20 Episode results for "David Duke"

Season 4 Trailer

Slow Burn

02:49 min | 1 year ago

Season 4 Trailer

"In the nineteen seventies David Duke was America's best known white supremacist. Why. Are Searching are reaching out for a moment and AQAP plan. In the eighties and nineties, Duke became a political phenomenon. There's something very scary about the election of David Duke, the former imperial wizard of the Ku Klux Klan. UPS Klansman David Duke David Duke. No big endorsements David. States came out against. I'm Josh Levin Slates National Editor. I grew up in Louisiana and as a kid I watched David Duke Win elected office and come close to taking control of the entire state. Back then I had no idea how the David Duke story was going to end. On the new season of slow-burn, I'm going to look back at the Duke Movement and how he nearly became Louisiana's governor. He really believes that inside every white person was racist, trying to get out. We could feel the fish hooks of his propaganda like hooking into part of our brains, and just really allowing us off to the side. How did David Duke Take off? Do was a master scapegoats. He was saying things about taxes in welfare that people wanted here. and. Why did people support a Nazi sympathizer and former Klan leader? You warned about Duke. And then when he don't. Be this monster. You give him more credit for not being the monster. Then you would give somebody who's never been a monster. There's a lot I didn't know about Duke. And about all the strange and dangerous stuff swirling around him. Finally one partly. David he said YEP has this. Are you out of your mind? Who Was David? Duke I I'm standing up for the white race I don't I don't deny that I do. Focus. In. What did it take to stop him? I. Hope I'm wrong. I hope he fades away. I hope all this was incredibly. And ridiculous and. None of this comes to pass. But I'm a great believer in history and learning from history. And not repeating mistakes of history. slow-burn season for David Duke coming soon wherever you gave podcasts.

David Duke Ku Klux Klan Josh Levin Louisiana Slates National Editor America UPS
S4 Ep. 1: White Knight

Slow Burn

46:13 min | 1 year ago

S4 Ep. 1: White Knight

"This podcast contains language that some listeners might find offensive. White. Supremacist love talking to Evelyn Rich. Maybe it was her talent for flattery. All right well. You better face weird the way. Did you kind of an interesting and maybe? At and. Rich was born in England and she was getting her. At Boston, University her dissertation was on the modern. Ku Klux Klan what they believed and why they believed. On February Seventeenth Nineteen, eighty-six. She put her tape recorder in front of a Neo Nazi named Joe Fields. Incident From the time I was. Probably four or five I was attracted. To. National Socialism I used to watch Hollywood movies and I move for the Germans. Rich in fields got together in southern California. At a conference hosted by the Institute for Historical Review. The I. HR called itself a think tank, but it was really a hate group. Its main goal was to sow doubt about the Holocaust to spread the lie that Germany hadn't really killed six million Jews. The doctoral student and the Neo Nazi wouldn't be alone for long. A few minutes into their conversation. Got Interrupted by a knock on the door. She's probably the only one in my family why? Really Talk to you. Feel It was David Duke America's best known white supremacist. Wrong. Getting that way. Do could grown up in New Orleans in the fifties and sixties. His father wasn't around much, and his mother was an alcoholic. As a teenager, he found a community at the New Orleans White Citizens Council, a group that fought to stop the immigration of public schools do cut famous in the seventy s when he was a leader in the Ku Klux Klan. Reporters and TV producers thought he was a fascinating subject. He was well dressed and clean cut. He seemed like a perfectly nice young man until he opened his mouth. American white people. Are Searching are reaching out for a movement and a blocks plan. Is that movement? By the time he met Evelyn. Rich Duke was in his thirties and he'd broken with the clan. Do couldn't resist butting into rich's. With a Nazi. When Duke spoke up, he made it clear that has worldview hadn't changed since he left the KKK. People, Joe Deserve. They try respond to people I. Didn't they're trying to raise I? Think probably a moral sense Jewish people. Been Hall. And they probably deserve. Got Him gasping history. The Jewish people have been a blade. They probably deserve to go into the ash of history. Behind closed doors at this California Mita for Holocaust Deniers Duke felt comfortable sharing his true beliefs. And that wasn't all he revealed. A few minutes later Duke talked about his master plan his strategy for breaking into the mainstream by keeping quiet about his extremist views. Trying to do people and. It's the difference if they can call you a Nazi and make it step I mean. Really hard. It's GonNa hurt. It's hurt being built. In what you're saying? When fields brought up, Nazi, Germany Duke said the time was right for a new theatre. It doesn't take that many people to start rolling if they're starting seven men right, and that's what I'm trying to a lot, most people have. Into thought you think it can happen right now with the rank package together. Don't you think that there are millions of Americans are alienated hoping something and the truth is the truth and give them some people leave and Gary Well. Somebody. Might. have. Because nobody else might do it. The recording you just heard would help bring down David Duke. But that would happen later. In the late eighties early nineties, Duke was sure his time had come. That he was the leader, white people wanted to believe in. He was canny and charismatic, and in his home state of Louisiana. He was becoming a political star. As a kid growing up in new, Orleans, there was a lot about Duke in his movement that I couldn't comprehend. But I saw and heard enough back then to understand that something enormous was at stake. There's something very scary about the election of David Duke. David Duke is drawing full houses much of the debate. At least at first will be about David, Duke. Some hate him. To others hero. This is slow. Burn Season Four. I'm your host Josh Levin. Over the next six episodes, you'll hear about the moment when a white supremacist became an American political phenomenon. What were the forces that fuel David Dukes rise. What did it take to defeat him? Did he ever really go away? This is episode one. White Knight. David Duke had big plans and an enormous ego, his first priority in the years after he bared his soul Tavlin rich was to win the highest office in the land. Of Your commitment, you might commitment. Tomorrow I well announce. Might inform all entry. into the race, the Democratic nomination for President United States. dukes nineteen, Eighty, eight presidential run was a flop. As a Democrat, he couldn't muster enough support to get on the debate stage Duke then ran under the banner of the Populist Party, a fringe group dominated by Klansmen, Holocaust deniers and vowed Nazis. In that nineteen eighty-eight race George H W. Bush Michael Dukakis by eight points do quit earn just point zero five percent of the vote. Duke was undeterred by this electoral rout. He believed he had a great message, and that he was a great messenger. He would just need to take a different path to power. A month after the presidential race, the thirty eight year old Duke found an opportunity that was within his grasp. He was going to run for the Louisiana State House of Representatives. This podcast is going to focus on a few pivotal years in dukes career the period when he made his most successful run at real political power. I'm starting here with the campaign and the New Orleans suburbs because this was the race that changed David Dukes life. Before this election in Louisiana's House district, eighty one duke wasn't really a factor in state or national politics. But by the time the campaign was over Duke was incision, and he was threatening to take control of the entire state. And it all happened incredibly quickly. House district eighty one was in the suburb of metairie in Jefferson parish. Parish by the way, or what most dates call counties new. Orleans is an Orleans parish. Yes, there, pronounced differently for reasons it would take a whole other podcast to explain. The district! Eighty one race was a special election. The seat came open when the guy who held. It became a judge. It would be a lightning-fast campaign. The primary was in less than two months. Dukes opponents included a school board member, a florist, a Bingo, hall owner, and John, Trine, who is best known as the brother of a former Louisiana governor? Any of those men could have ended David. dukes campaign before it started due could been living just outside the district. If someone had challenged his residency, he would have been disqualified and it's possible. No one would remember Duke to. But none of them raised a challenge. They didn't think duke was a serious contender. Maybe they didn't understand district eighty-one. Jersey James Gill who wrote about Duke for the New Orleans Times Picayune. Very Very. Consultative is the polite word. If ever of a clansman, announcing wants to get into mainstream politics. You couldn't choose a better district than this one. A mentoring saves tailor-made. District Eighty one included the neighborhood of old memory with its tree, lined streets and big mansions. It also included the working class area of Buck town, an old fishing village dotted with clobbered homes district eighty-one had rich people and Heart, people and people in between, but almost all of them ninety nine point six percent of them were white. Most voters in the district were on the Rolls as Democrats, but they'd started to cast ballots for Republicans and huge numbers. In his nineteen eighty four reelection campaign, Ronald Reagan got eighty four percent of the vote in district eighty one. David Duke New has audience in this special election. He wouldn't be a Democrat or a populist this time he'd run as a Republican. On the trail duke touted himself as honest and outspoken at times as national news outlets pointed out that outspokenness was more like straight up racism. One plant in Dukes Platform, reforming the welfare system by curbing the. Black birth rate. But Duke didn't mention the Holocaust. And when he got on the subject of race, he spoke more stridently than Ronald Reagan did, but mostly took the same positions. In fact I'm trying to prevent discrimination with his ideas. I save eliminating quotas. workfare instead of welfare, and we want an absolute end. These anti white programs of racial discrimination called affirmative action minority set asides. Duke presented White Nationalism as an ideology of fairness. He argued that black Americans were getting special privileges on the job market and in government contracting. And that it was time for someone to stand up for White People's interests. Here's Quinn Hillier a Republican who supported dukes opponent John Trine. When he did talk about race, it was never about. Doing anything to blacks. It was always about protecting whites psychologically for a lot of voters these distinctions. Subtle distinctions are important. Duke didn't only talk about race. One of his biggest issues was property taxes. He vowed to keep them low to protect what he called hardworking productive middle-class People This was the plan. Duke had laid out to Evelyn wrench in the Neo Nazi Joe Fields. She was trying to bring New People in to win over voters who didn't identify as white supremacists. To understand the district where David Duke was running, you need to know about the most powerful man in Jefferson parish. He was a Chinese American sheriff in a cowboy hat and his name was Harry Lee. Here he is an a two thousand six interview with NPR a year before he died. The Sheriff of Jefferson Parish is the closest thing. There is being king and the United States. I have no unions. Service! Hired and fired will. I don't have to go to council. PROPOSED BUDGET I approve the budget. I'm the head of the law enforcement district in. Addict only has one vote, which is me. Lee was a fun loving autocrat at Mardi Gras. He threw Harry Lee dolls from a flood that featured an enormous likeness of his own face. The sheriff spent eighty thousand dollars on that flute which he saw as money well spent. Every year he said my big fat heads, coming on veterans, highway and a half million a million people see. Harry Lee was born in New Orleans in nineteen, thirty, two and the back room of his family's laundromat. A bunch of lease constituents. Jefferson parish had relocated from New Orleans to. One of them was David Duke who moved to Jefferson in the nineteen seventies. White lenience went to the suburbs in search of bigger houses and lower tax bills. They also wanted to get away from black people. Here's former New Orleans Mayor Marc morial. His father was the city's first black mayor. What they were doing was getting away from integration. Fleeing. what they thought. The city New Orleans was was becoming, which was a city, which was more racially diverse, and we're African. American numbers were increasing in African American influence was increasing. As the population of Jefferson parish swelled Harry Lee presented himself as the guardian of the suburbs. He'd make sure that memory felt like a safe haven for white people. The sheriff faced a big test in nineteen, eighty six, when the parish was hit by a string of armed robberies that December he proposed a solution to the crimewave racial profiling. It will be stopping more black people in predominantly white neighborhoods and in. I. Don't know how to say that we're going to do. If you live in a predominately white neighborhood in this to blackmail to the call ripon you There's a pretty good chance that they're up to no good. The Executive Director of the Louisiana as you called Leah despicable bigot. Protesters descended on Jefferson parish, demanding his resignation and chanting Harry Leeann. McClellan go hand in hand. Lee Walked back his plan, but he didn't resign. James Gill covered leave for decades. He would away say exactly what he thought. And what is sold was. Seldom Livni correct, but often chimed with his constituents. Harry had that knack of getting away with stuff that. Other people couldn't. And they just loved him for it. Harry leased, supporters thought he was being straight with them about the dangers of New Orleans and of nor lenience, specifically black new ORLEANIANS poverty blade and gun violence were real problems in the city and the nineteen eighty s here's mark. Morale again. Louisiana was experiencing a deep deep recession related to the the downward price of oil. which caused a? Tremendous upheaval. Caused New Orleans to lose a population. It gave us a problem of abandoned housing fueled the the crime and the crack epidemic in the city. In New Orleans, the economic catastrophe of the oil bust converged with the nationwide trends of white flight, an urban neglect. The white suburbanites of Jefferson parish meanwhile went to great lengths to keep their enclave sealed off one incident in nine hundred seven drew national attention. Finding this evening, we have a report about crime and race relations, and it may come out of which side of the fence you live on just outside you Orleans to be specific. Offense and IT'S NOT A. It's a barrier. The Jefferson Parish Council ordered the construction of two steel barricades. Those barriers closed off a pair of public streets, blocking traffic from black neighborhood New Orleans parish officials, said the barricades where to keep criminals from slipping in and out of their neighborhoods, but is pure racism. This Atta. Jefferson is predominantly white wears. This side of all these Paris is predominantly black. A NEW ORLEANS. Government crew bulldozed the barricades, and Jefferson decided not to rebuild them. But the message had been sent. We'll be back in a minute. Hey there slow-burn listeners. I just wanted to take a moment to say that. If you're a fan of the show, please consider signing up for sleep. Plus that is slates membership program, and this season were letting slate plus members listen to the first half of our series on David Duke Right away whilst I have bonus episodes where we'll dive deeper into the history were exploring the season, and as always members get to skip out on all ads on all slate podcast. It's only thirty five dollars for the first year, and you can find out more at slate dot com slash slow-burn that slate dot com slash slow. Burn thanks so much. Racism was a powerful force in district, Eighty, one the popularity of Harry Lee and the barricades constructed on the border with Orleans parish for that out. So did the rising street level support for David, Duke? Early, polls had duke and third place with just seven percent support, but James Gill was sure those numbers were bogus. He watched Duke Stroll into a bar in metairie and get received as a hero. He also saw Duke Yard signs everywhere and Gil thought although signs actually understated dukes popularity. People would be embarrassed to confess. They were voting for you. But in the privacy of the voting booth. They would do it you. And on January sixteenth nineteen thousand nine. Five days before the primary. An incident in New Orleans, made race-based campaign resonate more loudly and Jefferson parish. At approximately four this afternoon Martin Luther King Day on. Canal street turned ugly calls could be heard on police radios find keep the crowds from building to thick. When they did. There were fights between blacks and whites another games. The police, said the violence in downtown, New Orleans stem from what they call turf wars between black youths. But some bystanders got caught in the middle. By Sixty feet up. We came down here, saying no whites black. Company. Canal Street had been New Orleans as main shopping district. But by the lead nineteen eighties, it was bladed. Anyone, who could afford to when shopping at malls a few miles away and metairie? The violence on Canal Street was part of a larger story about disinvestment in American cities. But most people in district eighty-one weren't thinking about sociology. They wanted to keep New Orleans and everything had represented is far from their front doors as possible. The more scared they were, the better it was for David Deep? One of Duke's opponents, watching footage of the violence told his wife. I think we're going to have some trouble with this. As voters district eighty one went to cast their ballots. David Duke was still considered an underdog. The front runner was sixty two year old Republican John Trine. Beth. Rickey worked for the trump campaign here. She is a nineteen ninety-one. I came up the stairs at nine election-night and coming up the stairs, and I was just waiting to hear that it was John and this other fellow Delton Charles and run off and someone grabbed me and said do came in first. Governor Buddy Roemer says electing former Klansman David Duke to the state legislature would not help. National Image Duke Lead train with thirty three percent of the vote. David Duke was inching closer to the American mainstream, but he wasn't a winner quite yet. This was just the first round of voting. Since neither duke or tree, and had a majority, there would be a runoff a month later. In Private Harry Lee described the face off between David Duke and John Train as a choice between a bit and an asshole. Republicans in Louisiana loved trains, brother, Dave, the former governor but John. Who made his money? As a home builder was seen as entitled an arrogant. He was the type of guy one anonymous Republican said who can tell you good morning and Piss you off. Tree, and had thought he could coast victory on name recognition alone. When the race became a personality contest, he was severely outgunned. Sean Train. WAS Not An impressive candidate. Abuse perfectly guys for other note, but had nothing ready to commend him. He was no. Charisma no NOKKALA. No style no dash. David Duke had the Dash John Trine lacked. dukes fans reveled in his youth and his energy. Earlier in the eighties, he remade his face with plastic surgery, a nose job Chin implant and chemical peels. One seventy two year old woman, said that seeing Duke at her door, one of the most thrilling moments of her life. Trine, voters tended to be the very richest in district eighty one the type that belong to country club. Duke support was wider ranging middle-class people, working class laborers, retirees and the people that liked him. They really liked him. Some voters are concerned about Dukes clan connection, but a lot are not. You got my full support. I mean I see nothing wrong with being white for white does not necessarily mean anti. It doesn't bother you that he's a former Klansman. And now I. Think This counting and all of them. Here's Beth rickey again. When I was on radio show one time. I got an sort of a debate with this man who was saying. Are you calling me a racist for supporting David Duke and I said why. Why are you voting for David Duke as opposed to say John Training said well David Duke Scott Credentials. And I thought that's so true. You know he's. They know. He means business about welfare reform. He's a clan leader. Tree and himself was no greet champion of civil rights. He'd once been a member of the segregationist states' Rights Party. But he said his views on race had evolved, and he drew a bright line between his values and David Dukes. Thank you very thin veil, racist and Anti Semitic campaign? This is history that goes back. They publications that his put out. One of trees, campaign mailers showed tree in his navy whites at age nineteen, serving his country during World War Two. Alongside it was a photo of nineteen year old, David Duke dressed as a Nazi brown-shirt. That image wasn't doctored. He really had worn a swastika. Duke knew this was bad for him. It was just like he'd said to Evelyn rich three years earlier if they can call you a Nazi and make it stick. It's going to hurt. Duke needed to make sure it didn't stick instead of apologizing, he played the victim. He called that flyer character assassination and made a show of tearing it up on local television. The Raisin district eighty one came down to trust who was an honest broker, and who is telling voters what they wanted to hear for Duke and train. This was a fundamental distinction. You don't even know the definition of cheating I'm standing up I'm standing up for the white race I don't I don't deny that. Do We know that officials? You agree with everything I say, but you don't have the guts and the courage to come out openly and say what I believe. You don't have the guts and courage to tell the truth UNAI doing it again. The runoff drew closer. The national media descended on district eighty-one. Polls have predicted a close race between Klansman David. and John Train both running as Republicans afternoon election officials said it appeared between seventy-five and eighty percent of the voters in the district would go to the polls. This is the front runner David. Duke is thirty eight years old. Smooth, articulate a sharp dresser and a former imperial wizard of the Ku, Klux Klan. Republican leaders were horrified by Duke by the prospect that he'd stay in the party's reputation. They saw the race in Jefferson parish as an emergency, John is always worked for the traditional values and principles which you and I cherish. Ronald Ronald Reagan recorded a radio commercial for Trine and President Bush and a letter to voters in the district, calling train the clear choice. It wasn't just National Republicans. Who Lined up by dukes opponent? The Louisiana Republican Party back John Trine to. Duke described these endorsements as outside interference. heavy-handed it's it's an ethical. I'm just as as much as legitimate Republican as John Train or are Reagan, Bush earnings other people. David Duke positioned himself as the ultimate outsider someone who understood what it felt like to be put upon and forgotten. The In district eighty one he said was me against the world. But not every public official took a stand against David Duke. Sheriff Harry Lee had a special connection with his white constituents a connection he'd built despite not being white himself. They saw is someone who has genuine and who spoke the truth, even when got him into trouble? So it's possible that we could have tilted the election if he told Jefferson parish voters, the duke was beyond the Pale. Instead lease at the race out. He didn't campaign for the bigot or the asshole. Here's James Gal. Harry must have felt. Very carefully. because. It didn't want to Eddie Nate's. Him Ready for Juke would also vote for Harry. ooh! On Election Day Quinn. Hillier posted up at the busiest intersection district eighty one the corner of Bonnabel veterans. There were maybe ten or twelve of us for train that we're at that intersection without green trained signs and twenty, five or thirty. Do People there with their blue in light? Duke signs, and for a large part of that time, David Duke himself was there. Hillier who was not quite twenty five at the time was active in the Louisiana. Young Republicans so. We're most of the other and supporters at the intersection. The Duke Partisans that Hillier saw were more ECLECTIC. They were skinheads that were making circles circles circles, yelling in favor of do there were even some frat boys at were hanging out and yelling in favor of Duke, they were. You know teenage girls who thought he was dreaming or something, and there were TV cameras all over the place. Duke was standing in the middle of all this delivering a gentle soothing message. People would recognize him. As I drove up in it. Stop at the light. They'd roll down the window and in this nice pleasant voice. Hi, David, Duke running, represent everybody in the district. I love everybody and I. Really WanNa do this right. I would really appreciate your vote. A short while later, the other train supporters went to lunch. He'll your was at the intersection by himself. There was a lull in traffic. And Duke saw and when there was nobody else around. Immediately to see. He, all of a sudden made a beeline toward me and started yelling at me and snarling, and his face got I'll read any, said the get off of my corner. This mustard street corner there three other corners. You can go to get the hell out of here. And then traffic had picked up, so he went back to the corner, and people stopped in all of a sudden he went from this snarling red phase. Beast to hi. I'm David Duke and I want to represent everybody. David was desperate for every vote. John Tree and just wanted the race to be over. When Hillier went back to campaign headquarters on the afternoon of Election Day. He found the candidate alone. John Train was sitting back there. Looking. catatonic glassy eyes, staring straight ahead I tried to talk to him and he the answer in these. Single syllable monotones. And I felt really sorry for the poor guy he he had no expectation getting into this race what he was in for, and he didn't know what had hit him. Was, one of the first people I spoke to when I started working on this podcast. How are you feeling? How how's it going? Happy Ninety four th birthday belatedly well, thank you very much. It's good to be ninety four. It'd be saying. They were known alternate defense. Good thing about getting no. It's always easier going downhill. Doom use it did. Okay. Hurt in what can I do for you know? My main takeaway from interviewing train was that he still hated David. Duke really really hated him. Train told me the Duke had spread a horrible lie about him during that nineteen thousand nine rees. When he got wind of it on election, day. In addition to all the other things I heard I distinctly remember one person going by drilling down they window, and said no way button for your guy. He's a child molester. John Travolta wasn't a child molester his brother. Paul was facing charges of child sexual abuse paltry in would later plead no contest and be sentenced to probation, but a lot of voters thought John was the one who done something wrong. Thanks to whispers from the Duke Campaign. That's Mir followed tree in long after the race was over. I had people that for years later. He noord me or had things to say ugly things to say to me because. That word got out. It was a problem. If you could say something to Duke. Now then, why would you say? I wouldn't speak to them. Would have nothing to say to. What? What would go to do to say anything to him? Nothing Two months after we talked John Trine died of Covid nineteen, his obituary began with the race and district eighty one. Let's take a quick break. What's the number one sign of a bad home security system that it's so complicated? You never use it. That's exactly the type of security system that simplisafe has been a decade fighting against. They believe that simple is safer, and that's why simplisafe is the home security. SIMPLISAFE was designed to be easy to use while protecting your whole home twenty four seven order online with the click of a button. Open. The box placed the sensors. Plug it in, and your home is protected around the clock. No technician or salesperson has to come and bother you and you don't need to pay any outrageous monthly fees or sign a two year contract, simply safe was named best overall home security of two thousand and twenty by US News and World Report. And there twenty, four, seven, professional monitoring an emergency dispatch starts at fifty cents a day. Head to SIMPLISAFE DOT COM slash slow, burn and get free shipping and a sixty day money back guarantee that simplisafe dot com slash slow-burn to make sure they know that our show saint you. I went to the Duke. Headquarters the night of the election. It was a lions club on memory road. And the mood of the crowd was hostile. Unruly. That's Jason Berry. A writer based out of New Orleans. I got in a conversation with several people who were telling me that the Holocaust was a myth that it never happened. Six million Jews did not die was all a form of propaganda I had never been exposed to Holocaust denial before that. Other journalists who were standing in a roped off media section became the targets of racist abuse from Duke supporters. A black cameraman said we need to get out of here before they lynch us. Remember I turned around, and I saw I had known Oh, in the eighth grade, who sister had been a debutante in New Orleans, and when I saw that guy. I realized. This is not just a bunch of. Of hard edged. Game is with shotguns in the back of their truck. There's there's something deeper going on here. A lot of people of middle class and of means. Closed ranks to vote for him. After campaign, pampered charges of racism within a visual return doing thirty five or thirty five precincts, reporting Duke has eight, thousand, four, hundred and fifty six trine. Eight, thousand, two, hundred and thirty two. No, big? Doors. Even the President United States came out against us. David Duke One officially two hundred twenty seven votes. For the former clansmen and the people who loved him that narrow victory felt like a landslide. That's the crowded dukes election night party recorded by pleader Robinson. Robinson was an independent radio journalist. He spent that evening circulating through the room, asking dukes biggest fans to explain what had just happened. We don't like people who are from another area who don't know the issues and don't know the people who are in dialed political right. Down here interfering in politics and telling us how to. The most common answer Robinson heard was the duke was going to lower taxes. We want change. We want something to be done where we have to pay less tax and get more representation in the state. That's why we voted for David Duke to get better representation. That's the bottom line. There was one thing. These people said the didn't influence their votes. It wasn't any racial. Economic all awake and and the role of racism. Is that prominent. Well. If the news media could describe to anyone and a good definition of racism. I certainly would like to have it. It was obvious to anyone who was paying. Even a Scintilla of attention that a vote for Duke was a vote for the most extreme kind of prejudice. But by spending at least some of the campaign, talking about taxes do gave people in district eighty one a cover story. He allowed them to claim that they simply like to stand on the issues and the way he spoke his mind. dukes plan the one he'd explained. Tavlin reg had worked perfectly. When he wrapped his bigotry and conventional Republican politics, he gave his fans and excuse to vote for bigotry. Duke made himself a cause and he made his supporters feel like members of a political family. Is, Duke made clear on election night. An attack on him was an attack on the whole Duke tribe. There hasn't been a campaign in modern. American history where the candidate was more attacked and more slandered. And more line about and put down. Your David Dinkins election. You knew that nine hundred. This was a campaign of Grievance and L. Rage and winning. One election wasn't going to change that. At that time in that room I was really struck. By. How angry people were. Even though the guy at one. Thirty one years later, John Trine had no trouble recalling how he felt that night. I remember. And actually I broke down and cried. In one of the reasons was that it wasn't just because a loss because I thought he would hurt Louisiana. I think he did. My great grandfather Louis rate came to the United States out of fear. He wanted to escape the rising tide of anti-semitism and Eastern Europe to find a place where you'd feel secure. Louis ended up in the town of Eunice Louisiana where he opened a dry goods store in one thousand nine hundred eleven. There were about seventeen hundred people in Eunice then. Only, a handful of them were Jewish. But Louis and his family were embraced their. Louisiana felt like home. Lewis's daughter Lillian. My grandmother move from Eunice to New Orleans to go to school. That's where my dad grew up and where I was born and raised. I was eight years old when he won that. Election Jefferson parish. I remember seeing Duke signs all over the place including on the roof of a restaurant. That's really good Gumbo. I also saw duke himself working the crowd and Lsu football game. I always thought that tiger. Stadium was my favorite place in the world. But after that day I wasn't sure a Jewish kid like me. Belong there or anywhere in Louisiana? Since I started out as a journalist I've wanted the chance to look back at the Duke Years, and to understand why so many people were drawn to him. That feels more urgent now as the movement Duke Belt looks like a historical oddity and a warning sign. The morning after the election in district eighty, one duke said that everybody needed to calm down. That all the fears about what he might do to. Blacks and Jews were totally overblown. Children's story about chicken, little chicken little ran around and said the sky is falling. The Sky is falling, and it turned out. It was only a small acorn on chicken littles head. I've been elected on the new representative from this district and Ladies and gentlemen. The Sky hasn't fallen. The next day the new. Orleans Times Picayune published an editorial. It was headlined the Duke Embarrassment. Mr Dukes message was clearly a racial one and remained so throughout the campaign. The paper said. This message is repugnant. We categorically rejected. At the same time we believe every human being shot given the chance to grow to change to see the errors of his ways. Next time on slow-burn in nineteen, eighty nine David Duke made himself out to be a new man. But his years in the clan were the key to understanding who he was and who he wanted to become. What did David do for the Ku Klux Klan? And what are the clan do for him? On episode two of our series. slow-burn is a production of slate plus slates membership program. This season slate plus members get exclusive. I access to episodes two and three of our series. Yes, if you are a member, you don't have to wait another week or two. These episodes are in your feed right now. Here's a preview. And the crowd started chanting things like boneheads, boneheads boneheads. and. You know he didn't have to do very much. Rev Up these people. They are anger was there? They agreed with him. They you know they wanted to do more. They would say where our sheets. You can listen now by signing up at slate dot com slash slow-burn starting next week plus members will also get weekly bonus episodes where we'll dive deeper into the history were exploring this season. We couldn't make slow-burn without the support of slate, plus so please sign up if you can head over to sleep dot com slash slow-burn. slow-burn is produced by me and Christopher, Johnson with editorial direction buy low and Loo and Gabriel Roth Madeline Ducharme production assistant, so if he summer Grad is slow Burns assistant producer. Mix Engineer is Paul Manzi. David Gross composed theme song. The artwork for slow-burn is by LISA. Larsson, Walker special thanks to Jordan Hirsch Jessica Seidman and slates chow to Katie Raeford. Laura Bennett Alison Benedict, and Jared Holt. Thanks for listening.

Klansman David Duke Louisiana New Orleans dukes David Duke America John Trine Harry Lee David Duke New Jefferson Parish White People Germany Duke David Dukes Duke Belt Duke Campaign James Gill Evelyn Rich New Orleans White Citizens Cou Joe Fields John Train Ku Klux Klan
How to Stop a Racist Politician

What Next | Daily News and Analysis

25:34 min | 2 years ago

How to Stop a Racist Politician

"Support for this podcast and the following message come from Google veteran Mitch Hoyt founded skinny sticks Maple Syrup and he's showing the small businesses can do big things Mitch started making Maple Syrup from a few trees Wisconsin Dockyard and now he is connecting with customers worldwide with help from Google tools. Skinny sticks is one of millions of small businesses using Google to grow learn. How Google is helping businesses near state? I Google Dot com slash. Economic Impact Donald Trump might have officially launched his twenty twenty campaign an Orlando Maga- rally last month but it didn't really feel real to me until last week. That's when trump went all in on racism as a Campaign Strategy Representative Don Omar. If you're not happy here then you can leave you lift David Dukes words and Donald Trump's words and I guarantee you you can put them together. You can find David Duke. tweets are votes. It sound just like what Donald Donald Trump's been saying the past couple events it turns out it wasn't just the talking heads on M._S._N._B._C. thinking that Donald Trump was sounding an awful lot like a former grand wizard of the K._K._k.. It was a guy named Tim wise to I'm anti-racism Educator and author and that's about the only way that I can describe it back in the early nineties. Tim Thought you make into political consulting its first job I was working against David Dukes campaigns for Senate and governor in Louisiana. I was really young. I mean I had just come out of college and <hes> and I happen to be at two lane. In New Orleans is in the right place at the right time at the very bright moment you know my I work in politics. Literally is limited to the Anti do quirk essentially in ninety and ninety one and it was that that actually you know made me realize I needed to be doing anti-racism work fulltime rather than sort of political consulting looking back on those days. You feel like you are naive about things. You know maybe less than some but more than some too I mean I think I think we learned really quickly. Some things that a lot of folks didn't understand <hes> about about racism and pulled particularly its usage in politics during that time in some ways David Duke is nothing like Donald Trump looking back at video of him from the nineties he looks mild-mannered and rehearsed the opposite ever freewheeling trump rally but he's intent is pretty clear. It's not a question of being against minorities at all. It's simply a question of of making sure that our rights are also protected. If we'RE GONNA have civil rights in America we must have civil rights for everyone and not a chosen few I mean this is someone who was a Nazi. It's not a word I use lightly but it applies in his case and he was still able to get six out of ten white people to vote for him with a message that was explicitly about racial scapegoating and so. I think there were a lot of people who didn't expect that that was going to happen. There were a lot of people who said from the beginning when he won the state legislative race. Oh you know ignore him. He'll go away. Ignore him and he'll go away. That was the popular killer approach to trump last time around two which is what makes tim worried when he looks at the presidential race right now when he sees the candidates debating Medicare for all national daycare and Free College he's like what are you guys doing long. Stay focused. I'm very concerned about the approach that the Democratic Party and the seven hundred eleven candidates that they have <hes> are taking what I think they they don't get is that you cannot defeat something like trumpism with policy papers so if this is where we are as a country fighting a racist President Tim wise says he's got a political playbook for us us and it looks pretty different from what the experts are recommending in Washington. I'm Mary Harass. You're listening to what next stay with us. The following episode is sponsored by Anchor. If you're one of those people who's got an idea for show and wants to get started with your own podcast you might want to learn more about anchor. Anchor is another spotify owned company that makes sit easy for people to get into podcasting. It's basically an all in one totally free platform where you can record podcast hosted distributed measure your performance analytics and find some show sponsors an all all works from your web browser or anchors mobile APP. You can give Ankara try for free at Anchor Dot F._M.. Slash slate what next that's anchor dot F._M.. Slash slate what next so me start here. which is you say there's direct comparison between Donald Trump is a candidate and white supremacist David Duke in terms of how they campaign and what they're saying? I really feel like a lot of people would. I'd say that's a bridge too far. What would you say to that? Let me be clear. I'm not suggesting that Donald trump is the literal equivalent or even the political equivalent of David Duke. David Duke is a national socialist. David Duke is a Nazi. This is someone who used to literally throw birthday parties for Hitler every April twentieth with beer and cake and chips like literally that is an actual story but but what I am arguing and what I would suggest is that both Duke Ism Awesome as a movement and trumpism as a movement tap into the same vein of white racial anxiety and resentment now in dukes gays. I think he did that because he is always for his adult life any true believer in white supremacy white. Nationalism and frankly the creation of an all white America Donald Trump. I think came to this very differently. Do I think that he has a long history of racism will yes but I would say that. Donald trump came to his politics takes a white racial resentment mostly because he understood it as a marketing tool any understood it as a way to gain power and that's really Donald Trump's primary thing is donald trump but when we're trying to figure out how do we respond in this moment warning from how we responded in. That moment becomes very important because it's what drives the movement is the same even if what drives the men is different you say it's instructive to look at David Dukes campaigns for public office as a comparison Harrison to where we are now so in one thousand ninety. David Duke ran for U._S.. Senate Louisiana where were you at the time so I was on the staff of the Louisiana Coalition Against Racism and Nazism which was the Political Action Committee Committee that was formed for the purpose of defeating him in that race <hes> started off as the campus coordinator organizing all the college groups against Duke and then later would become the associate director about a year and a half later <hes> and this was a coalition that was put together. It's very interesting. <hes> the organization was founded by a combination of sort of liberal folks progressive folks on the one hand that certainly what the staff was but the board of administrators also included <hes> some very solid solid Republicans but Republicans who understood the existential evil of white supremacy and Nazism and so it was not always a comfortable coalition. We didn't always agree on everything but we understood the threat that was posed by hatred twitter what we call the politics of prejudice that David Duke was running on but what's so interesting as you say you understood the hate was the problem. You need to fight it. But what kind of arguments were you actually making voters in that first race for Senate well. There's AH there's the argument that we wanted to focus on and then there's sadly what we ultimately ended up doing because of the advice of some consultants that I think was frankly not good advice so if you were to ask myself certainly most of our board members especially Ashley the more Progressive Ones and certainly my boss the director Lance Hill <hes> who led the organization we understood we need to stay focused on Duke as an extremist not only was he still tied to Neo Nazi individuals and organizations nations but his whole politic was a politics of racial resentment and racial scapegoating and so we wanted to say he hasn't changed from his days in the clan. He's just repackaged it. He's playing upon white fears. Here's an example Blah Blah Blah that kind this stuff there were mainstream consultants who came in these are Democratic Party and Democratic candidate traditionally consultants who came in and they were very nervous <hes> they obviously agreed. Yes you have to talk about his is clan. Past you have to talk about is ongoing connection to Nazis obviously but they were very worried about anything that would focus too much attention on his contemporary racial appeals. Why well here's the thing so for instance? David Duke focused a lot on welfare as the reason that people's taxes were too high and affirmative action's why white people can't get jobs and emigrants or taking jobs and all that stuff that you still here today very often and we wanted to talk about that as part of this larger politics prejudice in sort of shifting attention from the real problem in blaming black folks for things they didn't cause and the consultant said you know problem is if you do that you play into his hands and there are a lot of voters especially white voters in Louisiana. They said who agreed with him on those things so if you if you mentioned that stuff at all to any real extent you're going to ultimately help him and so they said focus on the clan unsure focused on the neo-nazism sure but then they also said you need to do other things like for instance talk about the fact that he paid his property taxes late or talk about the fact that he avoided service in Vietnam or talk about the fact that he wants wrote a sex manual under a female pseudonym which yes as a matter of fact he did is disturbing that is and unfortunately I think we fell for that and I say unfortunately because you know here's the thing if you're dealing with a Nazi in this case case or just any kind of a racist and you're taking time to talk about you know when they paid their taxes or did they go to Vietnam or did they write a sex book or something it undermines your core point. You're trying to say this. person is an extremist who is beyond the Pale. He'll irrational discourse when you throw all that other stuff in it allows voters to say will if he's really such a Nazi. Why are we talking about his property taxes and even though he lost he did lose? Thankfully he got forty. Four percent of the vote including sixty sixty percent of the white vote and I think that was because we didn't focus in on the core message in that campaign in the Senate race. You described the night that David Duke lost and how your boss US was speaking. I believe to the press and said tonight was a referendum on hate in hate one right. If Duke lost. Why did you end up thinking that well because when a Nazi an actual honest to God Nazi can get six out of ten white people to vote for them six hundred five thousand votes approximately and yet you know that there are not six hundred five thousand Nazis for goodness sake in the state of Louisiana then what you know is that that the politics of hate have triumphed Duke Ism has proved itself to be a force far more potent than a lot of commentators gave it credit and it ended allow David Duke to have the political energy going forward to run for governor if we're able to defeat him crushingly in that first race he's gone? He's done but we didn't and for all intents and purposes duke himself said I one my base. And he was right right. He got six OUTTA ten white people eating care that he lost Blat New Orleans. He knew he was going to lose black new ORLEANIANS. He knew he was going to lose black folks generally but he got the people he cared about that buoy lead him that provided if you will the yeast they allowed his political bread to continue rising the next year when he ran for governor. How did you and your boss change strategies? When David Duke ran for governor so the next race we decided that the focus needed to be on on the threat that Duke and Duke is imposed and so rather than talking about you know Dukes late tax payments the sex man it will the Vietnam thing all of these other sort of sidelight issues we really focused in on the threat posed by hate and so for instance in the Senate race we run this very fancy ridiculously expensive television commercial where a lot of these side issues came in and it was too clever by half you could tell it was a commercial intended to win an award in the governor's race? We stripped it down in audio recording which we had dug up of David Duke from about five years before this time so the election was ninety one. It was a nineteen eighty-six recording where David Duke was being interviewed along with another open Nazi and this other Nazi says in the you can hear the other Nazis voice. He says Hitler started with seven men. It doesn't take that many people start some rolling ever started okay seven men right and Duke responds right and don't you think we can do to if we just put the right package together can happen right now with the right package together. Don't you think that there are millions of Americans are alienated. hokey something and the truth is the truth gives us we just has had this audio play and and we did this on radio. Thousands of times Democratic Party used the same recording did their own commercial on television and all it was wasn't fancy. It wasn't stylized it was the only visual you saw was like a reel to reel old reel to reel recorder and the voice over with the captions of David Duke Sang this that was the focus. It wasn't all this other stuff and the reason that we wanted to do that. Was We felt. That's what's GONNA drive turnout. One of the problems in the Senate race was that black turnout was actually down and white progressive turnout was down. I had arguments with white liberals in the Senate campaign in Nineteen Ninety that said Oh. I'm just not gonNa vote because <hes> the the the opponent Jay Bennett Johnston who was the Democratic incumbent senator he's he's in the pocket of the oil and gas industry. He's just a corporate schill. He's no better than Duke because apparently some people can't tell the difference between corporate richhill and a Nazi which is very disturbing so they were both sides ing yet right exactly it was just sorta like well. I'm not less than two evils is still evil and I'm not going to participate in evil or are you know whatever and so in this particular race I think by by focusing on the actual evil in the room I mean the true existential evil a lot of those people who would not voted. Were like holy crap. We've really got a vote and black turnout ended up actually being higher than white turn out in the governor's race which just almost unheard of in that state at that time and it's very rare generally why because the threat was clear. It's interesting because you also say that you basically abandoned people who voted for duke the first time around Bryant you saw them as kind of lost. 'cause here's the thing I mean it's not that people don't change but what changes them doesn't happen in the course of a couple of weeks or months in a political campaign so I'm sure that there were duke voters who regretted their vote and I'm sure there trump voters who do but the reality is most people who vote for someone who who's politic is so extreme and rooted in in hatred and bias are not going to in the short run. They're not going to acknowledge the horrible double moral error that they made because doing so requires them to say Oh yeah I voted for a monster the last time so David Duke he loses the race for governor too but the metrics are so different where you have way more turn out among progressive people among black people but this other thing happens that I found really disturbing. which is you talk about how some Republicans like Pat Buchanan looked at the David Duke doc playbook and said Hey we should all be doing that? That's exactly right I mean Pat Buchanan rights and editorial shortly after the governor's race and says we should be copying David dukes winning winning playbook which of course Buchanan then does in his run for the presidency in ninety two and he got a lot of traction with that you know he he he he helped move as much as anyone Pat Buchanan did the Republican Party towards this party of ethno-nationalism and white racial resentment when he stood up at the ninety two convention in Houston and gave that culture speech these wonderful twenty five weeks of our campaign. The saddest days were the days of that riot in L._A.. Worst ride in American history and as those boys took back the streets of Los Angeles Block by block my friends we must take back our cities and take back our culture and take back our country. God bless you God bless America. It didn't get him the presidency but it changed the party in a fundamental mental way it moved the began the move of the party from politics dog whistling to a politics of much more open articulation of racial resentment so that now here we are all these many years later and we're talking about not dog whistles. We're talking about bullhorns and that begins with Duke it is given the promoter of support from Buchanan and now we see manifesting in Donald trump so you're an anti-racism activist and educator. I found it really. Interesting listening to you talk about the strategy of just kind of abandoning the people who voted for the nationalist and just focusing on the other people to come out because something I hadn't heard you say before is how people change but they don't change that fast yeah I mean for instance I was actually in an email conversation with my old boss at the coalition landfilled today and he was reminding me that many many years after the elections he was talking to someone who had been doing some research trying to find people in Louisiana who would admit to having voted for gook and they couldn't find anyone like they literally could not find white people will who admitted doing what we know. Six hundred seventy five thousand of them did now if you would ask them a year afterward or six months afterward or probably even five years afterward. I think you would have found plenty of people who said Oh damn right. I did but all this many years later folks have sort of selectively become a bit ashamed and I think it's really important to just put a fine point on this and just explain how the timelines are really different from the electoral timeline to the change change your mind change your spirit. Change your outlook timeline. That's rainy a decade and changing. It's something different at least and I think they're very few politicians who really understand this <hes> because we sort of I don't know we losing right of losing they are but the irony of it is in their fear of losing. They are opting for strategies. That actually aren't always helpful to me. Those of us who were progressive have three possible audiences to whom we're speaking one are the people were trying to convert the other are the people were trying to mobilize who were already on our side and the other are people who were trying and sort of in the middle to inoculate eight against whatever poison the other side might be thrown at them and strategy for each of those is going to be very different right. I think that we spend a lot of time on the conversion piece because people really think that's where we're the action is oh. They just assume that their base is going to show up. Well as we've learned and people of Color in particular have been trying to explain this to Democratic candidates. You can't continue to take for granted and just assume a we'll show up and vote for or anybody with the D. behind their name. You can't assume that progressive people are going to do that because some are going to say. Well forget that I'll go vote third party or I just won't stay home. That'll be my way of protesting these awful choices that I have you have to have a clear uncompromising message or some of the people who you think you already have won't be there. I had this theory that there's this older generation boomers that remember member what happened to Martin Luther King and remember what happened to R._F._K.. And he's created this fear in them about movements like this now they aren't controllable and that once you start this conversation it's triggers a backlash. They can be dangerous and that those people in that generation. They're the people running newspapers and television stations. What do you think about that? I think you're very right. I think that there is no doubt that some of what we're experiencing right now is is a backlash to the modern world. It is what Carol Anderson at emory university refers to as white rage historically every step forward for black and Brown people's has been met with this backlash so it's inevitable the idea that we can avoid it by. I'm not talking about it or not. Confronting it is belied by the entirety of American history the only way you can avoid it is to not make progress toward racial democracy and pluralism so if we believe in racial democracy and pluralism. We have to walk through it. Yeah I mean what you're saying. Wing is basically the Democrats are afraid that by waving this racism flag around they're going to somehow have a backlash but the backlashes already happening. It's it's in full effect. Remember Barack Barack Obama was called racist for including in the healthcare reform legislation there was a there was a line item in there somewhere that raise taxes on tanning beds by like I don't know by like ten bucks right because tanning beds ads lead to cancer and it was just a way to try to improve health and there were right wing talk show host who literally said this was a racist tax on white people because only white people use tanning beds which isn't even true but that was their argument that they accused the Guy Power of racism for anything that he said if he criticized the cop who stopped really was gates going into his own house and arrested him right. Oh my God that's an attack on white. People Glenn Beck said you know he eight white people all being a rush limbaugh said he's just trying to pay white people back for Slavery Oga Healthcare Reform Bill is just a reparations built like they're going to do racist backlash based not on what our side does but based on the fact that that were living in a society that is multicultural that is pluralistic and they aren't down for that and as long as we intend to be that multiracial pluralistic place. They're going to be doing this back that it's not even backlash. It's front lash and the question is are we going to respond respond to it or are we going to run firm it because we think Oh god America's so in veterinary racist that we can't win challenging it. That's an incredibly pessimistic message. I happen to think better of the American people than that and I think most people even even people that have implicit in subconscious by don't want to endorse the politics of hatred and division that we see you know tearing the country apart right now tim wise thank. Thank you so much for joining me. Oh you bet thank you. Tim Wise is an anti-racism speaker and author. He lives in Nashville. That's the show if you're hungry for more. Go check out. Mike PESCA show the gist rest today. There's a very special episode of is that bullshit his regular segment with Maria Kondakova. The topic is is it possible to keep off weight once. You've lost it insider tip here. Mike is ridiculously physically fit so maybe he has some.

David Duke Donald Donald Trump David dukes Senate Duke Tim wise Democratic Party Louisiana Google David Duke. US scapegoating New Orleans Vietnam Hitler Duke Ism Don Omar consultant Representative spotify
S4 Ep. 4: A Silent Army

Slow Burn

48:55 min | 1 year ago

S4 Ep. 4: A Silent Army

"I want to tell you about a new podcast from sleep. It's called thrilling tales of modern capitalism. Hosted by Seth, Stevenson, it takes a closer look at companies like Carnival Corporation Victoria's secret. And McKinsey and Company, examining their histories figure out why and how they found themselves in their present circumstances, some of these stories are at big disasters. Others are tales of skyrocketing success triumph for failure. Every company has the story. And those stories are more thrilling than you may have imagined. Subscribed to thrilling tales of modern capitalism wherever you get podcasts. This podcast contains language that some listeners may find offensive. First of all, just said that I can inform the listeners Willie are. Would you tell us where exactly are? That's player Robinson it was the summer of Nineteen Ninety and he was working on public radio story about David Duke Campaign for the United States Senate. Where you know, you're the hill todd. And what it calls head of Allen. And whereabouts are we headed? We're headed to a place. You can't get to buy land. It's called the Blind River Bar. To Blind River Bar was in Livingston Parish Louisiana in swampland about forty miles outside van. Rouge. On this morning, three hundred people were heading there to eat and drink and cheer on David Duke. Played a Robinson caught a ride to the bar on a motorized houseboat full of Duke supporters. Do could stage two different kind of rally in Livingston Parish Nineteen Seventy Five. Back then Duke, the Klan leader had burned a forty foot cross, shouted the n word and threatened black-americans with violence. Give us liberty he said in. Give them death. By thousand nine, hundred, ninety due could learn to use softer language. But, the politician and his followers were still focused on the same enemy. But what is it that brings you out here today and support David Orange Border David do. Because I was a small businessman at one time run out by minorities. Demand played a Robinson was speaking with identified himself as an unemployed boiler repairman. He said America was moving in the wrong direction. And the Duke could steer back on course. I've been out of work for a year and a half and I'm still sending free contributions. They were small, but I sent him doing. It make you feel uncomfortable to see the photograph of him dressed in the. Uniform of a Nazi stormtrooper. It would have if I haven't if I, didn't hear his explanation and believing. But is it fair to say that you want to believe in Him Oh? Yes. Affair. The people gathered at the blind. River Bar felt the same way the boiler repairman did. They wanted to believe in David Duke, and they were tired of the media telling them that they should know better than to vote for Klansman. David. Duke wasn't running away from his association with the Klan. At another speech a few hours later, he presented his clan days as an asset. News Cancer. She said she said. Representative, Dude. Don't you think that hurts your credibility that you were once in the clan I answer and I said look Ma'am I, said I, think proves my. It proves it all the person. I WAS GONNA Say Really. Duke was praising him for his supposed commitment to authenticity. He said he was the only candidate who understood how white people in Louisiana truly felt. Knows right and to fight. For you say that? Allow that y'all. Saying your heart to your friends, your neighbors, a church were. All that on a hope, I'm speaking for you. and. I WanNa ask when you do something for me and show where you put a bumper. You raise your hand. Permit. That thing about bumper stickers wasn't just a line in a speech for Duke it was an imperative. He said his fans needed a slap them on their cars and boats and trailers, no matter how much blowback they might get. A lot of Duke. Backers thought it was too risky to make their allegiance known. Some. Who did support Duke publicly complained? They'd been targeted for their political views. One of Duke's local coordinators said yard signs were getting torn down and pelted with bullet holes. A woman outside New Orleans reported there. One of her duke signs got stolen and set on fire. And in Shreveport dukes campaign headquarters got tagged with a big black swastikas. Carcassonne, to some guys say I can't put a bumper sticker on my car. I might get a flat tire. Might. Get a window not. There's an eighty two year old woman who lives in the black sexy bedrooms, a big old bumper sticker carney yards on for on and I got I know some strapping young men a bumper sticker. Put a bumper sticker on. I was ten years old in the summer of Nineteen, Ninety Nine I. Don't remember following all the INS and outs of that year, Senate, campaign. But I'll never forget dukes campaign signs. They were always really simple. Blackie white text on a dark blue background in nineteen ninety. Those sign said David Duke US Senate. The. Letters D. U. K.. e. were way bigger than everything else. Those signs and bumper stickers were in just simple expressions of political preference. They were away to mark territory to show who was welcome in certain parts of Louisiana, and who wasn't. Saint Bernard parish is a working class predominantly white community just outside New Orleans. When schools in New Orleans is lower, ninth ward began to integrate and nineteen sixty white families swarmed to the still segregated Saint Bernard. They did so at the urging of the parishes, virulently racist political boss Leander Perez who told white parents. Don't wait for your daughter to be raped by these Congolese. In nineteen ninety, Saint Bernard, still had the feel of a white separatist enclave and David Duke's name was wielded there as a threat. When word got out that a black family was buying a home in a Saint Bernard subdivision, Thirteen David Duke for Senate signs popped up around the house overnight. A black pastor also had bricks thrown through his windows and David Duke written across the windshield of his car. Tammy Barney wrote about that break incident for the New Orleans Times Picayune. Barney was the newspapers Saint Bernard. Bureau chief the first black journalists to have that role. Requirement the job was that I live in Saint Bernard parish, and so I started looking for a place to live. I found a two bedroom house. I moved all of my things in and went to stay with my parents in New Orleans for the weekend I came back on Sunday and when I got back to the home, my electrical wires had been cut my cable wires had been cut, and someone had spray painted on the back. Leave inward. In Black Letters. Barney says that when she called the sheriff's Office, they told her it was just some kids and nothing to worry about. Barney didn't let the racists run her out. She stayed in Saint Bernard for three years, and she later wrote a column asking why so many white people in the parish felt an attachment to David Duke. I actually received a letter. From a gentleman who said that he lived in New Orleans. And that. There were things he thought and felt about the black community that he couldn't say in new. ORLEANS, because new, Orleans was run by Black Mare because his neighbors were black, but that David Duke said those things for him. Gave a lot of people a voice. But it wasn't clear how far that voice would carry in his first statewide election. When Duke announced his run for the Senate, he'd been in the state legislature for less than a year and he hadn't accomplished anything of note there. But he wasn't interested in biding his time on the lower rungs of the political ladder. Duke had national ambitions and a growing grassroots following. What he lacked was institutional support. dukes fellow Republicans in Louisiana hadn't taken a stand against him as the activist bath ricky had them to. But they weren't eager to be seen boosting Duke, either and the Party was in backing him financially. The official Republican candidate was another state legislator Ben Bagger. In Louisiana's open primary system, both men were running against Democratic incumbent J. Bennett Johnston the clear favourite. One August poll showed Johnston with fifty two percent of the vote Duke with twenty four percent and beggared in the single digits. But, the pollsters had been wrong about Duke before, and it was possible they were getting it wrong again. As he barnstorm across the state, a sort of Duke Mania began to take hold among white voters Louisiana. When Duke addresses his clamoring fans. He made it clear that this wasn't just a campaign. It was a 'cause. I'm lazy. Around this country. I love this country. Losing. When we want our. GonNa say. How did David Duke make himself a statewide sensation? Was He striving for political power or just for personal gain. And what message did his supporters said to everyone else in Louisiana? The slow burn. I'm Josh Levin. Episode for. A SILENT! Now is the time to catch up on the PODCAST. You've always wanted to listen to you. So, many of them are available on Luminary. Luminary is a subscription podcast network with original shows. You won't find anywhere else. One of their new shows is murder on the towpath. Captivating True Crime Miniseries hosted by award winning journalist Soledad O'Brien. Burger on the towpath explores the nineteen sixty four murder of Mary. Pinchot Meyer in the neighborhood of Georgetown in Washington, DC. Her death resulted in a trial that rocked the country in the became a time capsule of all the racial tension scandal and distrust of the nineteen sixties. It remains one of the most fascinating unsolved cases and US history. Listen to murder on the towpath. Only on luminary good a luminary dot link slash towpath and get a seven day. Free Trial luminaries original podcasts. That's luminary dot link slash towpath. Cancel anytime terms apply. I was in high school the first time a white friend asked me. Why is everything about race with you? And I said because everything is about race. It's still true especially in this election year, and for a lot of folks. That's just too uncomfortable to talk about. But I'm talking about it. I'm Rebecca Carol. Check out my new podcast. Come through from WNYC studios and listen wherever you get your podcasts. Best Spent Nineteen Ninety following David Duke around. Carrick was making a documentary about Duke and his movement. After awhile all the rally, she went to started to blend together. They had this blonde, woman. With a blue dress who is absolutely was like the picture perfect. Aerienne. Super Woman and she sang the national anthem every time I went to a DIG rally. You, say. The. Perfect one hair lipstick in that blue dress, Innis. Singing the national anthem, and then he'd have you know some rabble-rousers that we come on stage and one fellow. He would wind up the audience. Dukes warm up. Act Was a former Democratic congressman named John Rarick. Rarick had represented the Baton Rouge area in the US House in the nineteen sixties and Seventies. One black legislator called him the leading racist and Congress. Played, Robinson recorded rarick speech at the Blind River. Bar. Is Only one candidate. He believes the whole riots bill. Be Changed, yes. Is a law or an American -scriminate, against in American Whitman all. Rarick, God what a miserable son of a bitch! That guy was, and you know when when we would arrive instead up the camera, a lot of the people in the. would. Get Out of their seats. Everybody was very happy and they would jump in front of the camera. Wave and carry on and say you know. Put me on. TV PUT ME ON TV. Then once rare Ghanem all wound up the mood in the room. Just absolutely become palpably a tense and bitter and horrible. David Duke didn't sound as angry as his followers were. He presented himself as a sorrowful Patriot, a man who wanted to restore the United States to its former glories. I'm here and I know you're here. We know that America cannot. Prosper. And be safe and sound for all of its citizens, and offer hope for all of our young people. Until we have a system that rewards people who work and produce. The people that work in produce that was not so coded reference to Dukes White Base. And then there were the people that allegedly didn't work and didn't produce. Duke talked about them to. Why am I Jim? We've gotTA find a way to reduce the massacre welfare birthday. Because I tell you if he will bear children bashing the. Tax Overhaul. Before I started working on this season of slow-burn I wrote a book and made a podcast series about the origins of the welfare queens stereotype. When Ronald. Reagan ran for president in Nineteen, seventy six. He told exaggerated story about a woman named Linda Taylor. An anecdote, the depicted poor black women as a drain on society. CHICAGO, they found a woman who holds the record. She used eighty names thirty addresses fifteen telephone numbers. To collect food stamps, social security veterans benefits for four existent deceased veterans husbands. As well as welfare, her tax free cash income alone has been running one hundred and fifty thousand dollars a year. During his nineteen ninety Senate Campaign Duke put his own spin on the welfare. Queen Meth. The story he told was cruder than Reagan's and even more ludicrous copy, but the crowd reacted just the way duke wanted it to. The doctor said it presented I've got. A bit of information for you might find interesting. He said right now I. Have a lady in my office. is on welfare. Senate thirties. Chance three teenage daughters. The raw porno legitimate. and. This lady is pregnant now with. A CHILD! And all three of garbage now, also pregnant. And he said you know what else and I said I can't imagine what else. Is, said the woman, and all the daughters are all pregnant by the same man. I tell you. Guy Jellison. Telling stories was a new thing for Duke. His nineteen thousand nine race for the state legislature had depended less on stagecraft than on knocking on doors, shaking hands. But in nineteen ninety, those priorities flipped his Senate. Rallies were big and loud, and for his fan base extremely exhilarating. But even if the delivery was different, the underlying message was the same. Here's Mark Morale in nineteen ninety. He was a candidate for Congress he later became the mayor of New Orleans. In any debate in those days if you ask took. A question about anything. You asked him about hurricanes. You ask him about utility bills if you asked him about higher education. Bs about healthcare, ultimately, he found a way to inject welfare recipients as being the problem that the state faced. Families with dependent children, the program commonly known as welfare made up just two percent of Louisiana's annual budget. The state's monthly stipend for a family of three was one of the stingiest in the country, one hundred and ninety dollars. But for David Duke. The reality of welfare wasn't important. What mattered was the message he sent by demonizing it. The People Dukes. Rallies were primed to receive that message. At one campaign event, a woman screamed out were tired of those lazy bastards collecting checks? Here's the filmmaker best carrick again? I've been around. You know racist and wack jobs, but the problem with David dukes rallies. was that he would create that virulent crowd mentality. And he had a real cult like following and they were. Transfixed with what he had to say, they would do whatever he told them to do. One time at Veterans of Foreign Wars outpost New Orleans character cameraman started shooting b roll of the crowd. She followed him down the center aisle. And we see the faces. Of the Duke supporters and I looked in there is. It felt like they had been broken a long time ago? And it hit me like a wave and I felt extremely nauseous. And Sad at the same time that broke and people do search. For these. Leaders that imbue them with a sense of rage and power. That's all complete illusion. Like if we did not have our own barriers up in our own awareness, we could feel the fishhooks of this propaganda. Hooking into part of our brands, and just reeling us off to the side. He is just. Very convincing everything he says if you don't examine it carefully if you just. EAT IT aided aided in swallow it. You're going to buy it. In March nineteen ninety seven months before the Senate Primary David Duke drew about two hundred seventy five people to a Holiday Inn in Alexandria in the dead, center of Louisiana. People are coming out of the closet. Duke told a reporter. At the end of June, four hundred people showed up to see him at the B M gas station and restaurant in the southwestern part of the state. Ever see anyone who could get this. Many people to a little dump like this one local man asked is cars lined up for a half mile and both directions. Staffers for dukes Dietrich opponent J Bennett Johnston didn't think they were at serious risk of losing. Given the twenty six percent of voters in Louisiana were black. Do quit to get an enormous number of white votes to have any chance. But these do crowds were starting to look kind of enormous. Bob Man was the press secretary for Johnston's campaign. I. Don't recall Duke at our polls ever be getting above the low thirties, and it was at the polls that worried me so much. The gave me heartburn. It was the fact that wherever Duke Win. He was packing halls. He was filling auditoriums. He would go to a town and five or six hundred people would show up and we would have struggled to get two hundred people in that town to show up. J, Bennett Johnston was one of the most powerful people in Washington. He was the chair of the Senate Energy Committee and a senior member on the Appropriations Committee. Johnston had been in the Senate for nearly twenty years. And during that time, he brought a huge amount of federal spending to his home state. He'd been reelected twice without any trouble. But nineteen ninety felt different. Johnston drew six hundred people to his hometown of Shreveport for a hundred dollar, a plate fundraiser a week later, a crowd of fifteen hundred came out for Duke and neighbouring Boozer, city. They weren't the kind of people who could pay one hundred dollars a plate. But Duke knew how to open their wallets. Tyler Bridges Covered Duke for the Times picky in. It'd be a really unusual thing at do rally. Where at a certain point, he would literally pass the hat or pass a bucket around, and people would throw in a dollar or five dollars ten dollars, maybe twenty dollars. Do paid close attention to this bucket brigade. In a video taken during the nineteen ninety campaign, you can hear him micromanaging the operation. Collected hopefully the covered. The collecting passing the. Buck. Up to. Thirty knocking down the rows and all three rows third time. And next time we do everybody take one dollars. And it's going to be just like church bucket. One bucket and it's gotta go all the way. Another person on that takes it and puts it down the other being one. The bucket system wasn't the only way the duke. Campaign made money. The typical politician that I've covered would be thrilled to give away t shirts, but do cut such vermin followers. He could sell them. David to. Rehab. And, we also have. Regular shares. Duke supporters also paid cash for hats. Bumper stickers buttons BUREAUC- uzis Advisors. Nobody had their allegiance that big Duke Rally. They were all on the same team. In his stump speeches duke explain that he needed hundreds of thousands of dollars to era series of infomercial statewide. Those ads started running in July. You've read about it. You heard with critics now here. David Duke. You're about to spend thirty provocative. With the US Senate candidate. All of your is talking about. Was using these TV ads to win over the kinds of white voters who didn't go to his rallies, richer better educated types who made support him if his candidacy became more socially acceptable. On TV Duke did his best to look and sound normal. He wore a dark suit, sat in a leather chair and talked about the America I grew up in. I remember when criminals not homeowners live behind bars. I remember when names like New York. Miami New Orleans and Detroit vote images of promise and prosperity. I remember when kids played ball on the streets bedtime. And their parents didn't worry. At the end of one of these spots he brought out his teenage daughters Erica, and Kristen, holding the girl's hands, and calling them his two main sources of comfort and strength. Have Y'all enjoyed working on the campaign so far. I'm enjoying I like traveling around the state and meeting all the wonderful people losing. And like to ask you for my dad 'cause he's make Christner me. Well let me tell you something I appreciate both of you very much in love you both and We're going to win this race. Duke infomercials were themselves moneymaking scheme. In one ad, he urged his supporters to dial a one nine hundred number where they'd hear a message about his political philosophy. Then get charged ten dollars on their phone bills. At the end of that call, they'd hear a solicitation for a second one nine hundred number this one costing twenty five dollars. By the end of the campaign, do could raise two point four million dollars about as much as j Bennett. Johnston! Most of that came from donors who gave less than one hundred dollars. A good chunk of it went to Duke himself. During the Senate race, the Duke Campaign Duke the individual thousands of dollars for access to Dukes own fundraising lists. It wasn't the first time do could been accused of self-dealing the previous year. The times-picayune had reported that a company owned by Duke got one hundred forty thousand dollars from his political campaigns and the National Association for the Advancement of white people. Tyler bridges who wrote the article says it made Duke extremely agitated. I don't think Duke really minded. When somebody called him, clansman him, talking about having been a clansman spoke to how he was going to shake things up. But the story I wrote about. His campaign, paying him, money spoke to something different. Duke wasn't charged with any financial crimes and connection to a senatorial campaign. But in the mid nineteen nineties, he'd collect more than two hundred and thirty thousand dollars under false pretenses. Sending out fundraising letters claimed he was facing economic ruin. He then blow a good portion of that money gambling in casinos. Do, quit ultimately spend a year in prison after pleading guilty to mail fraud and filing a false tax return. Journalists Stephanie Regal Investigated Duke's finances during his run for the Senate. Regal came away, believing the duke was soaking his followers. But, she doesn't think he was running for office solely as a graft. It was political. It was philosophical for him, and it was also financial. He had a couple of things going on at once I. Mean if you could have seen him in those years, there was so much ego. He just loved being an icon to these people. Regal saw another side of Duke when she went to interview him at his campaign office, which also served as his house and the headquarters of the N. Double A. W. P.. She says he came down the steps. Wearing a pink shirt with the collar flipped up like an extra in Miami Vice. And he just walks over and puts his hand up against the wall and Cox's other hand on his hip and Kinda leans over me like a cheesy I would do in a bar and he's like. Hey, he was right up close. In my face and in my personal space and I guess that was his. Tactic to try to disarm you. Or to try to charm, you may be an even as a twenty four year old. That was very very obvious to me the time. Regal wasn't charmed, but other women were. The reporter John McGuinness described the do campaign as a rock and roll tour with screaming fans and nightly groupies. dukes attorney told McGuinness that the candidates obsession with female companionship got in the way of his other duties. At one rally do blue his choreographed entrance because he went onstage to get a better look at a blonde in the third row. Another time when a campaign worker told Duke, he needed to stay away from young women Duke reportedly answered. Look. Isn't enough that I'm trying to save the white race. Can I see who I WANNA see. Let's take a quick break. Jay Johnston wanted to run on his record and ignored the X. clansmen in his rear view mirror. But a month before the primary, it was clear David deep wasn't going away. It was the candidates thirty one year old son also named Bennett who convinced him to change his approach. Here again is Johnston's press secretary Bob Man, we were in farmer, Ville and northwest Louisiana and right before he got out of the RV, Young Bennett, handed his father a piece of paper, and it said he just written the simple words Nazi racist. Bigot get mad. A couple of days later man recorded Johnston's new fiery or stump speech. Now, why can't people wake up? Why can't they wake up? Don't they understand what's going on I? Mean people have sort of flirted with some of these ideas I mean. How many times have you heard? People say well I don't much like David Duke. Share like what he's saying. He's standing up for standing up bull. He's not standing up anybody but himself. Two weeks before election. Day Johnston released the first attack ad of the campaign. David Duke led the hoops clan as an adult. No more truly representative of a wiring. Cross it is our simple. By Commercial Show Duke presiding over a cross burning in the late nineteen seventies. When Duke said White Victory, he raised his left arm and a stiff salute. Bob Mann thought the cross burning ad was a kill shot. At first. It seemed like he might be right. The Johnston campaigns internal polling showed the duke dropped six points after the spots started airing. But a week later dukes numbers had bounced back up. It's always made me wonder if what we were doing in a way was telling dukes supporters that he may be talking in all these code words and dog whistles, and really toning down a law, but no, no, no, he's really the racist that you want him to be and so in some bizarre way we might have actually helped him with some of his most racist supporters. The state's main anti-drug activist group the Louisiana Coalition Against Racism and Nazism thought it was still possible to scandalise some duke voters. Lance Hill was the coalition's executive director. As, our polling showed the place for he really took. A dip was on his Nazism, because the clan was identified among white people as part of their political tradition. But the Nazis weren't. dukes fascination with Nazi ideology was public knowledge by Nineteen Ninety, the lot of people in Louisiana either had absorbed it or didn't care to believe it. That's summer. The Times Spooky Tyler bridges published some new information. His source was a woman Duke had dated in the Mid Nineteen Eighty S. Yeah, she told me how. I for the time that she was with him. She remembered that. He would celebrate Hitler's birthday every year. He'd have a cake and it was. It was an important occasion for David Duke. Duke tried to brush off that Clam Sang. Hitler's never showed up in my house for any birthday parties. Johnston and his staffers couldn't be sure if that Hitler birthday story was going to stick. All they knew was, the duke was posing an ever larger threat. Louisiana has an open primary that means if one candidate gets more than half the votes he or she wins, but if not, there's a runoff between the two top vote-getters in if there's a runoff in the US Senate, race is a good chance to one of the candidates will be David Duke former. Grand Dragon of the Ku Klux Klan. If Johnston didn't get a majority in the October primary that would raise a lot of questions about just how powerful the Democratic senator really was. David Duke would also get a month in the national spotlight before a November runoff. And there was a real chance that do could win that runoff and become the next United States senator from Louisiana. The, truth It was too late for Johnston to control his own fate. Heading into the home stretch of the campaign, there were two men taking votes from him, not one. Then bagger had won the endorsement of the Louisiana Republican. Party, but he hadn't found a constituency bagger who positioned himself as a pro-life welfare. Reforming environmentalist wasn't left-wing enough to win over liberals or right wing enough for conservatives. When? Baggers candidates. He failed to take off. He tried to elevate himself by tearing down David Duke Here's how he remembers it. Actually at one point I. I declared that we shouldn't make a MAG into a martyr. Employees really didn't like that. Tell David Chen. Chimps fall on a plastic surgery did really good. You WanNa take an extra minute ago? Push back up. Things like that. Bags insult comedy routine didn't change the dynamics of the election. He was always the third wheel in a two man race. In the closing days of the campaign eight Republican? Senators announced they were endorsing Johnston even though he was a democrat. Bag was totally alone. He had no money, no staff and no hope. On the plus side, he was a pretty good guitar player. Maza. There is not much sunshine these days Ben Bagger the endorsed Republican candidate, running a distant third in most polls dog by Duke backers as he campaigns. So today Maggert withdrew from the race and said he would vote for Democrat Bennett Johnston. I'm not endorsing anybody, but you know I'm not voting for David. But will voters take his advice? Bagger pulled out just two days before the primary. Do Quid cry. Conspiracy alleging that someone had paid back to take a dive. beggared, who's now seventy six years, old and practices. Law New Orleans says that's not true. As got close in as I realized that I would never make it. I said I've got. To pull out of this thing, I can't let my footnote in history hours the. Guy. Who wouldn't pull out of the race and Put do can a position to go the US I don't want to be known as that. I'm satisfied that I did the right thing. And it was something that that ended my political career. Bennett Johnston. Pollster thought the election was sewn up. With bag out of the running, he figured Johnston would get around sixty five percent of the vote. Then, the polls closed. Here's Bob Man. Well election night we booked a big ballroom at the Riverside Hilton in new, Orleans and that night as the as the results began coming in, it was clear. Pretty early on that. This was not going to be a sixty forty race. It wasn't sixty forty. It, ended up fifty four to forty, three and a half. Bennett Johnston had avoided a runoff but David Duke had outperformed every poll. When all the ballots were counted, six, hundred, seven, thousand, three, hundred and ninety, one people had voted for the Neo Nazi. It was the most depressing win. I think that I've ever been a part of because it just felt like even though a majority of the state had voted for Bennett that she just knew that it should have been a lot more like you know. How could this many people vote for this guy? Johnston gave a victory speech that night. Saying that Louisiana was united. But it was duke who sounded triumphant. To build a political movement in this country to. Bring back the rights the. Majority Once again, the polls hadn't captured David Dukes true level of support Louisiana. dukes, Ku Klux, Klan ally Don Black had provided under the radar support during his friends campaign using his computer skills to help with voter outreach. Black had a name for dukes hidden voters the ones who didn't identify themselves to pollsters. A silent army of white believers. In the days following Duke second-place finish, the makeup of that army came into focus. Do could one sixty percent of the white vote in Louisiana. It hadn't just been poor and less educated whites, rally-goers and bumper sticker buyers could cast their lots with him. Dukes base was white, people It just defied reason to me that someone. Who is that open? This guy wore a hood celebrated Hitler's birthday. Just go down the list. There's just no way that people going to embrace that and I you know I now realize that dukes embrace of of at persona was was exactly the thing that drew people to him including the man that would become my father-in-law, my father in law, who is a wonderful lovely man, was duke supporter and you know I was I remember the first time. My Wife. Then girlfriend brought me home. I was very suspect to these people. I was the press secretary to the enemy. Did her father have economic anxiety. No, no, he did not. He was a very prosperous I don't think it was economic anxiety. That was prompting his support of David. A post-election survey found that twenty five percent of Dukes. White voters were upscale white collar professionals. One of the most common reasons, the Duke supporters gave her backing him was that he took a strong stand on cleaning up the welfare mess. The other most popular rationale. that. He had the guts to take pro white stands while other politicians cater to minority groups. The rise of David Duke was a political story about a candidate learning to harness rage. But, it was also a personal one. For the people appalled by Duke, his growing power didn't feel like a distant force. One way that I describe those last few weeks before Election Day. That, it felt like a series of weights were being placed on me. That's Michelle Bell Bossier. She identifies as black and Louisiana Creole. Her family has been in southeast Louisiana since the seventeen forties. In Nineteen Ninety, she was a twenty five year old biology graduate student at Tulane University. It seemed like. Those weights were getting heavier and heavier, and it was harder to function harder to make forward progress in my own life because of this idea that. They're going to the hundreds of thousands of people who actually vote for this. Individual. Bossy are had never spoken out about politics, but after the Senate primary, she sent a letter to The Times Picayune. I asked her to read some of it. I had been haunted by the fact that sixty percent of the Caucasians in Louisiana supported David Duke. I have spent the last few weeks in a state of paranoia, unlike any I have ever experienced. Boissier was the only black PhD student and her department at Tulane or in any other science department the school. So I was very much alone all day. and. I had to wonder well of the fifty white people that I talked to tomorrow. which thirty of them voted. For David Duke. Because, they're not necessarily going to be pumped. Bold bragging about in effect, they probably will not. And that was really really hard to accept. It was hard to realize. That people you want it to trust and thought you should be able to trust. Perhaps you couldn't trust. Did. You ever ask any of your heart. Wait acquaintances, or friends or colleagues, explicitly F. They had voted for do. I never asked anyone if they did know. A few people made a point of telling me they didn't. In her letter Wasser Road I. Am a part of a generation of African Americans who were never forced to sit in the back of a bus, never denied admittance to restaurants on the basis of colour, a generation of blacks who have always had the right to vote and never participated in a Freedom March. She said that all those votes. For David Duke were the most blatant sign of racism she had ever witnessed, and the blatancy of it made her feel blacker. In some of that is the Oakland is It made me realize that I had to be. more expressive in who I am as a black woman. Because I was now in a situation where that was warranted, it was really needed. Boissier is now a biology professor and new. Orleans is historically Black Xavier University. I wanted to talk to her now three decades after she wrote that letter to the editor because I was hoping she could help me answer a question. It's something I've been asking myself for the last thirty years. How do you continue to? Live in the state and move through. The world and go about Your Business. Knowing. How people voted in that election. Oh Boy Luckily I have enough to do and keep me busy. that I don't have terribly large amount of time. To? Ponder about all these things every day. And I also know that. The work that I do. And the way that I. Conduct myself. Is. Is a source of pain? For people like David Duke. That in my career. I help young people. Primarily people who are African American. I helped them. Complete career journeys that people like David Duke think they're not well suited for think they. They're not capable of doing. so I know that I live my life doing things and being a person. That is disturbing to him. And, that's quite comforting. Next time on slow-burn. Duke for Governor. Slow burn is a production of slate plus sleeps. Membership Program. Slate plus members get weekly bonus episodes of slow-burn where we'll dive deeper into the history were exploring the season. On this week's bonus episode, you'll hear my interview with Tofa Grace. Who Played? David Duke Spike Lee's film black clansmen. HEAD OVER TO SLATE DOT COM slash slow bird to sign up and listen now. We couldn't make slow-burn without the support of slate, plus so please consider signing up. If you like this series, enter able to contribute. It's only thirty five dollars for the first year and you get a free two week trial. Good asleep dot com slash slow-burn to find out more. Slow burn is produced by me and Christopher Johnson with editorial direction. Buy Low and LOO and Gabriel. Rod. Madeline Ducharme is our production assistant. So he summer, Grad is slow Burns assistant producer. Mix Engineer is Paul. Manzi David Gross composed our theme song. The artwork for slow-burn by Lisa Larsson Walker. Tyler bridges is the author of the biography. The rise and fall of David Duke best character documentary onto because called backlash raised in the American dream. Some of the audio you heard in this episode is courtesy of the Ronald Reagan presidential. Foundation and Institute and the Dodd Research Center New Orleans Louisiana. Especial thanks to Jordan Hirsch Jessica Seidman and slates chow to Katie, Raeford. Laura, Bennett Alison Benedict and Jared Holt thanks for listening. Salihi.

David Duke Duke Louisiana J. Bennett Johnston David dukes Senate New Orleans United States Senate David US Nineteen Ninety David Duke Spike Lee America Tyler bridges Ku Klux Klan Bob Man Robinson David Orange New Orleans Times Picayune press secretary
Slow Burn S4 Ep. 1: White Knight

The Queen

45:54 min | 1 year ago

Slow Burn S4 Ep. 1: White Knight

"Hey there. This is Josh Levin host of the Queen and national editor at slate. I'm here to let you know that I. AM hosting season for of slow. Burn a podcast that looks in depth at the biggest stories from American history. Our new series is about the Nazi sympathizer and former Klansman. David Duke how he got elected to the Louisiana later and almost became the governor of the state. I've been wanting to tell this story for a very long time as I share in the episode. You're about to hear. I grew up in new. Orleans and I watched duke become a political sensation. The story of how he rose to prominence feels just as urgent now as it was then here's episode, one of slow-burn season for if you WanNa, get the whole season, subscribe at slate dot com slash slow-burn or wherever you get your podcasts. This podcast contains language that some listeners might find offensive. White Supremacist love talking to Evelyn Rich. Maybe, it was her talent for flattery. Face the way. You felt like kind of an interesting versus maybe be. and. Rich was born in England and she was getting her PhD at Boston University. Dissertation was on the modern Ku Klux Klan. What they believed and why they believed it. On February Seventeenth Nineteen ninety-six. She put her tape recorder in front of a Neo Nazi named Joe Fields. Into! From the time I was. Probably or or five I was attracted. To. National Socialism, I used to watch Hollywood movies. I would for the Germans. You know rich and fields got together in southern. California At a conference hosted by the Institute for Historical Review the HR called itself a think tank, but it was really a hate group. Its main goal was to sow doubt about the Holocaust to spread the lie. That Germany hadn't really killed six million Jews. The, doctoral student and the Neo Nazi wouldn't be alone for long. A few minutes into their conversation. They got interrupted by a knock on the door. She's probably the only one in my family can really. Yeah. It was David Duke America's best known white. Supremacist, your energy. Duke had grown up in New Orleans in the fifties and sixties. His father wasn't around much, and his mother was an alcoholic. As a teenager, he found a community at the New Orleans White Citizens Council a group that fought to stop the integration of public schools do cut famous in the seventies when he was a leader in the Ku Klux Klan. Reporters and TV, producers thought he was a fascinating subject. He was well dressed and clean cut. He seemed like a perfectly nice young man until he opened his mouth. American white people? Are. Searching and are reaching out for a movement and flux plan. Is that movement? By the time he met Evelyn Rich Duke was in his thirties and he'd broken with the clan. Do couldn't resist butting into rich's conversation with a neo-nazi. When Duke spoke up, he made it clear that has worldview hadn't changed since he left the KKK. People Joey, deserve. They try. Try exterminates. I think probably a moral cents. Jewish people I've been fly home you. And they probably deserve. You got him gasping history. The Jewish people have been a blade. They probably deserve to go into the ashburn history. Behind closed doors at this California Mita for Holocaust Deniers Duke felt comfortable sharing his true beliefs. And that wasn't all he revealed. A few minutes later, Duke talked about his master plan his strategy for breaking into the mainstream, keeping quiet about his extremist views. Out Try to find New People. I can problem. And but it's the difference and they can, if they can tell you a Nazi and make it stick, I mean. Really hard? It's GonNa hurt. It's hurt me if you have is much. When fields brought up, Nazi Germany Duke said. The time was right for a new. A? It doesn't take that many people to start something rolling. Hitler started okay seven men right? That's what I'm trying to. Most people don't want anything to do with thought. You think it can happen right now with the package together. Don't you think that there are millions of Americans are inundated hopefully something and the truth is the truth gives us to believe in Gary To. Meet Somebody Mike I. It's not me out. Because nobody else might come on. The recording you just heard would help bring down David Duke. But that would happen later. In the late eighties and early nineties. Duke was sure his time had come. that. He was the leader. White people wanted to believe in. He was canny and charismatic, and in his home state of Louisiana. He was becoming political star. As a kid growing up in new, Orleans there was a lot about Duke in his movement that I couldn't comprehend. But I saw and heard enough back then to understand that something enormous was at stake. There's something very scary about the election of David. Duke David is drawing full houses much of the debate. At least at first will be about David. Some hate him to others. He's a hero. This is slow. Burn season four I'm your host Josh Levin. Over the next six episodes, you'll hear about the moment when a white supremacist became an American political phenomenon. What were the forces that Fuel David Dukes rise? What did it take to defeat him? Did he ever really go away. This episode one. White Knight. David Duke had big plans and an enormous ego, his first priority in the years after he bared his soul, Tavlin rich, was to win the highest office in the land. I have your commitment. My commitment. Tomorrow. I well now's. My formal injury. And in the race for the Democratic nomination for president of the United States. Dukes nineteen eighty-eight presidential run was a flop. As a Democrat, he couldn't muster enough support to get on the debate. Stage Duke then ran under the banner of the Populist Party a fringe group dominated by klansmen Holocaust deniers and avowed Nazis. In that nineteen eighty-eight race George H W Bush beat Michael Dukakis by eight points. Duke would earn just point zero five percent of the vote. Duke was undeterred by this electoral rout. He believed he had a great message in that he was a great messenger. He would just need to take a different path to power. A month after the presidential race, the thirty eight year, old Duke found an opportunity that was within his grasp. He was going to run for the Louisiana State House of Representatives. This podcast is going to focus on a few pivotal years in dukes career the period when he made his most successful run at real political power. I'm starting here with a campaign and the New Orleans suburbs. Because this was the race changed. David Dukes life. Before this election in Louisiana's House district eighty one duke wasn't really a factor in state or national politics. But by the time, the campaign was over Duke was a sensation, and he was threatening to take control of the entire state. And it all happened incredibly quickly. House district eighty one was in the suburb of memory in Jefferson parish. Parish is by the way or when most dates call counties New Orleans in Orleans parish. Yes, there pronounced differently for reasons it would take a whole other podcast to explain. The district. Eighty one race was a special election. The seat came open when the guy who'd held. It became a judge. It would be a lightning-fast campaign. The primary was in less than two months. Dukes opponents included a school board member a florist. A Bingo Hall owner and John Trine who is best known as the brother of former Louisiana governor. Any of those men could have ended David Dukes campaign before it started due could been living just outside the district. If someone had challenged his residency, he would've been disqualified and it's possible. No one would remember Duke today. But none of them raised a challenge. They didn't think duke was a serious contender. Maybe they didn't understand district eighty-one Gears James Gill. Who wrote about Duke for the New Orleans Times Picayune. Very Very. Conservative is the polite word. If ever a clansman Rinaldi wants to get into mainstream politics. You couldn't choose a better district than this one in. Salem. District Eighty one included the neighborhood of old battery with its Tree Lined Streets and big mansions. It also included the working class area of Buck town. Old Fishing village dotted with clobbered homes. District, eighty-one rich people, and hard up people and people in between. But almost all of them ninety nine point six percent of them were white. Most voters in the district were on the Rolls as Democrats, but they'd started to cast ballots for Republicans and huge numbers. In his nineteen eighty four reelection campaign Ronald Reagan got eighty four percent of the vote in district eighty one. David Duke new his audience in the special election. He wouldn't be a Democrat or a populist this time he'd run as a Republican. On. The trail duke touted himself as honest and outspoken at times as national news outlets pointed out that outspokenness was more like straight up them. One big plank in dukes platform, reforming the welfare system by curbing the illegitimate black rate. But Duke didn't mention the Holocaust and when he got on the subject of race, he spoke more stridently than Ronald Reagan dead, but mostly took the same positions. In fact, I'm trying to prevent discrimination with this idea as I say of eliminating quotas. workfare instead of welfare, and we want an absolute end. These anti white programs of racial discrimination called affirmative action minority set asides. Duke presented White Nationalism as an ideology of fairness. He argued that black Americans were getting special privileges on the job market and in government contracting. And that it was time for someone to stand up for White People's interests. Here's Quinn Hillier a Republican, who supported dukes opponent John Trine. When he did talk about race. It was never about. Doing anything to blacks, it was always about protecting whites psychologically for a lot of voters, these distinctions subtle distinctions are important. Duke didn't only talk about race. One of his biggest issues was property taxes. He vowed to keep them low to protect what he called hard working productive middle-class people. This, was the plan. Duke had laid out to Evelyn rich in the NEO Nazi Joe Fields. He was trying to bring new. People in to win over voters who didn't identify as white supremacists. To understand the district were David Duke, running. You need to know about the most powerful man in Jefferson parish. He was a Chinese American sheriff and a cowboy hat, and his name was Harry Lee. Here. He isn't a two thousand six interview with NPR a year before he died. Sheriff of Jefferson parish is the closest thing. There is to be an king in the United States. I have no unions. Service. Hired and fired will. I don't have to go to council in proposed budget. Approved a budget. I'm the head of the law enforcement district in. One vote, which is me. Lee was a fun loving autocrat. At Mardi Gras he threw Harry Lee dolls from flood that featured an enormous likeness of his own face. The sheriff spent eighty thousand dollars on that flute which he saw as money well spent. Every year he said my big fat heads, coming down, veterans, highway and a half million. A million people see it. Harry, Lee was born in New Orleans in nineteen, thirty, two in the back room of his family's laundromat. A bunch of lease constituents in Jefferson parish had relocated from New Orleans to. One of them was David Duke. Who moved to Jefferson in the nineteen seventies? White New Orleanians went to the suburbs in search of bigger houses and lower tax bills. They also wanted to get away from black people. Here's former New Orleans Mayor Marc morial. His father was the city's first. Black Mayor. What they were doing was getting away from integration. Fleeing what they thought. The city New Orleans was was becoming, which was a city, which was more racially diverse, and we're African. American numbers were increasing in African. American influence was increasing. As the population of Jefferson parish swelled Harry Lee presented himself as the guardian of the suburbs. He'd make sure that battery felt like a safe haven for white people. The sheriff faced a big test in nineteen, eighty six, when the parish was hit by a string of armed robberies. That December! He proposed a solution to the crimewave racial profiling. It will be stopping more black people in predominantly white neighborhoods and in. I don't know how to say that we're going to do it. If you live in a predominately white neighborhood in it in this to blackmail to the call right behind you. There's a pretty good chance that they're up to no good. The Executive Director of the Louisiana Aclu called Leah despicable big. Protesters descended on Jefferson parish, demanding his resignation and chanting Harry Leeann the clan. Go Hand in hand. Lee Walked back his plan, but he didn't resign. James Gill covered leave for decades. He would away say exactly what he thought. And what he thought was. Seldom politically correct, but often chimed with his constituents. Harry had that knack of getting away with stuff that. Other people couldn't. And people just loved him for it. Harry lease supporters thought he was being straight with them about the dangers of New Orleans and of new Orleanians specifically black new ORLEANIANS poverty, late and gun violence were real problems in the city and the one thousand nine hundred eighty s here's mark morale again. Louisiana was experiencing a deep deep recession related to the the downward price of oil. which caused. TREMENDOUS UPHEAVAL! CAUSED NEW ORLEANS TO LOSE. Population gave us a problem of abandoned housing fueled the the crime and the crack epidemic in the city. In New Orleans, the economic catastrophe of the oil bust, converged with the nationwide trends of white flight and urban neglect. The white suburbanites of Jefferson parish meanwhile went to great lengths to keep their enclaves sealed off. One incident in Nineteen eighty-seven drew national attention. Finally this evening we report about crime and race relations, and it may come down which side of the fence you'll live on just outside. You Williamson to be specific. It's not offense and it's not a wall. It's a barrier. To Jefferson Parish Council ordered the construction of two steel barricades. Those barriers closed off a pair of public streets, blocking traffic from a black neighborhood in New Orleans parish officials said the barricades were to keep criminals from slipping in and out of their neighborhoods, but it's pure racism. This side of Jefferson is predominantly white wears this side of all these powers predominantly black. A New Orleans government crew boulders barricades, and Jefferson decided not to rebuild them. But the message had been sent. We'll be back in a minute. Hey there slow-burn listeners is wanted to take a moment to say that. If you're a fan of the show, please consider signing up for sleep. Plus that is slates membership program, and this season were letting slate plus members listen to the first half of our series on David Duke Right away whilst I have bonus episodes where we'll dive deeper into the history were exploring the season, and as always members get to skip out on all ads on all slate podcast. It's only thirty five dollars for the first year, and you can find out more at slate dot com slash slow-burn that slate dot com slash slow. Burn thanks so much. Racism was a powerful force in district, Eighty, one the popularity of Harry. Lee and the barricades constructed on the border with Orleans parish for that out. So did the rising street level support for David Duke. Early polls had duke and third place with just seven percent support. But James Gill was sure those numbers were bogus. He watched Duke Stroll into a bar in metairie and get received as a hero. He also saw Duke Yard signs everywhere and Gil thought although signs actually understated dukes popularity. Would would be embarrassed to confess wave. They were voting for you. But in the privacy of the voting booth they will do it. And on January, Sixteenth, one, thousand, nine, hundred nine. Five days before the primary. An incident in New Orleans made dukes race-based campaign resonate more loudly and Jefferson parish. At approximately four this afternoon Martin Luther King Day on Canal Street turned. Ugly calls could be heard on police. Radios find to keep the crowds from building to thick. When they did. There were fights between blacks and whites non other games. The police said the violence in downtown. New Orleans stemmed from what they call turf wars between black youths. But some bystanders got caught in the middle. Guy. Getting, beat up! It came down here, saying no white foam. On Canal. Canal Street had been New Orleans as main shopping district, but by the late nineteen eighties, it was bladed. Anyone, who could afford to when shopping at huge malls, a few miles away and metairie. The violence on Canal Street was part of a larger story about disinvestment in American cities. But most people in district eighty-one weren't thinking about sociology. They wanted to keep New Orleans and everything had represented is far from their front doors as possible. The more scared they were, the better it was for David Duke. One of Duke's opponents. Watching footage of the violence told his wife I. Think we're going to have some trouble with this. As voters in district eighty-one went to cast their ballots David Duke was still considered an underdog. The front runner was sixty two year old Republican John Trine. Beth Rickey worked for the trump campaign here. She has a nineteen ninety-one. I came up the stairs at Ni- election night. I'm coming up the stairs and I was just waiting to hear that it was John and this other fellow. Delton Charles in a run off, and someone grabbed me and said do came in first. Governor Buddy, roller says electing former KLANSMAN. David Duke to the state legislature would not helpful using Atas National Image Duke lead train with thirty three percent of the vote. David Duke was inching closer to the American mainstream, but he wasn't a winner quite yet. This was just the first round voting since neither do or tree, and had a majority. There would be a runoff a month later. In private, Harry, Lee described the face off between David. Duke and John Trine as a choice between a bigot and an asshole. Republicans in Louisiana love trains, brother, Dave, the former governor, but John who made his money as a home builder was seen as entitled an arrogant. He was the type of guy one anonymous Republican said, who can tell you good morning and Piss you off. Tree had thought he could Costa victory on name recognition alone. When the race became a personality contest, he was severely outgunned. Sean train was. Not An impressive candidate. Is perfectly decent guys. But had nothing really to commend him. He was no. Charisma no, no color, no style, no dash. David Duke had the dash the John. trine lacked. dukes fans reveled in his youth and his energy. Earlier in the eighties, he'd remade his face with plastic surgery, a nose job Chen implant and chemical peels. One seventy two year old woman said that seeing do could. Her door was one of the most thrilling moments of her life. Trine voters tended to be the very richest district eighty one the type that belong to Metairie Country Club. Duke support was wide ranging middle-class people working class laborers retirees in the people that liked him. They really liked him. Some voters are concerned about Duke's plan connection, but a lot or not. You go full support. I mean I'll see nothing wrong with being white for white does not necessarily mean anti. It doesn't bother you that. He's a former KLANSMAN. And now. I think the skeletons in all of them. Here's Beth rickey again. When I was on radio show one time I got an a sort of a debate with this man who was saying. Are you calling me a racist for supporting David Duke and I said why. Why are you voting for David Duke as opposed to say John Training? said. Well David Duke Scott Credentials. And I thought that's so true, you know he's. They know. He means business about welfare reform. He's a clan leader. Tree and himself was no great champion of civil rights. He wants been a member of the segregation. States Rights Party. But he said his views on race had evolved, and he drew a bright line between his values and David Dukes. Thank, you very thin veil, racist and anti Semitic campaign Mrs History that goes back. Publications is Put Out. One of trees campaign mailers showed Trine in his navy whites at age nineteen, serving his country during World War Two. Alongside it was a photo of Nineteen Year Old David. Duke dressed as a Nazi shirt. That image wasn't doctored. He really had worn a swastika. Duke knew this was bad for him. It was just like he'd said to. Evelyn rich three years earlier if they can call you a Nazi and make it stick. It's going to hurt. Duke needed to make sure it didn't stick instead of apologizing, he played the victim. He called that flyer character assassination and made a show of tearing it up on. Local, television. The race in district eighty one came down to trust who was an honest broker and who is telling voters what they wanted to? For Duke and train, this was a fundamental distinction. Definition of I'm standing up. I'm standing up for the White Race I. DON'T I don't deny that, do we? Should focus on. You agree with everything I say, but you don't have the guts and the courage to come out openly and say what I believe. You don't have the guts and courage to tell the truth. The runoff drew closer. The national media descended on district eighty-one. Polls have predicted a close race between ex, Klansman David, Duke, and John, train both running as Republicans afternoon election officials said it appeared between seventy-five and eighty percent voter district would go to the polls. This is the front runner. David Duke is thirty eight years old, smooth, articulate, a sharp dresser and a former imperial wizard of the Ku Klux Klan. Republican leaders were horrified by Duke, and by the prospect that he'd stained the party's reputation. He saw the race in Jefferson, parish as an emergency. John always worked for the traditional values and principles which you and I cherish. Ronald Reagan recorded a radio commercial for Trine and President Bush sent a letter to voters in the district, calling train the clear choice. It wasn't just National Republicans. Who Lined up by dukes opponent? The Louisiana Republican Party backed John Trine to. Duke described these endorsements as outside interference. A heavy-handed it's it's an ethical I'm just as as much legitimate Republican. John Train or a Reagan Bush needs of the people. Who David Duke positioned himself as the ultimate outsider someone who understood what it felt like to be put upon and forgotten. The In district eighty-one he said was me against the world. But not every public official took a stand against David Duke. Sheriff Harry Lee had a special connection with his white constituents. Connection he'd built despite not being white himself. They saw Lee is someone who has genuine and spoke the truth even when it got him into trouble. So. It's possible that we could have tilted the election if he told Jefferson parish voters, the duke was beyond the Pale. Instead lease at the race out. He didn't campaign for the bit or the asshole. Here's James Gal. Must have felt he needed to tread very carefully because. It want to add innate people for him. Ready for Juke would also vote for Harry. On, Election Day Quinn Hillier posted up at the busiest intersection and district, eighty, one the corner of Bonnabel and veterans. There were maybe ten or twelve of us for train that we're at that intersection without green train signs and twenty, five or thirty. Do People there with their blue and light? Duke signs and for large part of that time. David Duke himself was there. Hillier, who is not quite twenty, five at the time, was active in the Louisiana Republicans so we're most of the other and supporters at the intersection. The do partisans that Hillier saw were more ECLECTIC. We're making circle circles circles yelling in favor do there were even some frat boys that were hanging out and yelling in favor of Duke there were. You know teenage girls who thought he was dreaming or something, and there were TV cameras all over the place. Duke was standing in the middle of all this delivering a gentle soothing message. People would recognize him as a drove up in it. Stop at the light. They'd roll down the window and then this nice. Pleasant Voice Hi David Duke. I'm running to represent everybody in the district I love everybody and I really WanNa. Do this right I would really appreciate your vote. A short while later, the other train supporters went to lunch. He'll your was at the intersection by himself. There was a law and traffic. And Duke saw me and when there was nobody else around. Immediately to see. He all of a sudden made a beeline toward me and started yelling at me and snarling, and his face got I'll read any, said. Get off my corner. This is a mustard corner that three other corners. You can go to get the hell out of here. And then the traffic had picked up, so he went back to the corner, and people stopped in all of a sudden he went from this snarling red phase beast to Hi David. Do can I to represent everybody? David Duke was desperate for every vote. John Tree and just wanted the race to be over. When Hill went back to campaign headquarters on the afternoon of Election Day. He found the candidate alone. John Train was sitting back there. Looking. catatonic glassy eyes staring straight ahead. I tried to talk to him and he'd answer in these. Single syllable monotones. And I felt really sorry for the poor guy he he had no expectation getting into this race what he was in for, and he didn't know what had hit him. Free and was one of the first people I spoke to when I started working on this podcast. How are you feeling? How how's it going? Happy Ninety four, th birthday belatedly well, thank you very much. It's good to be ninety four. Alternate defense. You. Know good thing about again. No! Is always easier going downhill doom. Use It dead. What can I do for you know? My main takeaway from interviewing train was that he still hated David Duke. Really really hated him. Trine told me the do could spread a horrible lie about him. During that nineteen thousand nine race, when Hill your got wind of it on election, day In addition to all the other things I heard I distinctly remember one person going by drilling down they window, and said no way I'm button for your guy. He's a child molester. John Trine wasn't a child molester his brother. Paul was facing charges of child sexual abuse paltry later, plead no contest and be sentenced to probation. But a lot of voters thought John was the one who done something wrong. Thanks to whispers from the Duke Campaign. That's Mir followed tree in long after the race was over. I had people that for years later or Not or had things to say ugly things to to me because you know that word got out. It was a problem. If, you could say something to Duke. Now, then, why would you say? I wouldn't speak to them. Would have nothing to say to. Say What would go to do to say anything to. Nothing. Two months after we talked John, trine died of covid nineteen. His obituary began with the race in district eighty-one. Let's take a quick break. I went to the Duke Headquarters the night of the election It was a lions club on Metairie road. And the mood of the crowd was hostile. Unruly. That's Jason Berry a writer based out of New Orleans. I got in a conversation with several people who were telling me that the Holocaust was a myth that it never happened that six million Jews did not die. This was all former propaganda had never been exposed to Holocaust denial before that. Other journalists who standing in a roped off media section became targets of racist abuse from Duke supporters. A black cameraman said we need to get out of here before they lynch us. Remember I turned around and I saw Guy I had known oh in the eighth grade. Whose sister had been a debutante in New Orleans, and when I saw that guy I realized this is not just a bunch of. Of Hard, edged guys with the shotguns in the back of their truck. There's there's something deeper going on here. A lot of people of middle class and of means. Closed ranks to vote for him. After campaign, pampered with charges of racism with unofficial return chewing thirty five thirty five precincts, reporting Duke has eight, thousand, four, hundred and fifty six months trine. Eight, thousand, two, hundred and thirty two. No big political endorsements. Even the President United States came out against. David Duke One officially by two hundred and twenty seven votes. For the former Klansmen and the people who loved him that narrow victory felt like a landslide. That's the crowded dukes election night party recorded by player Robinson. Robinson was an independent radio journalist. He's spent that evening circulating through the room, asking. Dukes fans to explain what had just happened. We don't like people were from another area who don't know the issues and don't know the people who are endowed. down. Here interfering in politics and telling how to those. The most common answer Robinson heard was the duke was going to lower taxes. We want change. We want something to be done where we have to pay less tax and get more representation in the state naturally voted for David Duke to get better representation bottom line. There was one thing these people said the didn't influence their votes. It wasn't any racial. And economic all the way and is the role of racism. That prominent. Well If the news media could describe to anyone. a good definition of racism. I certainly would like to have it. It was obvious to anyone who was paying even a Scintilla of attention that a vote for Duke was vote for the most extreme kind of prejudice. But by spending at least some of the campaign, talking about taxes, do give people in District eighty-one a cover story. He allowed them to claim that they simply like to stand on the issues and the way he spoke his mind. dukes plan the one he'd explained. Tavlin reg had worked perfectly. When he wrapped his bigotry and conventional Republican politics, he gave his fans and excuse to vote for bigotry. Duke made himself a cause and he made. His supporters feel like members of a political family. Is. Duke made clear on election night. An attack on him was an attack on the whole Duke tribe. There hasn't been a campaign in modern. American history where the candidate was more attacked and more slandered. And more lied about and put down. and. David, Jenkins this election. This was a campaign of Grievance and L.. Rage and winning. One election wasn't going to change that. At that time in that room I was really struck. By. How angry people were. Even though the guy at one. Thirty one years later John Trine had no trouble recalling how he felt that night. I remember. And schlab broke down and cried. In one of the reasons was that. It wasn't just because loss because I thought he would hurt Louisiana. Did. To. My great grandfather Louis rate came to the states out of fear. He wanted to escape the rising tide of Anti Semitism and Eastern Europe to find a place where he'd feel secure. Louis ended up in the town of Eunice Louisiana where he opened a dry goods store in nineteen eleven. There were about seventeen hundred people in Eunice then only a handful of them were Jewish. But? Louis and his family were embraced their. Louisiana felt like home. Lewis's daughter Lillian my grandmother moved from Eunice to New Orleans to go to school. That's where my dad grew up and where I was born and raised. I was eight years old when Duke won that election in Jefferson parish. I remember seeing Duke signs all over the place including on the roof of a restaurant that served really good Gumbo. I also saw duke himself working the crowd and Lsu football game. Had always thought. The Tiger Stadium was my favorite place in the world. But after that day I wasn't sure a Jewish kid like me. Belong there or anywhere in Louisiana. Since I started out as a journalist I've wanted the chance to look back at the duke years and to understand why so many people were drawn to him. That feels more urgent now as the movement Duke Belt looks like a historical oddity than a warning sign. The morning after the election and district eighty-one Duke said that everybody needed to calm down. That all the fears about what he might do to blacks and Jews were totally overblown. I don't know if you remember the old children's story about chicken. Little chicken little ran around and said the sky is falling. The Sky is falling, and it turned out. It was only a small acorn. Chicken littles head. I have been elected. Representative from this district and Ladies and gentlemen. The Sky hasn't fallen. The next day the New Orleans Times picky published an editorial. It was headlined the Duke Embarrassment. Mr Dukes message was clearly a racial one and remained so throughout the campaign. The paper said. This message is repugnant and we categorically rejected. At the same time we believe every human being should be given the chance to grow to change to see the errors of his ways. Next time on slow-burn in nineteen, eighty-nine David Duke made himself out to be a new man. But his years in the clan were the key to understanding who he was and who he wanted to become. What did David Duke do for the Ku Klux Klan? And what of the clan do for him on episode two of our series? slow-burn is a production of slate plus slates membership program. This season slate plus members get exclusive I access episodes two and three of our series. Yes, if you are a member, you don't have to wait another week or two. These episodes are in your feed right now. Here's a preview. And the crowd started chanting things like boneheads, boneheads boneheads. And he didn't have to do very much to rev up these people. Their anger was there. They agreed with him. They you know they wanted him do more. They would say where our sheets. You can listen now by signing up at sleep. Dot Com slash slow-burn starting next week plus members will also get weekly bonus episodes where we'll dive deeper into the history were exploring the season. We couldn't make slow-burn without the support of slate, plus so please sign up if you can head over to sleet DOT COM, slash slow burn. slow-burn is produced by me and Christopher. Johnson with editorial direction, buy low and loo and Gabriel Roth. Madeleine Ducharme is our production assistant sophie summer. Grad is slow Burns assistant producer. Mix Engineer is Paul Manzi. David gross composed are themes on. The artwork for slow-burn is by Lisa Larsson Walker special thanks to Jordan Hirsch Jessica Seidman and slates Chow. Katie Raeford Laura Bennett Alison, Benedict and Jared Holt. Thanks for listening.

Evelyn Rich Duke New Orleans David Duke Louisiana dukes Klansman David John Trine David Duke America David Dukes Jefferson parish Harry Lee White People Harry Duke Belt Duke Campaign Evelyn Rich dukes Duke Headquarters New Orleans Times Picayune James Gill
S4 Ep. 3: The Nazi and the Republicans

Slow Burn

57:05 min | 1 year ago

S4 Ep. 3: The Nazi and the Republicans

"If you've been enjoying the season of slow-burn. Please consider joining slate plus slates membership program. We couldn't make the show without the support of slate plus members in in this economic climate. Sleet really needs your help. It's only thirty five dollars for the first year that less than three dollars a month and that money will really go a long way for us. Once you sign up, you'll get access to weekly bonus episodes where you'll get exclusive or extended interviews and also get the inside scoop on how we make the show. You'll also get to skip all ads on all slate podcasts including ads like these you can find out more at sleet dot com slash slow-burn that sleet dot com slash slow burn. Okay here's episode three. This podcast contains language that some listeners might find offensive. Beth. Rickey found politics thrilling, but also a little bit terrifying. As a member of Louisiana's Republican State Central Committee she helped to manage the state party from behind closed doors. Ricky liked watching the action from a slight remove making droll asides about the frontline players. But sometimes she couldn't resist speaking a little louder here. She is a nineteen ninety-one in an interview for a radio documentary. I get really angry. If I think someone is getting stepped on but I hate to be. I hate criticism. I mean I'm like this real sensitive person, so it's like this is not what I should be doing. Ricky grew up in a big house in Lafayette Louisiana and she had the bearing in the booth on Hairdo of a southern debutante. She idolized her father Horace Ricky. Who died when she was young? Horace fought in World War Two and helped liberate the German death camps. He'd also been a key figure in the Louisiana. Republican Party back when segregationist. Democrats ruled the south. Beth grew up believing that the GOP stood for rectitude and morality. Before David, Duke got elected to the Louisiana State House of Representatives. She still believed it. In one thousand, nine hundred nine ricky was a thirty two year old graduate, student and political science at Tulane in New Orleans. She was also working dukes opponent in that. House race John Trine. During that campaign ricky spent a lot of time reading up on Duke and the two Lane Library. The material that she uncovered shocked her. I come bounding up the stairs with all. These book lists and ridings and And I said you know. My God the Nazi. He's not only ahead of the clan. He's a Nazi. The trine campaign presented Ricky's findings voters. A photograph of Duke Nazi, Regalia Dukes claim as a college student that Adolf Hitler's Mein Kampf was the greatest piece of literature of the twentieth century, his long-standing embrace of eugenics. So, we thought that if you get the message out about David, Duke people would be shocked and they wouldn't vote for him. I don't think the strategy worked. When Duke won the seat Ricky felt shaken and discouraged, but she wasn't ready to give up her. Two weeks after election day in March nineteen eighty-nine. She followed Duke to Chicago. He was going to speak at the national. Convention of the Populist Party the fringy far far-right group that had backed his run for the presidency a year earlier. Ricky wanted to hear what David Duke said when he was among friends. Hanging out with a bunch of midwestern fascists was a surefire way for Duke to sully has cleaned up image. But these were the people who had rejuvenated dukes political career, and who had helped bankroll his successful run for the State Legislature Duke decided that he couldn't turn his back on them. Ricky had registered for the populist party convention as a journalist and Duke speech was closed to the media. To get into the room. Ricky went undercover as a member of the party. The guards at the door I found out later. They were with the American. Nazi party in Chicago. If I had none that I. Don't know if I'd be so brave now that they I pretended one 'em was a friend of mine and said Hey, how you doing. How's your family has wife? I'm glad he was married. Ricky got past the guard and found herself among skinheads. A Neo Nazis in front of this crowd David Duke felt comfortable talking strategy. So he said I may be a Republican by always be a populist and something like that, and then they all cheered. I felt like I, was in on dirty little secret ha, HA, ha! Liquid didn't Louisiana. pull the wool over their eyes, and he was using the Republican Party and that just made me mad. After that closed meeting Duke was photographed, shaking hands with a man named Art Jones. Jones was the vice chairman of the American Nazi. Party That picture would run in newspapers all over the country. This wasn't the image the Duke wanted to project. When he got back to Louisiana, he wind that the media had treated him unfairly. Duke said probably truthfully that he never met are Jones before and he called Jones Nazi Kook. Duke also claimed not at all, truthfully that the populist party was simply an anti-tax organization. And Duke said he repudiated any efforts of extremist groups to capitalize on his electoral victory. Beth rickey knew that last part was ally. She been there when Duke had told a roomful of extremists that he was one of them. She'd also heard Duke admit that he was a Republican in name only. Ricky had a clear mission. Stop the Republican Party from becoming the Party of David did. She had no idea how hard that would be. This is slow-burn. I'm Josh Levin. Episode. The Nazi and the Republicans. Billy non loyalty to the Republican. Cause was boundless and he couldn't help expressing it. Here! He is with radio. Reporter Gary Casino in Nineteen, ninety one three years after none Gasser became chairman of the Louisiana Republican. Party. Tell me with that big thing is in your parking lot. That's an elephant that. Bought some years ago? That is Life, size as you noticed. Tell it around. Yeah Yeah I told her I. Have Someone told to where we want? I bought it in a weak moment one time. None guests who grew up working class in New Orleans. He became a self made millionaire. The proprietor of a seafood canning company and a catering firm for oil rig workers the writer Quinn. Hillier says none. Gasser was the life of the Republican Party. So? He had this persona of this roughneck, and he was a burly guy in strong. But if he was at a wedding or something, you might see him in A. all white suit with a bright pink shirt and a bright orange tie. Very excitable. Very pithy very earthy. All in this one big package of energy, he was like like nobody I've ever known. When none Gasser was elected chairman of the State Party. He told his fellow Republicans. We are the good guys. David Duke joined the party less than a year later. During dukes race against John Trine, none gessler said that a victory for the klansmen would be a disaster for the party, the state and the nation. When that disaster came to pass, none guess her had a decision to make. He could either disavow in elected Republican officeholder, or he could embrace the most notorious Bigot in American politics. The Chairman of the National Republican Party Leah Water made his position on David Duke very clear. And this man's got a twenty year history of participating in Klu. Klux Klan Nazi activities. There's no place for this. Republican Party not as long as I. AM sharing. During the State House race at Water Ronald Reagan and the newly elected George H, w Bush all denounced duke. After Duke out elected, the Republican National Committee voted to censure him into deny duke, any form of aid and assistance atwater called excommunication. I. Don't care what he's been elected not. Is something I feel very strongly about. And I'm letting my moral compass takeover rather than my political compass, so I'm going to tomorrow coming from Lee atwater. This was an unexpected. Move a Little Lake Satan saying he was installing central air conditioning. At water was notorious for his vicious recycle politics. In a nineteen eighty-one interview released after his death at water, explained that Republican politicians hid racist policies behind race neutral code words. You start at nineteen fifty four by saying Nigger Nigger nigger. By nineteen, sixty eight, saying that hurts you back. Say stuff like a fourth buzzy. States, rights and all that stuff and you get so extract now you're talking about cutting taxes and all of these things you're talking about totally economic things in the five five. Get hurt, worse. At water had been George Bush's campaign manager in nineteen eight when he ran for president against the Democrat Michael Dukakis, that election turned on a campaign ad about a felon named Willie Horton. Who was black? Despite a life sentence Horton received ten weekend passes from prison. Ordin fled kidnapped a young couple, stabbing them in and repeatedly raping his girlfriend weekend. Prison Passes Dukakis on crime. The Bush campaign didn't make the ad, but atwater loved it. He said he wanted to make Horton. Dukakis's running mate. Before nineteen, eighty nine Beth rickey had never criticized the Republican Party's racial politics. But she told the independent radio journalists played a Robinson that the rise of Duke made her reevaluate her views. The Republican Party has had a platform for a number of years of being opposed -firmative action and minority set asides. and has appealed to the white southern voter in a veiled way. Willie. Horton Willie Horton is a classic example of that? But their greatest Maher was that some out and out racist would come along and say. This is the home of the Republican Party is for racist. For Billy Gasser David Duke was a different kind of nightmare one that was threatening to rip apart the Louisiana Republican Party. Elected officials in Louisiana had to choose sides very quickly. Just before Duke was scheduled to take his oath as a state representative, an independent legislator named Don Bouquet an objection. Bokke said the Duke had violated the State's residency requirements that he hadn't been living in Jefferson. Parish district eighty one for long enough that meant his victory was illegitimate. If the people of of district eighty-one want someone like that. To be their representative. That's their right. That's America. They can vote for him. As long as it is legal. And if it's not legal. And it wasn't. Than not matter how they voted, he should not have been seated. None of dukes opponents in that district eighty-one Ray said challenged residency. Bokke was raising the issue now because he hated everything, Duke stood for he was using parliamentary procedure to take a moral stand. And the Republicans in the state. House hated him for it. What did you hear from your legislative colleagues kind of behind the scenes? It was stupid that there was no way that I was GonNa, win the put them through making a vote if they have to vote. There on the record. As colleagues were right, he didn't come close to winning. sixty-nine stay representatives voted to give duke his seat thirty three voted against Duke, only three of them were Republicans. Duke was now officially state representative and a member of the Republican legislative, Caucus. It was easy to denounce dukes victory from Washington. It was much harder when his message was resonating in your own backyard. None guests didn't want Duke gather strength. But the Republican chairman also knew that attacks on Duke were creating a backlash in Louisiana. Because the press in every case. Comes on and says this Nazi this Klux Klan. and. People expect when they start paying attention. They expect him to talk about where they gonNa Lynch black tonight, and maybe where they going to Gasa Jew. And he knew that. And when they don't hear that. They almost receptive when he comes with a legitimate message. Say Hell this guy in. Bahrain in houses churches. You want about Duke. And then when he don't turn out the this monster, you give him more credit for not being the monster. Then you would give somebody who's never been a monster. If none, guests are excommunicated too from the. Louisiana. Republican party can risk losing. Every voter liked what was saying. and. That could be a lot of voters. All of that was a non gas head when Beth. Rickey came to speak with him in March nineteen, eighty nine. When Ricky told the chairman about David Duke speech to the Populist Party. He advised her to keep quiet. None Gasser said that making a big stink about Duke might give him the attention he craved. Beth rickey didn't want to defy billy Gasser, but she continued gathering intelligence on David Duke. She had help from a two lane. PhD Student named Lance Hill. Health had been monitoring Duke for a long time. In the early nineteen eighty, he started looking into Duke so-called Civil Rights Organization the National Association for the Advancement of white people. I subscribed to his paper under a phony name. and then I even went out and met him. He had two sets of literature one on one side of the wall of the W. W. P. The new improved racism. And on the other while was all the Nazi stuff. He kept trying to push the AA WBZ. Stuff on me and I'd say. What about this book over here, `Bout did six million really die? And he said well. Don't worry. The does just read this for now. You know kind of Bait and switch. Get hooked on the milk, toast, racism and the need. Drop the real stuff later. In April of one thousand, nine, hundred nine two months after took off as as a state representative help place the call to the N. W. W.. P.. The person who answered the phone said David Duke District Eighty one. I will ask odd. And so I called Bath and said I bet he still selling all of these Nazi books out of his basement there in Missouri right with his legislative office. To confirm their suspicions Helen Ricky started placing orders for books popular among White Supremacists. Here's how Ricky told the story to play Robinson. Lance call NASA the Turner Diaries and They said Oh. Sure we have it so I went and bought up. They know me at that point, then over a period of three weeks I sent in. I, had someone call and ask for. Do you have Hitler was? My friend had the book list and they said just a minute. Our out of that, but we do have mine comp. I'll never forget that I thought that was so funny, so we bought all these books, and then they gave us because we're such good buyers. bonus These little books on eugenics on breeding amass race. You know, so. It was kind of a lawn. Yob is called around here little extra. Ricky now had clear proof that the new David. Duke was really the Old David Duke. So, she reached out to billy non gessler again. But none geezers position hasn't changed. He said that she was stirring up a Hornet's nest and the going public would just give Duke Free Publicity. Ricky was at an impasse. She didn't WanNa add fuel to dukes movement, but she knew what she believed and she had hard evidence to confirm those beliefs. What Ricky needed was guidance and a path forward. She got it from an unexpected source, a Holocaust survivor who never thought of herself as an activist. Let's take. A. Small town a brutal murder. The series witnessed docs from stitcher presents a journey into the heart of America's unfinished business. Their new podcast is called unfinished in deep South. And it starts with one question. Who Lynched is door banks. Sixty six years after the murder of a wealthy African American farmer in a small. Town. This investigative true crime series attempts to restore the legacy of a World War, one veteran who found a way to prosper in the Jim Crow, south? This. Story explores the system of white supremacy that surrounded bags, traced and forgotten court records fading FBI, files, and testimony of. Witnesses it also aims to solve is door banks's murder before the case goes cold forever, listen and subscribe to unfinished deep. South, starting June, twenty ninth and Stitcher. Apple PODCASTS, spotify or wherever you listen. In this moment of crisis, it's worth remembering that the country has been through disasters before. In history often repeats itself. Flood lines the new podcast series from the Atlantic. It's about Hurricane Katrina in the city of new. Orleans my hometown and the birthplace of the season of slow-burn. Flood lines follows the lives of four people who lived through Katrina and its aftermath. And it reveals how government failures misinformation led to tragedies far beyond what the hurricane caused. Host van newkirk shows what we can learn today from that disaster fifteen years ago. You'll hear a sneak preview of flood lines at the end of this episode. You can hear more at the Atlantic Dot Com slash flood lines or wherever you get your podcasts. On June. Sixth Nineteen, eighty-nine and Levy got on a chartered bus to the Louisiana. State Capitol in Baton Rouge. I was there was a whole lot of people from New Orleans. Some survivors. And we just went there to visit to see the exhibit. The exhibit had been brought to the capital by Jewish human. Rights Organisation the Simon Wiesenthal Center. It was called the courage to remember in. It showed the history of the Holocaust and photographs. There were pictures of burning synagogues and starving children. For an Levy this exhibition was deeply personal. Leave. He was born in Poland in nineteen, thirty five. The German army invaded her homeland for years later. The Happy Time said I remember is right before the war a walking with my parents. Getting ice cream and balloons on a Sunday afternoon. And that stopped abruptly. Less than one percent of Jewish children in Poland survived the Holocaust by the end of World War Two the Nazis had killed at least three million Polish Jews. Levy, her younger sister, and her parents faced horrifying deprivations, but miraculously they all made it out alive. They may actually be the only nuclear family to survive the liquidation of the Warsaw ghetto. They lived in part because Levy and her sister managed to stay hidden for twelve hours every weekday for as long as five months. There was like a dower chest. So you'll lifted the top and you could store things in it. So, my father made a false bottom. And on the top, if you lifted the top or you so was old rags and old newspapers, and in the morning before they went to work. My sister now would go in there. And it was totally dark. Dark. And you spend the day just sat there. I don't know how we did it but circumstances. And A different time in the world. When you? We had to do what we were told. Leave he was a very small child during those years in Poland. People think that just because I was young. How could I remember? When I saw an with my own eyes would happen to people when they died in the street. For example if the head closing on them? It would be gone. I remember seeing these dead bodies naked. And Somebody Would come by and maybe cover that body with newspaper. How could you forget that? I don't care how old you are. Levy and her family gaped the Warsaw ghetto in nineteen, forty, two or nineteen, forty three and passed his. Christians until the war was over. But an still had to stay out of sight as her curly hair and olive complexion gave away her Semitic heritage. When she made it to America nineteen, forty nine. She did her best to leave the past in the past. You have to realize that when we came here as survivors. It was like okay. Forget what you experienced in Poland. And you put up this. Shade and you start a whole new life. In one, thousand, nine, hundred, nine and leave. He was a fifty three year old New Orleans Grandmother, and she owned and operated an antique store with her husband. She'd started to open up very tentatively about what she lived through during the Holocaust. But when she got on that chartered bus to baton rouge, she wasn't expecting to get involved in any kind of conflict. She was going to look at the photographs in the Capitol Rotunda, and to listen to speech from Louisiana's Governor Buddy Roemer. But then leave. He saw someone she didn't expect to see. But I noticed David Duke coming in. and. Couldn't imagine what he was doing there. The Wiesenthal Center had brought its exhibit Baton Rouge because of David Duke. The images on display at the state capital refuted dukes core beliefs. They showed very starkly. What exactly Holocaust deniers were denying? Duke had kept quiet about the Holocaust when he ran for the State House. But after the election, a New Orleans TV reporter confronted him about his views. Host of the twentieth century. Talking about the Holocaust, being a hoax. Saying that the that the atrocities were exaggerated in Europe. Do you believe a thing where? I think it's possible that some of the atrocities were exaggerated. An Levy had been following dukes rise to power with increasing horror. She wasn't sure why he'd come to the capital. Maybe he'd wanted to prove he couldn't be intimidated by a bunch of Jews. Whatever the reason she wanted to keep an eye on him. He was going from posted poster. Looking at these horrible pictures. And it was also his demeanor with his hands behind his back, like it kind of flashed back with the German offices you to walk around like. And He had the same mannerism. As headless henchman. and. Stayed in my mind and that's what came to my mind. At that particular moment, I thought I had to speak up. It took over my body and I just had to deal with. I tapped him on his show. And nothing happened He. He noord me I did that three times. And finally. He turned around. and. I just got to ask him what I don't know. Why are you looking at the posters? I thought you said. It didn't happen. And that's when he turned around and sort of A. Foul Mood. He said. I didn't say it didn't happen. I said it was exaggerated. Well! Lost, my cool low bid because for him to tell me. that it was saturated. I realized demanded what he was talking about. And when that happens, he started walking off. And I tried to follow him, but. His a much longer than mine and he just laughed. Press took notice of Duke skirmish with Holocaust survivor. Journalists Jason Berry was in Baton Rouge that day. He got out of that part of the capitalist as he could. And I managed to you know trail around and find him and I went up to him and I said. What do you think about all this? And He said well, I'm being accused of. Orwellian thought crimes. Which I thought was quite striking statement. When he was cornered by reporters. Duke said I know there were terrible atrocities against the Jewish people. But. He insisted that it was fair to question certain aspects of the Holocaust and he said that he rejected the politicization of the whole thing. If Duke had gone to the exhibition to show, he couldn't be intimidated. His behavioral proved the exact opposite. He didn't WanNa talk about the Holocaust he didn't want to talk to a Holocaust survivor. And Levy as a family friend I've known for a long time that this moment and Baton Rouge. Her. But didn't understand how important. I never wanted to be in the papers and I never wanted to. Make a nuisance of myself. But. It was something if behind baby myself. A Nuisance David took that I didn't mind I was. Very in the back person that doesn't speak up and really changed my life. It changed. In, away my children look at me differently. Because I did speak. Levi's encounter with David Duke wasn't just consequential for her personally. It helped shape the entire. Anti Duke Movement. Beth rickey heard right away about what Anna Lee had done. She thought that Levy had showed tremendous courage in exposing. David Duke and public. She wanted to back levy up. To summon the same kind of strength and conviction. Confronting Duke, directly also seemed like smart strategy. It, clearly through off his game, and it was sure to draw attention from the press. The next day. Ricky brought the Nazi book. She purchased to the state capital. She met the media outside the Louisiana houses committee rooms. Later she did an interview standing in front of the Holocaust exhibition absolutely outraged. This man has the gall to. Put literature that says the Holocaust was a hoax. The New Orleans media thought Beth rickey was onto something. Duke says the books that were available at his office. Don't necessarily reflect his views. This is not the issue what I'm doing the legislature. This is not the issue that that I'm. Standing up for? Sure it's. Again this book right here this weekend. This book right here. You can find that. Will they bookstore? Do, quit alternately vowed a stop selling Nazi books part of his never ending project to present himself as a changed man. But. Ricky's expose had worked. She'd embarrassed Duke and laid bare who he was. You'd think David Duke would have seen Beth Rickey as an implacable enemy. You'd think he might have worked to discredit her or maybe just ignored her. Instead, he did something surprising. He tried to win her over. Two weeks after Beth Rickey publicized David Dukes Nazi book-selling operation. She invited a couple of friends over to talk about where the anti-drug movement should go next. Around ten PM the phone rang. It was duke. Beth Rickey and David. Duke spoke for three hours that night. He told her that Iceland had a superior culture, and he talked about sperm banks and his love of nature. In the background, he played the song silent running by Mike and the mechanics on repeat. That was the first in a long series of phone calls in the summer of nineteen eighty. Nine Ricky thought it was bizarre. The Duke wanted to talk to her, but she saw it as an opportunity a chance to get them to open up and reveal his true intentions. Ricky didn't quite understand who she was dealing with. David Duke started working on her right away. He would do things that were very disarming. You know he would say. Hey? There's something on TV. I think you'd find interesting. And I would say to him on occasion. Please don't tell me anything that you don't repeat it. All I. Know You wouldn't do anything to hurt me. We're you know we're going to be friends? And non it was very clever of him. Ricky found that Duke had no sense of humor and that he only wanted to talk about himself. He saw ricky as a potential conquest intellectually and maybe romantically. Here she has with played Robinson. He was reading. His book finders keepers to me over the phone. I'm thinking I've got to do this for the sake of his street. And he's three leading this how to keep a man and how to keep a man interested in you? And he said Oh one way to do. It is to attack and publicly. At the state capital. I'm like I, said David I. Don't go out with Nazis or something like that. Duke and Ricky's relationship would remain platonic. That summer. Duke tried to convince her that he was a family man. One day night he showed up at Ricky's place with his two adolescent daughters, his children from a marriage that ended five years earlier. So He insisted he wanted to go to a bar. We had these two kids with us. You're like Daddy. We don't want to go to a bar and they are dislike. It was strange conversation going he'd say T- Erica tell miss, Beth about how I used to dress up in a clan. Rove is akin. She said Daddy. That embarrasses me, but. He kind of nor the children you know. I had to give him money to go play video games and it was. It was just a real bizarre evening. Beth rickey had been trying to evict duke from the Republican Party. She busted him selling. Nazi literature. The only reason they were talking was because she'd taken it upon herself. Mask Him. But. She explained to play Robinson. All these conversations were having an effect she hadn't. It's like being how captive by somebody you get kind of goofy and start identifying with your captors, so to speak and I would call people at night and say look deep program me. You. Know I've gotten all this stuff in my hat. Ricky was still investigating Duke digging into the identities of his campaign donors and his bogus claims about serving in the military during the Vietnam War, but she was also going on drives with him, listening as he sang along to the impossible dream from man of La Mancha. Duke told Ricky that he wanted her to call another press conference in this time. Tell the world she'd been wrong about him. That wasn't going to happen, but ricky still need debris. dukes spell to remind herself what she was up against. That reminder came in August nineteen, eighty-nine when Duke started chatting her up about the Holocaust. We had lunch at a Chinese restaurant in metairie. Here we are at lunch having lunch and we're talking about bodies at death camps and he was telling me how. In sort of Conspiratorial tone leaning over and saying you know, bet really didn't happen. and. Finally I one leader David he said yeah passes. Are you out of your mind? And whole Ram me. Life is going on. Here these. Normal people sitting there, eating Chinese food and we're talking about him going to visit one of the death camps in Europe, Mount House and I believe scraping the walls. Path. Talks like this leaned over this kind of breathy voice. There have been any gassings. There would have been a residue on the walls. Compression Blue I went in scraped. There wasn't a residue. And he's telling me this and. I wish I could convey to you this. Growing since of horror. Sitting, there, talking to this guy was just. I just found it so offensive, and that was the last time we had lunch. When Ricky went public with the Chinese restaurant story, a couple of years later dude claim. It was completely untrue. His denial is hard to believe though given what he told, the graduate student Evelyn reg just a few years earlier. Testimony? But it really is just. spectate survived themselves tremendous Arginine, but in fact the extermination didn't take place. Duke was always bragging to ricky that he had an IQ of one hundred seventy one. But for a guy who thought of himself is highly intelligent. He did a lot of really dumb things. He went places he shouldn't go in said things he shouldn't say to people you shouldn't say them to. Beth rickey at a theory about that. There's a self destructive streak and hand that I see. He has the sense of religious mission about his. His calling. He almost has A. You know. A Jesus Complex called or something like he's untouchable. As of the fall of Nineteen eighty-nine Duke had good reason to think he was untouchable at that point the Louisiana Republican Party done nothing to hold him back. For David Duke, the Louisiana State House wasn't a place to pass legislation. It was a performance space. As a freshman state representative do proposed a bill to require drug tests for welfare recipients. He also wanted to impose harsher punishments on people who sold drugs in public housing. These bills weren't designed to become laws and they didn't. They were written to get attention and to send a message about who duke wanted to see punished. Some of Duke's Republican colleagues helped show him the legislative ropes. Others found dukes beliefs Horri-. I don't want to be associated with the racist. Sob One Republican. Legislator told the New Orleans Times Picayune. But. That official wouldn't be quoted by name. Here's Larry Powell. He wrote a book about David Duke an Levy. There was hardly anyone who is willing to step up and. And speak out against him. They sense that his support which is growing statewide. With stronger for him than it was for. For them. I mean I had to do was go up there and I went up there several times and. And Watch, too can be at the back of the back rear seat. The state legislature. In. His desk would be piled with envelopes. and. He'd be there slicing him over why people are debating? And checks and Money was befalling out of it. As a member of the republican state Central Committee Beth. Rickey was still pushing her party to do something anything to condemn Duke. I was trying to compromise with the party leaders and Why don't you just say you don't like him? I, mean you know something so how `bout? You wouldn't have him home for dinner I mean you know? Ricky had one major ally on the state. Central Committee and Evangelical Christian. Name, Neo Curran. Father as a matter of principle we needed to. To stand against Duke. He really wasn't a Republican and hard. He was a Nazi. Ricky, and curren worked together to draft a motion to censure Duke just like the National Republican. Party had done months earlier. The resolution wooden do much. Practically it wouldn't take duke out of the State Party, but Ricky and current, Saad is a clear statement of principles, a line in the sand for Louisiana Republicans. Billy none Gasser didn't want his party to have to cross that line. When the chairman found out when ricky was up to, he flew into a rage. Here's Ricky described it to play to Robinson. I had no right. No right to do this I was. Grandstanding trying to seek publicity for myself. I was also writing a book and getting publicity for the book. which isn't was not true. I mean on. And I said look you know. I've received two death threats this week from people I had a particular specific threat, if I got up and said anything about Duke I was GonNa get shot, and when I said that to the state. Chairman I said you know I, think that if that doesn't safer you how serious this is! And how serious I feel about this, I'm going ahead in spite of that. And he's response. Well, you know he didn't want me to get shot. None gasser did allow bath. Ricky Neil current to present. Their censure resolution. said the duke was still associating with Neo Nazis and Klansmen, and that the Reagan administration had identified Dukes National Association for the Advancement of White people as a racist group. Koran was the one who stood up and read the motion. and. There must have been thirty television cameras there from all over the world. There were several from Germany I. Know and David Duke was standing in the back of the room. Just. His eyes burning. He was he was mad. The resolution came to nothing. Another member of the Central Committee an ally of billy non Gasser moved to have it tabled. None guests there had made a backroom deal one that ensured that the Louisiana Republican Party wouldn't have to take a public stand on David Duke. None Gasser who died in two thousand six argued that the committee had no choice. He said that current and Ricky hadn't followed the rules. We have a procedure that anything. That comes state. You have to give five days. Notice to have it go. Any resolution is no procedure for century. What would people realize? Is there were an are in this party? People who hate David Duke and in the past of Haiti, but legitimately think that when you start censoring somebody then you have to do it correctly. Beth rickey thought none Gasser was being totally craven the no matter what the official rules were. He clearly didn't have the spine to protect the. Republican Party from David Duke. When her resolution Guy Killed Ricky sent the chairman and note. Dear Billy, she said. You double crossed me. I will never ever that you forget this. Later Robinson interviewed ricky a year later. As I look back now. I see that they see. They are some sympathies for Duke? Also I believe party leaders. This has come out now. The party leaders have finally admitted to me. That the reason. They didn't come out against. Duke is because they don't want to alienate the duke voters because they may need them. Ricky herself began to speak out against Duke a lot more loudly. She became one of the leading voices in the Louisiana Coalition Against Racism and Nazism. The state's most prominent Anti Duke Organization. While Ricky criticized the Republican Party increasingly harsh terms. I don't believe she ever publicly renounced it. But Ricky said in one, thousand, nine, hundred, ninety, one that our fight against Duke and against the party she grown up with took a significant toll. It's fractured many relationships I'm I'm having to find a whole new circle of friends, and it's been very difficult because I I don't WANNA lose people I've worked with for twenty years. And was. A lone voice you know in the woods. Here's Lance Hill again. And she was Vilnai's. An, she was not a emotionally. You know the most. Secure Person. Though he was capable of some very courageous things. She was vulnerable person and I believe she. She really paid a price. Ricky began to decline physically after she contracted an illness on a mission trip in the Mid Nineteen Ninety S. From, then on her life was marked by instability, she moved from place to place, struggled with money and was often in poor health. In two thousand nine ricky was fifty three years old and living in a motel in Santa Fe New Mexico. She told a newspaper there that she had been through a lot with the duke situation and that she needed to get away from the insanity. Her friend Quinn Hillier asked a woman in New Mexico to look in on Ricky. Not on the hotel room door. Nobody answered. She called nobody answered. And so she called the authorities in. They opened the door and she was famous for loving. Homemade instant iced tea and she had a pitcher of ice tea in her hand or spilled ice, tea. In her hand. She fell to the floor and she was dead. Rickey died of pneumonia and heart disease. In his obituary for Ricky, Hill your wrote that she was one of the bravest women ever meet. When it made a huge difference to a state gone haywire, he said. Beth more than answered the call. In nineteen ninety one. Journalist Gary Vino. Asked Beth rickey a simple question that she had a very hard time answering. Do Hate David do. I. I hate what he stands for I. I really hate. The fact that he has a High Q. and he knows better, he should know better. During the years she's been battling Duke Beth. Rickey was continually alarmed that other people were not alarmed by him. She knew how charming he could be and how ambitious. Duke saw the Louisiana Legislature Steppingstone in December nineteen eighty-nine after less than a year in the State House. He was ready for his next move. India. Re going senior. Point. Even at this point with Ducas Senate candidate, a lot of Republicans in Louisiana didn't think he was a problem. When Ricky spoke with Plato Robinson and Nineteen Ninety that campaign had yet to play out. What if he goes to Washington as a Republican senator? You know it puzzles me why? These people can't look ahead and see the damage I've heard Republican. Legislator. Tell me you know come on that. Was He got? What damage could he possibly do? In the US. Senate and I just looked at him like. Are you nuts? We've reached the halfway point of this season of slow-burn. Next week we have something a little different plan a brief interlude. It's a story from nineteen eighty nine when David. Duke just been elected the Louisiana State House. A black twelve year old girl in new, Orleans was writing about Duke for a Social Studies Project. So she picked up the phone and gave the white supremacist to call. And recorded the whole thing. Blossom be letting you in on a few choice excerpts from our sleep plus bonus episodes including some of my interview with Toepfer Grace who played David Duke in Spike Lee's Oscar winning film. Black Klansman. The following week we'll be back with episode four of our season that slow-burn season four episode for two weeks. Slow burn a production of slate plus slates membership. Program Slate plus members get weekly bonus episodes of slow-burn where we'll dive deeper into the history were exploring the season. On this week's bonus episode, we'll hear more from an Levi. The Holocaust survivor who confronted. David Duke in nineteen. Eighty nine. Head over to. SLATE DOT com slash slow-burn to sign up and listen now. We couldn't make slow-burn without support of slate, plus so please consider signing up if you like the series and you're able to contribute. It's only thirty five dollars for the first year and you get a free two week trial. Good asleep dot com slash slow-burn to find out more. slow-burn produced by me and Christopher. Johnson with editorial direction. Buy Low and LOO and Gabriel Roth. Madeline Ducharme our production assistant sophie. Summer Grad is slow Burns assistant producer. Are! Mix Engineers Paul Mounsey David Gross composed our theme song. The artwork for slow-burn by Lisa. Larsson Walker. The title of this episode, the Nazi and the Republicans comes from an essay by Beth Rickey published in the Anthology, the emergence of David Duke the politics of race. Larry Powell's book about Duke and Anna Levy is titled Troubled Memory. Special thanks to Jordan Hirsch Jessica Seidman and slates chat to Katie Raeford Laura. Bennett House, and Benedict jared homes. Thanks for listening. I've been a lot of time recently. Thinking about a man I don't know much about. I. Don't know what he looked like. I deny old he was. I don't know where he was born where he died. What I do know is his name. Richard. He was enslaved. And he was on last island in eighteen fifty six. Last island. Yield then yeah. Back then they spoke French in southern Louisiana and that island was about as far south as it got. Last island was a resort. Place where everybody who was anybody went for the cool, salt breeze. The wealthy of America's save accuracy. We go there in the summer to have balls parade down the promenade relax. Behind their leisure was a hand of slave power that ran everything. A little bit more about the man who owned Richard. Thomas Mill was a Frenchman. He ran a sugar plantation out in the by you. Mill family to their mansion last island that summer. On August ninth Saturday night, they danced in the grand ballroom the local hotel. But on Sunday. They look down into the waves and felt the bracing wins approach. The storm was coming. That night the winds grew stronger. The science of last island panicked impact themselves into a hotel. But richer was worried. He tried to convince a master in his family to leave their mansion and take shelter in a stable. But they refused. The storms I approached. Waves got higher and higher. The surge of water to storm pushed ahead of race to the island. It hit like a tidal wave. Through it all Richard Braved the storm in the stable. His only companion that night was an old horse. The next morning. The only building skills Danny on last island was at stable. Rigid and the horse it made it. Many other folks aren't so lucky. About. Half of the people known to be there died. Richard found his masters eighteen year old daughter bleeding from a head, wound and delivered her safety. She was the only member of our family on last islanders survive. As far as we know. Rigid was the only person in slave who survived. Everything we know about Richard Comes from a newspaper interview, but the daughter he saved. The story of last island became a sensation across America. Sensational in part, because, of who died. In the eighteen fifty s southern Louisiana had the highest concentration of millionaires in the country. Last island hurricane and killed a lot of them. The idea of doomed grand balls and final pageants at the plantation aristocracy. And was also tragic and romantic. But I don't really care about that part. I just can't stop thinking about Richard. The last island hurricane was a category four storm when it hit. It's been called the first great storm in recorded history of Louisiana. It seems like every generation has one. Eight eighteen ninety three. Thousand Nine Hundred Fifteen. Nineteen, forty seven. Each with their stories in their myths. With Richards. The last big storm in New Orleans Hurricane Betsy. Nineteen sixty five. Then for forty years. It was quite. Turning into a monster of a store in the very. It seems to be taken responsibility Georgia. About Black. Back. From the Atlantic. I'm Van Newkirk, and this is flood lines. Listen to all eight episodes on March twelfth. And visit the Atlantic Dot Com slash bloodline.

David Duke Horace Ricky Beth rickey Duke Louisiana Republican Party New Orleans David Duke Plato Robinson Anna Levy David Duke District Eighty State Party David Republican State Central Commi Republican Party Populist Party state representative Gasser chairman America
Slow Burn S4 Ep. 1: White Knight

Slate Presents: Charged | A True Punishment Story

45:54 min | 1 year ago

Slow Burn S4 Ep. 1: White Knight

"Hey there. This is Josh. Levin host of the Queen and National Editor at slate I'm here to let you know that I am hosting season for of slow. Burn a podcast that looks in depth at the biggest stories from American history. Our new series is about the Nazi sympathizer and former Klansman David Duke how he got elected to the Louisiana legislature and almost became the governor of the state. I've been wanting to tell this story for a very long time as I share in the episode you're about to hear. I grew up in new. Orleans and I watched duke become a political sensation. The story of how he rose to prominence feels just as urgent now as it was then here's episode, one of slow-burn season for if you WanNa, get the whole season. Subscribe at slate dot com slash slow-burn or wherever you get your podcasts. This podcast contains language that some listeners might find offensive. White Supremacist love talking to Evelyn Rich. Maybe it was her talent for flattery. Face the way. You felt like kind of an interesting versus maybe be. Rich was born in England and she was getting her PhD at Boston University. Dissertation was on the modern Ku Klux Klan. What they believed and why they believed it. On February Seventeenth Nineteen ninety-six. She put her tape recorder in front of a neo. Nazi named Joe Fields. into. From the time I was. Probably or or five, I was attracted. To. National Socialism. I used to watch Hollywood movies. I would for the Germans. You know rich and fields got together in southern California. At a conference hosted by the Institute for Historical Review, the HR called itself a think tank, but it was really a hate group. Its main goal was to sow doubt about the Holocaust to spread the lie. That Germany hadn't really killed six million Jews. The doctoral student and the Neo Nazi wouldn't be alone for long. A few minutes into their conversation. They got interrupted by a knock on the door. She's probably the only one in my family can really. Yeah. It was David Duke. America's best known white. Supremacist your energy. Duke had grown up in New Orleans in the fifties and sixties. His father wasn't around much, and his mother was an alcoholic. As a teenager, he found a community at the new. Orleans White Citizens Council a group that fought to stop the integration of public schools do cut famous in the seventies when he was a leader in the Ku Klux Klan. Reporters and TV producers thought he was a fascinating subject. He was well dressed and clean cut. He seemed like a perfectly nice young man until he opened his mouth. American white people. Are Searching and are reaching out for a movement and flux plan. Is that movement? By the time he met Evelyn Rich Duke was in his thirties and he'd broken with the clan. Do couldn't resist butting into rich's conversation with a neo-nazi. When Duke spoke up, he made it clear. That has worldview hadn't changed since he left the KKK. People Joey deserve. They, try. Try exterminates I. think probably a moral cents Jewish people. Fly Home you? And they probably deserve. You got him gasping history. The Jewish people have been a blade. They probably deserve to go into the ashburn history. Behind closed doors at this California Mita for Holocaust. Deniers Duke felt comfortable sharing his true beliefs. and. That wasn't all he revealed. A few minutes later Duke talked about his master plan his strategy for breaking into the mainstream, keeping quiet about his extremist views. Out Try to find New People. that. I can problem. And, but it's the difference and they can. If they can tell you a Nazi and make it stick I mean. Really hard. It's GonNa hurt. It's hurt me if you have is what you. When fields brought up, Nazi Germany Duke said the time was right for a new. A it doesn't take that many people to start something rolling. Hitler started okay seven men right? That's what I'm trying to. Most people don't want anything to do with thought. You think it can happen right now with the package together. Don't you think that there are millions of Americans are inundated hopefully something and the truth is the truth gives us to believe in Gary To. Meet Somebody Mike I. It's not me out. Because nobody else might come on. The recording you just heard would help bring down David Duke. But that would happen later. In the late eighties and early nineties. Duke was sure his time had come. That he was the leader, white people wanted to believe in. He was canny and charismatic and in his home state. Of Louisiana. He was becoming political star. As a kid growing up in New Orleans. There was a lot about Duke in his movement that I couldn't comprehend. And heard enough back then to understand that something enormous was at stake. There's something very scary about the election of David Duke. David is drawing full houses much of the debate. At least at first will be about, David. Some hate him to others. He's a hero. This is slow. Burn Season Four. I'm your host Josh, Levin Over the next six episodes you'll hear about the moment when a white supremacist became an American political phenomenon. What were the forces that Fuel David Dukes rise? What did it take to defeat him? Did. He ever really go away. This episode one. White Knight. David Duke had big plans and an enormous ego, his first priority in the years after he bared his soul Tavlin rich was to win the highest office in the land. I have your commitment. My commitment. Tomorrow I well now's. My formal injury. into the race for the Democratic nomination for president of the United States. Dukes nineteen eighty-eight presidential run was a flop. As a Democrat, he couldn't muster enough support to get on the debate stage. Duke then ran under the banner of the Populist Party. A fringe group dominated by klansmen Holocaust deniers and avowed Nazis. In that nineteen eighty-eight Race George H. W Bush beat Michael Dukakis by eight points. Duke would earn just point zero five percent of the vote. Duke was undeterred by this electoral rout. He believed he had a great message in that he was a great messenger. He would just need to take a different path to power. A month after the presidential race, the thirty eight year, old Duke found an opportunity that was within his grasp. He was going to run for the Louisiana State House of Representatives. This podcast is going to focus on a few pivotal years in dukes career the period when he made his most successful run at real political power. I'm starting here with a campaign and the New Orleans suburbs because this was the race changed David Dukes life. Before this election in Louisiana's House district, eighty one duke wasn't really a factor in state or national politics. But, by the time the campaign was over Duke was a sensation, and he was threatening to take control of the entire state. And it all happened incredibly quickly. House district eighty one was in the suburb of memory in Jefferson, parish Parish is by the way or when most dates call counties New Orleans in Orleans parish. Yes, there, pronounced differently for reasons it would take a whole other podcast to explain. The district, eighty one race was a special election. The seat came open when the guy who'd held. It became a judge. It would be a lightning-fast campaign. The primary was in less than two months. dukes. Opponents included a school board member, a florist, a Bingo Hall owner and John. Trine best known as the brother of former Louisiana governor. Any of those men could have ended David Dukes campaign before it started due could been living just outside the district. If someone had challenged his residency, he would've been disqualified and it's possible. No one would remember Duke today. But, none of them raised a challenge. They didn't think duke was a serious contender. Maybe, they didn't understand district eighty-one. Gears James Gill who wrote about Duke for the New Orleans Times Picayune. Very Very. Conservative is the polite word. If ever a clansman Rinaldi wants to get into mainstream politics. You couldn't choose a better district than this one in. Salem. District Eighty one included the neighborhood of old battery with its Tree Lined Streets and big mansions. It also included the working class area of Buck. Town, old fishing village dotted with clobbered homes. District, eighty-one rich people, and hard up people and people in between. But almost all of them ninety nine point six percent of them were white. Most voters in the district were on the Rolls as Democrats, but they'd started to cast ballots for Republicans and huge numbers. In his nineteen eighty four reelection campaign, Ronald Reagan got eighty four percent of the vote in district eighty one. David, Duke new his audience in the special election, he wouldn't be a Democrat or a populist this time he'd run as a Republican. On the trail duke touted himself as honest and outspoken at times as national news outlets pointed out that outspokenness was more like straight up them. One big plank in dukes platform, reforming the welfare system by curbing the illegitimate black rate. But Duke didn't mention the Holocaust, and when he got on the subject of race, he spoke more stridently than Ronald Reagan dead, but mostly took the same positions. In fact, I'm trying to prevent discrimination with this idea as I say of eliminating quotas. workfare instead of welfare, and we want an absolute and these anti white programs of racial discrimination called affirmative action minority set asides. Duke presented white nationalism, as an ideology of fairness, he argued that black Americans were getting special privileges on the job market and in government contracting. And that it was time for someone to stand up for White People's interests. Here's Quinn Hillier a Republican who supported dukes opponent John Trine. When he did talk about race, it was never about. Doing anything to blacks, it was always about protecting whites psychologically for a lot of voters, these distinctions subtle distinctions are important. Duke didn't only talk about race. One of his biggest issues was property taxes. He vowed to keep them low to protect what he called hard working productive middle-class people. This was the plan. Duke had laid out to Evelyn rich in the NEO Nazi Joe Fields. He was trying to bring New People in to win over voters who didn't identify as white supremacists. To understand, the district were David Duke running. You need to know about the most powerful man in Jefferson parish. chinese-american sheriff and a cowboy hat, and his name was Harry Lee. Here. He isn't a two thousand six interview with NPR a year before he died. Sheriff of Jefferson, parish is the closest thing. There is to be an king in the United States. I have no unions. Service. Hired and fired will. I don't have to go to council. Proposed budget. Approved a budget I'm the head of the law enforcement, district. Is One vote, which is me. Lee was a fun loving autocrat. At Mardi Gras. He threw Harry Lee. Dolls from a flood that featured an enormous likeness of his own face. The sheriff spent eighty thousand dollars on that flute which he saw as money well spent. Every year he said my big fat heads, coming down, veterans, highway and a half million. A million people see it. Harry Lee was born in New Orleans in nineteen, thirty, two in the back room of his family's laundromat. A bunch of lease constituents in Jefferson parish had relocated from New Orleans to. One of them was David Duke who moved to Jefferson in the nineteen seventy. White new. Orleanians went to the suburbs in search of bigger houses and lower tax bills. They also wanted to get away from black people. Here's former New Orleans Mayor Marc morial. His father was the city's first black mayor. What they were doing was getting away from integration. Fleeing what they thought. The city New Orleans was was becoming, which was a city, which was more racially diverse, and we're African American numbers were increasing in African American. Influence was increasing. As the population of Jefferson parish swelled Harry. Lee presented himself as the guardian of the suburbs. He'd make sure that battery felt like a safe haven for white people. The sheriff faced a big test in nineteen, eighty six when the parish was hit by a string of armed robberies. That December he proposed a solution to the crimewave racial profiling. It will be stopping more black people in predominantly white neighborhoods and in. I don't know how to say that we're going to do it if you live in a predominately white neighborhood in it in this to blackmail to the call right behind you. There's a pretty good chance that they're up to no good. The Executive Director of the Louisiana. Aclu called Leah despicable big. Protesters descended on Jefferson parish, demanding his resignation and chanting Harry Leeann the clan go hand in hand. Lee Walked back his plan, but he didn't resign. Gill covered leave for decades. He would away say exactly what he thought. And what he thought was. Seldom politically correct, but often chimed with his constituents. Harry had that knack of. Stuff that. Other people couldn't. And people just loved him for it. Harry lease supporters thought he was being straight with them about the dangers of New Orleans and of new Orleanians specifically black new ORLEANIANS. Poverty late and gun violence were real problems in the city and the one thousand nine hundred eighty S. here's mark morale again. Louisiana was experiencing a deep deep recession related to the the downward price of oil. which caused? Tremendous upheaval. CAUSED NEW ORLEANS TO LOSE. Population gave us a problem of abandoned housing fueled the the crime and the crack epidemic in the city. In New Orleans, the economic catastrophe of the oil bust converged with the nationwide trends of white flight and urban neglect, the white suburbanites of Jefferson parish meanwhile went to great lengths to keep their enclaves sealed off. In nineteen, eighty-seven drew national attention. Finally this evening we report about crime and race relations, and it may come down which side of the fence you'll live on just outside you Williamson to be specific. It's not offense and it's not a wall. It's a barrier. The Jefferson Parish Council ordered the construction of two steel barricades. Those barriers closed off a pair of public streets blocking traffic from a black neighborhood in new, Orleans parish officials said the barricades were to keep criminals from smoking in and out of their neighborhoods, but it's pure racism. This side of Jefferson is predominantly white wears this side of all these powers predominantly black. A, New Orleans Boulders Barricades and Jefferson decided not to rebuild them. But the message had been sent. We'll be back in a minute. Hey there slow-burn listeners i. just wanted to take a moment to say that. If you're a fan of the show, please consider signing up for sleep. Plus that is slates membership program, and this season were letting slate plus members listen to the first half of our series on David Duke. Right away whilst I have bonus episodes where we'll dive deeper into the history were exploring the season, and as always members get to skip out on all ads on all slate podcasts. It's only thirty five dollars for the first year, and you can find out more at slate dot com slash slow-burn that slate dot com slash slow. Burn thanks so much. Racism was a powerful force in district, Eighty, one, the popularity of Harry Lee and the barricades constructed on the border with Orleans parish board that out. So. Did the rising street level support for David Duke? Early polls had duke and third place with just seven percent support. But James. Gill was sure those numbers were bogus. He watched Duke Stroll into a bar in metairie and received as a hero. He also saw Duke Yard signs everywhere and Gil thought although signs actually understated dukes popularity. Would would be embarrassed to confess rave. They were voting for you. But in the privacy of the voting booth, they will do it. And, on January sixteenth, nine, hundred, eighty nine. Five days before the primary. An incident in New Orleans made dukes race-based campaign. Resonate more loudly and Jefferson parish. At approximately four, this afternoon Martin Luther King Day on Canal. Street turned, ugly calls could be heard on police. Radios find to keep the crowds from building to thick. When they did, there were fights between blacks and whites non other games. The police said the violence in downtown. New Orleans stemmed from what they call turf wars between black youths. But. Some bystanders got caught in the middle. Guy, Getting beat up. It came down here, saying no white foam blacks on canal. Canal Street had been New Orleans as main shopping district, but by the late nineteen eighties it was bladed. Anyone who could afford to when shopping at huge malls a few miles away and metairie? The violence on Canal Street was part of a larger story, about disinvestment in. AMERICAN CITIES But most people in district eighty-one weren't thinking about sociology. They wanted to keep New Orleans and everything had represented is far from their front doors as possible. The more scared they were, the better. It was for David Duke. One of Duke's opponents, watching footage of the violence told his wife I think we're going to have some trouble with this. As voters in district eighty-one went to cast their ballots. David Duke was still considered an underdog. The front runner was sixty two year old Republican John Trine. Beth Rickey worked for the trump campaign here. She has a nineteen ninety-one. I came up the stairs at nine election night I'm coming up the stairs and I was just waiting to hear that it was John, and this other fellow Delton Charles in a run off, and someone grabbed me and said do came in first. Governor. Buddy roller says electing former Klansman David Duke to the state legislature would not helpful using Atas National Image Duke lead train with thirty three percent of the vote. David. Duke was inching closer to the American mainstream, but he wasn't a winner quite yet. This was just the first round voting. Since neither do or tree and had a majority. There would be a runoff a month later. In Private Harry, Lee described the face off between David Duke and John Trine. Choice between a bigot and an asshole. Republicans in Louisiana? Love trains, brother Dave. The former governor, but John who made his money as a home builder was seen as entitled an arrogant. He was the type of guy one anonymous. Republican said who can tell you good morning and Piss you off. Tree had thought he could Costa victory on name recognition alone. When the race became a personality contest, he was severely outgunned. Sean train was. Not An impressive candidate. Is perfectly decent guys. But, had nothing really to commend him. He was no. Charisma no, no color, no style, no dash. David Duke had the Dash. The John trine lacked. dukes fans reveled in his youth and his energy. Earlier in the eighties he'd remade his face with plastic surgery. A nose job, Chen implant and chemical peels. One seventy two year old woman said that seeing do could. Her door was one of the most thrilling moments of her life. Trine voters tended to be the very richest district eighty one the type that belong to Memory Country Club. Duke support was wide ranging middle-class people working class laborers retirees in the people that liked him. They really liked him. Some voters are concerned about Duke's plan connection, but a lot or not. You go full support. I mean I'll see nothing wrong with being white for white does not necessarily mean anti. It doesn't bother you that he's a former Klansman. And No. I think the skeletons in all of them. Here's Beth rickey again. When I was on radio. Show one time I got an a sort of a debate with this man who was saying. Are you calling me a racist for supporting David? Duke and I said why. Why are you voting for David Duke as opposed to say John Training said Well David, Duke Scott Credentials. and. I thought that's so true. You know he's. They know. He means business about welfare reform. He's a clan leader. Tree and himself was no great champion of civil rights. He wants been a member of the segregationist states' Rights Party. But he said his views on race had evolved, and he drew a bright line between his values and David Dukes. Thank you very thin veil, racist and anti Semitic campaign. Mrs History that goes back. Publications is Put Out. One of trees campaign mailers Trine in his navy whites at age nineteen, serving his country during World War Two. Alongside it was a photo of nineteen year, Old David. Duke dressed as a Nazi shirt. That image wasn't doctored. He really had worn a swastika. Duke knew this was bad for him. It was just like he'd said to Evelyn rich three years earlier if they can call you a Nazi and make it stick. It's going to hurt. Duke needed to make sure it didn't stick instead of apologizing, he played the victim. He called that flyer character assassination and made a show of tearing it up on local television. The race in district eighty, one came down to trust who was an honest broker and who is telling voters what they wanted to? For Duke and train, this was a fundamental distinction. Definition of. Standing up I'm standing up for the white race. I don't I don't deny that, do we? Should. Focus on, you. Agree with everything I say. But you don't have the guts and the courage that come out openly and say what I believe. You don't have the guts and courage to tell the truth. The runoff drew closer. The national media descended on district eighty one. Polls have predicted a close race between ex KLANSMAN. David Duke and John Train both running as Republicans afternoon election officials said it appeared between seventy-five and eighty percent voter in the district would go to the polls. This is the front runner David Duke is thirty eight years old, smooth, articulate a sharp dresser and a former imperial wizard of the Ku Klux Klan. Republican leaders were horrified by Duke and by the prospect that he'd stained the party's reputation. He saw the race in Jefferson parish as an emergency. John always worked for the traditional values and principles which you and I cherish Ronald. Reagan recorded a radio commercial for Trine and President Bush sent a letter to voters in the district, calling train the clear choice. It wasn't just national. Republicans, who lined up by dukes opponent? The Louisiana Republican. Party backed John Trine to. Duke described these endorsements as outside interference. Estonia heavy-handed, it's it's an ethical. I'm just as as much legitimate Republican. John Train, or a Reagan Bush needs of the people. Who David Duke positioned himself as the ultimate outsider someone who understood what it felt like to be put upon and forgotten. The In district eighty-one he said was me against the world. But not every public official took a stand against David Duke. Sheriff Harry Lee had a special connection with his white constituents. Connection he'd built despite not being white himself. They saw Lee is someone who has genuine and spoke the truth even when it got him into trouble. So. It's possible that we could have tilted the election if he told Jefferson parish voters, the duke was beyond the Pale. Instead lease at the race out. He didn't campaign for the bit or the asshole. Here's James Gal. Must have felt he needed to tread very carefully because. It want to add innate people. Him. Ready for Juke would also vote for Harry. On Election Day Quinn Hillier posted up at the busiest intersection and district eighty, one the corner of Bonnabel and veterans. There were maybe ten or twelve of us for train that we're at that intersection without Green Train, signs and twenty, five or thirty. Do People there with their blue and light? Duke signs and for large part of that time David Duke himself was there. Hillier who is not quite twenty. Five at the time was active in the Louisiana Republicans, so we're most of the other tree and supporters at the intersection. The do partisans that Hillier saw were more ECLECTIC. Skinheads were making circles circles circles yelling in favor do there were even some frat boys that were hanging out and yelling in favor of Duke they were. You know teenage girls who thought he was dreaming or something, and there were TV cameras all over the place. Duke was standing in the middle of all this delivering a gentle soothing message. People would recognize him as a drove up in it. Stop at the light. They'd roll down the window and then this nice. Pleasant Voice Hi David Duke. I'm running to represent everybody in the district I love everybody and I really WanNa. Do this right I would really appreciate your vote. A short while later, the other train supporters went to lunch. He'll your was at the intersection by himself. There was a law and traffic. And Duke saw me and when there was nobody else around immediately to see. He all of a sudden made a beeline toward me and started yelling at me and snarling, and his face got I'll read any, said. Get off my corner. This is a mustard corner that three other corners. You can go to get the hell out of here. And then the traffic had picked up, so he went back to the corner, and people stopped in all of a sudden he went from this snarling red phase beasts to Hi David do. Can I WANNA represent everybody? David. Duke was desperate for every vote. John Tree and just wanted the race to be over? When Hill went back to campaign headquarters on the afternoon of Election Day. He found the candidate alone. John Train was sitting back there. Looking. catatonic glassy eyes staring straight ahead. I tried to talk to him and he'd answer in these. Single syllable monotones. And I felt really sorry for the poor guy he he had no expectation getting into this race what he was in for, and he didn't know what had hit him. Free and was one of the first people I spoke to when I started working on this podcast. How are you feeling? How how's it going? Happy Ninety four, th birthday belatedly well, thank you very much. It's good to be ninety four. Alternate defense. You know good thing about again. No! Is always easier going downhill doom. Use It dead. What can I do for you know? My main takeaway from interviewing train was that he still hated David Duke. Really really hated him. Trine told me the do could spread a horrible lie about him. During that nineteen thousand nine race, when Hill your got wind of it on election. Day In addition to all the other things I heard I distinctly remember one person going by drilling down they window, and said no way I'm button for your guy. He's a child molester. John Trine wasn't a child molester. His brother Paul was facing charges of child sexual abuse paltry later, plead no contest and be sentenced to probation. Voters thought John was the one who done something wrong. Thanks to whispers from the Duke Campaign. That's Mir followed tree in long after the race was over. I had people that for years later or Not or had things to say ugly things to to me because you know that word got out. It was a problem. If, you could say something to Duke. Now, then why would you say? I wouldn't speak to them. Would have nothing to say. What say what would go to do to say anything to. Nothing! Two months after we talked John, trine died of covid nineteen. His obituary began with the race in district eighty-one. Let's take a quick break. I went to the Duke Headquarters. The night of the election It was a lions club on the road. And the mood of the crowd was hostile. Unruly. That's Jason Berry. A writer based out of New Orleans. I got in a conversation with several people who were telling me that the Holocaust was a myth that it never happened that six million Jews did not die. This was all former propaganda I had never been exposed to Holocaust denial before that. Other. Journalists who standing in a roped off media section became the targets of racist abuse from Duke supporters. A black cameraman said we need to get out of here before they lynch us. Remember I turned around and I saw guy. I had known oh in the eighth grade. Whose sister had been a debutante in new, Orleans and when I saw that guy I realized. This is not just a bunch of. Of hard edged guys with the shotguns in the back of their truck. There's there's something deeper going on here. A lot of people of middle class and of means. Closed ranks to vote for him. After campaign, pampered charges of racism with unofficial return chewing thirty five thirty five precincts, reporting Duke has eight, thousand, four, hundred and fifty six months trine. Eight, thousand, two, hundred and thirty two. No big political endorsements. Even the President United States came out against. David Duke One officially play two hundred and twenty seven votes. For the former Klansman and the people who loved him that narrow victory felt like a landslide. That's the crowded dukes election night party recorded by player Robinson. Robinson was an independent radio journalist. He's spent that evening circulating through the room, asking dukes biggest fans to explain what had just happened. We don't like people were from another area who don't know the issues and don't know the people who are endowed. down. Here interfering in politics, telling how to those. The most common answer Robinson heard was the duke was going to lower taxes. We want change. We want something to be done where we have to pay less tax and get more representation in the state, naturally voted for David Duke to get better representation bottom line. There was one thing these people said the didn't influence their votes. It wasn't any racial. And is the role of racism. That prominent. Well. If the news media could describe to anyone. a good definition of racism. I certainly would like to have it. It was obvious to anyone who was paying. Even a Scintilla of attention that a vote for Duke was vote for the most extreme kind of prejudice. But by spending. At least some of the campaign talking about taxes do give people in District eighty-one a cover story. He allowed them to claim that they simply like to stand on the issues and the way he spoke his mind. dukes plan the one he'd explained. Tavlin reg had worked perfectly. When he wrapped his bigotry and conventional Republican politics, he gave his fans and excuse to vote for bigotry. Duke made himself a cause, and he made his supporters feel like members of a political family. As Duke made clear on election night. An attack on him was an attack on the whole Duke tribe. There hasn't been a campaign in modern. American history where the candidate was more attacked and more slandered. And more lied about and put down. And David. Jenkins this election. This was a campaign of Grievance and L. Rage and winning. One election wasn't going to change that. At that time in that room I was really struck. By. How angry people were. Even though the guy at one. Thirty one years later, John Trine had no trouble recalling how he felt that night. I remember. and. Schlab broke down and cried. In, one of the reasons was that. It wasn't just because loss because I thought he would hurt Louisiana. Did. You. My great grandfather Louis rate came to the states out of fear. He wanted to escape the rising tide of Anti Semitism and Eastern Europe to find a place where he'd feel secure. Louis ended up in the town of Eunice Louisiana where he opened a dry goods store in nineteen eleven. There were about seventeen hundred people in Eunice. Then only a handful of them were Jewish. But Louis and his family were embraced their. Louisiana felt like home. Lewis's daughter Lillian. My grandmother moved from Eunice to New Orleans to go to school. That's where my dad grew up and where I was born and raised. I was eight years old when Duke won that election in Jefferson parish. I remember seeing Duke signs all over the place including on the roof of a restaurant that served really good Gumbo. I also saw duke himself working the crowd and Lsu football game. Had always thought the Tiger Stadium was my favorite place in the world. But after that day, I wasn't sure a Jewish. Kid like me. Belong there or anywhere in Louisiana. Since I started out as a journalist I've wanted the chance to look back at the duke years and to understand why so many people were drawn to him. That feels more urgent now as the movement Duke Belt looks like a historical oddity than a warning sign. The morning after the election and district eighty-one, Duke said that everybody needed to calm down. That all the fears about what he might do to. Blacks and Jews were totally overblown. Know if you remember the old children's story about chicken, little chicken little ran around and said the sky is falling. The Sky is falling, and it turned out. It was only a small acorn. Chicken littles head. I have been elected. Representative from this district and Ladies and gentlemen. The Sky hasn't fallen. The next day, the New Orleans Times picky, published an editorial. It was headlined the Duke Embarrassment. Mr Dukes message was clearly a racial one and remained so throughout the campaign. The paper said. This message is repugnant and we categorically rejected. At the same time we believe every human being should be given the chance to grow to change to see the errors of his ways. Next time on slow-burn in nineteen, eighty-nine David Duke made himself out to be a new man. But his years in the clan were the key to understanding who he was and who he wanted to become. What did David Duke do for the Ku Klux Klan? And what of the clan do for him on episode two of our series? slow-burn is a production of slate plus slates membership program. This season slate plus members get exclusive I access episodes, two and three of our series. Yes, if you are a member, you don't have to wait another week or two. These episodes are in your feed right now. Here's a preview. And the crowd started doing things like boneheads, boneheads boneheads. And he didn't have to do very much to rev up these people. Their anger was there. They agreed with him. They you know they wanted him do more. They would say where our sheets. You can listen now by signing up at sleep. Dot Com slash slow-burn starting next week plus members will also get weekly bonus episodes where we'll dive deeper into the history were exploring the season. We couldn't make slow-burn without the support of slate, plus so please sign up if you can head over to sleet dot. COM SLASH SLOW burn. slow-burn is produced by me and Christopher Johnson with editorial direction. Buy Low and LOO and Gabriel Roth. Madeleine Ducharme is our production assistant sophie? Summer Grad is slow Burns assistant producer. Mix Engineer is Paul Manzi David Gross composed are themes on? The artwork for slow-burn is by Lisa Larsson Walker special thanks to Jordan Hirsch. Jessica Seidman and slates Chow to Katie Raeford Laura. Bennett Alison Benedict and Jared Holt. Thanks for listening.

Klansman David Duke New Orleans David Dukes Louisiana dukes John Trine Harry Lee John White People Duke Belt Duke Campaign Jefferson parish Evelyn Rich Duke Headquarters New Orleans Times Picayune James Gill California Jefferson Germany Ku Klux Klan
Anonymous Snitching & Josh Levin of Slate on David Duke and the KKK from Slow Burn Season 4

High Noon

57:44 min | 1 year ago

Anonymous Snitching & Josh Levin of Slate on David Duke and the KKK from Slow Burn Season 4

"We'll. We started with today's show I. wanted to tell you about another great ESPN podcast the low post ladies episodes are redrafted the two thousand nine MBA drive with Bill Simmons and a discussion of all the details of the NBA. Bubbling Orlando with Kevin Arnovitz. Be sure to check it out. You can dow subscribe to the low post now as well as the right time wherever you get your pockets. Ladies and gentlemen welcome to the right time. My name is Bomani. Jones as well think wherever you get your podcast is review gives five stars only give it four stars. I'm inclined to believe you are a hater coming up this episode. We're GONNA talk to Josh Levin a slate. It's a new season slow-burn podcast. We're GONNA. Talk to him about what's going on with that also the NBA bubble, which sounds kind of hilarious but verse. All right guys I am here to briefly advised you not fall for Okeydoke, and there's no shade anybody because I feel like people have kind of fallen foot Okeydoke, but I saw it all over the television yesterday. I believe you saw it also where people were like. Hey, man, the charges. It's about bringing in kind of cabinet four workout. If people got all excited now, I want to start another one. At this point, the idea bringing cavern again for a workout. Don't meet a damn thing. 'cause seattle basically do the same thing a couple years ago. All this. What I might do what to do everything else. None of that matters until somebody actually signs the duke like give me charged about this, but this is how low our standard is at this point, Anthony Land was talking to reporters, and this is what he said about the idea of cabinet player for the charges. You said it would be crazy to not have him on your workout eldest. All right further, he says I spoke with Colin. Not sure where he's at as far in his career what he wants to do, but Colin definitely fist style a quarterback for the system that we're going to be running a very confident and happy with the three banks that I have, but you can never have too many people waiting on the runway waiting on the runway right, do say basically if something happens to eastern stick. Maybe. We'll give Colin Kaepernick a call eastern stick. We'll give them a call. Charges have tyrod Taylor right now as the starter. Just in harbor first round pick is the next guy, and then we get to our man eastern stick no shade eastern stick all I'm saying is if the coaches saying if something happens the eastern stick, we might give Colin Kaepernick a call. That tells me that we're Kinda SORTA far away. You know what I mean. Maybe I'm wrong, but that's what it tells me right in there. Do they not gonNa do it. Have you seen anything from any owner to indicate that there's any level of Banda coming on this right like? Have you seen that? Can Go budge right, and here's something that I think is important. If we're talking about the owners and the fact that they're not going to budge my belief at the Nagano Burge, it's important to know why, because when this was all going on like 2017 when it was really cracking on keeping cabinet out of the league, there were two things that people talked about number. One was the idea that this would be grossly offensive to fans right? That's their big thing I. still haven't seen any evidence of it, but number two was. Nobody wanted to draw the I R- of the president. Okay that was a huge part of it and look if you worked in media any place that was forward facing and you had a twitter account the one thing that you learned in two thousand seventeen twenty eighteen thing that scare job losses as much if not more than anything else was the idea that president trump will tweet about you, and now everybody's days ruin now. Everybody's saying is messed up money. Give stock prices. Go fall all of this stuff on the basis of Donald Trump, sending a tweet. People. Don't seem to be as worried or shook about trump senator tweet at this point. He don't scare people now the way that he used to scare people. That's worth noting, but on top of that listen to Donald. Trump had to say on Wednesday when he was asked about the idea of Colin Kaepernick kneeling. Clear about this. He was asked about kneeling. Let's go when it comes to sports and kneeling. Do you think Colin Kaepernick should get another shot in the NFL? If he deserves it, he should. If he has the playing ability he was, he started off great, and then he didn't end up very great. In terms of as a player he he was terrific and his rookie year I think he was very good in the second year. Then something happened so is playing wasn't up to snuff. The answer is absolutely I would as far as kneeling I would love to get another shot, but obviously has to be able to. To play well if he can't play well I, think it would be very unfair. Okay, guys. Let's stop and think about what happened there. Like Donald Trump says he says the CADA cap predicts should have another chance in the league if he could play, he was asked about kneeling whether he should come back and don't forget guys. Trump is the guy that said we need to throw autumn. Sons of data the league remember that right like wouldn't that his thing that we need to throw all the sons of the League. Just because they were nearly. You notice that he's backed off that rhetoric. Think about this for second. Donald trump isn't even banging. The drum of how disrespectful kneeling is anymore. He's not doing that. Okay, so the owners argument behind this as it's been given to us, has been hey man. We don't WANNA fin. Trump and we don't want to offend our fans right by the those people that they don't WanNa make mad and that's why they don't WanNa. Get Down with this. Okay. Coup trump doesn't seem to be bothered in the whole public discussion around all these matters seems to have changed and you. You still not hearing about anybody wanted to bring Colin Kaepernick got with their requires from us as media. If any of you guys ever get a chance to actually ask an owner a question, right if you're not afraid of the backlash or at the backlash is not what you thought it was going to be if we have all these people getting clear indications that the backlash ain't really something that you gotta worry about. Then, why aren't you doing? We've stripped out all the nonsense right. We've stripped out all the noise. We have winnowed away. Everything that's around the core issues data here and now you can ask yourself. So why doesn't Kinda, Kaffir Nick Job? And why won't somebody seem to give him a job? And for how many of the owners is the reality that? I don't like what he had to say. Like that's it not about money. Right not about PR. How many of them just didn't like what he had to say. You know and hey. I do think there's some of them might be afraid of their fans for example shod con in Jacksonville. Right. Don't exactly know how that goes over. And this is worth note and I'll put this out here. This is something that whitlock reported like fifteen years ago. Somewhere in there right? Give them credit because he's the one who said you're remember when by left, which David Garard, where would you jaguars? Their whole depth chart was black dudes at quarterback had three black dudes at quarterback. Also, had a black general manager who was a pioneering quarterback, worth note but anyway. The reason to will report that they did that was so that the fans wouldn't stay screaming for the white. Dude that was on the bitch that the only chance that black quarterback had in that place was that there was another black quarterback behind him. Otherwise the noise would be to laugh right so that's separate from Kapernick adds a political issue. It just recognition of how that team seems to think it. City is going to react on these matters, but if the issue is simply that these owners didn't like what he said, who the snowflakes now. You know everybody who gets caught up in that logic, and all those discussions and everything else who snowflake now if that's the reason, why do not in league or at least getting a chance? Because I think there is some measure of legitimacy to the argument that capture nick has played in years. However. It's a lot to do in the NFL Wayne played in years like. Lot Of dudes thing about somebody gave chase Daniel like seven million dollars when he had thrown basically any passes in the NFL right because they start, he would be such a great option as a backup Chad Hindi. WHO BACKS UP Patrick Mahomes out here? Really been throwing a whole lot of passes in the last ten years or anything like that right? The been there go around. Go find. These guys is lots of dues in the NFL. who eight throwing a pass anytime. Lot of that, don't sound like. Hold up to meet here, remember. They got Josh mccown while he was coaching somewhere. I, remember quarterback. It was recently we had played, who said if somebody came and holiday at him and asked him if he'd be willing to come back and play football. Now man, these owners apparently. Didn't like what he had to say or they didn't like the fact that he did it without permission. Either way goes every argument that they had football or otherwise as to. Why can't signed capper? Nick has gone out the window. All we're left with is whatever the reason is that y'all won't sign cabinet and you'll never get any of them to say it out loud. Because that's when they start telling all themselves. I'm an NBA GONNA. Try to these games in his bubble. By the way, can I talk to some of Y'all sand? Think variety is sell out because I ain't trying to listen to Kyrie Irving first of all. What I think is happening. Here is I. Don't think that people are actually listening to what I say about why I'm not listening to carry on this, and they assumed that my logic is the same as Stephen a Smith or anybody else. Else that they beside if they don't like what those people say about this thing, Kyri my thing is number one. If it is unsafe to play in these deemed to be unsafe to play that they should not play I disagree with the idea that coming back to play, basketball will suddenly take all this attention away from the protest. Right and you want to know a reason I disagree with the now. That I did not say before it's pretty simple. y'All ain't paying as much attention to the protest now as you were two weeks ago and there ain't no, NBA. I don't blame the basketball for that right. If you want to pay attention and give that your energy thing you can do that. You can do it or watch basketball games on the same night. Whatever it is, it can't be done, but the level of interest that people are going to have and what's going on in the streets, I don't think the presence of basketball. Basketball going to affect that like if I thought they Kyri was right in the coming back to play, basketball would truly take away from what's going on outside the now. We'll be right behind him I. Just don't think that's correct like if he was correct, I'd be like and make the decision y'all GonNa lose some money by the way the money part matters like. Money! Don't matter the whole economic structure of the League is at stake with this like I'm not being dramatic. I'm not making that up. That's what it is, so these things have to be very seriously considered, but I'm not just simply like. Oh. Man No I'm saying that you might WANNA consider the economic system as it plays, but more than that. I just don't think that what he saying adds up and you know people. Do you just blaming the Messenger there? Right got a problem with the message. The message that doesn't have a credibility and that's fair for me to say. I would not follow that dude into this. This right so as not to throw that out there, but anyway we find out about what's going to happen with this bubble. Emma I. Point was if it's not safe I. Don't blame anybody for not go. It engaged this. All sounds wild unsafe like they sound like they are trying to thread a needle on such spectacular level I. Put it like this. This is one of. Of Two things that jumped out I'm GONNA say to one thing that jumped out to me out of all the puzzles and I'm going to ask you. What jumped out to you because I better not go up that to you. They say they go hang on tables into hotels. They gotta find things Valdis cast. Do have all the decks of cards right shoulder. US Decca Card. Card once and then you've got though it out because you don't want to catch it or anything and I imagine there will be copious sums of money on the table. I would love to see some of these instagram stories of these cats, while they're all lockdown in these fancy hotels, but gave they have paying pong tables, and you can play singles. Ping Pong, but not. Yet you can play basketball with someone in touch the same basketball, but. Stand next to them. Can Ask you this other question. Do you know anybody that plays Doubles Ping Pong. That's not a professional. That sounds like something that kids do in high school. The only way get everybody to participate is to play doubles just because it's a numbers game, yes, I don't know anybody who owns four paddles held a boys club got two paddles per tape, and one of those paddles is actually a good pedal that is correct. Yes, but there nobody's equipped with doubles pink Paul, but anyway yeah, you could play singles, but you cannot play doubles. Doubles I just found that to be hilarious. was anything else that jumped out about the bubble proposal? Will what I originally thought was that guests were not going to be allowed on the worldwide sports campus, but that's actually not true. Guests are going to be allowed onto campus after the first round of the playoffs is completed to be allowed onto campus guests. We'll have to self quarantine for a week then quarantine in be tested at least every other day for three days in the home market or outside the NBA campus in Orlando. Upon entry into the bubble? Guess, we'll have to quarantine be tested every day for four days. Anyone who test positive must self isolate these guys go be tries to take him in the back door. bag where we had a visitation restricts is in college. Will I mean? What do you think of the anonymous tip line Berry go? That is the one that's been very. Very. That's what I thought you go get to the snitch line like they had this. With Michael Jordan was playing. How was snippy with? Michael Jordan be doing in the name of winning at all costs. None of us this is the top line of stitching. WHO's going to out here about away I? Don't blame these cats for snitching. I'd be snitching anybody that I could snitch all absolutely I am shook. Man I'm out here looking outside, y'all stop caring y'all stop giving a damn y'all just like if I die. I Die Riley air by design here, acting like something change just because it was summer, nothing changed. Nothing change we are not out of the first way that thanks still wave at heart is hill if I saw somebody out here, brigands. Rules you Dan Right up snitching. If no other reason because I'm hating right up staying in here, doing what I'm supposed to do. I am going to tell on you. You better believe I'm telling you whoever it happens to be. Who GonNa be like the number one snitch? I can't wait to find out. What are we find out that KUWATA SNITCH? I wish we could get tapes of those calls Lebron. What about Lake Yeah well, hold on hold on a whole lot of another level. Who's going to be the guy that snitch on somebody on his own team? Because he just don't like him with or not, a player matters to like the will of championship. Yes, someone that can be sacrificed. Would you snitch on your own teammate to get out of something? Yeah, self report, you know. There was a party over in the yacht club and It wasn't me, wasn't me? My teammates and they add these girls. There wasn't promise right to go point. Let's think about this, too, so we talked about who car gains West is some gambling. They need to keep them ATM's in the lobby. Livestock like the casino good. He's going to cash gamble with it. Automate they go up there by the way cast. That's a great way to catch it. It, but anyway they go be there without a gambler and other thing as many people have heard they loosening up the drug restrictions, and they say and do it. No more drug tested they do drug tests for like trolls and for steroids, but it's there. They go test for marijuana. The happiest place on Earth is going to be the HIPPIE EST place owner. is going to be about highest place owner. You gotTA budget due to an allowed to do nothing, but sit around with each other, and it's personal chefs, and they got access to all the food and playing cards and stuff. WHOA. Wait I'd like I don't know how much we have the smoke into hotel, but somebody to call on you. They say that you're not allowed to smoke weed at Disney hotels, but they're not going to test. We tell you some about hotel hotel looking for any reason whatsoever. Not Knock on your door about that. We'd you smoke if not from what I've heard was. Somebody's cats might want to consider is getting a whole bunch of dryer sheets I myself have not engaged in that activity, but that's what I've been told. I'm just telling you know. Who's going to be the guy that's really that hater? There's like I can't believe is next door to me smoke a week because they're going to be smoking. A lot of we outerwear, they go get from though yeah, because you can't have any guests in there, which means that rich Paul is not on the invite list good point. Let Me Day, we. Go. See Facility. A whole lot of packages be sent from the following places Oregon. California perhaps even the District of Columbia. There's some real legs survivor type things going on here to where the last person that's there. You're in this godforsaken place that you don't want to be right. Yes, by winning the championship in making it to the finals. How miserable are these people going to be after this tournament? Man? Yeah, it'll be the happiest champions ever right how his? It'll be the happiest champions ever. How mad would you be if you lost the finals in game? Seven at you got cramped up for three and a half months only hoping to win a title just to Lubes. Nothing. For nothing for nothing whatsoever like at the get to the final that lose game seven by the time honest said and done. JANAS IS GONNA hate out of dudes on the team and all dues of the team are going to hate him, 'cause they've been around nobody but each other for like three and a half months. Did you think it was kind of weird that potential championship contenders are all shacked up at the same place. There's almost like a hierarchy of these teams are getting set up. That is true Pelicans or in the yacht club grand whatever lakers. Clippers Raptors bucks. Bucks Yeah. I remember they had to find some way to like. Recreate like homecourt advantage. You know what I mean, and so they are rewarding. The teams that performed with the nicer accommodations tate is let me tell you who went to be staying down. Yacht Club Lebron, James that would abide to be. It also want to see like what players getting like the presidential suite. All these hotels, not all the rooms are the same. Yes, from what I've gathered to. It's not like some of these accommodations are necessarily the nicest year old. Is it going to be a step down? This ain't the four seasons now is. About to find out just how Buji they have become, who will be the first one to order his towels off Amazon right? Oh not on on ninety some a little bit more luxurious than this. All these cats are going to be wearing. Nothing but team issued gear. They go send the game systems. I imagine that's going to be coming. Through is going to be wack. Ain't none of I'M GONNA. Have Good Stereo well. Who's going to be the person that listened to a stereo? Too Loud, right? At night with his music too loud like it's a dorm. You'RE GONNA family man in one suite. This war another thing, too. That's a little weird is to your point about the dorm environment a lot of these players when they're done at work. Home. That's private right? Yes, they're going back to a time in their lives. When very little is private because you're in close quarters with everybody, so imagine all of the different little routines and stuff that people like Lebron do in the privacy and sanctity of their own homes that are going to be on front street now. Yes, yes, yes, yes, OH, man! Let's be honest about this. Airbus needs to notice all right. These cats live different social lives. Shall we say? Then the rest of us. Would you like to hear a story? This will give you the best indicator that you need about how different these guys! Social lives are okay. True story won't take a player won't take a location, but a friend of mine was walking with an NBA all star, after some like charity event or something like that as Walker with him, and that all star is about to get in a cab and go to his hotel and ask. He's about to get in a cab to his hotel. These three women pull up in a car in one rolls down the window and says. Hey. What I have a foursome. At which point that all star? Thought about it. Shrugged his shoulders and said. All right. And then. This was not an exciting thing to find out right. This was not his lucky day. This is the cottage that comes up all the time in his life, and that dues going to be stuck in a hotel with a bunch of his partners, perhaps for three months with no visitors. It's go be a Lotta dues. Doing pushups in these hotels is gonNA be a budget. dudes riven fold books in have. A porch. A Lot, 'cause the live that they live a totally different than the lives that most of us live totally different. It's probably been hard enough as it is, but holy totally totally different, those scenarios are be popping up. The same way also WANNA. Say Some right fast because I've seen people. Bring this up i. saw somebody mentioned wants all the tweets and they were like yeah, Oh man. What's going to happen if people start protested? At Disney right show up to the gates at Disney protests. Let me tell you what's going to happen if that happens. Some people are going to suffer very sad face at the happiest place on Earth Right now as you may know. I work for Disney I. don't even think about it that way just to be clear, but that feels like a full disclosure. This is the only thing that you need to remember about Disneyworld in north. You know this. Did. You know that there is a no fly zone over. Disney! Yes, I'm familiar with that. It has long goal been decided that it ain't. GonNa be no Ruckus at the happiest place on Earth. that. Call was made a long long time ago. That ain't happening at the happiest place on Earth Angle. That's going to be the safest place owner Ainhoa. Buddy, getting into that bad boy, no body at all is going to be a bunch of grumpy MBA players, who by the end of this if don't work out for you in the League? Maybe you can make the Olympic pain policy right? Maybe that maybe that's what somebody's casts the thirteenth fourteenth man. Start thinking about your next career. Get your forrest gump. All you can, you can meet the president. You can go to go to China. All of that stuff is no bring Daryl Morey which you. Now like you? It is that time a week where we bring on guest joining us now. He's doing the slow. Burn podcast with slate. Last year. We had Joel Anderson on a slow burn was about big in to pot. This season is about the political rise of David Duke who I'm sure. A few of you have heard of joining us. Now's the host of this season as Josh Levin a slave Josh. How are you I'm good? Thanks for having me now man. It is great to have you so I. Wi- David Duke this season, I grew up and New Orleans I was born in one, thousand, nine hundred. And so dukes political rise in the late eighties and early nineties. Is a huge thing in my childhood. It's like I don't have a photographic memory. I'm not that kind of person, but I do still have the strong kind of sense memory of that period of the feeling of kind of dread and confusion around Duke of seeing the signs everywhere, and it's been something that's stuck with me for my whole life, and I have always wanted to go back and try to understand what happened during those years would also imagine like in that time being from New Orleans and being Jewish. Of seems like almost a counter, intuitive existence, and then a real live like Nazi basically is now running for governor at the time I imagined. The people around you wait a minute. WHAT YEAH I mean! I think as a white person in America, especially coming up. Pretty well to do background you can feel like politics doesn't matter as a kid. You can be like pretty naive about things and this was a way. I think that naievety got stripped away like. Ending that these elections could have serious consequences for the state and the people who live there including my family, and also just wondering you know as a Jewish person in a place where there aren't that. Many Jewish people just feeling like do actually belong here. Is this really my home to people? Here? Want me to be here and so yeah I. mean all that stuff was kind of in the air now one thing of course, the name of this slow burn thing would do that. You know I'm three episodes into it now. I went ahead and got the plus a subscription, so I think consoled as quickly as I possibly could, but it's certainly inappropriate. Inappropriate title for dealing with Duke because I think that at least for me, I remember when do popped up in the late eighties and early nineties on the same age as you and it seems like Oh, my Gosh, this just popped up out of nowhere, but in reality this had been building basically says he was Lsu in the seventies. Yes, so he is an ego maniac and he thought he was to beat president so just like getting in the runoff for the Louisiana. Governor's race has kind of come down for him, but he was running for office as far back as the nineteen seventies when he was a clansman and he wanted to build. A movement around. White anger something he tried to do in various ways, his whole life, and the only difference in the political run in the late eighties, was that he in a disingenuous way kind of swore off the clan past swore off the Nazi sympathies that he'd expressed openly in the seventies and kind of became a more racist Ronald Reagan, and that was a formula for success for him. Now I think the question for me. At least it seemed in the way that I took it in hearing. Hearing is that it was very interesting that he was kind of overt about. Hey, yes I'm the clansman and then Ronald. Reagan came around, and Kinda messed that up for him, completely because he looked at Reagan was actually adopting a lot of the things like fundamentally that he was saying, but dress them up much differently. A guy like Duke couldn't survive politically in an era where Reagan figured out how to code this stuff more elegantly. Yeah, I think that's exactly right and I think. Duke use the clan in some ways. It was savvy and other ways. I think it limited him. Because he recognized that in the nineteen seventies, the clan was its reputation deservedly so as abominable across all demographics in America after the atrocities of the fifties and the sixties, and so he recognized that by kind of taking up that mantle, and associated himself with the clan, he would make himself infamous. He would make himself somebody that people would be interested in who who is this young guy in a suit saying he's a clansman. We've got an interview this guy, but that also just put a ceiling on his possibilities. You know the number of people that would go to a Klan rally, you know. Know, even in the most racist parts of the country. There's a ceiling on that. You're not gonNA even people who might sympathize with his views on his vision. They're kind of smart enough to know that. If you're like a middle class professional, you know it's probably best not to be seen in an event like that, and so you know by the time that Duke recognized that and tried to shift I, think he still had this association and this connection that would make people suspicious of him, and rightly so you know forever and correct me if I'm wrong, didn't he kinda sorta like just kind start up his own chapter of the Klan like it wasn't like fully attached to the clan clan. Yeah I. Mean it feels a little weird to criticize him and be like you know he wasn't a real. He wasn't a real authentic landon. There is a bite in the show and episode to where he has this debate with Jesse Jackson and Jackson's final kiss at the end like you're not even a legitimate clansman. Duke Starts His own Chapter Knights of the Ku Klux Klan in one, thousand, nine, hundred, ninety three, and I think that's the thing that I didn't. Know until I started researching this and I think a lot of people don't know. Is that like when you say? The Duke was the grand wizard or Grand Dragon of the KKK, he just made that up. It's not like there was some big vote or like, since eighteen sixty seven, or whatever like there was this tradition and it got passed onto him. He just decided. decided like I'm a Klansman now and I'm GonNa. Make myself a leader and people bought it, and I think the where I find this to be very prescient for right now and I imagine correct me. If I'm wrong, part of why this story jumps out as things like a great one to do right now is would do. Did we have seen other people pull off. Which is the idea that? If you put a stark raving racist in a suit, the suit makes them respectable. And now all of a sudden he's treated as somebody whose views have to be tolerated, but actually consumed as though they are of some measure of dignity that we saw this Richard Spencer three or four years ago where he decided to put himself in a suit, and now all of a sudden, he's been featured in the New York tops. Yeah, for sure I mean. You could see that in the seventy s when Duke was actually. In the clan where his first national. Platform was on the tomorrow show at Tom Snyder in nineteen, seventy, four, when Duke was still at Lsu and this was a show that. was like on at one am on the east coast and really wanted to be edgy there. Booking guests who they think will get attention and so yeah. It's like clansman in a suit. Let's give him a plane ticket. You know to to come out tar set, and we'll have a on, and that gives a platform of audience of three million people to air his views. But I think you also saw it. In the late eighties and early nineties, you know he was not only wearing a suit when he was out campaigning in Louisiana, but when he wins the state rep race and the all white New Orleans suburbs. He actually not only does he have the suit then he has a platform of being an elected official, and so then based on the norms of our media when somebody is A. A politician, then you kind of treat them in a in a certain way. You put the Lake Republican Louisiana Prentice behind their name. They had it converted to kind of legitimacy on him. That you know gave him the standing that he needed to run for higher office, and I feel like it put him in a place. I always say that one thing that's important understand about race in the public discourse. Is that largely among white people races the discussion that they have between each other right like black people are kind of a topic of discussion, but. But. It's really about them right. It's this group of people versus group, White people versus this group of white people in one thing. I know he goes an episode to something that do kind of weaponized was the idea of saying out loud to people who were more left leaning than him. Basically Oh. You don't like them any more than we do right like you don't WanNa. Live with them any more than we do, and so it seems like his campaign again was less about any specific policy political notion as much as just really I'm tapping into whitens. For sure and the guy that he ran against eighty nine that he beat. Was John Train who had been in the segregationist states' Rights Party back in the day, and what Duke? Said was and I think this was really powerful for the people that voted for him like this guy doesn't believe anything any different. Than I. Do you know him saying that? He has changed his stripes. That's no no different than what I'm saying. The only difference is I'm being honest with you about what I believe. Whereas this guy is saying the same things that I'm saying behind closed doors, and so duke was trying to make an argument about authenticity, and that I'm being real and all these other people. Are Fake and I think he tried to normalize racism in that way like like come on white people. We all are talking about all this stuff like I'm just a you know the one who's open about it and admits it and I think for people who were openly racist or people who maybe were kind of inching in that direction I think he made them feel safe and comfortable and their viewpoints. And I think he started with this message that he thought would work. But you know you need affirmation whenever you. Basically he's apologised is no different than people who create content. Whatever right like you think you've got a good idea, but you have some moment that turns it over. You're like man. I think this thing is really catching on and I. found it interesting that for Duke a trip to Boston. Yeah, so he goes to Boston. In Nineteen, seventy, four as the busing crisis is really getting underway You know the first day of school in Boston. South Boston September nineteen seventy-four. There's white adults and children engage in mob violence against black students who are being bused there and integrating schools and Duke sense saying you know racial conflict. He's like I'm GONNA beyond the next plan from Baton Rouge she goes up there and says the people in South Boston our American heroes. This is the new American revolution, and you know the government is forcing this. Integration and immigration is bad. We should be separate and the reception that he gets there. He doesn't get any kind of attention from the media doesn't get attention from public officials, but there is this kind of grassroots response to him in South Boston and just like again. This guy is saying what we believe and they're kind of like egging each other on the crowd. Crowd Egging Dukan say racial slurs Kim standing up on a car and proclaiming white victory. I mean it's. It's a kind of terrifying scene to think about, and also wonder with him, and this wasn't really so explicitly stated, but it's something that I talk about all the time which is always say that any state in America if you make it forty percent. Percent Black ill startling like Mississippi real fast right like that is the driving factor in this and people have this assumption about the south is being a south the south as more racist than other places in the country. When I think reality, the South just has a different threat because of the demographics and the population numbers, but always wondered with Duke for him to. To, get out of the South and realized that it was resonating same way that had to be the moment that just unlocked something for him I think that's right and I think in the late eighties there was this debate about whether Duke was a creature of Louisiana or whether this could happen anywhere the novelist. Walker Percy actually had a good quote about this. In an interview. And? I think it was June nineteen eighty-nine nine where he said you know the people outside. Louisiana like to think we're all like rednecks and Yahoos down here, but this could happen and Chicago. This could happen in Queens and I think that you know people like to look down on. You know whether it's Louisiana Mississippi and rightly so. And a lot of ways, but it's no accident that you know. There are lots of examples of like Martin Luther King going to Chicago and saying never witnessed more resistance than he did. When you know marching for housing there or you know what Saen Boston during the busing crisis and and Duke was received very very well there that was an and I try to be careful about this Boston is so easy to pick on Boston. Mississippi of the North decided to talk about somebody being raised. We just out to Boston, but that's seeing that you describe Austin was like Oh my goodness. What's really going on? Even the Red Sox now are saying that Boston is racist so I think it's gotten. Affirmation affirmation from the highest levels of Massachusetts Loyalty Yeah. They didn't trust them. In the spotlight team city. Right like I was I was so amazed at the spotlight team was like fine guys. We'll look into this and see what we can come back with. They came back with everything. Everybody has been saying about us is. Yeah I saw that. You tweeted out of Bonnie just about some of the the stats from other ninety as from the ninety one. Governor's race and the thing that's so interesting to me conceptually and how to. Just, looking back and thinking about how to feel about the duke phenomenon so in ninety when he loses on that Senate race, you get forty four percent of the vote gets sixty percent of the white vote in Louisiana and the governor's race. He loses in a landslide to Edwin Edwards but fifty five percent of the white vote. How do you think about those numbers I think about those numbers and. And I mean it's worth noting trump the majority of white voters of every demographic in America. Basically at every turn part of that's in line with the fact that Republicans get the majority of white votes in just about every election that you wind up. Having sixty percent of the white vote in Louisiana was kind of staggering when you looked at now. Of course, part of southern voting behavior does basically. Basically has to do with white people voting against integration right like it's a long continued history of they for black populations in the south to be as large as they are. In those states, still be read means all the white people are voting in the same direction so as disturbing. It's kind as it is the idea. The David Duke with eighty five percent of the white vote in one of. Of those elections, it's also kind of interesting that forty five percent of people were just like Oh. Hold on now. This is just a little little too far and I wonder from those people is was that a rejection fully of his views or did they find him to be embarrassing? Because one thing southern very concerned about is how they look relative to everybody else on these kinds of things. And the governor's race there was definitely some of the ladder and a an appeal there was really effective was from the business community that said it's going to be catastrophic like we'RE GONNA lose convention business. The New Orleans we're GONNA. Lose. Tourism you had people like Bobby Bare. The Saints Quarterback, then cutting an ad, not calling out Duke specifically, but saying you know there's some cheesy line in there about like you know the black and gold and black and white need to come together to stop racism, and there was this consensus among sort of elite business leaders in the state that we need to come out really strongly incest guy so i. don't know if that particular. Economic argument worked or was the embarrassment thing, but I think it wasn't all necessarily just a repudiation of views. There was some kind of calculation there. This is what facts going to be. This is how it's GonNa make us look I. Wonder How it would have gone if he won right because I. think that there were a lot of people who felt very similarly about trump and I'm not making a direct parallel between those two guys before somebody. Trope the Clinton no I'm not saying that directly right? They obviously have some views that are in line the same way, but I think there were people who were embarrassed by the idea of trump, and then he won, and everybody fell in line like if Duke had one that I really wonder how the people within his party would have been behaved. We saw a little bit of that when he won in nineteen. Eighty nine, and you had the National Republican Party led by. Leon water, who notorious for his cynicism around race, but in this case it's. He was again calculating, but immediately you know. He called it excommunicating Duke from the National Republican Party. They thought Duke of an embarrassment that he was somebody who had make the Republican Party looked like it was explicitly racist in a way that they didn't want to appear whereas in Louisiana. It was more complicated. There were some Republicans in the state who denounced him, but there were others who, while not explicitly saying we support. This guy were also very careful about. Alienating his voters, because Duke, was this runaway train and the people that would vote for Duke. These were potentially new voters. There were being brought into the Republican base is part of this realignment from the old Dixie crat south to the new solidly Republican South, and so there was a lot of very cynical calculation of like. We don't like what this guy stands for, or maybe we do like what this guy stands for. We don't want to say it admitted. Well it kind of to something that I had kind of thought about which is I think we'd agree. Basically, the reconfiguration of the two major parties in America happens in nineteen, sixty four since one, thousand, nine, hundred, sixty four. The Republicans have not elected what I would consider to be. A real live southerner to the Presidency Lake George W. Bush doesn't really count right. He was the governor of Texas, and he had enough of the Twang, but this is still I mean. mean. He's not much more southern than his daddy was, and none of us think of him in that way and by the same token Obama being the exception, the Democrats basically just elected southerners to presidency from nineteen, sixty four on it kind of speaks to the consensus model of American politics. We've got these two parties, and that's kind of convergence to the media and a lot of people that you can get somebody. If you're a Democrat, you can get somebody that's fairly. Fairly liberal, but you kind of need somebody southern in order to sell those people, and if you're a Republican, we can't have somebody that looks too much like the worst of what people associated with us and so I find it very. It totally makes sense that the George W. Bush's are the world and even Lee Atwater who was cynical about race, but also like play Blues Guitar and try to get himself on the board at Howard because he somehow thought he could. Could do both things at one time. That's not the guy that's looking at David Duke like it is future right there like I think they seem to feel like. The future of the party had to separate itself from such a guy. And then interestingly you wind up with trump who again says very similar things to a guy like duke, but the packaging, even as bombastic as he is is different than you get from a do, do totally. I'm glad you brought up. Leon water being on the board of Howard. Because sometimes we you know when you're doing interviews, people ask like what's the. craziest thing you learned and like there's not really any place to put that in a podcast, but David Duke, but I had not known that water is on the board of Howard is just an amazing moment in the history of this country that some set of people thought that this was a good idea. Yeah, till, wasn't I. Don't know if you've ever seen the clip. But what do you show it up on campus? Like for people who have? Have Seen. It is a great documentary on atwater. Called boogeyman this. We're checking out. And what was fascinating about that with their water is add water shows up on campus, and the students are out in full throated protest. Any broke his heart because to him. He just thought this other stuff was politics right? He's like Mattis here playing the blues. I hang out with black people all this stuff. He just thought it was politics and we were like. No, actually that's not what it is at all. He was so proud to be on their board. An airline now, buddy. You guys to go. Back to the Republican Democrat thing you were talking about a few minutes ago. I think the thing that's important to note is that? In all of these races that we've been talking about. There were other Republicans on the ballot, so it wasn't like white people in the state. We're like we could vote for. Democrat who don't like or David Duke the only Republican choice like an all of these races. There were other Republican options, and so duke became the top Republican choice in all these raised now because the party picked him not because he wanted some convention was because the voters mark their ballots for him. They wanted him now. Maybe should've started earlier with this, but I think that. This is very important for people who were not very familiar with the south in general, but not familiar with Louisiana in particular. This is an insane political system that we're talking about. It is stated Louisiana even open saying the right word, but unique definitely fits right like how much of the story of Duke and his rise is particular to Louisiana. Well, there's this open primary system where there's no republican and Democratic primary so everybody kind of. Runs at the same time now. That's the jungle primary system is some people call it. Yeah, you know you only have to think about this for about three seconds to understand their. What ends up happening inevitably? In, the system is that. People from the extremes. Get favored and people in the middle kind of tend to get squeezed out, and so it's a system. That definitely was beneficial to do. It's a system that. Edwin Edwards actually conceived of and pushed through in the seventies when there were essentially no statewide Republicans in statewide office, and Edwards was annoyed, always having to face some lame. Oh Republican challenger, after making it through the Democratic primary, and so he's like it'll be more efficient I can just beat them all at once, not kind of understanding that he was actually empowering the Republican Party and making the Republican Party stronger and so yeah, it's the voting system I think did help him. It is particular to Louisiana, but as far as the electorate goes then I think you could probably find similarities and a bunch of other states. Now, you brought up a man words. I'm sure we'll get more to him. That race for Governor I need to find out who ran Edwin campaign because it involves some of the most hilarious campaign propaganda paraphernalia that you will ever find including the bumper stickers that said vote for the Crook. It's important. We will get in the in the podcast later episode to wear vote for the Crook came from, but we're still working on it on the remaining episodes, but you brought it up, but every person that we interview no matter what we're talking about no matter who they are. What kind of aspect of all of this involved in has said you remember that slogan from Nineteen Ninety one vote for the crooked important. It isn't one of the most. Memorable, ineffective and evocative slogans I think in American political history. Have there been people to run against each other. who were more self aware about what exactly it was that they were doing. I think it'd be hard to find another to some like them. I mean they're both really into gambling Edwards. Known for his one liners talked about how they were both wizards underneath the sheets, so you know there are a lot of differences, some maybe superficial similarities, but I think easy to understand if you can think back like why the runoff between them in November nineteen ninety-one would become this huge national story, an international and national media would descend on the we because you not only have the possibility of clan guy becoming governor of Louisiana you also just have Edwards as one of the most memorable characters American politics now in your research. What do you think is probably the most surprising thing that you've stumbled upon other than water at Howard yes I, guess I wasn't as aware. Of the connections between Duke and Nazism and it probably wouldn't be a surprise, but I think it's still interesting to note that what polling found. Is that connecting Duke with the clan was not like a real winning issue for dukes opponents, because if you're asking a white voters to say. You can't vote for somebody who's in the clan. You're saying. Are you asking me to disavow my father? Are you asking me to disavow my uncle? There's a lot of connections to the clan for a lot of people, but the Nazi stuff was seen as beyond the Pale. And so Duke! Would you know somebody who was an inveterate fabulous Te. Would try to pretend like you know. He hadn't worn a swastika that he hadn't been. Associated with and connected to the American Nazi party and you know I didn't know a thing that I learned from Eli. Book which is that the first time that Duke went to a convention like a Nazi Conference, basically in Virginia the people that the group connected him with for Carpool, were don black who would later found storm front, biggest racist website in America and this Guy Joseph Paul Franklin, who would become a serial killer who shot and killed interracial couples? Who Shot Larry Flint? Who Shot Vernon Jordan? And so these connections, and how many of them there were? And contrasting that with dukes later like disavowals. That was something that was pretty stark to me. Well, how complicit is the media in this and I say that because the media's had this dilemma about what to do with Donald Trump when he says things that are not true, says things that irresponsible whether or not, you should put them on television or broadcast, and simply because he's the president of the United States and it sounds like a lot of people were just couldn't David Duke on TV like you say because there's A. Suit without thinking a little deeper about that. Yeah, I think the Tom Snyder is a really good example of. The arrogance of a lot of media around these issues because I think there can be inflation where people think that because somebody's views or so wrong. And so evil, that means that we can beat them in a debate. When that person's been. Thinking about this stuff and preparing for their entire life, and maybe you as Tom, Snyder. Like the day before you interviewed. I mentioned one guest the it was like a blind man who opponent pornography censor I mean like this guy was not prepared to deal with David, Duke, and so I think a lesson there is that if you choose to give somebody like this a platform, you need to know what you're doing. You need to understand the gravity of that and you need to be prepared and I think there are some instances of of media. who were prepared for Duke and who treated him a lot differently than than Snyder did. And so I think he was a creation of the media, certainly in the seventies and I think it's a harder question. The debates that emerged in the late eighties and early nineties, Alec if we cover this guy, are we giving him oxygen, or is he just a really big threat and it would be responsible all. Of us to dig in and do a lot of reporting right fast. We have some audio from this and a bit of a sports tie in This is College Temple Junior, who is his son? Garrett? Temple plays in the NBA plays for the nets, but he was the first black player at Lsu in basketball, which did not happen. It's on one, thousand, nine, hundred, ninety, one that surprising for me to find out looking it up as guys the here. Junior. Talk about David Duke Experience Collis was seventeen years old when he moved into the athletes dormitory. He lived with more than one hundred young white men. There were tense times when I was around. These guys because they weren't feeling comfortable with me and I knew that the majority guys weren't necessarily incident being there. Some of them are social outlet candidly in terms of who communicated with the most. Were actually people cleaned up the dorm that I lay of then the janitors. And the people cooked. Temple, also spend time hanging out with other black undergrads at lsu student. Union. To get there, he had to walk past campus hotspot. Free speech was USA. Identifiable area where people just got up and expressed how they felt and people talked about. Some of everything all the social ills throughout this country. Students at free speech alley spouted off about the dress code at Lsu, which forbade women from wearing pants. They got fired up about President Nixon in the Vietnam War and they argued about civil rights. There was one student David Duke. Who was always shouting about the dangers of immigration? He'd be out there talking about why Jews and Didn't that. Be a part of our society as basically what it came down to. Stop and listen. Stopping listen. And tell him he was fully. That's a lot. Yeah. And I was really glad to be able to feature calls Temple Junior. WHO's a really incredible guy and somebody whose? Life Story and his story at Lsu kind of. Exposed just by juxtaposition. The absurdity of dukes claim that it was white. People are the ones who are really being discriminated against. When you look at them next to each other, you can see how absurd that is. All right now last thing I want to ask you why we got you at I'm going to be very difficult to do I understand, but I want you to give it the old college try. Can you try to describe our man? Harry Lee in one cents. I'll give you two very powerful chinese-american Sheriff who claimed he couldn't be racist because he was Chinese A. Right-wing about way leans in on the notion of the sheriff is the most powerful man anywhere that there is I never heard anybody talk about himself. Be Allowed order the way to here. He talked about it here. A guy who financed a Mardi gras float that had the design was his face and would go on the float. Every Mardi Gras and throw dolls himself to the adoring crowd, so somebody with no shortage of ego, but who, in these New Orleans suburbs where the? Dukes base was. Was a guy who kind of enforced. This idea of you know I'm. GonNa make this place, comfortable and safe for white people and he was a very important. Figure to understanding that environment I listen to podcasts typically on one and a half speed, and I gotta go back and listen to that episode because I need to hear that man talk. Like a you, you put all of those things together I. Need to hear that man. Yeah one of many fascinating figures and slow-burn season for. Right, so you guys are still working on the project. It's great so far right so I. Guess we're going to. How far into Dukes journey are you going to go with the last three episodes? So I'm going to go through the governor's race and ninety one and I think it's you know my preference with projects like the and with the first three seasons of slow-burn burn is to really inhabit that particular period of time and not really carry it forward. Into, what's happening now? Just because I think one of the. Kind of central precepts of of the show is that we don't know how stuff is. Get end up when we're living through what the consequences are going to be and I think you know I find more powerful just as a listener or reader F. you're trusting the audience to kind of draw the lines and make the connections themselves rather than me coming on at that and being like look at what's happening now you know like. Can you see it? Is a Jazz Levin Checkout. Slow Burn. This season is on David Duke in his political career. Please check that out I'm three episodes in. Check it out. Slate I am loving every bit of a man, and thank you so much for joining us really appreciate it. Thank you appreciate all right. No Problem Ladies and Gentlemen I joining us here on the right time. We do this thing a couple times a week Aman gay essay. And how does everything behind the scenes? Thank you, sir, remember, subscribe to the right rates. Review was given five stars. You only give us. Cloud to believe you are hater. Guys a couple of days take it easy. Thanks for checking out the right time with Bomani Jones podcast. You can listen or subscribe on the ESPN APP Apple, podcasts or every listen to podcast the right time with Bomani Jones.

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White Supremacy in America and David Duke

People of the Pod

45:16 min | 9 months ago

White Supremacy in America and David Duke

"Hello and welcome to people of the pod brought to you. By Hac each week we take you beyond the headlines and help you understand what it all means for Israel and the Jewish people. I'm seventy KOGEN and I'm on Uber. Sheer cashman. Earlier this week during the first presidential debate president trump refused to condemn white supremacy today on this podcast I talked to the creators of two other podcasts worth tuning into both shed light on the rise of white supremacy here in America it's appeal it staying power and its role in American politics. In two thousand seventeen while covering religion in. Chicago I interviewed Christian Pitch Aleni a recovering neo Nazi who three decades earlier had been a leader of the American white supremacists movement. His journey was astounding. I could've spent another year talking to Christian had done. So I would have had a much better understanding of how a wave of hate energized Americans back then and still does today. Thankfully my colleague Chicago journalist Odette Yussef did spend a year talking to Christian and others from that time for the third season of motive a narrative podcast that debuted Chicago's NPR affiliate last month. She's here to talk about what she learned over the past year and what she hopes listeners will take away now full disclosure. Odette is also dear, friend of mine friend. Welcome to the show. Thanks on us to be here. So you know I am green with envy that you thought to pursue this and also very grateful. So how did it come about for you? So I got Interested. In this story a year or two ago when I was working on a story that was focusing on teacher at the Chicago public schools who put together a tool kit to help education no communities fight white supremacy when it shows up at schools and trying to sort of contextualized that within the history of the White Supremacist Movement in the United States. So when I was interviewing this teacher, she told me that she really had actually been doing this anti-racist work for three decades and the reason was that she had grown up on the southwest side of Chicago during A. Time that a guy named? Christian. Peach leaney was actively working to grow the ranks of neo-nazis skinheads. I actually had met Christian socially a few years before that but I didn't know that much of his story. So after I interviewed this teacher, her name is Nora Land Again I went and I interviewed Christian and he revealed to me probably the same very interesting history that he revealed to you on you when you interviewed him and it planted in my head this question of why was Chicago Fertile Ground for recruiting youth in the nineteen eighties and the nineteen ninety S to. The Neo Nazi ideology and that's really what kind of set me off on this whole path. Okay. All right. So you know one of the things that stands out still in my mind perhaps because I have children and I feel like I work all the time is that Christian said he really fell into this. His parents were working all the time trying to make ends meet. They weren't paying attention to him. He was vulnerable. He wanted to get back at them and the also just searching for a place where he felt like he belonged so I just thought that was. Such an innocuous way of getting into such vile movement I mean, can you talk a little bit about who is vulnerable? Who did this movement target? Who Does this movement target now? Yeah. So Christian was quite young when he was recruited, he was fourteen years old, and at the time we saw that that age range fourteen to eighteen years old tended to be the age range that was targeted by people and these were kids that were hanging out on the streets. We spoke to many skinheads not all of them necessarily who were recruited into the Neo Nazi movement. But people who were what came to be known as antiracist skinheads as well. Who fell into the scene just because they were sort of disaffected youth I spoke to many people who were runaways from home people who had been kicked out of their homes. You know some people actually had great relationships with their parents, but they got into punk music because of its sort of anti, Thawra, -Tarian Message So these were kids that were sort of looking for another way, and these were some savvy organizers who came from the White, supremacist movement, and saw those kids as ripe for recruiting. This material really makes for great radio because punk music really does play a huge role in this movement. Obviously, the lyrics differentiate right distinguish between the NEO Nazis head movement and anti-racist. This was actually a discovery for the movement. You know that music could be an effective vector to transmit the ideology because you didn't necessarily have to get into the music because you liked what they were saying you got into the music because he liked the tune. But then over time you might start adopting the ideology. You mentioned the Anti Racist skinheads can you talk a little bit about the skinhead movement broadly and kind of explain how it morphed into something once the Nazis arrived on the same. So the roots of the skinhead movement, actually go back to the UK and there's a lot of writing about how sort of the early skinheads in the UK in the late sixties and in the seventies actually were somewhat diverse. You had you know west Indian skinheads people listen to Scott and reggae music. So it didn't start necessarily as an explicitly racist movement. What happened in the United States was a little. Different from the UK in some ways. So in the US, the punk scene actually was here and out of that the skinhead movement in the US kind of grew as an offshoot and so the first skinheads in the US and in Chicago, which is where I really focused my reporting. We're not racist at all. You know it was a very diverse scene. I had sort of the delight of like speaking. With many black skinheads who were here in Chicago, they have their own, very rich an interesting history and their own sort of unique motivators in some cases for what brought them into the movement, and it really was a place just where people were united because they loved the music. But what happened is there were some people who came from the white supremacy music had heard some of these white power bands. From the UK, the most notable among them at the time was a band called screwdriver and begin basically distributing that music in the skinhead scene in the United States and so that was sort of them infiltrating what was a non-racist seen to plant the seeds and they used that music, and then eventually over time you know there were bands in the US, homegrown power bands that sort of further propelled the movement. And you even told me off line that you even interviewed a Jewish skinhead. There was a Russian Jewish skinhead who was a part of the scene here and he had run away from home. He was just a teenager on the streets and actually he found his way into the skinhead scene because the owner of one of the popular dance clubs here called Madouas took him in and he took a bunch of guys in that had been sort of wandering and they would work at the bar and they got really into the scene. I mean it's so funny because like when I interviewed him, he's still is angry at the Nazi skinheads it was really Formative years for many of these people, it shaped the decisions that they made shape, the people that they became and it still runs deep. I think in many of these people, there's this famous blues brother's clip from the movie talking about the Illinois, Nazis but there's actually truth to that clip. Can you talk a little bit about how Illinois really was a hub for Nazi activity? In the nineteen seventies Chur this clip is the blues brothers or in their car their stopped you know in front of a bridge where there's this demonstration of a bunch of white guys in Nazi uniforms. Standing in line and you know declaring their whatever allegiance to Adolf Hitler and they're facing a crowd of angry protesters who who are basically saying Nazi scum get off our streets there presented in sort of this ridiculous way like these old guys that have nothing better to do than dress in costumes. But that happened in Illinois in nineteen seventy seven. There was a Nazi organization that was based on the southwest side of Chicago that fought to the supreme. Court their right to demonstrate. They were threatening to do this in skokie north west suburb of Chicago. That was home to thousands of Holocaust survivors. That was the sort of thing that Nazis in Chicago did at the time they would choose something that they knew would be provocative that they knew would get national headlines and this one certainly did the fact that there was an organization in the city of Chicago that openly flew a giant Nazi flag unim-. Major Street just shows that there was in some parts of the city a tolerance for those kind of us. You Talk About Clark Martell that's pretty key central character. In this series, you referred to him as the Johnny. Hey or patient zero. If we want to talk about it in terms of a virus, which I think is a very apt comparison. WHY DID HE PICK CHICAGO? So, Clark was a young man who had grown up in billings, Montana, and we looked up his criminal record and there was a really interesting excerpt from an interview that he had done with probation officer in which he said that he had read Mein Kampf as a youth and it really spoke to him and shortly after that, he decided he wanted to move to Illinois to join the Nazi party? And that's where he sort of fell under the tutelage of these older sort of neo. Nazis that were there. But he was a young guy and he was the one that started selling knock off copies of screwdriver cassettes and he was the one that started to go to the clubs in Chicago to spread that message, and then Clark also recruited Christian pitcher. That's right personally, and then what was. His role and the reenactment of crystal in Chicago, and you spoke with a lot of folks from that era who experienced that her. So in early November of nineteen eighty-seven, there was a spree of vandalism on the northwest side of Chicago which has been sort of in the city limits. It's been sort of the hub for the Orthodox Jewish community and there were about a dozen institutions that were vandalized. Most of them Jewish and there were swastikas were painted on synagogue's windows were broken. It was very disturbing, and in the end, there was only one person who was convicted in this event even though the police at the time believed that there were more than one, there were several people that were involved. The person that was convicted was a member of the Neo Nazi skinhead crew that Clark Martell had created in Chicago. Now, Clark himself was never you know indicted for this. He was never charged for this to my knowledge. He was never involved with it, but it did provide the opening that police had been looking for for quite some time to try to see if there were any other crimes that could actually pin on. Clark they actually did successfully do. And then in the most recent episode that just aired, you talk about how they're really was I would say this is the most troubling revelation but you talk about this infiltration strategy that the white supremacists really employed under. Christian back thirty years ago. But is really kind of materializing today and the title of the episode really sums it up boots to suits but can you talk a? Little. Bit about what that means. Yeah. So the Ark of the neo, Nazi skinheads was pretty short we started with telling the story of how they came to be in Chicago and then shortly after they showed up in Chicago it started spreading across the country. There were thousands of Neo Nazi, skinheads, and that may not you know seem like a huge number overall but the violence that they. Were committing on the streets was brazen over time they started to attract enough law enforcement attention and scrutiny that there were some leaders in the movement that started to say okay. Well, this isn't working out for us anymore we need to try different strategy, and so the word went out, grow your hair, take off your boots, put on a suit and get a job with your police. Department go join the military go run for public office. You know you need to be less explicitly racist in what you say, find a message that might appeal to your average American who may recoil at you know seeing an OSCE Tattoo on your arm, find a message instead that might appeal for them. Maybe the confederate flag would be more acceptable symbol in some parts of the country. So, what is the goal of this movement today? You know we're focusing on the organized movement, which is the most extreme of the white supremacists. Right I would say they have two goals I, they want a white ethno state. There's a term that we often see written in news articles called white nationalism, which you may sort of think is like, Oh, they want America they want this democracy, but they only want it for white people. They don't want democracy they want an overthrowing of the US government so they could institute their own ethnos date. That's one goal and the other goal is to really normalize and mainstream the tenets of their ideology and in researching for this podcast, I went back to some archival publications of white supremacist groups back in the eighties and earlier. And in those publications, writers talking about cutting off immigration, stopping legal and illegal immigration things like that. That now have come to be just another policy position that you could have as an American. But at the time they were considered somewhat extreme and so the mainstreaming of the ideology is something that I think there hasn't been much attention paid to that and I think that it is helpful to know what the history of some of these ideas actually is how does the Cunanan Movement compare? I'll preface this by saying that I'm not an expert in Cunanan but I've read what probably many of your listeners have read sort of the basic tenets of what Qa non believers think and the similarities to the neo. Nazi ideology are just stunning. This discussion about a deep state, right? Well, they had a different name for that back when people were avowed neo Nazis and that was the Zog Zionist occupational government. It's the same thing. You know this whole theory that children are being trafficked or even worse. You know if you go back and you read some of the literature that the neo, Nazi skinheads used to read in their cannon things like the Turner Diaries, you know there are themes of cannibalism and of the trafficking of young white children that show up in the literature even back then, and so what I've read when I've read about, you know Cunanan is basically just sort of a a little bit of rebranding of the same old ideas. Well, this is fascinating. I can't wait to hear next four episodes of the series and I really appreciate you coming on the show fun fact, it was someone at AJC, who introduced us many years ago so that's right. Shout out to my colleague. Emily. Sola for doing such a fine matchmaking job. Thank you for having me. The parallels between American politics in two twenty twenty and in the nineteen eighties or striking as our similarities with the campaign of two thousand sixteen. Then candidate Donald Trump declined to condemn support from former KKK grand wizard David Duke, Josh Levin is the executive editor of slate and the creator of the latest season of the podcast series slow-burn over six episodes josh takes. US back to his home state of Louisiana to tell the story of how David rose to political stardom in the nineteen eighties culminating with a presidential run in nineteen eighty, eight Josh is with us now to discuss the rise of the renowned White Supremacist Josh welcome to the show. Thank you so much for having me. Well, thank you for doing this really incredible examination. Of Mister, Duke, let's start with how it came about your family goes back generations in Louisiana. Your great grandfather emigrated there from Eastern Europe. Can you tell us a little bit about your heritage and why that made you want to exploit Duke and his influence? Sure. Yeah. The story that I tell in the first episode of the podcast is about grandfather Lewis, right Who came to Eunice Louisiana in the early twentieth century and had a story there store. The my family had for generations in the small town in central Louisiana and he felt welcomed their my grandmother who grew up there they all had a pretty great upbringing in this small town despite being one of very few Jewish families in Eunice but you know there were. Times when I was growing up where I felt like Louisiana might not be a place that was welcoming for me and my family and people like me there were times when I did feel welcome and I felt like I had a great community in my hometown of New Orleans and the state you know one of the reasons that I was interested in telling. This story was because that feeling of potential dislocation of uncertainty of anxiety was really profoundly important to me when I was a kid, it was the first time I really had a political consciousness and I had kind of a child's understanding of what was going on with Duke and his movement, and it's something now that I'm an adult and a journalist I wanted to. Go back and actually explored in more detail what happened and why it happened. You talk about if I recall correctly the site of Duke working crowd at Lsu's Tiger Stadium and that really was a high point of where you question whether Louisiana was truly your home. I think maybe it was more the crowds reception of Duke Than do himself but can you talk? A little bit about that moment. Yes. So my family had season tickets to Lsu football going back a really long time, and so I really loved L. She football continues love Lsu football to this day would go to the Games when I was a kid and you have this feeling when you're a sports fan of belonging to this community and everybody in the stadium. Home Stadium you're all rooting for the same people you're all rooting against the same people as well. So there's this fellow feeling and you know we're all here in Rome the same team as it were, and so when I saw David Duke making the rounds at Tiger stadium that was profoundly disturbing both because it's David Duke but also because of the reception that he got there in the sense like, okay. Maybe this actually isn't my community may be you know the fact that this appears to be David Dukes. The A lot of the people in this, the stadium that was kind of a revelation to me Well, he's an Lsu alum and you talk about how in fact, that was one of his first platforms was a space on Lsu campus called free speech alley and as you were talking about that and and interviewing a student who had been the moderator of Free Speech Alley, I couldn't help but think about his social media platform and also I'm just curious if the moderator that you interviewed ever kind of looked back with hindsight wishing he hadn't allowed hate speech to be. Shouted in that space did you talk a little bit about that? I mean, there are debates set Lsu at the time about whether you should be allowed to speak he was known on campus as the Nazi because of his you know his neo Nazi ideology expressions of belief and interest in a national socialism. So it wasn't any kind of secret who he was or what he supported at that time. But I think the thing that's important. To understand is that we're in a very different place as a society right now on these issues than we were in the late sixties and early seventies, kind of coming out of Berkeley, the free speech movement was a lot more absolutist back then than it is today and the values were at that moment, it was considered very important to allow any kind of speech even speech especially speech that was considered a porn or was not normative. And so duke was I. Think Taking Advantage of this atmosphere where was considered hypocritical for people on the left to be intolerant of speech in that way but it is a different conversation where it is. Now I think considered to be more of a typical view that there are certain kinds of speech and certain kind of speakers that should not be given a platform. We decided not to interview for the podcast and I explained why because? I wanted to be transparent about that. We felt like we didn't want to give him a platform and we felt like we were airing his views and giving them like if you listen to slow burn if you listen to the season, they'll be no doubt about David Duke Duke is and what he believes well, we also included his responses to various allegations against him. So it felt like we were being fair journalistically but at the same time. I don't think that that's necessarily a straightforward or easy decision. It's the decision that we made and I feel good about that decision and I think it's something that whether you're in a newsroom or you're at a college like it's things that need to be talked about and discussed and thought through. Well, you do talk about a lot of people gave him a lot of platforms you get to the probably about the third or fourth episode I certainly didn't need you identify David Duke I, recognized his voice quite clearly in the audio and I'm just curious. Did you circle back to any of the news anchors journalists people who did give him a platform to ask do you regret doing that? So you know the people that I guess I, did kind of have the most back and forth on about decision making around platforming or not platforming Duke where the journalists at the. Times Fan who went through different cycles in terms of how they approached to going from not covering him at all and thinking that giving him oxygen would be a bad idea. And then when actually becomes a serious candidate for the US Senate and for the governorship of Louisiana, then they made a different decision about okay. Now, we need to cover him less as a politician and more as a threat. Right. There was that debate with Jesse Jackson him and Jesse Jackson moderated by Steve. Edwards in Chicago and I just thought that was fascinating listening to the audio from that and wondering would that happen today? Yes. So I found it surprising. The Jesse Jackson who at that time in nineteen seventy seven was considered to be probably the leading black civil rights activists in America in that moment that he would consent to doing this debate and by implication kind of raising David Duke to his level like they were representing different sides in an Bait, which is you know. I think a very strong argument could be made that that was a mistake by Jesse Jackson to do that. But Jackson does make a thoughtful argument and presentation in the show. He answers that very question and he says that at a moment like this, and this is a nineteen, seventy seven when they're sick doldrums than their, you know white people in America are susceptible to demagoguery like what Duke is representing and so Jackson thought that it was important to speak to dukes potential acolytes directly and to confront these ideas directly. Yeah. Well, bad audio. I think. That was one of the highlights for me was listening to that especially in the context of today's current events. So I thought that was fascinating and Jackson sounds very like it sounds like the stuff you saying is conversation with what's going on in the world today I. mean he says the phrase he says the phrase economic anxiety I mean I think one big lesson in reporting this out and I hope one that people get from listening to the series is that stuff that feels kind of like it's never happened before is unprecedented that there's Historical precedent shopper most everything that we lived through, and it's important to find those stories and understand that other people have lived through a lot of what we're living through now before. Yes. Now let's get back to David Duke? So he's not just a former Louisiana politician he was quite a phenomenon there. He won a State House seat he ran for the US Senate he ran for governor we can't really forget his bid for the White House while most of these were unsuccessful, he did get votes. So why did people vote for him? I think there are different reasons I think that you couldn't vote for duke not understand who or what you were voting for I think his views on his anti Semitic views and his racist views are very clear. So whether you some people voted from because they liked what he was saying on those issues and like what he stood for some people I think we're voting for him thinking that he had changed or despite that but still knowing who had been in the past than who he was and in the present I, do think that a lot of times throughout history and any place in the world. That people just want someone to blame for their problems and Duke, kind of had you know put a name on it and put a label on it that you know the reason they you way people have Louisiana are suffering is because these you know black people are getting are on welfare because black people are getting these government contracts and whether it was because the white people have Louisiana voted from blamed black people or the government for supposedly giving black people advantages that message was really potent and it was a race based message more than anything else. Well you. You talk about history repeating itself and you talk about the picture that circulated of him shaking hands with Art Jones the vice chairman of the American Nazi Party and this is the same Art Jones that ran for A. Seat recently, in Chicago suburb correct. Those correct. Yeah. and. So I thought that was an episode called the Nazi and the Republicans and it, and it tells the story of how really focuses on how one woman try to keep the GOP from becoming the Party of the Nazis and the tough time. She had to get the party to reject David Duke that did not seem to be as tough a task this time around when Art Jones threw his hat into the ring or did you see again history repeating itself well, I think with Duke again, he would just deny everything I think if Duke had embraced being a Nazi than I, think it would have been relatively easier for. The Republican Party to disavow him and distance themselves from, and it's also worth noting that the National Republican Party did very strongly disavowed Duke Lee atwater was the chairman of the Republican Party. She's known as somebody who used race and very cynical ways politically and under his leadership, the National Republican Party. Just in the strongest possible terms said, we're not going to support him we repudiate him we want to excommunicate him. It was more in the state of Louisiana that things were fraud because there was this understanding by state party. Officials that Duke is building a movement here and the people that are voting for him that are supporting him. You know could vote for other Republicans and we don't want to alienate him and you know it's also worth noting Beth. Ricky's papers are in the AJC archive and we were able to. Study them. It's a really it's a great resource. Yeah. That thank you for pointing that out. That's fascinating. You talked about the reason why you did this series You wanted to kind of just explore your own feeling of dislocation and again when interview I really liked and appreciated was the African American professor of She's a biologist born and raised in way. You asked her how she was able to stay. She had been very outspoken about dukes success or close success in elections and I'm just curious if you were satisfied or this series kind of satisfied some of you are just feelings of dislocation. Her name is Michelle Bell Wasser and she was really great and I asked her the question that I had been asking myself and I had asked a bunch of other people, which is just as you said, how do you think about this place as your home when sixty percent of white people in the state voted for him for the US Senate and she talked very movingly about the work that she does you know she's a professor at a historically black college preparing people for careers that someone like David Duke might feel like they weren't equipped to do and proving him wrong. So that she finds out very very comforting and satisfying and I thought that was a great answer and one that had occurred to me but seems perfect and apt, and so I think you know you tell a story like us that is so fraught and you know that there's uplifting things you can pull out of it and there's depressing things you can pull out of it and I think I came out of it at the end. My sense was the reason that David Duke was defeated ultimately wasn't That the people that voted for him were persuaded that they shouldn't do that because I don't think that's actually what happened I think what happened is that people the people that oppose do came out an enormous numbers to say this is not going to happen in our state and we're not going to allow this to happen and so is that an uplifting message about people coming together to stop it or is it a depressing message about the core base of support being on persuadable I don't really know. But I. Think the truth is like an all things the truth is complicated. Well, Josh thank you so much for this opportunity to talk to you about this series and I encourage all of our listeners to find slates podcasts slow-burn and listen to all six episodes. You will have a hard time turning it off. So Josh, thank you. Thank you so much for having me. Now, it's time for our closing segment sh about table talk and joining us at our archambault week is Simone Rodin ends akin the director of AJC Europe Simone when you're talking with your family at your table this weekend, what are you going to be talking about? So. Actually our Shebek Naples started to grow again after dropping corona virus cases over the past month in front. Is once again, getting smaller asked cases is growing again. So Chabad will be small in a small with my husband and children who of course are falling my work closely and still really haven't figured out what I'm doing. For them it seems that it has gone from being constantly in meetings on the plane to mom constantly being on the phone and on zoom more seriously yom. Kippur. We spoke about tissue and our capacity to change the idea that we are not destined to somehow be forever what we are, and so I think we'll continue that topic by speaking about my work and more specifically about my work in France and on Hezbollah. And on my hope that France that President Macron will change. So as you know, France has held the position that has basically consisted of being the main expert, but also the main obstacle preventing you from lifting Hezbollah in its entirety as a terrorist organization. Now, front is, of course, they're doing it just for the sake of doing it but because it has believed, it is right and in the has had the long-held believe that its strategy is basically the right one. This held the believe that listing Hezbollah as a terrorist organization would destabilize Levinson that would prevent France from speaking Lebanon and prevent Franz from having kind of leverage. Now as you know front had a very long in previous relationship with Lebanon. This is why President Macron has invested considerable time and effort on. Lebanon. After the blast in August traveling to Beirut twice and spending really you. Know countless hours with political actors on the ground. And this action human colluded meeting with Hezbollah members of the Lebanese parliament which I obviously wasn't particularly happy about. But and this is the big butts despite all of this effort unfortunately to no avail the French president had said that line and this stat line for the Lebanese actors has basically run out and those who have obstructed. The process are indeed Hezbollah they have according to reports insisted on getting the Ministry of Finance and other vital ministries and basically have blocked any kind of French efforts. So front finds itself in a tough spot micro has invested huge amount of political capital, but the reality is that the strategy over the past fifteen years has basically failed. And it is my hope that President Macron will both realize it and again make the necessary change. Considering Hezbollah as a legitimate interlocutor in the process engaging it's representatives. Lebanon has basically only led to the perpetration of the problem. Lebanon has not become any more stable to the contrary. The situation on the ground has deteriorated. The country is on the brink of basically disappearing. And the danger of a war with Israel is growing by the day as owning legitimacy is derived from opposing Israel. The reality is that Toronto not much leverage has has continued to endangered Lebanon by making regular incursions to Israel, but also by intervening in Syria. And the reality is that France. To bring his law not to block the political process that could potentially save Lebanon. Now much of it has to do with the fact that France and others have refused to admit that Hezbollah cont be influenced than it can't be reckoned with the reality is that it is an Iranian organization that has held a grip on Lebanon for decades it's a state within a state it has used violence and intimidation to gain political power and there's no way it's going to let go of this so very recently there is some Hope that McCall is actually changed at an unprecedented press conference Michael Himself said, and I quote in recent month Hezbollah has maximized its weight by playing on ambiguity am beauity that makes both militia, a terrorist group and apolitical force Hezbollah representatives clarify their position. You cannot claim to be a political force of democratic government by terrorizing with weapons. You cannot be around the table permanently if you do not keep your commitments around the table and unquote. So basically has a conclusion. President Macron has always prided himself of the capacity to change of the fact that he's a young man who has the capacity to change but with chains comes the capacity to look reality in the face, this is the case if you want to change from within ourselves whether it's spiritual or personal, but it's all to the case in foreign policy. It's only by admitting one's mistakes by looking reality in the face even if we don't like it, then one can make the necessary changes. So I hope the change will occur and that Franz will finally after decades of denial confront the issue of his ball. So that will be my Shabat table. Talk? I think my kids will probably be very, very bored. No Simone honestly I think your kids will be proud. Once you explain what you've been up to, they'll realize their mom is doing courageous work. Thank you so much. You pointed out that Hezbollah is a proxy of Iran. Well, my family also will be talking about Iran and our hopes for a more just and peaceful. Existence for the Iranian people because at about table, we will be talking about the Olympics. My son loves the Olympics to this day when he runs a specially fast he shouts Jamaica an honor of Ucla Bolt and Jamaican teammates in two thousand sixteen that Europe the International Olympic Committee banned number of Russian athletes for state sponsored doping diocese also banned Kuwait permitting nine of that country's athletes to compete under the Olympic flag. AJC is calling on the IOC to ban Iran after the execution of twenty-seven-year-old national wrestling champion navid off Cari. Cari was arrested during the two thousand eighteen protests and charged with insulting the supreme leader and waging war against God authorities tortured him into confessing to the murder of a security guard and a kangaroo court sentenced him to death. The. Olympic. Charter specifically forbids retaliation against athletes for political reasons, and this is only the latest abuse of an athlete. Earlier this year Kimia Alisa Day, a bronze medalist in taekwondo, and the only woman to ever win a medal for Iran defected. She had been forced to wear job during the competition and last year judo champion Saturday Morley fled after he defied orders from Iran's regime to lose matches and drop out of competitions so as not to face Israeli opponents. Iran has been banned indefinitely from international judo competitions. The Olympics should consider doing the same there is precedent South Africa was banned from the Tokyo Games of nineteen, sixty, four until nineteen, ninety, two for its oppressive apartheid regime Afghanistan was banned from the two thousand Sydney Games because of the Talibans mistreatment of women. The goal of the Olympic movement is to contribute to building a peaceful and better. World. Goal is to educate. Youth Sport practiced without discrimination of any kind. If its goal is to foster and promote the Olympic spirit. This seems like such a no brainer. So I hope the IOC listens to AJC and makes Tokyo memorable. Once again as a place where the International Olympic Committee upheld its principles, our children are watching the Olympic spirit. That's what we'll be talking about at our Shabat table this week Seffi. What will you be discussing? In today's America, political affiliation is more important to some people than their religion, their nationality, their ethnicity. Their true tribe is either team read or team blue and they know exactly what to think about. Events or even events unrelated to politics by what their favorite politicians and political commentators say about them and woe betide anyone who would say anything negative about their team In today's hyper polarized politics. Someone who criticizes your team must be part of the other team. Is there even another option? This week I saw one person on twitter referred to AJC as quote a Republican Front Group and other call us quote a mouthpiece for the DNC. In both instances, twitter's were angry because we had pointed to objectionable things done by members of team red and team blue. I an organization devoted to ensuring strong Jewish support for the democratic. Party released an ad comparing trump to Hitler and the Republican Party to the Nazis AJC has long believed that these kinds of Holocaust analogies are offensive unhelpful and lead to a diminution of the moral power of the Holocaust. That power should be marshalled help fight antisemitism and hatred not to score cheap political points against an opponent. So AJC spoke out and called for the organization to remove the add by the way. Before this week, we had issued ten similar callouts for Holocaust analogies in two thousand twenty. Nine of them were against. Republicans. But tweet was enough for numerous online critics to attack us and for at least one to call us a Republican Front group. Then came Tuesday night's presidential debate in which president trump refused to condemn white supremacy for demanding that he come out strongly against some of his most hateful supporters we redeemed again by at least one online critic to be a mouthpiece for the democratic. Party. Some people and some organizations call out anti Semitism when it's convenient. AJC calls at antisemitism when we see. It's much less politically convenient, but also it saves Jewish lives and prevents antisemitism for being used as a political cudgel. There aren't many true non-partisans left, but our society has never needed them more. I'll be musing about that at my Chabad Table Shalom. Shalom. So that's You can subscribe to people of the podcast on itunes Google play or spotify, or learn more at JCP dot org slash people of the pie the views and opinions of our guests don't necessarily reflect positions of AJC. We'd love to hear your views and opinions or your questions. You can reach us at people of the pod at E. J. C. Dot born if you like this podcast, be sure to rate it and review to help more listeners find us. Thank you for listening this episode is brought to you by AJC. Our producer is Congo. Our assistant producer is a Tarlac Rats and our sound generic tk Broddrick tune in next week for another episode of people of the Pot.

Chicago David Duke Duke United States Louisiana AJC America Hezbollah Donald Trump David Dukes Clark Martell Lebanon Duke Israel International Olympic Committe US Senate White Supremacist Movement Adolf Hitler Josh Levin President Macron
S4 Ep. 2: Robe and Ritual

Slow Burn

57:55 min | 1 year ago

S4 Ep. 2: Robe and Ritual

"This. podcast contains language that some listeners might find offensive. Collis temple junior was a great high school basketball player. A six foot eight center, he dominated as a rebounder and an inside score. A bunch of big time. Colleges scouted temple his senior year. How was being recruited by the UNIVERSITY CANTV? was being recruited by Nebraska. Oklahoma. And by Colorado, and those are the teams that were recruiting black athletes from the south for the most part. Even though he lived in Louisiana in a tiny rural town called Kenwood. Temple wasn't expecting to hear from the state's flagship university. It was one thousand, nine, hundred seventy, and the lsu basketball team had never had a black player. Temple did. Get invited to join the roster. The man who recruited him wasn't from the admissions office or the Athletic Department. Phone was sitting in the kitchen. I happened to pick it up and. Saying hello, and then he said this is going John McCain. And I said Oh really okay. Told my dad. This person on the phone says he's the governor. And he wants to talk to. John McCain told the templestowe their son belonged at Lsu. The governor said that times were changing, and that call us would be safe on campus in baton rouge. The temple family saw this as a chance to make history and an invitation. That was long overdue. My Dad's attitude was well. We all pay taxes. So? That Louisiana State University could be built, and it's about time that we get a chance to participate in the educational opportunities, because it's the best school in the state. College was seventeen years old when he moved into the athletes dormitory. He lived with more than one hundred young white men. There were tense times when I was around these guys because they weren't feeling comfortable with me and I knew that the majority of the guys weren't necessarily interested me being there. Some of my social outlet, candidly in terms of who I communicated with the most. Were actually people who cleaned up the dorm that I live Dan the janitors. And people cooked. Temple also spent time hanging out with other black undergrads at lsu student union. To get there, he had to walk past campus hotspot. Free speech was just A. Area where people just got up and expressed how they felt and people talked about. Some everything all the social ills throughout this country. Students at free speech Ali spouted off about the dress code at Lsu, which forbade women from wearing pants. They got fired up about President Nixon in the Vietnam War and they argued about civil rights. There was one student David Deep. Who is always shouting about the dangers of immigration. He'd be out there. Talking about why Jews and Niggers should not be a part of our society. That's basically what it. Came down to. Stopping lesson. I stop and listen and I yell and tell him he was full sheet. In the first episode of our series I talked about David Duke the politician. How he triumphed in Louisiana in one, thousand, eighty nine. In this episode I'm going to start two decades earlier when Duke was figuring out who he wanted to become. He became America's most prominent White Supremacist Duke was a campus rabble rouser. Standing on a soapbox, free speech alley he claimed at whites were mentally superior to blacks. He said that Jews were traders and he gave the Nazi salute. People used to call the Nazi yeah. Yeah. Aussie he was he was. He was open about it. That's colleague. Joseph. He was a moderator at free speech alley in the late sixties and early seventies. It was his job to watch the clock. ooh, he never told anyone to tone down their language or pick a different subject. No topic was off limits. And banning an individual student, even a Nazi was totally out of the question. People yell at Speaker people would. Complain or hoot and Holler they didn't like things, but he was given his opportunity. Because you know we are, motto is fair play we have to give people can't speak. One afternoon in one, thousand, nine, hundred, ninety, nine Joseph watched David Duke declared that whites where the master race. When dukes time was up. A black student got on the soapbox. He. Began making a case that everybody everybody's blood same all the same and We all bleed the same blood, so he pulled a knife and cut his finger. And then he begins to call out David and telling David come up to the box. And he obviously wanted to cut his finger I think he even said We'll see you bleed united we the same. David Duke declined to join in on the bloodletting. He later said it meant nothing. Dan that all humans bleed the same color. After, all Duke explained. That's have red blood, too. Long after he graduated from Lsu Duke to reminisce about free speech alley here he is in one, thousand, nine, hundred five. They! HAD PEOPLE HANG ABOUT OFFICE? They were totally awestruck didn't know what to do. They couldn't leave this guy's. Kelly Joseph recalls things differently. I don't remember the David rb any support many body. He was not popular at free speech. Alley and Did. The whole thing was intense. and Dave I mean he was byun that hate. There's no doubt about it. The presence of a black athlete like Kali temple at Lsu was a marker of Racial Progress David Duke was there to remind him that the opportunity he'd earned was provisional. Temple in his black classmates saw. Duke is a threat. Someone they needed to stand up to or shout down to solidify their place on campus. Most white students saw duke as a curiosity or a repetitive bore. dukes performances at free speech alley. The LSU student newspaper said always get back to a commie Jew plot by the black lovers of America against the Good Ole White folks. To spread his message Duke needed a support system. He'd find one beyond free. Speech Alley. As a student at Lsu, do grow letters to the national, socialist, White People's Party. The group formerly known as the American Nazi Party? These Nazis invited Duke to their annual conference in Virginia and suggested that he carpool with two other white supremacists. Here's the author Eli Sas Low One of them was about his age. A guy named Joseph Paul Franklin. The other was about two or three years younger, a guy named Don Black and they piled into this car and started driving. Eight hundred miles up the highway, and over the course of those hours these three kids became really close. Duke Franklin Black Eight Pretzels Listen to southern rock and talked about the biological superiority of the white race. At that conference in Virginia, they met hundreds more people who shared their beliefs. They came away from this Nazi get together, feeling less alone and more resolute. They not only that their ideas were widely spread, they thought that it was possible to have their ideas and live a successful life in this country, and I think that that's something I'd. They all took back to Louisiana with them. David Duke and his two new friends shared white nationalist ideology, but different visions of how to spread it. Don Black would eventually create storm front the largest online gathering place for racists. Joseph Paul Franklin would take it upon himself to instigate a race war going on three year killing spree before getting captured by police. The third man in that car dreamed of becoming the National Front man for white supremacy, the charismatic leader who bring racism to the masses. To become a star. David Duke would need to get on bigger stages than free speech alley and he'd have to Laura, new and different followers. That? He needed a new brand. Before he even graduated from Lsu, he found one. If you've ever seen a member of the K. K. K. with the hotel. You'll get your chance. We introduced Mr. David Duke of the Knights of Kukoc Spine on the tomorrow. Program continues after this. How did David? Duke used the Ku Klux Klan to sell his message and himself. How did he turn black progress into a rallying cry for disaffected white people? and. Why did he leave the clan behind? This slow-burn I'm Josh Levin. Episode to Robe and ritual. Hey there slow-burn listeners. I just wanted to take a moment to say that. If you're a fan of the show, please consider signing up for slate, plus that's slaves membership program this season. We're letting asleep. Plus members listened to the first half of our series on David Duke right away. We'll also have bonus episodes. We'll dive deeper into the history were exploring this season and just always members get to skip out on all ads on all sleep podcasts. We could not make slow-burn without the support of slate, plus in this economic climate, your membership is more crucial for us than ever working hard to continue bringing you the news and analysis you depend on, but sleet and slow-burn. Need your support right now, so please sign up if you're able to. It's only thirty five dollars for the first year, and you can find out more at sleet dot com slash slow-burn that sleet dot com slash slow. Burn thanks so much. I used to think the Ku Klux Klan was a single fixed organization in reality. It's more like a virulent American medium, a shifting collection of symbols and ideas that have been passed on from one generation of bigots to the next. The first ku-klux-klan arose after the civil war when white vigilantes and masks and robes terrorized and murdered black, free and men and women. That KKK was broken up by massive federal intervention. The second clan was something closer to a political party drew in millions of White Protestants all over the country in the nineteen twenties, and it was animated by hatred, not only of blacks, but also Catholics, Jews and immigrants. It fizzled out around nineteen thirty in part, because clan violence gave the group of bad reputation and polite white society. The third KKK came into existence during David. dukes childhood. Murderous backlash to the gains made by Black Americans in the nineteen fifties and sixties. They died in Birmingham. At the Sixteenth Street Baptist Church rallying point of the Negro drive in the nation's most segregated big city. Dynamite exploded on a Sunday morning killed four little girls in Sunday. School injured twenty other Negroes. This is an Earth Dam, the temporary grave of three civil rights workers to white one negro beaten and shot to death. Among those indicted for this triple slaying, where six men defied as members of the Ku Klux Klan. Clan terrorism became a national outrage and help spur the passage of the Civil Rights Act. At the same time, the FBI began to tear the KKK apart from the inside, infiltrating its leading branches. By the nineteen seventies about a century after it was founded, the clan was basically in ruins. David, Duke saw this as an opportunity. America's most powerful symbol of white supremacist terror was up for grabs. Let me, introduce to now. Mr David get further right into by Mr who comes to us from Louisiana. Is the Grand Dragon the best state in the southern? United States his national. Director. of Ku Klux, Klan. Duke Thought of the Knights of the Ku Klux Klan is the true heirs to the original plan, the one that sprung up after the civil war. In fact Duke himself invented the group in Nineteen seventy-three. The nightside, no history or heritage and no connection to any of the various Klan. Factions in the United States. Nevertheless Duke figured that. The KKK name would serve as a kind of tailwind for his career as a professional racist. He was right. Twenty three years old I'm told youngest Clinton Greg. States of America. Do you feel uncomfortable with she off tonight or If. You're uncomfortable on yourself. No, not at all. Dukes Network Television debut came on NBC's tomorrow in January Nineteen, seventy four. The tomorrow show aired at one am on the east and west coasts, and it wanted desperately to be edgy. It's host Tom Snyder chatted with the priest to claim to exorcise demons, a blind man who found work censoring pornography and celebrities like Watergate icon Martha Mitchell David Duke the handsome young White Supremacist was the perfect tomorrow booking? He was well spoken controversial and beyond the fringes of social acceptability. We don't preserve our. Well I think we're seeing what's happening right now. I never remade city of this country the white people. Great numbers! Hurt not murder rate. Of used by Negroes Snyder never prepared questions. He preferred to let the conversation flow naturally. Fine for Duke. He was no longer the ranting raving young man from free speech alley. This. David Duke the suit wearing grand. Dragon was on a mission to win over his audience. His strategy was simple. Persuade White Americans that they were victims. We believe it though the white people in this country must organize on. People pushing for off. People in the schools for our people in the governor. The light race has been won as forgotten John. You might say. Snyder didn't ignore the clans legacy of violence. was. Looking. I wouldn't. Take Part in one. Now I think that there wouldn't be. Much I want to. Forty, years. In some cases it might justify. But it was the guest, not the host who ended up steering the interview. Rather than focus on the KKK is history of atrocities against black, Americans Snyder in Duke debated whether blacks were predisposed to criminality. Snyder also didn't ask to about his Nazi sympathies or his clan newsletter, which depicted black people as guerrillas and described tear gas as Negro control equipment. Towards the end of their time together Snyder called Duke. Intelligent articulate and charming. Their Banter was collegial at times, even jocular. Doubts about five of the biggest. I know of a couple on the football game. We saw your brothers A. Football here will for the Holiday Inn in the bowl game probably may have. One of the black. On. The tomorrow show averaged three million viewers every night, and it made David Duke public figure. National TV and Radio Bucker saw him as a great get. Someone who'd stir up controversy who people would tune in for? Duke also became a regular on the college. Lecture circuit, collecting speaking fees for delivering his views to impressionable minds. David Duke had leveled up. He had a national profile and he learned how to portray himself as a new kind of Klansmen one with a department store wardrobe an intellectual pretensions. But. Do couldn't lead a movement if he didn't have an army behind him. One fueled by White, anger. David Duke didn't observe America's racial conflicts from a distance. He searched them out and stoke them. In south, Boston he found a war that was already raging in a place that seemed aligned with his white power agenda. Here's journalist Joe Klein. Well Southie. In the nineteen seventies was a working class community and things weren't going so good for working class. People there used to be factories in Boston, but they were closing down. And on top of all that suddenly, these suburban liberals want to break the ethnic identity of the neighborhood by bringing in black kids. On the first day of school in September, nineteen seventy four wait adults and children in South Boston attacked school buses, carrying blacks do. Don't exit one door and try to get. People would have black makers. Burst, In Boston and elsewhere white opposition to school desegregation was violent and persistent. Busing was the most visible battleground in a bigger fight over the state of the civil rights movement. In the nineteen seventies, black college enrollment was on the rise and more black politicians were winning elected office. A lot of white people thought these gains were more than sufficient. They believed the push for black equality was going too far. The programs like affirmative action were unfair, even racist, and that integration was an attack on their way of life. Duke since this growing white insecurity and he wanted to capitalize on it. As. The Nation's is turned toward Boston. He tried to make himself the center of attention. Duke told any news outlet. They would listen that he'd gotten a request from the white people to come up north and help them get organized. In the sixties we had freedom rides of the blacks and certain white of liberals down to the south today. We have reverse of that. We've got right freedom rides north, and our people are aiding our white brothers and sisters and Boston to fight against this tyranny. David Dukes go to move in the nineteen seventies was to show up where racial tensions were high, find a camera and boast about the size of his following. Duke declared that one hundred and fifty clan members would be joining him in Boston A few years later, he claimed to be heading up a massive clan border watch a group of thousands of volunteers keeping an eye out for Mexicans trying to cross into the United States. This was all bluster. The Border Watch would turn out to be Duke and seven other guys, and there's no evidence. They did anything. In Boston Duke, had just two minutes, his side and public officials acted like he didn't exist. A handful of reporters did greed Duke when he arrived at Logan Airport. But most of them peeled off after that initial photo op. One journalist, who didn't was Joe Klein he wrote about Duke for the underground newspaper The real paper. We went to several neighborhoods in Southie and along the way I think duke was. Shocked because his the image he was trying to project was clean, cut the new face of the clan, and there was nothing clean cut about the people in Southie. They were for more profane than he was. By. The end of their day together climbed got the sense that dukes trip to South Boston was more than just a failed publicity stunt. Outside the public eye away from the TV, Cameras Duke was starting to find his people. After the sun went down, the clan leader staged a gathering at a monument commemorating the revolutionary war. I would guess that there were five hundred two thousand people. They're mostly teenagers. Most kids, some older folks and it was in the field behind southie highschool. Duke said that the white people of Southie were American heroes. He blamed the federal government for allegedly forcing little white children out of their homes and sending them into black jungles. He also attacked welfare programs, saying they take money out of your pockets to finance the production of thousands of little black bastards. And, the crowd started chanting things like boneheads, boneheads boneheads. And he didn't have to do very much. Rev Up these people. They are anger was there? They agreed with him. They you know they wanted him do more. They would say where our sheets. Duke was wearing a suit, not a robe and hood. But on this night he wouldn't play the part of the well-scrubbed clansmen. The real issue as an a school here or a school there, Duke said the real issue is, and then he screamed the N. Word In his for the real paper client wrote that the place exploded when Duke yelled. That's ler that this is what the residents of southey had come to hear. When it was all over the twenty four year old Duke stood on a car and declared white victory. He then asked the kids who'd been shadowing him to hand over three dollars each. The price of a clan membership. dukes Ku Klux Klan was gathering strength. In April nineteen, seventy five, he drew a thousand people to a gathering in rural Louisiana. It was one of the biggest clan meet UPS in decades. Duke told the crowd that black people were the puppets of Jews and he spat out the N. word much to the audience's delayed. Duke started out wearing a suit and tie, but at the end of the night he changed into a Klan Robe. He. Then set fire to a forty foot cross. In a press release Dukes clan explained that they disliked the term cross burning, they preferred to call that ritual, which had symbolize death and terror, two generations of black Americans across lading. This was David Duke stance he sold himself as a new kind of clansmen, while relying on old fashioned clans, blurs and symbols. The KKK's history of savagery gave him at I saw danger. They'd be alternately played up and played down. He'd talk about wanting to shoot a black person. Then turn around and say that he never condoned any kind of violence. Depending on the occasion, he styled himself as a polite activist for the civil rights of white people, a crowd, inciting grand dragon or both. The Movement Duke envisioned was more expansive than clans. He welcomed women and Catholics and his big white tent. A tactic. Want him yet more media attention. In Nineteen, seventy, five, a writer from the New York. Times interviewed five clans, women, Dukes House and Baton Rouge one of them. A thirty five year old mother said that white people have to do is fight I. Don't mean with violence, unless of course is to protect ourselves and our children. I mean fight politically by electing congressmen and senators who feel just like we do. David Duke had the same idea. Need a voice for our heritage ideals and interests only fair. Evened up a bit. We do need a real voice with the majority Lens Look David. Duke Senator District Sixteen. In this nineteen seventy five election for a state Senate seat and Baton Rouge. Duke didn't pretend to be anything other than a racist. He said that his purpose as an elected official would be to work on behalf of white people. dukes space wasn't yet large enough to sweep him into office, but he had reason to be optimistic. In nineteen seventy five. Thousand people went to Dukes Big Klan Rally in Rural Louisiana. That same year more than ten times that many Louisiana residents, thirty three percent of voters in an affluent district were willing to cast ballots for a clan leader. The electorate duke said was just about ready for us. We'll be back in a minute. If you like slow-burn. There's another podcast I think you should check out. Decoder ring is a show from sleet about cracking cultural mysteries in each episode, host Willa Paskhin takes a cultural question object or habit examines history and tries to figure out what it means, and why it matters. If you're looking for a good place to start, check out the episode Chucky Cheese Pizza War about the sordid rise and fall of the animatronic pizza chain. You'll also love sad Jennifer Aniston about how the tabloids covered the break of Brad and Jen, and the John Locke conspiracy about a conspiracy theory among Sherlock Holmes fans. The got way way out of control subscribed Dakota ring, wherever. You get your podcasts. I've spent a Lotta time recently. Thinking about a man I don't know much about. I don't know what he looked like. I deny he was. I. Don't know where he was born where he died. What I do, know his name. Richard He was enslaved. And, he was last island nineteen fifty-six. Last island. Yield then yeah. Back then they spoke French in southern Louisiana and that island was about as far south as it got. Last island resort. Place where everybody who was anybody for the cool salt breeze. The wealthy of America's save crecy will go there in the summer to have balls. Parade on the prominent relax. Behind their leisure was a hand of slave power that ran everything. A little bit more about the man who owned Richard. Thomas Mill was a Frenchman. He ran a sugar plantation nearby you. Milton his family to their mansion last island that summer. On August ninth Saturday night, they danced in the grand ball the local hotel. But on Sunday. Look down into the waves and felt the bracing wins approach. The storm was coming. That night the wind grew stronger. The science of last island panicked and packed themselves into a hotel. But Richard was worried. He tried to convince a Mathur and his family to leave their mansion and take shelter in stable. But they refused. The storms I approached. Waves got higher and higher. The surge of water to storm, push ahead of race to the island. It hit like a tidal wave. Through, it all Richard Braved the storm in the stable. His only companion that night was an old horse. The next morning, the only building Daniel last island was at stable. Rigid and the old horse. It made it. Many. Other folks weren't so lucky. About half of the people known to be there died. Richard found his masters eighteen year old daughter bleeding from a head, wound and deliver her to safety. She was the only member of her family on last islands of I. As far as we know. Ridge was the only person who survived. Everything we know about Richard Comes from a newspaper interview with the daughter he saved. The story of last island became in sation across America. It was insatiable in part because of who died. In the eighteen fifties southern Louisiana had the highest concentration of millionaires in the country. Last island hurricane and killed a lot of them. The idea of doomed grand balls in final pageants at the plantation aristocracy. was also tragic and romantic. But. I don't really care about that part. I just can't stop thinking about Richard. The last hurricane was a category four storm when it hit. It's been called the first great storm in recorded history of Louisiana. It seems like every generation has won. 1893, nineteen, fifteen. Nineteen forty seven. Each with their stories in their myths. Each with their richards. The last big storm in New Orleans was hurricane. Nineteen, sixty five. And then for forty years. It was quite. Drain is turning into a monster. In a very. Seems to be taking responsibility. From the Atlantic. I'm Van Newkirk and this is flood lines. Listen to all eight episodes on March twelfth. And visit the Atlantic Dot Com slash flood line. David Duke didn't just look to previous white power movements for inspiration. He also took notice of the fight for black equality a crusade he considered offensive, but highly effective. Here he hasn't an interview from nineteen seventy-five. What's happened? This country's of the minorities of factory stick together have been able to will tremendous power in terms of our government, and we believe it's time that the white majority of the people that built this country and created our Constitution and our ideals. They again become masters their Augustine. One of Duke supporters said that Duke was trying to do for white people. What Martin Luther King did for black people. Duke like to think of himself as a more militant voice, he said if I'd been born black. I would have been Malcolm X.. Duke wanted to sell the idea that his own movement was an equal and opposite force to the push for black civil rights. In September nineteen, seventy, seven, a Chicago. Television host named Steve Edwards gave him the opportunity to make that case in an hour long televised debate. dukes opponent was Jesse Jackson? So we will meet the clansman civil rights leader when we come back in a moment on Friday night. A few years earlier do could been shouting racist Tirades College classmates from on top of a box. Now he was sharing a stage with a man widely seen as America's most influential black leader. Jackson who had worked under Martin Luther King saw himself as a pragmatist. He believed in school integration, but not because he thought black students learn better alongside white ones. Rather. He understood weights. Schools got more government funding because Jackson said. Whitestone intend to leave each other ignorant. On his home turf of Chicago Jackson organized boycotts of White owned businesses. The didn't extend job offers two black workers, but he also took the leftist position that racism was inextricable from class struggle that poor working class, blacks and whites should recognize their common interests. Duke began the debate by trying to make white nationalism sound, peaceful and reasonable. I don't want to suppress anybody and the client is not trying to put anybody down or trying to do is allow each race to be mass own destiny. Should have control over their communities and their nations in the world and we think that the white people we should have control over Rs. Jackson said the Duke Misunderstood the United States. The genes of America is an experiment. That suggests that people love of Min nations. Mini races of the world. Well somehow accept the challenge? To learn to live together in some relative proximity hominids. This was high minded stuff. It didn't take long for the tone to get earthier. At, one point dukes started talking about the founding fathers, and what they might say about inner cities. I think Thomas Jefferson would walk on the south side of Chicago if you could walk and survive and he'd vomit. That's what I think Thomas Jefferson. We do I think he'd be sick. Jackson and Duke went back and forth and increasingly hostile fashion. Well you don't have in monopoly on work. I mean the fact is blacks worked hard, but didn't get paid for. Work of even why stories on the Senate blacks made cotton, king and hold tobacco row. and we raised children when you were to try and do radio. Talk, that is not a talking about physical things. If that's what makes America, we're going to have to give the horse the right to vote and give the horse equal power, because they even contributed more than the black man physically. No matter who said what the fact of the broadcast was a triumph for Duke. He was being presented a spokesman for White America one whose ideas were worth batting around. Jesse Jackson didn't need this platform. So why did he agree to go on TV with a blow dried bigot. I chose to participate in. This program Steve. All of the 'cause think that as more why people develop. Economic anxiety, there's an economic insecurities they're-they theis can be played upon by demagogues father the threat to this country right now. Is the fact that we will end up so racially polarized, and so we and separation until we would not be able to make the nation achieved level of greatness. It is capable of of achieving. Jackson ended the show with a pointed message. It's important me to send you know first of all. Blacks are not afraid of clan. In the morning they can wear hoods aware suits. They can burn crosses the bathroom. That's Promo. We're not afraid. Dukes final word was an invitation. People watching the television, so they might think this is not true or not telling the truth wealth. They agree with me are if they disagree with me? They could write to me and I'll supply the documents. I guess right. David. Duke Ku Klux Klan Jefferson Louisiana of provide these documents to them, just. David Duke. Jefferson Louisiana the duke thing very. Even. The Jamie Land, I'm sorry, goodnight. Everybody else Monday morning on am Chicago. In. The nineteen seventies David Duke became synonymous with a certain kind of white supremacy. He built his knights of the Ku Klux Klan up from nothing and made it into one of the nation's leading racist organizations. Duke was attuned to white anger, and there were plenty of Americans who found his bigotry invigorating. But by the end of the decade Duke was hitting a ceiling. When he ran for the state Senate and eighteen seventy-nine, he got fewer votes than he had in nineteen seventy five. A national poll also found that the Klan had an approval rating of just ten percent. Up Four points since nineteen, sixty five, but still abysmally low. Bertha Gafni. Gorman met David Duke in the summer of Nineteen Seventy, eight. She was a staff writer for the Sacramento Bee and she was working on a series about civil rights ten years after the king assassination. To me almost a natural. There had to be some writing about David Duke and who he was, he really was beating his own trauma, and other people beating the drum for him, and they were lifting him up as some kind of mystical man, and he himself was gonNA save the White Race. Duke insisted on doing the interview late at night and Gafni Gorman's hotel room. Gafni Gorman is black and she brought a white male friend her on the road trip for safety purposes. In the room duke shook hands with the white man. He didn't extend his hand to Gafni Gorman. I mean he would not let me in is he would not look me in the face, and he always looked off to the side whether teams that caught my attention immediately. Is that his feet? His legs kept moving. He had this really nervous. His legs go pepper cayenne pepper. He, and then he would seem to try and control it, and then another one would start, and he did that all through the interview. Do Give Gafni. Gourmet has usual pater-. He said that white people were being discriminated against and that the civil rights movement and immigration had caused every problem imaginable. But people destroyed education system. They destroyed economy. They destroyed automobile industry. Unit black people destroyed. Duke said the KKK was on its way to political power, and that reports of clan violence where concocted by the media. He told Gafni Gorman that he got no salary from the clan, and that he supported the group by writing books under a pseudonym. And with that, he walked out. Oh. When he left, it was not of a person who felt very Powell. person who felt very angry and felt that. Someone had taken something from him. And I I was not very. That was not very impressed with him. He literally was halfway to before he came back and ask for the money to pay to park. Park who was a dollar twenty five cents. Before she left town. There was one more thing Gaffney Gorman wanted to do. After a lot of thought I said I WANNA see where he minutes. Don't know if that's a good idea, but. We. Really need to see what this man is about and sure enough. We drove out to this house where he lived talked about a weather beaten painted house. That's where he lived. Vise Writing Bucks underpin names to make money. One of them find irs keepers was a guide for women looking, attract and hold onto man. Its Authors James Conrad Dorothy Vanderbilt Aka David Duke and David Duke suggested speaking slowly and softly, getting cosmic surgery and agreeing to anal sex. Do grow another book African Addo using the name Muhammad X.. That one was built as a streetfighting manual for black militants with technology supposedly learned from a tribe in Nigeria. Duke would claim that African. Ato was part of a counterintelligence operation. All I can say with certainty. Is that African? Addo is a very weird buck and it didn't make Duke Wretch. The Klan had made David Duke famous, but it can only carry him so far. By the late seventies, he was looking for an escape plan. And dukes. Fellow clansmen were happy to see him go. One clan member said the dukes womanizing was conduct unbecoming a racist. Others accused Duke of pilfering money from his own followers. Duke denied all of these allegations, claiming that disgruntled clan types had conspired with a Jewish group to try to bring him down. dukes most persistent clan antagonised was Bill Wilkinson, the leader of a rival group called the invisible empire. Woken thought Duke was a glory hog, and too much of an egghead to get things done. You don't fight wars with words and books, Wilkinson, set of Duke. You fight them with bullets and bombs. After feuding for five years Duke and Wilkinson agreed to a secret deal. Do good resign from his clan and sell Wilkinson has membership list the names and addresses of three thousand klansmen which were supposed to be kept secret. Wilkinson would pay Duke thirty five. Thousand Dollars. It was a setup. Wilkinson had invited some reporters to listen in on their negotiations. When the journalist popped out and started asking questions Duke ran away. Wilkinson considered this operation a huge success. To show people. That he's coming. In the human, who would literally US people out there? Hard and Duke would publicly quit the Knights of the Ku. Klux Klan in July nineteen eighty. I'm resigning. He said because I. Don't think the clan can succeed at this point because of its violent image, and because of people like Bill Wilkinson. Woken Santa turned out with an FBI informant and he later leave the clan himself. Duke would hand over the Knights of the Ku Klux Klan to his old friend Don Black, who had met ten years earlier on that road trip to a Nazi conference. In nineteen eighty one black was convicted of taking part in a plot to overthrow the island of Dominika, which he was hoping to transform into a white utopia. Blackwood learn to code and prison and he'd used those skills to launch the racist Website Storm Front. The other guy on that Nazi road trip Joseph. Paul Franklin firebombed a synagogue in Nineteen Seventy, seven, then murdered multiple interracial couples. He also shot and paralyzed Larry Flint because he was outraged by the depiction of interracial sex and Flint's Hustler magazine. Franklin was arrested in nineteen eighty and was ultimately convicted of murdering eight people. Though he told one reporter, he'd killed approximately twenty two. He was executed by lethal injection in two thousand thirteen. To revive his dreams of building a mass movement David Duke needed to start something new. Reform Grand Wizard. Komo positive image. Public is I I'm just tired of Have you deal with the Hollywood stereotype clan? I want to discuss the issues before Malcolm public. Hi, you've reached the NAACP The National Association for the Advancement of white people. We are a nonprofit civil rights organization dedicated to equal rights for all people and to the preservation of heritage and culture of the white race from copy of our newsletter. The NASA WBZ news please leave your name and address after the tone, and we will send your copy by Return Mail. Please speak slowly leaving your in command. For Duke the NWEA AA. WBZ was clean slate, a group untainted by violence. It was also perhaps admission that he'd taken the wrong approach to white power movement building. Here's the story Lance Hill. I think by nineteen eighty. He realized that at least superficially. The Racist Movement had to lose the robe and the ritual. Version of the N. double ACP didn't win any political victories for white people. In the first half of the nineteen eighty s do quirk mostly as a newsletter publisher writing up in reprinting racist articles. By nineteen eighty-four Jesse Jackson was a serious contender for the Democratic presidential nomination. That Year David Duke's name appeared in the New York. TIMES, just once in the ninth paragraph of an article about Bill Wilkinson. Lance Hill has been following Dukes the seventy S. He thinks there's a simple explanation for why duke loss team. Ronald Reagan. Once Reagan came into power. Here's somebody who expressed many of the policies. That the openly white supremacist groups had been advocating as organizing issues. I N it just sucked all of the fuel out of the. Radical right wing movement. If. Do couldn't beat Ronald Reagan, he had to be like Ronald Reagan. The clean cut clansman, bet it run its course. Dukes best path forward was mainstream politics. And what's going to happen now? This is the best I think I have to give you. What happens now it is a gentleman. We have created a political shift in this country. Next time on Stober. In one, thousand, nine, hundred and nine, David Duke got a foothold in American politics. To build on that victory, he'd have to fend off to Louisiana women. One was a Republican official. The other was a Holocaust survivor. slow-burn production of slate. Plus slates membership program. Then we're giving slate plus members early access to the first half of the series. Sign up now, and you won't have to wait until next week to your episode three. Here's a preview. House pretty you know anti do, but when I went up there and saw how he was like I felt like I was in on a dirty little secret. Ha, ha, ha liquid. I didn't Louisiana pull the wool over their eyes, and it was like he went back to his supporters and. I on, he was using the Republican. Party and that just made me mad. You can listen now by signing up at slate dot com slash slow-burn. Slate plus members also get weekly bonus episodes. Were we'll dive deeper into the history were exploring this season today? You'll hear an interview with Elisa slow. Who wrote a book about David Duke? God's on Derek Black and the origins of the modern white supremacist, movement. Head over to slate dot com slash slow-burn to listen now. Slow burn is produced by me and Christopher Johnson with editorial direction by low and loo and Gabriel Roth. Madeline arm is our production assistant so fi summer grad slow burns, assistant producer. Mix Engineer is Paul Manzi. David Gross composed our theme song. The artwork for slow-burn is by Lisa Larsson Walker. Special. Thanks to play her Robinson for some of the audio. We used in this episode. Thanks also to Jordan Hirsch. Jessica Seidman and slates Chow to Katie. Raeford Laura Bennett, Alison Benedict Jared Holt. Thanks for listening. I've spent a lot of time recently thinking about a man I don't know much about. I don't know what he looked like. I Don I old he was. I. Don't know where he was born where he died. What I do know is his name. Richard. He was enslaved. And, he was on last island in eighteen, fifty six. Last island. Yield then yeah. Back then they spoke French in southern Louisiana and that island was about as far south as it got. Last island was a resort. Place where everybody who was anybody went for the cool breeze. The wealthy of America's slave accuracy will go there in the summer to have balls parade down the promenade relax. Behind their leisure was a hand of slave power that ran everything. A little bit more about the man who owned Richard. Thomas Mill was a Frenchman. He ran a sugar plantation out by you. Milton family to their magical last island that summer. On August ninth Saturday night. They danced in the grand. Ball local hotel. But on Sunday. Look down into the waves and felt the bracing wins approach. The storm was coming. That night the wind grew stronger. The science of last island panicked and pack themselves into a hotel. But Richard was worried. He tried to convince a master and his family to leave their mansion and take shelter in a stable. But they refused. The storms I approached. Waves got higher and higher. The surge of water to storm pushed ahead of race to the island. It hit like a tidal wave. Through it, all Richard Braved the storm in the stable. His only companion that night was an old horse. The next morning, the only building skills Danny on last island was at stable. Rigid in the old horse and made it. Many. Other folks weren't so lucky. About, half of the people known to be there died. Richard found his masters eighteen year old daughter bleeding from a head wound and delivered her to safety. She was the only member of our family on last islanders vied. As far as we know. Ridge was the only person and slaves who survived. Everything we know about Richard Comes from a newspaper interview with the daughter he saved. The story of last island became a sensation across America. In part because of who died. In the eighteen fifty s southern Louisiana had the highest concentration of millionaires in the country. Last island hurricane and killed a lot of them. The idea of doomed grand balls and final pageants the plantation aristocracy. Tragic in romantic. But. I don't really care about that part. I just can't stop thinking about Richard. The last island hurricane was a category four storm when it hit. It's been called the first great storm in recorded history of Louisiana. It seems like every generation has won. Eighteen ninety three. Nineteen, fifteen, nineteen, forty seven. Each with their stories and their myths. Each, Richards The last big storm in New Orleans Hurricane Betsy. Nineteen sixty five. And then for forty years. It was quite. Into a monster of a store in the very around. No one seems to be taken responsibility George Bush. Back. From the Atlantic. I'm Ben Newkirk and this is flood lines. Listen to all eight episodes on March twelfth. And visit the Atlantic Dot Com slash floodlight.

Martha Mitchell David Duke David Duke America Louisiana Ku Klux Klan Duke Duke Ku Klux Klan Jefferson Lo United States Don Black David Dukes Duke Franklin White Race Movement Duke Joseph Paul Franklin Lsu Duke Senator District Sixteen Jesse Jackson White Richards
MYTH BUSTED: Did Trump Praise Nazis as Very Fine People? | Louder with Crowder

Louder With Crowder

09:18 min | 8 months ago

MYTH BUSTED: Did Trump Praise Nazis as Very Fine People? | Louder with Crowder

"Hey their audio listener. Are you tired of your old bedsheets. I and i don't have any that can do for you. Because bedsheets don't sponsor this show but i would like to tell you about gold really more of a golden opportunity. Join mugla but a lot of cutter dot com slash muklewicz. The only reason that this show is actually available audio version that you're listening to or on youtube and we have a full daily show that you don't get access to anywhere else so if you want to continue enjoying this show change my mind or the like or if the hate listen you like to hate watch. People do that punishable face. Please do consider supporting at louder with crowder dot com slash mug club. Join up today in. you'll be a better person for it. There is no such thing as a very fine neo. Nazi i would agree with you. Yeah i would agree. Let me ask you this. Would it change your opinion if trump agrees with you and he had said that at that exact same conference. Oh it would have helped this election coming up. There's been a lot of accusations of racism and it struck me that a lot of people still believe president. Donald trump did not condemn white supremacy in charlottesville north carolina. Peaceful protesters were protesting racial injustice. And then on the other side. There were neo nazis the commander commander-in-chief chief said there were fine. People on both sides moral equivalence good people on both sides. No one wants to hear from the man who says there are people on both sides essentially suggesting that there are very fine people in the nazis presence ever ever see should they're very fine people both sides. I realized there was no video. Actually questioning people about this didn't exist so i decided to make myself but i had to go in disguise. Let me ask you. Do you think that donald trump has he done enough to condemn which you don't think so. No so personally. I i don't think so. Do you think that donald trump is done enough to condemn white supremacy. I mean it's kind of a trick question if you ask. We'll just a point that he's always at least not speaking up Very clearly In condemning some groups. I think it's pretty clear when you look at comments. Like can you condemn david duke. And there's a hesitation and two week or a week or two later here. Respond to it yes i condemn it. He hasn't been. He hasn't been as clear as he needs to be. In my opinion no do you think that. Donald trump is racist absolutely. Okay and what makes you say that. I listened to every word. He says everywhere everywhere because of a lot of the things that he said Just throughout all of his speeches especially in context to the corona virus calling it the china virus and things such as that like is. Yeah i just don't think that he really like mexico's he hates mexicans. There hasn't been a lateral like on every single front that white supremacy is bad from donald trump. there's been hesitations. There's been misstep very consistently. And i think that's what's opening the door for a very unfortunately racist base signed an example. Find people on both sides. Yeah i mean. I think that was to me. What's kind of a unnecessary comment. And i think just knowing how if you're so against the media then why given something to look for right why not just say clearly premises. They should be condemned totally. Yeah exactly and i think once that said then then acting that's just to me it's an easy thing to do. Right would bother you. Most about his comments and charlottesville the good people on both sides. Okay it should be pretty easy to condemn white supremacy neo-nazis nazis outright in no uncertain terms. David duke should be a very easy person. Degree with right or condemning. Yeah white supremacists or neo nazis in charlottesville. Yeah you would've you would've liked see both of those to make sure we're talking about the same thing this was. This was charlottesville right. The first This is yeah. Play it that we are talking about right people on both very but you also had people that were very fine people on both sides right there and yeah i wish he would. One of the there is no such thing. As a very fine neo nazi. I would agree with you. Yeah i would agree. Let me ask you this. Would it change your opinion if trump agreed with you and he had said that at that exact same oh it would help be different if he had done those things and would be better condemning really. Yeah it was it now because he knows he sent. Trump always been saying it for a very long time. Have you seen the full clip your changing culture. And you had people. And i'm not talking about the neo nazis and the white nationalist because they should be condemned totally. But you had many people in that group other than neo nazis and white nationalists. Okay does that. Change your opinion on. Maybe have you seen that before. Today i have. I don't remember the last part right. Condemned white supremacy. Did you know about that full context before you saw that clip. I haven't seen the full clip because that help like you said you know it helps but there it goes on and on and on like i don't think that has a big influence on my opinion one because like i said like those two comments aren't the only parts it's gonna very consistent part of his rhetoric but do you think with charlottesville. Do you think. I was dishonest. To the media he didn't condemn late. You premacy when he did at that. Certain insects yes no. I don't think it's just pulling from an actual thing that he said his now. But what you're reading a and watch. You never actually heard or saw the comments of donald trump condemning went premacy at charlottesville. Did see did see that. Did you know about that full context before you saw that clip. I haven't seen the full clip i. I'd seen the clips. And that's why i told you whenever you first interviewed me or the start of this interview is my thoughts on that and i think that he can do more i bring. The media is biased in that way like. Obviously that's not what's going to use on cnn. Does it worry you that. That's the first time you're seeing that considering obstinate before you said that he didn't would it. Change your opinion if trump agrees with you and he had said that at that exact same conference our would help me. I listened to the strength of what he says. But you didn't know until just now that he said i'm not talking about white supremacists or neo. Nazis should be condemned totally. And you just said that had he condemned it in no uncertain terms. You would've viewed him differently. I don't think i've even differently like from. That isn't gonna knock down in general. Yeah i think. There's other instances that you can really. I know you're talking specifically about limb right. Doesn't your opinion though. No and i mean. He says they're fine people on both sides. David david duke in robocalls out again. The white supremacist movement supporting you. Do you have any words for that. David duke endorsement. okay. I disavow okay. Th where we looked at it. It looked at the question. I disavow david. So are you prepared right now to make a clear and unequivocal statement. Renouncing support of all white supremacists. Course i am. Of course when christie's exact same question. I said i disavow about then disavowed today on. Abc with george stephanopoulos. I- disavowed again. Eight minutes mike. You can tell me. I think it's enough to take over the years. I totally disavow. The klu klux klan totally disavow david duke ultimately he got to the klu klux klan. Which obviously going to disavow have reject david. Duke rejected david duke I've rejected the kkk video. So we went through charlottesville said in general I mean it could be. It could be a two hour video. Does that change your opinion again at all on his position outright condemning in no uncertain terms surpremacy Now i mean i'm not saying that. Donald trump is the president of white supremacy. I think he could have done well again. It's the inconsistency that's been like the oaken door for a white supremacist. Right now to support him. does that change. Maybe your opinion on donald trump's view there now no it doesn't so you don't care so much about what he said. No no no what what would be required for you to say that. He's adequately condemned it it. It's it's a good point you make in. It's it's it's it's a matter of degree of strength but it's a point you. I think he walks up for the first time when he could have said. You know what. I still don't like donald trump but that changes the context. I think i would have been a better. Answer is but instead you argue that he's still hadn't done so i disagree with you. I think he's done for now. That i got into this social distancing. How is that larry. David david david distance.

donald trump charlottesville trump two week david duke youtube north carolina mexico David david duke Trump china klu klux klan white cnn two hour george stephanopoulos david Eight minutes christie Abc
Cold Call

Slow Burn

25:01 min | 1 year ago

Cold Call

"Hey slow-burn listeners I want to tell you about another show from sleep how to with Charles Duhig. Charles is political prize winning reporter and the author of the power of happen. Each week on how to? He tackles listeners tough as problems with the help of experts. A recent episode you might be interested in is how to fight racism in your town. It's about a white guy from Austin Texas. Who wants to do more to counteract systemic racism, but isn't sure where to start. Charles brings an EEG GMO low the author of so you WanNa talk about race to walk through concrete steps. We all can take to harness this moment for real change. Look for how to Charles doing the show. Ad Week Honored Two Thousand Nineteen interview podcast of the year wherever you get your podcasts. Hey slow-burn listeners. We've got something different for you this time out. This week you'll get to hear a preview of our bonus episodes for slate plus members special shows where we go deeper into our story, stay tuned for excerpts from my conversations with an Levy. The Holocaust survivor who confronted David Duke in nineteen eighty nine. Allies SAS low. Who wrote a great book about the Modern White? Nationalist Movement and Tofu grace who played duke in the Spike Lee film black clansmen. But I I want to introduce you to someone you've probably never heard of. Her name is Joanna. Burnett and I've been thinking about her a lot as I've been working on this season of slow-burn. Joanna is three years older than I am and like me. She grew up in New Orleans. In one, thousand, nine, hundred nine when she was twelve, she did something really gutsy. It all started when she noticed that one particular story was dominating the local news. I, remember I almost every single day. Coverage on this former Ku Klux Klansmen who is running for office. In. AN AMERICAN CITY! Joanna was looking for a topic for her school. Social Studies Fair. When David Duke won his race for the State House of Representatives. She knew what she wanted to do. I just found his name and number in the white pages. and. I think I was surprised. It was just right there. On March Twelfth One thousand, nine, hundred nine. She grabbed a tape recorder and her parents speakerphone and headed out to the garage. And then she started dialing. Hi, my name is Joanna Brunette? Aft Out the number several times today off gotten was. A telephone rain. After about ten tries. Somebody picked up. Is David Duke over there. Is. David, do river. This is David. How? This is David do really finally. Okay, and then I just immediately start asking questions. How I don't think you'll get elected. How do you think you got elected? In agreement horror. Okay Okay, you say you're not like. You know like a big anymore. Okay, but you call yourself a racialist. Myself right right back because I believe in equal for. Joanna is black and she knew the Duke had been in the Ku Klux Klan. But she says she wasn't afraid of him. I think I was still really. Puzzled and trying to understand. This. person's type of thinking. Duke intern wanted to get inside Joanna's head. To do that. He needed to know who he was talking to. Do you think that you should be removed from Louisiana legislative. Car about it's my social studies project. I've been Montessori. Twelve. Duke spoken a call even tone. He told Joanna that he opposed forced integration of education. He said that the best qualified people should get jobs and promotions and scholarships and racial discrimination goes on today in America against white people in those areas. When Joanna asked if he'd really changed since leaving the clan, he turned the question back around. We all change. And I think we all grow. And I think that my statements have been recorded and photographed. I think I'm sure there are something your life. Maybe you change if you could. But you've done. To the rituals. Parents teachers from. Joanna was skeptical. She'd heard a lot of stories about dukes passed and she wanted answers. She asked him about his use of racial slurs whether he'd been affiliated with Nazi group, and if his wife had left him because he was in the clan. Duke denied everything. He was defensive and Cagey and manipulative. He also criticized the twelve year. Olds interviewing technique. All you're telling. Beating allocation. At Pack? Bothered me. Duke went on a three minute diatribe, complaining that the media didn't focus on positive things like his academic record. He said that any important person has things in their past. That would be controversial. Never confirmed myself. But about what you have written about cry. if you were person a bit like A. Crisis so lied about. That, they crucify the man they made. People hate him so much. Duke, told Joanna that she needed to have an open mind. He suggested that she placed an order at his bookstore. The same place where bathroom key would purchase Nazi bucks shore while later. The title he recommended was race and reason. Duke had read it when he was about Joanna's age. The author Carleton Putnam believed that Black Americans were genetically inferior to whites. Did you ever? Pick up the buck rayson reason. Now now. Now now. Duke talked to Joanna Burnett for twenty minutes that night. She's not sure why he stayed on the phone that long. She thinks the duke may have thought you white and that she'd pass on his talking points to her parents. Joanna's parents weren't duke supporters. They did believe in good manners, though and they asked their daughter to write duke a thank you. Duke Printed Joanna's letter and her home address. In the newsletter for the National Association for the Advancement of white people. I received a at least three letters that I remember from prisoners from inmates telling me that they were. Know, five foot, whatever or six foot, whatever brown hair, blue eyes and their AERIENNE. There's a moment at the very end of Joanna's tape. That really got to me. It comes when our conversation with Duke is over, but before she stops her recorder. Heard. You heard it. Maybe not. Getting point. Through. Paul? Paul! He was just getting his points through. You should look at two sides of every story. Joanna Burnett was puzzling through her conversation with David Duke real-time. Ceasing, I should get the fuck race in reason, and you should learn. Listen to both sides of an argument. Yes, but should I really be letting. David Duke tell me this. No Should we be letting David Duke? Give us his side of the argument. I've thought about that question a lot as I've been doing my own research. It's standard practice and journalism to reach out to any subject your reporting on. For one thing, people have a right to respond to accusations. You're making against them. Plus a story typically benefits from the perspective of its main subject. But David Duke is not a typical subject. Consider Tom Snyder's interview with Duke on NBC Tomorrow Show in one, thousand, nine, hundred, ninety, four, the one you heard an episode to where the host and the white nationalist sub almost chummy. About five, the biggest plans for that I know of. Come on football. We saw brothers A. Hero over the holiday in the game. Half! You know you don't have to. Snyder introduce duke to a huge new audience and I don't think he understood the gravity of that choice. The thirty seven year old late-night host wasn't as prepared as the twelve year old. Joanna Burnett. He allowed Duke to define himself and to spread his white nationalist message nationwide. Other TV anchors have done a much better job confronting duke. You'll hear about one of them later in our series. But sometimes the best choices is to keep someone like duke off the stage entirely. and. That's why I won't be interviewing David Duke for this season of slow-burn. In the episodes we've already released. You've heard plenty of Duke Voice. I don't think there's any doubt about what he believed in the seventies, eighties, nineties or today. Duke told Joanna Burnett that. We all change and grow. But he still using whatever platform he has to foment racism and anti-semitism. ducas also congenitally dishonest. He made himself a mainstream political candidate by lying about his views and his background. His goal and interviews isn't to explain himself. It's to manipulate the record. I'm doing this series because I think the Duke Phenomenon Warrant close scrutiny. And, because the ideas he espouses are still with us and still dangerous. But Duke, the politician is not currently a threat. Yes. He attached himself to the unite the right rally in Charlottesville, and yes, he supported Donald Trump's run for the presidency. But the last time he ran for office in two thousand sixteen, he got three percent of the vote and a run for the Senate. Talking to him now would serve no one's interest, but David Dukes. Will be sure to include dukes responses to allegations levelled against him. But his core beliefs that black people are inferior to whites that the Holocaust never happened. Don't deserve to be debated. And so on this podcast. We're not going to hand him the microphone. We'll be back in a minute. Long, what's the number one sign of a bad home security system? That it's so complicated. You never use it. That's exactly the type of security system. SIMPLISAFE has been a decade fighting against. They believed that simple is safer, and that's why simplisafe home security for right now. SIMPLISAFE was designed to be easy to use for protecting your whole home twenty four seven. Order online with the click a button opened the box placed the sensors. Plug it in in. Your home is protected around the clock. No technician or salesperson has to come. Bother you and you don't need to pay any outrageous monthly fees or sign a two year contract. Simply safe was named best overall home security at twenty, twenty by US News and World Report. And there twenty, four, seven, professional monitoring an emergency dispatch starts at fifty cents a day. Had To simplisafe dot com slash slow-burn and get free shipping a sixty day money back guarantee that simplisafe dot com slash slow-burn to make sure they know that our show saint now. I'm Keegan. Hamilton and I'm the host of a new series painkiller America's crisis from Vice News and spotify. It's about the deadliest drug in America. How we ended up in the middle of an opioid epidemic and you ever go to. A doctor, said No. I'm not going to give you pills. Oh, yeah all the time, so we'd just go find another one and what happens now so often people struggling with opioid use disorder. They don't know how to get out. Listen to all now free spotify. A small town a brutal murder. The series witness Docs from stitcher presents a journey into the heart of America's unfinished business. Their new podcast is called unfinished deep South in it starts with one question. Who Lynched Isadora banks. Sixty six years after the murder of a wealthy African American farmer in a small Arkansas town. This investigative true crime series attempts to restore the legacy of a World War One veteran who found a way to prosper in the Jim Crow South. This story explores the system of white supremacy that surrounded banks traced, and forgotten court records, fading F., B. I. Files and testimony of. Witnesses it also aims to solve is door banks is murder before the case goes cold forever. Listen and subscribe to unfinished deep South Right, now in Stitcher, apple podcasts at spotify or whatever you listen. Making show like slow-burn requires a lot of research and interviews material that we sift through and. To produce our series when it's all done, we have a ton of stuff that doesn't make it into our final episodes, but there's a huge amount of treasure and the slow-burn volts, amazing archival fines loads of anecdotes and fascinating conversations. That's what we bring you in our bonus episodes for sleep, plus in these weekly shows slow-burn producer, Christopher, Johnson and I give you a behind the scenes peek at what it's like to make the show. We also run extended interviews with some of our sources so that you get to hear their stories in their own words today we're going to give you a preview of what we cover on slate, plus and hopefully you'll like what you hear and sign up to become a member. When I started working on this season I knew I needed to talk to an Levy. Levy, is a family friend who I knew growing up in New Orleans and I'd always heard about her famous confrontation with David Duke. What I didn't realize until our interview was how that in changed her life, and how it transformed the Anti Duke, Movement In this clip, you'll hear Levy talk about continuing to stand up to do because he threatened to win higher. Office! After that he started going around the city. You know he'd be on the radio and. I remember I was in the car driving from the grocery store, and I pulled up from Navarre store. And, I told him I walked in and I, said stand. Guess was on radio. David Brooks on radio, and he turned. Her is okay, cokie. And so I went where he was speaking. and. The funding part of his our sitting in the audience. And is he came down? He nodded to me to say alot of identify looks familiar. And I said I like to talk to you afterwards. But he ignored me again. He left. He didn't want any part of me. She was afraid of you, or he didn't want the confrontation akin. To me when I think about it, had he been smart? Maybe he would have sat down and asked a few questions. Why was I following him? But he didn't want any part of it, because at that time in his life and trying to be a politician, he was very actively trying to conceal what his beliefs were. And what has passed was and you are kind of. This reminder. He really was well. There was the whole idea you know. He was portraying himself as one thing. And when you, his history is something totally different. How could you get him to get away with that? A lot of people spoke out. I never thought I'd made such a big impression. Against I did. Washington. Post reporter Eli SAST low was another person I really wanted to speak with. He wrote the book rising out of hatred, which tells the story of Dukes God son and heir apparent Derek Black. Sas Low reveals what happened when Derek began to question his worldview and chose to leave white supremacy behind. As he followed Derek's journey, SAS also learned a huge amount about the modern shape of white nationalism. In our conversation, which was exclusive for slate, plus we discussed how duke still influence as the world, today? Here SAS low talks about the strategies and language. The Derek Black and David Duke used to try to build a white supremacist movement. I think the scary thing. It's at the foundation for both of them is the realization that that audience is massive in the United? States you know I, mean polls in the country consistently show still about forty percent of white people in the United States believed that they suffer more discrimination. More prejudice than people of color were juice, and that is insane. It's inaccurate by every measure that we have but the fact that degree of false white grievance continues. Continues to exist in this country means that there is a huge audience for these racist ideas. If they're packaged in a way, that doesn't announce themselves as explicitly racist. The truth is, and it remains true for Derek now even now that he's a prominent anti-racist, the other side he still feels sure frighteningly share the ugliness within our country exists and make these ideas powerful enough to drive movements to get people elected to the biggest office in the country. So one of the things that I kept. Kind of rolling around in my head was. Is this just a small group of people talking to each other? Is this massive movement. How scary and dangerous is it? I would say that the white nationalist that sort of politically active group I think it's a fairly small group I also think that it's a group that is growing in its own ways, and that also is becoming more and more dangerous I mean. We've had many massive terrorist attacks in this country by young white people who've radicalized in the darkest corners of the Internet for the most part and have done awful thanks, and then are talking to each other through their manifesto. Even just as sort of like an activist, terrorist group I think it shouldn't be underestimated because the consequences are real and scary but I think the big thing frankly is that it's a group that is by a few degrees removed from a lot of white America that continues to share a lot of the same ideas that are talked about storefronts, and whether those are ideas. Ideas about immigration and building a wall, or the United States becoming too diverse or changing fundamentally from what it's been. There is a wide sense in the country that this is a white country and white culture is the priority, and that's because our history bears out. That's what we've been and reconciling with these white supremacist ideas means reconciling with with what this country is foundationally. Finally I'm going to share something from next week slate plus episode, which will feature my interview with actor Toe for grace. Grace Played David Duke in Spike Lee's two thousand eighteen film black clansmen. Here he is talking about the research. He did to prepare for the role including reading Duke's autobiography. Yeah I mean I did a lot I I. Read my waking, which was just. Terrible experience If someone wrote a full book. That gravity doesn't exist it. Just every page is like you know I'm pretty sure it does I. Just me sitting here is evidence of it, so it's. It's weird to read something that you feel like you've been just by reading your. Complicit or something, but I thought the film was great and I wanted to. Do the best job I. couldn't I hadn't played a lot of characters that were. Not Fictional. and even the ones I've played were based on real people weren't people that many people were aware of or were infamous, so I listened to his. Radio show even though he was older when he did that. Kind of talk a lot about how he spoke. Watch clips of in the seventies read articles about But then it was really I saw a couple of parents on Donahue I. Don't I'm sure you've watched some of those right. That taught me the most about him. Because, it was him interacting with the crowd. I mean he was there for people to hate. You know that's why. Donahue brought him on, but what I noticed by the end of these episodes that. It wasn't like they were cheering for him, but he changed the temperature of the room. They were listening to him and I thought Oh man. This guy's a different kind of evil like a new form of racism. You know it sounds like whatever at the time was like the conception of a? Racist it's like a different thing where people are really starting to listen to him. We just same thing black lines and was trying to show how that changed the course of. Racism in America. To listen to all of these interviews and fall, and to learn more about the history were uncovering this season and how the show gets made. You've gotTA sign up for slate plus. It's thirty five dollars for the first year fifty nine dollars after that. And your membership helps keep slow-burn running. You'll get bonus episodes for this and every other season of slow-burn. And you'll get to skip all the ads on all sleep podcast. Sign up now at slate dot com slash slow-burn at sleep, dot com slash slow-burn. This week's episode of slow-burn was produced by me Christopher. Johnson and Chow to with aditorial direction. Buy Low and LOO and Gabriel Roth. Madeline Ducharme is our production assistant. So he summer Grad is slow burns. Assistant producer. Are Mixed engineer is Paul Mounsey. David Gross composed our theme saw. The artwork for slow-burn is by Lisa Larsson. Walker special thanks to Jordan Hirsch Jessica. seidman inflates Katie Raeford Laura Bennett House and Benedict and Jared Holt thanks for listening.

David Duke Joanna Joanna Burnett America Paul Mounsey David Dukes Duke Duke Derek Black Joanna Brunette Levy Charles Duhig New Orleans Spike Lee David Duke Austin reporter Ku Klux Klansmen David David Gross
Global Pariahs

Slate's Political Gabfest

1:05:32 hr | 1 year ago

Global Pariahs

"This episode of the gabfest contains explicit language. Hello and welcome to the political fest for June twenty. Fifth Twenty twenty the global pariahs edition. I'm David Lots of business insider. At home in. The. Dank dark cube off my bedroom in Washington DC. I'm joined from. New York City by John dickerson of CBS's sixty minutes Hello John. Hello David! Johnson his guest bedroom which I called the David Plots Memorial bedroom because I've stayed there. Have you put? The plaque the plaque is up and. It's been newly polished by the team of. Experts here since the dose dose. Yes, the five or six does since you have. And then there is Emily The New York, Times magazine, and Yale University Law, school from her home in new haven. Low Emily that might be a bedroom I've stayed in also. Do you have a point? I can't remember if you stayed in this room or a different room but I working on my plaque. I'm burnishing it. Okay good. I just need to pause for one second because I'm in this hidden room off my bedroom and I'm about to move from my home, and so all this everything's in disarray and discovered the most amazing thing which I just WanNa. Share with you guys. So a few years ago, for reasons, I cannot remember on and I came across something about. that there are these pinup catalogs for fish. And there I ordered something which seems to be called the carpenter, which is carp. It's women holding huge carp in various states of undress. It's the craziest thing I've ever seen. For Listeners The women or the carp that are in various stages of undress everybody I've seen. NATTY looking carbon in full coat and Thompson Tales it's so weird like this one she's. She's like struggling to carry this huge carp out of the like mermaids, except not, and it must be, said carved uncomfortable the carbs in the pictures that he's showing link the size of what? They're huge. They probably wait fifty pounds there like I'm bigger than a toddler. The calendar is hilarious but I digress. On today's. The virus is back where it really never left, and everything is falling apart in the south and west, and everything is also part for the trump administration, which is pretending, there is no virus. Then the politicization of the Department of Justice Bill Bar Roger Stone Michael Flynn. The cost of what happens when you personalized justice and put it justice in the hands of people who are unwilling to do justice or only willing to give justice to their friends, and not their enemies. Then there's a new slow-burn season about the rise of David Duke. We'll be joined by host Josh Levin to talk about Duke. The man who set the stage for the white nationalism that plagues us today it's fantastic podcast and can't wait to talk about it. Plus of course we will have cocktail chatter. If you were hoping to travel to Europe this summer? Sorry Americans have become global pariahs because of our inapt response to the coronavirus pandemic. While Europe and most of Asia have controlled the spread of the disease of covid nineteen. They've reduced. The are not below. One is spreading wildly Texas Arizona, and Florida among other states and the. Has simply given up. So, Emily, the most extraordinary part of this I mean. I think we have two stories happening at once one is. The virus there was no end of the first wave. The first wave simply moved itself elsewhere in the country, and is now in full flame, and then the second piece is that we have a federal government. At least at the at the White House level is completely absent in a way that is maddening and strange, so talk about those each of the two phenomenon. I mean I guess I feel like there's a split screen right because if you look at the northeast where the virus was the worst and really out of control earlier in the spring, the curve goes sharply down. We actually look a lot like Europe. And then you look at the southwest in the parts of the south, and you see this spike and I don't know if it's because they are using air conditioning more or. Their immunity levels were really low, or if it's because they reopen too fast, which lots of public health experts warn them about? But they look very different. It's only if you look at the country as a whole that it just looks like we're having one continuous wave that I sort of feel like that's deceptive in it makes more sense to think of this regionally as if we were quadrants of the country, or and if you think about Europe, there are some European countries that are. are having different experiences than others so again, I mean yes, they've done like so much better than us and they can dunk all over us. And you were calling the show. The global pariahs outset, referring to us but I just think we seem like pitiable and week, and like we can't take care of our own in this way. That's incredibly sad and I think for people who are skeptical that leaving all this individual governors, and not having a real coordinated federal strategy for testing and. Tracing and just sort of direction that has just proved to be a self-inflicted blow that we can recover from well. I would add that it's. You can you can also imagine that we didn't have a great strategy for testing and contact tracing, and you simply had a leadership which said behave responsibly that said wear a mask. Avoid Indoor gatherings. Don't say hold a massive aiming for twenty thousand seat indoor, gathering the state with a with a blossoming. Pandemic in in as part of your presidential campaign where you discourage people from wearing masks, so the fact that the leadership of the country has also not merely incompetently done things that it could have done if it were signs oriented, but actively discourage people from doing very easy public health measures, which would have kept US relatively safer. That is what is so appalling to me and so. You have not only the president and undermining the public health consensus at a moment where he could be helping, but it's also the consensus that's required to get the economy moving again. So this isn't just about. Keeping people healthy. It's the precondition to the thing. The President says he most desperately wants which is to return to economic activity and Austin Goolsbee did a paper on looking at the cell phone data, and the and the behavior of people before the shelter in place, and then wants the shelter in place, started happening, and then a period of when they started lifting, and what it found was what other studies have found what we've talked about. which is the precondition for increased economic activity is not a public order so that people can go rushing from their houses to press close to each other while they go through the clothing rack. The precondition is people like. Things are safer and they're not going to get sick and if you can't fix that, then you're not gonNa have the economic activity that everybody so desperately wants I. Mean Just rewind and imagine a world in which all the people who talked about how important it was to reopen the economy, which it is really important. We're going to have a million more people on the roles. Imagine those people. It said okay. Here are the three things we need to do to make sure we can get economic activity going. Governor Abbot in Texas. Now is talking about a massive outbreak. But when the numbers were ticking up, he was at first forbidding various mayors from imposing orders. People had to wear masks, and so the fact that masks became so partisan and divisive and that. Some conservatives have sneered at them. As this loss of freedom is just proved enormously costly and I think you're. Exactly, right that like the precaution of the mask and limits on gatherings are the precondition to being open, but it was. It's as if those dots have not been connected maybe until now when it feels like it's too late for a lot of people, or at least it's going to be much harder to control the spread of this virus, and that's GonNa have ripple effects out into the fall and next year. The Philadelphia enquirer did a piece this week in and the data are fuzzy, but it found that eighty five. Cases have gone up eighty four percent in states that don't require wearing masks in public in states where mask wearing his mandatory cases of fallen by twenty five percent. Just adding and then I'd add one other little piece of data. Is that a dozen dozens of secret service agents were asked to self quarantine because they had been with the president on his rally trip to Tulsa. With the part with the masking is just so infuriating because you see this. Masking portrayed by by people who are. Who Really? Deserve. they they deserve. They deserve extra years in hell. They deserve imprisonment. Saying Oh, it's an infringement on my liberty. These are people who wear seatbelts. These are people who if they go to a doctor's office and their their doctors is not wearing a mask as he operates or not wearing gloves when he operates. They think they would be upset about that. It is an act of it as an act of. Aggressive. What you know, evangelical cruelty to not mask yourself. It's not about protecting yourself. It's about protecting these other people, and there's the some sense that liberty is i. don't have to do anything that impinges on something I wanna do not that. I am responsible to all these other people around me. That is what is the this conception of liberty where you're not responsible to others is. Is, the most disheartening part of this whole thing for me? It's like we. We are in this together, because we just infect each other, let's protect each other. We should also note that there's going to be. Something interesting to watch as New York Connecticut new. Jersey announced that they're going to require states. This is basically a mini American version of what the European Union is is. noodling which is having a quarantine for people travelling from high in high case, states keeping them out of. New York Connecticut and New Jersey which is what Florida originally did with New York. Many months ago. I I WANNA talk a little bit about us being barred from Europe for the summer and and and also uh, barring immigrants, sparring H, one B visas, and forbidding people from applying for new green cards, and what that signifies I. Don't eight truthfully. There weren't a lot of people who are going to travel to Europe for vacation this summer. There weren't a lot of Americans are probably people who are trying to get back to family. Who will now not be able to do it, but I don't think there there is a there was going to be a huge travel boom. That is going to be quashed, so it's not that significant. From economic terms and Norwood, they're going to be tons of European travelers who are coming to the US or travelers from anywhere coming to the US for vacations here And it's also true that we're still going to be able to import iphones export soybeans expert music, but what's happening with what the trump administration's doing, and with with our completely incompetent covid response is that the things that make us essential to the rest of the world? Our ability to attract the best people are ability to attract the best ideas, and then then you know, remix those ideas and share them out in. In the world, it is completely halted for now, and the rest of the world is GonNa? Start to knit back together and we're going to be out of it and our ability to to sort of be the central place where it all comes together, and then we're the best ideas come. The best ideas are germinated and spread out is stopping, and and then we'll be diminished in the long haul so our central. The central power of the United States is not necessarily that we are the biggest market in the world, but it's that we're the place which most people wanted to come, and where which was the the heart of where culture was created where universities were were science were where people wanted to immigrate where there's a huge mix and we are. Becoming peripheral to that, and that's tragic the long run we are also included in that evaluation by the European Union with Russia and Brazil. Two Countries that are. Have a completely. Incompetent response to look over out breaks, so it's sort of the Betty Crocker seal of despair that we have been given by the European Union for our response. Can I just say one more thing about? The testing. Is that the the? The message from the President and the vice president is well who is who has been putting out the message that. Wall Street Journal piece that says America is winning the fight and the president. said that fears of a second waiver overblown, which is true, there is no second way because we're one. Right, but this is my point. The increase is that are happening, and particularly the increases in hospitalization are not just the increase of more testing. They're more cases happening and there is. There is actual alarm among experts. But when the President Vice President give people off roads so that they don't have to engage in the fact that there's actually an increase in hospitalization or an increase in danger. That's equally. That's like another special kind of danger here which is a keeps the ability to focus on one set of facts. It's not just the to deny those facts. It's to give people an easy way to not even have to look at them. Emily I want to close this segment with a question for you, which is that there was an astonishing poll from your hometown. Paper your employer. The New York Times this week about president trump, Joe Biden, which showed Joe Biden opening up a huge lead on president, trump, and and key reason for that seems to be people. Disheartened with the presence, poor response to the pandemic, and and as well as his response to the George. Floyd protests what did you make of that? Evidence that the Biden campaign is doing well, or at least the trump campaign is in is in dire shape. I mean I think the question with the trump. Presidency has always been if there was a real crisis, how would he handle it? And if he botched it would. That change has numbers, and the answer right now is yes I mean there's if you look at the approval ratings for trump over time you know NATO elvers always talking about. About how they revert to the mean right now they're not reverting to the me and they continue to separate i. mean they still could. We're five months away, but It's starting to look like people have are turning on him I. Want to add though that if you look at the swing states the numbers are closer right. We're talking about like eight points in Michigan or maybe six points in Pennsylvania and so if those polls are slightly off. If, they just haven't been done quite right to give trump supporters, enough weight, which is what we saw in two thousand sixteen, then the race in those states is closer, and so I think that, even though it can sound like a lot of just sort of nervous hand-wringing among liberals who were scarred by twenty sixteen to keep worrying. It seems like it's within striking distance could come back, and so trump could come back and so I think it's also important for these campaigns to be. Conveying, message of urgency and for voters, not to get complacent, because if they want a change of leadership, they're going to have to go and cast a ballot and the whole challenge of the election remains rate like the more we worried about the omnipresence of Cova the more we need, these vote by mail structures to be solid. We need cities and counties out there and making sure they have the capacity to actually run the selection and meanwhile. Trump just continues to attack mail in balloting as Crazy threat which it really isn't, and I was dismayed this week to see bill bar the attorney general joining in this attack, as if like these allegations and suspicions of fraud are not just like a fantasy of president trump's. The poll numbers in the battleground states. They are closer than the fourteen point lead that Biden has overall, but he's still relative to how trump dead in two thousand sixteen he's still doing better in those battleground states than than you'd expect so given that the battleground states have a higher a disproportionate share of of whites without college degrees, which is the president's strongest element of the electorate. What was striking in the Times was also was that on the questions? Hey, of masks. The country is basically not with the president on the question of black lives matter. The country is with the protesters and not and not with the president. So, you have two major conditions where that will be chronic and ongoing all the way through with the election when we think about reverting to the mean, usually what happens, is that the thing that causes the bad poll numbers disappears, and then the poll numbers revert the pandemic and the racial unrest in America will be here and the president's response to both seems to be actively move. Against Public opinion on both, so that that'll be one thing to watch. And then there was strange punditry about the president's ability to rely on the economy if it starts to come back, but if the economy doesn't come back until people feel confident enough by the response to the pandemic I'm not sure how he takes advantage of resurgent economy, since he has been against the measures that are the preconditions for that economy to re animate. Slate plus members you get bonus segments on the Gab fest other slate podcasts, and also you provide hugely valuable and appreciate support for the journalism it's does overall we really encourage you to become a slight plus member if you possibly can, it's been a tough time for slate, and that they could benefit from your support. If something you value in your in a position to be able to do it, it's only thirty five dollars for the first year, and you get to hear more of us. And the bonus segment you're going to get on slate plus today we're GonNa talk about three months into the pandemic until lockdown into quarantine to into this diminished, narrowed life. What is it that we have come to love? And what is it that we're sick of? So go to sleep. Dot Com slash fest plus to become a member today. The corruption of justice has been a defining element of the trump years. He's used pardon. Power grotesquely is installed an attorney general bill bar who has proven willing to take an obscene view of executive power over fair justice, and to literally create a different standard of justice for trump's friends than for his enemies. This week we have seen all those forces colliding I with an effort by bar to expel the US attorney in Manhattan and replace that US Attorney with a bar lapdog. then. By testimony, and then testimony to the Jewish has judiciary committee, a former DOJ prosecutors that bar or his lackeys had ordered them to go easy on Roger Stone in sentencing, because he was a friend of trump then with the decision by panel of Appeals Court judges to stop another judge from investigating. The DJ's really. Shady decision bars really shady decision to drop charges against Michael Flynn. These are just three recent examples. We also have the. Persecution of former acting FBI director, Andrew, McCabe We have his bars efforts to hide trump's personal finances from investigators, he bars and attempt to undermine the Mueller investigation, so it's it's been a really dismal couple of years of bill bars probably hasn't even been a couple of years probably only one of the things. There's only been three months, but it feels like a couple of years. So Emily, there's a Republican lawyer named Donald Air. Who testified before the House Judiciary Committee yesterday I'm here because I believe that William Bar poses the greatest threat in my lifetime to our rule of law and to public trust in it is that. A fair statement. Donald Air I believe worked with Bill. Bar in the nineteen eighties in the Justice Department and really doesn't like him. I talked to him a couple of months ago and he has strong memories of Bar, being very aggressive in his definition of presidential power back then, and I think we're still continuing to see that play out. The current version of it has to do with these prosecutions of stone in Flynn. That trump doesn't wanNA have happening plus other investigations in the southern district of new. New York also presumably disadvantageous to president, trump or people. He's close to like Rudy Giuliani and so you see bar willing to interfere in investigations in a way. That is what the president wants him to do. There's no law against this I mean this is a set of norms established after Watergate, that was supposed to really protect the Justice Department and investigations from meddling by the president. But if you decide as attorney general that you just don't really care about those things very much, then you. You can change how that works, and so I think what we're seeing is all the manifestations of that and it looks really rotten. It looks like the president. Friends are getting off and the prosecutor who testified about hearing that they were going to change the sentencing recommendation for Roger Stone, because that was the the political interest that was the way the wind was blowing in the justice, department. That's just not how it is supposed to work. There are so many professional lawyers there who depend on it. It not working that way, and then to me I think the worst thing this week was the DC circuits opinion telling Judge Sullivan in the Flynn case that he can't even have a hearing to explore the very strange looking decision. The Justice Department made to drop these charges against Flynn after he had twice pled guilty. And when you read that opinion by and I only royale, who is a recent and much hailed trump appointee. It's just really strained legal reasoning about the role of the court. At this stage of a case, and there's a very strong dissent by Judge Wilkins who is a Clinton appointee and I assume that roused. Decision is going to be overturned by the circuit when they all get together and hear the case again in what's called on bank review, but in the meantime it just looks like the courts are also shaky, and we passed a milestone this week that we now have two hundred trump appointees who've been confirmed to the bench by the Senate, zero of whom by the way are black. That was amazing I saw that. I, little you. Possibly be true, yeah, shocking, and these two hundred judges, some of them have a really deeply held set of conservative beliefs that at least appear in this decision to extend to. Protecting president trump I mean it's really hard for me not to reach judge rows, opinion and think that's what's going on, and that's just not. That is not how it's supposed to work the collection of instances in which the President who believes the Justice Department works for him and then. The Stone Flynn. All of these cases are go right to the heart of something. The president campaigned against which was remembered the swamp. What was the idea behind the swamp? It was that people in power would use the levers of power to help themselves or help their friends. secondarily that their concern would be disproportionately arrayed towards the things they cared about and not towards the. The larger country so when you think about the president and his things he gets concerned about and the people to whose aid he rushes. It's people like Flynn and stone. It goes to something. He was supposedly coming to Washington to change. Which is the use of office? For the interests in ambitions of those in power. Right I mean the FBI law enforcement is amazing. It goes after black people and when it goes after his friends, they're the most corrupt people on the planet. and. One other tiny thing as a management matter when you look at the president, and because he was beating up on John Bolton perhaps justifiably, but when you look at how he rags on all the people who've last left his administration. The people he defends the person he defends. Is Michael Flynn. Who regardless of what the courts may say did in fact lie about what he did to his vice-president, and in fact didn't tell the truth about his dealings with Turkey, so sps separate and apart from the judicial part, just in terms of maintaining his duties as a as an official, the president praises the ones with the issues and rags on the ones who didn't have them. Emily I wonder if you get a sense of is the guild ship of lawyers so strong that if we get a new democratic president. that. In. This kind of use of the Justice Department as a as your personal law firm will not be permitted. or People come in, and we'll the norm snap back into place. or I actually almost had the question, which was if you really wanted to get the norms solidified. Maybe the thing to wish for is for Democratic president to come in and behave exactly the way trump is so that Republicans and some and some Democrats will be like what the hell this cannot be, and putting in some very strong, congressional and judicial restraints that that will outlast. Whatever president is I mean I guess there's sort of two questions. Here are so to pick up on your thread for a minute you. You might think that it's time to have an independent council again. A strong independent counsel statute in which the appointment of that person comes from a three judge panel as it did, after Watergate instead of from within the Justice Department, which is how muller was appointed I. Totally think there's a case for that. I think I, actually made that case about a month ago, and it really has more to do with the key. The cases involving trump's tax returns, and how bar was able to manipulate the rollout of Muller's report. So. That's one way of thinking about this that actually we're. We're constantly in this country, and in other countries wrestling with how to have truly independent investigation. Removed from the presidency that does not spiral completely out of control, as people think that it did for example in the Ken Starr Investigation and maybe in the Lawrence Walls investigation before that if you are Republican and so that idea that. We want to re scituate firmer source of power like maybe this is cyclical, and we had problems with the first independent counsel statute, but now getting away from it we should go back, but the other questions about like these decisions about sentencing and dropping the charges with the stone in the Flynn cases that you just want some principled attorney general to come back in. In and empower the career professional lawyers you know in these cases, the people who worked on them for years refused to sign the briefs, and either resigned from the Department or left the case. That's a matter of just like restarting the professional ethos of the department, and you're going to have to bring in some more people because there's been attrition and just like. You know despair going on internally. I mean this testimony about the politicization of the stone case. This week was incredible like prosecutors. It takes so much for people in that position to make that kind of turn, and so what you really want is just to restore. Office in that in that vein? I ask You a question about the Flynn. Case was the were. Was the appeals court determination? About the underlying case about whether a judge can deny essentially a prosecutor's motion to dismiss charges. It's about the ladder I, so yeah, I mean I. Thank you for asking because what what's happening here is prosecutors have tons of control overcharging decisions, but this is no longer a charge decision. This is someone who pled guilty, and so in order to dismiss the charges in that context. You have to have the leave of the court. The judge has to sign off and so what Judge Sullivan tried to do because he basically thought something fishy was going on was to appoint Judge Gleeson retired. Retired judge to come in and argue the position for not dismissing the charges that the government was no longer argue he wants to air all this and find out what the hell is going on. What the DC. Circuit opinions we said is no. You can't have a hearing. It was improper for you to appoint Judge Gleeson. You can't try to get to the bottom of this. You just have to sign off on it and when you read the analysis by judge row, it's a very wooden. Separation of powers analysis about the judge, the judiciary versus the prosecutor the Executive Branch Even though that is just really not how this it's called rule forty eight that. Right that's just not how it's worked before. Not How other circuits? Think that it works, but she was very concerned about that. You know for me as someone who cares a lot about prosecutorial power. In this case, the DC circuit is preventing a judge from. Allowing Prosecutor to exercise mercy right at least like without investigating it, but really it's just about the idea. The judges have no say over the decisions. Prosecutors make an often. Prosecutors are GONNA make more punitive decisions, so there's that kind of aspect, too, but was rows. Decision based on this idea that you said at the beginning, which is that executive branch officials and I'm asking about the separation of powers part that executive branch officials have. Power to make determinations within their own branch particularly when it has to do with mistaken prosecution. which you might agree with, and which previous readings of rule forty eight would agree with, but what makes this different is, this is left over and out of the executive into the judicial because of the guilty plea that that makes it something that's not just within the executive. Yes, it's a different phase. It's also true. The judges have to sign off when somebody accepts a plea bargain right so all of that plea bargaining negotiation happens in the executive branch with the prosecutor's office, but then a judge has to sign off. This however is like a step beyond that where you've had the guilty plea. Already. The judge has duly. Accepted it and now you're saying to me I don't WanNa do this anymore and the judges. Just saying you have to explain I mean so much of the legal trouble. The trump administration has and we were talking about this last week and the dock ace or I guess we didn't really get to talk about it. Because the DACA case came down right after we taped, but it's the same problem. They give really fishy or. Shoddy, they guess fishy or shoddy reasons for what they're doing. And there is something that kind of offends the intelligence of some judges. I think that was part of what seemed to at least be animating Chief Justice Roberts, last week in the Daca case Sullivan before has done this in the Ted Stevens case a Republican senator, in which then Sullivan ultimately. Undid the ruling against the Republican senator. My point is if you're searching for partisan motivation here and what the what row and other words say as. Extra judicial process or whatever he doesn't use the same process before. Yeah I mean this is the judge. That's a huge case of a a terrible black stain on the justice. Department, for prosecutorial misconduct because they hid. exculpatory evidence, involving senator former senator Stevens and judge Sullivan was willing to really like. Look under the rock to find out what had happened, and it has nothing to do with partisan affiliation. He just wants prosecutors to behave in a regular manner right and he can see that's what's or he has a suspicion. That's what HAPP. What's happening in front of him in the Flynn case is. Irregular. I want to disclose actually just by making a point. which I like to make periodically because I think it's really important, which is that? If you are B believe in a super expensive you of executive power bill bar does, and the president can do the various things he does, and that the public's the public mechanism for for constraining. That is an election. That's a theory, but what happens when the thing that the president does is exercise pardon power for people like perhaps Roger Stone or Paul Manafort Michael Flynn protect his friends. But what he is protecting them from what he is, what the punishment he is helping them. Avoid punishment. That would come because they helped him cheat to win the election. And, so the idea that the election can be the remedy. For All of this presidential executive overreach doesn't work if what the presidential executive overreach. is distorting justice distorting the law to cheat to win the election? And! That's what's so unsettling to me. It's like I. I feel like if you felt like. Oh, well, we can have an honest election and that that's when we're going to. That's when we're going to call the president who account. That's the. I still don't believe that theory, but that is the theory, but if you can't have an honest election, because the cheating is happening in the justice. Department is allowing the cheating to happen by administering justice unequally. Then the whole thing falls apart so just a final point. Support for the GATT FEST comes from Casper Casper has done it again with all new mattresses. Are you waking up with back pain. Casper introduced zoned support their unique economic system designed to keep your spine aligned while you sleep. There's also something brand new called Air Scape which is engineered foam layers perforations that help you regulate your sleep temperature. From betting to bed frames, and even a dog bed Casper has everything you to build your dream bedroom for every kind of sleeper. And now Casper is offering free contactless delivery, and as always free returns. To Casper. Dot Com and use Promo Code Gabfest for one hundred dollars off your mattress order. That's Code Gab best for one hundred dollars off your mattress order, terms and conditions apply see casper dot com slash terms support for this podcast comes from iheartradio JC I'm sorry, but staying on top of the news. Every single day has been really hard I. Wish there was an easy way to get everything I. Need to now Hayes I think you're forgetting about news o'clock you know the daily podcast we host from buzzfeed and Iheartradio Oh, right? I'm Haze Brown and I've Casey Raca and every day on news. o'clock we help you catch up on all the stories you missed throughout the day from corona virus updates the latest pop culture with a little help from special guest like a Ray I definitely won't be able to do a yeah party this year at. My only chance to be the life of a party. Your boat. It's your party. They will pay. Back! My News o'clock is the new podcast from Buzzfeed, an Iheartradio that you need to keep track of life outside of quarantine listen to news o'clock on the iheartradio APP. slow-burn season four David Duke. The wonderful slate podcast series, which takes deep dives into history that we think we remember we kind of know, and excavates incredible stories that actually be forgotten, so it was done with Watergate Clinton scandal with the murders of big in to park, and now we have a new season season four and a new host, Josh Levin, who I think slates national editor right Josh that is right. David and host of hang up and listen, and Josh is digging in to the. Story of David Duke. Who is of course, the former KKK leader, the I guess you could even argue Nazi according to some of Josh's reporting who came within a hair's breadth of becoming governor, and then perhaps even senator from Louisiana in the early nineteen ninety s so hello Josh. Welcome congratulations on slow-burn. It's fantastic. Thank you so much so I think people remember David Duke the. He has this kind of the handsome troy Aikman looking guy in the eighty s a very very good looking blonde white guy who suddenly. Emerge so who was the? And and how did he emerge? To the world, maybe not to the narrow streets of Louisiana to the world as a whole. I have never heard the troy aikman comparison before so I have to give you props for that I think it's kind of apt appearance wise, but he was infamous in the seventies as the face, the new face of the new Ku Klux Klan. Duke tried to present. damage of of the clan is the kind of suit wearing intellectual racist, and he had some degree of success with that he got a lot, a national television a lot Um, and so he had some degree of of renowned from that period, and then he sort of went away for a while and reemerged in the late eighties is like a slightly more racist or maybe more than slightly. More Racist Ronald Reagan talking about how he wanted to lower taxes how he was opposed to affirmative action and one elected office as a Republican in Louisiana one seat in the state legislature, and used that as a platform to then run for the Senate and for governor, and that's kind of when he became really nationally famous Josh I love the scene of the podcast. Where you use this recording that a woman who kind of infiltrated at this moment, right? She's at this convention where Duke is and doesn't say that she's a reporter necessarily, but she has this revealing tape of Duke. The got him into some trouble and one of the things that I kept thinking about as I was listening was just this like line that do keeps crossing right I mean he's by affiliating with the clan by talking about really white power explicitly. that. People White people don't usually say in plate society, and yet he's also picking up on these deep grievances. That white people around him have I mean? How did you end up thinking about him? On the spectrum giving voice to what lots of white people talk about in the privacy of their own homes, or is he kind of pulling grievances that could be not necessarily racist in a more racist direction so I think his core audience is base when he was. In the clan was people who had extraordinarily racist views who are very prejudiced, and he gave voice to deeply bigoted ideas, and in order to build a larger base one that could get him elected to office one. That could Constitute A broad-based national kind of movement. He needed to pull people who would say the kind of like I'm not racist, but and so he would take people who had maybe a little bit of a seed of I feel like. Things are going my way Maybe I don't have a job or maybe I think I should have more stature in life, and we're looking for someone to blame and David Duke would assign that blame. He would say that it's people on Welfare. He would say it's women having illegitimate children and he would say just exactly what what you said I'm brave I'm authentic will know that everybody believes everything that I'm saying. We all know that this is what you talk about and what you feel deep in your heart, and I'm the only one with the courage. To say so, he made his followers feel like they were members of this club of this tribe, and the idea was like you know we are are all being real. We're being honest and everybody else just isn't acknowledging the truth of the world, and that's a pretty powerful idea. That triumph of authenticity. Yeah, I mean, he's a totally authentic. Individual. WHO SELLING AUTHENTICITY I? Mean? I don't get into too much in the PODCAST, but a lot of people relate the plastic surgery that he had with the way that he changed his his views, and that's I. Think it's fair to make that comparison. It feels a little bit too need to me to say look. This guy is a different face and and different views, but. But he really was somebody who adapted to the Times. I don't think he ever really changed his truly core antisemitic anti-black views. He would just figure out how to ride the wave and present those ideas in a way that would chime with the time, so you know always arguing that he was authentic while at the same time. Always changing has a self presentation. So that's one of the things I wanted to ask you about Josh George Wallace. Famously loses in one, thousand, nine, hundred, fifty eight. He's endorsed by the end. W. C. P.. His opponent is endorsed by the K. K. K.. And he basically says in an in an incredibly vulgar expression. I'm not going to use that. He's not going to let that happen again. And he then becomes the the candidate who says segregation now, segregation I guess today tomorrow, and forever so it was, it was always interested me with Wallace is whether he was just deep down. A racist and then pretended not to be, and then fell back to his first love. If Duke is constantly sculpting his public persona to stay right on top of the line with deepen his bones from his birth, or what portion of it was seeing an opportunity in the electorate there? Whilst there. It was deepen as bones from what we know about do key. I found kind of sense of community. In the white citizens, council in New Orleans in the nineteen sixties when he was a teenager, these were groups that existed to oppose integration of of schools primarily, and so duke cut a difficult home life, and he found people there who welcomed him and who saw him as a kind of intellectual prodigy. He had also started at that early age. Age to embrace Nazism to embrace Hitler's ideas as laid out in mind comp and the people in the White Citizens Council also You know we're like we're not. We're not really as into this Hitler stuff. Don't you stick to You know the the regular old American racism, but he would continue to be fascinated by and pursue these Neo Nazi beliefs into college and beyond. And so there's no indication in anything that I've. Read or heard or seen that there was a calculation on the level of not believing the like really core views that that he starts expressing in the sixties and. You know barely below the surface I mean as emily pointed out the opening of the series. You know the intention there. The editorial choice of putting that I is to show that during this period when he's on presenting himself or about to present himself as a conservative politician behind closed doors, he saying the Holocaust doesn't exist. The world is ready for a new Hitler it's it's on Tape Josh. At the moment there's a white nationalist right that is poisoning. American politics at its it has become a surprisingly to me dominant force in conservative politics, and it certainly animates some of the support for president, trump and president trump certainly at least winks at it. Is there a single line that takes us from David Duke to the white nationalist rate of today, is he in fact, the father of this the ancestor of this, or is it a different? Is this different movement with different antecedents? They're a bunch of direct lines. Allies ass low is really smart on this. has been called rising out of hatred about Derek Black. WHO's David Duke's Godson? And who is considered the air? He was actually called the air by people in the White Nationalist Movement Derek eventually broke away from it, but you know his father, Don Black, who is dukes kind of closest friend and ally in the clan, and then who started the racist Website Storm Front which is kind of the nerve center of lot of this this movement you know Don and David Duke both were trying to mold. Derek to become the new are better version of what Duke was and Duke was I think of inspirational in terms of how far he got and how he was able to. Bring these ideas to gubernatorial runoff in Louisiana how he was able to put. A different kind of face on white supremacy and white nationalism, and I think one thing so interesting that you lice slow told me was that Don Black and David Duke were always. Primed for failure that they would have never imagined or hoped or dreamed that their ideas would have kind of currency that they have today, and that actually people with extreme views like this often see failure, perversely as success did it shows them how resolute they are. It shows that. They won't stop even when they're told to. And so actually dealing with success is is not something that they're used to. That's really interesting, I mean. I say there's this. Predictability to this strain of politics rate. I, mean it's not just in the united. States! Obviously, we've seen a rise in Europe and various moments as well on the far right is also. On the upswing in Europe. There's this part of me. That just feels like there's something kind of. Boring about always coming up with the same groups to treat as the other and being so unwilling to see kind of common sense of humanity across racial or religious differences. I'm not exactly sure how I bring listened to a question, but when you watch the footage of Duke at the Charlottesville March, which is kind of high in the last few years for this movement, I mean. Do you feel like there's just this? Way that it's inevitably that that people's distress about their own lives of their feelings about how they've suffered or not achieved what they want to like that it's always going to express itself unease, racial and religious terms mean it always has thus far in human history I mean I. Guess It could change but I think that's the pattern that we've seen recur in America and throughout the world, and and what you just said made me think. Think of the debate between David Duke and Jesse Jackson, in Nineteen, seventy seven, we included some of that in our second episode where Jackson who at that point was considered kind of the leading voice and and the Black Civil Rights, movement makes a cross racial class-based appeal in this debate around shared humanity. You know, he says things that sound very modern to our ear. He talks about You know he the reason that he's. Taking this opportunity to speak with do because that he wants to address his constituency directly. Because when people feel economic anxiety there, you know prayed demagogues. We didn't include it, but Jackson also talks about things like universal healthcare and the importance of that, and so you see this kind of opposing strain and Jackson. You know would have a great deal of success in an eighty s as a presidential candidate with this message, and so there are always these opposing forces at work. If you want to put like a little bit more optimistic, spin on, it is just like people like David Duke creating a vacuum. That's the only message out there in the like there have always been and I think we'll always be people who are trying to sell a different vision. What's David Dukes role in life now Josh? I as emily mentioned, he was in Charlottesville he. He claimed the MARCI ON DONALD TRUMP's name detail. You know saying that we're going to fulfill the promise of Donald Trump and then there was that moment in the campaign when Jake Tapper asked him about him and and Donald Trump was. Incapable of answering the question to such an extent that Mitch. McConnell said. That criticized for seeming ambivalence towards David Duke in the KKK. What is role now in in conservative politics? I would characterize him. kind of like a spent Husky at this point. Like his ideas are are his ideas are much more important than he is. I mean. He has a Internet radio show He's always trying to inject himself. Into the national conversation, and even when he has some degree of success with today, the level of successes is of microscopic compared to what it used to be. I mean he was just personally discredited. He went to prison for income tax issues. He was seen as a perpetual candidate and I think his message in the state. Of Louisiana got a little stale as people got tired of the Messenger, so I'm not doing this podcast, because I think duke himself personally is an important figure force. In contemporary politics are American life but I think the path that he went on is telling an interesting and historically important, and I do think that his ideas and the way he tried to present them. That's still alive issue and our society today so Josh Duke excited about this podcast. Because of the attention, it brings him. They wouldn't surprise me. I mean I haven't heard him. EXP- express that either to me or to anyone else, but he loves attention and thrives off of it and. We heard in the in the second episode. A bit of the first interview that gave Duke National Platform on the tomorrow. Show with Tom, Snyder. And Snyder I think naively. Figured that it would be kind of Edgy and interesting to have this clan guy on his show. You know he gave. Duke a platform and the ability to define himself in front of millions of people, and that gave Duke Oxygen at that time, and so I think that's a risk when you are featuring a someone like this is a worth giving them the attention that they want, and I think you have to be very. Careful about how you approach that I hope I. I've done it appropriately, but it is something that I think you need to ponder when whether it's somebody like David Duke or Richard Spencer. What are you getting out of? Highlighting them and I think that's why. I've focused more. On the past and on the president with Duke. I want to show what he did rather than who has now. Josh. Levin is the host of slow-burn season for David Duke. Listen to it now on whatever podcast platform you listen to podcasts on. It's great thanks Josh. Thank you David and Emily and John. Congratulations Josh. Let's go to cocktail chatter John. I discovered frozen this past week. My God I can't believe I've lived my whole life. I've lift ears that I. Say it's delicious. Like a like like a thirty five year old woman. It's fantastic what the hell is for frozen sounds like something. You would find in an Oldie issue of. Rosy rosy, slushy made with it's like Rosette frozen rose A. Berries sugar I think some vodka and it's like a slushy. Delicious Raw. That sounds young. So when you're having your frozen. And Dickerson manse. What are you GonNa? Be Checking in Abidjan. okay, frozen So I've got two quick chatters. The one is. A revelation about been frustrated by people who when you when you have kids, they say oh, you know pay. Take a pay attention to every moment because it all goes by so fast because. What the hell does that mean really and all it does is bum you out at the beginning of your child's life by telling you. It's all going to zip by quickly. However, sometimes it feels like it's lasting forever. That's true, but then when you come to the position where they are teenagers in about to leave the house. You feel this acutely that. Oh, my gosh time passed so quickly, but then if you tell people with new children, this all you're doing is replicating the bad advice. You were given not bad. It's not even advice really. It's a lamentation anyway so I. Now have to actual concrete things that new parents can do, which are based on my own discoveries in this Kovic period as we've had extra time at home to kind of clean things up, one thing is that an God lover wrote notes about the kids like at the end of every day when when she could about like just what they were doing and how they were paving, and we came across some the other day and They were incredibly transporting the things we'd totally forgotten. And the the memories were. It was quite a bomb to the encroaching feeling of leaving them or having them leave us. The second thing is record their voices which IBS everybody now because they have iphones we didn't want our kids were born, but the little voices they have are so extraordinary, and you forget it with the passage of time. Those are two concrete things you can do if you are having new kids now. The second part of my chatter is a piece called poker in the psychology of uncertainty. What's in wired by Maria Kondakova? She's Maria. She's the she's the best. You could also it's an amazing piece in. That says which is great about how poker which I don't play, but. Is a great preparation for the complexity of the kinds of decisions you make in life, and I wish I'd known this before. I'd written my book because it's a perfect encapsulation of the kind of risk taking leaps. You have to take with bad when you're dealt a bad hand as a president, it's like, and I spent all these chapters talking about that, and this would have been a perfect thing. But it's also just. breezily written light on its feet. Fun to read. So I. I recommend it to everyone. Emily what is your chatter I recommend Maria Konakov who I love and who is a frequent guest or she used to be at least a frequent guest on the gist but she's just A. She's so smart and funny, and I can't wait to read her book. My shadow this week is about the city of Philadelphia, so you may or may not remember a few weeks ago at the beginning of the. The protests there was a mass protests that went onto the highway outside of Philadelphia or actually right inside of Philadelphia six seventy six, and there was this mass teargassing where the police gassed all these protesters, and they had to run to get out of the way it was really scary and upsetting incident. The police said they had no choice. They were under threat. They said that there were people throwing rocks. Rocks at a cop car that there was a cop car that was surrounded, so some of the footage of it's not body cam footage, but it's the camera footage from a couple of the cop cars that were there has been released, and it doesn't show anything threatening. You cannot tell watching this more than fifty minutes. What prompted the police to let loose with all this tear gas? It is possible that. That there's something happening somewhere else on that highway that did provoke this response, but this is all the footage that we've gotten not clear with all the city in state police. Who Were there? Why this is it? But so far it is, and it's just it's really upsetting. It makes me feel once again that the police are not telling the truth and just that there was this like really scary incident. Didn't need to happen. You know out of very chaotic moment for the cops for sure, but distressing, really distressing. My chatter is about a really unsettling story in the Atlantic by Melissa Fay Greene. She's a really good right art reporter, and it is about what happened to those children in the Romanian orphanages in the. In the end of last year's communism, so if you remember in nineteen, eighty-nine Ninety s Romania. As, the communist government of Romania fell and Nikolai Ceaucescu was was deposed, and I think ultimately executed There was this discovery that tens of thousands of children had been tossed into horribly. Squalid orphanages across, Romania, and that was a horrible experiment to because the orphanages featured very little touch and love and attention to the children, and so there are these children, some of whom were severely disabled in various ways who had just been neglected, and there was an enormous global campaign to try to. Rescue, these children, and find them homes, and many of them did find homes and many some America Melissa Fay Greene. Tries to figure out what happened to these children. What happens when you are raised for the first formative years of your life in an environment without love and touch and. Care and trusting relationships and bonds, and she finds in particular one young man who's now thirty nine years old. WHO's the manager of a KFC outside of Denver and talks about what his life has been like. It's a it's a really sad story and just makes you feel that. The decisions the that the Romanian government made in these the way they set these orphanages with tragic and cruel and touch a crime against these poor children who whose lives have been ruined by it. I also have a very quick other. I need your advice listeners, so I'm moving into an apartment. I haven't lived I've. Been in for most of my adult life, and I haven't been moved in a really long time and I don't really know what it's like to set up a house, and like how you deal with all the things of setting up a house if you have this dickersonespn request if you have life hacks for moving and for setting up new house and like how you get. Get furniture. Right like placate places to do shortcut, so you don't have to endlessly I dunno like better ways to hang, hang pictures, or whatever it is I could welcome them, so please email me at David plots a g mail DOT COM. If you have great advice, could really use it great service, Great Organization. Great whatever it is that you've had experience with I'd appreciate it. Can I give one piece of advice as really obvious so I always a big rush when we moved to make everything like set up again. I hate living among boxes I. Find it very unsettling. It's better however not to like. Do it all at once, because if you let yourself as I never want to live in a place for a little while you'll actually end up making better decisions about things like where to hang a picture or what kind of rug you need to buy, etc, so give yourself a little time to breathe as my small piece of advice. You're probably already sane enough to know that. And and a corollary to that is to pack one box full of the things that will make you feel most at home whether it's your. Freeze it, what's it? What's it called? The drink you're drinking. A. Salad your thermos of frozen. Or your favorite tea or your? Whatever that will make it feel. Less destabilizing. In the in that period that emily quite rightly puts her finger on. We took us. I'm in I'm now in I'm recording this from a new room because we keep readjusting, so the readjustment takes so long time. Okay good to know, thank you. Listeners? You have also sent us wonderful chatters this week. So many good ones please continue tweet to us at slate, Gabfest, whatever it is, that is occupying your resume drinking time. Please let us know this week's chatter. Actually strangely is comes from my old employer. At obscure, it's Frederick Hilden at F. Hell Dane. Points to a wonderful video made by a couple of former colleagues of mine, former colleague of mine at Atlas Obscure About. In Australian artist named Anton Thomas and what Anton Thomas did is over the course of five years. He hand drew a map of North America. with using colored pencils. And it is. An extraordinary level of detail the whole map is it's about the size of a person, and it's just gorgeous and my former colleague Jessica Hester interviews Anton Thomas and talks to him about making this map, and how he puts all these special details in it, and you can now buy digital reproduction printed reproduction of this map and it's it's glorious glorious little video. He's incredibly charmaine in that way and the map is spectacular. That's our shepard today. The gap is produced by Jocelyn. Frank or researcher is bridget dunlap Gabriel Roth is editorial director of podcast. You Thomas Managing Producer Alicia Montgomery is executive producer of podcast for Emily. Baz, Lan and John dickerson. I'm David Plots, please. tweet chats to us at slate, Gabfest and follow us on twitter there. We will talk to you next week. Hello slate, plus how are you? Good Okay we've now had about. Three months spent more than three and a half months of covid life. And so we thought we talk about what we actually lie about it. And what did we like about it for a while that we've stopped liking? I have a lot of thoughts. I'm sure you guys have a lot of thoughts. I like the pace I like. The things are slow down that I have fewer things to do people in my house sleep a little more than they slept before. And we're all together constantly, which has its moments of intense irritation, especially children toward parents, but also is quite lovely, and has like you know gotten us to have really long conversations go on long walks. Cook a Lotta meals, but mostly I just think it's GonNa. Be Actually hard for me to go back to the faster pace that I was used to with so much more travelling and moving around all the time. Did you guys know what the phony war is. My mother was talking to me about this, so in the period between the Nazi and Soviet invasion of Poland and then the invasion, of France which was maybe six months later so as Late nineteen, thirty nine, and then the first few months of nineteen forty. Gavitt fans that was just a tease her to hear the rest of our slate plus conversation go to slate dot com slash gabfest, plus to become a slate plus member today.

president David Duke Emily Michael Flynn DONALD TRUMP Europe Josh Times Roger Stone New York Louisiana prosecutor Josh Levin executive Pandemic David David Duke Judge Sullivan Justice Department America
Full Episode: Monday, February 18, 2019

Nightline

00:00 sec | 2 years ago

Full Episode: Monday, February 18, 2019

"Are you hiring with indeed you can post job in minutes set up screener questions than zero in on your shortlist of qualified candidates using an online dashboard get started today at indeed dot com slash Nightline. That's indeed dot com slash Nightline. Good evening, and thanks so much for joining us, Spike Lee, his latest movie landed six Oscar nominations and combines today's headlines with history from the civil rights era, black klansman ease. The Hollywood version of police detective true story investigating the Ku Klux Klan Nightline co anchor. Byron Pitts goes behind the scenes with the Star City cast and the man who got inside the clan. This American nerve point more expose wrong than we have seen in generation Richie boiling point in the summer of two thousand seventeen in Charlottesville. Terrorism is home grown homegrown. Apple pie. American terrorists with understand that terrorism is terrorism. Milk comes comedic relief with the sharpest of edgy. What can I do for? Well, since you asked I hate blacks. Spike, Lee's newest film, black plans based on Volve him a true story. I'm happy to be talking about true white American. God bless white America. Nineteen Seventy-eight Colorado Springs. Colorado a black cop infiltrates, the KKK, and is depicted in the movie buddies up to unsuspecting David Duke, then grand wizard of the klu Klux Klan today, we are privileged. To be among white men and white women. It is unapologetic about his subtle as the chef gun style Lee links America's ugly past with race to her uncomfortable present the whole goal going in. With connect this film that takes place in the seventies. It was happening to date and Agent Orange. David Duke and the Neo Nazis gave me a coda. You're referring to the president is states. President trump. I say I call them Agent Orange. I wanna thank you so much. For never putting your country's second. America. First some of the language in the film seems to be lifted from today's political rhetoric from this day forward. It's going to be only America first America first. This film directly takes on President Trump and his initial refusal to renounce hate groups. I think there's blame on both sides. And I have no doubt about it. And you don't have any doubt about it. Either. You're not a fan of President Trump like many people in America you take unfair shots at him. And this g think I. Did not tell Asia orange to make that statement. He did that you also had people that were very fine people on both sides. Why should they be any liberation when you chew between peaceful? Protesters and hate groups how do you propose to make this investigation all of established contact and created some familiarity with the clansman over the phone? What clansman is the Hollywood take on run stallworth book about his time as a police detective investigating the KKK how in the world. Did you come with the idea to infiltrate like client? I was talking to Kitto dill the local Klan organizer on the phone and told him that my sister had recently dated a so-called in word, I hate that term but had recently dated one. And every time he put his filthy black hander pure white body. It made me cringe, and I wanted to do something to stop that abuse of the white race. His response to me was just kinda man we're looking for when can we meet, that's where you? Yeah. That's when I thought, okay. What have I gotten myself into? I gotta do something infiltrating. The KKK sounds like something from this famous. Dave Chapelle skit about a black white supremacist. But in this case over says it actually happened. He's still carries his claim membership car with him today. I have a warped humor. If I'm ever in a fatal car crash on poor cups gonna come up on my mangle, black body, go through my personal effects find that card and just freak out. John David Washington, Denzel Washington, son plays stove in the movie. How was it for you? As a young black man relating to the story about a young black man from the nineteen seventy s did it seem familiar in that language of hate did. I mean, I was called the N word by a white person North Carolina when I was ten years old. And you remember that still? Yeah. But I have a lot of fun great memories of North Carolina too. So that was just that's just one I'm not risking my life to prevent some rednecks from lending a couple of six on fire still work needed a stand in of course for the face to face meeting. So white officer agree to go undercover. I'm gonna get you your membership card. So you can go to the cross burning and get in deeper with these guys in the movie Etem driver plays his white counterpart ever seat. Once they send you your membership card. You'll be able to participate in all our programs stone with managed to get David Duke himself on the phone grand wizard of the Ku Klux Klan that that David Duke. Yes that grand wizard and national director. Yeah. How'd you get David Duke on the phone of all clansman? I've always had a philosophy. Why should I waste time talking to the lowest rung on the totem pole when I can go directly to the top. I consider you a true white American hero. Is there any other kind? No, sir. If he was. Isn't who he was you could have the type of guy. You would wanna sit down have a drink with talk about whatever. True, white American. In. It seems like there's less and less stuff is out there these days, but his win the subject to race came up the doctor Jekyll became mister, high the monster and him was unleashed. And he was often running Toepfer grace plays, David Duke. I knew if there was anyone I could do it for anyone. I mean, there was one person that could that I feel comfortable doing with. It'd be spice. I just had proven easy to say, look, no one's going to think that this is use speaking. This is David Duke. There are moments of that movie where he looks like he sounds like the David Duke of nineteen seventy eight it was it was uncanny for me interviewed Toepfer captures. The equally charming charismatic and calculating white nationalist. I've sat across front for those. Who would dismiss you as men stuck in the past. You say what I say with the future Ducas master, the art of intellectualize would history long ago deemed indefensible. Duke has since been back in the head front center two years ago at that rally in Charlottesville as Jackie minute. By India star reported determine thank our country back. We're going to fulfill the promises Donald Trump. That's what we believe in. That's what we voted for Donald Trump. What President Trump has disavowed? Any affiliation Duke remains of vocal supporter of the president. Do you hope the President Trump sees this movie? First of all, I'm not going to the White House ain't going, but I'm thinking invitation probably is that in the mail. So to say, I'll have no problem. Him and David Duke saying it because there ain't it. They're in the Bill for all the dark, humor creative. Cinematography clansman is chilling. It's not Hollywood. It's hard truth. KKK new take on one of America's. And when we come back lady Gaga opens up about her Oscar-nominated role of a lifetime in a star is born. When it comes to hiring. You don't have time to waste you need help getting to your shortlist of qualified candidates fast. That's why you need indeed dot com. Get started today at indeed dot com slash Nightline. That's indeed dot com slash Nightline. A little coming attraction. There lady doggone Bradley Cooper performing shallow from the stars. Born the payroll also sing it Sunday at the Oscars inner big screen debut. Ganga peels back her on stage persona removing her typical uniform of big waves and bold makeup. Forging a new path in her Oscar-nominated role. Here's ABC's Michael Strahan. It's a raw in on. If love story as your personal question. Bradley Cooper, lady got undeniable chemistry, transcend the silver screen star is four and I think it'd take off my way taking off my make going back to earlier place in my life to play this character. It's it's an interesting thing for me to reveal an to experience place alley a waitress whose dreams of making it big have stalled. The star of sins when she meets Cooper's character Jackson main a legendary musician battling his own demons. Her kid, Ben so hard cold. The me. The movie marks a career milestone from both actors for Cooper his directorial debut for Gaga her first leading role. The kernel of this movie was was really just a love story, you know, and to people. Honestly in love with each other. And what that means. I looked in his eyes, and I just had an instant connection with him. He said to me t- mind if we sing together. I was blown away by his voice because he sings from his gut who sings from his soul. I was overwhelmed with his ability to tell a story of his boys. That's why wanted to do. This was because I believed in him so much Cooper believed in her to. It's one thing to be talented and then to harness that talent, I'm just so glad God gave her the talent that she has any chose her. Because that's quite a vessel to go through. Their mutual admiration and respect for one another if evident in their performances culminating in one pivotal scene showers. Very. For me in that moment. All I had to do was go. I'm on set. I'm an actress I was able to go. Oh my gosh. This is new this is real. This is something I've never done before. I love this song. Tell me something girl. Are you happy in this modern world or do you need more? I don't think that those words could be more relevant to this these times right now. It's it's powerful plays a character in the movie because you know, then in the chorus she says. Watches. I dive in never meet the ground. They can't hurt of far from the show. Much like the actors the character form and immediate connection. I don't think. I don't sing songs. I I just don't feel comfortable my initial thought with how are they able to put chemistry and energy on the film to this degree? He says it to me in the movie, and he said to me in real life. You gotta do is trust me. And the truth is is that I really trusted him. Going to take another look at you. You're strip down your bear for the world to see. But why would that important for your character in this movie? Well, that's just too alley is he's a real woman who also has talent. But who has completely given up on herself. She's so different from me. I really believed in myself when I started out. I was like I'm going to do this. My friends called me Gog. I was like all right. Yeah. I'm gaga. This girl alley she she's jaded by the business. She's been told she's not beautiful enough. What's amazing is that this is a love story. And it's his love for her that gives her wings to fly. Should did you relate to that part? I did relate to that part. But it was it was different. It was different. I really had to go back to an earlier time in my life in high school. You know, I got moved fun of for having big dreams. I got made fun of for loving to sing during that time. I was bullied, and I was made fun of. And I I was depressed. And that is where I drew from from my life experience for this character. Real life guy is nothing like her character. She says Allie has stayed with her the night after you've dot filming you went back to the blonde hair because it was something different in the movie about you. Yes, people will understand why. When when they see the film why wanted to escape from Allie very quickly. But I was full to think that it changing my hair color would do that. You know, watching the film, again, I'm very back in there that character. She's still very much inside of me for Nightline. I'm Michael straight hand in. Next. You might not see her at the Oscars, but you'll certainly hear her the voice behind the Academy Awards. This Nightline at the IRS. And finally tonight. She's the voice of Nightline, and she's also celebrating ten historic years as the voice of the Oscars ABC's Romena Puga takes us behind the microphone. Hey nightline. This is where the magic happening you might not recognize her faith, but you know, that voice should night. It's a very special Nightline, that's our announcer. Randy Thomas who begins our show each and every night night on Nightline. I just feel that my voice is very at home in a news environment. I feel really blessed to be a part of that team. I'm the first woman in its thirty eight year history, you know, go back to Ted Koppel, the original guy, and and it was a man's world. So when you ask me where I fit I like doing things that have been traditionally done by men up until you know, I give in the room, and then I get to allow the other women to come in through the door behind me. Randy has done the m. As the Tonys and the sag awards the first woman to do. So and this Sunday marks her tenth year as the voice of the Oscars. Please welcome your host, Jimmy Kimmel. How did you get into this type of work? Well, I was discharged on the radio and back in the day. When I started in radio, there was only one woman on the air because I came out of that era with their all the guys where the DJ's, and if you tried to get on a radio station that had a woman they would say, thank you. We're good. We have a woman here is our host for the fourth consecutive year. Billy crystal. Nineteen ninety three sixty fifth Academy Awards. I became the first one in history to announce the show. So that was pretty spectacular. It was nothing I could have ever dreamed about. But when it happened it changed my life the ninety I Academy Awards. Welcome to the show announcing some of the world's most famous names and entertainment might be stressful for some fin not for Randy Hershel Ali green book before I actually read something live on the air. I will actually read that line out loud. Not on the microphone just before. I say, ladies and gentlemen, please take your seats. What have you need to cough? How do you with me? Sure. That your voices and strong. I hydrate I drink a lot of water I avoid sugar for thirty days. So I do that until after the show not the ball for stucco and Chuck. That's my reward for Nightline. I'm roaming Puga in Los Angeles. You can catch the Oscars right here on ABC this Sunday. Thanks so much watching Nightline. Good night. Are you hiring with indeed you can post a job in minutes set up screener questions than zero in on your shortlist of qualified candidates using an online dashboard get started today at indeed dot com slash Nightline. That's indeed dot com slash Nightline.

David Duke Oscars klu Klux Klan president America Donald Trump Hollywood ABC Bradley Cooper Trump Spike Lee Gaga Byron Pitts Charlottesville Colorado Springs Michael Strahan Colorado North Carolina Milk Apple
S4 Ep. 6: A Concerned Citizen

Slow Burn

1:01:08 hr | 11 months ago

S4 Ep. 6: A Concerned Citizen

"This podcast contains language that some listeners might find offensive. It was comforting to imagine that the David Duke phenomenon was an illusion or a fad. That people would get wise. The Duke would hit a ceiling. Plenty of people thought that. But in the fall of Nineteen ninety-one dukes movement just kept building. Louisiana politician, David Duke has a new listing on his resume. He is not only a former grand wizard in the Ku Klux. Klan is also now a runoff candidate for governor. He was repudiated by both state and National Republican Party, yet finished a strong second with thirty two percent of the vote. We have noticed apart from all the major publications and newspapers. The we had the endorsement the cavs this. Indoors. There were four weeks between the primary and the governor's race and the November sixteen th runoff. For Duke, those twenty eight days where his best chance to become a real force in American politics. Duke was running as a Republican against Democrat. Edwin Edwards, who'd served three terms as governor in the nineteen seventies and eighties. Edwards had long been accused of running Louisiana's his personal fiefdom, using his position to enrich himself and his friends. Republicans who've been on the rise in the state for more than a decade despised Edwards in the style of politics represented. David Duke looked at the Power Edwards had wielded and wanted some of it for himself and this state. The governor is like a king. He knows what he wants so have the opportunity. To make great changes if I'm elected and That's what I WANNA do. For everyone fighting to keep David Duke from gaining power the runoff with the time to make a final stand to convince the people of Louisiana that this was an emergency. In Ma Mind. You vote for Edwin Edwards even if you didn't want to because without that vote. Then David Duke would win. Kirby neuberger lived in the New Orleans suburb of mastery and he worked in wealth management. When neuberger candidate, the reform minded Republican Buddy Romer finished third in the gubernatorial primary. He was left with two unappealing choices, but for Neuberger it was an easy call. And it was the morning after the election when I called my printer, and I said would like for you to print up for me a thousand bumperstickers. They'd say vote. For the Crook, it's important. He said I'll do it. I said. Do you need to know the color scheme? He said no I. Say Great. The color scheme was white text on a blue background. The same as David Dukes campaign signs. Neuberger says it cost him about eight hundred twenty dollars to print those back handedly pro Edwards stickers. He plastered. The first one on the bumper of his old mobile cutlass convertible I would be driving around and people would hold their horn and say that's a great bumper sticker. Where did you get it? And I'd say. Do you want one? And I'd pull over an open my trunk and take one out and hand one to them. There were other anti Duke slogans, no Dukes Nuke Duke David Dork for fewer vote for the Lizard, not the wizard. But it was neuberger message. The took off. Vote for the Crook it's important, captured the dark comedy of an election, in which the least horrifying candidate was a guy, widely seen as quintessentially shady Louisiana politician, but the bumper sticker also made clear that this race wasn't a joke that the stakes for the state had never been higher. Neuberger was trying to reach people in his own demographic white conservatives, who weren't sympathetic to bigotry, but who had define themselves in opposition to Edwards. Together the Republican candidates had gotten sixty four percent of the votes in the primary. If those votes stayed with the GOP then David. Duke would be the next governor. Neuberger was asking his fellow Republicans. To recognize that some things were even more important than vanquishing Edwin Edwards. The outcome of the governor's race wouldn't just be decided by Kirby neuberger types. Ken Smith was the student body president at the historically black southern university in Baton Rouge just felt like that. We have to get engaged. And kinda border does not on our watch kind of things other student. Even Lynn. It was kind of. This can't be happening. When Duke made it to the run-off Smith joined his fellow students and marching to the state capital. He also helped a voter registration drive with entertainment provided by the southern university marching band. We're talking about the over a thousand people in line, and the concern was that they would leave when they saw lines being so long to register and so having the ban there The band for southern. is a really really big deal. And it made all the difference in the world, and so it became a fat. They're gathering of positivity if you will. The students at southern university weren't alone. Close to sixty five thousand LOUISIANANS would register in the two days after the primary. In. Jefferson parish. David Dukes home turf. More than two thousand people were still in line when the office was scheduled to close at eight PM. With three weeks ago until election day, the raise looked extremely tight. One poll showed Edwards with forty six percent of the vote and do could forty two percent with twelve percent of voters still undecided. Lance Hill hadn't expected duke to make the runoff, and he found duke strength at the polls profoundly worrying. Hill was the executive director of the Louisiana Coalition Against Racism and Nazism. The state's most prominent anti-drug organization. He'd read most everything that Duke had written, and he'd heard Duke disparage blacks and Jews and the harshest possible terms. He was constantly thinking about persuasion about how to convince as many people as possible to see David Duke like he saw David Duke. During the month long stretch between the primary and the runoff hill got to talking with a man at a bar, a white working class guy who said he liked duke and what Duke stood for. Hill tried to sway him. He said the duke admired Adolf Hitler and that as Governor Duke would follow Hitler's playbook winning power at the ballot box then demolishing democratic institutions. And the guy said he was incredulous. He said well He. He can't do that I. said. What do you mean you can't do this this? Why this is America? You can't just get rid of democracy. And ever really sunk into me that aside from the racism of Dukes move and how it attract people. They also believe that democracy was always safe. And that's very difficult Objection to overcome in an argument. What arguments did David Dukes opponents make. Who did they hope to persuade. And what did it mean in those four weeks nineteen ninety-one? To stand up and be counted. One of the most divisive elections, any state has seen in a long time. Louisiana will a good deal of the state of race relations and middle class frustration everywhere. Somehow the word has gotten out that there's a possibility that this could happen anywhere in America. This is slow. Josh. Levy Episodes six. A concerned citizen. Like to tell you about the PODCAST, stay tuned with pre. Now more than ever. We need thoughtful steady voices to help us make sense of what's happening in our world. Stay tuned covers issues of justice law in the future of our democracy. The host is preet Boura who's the US attorney for the Southern District of your from two thousand nine to two thousand seventeen. Creed offers straightforward explanations of complicated issues, cancers, audience questions and speaks with people shaping history. Previous guests include peop- footage, healthcare, expert, Andy, Slava and former attorney. General Sally. Stay, tuned bonus conversations from the show in the exclusive insider podcast or all available at Cafe Dot. COM C. A.. F. E. DOT com. If. You enjoyed this season of slow-burn. Please consider joining slate plus slates membership program. This show wouldn't be possible without the support of slate plus. And, in this economic climate, sleep needs your help. It's only thirty five dollars for the first year. That's less than three dollars a month and it'll really go a long way for us. We want to continue bringing you the news analysis and podcast. You depend on here at sleep. Once you sign up. You'll get to catch up on all the bonus episodes we did this season and other seasons of slow-burn, and you'll get exclusive episodes and segments from political gabfest. Trump cast amicus and other slate shows. You can find out more at slate dot com slash slow-burn that sleet dot. COM SLASH SLOW burn. There were two big stories in Louisiana on the weekend of October Nineteenth Nineteen ninety-one. The I was David Edwin Edwards clinching spots in the gubernatorial runoff. The second was New Orleans as undefeated pro football team. Pick one by one opponents fell as the saints race their way to the top of the NFC west. As they did the WHO. Dad's rang up each victory all to glory that was allowed and often check Jake! On the day after the primary, the saints had a home game in the superdome against the Tampa Bay buccaneers. Keith Woods was the city editor of the New Orleans. Times Picayune the newspapers highest ranking black journalist. He was a saint, season ticket holder along with some of his colleagues at the paper. If that game, he was also surrounded by Louisianans. He knew only in the. Of their, shared Phantom. The people eat cheered alongside in the superdome for years. There was a Ruckus in you heard. A roar, and then a few minutes later erupted again except now it's a little bit further. Around the superdome from where it was the last time, and maybe by third time I heard the roar. I realized that what was happening was that David Duke was coming out into the main stadium from the the breezeway. Encircles it. Turning and waving to the crowd, and going back in, and the roar was this mixture of cheers and jeers, every time and I just remember the experience, the anxiety that rose in me as he made his way further closer and closer to our area. Because I knew that I was Gonna learn something about the people around me. And I was afraid of what was going to be but here he came. into our space. And behind me and in front of me. There were people who cheered. They were part of our community and your sense of that community is shattered. Permanently by that experience. For David Duke that victory lap at the superdome was an attempted coalition building. To win the governorship Duke needed to woo the white conservatives who'd cast ballots for Buddy Romer? To get them to vote for the klansmen not for the Crook. Duke declared that he was taking up. Roamers Pat 'cause fiscal reform though the Times Picayune. Reported the Duke gave no details. Edwin Edwards was that that Saints Game Too. He ran into duke outside one of the super domes, luxury boxes and told him you ran a better second then I thought you would. But, Edwards didn't seem worried. He told reporters that he felt very confident and very comfortable. It's going to be an easy election, he said. If nothing else Edwards would have an easy time raising money now that he was the only person standing between David, Duke and the governor's mansion. After the primary the Journalists Stephanie Regal went to Edwards, fundraiser at a mansion and uptown New Orleans. The crowd was full of old line Republicans and it had the feel of just a funeral. These people had hated Edwin. Edwin Edwards to this group represented everything that was wrong with Louisiana politics, and they were just so unhappy to be there, but that's what it had come down to. Money Poured in from those uptown mansions and from all over the country. The? Question was how to spend all that money. Raymond Strother thought he had the answer. Strother who'd been buddy roamers, political consultant was also in the superdome. He watched the Saints Twenty three to seven victory and governor rumors private box. And I looked over to my left. There was a pipe divider and there was bill Morgan my closest friend from college, a guy who had worked for me for years and who had done the media for Edwin. Edwards and outlined to him the economic message how you went down to the very bottom of the blue-collar spectrum and threatened people jobs that would be dukes base. You can make some inroads. Strother believed that everyone in Louisiana had already made up their minds about Dukes, clan ties and Nazi views. He thought the only message that had a chance to break through was one that appealed to voters financial self interest. Other LOUISIANANS had come to the same conclusion. I went through my Rolodex and started calling. Everybody I knew we had to do something about this. That's real estate developer. Press Kavak off. In the primary Cavaco supported Buddy Romer. After, Romer lost. He donated five thousand dollars to Edwin Edwards. Kabakov believed that if Duke won Louisiana might get hit with a national economic boycott. I can remember. Getting up in a forklift, being elevated above a hundred and fifty workers. And, explaining to them that whatever your your position is politically, if David, Duke is elected. The next job that you'll be looking. We'll be looking. Looking to do won't be available. Duke said these were just scare tactics, and that Louisiana would hold up just fine under his leadership. But Edwards and the group supporting him latched onto this economic message. In the run up to election day, voters in Louisiana saw ad after ad portraying a do governorship as a financial dystopia. Fifteen thousand conventioneers canceled their convention in New Orleans. And fifteen thousand chicken ally king dinners are no longer need. You know how many jobs leave Louisiana and come to Texas. If ducas elected heart van. That last ad was masterminded by Republican operative Floyd Brown. Three years earlier Brown had made the commercial connecting Democratic presidential candidate Michael Dukakis to a violent felon named Willy, Horton, who was black. That ad became a symbol of Republican racial fearmongering. Now it's creator turned his sights on David Duke. But Floyd Brown's add didn't tell the people of Louisiana to vote against Duke. Because Duke was a racist. It told them to vote against. Duke, because other people thought Duke was a racist. And those people would shun Louisiana. He became governor. It wasn't a moral argument. It was a pragmatic one. A lot of Republicans were prepared to cross party lines to support Edwin Edwards. Others were going to vote for David Duke because they liked him or because he was the only Republican on the ballot. The chair of the Louisiana Republican Party billy non. Gasser had been dithering about Duke for years declining to censure him, but also refusing to support him. Now none guess there had to make a decision. He wouldn't say what it was. I haven't told the president I won't tell them. My choice because it would you know there's no way of stopping from being associated with the Republican Party. Maybe, there's something to be said for the guy in Louisiana. Couple of years ago, a guy tried to get his name changed none of the above. And then get on the ballot. Say because he figured he win. But none of the above was not on the ballot in Nineteen ninety-one. And behind the scenes at least some state party officials were choosing sides. Michelle shower heard from them after David Duke made the runoff. Shower who you heard from in our last episode had not supported Duke in the primary. She'd been paid staffer for governor. Buddy Roemer making calls on his behalf from an office in. New Orleans. When Romer lost people, she knew in the Louisiana Republican. Party asked if she'd be interested in joining up with the Duke. Campaign. And they invited her to a Duke Rally. I saw you know one of the people from the State party that I recognize, and he said Oh hey. Hi, how you doing. He goes. I'm going to take you to where everybody is nice. What do you mean where everybody is? They said I thought you know this. Was it and he goes? No, no, no, so behind the curtain. Auditorium with the foldable walls, and in one of the foldable walls, there was a door, and I walked through the door, and there were more state people elected officials I. Think I love my job. Probably actually you know opened and was like what? Shower was wary of Duke and what he stood for. But if other Republicans were helping him, then, she felt okay about helping to. Shower worked alongside dukes campaign manager, how Farrell making fundraising calls to Romer supporters. Not, long after she started Farrell asked if she liked to get to know Duke, himself and I said sure. You know he was pretty famous and I thought. When are you ever? GonNa get an opportunity to do something like this again. better to take an opportunity then to shut went down. Shower Duke upstairs at his campaign headquarters in the part of the building. He used as his private residence I. Think for the First Fifteen minutes in my mind I was like God. I can't believe I'm sitting here talking to David Duke Oh. My God I can't believe sitting here talking to David Duke I. DO think I learned it out at one point, where you a part of the KKK, and he just kind of looked at me for a second than probably didn't answer my question directly. It was interesting I'm glad I did it. Because I can say met him. Shower says the Duke didn't sway her to his side that meeting. She also says that he came off as well spoken well, read and polite. But there were other people hanging around the campaign office. Who made her feel a lot less comfortable? People who felt emboldened by Duke and what he represented, there was one gentleman he goes. We're starting to put a plan together for utilizing the superdome and I said Oh. Yeah, for what what Kinda rally going to have in the superdome. He goes how we're going to figure out how to get all the black people. And of course he didn't use the word black people. into the Superdome, and then we're going to blow it up and I just. Looked at him like. Are you crazy? And he was not crazy. He was serious. Talking about it like this is something that he could accomplish and. I just remember sort of turning around and going wow! Shower walked away from that conversation. But she didn't quit the do campaign. But. I think a lot of people would say I never would have. Worked for that guy, no matter what. What would you say in response to that? You know obviously it's not something I. Talk About a lot looking back and thinking on it now. I should have taken care more careful. Look about who he was and what he had done. And of course, the doesn't make me feel good. I, you know I'm not proud of it, but I'm not ashamed. would I choose differently? Potentially I don't know. The Times. Picayune was a daily companion for the people of New Orleans. Two. Thirds of adults in the city read the newspaper every week day. The picayune could play kingmaker when it chose to. In September nineteen eighty seven, the paper had endorsed Buddy Romer in page. One editorial calling Edwin Edwards is tenure a disaster for the state in stumping for rumors stable political leadership. Donations to roamers campaign surged, and he rocketed up the polls. He beat Edwards a month later. When David David won his race for the State House of Representatives and nineteen, eighty nine. The picayune published a different kind aditorial. That column, which ran deep inside the paper, called Dukes victory and embarrassment, but it also said the duke should be given the chance to grow to change to see the errors of his ways. That editorial was everything the activists Lance. Hill was fighting against. And I printed that out and pinned it on her bulletin board. You know twenty years at work. And saying this is how? Fascism wins. During that nineteen, thousand nine race health had the picky in all sorts of research dukes passed. But the newspapers leadership wasn't interested in printing it. And their position was. They didn't want to cover him as the subject of investigative journalism. Because, that would give him an audience of what happened. Was He got the advantage of politically growing in a in a vacuum of criticism from the media? After Duke, won the Picayune filled that vacuum assigning tyler bridges to cover Duke fulltime. Bridges broke a huge number of stories on the Duke, beat on his self-dealing his failure to pay property taxes and his annual birthday parties for Adolf Hitler. Bridges spent a lot of time interviewing duke. I think he is the enemy. Admission of finding out who he really was investigating him and he knew it. And so there was no real pleasantries. who would tell funny stories? You had been above bland personality. Actually just the overriding feature of him was his neo Nazi ideology. Bridges coverage was thorough and relentless, but the picky was still wary of giving Duke excessive attention. The papers top editor Jim. Amos who took over during Dukes, run for the US. Senate wanted the picky to be perceived as a trustworthy chronicler. He was hoping to inoculated against criticism that it was attacking Duke gratuitously for ideological reasons. anti-drug activists thought that meant. The newspaper wasn't being nearly aggressive enough that it was burying important stories or declining to publish them at all. Keith Woods, became the picky and city editor, the very end of that Senate campaign. He says that the newspapers leaders shouldn't have been so fixated on fairness playing the duke story down the middle that meant missing the larger story, a huge consequence of decisions on how little to cover. Duke was that we also didn't cover. The opinion that accompanied Duke the morality are absence of it. that existed across the state. That what he had exposed as the the mainstream nature of a lot of his thinking. Among White? Voters in a state of Louisiana. When, Duke made the runoff, The Times, picky and top editors called a special meeting. They decided it was time to take a new approach to treat. Duke is a politician than as a threat. It's like you know discussing the impact of a hurricane on the ecosystem in the larger environment. Yeah, all of that's true, but what you're concerned about right now is whether it's going to blow your house away. The picky Yoon would assign around forty reporters, editors, artists, and photographers to cover Duke and his movement. But the paper didn't just change its newsgathering philosophy. It also chose to make its position on Duke Explicit. The title of the series was the choice of our lives. The choice of our lives was a collection of editorials in those columns. The newspaper focused on Duke's inveterate, lying his hatred of blacks, Jews, and the potentially dire consequences for Louisiana. A few became the governor. This was a major move. To be taking such a profound, moral position, against bigotry against racism. And saying we are going to stand on our heads now, we. We're not going to pretend that we're covering an ordinary thing. Four years earlier, the picky had used its front page to call for Edwin. Edwards to get booted out of office now. The newspaper endorsed Edwards on page one. The choice is an easy the Oriel said, but it's clear bigotry, even masked with codewords eats at the ties that make us a civil community it divides and diminishes us as people. We must reject it at all costs. David deep lashed out at the newspaper during the last week of the campaign. It's just amazing to me how the media has not been fair in this campaign of Times-picayune as attack me day in and day out. This kind of rhetoric wasn't new for Duke He'd railed against the Times Picayune even when it barely covered him, because attacks on the press played well with his supporters. But this time, the picky didn't worry about the consequences of going after Duke. The paper was more worried about the consequences of not telling its readers the truth. We'll be back in a minute. David Duke had started talking about his Christianity during the primary in an attempt to went over conservative voters. During the runoff, he leaned even further into religion acidy. Says the cross means something different to him now Christian person. And I believe that the power Christ and the tile, your faith, and just growing up and getting more mature in life that you can certainly become a moderate. Some of Duke's opponents questioned his sincerity. Anthill heads to Louisiana Coalition Against Racism and Nazism. There's no doubt in my mind. That David Duke is using Christianity is profess belief in Christianity is as a mere gimmick to win votes. That's suspicion got even stronger after the first debate of the run off. If you could. Could you tell us what church you attend the name of the pastor there and what was the last time you were there? Vans Article, Bible Church and the closest pastor I'm to in my life is revving Rundstedt. It gives me an awful lot of spiritual advice and counseling, and I really appreciate him, and if you're watching the Evangelical Bible Church didn't exist. There was no such place. Later on a radio show, Duke said that he didn't go to a specific church, but instead attended a nondenominational Bible study. After that Duke volunteered to undergo a theological examination by a group of jellicoe Christians. One of the men who did that examination was Neil Curran, a leader at a conservative, Evangelical Church and the New Orleans suburbs. Current, had been the anti duke activist Beth Ricky's closest ally in her battle to censure. David Duke He'd seen stopping. Duke is his moral duty as a Christian. When he heard Duke Expresses Devotion to Jesus Christ, he called the candidate on the phone and said I'm surprised. Pleasantly David if you really become a Christian, you know we've been public enemies. But I don't want to be. If, you've truly. Put Your faith in Christ and. That I'd like to talk to you. A couple of weeks later curren met Duke for that theological examination. Finally at one point I said. David you, you're talking about your faith, and and how it's changed you. When did you become a Christian? And he said I became a Christian when I was thirteen years old. Almost thirty years ago. So, what happened to you? You've been clansman since then you've been Nazi since then very publicly in both cases. And he said well I guess I back solent. Current didn't buy it. To me into the other pastors. We felt that somebody had been feeding him. The right phrases to use. To what people think that he really was. On Evangelical Christian. After that meeting Carin, Ran anti-drug add on Christian radio quoted Jesus's words from Matthew Seven. Beware of false prophets who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly are ravenous wolves. You will know them by their fruits. Current got some back a week before the election. When do gave named Bob Hawke's quit the campaign and called Duca fake Christian. Here's what Hawks said about Duke and Nineteen Ninety two. And I. Never saw any good works. Good Christian works. In from David Duke except when he was stayed center now that's on television on a platform at a rally are are being interviewed by the press other than though tabs Jesus. Christ in Christianity was never mentioned. Duke Denied Bob Hawke is allegations. He also claimed without citing any evidence that hawks had been planted in his organization to discredit him. As we come to the end of this season of slow-burn and one you. The checkout slates Daily News podcast. What next? Every weekday what next takes on one story in the news and goes deep behind the headlines. It's the kind of news analysis. You're not going to get from just scrolling on your phone. Slow, burn is a podcast about how recent history played out in real time. What next takes you deep into today's most important stories from the pandemic to the protests from the Supreme Court to the presidential election. Stay tuned at the end of our show for an excerpt from a recent episode of what next it's an interview with the country's top infectious disease expert Dr Anthony Fauci. Host Mary Harris asked what he thinks of the nation's corona virus response, and the White House recent campaign to discredit him. If you like what you hear, subscribe to what next wherever you get your podcasts. Live from baton. Rouge Louisiana Public Broadcasting Presents debate ninety one the governor's race. Moderator for tonight's debate second televised debate between Edwin. Edwards David Duke took place on November Sakes Nineteen Ninety one. That was ten days before the election. Duke and Edward Sat onstage and a TV studio with the moderator between them. Four political journalists had been brought in task them questions. One of them was Norman Robinson. Robinson was one of New Orleans is best known and most respected news anchors. He was also a black man. He considered for a moment, not taking the debate assignment. But Robinson decided that he owed it to himself to meet David Duke had on are considered in the final analysis to be a challenge to be a challenge to face in. to confront him in compartment lies Mine My. Robinson had been suppressing his rage for as long as he could remember. He was four years old in one, thousand, nine, hundred, eighty, five, when Emmett till was lynched in his home state of Mississippi. He was five when he saw the photos of till's disfigured body, and when his parents told him that's what some white folks will you? He was living in Mobile Alabama, even later, when klansmen bombed a church in Birmingham, murdering for black girls who were just about his age. It was an emotional time in our household. We were stunned. We're almost immobilized physically and mentally. I think it's something that are trying to bury but You know it's still there never goes away. For Robinson David Dukes rise in Louisiana felt like a scab. Getting pulled off an old wound. and. He was done hiding his injuries. Our next question comes from Mr Robinson and it is directed to Mr Duke. Mister Duke I have to tell you. I am a very concerned citizen. I am a journalist, but first and foremost I am concerned citizen. As A. Minority Who has heard you say some very excoriating and diabolical things about Nargis. By blacks about Jews. About Hispanics. I am scared Sir. You made yourself vulnerable. Yeah, exactly because I wanted to talk to him as a human being. I wanted him to see me as a human being and not as some journalist. But Robinson was a journalist, and on that stage he showed that he could be both things at once a human being who felt threatened by Duke and reporter who could expose Duke really was. Robinson had prepared for the debate using research from the Louisiana Coalition Against Racism and Nazism. He chose to focus on Duke's own words statements. He'd made to the graduate student Evelyn rich in eighteen, eighty six, and it has televised debate with Jesse Jackson and nineteen seventy seven. Robinson didn't get his question approved an advance. And? It wasn't until he was sitting in that studio, watching Duke Deflect and evade did he decided exactly how he wanted to phrase? I've heard you say that. Jews deserve to be in the. Ashburn of. History! I've heard you say that. Horses! Contributed more to the building of. America then. Blacks did. Given that kind of pastor. Given that kind of diabolical evil vile. Mentality. Mr Are convinced me question. Convinced me Sir. And other minorities like me. Why they should entrust their lives and the lives of their children to you. When the camera cut away from Norman Robinson. He was staring straight at David Duke. When Duke appeared Onscreen, he cast his eyes downward before he began to speak. FISTER, Robertson. I don't think there's a human being on this earth or in this state who hasn't been some time intolerant in their life. And I think that's true of white people I think. It's true of black people I. Think it's true of everybody at one time or another. I regret some of the things. That I've said in my life I have been to intolerant times, no question about that, but that's not how I live today and I. Hope that's not the way you live today. Maybe you've never said something in your life that you could be taken as racially biased or concerned, everybody said thanks. Pressed by Robinson, Duke said he repudiated the clan and any other racists or intolerant organization. This is how they're exchange ended and there's a lot of racism that exists in all just not just the white community. There's violence in streets every day directed against white people as well as the other way around and this. As well as against black people. Look Mr Robinson I. Don't think you really being fair with me. I. Don't think you're really being honest. Surf Well, you're not. Doing the debate here, aren't you? You're not even asking questions year here to me down and that's your prerogative. You said that you wanted to make an effort to try to have acumen connection with them. What did you think of that effort? And then? What did you think of his response? I thought we did. Have a human to human connection in. That's what made it so. Significant, but we got to the bottom of what it is. That needed to be discussed. The television station that broadcast the debate got one hundred fifty calls after it was over. Of them were from viewers complaining about Norman Robinson the? Times picayune published letters, chiding the TV anchor for his extremely unprofessional behavior and his lack of objectivity. Then there's the mail that Robinson himself got. One letter. We thought you were intelligent. We thought you were were of same mind at us now we see your true colors. You're just a a nigger with suit. For Months? Robinson didn't go anywhere, but work at home and he started carrying a pistol. But, he never regretted doing what he did. It was Cathartic. For me in a sense. Got To confront a lot of. Demons that I've been suppressing for a long time and I think. I think it was liberating for a lot of people. In the debate, Robinson hadn't talked about the second order effects of Duke Governorship. How Louisiana's reputation and economy might suffer because of how duke was perceived. He called Dukes, bigotry directly and unashamedly. I haven't been prouder of somebody. That I was of Norman Taddei. Keith Woods the city editor of The Times Picayune watch the debate at home with his family. So much of the public discussion around this was asked in euphemism and from distance, and Norman made this about him and David Duke in that space at that moment, but no woman did it in the guise of. Utter. Politeness. And yet it had edge is so sharp that. It easily cut due to the core. And I think moments like that. You know rarely have the effect of having somebody who. yesterday thought it was fine to vote for a clansman. To, wake up and say Oh, now that I've seen this nominee I know it's not. But it certainly connected to hold those people who like me in. What didn't have any doubt about how they were voting. But felt a little bit better. About the place I lived in the people I lived with that. Courage like that would come to the fore. Bidding fairly has raised for governor generated so much attention. Everyone has an opinion on the contests and Louisiana between former governor, Edwin Edwards and Republican candidate David Duke in the last days of the nineteen ninety-one campaign David Duke was his own worst advertisement. On November Tenth Duke and Edwin. Edwards made a joint appearance on. NBC is meet the Press. They were questioned by Tim. Russert sir. Who are what manufacturers are the three biggest employers in the state of Louisiana? Number of employers in our state, but who are the three biggest manufacturers where the biggest employers in the state of Louisiana I? I couldn't give you their name officer. You don't know who the biggest employers in the state. Have insists if. You're talking about economic, development. The. Correct answers which Edwin Edwards provided to a reporter afterwards, Avondale General Motors and a T and T. It wasn't just dukes present day ignorance that hurt him. He was also damaged by statements from his past. Beth Rickey had previously uncovered transcripts of Evelyn riches interviews with Duke. But the tapes would you heard an excerpt from at the beginning of our series hadn't yet emerged now they did the Louisiana Democratic Party turned the audio into a thirty second commercial. The you're about to hear was recorded on February, Seventeenth Nineteen eighty-six. The voices are those of David Duke and Joe feels a California Neo Nazi. Out Say a Nazi never deny it. Out of it, because I'M A. Hitler started seven men. Don't you think it can happen right now with the? Most people aren't ever going to them over until things get tough gets A. Very for. This government making a difference discovery. Here's Land Hill. And to this day. I remember that one of my board members from Monroe Louisiana told me. She had gone to get fish from our fish guy who was a dick, supporter. And she asked him well. What about sculptors base go? I'm not going to vote for. and. She said why not he said I heard him. He said he's GonNa. Take over America like Hitler took over Germany has. That's hilarious. That's. You know proves sometimes truth gets out. It's nine thirty five. I'm screwed in the morning. And whether you're at work in your car or at home, please with us the day before the election, David Duke, and whenever in the runoff, one of them tomorrow we'll be elected our new governor I'd like to see for one day for twenty four hours. This read the headlines of Duquesne elected just to see what the media would say then. You get out of black people man. That's all I mean. We don't even want. Be Out in the street now I. Mean You know in my neighborhood? They get duke and. We can lead, and I can tell you this. The first time in thirty five years and I was born and raised in this state that I will not vote I in good conscience cannot vote the either. Candidate General. There are a lot of people feel that way, and unfortunately I looked. I. I mean. There was no doubt about it I was GonNa vote for Edwards over no matter what as much as I detested at which. The conservative columnist Quinn Hillier I put my hand on the lever. They were lever machines, and then I literally act after made sure I had the right lever. I closed my eyes, so I wouldn't have to see myself pulling it. A lot of people didn't have to close their eyes or hold their noses when they voted on November sixteenth. Many like Angelina Jackson voted for the first time. She is sixty five years old. I kept putting it off and on, but. This time, I have to come. Down here to stop. That's why I'm voting today to stop David Di. After a flurry of public embarrassments for do. The polls going into election day showed Edwin. Edwards is lead widening. But given dukes history of outperforming the numbers. The outcome felt far from certain. Quinn Hill your watched the returns at Beth Ricky's apartment. The stalwarts of the Anti Duke Movement. had fought duke during his run for the state legislature then again when he ran for the US Senate. Yon We've been doing this for three years now. and. Obviously. We expected. A close race. And then it was a landslide. It is over now, and it wasn't even close the race for governor there in Louisiana, after weeks of controversy, political, passionate national attention Edwin Edwards, a former governor crushed David Duke Edwards one sixty one percent of the votes to Dukes thirty nine, and you would've thought they would've been elation and high fives and instead. They were alive, quiet smiles and exhales of breath sort of been relieved way. They were sort of a sense of. Accomplishment but exhaustion. Edwards said his victory was vindication for his home state. I all of those who, for so many months. Rejected with Dr Concern the possibility that a David Duke Governor Louisiana. Nation we are better than Louis. Duke said he'd lost only because of economic blackmail. The people hadn't voted for him because they were afraid they'd lose their jobs if you one. May on! A. Layer. David Duke supporters hadn't abandoned him. He took fifty five percent of the white vote. More people cast ballots for him in the governor's race than when he ran for Senate the year before. But this time he got swamped by the opposition by people who were not going to let him win. It became a movement for. Ken Smith was the student body president at Southern University in Baton, rouge, but he he woke up the sleeping giant in that particular election. We found a voice. We found a voice that ultimately had a say in what happened with the gubernatorial election. Smith and his fellow students wanted to take down David Duke, but they were also fond of his opponent. Our conversations were standing around. What's best for the long term viability of us as a group and clearly we felt like. Edwin Edwards provided that opportunity, and quite frankly he had somewhat over track record of helping african-americans more sold than other governors. The overall turnout in the governor's race was seventy percent close to an all time record for Louisiana. And for the first time in the history of the state, a higher percentage of black voters had gone to the polls than white ones. Ken Smith Voter Registration Drive had made a difference, so had Kirby new vote for the Crook, stickers and the message about economic damage to the state. Tyler Bridges Reporting and the Times Picayune aditorial 's Neil Curran's add on. Christian Radio Norman Robinson's debate, question and Levi's taps on David Duke Shoulder the Holocaust exhibit back in nineteen eighty nine. Beth ricky's years of persistence. None of them individually were decisive. All of them collectively beat David Duke. Landfill again. A Guy who was a dentist Lafayette sent out a letter to all of his patients. Saying. I support Edwin Edwards! In the the criticism was not coming from top down. It wasn't a -letes telling you what to think it was your neighbor, your co worker. Your Co religion EST it was coming horizontally, and that's the most effective criticism. What did he think of the vote for the Crook? It's important bumper sticker. We actually still have some of them. Hold on. What did you think about vote for the crooked? That's Edwin. Edwards is wife Trina Edwards. You're a call from our last episode that she was passing along my questions, because the ninety two year old ex-governor can't hear very well on the phone well. That was something that. My supporters put out most people then and now a suspicious of politicians anyhow, and I was very controversial, and that's what calls that. Edwin Edwards was a crook. He went to prison in two thousand and two for rigging casino licences during his last term in office. The one! He served after beating David Duke. Would he be interested in talking to David Duke Today? What what he say to him if you talked to him, would you be interested in talking today to do? And what would you say to him? Well. I have no. Regrets about him, I don't like what he stands for a Hoodie says, but that's his been. I talked to him if he called me because. You know I'm no longer run infinity, thing and. He started can't run for anything. In Louisiana in this country can maya pig. Less than three weeks after he lost the Louisiana Governor's Race David Duke announced he was challenging. George H W Bush for the Republican presidential, nomination. Duke wouldn't win any elegance in one, thousand, nine, hundred two. But another Republican and third do surprisingly well. and. Our Western heritage is going to be handed down to future generations and not dumped onto some landfill called multiculturalism. Can ran on the same platform as Duke. Many, people including prominent conservatives had called out Buchanan for trafficking in anti-semitism and Holocaust denial. But he hadn't been a clansman in a never been photographed wearing a Nazi uniform. Buchanan got a speaking slot at the Nineteen Ninety two Republican convention. DUKES party on Super Tuesday drew just twenty supporters. A, year after the runoff in Louisiana Tyler, bridges checked up on Duke for the time picky in. He'd been spotted at the New Orleans Convention Center Selling Duke for President t shirts and discount long distance plance. He looks sort of pitiful one convention. Gore said. No one was paying attention to him. Do Grand for the Senate again and lost again. He ran for the US House of Representatives and lost that race to. He went to prison for tax fraud. He spoke at a conference for Holocaust deniers in Iran. He supported Donald Trump for president in two thousand sixteen the same year. He lost another Senate race and he said at the CHARLOTTESVILLE. Unite the right rally in two thousand seventeen. We are determined to take our country back. In Louisiana Duke doesn't make the news all that much anymore. But he hasn't gone away. When he came into town, he would to see me I can't explain. Norman Robinson, he would come to the front desk and asked the receptionist. If. I was in and reception with call me missed. The Duke is here. Would you like to see him? Is it okay if he comes in I said Fine Yeah Letterman I'm Dr. Robinson remembers one visit about six years ago, not long before he retired as a news anchor. They didn't talk about that moment. In nineteen ninety-one when Robinson helped crush dukes political ambitions. They've actually never talked about and the almost thirty years since. When Duke dropped in on Robinson, he came bearing a gift. A book about how Jews control the media. I forget the title. Throw it away, but you know I listened to him. I'm humanist. Even be I just cannot be rude and cruel. Do another human being I can't do it, so I entertain this what he had to say, listen to him and when he left I discarded this book. That was the last time I've I've I've seen him. I think he likes attention. slow-burn. Production of slate plus. Membership Program. Every week slate plus members get bonus episodes where we dive deeper into history. We've been exploring the season. This week you'll hear an extended interview. Norman Robinson, the journalist who challenged duke during a gubernatorial debate in nineteen ninety one. We couldn't make slow. Burn without slate, plus and we just WANNA. Say Thank you again to all our members for their support. If, you like this series and are able to contribute. Please consider becoming a member. It's only thirty five dollars for the first year. And you get a free two week trial. Good Asleep, dot com slash slow-burn to find out more. slow-burn is produced by me and Christopher. Johns said with editorial direction buy low and Loo and Gabriel Rod. Madeline Ducharme our production assistant sophie, Summer Grad Slow, Burns, assistant producer. Our engineer as Paul Mounsey. David Gross composed theme song. The artwork for slow-burn is by Lisa Larsson Walker. This is the last episode of our season, so we've got a lot of people. We WanNA. Thank you thanks to Jessica Seidman Se Chambers Holly Allen Joel Anderson Allison Benedict Laura. Bennett bill, Carrey Jeremy Chase Serena Don Yari Amanda Godman Jordan Hirsch Jared Holt. Marriage Jacob Derek John Megan Kallstrom Noreen Malone Sat Mac then Alicia. Montgomery Sung Kark will pass. Katie Raeford later Robinson, Oshawa Saluda Rachel Strong Maggie Taylor June, Thomas and Chow to for making slow-burn, possible. And thank you very much for listening. I still cannot believe the duke would come in. After that I'm imagining like you know you guys are about the same age. It's like maybe ten or fifteen years had just show up at your door, and still WanNa talk about the Jews and you'll let them and he'll give you his new book and. I'll let him in. Absolutely I'll let him in. Ways been. And what he's been doing. Earlier in the show, I mentioned slates Daily News podcast. What next now we're going to share an excerpt from a recent. What next episode? If you like what you hear subscribed to wet next wherever you listen to podcasts. Dr Anthony Fauci by now. You probably know who he is, and you probably know how you feel about him. More than half of Americans say they think Saudi. The Nation's top infectious disease expert is handling the corona virus well. But you know who isn't so sure about that. I don't know that. He's a little bit of enormous. That's okay little. Alarm a little bit of enormous. President trump and a few of his closest advisers have begun murmuring about Dr Fauci over the last few days. They've been highlighting all the ways. The doctor has stumbled since this corona virus began spreading. This is the president on Fox News over the weekend Dr Fauci at the beginning, and again I have a great relationship with them I spoke at length yesterday Dr Voucher. The beginning said this will pass. Don't worry about it. This will passing was raw. Dr! Interview came at the end of a week in which the White House gave reporters anti-fouling talking points, it came after a top adviser to the president challenged Doctor Fauci on the op-ed pages of USA Today. But over the last few days, Dr Chee has not been afraid to speak up in his own defense. So we call them to talk about the politics of this moment. And the science to. Dr Fauci. Did you just put on hand sanitizer I did? I love it. You're always on point I'm always on point. I tried to be anyway. So she gives us thirty minutes Monday afternoon just before you had to speed off to a coronavirus task force meeting. The New York. Times ran a story. Saying you know. The chatter in Washington is what's happening with Dr Fao G. Do you get asked that question directly? Do you want answer it? Well, you know a lot of what you've heard about. You know an editorial that was written. You know very. The displeasure of most people in the White House that that by Peter Navarro. Yeah. I mean that's just a lot of noise. It's a whole bunch of nonsense that we need to just put aside and concentrate on a very important task that we have to work together. When I hear and see those things you know as much as it might get into the New York Times and the Washington Post. You gotTa Trust me. I try to pay as little attention to it as they possibly can. Just before we got on the line, there was this announcement. That president trump is going to bring back the daily coronavirus briefings first one is Tuesday. Are you going to be there? I would imagine I am I there's. There's been nothing official that I've heard about about that. I've heard the same sort of rumor that you've heard that. We're going to be getting back to the daily briefings, but I haven't heard anything definitively, but that doesn't matter. That likely will happen anyway, but I I would imagine that I'll be there if if it does occur. I'm Mary, Harris, you can listen to more what next wherever you get your podcasts.

Governor Duke Duke David Edwin Edwards David Dukes Louisiana David Duke New Orleans David David The Times Norman Robinson president Buddy Romer Times Picayune Duke Rally Lance Hill reporter US Senate New Orleans Convention Center Kirby neuberger
#593: The Questions We Didn't Get To

Advanced Selling Podcast

14:57 min | 1 year ago

#593: The Questions We Didn't Get To

"Hey welcome back to the event selling podcasts the longest running sales training podcast as we are in the middle of a corona virus disruption and. I'm glad to have with me on phone. I'm on the phone. The guess because it sounds like you're on and on so on my bad headphones we are doing or stream. You're doing a remote recording of course because we're afraid of each other and being in saint ruined each other so we do we do when we record. We sit six feet apart. I know I think our listeners would argue that the event selling podcast is in the central business. I would argue that. I'd love for all of you to Chime in listening to this. If you were an essential business you know. Give us a little like on itunes or wherever you go there foot in the link group whatever as right lash. Aspca essential ASPCA essential. It's doing I love it. I love it I love it. Yeah but we we think IT S. That's why we're continuing record because we doing it and love helping you get a lot of emails and connections on Lake. Dan saying the same thing so we appreciate all those you want to talk about the web. The Zoom webinars for we are so and so we know because people consume podcast for those of you who consume week of recording Monday April thirteen this Friday April seventeen twenty twenty at noon eastern time. Bill and I are doing a coaching session to help you get ready for the opening of the country. That's a recall. Any verdict from the President Bunch. Like a we need open our country. I got open our country our guest. What our country is going to get open. Sooner than we can all hope and or believe. And so. We're going to talk to you Friday and start to tee up what you need to be doing now to get ready for the opening of the country because if you wait until the country is open to get ready you're already behind and so we want to see you. Go to our website advancing PODCASTS DOT COM. There's a big yellow banner at the top. That's where you can go and register. You can also look on Bill. Caskey's Lincoln Feed Brian. Neil's Lincoln feed or in the Lincoln Group that all those places have the registration for the cost. Is Zero still a gift for us? We've been given the podcast away for ten years there so That for that one particular no cost to you. We love you. Your sales team spread around your friends helping you get ready for the opening of the country. Because there's some things you have to be doing now. That's where we're going to talk about on Friday. If you're on our email list you probably have already seen and There's a link there that kind of lays out the process and everything but if you are not on our email is for some weird reason go to advance selling podcast dot com okay. Also we had one couple of weeks ago and we had a really nice outpouring of questions on it and there were a couple of questions. We didn't get to that we want to talk about today and if you've registered than you probably got an email back and we want your questions for tomorrow but these are kind of carry over leftover questions from last time so Brian. Do you have wanted to do the first one that will tag team I do. So we're GONNA talk about. We talked about a few of these. We're not going to go through those again. But if you were going to a very similar thing This coming Friday so warm up here is what is really good. Question should individuals and companies try to maintain their existing fail strategy muckraker possible or take time to create a new one should individuals and companies try to maintain their existing sales strategy as much as possible or take time to create a new one. What do you think about that? One Mr Color Blind in black and white so I did a black and white may can hang. Thank you thank you question. Thank you person. I don't have I don't have who rose and the question I'll take a stab us down. Well of course I knew exactly. It's it's a trainer trick. I always tell people when he gets stuck in front of the room. All you do is you. Let's go to question whether you guys think it's a great when you don't so first of all pullback for second I think you should always be retooling. Your sales strategy always now. I don't think you should be scrapping it and starting over but I think you should constantly be retooling whether there is a pandemic or flood or fire or death or anything bad in your life or whatever all the bad things you should always be retooling. Your sales strategy always In My side hustle business refereeing football in the NFL. There's not a team coach or player that isn't constantly retooling their processes in our strategy constantly. They're never sitting still Santiago's worked for me for fifteen years. I'm gonNA keep doing it. None of them. Not even the ones that you know that when a whole bunch of super bowl champion Jabs none of them do that so I answer is you should always do. This has nothing to do with that. It's unrelated you should always be a regionally. Now take the time to create a new. One is the one part of the question I want to hang on here. Created new one. I don't know that you need to create a new one in terms of like with scrap the whole thing. Some businesses have had to do that because of the business that they're in the most notable ones we all hear of are the people that make gin and vodka who switched over to making hand sanitizer. That's a full on shift that's temporary it's just temporary in part of it's out of the goodness of their heart to help the country not other stuff so I don't think you should create a new one. I do think you should look in. Say What have I learned from this whole event? That's positive that has taught me something that I can end. Blow up carry on down the road that makes sense so a for instance would be in our world if we've gotten if bill and I've gotten all of a sudden pretty good at doing zoom meetings and we're realizing we can recreate a pretty good experience. Maybe not as good as live closer than we thought. Now we can say. Hey I could actually be virtual training zoom. You know that's an example or maybe that wasn't my strategy six weeks ago now it is but it doesn't mean that scrapped all of our content. We haven't changed the whole way we think about was. It's not a wholesale change. The way I read this was not should I create a new business but should create a new strategy is at the meeting that I had a couple of things. I agree with all of yours too and I had a couple ads here one is. I think we have to as we're looking at read retooling reinventing as you say. We always have to be doing that. But if you're not doing it today for the next six months or the next year or even the next thirty days then I think you're missing an opportunity to reinvent appropriately and that is what is the market need. What does the market need today? And I think we have to be careful about and I've heard this in the last two weeks you know. Let nobody buying in. My customers are kind of out of business right now. They're all closed up. Well that's not really true. We don't really know that. And Yeah of course. If you're in the if you sell to cruise lines probably going to have a tough six months. Manana End I saw where cruise line bookings for two thousand twenty one or twenty twenty one. Were off the charts high because people expect it to be over. Then they want to go out. They've got money to spend so some of this might be short lived. I think you have to say what does my market need during these times number two. I think you have to consume thought leaders. You have to look at. What are the experts saying? About how businesses will change. Don't take everything they say. FOR GRANTED. And don't take it as truth but put a lot of things into your brain and start to say you know. I like what Tom Peters said. I really liked what Brian Neal said the man. I really liked. What bill cast. And they'll say that but listen. Listen to some thought leaders in your in your world in your industry listener Brian. I listen to others and start to create a plan based on what you're hearing if somebody says you know what all the banks are going to fail and you say thanks aren't gonNA fail. That ain't GonNa happen then. Don't worry about that when you've gotta use your judgment but I would say put as many thought leaders in your ear as you can right now. Listen consume and make your own conclusions while but Conclusions on that your own conclusions. Yeah make your buy in everything you hear at all no. I think we've learned. We've learned that unless you. Let's thank you to make sure you pay attention to as you're doing your next plan six month plan. Let's say is there's going to be severe economic scrutiny. Scrutiny scrutiny to what gets bought nearly flip scrutiny and day babe so there's going to be a lot of scrutiny when a company gets ready to to spend money because it was this way back in the crash of two thousand eight. It was an it wasn't that they didn't it's every every expense was scrutinized through the filter of this. Is this going to make us? Money is going to save us. Money is going to be economically beneficial for us or we just buying it because we buy it every year. I think there's GonNa be a lot more scrutiny. So for you as a sales professional. You've got to make sure that your sales process is true too. That is congruent with that. And if you don't have a part in your sales process where you talk about the economic value of what you sell. You're going to be shunned because people are going to say. Well you know what they one hundred hundred grand for that and I'm not able to make the connection between what it's going to save us or make us over does not gonNa do it. You'd better get really sharp on your sales process. Especially that little section in economics I would also add. I just read a Lincoln Post from getting David Duke here in Indianapolis in the part of a really cool startup I now I just avow David Duke knowing that wrong guy. That's right. We talked about him. That's right David doing this until younger. Little more put together. He people don't run when he walks in a room. People don't run. People are listening. Like what are they talking about? They're gonNA Google David Duke. They're gonNA find a young kid from Indianapolis with a startup. Company called medicine. And they're gonNA find the other. David Duke fills docket about but he forwarded something today linked in. I can't find it right here. My fingertips I don't think I can. That was really great. Essentially it was talking about for lack of a better term justifying or defending the spend of your products with a with a customer. Another words if you if you sell. Software and software Is under scrutiny? Bill saying which it will be is your main point of contact have enough good evidence to defend the position to keep your software when he or she gets asked by their CEO CFO or whatever or even if you're selling the CFO the CFO have enough you know and or if you're talking to the CEO do you have enough information quantitative and qualitative info. That will help you defend your position to say you need to keep this on board or software going. That's a great thing for salespeople to get good at right now economic evidence economic. So that's the save that's to save a client. Yeah gets to renewal and also to generate a new client. Because at some point the the money gets tight and personally. I think everybody says I think we're going to head into recession. What you talking about already in one. We are in a recession right now. Yeah Yeah for sure. And the question is it will probably end up being a depression or somewhere in between a recession and depression and again lots of millionaires and billionaires were created starting in the in depressions and recessions. This is not a bad thing. It's just you got to change your habits. You've gotta gotTA tighten up your skills a little bit so that you can sell during these times. It's also funny. People say we're in recession like okay like Thanks for telling me 'cause it doesn't matter it just doesn't matter you just have to worry about your deal your customers and doing what we've always taught you on. This podcast is to think about good intention helping your clients and customers in whatever way shape or form you again and trading money for that and believing in abundance because it's still there even air quotes recession. All that means is we've gone backwards for two quarters. That's right math end. That that's kind of an opinion debatable. Opinion People think well maybe three quarters. Maybe it's one quarter. Yeah Yeah now you can get all hung up in the in the yes words around it. But here's the deal and maybe we can end on this if you have thought to as a we are all communicating and selling things that are valuable for our market and valuable means that either. Solve the problem that they have it avoids a future problem or it gets them to a new future. There's there's really three reasons people by and be to be so if you keep that in mind. The problems haven't gone away. They probably become worse. The all people still have visions and goals abolished. All those people still want to save money. WanNa earn money so if your product fits in with one of those three which I think it almost always will then. Don't worry about what we call it. Let's just go out and let's get our basics better? Let's work on our principles our foundation and let's prosper through this thing. Yep that's it gives people do as people in fact the vast majority of people do they just do fours looked to rethink your business. I mean come up that at anything and I know it's hard for people that are hearing this some view listening you like you've lost your job against furloughed or whatever you WANNA call it stockton. I get it it sucks. It does and even with unemployment rates. You're like Oh my God. The unemployment rate was shocked at thirty percent. No-one says the employment rate is seventy percent. Seven out of ten people have a job still. That's pretty good anything you know what I mean. Seventy percent pass completion seventy percent batting average. Seventy five people like my. It's really really good really good and so we have to keep things in perspective here keeps going just us. Sounds good so make sure you join us go to advance selling PODCAST DOT com up a section? There is a link to the Webinar. The Zoom Webinar. We're doing on Friday April seventeenth twenty twenty. So if you get this in here this before then make sure you're on with us. We're shooting for two hundred. People had a great time last time. We're GONNA do better this time. We just had the ASPCA Zoom Room We got new carpet and Wall Hangings Wall Street oil. We did on a window treatment. Sorry Yeah in Zumra as we call it the ESPN Zoom Room. Baby got we got. We're GONNA use the Soom Green the green screen photos. Have you done that yet? I try for some reason And I I my my Mac. Software is not up today but it is so. I don't know what the deal is with that old. Yeah all right so you on Friday by.

Bill David Duke Brian Neal sales training Indianapolis Dan President Lake Lincoln Group NFL Tom Peters Caskey Neil Santiago Soom Green depression Zumra
1283: "Dumb and Sick"

No Agenda

3:12:24 hr | 9 months ago

1283: "Dumb and Sick"

"She was the rubber person. Curry John's Devora. For Three Twenty twenty this is your award-winning on Asian media? Fascination. Episode Twelve hundred eighty three. This is no agenda. forty-five savage Jonah thirty three and broadcasting live from opportunities thirty three or the frontier boss taxes capital of drones star state in the morning everybody. Curry and from northern Silicon Valley. Where we all know that oats are good for the gut and Jesse. Scales the Mon-. Well. That may be your California. Thing. We don't eat oats. We leave that for horses here in. Texas. Not. For men they say okay but they won't say when. Hey. MA'AM FORTY-FIVE SAVAGE DOWN WITH THE RONA How about that? On a show? Of course? Thirty three days before the election. Come on man come on man may man you could not have asked for a better plot twist if we had sat down to write it. In fact, we would have said that. Now Who Corny we can't do that no no no. No. That can't happen. But how beautiful for the show To, see what's Taking, place is this the October surprise is this the ten days of darkness which will lead to thousands of sealed indictments is this well? As sick and could he die? There's so many ways we can look at this I. Love. Ill Him. Or was he infected on purpose? That's a possibility. Well. There's there's so much speculation. There is so much. It's fantastic. I love deconstructing media in these days. I have a prediction right away. Okay. Do I need the book I wanted to? Do I need the book or do not need the book I don't care about the book vote. You know I don't like your attitude towards the Red Book but okay I know you don't others don't either I've gotten this message from others. Enough about Mimi I you know trump likes to do these big giant events. Yeah. So I think he's going to. Up The ante on these events, he's going to do more of them than less. From from Jim simultaneously with the big giant head monster screen. At all of them Siam simultaneously. So they'll be like ten or twenty of them all at once the covert rally. In, it'll be like Max headroom like a big totalitarian. Yes exactly. Okay. So we don't get a lot of attention does a Mussalini would have done this? That's good. Know personally. I look at this and I thought well. If he is the he'll in true wrestling form. There's nothing that America loves better than a comeback. It's it's just a fact of how audiences respond and look and look at how his base is energized by by him being in the hospital and Obama jacked up nicely done with the helicopter and everything I mean that's well done. You can't deny it was show all the ways just beautiful. But well they. Do that breaks up the other issue and there's a headline out today it says trump a secret service has five body doubles for trump. Oh I. Didn't I brought this up at the dinner table. He said you know I swear that the trump going into the helicopter was not trump the right gates he did. Yeah. He didn't have the IMO boy I to notice that he had his head down. You know looking down, he did a little Possible. We haven't seen many trump impersonators like we used. See You. We haven't. That's true. Obama was pretty but then the hillary one with the perse. ADS obvious. Third Stringer. Fire her like now i. Never even got a callback he was just on reserve. Is Terrible but did trump going to the helicopter when good point? You can't make these points John when you make these points. You broke up for a second your back. BREAKING UP I don't worry about it. Yeah. So the helicopter, you could drive there and he probably did cause this phony trump just didn't make show and he comes out and he drags us out. He doesn't quite look right? He's got a funny gate. Seventy was because of the Cronin did I. Don't think it was the same man his hair didn't fluffed the right way. They kept waving doing thumbs up everywhere. Not Welcome and this is a good point I feel. Because the whole idea was well, he's he's tested positive. He had some sniffles. So just go to Walter Reed just to make sure if that was truly the case. I think he would spoken to the press if it really was him, he would do a little. It's alright. I'm going to be cool. Now instead we got the White House video before then we've got the heli walk. That's something to, and also what was taking place was he was right in the middle of denouncing white supremacist again and I think the walls were closing in on him. There was no today. MSNBC is still posting as of two hours ago that the president has not denounced white supremacy or white supremacist would you have the Super Clipper? Do I have the Super Clip I? Don't have a super do you have the super clip I have the super? Let's hear the Super Clip what this is the trump on white supremacy with without the name Judy attached to it, and it goes on forever. This is a very long clip is yet wants to condemn white supremacy the NEO Nazis. He hasn't condemned the darn thing about strategy cotton. Let's face off for David Duke just joined a bigot, a racist, a problem. Repudiate David David Duke and robocalls her out again, the white supremacist movement supporting you. have any words for that. I disavow. David. Duke endorsement. Disavow. Okay. Where we looked at it, it looked at the question I disavow David. About David Duke or weekend long entree spoke on twitter. That does go on forever. Him disavowing not the media saying he doesn't disavow. Yeah. Now, that would have been funnier as a super cut. Someone's going to put that one day. They should. He goes on and on and disavows everything you can play a little more. Let me play a little place. because. Gets to the point where it's stupid you sleep. So. Are you prepared right now to make a clear and unequivocal statement renouncing the support of all white supremacists Of course. Of. Course I when Chris joined, we had a news conference and the exact same question I said I disavow I. Just about. Then I disavow today on ABC with George Stephanopoulos disavowed again. David. Duke is a bad person who disavowed on numerous occasions over the years. I totally disavow that Luke Klux Klan I totally disavow David Duke ultimately, he got the Flu Klux Klan which obviously I'm going to disavow. David. Do rejected. David Duke. I rejected the KKK the ku-klux-klan. Just, and this is from mainly Twenty sixteen isn't it from the previous election where he was doing, he had to do during the David Duke Disavow David Duke era. Now. By the way I, WanNa, point this out, this is the playbook they're running the exact same playbook Iran when Hillary was running. Only they've changed a couple of elements and he goes on I don't you obviously don't want to play it but I do. It's just wait a minute for just went by what how can this effort by I thought that it scheduled ladies and gentlemen a very very, not yet it's coming. What's this effort? Okay. This is an interesting one. This was a nine cars, Zephyr The bonus car was a male car bonus car. Anything, else or is a speed it was going I thought it was going slightly slower than usual and gentlemen. We have a very interesting economic report alert the boys at CNBC on the squawk box we have nine cars effort with a bonus, Mail Card Ladies and Gentlemen Bitcoin Ten, thousand, six, hundred, eighty. Hard When they changed their schedule, I think we have to change show days. No. So let's go back to this This disavowing to he also have disavowing the fine people want clip in here Melissa. Listening does it and he doesn't and he doesn't. He does it does it and but yet they say the they say that he'd never does it and and so I have to play this clip. Says you WANNA. Play No, I'm saying I want to play it's three minutes I figured it'd be fun to interrupted instead of boring. LEARN MORE AT A. Punchline at the end it's not that I don't WanNa play it but I am radio program I know how to keep people listening Ugueth thing to his supporters and followers vote for Donald trump white supremacist they're saying, do you want those votes now? I don't want them and I don't want him to say it and you want to support him. Supremacist by the way I don't like any group of Hake. David Duke announced his Senate candidacy. Claiming your agenda. Before you ask the question Newt Gingrich said every Republican should repudiate this guy. Do We'd be is that okay rebuked review doesn't. Want White Supremacists to go for you know I. Don't at all not at all his campaign is denouncing show of support from the KKK's official newspaper as in the Ku Klux Klan New York Times interview he denounced white supremacist you denounced the NEO Nazis who support him racism is evil. And those who caused violence in its name are criminals and thugs including the KKK neo Nazis White supremacists and you had people and I'm not talking about the Neo Nazis, the white nationalist because they should be condemned. Totally. I spoke out forcefully against hatred bigger in violence and strongly condemned the neo knocks the white supremacist and the KKK President Donald Trump signed a congressional joint resolution that condemns white supremacists Nazi. resolution. Nation was condemned racist. Bigotry and white supremacy any group of hey I don't like it any group of. Im whether it's. White supremacist whether it's any other kind of. Whether it's at defy weather is any group. Of Hey, I am very concerned about it and I'll do something about. It wants to condemn this supremacy. This is very interesting. You know I'm thinking about this. I. Got a note from. Someone a couple of days ago, and they asked me if I had a link or a recording of that original you know the fine people on by side. Yeah and it was my understanding I know this person's connected to. Michael Flynn or some other people, White House related, maybe Dana White from you just like people around and that there was a strategy they wanted to put up a website so people could see this maybe the idea was, hey, they're rolling out the playbook it's clearly a lie. It may be let it all build up in self implode on itself or come out with something that shows that they all lie I mean this. This, of course, they have it. I want to play one last clip in the same regard. Play the trump white supremacy, judy. has happened before with President trump stopping short of clearly denouncing far-right extremists and racist groups and sentiments when prompted. This was like this week. was like a couple days ago. Schutte is are horrible journalist. How can they do that? How do they do they? Do you think they don't remember or? This is Jerry member well, maybe they don't. I mean these people are daisy stupid possibly become much money they're making they must. And they mentioned the New York Times even had him in the New York. Times. In that last series eclipse. The New York Times said that he denounced white supremacy in the New York. Times anyone who's in journalism at the level that Judy's at has lexus nexus they can look this up. You can look up trump and white supremacy and boom the New York. Times article come up. Now why in world do you a say Judy's journalists and be thinks she would do anything of the kind she is not. She is a news reader pews to be a huge. News reader in her writers are Viner shing writers writers. Thank you there a journalist writers exactly. So. Maybe we let them all. Maybe we maybe this is two weeks till. We can see all the hate because while man last night Saturday night live open their new season. Now imagine the problem you have. If you Saturday night live you've been. Writing practicing all week in everything going everything is every punch line is trump joke had the entire. Debate did big like a fourteen, fifty minute open outstanding Alec Baldwin He didn't have his funny lines Jim Carey was Joe Biden. phenomenally good. Extremely funny. The whole thing was great. Everyone was made to look foolish trump biden and all the right things I'm biden to like forgetting stuff looking in the camera creep. Really. Trying to contain his anger menu was anger management steps and trump. We've kind of seen from from Baldwin. You know it's like Oh interrupt. Now kind of what you'd expect from we're still funny but then. Paul my God then they had to or Jim Carey I guess it was his task to do this. and. Now, most people haven't seen this because just aired late last night and I stayed up to just to watch the the cold open and Chris Rock's monologue, which wasn't much funnier because they went all out. It's like. Lauren Michael said, screw it. Let's just go all out who gives a shit. So the scene is the end of this door in the middle debate the. Baldwin. Trump character is yelling whatever and then all of a sudden he freezes and then we see that Jim Carey Joe Biden has pressed a remote control and he's frozen. The president and then he comes up to the camera and he starts talking Chris. Can I speak directly to the American people. Wear totally. Totally. Weird. MERICA. Look at. Look directly into my eyeballs. You can trust me. Because I believe in shines. And Karma. Just. Imagine if science. And Karma. Could somehow team up. To Send us all a message about how dangerous this virus can be. Still frozen. I'm not saying I wanted to happen. Just match. I would just imagine science Karma came together. Mu. Crowd loves IT CRAB CRAZY So the joke writers juice Jost and Michael, charity weekend update and Michael. J.. Try to explain the problem and just thought it was interesting just to the play how they discussed this on the show as to how they should do jokes about this. Well, say what you will about twenty twenty. It's got moves. This news was a lot for us to process a day before we came back on the air after four months off and it all happened so fast I woke up yesterday and heard the president had mild symptoms and then four hours later he was getting Medevac to a hospital in what looked like the last shopper out of Vietnam. US say it's a bad sign for America. When trump said, he tested positive for a virus sixty percent of people were like prove it. And it's been very weird to see all these people who clearly hate trump come out and say we wish him well. I think a lot of them are just guilty I wish came true. You know politics aside this is awful news for rush because trump was actually supposed to host us next week. Okay serious voice. While in the hospital, the president isn't allowed to see any guests, but he is expected to be visited by three ghosts probably one from his past one from issue. Okay. This is weird. Because, a lot of people on both sides are saying there's nothing funny about trump being hospitalized with corona virus even though he mocked the safety precautions for Corona virus and those people are obviously wrong. There's a lock funny about this maybe not from a moral stand boy. mathematically. Constructing joke. This is all the ingredients you need. The problem is it's almost too funny like it. So on the note, it'd be like if I were making fun of people who wear belts and then my pants immediately fell down. A new poll couldn't talk couldn't even finish the thought. I don't know when did when did trump mock safety precautions? No, he has. That's how people receive it. People think that he's he's mocking now. Doesn't not abidance huge mask. Yes. Yes. EXAC Hey, I was thinking about masks. There's so many studies. The surgical we talked about on the last show the surgical masks. Everything blows out through the sides comes back. If masks really really work. Why don't we have like for everything else? Some. National Mask Programme. Where everyone gets an approved mask, the mask, the mask that works. It doesn't wouldn't that happen wouldn't that be a recommendation this is the mass give everybody a mask. Well if you just look at the flu season I, would think maybe Demi in China, they do that does seem to stop anything. But but it's so important that we wear a mask. It's the most important thing in Glendale California up to three thousand dollar fines for your third and fraction in the Netherlands now, Ninety Five, euro, one, hundred dollars basically fine for being caught without a mask is included in the park by yourself. Especially, if you're in the park by yourself, it doesn't matter you know the. People who patrol this are all in now the guy. That just looking for. Power a little power going on thousand dollar fine in new. York City. Shouldn't we then at least have the right masks because you know It. Just makes no sense. We've done everything else ventilators. Whatever whatever it needs new hospitals, but we're not going to give everybody the approved mask. It just can't be true then. It's just a muzzle to shut you up. Working kind of working very well, kind of it's working fabulously. Now I like the way they keep downplaying the fact that there's a lot of hate wish trump was dead commentary hell tons on twitter and facebook infect going to Mimi who is on facebook still she says that is weird to watch because there's a whole bunch of backlash. All these people that are saying trump should die. Cova because apparently there's some Jewish Idea that or a wives tale or a superstition. If you say something like that, it'll happen to you or bad Karma. So there's all these crazy back and forth going on facebook with its although they're trying to just eliminate anyone who says anything like that like they did on twitter or they've done a pretty good job on twitter still pick up a few of them. And there's some people that have been collecting them. Yes. And they one I posted in the newsletter was from Obama inner. She just said Decay folks you. Hope, he di Jesus and Obama staffer who's now writes for Vanity Fair, which has become kind of a left-wing crazy magazine. especially teen Vanity Fair. That's when they had the article by why you should reconsider Marxism. Ask You a question. I really like the the donate the newsletter with the five donation for the get well card. If this had been. I would we would you have still considered doing the the get well card absolutely. But it we would've gotten a dollar less. Certain. People like Oh. That's horrible. City about and some Australian sent me a note saying we're horrible and he said, yeah, you should just just shows you big trump supporters. You you know and I said that we would have done the same thing for Obama and I would I believe that I don't see why people immediately. Oh. I in fact I think we've done some well wishes for Obama at some point, but we were a doer of the of the. We were of the notion that Obama just being used and he's actually. You know here's the deal. The to Obama's also is personality where he wants to do the right thing, but he can't. Ryan. Right so no, we didn't have any. No. was. By the way I think you know every look look the campaign the campaign is is campaigning ridiculously off of this if I can just read. A. Few of my ex Massachusetts, don't I'm not even out in these mailing lists. They're so good now. So Good Here. We go. Trump get well, Card Adam. Your signature is missing from the president and First Lady's get well cards, sign your scientist show you care, and of course, you go to donation page. President trump and first lady melania tested positive for covert send them your best wishes. Fundraising. The fundraising. And and of course. We have here. President. Trump has a message for you from Walter Reed we will beat this. Chip in now, they don't say Chipman. That's not them. What do I have from the Biden's here, get a pretty good job at not saying chip in. Let me see Biden Harris H. Ever today is your last two to make monthly donation to the campaign. I keep getting a text messages from Hillary, Clinton and Barack. Obama. Because I'm sure it's them right texting me do you think people actually fall for that y'all Ya know I want to mention something to the people that bitch and Moan about this are forty five dollars thing will end the get well card which you'll have bruins name on it which I'll send myself. If we were big trump supporters, we'd say send them the money. Saint who the money Trump. Trump campaign right now we're taking we're taking the money hello Monies for the show we need this show needs to boy. saw kind of trump supporters are we we're not sending the get well card with the money we're not good. We're good. I do love New York are taking them with the money is native. This show needs money that money goes to us I, Love The New York Times. Here's the Davy Alba. Roads Liberals ask why should we believe trump has the virus that you know I. think that's a newspaper to do chicken Shit I. Did it myself on the show? Yeah. Of course still chicken shit if the newspaper. Well if you're the paper of record I, guess it kind of just reporting on tweets. This is the New York. Times has a lot. It's reports about what people tweet debts not really reporting. It's just getting your own twitter account shouldn't say opinion maybe doesn't I don't think it says if Komo everything's opinions on the New, York now doesn't say though doesn't say it's not the under the opinion pages. Under trump test positive. Oh, on whatever as fine I don't mind. I. Think it's just a it's just great. What what? What a great here Michael Moore. He's also he's he definitely believes it's a it's phony. Cause he's a phony. I I'm still thinking. My favorite is the ten days of darkness according to John and thousands of sealed indictments. This would be perfect. Not Holding my breath. It would be perfect. And with this, we've we've gotten a new term which in a in a bizarre kind of way works possibly quite well for an end of show Eyeso-. This is Corey Lewandowski who was with the president during the debate and. And I. Guess He must have also been around pigs. That's another thing that bothered me. I mean, what's the testing system? If they're all on the plane together and yet someone gets tested first gets result I then the president's tested. That was. Bothers me the most I thought hope Hicks was out she was ousted. She was data the old thing. Yeah she was gone. Get Back in how did that happen I? Don't know listen to Corey Lewandowski. In Two thousand sixteen. How how do you think the campaign changes right now you got an election and thirty one days and your candidates in the hospital. You know build this as an opportunity for all those people who supported this president to start fighting for him as he has done for us over the last five years on the campaign trail and the four years as president. So look we understand what's at stake in this election, the future of our country's at stake. We are here to support Donald Trump to stand them the breach that he can't stand in right now and I can tell you this. The people on the trump train continue to be actively engaged in advocating for this president for four more years in an election, which is one month from today. Core. Thank you for your time and hope you continue. Say Negative. Just. Like so many others thanking coroner. Stay safe. I hope you stay negative. Thank you for your time. Hope you can use negative. What's Great. Great. Show I. So thank you for your time and hope you continue. Say Negative. Competitive. Once for that as okay. Just thought that was funny like stay negative. Hey, thank you for your courage stay negative. It just has such a great ring to it, but this is another by the way. This is another example. Dowse get to do with any of this has been supposedly. Off The road for a long time ever since he grabbed at Phoney Bologna reporters arm, it's just call. Me You sending me to the ground and then then Ben Shapiro. The big phony says I am quitting Breitbart because they don't they're not just supporting. These are phoney writer here who got hurt damaged by Corey Lewandowski. I'm GonNa Start my own publication. Forgot all about that? So long I remember that every time I hear Shapiro I think what else phoney Baloney. This guy is I hear all disguised great in the entertainment corner. We also had South Park where they're big Rona episode, the the corona virus episode it was. I'd give it a seven. It was. Okay. It was pretty funny. All ultimately anti-trump. They, just show him as a big flame throwing douchebag literally flame throwing everything. Was Very funny bits and this I thought was the reasonable reasonable humor. Is that we can't let some dirty virus from China completely up into our lives and shut us down. Please do not quote the president in front of our child. I think that's pretty funny. Guys have the right idea. What else you have on this specifically because I do WanNa, talk a little bit about. I guess, for example, the on yesterday's NBC nightly news. I'm just GONNA play the I have other clips. But I. WANNA play the run because the whole show the whole half hour news show I was just about trump and Gavin Corona. This is the one minute nine second. Opening, Teaser for the NBC nightly news yesterday breaking news tonight critical hours white. House official warns that the next forty eight hours will be crucial for the president's health. The mixed messages as his doctors say the president is improving Thursday. He had a mild cough nasal congestion with teague. All of which are now resolving and improving. The new reporting on his condition just before he was hospitalized, did he need oxygen and to the president travel on Air Force One to a fundraiser at that while he had symptoms. Also breaking Chris Christie hospitalized for Kobe Tonight House Republicans Senators Kellyanne. Conway. And the President's campaign manager also test positive. A. New Photo from inside the White House event at tended by many now sick and the moment at the debate when the trump family waved off a doctor reminding them to wear masks new rules for the vice presidential debate just days away the new protocols to keep the candidates safe Mike Pence announces more in-person, campaign, events. The president's experimental treatment we talked to patients tried him. This ABC. News with Jose. Belives. That's also interesting. That he's been given severe and regeneration. Mama Monaco Open. Monaco. Yes. A monocle cure. I had the clips on this L.. Let's talk. Can We? Let's talk. Let's talk. Let's This is from the same NBC report and this is NBC when I didn't clip these. They went into this thing about whether or not he was taking oxygen they mentioned it in the teaser and that was part of it back and forth, and there's nobody would say he's taking oxygen but NBC kept saying we have sources that say he's been taken oxygen and I don't even think what difference does it make you Actually be good actually take off. Is that what they say. When you go in the hospital? If you're pregnant you go in the hospital. The thing you love is when they put that little cannulation, your nose. Oh. Man. You don't smell the hospital. It's Nice and fresh makes your brain clear. But there was there was deconstructed photos of his walk to the helicopter that purported to show. He was wearing a very almost invisible. Kanye had a thing on his back a portable Basically Joe Biden's run an easier ski better experience. Fake trump now have to go review that again. You. Look at it. You'll see is a fake trumpy. He doesn't walk rice everything about it as well, and if I can point out You were very adamant few weeks ago that clearly, the president had already had corona virus had taken hydroxy chloroquine and therefore could not even get the Ronin anymore. I mean obviously, you have to stick to that. That was more than a few weeks ago the. Early on. Okay. Well, let's just listen to the experimental drug because this is interesting in that it generated an open letter by some maniac who sent it all around. US short short of my inbox has passed around from person to person about how he's gotTa stop taking this experimental drug because it blows out your kidneys are trying to kill the president these and these doctors are a bunch of Democrats Nice. But the NBC report has none of that but NBC maybe. On their son decided that killers. To experimental drug part one president trump is receiving treatment not yet approved by the FDA. His doctors had asked for special permission to use it just how effective is it? Cathy Park has details soon after the president's Kobe Ninety diagnosis, his physician released an update saying Mr trump received a single aac graham does the regenerates antibody cocktail cocktail of two antibodies review pudding to at least based on all of our scientific experiments. You can really protect against what a lot of people are worried about the experimental drug is intended. To boost the body's immune system to help fight off the virus, we could with a senior injection within a couple of days dramatically, lower their viral levels by one hundred fold by ninety nine percent the treatment still under review being tested on patients at all different stages of the infection regeneration release a drug to the president under compassionate use in approval process that goes through the FDA for those requesting the drug outside of clinical trials. Are there any side effects of taking this cocktail? It's been in more than two. People. The safety is being monitored not only by us by outside independent experts and independent safety monitoring committee. And the safety profile is very benign I will say no case. Have I heard of the patient especially of the president inside the importance of the president getting a experimental infusion of a an antibody cocktail Nicole Martinez was diagnosed with Kovic in August with a weakened immune system do multiple sclerosis. She believed the benefits of the experimental treatment outweighed the risks you think it potentially could have saved your line. Yes. I would have to say that. A thousand person days after the injection. Martinez. Says she began noticing improvements I gave it like two days. Then miraculously may some smell and taste started coming back, which was a godsend I did not see the Walter Reed medical professionals a little press conference today confirm that they are that. These are the the treatments being used. Do we have confirmation or is this just people talking no I? Believe that they did confirm that okay. What would seem to me that I still would like to know where the president trump has a sense of smell. Noah's asked even talked about this woman who kind of brings it up because that's the one thing that happens to most people that get corona they had ended up with the they lose their sense of smell. Which I find to be peculiar. To. More clips in this series I heard that. People with influenza also sometimes loose sense of taste and smell I've never heard. Yeah. I heard a couple of times. I don't think that would be a benefit to anyone who likes wine. Now. Okay go clip to and Kathy joins US now Kathy. How soon could antibody drugs for Co, would be available to the general public. There are several companies developing these drugs right now the right now, they're still in the trial phase Jenner sentence working with the federal government roll out roughly three hundred, thousand doses. Of the year for those at highest risk. Jose. Rovan about three hundred. Now, I got the third clip, which is just a little add on here and I wanNA play it and then I'll discuss something about it afterwards with his diagnosis the president is now part of an increasingly common club one, seven, million Americans have contracted the virus more than thirty thousand or in the hospital for it right now, the country has become almost numb to the grim statistics nearly one thousand Americans still dying each day but as commander in chief battles, the virus will it change any behaviors Sam Brock more On the streets of south Florida a buzz of activity inside restaurants, bars, and clubs some lorraine's feeling pandemic fatigue. They go into the Florida thing and show people you know boosted up having a good time. Now. There was a there was a little throw through. I don't know how to describe these but they happen all the time. And In that last clip that you don't, you didn't hear it. Because nobody hears this stuff and I'm really concerned about the fact that news reports can do like this and nobody. Because the does probably go in the brain. and. Do you do you have any idea what might be? No I'd have to listen to it again would caught it you if you're going to see where you can. Just thirty seconds I'd like to try it again. I'd like another try Alex please with. US Now that you know exists the are now I'll find it hopefully you'll find you I. I would be stunned if you didn't but let me mention something else about that. If you if you listen to all the news with it in mind that these exist, and so you're we we try by the when I will say that I don't catch these things right away you. It's only because we do these clips that catch him at all because we listen to it right we'll get the clip. Reviews the Tiffany, the process of producing the clip. We hear it. All right. Listen again with his diagnosis. The president is now part of increasingly common club one in seven million Americans have contracted the virus more than thirty thousand or in the hospital for it right now. Well, right there off the bat you know one in seven million have tested positive is not the same as contracting the virus. Is it that because that's a problem too. No. That's kind of I have the I so of it well, let me let me let me just continues. The rest of it? There's no more that was. Caught you caught the moment. Okay. I. Didn't know if there was more I'm sorry. What he does is eat you listen carefully says one in seven million have the virus when he? Say Oh. What he meant to say was more than seven million. Man But he's not listening I have the play the Ice Oh this is so you can hear it a little better. This is the trump experimental drug bonus eyeso- one, seven, million Americans have contracted. The virus is he is he saying more than seven million he's saying. When you hear it, it's one I'm here to get one seven million as saying more than cad saying more but it sounds but you can hear one, one, seven, million Americans have contracted the virus. Okay I. I'm just hearing him say more. It's. You're hearing more because you want to hear more now because he's saying, Moore. All but you can also hear one. and. In the longer clip, it sounds more like when we had this. Phenomenon before this is like the blue dress goals. Can hear those words. Well, that's sometimes obviously I exaggerated like the the thing where it says Jew here to the last show second point I'd make to. I'm just worried that you can actually hold onto it. Here he do here in both ways right that's what makes sure you hear everything but I got the Jew thing comes from a woody Allen Bit I think it was either in any haller Manhattan. winker keeps Google walks down the street with his partner and it keeps saying don't Ju he said wouldn't Ju- mind going with me Jews as drew and he makes a big stink about this August you comment and every time I hear somebody who runs the whether runs together the words wooden. Ju. Ju. I just think back on this Woody Allen Gag. Just pulling them out. Okay. That's pretty funny. Anyway. Okay. That's all I've got on the experimental drug in this one in seven million. Well. Final thought is operatives razor. He's actually he's got it. He sick he's GonNa. Fight it. He's GonNa I think he's got it. He's going to is going to come out and he'll do a big A. Either he comes out of a dozen. He looks like he's like he's facilities fluey. It looks built fluey just from the pictures I've seen those come. He comes out and he staged a huge comeback and it's going to be you know monstrously good or he's going GonNa die I mean this. Die. Could Happen. But I don't think. So would that CARE is impossible people dire uc they want to go to the doctor and the next day. Well, let's talk about. Testing for moment because this is this is heating up. In a very interesting way, and of course, I love it when things have been looking at start to pop to the top I, we go to the United Kingdom's This is What's that guy's name Andrew he has the talk show normally Kinda that interface guy. Farraj. Used to go on there all the time and argue with him can't remember his name. He's doing a show from home of course because they're. United Brian I don't O'Brien. Now it's Andrew Most in your face gathered Andrew Neil. Neil. Thanks, Carol. Yeah. So. He had on. And this is you know this is BBC an be BBC doesn't matter. He's a real television, real television a podcast. And he had on professor soon, Netra Gupta leading epidemiologists at the University of Oxford and a very good question is what metric all these numbers that are being thrown out what metrics should we actually pay attention to to understand where we are in the power dot AC. Metro should we be using to see how bad couvin situations? Well, certainly, we should be looking at cases. They're all sorts of problems associated with. Testing positive. What that actually means doesn't mean a person who is. Infected infectious or simply has some residual. Bars that Rome. UPENN those wherever they take it from. That's is always good. You can't argue with debts, but the other I think we should be looking at debts very about the other important point. Is that we should be looking at deaths and even cases were, should we be able to measure them correctly and? See. July against the amount of testing that's being done even all of these should be placed. benchmarked against what is happening with other infections other researching fictions in particular what's happening with flu? What's happening with pneumococcal pneumonia until we place it in the context of these other infections, we tend to get instead of blinkered. Viewpoint very strict. Yes and that of course is intentional. So nude hair here almost zero death rate all you hear is a number thousand people dying every day thousand people. we don't really know if it's a CO morbidity and it's a never ending argument will never never finish it. We have the charts we Iran him in the news constantly every news got a new chart. Sand thing now cases. BUMP in April way up the curve came way down the secondary little biddy bump in terms of deaths and then down to pretty much next to nothing but the case is skyrocketing the whole time. So. An unbelievable question and answer session in the candle Navien parliament and yes. To in Australia in Canada, they do say premiere. In Australia's premier. As so we had the independent member of parliament Randy Hillier, and he asked the prime minister but wha- represented in this case by his. Health and Human Services official about the. Test and this of course is one of my favorite topics because we have seen anything but. Data that shows from our very own epidemiologists are lab technicians, all the people who are members of Gitmo nation saying really if you're spinning this thing to amplify to find traces of something above thirty cycles, you're really going to bring up all kinds of stuff that could be something else it could. It could look like you're positive. It's dead virus fragments. So it's really not helpful and this bless him this this member of parliament had quotes had all thing and it just beautiful exchange and I'm so happy it was on their parliament TV. My questions to the premier are covert policies and the risk that they pose rain year requires an honest and forthright discussion. Dr Eden a former TIF scientists with the pharmaceutical giant Pfizer has stated and I quote. Most, if not, all of the. Tests result in false positives, due high ct thresholds, Juliet Morrison, Garages. At the University of California states and I quote any tests would a cycle threshold about thirty five is too sensitive. The Public Health Agency of Canada reported in May of this year that testing over twenty five cycles provides dubious results. The prestigious Oxford professor. Doctor Carl, Hannigan estimated a Does not equal covert nineteen speaker. My question. is are your testing treating both a false understanding the risk as well as false positives. Before we go to the answer, we talk to our political consultant from the courage of our consulting group John. The correct answer for the health professional in this case John. Bull. I'm not sure what the question is. That's a great answer. Let's hear it again. Keen Speaker my question. is are your testing treating both a false understanding of the risk as well as false positives? Yes, it is that the. True answer would be if you're the consultant you go. Yes, it is. We need to keep the public all jacked up. To the election to we get trump out of office. Once that happens we can pull back on all of this problem. Canada. Here they hate trump they hate trump and more than they hate him here. But that can't be the answer from the health ladies saying yes. While she actually answered that way in her own way. Speaker, the PC our testing is very effective. There are outbreaks in has proven to be so we are very. Not Accurate not precise. It's even worse. They're very effective where there's. Great use of the term effects. Earning the job perfect speaker. The PTR testing is very effective in areas where there are outbreaks, it has proven to be. So we are receiving that information. We need that information in order to take action we have taken action on several fronts in terms of living social, unmonitored social gatherings limiting. Capacities in restaurants and bars in another actions that we've taken but I'm not quite what the member is suggesting. Are you suggesting we don't do any testing? Shop testing is that the reaction that we should be taking with them all go on the offense right away go to what we shouldn't be doing any think even though this is. A she she literally said it's very effective in an outbreak so that we can then get people to social distance, not very effective it or precisely identifying who has the virus none of that is in their this lady screwed it. What else would you suggest acted a premium and I'm glad to? Question was posed on July thirtieth deputy medical officer of Health Dr. Bribery. I quote our testing can result in over fifty percents false positives. The person actually doesn't have covert. Have some deals or they have they have nothing. She is also called for limits on testing vase dramatic people while the government calls for more another contradiction in a long list of we contradictions we all high false positive rates are too high ct's and Canadian and world experts. Agree. It should not be more than twenty five cycles yet according to the Journal of Veraldi Ontario labs are testing chapels at thirty eight to forty five cycles what needs to be done. And it's the same here with our lab at forty five, not even thirty, eight to forty five, just crank it up to thirty five. That's where it belongs. So these lab guys, these lab guys who are part of the pharmaceutical medical industry industrial complex. These recycles the more money exactly, and then he comes back he doubles site where the motorcycles, the more money, the more money more testing and more testing the more money to more site I mean, this is just unbuttoned Manza and I think if you're running a lab by the way, you're not making a Lotta money generally. So. So now we're going to double down. And we're just GONNA, take it a step further speaker to the premier. When did the premier become aware of these faulty tests and practices? Then why have you done nothing to fix them? At least July. The member, there are zero inconsistencies coming from our public health experts talk. has clarified what she indicated before what she indicated four was that the. Testing is very effective in areas where. Outbreaks such as effective in areas where we're having outbreaks. So when I did my PCR tested Rogin, it wasn't effective because it wasn't an outbreak. So it's not only effective so you can just say, Cook we have an outbreak. makes. No Sense. But Oh, don't worry areas where we are having outbreaks such as what we're seeing the areas province right now in peel in Ottawa and in. Toronto we need that testing to make those decision. We are taking your that we need. We need testing to make those decisions because it's very effective. Yeah. For your agendas decision, we are taking action where we need to take action we're looking at other methods of testing. Some of the Antigen testing is looking very promising. It looks as if hell candidate is proving that it's a good screening tool, but we need every tool that we can use. CR. Testing Antigen testing. We're looking at saliva testing. We need everything that we can do for screening and for testing purposes to keep the people of Ontario down. To keep people locked down, we need every tool it's looking promising not a single one and that's one time. This lady say this works it's accurate or precise. No none of it's looking promising saliva test antibody test bull crap bullcrap we're being hoodwinked and it's in the system. It's not by these people. The Assay showed up for the big lab that one of the two big lives that we habits forty-five cycles it's just too high. And they need Oh yeah. They needed we she's not lying. We need it. So we can keep you locked down and muzzled up shut up slave will what's the point? Control Power. Kind of power, they're going to get what can what can control what can I control and power the What were they going to use the power for? Break backs the economy they're ruining all the restaurants daylight to go to build back better. Hello if got to break it down to build back better. So we have a reason to shepherd in the green new deal and all of the great green good paying jobs it's going to bring good paying union jobs. Yes I think that that is ultimately that is ultimately where it's headed. This is all part of the giant hoax of climate change Yes note from Greg I'm a producer leaving Italy on October first, the Italian Prime Minister Garcia Picante while addressing the assembly in Berlin used the phrase. Reconsider. Leo. which translates according to Google translate to we try to build back better. So he basically said build back better. It's all over the place. Another Italian, another Chinese affiliate with build back better coo the heck knows who's WHO's behind it. But when you tell the Chinese would benefit from this put off their they've already made the statement although Biden praised it. As China's clan they're going to they're going to have carbon dioxide emissions peak is GonNa peak in twenty thirty, and then they're going to head towards zero emissions. Peaking anything there's just doing what they do. They're paying no attention to any of this. They're going to be at a dominant position to in terms of manufacturing and in terms of just. The ability to do anything profitably. then. Anybody. That's GonNa Start depending on win power when you have for example, the United States has three hundred and fifty years. Worth of coal in the ground that could power this country for three hundred and fifty years Yeah but we can't do that. CHEAP, cheap cheap energy and energy translates the cheap goods. Because if something if if you can power plant to make something and it doesn't cost anything, the power plant, the product coming out is GonNa be a lot less expensive just going to be coiled materials if if they get their way and they clearly seem to be pushing very hard. there will be everything will be shoved onto the green new deal new taxes. Elliott everything and and and there will be they've already said it work from home weeks. It's lowering the cost of operation keep big corporate infrastructure lowering their building costs for sure by forty percent. And keeping slaves interchangeable at home in the little pod it's like the Matrix, we just connect the Internet to your umbilical cord and we've got a human resource. It works by itself. Look at it. It's a little thing. There's little little house. Generates stuff for me. Don't have to do anything to it. Don't have to worry about it. No HR issues. And no workman's COMP. This is great and then we'll just give him phoney baloney jobs that'll be good paying green jobs and universal basic income. You know this is what they want to do. They're not hiding this. Don't hide it now. So so obfuscate things in a certain way that only a few people can understand normally. Our. Producers, we can figure most of this out. But I don't know what good it does anyone. Makes US feel better. or at least we. Prepare for the worst guess I don't know slammed. You're right. This whole thing is just in a bad is a bad situation. Just this whole the rest of this year with this bullcrap lockdown when there's no dance is ridiculous. But the ridiculousness is from the citizens themselves. Austin had a big rally yesterday. Would they call it? It was like Constitutional Rights Rally You see what it was called. Yes. Constitutional Rights Summit had stuff to do obviously. A Everyone went out and bitched about not having a mask. Sure. I would recommend people to those four charge that in the last newsletter in the be all the other newsletters before that just take a look and tell me what what does it make sense So now we're starting to Polish everything up. You know make sure everyone knows who's on the right side of all this and who's doing who's doing doing the best and who's doing all the good work. Good work and the CUOMO who I believe to be responsible for Not Directly. But yes, he did he did order a directly people. Well, he's denying this. Denying what would they have documented? Yes. I've two clips one from CNN N. N.. Now, of course, with the soft shoe because he is Chris giant head Cuomo's brother. And they're kind of setting it up for the ALLEYOOP, which is the second clip. For, sure. How many? Of New? York's six thousand Cova related nursing home deaths are linked to the states order but it is growing political storm for Governor Andrew Cuomo. Who insists he was just following federal guidelines New York followed the president's agencies. Guidance that is not quite the true. Not Quite guideline say nursing homes can accept Kovic Patients New York's directive said, no residents shelby denied admission. Still Cuomo said nursing homes were not required to take over patients. If they didn't feel they could handle them. I think the rule that you can't discriminate against the COVID patient. Is is right. That doesn't mean the nursing home has to accept a Kobe positive patient, but the heads of nursing home say they viewed the March twenty-fifth directive as a mandate one telling CNN we were told that we were not allowed to turn people down nursing staff tried to make other changes but many couldn't stop the spread of Covid. After six weeks, Cuomo essentially reversed part of directive issuing an executive order saying hospitals cannot discharge a patient to a nursing home unless the patient tests negative for covert nineteen critics claim the governor finally realized his policy was wrong. So that's the soft cover he's given, which allows the governor of New, York. To make this statement to the Finger Lakes Daily News and we never needed nursing home beds because we always had hospital beds. So it just never happened in. New York. Where we needed to say what nursing home we need you to take this person even though they're con- covert positive it never happened. We had extra beds. We had extra beds. Javed's extra beds at emergency hospitals that we put up all across the state. So it just never happened. That, we needed a nursing home to take a covert positive person. It never happened. And that's how it goes shameless in. That's how it goes. Now he's not just shameless. We only have one word for that here on the show. Total Douche. So I have a note from I'm GonNa get this if defined it. From From the anonymous Lesbian Oh. Good have much is actually summariser note. She says that Survive did print it out now. She says she's been she hates this Guy Cuomo and she She's convinced that there is a he's behind some. There's some scam going on and everything's part of the scam of his he's somehow profiting. And she believes that wants the shutdown took place especially in New York. Nobody has noticed what they've done to to Laguardia. She flew out of Laguardia to Boston for some advantage and then she she says Laguardia has been completely leveled and completely rebuilt on a twenty four seven basis. They had every worker in the service that could be in construction no mass no that just working their asses off harmony for seven to rebuild the Gordian into some outrageously gorgeous modern airport and you've been Liguori I've been there. Yes. The piece was shade whole Shit Shit Hole Airport and she thinks that there's some there's something went on with him and the construction workers or whatever to rebuild this airport from the ground up from scratch. To this modern new fancy airports, no one's talking about it. It is an eight billion dollar construction of new Laguardia taking place while keeping the existing airport fully operational. On a site smaller than Central Park. When complete, it'll be the first new major airport in the United States in more than twenty five years the new Laguardia Airport follow the Vision Governor Cuomo outlined in two thousand fifteen to create a unified twenty-first-century airport with world class amenities iconic public art, the state of the art security that. Trends. This is this. Is Your Gulag People improve transportation access an additional airside taxi ways to reduce delays the overall eight billion dollar investment New York broke, but no eight billion dollar investment is two-thirds privately financed. Okay. There you go. There's your scam. What do you think? Chai Khana could it be? When he be China ever thought China because China's involved. Airports in China is probably Chinese people building it man, what are you talking about? Risk could be two? Oh, let's see. Let's see who is investing. C doesn't say we should know. Magic Johnson, is invested in it apparently. In the new Laguardia. Are that work the I dunno magic Johnson enterprises teamed up with loop capital markets in a CEO Jim Reynolds become equity investors in the Guardia Gateway partners. My goodness. Well. Now, let's just do a simple search China investment. Laguardia this is show prep why bother beating around the Bush? I don't see it. I don't see milestone reach maybe this is it. Could be could. Be. I don't know man but that's very interesting. Very, interesting that she brought that to our attention. New I thought that New York had no money they were broke. They need a bailout. Gas Project. Is, apparently, airports have beauty. Well that is kind of welcome but you know I just I worry about the Chinese thing because they own Times Square for New Year's Eve they own a lot of stuff. Yeah. They could be really heavily involved in maybe Magic Johnson whose ex NBA is just a front man for the Chinese for all we know how here we go Charlie in the troll room back in two thousand, fifteen cuomo first announced plans for the overhaul Olympic consortium called Gordon Partners, which includes Scott Scott H. Okay. WPBSA USA Vantage Airport. China's are involved. Chinese. Yeah. So of course I mean there's going to be all kinds of money in a project like that. How can you? How can you go wrong hockey go wrong that's why Magic Johnson's nodded WHOA. Yeah. Well. I. Love the anonymous lesbian for turning US onto that. That's very good. Now back to the douchebag elite Spin Chicago Mayor Lori lightfoot lost her marbles. And this just gives you a little juice. I had not thought of her that way but yes, beetlejuice. beetlejuice dozens. Bit. Well. She dressed up as the Rona, crusader? Yes. She came into the press briefing with this music playing and she and her health and Human Services Secretary were wearing capes and masks to handing out bottles of clorox and the hand sanitizer as the guess what we're here to talk about the Crusaders. Good afternoon everyone. Happy October I. I'd like to begin by A. Partner in crime. Dr. Public Health. Truth wants to. Partnering cries you nailed it truth wants to come. Out. I. Absolutely. That's funny. Well, here's another truth wants to come out. This is Chris. Wallace seems to be the case for those who know Chris, Wallace Fox News, the guy who moderated the the first presidential debate seems to be the story is the health of the president and the question of the same thing to me. The takeaway of this whole thing is the follow science. We've made the masks a political issue. Oh Yeah. No no no no Chris Wallace you have. You made it a political issue. The news media made it politically issue no backing down. We haven't the candidates have and it's not a political issue. It's a public health Estrin, and if I could say, one thing to all of the people out there watching. Forget the politics this is a public safety health issue. The president of the United States is in the most secure bubble in the world in the sense that everybody who comes in contact with them has to take a task and he's still got it. So where the Damn NASC and follow the science, the key takeaway. This follow the science listened to the science. The science tells us is bullcrap science doesn't talk the men who speak for science. That's that's the power right there. You know people like Bill Gates everyone he speaks on behalf of science. These are the representatives does those people need to be listen to? Science says this. We better learn a little bit as a as a world. How science really works I just want to remind you everybody about Bill Gates back in Davos? Twenty fifteen I think twenty sixteen when he was talking about, you know this is obviously pre corona virus talking about his investments in in the vaccine industry please just remember what's going on here. You invested ten billion dollars vaccinations over the last two decades and you figured out the return on investment for that and it kind of stunned. That can you walk us through the math? Impressive that When you take these vaccines, get them to be very inexpensive by making big volume commitments. Have that right relationship with the private sector. Get the delivery system. So they're really getting the coverage out there. You literally saved millions of lives. We see a phenomenal trucker, it's been one, hundred, billion overall. The world's put in our foundation. It's a bit more than ten billion. But we feel there's been over a twenty to one returns. The economic benefits that's pretty strong number compared to anything else. Human benefit in millions of lives saved. So we're here pretty strong message that. Although all these other issues are very important. Let's not forget about the great success in global help in maintaining that commitment I think the numbers that you ran through where if you had put that money into an S. and p. five hundred and reinvested the dividends you've come up with something like seventeen, billion dollars that you think it's two hundred billion dollars here. Yeah. Yeah. Lovely to getting rich. Nonprofit. I Love The nonprofit where it just just keep printing money. So cool they never have to fundraise. They never have to do anything it's just they invest and it just becomes more and more is fantastic. Investment prisons to yes. No, they said they dialed that back but I don't believe dialed it back doesn't mean they don't invest prisons. Do a lot more, but we decided not to dial it back a bit I got. Two little. Remember the What was that? Hey Guy from the UK the you will obey and. Above the billiard ball guy. Yeah actually I should probably. Was that Haig howdy Spill Hague H. A. G. I think I've maybe Yeah Aso just this. This is something we put together years ago. Takes place within a strong legal framework? We offer them to the rule of law. And our accountable for. Southern countries secret intelligence is used to control the. Hours. Exists, to, protect the freedoms protects the? So we had that. we have our night of the southern skies who is in. Danny Stan. Also. Known as the Victoria Nobre Australia and he's put together his own versions. To actually of the Mr Dan, and and his statements. For the rules there is no need to protest anything. New. and. Then let's be clear. The spots some of the absolute nonsense, daddy criterion papers, civil liberties, and human rights. Enforce the rules. No human rights, he needs a little more I, like the Russian. Chorus in the background but he needs to put a little more echo on the guy. Yeah and maybe a little more high end who's sweet punches through a bit better. But it's a very good job like these a lot and I like it because we're months ahead of Australia. They're catching up on the script and it's nice when we can kind of give them the same jollies we've always had here. You need that stuff you need to laugh about it and I think. This is the clip. Maybe not what is this? But the hell. Thousand Different One. Could forward. Doesn't take much to make these sound guys. I'm pretty evil and all the elements are there just need to add a music bed and a little echo? That's that's what's really happening down under. Anything more on the Kovic or anything we need to do that we've. Go I do have this woman net is a healthcare worker with little complaint she had a real long complaint but I I took thirteen seconds of it i. think she's a doctor machines bitching about seven I took the thirteenth seconds out of the thirteenth six I pulled to good ISOS for the to show mix and I. think it'd be just generally good for a lot of different things but this is a healthcare worker. And her complaint what I now find out is that I am trained to work for a system that keeps people dependent, dumb and seek. and. This is a crime. This is show girl woman. Who are in It was actually Ancilla who told me about her because she knows her very well, and she did quit her job and she's crowdfunding her existence to be out there and talk the truth and it was actually quite a good statement that she made. I liked the ditch. It gets and it's not as -fensive like your. Dutch. Dutch offensive well, not to me Oh. The dish like it. Oh they think. I I got the to ISOS and I thought at the End of show and then you have. Never went dumb and sick. There's a very into show dom. Okay. Good. Good ended show the other one which is crime is so this is a crime. So we have, let's see. We have I think dumb. Sick. Is. Up. There but I think stay negative is still in the running. Let's listen again gum and sick. Thank you for your time and hope you continue say negative and that's too long. violating. Your rule of length I'm too long. Yes. Right. Okay. I. Think Dominic good because we are we're dumb and sicker. Everybody and with that would like to thank you for your courage and say in the morning to you the man who put the see in forty five. Cycles Mr John See divorce. In the morning you Mr Adam carry in the morning to all ships at sea boots on the ground feet in the air subs in the water and all the days the nights out today in the morning to everybody including you trolls eighteen seventy of yet yet they're backed John Everyone's everyone's back on board. That's the way linked to see it in the morning because Oh desk is now they're back on the trump benway. Well, what happens this? Trump. GETS GETS whatever goes to the hospital. My phone blows up my family. And you can see the mixed emotions and they're confused and angry and mad and and but oh you. Okay. Okay. Stepped on a cord took to the Mike. Okay Rob Plant. So it's it's. Logical people. Did, you see what happened on the twitter's Thursday a sample we needed emergency pod tweeted emergency show right now you have to get on the stream and talk to us. Like. That no twitter that much anymore now good good and while I appreciate unmastered on now no the why appreciate it Now that's not how it works. You know we need to digest. We get clips we need to see what's happening and he can't do from one day to the next. and. please. It's unstoppable but I personally. I can't tell you why exactly. But when people say an episode or show and they call it a Pod, I just WanNa hate you all I didn't know it. Oh, that's terrible. It started with Pod Save America started using that term will tomorrow on the POD and it's taken over it's now it's called a pod. And if I'd save America's one of the worst podcast of of the mall, it's just a bunch of. People haranguing trump you know unlike us. Every game rang every rain anybody but but it's just the the turn pod like a p. pod or little pot of idiot sitting in the pod pod bean. Prod being it pod been working on the podcast index. Org. pod Bean is I'd say number two or number three of all podcast feeds. Really. Yes I meant to tell you that was like holy crap pod beams no joke. Those guy says the real deal. They got I think fifty, sixty, thousand at least. Updating yeah. Not just think we're even on their says some. Are Not. I don't know what do you mean? Well I mean he he they go on staff they. taught me well this a big problem. There's there's a lot of fraud where like Scott Adams is a perfect example and it's on spotify this potter. Spot spot at pod Adams is on spotify with two feeds the same show except he doesn't own one of them is just someone ripping off his feed and if they ever run as the. Probably make the money off of it. There's a lot of fraud in the in anchor which was bought by spotify and. St. About. Stitcher but for sure pod. pod Wien. Power to those guys did they did it right pot being? The name that cracks me up to use it it's like spas them. Yeah. Be See that's just funny. So I use it all the time 'cause always gets you gets a laugh. Does I can't help, but it just is so lame pod beating anyway good trolls working hard time. A highly appreciated no agenda stream dot com go to that page. There's a chat widget right there. You can listen to the stream live chat along with the trolls is really called trolling. and. They're told me right now I shouldn't be looking on trying to concentrate. That is no agenda stream dot com when you're in there, just hit him up for an invite to no agenda. SOCIAL DOT COM, which is our mastodon federated social network. No Algorithm. So the signal to noise ratio is high John, and I post there more while John doesn't post anything on twitter anymore just re tweets So if you want some of those some of that great brain juice from the from the Fabulous d'Ivoire act Goto. NO AGENDA SOCIAL DOT COM and a big in the morning to the artist who brought us one of the best pieces of art in an conceptually, and I think an Execution Mountain J., the bill back better Django blocks. Jingo Django Django, whatever the game, what they're caught even know that. Until you pointed it out which soldiery on the Peace Yes Jenga blocks. It's you know it's the game when you pull the blocks out and then it all falls down if you do it wrong. It's called. So as building blocks zeal back better I saw people asking for AH version of it without the writing so they could it for their own country. Now, of course, great reset and green new deal you and you can leave in there but you know they want maybe blow job and had to go but people were so jacked about. The week as one and I was interviewed by Max Kaiser Maximum Stacey yesterday on their orange pill podcast And I I lay this out on about the bill back better and you want to see Max Kaiser's brain start to go into high gear start smoke comes out of his when he heard this, he's like holy crap. They're they're exporting the entire globalist agenda to year end the branding. This is starting to figure it out and how long have we been on this half a year At least. Well. When you first you found it in the U N Declaration. And private say it's about four months. Maybe longer lose track at times with some of these things are just going on and on and on and nobody's paying attention. But accept is I really I really liked that piece and and you know once you once you see it then it's like holy crap. That makes that's just so good to very good peace now we're there now. Yes Go. We will talk about the ones that the pieces that you started off with a you're a big supporter of the bill back better thirty three train that was done by Darren I wasn't I said it was nice. Well, you liked it. Yeah. Sure and also. Putin for some reason, I didn't think much of it. I kinda like the one I kinda like was Nacho tramps disgusting picture of in kissing a Chris Wallace Lewis Wallison address. And I was actually promoting that piece the most in but you nixed it based on a feeling that you had seen the art before. Yes. That's right. Well, certainly, that's a template the template of Joe Sniffing someone. That's all it was well done. I didn't like our own template, the no agenda Temple there was. I want. I. Would have still continued to push this piece and I. It was sold except for the fact that you thought you saw for any, here's what I'm going to just mention for the artists benefit. If you we see that looks like it may have been lifted. We don't use it and we usually check for it. I can not find that this was lifted and I used it. I just posted every once in a while because I think it's funny but the the promises, this artist nacho trump's tramps or whatever it is. Has No track record of of any sort. He's got one picture of Pepi the FROG, which is definitely lifted so I couldn't go with well this guy's looks like a pro he's been doing a lot of stuff. This is very much like his normal style. I. Couldn't back him up. And so many of the artists you can just click on there. Yeah. You can. Generate you can look at their history and you can see the artists who are professionals honors show. It just stands out like a sore thumb. Honorable. Honorable Mention for nick the REX nick nick the rats. Putin's puppy. Yes. Nick Rats Putin, which was another nice piece 'cause it turns out that Putin desolate like a dog. And I thought that was also in contention, but we ended up with this piece which you actually identified. And sold me on because you mentioned the name of those blocks I didn't realize it was that and so I. Yeah. That was the piece at one. It was a tough one. This was a tough it tough tough contest for sure. Yeah. But we all the artist should be happy. They were mentioned especially in this segment and please feel free to go take a look at no agenda art generator dot. com, you can see all the pieces submitted many of them, make it onto products that the go are available at no agenda shops, DOT com. Of course, we put them in the newsletter Tom People, print them out they even talking about hi Rez for people to do posters. It's a perfect example of value for value on the show that we love so much you give time your talent, your treasure. and. Just whatever you felt you're getting out of it and we'd like to look at some of the executive producers and Associate Executive Producers for episode twelve, hundred and eighty three these people came in. At the top and that's why we give them those credits and read their notes and and dance like monkey boys. There's no big names today I'm not that big news is no big numbers today so we can get through this pretty quickly. Combat Rocket Idaho Highlands three, thirty, three, three, top donor, and He says, he like a manning money shot a Memphis BOP WBZ t seven won't go away and says W bt's what it says this. WTC for your information and is out dear John and thank you for keeping the amid villa small during the current academic pants scam Democ I've been busy hitting multiple family members in the mouth none of whom have donated. uh-huh. So the following douches need to be bagged. Julie. And Joe from Texas. AM. Rita from Boise. Ask last but not least my smoking hot wife Christina. There's nothing truly there is truly nothing like a dame went thirty, one, thirty, three of my donations diverge in my wonderful better half to start her way to dame what she's not. She's not a do she no. So please D- Duscher. douched. Lousy. L.. In by slits shamelessly plugging my custom rifles building business as specialized in precision hunting and target rifles of all in any kind I can have shipped my work all over the United States I'm a one man operation. I'd take the utmost pride in ensuing my customers receive the highest quality firearms possible for their monetary value. Got Makers makers. Can Be contacted through my website. BENFIELD PRECISION DOT COM be Bien Field Ben field that can dude named Ben Ben, feel precision dot com, or on the Graham instagram at Benfield precision any listener who uses my services I don't use the graeme please anyone who uses my services who receive a ten. Ten percent discount. If, they can show proof of donation to the shadow of at least fifty dollars. Some nice stuff. He's got here. These are pretty the clip. Pressured gathered under this really makes saw. Three thousand dollars for him but holy crap those things are pretty. Combat Rock of the Idaho Highlands Okay Nice. Man Thank you very much. Yes and he didn't ask for Karma or anything But what he? got shown a money shop. Jesus we're. We're GONNA. Money. Shot Ken Conway Monisha. Amen fist-bump. In the hang. Tag. Lie. Thirty, three, thirty, three. Or? Three thirty seventeen in Austin Texas it. M. John and Adam, this Sharon be from Austin Texas I'm grateful for you to thank you for your insight and demystifying the five am for shrinking my Miglin for making me laugh I needed deducing since this is my first donation. You spend -duced I got hit in the mouth by my friend ignatio from Spain who is a barren or some big deal we met while traveling on the same tour group in Jordan, back when we could travel and I. Knew. We would be close buddies. Check that out. That's pretty odd why you meet you meet a no agenda person on the road you connecting you identify that's not. A Baron in Spain is. Unusual well, this is true. We listened to do although it might not be unusual if he's he's the guy this keeping tabs on her. We listened to no agenda on road trips and I got addicted to you guys. I love. He's a good man I love to request. China is a whole jingle and go Karma please lovin lights you both. The entire no agenda. Community Nice Story. Welcome to the Party, Donald Trump don't trust China. You've got. or to associate executive producer Taylor Butcher. WHO's in Lewistown? Montana two, three, four, five, six. Taylor butcher here with birthday donation for my dad and brother they're on the list who are avid listeners are Douche bags or not donating through. Two of them. Of course. I can no longer stand idly by while Ross and Andrew Butcher propagate the we're not being while being douchebag. So like always Daddy's got to come in here and clean up after Y'all podfather requested double D douching for Ross and Andrew. My. Okay well. issue. Do. One and You spend. Okay, well, this is the second time this has happened in this donation segment I'm going to. Mention that I, not a big fan of douchebag somebody. Then D. douching them in the same same people. No, that's not cool. I'm sorry I misunderstood. What. has happened earlier in this donation saying I want to try to put an end to this before we have to make an executive decision that was suck. Exactly my brother Andrew and I are electrocutions and Ross is a county commissioner for Fergus county here in Montana, which is quickly becoming a California because of the mass. Migration. Birthday. Now. Really. Montana. Very. Interesting. I didn't know California moving up there they're moving anywhere. Anywhere it's a plague. Them Californians are buying. Okay. Then Californians are buying everything sight unseen. That from Texas, the from Montana and move with the Montana's to have an accent themselves. It's tends to be a cowboy access. Between here and there I can't say we're indentified his Texan might Texas is not that good I can only do a good fort worth accent which is talking district between your teeth guest away and Fort Worth Bush Bush. That's right. That's I can't stand it to all people moving in Montana. Please don't. California. My Montana pet. Gets bumper sticker can I get an Alex Jones frigging frogs are gay followed by little girl Yay followed by Biden full load. Thanks guys butcher out. Putting chemicals in the water that turn the frigging soggy. I'm GonNa give you the whole low today. This okeydokey. Armenian. Schick is connection Nixon two, hundred, thirty, three dollars and sixty five cents. Does she know about the grapes. Grape debris. Wars he does I. Don't know I don't see. What did she say? I just turned thirty three. Off My job and was hitting them out by my mother. Sweet. Thank you both and all of the producers of the sanity and MiG shrinkage can I get a D. douching for my mother and I? You've been deep -duced. Be Sixty fifth birthday mom Linda. Tuesday. October six never mind the wind. Armenian. Cognac is the best. Well, now that's something you would know about. I've had. Armenian. Cognac. Yeah. Code for I, I was introduced to it in Russia. And the Russians think it's the best. Outside of Cognac itself. And they there's Russian brandy and there's Armenian Cognac and if you have a choice, you don't WanNa drink to Russian brandy. anyway, and it's now call Armenia Brad he used to be called Armenian Cognac. It's this fact. Anyway says or brand is the European Union rule that we must start calling brandy fear speculation but my mother mentioned Portland History with building moratoriums when we spoke about the continued publicized protesting. Listening to grumpy old vans. They mentioned Portland is a top city. Americans are leaving. Niro didn't burn Rome, but he did have a build back better plan it took six months but I finally started a new and improved job this past week I request job he's all over the map. Get drunk driver I request jobs Karma to pay plant forward for anyone that needs or pay it forward and an eight Kale for my carnivore mother. Okay, we'll do a double shot for Ya. Kale not donuts. Jobs. Jobs jobs and jobs. Harmon. Think. It's the Kale obeyed that she wanted to make sure I. do that one because that's a good. Have more. Kale. Have More Kale. This is the mind control had bringing deborrah have more Kale have more Kale. You. Kale. You will. Have More Kale you will obey. IF THEY WANNA. Promote. Kale. Have US do the commercials people. Okay. We get results here to curry divorce consulting group. Yeah. We would do it. We'd do actually that'd be an easy win for us with God Melody Fogo. Gladstone waiting for her husband is show up. To thirty three thirty three magic number showed up again. As our order while the Kiddo Izzy and I were at dinner at the local dominic casual Italian in nearby park. Ville Missouri. So there's wishing great Karma in general for the family. Thanks Adamant John Off that's so nice. Game. Metal. You've got Karma from the FUCA Zotov family whose husband has been away not able to return home for I. Think. Since before his his before his daughter was born I think. Well David Pflueger Todo. Are Night and. He's got a block title, these Duke I think burn. To thirty, thirty two. They're donating one after another. That's what it looks like. Wow maybe they're sending messages. This is nice. You family you. You'll you family you who thirty to thirty two and he's done a penny jingle please thirty-three semaj number goat Karma here's a donation from the proud husband and father whose wife's donation trigger is now tuned to fire upon contact with the magic. Number. Well done. A beautiful thing also, Adam Gay Melody told me last night that the recap of your experience traveling a few weeks ago gave her the confidence to fly for a fresh. Irish dance competition in north. Carolina. Last week. Good for you. How'd you know Ti you Wanna fly now as the town House No incidences of corona being passed around in airplanes it can't figure this out. This again, came up with any numbers that would love to but I just like to. Reiterate as an airman who knows something about pressurized aircraft has cetera. You're not sitting in circulated air that you're not breathing. The only thing that circulates for second is your neighbors farts but that also goes away the whole plane doesn't die from the FART. Thank you for that insight just so people can test it. So the contested themselves have up front. farting. Fart and then go back and see if you could smell it in the back now it goes away real quick. Well, you know you could. Yeah but there's there's there's things as wind current. So the FART could get into the aisle and if you walk as you were walking toward the back, you could be carrying the Fart with you. Vortex. While you're walking if you're the walker yeah, then that would be good. So. If you're GONNA okay I think this is good news. This is very good information. You don't want to disturb your neighbor because they're be giving you the distinct guy literally. So. Just walk up and down the aisle when you're farting. Exactly I've got information man. Has Come to light literally. Belly she continues to earn your not or he does actually dame a came back with a couple of trophies to her last two first place showing that she needs her advancement in debt eluded her. Please give her shot goat Karma keep shrinking amid as across the fruited plains. Thank you for your courage. The Magic Number You've got. Armagh. Brecca any. KATINA's. Remember could be racketeering racketeering. Could be. Could be could be let in. John and Adam thanks for keeping all saying his all along with all this craziness. I will keep the notes short. My handsome husband Baron Oleg Cotin is turning forty today. October fourth is an amazing person. A loving has been the best dad to our to Human Resources Happy Birthday Zeki. You are the best and we all love you to the moon and back no carbon per jingles just play shut up slave in. Italian follow by science should up slave. Scowl. got a full shot, their science I that's our group of associate executive producers and executive producers for show twelve eighty. WanNa thank each and everyone of them for helping me make this show happen, and these are official credits means they can be used placed anywhere. People are looking There's a lot of people who are afraid to go on production productions. Are Very expensive at the moment because you need all kinds of consultants. In fact, I think it goes as far to say that you are an executive or associate executive producer and corona consultant of the no agenda show episode one, thousand, two, hundred, eighty, three. Do you not think that they have? Can we have consulted with them? Have they done that work? Done the work they've done the work so you can put that there. It might help put it on your Lincoln anywhere where credit's recognized because they do matter but above all, thank you for helping. US. Produce the no agenda show it is the best podcast in the universe and Without people supporting it just would not continue and we love doing. He gaffer and Corona virus consultant. So executive producer gaffer and Corona virus consulted for the no agenda show episode one, thousand, two, hundred, eighty, three if you'd like to support us and grab under those beautiful credits for yourself for the following program Goto. Dot Org slash. Always. Thank you for delivering this show with your time, your talent and your treasure. Formula this. We go out. People. In the mouth. A. Boom boom we were talking about China. I got to quickey. China bits. which is It's kind of interesting. Have you ever heard of the quad? Squad. The Quad is a it's it's United States. Australia India and Japan together they they formed the quad I know this yeah. They may even be just see Quad USA well, I thought I had heard it but I thought it was kind of like one of those thousands of sealed indictments type deals but. the quad with United States now, of course. is to be the Quad I lost that page. Israel thing and it they call it now. This is from St Dot Gov. Okay. That will be. Useful. Here, it is from our State Department US Australia India Japan consultations known as the squad, the Quad I don't know why it's the quad is not it's not an acronym. But it's four. Okay. So they're doing stuff and they're doing stuff and the whole point of the quad is to mess with China. So remember it's the United States it's Australia. It's India and Japan a quicker foreign report that I picked up since we don't get this kind of news in the Free West Mead where China the quad has come. Into action because India takes the Philippines from China, Japan has begun working on Vietnam and Indonesia. China is being given some of the most decisive blows in the Indo Pacific as the Quad and infamous strategic group comprising India Japan the US and Australia seems to have made up its mind to go out in containing China's influence India and Japan to key what constituents. ASSIETTE members in a bid to kick China out of Southeast Asia I India tempted to take the Philippines away from China by working towards a preferential trade agreement with Manila, and now Japan's Prime Minister Yoshihiko. Is I. Do the RCN members we at Phnom Anna Nisha as a part of his first overseas trip after coming at the helm of his Japan and India thus turning the tide against China in Southeast Asia, which happens to be at the core of the Indo Pacific strategy check Beijing's growing influence while the South East Asian nations like Vietnam. Indonesia and the Philippines are having common interest with the quote including this shit concerns against Chinese expansionism belligerents and it's Salami slicing techniques to win. The South Esi it seems that the UN hasn't deserted China in the courts favor I like to the Salami slicing tactics I never heard that term before. Salon China's Salama Slight Salami slicing tactics. So? What Australia may be part of the quad there is an attack coming up from the south with New Zealand on September the twenty fifth a report released by Chinese Global Television network CGT, and said that New Zealand China will upgrade its free trade agreement FTA within the framework of the controversial belt and Road Initiative Bri Kao Fong a spokesperson from the Chinese Ministry of Commerce reportedly announced the news at the virtual China New Zealand Joint Committee on Trade and Economy Meeting on September twenty third the upgrade I am to deepen cooperation and infrastructure agriculture and Tourism Gal said CGT in reported that New Zealand and China would also maintain communication on research, medicine and Vaccine Development. New Zealand and China concluded negotiations for the upgraded T in November two, thousand and nineteen. It is yet to be passed by the New Zealand and currently is at the stage where submissions from the public are being heard it sounds like Belton road to me has Alford New Zealand New Zealand is either going to have to village should probably be kicked out of five is exactly. Either that or they should could be used by five is to spy on China and some funny way. Sense 'cause they're a bunch of socialist. Prime ministers kind of debt. They're good to go. With China they don't care about anything else. And Prime Minister whack-job prime ministers just A. Complete nut I haven't heard from. Who Have Sir Chris I think in New Zealand as well. I haven't heard from him wonder if everything's okay know it's so small. Do. They still have Internet. Are they still connected? Are they're still on the grave? Maybe? After all those earthquakes. New Zealand. I don't know man you know who's buying Land New Zealand is all the California. Yeah. Exactly the douchebag rich. Californians. So maybe that's good. Miss a good thing. They should have their Chinese friends. They're running the show they probably like it think it's good. They can have was she. She, she pay she come onto the compound. Komo to the COMP. Okay. see Mike Says Adam. My sister is a spy I mean Dominican nun in New Zealand they still have Internet okay. You didn't just saying your sisters Dominican non we already understand she's a spy. You don't have to tell us. We're hip to that. We got it. So I. Just a little research because I'm working in a new the new BINGO cards. Yes this coming up Wednesday. So I gotta get on the stick I finished I finished the Harris Card I. Can you give us a few examples because she's on the computer I'm GONNA put it onto mastodon probably tomorrow said get anymore what I can't. Okay. There's still room for input. Yeah. You're GONNA have a hard time crack through I commend Issey well thought out cart. But I decided that if you want to do some research on Harris and if and I'm sure pants is doing this. You gotta go back to the debates when she got into a beef with Biden and you're talking about the Democrat debates. Yeah. which you got into a beef with Biden. She got into a real slam fest with Tulsi Gabbard and I pulled some clips a slim fast. You tell me. Nice. It's a slam fast and so we have by four clips that are very entertaining more like, but they also were developed you develop a. The buzzwords, the buzz words for the Hi Ed Harris a Bingo card. But let's listen to this token. Remind as what a Jerk Harris says by listening to her, she got no votes to nobody liked her as she was blessed even you can even tell that they were. The hosts of this debate were scamming or when they brought Tulsi Gabbard in. Just, a slam even more. Let's go with the early Harris Debate. clip one Senator Harris. been quite critical vice president PA Vice President Biden's policies on race specifically on the issue of busing in the thousand nine hundred seventy s having benefited from bossing when you were a young child vice-president Biden says that your current position on bussing you're opposed to federally mandated busing. That position is the same as his position is right that is simply false and let's be very clear about this. When Vice President Biden was in the United States Senate working with segregationist to opposed busing, which was the vehicle by which we would integrate. America's public schools had I been in the United States Senate at that time I would have been completely on the other side of the aisle and let's be clear about this had those segregationists their way I would not be a member of the United States Senate Cory Booker would not be a member of the United States and Barack Obama would not have been in the position to nominate him to the title he now holds. And so on that issue, we could not be more. Heart, which is The vice president has still failed to acknowledge. That it was wrong to take the position that he took at that time. Now I would like to also talk about this conversation about Eric Garner, because I to met with his mother. And one of the things that we've got to be clear about it that this President United States Donald Trump while he has been in office has quietly been allowing the United States. Department of Justice to shutdown consent decrees to stop pattern and practice investigations. On that case, we also know that the Civil Rights Division and this is important the civil rights division. Of, the United States Department of Justice said charges should have been filed but this United States Department of Justice was usurped and I believe it is because that president did not want those charges to go forward and they overrode a decision by the civil rights division of the States Department of Justice under my administration, the Civil Rights, division will rain and their. Methods President by now want to give you a chance to respond to what Senator Harris. Okay. Okay so she steamrolls everybody. Runs over time and she's this is important. It was and it was the Tom what she said was incomprehensible she's rattling off something she she memorize it wasn't all that great was not. At all she, she's no good last night on. SNL At the end of that whole opening sequence Maya what's her name? The WHO WHO to? Get My. My my Angela was playing. Harris now. Maya Rudolph that's. So she comes out and she says, well, what I'm going to give you a WEAP- woman as president and it's time for that. I'll just be hot VP in charge and it was clearly written. The whole bit was written to show that trump's old idiot biden's and old idiot and really Comma Harris is the way to go. That was the message from NBC Lorne Michaels Saturday night live. Made my stomach turn. Here we go. A Want to give you a chance to respond to what Senator Harris Cassette. When Senator Harris has turned general for eight years in the state of California. There were two of the most cigarettes, school districts in the country in Los Angeles and in San Francisco, and she did not ev- I. I didn't see a single solitary time. She brought a case against them to descend from. Secondly, she also is in a situation where she had a police department when she was there that in fact wasn't abusing people's rights and the fact was that she in fact was told by her own people that her own staff that she should do something about and disclose to defense attorneys like me that you in fact have been by the police officer did something you did not give you information. Expo. Your your client she didn't do that. She never did, and so what happened along came in federal judge said enough enough and he freed thousand of these people. If you doubt me Google a thousand prisoners freed Comma Harra. Thank you. Vice President Biden is Inter Harris you're response. Is. Simply not true. And as Attorney General of California where I ran the second largest department of Justice in the United States. Second only to the United States Department of Justice I am proud of the work we did work. That has received national recognition for what has been the important work reforming a criminal justice system and cleaning up the consequences of the bills that you pass when you are in the United States Senate for decades. Was the work of creating for one of the first in the nation initiatives. Entering former offenders and getting them jobs in counseling. I did the work as attorney general of putting body cameras on special. Here this I'm kind of excited about this debate. I have no idea how the the former radio guy. Vice President Pence is going to. cause. It is. Have, we ever seen him. Raise his voice get a little testy. I don't nothing ever. For. Comma harassed. Let me be clear. These are all pretty obvious ones that she's GonNa throw out there but pans does he have any comebacks? It he's he was given this role. He plays it perfectly, but he seems devoid hurting as we seen. Personality not then it'd be using what I'm playing now as their base. Because she's argumentative she runs over time she does all these things too. Let's go I. Guess Now it gets a little better because they bring in Tulsa Review. This is going to get better. This is the worst. This is horrible to listen to this. Special Number And I would ask. Congresswoman Gabbard Congresswoman Gabbard you took issue with Senator Harris Confronting, Vice President Biden at the last debate, you called it a quote false accusation that Joe Biden is a racist. What's your response I want to bring the conversation back to the broken criminal justice system. That disproportionately negatively impacting black and brown people all across this country today, a Senator Harris says she's proud of her record as a prosecutor in that she'll be a prosecutor president, but I'm deeply concerned about this record. There are too many examples to cite, but she put over fifteen hundred people in jail for marijuana violations, and then laughed about it when she was asked to she ever smoked marijuana. She blocked. Evidence that would have freedom and incident man from death row until the courts forced her to do. So she kept people in prison beyond their sentences to use them as cheap labor for the state of California and she fought to keep. Failed in place that impacts four people in the worst kind of way. Thank Congresswoman Center response. I kind of like the she basically said that she will enslaves people. That's pretty good. Tulsi way to her family was slave owners. Of course, they don't forget that little tidbit. Of course, they were and yeah. And it's to talk on the on the debate card. Yet okay. I think to Puck may may have to come on the day I don't think. So she's still lying about him. I'll play the clip after you're done. Okay. Let's play this one. This one big number four. Yeah. Respond. As the elected Attorney General California. I did the work. Significantly. Reforming the criminal justice system of state of forty million people, which became a national model for the work that needs to be done and I. Am Proud of that work and I am proud of making the decision to not just give fancy speeches or being a legislative body and give speeches on the floor, but actually doing the work. Of being in the position to use the power that I had to reform a system that is badly in need of reform. That is why we created initiatives that were out reentering former offenders and getting them counseling. It is fine because I know that criminal justice is broken that I am an advocate for what? But legalize marijuana in the United States, I want to bring Congresswoman Gabbard back in your response but bottom line is Senator Harris when you in a position to make a difference in an impact in these people's lives, you did not and worse yet in the case of those who are on death row, innocent people you actually blocked evidence from being revealed that would have freed them until you were forced to do. So there is no excuse for that and the people who suffered under your reign as prosecutor you owe them an apology. You got. Centrist. Entire career I have been opposed personally and posted the death penalty and that has never changed and I dare anybody who was in a position to make that decision to face the people I have faced to say I will not seek the death penalty. That is my background that is my work I am proud of it I think you can judge people by when they are under fire. And it's not about some fancy opinion on a stage. But when they're in the position to actually make a decision, what do they do when I was in the position of having to decide whether or not to seek a death penalty on cases I prosecuted I made a very difficult decision that was not popular to not seek the death penalty history shows that nine proud of those decisions. Now you using audacity because that's pretty good for our city. So fancy fancy. She says to to put her down you just fancy opinion on a stage A. Fancy, opinion stated which she says that was her that was. I do want to play one little snippet as a little twelve second. This is Harris Short snippet just to show you that she uses this term a lot, and let's be clear. There is no. Vaccine for racism. We've gotta do the work. Well. Good news in a long line of. Presidential or vice presidential candidates We have had on this show and covered throughout our almost thirteen year history. Of course, we started with the children and the children have always had something to say. Hillary Clinton and then of course we got. Giant in your skin asking. and Luckily today we have. ME. A. So desperate sounding and. Cam. Beauty Jam. Let's see Mike's one of his eighteen children. She's got a career ahead of her. Say Car now and put her to work. It's so good. I can't believe we haven't played that more. Coming into vogue that is very good. I just have two little quick Quick cameras since I've been holding onto, it would have been doing other stuff. So this to pox your core know she would lie like she was in school before the album came out she. Was Smoking Weed listen to pock. She was doing a zoom zoom interview on An wasn't We're CNN I. Think we're maybe MSNBC WITH ANGELA RYE. Angela don't like her at all and and this and Communist. So Dom- listen. Mass rapper alive to pop. Lives as best rapper alive she says to. Angela writes GonNa try and save her. Safer from. I gotTA. Lana Second, I have to relish this. You ready keys asked. Who's the best rapper alive? Yes. And everybody including all white men. That the main thing about two. was good in his era, but he's dead everybody in there everybody knows this. Pay. Don't group me with the old white men just yet. But. Still she. Hip. Camera or Kamala or whatever she wants to call herself Harris. Stacy's the best rapper alive and okay started from scratch again because I wanna to hear it again. Mass rapper alive to pop. You. Say he lives on. I keep doing that. Listen West Coast girl thing to pack lives on I'm with you I'm with you so to. Say Own that Would I say I mean, there's so many I mean. Any of them there are some that I would not mention right now because they should stay in their lane. But. Yeah that's a slam at Konya. That's stay in his lane not acting black GONYEA. That's what she's saying. There are some that I I would not mention right now because they should stay in their lane get back in the black lane with me the black lady. But Others, I. Wasn't. There are some compilations of I kept. Putting aside, I never got put one together but cameras got to. She's worse than Hillary, with that cackle she laughs and lasts less than you very. Often at the wrong moments he has an cackle and it's just I think is worse than Hillary's well, let's check. We have. That's that's not actually. I thought we had. That that we have that one a couple of times. We have casick. And we have. Rachel maddow. Oh, that's how it works. Okay. Now, let me see if we can get spot here and Carol. Back a little I keep doing that. Let. This songs with her cackle I. Think we we might have had one on the word is. Many I mean you know it? I. There are some that I would not mention right now because they should stay in their lane. But on others I. WanNa know. I. Keep moving. and. That was not supposed to be as. Well. She could have done another one and was clearly on her mind this bothered her so much to so bothered that she had messed this one up and she couldn't come up with any other names other than Konya was just living rent-free as they say in her head. So she had to stay in your maybe she meant staying you're laying out of my head. What you do on black man, you can't. So when she was talking about, you got it right the first time. So when when she was Doing a speech answering questions about. Ruth Bader. Ginsburg this came out of her face she was part of our culture. Yes. We wear those notorious B I g t shirts with a lot of pride. So. Notorious B. I g was a rapper whose also dead. said. I G. instead of instead. Of. Our BG. Yeah. Yeah. Yes we wear those notorious B I g t shirt with. That was from notorious B I g not our BG. That that's what she's consumed with. She's consumed with the mistake with Angela Rye and then she'd messes up her brain. So patsy messes up our BG with the I G. Those are good catches. That was a keeper. She got loud. Did a good job now that's a dynamite catch. Yeah. I wouldn't have caught that in a million years. Since My goodness. So plaintiff plaintiff is exactly. That's right. That's right. Let me see. You know just to go back to the debates for moment. Chris Wallace who I really do blame. For, a lot of just how it went wrong. He's so full of crap. So, here he was on Bill Hammer show. I don't know. I didn't. I'm not sitting at home watching Fox where people send me clink. Links to clips. And so he blamed this thing going off the rails even argument went off the rails. It was just not not pleasant to watch, but I don't think it was off the rails. A lot of people thought it was pleasant pleasant in an entertaining way to watch. I wasn't squirming in my seat watching it. It made me. Anxious, but just it was uncomfortable. And funny thing. And I've watched it. So many times now could have watched for different clips that people you know check this out. He said this I was going looking for that for the Ju- comet all of this stuff a lot of good things were said by both he was just the interruption somehow. Overpowered by the way apparently. According to analysis from sound engineers in a sound engineers read at group The president's microphone was consistently three DB's lower three DB, which is quite a bit. A Lot. Yeah. Then then Biden's microphone anyway. So here's Chris Wallace blaming it all on the president. Here's what happened. You know we began the first segment on the Supreme Court they each got their two minutes and they both a obeyed and not particular case. Then, Biden started to answer a question and the president started erupting him and my initial reaction was this is great because so often these debates parallel news conferences where one candidate answers the question to him the other candidate answers the question to him. So when the president started engaging with Biden, I thought we're going to have a real debate here it became clearer and clearer over. Time that this was something different and that the president was determined to try to but in and throw Joe Biden no off. You gave your statistics I saw another Fox analysis that indicates the president interrupted either Biden's answers are my questions a total of one, hundred, five times, which is way more than what a minute and he bears the primary responsibility for what happened onces so he? This is nonsense. Okay. So it just bothers me this guy. And because I know I know that it just wasn't like that and then he's Biden I interrupted him in fact now what would Chris? Wallace said was? Joe. Biden was answering a question and trump interrupted. That's what he said. Let. Me Just see if I can find A. Reaction started interrupting. Our question and the president started erupting and my initial. Okay. So the vice president was answering the question and the president start interrupting him. No the first question, the president answered for two minutes. Joe Biden answered for two minutes. Then the and he ended his statement and I timed it, it was two minutes. actually think a couple of seconds over. And then the minute he started into what I guess would be the open discussion trump interrupts and it's not really a super interruption but then what? What Chris Wallace did I think really is a mistake as a moderator key made a grave error where Biden had just spoken for two minutes goes into open discussion trump interrupts wallace says stop interrupting and gives it back to Biden who had just been speaking for two minutes and then says, it's open discussion I know it's I'm hammering this and the last time is this guy's Foolish and he made mistakes he could have saved it here listen and so it's just not appropriate to do this before this election if he wins the election and the Senate is Democrat or Republican neck, he goes forward. If not, we should wait until February. All right. One hundred, million people with preexisting conditions as far as the say is concerned, the people already had their say they. Okay. Justice Ginsburg said very powerfully, very strongly at some point. Ten years ago or so she said a president and the Senate is elected for a period of time but presidents elected for four years. We're not elected for three years. I'm not elected for three years. So we have the Senate, we have a president elected to the next that period of time. Period of time we have an opening I'm not elected for three years elected for four years. Hundred argues. Joe Two. Hundred million people is totally wrong. I. Don't know where you get that number. The bigger problem that you have is that you're going to extinguish one, hundred, eighty, million people with their private healthcare that very simply not true. Well, you sitting going to socialist how? We're. Gentlemen. We're now into open discussion discussion discussion. Yes I agree advice Fresno One He come on. Trump was talking. Why should we go ahead vice president he's interrupting Biden that's the first interruption of the night is just not true and he should've just let it go. Yeah. It was fine. Inviting was intr- violent should've just waited and said the way trump did it You know you waited and then he gave. I mean this whole thing now I have one clip from this thing I got another clip somebody sent me to one of our producers and e really the video's even better than this I should give you the video posted. Okay. Is a very short clip were were trump is talking to Chris and trying to get his attention. And he's and trump is actually multitasking. So He is listening to Biden you have to play this clip a very short clip only nine seconds you're going to have to play it twice to really hear it. Trump is going to give you what what's going on. So you can kind of visualize it. Trump is talking way and Biden's over there interrupting talking over trump to talking over each other and and biases that the point number one, point number two and. Then, he says, point number three goes out to. Giving point number two and trump without missing a beat. Waves at Biden look looking at, but is waving him off and saying, no, no no, you're still important number two and it's Remarkable is worse waiver to. Three they said it would take. No you're number two know Chris. Chris they said it would. Go to. Bring back. is in the side of his head. It was the damnedest thing I've ever seen. Time Reptilian move man. That's Waiver to number three said. Number two. No, it's like. You know what this is. His line trump's doing his lines. The whole thing was scripted his. Looks thing when you think about it that way. You didn't get them before number two. You're already point number three get back to the SCRIP, scroll the the prompter back. The best part is video where we`re Biden is really befuddled because he knows he skipped point number two, and then he starts mumbling to himself. Waiver to summer three said it would take. No. You're number to know Chris Chris they said it would. Go to bring back. This guy he says, disguise. I I love the. I love the animated no agenda. Dame Jennifer put together. With the so good. What it is. Is, what is because you or who you are. That's why it is I mean. Biden wins. It'll certainly be a couple of months worth of fun for us until the before he dies. When that when he hears that cackle man he the hairs on the back of his net gotta whole. Coming. Good observation by one of our producers that. Biden looking straight at the camera. During the debate which he did creep release several times. was which Jim Carrey also did a great job of making fun of. Those are all for political ads. They're all being used in bats now. So they clearly told him and when you say this look right in the camera look past the teleprompter. But Smith looked through the teleprompter. And I love it. When you guys tell me about your kids how they're how everything is going with them. Now, we've had children hitting trees there. So angry Joe Biden from. Political ads and this is from Chad. Says Hey. The story of the kid in Wisconsin cracks me up and I can relate last year in a road trip might then five year old blue shouts from the back seat. I hate you might Bloomberg. And it turns out for him to the ADS have been popping up all over his youtube shows fast forward. All right right. These idiots. They don't have any control over there at placements fast forward to today and both of my kids now six and nine have all of their youtube shows covered in Jon Ossoff ads both foreign against the absolutely hate the man, the youngest screams middle finger at the tea every time he comes on. You know. This has got to be fraud by Google and Youtube they are. CanNot, be a part of any political campaigns media by to terrorize five year olds who are waiting for their children show to come on this. I think violations here you cannot just use the you may be showing horrible scenarios. You know trump kill people to five year olds stop that's gotTa stop someone has to call them on this out of control We're doing that we're calling him on it but I don't think there's anything I think it's just them I think is there elbows I don't think they care they sold the ad it's going for general use. Stuff brand brand safe. Don't worry about where it goes and they ended up in front of kids programming and the housing. You know the kids hate these guys I, I think that They don't think they're doing it. I think it's just Lazy Lazy laziest the way all these they don't have anybody working there. There's nobody in customer support they the running on shoestrings and Alagoas? Lazy. Lazy Lazy They're running on shoestrings alcohol. That's t shirts. No Agenda Shop. The Nation runs on shoestrings Alagoas. I think it's wrong. It's morally wrong. You're exposing chilled specially with negative ad you're exposing them to hate and lies all the ads are lies. And you're making your children mad. This is not a good way to involve them in the political process. This is not civics one. Oh, one for your child. We need a snappy slogan so people can. have. Express their outrage hike kids tell your mom to vote for me. Now. If that they were doing that then I have respect I would have respect. CERMARK here in. In Austin has been following a very interesting trial about seven hundred thousand ballots that have been harvested in the fun thing is that the person who did this who has been who's been running the program in Harris? County that Houston. was actually a Biden's campaign guy for Texas on August twenty six so Yes. Hard to believe how does that even work? I think there's always been fraud and shenanigans. You think it's going to be any more than usual. I think both sides doing I think is. Might be more because. Because it's been telegraphed but California's it's taken over the place. That's why there's pretty much. It's just an all Democrat state now. And it's. California's got to be the biggest scam state this whole you know and they do it at all levels they steal money from the taxpayers high the whole thing just a rip off. And camera comes from California. Hello. Hello. Let me see. Anything else swallows. Debate I. Have One that might be worth playing. Okay. This is This is a local story. This is elected officials There's this is the we did clip member years ago we did this woman was the secretaries elected official in Walnut Creek. And eclipse still around you played recently like about know six months ago. But as this woman she got elected and she her job is to be sergeant at arms for some city council or something she had to take the minutes and she never did she said I don't know why I'm taking minutes dumb and so what did you were you were actually elected to office to take the minutes that is your job. I don't know I just think it's stupid. I'm not yeah I'm not doing it. And this kind of thing is the stupidity of certain millennials. When they get in office, they don't understand their responsibilities or anything whatsoever. So now there's in Washington state. There's this one I. Think she's a city council member woman who's like so dumb that she's promoting play this clip this the elected official promotes Molotov cocktails. Before I play it. I can't financing under walnut. Creek I'm trying to think what the hell you're talking to been conquered to alcohol Molotov cocktail attacks against police officers surge in this region council member out of snohomish county she seemingly promoted more of it Megan. Done is a Democrat from Everett and she posted on a personal facebook page last week a stitching of a Molotov cocktail. And the text accompanying it read be the light you WANNA. See in the world interface oppo said, the stitching was caught a good reminder. Good reminder of what using Molotov cocktails shutting down. The line is Sergeant James Collieries the president of the Everett police officers. Association. Welcome to the show. Thank you Jason Thank you for having. So when you first saw this post, what was your reaction? It was it was shocking and. Look at it a couple times I. saw it on social media posted on some other sites. And it was it was shocking. Was it so shocking to you what did you take out of it? I mean I've heard that quote before and it's a it's a bit of it's taken from. A Gandhi. Gandhi comment. and. It was instead of having a like a shining light or a candle or sunlight in there to be that shining light in the world there is this molotov cocktail. We've seen our friends in law enforcement have these thrown at them at these riots. We, we have friends that have actually been injured. We've we've seen it in Portland and Seattle. And it was shocking. It was it was It was tough to see that coming from the elected official. Now she put out a statement Megan done in which she says it wasn't supposed to be a threat of violence. She said she's in this part is kind of Artemis. She did not connect the Molotov cocktail imagery police violence. Do you buy that. When you look at I mean that post you said a counter culture cross-stitch art project. And my belief with you know the definition of counterculture, you know we reject or opposed dominant values. And behavior in society will. So this counterculture violence is an acceptable. Footage who are these people. A. Serious. and. Had just come. In there all bunch of weenies. Every throw molotov cocktail or silvery even be involved in something they were flying back and forth. But you know it's Kinda. Cool. It's there's just this peer group. Well, I have something as beyond me. I have something just as stupid which could only come from Austin City Council who was all in on Black Lives Matter Inc and fund the police which is. Actually happening mental health funding and Austin got a boost today city council voted to allocate more than four million dollars to two different programs. The bulk of the funding roughly four million dollars will help pay for an expanded mobile crisis outreach team that team will be made up of first responders. To people experiencing a mental health crisis within ten or fifteen years. Its goal is to avoid jail bookings and admissions to emergency rooms and to provide short-term resources. Tell help stabilize people in need. The new funding will increase staffing to ensure twenty four seven access and also pay for five hundred tablet devices to first responders. Austin City Council member Greg. Khazar. Says the hope is that To ninety percent of these calls will no longer need a police officer to respond. Do. Really important role here is that will be able to respond to well over five thousand calls. Away, from you traditional nine, one, one response to. Trained mental health first responders. Or things. I've we have dental health. First responders may assist our police officers to be there to make some of the calls about our level of force is necessary. Now. He's coming at me. What level of force is necessary can just get a level a three. Three just I show the tasers were I do the? Fi Idiots glade situation you know start your second. Pick it up but I wonder how many police are out there to say to themselves. You would've sent a social worker for a domestic violence call pay go for it or what is shown on the television telescreen as. A mental health episode when clearly someone's in. The Delirious State What is it called again? Delirious state now? No the delirium. George Floyd actually head. I'm blanking on a troll will know somewhere but you know someone it seemed it's Oh they had to put a bag over his head and he had a mental problem. No, no no, it was It's it's the drugs. It's the yeah drugged up. Yeah. Hope I I can't send social worker over there and that they that them spit on the social work. To do good luck though the social the way they should do it my thinking. If I was GONNA, take take this approach that say I was taking this seriously. I tell the police we're GONNA to send a social worker for the police. Think this is Larry. We're going to send a social worker and to to to deescalate the situation because you guys are incompetent doing this. Obvious. But we'RE GONNA WE'RE GONNA, take this money and gives some social worker and they're going to be part of our department and they're going to go in there and they're going to escalate as mystic and they will escalate. Only. If necessary and then you'll get called in. We'll. Can you imagine excited delirium. Thank you goat in the troll resided delirium. Yes. So you'RE GONNA end up with I. Would I think this'll be fun to watch Austin. By the way. Anyone we don't promote this enough, but we have a lot of good search engines and being it dot io actually typed just delirium into the search box and showed me excited delirium as well. If you know anything no agenda related, that's the place to go. Also about what level of force is necessary how? To de escalate situations that we can make the city safer for for all of us he said from his penthouse at the w hotel. Lobby guards. Yeah. Caffeine thousand dollars in new funding. This is funny as a tag. So we got four million dollars for all this. No more cops needed for that, and then the tag may tax. For for all of us, another one, hundred, thirty, seven, thousand dollars in new funding we'll go to the homeless outreach street team. It connects people with services to help find stability and housing. seriously. So the biggest problem we have in Austin and where a lot of mental workers need to go where the police is involved is with people experiencing homelessness I mean it's it's becoming epidemic now but wait. Did she say, civility? What did she say? What was your tagline? She said? Don't know it's check please gland situations that we could make the city safer for for all of us another one, hundred, thirty, seven, thousand dollars in new funding we'll go to the homeless outreach street team. It connects people with services to help find stability and housing, stability stability stability stability. Shows people walking along saying, Hey, you can go over there or you could go over there. Only, one hundred, thirty, seven, thousand dollars four million dollars for this mystical mythical project of which five hundred. IPADS are being purchased. That's probably most of the brother. Stolen the black mark, a half a million dollars. Reselling these IPAD. Yeah. It's it's really it's really quite set. It's. GonNa show much by donating. Imagine all the people who can do. Yes. So we do have a few people for twelve eighty three believe do. Edna. Show thirteen hundred starting with a Alosha Wettin I. believe in would Washington. On eighty exactly. she says, thank you. Sir? Louisville. Mercedes Texas. Relationship to Villarreal Villarreal invades one hundred and fifty dollars rank you. Also on behalf half of Dame pill pusher. Tony Dockery and highland. Today that is. My sister-in-law. Right check them out producing. You met Tony Yuma Tonio docker yet Tony Dockery I've met her island Indiana one hundred. Thank you Sir John Reuben eight hundred Sir Fact Bass Houston Texas one hundred Joseph Hatch in Springfield Virginia. got a birthday maybe a night or something coming up. And Spring. One hundred he's this is Joseph and he says just finished with the Kaiser Louder Germany Bruising stogies meet up. Yes. He sent us a meter report which I have for you. It was like a party it occurred to me of in me counting lady Lo and behold is surpassed the baronet level sometime back. See counting attach please upgrade me at your convenience and he's added to the birthday list as well. Philip Cam in San, Francisco comes in with. A hundred. Is a note you might WanNa Research. There's anything here we need to read. Acid regeneration stock will skyrocket faster than Eland Musk's. Yeah thanks for the tip. Proper probably probably. Probably late fall short about a week late. Sir Kevin McLaughlin Duke of Luna Lover of America and BOOBS and locust boobs North Carolina Eight. Oh eight had sir herb land with A. sugarhill California. Georgia's. Sir End. Not In Williamsville New York eight oh eight Barron Marquette Eighty in Whittier California. He's comes into a month. Now. It's up to eighty. Continues Joe Walsh in Miami Florida here's a must read note which obviously don't have here in front of me sack seventy seven. Seventy seven. I'll go get the note. Read it in this last part of the show. Okay. We get the over on the desk I think I. Hope. It's quite interesting though forgotten Basketball California sixty, nine, sixty, nine, Jeff. Burridge Barich in Queen Creek Arizona. Ten Short Quiz Stan in lighten Great Britain UK fifty five, ten Harry Pilgrim fifty-five ten in Fredericksburg. Virginia. circum- in deforest Wisconsin also fifty five, ten, Salem Medic Madigan fifty, forty, five. He's actually in Tom Ball Texas Tom Ball. Brad horwitz video one dame Jennifer Buchanan are fabulous theme Jennifer in Charleston South Carolina she finally got up to ten thousand subscribers and she says in the morning a thousand. Thanks for the newsletter shoutout towards animated no agenda I was so tickled big time LG Y. subscriptions are climbing this birthday donation for our very good friend Paul. Quinn who is having a significant birthday ending in. The sex much love Bikaner from dame, Jennifer and Cermak of the twenty one twelve. Michael Jonoski Inland Dora Pennsylvania these are fifty dollar donors now starting with Michael. Jonoski did then David Beach in San Antonio. Douglas instrum is on the list Trevor Kelly in Hershey Pennsylvania. Dan scalise. In Vernon Connecticut Matthew Kansas key Sir Matthew to you in Chicago James Share Meta. In Napa Notch. Bobby pronounced NAPA. NAP A notch. Something says Napa Notch as much. But I'm sure it's never know Ker. Some crazy thing who knows is a local pronunciation. I'm not local Bradley Leaden Andrew Oxen Ham in Knoxville Tennessee cer- Brett Farrell in Oklahoma City Ok to Brian Watson in Raleigh North Carolina and last but not least Janice all over. Oh L. V. E. R. F.. Apparently. Somebody decided to correct the spelling of the spell checker data, but it's actually oh lv or an edmonds Washington Fifty WanNa. Thank all of these social being the producers of show twelve. Eighty three I think yes and we missed the deducing here for Trevor Kelly who says been hitting my friends in the mouth please give me a D. douching and keep up the incredible a deconstruction. JUICED and. Yes before he continuing to have to know from Joe. Okay Joe Walsh this is interesting. Excuse me quick message from Miami Surges apparently left Miami and south. Florida seems to be doing rather well down here. There's normalcy that is slowly been put in place. Of course, the mask issues still continues, but I think most villages going along with the program. Here. It is John have one crush view I. BELIEVE I heard more than on one occasion months ago. You stated emphatically that Kamala Harris would not be the running mate Joe Biden basically because the female political in the Democrat Party would not stand with her back her I am rather certain at Adam made an entry into a special book nothing noting your statements I, hate to call you out on this. Can you have Adam? No, he he doesn't have to check anything I will admit it. I wrote it up in a number of cases I was of new complete wrong impression that there is no way they're gonNA pick Kamala Harris. So I don't need to be called out I will just admit it that I was wrong. Wrong. Aren't you? Glad you got that note from your desk. There's a reason you left it there. You, take that criticism. My goodness. Now, you given up on the red book, but I'm maintaining mine and when I heard trump had the rona. I was kind of disappointing Al Crap because you know we had the entry that you said there will be no debates and I said we had a debate. You said it says debates. There may be no debates. Disappointing thing so then we had our forty five best wishes and those aren't mentioned here right that those names they're all still under the number that we were. We'll say there is a a lot of people that sent A. Forty, five dollars into. It which will be listed on a on a card but no, let's put it this way. A lot more people send money for a get well card for the president then for mother's Day. Yes as a matter of fact. I don't want it. That's one of the reasons I'm not interested in really just bragging about the number of people is a lot of people that sent the forty five dollars and we'll continue this for the two for the next show and then it's over and I'll send the card and immediately I think Cardi Carbon just funny people do like their MOMS much less the there's no comparison. Oh my goodness. This is one of our. We do these kind of gimmicky things once in awhile I take. Planned to raise their is what it is for the show but at the same time, it does it's Kinda cool to send know get well thing and get well soon it than thanks for the all the well wishes going the other way which is toward the show. But yes, we have a bunch of people WANNA. Thank for. Twenty five dollars for this. Promotion just got a text from Don Jr. Pay Adamant Don Jr. from eight eight Oh two to his only heard about the forty five dollars promotion. He says, my father shared a message with you earlier. Let's make America Great. Again, we're only seventy five thousand dollars short of our daily goal donate now so. There's no shame man. My Dad's doing okay. But we need a little more money. God Love American, politics thank you to our producers here, very kind of you and naturally to the forty fives, but also anyone who comes into the fifty dollar level, which we do not mention for reasons of anonymity, but also a lot of people on a sustaining donations these are. Regular donations that come back. There's a lot of different things. You can pretty much fill it out yourself, but you can do thirty, three, thirty three for for a week or a month whatever it is. We appreciate it and thank you for helping US produce the best podcast in the universe, your no agenda show. Dot Org slash. A. Man It's already the fourth of October. Can you believe is the fourth? The Fourth of October? Here's the birthday. Taylor butcher butcher says Happy Birthday to his Dad Ross and brother Andrew both the same day. Daria racketeering, her husband, Barron Oleg rocketing turns forty years old today some Armenian chick says happy birthday to her mother Linda Sixty five on October six at Dame Jennifer from animated. No agenda says happy. Birthday. To Paul Quinn his celebration is on these six as well and Joseph Hatch will be celebrating on the fourteenth of October. Happy Birthday everybody here at the best podcast in the universe. Do not have any titled Changes Because Joseph Hatchet No Joseph Hatch goes straight to the top. He had. He not been a night at all. So he becomes a BARONET INSTA- baronet. Barons the BARONET. Exactly. So I'm bringing, how could it be new? This is no, it wasn't. Just skipped knighthood is what happened he was a night exactly. The wasn't night. Okay. Let me show you that blade again. That's what I got with me. What are you got? I got the big one show it. Look at this. This jump. Light up at the podium please actually. We got A. Nike Dame Katie Humor. Katie you are welcome here on the podium along with Joseph. Hatch both of you have supported the no agenda show and. Any amount of one thousand dollars or more. In fact, Joseph went above and beyond and Katie. Well, you're gifted part of this. Beautiful. So we have you here allow me to pronounce the. Dame Katie Dame of the unfinished knitting projects and Sir Baron Vinci. Yes. Few we have hookers and blow rent boys, Chardonnay. We got hearts and how all redheads and rise. We've got beer and Blunt Sasaki Balk at Manila budgets and Bourbon Ginger gerbils orange. The mutton mead, we know you love it. Thank you for supporting the no agenda show over to no agenda DOT, com slash rings, Barrick show. We'll take care of you and get everything set up as soon as possible and Um yes. It's time to get into our meet up says what it is. Couple of meet up reports I from South Carolina well, that was hosted by Katie I guess. Adam and John. The Charleston. South Carolina meet up at the holy city brewery last night was great perfect weather turn out from around twelve including David and his family from Goldsboro north. Carolina Scott from Columbia and Rusty from Conway good conversation with no triggering and send a picture of her human resource having fun with our heads on sticks. Yes. When we were kids we had funds with sticks and Dog Poop, and now it's John Adams heads on sticks. We listen to the show together on her walks and she likes to sing along to the cheers theme meet up song coming up in just a moment just for you. sadly says Franco Dan Franco in New York City I had to report due to last minute cancellations the New York City no agenda meet up for Saturday October third was canceled. Nonetheless I WANNA thank my wife Jen and sons Nick and Matt for helping prepare and you Adam and John for promoting the event. Well, of course now, we go to Deutschland for the second bag meet up in the morning. This is tim the in chanter at. The bruising stogies meet up we had to move to Konin Foss in Cazar slot in. had a great time. I'M GONNA PASS IT OFF TO I. In the morning of and everyone else is listening from Orleans just like give a share their no agenda of com, check it out especially if you're not in the United States because we stick together right arm. Lashing rain here but we all feel good wearing muzzles phillies play democracies jingles. In the morning. This is Servando says and I'm just happy to be here meeting some new Deutsche. Bags. Reduce Bag Ray I gotta say this. and. Catching. By always. Having a great time just like last time spent a good time by Pay Adam and John Michael here. Thank you for for the great podcast and for bringing us all together I. had a great time with really nice people also a big shout out to all the producers for keeping the show going in the morning. And, that's one of my favorite reports of all time. You. Know they said, Hey, you know you don't we especially not in the US we gotta stick together. It's rough out. Here's well this the guy from Ireland. You can tell these people could fit right into the South Carolina North Carolina. I could. I just love that you're. Somewhat worse over there than it is sounds like it. Yeah. But but I have to say they're venue sounded great like. smelly kind of German beer kind of thing going I could almost smell it in that report. Mac and cheese by Ayn rand to Minnesotan nuts putting live from the still smoldering goals in Minneapolis on. Third of a small Migdal meet up here in Minneapolis Jake from Minneapolis reporting live in the morning Jensen's Chester from Minneapolis. This is Alex from Burnsville in the morning. This is Ben from Elko in the morning Mary from Minneapolis in the morning. It's April for Minneapolis. I'm not triggered but John It's shock apiece and this is Christopher I'm still douchebag. two-three. She's not triggered, but it's chuck apy. Even. What is that a place name that we've messed up town? Yeah I keep calling should. Oh Schalke. Remember for the next time. Right next to right next to notch or whatever it was called. The notch. Great reports guys. Thank you very much. No agenda meet UPS DOT Com and I love the audio reports half minute to minute you may. Meet up do what you can here's what's coming up last minute schedule today local Oregon thirty, three at three, thirty, three PM. So that is very last minute again today October fourth organ local thirty, three the farewell to Sir. Craig Porter the ronin moving greener. Sunnier pastures meet up is that today that is that is the one today. So deep pass away. This sounds horrible. No no he must be leaving. This is I don't have enough context here back office he created group thirty three when there wasn't a group in Oregon this is an outdoor meet up at the park and Westland bring it West Linn Blink, bring a chair and meet near the riverside parking lot parking on the volt it's where the okay. I don't know what this is. I. Hope he's not dead sounds like a fun meet up regardless. Coming up on Wednesday Saint Beach Pizza Saint. Pete, Beach in Florida eleven in the morning keep that in mind on Friday the Zurich Sanity meet up six o'clock Central European summertime on Friday as well. The southern Sheila no easy Ian meet up six o'clock this coming Saturday Oak town southside two, o'clock central time the no agenda local five twelve F. Austin October meet up who where's that taking place I usually do work Willie's joint bar and grill in Buta Texas Sir Scott. Okay that but if I can make it, that's a good one. then we have also on Saturday Nashville. The Cova. thirty-three to be. Announced rich be is doing that good. We have the Dortmund meet up. Dortmund's on We'll be next Sunday Thomas needs inputs go to meet ups are calm and help him out, and then we have the NFL kicking myself. I should've mentioned it Thursday the keeper I will be in Vegas. We'll be at the sands performing. Now will be a part of the meet up. That is taking place as being organized by Dame Angela and of course, the she'll and his entire family will be there patrick Kabul is coming in and is also working on organizing am. Would we're not going to list a venue you need to rsvp to get the secret text message because Vegas still is kind of on the shutdown. So we have some friendly people who do want to help us. But we can't be put that on the website. So and the keeper, and you know the keepers the big draw. Did you know this. Yeah you said this allows everyone wants to meet her. Yes. Everyone allows you to stay home. She'll have a lot more fun without you there. October thirteenth in Las Vegas. That's it for your no agenda meet UPS. Please go check them out at no agenda meet UPS DOT com. Or if there isn't one near, you here's a thought. Once you start one over there no agenda ups dot com it's like a potty. All. WHO'S L.. A. Man The crap is hitting the wall over to spotify. He what happened no I? You. May as well. keep us up or keep. Review which going on before. They're they're big hot deal was the Michelle Obama podcast. And and the that's a winner well. So they announced, they announced Think it was Friday great Friday news announcement. there. Now going to release it to other platforms as well. Meaning it showed up everywhere apple podcast. It showed up Michelle the Michelle. Yeah. The Michelle Obama podcast it shows called is called the Michelle Obama podcast. Bill. But then it's on Pod Bean. We'll wait no no. No, but here's the here's the problem. They launched with. proctor and gamble to products tied and dawn. And what from what I understand? They couldn't fulfill the order. That's why they had to shoot this thing out to everything even to competitor. I think they're trying to get it on stitcher. A. Well let's go. Re explained couldn't fulfill the order. Well They had the the Obamas have just like a leaks. They have a production deal whatever that means it's just like a big ASS retainer. You get that money you gotta do something and it seems like Michelle's the one that does the most she does the books she does the tours. The podcast I don't know of is doing anything at all. So. The time. So of course they paid her I don't know I have no idea but I'm sure it's in the middle. Part of overall three sixty. Deal. So you know to offset that of course, is the same they'll do with Joe is they put in a ads. And they launched with to proctor and gamble tied. Hello you know what market they're going for. That's for the black people who will listen and then dawn for the white people I mean they might as well say white and black soap. So they I don't know if both soaps are failing but they're not getting enough views for the amount of money that this launched sponsor spent and I understand it's really bad. So for them to release it in general release after the so called seuss now, there's something to be said for we'll lock it up for premium for a while but I smell smoke. You smell a flop. Flop big. Flop. A BIG FLOP KENNEDY'S I don't have any like, for example, try to keep up with everything going on this for the show I've had no Now I might but I've had the as the flop but I've had no inclination to even see what the hell she's got to talk about nine zero. It's a incredibly unimpressive mediocre product is just not interesting of course, I've tried to listen. Is Chase not eating at all at all? But beyond that that doesn't matter if your network and remember Iran one of these spotify so we'll see how you do. If you're a network, it's not oh well, you know Michelle, Obama's no good. You you network with your algorithms and you're targeting you should be able to. Deliver. The audience they are selling their audience they are buying people to talk to their audience. Their audience is just not they don't have the numbers yet if at all. For podcasting, they can't convert or whatever it's. John my idea would to from the get-go it's Probably. All triggered by the same S J W people working at the company out in. New York, which is where the all those deals are done for the OBAMAS and whoever and they didn't like I mean they they don't talk was going to be a great thing because we can promote Michelle and her future and she's GonNa be President Someday and so they pushed this through in a big big bomb in these are the same people trying to get Rogan off the trying to sink the company somebody hatchet men better get in there. We could put Tyrez. Firing people left and right. This is going to be such a topic for management of school in the future. is how to deal with this. Max Kaiser brought that up. I guess I guess to say what you said the coin base eeo said we'RE NOT GONNA we're trying to we're basically a bank we're trying to make money. We don't give a crap about your social issues issues F-. Off. And he thought that was good said, of course it's good. Just go away but people are afraid. So you know the Daniel the people that are afraid or going to eat it, but Daniel is not afraid. That's for sure that guy's not afraid if you're not afraid, you'll be fine. one other thing. One of the thing from the last show that I didn't get to bring over but someone sent this to me I just thought it was so great because we're all talking about. Roe. v Wade and notorious RPG or as comma would say, Gee. And this is from the Philadelphia in intelligence or and there's actually a scan of the article from the newspaper. And it's from is not even that old is from two, thousand, nine, two, thousand, nine. So this is only eleven years ago. And this it opens with this quote from Ruth Bader Ginsburg. Frankly, and this is about rover Roe. Versus Wade. Ruth Bader GINSBURG. Frankly I had thought that at the time Roh was decided there was concern about population growth and particularly growth in populations that we don't want to have too many of. She spoke spoke bluntly an interview published in The New York Times magazine, which was an article on women on the court. So it was not simply women's rights agenda it was about eugenics. She thought they were concerned about the population. And in particular growth in popular populations, we don't want to have too many of. Yeah. She's been going on. This is the seventies thinking, but this is two thousand and nine this race what she's an old woman she the seventies. But but that's crazy thinking this way they want an Africa, the number one target. It's we heard that little clip. Nobody's talking about a couple of shows ago where they said if by twenty fifty, half the world is going to be African. And then. You know something we've talked about on the show for years for at least a decade. Finally, we will ride of course, but now it's admitted and it's just like never mind we we took that here planned parenthood of Greater New York is removing the name of Margaret Sanger founder of the National Organization from its Manhattan clinic the abortion provider says eat made the decision because of Sanger's quote harmful connections to the eugenics movement pro-lifers are responding in a statement Susan B Anthony List as the next step for planned parenthood is recognizing that Margaret Sanger's racist legacy continues today as continues to disproportionately impact minority communities. especially. The black. Community. Join me now and Skype to talk more about this is Dr Angelov francs author of the Book Margaret Sanger's Eugenic Legacy and professor of theology at Saint John's seminary in. Boston Dr Franks welcome to the show. So glad to have you let's start right there with the legacy of Margaret Sanger for people not familiar with the term eugenics. What exactly is it the movement divided people into either the so-called fit or unfit based on their genetic health and capability and Sanger completely bought into that movement it really had its heyday between the nineteenth jeans and really up through World War Two, and she was an active part of that movement. For at least ten years, I'd say that the so know Margaret Sanger was eugenicist. Is Not like that off he's not true. That like everybody. Well a couple of things I did at whole thing sanger and realize that she's I. I'm GonNa take the other side of this. She'd never was a eugenicist until it became a popular thing much later she started her whole operation to try to legalize the use of prophylactics rubbers. She was onboard with the rubber with rubber guys she was the rubber person, and so she she made bench and it in fact, it was the black community more than anybody else who embraced her you can look up history is not that hard to find and the black community embraced her because she was in did not eugenics but population control via. Birth control she didn't think people should just be having babies when they don't want the baby. So that's right and she got the Reverend's on board to go spread the message she got everybody on board and they were doing find, and then all of a sudden went abortions came along she was never for abortions ever no I know. She all this was like, but it's all you know we got now but she. Do. Genesis came up during this era that then it became Hitler adopted it. The whole are Hitler's group adopt this whole thing was American invention I thought I thought it was when the operation paper clip when the guy came back here that's when we really got into it. No, no, we were way early. In the twenty s and it became with lots of books were written in this when everything was erased Irish were already scots were erased this was. To say that voice shame on shame on those people just throwing Margaret Sanger under the bus just because she's inconvenient right now. Seeing as much it. Yeah. So I win either way. You'll you win. Harbour, you WANNA take it because. Pretty much. It was pretty obvious when this started when this began in this began some years ago. That this was going to continue till she was thrown under the bus and it just never showed up in the conversation against we never could do any real meal long analysis of it, but I can tell you I read all this stuff. She was a good woman. Is just telling you this is a t shirt Margaret sanger she was a good woman John C. Divorce. I think I have a winner is just the way it goes. You know you just I mean it's the left eating itself what it always amounts to I gotta love it. I just have one more thing that I'd like to. Mention Yeah. in the OT G. category because unlike people go look this up on the show notes, it's under ot. And I'm not sure who publishes this. Did an analysis of APPs and how much they communicate with the some kind of tracking server on a daily basis. And they really colorful graph of it and I'll just give you the name of the APPs that track and you can see I mean per day per day. We're looking at. Like thousands thousands for zoom read it Netflix Door Dash, instagram youtube twitter Microsoft teams facebook Lincoln Tiktok Vin Mo- spotify instagram Amazon WHATSAPP and those are the main ones says Guy Beach in the trillions you're listening Well, they have twenty twenty every minute of the day. forty, one, million, six, hundred, sixty, six, thousand, six, hundred, sixty, seven, Paintings are sent. Back. From what's APP forty one, million, million minute. Yeah. It adds up? Yeah. Well. I think everyone gets, but it's just it's. It's crazy. It's crazy. They should just take a look at it. It's a data never sleeps at the title of it. It's it's well, we're taking a look at and I'm just kind of banking on you having a great inter show clipper something for us. I do have a reasonable one. actually I. Do have a great not as play this one though. Why be good when you can be lousy? So apparently L Franken came out from under his cave and he's the same old grabber us always been apparently. But he's got to say something about the supreme core you know he's got to get his you know he's back in his. Just liberal progressive mode making commentary. That's. Just. Not Right I mean. The I'll play the CLIP IS L Franken coming out of his whole office basement Democrats win control of the Senate that there should be more supreme court seats added. Do agree with that I think we should definitely very definitely look at that This will be they will have stolen two seats. Are you worried about the potential Pandora's box of if you do start adding seats that if the Republicans then take over, they could do the same and then we just have a bunch of extra Supreme Court justices, which makes that body even more political than it already is the problem is that If you trace this back. It goes really back to Mitch McConnell and. Two thousand nine. Saying. My goal is to make Barack Obama one term, president? And then filibustering, he filibustered more executive appointee. Have you noticed how old he looks to? Looks like crappy looks really he does not look well. Man. had been filibustered in the entire history of the United States before. Mitch McConnell is a cynical. person who only cares seems to care about power. and. At a certain point. You either a responding kind or just let them roll over you and I think. I think it's it's time that we respond. Rather projection much franken man. Now, let me ask a question just a general question. Let's say that you took over the place you got the you know the Democrats I don't know how this could possibly happen. But let's say took the House the Senate the presidency. So they can do whatever they want and so they added two or three more. Supreme. Court tactic the courts. Then, the ideas whether it'd Republicans takeover and then they pack the courts. One hundred people in the Supreme Court Beheira. Terrible But is there any way you could like? Drop it back. Can you like after? GINSBURG? Dyke and you say we're going to have only eight justices in this somebody else does you only have seven? Can you go the other way? Is anyone ever thought about that? No one ever talks about it I think you could. It's just Who Do you? Who Do you kill? Can you do it while they're still there? What you can kill him its lifetime appointments beside let's just assume they're not gonNA kill him then. Why are you even in government if you're not willing to kill somebody. Be Honest about it. If I could top that one. Okay. He's a win would just leave it for what it is then. I think you nailed it. All right everybody. We look forward to seeing you again on Thursday please remember us at divorce dot org slash and A. Mix finally that Chris Wilson as Migdal of show mix, we got it for you along with Tom Start weather and can't do a show without Jesse Koi Nelson reviewing the latest which will be. Probably some debate related stuff he's always good at that. Remember no agenda, meet UPS DOT COM and the Vegas. Oct. Thirteenth WanNa come Paulo Welcome. There are hotels opened deals a great basically free pay the resort the. And come you for opportunities owned thirty-three here in the capital of the Journal. Star State, Austin Texas in the morning everybody I'm Adam Curry Ken from northern Silicon Valley and Johnny boy. we return on Thursday right here in another episode of no agenda stay tune on the stream no agenda stream dot com for the fifty. Episode of Mo- facts without of curry. Until Thursday. And such. A. In the morning. This is Chris Drunkard Minstrel here in the studio at Cali. The. CAPE. Is Corner, Shop Cocktail Lounge, and character by I'm reading my first ever know agendas children's book. For MacDill and this is a book that I regularly read twitter. Human Resource Felix. And now I'm going to read it for the world. Gitmo nation publications present is for. A knowledge into book of ABC's read by Chris Wilson. Is for which you don't want to swell from all the bad news it will make you feel. Awkward and makes Adam Proud is for aircraft with pits onto loud. Is the dimension. He doesn't want to be full of bigotry and bias and run by bullies bees for being it blockchain and the bottom in the bud that breaks bitcoin will make it with nothing. See as for Clinton for me in collusion with the CIA run CBS to causes confusion and CNN ABC and CNBC. Pushed climate change and sell crap you and to me. Is for the. Jukes Nation Sadan douchebag and make a donation is for exciting stories by John About trains and emotional support animals that travel on planes if his face bag fake news and feminists who flailing fists in the faces of Fascists if it's false flags and full foucault warrants in the wider obtained was pleased apartment Jesus forget my where we live ever often. Give to ask. To get some good com hiatus ham radio for boys and for girls with the apocalypse comes, they'll be saving the world touches for height and for Hillary Hysteria, and if you're not with her, you're literally Hitler buys for Vancouver just out of reach, it's president trump they want to impeach is the Isis funded by C. A. But since trump got in the runaway giants Fa John Always Ready with the joke and jazz jingle at implies for us, Folk Case for nights and cares for Karma that keeps hit. Strikes and away from the drama. Dallas for. Langley. Love lots of long wars as Lockheed. Martin with sales for sure L. is for naught lion white playing with little each month not that you can names for maxine impeach forty five as the five Amtrak keep me alive and Phil millennials heads with bias and height as they tried to stop. Trump's make America. Great. Again is for Nazi network fake news of the non-sequitur that they use to confuse lucky we have out now agenda showed novel interferes plans to get. I was oil the flows in. Pipelines. For a Bama we thank hold. These petroleum and plotting with Putin, and if you follow the pipelines, we'll see shooting is for podcast produced view and means tap through pay pal to prevent poverty curious for Queer and questioning Queens. But with so many GIS it's not as it seems virus for Russia and the radical lift which were one in the same before Gorbachev left. And self driving cars and stories of sending humans demise as this streaming searching show nuts the silly al Sharpton and Keith Service Cuts. For trump and vice tormenting trolls can never give up though they means to grow all. US for university and Universal Healthcare. That's really a scam and clearly not fair visas for value for value. That's true and thank you to Adam Fortuna View W for whipped soul and privilege the twice wonderful books that John's garage. X Z Emphysema and emphasize for people who insist we address them that why wise for? Yes we can or is it thank you saizen and yelling at stuff when fix get my nation ZIG is. That guys Bhai John's window. He tells US each time of the start of Ash. But Sadly Alphabet Ends with Z. Twenty six ladies and not thirty three. It's the in Nevada book and your Nikolas well nourished. So I say in the morning and thank you for your courage. I the decided. Or other interruptions. So we importantly. What the candidates opposite somehow car with needs people to where? We. Got A lot of times. Suburbs or buying large integrated. There's many people today driving their kids to soccer practice and. Black and white, and Hispanic in the same car as their happen anytime in the past. What. POINT DO WE TURN ON K. Street? You just lost the left it's getting dark. You. Had To do is turn the lights shake-up. As. Brash humor. Nancy Pelosi and shoe they haven't. got. To provide these businesses the ability to have the money to April. Gentleman. Heights boy. Obliged to be different than the two of you. So here's the data point can. Ate Your Joe. Bourbon mostly took a wrong turn. Raised in the suburbs. Have a mess grade. Masks. For when I think I need is To. Do is. Just. Out Christian who is on your list This. Johnson I. Think this is certainly. Not Going to give me abandon this segment we're going to move on to the second second hey, can't get some gas money first of all home. Thank you for doing this. But he made a statement about the military said I, something about the military he and his friends made it up and then they went with it I never said. Okay Sucking he by Leterrier by. Best, sites I. E said. Values. Sti- would never. Play go ahead. Clapper that stupid. Kuban. Black. Bird. I. I. I. Credibly, good, judgment. One I'm married. And two appointed Johnson's of the academy is wanted to know that. Clap for that. Play. MOEPO IRAQ DOT org slash. A. Dumb.

Donald Trump president trump Times Obama twitter White House John China Hillary New York KKK David David Duke California America official Jim Carey Joe Biden wrestling US WanNa
S4 Ep. 5: The Road to Hell

Slow Burn

49:52 min | 1 year ago

S4 Ep. 5: The Road to Hell

"Before. We get back to the show. There's another podcast I WANNA! Tell you about. It the investigative podcast in the dark in its second season examines the case of Curtis Flowers, a Black Man Mississippi tried six times for the same crime by a white prosecutor determined to execute him. In. The dark team of reporters spent more than a year looking into flowers as case and they uncovered shocking new evidence. Witnesses recanted to the team. Reporters discovered an alternate suspect in the case. And they exposed junk science being used in the courtroom. After the podcast aired. The US Supreme Court overturned Curtis. Flowers is conviction. And after almost twenty four years, flowers was released on bond. You can listen to in the dark wherever you listen to podcasts. Is it true that he's kind of a private and quiet like introverted person when he's by himself. Me Or him. Asking him if you want to weigh into that's. He definitely is. That's Trina Edwards. We were talking about her husband Edwin Edwards the former governor of Louisiana. Trina is almost forty. Two and Edwin will be ninety three in August. She was passing along my questions because he has a hard time hearing over the phone. Is it that you're a quiet kind of introverted person when you're not in public when you're home by yourself. I'm a very different person when I'm not on the stage. The Way I am. I'm very quiet and and private and I don't drink at all. I. Don't use drugs at all and so. Now. Knows Fun having life is taking care of my. Seven year old child. And my wife. Okay. Trina is Edwin. Third Wife. They've been married since two thousand eleven. The two of them met when she started writing him letters in federal prison. Edwards served eight years on corruption charges. He was convicted of rigging casino licences during his final term governor. When he got out, he intrigued brought their relationship to reality TV. In this story is. I is why. Show went off the air after eight episodes. Since then Edwards is run for Congress and lost, and he's had a couple of healthcare's, but he still has a remarkable command of Louisiana political history, much of which he shaped during his four terms as governor. To understand David Duke you need to understand what makes Louisiana politics distinctive, the unique alliances, the entrenched corruption, and the charismatic figures who've molded the state in their own images. And Edwin Edwards is Louisiana politics. personified. Edwards is first. Gubernatorial campaign began in Nineteen seventy-one, first of all spoke French, and in in Nineteen, seventy one. There were still people old people. In Louisiana, who? Understood English but prefer to hear and figuring French. So made some franchising. It helped me with that particular group of people. I mean he had a coalition a distinctly Louisiana Coalition. He had Cajun's blacks. That's Marc morial. He worked with Edwards. Is the state legislator and as the mayor of New Orleans in Louisiana? If you can put those two voting basis together in those days, it was unbeatable coalition. Unlike most of his white democratic peers Edwards was an unabashed civil rights champion. He invited Black Louisianans to work in government positions and helped craft state constitution that outlawed discrimination. He also made Louisiana Richer. As Governor Edwards helped change how crude oil got taxed moving from a flat fee per barrel to a percentage of the barrel price. When oil prices shot up, state revenues soared, so did Edwin Edwards his popularity. Stories about Edwards. Gambling and womanising didn't hurt him with voters. The MIASMA of corruption and scandal that hung over his administration didn't damage them either. There were six grand jury investigations during Edwards is first term, but he wasn't indicted in any of those cases. It seemed like the silver-haired silver. Silverton governor could talk his way out of anything. When asked about some iffy political donations, Edwards said it was illegal for them to give, but not for me to receive. Edwards led Louisiana for eight years leaving office. March nineteen eighty. The only thing stopping him from being governor for life for term limits that Edwards himself had pushed for. So he went on a brief hiatus, sitting out the next election cycle, then returning in nineteen, eighty-three to reclaim his throne. In the last days of that campaign Edwards fired off his most famous one liner. The only way I could lose. This election is for got caught in bed with A. Dead Girl, all live boy and. That took on a life its own and has been quoted many times. By other people as I got enough or Thank you. Does he regret saying that, or is he happy that it? A guaranteed regret anything he's ever done hold on. Do you regret saying that, or are you happy? No. It's one of the things that I said that. People identified with being thought it was kind of funny. Edwards was right to believe that nineteen eighty-three election was a lock. He'd win it with sixty two percent of the vote. To celebrate his victory, he did something audacious, even by Edwin Edwards standards. If there's one thing Louisiana governor elect Edwin Edwards knows it's Outta. Have a good time. Even with a four million dollar campaign sits staring him down Edwards chartered jumbo jets announced he was going to Paris and invited anyone willing to contribute ten thousand dollars to come on law. More than six hundred people joined Edwards on that trip to France which was touted as the largest single political fundraiser ever thrown by an American politician. The writer Roy Blunt Junior on assignment for people magazine went along for the ride. You know the whole deal did not. Smell of righteousness. That's for sure. But. Some people said is hard to be. Proper and having a real good time. The french-speaking Edwards and his crew of Louisianans, eight high class at the palace verse I. The governor also received a warm greeting from a non outside Notre Dame cathedral and she gave him what she described as a French kiss, which was actually of course more lacking nuns guest, but She can take a joke, and so he said okay sister, but just don't let me get into the habit. And all of his supporters gathered round, cheered and beamed, and that's kind of thing the had come to Paris for. The party ended Fred when Edwards, as soon as those jumbo jets landed back in Louisiana, the campaign of eighty three was great. It was one of the finest experiences of my life service in the governor's office from eighty four to eighty seven. It was not it was. It was a very difficult experience. That said Moreland he was Edwin. Edwards is assistant. By the mid nineteen eighty S, oil and gas revenues had plummeted in the state was facing a huge deficit. Edwards tried to fill that hole with tax increases. His constituents didn't find that rakish charming. You know when you're trying to raise taxes on people who are really struggling already. It's a very precarious political situation to be in so this tax package was probably the beginning of his unpopularity. In February nineteen. Eighty five Edwin Edwards is run of bad lot got a whole lot worse, the Fifty Count Federal Indictment Charges Governor Edwards and six others, including his brethren, a nephew with racketeering and fraud in a multimillion dollar scheme, involving the sale of state approval for medical facility construction projects. Edwards was accused basically of accepting bribes to steer state money to his friends. The trial dragged on somehow for fourteen weeks. Moreland spent most of it on a payphone outside the New Orleans courtroom. I was constantly calling the governor's office in Baton Rouge in getting the phone messages in returning those phone calls in explaining to people under the circumstances you know the governor can't talk to you right this minute and We tried to be as diplomatic about it as we could. And of course, most people knew where he was in. He was going through, but they call anyway. The case ended in a mistrial. Edwards was later retried and found not guilty. When that verdict came in, the prosecutor said if we didn't make him honest. I hope we made him sorry. When I asked Edwards about the case, he didn't sound all that sorry. That was an example of. Of A stupid process prosecutor, who didn't know anything about was happening. Today by their him when people said he was profiting from his role as the governor. Did it bother you when people said you were profiting from your role as governor? No. because. There's no truth to it, so it didn't bother me at all i. just laughed about it. Edwards may have been laughing, but he was still in a precarious spot. In good times, most people in Louisiana loved his misadventures. But, these were in good times. The boom years of the nineteen seventies were long gone. In one, thousand, nine, hundred, seven Louisiana was ready for a change. I noticed my opponents. Don't make many people angry. That doesn't surprise you. Does it politics as usual? I don't like Louisiana Politics I love Louisiana. I love Louisiana enough to make some people angry. Buddy Romer was a congressman from North Louisiana. In the last four weeks of the nineteen eighty-seven governor's race, he's zoomed from fifth to first in the polls. By Folksy TV ads a string of newspaper endorsements. Romer lead Edwards by five percentage points after the first round of voting setting the stage for a runoff. But when Edwards emerged after one a m to greet his supporters, he made a move that nobody had anticipated. And I have determined that under the circumstances since I did not run I. That it would be inappropriate for me to continue this election. Supporters were stunned. Some of his family cried. He's sixty. He's been governor twelve years. He said that's long enough. Most voters thought so too. There would be no runoff. Romer would be the next governor of Louisiana. and Edwin Edwards it looked outside observers like his career was finished. But. That's not how Edward sought. Dropping out of the race, that was the first step in his comeback plan. I spoke with him that night and he. He was absolutely resolute. Good Look, you know I'm GonNa let him have it. I'M GONNA. Turn it over to him. He's been going all over the state saying he's GonNa. Fix this. He's going to fix that and he's GonNa Disintegrate. You Mark My word. Edwards had it all mapped out. He would let Romer run the state for a few difficult years then reemerge to save the day. It wouldn't be that simple. The nineteen, ninety one election would be about a lot more than who got to sleep and the governor's mansion. It'd be a fight over one Louisiana was and what it should be. An, Edwin Edwards and Buddy Romer wouldn't be the only ones in that battle. In Nineteen ninety-one David Duke was at the height of his powers. He'd honed his message. Don't a rabid fan base and come shockingly close to getting elected to the US Senate. The governor's race would be the culmination of his life's work. This was Duke's chance to turn his words into actions to take control of an entire state. And make it into whatever he wanted. This is slow burn. I'm Josh Levin? Episode five the road to Hell. What's the number one sign of a bad home security system? Oh. It's so complicated that you never use it. That's exactly what simplisafe has been a decade fighting against. They believed that simple safer, and that's why simplisafe is the home security system for right now. SIMPLISAFE was designed to be easy to use while protecting your whole home twenty four seven. Order online with the click of a button open. The box placed the sensors. Plug it in in. Your home is protected around the clock. You don't need to have technician or a sales person. Come visit you at home. And you don't pay any outrageous monthly fees or sign a two year contract. Simply safe was named best overall home security of twenty twenty by us, news and world, report, and there twenty four seven professional monitoring and emergency dispatch starts at just fifty cents a day. Had this simplisafe dot com slash slow-burn and get free shipping and a sixty day money back guarantee that simplisafe dot com slash slow-burn to make sure they know that our show saint you. When Edwin Edwards was three years old. The governor of Louisiana a man kidnapped. It was nineteen thirty and the governor was Huey, long? The Guy who got snatched was about to expose rampant graft and state government. Four days after he disappeared, the victim reemerged to say not at all credibly that he'd staged the kidnapping himself. In a radio broadcast, the man announced that Governor Huey long with his best friend in the world. Long was shot and killed at the state capital five years later. A lot of people in Louisiana will tell you that he was the best friend the state ever had. Yes. Long was a corrupt dictator ensure he orchestrated the kidnapping, but he also built bridges and hospitals and paid for it all with money. He pride free from the big oil companies. Edwin Edwards carried on Huey long tradition of economic populism. Like Long Edwards US money, not from big oil to build bridges and hospitals all that and he finished construction of the Louisiana, Suto. David Duke on the other hand said he wouldn't follow long's example. Ray Nate another populist, not apart gross like. For more government, but a populous for the state, of Louisiana, burlesque government and more power to the people thinking. In reality dukes brand of populism had nothing to do with shrinking government. It was built on racial resentment. dukes message journalist John McGuinness wrote held a lot of appeal for the children and grandchildren, a few long's old voters, I, doubt the duke cared one way or the other about long's policies, but he did respect the man's power in fame in reference to to make a point about his own celebrity. The ladies that do the tours, the state capital not far from here. They always tell me they say you know. There's two things people want to see when they come the state Capitol and Baton Rouge. They WanNa see what you re long shot and we're David. Duke says. Buddy Romer offered voters a third option. A complete break from the sleaze and self-dealing did marred Louisiana politics from the long era to the present day. The Harvard Educated Romer said that long's legacy was something for nothing. Somebody else pays. Romer promised a new era of responsibility one that would earn his home state national respect. He called this the Romer Revolution. Most people in America will never come. To Louisiana. Most people in America will no US only by a reputation. I'll put Louisiana I and will make them stop laughing. And Start List. Roamers big initiative was a plan to modernize the state's approach to taxation. One day early with votes to spare tax reform finally made it through the Louisiana lead after we're talking a new way. Of approaching our old problems that are eating US alive. Romer was adamant that his fiscal reform plan was not a tax increase. He said it would just shift more of the burden to people higher incomes. In the spring of one, thousand, nine, hundred nine, he made that pitch to Louisiana's voters who needed to approve the proposal in a statewide referendum. David Duke then a newly elected state legislator was one of the governors, most outspoken critics, overall a six hundred and twenty five million dollar tax increase, and this from a governor who swore to would not raise taxes. I'm going to ignore David Duke. I mean I. don't Care What the American Nazi Party thinks about this program. A lot of people in Louisiana did care what David Duke had to say. Duke staged a series of rallies across the state railing against Romer and presenting himself as the champion of the working class at one event, a Louisiana anti-tax tea party. He climbed aboard a riverboat and tossed him. t into the Mississippi River. You don't raise taxes in a recession. Duke said You don't tax your way into prosperity. The Blues on the streets of new. Orleans are now being son in the governor's mansion. After voters resoundingly rejected new taxes, digging Louisiana's already troubled economy ever deeper in debt and forcing reform minded governor Buddy Roemer to scramble his way out of a new financial crisis. As of May Nineteen, eighty-nine, the Roma Revolution was pretty much dead. Later that year. Rumours wife Patti left him. When the political consultant Raymond Strother visited rumour and early nineteen ninety-one. The governor was still in a deep funk. He said I'm glad to see. Need your help. He said. I need to write a letter to Patty. I know of made some mistakes, but he said I want her to come home, and he said helped me write this letter. You're a good writer. struthers said that he wasn't the man for that job. His own wife had just left him a few weeks earlier. But strother who helped drummer win in nineteen, Eighty, seven was available to work on the governor's reelection campaign. He said move move into the mansion and I did and it was nice. You know you have a dry cleaners, downstairs and He. Put your shoes outside the door every night and they come. They start the next day. She Shannon. And every night when I'd go to my room. It'd be. Pitcher of milk and ice. And some still warm cookies. How good were the cookies? Cookies were splendid. They were every afternoon. I sometimes again just before breakfast so I always had fresh cooksey probably gained ten pounds already fat so. Apart from cookies stronger has no fond memories of working on rumors reelection the first big conflict came when a new agey rumour advisor named Danny Walker suggested that the governor where rubber band around his wrist. And he said well Larry Time. We have a bad fuel pop. That rubber abandoned house pain pretty soon. You won't be having bad thoughts, I, said you. Keep your damn. Rubber Bands Yourself Danny. Rumour actually liked the rubber band idea. The governor also embraced Robert. Full James Book all I really need to know I. Learned in kindergarten, which touted the virtues of sharing everything and playing fair. But he was ended that Guru sorta stuff touchy feely. I can't stand that kind of thing. After reading that self help guide. The governor decided he'd been too abrasive. In his State of the state, address Romer apologize to the legislature for his inflexibility and insensitivity. Let's say goodbye to me. And Halo We. Let's say goodbye lines in the sand. For Strother, the self-help stuff was bad, but what happened next was worse. One day at the mansion. He happened upon meeting that he wasn't supposed to know about. Aso Mary Matlin a whole bunch of. High Echelon Republic considering round a table with by the dining room table with buddy. And I said Oh my God. Number had always been conservative. As a congressman, he tended to vote with Republican President Ronald. Reagan and against his own Democratic Party. But. struthers says Romer had always assured him he would move to the GOP. He broke that promise and March nineteen ninety-one. Romer explained himself at a press conference outside the White House. President George H W Bush. Just welcome him into the Republican fold. Parties not the most important thing in American. Families are integrity ideals, commitment principles, those are more important and on those issues I never chain, but when it comes to political action. I will be a Republican and proudly work in the party. Romer was the first sitting governor in modern American history to switch parties. Ideology Aside Romer thought the move with smart strategy. Edwin Edwards was going to grab votes from his left. No matter what. Romer figured that branding himself. A Republican would help stave off right wing challenger. Who might threaten his re-election? The statewide polls showed that the top three candidates or Duke. Edwards and myself and in the last poll I was in the forties. Thirties and do ten eleven or twelve with some undecided. I felt good about the politics. Raymond strother did not feel good about the politics. It was a dumb move for him and me. It was just a dumb move. Democrats in Louisiana felt burned by Romer. And Republicans including state. Party, officials were ensure they trust him either. Billy none Gasser the Republican chair. Who'd undercut the effort to censure David Duke resented that Romer hadn't included him in discussions about the party switch. And Romer forgetting the lessons of ever needed to know I learned in kindergarten cursed out on Gasser, rather than trying to appease him. The Louisiana Republicans made their endorsement in the governor's race at a state convention in June nineteen ninety-one. That endorsement wouldn't go to Buddy Roemer or David Duke. The GOP's choice was a pro-life Congressman named Client Holloway the preferred candidate of the Christian coalition. Romer knowing that he wouldn't endorsed, didn't bother to show up at the convention. But Duke and his supporters made presence known. Here saw the Anti Duke activist. Bats Ricky described the scene in nineteen ninety one. It was like a do convention. They were just. Booing indiscriminately anything in every body, and they were just wild and they were. Then Duke was egging them on. You know to disrupt things. They had to sing Dixie to quiet them down. Quite literally they tried God, bless America and the battle hymn of the republic, but it wasn't until. Saying I wish I were in the land of cotton it a hush fell over the convention. But he romer had tried to consolidate the conservative vote. That plan had been a total failure. The splintering of the Louisiana. Republican Party would be a gift to Edwin Edwards. And to David Duke Let's take a quick break. Now is the time to catch up on the PODCASTS. You've always wanted to listen to you. And so many of them are available on Luminary. Luminaries subscription podcast network with original shows. You won't find anywhere else. One of their new shows is murder on the towpath. Captivating true crime mini series hosted by a word winning journalist Soledad O'Brien. Murderer on the towpath explores the nineteen sixty four murder of Mary Pinchot Meyer in the neighborhood of town in Washington DC her death resulted in a trial that rocked the country and became a time capsule of all the racial tension scandal in distrust of the nineteen sixties. It remains one of the most fascinating unsolved cases in US history. Listen to murder on the towpath only on luminary good a luminary dot link slash towpath and get a seven day free trial of luminaries original podcasts. That's luminary dot link slash towpath. Cancel anytime terms apply. No other state does elections like Louisiana the credit for that or the blame belongs to Edwin Edwards. The first time he ran for Governor Edwards had to compete in three separate races a closed. Democratic primary a democratic runoff, and then the general election. In the days when Democrats dominated Louisiana that last race against the Republican also ran was pointless nuisance. It was like winning the hundred meter dash at the Olympics, then having to outsprinted kid pulled from the stands to get your gold medal. And I I. Didn't like that idea. I said well look less change it everybody. Qualifies at the same time regardless of party, affiliation and everybody votes for anybody he or she wishes regards the registration. Louisiana's open primary system went into effect in nineteen seventy-five. Edwards cruised to re election that year as the Republican Party didn't even field a candidate. But in the Reagan years, the GOP surged throughout the south. By nineteen ninety-one, the open primary was open in a way. Edwards may be had anticipated. It was a true two party free for all. Political writer John McGuinness had a name for the showdown between David Deep at Edwards and Buddy Romer. Call this, the the race from Hell you have three very angry. Men candidates for governor and the people aren't happy either. In the beginning, the race from hell wasn't exactly rollicking. One reason for that was a package of campaign finance reforms part of buddy roamers, good government agenda. The new law limited individual contributions to five thousand dollars and major state, wide races, band cash contributions of more than one hundred dollars and required that small cash donations be reported. Do could pass the bucket with impunity during his nineteen ninety Senate campaign because that was a federal race, but thanks to Romer the revolutionary. Louisiana's guidelines on cash. Giving were now stricter than the nation's. Hamstrung by these new rules Duke held fewer rallies as a candidate for governor then when he ran for the Senate. And Edwards is fundraising slowed to a trickle. He raised sixteen million dollars during the nineteen eighty-three governor's race in the one, thousand, nine, hundred, one primary, he brought in a little more than one million dollars and Buddy Romer. He preferred staying in going out to meet his public. Rumour had always been like this Raymond Straw there saw it up close during the nineteen eighty-seven race, he was sitting back to campaign headquarters and re novels, usually mystery novels, and he wouldn't go out and campaign. We'd go to a restaurant to eat lunch and he would sit in the back of the restaurant in a corner with his back to the room. So nobody would seem and recognize him and come over and start talking. Rumors. Charismatic misanthrope routine. And Nineteen eighty-seven and it seemed possible he could pull off the same trick in Nineteen ninety-one. Michelle shower started volunteering for the rumour campaign when she was still in College Louisiana Tech then got a job on staff right after graduation. She says the when the governor did make public appearances early on, he seemed totally energized, and he literally walked into the room. Pushing both doors open, good afternoon, everybody great to see you know. He was clapping and smiling and really exuberant, and it was really very exciting to be in a room with them. He was just really engaging the crowd and I would say for the first part of the campaign. That's the way he was. He really came into room and made it alive. The problem for Romer was a lot of swing. Voters felt drawn to another candidate. At first Straw like the focus group results. He was hearing blue collar. Democrats said they couldn't stand hypothetical candidate with all of David dukes characteristics, but then as soon as they learned, it was David Duke. They'd say well. That's what politicians do our. Cake well. He was a young man in Nazi while he was a young guy. College kids do stupid stuff. You know whatever it was. They make an excuse for him. While? Rohmer struggled to hold his coalition Together. Duke was finding a new way to expand his appeal. It's been tough for me some Tom last couple of years a lot of media tax, but was made made it better for me. That I'm a Christian I work hard. I believe in Christ and I'M GONNA keep on fighting for you and for the future Louisiana thank you very much. Do convoked is Christianity far more in the governor's race than in any of his previous campaigns. He used religion as a shield and sword. At a debate in September Duke, said that he'd repented for his past sins in those who tried to discredit him were being. UNCHRISTIAN I've certainly been intolerant before my life. But we condemn, and point their fingers at me I'd like them to look in their own lives and ask if they'd never heard a friend or change their opinions. It wasn't clear based on polling. How White People in Louisiana were responding to Dukes latest attempt at image management? Susan Howell had been struggling for years to get a handle on duke voters. Hell was a professor of political science at the University of New Orleans. She taken her first. Look at Duke during his run for the State House when his opponent John Trine. A phone, survey. How old's poll in the primary had duke at seven percent? She was off by twenty six points. And I was stunned. And, then John Trine stood up on a table and he was done to and I remember him saying the people of memory are not racist and I thought well. Maybe we should rethink that. trine fired Howell after the primary, so she'd have to wait poll. Another do grace. But, she had a pretty good idea of what was going on with his supporters. People were reluctant to say I'm going to vote for Duke because they were afraid of being labeled racists. Even talking to you know On an anonymous phone call to upholster. It's like people are reluctant to say how much alcohol they drink or were. They ever arrested? This became a research challenge for howl and her graduate students. How could they get David? Duke Silent Army to break it silence. We came up with some alternate. I would call sneakier indirect questions. To identify someone who might be sympathetic to Duke. One of them, which actually worked pretty well in increasing the duke support. In. The poll was to ask people if they approve or disapprove, but the Martin Luther King Holiday. How conducted a survey one month before the gubernatorial primary. Respondents were asked to they were voting for and also how they felt about statements like. If blacks would only try harder, they could be just as well off as whites. The raw number showed that thirty five percent of people were voting for Buddy Romer thirty percent for Edwin Edwards and twelve percent for David Duke. But when how old accounted for sneakier, indirect questions support for Romer and Edwards dept and Duke. Support doubled. Given the margin of error, the election was too close to call. That's how things look from the outside. On the inside, there was gossip about a possible secret alliance and the governor's race. Roamers political consultant Raymond's brother heard that speculation. The rumor that we heard was it at Edwards was encouraging and perhaps funding David Duke. Edwards wanted revenge on Buddy Romer after losing to him in nineteen, eighty seven. But Edwards also knew how to play the odds. He was smart. Enough theory went to sense that he'd have a better shot against an ex clansmen then against the incumbent governor. nobody had any proof whatsoever, but I saw brandon anybody on either side. Who didn't think Edwards was playing funny with David Duke. When I got Edwards on the phone. I asked if there was any truth all that chatter. Did hear his supporters do anything to help duke make the runoff like giving him money or or propping him up in some way. You. Help you get into the runoff with you know? I I didn't I I didn't do that because I didn't think it was necessary and I would've. Got Caught at and so I didn't do that. I just let it run as rape Iran mine. Role Moran is. and. That's as far as I got chasing down that rumor. But I did learn something else. The Edwards campaign it turns out had a totally different secret alliance. Clyde Holloway was the pro-life Congressman who've gotten the official endorsement of the Louisiana Republican Party instead of Duke or Romer. He was way back in the polls in a distant, fourth and needed cash. Dare commercials. One of Edwin Edwards closest friends Bob to him mcchord new one of Holloway's campaign advisers. To him, accord says the two of them hatched a plan he would. Show me. Results of a tracking poll which I'll, people confirmed that. Every vote declined Holloway. Lose receiving the getting. WHO's coming directly off of. The sitting Governor Buddy. and. We have people who notched out a lot of money to support it everyone. Everyone's Asir what else they could do it, so we get discussions on. TV radio. I said that would help. US awesomely. Getting in the second private would be able to do. Rather than a sitting governor. To him, accord is describing an electoral double bank shod. Edwards supporters and money to Holloway. Holloway takes votes from Romer. Romer slides out of the runoff and Duke Slides and. We felt that we could be. David do cross substantially. And Motorola would have been a different results bill. Don't WanNa not. Fully at the time, it would have been tight. Governor. Edwards know about this strategy. Yes I informed in this was going on. Here is answerable is be careful. When I asked Edwards about the alliance. He told me he didn't know anything about it. In John McGuinness his book about the nineteen ninety-one Campaign Clyde Holloway's campaign adviser. Bryan Wagner, also denied making any such deal. Wagner died in two thousand eighteen. That said I believe to him accord story to be clear. None of this would have been illegal. Assuming the campaign contributions guy reported. that it was kind of devious away to help David Duke without giving him direct support. I don't WanNa. Make this alliance seem more important than it was those Holloway. Ads were just a small drop in an enormous bucket of campaign spending. In the final days of the race, the owner of a hazardous waste recycling company spent a massive amount of money on anti-roma commercials because he was angry about the governor's environmental regulations. That ad by was a huge deal. The Holloway ads really weren't. But it still telling that the Edwards campaign was willing to take active measures to help. Do get into the runoff. I. Think it is. Very typical of Edwards. That's Quinn Hillier. He was one of Louisiana's most prominent Anti Duke Republicans. He also thinks that words is totally corrupt. Here's what he had to say about the Edwards Holloway Alliance. I'm not saying it's immoral. It's just amoral completely without regard. To the morality of trying to help David Duke get into the runoff, and whether or not that would be good or bad for the state of Louisiana, it certainly was. Playing every political angle and it was at words and his people at their Edwin Edwards Gist. This was in some ways typical Louisiana Chicanery. Politics is sport with a win at all cost mentality. The Duke wasn't a typical candidate. Maybe, the Edwards camp was rate that they're odds were better against Duke Than Romer. But what if they were wrong What if David Duke One? We'll be back in a minute. I wanted to tell you about another podcast. I think you'll love. Deep cover the drug wars is a true story. The begins with the Detroit. FBI agent, going undercover in an outlaw motorcycle gang and ends with the US invasion of a foreign country. Pulitzer Prize winning journalist Jake Halpern guides listeners on this wild journey of marijuana, motorcycles and mayhem. It's perfect for fans of narcos, sons of anarchy or anything by the CON- brothers. You can hear it now on apple podcasts, or wherever you listen brought to you by Pushkin Industries. Come on in. In. January nineteen eighty-nine David Duke had been a bit player. A second tier candidate in a small suburban race. Now almost three years later, he was a star and a contender. His Election Night Party was a celebration of how far he'd come, and how close he was to winning the state's biggest prize. Oh, you got Duke Dukes is over my shirt. Big Deal. I'd have to. Face if I didn't have to see. On October, nineteenth. Nineteen ninety-one Dukes fans gathered at the pontchartrain center in his home territory of Jefferson parish. They were treated to a short performance by that blonde woman. The Blue Dress who sang at lots of Duke rallies. After Dixie came. We asked. Our leaders and that they might govern with compassion and love and understanding. We ask a special blessing upon this assembly, and that which is done here will be ultimately to the glory of the Kingdom of God. And then David Duke himself took the stage. With every minute gentleman. It appears. That we will be. In a run off the governorship. Back in Nineteen, eighty-nine Dukes First Victory Party. He'd shouted about winning a state. House seat without any big political endorsements. Idea and the political establishment and wind that he was always getting light about. A nineteen ninety-one, he didn't sound bitter or vengeful. This David Duke was smooth, humble conciliatory. He'd figured out how he was supposed to sound and how to make an appeal that wasn't entirely based on grievance. My thanks goes I. To the forest in my life. That's given me strength and help me. Withstand a lot and continue to stand up for you. And That's Jesus Christ Ladies Gentlemen. David Duke was in the runoff with thirty two percent of the vote. Duke finished with two points behind the leader Edwin Edwards. Buddy roamers political consultant. Raymond strother new. His man was going to come in third. He went to bed at the governor's mansion before the race got called. And the next morning I got up. I went down to get my cookies and milk and buddy was down there, and he said well. You didn't have a good candidate you, I said. Must not have buddy. He's well. We took our best shot and he walked out Nisa last time. I've ever spoken to him. Buddy Romer finished five points behind David Duke. Ultimately, he wasn't taken down by an electoral conspiracy. He'd lost because Louisiana didn't want a reformer. And tonight, the people spoke. and. They said buddy thanks, but she didn't do. Enough I think that's fair. When Michelle shower started working on the campaign, she'd been inspired by buddy rumors energy. But now that it was over shower thought Romer seem relieved. She found her own feelings harder to pin down. She was thinking about leaving the state, maybe going to live with their parents and Montana. But, then she got approached by some people she knew from the Louisiana Republican Party. They said we have an offer for you before you rejected outright just listen to us and they said. You could go to work on David Dukes campaign, and of course my eyes widen like. Are you crazy? Shower had never considered supporting. David Duke much less working for him. Her family had been on government aid when she was growing up, so his rants against welfare weren't persuasive. But shower really didn't want Edwin Edwards back in charge of Louisiana. Plus those people from the State party told her that she didn't need to take public facing role that she could stay in the shadows. Shower agreed to me with Dukes campaign manager how we feral. When they got together, he said that the time had come to brought in the duke operation by bringing in people from the establishment. Shower wanted to be campaign manager someday and she liked the idea of learning from one. She was also unemployed. So from my perspective I had a job in an opportunity to look at an alternate campaign, and that's how I started. During her stint as a Duke Staffer Michele shower would hear things that shock turn. She also make a lot of phone calls on behalf of David Duke, using a list brought with her from the Romer. Campaign. That list was the main reason. The do campaign had hired shower. Romer supporters! We're now up for grabs. If voted Republican in the November runoff, then David Duke was going to be the governor of Louisiana. The State Republican Party was still not going to support Duke publicly. But he was the last Republican standing. And when shower talked to her friends in the party, they said they knew how to keep Duke under control when I would have those discussions. They would say. There's not much he can do. He's going to have so many eyes on him. If he wins. There's so many is. We're going to have people around him. He won't be able to push board any of these. Agendas from his past, he'll have to stick to the policies. And at that time I, believe them, and at that time I thought while I wasn't really willing to say. I was four him. I was more for sweeping in. A Republican governor urged tried to fix things in Louisiana. That's really where I was coming from at that time. Next time on the final episode of our season. Four weeks to decide the fate of Louisiana. What would David Duke due to win? and. Who would fight to stop him? slow-burn is production of plus slates membership program, slate plus members get weekly bonus episodes. We'll dive deeper into the history were exploring this season. This week you'll hear an exclusive interview with writer in. New Orleans. Native Clint, Smith and Van newkirk of the Atlantic the host of the podcast flood lines about Hurricane Katrina. We spoke about what Louisiana was like. When Katrina hit in two thousand five and the parallels between what happened then, and when David Duke was on the rise in the eighties and nineties. We couldn't make slow-burn without the support of. Les, plus so please consider signing up if you like the series able to contribute. Only thirty five dollars for the first year and you get a free two week trial. Good slate dot com slash slow-burn to find out more. slow-burn is produced by me and Christopher Johnson. Editorial Direction Buy Low and LOO AND GABRIEL ROD! Madeline. Ducharme is our production assistant. Summer Grad Slow Burns assistant producer. Are Mix engineer is Paul Mounsey. Gave it gross composed our theme song. The artwork for slow-burn is by Lisa Larsson Walker. John McGuinness book on the Nineteen ninety-one campaign is called Cross to bear. Special thanks to Jordan Hirsch Jessica Seidman and slates chow to Katie Raeford. Laura. Bennett Alison. Benedict and Jared Holt. Thanks for listening.

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How Derek Black went from being the golden boy of white nationalism to its outspoken critic

Cape Up with Jonathan Capehart

47:08 min | 2 years ago

How Derek Black went from being the golden boy of white nationalism to its outspoken critic

"Wow. I'm Jonathan Kaye part and welcome to Cape up. This week. We revisit the story of Derek black. He was born into a family that was prominent in the world of white supremacy and was considered an heir to the throne of white nationalism until he went to college. His transformation was expertly chronicled by ally Sasso low Pulitzer prize winning reporter for the Washington Post in his book rising out of hatred. The awakening of a former white nationalist. Thank you very much for being on the podcast. Thanks so much for having me on. Okay. So your your book is pretty incredible. Because it it's the story about a young man named Derek black. Tell us who Derek black is sure what actually who der black was. Yeah. Exactly. I think was is is the key word. Derek was raised sort of within the very insular world of of the white nationalist movement and his father, Don black had been the head of the KKK in the United States for a decade and then later in his life had started storm front, which is sort of the epicenter of of racism online. It's the largest for twenty years. It has been the largest sort of racist website in the world and Dirks. Godfather was David Duke, probably the most notorious racist politician of in modern times and both of those men raised. Eric kind of in their in their image to take over this movement, and to mainstream at and because Derek was really really smart in that case, I should say is really smart and also really ambitious he invested himself in these ideas that have kind of you know, he'd been indoctrinated with and was disastrously successful. You know by the time. He was eighteen nineteen years old. He'd been elected to office on the Republican committee and Florida he had his own daily radio show. He was traveling around the country to these white supremacist conferences, giving speeches about how politics were the way that that these people could quote unquote, take the country back, and, you know, an endemic did a lot to spread these ideas and grow this movement until later a little bit later in life after I going to community college, he went to college and through the course of three really dramatic years. He slowly kind of realize that not only had he been wrong about every. Thing. But also that he had caused huge and tremendous damage and had to figure out what to do about that. And the book sort of takes place over those three years. Yes. Okay. Let's not. Let's not give it away. Because it is. It is an incredible story. So David Duke is is Derek's. Godfather, right, right. Yes lead. He's also Derek's mom's first husband. Yeah. In the in the very strange, you know, for for all the other reasons that it's strange awful. Also, an unusual closeness in this white nationalist world and Don black Dirks father, David Duke, where sensually best friends and are best friends and also, you know, sort of ran this ran this movement together. And you know when David Duke was the head of the clan. Don, black Derek's father was his number two. They of came into this movement together and roast the top together at first David Duke at L LSU meta woman at who he married and had two daughters with. Then they divorced and few years later. She married, David dukes best friend, Don black. They had a child, and that's Derek. And so so David Duke was sort of a presence at at Christmas all the time, and Derek would go and spend time staying with him in Europe where David Duke spends a lot of his time, you know, a real unusual. Closeness derricks two half sisters. David duke's daughters. Right. And in David Duke is spending his time in Austria and isn't allowed to travel into Germany, but he does a couple of times to go see Derek when he's studying their broad not to be hyperbolic about this. But just in the description of Derek in and his life then. Derek was being groomed to be a leader. And I kept sitting there thinking, oh my God. This is sort of like the white nationalist Kennedy family. Yeah. Where I think I I think you're spot on. Yeah. And I think, you know, not only was David Duke, grooming, him to to sort of be his protege, but sort of much scarier and probably more powerful. Derek saw himself the same way. You know? I mean, his his goal for his life as a teenager was to lead sort of a a white takeover of of the country, and he'd he'd invested himself in in that, you know, it was what he spent his time studying and reading about I think it's also important to note that David Duke and Don black and Derek's Dirks family had decided to remove him from the public schools where he lived because they thought those schools were to diverse and so Derrick was spending almost all of his time either at home where he would research, not only science and math and things like that. But also, white, nationalist ideas. Or he was travelling along with his father, David Duke, as they would spend weeks at a time going usually through the deep south to all of these conferences or spending time with their white nationalist friends, and they said that Derek was quote, unquote, unschooled they they wanted to school him only in these white, nationalist ideas. Now, the thing about the thing about Derek. And the reason why they invested so much in him was the way he went about espousing, the white nationalist idea. He was sort of David Duke two point. Oh because as I read your. Your descriptions of Derek I kept going back to my interview with Mitch Landrieu the former mayor of of New Orleans and his book in how he wrote about his dealings with David Duke in Louisiana and how David Duke was Trump one point. Oh that in this David Duke was able to get as many votes as he did because he put a smiley face on white supremacy and white nationalism in Derek you. Right. He never used race racist slurs. He didn't advocate for outright violence of or breaking the law. His core beliefs were the same as those of most white nationalists that America would be better off as a whites only country, and that all minorities should eventually be forced to leave. But instead of basing his public arguments on emotion or explicit prejudice. He spoke mostly about what he believed to be the facts of racial, science immigration and declining white middle class. Yeah. And was extraordinarily powerful in doing that. I mean, I think one of Derek's most lasting, and and damaging impacts on on this white nationalist movement is that he convinced his father to scrub storm front of all racial slurs all Nazi insignia this. This message board that still remains extremely explicitly racist. No longer traffics, and sort of the lowest form of of racism, and Derek fought the way we're going to reach more people is instead of of using this kind of language we need to play to this false, but unfortunately, very widely spread sense of white grievance that still exists and in big parts of this country, and and Derek began targeting the message to those people. And so when he ran for office in Florida, he would go around talking not explicitly about being a racist. But would say things like isn't a too bad that we start were starting to have all these signs in Spanish, all around us shouldn't shouldn't this really be country that only speaks English. Don't you think it's too bad that we have all of these immigrants coming here. Changing the culture of what the country is don't you think that that the violence in the inner cities is a problem, and isn't that probably because of the kind of people who sometimes live in inner cities, he would he would traffic and all of these stereotypes, and and by doing that would begin to speak to a lot of white voters who agreed with some his ideas. I mean, I think the fact for me that lasson my head more than any other reporting the book is this idea that still in this country about a third of white people believed that they experience more discrimination and more prejudice than people of color or juice. That is wildly wildly off base by every statistical historical factual measure that we have. But the fact that that much grievance exists in parts of white America means that these messages have real currency in parts of the country and Derrick Derrick was one of the people who figured that out. Well, to that point you write all about you mentioned earlier that Derek has. Had a radio show on through through storm front that was very very popular. And you write you write about Derek's philosophy. Then white nationalist were not fighting against minority rights, but fighting for rights of their own Derek and other activists were quote simply trying to protect him preserve an endangered heritage. And culture, he said they were trying to save whites from a from an quote, inevitable genocide by mass immigration and forced to simulation. What's happening right now is a genocide of our people, plain and simple. Derek said we are Europeans. We have a right to exist. We will not be replaced in our own country, which has echoes of Charlottesville. But then there is one more thing that you wrote about. In your book, and it's quoting Derek from his radio show. I believe it's in two thousand eight and this gets to your point about white grievance going into electoral politics, he said on that show most white people don't want to be called racist. But they do want to make sure their culture and their position. In society, isn't going to be undermined people are just waiting for white candidates to come along who are brave enough to talk about these things. And when that happens whites will go streaming to the polls. Yeah. Pretty pretty powerful pretty prescient. I would say, you know, I think one of the things that you mentioned in there also is this idea of of white genocide, which has become probably the most powerful keyword within the the white nationalist movement. And it's something that Derek did more than almost anyone to help popularize. And when he first suggested it, you know, a lot of people in this movement thought it was a weird idea. Like why why are we going to talk about this idea that did whites? Going to be wiped out. How how is this really a genocide? How is that powerful? But but Derek sort of decided that if we can convince people that the way the demographics are changing in this country is going to wipe them out. It's going to wipe their children out is going to mean that there people, quote unquote, don't don't have a future. And then that is something that will activate them an end, you know, just recently at the synagogue shooting in Pittsburgh. I know that dick was was haunted and sick to his stomach to hear that the shooter had had walked out of there saying that he had done this because there was a white genocide underway. And that term has become exceptionally popular within the movement. You know, we'll we'll get to Derek's sort of transformation rate now, and that starts when he goes to new college in in Florida, and he ends up. Here's this white nationalist arrives on campus in he ends up having. This collection of friends who hit spent his entire life denigrating sort of in the abstract. Brad math. Matthew, who who is orthodox orthodox Jew Moshe one who who's the first person he met 'cause I think they got lost trying to find the college, right? Then there was rose who's Jewish and they kind of dated until she found out who he was ally. How do people find out who Derek was he I mean for the first six months that Derek was on this campus? He sort of made this really calculated choice to be a white supremacist activist on the radio every day and a regular college student in this in Sarasota, Florida and new college of Florida is a really liberal school. Derek went because it was the best public school in Florida, which meant that it was the best school he could afford. And you know, he was really smart and qualified and. So he thought no matter what the politics of the school is like nobody's ever going to impact my thinking like this. This was the thing that he invested his entire future in. So he also realized though once he got there that if everybody on that campus knew who he was his his campus. Life was likely going to be lonely and miserable. And so what he would do is. He would wake up really early in the morning, which in college is like, you know, ten AM, and and he would he would like walk far away from the dorms to this quiet spot on campus, and he would call into his daily radio show, which he at that point was doing with his father, and they would, you know, go on the air and rail against the minority takeover, and, you know, say say really hurtful things about I q differential spreading this false science, and then he would walk back onto campus, and he would sort of befriend whoever walked by and part of that is that Derek had always been hugely curious about about things about people. And also he had never in his life been inter personally. Hateful in that. He didn't believe that. It was ever useful to have like a direct interaction with somebody where you were name calling or things like that. And he tried to make these ideas that he'd that he'd been given and learn from very on in childhood he tried to make them about science, and he tried to d- personalise them. So in his personal relationships. He was always kind, you know, a little bit of Paik. Nobody knew much about him or his family, and he was just sort of an anonymous kid on this college campus intil wait in his freshman year there. Another student on campus was doing a paper for the for for their their thesis on the biggest extremists in the country and went on the southern poverty Law Center website and looked at their they're sort of roll call of of the people who are the most dangerous to the country's future. And in this list. Sof Oto of a kid who sat nearby him in math class. And and at that point, you know, the the school essentially exploded in this uproar of what do we do? And now, we know that that sort of the rising star of of this racist movement is. Going to school among us. How do we respond to that now? So I've got the sequencing wrong because where does the details magazine profile of him? Come into play. Because didn't he sort of strategically place it somewhere where he hoped? Someone would find it before. I think it was Christmas break. Exactly. Yeah. He did. And this sort of was happening at the same time as the student was researching on the southern poverty Law Center website ham. Derek this double life was taking a toll on him, especially because he had started to make real friendships with these people people who often he dehumanized on the radio, and particularly with one woman rose, Derek started to date her before realizing she was Jewish, and then then was sometimes, you know, spending nights on the college campus with his Jewish girlfriend, and then going home the next day to thanksgiving in West Palm Beach where David Duke, and Don black would sit at the table talking about how the holocaust was a sham and an end Derek just felt this tension at that point sort of exploding inside him and felt like he needed to end. But he also didn't have the courage at that point to tell anybody. And so he. He had he had tried to take one of these big magazine stories about him and put it in the school gym like on the elliptical machine hoping that maybe somebody would would see it. And discover it that way, I think at that point. He just felt like he couldn't he couldn't take it anymore. He he puts with magazine on the elliptical open, the big picture someone someone find me. Exactly. Maybe it's a school where not many people were going to the gym. I'm not right. So Matthew is the one who starts inviting him to. It's not was it Chaban dinners every night. Yes. It wash about dinners. Yeah. And that was after he had been discovered. Exactly. Yeah. I mean, so one of the things that that because Derek had some relationships from those first months on campus before people knew who he was, and you know, when when the campus sort of exploded in this debate about what to do about him. There were some people who felt like they knew him. And who also felt like wait. This can't be this can't be right. The seem somehow inconsistent. Like, he's this is somebody I've spent time with this is somebody I've played guitar with can he really believe these things and pretty quickly at new college. And there were there were two. To sort of main responses in terms of what to do about, Derek. And I think you know, they they were both effective in their own ways. There was one group of students who thought we need to shut us down. We need to we need to either work to get him expelled. We need to sort of make clear that this kind of speech is not okay here that it's hurtful, and they began a campaign of sort of ostracism trying to push away from campus, and they were hugely successful. They Derek would sometimes get flipped off when he walked across campus students who were in classes with him would drop the class and protests, and at one point students organized the school shutdown where they shut down the school for a day and brought in somebody from the southern poverty Law Center to talk about white nationalism. And and the dangers of it at all of these things, you know, had a real impact on Derek. I think for the first time in some ways he saw through the eyes of his peers people people that he considered in some small way in his in group. How? How how hurtful and damaging these ideas were and how much they they affected people. He also was isolated more than he had been before on campus, which was practically useful because then when some people like Matthew and some of these other friends began to reach out to him Derek was in a much more vulnerable position and was much more likely to say, yes. So I think both of these affects really really did some great good in their own way. And Matthew was very very patient. There are people who are saying to him why on earth, would you have this guy over for dinner? He hates you. He hates all of us. And yet you're going to sit across from this guy, and one of those people who really didn't like Derek and who used to go to the Friday dinners, but decided to like sit it out sit in her room. Not partake was Alison, right? Yeah. Alison was was Matthew and Moshe as roommate. And and when they decided that they were going to. Fight this this famous white supremacist over to their to their dorm for shebab dinner. She thought it was a terrible idea. You know, I think she'd she'd been much more in the camp of we need to make it clear that that this kid is not welcome here. And so that I that I inner she she stayed in her room. She sort of refused come out out of protests, and she did that for several weeks. But Derek kept coming back. And he it wasn't just the first Friday or or even a month of Friday's month after month, he kept showing up at her dorm room, and she began to see that he was sometimes arriving with the bottle of kosher wine, or you know, he was nice to people. It was diverse group of people at the table. And she I realized he didn't seem to be a physical threat. Like, he didn't seem to want to hurt anybody. And then she just got intensely. Curious Allison is now a on her way to her psych PHD, and she she really always wants to figure out people and something about Derek to her. Didn't fit. She couldn't understand how this person who believed that all all minorities should be banned from the continent. Also was capable of having these thoughtful worldly conversations with a diverse group of people at dinner, and she decided that she wanted to try to figure him out. So now, Alison figures prominently in the in say, the the second half of the book because as she's getting the know him. She is really putting the screws to him in like sending him studies and articles and they're having talks in arguments about about his views. She was adamant in a way that and in arguably more successful than say, the the sort of more passive approach that Matthew took. Yeah. That's exactly right. Yeah. I think that one of the lessons from reporting the book is that there's there are so many ways to go about impacting somebody's thinking, and and you know, one of the things that I loved about about getting to spend so much time with all of these people is that they they had really different approaches. I mean what Matthew decided he was going to do which I find totally remarkable in and of itself is that he almost never talk to Derek about about. Nationalism. And instead he decided what he wanted to do was just build a relationship with they're not build a case against him. Just hoping that at some point, you know, Derek would would begin to see past his prejudices to the people into the humanity and for Matthew and Moshe also Moshe who's a Hungarian Jew whose family was essentially wiped out in the holocaust to to show up at these dinners week after week. And even when there was no sign for a long time that Derek's ideas were changing. And even when sometimes they would hear oh during last week, it looks like Derek was was back at the storm front conference in the woods of Tennessee. The fact that they kept coming to that table just sort of choosing again, and again to believe in in kind of the goodness of humanity is stunning to me that they never had that conversation. Alison on the flipside decided that she was going to go about dismantling Derek's ideology, which meant for her that I she wanted to learn about it. So Allison started having conversations with Derrick about what really are the things. Do you believe tell me tell me why you believe these things, what's what's the science that you have to back this up and at one point she took the extraordinary act after sort of befriending Derek of going with him undercover to one of these white, nationalist conferences. So that she could sort of marinate an in it for herself and hear herself literally marinade, and as I was reading that Eli I kept thinking could I in a million years put myself in that kind of position where? I I am in the room filled in surrounded by people who if they knew my true, identity would to my mind. Tear me limb from limb. Yep. Exactly. I mean, I think I think Allison had had had the privilege in that situation of being white. She could blend in she knew that people would not necessarily identify her as an outsider immediately. But I think she spent those two days, you know, feeling sick or stomach, and and repulsed and she would go during the speeches to the bathroom and just almost like compulsively washer hands because she just had this desire to feel clean and to drown out. The noise of what was happening in the conference. And and I think more sobering. To her even than any of the speeches at the conference was seeing how this community reacted to Derrick. Derrick was not just an attendee at these conferences. He was the golden boy he was he was the chosen one and not only was he giving the big speeches and. Telling people that the way ahead is through politics. But he also was the most popular person in the room. I mean, these were these were his family members these were his family friends for him. It was almost like being being the the beloved person family reunion. And so in between every speech if she was sitting next to him all of these people would come over to him and say, Derek so proud of you, you're doing such important things. Now that you're getting this college degree, you're going to really be able to sort of mainstream these ideas and bigger ways, and so left that conference not only with an understanding of the ideology. But also with the realization of how much Derek would be giving up and if he left it. I mean, I think she realized how central he was to that world will the ways she was able to get to him in after having gone to gone to the conference and just the way it seems that she's wired she she is about fats hard facts. Here's here's how I'm going as you said. Dismantle your arguments, and she perceived that you know, this is the way Derek is. I the the, quote, I read before that, you know, instead of basing his public arguments on emotion or explicit prejudice. He base them on what he believed to be fact, so she met him facts for facts. And the thing that I found most fascinating in this time that we're in. We're no there doesn't seem to be a a set of agreed upon facts was that Alison would bring him a study on genetics or intelligence and tests, and he would read them do his own research, and sort of internalize what he was getting from her. I now more open and accepting. Yeah. Yeah. And also like hugely comforting for me and reporting the book, I mean, I think I sense this before as we all do, but looking into all of the facts and all of the science like it is all on the side of the anti-racist. Right. And so. Allison knew that her facts in her science was better an end Derrick began to trust als enough because there was a relationship there. There was first of friendship, and then like a becoming closer and eventually romantic relationship. He trusted her enough to open up her emails. Right. Like, so he he said, okay. If she's sending me this. I trust her. I'll read it. And then Dirk was smart enough to see that. In fact. Yes, her science was better. I mean, Derrick Derrick talked a lot about this idea of IQ differentials between races Alison herself at that point. Was administering the IQ tests new it much better than he did. And and was able to send him all kinds of studies showing him. Why his information was wrong? You know, she she was sending him stuff about the ways in which races is a social construct, and how it sort of bonded to emotions from early in life an end and given to us in in those ways, you know, an end to new colleges credit Allison also during this time was able to enroll. Role in a class about the science of prejudice and discrimination, and the impacts of it, and she used that syllabus she sort of like weaponized it and would send Derek all of these studies that she was reading in class about not just how he was wrong. But also about how prejudice hurts people in real ways and the health effects for people who suffer discrimination, and you know, an end those began to have an impact on Derek's thinking, I saw in reporting the book. Well, as as a reader, I'm sitting there, and I'm reading about this guy who just on paper. I have. So I head I had so many problems with his worldview and yet in reading about him and just the way he started shifting and changing I could not help but be charmed by this guy. And that's why I was sort of asking myself could I sit at dinner with this guy part of me thinks that I could. Yeah, I part of me would be repulsed. But the more, you know, could part was the one that was winning out. Like, I actually thought I could be friends with this guy. Right. That's that's that's an incredibly nice thing for you to say in terms of how how I perceive and feel about the book too. Because I think the truth is the Derek even when he was a spouse ING, racist, damaging awful ideas, and was a complicated person. Right. An and he. Was a part of this was because these were ideas that he he had he had been been given in some ways and not not come to on his own. And and part of it was because he is just like this insatiable curious person like he he pursued knowledge even as a white supremacist in every way that he could an end that was through reading through challenging his ideas through building relationships. And you know, so so I think I think you're right. Like, I'm I'm sure now, obviously, the you'd you'd love how sitting down and having dinner with their, and you guys have a lot of you know, your ideas about things would would be well now I would. But even even then I think like he was you know, that was that was the thing that all that's why all those students kept coming back to the Chabad dinners. And it was that was a diverse group. It was there was you know, one who who had had immigrated from Peru when he was ten years old there. There were gay students were black students there were there were, you know, white students. It was it was a it was a diverse. Tables transgender student. There is a transgender student Rose's friend, right exactly and Derek. Know inner personally was kind all of them was curious about their experiences. And so the other thing that Allison did is is she Derek had tried to separate this idea of like a white nationalism is is just an ideology like it's not it's not a personal thing. It's just a way of thinking about the big movements of of the country in the world. And an Allison, which of course, was a fallacy a huge fallacy in Allison would would make it personal for him by saying. Okay. So what do you think should happen to one to to your friend? Who you spend all this time with who's like part part native American part Peruvian part black like where what continent does he go to in this? Great resorting that you want to happen and what happens to his family. And and how does he get to that other continent? And what does that mean for his his, you know, everybody else in his family? And and how does that look, and she sort of forced these these ideas to become personal for Derek, and he had increasing trouble answering those questions. And he didn't know where they should go. So let's fast forward Allison has succeeded in in her work in getting Derek through facts and science and and credible. Studies to see that his white nationalist philosophy was not dangerous, but hurtful and wrong. He decides that he is going to renounce everything and he does it through the southern poverty Law Center, right? Yeah. Talk talk about the significance the significance of that. And when he did it and why he did it. Sure. I mean, I think for for a while. Derek sort of came to these realizations. I that he'd been wrong 'em. Then then that that he had done huge amounts of damage and his first instinct was I just wanna quietly slip away an end as time went on. He realized that was not a possible thing to do like he'd left it. He'd left a huge public legacy within this movement. And and he had no right to quietly slip away. He had to he had to sort of speak back against it. But he also knew that by doing that he likely risked ending every connection that he had to the first twenty three years of his life. He suspected that his family would not talk to him. Again. He he suspected that every relationship that he'd had up to that point would be severed. So it took him a long time to get up the courage to do it. He went back shortly after graduating from new college to West Palm Beach to help his parents, fix fix some windows at the house, and it happened to be the day that the Trayvon Martin the. You know, the verdict had come out, and and Derek was driving around with his dad, and he heard his dad's saying hall of these dehumanizing things about about Trayvon Martin. And it made Derek feel sick to his stomach. I think in part because at that point. He was so distanced from this ideology that that in fact, what Derek had been reading or like the op-eds about Trayvon Martin in the New York Times, but more upsetting than hearing his father say these things was Derek realizing he had said all of those similar things about situations like this again, and again, and again, and and he he still couldn't figure out how to tell his father how far he'd he'd sort of traveled from this ideology. I mean, their their relationship had always been the closest relationship in both of their lives, and Derek knew that it would you know, he was essentially going to break his dad's heart. So instead what Derek did is he left the house and he went to a bar nearby. And he sort of finished writing this letter he'd been working on. About you know, why wait nationalism is wrong and the damage that it causes and the damage that his family was still causing and he sent it to the southern poverty Law Center in part because he felt like that was where it would resonate the loudest the SPIC, you know, in addition to having a large audience of anti-racists is also very well read among white supremacist, some white nationalists in part because they identify it as you know, like sort of their their number one enemy, you know, the the SPIC had sort of built itself in some ways on something called KlanWatch, which was a publication that really just covered. Don black when he was running the clan. And so so it was very personal renunciation that he knew his family would see he also new wider audience and see and an end. Yeah. It landed it landed with a bang. Yeah. A big bang it caused him to not I think disowned is probably too strong a word, but his mother would never Lau him back in the house his dad he and his dad at least at the very beginning had a very strained relationship. Didn't talk to each other his father actually thought that this was a joke that this was you know, sort of the the predecessor the precursor to fake news. He thought that it was some sort of trick. Yeah. I mean, Don black in for his whole life has sort of believed had believed the two things were like the the greatest truths one. He thought that white nationalism was correct righteous. The way the way the way that he would the thing that he would devote his life to and number two. He thought the Derek his son was the smartest most capable person that he knew so suddenly if Derek was saying that no white nationalism is wrong that meant that dawn had been wrong about one of those two. Things either he had he'd been wrong about white nationalism or he'd been wrong about his son, and and suddenly like that paradigm no longer fit. So Don came up with all of these tortured, tortured ideas to try to make his ideas still square like maybe Derek had somehow been been brainwashed. By by the left in college may be Derek was faking change to have an easier. Life going forward. Yeah. Maybe maybe this Email had been maybe Derek Email had been hacked into and somebody else had sent this sent this Email, and they I think for everybody, and it wasn't just dawn like within the white nationalist movement. Everybody knew Derek. And so all of these message boards storm front and everything else lit up with people. I talking about weight as true what happened and then as as the days, and then weeks went on people trying to figure out, you know, where is he an and is there something we can do about this. And so. Derek by that point had decided to change his name. Switch his first and middle name, an it moved across the country to graduate school, not telling anybody where he was going. I mean, I think at that point. He thought his his best course of action was to essentially disappear and start over and he expected that point that he probably would not, you know, would not see most of his family members. Again, some of them. He hasn't. You know, it before we started the interview Eli remember when I was saying there's this one passage in the book that I can't find it. But at some point probably during the interview, I'm gonna find gonna go. Aha. Yes. I remember I I found it. And this is a good segue into sort of fast forwarding to Donald Trump. You have here on page two fifty two I think it khloe. You have your khloe told Dom that spectacle reminded her of dukes rallies in the nineteen eighties. When he routinely drew thousands of whites to hear him speak in rural Louisiana. This is khloe having gone to a Trump rally, right and Chloe Eric's. Mom, right. And so you have quote, we have been trying to recruit these same disaffected whites that Trump is going after it's the exact same audience on said shortly after Trump secure the Republican nomination in the late spring of two thousand sixteen quote, everybody may not want to call themselves, a white nationalist that sounds a little scary. But but it's the same principle. He is tapping into the fact that raises still a huge part of identity, his accelerating. The time line of our movement by several decades by making many millions of people more racially aware before nobody really knew what a white nationalist was now, he's given us this incredible. Platform. Yeah. I think Derek, you know, Derek, I when he moved away, and he moved to Michigan and changed his name. He thought for a while like, maybe maybe all these seeds that he'd helped plant him would just stay in the ground. And and maybe he could sort of go on and live, a normal life and white nationalism would would remain sort of a small thing that not very many people talked about, but he began to see in in twenty fifteen twenty sixteen you know, all of these seeds growing all around him and terrified him, you know, and this is also when I first learned about Derek and kind of came into his life was after doing roof had him had murdered ten people at the church in Charleston and had been motivated by storm front and hid used language that echoed a lot of the language that Derek and his father would use on the radio. And so not only had that happened. But in the way that that anti-refugee redder rhetoric sweeping through Europe. In in the way, that Americans were talking about immigration or the black lives matter movement, and then certainly in the presidential campaign of twenty sixteen. Derek heard all of these talking points from his childhood echoing all around him in these huge powerful ways. And I think the thing that scared Derek is that he he knows the power of this ideology because it's it's a power, unfortunately, deeply rooted in the marika's hugely problematic racial history. And and and Derek believed that you know, there was there was a way to speak to this white grievance that would have huge political ramifications. And and once he saw that happening. I think he decided it wasn't enough to speak up against us ideology. Once in this letter DSP L C, he he decided and his continued to decide that he needs to continue to invest himself and his own future in speaking up against it. Because you know, at this moment in particular. I think being silent is almost like being complicit. The stakes are just too high. Yes, he saw all around him. You know, Trump was sort of the the the mountain top for for the white nationalist. But before Trump came on you had Andrew Breitbart. Rush limbaugh. Lou Lou Dobbs, Newt Gingrich. Glenn beck. Congressman Steve king who were all in one way or another using white nationalist language to talk about mainstream, political ideas. I can't end this interview without asking so Derek. We started this conversation with him being white nationalist. He's now no longer a white nationalist am very much publicly. So where is Derek now? So Derek now is finishing his PHD at the university of Chicago. You know, it's it's his transformation is sort of impacted his in the fact that he's just invested himself and fighting back against this has impacted his life in these really interesting ways where he's as part of of learning that he'd been wrong about white nationalism. Derek initially as a kid as a teenager had sort of invested himself in this idea of the middle ages as a time of crusading white European warriors fighting for the white race, this this is like the iconography of the white nationalist movement, and Derek had invested himself in that version of history. Then he went to college hoping to be medieval and began to learn that in fact, you know, none of these European warriors conceived of themselves as white that that concept didn't exist in the same. Way. And also at that time, actually, the is logic world was far ahead of the white world or the European world. I should say in many ways, and so Derrick his switched his specialty and is now studying the Islamic world and has been working to learn Arabic. And I think part of his focus, you know, in terms of his own history work is trying to trying to get medieval to acknowledge the sort of true version of a more global history and instead of focusing mostly on on the rise of Europe. So that's one thing that he's doing. But also, he's you know, he spent last summer as as a as an expert consultant to Facebook, helping them figure out and sort of the rise of extremism, and and polarization online, you know. So so I think he's he's trying to figure out what's the way to have the most impact, you know. And I think it's really it's a challenging question for him. Probably in the years going forward in that. He I think he feels really compelled to do as much. He can to push back because all of all of the the damage that he did it still. It's still is. It's still exists. I think he doesn't know how many people were marching in Charlottesville because they had had seen something that he'd said or because they'd gone to the white pride website that he built for kids that was visited a million times. And you know, I I don't know what the number is. But I'm sure it's not zero and so daring, then I think he's he feels like, you know, he needs he needs to do as much as they possibly can to push back against it. Because because the damage is still real amp. But at the same time, you know, he's he's I think really bright historian who has who has a great future in his own, right? And so figuring out a way to balance those two things. I think I think it's something that he'll continue to work on. And where's Allison? So Derek Alison are together still together committed to each other. Allison is she's at at a school in Michigan. So she's in her finishing her PHD program said so. They live like three hours apart, but they spend, you know, I I I don't know if it's the bulk of their time together, but they you know, it's it's a short enough long distance relationship that they're able to spend much time together. And certainly when I was reporting the book, and I was spending a lot of time with the two of them together you where where they would have weekends together. And I would just come in third wheel it, and and and hang around. I mean, that's the thing about about your reporting even here at the Washington Post is that you give us a fly on the wall, not even fly on the wall. Sometimes as you said third wheel like, you know, like, I know allies sitting at the table right now as I'm reading things alight. Last question. What do you hope people will take away from your book? You know, I think for me. Anyway, what I took away is is it's an interesting like to to really divergent sort of realizations, one of which is that the power of this ideology, and in in America's mainstream is profound and that, unfortunately, I think as the country's demographics continue to shift playing to this false sense of white grievance is only going to continue to have more potential power. And that's really scary. And I hope. That that part of the book can in some small way be be a little bit of a call to action in terms of what were what we're up against with some of these ideas that are so deeply rooted in our history, and the other thing that I took away, and then I hope readers takeaways that the possibility for personal transformation is profound like if the future leader to this movement who was who was connected to it in every single way, especially within his family, and if he is capable of finding his way out renouncing, his beliefs and ending up so far on the other side as like a rising in prominence anti-racist activists that gives me a lot of hope that people who have less further to travel and are also capable of challenging their own ideas. And changing, you know, the problem, of course, is that there are a lot of people. There are a lot of people who have who as Derek would say don't want to be called racist. But who have ideas that are are are influenced by race? And. And that are racist at their core. And in less, we can force those people to confront some of those ideas in the same way that that students on campus forced Derek to do that. I think we're in a lot of trouble ally Scislo Pulitzer prize winning reporter at the Washington Post and author of rising out of hatred. The awakening of a former white nationalist. Thank you so much for being on the podcast. Of course. Thanks for having me on. Thanks for listening to Cape up. Tune in every Tuesday, you can find us on apple podcasts, and Stitcher and how about doing me a huge favor subscribe rate and review us. I'm Jonathan Kaye. Part of the Washington Post, you can find me on Twitter at Cape heart. Jay. If you like to keep up with Jonathan Cape art, usually check out some of our other great podcasts. Like can he do that a podcast that explores the powers and limitations of the American presidency or try post reports every afternoon host Martine powers brings you the unparalleled reporting and analysis you expect from the posts newsroom in our newest daily podcast. You can find these shows anywhere. You listen to podcasts and learn more online at washingtonpost dot com slash podcast, the Washington Washington Washington Post.

Derek Derek Alison Don black David Duke southern poverty Law Center Allison Derrick Derrick Derek Email Florida Matthew Jonathan Kaye Washington Post United States Europe Cape David dukes Don America Charlottesville
Part One: The Complete, Insane History of American Border Militias

Behind the Bastards

52:19 min | 2 years ago

Part One: The Complete, Insane History of American Border Militias

"I'm Robert Evans hosted behind the bastards. And did you know that the greatest bastard of all might be a or it might not? I don't really know because I haven't listened to sleep walkers yet. But I'm about to start because it sounds awesome. It's a new podcast about how AI works how it infects and effects our lives in how our behaviors are being subtly modified by AI without us. Even knowing sleep walkers is the podcast that asks what is all this stuff with all these computers doing stuff? What does it? What does it mean for us? So if you wanna know how a I could stop someone from joining ISIS what happens to doctors if AI diagnosis illnesses better than them. And what a song written by sounds like then checkout, sleep walkers? It's pretty cool. You can find it on anywhere. Find pods or casted. Let's pump and McCray. I'm Robert Evans hosted behind the bastards the podcast retail. You everything you don't know. But the very worst people in all of history. My guests today. The inimitable the unstoppable the dynamic duo sexier than Obama deadlier than Osama. Cody Johnston and Katie still the best in show. I really worked on that one. So every second of it. And also you could have just said Obama for the second one would've worked. Well. He went to the extreme. Did I did? I did. I always liked comparing my guests to famous terrorists felt right? Goes it goes. Well, every time are y'all doing today. Great great. Yeah. We we do have. Of course, our coffee mate in the in the room with us one pump. When cream Pombo green it expired in January twenty nineteen. That's very cool. I do have you because I throw things now on the air because I've become a prima Donna this time. It is a loaf of Izzy. Oh, artisan bakery. San Francisco style. Sour dough. Throwing this in anger at several points that coffeemate might have curdled by now. But it might make a good spread for this hour, though. Oh, that's a good idea. Just putting that out there. And if I wanted one cream is bread on the Sourdot, how many pumps would that be? One one problem pump was one for so it's so like old now and Colonel two or three, you know. You know place to get it started. Yeah. Speaking of getting it starting you guys hear about that border militia. That that apprehended hundreds of migrants at gunpoint. Yeah. You want to hear the whole history of civilian border militias? I really do. Oh, I thought we were just going to hang out. Okay. Okay. Okay. I told Cody to get him here. But but when the Colleen every time people, it's working. Yeah. That's got to get those pumps and the equal number of claims. Ideally, we should get new coffee experts is cream puff. Clearly, nobody wants to use it. So. So. Anymore cream only a prop now just a proud? It's it's ambient cream. Okay. Let's get into it. So when I was a little kid growing up in Texas. I learned about the glorious war. My white ancestors had fought against the brutal Mexican government in the evil crossdressing Santa Ana there was a lot. I did not learn though, like that the Texas revolutionaries had been fighting for the right own human beings. And that Santa Anna was one of the founding fathers of cockfighting. I did. However, learn a lot about the Alamo from there might Texas. History course went from the short lived in incompetently, led Republic of Texas to the civil war. That's basically it. I don't remember learning much about Texas in the nineteen twenties or anything about the border aside from some Hanky graphic tales of the very first Texas Rangers. Now in case, you don't know the Texas Rangers are basically, the Lone Star states FBI only with more spin kicking see the documentary Walker Texas ranger information in their current incarnation. I did not however learn much about what the Rangers have gotten up to pre and post civil war days, according to Kelly Hernandez, author of meager history of the US border patrol quote. They battled indigenous groups for. Dominance in the region. Chase down runaway slaves who struck for freedom deep within Mexico and settled scores with anyone who challenged the Anglo American project in Texas. The Rangers prove particularly useful in helping Anglo American landholders win favorable settlements of land in labor disputes with Texas Mexicans whatever the task, however, raw physical violence was the Rangers principal strategy. Yeah. So okay. Cool. Very cool. And so you do it. That's how you Roth physical violence the art of the raw physical violence. Yes. Just just shooting people. Now, I found that quote in several others in a wonderful intercept article that makes it very clear just how much unchecked violence was key to early border patrol strategies because the Texas Rangers evolved from a force bent on maintaining white dominance and Texas too in the early nineteen hundreds this nation's first real border patrol. Here's the intercept quote the early years of the twentieth century from nineteen ten to nineteen twenty. We're particularly bloodied with hundreds of Mexicans murdered lynched in the Texas borderlands, the dead included women and children the aged in the young longtime residents in recent arrivals says the refusing to forget project and initiative started by collective of border base to story, and researchers they were killed by strangers by neighbors by vigilantes and at the hands of local law enforcement officers in the Texas Rangers some were summarily executed after being taken captive or shot under the flimsy pretext tried to escape somewhere left in the open to rot others desecrated by being burnt. Capitated or tortured by means such as having beer bottles. Rammed in their mouths. So that's the start of border patrol. What if we didn't do? Like what if what if somebody looked at that that we shouldn't allow that? Well, but then you wouldn't be a country. Okay. Okay. Definition of country here. What if we could though that's all I'm saying is what if you could be a country and not to sounds like some pie in the sky leftist. Woo, okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Keep dreaming, Cody here, but imagine. Okay. All right. No, you're right. Yes. Too lofty a man in all the people not torturing. With beer bottles. Rammed in their mouths. Imagine. Not that though would if I what if what if not that. What what if not that what if? Laws. What if not that what if laws this is poetic, but they broke the law by crossing a an imaginary line come if they didn't want a beer bottle, rammed in them. They shouldn't have come here. Yeah. That's true. And then by like just by virtue of being here. They're they're criminals. They didn't human being angrily. I mean, do we even want to say human beings like with these people doing? What does that word when you when you when you refer to them as human beings that makes me bread throw an angry? Tobacco. Any? I'm not actually if they didn't if they didn't want these things to happen to them. And then they shouldn't come here. We don't want to do it. This is deterrent. Oh, it's it's a deterrent beer bottle shops. This is an example. So you know, what you're getting. Yeah. I hate it. Did it work? No, oh, I I did a paper damning issue. The sound is not in any way translate to the audio format that we work exclusively at but as very comedic in the rim. Yeah, I'm I'm glad it worked in the room in the roaring twenties inequality soared while an oppressive drug prohibition state-led outbursts, violent crime across the United States. And by nineteen twenty four some Americans had decided that the cause of their problems were all the goddamn immigrants. We've talked a bit about this a little and other episodes, the second KKK made halting immigration at keystone of its politics, although they were mostly focused on stopping immigrants from the bad parts of Europe. But down south in Texas, many Americans decided the problem was Mexican immigrants the need for Mexican farm labor meant that. No, real restrictions were put in place on immigration, but the government created the border patrol is a SAF to people who wanted something done a capitalize. The essence something I heard that the with the way inflected. That's why. Yeah. Something. Yeah. People racists in Texas where like I don't want these Mexicans coming in in the business companies. We're like we can't harvest food without them. So we're not going to like we're going to lobby the government to not restrict them from coming in and racists rely. But that makes me angry. So the the government was like have have border patrol. That's where they come from. And now. Tossed the bread. Here goes the bread says eat more toast on it. You know what I'm noticing right now. As an issue with toss and bread today. It doesn't bounce back like the bagel bagels palm right back to me. You know, I'm gonna have to have Dan will go get it. Thank you, some extra work for somebody for somebody. Because I am a diva premadonna yet Davis. Yeah. Like beyond say clean. I have taken that on myself. Oh, no, no, no. I'll keep throwing the bread. You're going to get the make. Let's continue while he grabs. My toss and bagels. Now. The early border patrol was very much cut from the cloth of the Texas Rangers the intercept interviewed Francisco Cantu. Former Puerto patrol agent who told them, quote, I often heard romanticize stories of the old patrol element for the days. When agents had free reigns. Across the borderlands lighting abandoned cars on fire in tuning up, smugglers and migrants at will as young trainees my colleagues, and I were taken to storied places in the desert, a remote password earlier generations of agents were rumored to have pushed migrants from clifftops and hidden their corpses. A stretch of road were an agent had run over a native American lying drunken asleep in the road, an isolated patch of scrubland where agents had forced fed smugglers fistfuls of marijuana and turn them loose to rock through their wilderness. Barefoot and stripped to their underwear there is a lot to digest there. Yeah. Thank you. Dan. What is turning up me tuning up tuning? I means the meeting the shit out of. Yeah. Of course as time went on the border patrol became gradually, more professional and somewhat less like a bunch of drunken sociopath less being the operative word. Not unlike and we're not gonna. Talk enough about the number of people who are killed by border patrol every year, some violence still persists. But it's it's obviously less than it was in the twenties. Sure, just like, we don't, you know, there's still problems with prescription drugs. But we don't sell children morphine. Right. A lot of things are less than the twentieth. Yeah. Yeah. As a chin rule rule make it. Okay. Doesn't make it. Okay. So. With your really all those years ago. So the border patrol became less sociopathic, but the desire to fight immigration with hooligan ring remained inter Louis beam. You guys ever heard of Louis beam now, oh, he is someone we will be talking about a lot in my up coming audiobook, the war on everyone because he's like if George Lincoln Rockwell is like the George Washington of American fascism share Louis beam is like the ABRAHAM LINCOLN of Nazis. Okay. Yeah. I that actually does not scan at all. So I I don't know. But I mean, I got you. Yeah. Louis beam did an eighteen month extended tour in Vietnam as a helicopter machine gunner. He saw extensive combat and spent roughly a thousand hours shooting bullets at people accounting for between twelve and fifty one kills when he came home. It was as a radicalized far, right? White nationalist with fervent anticommunist views in the early nineteen seventies beam created the clan border, watch part of a neutron towards paramilitary training among the KKK beam stated at the time when our government officials refused to enforce the laws of the country. We will enforce them ourselves. Okay. That's what the that's the. That's the constitution. But. Argonne given right to take the lawn tomorrow hands. Exactly, yeah. Exactly, if the government won't stop people who are critical to the infrastructure and economy of this nation from entering illegally because the legal pathways are gigantic pain in the ass. Then it's got to be up to the KKK to do it. That's just it makes sense that doesn't make me question any of my feelings about immigration or immigrants, or what people think about getting rid of them. Yeah. I'll just take those two things at face value. The never think about it again. You know, what you know, what I love is never thinking about things against everything about it. I guess never think of it. Again. It's easier that way it's way easier that way. Now, we're going to as I said talk about Louis beam so much more during the war on everyone. My upcoming very fun audiobook that everybody's going to love find uplifting. Dare I say shamefully Roddick. But for the purposes of our story today, the tail of the clan border watches, a lot more to do with two different and somewhat more comical racists. Tom Metzger and David Duke. David. Fuck. Yeah. Now Metzger was beams counterpart in the California Ku Klux Klan and Duke was we'll get to David Duke and a little bit. And anyway, here's how bring the war home by Kathleen Balu describes the clan border patrol, quote, the patrols functioned both as a publicity stunt, and as a way to inculcate real anti-immigrant hostility and encourage acts of violence some patrols worked as photo opportunities for the press in one such incident. Duke in California, KKK members hung clan border watch signs on their cars and drove to the border near San Diego. And to wanna when no undocumented immigrants appeared Duke boasted to reporters, I think some Mexicans are afraid to enter the country because of the clan. There's that deterrent working. There's that deterrent working. Yeah. That's that's 'cause if if the KKK being there didn't work so like, let's just take your kids away. That's next. Progressive political step, it doesn't work. Okay. Well, I guess like tear gas, you know, that does work next stop bullets. I didn't wanna think about it more. I was going to put that away. I wasn't going to, you know, just not analyze that shooting straight. Remember what you're talking about? Exactly the way go, you know, what I'm about to put away these throw in baking. You really see that? On my feet. I we gotta stick with the throwing bagels. This this toss into bread is del Tondo doesn't work. When you laughing at Sophie, this is very important. I'm doing a very important podcast right now. What if the toss inbred company offered to sponsor this show? You know, I have too much integrity to hear. I mean, I'll let them sponsor the show, but I'm not going to lie and say that the tossing bread is better than the throw in bay. Exactly exactly got to be honest. Anyone can advertise as long as the truth can be told exactly for curdled cream. That's and that's what we stand behind it. It's I'll say this. It's more fun to throw the bread. But the bounceback is so much more satisfying on on the tossing bagels. That's I mean, I'm to throw the baby. Yeah. Air pumps. One crane. I mean, we we could test that out. Let's not let's not. But let's do someday. When the when we inevitably do the drunk episode of this podcast. We'll figure out exactly how these relate to one of those little Creamer package. You get in a seven eleven in one year when a year old when a year old cream. We'll figure. Yeah. So Tom Metzger and David Duke are both important figures in the development of the American fascist movement. But the day I wanna go into a little bit more detail about David Duke. He's been racist longer than most Americans have been alive during the nineteen sixties when he was in high school, he was already an ardent white nationalist when he went to college nineteen sixty nine he became a student organizer for the national socialist, white People's Party, a direct descendant of George Lincoln Rockwell's Nazi party, Duke. Also started the white student alliance and the white youth alliance. He was particularly active in Louisiana state university's free speech alley according to Leonard's Askins blood and politics quote in one incident from those early years duked on the Nazi stormtrooper uniform complete with swastika armband and strode around for the cameras with a picket sign protesting campus speech by noted left-wing attorney, William kuntsler. Free speech. This checks out. Sounds like a real good conservative sounds like a real goo ga. What if let's say he and these people were to get a lot of power. Do you think they would care about free speech? Yeah. Of course, you think that they would they would defend free speech for people who maybe disagree with them. Free speech, Cody speech is my ability to talk about what I want. I don't give a. Who taller someone else was reading about a free speech activist guy named Hightower Hitler something? Like that in Germany. It's pronounced Tytler Hitler. Yeah. And he came to power actually in in the early nineteen thirties. I even read further in the book that I'm reading about him. But I think he was a real free speech crusader there. Our I haven't finished the book, I'll get through one of these days. Yeah. It's talk about height ler. The California border patrol was duke's brain baby first informants, although Metzger handled most of the logistics, blood and politics describes the media campaign. He crafted around these patrols relating press conference in October of nineteen seventy seven David Duke stepped out of a rented helicopter and onto the grounds of the San Ysidro. Port of entry south of San Diego federal office used by the immigration and Naturalization Service INS to regulate traffic on the border with Mexico dressed in a light blue business suit Duke was surrounded by an entourage of tough looking men in street clothes all members of the knights of the Ku Klux Klan, they faced a protest group angry at the klan's public appearance. An egg splattered on duke's close in Iraq broke the windshield of the Klansman's car. Police arrested the rock through our while in INS agent. In charge welcomed the clansman and gave them a guided tour of the facility for Duke and company this visit was the first stop in an effort to stir up opposition to Brown skinned immigrants. We believe very strongly white people are becoming second-class citizens in this country. Duke told the press when I think of America, I think of a white country. We try to keep this light and fun, but my blood boils a little bit. Like, I feel my shoulders inching up to my ears. We could because you're angry at the the anti-free-speech people who talks to rocket that. You you got me going let them speak. Yeah. I mean, I think you're doing a great job because you're you're you're like relaying the message. But right now, he's the egg-throwers they might as well be shooting guns. They might as well shooting guns and should be treated as such. Also, what about those poor baby eggs, the baby chicken xactly that could have been murdered a third of an omelette. Yeah. As the current president of the United States says, maybe we should treat them throwing rocks. As if they were guns. Yeah. Yeah. That makes sense because you know. When you toss a rock that can could go to solid fifteen twenty feet per second. And you know, a a rifles only like three thousand feet per second. It's not that difference a bullet, but a tiny rock. Exactly. What's math, but numbers, you know, come on Duke officially announced his clan border watch several days later in Sacramento. We said five hundred one thousand Klansmen would patrol the border crossings in areas in between the fences in search of a legal immigrants. The reality was less impressive less than two hundred Klansmen actually showed up to drive around in their activity at the border was limited to a few weeks the knights of Texas started patrolling their border at the same time. But in both cases, the border watches were more PR than practical the clans newspaper. The crusader published a special article to commemorate this aerobic action. No single action in the last decade has done more to bring public attention and awareness on the border problem. Now, it would be more accurate to state that no single action did more to bring public awareness to the cause of white nationalism focusing on the border. Into legal immigration was a hugely successful PR move for America's most organized racists as David Duke himself noted when a hundred reporters are gathered around hanging on every word when they hope you accomplish your objectives by their own misguided sensationalism, if indeed it was a media stunt, it was by their own presence in admission that it was a very brilliant one. That's relevant to anything today. Yeah. No. It does not tie in my favorite thing about coming on this podcast because it's relevant is hearing hearing stories and stuff that has nothing to do with what's going on like because I like to you know, we read the news all the time. We talk about it all the time. And so you wanna shut that part of your brain off and hands. It never happened. Just wanna hear stories like this man thing Ivan? Yeah, that has that doesn't tie into anything else. Nothing. You know, what does tie anything else ads for products and services? It might even be an ad for sara-lee deluxe throwing bagels. Yeah. Right back products. Do you sell stuff online? Then you knew what a pain shipping can be. It's time consuming. It's expensive. It's a hassle until now. 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Just like these bagels were back after I threw them because they bounced right back when should be the tagline if the fucking Lee people advertise a product hire a Sara Lee. Themselves a mother fucking big bounce, right? Back bounce right? Bagel rings, bagel. Oh. Oh. I love it. We've got a career trajectory for looming in this room. Yeah. This this feels more organic than pitching Doritos. Because I love toss in bagels. Yeah. Even more than you need us that can be a euphemism for a lot of things to talk and bagels in. Yep. Wolf my mind went places. Bagel salad as I am. In a chicken stir, fry salad and it coffee. Coffee, mate. Yeah. That's that's that's the that's the crane. It's a reduction in salad claim this is I've been on this podcast a lot. This is the worst thing I've ever heard. Let's talk about stuff, that's even worse. So well, David Duke and Louis beam. We're content to mostly use the question of illegal immigration to drum up interest in their super coupe clubs, other Americans remained frustrated by the fact that no actual action had been taken to stop migrants from coming over inter civilian material assistance or the CEA may the CNA was founded in nineteen Eighty-three by a wholesale grocer from Arizona who wanted to provide aid to anticommunist guerrillas fighting in Nicaragua this eight eventually turned into actual volunteer fighters several of whom died in that country, Kathleen balloon notes that quote in Nicaragua acted covertly and behalf of the US government. It was funded by the CIA and supplied by the US military coup. This good shit. Now, the nineteen eighties were a time in which a lot of civil wars were raging all across Latin America, most of those wars were funded and in some way supported by the CIA and the US military, for example, also during this period, the Guatemalan government was fighting an insert. Agency. They dumped suspected guerilla fighters into the ocean out of helicopters. So no, one would find their bodies and disrupt the military aid they received from the United States, all this violence and unrest across the region. Let a lot of people to flee their homes in search for a better. Let's find that life in the United States. The was not a fan of this. According to the intercept quote in the summer of nineteen Eighty-six approximately twenty heavily-armed men in military fatigues stepped into the darkness of the Zona desert. It was July fourth weekend outside the remote border town of luxury L and the gunman were on the hunt carrying in sixteen. AK forty sevens with his Rayleigh night vision goggles strapped to their heads. The vigilante soon found what they were looking for two carloads of Mexican nationals. JR Hagan the crucifix wearing Vietnam veteran who led the operation would later say that the vehicles came to a stop on their own other members of his team disagreed telling reporters that they booby-trapped the road tearing the tyres of one of the shreds before opening fire. It was the latest in a series of escalating actions, which also included clandestine forays into Mexico. This the militia. Members held sixteen men women and children at gunpoint for an hour and a half before border patrol agents arrived to take them away. Very big discrepancies story. I love it. They're they're protecting the US border play invading, Mexico and believe in it's fine. Like, it's almost like these, hyper masculine people they need this award be fighting. They need to have some like battle. And then planets, I get I like football. I get the desire to lark with a fuck. Fucking AR. Fifteen go do it on your friends land and shoot it old cars don't fuck with people's lives shoot their vehicles video game play fucking video game. Yeah. Yeah. Like, go fuck up another country. And then when they come here, stop them with guns. I love because it's really like, okay. One guy said they stopped on their own. But they disagreed, and I was waiting for like, no, they stopped. They like held up Gandhi. I stopped the car. No, no. They bubis. We like we like put shit down. We were just standing in the middle of the room for this. They do want war zone. Yeah. They went to war. They wanna civil war. They want to revolution. There's a went Hannity's old website in like nine and all these polls of like, what revolution do you prefer? Yeah. And it's like I want civil war. No, I want like a real like we're revolt against the government, just like all these different options. There's one thing they want. They have all those cool toys, and they want an excuse to use them. Nobody voted for the industrial revolution. No. That was what's your favorite? You know, what I love is what little cute little Tykes work in factories. Just really gets me. Keyword is cute. It's your it's cute yard dolts when they're little hands that go into those grain Thrashers, and they just try to pull the stuff out faster than it can cut their fingers funds Q wholesome Hans wouldn't be able to do that. It'd be less cute. And it would be less cute. Oh my God. In the little the little cute little fake limbs for them the little peg legs and stuff. Thrashers. I like like. Yeah. Yeah. Think of how little those black lungs are too. It's adorable. I love a good liquorice jelly beans in their in their chest. Yeah. Mm cute. Yeah. I took it too far. Jelly pizza cute with. No, you know, what you're who. Katie. If I throw it out the other wall with. What is that expression? Sovi? Protesters throwing something. Fire. Great Langham, bagels fact, just please. Thank you. Yeah. Instead of a molotov. Molotov cocktails bagel. I love that Pagel this something here multiple locks to something we're close we're getting there. We're getting there. I'm proud of all of us. We'll probably cut some of that out. Nine hundred ninety one was an important year for America's political racists. It's the year. David Duke ran for governor of Louisiana he lost. But he won almost thirty nine percent of the popular vote, which is a lot of vote. That's the magic number. If like that like that rate is there's always that range of people who vote for is kind current approval rating. Talking about who you're talking about. It was also the year of the Gulf war, and many of America's white supremacists. We're very much against that war happening. The populist party was founded by Willis cartel in nineteen Eighty-four Willis will get an episode himself. But the short of it is he was modern America's first successful intellectual Nazi think of him as rich as the Richard Spencer of the nineteen eighties and nineties he kept his power level. Just wrapped up enough to avoid being tarred with the same brush as George Lincoln Rockwell, but he shared Rockwell's ultimate goal. Uniting the American right behind white supremacist politics. The populist party was a major early vehicle for David dukes political career in nineteen Ninety-one. They picketed and protested the Gulf war, blood and politics sites. One of the leaflets they handed out by the hundreds quote, if the populist party were in power, we would have hundreds of thousands of troops on the Mexican border not in desert desert sand dunes, ten thousand miles away. There would be no affirmative action quotas or other anti white racists schemes anti white racist scheme. That's my hell. Oh god. Waiting for like, no more wars. Just not where we want to closer. We want to do it close in a war on those unarmed. Tried to cross the border. Gotta kill those women and children. We want to be able to see the war from our back backyard. I want to one a war. But I also don't want to have to go too far from kitchen. Well, you don't wanna have to fight war in like a gross foreign country. No, no. You wanna know kill some people want to go home to my own bed. Exactly america. First. We're here. Forever import. Don't export exactly exactly exactly got a word deficit. Trade was at the war gas. Nineteen Ninety-two or in nineteen Ninety-two. Pat, Buchanan ran in the Republican party primary against George Hw Bush. So to Tom Metzger for that matter Buchanan made border security the keystone issue of his campaign during a precedent at the border in may he told the L A times, quote, I'm calling attention to a national disgrace. The failure of the national government of the United States to protect the borders of the United States from a legal invasion that involves at least a million aliens a year as a consequence of that we have social problems and economic problems and drug problems. Oh, unfortunately, for Pat, Tom Metzger showed up at the border that same day intent on a tacking, Pat Buchanan from the right? Here's how blood and politics relates what happened next. The only problem was Metzker who waited with great fanfare for Buchanan to appear. Where was the great white? Hope he sneered like a perfect villain in a street theater. I want to talk with him when Buchanan finally did appear he was forced to huddle in a small circle of supporters to avoid contact with Metzker. But the ornery Aaron worked his way into camera. Nevertheless, Pat, he yelled is all the. Cameras swung away from the candidate in toward him. What are we going to do about all those rich Republicans making millions off the wetbacks in the imperial valley as the cameras swung back and forth. Buchanan beat a hasty retreat after less than fifteen minutes of photo opportunity with the cameras all to himself Metzker, then staged his own press conference. If he were president he argued volubly, he would station national guard troops like a picket fence along the border with orders to shoot to kill the immigration problem would be over in one night, he declared. Yes, that's also cool. But also gross. It also gross deaths. Yeah. That's it's always fascinating hearing stories like a picket fence, but just like. Yeah. That fence Dunn's a guy that has Buchanan from the right? That's that's a thing. It's a feat. Okay. Okay. It's like like I've seen that conversation happened online many times. But just like, oh, yeah. Two candidates are doing their Twitter Twitter argument, but in real life. Yeah. And pulling them to the right? This is what we had to do before Twitter would show up at the the the border shouted Shuten. Now, obviously, the nineteen Ninety-two election did not go to any Republican slick willy noted lawyer and probable rapist one in the mid nineteen ninety s Clinton's border patrol launched the prevention through deterrence campaign, this basically focused the border patrol in several specific border cities in an attempt to funnel migrants into the Sonoran desert by basically blocking off all of the easy ways into the country. The idea was that migrants would realize that we're no safe routes into the United States, and thus stop trying to enter I'm gonna I'm sure that worked seems like people fleeing war, and in some cases literal genocide in their homes would be stopped by crossing an additional desert right desperation and the human. Drive for survival is easily deterred. Yes, it very very like a single extra obstacle. Exactly that isn't necessarily a worse. Obstacle than once. They've already gotten to that way to get people to stop trying to do something like go through hell and be like what about a hell light about a slightly less worse. Anyway, let's read the next pair. Oh, no. It turns out thousands of migrants tried to cross and hundreds of them died in the Sonoran desert, in many cases, they died due to lack of water, heat stroke, and all the other terrible things that can happen to a body whilst travelling through the desert on foot, but a number of those migrants, we will never know how many died violently in two thousand you CBO. A Mexican man was shot to death by Texas landowners. Sam Blackwood you CBO had asked. Sam for water Blackwood was convicted of a misdemeanor deadly conduct charge in fined four thousand dollars. Several members of the jury hugged members of his family after the verdict was given all of this finally brings me to the Minuteman. No. If you're like me, the Minuteman civil defense corps were the first vigilante border, militia you ever heard about at least started in April of two thousand five is the brain child of a man named Chris Simcox. Now, Chris was born in nineteen sixty one child had occurred. While David Duke was wearing a swastika in free speech alley and Louis beam was machine gunning people in Vietnam in his early years Chris's life gave little hint that he would follow down and evening Begley similar path to those men he moved out to L A with dreams of becoming an actor after several years of failure. He became a kindergarten teacher instead and taught at the Wildwood school could their teen years. It's just like. Like. You're you're really not with his cO. It goes. By September eleventh two thousand one he transitioned to running a private tutoring. Business according to the nation, quote, he appeared to suffer a mental breakdown in the days after the September eleventh two thousand one terrorist attacks refusing to communicate with anyone unless they first recited the preamble to the US constitution and he's a series of bizarre messages on his ex wife's answering machine about stockpiling weapons. I'm going on a great adventure. Simcox told his son three weeks after the attacks. This doesn't end. Well, it's interesting fun. Yeah. Adventures are fun. Ventures ventures sensors adventurous unders both are fun. Both are fun. And nobody dies in either. Either. That's my favorite thing about adventure. Never dying part this adventure was Chris moving out to tombstone Arizona and getting a gig as a fake gunfighter in a local show for tourists. His dreams. This is going to be. He also sunk some of the savings into buying the tombstone tumbleweed, a small local paper Chris change its editorial direction from local news to ranting. Violently about immigrants. The next year two thousand two he founded the tombstone militia, which is owned newspaper described as a committee of vigilantes, the tombstone militias started patrolling the border irregularly in January two thousand and three Chris was arrested through. Infrequently. That's that's how you dot costumes. We don't do it that often. Two thousand three Christmas arrested for illegally carrying a firearm in a national park during one of these missions the nation notes also in his possession. We're a police scanner and a toy figure of Wyatt urp reading a horse. Yeah. All right. Everything's adding up. Yeah. In April of two thousand five Chris teamed up with Jim Gilchrist, a retired accountant in Orange County to start the minute man project, according to Chris citizen, border patrols were needed to do the job. The government refuses to do and protect the country from people he called invaders. That's a new word all of this is not the same language that Louis beam the Nazi used to justify the clan border patrol couple of decades earlier, very totally different the same language and other say where any of these people use specifically or the Christ Church shooter or I could to keep. Yeah. I'll just I'll just you know, what I actually it's one of you wanna throw these bagels and anger. Wherever you want. You toss those bagels nothing in here can be damaged. Oh, this is solid to us. It's back to Robert and the invasion is over. Does this play well on podcast? Oh, yeah. People love people. Love a good. Good bagel throw. It's the cornerstone at my show the minute man project lasted a month, and it mostly involved groups of volunteers sitting in lawn chairs near the border looking for migrants with binoculars while it was unimpressive on the ground the minute man project was a huge PR success, FOX paid particular attention. But coverage span the gamut of mainstream new sources, I found an NBC news article from June two thousand five about two months after the minute men's first outing quote headlines from the zone event gave the momentum. And turned what some believed to be nothing more than a publicity stunt into a national movement. The group has since hired lawyers reorganized into separate corporations filed to legally protect a minute man project hired a Washington-based media consultant and started an aggressive fundraising campaign. And representatives of the group have been to Washington to lobby congress in relate the lessons learned from their time on the border. So unless the work continues is just going to be Butte as a dog and pony show said James Gilchrist, one of the minute men leaders when the Arizona project wrapped up he Simcox unabashedly acknowledged that among their chief considerations in Arizona was getting media attention. So if you know one thing about the kind of people who create volunteer militias, it's that they're all impossible assholes who hate each other Simcox and Gilchrist did not get along and less than a month after blowing up, press wise the minute, man. Okay. Yeah. I I'm hung over again. So I'm I'm reading some like shit head listed a month after blowing up in the news. The minute man fractured into two separate groups. Go Chris created minute men Inc. An organization aimed at fighting a legal immigration inside the US by attacking employers violating immigration laws. Simcox ran the minute, man. Civil defence corps or MC DC on paper. The two groups were part of the same larger hole in reality. They had fairly little to do with each other. This worked out great for Chris Simcox because it meant he could solicit donations directly to his group without sharing with Gilchrist by August of two thousand six between sixty thousand and one hundred and thirty thousand people had donated money to fund the M C D's operations, Chris Simcox claim that he'd received over one point six million dollars. He claimed at that point to have more than seven thousand four hundred fifty one cousin Megan tastes or migrant hunters in his personal army. He claims these men had personally delivered thirteen thousand legal aliens to the border patrol Simcox Gilchrist quickly. Nd the attention of powerful forces within the American, right? According to the nation, quote, the cannonball media splash that followed attracted the attention of diner consultants. The Chicago based political consulting and fundraising operation is run. By Phillip, Sheldon, son of the traditional values coalition long. One of the nation's most Pacific anti-gay crusaders diners one cog and Philip Sheldon's revenue generating machine which also includes response and limited a direct mail firm promoted as the nation's best and most comprehensive source of mailing lists for conservative and Christian may lose Intel marketers and perhaps best known for ghoulish Lee purchasing a list of donors to Terry shovels legal fund from her parents several days before her death. Who? What is even cooler another mailing list? That response limited would happily sell to the highest bidder was a list of people who'd subscribe to a now dead magazine called the spotlight spotlight. Third of spotlight's. Yup. Will the spotlight is a literal Neo Nazi news rag that mostly focused on denying the holocaust. By Willis, cargo, founder of the populist party and backer of David Duke. So Chris Simcox was happy to sell access to his mailing list to these these people. Checks out cool. The the didn't care for the Nazi stuff. Didn't care. I didn't care for that. Par not a fan of referring to them as migrant hunters pretty pretty. So much because all of the above you can't say that I'm not a fan of migrant hunting either. You know, what I am a fan of products? I love products services. Oh my gosh. She served now included before we go to adds. I'm going to try toss something I've never tossed, and this might be an objectively bad idea. Okay. I'm throwing the what happens this. There's no way to tell us all the cream. It was fine safe. Everything's good. Everything's fine. Nothing. Pardon me, because I baptized away to the language, but nothing came out. But if you. Thing to come out the product. We need to talk about something Chuck. Yes. Constipation abdominal pain and bloating. That's right, man. You tell yourself. It's not that bad. You take laxatives modify your diet and exercise routine but thinking about it all the time is frustrating. Yeah. Do you? Find yourself making up excuses instead of admitting to people that you don't wanna go out because you're really worried about leaving home despite your best efforts to feel better your symptoms. Keep coming back is this right? Yeah. Man at this feels all to relatable, you are not alone. If your gut symptoms return again, and again, and again, you don't know why it may be time to seek help like thirteen million others, you might have a real medical condition called irritable bowel syndrome with constipation or IBS C. Yep. To get more info about your symptoms, and I be SC to oh, my gut dot info slash podcast and learn about your constipation, abdominal pain and bloating. And if you're ready, find out ways to talk to your doctor or. Excess one online. That's my gut dot ie NFO slash podcast. We're back. God those ads. I bought I bought it all I'm so full from those ads. So am I so am I you know, let's let's let's fill our heads. Now. Some some knowledge digest something. Okay. So we were talking about response unlimited people who buy up all the mailing lists. They bought the minute man's mailing list. Or essentially, Chris Cox sold access to that the nation actually managed to find some of the people who purchased access to the minute man's mailing list. It included judge ROY Moore for his failed than aerial campaign. Oliver North's Freedom Alliance and some organization called stop Puerto Rico, statehood. What? They they know they're fucking. Oh my goodness. Data cool. Yeah. Now, most new Griffey's, and Chris Simcox has position would have fucked everything up within six months or less of their first gripped going viral. But Chris is a smart, dude. On April nineteenth two thousand six. He showed up on Fox News as Hannity and Colmes. He stated with zero evidence that three hundred thousand middle easterners had been apprehended entering the country in the last year. This is a clear and present danger. It is the greatest threat to national security and public safety the time for negotiating is over. He then delivered an ultimatum to President George W Bush declare a state of emergency and deploy the national guard and military reserves or by Memorial Day weekend, we're going to break ground, and we're going to start helping landowners to build a double layer security fence along their properties, thus was born fence gate, okay pool. President Bush was forced to send six thousand national guard troops to the border to placate the FOX watching crowd. Chris used the media storm around this to solicit. Even more donations. His plan was to buy up miles of private land along the border and Bill would he called an Israeli style security fence, including six foot trench and concertina wire on top by may ninth. Just a few weeks after his FOX appearance. The vincit raised one hundred seventy five thousand dollars a month later almost four hundred thousand dollars has been donated week by week. The minute man grew more and more tightly woven into the Republican establishment in mid two thousand six it was absorbed into the declaration alliance. A group formed by conservative activist. Alan Keyes in nineteen Ninety-six to fight abortion and gay rights the alliances President Mary Lewis was a former assistant to Bill Kristol editor of the now defunct weekly standard during a minute. Man gathering keys told the assembled militiamen what we're doing here is not just building the fence. We are rebuilding a character. We are redefining a people now and every press appearance in interviews. Simcox has been careful to note that the minute men were nonviolent when Alan Colmes the FOX's now. Dead pocket democrat crush. Chris about the fact that some minute men carried guns on patrol. Kris told him Allan this is a dangerous place. There are drug dealers are group in California yesterday came across some drug mules, one of them carrying an AR fifteen, you know, our volunteers thank God for the second amendment are allowed to defend their lives if they're attacked and when they put themselves in this dangerous situation the same as the men and women of border patrol. They have that right? The reality of the situation is that Chris Simcox Jim Gilchrist in many of their volunteers champing at the bit for an excuse to murder Brown people. I'm going to play an audio clip from documentary footage shot in two thousand four the first person. We're going to hear is Gilchrist available to shoot the Mexicans on site. That would end the problem two-three Mexicans shot. The they'll stop crossing the border and take the cows home too. And here's Simcox I feel that coming across. Fading this country. They should be treated as enemies of mistake. And we need to start putting them in work camps. Anyone could have walked in this in this country, bringing bombs chemicals weapons of mass destruction. I'd ignition shot outside. Yeah. You know, all those migrants bring weapons of mass destruction. Yeah. I I looked into it. Because I wanted to know how many do terrorists Al Qaeda guys have snuck into America through the southern border. It's a it's still zero. It's still zero wandering it's only been eighteen years so fingers crossed changes zero. Now exactly eighteen years after people started. Never know. It's interesting hearing all these people talk. Instead, he's terrible things that many of our public officials say and do and they'll do like the camps like the camps like insinuating that maybe we should shoot them. But we will maybe we maybe we well, but we should. We won't. But but I also like the deterrent. That'll deter them. It's and that's what go Chris said that like if you start you only have to kill a few in it'll deter them. That's literally the same thing. Nazi Tom Metzger said thirty years earlier you start killing a few and it'll stop it. Yeah. Yeah. It's important to note that the minute men, although they wrap themselves in more moderate garb in were very tightly woven into the Republican party. We're just as hateful and had intentions just as violent as the Neo Nazis klansman who preceded them. You know, like people are talking about like Donald Trump. And how like he's look look what he's doing to everybody. Look what he's doing to the public and party. It's interesting. How? It's less than more. He's expression of it. He's he's just the DJ. They were already dancing. He's got up and he pumped up the fucking pump one cream to their rhetoric. He's the if I may borrow a name the spotlight. Yeah. Nice. Maybe a little bit lot. Nice tie-ins here. Yeah. So yes. The in wrap themselves in the notion of protecting America. But what they really wanted was an excuse to murder Hispanics in part two. We're going to talk about what happened when some of them finally got that chance. But I. Ooh. Ps zone. We hid zone. Piso? I mean, it's plug your stuff drop drop a p in the zone like we're here. We're here on the podcast a lot you like that. You've got our own podcast called even more news. Cody, you do the rest. There's also YouTube show called some more news, the videos, and my Twitter's doctor, Mr. Cody, and my the shows Witter's somewhere news and case Twitter is Katie stole. That's right. I have a Twitter. My right, okay. On twitter. You can follow me there. If you wanna be my friend or my enemy on taking both. I have there's t shirts you can buy on public. You can find this podcast on Twitter or the Graham at bastards pot. You can find all of the sources for this episode and behind the bastards dot com. I don't think I have any other podcast plug. Sophie is that correct? You just looking like you're angry at me. Like you furious missing something. Oh, do you only to throw the bagels again? Okay. I'm gonna throw the big. Oh knocked over katie's drink. They are kidding. Progressively more dangerous. But I'm not I'm not gonna stop. Why would you? Why would you? Exactly. Cookie. Speaking of America, I've podcast about what if civil war cold. It could happen here spoilers. It's terrible. The podcast is good. But the I hope so anyway, the episodes over go throw some bagels hug cat give a cat bagels. We're done episodes over. Are you scared about the possibility of a second American civil war? I'm Robert Evans. I'm the host of the podcast behind the bastards. And I've worked as a conflict journalist in a couple of actual civil wars in Iraq and in Ukraine, and I'm here to tell you I am scared of that possibility. If you wanna know, what might be awaiting your friends and your family, listen to it could happen here. You can listen and subscribe at apple podcasts or on the iheartradio app or wherever you listen to podcasts.

David Duke United States Texas Chris Simcox Chris Louis beam Tom Metzger Texas Rangers America Mr. Cody Mexico George Lincoln Rockwell Cody Johnston president Robert Evans Twitter Pat Buchanan Duke