20 Episode results for "Evanston"
CBS 2 News PM Update 011421
"I'm marie saavedra. Hear the stories making news at this hour. Seventeen police officers and sergeants have been suspended. They were caught on camera last summer. Lounging in congressman. Bobby russia's office. Well riots were going on outside. The police union is challenging that decision. Evanston firefighters rescued a woman trapped in her burning apartment. Firefighters tell us they found her not breathing and with no pulse on the third floor of a building on dempster. They did cpr and she started breathing again. She is now in critical condition. Some alarming news on the kobe nineteen vaccine chicago mayor lori. Lightfoot says the pace we are going it will take eighteen months to get everyone vaccinated. The mayor is calling on the federal government to speed up vaccine delivery turning to our weather tonight. Some light rain. The changes to light snow showers. Temperatures will dip to about thirty three tomorrow through the weekend. Snow showers are expected with temperatures in the mid thirties. You can join us on. Cbs to or cbs chicago dot com for news updates around the clock. I'm marie survey dra.
Ebanista School Students Natzem Lima & Zac Bell
"Hey, everybody. Welcome to its podcast on all things were being the tool, we use companies who make them and artisans whose please remember the views opinions and actions. Vinnie guest not reflect my own nor anyone who works with me. Hey, remember, if it would we're good. Everybody on the last episode. We spoke with Jonathan Cohen who started the Evanston school of fine woodworking. Now, we're going to speak with two of his students Zach bell and not some Lima have entered classes here at the school in the few weeks ago. And I spoke with them about their experiences, and what brought them to the Evanston school. I'm sitting down now with one of Jonathan's students not some Lima. Welcome to the show. Thank you for taking some time sitting down with me. Thanks for inviting me. Yeah. Pleasure. Pleasure. You seem to be taking off on a path of adventure that I love so much. And we heard Jonathan talking about it. And we know for fact that he does as well. How did you get started with a desire to learn woodworking? We're did that start? Yeah. It's kinda hard actually when I try and think back and trace it a little bit. Yeah. I kind of think back a little bit to my childhood and what I was exposed to my childhood. And then I think back to when I actually formally was in a woodshop and try to differentiate between childhood in which up in which one of those two actually started the whole adventure into woodworking. But yeah, I guess a little bit about my childhood when I first immigrated into the US we were living in Texas in. Circumstances. We were living in this. Like, we called it the show PTO. It was where one of my uncles had a plumbing business and me, my mom. I think my sister lived there for a little while in, you know, often times I would sit in the little bathtub in the Shuki toe and kind of look out, and this is like a kind of industrial type place in this is where you're living, and I would look out across the road. I would see this metal working shop. I would go off over there. Just like see the big machines and see them like taking away medal and that the same time. My dad was a carpenter and he would bring me onto job sites. You know? I was a little kid, and I'd kind of wander around pick up like nails after him and stuff, but all that. I just kind of exposing me to building into making things, and it was all pretty exciting. And you know, I think that kind of began the. I guess the spirit to build things and then fast forward if you years I was going to school. And I think the first time I made it into woodshop was because of believe owes building. Can't recall now, I was either building a frame or a little tray table, and I still remember his name because he's one of the best, you know, instructors have had to stay and I credit a lot of like my start of woodworking to him. His name is Ken stone. And he's out in Massachusetts. You know sense. He's retired. But he was running the hobby shop at the school. And you know, he gave me some guidance to whatever I was building. I think it was. I think it was a frame actually that was the first thing I started always a frame as a gift to my partner to my current partner. So. Yeah. I started building this frame. And I really didn't know anything about would slash. And I didn't know anything about putting veneers on. I didn't know anything about mitering just all kind of, you know, new new things to me. So with a little bit of guidance and a lot of shop training. I was able to kinda take it on my own hand. And learn a lot of the tools around the shop and. Ended up making my first frame. And I remember I think, you know, besides using the machines. I don't think that was particularly exciting to me. But I remember the one part of the project that was the most exciting was when I had these two veneers that I was laying out on this long piece of wood and the two edges of the veneers were not matching up, and you know, the the canzone came over and he pulled out his little plane, and he just kind of like cleaned up the edges of the veneer. And I was like, oh, what's that? He's like, oh, this is a plane. I was like, oh, that's really cool. Can I like, you know, can you show me? You know, what you did? And how you're doing it. And so he gave me a few lessons on using the plane. And I think that's when you know things really took off for me when I started to use that little plane to like just trim the edges of years. Very simple. But I think just the art of removing would and I guess kind of what it did psychologically was. Was released satisfying to me. So after that, I just found myself in the which up all the time and. That's to Gough what age were you at that point. I think I was nineteen nineteen hold are you now twenty four so not really that long ago. No not that long ago. I'm still pretty I still novice. I feel like I'm always gonna feel like a novice. We all do I think we all go through life going. Oh, I wish I was good as that guy. Or I really wish I was better at this. And and you know, and then people look at your work and go. That's just amazing. You know? And it's that humbleness of woodworking. I've met a few that we're arrogant but would workers, but it they earn? You know, you look at their stuff and go. Yeah. You can be out of that stuff. Yeah. So. What made you find this school and decide on this school? Because it's not free. There's an investment in time. Tell me why here. So yeah, funny story how I met Jonathan. I was working on a. Also, I was living in the. What do they call excessively dwelling units out here in Seattle as living in the successor dwelling unit, my landlord live, right next door to us and. The my landlords current girlfriend. She she's friends with Jonathan. He just happened to be over the house that day. And I was inside of you know, our little dwelling unit, and I was working on a table. A slab dining table that I made and I was just on the ground just like planning away at the table. There is like some sanding is doing and various other things that I was tackling that day and. I think is dog wandered in to our place. And I was like, oh, hey, Doug. Oh, and. You know, then Jonathan followed in right after and I had no idea who you was at the time. I don't really follow the woodworking community too much or anything like that. And so it's like, oh, you know guidance dog and he's like, oh, what are you doing? And I told them about the project and in as like, oh like, you know, what what do you do? He's like oh woodworker. I was like oh cool. No ways like show me photos of what you've got. And then. Yeah. Than I was very humble. Yeah. You pulled out. He's like, oh, you just look me out. I have a website. I was like. Oh, okay. And so you showed me the stuff, and I was like I mean, they just paled in comparison. It's yeah. It was pretty nice. And then so that that was about a year and a half ago that that Jonathan kinda just walked in on me doing my own thing. And I was on the ground where where we are living. And I think he's seemed to admire the fact that I was just doing whatever I could to be woodworking, no matter where it was. I I had pieces of two by four sitting on the ground with slab tables set up on. And then it was just like, you know, whatever you had to do you have to do to make it happen. And I think he was I think he admired that a little bit. And so when he started the school he actually reach out to me to to participate in one of the classes. Hopefully in the in the spirit that here -membered, you know, it's like do whatever it takes to get to work on my projects. That's awesome. Now, I asked. Jonathan. Why would? Why do you work in wood? I work in wood and metal metal worker per se. But I'm a mechanical engineer by study and currently doing some electrical controls engineering, but the you know on the metal side of it. It's very very different world. I mean, you you talk about being off even thousand of an inch on various features in that could be ruinous for the project versus with woodworking. It's a bit more forgiving. But even I think beyond just the forgiving or the forgiving nature of wood. I think there's a pretty big difference between. Being able to do something with your hands and carved through it with your hands as opposed to with metal. There's there's some hand work you can do, but it's very limited to small pieces. I think that that differentiation. I think is what attracts me to would. Yeah. You're talking about being accurate to thousands of an inch a piece of wood will change. Yeah. Inch while you're working just to you know, breathing the humidity. Yeah. It's a lot more. Yeah. Wouldn't itself Asli. It's definitely a bit more random. I think the reason lot of engineers use would end in your classes because a lot of it is really well understood how it's gonna expand. How it's going to behave under certain loads in stress, and so I think that's a peeling on the engineering side. But with wood. Oftentimes, those aren't really the biggest concerns generally your. I don't know something that kinda grows itself. And then shaping that thing that grew itself is I think were more rewarding and every pieces different. Yeah. Yes. What I love about. It is every pieces different. Yeah. Yeah. So have you gotten to part in classes nine they've only been going on for what three weeks to where you're signing. The piece that you're working on or you still learning some of the basics. We're still learning some of some of the basics not not too much design yet. I mean, he's been telling us design. Do you know what you're gonna make? Yeah. I think I'm going to make a lap desk. Do you know what you're gonna make out of yet or the details are pretty unclear I just know it's going to be about thirty inches wide eighteen inches deep in three and a half inches tall. Nice. I wanna have a sliding dovetail jor or dovetail joy slide. So I think that might be the bishops part of the project because trying to get a long run like that nice come out that smooth and uniform is gonna be it'll be fun. If you don't do it. Right. You'll know won't. Yeah. Yes. Drawer won't move completely. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Most of the times I take on projects. I try to make them the most difficult that I can because you know, if you're spending your own time on something I just generally feel like you wanna be doing stuff that really takes you beyond any like ordinary skills that you might already have otherwise I mean personally to me in does not anybody else. But if feels like wasted time to me if I'm not doing something, that's relaxing challenging yourself. Right. Exactly. Because what are you learning? If you're doing the same thing over again. Right. That's practice. But being able to learn something new. I think it's part of the passion for what we do. Yeah. Yeah. That's awesome. That's awesome. What are your aspirant for woodworking? You want to get out there and start your own studio. Yeah. I don't think I have aspirations nature early. Maybe not yet. I just given a little bit about how I grew up in stuff. I think having a little bit of job security is pretty important to me. And you know, being able to provide for family when times get sure gonna win times are needed to be able to do that in. I guess the impression I've gotten so far is that you know, if you have your own businesses woodwork? It's you know, it's it's a lot harder. I think to be able to rely on steady income and actually my parents are both artists. And so I also understand you know, income is is a lot more sparse when you're doing artistic work as your it can be. Yeah. But it can also bring in a lot too. Where do you find inspiration? When you're coming up with an idea. A good question. I never really thought about it. Generally, when I fall asleep at night is when I'm mostly thinking about what something a little like or you know, how might function generally like China work problems out, but where the inspiration comes from. I don't think there's necessarily one place. It's probably a combination. Well. It's hard to say that anything I ever come up with will be truly unique. Because everything I'm exposed to anytime. I see something somewhere where here's something somewhere. I may not personally make a bookmark of it in my head. But it does influence how my brain goes to create the next thing. So I don't really feel like anything is truly unique to me. So it's hard to say that I find inspiration one particular thing. It's I think just generally living is good inspiration to build stuff. That's awesome. That's awesome. And I think you're selling yourself short. I think as time goes on and you're designing different pieces. Yeah. I took a little bit here a little bit here inspiration over here this, but you made the recipe you took all those little pieces. Nobody else is gonna take them in that same order, or you know, think about it quite the same way. The masters out there that that you're inspired by. Or are you that familiar with them? I'm not super familiar with any of we're talking like Sam Loof and James crossing and not yet. Fine. Do those kind of guys. Yeah. The only the one of the more famous would workers that I've gotten to just read a little bit more about was actually because I used his butterfly designed to join the two house of slab dining table. So you know, I figured be get to learn about you know, what he did. And what his history was like before. I just do this. Who was at this is George Nakashima. Oh, yeah. Yeah. And so, you know, I said I study a little bit about him in his origins. And I mean, it's a lot of history, and I generally have triple even remembering name, so. But no, he's he's really, I guess he did really awesome work in. What's it like learning from Jonathan? It a lot of ways it's very what's nostalgic. He reminds me of my dad alive, and that's kind of weird. But. My dad has a lot of the same mannerisms as heat has. And you know, my dad's also very Tissot in that sense. He just had a very different set of circumstances that led up to him, you know, doing the things that he did. And you know, Jonathan different set of circumstances that led him to become woodworker. But you know, a lot of the mannerisms I find. The Sal GIC. You know, when he does the light he's describing a motion across a piece of wood or something that's pretty similar kind of built in for miliary almost. Yeah. Built in familiarity. He's really humble guy. And never felt that he's viewed any of me or any other students says, you know, lesser than than he is, you know, given his reputation as woodworker he's always treated us. You know, I I. I generally see that being the case with everyone in that trade alone. I think it's pretty far. Now, how long is the program here. Ten weeks ten weeks ten weeks six hours a week three hours for one day or two days a week three hours. Each doesn't seem like enough time in the shop to now. Not some thank you so much for with me. I I envy you in a way being the know not the very start. But the storm of this part and being able to learn from Jonathan who I just met. But I looked at all these pieces and read his bio and all this stuff and did some research, and it seems like he's going to be a great teacher. Yeah. I'm excited. We're only third week so far still brand new. So that's awesome. Well, thank you so much. I appreciate it. Now, I'm sitting down with another student of Jonathan's, Zach Belle and Zak thank you so much for spending some time with me and getting chance to talk to you. Of course, my pleasure. Now. Where did you start? Where did you find the first passion for woodworking? How did how did that start with? You. All I started in high school would shop both me. And my dad went to the same high school, obviously years apart, and I really wanted to get into something that always love doing out in the yard building stuff on. So I I was one of the first things I wanted to get into got into high school and had the option to kind of fun my dad's his sophomore year in high school is the first teaching year of the of the woodshop teacher there in STAN would Mike Chandler, and my junior year was Mike Chandler's last year of teaching. So we both got to go through woodshop with the same teacher, and that really spawned and the friendly rivalry between me and my dad on on furniture making woodworking and and trying to win up each. All the time. And then it just kind of took off from there. Just really the only thing I really ever didn't have to try extremely hard to understand and always loved you. Remember, what the first thing you built in which was up to box and still sitting on my mom's dresser, Alaska, and I look at it. Every time I go in there and think oh man really want to go back and fix the ending. Graduate from this set of classes, you can build a new box. Yeah. Yeah. So what brought you to this school and to learn from Jonathan. About five six years ago. I kinda got into professional side of woodworking got into production shop and decided that that. Knows where I wanted to take my career on the side of been trying to to slowly accumulate both tools and skills just on my own watching YouTube videos, listening to podcasts stuff like that. And. Constantly getting frustrated not having the right direction. Not being told any of this is a stupid mistake that you don't even realize you're making and got to a point where I realized to get to where I want to go to get to the the skill level. The high skill level that I want to be ad that I needed to be an environment. That was gonna. Point out this stupid mistakes that you don't realize you're making in in really fine. Tune some of the detail work, and then I came across Jonathan when I was actually googling for port Townsend woodworking school, which is much more difficult to do on their schedule on that. I found this week before class started and scheduled worked perfectly my call Jonathan we were able to make it work. And some things are meant to happen. I got the chance to go up actually to the port Townsend woodworking and dueled set of interviews with them too. And it's a fascinating program. Yeah. I just there's just no way I was going to be able to do full-time five days a week for towns, and I've got I've got two year old daughter. And there's no way I can make that work. So you're still in like we talked to not some in your guys are still in kind of learning. The basics and getting going. So I've been going on three weeks. But do you know what your first projects here is going to be? Well, if had a couple of designs drawn out and everytime Jonathan tells me to simplify it. So. Probably thinking somewhere along like liquor cabinet or bathroom. Vanity some some sort of wall hanging cabinet of IVA tendency to not like straight lines, and that obviously adds to the difficulty level and the time scale, so I need to come up with something that's gonna be able to be completed a little quicker. Well, it sounds like you've got the right teacher because Jonathan when I interviewed him he was talking about. And he hates straight lines nieces the first time after make a box of anything. I'll put a band in it or something like that. It was really funny when I won. I think it was the first class he start you're showing some pictures of his work and stuff and probably fifty percent of the pictures that he showed us. We're pictures that I'd seen or pinned on Pinterest or saved as I really like this as inspiration. But you didn't know. But you didn't know it was his started showing pictures of I've seen that always seeing that to really cool. That's awesome. That's awesome. So how's he for teacher? Always great. You can tell he's got just a wealth of knowledge. I mean more more information than you can glean from him in just ten weeks. Yeah. Yeah. So what do you hope to do when you get out of here? You're going to start building furniture. Is that the plan or is that something you're going to grow into eventually? Yeah. Eventually I want to get out of production is my main goal, whether that's my own shop where I'm building commission pieces or it's a high end furniture shop that does not have production shop in one off for somebody else. I generally don't have the business goal. So initially, it'll probably be in a different shop. But I I wanna get out of production. Yeah. I mean, there's things you can learn you can learn the business side of things. Yeah. Working in another shop just pick up. Whatever you can. So is there what tends to be your favorite woodworking disipline mainly just furniture making any turning carving anything. I do have a life. I get on it whenever I can. I'm not the greatest added I've got very cheap turning Jesolo for. But it is a lot of fun. I like mainly furniture, though, is is really whenever I'm sitting there. And I don't have anything to do the lay. There's not the first thing I go to is always get out there and start designing piece for specific space, whether that's table or a cabinet. Something that's more complicated has got a lot of different pieces and parts that you really have to have to think of the full the full skill bigger picture. Yeah. Yeah. I love turning. I mean, that's my going to if I just want to be in my shop. I'll Chuck up a piece of wood and go for it. You know, the other things to me seem like all I'm doing is cutting little pieces and putting them all together, which is great, and you can make some amazing stuff. But for me. That's that's what I'll go to. If I have no idea what to do in my shop. Cut this part out thinking trying to think of what? Trying to think of there's what else I wanna ask you any stories. Well, this this last weekend actually back to the turning. Topic is so last early last week my grandfather passed away. He was it was his time doesn't make it any less difficult. But we've obviously we've been going through some of his stuff, and I helped move one of his old dressers this last weekend. I opened up one of the doors and a little box like. Glass gate classes case, I opened it up and there is a mechanical pencil and pen both of which I had turned when I was thirteen years old, and they were in pristine condition still both worked perfectly as it was very cool. Very heartwarming moment for me to open up that box had no idea. What was in it? And go. That's my work from when I was a teenager listening to DC in the shop sitting in front of my mini lays just going to town not worried about time not worried about money just having fun. Well, I think I think that whole discovering the the care and the appreciation of those things it just makes it so much. My grandfather was big into lapidary working rocks. And he taught me how to do it. And I made a bolo tie one of my first rock projects. And I gave it to my great uncle his brother, and I've been going through they passed away, and I was been going through their stuff, and I found it. And now, I have it back, and you know, it was very well cared for of box and same kind of thing. So much more spectacularly, and it's like, okay. We'll some navy bell pass this onto my kid with. That. And I hope they appreciate that. It's it's the whole everyone always talks about one to make a piece that lasts a hundred years, you know. And if you don't if you make it and sell it and give it to somebody else. You never see it. Again. It doesn't have the same effect where if you make it for someone all of a sudden now, you're the one that's passing it down, really. Is really neat. It's really, heartwarming. But I think sometimes just when you make a piece on commission, and you give it to them. And you could see that light in there is like, oh, this is going to be around. Are you know, we're going to hand this down? Even if it wasn't something they made that appreciation is there, and you have to feed off that because you don't get to collect all your piece. I just can't my wife would be so mad at. Does she support what you're doing? Oh, absolutely. She gets a little frustrated with me at times. She says I have a problem. I'm a little bit of a hoarder when it comes to scrap wood. But absolutely. She supports me. Yeah. That's awesome. That's awesome. Well, I know you gotta get out there and do your classes and thank you so much for sitting down with me. Give me a little insights. And what you're doing what you're learning. And it is so refreshing to me as an older woodworker seeing what that this is still the craftsmanship coming up in the students coming up in the passion. And the love that they have is. You know, what I had when I started. And and it's very refreshing. So thank you so much. Of course, appreciate it. Hey, everybody. I hope you've been enjoying its would show about all things woodworking. My audience has been growing fast. And I want to say, I appreciate the time. You spend listening to my show. I have been planning more trips to extend the reach my interviews and bring you stories from further and further away from my home. Unfortunately, this takes money, and I want to encourage you to go to WWW dot it's dot com hit that patriot link and for as little as one dollar a month, you can help support the show and keep this adventure alive. Also, there are higher levels of support which with those you will get some great items as my thanks to you, please consider subscribing in this way to help me out in creating great content for a long time to come. Thank you very much. Thank you for joining me on this episode of it's a show about all things woodworking. If you have enjoyed this episode, please subscribe using the app use to listen to podcast. You can follow me on Twitter using the address at its would podcast, and you can find me on Facebook using the address it's would if you would like to help support the show you can hit the merchandise link on my website and find limited edition, t shirts, mugs, and other things designed by me with the woodworker in mind, or if you'd like to support the show directly hit the patriot link every donation is greatly appreciated and the money goes to help keep the show rolling and the adventure in woodworking alive. It's what is produced and hosted by Daniel Carter and brought to you by the old nerds workshop LLC all rights reserved portion of this audio may be used without written permission. I hope you will join me on. My next episode. If it's would thank you and create.
Clash at Wembley
"Great news. There's a quick way. You can save money. Switch to Geico. Geico could help you get great coverage at a great price. And it only takes fifteen minutes to see if you could save fifteen percent or more on car insurance. Go to Geico dot com today and see how much you could save. Welcome sedation ESPN essay, I'm Dan so much on my Craig valley. Stuart Robson and alley Moreno, we also welcome in down to the show as we welcome. The return of domestic footballer to Europe yesterday. We talked about our legal. Let's focus on the Premier League show this weekend. No question. The game is at Wembley Spurs taking on at Chelsea just one point separating these two sides going into their clash, according to the bookies. Wow. She's pretty much fifty fifty Spurs nine to five Chelsea eight to five Chelsea slight favorites. Cray. Is that surprised you? Not really. Suppose. Heavier injury list. It goes on a few portrait CENA's been talking about. You know, some of them are basically getting punched open. Maybe it's a coincidence of not saying any players in the summer, both sides of fear a momentum. I think the one thing taught them can take overs. You can get jokes about four. I was reading something earlier that chair. Sort of been a home recently against teams that we sort of the big six so all that said, I'm probably going to go for draw. The hunting foam has been an issue for Spurs away from home. Now the best team in the league. It certainly has. They played Liverpool. They were outlay loophole press out the field won the ball back in good areas. Spurs didn't have let fluidity and Craigslist mentioned it they've got licensed evidence centuries out. They've got John canal. Now, they've got a lot of trippy is going to be out. So there's going to be a lot of problems defensively. I think for Spurs the problem for Chelsea they haven't got to send the foreigners planned, but seeking Willett Mon morass in a moment. Just overall expectations from this game for me. I just think Chelsea wins this game. And the recently this happens is because for the last few years, we've got an excited about Spurs, and we've gone out there and in this show, and we've talked about some of the things that they've done well on the momentum generated and the core group of players and budget Tino. I just don't see that the upward trend is going into direction that it should go for Spurs. Yes. They win a few games here. And there they generate some momentum. You think okay? Here's the moment. This is a time that in a big game Spurs is going to win it, and I've gone out there and pick Spurs and they've disappointed me. So I'm not going Spurs. Again. I told you back then that I wasn't going to do it anymore. And that's it. I've turned the page Spurs big game. I don't trust them. No things in Spurs. Don't think because this is that best Evanston. So primarily scenes and yet something doesn't feel quite right? Why is that what if anything they've been winning ugly, but they have won their last four games now in competitions. I scraped it out at Crystal Palace in the last game before the break in the news on Yan Vitton, by the way is good. He's been back training and could well start the game of the weekend. So that's one injury problem. They don't have Evanston Sanchez is out for a long time. I've got a sneaking regard for Spurs in this game. That was a time when they could never be Chelsea really were that bogey side. But Chelsea I dunno. Did they go off the boil a little bit and not no no drawer again Staten in the loss game. I've got a feeling that Tottenham might well and Chelsea's unbeaten record here be close. But I think they've got a right chance of doing it all these feelings. When you send them put you Tina. I think he's done a very good job Spurs because they was doing. They was talking about supposed needed to go on the which and he's absolutely right. But you have to think where they were when he first came in the not so you would think would be up for when he took over these built a good side with not spending overly I think he's got the best out of the plaza. He's gonna viable they Kate with a similar sized lots of the games over the last three or four years. He's one or two challenges you change the system every so often, but he still needs to go and win something that will be the test can put as at least you said they need to go to that next level win something. And then I think he will be highly regarded as a top-class coach the thing is he's he's. In the League Cup, uneven. Maybe the FA Cup in extent. He's kind of throw it in the well off go to think about champions legal. You don't believe every is going to end up and then getting into toll four. So you only get four challenges every season you get full chances of winning seats. Seems wouldn't even the FA Cup of the League Cup is of great interest in some of these monitors. No more as to four. So, you know, I agree. I mean as important to when things, but it doesn't seem to be as important for the monitor's. Look the question as we go. See him have success at taught on before he's cherry peck, because as only amount retired before he leaves and goes to another club continue to have the other team spending spending this branding, and then you don't much are you don't even try much. No, no, the move this new stadium. So the trends are going to be chain. And he's only going for so long that a good site. But and it's four from me that she does. That's good for it. I think I don't think they're gonna challenge. Meanwhile, when we talk Chelsea inevitably we talk strikers and our Miranda using a lotta Chelsea the scenes what you see in real life in person when you're at the game, isn't that potential? That was just as confidence social. Well, I think there were signs earlier in the campaign if I'm beginning to pick up his former 'cause he was it was a bit of a car crash for him really allow season try to set. And then she ru was starting ahead of him. Now, he seems to have regained the place and regain the favor of the manager. I like Chelsea that very easy on the eyes is lovely football to watch your knees and instant hit their sorry. No doubt about it. Who default? I'm this was supposed to be a big year of transition for Chelsea that they'd be still unbeaten this stage. They do have a way of keep eking out results, and my rats are. Well, I think yeah. Find a line really is jury still out isn't he? It's been out for a long time. It feels it. What the problem with more data is that? Okay. First of all when there is no confidence. It's clear when whatever you see it, and he can not fake it. You can sense it that he's not confident. This thing is that the standard that he is compared to the locals that even if he wasn't scoring goals. He gave Chelsea a certain personality show. He gave Chelsea something different. He can hold up the bowl. He could draw foul. He could do things that would impact the game other than scoring goals in what at this not scoring and it's not confident. And then he doesn't give you hold the play. Then he's just another guy on the field. And you just can't have it not at this level. I actually think that we have seen perhaps the best of whatever we Chelsea over the last month and change, and that's not saying a lot because the bar has been very low. But this has to continue enor- for tells him to be successful. There's just no way just the same way that I don't trust Spurs. There's just no way to trust more out there right now looks nowhere near the polarity was invented when he was on loan events. He was brilliant. So the best the food display probably ever seen against I think he's Real Madrid. When he kept running in behind. He was a bomb. Mediums absolutely magnificent put in the performance running in beyond holding. The bull will upset imply up scoring goes, this is a took place and the food and since he's been at shows he hasn't done that. So Why's lost these companies? When we spraying and stuff Alvin Omarosa, again, those games played certainly one of them think it was the last one we've had highlighted on the show here because he missed a coupla Glading Cianci's. He's Joan border Tyne as far as I'm concerned these on borough tight. I don't care if he scores another bag full of goals that she and his whole plays not been good enough. He's movements Nova in good enough. He's not strong enough. There's been talk about a county sheriff's you can get him away from enter remains to be seen by settling them over Murata all day and every day. I just think it's only a matter Italian when Chelsea do replace them. But this moment in time. It's a needs must scenario because he's replacement hasn't done. But certainly, well either is he. You know, last time you're on in the studio equals, vivid who who home with your criticism of Joe, Gino, you said you didn't like him done. Right. Tim. What's like, I said, I don't see him as a world class player didn't seem as the most important platform. Chelsea now he has played. Well, what doing what he does on these facility? He gets in between the midfield pleasant. And he's defenders and he receives the bowl when they're playing the way he's facing they played to a full, but it keeps possession really, well, but what have seen? He's not gonna go and pressing because I don't think they fear him on the ball. They they want to stay more compact to make sure that has out doesn't come on spice that William doesn't come show phones by Cova chicks when he's blind doesn't get into open spaces. I can't see that is an out and out. Good defendant is a holding midfield player. He pauses it. Well over ten fifteen years. He's long. He hasn't got along rain falls in very often. So if he was saying that you picking him for even just keeping the play you go in but. If you give him saw him when the bull will pick up policies in the juvenile would left to play through passionate. Since he came the primarily, it's been excellent. And they love to go through him. And he's comfortable on the ball. Are buff dot by plan? Rica teams where he's going over to the film about getting pasta and defend and then they'll play the longer the real test will come over the next few months when when jokes are playing a game. The bigger teams have a full strength side. Who just I'm a narrow like eleven that'd be going press him. So it is obsolete. Unwell and he's key to what sorry wants to do. But we'll see the bigger games, primarily -ocial. No. By the way, you have perhaps actually the best defensive midfielder, and Chelsea not playing as a defensive midfielder and doesn't go low county. And so not only does that impact. Because we talk about white genius does and how he impacts the game. How about how he impacts the game owing goal hunting in between? He doesn't know whether to defend whether to attack he's kind of running around and covering spaces and those certain, but he's not a guy that it's really going to joining the tag and give you a whole lot of production there. And so if you're I appreciate your genius good player, but not good enough to. Move the best guy in that position in the world, arguably because you just wanna complete more passes. I just don't see that. And that's the part that it on countries. Just signed a new deal is you know, it looks like he's going to continue in that position choking cheese. If you want to play the passing game for Joel genial, then he has to play there. But you're not gonna get the defensive jetties. So he's not going to couple the field bucks county. He's not going to them at fielders Condie's, not going to sit and between the centre-half's and read the game like Angola Conti. But then if you been men and he come pasta bowl age genius. But if you press Judy no he switched and turn away from Trump, and he has to play back the way he's facing. That's why it comes to send it back to us enough. When he's pressed he ever get to play full size, the standouts high isn't it from the Premier League this week? Can you check out some of the other matches this as well Liverpool away against Wofford? You've also got also against born the fifth as sick own ends on Monday with Burnley against new calcium. United ITO those blink motion activated security. Cameras. Yeah. Hoped would go on sale. Just did. It's the blink black Friday cyber Monday sale with huge savings now through Monday blinked cameras are motion activated when they detect someone snooping around you get an alert on your smartphone with an HD clip and blinks live feed option, let you monitor your home pets and package deliveries. Visit blinkprotect dot com slash radio. That's blinkprotect dot com slash radio or hit Amazon and search blink camera. Right that it'd be a lot of Josie Marino. Quote, standing around today after an interview it didn't Spanish which storage cough, and some things mistranslated refuse to talk about it in the press conference today. But we have the translation exactly what he did say. And he was asked about the diamonds within his team out young diamonds, and what they were missing. What was the problem? He was saying they miss maturity, here's implies a very different this year that this generation had surpass because then we'll spoilt he mentioned a by name. He talked about linger talked about Russia and mouse show. And Luke Shaw, we'll players are more spoilt. These news. So what was gonna loss as he said anything? I mean, if you go to go back to the apprenticeship. So we used to do you did all the jobs on you trained on you Clinton boots? And you did all up, and you roll your sleeves up the young kids know, they go in there. Then he's in Detroit. And they don't do any of those jobs. The whole dynamic has changed and with social media and all that scenario, the players are, you know, I will use it what mollycoddle more. I mean. I don't see the benefit of him coming out stating that I think that's the that's the point is gaining. He's going to do it in house if he's issues with the plays. Lisa keep it in house till the plays, and and trying to dress it if he signed that they don't understand the game and they're a little bit spo-. And they don't haven't got great hall, then he's got to join educate, but Marinos not that sorta manager he wants the finished article. He wants to know that they can carry out going blend young players coming out going because I still don't always understand the game as well as they should. And that's where he's got to improve to your point that's part of managing and the evolution of what the game is today as what it was ten years ago twenty years ago, that's part of that evolution now, we may not like it women appreciated. The fact that players may be spoil. But if you wanna stay current you have to be able to handle this you have to be able to handle social media. You have to be able to handle players that have a policy with them that have a group of people that support them and tell them how great they are and fantastic great. You have to deal with the play because that's part of your job. That's your job. Is not on the okay? Let me just say that the team out there, and they'll be fine. No, look, you have to get the best out of the player and part of getting the best. I you replace. It's understanding what makes that player go. And if you have to go on talk to them about social media, and that creates a connection between the play you do it. If that means that he's going to give you better productivity on the field. AM what you make of all this. Well, I think it's a bit of a phony control policy in this case, I think Josie Marino might have a point really and being a little bit annoyed about how much is being made out of all this. What are you said to Hristo Stoichkov chatting to him way in Spanish was he felt the younger players. These days were a bit overprotected that maybe they didn't quite have that instinctive aggression. Maybe that play had say like a Graham soon s playing amid fo- for Liverpool in the heyday is had instinctively back. Then I think he was actually quite complimentary about a rash. And lean God he said he knew that they would change the game when they came onto. He said, Luke. Shaw from playing once every three months slushy. It was good enough now to play every game. Even though he had made that mistake against Manchester City. So I think here Marino does have a point. Meanwhile, Liverpool sticking throwing how's your crop address? Today, always headlines on a few months ago, and he came out and said, well, it's good. It's good for us. Really good. It's all about the small things as well. And he helps us massively in that to be honest. Missile some some of the media were mocking mocking. This kind of throwing coach coming in with. Some of never seen. Never what throw in court. I mean, I mean, I presume a presume it's trying to to get more players the ability to throw longer when the final fault. We saw Joe Gomez played for England against Gracia was the Mogollon Idaho, much coaching. You need to do that. Rory deal out was a great example of the guy played with Darby who from stoke sexy used it from the halfway line. But Rory was a notch. So I don't know. I don't know how much she coach I like ROY story because when he was dominant. I didn't know he could for so long that right? I thought ever remember Rory thrown along. Went to stuck enro- Rory end up stoke and the bowl was rocketed end from everywhere. I don't ever remember when I was young. So for the first two years, I took long throws off the company is the long throw went out the game a little bit. So I didn't go over and talk to them anymore, but I still had the loan throat, but we didn't just use it. All right. What you learn your show. You wonder coaching? You didn't coach to throw that? We'll use the long throw. You didn't. Can you be coached? That's throw along to take a little let me see you. Let me see you can obviously something has been offensive. If you're actually immediately get an explanation, but to be yeah. Give some sort a clear clear vision of ho ho that's going to help. Yeah. It doesn't want to do that. Because we'll ever I know a few things is going to get an advantage fight. I just you know, I'm not quite sure how you're going to go from having an average through to be enrolled rebel up quite c can you picture in training? Hey, the long throwers this way. All right. All right. You're going to work for another twenty minutes. I mean, come on and join a boast about long further, maybe you're used to have like robot. I certainly did. I mean, if you're in Klopp tells us that his long throw in coach is an important player. I think we have to believe in. But I don't say Liverpool signing Rory Delap or engage Stewart ropes anytime soon. Have you seen the longest for an awesome? Good anything. That was a real threat. More about it and extra time account. Wait for that. We always on questions, of course, every day. You can check it out on the website as Gavin loved playing football. He lived in briefed wanted to go when he'd spent hours upon hours just see this touchdown dances at one day. Well, getting fitted for bifocals, he realized he was never much good at throwing or running or country nor even kicking. Yeah. Gavin's chances of playing football. We're looking like fourth and long very long, but he did hear how DIKO could save money on car insurance. So he switched and saved. Then he did kind of a touchdown Benz. At least he was still good at that. No question the big game in Italy this weekend. It's four I is faith Laczi. Oh, take on as Milan. AC milan. Injuries all over the place, and you're going to spend it as well. It's going to be a big Thompson Mitja problem for them because although they they started off the season poorly. They've got better and better on the too. So, but there's still a very creative. And when their main strike he going they suspended Qatrani will come in. And there was Abraham of each. That's why there was for him. If he's going to ICM Olympic Qatrani who comes in a young player your trauma runs in behind these hard work and send the food, but he hasn't quality that's gonna get lots of goes in wider, sue, so he's that best player you can create things coming in on these left-foot. Kelly hug new Callahan who plays on the left hand side. He can come on. And he's right foot KCIA trying to dry from from midfield. But then not a creative. So I'm not sure how they're going to school goes against this because there's no real price the running behind, and it might matters worse. Their best centre-half Romagnoli's, not going to be fit and immobile. For. Let's you if somebody who can running behind in school goes emotionally say it's not just me that say Chung gluten. Didn't go for thought budget to Mogadishu late the manager to show. I mean, the not as rob who said the not worthy the more pleasing in the ice is. But if they're going to get an adult full this year, that's the way they're going to do but equally and was optional ship it with these reaction and the game is going to cost them on. Of course, they've got. Doria breathing down the neck as well behind them. So they're really under pressure. But scoring goals is a problem for them. There's something about Milan we're talking for full wouldn't trust them, windy. No, no, certainly not. And this is a team that sort of you think. Okay. They're going to get better. All right. They're taking the right steps. Eat feels like maybe this is the season where they those steps they'll steps forward are noticeable in the feel and get I don't see it. I don't see the real improvement. And certainly when you have the injuries that you have when you have the suspensions that you have I don't see me line really competing in this monetize see last year winning it and win at handily win. Let's win the game. And again because of that four is a patter is planet send off a ball. He's white policies best. And then you go to road Rigas. There's no good one. We won't defend this. Let me let's just remind you show the other man Shays type place over the weekend events is taking on spout as a Roma completely Saturday lineup. Extra time in a moment. But I made to measure suits fit Batts compared to generic off the rack, suits. And now there's no longer any excuse to wearing an ill fitting suit, especially Stewart. At such great prices Indochino is North America's leading mates a measure menswear company. They make suits and shirts. Your exact measurements for non parallel and comfort. Or you need to do is choose your fabric, any other design customization and submit your measurements. Then you can relax on you'll suit gets professionally tailored on mail to you in a couple of weeks, and then is black Friday season, meaning two thousand eighteen lowest prices and Indochino that means taking up to seventy percent of everything this week. This get black Friday pricing by using code ESPN NFC at checkout that seventy percent of the regular price from mates measure, plus shipping is free. That's Indochino dot com. Promo code ESPN f say up to seventy percent off. That's incredible Dale from mates measure suit. Once you custom you don't go, right? Welcomes extra time I trust. Everyone had a lovely thanksgiving. You know me. Let me take a look at com. Hey. And his element. He was there. All the turtleneck. Nice. I know. Code. I put that on Twitter and some of the responses where interesting vote shiny head. You didn't tell me Patrick, Stewart run your. It's one of the comments as well. It's like FREDDY Krueger, let me crude. Oh now that's funds dresses Steve Jones. Yes. If you took you on his head, would you notice the difference? Some others that we can't say. Oh, we I was thirty Juba. Excellent. Joe? Very good. Right. I wasn't. I was y'all suddenly we it was it was great. It was good. It was just the four of us and my family family my beautiful wife. Just put out a spread of it seemed like it was going to feed twenty people. Right. Did you have a go at it? I had to go. Yeah. It was Sali. Yeah. I thought it was good. I didn't disappoint Craig missed it. Go room. I was going to my neighbors because my wife's away on a mentioned his name by virus? Brand John Keenan off item around on when I was driving by joins hosts. So everybody sucked table leading. I was like. I was like why don't you Elliott like a true joke? He came in here had a free meal when he wasn't working. I came on to do. And I took advantage of the free Cuba. Donaldson. I tweet and Ken create his phone away for two seconds. No. It's not happening. Oh, no. It's not hour here. The central security. Yeah. That's an what's the best atmosphere. You've cooled a match in an outside of Europe. Lou. I'm going to go off the top of my head brusett. Oldman is always a fantastic place to go with eighty thousand people. I'm that big yellow wall is great. And what about outside of you in oh side of Europe. Well, I think the American are in Brazil would have to go to number number one there. Although it's not the easiest commentary physician. But you don't want to know about that, Dan. I know you don't maybe. No, you don't. Right. Should should the F I office Southgate and extending than contract due to his impressive work in two thousand eighteen. Well, they were English. What you don't supporting them? Thank you. They don't just give him a contract. Yeah. I think he's I think he's got a new deal. I think he's he's he's getting a new deal. Anyway, I'm not sure whether it's he's put the ink to the paper yet. But the answer to that is. Yes, of course, I think. Nothing. Really good job these things they've got the spirit. The because we discussed. Would you talk with the wind Rooney scenario a little bit? Yeah. I can see why I think they were trying to sell tickets. That's the money thing because USA hadn't great following the tickets headed seven wells. Let one bring Wayne Rooney back another what a moment the kids. Why? Love the lovely beautiful. A heart. I've got no hot. I know that win the super classic. I got harder. This who's your? Head coach for Boca Juniors manager for Boca Juniors. That's my guy. Yeah. Did you see the training yesterday? Yes, sir. Wow. I'm going we Boca. Yeah. Fun and one in is this the worst you've ever seen the US men's national team. Well, no, any good place at the moment. I mean twenty eighteen is not vintage by any stretch of the imagination and. You know, the performance at Wembley really wasn't good enough. And I think it just says they go to get on with it. Now cephlon a new lineup. And of course, most of all find that new coach name. I don't know what the delays now there shouldn't be any delay. Now. Good job Gogol US. And when you. I was going to say. Has gone redundant for a minute. I think longer than that. China. You're saying. You off tomorrow. You know, you're trying to push me. But we all. Tomorrow to reflect on we'll pick up boss runflat see what type zone. Fell Monday tomorrow. What do you know? Good. You. Look your research narrowly. We've doing eighteen highlights. On to that.
#B61 (bath to bathroom)
"Hello Word nerds. Thank you for tuning in to this electron digital on demand. Podcast thing It's called the dictionary. It's podcast tell everybody you know. Go right and review especially on I tunes give me five stars and say how you really feel and Download on as many platforms as you can and become a Patriot on. Send me an email a message of whatever on the things in the stuff and Let's talk about some words. I hope you'll learn something. I word is bath. B A T H. It is the I form It is a noun from before the twelfth century. One a washing or soaking as in water or steam of all or part of the body number two eight water used for bathing to be won a contained liquid for a special purpose To be to a receptacle holding the liquid so the bath can be in the bath to see one a medium for regulating the temperature of something placed in or on it to see to a vessel containing this medium three A. We have these synonym bathroom. Three beat a building containing an apartment or a series of rooms designed for bathing three sea. We have the number one definition for the word SPA and it is usually used in plural so bads or baths Now we are on Three D. this British and we have these synonym swimming pool and it is also often used in plural for a the quality or state of being covered with a liquid four. Be We have the number three definition for the word flood five. We have the synonym bathtub number six a financial setback. Synonym is loss as in took a bath in the market. Let's look at the analogy. Shall we This is middle English from old English. Bheith B. E. T. H. Or be ash t h akin to the old high. German bad B. A. D. which means bath From Old High German bane which means to warm. Now we have the second form of bath it is a transitive verb from the fifteenth century. It is also British So it's just a verb We're going to start with the transitive. Verb definition to give a bath too and the in transitive definition is also British and it means to take a now. We have the third form of bath. It is a noun from the fourteenth century. An ancient Hebrew liquid measure corresponding to the EPA of dry measure This is a Hebrew word. I don't know what EPA is or if I even said it correctly. It is spelled E. P. H. H. I assume that that is also a Hebrew word. Now we have bath share. It is two words noun from seventeen. Sixty five a hooded and sometimes glassed wheeled chair used especially by invalids This feels like it should be updated Okay and then it's Then it says broadly we have the synonym wheelchair Hooded why's it hooded and glassed in. I don't know anyway. This is from the town bath in England. Now we have the word bathe B. A. T. H. E. It is the I form verb. From before the Twelfth Century transitive definitions are first number. One synonyms are moisten and wet. Some of you probably Did Not like that number. Two to wash in a liquid as water number three to apply water or a liquid medic medicament to to apply water or a liquid medicament to. It's kind of like the word predicament I think I pronounced correctly medicament. I think so. M. E. D. I. C. A. M. E. N. T. number four to flow along the edge of synonym is laid L. A. V. E. number five to suffused with or as if with light now we have. Yeah like if you bathe something in light you've heard that before now we have the transitive definitions one to take a bath number two to go swimming number three to become immersed or absorbed and bather is a noun now the second form of bathe it is a noun from seventeen forty seven number one is British and we have the number one definition for the first form of the word bath which is basically the first thing we read at the beginning of this episode. Number two is also British. We have the synonyms swim and dip. When I dip you dip. We dip now we have both pedic. It's like a pathetic but with a B. It is an adjective from eighteen. Forty five characterized by baths buff. Ethically is an adverb. So this is interesting. It says well. Maybe it's not that interesting It is from the word Bathos Which we'll get to later Plus the suffix and then it says as in the word pathetic Doesn't say what the suffix ethic means but that's also it starts with an e. So we're not going to get to that for a while. Now we have bath house one word now from seventeen zero five one a building equipped for bathing number to a building containing dressing rooms for bathers next is bathing beauty. Two words Noun from Nineteen. Sixteen a woman in a bathing suit. Who is a contestant in a beauty contest Yeah that beauty contests are still a thing. That's happening now. We have bathing suit two words Noun from eighteen fifty two and we just have these synonym swimsuit neck. Next word is a bath mat. Two Words we actually need to get a new bath mat. Ours is not very good and I think it's a little old This is a noun from eighteen. Sixty seven a usually washable. Matt used in a bathroom now. We have baffled with. I sound like a have a Lisp B. A. T. H. O. L. I. T. H. Bath. Sounds like I'm trying to say the word bath now. Don't even know how to say it. Bassa Lisk what is that the Lizard Thing Bass With a lisp so bath a lift anyway now from eighteen eighty four. A Great Mass of intruded Ignatius rock that for the most part stopped in its rise a considerable distance below the surface bath Olympic. I just find it funny That is an adjective when I think about the fact that it sounds like somebody with a lisp I it's just makes me crack crack. Yup that's good now. We have the word Bath Ose So Bath Elizabeth is actually from the Prefix Bath House. Which means depth Which I said we're about to get to And then what was that word before a overthetoproof also The base word is bath house. So here's bath. House is a noun from seventeen twenty seven one a the sudden appearance of the commonplace in otherwise elevated matter or style. One be synonym is anti-climax so the opposite of climax. That's an interesting concept But yeah it's probably just deep down. I don't know what I'm saying. Number two exceptional commonplace nece commonplace nece by the way is all one word And a synonym is trite. Nece number three insincere or overdone pathos. Synonym is sentimentalism. And then this word is Greek and it literally means Depth D. E. P. T. H. Now we have bathrobe. It is a noun from eighteen four. A loose often absorbent robe worn before and after bathing or as a dressing gown. How many people actually wear a bathrobe? I think the brain is not working. They're so many thoughts in the mouth. Can't work fast enough I should put a like an instagram or twitter. Poll do you wear a bathrobe? Yes or no I think I had that thought before for something else and I think I totally forgot to put up the poll anyway. Do you wear a bathrobe. Yes or no I used to after I took a shower but then I was like. Why am I wearing this bathroom? I don't know All right next and last word for this episode is bathroom. It is a noun from seventeen. Eighty one a room containing a bath. Tub or shower and usually a sink and toilet number two. We have the two definition for the word lavatory. Or some people say lavatory Some people say bathroom. Some people say restrooms. Some people say the loo- they say that a lot in Europe What do you say? What would you like to use? I like to say bathroom. Even though it doesn't really make much sense but restroom doesn't make a lot of sense either What was the best word in my mind while I have to pick Where did it go bath? Lift as the word of the episode. Just because I like the way. It sounds That is all the words I started I thought about something earlier today that I could Mentioned to you. Maybe I'll do this periodically I'm just GONNA maybe every once in a while just mentioned A podcast that I'm listening to Or show that I'm watching which I had mentioned before but I don't have any new stuff to say but I will tell you Let's find good podcast that I'm I should probably do an order. Otherwise I'll get super confused. let's see. Well let's start out with something. That is highly highly specific It is called the checkout This is four the Evanston or from the Evanston Public Library in Illinois near Chicago So if you're not in Evanston You know you might not find it as interesting But you might actually find it very interesting because what they do. It's not about the library or books. what this podcast does. Is They just interview interesting? People in Evanston Who are doing interesting stuff. And they've only had five episodes so far but I think at least three. I haven't listened to the fifth one yet but I think at least three of the The first four have been people who are doing a lot of work with social justice And so you know if if you're somebody from another town and you WanNa get some ideas. Maybe something that were doing Check it out. Check out the checkout It's it's been really interesting and it's it's been cooled to hear about some things that are happening in my town that I was not aware of And I'm I'M GONNA keep on listening and I hope you keep on listening to that and you also keep listening to mine and I'm just going to keep giving you more content to listen to because I'm sure you don't have enough anyway. That is it for this episode You very much for listening and This has been spencer dispensing information to you and I hope you appreciate it. Thank you and goodbye.
Talking Marketing & 90s Ska w/ Chris Askew- S5Ep13
"Hey there welcome to beer beef and business the business podcast for smart people who appreciate the the insights found in a good conversation. That guy sitting at the end of the purview bar is your host David J P Fisher that everyone around here just calls awesome B fish. He's an author speaker and business coach. Basically he's a professional talker. So grab a glass of your favorite beverage. Grab a seat eight and join us for today's episode. Let's see where the conversation takes us. Hello Hello Welcome back to another interesting conversation with an instinct person. Today the role of interesting conversational partner is being played by my good friend Chris Q.. Chris is the founder of tilt marketing and branding and also the host of his own. PODCAST is a sales and marketing. PODCAST called Tag Chris. Welcome how are you thank you. I've I've never been introduced. That way is it's an interesting conversational partner that feels so sterile. I know anything but because we've actually got a dry veyron of this conversation Because I cried the classic podcast or blunder and got to push the record button for our lives so we got a dry run. We're going to do it again so I know it'll be good and by the way I do want to also mention our sponsor. We got a new sponsor for the next couple couple of episodes temperance beer company located here in Evanston Illinois I love temperance for many reasons. Not least of which is as their name For those of you might not know the temperance movement was headquartered in Evanston Illinois If you are in the United States we have seen called prohibition back in the Early Twentieth Century our beer's allowed and all alcohol was out loud and that was again headquartered right here in Evanston Illinois so of course all of the breweries and distilleries pay homage by name themselves after it has exit the Prohibition Movement and going Nanny Boo Boo. I right so anyways. I am drinking their gatecrasher. English style Ale L. and it's quite tasty so thank you for helping us bring this conversation to you all right. Let's and Chris you drinking something today. I think I think he is representing our local brewery. I'm from Lisbon. Ohio which is a super small town south of Cleveland about an hour south of Cleveland. But this is a local brewery that makes an amazing blood Orange Ale and the color is a very read Beer but the taste. It's very like fruity. It's almost like a I don't know man. It's almost like a site or but it's still a beer so it's real sweet the and good but listen to this poor out if you can catch it all right. I don't know if that's coming through some of it did now. I don't know if I'm thirsty or if I have to go to the bathroom so I mean like it's peers. So that's kind of constant right. I think so. That's our also work nude like you have a beer and then make room for more. Yeah then you have a coffee if you need well never mind all right. This is my question before we completely clearly go off the rails right from the very beginning. So I'm sorry no worries you are kind of new to the running agency see world you were working for agency now. You're on your own marketing. Here's my question as you've gone to running your own show show and having do marketing for yourself. What has that changed in your perception of of how marketing works and in kind of the opportunities and the challenges that face as we market ourselves all right so yeah you hit a good thing like we? Yeah I kind of technically run two businesses the way of you my podcast. Even though I don't really make money off of it I do view it as a business. But it's a It's been a lot of work and the my time has been incredibly compressed because not only do we run the podcast and the AD agency but I'm also a father author of three boys. which do that keeps guy too right? Yeah you know and I worked from. I'm working from home right now because you know it just started up this agency. So we're real small and I work with freelancers Ramon but that means like I got my little guy with me most often during the day too so yeah by my time has been incredibly compressed so I guess like the biggest thing that I've learned is I've I've had to force myself to not be a perfectionist. All and you yeah to just has put out content in idiot faster than I ever have before like. I feel like everything's compressed and even if something is a fail I would rather get a message message to market than sit around and try to you. Know worry about that whole analysis paralysis thing that you know many so many business owners run into overthinking things and perfecting their message. Now don't get me wrong like I think having your message having the right messages good before you funnel a lot of dollars behind it but I also very much believe in put stuff out there. See what's working experiment dude. I just jumped onto tick tock doc myself okay. Yeah like it's it's been. This has been fun because we've just been experimenting there because like I have always wanted to have fun agency the agency worked for before. was you know it was a very business forward. We had a lot of like accountants and banks. That weren't they weren't fun. They weren't could experiment with a brand new social media platform. Oh God no God blessed they ever experimented with something funny. You know what I mean. It was all series in like. That's not my personality European so that was one of the reasons why I ended up needing leave was because that's I I do. I at least I think I have a good sense of humor. I my kids always tell me though that I think I'm funnier than I am well. That's just your typical dad. I mean that's just kind of the way it works. Yeah I mean if you can make your kids laugh I mean then you then you actually have a legit opportunity to have a career. 'cause they are going to be the hardest audience. Yes so it's interesting. There is two things that cash it out to me. I always talk about the challenge of bandwidth for small business owners. You No solo preneurs entrepreneurs. There's only so much they can do but a lot of times what happens and what I'm hearing is that whether it's the marketing The team or the marketing agency. That's GonNa help them or any other kind of expert resource that small business owners going to tap into a lot of times those those outside consultants think that they're the most important aspect of that business owners life and so they go. Oh Hey here's like the thirty different options. You have for marketing right and this happens a lot different areas but definitely in marketing. Where they're like? Hey here's the nine different platforms. Here's the fourteen different campaigns pains. Here's this that and the other thing. Oh Yeah and yes you should experiment to. So maybe you should try these other two or three things and you know the the business owner in this case Acer the agents had is going dude. I I got nineteen emails in the last five minutes that you're talking to me I I've gotTa do client work. I've I've gotta do all the other things going to take care of her team and my personal life kids. Your kind of Sometimes is analysis paralysis. It's just they shut down because they're like I can't do this heavy armor. The band was well. I think it's really important to like Yes I'm experimenting with Tik Tok but let me clarify. Lincoln is my platform of choice. That's where I spend ninety percent of my social media time The other ten percent is spread out between like hail posts out some stuff on on instagram. Play around with Tik Tok. Maybe I'll do a couple of tweets but the reality is is David. I just had to make a decision on. I'm going to do this one platform. I'm GonNa do it really well. And then when I talk about putting out a lot of content I'm talking about putting out a lot of content on your main gene platform that you're using so I'm not necessarily saying. Hey I'm gonNA spread everything between everywhere else because your brother ain't nobody got a time for that. You know what I mean. That's that's honestly it's a fulltime job and honestly for most companies. If they're going to really be honest it's it's more than one person person running all of those channels to if you're going to do it really really really well. So being as being a small business owner and working with a lot of small businesses or startups they you just don't have the capital. Not just the money but the time capital the investment to to do that. Because you know the what I found is the best way to get engagement engagement on any social media platform to actually be social right which that doesn't scale. Well you know what I mean like. You have to literally respond to people people you have to send personalized messages like. That's not a copy pasta. Approach that you can take in any kind of success in when she would tell the the sales people that send me the carbon copied Lincoln requests in messages. Like over and over. I mean I guess it worked with somebody but I can't imagine dude I got. I got three of them just this morning on on linked in just. Because that's my network like I've kinda grown they're a little bet and you know now getting to the point where I'm getting like a whole bunch of Rando sending me requests rather than me being the Rando sending somebody right which is fine have but like. Oh you're absolutely right. So many sales people just send garbage post that get completely ignored and yeah okay. You didn't put very very much effort into it but because you didn't put very much effort into it I'm not GonNa put very much effort into responding even bothering to respond right well and down down the line. Something I tell sales people all the time is anything you're putting out. There is going to make an impression. It just is very likely that will be the wrong impression right the one that you want to make. Yup but I think you also said something really interesting there that I wanNA highlight for anybody in this. I think goes for definitely breath. We're talking small business owners Ashburn yours but even research on sales people and I. I talked to salespeople lot it. It's not about using all of these tools all time right because you know get shut down is when somebody goes. This is being the social selling space for example where people like. Oh Oh I've gotTA use linked in and twitter and facebook N.. Tick Tock and instagram all of these things. And that's really not the case it's figure out where where the people that you want to engage with our time on that I'm very similar to you. I spent most of my social media time which to be. Blunt isn't that much now that I've kind of got some systems in place and also just some some habits formed around it. I am on Lincoln most of the time like you. I have on twitter. A little little bit I have an instagram account. But I think the I think by instagram bio says come find me on link. Because I'm never here. I need to probably really do that on mine. And to be very honest so I'll I'll get a message on instagram. And I won't see it for like two days so if you're trying to reach me on Instagram I'll see the ad eventually right right. Yeah and one thing. We didn't just mentioned his facebook like personally. I'm a lot I mean if you are that's great now people who love facebook in time. They're either for personal. Lives professionally if if you have like a BBC business if it makes sense to to talk about your practice engage with your customers. They're great but lake if if customers aren't there and or if they are there but they're we're not ready to talk about what you're selling. I have some clients who are insurance run insurance businesses or financial services business and like people don't want to talk about life insurance on facebook. That's not why they're scrolling exactly. You're the dude at the party who it's like a holiday party and you want to say. Hey what kind of coverage do you have. It's not the right context but I said it's just pick your lane and then just run in that lane. Yes yeah and it's it's In early on if you're if you're like let's say you're a startup and you're trying to figure out. What Lane do I get in at that point? I say get into a lot of put your fingers and all the different pies spend a little time remaining and checking out the content just to figure out where your audience is sitting and then like after like a week seeker to you should know this. It should become pretty pretty clear early on okay for those of you who are startups. Yeah I do encourage getting into all of them just for checking it out not necessarily posting but consuming content so and then once you decide like hey yeah this is where my audience would sit than pick that lane right and so when you have my tick tock earlier in to blend our even really know much about I know but this idea of experimenting with it if you were going to you know for yourself or for a client working with when you talk about experimenting what are you. What are you hoping hoping to get from that because I think some people have the right idea of what experimenting with New Marketing Tool? Looks like yes so. There's a couple of different things like when when we you say experiment. It's always good to at least see what's out there and see where it's going to grow like I I always say like you should have your finger on the pulse a little bit. Okay you understand understand the guys at least somewhat so that you're not left in the dust if something really takes off and you know I saw a tick tock as something that you know I remembered vine from way back in the day was huge and then twitter was just you know. They made some financial missteps where it was no longer viable. Because of how they were rolling up periscope and all of that and it pretty much killed the vine platform which which kind of sucks. Because now tick tock is out and it's backed by the Chinese government and everybody's jumping on this thing and I'm over here like got a few concerns about that. I actually just saw. Yeah yeah a great video by German name Hank Green. WHO's a big youtube creator? And he's like who makes money in. His career is based online online and on social sharing. He's like Yeah Tick Tock in some ways is really cool but let's let's just pay attention for a moment about you. Know they're are they can take all of your data. It's not an American company where there are some protections or European and the Chinese government can basically say we want all the data you have and TIC TAC has to be here you go. Yeah well think about it like this to like Not only is there the data concerned but you know Chinese government has been messing with the US dollar and painting value to it for how long now. And there's there's so many think about like the ethics behind like there's been literal apple stores opened end up in China that were completely fraudulent so and not owned by apple at all but like when you see pictures on it it looks like a legitimate apple store. It's like when you're when you're talking about the Chinese like business like there's a certain element of distrust that I think has been earned because of illicit actions on their part so so when you say like hey somebody blew up to one million users and they have like ten thousand Wykes for every video that they have. I've gotTA wonder you know. Is there you know gaming. On the on the system in order to promote their platform and make the Americans think that they're they're becoming viral when in reality. It's botts doing it right right. There's now transparency do that's and they're never ever will be because WHO's lose to hold them accountable. Now you think about this way like. Do I trust Mark Zuckerberg. No I think I think Cambridge Analytica like pretty much. Blew that out of the water. Her riot do I trust the Chinese government to run my social media platforms more. No no harm no. Yes so that said like everybody and their mom is now on this platform so we decided to jump in and try it out and our video like I made a video with my kids. It's like I wanted to do something really funny and related back to marketing but was really funny is the video. I posted it to Lincoln and to to instagram. I am and it actually trended on linked in and I got four thousand dude. I got four thousand views off of off of it. offline took me ten minutes with this video together right. It's it's like for video. That's my most viewed video that I've ever put out like I usually get good views on my static content but this this was the first time a video of mine has ever trumpet. That's so yeah well it's also interesting as you said that wasn't experiments. I like the way to said there where you're just trying to keep your finger on the pulse because what doesn't sound and correct me if I'm wrong what doesn't sound like you're doing is going ham experiment to see if any of this has legs and then throw a bunch onto money at it in time. You're saying hey I wanNA make sure this is that I have some awareness of this and yeah if something really starts kind of ringing a Bell I might I put a little more attention on it but at least I know what it is. Yes okay and I'll and I'll know how to guide a client in it you know. Because here's the thing like most Let's just be honest. Most ad agencies do not know how to reach millennials let alone Gen Z.. Shirt so I wanted to it. Be a fun adding. Am I going to be going after Gen Z.. Clientele no not necessarily but I at least want to have a rounded. Hey We know what we're talking about and we're not idiots. You know what I mean so like I wanted to check out this platform and actually post and stuff consumed some stuff and see what made sense so that I'm able to help customers customer better and I think about something. That's good for any business owners who do interesting so let me kind of move this from from the online world to the offline world. Because I think it's real easy these days whenever we talk marketing to think of social thing of digital channels which are which is obviously important but I think skip over a lot of other channels something that you kind of touched on for you built your linked to network that were you just talked about all of the The message you're sending the the real engagement you're having networking is has always been a big part of how I build my business. I write books on it so yes. I'm super biased. I know it is for you. How do you see kind of networking kind of dove tailing social media like is it? Is it the same as a different. I mean like I guess to me I don't really the line is very refunding on that which is to just curious. Yeah no because like. I'm literally like I guess. My view social media as doesn't networking that's honestly like my viewpoint of it and what's really cool is You know a year ago. God bless I think a year ago I had less than five hundred connections on Lincoln. And we're we're up to like you or any of those. Oh my goodness under five God and yet your Flavian only blocking young yeah right but But now like you know like we. We have a good amount of connections. Now that I've curated and built up by being social I use the platform as a networking tool cool. And what's really cool is like even for my podcast. Like I've used it as a means to reach out to people that I've wanted to learn from it to network with and get to know Oh and that has leverage some incredible relationships for me. That's why we're talking like unite. Never met yeah exactly wait but we've also had a lot of conversations and I think this came up in another episode. I forget which one who always with my friend. Pat Hellmers Aw there you don't have to necessarily meet in person but you still have to have that one one true conversation whether that's by uh-huh hopping on video chat or something. Yeah and one thing that I try to do too. And I was encouraged by Dan Willis to to do this Grape social media coach He actually encouraged me to record personalized videos and send them to people rather than in just even responding with a tax response yet and that that dude. That's been amazing. First of all. Because a like you know how much gets communicated indicated via your facial tone your facial expression yep and a lack it's lost in taxed so and people just love video and like it makes that high light light at highly personal touch. Where hey somebody took just a few extra seconds to record a video? Incentives me on linked in private messages. Nobody does that nobody does that. Do the only person I've ever gotten that from was. Yeah you start to people. Oh you and then one other dude sent me wanting to blew me away. It was he was the first guy that sentence me Edwards Zia Australia and like he when he because you sent me one after heated KITA. Dang it man you slow to the PUCK. Well I've been a big fan of that because as you said it's a great way there's some free platforms out there right now. Now that you get really easy and one thing I do caution. People is remember that you are going to be on camera and then it's not just a matter especially especially in a professional setting. It's you're not just calling your friend or something so you do have to kind of be quote on a little bit and you gotTa make sure your diaper genies not in the background Redo. Oh you do it. Hey you know what. That's people know that this is this is the naira slash ask head national international terrorism Rockstar assets. So we had I had David up odd by PODCAST. Ask just to give you background. And like the whole time he was talking like every time he moved his little diaper. Judy was like right like almost lost. It at what point during the conversation should because I- toddler and I thought it was funny. Hey you know what but strangely enough and I completely didn't do that on purpose it but what we're getting to all this is that there is this value of being human right. Yes it was Recently I saw Mark Schaefer. Who's he's a big marketing writer speaker as I am talked for a while and one of the big things? He's kind of champion championing right now. It's hard for me. Aw is just this idea of really looking at marketing not as systems or processes or anything like that but really about. How do we get human-to-human mm-hmm and how to react with you talk about the younger generation? They don't want to connect with your brand. They want to connect with humans right. N- exactly exactly and so there's nothing wrong with sometimes having that diaper Genie Ryan the background. Am I got. I got a little kid that comes with the territory. The right man. You just had something interesting that I wanted to whatever I forgot about. Let's let's switch up Hey so so we were. I was looking at some of the music your day in and like me kind of the same age is at nineties rock and stuff. But here's here's what I loved Ogden. You might not know this about me so you made a joke that you used to like the super tones back in your days so I I played in a Scott funk man for over a decade. That's crazy they sell out yeah. I was a drummer by started. Back when when Scou- was king in the mid nineties third wave baby so do do you know how to skunk are you a stinker. Though the first song I ever wrote For the band's called gang to this so they know it you know it yeah. That's something that's something I'm surprised hasn't hit back in a while like you know how like trans kind of bounce back. It's been a minute since we've had anything that's really like horn section driven or anything in a lot of music so it's it'll pop. I think I think part of that's because I think by the way. There's still some some some scab as just keep keeping it going like if you I mean here in Chicago for sure. There's definitely bands hands coming through in there still shows. I went to one recently actually Recently I think about a year ago but it was mm-hmm mustard plug their twenty fifth anniversary or something and it was great. 'cause there's a bunch of US old seniors but there's a bunch of kids and I'm like when did they start letting right and twelve year olds in here and I'm like I just feel old. Do that was actually the worst part about jumping on talk was like I'm sitting here waiting through at the beginning beginning and like because everybody is like get uptick talk at least check it out and I'm scrolling through the feet and I'm like God bless I feel like a pedophile. Everybody's twenty I hope hopefully hopefully not but yes you know like the old guy took yes very much like the old guy the borrow surrounded by twenty somethings like do fit in but eventually decided not a pedophile. Just Click yes into the interweb great big disclaimer. This awkward fast. That's an old Chris. Rock comedy special. Ah I twenty is going to still rings in my ears. Sometimes we talked about the old guy in the club and he goes. He's not that old he's just too old to be in the club. Yes what's funny is. I had to like a search out like certain hashtags and whatnot that were relevant to marketing advertising sales and then when you start finding your your crew so for those of you who have tried tick Tock and decided. Hey it's just a bunch of kids doing dumb shit. Pardon my French It's not you can find signed like adults on there. You just gotTa like give it some time for the Algorithm to let you know that you've got to find all the parents. Yeah right right. You've got to find the DADS trying to be cool. And and and you know rocking out their old Scott bands right and to go back to my point. I think that at the electronic music craze over the last fifteen years definitely kind of Stymie the development of the next way. But here's what I do think I think were you know. Everything does go in waves and we're starting to see some of the kids getting back to really liking bands that aren't electric electronics. Driven Right. I mean the two thousands early twenty twenty teens. You saw so a lot of kind of computer based idiom all that kind of stuff and now you see people kind kind of goes back to acoustic and an van. Horn's they're gonNA come back because you have good driving horn section and ain't nothing like it. One of my first concerts was Scott concert sir. It was a band called five iron frenzy and I was in I was in Aberdeen. South Dakota at that concert man Mecca UH Scott Mecca. There was twelve of US rocking out. It was amazing. That's a big show. I still remember when I was still in the band so I mean this is actually early. We asked me like late nineties if you remember the onion newspaper the comedy newspaper. Oh yeah they have. I still follow that online ice. They had this is back old school before they ever had a website. So you actually had to go get the newspaper At the record store they had this big headline the record store and a new. How old are you under the news? I in you know the onion hatted actual physical labor. Oh for sure I mean they. They start in Wisconsin. I grew up with them in high school and stuff. They had a fake fake headline which was Skoll band at local show outnumbers audience. ooh Go to me at all if you do go. Yeah it's about right that's about right. You'd have these Scott shows especially when it first started started so this is like ninety five is before the boss owns had their their one hit and summer. Ninety eight was so so exciting for us. But there'd be like four bands you got. I usually have about six to eight people in the show. It needs band and so that was a trick if you had four of them. So there's like let's say six people six hundred twenty four that means that Six of them are on stage and then you have eighteen people there that's awesome and if there's no random friends I mean that's a huge show. I know super tones had like eighteen people in the band because they had like a big horn section so it was quite the crew so you know when they were traveling through small town. Small towns in South Dakota outnumbering. Your audience is probably easy. interest rates you but that was one of those stops where they're like okay. Hey we're driving our van from the West Coast the Midwest are. Where can we stop and have a show where maybe somebody will let asleep on their floor because you know oh that especially with those big bands like they did not have enough money to To buy hotel rooms for everybody so basically you're looking there. There might have been a couple of times where some traveling bands of outer city bands crashed on our floor. Where like at school guys yet? We open for you and then you come and crash into floor no Brockville. So what was the first concert. You played them in the first concert So with this band so I played some some man's earlier but so are banned it. It was called gestures. I think something is still around doing it. Good for them Our first show ever. I was the the the president of our hall in our dorm and so we had to like have snacks like a snack night. So I was in. We mean when my friends to start bands are like Oh. We're going to play in the dorm basement so it was in the Foster Walker. Complex basement is Thursday night and we had a ribs ribs from a local rib place. That's why everybody came. But who cares. And then they listen to us and then whatever it takes to get him. They're gone couple of albums had a a lot of fun. Played everywhere from Garages and downstate Illinois Up to the House of Blues and it kind of everywhere in between so so the only thing a have stuck in my mind is that scene from Kevin from the office where he plays in the wedding band. This is this is not repeat right now itself you gotta give Vinnie video or something. They could pose throwback rb because I need. This mental picture broke brother. Thank you and I think that's a good view that we should wrap this up before we go off the rail up. Sorry we're you know we're GonNa talk again. It's all good right. Hey One thing that I do ask all my guests. At the end of our conversation. There was one piece of advice that you give someone help them have a better day. Today I would say just Don't worry about being self conscious about stuff like like. That's something that like. I'm a thick guy you know like I went went from being real heavy set dropping whole bunch of weights. Unfortunately like I worked at a job that I hated for a couple years and then I found another job that handed after that for a couple of years I did I popped up again so but like I you know like you gotta get over like I just did I got to interview Joe Lissi in a person and it was all livestream video. I live streamed at a digital marketing conference. And like I said Dude but like dude you just got to break through that so if you're if you're struggling with not not putting out content because you're worried that you might sound weird you might be ugly. You might be overweight. You know like your concept might be good. I'm just gonNa tell you right. Now get over it and just do it dive in Iran commit yet because like once you once you break pass site. It's all just a mental. Click that you have to like just shut up your brain once you break past that. You're going to see that people buy in. You don't mean in in like it's I'm living improve to that you know what I mean like. We've you know we've grown tremendously. The podcast has grown tremendously like my social presence has grown tremendously. Because like I put myself south on I try to be authentic. You know what I mean but you know like I could have let my own insecurities hold me back. And they were for a long time so I would say yeah. Yeah so that would be the best advice that we give like. If you really WANNA start kicking by like get all that behind you and just dive in and go for it. The world needs to hear what you have have to say is what I tell people all the time I love that and and also of course when we talk about things that we have to say we do have to thank our sponsors for the show. Temperance Beer Beer company right here. In Evanston Illinois I have been am now completely finished with their gatecrasher English style Ale a great IPA. A and again. I'm not a big fan so if I can drink a beer pay and say hey. I'm kind of enjoying this. That is that is high praise but you can look for them all all over the Chicago. Land area distribution has even started to grow beyond that as well so thanks. Thanks everybody over temperance and thank you for listening to this episode of Beer Beatson business will be back at you with some more interesting conversations with interesting people and until then have a fantastic day AH.
POG #24 CleanNow offers a clean house & a clean way of doing business
"Create a business, you can be proud. Leave a legacy be a force for good. Leave the world a better place. Become a pioneer of goods meets the game changes of the world's these entrepreneurs are uniting the world of making money in the world of doing good, and they're succeeding, more and more people are joining the community of doing good whilst doing business. Listen to these interviews with a hunger to learn more. And you to contribute to changing the world's. How much impact could you make within six months of launching business judging from Angus Gasol standards quite a bit? He is the CEO of clean now an online APPA transforming the domestic cleaning industry, inviting someone into your home to look after your personal space involves quite a bit to trust. So how did Angus achieve our personal trust as consumers within this domestic heating industry? All often up, he shows how he came up with this idea as well as what is managed to accomplish to leave. Both the customers and the keenest satisfied whilst the also seeing bigger purpose the purpose behind now which is to build a better economic future for marginalized, and, and represented communities. Whilst also take. Into account the environmental impact of driving to these locations. And also the Keene products anguish as nece interview how he and his team constantly looking to improve this service. They quality and also their environmental impact, I'm so enough about me talking about Angus. Here's Angus talking about Angus and his company. Clean now. So Hello, and welcome to this episode of pioneers of good today. I'm interviewing anger scuttle who's the CEO of clean now, this is kinda, I truly app, powered undermines home cleaning service Angus joined cleaner with more than ten years in the marketing innovation mantra, preneurs space industry and also led technology projects by small businesses large enterprises including a TB financial Samiti excited about hearing your personal genius. Well, and, you know, as he's been Asli, real enterpreneur himself Angus has co-funded multiple companies from marketing agencies toward winning restaurants. Sue what's skill set there and is currently at the helm of clean now. So you have got great, and big plans to transform the home cleaning industry and bringing it into the app, driven future, which I think, is that should be driven presence. So master yet, must've qudos, thank you so much for making the time to speak with me and. Welcomed pioneers of goods thrilled to be here. Thank you so much. So I mean we do we stopped, I mean way would you like to start where you on now with key now? Oh, how you actually got into running this pioneer of the Kenyan business. We could maybe talk a little bit about where the idea came from. I'm sure you can probably relate to this as well. We all have friends and family have cleaners in North America. Many people have clear most everyone as cleaners and everybody seems to suffer from same issue, which is around trying to find someone of good quality trying to get a referral aid. You know someone if they've the Muslim for some reason, this than punchy another job with a gun vacation, even just an absolute villain. So it is something that will struggle with cleaning isn't always top priority for busy. Entrepreneurs busy families. So we felt like there was a technology solution ear. We have it would be in, in our invest group investors. We have network of clean. Here's one of the investors runs the large cleaning company. So we know the folks, they're looking for work on the other side of the Bush, we'd no number of people that are looking for clear. So it seemed like we can put technology in the middle and trying to nets dislike everybody else, crates observable marketplace, where we'd be connecting visiting and homeowners and try and make that easier with the caveat that we wanted to try to break into this. I of on demand, not just creating home cleaning company. That was a better widget. We handle scheduling, maybe a bit better than an paper, that was the hope is that we would actually get into a place where you can have wine and cheese. And you could decide that you'd rather stay on the deck and watch sunsets. That of cleaning and you go on your phone and get some under pop by and have a cleaner, come for twenty minutes, half an hour and do something Sloan auto is having to do these whole home is Francis wrong answer. But that's sort of where the idea came from. So can I ask is personal pain of yours that it was night to as well? Maybe. Oh, certainly. Yes, I should mention definitely with our household. Yeah. We, we've gone through a number. We just couldn't find one cleaner that was a fan or would stick around long enough. So, yeah, personally definitely we'd now have seemed to have solved that issue for our household where we have a clean house inscription, obviously. And we have cleaner that we really liked through that by form. And then if they have to big, Asian people do we support that we can back fill was another great tea pots of it is, also, you inviting seventy a high on business element of trust. So I'm king. Does this also opens at the insurance that you, you may not know these people, but they come with a sit-in level of quality that respect to private spaces while you trust is absolutely crucial like most commercial enterprises? We vet our cleaners do a background check with make sure they have a work visa to Canada. We also meet them in person gets a know them. I don't feel comfortable, send them to your house. If I haven't bought the more sonars has about the. Made sure that they're legit, and then we put them through a training program, so we have a training facility here. We have a botched house, which also serves as our brain, which is really handy. We have the cleanest break Ruben Evanston thing, but they have to go through the in class process or health safety. Learn about all those losses procedures, and then also we go into field with sober audience doctrines that we do a real house and sort of baby steps walking through the process will further certified released to the world as it were interesting. Because when everyone says my house is clean everyone's level of kings, slightly, different and. Yup. I used to guest high-speed seven years. And I've got into the habit of running my finger along the top rail of the doors, and it's surprising without missed and I don't know why. But that seems to be what it might bug phase of the world at the moment that I checked the tops of every door. And that's what I gauge on the great train them, a great way to do it for sure that I would say that the only real difference between. Us and you clean your home that we clean with a bit of a method. So we start maybe already know this, but we start from the highest area, the home, I, we do the lighting we do the tops of the doors and he sort of high dusty. That's report, we work our way down through the sort of mid level, or zonal services that we leave the house Cerna back using our way out so that we're pulling the dust down slower than out of the house, and that's strategy helps us get a good solid clean more frequently more consistently. But what we're discovering where we're working on now is that like you said, clean is different for different people. It might between the two of us are standard of clinic, your standards, probably higher than ours based on what I discerned, but. When you first bought in that guest house. That's really the question is what senses are you using determine that it's clean? Are they shiny do they feel stickier Lucille, smooth? How does it smell the smell of chemicals in business? Smell like lemon trying to get into the psychology of clean were doing the stuff. You can't see where sanitizing like a light switch for making sure that we just got through winter here. So the getting rid of the winter bugs up artist Dodd and you can't see it, though. So how do we show you that it's cleaned over and above that not sort of a workout right now? That's amazing. I've never thought of teen is a sensory experience. But you're right because you take that breath in and what do you think you when you smile as well as what you see? Yes. That moment of joy, as soon as you walk in the house. It seems to have a really big impact on whether you feel like we did a good job or not. So we wanna make sure that first oppressions runs Trump, some store king, and you have over ninety five percents a five-star reviews ever. You're doing does seem to be working. Ng. Yes. Nobody had a really great. We've had a really great run. And we've only been around since November, but yeah, we have for many people. We've solved the first issue, which is access to cleaners. And now for those the five percent the that maybe they have it average experience or something things happen. How can we close the gap? Can we give them that sense of clean over and above the hits us? It's great. The affecting on that sort of the little five percents as well. While also giving yourself keyed else, because that's where the Nunes are a lot of businesses think they're doing good enough. But it sounds like you're constantly improving. Meaning growing and also getting back to say, how can we make it better for everyone, sir? It's great to hear you sort of implementing new Ning experienced via salsas businesses. Yes. And I, I know you wanna talk a little bit of a V Court, but joking ahead into that conversation part of what we like it, though, be corporate. What is pushing us to do is to be transparent. So we include all of our customer. Views as part of our peak or learning. We put a reviews right on the homepage and that's not filtered that is live as, as reviews you're coming in. So we, we have to be in to be. But also we want to be transparent. We wanna ask for feedback after every claiming wanna talk to customers, get to know them, but transparency is key to building trust. And that's pretty brave to a seem just starting is with being five months. Is it since you being a yet five six months yet? We're just we feel like we're just getting started. So if I can rewind, you say seven months ago before you had that sale you, you touched on earlier, you got seed funding, you do have a board of directors. You are being cooped certified which means that you've got a high standard of a triple bottom lines, you're not just looking after the profitability of the company. Your mind is also around the social environmental impacts of your company. What would the steps for you? And how did you feel whilst getting that I download of the app and also that I sail? I really love that question that I as we launched on a twenty six November. And I'll never forget it because we were actually supposed to watch the twenty seventh but we had a Instagram, influence or that we were working with host a day early. She had a really great clean the day before, and she she posted because she was passionate about a she posted like fifteen stories about just going to allow she's really excited which was fantastic. But with this particular woman, or influence her followers are very close to her. She's a local sort of famous person in Evanston, you know, as his famous, this can be here, but, but people are very passionate about what she's doing immediately jumped into it. So she posted in the booking started coming within a couple of minutes, hosted say eight nine o'clock in our team was up until two three in the morning, trying to answer questions or even just get the. The team ready for the next day, we'd planned for maybe five or ten but not fifty in the space four hours. Our first client happened was in a few minutes of that hosts, and that was exciting. But it was dealing with the next sort of forty nine over the next few hours. It was crazy. So I think about that. I fifty that we've been wanting clean starting the next day, but also through December, especially Christmas Eve, which was the bonkers everyone was. Back group, not a lot us. It gives validation that we weren't crazy. But also, they were really big take a take a leap of faith on a group. They'd never heard of the sore had no brand equity so that we still have many of those customers in their very near dear to our hearts for shirt. It's business dream to have fifty one sale, but on the other hand, it's twenty four hours early on the is, as you said a bit too slight panic. Are you can be deliver as well? Yes. See I was a dynamic time for sure. Did you get your lips ready? Just in case you have to hide yourself. Everybody on staff was cleaning was GM. Absolutely. Because it was it started at eight AM the phone warning. So we we hit the road. I was all she glass with somebody else. Whereas just amazing. I love I love that will ever level of business. We are. It's about just being passionate about your product or service and getting stuck in not just sitting on the behind the desk going, I'm the CEO while leave. Guys to it. So I up good on user, we're not, we're not a monolithic company where a small team. And we know all of our cleaners personally. So it was really just about helping our friends though those keen is still with you. Just I security us, not that it find it Kino's. Yes. You're absolutely. We haven't lost anyone yet. Everybody is that signed those early contracts with us in working. So, so we're good wrapping apple apps amazing so touching on that because I am lots of companies do struggle with employee morale and, and do know some sue this face companies that would with, as you call themselves, the ended representatives in marginalized communities, the tune over staff is quite a problematic, and how to reward them in a way that they liked to be rewarded. So what is your secrets while? We're certainly still figuring that out. That's another one of the benefits of this beaker certifications, we can ask some of those questions of people that are much further along on their journey. We are we have high ambitions, for those sorts of things. What is it looked like for some of our cleaners that are consistently getting those five star cleans, every time they go out we give some time off, or we pay them more per hour? We give them even a Starbucks gift card or something, we give them some sort of a, thank you at the moment. We're just giving them a hug. Saying amazing work, but we need to get better there for sure. We'd be just like with our regular sort of customer loyalty program was the equivalent for cleaners. The nice thing about that Rupe is that they are as ashington about it as, as we are they are doing this as a side job the doing this as a career. This is what they were doing before. They were with us now doing it full time for us. But yeah, the, the simple answer is, I don't have any secrets yet, but we are going to figure that out in the next twelve months, for sure. BNB let me know when you find the nights, I'm sure this way monetize in not. Definitely full you should also mean you're, you're very new business. And you're very new in this the corporation world to which is a force for good yet. You've been winning a lot of awards making some strong ripples in Canada. He gave shea. What's even come push even in the short space of time. Be corpus certainly been the biggest win for us. I guess it wasn't award to a certain degree, but I felt like a bit of a slob join through the assessment. It was a four months of really hard heartfelt out work to, to really around the verification process in answering these suspended getting over eighty is challenge, but it's doable, but then proving that you're not fully B S, and that you are actually doing these things the trick. Yeah. Other wars, we've had I know that we've been someone very kindly nominated for top forty under forty, which is really nice that we, we had announced yet. But that is something that's on our in the wings, soar, please really. The it's been less about the awards of our vote, just the support from even just the unity that first month's see TV Tronto, which is obviously a national broadcast brought us on. You know, there's unknown company from Edmonson Todd from CD. V Hatice underneath view that just the, those kinds of supports could be out of the woodwork was really amazing. That's amazing you from what I can hear and the numbers showing it's if your plans still working with you, and your staff, still engaged you're doing something right? And it's about having my passion about pufus behind the business, not just at paycheck, that people buy into what you some for, and you hear to, to change the willed sounds like economically and plenty miss wise as well as that social impact to for forever. Reverend involves absolutely an ad for us, the next stage is really about skill ability. It's not too hard to have open lines of communication with everybody sits in the same office sent table. But was it looked like when we're a hundred can we maintain that satisfaction Miller cleaners and for the staff and clean? Now what does that look like where there's a lot of things a lot of processes there, that, that we don't have that will still have to build so that journey. Roads, two hundred or or the best for the world that that'd be Corp has the long way to go. Yeah. Well, I say in Las his it's just one step into time we might not be factors Tiffany, and we might never even get to perfection. But it's just taking that one staff. And as you are constantly showed already is what else can we do? How else can we improve? This is just that hunger to, to continually noon and improve that you demonstrate saying, yes, absolutely. An and when we extended UK we've is your house excited to get your feedback as well. I'll be checking the table, talk every hundred. I bet you absolutely. I can be critical assessor if Kate top you the. Willed sappy. I believe you. See their finance and in touch on you. You are forty into four to your, your running this company that seems to be growing at an accelerated pace and doing a lot of things rights. How did you get to be where you are today? A hard question to answer. I guess the simple answers has been a lot of small steps I came up went to university at fax Nova Scotia, I came up with the agency marketing agency, world. I worked in, in Halifax and unin trial now here in Berta that experiences chief for this job, specifically we are functioning as a marketing from our funny, do sort of marketing channels for, for our cleaners on their behalf. So but together the spring campaign that we just launched that pulled on a lot of those strings. But also in the last, let's say four years, a lot of those other projects that you mentioned, Tim up the creation of factory is starting the all the Ruben Alta makes face brew. But now with clean now all those added to my experience in, in some small way, and now we're sort of bringing those tools together. To try build this, this crazy vicious project. It's a. And so is is your goal? She go global. Yes. Yeah. We definitely would like to follow the same path that we've all seen from, from others, Silicon Valley startups. That is the goal is that we would just build something scale really fast and sell it to somebody, but that we actually expand that we have in working Chambas nationals on the immediate agenda in Canada. We are expanding our network in the west. So expanding through almost America's the next stop and I was lucky enough to be someone at the Venta that I was speaking in Calgary from the mayor of London's office. So expanded UK would be shortly after that, maybe that's twenty twenty one or even twenty twenty for lucky. But that's definitely plan is that we would like to be something that's applicable everywhere. Not just in our backyard again, touching on what you said, it's about making sure that you grow is sustainability to make sure that the communication on the quality's cafe with the possesses faction for especially Aquinas because neither. Ones who are going to be front facing for your plants as well. Yeah, absolutely. And that's not that there really hasn't been another startup that's cracks at the people that have come before us, and the cleaning space have focused almost solely on expansion, trying to get as many customers as they can and quality is sort of an afterthought. So we've put quality of at the top of our list, or you know with our social environmental agendas. Well, but how can we make quality scalable for homeowners? It is. It is a leap of faith when you have the first visit having a strange company in a strange person, come into your home, potentially when you're not there. We take a lot of responsibility on to make sure that when you would you do the top of the door frame with your finger thought it comes back clean, and that, whatever we can do to give you die. Great experience. We will do we have quality inspectors in the field. And the city manager that that's their sole job is make sure that our cleaners are consistent across the board. Back to how do we make that scalable? And at the moment, we're just investing everything began in the training to make sure that everybody's consistent and then because it's high topical at the moment with climate change. I like I call it kind crisis. Caning domestic meaning scene is quite labor, but it's quite use use that you've got to drive to places you've got to use chemicals. How you minimizing the negative impacts in making sure that you sustainable also. Those areas tune. That's a great question. And that was really the centerpiece of our core mission. So we are carbon neutral, the first place started, obviously, with our onto band agenda. We have people driving around. They're not all driving a fancy hybrids. So we are by offsets from a company or a group, called the less organization. We're doing that based on GPS tracking other bodies cars, while they're on shifted in line and, and all the staff. So that's a cute one from a product point of view, and from a process point of view. We're using reusable clause makers clause in the home that are color, coded by rooms or not Nixon bathrooms kitchens together with the bugs. So where we are using disposables reduces our ways the products were using our certified by organization called green seal, which helps us ensure that, that we're not having sort of sketchy. The manufacturing processes for these different cleaning products. The giants are strong or not strong, but the bay factories really what it comes down to for us. So those are couple of ways that we're doing it, but we still have always to go where in a regular office building with a regular landlord. So we don't have as much fine grain control as the big or team at, like, we don't have solar panels VR, track image, moderate using, you know, this are thick. So we have more more with things to do. I guess, say on that front as you said it gives started, you'll pioneering in the way, and you'll building on its ongoing sustainably as fall. Yes, the, the nice thing about Biko Vegas. We're gonna talk about today's though, they have this thing will be hive for certified companies where you can just ask these questions. People are in the same situation as we are from Portugal, or from London or wherever they're from can help us servants for some of these questions experience. So it's that. Global community of, of twenty five hundred. I think now I companies they are already coming to our aid, and open with us. Spring. And by invent the wheel, if what you're doing you can share with other people in accelerate the pathway, then it's all helping the same world and it's it breaks the sort of competitive mindsets of your this is my idea. I'm going to keep it away from you. Yes, absolutely. The openness is the future. Certainly and it's also just it's feel so much easier. Feels a little bit like cheating, some ads on the avid resorts like that, to just give you the right answer, and give you an opportunity to, to share his house, as well as fine and some so apart from global expansion and taking over the Keene, wills whilst is in store for you and the business. That's a great question. I mean at the moment, we are really focused on that next audit coming up and treat years to make sure that our, our eighty point eight becomes that one hundred. So that is one key thing. But also going back to the start of the conversation, talk about, that's like college clean trying to crack that more efficiently than we are now, what are those tools we can use to, to show someone the that we are delivering a higher standard than there used to not just for convenient and not just eco-friendly but actually clean his better. The people are nice in the abbot opportunity, Bill relationship with them. So, yeah, I think a lot of our work is going to be in the in the trenches to insert agree really refining this laughable. We'd go. Yeah. I'm just thinking of the movements, I'm just gonna find who's blind who will see how different teaming issues to a friend of mine, who has a child to myself, who lives alone. And it's being able to satisfy them all with congr-. Nc as so it's the same quality but also hitting the same pay the pleasure point to what I call clean compared to my friends. Yeah. That's a great point. I mean, we, we have a lot of lot of families on the on the platform, currently busy families both fans working or one parent to won't pay families as well. The folks with physical limitations is another groups of we work with very closely. I mean, there's the cleaning is the same, but our approach to that person's, you know, worldview maybe slightly changes a little bit. But when you hire us wherever you are in the world, ideally, you're going to know that you like any of those other larger companies you're going to get a very consistent experience. When it comes to your vision. How can we build an app that doesn't require you to have sites? That's a really interesting thing to think about. We aren't providing that right now. But that is that when you to. Just think about. I mean at the moment will focus on language barriers. We have cleaners, the their, their English is bird strongest, so can we provide the app in another language? But the giving me something big about their where we could be doing a better job, clearly I mean obviously you started. This is an lots of people, you can be saving. It's just making sure that you focus on what we for fuel company. I'm also the it keeps expanding to encompass every person in the world type from ATS office phone. Yes. Absolutely. Yet more work to do. And as a final question, because this podcast is all about pioneers of goods, and I do see you as a pioneer of good indicating. What we currently doing today in potentially this industry or somewhere else, close to your heart. That might be seen in the future's all cake, or ridiculous. I'd love to of no, real magic oracle answer to, to what the future may hold for a seer, certainly the most gig big. We're doing verdict fossil fuels when we're driving between all these houses and unfortunately, the tesla world is still because for him very hopeful with. We'll get to a place where we can have a hybrid war electric vehicles, getting us around. But even more importantly, we move into higher density, cities. If downtown Vancouver. Not needing a cart. All be gets you there with one of those birds scooters or something instead of leading to, to repulsive fuel. So I think that's a, that's a much stronger answers. That's to be thing. That's most archaic is, is also feel empowered movement. We on my minute books. When two full well, I'm just for everyone in Canada, who has the possibility of using your services. How can we find is to bite? You'll company. Sure will best ways, cleanup dot com is always easy enough. Also, were on Instagram at, at clean out Inc. Those two are usually the best place to start when two phone and for the rest of the world watch this space, because clean now is definitely coming to knock him out doors and clean them at the same time, Nuba Houston, Mitch visited Taiwan guesses beat him up sleep pleasure. Thank you, choose. I'm guessing this team created clean now out of a personal problem. Finding high-quality cleaners that were trustworthy and also respected within the industry. And also making sure that the caning projects would positively impacting or at least neutrally impacting environments? So we invite you look in your life. What problems can you see that you feel you could offer a better solution to and use the story of how clean now was created just six months ago, and is definitely set on a trajectory to impact the world, for the better in residential cleaning? So if you want to get in touch with clean now, please visit the website, clean now dot com. And as always, I would love to hear your feedback. So please liken share this post comment below. And also, if you do want to keep in touch my Email is Hello at pioneers of good the org. On you ready to step her. The pioneers, if yes, get in touch with me. My name is Kate strong, and I'm on a mission to create more businesses that are profitable and doing goods. So get in touch with my Email is Hello a plan years of good dot. I promised I didn't fight so reach. Recharges drop me an Email, and we can catch up over a virtual coffee to see how you too could join the tribe of pioneers of. And if you enjoyed this episode then jeez, like subscribe, and share this clip past, the more, we can share the message of creating profitable, and purpose driven counties, the quicker, we can change the road together, and that just involved she her senior on your social media channel so until the next podcast he in positive action.
Ep. 188: The Burden Bureaucrats Bear at Indian Affairs
"Hello I'm Richard From Winnipeg. This is media and digital episode one eighty eight on this week's indigenous roundtable. The bureaucrats burden. Could there be any job tougher than bring Indian affairs sources at Indian affair? Say No wow. What a scoop. That's right in a global news exclusive senior officials at indigenous services. Canada wish Canadians better understood. All the great work they do something they say has been difficult to communicate effectively and they think they know why spoiler thoughts on the web. I told you in a moment will dive deep into this departmental dismay and diagnosis. But first we have some people to thank part of our drive for five hundred supporters by twenty twenty on patriot and as we hit the home stretch. Here are the newer patrons getting us. Oh so close to our goal new patrons like Allison Janine Claudia Wall Samantha. Toby Isabel Maureen Violet and Robin all each. Now pledging one dollar every month Matt Ginger Drew Aurora an amber each two dollars Andrew at three Kira at four at five dollars each harp and Jeremy Archie. Clint Nina David Daniel Denise Lisa Kendall Holly and Ricki Lee at at ten dollars a month each are derek cat and Eric. Thank you all thanks to you. We now sit at a record. Four hundred and fifty eight supporters. Forty two pledges away from our target. Be Among those who help us get there? Go to media and digital dot com and click the pink supporters and joining me at the roundtable. This week are in the mountain time zone of Evanston. It's Ken Williams Assistant Professor with the University of Obama's Department of Drama Kenneth. I everyone Ed. In the eastern time zone of McDougal -TARIO associate professor of indigenous studies at York University Brockman Oana Quad Brock. Hi Rick I can all right. Our topic is one of struggle and sadness this week story of beleaguered bureaucrats who feel much misunderstood and maligned. Well at least that's the picture painted by federal documents obtained by Global News chief political correspondent David Aken and according to a story officials in the Indigenous Services Department believe they've made significant progress improving the lives of first nations in you. It and may T- people but seem to suggest OUGHTA was not getting enough credit for the work gets done on issues. Such as boil water advisories and providing some but not all remote indigenous communities with high speed Internet access. Man Can when will the white man's burden ever see lifted from those carrying colonial shoulders when people give Indian affairs affair shake I mean. Do you think it's easy? Under-funding nations education child welfare and infrastructure. Course it is. I fear humanity has yet to invent a bom or SAV capable of soothing. This open puzzle wound to the heart of Indian affairs. Managers seriously though. Can what got you interested in this story. Because you're you're behest that we decided to tackle this topic this week. The one of the things that stuck out for me when the story came out was references to fake news and twitter bots where the reason why a just services count was having trouble getting their message out. I was thinking to myself No that's not the reason Okay before you go any further winter pots for the uninitiated. What what is it? Twitter bought it right. Yeah right now while we know the phrase fake news has been Trump pretty much trademarked. It has attack on the media and it's become it's unfortunately becoming far more issues more often but twitter bought is an actual isn't actual thing that is threatening both do communications into Journalists into democracy everywhere and these are automated Automated trolls in people. Need to know what a troll is. Please go google it because I don't have enough time to explain all that stuff but Yeah twitter BOT is an automatic. It's an algorithm fits into it does a keyword search and then it already has a preset message attacking or setting up a new narrative that sorta counters the the narrative. You're trying to say or it. It does kind of shifting of the perspective by making fun of it. Okay so if if not for these Twitter twitter bought accounts. Everyone would be loving Indian affairs. Right is that can't that's that's exactly what they're saying. While according to the according to the article that David Aken Road it's And I was like laughing when I heard that that this is the reason why they think their message. All the positive things that they are trying to accomplish is not getting out Because my reaction to that is like you know every time your child comes home with a a ribbon. That says participant. You're supposed to to the refrigerator. This is what you know. It just disservices. Canada isn't getting the praise they feel. They deserve and my point of view anyways because whatever they accomplish is still like such a low bar In her to the mountain compared to the mountain of problems and issues that let's put it also honestly on them they create So it's not you know I'm GONNA go. Hey Yeah you've got got one more reserve. That now has water they. Drink TAP Ray Okay let's get to the rest of them. Let's get the grassy narrows and that's just not an aggressive is the epitome of the mercury poisoning is not the only mercury. Pois- so there's just so much rage me that they don't get the the hugging the hero biscuit for him coming in just finishing the race. Like Jesus. Yeah No. It's it's sorry I swore you're gonNA bleed a lot of that That's that's all right. That's all right I mean it. It is sometimes just stunning the the goal of wanting pats on the back if not more attention for getting digits peoples to the baseline enjoyed by the absolute majority of Canadian celebrating it. When you're literally doing the least the bare minimum. Oh yeah it's it's fantastic. That to me is Yuk way to go. Yeah yes this is. Why your messages of successes of success are not getting out there? Yeah Gimme a break. Yeah so just to put this in larger context so again. This was Obtained through a freedom of information request. Where you basically asked the government. You know I have an interest in particular area. Extra why please send me all documents related to that and then I guess what came was basically a kind of like a powerpoint presentation forty six pages long and Yeah it was mapping out. I guess the terrain of of accomplishments but also challenges including Communications Challenges Brockett you you had some interest in this story to what what grabs you about it. I think what stood out to me was. There is a difficulty in terms of any governments communication strategy. Because ideally they're seeking to self perpetuate right so the liberal government is thinking had in. This was a document that was prepared for the minister. So how do they get credit? And I ideally avoid accumulating too much blame or negative attention that would actually deter. Stop people from showing up in voting liberal. That's that's kind of the way I interpret this and so I I do see why. There's a communication challenge for the department. Because so often I think certainly coming from our perspective We see any investment in indigenous communities. As as good as it's it's necessary long overdue and as Ken mentioned and you mentioned Rick were still talking about bringing so many indigenous communities up to a minimum standard that other Canadians take for granted so that I do understand. I agree with that sense of frustration. I I I think the in terms of the sort of the political aspect of this for the minister for the Liberal Government. The challenges is not to be perceived as being too hard. I say this soft too beholden. Yeah exactly too. Soft on indigenous issues and the government did like at least rhetorically. I. We've talked about this. Many Times. Trudeau said the most important relationship in Canada was the relationship between his incoming government. This was four years ago and indigenous peoples. And that's part of the reason why I find. This story is interesting as well. Because the the government has promised so much inconsistently under delivered and yet the public perception will be somewhere in the middle. I think. And that's what I'm I'm kind of curious to to get a better sense of there was another story that we looked at a couple of months ago wreck that you were proposing to us and it was showing that the reconciliation wave has started to crash. Do you remember. This was the globe in Mail story and there had been a survey done and it showed that broad public support for reconciliation was now showing that It was receiving it or yeah so affected peaked. Yeah it peaked in was starting to come down and so I think in some ways like being alert to that is important as well and I it just because I mean I'm old enough now to look back at how certain governments have come to power in large part almost by campaigning against Indigenous issues than the one that comes to mind right away would be the BC liberal party right around the time that the final agreement was being negotiated in the BBC treaty process was still being set up by what was then the the end ep government in BC and the the Liberal leader at the time. came out so strongly against any concession of while specifically against the initiative agreement but also against BBC treaty process in principle and he won an enormous one of the biggest electoral majority governments in in the country's history. So that's I I am interested in that I am have been for a long time by sort of that idea of political marketing. Essentially how how do governments and politicians specifically craft their message for their electorate? And I think that that is in. Some ways is always going to be a challenge for for governments in Canada when it comes to indigenous issues. And it's unfortunately they're reaping what they sowed because for so many years they've made it sound that You know indigenous peoples have great that They have All kinds of benefits whether it's in housing education that really the list you just provided us in terms of child welfare education housing and that's unfortunately that's become fixed in the broader public a conscience of what What indigenous people receive and so in some ways like they're they're victims of their own propaganda Okay it's interesting right because this is a document an internal document it wasn't meant for for public consumption so what I always think about now is who was it written for is a is written internally but it was also written In terms of spin as you say towards the larger general public which is absolutely predominantly non-indigenous. So they're they're just trying to think. How can we sell? How can we spin? How can we present what we're doing in the best possible late Which I mean. That's what every bureaucrat is. Trying to do which away just as a quick los ice of it makes me wonder. What's the news value of this story? This this is an age old orientation of the federal bureaucracy. Why would we report on? Well what do you know? Senior Indian affairs officials feel. They're doing the best job possible. Say Senior Indian affairs officials like? Wow what a revelation. What a scoop but we. We investigated ourselves and we are innocent. That's not quite but you know this is about right. This is about you make a really. I think you make a fair point bracket basically you know if we were to give federal bureaucrats the benefit. How do they sell something that for the longest time they themselves worked against? Yes thank you. That's sums up to the contradiction there. Yeah and so now they have a handy. Fake News. Bought Accounts Spreading disinformation on social media. That's literally a quote from this document in terms of one of the challenges in the communication's sphere the militias spread. Disinformation often targets polarizing issues. And this kind of activity increases leading up to an election according to a CBC article about twitter trolls. I'm reading again from these F. Wide Freedom of information requested documents according to a CBC Article About Twitter Trolls Troll campaign of twenty one thousand six hundred tweets directly targeted Canadians last year. Many of these messages were critical. Canadian pipeline projects which is an inter- like why would you insert stuff about pipelines when we're talking about boil water when we're right when they're otherwise talking about ball water advisories and education? Anyway I'm amazed actually. I'M AMAZED RUSS DIVA's name didn't come up specifically I WANNA see a list of these trolls that the troll Indian affairs specifically well. That's exactly it right. Who you know okay. So you mentioned the pipeline thing that interests That's but that's not specific to indigenous services. Canada know exactly yeah. I would like to know from Indigenous Services Canada which trolls they're talking about which Which fake news. Which twitter boss. Because you know I follow this stuff rather extensively and I see very little amplification if that would make me think that there's a twitter bought involved because you know twitter bots amplify things into the millions very quickly By you know by recycling repeating and then getting other people to recycle repeat what they're saying That I see happening with Anything involving indigenous services candidate. I don't see them getting millions of hits on their tweets. I don't see them getting millions of hits on their stories I see them getting. Maybe thousands and I see a lot of the perspective usually when it's negative comes from us you know as three Candice and Kim as well We're fake news Ken. We're victims. Yeah we're fake news. Yeah because we have to have no idea what we're talking about you know. God forbid and indigenous person has perspective. But you know that's the thing is that we don't have I don't I? Don't see the evidence in that claim. That's a pretty. That's pretty far-reaching claim to make that our message is failing to be received positively because of twitter bots that just I would like to see the numbers on that if they could prove that yes. I'll gladly take that. Take that back but Again I'd have to run an extensive search in whatever you know but I I do follow this stuff very closely. I do not see that as a as happening. I see hundreds of repeats. Maybe maybe tens of repeats but not the millions or hundreds of thousands now. Now what about Brock's Point Which I'll I'll I'll bring up by citing again this. This document Communications considerations it talks about the challenge about how communicating effectively about indigenous issues can be difficult. These issues can be complex subject to different interpretations by different audiences and may lack immediacy for the general public also. The public environment is crowded with other issues making it challenging to sustain focus on indigenous concern. So I mean are they trying to tell us that you know that they're concerned? Canadians aren't picking up on all the good they're doing. Is that what they're trying to say or that there's issues involved at all like yes. It is complex but it's complex Because this is a fundamental this is the foundational relationship for this nation. It doesn't exist without indigenous consent. So yeah that's that's the very beginning of the whole thing and they've been trying to erase indigenous consent and and Nationhood Culture from the very beginning and now all of a sudden they want to change their minds but again focusing on the fact that it's an internal document. Sometimes I feel like this is just meant to to spin within because this was going to be part of a presentation for the then Indian Affairs Minister as he prepared a brief a key. Federal Cabinet Committee about results to date and key achievements by indigenous services Canada. And I think of it like that I it almost seems like you kind of boilerplate. Well guys things are complex knows. Turn that sentence around. These issues can be simple subject to complete agreement by all audiences and have urgent immediacy for everyone in Canada. Like such sentence exists when it comes to communications. It's saying it has the beauty of saying something and absolutely nothing so I dunno I in a weird way. I've started to come over to brookside where like let's give them the benefit of the doubt. They're not very competent. They don't really give about Indians. They're just trying to sell this to the people they need to sell it to and I don't know maybe I'm Planning Bra. That's probably true. That's probably true. I would actually take that if in yes definitely was not meant for larger public and it started comes across as you explain it that way. It's starting to make me think. Please save our asses like we're trying to do a good job here. We must be. We must justified to the prime minister. His own idea of splitting the Department of Northern Affairs separate departments trying to sell it to to their boss. Yeah whose idea was to create in the first place like yes. We're doing a good job. Mr Prime Minister. Your idea was awesome. But we're having problems making it look man but you know still I it. It's obviously not for us. And and it just comes across ridiculous to hear this to basically get the message. Look where decolonizing. Fast as we can alright peak decolonization and and it's the racism of of lowered expectations Really coming to the fore now something else. I'm also reminded of though in consuming this story and just trying to put it in its proper. Proper place is something that Cindy blackstock wrote actually a couple of months ago in the Toronto Star it was with reference to senior bureaucrats. The kind who produced document and I it was in the context of how the federal bureaucracy once again not necessarily indigenous services. Canada's probably justice candidate that that was leading this but basically pushed to quash compensation to first nations kids hurt by the on reserve child welfare system which has been chronically systemically underfunded for forever. So let me just read this quote. Now she's talking here about Jordan's principle which is which is about funding for health care when it's not clear what the jurisdiction is very much consistent with with the whole debate around under-funding. Here's what here's part of what you wrote. Federal statistics show that since nineteen eighty nine. First nations kids spent over seventy seven million nights in foster care twelve times the rate of other kids one four year old girl required hospital bed so she would not suffocate when she visited her family over the Christmas holidays. The request went through over a dozen federal bureaucrats before someone said absolutely not in another case. Parents were forced to wash feeding tubes for their terminally. Ill Child because candidate would not provide a sufficient number one of the most disturbing indictments of the federal system came in the form of a twenty twelve award given by then Indian affairs. Deputy Minister Michael. Were Nick who went on to become the top bureaucrat in the Privy Council Office An award he gave to bureaucrats who ensured. There were zero services approved via Jordan's principle by denying requests like the bed and feeding tubes. So this is twenty seven years ago. I don't know if it's fair to bring it up but you have to wonder I mean there are Bonuses based on performance pay and the lake depending on whether or not you do the job of the department As set out by by you know by the ruling government of the day and by the by the public service senior public service so This all makes me swing back away from where Brock was taking us to say. You know I don't trust these guys as far as I can throw them. I would be more outraged if I wasn't already so cynical. Okay it just seems to me that that just makes perfect sense as to how anything involving additional services anything involving indigenous people in their day-to-day working with the federal government on anything like we looked like the other evidence we had out there is there their willingness to spend over one hundred thousand dollars in legal fees the fight like six thousand dollars in dental services to one person that is just typical to me and that the fact that they would Monetize and and reward basically do is what a corporation would do. We're giving you a bonus for saving US money. Yeah Yeah Yeah so. That's no different. It doesn't make it doesn't end. That's exactly how they think you know it's all about. How much can we spend? On indigenous people without it becoming criminally obvious that we're underfunding indigenous people. Well they wouldn't put in these terms but it it just feels like what can we get away with? What's the least we can get away with? And we don't know what. The current incentive structure is in place. Now maybe that's what. David Akers should be Hawaiian. Frankly what's the opposite of the benefit of the doubt? The detriment of the. I don't know but I I just don't I don't try like I already said I. Just don't trust them. I mean brock. Were you aware of this? of this unfortunate Jordan's principle Award In terms of basically you know the more cases. You deny the the the more likely you are to win to be the champion of denying kids care. Well according Cindy blocks. Yeah like Kim said I I think with my cynicism prevents me from being shocked by it. I mean it's just it's deeply disappointing but considering that the government and this is kind of what. I was alluding to earlier as well. The government will make announcements of like spending Infrastructure Development Program Development and so often when it actually comes to the the delivery of that they'll underfunded. Dale are the replicate the announcement multiple times to make it sound as if it's much bigger than it is right. And another cases like in this instance. They they'll actually do the opposite of what I would just say struggling with the what phrase us but just what any sort of sense of justice would would require and I know this was true as well like in the years that we had. The Harper government was in power even though they were cutting funding for safer indigenous like schools on reserve. Or whatever. You almost any program. They were leaving funds in each fiscal year. That went unspent. That's right and then that money ended up going back. So it's just kind of like this consistent pattern of creating a facade. I think for the broader public that yes indigenous were taking care of indigenous people. You know. Don't don't worry we we got it sorted out just You know get back to your regular lives. Whatever distractions there are and yet perpetuate that underfunding lack of care and in some cases like outright hostility. Like Ken mentioned with The example of fighting indigenous children's right to You know fair dental dental services. The point you made about having access to information would be so valuable in terms of what are the actual goals because the Trudeau government has made a sort of a public spectacle of the letters that That he writes to each of his cabinet ministers at the outset so in terms of the directions that he is giving each of ministers in terms of what their duties will be for as long as their their office and it would be very helpful to know. What are the similar Inducements I guess or targets that senior civil servants are working towards because if if that is in fact the case that there were specific monetary rewards paid to bureaucrats to thwart indigenous people receiving medical care. I mean that to me is just so disturbing. If that's that's in fact part of the reward structure yeah and I mean if it comes to light that there's a reward structure in place for getting rid of all long-term boil water advisories for. Let's say three years right. And then three as opposed to getting getting rid of it so that you can do the press release on it and then two weeks later it comes back you know what I mean. It comes back into effect because as we know they come in and out. It's it's always transitory. It's never a permanent solution. Just like the funding. It's year to year to year type of crisis crisis crisis crisis Yeah if there's an incentive structure for that but they'd probably be promoting the heck out of it so it's notable I don't know it'd be maybe it's right there in black and white on the website if someone can find it and let us know we can talk about it later but I'd be happy to but Another another thing that came across my radar that I feel fits into this. And I'd like to get your reaction to it. It's it's Unfortunately I haven't had haven't had the time to watch it but al Jazeera has done What seems to be a formidable amount of research into what's going on with the pipeline which we know is about to ramp up the next phase of construction and According to one of its tweets both Trans Mountain and Ottawa conducted separate rounds of consultations with more than one hundred and thirty indigenous groups. In recent years we analyze consultation data and found just three percent of twenty five thousand reported consultations from two thousand fifteen to twenty. Eighteen were conducted in person. So I'm just trying to square that fact on the ground with this idea that you know you know what our challenges fake news and bots spreading. Disinformation give you give me a break. I swear to God that that should be the new name of the podcast. Give me a break. Because that's what we're always anyway. I just I still can't shake this nagging question in my head. Why is this a story Initially I gotTA confess. Initially I thought this was a leak by the bureaucracy to to to the chief political correspondence and then you know. I obviously had to read the article I went. Oh this was. This was F- allied. This is entirely different. They they weren't trying to spin or or work on somebody in in the political media. This is just so but I. I was still left bewildered. Like why is this? A story bureaucrats wanting to advocate for themselves. And the great job that they're doing 'cause this is the thing. I I'm wondering if Canadian get past the first two or three paragraphs which are you know Indian affairs really trying and wish people would would talk about the good news stories coming out of our Department okay. I don't know why like you know you file. File those things in a who knows what kind of fishing expedition David Aken was on. But you know 'cause 'cause you know you just you just sand out. F- allies like crazy Because sometimes you will find something Could be something as simple as Webb space. We need to fill the web space. Come on now get the goat fed. Yeah go Which you know. That's the unfortunate thing. That's something that happens quite a bit in journals especially like you know if you WANNA cut in my rant about the twenty four hour news cycle. That's a thing you gotta keep billing it and I don't know I would like to know what was what he was thinking. But there are some you know. There's a quote in there from you. Know the national chief but how good the liberal government has been to first nations people the past four years. Yeah but he was but he was relativistic about that. It was very relativistic about it. But that that could be a quote summit might WANNA throw back in his face a little later on because again to your point about who reads past the second paragraph. That's buried that's deep in. You know that that's the first quote you get from the national chief you don't get and if you just stopped reading then you wouldn't get the rest of it where he's actually had critical of all the other issues that still need to be you know mats and and and and worked on Again and the rare moments where parallel garden on the same page. He's basically saying. Don't give yourself a ribbon just for showing up you know. There's so much more that has to be done or a ribbon shirt as the case may be but so but it raises the interesting question right because I think you could plausibly argue that Aken was was trying to say like look at these competing narratives. Here's some insight into that but you know the the story didn't feel like it was for walks. The story felt like it was meant to be consumed by by the general public. You can't always know how your stories are going to be received. But ironically in a way this story doesn't diffuse the spin cycle at actually mix it accelerate faster. I feel that any story that can be casually consumed becomes fodder for the narrative that we're trying as hard as we. Can you know that alleviates? The embarrassment that Canadians feel and it and it's always about them. Feeling embarrassed at the Indians have been so miss mistreated. It's not not that it's going to result in restoration of access to land to anything that muddies the waters. helps become a suitable alibi for Canadians. Now having said that I guess I have sympathy for any journalist. Trying to navigate that because they want to appear objective Blah Blah Blah. But as we've said on the show when you live in a cellar colonial status quo just trying out. He said she said or they said Indian say is not is not sufficient. Is IT GONNA make? It doesn't muddy the waters. Come on this is this is. These are waters. That are like churned up there there's bones in the maters. There's like pollutants in them. Waters like Wisdom Hampshire. Yeah there's no clean Water Hampshire. Also I think this would be a great analysis for anyone. Studying how indigenous issues are covered by journalists. Do we look for nefarious under story while we. Kinda do just because that's where we are right but I think in reality I it was just like an F. O. I paid off. And he just printed up the information government. Yeah and to be fair to Aken towards the end of the story. He did talk about all the things that weren't referred to in his self-congratulatory self-serving yes powerpoint You know like grassy narrows the fact that Treatment Center hasn't been billed for them despite decades of mercury poisoning and years and years of promises to do so by the Trudeau government. All the other insufficient funding that that's chronic ongoing so rock final thoughts. I agree it's the author. Did identify some of the outstanding issues. End The national chief continues to tap dance down that line between you know completely coming over endorsing the Trudeau Liberals in still putting out that that qualifier on his his support for them by saying well. It's the best government we've had for the last forty or fifty years but again that's working off a really low bar but still in terms of recent memory a pretty obvious contrast with the Harper Conservatives. Were the relationship was at times you know completely adversarial so but yeah definitely the tone of the article. It certainly doesn't feel like take down of the Department of indigenous services by any means. Yeah I don't know but for some reason what you just said. Put the phrase in my mind be happy for what you get and that just seems to be the unstated through line of a lot of this stuff dammit Indians. It could be a lot worse. Yeah exactly know absolutely that comes through yet. We don't have looked back very far. Though on that note do we ever end on uplifting her? Merry Christmas you've already got your presence. Good God Daria. You should be happy. We put wrapping paper out of this. Well hopefully we'll talk to you before the New Year if not merry Christmas happy New Year however you mark the season Brock Zia can. That's it from media and digital episode. One hundred eighty eight reported the morning of Monday December. Ninth two thousand nine hundred thanks again to Brockton. And one aquatic associate professor of indigenous studies at York University and Ken Williams Assistant Professor at the University of Alberta Department of drama. This edition of the podcast is edited hosted and produced by yours truly rick hard. Thanks for listening. Everyone adversary Our theme is nesting bureaucratic.
Ask The CLO 10/19/20
"What's it like to drive the Volvo xc ninety plug in hybrid. The thrill of four hundred horsepower t eight twin engine. The joy of impromptu. Travis. And Serenity. Of Electric Power in pure Eko. Mode. Visit DMV Volvo retailer today to experience the ninety recharge plug in hybrid for yourself. You know how they say history repeats itself on the Frost. Tapes. PODCAST. We'll be sharing interviews from legendary TV host, David Frost who sat down with some of the most influential people of the sixties and seventies time. That feels so much like today we've allowed ourselves to be so divided. That's me too. But when the president does it, that means that it is not only listen to the frost tapes on the IHEART radio APP apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Steve. Time now for you to help some listeners with their love problems, this is our ask the CEELO segment of you. If you have any love questions for the CEELO please go to Steve Harvey FM DOT COM. All right. Steve it sounds like you're ready. This one is from incognito in Oklahoma. That's my husband is a security guard at a community college. He recently busted to students smoking weed and he took the we'd and reported them. He brought the we'd home and put it on his nightstand I. Didn't know he had to turn the we'd into the school so I smoked it. We notice the we'd was gone he flipped out and said, he could lose his job over this. He searched all over the house knows I, smoked but he never accused me of taking it I hate to see him this stressed out. Should I confess? You confessional say the job you got to Bassim. Oh. We'd give it to you. But you too high to fit at. All the damn. Are. But. He doesn't smoke and she she thought. You would you do what? I do jd pants off the top. Joint and call it a day. Damn. She's greedy. All right. so by your man more, we'd all right moving on sin. Tanya in Evanston Illinois says I'm alive music junkie and always loved drummers two Saturdays ago my boyfriend and I want to hear a band and I locked eyes with the drummer and we floated all night I managed to slip him my business card before we left and he called me the next day I met him for lunch on a Tuesday and right after we were seated, my boyfriend appeared out of nowhere and sat with US my boyfriend and the drummer, our co workers. So it was the setup and my boyfriend dumped me it's cool though. It's cool though because I want the drummer, do you think I scanned a chance with him now? You're going to drum. That's all you're going to get a drummer. You get be any NS. He going beach. Were dramas. And, that's going to be it. It was a setup they was co workers you got busted. That's okay. You want to join anyway gonNA. Go for the drummer but you defy, Detroit. Dues dues is real tricky when they real boys. You need to get off to him drums I mean, if you just have to have. An open yourself up to piano player. Horn players. Sex. Yeah. That's kind of crazy. No, you don't stand a chance with him Carlita in Macon Georgia. I've been married for a year and I moved into my husband's home after the wedding. I noticed he had a lot of female clothing in coats in a basement closet. He told me they belonged to his ex and she moved out of state and needed to store a few things temporarily, I put all of our stuff in a big plastic bin and I told him, I, need her address. He said I can't send them to her because that's rude and he promised to keep them for her I. Know He loves me but should I worry about his loyalty to his ex plant? It's not known loyalty. Just a he's got a little bit mixed up. Doesn't he? He's been living man house in peace with huck close. Damn Basement he sandy mistake. Your job is to give nothing Hugh Hale blocking loans to go. All Philipson. No, I'm not telling them nothing. They ain't going to do anyway. So He Always tell wrong thing up this what they do. Any Day. We already knew this I. Applaud her so hard for for packing them up and sending them to her wanting to leave. No No, no no she got to get out of here. Now he told her he keeps no pardoning. Oh I got what you say you. Know. Got To. Yeah I know he loves me but should I worry about his loyalty to? Loyalty to. Is something as a fate he thinks he's being. Honorable by. Doing what he said he going to, but it cannot be expensive. You know to part he's missing right? That's exactly right. Steve. He said I can't his wife can't send them to her because that's rude. We ought to. Be. Ah I'm the new missiles. So in hero sugar, honey iced tea. Right. And then husband said, he promised to keep them for her what. Your Way so I'M I. Promise. You problems add. Yeah. Thank you. This is my house now we. Ever. Do you want to burn it. I wouldn't. Run and by. What is that in the fireplace? Yeah. Smoke West. La. Perfume. Close. But this is a red flag though because he doesn't see that you know this the red flag he said, I can't send them to her because that's rude and I promised. A Red Flag your husband should never say that to you about another woman. In the morning s Dolan. Promise you need. Yeah that that's not cool. Not Cool at all. CLOSED BRING MENDEZ All Right Junior. Thanks Jack. Keeping. And you can handle this because that's rude now. Checking. Not. Now. WHO started the? Jimmy. General Jimmy Jack. Thank you. Thank you so much. The L.. Great advice as always coming up next church complaints with Reverend Motown in Deacon. Deaf Jam after this, you're listening to Harvey. Morning Show. Piece to the planet, Charlemagne God, and it is a privilege and honor to be able to introduce to you. A new podcast creates shot no chaser hosted by queen named Tesla Figaro debut in Oman new black effect podcast network on iheartradio. She is the hood whisper a game of politics and you take it actually give it to you straight shot no chaser you've been warned will be informed. This is Tesla favor out. You know that saying the truth is hard to swallow. Will I have learned that the more you consume the truth? The easier becomes a digest. The truth is an acquired taste I'm GonNa give you the truth one shot glass at A. Time I wanted to light a fire in your soul afire that no one can put out a fire that empowers you to speak to stand up into affirm your rightful purpose in this world. Oh, my podcasts we'll cover a number of topics, politics, black lifestyle, racial justice, and for the soul to inspire you, my guest will include everyone gangsters passed as politicians, activists, you name it they enough. So come sip destruct with me and like I always say you can either use it a loser but I came make it shoes. It subscribe now and listen to straight shot no chaser with Tesla Figaro on the iheartradio APP apple podcast or wherever you get your podcast. Feeling loss. Then we've got the PODCAST for you labyrinth. I'm Amanda Knox and I'm Christopher. Robinson. I know what? It's like to be absolutely stuck to wind up in a life I never expected but everyone's got their own personal maids complete with dead ends, shortcuts and mentors. So we're bringing you up hot cast where you can get lost on a cruise ship in the trauma of a mother's murder and presidential campaign or in a corrupt court surrounded by ravenous media podcast featuring unlikely obstacles, a terrorist husband, a shadowy cabal, a pregnant wife across the ocean. So come on, get lost with us as we bring you stories from Jon, Ronson Lavar Burton Jasmine Muhammad Dave Navarro Andrew Yang. Malcolm. Glad. Well, and others expect dark and hilarious misadventures, controversial questions and above all expect to arrive at unexpected places. Listen to labyrinths on the iheartradio APP, on Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.
. Part One: R. Kelly: His Life, Times & Vicious Sex Cult
"Hey, Matt I have yet to ride one of those birds scooters 'cause I hate those things that does not surprise me at all Joel. But you know, I been getting Instagram adds to give me to become a bird charger to join that gig economy. Oh, that's right. Just like Uber folks are getting targeted to start side hustles to make an extra buck or even to try to make a career out of it. But should you? Do it not all side hustles are created equally. Exactly every week. We dive into practical money topics like this on our podcast. Listen subscribe to our show on apple podcasts the iheartradio app or wherever you get your podcast. Just search for how to money. Hello friends. I'm Robert Evanston. This is once again behind the bastards the show where we tell you everything you don't know about the very worst people in all of history. And today, we have a special guest who we will be talking about a special subject with the guest. Not a bastard is Theresa Theresa. I could be a bastard. Well, I don't know. What is the technical definition like that? No, no, dad. No, mom, runaway dads went away. Then you're vested, right. Jeff you dad's gone yet. Yes. Yes. Okay review. We don't use it for that anymore. Really? I made a mistake of getting a bag cookies right before the started. And I was like I'll just stack, but you can't eat cookies on a podcast. You can't eat cookies on a podcast. You can't eat air. I was gonna say the truth. Oh, yes. You can. Okay. We'll look at those transitions. Great today. We're talking about someone who we will be catching some fire on Twitter for talking about what do, you know about our Kelly? Well, I I don't know. I know I think I know enough like, I know what was big news. But I never decided to like open up the book and deep dive into our Kelly. So there may be things that are surprising to me. But I will say just before his podcast. I was like let me look at all his songs again just to remind myself. And I forgot that he's saying the space. Samsung. So I believe I can fly. So now, I'm like rethinking plane long my head outside of that. Like were you ever a fan of his music? Do you remember any particular albums that like I never used to buy albums as a kid? So he was sort of in his heyday, his popular songs, I would you know, play and sing along to and dance too. But I I wasn't a big album buyer until pretty much in the last couple years because I wasn't really allowed to as a kid. I would say, yeah. If similar experience with him to wear like is a nineties kid. I heard a lot of R Kelly songs, but I liked I did like a lot. I didn't ever attribute it to him. It was one of those things where it's like I like this new song o R Kelly. But it wasn't like I stand for our Kelly. He was just a big part of like the soundtrack of the late nineties, and autzen particular I like that. I'm a flirt song. I think does he think I'm in love with the Barton was no that was definitely not right to t pain. That's right. Okay. So but. His air. He's around that era. I feel like the T paint songs on the radio R Kelly sounds around the radio. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, he like either fun to grind to that sort of thing definitely fund to grind to. I think he has a couple of songs with grind in the name. So let's hear about the fact that he probably has a sex cult like he's the kind of a child pornographer. Right. Isn't that a thing people like know him for people, but wasn't she also underage? We'll be getting into that. It's actually very tough to answer that question definitively. Like, it's one of those things like where pretty much everyone's like, but legally he actually got off. No, right. Because there's no proof way. This does remind me real quick. Speaking of R Kelly the song, I'm Aflou when I was I was a tech. I was technically, but nothing bad happened. But I was bad. I have to preface that some people don't get uncomfortable. But that's on. I remember I worked out a YMCA camp. I I'm ran I was like kind of talking to in the way seventeen. Do a very innocently doing nothing. But to to a twenty one year old football player has ever and we Stanford. Yeah. We grind to that song fancy as summers. But okay, you grind it kind of introvert to our Kelly because technically I was underage oh seventeen years old. So yeah, I was kind of like o R Kelly. Hey, cool. Get over here and get maybe put yourself in a questionable position. I understand. Right. Seventeen is the age of consent for grind dancing, the seaboard? He was respectful. I feel like it was he was like let's see how your ago, and I will not you know, what I mean. Like, I feel like he was like, it's crazy. It's crazy that that's the bar for being a good guy. I'm not gonna push it with this teenager. Definitely didn't put a stop to it. But he went as far as I was comfortable, and then did not push it further. I gotta tell you Theresa as a man it is so easy to be a good guy. Because it's it's just it's just don't assault people. Like, really if you don't assault people like I've done a lot of shitty things. But as long as I don't assault, people are gaslight them. Like, I feel like I'm sailing. I've gone years without paying taxes, but none of that matters because the bar is just below the floor these days opposite for women. Have you just start a sentence with I want your just automatically a bitch? Like well. I mean men never expressed there. Would you get me a celsius? I want to celsius. Double flip off. Well, we should probably get into the story now. Yeah. Okay. But I'm sure there will be a lot more fun conversations about gender politics. Come. I know that's what the audience really tunes on for. Roberts Sylvester Kelly was born in Chicago on January eighth nineteen sixty seven. His dad was absent from the get go in his mother JoAnne raised him and his three siblings. She was a schoolteacher and a committed Baptist writing later in his autobiography Sola coaster Kelly. Rick sorry, there's a little. Yeah. Is is his auto vilo Sola coaster a roller you exact Rolex and serve salt. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. We will be hearing that title regularly, and it will never not make me die just a little bit inside just a little bit. But the thing that I hate to admit I kind of like the layout of the book. Is it looked like a rollercoaster? No, no, no. It doesn't. It's just like, it's just neat. I've never seen an autobiography like Kelly clean ups and downs. No. It's a lot of visuals. Oh, like, he put a lot of thought into how he laid out his auto biography. And it's one of those things you get this throughout the story. I it sucks when someone like Harvey Weinstein whose like a piece of shit. But like, I can't point anything great. He did like just a piece of shit who was tied to some good movies are Kelly is like a really good artist. Like, he's one of these people. He's in like, the running for the best R and B singer of all time, and he's like he's legitimately talented. So like as you go through like as I'm reading his autobiography with it's ridiculous. Stupid name. I'm like, oh, well, let's go. Got a real good talent for layout. And then I'm like, oh, yeah. And he's molesting children fucking Christ. It's frustrating now. Maybe it's not. I mean, he brought someone else. Probably laid it out. I don't know. I feel like he's he's he's kind of attor. I think he's just too controlling till it someone else lead us auto biography. But we'll get to that too. Anyway, I'm we're parallel coaster solar coaster. Yeah. So in his autobiography solar coaster Kelly recalled it on the rare occasions he asked his mom what had happened to his dad. This was her response. Don't say nothing to me about that. No good son of a bitch because the minute he found out I was pregnant with you his cowardice left disappeared in the wind didn't want to have anything to do with either you or me Kelly goes on to write. I remember my mother's eyes on one of those days close to blood red as the anger grew and grew or she talked about my father as if he was the devil himself. I remember my is getting baby blood red too. Because what my mother loved I loved and what she hated. I hated baby blood ran. I don't know. No collar baby blue as a color, baby. Boy. I mean, maybe if you a lot of ABC. Yeah, he's got babies on the mind. I mean, I imagine if baby's blood would be a different color because baby has not been subjected to all the same adultery. They're not eating solid foods yet. Exactly. Okay. So maybe if you've seen a lot of baby blood sticks. This is part of why I think he wrote it to know ghostwriters going to be like baby blood red. That's sounds like it came out r Kelly's head. It was that day that moment that I decided to hate my father, not knowing really what hate meant or having a clear understanding of love. She told me on that day never to mention him. Again. I'm your mother and your father. She said I promised that. I'd never talk about him again. And I never did different is clearly. Repress any of that? Yeah. Well, that's that's that's his background. Robert Kelly grew up very poor. As family lived in the projects on the south side of Chicago, which according to the song, bad bad. Leroy Brown is the baddest part of town in his autobiography Kelly vaguely refers to his childhood home is being filled with numerous older women, and it's unclear how many of them were related and how many of them are just around. But it seems weird. It seems weird in Kelly's telling of it. When my mother wasn't around the women ran a little freer as I crept up in age found myself more curious and sometimes aroused, and I was shamed of being aroused. He says he was eight when he first saw people having sex in the story. He tells is kind of baffling he comes upon this couple getting it on and they see him and basically give him the okay to watch like look at him and on one occasion, I think later than this. He was handed a camera and asked by a couple having sex to take their pictures while they were having sex. He recalls that the photographic technology. Impressed me more than the sex. Maybe he's like, we're press some of them. Let's add this makes me sad. I know. I mean, it's it's one of those things you got to start with like, why do people do like that's another thing with like Weinstein. I don't know enough about is like childhood to know. Like was he abused a bunch of kids that have an impact on it not that that mitigates bad behavior because most people who are abused people who write that people go both ways. But this makes you understand what comes next a lot better this kid. He's never going to have an easy time coming up. He had his barometer. What's appropriate? And what's normal is is off right from the get-go. Yeah. Age eight seems to have been a crowded our for young Robert Kelly. It's the year when he I watched people fuck I photographed people fucking, and it's also the year in which the love of his life died. Yeah. Here is a quote from his auto biography solar coaster. Okay. I love love. There's no one on earth more romantic than me I've been in love with love ever since. I can remember I've always loved the idea of having a girlfriend. I love the closeness the sweetness holding her hand kissing her. Cheek whispering words of affection. Hearing her say that she feels the same about me, my first girlfriend was named Lulu. And she was so special though, we were only eight and it was puppy love. I believe she was my first musical inspiration. When it comes to love songs. So according to our Kelly Lulu died brutally that same year when he was eight at eight. Yeah, they were out playing near the river, and she fell in and bashed her skull open on some rocks. Roberts watched her die and was as traumatized as you'd expect. That's about the most traumatizing gagging. Imagine happening to an eight year old. Yeah. Yet doesn't get much worse than that. There's like little foot seeing his mom die and having your eight year old girlfriend, Bashar sculling on some rocks. They're right up there. So this trauma was compounded. Several months later when Robert Kelly fell asleep in front of the TV and woke up from a quote crazy dream about three's company to find one of his older female relatives fondling him. Yeah. He's never given a name for this woman. But she appears to be someone who is still around in his life. He is not told his other family members who this was and win Chris heath a writer for G Q interviewed him about this later. He said, quote, I remember it feeling weird. I remember feeling ashamed. I remember closing my eyes and keeping my hands over my eyes. I remember those things, but I couldn't judge it one way or the other fully. So Kelly says this mystery relative continued to molest him until he was roughly fifteen years old. She was not the only adult to go after child Robert, a trusted male friend of the family wants us Kelly to masturbate in front of him. He offered to pay our Kelly later said it was a crazy weird experience. But not. Oh blown experience because it didn't go down contact sexual no a- visual. Absolutely. A visual from him showing me his penis. And all that stuff, which is whether or not there's contact. That's negotiating that's the thing that survivors do like, yuck. Oh, sheeting or maybe are thinking, oh, there's experiences invalid because because people quote unquote worse he didn't touch me. So it wasn't like I should be that like these feelings maybe are invalid. But they're all valid because as long as you cross the line. It's militated nestled if you're a child adult comes up to you ask you to masturbate and pulls out his genitals. That's a sexual assault. Yeah. Hundred percent of their power. So he's got a rough upbringing. And this is not all of it. Robert Kelly was probably shot when he was thirteen. It's hard to know for sure what happened because he's not exactly a totally reliable narrator here for years. He told interviewers he had been shot by thugs who wanted to steal his huffy in his autobiography he claims the bullet was his just a stray round from some gun. Fight drive-by though. One of his close associates. Your parents told the Chicago sun times that Robert shot himself during a botched suicide attempt. This person says Kelly's version of the story is ally invented to cover up the suicide attempt. Most reports say he has a bullet in his shoulder though. And if that's true, it does kind of make me think it was probably more likely a stray round than suicide, but I don't really know. Shoulder. You definitely a suicide unless you want to and even if you missed it probably wouldn't be a liar. Hartley blow your job he was like all do here where it doesn't hurt you because little Wayne shot himself in the back or something like that. Yeah. There was just a gun in a couch, and he was playing on accident. Yeah. Yeah. It was an accident with him. I think so hard to say, but it looks like he probably got shot to when he was thirteen either. A suicide attempt to just a stray bullet because he lived in a rough part of town, whatever the truth hits really clear that Robert Kelly had a very very rough childhood not an upbringing I would risk on anybody. But it was not all an R rated version of a dickens novel. He had a teacher, Linda MacLennan who recognized his nascent musical talent early on and nurtured it she convinced him to sing Stevie wonder's ribbon in the sky for a high school talent show Kelly's first performance in front of an audience. He said about it later, quote that night it was like being Spiderman being bit. I discovered this power. I knew I had something then miss MacLean got Kelly on TV for the first time singing at a Christmas tree lighting. Ceremony in Chicago. Now, Robert had no Ma head for math or reading, and it actually sounds from what he says like he might be dyslexic. It sounds like MacLean was instrumental in convincing his mom and him that an essence he should throw all of his effort into singing into performing. Because that's the thing. He was clearly best at and that was definitely the right decision. Kelly started busking on a subway as a teenager on one particularly good day he made four hundred dollars. So he gets into performing and realizes like this is something he's got a crazy talent for so as a young adult he began booking more formal gigs. And it was during one set at a backyard barbecue at age twenty four that are Kelly was first discovered by the industry, Wayne Williams who worked for jive records just happened to be at that barbecue, quote, I was inside the house and Robert was performing outside. I saw this guy who had all the steps down real choreographed. You could tell he put a lot into it. Which is something you don't usually see especially at a backyard barbecue, it was the eye of the tiger. I'm not sure if he means that are Kelly was singing the eye of the tiger. Or if he was responding more. Generally to like, it was kung FU. Games rising up to the challenge of his rival. Kelly began working with berry hanker Sohn an agent with real standing in the music industry. Hankinson got him signed with the band public announcement Teresa, I'm gonna show you a picture of the band public announcement. And I just want you to tell me what, you know about their music based on this picture. That's a it looked kind of almost like a like a boy bands stance. You know, there's a woman in the middle. There's a woman in the middle. So it's a little off from that. But otherwise all the guys look like boy band. I imagine there's some dancing involves in very nineties Harris like tear touching slicking back kind of like Nadi not at the camera, and pointing that sort of thing in our Kelly is wearing what looks like the ninety s windbreaker ever been purchased limb. Breakers, those were windbreakers. Yeah. He was on the cutting edge of that windbreaker trend. Anyway, they dropped an album, and it did pretty well. But Kelly almost immediately outgrew public announcement. He released breaker and the windbreaker mean, we all kind of outgrew the windbreaker. He released his first solo album twelve play in nineteen Ninety-three wondering what the name twelve play means. Yeah. Definitely isn't alluding to his his child. Oh, jeez. That's even Dr that's really dark. I don't know. What does that mean? I thought I I mean, it's still messed up according to the Chicago Sun-Times, quote, it's because Kelly quote claims that while other lovers might give you four play. He gives you three times more. Just like, okay. All right. So I mean, you got to give it to him. He put math in math. There you go for especially for his first album. You know, you gotta conquer your fears. He has math and words mixed up these tracks on the album, twelve play include such subtle titles as bump and grind. Sex me in this is my favorite. I like the crotch on you what I like alleged you. All right. You gotta you gotta love. How just like? Okay. You really not hiding anything there, buddy. Like I like the crotch on clutches. Not a sexy word like it's not it almost like I feel like crotch just sound. I don't know. It sounds like it's like like it's not I don't relate it to sex. Even know it's pointing to the journals. I relate it to like, I don't know what I really just g I would think of jeans because of caused by dirty jeans, and like someone who didn't do their laundry. That's what I think of what I think crotch. No couple in the throes of passion have ever said bring that crotch on. That would not. It's just not an attractive word. Yeah. It's like something. A Taylor tells you by the crotch jeans or something. Yeah. You're right. Okay. So ridiculous. Is it sounded twelve play became the number one are NB album in America for nine straight weeks, you success and apparently a great Aren be album solo album. Yeah. This is a solo album. I don't know much about our B. But the one thing pretty much everybody seems in agreement on is that at his stride R Kelly was a hell of an R and B singer. So his career exploded after twelve play came out he owed much of his accent to his agent, of course, berry Hankinson, and it just so happens that Mr. hanker Sohn had a niece a fifteen year old girl named Leah Dana Haughton, she had musical ambitions about load of talent. And she's Leah. Yup. Yeah. This is that a Olea she soon started working with her uncle's top musician, the incredibly talented, Robert Kelly. He wrote a number of songs for her and acted as a producer on her first album age ain't nothing, but a number Kelly. Kelly wrote that title to. Yeah, I'm not surprised in interviews at the time a lien talked about the many many long hours. She in our Kelly put together to make the album, they're perfectionists and this led to numerous late night spent in close proximity. The was a hit selling more than three million copies in this courting to some people who know shit about our in beep, it was revolutionary in a number of ways in that John Ryan, I can't comment on that. But that seems to be the consensus. However good the album was it also lead to something even less savory or I guess exactly as unsavory as that title would suggest almost immediately after the album dropped Robert Nelia were married at that most stereotypically romantic of destinations the Sheraton gateway suites in Rosemead got married yet assure did she was fifteen. He was twenty seven. Oh my God. Yeah. That's not. Okay. That's not okay. Only. We're be improved to be like I'm fine with someone dropping a song called. I liked the crotch on you, you know, that your own thing here. We've got some not okay married for a long time. No, okay. Because I do not remember this. How was this not the thing that made him because he wasn't big enough? He was big news. This was there was like a controversy over this that extends to today because again, Leo was fifteen in. That's you can't be a twenty seven year old marrying a fifteen year old. It's not legal. So sometimes in a lot of states you can actually marry at that age, but your family has to consent and Elise family had no idea any of this was happening. In fact, the wedding was a secret the world only found out about it because several months after the fact vibe published the marriage certificate, which listed Leah is eighteen so fraudulent marriage certificate now. Big problems. Now, the whole episode is somewhat murky and unclear and there are a number of different narratives as to what precisely went down g cues account of things is based heavily on the memory of Dimitri. Smith a somewhat shady character who worked for Kelly at the time. He said this quote the week of the marriage Smith recounts being in Miami on tour with Kelly and how Kelly explained that he had received a distraught. Phone call from a lien saying she had run away from home believing. She was pregnant Smith says that Kelly was then given some species advice that he could protect himself from the legal ramifications of the situation by marrying her Smith's account of what happened next during a break in the tour Smith and Kelly flew together, Illinois Smith procured a fake state ID for a leeann from a friend in the public aid office, and they got a backup ID through someone. They knew at Federal Express that night after the ceremony in a suite at the Sheraton hotel Kelly and Smith flew back to Miami to resume the tour. So is it. I mean there are trying to like do the paperwork by getting married to make it legal. But then they use fraudulent ID's. It's the whole thing isn't legal. So what's the point of that? I mean, a couple of things number one keeping your head this before the internet. So the odds that someone would find this we're lower, but. Marriage is null if it was built on. Yeah. So that'd make no sense. At all the whole thing is no there were hoping nobody would notice he got when did she come out with are you that somebody 'cause there's tons of random baby noises there that I'm like what the fuck is this, and I kind of just part of it. But now, I'm like was it as a secret message like what she like on pregnant. It might have been I think that was after older because if that wasn't from her she she lived until like twenty four so that wasn't her first album. That's not on age ain't nothing. But a number than with Rome. I think it was the movie Romeo must die. Oh, then. Yeah. That would have been way later. So it is an adult that point. She was sort of trying to slip in the story of it's hard to say what happens child just one guy's relation. She didn't have the baby right? I don't think. So. No, no. She did not. And we don't know if she was actually pregnant again, this is like one person's version of the story, and I don't know this guy's reliable. Yeah. And we we don't really know one hundred percent what went down because there were a lia's parents found out and made them, you know, they annulled the marriage and everything and there was like a big legal settlement where he reportedly paid like one hundred dollars is like token thing. And then like they both agreed not to say anything about this. And like, no one said anything about it in the year since so we don't know what went down. But what I do know. No is that there are some fine products and or services that Theresa you're just gonna love to hear about. Ooh, I love the ad reads. Yes. Ed's. Hello. My name is Kevin Pollack. Yes. The award winning funny fellow from that film. And or TV thing that makes you smile every darn time. You see it, folks. Did you know, I've got a new comedy podcast that was created with you and mine 'cause I do it's called alchemy this, and it was designed with a single purpose, you laughing a lot I'm talking please. Let someone else drive when listening if you enjoy laughing uncontrollably while running errands exercising or building a crispy cream doughnut machine and your basement from parts you stole while working there as an assistant manager, oh, buddy. Boy, I've got the comedy podcast for you each episode. I'm the puppet master who sets the scene, and then five genius improvisers, and I will make you laugh and feel better alchemy. This the new funny podcasts from me. Kevin pollick? Listen and subscribe at apple podcasts or on the iheartradio app or wherever you listen to podcasts. We're back. We're talking about a lien in our Kelly's very short lived in super legal mannerly. She was sort lived. Well, yeah. Yeah. She died in a plane crash. She was like twenty. So anyway, the settlement between Elliott in our Kelly. We don't again, I know exactly what went down. But it's a supposedly included a promise from Leah not to sue R Kelly in the future due to quote emotional distress caused by any aspect of her business or personal relationship with Robert she also agreed not to sue for quote, physical injury or emotional pain and suffering arising from any assault or battery perpetrated by Robert against a person. Again. We don't know what went down. We don't know. What all was getting bandied about he he is like is preemies too. But like he ready new. It's like he was like, okay. This kinda shit will come out later. So I'm just gonna totally. For my basis. Well, it's it's it's not even like preemies to me too is just people finally getting angry about this this whole thing. We're like rich people's as Jack NDA's, we're more like, oh, I feel like it came from a lot of the men who make people's I or silence women a lot of it in the past came from like, oh, I don't want it to hurt my reputation. But the fact that he was already like I know that you're gonna go through emotional trauma that might not surface until ten years from now. And then you might wanna talk about it. He's like hold up. You don't know you're going to have this. But I know because I've been through it. So don't talk about it. Oh shit. Okay. Now, that's a really went through it. And that's why he knows that there's going to. I don't think a lot of men in the past were like you're going to have emotional trauma. I think they're just like I don't wanna get caught. I didn't even catch that. But I think you're right. Yeah. That's really insightful. It's kind of Dr. I mean, it's it's sad. Because it's like he's a victim or survivor himself. But also, you know, there's cycle, and he's perpetuating it. Yeah. I think you're I think you're. Really onto something there. So neither are Kelly. Nora Leah have ever provided more detail about what went down or the reasoning behind that weird settlement in nineteen Ninety-seven Elliott filed to expunge the marriage certificate from the county court records, the most detail she ever gave an interview was with the Chicago Sun-Times nineteen Ninety-four where she said, hey, don't believe all that mess. We're close in people took it the wrong way. But that was again like right when it happened. A Leah died in a plane crash in two thousand and one at the age of twenty four R Kelly has said almost nothing about her in the two decades since her death. He doesn't even mention her name once in his auto biography Sola coaster. There is however a disclaimer at the beginning that notes certain episodes could not be included for complicated reasons, that's probably a reference to the court settlement during that two thousand sixteen interview with G Q Kelly described Elliott as his best best best friend, which seems odd for someone. He left out of his auto biography. But again, probably was legally restricted from doing so in nineteen ninety-five R Kelly release. His second solo album, just titled R Kelly three songs on the album reached number one on the RN. Be charts. Song titles include down low. Nobody has to know. Llama knows on December twenty fourth nineteen Ninety-six R Kelly was sued for ten million dollars by Tiffany Hawkins high school student with ambitions for a music career. She claims she met Kelly when he talked to her choir class, her teacher, miss mcclen left. Having Kelly come over to talk to her new students. Kelly seemed to have love flirting with the literal children in these classes, I'm going to quote, Jim deroga-, the indispensable reporter on the R Kelly allegations here, I'm going to probably butcher. This guy's last name. What do you? How do you think that Duero Gaddis deroga-, maybe two Ragas deroga- rogue Atta Stephen D row Gaddis? That's what we're going to land on probably should've checked that. When I was reading about our Kelly for eleven hours, quote asked about the charges in the Hawkins lawsuit that Kelly had sexual relationships with some of the freshman and sophomore girls from lens choir. The teacher says I don't know what he did outside of school. But in the school, there was no Hanky panky if they were involved in that the sad thing is it takes to Tango. Oh, no. It's pretty it doesn't take too full person under age. He really not the it. You can't be part of it too. When you're not going to you teach teenagers. You know, they're not real people yet, you know, that you teach them like if you put a puppy in a box, and you're like, well, he didn't get out. Well, that's different. If you have more power. You're a big person. Hawkins claimed her sexual relationship with Kelly started in nineteen ninety one when she was fifteen and he twenty four she says Kelly ended the relationship when she turned eighteen Hawkins slit her wrists. Immediately afterwards a suicide attempt that she thankfully survived. Also in nineteen Ninety-six while Kelly was settling the lawsuit over the teenager, he allegedly molested into a suicide attempt. He met an adult lady. Andrea Lea Lea was a choreographer dancer who'd worked on his tour. Andrea and Robert married and eventually had three children. There are a few signs that the marriage was something less than super romantic. The pair were almost never photograph together. People close to Kelly told the Chicago Sun-Times that Andrea was required to knock before entering any room in their house, while her husband was home and in two thousand and three several of Andrea relatives complained to the Chicago Sun-Times they weren't allowed to visit their daughter at the home. She shared with Kelly or talk to her on the phone so consider that whole paragraph. Just TI Nancy metaphor shadowing. His autobiography better Sola coaster. But what? So the solar coaster. Okay, year later or start a little later in nineteen ninety six which was very full year for R Kelly. He ran into legal trouble again when he was arrested for battery and Lafayette, Louisiana after a fight between himself his aunt Arash and three random dudes at the basketball court for a local gym. Now, he gets a pass on this one from me because why would you go to a gym basketball court? If you didn't wanna get into a fistfight with somebody in their Underash true. What happens on a court stays on? Now. That's probably not true. No it is. If there's one thing gym basketball courts, therefore, it's fistfights with famous people. And that's cred. That's a sacred thing is as long as you. I mean to certain degree you don't want like beat someone's face to pull. But if there's a little bit of fighting on like if it's more like closer to wrestling on on a on any core of sport as long as when the game ends, you're shaking hands patting each other's back and saying good game. Then I think it's a little okay? But I think if that's real aggression. That's carried on past the game. Then you're like, oh that was a real fight. I think it all depends on whether or not someone has an entourage. Because if there's an entourage. There's no option, but to have like a really showy choreographed fistfight, it's like a gang. We don't really have the big old west side story gangs, the way, I don't even know they ever really did do those dancy dancy fights. But now I feel like you've got fight on the court. I imagine if I ever got into a fight with Ashton Kutcher. You would have dancing and singing entourage have to fight my way through I but yeah. Despite all of its ups and mostly downs. Eighteen eighty six ended on a high note for Robert Kelly. The movie Space Jam was released in December of that year, permanently delighting my former boss, Daniel O'Brien and making art a household name. His hit song, I believe I can fly was basically everywhere for like six months. It was the number two song and America I was like eight at the time and a tremendous number of my early memories involve hearing r Kelly's voice over the shitty. Speakers at a blockbuster or piggly-wiggly or what have you? Bad man. Michael, jordan. So well, I don't know much about Michael Jordan as bad, but not a nice guy. No comments until I do the digging on him for the Michael Jordan episode Kelly's mother died in March of nineteen ninety seven. This was a devastating blow to the self-described mama's boy as it would have been for anyone shortly. After this Robert announced on stage with a gospel preacher that he had given himself over to Jesus his autobiography contains numerous religious references. He's been very consistent about the importance of faith to him over the years. Yeah. R Kelly's desire to get right with God. However, did not inspire him to get right with the Justice department in June nineteen Ninety-seven he missed his key ring on the battery case over that basketball court fight he wound up having to settle out of court with men for an undisclosed sum the next month. Settling with people friend disclose sums of money would grow to become our Kelly's number one hobby over the next twenty years in one thousand nine hundred eight he settled his lawsuit with Tiffany Hawkins, the teenager. He. Yeah. G tempted suicide reportedly for two hundred and fifty thousand dollars the settlement came four days after Hawkins delivered a horrifying seven hour deposition. In a way, it was too little too late news of Kelly's escapades with Hawkins began to leak a young woman who'd been prepared to testify about being in the threesome with Hawkins and Kelly. While Hawkins was under age told the Chicago Sun-Times, quote, I'm not trying to down him because I honestly think it has to be a sickness looking at pictures of me and Tiffany when we were freshmen boy, we were ugly little girls compared to what he could have had. So I didn't understand why he did what he did on. That's also like a fad sort of trying to justify and make things feel normal. You like as a survive? I think she's also like trying to explain or, you know. Yeah. Move on without being stuck in the moment. Yeah. I'm not gonna I'm not. Gonna judge her for that. But it is we yeah. That whole article was published in two thousand it includes a lot of really unsettling information, quote, according to Hawkins his lawsuit Kelly had sex with underage girls in his apartments at nine s Wabash one eighty five North Harbour's drive and other locations in Chicago and response to questions from Hawkins is attorneys. Kelly admitted that he employed Hawkins is a background vocalist in periodically gave her small cash gifts and approximately fourteen hundred dollars in checks, but he denied having any sexual contact with the girl. Now Hawkins is friend who was prepared to testify did make it clear that are Kelly did not force himself on her sexually. He treated us. Very well, she said we got anything we asked for, but we weren't going to ask for much a pair of air Jordans or one hundred dollars was a lot of money to us. I still love our Kelly's music. I don't hate him. She added he reminds me of a boyfriend who hurt you that you still love he hurt me by not helping me out and telling me to drop out of school. He told me in Tiffany both. If you wanna be serious about the music, you have to be at the studio and not at school because school isn't going to make you a millionaire. At sixteen. That's like a dream to us to work with our Kelly. So we listened to him. I think it's a sickness. Yeah. I mean that's rough. She's definitely negotiating whether it's on there's no right or wrong from his point of view because it's like how she feels it how she feels. And you know, sometimes to move on you have to eat the narrative in her head. It doesn't mean it's real you know, what I mean? Like it. Clearly, he cost a line from objective point of view. But the number of from her point of view. I don't think we could fall her for wanting to think of him fondly because otherwise just to move on with her life feeling like this bad thing happened, which it did. But it's okay. If she wants to live her life feeling a little bit more normal. And it's also it's a the the bargain, he put these young women and was essentially the way who's making the thing of it is like, okay. Well, he's grooming. Her to this may be creepy. I may not like parts of this. But like other parts are to her good. We'll get we'll get to be a millionaire. If she felt like she consented are maybe he didn't ever. Maybe he didn't have a quote unquote force himself, but just by nature him being an adult and then being kids and. Him treating them that way already sheet is like we're moving them to feel like they owe him. And I would argue that even if they'd both been eighteen the money here would have been an element of force not that he was offering them. But because yeah, it's coercion of like if I put up with us for a while. Then I'll have a career in the music industry, and I'll never have to worry, you know, abusing his power. Yeah. Yeah. In a couple of ways like his power as like an older man whose wiser in the world and these fifteen year olds and his power as a gatekeeper to celebrity, but there's also like there's so much new. I mean bottom line, it's wrong. You know, he crossed the line bottom line. I want to preface that. But I also want to the nuance of like someone he was a survivor as a kid and part of him. Maybe that like the part that you know, he never dealt with maybe wanted to rewrite a little bit. So maybe he did treat them really well and didn't force them in a in a way to kind of rewrite like what if? When this happened to me, it was sweet and kind and they didn't force it. So in a way, he may have been trying to rewrite his own past that way, still bottom line wrong. And there should have been more resources in place to help him get through his trauma. So that he knew how to properly deal with it. But there is a world with maybe like, maybe he thought treating them. Well, and then going to sex would kind of be like, oh, there can exist a relationship. That's yeah. Because he's trying to justify what happened to him. Yeah. He's not like most people who do really bad things. I doubt he's going into this mall way. The way he wanted to sort of put some sort of meaning to what happened to him. And and make it feel like it wasn't so bad because in his mind, he was like, well, if I can have relationship with kid that feels even or in his mind, it's even they like this. Then that can mean maybe when I was a kid. It wasn't so bad. Do have like he's trying to revive a little bit. What happened? Yeah. I can see something like that going on as head. I can see that being like a way to sort of deal with like crusher conscience a little bit. Yes. You start to be like this is fucked up and Robert Kelly about himself. Yeah. Yeah. Or his actions in this, particular instance, well, let's read the next paragraph in two thousand one Tracy Samson sued Robert Kelly for bringing her into an indecent sexual relationship when she was just seventeen she claimed she was treated as his personal sex object, and quote, he often tried to control every aspect of my life, including who I would see and where I would go her case was settled out of court for an undisclosed sum. Kelly was sued in successive months in two thousand and two once in. In april. And again in may by two different women one claimed he impregnated her while she was underage and other claimed he'd filmed a sex tape of them without her knowledge or consent. According to the BBC, quote, the recording was allegedly circulated on an arc Kelly sex tape sold by bootleggers under the title are Kelly triple X in both of these cases are Kelly settled out of court for undisclosed sums song track. Should have been called ages. Just an undisclosed sum. That's that's really good. Both of these women found Indy as I found a telling quote, though, from a BuzzFeed article that interviewed a lawyer who's been involved with several of our Kelly settlements, Chicago attorney Susani Loggins declined to say how many settlements she has negotiated with Kelly before lawsuits wherever filed, but she said they were numerous in recently included, one for a seventeen year old aspiring singer from Chicago's west side who has said to been part of Kelly's inner circle. So it seems like for every one of these cases I've read there's many many many others that never proceeded trial because the victim just went to Kelly straight away and they worked out a settlement. So like the people were talking about on. This are probably not the only people who could come forward with allegations. If they hadn't already gotten paid and signed in India with the Weinstein thing literally the month. After those two cases rubber Kelly was charged again this time with filming illegal sex videos. This is the are Kelly case you've all heard about the P tape because the actress in this tape that was circulating underground was allegedly underage. Kelly was charged with twenty one counts of making child pornography. So the backstory of this one is a little bit interesting. So we're gonna hear back for a little bit to November of two thousand when Kelly released the album teepee to number one debut on the billboard albums checked. It featured two number one Rb hits. I wish in fiesta. It also featured songs like the greatest sex and feeling on your booty the album reviewer for the Chicago Sun-Times was Jim deroga-. He wrote this about it one minute. He's grabbing his privates and bragging of being like a real freak the next. He's drawing on his gospel roots, and once again paying homage to his due to parted mom on the lush and touching single. I wish prince Marvin Gaye and Al green all showed that in the right circumstances. Sex and prayer can be the same thing. Kelly has yet to combine the two in one song. So he has yet to make the transcendent record. He's been promising throughout his career is Lear shifts from church street corner are still so jarring that they can give you whiplash. So you can tell they're deroga- has hardly came into the Kelly cases a hater. But it was probably this review that would contain the seeds of Robert Kelly's down. Fall or at least probable downfall, one of our Kelly's assistance read the review and sent this letter to deroga-. You're at about R Kelly and compared him to Marvin Gaye, we'll I guess Marvin Gaye had problems too. But I don't think that were like Roberts Roberts problem is young girls. I've known Robert for many years, and I've tried to get him to get help. But he just won't do it. So I'm telling you about it hoping that you or someone at your newspaper will write an article about it, and then Robert will have no choice, but to get help into stop hurting people. He's hurting this is one of his assistants. Yeah. So we will talk about what comes this later. But before we get back to the R Kelly sex tape, you know, what's better than a sex tape that is probably child pornography? This is not a good effort. Boy, we're spiralling anything celsius the only energy drink currently on this table. That's also not involved at all in our Kelly sex cry alleged sex crimes. Here's some other ads that paid us. You know, people say necessity is the mother of invention. But that's not always true. Sometimes the mother of invention is advertising. Yeah. Or pure accident. How about ego maniacal delusion? Absolutely. Or just a desperate longing. To be cool. I'm Robert lamp, and I'm Joe McCormick. We're the host of the science podcasts stuff to blow your mind. And now we're branching off into the exploration of invention. Invention is the story of human history told one piece of technology at a time the things we made and how they made us invention publishes every Monday, listen and subscribe to invention on apple podcasts the iheartradio app or wherever you find your podcasts. We're back in. We've just been slammed into our first free real ad of the day for diet mountain dew, the only caffeinated beverage currently in my hand because I didn't wanna make another coffee. Why are you holding a skateboard 'cause Ranco, oh, what do the do the sound of a half pipe? You're going to say do this out of a hang loose. Now. There's no sound that you just got to put it in your voice. I can hear it when you do the hand gestures. Yeah. You're hanging loose. There's no way to do that sign without sticking your tongue out. It's required. It's the law. Speaking of the law. Let's talk about our Kelly's Twenty-one it's churches of child pornography making when we when we last left off Jim de Ragas at the will be pronouncing differently. Almost every time. I talk about a reporter at the Chicago sun times, I had just gotten an anonymous letter from one of Kelly's assistance being like r Kelly's got a real problem with young people and somebody needs to do something about this. So as a journalist getting a letter like that is a legally prickly thing anytime, you're considering breaking the story that would accuse someone of multiple felonies you've got to be on guard a letter like that on its own is not super journalistically actionable running. The letter alone would not be the best practice. Right. So nothing happened at first this may have prompted the person in Kelly's orbit to push. Again. A videotape was sent to the Chicago Sun-Times by some anonymous person the tape showed Kelly having sex with an extremely young person because this was super likely to be evidence of a crime. And because if it was evidence of a crime. It would also be child pornography. The Chicago Sun-Times went to the cops the police because how is it? If you even look at it. Yeah. So if you get sent a video like that you have to call the feds yet you have to immediately bring in. Well, I think they go to the local I'm not sure they go to the cops us local cops. So in the not with child porn, so but the police opened up an investigation, but there really wasn't much that they could do because they didn't have like hidden. You don't know the age of the person, you don't know for sure that this is our Kelly. You just have these claims so they kind of wait for a little while. And you know, somehow, you know, right around this time tapes of our Kelly bootleg, sex tapes of our Kelly with young women start floating around. There's multiple tapes they are not all underage people. Kelly apparently has sex taped his sex taped regularly. So somebody in his orbit was leaking. These not just to the press. I have not watched the R Kelly p tape, but this is when the air Kelly p tape that's famous gets out into the world. People watch. 'cause I remember hearing the news, I guess people. So people are watching it. But if you watch it isn't that they weren't all child pornography. Okay. But it wasn't that. I don't know much. I just remember I didn't even know she was underage. I remember there is a p tape and the Dutch. And then there was like a dungeon. Yeah. That's part of the spouse and stuff. Yeah. Okay. So Hoover started sending these anonymous tapes to the Sun-Times eventually got fed up that nothing had happened yet. This person left a video in Jim deroga- has his mailbox. He sent it to the police as well. And they were finally able to make an ID they found a source who claimed to recognize the young woman in the video as her niece. She basically able to name the kid in like Kelly says the first name in the video. So the police were pretty sure that they had the right person. And so the cops give the Chicago Sun-Times, the go ahead to publish their first story on the matter. Terrifying. I mean, I know they're just investigating. They have to do their job. But that's terrifying. Have to like Europe. Sex type is not only getting leaked. But then people are like, do, you know this girl? Unlike like asking your family members will they weren't going straight to Kelly adverse. I know that when they asking she recognized the girl as her niece year, they found that means her Onder ankle watched the sex tape to identify her. They probably saved a like had just a girl's face or something. I doubt they played the whole tape for this lady. But like they heard a first name, and I think they narrowed it down because they had some like it. They feel like they have enough that the police charged him with twenty one counts of child pornography 'cause the aunt of this girl claimed she would have been around fourteen at the time of the filming. So our Kelly who had just performed at the opening ceremony of the Winter Olympics was forced to respond personally quote. It's not true. All I know is this I have a few people in the past that I fired people that I thought were my friends, that's not my friends. It's crap. And that's what we're going to treat. It the reason these things are happening. I really do believe is because of the fact that I didn't fall back as far as blackmail was concerned. I didn't give them any money. So our Kelly was indicted for child porn on June fifth two thousand and two. He pled not guilty the neck. Day in posted bail using seven hundred and fifty hundred dollar bills. Once he got back from court. He immediately violated a court order by singing at kindergarten graduation ceremony seven hundred like single dollar bills that way one hundred dollar Bill what he just has just be petty. Like, no why he just had a shitload a couch one hundred dollar bills. Gotcha. That makes sense. Yeah. So at this point, the grinding wheels of the Justice system set into motion jury selection did not begin till June of two thousand eight six years after the charges were filed. This is not normal as an MTV article point at at the time quote in the last six years. Michael Jackson was charged tried and acquitted of molestation Phil spector was charged and tried for murder and due to a mistrial who have to do it. All again, though, Kim was charged tried and convicted of conspiracy, and perjury, and she even found time to shoot a reality show while she served her sentence all that happened. While r Kelly's case was waiting to actually go to trial now delaying this case was very definitely a strategy used by our Kelly's defense. They probably figured that. Since his alleged victim was expected to take the stand. It would be better optics. If she were in her twenties rather than still a teenager when she had to deal are. So first off they wave Kelly's right to a speedy trial, which would have required the case to take place in four months or the chargers would have to be dropped. They also filed thirty some odd pretrial motions all of which demanded a response from the prosecution in usually led to an argument in court this always delayed. Thanks further. There are also some freak happenings that disrupted matters. The judge fell off a ladder and injured himself r Kelly's appendix burst. That's all your died. Fell off a ladder. There's some weirdness around the judge in this case, we'll get to some more of that later during the six years while he waited Robert did not exactly shut up and just sorta hunker down like a month after the charges were filed. He released a single heaven. I need a hug, which was basically his plea of innocent in the court of public opinion. Here's some lines from heaven. I need a hug, and as for Robert here's what I need to do get rid of them clowns and get myself a whole nother crew media do your job. But please just don't make my job so hard somebody. Please pray what I'm talking about. I'm still young trying to figure it all out heaven. I need a hug is there. Anybody out there willing to embrace a thug? So yeah, he needs a hug he's using. I had I mean people get on side powerful tool the question of his guilt or innocence is actually a semi regular theme in our Kelly's music, for example in the album chocolate factory. During a ten minute mini opera. R Kelly finds himself at the gates of heaven Saint Peter denies him for his sins. But then she's absolves him the same scene apparently plays out in the album love land as well. In the middle of a twenty minute remix of I believe I can fly so regular reoccurring theme in Kelly's music his career continued to chug along in the early 'oughts, but even his work wasn't free of drama in October of two thousand four he Jay z released their second collaborative album, which did predictably well, they started touring together and things were not smooth during a performance in Saint Louis on October twenty third Kelly left the show after getting into a screaming argument with the lighting technicians. He actually left the venue drove to a random McDonalds and spend our serving food to customers through the drive through window. What was your son comforts sheds a little light? Now. Kelly's people spun this weird Kelley's attorney Ed Gibson confirmed reports Monday that Kelly headed from Saint Louis Savacentre do a McDonald's restaurant that had closed, but which he persuaded to reopen for the entourage traveling on his bus. Then he decided he wanted to work the drive through Gibson said it was on the radio people were running out of their houses to have our Kelly serve them. Kelly is a big McDonalds fan who has stopped and worked at the drive thru windows. A McDonald's restaurants before in a primetime live interview that aired on October. He talked about frequent visits there with his late mother. We'd go to McDonalds almost every morning. She drinker Cup of coffee. She'd wear this cheap lipstick, and she'd leave this red lipstick around the Cup Kelly said that well first of all to McDonald's for being so big that that's not even a thing. USA as much Donald is just a house just like going to the store. You know, what I mean to be like he started people? It's like if you're a small brand, it'd be an art Kelly was just decided to work for you for a day. Like that would be the biggest thing that happened to you. But yeah, so bakers like you don't even associate that with the brand. I feel that this has to have been a franchisee though, because I feel like McDonald's corporate if some if they'd Nass she we had this guy who's being indicted for child pornography work in our Trifu. I feel like the CEO a lot of go in to eat. Well, yeah. But I feel like Ronald McDonald re. Polly be like, yeah. We don't want that worked out window, right? Right. But I'm gonna guess. Yeah. It was some like local franchise owner who was like we'll FOX business. Mcdonald's in Saint Louis. Yeah. I feel like would you have gone if you were there at that time like knowing what was going on? But like he's found guilty yet like as a normal person. Would you be like I'm gonna go get food from the art Kelly drive through you know, what also this also someone who was born in Saint Louis, and who has been their number of times in my life. If I was going to get handed French fries by a child pornographer, I would expect it to be at a McDonald's and Saint Louis. Yeah. That's like I think looking back. I'm like oh on principle. I wouldn't want anything to do with him. But I'm like if I was there at that time and someone was like dude r Kelly's handing out burgers demonstrate, I'm I'm going to be totally honest. I probably would drive through like, I don't like the right thing to do. And you can like whatever come at me. But I'm being honest. I think I would have gone, so okay. Let me only positives to you. If like Mel Gibson gets no because I don't care about Mel Gibson. I would have to be someone you care. I don't care about. What is the difference? Maybe the public opinion thing did make a difference him singing about him. So because I'm like, you know, what I mean like he seems more human. I mean, he was super popular though, too. I mean already outside all this. So I don't know. I think if it was someone like, okay, William Shatner is a famous person. I'd love who. I'm sure has done horrible things that just haven't heard about he must've shattner, I'm all he has to have look at look into his. But he just looks like a character actor who plays that. I think be sweet we don't know if any member of Hollywood has killed someone for money and Bill Shatner. Okay. I'm saying that right now, I have no evidence of this completely unsubstantiated Herta here for any Ayla star is a hit, man. It's it's Bill Shatner in his younger days when he was a lumberjack just that classic Canadian stereotype of the lumberjack slash handed burgers by like, a serial killer. No. But if. Like Shatner care. And I knew it. I would do it. If arbiters was handing out burgers, people, go people would go. But I don't think I would want to know. I don't want a killer to look me in the eye ever. Because it's like, I don't know how they choose their victims. Like, if they know my face, I might be dead in ten you know, what I mean? Like, I don't know. Maybe one day. They'll be like I remember that face. Oh, just randomly ultras killer. You know what? I mean. I don't know anyway. Sorry for derailing. It's not only from St Louis. What is Nellie from? Oh, anyway, I I I guess other artists from island is if like Bill Shatner was on trial for some terrible crime. And he was on his way to court working at a McDonald's. I would try to get some mcnuggets from from William Shatner, you it. I I think I would so. Yeah. That that's your answer is I can see why people would do this. So quite the digression on October twenty ninth two thousand four a few days after Kelly's night at McDonald's guy R Kelly stopped he performance in Madison Square Garden saying a fan. Had waved a gun at him. He wound up in a fight backstage, which one of Jay Z's people and got pepper sprayed. He went to the hospital. There were shitload of lawsuits in the tour collapsed in on itself. So on July twenty first two thousand five during pretrial proceedings in Kelly's court case. A twenty one year old woman testified that the girl in Kelly sex tape was fourteen when the video had been filmed saying it, quote, it was the summer after eighth grade. The judge did not consider yet. That's bad. Right. Eighth grade sound so much younger than yard teen. Fourteen. Sounds it's still bad. But eighth grade really drives it home. What's going on here? The judge did not consider this enough and threatened to toss out the court case, unless a more -firmative ide- could be made two months after this. Robert's wife Andrea filed for an order of protection against her husband. She claimed that she had asked him for a divorce in he'd hit her she rescinded the order shortly thereafter, but they wound up getting a divorce in two thousand eight anyway, we'll hear from Andrea a little bit at the end of all this back in February of two thousand six while. Everybody was still waiting for the Kelly trial to start Robert Kelly's brother, Kerry or Killa Kelly came out with a DVD filled with allegations against his sibling among other things. Yeah. Killa Kelly claims that are Kelly offered him fifty thousand dollars in cash into record deal to pretend to be the man on the tape. He also alleged that his brother was abusive to his wife and had a problem with underage girl. I none of that seems out of the pale. I will say that the credibility of Killa Kelly's allegations is somewhat put into question, by the way that he chose to drop this bombshell. Number one. Next time. A DVD is not the most credible way to present alligators title page. Find the title I found it was published by drama magazine with an h in the word drummer Hans. It's again, I'm gonna guess he got money for this. The H came before the diesel trauma. Yeah. So maybe it was all a cynical cash grab that said it is consistent with all the other allegations that have been made in wouldn't be the weirdest thing in the world. If R Kelly tried to have his brother take the fall for him now, even under the cloud of legal fucker looming over him Robert Kelly had continued to release albums that continue to be gigantic hits. And this is important to note and part of why Kelly's fans defend him, silver, seriously R Kelly has been the biggest name in our NB throughout most of this in may two thousand seven R Kelly gave an interview to hip hop soul magazine in it he said, I'm the Ali of today. I'm the Marvin Gaye of today on the Bob Marley of today. I'm the Martin Luther King are all the other greats that have come before us and a lot of people are starting to realize that now in February of two thousand eight a couple of months before jury selection began on the trial, Regina Daniels, Kelly's longtime spokeswoman and the person who deficiently denied the allegations of his wrongdoings to the press for like a decade left. His employ with her husband, George Daniels in the interview George explained he crossed the line with my daughter. It did. Get to the extreme of that the sex tape video or else, I wouldn't be here. If you know what I'm talking about the reason I'm that I'm talking about this. It's not just for me. It's not just for my wife. It's not just for my daughter. But it's for other fathers and mothers. Because it doesn't have to be a superstar. It could be the dude on the corner there guys who sit around and give your child a couple bucks to go to school. And then wait until they get a little older. And then they set that trap, grooming. Yeah. Yeah. It was grooming. And this is now again, the husband and his spokeswoman both of them had worked for him coming out and saying this a lot of people in his orbit have come out later with allegations on June fourteenth, two thousand eight R Kelly was found not guilty by a jury of his peers, the prosecution's star witness the woman in the tape never took the stand. Jim deroga-, the Chicago sun times reporter who broke the story took the fifth and did not testify. My think some of it is that he might have had to like admit that he'd seen the tape which would have been legally scary. And he also had some like worries that he he would be required to give up like sources and stuff like. That. So he he he did not testify, which is always a fraught thing for a journalist in a court case, there's a lot of reasons that would be complicated. Four days later judge gone through a post trial party at a bar to celebrate the end of the case he invited the defense. The prosecution court workers and reporters one of those reporters thing. The thing that people do it happened. This time is that typical. I've never heard of this before like, hey, guys, rack hardy people who are everybody trust secure Shen? Let's all get on get down. So bizarre. But one of the reporters who was present says that it was a hoot, and that everyone there was loosened relaxed. So that's nice. Oh, you almost put me in jail. Let's all part part. I don't think R Kelly went I'm gonna guess maybe that was the judge is hoped that he'd get to party with our Kelly again, there's some weirdness what the judge threw it. Yeah. Some weirdness. So our Kelly was not guilty. And if he were truly innocent of all of the allegations against him, this story might have ended there. But this is not the sort of podcast where we talk about wrongly accused people. So in the years since R Kelly was declared, not guilty things have only gotten darker, and a whole lot creepy or all of that will be coming to you the listener on Thursday, and we dropped part two of the working title has been R Kelly. What the hell man? How you doing? Hey, I didn't realize that you were gonna leave me on a cliffhanger that I'm gonna leave you on a cliffhanger or so I'm not going to know that when the air horn should have kicked in. Defense that people say like, oh, great art, blah here. All the time. Great artist. You know, what we're gonna do not not give their art. Yeah. I think it would have helped public opinion if when someone's under trial for child pornography that they're forbidden to put out art because then people can just fine. Appreciate the stuff that came before. But like we don't need to continue liking the guy. We we might it might be true. He's talented. But like while you're on a trial for something bad. You shouldn't be allowed to put out any more of your art. That's a privilege, not a right? Well, I mean when you're in trouble, you're not guilty. Like, you can't stop someone from putting out art when they're innocent until proven good. I think because post people on a position where it's like. Well, it's a good. We should just listen to. Well, why don't we just stop having it that we don't have to be like, it's all good and defending it. I think there's you you have some water when you're trying to get people to be like, hey, this guy's been accused of bunch of heinous crimes. Let's all boycott is music. I think that's fine. But I like the government can't go and be like, you don't get to make music. Yeah, you're right because then isn't guilty that can it can be used against him to silence them, but that's pesky civil rights, man. I don't know Justice. Teresa you wanna plug your plug Ables. Yeah. Sure. I've got a podcast. It's all about secrets you on sometime. I love secrets Johnny secret Mary open book, but it doesn't have to be a scandal. Listrik which is something you've not talked about on stage or whatever ready did podcast about it's called. You can tell me anything comedians confessed, something they haven't told anyone. It's really fun. You can find it on Instagram at tell me anything pod. And I'm on Twitter at LaRussa t. Yeah. Up to be on talk about the time. I firebomb that oil Derrick or something, I'm Robert Evans. This has been behind the bastards. You can find us on Instagram and Twitter at at bastards pod, by shirts, and cups, and cell phone cases, and commercial drilling equipment all at our T public store behind the bastards t public check it out. You can get our branded stuff on your IMAX eighty earth core cracker, which is one of the finest commercial drilling rigs available. I shouldn't be lying about commercial drilling Twitter. Them. We're going to have like thirty people top up on Twitter and be like also, you can get stickers. You'd find me on Twitter at I right? Okay. You'd find the sources for this episode on behind the bastards dot com. We'll be back on Thursday with the story of our Kelly's alleged sex Colt. An until then podcast. Yes. Investigators have been desperate to figure out how that family flew off that cliff in California, and whether it was on purpose early the morning of March twenty six rescue workers repelled down the cliff where they lifted the dead bodies of three children arm to the point where I no longer. I'm calling this an accident. I'm calling it a crime who are these women, and how did they come to adopt six children two sets of three black siblings. You're one of my early role models or what like non traditional fan bringing look like we looked up to her like, wow, she's the best parent in the world. We're horrible. I don't mind how now there's some kids that I feel as being highly abused. She would eating out at the garbage like something's not right about them. But since she's told me about it. I just can't live with it. I'm very concerned for these kids from glamour, and how stuff works this is broken hearts. Listen and subscribe at apple podcasts or on the iheartradio app or wherever you listen to podcasts.
Eula Biss Talking About Whiteness
"Support for on being with KRISTA. Tippett comes from the Fetzer Institute. Helping build the spiritual foundation for a loving world Fetzer envisions a world that embraces love as a guiding principle and animating force for our lives, a powerful love that helps us live in sacred relationship with ourselves, others and the natural world learn more by visiting Fetzer Dot Org. You'll abyss authored an important say in two thousand fifteen called white debt. She reflected on Whiteness in America through the metaphor of buying a house. Have surprisingly comfortable. Debt can be in the right circumstances, and how easily we forget that we don't actually own what we feel we possess. She helpfully opens up words and ideas like complacence, guilt and something related to privilege called Opportunity Hoarding. This show has been turned to you by many in this moment, and so we are offering it up new. It is the only on air conversation. I've ever had in which my guest and I had to stop midway and acknowledged how embarrassing it is that we have to have this conversation at all, and how inadequate all of our words yet. How urgent that we reach for them nevertheless. Rereading the essay that introduced me to her. I'm struck by sentences that have now revealed their deepest hardest truth in my community in Minneapolis and across our nation. She wrote. Whiteness is costing me my community. It is the wedge driven between me and my neighbors between me and other mothers between me and other workers like a bad loan, the kind in which the payments increase over time the price of whiteness remains hidden behind its promises. I'm Chris. And this is on being. You'll abyss teaches writing at northwestern university and is best known for her book on immunity. She's also the author of notes from no-man's-land, which deals in part with her experience growing up in a multi-racial family. We spoke in two thousand sixteen. Really WanNA focus on a frame our conversation around. Ideas that you pulled together so compellingly in this article. You wrote in the new. York Times December into December two thousand fifteen called white debt, reckoning with what is owed, and what can never be repaid for racial privilege. I realized is I. Read You know what you've been writing for a long time? We've actually been living thinking. Around this subject for a long time and in fact. As you wrote in your notes from no-man's-land. It very much centers around themes of race and you actually have. A new family, a cousin WHO's of mixed race They're mixed race adoptions in their family. In fact, most of our families. If we trace them fully, we'd probably find this, but your mother's longtime boyfriend when you were a teenager was African American, numb. Yeah Yeah. You know this is something that I do. Try to resist the idea that there's something unique or special about the kind of racial makeup of my family, because I feel like that supports this idea that only people who are racially other have an entry way to race, and so that's I guess that's my preamble to the answer. Is that I I think you're right I. Think most American families are in one way or another somewhat racially complicated. Mine was maybe especially so end. Yeah, in my household. When I was growing up, was mixed and my step sister was black. My stepfather was black, so I was exposed I. Guess to people from a lot of different backgrounds, but I don't think that that is in America, all that unusual either and I I find one thing I love about this article you wrote, and in about your writing in general as you interrogate words just. Just individual words language that always appears in this conversation that we don't really know how to have interrogating languages wave searching for better understanding, so so the you know whiteness is there and one of the other words that you take apart. You say that the word complacence as you looked at the roots of that word yet, Amal that were that, in fact, it did not mean what you expected it to me, and then also quitter reflect on this. I was looking for word that would describe a kind of blindness. That wasn't even willful right. And when I looked at the meaning of the word complacent, it actually looked more intentional than the meaning I was searching for because I I think that that's part of the problem is the the attitude is highly unintentional. It's highly unexamined. It's relaxing into your own privilege without even thinking about it, and that again is one of the privileges of being white right is that you can coast through your experience? You can coast through your life without having to think about what your race means to other people and what you year existence in community means to the people around you yeah. You sight this essay by Claudia. Rankine Let. She wrote in The New York Times magazine after the Charleston the massacre in the church in Charleston. She wrote I asked another friend. What is like being the mother of a Black Sun? The condition of black life is morning. She said bluntly morning. Am Oh. You are an I. N. G. for her morning lived in real time inside her and her sons reality. At any moment, she might lose her reason for living. Though. The white liberal imagination likes to fill temporarily bad about black suffering. There really is no motive embassy that can replicate the daily strain of knowing that as a black person you can be killed for simply being black. No hands in your pockets, no playing music, no sudden movements, not having your car, no walking at night, no walking in the day no turning onto this street, no entering this building, no standing your ground, no standing here, no standing there, no talking back no playing with toy guns, no living while black, and you wrote sitting with her essay in front of me. Ask myself what the condition of white life might be. I know that we're complacence. Is something that you're floated on but I I? Wonder how you you know. How would you think about that question right now? What the condition of white life might be how to start to summarize that or to evoke that? Yeah well I. Guess my mind. It goes right to the particulars, and that moment that you read made me think of a meeting that I was recently at my son's elementary school I think because of Claudius friend, talking about her son, and the the question of how to keep him safe, and I was at a meeting that was parents discussing how we were Wayne to bring the issue of talking about race to the school community, and there is a huge range of experience in this room. There were parents who had not talk to their children about race at all, and there were parents for whom it was a daily. Daily concern and there was a Kenyan woman. There who was saying that the way her children looked every day had everything to do with how dangerous she understood it to be to be black in America and She talked about the way she dressed her two children and the way she taught them to talk to strangers and the way she taught them to act in public, and I was thinking about how how few of those concerns I had shared a specially around safety in terms of I haven't spent time training my son in ways of being polite, for instance, because I'm afraid that someone will kill him. And That doesn't directly answer your question, but it points back towards. The state white life or the state were in yeah. You know I live in a placid kind of high functioning. Leave it to beaver neighborhoods in Saint Paul Minnesota, the kind of neighborhood where you can you know moved here because your kids can get on their bicycle and Saturday morning and not come back until dinnertime. You don't ever worry about them, but. right around the corner from my house like five blocks from my house. Full Landau Casteel was shot. But the fact that we have to talk about this with our kids, because somehow even though we are inhabiting, our cities together were not. Having the same experience. very complicated and disturbing. When you start to look at it that way it is, it really is and you know. An article came out in Bloomberg News that was. Making the rounds of conversation in my neighborhood it was an article about Evanston township. High School which is the high school that serves everyone in Evanston so it's it's necessarily a highly integrated time. And A series of studies one of them done at Stanford and another done within the Evanston school. Districts found that in these integrated schools that we have in Evanston. black students in white students are not getting the same education, and so this is even within the same buildings with the same teachers within the same physical space and I think it's still unclear exactly what the nature of the problem is, but one of the phrases that came up in this article that one of the researchers used a phrase opportunity hoarding and they used this phrase to. what white parents do to make sure that their students that their children are getting more than other children are getting. And I really thought about both the opportunity hoarding that I had seen around me and the opportunity hoarding that I myself had engaged in in in one example of opportunity hoarding that I'm just remembering from this article was that for instance something a little over ninety percent of white students at Evanston township high school have taken at least one advanced placement class, and the numbers for African. American students are around fifty percent so there's many more white students disproportionate amount of students ending up in advanced placement classes, and there's probably a lot of. Of factors that feed into that right, there's a parent advocacy. There's probably some racial bias going on the part of the school. There's this probably dozens of different factors, but I think the reason that that term opportunity hoarding spoke to me as I thought well, that's something I can control for yeah, that's something I can watch in my own behavior, and that's something that I could have conversations with my neighbors around, and how were treating opportunities that are available to our our children, and whether we're ensuring that those opportunities are available to all the children in our community, and don't you think also I mean that's that's kind of. It's A. It's an unsettling phrase. Opportunity Hoarding. It also right, and you know when it comes to. Our children were so i. mean there's such a fierce drive that we have right to give them the best right to make things possible for them. It doesn't even. It's not a I think consciously about wanting them to flourish at the expense of someone else, but but what you're pointing out what that language makes clear. Is it in fact? That is what happens, and maybe I'm wrong that. Not Always that Yeah, and especially when we're talking about limited resources. If those limited resources are hoarded, it necessarily mean somebody isn't getting them. So you know this thinking got refreshed for me when I bought a house here. In Evanston am buying a house in getting a mortgage inspired me to do a little bit of research into. Housing laws and the history of redlining in my community and in the history of housing, discrimination and mortgage discrimination in Chicago and Tana, Hussy coats has written really beautifully about this, and especially in his piece the case for reparations. Very elegantly lays out a history of legalized housing discrimination and some of his examples his particulars come from Chicago and when you look at the history, you can see. A highly intentional, an entirely legal history of white people, hoarding both real estate and financial resources, like mortgage is at the expense of other people, and and even you know in the case of predatory lending. There's people making money at the expense of African American families who lose their houses because of the unfair loans that they've been given the poor terms of lending so. Buying a house was another moment where I felt that I was kind of forced to reflect on on how I was benefiting personally from a long history of. Racist policies in my country. I'm Chris Tippett, and this is on being today with the writer. You'll abyss and we're talking about whiteness. was just speaking with Isabel Wilkerson. He wrote the warmth of other suns and. Very much to that point you know she talks about when there was this exodus of six million African Americans in the twentieth century from the South to the north. They were still you know the they could only live in certain places in those certain places you know, turn out to now be our inner cities and we're charged exorbitant rates. Because they had no choice I wasn't. And that is built in. That is in the DNA of our of our cities. Right I. Mean you've started? That's the buying of the house was kind of the image that you worked within this New York Times. Piece of and then and really delving into the meaning of debt and the experience of debt. Yelm? And Yeah and Dennis well. Yeah the moral debt you know. What really broke that piece open I knew for a long time that I wanted to write about. the feelings I was having around buying and owning a house and and getting mortgage, but what broke that piece open was a conversation with my neighbors who had lived in Germany and one of my neighbors mentioned to me that the word for debt in German is also the word for guilt, and a kind of you know. That was very illuminating for me and. For a long time wanted to think about white guilt in a way that could be productive. You know both personally productive, but also socially and politically productive. It's a really a as a term. White guilt is pretty poisonous or even the notion of white privilege. Experience you know we're. We're very attentive to editorially when we put shows on the air around race. Around these issues that you could you know? You want people to listen. And I personally don't think. People get paralyzed or turn away. Because he don't care. Maybe it's true that sometimes they don't care, but there's a paralysis that sets in right It's about. I don't know what to do with this. I don't know how to make it better. and I think that's one reason you know one doesn't put guilt in a initial title. Right. But you make a really interesting. I think you're arguing for saying. Not Letting guilt. Be a bad word kind of honoring the fact that you're. Why Not Imagine guilt? As a prod a goad, an impetus to action isn't guilt an essential cog in the machinery of the conscience. Maybe we should try to. Let this word in welcome this word in. This conversation about race like I honestly think we. We talk about race when we talk about how we don't know how to talk about it I mean it's not even really like we do. Have a national conversation about race and Navy, because all at the word guilt enemy. Important Yeah and I do think you know co circling back to this question of you know. What's the state of White Life Yeah I. DO think the State of white life is that we're living in a house. We believe we own, but that we've never paid off. I also think that may be you know. Maybe the language that people could find more palatable right. It would be this this word responsibility. You. Know this this word that we associate with adulthood and. androgen shame, but that's that's another coloration of guilt. Right is that there's There's that meeting of the word guilt that gestures at responsibility because I am culpable for this I am now responsible. For and benefiting from yes, exactly exactly and benefiting from you know I. Think a lot of people want to wash their hands. Because the benefit has been indirect right and I think it's a lot of cases, culpability can feel indirect too, but it doesn't. It doesn't make it right. Right absolutely you know I have. I've the unusual situation of of living in a house. The House that we bought here in. Evanston has an identical twin. That's right next door to it, so we live in a little brick bungalow that is right next door to an identical brick bungalow in these two brick bungalows were built by brothers, and neither of those brothers live in the houses anymore, but our next door neighbor is an African American man who's been living in his house since I was born And so we have four white family living in a house that's identical to the House of the black family next door. which has given me some occasions for for reflection on the the differences in our lives, and the ways that we have or have not benefited from the systemic racism about around us, so one example of that is The before we moved into our house, the previous owner did a major renovation of the attic of this little bungalow and and I was describing this renovation to my next door neighbor over the fence, and he said I'd love to do something like that to my attic I would love to do it. I I want so much to to renovate our attic. I have wanted to, and he said but but I'm never going to have the money for that. And And this is a man who's worked his whole life He's worked for the Post Office for longer than I've been alive and he mentioned to me and off, and way he said you know. I have a lot of family members who are in jail and two are in prison, and that one of the draws on us. Financially is supporting the families of people who can't work and so that's just one tiny window. Right into how the criminalization of life is a draw financially I'm people who are not engaging in any activity right who never been accused of a crime never To. They're they're addicts to increase the price of their property? And all exactly exactly you know in my neighbor left off this conversation. We were talking and he left off by saying I. Guess God just didn't want to be rich. You know and and I said I. Don't think it's God. After a short break more with you'll abyss, you can always listen again and here the unedited version of every conversation I have on the on being podcast feed wherever podcasts her found. On being is brought to you by the John Templeton Foundation, harnessing the power of the sciences to explore the deepest and most perplexing questions facing humankind learn how their guarantees are helping to address the coronavirus crisis at Templeton. Dot Org. I'm Krista Tippett and this is on being today. We're talking about whiteness, an awkward inadequate, an urgent conversation. I'm with the author you'll abyss. Who wrote the important essay White Debt? I interviewed her in November two, thousand sixteen and her insights feel prescient in useful now. Fuel so good. To talk about this and There's a sentence you had. In the white debt piece I have written in a race one hundred sentences here. Trying and failing to articulate something that I can sense, but not yet speak. And, you know I may be reading into this, but The truth is this is also fraught, and there are so many things kind of coming to the surface that in part feel very shocking whether they should be shocking or not. You know violence and kind of seeing the roots of things we haven't seen have. I think one reason I. Appreciate that you work with language because language itself is so fraught and the wrong word. Can Be. Taken as an offense. Even though we're reckless with other words. Right. Yeah I do I think that this is is a major problem for us. In terms of talking about race, and is attentive of as I am two languages in is as sensitive as I am to it as a writer and as much as I believe that that insight can be found or lost through language. I do think that when it comes to racism, we pay too much attention to language, and we give language power that. I don't believe it actually has. When in fact I think there are. Many graver actions that are happening that happened without anyone ever saying anything, offensive and that a lot of our policing of offensive language. It's. Unimportant. It's not that people should be allowed to say whatever they want, but I feel that there's extra energy. Put into that policing, because we aren't sure how to address the real problems. And how to address the kind of systemic racism that happens without anyone ever saying anything that would look to us like racism. And I think that this is part of how were hobbling ourselves around coming to kind of broader and more advanced understandings around what's going on with race and about how we live together as opposed to? Just! How talked together House Speaker? We, can't I think if you can't talk about something? You can't think about something and I think I've worked with students who could barely let themselves think they were so scared of thinking the wrong thing. And so I. DON'T WANNA be misunderstood is making an argument for offensive language, but I guess the argument that I'm making is. That I think that we need a cultural atmosphere where we understand where the crimes are happening, right and that many of the crimes are not in the arena of language, but that we need to be able to stumble through imperfect language and imperfect sentences in order to find our way to where the crimes are happening. I have a friend WHO's in her late seventies and. She was a professor is a is a professor, and she told me story about in the Mid Sixty S. When civil rights was happening She had a close friend who was also a colleague, fellow academic. Who African American! And that they had a pact that. Will that pauline had a kind of agreement with her that. She would bounce things off her that she was going to say or write say. Is this racist right? Does this work is this offensive and. And I I love that story. Because it was it was self correction in the context of a relationship, and she was enough right to ask to be corrected as opposed to So worried about getting something wrong that she wouldn't say anything and I feel like we. We've had this illusion here. In Our twenty first century that we're way past that right like we should know what the wrong word would be or what the offensive thought would be or what the when the egregious Emission would be, and we don't you know. Sadly we should, but we don't and. I've wished you know. What if we could each have a friendship that as a safe space? Where we could air an ask to have. It pointed out lovingly us that we should get it right yeah yeah. Yeah I, and you know this is another way in which I really really strongly believe that you know for all the Wiz. White people benefit materially from racism that were very damaged by it and I think that this is one of the ways in which were damaged and the racists. Structures of our society cut us off from close friendships with people of color and that doesn't. Doesn't mean we don't have them right. But there's many ways in which were alienated from each other, and that's one of the things we lose that kind of productive conversation that can move a person's thinking forward, and can expand a person's not just there. You know acceptable vocabulary, but also they're real understanding. Yeah, their understanding in their presence in the world, their ability to move forward. It's also. Another. Very striking thing about this moment we inhabit. Is We've. Were aware of all this unfinished business. You know these things. We actually thought we'd made it so much progress on, but also seeing full circle. That the legacy of Whiteness is now costing white people. For closure, crisis or opiate addiction or the the white pain in the presidential campaign. There's a way in which a lot of what happened. To people of Color is now afflicting. White people as well like these systems didn't stay closed. Structures didn't stay closed. Yeah, I think where I see. It is in fractured alliances so. These disaffected poor white people see themselves as white before they understand themselves as poor right, so there's a potentially very powerful alliance between poor whites and blacks in our country, and that alliance has been undermined. And prevents flourishing defense. yeah. Giving to for those fractures to soften and follow away. Yeah and ultimately I think who it benefits is a very tiny tiny little segment of the society. I guess we're really you know. This is another way of talking about the one percent right, but part of how we've empowered. The one percent is by allowing other people to think that by virtue of their race they might have access to the one percent that all they need to do is work hard enough and try hard enough and be good enough and that they might get to belong or their children to belong or their children might yet. I WANNA I WANNA come back to raising our children and You know that's a primary place we can. Walk with this differently. you right very beautifully about. Britain in many ways about you know raising your son, the ordinary joys of life. You did mention awhile ago. How you wrote in that time space on white dead about. I think this must be what you're talking about. Somebody took exception to that when your son was four. he brought home a library book about the slaves who built the White House. Is GonNa read this I didn't tell him to. Slaves wants to counter for more wealth than all the industry in this country combined or that slaves were as Tana Hussy. Coats writes the down payment on this country's independence. Or that freed slaves became after the civil war. This country's second mortgage. Nonetheless my overview of Slavery Jim Crow Left. My son worried about what it meant to be white. What legacy he had inherited. I don't want to be on this team. He said with his head in his hands. You might be stuck on this team I told him, but you don't have to play by its rules. Yeah. And that you know. That you don't have to play by its rules. Part is of course easier said than done. Yeah, right? Yes, and I think that that for me is an ongoing parenting challenge, but it's also a challenge for me as an adult living adult life is where, and when do I do I? Refuse the rules riot. Wherein when do I? Defy expectations That are written into the social code I for me. It's tricky because rules are so important for both parenting and for education right so our children's lives are little nets of rules, and so I. think that it's it's actually pretty complicated. Nuance conversation to talk about. How do you discern whether a rule is unjust or not? And when you choose to violate it. You know you were talking a little while ago about the study about high schools AP classes so. I was thinking as you were talking about. You know my son went to A. Great big urban high. School. In Saint Paul. And We liked that about it that it was a big urban high school and it was diverse. But in african-amer, a new friend of mine, WHO's African American talked about taking his son to visit that school and being there at lunchtime. Being there at lunchtime and seeing this high school cafeteria where kids were kids where you have all these high school kids being high school kids in there laughing in. They're talking and it was very mixed. in the Bell Rings. And the white kids head up the stairs to the AP and IB classes and hardly any black kids. You know so you have this stark segregation and what feels so shameful to me. Is that I? My son has graduated now, and he had graduated by the point that I heard this story and I I knew that there wasn't that. There was a segregation going on that I didn't understand I didn't like, but I didn't. Like why it is our job right as white parents as much as it's the job of the parents of the kids of color. To not let this continue. Yes Yeah and that's I've been very inspired by a number of things Did I've read in in a journal. That's that's no longer being published called race traitor, and this was published by NOLDE natio the author of how the Irish became white and John Garvey published this journal for years and one of the stories I read in. There was about a group of parents who protested the selection processes in their school. That produced a gifted program in a school that was majority black The gifted program was majority white, and so so white parents protested this saying this. This can't possibly be the case. Case Right. Not all the gifted children in the school can be white, so there must be a problem with how we're deciding who gets into the gifted program? There must be something wrong here and I do think that that's That's our job right as as white parents is to to see that in no, it can't be true and then to try to whatever that system is. That's producing a gifted program that is. Entirely white at a school. That's mostly black to dismantle that system. Yeah again easier said than done but I, but I do think that there are in these particular cases. There are things that can be done if people say we won't have this I was also really inspired by a story that I heard on public radio here in Chicago. A couple years ago, about a group of students at a very wealthy public school, in Lincoln, Park, and these students were many of them. Them were white students who were protesting the fact that their school was GonNa get a major renovation that would cost a lot of money. and they were protesting on the grounds that they didn't think their school was the most in need of the public schools in the city, and they thought that it was unjust. City funds would be going towards their school when there were schools that didn't have enough textbooks to go around And I also found that story quite exciting and thought okay. We're getting somewhere here. I'm Kristie Tippett and this is being today, and what the writer you'll abyss and we're talking about whiteness. As! You're out there talking about this as you've gotten a reaction to the white debt piece Is there a difference in? How can people of Color respond to do? Hear from Non White People about? This I do I do I'm not sure this is answering your question, but I guess one of the things that surprised to me. In terms of response to my own work was that for the most part Meyer writing about race did not seem to make a lot of people very upset, and that worried me a little bit. To. Tell you the truth. Actually. You know I I think that's somewhat true especially, if if you're writer in this subject matter. You're probably not doing your job unless people are pissed off. That's an. Of A problem, isn't it I mean I I wonder if. You're just being kind of straight. You're saying. Let's talk about Whiteness your. Framing the question a little differently. Gosh. We've got to have a place for. Speaking honestly, that is not that controversial. Even if it's not everybody's experience, and yes, I don't know one of the things I've observed in education and this is something we. I don't feel like it's talked about a lot, is that? Learning can be really really upsetting and I do think that That it's fair to expect that. The A conversation that's as difficult as this. There will be flashes of defensiveness of anger of Of bitterness of ferocious resentment in that I guess the space has to contain that. There's something hopeful about. About taking in fury as a function of learning. I actually maybe it's because I have a terrible temper myself but I actually I am inclined to embrace fury in you know not just in an academic setting, but in you know in in a conversation in general in any essential conversation I think probably has the potential to set off some anger. So, so you know we live in this. We also another another aspect of this moment. Is that I hear language, and not just language, but intentions surfacing you know words like. Truth and reconciliation commissions for race and. Mercy you know I mean we were using words like mercy in conversations about public policy words like redemption I, feel are coming in and you. You have reflected on an NFL. This is a new opening you know to say. How do we live redemptive Lee Repair? It of -Ly. Rather than destructively that look like how does it start and again we and speaking as to white people that we have to? Craft and on kind of discover. That new way of living kind of one life and one action at a time yeah, though you know I find this. Super Embarrassing to talk out loud about really like no, it's feels really scary. Yeah and you know I'm I'm like already pre mortified about any of this being air on the radio. As much as I think I'm allowing this embarrassment to just wash over me because I, still like really deeply fundamentally believe in bumbling your way through a conversation about this subject. Because I think it is so important, we just cannot be silent because it's so inadequate. I think it's very inadequate yet. I feel like an anti. Also you know I as we talk I just feel super aware of my own like partial understanding you know, and and I feel like I'm constantly touching the edges of my own comprehension, and I'm aware that that I'm really not getting it all and. So, yeah, so it feels very uncomfortable. And an intensely mortifying. But I think to your point also. We need to also allow ourselves to have inadequate conversations. I think that we have to begin by getting it right or perfect completely, because it's not possible as you said, we're talking about generation upon generation and things that have been conscious and unconscious, and we don't know how much we carry around unconsciously I've got something we're learning of ourselves. You know the very first question. My son ever asked me about race. It wasn't that long after he started talking, so he was, he was somewhere between two and three, and he asked me I was anticipating a question like this but I did not anticipate the format took. He asked me why a friend of his head Brown skin, and I was expecting a question like that, but what was surprising, was that the French he asked about was someone who who would be considered white. and I think her background is Romanian? But but she's her features are European and she she moves through. The world is a white person, and so does her mother, but her skin is in fact darker than the skin of a number of other people. We knew who would be classified as black. So the very first question my son asked me about race was much more complicated than the question. I'd been anticipating. What he was asking me is. Why is this person with dark skin called white when there's people with lighter skin who we call black? What he was really getting at. You is a question that went straight to the inconsistencies in how we define race in this country yet right and. And some of the absurdity of it, some of the absurdity of oven. Somewhere you post these two questions together. Or these to. These ideas the things we do to each other out of fear the things we owe each other. Sale a little bit more about what would be on your list of the things we owe each other. Well again I think. This this is in some ways, very, you know. Very personal for me because I I do ask this question of myself for myself all the time but but one again one of my kind of private conclusions for my own self and this has to do with fear, but it's. It's slightly different. Is that I do feel that? We owe each other trust until that trust is broken. And And I think that that can be in practice incredibly difficult we live in a political climate in a political atmosphere that mix trust. Extremely difficult in a young even seem quite foolish, yes. Yes just trust in this particular climate And I think I think there's people who would disagree with me on this, and and probably rightly so I I guess that's just my way of saying that I'm not entirely sure that what I'm saying is right. I'm maybe even partly convinced wrong on this, but it's still something that I've come to. That is important to me. Is that in my everyday interactions with other people I feel that trust is something of radical act and I. I go to to great efforts to trust the people around me. and do you find that that is a risk that has rewards is to talk about the the paradigm of where do you find that? Many people in situations rise to that occasion that it's worth it beautiful through the airing on the side of trust. For me. It has been I for me. That's it's rewarding way to live. That doesn't mean that people haven't disappointed me broken my trust but it didn't. It tends when that happens to me, intends to be. In situations where I never would have anticipated it, you know and. I feel like this. This does come back to the question of fear I think. There's some people who feel that nurturing their own fear will will Will be a balm against danger. If if you just feel fearful, enough and often enough, you'll save yourself from the dangers of the world, and I don't think that's true. I think you get hurt either way so you. Know you get to live as a suspicious wary person paranoid who gets hurt or you get to live as someone who trusts other people and gets hurt, it's. I'm not sure if that's. That's really helpful and uplifting. In this term, if this in this context of of Whiteness You know what what do we owe us as white people you don't. This is a question that I do again I I'm asking myself all the time trying to answer in actually very concrete ways, and my answer is again constantly evolving and constantly shifting But I I do feel that. That I. Owe Action to the communities that I'm a part of. Those communities are various and overlapping, but for instance the whole reason I was in a meeting at my son's school to be involved in making race something that we're talking about in the schools and with children and with teachers when we're when we're doing hiring, and when we're inviting guests to speak and you know, and that's something I fail on to and. I feel that I also. Oh it to my neighbors. Not to reduce them to symbols right. To see them as people, and not as symbols or ideas or shorthand for. An experience that we assume a shared and may not be shared. Ula? Best teaches writing at northwestern university. Her books include on immunity an inoculation and notes from no-man's-Land American essays. Her writing has appeared in many publications including the new. York Times and Harper's magazine. The on being project is Chris Cagle. Willie Percy Laurent door doll Aaron. Soko Kristen Lynn Eddie Gonzalez billion vote Lucas Johnson Suzanne Burly Rose Siri Grassley Colleen. Check Cristiano Mortell Julie Cycle Gretchen handled and jolly. Come on, the project is located on Dakota. Land are lovely theme music is provided and composed by Zoe Keating, and the last voice that you hear singing at the end of our show is Cameron Kinghorn on being an independent production of the on being project, it's distributed to public radio stations by PR X.. I created the show at American public media. Our funding partners include the George family. Foundation in support of the civil conversations project the FETZER institute helping to build the spiritual foundation for a loving world. Find them at Fetzer Dot Org Kelly Paige Foundation dedicated to reconnecting ecology culture and spirituality, supporting organizations and initiatives that uphold a sacred relationship with life on earth learn more at Kelly pay, Dot Org, humanity, united advancing human dignity at home and around the world find out more at humanity united. Dot Org part of the. Group the Osprey Foundation a catalyst for empowered healthy and fulfilled lives and the Lilly endowment, an Indianapolis based Private Family Foundation dedicated to its founders interest in religion, community, development and education. On being is produced by on. Studios in Minneapolis Man.
Monitor Show 07:00 01-10-2021 07:00
"Slack is a new way to communicate with your team messaging. That's faster better. Organized and more secure conversations happen in channels that are easy to create. Join answer try it for free at slack dot com slack. Where work happens. When will you be able to go to a meeting where nobody smells like. Hand sanitizer bruno's but we can give you the latest business and financial news fragrance free swiss tease out. Some of what. You just said our tools in the toolbox for the fed does that point to the need for continued monetary support bloomberg radio the bloomberg business app and bloombergradio dot com is the mark that this is having on a younger generation bloomberg. The world is listening broadcasting twenty four hours a day at bloomberg dot com on the bloomberg business app and bloomberg quick. Take this is bloomberg radio now. A global news update four people were killed and two were injured in chicago shooting spree saturday. Wma says the shooting began early in the afternoon when the suspect allegedly entered a parking garage fatally shot thirty year old man sitting in a vehicle the gum and then went to a nearby apartment building where he killed a security guard short while later he shot a twenty year old man and critically injured in eighty one year old woman. The suspect then robbed a cvs pharmacy in nearby. Evanston then fled to a nearby. I hop restaurant where he fatally shot a woman. The suspect was then killed in a shootout with police officers the west virginia delegate who was arrested for being part of a mob swarmed the capitol building is resigning that madison with more. Derek admitted his letter of resignation to governor jim justice today. He wasn't a delicate for long.
Le Temps, Britains Best Political Cartoons and More or Less
"Hello and welcome to the stack this week. We're had to switzerland to speak with your home. Cushman from the evanston foundation on the recent acquisition of swiss daily paper little plus jamie perlman is back on the show on her beautiful fashion title more or less and we also discuss political cartoons within benson enjoyed the show From housing london. This is the stack. Thirty minutes of print industry analysis and i am fitna to share coming up on the show. We have jane pearlman for more or less magazine and team. Benson goes through the best political cartoons of the year. But i will head to geneva the city that will be the new headquarters of litter. The leading newspaper in french. Speaking switzerland the paper was recently bought by the evan tina's foundation. Although the media module foundations by newspapers is becoming common in other countries see carlotta benedetti's recent damani newspaper in italy which was featured on the stack a few weeks ago. This is still a new thing. In switzerland i spoke to your home. Cushman member of the board of the evan tina's foundation about the acquisition. And if this is the media model for the future foundation was actually founded a year ago based by with a very strong financial support from three major foundations in in swisscom. Auden french speaking part of switzerland. This foundation It's which actually rolex group watch industry. The other foundation is a foundation based in luzon and the third foundation is the michelle ski or leakage or for the writing which is also based in state of war and the three foundation decided with some also privates reports to create before estimates in this with a one very specific and clear objective which is to support the quantity media and chris in the french off of swim. So a board of directors was a year ago which is chaired by ronald shaw. With the former governor of geneva and other members such as a joke with former ambassadors recent basseterre to unesco in paris and captain leo with another member of the states of vo and myself. I was a journalist myself for ten years and i work in private. Sector in communication management so the objective of the foundation is related to support in high quality rests in this region in to encourage diversity of the media as you can imagine. We have received many requests this year since the land of the from year ago. Because we all know that the media landscape is is quite difficult at the moments with the shop. Increase in revenues cost structure the Very area efficient is why in a nutshell. The rational behind the creation of this show have seniors and of course one of our objective aboard wants to focus on the quality newspaper in the region. Which is low talk and e- indeed announced a week ago. The acquisition offer this newspaper daily newspaper from a year access. Pinger go and The closing of the transaction take place by the end of the year and we have a coercive objective and major steps to move ahead in the next months. But i can elaborate on that a bit later and Tell us a bit more about. Little is a very very important newspaper for the french. Speaking part of switzerland i believe is is actually one of the few dailies as well in the region so i think this is hugely important is a huge deal there. For the media landscape in the region it is indeed. Talloires was founded in nineteen ninety eight or twenty two years ago. It's the swiss reference for quality journalism. Jeez of course aimed at french. Speaking on the song is placing innovation at the heart of its approach of formation. It has a pretty interesting digital strategy as well which consists of offering high value added consent whether it is goes tax video as well audio in media creations and we talk develops a quite a giant approach to quickly explore technological innovations and new joystick practices and websites of saw currently gathers some half million unique users a month on average the french speaking switzerland group. Which as you may know has a population of over one point. Five million people looked. Oil is also offering iphone and android applications Dedicated to the us as well as ipad application at presented digital copy of the prince edition and the daily newspaper. It's daily newspaper covers of course swiss and international automatics economics finance culture. The certified circulation afraid saw is some forty thousand. She's nuts a high standard knowing the country but it's readership announced more than one hundred thousand people. According to the latest ran this of french-speaking in this is what the song is all about. And it's the original efforts. All the foundation of its own actually came from the merger off to other newspapers which were out there snap which was very well known not just in. Switzerland both saw other countries during world war two genetics nab Very widely read in all capitals of the world and The other newspaper was a new cottage on and their merger of these juniors papers created originally. Let's on twenty two years ago and she is your home. What will change it. Dettori really in the newspaper. I know for example that you know kind of the main office who move to geneva actually from the fan but any other changes that we can expect just to be very clear in the for national news is a non profit organization. As i said we have strong financial support from visa three major foundations to lounge and i would say give a very strong financial in sounding basis to this project the reason to transfer all the staff from from from roseanne to geneva is simply related to the fact that the phone national huntsville is supporting projects and activities which off most of them in geneva or on the territory of geneva this season in the statutes of the foundation. So that's why it's the reason the transfer of all the staff from route saw to geneva. We are currently working in the phone. Seo of into news. Two sets up a board of directors its own. The chairman of the board will be precisely who is a season and renown journalists was a war correspondent like i was myself especially covering russia east european countries. He will be the chairman of the board of the latin and actually We have designated officially designated yesterday to prominence managers as well one is debate. Had lehrer. who will be the general director often. It's always a former ceo. Eddie press and he was also heading the thing. Tanker avenue extremists switzerland. And the other key person. In key actor of these projects was designated yesterday a madman for nelson also area experienced former journalists in finance economics will be the editor in chief of the top beginning in january. First the role of the There is a working group with a asli and other experts. Including for instance mr dako with former head of the international red cross and this working group is working now to elaborate the editorial projects of little and To make sure that we have a very strong governance of the project as you know when you want to be successful in in business operations you need to very important elements the first one is of course To make sure that the project is financially. I m o in over the long term that you work on a sustainable project which is a case with the financial and moral setup. We've put in place with the news and the second key. Element of course is the quality of the governance of the management and We are very very focused on that at the moment to make sure that no. I don't wanna say we take the best and the brightest but we'd take very seriously the capacity our capacity to do to choose and to hire high quantity experts journalists who can really move Forward and make sure that sam. It's sustainable over the long term with a very clear editorial project and to make to make it clear the fornesco avenues wants interfere in the editorial line of luzon. We made sure to to have this double elements of offer sequence the foundations which supporting the phone national continues the best show. I've been to news itself which actually owns the newspaper. And then there's a kind of china's wool in the restaurant and the board of directors of the and the editorial staff of its own to guarantee from an ethical standpoint very important thing which is the fully independence independence of its offer editorial standpoint. There was your home. Cushion from evan tina's foundation. If you're in switzerland you can buy your copy of later in the best new newsstands. Also the show when essential for good newspaper to have is as mark cartoonist est depicting the stories of the day a man that pays close attention to the work of cartoonists is tin benson. Britain's leading authority political cartoons. He also runs. The political cartoon gallery and cafe in london just published his new book. Britain's best political cartoons two thousand twenty hereeast in with more. I've had an interest since i was a child. We used to have a political cartoon books. Hope but i only really started to immerse myself in political cartoons when i was looking for a subject for a phd. Because i used to teach history. But felt i really couldn't call myself a proper historian without doing some serious research because degree level you kind of touched the surface and you're basically working with second resources and so i tried to find something which would interest me and academically. No one else had looked out because it obviously has to be original research. And i scratched around for a couple of years and i realize how had sort of general interest in political cartoons. How about doing a phd on a political cartoonist. And it started for mary late then i thought having the cartoonist i would Research a gentleman. David loan is probably the most famous. Political cartoonist of the twentieth century have been ridiculed the hitler mussolini and created the character cuddle blatant. I decided that i would love original cartoon of his two to inspire me Through my research. And and i managed to acquire one and then i go into this habit of collecting original cartoon nods and then ended up with the gallery which is impertinent right. I mean tells it's the only cartoon gallery of it started. That's fantastic antonino talking about your book. Something that is so true. I mean apparently you know if you are a cartoonist. Indeed you basically don't retire. And i think there's been a lot of quote sarah of You know that's why a lot of cartoonists you know. Basically they work until the end of their lives. I mean. I think it's something that if you so close to that they. They can retire right. It's it's like a vocation it's like having the buzzer being involved in in sort of politics at the press in the news. They're always terrified that if they retire they will very soon miss it. And there's little chance to coming back because there are so few fulltime opportunities and of course they all go on a lot of them way too long. Their eyesight starts to go. You know the aging process takes place and they stoltze Thought to decline and at the same time it's interesting thing that the the job of cartoonist. Especially these days. I mean we've been hearing a lot from other countries as well. it can almost create wars cartoons. You know it is it is it is incredibly controversial topic for some and i'm sure there's a lot of challenges in being a cartoonist. At this day and age you know. The problem is cartoons sort of rely on on sort of stereotypes. So the national stereotypes. of course. it's a very unfair awful and it's about ridiculing mainly politicians because they tend to hit up they can attack those who can't defend themselves and really. The problem is being obviously where religion is entered the fray and i think religion should only be considered a topic for political caricature if attended the political arena. Serve the pope says something. Which is overtly political than i think he you know the cartoon is right to pick him up on it but to attack religion for the sake of it i think is not only wrong. 'cause religion is about faith and belief and i think it's wrong to be provocative to attack people's religion when it has nothing to do with the The politics of the day tim. Let's talk about two thousand and twenty. I mean that's more or less the year where you covert a here in your book. I mean what a year. I mean not only coronavirus but we had a general election here in the uk and so many other events. And i have to ask. I have to tell you think you know. Boris johnson liking or not. he is heaven four cartoonists. I would say Because of his face and appearance. I think he's a very easily is kind of character to be portrayed on yes we've been lucky i mean although other competitor trump there there were slightly fewer opportunities. Should make fun of it but yes. Boris is a some stage. sometimes these characters like trump. I'm boris tend to satirize themselves. It has been a wonderful year for call tune. Considering we we had the general election of of the diversion year which is competent in the book and then of course conveyed outbreak and of course the presidential election in america have dominated. The book and the interesting thing about conveyed is actually most viruses. Illnesses are actually very difficult to portray to visualize in an image but this covid thing which of course is like has a very distinct shine. You know this this'll bull thing mushroom stalks coming out to is on the Great with in fact. The new series of spitting image. They've created this character. Cooed koroni which is of course the virus which trump befriends i believe in what episode yet quite enjoyed. Actually the return of spitting image. Any antony's interesting here in the uk literally every single daily newspaper here in the uk. You know have a celebrated cartoonist. I mean of course other countries have it as well. But i few a few in particularly here in britain. They are very important still they. All i've seen before. But i couldn't do this book in any other country in the world apart from possibly australia. They have version. But you know you'd think in america especially now editorial cartoonist would be flourishing. I'm there narrowing the handful of the considering the thirty forty years ago. There were over three hundred. In the country we have a wonderful heritage brinson applicable cartooning. Going back hundreds of years. I'm the fact is that what is distinct about britain in comparison to other countries as that we have a lot of national newspapers so call tunis become known around the country not just in the locality of which they work very much and i was going to us ten. I've ever tried actually to be a cartoonist. As well or did you give it a go or go to. Because i came from an academic congo and i liked to write about them. And i think there's an advantage to not being a cartoonist. Because there was a it was a culture musical mel calman. Who's a pocket cartoon is times and he how to coaching gallery in the seventies and early agents in london lost a cartoonist. He was doing it to further his own career. So i'm not actually in competition. With so it's much easier to work alongside of the cartoonists and get them to cooperate in nisa. This great venture listen to in the book is a joy and i think people will enjoy because i mean we had such a so many things happening this year and i think he's been portrayed very well by the best tunis here in britain and you did a good job compiling all of those. Thank you so much i do find the worst things get the better. The book cats inside really there. we go. i'm sure the world series for humanity. The battle is for britain's best was team benson. Britain's political cartoons. Two thousand twenty is out now. And now i had the pleasure to speak again of jamie pearlman editor and creative director of more last magazine. A bi annual fashion tied the prioritize sustainability in the fashion industry. The fun title is in its fourth issue. Already the new issue has a few eye-catching covert from close vinnie in a pro biden. Kover to eddie campbell. With a boiler suit made of kant's here is my chat with jaime issue for is out and what a beautiful issue it is And jimmy first of all. I mean there's some fantastic co versus And one of them cloven e with a president biden shirt. That's fantastic. And i have to say i'm sure our listeners. They like the little details. There's a lovely poster inside. I think could be very valuable in the future. You know i should hope so yes i think. I hope everybody's putting who has a poster is gonna put it up somewhere so that everybody can see it and actually since we're talking The t shirt was made by mark henley an artist who's in new york and we've actually printed a limited edition amount of the same gay for joe t shirts and they're gonna go in store at dover street market new york and la tomorrow so you can go out and buy your own. That's fantastic and and jimmy. Of course remember last time. We spoke about sustainability. You know about the climate crisis which are topics that more or less covert indeed and also a little bit of politics. Do you think you know you saw those kind of I believe you always believed that fashion. Shoot talk about those things but you think fashion magazines. In general the are becoming a little bit more political. I think I think right now. The world is sort of i think integrity prevails. I think the message of integrity and having meaning behind anything. You say has more resonance because everyone is. I think in a much deeper place. I think fashion can be very shallow. And i think right now you know fashion magazines publications in platforms that have a bit of integrity in more of a deeper message behind. They're saying that's truthful transparent. I think they have a lot more residents with people today. Just because of the state of the world and and what's going on out there and a few even designers brands they are a little bit more open for that. Because i know you've worked in fashion for quite a few years now. If eating the cost was was always in the out lawyer. You know that okay. This is the kind of the eco-friendly designer. And then the rest was really listening. When i think this is changing right. Yeah i think it's it's got to change. I mean we have absolutely no choice. You know. I think what's what i hope will prevail. Actually after while. I mean i think from now forward you know. It's interesting to see lots of big brands making changes and small steps towards doing things better. Which is obviously very important. But i think we need to. We need to look past that and stopped doing. There's a little bit of greenwashing going on. And i think we need to be careful. I think brands need to actually make real changes or at least if you're gonna make baby steps baby steps have a very long term goal in mind that's attainable for brand. Because ultimately i think every brand should be thinking about totally redoing their business to be fully sustainable in the coming years. And we don't have a lot of time so i think it's one thing to do a capsule collection that scott like recycled materials. But actually people should be looking at doing their entire main collections in a much more responsible. Eco friendly way will talking about know recycled materials and other amazing kover. Which actually is the one. I have in front of me. Eddie campbell on the co vermin way. Love that one. What especially onesie i mean. Can you tell for our listeners. Who perhaps don't have a magazine front of them. Yeah we love that so. This was actually shot just before lockdown since been sitting on this cover since march. We are so thrilled to finally release. The cover was shot. By the amazing oliver hadley perch and one zero was made by charlotte collapsed. Who's incredible fashion stylist in paris. And she has her own sort of kind of jokey label called kazakh. Oh i think it's it's actually very seriously important. And they use all kinds of recycled materials to make really kind of outrageous outfits. You probably wouldn't Where everyday but they're very fun and fashion shoots. And i think the cover made a real statement. Actually i wanna to wear one. I think you should. I think it would look very good on you. Jim in another question. I mean you mentioned that you were sitting in this covert since march. How did covid nineteen affected the production of more or less. Because i few special even for some fashion magazines did disrupt the way you know. They make their magazine. I mean the world was completely in cao's in the first months and there's still quite a lot of kind of back and forth depending on the country. You live as well. Yeah i it was tough. I mean we had a whole list of content. That was planned and it totally changed and in a sense you know i mean. It's good that we didn't shoot that much because the state of the world completely changed the Things we had planned initially weren't as relevant as the things we ended up doing it lent us the actual lockdown Lent itself to doing some really cool shoots like brian. Listen went around and new york when the streets were completely empty with a model and a bag of clothes in a van and shot all these up and coming new york designers Just to demonstrate the resilience of new york city and ariza a model. Justin these empty streets. Kind of half-naked hearing these independent designers so that was really powerful. shoot another -nother she. We did during lockdown with katie holmes. A fashion stylist had decided to start taking pictures during lockdown into the portrait's and she did a shoot of all sustainable jewelry. I'll shot on herself. And it's really beautiful and i think a lot of artists really really took the time you know. A lot of people have found new ways of producing creative materials and things during lockdown and it was very challenging but interesting in creative times. Well and jamie. I mean what i like about the magazines very consistent. I mean of course when you talk about sustainability is now that you're just as you rightly said. Oh just a capsule collection here and there. I mean the whole fashioning in the magazine is is sustainable. Way and there's a story behind that must be quite challenging as well I would say yeah. I think But that's also you know having those restrictions and limitations. I think in a way it almost makes things easier gives gives everybody a theme to follow. And you know there's so much happening. This is the most important movement in fashion right now in there so much. New stuff happening the whole younger generation of designers. They really prioritize sustainability. So i think there's a lot to say there's a lot more to be said. It's only the beginning really jamie pearlman for more or less magazine. Well that's it for this week's show my tank store editor not a whole and if you have any comments or queries few free to write to me do at fb and monaco dot com and remember. We're back next saturday at the same time you can listen to the show again at monaco. Or subscribe to it on apple podcasts. Spotify or soundcloud and the monocle twenty four app as well before i go a little song for you. It's aqua with cartoon heroes. You've been listening to the stack fernand august by share and to next time. It's goodbye from me.
"Hey Guys Willie geist here with another episode of The Sunday. Sit Down podcast. Thanks as always for clicking and listening along I got a good one for you this week. My guest is emmy winning actor producer writer director. And everything else you can possibly be in Hollywood lean away. She is truly one of the brightest young stars in Hollywood. Lena won on her emmy writing an episode of Master of none. That's the Aziz on. Sorry show she also starred in the episode entitled Thanksgiving which is the story of her coming out as gay to her own family she also created and wrote the show the shy which has a big audience on showtime in her current film. It's called Queen and slim. It's got a lot of people talking. We'll let her explain the premise of the movie. Some of the controversy behind the movie You also might know her from ready player player won the Steven Spielberg Film. He hand picked her to be in that movie. And she's GonNa be starring in Westworld coming up as well. She's got a lot going on her. Life comes from Chicago ago. When she was a teenager she moved to Evanston Illinois which is on the precipice of being suburb? It basically is a suburb but a close in suburb and she. She talks about how moving to that more diverse area around Chicago so broadened her view. She'd gets into a bunch of her. Inspirations interesting for a young woman to grow up wanting to be TV. TV writer not necessarily an actor because of the shows the faces in the story she saw on TV like the cosby show in a different world. She's a fascinating woman. A talented woman. Great to talk to. I think you're going to really like if you don't already know lean away. F- this is your introduction to one of the biggest stars coming up in Hollywood here now. Oh my Sunday sit down. Conversation with Lena Waif Lena thanks for doing this. I appreciate it. Thank you for having. I told them about an hour out from having finished my heart's still beating out of my chat. Yeah congratulations it's incredible. Thank you let's go back to the genesis of it. How it came to you? James Frye bought the idea. Yeah I mean how did start. I was at a party thirty in Hollywood as they say I was with my wife and I was just standing there. James Free came up to me and I know no who he is the introduce himself. He's had this idea for a movie that I can't write and worst idea. And he's like a black man black woman on the first date on their way home. Kippur police which is never a fun thing person things escalate very quickly. They killed a police officer in self defense and decide to get in the car and just go and I was like yeah. Yeah you can't write that but I can. I think it's a really interesting idea interesting. Starting point he had he had an outline another title and I was like. I don't want any of that that a- and I was like you know obviously fairness I'll share story credit because you plan that the seat but I really wanted to grow the tree on my own and do it myself. And he didn't have any issue with that he was like go for it. And so I did and I really just started the process of developing these two characters that were kind of become algorithm for all of us as a as a people And just sort of what it's like to try to survive and find joy and love while drowning and oppression. So did you change his idea. Much in other words was his a story story like A. Yeah I think I think he had some some thoughts about it I had different thoughts. I really wanted to to really take it from. I wanted to have have a jumping off point for me for a movie and so yeah but the thing about the first day in them getting pulled over the killing police officers and all that stuff stay but everything else around it I really they created and defined the world of my own to as you took this kernel of an idea. What did you see in it that you said I can tell a bigger story about our culture popped out at me? I just sort of thought about because the relationship between black people and police has been so fraud from the beginning of time That's the thing when you look at civil rights footage and you see young vibrant college students protesting or doing sit ins and you see the police department. Sticking dogs on them. FIREHOSES firehoses Beating with batons. It's sort of this weird thing that we as citizens are supposed to believe that police are here to protect and serve us and then over the history of the Rodney King or whatever it may be We just doesn't feel that way if feels like that's not what the police police are here for when it comes to us and even in the film. I'm very nuanced about the police. I know that all police are bad and that they're not monsters We're all human beings Trying to figure it out. And we've all we have these judgments and these things that we're thinking about each other that may not be based on fact but more so based on what we've been told what we've been taught to believe I believe and so that's really what I want to play but also I went to. I wanted the movie to be a meditation on blackness and all that comes with that because to be black is beautiful but it also can be traumatizing at times and I wanted to cover all those things so so yeah I I saw it as a beautiful jumping off point because I thought to myself I said there was a story about two black people killing a police officer. Some people think they were heroes. Some people think they were crazy. Some people might think they're official AUNTIES and I wanted to explore all of those ideas and how that would affect these two normal people who are just living their lives and trying to go along to get along so one of the great things about all your work. I think it's fair to say that you come from a personal place right. I mean all the won an Emmy for writing episode about your own experience right about coming out and entire series the shy about your in your life right. So what did you bring to this from a personal point of view that you could speak to so much I mean I think it was really. There's a a little bit about black community by family about religion about what legacy means to me and I can be both minds ends that on one hand. It's about like what does it mean to matter. So on one hand you may think I have to bend the world to really leave. Something behind could also argue. Argued wasn't enough for us just to exist in the world and live a quiet dignified happy life but we have been taught to believe well. That's not exciting. And I think I wanted to honor lives like that where someone gets up and goes to work every day you know takes care of their kids like you know is doing all the right things and just trying who just happens to pursue life love and happiness and that is everyone's right and but for some reason I think in our society. We started to think that. That's not cool. Oh I think it's extremely cool just as cool as if somebody would have been the world. I think it's I think to me Barack Obama and the guy that you know picks up your garbage every week are are equally important and I think that's what I was trying to get at this to. It is incredibly powerful obviously from that first scene which sets off all the action the film to the very last scene that we were just discussing which I won't give As you set out to create this story obviously you're casting at you. Want to find the right people get in it but how did you wanNA tell this story. So that rolled out in such a truly powerful way. I mean I think a big thing for me was to tell it with complete autonomy. I didn't want notes from white. People Know Shay to white people. I just felt lake from the beginning of time we've had movies told to us and your English and I feel like black. People have a language that we speak. We have a broken English to a little bit of a southern a little bit of city and a little data slavery like we have a broken English and I wanted our native tongue to be front and center and this movie and much credits everyone involved. They agreed when I said I want a final about what goes on the screen. I want final cut about what goes on the page and everybody was like. Yeah sure that makes sense and what we got was is a product that feels different. If feels unique it doesn't feel like anything else because it isn't touched by the white gays and I think we have a right to have movies like that because Casa Blanca Glauca gone with the wind. You know all about Eve was it of all these. These history of films that have been told from a wide perspective. That black people have seen in a bunch of times to. We're fluent in that language. We know how cinema has communicated to us about our society about who we are as a people and I just thought it was time to I. I want to tell our narrative in a way where people have to show up and learn about our culture and how we walk through the world. And that's not easy right. You WanNA challenge some people. Oh Yeah it's not easy for you but also for the audience you know somebody who goes in and watches that and go. Wow that I mean as I said that sets off the actual at the officer you go. Wow that's intense. Yeah so did you want to make people feel a little bit uncomfortable. People like me who said watched Yeah I think everyone's GonNa feel uncomfortable with that with that scene when they get pulled holdover. Because either you've been in that position where you've been behind the wheel or or you relate more to the person pulling them over and curious about where they're going or why they're swerving while they he missed turning signal and my big thing was humanize every person in that scene there are no villains and heroes and this movie. It's not black and white There's so many shades of gray that even like for it was important to. PF people pay attention to that. Scene is purposely ridden on the on the page on screen that you see a picture of the police officers family on the dads but when he does get in the car you know and that's my way of reminding people he has kids at home too. He has a wife waiting for him. These are all people and we keep bumping up against each other all the things that we aren't even apart it really is our history coming back and haunting us We haven't been able to shake The prejudice that our society is still so you know wreaking of I can hear. It's interesting. You say no heroes no villains because I can hear some people who might watch that scene in the movie that files and go oh well there are no heroes. Why are they the heroes of the story? They Killed Amanda Beginning of the movie. So what would you say to someone. who has that feeling after watching the Phil well? It's interesting you know. I'll say that we he killed police officer celluloid. It is a movie it is fictitious. Black people are killed by police officers in real life almost every day and that is not a movie for us. That's real life. We watch these stories like everybody else and it is traumatizing because also usually a week or two later. We hear the a follow up to the news story which is always inevitably that the police officer has been released back on the force and they're out there on the street again and so it tells us that I live. Don't really carry a lot of value and it makes it scary to be walking around in the world or God forbid be pulled over our police officer because you don't. I know how that can wind up so we really wanted to do was flipping narrative so if anyone is upset that we're you're seeing violence police officer on a movie screen. Imagine what it's like to see it happen to real life and nothing happened because of I told you a minute ago off camera that I interviewed. Carrie Washington weeks ago and we had the conversation around American son of what it's like to be black and pulled over and I you know as a as a white man. It took me until just a few years ago. Having friends say to me. Oh Yeah we we tell our sons and daughters and you can pull over. There's a routine here's what you do and I didn't know those conversations were happening. Is that a personal experience for you as well that you brought to this film. Well it's interesting. I haven't had that much of a violent experience experience with a police officer but I've been pulled over before and of course and that doesn't drink. I don't even have a speeding ticket so you would think if getting pulled over. I'm going to be calm. It's not the case yes I am. Yes sir no Sir yes you can start this because I want to go home I wanna make it home so therefore our absolutely become Obedient and compliant It it'll I will literally turn into like a slave trying to find papers when I get pulled over police officer but that's not fair fair. That's not cool. You know autism hours over the rights to get an attitude or a certain my rights or talk back but we don't have that right especially if you wanna Survive uh-huh so what do you want people to feel when they walk out of this film. Is it something different for everybody. Or what's the statement. You WanNa make. Yeah you know the thing is I believe Nina Simone says it is an artist duty to reflect the times. And that's what I'm trying to do. I'm being reflective of the society in which we live and it's not pretty all the time time especially right now and we can't ignore that and I think as an artist I'm trying to show us our reflection. We WanNA look at it or not and because I think we can beautiful sometimes as Heidi. We've seen that. We've seen those those feel good stories about people helping one another and being a good neighbor and doing charitable things. Well we also could be really ugly and I'll have to go down that list because it's very long so we're both and I want people to take away from it. What they bring to it? You know it's like there's going to be some people that hate it. Some people that love is some people that think is irresponsible. Some people that think it's about time some people think it's a classic you know I've heard all of it but to me. That's good art is. It should be a debate. It should be subjective. I don't WanNa have everybody across. The board feels the same way about because that means I didn't do my job. There should be enough nuances in it. That people can make an argument and say well I think this or I think it should have gone that way or if they did. There's maybe it would end this way. You want those conversations you want that dialogue also would ask themselves. Would I have done this scenario. I'm siding with her or why didn't why did he. Why was he so compliant Brian? Why was she so loud? Like everybody has a difference of opinion. And I think that's welcomed. I WanNa ask you about the cast to amazing group of absolutely because it could run. The risk of becoming this like chase movie thriller never does that Right. I wanted to stay away from that. It wasn't that I mean the throat was there but it was more more subtle when you put together the cast. What were you looking for? Well I can't take credit for Daniel. He casts himself. He read a very early draft. We happen to have dinner dinner. You know when I na and he was what are you working on what was it. What's next as this feature about you? Know these two people that killed police officer and self defense. He's I wanna read it. I want to read it and I was like okay early. Man I don't care I want to read it so he did. He read it in a couple of days later. He hit me and said I am slim. I have to be slim and I say okay. Oh man okay. That's flattering. Hold on. I'll say I want Molina to direct. She hasn't ready yet. I said but I'm going to do in the past. I'm going to get it to her. And if she decides is to direct the movie who clements Lamar have to be a conversation between she and I so if you down hold a B and he said I'll wait wait so he did wait a couple of months because it took a beat for me you get to reading it and She did and she said Hey. I want to direct great. Guess what Dan was and she was like. I don't see him as slim them. I wouldn't have either there. But now after he mentioned it to me. I can't get him out of my mind is interesting. So why wouldn't why didn't you see him. I I don't know I don't don't think of actors when I'm writing or even right after I like for casting to surprise me so I'm just that's just how I am and so but if I was thinking I don't know if he would have popped up for me for whatever reason so and I think it's the same thing with Molina. He's the guy from get out now. I don't see it so just go will sit down with him out of respect that you give them five minutes fine fine so she goes to sit with you and I'm waiting for my on my because I'm like what is this about to be five hours. Lehto she calls me and I was like I hope you still like him. 'cause I offered him the role at the table and I was like great. Yes yes and so then. It was three highway. It was accidentally package my movie. And so now you've got Molina over here. Louie over here you got me in the script and the Tau now like was like what do we have to get it because I think there's this weird narrative that must've been difficult this movie made. How did you get it on the screen? The system the system came after us they. They saw the potential. And what this movie could be. And that's not thinking Leinen. I really sort of opened our eyes. Say Wait a minute. We got the leverage year. They want us us. So let's ask whatever we want and we asked for final cut because we wanted to have complete autonomy. I wanted everything on that screen. Every word every look every glance to be intentional attentional purposeful and it is so when people say Queen this lab. You Getting Lean Molina all day and I wanted to shoot it and release it in the same year because I knew how urgent this was. I didn't WANNA do test. Screenings Down Langley was might WanNa do at least one just in case. There's something missing. I said fair enough but it had to be all black. She was like okay. And I'll say it. Whatever they saying that screening? I don't have to be forced to do it because sometimes we don't even know as honest what we need. You know since I wanNA push us a little bit further. We may be ready for right so she was okay fair enough And we also wanted a lot of control of the marketing. That's what I think. The billboards look a certain way. That trailer feels a certain way. Because we didn't want to just make the movie we wanted to be neutral of how we rolled it out and I wouldn't use that in Hollywood people watching this realize it never happened and the big thing was we wanted to break take a new actress. Since we had Daniel Khalil was very recognizable. We wanted to bring a new face and we want her to be Brown skinned and nobody blinked it up. They were like fair fair fair. You got it at. We're like awesome. Then we'll sign that lie and we really. That was the thing we knew our power we knew are worth and we demand it what we deserved. Doesn't that speak to the position. You've put yourself in Hollywood now though with the success of the shy which got its third season adulation thank you so much. And you're winning Ami and everything else you've sort of put yourself in that place. I can even venture to suggest any of that to a movie studio alone have them say yes to it. Yeah I mean I think it was a combination of the fact that I had kind of You know have a feather to my hat. And they were kind of. Can't deny you look okay. I know what you're doing a little bit But also I think it was the power of the script. I think people really look that script and understand that I was doing something a little different and something that really kind of had been done before but also to. I think it was the power of the fact that Molina you know have been building her resume and people are very excited about her first feature. Daniel obviously didn't hurt because of the heat that he had and so it was really. We are a product of black community when people come together and we're stronger together than we are alone and I think it was the combination of all those things and also to really you know grateful to make ready the Pam Abdomen Brad Weston. Who really fought hard to get in there with us and become such great collaborators? who had a deal with universal and we love how I universal released? Get out how they released Outta Compton which were very like specific niece black movies that they made temple so I was really impressed with how they were releasing content content with black people at the center of it and not treating them like small independent movies for rather really big event films which is how they really rolled out cleanest lent which has been so exciting. The big reason why a broad audience is is excited about the film and not just a certain pocket of people in all those movies did well. To salute became huge awards and everything. Yeah Yeah Yeah. I don't I never liked to ask somebody that's been I'm going to ask anyway. The awards chatter. That's out there. I know it's early jinx and all the rest but do you hear that. Is that exciting citing. Does it matter to you. I do hear it. I think to me I really want the culture to appreciate it. That's what we do it for. You know we want our people to come come up to us and say thank you. That's to me the greatest reward but also know what awards me. I've got one of them. You know so. I know that it increases the visibility. Also makes is it easier to get things done but also to cosign from your your your your community because the Television Academy or the Motion Picture Academy. They're made up of a lot of people who work in the business or do what we do so for for them to say. Hey we think this is good. Oh we think you could be a part of this just like elite club of films that we want to honor and hold in high regard for a very long time. I'm I do. Welcome that because I think that movies like this. This deserve to be in those conversations because more than not it is. The White House is like mostly predominantly white casts. White direct is also reserved for films like dad but I think seeing get out best original screenplay saying Moonlight won best picture. Those moments are really huge. Black Panther being nominated in the best picture category does moments really show us that not only do deserve a seat at the table but we deserved to sit at the head of it and to to have our own table And it's a build our own table you know. It's not just about asking for permission. But we deserve to be in those conversations like everybody else. You're going to be at some of those tables I think so. Let's see let's the cable see what happens. Hey guys thanks for listening to the Sunday. Sit Down podcast stick around to hear more from lean awaith right after the break. Hey it's josh megawatts from dateline. Do you need your true crime fix on the go. Dateline episodes are now available in podcasts. Mysteries with the twist from dateline. Subscribe now so you don't miss an episode. Hey It's Chris Hayes. Sometimes it's good to just take a step back from the day-to-day today onslaught of news and take a broader. Look the issues. That's what I'm doing each week. My podcast why is this happening. We're exploring topics ranging from school segregation to climate change. The way that I think of it is climate change will be to the twentieth century. What maternity west of the nineteenth century? It'll be the central subject of questions about economic justice. Everything you care about in the world will be affected by climate and digging deep with guests uniquely qualified to analyze issues from mass incarceration to race relations. As you know for the first time in our history at the National Sean level whites are on the verge of losing their majority status in twenty years. And I think it's no coincidence that our politics are getting more tribal. Join me for. Why is this happening? New who episodes every Tuesday. Wherever you get your podcasts? Welcome back to the Sunday. Sit Down podcast now. More of my conversation with Lena Waif the shy. I ask you about that as well just because to me again. You've so been able to do things that come from you. which is unusual? Just the the way you were able to sort of control this film. Tom Is to be able to produce things that are meaningful to you. Where did the shy come from in terms of your background? And what did you want to say about the city and the culture well I'm from Chicago and very proudly and but I would see so many news stories about Chicago about the violence about issues. The city was having and look because I'm from there. I think I look at it from a different Lens and I know the people there I know how special it is. I know there's a culture. There's a community eighty there that often gets lost and some of the new stories so I really wanted to do was to humanize the people. Chicago's Best I could and I think a lot of times particularly black young men and Chicago Chicago are categorized as the gangsters heartless people and I'm just like no. I grew up with those there. I think you know didn't like my brothers others and and even though they may not be perfect they're not monsters and I thought that to me that's how they're being portrayed in the news and I didn't appreciate and that was the reason why I sat now started writing in it Brandon Kevin. Ronnie Ronnie was with my uncle who listens passed away. I grew up with a kid named Kogi literally. That was nickname Ethel his first name. You know all these things like I literally pulled from my family. Our community our lives to sort of really show people what Chicago feels like what it looks like and it looks like human beings trying to figure out this thing called life and I'm so grateful that people really tune in appreciate these characters and obviously this new season. We're going through some changes for sure but after like it's the most grounded and most human season of the show we've ever ever had because it really I had to go through adversity with the show. I we lost a cast member of to cast members actually and it was a scenario in which I I had to really dig deep and remember that the the shy is bigger than one person. Literally and figuratively Chicago is made up of so many people and we got. It's a really give some of these other characters new characters a little more real estate to to come in and tell a new story about this city that I love is that big responsibility to be the one who's going to tell the story of the city you love like okay. This is what the world is going to see Takagi. I better get this right. Do you feel that. It's tough tough hitter. You can't believe everyone of you can't so I don't even try you know for me. It's more about how honest can I make this for me. You know and again they can never be just one show about Chicago because Chicago is so vast and there's so many different kinds of people that live in that city you could tell eighteen shows about Chicago and they never could even touch. I teach other because there's also so many little pockets so many little neighborhoods in Chicago as well. Most people aren't even aware of so we're talking about certain pockets on the south side right and we also ventured to the west side every now and then but we there's no way to cover that whole city in just one series. We're trying to talk about individuals in the city and how that city has affected them And how city can hold onto you and never let you go or did he can feed you. How sometimes it can make? Are you frustrated how you can fall in love in that city you can get a job lose a job in that city. It's really more about telling the human story rather than just I'm trying to make everyone that lives in that city field height. Oh Yeah. That's Masha cargo. Everybody has a very different version of the city. And so that's what we try to remember. It's like hey this is our version of Chicago. What makes your perspective so interesting? We were talking about this before we started is that you have the different views of the city on the south side going to Evanston and and how that sort of informed you culturally and allowed you to tell some of the stories absolutely. Yeah what was it about that sort of mixed from the south side and Evanston they made your point of view so interesting well forward. A big thing for me was when I was on the south side of Chicago I only really encounter black people. That was my experience. You know up until I was twelve of years old and I loved it was amazing. It was great I was like Oh this is such a wonderful utopia then. I moved to a suburb. It wasn't too bad. Evanston is pretty diverse. It's not skokie no shave skokie. Evanston has a little bit more diversity and but still I was very much a culture culture shock for me. I wasn't used to that I was in school. They didn't feel like the school. I was in the south side which we try to tackle on the season. The shy about what. That's like when you go from you know this school to a more private school and how that affects how you walk through the hallway a little bit and so it definitely expanded my perspective effective because I talked to folks that ordinarily probably wouldn't talk to and befriended people that ordinarily wouldn't befriend and I think it made it so. I'm a better artist because of that today I really really having that exposure to a different neighborhood And then also too and I went to Columbia College in Chicago. Which is downtown Lou sort of being there and meeting People Columbia was also a unique perspective? I think for me it was really about meeting different. People and hearing different perspectives just sort of expands my mind in terms of how I want to tell stories of how to write characters up until this day I was reading some stories about you and the growing up you love. TV watching shows like cosby. Show you all the ones that we watch but you dreamed about writing those shows. Oh yeah the rest. I was trying to be Theo or wherever started. Show I write your young remind you were going to write. Those shows interesting perspective for young person. And how did you get to. I want to create that show not be on it other than I wound up being being on a show but really came from a teacher. You Know Fifth Grade Star bonus she was like Hey Turner Droop Academy Chicago. She he's like I look forward to reading your paper every week because you right the way you speak and as a fifth grader. I didn't really understand what that meant. But I knew that it was a compliment complement and I knew that she was highlighting something that I did. Well which was writing and I think I just always felt like that was my superpower to right and tell stories but also I loved watching television so I was gonNA marry those two things and say how can I tell stories on the television and but also I knew how those those stories impacting me. Yeah I mean. Production Companies Helmand grab productions which is taken from the fictitious hugh that they attend on a different world because that's how significant that show it was for me to see those images and those are very aspirational images because somebody could argue that. That wasn't my reality. Of course not. I wasn't in college yet. I wasn't old enough to even be thinking about it. I didn't know what to historically black college was until I watched a different world but it really showed me that black people could be smart educated and cool and fashionable and fall in love live and learn about Malcolm X.. and Dr King and all these things I mean that show to me still is lightning in a bottle and and you Kinda can't recapture there's always wanted want to make a different world again. I'm like it was a moment in time but I'm grateful for that moment because if it wasn't for that show I wouldn't be sitting across from me right now. By the way all those things we had the same impression young the white kids vision even though a specific as it was it was number two Nielsen Ratings. The cosby show a different world. And you don't get blacker than those shows. Even though they were very they were very easy to watch and very universal but it was like a different world was a little show about a historically black college. Like I don't think understand mistake like and it was like number two on. NBC Like please like it was that was nuts and that's thirty years ago and for me to be a kid like having that it changed my whole life so you knew then pretty young what you wanted to do with your life. You graduate. College moved to L. A.. Quickly what was the plan going out there. What did you WANNA do with yourself? And what were those early years early years were very broke. didn't have a lot of money interning time Working odd jobs house dogs. Do you pay the dues. But I really wanted to conquer I wanted to conquer La. I want to conquer the town. That was the mindset. I walked out there with and and I meant like like by conquering it. I want to be the mastermind craft. I wanted to be a really great writer I want to. I want to be very hard worker and that was really mine my intent. I wanted to be the best and I'm still working at that. I don't think I've gotten there yet. I still think a lot of Mar.. I still have so much more to do but but I wanted to be a constant student of the craft of writing because of the ones I looked at as the greats and all those movies I will watch. TV shows. I would say man those. Those people really know what they're doing like people like Norman Lear. And you know and Debbie Allen and Shonda rhimes and David Kelly and Aaron Sorkin Matthew Line are these is are all people that I looked up to and admire. They had a singular voice in a specific vision. And that's why there weren't really spoke to so many people and I love that I love of that how intimate television can be. It's even more intimate now. 'cause you can watch on your laptop or your phone It's still very honored to be a part of this television landscape unscathed with behind the scenes. Obviously sometimes in front of it too but I think television is such a powerful powerful medium because we really get to communicate with people in their living room or in their bedrooms when their car while they're waiting in line It's important that we're talking directly to people and not preaching the people not giving them a specific message but starting conversations and and I enjoy doing that. So what was the moment Lena in that trip where you felt like okay. I'm here now. I've done something people like something people have heard about out. I'm starting to make a little noise out here. I think I can survive. The Emmy might have been that moment to say that but I know for for you. There was something before that I mean the thing was it was that was that was a moment of. I've arrived for sure that was definitely and a rival moment. Because there's no turning back after that it was almost aside my place in history people stood up and saw me me in a real way and and I took that to me. Okay now I'll go for it. There's nothing I can't get done because I know because I've had this moment this moment in time and I'm going to earn this moment I just had But yeah before that I just felt like if I could write a good script that I felt good about people enjoyed that to me was also a moment of arrival as well so and I knew after Thanksgiving episode. The script was good before I was nominated for an I had to feel like it was good for after validate me before anyone else can so that was also a moment to for me to read that script and the Austat cutting goes. Yeah I feel good about that. I had no idea it would become what it did But that moment was sort of the industry saying you did good the kid and again coming back to the theme a personal story. Yeah we're able to do that script. Yeah was that a difficult thing to do or that feel. Oh good thing I've ever seen. These wrote that while I was in London Filming Ready Player one. Just because that's how the schedule worked out. We wanted in three days three the days off of the movie and he came to. I went to his hotel room and like we just sat and passed the laptop back and forth wash old music videos talked about stuff. I remember. There's just on things In that hotel was what we say we want to Molina to direct it. We just really kind of came together and worked quickly which we tend to do but yeah and it was such A. It was easy to tell that story because I had lived in survived survived. I I lived until I did the thing I came out the other side and I have more perspective without sitting down to write. It was around the time I came out I didn't have any. I was frustrated. I was confused I didn't know what the future held so I was very different space but being in London Spielberg movie and disease flew into to write the script with me. I was like I was going to tell my story man like I've like I valid this my who I am how I present myself. I'm just as valid valid as everyone else and I think that was a space. I had to be an for me to sit down and tell that story to see people respond to it that way not only been like watching it but the hand you a trophy and put you up on stage where it must have been incredibly validating your experience absolutely and the thing is that was industry moment and cool but every single day someone comes up to me gay and straight. That's the thing straight. People love that episode but they come up and say Oh that episode television change my life or I walk. I watched that with of my parents. You know after I come out Kinda stuff. That's the true reward fast a gift. Yeah the real life version of that story coming out more difficult than writing about it. Sure so what was that experience like for you. Coming out is never fun. It's not fun. 'cause you Kinda have to prepare yourself for the worst. That's we're coming up. I think it's so difficult for people because you don't know what the other side is going to be. You may think you do but you never know and there are people that are put out of their homes. People that are owned owned by their family people that are ridiculed people that are people throw bibles at them. I mean it is. I think probably one of the most difficult things a person person can can really experience as a gay person because you or Queer Person Because you really have no idea how your family your friends a home ever co workers wherever you as. You're coming out to how they're going to respond. But you have to prepare yourself for anything right and and it is it is. It's the rights of passage. It's a thing that we've all experienced but it's the thing that we all can survive if we can but also too there's a level of privilege that comes coming out as well because if you don't have the means if you don't have the funds to live on your own or to not get even though yes as illegal to get fire fire someone for their sexual orientation but who knows where people so. They can figure you got a way to do that. What if you're frayed of losing a job afraid of out of your house so coming out is a privilege? I think that's something that we society needs to understand. That's interesting even. I thought of it that way. Absolutely stick around here. More from Lena Waif on the Sunday sit down podcast including why she started her production company Hillman Grad and the story worry behind her low key wedding to wife Alana Mayo. Welcome back to the Sunday. Sit Down podcast now. More of my conversation with lean away so so we were talking about your foundation. The your production company yes helmet Grad and the part. You're able to play now in the culture culture and in the business where you can hand down what you know and give opportunity to other people because of the work you've done in the spotlight you now have. You can help. Put some other people people in that spotlight. Why is that important to? You is important because I want to leave this business in better shape than I found it in and I I think the best way to do that is to mentor is to educate is to make sure people that are not. They don't have the privilege to leave. Everything comes to Los Angeles or New York and just to pursue their dream. We want to sort of level playing field. We want to find the funds to help people go to writing class. Help people acting classes help people learn the crap that they so desperately want to be a part of because we want to raise their hands saying I want to be a writer but everybody has to take writing classes to take time out of their day to be writing groups and all that kind of stuff it takes a lot to become a good writer. It takes a lot to become a good actor. It takes a lot to learn to being a producer director and people want to do it. But if you don't have the crash or the skill you're not going to be able to break in or less you. One of those rare beings knows how to director knows how to write really well this very few of those people and also I had to learn the craft I went. I'm just GonNa be a college and studied writing and producing television. And that's why we're not came out to La. I was able to hit the ground running but most people you know sort of realized at forty five. You know what I don't WanNa do this job. I WANNA go right. I WANNA wreck and that's cool too. You know I want. I want those folks to know that like. Hey We're here we WANNA help. We want to be supportive. We went no. We can do to help someone really pursue their dream and eventually live it. Does I do believe that everyone has a gift. Everyone does you either embrace it or you could suppress it and I think I think a lot of people choose to suppress. They got bills to pay the families take care of responsibilities but there's a difference in the way someone walks in the world by someone who just thinks about they dream versus someone. Who's living in and you help people do that? I love what you say that people are into your calls more often now since the and you say hey while I got you on the phone look at this writer this. This came from the industry. So don't wants to say oh great. Donald Isa Lena Cool you know and I was just like Nah is is a wholesaler of us and we all have to be here. We all have opportunities and we all deserve to have our stories told last. Obviously most importantly congratulations on your marriage. That's incredible so. Was it as casual as it sounds. I was listening to tell John. Legend the store driving by there. We you know. No we We actually have a really close friend. Who Lives in San Francisco My wife loves going and And so yes she was at this idea. So why. Don't we get married City Hall there. You're wrong because it's beautiful and too because it has so much history With our community and I was like. Oh yeah that's a great idea and we just decided to keep just us. It was so much easier that way and also a great photographer as well Audrey Wagner who Who Shot the poster if acquaintance limb And so he captured us as well queen and Queen but that was it and also we're so we're a little lazy. We don't want to plan a thing. We didn't want to be in those clothes all day. We were just like so. We're both Torrens our tour. She's a tourist so we we like nice things but we also like to chill and hang out as so. That's what we've got to. We've got to go get married really quickly. We've got some eat after hanging out with the hotel and back to work pretty quickly wedding. Picking Out Napkin. I mean she could have planned a beautiful wedding. I stop but I just think it would have been too exhausted and we're very blessed very busy right now in the business so we will get this done. Well we'll do it felt we've been married for this whole time now. We just have a nice jewelry to go with it but Yeah we wanted to kind of get it done. Quick and easy no Muss no fuss and it was sort of. I think it was the best decision. That's great and I have to ask you what's what's next for you. What's on the horizon? You're still young. You got a lot of road ahead. uh-huh big plan. Oh man this is the beginning. What are you shooting for? Twenty s which is loosely based on my twenties living in La Hustle and bustle and being a PA and being a runner? That'll be on the in February of next year. So very excitable the half hour single camera comedy eight episodes that really. I think we'll get people laughing and inspire falls onto follow their dreams. I'm going to be in Westworld A Nice season which is exciting. which would be out Next year and and then also awesome producing a TV show. That'll be on Amazon them them covenant is the first season. It's all about a black family that moves to an all white compton. Yes companies to be all white in nineteen fifty three Harry and the only thing scarier than the white neighbors that don't want them. There is the haunted house that they've just so it's going to be something special. Yeah are busy. Yeah a little bit found tiny getting. Mary did exactly we. We got a big congratulations to lean on her marriage and my big thanks to her for a great conversation. Her new movie Queen and Slim is in theaters. Now I'm joined right now in the Sunday. Sit Down podcast by the producer. Maggie Law Hi really good to see you. Also making her Sunday sit down podcast debut and and looking thrilled about the prospect leash. Thanks for having me Oak. said to be here. So at least you produce the interview with lead away I confess confess before we started for. We really dug it. I didn't know a ton about lean away. Of course I knew she was Through all the shows that she's done but I didn't know her whole life story Oh I didn't know how engaged she's been with her Hillman Grad Production Network of making sure that young people like she was not so long ago. Get their chance in Hollywood to come up just a super interesting person to sit across from for an hour absolutely and I think for me I remember her emmy speech because it was so uplifting and I think it went a little little bit viral with the whole idea. That being different is what makes you special useful in Hollywood. And then of course her gala. The Rainbow Robe which was like the classiest most amazing thing that I've ever seen so that was for me like the starting point and then to find out so much more speaking of splashy Washington. Maggie is heard that she was a sneaker head. Yes which I think you would call yourself browse the heads of rare. I just go to tanger outlet on the Boom Outlet Long Island over twenty nine ninety nine. I'm out right but but so I was so I wore a pair of Jordan's good old Jordan. Little twist on the original nice orden ones like it. She came in and totally one up with sneakers. But with the most resplendent extraordinary pair of slippers slicer suit like a high fashion two piece suits Sherry and then I looked down for the sneakers occurs okay. We're going to have a sneaker thing. Slippers slippers likes lives. They were they were slides but they were like very fancy leather slide. Slide with bunny ears literally looked like slippers. Yeah works actual bedtime slippers to be worn out in public noon. Sooner whenever we spoke and she looked fabulous fantastic. Sure she looked amazing. Did they had floppy bunny ears on either side when she walked down the bunny ears ears flop music with the level of self confidence and so. I don't think I have to wear a pair of slippers catching you aired slippers. The master of none Fan. I love master of none. That's she won the Emmy of course for reading that. Yeah I was GonNa say I think the Emmy speech is sort. We'll put her on the map for most people. And that's I mean I knew her as somebody on the show but then to see that speech. You're like Oh wow. She's go places in Hollywood for sure you heard in the interview I was born in Evanston to. I lived there until I was five. She and I would have gone probably to high school together. Although I'm a little older than she has gone to the same high school anyway and I loved what she said about Coming from South Chicago and moving out to the suburbs and like getting a new understanding of different cultures. That's informed and help her become a better at a writer and producer and and Hollywood force that she's become and it's great. That's the whole point behind. The shy right is that there's no one Chicago and that every experience variance that everyone has is just as human whether you're in Evanston or the south side Yeah and it's nice that she can have all those perspectives. I hope a bunch of people go see this new movie. You'll see it. You'll be uncomfortable at times. It's fair to say I'd be interested to hear what everybody thinks about it. It definitely test you But it's a good flick. It's called Queen and Slim Amazon mentioned. It's in theaters. Now Leash Maggie. Thank you both and thank all of you as well for tuning in again this week. If you want to hear more of the full length conversations with my guests every week nick subscribe so you never miss an episode. And don't forget to tune in Sunday today on your television set every weekend NBC. I'm Willie geist excellent. So you right back here next week on Sunday sitdown podcasts.
What To Expect From Farmers Markets This Season
"Hey there I'm curious. City reporter Monica Ing Jennifer Lives in Logan Square. Usually this time of year. She spends her Sundays at the Logan Square farmers market where she likes supporting local farmers. Local businesses our favorite TACO. Place is usually. They're the market normally opens in May. But today it's still closed like all city farmers markets because Chicago officials are still sorting out the rules. Which they say are coming soon. But in the meantime Jennifer has a question. I'd love to know what farmers markets are going to be like this year. Well even though Chicago markets are open. Yet you don't have to look far for an example of how these inherently social places are going to change in the age of social distancing Eddie this is Evanston downtown farmer's market which has been operating weekly for a whole month now with rules officials say Chicago markets are likely to follow. I up visitors. Have to go through an entrance where they get turned away. If they're not wearing a mask inside. The square folks have to walk in one direction around the stalls. There's no basil sniffing or tomato squeezing because no one's allowed to touch stuff on the tables. There's even a yellow rope in front of some booths to stop shoppers from getting too close. Debbie sharp will not cut back a beat spinach and Kale from Nicholas Farm. And I asked through our masks work. You just go in line. You pick what you want and then you pay around the corner around the corner the Nichols booth. There's a person mask and gloves. Who does nothing but deal with that? Dicey money part and Debbie got to try something new. It was my first time using apple. Pay Great you can expect to see more farmers taking payments like this to keep potentially Germany cash handling to a minimum and for even more safety a lot of managers are urging people to preorder and prepay for their stuff online before coming to the market to pick it. This will also be the case at Green City market which normally has to open air locations in Lincoln Park in the West loop but so far this spring. They've done everything online. And even when they do open for in person shopping probably June. Unfortunately some of our wonderful community programs will not be available on site but will continue to. Do those. Virtually such as our sprouts or our chef demo. It's Green City executive director. Melissa Flynn who says farmers will also be more spread out and like Evanston. You'll have strict mask in social distancing rules so it is going to look different but the food that you've loved for twenty years will still be front and center. That's also how it's working at the Oak Park farmers market which opened this weekend. It moved to a new roomier spot near the Oak Park River forest high school athletic field. But they're still preserving at least one sacred market tradition. I think the most important question to ask here is. Can you still get the hot donuts? A apparently sell it. It's our understanding that you're gonna be able to preorder. That's how park village spokesman Dave powers. They're going to be pre box. You know it's it's not going to be the same as people would walk around the market much Adele. Right weather off the ban will be there. What the famous Oak Park Farmers Market Band is going to be. Gone like forever would never say never but having a functioning market that's safe and as for Jennifer's favourite tacos at the Logan Square market organizers. Tell me they're gonNA be gone to along with all takeout food because they just don't want people hanging out and eating and that seems to be the general consensus that this year's markets are going to be a lot more about being safe than being social humider. What Chicago markets end up looking like the summer organizers say they're committed to serving their neighborhoods one way or another one of those people dedicated to making sure community gets what it needs is connie spring. She's the founder of the sixty first-rate farmers market and would lawn. I spoke to her about the challenges. The markets face during the pandemic and the road ahead but I. She explained why she started the market. The first place what we had lived in the neighborhood for twenty years so we wanted to create a place where we purchase food healthy sustainably grown foods and we thought that our neighbors beer in the woodland community would also use that market to purchase foods at the market because along with providing fresh healthy food which she really wanted to do was build community. Any farmers market is immediately a community. Amenity it's an event builds community and brings the community together and so part of my thinking was to create this place where people could come every single week and it would always be there and be be something that would be dependable. Something that would be dependable for everyone from the very beginning. Connie has focused on making healthy local food accessible to people regardless of income when sixty first street farmers markets started in two thousand eight. It was one of only two markets in Chicago that accepted snap benefits not long after Connie helped launch a program the basically doubled the buying power of shoppers using their snap benefits in Chicago markets. It's program that would be especially helpful right now with so many people out of work and struggling to make ends meet but like a lot of other Chicago. Farmer's market managers Connie still waiting for the city to issue guidelines in a green light to win out doors that will likely happen in June and understands. It's complicated I mean these turn into big social community events but on the other hand governor Jay Pritzker designated them as essential businesses from day. One of the stay at home order so it's been frustrating. It is really frustrating. Literally for the last two months farmers markets in Chicago have been studying this looking at other markets across the country. New York. Washington DC San Francisco. Evanston you know close by and looking at how they're doing it learning developing best practices and really making plans for opening in the safest way possible and so I think there's a lot of confidence that markets have in Chicago that they can operate in the safest way and likely more safely than grocery stores. Because they're out of doors. There are fewer people handling the foods that you're purchasing. The foods won't be immediately available to the customer to pick up. There'll be behind the table. There's a lot of work to be done to make it work well but it is possible to well. I think that our market in markets all across the city. I ready for it. In the meantime sixty first street has joined several other Chicago. Markets like Green City by going virtual are now offering their foods online and so you can make online sales and they will come and drop off or they will deliver to your home. Depending on their capacity and even though the market isn't a physical gathering place right now Kylie says that all important sense of community is still present. The clientele understands that farmers need support right now and the farmers know that their clients needs support right now and so that component I think is has become very very important in his really stood out for people in these last weeks that we're all there to support one another but there's one problem with that virtual setup shoppers Illinois haven't been able to use their snap benefits to order online thanks to legislation that passes month though they will be able to start using those snap benefits starting in June but only with big retailers like Amazon and Walmart. For Now. So in the meantime we have been trying to figure out how to enable our snap customers at sixty first street farmers market to have access to the foods of the market we have created a market box initiative whereby we've been bringing in funding and creating these forty dollar boxes of fruits and vegetables and bread and eggs that we are actually giving to families low income families on the south side of Chicago. I think we're over four hundred boxes at this point and still raising funds so that we can do this through June by June. Connie hopes the market will be open. And when it does it'll look a lot like Evanston and oak park masks. Lots of social distancing rules in place now lingering or socializing more in out service but even though the experience might be less will social. She says it's still important to get out there and do farmers market shopping when you purchase food from farmers market. You're purchasing the freshest the healthiest the most nutrition dense foods that you can find in many many cases they are sustainably and organically grown. They are grown by folks in your community or folks near your community and so when you spend your dollars at farmers market you are putting those dollars in the pockets of local farmers who then are sustaining their own communities and Connie says that the specially important here in Illinois because we don't actually grow much that ends up on the kitchen table sure we have thousands of acres of farmland mostly corn and soybeans. But the bulk of that ends up in animal. Feed ethanol processed foods words exported overseas Illinois is one of America's most prominent and biggest agricultural states and despite that fact we import ninety six percent of the food that we eat and it's imported from California Central America Mexico China. We grow very little of it so we as a state needs to be thinking much more about how can our individual folks may be food insecure but we also as a state are food insecure and by shopping at farmers markets. What we can do is support our local farmers we can support farming production and help to grow that agricultural economy in the state of Illinois the local economy. He's talking about his obviously been hit hard by the pandemic but she remains optimistic. I think that over time the farmers markets will bounce back and they will be what we knew. I think however that in this process that we're going through we are discovering if we didn't know them already the inequities that exist in our society and I am very very happy to be able to say this the Illinois General Assembly approved a budget that included a five hundred thousand dollar appropriation for the healthy local food incentives fund and what that does is provide five hundred thousand dollars a year to these kinds of incentive programs to help our low income folks to be able to afford the healthy foods sold at farmers markets in Illinois. So to me. That is a sign of good things to come and that there's going to be more support for farmers markets. And there's going to be more support for our snap neighbors for now. Connie waits planning for the safest reopening and enjoying a little extra time for herself on the weekends. I take the opportunity to weed my garden for me. It's a bit of a vacation to be there at dawn But but I very much miss the market because there are somewhere between fifteen hundred and two thousand people who come to the market on a nice day and many many of them are my friends and it's something that I very much. We expect those guidelines from the city about wind. Chicago's farmers markets can open to be released in the coming days. Curious city is supported by the Conan Family Foundation. I'm Monica
CBS 2 News PM Update 070820
"I'm Erica sergeant here. Are the stories making news at this hour? The state is expanding its covid nineteen testing efforts with twelve new mobile testing teams focusing on hard hit communities across Illinois the mobile testing sites can be moved as needed to areas with emerging outbreaks of the virus, such as at meat, packing, plants or nursing homes Illinois. Residents are getting an extra month to redo expire driver's licenses, ID cards and vehicle registrations as many drivers, services centers are dealing with huge wait times forcing people to stand in line outside for several hours. Hours during a heat wave, the expiration date of all driver's licenses ID cards and vehicle registrations is now November first. North Western's game against Wisconsin scheduled for November at Wrigley Field is being moved to Ryan field in Evanston because of uncertainties due to the COVID, nineteen pandemic athletic director Jim Phillips cited the possibility of a limited crowd at the famed Ballpark, even if fans were allowed and turning to the weather, the nineties stick around until Saturday. There's a chance of isolated storms all week as well from the CBS News. I'm Erica Surjit.
CBS 2 News AM News Update 01-11-21
"From the cbs newsroom. I'm ryan baker with your monday morning. Headlines mayor lori lightfoot has extended the city. Stay at home order for another twelve days. This chicago public schools resume in person. Classes today pre-k and special ed students. Cps about sixty five percent of its teachers and support staff to be back in school buildings but the chicago teachers union and wants to stick with remote learning until covid nineteen vaccines readily available. Grieving families are mourning. The loss of loved ones after a weekend shooting spree from hyde park to the south side leaves three people dead. The gunman fled the evanston where he was killed by police. The bears had more than enough chances to pull off a playoff upset in new orleans but instead to many dumb plays ended their sub par season. It's a wildcard one and done the bears lose to the saints. Twenty one to nine to finish their crazy. Kobe season at eight. Nine are great january continues. It'll be mostly cloudy with a high around thirty to download the free. Cbs chicago app to get updates throughout the day on our digital streaming network cbs in chicago.
CBS 2 NEWS AM Update 07-26-20
"I'm Suzanne lemonade here. Are the stories making news at this hour? Police in Evanston are searching for a suspect and a motive. After a twenty one year, old man is shot and killed while sitting on a porch to Sean. Turner was shot in the arm and chest on the twenty two hundred block of Emerson, a man, wearing light colored clothing, and believed to be in his twenties ran from the scene. Illinois's latest covid nineteen numbers show just over fourteen hundred new confirmed cases and twelve deaths. Chicago Park district activities may be cancelled because of covid nineteen, but that doesn't mean summer. Fun is canceled to the Park district teamed up with my block, my hood, my city to help kids stay busy and active this summer by handing out donated playbacks filled with jump ropes, hacky sacks, Hula hoops, sidewalk, chalk, footballs and soccer balls weather today, partly cloudy skies with highs in the nineties join us on CBS to or CBS CHICAGO DOT COM for news updates around the clock. I'm Suzanne Neo.
Acute Zoom Poisoning (with Lauren Lapkus)
"Support for this podcast comes from Microsoft teams. Now, there are more ways to be a team with Microsoft teams bring everyone together in a new virtual room collaborate live building ideas on the same page and see more of your team on screen at once learn more at Microsoft Dot com slash teams support his podcast comes from state farm with surprisingly great rates. State farm is the real deal when it comes to home and car insurance state form. Agents are always ready to help you personalize your insurance plan. You can create a policy that fits your needs. You can manage your coverage, pay your bill or even file a claim right from your phone with the state farm mobile APP, and you can always call one of the state farm agents in neighborhoods across the country. Get a great rate without sacrificing great service when you want the real deal like a good neighbor state farm is there. Hey Esther. Hey Caroline. This is a big one. This is what we call in the podcasting Biz of. Vic. One. A long time in the making this is this is someone I've just sought after my whole life. You know ever since I, I saw her on my TV screen I was like who is this person? She's so funny she so different, she's beautiful you I just I feel weird connection to her I bill. We're connection her guys. Welcome to the show Lauren Lap Kiss Hi. Esther do remember. Got Pink Berry, and we learned all the things we hadn't come in. That's why I brought that up. No I I saw you on. Are you there Chelsea the NBC Sitcom that you were on? Is that what it was called? Are you there? Chelsea it's close. I mean it was based on her there. Are you there vodka? It's me Chelsea. So I feel like the name is many things. Yes. So I saw you on that show and was like she is so funny and then. I just hit you up. You're you're like, yeah let's hang out. We Got Pink Berry was very like on brand. We realize we're both from from neighboring towns I'm from Skokie Evanston, which is insane like so much to catch up on on that. Also I mean now look you're married to someone who is in my high school or college in practice Yes we're just Carolina Spoil the gap fest here ladies. And I went to North Western and I was on the North Western satellite. Improv. Team that was coached by the same adult male that esther and I assume your husband. Had We hero wait a second esther? Was You? Mike Dowse Siad yet same. Oh okay. Okay. Different team because my team, my husband Mike Team. But that's so funny. That's such a small world you went to North Western that's amazing. Went to northwestern There's a lot. There's a lot of Evanston. Chitchat. We need to do there really is I mean esther I haven't gotten caught your special yet but it don't you talk about Skokie right? You go to skokie in it. I, mean, there's so much coke in it. It's GonNa make you sick. It's GonNa make you. Just, disturbed great way a deep amount now. Lord bone chilling amount of school. Where did you go to? Lord, where did you go to school to college I went to Depaul in Chicago Okay that's right. Okay. and you're a wild kit. Yes I am what was the? What was your high school thing? We're the now's North Vikings purple just not that. Cute. In H. S.. Yeah. Wow and which high school was mean girls said at it it was. S. Still. Be like that. Yeah. Wow I know they were in Evanston the head degree I'll have to say I know it's pretty cool. Wow, I lauren while we're talking about Evanston. was doing some research. Sean you and I saw this like really fun essay for Lady Mag. I can't remember which one about this this jacket you bought at the urban outfitters in Evanston. Yes in style. That urban alligators floors? Yes. Such a good urban. It was so good when I when I was like in Middle School for some reason my I guess my brother and you about urban outfitters in Chicago and so we went there and I got like cool t shirts that I didn't know what they meant and like wore them to school I thought I was the coolest person and then when urban came to Evanston that was like a huge moment and also my friend's Dad designed the urban in Chicago and possibly Evanston one to the industrial sort of look at all. Wow Yeah he's like the Frank Lloyd Wright of my heart. Like Frank Gehry move aside. Architect in the mother fucking house. That's insane that that will corner like that pocket in Evanston. Can we walk through it all together I'll just pretend we're right there on Meghan I'm blanking whatever street that was like. Well, so I guess if behind Sherman Street yet maple it's maple so. There's that movie theater that came in, which was like amazing that ASL. Nice. See I the only theater I'll go to. As you're. In a movie in the past five years in lesson. I don't see movies in I. Fly to Evanston I see them. They're okay. They're also this is probably a little bit newer. Your guys is time, but since I basically live in skokie still there's a pure bar right there on that corner with noodles and company is to be kind of across the street I don't know if it'll still be there. Really. Past every sorry. The I've done I've done bar at that. Pure Bar. Oh. A few times I mean. Somehow my bad. I didn't realize we were in the presence of an instant bar royalty. Can I say? Tiny tiny movements. Big results it is hard. It is very hard hard time Lauren we took a bar class. Like I said we gather but one time we met in a bar in studio city bar method. Yes. That was an journal low together when I wrote for Esther show and I was like cramped in these pre these pre alone together bar workouts an impressive. No I didn't say to Brag I meant well I hate you for it I hated you for it then and I hate you for it now remember being like, wow, is so cool like No I yeah, I was like, yeah like. That girl like she takes care of she holds it down. She look that's fairly new. That's new to work I. Mean I didn't. I never worked out of my life until like I was thirty and I'm thirty four now I just turned thirty five. So I guess it's been a few years now but I never did it at all and then I started getting into it and so you caught me right when I was starting to really get going little. Did I know I mean look I love shoving a ball up pretty much in my Shaina. And just Oh, yeah ooh, I love it I think pop physique is all going down in the I'm getting nail shutdown pop busy thank was victim of having like really bad management. They had zone money locations at one point it got became like starbucks pink Berry level locations I think was too many state I wanted to someone to write an expose on pop physique i. have this this I suspect that it was some sort of real estate scam. No I remember I used to work with a girl who worked on location Jeez? I don't understand like the founders are crazy like that. All this real estate. I've heard that there is some article I read about the. kind of crazy but I can't remember what all the details were. But if felt like one of those things that was just totally unsustainable as much as I liked going, I would go and then sometimes be like one of two people on like this can't be. I don't WanNa Brag, but I was client of the month at the Hollywood location one. Clan of the month. That's crazy. It was only at the Hollywood one because it was a franchise. Different. Role Sin you also told me that you tried to let you like try to become friends with the staff you would like to hang out there or am I imagining that you're thinking of a story that became a storyline alone together were my my pup Zeke teacher invited me to a hang out when I thought there then up being a pyramid scheme event. I think that's what you're referring to did that happen in real life? Yes. No. That is the real life. Oh. Okay. Lauren the reason we didn't you here we want to talk to you about. Slash Growth Sarah and. I've literally heard that one is very good i. It is actually really good I hate to say I've used it. I hate to endorse. Yeah. Fields and my lashes like crazy scary long. Okay. Hold on I wanNA talk about noodles and company I feel like we really like raced past so. I'm from. I'm from Sherman Oaks. So when I came to the Midwest like it was as if a whole trove of culinary options open up likes of which I had never seen before on tolerant. Pot Belly. Yes. That was a game changer I hadn't if I was just going off about poppy last night in a show I I'm obsessed with potbelly. I'm so sad that did they haven't moved out here at all me me me me. Mid West to taste I want to say, I don't see there being a foothold for pot belly in the Los Angeles. Area. You're crazy. So portable, it's high quality. It's so good like. No we need it, I would be so rich if we had potbellies here because I would save so much money on food every I go like hopping. Dangerous place but so it was like pot belly and. Noodles and company which was A. It was just pasta. You ordered it at a counter I. don't even know how to explain what are you confused about? What is Literally Pasta? It's sup- it's anything with noodles. Those kids that only eight buttered noodles as children were like, what if we started at a restaurant this? It's perfect for me. I truly was like like that as a kid and so noodles and company is so perfect because it has like the most plane options you can just get like the most playing chicken noodle soup or like a pesto pasta very simple I. Love that it's this is to go every day in college. Oh Japanese Pan Noodle the Pad Thai. The buttered noodles I. Mean. Again, another place that I'm I'm missing deeply potbellies Jimmy Johns I know there's a couple out here but I know I love the Jones to, but it's not that great. The quality isn't transfer over. There aren't as good here and I feel like there aren't enough places where come a grab and go something it doesn't feel that easy here I will say I think Los Angeles has the worst lunch culture out of any major city in their world. Yeah, and part of it is because we're not a walking city. So there aren't those grab and go options that you're like passing three times a day but what do we have? What is what is the Los Angeles Ship Hallway? That's the best I can find. SLAKES hand. Sweet Green. I think sweet Greens kind of dominated the casual lunch market and screens polarizing. It really is people really hate it but I love it I. Love Sweet Green to I. Love. Why do they hate it hate sweet green. Lotta. Just don't know what they're doing. They don't know what they're doing. It's fine. The learn amateur either very important question. The answer may determine how the rest of the day goes for all of us. Did you or did you not growing up eat at pita in. I didn't eat there my brother did and he still likes it. Okay, fine. Teasing answer. Oh. Strange very strange but we'll. We'll fix that. Yeah I think I would eat it now but I. I. Was Really Picky as a kid. So there was just so few things that I really liked now now I'm much more open but yeah. Okay. She was like a cheese, Pizza Queen Yeah Yeah I truly I love sausage pizza as a kid and my brother told me it was weird and I never had it again. And I now like it again I was like. Oh. Yeah. I this like. This is like your eat pray love you're finding yourself except instead of going to. Tuscany year like having sausage pizza. About this is. Oh I for those people are listening who don't know what PITA IN IS CHICAGO? It's the Chicago what it is by now if they. It. Say for those that don't know when Esther told me there's a restaurant in skokie. That has the best Hamas she's ever had Mike Okay. I'm Persian like when a girl from skokie tells me that I I didn't believe her I thought you were crazy that I went and it's true. It's the Best Thomas I've ever had. Hands on that is that is why we are. So friends and business partners. I do feel like I'm on the fence for you right now and I have to like I have to eat it release soon, just to fix what I'm here you will. It will happen you. Put on. Your I know that fucking sucks actually go. Hat's Mat. Su. If I WANNA. Get it at this point. Well, you know. You GotTa do is you gotTa do Your, how is your quarantine going? What's your day to day? Like? How are you? Because you're in this business with us? It's like of shut down like where you at how are you doing? I'm doing okay I'm definitely like I have a lot of ups and downs emotionally during this time I'm like I. One thing I've noticed is I have a tendency to like make myself really busy in general in life and to the point where all like you. Know totally burn out, and then like try to take things take things out of my schedule and then like build it back up again and I been doing that during this I realized I'm like it's not the same because I'm not going to a lot of places but I'll have like three or four things in one day or like the expectation that I put on myself like right something or do something and it makes me feel really bad and. So I'm trying now to do that to myself as much and just let myself watch. TV, without thinking I should be doing something else because I watched so much tv but I'm usually feeling guilty while I'm doing it and so there's I'm trying to find that balance at this point of like I don't have to rush to do anything because nothing is being made and there's all these pressures from outside forces like you should be doing so much because. We have this time but like it's not accurate because I'm emotionally drained like it's not like I'm normal normal time of year where I I have some time off and I might as well get something done like there's this feeling like in our community and in this business that like you need to use all this time and make something or like have something ready to go the second, you can make something like that seems unhealthy. What are your thoughts? No I agree I mean this is definitely been a big learning experience for me I, I'm. A lot of things like I'm just really learning how to manage anxiety better and also. To not be guilty for not doing anything like that I relate to that. That's that's a lesson I'm learning that like Oh. My other big thing is I have hobbies now. So I have links that I do that are not my career and that are not work that like are in. There are not going to whole foods in target because that's all that was only hobby before. And I tied I and I guard I like messed around with my garden like I just do other things and it's made my miserable. For masturbating by the way. On the garden. Busy I'm using my hands. And learning how to have a more balanced like full, well, rounded life and not just think like I only deserve to work or lake raise. Yeah. Whatever see I. I had moments where I was trying to get hobbies 'cause I'm I'm similar in that like I don't really do a lot of stuff that's not somehow connected to comedy or acting or whatever, and I started doing a piano lessons on my. Phone on this APP and it was going really well, and then I just stopped and I haven't done it in months like it's so hard for me to force myself to. But I was really enjoying it, but it's it's segments break the habit I'm totally screwed and I also haven't been exercising at all during this I've barely and that's probably playing a lot into my you know mental health not being. Fully Amazing Fair enough I mean you did star in one of the biggest movies quarantine though like Idaho you're like I don't know like I've just been like China like. A huge accomplishment over quarantine. You Steiner Wrong Missy, which is the funniest movie of Quarantine Oh. Thanks. It was really exciting when that happened and I. Think like part of that was good for me I mean obviously, it was good because I was really excited about the whole thing but getting to do interviews and stuff like made my days really full and that was cool. But then that. kind of kept going even after all that stop the Guy was like do this do that and then like it was kind of all unnecessary but forcing myself to do things But yeah, I mean it's cool that that happened. But at the same time, it's like September now and that was may and there's like a part of my brain. That's like really confused by that. So yes. You sure those are the months i. Back for a second. Isn't that insane? No. Fucking oh. Sorry. Here. Take out. I I mean look I. We're also grateful for the wrong missy you brought so much joy into. So many people's lives in just. Yourself a thank you big. Lovely Pat on the back here that's nice. For non is so good I know that external of validation and complements success is an achievement don't always relate and translate to it's going inside. So I understand that I see you. Yeah I mean I'm going to therapy during this been cool. I mean I was already going but I stopped at the beginning of the pandemic because I was like she doesn't want to hear me cry about the pandemic everyone's doing that and then I found other things and I also feel like cry about that too and it's fine. But you guys I'm just realizing I have a like a new disease like somehow over the course of this conversation I'm coining this term I I have acute zoom poisoning. What is that I? Am I'm an zoom writer's room and like that's just zoom all day long and I'm doing zoom meetings I'm zoom podcasting I have zoomed sickness I have. True True Zoom poisoning of the mind. Yeah. I relate to that. I Find Zoom extremely draining way that like regular conversations aren't I feel like a writer's room must be really hard for that like it's just it's so real. So these are all complete strangers we're just supposed to jump in and like. You know form banter and like connections with an it's so hard to do that when you can't like rakoff and have a side conversation with someone. All of this grid and it's all people's Torsos. I didn't see people's legs. I still haven't seen a lot of people in the room. It is bizarre like I can't really tell how tall people are i. i. find that to be I find that to be really disturbing but it's i. mean you form a sense of closeness with people these digital SIMILAC Gra. big word. Yeah. It's. It's really. It's changing conceptions what friendship and what human contact is but that's such a good point about how you can't break off and have a side thing like I was in some group thing and it's such a different. It's like being a party and everyone's just staring at each other and like if two people WanNa, talk that everyone stares at them while they talk. Like you don't get, you can't connect in that sort of setting has one big conversation way might be realizing the zoom that is action. My dream in person hang where everyone has to pay attention to everyone at the same time and there can be no side condos 'cause that sometimes I'll have a gathering and it's too many people like what are they talking about? What are they talking about but I like it to be you know ten people in his circle and we're all in the same conversation that does sound good. But I know you mean Carolina about zoom like. Zum I I. Don't know other I've another podcast esther club like I don't. I don't like zooming I'll do it per caroline and this show because it's worth it because we can have such good conversations with people about important things like Meka but yeah, it's zoom is it's a bummer Miami to your other one. I do it just me or like when I had my friend Andy Letterman come and do it to what's funny is it's really just Doing stream of consciousness. Own. Camera. It's amazing and that's what I thought because I listened to it and I was like I did a solo episode I don't know if that was a consistent thing for that show. Is it typically just you hard by the way? She. Does it so call the ramblings of a mad madwoman. Very successful, Solo podcast I am astor truly amazed that you have like enough to say in the stamina to do that. I'm not being facetious, I. Do you plan what you're going to talk about dollars adjusted fully like one thing to the next. Well, it's about eight percent announcements so. excited. Started multiple quarantine businesses and. Poor, poor podcast listeners they just have to. Make aunt. Esther you you're you're doing God's work. Lauren you're no, you're no slouch yourself you're the queen of podcasting. Doing him, how do you do now? Do all the ones you start today, go all the time or the season's and like how does it work? Through. This like the ad agreements like we really want to look at some of those, I would love to explain I a lot of them. I've I've wrapped up and they're kind of in the past until I decide to bring it back. So, currently, I only have newcomers, which is my show with Nicole buyer where we watched all of star wars the first season under season watching all of Lord of the Rings, which is no small feat. By the way, they're fucking the longest movies I've ever seen in my life. And I have a Patriot where I kind of just do whatever I want from week to week so I do watch along or like Improv, or conversations whatever. And that's been really fun I started in November. So I was really glad I. had that wants this whole lockdown happen because I knew how to do all this podcasting stuff from home. So it's been really an easy transition into doing these zoom but. But yeah I mean I had like raise pay-tv with John. gave. Seasons. We'd kind of sign contracts that were for like a certain number of episodes and then we would complete bad and then. You know there's a whole thing with the way stitcher premium works which I don't need to bore you with but it kind of explains why a lot of these podcasts at Lake function a certain way, which is that. You do what you signed a contract with Stitcher, and so people have to pay for the subscription to listen or they can wait six months and then it'll start being released for free week by week. And so then it kind of feels like it's always ongoing because you're promoting all the time even they were promoting an episode from six months ago, which is kind of a little bit John But. Yeah. I'll be coming back with three am, which is my show with Paul, Tompkins and Scott Herman and we'll be doing that soon I think. We're trying to figure out how to do it in this in. Our show is really like we talk over each other and we're like really knowing each other and I do feel like being in person is really helpful for that and so we were thinking about doing it with like really long wires backyard. I mean I mean we'll see it's like Marconi. It's back to the early days. It's like a can on a string. It's super weird. Yeah. I mean I'm like I'm very much a covid. Paranoid Person I have no interest in being close to anyone. So the only way to do that as if like I have my own microphone and I'm like more than ten feet away from them. So we'll see really long wires the future of podcast. It's Your. Your Hustle is all we do we. We Adore you on the show if like the glowing vision board has you from. Very. And the picture of the Pad Thai noodles and company. was kind of like our guiding principles. Okay you guys. I'm actually freaking out about one of today's sponsored. It's the famous the legendary. Elf Cosmetics. Okay. A sponsor this exciting. This affordable. 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I'm also just remembering that noodles and company had punched card like a really good punch. Yes. Yes. Sir. Right now, anytime, Pasta and punchcards overlap. I love a punch Card Pink Barry had a punch card. I don't anymore. But I I used to go there all the time but there's there's not one near anymore. I guy in a bit of a tough tussle with Pink Berry Management in Studio City I remember this assert remember this it was something about the your birthday it wasn't my birthday and Companies wouldn't get a free birthday treat their big if you a bit of like a day window on either. Can't always make it there on your birthday. I'm sorry. Too. Bad. Birthday system works do Laura I'm so convinced the studio city. Pink, Berry has a sign up in like behind in the office and says, it is not this woman's birth thing. I was like it's my birthday. One, it was like the day after my birthday like great. Can I see your ID now? I like you can see it but like It was actually ever yesterday but like it's still my birthday, can I one trying to play like Darth vader mind games I think you're totally right for a daily at on that because like your birthday, your main activities might not be to go visit every place you can get a free thing that could be fun. But like Pink Berry is maybe not your first location on your birthday lauren tell it to sugar fish. Okay because they're not gonNA give. Dale do birthday but you have to be at your actual birthday with your ID and you have to dine in and guy you gotta. Uh, he trusts me dude I'm doing. On my birthday was a few days ago. But to copy birthday Virgo Queen, you have you have to dine in the sugar fish and check in twice prior in the year up to your birthday what I don't know it's such a racket and it's not a racket. It's not I won't allow that well the in there. Twice but see that's not fair because what if you can't afford triggerfish but you're like Oh my God do a free birthday thing that'd be so amazing only for you can. You can sweet talk them a little bit I've I've had some luck like sometimes the check ins don't register I've gotten into some tense conversations with sugar fish staff to get that. The one time that I went to a full birthday dinner with my family on the way home I wanted my three trust me so badly sat down by myself and just had a whole second dinner by myself. I. Love You. So so I've done it alone a solo trust me birthday thing I did that once We've all been like a solo trust meter relief force you to think about what you've done, and what led you there and what you're willing to do for twenty seven dollars. It's hard. It's hard, but it's it's good. It's good to talk about this. All. My Gosh birthday treats. Lauren. Did you do anything? For you know. So I was really hoping to be out of quarantine by birthday time, and that was not the case. But I think we'll all get to have her birthday in this. So that's Kinda great I had a really great day. Actually I got. I think there's a little bit of this. My theory is that birthdays in this time people feel a little sad for you because you can't do anything who all and so I had a lot of deliveries from friends of like I got a lot of donuts. I got a lot of cake and cupcakes delivered to me and flowers, and so I was really. Living a great life for that day I was really happy. So it was a really really special special day and I was really in a good mood I didn't. I didn't feel sad I. Think sometimes I feel sad my birthday but I mean I this quarantine birthday was one of the best birth as I've ever had I had it was my thirtieth. I felt so much pressure to do something big have the best party ever, and then all the pressure was taken away went into Gabardine and I could just enjoy my day and not have to worry about like. Sending out a funny email all my friends. So like meet up at like the perfectly coolest bar that I picked. You know like that's really true. Maybe that's why I felt so good this year that I didn't have that pressure where I have to be like who's coming and are they going to show up and he's going to bail and who's GonNa you know all those feelings that happen with like throwing something and the pressure of that and everyone like paying attention to you in a certain way it is weird Yeah. I I don't I don't think I want to go back to the old way. Carolina will you tell Lauren in the listeners about my birthday this year? Oh. Wait what do we do for your birthday? What did I summit Oh God I'm sorry i. Tried to bury it and When was your birthday mar? It was worth second. So it was right before lockdown like a week before but I was already fully afraid and ready for lockdown. ESTERS defense since January she's been on. Kobe. Read it. Like I was going, I was hanging out with Esther January. February and she's like you don't understand this is going to change our lives. You're amazing. Yeah. I'm just afraid of everything. So I pay attention it's not good I have been enjoying my final moments Lloyd. You're slow descent into madness started in like early January. So you were grappling with something bigger than all of us way back then and Oss. We disregarded you. We laughed at you, but you're right the whole time. So come March second. We're at a fever pitch in America esters at peak anxiety she's been carrying Koga, on her shoulders with her friends and family. And then that all that. There is a nexus of all of that with Ester. May I say imagined that you had growing in your house? So her birthday turned into an Ester anxiety reduction summit it was basically like the birthday party of thunder vast where like three esters closest friends had to just sit her down and be like. There is no mole like everything's GonNa be okay. It was just it was sad. So figure out that there wasn't any mold. there. She's kind of exaggerating it wasn't really a mullet was more than I was having. It was like a bad allergy situation that I was having that have since figured out I just have allergies need to take Zyrtec every day, but it was more more than that. It was anxiety I just earlier this year I learned Oh, I, have a mining. Zion is not just like anxious. It's it's it's an anxiety disorder. So I, I started anti anxiety medication like I'm better now. But I think being afraid of Kobe and like just spinning out about anything in general and having all that free time at the beginning of the year just led me to that path and the ESTER birthday executive summit was like. Days before started my meds. So Carolina really got to be a part of that. Sounds really. Intense. Sorry. I don't. I'm not I'm not I'm not afraid of it. I'm just. To have you at the next one. To be there told you love yeah. As their next time, we we need straps of some kind. Some sort of jackets restraint type thing gravity blanket. I have one by skokie home. You need one here I got one for Mike and he loves it and I I've worn it to sleep one time, but it's too heavy for me because it's for his body weight but. But I really did fall asleep quickly. It was cool. Amazing. Wow What heavy books with heavy old books on top of That work. I. I want one I flirted with A. You'll you'll never pay the price the retail she. Yeah. It'll never happen. She's there's always a discount code for you if you if you want to do it my friend. Gayle posted a discount code and I remember like months later and sought it out I. Love I love using coupons like a gravity blink it won't hit the same if I can't purchase it on impulsivity Tuesday morning you know what I mean yeah. Like who's the morning while that's mid Western isn't it? I? Mean they don't have that out here. Yeah. I guess the equivalent here would be like a TJ maxx Tuesday mornings different than Tj Max, it's almost like goodwill but better. I'm if she ever gets a gravity blanket, it's GonNa be something her mom baugh at a Sherman oaks goodwill. That's that's our only choice. Yeah. If if it if it doesn't get picked up in a box on the side of the street then pretty much. Yeah. Not Interested. Be Fair I did buy my gravity blanket on Black Friday at. Guy. I just replied. Oh. Oh. My God speaking of. Midwest area. Superstores. Believing, even sell that there. I feel like as a hardware store or no. Dude if Newcastle. No Minutes minorities, menards, black, Friday, you don't even know bitch due. For Ninety nine cents. Escort Esther last game was like I'm going to go back to Skokie for Black Friday it's going to be awesome. We're GONNA hit menards and I'm like okay like that's interesting like and when I think black Friday, it's like Ticket items that's the point of black right you gotTa Lean Td. Yeah. Yeah. It's like it's items Esther. There was like wait till you see my black Friday hall it was crazy and it was like four skis. Tiny. Gallagher Desk, cactus a gravity blanket and like a slap bracelet or something you're gonNA. Since. It was like Friday I tried black Friday a couple of times, and I find it really disappointing and kind of scary. But the one time that worked really well for me was I got every season of sex in the city on DVD at target and it was like two dollars a set. Wow I love looking at my big DVD sets that now are completely meaningless. Taking we bought and spent hundreds and hundreds of dollars on nothing gives me. Nothing gives me greater pleasure. Okay born this is kind of a detour but in my research as I mentioned earlier, I was really impressed to see that you have done. Would I find to be the peak of celebrity journalism an US weekly what's in my bag? I was so excited about this. This is like I. Feel the same way about those I flip the back immediately to see those Yep zest. Yes I spent I painstakingly put together I truly was like very obsessed. Well, I'm GONNA pull it upside kind of want to talk about it. Lauren I'm like the thought that you painstakingly put it together. Just want you know. It it matters to some of us. Like we feel that work and it means a lot. Okay. Learned number. One thing that I have to ask you about in the what's in my bag in esther is the percent introduced me to this product Jau Heads sanitizer dot do us okay. So that Hansen Taser I learned about from makeup artists because they all have it in our hands. So good is they're putting makeup on you, and so it it started to give me like a just a happy feeling and then I realized I could buy it which I had never considered. I just thought like only they have that. And so I bought and then made well started selling it and so two anthology I think and that also made it easier to get and it's just the best I've been using it during this time obsessively and it's nice. It smells like lavender and most hand sanitizer especially right now because everyone's making their own version and they're all a gross and bad we noticed. That smell have you guys noticed There I have one that's most like, I don't like burning rubber. It's like so gross but we'll. Leave your skin dry like I just. None of them are working for me I agree this one is the best and it's really nice blue bottle and it just feels fancy. It feels kind of like you know it's like ten dollars for a fairly small bottle, but it lasts you over the long time. Oh. Does it ever does it ever has anyone? In, the Soom have you ever used Jiao for one of the alternative uses that mentioned on the bottle off the top of my head it's zapping. UNDERARM. autorizher. have either have you guys tried that at all? I. Never have but I always like knowing. It's there like the fact that I'm like if I'm running around I realized I forgot deodorant this isn't my bag feels very safe. Yes. Okay. Every time I pull it out Dave is like. It's not just for hands he'll. tagline. Big Bucks for. Is the real freaking deal. Okay. Lauren talk to me about your supergroup glow stick. I was very surprised all the supergroup products you wit with the glow stack. While the glow stick I have to say was given to me for free how I got into it. And I like it because you can just swipe it right on. It's like a stick. It's just hundred us is almost like a deodorant stick, but it's clear is it's a slimy motherfucker. It's yes it's but it's like mad it's like weird like it makes your skin kind of Matt and I just like how easy it is to put it on a stick like my hands don't get all covered in shit like when you're squirt not a big old glop sunscreen and it makes me more likely use it. I'm really bad with sunscreen and also I thought supergroup was from goop like forever and then learned we all we all made that mistake. Yeah. I think that's a huge problem I e yeah. It's a bit of a struggle with that trump. It's a bit of a misdirect. Yeah. I may think it was like way fancier than it was it's still is fancy but but yeah, I, recently bought another one by them that has like a bit a to it which I didn't know because I bought it on online at Sephora and like it came and then I was kind of disappointed by that because I don't really love a tenth that I haven't really worked on you know what? I mean like finding the exact rate matt was it the Mineral Sunscreen that? Because that would be a tent? Yeah, and it's make your skin kind of blurred. which is good for me. Lert is code for it's GonNa pill on your skin and right that super weird. Yeah. I haven't been using it but I still like that other stick, we ask all our guests are you wearing sunscreen inside during quarantine? I am but it's out of. Laziness I guess because I'm really bad with finding products that I really like and I ten to in a moment of panic just pick something randomly and so like right now I'm using like affil- like some screen moisturizer, which is like, maisky like very basic I. Guess I would like you know standard. Data good. And I use that every day. But I wonder I read something that was like you're supposed to wear sunscreen inside to is that true? It's fear mongering. It's totally true like UVA UB raise they're going through windows that are attacking us but like If. You remember. Don't put it on if you forget like lifestyle might. Not, attitude. You gave me when I told today wasn't wearing Lewis. Okay You. Can't say can I save? My mom has amazing skin and it's like the first thing everyone laments her on and she her big thing is that when she turned thirty s, she started using sunscreen every day and so I always think like I need to be doing that because that's the one thing she swears by. and. So I, try to do it when I think about that and like you know putting moisturizer on my neck and trying to. Things because right now I feel fine but I'm like this could turn fucking south dude says one set in the craziest tip to glowing up and I'm gonNA share it with you guys. It's he happens to be a male model I know him I barely know him but he listens to going like I. Think new share this tip of the world that apparently people know US skincare on the back of their now. Oh, I've never heard an apparently the back of the neck, an oft neglected area that can show aging I mean it sounds crazy but he says that like he's heard this tip from industry insiders. This is crazy but it makes me think that like maybe the back of the neck would affect the front of the net click if the back of your neck starts to get older looking than it would obvious connected right there. Yeah. That Meridian is. Very tenuous because I'm doing it right here just that front low patch pretty much. It's not going beyond that hit the gels job. Prevention I should say I mean. Skin care they say it should go down to the NIPPLES. Like. It's a time issue. Have you tried that bum cream or whatever? Sold the. Bomb Boom I have that. Boom Ladies Oh respect. It deserves please boom boom cream. I've been I've used that a bit but. There's something it feels like I'm really treating myself when I do that because I'm like my but needs cream like it feels like it's not my standard routine God. Are you kidding my favorite part of my my like moisturizing routine is hitting the but and I'll say it hitting the plus if I'm buying. What? May I step back for one second just to say, I went through this phase. An ester you went through a or use this product every day oil, which is like I have that it's the best. And I think one of our guests came on it was like is just will slather it all over the outside. You know like respectfully, obviously, you don't want stuff getting up in there, but like it'll just it's so natural like it makes area look feel smell good. Of course, it depends on the product, but I will hit with without abandoned. That's ominous say interesting now do use everyday oil that is scented because I wanNA have a scented Me It's fine for me. I've got a what they call in the business strong push. unflappable. It's the unsinkable molly. Brown is how? Are you like swiping in and up like can you give some graphic detail more slap and around? It's like slap outside it's not there's No there's no like inside like it's not that astor do you ever get bikini waxes I'm asking because I feel like you'd would be someone who either be totally for it or totally against I did it in high school weirdly then stop for like ten years and then I got one recently I have a really great person if you need a recommendation but I don't. I don't know I'm my body hair relationship is really complicated I. I got a lot of it. I got I like have cubes like on the upper is it's It's so much going on the and I don't. It doesn't bother me like it's not an insecurity for me the way like. I don't know. Late in stretch marks than body here, I've had it for so long I don't care. What you are you do you bikini wax what's your status I typically do but during this time, I'm obviously not able to go do any of those things and so I'm just kind of like. Dealing with it in my own way, but it can get someone to see you outside I. Think. Do I want to do it the -squitoes the year like. Go in the more doing it in the morning. Have someone come back do you have any privacy in your yard? I have some if you want to have an appointment. Could. Berlin was GonNA come my balcony. I think she's coming next week together pussy. Wax Shuts. Areas I. I'm curious how that goes. I'll have to talk about that I. I'm like I'm kind of just letting it be a quarantine you know. Change translate take a break and like you know it's expensive. So that's seven six seven months right? They're not spending money painful physical sensation like in human existence and so awkward really I mean like you get over it pretty quickly but it is awkward and so I was thinking about it because you were saying like you're putting this this oil and like they do that stuff and then it's like I think that's the part that kind of makes me feel like it's the most personal is when they put oil on you after and then it's like. Just touching it when they treat you like an adult baby in there. There's nothing. Wait Men's My woman there's nothing awkward with her. So let me know if you need someone. She's very, she knows what she's doing. She's to the point. She's she's good. Okay. Good to know. Well, it won't be it won't be sexual there will be no tension. I love that I don't WanNa be this girl but I will never understand why women don't get their vaginas lizard it is like It is the same price if not cheaper than getting a wax and after like three or four sessions you're done. We'll see I. had it done and I had gotten a groupon for which is probably my first mistake and I did lenny the just the Bikini Line I was like, let's just get that taken care of her and I got totally bruised and it lasted months and so I was never doing that again. So that was why I've never done it again but I feel like it's it could be fine. Maybe it was just a bad place or something, but you also do look like you have sensitive Nordic skin. He seriously, which is like scary. Stuff. Yeah. Yeah that's true I. Never Really Thought about that with the laser thing but yeah, well, yeah I look maybe revisit it maybe don't do it with like a discount or on. groupon were huge for a second though by the way I feel like I, don't know anyone talking with no one southbound coupons anymore. But there was a period of time where I was like this is how I find what I'm GonNa? Do next. Just scrolling around and yeah. Why chicago-based empire. True I knew a lot of work there. Funny people would work at groupon and what do you do like you know? I know I think they the funny like copy that would come with like WanNa go paragliding like. It's GONNA be Great. So. I. Do we. Why have they kind of faded out what's going on because? So many companies like groupon came about and I think it kind of watered down the market a little bit. And maybe with the Internet like finding. Deals is easier now than it was then right like and it's like. Yeah. Also, I think they did have financial problems like they did over higher and they like maybe ran out of money. Like. groupon had. It gave its death rattle and it came back to life briefly with Tiffany haddish right. She was really talking about it. I thought that was very confident of her to take will and Jada on a groupon day. That is definitely one of the greatest thought that was very cool and now there's no one Kerr. He's incredible. Let's talk about today's sponsor. You know it you love it where obsessed with it glossy a Omega you probably lost for their skincare products the popular popularized globally dewey skin. They also create makeup products, body care products I know caroline loves their love's body hero and I love their sky. Wash. I. In the shade pebble. They have fragrance glossy believes in the power of self expression and personal choice in beauty and beyond. 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Get boy brow by visiting glossy dot com slash podcast slash glowing up an all new customers will get ten percents off their first order on glossy dot com slash podcast slash glowing up that's G. L. O. S. S. I. E. R. dot com slash podcast slash glowing up where obsessed we know you will be to. Hey gloomy is okay. Shape wear is really like in the conversation right now and Carolina and I found an option that we love and it is shaper mint. And look sometimes you just like a wannabe a little sook and tucked and comfy in a way where you're not. Man Hanging around you know you know what I mean. Okay. We all like shape wear for our own reasons and you know what I mean shape wear from shape permits moves you out. It feels comfortable and boost your confidence because when you feel confident, you feel empowered rate I know I really don't like the feeling of like things stomach skin hanging you know I just I wanna be I WANNA be. Like. Confined comfortable I don't want to be all out there. 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In fact, it's actually half the price, and if you aren't in love with your shape where purchase you can exchange or return it within sixty days. No questions asked that's the shaper meant one hundred percent confidence guarantee. You can return within sixty days. I love that I live for it I need it. In addition to the everyday discounts and promos Superman has on their website I have a deal. We have a deal just for our listeners that will save you an extra ten percents off your order. You have to go to shape herman dot com slash going up in us our code glowing up. That's. S. H. A. P. E. R. M. I N. T. Dot. com slash blowing up. Code glowing up to get our executive listener at added discount of an extra ten percents off your order. That's shaper. MINT DOT com slash glowing up code glowing up. Carolina because you said, the words financial problems can you tell Lauren about what your mom said when you went? To a nose job consultation I've struggled my whole life with you know getting a nose job. It's like SOB story. Wow like pork caroline like you never know if I should get it so. I have a very like Persian pro plastic surgery mom she's like always trying to get to get one. He's like a hound. She's a dental hygienist in L. A. Plastic Surgery. Mom I don't know how else to say it. So she was like Carolina I I heard this guy he's Armenian and he's in Glendale and he gives all the Armenian girls. Their nose drops in the only cost seven, thousand dollars on my mom like that sounds a little scary signal. You don't understand like I saw his work it's amazing I'm going to take you there like distrust be and. Of course, like let's go. Let's go check them out. So. This is like last year not too long ago. So we go check them out. It's like couldn't be sketchy. You're like it's like it's a rundown office like usually plastic surgeons will do like a CJ mockup of what you're GonNa look like after gaining surgery he didn't do that. He just held a pencil on my nose and it was like it's going to look like this and he like pulled up. He's do you like it a Mike Commit to like. Yeah. So I was like mom I don't think it's GonNa work. She's like I think he's fabulous like sheep like this is perfect and so we're like on our way out again, it costs seven. It's very cheap nose job. How much is it usually like twenty thousand Oh, I didn't realize it was that much to twenty I don't know. And on the way out, she's like, let me see if I can like gather get them down and again. Sheep already, and we're leaving my mom my goes up to the woman at the front desk like a receptionist doesn't handle the billing at the plastic surgeon she's. Like my daughter. She's having financial problems. He's very poor life. Sort the program the girls like no I don't even know what you're talking about or how. I think. She's a student like. Like throwing in that that someone's a student like my mom thinks it's going to work like change things. She's the. Only student. Never. Just like he needs it. Ma'am please leave. Your mic Nose Job Dr. Yeah and they have you ever gone to a place where they give you a consultation like where they mock it up no I I really I really want that. You need it but I'm also like someone who would say that so I think it's fine if you do do it but I feel like you have a very nice now. Thank you so much. I think that the zoom retouching and like. Zoom. Zoom dismore fear that you're experiencing. Perfectly like I'm getting the sun on half of my face it just makes me completely different. Oh. My God s driving theory. That zoo makes you look like Ghost Mister Burns where? He's washed out and everyone looks fucking gorgeous. I Agree Carolina's beautiful doesn't need a nose job but I if you want one I, support you on the journey. Yeah like. Feel about plastic surgery for other people I. Mean it's like if you want it, that's fine. But I but it's such a huge change. That's one of the things that makes me nervous about the ideas like a nose can change your entire face like without like the way you look. Like the standard example is Jennifer Gray but from dirty dancing her she the tiny different where you kind of her and then it's we it's crazy like how much that changes it? It's really hard to get a doctor. You say I wanNA subtle nose job and I want to still look like myself. It's really hard. To find a doctor that like gets that yeah and isn't just going to give you like an upturned. swoopy. Yeah I mean. But there are also some of the great nose jobs in history. We're talk Oh. Yeah. Blake lively. Yeah Oh. Yeah Oh. Yeah. Sham. bealer SOM OH yeah. Oh, one. Yeah Pretty Much, very subtle. Every celebrity I know that's the kind of crazy thing and I think that's part of what's so weird about this like business is that it feels like eventually everyone does that he don't even necessarily know if they dead. Yeah I wish more people were open about it. Yeah like the way the Kris Jenner is. Okay and they're ending their show twenty twenty season. Oh. God Lauren you do not strike me as the type of girl that watches Kardashians I do watch the Kardashians us not all I haven't watched every single season but I mean definitely the old stuff the more recent stuff I've fallen off a little bit started feel release scripted but the older stuff really fun. Yeah. You're like Robin China girl through and through. What do you? Do next like doesn't it seem like you know something even bigger is coming with them if they turned something down like Sure, like doing that bloom steel or. Kris Jenner network. What's your maybe a network or maybe their own company like? I mean they priority have that I guess they probably make things I. don't even know but I think you guys are will be some onto something with this. Netflix. Steel. Could. Definitely see that happening I. I. Don't know though, but the businesses are so lucrative. Yeah I mean I wonder I kind of figured with the Kanye stuff that it'd be the? Time for them to like wrap it up because it's just hard to pretend that's not all happening. Pakistan to pack it up, pack it in Yeah Yeah. Yeah. Well Lauren have you ever met a Kardashian? Nobody I've been really close to him how? My friend was working at watch what happens live and they did a live show in La with a big audience and so she got me tickets and I got to I was pretty close and so I got to take pictures you know from the audience and zoom in really close to her and she was perfect. She was truly perfect at everything. She said I was like Yup like I just loved all of it. I was fully on board. Everyone says she's so nice and cool and normal people love her who know her I think she really might be during the break. She was very funny like not even you know it was just like kind of casual conversation with her Andy and I was like she's so normal. And I laughed and I was like I need to be her like there's just that feeling of like. Feeling. Sad. Yeah. I feel so good. It feels so good. But then afterwards, there is like a, it was a pretty secure. Doing, Molly have you met her? No. Never been in with acidity. With Rob Crash Ian. That's crazy. Talk Empire Yeah a pretty big frigging deal. He was like the hottest guy he was like, Mr Sexy. Grade, he was a senior starved the basketball team. Valley. Yeah. He was like the hot guy everyone had a crush on him. Wild Yes so I'm in Hollywood. I would. Then you must have gone to school with other famous people. I'm guessing Oh. Yeah. Some some pretty some pretty fun ones. Okay. Albert Einstein's grandson. Stein Carolina told you not to tell anyone my back story. He was a door. That's that's. Amazing. It doesn't get better than that as grandson or great grandson. Great. I think it was okay. Maybe like when did he die because I? Feel like he's one of those people where like he probably was alive way later than I realize yeah. Yeah. He was definitely born in the eighteen hundreds it must be as great. It was definitely is great, yeah okay. Fair. Enough. But his name was benign semaines and he looked just like Albert Einstein. That's crazy. So adorable, right that's very cool. Yeah there's a lot up to. He was like a normal dude. I remember I went to school with the girl who was like really rich and like her parents it was only described to me as her parents were people who supplied the meat to Burger King to me. That was very famous. Of course I went to school with the from Yoga kids there. Beer and they were like super flexible. They were and Yeah. Just like a lot of fun. Just stuff like that. Yeah. I was like you know the poorest I in my high school on Scholarship and I. my first car didn't have air conditioning and my mom bought at a police auction for two thousand dollars. And my peers had g wagons for their first car. Wow. So good I'm just jealous. You had a car i. wish my parents would have. Got Me a Janke car. What did Nothing I know what? My licensed eighteen? Oh that probably played a role. In A crazy person layer. Not giving you a car like nose know that yeah. No, I'm not at fault here. Why didn't you learn team because no one was going to get me a car. So it was like what point Jeremy Putting on them they're putting this on you like Ya Watch. Mary special for more. Okay. I will I'm actually very excited. I'm not telling you to watch it though I literally was planning to. Stop. Please Okay I mean I. Wish we had more time to go through everything in your bag. I'll just say the last thing that caught my eye, the Rosebud salve lip balm. But really weird flavor tropical I. don't like rose scented stuff. and those bombs are really amazing and I hate rose. So they had other flavors or whatever, and the tropical one is so good and it's very nourishing for your lips. Wow. Look at her GonNa try Fraser recommendation for me because you probably know a lot of products that I don't know let's do what skin type do you have I struggle with this but I think I have like my cheeks dry but my a t zone is kind of oily combination I. Guess That's textbook combination. Yeah, textbook combination. Now, am I supposed to be using two different things or is there like okay now I don't think so so I'm Super Dry I. am very, very dry. So I'm kind of them moisture hydration expert and there's a product that got released zero. My Minute go-to for hydration. It's the drunk elephant F bomb and it's referred to as a mask. You can use it as a face moisturizer and to me that's like solves all my dry skin issues I just slapped her that on at night in Waco I. You're you're you have that is like you are. So you have the dry skin in the world back you. said that she's combination but she wants a moisturizer. I'M GONNA recommend a product by I'm really into Korean skin-care. There's this. Crave beauty with a K. and they make amazing really nourishing like. Skin care that's really affordable down. She's running mine down Esther. They kind of down drunk elephant but I've been afraid of drunk elephant because I feel like it might be hyped up it's very expensive to I. I spend money on like Sephora and then I don't like half the shit. Check out something called return policy comes you know I've never taken them up on. The Library Lauren it is not I said. Okay, I need to get into that check out the oats so simple cream from. Yeah, I'm a big. It's really nice nourishing moisturizing but not too moisturizing love that we love it. We love to see it. Lauren. You said it all. I mean, you're busy woman I assume you have forty five more podcast record tonight. So I do not WanNa keep you have to watch the Hobbit to actually Oh God. Do you want to stay like. Go like what? Is that exact the desolation of smog in you're gonNA smoke tonight yeah. So I am I just watched the first forty minutes before we did this, I have to break it up and chunks lose my mind. So I will watch the rest of. Okay. Well, you're about to. Buck in. Full Smog. Yeah. I did I saw smog at the end of the Hobbit one and thought it was a cool character. Um So I hope that it's good. I don't know the okay. No I'm not okay. Agree and by the way like everyone told me first of all, I don't like Lord of the rings but everyone said I hate the habit and then I liked the habit more than the other ones and so I think that I'm like broken. Yeah. That's that's a confusing place to be for sure. Yeah. Yeah. But it's hard not as live lot of hotties and Lord of the Rings. got. ORLANDO. They don't really do of arena actually prefer the Hobbit crew. They're all like really weird looking and like funnier like, yeah. Okay. I feel that I can't remember any of the actors besides Elijah Wood. GonNa try to drop some names. What's his name Oh God? Not Sean Astin whatever? No the other guy. Martin. Freeman. And he's so cute. So funny. Learn. You've got your smogs. You let your smog full. Yeah. Multiple the smog don't forget to moisturizer smog and. Have a good smug I will thank you so much. Thank you I'm sorry we sidetracked so much. I do we have heavy back and get more beauty or people are going to kill us so I loved I loved talking about noodles and company on us. For an hour. So okay, good. Okay, good. Well, thank you so much. Lauren everything. Listen. To Lawrence pod cats watch. On netflix watch the between two ferns movie on Net, Flex yes and even if you don't like Star Wars or Lord the Rings, you might like my podcast because we don't like it either. So it's something that we all have in common. Horn and a coal buyer together like that's a Dream Team if I've ever funny she's the best or we love you. We're still love you guys. Thank you for having us. Oh fine. Thanks. Bye Guys. A podcast network.
SEEK GOD! -Psalm 34:1-22
"Hyphen welcome to swift trip. Do you listen. It is doubled lesson day meaning double episodes today double segments. I am so excited about today. This time. i will him from some thirty. Four one to twenty and i will be read from my new life table vision so we have so much slammed from this segment with been said. Let's jump right into eight father. God bless the stablised the sweat and lust as vessels one two three. I will honor the lord at all times. His praise will always be in my mouth. My soul we'll be proud to tell about the lord let those who suffer here and be filled with joy. Give great on to the lord with me. Let us praise his name together so fun at all times on in praise god may his praise always be in your mouth of talked about the importance. How vital idiots to praise god. There is a difference between singing praises and actually being in prisons with my soul as we truth is so happy to talk about my god. I can proud to talk about my father and let everyone be filled with joy because of jesus christ. It is a blessing. There is no one like my father. There is no unlike our father our guide. It is a blessing man. If you don't have a relationship with god and you haven't gooding yet experience his praises in your life. Men venue missing out. If you don't know god you don't know who god is. You don't know. Jesus in you know taking the time you even willing to get him. You most definitely missing our together from lettuce. Praise his name. Let us praise his name together full. I looked for the lord and he answered me and he took away all my fears. So when you sick guy you'll become fearless when you you become fearless uniform. I dunno of tokyo. The story before verbally by. I will say again those time man when i came i two fists with the spirit of the i mean like literally. I'm talking about literally. I was asleep one day and night. I think i had some kind of like a bedroom or something. Like that. And i got up and i just felt like just right through the dull this you know this feel like i said it. I was shaking like literally shake camp shaking so hard and i don't even know where it came from because it's like even before in the like a folks here but it wasn't like this. This was different. This was the actual spirit. That had come to visit me. That i'd like i knew because you can know you can know in like it was the spirit of fear festive face-lift i have come festive fast. With the spirit of looking writing the is literally shaking. And i had to be firm in. Say no i had to say no get in custody. Fear out because i knew deep in my heart but my father had given me a spirit of fear so i had to stand against i had to fam- and catholics spirit out. See fear is a spirit. You need to know home is a spirit and so when you know that it is a spurring you cut it out and you know in you know in you know in your heart of hearts of hearts that your father for the husband given us a spirit of fear you can customers are you can trust it out and say no. No no stunned. You're grown insane. No i had to stand my ground in say and cast out. And from the day onwards i have never seen fee. I mean fan most not mess with me. Sweet truth because fee and moles that. I know that my father has given me a spirit of seattle's way always say at the end of every segment be feel is because from the day on loads of always been fearless about anything despite the situation despite what is going on i have lent because i have i the spirit of the festivus. This was like nothing of evanston before it wasn't like ma band of f. Experience this was different. This was on a whole high-level soul. I know what i'm talking about. And i know when i tell you that the mine of fear the fear that you might have about you know the day to day experiences of fear. I mean that's nothing compared to like what. I saw that compared to like how i fell in that. Say that woman ma'am. There was different so i have land from like no. There is no way. There's no way it's like the spirit of fuel wanted to come in me and make me this fearful pestle and i'm just living in fear and i was like no like i had to put my foot and be like is no there is no lia leaving me. There is no way i'm gonna have an accept what my father did not give me like. Why would i accept that. My father didn't give me. I don't want to have anything that my father did not give me. I don't want to say anything that my father did not give me so you need to send against fair unit stunned against this spirits that are not from our father so by you can be invited. Play is in the place of peace and calm the fi. They look to him in their fences shine with joy. That festivals would never be ashamed. So who are they they look to him is is so when we look for god when we look to god. We will be filled with joy. Six this woman cried in the lord head him and his saved him out of all his troubles. When you sit got from your troubles run from you. I'm gonna say that again when you seek god your troubles run from you. You said sometimes the only reason why our troubles still troubles because we are not seeking god when you begin to sit god you begin to cast out those troubles away. They were read from you. And i'm speaking from experience. I'm speaking from experience. I know that when you sit and look for god your travels will run from you. Seven the angel. Of the lord's close around those who fear him in. He takes them out of trouble again. I've talked about this many times again. Feel said those who feel good. They're not talking about the actual via the one. That i was talking about the spirit of you. Know the one of being scared and all that no when we talk about the fear of god we are talking about having that respect forgot and so our guiding angels the ones that god has blessed to be by our side will stick holster s and help us keep out of trouble. What a great premise. Eight test and see that the lord is good. How happy is the man who trust in him. You'll come true happiness. Real happiness comes from god be in a real relationship with god and experienced true joy. Be in a real relationship and i said the word real because so many of us kind of like brushing. God yeah. I mean i'm in yeah. I love that. I go to change. I attend youth service. Tim their dot service. I do blah blah blah. I won't change man. I love god. I love that i love god and all that his grade but i truly in a relationship with god i you truly in a relationship with god you need to know the difference between the living god it actually been in a relationship with c. You can sub got. You can praise god you can do whatever full god but what does that amount to. If you are in a relationship with god you need to be in relationship with god so there is a difference. There is a difference. There is a difference on as i am also about knowing the difference in lemming the difference so much in your life man. I am so grateful full suite truth i am so grateful for the word of god because it has only been through the word of god that i have been able to lend in moldova. Some slow many differences. So much. That even i didn't know about into a set of reading the winning that is why emphasize on reading the woodfire because emails vital. Torri the woodfull for of when you're in the wet for yourself. You know and so i know because i read the way for myself and that is how come i came to land that. There is a difference with twin fans and it surprises me. You know because it's like well like. I didn't know there was different this on this news. The difference between this and there is a difference between this and this little difference lambere difference. There is a difference. There is a big big difference and so serving. god doesn't actually mean you in a relationship with him so make sure like ask yourself this question and looked on your heart and ask yourself am i sure am i am a relationship with god and it's not until it to you are in a real real real relationship with god that you can begin to experience the joy the true joy true happiness and real happiness. That only comes from father. You cannot get those spins from people you know from your significant other from your family from your friends. They are additions to that. So they add onto the joy they add onto the happiness. But the full amount of the four mess of it the fullness of joy the fullness of the true happiness in the true joy comes from that. See all the people around you. A chance to that you'll full amount of joy and happiness doesn't come from them and it is wrong of you to depend on others to depend on your friends to depend on your family to depend on your girlfriend or boyfriend full. You'll fullness for the traumas of that happiness joy that can only come from god. They are still that they want. Ads joy to your life. They would add a happiness to your life but the forms of it only comes from god so sick. Be in a relationship with him. So that you can experience the truthfulness of joy happiness fulfillment. That can only come from god thus mine all fee of load all you who belong to him for those who fear him never want for any offence. Men obey god and you would never want you will never be in made of anything. Why because god supplies your needs all your needs because he most to the full extent of what your needs are. That's why you need to trust god. Trust trust because he knows he knows. Sometimes not even your nose you know to the fullness of what your needs are you know a foot mar in the future you know in the knicks moment. You're no you're no but god knows. Trust guide for that a ten to eleven the young lions suffer want and hunger bad. They who look for the load wound not be without any good thin. Calm your children listen to me. I would teach you the fear of the lord so ten those will seek. God will always have good. Those will sing. God will always have good twelve and this is a question who is the man who has a desire for life and wants to leave. Longs he may see good fans and versus thirteen to fourteen. Have signed. It says. Keep your tongue from san and your lips from speaking is ten away from what is sinful. Do what is good. Look for peace follow it and there is your answer so the one who has the desire who wants to live a long life and good things in he. Or how's life. What do they have to do. Do you have to switch with. I want to live lungs. Which are i one fans in my life. I won a long good life wall. It's simple just keep your tongue from sane from the previous segment will suck it up by all you have to be careful about what you speaking because the tongue has also keep your mouth from same and your lips from speaking lives. Don't be elias. don't speak lies then what else. What else simplest away. Turn away ten away from what is sinful. Do what is good. Look for peace in full air is to look for peace and follow it so say god be careful what you're speaking out. Do good look for peace and follow air. What a blessing then fifteen to twenty two purpose arrests and it creates the eyes of the lord our on those who do what is right and good. His ears open to their cry. The first of the lord is against those seen here will keep the people of earth from remembering them those who are right with the lord cry and he hears them and hit text from all their troubles. The lord is near to those who have a hard and houston lives. Those who are brooklyn in spirit. The lord is our true comfort. Despite what you're going through if you are looking for peace you are looking for comfort. You don't want to look for both fins in human beings. You don't wanna go there because even if you did you won't find you on dissatisfied. See true comfort also only comes from god. Trapeze only comes from gutty. You've got to look for those things like i said. They may be additions to those things. But honestly the fullness of eight the extent of eight only comes from god so the word premises us and tells us that he is near us actually and it is. True of experience was the lowest grade. My best friend literally everyday is always there for me to supply all my needs. All my daily needs whether it be mentally spiritually emotionally. He is there so for all your needs. It doesn't only mean the physical needs materialistic needs. But not even emotionally even mentally got. Is there for you then just waiting on you just waiting the whole way. You like come on leggy and yeah just sokaia sika cigarette and you know what i mean. You will know what i'm talking about. It goes onto say a man who does what is right and good may have many troubles but the law takes him out of them all so sometimes just because you are experiencing troubles doesn't mean you're doing the wrong fans you know. Do invite in life in like you've just those bad vibe but follows you everywhere now because you can doing everything right in we do everything ride. God has promised to take you out of that. So trust trust in god he will keep all his bond sale who god will keep all your bones safe. Not one of them is broken. Seen will kill the sinful and also head guts. People will be held guilty and punish forever. The lord serves the soul of those who work for him. None of those who trust in him will be held against the trust. God sika lean upon. God we in a relationship with god confessed your sister and he will never heard you'll kilty for he will bless you. He was servia so he wants to serve. Souls guy wants you to be with him at the end of the day of the end of this f li life in the beginning of all insanity. Where will you be us why you need to sit. Gut cigars cigar. Any few are willing to come first of all those sinful as in. You don't want to leave that life anymore. And you're like you know what switch ruth i am ready to trust. God i am ready to lean upon him. I am ready to be with him to be in a real relationship with him. Not only seven him not only say i do this forgot i serve god i seven might change but truly being a relationship with him and i want to know the wet and rid the would in begin. What step number one. Then please if you are willing repeat after me deal load. jesus. I know that i am center. Am i ask for your forgiveness. I believe you died for my sins and rose from the day. I tend from my sins and invite you to come into my heart and life. I want to trust and follow you as my lord and savior. Jesus main amen amen men and if you pray that pray oh welcome from man. The angels' ma'am but partying heaven. Wile manual from god loves you so so much. Jesus christ loves you so so much. Bill blows being crushed and be feel as god bless you.
Talking SEO & Google Hegemony w/ Corey Northcutt S5Ep6
"Hey there welcome to beer beef and business the business podcast for smart people who appreciate the the insights found in a good conversation. That guy sitting at the end of the purview bar is your host David J P Fisher that everyone around here just calls awesome B fish. He's an author speaker and business coach. Basically he's a professional talker. So grab a glass of your favorite beverage. Grab a seat eight and join us for today's episode. Let's see where the conversation takes us. Everybody welcome back to another interesting conversation with an an interesting person today. The part of that interesting person. I my good friend Cory. North Korea is a three time entrepreneur. In He's actually currently building a company called North cut didn't spend a lot on the brand new sorry ads of buster jobs. north got they are SEO agency that works with national and international brands. And I do want to say that while I talked to career I am drinking a beer from our sponsor for the next couple of episodes. We got our first sponsor for season. Five schedule grooming. You heard about them a few a few episodes ago and right here in Evanston they have lots of great beer. This is how I know they make lots of great beer. I am actually drinking an IP. A down. And I'm enjoying it. I know that this doesn't happen very often but I really like this is their orange or I highly suggest if you we do enjoy as try it. Try It if you don't again I've been pretty vocal about my preference for not having hops and this is super tasty so so anyways that's around drinking corey. How are you doing today? I'm doing great. That's it that's it is great. I love it. Did you WanNa talk about anything else us. Now we're good thanks. Everybody here's my question for you so you are an SEO expert. And I always tell people that you are one of my seo experts. I have any questions I go talk to to. You and this was definitely corroborated. When in our pre call survey you talked about some of the trends that are happening in Seo? And I had no idea what you're talking about so even at that level. I'm like wait what's happening so I wanNA keep keep this broad as search engine optimization as even quite simply google becomes such bigger part of how we focus Our attention right about how you decide what to look at what to listen to we. We put Alexa or something like that. In our homes you know we say hey give us this information mation. There is a bunch of algorithms deciding what we actually have presented. What is the biggest thing that you're you're finding both interesting about seo right now but also maybe what what do you get a little nervous? About what kind of somebody who knows how the sausage gets made. What met may see a little nervous? I'm GonNa give you a completely different answer When you frame it like ahead? That's that's good. I don't know that nervous is the right word. But it's it's off putting Right now Google is amidst of a class action lawsuit dude or Oh wow okay does not know some legal proceeding. I don't know that it's a class action for essentially I think it's an antitrust Okay and a series of them and one thing that everyone is up in arms with In recent years is well. Google has policies. You can't scrape their results right like you can't set up a a piece of software to go in minded search results. Okay everybody does it. That's how you track your rankings with any software of you think about it that that is Google's business stealing your content They crawl your website. They download everything. They decide what they think of it. And then they decide how to return that they returned snippets increasingly singley. They return more right. Well sorry interrupt but that's interesting like just the idea of what comes up on your search screen right it used to be it I see this for example Song Lyrics Right. It used to be just. Hey here's a link to a page. That has a song lyrics. Now they just have the lyrics Rx right on the page theory. That comes from somewhere I guess. So are you saying that might not be that comes from. It's not Google did. Did you know about the big. It was a song website actually earlier this year it created out big. Pr Nightmare no tell me about it. Because maybe I saw aww and don't remember this but I think it was like genius like the lyrics database. They Google stealing lyrics like they had a lyric that was only on their website website. I think like there was a certain type of or something that was unique and Google had been advertising. Now like we've got machine learning and all these other algorithms like we would never just take the entire full form of your lyrics and return them as a result pay age we were linked to you. And but that's the end. They got caught. Yeah like it's like no clearly you did. And then they came back with like yeah. It was like a half apology. Our they ended up adding a link to their website. After you click the expand button in after you read through all of the lyrics for the entire song. That's like a page and a half words Ryan got a link back to their website so that there was nothing and this is what seriously concert producers are really upset about is just google increasingly getting greedier greedier with how much they can kinda run away with right on the results page. That makes sense. I mean I would be ticked office. Somebody was like I wanna get better at networking what are the top networking taps and instead of having a link to an article that I've written you just Google on the front pages. Here's top-five networking tips. That they stole from me get what does it look like if and again we don't know what the the legal proceedings are liked but I mean can you have a world of more than one search engine that's Bible 'cause I know there's been like bang. I mean which I'm sure is kind of like the joke. Like Zun. Is The joke of music players players or you know you see all these different kind of new web browser search engines popping up can you. Can you have a world where there's multiple web engines and I'm sorry search engines. I would say lawn service. That's tough right. Everyone's going to have their favorite. We used to have them work. DOC that at least more distributed market share used to be a bank like a little over half google than it was two thirds was google. Now it's like ninety. Ninety eight percent is Google at least in the. US Real. Yeah but gets its enormous like that includes like youtube in some of their other properties but yet all right well what are the top three and correct me. If I'm wrong. I thought I heard that the top three search engines at least in the United States were Google Youtube and linked Dan and Google Youtube or the same company so skip. Let me throw a crazy idea would it. Would it ever make sense to have google or some form of search engine. Good move from a private service to a public good right like we like a utility right where you just say. Hey we need to have access to information and I know there's talking about that would just the Internet general with. Would it ever make sense to do that. Like would that work I guess. I don't think it's necessary. Like computing keeps exponentially increasing in power. Right like it's easier and easier for people to call the whole web it. It blows my mind that the people do it in the SEO to will space you've got at least. I think five companies now that are very good at crawling the entire a web for the purpose of just sort of falling google around right so okay. So what do you mean would explain so you pretend I'm slightly ignorant here because I am sure. Say Crawling Crawling the whole web like they're going around and looking at all. The websites are out there. Like Google would all of the pages on all of the websites that seems pretty intense. It's very intense but what you're saying is there's companies besides Google. That can do that. Yeah and to that end and There's a company called. Ah refs that anyone who's really deepen Seo definitely interfaces with fairly regularly. They run one of the big back link databases so google. It doesn't actually tell you about who links to you okay. They try to curb you having too much information right there. They don't want you to see behind. The Curtain Morales become. Yeah all right. So yeah that basically sponsor of industry of companies that do and Who is I think actually has the biggest back? Blink database now announce Either early this year or late last year I think that they were gonNA Their own search engine. And I'll ed rooms like this is crazy. Why would you do that cycle? They already have all the data was just like at reframe. The like the front page of different interface on right Google's Google's doing like doing because they can but yeah other people are doing it so maybe just that there's maybe part of like a a curb almost like a natural life cycle that happens in a lot of industries where you see kind of the consolidation and then the break everything breaks aches apart consolidates it's like countries right. You know all all of a sudden. There's all these little fiefdoms and they become a big country and then they all start arguing. They split apart again and the Holy Roman Empire is neither holy nor Roman Empire Discuss Right. Yeah I think that's a good analogy Power ingred like. Just accelerates celebrates and accelerates until it's not sustainable and then it shatters and then do it again so so we could have a really good. Hbo Go Series Drama. Series out. Google after there's got to be one of the work somewhere. Yeah so so. What does that do for you in your all? Because you know you're talking with companies in kind of helping them to to navigate this Seo. Theo world which as you said is really just google. Does that mean that you have to be very agile with kind of what what you do and how you do it. Because in eighteen months the landscape might be vastly different. I would say vastly but we do stay. Agile just I work with Google. Because they're constantly making tweaks right guy and what a lot of people that don't work in Seo don't necessarily realize is. The foundation of Google really has not changed in the foundation of like duck duck. Go and being in the ENDEX and all these other search engines is not that different. The signals that the inputs that search-engine has a are what their words their links from one website to another There's sort of analyzing all these relationships of these things and there's only so many ways you can do that okay. So within the sandbox of things we have sort of like the core of like eighty percent of what Google really is in all the time I've worked in. Seo that has not changed the right thing you still want to have good links you still want to have better content more elaborate content more relevant content and it just kind of re Tools like like we know of hundreds and hundreds of factors but you could still do them and people do think even Google at one point a couple of years ago they recorded recorded anger to ranking factors content and links like well. Yeah I guess technically you could look at it that way you've got what's on your website. What is on your website a narrows it down right fair enough And so so you're saying as you said the core. The eighty percent has has remained constant. And is it the then the twenty percent the algorithm that keeps changing that flagware saying it you and your competitors editors are going. Hey if we can figure that out and then present these options to our customers we can help them. More effectively use. Is that twenty percent because it sounds like. That's what's going to put you above your peers right you know. Sometimes I would think that too but in my experience like it's incredible how bad most people still are. Seo especially at enterprise what you're saying that most people don't even have the eighty percent right right. Right I right like there's so much opportunity there. The twenty percent isn't edge for sure like there are times when you were just. You've got teams of in house. People that are dedicated. That's the Oh they all have. Seo In their job title. They're all doing good job. Did you see now. Like the got the new rich snippet like you can. Maybe Google like Sports Ford statistics that you get like the little table right there. Bit Hopefully unlike the song lyrics they actually linked to you great so what. What's a rich snippet? So rich snippets are anything you see on the results page. That is not ten blue links so it could be a map images statistics. Six other call outs all sorts of things. Gotcha so but but those are from other pages right right so Google's going back that idea the song lyrics they are pulling out from somewhere. Yeah so they all come from different from places For the most part they're free you do have like a Google shopping call out. You'll have little shopping carousel at the top of like products in prices. That you pay for you got the ADS. which is the traditional Google ads which they keep making more and more misleading on purpose? Change the background color. The font bigger they removed the they're actually by the FTC's guidelines on endorsements. I think the required to say that in AD is an ad but they changed the text. That was an ad the as subtle is it could possibly be. It's just like plain black with no background color. Now say they are pushing every single limit they can just to make their next earnings call. So Oh Google isn't necessarily a good actor we're go figure right but joe to go back said you'll rich snippets so you're saying that uh-huh yes some organizations are doing. Seo Right in there getting their content to be used as rich snippets or they're they're they're they're actively engaged in making sure they're eighty percents is effective but a lot of people aren't even doing that right. Yeah it's usually something something much simpler like you run a store that sells widgets right. Let's like the oldest. Seo Example ever the widget company. I use you've got some people love wages and you've got someone searching for widgets you've got someone searching for blue widgets. You've also got someone searching for who has has the best fits you got someone who only Google's widget features and you don't WanNa literally rank for anything that mentions which it the rank for that stuff you've got all these alternate the use cases. Were how people actually research things and there's hundreds of things right like you've got the five ws you've got all the questions to cover. I can't tell you how. How many big like we actually had been quoting out? Big Enterprise. Healthcare Company is. It's like we have fifty pages on our website. No one can find anything about us because it's just the products. It's no help information on anything if there is hope information. It's not framed in a way that people actually research it Russia's like jargon or codes it's like this is really simple. It's not like that last twenty percents. It's just put the words on the page like you didn't do the basics yet riots. They're diabetic scanner. Doesn't have you know blood sugar. Actually on the page with the bludger scanner right. Okay yeah so the basics basics are always going to be important as what you're telling me I love it so let me flip it for a second. You know we've been talking about how companies can use or should be using SEO. Do you have any idea any tips or thoughts about how to use Google effectively as a user. Yeah like wants something. I'm I'm asked too often but Sure like if I want to get the best results for answering a question like what what are some of the best things I can do with Goule rule whether that's shortcuts at might not know or are there some basic foundational stuff that most people don't know about using it. Yeah well in general take Google his his optimize it itself to solve this problem but there are a lot of things you can do. If you want to search results from like just one website you you can type in sight colon the domain so if you want something on North Cut dot com you type in sight Colon North Dot com whatever you want mm-hmm and you usually get it interesting. Great go through those that you're sites pages in fact if you look through the analytics accent a lot of sites you start to find more. People are doing that in a lot of cases in Argh even using your navigation menu so interesting in this search appearance is even like just like the basic functionality of a website can really matter so that's helpful auto suggest is always nice is tonight start typing you. Just don't hit enter coincidentally. That's how a lot of good keyword research happens is a lot of tools. That just brute force like Google auto complete like when you you now you start typing like what is and then it fills in the rest of your sentence that means that other people have searched that and it means that there's enough interest in volume around the. There's going to be something there hopefully in that. So that's what drives the complete is is what other users have searched for. Yeah it's it's been searching the past best okay. Hopefully sorted in order of how popular it is. We don't have the actual numbers in that case but yeah it makes sense right like they want to solve the most common problem. Yeah it's like this is what people in asking if we can shorten shorten your typing. God forbid you have to type another word or to don't make right. What any any other good tips for using Google that you like uh every time I think through this problem it's through the Lens of doing Seo? So I got a million other like you can do site colon. You can do in text colon Poland and it's only going to give you results that literally mentioned some texts you can do. It will only give you a word that appears in the URL of a page. They call the search operators. I don't know that anyone else really uses them though. At least it's like recreationally with Google. That's interesting though because I don't think that I'm completely unique in this but often I get frustrated when I am looking for a relatively specific answer and maybe I kind of know maybe now where the the the website it's on is but I kind of know the general general area in I'll put in a question and just get a bunch of stuff. That's just not useful ran in. I do this a lot especially when I'm like like researching I'm researching an article for example and I want to find out. How many websites are there? I mean that's just a broad question but it's sometimes amazing how much garbage or it's like old it's out of date. It's hard to figure out so at least I figured out how to do the time that that was a big one for me any figure out how you could do the timeframe yet with the advanced search. That's useful for the purpose of like cleaning up a search like you put things in quotes votes All those operators that I mentioned in just about anything you can also use a minus next two. So I've seen that a lot like I want an article about blinked. But I don't want ten pages of results from Lincoln which is usually what you get if you've ever used the word link because the site so popular authoritative so many links so you can do minus site colon. Lincoln Dot Com completely filters out linked engineer results while this conversation is just proven incredibly valuable for me. 'cause that happens all the time if you try to find Lincoln statistics. I'll get a lot of grey statistics from Lincoln. And I'm like no. I want them about Lincoln not firmly. Dan definitely edge thing so if I had to do a Google search right now on what would beers. You're drinking 'cause you're one of my my your friends but what are you drinking site Colon Beers Corey is drinking these days What what would you be drinking by Donna work? Did you like that transition. Just registered that so I've recently been a fan of New Belgium there dragons milk white pretty tasting was actually just up there. I with my my wife my daughter and you don't see it too much around here but it's Stacy's he's like dragon's milk because you'll leave stout it's usually really happy to a big fan. You got to be careful with slight. It's got a little sweetness to it. But it's slightly I'm the alcoholic side. Yeah it's a big one. The white is I think a little bit less so and a lot less heavy like it's still kinda tastes like SCAP A to step out but it has more of like a like a golden colored it tastes Likes Vanilla notes too. But it's just just like a much lighter stout to the point where you could actually Kinda get away with drinking in on a hot day and you don't even mind it like it's it's pretty dicey Larry. Oh that's that's that's good to know that's always the challenge of the summers. I mean I. It's a good excuse to switch to a different beers. But it's it's really hard to justify drinking and imperial cereal stout in Chicago when it's like ninety three degrees you know you're not like let's let let's pound this really dark. The beer as I sweat profusely. Don't wait until is it a stout or is it. It is still else else so far as I know. It's technically a stout. That's like a Golden Stout Golan Stout. Okay I don't think that's the thing. I don't think anyone else uses address. But it's always great when you've got an adjective before style of beer and the trick is just if you can get somebody else to use it. Go back to your somebody imperial stout right so imperial styles or just because think forget who started making them. But I don't think it was Guinness but it actually might have been but they were making beers for For Russia two hundred years ago so the whole they had to put put more hops and more Maldon because it was a long trip kind of the same thing with Ip as but right but the name imperial kind of came about because they were literally going to like imperial Russia to czar. And that was kind of the branding. And that's that's also I. Imperial sows are higher. Alcohol contents Said more more style Mall More hops but it stuck in. Now Laugh you'll make imperial stout out so as long as you can name some than anything yet. Somebody else go along with it. You're like all right. That's a new new style for Ben now I love it I like it just because You always have have good music. You're listening to what's what's something. That's exciting you right now. Aw in your in your Your ipad your your spotify lists what it was exciting to you state. Radio is has. I've been getting a lot of play so band that did not get super popular It was actually two of the members of another band called the dispatch. That was a little more popular. I've heard the name dispatch never mandate radio giving me some deep cuts. What's what so? What kind of music is it? I don't even know it's like good sort of rock. Jammie Jamie sorta music nick at Jam Band but somewhere in between a having some talented musicians in some good songwriting at the same time. All right show rock band with extended Solos. Yes I'll take it I like it I like. There's there's there's you know there's a lot of good old fashioned rock and roll these days so it's good to no at somebody's sitting at somebody's still making it Someone's got to. I sure there's still a lot out there. I've I've just accept that I'm not cool anymore so I don't know you and me we both men awesome way. I have a feeling that we could continue talking and we'd go in completely different directions but I think this sounds sounds like a good place for us to to wrap things up corey if if people want to reach out to you ask you questions or follow up. What's a good way to get in touch with you? Yeah you can email me. Corey and North Cut Dot Com. So C. O.. Ara Ui perfect. We'll make sure we put all the links in the show notes as well and of course WANNA send a shout out to sketchbook for being the sponsor of today shows. I am now pretty much done with my orange door. Double Dry hopped and again. I think that the biggest. I don't know what you'd call the biggest commendation I could give recommendation testimony like a gift for this beer is I don't like IPA's and I like drinking this this one so they make lots of really fantastic beers look for them at your Your local place where you buy beer or comes comes in Illinois check out their taproom its recently expanded is pretty cool and with that Corey. Thank you so much and everybody will see you next time and by employers I will talk with somebody interesting. And you'll listen. We'll talk to you next the next episode of be three all right. We're apply. Thanks for stopping by. You can find show notes and links in this episode at Fear Breath Beats and business dot com. We all know the best way to find out about new. PODCAST is through our friends so please help us out and share what we're doing through social media or just tell someone