1 Episode results for "Dr Theodore Schwartz"
Treatable but not curable cancer
"What's it like living with cancer? That's treatable but not curable. Hello I'm Annabi and welcome to talking cancer a podcast for Macmillan where I'll be meeting real people to have honest conversations about living with cancer in this episode. We're talking cancer with Adam. Let that if I decide in your brain but we turn away is going to have to operate need some and then the Black Sonya I knowledge is looking at Solomon Lipset. And when we're talking potential BRAINTREE RATIOS WENT. Yeah potentially thirty one. Adam Carroll was enjoying life and enjoying a job that allowed him to work in New York then on one of those work trips. He had a seizure and collapsed. And because I work in a quiet environment they will just fell over. Sorry I was on my way down laughing and cheering then and some went on us. Not Normal Adam was diagnosed with a grade. Three brain tumor when doctors can treat it and manage it. It's something that Adam has to live with forever. Five straight on the the triple private travel is maintaining life and always news. We signed to be managed testimony. And even if there is nothing to come alongside Zappia wherever my first molar? Some doesn't matter. How long is you may have seen. Adam on the TV show first dates all from the price coverage which followed a thing. Really take a lot from his story and later the kettle on for Macmillan Professional Dany who will be here to talk about the one hundred thirty thousand people in the UK with treatable but not curable cancer. The biggest impact is living with uncertainty. And not knowing. What's around the corner even if you'll responding to treatment you don't know how long it's GonNa be Forum for some people. They find it quite difficult to get their head around that William McMillan and we're talking Cancer Huh. Hello Life it's lovely to have you with we all get. It took a lot about your cancer during our conversation. But let's start with life before cancer. What will you like back? Then what was your life like? Let's go that. New is now but just minus the cancer. What what kind of a person would you say you are really? So how old are you five? What do you do for a living work for stockbrokerage about the gatekeeper side of it? You know I'd say the moneymaker said. They should've worked hard. Say to myself every day so in New York for you. Stay in a hotel where you with friends. I mean life within hotel but really swanky hotel as working out there yet. This is absolutely brilliant. An messed up didn't miss out. Don't be silly. Was your life going to plan. Then what we all kind of hopes and dreams I spill. The plan is just was just like today always was on. I think and my more than ever he always will be. And you have your family your brothers and sisters. I would probably older sister. Mammoth at the down. Ken I'm a mom and dad quite pleased with the way Adam Gorgeous. Son's life was working. You'd have to ask them not to extend American. Was it more like I'm fine. Code has been sacked. Let let's talk about the day when you collapse them because this is where everything everything changed with. Was there anything that you had noticed about about how you felt. That could have predicted this salute. Nothing as way to swing. Because I didn't even have had I feel I didn't feel ill whatsoever. I just stood up in your office today to some of the best can try them. They're not actually a member not being able to speak and I stepping up my words and can't remember claps him and because I work in a quiet environment they will just fell over. Sorry I was on my way down Nakayama laughing and cheering and some went on us. No lie on the floor convulsed today and from from that the the memory is a little bit closer and then blackout and then next K. memory is on waking up surrounded by New York. Paramedics dramatic film but it is quite dramatic. It's probably not nearly as glamorous as it is. That is quite dramatic and you know a few to be so ill far away from high So he had anybody come with you from the offense when senator combined an NBA wants everything that happens and Arkansas. Spill and been diagnosed was the company took steps to get my father out to be with me. Okay so you you being dealt with by the paramedics in New York. What are you hearing about what they think it might be? What are like the pit with the paramedics but when it got arum stuff like that and being blue lighter hospital it's all a blur really. I remember I remember trying to speak to my colleagues on. The New York office comes with me. An connor remember China. Talk to as if to say you making a designed Yeah College. Go BACK TO WORK. And he was just like no. We have to do this and then I remember hospital and there was a nurse. I spoke to rigidly. And she's like we'll see signing sap wounds so we're GonNa have to do a scan on you at that point and you'll conscious by Ya. Fully aware of the conversation is putting and at that. Point is like quite quite flavor through quite pretty quiet. She was laughing back and she's really cold. And then our heads my scan comeback up that I must have been our lighter Aaron halfway or whatever this is all happening this like that. Luckily soldiers blur and and the same nurse. She says all we've got your results are how kind of the main change to the point where I was like. Yeah I was like she guises SOMAC-. We've let that if I decide in your brain but we don away is going to have to operate. And then the Bob Sonia Oslo. Yeah exactly that and I was looking at. She realized Solomon upset with talking potential braintree mercury issues. When yeah potentially how did you? Why did you jump to that conclusion? Whenever you got inside suicide crazy we'll is going to be saying really really bad. Jeremy alcon wouldn't just collapse overhead. So yes my mind is like the worst case scenario. We you in pain at this point. Nine zero pain and enough. That point hasn't been didn't affect your movement that is It's about right about Iraq. If you have a seizure obviously then let your speech because I wear my brain. Jeanmarie is is in an area. Brainwork affects your cognitive functions. Speroni's say things like balance walk in talking and stuff like that Not Not all. That was fine. Believe it or not hearing voice now. That was for a very very through few hours. How long are we talking in between you hitting the deck at work and going into have you think so probably collapsed about one o'clock in the afternoon they WanNa Cook? Let's be appropriate. Oh by God and I come out of Kasey they put me on the the the brain surgery. Come out of that fully morning and by that point. I'd already got my dad out to New York did you. Had you had a chance to speak to your team dot com. Yeah because it's all just like who hands on deck because see what I've got going on or had no chance to talk to anyone like my family or nothing. You must have been terrified. I was is the most multi life by mile absolutely. I can't believe you didn't have time to speak to anybody that you know what I think it was. I'm a frequent in that situation. They dislike when you see this dude I was was. That was on the cards. At that point was that somebody mentioned we need to do this? Because you walk critical Ni- Ni- wherever it was the case. Oh no diaper. They never said anything to me. They said time is of the essence. And how how does American emergency surgery situations compare have you? Uk We well looked after. Did you feel like you're lucky enough? We get private carefree work. Say We was look house looked after. Reread well out there. And did they. I mean at this point. Were they using long? Words that you didn't know did they. Were they examining just in? Let's do this man is like very simplistic layman's is just like this is this. This is the south the Bob. See so the guy popsy this is novel Mac. Caveats while Vince I. It was all meant to be a little spice happen in New York. His name he's literally the most famous brain surgeon on the planet. Dr Theodore Schwartz. So I'm very important so I was like who is just chomping. My head open good with in hospital. And he's on Sky News. Cnn order talk in America like the Oracle of brain surgery. So I was like yeah. He can come ahead. I've been again so I if you're not cultural gain you can. They then do a biopsy the you're awake for Yes not fully under because You levels and stuff but yeah as close to being under as you possibly can actually being under but not to the point where I actually remember him doing any surgery or fell anything about yeah pumped me full of some ridiculous. She stronger trucks. Because I said when I wake up I was trying to take them on my cable's out stuff like that and our sign. I want to go to up and this is a reaction from the medication. You were taking your all your line for a Guinness. I mean to be honest with you. After the experience thus far I think most of us would be reaching for a strong GIN and tonic. So you got the biopsy. You've got the incredible doctor but this this whirlwind has got to come to a point. Which is your diagnosis. Yeah so at. What point are you told the? This is what you have wanted. This as I sought after the biopsy soda is a gray free greatest. I'm a brain SHAIMAA. Fatal shoots again said Ball. I can cut more. So we're GONNA put you back here from Oh surgery. And that point is that she more scattered at one. That was the first because remember the first one second one night about free. Think of it because By said Yeah. We're going to get you back. Eight and feet. I signed up you get. He said I'll can take more of the chamber out and then let it be on your merry way member for free days sitting in a hotel by my dad loss APP. See Myself and an well. I mean you know everybody that we speak to. The wait is the worst. And now you have your dad there as well so the world is a very different place all of a sudden he might. He might be like a holiday. We were at Central Park. He signed picking up pictures you wanted to buy from street sellers is that for a while with haight. Do you think did you did you. Did you talk about the important stuff with him on those three days or did he try? It's a we'll figure is aware of it. It and it. Kinda got brave mentioned Buffett. Buy Because we're not very good relations stuff that side who is like. Let's just get drunk and worry by reading New York exactly? I wanted to see what hotel from highline and stuff like that. He wanted to Wat- my husband. Damian would do exactly the same thing hilariously. Christmas is Christmas without home loans. That they were trying to find the bridge in Central Park. Mike in this means hopefully she might save everybody. Who Needs Dr Schwartz the pigeons? So what do you at this point? Now that you've been told you this grade three brain chamber you don't have some more operations. What do you at this point? No about what that means to you. So I'll say cognitive googling newness everyone can up. I didn't scare myself more and then realizing the you can treat it but you'll never fully go That point Oh yeah this is pretty rubbish and then but yeah so after this law freedom more surgery he comeback. He said that he said he's delighted of height. Would he said zone? Eli residual cells left the so cancerous he says but we've right effort became a for. Ap that should be like under control. You'll be absolutely fine. He says I'm happy to send you back to London. Amazing so they're right here for. Joe Is pretty naive. They ready for came for beefing. This will get rid of it. And it doesn't it just manages it and as an is the reason why you thought that because this this phrase which is treatable but had not been fully explained to you at that point and actually that probably when somebody says that phrase you for the first time probably quite it actually is not as specific as you might imagine. Personally he made the most sense abuse oncologist at Macmillan Moreland 'cause he said the he said Oh. See what we're going to manage this retreat is. We're going to manage it. You guys by one is one is you would never ever get a full clear. I'd suppose but at point US except in Affleck or is it a point whereas I will everyday's a bonus say just treat me. Did that make you more all kinds of more determined to live your life. Well daily basis ordinary people say they get hit by a bus. Tamara is vice. That -ality overseas. It's not like I could just got pie and leave a playboy though some treatments. I'm feeding pre pre RIPI for all of it but they kind of just get to the point where it's like see what he's wiping. Praise blessed to still be and so. Let's talk about the treatment the managing of the year. So what does did you come up with a plan to buy? Give you a plan so that you knew what you were. Yes shorts in New York said the said the best course of action would be to do right affair P. Khaimah therapy doctor. Muholland come up with a look at a time plan for that. So that took. I think nine months at the same time because what we're learning as well as everybody's treatments to you tomorrow was for days in a row of whoa right effort going into UCLA. Ch- everyday for days getting zapped and a guy and I think it's maybe a month break of that okay got inside the McCain for a p which is Oral Chemotherapy. Say taking tablets at home. So that for twelve months maybe stay with twelve months. Knifing talk maps exactly and then after that Dr Mohamed suggest is like who'd immunotherapy which is Well I mean mostly my I should I more schools have been doing it targeted combinations of drugs which I suppose is really used for brain tumors by Dr Mohamed and say because Iraq did so well to. He felt comfortable enough to be strong enough to take it. Are you working through this time for the first nine months? The rate of therapy chemotherapy. Night work gave me that time of. How were they were? They were a London. Got ripped a little bit as I. Anything for. A DAY OF FOOD. Science stuff but My work have been amazing. Saddam went down Whether my need for the first four months that are more intense than the rest of the things I work at four months of. What do you mean by that does that? What do you mean by into hospital over? A billion in getting your treatment site as site spent over the course of the year two different drugs but first full mumps every two weeks for you weeks. It's like they. Crime it within its star. Yes it's make it more bearable for most. And how is it? How does it affect you get Kinda? Give me kicking three days. It wasn't nice. Tie Tie aided by you'll be sick. 'cause it's a cool. Ivankov MOMS and you get scanned. Quite regularly The proof was the spicing. It wasn't doing anything. Just let stable size. I I'll take any kind of sickness thanking those little wins really points where I'd be like frying up or feed inaudible and I'll be like what's the point and then I guess that's the point a wants to exactly emotionally around. You know the you know you died in you know. That's probably the the way that most people are and you just get through it. What about your your wide family? What was that like kind of breaking the news to them if they so when bumped up meeting New York? She get quite badly but she was like the retirement. Age guys take retirement. Just how it works. Because I'm not coming out. This guy is is nice because concord straight because Adams where he is so she retired side. She is me Barbara. Sister Sister said she was actually in pieces when it found out what happened in New York which I wasn't surprised about Bravo said the same thing and I was surprised about because again as one of let me kind of thing. Basically he him really hard and then I was if he wants about. Food is an issue. I think that was as scared about me in the treatment as I will. If you've got your pipe until I saw you can take a few TOPIX. Say off that I think it will be and I think it's going to point where I kind of forget how she was just like hanging person. Yes on and say you know apologies for the the phrase but you know you'll you'll brain does tend to forget on purpose. Yeah everything well and this is I mean this is this is the the you know how the how this is affecting you on a day-to-day basis. So you must miss work. Yeah I'm sure in that environment with everybody. It's actually just being off work and not being around people I get back. I'm in favor and I like being around. People are chain Goblin stuff sign those contemplating life of living cancer. It's not ideal for me. It's not what did what did you do to relieve that. Start running. Okay I get fit and healthy so you could. He run for a bus decides running around park every day. Is the goal from this year. Oh you've run a run walk. Yes cold well. I'm the best of luck with that. So how far can you run at the moment Regularly run so ten K. Hoffmeyer funds before so Nakal half-marathon score to us. She Best Ten K. Time if the minutes maybe yeah okay as a while ago. Haven't done a guy. Are you the type of person that needs a goal in an audience? Yeah Yeah Yeah no my my other half is exactly the same So the running is keeping you busy with good keeping your trouble And your you needing to be careful about what you eat. The pork scratchings in the pint may have gone so I actually don't six months of night drinking Quite recently skit thing here and in spy went full football in salads and stuff like that are now for some kind of like reincarnation of God and the Christmas drink and again so so we're not a window in when you're in treatment as well. I'm sure you have to be careful about what you eat. Yay ECON tycoons everyday. So they what. You're eating a lot more because I mean obviously before everything that happened. I was just a standard working in. Yeah just like tyco every lunch. Just coffee coffee coffee coffee. That happened. Okay Office party more To kind of help about do you think what's happened to? You is affected group of mates as well like giving them a an opportunity to reassess their lives. Do you think I think so I think in yeah I think in half of cases? There're I think there's people that were kind of on the verge of that mindset anyway and then I'll see this happens and I say however reacted and what I've been doing. I think that's giving them a little nudge to kind of see what they was kind of thinking of John by people POWs who will pop pop pop football that kind of stuff once you kind of like wanting to get away from that. See Wild and free and as a at she. Wink nudge in the ribs. Get fit they look after you so I ate are. We couldn't do this reply and goes still were still lacking on that from our first dates was selfish reason behind it because looking for love but also because I think that happens and cherries kind of got wind. The my story they knew is applying for it they vote and as I quiz us a like as a fico study and I was like yeah of course I was. I bring wider attention to braintree stuff like that and I was Kinda got in Shifu. Laugh now actually. It's a pretty big platform. He's very popular shy. People people will see so it's like Yay an ideal Charles to get my story out there and even if one person saw me thing was and ask you and I were. There is hope kind of thing though. Yeah right well we need to sort this out anybody out there. So you know what? What sort of reaction did you get your the poster boy for brain Absolutely yeah like Wellman. Just yeah the reaction of people not social media which is like nothing I ever expected whatsoever. It was a melon are doing a lot of work to raise awareness of treatable but not curable cancer like yours. Adam is a useful term when you're telling people is because for Kazuyoshi you get people to see in that I think. Look ill you must be back on his trip curable. Release that kind of insinuates? The there is no like end. Care kind of thing by just manageable but like come come this for free years basically since smart devices and I still feel waffle but never For if I was kind of benchmark to get somewhere than any head you baby by this time is six months or twelve months. They'll be kind of new treatments and stuff like that and I think it's happening more and more now. I'm not saying it's GONNA come out and it will just be. Branching was done golfing. There's always hope thing. Well I mean you know the immune the accumulate for immunotherapy thank you. That's quite new locker trophy. Lot I think about is quite pioneering. That's really interesting as well. Because I guess I'm the you know the treatable but not curable tag Could quite happily sit really heavy with you. Make it very difficult to kind of look straight on the the triple Pavitt. Trouble is of maintaining alive and all eyes news we signed. It has to be managed for similar. And even if there is nothing that can come alongside zapping wherever you for a small Sarma. Formiga does matter. Hold on is very proactive person. I just we'll just get we'll just do it. We'll just do we have you other people with this condition is you and has that been has been helpful so a friend of mine. She does a lot of work for a lot of community law. Remond and yes. I see regularly does Get togethers and she does not shirts and stuff like that. So met hundreds of people in the community. And we'll still in the same boat and it's not by anyone most obey. He just kind of get them they make some people and then you like you make people think you're really well or not so you have like you have like a down day number person you like. Oh actually got nothing to mind about. Wow you know. That's that's the that's that's the strength that you get people in in the similar at that have similar conditions is that everybody has these good days and bad days. You know when it's when you are given that I noticed that is treatable not curable. I know that some people in the past have kind of you know felt very had a very physical relationship with with the tumor with the cells. Still there does it do you. Do you feel like you need to get rid of it the whole time or you out one thing. I'm the point now where it's just like every time I have a scan. I say it's not doing anything. Find you just keep on doing anything. Fine your carry on all day. May that's really free month's time. Yeah Yeah yeah absolutely. And there's there's you know I suppose that the big questions the big questions in Life Adam It taught now I'm not talking about. I'm an Aston Villa Fan. I can die. No I have to carry that cross. Okay can you pinpoint how this is really changed your life apart from you know the obviously martier physical aspects of in how that has changed you but has it changed you as a person I would say no loads of people would say yes. I think that's I am a bit more than a bit more people carrying bit more like white about other people saints have been more of a purpose in life. Which is why I'm doing stuff like this. And the future before this liaise absolutely no. I wouldn't like maybe on Friday night at ten o'clock. I'm you all daring to forward to that. And what what does the future? What's on what's on your horizon? If things you want to do a go you got him back to New York. Anytime soon. Disinfects collapse again? Life each goes I've seen a marathon is the mice of upcoming one am beyond just livers. Life is no more possible maybe going first dates again on just for the rankling without him. He's still young for using birth dates. He brings in ice to talk to you. That was been really really rely on. And we wish you all the best. Thank you very much dany or Macmillan. Professional is back with me. Hello lovely. What do you make of Adam Story? Oh really really interesting and slightly different in terms of being diagnosed in a different country but amazing that it all came together for him and also that he got such fabulous support from his employers. Very bizarre how it all unfolded but you know in the right place at the right time. Thank goodness so we're talking when we were talking with Adam. You talked a lot about at the phrase treatable but not curable cancer. What does that mean? So essentially years ago those types of cancers often meant a Qua- a poor outlook on people may have survived a year or two but with new treatments. What we're seeing is that people have options for different types of treatment. The cancer will never be completely eradicated so the term treatable but not curable kind of identifies you know that they can have treatment to keep the cancer at bay or control it or treat symptoms but it won't ever advocate cancer at the point at diagnosis. Would your Doctor Tell You That the CANC- you heartless treatable nor curable. They might not use that terminology in essence spot. There are some Kansas where it's fairly obvious that they're not curable and also the stage of the cancer can indicate so it's dialogue that might need to be ongoing so it might be. The first conversation is around that staging and that the hope is what? The treatment aims all but sometimes if the person kind of is asking all the right questions then absolutely the commission will be as open as the person wants them to be so it might be that. It's it happens in two or three conversations rather than Bam right at the beginning It really depends on the person the type of cancer. I'm what treatments are available. Because they may not be a hundred percent. Sure what type of re response someone's GonNa get but they would definitely be articulating. The of of the treatment is to hold the cancer at bay manage symptoms. Even if they don't say the words treatable but not curable and it's important as well to clarify that treats will not curable is different to terminal. Yes I mean when when when somebody is not going to benefit from any treatment the term. That's probably used as Palliative and supportive treatments so you might still have chemotherapy or radiotherapy to manage symptoms but the aim of the treatment is palatable supportive and give us a sense of what life looks like for someone who's cancer is treatable but not curable. I mean you know. He's he's a he's a from this and he's got his he's got his life and he goes well go football. He has made adjustments. But what would what adjustments would you expect somebody going through that to have to make? I think the biggest impact is living with uncertainty. And Not Knowing. What's around the corner Even if you'll responding to treatment you know how long that's going to be for what we often find. Is People find it difficult to plan like we would plan something for next year? You know for some people they find it quite difficult to get their their heads around that I mean Adams actually adjusted and worked his way through that and I guess the other thing is the. They're often on constant treatment. So some of the treatments available to people with incurable cancer. They have to have for a minimum of two years. Like the. Yeah with my little understanding of immunotherapy during during that time you know you have to really look after yourself. Don't you yes. I mean I mean we even with other types of treatment and with any type of cancer. We know that if people take care of their physical and emotional health and the general well-being they tend to do better and there is research in some Kansas. That it does help you know. Hold BACK A risk of recurrence CETERA. So so taking care of yourself. Your physical health is important. What are the different treatments? That people might have then in Adams case. Because there was that was a patchwork of different a different treatments that he's encountered so a lot. A lot of chemotherapy. Regimes are a combination of drugs. And they all have acronyms because a names of the drug saw a mouthful but it's not uncommon in some types of cancer to have what we call. Neo Chan treatment. So That's chemotherapy or radiotherapy. Both before you go on and have surgery. So what what's the purpose it? What's the purpose of that then before surgery because my my my head? I'd be like that. No you know surely you need to go in there and cut it in in areas where things are more difficult to do surgery because you've got lots of important structures around trying to kind of shrink down the tumor sewed. It makes the surgery easier. is why they do it in someone in Adams situation. Then what kind of support might someone need with this particular type of cancer on? Where would you go to find it? So if he was looking for help with a physical animation or impact is. Gp is place to start. There's lots of local support services that will help somebody Equally he did find his own way and some people can can do that in terms of some of the cognitive impact of having a brain cancer that can be more difficult again. He might want to have a conversation with his specialist team more. He's Jay Petty because Thou- that'd be more targeted support. He was really lucky in that. He had really good support from his employer. Unfortunately isn't the case for everyone but you know he. His story does demonstrate. Actually if you have a good employer with good support it makes the world of difference. Khloe and Adam have found a lot support in other people in their situation. How do they find those networks? There's lots of different ways. People find those networks so that sometimes they find them online and using social media sometimes they connect with people when they going for their treatment because they're all sat in the waiting room and there are often local support groups and again. It's about what's right for you as an individual because people will want a different Approach but actually. That's not uncommon and lots of people really value peer support. And they also like to see and connect with people that are further down the line so that they can save people have come through it and as things stand with the current treatments available there will come a day when someone with treatable but not curable cancer will eventually reach terminal phase. A how. How does the system deal with that? They consultant or the conditional the team supporting the treatment recognizing that treatments not benefiting the person anymore and I guess the person themselves will have a sense of fat that I'm actually. They're not getting the same impact from the treatment and conversation has to be the K- And talking openly bounce it and allowing the person to make their their choices. There's lots of support out there for people to kind of Live their life as fully as they can right up until the end and it's just about having the conversation I think with either the or The the hospital support team. That's been supporting them to help them find. You know the right support for them. Dana thank you so much such stabilizing voice in all of this confusing terminology in these incredible stories. My thanks to Adam for coming in to tell a story to get more information about what we've talked about in this episode then go to our website. Mcmillan DOT ORG dot. Uk forward slash talking cancer. Next time we're talking life after cancer with Erawan came in and she sat in the car with men and she looked at me and she said look old years I've been with. You're never seen you quit on anything that you've ever done and they're quite powerful words when you open your eyes out because I stopped crying immediately and I looked and I thought you know is this her way of motivating me because if it is then I need to take. I'm Annabi and talking. Cancer is a Macmillan cancer support podcast