20 Burst results for "David Hackworth"

The Ceiling You Can't Break Through is Made By You

Jocko Podcast

06:11 min | 3 months ago

The Ceiling You Can't Break Through is Made By You

"This is Jaakko podcast number two, fifty, three with Dave Burke and meet Jaakko willink. Good evening. Gave good evening. So. Last couple of podcast to fifty one with Leif Bob and two, fifty, two also day burke we're continuing to make our way through. This book right here guidelines for the leader and Commander by General Bruce Clark. Leif and I made it up to page thirteen. David I. Last time we made it up to page twenty eight. There's one hundred seventeen page book. Just almost impossible not to find lessons and say to yourself. I don't need to worry about that section right there. So the take these. Experiences from this. Leader Commander. and trying to play him and this this book was the guidebook. For my biggest mentor Colonel, David Hackworth. Author about-face. And there's so many threats. I just noticed that thread today or on the last podcast, the thread between General Clark and making the men stand to them being okay with it once they almost got overrun and Hackworth just there the threads just connected on that last podcast. So the threads keep getting connected. If, you want to see the threads of the way hackworth learn to lead. Which? In turn taught me how to lead they all tie right back, General Clark so that's we're doing. We're tracking these left lessons to their root cause to their route. To the source. And learning as we do it. So part three of guidelines for the leader and Commander by General Bruce. Clark. first-section section we get into today. One Chapter Five. The conduct of inspections? And I'll tell you there's as I was as I was parsing this book the first time I prepped for it I thought late and I we're GONNA get through half of it. And I thought Leith and I will do back to back podcast we'll be half, one podcast. So, we'd cover sixty or so pages, and then we do have we do come to him back to back. We made it through thirteen pages. So now as I'm reading it, I'm looking for like the breaking point where I can go. Okay. This is a good section this section today the the end of this section where to cover today is It's it's. It's freaking. Epic I'm I don't feel that we're around very often. So we'll get there but this this chapter five starts off with. The. Conduct of inspections and the first question is why inspect and then it says there is a saying in his nation does well, only those things the boss checks. This truism originated insofar as I am concerned from a speech that I heard made by vice president of one of our largest corporations this is not a new thought to anyone who has military experience because I have often heard it expressed as anything that has not been inspected has been neglected. I changed the way I said that word neglected, but it made it sound a lot better. So anything that has not been inspected has been neglected. If these things are true and I think they are it follows that anyone who has important position must be able to check in on or inspect the operations which he's responsible Leif when life saw this. I. Think I sent a picture of this delay because this is you know a line that I hear life say a lot. It's a line that he heard me say a lot and we always attributed to, Hackworth. We always attributed to Hackworth. And guess what it didn't come from ACWORTH. So how to inspect return about how to inspect civilians often think of a non commissioned officer and officer as a demon inspector. A demon. Inspector a good inspector is certainly not a demon but good inspectors are not plentiful in the army or out of it however, to be a successful non commission officer or a successful officer wants to be a competent inspector. This quality cannot be attained without a considerable amount of study planning and practice now. This is interesting because. I wasn't sure how much of this section to cover because. Inspections are not something that I utilize to any great extent as a leader. When I was a leader I didn't inspections was not one of my big tools. And so I thought well, you know. We'll talk about it. You certainly have to inspect things and I get that and that's why I would say that Hey, an organization does well, the boss checks. I've said that many times and I believe it but also. I believe that if I have to inspect you that means I'm doing something wrong somewhere else you know what I'm saying like if I've got it if my Gig I've to inspect you. That means I'm making some other kind of mistake somewhere because. Should I have to inspect your weapon is ready. Should I have to inspect that you've prepared for an operation I have to inspect that you've done the work that you're supposed to I shouldn't have to inspect if I've led correctly. Then You know why you're doing what you're doing, and therefore you don't really need to get inspected because you understand the why you make things happen. So I've always had that attitude. It's been very successful for me. So I wasn't sure how was sure how much I was going to get into this whole inspection mode because what I don't want to do is create a bunch of leaders that are going out there becoming these inspection. Happy. Dig Down How come and inspect you use funny with my kids. A belief the. Whenever my wife's not around my kids are they have to do everything right? And so I'll say are you what time will you be ready for inspection? They just get so they know what that means I'm going to inspect I'm going to inspect any better squared away so. I didn't want to create I. Don't want to pass on this. This idea that hey, gotta be Inspection Inspection Freak.

Hackworth General Clark Leif Bob David Hackworth Commander Officer Dave Burke Jaakko Willink David I. General Bruce Leith Vice President Commander. Acworth Clark.
Guidelines for the Leader and Commander

Jocko Podcast

06:21 min | 3 months ago

Guidelines for the Leader and Commander

"Is Jaakko podcast number two, fifty two. With Dave Burke and me Jaakko willink good evening. Dave. Good Evening Echo Charles is taking care of some other business. On the last podcast. Number two, fifty, one with Leif and we started getting into the book guidelines for the leader and Commander by General Bruce Clark but we only made it thirteen pages in two and a half hours, and it's one hundred, seventeen page book. To, recap a little bit, this is a book that I searched for for over a decade I originally heard about this book in my favorite book, which is called about face by colonel. David Hackworth. Finally, found a copy a month and a half ago. and. So here we are just a little background once again on General Bruce. Kark. World War One. World War Two Korea enlisted in one thousand, nine hundred and up going to west point colonel in World War Two. Then a general commanded the Fourth Armored Division in Patents Third Army. Battle the Bulge Distinguished Service Cross three silver stars forty five years. Of Service? And then spend a bunch of time not only leading troops but also training troops or overseeing training commands so. Awesome Career Hackworth talked about him glowingly in the book about face and That's where that's where the star took me a long time to find this book. Who did somebody texted me about it. And said, it was the white whale. that. It was definitely hard for me find this book, but we have it and that's it. That's what we're GonNa do where do you go back into this book? So here we go back into guidelines for the leader and commander by Bruce General Bruce C Clarke. This section starts off with administration some thoughts for the commander. And he says inflammation, I would like to point out the close. Interrelationship between training programs. And Sound. Overall management. So this is something you know when you're that young gung-ho leader. That just thinks, hey, where you're operate whatever that operation is whether it's shooting machine guns or whether that's out selling things or making things and you think, Hey, I'm I'm on the front lines I'm going to make things happen and you think all the administrative stuff you shouldn't have to worry about. That's not me. And I know many individuals that are like that I know one individual in particular like that whose name is Jaakko. 'cause I was definitely like that. Many commanders. I should say I. was like that when I was younger because I absolutely I realize this and you can hear. We'll talk about the paperwork drills that we had to do and how. Life. Came to me. We shouldn't have to do this stuff and I said Oh we're going to do it and we do a better than anybody else. So I figured this out but it is it is definitely a learning moment that people have and so why not learn it right now many commanders are defeated by poor administration. Imagine that just that statement many commanders are defeated by poor administration not defeated because they were tactically unsound not defeated because they made bad decisions not defeated because they couldn't come up with a good plan they fail because their administrative losers. Without. Sound Administration at Commander CanNot Succeed in his training and maintenance programs. Good. Administration is nothing more than applied common sense. I'm including here a number of items that may well be considered a checklist of indicators of sound. Administration. Number. One. Importance of time. The principal coordinating device in the army is time. Learn the proper time space factors. So you can be on time and make reasonable demands of your subordinates. So. So that's number one by the way, which is probably why you hear a lot of talk about time management. Just think about the idea that the first thing he's GonNa say is time this is someone who clearly understands that have all the resources in the world that we have. That's the one that matters the most because we just can't produce more of. I was GONNA say it's the it's the one that matters the most and it's the absolute one that we have the least control much control. You have time you zero you cannot stop it. You cannot bring it back. You gotta say the power curve. I hate that fewing. I hate that feeling and let me tell you what. I realized this a while back. So when you go to the airport if you show up at the airport late. In now look TSA doesn't care that you're late the baggage handler doesn't care that you're late the uber driver does not care what time your planes leaving they're they're doing what they're doing, and so what that does is it takes you have no control. Over that time once it started to commence, what do you have control over going to the airport a little bit earlier? That's all. That's all not that big of a deal. Go to the airport a little earlier, and you won't have to worry about TSA. You won't have to worry about baggage you won't have to worry about. How long it takes for the Uber driver or the left let's give proper. Credit or lift driver to show up and bring you to the airport. Not so so how'd you get control? You can't control time once it's unfolding you can't bring it back you have to you have to plan for appropriately. And there's a there's a sense of urgency and I have a pretty good sense of urgency and you you may have may or may not I know like at the monster especially the earlier musters when we weren't. When the backside wasn't quite the well oiled machine that it is now certainly as a well oiled machine now the early musters do. Not a Well oiled machine. So on the on the front side, people would know that when Leith and I were walking out on stage at eight o'clock in the morning, we had two hours sleep because we had to do whatever we had to do behind the scenes and that's just the way it was. I can feel I can feel. When the shortage of time in fact, I think I feel the shortage of time every single day single waking minute.

Commander Jaakko David Hackworth Dave Burke Bruce General Bruce C Clarke General Bruce Bruce Clark Charles Leif Fourth Armored Division TSA Leith Korea Patents Third Army Principal
"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

Jocko Podcast

02:01 min | 2 years ago

"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

"So officially by the way we stop this. This was like think I was talking to leave the opposite of the path is a slippery slow. Okay. You can step off the path for ten minutes for one day for one week, but keep in mind the more you're the more time you spend. Slid. It's the slippery slope. So boom, unless if your whole mindset is to drink more just because it tastes good. No exercise, no this, but you're, you're, that's the wrong path. You're going in the wrong direction here. A foot on the slippery slope at that point. Yeah. And you, you could phasing. They're only that tastes good, boom, same reason, but you're not. You're saying your pizza. You're two feet are off to mock one foot on the path mocking working out. You're on the path. Okay. Real quick because we're getting crazy here. We got Menchaca chip, we got peanut butter chocolate, Dave Burkes favourite, Mench officers, my favorite. What's your favorite mint. Minute, but you mix them 'cause you're psycho well, and then now new to new flavors are out. Vanilla gorilla and we got a chocolate which is called the darkness. Whenever gorilla I was like, hey, no, we need to make it vanilla gorilla. And then he, he liked paused texting. And he's like, wait, seriously. And I was like, yes, and he made a little crazy looking vanilla grill a little white Grenet guerrilla. So anyways, vanilla gorilla is the name and the chocolate of course, is called darkness. And if you don't know, there are layers to both those comments. If you know about the darkness that know that one. And if you know if you know life when you can figure out the vanilla aroma. Yes, these are all impeccable things can impeccable that might not be the correct word, but they are impeccable things to stand. Keep you on the path. Plenty percent. Indeed, hundred percent also chocolate stores called Jaakko store. This.

Dave Burkes Jaakko hundred percent ten minutes one foot one week two feet one day
"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

Jocko Podcast

04:28 min | 2 years ago

"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

"It's what I feel like you at the roll call at the roll call that we just got done, which wasn't event. If you don't know for military first responders, law enforcement, paramedics firefighters. Those a lot of people there that are straight up on the path, three legitimately on the path. Yeah, it's one of those deals where you know how like when you hear a certain story and then about so many like, dang, that's impressive. And then you hear it again and again and again, and then you're like, okay, you know, I'm kinda used to it. I don't feel like I've gotten used to this at all because everyone stories kinda different, you know? So it kind of exposes this element of like real like. Just immense individuality of a person, you know? So it's it's kind of like, I don't know. It's like, I don't know, maybe like your kids birthday or something that happens over and over again, but never gets old, you know, kind of that kind of situation. There was a guy he was like, and he just told me this while we were listening to you guys do to us just right in the middle of it. Just kind of in my ear, dude, I lost seventy pounds. Just because I'm on the geez guys were just guys and girls, females, boys and girls. Men and women were walking up to me and like show me pictures, hey, this is what I looked like fourteen months ago. Of lost thirty eight pounds or whatever. Awesome. I got promoted. It's it's, it's awesome. So yes, you are correct. There's a lot of people on the path kids. Everything kids. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. People I, I made videos for kids. I was looking at videos. Kids kids doing pull ups. It's doing ju jitsu low warrior kids straight up on the knowing the knowing the Gettysburg address. Hey, look at this kid. Look at my son. He knows the Gettysburg grass. He's six. No look at my daughter. That's six pull ups right there. You know how many she could do last year? Zero. You see what I'm saying? Yes, sir. Do you think it's gonna get crowded on the. No, it'll get wider. Maybe the path is wider, gets wise. Everyone's kind of on their own path, but their stay unified. Yeah. Oh, there's there's common ground on the. There's. There's based on a fundamental level. Actually, there's, there's immense commonality. But the path is big enough to to maintain the not gonna get. There's not gonna be a traffic jam on the path. No. It's the, it's the more people have Pat, the faster it goes momentum. Yeah, yeah. Shoot, so. All right, we'll take leadership principles and apply them to yourself. Yeah, yeah. So it's almost like a lie to yourself. Think about that. You think about the little lies. You tell yourself? Oh yeah, it'll lies. So long time ago, my my mom was like overweight, I didn't. I mean, I guess I knew that when you're little kid, you know. And my and then so she got on the path back in the day and and she lost a bunch of weight and my dad said, hey, you wanna get your mom for her birthday. He's like a mirror of full size. Mirror because she lost a bunch of whatever now and I was like, cool, you know, don't stuff, whatever furnish. It was a furniture, good, whatever, whatever you know, then I kind of thought about it and I'm thinking about it more now. It's like men, you know what that, you know what that says that says that, like, you know, she was like overweight and she was from my dad to know that into take action like that means that he knew that she was in a way in one way or another avoiding the mirror. And I would say straight up avoiding it, but she just didn't wanna see herself in the mirror. You said the same thing I said, I guess I said that a little bit of different way, but she didn't wanna see yourself in the mirror. Right. Like if you have a and you're gonna think about it. Sure. You have a mirror in the bathroom and it's sort of it, but like, I don't know where where else do we have mirrors right? Like I don't know in the bedroom or some girls get ready. I dunno compared to my car. Situation, the mirror in the bathroom medicine cabinet. That's it. He. My, you know what you're right because both my daughters, my older daughter's had mirrors in their room..

Pat Kids thirty eight pounds fourteen months seventy pounds
"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

Jocko Podcast

03:39 min | 2 years ago

"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

"I wanted to just grab a couple sections out of the Vietnam primer. Again, this is the book that that Hackworth wrote with SLA Marshall when they got back for when they got back from this toward Vietnam few months long, and they went and talked debriefed all kinds of people. And again, there's all kinds of tactical level lessons in here. I mean, like real tactical, doubling security contending with the jungle security on the trail, the company and movement, field intelligence. I mean, there's the defensive perimeter. It's very, it's also a very short book. It's not even one hundred pages long and Lega said, if you wanna get this, if you're in the military, you might be able to use this. If you're leading. If you're platoon leader, you probably get some. Isn't lessons learned out of this, but this isn't one of those books that translates directly to business because it's actually not. It's not about leadership. It's about the tactics of. Plenty infantry platoon infantry company, so, but that being said, of course there are some. There are some lessons and what's interesting to me as also as I found these leadership lessons, they're not just leadership lessons beyond being leadership lessons. There's a lot of lessons here for. You as a person for me as a person, and you start taking the leadership lessons from Vietnam primer and applying them to yourself. I think you could see a lot of crossover. Starting from a leadership perspective, though, here we go Vietnam primer. Back to the book, our mistakes in Vietnam are neither new nor startling. They are not something we can blame on the mysteries of warfare. They are the same problems that have been haunting small unit commanders since before Gideon. In peace or war. These errors spell the difference between professionalism and mediocrity. Many young leaders enchanted by the Hollywood image of war approach combat with the good guy versus the bad guy attitude, but there is no similarity between what John Wayne gets away with on the screen and the hot hard facts of a firefight. A small unit leader in combat cannot afford to have a film heroes devil-may-care attitude toward training discipline and basic soldiering in the recipe for battle victory. Well, led and disciplined soldiers are the main ingredient soldiers who have been conditioned through training to react by habit. When confronted when confronted with the searing realities of engagement, the habits learned in training, good or bad, are the same habits that move the soldier in combat. A leader then must ensure that each of his soldiers is well trained and has developed good habits habits, so deeply ingrained through correct teaching and intensive practice that even under the pressure of fear and sudden danger, each soldier automatically will do the right thing. Check. Continuing. There is no magic formula or sweatless solution by which one can achieve this goal. There's no, there's no hack. Leaders may approach training for combat only with intense dedication, accepting as gospel,.

Vietnam infantry platoon infantry Hackworth Lega John Wayne Marshall Hollywood
"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

Jocko Podcast

04:47 min | 2 years ago

"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

"Would it surprise you to know that the chief concierge at the Continental Hotel Saigon's top hotel was in fact working for the Viet Cong Hackworth it wouldn't surprise me at Ted of sixty eight. The secretary of to the commanding general of the US forces in Vietnam general Westmoreland was found holding an AK forty seven with the whole Vietnamese apparatus. I never once trusted Vietnamese. I never trusted a Vietnamese general. I never allowed a Vietnamese inside my camp. My firebase if I were going to meet Vietnamese Colonel, I would meet him outside my firebase because I didn't trust him. I seemed everybody was vehicle. Question and these are the people you were meant to be fighting for Hackworth. That's right. And that was my attitude. The soldiers from the night. The vision hated the South Vietnamese soldiers more than they did the Viet Cong. So what he's saying right there is I'm gonna read that again. My soldiers from the night division hated the South Vietnamese soldiers more than they did the Viet Cong. That's horrible situation. They saw them coming in going out. They saw them going out on operations and not beating the enemy, but voiding the enemy, they called it search and avoid where it was supposed to be search and destroy. My betine could go all the way through the same area and come back bloodied and battered that really got to my guys. I was walking the perimeter one night. I used the British system of STAN to in the evening where everybody was at their post with a weapon ready to go just as the sun was going down. One of my sniper said, sir. How's the body count today? And I said, not so good. We only had eight or nine for the day for the battalion. And he said, well, I'll get you two more before I could stop him. He took out a sniper rifle, I looked down at the end of the weapon to see you where it was pointed. And it was pointed at two South Vietnamese. Soldiers guarding a bridge about forty meters from my perimeter. I knocked the weapon up before you had a chance to scream squeeze off around. This is the attitude of a lot of soldiers. They didn't like the South Vietnamese because they didn't pull their weight. Question. Why did massacres occur in Vietnam Hackworth. Well, the big massacre was me lie Lieutenant William Kelly and captain Medina where the principal characters involved in that act. Why did they have that occur? It occurred for number of reasons. The soldiers were frustrated. They were mainly frustrated because of mines and booby traps, and because they could never find the enemy, they were just tripping through minefields and seeing their mates blown away. Never grabbing hold of the enemy and getting into a real fight. Then there's a lot of people in a village and then insanity takes over and they just start blowing human beings away. It's also about bad leadership. Tenant, Kelly gone through officer candidate school. He'd gone through three separate courses was found wanting in leadership in two of them and had been recycled instead of being booted out. The military was into a numbers game and didn't want to have a try high attrition rate for their officers. They kept recycling someone until they graduated. So here's a guy who never should have been trusted more than an army PFC ends up Lieutenant. He's with a platoon of soldiers who extremely frustrated because of mines booby traps, and he doesn't have the leadership ability to control them to say, stop that fire. I think massacres occur when you don't have strong leadership when you don't have soldiers who are extremely well trained and well, disciplined and well controlled by their leaders. That's what happened. All those components fell apart. And I think the book that we covered on the meal massacre actually gave even better details obviously, gave better details because it's a full book, but I really was one of the key things. I remember I remember how the intelligence escalated escalated and I'll tell you something else. He saying that you know that Lieutenant Kelly couldn't stop them. Lieutenant Kelly lead that massacre he led the massacre wasn't him saying, oh, I can't get control the guys. No, he was actually doing the massacre and they were. They were actually following. And that wraps up that. That wraps up the interview has kind of abrupt ending. I don't know why it's so abrupt, I looked around to see if there was anything that was missing, but that's that's how the that's how the interview ends, but I wanted to go from there..

Lieutenant Kelly Hackworth Continental Hotel Saigon Vietnam Hackworth secretary Vietnam US STAN battalion principal officer captain Medina forty meters
"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

Jocko Podcast

04:17 min | 2 years ago

"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

"They made the price. So heavy for the Soviets of in terms of costs that they blinked first and got out. Again, they used an incredible number of mines in booby-traps creating a great number of Soviet casualties. The Soviet units did that did well. There were special units led by people who understood that form of wealth warfare. But they're conventional infantry was exactly the same as the American conventionally between Vietnam or the French conventionally infantry in Indochina question. Why did the Soviets failed to learn from the American and French mistakes? Hackworth? I think it is a military mindset. We don't want to go back and look at the past. We're in such a hurry to get where we're going. There's a certain amount of military arrogance. The older I get the more I realized how we never studied the past and try to learn from it. We just stumble along and make the same mistakes. We're doomed to do that until people wake up and with the military mind on not sure we'll ever wake up. Got to keep your ego in check. Gotta learn from the past. Hundred percent, correct question. Is there anything about guerrilla warfare, which is new this century. Hackworth well, a number of things or new, the amount of firepower that the insurgent employs uses the use of booby traps and mines. The ability to communicate via electron of communications. One of the problems that's always hampered. The grill is getting the word out in the days of old. It was done by messengers, which two days and hours today general has very sharp communications out in Somalia. General Adid had little portable radios to talk to his soldiers, very low frequency. The American CIA's intercept devices are all high frequency. They couldn't listen to what the man was saying. They didn't learn a thing. Question, how frightened was the average American conscript faced with all these obstacles and the skill of the enemy. Hackworth the average American soldier going into battle in Vietnam carried a whole pack full of fear mainly because he wasn't trained properly. Back in the states. The training base was just off. They were preparing for World War Two, not for insurgency warfare. So the lad received sixteen weeks of trading was flung into Vietnam generally in a unit that was never kept together, but it was always filled up by the individual replacement system. As a result, there was no real strong cohesion not work in the unit, and this is something that SLA Marshall talked about in men against fire. The soldier was like an orphan thrown into a family, but a family that was not solidly put together as a result, his fear level be because of the uncertainty of what he was going into. The typically the typical kid who went to Vietnam was black, twenty. One percent of all soldiers were black and the Hispanics and the whites were from others. The other side of the railroad tracks. If you went to good university like Brown University or something, you'd find you didn't find yourself carrying m sixteen rifle in Vietnam. You did a Clinton, you got out of the war. It was very unfair. The poor working classes with the ones that carried out the war effort. But they're made of tough stuff because their whole life required tough stuff. Once they were provided with the leadership, the proper leadership that raw material did a hell of a job. But it didn't make the fear go away. When you're playing in that kind of a lethal Super Bowl, the possibility of dying in coming home in a rubber bag is always lingering in the back of your head. Regardless of how courageous you are. You will still have fear, but if you have competent leadership that you have confidence in and if you're well trained, you can get the job done. It's my theory that the better trained you are the more natural courage you have because you have a belief in yourself..

Vietnam booby-traps Somalia CIA Clinton General Adid Indochina Brown University Marshall Hundred percent sixteen weeks One percent two days
"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

Jocko Podcast

04:03 min | 2 years ago

"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

"Question was the April nineteen seventy five victory of victory for a people's style of war Hackworth. I think that the victory in Vietnam introduced a new phase of warfare where low intensity conflict can eventually win question. What was what does the concept of people's war mean to you? Hackworth it's the same thing that my forefathers employed in seventeen seventy six. We wanted independence and we were willing to pay with our lives. All people want to be free. And if they have that anger inside them and the ability to arm themselves and somebody comes along and says, hey, I'm your leader. I'm gonna show you how to do this. The one guy who's trying to suppress them is in trouble. Question, what are the key lessons to be learned from the Viet Cong success? And actually, before we go to that question, if you think about think about this from a leadership perspective, we all wanted independence. We all want to be free. And if somebody comes along and tries to dictate to you, how things are going to be that person's in trouble. Right? So as leader, if you try and impose your will on people look, can you get away with it? Yes, yes. Does it work if you're, you know if you can fire someone or you. Yes, but to be actually lead someone, you can't just try to impose your will on top of them. Need to get them in the game to next question, how important was mass mobilization to the success of the Viet Cong. Hackworth. If you're going to fight a war today, you're going to need your whole nation behind you either as fighters or supporters or carriers. It's no longer the act of a few soldiers fighting on a sunny hill waving swords at one. Another warfare is now the employment of the complete population. The Viet Cong took on two superpowers France and the United States, and they couldn't have done it on a shoestring. They need to mobilize everything within their nation and they needed to get as much outside support as possible. At the end, the war became almost a conventional war. One of the things that bothers me is that the Americans who are now trying to rewrite history of what actually happened say, we won all the battles, but we lost the war, but we didn't win all the battles. We lost most of the battles. This is really, this is really critical. And this is a very important thing to think about. The reason they've come up with this very bad rationale is because of the American way of keeping score in the old American way of conventional warfare. If you're king of the mountain at the end of the day, you've won the battle. But to the Viet Cong it wasn't who held the ground. It was what kind of punishment you inflicted on your enemy. The Viet Cong North Vietnamese were willing to pay an easier, easy ratio of ten to one. If you fought him and you one soldier and he lost ten. He walked away saying, I was the winner. There's the mentality that you have to understand and that's why you have to be willing to kill and you have to be willing to die. If you're going to go to war, that's why right there. Question can parallels drawn between Afghanistan and Vietnam between the Vietnam war against the Americans and mujahideen war success against the Soviets Hackworth. Absolutely. There's no question that the that there are sharp parallels between the Afghan war and the war in Vietnam. The fighters, there were freedom fighters. They were trying to rid themselves of communism. They were supported by outside country. This time, the USA who poured billions of dollars into that war. They tried to win by using an enormous amount of firepower said they being the Russians. The Russians tried to win by using an enormous amount of firepower conventional tactics against the search and destroy operation a high degree of technology, all the mistakes that the Soviets maiden Afghantistan the Americans made in Vietnam and the French maiden Indochina. No one looked back on the lessons learned..

Viet Cong North Vietnamese Vietnam United States Afghanistan France
"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

Jocko Podcast

03:40 min | 2 years ago

"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

"Offense means you offense is you strike I it. You have the initiative that's when you when you have the initiative that's offense. Yeah, when you're reacting that's defense. Yeah. For like in your situation that you're like. So if I punch you, I was on offense, right? Yeah. If. I just I was on defense. So yours was like a pump you weren't punching? Yeah. Interesting. Yeah, it's it's, it's hard to, I guess, really get the capture the actual how you explain that. I think the best I could do is what I just said. Operationally, you're on offense, meaning we're pushing into your neighborhood. Yes. So that's essentially blow like this. If you had a a bar, you're the bouncer at a bar and I had a beef with you. I showed up at your bar, right? Right. But once I get there and get your face, boom, you crack me. You just went on offense or even better while I'm going to your bar one of your boys steps out of the alleyway. 'cause he was waiting for me cracks the bottle in the back of the head. Right, to be ready for like you could? Yeah, whole 'nother thing. You gotta cook ten with different orders. They'd better kill me. Killing you and deep into or scenario. There. It is a bit of. Try and be on offense that if you if you at least the lesson to be learned there for me, if you're at least think about it at least think about that you wanna be on office, right? And that was was nice about these. A lot of missions that we did Iraq. We were surprising the enemy, but if you can surprise the enemy, you're on office. Yeah. So, yeah. So like even like you're back to your example, your your missions, just the fact that you initiated that capture kill mission that your offensive and defensive movement. Yeah. But just like when I'm coming to the bar, I gotta get to the bar. That's what I'm getting accent in order to get hit. Right. So it's like throwing a punch with that with that other hand up, it's important to note that we would teach our guys to have at offense of mindset. Meaning when we saw one of our patrols on one of our vehicle patrols or a foot patrol UT every guy ready to engage the enemy. A most likely the for shots gonna come from the did that happen. Also know there's sometimes we, we know on a patrol guys engaged, I or that that could happen. But most likely that that's luck. That's luck because most likely the enemy is a little bit smarter. They're hiding in a, you know, when you're walking thing about when you walk down the street thinking, how many windows there are, how many doors there are. So now you just walk down the street and how many windows can you see two hundred? Three hundred, right? I mean if you're walking down the city street, you can see a hundred windows. Let's say one of those windows could have a bad guy that in you kit. You're not gonna see him. Yeah, he's I, yeah. So. Check next question in April of nineteen seventy five. During the fall of Saigon. There were some memorable images of American helicopters taking off from the roof of the American embassy in dozens of South Vietnamese, trying to escape. What were your feelings when you saw those pictures? Hackworth. I was heartbroken when I saw the end calm and the helicopters airlifting people off the embassy, but at the same time in nineteen seventy one. When I left Vietnam, I said four years from now, the North Vietnamese will fly a flag over this capital. The reason I said that and I was dead onto the month was that I had been like a doctor feeling the pulse of a dying patient, and it was obvious to me that this patient, the South Vietnamese government was on its way down..

American embassy Saigon Vietnam UT Iraq four years
"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

Jocko Podcast

03:00 min | 2 years ago

"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

"So I mean, we, we work on offense eighty five percent of the time, but we were on offense. A lot of the time the the boys were getting out on offense and surprising the enemy on a regular basis. I mean, probably more than half the time because we were also doing things where would definitely we were on the defensive. I mean, it's offense and defensive at the same time when you're pushing through when you're doing a clearance operation, you're on offense, but you're on defense because you're the enemies waiting for, you know. So there's a little dichotomy in doing that type of mission, but like doing it direct action mission where you're gonna go and take down a building where you think there's a bad guy. Your offense when you get to that target. But while you're going to target, you're waiting get ambushed. You're waiting to get ambushed. That's what you're doing. Even though you're scanning, even though you're looking for threats, you're still waiting to get ambush awaiting a rollover ide-. So you feel like you're on offense that we train our guys to be an offense. The the reality is the first shot in those situations is absolutely going to be fired by the enemy. The the idea is going to be initiated by the enemy wants. You do the raid, the rate itself. That's us being on offense right there in their sleeping or they're, they're not expecting you to come and boom, you blow their door off and you enter their house. You're on offense. That's like four minutes is. So you're saying before that before that while you're going to the targets, they protected himself with whatever measures, unrelated. Like let's say you're going for a bad guy that guy x. and he lives in the house. You know you're going to get him. And when you get there, you're gonna surprise him and he's not gonna be expecting you. But on the way there that guy z.. Bad guy m. and bad guy ETF have all set up ambushes on this road. Not maybe completely disconnected with x. okay, but you are going to have to go through the ambushes that they've set and and they don't care. They'll sit up that Bush tonight known comes. Okay. Said no one comes tomorrow night. You only got to go down that one road one time to get ambushed. So you're when you're going when you're when you're moving through enemy territory, you are on defense. Again, that's not the mindset we teach. The mindset is like we're on offense where we're gonna go get some. The reality is the first shot is going to be most likely most likely fired by the enemy. Most likely. That's the way it is in we did. I mean, these big clearance bees, big sector that we were doing. The army was doing the brink Odem and like I said, you're on offense. It's an offense push. You're making the initiative, you're taking the initiative and getting in there on a on a operational level. On a tactical level, most likely the enemy is gonna see, you, I, they're hidden. They're hiding the two rooms, deep in a building there. They're waiting and they've got an ID Baird in the road. So so offenses kind of when you think about it is just like a mindset kind of mainly to begin with because it so it's like a, it's like a forward leaning mindset..

Baird Bush army eighty five percent four minutes
"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

Jocko Podcast

03:36 min | 2 years ago

"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

"There used to be x. amount of enemy attacks day. Now there was euro. Sorry, hack. Come on. Don't worry. I got you. Wasn't the fighting from seventy two to seventy five more like a convinced more conventional warfare Hackworth it was conventional warfare. A guerrilla campaign starts with a few people who are dissatisfied, they throw rocks at the enemy. They finally kill an enemy soldier and get a rifle, the more rifles and they rate an armory and they get more weapons and they build and build up phase. One of grill campaign is individual sniping laying booby-traps and low scale, conflict type fighting the final phase. The final goal in phase four or five is to move in brigades and divisions and cores in a conventional formation. And that's the culmination of the war. Which is interesting to think about when. It's like one of those situations where what made you strong you leave behind? Right. It happens with companies all the time. You know, this company starts off their small nimble, they can adapt to the market and then over time they get so big, they can't change any more and than some other company that was a startup is now smaller nimble and can take advantage of the changes in the market. Same thing happens. Unless you pay attention on less, you keep yourself unless you enact decentralized command, you can prevent it. You can keep if you, if you start to centralize everything, what you have to get somewhat more centralized when you grow like that. Like one thing is in the military, you say, well, we've got decentralized command. Well, part of that part of the reason we have that we can. We can let people have decentralized command is because we have the discipline trading up front, right? So once a company as a company grows, if you put discipline on them, you can allow them still have decentralized command and act very quickly be gotta, have trust in your subordinate leadership for sure. To to be able to employ that. Next question, but the actual defeat of the southern government was by the North Vietnamese, regular army that was hardly Viet Cong victory. Was it. Hackworth oh, I think that the architect of that general trae was Viet Cong a southerner. He was the one that planned it. There were number of Viet Cong divisions. For example, the night Viet Cong division in the delta fought in the final battles as a regular unit. Sure. The majority were regular forces for the north, but they fought in hit and run type operations. They always fought on the offensive. That is interesting to note is that of a hundred percent of all contacts when one guy attacks. Another eighty five percent were enemy initiated. That means that throughout the war, the Americans were on the defensive eighty five percent of the time and the enemy. The Viet Cong and the North Vietnamese was on the offense. If you can't win a war by being on defense, you have to have the offense of power. We didn't have the initiative throughout the war from beginning to end the initiative rested in the hands of the opponent, the Viet Cong and the North Vietnamese. That's like in jujitsu, when someone's just attacking and attacking and you're defending all time, you're going down a meet eventually you're going down eventually. And that was something that that we definitely changed up in for my last point when we were Ramadi with tasking bruiser. Whenever you're on patrol, you're on defensive, you're on the defensive. But once you set up a little overwatch position and you're waiting for the enemy patrol will now you're ambushing them. So now you're on the offense..

Ramadi Hackworth eighty five percent hundred percent
"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

Jocko Podcast

04:25 min | 2 years ago

"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

"Everyone had been fed these glowing after action reports by the president Lyndon Johnson by general Westmoreland that there was light at the end of the tunnel that we were prevailing, that it would only be a matter of months. The American public was still oriented towards World War Two. They were believing that as long as we grab this real estate, we would eventually find the light at the end of the tunnel, but the light at the end of the tunnel was Viet. Cong freight train coming on full bore. That's what we discovered in tete of nineteen sixty eight. And that was the turning point of the war question. Why was it the turning point? Hackworth tat was turning point because it destroyed the will of the American people to support the war. Those soldiers who were in the know realized that this was just the beginning of the end. We saw that the American people switched off. If the support of the people is not there, you are going to be caught off at the legs and that exactly what happened in Vietnam. And this is a when I was on that show on the history channel, the warriors show, and I talked about how you had to have the will to kill and the will to die into show about Markley. And that's, that's where that quote that I, that statement that I made is rooted in what I learned from acworth. That is, you have to have this, will you have to have the will and the people the nation has to have the will not just the military has to have the will. It's the people, because what is what is the military? The military is the people. Back to the interview. There had been a fair amount of support for the war until Ted of nineteen sixty eight people thought it would be unpatriotic not to hang in there and wait until we grab annoy. When we when the people saw Viet Cong climbing on the top of the American embassy, they knew that they'd been lied to. Then they knew that this war was not winnable. All they had to do is ask their sons by that time. Probably a million Americans had served in Vietnam and he'd come back home and told their parents and loved ones. The truth about the war. The government couldn't just provide it with a Madison Avenue, snow job anymore. Question, could the war of been one. Could the Viet Cong have been beaten Hackworth. The war could not have been one unless the host country, the Saigon government, the South Vietnamese changed their very repressive form of government and won the hearts and minds of the people there the northern government headed -ployed this technique, and they'd created the promise of this utopian dream. As soon as they kicked out the invader, this repressive South Vietnamese government, the South Vietnamese government never understood why? What never understood that they had to make those changes. They were led by greedy people who are into making money. They had no contact with the people in the main. They were mainly Catholics and they were into they, and they were trying to rule a country that was ninety percent Buddhist. Question. Why was body counts so important? Or was it Hackworth? McNamara was a number cruncher and he wanted to have something to crunch a number. The overall strategy was attrition to wear out the enemy by counting bodies, we would know the impact of the war, its success or failure that became the standard measurement of success. It was the score and everyone wanted to know the score. What really happened was the body count counting completely eroded the honor code of the military. Specifically among the officer corps, a top people to lie. The young fresh lieutenants out of the military academies were taught to lie. The generals who are pretty proficient liars anyway, pushed the body count. A high body count meant great success. So in every battle, enemy bodies were counted several times if there were two hundred bodies, suddenly the figure became six hundred fifty. And it became to quote with Westmoreland another great American victory. It corrupted the officer corps and appalled the soldiers who by that time we're mostly draftees. They were scurrying around the jungle counting bodies, which was a pretty awesome and terrible thing to do. It had a real boomerang effect on the military because it was like a cancer. It destroyed its soul..

Hackworth Vietnam Westmoreland Ted Lyndon Johnson officer corps president Markley American embassy acworth Saigon McNamara ninety percent
"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

Jocko Podcast

03:43 min | 2 years ago

"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

"It was easy to dig in, but still quite strong and easy to shore up. They could go down to three, four actual floors with pumped in air and brought in water. It gave them a secure area that was really behind the American lines and the America's never really worked out, but they were there. For example, there was a place called the iron triangle. There was a great number of such tunnels and a general named Williamson took a brigade in there and said, the iron triangle is no more. That was in nineteen sixty five at the beginning of the American involvement in the war when the north. Seized the country and they win when they won the war in nineteen seventy five. Their headquarters was in the iron triangle in those very caves. That's, that's like another situation you call this area secure in the enemy is actually has their headquarters there. Crazy. Next question wasn't possible to block up the tunnels or gas them or blow them up Hackworth. We try to everything possible to destroy the tunnels, including having small soldiers called tunnel rats, go down and try and clear them, but they were so cleverly done. You could never find where the actual end was. There will be a dead end with a hidden door going down to the next level. I'm sure that if enough creativity and effort had gone into it, then yes, they could have been closed up, but the top generals were not concerned, an anecdote. A cave expert came to me between my tours in Vietnam and my office in the Pentagon. He said, look, I can help you win the War. I can tell you where the caves are because this is something I've studied my whole life. I took him to my boss, Vietnam veteran who is very excited about. We took him to our general it. He didn't wanna know about it. Who wants to waste money sending this guy over there and have him examined tunnels and caves. What's he gonna tell us again. It was the mentality that firepower will win the war. These great outpourings of American industrial strength will win this war. This arrogance didn't allow us to get beyond a blinkered military mindset. Good advice for life in this. This is something that with echelon, front working with a lot of businesses, sometimes your strategy is wrong and it was Louis. And that's what happened in Iraq with us. Your strategy was not working. It took us some time to figure that out and start doing it counterinsurgency campaign, but see, this was businesses lot to they're using some strategy and it's not working, but maybe they used it twelve years ago maybe two years ago and it worked and and they were celebrated and now they're just going to do it harder. Do the same strategy more seems like that's the case with marketing marketing. Just changes so much. You know, like when you're marketed to the new strategies that it's not as obvious, but the old strategies like door to door salesman. Oh yeah. Door to door salesman comes to your house now, bro. Didn't wanna hear it? Why did you even come to my hot? Well, that's like, wouldn't that be considered just a complete waste because you gotta pay some kid. Forever. Twelve bucks an hour to go door to door, whereas you can pay twelve bucks and send out a, I don't know mail something, but even Email old. Yeah, that's what's the new deal. I don't know Facebook ads even that's kind of old now, but the no door to door. There was a time we're door to door was dope. You know what's funny is I still talk to people that will go out and make stuff happen door to door. So now it's old school again, right? Coming back. Here's the thing usually door to door seems like a hard sell, so sure they'll make things happen, but it's not as a fishing as other ways, like newer ways of marketing. These people come to my house door to door people. They want us sell me stuff. Yeah. Yeah..

salesman Williamson America Hackworth Facebook Vietnam Pentagon Iraq Louis twelve years two years
"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

Jocko Podcast

04:01 min | 2 years ago

"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

"When the first soldier hit it, he would lose his life and maybe three or four people behind him would be down obscene what we call number ten cans. The large cans packed full of c. four and so filled with nails to have a fragment effect that it could take down ten or twelve people. The impact on the soldier was a psychological impact that every time you put your foot down, you didn't know whether you're going to have a leg a limb or a life. Then this played over and over for three hundred sixty five days of going down trails going down waterways. It took the fight out of you. I took over the battalion down at the delta. It was called the hard luck battalion in six months before I took it over it at six hundred casualties killed and wounded all from mines and booby-traps. It had never met the enemy. It was all from these insidious little devices put down by these people that the generals didn't count because they didn't understand the nature of the war. Yeah. And I think I think the numbers for Iraq was seventy. Five percent of the casualties were from ID's seventy five percent off to confirm that, but whatever it was, it's a huge number. It's a huge number. And then must be an odd feeling to find that, you know, like, dang, they made that bomb out of our stuff like especially at first when he used to, it's different like you're like, what? If you came across the the results of a bomb and it's like, dang, does using that coffee. Can you know like two days ago or something like that, ROY. Yeah, that's why disciplined soldiers wouldn't leave anything behind ever. But lack of discipline soldiers would leave all this stuff now. Now I sometimes you drop bombs and they don't detonate. That's so they can't really far anyone for that. But yeah, coffee cans. They they. They taught us when when I when I was going through training, they taught us like we weren't allowed to leave anything behind couldn't leave anything behind because we didn't want the enemy to use it. It's the way it was. And you know what the, you know what the Iraqis Iraqis did the same thing. The insurgents I should say the insurgents in Iraq. They used old ordinance now, some of the old ordinance that they used was actually from the old Iraqi army, a lot of it. But a lot of it was from unexploded ordinance just like what the Vietnam vehicle used in even. To me, it kind of seems like even if it wasn't stuff to us, like I mean, man is the spectrum like some, you know how like when on the movie where the the criminal they're chasing the criminal with the dogs, and then the criminal left part of his shirt or something. And then the dog sort sorta smells it. It's like that feeling like your enemy has like something a yours, right? So he on one side of the spectrum is like, okay, they use it to make bombs, which is kind of just maybe psychologically just kind of odd. And then just the fact that, for example, like what, if in Iraq you capture somebody or whatever, and he has like a pair of like some old army boots or something, for sure, buddy. There's well, I'd say, yeah, that's, that's a, I see hitting you, and I'm trying to figure out why this is kinda shocking to you and it must be the first time you've ever thought about this. Yeah, yeah. For me. Like, for instance, this was horrible. So just think about this, there was an element of snipers that got overrun in Ramadi. And so think about what the enemy got sniper weapons night vision. That's always like you're horrified night vision, goggles and sniper weapons, so that it takes what you were just talking about in multiplies at times a lot because now the enemy has legitimate equipment that puts them a little bit higher than all the tactical level. So that's definitely scary. And that's why were so careful about never leaving anything behind..

Iraq Iraqi army Ramadi Vietnam three hundred sixty five days seventy five percent Five percent six months two days
"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

Jocko Podcast

03:44 min | 2 years ago

"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

"Now I'll tell you what if that recent fighting in. In Iraq against ISIS. There's been a lot of bombing in the bombing. His been, let's just say it was very, very productive, very, very productive, and they killed a lot a lot, thousands and tens of thousands of of ISIS fighters. And even with that being said, there was ground forces that had to move in. But man, they did a lot of devastating, devastating, destruction, the ME without stuff. So I think it certain situations you can have a massive impact with firepower. Yeah, but isn't that like like I used to like the? Isn't that like because of intelligence that they had and stuff like that there was more more to it than just, hey, let's just a bunch and and and the ISIS were easier targets and not only not only easier targets but better weaponry. Because man, if you look at the number, like I remember reading something about a bridge. They were trying to take out in Vietnam and they launched mission after mission. After mission after mission draw bomb after bomb after it's hard, it was hard back then to to actually hit something like a bridge. Gotcha. Okay. You know what I'm saying? We'll have to get. We'll have to get Dave Burke on here. Could do. Yeah, good deal. Dave. We'll have to get him on here and talk about how hard that is to with dumb bombs keynote everyone says smart bombs. Now, those were dumb bombs you had to basically you got eyeball it. Can you imagine now aren't that is like, okay, we get that if you just want to bomb this general the city, right? You can just drop bombs on the city. Okay, I get you can hit that, but you're trying to hit a bridge. Yeah. Can you imagine are that's got to be. Yeah, I do because I used to play this game called Mario Kart, right? So it's like a sprint split-screen tracking getting these weapons. Right. And you're playing your friend who's sitting right next to you because split screen and you can pick up these weapons. So to the weapons, were the turtle show as red one and green on the red one was a smart turtle shell it like seek the other guy out, but the green one just went in the exact direction that you shot it. So imagine you're on a track taking turns sweetheart with a green shell. You know smack Vietnam was a green shell, not as we got the red show you pretty much fully understand this flu. It's the same thing check. All right. With that gluco back to the interview. Next question when you were active in the make on delta, was it difficult to tell who is vehicle and who is civilian Hackworth? I was in the ninth division in our commander was general Julian Ewell who was called the butcher of the delta. The policy of the division was that it didn't matter if it moved, shoot it and then count it. Theoretically civilians were supposed to be away from the battle area. They would say this as they would say, this is a free fire zone, but without realizing the tradition of the people to go back to their homes dead. So regardless of the danger, they would go back to where their ancestors were, and then they were considered Viet Cong and fair game. There were an enormous number of casualties who were civilians, but all the civilians, you have to understand where sympathetic, certainly in my part of the delta to the Viet Cong effort. Most of the people in the rural areas of Vietnam were sympathetic to the Viet Cong 'cause they had won the hearts and minds of the Vietnamese people. They felt that their cause was more just it had a more nationalistic purpose. Question, you'll once flying in a helicopter over the delta and you saw some people running along. You fought their civilians, their children Hackworth. Yes..

Vietnam ISIS Dave Burke Iraq ME Mario Kart commander Julian Ewell
"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

Jocko Podcast

04:22 min | 2 years ago

"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

"And then when you take them take off your shoes, does it like does the pain set in the end or. No, they were actually, they went the. They went who didn't hurt at Belva did, but they didn't hurt. They hurt more when I got out of the field. Yeah, that's when they started to hurt. Yeah, they were actually, no, yeah. 'cause I mean, the way I imagined it is like. You know, I don't know you're in the pool or the bath, or you know when you're a kid you in the bathroom, we're long at all the wrinkle. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Rooms or whatever is the prunes pruned up feet. Times five days going too far kind because they seem kind of sensitive to when you think about it, you know they're gonna sensitive like, oh, man. So. Next next question. Why were you met in the water? Why didn't they walk along the banks or along pathways between paddy fields Hackworth you could expect any dry surface was mined and booby-trapped and sixty percent of all casualties. We hadn't. Vietnam came from mines and booby-traps laid. I might add buy those local guerrillas who the generals at the top Westmoreland and assistance didn't count. So he's saying the local guerrillas. They talk about how the the, the generals like Westmoreland would say, oh, you know, there's this many people and they wouldn't count the local populace or these local guerrillas as insurgents on. Continuing. They didn't believe that they were the enemy because their mentality was a World War Two mentality. They didn't understand the nature of the war. They were refighting World War Two, and they thought they could win the war by applying heavy firepower the outpourings of Detroit and great technological ability. They thought they would steamroll this opponent into defeat. They found that a war could not be one with bulldozers against somebody fighting with great cause. Next question, but after the Ted offensive didn't the heavy bombing raids actually take a very heavy toll on the Viet Cong Hackworth well, general LeMay said, if I had enough bombs, I could win this war because I'd blast the Vietnamese back to the stone age. What he didn't understand was that the Vietnamese were already living in the stone age and that firepower wouldn't work under those circumstances. I do think you're correct that at the end of Tet nineteen sixty eight February nineteen sixty eight. We increase the amount of bomb tonnage, out of frustration. Vietnam is a country about the size of California in terms of area. We used three times the amount of bombs in the Vietnam war as we did in all of World War Two, both the allies and the axis. How's that for just completely insane. We put enough steel on that California sized target to sink. It ended did not cause the opponent to give in firepower was not the answer. The answer was to win the hearts and minds of the people question. Why didn't firepower work Hackworth well, what firepower did using pursuit aircraft fighter aircraft fighter bombers, artillery mortar, and so on. What it did was it galvanized the opponent? It puts steel in their back. They could see themselves being struck by a giant and they had no way no recourse to. Strike back it as it did historically with the British in World War Two, it put fire in their belly. It was absolutely the worst thing we could do in Vietnam. It gave them a tonic to fight harder. So we've covered that on the podcast about how the Brits when the Brits got bombed psychologically it made them tougher because there's something happening. Look this, this massive attack comes, will it seems like a massive attack. It's something you can't control something. You can't fight back. But when you bomb a city of a million people, there's actually a small number of that get that actually get impacted by it. So everyone else goes, hey, we can survive this. And so that's what happened with the Vietnamese. They, you drop these giant bombs on his case when I'm still here. You can't do anything to me America big America with your big bombs. I'm still I'm still right here. What do you got..

Vietnam Viet Cong Hackworth Westmoreland Belva LeMay Detroit California America Ted sixty percent five days
"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

Jocko Podcast

04:07 min | 2 years ago

"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

"Next question. Did you have any personal experience of finding Viet Cong lurking under the water surface Hackworth commonly if we saw bit of Nipah floating down a waterway bit of jungle debris, we fired out it in. Invariably, it would turn red that meant there would that be low was via Kong, hang onto the roots of the debris with a read, going up to get air and we'd killed one enemy. Once we located them, I always took concertina wire and put it on both sides of the creek. So they couldn't float down. They'd run into the wire. I instructed my soldiers to fire at any foliage. And in most cases, there would be a Viet Cong hanging on trying to get out. They were simply the most skillful, the most dedicated the best opponent obstruc in almost fifty years of being around soldiers. They're the best. Question, what other problems were unique in the make on delta. The problem in the delta was not only the terrible conditions that prevailed there, but it was the impact it had on your soldiers. I'm speaking now is an American. We had terrible casualties from what we called immersion foot immersion foot was the problem in World War One called trench foot after being in the water for a long time, if feet would become very soft and the boot rubbing against the foot would become very abrasive. Suddenly you've had, you'd have a hole in your foot, the size of a bullet hole, and suddenly you're lost soldier. We had to be, you had to be very wary and take care of the feet. There was no place to sleep. So you were in the water at night. Your soldiers were in the water and you stayed miserable and wet. My rule was at a unit could only stay in the field for five days after five days, immersion foot said in so badly, that a whole battalion of eight hundred men could be laid up for weeks. Got immersion foot one time. Yeah, I got legit immersion foot and we're. So I was doing a trainee exercise in. It was added. It was we're doing a training exercise doing a reconnaissance of an airfield that was located around the swamp. So I spent five or six days in this swamp and not the whole five or six days, but a good amount of days. And plus the days I wasn't in the swamp, there was heavy rain. So just my feet were wet for an extended period. I'm actually on this particular training exercise when we were going into the field, it was raining when we got in the field that started sleeping, you know, like like ice and that turned to snow. And so it was right around, you know, and then in the daytime, it warmed up and it will turn back to rain, but it was a pretty miserable six days when I got out of the field. And and quite frankly, I didn't really understand the threat of immersion foot. So I just kept my boots on probably almost the whole time. And when I got out my feet were really jacked up really jacked up is a matter. Fact, I was looking at some pictures just to see how bad I had it compared to how bad it can get as looked at some pictures on, you know, on the interwebs and my feet were jacked up legit. I mean, obviously this is. I mean, I've never heard emerging foot, but that's a comedy of trench foot. Right? Yeah. Yeah, yeah. So that's common knowledge, right. 'cause remember Forrest Gump when he said that when he's like a Lieutenant, Dan, when he met coming till you to or whatever, and one of them was keep your soft dryer. Yeah, yeah, yes. So that's definitely a common thing that he's, he talks about it a lot. You gotta get inspect guys feet, make sure the feeder good to go. Yeah. When guys feed on a good to go, there done, you can't walk. You're done, but my feet from that immersion foot, they were Nome. They were like dead. What? 'cause it got colder or it was the house? Just the wetness? Yeah, we was cold. It only snowed and re. It only was below freezing that first night and then it was warmer, but they were wet for a long time. That was what I was young..

immersion foot Nome Kong trainee Dan Forrest Gump six days five days fifty years
"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

Jocko Podcast

05:06 min | 2 years ago

"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

"No, because the Americans again tried to impose their values on the country of Vietnam without understanding the culture and the religion of Vietnam. It was a country made up of Buddhists who worshipped ancestors frequently listen to this frequently. People who'd been moved from their homes would go through minefields to get back to worship at the graves of their ancestors. We didn't understand that we didn't understand what the Vietnamese culture was all about. So imagine that you'd think you can just you think you're just move people around, you know, actually, you can't do that that that ground is holy to them. That grant is where their family is. They have deep rooted ties and we didn't recognize that next question. What do you think was so particularly good about the Viet Cong guerrilla fighters? What did you as a military man respect about them? Most Hackworth I respected their dedication, the fire in their belly, their great strong belief in freedom. So that's interesting because, of course we're looking at them. We're looking at the Vietnamese thinking they're communist. And there. We think we're fighting for for for freedom, right? But and this other, this is. A fairly common opinion about Vietnam. Is that the, they just didn't want outsiders. They saw any outsiders were were imposing on their freedom. So even if we were going to bring glorious democracy, wasn't their glorious democracy sending want. Yeah. Back to the interview. There's was a mission, a complete dedication to winning independence for their country. So there you have it. So I respected them for for where they were coming from. Maybe it was empathy. My ancestors, two or three hundred years ago had fought for the British or sorry, had fought the British. What about their strategy and tactics? Hackworth as fighters, they were very fanatical and very dedicated. They were like my paratroopers who were extraordinarily find soldier's. A soldier tends to respect to counterpart. That's a heavyweight. And they were indeed heavyweights because of their devotion to the cause. Next question, a female guerrilla leader said that sometimes when they shot in American soldier, his comrades would come up to get the body and then they'd all burst into tears, which she said was a wonderful opportunity to shoot them or to grab their weapons. Is that a fair comment? Hackworth. It's right on the Mark. The problem with Americans fighting that war was that as the war went on, they lost leadership. They lost their hard core. Professional leaders, a professional soldier does not go after wounded. He leaves that to the medics, but soldiers that are not well trained and not well disciplined by their leaders tend to become more of a group of fraternity. Buddies who care very much for their fallen comrade and who want to get him out of the line of fire in Vietnam. It was known that the standard technique to use was to hit the first guy, then takeout anybody going after him. That was how they add to their casualty list. I have had my soldiers tell me that a guy might have been hit in the leg in a hot firefight and his opponent only ten or fifteen feet away would be pointing out pointing his weapon at him, giving him the finger doing all these things to tease him while he's waiting for someone to come out and pull him away, then they could blow that guy away too. Prioritise. Next cute. You gotta know what the most important problem. You've got an, it's not the wounded guy. It's the guy that's trying to kill you. You gotta be able to get a train your guys to be able to overcome that emotional situation that they're going through because that's going to be the instinct. That's the human instinct. Next question. The Viet Cong hid in the jungle, but in the maycom delta, there really isn't any jungle. So where did the Viet Cong hide like this answer Hackworth? Well, they were hidden in the jungle. That was always alongside the waterways, which tended to be very thick and well booby-trapped out in front. They were hidden by the people they hid in the waterways. They would get underwater and take a read and put it above the water and brief through that then surround themselves with a bit of floating Nipah grass. They would dig caves under the waterways and then put a bit of read up to the top and breathe through that. They were very, very cunning fighters. Yeah, that's. That's like what you hear about in the movies. Right? The little review. Breathing through reading. They're actually doing that. He goes into that more here..

Vietnam Nipah grass maycom delta three hundred years fifteen feet
"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

Jocko Podcast

03:46 min | 2 years ago

"david hackworth" Discussed on Jocko Podcast

"This is Jaakko podcast number one, forty, four with echo, Charles in me. Jaakko Willink good evening, echo good evening. And a few episodes back. I reference an interview that I had read with Colonel David Hackworth the author about-face my my favorite book of all time check and it was actually on on podcast number one, forty two, and I referenced viz interview, and I said it would cover it in the future on a podcast. So here we are one forty, four. The interview is from PBS dot org. They had a show called people's century and inside that show inside that series. There was one part of it. I guess maybe was an episode called the guerrilla war. So we're going to take a look at that also on top of that to expand on some of the topics. I'm also going to take a look at a book called Vietnam primer, and it's it's a pretty cool book. It's very tactical. And when I say tackle, I'm not talking about I'm talking action. Title tactical, like it shows where you should put your security elements while you're in Vietnam. What's the best way to maneuver through the jungle in Vietnam? It's very, very specific to that kind of jungle fighting. But there are definitely some topics in it that I wanted to pull out, and that is the book in about face when Hackworth is talking about working with SLA Marshall, which we covered his book on one forty, two. He's talking about how he worked with. They wrote when they got done with going in interviewing all these people, they wrote the book Vietnam primer. And so I wanted to at least take a look at that. I probably won't cover it in any great depth on the podcast because it's so tactical and it's very specific to that time and maybe I'll covered someday but because you never know. Well, anyways, there's definitely some things to get out of it that I I wanna look at and we'll pull some of those up today, but the basis is to look at this this interview with Hackworth and I think you're gonna see it. It takes a lot of stuff from about face and just really puts it in the clear. In the clear. So. Here we go. People century gorillas gorilla wars, and this is the interview with David Hackworth from PBS. What do you think the Viet Cong learn learned from mount Satan? And Hackworth says, I think the major thing was how a poor man fights a rich man, how a war can be fought employing ancient rules. I developed by sunsuits the need for patients the need for political motivation. The need to fight a war of economy and how to apply employ all the rules of warfare. So there you go. That's a little way to start this thing off the need for patients. The need for political motivation. He gets gets into this and he talks a lot about talks a lot about the economy because that's something that you can lose track of as a frontline person, but you need to think about it next, this is this is very interesting. What lessons should the Americans have learned from the French defeat. So French got beaten Vietnam, and here's what Hackworth says. Well, I think the major lesson they should have. Learned was that that war didn't involve the security of France and the security of the United States. It wasn't at issue either on a tactical level, they didn't have an objective. They didn't have an objective on attack the lover..

Colonel David Hackworth Vietnam Jaakko Willink Charles France Marshall United States mount Satan
 discussed on Jocko Podcast

Jocko Podcast

00:24 sec | 3 years ago

discussed on Jocko Podcast

"And although the two right on anyway lightning bolt fire yemen emojis norman there don't over to a double shocker though asanka what's the highest level of a moute emoji approval you can send me three lightning bolt three fires three shuckers three removed first your theory of everything even before it's like a like you should into four for his daimary all laughing depends on what i say though so like if there's if it's a weird all the foul in the word we'll who they'll be like that's that can be infinite rudy leg if i played i don't know you not like you'll tell me something exciting and i'll put it not an dang instead of de a angie i'll put d lower case eh depending level of excitement a in that can go infinitely by the way back in spanned twenty text messages even over twenty days that's how infinite it can be in the first half of the is lower case the second half of the asia upper case the an maybe ten ends cheese all capital there and you know then it a did leave him it just may as well like i said i think you communicate well i be as a thumbs up on a on a theories note in regards to communication that is affective you know what i mean view this as a level of excitement new as opposed to cool periods area no you're you're you're your with clip x ray of blood in his life a anyway next question if you have already come all good hey is a to booed i guess yeah the rainbow airbus does fits loathing good dearest jaakko speaking of lighthearted uh nice emotions dearest jaakko due to skip reform okay my mother jukka what is the difference between extreme ownership versus the easy button can you elaborate i just need a little more clarification to connect the dots in my situation okay uh again so as a leader yes of course you are supposed to take ownership of everything extreme ownership of everything that's what we talk about all the time but does this mean that you say i will do this and i will do that and i will do the other thing i will do everything that the team is supposed to be doing no that's that's not what i'm talking about now 'ownership does mean that you get things done you are responsible for making sure things get done that's what 'ownership is our team is in charge of something if our team is in charge were project and and we don't get it not it's my fault sunny he bielsa's so that's that's what it is it means you take responsible do things go wrong it means you take responsibility for problems and you get them fixed that's definitely ownership now the easy button and when i talk of easy button in a negative way because that's what i'm doing here it's when your subordinates come to use and say how should i do this or or what's the best way to execute this or can you can you tell me a good plan on on how we should make this happen or even haters bad news qin you come tell my people because i don't really want to do it now if you say yes to all those types of things uh on a regular basis then what you're doing is you are actually you're actually stunting the growth of your subordinate leader because instead when you come to mean you say hey jaakko get this mr we got a plant how do you think we should do it if i say okay we should come in from the northeast you should do you to set up a overwatch position here he's moved the target from this direction you did didn't learn anything you just took what i told you in san jose will go come up with your best plan and come back to me briefly on it and so now you might be kinda bummed out 'cause you wanted union i wanna have to do this extra work but now you've got to go to lecture work but now you're learning and in two or three times uniting income asked me more you're in a coma the plan and because we already did a cycle cycle after cycle of you said hey here's my plan of mecenate make this adjustment and you come back next time you say here's my plan as it make this little adjustment and eventually you know to make those adjustments on your own and now you can do by yourself and that's what we want i don't want to stunt the growth of my subordinate leaders so i don't want to be an easy button um so you're providing the easy button like that's what they're talking about when they see easy button you yet if you don't want to be that you don't want to be an easy about your everybody else and are also no one's going to be able to take your job from you which is actually what you want you or i want to make every one of my subordinates so good that they can take my job for me that means i can step up and look forward and look out and they can do a better job of handling what they've got hand one eventually when it's my time to get promoted i got people to take my place and we're all good um of course that doesn't mean we them blinder let them failed don't do that gives you want to give them rope but you don't give him enough rope to hang themselves he'll you give him enough rope that they may be get a little not in the rope and he gives clear but sloppy new and then you go over to me say mater let me help you get that untied and now you give them the rope again so you don't eat you know in in a in the military you don't let someone go dual mission dutch real where someone's gonna get hurt killed were mission failure because you wanted to not be the easy but no you don't do that the in disability in sector you don't let some one lose a big client or lose a bunch of money or make a mistake the costs a bunch of capital because you didn't want to be these about no no arms now might you let some will make a little mistake scher little mistake the cost of a little bit of money new so they learn a lesson scher but you know what i'm phone your place you don't let them hangar hang themselves so that's that next rush dearest jaakko a question for you and the podcast are fire department promotion process has roleplaying scenarios those roleplaying scenarios i lose points because i'm not outwardly passionate quote unquote enough i would have to fake it to succeed and i'm not a fake person is this worth it to fake it when seeking promotion it's not like i'm gonna fake at once they attain the promotion and k this is a this is a very cool question on this question a lot and actually on the sky sent me this question on facebook i responded very quickly and simply my response was play the game you so fake it play the game yeah and and you know he wrote back got it yeah good for him he ask is what everybody i think thinks i'm going to say is like no you yourself know the game united up there an act all passionate about stuff you're you you hardcourt no the a play the game now you because you what you're doing you play the game you want wanna do good job and you're doing your job and dui your job to any job requires some level of faking it you now does this mean that you're a fake person no immediate you're trying to do a good job think if every time that your boss came in with a dumb idea and you your reaction was to say that's a dumb idea mia it is going to get you anywhere or every time a costumer had an eighty eighty idiotic complaint about something you were like hey you're an idiot or every time your wife said uh you know is this chicken dry avery said it's drier than a piece of cardboard in the saharan desert is that is that the eu are would you would you benefit from that how would that work out their answers you would he would not work out well in any those cases you have to play the game you have to play the game and i know i know that that's hard and i'll tell you what i did to get myself over playing the game i i turned it into a game in my head i was like arm i'm going to build a relationship with this boss that i don't like me to do it new from nabil the best way that's my game i'm like i'm gonna become this guy's bro right but when i was at officer candidate school you've got to do the most ridiculous rules they have his rules that you've got a follow that were really annoying and you know what i did i i executed the rules harger and more stringently than that anybody fought was even remotely necessary view and had fun with it i played that game i you know if i've got appear that may be arm competing with ford or some tension i'm going to support them and we'll play the game that's what i'm saying you got to play the game now this make me a bad person or fake present no why because you're doing this the reason you're playing the game the reason you're act asked acting this way is four benevolent reasons right this this guy at the fire department he he's not trying to get promoted so that he can usurp the powers it and takeover no he trying to get into a position where he can better lead and serve and and step up and raise young leaders underneath him back that's what you're trying to do you're not trying to sneak into a position you don't deserve and you're not trying to build relationships so you can take advantage of people for your own benefit that vat would be a fake person media in my opinion you're trying to move but if you're trying to move up in ranked so you can do better and you can take care of the troops you can increase readiness there's nothing wrong with that and if you don't play the game twos at some level you're not gonna get promoted and guess what then people that played the game that might be less less qualified to do that job they're going to get the job because you wouldn't play the game you're too stubborn your ego was too big so you've got to put that aside and i'll tell you something else learn from what you are being told him if if you're showing no passion if you're showing like zero motion that's bad people will not connect with you and if they don't connect with you they don't follow you if they don't connect with you you're not building relationships the people if you don't have relationships with people you don't have a good team so show a little bit of passion sometimes you got a fake it that's fine yours just a really on passionate person core show a little bit about russian fake it a little bit learn it a little bit yes actually gonna be beneficial is i would love for you to fake it for what a while until you you start carrying who what like what are you not passionate about are you not passionate about the job are you not passionate about your firefighter about saving people's lives are you not passionate about having a squared away department you of course you're passionate about that stuff otherwise you wouldn't be you wouldn't be sent me a message saying hey how do i get advance outright to how do i do better yeah you are passionate about it and that's fine it's good um i say it all the time you know if you don't have any motions your robot and robots people don't fall robots new so sometimes you gotta show a little bit of that a motion of passion to connect with people that's okay via don't be scared homi scaring yet because that's really the thing right is showing it of course your passion and above but showing it two different people this summit brian i did it how on a always be like showing how fired up i am all the time or whatever in in whatever scenario or whatever but you're right that does help delic when he williams excitable it's and there's a there's a dichotomy here you because there's some people that will show too much emotion yeah and there some people that will not show enough you want to be some were balanced in the middle as true and i dig it to one because it does feel like faking it because they can inflict while the tradition is like to be fired up on the sidelines let's klesko you know like that can but probably some of the energy for that as some empty canada's nervous you want to focus on what you got to do whatever you know but it's kinda part of the game you know in in it does help the people around you to things like okay he's fired up okay maybe not part up now but he's going to get me fired up you know any kind of like helps the team but uh the athamna under doesn't feel comfortable to do expressed outwardly you know i'll passion but it helps both his fake like faking it that's like a framing thing to you know like via frame it like your faking it versus i use that you'd playing the game bright usually in the game because you want to do a better job yeah i wanna get promoted you wanna you wanna get promoted for the right reasons there's nothing wrong with that yeah that's at yeah that's good i think if you can kind of banned in stretch yourself in an uncomfortable way for the benefit you know the ito i think were people i think that term of faking it no one wants to be a fake purse right right yes which is which is why you're correct in that the way that's framed un is i being a fake person you and no one wants to be a fake person you at the same time you have to grow you and you have to adjust and if you're going to be in a leadership position you're gonna do things that you don't that you wouldn't apparant how do that all the time anew house in the military you know i worked with people that i may offset the store or i work with people both below me the chain of command and above me and the change grant that i despised they never knew it they don't know who they are right now dang but you know the only way member that a you got it was that made me a fake person no makes me a professional may me a professional doing my job because i was going to be let some little personal motion of minor some of that guys does this not like that so i'm knocking white came in and now we have an adversary relationship and now i got a problem you know i'm playing the game play the game is the line what is the fake person genuinely well uh i was going to you asked what the line is the line is if you go against what your principles are you dose of you've got fundamental principles that they say oh if you want this job what we need you to do is fill out a report about billy saying that he did something wrong that you know he didn't do wrong right and you go no marking to do that that that that's what that's bad writing that's now now you're not just playing the game now you're going against your principles of being an honest person about what's happening yeah this that's really what it is rate the honesty when you're a fake so like if sums like oh i'm faking it or or i'm being a fake persson heison a fake person like turning on some passions manufactured passion for the sake of the team and stuff like that that doesn't feel like you're a fake person figures is kinda like you'll sit like some on enough for example someone's in the room and you're like hey you're getting great that shirt looks great and you're doing a great job they leave in velika sucks right add their nominees all tell you the different seeing the reason that someone the reason that you would consider psalm one it'd be angry that some was a fake person is when they are doing it because beat they're doing it for personal benefit on they're they're saying the like if if if if you were my boss and i come in and i say hey echo our every like your new haircut looks great i really think that clear co looks down but i'm going to say that anyways an everyone knows that all i want to do is get that next promotion yeah that's be fake yeah mic that's being fake but if if i'm saying because what am i really do at what i'm doing is on on a making an adaptation i'm glowing i'm i'm doing something that om uncomfortable with because i know it's going to make me a better leader that's what i should be doing is trying to become a better leader now again if that if if in this whatever organization what you have to do is is do something that you don't agree with and it's it's the wrong thing to do and you do it anyways will than than that's that's that's that's almost a totally different thick there's that then there's hey i'm gonna kiss ass room so that i get promoted it's all about me and that's probably the what we think of the definition of a fake person here next question i saw a weakness in you on your latest podcast you seem to overlook the fact that some infant children were raised in undisciplined environments with undisciplined parents they grow up having modelled these undisciplined examples i hate the fact that i have growth undisciplined behaviour solving this is a major priority of my life you have zero idea of what it of what this experiences lake for me you seem blind to this struggle like a father who ignore their child struggle and offer only the words mana so this is a good question and i i see were uh this guy's common from for sure and i know that it can be very very frustrating to try and become disciplined and i apologise that i haven't talked about the fact of of what to do if you come from an undisciplined family or you have undisciplined parents i haven't really talked about what to do in that situation but there's a reason that i haven't talked about that before and that is because you don't get discipline from your parrots you don't get discipline from your parents from your grandparents from your older brothers and sisters you don't get discipline from an external source you have to get it from you that's what selfdiscipline is you get it from yourself you get it from you so the here's people from every possible background from no parrots too crazy parents to you don't drugaddicted parents to super squared away parents and everywhere in between on that spectrum that are completely disciplined people more disciplined than any one i know it doesn't come from your parents who don't inherit it and there's another piece here it's called ownership right it's called ownership and if you're if you want to blame other people for the problem an essay this all the time if you don't take ownership of the problem the proms opera get salts of you blame your parents for not having raised you in a disciplined environment you're not going to solve that problem you're looking at your parents and if you would have done a better job being more disciplined for me i would be more disciplined now so that means that means you can't do anything the fact the matter is it's wrong you actually can do something and it doesn't matter what do how your parents raised you and brought you up you can have the discipline you need to decide to do it so as long as your blaming other people i mean if you blame me for not discussing it you blame me for having zero idea what that experience is like you blame your parents were not raise new this ways long's your blaming other people's lungs you're counting on other people to give you discipline as long as you do that you will not have it so again i i'm sorry i should have made that my should make that more clearly in i'm trying to make it more clearly now an and like my parents my parents are are good people they had successful careers as as educators in public schools in my mom eventually became uh went into school administration my dad taught in high school for thirty something years and they were good hardworking people and of but i'll tell you they were no they were no extraordinary preachers of discipline and i'll tell you i in fact i i never remember either one of them ever using the term or referring to discipline any way um you know one actually both my parents worked they both worked my dad was coaching sports and we're doing after school staff my mom same things like we were on our own a bartsch what my parents were gone in the morning we got ourselves to school when we at home in afternoon they weren't home uh you know so it wasn't like they were setting up this rigid disciplined manner for me and um and you can see this with families many many different families there's families that have kids that the parents are very disciplined and the kids are wild um and how to control sometimes at problematically so right kids that come from really good families but they get addicted to drugs lack of discipline kids that come from really good families but they they spin out of control would end going the wrong direction and there's also the opposite which is a the parents worn around or the parents were abusive for the parents were drug addicts and and overcome the keep the kid comes out of that in is squared away is awesome and we saw that old time the seal team's of said that before on this program doesn't matter it doesn't matter where your background is is what you decide to do you um and i'll tell you another thing it's not even from the military like the military requires discipline obviously but there's plenty of people in the military that don't have it right and in many poor many people lose their disciplined when they leave the march is not being imposed on them anymore moved so let me just go look around uh i mean being in the military does not make you discipline first being from discipline family does not make you discipline person being in a discipline group does not make you discipline person what makes you disciplined port person is choosing to be disciplined so d i n and also as far as telling people the man up um which you know when someone says how do i get up early every day i said get up early every day you how do i stop eating sugar stopping the the if the that's the definition of mana but obviously not just men that need displined in their life and the guy use that term but what i do tell people is the get after it that's what i tell people to get after it yeah i tell people to do the things that they know they're supposed to do right there are things that you know you're supposed to do as a human being things that you know oregon improve your life do those things there's things that you know we're going to make your worst person and make your life force don't do those things don't do the things that are making you weaker start things that are going to make you stronger and smarter and faster and healthier and get a make you better human being and i'll say the same thing to this guy you want to be more disciplined get after it and get up early do some kind of worked out eat good foods clean your room make a list of things that you're supposed to do when your wife and in wake up in the morning and do those things that you put on the list that's would discipline s and no it is not easy do not going to get it from anyone else but you and it's worth it and it is the thing that is going to bring you freedom that's the key word rate their own food it's worth it you know what i think this is what i think i think like in an environment as like how he put it in undisciplined virement rain or something like that where he grew up in an undisciplined environment ido obviously that the very vague expression redletter undisciplined farm did i mean that can mean a lot of young a lot of different things so i'll let him like when you're little brought up in a certain environment basically you're kinda taught or or not taught like like the value of certain things so if you use like unal working out who would ever right so armies myself as as an example my data than athlete um you did not disappear athlete but hughes you know he he knew like working out was a part of life instantly and you know in elementary school were doing sports and stuff like that you know some people they don't do that at all so at when the grew up into adulthood mit some people straight up have never worked out before never been in the gym and you know so grown up there they were never taught the value of what work in a does for you we never taught so they can appreciate it they just simply don't know the value surely see people with you know you know they're in shape where they can do these things and they're very function whatever they see that of course but they don't have that value they don't feel that value feed the just never learned it so it it can come off as like this thing for other people you know like oh that's what other people do kinda thing so they don't understand the value so back to the point in their mind this weird the connection is not made that it's worth it because they don't know the value of and really but if you do know the value of it and then you can decide okay is this worth it is it worth it to wake up every day in in clinical get after it for this particular goal or the this particular set of goals so that's what it is and think sure the undisciplined environment can may be provide that but i think you're right i think that once you're like oh yeah that's worth it y you know how people they'll find reasons one is worth the even though they've never expect like you don't like a person who has a heart attack or something is like and they have kids a young kids and they have a heart attack i've lady never worked out ever in their life have our detect almost died there like guess what i'm working out every single day i'm a vegetarian now you know like doing major major changes that they've never even thought about making and they'll do it because they decide it's worth it and they'll be disciplined they'll find that discipline real quick no matter how they're cheering as you know their environment in their kounellis yet it's going to be worth it that's it yeah and if if it's not worth in that i think is what you develop the value of working out the value of you develop you can develop that from anywhere at that's one of her let's put it and thankfully that as far as early develop that from any any you can develop that from from anywhere yet you can get it from parenting yet for yeah exactly right exactly right but the disciplining itself just like i said that's gonna come from you your parents can teach it but guess who has still you it's hill you and you can go to the military to specifically learned discipline when you leave it's on yoohoo is it yeah exactly right and just like i said like yeah i know people who were done with the military in a good dad they're done with that right there glad with this waking up early they're they're adly with you dig that downward ethics monster out of shape they're not doing anything productive it's it's horrible to say now but it happens happens with the military happens with anything else would kids get out a high school sports you in ulsan they don't want enough to do that anymore dumpson a coach you you crews each don't listen to coach listen to yourself yourself yeah determine whether or not it's worth it and i'm telling you did you don't need to german i'm telling you it's were phil i am telling you it is worth it and you know what you actually know it's worth it that's why you're asking this question view now it's worth it you know it's worth it to have disbelief think there's an easier way you think that it's something that people have you think that when jaakko was alarm clock goes off it's like oh just like my father taught me i rise and i shine it you don't like no i i it's like the pillow fuel soft and comfortable and the alarm clock has banging on my head and a don't like it you know what i know it's worth it to get up and get after i know it's worth and you know it's worth here's the thing though we all know it's worth the is it in a in a way you're right but lake really they'll really i'm going to be open open and honest with you i don't think that the people notes worth it i think they know it's worth it like the kind on paper none of they have a multiplechoice question is it worth it yes or no there'll be like yes obviously i know working out is worth it but here's the thing i don't if you don't know if you don't like like having good credit for example so i never dutt taught like why really my mom said yeah you should have good credit that's it that's the limit to late education on credit for of course a blow it because they get you know a fall for literally all the tricks if selfinflicted and other wet critics jammed so ago so i don't know i don't know the value i don't know i have never experienced the benefits of having good i don't know the value of the credit so really didn't mean much to me really my credit was like junk and i didn't care until i got denied for something then a cared you know but just like if you never into working out until you're in a specific the ian what show that but but like this guy that's asking this question and god is asked the question them i am not from sean a much on a come off all hard um but he realizes he realizes the value of discipline because he saying that he wants it right he knows that it's going to make his life better yeah and and and that's why i think he he's gotten jammed up in whatever way we don't know 'cause i'll gnome maybe he's gotten unhealthy maybe he's you know who knows bbs gotten his finances jammed up would it wherever the case may be he knows that discipline is better for them him he knows that he does know this isn't a guy that does know yet because sure there's people that don't you know when you're sixteen years old you don't know the value of discipline you'll know that the what you're at the way racking renounce can affect you in five years you'll know if you can set yourself utilize whole life up to be pretty awesome yeah you don't know that yet you're just like worried about where you're going on a friday night eight height so this guy no worse and he wants it and he's looking for where he can find it in where he can find it is in the mirror yeah that's where it is you to do at brother good luck get on the path and stay on the path yeah and that's going to be beneficial when you do the harshly maintaining net like not knowing the values a big is the big thing is kind of like okay so back to my credit thing it it there is a point at the end where okay so um you know like i don't know ten years ago whatever i repaired my credit at my credit was repairing a i went through was painstaking not fun stuff but i did it gummy credit repaired an now i know the value because as an adult i'm functioning it youthful now you know so now i know the value of having the credit because of been through all things that having good credit brings you through now i'm thinking i'll never go back to bed cartwright never it's worth it every single day i'm telling you that that i agree with what you're saying yeah i agree with reducing i'm saying that this guy knows the value that's why he wants it yeah it's like when you free realize that you got denied for something and you'll let ovau credit has value i understand that julia something happened in his life use at discipline has value i know that now but you did credit repair and in what you said was okay i need to gotten repair my credit you didn't say hey you know what my mom didn't tell me about bad credit now i have bad credit yeah yeah so now you're now what am i supposed to do uh you know who repaired your credit who repaired your credit well it was a combination of my wife and i but yoga but who repaired you did it yeah we this stuff you took responsibility for it and said okay i'm to get my credit green you talk to your wife could she smarter that you yes he was hike hey i will i will help this but it was you that said okay i got to get this fixed and you got help but you knew to reach out for help but you're the one that ultimately is responsible for yeah you're right about that like i didn't like i didn't blame my parents and then continue hacking bet credit rhino writes liked them said no i got to get the fao this this thing has credit has value i need to fix it yeah and you fixed it yeah regardless working regardless so what will vote would you know oh you don't know how to work out guven ugo wire personal trainer 'cause you know it's going to it's the right thing to do you don't have been oh you don't know how to repair your finances cool go get accounts or that's going to help you repair your finances oh you're addicted to drugs or alcohol okay i'm going to go find accounts or join a groups i can get through that thing you no one's going to hold your hand and bring you ended any those situations you got to do it yourself gather discipline to make it happen yeah good uh number 7 good morning did you find that people in the military mok those that emphasize the importance of good leadership who take leading and our responsibility seriously what does that mean mocking like the big fan of eu leah like what people in the military making making fun of you because you take leadership super seriously all ya the elephant is a late scout this is an interesting question so it makes me a little bit nervous because my suspicion is that this individual might be going about being a good leader the wrong way and if you go about it the wrong way people can take offence to it if you're the guy that goes around telling everyone that you are leader and you're trying to be great leader people will take offence net because you can't make that part of your thing right people that talk about the importance of good leadership the come across as implying that they are good leader and and that can be offensive especially if you aren't quite as good of a leader as you think you are she run around like you understand how important leadership is and about that savior right there in understanding forms of leadership echo all of a sudden on basically tony look i'm a good leader and you're not when the reality is just the way i'm talking proves that i'm not a good leader a as i'm talking down to you so we have a problem right there and also if if you take leading and our leading responsibility seriously what does that actually mean does that mean that you can't have any fun with your team does that mean you can't laugh at yourself when you've made a mistake does that mean that you are trying so hard to give off the impression that you are a great leader that it appears to everyone else that you aren't really who you act like in that your character is is disingenuous right if i'm if i'm constantly trying to put up this front that i'm the great leader everyone starts look at me think an that guy's not even is not that's not the real him uh his china rock around like a like a he's not true right you'd you'd think whether you're trying to build trust in as a leader we we are trying to build trust we talked dick winners talk about honesty being the most one the most important traits of uh of a leader but if we're putting up a facade and how we act that does not come across as honest and that doesn't build trust in fact it build the opposite and also if if if you have to put up a leadership front if you have to put up a leadership front if it in other words if sometimes you have to act a certain way fate get going back to something earlier he if you have to act and fake like a leader that means you might be you might be insecure about your leadership capability and you will come across his insecure and people consents that insecurity so that can be very problematic also if you're so into being a good leader that probably means that you have issues giving up the reigns that means that you are probably micromanaging because you want to be leader you want to prove to everyone that you're a good leader and so you start micromanaging and no one wants to fall will micromanager they don't want to do that and if you add all these things together what what what do people end up doing the end up mocking you they end up mocking the things that you think are important like leadership that south they start to make fun of it it's a man the it's like the needle i think his name is needle meyer in animal house is is the right name anand i've a connor i'm doing a move referee ion with iin as his messed up all i can give you the john belushi that yeah so there's eats like the leader the the rotc guy yeah he's yet like mr leader on huh and everyone makes fun of him yeah he's trying to be a great leader he's trying to be the authoritative figure everyone is making fun of him so you have to be careful in this case i would recommend you move to the center a little bit more meaning that on the one hand you have a leader that isn't building relationship isn't building trust expects people to do as they are told an and treat treat that leader with respect even though they have a nerd that's not a good leader on the other hand you have leaders that are to close with the troops has very personal relationships too personal relationships with the team it has lost any semblance of a forty over the teams of is your two extremes you wanna be balanced in the middle you want to build relationships will be people you want to build your team up in also foreseeing leadership on people does not work any more than forcing a religion or a diet or a workout or a political brie belief system an can you make someone from him from the leadership perspective if you have a forty over other people can you make someone bow down to your programme mechanically for a little while yeah you can you can but if it's not from them if they are not part of it wilfully it's not going work over time so you know don't beat people up verbally with your leadership lessons don't make it you're external religion that you are forcing on people internally yes of course obviously ma i always thought about leadership i always thought about leadership pat wasn't barking it at home i don't even think i don't even think like my the best the people that taught me the boast about leadership they never said the word to be upheld leadership right and i'm not saying that that's the best course of action because because sometimes it is good to you know poulsen someone aside and say hey this is the way act and right now from your troops in that that's not going to be effective sometimes that is good especially once you've built the relationship of i don't ever relationship with you echo when i say haiti to talk to you hit the way junior guys recognizing her to go over very well with him what's your reaction gonna be you'll be pest you you feel you don't know my guys i know the better the unit we're gonna have a problem i'd be a die compost nothing my coaching in mentoring of you was horrible because we did have a relationship so sure you're not listening and obviously of course when i start coaching in mentoring implies that i'm the greatest leader of all time that's my that vmi my implied statement new sock on great which people reject that as well especially when you're not that great of a leader in the first place so don't talk about it so much just lied be a good leader open up discussions take arapoff come from the flank instead of going straight on maneuver tactically and tactfully get into their heads and make better leaders by actually leading yes can like that lien a lead by example can thing it kinda makes you like the question kind of how you said of the beginning it makes you wonder he says the question is defined the people in the military mok those that emphasize the importance of good leadership you kinda think to yourself i wonder how this person is emphasizing the importance of good is he the guy at the party who you know people are talking about on another the food or something then he just bus a leadership stuff fetal that guy who's like everything on elect rotc gut feeling go to see got just everything he's just pushing it every day in a leadership is everything leaves of the bright we weren't even talk about that leadership is everything kind of any by the way work this is coming from a person me that i literally talk about leadership al at times iit eisley listening yeah and and i actually think that way and i i get up on stage and in companies and in front of military members and police officers in it i talk about leadership that's what i talk about all done yeah and that's what you know what's interesting that's what makes aboutface by curl david hackworth the one of the best things about that book because it's not a leadership book he doesn't just talk he barely talks about he barely says a straightforward sentences use it this is how you lead it's all from the flank and that's why it gets you so well uh because it's from the flank yeah it's not a book about leadership does he would say you know how many books get public publish all the time you know that visit leadership book i wrote a book with life how to lead in win hackworth did it better hackworth like oh this is about war read it yes yes in a way uh the ideally seen but obviously that's your jobs well i guess my point is that if you're if this is coming from someone who talks about leadership all the time literally wrote a book about leadership and i'm saying hey you might not wanna talk don't let us online at is my point freiha that's my point yeah good point just just just back off a little bit yes so if you're like you know you go on the road you do when a year you know you're deals and then you know at dinner with your family you start going into your leadership stuff with this that's what you should it q yes yes but i'm on i'm saying is with your team with your platoon tune you don't sit there and say all right today we're gonna talk about leadership again yeah you don't quote unquote emphasize the importance of good leadership right you demonstrate it yes leed yeah his do that they're smarter than you think they're you know what your undoing all as you dear kinda condescending noon to can help it you're treating them like they don't know you wanna talk about the importance which if they know what the importance leaders learn the military yeah in fact in example of their reaction of how people take it when you start preaching to them know how they take it they mock you sets a lesson learned that's a lesson learnt if people are mocking you they're not taking you seriously that means you're doing something wrong what you're doing wrong in this case is your condescendingly talking to them about the importance of leadership they know what the importance of leadership is there in the military they know how bad it is to have a bad platoon sergeant or bad platoon a platoon commander they know you'll need rub it in their face you remember i think i told you the story about one of my friends nicknames name because of thirteen you know you navy feel we're at a party in he got he got joe and he's sitting at the table explaining to all of us how bad asked navy seals are ya like for a long time new visas and he even said those were navy lose just so bad ask like we're so that after this is why all this stuff if the exact same thing because we know needs feels about us but you sitting here telling us how that ask you in all navy seals are is going to make us makia they're going to get mox the iron a little bit earlier ally navient mocked by other may be sealed by though at version or do enough stuff feeling check well i'm glad that this guy is asking the question i'm glad that the guy is focused on leadership and i hope that these points can come across and be digested with no um you know there's really easy to get offended by what i'm saying right if you're him it which doesn't get it you know what i mean it's really easy to say that is to resume yield roaches rooms age isn't always talking about on the one that your i'm trying to get these guys to be better utilised i'm trying to get my platoon understand ports of leadership i know man i know one i i respect that like the fact that you're have that mind and that's all through that's awesome uh that's awesome come from the for like a little bit from the flak when you're not going to you're not gonna do not going to get that get it done this way you it's kind of like if you try to convince everyone that you're the most humble person in the world and you know that nobody more humble in media on the most humble i'm humbler than that guy i'm humbly the new homeless than anyone who who've ever lift just most humble and world just doesn't work linda lentils order ex question dhaka how do you lead a team of volunteers how to punish or discipline them can't threatened to fire them because they're all i have i know leader does so much more than threatening punish but a need some guidance tried a motive try to motivate but feel the need to do more thanked china answers were quickly once because this is kind of a cost of answer before two different form um do they understand why they're doing what they're doing and do they understand why it's important do the understand how what they are doing will benefit them do they also see you working hard to try and make things happen so those are those of this the basic questions let's just get those out there every time every time someone is not doing what you want them to do do they understand why they're doing what they're doing do they understand why it's important to the mission of do they understand how being successful in the mission will benefit them so so let's just get those on the way next what can we do here have you game of fide the situation at all how you like that keane gamified right have you gamified the situation because i i realize that the term it's getting thrown around now but we would gamified stupid things all the time in the seal team's to make them fun new right how much braskin you pick up let's see i'll pick up more than you might squad to pick a more brass and you'll pick up olds unrun round the rain sharp pickup brass one of the most miserable things that you have to do this heelpieces pickup brass off thought reigns in the summertime mmhmm and you do it for for like two days because once you get done with all your work you gotta go up millions of rounds of brass spread out all over the desert in in august in the imperial valley it's hot it's sox but guess what we're gonna do have a contest india's a what are you gonna do to game a fight uh look what kinda cool competition around some shortterm goal can you set up that's going to be as gonna make it fun for them some kinda cool reward what about some kind of friendly bets around achieving something like i bet if i raised this much money you know i will go to work with a pair of underwear on my head or you after you know what i mean whatever is stupid bats you know what we used in the team's is we'd bet one dollar what am i will run inmates we we we had something like critical i bet you one dollar yeah that was like the biggest bet you could make because it's just it's pre europride suryono and then we'd we'd always have fun if you were collecting or if you're giving the dollar collecting the hour was just totally glorious yeah giving the dollar was shame the eddie so yeah like you could add like okay when you give me this dollar aid asked me in front of everybody v you have to add own all you have to do it while like walking in and younis some something real kathy meaning that yet but we didn't even have to do all that yeah hi foods with undisguised emi running mate if we won or lost the bet and as light but a loser you know in in you wouldn't even ask for the money you just look at it this by tonight he had more than most classic looks when he gave you the look when i lose about too many gave me the look i i i wanted to cry yeah yeah yeah he lost some yet more than that dea loss so maybe make a bet for dollar and if that's not working okay now that's not work if you can't game afife you can have fun with it maybe ask them while there why they are there in figure out what their motivation is for being there and how you can tie that in something concrete and then also though look you might have some people at her are really into this um and then lower your expectations of this particular group of people gog recruits of people i wanna get after it mm makes sense there have some fun fawn goes a long way yoga fun goes a long way for having a fond doing things goes a long way and the end that praise thing to you know when you should like add like a reward or something for because a lot especially volunteers were so you know uh we all feel this like even at at work you can have like a superfund job but you get you these two people generally speaking tend to get complacent in one way or another you know when things are routine or things are not as exciting or whatever um and you know when you're volunteering in that happens it's kinda like you not tied there by a paycheck really you know which is just is just a powerful ty you know that people have to work it's like addle in my job but it's peace bills and paying the bill the big deal kathy so if you add that element of excitement are fun or you know little personal payoff in one way or another at think that helps a lot of the time indeed and that tens tap into if the if the liam nothing this person is doing this are not doing this but like if they become kinda complacent in not recognizing how much they they they appreciate the volunteers you know like if they're just like oh yeah this does business as usual it'll ever coming in that's kind of it kind of being in the you know then he just gets kind of kind of blah you know like only the not the pay off that they used to have you know but had fallen kinda keep that going keep them in the game next bush do i need to keep training gg two if i hate it i mean kennedy just live my life the way i think it should be which is of health energy and become becoming a force of nature as a doctor without dreaming upload some invisible enemies on the street that have yet to come across in preparing in spending my pittance of wage of a wage on lessons that i hate in every sorts of ways for something that might be avoided physical clash if i learnt tease wit in saving my money to move into a good neighbourhood and i've been successful in preventing physical clashes to occur i've learnt basic ways to escape the mount i can run i'm fairly strong isn't that enough okay so iaea boro um jittery was not the meaning of life all right it's huge it too has a lot of i mean i find digits you very enjoyable i get a lot out of it beyond physical training beyond selfdefence yeah i get a lot out of it and i apply in all different sorts of realms in my life uh but if you hate it an and you've learned some basic ways to defend yourself the give skate the mount may be some basic guards type stuff then then okay i mean than step away you shouldn't be going through life doing something that you hate i for each hour you i'd still train occasionally even if it's just like once every two or three weeks once a month just to keep some of the ideas fresh and also also there's always the possibility that a quick in your head and you'll realize this there's like a magical thing that you could get out of the gia to um and it's of like waking up until waking up at four thirty in the morning that that's the time i wake up in in for its will on genetically predisposed to sleep less than most people and for instance we just had daylight savings time and you and so and i went to bed so i sat back my clock than it was it was like nine forty at night to went from 1040 when i was going to bed a setback my clock and now it's 940 a at us at all korean alseep extra hour we know what time i woke up like true 48 me a and then i i laid in bed saying no sleep more sleep more sleep mark can do it so i got about threethirty but that's that's me and in and that's that's just me and it depends what your schedule is it depends on what your genetic makeup is for sleep and if you work the night shift and obviously you're working at four thirty in the morning or you're getting off at were of work at 430 morning so this doesn't work in i try and put that caveat on pretty much everything that i say like my workouts but what i eat um everyone's a little bit different and i like what i like and and i do what i do and it worked for me and you can try it then if you come up with something that's better i'll listened to you um and that's the same with digits your man if you hate it then you know maybe it's not for you and in end you know what i would i truly think might my true fought is it beneficial for you yes it is should you stop doing everything that you don't like just because you don't like it no i mean there's some things you should press on should you get it should ever have a fundamental level of knowledge of jit suit it's very very beneficial uh but if you hated in and you've kinda come not conclusion then don't do it yeah in in in i think also once you give yourself that out once you give yourself the out in you not forcing yourself to do anymore you it might open up your mind to actually enjoy and try it and not be miserable about it yes yeah that's will actually would have see none of the this is they're probably and i don't know easily this some people don't like it straight up my gotta accept that i know i know but that being said there is a possibility that the environment that this first or that people train in sometimes will make you not like it and if not necessarily the jatiya don't like sure not eat wound up that way you don't like you to any more because you're kind of new pushed in the wrong direction as far as like what you the liking though like so you could try different school try difference try different story after like i said earlier today some schools are really strict and rigid and maybe that's booed be better for you some schools are real wild and there's no control maybe that that be a better school depending on what your personality as some people like that regiment environment yeah yeah you can you could definitely try different school uh but again i think i think the mental hurdle to come over is you've told yourself that you have to do it and now tell yourself you don't have to do should of water but certain in any see trader in school it it's the environment the train in sold the schools by the environment for sure but it's like training partners it's like the which can wind up as the pressure you put in yourself it's like everything you know the whole environment so i know that and people are different people took some people they want that pressure they want people yelling you don't like rim race to tell you like when you start coaching either media won't just in training not like you'll get fired out when you see to training whatever and you'll be like do this in you'll start kotan it's almost like you're like as a friend you're doing it like just for fun and you're like okay do this in you usually coach up the other guy when i'm rolling with them and that other guy oh he's getting coach way jackal so he turns up the heating and bro i don't like that because it's now it's like a thing and i know you don't i don't like that at all but some people do like that people they'd get some fired up get some more in the game you know thirty two m saint people were different so the possibility is that this guy happens to be in the wrong environment footage it to free for hip for to for himself yes exactly i saw as a possibility and just like i said you know he he could very well be pudding that pressure on himself like you have to go and everyone thing how great it is and as the best thing and if you don't show up to practice your lack near lame or get under that's true like if you get told all the time it's the best thing in the world and and then you show up there and you get beat up which is what happiness in need in yet and now you're you're how does everyone like this yeah this doesn't feel good to me and use gona negative mindset ready sei should be careful that and that's not to mention when you even imply that you don't necessarily like it old europe could you suck oh yeah because the year this or your week or you're whatever you're a slacker like basically all this negativity you know is gonna turn you off even more so now yeah you hate it now which which there is a read the reality of it is some some things don't agree with some people right that's that's a that reality like there's that some things i in don't the world i i know i i just don't like them like when we are driving to la your plains of music you some of the music that you're playing as is popular music i i just don't like it i just don't like and and there's other things like that in the world uh trying to think of things that i just just like other people like them and i just don't like them i just don't poke eamonn go that's one the out early i mean i don't i never even thought about pogue mogo seems like a cool idea you've got you look for things on your phone i mean i'm not that's not the type of thing that i'm talking about um you know i guess dancing at the club i mean m i don't care bomb trying to think of something that some i guess music is the best is one of the best examples for me is is you know i hate the certain types of music certain artists leif lately flakes hair lay flights hair medal from the nineveh he he legit likes there and and i i like legit do not like it and the reason i use the reason that's a good example is because that's not far off from kind of the music that i do like a i mean i like i like led zeppelin i mean i love led zeppelin right led zeppelin is awesome an and the step from led zeppelin two two two poison i mean you could you they could be in the same record category in the store right rock and roll led zeppelin i love you i poison kinda turns my stomach i i hate to end so that is an example of so some things that just don't sit well with you yeah and and may be jit's who doesn't sit well with this guy now um like i said i think there's a lot of benefits to it i think he is a lot out of it try different environment but if you hate it don't may force yourself to do it open open the escape give yourself out and that allows you to feel more comfortable can you feel trapped everyone feels like a cornered animal and in our you're just pissed off yeah you even be viewed in like hey these guys everyone i heard someone talking about you too so i'm gonna try it yeah and now you first day you don't like it for years i i'm going to keep doing it because that ruined saint it's great and you just end up in a bad way yeah so be careful that one yet you can a trapped with the with the junk parts of it that that kind of came about in yet and you can't release keep it the newly rebel against it if jack a member when we're driving up to la i was claim kerry by europe that is actually technically 80s hair metal gear eds an easier for sure but you're really mad yeah yeah gnome tony that music doesn't sit well with me for some reason you got little bdnf comeback to lay flicked lay flakes metallica leif like spikes sabbath lay flakes tool he likes rocking bands too yeah for some reason there's some genetic code in his head that poisons cool yeah just let that right in hot denying gets the and whole yet but then i guess on the other end of the spectrum you get the we get into music that leif and white likely flex pant tara pant ariza hard banned now i go one step further than pandera writer in similar to some of the music that i listen to him uh which i think leaves leif a little bit where he wouldn't listen to some of the harder music that i was new but painters you know brushing up against it he di listened to soft music tomorrow do you consider soft news as some samano something about love songs out another you know le let something soft teen on mc i'd say white buffalo white below okay is hard acoustic music but the you know he's got some pretty mellow songs he got a song called love song number one woods did about though like is it is it like romantic he does he talked out his low eliza girl or something like that i would say yes yeah canada the count 'cause you know like well how can that knockout otto no because you know how like that like uh metallica for example they have unforgiven right so it sounds softer but they're still talking about hard stuff and k and then they have like enter sanmen which is okay will and i guess i'm does not know my answer to use know look alike do you like what about led zeppelin by it won't thieves still talking about like these are soft things like you know soft lane algebra remember member algiere ill and you like what the all day if the european fewer mad at me personally like you and you're like who is this an another you know what though actually i played another song uh who was it he's a josh read in or something in your like hey this is pretty good i was very surprised it was a soft song hooker do you remember that's won't my musical tastes are varied yeah i different types of visa yes so i guess others aum's ives him he's a good at don't like yeah i sometimes wonder with you like it if you're the canyon hossam people they they just just i like music not i'm not thing me i'm just saying certain people they are into justice specific type of music that they're that's the whole reason for music in their head is like this very specific feeling like some people the um that a note before the only like housemusic the like anything other than al's music this is like it's just the old brother listen to nothing i wondering if you're like kind of that kind nowhere because i listen all different kinds of music yeah well at least does not maybe not all different yet at okay you're right i listen to a wide feerick various types sure are you though not alger although i forget the song but it was eager for back to it later thursday all right next question oba from tang and if of edf the guy who hates due to that's kind of crazy it's a bummer but it's it's not that rare yet makes sense it totally makes in us as actually talking with dave kimmeria sure i know who that he that he owns um i was up with him up in san francisco area yesterday and we are talking about how some people don't like gypsy high via the in you'd think even people that are you would think would like to to people that have jobs that dude it to would be really beneficial for them to know you they don't buy tickets and so and i was saying that i've introduced a lot of people to jit to a lot of people to jitsuo not many of them have actually stuck with it for a long period of time yeah but and and so it's not that rare for people to not like jitsuo yet in a a dig it's like not sticking with because you did sticks work it's not like the easy thing the provides discipline oh you're sized difference between not liking to to a not actually sticking with it yes yes tho those guys straight up i hate it the i thought of as a little bit more powerful vip treatment area yeah it's like deafening doesn't like people who don't stick with it for the most part this just a total gas on my prayer leading lacked discipline yeah like there there is they they they don't like it enough anand on account of momenttomoment basis take to get off the couch and go that's kind it journal with one of those situations the question jaakko of question after reading your book which i thought was one of the best books i've read since your last book thanks i'm curious what what you did during your seal team dis to maintain your your schedule as i would imagine in the teams your schedule changes at any minute to include you being deployed were active during your various missions that night so as in life how do you keep your balance of your schedule when do calls in your book you see keep your schedule but how did you work through this when you would be on a mission that didn't allow you to sleep at night did you still did you still the following day upon return maintain your normal schedule sponsored yeah obviously the teams that your schedule in the teams can vary a lot and you have to adopt to what makes sense and sometimes in the team's work 1820 our day sometimes out the field you're going to the field for two three four five days at a time sometimes you're working for 24 hours a day or you work for thirty six hours straight because you do planning in the bubble wassot that could be rama sometimes you're doing dives you're doing to dives a day and that takes a bunch of time and it takes a toll on you it's hard work i guess you could say um sometimes were running around all day or all night running around the desert running around the urban training facility and so the schedules changing all the time and it's the same thing with business the same thing with business right now i travel on the flight these early the fight leaves later work all day or the dinner with a clients or the interviewer the writing of the the recording of the podcast or the changing times on some things change answer what what i do is yes i try and i try and keep the schedules marched i can and if i fall off the schedule for whatever reason i get back all on it as quickly as possible and i think so so yes you do the best you can i think the main thing you have to watch out for is leading leading a change in schedule or a problem in your schedule beat excuse to fall off the path that that's what you have to watch out for um you know we think oh new times owner i've got jet lag right in sleep well or i need rest from travelling or i did this the other night and so i'm going to sleep until nine thirty tomorrow morning and just call it good real that's what you have to watch out for not sometimes you need to work to ninth disley till nine thirty dow sometimes you do sometimes you stayed up for thirty six hours you go to bed at three o'clock in the morning guess what you might need to sleep until nine thirty that's cool good f do it get some sleep um but just be careful of using it as an excuse to go away off the path and just get yourself back on the path as soon as possible makes sense yes sir yes that's all me right there like one little thing if he had they'll throw the obvious all day is gone i'll do tomorrow please got a careful not uh speaking to schedule i think we're about good for questions there's one more thing that i wanted to close out with and you know i get a lot of i got a lot of really a great emails i will get a lotta great uh messages through social media letters written letters again all those kinds of things and i appreciate them all i don't always respond all of them because there's i physically cannot do it yeah and of course you know oh get someone to manager social media whatever not doing that uh if you hear back from me you hear from me not from somebody that i paid ten dollars an hour to respond to my stuff in say cool get after it like no god not doing that but you know i get i get all these things and i i do read them so if you send it i read it and so i appreciate the feedback and everything i got one though that i that was good i wanted to actually one to read on here because i felt that it not only said hey thanks for you know the podcast or whatever thanks for the books whatever it actually give some pretty good methodology and really an insight into a mindset that i think will help people doing what they're doing so here we go mr willockx just wanted to share a quick story with you at thirty nine i had fallen into a 15year rot of undisciplined alcoholism i was soft and heavy and wanted to change earlier this year i started working out three to four times a week in my basement i was trying and failing to get a handle on my alcohol abuse every failure made the beast seem bigger an unbeatable it was like i didn't have control over my body i finished your book on a monday night and decided that i would get up early the next morning workout i got up and worked out not much but i just wanted to do something sit ups push ups fifteen minutes on the bike worked out twice tuesday got up wednesday and did it again got to thursday night a normal drinking night and decided to try not drinking made it through friday same thing worked out morning in night stayed busy and stayed away from the drink fought i should try and push it through the weekend worked out saturday morning took the rest of the weekend often stay dry monday morning i got up and started two days again made it through the week with eleven workouts by the second week i felt better than i had in my entire life i was astounded that normal people walked around feeling this good i guess not systematically poisoning your body will do that on the fifth week i got a project at work there was going to require traveling for the next eight weeks i was worried about overcoming my triggers and road habits but normal travelling evening was dinner watch cable and drink eight beers to my surprise the hotel at a sweet jim cool i'll just keep doing what i'm doing then at the site i found out that were we would start work at six a m damn that means i have to get up at four to work out i'm twelve weeks into my travelling to a days usually getting eleven to twelve workouts a week they recently moved or start time to seven am so now i get an hour and a half in the morning and evening i'm 16 weeks clean dropped thirty pounds or more haven't been on a scale in three weeks thirtyfour waste genes hang off of me by sit up and pushed upsets when from ten to forty to fifty keto bell swings went from 35 by ten to fifty by fifteen i started to learn how to run as a haven't done in twenty years now after a day off i can do to miles without stopping i do four or five miles on the treadmill and nine miles on the bike besides the sit ups push ups cattle bells core and weights i look forward to next year's competitive shooting season i'm going to bring it at this point my cravings are gone and i actually recoil from the smell of boos when i started this i thought it would be temporary now it's going to be permanent no reason to waste time with it anymore now when i question something your voice comes to me with the hard answer it's only black and white with no gray area one day when i'm standing before the lord lord and hear his voice if it doesn't sound like yours i might be disappointed the book i read those months ago was a way of the warrior kid i'm working on extreme ownership now thank you for your service thank you for producing a bad asked podcast and thank you for influencing my life so there you go and i i say this to people all the time most important here is it isn't me it's u n sure you may have grabs some little foothold from the podcast her from one of the books but it isn't me that changes you you you set the small goals you achieve those goals then set some more and achieve those and set some more goals may be a little bit bigger but not that much bigger you pay attention to the progress this guy is 16 weeks deep thirty pounds lighter working harbor stronger faster more efficient competitive the individual that wrote that is getting after it and changing his life and you can too to star start small start with changing tomorrow morning just tomorrow morning get that squared away and then move on to the next day and the next in move your life to a better place one little step one little victory at a time appreciate the letter in i think debts all of got four tonight so echo speaking of people getting better stronger in faster and actually supporting the podcast if they wanna do that sir do you have any suggestions for us sure of course they do i can talk about the fact that four gin as a new key coming up good on i don't know that the name of the game ghiz have names legba origin does day acharya yep yep yep that's cool name to buy of axiom but this one is called i think dis discipline i think it's called dissovling would be called discipline yeah not the discipline distrust this discipline that could be called up sure you can check it out origin made dot com right yeah surprisingly aesthetically great i would say it's i would say it's probably is the term the use like on brand on his brand meaning is it kind of fit fit sits year brand okay sure unfilled say it does that ijaw via the ad totally does it um it's like yet deal it's not the kind where you know like some ease like youth academy can tell there's like all these bells and whistles as far as decorations go you hit on either it's a good word it decorations yeah yeah a phil but he not looking for decorate here's the thing though there are some there are some uh i'll should i say function all decorations now that's not actually a good word for anyway it it looks cool put it that way it looks cool it will basically uh colonel lighterweight one for functionality but awesome nonetheless uh look at it i got away one and eight at the black had he known of both yeah i'm sure you have both air i'm still working on the black on but that's a long story nonetheless the good one and a lot like back when we first started to everyone would ask them the it i don't want the everyone but a lot of people there you know i don't like i is that we are no he's going to say let let yet little puke use everyday some people some people but the thing is a lot of people though as like a lot of you have always wondered did i get making the disclaimer it was a lotta people whether a guy like oviedo my little brother asked me once and then after me again use it's a lot of people maybe two times a week two times a week for two years by the way that is a lot of people he said i'm asking the same exact question anyway they ask like oh what can you should i get it whatever now there's like yeah origin ghiz and then now insane get this one who's the one st up to ask i don't know that all wear any other key nothing i won't unjust seen i don't know that i and actually i don't know if we know this did you know that they're going to sell this key and a certain number of m four hundred you're going to get a copy of discipline eagles freedom field manual loading signed two isil of you want us i'll did you know that gi in yeah because it's like a little little pill gilvis yeah little discipline package yet if you unabating geagea to what do you do for to hang selig he hang it out hang up we need in hopefully don't agency looked at one a question today yeah hopefully loved you to to most likely you'll objectives yeah hopefully yeah if you're getting the discipline equals freedom game is a disc lynn equals freedom key or just dicilec let's be called the deaf geat i dunno defke qaeda that's good deif winning freedom is goods embroidered as the american me yeah the end it is made in america like all the word and stuff but yes yeah that's a good on you look at delon get down if you still looking for a gigot don't give and if you're not looking for you just look at this brennan pick worth he he he said on twitter he's going to get the even though he's not change it it's today and it actually i have i didn't respond to brandon bell respond right now get the and trained jit sierra it's the kind where he's gonna he's gonna by the way data he's going to get the is like he but then changed i do kinda risk people saying hey you're nut law enforcement where you were in that patch like some of those patches if who me seem like you like you give me a nasa one like that's where you shoot should i do even wearing this the we got we got friends nasa tanjung i'm gonna wear it it was his from my friends at nasa rita anyway anyway back to origin origin that's all americanmade stuff from the caught in out of the ground american to the factory american factory in america in maine and make the material make the clothing make the ghiz make d'arrache guards make the will to the eggs have yet the gym bags and whatnot accessories i believe there called accessories yes it like beanies and tshirts all made in america yeah i think when it will jordan peterson that i think he liked it even even though he's not america stale and and the supplements yeah from origin labs yet those are jaakko supplements soul here's the thing i'll manet i'll go into the details later but super krill there is a legitimate difference between supercrew in regular krill oil there is and it's very beneficial say right now but just no super krill oil jaakko brand joint warfare jaakko brand for your joints supplements boom jukka came up with it that's the stuff from the beginning douse the main supplements you know joint stuff krill oil you're the number one reason not even the number in the only reason i started taking it and i'm kinda matter i didn't take it before you behind yeah and now you got your own one which is even better the suit it's super as meth super yeah but it's not just the name the joint were fairly the joe offer hausa the some magic in it sure in my opinion it sure an end in my shoulders opinion we add left shoulder both on my shoulders my back and my elbows or deeming dot com as a place to go also some legitimate fitness gear if one of them into keto bells now i get mine from on it did the coup in straight up that's it i don't think i could go back to regular keto both my opinion the where will but the big foot ninety pounds two pounds heavier than chuckles heaviest keddell bell every rep i think george peterson was impressed with that too by the way yes you us x one of us also oh sorry on it dot com slash jaakko that's the one good spot in a also good way to support when you buy books the chalker reviews i guess technically eccnet help preview in a real kinda discount endure act yes in other act is the way any way the books very compelling books when you get them go to the website jackpot guess dot com little tab on the top says books from podcasts go through there by the books do there that's a good way to support ticketed amazon shop in just the way prime one day shipping whatever you choose just like anything else but go through that is a good way to support into any other shopping you have to do carry on with sport also subscribe to the podcast on i iteens stitcher who will play depending on what kind of platform you prefer or is available to you because iphone i think done that have stitcher no my iphone stitcher await no android doesn't have i l s i don't know apple yenold that you could listen to uh maybe anand either i don't know but you can get it man yeah podcast is out there you can subscribe to it the point is subscribe to it yes yes subscribe to it on now on to leave review if you want if you're in the mood leave review also subscribe to it on youtube youtube subscribed to that's the point there regardless of if you wanna know what i look like are not doing no matter what i look like really barely maybe a little bit i guess maybe because if i see you out in the wild it'll be you know we can recognize each other if you own like beneficial there are times when people recognize u n you'll like say oh yet is that which are the tell their faith their life away are you sure that this is seal cowlings rivaling encountered that for sure of a real like i know all they're served as listen that's cool i dig it but if you own avoid that kind of situation subscribe to you too good way to do it m could would support also duckworth store called chuckle store chuckle sorta come we have tshirts on their if you want these tshirts i'm wearing a good tshirt right now i haven't worn this on the only time the original hi quality layers too by the way the good is backwards to look at in the mirror that message is for you if you think about the whole message of good i mean i know you said it needled hill you're like good kind of thing but you are kennett thank you guys had the the luxury of you being there to be able to explain it mm if someone's going through like something hard it's you can't just automatically just say good it kind of comes off kind of weird potentially also good way to support yourself psychological warfare if you to know what that is it's an album with tracks jaakko tracks in there are two view in the event of you needing aid near campaign against weakness on your path on that path okay so here's the thing about the path it's not always going to be easy what i'm saying i know what you're saying yeah every day man this is not a one day gig this is an everyday every day is a monday via on the path here's the i will say this though okay so and you you read the letter for the guy with with drinking i dipped i could relate to that deeply deeply could relate to that end in a way an ad on good too deep into it but in a way that my situation was in a way harder because the drinking wasn't prevented me from working out it will it prevented me from doing like a lot of stuff it was only prevented me from doing like a handful of things but those things are really wanted to do but it was really preventing me early it was put it this way it was making it super difficult and then just the fact of like drinking every single day you know anything and the more you you know how you the more you get in the routine it on some it with them in the heart the harder it is to destroy a break that routine especially when it provides the path is like drinking does chemically emmy nierlich when you drink the instantaneous iaf exactly right longterm payoff no longterm negative like not even proportionately more beneficial to to to stop drinking like you know when he said um while this is how everyday people walk around yeah good role ian really i felt that statement grit that so true that's exactly what i thought tang noone ridge trick in these feed jock who doesn't drink creates a no wanted chuckles doing all this stuff i could i could do all that stuff too that's how you feel nothing i'm doing all the stuff i'm just saying that the feeling like i could dig it anyway point is when you're on this path it's not always easy but psychological warfare is there to get you through those difficult parts parts that you admit or the candidate mit the need maybe a little little push little help little spot we can up early procrastinating that the begin skipping the workout that kind of stuff psychological warfare kit so there's a trap for every little weakness he might encounter skipping the diet or or or slacking on the diet that the good on um but yeah checked out one out and uh you know he would up good way to support yourself in your on the path when you're on the path and with puk as well also you can get some choco white t which tastes like victory and will make you feel really good you get that on amazon the books way the warrior kid number one which which is covered obviously it is not just a book for kids you uncle jake has something to teach all of us myself included through dolts and teenagers and anyone else that wants to have a better life can add some new book we're the work you which in a i'm on a cycle i just read it over and over again like as just like a routine to daughter yes four and a half the she can't wait read yet um but the ltte there's little things in there that it's like this is really good that these kids are getting this this message because this stuff that as an adult you're like dang and never really even though you know it like okay in this is what it is when you're like how do you expect to be good at something if you don't practice like little laws guess rail kids don't know that they don't they straight up don't yell and gutting practice i feel like a we kind of forget that in a way no we absolutely do yeah so yeah the is is for sure there's a lot in that book and sometimes i read that book and i and anders even more in their deny even recognised iin india because i not the lessons that are coming out of my head there so important though like beyond my own comprehension yet and i was just explaining the book where the warrior kid to which is going to come out and i was i was talking through a with a guy yesterday like what what it's about and as an explaining everything that it's about is a lot of stuff it's a lot of really important lessons schiff um but yet started wade were your kid uh the second warrior kit book will be out april twenty eight th two thousand eighteen actually speaking of books there is extreme ownership a new addition a new addition is out it's not a totally new book it's a new addition of it it's going to be available november 21st you can get it for preorder right now on amazon if you want it um it's got a new forward in too salesian i wrote a new ford it has some colour pictures in it um also the the new cover is black which aims to cover from white to black why because block obviously amazon barnes and noble you can get it out walmart by the way target the publisher ship it out the everywhere so you can pick it up it's a good book to give to people in my opinion it's it's it's not just like giving someone a book you're giving them something a little bit more than a book absent the sat like something a little bit more in the book is i don't know if i can i can explain it to well right now look at it yes yang can look at in it's it's not normal i would say it's not normal um if you want the audio version of that book which a lot of people have been asking about the audio version is available it is not on audible and it is not going to be an audible it is made and we put it together echo directed and produced the album that also has tracks so it's an album with tracks and it's available as mp three anywhere that you can get mp three tracks for sale i tunes amazon music music gouka play wherever wherever mp threeplatform utilize you can find it there and if he liked the leadership principles that we talk about on this podcast and you want to get them for your team or your business we have a leadership and management consulting company it's called echelon front it's me it's leif baben it's jp do now it's dave burke you can email info echelon front dot com or you can check out the website echelon front dot com and if you have more questions