is that like in the movies and the comic books. They connect to different universes. Yeah think about it like that on the portal. 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The vast selection of witty poignant pithy and downright bombastic liberty oriented messages at liberty stickers dot com. Go to your phone calls and thoughts. We got Jay z up. I in manchester new hampshire jay z. You're on free talk. Live yeah hilarious. Go with charles okay charles. What's on your mind tonight. I just wanna share the good cheer and the blessings of being in new hampshire. I recently moved. I moved to new hampshire in the past two weeks. And i want you and i have actually met before. I want to share with everyone on your radio station. How amazing and special new hampshire place is government dunes. You were mentioning are gonna have a hard time telling five thousand libertarians to sit up in our shut up in doubt. Tell me charles where you came from. I am a dc refugee though. I the swamp per se the district of suburbs. So what were you doing in dc for work and. Could you find similar work in new hampshire that workout for you. Let me tell you some of the amazing thing that. I've come across when coming in new hampshire. I'm thought service and twenty twenty. Was the year of everyone losing their jobs. I was listening to your radio. Show talking about how you met. Twelve people who in all of them lost their jobs. I'm one of those people. Well i came up to new hampshire and within two weeks. I got accepted her job and i'm starting on friday though. Jobs are a dime a dozen right now. Anybody that wants to anybody that wants to work can find work. You throw a stone and you're gonna you're gonna hit five different businesses Help wanted signs in their windows or and signs of the side of the road you know like warehouse eighteen dollars in fifteen bucks an hour for some things and yeah so people definitely need workers businesses. That can't open to the hours that they want to. Because they can't find is not because it's not cuza corona per se. It's because they can't find people willing to work during those During those hours the twenty four hour restaurant. I know that's not twenty four hours right now because they don't have the workers so it's crazy of the workers are waiting for that Six hundred dollars a week to come back to what they're doing But so So charles what was the inspiration. Was there some sort of You know straw. That broke the camel's back. What what was it that made you finally decide all right. I'm leaving dc. I'm coming to new hampshire as part of this freedom. Migration turnley twenty twenty and Over encroachment of government on us the will of the people when they locked down. Virginia where i was because i was in a little farm farm area of the dc area. And when i walk down. And then i didn't have any work. And because i'm i kind of weird set up. So i wasn't able to get the government you know milk. Though they left me they left me. Charming and i was living with a girlfriend. And i was just kind of looking at my life. And it's one of those things where it's like. You have to look like and go as this what i want the rest of my life to be stuck in the middle of nowhere with no community of people who are going to resist against the tyrannical forced that is bearing down on us. We're you like the only person in your circle of friends there in dc. Who was you know. Maybe opposing the idea of mask mandates or lockdowns or anything like that. Did you feel kind of lonely or did you have any backup. I maybe had well sort of a degree. Because ultimately i have one friend but i think hard to chat with him because he's kind of a hard core conservative and while i don't necessarily disagree with i. I'm not trying to get in a fight with anyone. But it's hard to have conversations with people sometimes dogmatic. Tell me what's different. I mean you've been here for two weeks calling for manchester new half you. You made the migration here from dc successfully. What are some of the striking differences that really kind of you noticed right away. Because i'm in a better mood or as the people around here i'm sure you your thoughts do create your own reality but let me tell you pretty much ever. I've been going. I've been getting miles and you know. Some people are messed up. But i often find are the. If i'm shopping. There are other guests. Who are not wearing masks. And we're having a great time. We're chatting were laughing. Were having a blast and for me. I've never seen mcdonald's where. I'm working mcdonald's right next to my new place of business is hiring for thirteen dollars an hour. Let me tell you. I know the minimum wage here is probably seven dollars. Eight dollars. thirteen dollars containing chart. How can mcdonald's be able to pay someone thirteen dollars an hour. it's harder than the minimum wage. Like people are complaining but they're not willing to work. They're not willing to put the nose to the guards stone for say yeah. There's probably some place in northern new hampshire out in the sticks with mcdonalds where somebody's getting paid minimum wage. Perhaps it could be but the what we are is proof positive. The minimum wage is a pointless activity of mickey mouse economics. You don't need it. There shouldn't be a national minimum wage in so much as obviously people in rural mississippi. Don't need to get paid people in york city or anchorage or like it's different economies needed different wage for different things and the that flexibility but in new hampshire. I don't know anybody who's getting paid the minimum wage. So you're saying that people were like having a good time. You're talking with people in is at the grocery store the mcdonald's wherever and seems like a different kind of a vibe or are you saying that like in dc everything is subdued. Everyone's quiet they're just shuffling. Unlike this is a big contrast. Is that what you're saying. It's it's funny. You mentioned i. I was really in the district of criminals to a degree because being about twenty minutes in the suburbs of dc much connected to with the majority of contractors or their cronies. And let me just tell you. No one's very happy around there. The cost of living is outrageous People are pretty miserable. I have it just wasn't a lot of good. Cheer to be spread around pretty much every everyone keeps to themselves and saying hello to your neighbors. Maybe a thing of the past. I was able to experience a little bit more later on but compared to here. It's like a huge difference. Isn't that interesting. Because like when i walk around i find it depressing here like. There's so many people that are in masks and to me. The the the feel of new hampshire has changed over the last year. Because it was more like to me what you're describing whereas previously would. It wouldn't be uncommon to share a smile and a quick conversation with somebody in an aisle at a at a grocery stores. Somebody asks you a question about whatever right or you just saying hello to somebody and making eye contact with the measure walking down the street. I don't see those things happening. Like like they used to. People seem to be masked up most for the most part. But it's interesting having somebody come here from the outside and we. We had this experience with these guys that were here. Last night. The dozen people that are visiting from all around the northeast here in keene this weekend and actually they're they're in the seacoast tonight but That you know these folks and there's guys that have become from connecticut over the last few weeks to visit us. They're like wow. It's so great here by comparison. You know we're coming from a lake man. it's terribly or what are you talking to us. It's it's awful because it's not what it was. Perspective is everything with that regard but Charles i just wanna say welcome and thank you for for coming here and joining us. Yeah feel free to call in again with any other. Observations is like the new guy you know. What are some of the differences. What are some of the striking contrast that you'll you'll be noticing. I appreciate your call tonight. Charleston welcome again to new hampshire. That's awesome. I love this as people are coming here in. I would say record numbers recently certainly to visit and i think also move as well. I think we're gonna see that accelerate over the next few months eight hundred five four hundred fifty free like freedom do the letters. Irs give you anxiety. I'm dan pilla for more than forty years. My book how to get tax. Amnesty created the tax resolution industry and is responsible for helping hundreds of thousands of people. It can help you if you're a non filer or facing irs enforcement right now. Your case is unique. You need real help not cookie cutter advice. My clients get my personal attention by my book at the end pillow dot com and get a free consultation directly with me. That's dan pilla dot com. Let's start solving your tax problem right now. At eight years of age. I noticed dramatic energy to climb atra five day workweek. I had to use one of my days all to rest and recover. I also had cut my gym business down from three times a week to once a week since i began using green meadow away. My energy level has greatly improved. I no longer have to take a day to recover. i have increased. My gym visits back to three times a week. I'm actually more active in feeling better now than i have in the last five years. It's so nice to wake up in the morning. Feeling good and ready to go before trying. Re-met away. I must try. Every way protein product on the market and everyone of them caused me bloating gas constipation. I've had no such issues with three meta way. In fact on sleeping better vision has improved and surprisingly. My emotional and mental state has also improved. I love with green meadow. Way has done for me. Be met away comes from milk derived from grass castro cows to order call eight eight eight nine eight three three two five or visit metal way dot com. What if you could cut your heating bills this winter with your existing would bring her place and not spend thousands doing it. You can with great wall of fire. Fireplace grates are. Us patented made in america wall of fire grates increase fireplace. Efficiency eliminate fireplace smoke problems and come with a thirty day. Money back guarantee cr greats inaction and get free shipping from wall of fire dot com or call eight hundred two seven four seven three six four fireplace heat without fireplace. Smoke wall of fire dot com on free talk live. We're bringing people to the ideas of liberty. Every day from wrestling superstars live. Plen- jacobs you guys really are having an impact. I believe like. I said a lot of where i am. Now is due to listening to free talk live. You changed my mind on some very important issues. Years ago to random people tuning in on the radio i was stuck in the left right. Paradigm meyer your show by chance on saturday night from there. I went on during the day project in become an amplifier. So i mean. That's really the reason why i am is because i know that if it wasn't for you guys being on the are never would have found the ideas of liberty. You're ample directly change. More lives by getting free. Talk live in front of people looking for talk radio online and on the air. When you an free talk live you get perks. Like access to the ample facebook group and amp podcast visit amp dot freetalklive dot com. Some of you asked. And now we've delivered l. dot. Fm's live keene. New hampshire studio shows are now streamed in hd on twitch visit our channel at twitch dot l. r. n. dot fm and. Give it a follow. If you have amazon prime you get one free subscription on twitch if you use it on our channel which will give l. r. and fm monthly piece of your prime subscription cost. So please watch follow share and subscribe to twitch dot l. r. n. dot fm that's twitch dot l. r. n. dot fm. So you've signed the shire society declaration and are planning your move to new hampshire to be around more liberty oriented people next sign up for the shire society forum at forum dot shire society dot com. There are a bunch of people there who are already in the shire and they want to meet you. If you're already in the shire physically you should also come by the forums. Remember not everyone uses facebook. New people are signing up for the shire society forum every month so drop in and say hello at forum dot shire society dot com. This is the liberty radio network broadcasting the latest liberty oriented audio content. Twenty four hours a day at l. Rn dot fm. This free talk live. You can bring up anything here. Toll free number is eight hundred fifty five four fifty free doughnut. The military did a total lockdown. And we'll give you the results here in just a moment. It's ian captain kick ass and mark in the studio. Of course you can bring up anything that you want here. I do want to tell you about. Bitcoin dot com where you can go to learn the basics about bitcoin and bitcoin cash crypto currency in general go to bitcoin dot com. Click on the getting started or get started there and you can watch it two or three minute long video that will give you the basics about how and what it what it is. It makes bitcoin so special and makes it such a world changing technology and once you get the grasp on that it's not hard. He's going to spend a little bit of time. There's other videos if you want to dig in deeper but two or three minutes. It's really all you need and you will have the The basic understanding. You need to learn about these things and then you might be tantalized to learn more. In which case. There's a ton of stuff and information there including their news site over at news dot. Bitcoin dot com updated every day with fresh information from across the planet about the world of crypto currency. It's bitcoin dot com. let's go to bj. He's in columbia south carolina. Listening to w q accel. Fm go ahead dj. Good evening gentlemen. Thank you for taking the call. Certainly go ahead. I called because I heard a another person from south carolina call and was listening to what he had to say. I've heard this man on several occasions. you know spew vitriol about certain politicians now as a qualifier I am not a registered political party. Any anything down a registered voter but this man seems to spew out these things that this person said and that person said speaking about trump tonight and I i'd like to. Maybe here's some of his sources. Because these things i've never heard and i'm pretty in tune to what were you specifically referring to when you say you've never heard. Was there one or two things in specific that you've never heard well he was talking about they the tova and how trump was encouraging somebody or he was speaking with somebody about something and a writer given an interview and and he said such and such and such and and You know this is the rome's pretty good. Because i've never heard of anybody else. Never read it anywhere So i'm kinda wondering You know i know he is a partisan and and I just i just kinda it hurts me. The way he he just spews nonsense. Not jerome is on other shows. Jerome is just an example of your typical partisan right. Somebody who has thrown in their lot with one particular camp and camp says they're going to go ahead and parrot what they say and all the other. The other side is bad. Whatever it is that they do the your camp is always right. The other camp is always bad. It's very tribal. Kind of your camp is wrong. You must protect your camp because it's writer than the other side and if you don't stand with your Camp than the other camp will win. And it's i mean you know. It's it's basically what politics tries to make us into voting the party line right And i remember rush. Limbaugh one point going on the air and saying he was no longer carry water for the republicans. Then you know day then the next day carrying water for the republicans. This is the this. Is the conundrum if you believe that one party is superior to the other and you're you're gonna just sort of end up You know naturally gravitating to that because why not and really would what happens is is that you know. There's plenty of people in both parties. That are just political animals that are in it to enrich themselves to To punish the people that they don't like in to reward the people that they do and that's just the nature of politics and has been for a very long time. And somehow we all get tricked into this notion that well we need them but yeah they're liars and thieves and in some cases can't trust them killers and you can't trust them and i wouldn't let him. I wouldn't let him hold my wallet. Let alone watch my kids or whatever but we have to have them and we don't that maybe and all that is true i You know but at one point in your life you decide. Hey i need to do my own homework. And i need to know what's really going on and you know i i mean i noticed around There was a new story that came out about nancy pelosi having her big dinner for Well you know the welcome. The new Congress people You know and and I'm sure no mass will be involved. You know once they get behind the closed doors together. Event gavin and. Yeah right out neo. He was not complying with his own rules and then had to come out and sing mea culpa Before the audience masks for me not for not for me. That's exactly what it's all about. You know he you know he took that mask off knowing that he was taking it off and hoping that he wouldn't caught because he's he's done it hundreds of times before and these people locked down. I mean this guy has the audacity the hubris to lock you down doesn't wanna follow. His hubris got gas. Pj thanks for the call tonight. I appreciate hearing from you. And i tell you what jerome gets more phone calls than i would say the average topic on free talk live. Every time he calls in people have something to say in fact there was another. Call that most hampshire. I don't think he's going to put him on the air. Put him on the air. He's a divisive host like yeah. He's not a libertarian. We don't need to move into new hampshire. We have people who aren't they should move here. They stay where they are. Thank you for the call. Bj definitely appreciate it. Sure i like him from afar lake. We don't need to encourage people who are not liberty minded to move here in fact. We need to discourage people in fact we do. Encourage the status to leave new hampshire be like. Hey you know you're not far from vermont and massachusetts like the evil alternate universe of the free state project. Oh yeah we already have the nanny state project where you move to. It was called the free lunch project where you convince people to move out of the state of divider. Yeah there was the nanny. State project was specifically massachusetts. That was way long before But yeah i mean you know. New hampshire is such a small state. You're always no more than thirty five miles from utopia if your status go on. Is there a new hampshire town called utopia. No utopia is maine vermont off. See everybody claims. The -tarian the eric is that they want this utopian society when no it's actually the opposite of that. It's if you believe that having a government is the way to solve your problems then you are utopian because you believe that. That is the correct way. Even though it doesn't work right you think that violence is going to make things better. Because that's what the government game. We just apply the right amount of violence to our problems. We can solve them. Let's talk too bad slave. He's on the line in new hampshire. Your free talk live out doing. You're on the air all right great. Thank you I you know you guys keep forgetting to mention you. You know jerome. Just you know bitching about cases and I dunno hundred twenty or whatever. The number was the test that they do the pcr tests which is the one that they can do quickly is in focus if asbestos fifty percent accurate. Didn't he lawn. Musk just tweet out. That he got four tests in like two of them came back positive and two of them came back negative. We know somebody who got who got a positive rating on a test. They didn't take right in on the own the domain less than ideal you. You've gotta tell jerome rome. At least half of those are false positive and and they you know the numbers have been reduced by ninety four percents out that hundred and twenty thousand number per per death rate the town. I should say what do you mean. They've been reduced. No they like you know a little over nine thousand ten thousand the real cova debt a co morbidity and they have the center for disease control released list. That said well. It's probably up to close to ten thousand at this point if not ten thousand that That there were only ten thousand deaths that only listed covert as the cause of death. And i think that this is a very important thing. It's not that. I'm looking for Grandma's around the country to be dead or anything. My mother's seventy nine years old. Obviously i don't want her to get it. But i mean it when you start looking at. Who's getting covid. It's often people smoke. I mean the median age eighty or was at one point. So you're talking about eighty year olds with diabetes. Who are morbidly obese. It's not like relive long anyway. I don't think you get to eighty if you're morbidly obese to begin with but some of the people that were younger that had problems were morbidly obese from what i understand. Thank you for your call. We got our to next. This is free talk live. You can join us on the radio. Having taken her father's throne. Syra calhoun fallout. With one of our best allies and her brother nathaniel heads into imperial philadelphia with reckless plan. And burgle thomas armed with new powers. New allies aims to remove sara from her throne and for the world of the living to survive and to gain the strength. she needs to find an impossible war. Sarah must unite the mound builder. Kings act an agent right that will propel her. Beyond mortality servant daughter mighty. Jay butler is the newest entry in the dragon award winning which he wore series. Babe looks at bain books dot com bear. The rescue dog had very flaky. Skin trapping a lot of firm and martin do steroid injection. I was at a dead end v. I t dot com probably six weeks after we started using dinovite. No more flaky. Skin doesn't scratch it edged awesome. How happier dog will be every rescue dog in american deserves dynamite for ninety days. Vip the new fourth edition of healing. Our world the compassion of libertarianism. We'll take your understanding of liberty to a deeper level and has over thirteen hundred updated references new cartoons and a foreword by dr ron paul with discounts for multiple book purchases. The fourth edition of healing. Our world is a great gift for the liberals pragmatists environmentalists and christians in your life. Who think libertarianism is cold hearted get yours today at healing dot freetalklive dot com and use promo code f. T. l. for five dollar discount. So you've heard all three hours of the latest episode of free talk live and you're still hungry for liberty oriented audio content. Did you know that we have another twenty. Four seven audio stream at l. aren dot. Fm the liberty radio network airs. The latest episodes of some of the best liberty oriented podcasts on the internet around the clock in addition to record content. You'll also hear live shows like free. Talk live originating from our keene new hampshire studio so listen anytime at l. dot fm. That's been dot. You're listening to heartland newsfeed. Radio network live twenty four seven at heartland newsfeed dot com. This stream is supported by advertisers and contributions by you follow us on facebook twitter and instagram building. His cabinet. I'm joe chiro fox. News president elect. Joe biden has transitioned advisers that his delaware beach house today continuing to discuss who should be in his cabinet. Progressives trying to sway in their way. If i'm right movement have their own wish-lists for biden cabinet picks they want him to choose congressman receded to leave as hud secretary and congresswoman prominence giant pal as his. Hhs secretary and senator warren as treasury secretary but bloomberg reports the top contender for that role. Right now is former fed chair janet. Yellen fox's hillary vaughn in rehoboth beach fox. News is told former ambassador. Susan rice is being considered for a secretary of state washington. Dc inundated today by thousands of supporters of president trump and his legal challenges to the election. The president today again tweeting that he will win. There are so many legal challenges that he is fighting in court specifically in pennsylvania pushing ahead with attempt to block results from being certified in the keystone state although results will be certified on november twenty third. The campaign experienced three blows in pennsylvania. Courts all dealing with the counting of ballots now the secretary of the commonwealth kathy book out with a bit of news She will not order a recount or re canvas. because president-elect biden's lead was so significant. Fox's david spot northeast governors this weekend holding a virtual emergency summit on the coronavirus surge while connecticut governor ned lamont and self quarantine after a stafford tested positive. The us reached another record for confirmed daily cases on friday new restrictions going to place many areas including new york or bars restaurants and gems have to shutdown by ten pm. North dakota as implemented a new mask mandate america is listing. The fox news. The united states army announced the identities of five soldiers who were killed in a helicopter accident earlier in the week while serving as part of peacekeeping operations in the middle east and aims at five american soldiers killed in a black hawk. Helicopter crashing egypt's sinai peninsula thursday thirty one year old captain said vana camp from katy texas 34-year-olds w three dallas garza from fayetteville north carolina twenty-seven-year-old. Cw two more gabor for marlboro massachusetts. Thirty five year old staff. Sergeant kyle mckee painesville ohio and twenty three year olds. Sergeant jeremy sherman from what sika one american remains hospitalized in very serious condition is the deadliest crash. The us military this year at the pentagon tomlinson fox news chicago taking drastic measures to prevent the spread of the coronavirus. Fox's charles watson reports with ten point seven confirmed cases in the us and more expected as infections grow larger. we're starting to see officials move toward tightening restrictions. It started with chicago that city. Reinstating that stay at home. Advisory response to surge in corona virus infections. The advisory sorts. Monday and is expected to last at least thirty days mayor lori lightfoot urging folks not to leave their homes for anything other than essential needs the city is also advising people not to have visitors in their homes and to avoid non-essential travel including the upcoming thanksgiving holiday. Other states implementing covid restrictions include new mexico and oregon and qualcomm has received a license from the us government to sell four g mobile phone chips to china's technologies company. It's an exemption to the us trade restrictions imposed in september on china which also blocked wise access to chip design software and fabrication tools. I'm fox news if you need to hire. You need indeed indeed delivers quality candidates. So you can focus on hiring. The person who is a good fit claim your seventy five dollars credit for your first post at indeed dot com slash fox terms and conditions apply nothing not valued by the market. Want to help. You can join our satellite fundraiser. For just two dollars a month that fund dot l. r. dot fm if we raise enough to keep both channels on the air. Awesome if we raise more. I'll add more channels if now we can shut them down and go internet. Only it's up to you. Thank you for your support. Fund dot l. r. n. dartmouth. Last night's victoria's secret fashion show was a ratings winner particularly with men who don't know that actual pornography exerts the angel's feather costumes and silk. Nightgowns were hit with thirty to thirty five year. Old male viewers who had no idea that new images of all the models easily accessible on the internet and the show did equally well with ten to twelve and a half year. Old boys who will go to have their minds blown when they finally get around. The parents internet bloggers. Cbs executives touting the broadcast as breakthrough programming for people who are excited by the tops of boobs produce. Dave mitchell told variety quote the two point. Five million dollars fantasy bra. It's a big draw with women. Who shop at victoria's secret and an even bigger draw with men who've never seen or heard about sex before the runway show drew expected outrage from the christian family research council executive director kathy rows charged the event degrades women by a justifying them most likely because she's never seen a ukrainian prostitute receivable caucus shower from gang of crackdown healthy indian team a free. It's free talk live. You can dial in toll free if you want to join us on the radio you can talk about anything you want all the.

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Heartland Newsfeed Radio Network

Heartland Newsfeed Radio Network

3:01:00 hr | 5 months ago

Heartland Newsfeed Radio Network

"He's a he's a broadcaster so he has he has issues with timing. You always took time to call in to give reports of what's going on in daytona and for that alone and for everything else that that don't have time to thank you for. I think you will thank you bobby. In one other memory is when w e be switched over and went from. Am only two fm ninety. Three five and it was at ten o'clock on a saturday morning literally. I think it was about maybe ten minutes fifteen minutes after the hour and i called in and while i was talking to you we flip the switch and turn on the fm signal for the first time on w. and ep well and that is really a cool. So we actually have made made history. And and i will say this for all of you out there in radio. Land and for radio host and radio owners and and pd's program directors in general managers radio station. We started nineteen ninety-one or four station in in two states. And w and e be with one of them since then w. in db and affiliate stations and they're five of the stations are so as i remember terry has been bought and sold. I think five times and for a radio program to steal air on the same network. The same station through to ownerships is a big deal. But through four or five ownerships only says that what a great connection i have enjoyed with daytona in ormond beach folks there and with w india be and the management of w in from the bottom level to the top level has always been first class and i know that for a fact because i have been treated show well in in in over the top not just today my last day but from the very first day show for that i wanna thank you and everyone else that i don't know behind the scenes to thank you for calling in the day. Thanks bobby and also got thank you. I got up early and cut the grass and then came into listen. It started raining. The minute i came in. So thanks for letting me get up early and dress host. Of all bobby. Thanks the ride. Well i intend. You're you're welcome. And terry i will say this After today i'm gonna take my foot off the pedal and i'm going to enjoy the ride for my retirement. I thank you buddy. I love you and stay in touch. Take care there. you go. Folks doesn't get much better than that. Okay so we're going to go to The next caller up with the tom left. Jim in binghamton has been on for a while. Jim thanks for holding. Welcome to bobby like his car clinic. Our our fundamental first of two hours broadcast today. I just wanted to wish you well. said day for for me. Even my wife is in mourning for me. Your wife is in mourning for herself because now she's going to have to put up with you saturday morning because i'm not going to meet their yet but But i really appreciate your help over the years and enjoyed your show I spent some time there shang lot when they used to drag races years ago. There we used to go there and watch I got one question. One last question for you. Okay turning air conditioning. okay. I've got a tractor a john deere tractor and close with air conditioning. I can't on a hot day when it's up in the nineties. I mean it gets warm. And they're you know if it's in the seventies relatively cool. I checked it with my gauge. I mean in the green area to oh fifty five or fifty pounds per square in straight at the maximum Which says i've got enough reality in it. I checked the filters they're clean. Okay stop right here. Number one fifty psi on the low pressure is too much this. The physical properties of refrigerant means that goes from liquid to gas which means it evaporates depending on whether it's our one thirty four a or the old a free on or the new one to three At a certain pounds per square inch and that is nowhere near fifty is belowthe thirty and so you're low side is too high. So you've got a either a cooling system or overcharge or what have you but that's what you have to fix. The low side is too high. You have to have no more than two to fifty nine high and no more than thirty on the low side show. Check your Your check system because that's where the problem is and then ultimately you may have to add ten to the tractor windows to get the cooling that you really would like to have. So they could pressure is off. It goes right into the reds compressor. Yeah well when it goes off at so. Yeah it's going to equalize in the low in hodge gonna join hands but but i will tell you still. It needs to be evacuated and recharged by a machine. Okay all right my friend. Thank you take care less. Got blessed to you. We have other calls in the queue. we also have another hour coming up and we only have a short period of time. that's all the time that we have for this hour. Bobby like his cartooning. I wanna thank you for tuning in for twenty nine years. And i think all of our great team our crew. Diane summer the executive vice president. John irving our our car clinic producer. Jonathan sloane jack of all trades and master of miniature come and millie schaefer are candu will do callscreener. Finally angel dome angel helped us with every issue in a new york city satellite starting with abc and then westwood one. What have you so thank you angel for. All of your help live from from the final broadcast with another hour coming up. I'm your host. Bobby like us like us you'll love. This is bobby. You're listening to the heartland news. Feed radio network lie at hartland. Newsfeed dot com. This is supported by advertisers and contributions by follow us on facebook twitter and instagram's another high infection mark. I'm jack callaghan fox. News more than one hundred eighty-four thousand corona virus cases reported thursday according to the stats kept by johns hopkins university. That's eleven straight days more than one hundred thousand new cases president trump saying yesterday he believes emergency approval of a corona virus vaccine is imminent and he credits the fast track that he ordered the average development time line for a vaccine including clinical tests and manufacturing can take eight to twelve years through operation warp speed. We're doing it in less than one year If you had a different administration with different people what we've done would've taken in my opinion. Three four five years would have been in the fda forever. President hurting americans to remain vigilant as the weather gets colder. Some areas reimposing restrictions. President trump took a possible. Lock down under a biden administration who knows which administration will be time. We'll tell but I can tell you. This administration will not go to a lockdown in chicago. The city is under a modified lockdown again ordered by mayor lori. Lightfoot we get back to criticism for her street party speech last weekend celebrating. the election. Results crowd was gathered. Whether i was there or not. California governor gavin newsom severe restrictions on daily life including thanksgiving the san francisco chronicle reports newsom broke his own rules by attending a lavish birthday party. Fox's leland vetter to biden campaign spokesperson declining. This friday if a nationwide lockdown is being planned the challenges to last week's election results a federal appeals court as rejected an effort to block about ninety three hundred mail in ballots that arrived after election day in pennsylvania and michigan judge refusing to stop the certification of detroit area results. America is listening to fox news. Demonstrations are planned in washington today including two supporting president trump. The million mega march and a stop the steel rally. A group opposed to the president is planning its own. Demonstration been another republican takeaway of the democrat held seats in congress. The gop's young. Kim unseating democrat incumbents kill cisneros further whittling the democrat majority of the house and is fox's chad pergram reports house speaker pelosi's influence selosia accepted responsibility for losing seats. In fact the speaker said she saved the majority but pelosi's power is already diminished. Not just by losing seats. But by president elect joe biden. She's no longer. The center of the democratic. Political universe still pelosi must grapple was internal divisions the house minority leader. Kevin mccarthy says democrats veered toward socialism. Conservative democrats believe liberal. Democrats nearly cost their party. The house and progressives are doubling down kratz abruptly cancelled a dinner for incoming house freshmen members of the capitol building friday. Evening after pictures of the tables being set up went viral speaker. Pelosi said the event was cleared by the capitol physician but the members were then told to take their meals to go new mexico now among the states ordering people not to have big family thanksgiving gatherings guys that many people will choose to ignore survey over two thousand people by the ohio. State university wexner medical center. Finding nearly forty percent of americans will attend a holiday gathering with more than ten people and a third will not ask guests to wear masks. We'll celebrations will look different this year reps for the survey or encouraging folks to follow health experts guidelines calling it an opportunity to experiment with new traditions like virtual gift exchanges christine goodwin fox news on jack callaghan. This is fox news if you need to hire. You need indeed indeed delivers quality candidates. So you can focus on hiring the person who is a good fit claim your seventy five dollars credit for your first post at indeed dot com slash fox terms and conditions apply. Welcome to bobby like car clinic. If you have a question for bobby call now at one. Eight hundred two six four five four five four toll free from anywhere in america and now here's your host bobby like us and then there was one that's right. There was one remaining broadcast and of the two hours. Daily broadcasts for twenty. Nine years of bobby likes carpeting again. Welcome to the last final hour. This is the one single our that's left show. I'm gonna do something. Well i'm not going to tell you what i'm gonna do because i don't know but i thought it would be great if i allowed more people to talk than i and that's not easy for me to do so when i come back from the break which is a hard break. What i will do is. I will turn the phones to you now. We're limited to a certain number of lines. Show those of you who call in. Let's keep it as short as possible and if you do have a car question i'll be more than happy to help you answer it. Let me give you the number for those of you not familiar. Triple eight car clinic. That's triple eight two two seven twenty five forty-six six million. We'll take your call. Millie shaffer and put you in the queue. And then i will put you on the air show this being our final hour of twenty nine year. Run and it's been a good run. I intend to after this broadcast. When everyone's asking me. What are you gonna do if you retire. I'm gonna take my foot off the pedal and go along for the ride. I promise that to my wife diane. I don't think she's gonna believe me but I'm going to do my best in the meantime after this commercial break. I'm gonna come back and take your calls. Put you on the air. You're listening to bobby like car traffic. Today's vehicles fe xiaojing conditions with a more than one hundred and fifty accessories for safety and comfort such as backup cameras and entertainment systems. They're like second homes. Clarius is the world's largest producer of automotive. Agm batteries at a precision engineered to be reliable. Doer will safely meet these. Challenging needs hey. Gm batteries have up to two times. The life traditional batteries on a non billable the next time you need a battery. Ask for an agm battery to meet today. He's driving and electrical demand. Visit auto batteries dot com. That's auto batteries dot com. You need auto parts of reilly. Auto dot com is just a few clicks away. We offer convenient options for you to get your parts quickly order online and pick up for free at your local o'reilly auto parts store. We'll even bring out. Curbside are you can have your parts delivered right to your door with free shipping on most orders over thirty five dollars visit a reilly auto dot com arts. You've heard me talk about. Motorized is leading the way with automotive thermostats fuel oil and coolant caps now motorists using their expertise and tier one. Oem facilities to deliver advanced engine management solutions products like camshaft and crankshaft sensors ignition coils. Mass airflow centers even variable valve timing solan awards and motor reds aftermarket products are designed and manufactured to meet or exceed original equipment specifications. Learn more about motorhead products and industry leading application coverage at motorhead dot com. Did you just look down at your phone. You did it again didn't you. You know you're flying down the road in a three ton hunk of steel and a text takes your eyes off the road for an average of five seconds at fifty five miles per hour. That's long enough to travel the length of a football field and cause some serious damage Turn it off trust me. Whatever it is you'll live learn more at stoptextsstopwrecks dot org brought to you by the ad council and the national highway traffic safety administration. You're listening to bobby. His car clinic in the small town of elmira new york. A boy was born into an all american family. The odds of him achieving his dream in the fashion industry one in twenty three million the odds of having a child diagnosed with autism. One in sixty eight i am. Tommy hilfiger and my family is affected by autism. Learn more at autismspeaks dot. Org slash signs brought to you by autism speaks and the ad council radio. It's been here all along. You know which station is going to tell you the score of the game where to turn when the weather gets round when something big happens good or bad. You know where to go now. Radio has evolved to move with you with the next radio app in your fm enabled phone just plug in your headphones to start experiencing radio and a whole new way while using way less battery and data than streaming apps. Find your favorite stations like the one. You're listening to right now. Download the free nextradio app today. Next radio live and local. Wherever you go and now back to body micheals cochran and your host. Bob like it and welcome back to the final hour the final edition and then there was one one hour to go and bobby like his cartooning broadcasts. It's been a great twenty nine year run. I will share with you. And then we'll go directly to the phones we are auctioning every single wire. Microphone camera studio Screen again her in an house show. We're doing that. why so that. I won't come back next week and say oh there's one more thing i wanted to say so For those of you interested in really great deals. Go to bobby like us dot com and that's l. i k. S bobby like us dot com. And you'll see a list of all of the great Items that leah joya. Who is a lovely young lady. Still a fantastic job. Joy and company auctions That's online bobby. Like us dot com. Meanwhile let's go to a new york. Take a call from ron hills ron. Welcome welcome back to bobby. Like cartoony bobby It's so good to hear your voice. I had to call in. Thank you back in august. You invited bob conway and meet to be on Bobby lakers car clinic. Two weeks in a row to talk about a car parade that bob put together. I wanted people to know that. Thanks to your help. And the help of doug mosier. Wnbf radio and binghamton we over four thousand dollars per sock l. cancer more than nine hundred meals for the local community hunger outreach warehouse and we couldn't have done it without you will ron. I remember that will and an although we don't have time but your partner bob. The one that brought drag racing to That community and he had to come up with some other idea even with covid for people to get together so he created this parade and the parade with for salk out cancer. Right that's right. We had over two hundred and forty cars urge and got people who had been housebound because of covid out Helping the community. So you don't just fix cars you fix communities. Well i appreciate that. And and i wouldn't be doing you justice if i didn't tell you. What kind of socks that. I have on today and i'm gonna right now Take put my foot up here. And i'm gonna look at my socks and those online can see my socks. It says out cancer so a gentleman jesse from new york sent me the socks and thought today would be a great day to where. I didn't know you were going to call. What a what a coincidence. It's karma. I guess i thank you so much and all the folks there in new york and next year. May you have a thousand cars for your parade and best of health to you and your community and continued to do the great work that you've done Helping people With cancer succour cancer parade folks go there next year planted and if i can help promote it you know from afar or maybe from in house you just let me know ron. Thanks for your call. My be thank you so much. I don't know what they'll put in the time slot that they won't replace you probably a viagra show gumby. I know you have other callers. Come to you and your family. Thank you this appreciate it. Let's go to ed in georgia. Ed a welcome to bobby likes cartooning. Glad to have any join us. Yes sir bobby. Shout out to our challenge for everyone. We've seen the evolution of the Actually eat Through report and i'm the bergen wagon days of my mom when she was first born road around that by the time she got a high school or early thirties right It was automobiles. So how you think. Now we're into the evening era. What do you think a time span to be for the most part of how ebays takeover with i c i folks i. C e stands for internal combustion engine shed. I'm i'm going to say normally twenty fifty by twenty fifty of course Gavin newsom is the governor of the state of california and a just issued a statement said by twenty twenty five. All new cars bought or sold in california will be vs by twenty twenty five and folks for your formation eleven and a half percent of all. New cars are sold in california and california's the most populous state in the nation show. That's a big impact in for the governor. You know a lot of petroleum industry says that had the goal of him to do that. But i'll tell you they're doing it in the uk it. This is already happening in a lot of cities for pollution. So are here and they will not be as i thought. Five years ago vertical niche they will be widely us because of all the money spent for research and development in the world. The medical industry is number one. The automotive industry is number two and every manufacturer every oem regardless of brand is now investing heavily in and The battery the holy grail of the new battery technology is the only thing holding back. You're going to see five to six hundred mile radius or arrange on cars and to that in that's going to take away the range anxiety and the maintenance industry We'll have to adapt because the maintenance will absolutely all but go away. Ed thank you so much for your call and always love to hear from you in atlanta. Now let's go to Nancy and folks alon just popped open. Triple eight two two seven twenty five forty six. Well one line. did nancy. Welcome to bobby like his car. And thank you for holding. Thank you so much pleasure to talk with you. Pleasure what can i have a two thousand six camry that i love. It has a v six engine and stability control. And i got it because i hate driving in the winter and this car is wonderful in the winter but i have a problem over the years to happen is my two front tires have started to get a mushroom shape. So we check the air pressure in it and Sometimes the tire looks terrible but it has enough air in it. So i'm assuming just the weight of the engine in that car is is causing this well not. I'm not sure that. I understand exactly what you're saying Because number one the tires all tires are accustomed to having the weight of the car. Whether it's a front rear-drive doesn't matter. Some tires do flat spot. If they use a nylon cord and a flat spot goes away once you drive five to seven miles but you should never be able to physically see this. I suggest to you and it sounds simple. Abundant you buy a new set of tires. We are very good about new tires. And as a matter of fact our snow tires we just put on has one more season. It has come but it is true that the newer tires the less. You get that shape. Well i guess that's true for everything about us in life. The newer you are the better shape you are at least at least you don't already better so i would i would say Have a conversation with your local tire dealer not to go buy tires just to find a local dealer that Tire dealer tire store. Goodyear go to goodyear store They're they're they're actually A a partner of ours and talk with a good goodyear person not to buy tires but to get advice and see how they treat you and if you can establish a relationship that you feel comfortable and they will give their time without taking your dollars just because they want to help you. That's who you should do with industrial. You should trust you got it. That's a great idea. One more question. How can i clean my headlights. They're just three three aren't they knew. Headlights will cost four to three. M makes a great headlight lens. Cleaning to a real available at o'reilly auto parts but if you're going to clean the headlights you must buy a what is it John ultra star sylvania ultra star and sounds like it. Okay the ultra star. Venus fifty percent brighter. They're not sponsors mom but i got him in. My car's ultra ultra star sylvania. Bulbs are fifty percent brighter than factory. They're available at o'reilly auto parts as is the three m lynch cleaner and sylvania may mel. They may offer one to nancy. Thank you for your call to got to go. I hope you have a very long happy retirement. You deserve it. Thank you so much. You're very kind. triple eight. Two two seven two thousand five forty six. Take a call from gentleman. South dakota jemma. Welcome to bobby kennedy. Trolling thank you. Bobby. thank you for taking my call on your final broadcast centigrade. State of south dakota the mount rushmore state. By the way you help me out. Back in june when i had a problem with the engine With the oil leak and that berry men's you recommended really helped. And i had no more engine leaks and was able to sell my car Outright got a two thousand seventeen cadillac now and it seems to have an issue when you first start the vehicle and put it in reverse or drive takes off and that's without applying pressure to the accelerator is that Normal for that seat keys fix it. Is that the brand of car makes no difference. Every car does that every car. Every computer is designed to have the rpm up to fourteen to sixteen hundred. Rpm when the engine is cold cole is is as relevant to the ambient temperature for me. When i fire my car this morning. It idle fast about fifteen hundred rpm for about twenty five seconds. Wait until the engine. Settles back down. Then put it in gear. Give the time to be oiled and everything to get be ready to go. And speaking of going i got a hard break. Gotta go but i'll be back. 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Casey all feature ceramic technology designed to repair the leak without clogging tough times create. The need to be prepared. Make party or emergency road kit. Casey available nationwide is stored like walmart. Check walmart dot. Com for hours and shipping options are go to casey old dot com with forty eight years experience in automotive repair. Our service team knows what dirty gasoline does inside an engine over time and miles fuel residue and hot oil vapors create nasty hardened clusters carbon that block airflow into cylinders collect valves and build up inside combustion chambers causing hard starting rough idle sluggish engine performance and bad gas mileage solution barium and be sixty high mileage fuel system rejuvenator be sixty cleans the entire fuel system of all high mileage gas powered vehicle to with powerful detergents and seven. That's high energy solvent technology at work be sixty gives you one tank cleanup fuel injectors intake valves and combustion chambers restore lost power reduce rough idle improve fuel economy and enjoy your drive again very much. Be sixty high mileage fuel system. Rejuvenator is the only fuel system cleaner with Solvents pick up a can at your local auto parts store. Today from war. Visit merriman products dot com. That's merriman products dot com. You're listening to bobby like his car clinic. Breast cancer survivor. The united breast cancer foundation saved her life and they need your help so they can continue saving more women's lives. Help them by donating your car. They'll provide fast free twenty four hour pickup and you receive a charitable tax deduction they took cars trucks vans and suv's running or not call twenty four hours a day. Eight hundred seven four five thirty three twenty-seven your donation could literally save women's lives. Call today eight hundred seven four five thirty three twenty seven eight hundred seven four five thirty three twenty seven. It's heidi summers health and wellness expert with your local health update. I get so many emails and calls about cbd the incredible oil from the hemp plant. That's being used to provide relief to millions for joint discomfort inflammation nagging injuries. It's the most talked about alternative health breakthrough in years the cd product. I always recommend comes from. Cbd labs the gold standard of cd cd labs. Oil goes to work fast to relieve your discomfort and deliver the results. One thought nearly impossible without a prescription. This powerful oil is not marijuana and contains no. Thc the ingredient that gets you high. Oh yeah cbd labs oil has also been used to help thousands. Get a great night's sleep. Don't be fooled by all the imitators and find out how. Get a free bottle while supplies last to get your free bottle of cbd labs the oil call eight hundred six five zero nine eight one four. That's eight hundred six five zero nine eight one four. Get your free bottle for a limited time. Call now eight hundred six five zero nine eight one. Four eight hundred six five zero ninety eight fourteen and now back to body like and your host. Bobby likes and welcome back to bobby like us. Thank thank you so much for tuning in today. This is our final broadcast final. Half hour or so of body like his car for twenty nine years. So let's move on so jim. We talked before the break about your headlights. And so with your headlights. I would say that. A headlight. Cleansing kit And three Makes one sylvania makes one a lot of manufacturers. Make one the. The kit is as good as the person supplying the kid. So if you're supposed to use Sand sandpaper number one then followed by number two three and four follow the directions. Don't get in a hurry. Make sure you tape around the headline so you don't buffet. Some of the paint to the headlight number one number two Put into sylvania Ultra star bulbs even if you got a new car Except for the xenon bulb. Savannahs will replace the bob and do better. You have a question. Do okay on that cadillac. Two thousand seventeen when you come to stop. Then you put your break on the engine actually quit and it will hold in that position for about well as long as it takes before you let me break right. That's the star. Stop start stop technology. And you don't like it right right. Well you're joined the club. Fable that no there is. That's a problem. Say my My jay has stopped technology. And there's a switch that that can defeat that the problem is every time you start to car it defaults back to the on mode. Bmw had so many complaints that they changed the hardware software so that the last the star stop technology stays in the mode that the driver said it. When i turn the car off last so i will say to you to knowledge cadillac. Doesn won't read your owner's manual. It's possible that the defeats which will stay in that mode when you recycle the key. But it's doubtful and the meantime then not a darn thing you can do about it except call me and complain and i'm complaining with you. Hey thanks for calling got go take care. You bet you're welcome. Thank you serve. Take another call from Triple eight car clinic as your number to call triple eight. Two two seven twenty. Five forty six Is it lamar gene. Yeah good morning. Welcome to bani yes. good morning. Welcome to bobby. Thanks for holding. Yeah but yeah. I got an picked. Ford gmc pickup truck. How dramatic in it. You put that thing in one dash four and it wouldn't go forward but it wouldn't go sideways always to other ride. I took it to a mechanic here to florida. And he said to. David panted done slip from the wadden rod and the dominated or twitter friends goal thing. I let him do it. Charge a thousand dollars and eighteen cents. Now what i won't know from you. I need to hire an attorney in policy case against him. No you need to go out to o'reilly auto parts store and buy a set of bosch icon wiper blades. And also he did take alcohol or rubbing compound and clean the windshield. And then all of your problems will go away other than bobby. Like bobby like as my name is jay brazzaville j. brazzaville this radio guy fawkes. Under right way back yonder in the early days we put the bobby locke his car. Clinical wwe in fort walton beach and that'd be bb k in blakely georgia and i believe that's been about twenty nine years ago. It would not surprise me. You dog you know we had to make a little humor out of it. And that was very little. I'll be honest but anyway You saw so many problems. I figured i'd give you one safe you tom in by dog you saw well. Masha mexico on blade and wipe a lot of things away but it can't wipe tears away and he can't white memories away j i remember you i appreciate your call and i will always remember all of the kind words and the fact that early early on when we were searching for stations to carry our program you stepped up and said i have two stations and i will put you on those most stations so for that i appreciate it and for your call today appreciate i love you appreciate your call. Good luck to you in the future sir. Thank you jay folks just You know we all knew. That was a joke. Our did we. It was a joke as my friends wayne loss a year or so ago said like as you have a little humor darn little so and he had darn little. Let's go to brad in nebraska. In the meantime now some lines have opened so now is the time for you to call triple eight car clinic. That's triple eight two two seven twenty five forty six brad. Good morning. welcome to bobby. Like carbonic good morning avi. It's been a long time you've been out here in kearney and we became friends and Through the years you've helped us promote cruise night many years and we're going to miss you man. Brad karnik sir. Well i'm gonna miss you. In fact i'm looking At a central nebraska car club aluminum license plate plaque that you gave to me along with buying my dinner the night. I never ate so much in my life is going out to cap ethanol and carney nebraska but You your car club. Jerry ericsson Everyone there in carney. Nebraska has really been a close relationship and the ride has been terrific. I most certainly appreciate your call today. And i'll tell you folks these people shutdown car in nebraska and they have six hundred cars that come from all over the state in fact the fire. Marshall says you can't park their cars that way and actually made them. This is five or six years ago. As i remember. Bread made you park the cars so that in the emergency afar chuck could come down to main street to get from point. Eight point me. Is that correct that accurate. Yeah hey my friend. Thank you so much for your call and for everyone tuned in there. and car in nebraska. Thank you Cagey f w station. That i'm so familiar with who actually produced a remote broadcasts from that station. Paul kenny president of kappa and his family are a great people. I thank you for your call and for your consideration and always for the hospitality that your whole town showed me and gave me when i was there for my quick short visit. God you thank you thank you bye. Take another call from john john. Welcome to bobby like cartooning. Thank you for holding bobby. I'd like to say thank you for all your years of service. Lima radio is i. Enjoy your show. And i'm kinda sad to see ago. And now i got two thousand nine hundred nine buick enclave. And it goes into auto stock. What is the purpose of auto stop. Mpg it so if your car maker near selling a cars and you're selling cars by two reasons and car manufacture sell cars for two reasons number one. I say two reasons under two mandates number one mpg to meet the mpg and the ever increasing demand on mpg and emissions. Show the kea. The national manager of kia told me one day bobby. We don't sell cars for the money. We are our for the what's on them. We sell cars mother amount of tonnage of emissions per year on that car. And that's why when you get a new car you see the monroney sticker and monroney is a was a congressman from oklahoma that created the monroney stick. Which is the new car sticker that we all see. You read all of the information but mainly you read what the emissions are per year of that car and the mpg. So when you stop an engine at a traffic light for thirty seconds. It saves a tenth of a gallon of gasoline. And so for that reason. If i'm selling a new buick and you're setting a new ford and you have a start. Stop your mpg. All things. Being equal is increased a tenth of a gallon than than mine. Therefore you're the big dog and that's what it's all about got it okay question on top of that and then okay. Doesn't that destroy your battery your car. No no because the stopped battery is not the battery that runs the car. It's a separate battery and only use for that issue and it's a special high immediate online battery that is in. The car doesn't use the same battery that the car runs on. Really really say ask of somebody's pipe-dream in the end of a mile okay. The final final question lancer in the big scheme of things. It will not save you or me or anybody else gasoline. But if we were under test if we're in the clinical tests. I have start stop. I win the clinical tests. And that's what is all about so if you drive in a commercial city area where You you start in a traffic light. A lot then definitely saves gas anyway moving on so here we go though. What am i supposed to do now. Hold whole okay. I have a special collar on the line and because lines are jalen okay. We can't put him over the regular things. If you're gonna have to speak to on speakerphone okay. Bring it on speakerphone. Here we go. This is mr. Yes on speakerphone Here here's a mystery. Yes here's a a folks. Oh my god this folks let me tell you who this is before he speaks his name is mark fan of all of the people and all the sponsors and all the partners and all the friends that i've made professionally. Here's one of the top leading. And he took a company that had four hundred vendors and by the time he was finished with that company that had twenty five thousand vendors. And i'm not exaggerating folks. Meet martin mc fan. I'm holding cell. Phone on speakerphone. Nick microphone mark. It sure is a pleasure to have you in the house. I can't tell you what a pleasure it is to hear your voice santa jusque so honored to be able to be here on the last day of lisbon such an incredible journey. You've been such an incredible mentor and coach. And fran both the people inside the industry and out and Man what a joy it has been to be a small part of this journey with you a what it means for me for you to take the time and and to call in and those words coming from you mean so much and folks that here's the gentleman that would never brag in what he likes to go to natural in and pick and play songs but also what he likes to do is build companies so he took broil purple and he built that company that originally had five percent of its revenue in the automotive world. He took it to fifty percent and then the will so for three hundred thirty one million dollars and so mark he retired before. I but only because you were maybe smarter than i doesn't matter. You're you're a true hero man now. Well thank you so much all. Take luck over skill. Any case i am really looking forward to you coming out to colorado. What paying a visit. We've already cleaned up the guesthouse. So it's ready for you as you're ready come see us. Well we will take you up on that. Covert inoke ovid And i will get with my handler and she will tell us what we're come out there. Okay well. I can't wait and i know you've got you know. People flooding the lines to to try to express their love and appreciation for. You won't take more time right now but let's connect us week and i'll look for new come visit thank you. Martin mc fan Ex owner of royal purple folksy. I'll be back. Don't test the dow with more to come. This project brought to you by blaster and new pro straw featuring control flow technology. Folks will what's important part of vehicle. Maintenance proper alignment provides better handling can also extends tire life but in some areas of the country roads suffer from harsh winter. Climate and salt damage is tough steering. Linkages and suspension components causing rust. Rust never sleeps and it becomes evident when you try to make adjustments to tyrod or even a cashman camera components. There's a solution. Pb blaster penetrate and its new pro. Straw featuring control flow technology when aligning the front end. Be sure to apply blaster using the convenient pro straw to tyrod gestures and any fasteners allow alignment changes year will make them easier to loosen and move and using blasters new pro straw provides the ability to apply only where needed ultimately making the job cleaner and more efficient. Pb blazers available at home auto or hardware stores near you work at like a pro with bladder products. For more information go to blaster corp dot com. You're listening to bobby like his car clinic. Page jason bonetti for ready dot illinois dot gov with a message for the thousands of illinois with functional needs. Needless to say everyone needs to have an emergency disaster plan and disaster kit but that plan and kit may look a lot different for those with functional needs. Learn how to make a plan and a kit that best serves your needs and the needs of your family and even your pets at ready dot. Illinois dot gov there's tips for caregivers and seniors to make a plan and make a kit find out how at ready dot illinois dot gov ready dot illinois dot gov sponsored by a started as medicine to relieve the pain. Take the edge off stress to just get through the day. I realize i can't stop. I can't stop can't stop. Can't stop can't stop. we can help call one eight. Three three to find help find ways to help you or the ones you love break. The cycle of opioid use disorder. One eight three. Three to find help sponsored by and now back to bobby cochlear and your host bobby like welcome back to the segment bobby. Moving on a few quick read that. I have to share with you. These are friends. I know that the phone john. We're gonna come to the phones and and clear the phones out and go next. But dave vanderlei who is an icon in our local community because he spends a lot of time on charity work and he does a great job he says. Congratulations on your retirement. Bobby from another seven sixty seven pilot. I always describe you as the car whisperer. Thanks for all you have done in. Our community will always be grateful for having the guardian and lied him the guardian ad-litem on your show. You have a great audience and congrats. To diana's well keith. Like us congrats for awesome. Show and thank you for all the help with my cars over the year. My nephew jordan from indicate new york. Hey body. I've called you a few times over the years. I've listened to you. Most saturdays best wishes on your retirement. You'll be missed. But not forgotten cheers and one last. Watch bobby live in our chat room. Tony cerna bobby. I'm not good with words. Show enjoy your next life by the way you have a beautiful family. And i've always wanted to meet you. Hopefully inside our next life. I agree tony turn up. Thank you so much now. Let's go to brian. In new york brian. Welcome to bobby like his cartoon. Thanks for holding. Bobby like is this. Is brian good to talk to you first. Time caller just got a quick question about a dodge durango and something kind of unique cap into it the other day okay. Let's let's move on. I was Coming back on a road trip. I pulled off and the engine was cold. We left the next morning. Hotel got immediately on the interstate and driving down the downhill. It never kicked into overdrive It acted like he was in tow haul win about forty miles a pulled in the next town. I got out just check. The transmission fluid shut it off turned it back on got back on the road and went back to work in And went into overdrive. So i i don't know what was wrong. No codes were thrown. Okay i wonder given its three hundred and twenty two thousand miles if might have an idea what happened there okay. I'm suspect that there's a anytime you have an erotic problem if you're lucky. It's a pre warning. My headlight flash. Tomio my car about two weeks ago but it worked in the next morning and then two days later it quit working altogether so the transformer in light went bed. I suspect that you have some internal issues in the transmission that i had to do with solar knowedge. So here's what i would do to say to you. Have the transmission service and use synthetic transmission fluid and use a shop that has a a machine that extracts the old fluid and put new fluid in okay. That's that's what i would ask you to do. Don't pay money to have a addressed. Don't pay money to have it. Diagnos just have it serviced. And even if it's only been thirty four thousand miles do that you synthetic fluid and then monitor it and if it happens again you know it's not the fluid is not trash. It's an internal problem and three hundred thousand miles. Then you can. Well you can call me back but you can make a decision on what to do with that car. Thank you so much for your call. Brian from new york next. Let's go to jim jim. Welcome to bobby like his carpeting. Thank you this. Is our last our last segment of bobby like his car cleaning twenty nine years Glad to have you join us on bobby. Like bobby is pensacola. A friendly town for people looking to retire in florida. That's probably that's a great question but i. i'm. I'm surprised that your question is my answer. Your question exemplifies one of the first assets of our community not necessarily today Not that we're not really as ever but back before we had a bustling hustling downtown. Thanks you are are good. Mayor like ashton hayward who is no longer the mayor he did a great job but thanks you too growth is equipped studios and all the folks in the fed levin's of the world and and the qin fords all the movers and shakers. That have made pensacola. What it is today. before they came on the scene pensacola and the folks in pensacola were of the nature. That you just described so. I hope that answers your question because i mean that As someone who came here in nineteen sixty one and watched it grow and knows the community. Because i've been involved in any questions. You sent me a cart clinic network coffee mug. I still have it. I use it all the time. I'm gonna miss your show. Thanks a lot thank you. Thank you a lot jim. Thanks for your call. Let's go now to Jim in a wego a we go new york. I'll we go to your jim. Welcome to bobby like his cartoon. Thanks for holding. A pleasure to be able to get on. Time is short. Yes bless you have a wonderful time. Thank you i appreciate what you well i. I really enjoyed see down a row. Jim thank you for your call. Triple eight two two seven twenty five forty six triple eight car clinic. Aaa carpeting folks is the number for you to call Gosh it's just so much going on here that i just don't know what to say but we have greg in the whole and bob into q. but my wife's coming up now so i have to stop what i'm doing and i had to listen to a good listener or pretend he's listening for ten. Pretend i'm listening so here we go so you know. We have some much of the family here today. Ken and roy and face and kevin and andy called in and we just have surrounded by family. Who love you. Because you've meant so much not only what you talked about cars which is substantial but also which you've talked to him about life and ethics and follow through and consideration the love of people. The one person who is not here. Who's actually supposed to be here. But because of the recent operation couldn't make it and that's misty. But i have a gift from her so i'd like to present you this gift on behalf of your daughter misty. Okay so here. I am now. This is a sack with maker in women. They they put it with paper. You know normally those bags have a bottle of bread one but let's see what this stuff another wrapped again. Oh my gosh. it's the make you make you work for this. What is this. What is this this earth. It's a fork. I'm done ten ten twenty twenty so flocking me. Put a fork me folks. i'm done look at that l. on on. Watch bobby live. It's a fork that has says ten ten twenty twenty. I'm don and i i will. I'll use that. If i go out tonight which i'll probably will to a restaurant. I will take my own fork and So that's the people that made this for. But thank you thank you. Thank you sweetheart retirement. Thank you so that beautiful woman. You're seeing on screen now with my wife. So she goes on with me now. We're going to go back to the phones. And i'm not done yet so don't stick that for me yet. Okay let's go to greg greg. Welcome bobby like his car clinic. Thanks a lot bobby. Appreciate it A few a couple years ago i called. Yeah had two thousand five f one fifty Had a issue with some knocking in it You get a couple ideas. But i couldn't get it to repeat as it ended up when it happened with my wife. Vulner- horse trailer she back into a slot and it ended up. She pulled out her phone video. So it had audio video of it was able to show it to somebody. the mechanic and It was a cam phaser issue right and so anyway we got taken care of I call you back if it didn't do it today. It wasn't going to happen so I really appreciate your show. I've enjoyed listening to you for several years And you're one of the people that I feel like that. You have more about cars than i will ever know by far and i truly enjoyed your show and i'm really gonna miss it and i just wanted to say thank you. Well i i appreciate that. I'm glad that you did call me. And when you get to the other side of what repairs because explaining what you know what you hope to help people From this end of the mike versus being real time hands on. There's nothing you know. Doctors don't do long distance operations they have to be hands on and so for me to to receive Information back to you and the accolades from you is much appreciated. And i thank you for taking the time making the time. Not taking making the time to call me as much appreciated greg and thank you and good luck to you in the future sir. Enjoy a retirement. Bobby thank you very much. Thank you very much greg. Now go to george george. Welcome to bobby like his car clinic. Hello hello sir. How are you couldn't be any better crying yet. Off caught three times already today. And i'm done yet the case yet. I still got another nine minutes. So let's go okay my question. I've listened to you for a while. Learn just tremendous amount of stuff i. It's just phenomenal. The amount of studying that you have behind words that commodity your mouth my question for all your tens and hundreds of millions of listeners is where do we go now. Do you have recommendations for anybody else. That may be out there. I do not. I will share this with you I don't think that it would be fair to the station or fair to an audience Because i think that you and so many of our twenty nine years of listeners would immediately compare a very qualified cartel coast to a one that's established and i don't think it's fair to the new i don't i don't i don't think it's fair to expectations i. It is my recommendation. That radio stations. That air bobby like carcassone shift gears or or find a local car guru locally to talk about Helping people to fix their card or local level. Thank you so much george for your call. I don't know where i'll go now. But but I i've got a short time to get there so thank you very much a beach. God bless you sir. enjoy the rest of thank. You must george go to dale dale. Welcome to bobby like his car clinic. Thank you for holding the terrific. You sir what can do for you. Oh i just wanted to thank you for all years and advice. it's it's been a great education. it's too bad. I couldn't use it to get a college diploma or something. Well live. i live across the border from a wego new york. Where he you've mentioned. Shangri la speedway quite a few times so Really appreciate all you've done for us and all the advice through the you most welcome appreciate you. And i thank you so much for your call and be safe and Take care and i'll think of you on the other side. I appreciate your call today. Deal thanks again. Thank you bobby. By she. Go to bob bob and new york. New york's really hot today. Well no pun intended bah bob. Hi sir i've been listening to you. Ever since you took over from jeff brooks nice gary area yes Okay well. I wanted to get car question. Like she'll go can You know. I really enjoy all along. May i ask you a favor. Let me put you back on. Hold and And give your address. And i'll give you my email address So in an all fairness to the time consideration So i thank you for your call. But that's put bombeck own hole and give him my email address and take a another call. Because i really don't have time to properly answer any indycar questions in time left here so we'll take a another call Okay good morning and welcome to like his car clinic so when you only have a couple of minutes. Left folks at time runs short. And that's all the time that we have the final broadcast and in all reality for those of you who could not get in. I apologize and for those of you. Who have gotten in. I sincerely appreciate your kind words A special thanks to chronic team Starting with The behind every successful individual every successful man. There's a usually a beautiful talented carrying woman and my case That would be diane. Diane stepped up Stepped over Ma- made Away when there was no way to be made No apparent way to be made Never say never the most carrying individual that that i know and i'm just fortunate to have her as as my wife and and my partner in life I'd be remiss if i didn't mention jeff firestone This gentleman you know. And and i lose i use the term loosely. Jeff but this gentleman has really An never gives up. He's always working to help. Everyone get what they want whether it's a national partner sponsor or it's a carton listener whose won a prize that we give away so jeff. Thank you john. Irvine is a carton producer and a young man and author as well by the way john irvine stepped up when we needed someone to produce the show. And you talking about throw in someone that there's no saying you teach people how to swim. Throw them in water. We taught him how to swim throwing him in in a producer seat and he stepped up. And he's doing it joffe slumming. You're welcome john. Jonathan slome he's the executor. Jack of all trades and master of many to come remember the name jonathan sloane you will see that his name in headlights sooner than later he will make a mark in life. Mill schaefer are candu. We'll do call screener. She's fabulous and finally Angel dome are longtime global technical director in in new york. Who's and help us work through every technical issue we've ever had always on the side day or night. He's retired now. But i'll never forget angel own. What a trip has been a share of the mike folks would everyone for the past twenty nine years and of all the great memories that i have the highest priority is the confidence and trust that you put into me for that. I love you all so live for the final broadcast from the center of the automotive universe on your host. Bobby like us like us. You'll love. this is bobby like bobby like his car. Clinic is a copyrighted presentation of car clinic. 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Where you then saw michael jackson coming down from rainbow ray of light coming from the sky. So what happened then. Did he invite you to his playland or whatever it is. He has nine months later. The virgin birth happened again. Happy that He he could resurrect invited me jackson's baby. I'm old listened. The free talk live seven nights weeks six to nine. Pm central time on heartland newsfeed radio network and heartland news phone dot com radio. It's nothing new. It's been here all along with free. Entertainment news sports music and information. Start just part of life. It's part of who we are. You know which station is going to tell you the score the game. Which one's going to give you a laugh in the morning which one is going to give you something to sing along with. You know where to turn when the weather gets up when something big happens good or you're listening to the hot land. Use feed radio network at live dot hotline newsfeed dot com. The stream is supported by advertisers and contributions by follow us on facebook twitter and instagram. Does the fall would be difficult on. Jack callaghan fox news for the eleventh day in a row new cases of the corona virus of topped one hundred thousand per day the us more hundred eighty four thousand cases on thursday in an effort to slow the rise. More states are imposing restrictions. New mexico's governor. Shell luhan grisham. Mexicans are instructed to shelter in place. You should stay at home except for only the most essential trips for health safety and welfare. Whose orders in place through thanksgiving speaker. Nancy pelosi sounding the alarm friday on capitol hill. Says it read. This is red alert all hands on deck but the speaker was scheduled to hold a big dinner friday night at the. Us capitol building for new democrat members of congress. The speaker telling a reporter tables were well spaced. And there was plenty of ventilation but when news of the dinner hit social media the new members were given their dinners to go emigrants have lost another seat in the house of representatives incumbent california congressman gil cisneros conceding defeat to republican young. Kim president trump. Friday announcing plans are being made to distribute a coronavirus vaccine as quickly as possible once the fda grants emergency authorization noting. The pfizer has reported its tests. Show a vaccine candidate to be ninety percent effective. This far exceeds any and all expectations. Nobody thought they'd get to that level and we have others coming which we think will be an equal level. Maybe more of this possible. The president says for the moment new york state is not being included in the vaccine distribution plants because governor cuomo said. He's not sure he trusts. The vaccine legal setbacks friday for the president's team an appeals court refusing to block thousands of late arriving mail in ballots in the pennsylvania and michigan judge declining to order the detroit area vote. Totals not be certified next week. America is listening to fox news. It's one of the corona virus co morbidity factors. That's one of the facts being highlighted today. On international diabetes day the international diabetes foundation says there are now more than four hundred sixty three million adults with diabetes worldwide. That's one in eleven. it's also one reason. The idea uses world diabetes day to underscore the health threat. The disease poses. This year's theme for world diabetes day is and diabetes to raise awareness of the role. Nurses play the prevention and management of it. The day is marked each year on november fourteen. Because that's the birthday of sir. Frederick banting who co discovered insulin in nineteen twenty two. The day is also being mark on social media with the hashtag world diabetes day and nurses make the difference tonge powers fox. News is scheduled spacex launch. Won't happen saturday. Night crew launch now postponed until sunday night nasa administrator tweeting out the is due to onshore winds and rough seas for the planned rocket recovery operation. So the new launch time sunday. Seven twenty seven. Pm eastern spacex beginning a historic new chapter with nasa going from launching test flights to now launching regularly scheduled contract crew flights from florida to low earth orbit. It's really the biggest lot for nasa since the space shuttles retired. What's the dragon docks with the station. Monday morning the crew begins a full six months day. Doing research and science at the kennedy space center phil keating fox news and other tropical storm in the caribbean. It's the thirtieth named storm of the year. Iota currently forecast to become at least a category three hurricane as attracts west toward the coast of nicaragua mimicking the path of hurricane. Ava twelve days ago. That storm blamed for at least one hundred fifty deaths. Most of them from flooding and mudslides. Jack dylan this is fox. Stamps dot com brings the post office and ups shipping rights. Your computer go to stamps. Dot com to start a four week. Trial plus free postage in digital scale with promo code. Fox that stamps dot com. Click on the microphone at the top of the page and type in fox. The election of our lifetime is here with americans on the nation and the balance. Will there be a blue wave. Will donald trump defy polling on election night join. msnbc as rachel. maddow's nicole. Wallace joy. Reid brian williams in their team of experts analyze it. All from every angle. Steve kornacki will be the big board breaking down. The data state by state county by county coverage begins tuesday november third at six pm eastern. Stay with msnbc on top of last vote is counted. This is josh barrow. And welcome to left. Right and center. You're civilized yet. Provocative antidote to the self contained opinion bubbles that dominate political debate. It is late. October and this week was the second and last presidential debate of the twenty twenty campaign. This one was considerably more normal than the last one. Partly because the candidates microphones were muted during their opponents. Two-minute answers in the opening of each debate section and partly because president trump seems to have decided that his strategy of constant interruption in the last debate didn't work right for him instant polls showed respondents tending to say biden. Won the debate but not by the same kind of margins. They said that about the first debate. In fact when waited to the electric poles tended to show respondents saying biden won by about ten points in line with biden's actual lead in the polls suggesting that people basically thought there. I won this debate since there was more policy conversation in this debate than the last one. I want to try to delve into that this week and do that. Let's bring in our left right and center panel as always. I'm your center. I'm joined by tim. Carney calmness to the washington. Examiner and resident fellow at the american enterprise institute on the right and on the left christina nba columnist at the washington. Post hello hey josh josh. Let's start with covert and school. Something we talked about on this show last week Like at the first debate. This one started with a discussion of the covid response. In a point of agreement between trump and biden was that more schools ought to be open but they seem to disagree on why so many schools are closed biden. Blame the president for failing to deliver federal aid to schools that they can make the changes they need to open in person. Trump said people are worrying too much about the risks associated with opening schools. Andy said the democrats are trying to keep things close to hurt him politically tim. Did you think either candidate got to the heart of what's going wrong with with schools in covert here now i think donald trump has always turning everything to himself and in this case he was definitely wrong. I put the blame. The hands of local officials yes local officials who are bowing to a teacher's union that is being absolutist in its claims. I mean when we see unions going ahead and demand if the new york times union said we wanna sabbatical. We want more pay. They drew an extreme line. We would see it as part of a negotiation when we see teachers unions like some now saying in northern virginia. There's a union saying we shouldn't even open until the next school year. Maybe that's just their extreme line to draw on early bargaining position. But guess what this means. Tons of parents are going to have to find a way to work and educate their kids at home while sticking their kids in front of a computer screen. I think the teachers unions extreme demands aversion to finding a way to open safely. That is the real problem. I think biden's right that there should be lots of money from the federal government sent to schools to help them whether it's putting plexiglass dividers. New air conditioning systems. I think the blame lies equally on both parties for that but If we're going to talk about this we're gonna talk about the unions. The teachers unions hurting our children. And in addition to the funding the other thing christine. That biden mentioned here was that because the president has not gotten the virus under control that has forced the closure of not just schools but other things in in in our economy and so i think that there are. There's sort of three things there. One one is the money thing which biden pointed to one is the community spread thing and anything that you're trying to do with groups of people as harder the the more out of control covert is in the community but the third thing. i think. Maybe what what. Tim is pointing to here. Which is that even though conditions should be better so that more schools should be opened. I think there are schools. That could be open right now and the conditions that we have especially elementary schools where we're starting to see stronger evidence that at least elementary schools do not seem to be big drivers of covid spreads. So i guess. Did you see a satisfactory account here from either of these candidates about why we're not doing that you know i wouldn't say that i saw satisfactory account from either candidate simply because this is not a satisfactory problem. There is not necessarily a good solution here. i do want to point out that you know the fact that the virus is not under control is just a huge. A huge part of this josh. And you're totally right Tim i have design thinking your analogy to the new york times a sabbatical as a little bit off here. Because there's a difference between wanting to go on sabbatical and you know being afraid of a deadly disease that might kill you And i think that it's fair. That teachers are worried about this. Are worried about contracting it. From their students are worried about their students spreading into each other yes. Schools are for now have been proven to be. You know not necessarily superspreader. There are ways to keep. Hopefully the caseloads down in schools but some of that fear is justified. But i agree. But i would just say i think josh pointed at sort of the the middle of the road the open all the schools up which trump sometimes says is wrong. There are places. Now with twenty percent positivity and there are certainly schools say just cannot find the space the open air the good weather to educate their kids and those on a state or local or school by school level. Should be making the decision to close where i live in the washington. Dc area we have sub three percent positivity that means more than ninety seven percent of every coronavirus test comes back negative and yet the public schools. All around here are closed and in some jurisdictions are talking about closing them through the next school year and if these schools open they would be open with masks they would be opened with all sorts of rules. They would Hopefully be getting money to upgrade stuff but even so in schools that are open that are using these precautions. There is a near zero transmission inside the schools. And those are the things we gotta find the places where we can open. Gotta find the students who need it. Most students with a learning disability students whose family has technology on. Get everybody into school. We can not get everybody in the school. everybody we can do it safely. And that's where in the in the big Municipal in the big cities and their suburbs that have low transmission those Do they're not opening and that's politics you know and once again. I think that. I think that i agree with you here. Tim i think that schools that can be open should because we are seeing you. A lot of Fallout from students being kept at home Loss in educational capacity of the inability of parents to work or get things done in the pandemic that said i just continue to think that we can't we can't underplay the idea that you know teachers and in fact some parents still are scared. Actually one thing that i found really remarkable From last night's debate on this topic was the president ito trying to say that covert isn't that bad he got he's immune. He used the example of his son. Barron who apparently contracted cova and has happily recovered To say that you shouldn't be afraid of it. He didn't even say that he had been worried about his son. When his son contracted the girl virus he didn't seem to express any emotion or understanding that the prospect of this disease is extremely frightening extremely alarming for people and yes could be deadly. I think saying like we can't worry about it. We can't hide home. We have to do everything to open is a little bit. Misguided doesn't actually reflect the complexity of thought and feeling that most americans have whether they are parents or teachers christine. Did you see anything. That indicated that more schools would in fact be open. If biden wins this election. I mean. I assume that he would sign another relief. Bill that would have some more money and we might see that coming to schools sometime in the late winter early spring but one thing. The president said it echoed. Mike pence a couple of weeks ago. The vice presidential debate was it a lot of things that the vice president says. He would do if he wins are things that they're already doing or at least on paper they're supposed to be doing. So you know the the president's response. I think has not been very on top of things i i. I do things a little bit of an open question. How quickly things would be. How much different If we change presidents yeah mean exactly what you said. These are things of the president. Says he's doing he puts on paper that he's doing as we look around. We can see that a lot of things are not being done. I think to the point of what i was saying earlier about. Actually being you know legitimate fears from parents and teachers about reopening schools. I think actually just giving schools funding yes to replace these h fach systems yet to be able to actually break out into smaller class sizes. Yes to get real training on how to properly work with students in different environments so that the Possibility of contracting this disease is lessened. Would actually make. I think teachers become more comfortable with the idea of opening their classrooms and even teachers unions with sending their teachers back if they knew that there was funding allotted to make the circumstances much safer. I think that if joe biden were to actually make good on these promises of funding quickly not just say that they're coming on paper and then never do anything about them that could change. The mood and schools immigration has been. I think kind of weirdly absent from this campaign and felt for a few years like it was central to our politics maybe even to central compared to its importance as an issue. And then it's it's flipped and now it's like completely absent below the level of importance. It has so there was at least a little bit of discussion of immigration But it was this sort of very narrow slice of immigration The candidates talked about the central american migration crisis specifically the hundreds of children that our government has failed to reunite with the parents at separated them from. They talked about border. Security biden talked about a path to citizenship for dreamers. What i didn't hear from either candidate was a vision of what immigration is four and who they would allow to immigrate to the country in the future. And that's where to me because it feels like this is the really important part of immigration policies. What kind of country are we going to build. And so tim. What did you make this because if you did. Ask these candidates about that. They have very different views on that they do. And it's it's why we got trump right that the elites of both parties believed in sort of large numbers of immigrants and the republican position was kind of and we let the chamber of commerce. Tell us what to think of. The republican position immigration was largely. We need to get labor in to help businesses Run at lower costs and that this created this massive opening for donald trump that he was willing to come and say no. These guys are driving down wages in addition to all the other things he said about them. Not being the the best people in the world But that voters it was largely yet. That i'm a worker without a college. Education and importing a ton of immigrants is hurting me but that was literally the point of republican immigration policy for years so it would be great if sort of in the trump republican party there were an articulation of immigration is for and at the washington examiner. We've said let's start with refugees. Let's start with people who are fleeing a really bad place and then after that we need to have a discussion. I don't think we should have guests workers. There are a lot of people who say we need the high-skilled workers people who say we need the low skill workers. It would be nice to have that debate now. That trump has shaken it up but trump's views on immigration never were terribly nuanced and refined so it will be good to watch how the where the republican party goes next. But we certainly haven't gotten that. This election cycle christina. I feel like we didn't at least in this debate. Really get the positive vision about that from biden. Either you know. I think i have to agree with you tim. i'm that there has been a clear. Articulation of what the good the real good the substantive good or in fact substantive bad about immigration is for either party. It's a big picture question. And frankly the big picture questions have been jumped to the wayside for years at this point but actually i think if you read between the lines a little bit and just talk about or think about how trump versus biden talked about the immigrants who are already here those envisioned. You do kind of get a sense of you know what i think. Immigrants are doing what they think. Immigrants are for Joe biden went directly to talking about daca talking about dreamers. He described how many of them are first responders. He talked about how they are trying to invest in their educations so it seems that he you know imagined or envisions imigrants as productive citizens who become part of the country and contribute to it in various ways. Great trump on the other hand of course went back to greatest hits two thousand sixteen Describing them as rapists and murderers As hideouts in sanctuary cities who are somehow siphoning away the government funds at the rest of us should be getting that's a pretty grim and yes. Xenophobic racist envisioning of immigration. And i mean that's the tone that he's taken throughout his administration. I don't see that changing going forward. Another issue that came up in this debate was the minimum wage. And this i thought was interesting because we got a pretty clear contrast between the candidates so first of all christine joe biden pushing for a fifteen dollar national minimum wage. This is a big victory for the left that i don't think really gets remarked on that much. This was a relatively extreme position within the party. Not that long ago now. The relatively moderate candidate who won the nomination. He's out there pushing for it on a national basis. Yeah it's a huge victory And it's a long time coming but it's also incredibly reasonable. If you actually think about it and ask the american people. I mean according to pew surveys. Something like eighty. Six percent of democrats are in favor of a fifteen dollar minimum and even forty. Three percent of republicans are to cnbc. Surveys found this year that fifty seven percent of small business owners said that having a higher minimum wage wouldn't infect her business but actually i think the clearest and best argument that joe biden made and one that should resonate with all of us is the fact that you know the minimum wage as it exists right now will put you below the poverty line. It's simply not enough to live on if we want a country where everybody can actually make a living where people can live without fear of losing their homes Able to take care of their children able to feed their families then yes we simply need a higher minimum wage. I think at this point everybody realizes that everybody reasonable that is i suppose that makes me one of the unreasonable ppacri seen I that. I think you're absolutely right that the public supports us. I think that largely that's because it's seen as free money and that in some parts of the country a fifteen dollars minimum is perfectly reasonable. What we have now is a low federal minimum wage seven dollars and a quarter and then many states with that have higher costs of living with higher minimum wages and then other cities that have even higher wages and higher cost of living with higher minimum wages. This seems to me the proper set up a great example of federalism the federal government setting sort of a floor and then states stepping in and seeing what is appropriate to them. What can small businesses afford their. What does somebody need to make. But a key thing to remember is that I mean biden makes that point but the counter argument is that a vast majority of people earning. The minimum wage are not in fact trying to be providers for their home. They are going to be younger workers or they're going to be somebody second job that they hold and so while we can hope that all of these people get paid more. We have to understand that what you're effectively doing is outlawing. That second job for the person when you say you can't work for eight dollars an hour or twelve dollars an hour you were saying it is illegal for that that College kid or that college age kid. Eighteen year old to hold that job for the summer or for six months before going off and doing something else and so taking away the ability to of people to work these jobs. It seems like it's raising everybody's wages for and for a lot of people it does. But you're also inflicting harm so it's a great argument for federalism let the low federal minimum wage. Be there and let some states and cities have higher ones tim. I think that that's an interesting argument to make. Though in the context of the president position himself as a populist and what you talked about is the rationale for the president's immigration position basically populist labor market thing saying i'm going to protect you from job competition now i i think the evidence is not super strong on the idea that that immigration pushes down wages although the where it is strongest is that actually immigrants who are already in the country. They're the ones who faced the most wage competition from new immigrants so they they might see their wages. Go up if you had less new immigration but it also in in that case it would seem to me that the policy argument against a higher minimum wage would get weaker if you are succeeding in tightening the labor market. And the way you're describing that should support higher wages and make it easier to have an increase in the federal minimum wage and it seems especially if trump wants to position himself as an economic populist. It would be a natural thing for him to say. I'm for less immigration and a higher minimum wage because these are both things that i believe will push up the wages of lower paid american workers. So it's strange to me that that that he doesn't make that show he's not willing to break with the more libertarian thinkers or the board business interests in the republican party Who would oppose that higher. Federal minimum wage. I think the deal you're proposing would be a perfectly trumpian deal. It would be smart. And i would like to say if we are actually Creating conditions by supporting business creation and stopping these the deliberate importation of low skill workers who guestworker program cetera and that that is driving up wages. Then what minimum wage can do is sort of at the margins push up the wages a tiny bit but if they're well ahead of the prevailing wages then they're going to just mostly go that's where the risk causing job loss. But i think you propose a great idea and it would be a great populist idea. But it's gotta be a package deal you are creating more Demand for labour through various policies immigration and economic and. Then you can come in with the minimum wage hike as as something to lift it up at the bottom tim. I really have to push back on you here Would you say that a fifteen dollars. Minimum wage is free money. A minimum wage is not free. Money you're going to work and you're getting paid for the work that you do Being paid fifteen dollars per hour is a more reasonable wage Compared to rates of inflation and the rates of Living in this country that have risen significantly over the past twenty years. You know since the last time while more than twenty years Since the minimum wage was last raised. I also do think it is unreasonable to say that a higher minimum wage equals outlying. Second jobs no one is going to prevent you from applying for or taking a second job or a summer job or a winter break job because the minimum wage is higher. Perhaps there will be more competition for their shops because they actually pay some big now up but no one is stopping anyone from having those jobs. I just don't know where that comes from their jobs. That don't exist. Because they would not be economical at fifteen dollars an hour and there and that would be economical at twelve dollars an hour and by that by outlawing will you are saying it is illegal to enter a labor agreement for twelve dollars an hour by outlawing that you are then limiting the number of jobs how big of effect that is really depends on market forces there but yes a lot of the people working minimum wage jobs or jobs between the minimum wage and fifteen dollars are people who are young people who are trying to provide for a family or people who are working a second job. Tim would you say that. That affect seems to be weaker than you might have expected it to be fifteen or twenty years ago. There's been a lot of economic research comparing neighboring counties that have different minimum wages and well economic theory tells you that you will have that effect where if you raise the minimum wage. Too much there will be job loss. And that's clearly true at some level if you had a minimum wage of seventy dollars There would be a lot of jobs that wouldn't exist but it really that that relationship does look like it's a lot weaker than you might expect. It would be looking at economics textbook. I mean i've myself lost a job because of a minimum wage back in the nineteen nineties. Movie theater owner was forced to sell because he was paying me. I think four fifty an hour and the minimum wage went up to five fifteen. So i know it happens. Yes as far as the broader data goes what What the position. i've come around to. Is that if the minimum wage is. is too far above the lowest wages at our Highly present in the market force in the marketplace. That's where it's going to cost jobs but just saying hey these jobs here That are under the current minimum wage. Those aren't necessarily going to disappear. There's definitely flexibility in wages. But it's not infant. And that's i worry about you. Know places in the middle of the country where wages are lower in the cost of living are lower. Those are the ones that. I don't want having to hike their way to fifteen dollars an hour new york city washington dc. I don't worry about them. Because they're not asking employers to provide a huge increase in wages and so the the economic research has shown me that it's not true that every minimum wage hike is gonna cost jobs but if it's too big of a hike over the current wages. That's when it's dangerous. Just one more thought just quickly looking at some data that i pulled up at this argument that minimum wage workers are generally teenagers working in the movie theater. You did in the nineties. Tim does not actually seem to be true More than eighty percent of workers who would benefit from a higher. Minimum wage are over the age of twenty so they are living adult lives. When would think and in fact one third of them are over forty So it's more likely that this is not a second job that they're doing for pocket money to buy candy but they actually are trying to support their families or at least support themselves an adult way so actually paying them. A fair wage is important. It's not just candy. Let's take a break. We come back. We'll talk about abraham lincoln. I've been talking with tim. Carney of the washington examiner and christine emba of the washington post. This is left right and center. You're hearing from our left right and center and we want to hear from you to tweet us at llc kcrw and download the free kcrw app to listen to left right and center on demand. Support comes from neon presenting totally under control from academy award winning filmmaker gibney and directors affiliate harutunian and suzanne hill injure filmed in secrecy over the last five months the three directors interviewed countless scientists and government whistle blowers to expose the shocking truth about the covid pandemic now available on digital vod and hulu back again with left right and center. I'm josh barrow of new york magazine on the right is tim. Carney columnist at the washington. Examiner christina emba columnist at the washington. Post one of the segments of the debate on thursday was about race in america and the conversation went about as you might have expected. Here's part of it. I am the least racist person. I can't even see the audience because it's so dark but i don't care who's in the audience. I'm the least racist person in this room. Okay vice president biden. Let me ask you very quickly. And then have a follow up question for you abraham lincoln. Here's one of the most racist presidents we've had in modern history. He pours fuel on every single free. Cest fire every single one started off his campaign coming down. the escalator. saying is getting rid of those mexican rapist. His ban muslims because they're muslims. He has moved around and made everything worse across the board. He says to the about the poor boys last time we are on stage reset. I told him. Stand down and stand ready. Come on this guy. Is a dog whistle about as big as a foghorn top. I'm gonna give you ten seconds to respond to that. I have you made a reference. To abraham lincoln. Where did that come in. I mean you said handling aware did. No no i said. Not since abraham lincoln. Has anybody done what. I've done for the black community. And i'm starting to say i'm abraham like christine. What did you make it a section. You know i. Well sorry. I just i just have to laugh because the the president needed to step out interrupt both the moderator and joe biden to clarify that he is not in fact abraham lincoln. I did i. I lost it at that part of the debate. It was also fascinating to hear him say. I am the least racist person in the room to kristen. Welker woman of color who was sitting there in front of him. Her response okay. was also perfect. I i think that was just a ridiculous thing for donald trump to say and joe biden was exactly correcting pointing out the numerous Racist things he said some even just earlier in the debate and also the fact that yes he seems to thrive on racist discourse. He riles up his base. By invoking racist tropes this is the air that donald trump breathes to say that he is nearly abraham lincoln if not in fact the reincarnated man himself is just a total total falsehood. It's a farcical statement. Tim if the president thinks he's getting a bad rap here why can't he just say that rather than claiming to be the the least racist person around Comparing himself to abraham lincoln is it. Is this intentionally over the top and unbelievable like why. Why take this line. I think that this is where trumps narcissism is on display. It's good to think of him as just sort of living in this room. That is his own brain and he's the only other person in there I mean here. I i like to try to push back on christine and and that sort of thing but the fact is donald trump's narcissism leads him to believe that he's elise races person in the world because he looks at himself in mirror and sees a perfect man and that when he said stuff like no president has ever worked as hard as i do. That's partly because all he would do is he would see you know Barack obama giving speeches and then notice that barack obama's playing golf and so if he didn't literally see barack obama sitting behind a desk or getting briefed and all that stuff he just thought it didn't happen if it hasn't happened before him then Then it hasn't happened. But i think besides sort of psycho analysis of our our president there. There's an interesting thing to happen here. Which is that we we all have different definitions of racist right like you get called a racist for being a conservative. If you say the word obamacare sometimes and then on the other hand. I think there's a lot of people especially baby boomer white conservatives who think if i haven't mistreated somebody knowingly because of their race then can't even throw the label racism anywhere near me and i don't even wanna hear about the this leftist talk of systemic racism and there's a million definitions in the middle and so trump is using kind of this old idea of this old white baby boomer conservative idea of racism and maybe missed remembering some of his pass at the same time but if we if we set aside the specifics of trump we can say okay. I think a lot of people would say. I've never done a racist thing. In my life would get call the vile racist by people on the left. We need to find a definition of it. That's a lot smarter. That's in the middle. Yeah you know tim. I think that's a really good point that you're making fair is a fiction in sort of the american public. Mind that if you are not actively a member of the k. k. k. You haven't used the n. Word to someone's face You haven't actually kicked out a person of color on the street or something. Then you're not racist. You're just like a nice person living your life. There is no understanding that racism can be more subtle And just as harmful even if it doesn't come with a burning cross. I think many americans just want to believe that they are good people. That are innocent. That they haven't done something wrong and calling them a racist or saying something as racist is very triggering because if ben implies it actually you do have some work to do. I do think that. I i hate to to use the word woke but the americans need to actually wake up and look around Instead of worrying about whether they are being called racist or whether somebody has described something they've done as racist they might want to ask the question. Oh hey am. I actually working to help with racial reconciliation Do i have friends of color. Do i do anything in my real life to know. Benefit the drawn together america if not that is a problem and that is something that we have to deal with trump rushing it aside because he thinks he's almost abraham lincoln does nothing to help and in fact makes nut problem even sharper. I think trump does make it worse. I think biden makes it worse when he says republicans are going to put you all back in chains. But i think also you use the word innocent and it's it's the assignment and the inference of blame in all of this. I gets in the way of us going on Getting better to say you're racist or that was a races action. yes that's triggering because rightly almost. Every american thinks that racism is bad. Okay we've got richard spencer on one side and ninety nine point nine percent of the country saying yes. Racism is bad so to say that's racist for you not to have a black friend which is not what you're saying but that can be the way that it comes across. Sounds like you're accusing somebody of doing something really bad. And they don't think they've done it to say we can promote better racial harmony. And actually you'd be surprised at what you'd learn if you know more about what it's like to be a black man in america if you know more you. I don't think you fully understand what. It's like to be an immigrant in america to make a quick algae i i had a friend who was talking to a mother of a baby who has down syndrome and we. We had heard other parents have a baby with down syndrome. Say oh well you know my my down baby was actually the one who potty trained the quickest or something and so that phrase downs baby we had heard somebody use that word in front of another mother and she said i find that word really offensive and this wasn't scolding my friend who use it was informing her. Hey you know what that sounds like. It's reducing my child to her disability. It was his moment where somebody who didn't know was educated in a kind and loving way. And i don't feel that we have a lot of space for that when it comes to discussions race and donald trump makes it worse. Yes but were Joe biden isn't necessarily making it making it a lot better. you know. we'll have to say though that actually with that example the you use. I think that joe biden did a really good job in the debate using the example of black parents talking to their kids about how to drive How to keep their hands visible. When they're you know talked to by the police that sort of thing. I think he has been drying more recently to to bring that experience alight. And angry you tim. I think that people don't wanna be accused of things. I think that people you know. Want to continue to feel innocent And i do think that you know in a pluralistic society. If we want to get along we have to be sensitive to other people's feelings at the same time. Sometimes you have to say that things are bad That people are doing something wrong. There are better and worse Ways to do this. But i'm not sure that we should just outlaw. The use of the word racist because it makes people uncomfortable. Sometimes people have to be uncomfortable. That's just how life works. I wanna talk a little bit about some of the other topics they discussed in this in this race exchange because the president had his pitch For black voters and christine. I want to get your thoughts on it. Because basically the the president's line was i did this criminal justice reform bill that didn't get done in the biden administration Joe biden was behind the crime. Bill or was it was a supporter of the crime. Bill that was part of a trend that you also saw statehouses that increased mass incarceration president touted his economic record and the and the broad prosperity that was being shared in ahead of the pandemic And so. I think that you know this isn't a message. That's connecting with most black voters. But what we do see in the polls as well. The president is running significantly worse with white voters than than he was four years ago. He has had improvement at the margins with black and hispanic voters especially black and hispanic men and so it seems to me that the there is at least some audience for the trump pitch on this issue. Yeah i think that there is perhaps some audience for any trump pitch on any issue That doesn't mean that that audiences you know various significant or enough to make a difference in the election Continue to think that you know trump's fall back on the well. The economy is better in black. People are employed is not actually a great pitch You know it's it's great to be employed. Black people should be employed. But is that the only thing that you can say. He also pulled out this a very similar line when when he was talking about pollution. There a question about why Black and hispanic people are more likely to live near a toxic oil refineries a toxic waste plants etc and trump as. Well they have good jobs. They're making money First of all. That's not necessarily true. And second of all the choice between living next to a toxic waste dump and making money or having a job should not be one that americans are forced to make should not be joyce that black and hispanic americans are forced to make. Every american should see their wages. Increase should be able to hold a job. That's not enough. That's not a big enough cell to the black community. This is also the debate where president trump got to air his accusations against the biden family. the new york post story about this apparent laptop that appears to have belonged under biden and emails from it about his business ventures. Tim was there an argument here yet. I think you know the the president talks about this as the laptop from hell and sort of trying to reprise the way that the hillary clinton's emails were discussed. But it's not clear to me that that people have an understanding of exactly what the accusation is here. The wall street journal new side reporting on this. Is that when you look at these documents. You don't see any indication that there was an actual linked to joe biden himself here. So what is the supposed argument about. Why voters should care about any of this. Well first of all you're right. That donald trump. It's really weird that this guy who's sort of spoke directly to the people talks most in kind of jargon than people outside of his little bubble that fox constantly don't get and he did not explain what the sort of Scandal here was and again the day after the debate. You got multiple reports suggesting that joe biden was not involved in what really was Sketching typical washington corruption by hunter biden. Which was selling his access and his name to ukrainian into chinese companies to try to get them connections again. The the most relevant question is not was hunter. Sketchy i think. The media has covered up for him too much but the relevant question for voters was joe biden get enriching himself or is he playing along with any of this access selling by his son. We haven't assabah sad reporting on friday mornings sort of undermine that statement so i at this point now i'm ready to agree that it doesn't look like it implicates Job biden very much because it was just his son doing a very typical washington thing and and selling connections and best case. Scenario for joe biden is that his son was kind of ripping off these chinese and ukrainians. Because he wasn't actually getting him. Anything from his father christine. Do you do worry about this at all. do you worry that. This is connecting with voters. You know i really don't In part because as tim said trump seems to just speak in this almost insane fox news. Can't that's basically impenetrable. Anybody who doesn't mainland. Sean hannity every night. But it was interesting to see him. Try and do in this debate. I mean last time. Trump went after hunter biden. He exposed joe. Biden is being a caring dad who supports his troubled son. And that was the news story for the next two weeks at this time. I guess he was coach to not explicitly go after hunter biden so as to Not further exposed. Joe biden's emotionality and care And instead you know gave himself rather gave joe biden opening to talk not about any corruption from his family but trump secret bank accounts in china and all of the corruption that has been you know flowing from the trump administration for the past three and a half years and unfortunately there is a lot of material there so i don't think that trump is winning anyone with this argument at this point yet and that was interesting to me because it was sort of joe biden who i brought up this story in the debate. At least obliquely he talked about how rudy. Giuliani is hunting for dirt on him. And it's rudy giuliani. Who's been shopping. This laptop around although reporters from nbc news said they asked early on. Can we see the whole hard drive. And he won't share it with them but then so he brings this up. And it gives trump the opening to talk about hunter and hunters business and then biden turns that around to say where your tax returns and what about all of your overseas entanglement so it seems to me that if you're a single issue voter on the question of does this candidate have too many family members doing too much business with compromising entities overseas. It's clear no contest. That that biden is your. You're better candidate that issue. So this actually i think is a. It's it's funny to put it that way josh but it's somewhat of a false frame because for a lot of voters almost no voters are single issue voters so we are weighing lots of issues. And let's say for a lot of conservatives we like alone we like lower taxes. We like better judges but we're worried about corruption. Even if we say yeah yeah. We grant that That trump and the family corruption is worse but by that doesn't mean biden's at zero just because a republican is going to carry some rural county doesn't mean that it doesn't matter whether he gets eighty percent or twenty percent in that is my analogy the fact that joe biden throughout his career has had really close sketchy dealings both involving his sons and local banks in delaware involving his chiefs of staff and lobbying. I've written about these. Burmese oilfields that got exemptions to a sanctions bill. Joe biden pass while his chief of staff was lobbying for the oil company. That had the contract there with burma's corrupt government all of these Biden things get a pass and part of it is because of that people say well. He's not going to be more corrupt than trump. Well but if he's a little bit closer and also care about other issues that can weigh into your vote. Joe biden is not perfectly clean on corruption on self-dealing. He's fairly typical of washington. And we shouldn't cover that up just because we think trump is worse. Yeah i i. i don't know christine. I mean this is sort of what the president was getting out more. Broadly about forty seven years in washington on the other hand biden was one of the the least wealthy members of the senate while he was in the senate. The president likes to talk about his houses including one that he bought for less than two hundred thousand dollars. Some some decades ago But it's you know i. I guess the question is does. The biden doesn't seem to have the the you know the the career politician things stick to him in the way that it might to some others when you look in polls people you know are his honest and trustworthy. Numbers are much better than donald. Trump's much better than hillary clinton's and that sort of the thing that i would look at to the question of do voters perceive this person as corrupt right. I'd have to agree. I mean tim. You make the point. That joe biden isn't perfectly clean. He's been in washington he has been in politics for forty seven years Donald trump is definitely extremely not clean His dealings are in fact. Filthy obvious and everybody can see that Yes i mean we could admit that you know both people have done something wrong but one is clearly worse than the other and we are also in an election season where we are voting deciding between two presidential candidates if one is by far worse than the other on a certain topic that we're interested than that's how people make their decisions but again Very few people are single issue corruption. Voters i kind of wish. More people were right but very few people are. And so if you're going to say if you are pro-life conservative and i know a lot of them who are torn you say. Joe biden is really bad on abortion and trump despite whatever's personal views it has governed. Okay trump is really bad on corruption. Well it might matter whether joe biden's at zero or a fifty even if trump is up at ninety and so that's why. I think it's really important to cover these things ron claiborne. Who's the lead runner to be biden's chief of staff if he wins is a career revolving door lobbyists for people like fannie mae. You've got alan hoffman. Half of chiefs of staff most of them have gone on and done the sort of lobbying inside a revolving door stuff that a lot of americans find this tasteful. That should be out there that we know what we're getting with this guy. It's not just off. Shucks working class Joe it's another typical washington guy. Yes you may think a typical washington guys better than donald trump but for people who are otherwise more conservative. These things weigh in. Let's take a break talking with christina of the washington post and tim. Carney washington examiner. We'll be back with jessica who's men from propublica to talk about voting. You're listening to left right and center. You're hearing civilized yet provocative opinions from all sides. Now we need to know what you think. Tweet us at l. Rc kcrw extreme. All episodes of left right and center and our companion show. All the president's lawyers at kcrw dot com slash podcasts or from the kcrw app support for kcrw comes from nation builder software for leaders. Whether you're advocating for your community supporting a campaign running a nonprofit or even running for office there are people out there. Fired up to help you nation. Builder can help you. Inspire them to take action it puts your website. crm communications and fundraising tools. All in one place you can focus on your cause go nation. Builder dot com slash. Kcrw start a fourteen day free trial and get an additional month of service free. Thank you for listening to this. Kcrw podcast in case. You don't know us. Kcrw is public radio in los angeles bringing the best of npr to southern california. We're also known for our own brand of bold and innovative program. Evocative storytelling taste making music and audio documentaries. That are little movies for your ears. You can join our community to support this show and others or make a one time donation just to say thank you more at kcrw dot com slash. Join back again with left right and center. I'm your host. Josh barrow on the right is tim. Carney columnist at the washington. Examiner on the left is christina. Emba columnist at the washington post election. Day is november third but of course the election is already well underway with even more early voting than usual this year the elections project estimates that nearly fifty one million people had already voted as of friday morning about thirty five million of them by mail and fifteen million of them in person. Although states don't necessarily break that out in the way they do the reporting the voting process has also been legally and logistically chaotic this year as election agencies move too much more mail voting than usual and political parties. Sue over the rules under which people vote. This has some voters worried. About how smoothly the voting process will go and about how to make sure. Their votes are counted so jessica. Who's men joins us to talk about that now. Just as a reporter at propublica covers voting rights and election administration. Hello jessica he thinks so much for having me absolutely. Thank you for joining us. So how is early voting going. We've all seen these pictures on. Social media of long lines at polling places. Is that typical. Is that a reflection of of this being a really problematic process. Is it just enthusiasm. Is that unusual. What's going on an unusual. Expect to see long lines It just the way that american democracy functions for better or worse. There's there's no suggestion that this year the lines are markedly worse or different than they than they once were. We're seeing a quite a lot of unexpected enthusiasm in places and then what we're also seeing that. A lot of folks who requested about by mail do end up voting in person and canceling that mail in ballot out at the polls which takes several minutes which slows some things down. And you know we can kind of ponder about why people might be making that choice but But i think that election administrators are largely doing fine with the midday curve balls. They've been thrown this year. What about making sure that votes count in. Uh there's been a lot of concern about rejected mail ballots for example. You might be in a state where you need. A witness signature on mail ballot. People might know that might not get one are states doing a good job of making sure that that's being running away such that people who send in their votes by mail. They'll actually be counted. You know that's a real mixed bag. So this is one of the things that i've been concerned about since the start of this pandemic which is that states that have gone to vote by mail in previous years have had a lot of time to do that. It took a decade to stand up vote by mail in oregon and colorado and hawaii and the the biggest part of that is teaching voters how to be productive part of this process and ensure that they know all the rules that takes actually quite a lot of voter education a lot of time a lot of investment a lot of money. And it's just not possible to do that type of vast outreach. In six months as we stand up the entire but by mail system in many states that have one. So i think we are waiting to see a lot of rejected ballots and i'm hopeful that some of the student your processes that states have put in place because they also anticipate this will alleviate some of the problem that we are going to have a lot of people who've never cast ballots before do so this year Most new voters are people of color are younger and so because of that we will see just fortunate. Number of their ballots rejected that could have been avoided if we had lots of education Around this problem but you were just running out of time. Let's talk about pennsylvania. pennsylvania may be what's called the tipping point state in this election. Which is that you know. Whoever wins pennsylvania. That's the thing that puts them over the top and gives them two hundred seventy electoral votes So it's the keystone state in in more ways than one and there's been a lot of litigation over how absentee voting will be conducted in pennsylvania. And you've gotten mixed results where the republicans have won. Some of the questions and democrats have others. What are you looking at in pennsylvania in terms of what might end up being an issue as they try to count their vote. You know i think that. The supreme court delivered them a a pretty good ruling couple of days ago when they split four four which essentially just uphold the lower court's ruling. So they have a little bit more time to count the ballots But i do think that we're seeing some sort of organizational issues there. I think that's one of the more insidious parts about litigating elections right down to. The final deadline is that election administrators and county workers are living in a space that they don't know how to operate and because no final decisions have been made and the shorter that you make that window. The more chaotic election day will end up being simply because they had far less time to prepare for whatever. The final rules ended up being tim when we have these lawsuits in general it's republicans on the side To make it harder to count the ballots for example in pennsylvania. Republicans wanted to keep a rule that the ballot had to be received by election day. In order to count on the state moved to say no so long as you postmark. The ballot election day can be counted. Even if it's received several days later that ended up the pennsylvania supreme court ruled in favor of that and the us supreme court didn't touch that. But why why wouldn't republicans want people's ballots to count if they show up after election day so long as they were sent in by election day. That shouldn't those voters have their voices heard. This is properly a question for the state. Legislature and not a question for the judge is the state law was very clear like it or not. Absentee ballot had to be received by election day. This is for the sake of counting the votes more quickly and again the state legislature has the ability to do that. And if you wanted to change it that's where you're going to change it. But what happened is the state supreme court. Just kind of said. Now that's not fair and we're going to act like a legislature and rewrite it so it is true that in this case republicans were lobbying for in effect counting ballots. But they're also saying these rules that have been written down and pass through the just way that they should stand. We want votes to count. We also want the rule the game to be played by the rules that were written before we started. Playing the game christine. Obviously there has to be a limiting principle here somewhere you. There has to be a date on which all the ballots after we received because you have to count and certified the election. And so i guess the is. Is tim right that the state can write that rule however it wants is it infringement on somebody's voting rights if you say that it has to be received by election day where where. Where is the line where tim would be wrong. And it's not just a matter that you know the legislature can make whatever rule it likes Well i think The moment that it could be wrong as the moment that we're in right now in which pandemic now highly contagious disease has upended our lives the way that we vote the way that we move around out of doors The fact that trying to participate in our democracy if you then come down with this virus infect kill you I think that state legislatures yesterday. Tj theories should be taking steps to make it easier and more plausible for people to vote safely. I think the question that you asked beforehand. Josh is the right one. Why don't republicans want votes to be counted. Why don't they want people represented. Why don't they want democracy to exist as fully as it can even in times of trial and difficulty. I think we all know the answer. Well there's there's a technical answer here. And and that i think is comes down to the fact that The less engaged voters who are going to vote a lot of times. They're brought into the electorate by activist groups. That are more likely to be on the left. And i would like republicans who respond to that not by trying to Discourage these less engaged voters from voting but to find their own lesson gave voters our own activist groups and matt. Celeste sort of last minute Ballot drives just. I want to ask about texas because that's another state where there's been a lot of national coverage of the voting issues in this. This question of dropbox is the counties. Have set up for absentee ballots in the state trying to impose limitations on that But i also see that there's been looks like really high turn out in early voting in texas so is it. Is it easy or difficult to vote in texas right now You know. I think that really depends on your life situation. I think that if you are you know a normal person in texas with no co morbidity is and you have an id and your person of some means than it's going to be pretty easy to vote. I voted yesterday in dallas. And you know it took no time at all. And i walked out with an i voted sticker but you know if you are a person that is concerned about contract corona virus No it's not been very easy to vote in texas this year With going in person and presenting yourself with a bit of risk texas did not expand mail and boating Beyond what we have seen a we've seen more interest in mail in voting. I think because there are people who qualified for mail in voting that you may not have taken advantage of it because they didn't feel strongly about it in previous elections but do now the dropbox thing has interesting and kind of gets at a point. That the that that you're panelist were Mentioning which is that in texas. The the counties had only historically been allowed to have one dropbox And when governor greg abbott put out his executive orders that freed things up. Just a little bit expanded absentee voting Count days and expanded early voting and gave more authority to counties to be flexible counties use that as justification to open more and gravitates line of reasoning is exactly like your panelists. Which is that. he's not asking for anything. Less than what is normal and that the rules were the rules. For a reason. I think fish that ignores a couple of things which is that in texas whole bought. The drought offices are not like the drop boxes and other states. They are manned at all times. You have to present your idea and you can only submit your own ballot so you know. A lot of the security concerns that republicans used to justify not having drop boxes. Don't really apply here. And the secretary of state's office in texas had issued multiple legal opinions two counties about how legal it was for them to have a second dropbox under this emergency order and it was all kind of taken back so i think you know. Emergency orders were vague in the beginning. Because we didn't really understand we're dealing with shows to deal with that vague and vice and many different ways and now we're all just of starting to figure out what we meant when we issued our orders six months ago. What should we be looking for on election night. Because i know one of the complications and pennsylvania's the state's not allowed to start counting absentee ballots Until the morning of election day. And because there's going to be a huge volume of them compared to past years that's going to take a while. So we may not have a result from pennsylvania for some time but there are other states that will that will count faster. You are there states. You're going to be watching the you think we're gonna know the results relatively soon. You'll listening to the heartland newsfeed ready nip work at live dot heartland use fee dot com. This stream is supported by advertisers and contributions by us on facebook twitter and instagram befall would be difficult on jack callaghan fox news for the eleventh day in a row. New cases of the corona virus have topped one hundred thousand per day. The us one hundred eighty four thousand cases on thursday in an effort to slow the rise. More states are imposing restrictions. New mexico's governor. Michelle luhan grisham on. The mexicans are instructed to shelter in place. You should stay at home except for only the most essential trips for health safety and welfare. Whose orders in place through thanksgiving house speaker. Nancy pelosi sounding the alarm. 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Cleansing university and libertarian presidential candidate. Joe jorgenson welcome to the rubin report. Oh so glad to be here. Thanks for having me well. I'm thrilled to have you. And i know for sure that my audience is thrilled to have you. Because i've received roughly four billion tweets thing. Why haven't you had jo jorgensen on so for the record. We have been trying to make this happen for awhile and we finally finally did make it happen. We weren't avoiding you and you were not avoiding us. Is that fair to say. Hey you just you just couldn't catch up to the bus Back there chasing my bus. You gotta powered a superpower bus over there okay. So there's a lot of stuff that i want to talk to you about. And i think you know a bit about my sort of political evolution and probably most of my political stances. You may not know that. I actually did. Vote for the libertarian candidate. In the last election. I did vote for gary johnson. I had gary johnson on my show. I i like gary johnson. I don't think he was. You know the strongest libertarian candidate in a year that there was a moment for it. So i guess my first question. That'll probably set up. Everything else is if it didn't work in two thousand sixteen when so many people were frustrated. What is different this time. what why should a libertarians. Have hope this time. Why think something really big. That's different is donald trump because in two thousand sixteen. He was running as an outsider. He said look. I don't have fifty years of political baggage. I'm not paying back favors. I'm an outsider. I'm a businessman and how to balance a budget and how to cut spending. And i know how to get get stuff done basically and i'll bring the troops home and so that's why the polls got it wrong because People voted for him. Who never voted or hadn't voted for twenty years. And so now it's four years later and we can see that he's acted pretty much like all the professional politicians that he's increase the deficit. He's increase the debt. Still has some brought the troops home. So now i think that maybe people will say you know Maybe republicans are beyond hope now. Libertarians have known that republicans are beyond hope since nineteen seventy-one and that's why the party was formed after richard. Nixon stopped acting like a republican. But maybe now the republican vote and let me say. There are many republican voters who want smaller government. It's republican politicians. Who aren't giving it to them. And so maybe after having an outsider come in a businessman who supposedly compounds the budget. Maybe they'll say you know it's time for a real leader. So what would you say to the conservatives or republicans who want smaller government. They want lower taxes and they're looking in there going okay. Trump did cut some taxes. He got rid of some regulation. We're clearly not going into other wars at the moment. We're bringing troops that are basically looking at that stuff and going. Hey trump did give us a bunch of the stuff that we want yes. Is the budget going up. Yeah but the budgets. The deficit going up. Yeah but it always seems to go up. Do you think he's done anything. Right from a libertarian perspective. Well he has cut some regulations. However i'd like to point out that a tax cut is also going to be possibly increase in spending if they don't do anything to make that up so Again he the deficits are going up. Either way yeah. The the exactly the bottom line spending's going up and that's what counts. Even if we're not paying for this year would be paying for next year. Tenure some now twenty years from now and that's that's what matters. Are you constantly amazed as libertarian telling people we want you to keep more of your money is not more of a winning ticket. I think when people really hear it if you bash them over the head with it over and over and over again and you're like yeah we want you to have your money not them. I get it but it seems like it's such an easy sale and yet for some reason people just don't understand it or don't absorb it yes. Well really frustrates me. Are people like bill gates or oprah. Winfrey who say yeah. The government doesn't take enough of my money tax me more but look at what bill gates us. He starts the bill and melinda gates foundation. Does you no good work. And a oprah winfrey her own school right over in africa well if they think that the government can do a better job than they can. Why are they starting their own foundations. Why not simply turn all that money over the federal government and so. I think that actions speak louder than words and if even they aren't turning their money over. I think that that should send a message to everybody else that hate the government doesn't do a good job. I can't think of much that the government does a better job than the private sector. And i think that bill gates Oprah winfrey and all these other liberals who want bigger government. I think that they're just proving our point for us. So what do you think is going on in their heads there is it just. Is it misguided nece or is it guilt or is it that they know that the machine and the media will like them more if they take these positions. I'm hoping it's ignorance the true sense of the word ignorance because a lot of people just don't understand how things work and that's one of the biggest compliments that i get from people i just. You know non libertarian friends. After they meet me they say you know what. I read the news differently. Now i look at things differently. Now they don't for instance yeah. We cut taxes. Okay what about spending so. You can look at things in a superficial way and think things are going. Great without the understanding are the underlying. What's going on beneath at all. Does the thing that frustrates you. The most have anything to do with the sort of simplistic way. We look at politics where you know. Half of the country seems to think that if you tell them they're getting something for free they seem to think it actually is free and combating. That notion is almost impossible. You say free healthcare you say free education free money now literally free money. It's like that combating. Oh but you do have to pay for it. That's just not what we do publicly very well. yes. I would have thought that with the obama phone. Remember those basically what obama's going to reach into his back pocket and by everybody a phone. And that's what i've been telling everybody about these twelve hundred dollar checks that they're getting is that money is coming from somewhere and i know that you know supposedly there was a holdup because donald trump wanted his name written on the actual check. Well i don't think that check is coming from his back pocket or his private checking account. It's coming from us. So somehow they give us money and and make it you know make it seem like it's a santa claus or something but what's frustrating is That they take our taxes out our income taxes so that we get a tax refund every year after april and so looks like. We're getting something. And i wish they had never started that practice. I don't think we'd be where we are. Now if people actually had the head to feel the pain and right now people feel the pain when they're teenagers and they quickly forget you know so many times here about somebody's You know friends Kid who goes to work and like wait a minute. I worked twenty hours this week. Wh where is this money going. And it's like well welcome to the world of being an adult welcome to the world of taxes and so feels painful then but by the time you're thirty forty years old and it's grown and grown you've kind of forgotten about it so yeah so i can't talk to the libertarian presidential candidate without mentioning the phrase that everyone says that Getting libertarians to agree on anything is like hurting a bunch of cats. And i think when people think of the party the party itself they think of the naked guy running onstage all the crazy characters and everything else what do you think the libertarians have perhaps done wrong if the ideas are right well. I think what we did wrong. Decades ago was try to focus on philosophy. Although i think the libertarian party pretty much had to do it because when the party started forty years ago we didn't have or actually more than forty years ago. Fifty years ago we didn't have all of these outlets we didn't have all these educational groups all these research institutions. So we pretty much had to do it all so we focused on philosophy and in fact it's interesting. Reading original libertarian. Papers that talk about how. We shouldn't even run candidates in our political party and maybe not run candidates because our job is to educate will now. We no longer need to do that. And so that's why. I'm so happy to be the candidate. And i'm really glad that i was able to draw together both the pragmatic caucus and the radical caucus Who somewhat agreed on me. Because when i'm trying to do is i'm trying to give a practical message to the american public and that talk about self ownership. Not talk about me. Talk about okay. You know what. You're having a hard time paying your mortgage because the your health care bills are so high you know or we hear about people being sent off around the world and you know your friends your neighbors. Your relatives being killed in a senseless war. So let's talk about things they care about and take off our philosophy hat and put on our political hat. Yeah do you think that there's a better chance because of what you said earlier that this is the year to make the dent because it seems to me like there was in the summer before the election. There was suddenly this buzz for a few weeks of like. Oh maybe there's this libertarian thing that could happen or at least i mean. I did a video in august. When i said that. I'm gonna vote for gary johnson. I said really look. Maybe he can't win. But i at least wanna get the guy in a debate. Now you did not get in the debates So i'm guessing you're not to happy about that but what about combating the system. Can you just talk about what it's been like to just combat the two party thing. Oh it's been an uphill battle and what people don't realize is. The one thing that i hate is how the libertarian party is put as one of the other third parties right and i've been asked. Will you debate the other third parties and my answer is no because we need to be on the debate. Stage with the democrats and republicans. We are the only political party other than the democrats and republicans to have a presidential candidate on the ballot and back presidential elections. You know we have joined the adult and that's the way we need to be treated and it is frustrating but of course the democrats republicans. They don't want us anywhere near because we're going to show that there is a real turn it of and we keep hearing the media talk about Talk about two old rich white guys. And i would say that's not even the worst part. The worst part is neither of home is going to let you make your own decisions. Neither of home going to let you spend your own money. Neither of whom is going to bring the troops home and neither of whom is going to do anything but crushing healthcare costs. And so i've been telling people hashtag fake debates because if we don't get the message out there then people aren't going to see a real alternative because there's really not a big alternative. You know they. They create a lot of fake drama. But they're both big government people as we saw with trump and so now we just have to wait and see what happens and we hear the you know. The debate commission who of course is made up of half democrats half republicans. Wouldn't serve the american people. You know too. Many people on sage forgetting that we saw what nine democrats on the stage at a time and they can't have three or even four and also when you look at the debates limiting it to to. It's not there to help the american people. It's there to help the democrat and republican party. They truly do have a monopoly on that all right so let's backup for a second because you mentioned that fifty years ago. There was this debate whether the libertarians are even run a candidate so for for some people that are watching this right now. that don't fully get. What a libertarian is. Can you libertarian. One oh one and sort of what is you know. The reason that it's so hard to heard these cats is when you talk a libertarian. There's always someone that wants less government so you get it to less. Then someone says lesson then someone's is less and less and less until you're endlessly everyone. It always ends in the debate about driver's licenses or something like that. What what is a libertarian to you. I say libertarian is somebody who's on your side and not the side of the politicians bureaucrats lobbyists and the special interests. And i tell people that you know best. What's best for you and not. The people in washington here simple. You should be able to make your decisions about education. Healthcare retirement all of these things that are going through the government. You should be able to make your own decision about. Do you ever think in a in a weird way. So i guess in a depressing way at some of that ship has sailed that explaining to people why government shouldn't be involved. Y you should keep more of what you earn all of these things that it sort of what we talked earlier but but in they get it but it's sort of like they can't even fathom a life where the government wouldn't do all of these things what you know. I was disheartened for a while. However with covid. I'm seeing that. No we haven't lost our individualism. I was so ecstatic to see those people storming around the michigan state house saying hey we're the land of the free home of the brave. You can't lock us up like this or to see the dallas hairdresser or to see even the shots. We've seen of nancy pelosi being a hypocrite. I think people are finally saying. Hey wait a minute. This isn't what america's supposed to be about. And so i think they're now feel libertarians out. People like me who joined the party. Decades ago we've always had this yearning to have freedom and to have more liberty in our lives. But i think the average person probably didn't feel it they didn't feel big government upon them until recently and they're being told they have to wear a mask wherever they go and they're being told nope you're under house arrest you gotta stay home. You can't go to your job and people. I think are beginning to question it. So what is the proper libertarian response to bid and lockdowns and everything else if you were president right if you were president in february and if you were president right now what would what would be different well. The biggest biggest mistake that trump made was he didn't get the fda out of the way and again when. Ask me why i'm running for. President is because government is too big too bossy. Too nosy too intrusive. And the worst part is they hurt the very people that are trying to help the. Fda is an excellent example of that that with the fda there were dozens of testing kits that we could have had. But the fda them originally we were allowed to have two of them. So meanwhile southeast asia they're doing extensive testing seen who needs to stay home and who can go out and work in the meantime sitting down our economy and on top of that we had dr are. We had a trump appointee on stage with dr fauci saying you know what if you don't have symptoms no need to get tested while at the very time. He said that they knew that over. Half the people at least that was the wisdom at the time that over half the people who had the virus had no symptoms at all. So that's the time you need to have testing when you don't know if you have it or not. And what about the lockdown specifically yes. Well what about about the testing specifically that we basically were locking down because they didn't know who would be healthy enough to be out on the streets so how about testing us letting us test ourselves and then we would know. And here's the irony from my part is one of my grandfather's is from sweden and his family immigrated here to have freedom a tab the freedom that they didn't have in sweden and yet sweden's Stores and shopping malls and educate Restaurants in schools allstate open. So they're able to move around freely. Meanwhile we supposedly the land of the free that people immigrate to for freedom. We're under house arrest. So that's just a travesty. So it's just rather ironic that my family came here for freedom and at the old country was giving them more freedom at least with in this regard right so would you have left the decisions about lockdowns up to the states because in effect that's what trump basically has done. I assume that that you're okay with that. Right you wouldn't have wanted this to be a federal mandate well again. Actions speak louder than words. Trump was encouraging the states. To lock down. I think the governor's were following his lead. Because the president is in a role of leadership and i think they were only doing what he wanted them to. Now he's saying open back up we had but you already told us to close down so He shouldn't have given that message to begin with. And what frustrates me. It's one more example where people are thinking that they only have one decision that that we should all vote have one decision and we don't people are under the mistaken impression that if the government doesn't tell store masks. We're not porno or masks and walmart shot. that down. walmart has a policy where you have to wear a mask if you're if you work there if your vendor if you're a shopper. Whoever you have to wear masks and walmart so why can't we have a world in which we vote with our feet. Vote with our dollars. If we wanna wear a mask then we go to walmart and we don't wanna wear masks. We go to other stores. Why can't we have that. And it's really frustrating because on my local new show The the my mayor of the city. Where i live required started requiring a mask for all grocery stores and drugstores and so they do the man on the street you know interview asking. Do you think we shelve masks. And sure some people are saying yes. It's a good idea. Other people were saying no and it was frustrating that nobody said well wait a minute. How can we all have to follow the same rule. And that's what i try to get across the idea with. Libertarians is how 'bout we each do what we want to do. And we don't need the government. Taina store mask clerk plenty of people who'd wear masks anyway right so i'm with you on that that it can be up to the store it can be up to the restaurant and they can figure out whatever policies if they want people to wear masks do they want people to take their temperature or whatever it might be. I'm actually completely on. What would your counter argument be then to the people who would say. Oh well if you leave it just up to the individuals that people are gonna do whatever they want and then will cause. More of a spread will again. You don't have to go outside for instance. My mother was in the high risk group and so she just didn't go to the grocery store and her friends went for her. So there's no rule saying that you have to go outside and go shopping or go anywhere so i would say that you know the governor. Nobody's putting a gun to your head and asking you to walk the streets or going into specific grocery stores and also again. That's just giving the impression that were too stupid to do anything on our own and if you look. There was a survey that was done sometime. May around april early. May where when some of the places we're starting to open up and they ask people do you think we're opening up too early and the polls showed that something like seventy percent of the people thought that we were opening up too early so it just shows that even in a free market people would be a little leery and would be taking precautions. Yeah all right. let's. Let's move off kobe and talk about the the other big thing that's happening at the moment. Obviously there the protests and the riots and antifa and black lives matter and the rest of it A couple of weeks ago. You sent out a tweet that seemed to support the black lives matter movement specifically and i know you got a lot of pushback on that. Can you just sort of lay out what you were tweeting. I dunno you didn't quite walk it back but there was a little bit of an exchange about it. Yeah it was a typo from a staff member who had capitalized black. Lives matter as in the movement as in the marxist group now let me point out that not all of the people who are marching out there with black lives matter are part of the national marxist party and of course libertarian would be the opposite of marxist however if you look he shares so many concerns we share the please the The qualified immunity right No knock raids The racist war on drugs so there are all these things all these problems that we agree with mont. The problem is we see a different solution. They want to go for more government whereas we see less government is the answer and i was able to meet with a local black lives matter leader who to do with the with a major group and i spent the whole day with him and i sat down and explained the free market to him and By the way he's he's a black preacher he had previously been in prison and we had a great talk and and he said yeah. This makes a lot of sense and the one thing he didn't know. And this is the message. That i've been trying to get out is for instance role heard about rosa parks. Write the heroic bike woman who refused to sit on. The back of the bus will what they're not telling you is that that was a government. Run government owned busk and that at the time. Sixty percent of the bus ridership were blacks. So if you look at it in a free market today with uber. What if uber were to discriminate against the best sixty percent of their customers. They would go bankrupt as well they should and i explain this to him and he said wow no. I didn't know that was a government. Busk and yeah. You're right they would go out of business and so when i explained how government had no accountability. He said yes that makes a lot of sense. And so if we can sit back to kind of educating if we can kind of show to these people look. You're going to the very people who are causing these problems. Maybe we can Get somewhere yeah. It is interesting because some of the stuff. That's overlapping. i always find that the the left or the marxist progressives they always say okay we've got a problem with the government and our solution is more government and the libertarian say. Okay we got a problem at our solution is less government. It's hard to get them to understand that. But if you can. I think that that's probably the inroads for you guys. I'm curious with that in mind with that in mind. Where do you stand on the nineteen. Sixty four civil rights act because i've had some interesting debates with libertarians. On whether it should have been passed or not and then if you if you say no it shouldn't have been passed immediately. Of course you're called a racist but there are some limited government principles that i think do make sense as to why you wouldn't pass the usually it ends up with everyone saying okay. Well we just shouldn't relitigate it. Yes so i have no problem with it being passed when it was passed. Keep in mind that this shortly after rosa parks and so There was systemic racism in government. There still is and so if government is the problem then yes of course we should have rules that government fixes it however i would say that right now. The free market can do a much better job than the government. What they should have done was they should have had sunset laws or something like that because keep in mind. What happened was immediately after they freed the slaves. The blacks doing great There were skilled craftsmen. They were offering their services at a lower price to get their foot in the door. Which by the way. That's what i did. When i started my own business you know. Hey try me out. I'll give you lower price and so they were wildly successful and so the whites. What they did was instead of saying. How can we compete with them. I guess maybe we should lower our prices to they said no. What laws can we pass. And they started his laws to where you know. You can't be a wood carver. She can't read at a fourth grade level. Whatever so so. It was through the power of big government that we got here. So that's the only reason why don't mind the nineteen sixty four civil rights act because it was because government was a problem so government needs to fix it but and i've gotten i've gotten criticized for bringing this example up but the thing is you can before you can be against but that's what that's the free market is all about. Sometimes we don't like what the free market does. Sometimes we do but You may have heard of the case where this woman who worked for this large company Put all lives matter on her facebook and she was fired and the key here was she wasn't. It wasn't a company. Facebook and she wasn't discriminating against an employee. Subordinate customer vendor anybody. Completely outside and yet she was fired. So this shows me that the tide is turning and the free market can handle this better than the government. Because we've got the profit motive involved now. A lot of people said well. That's not what we mean. Well you know. Sometimes you don't like with the free market does but it's it's society showing where it's values are i think. Society's values have come a long way. And i think the average american has much better values and much less discriminatory behavior than the government does. Well i always find it funny when people say if you rolled back some of these laws if you've got the government the way that suddenly people would be opening up white only restaurants and it's like most people that open restaurants. I'm pretty sure it's because they want to serve food. It's not because they're racist and if it was if there was a whites only racist restaurant. I'm pretty sure you wouldn't go there in the market would crush on with you on that but you did say one thing that i do want to clarify so i understand why you were saying that. There was systemic racism. Meaning that the south had jim crow laws and the government could come in and fix that. But you said you said is or is currently that there is currently systemic racism. I don't wanna put words in your mouth. So can you describe. Well actually i. Can you just define what you mean by systemic racism and then give me an example of what it is today. Yes i think. The definition is where people get lost. Yes systemic built in the system hence the word system so if you look at the laws let's say drug use right now whites and people of color use drugs at about the same rate and yet six times as many Blacks especially You know looking at people of color are arrested and charged than whites and you might say. Well maybe that's just. They just happened to be there. But you know that that raises another question but the other thing is if you look at drugs that white us compared to drugs that people of color use the drugs that people of color tend to use have longer prison sentences so And if you look at the prison population it with nonviolent with Victimless crimes. Which shouldn't be a crime at all. You'll see that. They actually are charged. More and victimless crimes than our whites. Right so i think the part that confuses people here is that systemic. I think when when someone says systemic racism to me that means that there are laws that are in place that are racist. So as far as i know there are no laws that are in place that erased. I think you're talking about the sort of second order of there may be more policing in certain areas because there's more crime so then and then. I think what a lot of people would say. Well that has more to do with the breakdown of the black family and why that happened something like that right well first of all to me. Systemic can still be part of the You know the the an organization the environment so if if if a cops are out there arresting people of color at a higher rate. Because that's either what they're rewarded for or that's the hidden message or they're just outright. Told you need to. You need to go out to this neighborhood. More often than that still systemic. Even if it's not written. But like i said there are written laws or penalties so that drugs that people of color us have longer prison sentences. So that's actually in the law. Do you know of any of those. That are still on the books. I mean i know i know that in new york city they used to have the law about crack got a higher sentence than cocaine and it was generally thought that more black people use crack because it was easy it was cheaper to get but i know new york city. Got rid of that. Are there still laws like that. Oh yeah oh yeah. And in fact i did check with a one of my respected on friends at kato to just check in i think about three maybe three or four weeks ago and i said okay. Just wanna make sure that all of these laws we were talking about before with The prison sentences and so and he said yes so. I didn't go into detail just because there were so many of them and yes crack. Cocaine is one example than crack. And of course now we get into the drug war and i can't. I have to least point out that milton. Friedman told us that crack cocaine would never been invented. Had cocaine not been legal. It's only because cocaine was illegal. That crack cocaine was even invented. Just like during prohibition People drink less wine and beer and then went to liquor because it was easier to smuggle because it was more powerful so And so i've mentioned the racist war on drugs and people have wondered what i mean by that again. We go right back to the war on drugs is hurting everybody of course but But especially with the uneven prison sentences. Yes yeah so. It's interesting because i think what it sorta whittles down. I think a lot of my audience is going to say the way you're defining. Systemic racism is a little different than than the way they define it. Which is why. I asked that question because there are specific laws or if there was a specific police department that said arrest more arrests more black people. That's in our code of conduct and of course that is wrong but if the question is there happens to be more policing in an area that has more crime in there happened to be more black people there. Well then we have to figure out why that is. I think most people bring that again to the welfare state and the breakdown of the family and the welfare state is very much a lefty policy. Certainly not a libertarian policy. Right absolutely but we'll let me just say that i agree with your listeners. Your viewers that yes. The free market can handle These problems that we've had with discrimination much better than the government and that now what we have is. We're discriminating against asians trying to get into harvard. And go right down the line. It's it's gotten completely out of hand. And i completely agree. Yeah so on the on the drug part of this. I find this to be really interesting. One because i always describe myself as a classical liberal and people always say well. You sound like a libertarian. What is the classical liberal. And i always say look a classical. Liberal in effect is what i would say. A really sort of a realist. Libertarian is meaning that. I love all the libertarian ideas. But i understand. I can't win all the time. And i'm going to have to put some some guardrails there. That's the way the most simplest way that i would describe it so in my book. I talk about the drug war and and i'm for legalizing marijuana. I'm certainly for legalizing psychedelics. And and then we can whittle down every little drug. But i'm not personally for legalizing the seriously hard core stuff and it's not because i want to put people in jail because of their decisions but but the simple truth is i know that if someone was cooking meth next door to me. I know that there's going to be more crime. And i know that that it's going to be riskier to be out there and you don't want kids there and the rest of it. So are you for legalizing absolutely everything with no regulations or is this a place where you find some some middle ground. I know you would kick it to the states regardless. But but where do you fall on this. I mean the at the states right now have laws on drinking and i was appalled when i moved from a state that you could drink pretty much anytime you want and then i moved to the south and i was shocked when i found out what you can't buy alcohol and sunday you know kind of where did i end up here. And in fact we couldn't buy alcohol and sunday until pretty recently so So you know yes. Even though. I don't like those laws. At least there's some competition among laws unless you get the federal government involved and by the way i realized i'm i'm gonna to kind of leave the topic for just a minute just to explain real quick because a lot of people don't know that you know we had. When when i was in school in fact i was a bartender in college because i was in a state where the drinking age was on the eighteen. And that's the way it was back then. The different states had different drinking ages until elizabeth goal transportation secretary in the ninety s came along took in government always says federal government says takes in the money and then dangles the highway funds in front of states and says hey do you want your You want your highway money back. You can have to raise the drinking age now. We can have it as bait. Maybe twenty one is the better drinking age. Whatever but the point is it shouldn't be the federal government deciding that should The state so when i say okay. Let's have the states you know. We'll we'll let the states regulated. If they like i mean really let them regulate it not have the federal government. You know back door in. They're trying to on whole bribes over their heads so they can do what they want so you so you do it fused what you said because you said that you wouldn't legalize the harder drugs but then you talked about you know having somebody have a meth lab is a meth lab iheart detroit. I'm confused. we'll meaning. I wouldn't want if meth was totally legal. Then i suspect that more meth labs would be popping up. And i know that i right now if someone moved in next door was cooking meth next to me. Why we know it's illegal and someone will hopefully do something about it. Assuming we still have a police department here in los angeles. I'm not sure. But if it was legal there would be no recourse and we know what will happen. Crime will expand your shadier. People around your property value will go down cetera. Well i see it completely differently. Because we've got alcoho- alcohol is legal. And i just don't hear of many people making bathtub gin. But that's part of the problem is when you legalize something or decriminalize. It however you want to do it is it has to truly be legal. So for instance in california. They've legalized marijuana but they've limited. The number of people can sell it about all these licensing laws. You've got to pay all these fees so they're still underground. There's still an underground market. There's still people selling marijuana illegally so that means the laws aren't right again. Once last time you heard of anybody selling bathtub gin. That would cause somebody to go blind. You don't because it's legal to the point that we go down and we buy it safely. So if meth were legal there wouldn't be people making it next door. They'd be making it down at philip morris or whoever seagram's whoever makes The other drugs. Okay so i saw. I'm not with you there. But i do understand the line of thinking that that's fine. But what would you say. This is where the conservatives i think. See the libertarian movement. Sort of bananas. Because i think this is where conservatives would say okay i get freedom. I get states rights. I get all that stuff. But you're telling me that ineffective there was enough demand for math. That morris unilever should start making matt if the market demands it and we know that a society filled with math is not great so the conservatives would take sort of. We want to conserve sort of functioning society. Where the libertarians are saying. It's more of a free for all. Do you think that's a fair. It's just sort of like a philosophically different spot. Well i think they're misguided first off if you look where marijuana is legal you haven't seen increase in marijuana use. Let's say in teenagers and you haven't seen it Basically abused i again. We look at alcohol. I'm marijuana's not marijuana's not highly addictive the way methods. You know some. Opiates hardcore stuff is well. Alcohol is highly addictive. Tobacco's highly addictive. Those are very different fact. Our own surgeon general said that Tobacco was the former surgeon general. I believe it was c. Everett koop cooper said that tobacco is just as highly addictive as heroin so and yet that's legal but you know what we have right now is. We've got drugs being illegal and so they don't go for help and even look at work starts again. When was the last time you heard of a liquor store owner going up and down the halls of a high school trying to sell jin. If it's legal and the profits aren't there you're not gonna have the profit motive for people to go out and sell it or I ask what when's the last time you ever heard of a vodka addict breaking into houses in order to support a vodka habit. You can make enough money to support it if it's legal when things are illegal. They tend to cost twenty to twenty five times higher. So that's twenty to twenty five times as many houses as you have to break into. And so i'm looking at it and by the way i'm not a drug user. Well actually i am a bourbon is my choice is a drug and i got a graduate certificate drug and alcohol studies and i understand that the way our neurotransmitters work. Alcohol is actually very dangerous. Drug much more dangerous than marijuana. But somehow somehow i got through the nineteen seventies in high school and college never having tried marijuana. I gotta admit you know. I'm a goody two shoes but the the point here is there's not a profit motive you know when when people ask me about legalizing drugs. The point is and they say well. But i don't use drugs so i don't care i say but you should care if you care about crime. You should care if your kids are in a school because right. Now there's a profit motive to get your kids hooked on drugs and high school kids themselves will say you know. It's a lot easier to buy marijuana than it is to buy alcohol yet. 'cause alcohol's legal not the profit in there there's competition it's we've got the free market out there taking care of it. So how about. Let's have the free market. Take care of the other things and then if you do have a heroin problem treat it as a medical issue and not a you know a criminal issue but also because you said why not a y'all you want it to remain legal but you're not for locking people up it isn't that the definition of if it's illegal than you do lock people up. I'm confused. I'm with you on the last part of that in that. If someone was addicted to one of the one of the drugs that i think should be illegal say meth or opiates or something like that. I wouldn't want to send them to jail for that. I would want to get them help. I don't think putting someone in jail drain. Sorry but isn't that. What illegal means that when i say when i say when i say illegal i was sort of giving you shorthand on that but when i say illegal i mean if you're if you're selling it then there should be a repercussion for it legal repercussion if you're if you're just using or if you're mass distributing it i see that different as someone that using it and again this is just this is just one of those ones where i find that sort of the were basically agreeing here. And there's like this little space where it's like. Okay how do you. There's quite a little more of a liberal approach. A little more of a conservative and libertarian approach and you can remain a good person and not totally agree on it. Isn't that crazy yet. By the way you can think that every drug should be legal even though you've never used them and bourbons drug of choice more of a more of a red wine guy myself. Well you know. I do have red wine with dinner. Yes if you're if you're a red wine guy than good we're run the same boat all right. Let's just keep going through just sort of the biggest hits and sort of the big issues so far in policy it seems to me that that trump has been pretty solid on foreign policy in that. It doesn't seem like we're going extra wars. We've got a couple of peace agreements that have been signed in the last couple weeks. He he's trying to tell the people we shouldn't be in afghanistan anymore. We got some troops out of iraq. It doesn't look like we're going to be nation building anytime soon Do you see those things as winds and sort of. What would a purely libertarian foreign policy. Look like yeah. We're in about a hundred sixty countries around the world. I think we were one hundred sixty countries. One trump took office. And i think we're still in one hundred sixty countries so if you wanna say we've made progress because now we're in one hundred fifty nine countries while i don't see that as much progress and we spend more on military than the next probably eight countries combined so and it's making us less safe that not more safe. That's the worst part about it. So no we need to seriously bring the troops home. And if i were president i would turn america into one giant switzerland armed a neutral in which we protect our borders. Yes we should have borders. We need to protect them However we shouldn't be protecting the borders of everybody else. And i pointed out of course half facetiously here. We keep hearing. How isn't france great. They get five week vacations. We should get five week occasions. Well yeah maybe. We weren't paying for their military. We could get five week vacations to. Why are we paying for everybody else's military around the world. Why should a tax payer alabama be paying for francis military. That's absurd and i was actually excited. When i heard that he was bringing. That trump was bringing troops out of germany. I thought oh finally a step at small step step in the right direction. And then i heard he was putting them in poland. No he needs to keep going. They need to come all the way home. They need to come to the united states again. One giant switzerland. We need to protect our borders. So it's interesting because you've got obviously differences with trump there but when he says things like you know you gotta pay your share to be a nato. You fundamentally agree with that sort of thing right that the us should not well i. I don't think we should be a nato. I thought he didn't like nato. I thought he was going to get out of nato. Isn't that what he was saying. I think well. I think he was at least saying that. The other countries have to pay their fair share. Where we'd get out. And i guess we. I guess we did at least cut funding. I don't know if anyone made made up bad funding. Well i got a great way for the other countries to pay their fair share. We out completely and we don't pay anybody's fair. Share how at catch problem solved so if we were to have strong borders military to protect the united states itself. Do you think we have any responsibility. Are there any situations where there could be a genocide anywhere else in the world or an evil team or whatever it might be. Would you see any situation where we should get involved to help. People that are not americans not from the standpoint of the government now. We heard george clooney trying to help people in wards warned horn war-torn sedan. We've heard or cerium. Sorry we've heard of other people going over and try to make humanitarian relief missions. You know americans are very generous. They're very helpful. They want to go over and help people so Let's let them help people but as far as the us military as far as a going in any time we go over there to do something good. Something bad always happens. There's always you know they call unintended consequences. Maybe there are unintended that. They're not unforeseen because anytime you go win and you pick one side is the winner. There's going to be a loser who's not going to be very happy with us. So i would leave it up to the very generous and very fair minded americans to do whatever they like on their own and keep the military out of it right. Is there an inherent problem there. Though that if this was world war two that the united states would just be sitting on the sidelines. And that you know. The nazis could've taken over europe. I get not europe. Do you see a moral quandary there at all well. I'm glad you brought that up actually. many libertarians. Think that we shouldn't have gotten into the war. But i'd like to point out that we were brought into world war two when japan bombed us so i'd like to make two points. First of all many historians say that the reason they bombed us to begin with was because of unfair tariffs that we were in a tariff war and secondly they you know we look at japan. Now i mean. Look at all the toyotas and hondas we buy from them. They're not going to bomb today because we're her best customer. You tend to not bomb your best customer. So you say you know when you say. Foreign policy is also include trade in that. And when you look at what trump's doing basically having a tariff war with with china i mean. You know there's a reason they use the term war and i would say needs to get out of any war with china that we we. There's no way we can get into a war with china. We have the ability to obliterate each other. We cannot do that and the best way to do that is to open up trade so just like you know we buy all these toyotas and hondas from japan and they're not gonna bomb us. How about we do the same thing for china. Let's open up the borders. It's only hurting the citizens. And of course. I know you've heard you've probably said it. Where goods cross borders troops don't have to so let's go by that model the Is there any risk there that if we just opened up tr- Trade altogether that they can just make things cheaper and that that ultimately hurts the american worker. What's what's the libertarian. Answer to that. I hear that one yet. They make things cheaper than that. Means the people in our country who are poor can afford them and it means that we just sell other things that we're good at that. We have a niche chat. And you know we've been great in front since entertainment. Industry look at the percentage of dollars around the world that are spent an entertainment that come from our country. I mean there's there's this kind of brings me back to deficit people talk about. Aren't you worried about the trade deficit. So like china you know selling other cheap stuff here. Well that's kind of like asking me. Aren't you afraid that you have a trade deficit with where you buy gas. No because i buy gasoline from them but guess what they take my dollars and somehow they come around back to me so we can't look at each thing in isolation and i'm the opposite of an isolationist. I think we need to be good neighbors to everybody. Around the world both economically and militarily. And here's one example where freedom works and freedom is morally right where we can trade peacefully and Present wars so. we focused obviously more on on trump. because he's the president and policies of the conservatives. What do you make about. What's going on with the democrats right now and what seems to be a war between the younger progressive lefties versus a little bit. I guess of what's left of the old guard. There ain't much left. And i think it's sort of summed up i. It's summed up by biden. what do you make about. What's going on there. What that the old guard is still strong. And the thing that i've been pointing out as how they muzzled tulsi gabbard. How they unfairly kept her out of the debates. And what such a shame is that. The democratic party used to be the party of peace. They used to be the antiwar party. And they've got a great anti war candidate Tulsi gabbard by the way. Let me qualify that and say great on that position. I mean i realize yes. She's socialist on the economic issues. And that's why. I wouldn't vote for her. That's why i'm running for president. Excuse me but on the war issues. She's great and yet. The government is the democratic establishment. Kept her out of the debates. Because i wanted to quiet her down. So yeah the old guard there may not be many of them left but they sure are powerful and that's really a shame and that brings me by the way just one other quick.

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Thursday Afternoon Monday Morning Podcast 9-17-20

Monday Morning Podcast

2:07:29 hr | 7 months ago

Thursday Afternoon Monday Morning Podcast 9-17-20

"Hey. What's going on its bill burr and it's time for the Thursday afternoon just before Friday Monday morning podcast in. A. Just, checking in on you I'm just checking in on. You see now hopefully, you're workweeks going I know a lot of people are working from home during this new normal. The new normal. Jesus fucking Christ. I will never understand. You know all somebody somebody says it and then everybody else just to. Say I wanted to say. Arbel. Why can't somebody switch it up? Just say Shit is now. That scares people don't use profanity. You have to stay the new normal. If they just hear the word normal, they're gonNA feel more normal. Everett's Ab-. Scary Shit. was on twitter but Jesus, Soviet who the fuck knows if it's true or not. But the same by twenty fifty over a billion people are going to be displaced due to global warming. and. I just don't understand these fucking. These fucking people in power. They just keep it's like a big circle jerk. They just keep fucking blowing each other trying to make more money in fucking over regular people. I just don't know where they think they just think like what's going to happen after I die it's like give a fuck about your kids. Unbelievable so You got to pick that sweet spot the sweet longitude latitude to buy your safety house. You know far enough from the equator for far. Far enough inland from the ocean, but not to north to the polar ice caps. You can figure out where that place is. Right. All the while. Like in the back of your head, if you did pick the right place, then you're going to be one of the last few. To survive, and then you're GONNA have to go through that. Right? And I'll tell you what it'd be. It'd be fucking great is all these fucking Goddamn red states for the for the longest time have been Shit non-hollywood said we're all in a pedophile ring and all that you wait to wear God red states. then. What are you gonNA fuck and watch. Who Do you think produce fucking duck hunters show you used to watch. That was us. The bleeding are blue ties The wealth redneck television they'll. They'll figure it out. They'll do something they'll stick generator up to a fucking satellite dish figuring out how to do it I, got a switch it up here. I'm always shitting on fucking liberal states. They're gonNA start shitting on the red neck states now I just gotTa do it. I gotTa do it. Speaking of Redneck I found one of those fucking GMC. Motorhomes that I love I found I, found a fucking nice one but. My wife hit me between the eyes with. Logic. She's like it looks like Shit I go. Yeah. But the body straight I got a guy, he could fix the whole thing up and all like how much is that GONNA cost. Quite a bit she go I go. Yeah. But once I have that I can I can do fucking road gigs in it. It'll pay for itself. I can do road gigs and it's just like. I can do road gigs in this thing I. We can finally go up to yellowstone can take you out to Joshua Tree and all that she just starts laughing at me I, go what she goes. Why don't we just rent one? Or. Why don't we just get a new one if it's going to cost that much because it's not going to be cool. Fucking Ron Burgundy Mobile. Come on you like vintage fashion. Why can't I go out and buy a vintage fucking RV. It's unreal. I. Am so fucking tempted. To just by that and it's Jalopy. I'm not I'm not fucking kidding this thing is a fucking who. Needs a lot of love and care I'm so tempted to just by this fucking thing have it redone and then just one day you pull up when it's shiny. Shiny new exciting and new come aboard Ron Burgundy's fucking you on that. Right. If I, just pull up in that fucking thing. I mean how mad can she be? Let's go. Let's go to Joshua. Tree. Right. Right. And just take it down the street you know in a perfect world that works out. In the real world her bottom lip starts quivering and she starts crying. What else are you doing that I don't know about and. Runs back into the house. And the awful sound of me shut killing the engine. Neighbors looking out. What happened he pulled up that big green truck and I don't know she started crying. I think getting divorced. Is that new house. Whatever a man could dream Kenny. A man can dream seem. A man can dream speaking of dreams guess, WHO's Dream fucking ended your Vegas fucking nights. Good Lord. Dowse wants the First Game Vegas wins gained number two. You think it's going to be a nice little back and forth, and then Dallas gives them the. Bread Pyrite do fucking Kisser Bang Bang Bang ran the table. Ran The fucking table they never got the ball back. was that they ran the clock. Just ran the fucking table congratulations Dallas Texas two things number one, you have a hockey team number two. Number two, they are in the Cup final. Stanley. Cup It looks like a giant shot glass. It's as shiny as the Spurs on your fucking horse. Shoddy as truck you drive that's never seen mud. Seen I've seen some of the cleanest cowboys I've ever seen in my life in Texas. Got The real ones that live in the middle of fucking nowhere celebrate Hitler's birthday and doing some cowboy shit right finding their last little calf by looking up at the stars whatever this fucking people do. Right. Around their assets chaps you know and then you got the fake wants the ones who live in the cities you know where they have the four door with an extra cab. The fucking bed is like two feet long by the time that done with it. It's a goddamn living room in their these shiniest fuck and trucks I've never seen so many pickup trucks in my fucking life that have never seen a day of work. Sharon either my truck I don't do any work in it. Anyway, you have a hockey team when they're in the Stanley Cup final, is it the finals or is it the final? I don't know what it is. But I say, anyways. So I, call them the finals. And they are waiting for the winner of the Tampa Bay lightning. Versus the. Long. Island. Long Island New York Islanders I. Guess The Island is won the last game. I missed the last game huge win for the islanders. Two to one makes the series three to. You know a little bit of pressure del. I was too busy watching. Was Too. Busy watching. fucking. That amazing. Amazing. Amazing. fucking amazing. Gave Celtics First Miami. Heat even though we lost a fucking block. That was A. Block for the ages all fucking ball against one of the rising stars. The NBA I don't know shit about who I just know a good game when I see one and I also got a big I hated seeing in the clippers, lose. Because all the LAKER fans out here we're shitting themselves they're up three games to one. They will legit nervous and then the second they lose they all start trashing them. Including Magic Johnson Magic Johnson was sweating the LA clippers. To go out and go tweets something I was like Oh my God magic Johnson, was scared. Yeah, they were looking like worldbeaters they were looking like the strongest team in the east and what the fuck happened. She was a lid on the Goddamn basket I watched that whole game. On I can't I watched the second half of that game talking about I. Think I was the jinx. Didn't what happens like the clippers up like fucking eight and the next thing you know they were down by eight. And then. Paul George and Leonard couldn't fuck it hit a shot to save their lives, what a game to go cold and and then all of these losers. Who've never even had a big pot at a fucking. Are those little putting green things but he called the six. Magic Golf Miniature. Golf. You know having a big PUTT. There is just sitting there trashing all of these fucking guys they could dunk on you and your entire family you know, and then take the family portrait off the wall and smashed over your head. You know we all have bad days. They had a bad day my condolences to them. Congratulations to the Denver Nuggets I'm pulling for you guys. You GotTa do it. You have to root against the fucking Lakers. Their their whole. Their whole fucking legacy is this is this is where all the great centers have played. Yeah. But you never drafty drafted George Mike and you drafted some seven foot guy from a Ymca in one, thousand, nine, forty other than that. None of them are yours. Chamberlain Abdul Jabbar Shaquille O'Neal, Lebron James, none of them. None of them. Goddamn fucking assholes that I think they're going to buy another one. Tell you the Celtics got to get better at by championships. We gotta get better at it man we gotta figure out a fucking way. I don't know maybe with global warming. You know L. A. will be fucking hot and on fire for anybody to play, and then all of a sudden we'll have like L. A. Weather in Boston. You know then Hollywood will move out there and then all the fucking hot ask will move out there and then we can start getting top tiered fucking. People around the league I don't know who the fuck knows what but I think the Lakers got a great chance with I'm just fucking around a celtics. I, fucking Lakers I respect I respected lakes. Okay I respect it. Okay. They're out here in. Hollywood. They got they got a bunch of bitches for everybody to bang after the game. They got great weather, and then they use that to a vantage. It's basically what it is God. Bless. We have to somehow make. Going snowmobiling and ice fishing. Cool to seven foot. Black guys. I don't know. Anyway. But. The Celtics are still in it this is going to be a great series. I don't give a fuck obviously I wanted to celts I just don't want the Lakers to win I don't I just don't want it because then they're going to be tied with us with championships and I'm GonNa have to listen to all these fucking morons given me shit out here who don't know anything about hoop songs it's an old school laker fan than I actually really enjoyed talking to most of them are just like. Celtics, bitches. Great Talk. Anyway plowing ahead here. Let's talk NFL. Football. and. The Patriots Have Seattle Cam Newton Against Russell Wilson. I don't know these two teams that transition right now I don't know what's going on with Seattle and I'm hoping that we're going to build off that wind. Cam gets a little more comfortable. The receivers get a little more open and maybe he doesn't have to run for seventy five yards I'm I'm liking our offensive line. Continue to protect Cam Newton and we will see what happened. Tonight Thursday night matchup, who do you got? You Got Joe Borough Verse Baker Mayfield. Vaguely. I heard Joe Borough had a great game last week and they kind of got fucked by some call at the I didn't see either one of A. Game I didn't see the BROWNS Games but. I don't know. I like both of those guys and So I'm hoping that's going to be a good game and then the Tom Brady buccaneers Tampa Bay bucket is excuse me have the panthers. And Teddy Bridgewater, one of the great names and. To taber budget teddy black magic. That sixty beasts. Was Teddy Teddy Bass I can't remember. Mr Blak magic. Plane crashes. Anyway I'm looking forward to all of that shit like so much fucking sports going on right now and I've been really busy getting ready to Do my little stand up tour coming up. That I am very excited about I got a couple of spots this week I've gotten back into the groove man I've been rippin new shit is coming out enjoying All of that stuff and hopefully you know it all comes together and then by the time I go out to the farmland out there in Connecticut. You know. I, could possibly. Have some good shows. That's what I'm hoping for. You know you can only hope. That's all you can do. You can just Kinda. Hope. So. Anyway we're coming down to everybody I think. I don't know what we're coming down to I haven't looked at the Cova numbers I just feel like you know. He's gradually put the fire out out here. So fucking states on fire. COVID numbers. By State By Stat oops, let's see here. April we had nothing and then we went up then we peaked now. Oh, we're going down. We're going down down down. This is good man we're going now I. Like it. Let's see here there's been seven, hundred, seventy, one, thousand cases, fourteen thousand. Six hundred forty, eight deaths. Two hundred, fifty, five, thousand in Los. Angeles County. What the fuck sixty two hundred died. Riverside at fifty, the most be seven, seventy, one, thousand cases. In California. Okay. It said United States here, people why do listen to this podcast? Well Man. There's been a lot of fucking people caught this shit not too many died six, seven eight. Nine, ten, thousand people died. Three. What have we got close to a million cases. Still, a lot of fucking people I don't know. Is it going in the right direction? Did. You See those fucking idiots talk about mass that one lady's like you know what I got to wear a mask I mean George floored said. You know I can't breathe he died, and now now we're saying we can't breathe and they're saying put on a mask. Oh Sweetheart. What happened. You didn't get the good books. I really just think that that is it's really just. The news media you gotTa have heart every once in a while when you just get a fucking dope onto just. Keep the footage for yourselves to laugh. Why would you put that out there? You know then they have this other one this fucking sweet old lady she's like know who likes mass? Child molesters. Grandma. Go make some. Cookies. Please please go make some cookies you know. Get. Mad at the grandmother. Your grandparents say crazy shit. That's their job. Their job is to spoil you make cookies and you just you just never bring up politics religion race relations because all you'll be like what the fuck just came out of that person's mouth. All of that Norman Rockwell look about him. Is it it just goes away. It goes away. So. Anyway. Why don't you let me get this fucking RV she's right. It's fucking stupid. What am I thinking? Where am I going to keep it probably gonNA use it like three weeks out of the year, and then I have a bus. Sitting out front of my fucking house like what am I supposed to do with that thing? Man It'd be fun I wonder if we can just rent one. That would be great. Who's going to rent me? They're fucking. Yeah I really fucking hate when I do that. Every time I try to see how much time is left on this podcast not every type fifty percent of the time and a pit stop splice these goddamn things together people you know there's no production value. There is no production value. On, this podcast. I'M GONNA get Studio Right. Going to get a studio and there's going to be somebody talked to in this going to be sound effects. I'M GONNA fucking do up but until then if you guys could just bear with me I'm alright. All form do a couple of reads here all form. Right if you've been listening to this show for a while, you've probably heard me talk about my. Mattress Very Quick Helix. Endorsement these guys make okay. He likes has left the bedroom and started making sofas. They just launched a new company called all form and they're already making the best sofas we've ever seen. So basically, they make a custom mattress feed asleep and Napa on right. 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So there's something for whatever you're into whether it's eighties, power ballads speaking to your audience right here, zoning out with songs to power the sole or powerful laps with the Monday. Morning podcast. Look at you Greece in your audience spotify is where music meets podcast spotify listening is everything and lastly, but certainly. Certainly not lease -ly. Certainly Not Kenny Easley sorry. Ma'am. How big shoulder pads used to be a fucking was he he was a safety. Simply say. All right. Here's the thing about home security companies, most trap you with high prices, tricky contracts, and lousy customer support. So well, there are a lot of options out there. There's only one no brainer simply safe simply safe's got everything you need to protect your home with none of the drawbacks traditional home security it's got an arsenal of sensors and cameras to blanket every room window and door tailored specifically for your home. 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They'll make jacket that fits and then if you don't want anybody to steal it, you don't you d'appel Ganger to come into your house. Take you comfortable SOFA. And Holy Shit does that jacket fit? I think it does you get the simply safe. You got an HD camera exactly what that fucker looks like. When the Manchurian candidate version of you fuck it shows up. Could you kill Your d'appel Ganger with that? fucking where you think it'd be easier to kill somebody who doesn't look like you or somebody kind of reminds you you. I, guess that would all depend on whether you hated yourself not. To get busted, of course, because you didn't plan it out. In the cops asked us this sweater. You know. All right. All right I did it I did it and I go. Well, why did you do it? It's just like well, you know what to be honest with you. I hate myself and just didn't have the balls. To, kill myself because it's against my religion. So I killed this person that seemed reasonably happy but sort of look like me from a distance. Mr Birdie unique glasses yes. Yes I do well, I want to let you know that that person was strawberry blonde. Okay. They were not a redhead. Sorry. About that. Well, we're sorry to. Bookham. Anyway. So The fuck. Out of people, I have nothing to talk about I have nothing going on in my fucking life either working my ass off or just sitting in my fucking house I've started production on a couple of things through all things comedy I've been working on those things. Those things are exciting, but I can't talk about them. I can't talk about him. Therefore, I cannot fill up the last three minutes of this podcast. So evidently, this is just going to become a fucking staring contest. Now I gotta be honest with the way you guys fucking raped me over the coals deservedly. fucking get this Goddamn. Cordova deservedly. Raked me over the fucking calls for eating that story about trump I am now afraid. To do any stories about politics, which is probably a good thing I'll get the fuck outta that I'll try to stay. Away from that because I know how sensitive people are. They take that shit seriously and I was just sitting there talking about killing your d'appel Ganger because you didn't have the balls to kill yourself. All of that is fucking fine. Don't be fucking talking about actual Goddamn people don't talk about some liberal woman who wants to run for office and then don't talk about the square job. fucking. Whether there's not even a zero, even a woman Republican. Holding office I mean those people are just so fucking sexist. Of fucking with you just waiting for actually. Geraldine. Fucking Ferrara was Republican let me see. Let me see here. Women. Republicans. All right here we go. Images of Women Republicans to to to women in the GOP. Grand Old Pussy. I'll that. Right where women have played a key role in the Republican, Party, since its establishment in eighteen fifty four, I would love to read that first line in an all women's College. Get an applause break night. The Republican Party and Republican women or the primary forces behind. Women's suffrage movement in the passage. All I remember that yet because they both switch one used to be liberal and the other became conservative like I don't understand how the fuck that happened. So then what Republicans like to do you know the people were against slavery the eighteen hundreds we're actually republicans and it's like they flip flip-flopped. I duNNo. I think that's what happened. All right read more all I know is every woman that they have in the GOP is a black and white photo. So my first STANDUP headshot. Now women. Ladies. Klanbake women. Republicans. CANS. In, office. Women Serving In the one hundred Sixteenth Congress now I WANNA, know who's with more Republican women running for office in ever women in the United States House of Representatives. Here we go. Babb, APP APP, and day come on low number low number. Nancy Pelosi I didn't know she was a Republican. Women Right Nancy Pelosi became the First Female House minority whip. In two thousand and two Jesus. That's none of that sounded good minority whip all in the same thing she went on to become the first and only to date female speaker. Of the United Stuff, she's a lesbian she's dating the speaker the Unites. Also in two thousand, seven Mazey Hirono entered the US House representative as the first female Buddhist. In Either Chamber of Commerce Congress in two thousand eleven the US House Representative got its first woman bathroom near the chamber. Bathroom. I've never understood that shit it's you know you. She has shedder in their anybody can use it right Where they just have a standup fucking. pissed off. Picture Tip, O'Neill dropping his pants taking dumping in that you would think that they'd have a toilet for the guys. Are fucking weird politics is where this is why I don't pay attention this shit. All right. Anyway. This has been the Thursday afternoon just before Friday Monday morning podcast. I gotTa say God bless all of these firefighters out here in California saving our ashes again, this year and. You know I really hope. that. There's more people. I don't know if there's just a way smaller companies don't give a shit about the environment could start making stuff for everybody and we can actually buy stuff off of them, and then they won't sell out to those consultants shark tank those types of people that don't give a fuck evidently about anything. My wife loves watching that show. You know I hate to she. She just watching people in a position of power taking advantage of people. Hey, you got a great idea tears deal. I'll give you the money you need I'm going to own ninety nine percent of your company. You can go fuck yourself how about that? We were thinking maybe like fifty fifty right about. And I like when they give an offer and then the people don't accept it and then the sharks they act like a bunch of babies. Because they didn't get their way. And I know it's just a fucking TV show but. That is how business is done. Oh, that's a great idea I will buy that from you. So you can get a nicer two bedroom apartment, and then I will me and my company will get all the credit for your fucking idea. What was the last time? There was an inventor that you knew the name. Let me see famous. Inventors in Van Towers. In Two thousands. Let's see here if there's anything. Ten things you didn't realize we're invented see they don't skip right past ten things you didn't realize it. List of inventors. All right. Here we go. All right. This guy these are the birthdates nine, thousand, nine, hundred, Sixty, eight, hundred, Forty, eight, seventy, nine, one, thousand, nine, hundred, fourteen, thousand, nine, hundred, one, thousand, nine, hundred, sixteen, thousand, nine, hundred, sixty. Randy. Randy because it's an eye Rondi meow Al Shushi Chewy. Invented the disposable cell phone. You know yeah. Looking out for drug dealers good for him nine, hundred, twenty, eight, seventeen, eighty, six. Thousand Nine, hundred eighty nine. Ruth. Amos invented stare steady. The fuck is that. Mary Mary eighteen sixty six. Mary Anderson invented the Windshield wiper blade go. Momofuku. And Oh Get the fuck. got here. Mama focus one of my favorite fucking places in New, York to get something to eat. They got those big fuck and. Balza Noodles and all of that Shit Asian style. and. This Guy Momofuku. Invented instant noodles. Lived a nice long life to ninety seven years. Hal Anger He invented the Gamma Camera. What the fuck that is. Why don't we just see what they invented then I'll read the person. Single Curtain. Focal. Plane Shutter. Jesus Christ conversation with that person. Inertia have curtains I don't WanNa Brag. We. Oh. Here we go. This piece of shit seventeen, eighty, eight to eight, seventy, four Neil. Are Not from the united, kingdom invented the water bed. You fucking fucking dirty old man. Come on there's gotta be something good here. Sawmill circular saw. Video Game Console. german-born American Ralph H Bayer Germans trying to get credit german-born American. Always born in Germany comes up. All right. All right, whatever whatever. We'll take fifty percent on that one. Come on the color TV. John logie Baird. Scotland. It's right. He was sick all those gingers in fucking awful in black and white. Let's get one more here. Frederick banting. CANDIDA INVENTED INSULIN Alexander Graham, bell invented the telephone then he's still only shit from Tesla or is that just some fucking bullshit? Ballpoint. Pen the cheese slicer. Flash freezing. The Stereo the UK Allen Blue Mine. seatbelt. Sweden came up with the seat belt and the wonderful Volvos is so safe. The taxi meter. Germany course. Once he went seven point, six kilometers. Come on communism the lawnmower will close on this one. Edwin beard budding. England, I, always assume that most shit was invented in America I don't know why look at all this shit. Electron, cooling. Russia. The bull engine or a modified steam engine England. Bunsen on Bunsen burner Germany. Horseshoe machine first usable iron railroad spike Scotland. The World Wide Web was not Al Gore. Was Robert Kelly. Belgium. Stock Ticker tape that was us you WANNA. Fuck. Parade with some lies on it and then we got. In. Duchesne Coil Ireland. Quick Release skewer. Italy. All right. This is just. Who gives a shit stuff here? Tension spoke wheels. Artificial cell. Chapman stick those chapstick. People how do I get down going down to fucking rabbit hole does like a million things that are neon lamp dishwasher you fucking Cock sucker. Josephine Cochrane you fucking Cock sucker. The GODDAMN Dishwasher is the biggest lie of the twentieth century. The fucking thing never worked it never fucking worked I used to do a bit about that. Gut I used to bit about that Guy I. Don't know who the fuck invented it. Oh my God I remember I used to do that bit. Whoever invented it was in toxic relationship because they would get nag the entire fucking time because the goddamn thing doesn't work. Doesn't wash the dishes it makes them wet it dries them. It's great. Drying him. It makes him wet and then it dries them and then it just bakes on whatever the fuck you cook there. All right. This has been a little extra long podcasts. I gotta get off the phone go fuck yourself and I gotta go get on the phones. What have to do is to off the podcast, enjoy the music from the Great Andrew Themm lists and I will get. Back to you on Monday go pats move Joe Borough. I am rooting for the Texans against the Ravens. I was GONNA go underdogs here, and what else can number with Tom Brady? Against Carolina that's it. Have a great weekend. You constant I'll talk to you on Monday as enjoy my segment on the sports gambling podcast. Sean Green and Ryan. Coming up after. Suit. Any The Sports Gamay podcast is brought to you by mybookie DOT AG head over to mybookie DOT AG to get in on all the NFL action and use the Promo Code Burr for a one hundred percent deposit bonus. That's my bookie DOT AG Promo Code Burr joining us on the line comedian patriots. Fan Bill Burr Bill Pat started one and on the Cam Newton here how exciting was that? You know it was it was definitely happy that we got the win the dolphins always play. It's difficult place tough. I mean. I was excited the about our offensive line. Look good. I still saw you know some of the problems we had from last year slightly improved, but it's early on. You know I have faith bill. Belichick. Cam Newton was great. Not. Too excited that he was our top rusher. Yes. Five yards. I mean kind of old school at that where I just feel like you're GONNA get hurt. So hopefully. You know Sony Michelle will. Pick it yards force and he can stand in the pocket guys like Harry. Maybe step up or something like that you. Number two receiver and I thought I thought I'd defensive pretty good. You don't strike me as a Jersey guy but if you were to get a Cam Newton Jersey, are you wait until he until he wins a certain number of Gainesville till he hits a certain threshold I haven't bought a Jersey since. I. Can maybe got like A. Steve Grogan one I think was the last one I had, and that's probably a bad s throwback one now. Well they wasn't the Mitchell and ness version of it was the Harman's sporting goods version so No I'm all in with Cam Cancer Guy, you know the guy is an amazing. quarterback, he's got incredible armed field vision all of that type of stuff. They just got to have more than one week to get on the same page. Now, the other the other big game we talked about last week Brady and the box went down to New Orleans didn't get help to. Own to against the spread but your team once he kinda hedged yourself there Brady look good. Early had that he had that drive yet the rushing touchdown it seemed like things were going well, and then it just kind of unraveled for Tampa Bay. Yeah I mean I wouldn't put that on him. It was a couple times he thought a guy was going to keep running and he stops. He did have the pick six, but I mean that happens just happens. It's it's against week I thought. But what I saw that was great as a fan. But upsetting because because he's not on the Patriots anymore still has the same zip still has the same fire, the leadership and all of that. I mean I. Think Tampa Bay is going to be a problem for people well, now, the bucks they're at home, they're laying nine points against the Carolina Panthers. What do you? What do you think about the bounceback game for Tom Brady and the bucks? This is going to be a nice week for them to go out and score points. Get some sports writers on this side. I think I think they're going to have a great game. You know the eleven thousand people that are allowed to go to the stadium will be excited to see Tom and We shall see. It is funny. How ASCII back out there. was good to see him catch a couple passes didn't do anything OJ Howard got the touchdown fellows better with Gronk in it. That's all and Gronk in Tampa is also probably good for things. So I'm happy with the situation. A Little Sad I'm a little sad they got up to the loss because now everyone gets the start chirping about Bella check verse Brady which we don't need right now but. I don't know Sean. Got Ahead opened now now the outside it's on the tea it's on the and now people were hitting it. So hopefully, brady comes back with a vengeance. against. Just, not pay attention to that I. I. Think. So much of that stuff just it's a symptom of twenty four hours of media, and then there's also like just. You know, let's just how they sell every show. This person who is that person this candidate candidate, this country country so red versus blue. Yeah. The big ten they're coming back and it was and we kind of hit on this last week talking about the they draw the lines for college football seems to be political like all these southern Republican states they were all in on football early then these swing states in the big ten, they were not doing it, and now they are doing football and then the the super left blue states are holding out no football maybe it'll be later on it's just hilarious how it's fallen right on party lines again. Yeah. Well, you know I. Mean They make the school so much money talk all nobody's GonNa show up to watch the math team solve problem. So I mean that's what it is and You Know I. Mean I think it's easier for you know some of the obviously the Ivy League and stuff like that. I mean they get probably more money from. You know egg heads. To. Give them money whatever how the hell that works out there. But. You know the football team is in carrying Harvard's endowment. It's going to be all the rocket scientists kicking back money. Yeah but I mean, if one hundred thousand people were shown up every week to see Harvard, Yale than they would be playing to I mean, at the end of the day. They gotta make. Money. Big. Big Thursday night game bengals at Brown's where are you at with Baker Mayfield and? Bengals. Three different pronunciations. Equity says he says bengals like the girl. Band. Bengals. Oh, you know this is how dumb I am I. Didn't realize there was a difference between the girl band and the football team assume they were the same all the bengals. Don't just respect the band without the bengals play the last few years. That was a heartbreaking loss for bengals fans everywhere that offensive Pi to kind of a cost them the game, and then the kicker comes out pulls his calf right as he's going for the game tying field goal. An offensive pass interference just because they never call it. So when they do call it, it just seems like it's this personal vendetta against you and your team but you know there was a bad period there were you could. You could even look at a receiver and they would throw a flag but I think they've done a pretty good job. About correct correctness stuff like that. But Joe Girl looked great totally looks like a game. And then he's going to be able to play at the NFL level, which is awesome. Jealous. You Fan. There's such a fun team, go tigers and. What a character there are Super Fun team. Yeah. So yeah. Looking forward to me I. I'm kind of happy now that there's NFL football three days a week to kind of complaints about Thursday afternoon at Thursday game with the frigging. Awful uniforms and then how rush on network and for a while, I couldn't get the NFL network unless they changed my whole whatever cable I had back. Then I was kind of against it now during this crap actually loving it. Yeah. It gives you something to watch a primetime game but yeah, bengals are getting six points in Cleveland. Do you think they covered? With the browns. I. Think they beat them. Outright. I like it. Outright Beta, it's one of those stupid divisional rivalry games. I always hate betting those gangs but yeah, I think the bengals going straight up eater I know but Cleveland has good running game right? They have a good running back. Yeah. No they got. They got nick children, Kareem Hunt I think could give the bengals rush defense and problems. I. Think that's going to be caretaker still the quarterback though that's probably the problem. It didn't look too good week one. I just never seen a guy gets so much shit before you even play. Yeah, no, he really bakers gotten a ton of crafts both got a Lotta Shit and been crowned all before he's done anything and now it is funny to watch him in those commercials where the the the stadium is house and he's I mean, thirty, eight six what was the score? It's not a good look maybe maybe more football less acting. It is brutal though when you're when you're quarterbacks getting destroyed in the game and then They're having like he's hanging out having fun living at the stadium like I don't WanNa see that right now like they need to have a guy in there who if it's a blowout, pull all the baker commercials at work underlines or work on the place now, your lunch just for his own sake, I, mean I, get it. You know you can be in the NFL and spend four hours at the stadium wins. Entire problem is Baker Man. Having. A lot of problems before he got there and I think one of the worst things that can happen to you if you're a high graphic as a quarterback is to go to the Cleveland browns over the last almost thirty years. So cut the guy a little bit of slack. There's something about a white guy who wears a band Dan. I don't know what it is. What does he think he's in a gang you just start at the all the way back to Andre Agassi, people just start trashing yeah it's. Like, an extra sons of anarchy with the hair going and the Indiana that Cobra Kai look you know another another kind of classic matchup the Monday night game the Las Vegas Raiders at home catching five and a half against the saints where are you at with Jon Gruden bill or are you big Gruden guy define an Jon gruden I also that new stadium they have little man. Yeah. A finally God knows you wait fifty years to get a place to play sixty years? They've never really had well I guess the Oakland A.'s Stadium at some point was new but that was. Those who those cookie Cutter Baseball Football. So I'm excited to see them that a a nice venue. Unfortunately, I think the saints are going to give them their first loss. In that building. I don't know five points doesn't scare me. Yeah Drew brees in the Dome Against Jon Gruden. Arenas just WANNA game. They're riding high. This is the perfect time to bet against and it is I. Mean we drove by person recently and it's just awesome to see it sitting there right out in the street hockey puck Komo's yeah. It's very stadium the death star they're calling very futuristic. It is going to be crazy when they do let fans go in there because I can just imagine just marauding bands of Raiders fans getting drunk all day on the Strip and just rolling into that stadium. It's going to be wild once they start letting fans in. Mike get discovered on the stripped away way. Yeah. Look? Great And cirque Du Soleil well, you know we saw the Michael's opening up next door. So they can get their crafts and work on their their plastic shoulder pads. Their eye shadow sticking out I. Don't know what happened. I, liked back in the seventies the raiders fans like a giant biker gang. Yeah. Somewhere along the line I don't know what they kind of they gotta get Outta the. It's a little too much kiss. It will just looks like they were hanging out on for an afternoon and go like, oh, Spike Styrofoam shoulder pads that'll complete my outfits like come on what happened just. Changes you know. Like the guy with the fighter pilot mask on with the giant like. visers it's like come on dude. But the black hole is fun, it'll be great to see those guys in there of course, it all over it. I mean it's fun and you know because it's it's just emblematic of the raiders a kind of a fun tradition. But yeah, getting dressed up in costumes and going into football it's it's I mean come on the they can take joke. See The seahawks at home, Dad Nice Win Week one patriots coming into Seattle Sunday night like this seahawks laying four points Nah man this is it's a tough spot for the Patriots early but I said that last week and they took care of the dolphins where where is your head at this game bill? I don't think I know enough about Seattle but. I do think that Russell Wilson will you know? Basically cancels out Cam Newton with that's that's a wash. And I don't know like that's sad I think this is a big test early four. Plan with an above average team because I do know that a Seattle has lost did lose a lot of players I mean with the free agency I can't keep up with it. So it's hard for me to gamble in in September here but. Mike. I would stay away from this game because if I had to put money on it, I would bet seattle Seattle and leading the points they appear to be letting Russ Cook Diamond. Bill with the emotional hedge betting against his team just because then you could you kind of have yourself covered I worst case scenario Seattle wins by three and then you don't get the you're doing it the spread and your team loses every single time I've said, I'm going to bet against my team I failed to do so are you do you? Do you find yourself? I don't see you as this guy but being superstitious having any sort of rituals when your team is on, do you do you get your kids i? Know you have a couple of young kids you try and get them into into watching the game where he at with. Your team on Game Day. Oh. No. I. I I gave up on superstitions. Finally made me give up on superstitions I see your the longest time. Don't put. Don't put a hat on a bed at on a bed. Bad Luck. And I actually I don't know somebody told me are sorta looked it up like where that came from like back in the day when People used to knit their own hats when they take the hat off at night, the static electricity and they would see the flashes. So they thought the devil lived in your hair. So then if you if you. Had or something like that with the hat on the bed the devil was in your bed and then was going to get into you and I was like that it's gotta be the Dumbest Shit I've ever heard in my life. And after that I, now move about freely in my living room I know that I have no effect on the game whatsoever it's been liberating for like the last twenty years. So why? Superstition I will tell you though is I don't have the stomach. To Watch playoff. When my team is in it because that whole thing where it's a game runs is just infuriating to me. where? Can't miss your team can't getting all of a sudden. We forget how to play and then they can't that doesn't happen in other sports. It's not like if you raw -fensive line is dominating the defensive line I don't care what kind of halftime adjustments they make. You don't come out in the half and all of a sudden you're team forgets not a block. Well mean maybe the Atlanta. Falcons in the Super Bowl where they were, they were up twenty eight to three. They seem to forget something but I know what you mean and it happens I swear to God it happens like three times during an NBA game. No, I mean the by twenty five and then twenty six who. I'd up you're like what the fuck capping well especially now when they when they just like every guy's shooting threes, even like seven foot guy from Latvia still like checking it up behind the arc and yet so easy to go hot and cold the bubble, the shooting and the runs have been crazy because there's no homecourt advantage. So got teams like the nuggets teams like the Miami Heat who maybe never would have made it if they were actually travelling and playing in hostile environments but yeah, it really feels like the last six minutes. Just wait till the game has eight minutes left in it, and then you can watch because if you watch it before that, you're just going to go on this strange roller coaster ride that means nothing and that's essentially what stopped betting on the NBA regularly. It's not good for your art. It's Jesus Oh. Yeah. And then also like the last five minutes takes like a half an hour. They've even added instant replay. Frame by frame to see if it hit the guy's fingernail like Oh, my God, they gotta do something to speed up the end of the game because that's That's what's fun about basketball the intensity, the running up and down the court, the flow, the game resembling some grumpy old. Get off our level struggle but I, I will tell you. But then you gotta sit there with your stomach in knots for half an hour for something that should have taken. Like maybe ten minutes. Now, I know it it never goes away that kind of not you have when you're when you're teams playing the good sweat sometimes one one final game worth hit known. About, sports. Well I find myself. I. It's occurred I mean my wife will have to talk me down after the Eagles law she goes you can't do this to yourself. You can't. Be Mad at yourself for something that you have no control over and the logical part of my brain is going I. Know what she's saying I can't control the other the reptile part of the brain's going you're fucked up you dumb motherfucker you war the wrong hat you knew what you're doing. You let the team down I'd like honestly I after a bad loss what could I have done and and I'm not I'm not it I know I can't do anything but it's it must be you know Irish. Catholic. Irish German, wish, I could go back to the days before the Internet when you lost your boss. Yes Iraq connection to the fans of the team that beat you like, did you see? You see Magic Johnson. Man He's great. He's hilariously twin on any trashed the clippers when they listen L. as always going to be like the Lakers city. Just. As the Celtics Man I was like wait they were kinda sweat and the clippers when were up three to one they were like Oh shit. and. Then all these got people came out. I don't know I thought that was a bad look. Down Lakers where it's like you the Lakers, you don't care about these guys. Actually has to make. That la will always be the Lakers city. It's just like you sitting on Sixteen Championship zero. I would you take the time to answer them now? I know. You don't really need to stoop down to the clippers level whether you don't need to rub it into your little brother. I. Love the Clippers I was rooting for him but. For. The nuggets. Yeah. No gets are nuggets are such a fun team. They have kind of that like Rec League team vibe that just got hot and you can't get them off the court but a joke. Jamal Murray shooting lights apples. Seem to be able to buy two guys in the League and then that's Drives me nuts. Yeah I mean it seems as though the NBA would love to see a Lakers Celtics bubble final but so conspiracy talking. We could somehow. Appeal. To people come to just be like Boston's like La it's just as racist as la whether Nice. We the BALSA can hang don't worry guys. All right bill won final game to hit on a nice Nice quarterback battle. Here you got Lamar Jackson in the ravens come just coming off a The browns going into a Houston to face the Texans Texans are a seven point home dog of course, they they. They got their ass kicked opening night against the chief. So they have a little bit along rest. What's your? What's your lean here on this game Texans getting seven? They always pick the perfect number. Don't ravens just you know they're going to beat them. To Shawn Watson Jj Watts it got those two pieces and I just don't feel like it enough arrested team works. Play call and I don't know what it is just doesn't seem to come together for them. The Ravens are perennial just as successful franchise, and then they had this next level guy at quarterback. Man But given seven on the road I. Know My brain wants to say, Hey, you're smart Gambler, take the home dog but then I look at that Ravens team and I didn't even think they would be as good as they started out week one and they just they're just an unstoppable force doesn't going Ravens. Favorites this week. Sometimes, early in the season, you got to pick winners story about the spread pick winners. Well, yeah. The Ravens are winning this game I'm with you Huston maybe they get in the back door but. Bill O'Brien once again looks like he's unaware of how to drive a a national football league franchise and yet he still has the kids I don't get it. Yeah. No Bill. Bryant was an interesting guy where like I was, you know the trade he made getting rid of the Andrea. Hopkins and I mean, you just gotTa feel like an Asshole when he goes off and has a career gain. The first game after the trade. So I try and defend him saying like, Oh, I think he's a pretty solid coach when the division so he must be doing something right. But then that game against Kansas City, he was just way too conservative. You're playing the chiefs you can't be ponding at midfield on like four three. So I don't know could be a long season for Bill Brian and the Texans. You don't think midfield against Patrick Mahomes than three go for it. No No. No I'm saying he should have. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Your housing be up for sale. Pretty quick. NFL coach. Well, that's what. I'm telling you guys, Klay Madden's football your idea. Yeah. I just. Four three no biggie. Well, we are. We are gambling podcast. On catchphrases. Let it ride. So you're right. Maybe I would. I'd either flame out or become like a coaching genius just going crazy down never pawning. As a fan, you just WanNa see crazy shit like that. Yeah. You Down Forty two exhibit. into the second quarter against the chiefs there on that but I would love to see a guy that have the balls to. Oh Yeah I mean and and not to get that guy in highschool one year that never he never punted or kicked an extra point he went for it on fourth down every time and he went for to every time. Well, and that's what I get out of paying attention to that. Too. I also don't think he had the best kickers. Could've. possibly. The undefeated patriots we lost to the giants in the Super Bowl. You remember that fourth down ballot check when he went forth and six. On the first drive we just like went forward and didn't get it. And now I remember that was one of the few times I ever questioned ballot check I was like what the hell was that. Yeah. No it's. and. Just immediately. Even if the mass supports it, you know it's like in Blackjack when you got sixteen and you're against a face card, you know the number says like the card that you get at the gift shop says you're statistically better off hitting and then when you do it, you bus, you're like what the fuck but really it's like fifty, five, forty five. So you should do it. The mass says do but yeah, I mean then you gotta live with the results or shoot Sean shooter shoe shooters shoot. All right bill wrote it down looks like you're taking the bucks minus nine the. Bengals. Plus six but you gotta give him. Nine. It's a big number for Carolina. In Carolina no that's in Tampa. They got the pirate ship one and a half pirates on it. Yeah. There could be some actual pirates I mean who knows what's going on in Tampa right now Tampa minus nine bengals plus expert also think they have a shot to win it outright. Ravens mine is seven in Houston new. Orleans minus five and a half in Las Vegas and then fade in the new. England patriots not believing in. SEATTLE MINUS Four for the Sunday night game. Arable all of those I think the Cincy pick is the most solid. Watch me eat my word. All right locked that up one. All right bill appreciate you calling in and have a good NFL weekend. All right guys. Thank you. Thanks for checking out the sports gambling pack s make sure you subscribe to our podcast to hear his pick every NFL game against the spread and give us a follow on twitter at gambling podcast and of course, if you WANNA play winning get paid mybookie Dot AG Promo Code. He bring. Hey what's going on its Bill Byrne it's the Monday morning podcast for Monday December seventeenth two, thousand and twelve. I am emotionally exhausted. From watching that Patriots. San. Francisco. Game. Last night. How Insane was that game? Unbelievable. Unfortunately, it was exactly what I thought although the comeback I was amazed by that. But I, I've I've. I've got so much from a couple of Friends of mine who are patriots fans because they feel like I'm not a patriots fan anymore because I keep talking about how bad our defenses. And they're one of those people who like you know they like dress like drew bledsoe when they watch the game, you know those people with this such fucking fans the no matter what's going on you you can never say anything. What they deem as like negative rather than constructive criticism but you know I feel vindicated. because. Last week, we beat the Texans was sitting there going you love that. They should be fed. What you gotta say now you're ready. Yet the dates up. Dates not. them the whole fucking time that the week. All right fucking week. The NFC has been far superior to the AFC for fucking. All right. But the thing is you've got brady and Bella check and a little bit of luck and that's how we got to the fucking super bowl last year we still almost one. But. That doesn't change the fact that our defense. Oh. We do good against the mediocre teams. In the so-called good teams in the AFC but I'm telling you right now we'll be lucky if we get by the broncos. Okay, you let up fucking forty something points to a second year quarterback I can't help you. Why is my voice cracking? Could screaming at the FUCKING TV for three hours watching the damn thing. If the forty niners actually had a quarterback, they would've scored like. A more experienced quarterback I'm not shitting on. The, Guy with the sole patch, whatever the fuck his name is that a boise state who could have played baseball. At? One fucking chatty. I mean, fuck at times you tell that story. I. Mean. He missed two guys who had like three steps on our safety. fucking brutal but I knew it was going to happen I. Know it was kind of APP. You know what I mean I mean I hate to say but if you know if the forty niners had Aaron Rogers. Drew Brees of fucking Eli Manning get up it's. We can't compete with that kills me. Kills me. On what the fuck we have to do but you know we're all right. We're all right in the box is they say, but I swear to God are fucking pass defense stinks. I. Don't keep it just. It was you know it was enjoyable watching the forty niners celebrating in stopping around and doing that. Because they're doing their job all that dumb shit that every fucking athlete does now. You know you fucking get a layup for two points and then you go. Scare children in the front row like like the this like you're actually in three hundred. You know, why don't you just fuck in bend over and blow yourself at that point I really enjoyed watching the forty niners do that and then get that deer in the headlights. Look is Brady calmly dis- dismantled their fucking awesome defense. In, tied it up and scored thirty four points in like a basically a quarter. I didn't do a thirty one whatever the fuck was I did enjoy that watching them have to stand down actually having seeing that glazed, overlook our now the phone rings. Now. fucking. Phone could anything else be going on with this podcast. Just, seeing that glazed over on Jim. HARBAUGH's face. Was Enjoyable but I fucking love that guy and I love the the fake punt call in the first quarter on your own forty was. Awesome. I respect it. It's like this guy is going for the jugular. But. I mean those guys honestly could have been up like twenty one nothing after like six minutes in the game. Yeah. So you go visit right nice big bucket of ice water. To the face of Delusional Patriots fans. That's that's what it is. That's where our defenses against. The elite teams. Sucks I'm not happy about it and Yeah, I'm not fucking happy about it i. just wish we could. We could. Fuck Sakes with your fucking. You know what I hate about this fucking stupid phone besides everything you have the fucking thing on mute and still makes noise like like I get important phone calls. Right clear what am I the president does it really need to do that? Even when fucking put it on silent mode it's still vibrates. Shut. The thing off right. I never thought. Let's I worked out OH. Yeah. Of course, my password doesn't work on the fucking computer. This is just going to be one of these days. You don't know who's going to be one of these days. I took my dog out for a walk and. She took his shit and I'm like rappaport I went to pick the fucking thing up. Right, now they had my headphones on and as I bent over to do it, my headphones fell down in almost landed in the pile of dog shit. And Rather than laughing it off like somebody with rosy cheeks would. I'm cynical bastard. So I took that as an omen. On, how this day was going to be and it's lived up that way? I had a bowl of cereal this morning I almost fucking died. And you know what's funny is the lovely Nia was literally maybe seven feet away in the other room and never checked on me. Could Give Shit. You know. What that is, it's like we've been together when you've been with somebody as long as I have. They just it's not like they want you to die. It's a combination of two things they. They just tune you out. So I could have been in there talking to her about how you know my headphones almost fell into the dog shit this morning or I could've been almost choking to death either way. She doesn't even hear it, and then like subconsciously it's not that they want you to die but they. Not? Fatally. But if you could die for like three hours. I don't think that they would be upset. Just, sort of. Drag you over and put you behind the couch. And just you know fantasize about being single again for like three hours and then you you know you wake up. Like a one of those those movies with Sutherland. Was that movie called? shockers. Wasn't clockers that was like. I don't know what the fuck was. Anyway. This is what happened. I was eating. Corn checks big fan of the checks family. All right. This isn't some sort of subtle advertising I'm trying to put me. Okay. This this this is coming from my heart not my wallet. All right. I like the check serious into rice checks that has nothing to do with World War Two. or Vietnam okay. I just don't like the taste of him. I'm not coming at you with some red states Schiller I ain't got fucking rice in an APP reward happened over there in. The DMZ, I'm not coming at you like that I just don't like the taste of that one. Are you go corn checks origo week checks? So. Yeah. You know what I noticed the other day is this this morning as almost choking to death on my cereal was all cereals kind of the same color You notice that it's all sort of fucking just different kinds of Brown's. Weird. Isn't that weird that that would go through my head is I'm almost dying joking. That fucking. Bad Eighties. Comedian analogy went through my head that we might have been my last thought. You know. Like it's like a topic you'd hear on NPR. All Things considered today we discussed the different shades of Brown and breakfast cereals. I don't care for eating rice checks, corn checks. We checks. Rice krispies cornflakes. The. All too familiar off-color band-aid Brown on all things considered. Yeah, we listen to NPR Neil listen to that shit. She's such a fucking nerd and she always has it on and I and I don't know. There's really no good radio stations out here as as like playing music. Out. Here in La I don't know why. I don't know I. Don't know what goes on out here but evidently. These the two bands that they play they play him like it's still one thousand, nine, the early nineties they play ice. Cube. All the time. Bam. When you come to my town bad ham like like I don't know why they play. Like they play it enough. Like you think he did he died or something. You know. And then, and then they also play the. WHO THOSE GUYS? Have Digital. Whatever the fuck they pretty fly for a white guy they play them all the fucking time. You know like everybody's still walking around and flannels going, hey, you heard the new Pearl Jam man. anyways. So. Here's the story. I basically I go to get my fucking box a corn checks. I pick up the box me lay notice it's pretty light you know poured in. Get a full bowl and there's like an eighth of a box left. Now I could be a Douche and put the box back. And give me a false hope. Oh, I wanNA bucks I wanNA bowl of cereal. You know and then she grabs the box and she feels the lightness than that panic comes in you start to sweat like I'll fuck. You start pouring in I'll come on me and keep going and there's only an eighth of a bowl left. You know. The douche puts that back in the cupboard the gentleman. The refined individual like myself you just say, all right I'M GONNA. Have a little more serious than I. Usually have. So that's what I did. All right and I start eating the fucking zero and I'm wolf in it down because I know the podcast is a little bit late and I'm going to get a bunch of Shit on twitter, right? So. I get about halfway done with my bowl I, take the box of cereal and I pulled that last eighth deal the last part of the box that's the most dangerous part of the box. You got half half of its Cyril in the rest of it's all fucking powdered. So all the power goes on on the top of the cereal. I started the shit and I'm doing that eating so fast you're eating and inhaling. Through your fucking pie hole you're. Doing that shit and I had half a spoon of powder. Was Cereal I inhaled the shit and my my throat just closed off. I thought I was going to I. Thought I was going to Passau to the point. I. Was I was debating. As I'm coughing and hacking away and is completely ignoring. Great. I'm sitting there. I'm thinking, should I make them loud noise in the kitchen or should I run two five steps to the bedroom but then I'm thinking that take up too much oxygen. And I basically. Was Choking on this shift for three straight minutes in Near. Didn't move a fucking muscle. Didn't move a goddamn muscle. Then when I finally I finally realized I was GONNA live. I was so pissed at her that. After you get done choking like your voice is like. It's like turned down to one. So you're trying to talk is like. Hoping that type of Shit. I basically said, sarcastically, thanks for helping in the I was just choking for three minutes voice in all get for Neo is like, Oh, I'm sorry the okay. Is that any way to start the fucking day? I don't think. Funding for that even remotely. Amusing to you I don't know. I almost died this morning. I just had from funnier not. CLEO. All right. Let's let's do a little advertising here and then, I'm going to talk to you about this thirty thirty I watch called broke. All right. Where are we GONNA? Do We got new advertising this week everybody Cascade Studios Cascade Studios. On Santa Monica Boulevard. Out here in Los, Angeles, we got a local ad here. This is based rehearsal studio. If you're in a band basically. And you need a rehearsal space cascade studios is the number one place here in Los Angeles. This is what I when I go down I play drums, and I tried to pull off that bottom stuff trying to get my foot as fast as his. This is where I go I go to cascade studios sixty six eleven Santa Monica. Boulevard, if you WANNA go down there with your band, they got a five piece drum kit in every room with hi hats to guitar AMPs Bay, Sam Pa System with three Mike's Simple rental is only five bucks. Just, drummer like myself and you want to go down there with your ipod and beat the hell out of a kit and have a great time charges. You fifteen bucks for an hour I highly recommend it I go down there all the time if you go down asked for Joe telling the Monday morning podcast center and as always everybody. It's stamps dot com. With the holidays almost here, you don't have time to go to the post office just traffic parking. There's somebody in front of is going to have like ninety boxes that the sending out to all their grandkids. You know as they take out to change person a handy shaken, right it's going to be packed with everyone mailing out holiday gifts is what I'm trying to say an packages. So what do I do? I USED STAMPS DOT COM INSTEAD STAMPS DOT com. You can void all the hassle of going to the Post Office during the busy holiday season everything you would do with the post office you can do right from your desk. Wherever the hell you're at. 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To the podcast so I was watching. I was watching one of those thirty thirty. And they did this whole thing on on athletes going broke it was really bad. There's a ton of people who've gone broke. Most of them didn't WanNa do the documentary like why would you? You know what I mean. You WanNa talk about how you completely fucking blew it. No, I don't I don't. I resent the fact that the end of your documentary you're going to be running a list with my name on it. You know that's what they had the end of it but. I was watching it and I felt bad for people. But after a while it was just the same fucking story. Over and over again. And It's As. Much. As I want to say that if I was twenty one years old and you gave me a million dollars that I would probably fuck it up to. I just don't think I would. You, know. I love these guys. I got a check for fifty five thousand dollars that I saw Hummer I had to get it. Talked to guide down to forty, nine thousand dollars and it's like if you just got a check for fifty five fucking grant. After paying all the people in your life. Your agent. Whoever else you got, where else has taken a geologic? Whoever takes takes a chunk out of that check whatever's left out of that the government's GonNa come in and take a forty forty percent. You get a check, fifty, five brandon and what we got left twenty grant. You just went out bought a fifty thousand dollar home. I don't know but anyways, the point I wanted to make was at the end of it. After showing all these people going through this hell. They have this guy that WHO's supposed to be evidently some sort of financial adviser. And in the end, they were talking about Lebron James going he is going to be he has a potential be. Other than Tiger Woods. pre-divorce. A billionaire athlete. Like how exciting is that? And they go what? What would your advice be to this to Lebron James? On how to hang onto his billion dollars in the Guy Goes He, goes don't blow it. Keep it simple. Count you money. said. It might have been the dumbest thing. I ever heard I immediately I had no sympathy for anybody in the fucking documentary. It's just like even like why is this guy on this who the fuck is that guy? That's the guy who manages money. That's hey I got a billion dollars. How do I hold onto this? Where should I invest it? What do I do? What advice do you got for me? It's simple. Don't blow it. Keep it simple. Count your money. All right thanks a lot I'll be I'm Outta here. fucking. Ridiculous. It was basically, it was an hour and a half of listening to morons telling you what the fuck they bought with all their money and I I don't know. I felt bad. But there was another part there was just one guy that I really felt bad for because. It was the hurt that he had. You know like Andrei of Reisen was on the thing and he's sitting there in his suit with sunglasses on. Mirrored Sunglasses doing the interview and just right there. It's like. I'd give you another million. If I had it if I gave it to you you you'd you'd fuck that up. Why because you're sending here on a shiny suit was fucking sunglasses on. Like Michael Jackson at the award show right. So anyways. The one guy who actually really bothered me was. If you ever watch it. It's thirty thirty broke. There's a guy who's sitting there and he's just ever. So slightly leaned to one side. And the just the the pain. In his voice. He's just just sitting there going. I made. Seventy, five, million dollars in my career and that. sadie. got. Me A, boat. Just. Sitting there, looking down on his knee playing with his PAT. Lick. Jetski in. Just. Look away. It was fucking. Brutal. But the rest of it was just a bunch of knuckleheads. I felt bad for Bernie Khoza too because Bernie Kosar. Seemed like his dad took his money I. Don't know what the fuck was was. It's a really it's a, it's a great all the thirty for thirty S or awesome. This one is awesome. But. They just should have had a couple of. Something not true because they had like four or five guys. There was only two people who really came off morons. But they would just so. They would such morons I felt at tainted the whole thing. That has been the dumbest thing I ever heard. What is your advice? Don't blow it too simple couch you money. All right. I'm sorry. What was that? Even remotely fucking interesting I love watching those thirty for thirty I gotTa Watch the Bo Jackson Won. There was just something about that like you know for as much as they showed. The amount of people that went broke there's been so many more people. In the league that didn't go broke. So really weren't you just showing? A select group of Morons. Who are going out and buying a corvette and sticking a fucking hot tub in the back of it. You know living week to week on paychecks. I mean, I just don't think that most people are doing. I would really think that if I was barely on the team I would be save every dime. I know I would. I've done that this business I've never fucking. You know what's common? If. You're in any sort of entertainment you know it's coming. And the day it's common is the day you think that you're good and that you made it, that's when somebody comes in with the hood on and the sickle and they just fucking choppy in half, and then that's it, and then you're that guy on TV fucking lean into women. That's why that guy was leaned to one side. They had to twist his torso back onto some fake legs. As he sat there going I. Got Me a cabin bought a mountain. You you'd think that if you had seventy five million dollars that you couldn't have anyone that shit goes in when when when it goes. There's nobody around. Anyway. I got a few more times. I feel like this is some sort of comedy in there. I just don't know if I got to it today. ANYWAYS, I've been drinking like a fucking madman lately, I really have to stop. I just keep going to these these frigging Christmas parties. You know. And they got booze there. So yeah, you know something maybe that if I got a zillion dollars maybe that that's what I would have would have done. Have gone become a complete frigging boost bag. Now what the fuck did. I do with my notes here. Oh, for Christ's sake, I swear to God this is just not my day. It's not here. It's not they're. Not. Here. It's not there where the fuck is it. Air It is. You know what? Let's read a question here. My brain is suffering from lack of oxygen here. Let's just read a question college duet. Hey Man I'll keep this. Short I got my eye on this broad. She heard me playing music in the dorms. On my door, I invited her in. We talk for a bit Jesus Christ Dude. I don't think you need any advice that sounds like you're already there. She just heard your talent and came knocking on your door. What more does she have to do? You know. pull up her dress and backer way in. Anyway all she said, she wants to do duets together my fault. I didn't realize she was also in the business of Jesus. Anyway second time I wasn't playing music, but she knocked on the door and started talking about duets again. Not, sure if she wanted to play then or what but I was busy studying. So I invited her in again and we talked yet again. Dude, you're only going to get so many at bats where it's going to be weird if you finally fucking make a move. All right. What are you doing? This is where did that come from? anyways I figure I'll invite her down. I have a single door with her instrument. Once, the work load didn't really sound good. What I figure I'll invite her down I have a single dorm with her instrument once the workload after holidays dies down and just kiss her and see what happens. This is just a band Geek right? What are you doing? Hey come on over and bring your your bassoon, and then she's going to walk any just gonNA. Kiss. Her. Please tell me there's going to be some sort of preamble of making her laugh or something you at least try to let a candle. anyways, he says, how does that sound any advice? I've had almost no interaction with her before or after this by the way. Okay he goes love the PODCAST, keep it up. You're a Greek just kidding fuck you. All right. What do you want to do with her? You just WanNa Banger if you just want banger will you have to do is just you have to? Stop acting like a gentleman. And I don't mean that in some sort of growthy disgusting manner what I mean is you have to you have to not. Just say this shit you're thinking. Alright. Just say the shit. You can say what you WANNA do right if it's one of those but if this girl, but if the girl is like. I. Dunno, She's more walled off. I don't know what the fuck it word is. I think that brain cell died when inhaled the power powder this morning. she's more walled off. I don't know she's like a nerd I don't know what to tell you. I. Never. Was, able to interact. With female nerds beyond just talking to them because they would just. So fucking I don't like everything was like awkward. So and then after that was to like, you know what I could literally rub one out faster than it's going to take. For me to figure out just how to get her glasses off. So, do just invited down fucker instrument. You know get the music out of it. And just say you WANNA. Come on watching a movie tonight just get over there. All right I don't know I. Don't know where you've gone with the conversation so far. It would seem weird if all son you're sitting there and you hugh hefner robe but that's the vibe I would try to bring. If you just want banger that's what I would do if you want if you want to date this girl then I'd take her out. If you just want Bangor you you, you have to start acting like a fucking. Crass individuals sooner rather than later? You know. You know it's a good way to kind of bring into the sex thing if you're watching TV and just start talking about some fucking girl on TV how hot you think she is and Blah Blah, Blah Blah hopefully that'll spin her around to be like, wow what are you find attractive in a woman and then you just fuck and Blah Blah Blah well let's take a look at you. You kinda got your fucking titty sitting in my phone right and then you're in Right because at work I, hope it works for you, sir? I think you are a great guy. You're a great guy. 'cause you're sitting in the dorm and you're you're practicing you're fucking Piccolo. All right. Next one. Actually. You know what that reminds me of a long time ago. Longtime ago I went to this girl's dorm and she wanted me to and I wanted to I didn't know how to fuck and bridge that gap and we sat on her fucking single bed for like till my ass fell asleep and I finally ended up just I just finally just said I have to just get Outta here I don't know how to you know what I mean I I don't know how to fucking crack the safe so I should have been a little more empathetic. God was pathetic. I was I was fucking pathetic. Say No I. Mean I think that's been through line in my life just being pathetic but it it sort of morphed. Every time I feel like Oh you know Kinda got that settled. Then there's a new thing. You know. Like say podcast. Feel like this is a pretty pathetic attempt this week. Don't you? Go Fuck yourself at the Stop Button. I don't give a shit I really don't. It's one of the great things about this this podcasting world. Is You really don't have to give a fuck. What the fuck is the man great thing. There it is. 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Dad goes out and shoots a pheasant. Ties to the rear view mirror and drive home with it what the blood drip down on the radio this is what you want. You want the mandate system, get it for him. Again, it's the man that's Great Grill Enhancement System Order today at Bill Burr Dot Com. Click on the PODCAST page and Get yourself one today for only nineteen, ninety, nine, the holiday special. All righty. Okay there you go. The fuck was debt reminded me of something in the middle there. The hell was I going to talk about? Oh I know what? I was GonNa make was going to try to make this shepherd's pie this week every once in a while get really into cooking it's usually when I have a downtime in this business and this time of year, I always take. I always take some time off. You know I don't like working over the holidays. I did enough for those fucking awful. New Year's Eve gigs you know. Some Godforsaken fucking strip mall. In the middle of nowhere you all by yourself. You go on stage. You got like a fifty fifty chance that they already handed out the fucking noisemakers. You standing up there eating your balls and then they make you do the Countdown Stop Your Act. That I talked about this last week I. Did I'll fast forward through this shit and then you gotTa somehow then they want you to continue your act after the countdown. It's the worst fucking thing ever. Everybody's hugging and kissing, and that type of Shit, you're standing up there by yourself like the absolute. Clear. Entertainer you know T. They're crying and your Tuxedo. So anyway. So I usually I take this time, you're often I. I start I always get I get into cooking, Cleo stop staring at me. Come here stop staring at me. So. anyways. I'm big. Mario Batali. Fan Right. So I made these short ribs. That with a fucking Shit went out. Got Myself with Dutch oven. You know which because of that joke is really been ruined. There's no way to fucking say Dutch oven. Cooking without somebody thinking about somebody farting under the blankets and pulling it over your face. But I made these brace short ribs that have been the shit but Niyaz on a fucking diet. So she's not eating any of them. So I ate like half a pig myself and I don't think my belly is ever been rounder or whiter. I have like one of those toddlers stomachs. Those little beer bellies that they have. You know I'm talking about cleo clear. You WanNA finish the rest of this podcast. Do you. Will get off me. fucking. Dog is so goddamn. Needy. All right. Let's continue on here with the questions for this week if I can find it. My computer of course I can't. Because this is just how my days but work I should've known I should've actually right back to bed. The. fucking the second. My. Headphones almost fell in dog shit isn't that isn't that like a sign that you should end the fucking podcast thirty three minutes and this is. Brutal Alright Douche boss steer bill I I want to say typically. All the episodes of uninformed. You did with the teen idol sensation on my phone and listen to them every day. But onto my dilemma I'm eighteen and work at the finish. Line. At the mall and my boss is a complete Dick. Of course, he is because he's managed managing a finish line at the mall you're eighteen. You got your whole life ahead of you he probably fucking married the wrong person. He's starting to go bald, he standing there wearing that referee uniform go we'll tell you about chuck taylors totally told you could stalk them up on the back or whatever the hell they say. Don't you just want to choke him with his whistle today. Make you wear whistles they're or is that athlete's foot or is that the footlocker? I Dunno actually know something I have like the the worst collection. Of dirty white boy sneakers ever going to see in your life every time I look at my sneaker collection. I pictured. Keith Robinson. Or Patrice still alive. God. It just trashing me. You know what's funny about how much I Miss Patrice is the amount of times. Is, when I I missed that guy. Tell the story with fucking out and somebody. Somebody. Told gave a fuck in speech. You know a whatever went on some rant about the state of comedy and everybody thought it was fucking amazing. It was just one of those times where I wish Patrice was in the room when this person was you know was was talking about. That's what I missed that. Dude. The fuck and most I missed him. Then I missed them when. Penn? State. That Sandusky Guy when he did when he gave the fuck and interview. Interview when he was talking to Bob Costas and they will go and do A. Little Boys and he was like, do I. Liked little boys I mean I. Enjoy their. Company and. Somebody says, do you like Little Boys? This one fucking answer? No. No I don't. Okay In Fuck you for asking me then and this guy sitting there like you know. Like trying to work out the math in his head and as creepy as it was to watch that when I. Watched it. I was actually laughing thinking of Patrice, watching it laughing hysterically and how he would somehow get twenty five minutes. Of Material. Just of that guy trying to figure out how to answer that question I swear to God like I. Don't know we got this benefit coming up for him and as just putting the together. It's just like going through him die all over again it's been fucking brutal. But good and a good positive things because everybody bought the tickets but it's just been like this. fucking. The finality of it, it's just something. I even talked all my buddies like we bring them up like he's still around. And, we'll talk about him. He's still around for five minutes before you start looking at the ground fucking awful I. Really I really do not wish. You know I don't know why you would and it's not even worth even stating but I really don't wish this on fucking anybody because it's really just something when I'm. Will if I'm lucky not. Drinking lately. But just be a little more conservative sixty eight. It's just something that's still just going to be. Coming to acceptance that it's going to be as sad when I'm that age as it is right now. It up. So I figure I talk about that to add to the already, not hilarious podcast that I'm doing this week. I'd add to the losing a close friend fucking vibe. WHO's can heal? It really wasn't a funny fucking week out in the world. All right Douche boss where are we here? The finish line he is one of those guys who okay his boss is a complete dick or it, and he says. He's one of those guys who got bullied all through high school in now actually has some control and takes it out on me and the other employees. How did you figure that out that? You just like psychologically breaking the guy down I have to tell you something there's nothing worse. Than Watching somebody. Abused their position of power however small it is. You don't like this guy right here has no right getting mad at like an athlete who goes around being a deck because it's like dude, you're doing the exact same thing you just can't run a four forty but your your head space is the exact same place. As some you know. Ego Maniac fucking athlete you just you just suck it sports so you sell the gear. To people to go play sports anyways he says even steals out of the register at work. In holds the special release shoes for him and his friends. He's thirty years old and tries to fuck the sixteen and seventeen year old who worked there Oh my God This guy is a character right out of the movies. I worked with a guy like this I used to work in a restaurant a long time ago. Sorry I'm trying to get. Out of my throat. I used to work with this guy basically like. Four or five of these guys bought to a restaurant. In in the one guy who's going to be there every day. Who's always the Guy Winds up stealing the silent partner always get fucked his his buy in was he had all the equipment for the kitchen So he he he I don't know he had some other failed restaurant he got all the equipment and But anyways, this guy was a cocaine he used to steal out of the register. He used to fuck in try to bang the not the maitre d', the fucking maitre Matrix. Whatever the fucking chick? Who Sits you down the hot one? Who Dresses Classy That skirt fucking going right over a shapely ass yet he's to try to fucking bang them all the Goddamn time and when they wouldn't give it up, they get fired and then he'd be bringing a new one. If that one ended up banging them. Then she stuck around was brutal. So anyways, he goes. He harasses me and others calling our phones repeatedly telling us to come in on our days off and leaves voicemail saying. We are ignoring him. Jesus Christ my fucking day off. anyways he goes recently he got the only cool management manager fired because he said he was stealing. I don't really need this job but would like to keep working here but don't know how much longer I can take this any advice on what I should do. Would be appreciated Sorry for being so long fuck yourself wasn't long at all it just sounded long the way I read. Well if you don't need the job, then I would I would quit. But what I wouldn't do is I wouldn't leave. On bad terms. I don't know. Is it really going to matter? It's not like when you're thirty. If you're looking for a new job, you're GONNA put on your resume I worked at the finish line. Because at that point, you're GONNA be into a career. I don't say I don't really need this job would like to keep working here. But don't know. Oh, you're basically you're saying you like having walk around money. Well, I would just get another job. Just. Get another job start the process of getting the fuck out of. Nothing you're going to say to that guy is going to change that guy. All that guy can do is of make your life difficult. You're trying to get another job. At this point your life just know that like he's at the tip of the iceberg of the awful life that he's GonNa. Be Living. Like the just. What the way he's setting the table. You don't need to do anything to him because he's going to do it to himself. And it would really be bad if if this guy was just such a negative force, you somehow got sucked into it. I know you probably fantasize about punching him in the face telling the guy to go fuck himself, and then the girl that you have the crush on at the finish line walks out arm-in-arm with you guys and you start your own sneaker store right across. And you watch him get fired I know you've probably played that fantasy out and you had one hundred times but I would just get another job. Sound like you don't mind working, you're not afraid to work working you like having the money, but you just can't deal with this. Do this is a great life lesson. You do not need to be surrounded by douches. You have the power, it's your fucking life just he's always going to be dosed just walk out of his life just be like, yeah you know I don't need to be around this guy. You know and then one day when you run into them, get another job. Hey, how come you left and just pick you know 'cause. I don't know you just in don't curse Adam or anything because then it gives him. An excuse. To not see himself and just I don't know man you the you just kind of creep me out the way you were always hitting on girls who were like sixteen seventeen years old I mean if that's what you WanNa do that's cool. But you know I'm just not into that so. You have yourself a nice evening and you just walk away from. Maybe. It'll work out like that I have no idea but. I try and get yourself another. All right. There you go. That's my advice. All right. Next one multiple fuck buddies gone wrong. You know what do just the fact that you had multiple fuck buddies. It's still a win. You know what I mean. It's still you made the playoffs. Hey Billy boy first time longtime I got. Going to get right into it. All right. Last weekend I got a text from a former fuck buddy who found out that I had slept with their friend before we started hooking up. Oh, go fuck yourself. All right. You're crushing asked all over the place. You don't need my advice I probably need advice from you. That's a secret goal of. A certain percentage of guys. Is like what if I can fuck her and all of her friends before they all figure it out. You know what I mean. It's sort of like an action movie with Dick. Can I stick in and all of them before the bomb goes off? And and can I get out of town like fucking Deniro when he? I see all of them coming up. With the how dare you have? You ever fantasized about doing that and you were so good. That is mad as they were. They all reminisced about how great you were and then all forum come over and be like. Well, fuck at the same time. If you haven't had that fantasy God bless, you are evidently way more decent human being than I am so anyways. With that. Here we go. Me Go, she sends me anyway. Let me let me just refresh your memory here. Last weekend I got a text from a former fuck buddy who found out that I had slept with her friend before we started hooking up, she sends me a pretty heated to page tax about how much of a dog and Douchebag Im for sleeping with their friend. Then fucking her the same weekend. Yeah to go dude, you're a legend. You're a fucking legend what is the doing? All you can do. Is just stand there with your hand inside take the slapped the face. And just know that yet you're a hero. Do you banged her friend and and her in the same weekend. And you're you're you don't front row a successful band I mean? That's that's. You know hats off to you sir. Hats off to you. anyways. He goes now reality I had slept with the friend in late May and then starting Hook hooking up with the fuck body and early September. All okay. So she tried to make dramatic. That's still great dude. You seamlessly made the shift over the summer. is still a hero. ANYWAYS, he goes to go into a little more detail. The Fuck Buddy had gone on several dates and fucked once three Oh, had gone on several dates with her fucked wants three years prior when we were both at college. But then shortly after she lost interest and we remained as friends for the next few years when I say friends, I mean the occasional texts and seeing each other maybe three or four times. All right. So what is your fucking problem? What is the rule? Shouldn't June? The second one be mad at you because you fuck the other one I. I don't I'll never understand. I never get any female if you still listening at this point if I have any female listeners at this point, can you explain to me? Why that makes you mad You know because. I don't know there was always like. There was always that girl that like when I was growing up like. I can't say me because I wasn't getting anything. Get anything in high school. Big fucking goose. Egg. I would make my. Pussy getting career in high school I was like the first year the Tampa Bay buccaneers came in the League. And went winless. What was the name of there? Gary Huff. was that the name of their quarterback I was the Gary Huff of Pussy in high school whatever the hell you I can't remember the name. Last name was huff was naming their quarterback with cream sickle fucking uniform. A middle had a suit made out of that when I was in high school. anyways. There were. There were those girls that like my drinking buddy crew like three or four of them. Out of the five head, all hooked up with her. And none of us were not nobody was mad everybody. Hi, FIS fun great. That's you know we thought it was a great thing. I don't understand why they get so mad. You know what it is is I I just think that they want to It's a big thing with them that that has to be difficult. And you know and if they think they just feel like if you banged them and their friend. They just somehow feel like. Maybe makes them feel cheaper. That this, you're just fucking hidden. It's like you're a machine gun you just mowing them down. I think that they really want to believe that they're the only one in that area code. That they're like. That it's like gold. Rather than like pine cones. You gotta dig for it. It's a precious metal. They don't. They don't want to feel like they're just like litter in the gutter maybe that's what I have. No I have no idea by have learned something in this fuck buddy is two words guy put fuck buddy together. That's how much he's into sex right now he's. He's literally like the fuck is, is gut the buddy part bent over and it's all one word they are one. So anyways, he said to go into a little more detail ratty read. The party said so fast forward three years and the friend of hers. That's the future Fuck Buddy? said that we should hang out after the socks game. All right I'm getting lost in this with all my rambling. Now what the fuck so You hooked up with the former fuck body. So not okay. So this is when when when number two comes in before you went back to number one. All right. So fast for three years later yes. So she didn't give a fuck. So who she should be mad at is the second one. No, but it's been three years. You know I. Really Don't think anybody has a right to be mad here. All right. Whatever should we should hang out after socks game of course I. See this is a green light because whenever girl. That you really don't know says we should hang out is Coz for down to fuck exactly. Did you hear that guy with the fucking bassoon. You got they speak in code. We should hang out sometime. That's literally that's what that means. Taking me out that means they. WanNa relationship we should hang out sometime. That's what that means. Okay I'm not saying one hundred percent. Just say muted it's looking good. You get waved around by the third base coach. anyways. With the helm for Fox I apologize guys. Grow says fuck so so anyway so we end up fucking. And she gets on a plane the next day to study abroad in Europe for the summer exactly she wanted some shoving off Dick You know. Let me get a little last piece of America before we go over to. Europe. Tremendous, anyways fast for three months later and the fuck buddy. All one word says that I should come over. Some weekend to hang out green light. We Bang. It's great and we continue to do it until the end of the month when I fly back to the place that I now live. So a few days ago I get the heat heated tech saying I'm a dog, a Douche bag, and she thought I was a friend at Cetera I say that there's nothing I can do or say to change what happened and the only thing that I can say is I'm sorry if I hurt her and then I am an Asshole by my question to you. Mr. No relationship psychology degree comedian is am I a dog for what I did. No You're not. You're not fuck these women who call you up and use you like fuck stick. All right they called you up because they wanted some Dick and you gave it to him. All right. You gave them what the fuck they asked for, and then she's going to turn around and get mad at you. And then you apologize say yamen asshole you're not an asshole but you know something I don't think you think you're an asshole because you're out there crushing it. You're just fucking saying you know this girl wants to here because probably six months from now she's GonNa fuck you again. Right. You're not an asshole. Hit on the other girl she said Hey we should hang out sometime. Okay. She's giving you the green light. You know what I mean you're a guy you have to take that. You gotta take it. Women don't understand that because they can get laid every night of the fucking week if they want to, they don't have to have any game. For us, it's it's. It's a skill. Okay. So when somebody if it's like you're in the wild, you've got a free fucking meal you're going to take. You know. I learned that in Australia when I was looking at those poisonous snakes and like why does that thing have enough venom? To kill two hundred miles. Why does it need that much venoms because it's out there in the fucking The outback out the outback food is scarce. So. If you get a shot at something, you got fucking take it down and that's what the hell you did. fucking dog. It's like you know what? Fuck? You Lady. I'm a dog then then you're a whore. From a dog, you're a fucking horror and I call you up. That I come around sniffing up your skirt. No, you called me. Because, you wanted some Dick and I gave it to you how about a fucking thank you letter. Do, you really should have come at her like that. You really should have and I tell you something and some fucked up levels. She would actually respect you as long as you didn't call don't call her a whore. All right. But she fucked sheet. So what is her relationship with you? You guys barely talk and like whenever she's an addict dry spell. She fucking goes over to you like you're hertz rental car and just just ride you Dick and then you're supposed to be exclusive. And not being a friend WHO's cut from the same cloth. Who wants to get plowed before she goes over to Europe this is your fucking fault. You're the want to Sheffield used. You know neither one of them wants a meaningful relationship with you. You. Know. What this is what I say just don't even write a back something fuck 'em again. Just Bang them again, you gives a fuck. Next time you see if she wants to give you a dirty look just like. I don't even react to it. What a fucking? What a bunch of bullshit. And I got I can't leave that like. We don't have a relationship. I'm just GONNA keep saying the same thing fucking over and over again like why don't We. Have Stuttering here. The other day I was watching I was watching the Texans when the Patriots played the Texans Monday night football, right, and Some lady at the at the at the was watching with us And she started giving Bob Kraft Shit. Grabbing like a thirty five year old girlfriend. For those, you don't watch football Bob Kraft was married forever. Had, a family and is wife unfortunately. died of cancer. You know. So she dies a cancer. You know he stopped by side did the whole damn thing and then now he's got a new girlfriend. And she's thirty five. And women are mad. The