20 Episode results for "David Cohen"

Prophets interview with jockey David Cohen.

Trust the Prophets Podcast

30:27 min | 3 months ago

Prophets interview with jockey David Cohen.

"Tom Tune change everyone with forty two. Russ until we are we're making NBA. Aren't we on major twenty? Two Times I think he calls to Emmett Smith episode last time by mistake really number twenty one legal buying booze episode. So yeah. We're here right now. We are into the. I'm getting a little bit too hung over because I'm able to legally buy booze episode. Ak As you said the Emmett Smith episode which as As detroiters we have a little bit of heartburn over obviously the got the Barry Sanders feels only winning one playoff game. Let's not get into that though. Those are some some pretty hard members to get through different PODCASTS. Different podcast different day. We do have a special gas with us. He's hanging in there tight. We will introduce him In a second before we do that empire maker you WanNa do a little bit of housekeeping. Yeah so for the last tenor fourteen days or so We add two of the best slates of our careers. I guess with trust the Prophet since we started in October oaklawn on May Second. That was the hardest to that point. The best The best day we've ever had oaklawn Derby Day. Set several of our records as far as prophet our ally on our picks only to be trumped by May seventh at Gulfstream where we re broke three or four more records on that day so the last ten or fourteen days have been awesome for us. profit wise Derby Day. We broke exact. We broke pick for record on that day. And then Gulfstream records day but Gulfstream on the seventh of May trump a few of those including the full slate our allies Try Don Dailey. Double in leading up to just throw in there. We have in changing our formulas around that same time. It's not a coincidence that around that time we've gotten much better we've we've tweaked are formulas we've come up with different methods for baking exotics. We have a brand new formula that we've been using to take exact the threes three boxes and they definitely been paying off especially one of the tracks. We've been playing three days. A week will rogers. We've been hitting that exact. The box wise at about a forty percent so we feel like we are. We are tuning in right now. Always looking to get better. Hyseni method constant movement and it seems to be paying off for us right now the nerdy Kazan referenced. Love it. Nobody's talking about but anyway let's get to the special guest. We got a big time jockey out here today. David Cohen coming at Ya. He's He's been what most recently at Oaklawn David you hear. Yep I'm there all right he's been Been all over all over the country racing for for years now. Most recently at Oaklawn. We're GONNA throw a few questions at David today and hopefully get some answers first off. I JUST WANNA start off with besides being on this podcast today. What is the single most exciting moment in racing thus far for you? I'll tell you what to back it up a little bit. It's a pleasure to be here but an honor to be here on the Emmett Smith episode. You know but I would desperately to sign that your Emmett Smith Fan or no old school. I think I'd have to lean towards Berry Berry though you know very saying that would be my lean but yeah it is an honor. I'll take that for sure. Backup to your question other than being here I'd have. There's a few winning winning the travers dead heat at the travers making history. There that was definitely a great day for me and I think the only one that could top that was winning in Dubai on the Dubai World Cup Day man. That's that's too awesome events. I've actually been to the travers Toga. That's an awesome event for the fans and obviously for the riders and horses and owners an of connections but. Yeah that's a that's a special wind man. That's that's awesome again. Just thank you for coming in talking to us today. I know you got a lot going on. Especially with with the announcements of the tracks opening up including Churchill where. I think you'll be this weekend right torture. We're opening up opening days this Saturday so I was very fortunate to not have much of a downtime. Only stayed offer for about two weeks since the close of Oakland. So very fortunate. I I got a question for you there David so within the past couple of months. Raider of the Stayed Open and Oaklawn was definitely one of them. I you guys switched from audiences to absolutely no audience. What was that like getting on for the first time knowing that this was a stakes race or a major race some sort and just having no in the audience or do you even notice it. All you know it's I wrote in New York for quite some time. So it's a little bit like riding the winner at Acworth truly but for big races. The thing with Oakland if anyone's has ever been there what makes us so special is the fans. Are The people that come out in love? You know the everyday with the national anthem from the jocks room were situated above the paddock. And you can just hear the roar of the crowd at the end of the national anthem every day so that I missed a lot. You know just seeing the faces in the fans everyone are just great supporters so it was a little adjustment for oaklawn. Park to to be that way but for the horses if anything it probably helped him. You know the more quiet. The Paddock is situated inside the building with people surrounding it so may have helped a lot of first timers or arche breads and not seeing that big crowd down. The Lane could've helped some horses as well. So as far as that part went Was probably only positive but from missing out on the fans and action definitely took hit. There's there's nobody throwing throwing pamphlets at you when you're not winning down the stretch. I'm share so again. That's the great thing about Oakland. That's not something that you experience. I haven't had the worst. It's it's it's just such great people and you know a unlike again. Nothing bad about New York by a different group of fans and Group of different betters. And they'll tell you go back where you came from broken you can go and talk about about a man. It's what we'll let that fly. You're among friends. We got no New York contingent here so we can. We can let it fly on them. I let it fly. I let it fly on Boston all the time. Just because I hate the Red Sox and all their sport teams we can. We can get into that later so that brings up my next question real quick assuming the way you're talking about Oakland is that your favorite track and if it is or isn't white why not you know for me. It's a a has a special place since since I came back off of three and a half year injury and return track and was fortunate to have the the lean jockey title there last year. Just the IT's a special place for me. It's definitely top three. I would put Saratoga into the mix for sure. Maybe a little. Belmonte del Mar. Those would be my top tracks that I enjoy racing at again Saratoga. Just what you have with the the vibe of the fans and the people that come out and support it and the town that loves horse racing so that in the historic value that both the tracks spring and you talk her. Sir Sir got on as you talked about. The injury is sustained in a horrible injury. No had a lot of time off because of that you had to go through recovery. So what did you learn about about yourself? What did you would you learn through that injury and recovery process that that changed to this day? You know unfortunately it wasn't my first injury but it was my lengthly. I encountered some personal losses with family after in throughout those few years so definitely probably a growing process just as a person and as a man who knows but as athlete it actually helped me restart my body back to zero and give back to the hunger and the fight of racing and just realizing not saying I didn't know it already but a good reminder of how fortunate I am to be able to do what I do and make a living out of it right right nothing like a major injury that shuts you down to reset perspective on things right. I know I've been through that myself. Definitely playing basketball in the backyard differ from being a world class jockey. But you know same thing you use you. Start to figure out. Okay you know I got I gotta do things a little differently and keep myself better shave and whatnot for you. I'm sure the scenario is quite a bit different though. Yeah tunic standpoint. You know everything's relative. You know when for me I. I got kicked on the inside of my knee. My right knee. I broke my Tibia and Fibula so I was fortunate that all that missed my actual knee and kneecap but if I was turned you know a few degrees to the left it wouldn't have hit the inside of what had on probably would have shattered my knee excetera and definitely would have never wrote again so it was just you know so fortunate and blessed that. I was able to come back to racing and to be able to ride this level that you've been a Jackie who as you've said already that you travel the World Right. You've seen some pretty amazing places. What's what's the most interesting place you think you've ever ridden earth or place that you went to when you open your eyes and you thought wow. This is completely different from from the other places. I've been on definitely. I would think any the most different track I've ever been out in in the world would probably be in Japan for the Japan World Cup. You totally opposite of what we do here or Dubai's different. The places are but they still have some similarities but definitely Japan. Tokyo is by far the different than anything else. Do you mean the racing the racing itself or the just the atmosphere the will atmosphere of the city and the racing itself as well the procedures that they have everything is just. I mean to a different level class. And that's not talking about about anywhere but Dubai's very nice with just everything is just overly done in Japan. No matter where you're at even the streets there's not one piece of trash on the street people walking around it to in the morning with the suits on and it's just a whole different aspect and when they send out there to these places when you ride internationally you usually have about a week they give you a week if you WANNA go in advance so pending on how your business is you either take full advantage of that and use it as a slight vacation or if your business is great you just fly in and ride when you can. I was fortunate to be able to take full advantage of it so obviously time difference from where coming from America to their my body adapt right away so being awake it. One two o'clock this morning it's just a a whole different aspect and way of everything that they do. I've done that before myself. Yeah it is. It's a roughly getting over there. No matter which classifying flying. That's for sure I'm blessed state. They say Joan first-class J. L. Airline. So it's beautiful. Yeah yeah that would. That would be nice. That would be nice. Yeah we we're not we're not high echelon big time jockeys David so. Tom was back in the fortieth thrown coach. If they didn't begging for a bag of popcorn or whenever one time I was able to stretch out over three seats back coach. One time they did find me business class for work though. That's a different story. Pay For. I'd be right there next to you all right last last of my serious questions and then. I'm GonNa get ridiculous as always. What do you consider David? The greatest source. You ever had a chance to ride whether it be a race or just a pleasure ride. I think the question I mean. There's so many up there that I've been blessed to be on and even beyond in the morning that never had the opportunity to race. That happens as well but probably. I'd say that I had the best relationship with status the horse that I wouldn't to do by with named proud tower two. I was three year old of the year and just the way he did things. Just all out speed and you know. No hold him back to hold on and just wire-to-wire every race and had a lot of good Moments with him. I may have been on some horses that have better careers but as far as everything all wrapped up together in a package. That'd be the one. That's that's awesome man like you don't even have to worry about somebody coming down the stretch. Your challenging you because you have that type of competence when you're on a horse like that. I'm sure funny enough mentioning that when I when we did run into by three or four other American horses were there in the race that I'd be I think two or three times prior so it was a when I wrote it. It was six for long straight now. They change tracks and it's a typical what we're used to one turn three-quarter race but there was a a straight race. There were no turns so I just had a kind of utilize. The same horse lapped up all my hip the same time as that three races prior and he had to start writing. You know a bit earlier before I had asked him a horse and I just kinda played it off of that so just made it a lot easier transitioning into that unorthodox type of race knowing that you already been horses that you beat in those were the ones to be in verse. Yeah it's an interesting segue into a question I wanted to ask you next. Which was Familiarity with a horse read so a lot of times you look and you see like the history of a horse and you see like the same jockey may have been on that horse three four five twelve times in a row. Who knows after you? Do you feel like if you're familiar with a horse that you have a specific advantage or or you feel like business as usual. Whatever you get you figure it out. No one thousand percent if you bet on that Horse Multiple Times especially if you have a positive connection with them win races on the horse it definitely will help out. I always tell people regardless if I went on a horse The first time I've ever been on them I guarantee a learn something in. I'll be able to move them up a little bit next time whether it's just knowing you know what type of turn of foot he has or whether the horse enjoys being inside a horses or outside or maybe a little timid whatever it is The more you ride them the more advantage you have more. You get familiar with their Their own personalities racer right. Yeah for sure and it develops confidence. I think between both view the horse and rider a lot of times. If I've never ridden a horse and I'll see a jockey that unfriendly with has ridden a horse multiple multiple times in the past Will share information or asking me anything you can tell me about the horse because that definitely makes a big difference. How often do they? They like to throw you off those type of people you don't conduct with and you know the difference you know so it's like anything in life if you value someone's opinion your reach out if not if they give you their opinion and you don't evaluate value it then you just go about your business as usual and regardless of what they tell you you're going to do what is best in that moment and I don't think they know really does into big detail but maybe the horse doesn't like being hit too much. Maybe the horse again as more comfortable outside of horses so if you had the opportunity to split horses or Tuck in behind you know on the lead or just tip out and keep them in the clear. Those options are good to know kind of the top. Trainers those are the. That's the type information though give you. They won't tell you how to ride a horse but don't tell you these are the characteristics of the horse and that's kind of the same type of thing that we would discuss formula you got. You got any other specific questions for David before I blast off into some rapid fire. Here we go at this all right. I got four or five or eight questions. I'm a rifle. I'M OFF US. Answer with the first thing that comes to mind run with the number one. Here we go. What is the jockey? Groupie scene like at the big money events so a lot of lot of groupies hanging out back waiting trying to couldn't tell you. David's point at the wedding ring I get it if not then all sets the right. I think more so than anything he just got a bunch of of the jockeys wives and family around with that I I assumed that honestly it was a smart ass. But but yeah. It's assumed I know everybody I've talked to. It's it is quite a family environment. And a lot of those big races especially. There's so much money on the line for everybody. Yeah definitely when big races? The family comes out. People with kids jocks room. You have separate to the doctor. You got a separate room where family can come and hang out so you definitely have more that environment on big days in day to day basis all next up. What is your favorite sport to watch outside of outside of the Horse Racing Game? Usc that would be the next one. He whiffs C. I call that human cockfighting for the record. But now metalwork been a longtime fan since Worst Gracie back in the day. I remember I remember how he's crazy. He was like probably one of the originals. Wasn't he one of the originals? Exactly before there was any weight classes and they just line them up and let them do what they do. Best pound each other to death and blood. D- do you bet on. Do you bet on any sports and don't lie to me. Nope nope seriously now. Never have because. Your industry is super dependent upon gamblers and I gamble some but I mean we. We're more about the You know analytics of the sport of horse racing and and I've always been a part of the analytics of all sports. Will there be fantasy football back in the day. Me and Tom started doing this. What thirty years ago? Plus when we were kids because we're both analytical Geek so you started earlier than me that's for sure probably honestly in elementary school and I never got into that and I grew up in Las Vegas so that may be part of it that I know. The Difference. Do Enjoy blackjack. That's for sure. So if you want to call that betting something out of you so never on your own. Horses obviously not. We're not GONNA go pete. Rose trying to get David kickable. The sanctioning bodies nothing like that. Actually I think the the laws are if you're in the race you can bet on your own horse. If you don't hide the race you can bet on anything now. I don't know where that stands. You know maybe that was told to me who knows ten twenty years ago. I don't know what the actual laws are now but I'm pretty positive. There is no law against betting against your own horse betting for Your Horse. I hope correct. Yeah that's a guard this. You don't do it any betting four yard. You know the conflict of interest as long as there's no of interest to go our next up you guys. The jockeys much like a wrestler High School in College in in all the way through the pros weight is a big issue Keeping your way keeping yourself healthy and in shape Do you drink alcohol? Ever what is your drink? Do you cut loose. Get the party ever or is it all strictly gym business straight edge. I try to stay fit in professional as much as I can. But just as any normal human being I don't mind socially avenue cocktail every now and then but as as anything heavier on a day-to-day definitely not never been a drinker. Just never enjoyed the thing with me. Is that enjoy a lot of liquid in me? You know so I do like something. I enjoy just like a nice hard cocktail. So assads Iraq at the fairgrounds okay. Okay I'M GONNA I'M GONNA have to remember that one. He's he's a note New Orleans guy. College go ahead blow it up to lane right. That's correct to lane university fairgrounds while I was there but Yeah how is that even possible? It was difficult to make it through. Yeah so next up. Do they drug test? You guys for marijuana. I know I know I know. The performance enhancing drugs a huge issue in horse racing. Not so much with the jockeys more with the horses but I'm sure it's with. Every jurisdiction is different. I'd say nine. Defy percentage earth stations your breathalysed and drug tested breathalysed daily and drug tested randomly More places do it more than not but I think it's becoming more widespread than it has been in the past ten years. Okay that's interesting matters because it's like you said it's it's different every state just like everything is right now including the over nineteen. You're seeing tracks open different times all over the world and and clothes and businesses all over the world. So it's one of those deals a state-by-state last couple favorite music genre. Go ahead I pretty much. Anything never really locked onto something. The only thing that I don't like a lot as a country so hopefully I don't offend either one to you but I dare. There is some country like but that's probably one of the ones I don't listen to. That's that's a that's a fair answer. That's pretty much how I answered to anything from hip hop to metal to chill folk music the Beatles anything like that same country country. I'M GONNA have to step out of step out of that room little bit so yeah. I think we're all in the same boat on that and I live in South Carolina so that's that's a bit of a conflict of interest there. Yeah Yeah not naturally from here. Obviously but all right. Here's the last one which Jackie is known around on the tracks the biggest bad ass that you would not want to tangle with in a fight after an issue on the track. Because I know there's one right you guys are all in shape you're all fit your PRI- little scrap tough guys. No DOUBT ABOUT IT. You could kick my ass probably. Will you buy one hundred pounds? But who's the guy that you don't want that problem you're looking at all right? That's forever news. Listen to the PODCAST. Two thumbs pointed himself. Okay I got you go. The biggest bad alison is DC. We're going to start calling in DC David going proclaiming himself. What he's going to get in there and he's willing to. Ufc style fight any of the other jockeys cases. Anybody was interested for challenge. Not really but you know what those days are over now. Now people file you know with the police or exactly they pop Or the detract. Just don't have it in the ban you so those those days are over a longer have that luxury selling things. Back in the jockey's room like most people are used to knowing about but just good spoarer even like a work atmosphere for anybody is take care of that. Take care of that non-public I think it's probably part of growing up as well. You know people when you grow up. You're you're more about business and you're not worried about that as well. Anyways it's more professional characteristic. I think you grow into other other than just wanting a few tips at Churchill this weekend of you if you've got any background help the kids out help the degenerate gamblers out a little bit with some kind of tip for this weekend. Because I know you're anxious to get back and we're anxious to see Churchill running again. Yeah I don't know how good of a tip it is but what is it Saturday. The fourth race monoploy girl. I'd have to go her. You're hearing it here. I in this. Podcast will be out prior to Saturday so excellent. We'll see what happens last question Tom. You good good good. And this is not part of the rapid fire. Ridiculousness is real question the different level. Ridiculousness there yeah. I guess in all seriousness though. What's the single goal in horse racing? That would make that would mean the most you before before the retirement age whenever that comes hopefully a long long career which what would be the biggest thing that would change your life or make you feel like accomplished all you good day legal would obviously coming back home safe and that but as far as the career goal. I think you'll get a widespread answer for many Jock Kentucky Derby Triple Crown. That would be you know being able to to go internationally. Leonardi winsome good races travers. Being one of them. I think it's a no brainer. Anyone that's in this game whether it's an owner jockey trainer or groom whatever might be you're involved with Kentucky Derby and triple crown would be a watch for David Cohen to be involved in that. What this year is too soon. We look at this year for you to get you know definitely not to never too soon in coincidentally because of the Derby being pushed back. It is now on my one year anniversary. Wow it's harder a a special day. We got engaged at a Belmont on Belmont Day would justify one so it'd be pretty cool little one year anniversary involvement. That'd be awesome. That's right rooting for you man. We'll be David Barry. I appreciate you appreciate you coming in Said Good luck to you with everything. Good luck this weekend at Churchill. Where else can we see this? This year outside at Churchill Oaklawn is kind of your home base. GonNa be headed to Saratoga afterwards. Maybe do a little Belmont prior to Saratoga believe Churchill end at the end of June and Saratoga doesn't open up until mid-july so you know granted we do run there and everything. That's the plan. Prior to this whole Cova catastrophe for horse racing and then after Saratoga had back into Kentucky do some keeneland Churchill and go right on back to plumbing do the whole process over all right. Keep kicking ass you. We know we know We'll follow you. We'll be root for you. Anything else to close it out. Gave a call. Thank you for joining up to the mountain weekend. Good thank you on all right. That concludes decide next. Podcast the Prophets number twenty two special interview with the David Back.

David Churchill Tom Tune Emmett Smith Saratoga Oakland Oaklawn New York David Cohen Jackie Oaklawn David NBA Japan Barry Sanders Churchill Oaklawn Don Dailey Kazan Russ Dubai Ak
Top Former CIA, Treasury Official David Cohen on What Makes Sanctions Bite

Intelligence Matters

36:09 min | 1 year ago

Top Former CIA, Treasury Official David Cohen on What Makes Sanctions Bite

"This is the intelligence matters podcast with former acting director of the Michael Morell sponsored by Raytheon. Sanctions don't work by themselves. Sanctions are enormously more effective if you have other countries amplifying what we're doing. And if you have sort of grudging acceptance of US sanctions rather than embrace of US sanctions you get evasion. Where we are. With regard to the reimposition sanctions on the sanctions on the payments for the sale of Iranian oil. We'll be coming back into the sanctions will have an infant. There's no question. He will have an impact I think Iran's trying to figure out what it is that the US is trying to accomplish. And what is the US policy goal here? I think the ministration made a serious misstep in Singapore summit because it was a importance leverage that we had over the North Koreans. Get them to do something before you give them a meeting with the president. And I think the effect has been that the sanctions are not nearly as powerful today as they were nine months. David Cohen is a law partner at Wilmer HALE where he leads the firm's financial and business integrity group, and where he represents a vast array of clients on matters involving national security, David surfer, eight years the administration in senior positions, including as the assistant secretary of the treasury for terrorist financing as undersecretary of the treasury for terrorism and financial intelligence, and ultimately, the deputy director CIA I recently had a chance to sit down with David to discuss the increasingly important role that sanctions are playing national security. We will be right back with that discussion. After a word from our exclusive sponsor Raytheon, I'm Mike morale. And this is intelligence matters. From end to end cyber-security too high energy lasers to quantum computers. Raytheon is there advancing technologies that protect people information and infrastructure Raytheon making the world a safer place. David, thanks for joining us. It is great to have you. Welcome to the show. Well, thank you for having me. Michael, David is you know, I have wanted to have you on the podcast for some time. Because sanctions have become a very important tool of American foreign and national security policy. And I think you're the perfect person to explain how all this works though. I hope so let's see perhaps the place to start is to say that for most of my career in government. I watched multiple US administrations impose sanctions, but with very little affect. But starting in the administration of George W Bush and then into the bomb administration and now into the Trump administration's sanctions seem to be much more effective. What changed? Well, I think a couple of things changed principally. What happens is that we moved from a approach to sanctions that was focused on trade and focus on broad based sanctions. So think about the Cuba embargo to financial sanctions and much more targeted sanctions. And that meant that we instead of trying to interdict goods traveling around the world focused on trying to stop money moving around the world, and the US has a asymmetric advantage in trying to interject financial flows because of the role of the US dollar the role of the US financial system. The role of the. Economy. We have better insight, and we have frankly better leverage that we can use to apply. Sanctions if we use financial sanctions rather than trade. Sanctions was that tool? Always there. And we just didn't see it in. This was just an innovation or did something happened that made it a tool that it wasn't before. So over time as the rule of the US dollar became more important post World War Two the this tool became more available. But I think it was impart and innovation, and I think you're right to to date it back to the Bush administration. I think that's when this innovation really first began and using financial tools, and as the the key element of our sanctions program. And I think we continued through the Obama administration to refine that we'll end to expand it, and I would say the one other I think important development, and it's you know, somewhat controversial frankly is the movement from. What I known his primary sanctions to secondary sanctions, which are very much in the in the news these days with respect to Iran. But you know, I the primary sanction is essentially saying that no US person can hold funds for joy transaction for someone that we've doesn't need it. So there it's trade or moving money or whatever or anything. Right. So so take for example, an Iranian Bank that is providing funds to Hezbollah if we put a sanction on that Bank, a primary sanction on that Bank. No US bag. No US business. No US person can have anything to do with that. Iranian Bank cuts them off from the US financial system, freezes their assets can't transact a secondary sanction sort of expands the reach of our sanctions enormously, and what it says is to a foreign person. So a Bank in Germany. It says you've got a choice to make you can either do business with. That sanctioned around him Bank or you can have access to the US market. We don't have any direct jurisdiction over that German Bank. We can't find that Bank. We can't you know, put that Bank executive in jail if they do business with designated or onion Bank. But what we can do is say if you choose to do business with the Iranian Bank that we've designated we're going to cut you off from the US, and that's an enormously powerful tool because of the importance of the US economy and says another innovation that's another innovation and that that substantially enhanced the power of US financial sanctions, can you talk about the personal role. That Stuart Lee played in this transition for those who don't know who Stewart is he was the under secretary of treasury responsible for sanctions the last five years of the Bush administration in the first two years, rather the Obama administration and one of the few officials who were who were kept you actually for his deputy. Right. I'm before you took his job. Talk about his role in all of this. Yeah. So Stewart was sort of there at the origination of this strategy and in sort of thinking through how to us financial sanctions his principal. Focus was on counter-terrorism and catch terrorists financing. And so you can use these sanctions to stop terrorist. Groups al-qaeda was particularly the focus at the time. If I'm raising moving storing and spending money we then expanded during Stewart's time, and then into the Obama administration in into focusing on people and businesses that were involved in supporting in particular Iran's nuclear weapons program the same technique trying to interject the funding that they needed in order to buy the material for for Ron's program. So those sort of targeted sanctions on whether it was terrorist financiers or those supporting nuclear program were. Sort of the the first wave of financial sanction invasion. We then you moved from those sort of targeted sanctions on elicit activity terrorist financing WMD support to to blotter topics like using financial Sanshui political issues. Exactly. So using financial sanctions to impair arounds ability to sell its oil, for instance, or to get access to the revenue from the oil. It was selling you can use financial sanctions in that way. And so not in a targeted against a particular individual. But to try and put broader-based pressure on an economy. Great great. So so let's talk now about how this process works right in practice. So talk about how we go from no sanctions on a country to a set a sanctions what what does that process? Look like, well as you as you noted sanctions have become something of the go-to tool in US foreign policy. National security policy. So what happens is a new issue arises, you know, then as Walea or, you know, most recently there was a new sanctions program that was put into effect focused on interference in US. Elections by experiences, your call to a meeting at the White House you go to the situation room, the deputy national security advisor national security adviser says we've got this problem with X country. What are we going to do about it? And you know, the State Department says, well, we've got these diplomatic options defense department says we've got these military options, we don't wanna use them. You wanna use them in you know, the diplomatic options. People think are not going to be ultimately effective. And so people turn to the treasure department. Say okay, what kind of sanctions can we impose here? And you know, as a result, we have now Twenty-eight sanctions programs, you know, ranging from Russia sanctions, Iran, North Korea Venezuela, Syria. Two topics like cyber activity human rights violations. Transnational criminal organizations a whole host of difference. National security issues we have a sanctions program because you have a meeting at the White House. And somebody says we need something between the sort of persuasive effect of diplomacy, and you know, the military hammer of covert action military. Yeah, exactly. And you know sanctions or right in that sweet spot and any near experience how high is the decision making on sanctions will ultimately requires an action by the president to establish a new sanctions program executive order an executive order under statute called IEP. But every sanctions program, you know, with minor exceptions comes from a presidential determination in an executive order to implement a new program as it has a US company. I just thought it has a US company ever challenged the sanctions regime in court and said you're blocking me from doing commerce you and you're under your you're violating my constitutional rights here. Yeah. And the answer is the president has alternate authority under article too. Yeah. Well, I it's it's a little more complicated than that. But but yes, there has been challenges both to programs. It's a whole into specific implementation of of sanctions on individuals or on businesses, and you know, because this is in the realm of national security, and because it is authorized by a statute that congress passed, you know, two decades, we're now courts have upheld the the treasure departments authority to implement these programs. Okay. So let me ask you to talk about something that I think most people don't understand. And that's that. Once sanctions are in place. You don't just sit back and watch. Right, right. The government in general and treasury in particular. I remember you traveling all over the world are very active in enforcing the sanctions. So how does that work? Well, it works because sanctions don't work by themselves. And so what you need to do is be active in try. To ensure that you have people complying with them. I think they're basically four key elements for ineffective sanctions program. One. Is you need a clearly articulated policy goal that you're trying to achieve like trying to persuade around to abandon its nuclear weapons program you need sanctions be part of a broader tool set. So sanctions are not a policy into themselves. They work best. If you have, you know, diplomatic efforts, you have eight efforts, you have messaging efforts, you may even have military posturing, if it's part of a broader effort sanctions can work you need. Good intelligence, you need to know who it is. You're trying to sanction need to know. Whether your sanctions are are working, you know, who's cheating. You know, his genie. Exactly and intelligence is critical and figuring that out and you need international support in the systems, although the United States is you know, as Endo to before sort of the center of the world for the financial system. There's. So much you can accomplish just by leveraging the US financial system. Sanctions are enormously more effective if you have other countries amplifying what we're doing. And so a lot of what I did when I was at treasury, my my predecessors. And my successors are doing is traveling around the world explaining our policy why we're doing what we're doing trying to engender support from other countries and trying to get them to use their own laws and their own ability to persuade the companies and financial institutions and business people in their country to abide by US actions. If not the sanctions that that countries imposing so so without all of this, really hard work. Yeah. You're talking about is there a natural tendency to erosion of sanctions over time. Yeah. Absolutely sanctions. Yeah. It's just they are they're much less effective in their initiation. If you don't have a amplification from partners around the world, and if you. Have sort of grudging acceptance of U S sanctions rather than embrace of US. Sanctions you get evasion. You get both, you know directive Asian, and then a whole bunch of sort of sub Rosa under the table efforts that week in the effectiveness of of USF, she'll what do you think are the keys to getting the international support you need fundamentally what you need is a policy that the sanctions are designed to achieve that others. Subscribe to if you don't have policy agreements on the goal that the sanctions are trying to achieve then it's very difficult to get others to abide by your sanctions, much, less implements their own sanctions that are complementary. And I think this is a this is a very interesting question. Is there a risk associated with the overuse of this tool? Yes, there's no question that there's both a policy risk. And there is. Is I think potentially a an effect on the role of the US financial system and the rule the US dollar the policy risk is, you know, if we use sanctions to try to essentially get others to adhere to our policy choices that they are not otherwise supportive of it. It weakens the effective for the sanctions, and it creates a whole bunch of sort of stray voltage in the relationship because you know, people don't like it. If you put sanctions on their businesses on their banks on their people because they're violating UN sanctions when it's inconsistent with what that country is trying to achieve. So there's a policy cost on the economic side. There is a concern that the use of sanctions will accelerate the development of alternatives to the US financial system into the use of the US to holler. German Foreign Minister just argued for a new mechanism for moving money around the world. So they could avoid USA, particularly with the spectra Ron the EU has been talking about putting in place this special purpose vehicle that would facilitate essentially trade in Iranian oil, and German goods that would be outside of the reach of the dollar and outside the reach of the us financial system. But the the Chinese also are very interested in developing a a means for international transactions that is outside of the dollar. And you know, we're they're not dependence on the us financial system. They're not dependent on clearing trades through the US dollar, but it operates entirely outside of the US reach that is they like that both because it gets them further away from US sanctions exposure. But also amplifies an enhances their role in the world and the. The use of sanctions particularly in situations where you don't have a broad base support for the policy that sanctions are trying to achieve. I think runs the risk of accelerating. The development of these mechanisms that are outside of the us financial system. Another argument for why am all tiled approach is better than bilateral. We're going to take a quick break to hear from our sponsor, then we'll be right back with more of our discussion. David cohen. Do you hear that? That's the sound of the world changing of networks. Connecting enemies evolving. You can't slow it down. You can't avoid it. You can't stop it. But you can stay a step ahead every day. Raytheon engineers are innovating modernizing delivering trusted innovative solutions that protect people information and infrastructure, so as our world changes we can make it a safer place. Okay. So let's talk about three specific cases, David the first is a Ron. Tell us where we are with regard to the reimposition of sanctions on Iran start there. The the basic structure of the Iran. You'll was the Iranians agreed to restrictions on their nuclear program in exchange for this suspension of some very powerful sanctions on Iran's ability to sell its oil into earn revenue from the oil that it sold. We we didn't we didn't eliminate those. Sanctions we suspended those sanctions with the threat of snapback the idea being that they would stat back if the Iranians didn't comply. All I mean, as it turned out the Iranians, we're complying. Over snapping back anyway, and we're snapping them back unilaterally. So it's just the US sanctions are coming back into effect and in particular on November fifth the sanctions on the sale or really the payments for the sale of Iranian oil will be coming back into effect. And the way that works is if you are, you know, China, and you're buying oil from Iran, the Bank that is involved in paying around for that oil is subject to secondary sanctions so between cut off from the US if it pays Iran for the oil that's being imported unless you get what's called a significant reduction exemption, which means that China is significantly reducing the amount of oil that is purchasing from Iran. The US will say, okay, you can pay for this reduced amount of oil. Those sanctions are going back into effect on November fifth and how effective do you? Think those will be in creating pain in the Iranian economy. So they will be effective, but they will will be not as effective. I think as the sanctions were in two thousand fourteen twenty fifteen timeframe because you don't have agreement around the world. In the in the effort. And so what you've got in Europe, essentially is the coalition of the unwilling you've got a bunch of European countries that are there companies are backing away from Iran, not because they want to they had been investing in Iran after twenty fifteen but on threat of being cut off from the US if they don't back away. So you've got this coalition of the unwilling in Europe, you've got a couple of countries China and Russia in particular, who are I think looking for ways to frustrate US policy here. So they will comply to some extent. But I think we'll also be looking for ways to avoid invade US. Sanctions. We should remind people that they were part, and they were part of the coalition first time around, right? We had the the p five plus one, you know, the among the p five where Russia and China, right? They were they were part of the effort back in the Obama administration. There quite decidedly not part of the effort now. Now, and you've got some other countries like India and Turkey that are a little bit on the fence right now, but also are not supportive of the Trump administration's decision to withdraw from the from the Iran deal. So the the sanctions will have an impact there's no question. They will have an impact they noted. There are many European companies particularly the big companies are backing out of Iraq on the Iranian economy itself is quite weak the value of the real has been plummeting. If he gets, you know years of economic mismanagement years of economic mismanagement, they have a, you know, a financial sector that is not all that attractive to begin with. And so it's a it's a difficult place to do business. And there is now the threat that if you do business with Iran, whether it's purchasing around in oil or doing business with other entities in the Iranian economy that you, you know, European company you're you Asian company run the risk of being cut off from the US. And that's a that's a powerful threat. So there will be you know, a a note. Possible impact on the Iranian economy. And what do you think is a different question than sanctions? But what do you think Ron strategy will be going forward? Well, I think that's the real unknown. Here is what you're running strategy will be I think there are a couple of important variables here. One is. I think Iran is trying to figure out what it is that the US is trying to accomplish know, what is the US policy goal here. Is it just to get a better nuclear deal is to get a broader deal that encompasses things like ballistic missile tests, support his Bulla, you know, other misbehavior in the region. Whether it's in Syria Yemen is to bring about so much instability in Iran that that leads to regime change, I think there's been a lack of clarity on the US side on what the ultimate policy goal is. And so from the Iranian perspective. I think they're looking at that. And don't know quite what it is that the US wants here, you know, secretary Pompeo gave a speech a few months ago, where he laid out of their twelve demands that the US has for Ron which are all you know, demands that would be very much in the US national security interests things like stop supporting his Bhalla, stop militia, cyber activity. Stop supporting the Syrian regime, but from the Iranian perspective. I think they look at look at that and say his century was the end of the Islamic Republic of Iran, and you know, so I think you're not going it's not going to be willing to do. Right. That is not a place where the Iranians are prepared to negotiate. So I think they will as I said endure a fair amount of pain from these sanctions, but their willingness to engage with the Trump administration. I think is very much in doubt. And I suspect what they will do is try to wait out the administration. See what happens in twenty twenty what happens in two thousand twenty and see if they can if they can get through this, and they have something now that they didn't have back in two thousand fifteen which is both a sort of safety valve of the the Chinese in particular. But also the Russians who are I think prepared to to help the Iranians get through this period. Where you know back in two thousand fifteen the Russians and the Chinese which own the Iranians they needed to deal at the table, and they also have a sort of diplomatic support around the World Service, psychological support. They are. They're the good guys. They're the good here. Right. And one of the things that was I think quite powerful in the lead up to the Iran deal was that Iran was isolated not just economically. But diplomatically today that diplomatic isolation is, you know, frankly, ours not theirs, and they have you know, some economic support that is long as they stick to the deal as long as they continue to do what they're supposed to do under the deal. They're gonna maintain that. Right. Okay. North Korea your assessment of the sanctions regime that the Trump administration put in place. So I think it has been quite effective. They the Trump administration early on. Did something which I think was long overdue and the right thing to do which was to apply secondary. Sanctions in the North Korea context. The the difficult issue with North Korea has always been that there's not there's not enough economic activity in North Korea to sanction directly the only way to really put significant pressure on North Korea is to put pressure on Chinese entities and the way to do that is to threaten secondary sanctions against Chinese entities. If they continue to do business with designated North Korean entities and early on the Trump administration embrace that and applied those sanctions and did a bunch of work to to ensure that those sanctions were being adhered. Why didn't we do that? We didn't do that. I think principally because we made a choice about where we wanted to apply pressure on China. There were a number of areas of concern. Whether it was the South China Sea Chinese cyber activity Chinese economic activity, and I think the the judgment was we needed to to choose among those all quite serious threats to US national security interests. And if we leaned in hard on Chinese business activity with North Korea harder, I mean, which is not say, we didn't do anything. We were. We were working this issue. But we leaned in very hard on Chinese activity with North Korea. It would come at the expense of trying to get progress on some other issues, which we did get progress on. And I think that was the policy judgment to emphasize on issues over the others. I think the Trump administration. Frankly, I think what they decided to do is just do everything was a kitchen sink approach. What the North Koreans were doing right after test in missile after missile launch. So there was more. So that was becoming more throw. It was becoming more real. And I think the Chinese were were prepared to work with us more on North Korea. Didn't see it as much as a threat to China. They saw more as something that was beneficial to China to try to tamp down this North Korean behavior. And so the playing field was a little bit more favorable. So it seems to me and get your sense on this. It seems to me that because of Kim Jong UN's charm offensive that the sanctions have have eroded, and there's some holes there. Yeah. Is that your sense that is my sense? And I think I think the administration made a serious misstep in the Singapore summit. My view is that the sanctions were starting to really have some serious affect we had the Chinese working with us and the president's took this offer of a summit meeting with Kim Jong UN at off. For that have been on the table for a long time. This was not the first time that the North Koreans had said what we forever have went to meet with the president. And they have never previously been accorded that opportunity because it was a importance leverage that we had over the North Koreans. Get them to do something before you give them a meeting with the president. Here. We had, you know, President Trump. I think quite prematurely jump into this summit with Kim Jong Hoon which and then on the way out of Singapore. Declare that the problem has been solved the effect of that was to weaken the resolve the intentional community to apply pressure on North Korea. Didn't turn it off. But it weakens the sanctions a weaken the willingness of the Chinese to continue to work with us. It weakens others around the world other the Chinese are by far the most important actor here. And I think the effect has been that the sanctions are not nearly as powerful today as. They were nine months ago. And if we get to the point where secretary Pompeo decides that the North Koreans aren't willing to negotiate here. Seriously, how difficult will it be to ratchet those sanctions backup? I think it'll be difficult. I think it'd be more difficult than it was to ratchet them up at the beginning of the administration because you won't have the provocation that you set it earlier of all these missile tests in the nuclear tests to to to point to and I think even more so you'll have others in the Chinese in particular saying, look, you you made this bed. You know? This was you know, we played along with you. We worked with you to impose these sanctions us said this this problem was solved. Now, you're declaring that it's not all that. I think that the the diplomatic underpinnings of a good sanctions program will be harder to to stitch back together. Okay. Really quickly Russia. Yeah. And I don't want to ask about Ukraine related sanctions. Or two thousand sixteen related sanctions. I wanted to ask you about the sanctions related to the use of CW against the former Russian intelligence officer and his daughter in London. There's a set of sanctions that we put into place. There's another set coming presidents got a tough decision to make right, though, the way these sanctions work is there is a initial relatively mild set of sanctions that go into effect upon the initial determination that chemical weapon has been used. And then there's a period of time where the administration is told by statute to get essentially assurances from the country. They use the chemical weapons that that they're never gonna do it again. And you need to have an inspection. You need to have various assurances given that's not going to happen. The Russians are not going to allow this inspection. I suspect they won't provide the assurances and they want make the other together steps they're necessary for the president to certify that the second phase of the sanctions don't need to go into effect. He can waive the second set of sanctions, and they are there. Go into effect. I think right after thanksgiving. What I suspect is going to happen is we will look and see what happens in the election, look and see whether the Russians interfere in the in the midterm elections. And frankly, look the emissions and look at the outcome of the election, and it's going to make a political judgment on how much pain they're willing to endure by waving this second set of sanctions on on Russia, which will be taken into political context here in the United States. Even if it's a sound national security decision, exactly. And if they don't wave these sanctions, there are some very some very powerful economic impacts that will result, including, you know, potentially cutting off the ability of Russian airlines to land in the United States, you know, access to the US financial system, a whole host of things that would be I think the Russians would regard as quite undesirable and. And can only be avoided. If you don't have the certification that the that the Russians would need to come up with under the the CBW statute or the president's just makes just waves. These sanctions and is willing to take the political heat domestically for doing so. Okay, david. Let me switch gears and ask a couple of questions about your time is the deputy director CIA you serve there. The last two years of the Obama administration, incredibly important time. Pretty good job. Right. That's a great. That's a great job. Do a whole pocket. I might as deputy director. See I. Yeah. But more seriously you were there when CIA and the IC came to the conclusions. It did about Russian interference in the election. Right. Was there any down in your mind at that time about the Icees conclusions? None and have you seen anything sense? You left government that has changed your mind in any way. Not at all. I mean, I think the only all that I've seen since I've been out, and I I left at noon on inauguration day has reinforced that high confidence judgements that the Russians interfered in our election at one of the points that I make when I talked to people about that judgments is that the first aspect of the judgment. It's the intelligence community made was at the Russians were looking to interfere in our democracy and nothing to do with Donald Trump or Hillary Clinton. It was about the Russians desire to cause turmoil. United States the second judgment was that they prefer Donald tr. Over Hillary Clinton, and we're trying to undermine what they thought was going to be a Clinton administration. But what sometimes gets lost in all of this discussion is that the intelligence community came to a high confidence judgment that that President Putin directed effort against the United States principally to create turmoil and so- division. It doesn't have to do with Democrats or Republicans. It has to do with undermine in one of the foundations of our democracy. And that was judgements that that we reached. And I have no reason to doubt from from a policy perspective as the deputy director Sierra, you were not in a policy job from a policy perspective. Do you believe we should have hit back harder on Russia? I think we we should have. And an I in in. This was I think a misjudgment in a sense. I think we we should have in December. But there was also a sense that there was a new president coming in and the part of the policy consideration was to leave some headroom essentially for the new president in his administration to demonstrate that this isn't a partisan issue that this is an issue about attacking American democracy, and to sort of leave some, you know, some powder that was dry that the new administration could then could then fire off. And I think it was obviously a misjudging because that's not where the Trump administration went. But I think we in the Obamas. Rations Taylor's Yvonne, ministration held back a little bit on what we could have done. So that there would be womb for the new administration to take action. David. Thank you very much for sharing your time with us. Thank. Thank you. That was David Cohen. I'm Michael morale. These join us next week for another episode of intelligence matter. This has been the intelligence matters podcast with former acting director of the CIA, Michael Morell. Sponsored by Raytheon the podcast is produced by Olivia gases. Jamie Benson and Claire Himes. If you haven't already subscribe rate and review wherever you download podcasts. You could follow the show on Twitter at Intel matters pod and follow Michael at Michael Jay, Merrell intelligence matters. Production of CBS News Radio.

US Iran Trump administration president Raytheon David North Korea Russia Obama administration treasury David Cohen Bank China President Trump Ron terrorist financing Michael Morell CIA
Cannabis laws: why London Mayor Sadiq Khan agrees we need a new public debate

The Leader

16:31 min | 10 months ago

Cannabis laws: why London Mayor Sadiq Khan agrees we need a new public debate

"From the Evening Standard in London this is the leader Ostlund cons ready for an evidence. Based Conversation on legalizing cannabis that have now legalized cannabis. Our Investigations Editor David Cohen speaks to the leader suspected terrorists and people of interest are still kept under some form of investigation plot functional that heavy that big made the bruising they'd be Wells Fargo ended Dokodo UK Slash Komen in a moment city comes you ton talking about David Cohen. Two Countries where cannabis has been legalized at the time said he conned said he base compensation about whether cannabis use should become lawful adds weight to the argument that it licensed outlets and decriminalizing its consumption include the ability to control mixed from places overseas such as Canada about half of cannabis on his next story but he joins me now and David the man of London seems to have changed his mind on cannabis I think it's quite brave for politicians these days because they do risk being criticized I sit about visiting parts of the world that have now legalized cannabis David where did you go with and what kind of things did you find when I went to Colorado and then also to Canada which is the first Western country to legalize and did so in October Denver's particularly booming now because of the regulated I mean this is you cannot just walk into shops you have to show id Abbas they beautifully laid out and there's no consumption on mkx impact is felt in fact that house prices have gone up employment has gone up all the paraphernalia around vaping canopus which is a whole other argument and the impact that that has lungs so I think one thing people quite concerned about I suppose I I guess it has to in order to operate as a business well this is assessing cannabis which quite often introduces them very young into clad away from drug gangs if we make it legal then trying to help former drug dealers into the trade and this trampled upon and these a whole communities that have been negatively affected facility in Toronto for example I met the chief thing spinoffs there has already been some changes to allow people to use on the positive side the positive for four uh is what they call skunk skunk is the cannabis in countries like Uruguay they have limited thc to nine percent using higher and higher thc content cannabis evidence so far is that underage use has not increased in that we need to wait a little bit longer and this is where the call for an evidence-based eight people were killed and forty before the London Bridge attack in which eight people ended the two thousand seventeen atrocity the carve-up Makalu crafty see refuses to criticize recommendations they include a core legislation to outlaw the possession of the most serious medical training for police and more busways for the security agencies to review the threat day coach correspondent. Kristen cogs been looking at the coroner's report just one edified something of a loophole legislation at the moment where not prohibited under the legislation at the moment is material that glorifies Dacian that passed the factory should consider education to to outlawed it there to say the outset that the the coroner found and my five in the security services you did identify some areas of their practice that they could perhaps work on one of the areas that he suggested that perhaps instead of suspending investigation as happened twice in the case of investigation they must be incredibly difficult to prevent an attack like an incredibly hard job to the secret service and the police have to do here in London and across the UK and that the police and security serves again finds itself dealing with something very similar and before they get to fruition the corner in this report made some suggestions honesty for Londoners and for the cities around the World Islamic terrorism go for glory in the Rugby World Cup against South Africa in Japan it's been an incredible Powell takes a look back at England's journey in Yokohama thousands of England fans of traveled millions more will be watching at home head the tournament the tournament GonNa End England captain in foul is also keeping Asia the mental side of it builds up from England go into the final having not lost a single match cigna peaking at just the right time they pull off a Nazi sensational performance against blacks great dynasty and of team by by beating not opponents in South Africa but correspondent doesn't think the springboks of anything in their locker that a baby without showing any of the sort of form England did there's a lot of expectation gene campaign is a far cry from the disaster of the fifteen woke up wearing and crushed is I'm with knowledge Japan was hosting An ex world but he's been around the block And he's done he's achieved everything in the game the greatest ever win in Twenty fifteen I've aside for evening Stein to we'll have the am just ask for the news from the Evening Standard and that's Alita back at four marketing.

cannabis David Cohen Evening Standard London England UK London Bridge Denver Toronto Canada Rugby Asia Editor Wells Fargo Colorado Abbas Kristen South Africa Uruguay Dacian
20VC: Techstars Founder David Cohen on Why Seed Investing Is A Different Asset Class To Venture, What Makes The Best And The Worst Board Members & Why Every Company Has To Have A Pessimist In The Room

The Twenty Minute VC

30:54 min | 1 year ago

20VC: Techstars Founder David Cohen on Why Seed Investing Is A Different Asset Class To Venture, What Makes The Best And The Worst Board Members & Why Every Company Has To Have A Pessimist In The Room

"We all buying for another week here on the twenty minute with me, Harry stabbings, and I need your help. I would love to make this show better in any way. So whatever you will force are on changes improvements. Let me know on Instagram at H Stubbings nineteen Ninety-six with tubes. I really would surprise that. But to all guests today, and I had him on the show over two years ago for the first time since he's enjoyed IPO's billion dollar access. And I couldn't be happier to welcome back. David Cohen found uncoached Techstars the worldwide network that helps entrepreneurs succeed today. David is bad hundreds of startups, including the lights of Chetniks out. Uber send grid twi- Leo class pass pill pack, and many more in total. These investments have gone on to create more than eighty billion dollars in valley. I'm protect stars David was a co-founder of pinpoint technologies which was acquired by Zoll medical corporation in one thousand nine hundred nine later, David was the founder and CEO of F E amusing service that was sold to Sonning swab. And if that wasn't enough David's also the co author with Bronfeld of do more faster Techstars lessons to accelerate your startup. Can I do you have say Houston is wonderful Mr. broad felt to the interest? David now, if a two years ago, I serve preciado that broaden. It really means a lot, and we mentioned some incredible companies in the insurer that and I wanna spend a minute talk about Brax first corporate called for startups brags founders Henry can Patrick builds a payments business in Brazil found themselves rejected for corporate cod when they are in y combinator they decided to build Brax with instant online. Sign up, no founded liability required and limit is ten to twenty times higher than standard cards. Yes. Pretty incredible. I know and you can sign up for bribes today and get caught fees waived by entering the code Harry during sign up on the really is such a special service and speaking of special, did, you know that there are five job openings for every one developer in the US. No wonder hiring great engineers is impossible. And that's why my friends that tell them come in Tom known as you're dedicated partner and quickly building skilled remote engineering teams. How do they deliver speed on quality? We'll tell them we'll does this by focusing on everything necessary to successfully source setup and support these teams. From little things like managing office. The gist steaks too big things like benefits legal and community. And they've developed this proprietary and comprehensive remote teams solution based on decades of experience building remote teams across multiple continents. So they really know what works don't take my word for it. Taking the words of van bright. Former twenty guests hymns dial on mall customers and lovers of terminal, and you can find out more stay at Tom dot ISO. I'm finally, I've always been a big history, man. And so I wanted to talk about coolie the global law firm built around startups and venture capsule since forming the first venture fund in Silicon Valley tutti, his four more venture capital funds than any other law firm in the world with more than fifty years working with VC's, they help VC's former manage funds make investments in the handle the myriad of issues that can arise through out of funds life cycle. So to learn more about the number one most active law firm, representing VC bond companies going public had I Cooley dot com. And also go to go dot com. But enough for me, I'm so excited Steve into this show. So without further. Do I'm delighted to hand over to David. Cohen found on co-ceo at tax does. You have now arrived at your destination. David it is beyond the plaza tab, you on the show again for vice bash around you say, thank you so much for joining me against a Harry, huge pleasure to be back. And right after the big news came out of your new fund. Congratulations. And so exciting that you've got that gun. Well, thank you so much. Indeed, it it's very exciting. But I want to start on news. So I want to start with those who maybe didn't listen to all first appetite. So I'd love to start with the middle on you. And how did you make you four into what I most definitely now Hulu wonderful world of venture. And really how you came to found textiles. Sure. So cook background is I've had one job interview in my entire life. And I got that job and decided I never wanted to see that again. Harry. As an entrepreneur pretty much my whole life and had some luck in some success with some early companies sold two out of three and had one failure in there. But started angel investing builds up a track record, and then really Techstars I think of it as my fourth startup. So I'm just entrepreneuring here stumbling through the venture capital of ten eleven years ended Techstars at this point. Absolutely in my web. What a journey has been. But I would love to kick off today. David with the people that really make happen for us. The the venture investors being the founders themselves we've China before about the foul you'd like to backing us book the moment of integrity. So I've like him on pack this, David. So what does the moments of integrity mean for? Ye so people do silly things area. Right. They make mistakes. Sometimes they lie cheat a little bit or whatever and someone sometimes might be confronted with something. And I think there's this moment. I call the moment of integrity where perhaps something's come too late or you're asked to direct question. And in that moment that is the moment of integrity is still I. Time you're asked about it. Let's say you're on a board. And you're confronting a CEO about something what they say. And that moment of integrity is how you can really tell Alker symbol behave and their value. And if they own up to it and say, Yep. I made that the, and here's what I learned. And here's I'm doing about it. That's one thing. But if they say, no that's not true and hide from it. And then it comes to light later through multiple conversations. Maybe the third of its conversation or in some other way that shortly. You know? Yes, that is a thing that happened you're dealing with someone that will actually cover it up and sort of dig deeper, and I think my insight is that in Knoxville investing. We're all gonna make mistakes and in that moment of integrity. Just owning them the steak talking about what you learned from. It is really he orces down the line dealing with it a different way. Now, the BT for me of doing this show that I also got people like you actually just devices the moments of integrity doesn't prove to be that positive outcome. The eastern they have maybe a more defensive denying approach. What do you maybe as an investor or? Member. What's the right response? Then in terms of subsequent action is it to address from straight away at income to their own realize ation, how should that subsequent action B gift to measure the response based on what's actually going on? So without getting into specifics of a particular situation. Yes, sort of hard to know how you want to be. But I think I've used phrases like, it's let's just talk about it. Now, if this is something that, you know, something about, and if they tell me now, it's not true that didn't happen or you know, that's not the case, then I tend to believe them because I I lead with trust. And if I find out later that that tros will violated, right? That's the challenge for our relationship. So I come back, and I say I asked you about that. And I feel like that was the moment when you could have said, yes, this is what happened in this is how dealing about tobacco or feed defensive or deny and that causes me to trust you less. So again, we all do things wrong. But if I can trust that we're gonna be able to talk about that openly, especially in a board or investor context or this works and personal life as well. Then I think. It's easy to rebuild. Almost no matter. What the transgression was. Absolutely. I do agree in terms of that rebuilding. But it's funny because we spent father catchers found a we loved see that. And I've heard you speak before about when it comes to kind of the born or the leadership so to speak whereas wanting to have as you've cooled it the pessimist in the room, so take the characteristics and traits of this pessimist. Let's start with that. I think it's super key. We're actually just debriefing on situation where we felt like we didn't have ram. Must end the and it went on. And what what I mean by this is not just having a naysayer someone that says now, I don't like that. Because those people are easy to find. But it's trusted advisers who are key part of your team that have a real seat of the table have row respects. So might be your general counsel, your chief financial officer, those are often people that can be pessimists in the room, a more more member that just isn't always gung ho about everything. But it's very it's awful in the company, and this is important because you want balance right entrepreneurs. They're very optimistic. Investors tend to be optimistic chewed. We wouldn't do this job unless we were unreasonably optimistic about good things that can happen. And so not just having a Nacer, but having someone that you really trust and believe in that room to have those conversations. Should we answer that market? Should we use the strategy? And why not is really he and I literally seen it Jilin tire companies by just being too many optimists hanging out spending each other up. I think that you kind of really big in troubling question for me. I always off myself is how are you? Silence. When maybe assessing portfolio company from the perspective between really buying into that mission invasion of the founder us is maybe being more realistic as to when something's not working. How do you think about that? Balance other any leading indicators to suggest either direction just separate the two. And I'd say if you don't believe in that optimistic vision and future, then why are you investing? I mean, that's that's just the anti-gay the game. You have to believe in that. But I think at the same time as you move towards that goal, right? That program to set long-term vision having people that can inject some realism were probably not going to triple revenue and three months, and we're probably not gonna do it more profitably than we're doing today is helpful because you can overspend you can over resource as you move towards his vision. But I I would separate the two and say don't do it. If you're not a believer in that vision and a huge optimist about it. Totally. I mean, one of the environments that we kind of discussed Sarah's being a case where it's necessary support itself, which is one of my ninety passions. Probably one of the many reasons, I'm still single, David. But tax. Styles. Binds many found is stages and often it's kind of the stages. So when do you feel is the right time for companies to establish aboard? That's a lot of debate. Well, it's the right time for Ye yesterday, I think that companies need to put an end soon as possible. And I think sprinters have the sentencing to think of the board as this overlord controlling things, and they can fire me and all that. But that's not necessarily the case. Right. So even a company that's just a few people and just getting started maybe with a small seed around. I think it's very very additive to have a born board doesn't have to have control necessarily. I don't think that has to be the dynamic. So you could appoint board members at your own pleasure. Right. That works because you want them there. And maybe you're giving them snack Woody or whatever. But there are people that are independently thinking about the business they're not living in it every day. And why would you not want to have really smart experienced people around the table? So I think too many companies wait too long, and I would really do that as soon as possible even in very early seed stage company. No, I came to agree more. I always think. That inherent structure that brings his side beneficial, but from your experience kind of moving policy going to now we have a board, and what's the key to a highly efficient and successful board in your having sat on so many successful ones back to some of the ones that have done better send grid. Probably an easy examples there in the news again, you know, what's really serve on that board for seven or eight years on I think that namic and building the board really fought solely was was the key. So, you know, we work for the CEO, and there were multiple, you know, on the board through three different CEO's and that company and managing transitions. But when Nazi oh had the full support of the board. We worked for that CEO. And that's how we thought about it. We all had a job we were there to be a resource to that person. And we were not there to tell them what to do or control over there to support them. We also had a good off line set of relationships. So it was easy to call up Piran from Bessemer or Orion found group and have offline conversations about what was going on in. How we were. Going to the work together to help make the company better so positive dynamic between the people who have the right motivations right incentives, who all view it as we're here to support the CEO until we don't when we don't need to make a change in the beginning to support that new person. He's at them being on the sangre booth seventy s with with kind of the changes that everything had happened on the vote that does often happen. I'm achieved. His you yourself will change over the seven years with the wisdom knowledge that you pay how scene you'll Stalin of being a bull member change over the many is now that you've been in VC involvement of that's when I was first four meetings and learning how to do that what I was doing. I was a big listener. Right. I would really try to listen and understand and speak less. Awesome. Which I know see is generally appreciate by the way, if you're person who says few things, but those things are impactful that's probably the best dynamic from their perspective. And so that's what I always tried to do. And then I sort of evolved in realize that really the value of these meetings is the strategic value, and there should be healthy to be the conversation. In between people. So it back to Hungary case rate. Byron is example, Ethan is partner. They're incredible masters of software as a service, right and really understood AmEx them how to grow the business endure take companies public. So I was learning a lot about those things from them. But when it came to the product strategy, I think it's having those healthy debates and being willing to challenge each other in public in in the room there with the staff and with the CEO is very healthy. And I think I do that more now than I did early on. I thought my role is to drop a wisdom Bob once in a while as I said, the BT this show being Sigane advice wisdom from people. He tell me what would you advise me having just as she my first board seat? What would that kind of cool was advice be to me looking to grow and develop as member my quarter, vice her it would be don't screw it up? Now, just for yourself look to help and recognize the value that you bring. But what are you bring to the table that the other word members ours and really try to take a role take a job be active and say, I want to actually go and do that and help you with that. So we need. Source in you executive. I'm going to own that I'm going to go do it. That's what's really helpful. And then, you know, recognize what you do. And don't know. I think as did all your career you'll become expert in some things and you'll be constantly learning about others. And so the worst form of board member is someone with confidently held this information. They were they they believe this is the case. And this is how this works. But actually, it's high confidence that low accuracy. So, you know, health where you know, how to help and own things. I think is the advice. I give Newport members channel someone advise me. They it's absolutely finds be comforted in your beliefs. I as long as you believe one hundred percent, right. Okay. Thanks about one. That's great. I. Many as I said, many many Bouman busy was with. This is a favorite of mine to us. He's the best pool men the with them. What did you think made them so special? There's so many just pick a couple. I mean, I mentioned Byron from best merges really deep knowledge of Al softwares of service and willingness to teach others and then guys at foundry, obviously Jason Brad feld chase mental son. Just terrific, you know, high each Hugh people, so this is a big part of it. It's not just the business acumen. But it's the interpersonal relationships, and they're just so strong with those and helping CIA's navigate challenging situations of PR crisis. Now, even change in leadership and serves house off the team about it. And just being there for them. I learned so much from the guys have found out now push their incredible installed on foods is one of my favorite books. But I wanna make one land Deepa from the founders themselves to the deals that they bring kind of a dominant theme that I'm seeing definitely more. Today's the rising quantity of nights. But then also the Viney rations on the nice themselves. Selves we before. And you said about the tones much ING the story statement. What did you mean? By this tons matching the story specifically maybe in relation to the nights. Yeah. The dynamic that's out. There is obviously notes convertible dead safeness things like that are being used a lot more frequently and the challenges that they are often described as a bridge right bridge to somewhere hopefully is not a bridge to nowhere. They're trying to get to that next round. But they need a little more time to do it. A little more progress on the business and often, you know, the story comes in. If you're an investor, you know, well, we've got this big round. We're gonna raise ten or twenty million soon and people are really interested in that's happening. But just need a couple of months of runway to get there. And so we're raising a note for a million and those situations Trump's take more and more. I think it's important that the terms matched that story. Right. And so, you know, one of my approaches investor is trying to look for inconsistencies in the story. And so if I say to them, well, that's great. I don't really do uncapped. Notes was put a cap on it, you know, something reasonable today. Maybe it's ten million dollar value. But they're talking about raising ten million at fifty million. What's hard for them to accept those terms because they see some kind of signal right on price. So they're often looking for uncapped note since one solve I've used for for something like this is to use the terms to make sure that they matched the story. A meaning if you don't raise that round what happens you're very confident that that's going to happen and say six months what happens if it doesn't the term should match that story Koss, let's run with that. In the cases where it doesn't happen. They lay out subsequent around like they said, they would what is the answer that they give him what would wanting spat full kind of when it doesn't go to plan so to speak. Yeah. Well, they're usually will it's going to happen. And so that's why I don't want to signal price with the note say, okay, great. Well, let's since it's going to happen. Let's just say that in twelve months if it hasn't happened that the capital be ten millions is that work for you. And this is where you really find out what's going on because the natural answer should be. Of course. You know, I'm very confident we're gonna raise surrounded to fee, and there's no signal there on the price at ten because it's only if it doesn't happen. And I have plenty of time to make it happen. So you would expect them to give you a quick. Yes. If they say, well, you know, how 'bout forty or now I really wanna go with Chapman. Then you're you're actually reading something in them. Which is they don't actually have the confidence that they're saying they have and you can do this with things like acquisition bridges to acquisition. I see the same dynamic. So when you're getting a story from the entrepreneurs about what's going to happen. Try to find ways to make the terms mash that story and the eventuality that story may not happen can us. We had my Maples on Shane. And he said that bridges nine thousand nine percent will most often to the majority of bridge to know at would you agree with that from your experience? And how do you think about bridge? Financing say, yeah. My stats early ninety eight percent. So. It's somewhere in that zone. They often they often Arbor just to know where and so I was trying to think of it is I was funding this company in isolation. And I was doing this today, and there's no other capital around the table, which is through Jalan closing. But this type of note in what were the terms v that I would want that are reasonable. So I I do think as an investor you have to be weary of these things. And it's it's much better to participate in the full round that really gives the company that next year or two at least a runway rather than a few months because often those go the wrong way is sorry. Do you have to you mentioned runway? There is often something that I'm pretty bullish on actioning. And it's how long do you think is the right amount of time to raise four in terms of runway stage of the company and the other assets company has, but I think the seed stage I look for a minimum of eighteen months today. I prefer two years actually sort of seed series a investing. I think if you're raising for year, you know, you're back out there in six months, and that's not what we want you doing as investors won't you building business. Totally. No, I'm with you on the twenty four months sat but I do want to avoid. In the great fire on I wanted to discuss the incredible stadium Tunstall's that we've seen now is one of the many impressive stunts fifty exhilarates is in thirteen countries. I have to say the first thing that comes to my mind is my word with such massive companies coming out of these accelerators in the textiles platform. How does one think about reserve on occasion, as you know, Harry, we're a little difference? You know, we're not your typical VC fund that has a highly concentrated portfolio of twenty or so investments or investing in about five hundred companies a year at this point across these shifty accelerators like you mentioned, and of course, that is a different type of asset. Then the classic venture asset or sort of series eight positions that are concentrated. So for those investments, we think of that as just a consistent performing asset which sets up the opportunity to fall on. So in some of those companies, you know, eighty percent of our accelerator companies are going to raise around from somewhere. We're in much fewer of that. Right. And we're generally color investment capital. So we're following along. Along with the market, cheap or ownership may be increasing a little bit. When we make a big investment, which we do we go all the way through sort of series, A and B as well. You know, usually were the second biggest shack and around. But when we do make a larger investment we actually reserve one to why. So for every dollar we put we keep a dollar reserves. And then we were time to reallocate that as needed and think about our reserves as a strategic part of what we do. I'm always a slightly questioning how to determine the right result strategy one of this often slice these clients can companies kuechly in kind of concentrating capital accordingly. Jeff From Compass said that the seed stage that's ridiculous high because the data is kind of inconsistent in unpredictable. How do you think about that theory chefs at the siege? Think when we're sort of small investors, we have a bucket of reserves. And we just think about that as a big bucket, right? And we try to manage to add as our our companies mature, we don't think about it as on individual companies in our scale. It's any sense to do that output again with the larger investments. We're reserving mole under one. I think it's a process of looking at those investments every three or six months in looking at the conditions, right? What is this company likely to need which ones do we have the most sort of belief in? And you wanna hold your reserves for the companies that match sort of where you think the value is over time. Sure, speaking Kaplon occasion, I spoke to one of you will find tastic columnists, Nicole before the show, and she also great question being when you live now at the tax dollars, Johnny resources, maybe once in office to go to one of the worst. What would you have done differently, David? Yeah. Well, I have a generally negative reaction to sort of looking back and saying what do differently, but I guess I'll do it in this case. I I don't think you should look back. I think shows look forward. But you know, if we recognize the scale ability of the model that we created I think we probably would have tried to have more capital formation in a more consistent way early on. We today have sort of unified capital structure at Techstars where it's just Techstars. We have capital we. It it in the accelerator level at high velocity. And then fall on. But I think you know, separating that a little bit more, and sort of owning the celebrator pieces part of what we do and then physician to the market that were more like an all venture fund with seed and series a follow on probably would have been a little bit different way to build a business. We sort of eventually figured it out and got there. But I think that would've allowed us to capture more value we were creating early on. And ultimately again, I don't like to look back. You know, I love where the value has gone are limited partners and investors that we've been able to create value for. But I think structurally, I might have done things differently. If I really understood the scale, it would be at today, speaking of the Alpes themselves, I to Jamie's parents now found Gina ESPN insomnia full of this show, and he also questioned say being in some of the foundational challenges that you've had to overcome with the scaling so to speak. I think foundational sorta challenges probably it would name to one is capital formation. I mean, look to get to the scale that we're at you just sort of. Always trying to figure out where's the capital gonna come from to be at the scale where outright were investing defeat seventy five million dollars a year just exhilarated level plus a follow on capitol. It's a lot of capital, and it's time for that capital to return. So, you know, I think that has been sort of a constant struggle over the last eleven years every three or four years we figure out a new way to get to the next level. Good. That is a challenge. Anytime you go for global scale. Then it's one we've been fortunate to grow up to this point. I think the second maybe is more interesting, which is attitude internal desire right were two hundred fifty or so people now, you know, when we were five or ten people. There's a core group that really love doing the thing we do in boulder and really low that's the family feel of it. And as you get bigger, and you do more you have to be aligned with everybody internally that you want that. And that that gross is important. You know, we have a value which is called E before quantity. I want to do everything. Well, but we also want that quantity in may have this global emissions. And so I think getting everybody aligned. About doing business. Not just in boulder and not just in L A, New York, Chicago, right? But also in the UK and in Berlin. And now in Singapore and Bangor, right? It's sort of people wondering is that what I wanna do. And having to get them alignment that at time. Of course, we built an executive team in a group that really is line without, but that was a a real challenge to sort of decide to grow in that big way. Now, I'm cellini, and I can see across seventy countries in seventy different salaries is not as challenge, but I do want to move into my favorite limited any absolute being the quickfire round. Davidson, you know, I say statement, you give me your media to slip out, sixty seconds. Oh, last ready. I love this part of the show. I'm ready. I so I'm flying to bold. I need a book for the flight. What must I read and why go get the soul of money? I don't remember the author terrific book that changed the way that I think about money, and how you use it and how it impacts others too interested in ought to ask. How did it change the way you think about money it makes you think differently bell? What you buy as a consumer? What you spend is who you are sort of the big takeaway and tone strategy. You know, how much is enough all of those kind of issues. Tell me a story about a time that was transformational to you as an individual. I guess I'd get to. I think a lot of us get these big things that happen to us when we're relatively young. And I just remember being introduced to the idea entrepreneurship, and I was in my father saw office and doing data entry on payroll systems for restaurants and just serve realizing how these people are employed because of what I dad is doing the work these for clients, he actually cares about them. And just seeing you know, how he sort of put others I really affected how I thought about life and entrepreneurship. So I just remember that question from you'll potent and McColl, how do you get through your Email? I started the bottom and I go to the top. I always struggled figure out. Why people struggle so much with their Email in ten thousand messages, but I do all the things that we talk about it used to list, I get inbox zero at least. Every couple of days, and you know, my super weapon is a have an amazing assistant who helps three is some of the Email, a huge user of labels and rules inside g mail. Tell me what do you believe the most around you disbelieve believe that angel investing seed investing as a completely different thing than Notre capital? I don't think it's part of venture capital. I think that it's a different type of asset which has different needs and requirements and has a different performance characteristic people lump in seed investing investing with venture, and it's just fundamentally different than I think the world is starting to figure that out. What makes you best day it on the other side? What makes us stay dust as being on the twenty minutes to see that's not about since up there. I love nothing more than being in. Whether it's a board meeting or just a one on one meeting with an entrepreneur and having impact, right? And seeing is light up like, yes, that's the right answer. And it's funny because it's usually not that I thought something brilliant. It's that I was taught. Talking about different options, and it's sort of salt solves and the entrepreneur figures out. So that's always the best when you have real impact as investor in it affects so many others. And I don't know the worst days are the ones that big PR crisis United something's going on in a portfolio company, or it's just something's not work any shot a company down, the it's no fun. And unfortunately, we all find this out on this business at some point in your company that just doesn't work and look up, and you say, wow. Yeah, we lost three million dollars there than that. Number feels good. I can't imagine totally once you'll see propound date. I can skip a night of sleep and function. Okay. Says if yeah this helps me a lot with their national trouble. I can't skip to I go to skip the second one on zombie. But I can skip one and function. So when I travel internationally else me a lot because I'm really fine when I land, and I I don't feel like I need much sleep one day. Again. I I can't do that two times a week or something. But I could do it pretty well, and sort of helps me a lot I travel that's insane. And then that's finish say on your. Recent publicly announcing vestment David m why did you say, yes, sure? So that would probably be order Mark, which came out of our celery program here in boulder, actually, so Los Angeles based company is infrastructure for ordering food online. You know, there are so many systems out there that helpless order food, but through a restaurant chore. It's you know, you gotta deal with all of them to be in the market. So I love love with the business was a love infrastructure have been a big investor on that type of business where it's really infrastructure for something kick is huge trend. And of course, you know, you just should've loved the founders, and he loves the hustle on you wanna work with people. So it had all characteristics. David so many of them each you'll friends before the show, so many great things back. Thank you so much for joining me again, stay David totally. My pleasure. Look with the fund and thanks for doing that. You know, it's it's a it's a resource for all of us. We really appreciate it. What if you episode that was with David? And I want to tell the show say she's saying he's him. He's been so supportive inclined to me behind the scenes, so David I really do. So appreciate that. If you'd let see more from David you can find him on Twitter at David Cohen. Likewise. I'd love see behind the scenes here at the twenty minute VC. You can do that on Instagram out H Stubbings nineteen Ninety-six with two UB's. But before we leave each day, and we mentioned some incredible companies in the insurer that and I want to spend a minute talk about Brax. The first Cooper called for startups. Brags found is Henry can Patrick builds a payments business in Brazil and found themselves rejected for corporate cod when they were in y combinator they decided to build BreX with instant online sign up. No, founded liability required an limits. Ten to twenty times higher than standard calls. Yes. Pretty incredible. I know and you can sign up for bribes today and get caught fees waived by entering the code Harry during sign up on a c really is such a special service and speaking of special, did, you know that there are five job openings for every one developer in the US no-one the hiring great engineers. Is impossible. And that's why my friends that tell him and he'll come in. Tom known is you'll dedicated Paulaner and quickly building skilled remote engineering teams. How do they deliver speed on quality? We'll tell moved us. It's by folksy on everything necessary to successfully souls setup and support these teams from little things like managing office suggest steaks too big things like benefits legal and community. And they've developed this proprietary and comprehensive remote teams solution based on decades of experience building remote teams across multiple continents. So they really know what was but don't take my word for it. Taking the words event. Bright, Fulmer, twenty guests hymns dial pot on mall, customers and lovers of Tom. No. And you can find out more at Tom dot, I'm finding I've always been a big history Mont. And so I wanted to talk about coolie the global law firm built around startups and venture capsule since forming the first venture fund in Silicon Valley to his full more venture capital funds than any other law firm in the world with more than fifty years working with VC's, they help VC's former manage funds make investments in the handle the myriad of issues that can arise through out of. Funds life cycle to learn more about the number one most active law firm, representing VC bond companies going public had I q dot com. And also go to go dot com. I really do. So appreciate you cheating, and I call them wait to bring you another fantastic founders Friday this Friday.

David Harry founder founder and CEO Techstars CEO partner David Cohen Instagram Tom dot US BT Brax Houston developer Brazil boulder executive
TechFan 406 - Macstock 2019

TechFan

56:07 min | 1 year ago

TechFan 406 - Macstock 2019

"DOC The tech podcast number four hundred six Max Doc twenty nine nine here with David Cohen on his laptop with his headsets recording a show said it sounds bad for some so I'm not used to recording with headset this how you usually do is this is normally use yeah. Obviously we've got more than one plus. I've got an actual boom mic over my head. When recording and you know you send me your audio file so I'm not recording you over wire or anything like that so it's the direct audio mind still sounds better because the microphone that I use so much better? The problem with me is on every week. I'm not really sure where I'm going to be called so let's have a mobile sets up. I've started now. Having laptops condit distributes around the place where I might be so. I've got something on US configuring or drag something with me so you're on John. That's blue to assume this this was this is yeah. This is a this is what I use for work for conference calls and is Bluetooth but it's one of these ones where it comes with its own Bluetooth dangle so so yeah. Your APP is actually seen as a U._S._B.. Device is exactly yeah because this way if you've ever used Bluetooth to record a podcast are at your computer sounds pretty crappy but if you use these jungles that comes with this as a Jabra headset I firstly there's no configuration you just plug it in the it worked qualities flow. That's a little laptop so what I usually do you send me your file and ended up in a garage band. I turned down the trouble and I bring the boost up and then I add some compression to it right that helps a lot yeah otherwise it kind of generally sound a little tinny yet but for a we literally plug it into your laptop and we're done we're ready to record exactly yeah and <hes> you know guys guy surly say with the my podcast and he's Br far more intricate sets up which is done me wrong is amazing. He's got livestream to pare down version of what he usually. You know he's got a he's got a an audience face and probably Mike's and it looks and sounds really good but it's not knowing as possible as I was traveling on the plane with this lot so I didn't want to have too much with now. You don't WanNa carry too much and at the end of the day is about the content and it's not about the gear case. It's not about the content on so it is <hes> little after two o'clock for stay on at the Max Doc Expo well Mexican conference that much of an expo or do we see here. They've got a table setup behind us. Were recording coup kitten that people have been kind of examining table morning tomorrow. They're doing <hes> examples of you know installing ram or S._S._D.'s and that ought to be pretty good yes. It's something I'm interested in that well. It's something that many people might not seen live. They might have watched a youtube video but it's different having somebody from those questions so yeah. I'm looking forward to that. <hes> of course they gave us a whole bunch of toolkits to give away for the O._D._B._C. my Mac <hes> quiz which we've just completed and was very very entertaining. Nothing ever had a good time. I <hes> I had fun doing it is a little bit on purpose. Low Key compared to last year <hes> this. I thought my my joke at the beginning would go over better than it did. Here's my joke people. Apple just announced a security bug found in safari and chrome web browsers that are randomly air-dropping private and incognito history data to random people in close proximity okay. I thought that'd be pretty funny. Yeah I think some people thought about it for a minute and then laughed I said so I sit to Alexander last night when we arrived here in in Crystal Light said you'll notice the White Wifi and the hotel slows down later in the evening just reasons that people are streaming video and many people is not Netflix Youtube to <hes>. I started watching last night at the hotel Netflix. It was about drilling and Corey where the asteroid hit that killed off the dinosaurs down there all right Central America and it was pretty interesting book was falling asleep so I know she wasn't interested in it but there <hes> I have a my ipad probably watch on the on the flight home is flatter documentary that they had on net flicks. I had was interesting from a wacky point of view. That's I just I can't stand that level level of what is this guy doing over there. He's going up to things that are clearly closed and he's pacing back and forth looking around join casing the joint over there guys zero. Are you casing the joint. He's he's pacing back and forth he he he spilled soda all over himself. There's a bathroom and they have paper towel. Yeah we're recording right now yeah. Were you doing a little bit after that though so sloppy guy well I can't really I can't really never singled anyway because I managed to fill spill coffee all them. I share on the plane the way over and that was early in the flight so I had to sit there slightly coffee. No it was it it didn't Kinda soaked through but I had a big coffee street right down here right down the middle and then walk through the airport and then go in high the car and drives to the hotel looking like trump. The face APP is kind of making its round here at Mac stock. The funny thing is I was using this apple year ago Brooke reminding me she goes. We're using this a burqa. Why is this a thing now extremely blew up and a lot of people are I don't know if it's right or wrong but concerned with privacy that this data is being shared with servers in Russia because the the developers who by the way don't live in Russia? They live here in the U._S.. I believe are Russian in origin but this I think I think some people are conflicting this with the you know the election scandal in in hacking and in generally when you think of Russia you don't think of Nice people and also it's while I there's a reason sometimes people do host stuff. Overseas is regulations that are a little Taylor and you're and it's harder if if somebody if somebody wants to accuse you of breaching a local regulation it's harder for them to get the data because Russian the Russian services may not cooperate in giving them information doesn't necessarily necessarily mean that there's something going on. That's the problem. I don't understand why this is. Let's say they are keeping the data. What is the data your photos? That's been aged are officially. I don't understand why this would be any kind of a privacy issue. You're sitting nude photos or something happening. The context of that I read something recently about Amazon's Ring Service Amazon is that bring Doro system and apparently they've been proce- at all skiing and signing contracts with local police department to promote the ring as a security solution and also giving the police departments access to local ring cameras data so that they can they take you undertaking investigation they can request that they from the ring owners may have promoted these cameras see without having to go through a court order or a warrant or something like that because persons could basically say arrive crime happens in this area we know who had can who has a ring camera and we can use the APP that ring of given them to kind of content that people directly and also the footage which oversee remove a level of judicial oversight and I think the concern is that the privacy groups say that the problem with this thing is not necessarily that it in posselt each individual incident is a breach privacy. The problem is dyson builds up over time and that data can then be taken need for other things like for instance programming face recognition and that might not be something you want your photos to be useful biases face recognition tools people who aren't you. There's been a <hes> an effort lately and actually some municipalities actually ban facial recognition software <hes> I don't know I don't know how I feel about that. I don't really want the government to know wherever I'm at just because he recognized my face but the amount public well I I think we've got a slightly different perspective in the U._K.. Because we've had you have cameras everywhere cameras everywhere for a long time however I think people will be less normalized that if those cameras actually identified you wherever you went and this is the difficulty is that once the face recognition takes shots being used is being used beyond the extreme abuse cases we all support which is identifying terrorist or identify somebody who's not GonNa Watch list or identify somebody who's escaped from prison or finding somebody who perhaps is known to have or some of those kidnapped exactly and it becomes more general well. The police will use it all the time for everything and they always know where you are and they can then always anytime you get it accused of anything they can always stop pulling in data that they have to try and construct circumstantial case against your fingers what people are concerned about and so I have some sympathy for the idea of saying well. Let's always take you stand. Let's always put the proper precision price to stop. That kind of creeping death effects where it's cumulatively over time. Everyone's privacy guess raced. I have some sympathy with that I do too. I just don't know if my concerns and that's going to outweigh the perceived benefits that a lot of governments not just western but worldwide are gonNA see in developing in putting this out there because it's not it's not unknown technology. I mean Amazon stuff is really good it is. I think that that's the other concern with facial tech. Is that better yeah it is but it's only as good as the data is fed and there is some concern that there are some catalogued biases built into the facial recognition for instance the because of the nature data they often get federal. They very often are better at identifying people of certain minorities than they are. Perhaps the rest of us. I'm obviously then skews results and that sort of thing it's complex issue. I think we should just do three episodes on it. We'll have it licked okay fair enough. You know we'll we'll submit those development and job done. I don't I don't see the problem so <hes> Mac stock is half over the half first day. I I have to think the you have the same opinion I so far I liked chuck's topic the best band presentations that was brilliant. Yeah it was funny. It was in full motif while also being amusing right what not to do in your powerpoint or keynote yeah and and I think the the having seen bad powerpoint myself views because you know I work business. I see a lot of powerpoint. People who I don't there are a lot of people who love powerpoint because they find it very easy to use and consequently squinting they don't want to do in my business for instance we'll issue full reports and things they want to do powerpoint and you end up with these slides full of information and they're thinking oh well. Nobody's ever going to present this. They can just read on paper. You know which is smart. I mean if it's just meant for a printout yet. That's not really a problem but the problem is sometimes when people want to kill me Biz stone so they'll do the dense prints out version and then ago right well. I've got slide now. Small present in that line and this and you get the feeling as well as powerpoint is not a word processor so not very good at doing the layout and the form checking and the making sure that the content you produce looks good in the same way those has will do that still comes down to the user. We've all C. N.. I don't care how sophisticated the tool is. If the person doing it is a dumb ass. It's it's going to come out bad matter. What Alexander Your Son's playing a game right across from what he's I think he's watching something? That's amazing him it. Just you sent him away. I sent him away not distracting him. GIGGLING reicher stipend. That's it's fine professional. I can do it so you brought. Your son. Alexander brought my daughter Brooke <hes> we had terrible breakfast this morning. We might put serious and I don't mind caller mouth. The restaurant was called <hes> the burnt toast. We probably should have figured it out from the name alone probably was a I. I didn't get the burnt Ish Hash Brown tapes. I'm a month for a long time and I specifically ordered mind with no onions the gap that bribery br tacos refuse Tacos Taco. You don't think there's something that big. Each one was the size of a big Burrito. It was really not Taco is a Barista right and there was giant onions through it and I don't mind cooked onions but I knew damn while this is going to have raw onions in house right yeah slightly warm because what it was in but and a hell of low chase way it's it was gupte on so much. That's all I could taste was oily cheese so we know where we're not going in the future. Live breath the difficulty when you come out someone like this where there's a little flow of local places you know so u unless unless you know somebody who lives out here knows the good places you choose someone that you taking potluck and in in using it based on a name or will this is a mile and a half down the road. Although this one was fourteen miles away thirty eight something like that I remember it was like fifteen minute drive. We definitely didn't we definitely didn't make could choice but the thing is the yelp reviews. Were good yeah so I mean what are you go by. You Really WanNa find someone local and go. Hey if I just gave you twenty bucks right now to go out and have breakfast where you're GONNA go. Well token. Somebody who's been reading on so you never know in Yale whether it's people who have <hes> conde you know big out because they know the owner all they worked there that yeah well they. You know they had a good night at one so something like that rather than completing the good memory to the good things which are two different things yeah exactly and also some people have different tastes so that's the other problem with yelp reviews and things is some people just they lock different time for food to you and I sent. I sent some pictures to my wife over in the U._K.. And she she said that food very brown. She's GonNa wrote things that choices what what you now well not too unhealthy monmouth official on the mom that she the the only itself was okay but the <hes> the Hash browns were Bert. That's all I could taste when we left didn't even hardly even touched the second Taco yeah juries. Oh as what I've got my but I couldn't even taste trees all I could taste oily cheese and the giant China onions. Yeah I hate that and Alexandra is not he's not gonNA wills most sophisticated palate he piled through a great big finger French toast this morning which enjoyed but he also did some Hash browns on his resources smothered in Tim us cheese and and he said to me often said that have been it wasn't just one fight that was bad. They didn't burn the toast they BR- average so we've got to figure out something better for tomorrow so we've got another day and a half year you fly out Monday. No we came back Tuesday night. I thought because Alexander was hey we tightly. She's ago and spent a couple of days in downtown Chicago. It's worth yeah so we're going to stay up here and Chris late tomorrow night and then Monday morning when to drive down to you a hotel at the airport and we're going to stay there and that means we can get on the L. from their against downtown my Sinisi my oldest lives and works in Chicago Right. She texted me wanting US East Brooklyn I to stop by her work on the way back tomorrow yeah but it's going to add an hour to my drive which I really don't WanNa do but I know Rachel really would like us to stop by so probably will know yes family say that Yeah Yeah Damn it. Who had this kid? Maybe what you need to to say is <hes> paps issue. She could come out Measham. She she came out here last year Max doc her and her boyfriend Michael and fact we had him on Tech van last year right <hes> talking about video games or something yeah and <hes> we went and had dinner afterwards and you know it was a good time so I yeah it's probably fair for me to go it out and see where she works. She really wants her dad and get my get my approval yet no so we'll probably do it and <hes> but if we go there and then we go home from there. It's going to take us through downtown Chicago. which adds it's going to be Sunday night so it's not like it's going to be super bad but that takes over the bridge which Brooks never gone over so you know Chicago's doesn't hold any mysteries for me? I worked here for many years but go for broke. It's kind of a big day but see I. I took Brooke with me back in. I'm GonNa say twenty eleven right when I was working at my specialist and you know we stayed in a hotel. She had a good time. We ought to come into restaurants went up to at the time I was called at sears tower I think or it might have been well tower at the time where you can walk out on the plastic number one hundred sixty s suspended straight. It's Kinda neat but you know my legs doesn't didn't WanNa step on it like new <hes> but you know that was a long time ago for her. She probably doesn't remember much of it now. She remembers getting sick in the car right before we got here right orange. I remember that very well. Those are the things that stick with the APIS. It's it's funny funny. Things sticking your head. You know yeah I remember. I forgot all about it yeah but then once I remember yeah I remember that so tech wise. What are we recording in here David so I'm using <music> <hes> I finished appropriate and audio hijack running and I have a U._S._B.? Hub plugged in with three USB headsets the wall on the I'm on then to Cheapo Sennheiser sennheiser chapter ones and then I've configured audio hijack so that each input h might phone is recording to its own channel so each one's good his own monir channel and the Nazi funding all three of those recordings as well to another record record this actually saving them all combined so I've got reference tracked so you have producing three separate files full is producing one for each and then a joint one. That's actually got the more I got two inputs yeah so the third wants to sit in their recording and I'll just not use that one because I just use the combined one is referenced fact so I can line up the other two putting together rush battle multi whichever art you saw today so you can tweak Rickie each individual track if needed exactly yeah because you always when you pull costs newest ideally one each speaker on the separate tracks so you can make adjustments individually and also you can shuffle things around edit and everything his Francis suppose we were talking leverageable. We normally do because we're skype because I can't see when you're yeah and here we can see the visual cues we know when each one's going to speed and when somebody's not doing it when you try if if you're trying to fix that in garage bands and you want to edit it out and stretch out to the people on on talking over each other is much easier to do live each person's on the individual having the whole thing combined together because then you can't break apart the individual choices well like I said at the beginning of the show I edit your audio not for content but for clarity because for whatever reason I it's a little hissy sometimes not that you're being his Sammy and Donnie equality and I boost up the we <hes> compression so the voices the sound output is close to what might as more of a high quality microphone because X. L. E. on a boom mic and you're using a headset so I mean you got those are two separate inputs that really don't line up while you no one's going to sound much better than the other so I sound more basie with a fuller sound in years dull so in software have to the new and try to tweak it enough where it doesn't sound robotic. I you know I want it to sound like you because I can really change it. Make you sound like a chipmunk wanted to baby tech. Uh David Barry White Lie. I don't know if that comes through on a headset. Are you doing it on the real Mike but no it's been a good show so far I see a a lot of the same people mhm this is the fifth year and for those who've been here every year might gave this nice little ceramic pins. Max Dot five got one on my chest. This is your second year here back stock right second. Is this your second. I feel Mike been here. I'm pretty I'm pretty sure. This is my third so I've been here for the first one. No the obvious eight for the second one and then I came the following year as a speaker. That's right missed a year and then this is my third because I remember number at the end of your first show. You said You'd think you'd do a speaking gig yeah. In fact at that point you even knew it was kind of going to be about gas with a microcomputers if you will and that's exactly what you did <hes> the the the theme that's kind of tying all together. I think creativity was that what it was yeah <hes> Mike Opening thing with his parents giving him a camera and a Nice Quality Cambodia Zhong really kind of lay the groundwork for what he's doing now. <hes> you know my daughter Brooke. She's waiting music. She's on a chromebook here yeah and she's literally making music as we're sitting here. She's editing our own staff and cleaning it up and adding attract this and shoots very involved and so she's is a perfect example of how the technology is fueling or at the very least helping that creativity yeah but some of them are. Just you know you could do this in notes. I don't know what that really has to do with creativity yeah. I wish they had more of a submit your ideas for a talk gonNA take the best ones regardless of what the overall thing the minister for the show <hes> in which case I would love to see because you submitted one but it wasn't creativity so he didn't pick it whereas I think they could have. Maybe not just on creativity. Make just a really good conference. That's going to have a broad rage of subjects is going to be much more appealing and possibly drawn other people to the show. I like Max Dot. They need to work on promoting the show I think so. I think it needs to be AM I. I think you're right. The broader Pale is important. I think it I mean one thing that there's a lot of people who've been involved in that community for a long time and user groups Nestle thing and I think it would be good to try and reinfuse is the kind of the user group style because it's it's like a very big user group shows it'd be good to bring that he feels to younger people because then they will take that back to their own communities and their own circle of friends and kind of bring that along because because I think this is Kelly of the the kind of the eighties and nineties group feels and then but the problem with that though David is the people that are up on the stage or people your age my age or older what they need to do do is have some of the younger people out there that are doing stuff with the technology that we haven't even thought and bring that audience as well yeah and also technology nowadays is much church easterby. We'd be good to see that reflected. It'd be good to see people doing stuff with talking about. I'd love to talk about how you how you make. Videos drones yeah because that's a really big thing now and again. It's one of those things it's a real skill is not the sole thing the in flight light up in the Air Force and anybody can do that and you have. I have done that yet but I I found it really hard to pew something. That's good watchable from that footage unless you know what you're doing you even if you have the same equipment exactly the important thing now is the barriers entries he's much lower than it used to be but the requirement for skill taste a little bit technique can just limited stuff to try and take it above the snapshot level is still there and and people need help with that watch a a reality TV. Show nowadays and you go. That's a drone shot yeah. Sometimes you even see the drums reflection in the grass has drawn chuck which isn't a bad thing I was. I was thinking I was thinking if you watch <hes> something show that you and I by fans top gear and also the grand tour which is the one off to do current the current V K now has new hostess store or the new one has a sturdy has they they started they they just did a short run about five or six episodes recently of top gear so completely new cell host Matt local anymore. Are they realized I had started yet. Yeah I'll to <hes> I'll say some links to it anyway. The the point I would make from that is the if you look at how they shoot the calls when they're doing the track shots and everything like that they have since I have to do something really use Siri. Remind me Monday afternoon to look for the new top gear. Okay good yeah. That's that's why like Sir necessary skill right right there. It'll pop up a MAC so because I would completely forget about it and they're like Oh yeah. That's right. The new one started yeah but the the point I was trying to make was that the technology to do that. Sort of filming is now available to anybody immigrate stuff exactly you know and you could reproduce that loop but to actually make it look as good as they do it. You need the techniques and the skill you don't just the equipment right unless Astana the content itself helps. You know you can make it look as great as possible if you're just flying it underneath the table umbrella open sky. No one cares win. It's a car spinning out in going around a corner really fast and that that sort of thing so it's got to be more than just the technique and goes back to what we were saying. Guy Has got great equipment over there blows what we've got as far as microphones and all the wires those away but it's about the content if he's that recording anything and we are the sounds better just by default. That's right now. Thankfully guy creates really good concept content so I'm not worried about that but a lot of people don't they spend too much time minutia of of how to do it rather than why why are you doing. You don't have anything to say if you don't have anything to video. If there isn't a point to your shot nobody wants to watch it. Yeah and there is a particularly video. I think there's an element of planning and thinking about the store you WanNa tell with the images of just going out and catching some footage and then thinking altron the Senate listen something interesting that being said the one of my favorite things on Youtube is <hes> playlists in four K which I can watch on my screen at home yeah of like fly bys <hes> drone fly by so they're slow panning shots of like the Grand Canyon New York's <hes> Times Square London where just this drone looking straight down in his just flying over and there's a couple of them out there and four k. that AH drones flying through fireworks exploding. I like those I like putting those on kind of a loop and just almost using it as a screensaver GonNa sit there and watch the same you know two minute loop of someone going over Time Square. I guess the difference now with the Cosima Gripe Tech is that anybody can shoot any place whereas I think when you see produced to produce media it's always the same shorts this always the same yes locations because those are the ones that the media no work best for what they WANNA show and also they use them. You see the establishing short any T._v.. Show they use shortcuts. Just basically tell the view. This is where we are. This is what's going that smart yeah well. That's fine for that so content not necessarily interesting because if you don't WanNa see that same show of that same corner in Chicago all that same precinct in New York or whatever it is you want. Sometimes you WanNa see what's the real place like what would it be like if I was there floating five hundred fee of the city looking straight down what I see and join technology. Let's do say that and also people can go and create that Schultz so it gives you a different perspective on places even that you see every day you know how many people listen to the show knows exactly what the top of their house looks like from two hundred feet in the air. I've done that it was amazing to take take my drone not far from where I live and and just just you know see the whole area from from the girl under fee up it gets it does give you the something about the Joe I think you build a mental map of the geography of where you live for it anyway you familiar and that meant doesn't necessary job with reality jives with your reality and then when you see it from a different view all of a sudden you see a different ways. You can realize the things you saw a far away from each other each other right. Sometimes you can say oh. You know what could go that way. I'd be there intimidates. If I just built the same behind my house I can jump over there and I'm there. I always remember that as a kate was when we were in Florida Florida there was a there was a a little shopping center that if you went from my house in Florida drove there it was like a fifteen minute drive seem like a long way away and it will it was a long way as fifty minutes the car we're at forty five miles. An hour is a long way we found a rude guy and Connie going through the woods and you know we took when into housing state and then we we kind of went across <hes> across a little bit for his land and then down this all fire road and then we turn on this place and we get thrown all bikes five ten minutes we what we thought we would never be able to go there on android steam. We thought we do have to driven there in the car. All of a sudden we found we could go there whenever we wanted. It was like you know it was like it was a lot teleportation cool yeah and it was just because we were taking the soul read. You can't take if you're in the car because you have to follow that the roads that go all the way round way out of the way from where you want the destination to be exactly the same thing coming here to Chicago offer me a stray shower from here to my house would probably take two hours but because of where we are here and I gotta go south of the Lakers three and a half hours you know the Drek lot route as the crow flies as they say is always going to be much easier but but that drone technology are just changing your perspective does exactly that it changes your perspective. You know we're sitting here we think. How far away is there a hotel? If we can send a drone we could see that actually were not very far away. It's a stupa traffic slows closes down flying cows. We settle for one yeah hopefully makes them look at you. Look at Khan that drone. Let's called cultures. Do you think surely won't be the hall to scale out somebody that is hard carrie. It's not difficult technology at all. We have that technology there. It's the stupidity of the user if you think it's bad getting offender better imagine coming out of the sky crashing into someone's house or school. You know that's the kind of thing that is going to prevent prevent us from ever having fighting cars until the collective intelligence of US gets higher either that will you know the self-driving techies this so basically you have no control well that might be good to would you be willing to take a self flying mini copter if you will a drone data point v well what's reliable enough only one on one thousand crash. That's the thing I don't know and it's not the crash Rasa get you. It's the sudden stop thing where it kind of fills the thing with phone just before you hear demolition man they got a chip you out of it and you can't move that's right yeah. I don't know why we don't have that yet. For no brainer I only think about how it worked in the movie. It's it hardens up but not right away so you're kind of in Gel for second during the actual impact and then it hardens up to keep you in place but why why does it keep. Why do you need to be kept in place? Just stay as a loose gel slide out because if you did I don't break your arm in the crash. Now you're in this hard plastic key foamy stuff that they can count. Maybe if it stays the jail you drowning it and that's why I don't know if he made oxygenated enough. You can breathe a liquid. Most people don't realize that in super super deep diving they've explored that and that was in some movie the abyss the abyss. They've actually explored that technology. They found that it's actually viable <hes> but people feel like they're drowning. I you don't want to trust it because it's liquid and your body's like no. I can't breathe liquid but again because it's so oxygenated <hes> I don't know maybe it's something like that. That's the the GEL that shoots out of but to be able to fill that much space. It has come out so fast if it's coming out that so fast. How much weight is that liquid adding to a car? I guess <hes> that's part of the problem is not simply. Think is yeah you can be hit by an Amtrak. I mean what people are seriously. That's actually the seat belts and airbags cause more minor injuries or anything else you know just anything that hits your body or stays on your body a long time like I knew some of this morning. They had these lines like right here on their face like an hour. I'd say anything but it's GONNA weird looking. That's my that's my puffy facial straps very it was very early but so the judge would be a great idea except where's that gel stored in the car until US needed and if it's GonNa fill that hole cabin how many gallons our leaders would that be yeah well the chemical but even still where do you put that much of these different chemicals and how was it mixing that fast to fill that much space and literally split second. What if it works in the movie? I mean documentary anyway I Wesley Snipes must be wasn't Wesley Snipes Schmidt but I'm wondering crash sylvester stolen cash or was it Wesley Snipes. I think it was semester salone because he's busting out of what the Hell is this center both its safety foam or something like that. <hes> I need to watch that movie against really bad at did not age well and everything's Taco Bell Jack Three weeks after his release actually with every restaurant being Taco bell's not too far off to be honest. I would've taken Taco Bell over the burnt toast today so <hes> but yeah getting back to maxed out. There's going to be some more speakers. I didn't even gone to the schedule so I don't even know what they are. <hes> that they conduct selby's you get kind of a full morning if talks and then there's multi stuff on the same breaks out and so they got the same a setup for tomorrow's just another full dice Ellison Sheridan did a kind of choose your own adventure Keno and she said if you guys want to find out how this works I already know how it works. It's kind of obvious and I thought it was Kinda cool but the problem is we accidentally clicked the wrong button. It completely backwards yeah. I was watching that thinking that would have veteran hypercard. Well you know the yes and you already. Have you have five branches right. You only make the choice at one time yeah so why. Why couldn't you go backwards because you just have from this one? This is the next slide. This is the next this next year. I'll I'll set a relational database. I guess that won't work. What so you could do that in filmmaker pro because you just have technically when you think of presentations it would be five different presentations glued together from the front page? So the moment you make a choice is literally loading the presentation yeah and you could have done even if all five presentations were something that keynote you could have done that using ultimatums or something automatic bill and then you just yeah you have to pictures and he quickly and then it jumps the correct session a keynote runs it through and then you can have the full back and forth exactly and I see my brain thinks relation database filmmaker pro because that's what I used to do that if you clicked this and literally it looks like it's in the same container because it is but it's literally loading data from a distant a different database so you can go forward back. It doesn't matter and you could still have a button on each one of those pages to click to get you back to the main menu and make another selection ago that right. I think people forgotten that fall Mike Pro Exists and how it works man I tell you you can do you could build your own build your own adventure that would be much more robust with a relational database. You can have it loading media and all kinds of stuff. You can have gone to websites <hes> it would would actually be a better presentation before she did than Keno but you can only do these things in kind of what you know. I don't know particularly if you have to create a project for particular tasks that might have a deadline on it does to learn a new system thrilled to do that is is people who are always more inclined to go while I'm going to try and it that the the tools I know we went the route that you did. You have a one slide Keno. You're that depending on what you click launches the automated launches that one brings it full screen starts to play it. Yeah that would have been the easiest way doing it just in the same way that I was saying to you off to the Siri presentation this morning. I didn't know Siri could do offer those things. It's a case of just having the somebody explain she what the capability in the possibilities are they can try to explore them and see whether it's in keynote you can have an action that takes you to a certain slide and that's all she was doing but the problem is when she gets to that slide she has to go chronologically and it was interesting but I think there was better ways of doing it that if you told her why don't use automate her have one page that was just the selection selection you click that launches this action which launches this one brings a false starts playing this is a really simple thing for a computer to do and then you have full forward and backwards functionality and and you can have different slides in there that does exactly the same thing it just simply opened this one now and yeah full forward and backwards functionality well up to the point where you launch that database because that's right. You can't go beyond that. Is it mentioned that you thought you had these slides on the service somewhere maybe up to a worldwide network and then when you click on the link it went to the next so you like this is a web web site would be a very good script and then you could do some thing would be a link but more votes linger yeah. That's good too but you kind of need a container to browse this information descriptive word it might work in progress right the stone we might come back and record some more of this <hes> podcasts at how far we into it how long <hes> forty minutes forty minutes Oh we might just call this episode. We'll see we'll get inspired intercourse a more but either way if this is it. I'll see you next week David <hes> if this is not it I'll see in a few minutes on the show see then and we're back at the Max dot conference. I'm actually <hes> David Cohen Call in David's right over here. I am recording. I don't know what it is. I get this gassy thing. Every time I started running the hell <hes> actually have the facebook live going. Nobody's watching but that's okay. It's recorded for ever so we are recording the rest of Tech Fan podcast number. I don't even know doesn't matter something is a four hundred yeah four hundred or something so it is day two at the Mac Stack Expo and it's been a good show. I've enjoyed it there. You are <hes> yeah. This is your first showed. I'm a facebook. It doesn't actually I should have probably turned it sideways before I started recording but the thing is when you do it in this aspect <hes> yeah tagged him Roberson. What's it doing <hes> if someone's watching it on a mobile device it fills her whole phone and I know guy does this way but the problem is on a mobile device? It only feels I doubt that so <hes> you know between what yesterday the time we recorded. This is about the same time as we're doing. It now isn't it. Eh One. Would you guys do for dinner. Last night. We went <hes> so last time we were up at the hotel with some of the guys from Mexico staying in the event their drinks things on that and then we went into the cannery village the town everything and all the places here some of them some of the towns villages any we went to mckenry. which is the nearest place the hotel we described sweet there? I still little bit gentler from the trip so it gets about nine o'clock at night and we kinda hit the wall. Oh that's <hes> you know I get to ten o'clock at night here and I hit the wall because to me that's eleven o'clock. That's like what three o'clock in the morning for you yet. That's right right so we we kind of eating dinner and then we got some bad side just destroyed outside. We are saying the same hotel <hes> I was woken up quite a few times last night with little kids screaming at between eleven and one o'clock in the morning running down the hall early accent terrible <hes>. I just wonder who the parents of these children are the less their kids at one o'clock in the morning eight year old nine year old little kids go screaming up and down the hall. What are you doing? I think people sat in the ball chasing as long as the kids aren't bothering them that didn't care could point so we did want to we were remiss when we recorded the first part of the podcast <hes> to mention our sponsor and they're actually here today. I'm going to flip this around. We can from a distance so inch where there's a session going on so it's really quiet right now but my hand looks really dark. Hi Theresa Phillips I can see that she's watching <hes> O._D._B._C.'s over there and they've got some products out and of of course they are our sponsor for Tech Fan and AMAC yet and speaks Memphis yet the the revived the customer service thing they have going on. I had to chat with him this morning. Joining because I just recently bought Woman's U._S._B.. S._S._T.'s that we talked about in the show previously the own voip prime mini and it came in this really cool kind of partitioning application that was somebody Mike and Windows and it was preinstalled in the drive and of course like an idiot when I had a quick look at it and then I used it and then reformats drama had taken a copy of the applications and I went over this morning I said look on the website. Can you let me know where to get it from gives you an email address. We'll get one of my tech Sabine such review and sold out one of the things I did want to mention do here on facebook live as well <hes> for not just those who are watching right now but who may be he eventually will watch us. I'll probably show this lady over on both my Mac dot com and the Tech Fam- podcasts facebook but more importantly here on Tech Van <hes> we had a meeting last night you and I and we talked to a couple of the other micrometres why we're here Mac and we are expanding and looking for new writers. We are looking for people out there. Who would love to do or maybe not even love enjoy <hes> doing some Predator views? My Mac really started back in the day as a resource for talking about shareware and share wills kind of big thing back then that was mid-nineties and we want to get back to more reviews on the site so if you've ever thought about doing product reviews but you just don't know how to go about it. How do I get products to review? This is your opportunity <hes>. We are looking at it. Doesn't you don't have to be a professional writer. <hes> Eh Hey. I started as a very good writer I do it. <hes> and David doesn't even know how to write completely illiterate branch my level so if this is something you're interested in then let us know it's the show. No I was going to get the tech fan we send it to Tim at my Mac Dot Com or publisher at my Mac Dot Com and we'll discuss we'll get products out to you for manufacturers. Be a software off. Were hardware doesn't have to be MAC or even iphone related it. If it's technology were interested in sharing your views with the world so <hes> publisher or Tim at my Mac Dot Com and let's talk about it but let's talk a little bit about our sponsor. They've got a lot of stuff over on that table David and when you come to an event like this instead of just looking at products on a website you can actually get hands on and realize how well built some of the stuff is. I know sometimes the Nice tables hold up to the white some stuff on there because <hes> this hefty everything everything seems to be kind of sheathing Netflix really has good and solid screwed together feel to it yeah. A lot of their stuff is metal. It's not plastic in you know nowadays with a lot of this technology used to this plastic. He Junkie feel that is not what you're getting without W._C.. So if you're upgrading your MAC if you're looking for a cool case for your iphone if you're looking for external storage I stop should always be Mac sales dot com as well as use MACs for sale that refurbish Max you fat. I noticed recently they had <hes> the <hes> the twelve inch apple of just discontinued. They've got a brand new in the ball to refocus so these ones apple have processed and have cleaned up and and ev- anything from apple that's referred is like a brand new machine so these these are come from apple and then the going through I W C <hes> the really cheap and they'll great machine so if you kind of miss out on the twelve inch macbook and you're looking for one. Will you never wanted to pay the price was charging them. This is a way of getting one hundred thousand told us and these are eight gig to fifty six machines so <hes> fancy stories plenty Aram and pretty good computers hurt a lot of <hes> lot of applauded coming from wonder if I should you know when we're done recording this episode I should take facebook live a little yeah he Jimmy Green. It's up <hes> so we are at mckenry College Crystal Lake Illinois <hes> This is the last day so if you're not here you missed it so it's going to be next year I expect. I don't know if Mike's Actually made the announcement win. It's going to happen next year but he has talked about possibly getting the hotel hotel the preferred hotel kind of the whole thing reserved for ten days which would be because that's not the hotel David Meyer at you got a sweet though this year I sweet sweet sweet sweet on traveling on <music> on points and <hes> which means that you know you turn on the hotel they come to know that you're a good customer of the brands right and which often means you get upgrades but the real reason was that we were traveling with Alexander we we offer <hes> <hes> see double beds and they didn't have any in how many Ramos fits two double beds so they said well. You can have sweetened step aside so I don't have a sweet <hes> I have one bad but I also have a pullout and I making that child right there Brooke. She's sleeping on the pullout but here's the thing David she didn't actually pull it out. Yes I'm GonNa Tag Brooklyn. The video look at it new Brooke was it's Facebook facebook. I spent knows everything not creepy at all. <hes> she slept on the couch. She never even pulled it out or anything. Yeah kids kids. She slept on the floor probably won't care so <hes> we did want to record a little a bit less. Here are a little bit more here on the Mike podcast or tech podcast well mixed up yeah <hes> and specifically wanted to again reach out and say hey if you've thought about doing proud of her views. Were actively looking for people right now. There's a lot of new products coming out David a lot of different product categories. I mean something different from sending back when I used to write for my Mac as opposed to doing pulsing with you is that the right of product release has definitely gone up. We were doing it back then so there's a lot more stuff out there and like you say it's become a much broader a much broader category of the things that tape to review. It's not just software and hardware the MAC. Now there's all sorts of things that kind of kind of go along with maxine lifestyle Louis Technology lifestyle while I was mentioning when I was on the stage today <hes> <hes> one of our recent reviews is it's like a cloth band that has headphones in it so it's for listening to music or sound while you're sleeping so that's something <hes> again tim at my Mac dot COM com. We'd love to talk to you about <unk> views. We also we being David and I love to hear from you guys any topics. You'd like to hear talk about you're GonNa hear a little bit more of a refocus Tak van here coming up in the very very near future less marvel universe more technology yeah and also you know less knee stuff more about the technology <hes> an cuddled the world of technology as opposed say while sending news he's from week to week. I think I think we want to get to more talking about things at a high level so we talked about loss months. Because you know is kind of go. We've been busy yeah but it's it's. We want to talk more about about the world of technology at AH kind of a Meta level individual individual things going on Yeah and plus like you said last night a lot of the news stuff is negative and we don't want to be just the negative people talking about about the negative news stories. Let's let's expand kind of in some respects. I'm going back to what we used to do on the show and so you know we're we're refocusing my Mac dot com on <hes> more product reviews and we'll see goes beyond that and we're going to focus on tech fan back on technology and maybe some more of the positive stuff so <hes> we look forward to sharing more of our plans in the near future. We're going to wrap up this episode. Are I do have to work Friday of next week. So we're looking at Sunday recording. Okay you'll be home by then I will. I will be home by then. I'll be home in like six hours at a couple of days more Chicago for us. I also many big plans which is going unkown society. We'll do the boat told the jury for fun yeah and in fact we were planning to do like two full days. I don't think Alexander meals that to be on the semi tomorrow and then relax get ready for the flight on the way back. Oh awesome I'm GONNA go meet Rachel Roberson my <hes> oldest daughter of course brooks with me and we're going to meet her and a couple of hours and <hes> I heard Grant Sulky.

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TechFan 420 - Holiday

TechFan

1:06:02 hr | 8 months ago

TechFan 420 - Holiday

"You're listening to another great podcast in the my neck podcasting network Tech Fan podcast number four hundred twenty and I I I bet most people listening would not have recognized that music the from a Christmas movie David Cohen One of the biggest one of the biggest. Yes movie of all time yeah The Music is actually written by John Williams and this movie is either loved or hated hated by people is a very divisive movie when the weather. Yes Oh yeah. There's there's a huge backlash clash against this movie So that is the theme music from home alone. Now I cut out the first ten seconds because if you hear the first ten seconds you know immediately what Carr's but once it gets past that first ten seconds I've always thought if some like well not always just recently actually. I've always thought it sounded like Harry Potter. It does have that kind of supernatural element to it. The music well. It shouldn't be surprising. I mean John Williams wrote both the Harry Potter Music and home alone. So I mean if you're GONNA borrow from somebody at it I guess it's not bad eh from yourself but you said something that I liked so this is the theory. I love this theory. This is a theory that the home alone film makes much more sense if Kevin is gross and if you you think about it fairly straightforward he gets left home alone but if you think about the action of the movies his family to test him yes yes everybody just tracing crap the adults right at the camp that you know they they descend so much that you don't notice when they leave without him. Yeah Yeah and then if you think about actually what he does the Basically eighty cents. It's a cartoon violence. Yes knife this for the wealthy really third final the final act of the movies causing fondants and the extreme that nobody should be able to survive that and yet those those guys who do do trying to break in do you know and they get that. Come up at the end but if you think about it if he's goes poltergeist haunting the family. Yet that's why they call it white to get away from him and then they feel bad about when they've left behind because he's the goes locate it And it also means that everything that he does makes sense because he leaves a supernatural being. Have you you out. Do you ever watch the The Youtube show The one I watch I can't think of who does it now. F subscribe to their channel. But but it's Via Fax artist react to and say nippy Oh yeah so they react to both good and bad. CGI and they actually should go in and explain how the good ones are done and why the bad ones are so bad and occasionally because these guys. That's what they do. Oh the artists special effects artists They go in and fix these scenes for them now. They don't do that a whole lot. But they've done enough of them. Where like you know the Rock and the Scorpion King? How badly done the G. I. is when he gets? Yeah I mean it's so bad. They actually cleaned that up. A little bit did look better but it's still expand But they did a home alone. Where what these injuries would really look like just brutal? I mean it's so funny for for anybody's not intimately familiar with the movie. I mean some of the things things are you know. One of them gets blowtorch to the head. Yeah yeah the guy. He basically falls down the stairs about five or six times he's hit with a crowbar is goes steps on nails. Yea this the birds and they're able to take can't paint cans of paint to the face. Yeah Hammer yet. I mean it's yeah it is it is and you know they. They limpet but effectively. They're they're still up and running and Kevin himself appears to be able to move round the house. Will this Steve Partner theories that if you're familiar with the movie he doesn't like the either the attic or basement and the suggestion that is because he's a he because he's a he's a ghost he's willing to face the idea of moving onto the next phase and we just WanNa go up and he doesn't want to get down. Yeah Yeah Yeah John Hughes did home alone and he didn't direct it though he just wrote it but John Hughes has almost a cult like following at this point his nineties teens movies or eighties teen movies. I should say Are Classics especially for our generation. And this doesn't fit in with the other movies. He did but I think it Kinda does I mean he's done great movies but we're talking about this because on the last episode I asked. What is your favorite a holiday movies? Now I didn't take Christmas movies. It could be any holiday but I think most people took that to mean probably Christmas movies but I you know I I wanted to see what some of these lists aren't. I posted this on facebook and I got a ton of response. So we're going to go through this and we also so have I guess you say special announcement. How'd you put it? I'd say special special. I'll sit special and I do want to get into that now or do you hold that to the end. Let's leave. It's the keep keep him hanging so so were. Is there really anything you think going on in the tech world right now. I mean it's kind of a dead time because anything that was GONNA be. You know the big Christmas present type of thing. Holiday era era. It's thirty been released. We probably already talked about it And honestly looking at a lot of these less I know I picked on Amazon last week with their top fifty list. It was kind of a joke because it was almost everything was Amazon products I haven't really heard a lot of people discussing some tech pack items that they absolutely want to get outside of and I've heard this quite a bit the sixteen inch macbook pro. I've heard a lot of people on social media saying they want that machine. It doesn't surprise me because effectively addresses. It's the end of what has been dot period in my lap. Delta does decide shots is a play we were in the other day. And it's kind of weird because unless you knew or unless you have it next regular bus fly Kibo between you just wouldn't notice. She's because most people expect you to type on a keyboard and a laptop and it feels novel and this new one feels perfectly normal whereas the other ones did not it is not actually apart from that and obviously they've changed the internals slightly bigger screen. It's actually not that much of a change from the previous machine. I I suspect that this is actually a holding machine and some point. They say we're going to get a redesign of all of the laptops into a new case style featuring these new cables well. You know we've been saying that for many many years but we've had this essentially the same design for Geez man as long as tech fans been on the air for ten years pretty much. Yeah I mean all the university machines we have in our economy based on an extension of the original sorry the second Gen macbook air. Yeah Yeah they've all been pretty much the same Simpson and they just gradually kind of losing leaves. They grudgingly lost ports as they've gotten older and got thinner. Yeah it's I don't know. Do you think I can can any company and if anybody can I would assume it's probably apple. Can you really come out with a new laptop or do you think it's. It's time now for apple to start looking at a dual screen type of laptop. That's both the Mac Os and an IPAD all in one. Well well it. Yeah I mean. We don't Jill screens are having had devices that Jill screens all kinds of equivalent Cleveland. Vigil screen kind of a flat glossed keyboard area as well as As a screen won't bows are very much. An acquired taste I think the problem is that laptops generally are you know have refined to the point that they can do. Everything they need to do is is very difficult to innovate innovate. And let's face it. The apart from if we if we put the keyboards the bus fly keyboard aside as a kind of a mad experiment. The other innovations apple is trying to bring laptops have not been successful touch it touch. An hour is not universally loved. No I don't know anybody who even talk about anymore. They did when it first came out but then it was a man. People didn't seem to care. I like the concept. I mean it looks really cool I just I don't know I've never owned one one. I've used one. Maybe a couple times apple star but that's it and it didn't jump out at me as particularly more useful than just a standard function keys up there and the difficulty apple vices is there is innovation lots of spaces. Just not being done by apple. You know you look at Mark Softer doing some good things with the with the surface line surface laptop is a very fine macbook competitor. You've got the service surface book they do which is kind of a variation on the tablets laptops type thing everyone I've ever seen. He's surface book user's Laptop and I've I've ever seen anybody take the screen of the thing that you know. What a lot people laptops announcement Microsoft had a couple of months ago with new services? Coming out I'll be honest with you. I was a little bit more excited about that than anything. I've seen from apple in quite a while. Yeah but you know there is time yet for various devices and we'll at least they're showing something there at least they're showing them yet but the the problem is is when you when you showing something a year out things can change. They can either not come out or they can come out different to what was originally shown so I love her. Where so much going with with Atari and vaporware right now you know the company that owns Atari Brand is coming out with a new gaming cycle our cycle well they keep posting pictures in updates but it was supposed to come out by now and it looks more like a not a android but a a lennox box with a bunch of immunizations and and you know either people online and some of the video game groups that I'm in or either can't wait for it to come out or of the opinion that it's never going to come out. You know you and I well. On record is big big fans of Retro Gaming and event emulation and Retro Gaming the difficulty for anybody coming into that mark is that there there are so many options out there and everything is going to do. I can do right now is very exactly and most of those options are all pretty good. But by the same token these little mini game systems. the Nintendo won. The Sony didn't hasn't sold very well and they've already cut the price into a third of what was a little. PSA classic but the Nintendo ones the ones. They've been selling extremely well and they seem to be universally liked in fact the sake one that just came out maybe six months ago some people are saying that's the best one that's out there right now. It's better than even the Nintendo ones so I think that there is a market for nostalgia type of video games. Not Everybody is going to go out there and build their own system roll their own video game platform like like you and I are want to do so. I think there is a market for that in e can't deny that Tari has that that brand even if it's not really Atari sorry. Yeah but you know long I know is it's the fashion. Now if you WANNA take looking at kickstarts and that sort of thing to it kind of publishing failures as you go through the development cycle but yeah but but this kind of this. This bearing in mind is coming from I come to. His name is normally recognized as being able to do something. This kind of looks like the work of guys who have no idea what it. It looks like a council from a marketing company. Yeah not someone that knows how to actually build video game systems and this is this is the I mean the. We took him to extreme sick about the laptops. You've got companies like Microsoft and then in gaming people like Atari. He Basically Telegraph Way. Way Ahead on what they're GONNA do and it may or may not come out and then you've got on the side you go apple. He won't tell anybody anything until it's ready to be launched. Nikki night It's it's it's an old thing Marshall I'm not sure which I'm sure fair either to be to be on this that let's and the other thing that wasn't adventure of launch the Mac pro bowl now I thought so I mean they accused last February. That there's something like that wasn't it. Whatever WWE DC but it was meant to be before the end the year? And there's only a couple of weeks left to that the third fourth quarter because fourth quarter goes into the new year. Maybe I'm not sure I think that's what they said but yeah it's supposed to be here by now. They had all this. Well there you go. It's the same thing the Microsoft did they announced it ahead of time. And then everybody waits is it changing. Ah What's what's going on with it. There's been no update. As far as I'm I've heard now so I'd probably Satele Semi Twenty Fulsome Awesome lineup. I don't think so. I think we're GONNA see until I think we're going to get announcement that it's been pushed back. I want to happen. Yeah Yeah I think the tariffs are hurting because even though it's being built in the US they're importing a lot of the internals and that's where the import taxes on astle eiffel the had exemptions. I mean they've asked for yet but they pay so they did that. Really Embarrassing Piney show with the president couple of weeks ago they they basically just let him lie about everything in his way where he doesn't tell the truth right so we just opened this apple factory well and it's been for a while oil couple years apple's factory yeah and and they just sat. There is something you know. Tim Cook just sat. There is something up presumably because he won't tariff exemptions and yet you said he's not getting them you know what the game I don't know I'm I'm really disappointed that Tim Cook could stand on stage next to someone that you know you know. He disagrees with on a fundamental level. Almost everything but I guess. If you're the biggest tech company nobody in the world I guess. Sometimes she got a tight one for the team. Well they're capitulated into China and Russia so I guess this kind of goes right along with. Don't stand up for the values so you actually have go for the money you know. They all multibillion dollar company at the end of the night point. Yeah you know that. He's this is business. Unfortunately your wireless mobile connections finally finally solve problems for pay twice as much as the answer. Well technically yes. I thought it'd be disagreement here. You Waiver in defense. I would say that mobile price. probate process here in the. UK are a pittance compared to what you guys. This would not be affordable foldable in the US. So yeah the situation for to bring everyone up to speed. Everyone may remember that I was on rages on a really bad. Kinda two two and to help make a DSL connection. And that was the best I could get. And the calls me no end of grief and that sort of thing and I'll replace it with a mobile broadband so offensive offensive via rutter connecting to the nearest four G. Network and there was giving me about six seven megabits and I was pretty happy about that was paying less than I was paying for the two megabit DSL but he was the problem being for G. It wasn't constant and it wasn't reliable. So what would happen is come from three or four in the afternoon. Normally when the school kids start coming home until about eight nine o'clock at night the latency would go up and the bandwith would go down. You have called the fortnight. Yeah exactly and of course I was. This problem may my own house because I have kids of my own sure and then we would find that it was find most of the time but every now and again it would just literally fall off a cliff and this could be. I think what was happening is we are very figuratively. eardley falling off the KRILL. Sorry did I say it's a bad habit bad habit. We all have figuratively fall off a cliff but yeah I think I think the problem was. We have devices in our house that also update because that's what devices do and everything is big nowadays. And what would happen. Is You know I'd be streaming something from the BBC late at night and all of a sudden I start getting huge buffering and that sort of thing and it was probably because something somewhere decided to download update. We'll check in or something like that is so it just it was. It was because it was unreliable. It wasn't a great experience so I decided finally fiddled fiddled with the Wi fi I wonder whether it was Wi fi channels the house rather than the the four g connection itself and ultimately. I decided that that probably the problem was add. Too many devices on a single connection and the issue was often. I would find eventually so problems if I go and shout the kids. It's clear up. Yeah because they would stop doing whatever they were doing so I came to conclusion that probably needed was two on two different networks and so I went out and bought same for another I had I had to route so I went out and bought him for another network the so the original one was on three and then the second one was on a company called E. A. had recently announced that they they were going to do an unlimited a broad mobile the same for about twenty eight pounds a month. Wow that's yeah and and this is this this is you know. No no data caps no throttling limits whatsoever. So I bought one of those stuck in the other in the other Mobile Riester. I had reconfigured the house so that we now have to completely independent Wifi networks. We have one of the kids and then we have one that that Landon I use and also the all the TV's on the House and the kids it's one these on the middle floor and that is for them and that gets the that's the the three connection and it's sort of it's slower. I get I get about twelve or thirteen. megabits it's the second only connection whereas I get at seven megabits only on the three one so the kids use that one and they Because they are the on the uses of it and they almost sporadic uses. They're really happy with it because it's dedicates them and then we use the other one and it's faster and we can stream whenever we one we don't have to worry about kids devices updating or anything like that and we now have sold law shoes. That's pretty cool. Yeah and Tho-. I'm still the experience Inexpensive well this is saying he because of the market here in the UK. I can afford to do this. And it's not prohibitively expensive. I'm paying about yet paying just a little bit more than I was paying for. The standalone two megabit DSL connection for at before buckle to mobile connections and the advantages. Well is that if one of the networks goes down the three went down for a couple of days a few weeks ago and then completely cut off. Because you've got another network so unless all of the networks go down your I K- interesting. Yeah it's a good solution and I mean. He was struggling for five years. Yes it's removes. It's this house and we've been nearly five years. Yes so yeah. We're we're pretty please now because basically has become a nation which is what I wanted it to be so. Let's let's talk about the subject that we asked the readers to our the listeners to give feedback on and of course on facebook and almost all of these I'll be honest actually came from facebook. They didn't income from listeners. You listeners aren't sending feedback at But before we get to that let me find this came. I'm from Elissa Sally I'm going to have to fire up tweet decare. We were talking about the whole topless from Amazon. And I said I don't know anybody who owns one of these Amazon Echos and Unless I said You said you don't know. Oh anyone with an echo show five. I have one arrive yesterday but I haven't had a chance to open yet another toy and then later says it's in. The kitchen turned turned off the cameras. Since I won't be using it. Great for music recipes timers alarms weather worth for fifty bucks and she sent a little picture on twitter twitter. And I you know it it does Kinda cool You know it's really. It's IT'S A. It's a kindle fire or can can afire but it's not but it is yes a kid who father plug all yeah and and it's tilted up g Yep I I haven't had any feedback so let us know Elissa. Is it working. Great is it I'm a little hesitant. I'm not a big privacy Z.. Guy But I don't know I the more I hear about these devices. That are always listening stuff. I gotta be honest at groups mail a little bit. Yeah I know what you main we've kind of. We've plunged pretty long headlong as the Amazon Echo is a system we have four or five house now. Each of the kids have one. Let's so listen to music. We have one in the kitchen that she's for music and for talking to other teams in the house we use the drop in HR. Because I house is three stories. It's very convenient. When and some these on the top floor to be able to use that show up the stairs so we use that all the time? The one that I have in the bedroom is the echo spot. So that is the small on the has a screen on it. It's like a little kind of orange bowl or it's sort of an oriole large orange or grapefruit and that has little round screen on it and camera and the reason is that in. The bedroom was displaying the time and yeah I I think I think Leeann plays jeopardy now again. We don't use the video screen for pretty much anything else. You can watch videos like news news snippets and things. We've got a do that. It works great. It's an alarm clock because it's always showing the time and it also shows the weather so that's kind of what easy for we could live without it if we had one without the screen but yeah the the show. I'm not convinced I need one. Well maybe a less it will give us the reasons to buy but but you are right. It does occasionally occur to me that we have these devices hooked up the Internet listening to all the time in the house. That's I don't know it's still all of this and having said that I don't know if you've not just this but I'm not just the recent update sue. IRS AND WATCH OS has to meet Syria Syria. Bit more sensitive to be false triggering a lot more than you see for me. I have a a cost that underlines the fact that you apple devices are actually listen since you all the time as well and they could be sending that data off you never know why they are. I mean apple. Got In trouble for exactly that not too long ago and they promise such doing anymore but unlike Google and Amazon kind of believe apple and they say that they're not going to do that anymore now should they probably not out. I mean they're they're huge company. And what do they care but part of me kind of says. Yeah I kind of believe that. At least a record saying they're trying hang on T- Still whereas the others are definitely well. I I've said this before and I'll say it again. I'm apples customer. I give apple money for these services and these devices that I use I use Google and I use Amazon and I give Amazon money to be a member number but they seem to forget that I'm the customer. Yeah whereas Amazon or a Google doesn't even pretend they're customer advertisers customers. And I'm I'm the product I have. Yeah I've colleague of Mindset to me she said how do I turn off Amazon prime. I seem to been enrolled in it. I don't remember enrolling for it and I. I'm sure it wasn't the Amazon. When she was browsing the side just decided she should become a prime trailer? I'm sure she did. Click on. Somebody's do it. But you know these designed to kind of lead you into doing that without necessarily understanding what you're doing and that's exactly what I'm yeah and they don't make it clear on that you are a member or if you are how to get out of being a member I'll say spent fat. I like to think that I know my wave around the Amazon pretty well. Eight took me about three. Four minutes of searching on the Amazon sought to figure out say de-subscribe from prime it was not a single click prices by immagination. Okay so I just went to Amazon If I there's a menu this prime but and then it says manage my membership. I clicked that Continued a membership management. The right here on the right lines. why continuing didn't do anything CIO cir prime benefits. I click that and there's on my benefits at the top of the screen should be three boxes and I think the one on the Brian Count. Don't your your membership and subscriptions and we have that. Because that's where I think it would be. Yeah and that's where it is in managed subscriptions my Amazon prime actually renews on my birthday. So everyone sent me money for my birthday so I can pay eight from Amazon and then well no it doesn't say. To unsubscribe their go to my prime membership advanced controls. And that's doesn't show me how to UNSUBSCRIBE. Wow I'm going around and this is the thing and you had to hit the right one so you basically the way you do. is you go to from the account lists tab you go to your prime membership Your membership while this I'm only UK site so the same. I'm just so you got. Where says hello? Oh you tim at the top. That should be accounts. Enlist right on that list your account for about half down this one that says oh prime membership Yup eh you click that no and then I get a thing that says Of the methods see more plans. Update your rhyme. I yeah that your settings management ship update your settings the Boltzmann that Bolton's a thing that says an membership. Yeah and that's where is well. Yeah Click through all of this stuff to try and figure out what we're heavy duty Tech Uber's and it took me about what two minutes and only be 'cause you walk through it eventually would have found it but I was starting to go into this round robin where I'm thinking. Oh clicked us and then I go back here while I was assigned this page. What's going on You know is that good business practices to make it hard. To unsubscribe for service that they are automatically going to make money off. You probably pretty good. I do I mean why would you make it too easy to stop giving you if you look at the bottom of that page where it says need help there is actually things. They had to cancel my prime membership and get a refund and then says Calcio Prime Membership Click here let me do that. Yep and then as she takes me straight to a cancellation page on not better. Better be careful. What do now because I want to? Innovate and cancel Niagara. They says me he says David. USA Four hundred and fifty pounds forty nine on delivery since March twenty nineteen being a prime member member. That's because I I all the faulty much tougher MOMS and I'm going to back page. 'cause I watch you want the council trump terms this week because I was very unhappy with them because I ended in on saga Monday. I ordered the latest Microsoft surface laptop. Three they had it on sale. It was the high SPEC model with a an is seven and eight gig Ram and a t fifty fifty six GIG. SSD and it was about three hundred and fifty pounds less than the regular price and also they had a thing in the UK. Now where for some products. They'll let you you pay. Interest rate overflight payments are. Yeah so they had that all front as well. It's not too bad and I have the surface laptop one. This tends to be the laptop. Okay you have one working from home and I figured you know it's not a bad deal. I can sell the other one on. It probably won't be too much alcohol. I'll give you go so I did it. And then I got a delivery. Nicest saying it wasn't gonNA come to Friday and this was Monday and I thought what the Hell Yeah. You didn't tell me that before. I clicked links. Thanks radicals I'M A. I'm a prime member. Only Williams didn't really need it but normally why do when they fail to fulfill the prime membership things that I call them up on my Sisa Jason say well you're not during the day and they normally give me a free month the prime so I figured I would do that dumps and get my free month of prime but this time no I co- eventually got three to some gentleman who was somewhat patronizing. I would say and he basically said to me said well really. It's only one day delivery from the day we dispatch it and they said No. That's not what prime is primarily is one day delivery from the day I order it. That's the way always works. I I know in the. US is two days but here in the day he went. No no no. You'll only it's only what we on the basic we'll dispatch and then we guarantee you will have it with a debate. Dispatching it so I said okay. So what happens if you started spectate next much. Do you think that's acceptable. When we wouldn't do that I said well? Yeah but you're telling me YOU'RE NOT DOC niche specialty in the week. That's not what I expect. And he was he was adamant so eventually I said fine. Let me speak to your supervisor about this because I think you yeah. I don't think you understand how what you're telling me. And he said he put meals supervisor and he put me in the whole ten minutes and then hung up and I cancelled the order. Because because you gave it you know you have to do this if you want to. Of course this is not going to change and Amazon's practices. This is an iota booze going to hear about this person. I take the view if a company wants me up and then once feeble when are being the mountain complain then I just don't want to give them my money so I can you know what I can live without that laptop so I'm GONNA cancel it. That's I did so the jazz and gave me twenty four pounds but yeah freelance. Well after you took drastic action though You know last week talking about I ordered the USB hub for the For the car and that came in and it went swimmingly. Well Oh hi installed it just like I was thinking some double sided sticky tape I've got to center councils one between the passenger in the driver's seat in the front and then one between the two backseats while the middle row. Because I've got three rows and swimming pool and so I I was going wait to put it on the back. End of the Senate counsel in the front because that's where the plug is. Yeah but then I decided well the cord. It's not a not very far between the front the back back I thought no actually. I'll plug it in or I'll mount it to the front of the Back Centre Council because that's where they're at and And then when I don't want it plugged in. I could just unplug it but they don't move between those two seats anyway so it doesn't really make a whole lot of sense. The Need to use is a tennis court this right or get to the Jacuzzi. I mean it that's you gotta go through their Electric say that you know but it works great. Great I plug my phone into it. Sent in the back seat and boom no problem I get so hopefully this will head off at the path any of these. No that's my cable. No you've been plugged in for a while. Goals is almost dead now. You're going to get the next thing. Which is okay now? They've got charged. CAVORTS ISN'T GONNA go dad. Doesn't you have Internet now. Brooke has Internet whole doesn't but he's under no misunderstanding just understanding that he's getting an actual cell phone with mobile connectivity anytime soon. It's not gonNA happen. Which is why? What's the car I had to? I had to buy something else too. I had had to buy a new digital multi meter. I was pulling my other one out because you know they have the long leads and the little thing and I was pulling mine and one the cables was under a vice grip and it pulled the lead right it. Just rip the wire right in hand and I was like well I try to find the exact same one and then maybe I can find parts for it and then I started thinking it was twenty dollars. He had spun you so I just bought another one for twenty bucks and this is actually comes with alligator clips to ooh ooh alligator clips. I like the but you know. What do you not need a multi meter? Yeah I do. I can't tell you how many times I've used that Malta meter. I'm doing some wiring. Am I getting power here. I'm turning it on plug it doing electrical work. It's kind of you have to have requirement. Yeah it's I'm glad I like having you know. It's also like having a soldering iron. Avery that I need to solder something you you know. One of the great failings of my life is. I've never learn how to sell something hopefully. Oh I know how to say properly. I'm at the point where I probably couldn't even till if I'm putting two wires together I probably need to spoil spoilt schools of solder AIDS. T wise is together. I buy one of those plastic locks where you put the wire in each side in tightness grief. Yeah I've used this before. They don't work very well. Ah that or shrink wrap shrink. Wrap if it's like speaker wire and stuff like that. That's that's where you time together. You put the little hit with the lighter and melted down. That works good but nothing. You beat solder It took me a long time to figure out actually the proper way to solder something. It's not to heat up as you're putting the solder on it. It's actually when you say you're going to solder something to wires together. You put the heat underneath the wires and then you can tap the Saad'o to the top of the wires and the the Saudis actually drawn down towards the heat and the heat. And you see this is when these things probably sat down with soldiering iron. And an IT'd be it'd be God. Yeah half a day may be a bit practice. I could probably get the hang I just never have Colorado. It's mine was building these arcade cabinets and rebuild. Shirts added building building from scratch in the putting this kind of stuff together that there some of these things you. There's just no way that putting a little clip on. There's going to worker trying to twist you gotta solder. I might my my weapon of choice in that Field Hockley. I love music ugly but but see that the problem with that is left. For instance I had a circuit board that was broken on the back of a monitor neck and I can see where the pins from one one side. We're going to the other and there's a crack right there so you can't really replace the you can replace aboard but you can't replace those those us but she could squeeze it together and pull Khokhlov on. Yeah so you'd have to jump them meaning a wire from one side are the crack to the other and there's no way to do that other than soldering you know before when you said You could fix multimedia that the just went out bought new one. Yeah Yeah that is my solution to that problem by noon. So let's jump into our main. We're not doing a wicky trolling. Because we're dedicating the second half of the show to our special Nelson at the end but I what are your favorite holiday movies First up was Dan night Dan initially created a low end Mac many years ago around the same time. I was actually creating my Mac and he said for Thanksgiving planes trains and automobiles automobiles. And I'll say that's one of my favorite movies of all time. Yeah and Isn't that John his movie. It absolutely is John Candy and Steep mountains to Barton. Yeah Steve Martin is kind of an asked who most of the movie until the very end. Yeah and then you realize what's really going on with John Candy's character. I missed that guy as an actor he was you know he died younger than you. And I are and I He was brilliant. He was such a good good act and he was in home alone two he was. I mean home alone as well not home loan to. He said Christmas as a Christmas story. Where you know what secret Christmas stories when those things that are now massive America of it? No and that's too bad I too because it's a whole Larry's movie it's so funny. It's a Christmas movie but it's a comedy I know. It has narration throughout the whole thing which I think is off putting to some people But if you don't know if you've never seen a Christmas story you seen things from a Christmas story ever see the leg with a stocking on it that the lamp camp. That's from a Christmas story on this university. I've seen those this whole. There's a whole set of cultural memes that have possibly by. Thanks thanks to lack of knowledge of Christmas story. The thing I know about I've never watched it and the other thing on about it has something to do with a BB gun in it. Yeah you should really watch a Christmas story. I seriously you should watch that before the end of the year. It really is hilarious. It takes place in the nineteen fifties and I will I will give it a go but I sure will I I. I recently had one of those experiences when I showed a movie. Vive I found hilarious when I was a kid to my kids and they they endured it and all the way through the guy that this isn't funny that this is yeah but see. Here's the thing. The Christmas story isn't about the kids is an as a kid when you're watching it. You'RE GONNA laugh because of the antics of the kids as an adult. You're GonNa Laugh because of the Dad God because you're going to totally understand these characters. Well I will I will watch and I will eight back Another big thing that came from that movie though is a tradition mission now in America instead of having a Christmas feast you get Chinese food auto a Chinese restaurant or are you or Chinese food in That that wasn't a thing until this movie came out and became a thing because of this movie and I'm not going to spoil anything and why that became a thing but and then Dan also said for New Year's when Harry met Sally Alley which I loved back in the day bores me to tears now and the Isa any want why. I'm trying to remember of it. What is it called souvenirs at? The end of the movie happens on New Year's and remember they have that standing date on New Year's throughout our ways. Why poss that possibly by I officiers in that movie yet? That was the first movie that I recognize. Carrie Fisher in anything other than Star Wars. Yeah fisting IVA so. Hey so hurry. In the pot from Star Wars. Was the police brothers. I forgot that she was in that she was she was just jumping Lacey's wife in the blues brother's trying to kill him. The whole way. Three I was was that before when Harry met Sally time before. At least this is i. I think John Belushi was on it. Jason Harris wrote that. There are so many but for Christmas. One Magic Christmas which which I've never seen a Smoky Mountain Christmas which I've never seen note the polar express which is horrible horrible. CGI I can't. Oh Yeah I Israel Uncanny valley stuff for me that the strange stuff going in that movie that I going on. We've I don't think they ever really probably resolve a hundred percent agree complex. Hanks plays a lot of the kids to. That's that's one of the things so so this is a holy in clones. There's a whole subtext. The whole business with the guy on the roof of the thing and you know the kids one point that being mean to each other than the be nice to reach other and yeah it's it's just very it's very peculiar and I guess you say I'm not sure I like it. I don't home alone. which which we've already discussed gremlins? Would I think he's one of my favorite that-that holds up pretty well and then white Christmas Guy Sir well of course podcasts for Thanksgiving addams family values which doesn't surprise me Christmas he says Gremlins and New Year's and he says kind uh-huh scare but it does have a new year. Seen New Year's Eve seen Anna very long our anniversary young John Doerr in it James Stewart Yeah after the thin man which I don't know if you like classic movies they man series with William Pailin mentally our offensive. What the thin man? I puree after who we see at Max often yeah He says love actually from two thousand and I would have three three. I love actually. That's one of my grant. Yeah Yeah yes. It's it's all the people who are in those movies. Yes there. There was a plus some extra people as well. You know it has some get a daily put daily deposit Alan Rickman Emma Thompson haven't seen that longtime. I might actually watch that again. I think I actually have it. I think L. now. Interestingly enough you'll notice on the characters on the guys just plays the. He's the guy who who's in love with his best friend's wife and you know the thing where he goes to the door with the cards. Yes yeah and of course is Andrew Lincoln who went onto become the star of the walking dead. And you wouldn't have put those not guys together. Yeah yeah no I remember the scene now and yes I do know that was So different there Michael Breed aide wrote over the past few years. I've kind associated the Harry Potter movies with holidays in and even more recently the star wars franchise. Here's a better breakdown for me Thanksgiving skiving. It may seem odd. But I like watching the Shawshank redemption. Chris miss an old version of a Christmas Carol in New Year Star. Wars a new hope. So you can time the death star explode you know Michael Leaf and I think I I think actually he makes a very good point. There very often the movies we think about the holidays and not necessarily holiday movies. They just movies. We always see on the holidays. And yes he's Brian Potter. And the story was movies. Traditionally get shown to death during the holidays because people are on vacation their home and stations stations in in probably more importantly nowadays is the online services are really pushing those. At that time of the year I would actually agree with the Harry Harry Potter though. I do associate Harry Potter with his Christmas movie. Well just because it's magic but they only have a fairly big crispus versus Christmas scene. The big part of each of the each of the books of the movies. I I have to say actually when he mentioned here when Michael mentioned any version of Christmas Carol Actually Thought About Christmas movie that I haven't four for ages but it's hilarious which is Scrooge Murray Bill Murray yeah ABS- I mean it's classic of Feet Bill. Murray it's so good John Guy worked with a specialist How about an Oldie? Meet me in St. Louis. I guess a Christmas story is an Oldie nowadays to it actually is yeah Ah Anna Walters This is my long lost cousin that I talk about occasionally From my biological father side. She said Christmas vacation in the old grinch or my faves Christmas vacation. I was surprised it took that long before. Someone mentioned it because that that look I know Chevy Chase has that reputation being an ass dial but that is a brilliant movie. It's so funny. I amaze me about Chevy Chase his reputation. It took so long for him to get it. I always thought I was enjoyed his movies. I always thought what I what she's movies are thought I was. I bet that guy's a complete Dick and realize in your Dunbarton my half brother said Christmas vacation and Diehard already that's on my list you know there's something about I don't know why it feels. Like of course they play play Christmas music and it happens during Christmas party. Yeah there's something about the end of that movie out. After Alan Rickman has fallen off the building which I've watched a special about that. You know his reaction to falling as an actual reaction because he was hanging thirty feet in the air over green screen and they're going to drop him on three. Yeah and the guy say okay. We're just going to drop him at one and they did a one take shot because they were really worried. He's going to get hurt even though he's falling into the big poofy at the bottom. It's still thirty feet up in the air. And so they said one and then they let him go so his reaction is an act when you see his face like Oh. Aw that's an actual acting there. It freaked him out and it scared the crap out of him when they did so every time I see that scene. I think that's a real reaction actually. That's what Alan Rickman looks like. He's falling to his death But the end of that movie The music plays and the snow is coming down and it's not snow. It's ash but still something about that. That's Christmas Laura. Another one of my cousins actually. They have cousins tissues and is now she somebody else's daughter I that whole side of the family hurt Thanksgiving she said you've got mail. Which is is a movie that I really liked and I watched it just recently? Actually in a does not hold up in time because it's very heavy on the tech side on some things. Tom Hanks characters always using using in meg. Ryan is always using laptops and all my God it does not hold up and they're using. AOL AOL this is. This is just not good the Christmas Elf which again. I'm I'm surprised that took so long for someone who mentioned Elf because really. That's the movie that Will Farrell became came will ferrell. SNL and he has some minor stuff in other movies but Elf. That is a tour De Force. That guy's talent I mean he's just brilliant in there. Aw and then New Year's Eve moonstruck which has share and what's his face. Nicholas Cage Nicholas Cage which has okay. I haven't seen I saw it when Kamsky says Jason Cubes. Christmas vacation mccamley said Alastair Sim version Asia of Christmas. Carol said that Allison is so that will be the one of the old black and white versions the US from the Larry Grenell of course From my Mac and Mackerel Imac Rolex bells and He's at Christmas story Mike I worked with him at ODBC he said L.. It's a wonderful life a Christmas story Christmas vacation in die hard. It's not Christmas until I see Falon. Yeah Melissa Davis says someone asked me. What is the favorite movie? I watched Thanksgiving in Christmas. She she posted this on our own but then she tagged me in. Et's our traditional Thanksgiving movie because Because my Nanna always put it on the big floor. TV in the basement. When we were little I now play it for my kids apple? Tv I think fun traditions are important ingredients for making good childhood memories. It's a good thought exercise to happen. I agree with you that that's about you know that's about a movie that showed that the holidays are of the being about the holidays. That's the first movie I remember. Remember people going on Christmas Day to go watch. I think that's when I saw the first time to his history thing for some reason my kids get he t they don't it completely they don't the magic does not grab them three T and I don't know why it is but it's because they've grown up with movies that are so derivative e t that when you look back at the original it feels more derivative than everything that's come sense show. I showed my door so recently. Batteries not included a bad movie. Oh I thought it would appeal to her because they appealed to me the H. night. No absolutely absolutely not no suze. Deliver the way thing about batteries not included is the most the CASA dead really not not just the old people till I mean all the young people in the old died young as well. Because you like the movie. What did maybe? Maybe maybe it's a little spaceships killed them because the movie is bad. Sousa Gilbert one of the three geeky ladies wrote. Christmas is a Christmas story. Original grinch New Year's as Boondock Saints You probably haven't seen have in She's he's from Massachusetts and she misses the accent that makes sense Boondock saints is. I'm going to try to describe it you just. I don't I don't know if it really appeal to you though honestly it's very much An American type of Type of story. I guess you'd say Elizabeth Sally of course one of the other three Geeky he later says I don't do Christmas movies. I mean you don't do them But at Charlie Charlie Brown Christmas is the best. Well how how do you know. What's the best if you don't do them? I disavow your answers. And then she says how the Christmas Levi's bet. Ah Yes. And then she says and how the grinch stole Christmas is a close second so I e the Kid is constantly picked on and everyone makes fun. One of the emitting. He's a loser. Charlie Brown and the other one eliciting herself on the grinch role. I think I think the whole day Christmas I think at least as it denial. Yup I think so too. Yeah so that is the list for me. I'M GONNA have to go with. It's a tie between die hard and the Harry Potter movies which hey look I guess. It's an Alan Rickman Christmas for me Christmas. I feel I feel good about watching the Harry Potter movies and those movies in those stories mean a lot to to our family They mean a lot too not just kids and older kids but the younger kids as well they mean a a lot to me and they mean maybe the most of my wife Julie I mean she loves the Harry Potter Stuff So I mean she has a a Harry Potter Wad collection. My wife is awesome dude. Yeah absolutely Needs to take it to eleven. We'll get down there eventually. I ah very bakary. Wow Wow wow. You won't believe what just happened. What did you hear that sound? I got a reminder on my computer guess what the reminder says us. What Julie's birthday tomorrow I just talk about her and my computer is like hey or birthdays tomorrow have you have you worried about? Allah's we're we're worried about Amazon and Google listening to us. My Mac said Oh by the way I as a famous. UK magician his catchphrase. Trays would say and that's magic. So what's your favorite holiday movie. I think I think we've covered a lot of mind. I mean I don't. They tend to watch movies over Christmas anymore. Because of the Lafayette it's just become dot thing. So but but yeah I mean I would the Harry Potter ones definitely as I said. Scrooge Te is one I've I remember watching in the past and really enjoyed about I would I would Kathleen Watch again if it was on. Make time to watch it but again I've always thought diehard is a Christmas movie I know some people argue. The isn't the you sent me a picture. Wasn't that you that sent me a picture about Harry Potter era die hard. I think someone sent me a picture on my phone. I don't remember who it was now and it says proof that diehards Christmas movie because it has this racket Walmart. Says your favorite Christmas movies diehards right there so walk okay if Walmart says. It's the Christmas movie Christmas movie. You know what the the and the Walton family he rumble. Not a very very spiritual people so you you sure I heard last week we may have done I remember. Saying something about Bruce Willis wasn't even on the poster. Sure at the beginning now that we didn't discuss that maybe told the truth but somebody else Yeah that that. Diehard that Bruce Willis wasn't a huge huge movie star at the time he was known for Moonlighting. Yeah and he got the role and he got a huge paycheck for which was really unexpected. Because a whole bunch of people would pass on this movie. And because everybody's like well. He's a loser through the movie. I don't WanNa because at the time. Remember these actually super buff. Guys are old Buildi- semester salone long run and big macho tough guys and this was not that role I mean he is an actual human. I mean he's barefoot. Through most of the movie he's all bloodied up and he's guesses but kicked left and right And then you you know he wins at the end but it's not because he he beat up the bad guy. Yeah thought the back guy. Didn't he did the scene. Where where Alan Rickman? Switches to the American accent is so good. I love that scene because you want to see these two characters onscreen at the same time and they actually paid off. It's a great movie I really really liked it But anyways when they first started promoting the movie and they had posters at the movie theaters and stuff. It was just a picture of the building. They didn't have Bruce Willis in there at all and it wasn't until after it came out and became a big hit that they reissued all these posters because it stayed in. The theater is a long time that it showed. The face of Bruce Willis kind of behind the building and holding the gun and But that's the movie that made Bruce Willis Riffles. Yeah I I am none of these Christmas. Maybe it's just the time could movie absolutely. It was one of those movies where economy he going to it. You don't really know what to expect and you came out and you would just blown away. How good it was well? I I know a lot of people like the third one and equally Samuel L. Jackson and I do like that movie a lot. I think it's excellent but I like the second one almost as much as the first day I take the the airport really like that one. They kinda messed it up towards the end but for most of the movies even make even sets the line hacking the same saved guts. Yeah yeah terrorists yes perfect. Yeah so let's spend spend the last few minutes here. David Tech Fan is coming up on its tenth birthday hard to believe that we've been doing the show almost ten years still the new show still the new show. And when you think about it I you know I I did the my Mac podcast for five years. Well six years and and then my jump to this show and I've been doing this way longer than that show we. Also you and I also started Geeky a show ever and that's still going strong in fact Melissa who were talking about earlier on that show. So we've been on a number of different podcast and when we started tech fan we purposely. Didn't name it anything after apple or MAC or iphone because we thought it was too limiting we are our our interests went way beyond just that smaller segment of the tech universe but yet we still kinda painted ourselves thousand cornered David in that it says tech right in the name of the show. Yeah and we've we've stretched those powdery. Someone yes and and it seems to me that we while we still love TAC. There's a lot less to talk about that. We're kind of passionate about that spurs long conversations. it's so over the years we've filled in with other things including our rookie. Trolling thing which isn't always tech related. Ah We've talked about star wars marvel movies. And if there's a big movie will always have a spoiler discussion about it and it seems to me that that seems to be a lot more of our passion so we don't WanNa Stop Doing Tech Fan and this isn't the end of Tak van but this is going to be a change to tech van in that tech fan after after this week is moving to every two weeks now for the next month or so you'll still see a show from us in your subscription description to tech fan But four twenty four twenty one. This is four twenty four twenty one will come out in a couple of weeks but you're actually starting a brand brand new show if you like tech fan chances are you're going to like the whole new show because still David I although we may start inviting other people in on this show as well But we're starting to show we all I'm GONNA do Discussion of those other things we like you want to you. You want to announce the name of the show so that the name of the show is of the geeks pub gigs part as Geeks pub. Yes because is the idea is is that just as this show is two guys talking about stuff. This is GonNa be the same sort of thing but we we kind of faming along the lines of pine in the pub talking about movies Games Scifi books the basically anything we WANNA talk about. That's exactly right but we still want to talk about technology. And that's what tech fans going to before. So we're not gonNA talk about tech per se on on GEEKS PUB and we're not gonNA talk about a lot of the geeks pub stuff anymore here on tech. We're GONNA this tech Vin more on technology allergy. Because I still have a passion for technology as does David. But you know like you guys were were multidimensional. We want to talk about other things and he and I love talking to you David I really do. It's a highlight of every week for me is to sit down in front of the computer. Fire up wire and hear your voice. Jason Talk about whatever and I know some of the Times. It sounds like we've kind of you know really planned out an episode because it comes together while other ones not so much and we never. Oh really plan them out. I mean we just naturally fall into these conversations and We want to expand on that but we in by expanding I mean. We're we're GONNA do this new show this also an open invitation. If anybody out there wants to join us in the pub occasionally We'd like that too because this is is going to be. You don't have to be some kind of a tech expert to come on you know if you know we're GonNa talk about Star Wars or a certain movie or a whatever it is and you WanNa to be on that show. Let us know. It's pretty easy to do now. The problem is we usually record on a Friday and a Friday morning at that but if someone wants to come in. They can't make a Friday morning because they're working. We can move it to a Sunday. So let us know if you WANNA be on Geeks POB It's going to launch next week. We gotta come up with the logo between now and then may have just a placeholder. I I don't even know if I'm going to create a its own website. David Hey but I think I might just hosted at my like. I've done everything else in the show notes will be at my dot com. I don't know if I really need to continue doing the separate website for something. I think that for Tech Fan but I think for Geeks pub. I think it's going to be at my Mac and nobody's going to the website to to see the show l.. I know John Nemo's but most people are listening to it on their mobile device in the car for a walk or whatever but they're they're not going to the website to listen to it and even if if they want to they can still go to my Mac dot com. Listen to it Just like they can Tak van. Just that can geeky show ever or three geeky ladies of the my podcast or it shows that we're publishing a central apple podcast which by the way we had feedback on. But we're GONNA save that to the next tech van in two weeks so David next week pub. I'll have a pint of often make it a well. Well I get a double double by then double double pied. I'll have to double shot. Yeah I'll see see that the.

Amazon apple UK US Microsoft Harry Harry Potter Alan Rickman John Williams facebook Harry Potter Atari David Cohen John Hughes Google Tom Hanks
Thousands of at-risk young people not visited by childrens services in lockdown, and the UK 'wants Biden to be President'

The Leader

13:32 min | 3 d ago

Thousands of at-risk young people not visited by childrens services in lockdown, and the UK 'wants Biden to be President'

"Hello it's funny here and thanks for listening to the later. This is where we bring you the latest news interviews and analysis from the Evening Standard's newsroom every day at four. Pm Hit subscribe to make sure you don't miss out and if you like it gives a writing to. We'd love to hear what you think now from the evening standard in London. This is the leader. Hi I'm Bonnie Christian. How lockdown will hit some of the most vulnerable children for years to come. We have young people living with parents who've been enormous stress. Some of the children their education just disappeared into the ether. Our Investigations Editor David Cohen on his exclusive report revealing a shocking full in high visit. Spa Children's services. And he's going to do things that nobody ever whatever think even possible because he's following the radical left agenda as the US presidential election. Basil hates up an exclusive survey reveals. Most Brits would rather Joe Biden Donald Trump but few believe he will taken from the Evening Standard's editorial column. This is the leader for the whole thing. Pick up the newspaper or two standard dot COM dot UK slash comment in a moment the at risk children left high and dry during lockdown an evening. Standard investigations found thousands of vulnerable young people across London including some most at risk when not visited by children's services teams during lockdown. We can reveal face to face visits in the three months until the end of June plummeted by seventy five percent in some Berra's that's causing concern among childcare professionals and out aditorial column. Says it can't go on. What has happened behind closed? Doors during London's lockdown we know the stories of homeworking zoom calls clapping key workers with our neighbors and spending time in a quieter city but there are things we don't know about to some of the much darker and more worrying. Evening Standard has exposed one of them the shocking collapse in visits by children's services teams to vulnerable families during lockdown. Of course carrying out. Work like this is never simple and asking people to go out on visits when others could work from home is demanding but replacing face to face visits with skype or zoom calls leaves children at risk. You simply can't tell if a child is threatened or frightened without seeing them soon we will see the consequences but then we need councils to work out how to get their teams out again to give young people the protection they need the evening. Standard's David Muslin spoke without investigations. As David Cohen. On this story he started by asking him. How serious the risk is to children's services. When they can't physically mate with young people experts in child practitioners have been talking a lot of this period about what they call digital or online Connection to young people and the overwhelming feeling is that zoom or skype or facetime can never be a substitute for face to face visits practitioners. Say that if a young person is at risk they can't really assess the risk online let alone begin to manage it. You country body language. He country turn voice and possibly most importantly you know who's just out of video cameras shot. It could well be the person who they're at risk from if you remember that young people are at risk sometimes from their own families but also sometimes from the communities and one of the experts in this area a youth worker from charity. One of the things they were saying is that sometimes even phoning the young person. It's difficult because they don't have a phone and you have to phone them through the parents who in some cases as I said is the risk factor but all this being said David we do have a situation where lots of people are working at home there is still a risk of Kaduna virus. Can we really ask people to go into other people's homes to see these children? Well they're all way. So some of the council's say they seeing them? Either in their home or near the home side's possible to a child outside you could get to the front door. Mpp and See the child who comes outside and you can maintain distance. I think it's quite possible to do this And some of the council's are clearly trying to do this But yes it is difficult and it's extremely extremely challenging and it's Pose them with the kind of challenges that they've never had to face before for your article in the Evening Standard Today. You've spoken to some of the people who are working with children services won't kind of things. Did they tell you what concerns where they raise them well? So for example we carry the case study of a young seventeen year old cooled. Zack who's His mistake was to befriend children from a rival state to the one he lived in a killing took place in which the gang members he befriended had killed somebody in his estate gang in his estate and although he was not involved in any way in this he became in in the woods of the local gang a legitimate target by association. They were talks ahead of lockdown of moving him because he's life was clearly in danger. He was getting daily threats on social media. Suddenly lockdown happens and everything froze. Everything stopped few weeks into lockdown things with fine he was staying at home but then as one does young people start to leave the home and one day he went out and a group of young people came at him with machetes and he barely was able to get home and he called. He was on a the third to his youth worker that night youth work from charity. That had come in to help him. He'd been begging social services to move him. This youth work started advocating on his behalf. Said he needs to be moved this weekend. Social services literally have one person there that we can unable to act quickly unable to see him and this without this charity work acting on his behalf. He feels that this person may well not be alive today so there are clearly immediate dangers being face by some young people. I wonder though if in the years to come. We're going to see problems arising because of a lack of ability is available to some young people shooting this time. That might not be apparent right now. I think I think that's a very good supposition. David I mean basically. We have young people. Living with parents who've been on the enormous stress. Some of them will have not seen will will have seen their parents perhaps not being able to cope displaced anger onto the children I I've I've interviewed young people and and families parents whether or now sort of fourteen of them living in a three bedroom so every available room is now used as a bedroom. Some of the children were at schools with was quite a bit of tension on them but others have been a pupil referral units and their education just disappeared into the ether so the impacts on young people's mental health and education prospects. I think is something that we need to talk about moving forward and we'll have impact in years to come and you can read David's special report in the Evening Standard newspaper or online at standard dot co dot. Uk. Next if the result would going to be decided in the UK is quite clear. Mr Trump would almost certainly get a hammering my spritz want Donald Trump out of the oval office spot come November few think. That's likely three months out from November. All is towards the US presidential election. Donald Trump is trailing behind Democrat Joe Biden and his latest deeply personal against his rival signals. An ugly battle ahead hurt. The Bible hurt. God He's again Scott. He's against guns. He's against energy are kind of energy as the UK looks on an exclusive. It's smari survey for the Evening Standard reveals more than two-thirds of Brits would prefer Mr Biden to win but far fewer believe he will our deputy political editor. Nick sessile joins me now nick how does the UK view Donald Trump ahead of the election while the evening standard has got an exclusive poll sauce Mori? Today which shows if the presidential election was being decided here Joe Biden would be clear when they should. This survey shows that sixty nine percent of the public. What Mr Biden to win compared to twelve percent who would prefer Donald Trump to win even a majority of Conservative supporters? Actually favor Mr Biden. Fifty four percent and at number spirals among Labor backers up to eighty nine percent but wanting something is very different from expecting if you look at adults generally forty two percent expect Mr Baden twin which is ahead of this trump. He's thirty eight percent but not by large margin given the Times. Where now have those figures changed much since the last election was certainly back in towards sixteen before the last election the British public already took a very dim view of donald trump with eighty four percent having an unfavorable view towards him? This reading currently is still over three quarters with sixty four percent of adults in Britain having a very unfavorable opinion of Mr Trump. Now obviously the elections are not to him started in America and the US polls put misapplied and a heads Including In many key battleground states I was own a Florida and Michigan Carolina Pennsylvania and wins counted. But the if the result was going to be decided in the UK is quite clear that Mr Trump would almost certainly get hammering and how do the Brits view of Joe Biden compared with the previous candidate Hillary Clinton Joe Biden doesn't excite people in Britain very much certainly compared to Mr Trump only fifteen percent of people have an unfavorable view of him but the people generally generally feel strongly about him than they did either way about Hillary Clinton you mentioned that Donald Trump was trailing behind in a number of states. Is that GOP still widening? He he had been falling quite sharply in the polls but that seems to steadied now so all over from his trump yet and in in certainly in some polls figs apple is one in Iowa which puts him a few points behind. Mr Biden is is clearly the favorite but would it quite well out donald trump yet. And that's the leader. You can read more on those stories by picking up a copy of the newspaper or sitting standard DOT CO DOT UK and. We also have more briefings available at seven. Am through your smart speaker. Just ask for the news from the Evening Standard. This podcast is back on Monday at four PM.

Evening Standard Donald Trump Joe Biden UK US David David Cohen London Times Spa Children London Bonnie Christian Editor David Muslin GOP Hillary Clinton apple Berra
TechFan 397 - Fire Pit

TechFan

56:16 min | 1 year ago

TechFan 397 - Fire Pit

"You're listening to another great podcast and the my neck podcasting network. Tech their podcast number three hundred and ninety seven. That's a lot of episodes. You know, what I was thinking about earlier David Cohen what? I thought it might be fun to go back and say what will we talk about five years ago ten years ago? Can't quite go back ten years. This is still going you show after all we I the show starting September twenty ten so we're not quite at that point. But I don't I can't always tell what the hell we were talking about. The show next to that. Good. Yeah. I I get quite lazy. I know says well the last thing we want to do is actually go back, and he won't be sounded like nine years ago. I'm not gonna listen to just be awful like, okay. One year ago may twenty eighteen David and Tim discussed the echo sharing private audio as well as Amazon working with law enforcement and facial recognition services and the rule of unintended consequences. I wonder if I could have made that frigging sentence longer. Talk about those on the criticism that sentence. I think the one before that three fifty Tim David disgust goule duplex in possible cheating the demonstration phone call. Yeah. That would. I think that and then three or forty nine Puerto Rico Infinity war. I remember that was pretty good one was Eric joined us we talked about the hurricane that hit down there. We also talked about Marvel's Infinity war. And then three or four eight I talked about Korbut high Star Trek discovery Oroville quick. We're really into. What was going on the TV shows is that Cobra con thing so guy. Yeah. They just released episode two or offseason to believe the gaining of this month or into last month laters end last month bread, stuffing. I think it's YouTube premium, right? So it's not Google thing. So yes, of course, it's changed. I mean, the old, of course, I subscribe for one month watched all the episodes in two days, and I'm subscribed again. So they get fifteen bucks from your ten bucks or whatever. That's right. It was worth it. But it's not exactly taken out of the world. Each your premiums at no, they have all their content sucks. Yeah. Except for the Cobra KAI thing. And people really seem to like the Cobra Cup season two is just as good a season one. So I am. I saw this morning that the coasts Goliath has just happened this morning that effectively they they've already announced they were shutting down nest as a separate division. But now typically the shutting down all the necessary services. So if you if you haven't invested that nasty co system than by the end of the most of it will stop talking to each shell to to themselves though will work individually, but they went salt to each other anymore. So if you bought one of those three hundred four hundred dollar nest thermostats, your it's going to be. The self will keep going, but apparently the way the next stuff used to work was it was it had it was branded works with nest. And then all the things will talk to each other. So for instance, the secured, they the the thermostat me like a hub and all the other devices like security cameras, and that sort of thing they would all communicate via this harbor to back in service, and you could do remote control everything remotely from one happened all of our thing and all of that stopping working. And of course, you will probably be of been more likely to buy individual. I'll quiet you would have been. He said somebody at the dole. I think he's my Wasco on. Yes. It is. What was I saying? Yes, you you would have bought a thermostat, and then you would have bought cameras and everything based on the fact they work together. And now they want. And that's Google. Well, here's what I don't get. I get it. Here's what I have a problem with. I I don't have any of the stuff, but that's kind of beside the point. So. If you buy some tech cure that, you know requires communications between each other and that company folds. Okay. I get it. The company went out of business. I'm screwed with my purchase. But what can you do the company went out of business? Right. This isn't a company going out of business. This one the rich. Yeah. Who just decided, you know what? We're not going to do this anymore. So the people that spent all this money is just well to every sucks to be. Don't worry. We'll have something new fee to buy that will be the thing is that Len Email those people and go, oh, we've got to upgrade offering for year, which will work. What if they upgraded the back end services? So these things would work, but in a new way with new well features would that be something? We know. That's not gonna happen at the ferry minimum company. Giggles resources could afford just to keep that that thing going in the background for a few years. You know, release a five year plan for it. So I look, okay, we're gonna be we're not going to develop this anymore and three years. We're not gonna be patching anymore at off to five years. It's going to stop working. So people have time to get some benefit out of what they've invested in. And also kind of know what they're doing. They know this like six months is gone. I think that's a really rotten boats. Good with us this time in the other. In the thing is I if you're a business and Google really pushes their business solutions. How could you trust Google with your business data? I mean with the way you run your business. How could you trust them will little bit light not to be honest in the enterprise space? Microsoft is changing things all the time. I mean, they just Microsoft just announced that they're going to have a Lennox Colonel built into windows ten. Yeah. But that thing is that they re they're a large launch amount. Their revenue comes from their cloud services. Now, all the stuff bison last year. And if you look at what they've done with Skype for business. They you get to a protocol teams now, which is much more complicated. Nobody really understands exactly what it's meant to do. And it changes all the time. I'm on office three six five in the office. And I've run it for our company and every week. I'm getting an EMA with about ten nights and saying this is changing this is going away. This is being moved to a new experience. You know, they constant developing it, and you you have to try and keep up is very very difficult. Yeah. Sometimes a tried and true is a better course of action. I think but I mean, you can't stop the progress of innovation. The cloud is the cloud. And this is the nature of the cloud of. Fortunately, you know, opposite than Amazon summit this week and Amazon web services summit, and they put up a list on a PowerPoint of all the different services that some web services offer. And there's this probably forty or fifty different things. Most people don't know what half these things are the defensively anything, you can think of doing Amazon has a wife you to do easily in the cloud, and you know, it's amazing business for them. But of course, the downside the cloudy. I mean, you get all that stuff way. You know, you don't have to roll your own. You can just go and buy service and the downside. Of course, is it's been devotes all the time in you run the risk of things going away. And you know, you'd argue with Amazon web services in a corporate environment. You kind of know what you're getting into the problem with companies like nest is as a Kisumu. Is you don't know what you're getting into? You don't need you you you're being turned into a beat Sesa for Google. It's it's disappointing to because you know, they have the resources to to to do something to screw over a whole soi. Here's the thing though. I think a lot of people who bought the net stuff. They don't realize Google now. You know, they hide behind these sub brands. Well, apparently, apparently this is now what's going to happen is they're not going to do that anymore. It will be known as Google nest, and it'll be perfectly obvious that nest is just a sub brand of Google is not a separate company. There's something they should have done a while ago. I guess well might as well kill it off. I. Come on. So this is us now. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's the horrible. Who here's something? That's not horrible as I got a new garden hose. Who cares? Right. Well, I got a medal garden hose. David somebody's just be fighting with bygone than highs this morning, and every time I put it down the spray head would fly off and spray me with water everywhere. And I'm very nice. I just got it. I haven't used it yet. I watched a video there's this reporter on a Detroit, I can't think of his name right now. But he's been doing these kind of investigative reporting in fun stuff for decades, I suppose, and he's got this thing called the wall of shame. And he goes after creepy people stuff people that are doing bad things. And of course, it's all viewer generated. You know, we'll send him an Email and say, hey, this person is selling. His services that he's a licensed plumber, and he's not he ripped me off. Wait, we have go. We have a similar. There's a program he could watch dog. And they have a guy traders he does that. And they put cameras in the house and show will the the bad things these guys do, and then they kind of do the at the end of the thing that do the door. Stop thing where they go in say what we saw you doing this. What we say about it. Yeah. Yeah. Well, this guy's been doing it for a long time. And I watch a lot of his old content on YouTube. I came I I subscribe to them. I think it's wall check something like that. And it's good stuff. But he also has Famer shame stuff where he they'll buy a product, and he'll find someone in a community that he tests this product with. And so I was watching a couple of these and a lot of these products will not good. Well, then he has this comedian on. And they have a metal hose does this thing actually work in the commercial makes it look very impressive. Like it. They say you can't even puncture it with a nail. And it doesn't get tangled. And it's easy to roll up. So they put it to the test. And after the segment I went to. Ebay, and I bought one because it was the real deal it, they don't tangle. 'cause you know with a rubber hose. I don't know. How the hell these NATs get in it? It's like, it's completely straight. I use it for five minutes has got three tangles in it now and it's pinched. And I gotta go figure out where the pinches and just horrible. There's nothing worse than trying to untangle wet hose. As well. When you go to tangle. Yeah. You'll find waters run down from the force. It all over the hose and it's freezing cold and wet. Yeah. Is David can attest from this morning, which we didn't discuss. So I wouldn't. And I I bought one of these in. It's a corrugated steel hose. It's very flexible. Does it looks like a shower like shower her? Yes, exactly. It's exactly what a site except for this one's fifty foot long. It feels very flexible. I mean, you can't bend it in half. So you can't really pinch. It it seems. I mean, it seems to revel. I got it off EBay. So I'm sure it's full of some kind of carcinogen is gonna come my long. It was just probably not real stale. It's probably mild steel in it will on the stain will probably rust beer, that's true too. But hey, I'm willing to give try it was fifty foot. I think I spent twenty bucks I'm looking on EBay here. And then the same price here twenty five pounds for fifty foot. So I'm kind of looking forward to try this out. Yup. It's one of those things that it could be a game changer or it could be John. So one thing I do know is that you'll often see marketing the same places of these steal hoses is expanding hoses. And they obscene those fail. Terrible. Because are they really hardly the reason the way they expand is because they're like a very thin plastic inside. And they just break for easily. I was wondering about those expanding houses that I never saw anything that made me think I want to give that a try. Unlike the steals that obviously I did see something that made me want to give it a try. So you know might as well some other purchase on EBay is. I bought a a nineteen in nineteen inch Acer monitor from Acer. They have their own refurbish store. This is for an arcade project that I'm working on. Well, I don't say I'm working on it. I've I've got all the pieces. I just have to find the time and the energy to actually do it. And that's kind of the hold up right now, you know. You know, the first hold up is all I gotta buy the parks. So you take your time. You buy all the parts, and then you have all the parts. And then you're like well now, we gotta move stuff around the room. So I can actually pull this machine out and get working on it. So that's the next thing that I have to do. And of course, I haven't done any of that yet. And then I have to actually I want to do the project. Don't get me wrong. It's just like you. I work. It's not high on my priority list. But it's it's just taking a older arcade that I have my Neo geo machine the monitor's getting fritzy on me. Right. So knees reply, and Well, I I don't ever play the Neo geo stuff, even when it was working to be honest, and it's a horizontal arcade. Whereas my other ones vertical heart, arcade vertical is like pacman. Yeah. You know, it's longer on the top to the bottom. It's not as wide. But then you have stuff like Simpsons, arcade or defender or stuff like that that are Cade is whiter than it is taller the screen, and I want to pay those kind of games too. So I'm going to convert it over I'm gonna leave all the original stuff. I'm just going to add all this new stuff into the new stuff small. So the only thing is I have to pull the monitor. And build some kind of frame to hold a new monitor. Yes. Not not an easy quick. Jim. It's not I want to do it. But I've got other priorities. Julie. And I want a fire pit in our backyard. Is that a thing in the UK fire? It is here in the US some people we like it. We don't have the space here, you know, I'll snow massage of Pisces stem. So the idea pointing digging holes and putting a fire in eight you've been you house, Dan. Well, not a whole we have the space between our shed and the far fence. That's probably I dunno fifty feet about say, I'm on my Hoegaarden fifty feet. Well, this is kind of a dead area of a lawn is behind the swing side. It's we're rubbish like branches and rocks will kind of migrate to and they just sit there and. Cares in the highest. Yeah, there's trees that are all around it. So it's kind of a dead spot. So we've decided or Christmas one of our relatives got us a. A firepit is I don't know how to describe a metal Boehm five is like a walk for a bonfire. Yeah. Exactly exactly what a sight. Have anything too big? But you know, it's it comes on little legs. And we've done at one time I posted some photos on Facebook. And it was a good time. You know, we're made some chm wars and stuff like that. So we where are we gonna put this thing, and we needed to cover it, you know, because otherwise it rains and just turns to go consi-. So we have decided that we're going to clean the area out which actually Julie did yesterday. And there was this giant hole that I had dug a decade ago that we're gonna put a fish pond in. Of course, it never did that and so she filled in the hole, it's not completely filled in but it's ninety nine percent in. So we gotta get some more dirt to level at out. Then when these stone bricks, I guess, but they're like. Sixteen by sixteen by two inch thick. I don't know what you call bricks, but it's like patio stones, and we'll lay those back there fill in the cracks with some sand or something smooth it all out and then put the fire pit on that with a something to hold the wood. And then a bench, and maybe a couple of chairs maybe string some lights up somewhere out there. It'll be nice little area. It'll be be breeding grown from -squitoes because I know that's going to have Kofi this Mike from the file driveway since most gay ties when using well, I'll be the safest one because if there's a campfire or bio fire going it's a hundred percent assured that the smoke even on a completely still day will somehow aim right at me a worm asks in just kids. You are a smoke Galt and the smoke love. Yes. So I'll smell like the bonfire until I take a shower. No matter what. Yep. It's it's guaranteed. So that's our project coming up for this next week. The the biggest pain the asks is just going to be leveling the ground. Yeah. That's that's never fun way. We having the the whole Bank gone replacing a couple of weeks time. So we're going to be if he's coming out and get input Stein down and call bulls, and you say. Have you somebody they in this situation with the having somebody needs to do it? Because no way I can not only do I have the time. I know what's underneath that that loan which is basically a whole lot of builder's rubble because we sold the house being built and we saw while they were dumping mountain that so I don't want to be dealing with this stuff because you're going to need proper tools to dig it out. Yeah. So they just buried the stuff though, yet by said that just use the outside the houses as the big trash Pitt. And then when you need to go up, and then they poor soil of the Talton platinum out, and they. Yeah. It's not very environmentally friendly. But then build us commercial builders her often just thinking about saving them money them as they did stout. Dispose of plastic trash in. That's what we'll be. Do you think that they could be held responsible for that? Yeah. Accountability for that sort of thing is not is not is not well found here in in the UK. Unfortunately, we have building standards and building codes, and they and they kind of adhered to that. But anything beyond that now because it relies on the local council is the local authority who their response for holding alleged regulations. And they're just too busy. And they don't have enough money. So. You know, they they they give them money by central government. And then they have to do everything legally responsible to do with that money. And of course, central government every coast the money, so. Well. You know, my my son called said. Part of the with we're building this little firepit area. The the side of the shed is right there. And I was thinking we could put, you know, some decorations and some cool stuff up there. You know, nothing nothing elaborate. New obviously. Firepit is not gonna be right next to the show. I mean, there's plenty of room. Right. But call said, we have put a movie projector back here to add we can watch movies while we have a campfire. I laughed, but then I started thinking, you know, that's actually not that bad of an idea. So I started spinning around in my head. How can I do this? How could I put a little projector back there? Well, they have tiny little projectors now that you can get those are just like HDMI. Yeah. So how would you go about doing that day? But I thought. On those little this look looking one type ashtrays in. I think so I know one even if not I've got I've got power to the shed. So I've got literally right. There is a electrical outlet. So a one thing I do know about the cheap rent diverse pocket. Projectors is that even though they suppose they claim to be ten ATP. They're not only much lower resolution, and then they're doing some scaling, and they get they they they figure they get away with it because they're projecting onto big screen. And also, they're not very bright. So I wouldn't say that that's the main thing to say, I mean, they're they're nice. Oh, you mean. I mean, right. Yeah. So. I I'm not sure that the stuff, you know, that the stuff of the boatmen the fifty sixty dollars stuff with the Chinese manufacturers is probably not going to cut you probably need something more like the two hundred dollar range so making that work. Well, and if you grow power yet, then you need we needed power and the tablet Araya or a laptop and off you go. I was thinking because it's on a shed. I could have like a little, and my wife, I reaches the shed. No problem. What if I simply put? Amac mini in the shed. With the little wireless. Keyboard mouse, in there with a, you know, descended a little show, and then at the same place that the power the outside power comes from the shed because it's, you know, the power's on the inside of the shed. I just run a little thing. I could actually tap into that box with like a little HDMI plug or something. And then all I have to do is have a screen, but I don't even need a screen. I could just use the type of Shad liquid. The here's white just needs to be. Well, it's it's a cream colored Araya. Okay. Use that with a little projector in Seoul. I'll have to do is run like an admi cable from that to to the progenitor and the power cable. In some of these the throw is ridiculous. You can be real close to the screen and still get like a fifty inch Petra. You'd also need audio of course, because the projects don't could speakers. So you know, I can run a little speakers to the top roof the under part of the overhangs all but a couple of speakers a couple of speakers the dopes survived the moisture, why them up to the MAC mini? You can get some of those rocks. Speakers that look like wrongs put those out there. And here's an idea you do all that. I can get the MAC mini from ODBC or sponsor, by the way, two hundred and sixty five bucks. They've got a mid it's I it's a apple MAC mini server. It's an actual server. Mid twenty ten I can just run plex on that for music and movie. Yeah. Because you can have one because they're very quiet expensive. Well, especially for a project with this. And then I could have some ambient music playing when I'm wanted. We can have a little projector have a little movie going back. There might be kind of nice. Yeah. But then I mean, I would probably start with the audio stuff. Not not the projector movies. Yeah. But that's another project something the GI. I mean, it was still be cheaper just to have a set of speakers out there and and plug in one of those little gadgets, so you can air play it. Yeah. Cheap is doing is the got onto Costco, all to WalMart by the TV. They have put it on a rolling stand and roll out that when you want to show you wanna watch TV outside the. But this is this would be the the lazy man way of. I don't know we probably won't do any of that. Because kind of the whole point of having the firepit out there this family time and make us more relaxing and not watching TV and the problem eve, if you call the font have you had the smoke problem, then that's not gonna be juicy to what she movies. All the cruise ships do movie sickly northern Europe. This is crazy. They will have these movies on the stars. Now, they have a big screen out by on the pool deck, and then go out there in the evening. Even if it's even in the tropics is normally cool up there because the ships doing twenty knots. A good wind blowing over there. And it's it's not warm and everyone down there only on the recliners covered in blankets. Normally what you get from the pool attendance. And you sit there being miserable. Watching the movie waiting for it to finish your back into the wall. There's something to be said for being under the stars in the fresh air though. Yeah. But temperature is a whiz issue the well. Yeah. It's either too damn hot or too damn. It's very rare that you get one of those perfect weather days that a society we can sit outside and watch your movie on the deck of the ship. As I say, I say moving ship twenty miles an hour. Well, it's a flawed concept. Right. From the beginning reading. So we do want to thank our sponsor of W C you guys like the idea. Hey can pick up one of these little MAC minis? And do it yourself two hundred sixty five they sent me an Email the other day, and they have twenty seventeen refurbish macbooks little tiny ones twelve inch ones with five twelve gig SSD's, and the m three processor for thousand dollars, which looks pretty five hundred dollars off regular and these brand new so the refurbished, but they're effectively Filippo guarantee as well as WBZ's guarantee, if you're in the market, and you think you can try and decide between stretching to a MAC book over the the new Medicare retina than this might be interesting. We do get some reader feedback to you got that front of me. We got one from Owen? Of course, you had on with you on the show a couple of weeks ago. And he wanted to talk about the. Obviously are my wish dot com. Loser pig wasn't HD. Antenna. You know, this little little town of that you supposedly stick on the window, and or a wall or something and you're going to get I think it's a two thousand mile range, which is stupid because. No. So I. Says he that he can Rick says you may recall, I was involved in the TV stage D TV standard. Yes company he was working on this. He says many things can affect your HD reception. The Antenne officio on the tuna absolutely as well. There's interference a multiple distortion in the US. You want a very a directional antenna to eliminate multiple interference. So that's that's basically when the signals bouncing off. And then you getting multiple signals rising now phase with each other, isn't it? He says new attune is can discriminate Besser news new technology how but that is all about the tuna sensitivity and the age of the chino makes a big difference off the more than the Antenne rashly. I have an old USB tuna and a new one the nutrient pulls signals ignore like, it doesn't see as for pulling in signals over two hundred forty miles away that is toasted nonsense distance will be better at night, if the frequency used compound, some propagates the standard using in the US is eight PSP, which is better in rural areas as sucks in cities and places rounded with large trees on mountains. So your surrounding area makes it a bit big difference even claiming one hundred and fifty miles is BS Aliko, then look TV where you might see a weak signal. The tuna must get enough data to construct a frame if it's on the edge. You get blocking and breakout below that he goes black. The signal has some Eric creation data in it the less. It has to us to fix the signal the higher the signal str-. Eighth which is not shown. But once she don't have enough. Good data. You got a black screen, and there is spoiled small delay between moving an antenna and seeing the results which makes pointing more difficult hope that helps Owen. It does it kind of reinforces what we were saying you thought is probably the tuner the antenna itself, and this isn't LG TV. It's quite new actually it's like two years old if that, but I mean, it was on the less expensive side. It's a thorough. I want to say thirty. Thirty nine inch maybe thirty to thirty nine inch TV smart TV, which most of them are. So it ahead plex built. And that's kind of the reason I bought it. It's mostly used for video game stuff. But you know, it's got a built an HD. Tune or so figured plug the Santana, and I can see free content which is stupid because I've got my cable box sitting on it too. So it's kinda dumb did the wish dot com antenna. Did it he power? Yeah. So do phrase USB, maybe doing some pre tuning preprocessing anyone could be without fully where it's fully down there. Either way. It's not really working all that. Well, yeah, it's. It was eight bucks. You know, it's not heart breaking loose and the White House. So they cannot use the trade will. Yeah. Well, just maybe I'll just stick it on top of my shed and see if an outdoor thing at the firepit would work better. We also got a tweet from Donny. Yeah. He said he said just so this full David might be interested ever remember correctly. He was looking for digital note taker awhile back, and he sent a link to a kick saucer, which is to the new yes, the coolest, paperless. And digitize notebook set Asia manufacturers, you can probably tell so for some the English here. They've already reached that goal on this kick-starts. But worryingly the goal was only three thousand eight hundred pounds, which manufacturer a whole run of electronic notebooks seemed very much money to me. I I think they're a nation manufacture who's kind of in this game. Anyway. But this this thing they're offering here is it's kind of a combination thing. It has the the smart pen the one with the camera in it that uses the paper with adults like the most skin one I had before they also bumbling something that looks very much like those boogie boards. You get in in WalMart and target in with the thing as well. But I don't think look reading between the lines that the the pen the use of that he's able to able to digitize the the the boogie board side. And I've used those big things they're fine. Full scribbling little notes leaving messages on the fridge and everything they kind the contrast is fairly low even in the video. He can see the shos is fairly low unless they're back where it doesn't like this one is so and they're not really conducive for making lots and lots of most in my opinion. They kind of the the thickness of the pen. It's. Lot writing with a with a sharp e a thin sharpie, and you will want to write patient pages with that. Yeah. It's interesting. It doesn't seem to be particularly innovative over anything anybody else's doing. But appreciate I'm looking at it. And I'm like, I think I've seen the exactly this before multiple times. They're always on quicks Kickstarter, which I get a ton of tech companies reaching out to me on Kickstarter saying, hey, who'd you talk about the, and oh, I can't because I think most of them are vaporware. They're never going to happen. Yeah. IBM to find anything kick starter in the last few years anyways that really piqued my interest. What I what bothers me about places. I kick starter is big companies using it for product. And it's like way what basically yo your huge companies. You're basically getting the public to fund your production. Our day. Yeah. It's a seems wrong to me. Hey, if you wanna back, that's totally your choice. But it seems to go against the the concept of what Kickstarter is big companies shouldn't be allowed us. The terror some companies now who used the kickstarts multiple, but not on kickstarts is she getting on the protections. I ordered. I ordered something is about three four years ago called the techs played which was kind of like, hey. Ineffective bluetooth keyboard that it used magnets and things to allow you to. To put the cable together and folded up when you went using and everything, and it'll really cool. And the thing is they had an auto page on there, and you ordered it. And then you will be told. Oh, yeah. We'll shift towards the end of the year. And then they had a block a block side which made it perfectly clear that they would they were still developing the products and effectively the use your auto money as are indeed money, and you had no protection. And effectively I think the thing has ever shipped this. If you go there now, there's still such a notionally taking orders for it. But looking on the forms and everything hall, the anybody's ever see this thing, you know, and yet the charging for it like it's real when in fact to ISM. This concerning. Very concerning. Oh, well, you know, there's going to be scammy places. No matter what unfortunately, it's the nature of the world. Yeah. Good point. Yeah. So you said you've got a product that you haven't used much, but you wanted to touch on. Yes. My children we all going on a cruise ship in about three weeks tire. Macho dron have decided that they will become YouTube blog this. They want to do a cruise ship video for YouTube. And you know, I'm trying to encourage in this because, you know, well, I don't think they have any lesions about becoming the next major YouTube channel, I think is an interesting project for them to do, and, you know, the the nine in sixteen and yet they both seem to be collaborating fairly hard with ideas about how they wanna to do this and this whole thing. So I wanted to encourage you hit. And I was going to let them use one of our phones to to do this. But the problem with recording lifetime, particularly for YouTube stuff is that it very much relies on the skill of the operator, and obviously they haven't gotten off experienced. So the high risk of them. It's turning out a whole lot of quite Janke video. But I spotted a product a while back that kind of piqued my interest. And I thought what the hell picked up a couple of weeks ago, if I wanna referred, and this is the also pocket, and what this is the people who make drones won't be effectively done is taken the four k camera that ships on the higher end drones. And they've put it on the little steak, and they use the technology having the drones to stabilize the camera. So it's a tiny little stick. It's not much bigger than two AA batteries with an HD four k camera on the top screen on the Bank base. You turn this thing on Stu sell stabilizes. So you can walk around and you get completely smooth radio has a selfie mode. It has faced tracking as object tracking as a little connector on the side. So that you can actually plug your iphone landscape mode into the side of it. And then hold the camera. So light you can hold the camera with the I. Phone. So you can use the app Terachi do more stuff with it. And it's a really neat little thing and the video at takes us amazing majority. Well, so the this they sell for three twenty nine I got one wrong Reefer to fifty nine. So. He'll be compared to the cost of a, you know, I kind of took the view that that was a few years ago. That's what you're paying for a good mid range. You know, hand held camera. Will it wasn't DS LA polka camera? So I didn't think it was actually that bad. And the society it's a full three axis gamble. So you can do some recall stuff with it. What it one thing? She can do is. If you wanna take a large panorama is it will take a nine shots. It will move the camera around. So it will take effectively nine individual shots, and then stitched them together into one really big picture. So it's great for kind of overview shots of an area and stuff like that. Call is called the DIGI. I also pocket only weighs hundred grams is really really Tony. And yeah, it's really kinda cool. It's one of these things that when you turn it on the sought using it, you just kind of from a tech point, we go that is this is amazing technology has a little tiny one screen touchscreen on the Bank. But has a say you want to have the little touchscreen, which is which you quite usable out. She wants you get used to it a selfie mode. So you can just turn around and hold it from view, and you'll still get the stabilize thing and it will track your face. You can put it on the table. And then you can walk around kind of like if you didn't presentations on me, and it will follow you. So where have you gone the frame, it will it will point the camera? It's really very very neat. Will stream to through a phone. Yes. Through phone or you can get a little wifi dot for it the charges it at the same time. And then we'll then stream I was the phone. And of course, being did Degi, which has got a very healthy third party system market. There's all sorts of different mounts, and gizmos you can buy it from third party manufacturers like this. There's one that will let you clip it to a backpack straps. So that you can just walk around with it on your chest leave it running. And so has a built in microphone has a built-in my phone yet. And it also has you can use the USB port to plug in the external my front if you want. I wonder if how good it does with wind. Yeah. That's one of the things. I've I've I've heard on the scene on the reviews, they say, well, you know, the the Mike fun on it is. Okay. But it's only. Okay. And if you want really good. Professional video you want to use an external mic world, tentatively voice over your stuff because all even even on the iphone, you can get wind noise, and and handling noise from from from the my friend this Bill device. Did you get it from them directly? Or did. You get it on EBay. I bought it via a reseller Amazon who is selling it referred. But it was completely. I mean, what a brand box. But it was on. I opened it was it was sealed it was. And I've registered Petit. I so it's completely kosher. I'm looking I'm on EBay right now. Brand new to fifty knots bidding look at by. Now, I never been on anything on EBay. I'm done with bidding. I won't be. If I bid on stuff, then I say, you something to bid at last minute. I have a sofa. I have a service I can use which basically will put in a bit in the last minute of the option. So you don't just driving the price up earlier. Does it does it come with the clip to clip right to your phone all of that stuff, spilling? He comes with comes within little it is basically eases USB, but it has the little of that that you can turn around. So you can plug it into lightning on the phone where we or or USB fund. It doesn't have a it doesn't have a Microsoft. Micro USB connect to. So if you have a phone with mockery should be can't use it. But it's what's great. The I find. And others aside because only one hundred grams when you clip it to the Boston, the iphone you can just basically use the iphone to hold the camera, and then he forms like a little compact unit or you can get a more stable thing to clip it all in if you want if you wanna put on a tripod or something like that. So it also secret. Well, they call them hype lapses, so I'm ill is like a time lapse, but it lets you move the camera while you're doing it. And it takes sees these. You've seen them on TV those things where is it looks like somebody walking really high speed through market or something like on the high plus fate whereas taking quick shots in quick succession, and then and then turn them into a high speed movie. I only found one referred unit on EBay, right, right? And it's three hundred twenty five right? Looks like it was lucky then you got a good deal. So good. It's good. And the kids are very excited to be using him because they were concerned about the quality of evidence. We know that leeann come walk so well because of a back injury we're going to do we're gonna go to Rome ordinary. We would take bus two Roman them wander around Rome for the day on this trip with this. Now, we're going to take a coach ship where we're going to be in the coach driving around Rome. And I figured I'll be able to say much more much better pictures of the sights what's going on on the coach and everything with one of these. And I would with a regular camera. I think so. Buy it. Now. The I you might as well just at least up here in the US. You might have just buy it. Now, the little storage thing is kind of cool. And it's it's kind of cool. I kind of want I'll bring it out with me to max stock. So you can have a play around with it. Yeah. Definitely speaking of next. Of course, we are going to be at max stock. So anybody listened to the show wanna meet David in person? We will both be at max, I'm going to be doing the ODBC Meymac quiz at MAC stock. It's yeah. I'm looking forward to it. It's going to be on the first day. So if you want to just even come for one day come to the first day out because that's you know, that's July twenty seventh and the whole point of maximum this year is called create and yeah, some really good people are going to be speaking and talking about how you create and go up to the website. You'll see how bunch of pictures and not surprisingly, none of them are David nigh. But you know, they they also have a film fast. This is going to happen. Yep. ODBC is going to be there. And they're going to be. Sponsoring they're they're a major sponsor the event. So they're going to have some breakout events where they'll actually show you how you can upgrade Europe. They'll actually upgrade stuff right there on the shelf. So that'd be kinda cool. So this isn't the kind of bringing swap thing is happening this year. I don't know. I don't think now. Okay. Yeah. I know that those issues with that last year so much stuff was leftover that Mike had to deal with. Okay. But also recall. I'll be recording this. So if you want to actually be on the show by all means come along and get you on the show, you we can we can interfere. We can we can tell e you can be part of the tech fan universe. We're going to date or I'm sorry guy. Searle, and I are going to be on the MAC main stage from one to one forty five pm on July twenty seventh. We're going to be giving some stuff away probably only or to be stuff since they're going to be. It's it's it was the my MAC quiz show. Now, it's the BBC my met quiz show their spot, Hank. So I don't think they're going to want to give competitor stuff away that that would make a whole lot of sense. But it's gonna be fun. We're going to give everything that we bring to the show away. We don't want to take anything home with us. Lots of something case. Taste tips. Obviously. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, you know, if what it'd be like, hey, give away the MAC book air. You know, totally. No one's getting. Yes. You won't you want here about that. So that's right. What what number of my guests? No sorry. What was that game show Ken scandal in the fifties? Oh, yeah. They were basically they were paying the guys stay they were giving them the questions. Yeah. Be a little bit like that. We'll have a couple of shields in your audience. That's. That's right. Backed or maybe my oldest daughter was show. I am I'm bringing my youngest daughter who's fifteen. You're also bringing your son is on the he's he's just about this thought his GPS's, which is like his major exams, so extreme stress at the moment. So this is. A good way to kind of decompress and stuff like that idea to kind of get away from the high stress situations. I think this would be a good I'll tell you. I'll tell you what he's looking forward to most. No, doc. It's Pender expels. Yeah. Well, how does he know about tennis of the show I told him about because you inch meets Pendry express. Alexandra is a very big fan of Asian food. And that he will be heaven Pendrey experience. What? Yeah. I don't know. If you really call panda express, Asian is from from from his point of view. It's like well. It's the McDonald's. Exactly. Yeah. I actually screwed up. I booked my hotel too late. So I did not get into the main hotel. It was full. Right. So I don't know. I don't know. If you've already booked your host. I'm using them. All that time spent in London the threes in London. I was my see staying in holiday inns need cumulating points. So I've put from the Holiday Inn because I'd have to pay for the one the one on in crystal. Well, that's actually where I'm a coin you see serendipity get again. Yeah. Yes. I got one with a king size bed with a pullout. So guess guess who's not sleeping on the pullout? The teenagers. Get the full out. We let's talk about putting up teenage son adultery an abandoned. No. Actually. Yeah. That's we're at the same hotel. But. More to the point on the twenty six which is a Friday, David, and I are going to take our kids, and we're gonna go to galloping ghosts. So that ought to be fun in next year, coal probably come with me to he wants to go. I think this year is still going to be a little bit boring for them. But next year, I think he's going to be ready to go to max. Okay. So if Brooke wants to come next year, she can come as well, I'll bring both of them if Brooke wants to take a year off, and she doesn't wanna come cold definitely be MAC stock in twenty twenty. So he'll have a good time. We'll have to go back to galloping go start cave with coal and co will be in heaven. In fact, he just came downstairs. I call. You're gonna come in here and say something. All right cold's gonna make a guest appearance here on the show. You're not going to max back this year. But I just announced that you get to go next year. What do you think? I'm going to finally get to go. Yeah. You think you'd be bored? There. Now, remember this is audio and I'm going to hear your head shake. So David your son is in into fortnight rice in a big way. Yeah. So so call your into fortnight to right? So what do you play for night on tenders? Switch and they would just so that's where Alexander places. Well, so what is your handle or name on there? So people could find you on fortnight. Fan podcast. So they make sure you tell Alexandra to see if he could I is it a friend or Questors. How does that work? Epoch friend requests tech fan podcast, which I think you could probably remember the name of that one and tell him, that's my son cool. I as soon as he's finished these exams because you bend for night. But soon as he finished his band from fort night right now because he's got exam tests. I yes since he's back on these Brooks. He's he's going to want to because he's he's inching to get the whole season one thing, which is started. So he he's itching to get into Susan nine are you on Susan nine? Yeah. So fortnight's a free game. Yes. Yes. Certain buffers on certain platforms. So how much money do you think you spent on fortnight? Over one hundred hundred dollars, and you've paid for it all yourself. Yes. So what's your favorite part of fort night? Because I can hear you play ICU playing on there. What's the coolest part of it? I don't really know. You don't really know what the coolest part will what when you think a fortnight you're gonna play. What what's the thing that comes to your mind that makes you excited to play? Head off of the shotgun, willow. Shooting someone's head upside. So the other night. Alexander asked me to to let him on the phone because there was an event and he went down. There was a volcano and he dove into the volcano. And then he ended up breaking this big loss thing with a special gun in it the gun. Everybody wants it it. It was an insane thing. It looked like watching the thing. It looked like watching ready play a one. That's really come to the vibe you had because all these people on that going to get this going for this this event. So Davis talking about Alexander playing it a special event of all Keno going into the volcano breaking something in getting a gun. The sound familiar to you. I know you talked about the Viscaino. Quesnoy erupting Alexander jumped into the volcano. And I guess there was something in there. It was like this. A lot. No that wasn't in the volcano that was in volt over it loud. Right. Of course. Yes. Sorry, hit opened up and everybody jumped inside got to go inside and start to pick their vote in the unbolting playlist, and whatever they chose came back into the game. But the rest students would you pick? I tried to pick the plane, right? I didn't work. No, everybody picked the drum gun. It was Alexander says that's the best gun shy. Alexander says that's the best gonna ever though. Yeah. No closest. There are there are things to be decided between these. That's right. Yeah. They gonna cut tell Alexander to watch out coast Kohl's itching to blow off with a shotgun. Yes. Well, thanks call. Appreciate it. So. On that uplifting, note, we're gonna. We're going to wrap up this episode attack fan date. No, David night. Neither one of us play fortnight. I don't get it. I tried to play on the PS four briefly. And I just I don't know what I was doing on there. I thought it was just a running gun, but there's some building stuff for. I don't know. I didn't get it. It was way confusing to me I like watching called play a little bit. But it gives me a headache. So yeah, I find the noises in the game very, very annoying. But that's why call wears home. Always shall exalted. Yeah. So he doesn't chat with people does. But the thing is because he's on the switch need. I've not looked tensest. But parents getting a headset. Mic fun on the switch is is not straightforward. He's kogo working. Really? Well, I as I said of little tip. He said he got a PS four hundred sixty we have one of those. What it really does? He says it doesn't work for Nintendo switch, but we'll have to look into that. Then because this was this was this. This was a stopping point. So Alexander tents today is he will have his friends always friends from school on WhatsApp chat on voice chat. And he's talking to them on their at the same time as he's playing for an eye on the switch. So that's kind of Nicole. Call does that he he will be talking to someone on the phone playing a game on his ipad? And I can hear the tiny little voice of friends coming through the speaker phone while he's talking to them. I yeah, I can't I can't take. I see we we don't become multi tells the young kids. No, not even close tweaking multitasking. I'm going to multitask, and hit stop recording on this because David not going to wrap it up. We'd love to get feedback. From you guys. It's the show at tech fan podcast. I really really consider coming to max, doc, David, and I would love to meet with with some people in including going to galloping go. So if you're into that, please let us know we can arrange it, and we can firm up the time that we're going to meet it's probably going to be. I'm going to sue probably around noon or something like that on Friday. We don't want to fight big crowds at Galvin goes later in the day. We'd rather get it done with and have some more extra time there. Although we didn't spend a whole lot of time there and remember that Mexican place we got those. Thinking of that as well. Yeah, we go across the street down a ways tiny little places like four taping six tables just. The the regulars look very suspicious when all these gringos. Yes. But man, they had some very good. Yeah. Maybe we'll have to go back to. Yep. Our every three years. I remember you guys from three years ago come on. I'm sure that's going to happen Pablo. Pablo? The we does a back. Crime. Here they go here they come again. And they brought children within this time. Again. They're going to gentrify restaurant. Great. Great. I'll talk to you. And weakness.

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Former CIA Deputy Directors on Life Inside the Agency

Intelligence Matters

46:39 min | 1 year ago

Former CIA Deputy Directors on Life Inside the Agency

"This is the intelligence matters podcast with former acting director of the CIA Michael Morell sponsored by Raytheon. The thing that I found sort of exhilarating was the sort of honest dedication. I wish people could see what was going on in this meeting or it could see how these people are going about mapping out this operation. They're going to undertake. You know, you can't talk to a lot of people by your job, you end up feeling as if you can share really only two people who understand it within the and that that's a strengthen weakness in some respects. Every special question for you know, you were the first female deputy director, gene is the first female director, tell people why that's important why that matters. I undervalued the degree to which seeing women and a variety of different styles and approaches to leadership meant to younger women who are coming up through the ranks and who can say to themselves. You know that somebody I could be that, you know, I can be the director. John Brennan Johnson's leaving government has chosen to challenge. The president quite directly just wanna know how you guys think about that. This is somebody who has spent decades in national security and intelligence, he can provide context, and he has credibility, and he has the ability to analyze and tell you when something's wrong, I want that voice. It's not just that John has a Meyer policy difference with what the administration's doing. I think what John is doing sounding the arm that we are being governed today by a president by administration that is several deviations away from the north. A real Hanes and David Cohen like me or deputy directors of the Central Intelligence Agency every all served as John Brennan's deputy from two thousand thirteen to two thousand fifteen and David did likewise from two thousand fifteen to seventeen today. Three of us are going to discuss what it's like to be the number two, and our nation's premier intelligence organization, we're going to have some fun, but we'll also delve in some serious issues as well. We'll be right back with that discussion afterward from our exclusive sponsor Raytheon. I Michael morale. And this is intelligence matters. Career at Raytheon is a career an innovation here. You'll advanced technologies that make the world a safer place. Join our team today. Learn more at Raytheon dot com slash careers. Every David welcome. It is great to have you both here. It is great to have you on the show. You know, there has to be some joke about three deputy directors CIA walking into a bar. Yeah. But it's great to have you guys on the show. Thank you for having us. Thank you. I wanna let our listeners know that today show's going to be a little bit different. Usually, I only ask questions, but today, I'm actually going to participate discussion as well answering some of the questions. So I think what that means for you guys is that it's fair game for you guys to ask questions as well. Great. So we'll just we'll take this kind of wherever it goes, David. I want to start with you. And I know that every day it is different. But what is it typical day? Look like for the deputy director. See I will for me. And I think it's probably different for each of you for me it began with reading the PD be the president's daily brief on the way into work. And then when I got there it was took me about twenty five minutes or so to get into work in the morning. I'd get there. And we read it in the car. I read it in the car on the way in. I would sometimes try and work out ahead of time. So that was typical day get way too early and try to work out. So I didn't turn into a big fatness. And then I would meet with my staff, I had some executive assistants and eat with them and talked about what was in the PDB, and I had a briefer who would come and join in that conversation. I'd usually made it through the PDB's. So I didn't get brief brief car with you is not in the car. And then, you know, the typical day would unfold with preparations for deputies committee meetings preparations for meetings with others in the intelligence community and in a fair amount of work inside the building. There was a lot of it was really important meeting with folks in the building who are working on various projects, but it's analysts are operators people in support TNT or in the science and technology operating or in the new digital innovation directorate. To understand what they're doing provide some direction try, and and and help them understand. What director Brennan who who's director? When I was there in you guys as well was was hoping to accomplish. Have you? That's not dissimilar for mine. I mean, I would really work hard to try to build in Starbucks break at some point that will come as a surprise to the tube you, but but multiples Starbucks, but for Trulia should know Starbucks is one of the highest grossing it's. In the nation. It was one of the reasons that I knew the was the right place for me. I just want to make that clear, but but I wonder was different for you. Michael was it. No it wasn't. I think people should appreciate David's point about preparing for meetings downtown. So there's the preparation, you know, which usually takes a good hour in your office talking to folks and thinking about what you want to say and then going to that meeting right which takes fifteen minutes to twenty minutes to get there. And in the meeting right at the White House a couple of hours at a time, maybe multiple sessions, maybe multiple deputies committee meetings. You know, maybe going to the hill. And then coming back to the agency driving all the way back to the agency. And then doing a debrief, right? So that is a huge amount of time. As important as the internal stuff is the external stuff pulls you away from the internal stuff. I think. Yeah. I agree. I mean, I remember. I used to get a card every day that would have my schedule on it. So that I could keep track of what was going on. And the question for me was always what font is the Carden. If it's ten point much scarier that is you know, but how many things you could pack in during day. And how you felt as if every moment had to count and is true. Like, I one of the things I learned from the job was how to prepare and how to read while you're in the car and make calls and make every moment be productive in that way. Yeah. I thought one of the difficult things about the job. Although is exhilarating was that virtually every minute was scuttled you had something to do. There was there were few occasions where I sat at my desk and thought I've got a half hour of unscheduled time here where I can read the newspaper or or even catch up on the stack of of briefings that had been accumulated. I mean, it was great is is a constant flow of really interesting stuff. But it was unrelenting, and I had this habit of if there was too much scheduled. I would say there's too much on the schedule. And if there were any empty spots, I'd say how come? Spots on. I did think it was important to get out and walk around on not only to the people who work directly for us. Right. The heads of the director, it's executive director. But actually just walk through the building and pop into an office and see what people are doing and show your face a little bit. I think that's really important. So I assume that you both loved the job we've talked about this before. And I'd really love to know why you'd think you loved it. And what did you love most about it? Every let's start with you this. I love the people. Honestly, I loved to constantly feeling as if I was learning new things it's when I feel most alive in any job. I love the fact that when I came to work, no matter how long the day was it. Oh, no matter how late it was. I felt as if I was contributing to something that mattered in a sense. You know, the the commod ary within the agency is really something quite special. Totally it's it's a remarkable experience flows. In fact, it's the secret intelligence organisation, and you can't go home Ryan family about what you're doing. So tend to group right? That's true. But I also think it's it attracts people who are not interested in fame and glory because you're clearly not going to get it at the CIA. You're really interested in doing something that you think is worthwhile for the country. And I I think that's a you know, there's a self selecting mechanism. They're in a way, and it brings people together as you say, you know, you can't talk to a lot of people about your job you end up feeling as if you can share really only two people who understand it within the agency. And that also creates a culture that's things. That's a strengthened a weakness in some respects. I think so. So. Wholeheartedly agree with everything wheel said, and sort of put a little twist on used to when I would talk to people, and I was in the agency. And now, they would ask me what did you enjoy about the agency the thing that that I found sort of exhilarating was the the sort of honest dedication of the people working there, and I had this experience multiple times. I was there which I thought I wish people could see what was going on in this meeting or it could see how these people are going about mapping out this operation. They're going to undertake and the care with which would with which it was done the fidelity law with which it was done. And it was for someone like me, I think real similarly who had the opportunity to parachute into the agency after spending many, many years doing other things and to to see sort of the the this veneer of myth. Collagen both good and bad sorta stripped away and the the way that the people in the agency approach their job was I thought really affirming, and I had I had that same fought a lot sitting in meetings. And I would think there needs to be Mythbusters. Right comes in and takes one of these meetings because there's so many miss out there about CIA being rogue and not being competent. Right. And it would just blow all those away. I love the job too. There wasn't a single day. I didn't wanna go to work in thirty three years for for all the reasons that you guys said. I loved my daily intelligence briefing special our right where you can really dig into the substance and ask questions somebody who's really studied it, and you know, do tasking and get follow ups. I I loved that. I loved traveling overseas to visit our officers I loved sitting with first case officers and listening to them talk about the cases, they were running. I thought that was all extraordinarily special. So was this the best job you ever had in government? So I had I had thought that my job treasury was the best job in government. And it's a fantastic job until I showed up at the agency. And absolutely. I mean, the in the things about it that were that willy were great is a little bit picking up on whatever you'll said is it was an opportunity at age fifty two whatever I was when I started to learn an enormous amount about the world about our governments. But but even more importantly about how. The world operates and how we operate in the world. It's an opportunity that I think few people you have and I felt extraordinarily privileged just to have the opportunity to learn that. And I think that's a that's a it's a great job if you can constantly be learning end. And it was consequential and the I think the what makes job enjoyable is that you know, you wake up in the morning, you think I'm going to do something today that it makes a difference. Hopefully for the good, and and I did think that that in that job you had the opportunity to do good. And you had that almost unique opportunity to good every day, and you had deputy national security adviser deputy director. Yeah. No. I I would take deputy director CIA pretty much any day over deputy national security adviser in some respects. But it's they're very different. And in the the reason I say that is not I mean, I loved being deputy national security adviser to it's just. When you're in the agencies, you actually feel as if you have the capacity to get things done, and that is a that's a heady feeling in some respects is you know, you actually are taking policy in your watching be implemented in a sense. And and you're taking action to try to you know. Exactly in the interest of the United States government. And you see how that translates in the sense. And and when you're in the national security visor position in a way, you're glorified staffer for the president, which is a remarkable thing and one of the most incredible things about that job is that you get to be there for all of these incredibly important meetings with the president and leaders and kinds of things and watch his decision making process in a very sort of intimate way. And you get to cheer the deputies, and you know, in facility that policy making process in a way, but it's a very different job. And it's and in some respects being a staffer is more suited to my personality of an introvert, and I'm not somebody who's very comfortable so to being out there constantly, but at the agency, you're a leader of the agency you need to be out there, you need to do things like ribbon cuttings and talking to the workforce. And so on and that pushed me out of my comfort zone. But it was also. Growing experience. Yes. So so let's shift to a discussion a bit about the agency's performance. I wanna give our listeners sense of how the agency's doing and serving the American people in serving the president. And as you guys think about that. I'd love to hear about your perception the agency's performance before you got to the agency. Right. You were at the White House every all as legal adviser at the NFC, David you're at treasury as an undersecretary. So you saw the agency used agencies product, and then you went to the agency. So how do you think about the agency's performance, you know, in general, and in that context when I was at treasury? We were heavily dependent on the intelligence community to provide information to fuel the sanctions booms that that I help to oversee. I had a very good impression. I thought of of the agency as sort of the lead analytic core of the of the government in terms. Of giving us the information we needed for our sanctions programs to work. What I did not appreciate and soon came to learn the agency was how little I knew about the agency. And what the agency did from my perspective at the tragic, which I thought was it was a very healthy relationship. I got out to the agency and realized there was a vast amount of additional understanding analysis operational activity going on then I had appreciated when I was at treasury. So I I think the agency combined large we can get into more detail on this does a a spectacular job in the areas where there's a focus and investment in and policy interest. I had the the privilege treasury to be one of those areas. So just building on what David was saying. I and I'm really interested in your perspective on this goal to. I it's. If you think of the way, I do at least watching policymakers at the national Security Council trying to. Absorb a huge range of issues. It's impossible for anyone person to be an expert in all of these different issues and not only are they expected to cover this huge range of issues. But they're also expected to do it at a sort of a rapid fire pace and to be making decisions about frankly, what should they even spend their time on right? Which of these things are real crises, which are not real crises. You know, how should we prioritize issues? And then what should we do about them? You recognize the premium. That's put on information on information that both is accurate that gives you a sense of what's actually happening in the moment. But also provides context for what's occurring and the one place that you can get that kind of information where you don't have an agency generally that's trying to spin you on essentially the policy outcome that they're interested in or the particular decision that they're interested in making is from the intelligence community and. What I saw both as a lawyer. But then ultimately from the national security adviser position deputy national security position is is just how critical that was at so many different moments to provide context to be able to make the kinds of decisions that you need to make at the national Security Council. And I think it's more important now than ever in a sense in that come down. So I think all of that is right. I do think in terms of collection that are at least this is five years ago. Right. I don't know what's happening today. But in terms of collection. I think the record is mixed. I think there are issues where we knocked the ball out of the park. And if we could tell Americans, here's what we know about XYZ. They would say oh my gosh. You guys doing a fantastic job? And then I think there's some areas where there are some significant gaps because the job is hard because we don't have all the resources we need because there's only twenty four hours in the day. But there's some areas where like tell the American people, you know, we don't have access to this this this they'd say, wow. You know, you're not doing your job. So I do think on the collection site. It's mixed. I'm not sure there's a lot that can be done about it change a lot over the period that, you know, I think no, I don't I think, you know, during the the the the existence of the Soviet Union during the Cold War. That's where the focus was. So we were very good on that. And we were less good on other things. And then, you know, after nine eleven we were very good on C T, and there was holes in other places. Remember, Tom Donald's saying wants to me? We're talking about a particular issue very very important to him in very very important to the president. He said the analysts have taken this as far as they could take it without new information right on new client destined information on and he was giving me compliment. But also saying, hey, right. There's more you need to do here. And I think that's a that's a pretty good way of looking at it. Yeah. I think just as building that a little bit coming from treasury and having the opportunity to sit with economic policymakers. I think that point that the agency is very good in areas where it is invested and an has long-term investment. But not so good in areas where we're frankly, it's it's hard. And we haven't invested is describes economic analysis quite well, we don't we do not do a great job. I think by emerge in not in this of micro economic housing following the money agency and in the whole twin communities pretty good at that. But understanding broader trends in economics in a way that is useful to economic policymakers. I think that that's an area where I think both those matter of collection analysis the agency could so so what do you guys think is the greatest strength and greatest weakness of the place. And maybe I'll go first here. Yeah. So I happen to believe that people and organizations weaknesses flow from their strikes. And it's actually a great way to think about people, right? I'm a horrible listener. And I'm in part, a horrible listener. Because when I ask somebody a question my mind is so analytic that I'm thinking about what the answer is rather than listening to them. Right. Just a weakness flows from strength. I think the agencies great strength in great weaknesses the same thing. I think it's focused on mission. It's a great strength for the obvious reason. Right. It's a weakness because we really don't wanna talk about or do anything unless it has to do with mission. So trying to get somebody to go to a leadership. Training course, from example, or focus on anything like that is really really hard at the agency because people are saying don't take me away from the job. Don't take away from them mission. That's the way I think about it. It's interesting because I I started off as a lawyer in the government, and and it's the same issue in legal offices, generally, right? Like. You get promoted because you're really great lawyer not because you're a good manager. And there was never sort of an effort to really, you know, promote leadership and management in the office. And I saw a version of that. I think at the agency, and I agree. That's an issue in every director has tried to tackle that. Yeah. Every. I know it's a perennial problem. Exactly. And you really have to change the culture of the place in order to actually have an impact on that. And I think that's true of few things like that. But I don't I, you know, another an agreed salsa strength because it is true. You know, David sort of alluded to this in his initial talk about the agency. I it is also really impressive. How focused people are on mission. And how effective we are at being able to get things in a crisis. Get out the door in an innovative creative way to actually do something about the challenge. But I also think you know, in in many respects, the the value that I put on the table or Lear on of being an institution that's capable of providing analysis flee without having a dog in the policy. Fight is another great strength that the agency brings to the table that you just don't see from from other places in the government and critical, but I also think in your sort of strength through also weaknesses. I think there's a a weakness that comes with that. Which is. In a sense because there's so much value put on being objective and trying to provide that analysis without having you know, sort of a spin on it in a sense. You also find that the agency can be isolated in ways that is not always healthy, and and sort of integrating the agencies work, for example, into things below the deputies level is a challenge. And I think also the agency's ability to pull from other agencies, essentially, the economic piece that David mentioned, but also other places tendency toward insularity. Yeah, exactly. That isn't always useful for the analysis innocence. Just. Same theme of strengthen weakness. I think the agency is is very very good at providing both collection and analysis on the critical issues of the day where I think the agency could do better. And I think this is also apprentice issue that that both I think directors and folks at the NFC have pressed the agency to do is to look over the horizon understand challenges really significant challenges that are coming, but that have not yet fully ripened into a crisis and and to alert policymakers to that at a time when they can be policy changes that can can avert a big problem down the road, which is not as he doesn't do any of that. But it, but because of the intense focus on mission and on the crisis of the day and on providing. Yeah, the inbox right providing makers what they need to deal with the crisis that that sometimes. We'll be right back with more intelligence matters. After a message from our exclusive sponsor Raytheon. Do you hear that? That's the sound of leadership being tested in battle and win. They returned home. Thousands of US veterans turn to Raytheon sponsored programs to put their skills to work in the private sector from scholarships to peer networks to innovation. Centres we're helping veterans and their families overcome new challenges achieve new goals and find new success. It is our privilege to serve those who make the world a safer place. Okay. So so every David let's shift to talked about some of the important issues of the day and place. I'd like to start is the the challenge that director hassle faces. In a very dangerous world with a lot of threats in a lot of challenges. So tremendous amount of work to do. Operating in a political environment here in Washington that is probably the toughest that I've ever seen. Right. So how do you think about the challenges? She is facing how she's doing David. I think she has extraordinary extraordinarily hard job impart in the no reason to assure go this and part because the president is not a series consumer of intelligence if he consumes at all and that the agency is geared to providing it's an to the first customer to the president's and having to presidents at least understand it. And then make judgments, and I think all none of us are obviously inside right now, but all the reporting, and there's no reason to doubt this is that the president does not pay a great deal attention to what the agency is producing. So I think that makes her job heart. I think she's done. She's done. Well, and I think we saw this recently. In the context of of the analysis regarding the murder of Jamal kashogi where she went up to the hill quite clearly delivered. What was the CIA as analytic line to congress when frankly, former director Pompeo and secretary Mattis, didn't I think that that wavered initially on that? Right. She. Well, she didn't go go initially clear about that moment. Right. But she did go and she did evidently say exactly what the agents. Yeah. And I thought that and I thought that was a important moment in her directorship and to to plant. The agency's flag that that she is able to present the truth to power in that fashion of decision to stay out of the public eye right in a way that craziest rectors were trending to do more and more of right? How do we think about that? I mean. I mean, I don't I suspect that doesn't surprise any of us doing her. Right. I mean, she's not somebody who I think relishes the spotlight in that kind of way, and I'm very sympathetic to that. Because I feel the same way. But I mean, and I think she's I think that's probably a good choice for her right now. Although she did just give a recent speech. And I think it would be great to see more of those because I think she is really, you know, a terrific face of the agency. I think she somebody who can talk to folks around the country and explain what it is that the intelligence community does in the value that it brings and explain, you know, things that are not obvious to many people, I think in this country. You know, I think it not being out there Fitzroy personality. So I'm not surprised from that perspective. And I'm also not surprised from a political perspective because if you go if you're the director CIA, and you go out there, and you get asked is Ron living up to its commitments under the nuclear agreement. In answer to that question is. Yes, right. Yeah. Your boss doesn't wanna hear that? And if you lean towards your boss, and, you know, raise some questions about whether the Iranians are doing that you put yourself at odds with your building. And if you lean towards your building, you put yourself at odds with your boss, so it's very dangerous to be out there. Right. So I think it's probably it probably makes sense her to be a little quiet. It does give a little myth. Bring back a little myth of the nation's spy master to. I think a little bit. So I think that's right. And I think she's in a terribly difficult spot because of the, you know, the fact that the policy direction is on a whole range of issues, obviously, contrary to what the analytic line of the agency is I do think it's important. And granted this is not director hassles comforts on. It is important. I think for the director the CIA to make an effort to be out in public and to talk about what the agency. Does that doesn't mean that he or she needs to get deep into the analysis on particular issues, but talking about how this secret intelligence service goes about doing his work. I think is a is one of the the key requirements of a leader in intelligence community. Every special question for you about women that see I know you were the first female deputy director, gene is the first female director Gina just appointed the first female head of operations. Tell people why that's important. Why that matters? Yeah. I will. But I wanna say one thing about to view. I. Mike credit you with convincing me that that I would be good for the agency coming into the job as the deputy director and having coffee at five thirty in the morning. Indeed. It's star. Yes. And I credit both of you as being men that I've had the great honestly joy to serve with who. Make a special effort, frankly to think about diversity in the context of your work and promoting people and trying to change the culture in a way that's productive for women. And I think that's that's something. I can tell you just how much it means. I think to so many people around us that benefited from that because I look at my own career. And honestly, I have soon many women who went before me to think. But also a lot of the men that made space for that in that context. So anyway, I think it's critically important in ways that I didn't recognize frankly at the beginning of my career, which is to say that I think I undervalued the degree to which seeing women and a variety of different styles and approaches to leadership meant to younger women who were coming up through the ranks, and who can say to themselves, you know, that somebody. I could be that, you know, I can be the director of the CIA I can do that. And moreover to see that, you know, whatever their particular style is is represented in leadership in some way. You know, it has an impact, and it has more of an impact on me emotionally that I, you know, even give credit for at times just watching Gina go through that process and take the mantle being the director of the CIA seeing Beth be, you know, promoted in that way. And I recognize the value that that has for women and one of the moments that I had similar to to David's description of I wish somebody could be in this meeting and watching this the absolutely astounding talented young women in the agency is just on a daily basis would just remarkable you watch these right? But I think I agree with you hundred percent. But I think before you and Gina and now Beth they always wondered whether they could get to the top. And now, they know they can. And I think that must be terribly terribly motivating for them. I hope so. Yeah, let me let me ask you a special question, which is about the modernization of the agency that retro Brennan put in place toes. What that was and tell us how well you thought it was working and how much of a difference you thought it was making when you left the building in January of twenty seventeen. It was in concept, actually, quite simple. The idea was we have an agency with. Capability in a variety of different areas. Whether it's in collection in analysis in support in science, and technology, and that the agency would do better would be more effective. If we found a way to not operate in silos, but the operate collaboratively and to and so the idea was essentially to reorganize the agency. So that the difference capabilities collection analysis support technology were combined and focused on particular mission sets whether parts of the world or specific subject matters. It was controversial because and there was there was just a let people there was a couple of places where that was the case exact before monetization counter-terrorism in on and those tended in my view to be the most effective organizations. Right. And so it was building on that. And so the counterterrorism center combined all of these elements and that. That was sort of the germ from which the the modernisation grew. And it was disruptive. We were talking before about how the agency's very mission focused and doesn't like to do things, you know, but their head down in charge a head it will quired people to lift their head up and think about working agency in a different way. But I think by and large I was not uniform, but by and large people understood that collaborating combining the capabilities agency in this way would make the agency more effective both in terms of the sort of the core mission of what we're doing as well as helping to integrate with the rest of the the rest of the intelligence community interest of the policy community, you we had two years to put this in place. It was starting to gel, and, you know, happy to say that the director pump Heo, although I think was initially skeptical by large captain place Martins. Asian and retro hassle has as well. Can I say one other thing about modernisation to pick up on your questions real on on women in the agency, one of the the key elements beyond the sort of the reorganization was an emphasis on diversity, and on ensuring that the agency identified and promoted, and and invested in officers from you know, a very very diverse backgrounds both because it was effective for the agency. We need officers who can operate anywhere in the world in various cultures with various languages, and the more that we have officers that come from diverse backgrounds. The better able we are to do that. But also because it was the right thing to do. And I, you know, I give enormous credit to director Brennan for being very courageous and forthright and pressing diversity to a point where you know, there were people who who were swaying uncut. Comfortable with the extensive what she was doing. It was absolutely the right thing to do for the agency. So you're at the NFC as the deputy national security adviser as they're digging into modernization. Are you seeing an impact into what they're bringing to the table? Yeah. I mean, and while I was there. We did the review that basically pulled together what it was that would be the plan for modernization, essentially. And and so I sort of you know, I obviously knew what was happening and it seeing the beginnings of it moving through, and and just to before getting there, the NFC, I, you know, another aspect of what I saw at least was when agency officers would go into conflict zones or interiors like that where you saw microcosm of this kind of completion of the different. You know, essentially, it's that that David mentioned you'd see that extrordinary value of basically, the interaction between the different places and any really was you know, they you could. See the younger generation just getting very excited at the prospect of actually trying to bring that into headquarters and make that work in a way that was affected, and when it came to bring them at NFC in watching this happen, one of the most obvious places from the perspective of what was happening, and sort of the impact of modernization was that you had somebody sitting at the table in the deputies discussions sometimes when the deputy wasn't available who actually could represent all of the different parts of the agency because what would happen. You know when previously when the deputy wasn't available. You'd have you know, the lead of a directorate usually they're like either analysis or operations or is it right? And instead of having somebody who actually represented all of these different directorates, and that really made an enormous difference because they could bring to bear essentially the expertise and the knowledgeable the different pieces of the agency when presiding the perspective of the agency, so might take and and and John John talked to me. Before he did this, and I was supportive, and so everybody now knows that out there. But I do think it is extraordinarily important to mitigate the downsides of any organizational structure, and I think the downsides of this were innovational structure are the trade craft of the work both opperations in Anna lick, and it doesn't mean that it has to suffer. It means. You simply need to pay a lot more attention to it. You didn't have to do that before. Because there was one person in charge of analysis in one person in charge of operations, and they could set a standard and they hold everybody to. And now there's ten eleven twelve people doing that. So there is a risk to that. And you just have to mitigate it. I don't want to talk about John Brennan we all worked for him. We all admire him greatly. We all know his record of public service. We all know that there are Americans. This is literally there are. Americans are alive today who wouldn't be without John's work Johnson's leaving government has chosen to challenge. The president quite directly. And I just wanna know how you guys think about that a former senior intelligence official career intelligence official really stepping. I know he doesn't think about it. This way doesn't think about it being political, but really stepping into the political arena. How do you think about that? Yeah. I mean from my perspective. I'm very supportive of him. Speaking out on these issues, and and here's sort of thinking on this. I I think he sees the current situation is an aberration. And really is deeply concerned about what's happening right now, you know, concerned about some of the approaches that the President Trump is taken and how it's affecting among other things the intelligence community and our national security, and when it comes to our world going exactly where we are. Right. Exactly. And how this will the country's ability to to. Yeah. Survive in the future in the way that he imagines can. And I think in a moment such as that it's hard to imagine anybody not wanting people with the experience John Brennan is head speaking up. Another words, this is somebody who has spent decades in national security and intelligence who has. Is served multiple presidents of different parties who seen so many things that the average person has not seen and he can provide context, and he has credibility, and he has the ability to analyze and tell you when something's wrong, and I want that voice in the public discourse. I wanna hear what he has to say. I don't think that everybody has to agree with him. I certainly think you can judge for yourself. Whether or not what he has to say is is something that you want to take on board. But I would not want to silence that voice using David. There's a cost to the agency at all. I think that is a concern of people who are really close to the agency. But is not the, but I think as a as a general matter not there is not a causE' h he's a former director, he's a he's a private citizen. Now as real said, he's someone who has spent a career in intelligence and national security and has a perspective and a special forty from his service that I think is valuable for him to bring into the public space and. It's not just that John has a Meyer policy difference with what the administration is doing from what the prime minister she was doing. I think what John is doing sounding the alarm that. We are being governed today by a president by administration that is several deviations away from the norm that there's a president who sort of lacks the intellect the ethics capability to run the country in a way that that protects the country Ford, and he has seen others in other countries, you know, behaving in this fashion and sees without leads. And I think it's important to recognize that it's not just John. You have former agency seniors like, John McLaughlin, or Mike Hayden who are also publicly critical of the direction that the administration has taken again, not because it's like minor policy differences. But because of a real serious concern. You have former senior military officers. You know, STAN mcchrystal Bill mcraven people who have spent their life defending this country. Who are you? Deeply alarmed at what's happening. And I think they have every right? And I I would say an obligation to speak out. So I agree with all that in. I agree with all of that. Where I end up is. I wonder how many minds are being changed because people are so firmly pro president or firmly anti president. And boy, it's hard to move a person from one box to the other and a lot of people in between. Right. So I wonder just wonder I don't disagree with what John doing. But it is wonder humming minds end up being changed at the end of the day. But but should that be the should be the reason? I don't know. I don't know. Because part of what I think is. Yeah. I it look probably would David saying to which I subscribe to as well is it? All of these people that David mentioned are folks who are geared not to engage in political discussion or to criticize the president, frankly. Right. That just you know by the virtue of their professional experience and the culture within which they grew up and yet, they're speaking out. And I think it may not change people's minds. Who are you know, core supporters of one side or the other? But I do think over time there's a moment at which people start to recognize Chee something's different here. This is this is really kind of extrordinary, and they may not listen at the moment that it said. But there may come a tipping point at which those voices are exactly and more significant. And I also think when those people speak up it gives people the the sort of space within which to begin to have that discussion in a way that they haven't before because one of the key challenges. I think we're facing right now is the country's so extraordinarily. Guided and on so many issues politics is clear one. But there are a lot of different divisions that we're dealing with. And you know, I believe as I know you to do as well that we are going to be stronger for United. We're going to be more capable of promoting the interests of the United States, and citizens if we're United, and I think that's something that if we can actually engage in public discourse where we disagree, and where we have views to express and so on that actually promotes being United. That's what we're trying to move for. And these are the kind of people who can do that who recognize both sides of arguments who see the value in having different politics in different views. But nevertheless, recognised once you've gotten to the aberration, essentially, the, you know, David described. Guys. Are you guys have been terrific? Thank you so much for joining us on the show. Thank you. That was real Hanes David Cohen. I'm Michael Morell. Please join us next week for another edition of intelligence matters. This has been the intelligence matters podcast with former acting director of the CIA, Michael Morell. Sponsored by Raytheon the podcast is produced by Olivia gases. Jamie Benson and Claire Himes. If you haven't already subscribe rate and review or ever you download podcasts you can follow the show on Twitter at Intel matters pod and follow Michael at Michael Jay morelle intelligence matters to production of CBS, News Radio.

president David Cohen Central Intelligence Agency director deputy director John Brennan Raytheon NFC John John United States acting director Michael Morell treasury CIA White House John Brennan Johnson Raytheon dot Michael morale Michael executive
TechFan Episode 402 - Ive had enough

TechFan

54:23 min | 1 year ago

TechFan Episode 402 - Ive had enough

"You're listening to another great podcast and the my neck, podcasting. Podcast. Number four hundred two giant is, is leaving apple stew? Loom ID softwares origin story. And I guess. It is tech fan podcast number four hundred and two, I'm Tim Robertson, and that is David Cohen. Hello, david. Hi, how are you? I'm good. I was going to do a solo show last week because no you couldn't do one and. Just too much to do. We finally had whether that it wasn't rain and nastiness, and I probably got too much stuff to do outside the house that just cut into podcasting time. I fail. Yeah, we just had our Galvan replaced from back. So this law, supplanting and stuff to be doing so doing. That's not fun. Well, so he's still very much thing. It looks nice when they stunned actually putting plant in the ground is identity. Joy, joy Julia likes. She's got a garden, and she got a late start on it because it was just the weather was just not good. It's too cold for awhile, and then it was too wet. And this didn't really work out, you know, time wise, so she's got the stuff planet now. But here in Michigan is been extremely wet and we've got quite a bit of flooding in the area. We've had it for a couple of weeks now and Chad Perry. For instance, there's this linear path. It kind of goes around our whole city. I think it's like fifty square miles altogether. But maybe more than that, I can't remember regardless a part of it is done by where Chad Perry lows, my original calls for the moment podcast. And he's been on tech pain in the past. It's washed up like way past this wouldn't path it. I've only seen it like that. Maybe once or twice my whole life. So the grow it's been hot the last couple of days. I mean like really hot. It was ninety degrees Fahrenheit here yesterday, but with like eighty percent humidity, so that's not comfortable. But you can't really complain when you've had that much rain recently or they just look like a Wigner if you do. And that's kind of what we've been struggling with. So, you know, she she finally got most of her garden stuff done now and the only thing that's really growing as green beans. And then I get I'm the only one in the house that likes green beans, and I actually like them raw and I get like one or two green beans every couple days. But now it's gardening has become a thing for Julian the last five years. I like it, though. I mean, you know, we get good peppers out of there and she's got green onions and, oh, I'm drawing a blank on the other thing. But the green onions are the onions that you eat the green part that comes out of the ground, and she planted it like three years ago, and it's never gone away. These are the biggest tree trunk green onions you've ever seen. And they've been growing for three years, we've never had to replant or anything, I remember when my parents had the house in Florida, which they had one on his growing up. The first year we've there, my, my mother, pants planted, the top of a pineapple in the very corner of the garden. And it wasn't it wasn't a big yard by any stretch. She dimension nation and it's only probably forty feet square, something like that. By the time she sold the house twenty years later that, that lineup will, she buried was a forty four point three crazy? Yeah. Well, it's Florida, so it's, you know it's hot and moist and stuff grows. Lot one five, but it still was yeah. Yeah, but it's history for you. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. I like those kind of stories when you hear that we bought this house. And the first thing we did was planted the tree, and then you look at the tree now and you're like jeez, thing is huge. My parents had something similar when I was growing up. There was no trees in the front yard and my dad planted. This little tree one year. And it's huge now. I mean it's, it's actually out of control, but. It is what it is. We haven't done that at this house, because we just don't really have the room. I made a huge mistake by the third or fourth year we're at this house. So, like two thousand and one two thousand two somewhere in there that I cut a whole bunch of trees in the backyard down cut two of them were dead. They had to go, but I wish I would have not cut a couple of the other ones down. But live and learn. So kind of big news in the tech world this week, which we're going to devote a lot of time, too. So let's just jump right in it. And that is Jonathon, Johnny is, is leaving apple. Yes, this funny thing about this one, really not in these the news. Interesting in the self is the fact that nobody idea this was happening this guy out of the blue. I don't know. I've been hearing rumors. For a couple of years now to be honest that, that kind of looking to move on that is interested in computers and tack was waning that the, the last big thing. He really wanted to do was the apple campus. I heard that. I, I, I remember hearing that four or five years ago. I remember hearing that when I was at mex- specialist, so I'm not really surprised. Well, look, he's been apple cheese. He's pretty much achieved. I mean you know, he's his status is a as one of the world's most famous designers has been has been Bill on the back of the week. He's done apple. And I think you're absolutely right. Everybody was aware that he devotional flow times, the apple campus as the new spy ship building. And when you hear some not you think, oh, isn't he meant to be focused on excel? Stuff customer facing stuff rolling into. So when somebody takes on a project right that is indication that, that they maybe getting a bit jaded with the day-by-day. So in that respect it's, it's not unsurprising but I think while the rim is a have been spilling for awhile. I'd I think nobody knew it was coming. And. What's, what seems to be seems to have happened is that? It's kind of been dressed up as Maury business as usual. He's, he's basically leaving to form his own design business. He's taking or he's partnering with Martin Newsom, who's another famous designer who he's been collaborating with for a long time, and they're sitting out there bone business or shorts dream project for him is being pictures, though, worry. We, he will continue to have apple as a major client, and so nothing change. But that's complete rubbish because obviously, he has been a very powerful influence on the design of Apple's products. But because being so close to when he he's been at the top of the company, he's been able to direct design led engineering now will not be able to do because he wouldn't have the intern leaflets perspective that he has as a head of design apple. He, he would just be a contractor affectively though. A very powerful influential. Contractor. But certainly no nothing like the level of it'll influence. He has today. So thank you. Or do you think that it was one of those, we think it's time for you to go and we're gonna dress it up as you've been wanting to go anyways, but we take it's time to go now. That's kind of what I think it is. I think that I think Tim cook and company said, miss, we, we gotta part pass at this point. And I think there's a couple reasons for it, but I think the fiasco with the, the laptop line right now was probably a major contributor to that, you know, Johnny Johnny a so all consumed about making things is thin is frigging possible. And it's in the last ten fifteen years has been function or form over function. And I think now we're at the point where he'd that's really starting to become an issue, and I don't think he was willing to, to change and compromise at all when it came to that, and I think he got to the point where apple realized, hey, you know, this doesn't make sense for everything we need to we need to get. Freshen things up around here. I think I I'll be honest. I think it's a good move on Apple's part and Tim's part to be honest to park companies. But I think it benefits apple a lot more than does Tim or Johnny is. Because they, they need a fresh perspective on their design because quite honestly, and I've been saying this for a while their designs are boring. Now, they're making the same product. For a long, long, long time. The I max are not significantly different than they were fifteen years ago. The iphones, they're almost the same as they were when they first released in two thousand seven ipads about the same as they were were. Where okay. The ear buds. That's, that's pretty cool. This amac prime which is quite well that's the first one. But this is. I agree. But I don't think that's a big Tim cook thing. A big Johnny. I thing Johnny ice thing. I think he was involved in it. But I think the engineers had a lot to say about that product now, the design for them, and it's clear by looking at the design, because it's designed around the engineering of the product, not the design of the product on I, I find myself wondering whether the experience of creating them, pro has, has forced or made some of the senior executive apple realized that. You know, the, the balance has been has been too far the wrong way Zahn. I look, I think the criticism she makes about the, the keyboard in the design the tops a quite legitimate. I think that has a problem that apple has been slow to respond to, and you're it's, it's interesting to speculate whether that might be because. Ability team apple would convince it was the, the, the fin cable was the right thing to do and oversea supported by engineers, who have said, look this radical technology. We've puts his keyboard is the future. Don't worry. We can tweak it. We can get it right. I think all of that stuff, apple would be a dumb company hadn't picked up on there and ultimately responded to it. Whether that's. Significant the departure of Gianni. I will not. I don't know. I suspect this is something that has actually been on the cards for a long time. I think he's increasingly been looking at different internal things to do. And he's kind of come to the end the road there's nothing left to be done except to go back to redesigning the products. And I don't think that's what gets him a bit in the morning anymore. He he obviously feels that he's he's, you know. Coach's deputies the point they can do that job properly. Full him. I do have some misgivings about how everything is structured down. There is. No, head of design. You know, your number was before. Title, yet, the wolves because let's it was. It was Steve Jobs, and us and also Stephen, Johnny. We're very very close. They were co collaborators. We'll see now. That's, that's I was getting to this. And I think he just hit upon the important thing. I don't think. Steve Jobs was ever a designer. And I don't think he's ever pretended to be. But what he had was impeccable taste. He knew what was good and he was. Right. Ninety percent of the time, and he also knew more importantly, what was not good in why and he could pinpoint it. And he has a power and thirty into that company going way back to the apple two days to enact changes to make it better. And I think his track record historically shows, he was right. Not on every single product. I think like everyone likes to bring up a cube. The g four cube that was simply product way ahead of its time, if that would have been released, you know, recently, it would have been a much bigger deal than it was then. But putting that aside, Steve Jobs was right. And most of the time when it came to what consumers want why they want it, and they don't know they want into we build this thing and he was right. And Johnny is. Is a brilliant designer that made a lot of bad decisions that needed someone like Steve Jobs, to say, no, not this way. Let's try it again. And without that kind of. I, I think John Gruber, put it really good McCartney and Lennon together. They were the Beatles. They were brilliant apart now so much. Yeah, I mean, you know, the Lenin stuff with Yoko Ono and other than maybe imagine most of it was pretty terrible and stuff with wings is horrible. It's, so it's the quite taste. No, it's, it's, it's mired in the midst of their, the yeah, the mid seventies, just garbage music. It really is ban on the run is absolutely atrocious. And he may be had one or two, good songs after the Beatles. And, you know, the forty years since but for the most part, it's just pretty awful. But together it was unbelievable. The, the sum is greater than the parts at that. I take that definitely with, with the search on. And I'm not saying sir, Johnny. He's a ninth realm. So I wanted. Yeah. But I don't live in the realm. In that case, I want cool. President Trump President Trump because he's I don't live in the US. It's fine with me. I don't like calling him president either. Mate would be better? But. Move it, honestly on. Yeah. I think that. Without Steve Jobs as guiding influence at apple. I don't think his work has been as it's definitely been the output has been high, but I don't think that the, the products themselves are as great now. He's done some really good stuff. I think the apple watches brilliant. I think the ear buds was great, but the computers, but remember everything that they build, it apple is a computer, and this is another thing that John Gruber mentioned his post about this. Everything is a computer and I don't think Johnny is wants to make computers anymore. The watch is a computer the phone the ipad. Those are computers, the max, of course, even the headphones are computers in. He doesn't want to make computers anymore. He wants to expand. This is a good move for him. I can understand that. And let's face it, you know, the guys coming towards the end of his career, he's, he's, he's at that point, where people want to slow down and Pap spittle picky about what they do what he could retire today and never work again. You know, he's, he's immensely wealthy. Yeah. But it's not. I don't think making money. We'll get him out bed in the think, is designed and. Lots of people in the all's wants to slow the round put down as they get older and become bowl choosy about what they do. So what can I can understand that the, the consumer have really is the fact that is to say without any head of design? There is a real risk that apple will go without stewardship go mid nineties, again, led by engineering and you end up with a load and load of schlocky products because some engineers things a good idea to do it. There is a real risk of that, I think, if, if the team is not careful. And be interesting how they manage that. I know diehard apple fails will say you have the mid nineties was when I got into loving Macs and apple and you know it was it was that was where my passion started. Yeah. Remember that was a beleaguered company. Yeah. They had some really bad products that we always kind of overlooked. And it that was the period where a lot of companies third party companies kind of stopped in to make Apple's products better, you know, because apple apple would release a. Let's say gee four and by the time they got it to market. There was already a faster processors out there. And yet, Apple's products were slower than what you could buy a great example, is processor, upgrades from Maxine dot com. Am I suppose that was pretty good? You got him at that was pretty good. You know they were. It was companies like Maximes other world computing, that stuffed into that void that apple was releasing products that were already out of date when it came when it was released, but we were still snatching them up. We wanted them knowing that those companies that go to see that we could immediately upgrade. So that's the mentality that older MAC users have that. Why won't computers? I can still upgrade will. Yes, because when you got into it, they sucked out of the Kate. Right. The problem is if the I might goes that why you doing this anymore nothing. It's the MAC book pro goes that way, you can't do stuff with them anymore. You know there are so few pulse you can change on these machines. Even if even if you've got the capabilities on, I think I think the light is once licensed, laptops, is pretty much nothing. EJ. Chelsea. And I've done this myself chase. Yes, essays and the older laptops. I think the current wants everything sold it in you can do that at all. So there's absolutely nothing. You can change in those computers. And the, you know, the only Mike is the pros, okay? The probably is not bad, but the rest of them have pretty much the same way and I understand your fear that apple didn't immediately announce a replacement. I don't necessarily think that's a bad thing. Let's get the right person in, you know, they didn't come out and say, hey, the hunt is on now. But you got to imagine this one of the richest companies in the world led by some brilliant people that's been an apple a very long time, and they know their history way better than you. And I do so I don't have that fear that it's going to become a purely engineering, lead company, although I would like to see engineering have a little bit more say in the designer products. I think that's been a big problem. And again, the, the keyboard issue recently is kind of indicative of that, but I also think that there are a lot of very smart, people at apple, and maybe they don't necessarily need that type of person. Maybe it helps to break up the design between, you know, mobile and desktop, you know, and when I say desktop, I mean, laptops. Max and I phoned in and then another one for all the other teams that are making headphones and watches. I can I can see the thinking behind that. If you've if you've had charismatic character, and you feel that design is become too, too much. You know, the tail wagging the dog ate, when that person leaves not to replace them. But so actually. Replace them intelligently, reorganize a little bit better. So instead of one person, it's for people, but the problem the problem I have with that is that nightshirt bills vacuum? And the problem is somebody needs to lead decisions. And, and if you've got a I think the ripple since the chief operating officer now I'll so if you've got designed reported to him and the engineering reported to him, you've basically you've, you know, you've, you've given him the role of mediating that, and you've got to be show that he does that well and doesn't let one be more infancy elva and d-. Do you will end up with these situations where? You know, once one saw till the other basic is like, who has the most cloudy sense of getting what they want, then it becomes more political, and that's not a good thing. There is one aspect of this, that I was hoping, maybe you would pick up on and you have it yet, and I, you know, I don't always necessarily like coincidences. I don't think that coincidences are always just that. Oh, it's a sequoia incidence that these two things happen, very close together, and there's a huge coincidence, here that I'm surprised you haven't picked up on. Canto Jonathan Jonathan is leaves but just a few months before apple makes a massive higher. They hired Owen Ruben. Occasional co host of the tech fan podcast. They he he works for apple now. And he's got such cloth that he can eat. He even came back on the podcast with you to do an episode while he was at apple. I'm not I don't think anything I don't want to put any rumors out there. I'm just saying, I don't know if I believe. Definitively not speculating I'm going. I'm not. No. That's you think that, you know, I, I don't think anything I just possibility that him and admire be. I had to step down in the car park. I you know, I think Joanie Bentley in drives a Prius. You know, I can see I can see them. Maybe Joe sling for a parking space pets. Woods Rix changed. Keyboard, brought up a Yanks act if I have you ever heard of major habit. Punk. Yeah. Know who I am. You remember Atari. Yeah. Yeah. You remember Liz old apple products that would didn't break, I designed those. We love you own. Yeah. So I you know you ain't get. No knighthood. No, you're not getting hood. Although you could be president. I think that this is a good move for apple. I really do. I've been bitching and complaining for quite a few years that apple needs to really shake things up on the design. Look, nobody else's designing anything in the computer space. They're really not. Whatever apple designs, the entire industry policy Samsung, when it comes to computers and phones, wouldn't be in business. If it wasn't for Johnny is day, just wouldn't because they just simply copy, every single thing he does tweaks it to their own. You know, whatever. But and then when they break away from what Apple's doing, like, oh, I don't know, foldable phones is a colossal failure. Right. People say, oh, they've made the first big phones. Yeah. That was a difficult thing to do. It's a bigger version of what apple Ernie made difficult. So apple needs to change things up entire industry. I don't wanna say they've caught up when it comes to. You know, the elegance of how something's built, I still think apple does that better than anybody. But for the average consumer do the same. They don't see any difference between the Samsung phone. And it's we're we're at the site. Now when you can, you know, if you get in sees a car exhaust, getting the Bentley, you can tell that it's a very high class well-designed interior yet. But then you get into Lexus and lunch center, people will go, you know, it's cheaper in Daly is good. I like it. And that's kind of why we all know is that, you know, apple apple being the Bentley Oviously, and then everyone else being the being Alexis certainly at the high end of computing. You know, I have laptops Neely as nice as a as an apple. Macbook exactly. And, you know, they kind of built the same way they ate the ascetics to a degree some refer some respects that's a resilient. So we're seeing we're going to have a new revolution in mobile device in desktop. And I think Apple's new MAC, pro goes a long way to establish an planting that flag that this is a different idea. I think you have to move on from surive, because it's just. I don't want to say his designs are stale, but he has an aesthetic that he always goes for you. Always know when it's one of his product products, you just do. And that's why I don't take the MAC pro was really his baby. I don't believe it was, I think he had some influence there. But I don't think it was. I don't think he was twenty four seven hands on that product death, he wants because he's been busy with all the things that is one of the reasons full this and I think he was more interested in the headphones and the apple campus and the watch in the things that weren't obvious computers. And I the proof will be in the pudding, when that machines actually released and we get hands on apple census, ten Eunice for review that, you know, is it as good as we think it's going to be, I think it probably will be. I'm very impressed from what I've seen of it so far design wise. I'm more excited about the MAC pro and I'm not buying until your wrong. But I mean. The I frankly, I'll be disciplined to then send us ten you know how they expect to do proper review with ten. Hello. It is called my MAC dot com. Yeah. I think it's a good thing for apple long-term to you do. I think what's interesting about the, the MAC pro is that nobody else in industries making computers like that anymore. You know, I mean that's still computers as a thing has pretty much faded away. Anyway. Except for in the gave me PC, but then you look at those, and those are still black plastic boxes with giant fans and LED's blinking all over the place. Thankfully, your whole exactly what they were doing in the nineties there. Yeah. It's they basically looked like Kobe calls from Felsen fury's. Yes. Exactly. Those machines this YouTube channel down lay down the corridor from me. They have his a wolves rule glossy so they have one hundred desk down there. It makes me laugh, every time I won't pulsed it AMD Reisen logo in conduct glowing green letters in the size of this box with a glass that side. It's just it's a glass pitcher of diesel in his Celica. You know. Yeah. It's yeah. I think I think apple is the company to once again, bring us new design new ideas, and computing and could because if not apple who it's going to have to be a new company. And I think the cost of entry now is such that I don't see a new company stepping up to rival of Dell or p or an apple because the problem is, is the home. The apple makes enough mall gin to about full to do that. Exactly what else everyone else likes tiny marched on the machines. And then they get volume. Absolutely right hundred percent. But then, again, if it was a true competitor to apple will what operating system you're running windows. Yeah. That's what well then then, then you're competing against the cheap products and you're, you're not going to do anything. That's Nick, or or is a new company gonna stop up and build a revolutionary computer with their own alas. That, oh, by the way isn't compatible with any program on the planet. Now, of course, they're not going to do that. So it has to be apple. They need quite honestly. They need to freshen up. Apple has been stagnant. When it comes to design in that wild factor for a very long time even before Steve Jobs passed away. And, and some people say, well, do you think that Johnny is would be out of if Steve Jobs, would still be there? I don't know. But I will say that the products wouldn't be what they are today. I think Steve Jobs would have Shukan shaking things up because I think it's, it's obvious to everybody that we've been stagnant in designed for seven eight years now. An entire computing industry. It's been pretty stagnant. If you look at your computers from seven eight, nine years ago, they're not all that different than they are today. Add stuff. I think that's a fake Coleman. Yep. So we had the we had the computers from the eighties and nineties, and then it changed in the two thousands. Right. And we have that little bit of time where we had these colorful, Amax and stuff like that. And the clam shell ibooks, and then tire industry started copying that, then, of course, apple pivoted again, and we've got aluminum and. We are where we are today. It's time for another change. Yeah. Oh, so it's, it's definitely true. If you look at that set sake of the methyl bodied, laptop. Yeah. Yeah. It has, you know, you can go all the way about that's tiny Powell book. Yes. And that was when it came in and you look at its tiny pound boats Davis is a molten machine. And you're the molding machines are thinner. They've got better screens. Go better batteries in the see much, much false the processes, but actually a Paul from that still same similar. But I would I would argue if you look at it to Tena PowerBook, I think it has more character than the machines due to them, because it uses different materials rather than just being one solid. Circle issue. But yeah, so that's David, in my take, we will look to have your take feedback is always welcome here on tech fan, even though we've got someone we've neglected to read them recently, it's the show at tech van podcasts dot com. You can hit us up on Twitter. It's tech vampire casts, and we are on Facebook. So we do want to thank our sponsor, I've already mentioned him once other world computing, if you're looking to get some more storage into your machine, or externally there, the company to turn to they've got a six terabyte Toshiba drive right now to seventy two hundred RPM misses the big three point five inch saddle dry. This is big one hundred and fifty seven bucks. Not bad six terabytes every bit of data I have right now. David, except for maybe some of my archival stuff could fit on one of these drives, I. That's. Would you got one of those envoy E X, we talked about the little Fum drives? That's like an SST thumb drive a couple of them because they, they have a big clearance sale going out, my, my that's from Larry regular emails from Larry that I go yesterday saying they have this big clearance going on. So I I'm browse straight, and I need to one of these because the MAC currently using I bought us, and it has a twelve month warranty on it. Warranty meaning that I can't do anything with the storage inside because some that thing where they put the sticker over one, screw halls. And if you take it off, they'll know and obviously, it's an older machine. I don't want to give up that warranty in case something, those government with it, but it means I'm stuck with the ones who are in the SST, which is not being for me. Those are on very pros though, they're, they're really fast. Yeah. Except well this why wanted I've, I've, I've tried using a. Usb three key to fifty six geek one, you know what is fine? But it's quite false enough. I know that the, the envoy once they have a presence in the pitfalls, so my two thousand ten to go the nine are forget the twenty seven inch MAC replaced with my pre owned twenty one inch I MAC. I got from. ABC. I actually booted that up in windows off over non VoIP pro. I plugged it in. I had windows installed windows on it. I restarted held down the little key combination. It gave me which, which provides you want to boot from my Buddha from windows, and it was fast. I was amazed a USB three is very false. When you've got false storage behind that as well. Then you will go side. Yeah. I was amazed that it worked as well as it did. I was like holy crap. This is awesome. So we wanna think our sponsor ODBC. Of course, we get to see them in person in a month David a month from right now. Well, actually a month from right now. It would be the last day of the show, but we do have max dot conference and expo coming up. I'm doing the my Matt quiz with guy. Sarah, let's going to be on the very first day right after launch. It's July twenty seventh and twenty eighth. If you're not planning on going, I like to know why. Hey, if you live far away. I get it. But if you're within driving distance of Illinois, even if it's like eight hours. I live in crow seat. Lindsey. You live far away. You're right Davis flying all the way from the other side of an ocean on a prop plane. It's gonna take him thirty two hours on that prop plane to get here. That's a shame. Obviously today sheep. Sorry. So we'd love it. If you guys came out, and, and if you do. You're going to see David and I come over and say, hi talk boss words, with a lonely guys that everyone's ignoring there. Bringing headsets so if you will so anybody who wants to be on the show. This is your opportunity, Zillow with me, will this recording and bit Ben to tell us how you hate what we do, and that we know if you really wanna have fun come into early because a day early will be July twenty sixth at one was at one or is it noon? I thought it was, there was noone noone will be there at one if you will still be noon on the twenty sixth David, and I are meeting and going to the galloping, ghost, arcade. It's about forty minutes. South of where Woodstock max talk is taking place. It. It's going to be a good time. David, and I've been there once the only time I've been there, I believe it was with you, and I still use those photos, occasionally that we took were there. So we're going to be at the galloping ghost start, Cade. It's not much money to, to play games for a couple of hours, we're going to be there for probably maybe two hours, maybe three who knows it depends on how fun the kids are having. This is one of the biggest arcades in the United excuse me in the United States. And I think it is the biggest thing United States. We've got hundreds of games. They also have pinball it's going to be a good time. Come out play. Somebody'll games with us. Hang out talk, we might do a podcast from there to who knows. But it's going to be good time. That's July twenty sixth. The day before max dot kicks off. Let's talk about the new dropbox David. Do we have to, you know, I? Let's call it produce. Most of the podcasts in the my MAG podcasting network. And when I say produce, I just mean, I host the files, so I get these files I F T PM up to the my MAC. I update the RSS feeds, basically I pushed the show live for, you know, the geeky show ever three geeky ladies, the Mayak podcast tech fan. Let's talk apple. Let's talk for tiger Affi. So there's a couple of different shows in here that we're doing, and they all share. You know all the files via dropbox. So we have a shared dropbox folder, I do with all of these different creators. They put the new episodes in there and all the files that I need, and I. You know, I could I get notifications that, hey guy just made a change. Fuhrer dropbox. So I know that that podcast is going to be ready here in a little bit. Well the last couple. Files that have been shared for whatever reason have been delayed. The last one, I believe was let's talk photography, and it was put up there and just it took forever for it to show up. Now, I thought, well, maybe this is a problem with, you know the. The the desktop app, if you will, and parked kept saying, well, no, I put the file up there, and he would show me soups. He would show me screen shot, and I would show my train child's not there. I even went to the dropbox website signed into my count, and I didn't see it. And then there was, and it was hours later so that, that is a problem and. The difficulty with that is that this was the Paul of dropbox whiz rock, solely. Rely, exactly why I subscribe and use a system. That's right. Because the reason we've never used alternative products like I cloud driving stuff like that, that are functional limitations, but it will say they. They were so complicated so much going on the back in the phones. His dropbox was had was a simple cone set you could understand his driveway and it worked it works. When nothing else words, exactly. Ten years ago. This fall, Sherry thing was really hard and false came along a mighty super simple. It was so simple that, you know, many of Iowa SAM's back in the days when I asked could do fall. Sharing side building direct API says since Trump wolves right in the app, so that you could easily move falls in and out of them's. Yeah. It was it's always been rock solid. The difficulty is is that? The, the competitors of cool. Sump now and you can now get built in systems from apple from Google. If you're on Android fine for Microsoft of your windows, the do the same thing drop. Look, Joe posters and they're fully integrations environments. So they in the pressure, and you would have thought that they would figure out a way to innovate the keeps the core product there. And is that what they're doing is they're building? Well, it's kind of helped to describe days because it seems will ever to workflow type of thing that seems to be like trying to copays point. Yes, thank you. I think in a little bit of Evernote, maybe. Yeah. And that's a little bit of Skype because they've got some video conferencing stuff in there as well. But is this is the problem is certainly not something you can describe in a nutshell the other. Elevator pitch. Guys forgot the basics when it comes to something like this, what's the elevator pitch? Well, I'll tell you what the elevator pitches is. If you wanna make use of all of these features, you have to subscribe loads, Elisa people in your organization to dropbox. Yes, because otherwise it doesn't do anything. Exactly. And that's the negative elevates page because it's basically saying, well, hanging them minute, I get this stuff from full for free, and that works with the collaboration ups. You know, pages numbers that sort of thing if I have office, three six five, which many businesses do I get I get would I get excel, everything get sharing? And I get shampooing them. I get all of that, for that subscription. And if I have Google docs and get all of that, you know, win land, droid fund. Everything's cruising. So Neo telling me on to ignore those systems, and by dropbox in states to do the same thing that I've already got with these other systems. Yeah, it just doesn't stack up and the problem as, as you've just strikes. It is that to do this. They'll breaking call functionality. And that's a huge problem fellows. I know you guys are avid subscribers. So I'm gonna put this Sinclair as I can knock it off. The core product is broken, you're going to lose all of your customers. I remember a couple of days ago, maybe the company is maybe three or four years ago. There was a big fuss over the dropbox clients for MAC that, basically, it was all skillful, it was, basically, the missions of breach. Some of they knew as security. The apple on and it cools a big stink. I don't I don't know how how, how is resolved because at that point, I stopped using the dropbox app, like, basically when I send falls gave us the web, because I don't need to have. Sink coffee Mudgal books anymore. Infant, I apart from seventy falls, y'all. Don't reuse it annual. Why use these other systems? You know, because they, they would benefit me, said that earlier that the other dropbox person that I collaborate with his you because up to about a year ago, I recorded both ends of the conversation, but with internet problems and what have you, it was just it was just as easy for you to record on your end. Plus, your audio is better even though I still have to tweak it. When I get it. I put some compression, I kick up the basin tournament trouble a little bit. Make it sound a little bit better. Psych we're in the same room. But when when you break that core functionality, you're hurting people like David, and I who are your biggest fans that's been promoting your product for very long time. I was on drop boxes side. Whatever you wanna call it for since the very, very beginning. I remember when dropbox for at least when they are very tiny company, and I had a meeting with a well, I don't get too many details. But I had a meeting with somebody and he asked. Me for ideas on how they can expand. And I said, there's this company that just came out the very small still. But I think they're going to be huge. It's called dropbox. I explained the functionality. I said. Honestly, if I were you, I would buy that company immediately? In this they were not big at the time. They've been offered, you know. Deals quite a few times at this point, and they've turned them down, which I think was smart then. But now, I don't know man. But it's hard to make your product sexy. When it's this shared folder between mobile industrial devices. That's really what it is. He's the cool offering. And I just said it's not sexy. I didn't say that. It's not a great idea. I think crucial to me to me. You've got you've got to build off that Cole. And, and if you one of extra things on that's fine. But you can't come ski you'll product sold says actually things and throw away the stuff that would so people. Why not too late for them to turn this around? I'm I haven't seen any whatever changes they made. I think they reverse a few of them, because it seems rock-solid again, I think the, the internet was very vocal with some of the issues that cropped up after this last major upgrade, and I did have an update to mind and it seems we work in great again. So the MAC cafes is still garbage it. I it's not good. It uses a huge amount of memory it requires a whole requirements backup. Well, I have the thing that's in my. What do you call menu bar? But that's a that is the Marquette. That's the sink cap. Okay. Okay. Look at she how it works. It's not good instead of improving that, and it's not great windows on this is steadily improving that they are just building the service on stuff that nobody really wants the thing. I if you don't know what your customers want, you might wanna research that I look look at gaps in the industry and fill those gaps find the problems that you can solve and solve them in such a way that you're going to get eyeballs and attention. And if you do that you're going to be successful. That's what may dropbox successful what they're creating putting on top of their existing platform. Now is it's not solving anybody's problems. Those problems already solved think of the next problem yet. And from our point of view on a very, very aware that they kind of follow sharing a folder sharing that we use is coming in on cloud for shortly. Yeah. We might not not we don't have any dropbox. So. Yeah, one of. The best stories in technology as far as I'm concerned from the nineties was it software. ID software. Did these are the guys that made doom? And what a great story it is right. Oh, yeah. John karma, karma. Check in John Romero's. Two of the pioneers and the legends and the video game industry again, you, you wanna use that same analogy very much a letter in the company on the absolute separately and so much. But together. Commack is the engineer rights kick-ass three D software. Yup. And then, and then Romero is the ideas man. He says, well is his what we can do that. You know, his his ton of video game we can meet with them, and they were very different people. Yeah. So here's this great story that those of us like David, and I and probably a lot of you listening that are these kind of hardcore geeks if you will know the story, and there was a book that came out a decade ago or so that I never bought but it's one of those things I keep meaning to go back and pick up and read. Well, I might not have to now because this has been picked up their story has been picked up by USA networks to make a TV series out of it, and this excites me because if you remember right, for the last few years, I was way into show called halt and catch fire and I love that shot. I don't know if you've ever watched it or I loved it. You should the series of complete. Now. I think it's four or five series or seasons. It's, it's done. I loved it. I've watched the series twice when they finally finished I went back and I watched the whole thing again. This could be a really good TV series if it's done right. And they've got a writer that I think is is on the ball. I think he's going to be a really good for the series. I I'm looking forward to this. We're a year and a half out from seeing anything from us. They have written a script. They haven't done anything. He's talking about pilot full serious. So this what I'm excited about this. I think this would be very interesting. The difficulty is going to be that oversee. It's is this going to be something where they stick slavishly to watch? She happened or are they gonna do what they did withhold and catch fire, which is these salty point that take it somewhere else? I think because are using real people, they're going to stick to the facts. I mean, they may exaggerate things here and there you kind of have to, but, you know, you're not gonna have three episodes of one guy sitting in a keyboard coating that'd be kind of boring. Unfortunately that's pretty much John. Comex story I know that being said, I think that this the history of tech that were we've passed now where you had these pioneers, I think some of these stories are extremely compelling because it has a direct correlation and what's going on in the world right now technology now this happens to be video games, but you could do the same things with the Microsoft, boys, they apple boys. I mean. History is so rich, I want to see it only that these people who have massively influenced culture, the one of the reasons the video games is, is a bigger industry today than movies is because a fisa -chusetts doom was the first bake playoff as pets shooter. Absolutely. So these are stories that I think it's gonna hit a couple of buttons the tech stuff the nurse stuff in the nostalgic stuff. This is going back to the early nineties, which a lot of people are kind of into right now. You know, you and I were eighty guys we were weighing in solid, you know, ten years ago. But now we're lying. Yes. Is well now those, those people that are in their late forties. Or having the Stahl Joe for the nineties. So you're going to start seeing the friends movies, and, you know, that's going to be bad. But I think that this is a whole genre. That halt and catch fire really called the pulse of and really did something quite amazing with it very compelling story. But there's a lot more story there a ton of stuff that they can do. And I like the you know, certain aspects of hall to catch fire that was historical. But most of it was, you know, basically, they took the story of compact. And then they just kind of went from there. This could be really good if it's done. Right. And I don't know. I'm excited about it. I wanna see more stuff like this though. Yep. The early days of my MAC, that's ninety five. I mean. It's a story that's waiting to be told. Oh, you got you got you got the story of aboard post guy working for the post office going through a divorce a new child, not sure whether he will come out that looking particularly good. I think know about the, you know, the skeletons you'll close it. That's right. The whole F B I Ray thing and. Yeah, we should probably don't their mind. Forget. I said that. So with that we're going to wrap up this episode of tech fan miss talking to you last week. David is fund this week. It was good and skit every week. It's a shame it couldn't happen last week. So we do again. Welcome feedback it's the show and we'll get to the feedback next week guys and we're going to we promised. We're going to get back into our Wiki trolling because I really enjoy that. We've just, you know, summers kicking off and things. Get crazy and schedules and blah, blah, blah, but we're going to get back into Ricky. Trolling as well. And feedback is the show at Technion podcast dot com. Tech fan podcasts on Twitter and tech fan podcast on the Facebook, you could also simply go to tech fan podcast at com or my MAC dot com and leave a message right there underneath the show notes. We'll reading here on tech pan next week the week after and the week after that baby could get books collaborate with us. That's right. Yeah. And if you've got an idea of something we should talk about hit us up. Let us know. Maybe we missed the story. Maybe there's something out there. They're like, well, you guys totally didn't even talk about this thing yet and I was kind of looking forward to getting your perspective on it. Let us know the David and I both work fulltime. So we're gonna miss stuff. Let us know we're both while read. So we probably didn't miss it. We, we think your ideas boring, but you never know us up. We'll. We'll tell you. Next week. David see that.

apple David Cohen Johnny Johnny apple campus United States Steve Jobs Twitter Michigan Facebook President Trump President Trum president Chad Perry Microsoft Stahl Joe Galvan Tim cook Davis Tim Robertson
Grenfell tower fire disaster: will there now be justice for victims?

The Leader

14:40 min | 10 months ago

Grenfell tower fire disaster: will there now be justice for victims?

"Assembling hardworking hands hands that volunteer hands that served our country hands the coach t-ball the hands that assemble our vehicles hold us together at Toyota we assemble cars and trucks right here with American hands American hands at the design table and on the assembly line handing over keys hammering I'm David Malls Land Seventy two people died in the Grenfell Tower tragedy from the Evening Standard in London this is alita willing to learn lessons because of this attitude it is clear from this that she cannot stay in her job she plans to retire next year at fifty and the fire started with an electrical fault in a fridge freezer in a flat hit spread because the cladding on the outside acted like a source of feel eighteen with children now more than two years on we've had time to process and comprehend with large pension she led an organization in a way which let down the victims of Grenfell attitudes does she has not learned the lessons she should now we know that number could have been lower there was a window where pretty much almost everyone could have been saved if London Fire Brigade and failing to prepare for fire involving cladding or in evacuating a high rise block. This in a city full of high rises is case slash comet There was no time on the fourteen Torsten Cook Yvonne now are investigations editor David Cohen has followed the grenfell tragedy from the beginning and spoken many times to some of those who survived and the relatives of those action has been taken very quickly on investigations editor David Cohen's been speaking to victims families on the day report reveals mistakes by London Fire Brigade acted to what it says I spoke to one survivor rookie yet Mahmoud do who walked out of the tower in her dressing gun carrying his nope that's no time to think no time to argue or second guess what you being told thirty six minutes is new time atoll seventy two people died taken from the Evening Standard's editorial column this is the leader for the whole thing pick up the newspaper had to stand Dacuda you ah polling so was the response in the control room dealing with those trapped by the fire I'm the advice to stay put giving evidence in September last year donny through June two thousand seventeen to understand what was happening the fire was first seen on the fourth floor at ten to one in the morning by one twenty six it had reached she found a dishonest disrespectful and hurtful and I've spoken to other survivors who feel the same way I think it echoes some Kohl's more deaths also dependent on what comes out and fees to or subsequent to concreting will then be the police decision for the kind of remarkable insensitivity for saying she would not have done anything differently here's what the standard things ever port finds an institutional failure sleeping son who basically survived because she ignored the fire department stay put policy and she had asked her solicited cotton says she would have changed nothing in the response to the fire the report condemns this a misquakees response on the night itself and warns that the FBI is at risk of mm issues and things that have happened all the way through there has been an attempt always to try and show maximum respect to the survivors but in this case it clearly hasn't worked the horror of the relatives of those seventy two who died must be collect the report yesterday and she was outraged that it had been leaked this morning so she discovered that when she woke up and saw it on the news inquiry has found the number of those who died could have been lower if London fire brigade had not told people to stay put. It's also accused the Brigades Commissioner Danny who did not he's been out of the newsroom speaking to them again today David this report isn't due to be published until tomorrow but it's been leaked early how of those you've spoken to if if action had been taken very quickly and if the first responders had been if my family member had not taken the advice they would be alive the must be people thinking that lots of you prosecute potentially the fire brigade under those this is not the end for the inquiry we look ahead to face to and beyond the city hall editor Ross Lytle and courts corresponder the thinking like that particularly because there was a window where pretty much almost everyone could have been saved if too many families who ignored that policy there was one family who I spoke to arrive back at the tower one in the morning was full of smoke the husband went to get his children out of the tower they want the thirteenth floor and sent his wife back down and arrived back they caught the lift up as luck would have it somebody jumped out on the fourth floor which is where the fire had just broken out the lobby has she got down to the bottom floor the first fire engines we're turning up and she said to them my husband children are up there and they're responsible let's see how fires can spread from his native Portugal and he ignored that policy and not only that he banged on all the doors of his neighbors on the thirteen up there and that must have been very very scary situation so incredible bravery shown by many of the fire service personnel who would flow and he saved the lives of all those people in the thirteenth floor some of the Fi and I've spoken to admitted that they radios were not up to the on the ground who could even tell them also and so's calling from this flat on this floor can you can save them they were pretty much on the aw on the night so when they did go up the tower they lost contact they did not have the right equipment that allow them to be in touch with their commanders the preparation I think there are others as well at the top of this command who face further scrutiny tell them to stay with a are and close the windows and doors and she passed her husband to tell him to stay put but he ah the conclusion you reach inescapably and sadly is how voidable most of these deaths were and we haven't even got on mm-hmm tiny cotton the the commissioner in charge of London Fire Brigade Who is she will retire next ah able to go up and clear those flaws they was window with that could have happened and I know David that I have spoken uh they feel that she should be made to face the consequences of this policy of in flexibility and also of this attended Grenfell Tower but was let down by those in positions above them well this is what survive is a feeling that and I think there there is considerable anger and and will continue to be because it it is grenfell there the plastic pvc windows melted and Bisley caused the site of the building to go up very quickly leaving people we'll go today brings the conclusions of phase one of the inquiry and looted events on the night of the fire is that a real concern I think is I remember six years ago spending two or three weeks though not lumber tone hole for the inquest into the to the issue of the cladding which itself is is a whole other issue still to come there are currently two hundred sixteen tall buildings in London where the St at the beginning of this inquiry I think some of the relatives of those who died and some of the survivors were concerned that might be a bit of a whitewash that's not what morten building will be able to protect its inhabitants for at least sixty minutes hence they can see Putin will be rescued if that Tim's thought that this was going to be establishment figure who wouldn't be criticizing people in charge an actually the report criticizes it happened no not at all this inquiry started office been criticized from the very outset the families relatives of the sleep that is one of the problems that happened at Grenfell to that there's this disconnect between the Fire Brigade Co Center and the residents phase two starts next year and looks at what came before how Grenfell Tower came to be in a condition that allowed the fire to spread with me now are I advice is no longer followed by London fire brigade because it's worried that these buildings are unsafe and we'll go up too quickly and the something like six thousand nine hundred evacuate very tall buildings and large numbers of people and should the inquiry when in the second half is the agree insight on those an opportunity to save people who were saying please come in Gates's please rescue us on the didn't get to them quickly enough on wiry and a thorough investigation into not only happened on the fire on the night of the fire but in the days weeks and months and even years preceding the hall editor Ross Lytle and caused correspondent Kristen Kirk both attended the inquiry hearings Ross reports that London Fire Brigade won't learn lessons from grandfather imagine there are some who are looking at this report today seeing that it really does pull no punches and being quite concerned about what might becoming had will that shape because I believe inside and the feelings there the brigade was worn dove was essentially not paying enough attention to nine nine calls made by the residence chapter there is justification and a possible convictions to lead on from from this this theaters quickly enough or get the models and didn't get these people even though they were desperate to be helped and they ended up dying in their plots just in you were there intially the fire brigade under those Imagine Kensington Chelsea counselor it's sort of off shoot organization for potentially corporate manslaughter and of course the criminal extremely important that London gets all the answers to this isn't it absolute fantasy but I think it was important in Granville cases to have this thoughts a dependent on what comes out and fees to or subsequent to including a will then be the decision on whether to prosecute the sixtieth set lacking all hosts which I think is a fourteen storey tower block encumber whale and what happened there was uncannily similar to environment very heavily Ross faced his Ju to begin early next year believe it's been delayed because of the delays in phase one that how policies were enacted in how we came to a position where a tablet could go up in such a rapid fashion and kill so many people yea just ask for the news from the evening standard this podcast his back at four PM Tomorrow Tower Event I don't think rushing to judgment is is the way forward so yes London deserves justice and the relatives would we're the steepest advice is no longer followed by the London Fire Brigade because it's worried that these buildings are unsafe and we'll go up too quickly and there's something like six days and then once all the evidence has been add in this inquiry then the can be proper decisions taken on whether the you're so when we get asked who we are we proudly raise our hands and say we are Toyota USA Toyota vehicles and components are assembled in the US using US and globally sourced parts investigation could actually potentially would imagine take precedence in a way in the me delete the inquiry father because the belief is that any sort of eh this is something that's going to take a lot a lot of time and that's Salida you can get overnight updates from audio news team three go smart speaker every morning at seven terrified calling nine nine nine saying trapped them chop gave me what day do unto crews on the ground simply didn't respond to that quickly enough didn't sane cruise up the nine hundred tall buildings again in London with the brigade simply new idea. Ho- see for unsafe the are just in your court correspondent if this doesn't of going back to the courts mm-hmm all buildings again in London with the brigade simply new idea Ho- see for unsafe the our our city hall at it's a raw slider and correspondent tristen Kirk on where the inquiries face thought then it means massive changes for people living in tall buildings and what what Danny Korten say two Weeks Square City Hall was there are currently two hundred and sixteen tall buildings and really old and all that sort of system fails and they have to quit changes the whole dynamic and therefore we're talking about firefighters having to intervene immediately.

London Fire Brigade Grenfell Tower Grenfell London Evening Standard Toyota David Cohen editor Danny Korten Ho David Malls Land Torsten Cook Yvonne Brigades FBI Mahmoud Dacuda donny cotton David Weeks Square City Hall
Sanctions, Secrets and Security (with David Cohen)

Stay Tuned with Preet

1:09:14 hr | 1 year ago

Sanctions, Secrets and Security (with David Cohen)

"From cafe welcome to stay tuned. I'm pre- Perahera. It's a terrible thing that we can't with great confidence say there is no chance that the president is not in some respect working for the Russian government. That's David Cohen. He held two roles during the Obama administration. I e served as undersecretary of the treasury for terrorism and financial intelligence, and then became deputy director of the CIA. He's now a partner at the law firm. Wilmer HALE, I speak with him about President Trump's strange relationship with Russia, the US shifts on sanctions and whether America has actually defeated ISIS. That's coming up. Stay tuned. As many of you know, we recently launched cafe insider, ROY delve into the daily avalanche of news and help make sense of issues at the intersection of law and politics members get access to a weekly podcast with an milkman me where we tackle the most pressing questions about what's happening that week members. Also, get a weekly newsletter texts for me when news breaks bonus. Stay tuned. Content and more stay tuned will be here every Thursday. But for more realtime in-depth analysis of what's happening today. Join cafe insider cafe dot com slash insider. That's cafe dot com slash insider. Okay. Let's get your questions. Hi, pre Louise in San Diego. And I'm wondering. Well, I'm totally freaked out by the fact that there's no readouts from from conversations meetings with Putin. And I assume that the senators know that I mean, if the public knows the senators, no, and I don't know why they're not more freaked out than than they have been and more wary of carrying out, his bizarre agenda. Anyway, thanks, I just needed to office. Even if it was just a line. Like, Louise, thank you for your honesty and candor with his back to your freak out and with respect to your question. As to why not more senators, and particularly in the Republican side are not freaking out. I I actually think that many of them are in every once in a while you saw Senator including chairman like Bob corker reveal his internal freak out when he would accuse the White House of being adult daycare. I think Mitt Romney probably is freaking out a little bit. He wrote that up Ed, which I think some people pooh-poohed, but other people welcomed, I think Mitch McConnell is freaking out in various ways. Even though he won't say it publicly he himself separate and apart from his concerns about how chaotic the White House's. He was fully humiliated by the president when he had a vote that got unanimous approval on a budget, even without funding for the wall. And then the president about face. So I think it's the case. And it's a theme we've been talking about week after week after. A week on the podcast that there's a lot of people who have problems with how Trump operates there are a lot of people who are really concerned about the Trump Putin relationship. The thing is talking about with the meetings and the readout are the series of discussions that Donald Trump and Latimer. Putin had in various cities, including Helsinki and Hamburg that the Washington Post has reported about suggesting that Trump is trying really really really hard to prevent the substance of those conversations from becoming no not just to the public. But also, even to the relevant internal high level White House staff, including the national security personnel, in some cases, the secretary of state and department of state, and that has a lot of people very concerned. It's got members of the house on the democratic side. So concerned they are considering as you may have seen in the news in the Washington Post article doing something fairly extraordinary issuing a subpoena to one of the interpreters who in at least a couple of instances was the only witness to the conversation between Trump and Putin. That would be an extraordinary measure. Later. But the problem with a lot of the things that Trump does is that it sometimes calls for extrordinary measures to try to undo the damage in make sure the information is known. I personally think it's a very serious step in a bad precedent to set going forward to the presence interpreter. But in a circumstance in which some people have ridden, including David from in a good article in the Atlantic in the last week, it may be a necessary step to take. So I appreciate your interest your frustration. Look, we all get frustrated the other night, I sent a tweet out when I saw the report that Donald Trump apparently has privately expressed great interest in withdrawing from NATO, and in my frustration, given the backdrop here, I sent out a, you know, somewhat ill-considered tweet where I said, you know, if this is true, Donald Trump should come forward state publicly his intent to withdraw from NATO. So he can be impeached and convicted by the congress to which a lot of people responded correctly, well, differences of opinion over policy are not a basis. Impeachment. And that is true. This is the problem with Twitter with two hundred eighty characters. Of course, that's correct. In part. I was showing the kind of frustration that I wish Republican senators show more of that you suggested in your call, but I will say that may be true the policy differences are not a basis for impeachment. But that depends on why one suggests they wanna withdraw from NATO and against the backdrop of the president of the United States constantly meeting with Putin not wanting anyone to know what he said reciting Soviet era propaganda directly the Soviet line on the propriety wisdom of the Soviet Union going to have ghanistan lots and lots of credible reasonable people in the national security community in the intelligence community. And the political community have wondered aloud is the president taking direction from Russia. And or is he more interested in serving the interests of Russia than the United States? And so in the circumstance in which a president is privately expressing an interest in withdrawing from NATO, which I don't know any reasonable national secure. Official or defense department official thinks that's a good idea. If he's doing it at the behest of his friends Latimer Putin that is one hundred percent impeachable this next week comes from clicky fingers. The XL God, that's J WD who writes at pre Perera, I feel like partisans on both sides are out in full force today. And I don't know how concerned I should be about bar getting confirmed can you cut through the rhetoric on both sides and share your thoughts, hashtag ask Prete. Okay. Cookie fingers or Mr. X L God. However, you like to be addressed look you're talking about the confirmation hearing a much of which I watched yesterday which was January fifteenth Tuesday, and it's kind of a mixed bag. I will tell you in. I I've seen a lot of commentary and seen a lot of the reaction from both people on the democratic side in on the Republican side their deep concerns that people have particularly given the track record of Jeff Sessions and the issues relating to recusals and whether or not Bob Muller contained place so on the. Side of concern. You have I think legitimate issues raised with respect to Bill bar taking a slightly different approach slightly different. But significantly different approach to the issue of coucil than his predecessors. So Jeff Sessions made very clear in the Senate questionnaire that he would seek and follow advice of ethics officials. And then he ended up doing that and withdrew from any oversight responsibility of the Muller investigation. Bob bar in very different language. The he reiterated yesterday at his hearing says he will consult with the ethics officials doesn't say he will follow the direction given or the advice provided, but that he will retain I guess he thinks he has the right to as the attorney general the decision making authority on whether or not he has to accuse which leaves a lot of leeway. Because even if it's the case ethics officials when they do their analysis, and they look at the memo that he said, which took issue with the obstruction aspect of the rush investigation and other things if they advise him. That the best thing for purposes of appearance or otherwise is to recuse. He has reserved the right? Not to do that. I think that's bad. I think people should be concerned about that. He's also seemed to prejudge a little bit as I've mentioned some of these relating to what the presence of thirty is and what Muller's authorities. That's not good either third. I think there are legitimate concerns that in some ways even though Bill bar to his credit has some institutional memory of the department of Justice, and is a professional. He served his department twenty seven years ago and his views on crime, and on incarceration, admittedly were formed at a time when there was a huge crack epidemic and crime epidemic and violence pathetic. In many major cities in the country. It is not absolutely clear to me or to other people that his sensibilities about those things have changed significantly. He did in response to questions from Senator Cory Booker. I think express some change of of opinion and some growth in that regard. But I don't know how far it's gone. So they're legitimate things for people to be concerned about in addition. All of that vanita Gupta. Who's a former guest on the show? A couple of times wrote a piece that you can check out on the cafe dot com website about how there's a deep concern that on the issue of civil rights which barely came up yesterday that Bill bar will be sessions two point. Oh, and we can't have that. Whether you're talking about voting rights or discrimination, lawsuits or anything else. So lots of areas for concern on the other side, Bill bars a lot better than what we have. Now. He's about a thousand times better than that Whitaker both ethically. Both as a skilled lawyer as 'institutionalised, and I understand that. It's not great from certain people's perspective to say, we'll someone is better than someone else. Can we do better? It's not clear to me. And I'm not saying that this is a good reason to support Bill bar necessarily. But it's not clear to me in the current climate with Donald Trump liking toadies surrounding him everywhere and often leading in place in an acting capacity. People who are heads of offices and heads of agencies. This is a professional person in all my dealings with him. I found it to be. Professional smart. I thought he quitted himself in some ways very very well during the hearing even on the issue of Muller oversight. He made it clear to a roomful of senators on national television that he will not be bullied by the congress by the press or by the president. I take him at his word on that. And he will do only what he thinks is right now the things that he thinks. All right. You might not agree with? But I still think that's a good thing. You know, the interesting thing that some other people have noticed as well about the bar testimony is that he said something good I thought, and that is that it would be improper for a president to attempt to intervene in any enforcement matter that touched upon someone close to him a family member or business associate and in fact, an attempt to intervene in such a case would be violation of the constitutional of that was said by Bill bar. The question arises has President Trump Ori committed that violation because if you believe the reporting he looks like he tried to intervene. With spectra, Michael Flynn. And maybe other matters. He also reportedly did that with Matthew Whitaker when he saw to ask the question. How can you rain in the SDN y prosecutors who bring the case against Michael Cohen? So whether it's with respect to Michael Flynn or Michael Cohen, Donald Trump, arguably has already breached the oath and his duty as articulated by his own AG nominee Bill bar as he said repeatedly. He's eight years old. He's had the job before he doesn't have a future in politics. He doesn't really need to be beholden to anyone in. So even though I think his views on presidential power a little bit broad. He does bring professionalism to the job. I think he's he's a better choice than Jeff Sessions was I think he's a dramatically better choice than Matt Whitaker remaining in place would be and look I'm taping this on Wednesday morning and the hearings preceding, but I agree with everyone else who says given the numbers in the Senate and given how he didn't have any particular gaps yesterday. And given the status quo of met Whitaker. He'll be confirmed in my hope is separate apart from concerns about him that he will distinguish himself and that he will do good things, and he will work with both sides of the aisle to bring about things like sentencing reform and civil rights improvements, and given his friendship and respect for which made very clear friendship and respect for about Muller. Does not think country with the president says the Bob Muller would engage in a witch-hunt. And also his clear statements that it would be his intent to make public the findings made by Bob Muller. I mean that that said he Bill bars, smart guy, smart, also clever, and he left himself wiggle room on all manner of issues, including the nature and substance of a report he would put out how much will be made public, but he would recuse. So we'll see I think there's some reason for cautious optimism, but I could be wrong. And then you can all yell at me hipeet. This is Sean O'Neil from Sholomo Massachusetts. Your show is simply superb. It seems to me Robert Mueller generating a lot of Antalya cases that will require support from the US attorney's offices at various districts, what kind of shape are those officers in under the Trump administration, and they ready to play catcher to Miller pitcher, Sean. Thank you question. I don't I don't know about the baseball metaphor. But I can speak to the southern districts ability to do those cases because I ran it which has had assigned to various things, including the Michael matter from os office, and they're in great shape. You know, the us attorney's offices throughout the country really are the backbone of the Justice department in terms of bringing prosecutions of asked majority prosecutions or not brought by trial lawyers who sit in Washington, but through the various districts all around the country, the other district in particular that I led for seven and a half years remains independent has the same. Excellent quality of people there's not turnover from time to time as happened with me there's turn over at the. Up. But when he was attorney changes that doesn't change the makeup of the office, the professional career, folks, whose politics are never inquired about his politics. Don't matter continue to work on the cases. And so, you know, other than shift at the top, which I'm not sure how much that matters the excellence of the office remains that's true. Also of the us attorney's office eastern district of Virginia and various other places some of which maybe we don't even know have received referrals from Muller's office. So the easy answer. Your question is there in very good position to bring whatever case, they think is appropriate to break into decline any case, they think it's appropriate to decline and further the spirit of your question. It's it's a little bit harder for president or even attorney general to shut down without good cause and without causing a conflagration in public. I think reckoning various cases in various offices. My guest this week is David Cohen during the Obama administration. He served first as the secretary of the treasury for terrorism and financial intelligence where among other things he oversaw the US sanctions program against Iran. David then became the deputy director of the CIA a position he held from twenty fifteen to twenty seventeen. He's now a partner at the law firm. Wilmer hale. I speak with him about the current status of US sanctions around the world the planned withdrawal from Syria, and whether he can say with certainty that the president of the United States is not a Russian asset. That's coming up. Stay tuned. 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If anything breaks, they will fix. Replace it for you for life. So for twenty dollars off a suitcase visit away travel dot com slash Preet and use promo code Preet during checkout. That's a way travel dot com slash Prete and use promo code Preet during checkout for twenty dollars office case. David cohen. Thanks so much for joining us. Thank you for having me. So I'm gonna start with a million things to talk about. Start with an easy softball question. Which is this is Donald Trump Russian asset. I don't know. Well, the fact that you don't know. Yeah. Used to be at the CIA. Yeah. As I say, the fact that I don't know. And this isn't have anything to do with my time. When I was at the agency has to do with everything we've seen in the two years since I think is really, you know, disconcerting that you can't say with great certainty that the president isn't either an unwitting agents or someone who has over many, many years been co-opted and brought into the Russian orbit does a pain you to say that terribly. It's a horrible thing. It's a terrible thing that we can't with great confidence say there is no chance that the president is not in some respect working for the Russian government. What is it about Donald Trump's interactions over many many years with Russians that make you worry about that? He has for a decade two decades. Been traveling to Russia on occasion, not consistently but on occasion, travelling to Russia. He has been involved in business relationships with the Russians whether it's the Miss Universe pageants or Russians purchasing units in his buildings worries me that he has in some respect been brought in to the Russian orbit that they have invested in him. This is the standard, you know, initially Soviet now Russian tradecraft, they see an influential American Donald Trump, you know, twenty years ago was an influential American they're going to look for a way to try to use that person as an agent of influence in the United States as someone who will who will help to promote their narrative, their align their view of the world. So, but do you think is hypothetical? If your poll varies experts within the agency that you. Help to run and said, do you think that thou Trump is an asset of Russia? Are there people there who would say definitively based on information that they have the answer is? No. So I can't say that. I can't say one way or the other frankly, because I imagine there has been a fair amount of information and intelligence at the agency is collected in the last several years that would help inform that answer. But you know, what we see, you know, openly transparently, you know, every day has gotta make you question. And and I think it's important to draw a distinction here between sort of policy approaches that you think gee, that's like ill advised. That's not how I would do it that seems to support the Russian viewpoint on this more than a traditional American going. You know, I mean, that's the president's prerogative. You know, we I think we need to give them the benefit of the doubt in some respects that he came to those views, you know. For example. So for example, his view on sanctions, you would say is a policy difference. Sure. I think it could be his view on the withdrawal from Syria. He ran and was quite quite clear during the campaign that he thought we were over extended in the Middle East, whether it was Afghan. I think the way that he has gone about announcing and beginning the drawl from Syria's completely screwed up. But you know, the fact that he took that perspective and others in the foreign policy and after scooter salad take the respect of. I don't think that's evidence that he is working for the Russians, but you can look at things like his refusal to accept the high confidence judgments intelligence queenie that the Russians attacked us attacked American democracy in the course to twenty sixteen election in you've got to kind of scratch your head and think why would an American president. Not embrace the intelligence community and not take the opportunity to defend one of the fundamental aspects of our country, our democracy. You can look at things like his sort of unrelenting attacks on the EU and NATO which again, you can look it as a policy issue or you can look at as a sort of head scratcher about why is it that he came into office, and essentially tried to blow up the two institutions that the Russians and Putin in particular are specially focused on trying to undermine. I do think the sanctions question is an important one. You know, there was a whole host of sanctions that were put in place after the Russian invasion of Ukraine, and that had broad bipartisan support. In fact, you know, there are many who thought that the sanctions in go far enough. We have in the course of the campaign apparently conversations between his incoming national security advisor and the Russian ambassador about relaxing those sanctions. And you gotta wonder what it is that leads him to to these positions. But if he's an asset he's very peculiar one, not only because he sits atop the entire government. But I'm guessing in your experience. Let me ask you the question in your experience. We're gonna tell matters at the treasury department and just living life. How many assets are you aware of who sort of did things publicly to cause people to wonder if they were in fact in asset usually they like to hide that stuff? Absolutely. I mean, I think that the traditional technique of an asset is to not draw attention to the fact that they might be, you know, working for a foreign power for Donald Trump. I think the the question has to be not whether he is sort of currently. On the take from the Russians and having some, you know secret conversation going on, you know, signal with Vladimir Putin where he's getting direction I think the question that people are asking. And I think it's a good question is over many many years going back more than a decade us, see Donald Trump, the Trump organization having interactions with the Russians. There's plenty of open source information about financial relationships between the Trump organization and certainly Russians and perhaps the Russian government. There are multiple trips to Russia. You see Donald Trump saying things like the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan was done in order to combat terrorism, which is a one hundred percents the initially the Soviet and now the Russian line. The reason that the Soviets went into Afghan. Have you ever? Have you ever heard an American official take that line? No god. No, it was the Soviet line. And it's now the Russian line. But it's it's not what the the US government viewed as the reason that the Soviets went Afghans, and they went into Afghanistan because they were worried that they were going to lose a client state. There was another article over the weekend that goes to some of the points that you're making about conduct. The Donald Trump is engaged in separate and apart from policy differences for which you say he can be given the benefit of the doubt. And one of those has to do with how secret he's trying to keep the conversations he's had with Putin and one of those conversations occurred at the Helsinki summit last summer to which I think there was maybe only one witness the interpreter. Yeah. If you were still at the agency, what would you make of a sitting president being sort of that annoyed and upset about the possibility? The other. People even within his own administration. Who there to give him advice counsel an expertise that he's so dead against anyone finding out what was said, I think it would be a very concerning situation. I think onto scores one is I think everybody would have the the question. Why is it that he wants this to be so secretive? Why does he want? No one else to be in there in the room as he has conversation and the second is there's a real intelligence loss. If it's just the president's who's in the room having the conversation with Putin. Right. Even if he were going to try to weed out that whatever was a two hour conversation with Putin as best he could it is it's impossible to to do that sort of readout effectively. You wanna have someone else in that room taking contemporaneous notes that can then be can then be shared through the intelligence community. Because that's that is a very value. Terrible source of information. What is the likelihood that the Russians have an audio of that to our meeting? I don't know. I don't know as I zero. It's not zero as one hundred right? So give me a number. Look, I mean, it was it was in Helsinki. You know, the Russians I think we can assume have intelligence assets there, and at least some capacity to try and bug that room where it happens. But I don't know what is the likelihood that the Americans the intelligence community. Some component of it has a recording that meeting. I would say close to zero we advise that well because we would not record the president surreptitiously. That's not what we would do and the president's unless he was the subject of a counterintelligence investigation. I think even in that circumstance. It seems to me bordering on the impossible to think that we Michael Cohen did his lawyer. Yeah. Taped him different situations different. That's different that the US intelligence community is not going to secretly record the president's meeting. And I totally get that. And I would agree with that. Although I'm not as expert as you. But I gotta ask you in time where this is serious question. The time where you have a president who's acting in a completely nontraditional way. In a way, that's making some people's heads spin in other people's heads explode should other institutions like the intelligence community play by the same old rules or should they think about doing? The extraordinary thing that you're describing I see shaking your head when I asked the question about whether. The community would take their own president. But does it come a time when you have to take extraordinary measures? Look, I think one of the tragedies of the Trump administration is the destruction of norms. The breaking down of barriers that are critically important to our democracy. I think one of those barriers is how the intelligence community operates and the care with which it goes about collecting intelligence. I would say it is not a zero chance that in some circumstance. You could have the attorney general director of the FBI director CIA, you know, working with the national security advisor in a circumstance where you think we really have a horrible problem here with the president's. We think he is he is actually on the payroll of the Russians where you could. I think hypothetically conceive of such a thing where you would serve your justly tip the president's. But I just I think as a practical matter, that's that's not how tone is Wendy operates. And it shouldn't be well, there's a related phenomenon that's been discussed in the last weekend as well. The New York Times had this revelation. They say that in the days after Jim Komi was only fired by the president that the FBI opened up specifically counterintelligence investigation right of the president is is. Not even more remarkable and unusual than what we've been talking about the CIA recording the president, what was your reaction as a former intelligence official to that news. So I thought that we actually knew that already from the spring of twenty seventeen from when Jim Komi was was testifying about the scope of what he was doing. And I think also the rules are put in place for the Muller investigation. It was clear that there was a counterintelligence investigation that was part of the broader criminal investigation that that Bob Muller was taking over you know, the fact that apparently according to the times that the president's was one of the individuals who was being it was the focus of that investigation. Doesn't strike me. As all that remarkable. It was a counterintelligence investigation looking at whether the Russians had coopted Americans in the course of the Trump campaign. And you would think that the guy ahead of that campaign would be part of the investigation. So in your time articles over hyped is that what you're saying David Cohen. I'm saying that I think we knew some of this already, and I I do find it striking actually that it took a year and a half for this story to to seep out if it's an odd leak that comes so long after there was so many people who had incentives to explain what was going theory on that. Which is I think the White House is anticipating the Muller report coming out in the next month or two, and they know that Bob Muller was conducting part of this is overall investigation counter tones physician, and they they want this out brilliant. It's brilliant Rudy Giuliani strategy. Yeah. Get ahead of it. This deal. Let me move on from these questions about Trump in the FBI. Do you know, you have a nickname? I believe you known as the sanctions grew. Yeah. Do you accept that? Title. I accept on behalf of a large number of people. Very diplomatic. You're the you're the guy how long did you do were involving American sanctions on other countries for about six years when I was at the department? So can we take a step back? Sometimes they're all these news reports about sanctions, and whether it's related to Iran or Russia or South Africa years ago for the United States government to impose sanctions on another country sovereign nation. What has to happen? In other words, can a president wake up one morning and say, you know, what I'm kind of pissed off Bolivia. Yeah. We should do something about that. The president does not have the unilateral ability to do that. Or does he well he sort of does actually congress passed a law in the mid seventies called the international emergency economic Powers Act known as a in the business that gives you thirty to the president to impose sanctions upon a finding that there is an unusual extraordinary threat to the foreign policy national security, our economy nited states, and if the president declares a national emergency with respect to that threat wherever I heard of that before exactly, but who who has to make the finding so the finding is made by the president's in an executive order that is the foundation for a sanctions program, but separate apart from the president doing that congress also has the ability to pass a law. Correct. Imposing sanctions on any particular country. Right. So in congress has done more of that in the last, you know, five ten years or so so specific legislation calling for specific sanctions to be applied against against countries by the Iran. Russia North Korea. But there's a back and forth. And there can be a check or balancer. Congress can pass a law. The president can veto at than you have to work out supermajority philosophy of sanctions. In other words, what is the makeup of a country that makes it more susceptible to influence by sanctions than another country is that just a country. It's also a target because we have sanctions program is against countries as well as sanctions programs against illicit conduct. Yes. Terrorist activity weapons proliferation. There'd be sickly five key elements. I think to a good sanctions program tick through them quickly. The first is that you have a clearly articulated policy of what you're trying to change. The second thing you need is that sanctions can't be the only tool using. We've got a vast array of power in the states from economic power to to messaging power to covert and overt influence campaigns to Miller. -tary singling a good sanctions program is embedded in a broader policy. The third thing you need is good intelligence. So you know, who you should be targeting sanctions, whether they're being affective how they're being Vadim. So you can then attack it the fourth thing for good. Sanctions program is international agreements around the program. Sanctions are enormously more effective if you have others around the world working with you not against you. And the last thing you need is a target that is -ceptable to sanctions meaning that they're exposed to the US financial system the US economy or make use the US dollar. If you got those five things you can have an effective sanctions program in deciding to impose sanctions is there somewhere in the process. A discussion of how it might affect individuals citizens of the country or does that not come into it? I think the Iran sanctions is a good example of that we in the Obamas ration- spent a number of years building up the sanctions. Against the country of Iran against the government of Iran by driving down their oil sales, cutting off their their banks access financial sector. What have you that was clearly having an impact on the economy broadly in Iran? Their GDP was going down employment was going up. There is a provision in law that forbids sanctions from targeting food medicine medical devices. So if you're selling food, or if you were selling medicine or medical devices to Iran, you could engage in that conduct. Even if you were a US company, and you can get paid. It's not against the law to sell food and medical devices, and that's designed to try to relieve some of the impact on the population. But we paid attention to that issue. Ultimately, the question that's asked in these policy discussions is whether the objective of the sanctions that were pursuing whose significant enough that this sort of collateral impact. Was something that has a policy matter. We were willing to tolerate financial sanctions were better than trade sanctions in what's the difference? I think by and large they do the differences financial sanctions go after the ability to pay for goods or move money trade sanctions try to prevent the movement of goods financial sanctions. I think tend to be more powerful because is actually easier to restrict the movement of money than the movement of goods. And so you can really you can have a greater grasp on what you're trying to achieve. What do you make of the state of play sanctions against Russia? And where do you see that going against the backdrop of what we've been talking about? Yeah. The president having a different view. Maybe is you are not comfortable saying one way or another whether or not he's an asset. Even though we might give them the benefit of the doubt on policy issues. It seems almost difficult to do that. If the other thing is true. So I think on on Russia's sanctions, we're we are. Right now is in a little bit of another world. We have applied sanctions with focused on the Russian activity in Ukraine. They have sort of run their course in in a sense sanctions on Russian oligarchs, which are I think design mostly to to put pressure on Putin himself have had sort of a mixed effect. Just recently the sanctions on Dera Pasha have been in the news because his companies which were also sanctioned when he was sanctions. The Trish department has proposed to relieve those sanctions on his companies don't think we have a good reason to think that that has had much of an impact on the thinking of President Putin that people around him, you know, on the other hand, we did see that the Russians were quite interested in having the sanctions relieved, which I think is a, you know. A good indication that the sanctions were having some effect. And if they didn't if they didn't care about them, they wouldn't be they wouldn't have spent so much time trying to persuade the incoming Trump administration to remove these sanctions, right? Sanctions are not punishment though. Sanctions in the classic inception. Designed to change behavior. They're not design to punish. So the target of your sanctions should have the opportunity to demonstrate changed behavior. Changed approach. Whatever it is. That got them sanction. The first place they should be able to demonstrate that they're no longer engaged in that behavior. And so the sanctions can be relieved that it's designed to be coercive. Not not unitive. Do we should have more sanctions criminal cases based on sanctions violations. Mike smiling. My my office brought a bunch of criminal cases based on violations of EPA and some of these other labs that you've described. Yeah, we need more of that. Or not like got to testify those no case or the with the spin off the. Silicates? People may have heard me mention this reservoir was an Iranian gold trader from Turkey who my office charged when I was in office he ended up flipping and cooperating with the government and its co-defendant went to trial after I left office, and you testified at that trial trial because this isn't exactly the legal charge. But the basic charge was that that this guy minute Attila had lied to us officials about what he was doing with raises rub. And I was one of those officials who allegedly light too. So I got to go in and testify about my interactions with with Mr. Attila, which I think has led to both you and the being we can't really go to Turkey. We can't go Turkey. I mean, I can't go to Russia. But I think sort of defacto matter can't took it was your file experience funded. My folks, you will did it treat me. Well, it was it was an interesting perspective to be in the witness box. Having been a lawyer from any years. How'd you handle? Yes. How'd you handle cross examination Jim out? I think I was able to to sustain myself. You think you're able to sustain yourself. That's very modest. Yeah. It was good months. We've putting any other countries you think we should be thinking about sanctioning. How many programs have sanctions we have we have thirty active sanctions programs, and I think we have too many candidly. I think one of the problems that we've run into in the last several years is as sanctions have become been used effectively in some circumstances. There's a view that they can be used effectively in all circumstances. So we have you know, just in the last year new sanctions program on deroga-. We've ramped up our sanctions in Venezuela. I think there's a fair question as to whether those sanctions programs. Can be effective, you know, whether they are trying to achieve some policy objective that has been, you know, clearly identified, you know, and sort of meet all of the requirements. I think a good sanctions program needs to meet in order to be affective. You go back to sort of the national security threat matrix a little bit. Where are we with ISIS? So we are very close to eliminating the territory that ISIS controls. We are not quite there yet. I've always thought a bit like infection. That's you know, you need to apply the antibiotics, and you had to stay, of course. So you really get the, you know, the infection out. I think that's where we are with ISIS. I think there's there's still work to be done to get them entirely out of land that they hold. But that does not solve the problem. Isis as your listeners may remember is just you know, the version two point oh of al-qaeda in Iraq, a terrorist organization that we spent a long time attacking and moving out of territory taking their members off the battlefield, but we never completely did the job either in terms of of Radicati the land that they held. But I think more importantly. Going after the the ideology that led to ache URI I emerging and certainly into ISIS emerging. That's the hard work. That's the long term worked in these to be done. But I guess my reaction is it's pretty much correct? In your view. Then what the president said that ISIS has largely defeated fair. No, not fair. It's not fair if by defeat we mean, we no longer need to worry about ISIS. Well, I guess the way in which he would claim that ISIS has been largely defeated versus the way you claim. They're still remains to be done, which I agree with is that work that needs to be done by military forces remaining in various parts of the world. And you get. Troops or something else? Yeah. So I think you don't necessarily need US troops to do that to do the the work on the ideology, you'd need some some ability to watch what's going on. Whether that's you know, with the military or the intelligence community to see whether this this problem to mix metaphors as metastasized, you don't necessarily need troops on the ground, and you know, to go back to something we were talking about earlier, the decision to to withdraw troops from Syria or for that matter. What seems to have been a decision to withdraw troops from Afghanistan is not one that. I think broadly people in the national security community think is completely illegitimate. It's you know, we've been in Afghanistan for, you know, a decade and a half now or longer we've been in Syria for a number of years. Now, there's no-one no-one than. I know support if uses phrase, it's a controversial phrase no-one supports endless war, right? So I'm assuming that your concern is with the manner in which the withdrawal was an honest. And that means not just the, you know, doing it by tweet which itself is, you know, so crazy, but not having any. Planning emplaced for how would draw troops will not create more problems than we currently have how we're going to work with the Kurds. So that they don't become you know, the target of radicalization by the Turks. We're going to address the fact that Iran is emplaced in Syria and using Syria as a conduit to resupply. Hezbollah MS a whole host of things that we should have done. So that when we remove troops from Syria. We leave a situation that is. Yeah. Better than the situation that we have today. I want to go back to what you said about ideology. That's the hard thing. You know, some of the work that you, and I have been engaged with an in in our careers. There were real concrete tools. You know, you impose sanctions you decide what kind of sanctions, that's a real thing charging someone with crime. That's a real thing to get at the underlying root of those things. Whether it's roots of crime, you know, socio economic status and opportunity and all those other things or eradicating ideology on the part of people who feel they have grievances against the west legitimate or not that's really hard grit in a little bit out of sort of the wheelhouse of how you and I engaged as professionals in government, Juban advice to focus to how you deal with that ultimate issue. Yeah. I do think that one thing that we need to focus on as a country is how we engage with the world. Right. And I think the terrorism question is puts this quite precisely the United States out in the world. Does a whole host of really good things. We educate we build we develop infrastructure, we combat corruption. And I think there is an expectation that the added states is on the side of progress on the side of economic growth, we need to ensure I think two things one is that as we engage with the world, we do those things we don't pull back. We make clear that the United States is there to help support our allies and countries where you know, they are not already deeply embedded in the in the alliance structure, the other side of this coin is we need to also make that argument at home. One of the things that I think is critically important is that we not allow there to be an artificial distinction between foreign policy and domestic policy one of the concerns that I have is you see people United States questioning why we are engaged with a worldwide we take leadership position in the world. The reason I think is at least from my perspective, twofold, one is because it is an investment in our own security. If we're out there helping to address. Conditions in the world that if we if left unattended could be the breeding ground for threats against the United States, that's one hand the other hand is there are real threats out in the world. And it's better that we address them there before they come here. We've got to make that argument in a way that is more compelling to to folks here in the states. We got to tell stories we have to explain why it is what we're doing. And I also think we need to be thoughtful about how we engage in the world. And it's a fair question. Whether we should be doing everything we're doing or doing everything in the same way that we're doing it you use the phrase leadership in the world. And that sounds very nice on the other side people will say, well, if that means that the United States has to be the world's policeman. We don't get paid enough for doing that we could take into our, you know, phraseology from Donald Trump. We don't get paid enough for doing that. We have enough of our own problems. We have an. Immigration problem. They say how do you get past that divide? What sort of interesting is there? I think there's a perception that dividers greater than it is. There was a recent survey done by the Chicago council global fares, they do this every year, and they asked people all across the United States, you know, should the United States being gauge in the world should the United States have a leadership position in the world. And somewhere in the like seventy to eighty percent of the respondents said, yes, the US should be gauged world Chevaliers position world, and those numbers are going up interestingly in the Trump era, those numbers are going up not down. So I do think that Americans do understand that an investment in the world in trying to address problems that exist out in the world redounds to our benefit. It's an investment in our own security as much as it's an investment in the conditions of others around the world like the problem is like with all things. Like that. It's in a more investment, if you put a certain amount of money into a country to help them build up a certain business, then they can trade with us. You can see that over time on a graph. But this idea of American influence throughout the world over time. You don't see the loss immediately because it's not a balance sheet anywhere. Do you think the issue of whether or not we should be involved in the world is beyond debate? Whereas at legitimate thing that people should talk about it. It's one hundred percent legitimate. It's legitimate to question what we're doing? We're doing it Howard doing it. I think that's that is sort of the essence of democracy, right? The only reason the United States is involved in various countries various places around the world is because we are trying to essentially fulfill one of the requirements in our constitution to provide for our common defense. Right. That's why that's why we're out there. The people ought to have. Say in this. My view is that it is hugely in our interest to spend the time spend the money have the people overseas, but to do so in a way that we rethink on Qasim basis, and I also think it is it is critically important that we explain what we're doing not in abstract notions of, you know, American exceptionalism, or you know, whatever it is. But why it is that if we invest in the education of some girl in refugee camp in Syria, where we invest in anticorruption efforts in Central America that that that helps the United States both be more secure it helps our prosperity. And frankly, it helps the image of America in the world, which in as you say morpheus ways, but in ways that ultimately are very real. Helps to protect the United States. Easy question. Yeah. In sixty seconds. Explain how we solve all of our issues with North Korea through sanctions. So I think the Trump can take you can take seconds. I think the Trump administration has screwed this up to a fair that will. And by that. I mean, he says it's all fixed. Yeah. That's that's why screw up. Right. I will give credit to the Trump administration to some extent. For a limited time in what they were doing it to beginning of this ministration in ramping up sanctions on North Korea. And they built on a foundation that have been laid. But did some significant steps to enhance the pressure on North Korea and to bring in Chinese to the offered those those sanctions that isolation of North Korea was starting to work. You could see it starting to work. Then you have Donald Trump. Just jump into the breach here in a way to sort of claim glory in this Singapore summit, and it destroyed everything that had been being built, right? So he comes out of that summit first of all with a declaration with Kim Jong Hoon that is fool's gold. Right. It's disarmament declaration where there's no substance to it. He then tweets that we have solved the problem of a nuclear North Korea on his way back home. He's recently told us he fell in love with Kim Jong. I remember that it was very very touching and the effect of that was to completely undermine the sanctions pressure. That was being built the Chinese in particular. But also the Russians are now essentially, not working with us or not working with us to the degree that they were previously to put pressure on North Korea and Kim Jong Hoon has since that. Summit taking a couple of steps that are completely reversible. Ultimately meaningless in terms of restricting his program. He's insisted that he only will negotiate with Donald Trump. So you've got Pompeo. You've got Steve begin you have others at the working level trying to work with North Korea. They don't and Dennis Rodman to probably. Yeah. I'd much deployed Rodman yet. But I don't think it's gonna work. And so the ultimately we are now with North Korea is that the Trump administration is working into a position where North Korea is going to be a defacto member of the nuclear club, and how soon well, they they have nuclear weapons the only way employed against us. We don't know with any precision, whether they're ICBM's can strike the United States. I don't think we can exclude the possibility that as we sit here today the North Korea can stick nuclear. Weapon on top of an ICBM and they construct US. But the so that's obviously a problem that problem is compounded. By the fact, that the way this North Korea issue has been handled. We don't have the rest of the world now working with us to try to restrict and ultimately eliminate the North Korean nuclear program Casca personal question. Yeah. Personal professional. Don't worry. We'll Laura on your up to the last day that you were the deputy director at the CIA you had presumably every day access to got briefed on the state of play a lot of threats in the world, including even though maybe we didn't know with precision. But you knew that day January nineteenth two seventeen the best thinking of how soon North Korea would be able to deploy weapons against us that they've developed already. Yes. Without being specific. You knew a lot of stuff. Do you miss knowing that stuff or does it give you some? Leaf. That's not on your plate anymore. No. I mean, let's be honest. Of course, I miss knowing that stuff it would bug. You did a bug you out every day. Like, oh my gosh. Look at all these threats. It it didn't in it. Didn't I think in large measure because I also had visibility into what we were doing about it, and the people who are working on it and the the range of things that we were doing to try to provide for American security. So yeah, there were lots of really gnarly problems and some really, you know, frightening threats out there. But you know, we were getting after it the extent you can be specific without violating duty if you'd had another year. Not at the top there at the CIA was particular area that you thought while I would really like to see this through and spent another year trying to protect America from any particular threat. If there's one you could pick. What would it be? So you can pick three. Yeah. Well, look, the this situation Syria when we were there, and to some extent, you know, even as we sit here today was I think by far the most complex difficult and seemingly insoluble problem. And you know, although I I don't pretend to believe that, you know, had we had another year we could have landed that aircraft in a way that peace, and and the in happiness broke out all over the Levant. That's an issue where I think I would have liked to been able to continue to tour on it, look and the North Korea Iran issues those nuclear issues, I think are are ones. We want to continue to work on, you know. The list is long cyber China or got to get you back in there. Yeah. Why don't we have so many intelligence agencies? Like three hundred something like that. Because they grew up over time in fashion that was not the I think the original design, I think we're designing until community from scratch. It would it would look differently. If he would have just one or do, you think Barry's agencies need to have some intelligence capability, you know, it's a it's a really interesting and hard question. I think expertise that you can develop in a in a specific agency like the NSA with its capability and its cryptological capability sit. You mean signals until signals intelligence? Yeah. You could that develop within a broader intelligence agency? Yes. It could you know, it's part of the broader intelligence community. But there's also something about having a dedicated focus that helps to concentrate the activity and improve the performance. What do you think the morale of people as the? Right now. So. People ask me that a lot. They do. I thought it was very good for a good question. I think the right answer to that is to say, I think them around the agency is the same as the morale in the United States that sucks. Yeah. Well in some respects it does right. Because you know, there's a lot of people in the United States who are quite quite unhappy with the way things are they the agencies about everybody's Jordi. Yeah. The agencies big place, and it's got people from all walks of life from all around the country who all have different perspective that sort of on the political dimension. I do think one important aspect of morale at the agency is that there is a enormously powerful mission orientational to what people do there. So what they think about Donald Trump. You know, what they think about, you know, Hillary Clinton or whoever the democratic candidates may be twenty twenty or the other Republican candidates for that matter in twenty twenty is not that important. Their morale doesn't depend on. That. Morale depends on whether they will pursue their mission. I do think that the way that this ministration uses does not use intelligence has some impact on how people in the agency feel about their day-to-day work. But it's not it isn't political. It's that you know, they're busting in their ass their taste taking risk. They're living in austere in difficult places overseas away from family away from friends, whatever it may be and the product that they're generating is not being used in the ways opposed to be used. I think that has an impact, you know. It's very similar to the way. I would answer I was asked about the Justice department. I think overall morale is high because the work that people do is based on the mission that they have and whether pursuing gang violence or homicide cases, Republic rupture or anything else. They don't love it. I'm sure when the president. Of the United States CASAs Persians on their attorney general and seems to think that there's no such thing as truth that has lawyer saying truth is in truth. And there's such a thing as alternate facts at all that not great. But probably the morale they feel as citizens is in worship in the morale. They feel in those jobs unless you're in a certain line of work. So I imagine there's some people who are working in particular issues. Maybe the folks who are focusing on North Korea may have their morale impacted more seriously than your average rank and file engine or analyst were employees. Yeah. I think that's right. I think the the the closer you are to the crazy the more your morale suffer. What do you make of John Brennan Twitter feed? Not crazy. First of all, I think John having spent a lifetime in until community a lifetime looking at threats to the United States looking at how autocrats operate and the damage they can do to their country, and a lifetime understanding that his responsibility is to warn about threats is acting in the way that a lifelong intelligence officer who has a platform now as a private citizen should act. I don't have a problem with John saying publicly whether by Twitter or or otherwise that he sees what this administration is doing with Donald Trump in particular doing as a threat to the United States. I think we're all the beneficiaries of people like John of people like, Mike Hayden, John McLaughlin, and others people who. Have spent their life defending this country. Stan mcchrystal in Bill mcraven in a real true American hero so-called generals. Right. People who've done extrordinary things and have spent their life thinking about these issues saying there's something seriously different and worrying going on. I think they're doing a service. See something hopeful about the future. I think that this country and the people who work for our government are fundamentally good they will ensure as we go forward that what this country stands for prevails and that the harm done in these four years gets repaired David Cohen. Thanks for joining us. Thank you. Hey listeners if you haven't had a chance yet check out the new cafe store where you can find original. Stay tuned merchandise, like t shirts, and hoodies and mugs, maybe spotted our gear at live shows or social media. But now you can find it online that shop dot cafe dot com. So head to shop dot cafe dot com. To check out the stay tuned swag. And rep your favorite podcast. That's shop dot cafe dot com. This is the part of the show run talking about something that struck me in the news. And today, I wanna talk about the basketball player, and whether or not you're a fan of basketball, you should know the story in his canter in this kanter's Turkish background, but he's a legal permanent resident in the United States on the path to getting his citizenship. He plays with New York Knicks before that he played for the Oklahoma City thunder before that he was drafted into the Utah Jazz. And the reason I mentioned him is because he is in some jeopardy of being arrested. If he ever goes to play abroad and has announced in his own up Ed in the Washington Post this week when the next go to play a basketball game in London the same day that this podcast drops he won't be with them because he fears for his life. Now, why does basketball player in the NBA if your life where it turns out the cantor does not have a good relationship with the president of Turkey president to one you've heard about? Before because I've talked about the situation Turkey on the podcast number of times to remind you the background president Erta one is very angry with and wants to extradite back to Turkey, a gentleman by the name of Attila Gutman who he claims helped launch the failed coup in Turkey a couple of years ago. There has been talk about whether or not Michael Flynn was trying to help the rendition of this American resident Fatullah Golan back to Turkey, and whatever. Squabbles. That someone Gula n- and Erta one have and whatever support even basketball player like his canter may have forgotten. I think if you're American you should shudder at the thought that has Bill Browder has suggested many times that INTERPOL can be used by a authoritarian leader of a country. Whether it's Putin Russia or early on in Turkey to snatch Americans who were doing nothing more than exercising. Their first amendment rights or having disagreements in a respectful way can be snatched. From an airport if they travel somewhere and brought back to Turkey to face imprisonment, and perhaps even worse as and his canter says in his op Ed in the Washington Post, quote, I wouldn't travel this week to Britain where easily could be kidnapped or killed by Turkish agents or to one's arms are long. He hunts down anyone who opposes him? And he reminds us. Cantor. Does that in two thousand seventeen or two security team or thugs as the posts detoro board described them even beat up peaceful protesters outside the Turkish embassador residents in Washington remember that so a mentioning this chiefly because I think we should figure out a way in the world for people to be able to practice their profession with playing basketball or being journalist exercise their right to speak exercise their right to associate and it would be nice to see someone on the American side. I haven't seen it yet. But an American official decry this kind of gamesmanship and threatening conduct on the part of so called officials in Turkey and his canter should be able to without fear. Go play basketball in London with the Knicks rather than have to be concerned about trumped up. Charges literally trumped up charges of terrorism against him. I can't put it any better than ended himself in a tweet where he said, the only thing I terrorize. Is the rim. Good for you. Well, that's it for this episode of stay tuned. Thanks again to my guest, David Cohen. If you like the show rate and review it on apple podcasts every positive review helps new listeners find the show, send me your questions about news and politics tweet them to me at freak Berar with the hashtag ask pre or give me a call at six nine two four seven seven three eight that's six nine two four pre or you can send an Email to stay tuned at cafe dot com. Stay tuned is presented by cafe. It's produced by Erin and the team had pineapple street media. Henry Malaki Joe level generalize. Berman and max linski these extra producer at cafe. This Tamara suffer and the cafe team. Julia Calvin Lord, the name Bassetti, and Jeff is our music is by Andrew dice. I'm pre- Perot. Stay too.

President Trump president United States President Putin Russia Syria David Cohen Trump CIA Bob Muller congress Iran President Trump Ori Helsinki Donald Trump America official Senator Jeff Sessions
TechFan 430 - Broken Glass

TechFan

1:10:08 hr | 3 months ago

TechFan 430 - Broken Glass

"You're listening to another great podcast in the my neck podcasting network different fan podcast number four hundred thirty. I'm Tim. Robertson joined by David Cohen. Hello David Hello recording from my Brand new I mac. So for those who listened to they'll ask jeeves pub. The whole episode was pretty much about my magazine. Yeah and then what I'm going to do and it was a conundrum. So what do in the end. Well I did what I probably shouldn't have done but I figured it would. It would make a good episode so I actually went to best buy and picked up the AMAC about an hour after we ended recording Picked up the Iraq that they had in stock which is probably the most sensible thing today rather than trinet fixing old machine. I just wasn't confident that the machine would come back worthwhile. Yeah especially for the amount of money that who knows what's wrong with it number one. It could be the motherboard Could be the hard drive. If it's a hard drive not that big of a deal but still just didn't wanna Dinka around with it for four or five days and it not work so they basically had a retina display. Twenty one Mac with a mechanical hard-drive one terabyte at best buy and. I thought you know for what I do on a daily basis on my Mac. A mechanical heart is probably fine. I know there are a little slower. But it's a little slow. Oh my God so the thing is the thing is we just had bad memories. We forget how slow hard drive is. Yes but the caveat with that is we remember man mechanical hard drive with an operating system. That was a whole lot less demanding. The won't we use nowadays this so mechanical hard-drive on say g three or G for AMAC is fine. Yep in click things move things around browse the Internet. Whatever it was fine If you put an SST in it'd be you know an order magnitude faster but it was fine. We we can get by. Yeah that's no longer the case I could not it? It was an am not. This is not off seriousness. I could not use the machine. Yeah I think unfortunately problem is the opera systems designed with the expectation that most people ever says days including the develops I. I don't think they've really tested very much hall drive. I couldn't do three things at once. I could not have a video playing moving a window and copying files both think that lately bogged down. That's the real constraint is basically these computer now. Doing an awful often the background they never yesterday. And then you you do your stuff on top and Yoyo disc Stran- data from multiple places in the drive at once and it's just over a quick. Oh it's not not that it's not very quick it's it it. It was unbelievable. I could not believe how slow it was. I literally said I can't use this computer. Might not eight year old computer when it was working was twice as fat or more than that. It was ten times faster. I mean it wasn't even close and and the thing is apple is selling it with the latest overprices some moments. We know. They're keeping that nope. When I got us was not running the latest us. What was it running the whole Well Yeah Mojave is still well. Yeah even Mojave though. He's not old No year and still has much of the same problems and so on the point. I'm trying to make his apple sells out the fetchy light. That's base. Vet She unusable. It's there should be a class action lawsuit this is. It is literally unusable. And this is how unusable it. So I'll take you through the steps here David. The first thing I did was said there was a software update for so I updated it Oh Yeah No. That's not gonNA work. The first thing I did was restore from my carbon copy clone backup. Yeah and of course that does not overwrite the operating system itself it just moves your files and preferences and libraries and all that over. Yeah so once that was done which by the way took an entire day a day I could not believe it took a day and this was over USB three. It took a day so next thing I did was running update and of course. I would've figured like you did that. This was already running the latest and greatest in no so it downloaded a whole new operating system installed that and it wasn't any faster. It was still deathly slow. And that's kind of weird because you know back when I first got into Mike's when you got new version of the OS was always faster. Because they were still in the. This is the ten point three temporary fulltime yet. Panthera Tigris back then because they were still kind of tweaking getting a rest- yeah they were getting always tend to wear need disobey and the replacing some legacy stuff and they were improving in that sort of thing certainly up until Oh probably poss- snow Leopard went. Wants to mavericks in that sort of thing. Ten point nine ten point ten up until that point every time you got new. Os that competes was Demonstra. You could not say foster every time you won't idea well not more so I got everything updated. I weeded out. All the thirty two bit APPs that would not work Which by the way some of them were working until upgraded the OS. Yeah issue this about that. Maybe stuck in my homie. Well I didn't realize that that was the update I thought it was an update to that as a whole new. Os there was no warning right so weeded out all the thirty two bit APPs and there were a few that I'm I've yet to figure out what I'm going to replace him with Love Letters. One of them Which I let tip to be honest. I mean love light. It hasn't been updated from five years and I know but it would work excellent made. That's the audio much better. Oh yeah no A- A great program But I always. I've always known this on borrowed time because added to fat affectively. The I think eagles sold to somebody and then they basically just showed a stuck just gelled air either way it's an of life Got Rid of old version of garage span. It was on here. All my adobe products are dead I thought about subscribing then I saw how much it is on a monthly basis. I went yeah. You're retarded. I'm not what are you crazy. Well no the the less defended bill grind. Who say. I'm going to going to play devil's advocate here. The the per- The pricing of of W subscription I think for what you get is very reasonable as long as you use most those apps all the time and if you're a professional who actually uses them for work I think actually the whole debut subscription thing is a radio contest small Saadia. The problem is off. Lavas are here who just basically we bought copy of one of the products. And we just WANNA keep using it and you can't right. Because if they slows things because of adobe basically given not on maintaining anything except subscription products now and there are some entry level subscriptions. But they're still expensive. If it's something you on the US. Once in a Blue Moon Photoshop would be the only one I I want and I forget what that is. But it's like twenty bucks a month or something Gary Bucks. I'm like it's gets three times as much as Netflix Yard. Your mind so quite honestly Hello Pixel Mater. Which I was using anyways. But I've always liked to toby. Photoshop shop better even for the basic stuff. I was doing. Because they knew our key combinations. I just L so much more efficient but going to get raw fish with now well the one thing you might be able to do. This is actually on a new machine. At Zak's she spent a whole division of obvious ten in an in virtual box. Vm-ware's on the line and then continues access your old apps that way you're though thick for him Off Spoken by a man. He's kind of spent a week messing with this computer. And is they now? Well maybe so the next thing I did was do a complete backup of the new operating system and everything because since updated. Everything rebuilt all the libraries. I didn't WanNa have to do that again. Because I knew I was going to replace this hard drive. I had ordered by A two terabyte. Ssd which was at that point sitting on the shelf. But I thought okay I saying is you have to to back up this machine so I cleared out space on a Western digital SSD. That I've got that I had decided I'm gonNA use as a time machine. Backup going forward Brian. But before I did that I knew the whole thing once again use carbon copy closer and backed everything up and that was another day from mechanical hard-drive that's in here to SSD or USB. Three an entire day. That's Yeah Dupe. It eight hundred ninety gigabytes. Well yeah again. The problem is that drawing. Your is just you know it's it. Produces data sought and writes data at such low rates compared to an sst that it becomes absolutely limiting factor. So I also decided since I had a little bit of time and I knew I was going to do it on the weekend. Some GONNA have the Machine Open. I might as well update the Ram. It's probably pretty easy. To update the RAM and here to offended Shimla it came with eight gigabytes which quite honestly is sufficient for almost everything I do I. I really don't need more than eight gigabytes but if I'm going to have the machine open why not crank it up to thirty two CAS PRESUMABLY AT ONCE? You've got access the innards. Then you know you just replace the bit. She needs to report. So the Ram came I ordered it from obt Wednesday night. I said today shipping it in Choctaw. Saturday Kevin She that is the problem at the moment with the so many people shaping so many things that everybody is struggling subplots as well will the carriers having to comply with a distancing regulations which means they're slower except for four hours away. I could have driven there and driven home. Yeah don't think it really you know. The the the problem is the way logistics works is. It doesn't really matter how close is probably could be right around the corner but it will probably still be shipped two hundred miles away to a logistics center before said Batty well. They said that it was going to arrive Monday. Which I was ticked off about I actually sent a support thing to ought to be ceasing. Hey I picked to day shipping You know I I need this by the weekend well it. It arrived Saturday so credit where credit's due to facts. They got it to me two days before they said they were going to. Yeah I mean I had to situation sweet. Wires white repackage With the game laps outlawed bought off Ebay and a bit Po. Po Twenty four IEP SHIPPING. And so it had been malt has been As out for delivery from two. Am on the days waiting for so it was you know which basically means they. They plan to put it out. You know it's on the truck going to it to you. Yeah nothing comes all day at five thirty knocking off time. All of a sudden the tracking changes to there was an emergency were severe weather event. And we won't be able to deliver this sedate and that basically is the driver hadn't got round to it and was going back home that that was the that was the emergency and I and I got this. Dutch Guy Because of this European support and I tore him strip because initially I was just I suspected that's what happened. I just wanted to know is going to come the following day and the Guy Fed to be said to me said well that service even those twenty four hour. He's not guaranteed in twenty four hour. We deliver it with best endeavors. So they'll try and deliver it tomorrow and I said well what do you mean? They'll try? He says well the same thing could happen tomorrow. If they can't get round blessed will surely sensible thing will be the first stuff off the shelf. The truck is the stuff you missed the day before. No it doesn't really work on said. Well how will I know if it comes tomorrow night? He says well. You'll just have to wait and follow the trucking. I sit bobby the truck. You will die at five this you just change it. Say not come in today you know. And at that point he he basically because he couldn't help me any further yet. He got frustrated because I was getting frustrated. 'cause he was assigned the same thing so again I was saying this is dumb wanting. Speak to the parcel center. Our can't do that. Will this'll thing and eventually he said to me. Well I can raise your free for you to collect it tomorrow so I said what you saying that twenty minutes ago. Where do I collected from? He gave me the address. These fifty minute drive from me. I said I'll go and get it tomorrow if you don't think you can guarantee to get it to me tomorrow. Our Ken fine. Are you just think what's wrong with these? So that's why did wrong with these people so I do sympathize with shipping. Well I don't because You pay extra yes in now I this whole thing and all that that's fine except you're still charging me extra. Yeah yeah no I descend in your situation. I would be looking for some money back from Fedex. Yes Oh accent. They the at she did so. I can't I can't complain but then Twad so I'm not going to. Yeah so they did it. I got it just just complain on some public show where thousands of people you might be thinking about using the change them on. I don't do that Then I thought you know. I'm going to go over video because I'd watched the one for hard-drive yeah well I I watched it. All sweet after year said that you might be changing the drive. I went and thought I wonder how hard is and I take city. 'cause I done that before on the other older Mac and like the the gloss screen magnets was held with magnets and yet suction pulled up. And then I as I recall you had to then undo four or five screens or something and actually removed the LCD panel from the correct machine. But then everything was there and now you were saying and the ODBC video demonstrated Ashley. It's Stockholm with with special. Double sided adhesive and there is no glass a glass and the LCD. One piece exactly now so in one respect I thought well that's better because actually the worst part for me was pulling the else fragile. Lcd thing out to fuss about taking the ground gloss of the Magnus but then the other things when you putting it over here because it's fiddly uh-huh uh-huh you oath that was I wasn't your neck It was the screen. Oh as well what the the the psycho screen What he just fell out the English properly. Yeah that that was literally my screen from the mattress fell off. I'm not even kidding. You can probably hear the families now. I thought you were joking. Now the wire pulled out. The Fan is starting to crank up big time because it knows that there's no controller now so we're GONNA have to pause this recording while I put my glasses here here. The Fan spinning up big time. Y'All can hear it. Yeah let's let's pause for a minute this okay and we are back. How long did it take me David about half now but half hour about the story? You have to accelerate story now given what just happened but yeah so yeah you you bought machine. He bought bought bullet. Ssd YOU BOUGHT RAM exchange. Because how how could he be to the Ram and you had done you backups. Now so had everything ready to go. Carbon Copy Kloner cloned over to the new SSD. This is a day before. I actually did anything. This is Friday night so a wanted to make sure that my clone hard-drive is you know correct doing its thing. So what I did was stuck it or I I went into System Startup Disk chose that one even though it's an external drive astray in I rebooted from it and it worked fine. And here's the thing even as an external drive it was ten times faster. It was embarrassing. Yeah he's the bottleneck. Yeah BE THREE YEARS. Be Threes telephonist. And he's a you. Tighten the slow thing at equation. Which is the intern tarp? I don't think they even some two hundred drives. They know they're they're one terabyte fifty four hundred fifty sabet cities the cheapest crappies one terabyte drive. They could find. And here's the thing. Fifty four hundred RPM was slow fifteen years ago and this is what they're putting in brand new. I Max Apple. It's a disgrace. You'd be ashamed of yourself. You can't tell me that they're saving any money by putting this in there and you know what it. He wouldn't be so bad if it was easy to change it yet. Particularly I mean look at the current sake of Saas. We Congress on Apple. Store have done and you you know you wait a long time for a build build to water. Yeah but it would be easier it except if it was like okay. Sorry so go to do that. But it's just a couple of grades. I'm the backup. Change it but that is not the case. No He's demonstrated so when you order the stuff from Odbc it comes with a kit. I remember I ordered two different things. So this is my saving grace trying to so I opened it up. I watched the video for the Ram upgrade. I and I went all crap because you literally have to take pretty much every single thing out of the i Mac because they put the ram behind the motherboard. Right so this is. This is where my mind particularly got blown as I was saying just before you had your accident Mom on the machine. I ever did this. All you had to tighten the whole. Lcd He kind of had take out a separate peace whereas now is kind of all stocked together glued into the machine but you can leave out and then disconnect it from the motherboard and then at least. You've got the folding and for me I was saying well before you had your x number saying that at least then you don't run the risk of getting dust between the screen and the display. Which is what I was always worried about when I did this spa but yet when you when you sent me. Oh pitches and was doing yes you were doing it am. I said well. What if you tighten them out for? Ya and you said because the rams on the back I was just my mind was blind. Because the thing is that motherboard takes up. Probably about a third of that case. You're now I know that the bolt the thicknesses all in the middle and then it's thin at the edges but nevertheless there's loads of room in there so even if electrically they had to have it not on the from the motherboard one helmet MSA on separate daughter board at the side so at least she can get the thing easily without taking the time machine upon Johnny is. That's why 'cause I'm asshole who believes no longer at apple decided everything has to be as thin as God damn possible and Heaven Forbid. Your brand new machine. That just came out of apple care. has a bad ram chip in it. 'cause that never happens. The mind really does bombing you know when when they start with the glowing stuff down and everything it was okay. Where's thinness in? The laptops is robustness. All of that sort of thing but none of that counts for nine Mak. None of they. Nobody's ever said man. I MAC is just too thick. Yeah exactly because I had a twenty seven inch two thousand nine machine. That was the section copy. Take the glass off young screw. Lcd implode four things and it lifts right out. Yup and everything once you got that out with super easy accessible yeah so anyways the adventure continues here David so I got everything apart. I put the new ramp from C. N. thirty two GIGABYTES. Remember coast. The other thing about this well sometimes. He missed the MISFIT ARAM chip. You're normally what you do as you would put the chip in. You won't put everything back together. You'd be economy make it. Budi up and check that the ram works come to be that way this well you kind of jumped ahead because this is going to be a big player here in a few minutes Now I notice when I order the Ram. It was a different speed. Then what comes with the MAC now? I I assume that? Odbc there. I know what they do. They DO THEIR HOMEWORK. And they're like yeah. This this ram is fine so I get everything all back together and the big. Tricky part is getting the screen back on now. Both with the Ram upgrade and the S. T. upgrade comes with a tape kit and I had ordered the screen replacement kit. The you know the tape and the toolkit from ODBC separately. So I had two of them so I put the whole thing together. Yeah plug it in. Who'd up and nothing. It will not start at all now. I know from past experiences that when you change a Ram chip sometimes you have to flash the RAM. Yeah I did every single thing you could possibly think of to get to work and it will refuse to boot at all period. It will not boot. So I know the hard-drive spine yet and I know I seated at correctly. I also know that. I- seated the RAM correctly. Yeah when I do Ram I know how I it's not Rodeo. I've done it on Sunday Times. Yeah and you will see sweet repair. Say Yeah I know how to how to install this stuff. And even though it's very lengthy process to take everything out of THIS IMAC. It's all pretty straightforward. The the biggest hurdles quite honestly is the tiny tiny little ribbon cables. Which by the way I think my microphone cable is connected correctly Yeah and I'm GonNa live without an internal microphone Everything is correct. That's correct 'cause I did it. Yep so I only have one choice. Take Part again. Took the whole goddamn thing apart again yet. Replaced it with the eight gigs from Apple. Now here's where I made a big mistake. You have to cut the tape to get this thing apart and I had to take cats right. Yeah well I wanted to make sure this works before I tape it together again. Yeah now this was an all day project yesterday especially you know having to do it twice. Yeah so there was still a bunch of tape residual pieces on their left a lot of it but I figured this is going to be fine. I put it back together in the screen. Seem to stay in place pretty well and I thought well. I'm just GONNA leave it like this tonight. I'll do the podcast. Marl David and then I'll pull the screen back off new tape pieces down. Put it all together because instructions. Basically say the you've got to kind of use. It's plastic tillerson. Leads to take all the old type off and replace all of this stuff. The stuff from apple comes off really easily stuff promote. Abc does not come off. So I started up and sure Enough Abboud right away from the internal hard drive. Every I'm golden so that's where I left it so you hadn't fitted the WC Rambert correct. I think the RAM is bad right. Okay and then you know after I pulled it off the Senate. I said you know what I can live with eight gigs. Yeah so I'm going to send that back to ODBC. It's obviously man. Ram they're going to be audited seat it correctly and I know what I'm doing we me so I'm sitting here recording with you ten minutes ago and then and the tape let go. I see because I was talking about taking it out the screen time. I'm sure you're doing a gang. No I was not doing again fact. You'll screen fell out if you I might and if I'm looking at I mac. The bottom left hand corner is now cracked right cracked the screen now. It's only cracked round the black part. It's about two inches and it makes a half circle right but yeah when it fell out The longer the two ribbon cables disconnected get it cracked the screen. The Matt kept running of course but because part of the that video cable the screen was no longer working. I'm to via Hdmi for cable. To my thunderbolt. Four cable I could still see what was going on. 'cause I use you know the twenty seven inch monitor. I don't yet one of the AMAC so I didn't really I. It didn't matter I was thinking about `continuing just kind of in the screen up and then of course the fan started freaking out. Yeah and blowing really hard and kick get really and you could hear if you go back. Yeah so I know Brooke was awake because she come down right before I started recording so I called her and I Got All the little the longest part of this whole half hour that it took me to do. This was getting the tiny little pieces of tape that was left on the Amec Out. So I with Brooks help. I put the new tape on. I plugged in the cables Then I found out that the ribbon cable didn't come off just from the motherboard also came up from the LCD screen side of polar apart again. But I haven't taped it down yet. Yeah it was just kind of sitting at the bottom sitting place. Ready to get pushed back in Toll connected that got. The cables connected. Now it's ugly together and I'm hoping will hold. Yeah I accept. His now has been cranking annoying crank. Yeah that's GonNa drive me crazy. Well I don't blame you his johnny crazy. I can't even see it. Well that means. I'm going to keep this Mac for probably another year and then replace it. Yeah night 'cause I I can't live with this crack even though I don't use that screen and the way my I'm x position I literally have to lean way over to the right even see it. I know it's there and every time I move that that's a weak point that crack could get worse. Yeah no I can look into buying a new screen but screw it. I'm not going to well. But he's the thing you know back in the magnet days you COULDA got new sheet glossing over the Front Yup and it would have been helpful cheaper. Now you've got about replace the whole LCD fixing to get apple care. Plus I don't think so. I think they'd cover scrape. Well the problem is they know you've been in there because it's got different driving it so I don't know I don't know either but Mutt my booth with a shot. I don't know I'm just going to replace the MAC eventually anyway. I you know at this point. I reckon the apple as you anyway So he's the thing so I also when through prices like this this week because I bought this gaming laptop what so. It's it's Is Cheap. It's by company called Medi on who a German company and basically they do what a lot people used to do near at which is they. The order reference designs from jeter Chinese Manufacturers. And they have them benched up with but their own thing. Medi on MED. I and and this one's about three years old Souissa piece six six six one Mendiola top. It's I'll send you a picture of. It's you know. Always say that's right. Yeah so it's a eight so basically. It's a plastic laptop. I'm so right now paranoid. The screen is gonNA fall out again. I can imagine I keep reaching over to touch. It feels fine but yeah Need to go find some clamps so yet basically the the idea behind this is that you know being stuck a host this six seven weeks Decided that she would really want to catch. Even though Google TV and that this whole thing want to read the one two game because I hardly ever get to gain and I have my switch on a game on that but there some games. You can't plan switch then either not available for it or they just don't work then they wouldn't work. Anyone switch and I like these big spice simulation came like elite. Dangerous is is the one that I really like and I. I've never been to play properly because I've never had a decent abuses do on. They stopped doing the version a few years ago and And she never ran that well on a MAC laptop anyway so I figured what the Hell I'm suck. I WANNA buy lots of that will run. This will run other games. Like for instance like the picture send us is running crackdown. Three crackdown is a gang. You introduce me to actually WanNa Festival. My Ex boss love. Your crackdown is a great game. And I know that the third one did not get great reviews but for me if it plays exactly like the original one then I mean because I love that Cardi game I really like crackdown. Three the it's more of a cartoon graphic but I don't know it's just so it's so smooth and yeah but for some reason on the pacy Eight needs a hell of a powerful computer. A I'm an try to run it all myself laptop and it was a slide show so that that's kind of where while so. I figured I'd go out and buy us one. I wasn't going to spend a thousand dollars on a over thousand pounds. Only new gaming laptop stretchy measured found one on. Ebay is a bit of a deal. I don't think the people who sold it you. They had and I made an offer. Three hundred twenty pounds on the accepted it now. This about three years old has a high five prices sonate but the important thing is as dedicated. Gt X sixty graphics continent mark which means yeah which means it will not is sent you want Ronald Lightest Games. Full settings bedroom. Most of what I WANNA run to and a might for some things on my other. Turn the resolution right better. Run them you know. I was pleasantly surprised when this arrived. It's actually quite thin. Not Particularly Heavy as nice screen on okay keyboard It was in very good condition. The battery even lost about three or four hours but it has one turbine even else so like you found out. This one's running windows ten but Probably not as bad as the I mak was but it was slow to do pretty much everything again like you found. He tries to do two things at once. Like downloading a game always out to download the Games wants to play many. These are a few gigabytes for downloading a game. And they'll try do something else. Because the hard drive is downloading bits. The game the whole slows down to nothing so you can't browse the web content anything so it becomes ridiculous. You've got a relatively powerful computer. That can only do one thing at time so now. I flipped this computer over yet. Barry Mandis is the cheapest of cheap gaming computers on K. You two thought Cossack demonisation over this there is a panel on the Balsam with Fox cruise. The when you open up by explosives expose everything you need to mess within the motherboard. There'll kept separate from the processor the heat sink as optical drive in there because she'd computer but at the bottom there is The Hawk Drive Bay. There is the ram slots and there is a a novice law in there which is an empty estee slow seismically. They know. You're going to upgrade the dry earth. The drive is slow. And they forty put the slot. Therefore you and it's accessible straightaway. There there should be a normal time. Not only that. The Ram slots is called Achey government. They won a cubic GIG chip in rather than to falls which means you can catch me. Eight an air more exactly. Which again is what you want to do. And I look at this and I'm really impressed on thinking because you'd have thought cars cutting would be stick. T- foggy chips and then they go to threat way they want more assembly with Dr. You'd say not not putting extra slot in there so the M to SSD slow is one of those ones like little tiny strip of gum. Yeah right so again. Go into your problem. I order one of them. I only one off a Amazon and I didn't really research this toll on kind of I looked at the slot and I bought one. That had the same connectors on it because I thought the whole point is empty. Law Is that is meant to. Be Passable. Isn't it so I got one. I stopped my Ssd In that. Turn the computer over. Didn't put panel back on to the computer wooden boat. Completely dead so that's all so take. Seo again these fine. So then. I go online not sought to research. It sends out that these MT slots have two or three different configurations. There's a beast Lawton an M. Slot and there's also one called B and m which will take either type of called when you get. Well the called. I got was a PC. I called when in fact this slot is only is only sport Sattar. And that's the problem I had is. I put a PC card into a satis. Lonnie will you work? Yeah but the thing is I could find out straight away and go. Oh my mistake. Send that back older. The other one put in with straightway without having to do the whole only go to go to site hoping again plug in and then try it now and then obviously my cloning was much quicker than yours because everything was actually already on the motherboard board so I just basically run a clothing program and I said. Copy this from there to there. Then delete the original one Reboot the computer. And they'll solve my is now running false again. Which is what you want you know. And that is for a deep rebadged Chinese design plastic salt. And which even your. Yeah you know. Twelve hundred dollar hundred dollar I Mac. I had a cracked screen. Because that's my fault but it should never come to that. No this ORLEAN design machine. It's it's about design. If the cheap rebounds Chinese company can do a better job than apple can because of the choices they make. This is a computer only sells for about six hundred fifty seven hundred pounds brand new. Yeah the latest models and they thought about what people need to do with it and they've put everything in that right and this is about functionality over form whereas example is all about form or functionality. Now that plays well into ipads iphones. Because there's really nothing to upgrade unless you gotta get a battery and then he must've just by one But it's not the case with an AMAC and it's it's it's unforgivable for them to sell machine with fifteen year old technology hard-drive in it that they know they know only. I can't imagine anybody who be able to use it. I mean it was that bad. I've Dude I've been using Max. For how long might might perform a four. Ten from ninety five was faster than my Mac on anything opening just opening up the hard-drive clicking it. Oh Yeah I could not believe it I again. It was insulting even Eurobank had fusion dry technology on it which was better right so they have a way of doing this even if they they want to retain the terrible there will put necessity. Sst A one terroir esteem. They're in charge you for it. They could have done that. You're putting the sixty four or one. Twenty eight Gig. Ssd configure the machine fusion drive at least usable but now they do not usable. No no you Tim. Cook's keeps getting on video talking about how you were making masks and kiss my ass all this money that you have. How about you give customers what they want. You can still make money. May Maybe fifteen dollars less machine kiss my asked him coke. You know. It's my experience with the length. Talk shows as perfectly possible to me you out these without compromising the design. You're telling me that apple could not have a card on the back of that machine the through a door not to take the screen off. You don't have to risk cracking the screen like you've just done. Yeah with Glue and all of that sort of thing so that they couldn't just have a card on the with the doors support and when you have near as though subordinate with an endle- as law or just making five millimeters thicker in use magnets instead of tape to hold the screen down. Yeah Oh just use in the back because nobody can see the screws in the back. They it it you know. I'm getting a little disenfranchised with apple. I really am. I understand it So let's we'd get feedback feedback after the Lhasa Geeks pub from Lee and he railed dear Tim and he's talked about my Amac. Woes said the same thing happened to my wife's. I'm twenty inch late twenty twelve. I spent three solid days trying to make super-duper clone with no success by the way super-duper is for those who don't know is like carbon copy cleaner it just clones drive. Yeah So immediately that tells me he. His hard drive itself was defective. It probably wasn't software. There's a bad spot on the hard drive. We finally bought the cheapest refurbished twenty seven inch Imac from the apple store online to replace it. The time machine backup actually worked which is good yes means a back. It is last backup before the drive failed. So yeah he he might have lost a little bit but probably not much. If anything. My wife usually gets my hand me downs. Welcomed Geek Life My current MAC is an Amac twenty seven inch late. Twenty fifteen four gigahertz Intel core. I seven which is funny. Because that's a late twenty fifteen. It's a lot faster than my brand new twenty nineteen. Yeah I I have wanted to purchase new AMAC for myself for two three years but apple has been updating i Max until recently the SST drives away too expensive. They can't even update to Wifi six. It took so long for them. To add you SPEC- I'm still waiting to buy a new AMAC for myself. Not until they get some better updates. I was born in the late nineteen forties. I hope I don't have to wait. Too Much Luck Lee. I'm with you a hundred percent. Yeah absolutely you know if if my if the other I mak hinton failed I was starting to get that itch anyways to replace it. I really was thinking this a little bit long in the tooth and it was a refurbished. I got from ODBC What was it? A two thousand and nine no and I to twenty twelve central doubt late. Twenty eleven right because it's a it was an. It's an eight year old machine so you know I was getting that feeling too and I thought about waiting for the i Max because like you. I'd had heard rumors that new extra coming yet. I still jumped online before my other one went bad and looked and I thought maybe the Mac pro but the price of AMAC PRO is insultingly high. I don't need a twenty seven inch screen. Yeah I mean look if you WANNA prior Mac. I mean compared to the Mac primarily I might is a very good family not well the it is because it's not twelve thousand dollars just just gay starts. Well Yeah if you compare it to twelve thousand dollars sure but it's PROB- an Imac pro together you'll find the AMAC PREDISPO- council screen substantially cheaper But the problem the MAC pro with the AMAC preser- yeah five thousand dollars starting price. You Bar Refurbish. You can be looking. Maybe three and a half four thousand still a big chunk of change and the problem. Is that some machine that actually hasn't been updated in two years now exactly. Yeah so. Don't get me wrong. It had topping components in it went but it still two years old right and the only reason I updated when I did. And this is the only and the only reason. I got this machine is. I needed something now. Yeah not in a couple of weeks if I'm at if apple comes out with a new one or build custom one from apple and wait another two to three weeks minimum Because all the ship times are just crazy coming from China. Yes because they have to quarantine it and spray it down. Yeah exactly yeah you got to be licensed before you I've got to be honest with you. How having heard what you've just gone through. I would evaluate your position a now. I would love finding machine to get by for a few weeks auto. Why wanted so? I wish I would have done if if if I would've known in hindsight how difficult the screen removal is because really that's the key component right there take once the screen is off. Yes it's a very lengthy process to unplug everything and remove everything and you have to do it in a certain order. Otherwise you're not going to do it you're gonNA break something but BC has awesome Install videos I mean the I used to edit them and do the voice over on him. I know how good they are. And I literally had my pet sitting right next to me and pausing and playing and it was awesome. It was it was great a great job on. But it's all about the screen this institute and to be fair to it will certainly be Fatto. You'll be see. The whole process will confine uv not. She followed their instructions role. Taking a count well it would have been fine if they WANNA set me bad ram well. Yeah okay Because everything was fine up until that point what. I'm trying to want him. Try and say it's not like WBZ's instructions a bad if you've followed them and use all the stuff they'd send you there actually. The screen will not fallen out cart. You know shame on Apple for building machine that so hard upgrade the yourself. You know an adequate Sarah shoes while bring in will do for you but obviously we can't do not apple won't who when they have to book no they don't do an upgrade. You can't take your. I'm out and say put. Ssd here apple does Dula. Oh you can't do that. No well. I'm not stupid as well. I thought about actually sending it out obesity. Because they have a service that they'll upgrade your Mac for you yet but I needed my Mac. Yeah so even when I was cloning it. I could still do some stuff. I could still check my emails. I still do a little bit of work stuff. Even though it take and I'm not joking here twenty times longer to do anything. Yeah I get some work done yet humming equal to one. You've got to wonder how much this in the long term has apple because plenty people have been through what you've done your you. You wanted to psycho my Mac and you've been into Max for over twenty years and yet you're thinking of this point or you know on kind of fed up with apple and these rubbish and the difficulty is is that you go you go to the other side. You know what you can get great machines for less money. You know if you've got to start thinking about a half a hack Mac or what do you call it a Mac Mac Thermo member but he's he's the dirty little secret that not really wants to admit which is actually once you get over the first few weeks ago to. Windows is not bad at all. Yeah Y- you know it's not that bad now one now rubbishy what to do with us. News ago has gone away You know it's it's not perfect. Punisher Matt stretch the imagination. But guess what Mac. Os is like that nowadays to the realities that much much happier if you can get away with the is much more easier to do. All on pads an irs because the the operating system is much more robust. But the problem is there. Are things like what we're doing here. Economy do in my pant You know so. Let's change subjects for a second here. I've got one more thing to talk about and so two you yet. One thing I want to talk about is One of the facebook groups I belong to talking about old retro games and stuff like that One of them's a the little tiny arcades you've seen those in stores and online right little tiny ones There's many ones and they're small ones and I like both of them. I've got a collection of a not a huge collection but a collection of. Yeah but there are three or four of. There's one that I saw that I wanted but it was expensive as like a hundred bucks a spending that much money and it's a neo geo machine and it looks like a little arcade kind of a generic l'arcade but had been reading these things that the joystick was fabulous. And it lights up. It's kind of cool It's got forty neo. Geo Games on there like you know King of fighters and all that Kinda stuff Essen K. humaid. The NEO GEO will about. I'm to touch the GAYS RELIEF. Which was fighting games and then kind of bullet. Hell shoot-them-ups and hopeful. They had some sports games. They are I never thought they were very good. Yeah but I kept looking at this thing and I just couldn't justify spending that much money and then I saw the price actually fell like sixty dollars and I thought that's not bad sixty bucks but you know. I've I've already got all of those gains on my stand up arcade so I really really wanted it but held off and Somebody posted in one of those groups that Amazon. Had it for half off right so now. It's thirty bucks. Yep So of course I bought it What's cool about this? Little thing is A. It doesn't run on batteries. You have to have it plugged in so that's a downside but up site is it hasn't Hdmi port which I tried and plugged into my TV and it looks fantastic on the TV. Oh it also has inputs for Control sticks or you know game. Pat's so I can literally set this on on a you know next to the TV plug it into TV by to control pads and colon. I can actually play at had had excellent. It's the screen that's built into. This is actually really nice. The buttons are great. This is a really good build quality and I have to be honest. I'm I'm shocked as good as it is the best little tiny arcade I've ever played. And how good is he emulated on that really good? I haven't had any issues yet. No it's fast. There's no hiccups. I've played maybe five games on it so far and it look. It's a small screen as like to match three inch screen So when you're doing a side scrolling shoot em up and a lot of stuff going on the screen. It's it's just too small but that's when you plug it in and I could plug this in and still use know the arcade stick on it itself. Hold this little thing. In my hand. Course then I got two cables coming out a thick HD and then the power cable which Kinda sucks. But yes. So I've been seeing on online that This this kind of the neo. Geo of the the mini Super Nintendo's in the mini Saiga's. The outlaws completed very highly anticipated. It sounds like this one is better than that I don't know I fell the other ones too and I've heard that those other ones are going to be again ninety nine dollars. Yeah and I don't want to spend that much money. No an NC for me. I was never really big fan of the neo. Geo Solid gain. Neither was I back in the day. I only discovered it because I bought an actual neo Geo arcade machine. It was the first machine arcade I ever bought. Guess about five years ago. I traded it for a Bluetooth Speaker yet but we wish yeah. We should probably stay that. I'm the thing about the neo. Geo was that the home system. You was very very similar to what was actually in slow. It was pretty much the same thing. Yeah you could actually take the cartridges from an arcade machine and run them on your home machine right so effectively. You getting all K- quality I which for the timeline was unheard of. It was amazing. So when I got my original arcade machine at came with one cartridge the whole point of neo Geo was you can have multiple cartridges to put in your cade machine. And you don't have to replace a whole machine. The whole arcade cabinet just to get a new machine. So if you're a bar owner and arcade owner and a new game comes out you just by the cartridge and it's about the same size as a vhs tape pop it in a slot restarting their ego brand new game. Division of Jama wasn't it it was and so I bought a multi cartridge. I don't remember how many games were it. Like one hundred and twenty or something hundred sixty one in something like that and I replaced the bubble bobble that it came within the cartridge. I replace it with actually had bubble bobble on it too so I didn't really miss anything and that's when I really started discovering some of these like metal slug I love metal slug. You know they had like five different versions. They're all essentially the same game same graphics. They didn't upgrade anything But I think those are really fun games And I like the the Neo Geo bomber man. And there's a quite a few games that I really really enjoyed playing so I thought a handheld version of those would be fun. I just wish there was more on it. You know I don't know if there's a way I can. I'm looking at right now. It's got Html I don't see any way to plug something in here to get more ROMs on here. The may be a maybe a USB sulks something she on the motherboard. If you get inside there but I'm not going to know while wife something else to do the work and if it's easy he gave is not. It's hard then you know. That's the of the way these things guy. This only some of the areas disassembling these things take them apart so talk about your wife. So this is the option. You just see my by the way Yeah so So much in the same way that I'm wanted to do something different lockdown. My wife did as well as she saw the laptop and there was the usual wash compensation of where did that come from. How much did you pay for it? Why wasn't I consulted saw but You know I said to US said look where will start around here doing nothing We should take your adult ourselves and do something that we wanted to. So she's also been thinking about doing something different really. She wants to get back into sewing. Which cheesy when she was go and so. I'm prompted by my purchase. She's decided she was GonNa go and get herself a new sewing machine and start doing that. I'll trees eleven is very craft orientated. As well site and she. She thought that that Charlotte would probably enjoy doing learning to do that too. Which is he tends to be the case she sake. It's like Dr Water so we bought a a new singer sewing machine for my wife. Had It delivered and like you yesterday? I doubt with her and helped her get it set up and man. I have to tell you this is not an entry. Level machine is a computerized machine has vowed thirty or forty different STITCH PATTERNS. And always this stuff in it and everything's meant to be relatively also aided by getting this thing working was a pig and I have to say in. Today's Today's modern. I don't I don't either. I just you know y y you to string beans and cotton through metal hooks and pokey needle. It's it's amazing. How complex machine like a sewing machine is. How long have we had sewing machines? Well what since the eighteen thirties eighteen forties proprietary? What I basically these Morton Ones. They were saying like your ones date. Yeah nobody is entrepreneurs out there. You WanNa get Deacon Filthy Rich. Make a sewing machine that I take my truck my thread. I open up a little door. I drop it in. That's it that's all I did. I drop it in. I push a button and it does everything so let me just run through a very quick summary. What we had to get this thing working yesterday. Tow was by surfacing yesterday. Is You have to put the threat of the. Bobbin and the Albany goes underneath the machine. You're underneath the sewing plate. Yeah so what you have to do. Is You have to get you thread. You run it through some hooks on the top of the machine to the Bobbin which is on a winder at the back and then you put about mom and the whole thing kind of manually winds threatens the Bobbin they can buy these things pre threaded at P- refilled Bobbins. If you want to in the standard size so you don't necessarily have to do that but then once you've got the ball being you have to wipe out the bottom of the machine and inside there. There's a thing called the shuttle and you have to put the Bob in in the shuttle and set up. Then you take the rest your thread normally the same color because you when you stitches look the same and he put it in another thing on the top and again he threaded all the way round the machine. This is a piece of cotton yarn. And you're running over hooks and round corners and that sort of thing and then you take it down to the front and then you actually have to thread it through the needle and there is an. There is a mechanism on there. That's meant to thread the needle foyer. But I tell you we spent fiddling with that deciding it was easier to stick the needle through the whole So that was. That was a file so we did all of that. And then she started ready sought stitch stitching on it and basically every time she stitched on it a calls a great big jam and the big con of knotted massive of cotton on the underneath the fabric. She was from the state so we don't really done something wrong. You know this is the same machine equivalent of the automatic basically took everything apart and did it all again. The second time we did it right. It was still doing that. Then we decided maybe the It was a bad year and he's also actually threat to thing they threatening the the Neil so it the whole thing again. Third Tom Manually. Did it RAV news this thing? That as as I told you we'd fest around with twenty five minutes. Then the machine. Slide working properly shocker. Yeah and it was just like well. I was thinking to myself you know. What if this was me? I'd have to really really WANNA say something to go through. My Dad is ridiculous. Because then you've got to these fancy stitching patterns on the machine which is great. You know you can do box stitches. You can do. Wave stitches even stitch a thing? Where on the helmet looks like flowers and all this sort of east fantastic for that all of that but every time you go to change color of thread because you do get different. Plant the Gum. And you're GONNA have to do all of this again easy. Yeah Yeah. I don't understand why it's so freakin difficult to use a sewing machine. It's like you say you should just be able to drop the thread in you. Baby baby you'd have to do two things. At the reason used the Bobbin then the threadneedle is actually need to stitch. The machine needs to threads needs one from the top three the needle and then it needs one on the bus which comes from the Bobbin and I can understand the way MECHANICA sewing machine works you might need to retain. That's okay so you might have to put two bits of threaten to Rosa threaten in different pulse machine but the point is feeding it and getting rooted the right way and actually getting it to the business end of the machine which led the needle goes up and down should be completely. Nutley also knighted. You should literally just drop it in easier to use a three D. printer then of sewing machine. Absolutely my wife's got a sewing machine. That's like fifteen years old and does everything you just described. I'm so they haven't changed an look at it and when she has problems on my. I can't help you with that stupid thing. Yeah my mother had mechanical sewing machine the EU did by hand that. She's when I was a boy I remember threading. It virtually exactly the same way. So these things have not move forward. Nothing apart from the par- computerized stitching and having rely on the On where the needle goes in everything. These machines are are functionally the same as they were seventy eight years ago. It's unbelievable now. Some people say well. You don't y y you don't have to fix something that just works. They don't they're so finicky and they fail all the time and the problem is when he goes wrong like this. It sounds like things about tear itself apart. Yeah basically you know just Kinda jams and makes a horrible noise throat still. It's like really I got oil my frigging sewing machine kidding me. This is the eighteen hundreds. And you see this. How the Hell do they do? This industrially well maybe that's the secret may be industrial machines de dr sue any of this because there their times money and they have ways of getting around. I don't know but home sewing machines the other senior yet. She's really enjoying it. She likes all the different stitches. She thought making up little bags for headphones and stuff like that. Yes they use instant scraps of cloth. She found Charlotte's doing as well. The both having a bowl with this. I don't want to discuss it but just from a technical nerdy point of view. It seems so hard as stupid is it is. It's all as apple design inventors who spend more money in the household women. Yeah guess who buys more sewing machines men or women game used all that sexist. No that's how if that's who you that look at Lee Lee Hans. I'm done with my computer on my wife gets that one. Yeah but also as well. We've got multiple for this look. Look how companies like keurigs and Espresso and ness cafe and whether the other ones Lewan they've done with the coffee machine. They saw the coffee shops. They saw those were making big bank. People like Nice coffee and they thought. How can we bring that in the home in a way? Where first of all? There's no mess. No faucets a one shot process and secondly we can make the the the one shot par part of it proprietary so even which go by all all pods and the you know those companies might aplenty forty two. Everybody likes being able to make a Nice Cup of coffee by dropping appalled in and pressing a button save. He did something the same way again. You might real bank in yeah it. It's so obvious that it's amazing. No one's done it. He can't say that it's difficult about. I'm not a mechanical engineer. I'M NOT GONNA advent one but I I can't I yeah I'm sure it technically possible obviously is always the cost of bringing it down to make it consumable but these end machines cost five six hundred dollars so even if even if it was that expensive. Yay and you read from the company because there's a certain little cartridge that you put in. That's how they make it. Simple people can put a little touch screen on there. Yeah I mean heaven forbid the set of these a button that you push shows and I don't know maybe just Bluetooth and five. I mean this is the way it could be done because everybody else does it. This way. It's it's it's unbelievable that no one's touched the space and realistically fifty years. Yeah they have done anything so there you go listen to tech fan to come up with great ideas to become rich there. You go look eight. May well be that. This is a solved problem and we just haven't heard about it in which case please well then. It's not a solved problem because we haven't heard about it. Yeah and that's not to say I. You know I keep up with the latest and sewing machines. Don't but I do keep up with the latest technology. If it was something that was really cool. It would have been on the verge it would have been. It would have been exactly you know it would have been out there until you mentioned three D. Prince is not something that far more complicated and yet you bond with us from fifty dollars down. So why don't you buy machine? That's Kinda that simple day. You know I have no I. I don't know you would think that a three D. Printer would be something I'd be way into but I'm just not I look at him. I go there I have won. A cheap will not. I bought this. She sounded the death where I'm at right now and we've had it for about six months we haven't got around to wiping at. I think the problem is. Would it make with it? That's the thing that I'm less worried about. I think once you've got it there then take you've got children you'll come up with something you can make with it. I think the problem is actually getting SESA. An going is a little bit like the machine which is in each kind of put time and effort in and Carnegie go and then once for about five years you know. Let's forgivable that it still kind of a pain to set up their five years old. Yeah exactly but some Sheen's hundred fifty years old. Yeah Yeah so with that. We're going to wrap up This episode of Tech Fan which is called correct screen of course You know I think it's funny that you thought that I was doing a bit because I was talking about the difficulty. Removing the gloss and the glass little our. I'm totally blaming you for this. Is your fault. Those screen literally fell off my back. Yeah well say you do this long enough and you see pretty much everything. And that's going to be a I. Guess I don't see anybody else point. Podcast where the screen falls out there. Amac while you're recording could you hear funk at shield the shack and one of the ribbon cables came on plugs? I couldn't see anything on that screen and I just looked at it and was. There's no one to blame but myself because I know exactly why I happened. Yeah but well look you say that. An and yes. It is partly fault because of what we said before but at you put in that position by apple well I needed to make sure that the original Ram was going to boot. The machine just to verify yes this ramp from ODBC is bad and when it did. You GotTa remember at this point. I had been on this for hours. Yeah it was close to dinnertime and I had to make the dinner The kids wanted to watch something. That's GonNa come on plaques which means I have the machine up and running so I just tilted it back and figure that'll hole. It'll be fine tomorrow after I record the show a pull everything apart so when we sat down to record the show actually moved the screen. So I could plug in my headphones and I didn't tell the back get. Yeah every time you get you but now I'm paranoid is how this new tape isn't GonNa hold. I'm sure it will but I'm sure it will take but I I'm disappointed. I'm not even GONNA look. How much screen replacements GONNA cost? What else with you? If you wanted to do that you'd have to go. The apple kept pulse rate. I of facts bearing in mind. There is a risk full out. I would I would sign off the applegate plus but honestly if I'm only gonNA keep the machine for a year. Yeah you say that. Green Falls Out Tomorrow. Night and smashes completely. Then you're not going to be a key for year. I can't go to apple anyways. No but applegate you educate you pack it up. Send too often. They fix it. They sold outfielder. I don't think apple care is going to cover a crack scream because of stupidity. No well I we. You'll have to look into it but certainly doesn't laptops. You have to pay but you don't have to pay you the full screen mirror. Extensive damage say I would imagine be I might. Oh I I'll look into it. Yeah I think I'm done with everything for a while. I was GONNA get back advocate window in a couple of weeks and then then you all done. No you got up to the first year. Don't you night How much is apple? Care about this Mac about three twenty nine nine. I think Check my service and support coverage status. Tell me about apple care products. So Click that Mac Three years and other. How much does it cost? Scrolling down how to buy Align Click on line seven hundred six hundred dollars for MS early. I'm thinking yeah so I didn't on my under six dollars. So now how yet? And an hundred six hundred dollars. In the ninety nine dollars for a screen damage climb resend code but my code in eight. Does it cover screen? Yeah Montilla Dulles for a screen Kline oh any closure damaged in two hundred ninety nine dollars for anything else so for hundred something bucks. I can get a new screen. Plus the two of two hundred seventy dollars you pay on six knife the MAC and then nights and nine dollars for the climb and you will get brand new screen fitted by Apple So this is I can get apple care plus on here. It says also it looks like devices and eligible for an epoch agreement. Shit there listen to podcasts. Were recording God. Damn it all right so I'm going back Are Interested aerial number. Let's do that no I. Don't want to participate in short survey Okay so where's my serial number or reveal serial number copy paste. An apple is using that I can't underst- I think we count pice it. No I can pace. I can't barely read the code. They put him on. That's Oh okay what? It looks like your device isn't eligible for Apple Care Agreement. It's a brand new machine right so you just have to bring up often. Sold out for anybody listens to this thinking. This is any way dishonest. Because he brought machine before advocate. It isn't really because if you bought the applicant when you bought machine and Cra- screen you so we're climb for it or serial number. This doesn't make any sense bringing she knows bought nearly a week ago. It's probably I wasn't return was it? I don't would. I know that no it wasn't sold as it said no apple up probably just a promo systems and you say. I want to buy carrots MANCON. They'll fix it for you travel more time. I keep entering the code wrong. It's not case sensitive is it? I Don let him yeah. It looks like here devices eligible for an epoch agreement. So I'M GONNA have to call and just fund eight apple all right. We're going to wrap up this episode. I'll see you next week from eastbound c. then by

apple Mac rams AMAC David Cohen apple US Ebay Geo YOU Iraq Johnny
TechFan 423 - Dog Thumbs

TechFan

1:28:07 hr | 7 months ago

TechFan 423 - Dog Thumbs

"You're listening to another great podcast in the my neck podcasting network Tech podcast number four hundred twenty three. I am Tim Robertson. And he's David Cohen. Hi David Hello how we Well see here's the thing listeners. Actually I think my Mike sold to crack down a little bit I'm not doing great to be honest Couple of weeks ago. So it'll be three weeks tomorrow I hurt my back at work. I was It doesn't matter. How do I hurt my back at work? But it's not a bulging disc or anything like that. It's a really bad muscle and for the first week or so. I was okay. Okay I mean it hurt but you know it was manageable. While it got progressively worse in the second week in fact last Sunday Five five days ago I actually went to hospital Not a big hospital one of the smaller things. You know the urgent care. I don't know if they have those in the UK okay but here in the US. They have a lot of these things called urgent care which are like small emergency rooms if you will and You know they gave me the Steroid for anti inflammation a non narcotic pain pill. I'm not big into take narcotics. They scare me. It could be honest. I don't want to wake up. You know two months from now Robin seven eleven to support drug habit eleven shillings been. Yes yeah and then muscle relaxant. which quite honestly you take at night and it helps you sleep? And I don't think that did anything but for four as I was running on about two and a half hours if at at most of sleep per night and that was starting to wear on me last two nights actually got decent night's sleep so but it's it's still sore and now it's I feel like I've got pinched on my side. The Baxter hurt some but not the way it did But I feel like I got after an inch because of often. What happens is you because it has she changed the way you walk and you stand? Yeah exactly that's exactly what's going on. I'm aware of it so it's not like what's going on now but yeah no it's it hasn't been great I bought. Here's a tech related thing I bought this little device. I've been the only thing that's really helps. It is a heating pad and I bought this thing called a smart relief. Tens therapy there are a couple of people at work that the swore by these things and the An- she's ten says. Yeah so for those. Who Don't know it's this little electrical device that you apply on your skin whether it's I've got one that's one big pat and it's kind of a Gel type of thing I hate putting it on? It's all sticky. And I feel like I'm on on the set of aliens or something I don't like it And it's cool at first heats up pretty quickly but And then you turn on this. Little device is that sends electrical current into it and it changes the frequency and the strengths. To basically all it's doing is it's confusing your nerve endings about pain and mine runs for about a half hour and then it turns itself off and you can adjust the intensity and I had to go pretty high intensity for to do anything for me. It does it work. I don't know I'm not sure that it's any more effective than the heating pad I Yeah I I I found. I've used a bit when I broke my back and Leeann uses one. This is one of the first things it works for Shakila. He gives you some short term relief. But it's one of the things you need to keep quiet. Unlock enormous usable relief. ow I no one been to physiotherapy the physiotherapy people have a much much bigger machine. Kind of feels like the same thing as much more powerful and stronger and that is awesome. You you have one of those in the Piney. Gaza Lifelock Day But you can't buy those constructively you kill yourself or experiments on cats hats I you know. So that's how I been and it's been Painful all and struggle and I did. I missed one day at work. I took Monday off and I went back after that I left. I think I left early. On Tuesday worked false full Wednesday and Thursday. It's just one of those things that you know you in life. You just Kinda have to deal with sometimes as you get an injury and you get hurt but you can't pause your entire life just because of discomfort and not only that. Unfortunately I think as you found they said the fountain a my wife definitely found time. It's ever met she back surgery. The reality is is that the medical community doesn't know how to do do anything very much about crony I don't think they'd be the other thing there'd be down to stem what causes it and and they certainly don't understand how to limit. I tend time back. This is what my wife has experienced is they. She's recovered to a degree. Probably about eighty percent of where she was before and the last one you've said they're designed to a now. Well the best thing he led to live with it. Yeah you know. It's not in some instances. I think we've made huge strides over the last fifty years in in medical procedures. For instance open heart. Surgery doesn't happen very often anymore. heart surgery when and you're having a heart attack is sometimes that you don't even stay the night in the hospital So that has come pretty far vaccines obviously has wiped out So many diseases of course. We have a whole segment of stupid people who are Google X. Vaccination Exhibition in a twitter post. This morning. It was just random. It's funny that we're mentioning this and this came up somebody said I don't think it's good for for doctors to be putting these drugs. These anti vaccination drugs in tier or vaccination drugs into your body. Any what they should do is give you a mild dose of whatever it is you're trying to cure and let your body just deal with it that way and I thought yeah you just decided exactly exactly what Vaccine Blake. Wow you couldn't you couldn't try to be more dumb if you tried the airways We've come a long way but I think there's a so much more to do and technology is is really starting to stop. I saw this story and I didn't link to it in the show notes and I'm not gonNA spend an hour trying to find it online again but it was basically This company has developed Nano bots and their organic and they run off of a heat that your body can generate. They live up to the maximum about two weeks very simple machines and they are self healing off But they can be programmed to go in and manipulate all kinds of things and they're talking about the long-term -cations of this technology could be de aging could be carrying cancer can literally go in there and reprogram cancer cells I think that is kind of future but pain itself. Sometimes at least in the middle community is hard to pin down what's causing causing the pain. Causation is the big problem and patients quite honestly or the worst person asked. Because they're like my back hurts exactly. Yeah they can't You can't quantify the pain necessarily wrote tickly well of course all those things you talked about by the strikes we made a little things that kill Ya and so naturally. The medical community focused on trying to fix things that kill you and most people don't die pine so it's not been a top priority for quality of life medical care. I think is probably the next big phase that we're going to see well. Yeah the reality is that the drug companies will invest vested things that make them their son and if they can figure out a drug that does something about back pain than they will invest in it and bring to market and chargeable knife or it and they well but they'll find a the final relief they won't find a cure. There's a difference. There's no money in a cure. No one got rich because someone solved polio fact the guy gave the patents away What's profitable is managing it? Now there's no cure for AIDS because they want to manage the symptoms so you keep coming back to your drug pusher to get the drugs so you're not suffering from your AIDS But there's no cure for it in. That's my fear and I think that's where Silicon Valley firms. He's tech companies. They're not used to coming up with a Solution and it makes you keep coming back to their actually focus on solving problems. That's kind of what tex about that solves problems whether it's an actual problem problem or I want better resolution on my television. It's still a problem and they're curing it with a new device I want to be able to access the Internet faster. They make a faster modem on your phone they create a new. You know Wifi network. They create five G.. They saw problems now. That of course sometimes sometimes will lead to other problems like Oh we have to. Have you know better contacts. And it's gotTa look better but that's beside the point. These tech companies companies. Who are making medical breakthroughs are actually solving Alexa? Trying to solve the problem underlying problem. I I'm AH ambivalent about ending everything. These same company see release products with huge security holes in and things crash. It's an. It's a nascent technology this whole business. I'm not sure I'm on that Seoul suffering my canet nights when they're inside you say that now. But what's alternative if they could prolong life three times what it is if they yeah if they can that the problem is is Dany methodical biological citizens. You've got to get it writing con release quickly Patchett Latino Lane. I think I think that what has to be snow angels. Medical Medical Industry did respective patch right. That's exactly what do a little bit more testing than I I don't know I don't know about that But it it's an exciting field to watch. I don't have You know any skin in that game at all but we all do in some respect. It's not reported enough number one it these kinds of things take so long it's such a low boil That it's kind of like watching paint dry. And so then you get an article that basically is covering the last five years development and it sounds like it's right around the corner and it's really not because you've got hold another five years to go before it even gets to animal testing trials and got another five years after that before they release a limited human trials. And then you've got another five years before it's now it's approved proved and at that point we're in twenty fifty and you and I are to all to take advantage of it But at least our kids and our kids will be good But that being said I don't think this kind of stuff gets enough attention. There are some websites that that cover it like I f Ing Love Science. That's a good one But there's not enough of those in the mainstream stuff the verges and in and gadget and stuff like that that they could cover this kind of technology I think it would bring an awareness which is sorely lacking. We want more. You know what's going on here I think. Yeah it's almost self fulfilling though because we've seen thanks to the activities of certain political people think huge backlashes against science and lost ten years scientists scientists something which is kind of pooh-poohed as being well L.. You know it's not settled. The debate people aren't sure these guys have the political agenda. My sense is online at exactly. You know I saw one one I'm GONNA blank on his name and it's right there. The tip of my tongue The astrophysicist Neil degrasse Tyson area rigo. I saw a facebook post. Someone said I can't stand this guy. He just goes shells because he's trying to be popular. He's not advancing science. And I thought okay wait a minute now. The here's a guy who believes the smartest guy in the room. Whatever room he said Yeah And Yeah goes on some of these shows. I'm he'll talk about a ventures and game and the quasi science behind that Sh- movie and and people go see that's not science that's just him riding on the popularity of a popular movie to to put himself out there Sure of course it is but it's also also advancing science because it's a way to get people who don't even realize that they're used movies that they're watching avengers or star wars when he gets on a show and discusses the the realistic implications of the lightsaber that gets people interested in science. And I think that is nothing thing but positive and only that they you know we just on the same thing people talk about him. They forget to put the doctor in front of his name and he does edythe job where he does real scientists as well as appearing on a few chat shows during a few costs. It's Awesome Matt. Yeah exactly although is there. Is there new. SEASON'S COMING I. It seems like it was a limited series on it was done nothing else. snowflakes mixing But so yeah it's I always when I come across these articles. They're always always interesting to me. And the Nano Bot will of course you know the writer of the thing has to bring up. We'll what if they turn evil. Oh my God. I'm so tired of that stuff. I've stopped watching the terminator. This isn't this isn't Hollywood. Did People are I don't know give them a little bit more credit because what is on thinking so let's go down with you What has been going on with me? Not a huge amount really. I'm doing a little traveling for work in the moment which doesn't give me an awful lot time. Say kind of stuff but the couple of things I did want to mention We bought a couple of weeks ago and take fan of out you know how we re JD. By Apple Arcade and finally enough. After that I came across the game and a new chemical Okay Bitch John Absent Loving and I'm actually. I don't think we said we're jaded by F.. Arcade I think the the discussion was. We haven't returned to that subject and initially. We were worried that apple arcade would be one and done. They're going to release his hundred plus Games. And then you're barely going to see any updates but the last story that we did and talked talked about was look at all this new stuff in a lot of it does look very interesting but the Jada part was we just had time to download and play any of this stuff l. l. i.. Element of it was difficult to pay the good stuff out. Oh that's always going to be the case. Yeah that that part. But that's not apple arcade itself that's the interface to that's the discovery phase of. That's not that's not just apple arcade either anyway I I. They came across a game. I forget how it was promoted to me actually But I think I must have seen on a website with like a new release Lisa Blockade. I went and downloaded this game and I am loving. Hello it's cooled. I haven't got my I so you can tell I just told my ipad out because I'm going well I haven't got my ipad here. Don't think he's lighted on my phone and let me just look ship. Shipping is here. It's cold no way. No way home others a cool one that just popped up as a going down. It's just like this futuristic diving guide diving down water looks Kinda cool actually so going down as what you said. It's called the. Yeah I know it. Sorry no way so. I'm going to do a quick search no way it's the first before you even finish it no way home. I'm cool. It's very cartoonish graphics. It if you've ever watched things like cut Space Show on Netflix. Never space or something anyways. It's yeah is it kind of looks like Nickelodeon nickelodeon cartoon in says the graphic style. But this actually this is a this is like a dungeon rogue like daunted crueler set in space environment that say. How's it controls because you always have to ask that with touch controls so the controls on this pretty? It's kind of twin in stick type of style. It does a little bit of auto aiming for you. That's okay we're old. Yeah you can send on explicit also aiming which kind of really nails everything I have. That turned off. Actually the controls. Kinda just pop out wherever your fingers touch on the screen playing on the top one nine each ipad cents plenty spice but they're very very responsive is supports a controller though and actually why after I started getting into it was supplying the controller. And it's one of these games you you go only through these mazes in space and everything you kill drop stuff and then you let's places and you can cross new new level off them exactly. Yeah and then the commission as well but the the stories quite entertaining is done in a kind of a a key style but it has some debts of it and it's just Salaam Fun. How long is the game played? He thinks actually there ten hours helped. Tell Him I'm I've been playing for about four or five hours on my kind working our way through it. It's it's one of these threats procedural so you don't get the same game each but the actual gay played itself. The is the the funding is the Nestle thing actually actually doing the combatant if things go to combat system and is relatively repetitive grind butts. It's an IT's fun to hangs Clark and because because it's apple. Okay you can pick it up as where you are. You can switch a different device. This is where you are obviously plan the Mac if you wanted to because it's apple arcade and that's that's advantage as well you know it's it's a fun game and and this is the thing that you don't see that much on the APP store anymore. If you didn't have arcade I would imagine if this was selling a kind of a regular thing. There's no free supply mechanics to sell about five six dollars. Probably it probably wouldn't be with on Apple Arcadia makes sense and Y- yeah. I'm getting my five five pound money without this one. I downloaded a my pen. Now check it out later today. it kind of. I'm not disappointed in Apple Arcade and disappointed that. I don't get to explore enough of it. If that that make sense like man. If I had an extra day I saw a really good threat to extradite. You need one extra day for sleep in the next day I saw really good thread on a A group that used to be extremely well done on Amazon or on facebook but Lately it hasn't been great old Maine New and it's they take old technology and they do something with sometimes modify something to make it. Look like you know something else like. There's this one guy it's not necessarily in the group but someone posted this video from facebook. He wanted a gaming pc in his living room mm-hmm but it didn't want this big giant ungainly pc box and half of those things people with neon lights and all that crap and it's like And I like neon lights in the PC case they just looked cheap. They really do anyways he wanted something more classy in his living room which makes sense to me but if he'd go and try to shop for Gaming PC for your living room it's just computers and and nowadays. It's it's it's relatively tilly. Super simple to enroll your own. PC It really is. I mean windows. Ten has gone a long way. I'll even go back and say windows. Seven started started at that. It's just really easy to build your own. Pc Microsoft bakes. And so many of the things in the operating system that you could assemble it yourself and it figures a lot of Out Downloads driving. I mean that's that's a really I remember back in the day building. PC's and you didn't soul Imax. They was expert at the time. And you wouldn't have any drivers. USB off the Internet offer Wi fi or anything unbased build and then you had to figure out how to get them on there if the income with a CD in the box then you you were kind of stuff really because that was the only you drive. That would be up and running when bill and you could be stuck with his terrible problems. I had to like get stuff on there to get things working so I'm getting old stuff. They've cared most of those problems. So this guy's youtube video I honestly I the concept of it and the execution nations very basic to me I thought okay. I know exactly how he's going to do these things and he came across problems. I mean how is going to solve them or at least how I sell them pretty quickly so I kind of skip through a forty minute video in about ten minutes But he what his idea was is okay. I'M GONNA I I already know the parts that I what am I computer. Are you still there. Okay Oh you just click something over He basically purchased all the parts that he wanted including including the GP the CPU and the Ram and the got it all so he had to find something to put it in and what he chose he went to Ebay and he did a search for vintage Stereo Systems Any and he had to be the right dimensions but he also also wanted a certain aesthetic. So if I'm like seventies marantz system and got it and he said he was actually surprised at how long it took him got it because it was such a complex System in there. And Yeah I I get that I remember the seventy stereo systems. any basically basically got it and put a piece in it even put a little. Led Lights Strip in it so when he turns it on and he routed. The power hit the power button and boots the P. C.. which is something thing Chattan? I did back. When are we? Turn an Atari Twenty six hundred into a Mac that if you push power button on the Atari it booted back inside of it Relatively easy things things to control and and problem solve but for me the most interesting part was when a sitting there you know next to the TV Eh. It looks like a vintage piece of stereo equipment and I thought you know what that is cool. That is what I like. No one is going to restore this. By the way when he I went to Ebay and he's looking for the Stereo Hughes specifically look for ones. That were broken. He didn't WanNa take a piece of venture stereo equipment that works fine and then got it. He wanted to find find one that was not essentially worthless but not working and in that way he didn't get a lot of people going. Oh look at. You destroyed this vintage piece. So you know Blah Blah Blah No it was broken the parts were it could. It have been fixed. Maybe but probably nobody was going to do that. And it was an older listed. We had been up there for a while so he bought it. I think he spent after shipping. Because remember those old pieces of Stereo Equipment This is the tuner. We're a heavy. It was Russian. Yeah so I think he spent like forty bucks four and another thirty to ship it. Yeah I mean But aesthetically pleasing doubt. I think you look at some of that sixties and seventies stereo equipment and some of that stuff the wood and the metal they use just that brushed. Aluminum look with wood grain. It was just a really beautiful equipment. I love the. I think it was Sony. Pioneer East do brushed aluminum stuff with peak heavily weighted dial L.. Yes Oh and they felt that tactile feel because when you turn them exactly make you feel a Vinson volleyball on those issues doc sticky again like led's kind of the the peak meters going up as well. You know pushing up into the red signed signed for the grain and all the values very very satisfied. I had a really really awesome graphic equalizer. I think I got rid of probably fifteen years ago. I wish I kind of kept it. Now aw It was like a twenty band graphic equalizer but the led's intimate were very colorful and very slowly and I think it showed like twenty led bars and each each bar had its own light. It wasn't the block once it was a little round ones and it started does one color and they would go up to a different color But it showed you know twenty Bands of equalization twenty lights so it really showed the spectrum the basic being played from the base to the middle to the highs and everything in between and it was just. I used to listen to music. Remember back in the nineties and pry Cry even going back into the part of the eighties. I would imagine excuse me. It was hypnotized because of course right in tune with music because that's what his job was was but I had a really cool feature that you can either push a button to equalize a music or not and I had really good audio equipment growing up because I was always an audio file and I didn't need this box to equalize my music because I had good all equalizer does is correct some kind of a deficiency in the sound and have deficiencies as an sound. It sounded good for the time and so really I never equalizer music. I just let it read what was going through in display the spectrum and I love that and I think I'm not going to do it. I don't have a need for a PC. But but I think I'm GONNA look at some more youtube videos. Maybe people doing this. But this is something that I definitely get behind taking. Something that's broken that's aesthetically medically pleasing. That's really cool. By the way he made the volume knob work. That was pretty cool He had to have a little adrenal. Breakout box inside of it to control the volume but It was cool. I you know that's the kind of stuff that trips might trigger. Man I like that kind of stuff and even if you're not particularly kind of electrical soldiering minded to be able to strip down something like that. You know what you pretty much. Anybody can disassemble a box. And you don't have to look like a band. Launched booed and everything up there. Won't he will missile assessing and you don't have skills skills. I want these little intel knock things which is PC inbox about sized apple TV. You know get that work. He then stick inside one on these boxes and all you need to do. He's probably getting the power supply. The Powell going say ten. How often everything else just comes out the back? Yeah it's it's cool projects objects let's Because if there's one thing I think modern electronic makers get one hundred percent wrong and it's the aesthetics of products folks and. I'm Hey I've talked about this with apple phones lately. You know that. They're boring to me televisions now or super boring. It's just is a flat plastic thing. Some of them are curved screens. But they're all they all look the same. I mean I don't mean the picture quality obviously but I mean the aesthetics of the device itself itself computers boring phones boring. This is all boring stuff. It's the interface that we're looking at. So that's where all the concentration of design goes. The problem is as a species. We Love tactile. We love good design. You know that's why we all live in different houses and drive different cars because we all have different ideas of what's aesthetically pleasing but if something really a masterpiece of electronics six like some of this old style seventies council stereos. Everybody agrees all s beautiful. That's really we can't even pinpoint what it is. We just I know that's really really nice. So some of the stuff just fading out. I would love to see more of rescuing this old. At least the aesthetics of the TAC Jack and upgrading. Not Everything. Look if it's if it's not could be dragging cassatt neck. Don't don't rip that thing apart. That is cool as it is But I've been watching a lot of this kind of stuff on Youtube and I also got into restores Followed into a rabbit hole. Call the day that I got hurt and I'm just basically sitting in front of my computer. I wasn't really wasn't able to concentrate on on work or anything like like that righty. I'm just sitting here staring at my screen because quite honestly my office chairs the only one where my back hurts that the heating pad could actually make good contact tend to suffer much And I fell into this rabbit hole. restorers so people would find like a thirty five year world draw price. That's all just completely rusted together and it looks like junk anybody would think. Well that's garbage and that of course the video is thirty minutes long and at the and it looks brand new. Yeah and I like seeing that stuff too that you know the techniques that they use to get the rust off and to make things work again and even this one guy found a hammer from the seventeen hundreds and he crafted a new handle for it. I mean it didn't even look like a hammer. It was so corroded with Rostan Austin. Yeah I mean it looked like rust growth. Yeah but the way he cleaned it up and made brand new again. It's just it was amazing music. The the crashed ship that goes into those restores or these amateur guys. They're not doing this to turn the for profit or something. So here's the thing. The the problem is as we move. Forward in. Technology is now becoming impossible to do this with stuff you can buy. TV In this area and if you know what you didn't get a working looking again with a molten stuff you can't. Everything's so tiny. Everything is so engineered by rebel and building the factory. You get one of these things in his broken this flow. You can do with it but I don't think firth doing anything. But that's that's the difference though David Buddy I'm talking about I'm looking at this conversation. Forward thirty years the stuff if that's out today give me all to repair any of it because it's going to be a fit to be on repairable but the best part and that sort of thing yes yes ask but I don't think a lot of the stuff out there like the. TV's that are out there. Right now I don't think there's going to be any kind of an interest in restoring these things because maybe it they're all the same. It's just the same slash rectangle with a screen on it. So I I've been looking at things recently. which are kind of on this vein gene of doing something a little bit different? So I just sent you a link in our in our super-secret general here to this phone. I've been playing around with. This is Nokia e six and this came out in. Let me just have a look. This came out in two thousand and eleven. And and what's interesting about the I have. I have a soft spot for phones with a physical keyboard on talking about this as an old product. But we're a year into the show on. This came out David. We have reviewed brand new this yet but the thing about this is this was already dying dying brand when this came out because this was post iphone yeah and the IPHONE had already changed the mobile phone industry. What I what I mean this is yeah? I'm a sucker for a phone with the cable. Well Nick this kind of looks like a black Beret sucker a sucker okay. Because I heard an APP sound in there I was. Hey Hey nobody yeah. I like keyboard and a phone particularly for text entry. which is what this is and this thing called it? Looks like an old blackberry but running symbian ambient. We'll see what I find interesting playing around. This is this I think is a window to walk. Mobile phones would still be like stay if the IPHONE hadn't had no question question about it and it's just it's interesting to to see the good bits and the bad bits railing. I have this. I'm working properly properly. I've been able to get connected to my email. I can browse the web with it. I can make phone calls with it. I can use it as a phone. The good things about this. This is one of the you know if you remember these sorts of phones on these ones way at the top of the screen for by three despite the bottom and then there's strip in the middle was of buttons and controller and then the bottom half is the keyboard these things a tiny they way nothing even compared to even the older phones. They may very little. She loved talking about days not hours. I mean this thing. Even though it's a web browser and forte JJ and email and all that sort of thing. Yeah I can leave it running for three or four days before I three charging. That's kind of amazing really really competitive what we have today but the downside very very limited in terms of the web browsing experiences horrible. It's although it's a Texter Yeah so Yeah it's it's clunky. Basically Sydney you score run the interface. This particular. One doesn't have a touch screen. You can get once we screens on. You bet everything very slowly load. You can see all look graphics. Come in peace at a time because obviously the predecessor needs ray slide but actually leaving leads vices none of the slick scrolling. You you ever go with the even with I I find find it. All feels very clunky. She's opera to browse on this now. Which compresses the web and Java scripts and everything because it doesn't have the power to do radio web even email client which works pretty? Well can feel kind of clunky competitive. What we soon? Now if you won't talk at email talking email this with tiny little chocolate keeble it's Fonsi period period doing it on my own eleven principally because when you got physical case you make mistakes. Do you do with the iphone and an and that makes a big difference. If you're writing emails all key maybe should we rising LOUIMA's on the phone but as a busy. He's sometimes I find on the half day so it's interesting you know it has everything will never developed. At least a is. The city operates systems jobs. It is interesting to see how where this might have gone. Had they continue developing it and put the foster processes that we have today. But you know it's I say something to the fact that even with under the ancient piece of hardware very low powered powered. This phone is still visible today. I mean if he gave it to a kid they probably wouldn't that much it off until at the end of the end of last year it was that was actually where he find on it. So you could still be. What's happening with your friends until then and I think that would have covers has low basis for for lot people probably some text messaging is fine on it? It's just interesting to see where where we came from and count. And that's what I'm saying. You know you can type much petrol and they sneak up on an iphone eleven. Well you and I can. Maybe but I guarantee you broke or call it would be the opposite. I watched some of these younger people on their phones and they're almost as fast with their thumbs as as I am with a keyboard. And that's saying something. Yeah I thought what did he with with the current irs. I find eight also correct frequently. He puts in mistakes for me. Yeah for whatever reason it auto correction uses the word duck a whole lot on my phone even that sometimes you able people will play in what looks like a random carries. Isn't it's obviously what he thought you were trying to type but you think abdomen. It isn't autocorrect. Must have a supposed to have a dictionary of real words to not use those look the context of the words. Before and it's it's just not good. Now it's gone downhill. I agree with you and one of my lucky here is that Physical keyboard you come to know when you fair key. You don't make as many stakes true this that go for it if only somebody could physical keeble to the iphone if you don't get sued by blackberry jobs although we're in his grave when you said it was it Ryan seacrest Detroit to do that. I think it was failed. Miserably anyway are just just one other thing. I actually just started playing with this week. I'm in a hotel the week now. And and I got sick of House. LTV So I bought Myself Amazon. A roku breaking express. Have you used to before. Yeah I've got my main TV. Roku and I've got I got the little breakout box on another TV. That hardly ever used so yeah. I'm very familiar with it. I never used rocket before I was incredibly surprised that everything on it. Yeah the you get Amazon very robust Absent in there. Everything is there Disney. Plus as. Well you don't have it yet. But Disney pluses on their Hulu and I thought why the Hell does anybody abide apple TV. There's no question. Yeah once you get into a Roku everything else including Amazon and everything else is stupid. There's no point in it Roku one and what I like is kind of exploring their own little APP store and I'm always looking for it. I have found any. That's really particularly jumping out at me but different screensavers Colon I fell into a life feed camp thing where and it's a it's basically a screensaver but you can look at all these different live camps from New York Times Square to La to London that that is kind of cool because it's live use of what's going on in the world and that's kind of cool to and it it. It shows up she as well. The ROKU does not have an awesome has his uniform off. It's a ton. The one I had is a tiny little boxes about the size of a compact flash card and the idea. She gets a team. You never turn turn off Yup because the thing is when you switch to it you wanna be able to watch something effectively. It's up you know the ones in the TV obviously They're also not turning off the TV itself does yeah kind of because you push the power button and it's like right now. It's it's ray ago filled up. I often I've had. I've had twenty five pounds little stress box. Just there's a box it's not a stick which is could you tell. TV's because you often can't easy gets achie- Mike Falls it. It's pretty good. I'm very pleased with. Let's jump over to something. That's a little fun that we've done once once and we said we were going to do again and we haven't you know with the says of course yes WISH DOT COM. It's time David to go down the the wish hall again And set our budget and finds something and buy it and then when we both received our item we can talk about it on a future episode of Tech Fan but we need to come up with and of course this wasn't planned out it all the type of device that were or item that we're looking at so we get something in the same kind of category instead of just some random Adam thing. What is if we're going to do a search? What are we going to search for? From Komo's it is as a whole. Yes literally the products but many of which are very very similar but nevertheless it would be he could to stick to a a caffeine. Yeah so and you have to search for because you can't. Because at the top the whole search thing is popular blitz express in Russillo viewed and then more and then more is kind of where we want to look at so I don't understand at least on my screen. The very bottom one is bottoms. That is but you have bottoms. Okay maybe people close bottoms it trousers and okay yeah. I've got boxer shorts. That's an interesting picture. So you've already clicked bottoms rich genes. We we have some toilet pipe there and basically anything underneath away. Anything the cousin. So let's go back to that and and do you want to go to gadgets automotive home decor accessories hobbies. Now we're a tech show so so maybe we should look at gadgets kind. Yeah well we did last time though but all right. So I'm in gadgets and let's talk about some of the things that we're we're seeing here now. We're not going to tell each other what we bought although I guess we Kinda could. I don't know if the fun is revealing what we bought or talking about. Why I'm picking this and then reviewing so so he he's why suggests assists? Let's push the bow out here and get to choose and I said we can get here on the show now and then we can choose something else which we're not gonNA tell each other it's Subscri- okay. So we gotta start our budget total budget so you could spend as much on each items you want within your total budget so if we CETERA budget at thirty bucks we can buy one for twenty five bucks another thing for five bucks all right so you set the budget at what thus the Yep so thirty bucks. Now I'm quite sure that what you're seeing on your screen and what I'm seeing on my screen are are gonna be totally different. Like for instance in my first item for sixty two boxes at ten core. It's a it's a what do you call it. A Tablet running android eight point. Oh what's up my mind. Is that Catholic crafted knockoff. Beats it's headphones can tell you that. Because it has a logo similar but not qu- I tell these claims to be refurbished each exchange gifts three headphones for eighteen dollars. Seventeen pounds well. That's probably the same I. Are they black with the goal logo on it. Yes yeah that's number three on my so we're probably seeing very similar things so let's kind of scroll through here When you find your secret item you could say I'm a secret and that's getting there but then we'll talk about kind of what we see in in what were publicly going to say we're buying My number two is a assist two terabyte ultrafast file transfers. It looks like an external hard drive for four dollars and eighty eighty four cents but I I would imagine that it just just for a laugh I bought a one terabyte micro St Card from which to yeah about seven pounds and you'll be when they arrive. It declares have one therapy. I'm pretty sure once I put more than about five gigabytes onto is still working and they get they give me my money back side. Here's here's what it says very much uh-huh that we wish dot com descriptions. Well when you pull this up if you look closely it says it's a two point five inch status serial. We'll port mobile hard disk box. There is no hard drive in here. Yeah it could be two terabyte if you put not Tara buy into it right exactly like like looking okay. Why have think I I have found my cheek little surprise gift thing? Yeah Yeah I it's only couple of pounds off go to budget left on Sony mold spectacular and I was just going to be your public or private thing. I think this will be privacy. How good he says? Because I've seen this thing before and yet this is substantially cheaper and I want to know is with buying. I'm not here's my problem. I have so much junk as it. Is that for me to find something on here that I'm like Ooh I want to try that like a GPS EPS tracker. It's four bucks. PULL US up a little box but the size of your thumb maybe a little smaller many real time magnet. GPS tracking device by GPS locator system portable GPS global tracker car motorcycle. Truck me kids. Teens means oil and other moving objects. How many does nothing have a lot? It has all out all your. GPS belong to us. I think to me this smacks of someone trying to catch cheating spouse exactly precisely what is I'm not interested in that one. You buy one put it on. He's an interesting I want. You buy one. Put It on one of the a constant work and then you can see where it's yeah. I'm sure they'd have no privacy issues with their work about that boss. His car during a test I yeah there you go here. Here's one with toothbrushes. Why is that in this category? Buzz vaguely electrical. Isn't it so he stuck it in an outlet and melted it. They have a problem buying some cheap toothbrushes on wish dot com. That I'M GONNA stick in my mouth breath. I would just assume being poisoned immediately. Why would they? Why would they poison loyal customers? 'cause wish does moderate stuff. Why would why would the Chinese manufacture poison that loyal customers? That's just back but this is man we Because we're Westerners I'm not. I'm not finding anything David. I'll be honest. There's a whole lot of the little cases and knock off of the iphone phone headphones. Those things are just everywhere on here. It's a pair of headphones. Twenty seven pounds. I'm sure it's actual bowls speaking of owes you see there you see what a good transition right there the closing all the European. US stores to which I go there was still both stores open really watch state. I've seen the boasts tools that probably because even the UK. Everything's mold then so. I have seen the boasts. Tools around Raj seen one. I've never seen anybody in our statement at least about co hosts from the UK. Yeah definitely yeah. It doesn't surprise me but I think the problem is is that online reviews and online pitch sing is fine for people who know what they will do by what was not very good this for people who don't know what they want to buy and I suspect that this will this move will ultimately disadvantage does because the problem is the Internet is awash with paypal. He basically say that bose terrible and you shouldn't ever buy and if you do that you some some sort of Rupe. He's not he's not I don't I don't think Bose's is absolutely brilliant. But I you know I think foes for what it does. I think he's actually pretty good. And I think most people who spend quite money'll buy stuff a normally happy with the results and at the end of the day. I think that's as important as anything else. I think. Much like apple both stuff guest thing down as being expensive when you when you bind buys your buying kind of equality experience and a good level of backgrounds. The don't get with the speaker and head if I'm friends I've always Way Back in the day I liked bows and then I bought a pair of costs headphones back in the eighties. I I was kind of my dad. had a pair of vintage sixties both Speakers that sounded really good. So in my mind bose is oh. That's the best you can get. And then I started visiting specialized stereo stores and realize that no bows is actually kinda crappy I he's you're paying for the name. Let me put it that way. But he's the fiscal you talking about those. As they went twenty five years. I think the worst now I think their quality has gone way down compared to the competition. Well the problem is what is the competition for those sennheiser Yeah now I'm sorry. Most people buy those are not thinking. Should I buy Vo. Shoulda by Sennheiser. Should I buy sure they're thinking. Should I buy bows or should I by Sony some. Yeah some brand. I've seen in in saying bows and now bose's coming up all in wish. I turn off microphones you know yes. It's overpriced but I think I think the majority bows customers are a happy to pay the price for what they get from. Bos- which is a level of build in quality that you don't get with a lot cheaper sets and also you do you get warranty. Do get back up. You can even on the things you smell to do. And I've done this a couple of times if you've ever lost an accessory bose headphones. I had the innate Qatif Fish I catch lost the clip that the con- eclipse the assery bid to your the front. Your shirt I would go into a bow store. I don't know what say you know. Yeah the clip. Can I get caught by another one and they would go. No we'll give you one thing and they give you one. If you lost tape or something like that they would sort you out and those are the things you lose by not having the stalls and that sort of that sort of thing. You don't get from other brands because they don't have that sort of tale experience interesting. I that is Kinda cool. I'll give him that. But I still think you're paying more for balls than the actual value of headphones. Well you could say the same thing about apple's computers all know I think that that's comes straight straighter because yes the physical price of the apple computers compared to the PC equivalent is way more money. But you're getting the apple because of the macro ass you're not that should be true with bows. Yes they cost more. The plastic is the same the earmuffs are in the same. But you're getting a better audio experience and I I just don't think that that's true. In my tasks over the years have proven that out you can get a superior sound for less price with some of these other brands France. I think with Bos you're paying for the name. I wrote last shape but but I think as well with as you all well paying for a product that broke out of the contest Stereo Stereo audio fall niche into becoming more mainstream in people's minds. I agree with that. And that's why I think you're incorrect when it comes to them closing stores. I think that the writing is on the wall of these stores are ghost town People aren't going into these places to look for headphones. They're just not what they're doing is oh I just found out my one thing buying Select size or button controller APP control. Oh well I gotta go APP control so excited and I'm going to tell you what these are. Led I'd glasses with APP control so you put these headphones on and the led's as you can spell out on your phone and it's on your at an sharing your glasses. I'm going to go with my boy. I change a color and the price certa Jope Is three eighty one with button. CONTROL APP control. It jumped up to fifteen dollars. I'm just outbreak though. They're not getting me. I'M NOT GONNA pay for convenience damn it Say The spyware anyway. y'All goes without saying ooh Multimedia for dollar seventy nine. That's GonNa Nice I bought and got for Christmas A brand new multi meter haven't even used it came in a case alligator clips on it. I pulled the lead out of my one that I had for years and they approach just got an online and families for it. But I was like it's twenty Bucks Brand Dylan. Yeah and I I really did. What the alligator clips on? So what the heck They got a An external DVD DVD. Blu Ray drive. That's clearly plugged into a Mac. Bennett doesn't work with them. Back that's the thing you got to be careful with those kind of things things. Will it work with my computer. I'm having. I'm really struggling finding a sufficiently junkie thing to buy. You WanNa look could a different part of the wish dot Com Gemini while you already Bossom denture always on your little thing i. I'm just not finding anything electron Trumping my trigger and so I'm going to go back up. I'm going to go from gadgets. To what does assessories I gotTa See. Accessories are oh it's like glasses and belt buckles and crap like that and that thing which I can't say on the Air How about phone upgrades their hobbies? What's under hobbies? Oh just this is the most cheaper thing. I've seen him anti life. Would you look at this is this is a four G. Networks smartwatch. Phone is this this under phone upgrades. No this was in the gadget section. A basically it shows fun. The world's most enormous phone and the jam domes were banned with thumbs playing fortnight. He saw see movies. He's Special Forces Guy and he has some sort of electronic gadget on his wrist. It looks like that's bad is hilarious and the point is I'm sure once you actually get this you'll find it. What show four nine or any of these pictures or anything on it will be? It'll be a crappy little screen. He'll have ADS showing a picture of the titanic sinking in. It's meant to be the movie. Titanic I think I use Oh my good- some pants smoke smoke. I'm under the category hobbies. And this is kind of a catchall for al-Qaeda. Okay yeah okay. I'll send this obese. The first thing that came up is a four hundred piece magnet magnets magnets superstar nude magneto. He's the one thing that you've been banned because worried about kids swallowing. Oh yes you're right. These are the NIA team Damian. Very very powerful Magnus and and that really meant the cross purposes but the so powerful this little they can beat that lethal on your fingers because they will fly across room to each other and then and then you know and yeah. Why be tied you if you've got one a few inches away and you'll think it gets in the way and you'll finger is just an impediment to the power how're mechanism and the second thing? Yes is that they are button-sized and so kids put things like that in the mouth and if you swallow these things this is not generally not very good for you so I just I mine is totally going to buy an eat them but now he says that I'm dot ruined it for me. I'm sorry I you know I am. The health and safety would have sensible that show. Well someone has to be. It's definitely not a hey. This is an interesting category. Though is fifty eight million lumine headlamp here for four pounds. Well yeah that's just overkill eight million lumens. I'm pretty sure the son doesn't say fifty eight million. No I think it does. We'd all be dead. Well we'd be blind Not Hey that's the flashlights. Let's Kinda well she's she's CONACO. Giannakou it some kind of a sham on my way because this is really quite pointless but but it's an led temple he put a during in. It's got a very strong light so you can put a piece of paper copy joint though is basically a light box USB powered. That's interesting Boy I there's there's almost too much here. Yeah it's like I don't even know where to start. Here's my problem. I'm trying to find something that I could actually use. And that's a problem when you're coming to wish to come with completed wrong my say totally This is pointless churchgate well. I'm trying to think of what future Tim could us. Well right now. I'm forty I'm in my forties tomorrow. I'LL BE IN MY fifties. So what does the fifty a year old tim need tomorrow. Let's face it today. He's sneakers yeah and a cool hat and sunglasses. Yeah tomorrow you need slippers and a walking frame. I'm probably going through all the way back. I say that on the basis that your fifty tomorrow and then I will be fifteen in a in a couple of months to say. Experience here are know exactly what you're talking about What about how about a look picking Lente look takes it transpired locks if you live in America for you? Don't know how to lock pick in America. You're way behind the curb. That's that's that's alimentary school. David what are you doing all right. I live in Michigan. Remember a violin. Here we go Eight colors for four full size base would acoustic violin. With case Rosen Bowl Bridger. Do not play. What's it is not the point? Police Stun Gun pretty sure this is illegal in the UK Yeah I would. I would hope so. It's probably completely illegal here. Unfortunately well we don't bother with stun guns we get real ones. I've I've got to take someone down. I'm taking them down. But I just found your little light box saying by the way here. This one says it's almost gone and it comes with cheap paper clip thing thing is to hold your paper on the super thin thing. Here's something I could use. Oh actually this is something I actually. We do. Want pack of eighteen seven bucks so this is An eighteen piece five millimeter up to thirteen millimeter. It's got to be more than that if it's pack of eighteen pretty sure between between five and thirteen. There's less than eighteen so maybe duplicates team plus five I think yeah. What is it Sorry it's a SOx leave nozzle nut driver set so what this is This is not driving. Obviously so yeah it it. Yeah so you could put the electric grow and you have. It's for bolts and stuff like that. I can actually use this for seven bucks so the problem is you can use to fifty is going to be able to use this but this is gonna find that really dial that's true I'm GonNa get it out of my basket. I'll remove it well by if if I tell you what I'll buy you one breath. Promise back to the beginning of my list. Yeah wow that's just not so there is a i. I find what you're talking about. Fifty two million million lumens super bright. Headland this is the headlamp. Would you looking at the headlamp. Yeah I've got one. That's nine hundred title. Nine thousand see lesson. Bus smelled of fifty million. Sir My mind one is is definitely far less superior than yours. Okay so I go in and select size I presume maybe ten on vaporize is your head well that goes without saying These I just love going into to the customer reviews because there's everything on wishes just fake two days ago works great very bright. Exactly what I needed five stars. That's from Vicki Johnson. Very Bright Love Zoom feature works. Great Five Stars David. I think you were very pleased with the item. Thanks if you're writing a review of particular. AD call an item fast delivery. Love it very bright headlights very bright. Thank you oh so. Every single one of them said very bright except for that but yeah for fifty million limit Brian. Well this is well now. It's changed now. Says four hundred million at so you can't physically uses it would melt. Your best logical progressively is come fifty four hundred million estimates of five minutes. Yeah you change the size and boy they really crank up the power on that which is quite quite impressive. With a little cheap rechargeable batteries last for about four microseconds and the batteries are dead power. Great guys on. Yeah you charge a TUSLA's it drives by us. Look at the Tesla boop there you go. You're welcome lot of grow lamps stuff. I'm seeing a lot of girl Williams the I I guess they think I'm growing pot here or something I don't know anything. He grabbed gras. Well that's the only reason people by the people who the people are really into gardening. Earning don't use grow lights. Girl Lights. Our guys hiding pot in their basement as they grow at the house round the corner from Arista. They've and and it was. All the wood was rushing on it. Yeah it looked like it was one step away from fiction and they not down. Yeah and I never saw anybody going out but on the top floor though is like an just a knee. Eve's Lucca a window. Those room of that and you always saw this ultraviolet light coming out of it and the Saudi was very very heavily entertaining. All they were great something the relied on quite a lot of UV light on a regular basis but the funny thing about it is this house and a window was right across from a really large three lane junction on the highway. If everybody who came through that area yet could secretly what was going on the this house and it was not enough for about two three days before the police. Cau- shuts down that. You're find out what they were growing. Yeah they were going to Paul as I figured. That's just embarrassing now. I found a A an end is skype here. Are you going to self medicate. That's I mean I. Why would anybody well? I presume you use it for looking pipes and stuff. I'd I'd imagine it it's rated for biological years is only thirty five. I can't say it's true I you know I I really WANNA participate. This was my idea. And I'm not finding anything over over an hour into the show and I cannot find anything that I want to spend money on to have shipped to my house and four months from China. Tina well I'll tell you what I have found something. I'm going to buy this just because I think he looks Kinda Cool Wall then. Let's do that this. This episode is dedicated. Oh you find something finding something on here and discussing and the next time we do. It'll be me buying something something in the next ten seconds because I'm just I have just clicked by an ad. It's my car but there is a one hundred sixty piece diamond building block cruise ship model. Set here so this is like A. This is like a Lego sets. Now they say it's a cruise ship and is a cruise shape this particular cruise ship conned of looks to build school and it has the full funnels gold funnels with black tops on. Yeah and see master either side of the funnels which gives a quite distinctive profile and then in front of the model. Is this kind of collection of gray. Breaks poking up out of the sea three so this is not a cruise ship model set. This is the titanic just before it hits Nice fix while I found the greatest piece of advertising graphics. I've ever seen in my life on wish now I'm I copy the Pitcher I'm putting in the chat This is this is the greatest out. The first thing that caught my mind now. This is cushion at thirteen callers. First One two three four cushion comfort cushion not include it right. Yeah sorry cover. It's a slip cover. So I know include cushion that include so the top of the Pitcher is a cartoon dog that looks like a little affir- is very muscular. And he's looking very aggressively as he is on your thoughts Mackenzie. But here's the thanks. So you see you see the urine coming out is it. Is it. Meant to be hitting your iphone. That was on the couch. That's destroying your iphone. Because that's kind of what it looks looks like I. I think it's implying that the seat covers so even get some flashback but no it's squared look at it. It's like a rectangle that's broken there. I think it's I think it's just stylistic okay so that's the first thing but the most disturbing it has a dog an actual dog winking at you sitting up with a very well. Well done. I'm going to say well done photoshop. Job of basically a human hand with the thumb and the dogs weaking at this is a hundred percent. The graphic for this episode. I'm using the entire ad pitcher right here here because that is the most disturbing dog pitcher I've ever seen. That's I think the duck with a thumbs up that should be on new like no. No this should be the logo for that Nanno company that I was talking about the Nanno box. This is their new logo. Ah Go that dog so confusing good escape. Yeah it's disturbing. I can't stop looking at the dogs. Weird arm 'cause. They actually matched the color because they've given the dog and elbow. They show very muscular forearms looking for on it and and it's got the thumbs up and if you look closely at the thumb nail what is that what is going on in this photo. I'm very disturbed but I kinda dig the dog very some that. It's come to some sort of pseudo thumbnail. Oh chlorine and if you're listening to this in the car and you can't see it the next opportunity go to go to tech FAN PODCAST DOT COM or go to my Mac dot com and just look at the picture that's or go to our twitter feed will be there to get buying something. It was listed list picture that I win. I've already won. It's amazing I like that in so many ways is so disturbing this gusting and an wrong but yet here I am somebody somebody in. China has some really good photoshop skills. I'll just say that. Actually you know what I'm GonNa do a quick And by the way You he was talking about the Nokia e six. I am putting that as our wikipedia this week. Because that's what you linked to David so Dog Dog I'm looking at Google dog thumbs up and So now I'm going into images and and the the areas it's one two three four. It's the fifth one so yup. Yep It's a much bigger picture is even more disturbing here So that will actually be graphic. Not Not the one that I posted stood. I'm going to use this one because here it is and you see they just reversed it. They just they just flipped Putting it on our comments I'll see you can see Very disturbing yeah yeah. That's that's just not right. I feel I feel less as a personnel. That I've seen this in chaired it. Nothing wrong with that before pita comes after us for this thing David people can reach out in a sentence feedback. All they have to do is Senate email the show show at tech podcast com. Of course we're on twitter to men at Tech Fan pocus. We haven't got a lot of feedback lately. If I did want to mention some feedback from a listener just bring out quickly on sorts mentioned. He contacted it does Joseph Hertzel Iot era is. We're talking about. I'd say a couple of weeks ago. And he got an error message that said device give ice melt responding check demerit points and retry gave gave that device demerit points. It's it's different a smart switches garage for his shop line so much in the the the Chinese government signing you demerit points yes depending on how loyal William Joseph don't don't overlook that you yeah he can get into a lot of trouble there the mayor or nothing to joke joke about young man. What would your mother say? I keep stand the Kona. So inhabits love to get some feedback from you guys hit us up if you find something really cool on wish. Let us know we'll check it out at. We're not spending a lot of money. Don't get me wrong but if you see something on West under thirty bucks right Timisha check this out. David Senator Lane I just. I just did mind okay. So Apparently be before the end the Mumbo believe it went to say. Don't tell me what it is. I don't want to know until you reveal it on the show and If I find something between now I do. HIT WISH DOT COM every couple of weeks. But the problem is I. It's it's like a scroll girl. Fast I get tired of scrolling because I'm scrolling and scrolling and scrolling again that for that little skull Tony Randomly Pick Things of wisha Colin. I'm present something from here without anything. Someone told me they found another wish dot com type of thing but it was all tech items. Yeah there's this Yeah there. Is this bank. Good it bang and good bank. Good DOT COM or B. A. B. I. N. G. G. O. DOT COM and they basically basically this is. This is buying stuff directly from Chinese warehouses Mu user eighteen dollars off. Get it now. Well of course so they will sell. They will sell you kind of in development products from China as well so you can spend money can buy I lap tops and things like that are not available in the West and chemical cables and stuff like that I bought from them in the past which are not available in the West I interesting and there are the couple of other than the other one is. There's an awful as well but this very emotionless vein where it's sunny tech processed. I read from China. These pretty good. Yeah this is Ah looks more high end than well. I'd say that and then I click a link and then all of a sudden assume junk that I've been so you can get some cheap stuff on here as well but it is a little bit this last less random than than wish which was literally sell you anything. This tends to be a bit more tech focused and get some cool stuff on here. Yeah I this might be a new rabbit hole. I can kind of explore and I love the budget for this one Ah Yeah there's some stuff on here that are not cheap. which especially these bras? That just popped up my train. This is kind of cool. Hand Ladies. This a laser thermometer here sort of thing. Where you just pointed something that tells you how halted is one of those who knows trimmer hang with Teddy fifty? That's definitely a requirement that's been a requirement for good. It is six or seven years. I had a friend who refused to do it. And at one point I was like dude. Your nose hairs longer mustache. You GotTa do something about that. And that's just you sneeze and you kill three children. I'm just saying I so. Let me. Just tell you quick very quick story to wind up because I know we're running along here but few probably two three months ago I'm working in an Citicorp booming at the moment. It's about one hundred miles from where I live and I'm walking to my hotel one day and I needed to head all Turkish barber and so I thought I'll just hoping to get my haircut and then it's done right so I go in there and early evening and they give me to the owners customers something like that is a young guy. He's the new into hairdressing. Yes they give give me to him to give him a bit of experience so when I have my hair cut it's spicy. It's just a razor alive down to a short length anyway. I you Tim from having met me in person. I have very bushy eyebrows. Yes and so he says to me. I call you Ali when you're not around exactly so he says to me and he did speak good English sets. You won't meet to eyebrows. We kind of gesture my eyebrows and so on normally have them trained Manati said Yeah Fine Okay and then he pointed it up. My is my nose he says. Do you want me to do the head there as well and now I assumed it's taken the as he was GonNa is tell me users. Oh my God oh no listen send that so anyway. He's light his lane me back and before I know what's going on there is wax being applied to the radio show. Oh and he takes comedies. Big Cue tips with wax on a shoves them up my nostrils and then still spooning walks into my ears or God you're done and it's hot as well. Yeah and I just I quickly I just the we'll I'm just I'm just along the right. Yeah I just this is death is bad enough. He pulled out and they were bad enough then he comes around the front than me. I thought my God he comes in those he plays fought my chest. Well I just want to do yeah and they and yanked these things I'll I'll tell you I. I'm pretty sure that I lost consciousness surprise. You could still see. And then having done that he then takes the steak with the ball of wax on the and he kind of waves in front of me is all the has sprang of. It'd be like well. Yeah he's still the small animal and then I get to the front. I had to pay extra for that privilege. Sure yes well. Why wouldn't to? Oh my God that sounds like that. Sounds like you had to pay for your torture. It was it was crazy. Ah Rang landed told that she she was no word of a lie. She was laughing twenty and wake up thinking of the wacky getting shoved it. Oh my God pulling waxing your nose hair anything. That sounds war painful. I would rather have the back issue. That's says eight guys on that now. Everybody there's your visual Joe for the week while my clinch so hard to think about you've you've got you've got ta show those here now. I'M NOT GONNA I want somebody actually listening to this show. That sounds awful funny at the same time. I would have paid to watch them and do that you. You don't know what's coming. That was the listing of that it could yourself about for it may be that and of course the next five days. My nose is running in custody. Because there's no traffic get healthy. I think you're crying the whole time. I think that's actually what was happening. They're just crying is I. What are you doing to US crave awful well with that visual? Let's see everyone here in two weeks for the next tech fan remember next week. We're doing gigs pub. And we'd love you to join us in the pub and talk about all things Geek. It's always a lot of fun. I'm glad we are have started a second show because it gives us a little bit more flexibility in our topics and we'll have some eventually some guests come on in fact we've done a couple of episodes now the second can we already had a guest But that being said if you would like to join us on Geeks pub because I think that's a little bit more open to A. Oh a variety of guests people coming on We'd love to have you with schedule a time to do the show to either be on a Friday or Sunday I probably not next week. Because you know Kinda short short amount of time but we'd love to give some more people involved in Geeks pub because that's what they show. Is this just talking about Kiki stuff. And if you're listening to this show and you listen you're into the Geeky stop and quite honestly David and I. Why are we got a lot of different interests? We talk pretty much any subject. So if you're interested in that hit us up seriously you don't have to be recent professional podcast. Or that's there's no fun in that The show at the Tech Fan PODCAST DOT com. reachout had to be expelled. We'll get you on. Have a good time Michael. I'm looking at Michael Breathe. I know he's listener and and Don't remember if we've ever had Michael Brown. Show got tons of feedback over the years ars but it's been silent right. If it was a fishing show. Michael would have been on a bunch of times. He's a big fisherman. And that's that's there's a tech tech aspect of fishing to which I'm not a fisherman at all but I know there's a lot of high tech stuff those Fisher but seems like cheating. Yes there you go the week David by the the.

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TechFan 372 - Mac mini

TechFan

52:27 min | 1 year ago

TechFan 372 - Mac mini

"Tech podcast number three hundred seventy two. I am Tim Robertson on a special Wednesday episode recording anyways here at tech fan headquarters with David Cohen. Hello, david. How you're not. You're not near usual digs this week. Now hotel on Kurnia said the muck future decoded events in London future decoded. Yeah. I have been dead this morning. And Pat, tell age recall this by begin tomorrow. So fun. It is it is she this as a nightmare plice. This is kinda much trying to say whether going. The king of this morning. I am not. So thing the problem. The problem with this event is it can be bit fluffy Roelof haughty hell. Butts. Yeah. Exactly. But you will get, you know, speak to people and sometimes he can win extra information out of the middle of all of this. It's what doing with much of. So the still with with coming along through for free Koper events this update. So we're actually recording this couples early. For two reasons. Number one. You can't record this Friday or I can't record this Friday. Sorry, you cut in front and then recover weekend. 'cause you're going on holiday. That's right. I am trying to figure out who I'm going to get as a co host for the next two weeks. Correct. That's right. Yeah. Shipping back on in about two and a half weeks yet the third week. Twenty twenty four. I think I should I'll be around again. So anybody who would like to co host with me? Let me know I've got an invitation to one person. But I haven't heard back it's a long shot. But. I'm looking for co host for at least one of the next two weeks with this other percents upset will be one host. I still need another can always do solo show. But I thought I'd kick it out there David why not bright? Absolutely. So the other aspect of recording early this week is because of what happened yesterday. And that was the apple of aunt. I don't know if it was I think for for MAC users. I think this was probably more highly anticipated than the last month's iphone about we get an iphone event every year. I mean. You can almost predict exactly what's going to be. It's it's nothing earth shattering anymore. It's an upgrade, you know. Maybe new screens a little bit different form factor. But not really it's a. Slab of glass. It's yeah. Because of the massive interest the on one we tend to get stuff leaked to love more this year. We knew fanny while ahead. Tommy exactly what was coming. Whereas with this this other event, it's been a little bit more not. So it's more interesting sea will begin the day. And I think that from my perspective seem like it was a pretty successful. I don't know how will the event went. But the reception was pretty good. I gotta say, and I don't mean the cocktails afterwards. I mean from the user's perspective sometime pretty the coverage has been very positive. I think I you know, they, obviously the is is very much, apple bread and butter knit, Seth lecture products. So they put a lot of effort into that. And make sure gets updated every year, whereas the privilege everything else gets updates when they get around to it. Anytime do get updated pre much on early basis. Went with the these price just announced a little were about eighteen months old. I think since the loss face it. They were twenty seventeen and and they they didn't touch the regular ipads on this talk about the mini which is still on sale. So I think the point is is a regular quirk. It is. Yes. The ipads, probably all update more regularly than the certainly some of the exiting this team. Maxi? Haven't been updates about full years that those are very well received any social good. Apple to try and show that they are not justified company. I think I think it's very very important that they do that. And that they do a better job of refreshing, these other products, the Macs, and ipads, simply because there's gonna come a day in a no some people don't like to hear this. And we're both iphone users. But there's gonna come a day where I phoned isn't a cool product. That's not what the kids are going to want. I know that people don't believe that. But you know, you, and I have been in the tech world long enough to to see that. That's it's it's always the case. There's never well thing that dominates forever. We can. We can very much. Remember people still coinciding about you know, what are gonna do win when people don't lie pumps anymore. We'll let the end of the company so they've been in that position before more important than to have the divest product line. And sometimes I wish they gave more. Impression that they thought it was important because I sure don't give that impression do that. I thought they they say the right words that you know, action state land for words had the right words them when they update something not in the four years previous when they didn't do anything with that product. Yeah. I'm a slice it. You know, they are fail. Well, known recently full common. Dropping the bullet some this stuff probing being promise zone pool. They didn't update up for many years. And then they have to come out and eat some humble pie and say we we've got this wrong with starting again. And we're still waiting for that product. They also is Sam since they made that announcement to so they clearly all salting from stretch with that. So you know, they I think once he can take one will, you know, against the minute. But one thing intensive wife looking at Apple's MAC, can I pad landscape now compared to how it was the day before yesterday is that they are still in the. A muzzle about what they want to be what they want to sell the the previous. The thing that they used to have fiscal into the max back nearly two thousand there was it was pretty laser focus about this is the product line. This is the split between private Cosima ambitions. What we have. And it was simple. And it was on the stand the Balik on the new way, you were that still isn't there still kind of allies the map, and even though I must congratulate than for for bringing some much need improvement. Certainly some of the provoke my fear is that we finally got some upgrades to long overdue products. And God only knows how long it's going to be before. Is it going to be another four years or are they going to stick to at this time? This is the way let's start with the MAC book airs, I that they unveiled its a retina macbook air long long and coming four four million pixels. David, but what more could you want? Well, yeah, wrestler is definitely Weller generally Zanny product, they sold that didn't have Resona. They you still say that they have a completely restaurant line 'cause tin coping Tim coat the still selling the. I'm Paul the reason for that is this particular new Medicare is about three hundred dollars more expensive than the one David. But let's be honest. It's ten percent thinner, and it's only two point seven five pounds three pounds. I mean years come on man, they shape ten percent. And it's a what a quarter of a pound less in weight. This is this kind of kind of what we always expected the macbook air update to be readies. Faintly surprising that they couldn't have done the surveillance, but they. This came out two years ago with is basic exactly the same specs except for the as I five. Yeah. Is basically the what many school the MAC book escape, which is the num- touch ball project and put into a small factor into basically a slight redesign, if the usual MAC. The right word, by the way. Very it is slight. And you know, they've come presenting hunter tried Kathleen. Hey, because they already have another product kuechley MAC book, the twelve inch meant. You know, they these two products come if stippled each other's ties could evolve inch MAC book, which is more underpowered than this has has one less pool in this. But still has the read the screen you have Satan, the new book that's kind of like the book kind of pumped up a bit over the map. Okay. Aniko controversial has that also cables that a lotta people don't really like and. Concerns about six reliability. So that sedan side as well compared the one, and it has to you a spec- ports to fundable pools. So they are you spec- thumper pope. So there's a high support high speed ports. Only one twenty eight geek of a state to sell it weighs added which is easy. Eighties. Yeah. I mean, we we all back in the battle days of. You know, effectively, she's like, the sixteen guy funds the entry level mobile to hit a price point. But it's not the one you wanna buy you wanna buy the one this Cup hundred dollars more because that has the will usable specs a nowadays it as tough to live in one twenty machine and yet all this is eleven ninety nine does seems awful expensive for what else's quite honestly, kicking apples. But in the Tra portable lap top line in those don't run MAC OS. No. But they run windows, ten and windows. Ten is a vast improvement over Preuss windows. It is on this papal who can get pefectly welll windows, and the pricing is a problem all of these Nassar's. I think the process I underst- I understand that. You know, apple has this thing full the stock market that they want to protect protect than margin. And they're looking at that average, and the average profit per device on they need to keep that numbers possible. Apparently has what the stock market likes kind of running when they sitting on probably one of the world's biggest positive Kashmir. They go. And on this is they seem to be on a drive at the moment to push themselves up the price letter. I concerned about these. I think one of the reasons personally why the old macbook gas sold. So well and everyone agrees. It was the biggest seller has been the biggest of longtime one of the reasons sold. So well, despite the fact that the specs were quite old wolves because it was the cheapest banks so you could buy and the I really was particularly syllable nine ninety nine. I really do wonder if this machine is enough to push people the full when you can't what we just said about wanting along dressy up the full five hundred dollars you need to go up. It is it's a tough off. Can you know, let's face it. These all turns doesn't have money and a month the funds, which tend to be fun. So Missouri percent cat. Lamble, something like that. Which means that, you know, paying laying out the Cashel up from with the met, you all your all seeing put down they chunk of change. And unfortunate competitors all windows. Same so cross arms. Still roundabout thousand camera thousands them out I've seen alias ninety nine. Well. Yeah. This will this is it too as well. The windows laptops, are frequently subject to sales and discounts. Whereas I will on all too. So that is another problem as well. Look is is it very Crecy become claiming the south figures if the old one continues to sell in the same way has done few people buying this new woman than apple will. But you know, I they went through this with the only pet you. Remember that the ipad was stuck? It wasn't growing the ease in years. And then eventually they bit the bullet. And they upgraded the ipad and rayvey the price and over some have sales growing again. I sys fakes we might see something like this as well. Oh. Yourself. Two two different products. Yeah, wins it wins that with a MAC, I can answer that never. Yeah. Literally, it's been it's been. But the point is they could've they could've go the rest of the new book down. They couldn't go down maybe eleven hundred dollars. So there's a hundred dollar upgrade over the previous one. I think they would sell them gangbusters agree. I think what they're asking for these that don't agree. This is also quite as well apart from the whole brand confusion on the eagles, a MAC book roundabout the same price and people are gonna go will wash up on one of the other. It's tough questions on. So. Yup. So that's what I mean about the mobile proline. The here's the kind of clarify the MAC mini a little bit. Mike, many is been the longest sufferer of being Nord. I mean. Everybody likes Bill Palmer who we don't speak anymore because he went insane. Famously said the MAC mini is the computer apple hates in that. It's it's a dead product. Well, here we are in twenty eight teen in the just released a new one, of course, October was when the last time they updated the MEK me, but that was in twenty fourteen whole so's well that everyone needs I think everyone kind of hitting young knows the MAC mini sets that that was probably the worst David because they fit Redan grinded late. But they gave it a spec bump they took away over called Kohl's basically putting so the Medicare in it. And and everybody said it was on the power mega-prize, not many twenty fourteen been the same. The the new one is effectively looks exactly the same which shocker apple doesn't do any kind of design anymore in God. Thank you that. I'm ticked off about it. I'll be honest. No. Because they have done anything. They would have made it smaller. And nobody looks the macbook air MAC mini goes, you know, what I can pieces CB. Yeah. They would have made it small, and they probably would have dropped more polls off air, and then everyone would have been ticked off. I think leaving alone change the color. So you know, that it's different machine is fine. I Victor should've made a cube. Yeah. They're willing to do that don't make things bigger true. All they have in in the apple design headquarters bacon slices. So they can slice Fleiss slice slice edges on. Finna? Can we make it round this corner for here? Well, let's be honest, though, it is a different color, and that's why it took five years or four years. Tough mates. They get the right shoulder. It's a six core eighth generation into a core. I five boosts up to four point one gigahertz, but standard is a three gigahertz. Yeah. It comes standard for eleven. I'm sorry for one thousand ninety nine dollars. So it's hundred bucks more than the last one. You get a whole Wapping eight gigs of ram. The Intel you HD graphics six thirty card, which isn't great. Wapping two hundred fifty six gigabyte SSD storage gigabit Ethernet. That's the standard specs. Yeah. Is it is it is found one ten ninety nine cheek one. Yeah. They do don't they? Yeah. I was looking at the got the three point six quad core for seventy nine. So that's actually a bad now. Yeah. I say this. I think they'd go this one. Exactly, right. I think I agree. That's a good. I think we're starting MAC. Yeah. Exactly. And there is a there always has been a place for a desktop without without a screen size. The only MAC so wonderful machines. But not everybody wants to buy a new screen, maybe time they've computer. This is you know, it's got the fast DDR for memory in it too. Which is a welcome. It's got three thunderbolt three which also USB seaports HDMI two point in available. Ten gigabit either. The either that's not on the seventy nine one, and you can get up to two terabytes of storage and up to sixty four gigs of ram now. If you max this thing out, you might as well, just wait and get a MAC pro. Exactly. But you know, what I think people are going to use these as desktop development. Sand by Dacia machines. And that sort of thing, I think moving up the product line in price giving it more performance. And you know, this is this is competitive performance for desktop, computer. Now. Well, I do at the seventy ninety one hundred twenty gig of storage. That's swelled again. Will that say strategy? That is the is the lady might you up. Right type thing, you know. It's so look, I'm sure you so call have you? You know, they're trying to price point vision. I quit on you. Your say actually, give anyone the muffler. No. Well, I really I know that I know that that is the thing in the car industry among so so manufacturers. This is the same on the thing is right. I'm just saying this is what they do. The the problem is at least with the MAC mini can upgrade you can get up. They do recommend you get out graded by somebody else an analogy from the previous mobile even been inside the many. It's a bad. It's it's because it's so small it's really difficult to get to what you need to get to talk. Right. So you cannot grade the memory cannot grade yeses yourself, but the thing is vice on the day that you don't have to pay full prices. At least a good thing problem with the MAC book air is the because it uses the touch ID, and it has to chip in it, you're not going to be great. Yes to yourself because it's going to be tied to that t- to chip Nikon. Just stick anyone in is basically, it's it's like the is like the I'm at pry. So that is a problem because if you buy one of those into one twenty eight gig machines, he decide he right in brothel take ticks later on you'll probably gonna struggle while I think by the one twenty eight you're immediately by external thunderbolts USB drive to slap yet to it. Because that's where you're gonna have all your storage in the SST is just the operating system and core amp. Applications like safari, or you know, the thing your Email stuff like that. Maybe not even Email to your power Email us like me. You're gonna Philip storage court with your. Anybody anybody with a photo collection? You can I will say that. For seven ninety nine. If if someone just needs a little, computer. You know, they don't need a media server, although it would work great for that. If you put extra hard drive on it. If you just need a little computer for browsing the internet and Email social media, that's an attractive. It's got built an H E M I C scope, pick up a cheap hundred fifty dollar twenty four inch LCD at best buy or somewhere, Amazon and you've got a fine, lower, computer. And they all come with a keyboard. And a mouse. You're all set. The Matt mini doesn't come Kayla. Mousa? I thought it could. I never used this. Did they never used that was the whole point is bring your on chemo to mass Mersa? I thought they let me go. They. Overview certainly used to let's see scrolling through strengthened numbers. One two three four thunderbolt see. Either. This is the top line one. Hey, they still have a headphone Jack. There you go. It doesn't say anything. They certainly never used. So that will be a change of. Thank you read somewhere that did. But maybe I'm obviously, I think incorrect. Yeah. It will be cool up send the bulks. Yeah. I'm looking in the bolts and that many Anna penalty temps, keeping a message shake well. Well, again, just go buy a wireless. Keyboard mouse, if you want that those were nothing, so I think that this was a worthy upgrade. I'm hoping that they keep the specs more updated than they have in the past. Because I think that the MAC mini is kind of the unheralded little computer that people never talk about when. I think for quite honestly. It's more computer, the most people probably need with how much you're using tablets and phones and all that now. Oh, yeah. I think it would be a fine upgrade one thing. In. I'm going to just pick the seven ninety nine one. And I'm going to say all right. You know what though? Eight gigs of ram David isn't. That's pretty Nemec. I I don't think I can handle. Gigs haram. I mean anymore random that. I need thirty two gigs. I think that's that that make it a good machine. Don't you think thirty two gigs of ram here? Six hundred dollars. Except hold on a second. Our sponsor ODBC sent this Email out to me, they have ram already to go for the new MAC many. A thirty two gig upgrade from apple six hundred dollars. Would it be three hundred twenty nine dollars? Yup. Presume not the full us while we send them in the Matt probably, but it looks like it's pretty easy to upgrade the the ram on these yet. Does the state that song? Exactly. So we do wanna think our sponsor for already getting ready to to get this out there. Actually, it's coming out on November eight eight the night. So if you order, the new MAC mini, don't don't get apples upgrade on the ram seriously. Especially don't get the thirty two. It's it's almost fifty percent. If you trade in your other ram that you pull out of your MAC mini. It's fifty percent. The savy another five percent. So order the gig or eight gigabytes of ram get the ram upgrade from ought to be safe. You wanna go all the way to by the way, sixty four gigabytes who that is fourteen hundred dollars from apple. One thousand seventy nine dollars from ODBC so say twenty five percent. So, you know, this is why I like. And this isn't just about to see right now. Obviously, we love Maxine sponsor the show. But this is why we love the third parties. And we we talked about just few weeks ago the right to upgrade the right to repair. This is why because you get. Ripped off from a company like apple that's charging that much money for stick Aram. It's ridiculous. Well, yes is just like any manufacturer apples axe again. Yeah. Going going going about the calls. Night. If you buy your nice island, Wales Ol-. Anything like that? But you any anything this this kind of customizable, by the data, and you're gonna pay money for those compared to fit. But the the yes, or no, let's you buy an entry level car. And you have no heated leather seats in it. You can get it from you know, Toyota Chevy ear audio whoever as an upgrade or you can do it through a really good third party in. It's just it's not as it's not the same. It's cut. Whereas. This is the so he can get different. Yeah. You know what I mean? So there's a little bit of a difference. But still I mean thirty two gigabytes of ram for three twenty nine come on. Apple give me a break that is not a six hundred dollar upgrade. So keep in mind, folks. If you're finally like, yes, I'm going to give new Mak. Many don't upgrade the ram through apple. The processor Scherf you want to the SSD probably way you're gonna get an update although two terabytes Vesti's sixteen hundred dollars despite to the MAC minis. Well, yeah, I mean at at that point you're in the hole so much so that she makes money down gave up on it crime up. So I think this is a worthy update. I'm looking forward. To would I have to replace my I MAC, this is probably the rod. I'm gonna go at this point. I think I get a MAC mini next because it's got all the external I need to plug in pretty much everything I've got and I've got a a hub that I plug into. So yeah, you've already gotten back on that to show spring. So you've already go screaming I hardly ever use the I mech screen. Yeah. This is the same the same reason why Heim run, you know, an all pry because it doesn't hang on today. Exactly. The last date from apple of course is the new ipad. And I'll be honest with you, David. This is the one that I was least excited about reading. It was one of those. Yes. Okay. It's too big. Yeah. It's I think it's great that they've they've taken the what they lent from the ten and they've applauded see. I had. I think he's good shows that they are so committed that products. They all clearly with the taking here in terms of software. They showed they've changed the lightning FEMA spec- trying to position the ipad private is they the conduct. They competes replacement template. It's more competitor. And Apple's mind to surface. I think that is apple surface. Although obviously the ipad came out first, but the surface has been extremely icy surfaces in the while all the time. Now, I really. Almost as much as I see laptops until continue alma safest guide. You know, what it's great the great right tablet on the surface prosecute as well. Pretty re won't they haven't been the pretty we price. Econo-? No. Unlike Apple's mobile product line, they aren't you know, what you getting pretty clear. Yeah. The difficulty I have with. Very cute to ten round against the Diane saying, the prices Neil pen, pro of thoughts to the ninety cent of the laptops in the market. I mean, yeah, right fine. But the point is at the at the moment. This is a nice upgrade. I think making the screens laundry in the same. Spices of good thing today. I think the USB is good thing today. I think if ice days great thing today. My set this guy, by the way on the sci-fi saw day. They've got it in on it. What's the point? Is that use coal that power? And every every time they upgraded that make it more powerful. But the problem is is still runs the same software as the entry level three twenty nine on the yet the difficulties you've got all that power. And you really can't do anything to use it. You certainly can't compete with the surface pro no because multitasking path still Pannonia it works. It feels like this is what can against you. It's because it was designed for that. Exactly. There's a reason that apple had the MAC OS and I o s and they're developing them. There's some crossover don't get me wrong. But they are two separate products to solve two separate problems. And they're trying to now shoehorn the ipad and s into a service type of computer. And it's just not that thing. It's just not. So he's the problem. Right. So when the first I price came out, the top one nine I had one I had few friends that had one and I still Roca template five nights that you love. So do I. Yeah. To be honest with you. I mean, you could say a wife everything doing while. I had to do the on the on the line, Pat, which is probably true. But the point as the eight I don't mind spending a little bit more because it is my primary computer, the computer tendency for anything so to being to have the prime model with Nassir screened in all of that is with while. Yeah. The difficulty I have is I have tried and I have friends who tried to use an ipad as that only competing vase for work, and they come just doesn't do it. And it's because that mulch toss case difficult, you know, they might the big deal company is about the drug control thinking about this. Hell the first MAC had drag in cannot tonight you fol- yet. The difficulties IS as it currently stands doesn't that what he wants to be. It's no suitable as a pro. And anyone you end up. So the program is probably you end up with all that power. And you still running one time you still can't run stuff in the background properly. You still do you don't have doing. Now, you don't have storage management that you can use. Yeah. An external hard drive where your work is. And no doesn't work that you still come to what we're doing now where on recording likely and still come the session with you have to you can't do that in the I pet pry yet. Despite the fact that has that incredibly powerful processor in had nice sent Foshan the woman over this whole thing. The problem is is have enough Rory. And then when you get any fund this team, you will use fund the next control. How you healed? Anew expensive to draw that and you know, the guys like his max toys ferry Kevi Tate. She who basically uses the paddle time, and he's written. Some fascinating all schools about said policy apps of what Karan's and scripts of wet flood is all these different things. He's done to basically make it work like pizza, right? But he's had to put hundreds of hours of tonight. Again, we the benefit. I don't get me wrong. I think very watching joys doing that. And it's very interesting that you can stuff, but yet, but who has the time to do that we will devices to just do this out the ball. And that's the problem is syphilis pro does everything that people wanted to out of the box. The I'd have probably dozen and this is the issue of call. If apple keeps positioning it as a laptop replacement, and that's to me. That's where the problem is not the capabilities of the ipad is the problem. It's where apple pretending that the product is going to go and they've done everything in their possible to make it. So it can't really do that. Yeah. I think the problem is if apple really wants to become the next find God competing. They have to within the next year. Basically create a pro vision of Louis for the pet prize with different ages moral Tamaz to bake. They don't do that. I think this product is going to struggle because it's again is hundred fifty dollars more expensive than the previous one yet. So they pushed the prices up again. And then you know, and I looking at ten half inch pro at the minute. I'm I think. This'll really since if amaze want great, no because it does everything my current one. It's kind of what I said. Way back on OBT obesity radio. When I started that. I think that was the first version. Yes. So one point. Oh, when I did the first episode of that talking about the ipad that was just released. I got one. And I was so excited. And I said a lot of people are decrying this as just a larger I phone, and I said, that's exactly right. That's what I want. It's still now to its detriment. According to apple PR, it's still just a large screen iphone? That's what it is. And you can't take something that you made to be one thing and magically turning into something else when you're still running the same Wes because what we would like to see as a true surface competitor. Being the ipad isn't the same OS that the iphone is running because the iphone is it's obviously not a surface. It's a phone. It's, you know, your portable whatever you wanna call it almost a PDA in some respects. That's not what the ipad is. But it is that because it's it's the same. That's why a once sending won't see I have pros today. They wanted to be something. They're not giving any advantage to be there giving it hardware in the world that you could possibly want including the new foldable smart keyboard Newcastle avenue, pencil, a great screen. Still can't no. I don't understand. It's like marketing, an engineering, don't talk or something. Well, I think I think they, you know, if they don't change the IRS keep them, I s keep shoe honing extra template features into it. The problem is the the pace of development, the previous Ventoux slide. Right. Because you need the software to export hardware, and if the IOS team looking at updating IOS for the iphone, and then signed on trying to this stuff on the side on tablet faces. That's just not gonna cut it. So here's here's the question. David. They have MAC OS. They have Iowa. Do they need a third us for a whole at that point? They have laptops, couldn't they just make the MAC a touchscreen. Couldn't the next to be a man air. It's just a screen on. They seem to be waited to the MAC OS cont roms, right? This melt on today. Is not a full-fledged, computer. Yeah. So window SCI fi winding. And it needs to be have much multi background so exposed to use pumping their head against self imposed wall. Either make the ipad. What it what you're professing that it is or make the MAC what it already is just make it more like an ipad bastardisation of the two doesn't work. I also I'm gonna be frustrated this still focused on the on private creative yet. Don't get me. Roll the stuff that pencil fabulous. The first pencils? Great. The second one looks even better. Yeah. The pros on show for an autism for design something on that, you know, brilliant. But the point is that is not a mess. No, you have to, you know, most people sit down compete, and they need to do documents. They need today. The way, you know, his one of the reasons that I can't compete surround swells. My only at home is because even the ipad, pro difficulty have gone safari. And this goes to the core of the problem. We've just been talking websites, and they seem come in. And they think oh, he your mobile device. You get down whipping spirits do everything you on the do one run jump street properly so websites don't work properly. And then you end up unto go all around gonna switch a windows machine run crime. So I cannot really fill in this website to to do what I wanna do. Absolutely. I frequently took my wife doesn't online shopping for groceries, and there are five or six different supermarket chains in the UK that do that. Right. I'm always telling if you're gonna buy groceries online on the I might show you get the app for from the. Grocery store on on the web, right because all the time. You do. I'm web cramps at hallway three. For all on chopping. There's some great mobile apps out. There is still doesn't beat their websites the websites desktop or laptop computers or on a surface is twice as good. If not more. So. Yeah. So so this is this is an issue goal rent power in the in the the new I prize you'll paying for it is they they won't will money. And yet I get push unless you run the vision fight shop or something like you might take to that talent. And and that's the reason why I'm not gonna want great until they change that because I don't need to. That's my pen. Now what year and a half old? I have zero desire to upgrade it. The other thing that would Danny thing. The might me change, it is if I had a halt with with it, right, actually swear. But then been not have a dilemma because I've been on site. Should I have the by the cheap mummy? Yeah. So this is not to say that they aren't impressed with the new ipad. We are. I if someone handed me when I be very happy, and I wouldn't get me wrong for everything just said. Yeah, he'll just said when I go to the store, look it. I'm still gonna be tempted because I know they gonna be thin be lying. They gonna be cool, and they all get attending. And do I wanna sure, but am I willing money to upgrade? Whatever got absolutely not. And as well. Yeah. That same problem would just say talking about the entry level eleven inch. Now, I pry yet comes with sixty four storage. The next up is comes with two hundred fifty six years one you. One thousand dollars. Exactly, you know. And I think that's the other problem with the price that most people who have ipads, also have a laptop or another computer yet. So by putting the ipad off of that price level, basically. Now, scientists somebody right? Okay. You know that all that money shell that thought laptop really good template. You're gonna shell out again. It's huge financial commitment. Exactly. So we had another story we were going to talk about it. But I I don't want to simply because we're worried forty-one minutes into this. And it's the kind of storm. We think we have a good wicket trolling we will day. So we already talked about our sponsor, of course, maximums dot com. So let's jump right into our Wikipedia which. It's it's a so dental. It's amazing that this happened. David. How's it we crazy? It's the MAC mini now. I remember very well. When the MAC mini was released in choose. What was the first one two thousand in two thousand two thousand five thousand five January two thousand five it was released. Now, this was not an Intel machine. This was a power MAC kind of. It was a power PC G four it had a plastic white case that if you see one now, they're almost all yellow. It did have the aluminum body around it though. Playing themselves. And I had one of these. I had the first generation had g foreign is. Even at a time. It was slow. It was low. No question about it. But unlike nowadays, they actually updated fairly often back in the day the risen one came out in January of two thousand and five the head a mid two thousand five upgrade and then another one in September of two thousand five so they were upgrading the sane and make it a little bit better here. And there they went from one point five gigahertz or one point four gigahertz power PC up to one point five. So they were they were increasing it, you know, that originally shipped with two hundred fifty six megs of ram and the one in two thousand and five away. That's the same year cheese. Honey, how do you differentiate the the season upgrade if you will was up to five hundred started at five hundred twelve with expandable to one gigabyte one ho gig. I don't know how we could hukou. We live with more than one gigabytes. So much ram and the coast of cool spot men, they will come in the nautical Dr. Yup. Yup. Slum from on this thing about him. I think it's easy to get. When the minis, how revolutionary was winning kind along Batman you wanted to buy pacey. Yeah. You had to buy a big beige box tower yet if you refused as she might put that to get yourself when you buy from gateway del something while guy, they will probably come down will something like that. You know, they they were both people. Stick them on the desk and kicking them full Dustin on the little thing. And then the might many came along. People could not leave that it was the whole computer. And you know, the funny thing is they launched this in two thousand five with the power PC. But that was right at the transition time of them going to Intel, and they just a year after they originally released it they came out with the early two thousand and six model, which was an Intel processor won't point five gigahertz core solo or a one point six gigahertz core dual and. You know, I think for a lot of people that wanted to dip their feet the hardcore Mak us wanted dipping to the new Intel processors. This was a good way in row inexpensive way of doing. So. Yeah. I mean that say it was the. As an entry level mine. A lot. Yeah. A lot. They was they were. You know, four hundred dollars five hundred dollars something like that. They they could be once you got the hang of the original ones. Remember from Trump site help all yet to use a nine heya to type off the plastic as they have at the head about this. He'll fully plastic tag that held the top on when you were doing it. You thought you would destroy it these horrible cracking crack crack, that's right? But then we'll go to open. It was pretty easy. They would you wanted to that was nice of the rebuild amend the lights of all those that she might hit friendly to to get out sedate. Yeah. These people forget were very popular. I suspect apple goal sideline on the on. The fact that seventy people, laptops, they come in that many something's gonna fight. A why? And. They didn't. So late two thousand nine was the last form factor for that MAC mini in twenty ten with the introduction of the core. Two duo starting price of six ninety nine. This is the MAC mini four dash one. That's the form factor. We still have today. So this four factor came out in twenty ten in our at twenty eight team that they finally updated it, and it's essentially exactly the same form factor. Yes, different. But it's a little dry slot. Yup. Polite anymore, but it's pretty much a site and those ran through late twenty fourteen like we talked about at the beginning where it was essentially a macbook air stuffed into a mini and. You know, we know that it had to sell pretty good because apple kept around for a long time. And then of new ones that just, you know, the really state for the new ones, by the way, November seventh. Remember, this vision back many server? Awesome. It it came with a server app. It was running. Macos ten server. Yeah. Mountain line. I think dance extremely popular in Colo's wall. People that wanted run their own server at a ISP, they just by MAC mini server, and they're only like a couple hundred bucks more than just a regular MAC mini. That's right. Yeah. Yeah. It was really cool. I remember that one point that was one that was double Heintz put an extra driving for the vision. And yeah, they were pretty cool. So that is the MAC mini. It was a. This products been around quite a while. David. I mean at this point, it's thirteen years. So you know for. For those who back in the day. So this was a machine that apple was trying to kill off. Still here buddies. Going strong. Yeah. That's right back by the end the John's on the maggots right today. We're going to wrap up this episode of tech fan. I will see again for another three episodes. Yep. Have I hope you have a good time. I will listen with interest whoever. So what you do. I will be massively behind on news bumps on the combat because two two weeks on the I'm not able to get my news fate. So that's awful. About that. And you smell. I have to step away from the mic for before we wrap up tell me about or tell the listeners about where you're at what you're looking at you did a little bit at the beginning about this pitcher what what is this thing? So. One of the cool things about this feature because on that is that much soft the. Basically celebrating they've come from when that guy when this. So as you will the show they have a series of kind of bedrooms sess up, which shows comment the compete on the thing. So they have one from ninety five oversee cousin have compete on it. But it does have a calendar. Mobile shoving meet with Steve. And it also has. Some. Kind of doodling about how you might come up much. Join the wet market competes together tonight the night company. So he's meant to be safe gates is investing don't treat. The next one is nine thousand nine hundred five and then this hasn't the MP's on the running windows one and. Mike paints, and all of that Seoul stuff that the next box in that. So thank so, they're incentivizing. Why they've come from a win looking guy. I'm one of the stalls down in the actual NYNEX area had on this strikes away because a lights on the from it. It has a I'm sure it's original one of his Klein at basically an old saying ata hundred micro computer has a long because original was a big box. And this is just a flat thing. Yeah. I I guess I'm not all my sometimes I think the ones with the Muslim Klein she can disconnect the front in the guts of it. And anyway, whatever it's the switch bold for the for the hundred and they have instructions from the thing is running the basic that Mike self develops full the outset hundred which Roenick because you know, we just lost Paul Ellen could go, and that this was how Microsoft got started in when he wakes to somebody else and bought an operating system to run the al-tair. Well, that was for IBM that was the IBM PC. All the all tear that wouldn't convinced Bill Gates to drop out of college. And do this computer thing. That's right. So they haven't and they actually have some basic instructions in front of it to she tell you how this program something on definitely gonna Sean tomorrow. It was a bit busy today is the show notes pitcher. It's kind of funny that the machine right behind. It's MAC pro. Interesting. She mocks coference. How many max you say this quite a few them? Well, then the frustration that apple took so long to upgrade the MAC book air knowing how many people use their, laptops. Yep. I don't I don't get it. Yeah. But this this this devices, they thing that started much softer than much will not exist tonight announce it it was pretty cool to see that. And I am going to have gun it because I've always wanted. How you ask you program? The thing bearing Monday doesn't have cable or scrape. Switches. Yeah. Seis which is but the mechanics about jihadi that outpour is still at an area of mystery semi on. Yes. No. Yes. No. No. Yes. No. No. Yes. Yes. No guests that that must be it. Yeah. It's pretty much. What it is. If either commit you can get up to that runs. Word easily. It can you can definitely have. No, there might probably. So that we're going to wrap up this episode of tech fan. David fun. Thank you very much speak to say.

Apple David Cohen Intel Tim Robertson Pat Mike paints Twenty twenty Koper Paul Ellen fanny Tommy Kurnia
TechFan 369 - Pandora's Netflix

TechFan

1:09:27 hr | 1 year ago

TechFan 369 - Pandora's Netflix

"When you think of Netflix, you don't think I'm gonna go watch, you know, such such movie that some people do that, but it's about the risen content on network. That's what you get that look for. Tech podcast number three hundred sixty nine tomorrow. Then David Cohen. Hi, David. How are you? I'm not too bad today. Thank you. Good. That's always good to hear. I like to hear at PC were good said of not too bad. Not new bad signifies that, but you're not know things that could be the English ways to we self deprecate and not to with easiest about anything I had initiating today I took. We're going through trying to find colleges for Alexander to do his. I don't know what is called the states. But in here in here in the u. k. most schools, they only teach you out to sixteen and you do you. I ve exams up sixteen dollars JCS's and then you do more halted hot exams, seventeen nineteen could levels. And that's what you used to get yourself into university. So many schools in England now do not do not directly do your A-levels yet to go to the different school. So we've been going around trying to find a school for him. So we've been. Visiting loads of different six colleges try find one, but he likes that has the subjects he wants and that kind of pace to have the right contact Democrats achieved. So we did. We visited fisting this morning, and then we went to an exhibition of bees that we've had haven Mench to. They've had a an art exhibition of the summer where all of these fiberglass sculptures of bees that been painted by different organizations have been put all around the city and the this loss we can. They clicks them. We'll not going to watch the wolof this week. So they had the mall exhibition together. I'm like Olsen ticket has been very nam it with these. So we went to see them all and I had to take roundabout hundred fifty. I find pictures of her in front of every different type of be that the has been on display. So the clone it was fun. Yeah, she enjoyed it. It was pouring rain. So that was that was a slight Dan down, but then it's Manchester, Toby kind of go to expect that. So now I need to pull together a sheet at school. Apparently the kid who comes in with the most pictures with bees is going to win some so price. So she thinks against the all of them that she's she's a sheer in for the price. So I now have to figure out what how to economically print on fifty five pages so she can take them into show them. Yeah, that doesn't sound like. I'm thinking collosal contact print or something like that is the way to go. Actors. Yeah, exactly. You do some of that and you realize that I'm actually quite hard to make those pictures. Interesting. She for some reason she she would behind every these things are about on November five, six feet tall on the plane. And then this little plaque explains the thinking of the artist who's decorated this particular be. Some of them are very, very inventive of stuff about the hit, the industrial history, Manchster, things like that on these quite a few about famous people for Manchester have been put on each other kind of a pun being name. You know. So the real quite good because she would stand exactly same place next to each one and smile. And if you don't care for you end up with basically pitches identical except the color of paint on the bay and the thing on the base on trying to encourage. So you do some different things and take them for different angles on that sort of stuff. But it was hard work. I tried to get the exact same framing every single pitcher and put her in exactly the same freight framing, and then just made a flip book. I did consider that, but then I thought that paps the the autistic approach that might be lost on the school. He could have started on one side and she walks off out different beings and copying her hands and Buffoni. Yeah, exactly. So I take it. You're at home. I'm now yet. I could tell because the listener probably can't hear it because you're recording on your end and I'm recording on my end, but your internet connection is terrible. There is a very good chance. My wife is upstairs watching that flakes and she she doesn't know him here. I was gonna go to the office. Do this today sponge. She just before we came on, I got down there and then found I didn't have my excess call to get into the building. That's come rushing back. So she's probably infancy fat. She's probably Netflix on the net full from it, and that's probably sucking upon bam with enough. You send a cake to me. Well, that's kind of funny because, well, I've got a much better internet connection, but one of Julie's old iphone is becoming Cole's new gore, fight ipod, touch, of course, and I backed it up and then I restored her. I, I should say I nuked her old phone. Uh-huh. And then I restored it from one of his backups from about a month ago. And I don't know while I do know why I was going to say, I backed it up and restarted. It should be fine, but I just remembered. I tunes, of course, doesn't do anything as far as the backup of and settings, and even that's dubious it all has come down from the cloud. So all his games right now are downloading on that. Iphone. Yeah, so, but I mean, I got a pretty good internet connection. Thanks to. Comcast. It works. You know, this is the problem with the cloud thing. You can buy that the Topan phones now five hundred twelve gigabytes all my. If for any reason you had fill out with them 's and then you restore. You've got a big problem. Even you have a very false incident connection. Go to big problem. That's why I don't like this cloud only crap. I think it's bad. Yeah, I could have had his phone restored in and you know, twenty minutes half hour at the most. And instead you just got to. Share bandwith and download everything again. Yeah, it doesn't seem to be particularly very, especially bearing on the apple is all about environments credentials. I mean, dight senses, they cost money to run and sending stuff of incident also caused power. Time energy, all of that stuff. So the fact that they constantly having read download the same thing over and over again for that reason is probably not ideal. No, let's let's stay with a apple for at their last week. I discussed how. The crackdown that I experienced from apple on companies like when I was working for Mexico list, Tom wrote in time, of course, worked for an apple specialist as well. And he sent us this message on Twitter, and he says, my twenty years of experience that I doing pairs apple never questioned us using third party memory and hard disks Rapple. Our experience was not what you'd mentioned him. I agree with David guarding the t to chip the, here's the thing, Tom was tech there. I know. For fact, he wasn't on some of the higher level calls that I was on with a lot of apple specialists and apple. It was a weekly phone conversation that annoys happen weekly, and that's why I know this did happen. I know for fact that apple was threatening all of these companies. Maybe Tom didn't hear about this, maybe his ownership in show this data with him. But apple was absolutely crack. Down on using third party upgrades to the point where they were on the phone, and I could use names for people at apple, but I'm not going to. Threatening to pull. Licenses from companies that were agreed Asli never using apple parts for upgrades or warranty replacements now, understand warranty replacements. That's, you know, it's a warranty item. You gotta you gotta use apple parts that was completely acceptable, but upgrades that's ridiculous. That's something that's out of warranty and has nothing to do with apple. But of course they wanted their cut. So. This wasn't my opinion, Tom. I was in on these very high level discussions, and you know it was ridiculous. There were, it's a chance that maybe they these policies off a have regional, and you know, say, well, his managing. For the Chicago area might have a, which oversees big customer base and and also has more official apple outlets might have a different view on this than somebody who you know in Minneapolis, isn't it? So it was the same route. Yeah, it was covered by the same region? Yes. Right. No, and it wasn't a regional thing because I would be talking to people other apple specialists in Colorado and AirAsia, California, Florida. Heck, we're talking to the same people that were running the one in New York. I'm drawn a blank on their name right now. They're a big one. Completely blanked out. Other name I had a second ago and it's gone. There was actually a lot of discussion before. I, it's hard to not say the guy's name that apple who's in charge of all of us. And then the apple specialist people or the apple care. People would come down to our shops and throw hissy fit when they saw how many third-party hard drives that we would have for upgrading customers, computers. The store that I had built and oak park was what apple care wanted as a model going forward for all apple care facilities, third party. I mean, we had rubber floors. We had amazing lights, great safety features. It was. It was a model of what they wanted. And so apple care. People came to our park store six or seven times in one year, take a lot of pitchers and kinda put together this portfolio of how they want off huger apple specialists to have their service department, anti-static and I mean clean environment, everything just what you would expect, which is a far cry from what. Apple had in their own stores, which I've seen a lot of those in there. Just a. An atrocious mass. So we were the model that apple is trying to, you know, push out there. So I got to be an all lot of these meetings and. And not just awesome apple, but ample and a lot of our competitors and I, I knew what the policy was. I knew what they were threatening and again, this wasn't my opinion. This isn't my opinion. This is fact this is what they said, this is what they were threatening with. So while I respect that, you know, one hundred percent believe that Tom didn't experience. Those time was tech there. He wasn't in on these high level meetings or if he was, he never told me about him and if he was and he would know that this is what apple was threatening because that's how it was. Apple was not happy with any apple specialist, choosing any parts and any Apple computer regardless of age that wasn't from ample that wasn't authorized by ample to be used. Then we're just talking about stuff like a Western Digital hard-drive. Well, apple used Western Digital harder is, but, oh, no, it's not the right one. You gotta use these. You can't use those. Don't go to Ingram micro to get your. Your memory in your Har hard drives or through apple? It was. It was bizarre. It was insult- in apple got their cut, but it meant that the apple specialist would make. I'm not kidding seventy. Five percent less by using the apple hard-drive rather than when we can get Ingram micro. Not as well. You kind of your charging the customer more for dense as well. He go. A Paul says Qassam. Worse than that really disadvantage in customers who have listened technical knowledge because they're, they're the people who can't go out and do their own thing. Well, beyond. Apple would only at the time. Let's say they would only offer five hundred gigabyte hard drive the customer wanted to one terabyte hard drive. Well, what do you do then you apple didn't supply that, so you had to get enough on. So it was it was ridiculous. There were work around one of the work around that. I know at least one other apple special is using was they would sell the hard drive over the counter to the customer. And then the customer would say, oh, by the way, I want to have you guys do this work for me and hand them the hard-drive. Yeah. Now. Well, now it's customer supplied part, so whereas the problem there, so that was kind of sneaky workaround, but. Look at the way apple machines have gone. Now in the they are increasingly less and less easily serviceable and even specialist counter anything. You can't do anything with salted in ram soul, the dynasties effectively. That point your upgrade options are off the table. Well, yes or no. Our sponsor does stuff like that though. Yeah. Offer Maxine offers the the ability to send in your hard drive or your computer threat on the bottom of their homepage. It's what's it called here. ODBC upgrade service upgrade your MAC with certified professional installation. I MAC pro MAC pro, I MAC mini the, send them your products and they will do it because some of those things are hot it on there. And the average mortal probably doesn't wanna start soldering inside their MAC pro. Have to the soul soldiering we're talking about, it's not stuffy with your radio shack. Soldiering on you need specialists Queant to diesel to ramp from a mother, bold. Exactly. Yeah. So thanks for the feedback. Tom, you know, gives us chance to hit on this subject yet again, I maintain what I said, oh, it's I, I know Apple's practices were I know why they were doing it. I know the excuses that they gave and I knew how they were threatening to crack down on people. Did they ever threat? Do they ever crackdown on us? No, to my knowledge to the our crackdown on anybody know. As far as I know they, they never impose that penalty on anybody. The point I do remember actually this MAC, I'm using them. I a retina macbook pro, the battery changing this by that policy when I first bought it because the Rishon battery was pretty weak. I thought secondhand. I had it changed by the policy. And then when I took it in because it had a a fault with the thunderbolt pulls the guy, apple said, I was looking for apples to pay to fix this. The guy apple said, well. Some of these been in here and been donor Pez. So I said, oh, have they. Oh yeah, they don't put this together way. We would do it and closed in what we're doing. Any kind of implied that they broke the thunderbolts pools. Even though I knew that wasn't the case. On so said, well, okay, I said, can you fake? Oh, no. We call this now because it's been what's about that policy. Which are kind of on the stand in all that's Bs come on. No, that's right. Look, I. One respect. I can't understand it because potentially they for napleton view going. Some of these been in here and they didn't know what they were doing. They didn't use all processes than they could've brought another things which if they can come to light during the head, the customer's going to expect foot the Bill full. I'm not saying I agree with that. I understand where they were coming from. It kind of the problem is if you take that extrapolate out to another industry slight, for instance, the car industry you would never ever go into a Toyota dealership with your and then turn around the say, oh, looks like somebody else's change the oil ahead so we can't do any work already more. Yeah, so but but by the same token, what annoyed me about that is that even if they had been prepared to work in the competed, they were talking about for logic, full replacement or five, six hundred pounds. Something on that essentially with percents you the value of the computer. And I sent to a third penalty guy. I think at some mission on the show on, I think it costs about seventy pounds of the polls fixed. Well, what he did, what what would have done? He basically descended the pools of the board and sold it. You own Chandler, king job done. Well, that kind of plays right into Russ and Johnny MO sentas. As feedback for last week show about an investigation and they both sent the same one nemo's sent one or Ross set. One that I think was half of the episode nemo sent the full Warner reverse. I don't remember which who sent what, but it was basically the same thing. But in Canada, they went undercover this news organization because they were getting a ton of complaints from customers saying that apple is trying to sell them new hardware set of fixing the existing hardware saying that while it's not worth fixing the old one because look at how much it's gonna cost. You should just by new one. These are the things that people accused apple of and the diehard apple fans say, all that doesn't happen. That's not that's not ampoules way while this news organization and granted, this was one case they went into an apple store. And the guy basically said he has replaced the whole screen and maybe the motherboard and something else. Olo it's not going to be covered under warranty because the liquid sensors had been triggered the red now. And of course humidity can do that doesn't mean sell spilled in there. And he took it to third party who fixed it literally for nothing because it was a pin out of place, connecting the back lighting to the motherboard. And he said he wouldn't even charge a customer for that. It was obvious. He looked under a microscope, saw it and said, yeah, fixed it bent the back and good ago and yet apples trying to say that well, it's the cost of Peres is more than a brand new computer. So you know we can do it, but you know you maybe by computer and that goes a long way to substantiating what people have been saying for a long time that ample pushes people. To new hardware rather than making it easy to fix existing hardware. And a lot of people accused apples slowdown, gate, battery gate on exactly that in that apple only reverse course when this came to light that they were intentionally slowing down old iphones. And we talked about this too, and I still don't. I still don't buy apples excuse that. Oh, we did this to to help customers get more battery life from their phones. Really? That's your excuse? Oh, no, this is this is this is a, this is a benefit. Are you kidding me? We're? We're not slowing them down. So you think you need a new iphone really? There was no dialogue like your phone is going to be slow because your battery is going bad. Nothing like that. They just arbitrarily decide to slow people's phones down. They reached into their phones that people had paid money for they own and and purposely slow them down. Now, I know at the time. You are arguing like, well, yeah, but you gotta look at it from Apple's perspective. I don't because they were grinding sales. Two new iphones does apple report, how many iphones that they repair or do they report profitability on how many new iphones they sell. Technet right. Having said that. You'd look, they lost the loss keynote and they actually made a point of saying they were trying to make that devices loss lower. Sure. Now after these reports keep coming out and. Phone. So they would buy new ones so that they could have just doubled down on it and said, no, it's industry practice, and we know what we're doing. Everything set the rivers. Cool. So at least give them that that they whatever you feel about the most facials behind it, they have at least change their mind and change the view, and let's face it. The lost king up. There was no need for them to make an environmental statement about how long they won't that device. It some Allston yet they did. So what the outcome of this is in fact that they've changed cools on that, then at least they've had the humility to change cools even better if they actually have changed course. Yeah. But yet the right to repair issue is still there that Apple's still making phones and computers that you can't repair yourself and that if you avoid the warranty and that'd be fine. I set that set that that he's the industry nowadays. It's basically it's, it's the west nowadays. That doesn't make it right. Yeah. I'm not saying I'm not saying it's right. I completely agree with you. Bob's the, you know, you you go. You go take a surface much surface that's broken a new one to the to the to the monks. Oh, stole on. They will take it off you and they will give you a refund because they can't repay them. Yeah, they certainly can't repent them in the stole they have to be sent off to to, presumably to China's be refurbished. The ones that were repaired? Yeah, most modern consumer electronics alight that. And unfortunately, if you look at plenty of other industries like the clothing industry in the food industry and all these other things, something goes wrong. Yeah. Nowadays they vote to Mayes their supply chain stuff that the cheapest way of dealing with the custom problem is swap out for replacement and environmentally and economically it's crazy. And yet that is where we've got to in today's consumer society, everything is become so cheap. And let's face it with these computers. I know apple lentils are expensive. Yeah, but there are a fraction of what the USA coast, the first apple up socks when they first came out with the equivalent of ten thousand dollars today. Yeah, then now they're now they're quarter of that on some of them are cheaper, and the bureau with that driving down prices and everything to do with that is that it's much easier to have things to be blunt boxes and something goes wrong with them. And you say you need a new one. And the problem is any warranty and they say you need any one, then you will start with anyone role than getting repaired and even more than calls alike that off the time you take collaring says a fault with it and they compete for into it and they figure out what's going wrong. Yeah. And then what they do and I've been through this selfish, they they said, right, where we're gonna to replacing this sensor in the engine. And this war over here on this unit here is they treat modular and they basically. Replaced bits of it until it stalls working the way it's meant to. That's always been the, that's that's. That's always been the case in cars though. Don't think the older cars they knew for fact that it was this thing doing it because that's not accurate that treating health of a human being and fixing a car very similar in that you diagnose the problem. It's most likely this and this because we've seen before, and so we'll replace these things and that should take care of it. And sometimes dude. And sometimes it doesn't. There's no difference. I mean. I agree with you, but the right to repair, I think should be whether it's a difficult repair or not. The right to repair means that you the consumer have a right to repair your equipment, whether you do it yourself for your take to third party without fear of, you know them washing their hands of everything. Now, look, if there's, there's some stipulations to that, of course in there is everything, but I am always gonna come down on the side of the consumer. I just AM. That's who I am in win companies become anti-consumer. That's where I have problems as aunt is apple anti-consumer. No, but I think this business practice of. Hey, somebody else put a battery in here. We can't do anything. No, that's wrong and credit. Credit's due. Apple does go out of their way to reverse course some of these things. But my experience with apple says they have a certain metality and it's. To only the apples benefit most of the time not to the anybody else not to their partners not to. I think we only we, I'm not both recognize on that that I is a cooperation and there is probably one of the mole Reza's come cooperations outlet there. I've said for many, many years and look. I'm a guy who started my MAC magazine back in nineteen ninety five. Okay. That's still going strong that you know, I I've never been a fan of apple as a company because it's a giant company and you're not supposed to be fans of a giant company anymore than you're supposed to be a fan of Exxon Mobil or or British Petroleum. I mean, you're not supposed to, but you can be fans of the culture that has sprung up around that company or that company's products. You could be a fan of the Amiga computer. That doesn't mean that you were a fan of Jack tremendous. At the time you could be a fan of of the, I MAC, but that. Doesn't mean that you get to put Tim cook on some kind of a pedal so that he can do no wrong. There's a difference between the corporate structure in the in the company that makes a product in the culture and the community that springs up around said products. That's why I like going to mackerel expo in the day. That's why I liked going to max stock every year because it's the culture of the people. It's not the culture of the company. It can't be a fan of a company that makes trillions and trillions of dollars. Because guess what money absolutely corrupts on that kind of level. And you know they're a company at the end of the day there they gotta do what's right for their shareholders for themselves. And you know, you look at the reports that's going on right now in Silicon Valley where the wage disparity between those at the top. In those at the bottom are growing larger and larger and larger at a March larger rate than it is in the rest of the United States that people are going homeless in Silicon Valley. And yet the wages in Silicon Valley are going way up, but only the wages for the very top ten percent, you know the, the corporate managers of companies like apple and Microsoft, and well, not myself because not so it kinda valley, but or Netflix or any of these of companies. Those people are making all kinds of money. And yet the people at the bottom, the people say that cleaned the toilets for those companies. They're living in their cars. Yeah. So, no, I'm not a fan of the companies, but I am a fan of. You know the guys who ride it my MAC, you know the guys over at the MAC observer, who do their thing every day that that's the the culture of that is what I'm fan of. So anyways, with talking about Microsoft for second, because you put this in the show notes. I've been reading about this that there's a, there's a update to windows that Microsoft basically pulled up gate upgrade eighteen nine to windows ten. This is the background. This isn't much self nowadays. Lights to pretend that windows ten is a service. So the idea is just constantly upgrade itself in the background as as when they think fit and actually the deal with windows ten, particularly the first couple when it was when it was viable for free for anybody with roll the windows license wells, you had to sign up to these updates. You basically have no way of stopping them in reality every six months or so. They do a bake. You and I would previously call the big release. Yeah, and I'm the, you know, the most was three, which was his code number this one, eight hundred nine was meant to be the next one. And the problem is they started rolling out and on the certain circumstances, people found that all of that document dissipate just pop out grade with it, absolutely is not meant to do. And the problem is, is that as I say, they try very hard not to make out. This is a big release that this is a big deal. They kind of make appear to be a patch, but the thing is is is a full Fettes operate system out great underneath which of course confuses people even more when the computer reboots off the saying it needs update and then for stall stuff has changed sometimes quite substantially changed. And then Secondly, they find a little Kamenz dissipate. Yeah, exactly. So they basically stopped pushing this update out because this problem. And really, this brings the focus on the fact that. Not many companies in cellphone nowadays. Marceau's testing processes pretty weak. It's not robust, and I think this kind of proves is not fit for purpose. They made a big deal a few years ago, it became big news that actually fired most of the people which and test engineering myself, they they scaled down to a much much smaller team. And now they have this. These inside of rings these various different levels of people enthusiasts who meant to test visa tests of film before it comes out. The problem is, of course, is the base test is of the public are not professional engineering tests. They will come on things they think are important. They'll probably know something something that's not. Of course these people aren't being paid. So probably only the most enthusiastic even file bug reports on these basis, and then you are relying on myself to pick up what fits affects your bug report a forum, and. She do something about it and it pays. In this case, plenty people had devised them that this was this under certain circumstances. This dates deletion was happening. They were trying to consolidate some so symbolic link ice or something from an again, an old system of windows used to have this news rages. They were trying to effectively wipe it away and make it more simple. And she, the co for that was bad and Kasan says, it would go, right. Well, let's get rid that directly. Now, ignoring phantom, Philip Difesa and yes, people have fun bug reports, but Mark soft hadn't really noticed it and so haven't fixed it and then went with the fun and release. So all I think you know, it shows that you know. Public based testing. It has a place, but really should not be your only major test for pricing system upgrades, which is what this is. Mm issue. Sickly for yet tickly for Microsoft to kind of light to portray themselves. As you know, the grownups in the room when it comes off writing system, self way, you know, they've always had this thing, whereas, you know, well, apple, apple is fine for the, you know, apple is fine for the, you know, the autistic types and Chromebooks fine for education. But you know here in business we we wanna get real wood on, then you need much of system and then for system like that's come out and basically delete people's data and the difficulty is they all the biggest player in the market. So even if it's someone that they, they blocked apparently was a tiny percentage point, a one percent they use having counts pro. This problem. Uses exactly that's thousands of people, thousands of people, the deleted, you know. You know, I'd be an issue. And unfortunately, even during the process, it actually puts on the screen saying, we're doing an upgrade, don't worry, everything will be back where it was when finished. This goes to show that you know, as great as some of the new current technologies are ended is the some of the new technologies just amazing out there. At the end of the day, you still have to have a local backup of your data. If you're not backing up your data that the bad thing. On a Microsoft or a MAC, or you know, you gotta. You gotta have backup of your stuff because you know, this happens that Microsoft releases us and you're completely screwed except got back up my stuff so. Okay. Well, the problem. Cool is that I think companies same companies, particularly no. From the stats, they receive computers of people use it products. There's no flow backup. Yup. And you know. Kinda like saying, let's use a car analogy and it's like saying to Saint to people by 'cause well, you know what? We airbags in the cause, but you know, you need to Bucky seat Bill. There are a number of people, they customers who they know will never buckle up this seat Bill. You have to protect those people from themselves and what you can't do is say, well, you know if everyone knows you should buckle up seatbelts if you don't buckle up seatbelt well, spent the cost to take you because you know that's not Joe about job tech people who were wedding, this seat bills. It's the same with this. You know, Mark self cannot make changes that delete people's data even though people should have backups. Speaking of backups though. Really should talk to see if they need backup solutions day. Hard to that. That sake way was smooth than malignant oil pooled put on a garage flu. You guys get in OWCP mercury on the go pro, you know, doesn't necessarily have to go anywhere considering your desktop forever, but it's a clear cased hard-drive that you just plug into your drive or your computer up to two terabytes bus powered. So no extra Corey. Just plug into your USB three point, one port and a backup use dragon drop your data. You can use a cool program carbon copy clone or what's the other one distributor and. Super-duper this double or no, that's another order. BC product, isn't it? Yeah. It's easy to back up their free software for you guys to use to back up your data. And if you're not backing up your data, you know, I would say, don't come crying to us, but I've heard the horror stories and I've experienced them when I was at max specialists. As an example, when I was running my own company doing a lot of consulting work that people went back up their data. I told a story way back in the day in early tech fans were a lady broader computer in and she never backed up all her daughters photos were on there. So and she was born and she was like two years old at that point and you turn it on. You can Lurlene here the hard-drive clicking. Click, click, click, click, click dead, you know, you feel terrible for this person. You know, there's, there's companies like Dr savers that you can literally send that hard-drive to and they can cleanroom pull apart the platters and see if they can rescue some data and they actually have a pretty high success rate of doing so. But it's thousands of dollars. What was your daughters. Photos from when she was aboard. The only photos you have of her for the first two years of life is at worst thousands of dollars, maybe maybe. But the thing is a couple of hundred dollars in the backup drive is a much better vestment a whole lot better of I guarantee that lady to this day still backing up. I presume. Cool. SIS, WC drive. You mentioned, we'll look equally well on a windows computer and that's what you wanted to. Oh, absolutely. It's three hard-drive. Plug it in and anybody anybody bearing on say, windows ten, every six months gonna get when these big uprights eighties worth keeping Difesa copied onto a separate USB drive of your windows computer, especially if you have a laptop. Just want the thing. You just won't once a week now, it's as easy that. Windows backup is a pretty terrible terrible program. They used to have a thing that was a bit lot time machine, but they've that case it it because myself. You probably have to pay for some fed policy software or you'll have to do something yourself dragging pool. What have you been? You know what backing up just data is on the computers. Normally pretty easy because the data that is normally in documents folder or something like that, and you just need to back out that volda you done. We do have a Wicky trolling segment this week win a look at net flicks before we get there two weeks ago telling you guys how I got a Pandora's box and that they sent me the wrong one. They sent me a four s and I actually ordered a five s and that they were offering money back at the time and they, I didn't respond to remember. I hadn't responded yet. Well, then they did respond that they actually got some new units in and they sent me another pin box and I have to now David. And you said last week that you. You are actually ordered one. So what did you order would you get? And have you tried it yet? Let's explain what the Pandora's boxes. So go ahead. So the penders effectively as a the original one that she was a jam of old in a convict, big console case with either one or two sets of controls. All k. quality control is so a an eight way joystick and only six right buttons, and it looks. The original ones would designed so that you could open up all k- cabinet takeout the control deck, put this thing in place and then warrior up to the. Melissa and so the then you would basically easy to convert all Kate cabinet into something that would run, you know, hundreds of games now what they've done these they've moved into 'cause became increasing popular. They've moved into stunt model. So you basically you power up, you comes with a to you plug it with Shimon inch TV, turn it on, and you have a al-qaid cabinet appearing on TV display with a menu, much like the retro pie thing we've talked about in the past where you have all these different games on the scroll down the one you want and if it works but the events, this is the, it's very much. These ones are quite orientation tools. The one on one fighting games, conflict streetfighter in king of that sort of thing, which is why they have the double sets of controls as as you said with your with the one you got lost week, very nice that controls feel very positive. Condit. Those feel like. Ann Cates system. And yeah, it's it's really, really good. So yeah, mine arrived and I was promised one with the teen hundred games in it and the system is sold. They, she said, well, have a memory called on the bold. That has thousand games on it, but we'll ship you some a packing called with MU games on it. I think getting that second call so that apparently posting that to me, but. Yeah, quite thousand games games promoted good stuff on my lows. At many memories for me, it would right. You can set it so it has a setting. So the looks. Runs at the standard resolution kind of looks like the original all game stayed with con of pick slighted Moke. Well, they have like a smoothing options trying improve how the graphics local on a high definition television attend the off because I thought it was terrible. That way you can control the the difficulty of the games you can control with. They were kind of like a credit system. We have to press the one play button to move virtual coin suet whether it just free plays the games on there are well, there's a very wide range of stuff from the, I would say probably the mid-eighties on woods. There's none of the tight games on that. The of the classic arcade games pacman, miss pacman, a of the classical games. Okay. Against their on the in luck in a weird Japanese version. So for instance on my one has pacman, but his Co. puck man, which was the original name of Japan and is typically the original Japanese version. So yes to me is playable some of those because those were four controlled up down left right. Troll stick and it doesn't work as well. I played a bit of bigots on with mine and I didn't find it was too bad, but I guess it's gonna depend on the exactly what type of state us and then kind of how out good you are. And and the thing is the, you know, with any of these guys, the initial levels are pretty easy, so that's gonna be problem as you get more into the game and it becomes much more frantic. So yes, that is a problem as a side. These are really designed fully that the the two big time to gains on there all the the Khanda, the Japanese upward scrolling chooses what? Yeah. What they call the the bullet storm games because just saying there's a whole lot of them will middle floor. Exactly. And then the and then say the one on one finding games the the classic game, those on the on my particular favorites are the kind of the the side. Scrolling basam ups, like double dragon, and then some of the branded ones like. Teenage meet niche tinsels couple of x. men games on there and that sort of thing. I, the Simpsons was another one that was that way by your constantly trying to get further to the right into the game as you as you walk along with your characters and enemies coming from me on trying to tacky, and that's fun. Player Stich like colon, I played a few of those games. You know, you don't have to drop quarters arcade, and you just sit there and play for an hour, and it's a lot of fun. That's right. And let's let's you get these gangs. You never saw Neil Kay's. 'cause you never skilled enough? Never had the money enough to cause those types against Radi with the of pace of play because typically you had to be incredibly skilled. So might one call to get you three or four levels in. And of course you know, most people didn't didn't. You know they didn't have the skill straight from the off. So you'd end up feeding these games a little courses just to try and get further into the game. And what they would do is if you die on the screen, you can put a quarter in and pick it up from that point. Ovid's Goss. I was the first game that I remember doing that in. Yeah, kind of a top down. Don't in crawler kit, golden effective, I mean gauntlet, and if the u. a paying for time, because even if you doing nothing, your health would decrease light your room. You know, you were constantly being poisoned dying in that game because you could avoid old amongst this new. It's still die after about two minutes because you health just declines, nothing kind of a party game because it was a four player game. Yeah, original host. Fun, but so how do you like it though? I like awful. I is the whole set. Very cool. The thing lights up when you turn it on changes, colors, changes, colors, all of that. You know, it feels good. It's big chunk is plenty spice, sit to it. It's great. We slapped on the kitchen table, sit up to the big TV we have in the kitchen. I was a, it was fun is kind of overwhelming the number games on there and they just kind of list there's no real organization or anything like that to it. And there are some that you look at anything. I the, you don't even get the the previous. You don't even sure what the game is. All previous? Yeah. A couple of on the pre couple mine. The previous don't pay a word properly. All the the previews just have an screen. Slash. Green screen doesn't really tell you anything about all the games like. So you know, and some games are ridiculous. There's one that your colon, I play your your hands and you're making the little gun with your fingers in the game and like bugs or flying at you, and you're shooting the bugs and you can swat and you can grab. It's absolutely ridiculous. That doesn't play very well at all. But we laughed our butts off for ten minutes playing this game. We'll probably never play again. But for that ten minutes, we were just rolling on the floor. It was so much fun to play and that's what this thing is for. That's what the Pandora boxes for. You can play better with people. What I would say is, you know, you can go to WalMart target and you can spend sixty seventy dollars on some kind of twenty one. This one joystick type guy in the have Tari all Saigo Nintendo. Something like this. We've talked about the Nintendo classics and the classics before. Yeah, this is only a very little. A bit more money than that, and you getting a huge amount of truly all k- quasi games. Now I understand what reading a couple of Reddit bulbs about this. Is that things like the four s and the five s and everything all deemed to be clones of the original Pandora's box. Not JAMA base. They're running emulates linens. The don't see different than the retro pice on ego sets up. The thing is it's all done for you. Don't have to have all you all the technical skill. You need to be able to connect it to TV. Yeah. So that's a benefit right there? Yeah, houna play some old on k. game some old school. Okay. Games and you don't spend money. This is a very, very reasonable way of doing it. I won't want to comment on the galaxy of the games in this system. They one presumes that they are officially licensed. I don't know. They're not. It's a lot of fun. You have the five. S I of course I talked before. That's what I was trying to buy and they sent me a four. Well, my replacement, although I I can keep the other one which now of course is going to go into Cole's room and he's very excited for that. He's going to get the forest. I have that. I'm playing the six s it's got thirteen eighty eight games on there. Many exactly like the four s but there's some other. I don't know what the differences are. I was a little disappointed that mortal Kombat wasn't included. I thought it was. A mine just, yeah, I'd be happy with their original. There's no mortal combat at all, and well, I. To be on. I knew the quite a few king offenses on streetfighter variants. It's kind of curious. Yeah, it's like two pages of king of fighters street fighter, and there's some that you know here in the west, we've never heard of, but it's all good. I enjoy. I don't think it matters which one you get? I think they're all pretty much the same. I, I don't see anything better about the success than the four us the it's ident-. Once you get into it, the menus look a little bit different. But other than that, it's the same thing. So if you're looking at playing some fun stuff jump on, EBay, they've got him on Amazon there at WalMart dot com. They're all over the place. Some bootlegs off of other bootlegs is probably gonna work for you. Just plug it into your TV, plug into outlet, turn it on and have some fun. Now, one thing that she should should address is that the initial question I hadn't. I'm show plenty of all this will have is what happens if you want to add more games to it. This is partly not simple to do. No. And that's why you know it's not, but but you know, the, the nicer of people is that particularly people listen to all show is that they may well want to say, okay, well, now you know, all k- console joystick system with with an emulation smoke game swit-. I've done a bit of searching around and so far is not easy. It does have USB ports on about you kind of, would you be stick, put a stick in and low them up. I haven't found the even wipe doing that yet. So for the moment, you know, if you won't get a by one, these expect to rely on the gazer on their of than addicts wants to it. So our Wiki pedia entry this week is Netflix never did you? Yeah, some. They do someplace some fly by night thing. I, you know their headquarters in Los Gaydos California there founded in nineteen. Ninety-seven stop. Think about that for minute. David nineteen Ninety-seven guess what was not big nineteen ninety seven and that streaming videos over the internet and DVD's were not big. DVD's didn't really hit big big until ninety nine. Yeah, you know this was so they were so early, but it was founded in August on August twenty. Ninth nineteen ninety seven. Marc Randolph pencils, Hastings, this excellent or released that walls in two thousand and one. I think when I was two thousand two thousand one, the next Mexican restaurant on the high street in most castles. Maybe that's when that flicks the day came from. Well, they they, they came up with the idea for Netflix while commuting between their homes and Santa Cruz and pure Astra's headquarters in Sunnyvale while waiting for government regulators to approve the merger of coupla companies, blah, blah, blah, who cares? Hastings, invested two point, five million and start up cash for net flex, and they knew what they kinda wanna do. They wanted to be they like Amazon, but they wanted to try to sell something over the internet and they rejected VHS tapes because they were too expensive to stock into delicate ship when they heard of DVD's which came out in nineteen ninety seven. That's what they the whole thing was. It was going to sell and rent DVD's by mail. And of course the the selling part went away pretty quick, but the rental. I remember back in the day David. I don't know if the headed over there, but here in the United States. I remember net flex was a big thing and it wasn't streaming. You would subscribe and you'd pick a couple movies and they would ship it to you. You'd watch them put them back in self sealing envelope, pre posted stamped already, and put back in the mailbox and when they got it back, they'd send your next movie in. There were different tiers. I think I was in teary can have up to maybe three or five movies at a time. Well, yeah, the the substantial business income of video and DVD rental Stolz was late face because most people would rent rent a movie and then forget to bring it back on time. But doing many during the journey eighties nineties doing many panic runs way. You realize you've forgotten to pretend the movies, you know, and you wanna get them through the through the into the box of the store before you. You know that they took over and they charge you extra an and the the beauty of Netflix will. Instead of having that, they basically chose you monthly subscription. And then however many films you were entitled hold onto it the time they would send those to you. And then basically you have held on to them until you descend the banks. There's no late fees. He still pay your subscription and you know if there was one movie hadn't if you say you had three discs a three, three tier, and there's one movie go round to washing, then you would just stick it in the show and just make sure to make sure the other two. So you get to more. And then when you were ready, you would watch it funk. It was. It was quite a disruptive, multiple it really kind of that even before streaming along really torpedoed the the blockbuster DVD rental. Will blockbuster offered by net flicks for fifty million dollars at one point. And of course that didn't go through in February. Because you know. Well done. They would acquire killed it. Obsolete of no question in February two thousand seven. The company delivered its billionth DVD and began to move away from its original core business model of DVD's, but interest by introducing video on demand via the internet. Netflix grew as DVD sales from two thousand six to two thousand eleven. Think about this. This is a very brave thing to do. Here's a company that made all of its money in DVD rentals, sending them in the mail, having the foresight to say, you know what? Internet speeds for consumers are going up. Our costs are going down to stream video content. What if we move our company into the streaming service and away from the DVD, the physical hard copies? We think that's the way to go. Now I remember back then when they started making this move, and I didn't know what to think. And for a while, there was a tear where you could get both, and then they moved away from that words, either DVD or streaming. And I was in a conundrum because I really kinda was addicted to getting these things in the mail. But I thought, you know what? I'll I'm gonna try the on demand service only the online service only. And of course like everybody else. I never went back because it just it made way too much sense. Yeah. And I, it was incredibly because the two, the two businesses opponent from the fact that the seven content on not remotely alike the logistics around sending DVD's people demand is nothing like streaming a toll. No, an I remember everybody the ice by to when they announced they were going to do this was somewhat confused because it's it's, it's almost like you know, killing the golden goose. You make you money on DVD's and you say, we're not going to do that anymore, or we gonna move away from that, and we're going to move to some of these going to kill our business if it successful, and yet they pulled it off. And then of course, nowadays you look at Netflix and it's almost even like the they're streaming service second, but there are constant company I, yeah. Where removing TV studio. When you think of Netflix, you don't think I'm gonna go watch, you know, such and such movie Netflix, some people do that, but it's about the regional content on networks. That's what you get net flicks for. Yeah. And actually, I was surprised because I, we, we bought into net flicks only relatively recently. We, we've had an impromptu description for longtime. So we've been using Amazon service and it's Portland, my wife is really struggling. Find anything she wants to watch on Amazon prime anymore, so said, oh, well, you know, let's try net flicks and see whether you like it. I could not believe going on the anew they had shows, but I didn't understand how many shows they have this really good stuff on there that doesn't get any press nobody's ever heard of. And yeah, you watch it and it's great, you know, and here's the funny thing they've been doing this for a while. Here's here's a show for you to watch David. And I, you probably never heard of it and I discovered it first came out on Netflix and I wash, I loved it. I think there's. Only two seasons might be three, but I think it's only two Kolui hammer. It's great. It's a smart guy that goes into kind of undercover or undercover witness protection after reading out. It's it's one of the guys from the sopranos and he plays basically the same character. And it was originally pitched as a spin off the sopranos, but he couldn't get permission. So he just did it this way. Any moves to Lillehammer. And that's the show, and it's it's great. I loved it. And I think it went two or three two or three seasons than it was canceled. I think if it came out now it would be a much bigger hit, but it's one of those things that no one at the time talked about and no one's talked about sense. It's a great series. I loved it. I thought it was fantastic. It was goofy and funny. And when you think they're start going to go serious? Nope. Back to the kind of goofy funny stuff and it was great. So there's one for your net flicks q. people get? Yeah. At Lillehammer to your watch less, you will not regret. It's it's a good time, and the Anna's is what several I'll being she tends what through the whole seasons of all these things. So she's wants several things that kind of wore on mine a US channels that we would never get here the she also pretty little lie. She watched which I think it's Showtime show. Originally, she watched four. A five seasons of teen wolf, which was like a bulletin TV update of teen wolf, the movie, the kind of, you know, has a whole twilight. The young I don't think going on. She enjoyed. You could probably wash the marvel stuff. Yeah. Well, yeah, legally without Dunlavey on torn and one of the things on like also like about that flakes is that unlike of the services there. They kind of have it that they really understand the audio that you know the apps, the epi spirits, to sign Crossley platforms, and she's need to be the same across oleo platforms. So once you have a multi, once you have a multi-diverse subscription because initially we were on just let you run at one device. Once you had a multi description, it's it's trivial to download stuff for offline viewing, and it's quick the the video files are up to my. They look right, and yet they're not long. It's it's easy to use you all the formation. You want about the different episodes, you know. So you get the plot summary if you get the cost, you get all the site and stuff you get on. The other platforms is really slickly weld on Netflix is the model of streaming service. We're about to be within the next three years buried buried in subscription service video on demand stuff. I mean, if you think it's big now. Just to wait, man, you know, almost every major broadcasting network is coming out with their own stuff. Disney's coming out with their stuff Warner Brothers coming out with like DC universe. I mean, I, it's going to be huge at n. of all of them coming out, even CBS has their CBS now that the only thing worth watching, of course, as the new Star Trek series, which is really good. The only one that I think I'm going to subscribe to, and and I also have Amazon prime, but their offerings or nothing, just nothing compared to Netflix, it's it's a, it's a shadow of what Netflix offers is going to be the the Disney thing. You know, John Fabrio is creating the man DeLorean a new Star Wars base series for that platform. Marvel series is going to be on there. Yep. That's going to be the big one. Yeah, we'll suppose great about Netflix in the UK is that a lot of these services on vailab outside the US a carry on that flicks outside the US. So for instance, the CBS Alexis channel which is viable outside the US, which has the new Star Trek discovery series on on the net flicks. So I was able to watch that on new kind Netflix, no problem. So I hope that continues. I hope that they don't end up losing only services the place, not all of them. Well, I think there's going to be a crash on these services and five years in in two and a half. Well, I'm gonna go in less than two years. You're gonna have a huge selection of these, and I think within four years, half of them will fall off and they'll partner up with places like Amazon or Hulu or net flex because you just can't have this many. I mean, there's only so many hours in the day that people can devote to watching this kind of stuff. And I, you know. P. one of the benefits are, hey, I can subscribe to Netflix and YouTube live TV, and I don't really need my cable box at home anymore. But then you start adding more and more of these kind of channels of a sudden, you might as well have your cable box at home because it's cheaper than all these subscription services. So I think there's going to be a an explosion of growth and then a big const. What's word today? Shen consolidation. Thank you. I can't completely drip like there in the same market within a few years because without original content, you're not going to succeed and guess what original content is very expensive. So I think that's what's going to happen. That's my prediction ship. Interesting. While we're talking about net flicks news yesterday that they've canceled on fist. Yeah, I'm okay. I see. I'm not. I'm joined the first season of on fist, even though I thought it was terrible. You didn't like it. I, even though I saw that she joy it hurt. The second season was much much better than the first season. So yeah, it is, but that's not saying a lot in the first season, they told a to episode story and what ten episodes is so long drawn out and I didn't care at all about any of the characters. They were all boring second season almost the same thing mildly better, except the last episode is really good in the last ten minutes of the last episode sets up what's supposed to happen. And that was by far the best thing that I it ever done. And of course I was cancelled, although I think it's going to be resurrected him Disney or you're going to see the continuation other marvel shows it was by far not even close the weakest of the marvel Netflix series. I don't mind that they cancelled it all. I'm fine with that. Yeah. Yup, because Luke cage the first season much better. Second season, Luke cage is not that good. The first two seasons. Daredevil were just brilliant. The defenders was okay, but it was a way of what happened. I the problem fend is actually their decision on all of these focus on the hand was a mistake as well. They've got past that now, which is good. They have, yeah, but it was just it. It just wasn't. They wouldn't exciting villain. Meant to be so lethal yet they wouldn't lethal because of the pacing issues with the shows is that those long periods of time when the to be doing the, you know, the villains appeared to be doing very little. And then of course, every time they would set somebody up as a big bad, then they get defeated and you on though they don't the big bad this somebody else's big path. How many these guys have all these big bads and yet get none of seaman also everything that seemed to be dreadfully long winded comforted. Well, I just don't understand why each season had to have. You know, it's basically one big story. Daredevil season two was smart, and that it was almost two different sees seasons, and then they, they combine them at the very end. Half of it is the Electra story. And the other half is the punisher story, which is great. And then they bring it together at the end. Brilliant, I loved it. I don't understand why they can't have standalone episodes in the series that would make it so much better like a comic book or perhaps look think about defenders. Okay. The episode one episode wanted defenders. It's it's daredevil teaming up. The next one is Jessica Jones and daredevil. The next one is Iran fist and Luke cage. Jin it's called heroes for hire, and there can be some common thread between them, but they're stand alone that would have been just growing, but I don't. COMEX. And of course, you know the COMEX as well too much you know, in in in a run, they might do two or three overlapping stories. Having just one great. We long story. Yeah, so yeah, it is. It is a problem with with those types of shows. I mean much. I love the punisher series. It was amazing how often he got beaten very nearly today. Two, two or three episodes and the, you know it was. It was like, oh, come on, give the guy. It was. It was amazing. Yeah. All right. With that, we're going to wrap up this episode of tech fan, three sixty nine. We do encourage you to send us feedback. It's the show at tech fan podcast dot com. Of course you can send us feedback on social media, Twitter, where tech podcast you can leave show. Note it either my Makamure tech van podcast calm, and we'd love to hear from you guys read your feedback right here on the show. Thanks to Russ and Nimmo for sending in the same video. That was really good. I enjoyed it. And of course things the time for sending in his disagreement of. What I described at the beginning of the show about apple. We will see you next week next week, David. Yeah, should be should be okay.

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TechFan 437 - Too Much Money

TechFan

1:05:03 hr | 1 d ago

TechFan 437 - Too Much Money

"You're listening to another great podcast in the my Mac podcasting network, bridge. It's time for tech. PODCAST number four, hundred, thirty, seven early on a Sunday morning joined by David Cohen David and lunchtime here. Yeah, it's not here I'm still tied. Didn't sleep. Well, last night happens he was halt here. It's been hot. He lost couple of days. So it's been difficult seatbelt laws. Lime had that thing where the weather change during the night. So we had all the windows I. We had the fans on. Come them in like -absolutely freezing. Yeah. Me Up the guy neither snipes conditioning fitted. which at the time? They had it done is to start is split. It's one of those split systems, which is obviously just covering one room I think it's their main bedroom they have in and at the time they had a dummy Phil what they want to spend that money for those ugly on the side, the house. Now. It's Casale taking. Wonder. If they have a number for that Guy Neha. Global warming. Yeah permit say conditioning just Mesa global warming West isn't it? That's the problem. Catch me not. I'll. Can't come home from work and sweat. Well, it's against my religion I I know exactly what you mean don't get me wrong having grown up spending some in Florida amid deep deep lover of air conditioning. The. Problem is is realistically here in Britain even as the climate warms, we don't get enough about whether suggestive having air. I don't know and still have it. Pragmatist. Buildings to house fine bit adding onto the houses the on designed for it it. Yeah. It looks like the guys guys house the back of his house novels like like one those office park outlets you know. Me Up with those ugly boxes hanging on the outside and. I'd take it I don't care. Australia what she'd say. Well she always us too cold. I'm always too high. So that's all upon the promise on this thou they off does not end up for machinery to come. So low-tech stuff going on in the world right now Elliott I mean obviously the whole. trump administration wants to ban tick tock which I'm. GOING TO BE CHALLENGED in court. Exactly I'm no lover of Tiktok I think generally it's a stupid system. I don't want to see it banned I think that's it to an. All, the land of the free, the home of the brave the bastion of free speech for for the guy who loves to do all these policy on twitter, it'd be banning a different such network is slightly hilarious. Well, he he's trying to blame the order Chinese spyware bubble blah. It's about him him getting trolled Costa as an also, it's about him wanting to look strong against China in the run-up election year but I'll eat zone achy doesn't mean anything. you know I don't doubt even the Chinese sources particularly annoyed with him about Tiktok was you know day care that that stupid thing is. Whether TIKTOK is stealing data or not I don't know probably not though because I would imagine most of the users, Tiktok not high value targets but the data that tiktok collects just from people using the services fall more valuable and many spicy Chris they steal because that social media dancers gold. Yes and we're and we've already given up that ghost to you know exactly four to five other social media sites that we use on a daily basis yet. I mean it. It's. It this is just pure politics. It is an as yet. It is stupid and always banning chant which nobody uses. In. America what is it? All right. He's He's just. It's Asinine. Well Yeah. Trump definitely puts the astronaut asinine. Well, talk about Asinine Yeah. Disney. This cool movie that looks like I'll be honest I kind of want to see the movie the trailers make it look kind of bad ass it does though having said that I mean it's it's one of these. We're talking about Moulin, which is one of these live action remakes that Disney has launched on few years. This one actually looks like it's worth a live action remake. I was original movie was kind of under rice it and because that whole kind of. You Chinese Warrior tripe type thing is pretty cool. Anyway, it's in modern times. It's an empowering story. It's about a woman who he wants to make away in a man's world for what she believes is right You know it's good stuff however. For the Disney to what's going, he was Disney's by saying is going straight to video on Disney plus. But if you WANNA, which is fine. Yeah which is fine. You'll have to pay thirty dollars to rent thirty thirty dollars. Now at first, it wasn't clear wait this is a thirty dollar rental are you out of your mind? when you put into context of actually going to see it even just two people and getting popcorn and city out. It's GONNA cost more than thirty bucks but fine. It's not a rental. They're saying you're actually purchasing it and you own it. Oh, but only as long as you're Disney plus subscriber. If you become an if you unsubscribe than this movie, you technically own, you can't watch anymore without subscribing to the service. So this is I. Think. Quite. Honestly. an executive decision that wasn't run by anybody run by anybody. And they just put it out there they could. Well, this is a good idea and they are scrambling now because the the backlash has been pretty brutal said this to it's to from all I can understand how they how they were is out they basically look to what they thought the expected gross of Moulin would be. Yeah and then they said, okay, we're not going to get that gross because people on goes through phases. So how can we get money back? We can do we can put on Disney plus it promote Disney plus subscriptions, and also we can charge for it how much we charge for and then they did the thing where they said well, family forego some movie theaters. You know that's like a fifty sixty dollars value. So we do for off that that does piddly gonNA. Love that and it's like, no because people on comparing it to go into the movie theaters they comparing it to renting it for two one, thousand, nine hundred, Archie Exert. Going well, Hey, tudent any a fifty dollars for one movie. All it's doing showing how expensive to the movie theater is but the problem is and we talked about this last week there are other benefits. To go yet, the movie theater, you get an out, you might be going on a date. You might go get a meal guess what this is the call. I get to angrily glare the guy behind me in doesn't know how to be quiet yet. We talked about the downsides against the movie season but some people like no Muss I, recreate it with call every now. Who? Nothing. Some people like the sticky floors and the schimmel hygiene and the overpriced concessions, but the point is. We can about that. But some people do actually like that. They prepared to pay for all of that because they experience it goes the movie theater right and the problem is if you charge them a good portion of that, but they're still sound. Yet then the GonNa go why should I pay thirty dollars now to watch this movie when in a few months six months year wherever it will be on the service anyway. That's the thing. No, you buy it and you wait three months and then it's on Disney plus to watch for free old all they never put Disney class and based yet means they take Putting it in an era in the hall, all their future content plans because once they if they if they don't want to do that, then they have to say once you've rented it for thirty dollars rented a house we can never offer it for free on the service because all those people patriot. I'm. That's really that's normally annoy of you feel. Now yet but in six months, twelve months, eighteen months I'm however long it is when it starts streaming service for free, you gotta be annoyed with them again. Here here's the counter to it which I don't agree with by the way, but I'm gonNA present the counter to this argument. New Star Wars movie comes on the theaters. We all go. Watch it. Three and a half months later it comes out on. on demand video and you can buy it for ten bucks fifteen bucks on itunes. Knowing Damn, well, that it's GonNa hit all the free services well. Subscription services for you to watch for free in quotes two months after that but yet. We still go and buy the latest star. Wars movie and Itunes or the new avengers movie. We still do that because we don't WanNA. Wait another three months to watch it. I'm not dreaming service. I completely agree with that sentiment but there you hit the other flaw in his plan that is today you talking about a new stalls, maybe not flipping Moulin. Hauled you may you may say Mulan Derogatory even though I think it looks good but this isn't the movie to set the president's with no that's exactly what I mean. This is the this is not the biggest blockbuster. The people are desperate to see if you did this with the next with the next marvel movie or the next Star Wars movie while I was still have some of the same questions. About the pricing in the strategy, everything that I could lease understand it. Because one thing we've learned from this is effective with these pay per view. One thing we've lived from pay per view over the years is that it's really make pay-per-view work on cash in you have to have a big hype around big event and I'm sorry but Moulin is it Roy Black widow would've been exactly. Yeah. Speak Maulvi. Fourteen ninety nine as a Disney plus subscriber you can buy. A black, widow. It's GonNa come to the service and three months for free. Well, you know what I when I say for free I mean you don't have to pay anything extra than the already paint and guarantee you would. It would have made a hundred million dollars on Disney plus yeah. Milan is going to be a huge failure. It's GonNa Geared Disney from trying to do this again. In some ways, good in some ways not so good because I personally think with the way things are right now. Disney and An HBO, and they need to have more first run movies rather than going to the theaters. Just released some on inefficient pays extra. That's fine as long as it's I here's the thing what I think. A lot of people are looking at going thirty dollars out of your mind. That's the problem I'll I completely agree and I think. Look that I have to play around models. They've got to figure out something that works we all. As we said on Gigs Pob last week we you know you and I believe that movie theaters are now spiralling down the toilet. and. They're in real trouble. And maybe you were to blame Gosh Dang it. Dammit David they've listened to the podcast you can win you know what? These two idiots has got a point we talked. About So they've got a funding model I. Just don't i. find it hard to believe that a company is savviest Disney can get model as wrong as this because I believe in my heart house that this model is completely wrong. Here I'll give you the example. When the news broke Yeah. My family been looking for to. Mulan. I. I mean again I I agree I, might point the I think the the blockbuster movie audience that Disney? Plaza. Changing. A chasing with this release yet Moulin is not in the movie for them. There's an awful lot of of young young people who will go Mulan Moulana wasn't Ousama kids cartoon under WANNA go see that no matter how good the trial is. Yeah. So that's the wrong thing anyway but my family. My wife and daughter are both. The, both Alden Disney cartoon fans, and they love the Disney stuff and they they've been so happy with Disney plus and when I said. Last. Year said all they're doing a live action Mulan Oh. That sounds cool. Everything Sean see try that. She thinks it looks awesome because it does look awesome. Yeah. They want to go and see it. When I said to them said looks like Milan's GonNa come out Disney plus they went great I said we'll have to pay thirty pounds, freak? Twenty four pounds, eight pounds whatever. What yeah exactly. Right now she's not Murphy Fan, you know she's she's a movie Fan but she's like a you know she's full of booby sized or anything like that loss against the movies. She's a Disney Fan. Yeah. She's Disney cartoon fan as she originally when she was looking forward to this one, those a five positives and she still went waltz exactly. Yeah and then she said they're on there is no way we ought doing that. So. Here's the question. Is it just? An I think the answer is, yes. Do you think that the problem isn't the idea behind it but the price point that they had look get I've been making this joke in my head for loss few weeks, which is, Hey, do you remember when we used to see new movies because we've had six months of virtually no new movies right and we've been having a lot from delving into all the content and the dark netflix stuff in the last thing. But actually stopping about is that where you all these movies disappeared yeah and we used to getting a whole year hundreds of movies every year when does not getting in the moment obviously they need to. Find a channel and video on demand via very Shanzer Museum. Obvious way to do it because there's been such a growth during lockdown but this model where you pay a big fee for each one just isn't GonNa fly for me I think they should do is they should say Okay you WANNA see Disney movies marvel movies everything like that. You pay an extra twelve dollars a of Disney plus yeah and then you get to rent them at the three ninety nine to ninety nine price point when they come out. and to me I think that you people will would don't get everyone's going to bitch about paying more. Yes. That's GonNa Always GonNA happen I don't care if it's it's. Five Bucks doesn't matter. But if you thirty bucks is a whole different, that's a different level if you. But if you basically say, okay, we can pay twelve, ninety, nine a month, and that gives you access to the service and then you have to pay a fee for every movie you watch. Now the way I would do is I would say that's not a one shot rental that's not e-. It is basically it's you pay you pay twelve months, nine months I for service access, and then you pay per movie three, nine, thousand, nine something like that, and then you have it for a month or you have a forever or you have it while use of how much that's fine. How much is Disney plus is it six dollars? Ninety nine cents something like that Yeah. Something like that. Yeah. is Disney plus eight to ninety nine, seventy bucks a month. Yeah it's it's not. It's not bad value for what you get. Oh No I think it's a they're right on the money I paid for like two months three months ahead of time and I paid less than seventy bucks but. This one movie is going to be effectively almost half the cost of that. Stupid. To, say. They're trying to get close to the revenues from the movie if they put it in thesis and yeah. Stop thinking about fifty percent of the ticket price. Don't they win when Nikon the thesis Disney's so they're trying to go for a family full family three or four, or maybe a couple of something like that. That's kind of the area we would hope to get for the movie if it was. Just need to hire you and i. that's what it really comes down because we tell them right away. Are we like the idea of releasing these I, one I run. Blocker buster movies the price is going to be nine, ninety nine and you have access to it forever. Yeah. By because I think you need to take a long game, you don't need to look at eight to the. With the movie moving in strays, they look at the gross base, only production and distribution and marketing of each individual movie, and they'd for video on demand you can't do that. You need to look at the whole channel as a package and I think that's the thing they used to do that in the nineties and that's why we had so many great independent movies. Yeah. From like the Weinstein Company which I hate saying that we're now because the the negative connotations but. To Be Fair I'm talking about the company as a whole here the Weinstein. Company. Would have big movies. That would effectively pay for the small movies. Yeah and that was the that was their distribution model that was their business model. They would have a big movie. And then you would get a Kevin Smith clerks. Yeah. They didn't cost them much was paid for by a big hit but. That was their way of grooming the next generation of directors and writers and actors, and that's how you get those next big movies coming from the smaller movies that you fund it. They don't do that anymore to that. To that level they just don't, and it's a shame because the independent movie theaters or movie scene back in the nineties. And early two thousands was fantastic. There was some really really good movies that came out I think of a reservoir dogs. You know that was a small independent film and look how it changed. The. Quentin Tarantino. Was it. He was born because it was a him. Yeah. That was wasn't it? Yeah I think is somebody else now now is Tom Tina? You still there. I think we lost David completely. We did let's take a quick pause and we'll come right back. All right after A. No sound pause or no actual pause to listener we're back. Minutes there. Yep. Something's going on with your network. I don't know what it is. Salmon cellulose. So why don't know unless they were doing? Maintenance on the network today. Well. Now, the listener won't here because you're listening to because you're recording your end of the conversation, you'll send me that in out combine the two that's rhyme it used to be that. I would record both ends of the conversation on my here side. and. So the listener would hear what I heard but the problem is now you're breaking up not terribly but every twentieth word completely aren't. Like that so We'll PETCO beam improvement depending on your point of view. Well, I was going to say that, but I don't want her feelings. So. Let's move on Google play. Music will start shutting down, in? September? This was news to me. Yeah, I was Kinda surprised, but I think it. I think it goes a long way to explaining the change in the streaming wars for music if you will, and that Google has done a piss poor job of of getting it right I. Don't know very many people who use Google music. and. I don't know anybody I. mean they're or streams music from there. I mean, it used to be because it was default with android phone or your chromebook something that it was natural choice and I know that a lot promotions the gave you you free free free uploads, all free Free Monthly Subscriptions, and that sort of thing for a long time. But the problem is this is Google over they. They often throw out a service give it no love, and then a few years after the and abuse it because they giving it in our love they just kill it and replace it with something identical. But with a different name, well, they've been offering youtube music for a while and I didn't understand that. I thought we. Got Google, play music why they promoting youtube music unless this is the thing that youtube trying to stand on its own and Blah. Blah Blah. But still didn't make sense because youtube is owned by Google. It is Google. It has been for many many years but now it does make sense that I think they're seeing some success with Google news or with YouTube music. They're seeing zero success with Google play music. So they're just gonNA, make the transition. Well. He's the thing that's I. Know a law people at she listened to free streaming music by leaked by basie play music videos on Youtube. And You know I've seen plenty of you know when you hanging around ready forms, you see plenty complaints about people saying, Oh, I can't play Youtube in the background want to be able to play you in the background. There was one a couple of weeks ago but some. I want to have youtube in the background and still have system sounds for my computer from my gaze playing as well and as an and I think this was a chromebook and this was because basically they wanted to be to play youtube videos in the background. So they have music playing while also hearing this Moliere and the game they were playing in the full grand mixer and you know. Well it. Makes Sense. If if that's how you can see my musics me, it was a bit of a head scratcher moment I thought why would you want to do that and then I figured out so I think part of it is the people who wanted cheap or free music from Google Youtube Anyway and I think what Google are saying. Well, let's let's trying. There and get money from it, but which makes sense but man. Now we Have quite a few of the podcast in the network on Google music. and. So I kind of looked at the stats and I kind of feel sorry for those four users but. Because, that's all that was doing it and an tech fan was the only one that's been promoting. Google. Music anyways on. show note pages. and. If you go to any show recent show notes in the last six months, protect fan either at Tech Fan podcast I come or my Mac dot com. You will see badges for all the streaming services that were on. And? I'm going to have to replace it maybe, but we're not on Google Youtube. And I don't think I'm GonNa Start uploading audio only to youtube that seems. Weird I mean I. Could. But I'M NOT GONNA. Start Recording video and were recording show nobody wants to see that. Good Lord. OF HOMES AS A. Exactly say. Exactly and of going to be honest I mean until this announcement came out I'd never heard of Youtube to be on some parents already existed for some time yet I'm and I don't I don't think it's been well promoted up until now. I just like all things this. This I'm sure this deep. This makes sense I'm in in Google but this is going to be a another distant third to specify an apple music. you know this this is just not where it is and why would. Why would anybody switch from spotify? Or Apple Music to this. I don't I don't get it I I the so looks like some sort of is very unclear. Are some sort of bundled deal. If you get youtube premium, which is the the you know the premium video service you get Youtube Music for free and that service just went up to like sixty bucks a month. I know people that were subscribed to it. So they can watch live TV and every single person. I. Know that was using it just cancelled because of the manner price hike I'm not a big baseball fan. But I was in my office. At work I'm, GONNA. Say Tuesday or Wednesday really really slow. So I had a second window up on my second minor her. Watching a baseball game, it was playing over there early wasn't watching it too much how still sending emails and stuff like that. But I headed up and running and I was watching it through. comcast because I'm in xfinity subscriber and watch. You know streaming content right there. And that was Kinda Cool I think I ended up for about a half hour. But the drone of the announcer was just too much to turn it off. That's the biggest American baseball by the way it's so so slow paced and the announcer suck all of them do. someone to pitch. Site Slight Digression here I've always found the the way American. Sports cost goes to be really old coming from the UK because. It's it's like. American sportscasters they they can't stop talking know when even when there's nothing going on, they keep talking whereas over here we tend to have commentators who will speak with a a soccer match they will speak when something's going on. Yeah, and and the rest of the time you know there will be poses as the Bulls being passed from person to person, they will send to announce name the players got possession, but there's no kind of you need to fill the the airwaves with the salt stuff here in American sports causes, which is well, of course, you know that the Jiminez had a had a point, three, four, two, La season, and that means email and only crap that nobody's interested in this constantly being spouse to that you're right sounds like dryer. So For well, it's it's not even what they're saying. It's how they're saying it. There seems to be this thing in American baseball that. You WanNa talk like that so and they're just so That's why I missed the drunk, Kerry Kerry? At enough you know who that is. He was a an announcer for the Chicago cubs and as the game went on, he would get drunk more and more drunk. I, mean I really. And he would just couldn't even understand me. He's stand up at the seventh inning and sing the song. Drunk office, ASS it was awesome. So good. He couldn't do it today, but at least it was entertaining now look. anyways. Let's move on. So Google Music is shutting down and I have some inside information that I'm not supposed to share because they actually told me that this information is confidential. So should I? I didn't I didn't say. I didn't ask him to send us to me. If you're going to sell me something. Unsolicited and tell me it's confidential screw you didn't agree to that. I'm not involved. I'm not going to be involved in pushing you one way or the other I think it's down to you and your moral compass younger talk about Let me. Let me Google this real quick to see if anybody else's talked about it. so I. Guess Z. Did anything where you actually spelled what was as you were searching for it. Tapped stab the. Great poke causing this You know. I don't think that area. Well Let Me Guess Sundial pitch is going to be devastatingly pull coughs. Well the thing is it doesn't look like this is out there yet. Okay. I'm just GONNA say a really big company that everyone here knows about and they also own a smaller company. That has to do with Audio content. Is Jumping in big time into podcasts. And they have already reached out to me. About getting our content on their service. and. I've already submitted every single show in the network. To this service. So we will be there when this service launches, technically they're logjamming with grain. What's I know? Where are you kidding? They showed you green The service what's the point? Is this? I consider the big one. And their sub companies also big so You're going to be able to listen to all the shows in the my mic podcasting network including tech fan and Geeks POB arch to shows. on these two new pod casting platforms even though they're gonna Kinda Mirror, each other. If you belong one or the other you're going to be able to hear it. So I look forward to talking about that more. When they launch out on them, keep their I think most people probably figure out who it is. But. This is that let's be clear. This is unrelated to the Google Youtube, this compete cigarette. Yes. I you know I think it's cool. I. Honestly I'm surprised this company hasn't done it before but. If, it's if it's the company I think you I. Think it is that I'm very, very surprised as well. This is kind of a natural move. Yes. Yes. I'm for both their platforms if you understand meaning. Yes I do I do i. do wonder what it means for I'm focusing in the long run but. That's a separate discussion. Shut me down never go away. Oh, I own my own context screw you. Okay. So he has his. Contemporaries finding it isn't it? If if the only way to go find it is go through big companies and the only way to get onto those big companies into bind to their advertising I think a lot of people listening to this show for a long time we've got we've got some really long term listeners. People I. Guess we could see more. Fourteen. dammit. Twelve. S Right. We you know. We'll. We'll stick it up in the service we can. FTP. It. Hit The fan world knows as tech Graham This week is apple finally updated the twenty seven inch IRA. Matic and everything was positive except I keep thinking are this is the high end one it's not the pro one but still it's high end one. Yep and it's finally SSD is. That's it. That's all you can get these machines in at least. For this one, that twenty seven we still get out of this and the twenty one and a half you. You can get a fusion driving this twenty one and a half, but you have to pay extra for it which is. To Study Yeah. So the base of the whole line now comes with the t fifty six GIG. SSD. But I to be honest with you. I had a look. I'm not look at these long time. I had a look at twenty one and a half inch line. And you really only want the pain one and if you're GONNA bother cellphone one it's on a couple of hundred dollars more for the entry level twenty seven. Side the whole twenty, one hostage line is of stupidity. Yeah. So did did he might use at 'cause oversee. You're just had funds with us as days. No because almost fifty six GIGABYTE SSD is crap. This. Gal that Data on that are you kidding me? Yeah. Yeah. But you know what? Internal dries mass storage is kind of all old school. Now, everyone stick said sticks a big SST in the side and does it that way? Nobody wants INTENDO drives. Don't WANNA pay for intelligence to laptop and those come in poultry. Well while yet, but that's exactly my point. So everybody when they buy a laptop, they go out and buy you know a one terabyte or a half terabyte whatever they need. A Samsung assist goes USB three point they're happy with that. Well, all they go or they go thunderbolt need something higher. That's why that's what people do now is it don't get me wrong a stupid well. I think this whole upgrading. The whole Donald. Yeah. The whole Dungle town thing is despising the wave. When does things now I just don't understand why anybody would spend anything on. If you've already got a twenty unless you absolutely have to get one like I had to might my older twenty one inch died I had to buy a new machine. So I didn't really have a choice there right. while I did I could've fixed the all but I wasn't sure what was wrong with it and I didn't WanNA spend days and days and days, and it took a long time to fix the. Longtime. But regardless, if you don't need a new, I'm at right now is not a pressing concern. You'd be stupid to upgrade one of these machines. And here's why. They got a whole new coming out a brand new architecture. Why would you spend money on a dead man not going anywhere architecture that a year from now is going to be completely replaced in the twenty seven inch because I guarantee you a year from now. No Intel's going to be dead at Apple Yeah. Yeah. That's true but. flair is still Intel and so you know if you have an old machine today. That's not doing the job. Then you need a new Intel machine you because you wait for. A. Pound no pap busy when apple apple silicon chips, apple silicon have you those she's come out there'll be no software running or very little of running nicely on it from day one. Know there will be I think I think they're giving enough. The big stuff is going to be in the popular stop is going to be ready day one or within a week or two I guarantee you. The problem macy's sometimes not the popular stuff you need. Sometimes it's that little niche application that you need to be able to kind of run the smooth workflow but ESA. Actually have to upgrade their. There's no need to. Know I I. Think. The chips were finally ready for these machines because they've upgraded the latest Intel chips and so I guess apple for why not I think what they're king to avoid is too many people waiting for apple silicon and let's be honest law law people going into an APP store going into the apple store to buy an automatic. Yeah. They don't allow people don't care they all commodity pro southern and Kale chips in you know and the apple store not going to say I will by the way suggest you don't by design today because we've got a whole new architecture coming out soon, it's going to be completely different. Don't say that to anybody could have something selling the schools and I. Guess. have. The you know it sells computers when somebody comes in next week to the apple store yet I often lockdown and they can say, Oh, yeah, we got this brand new twenty, seven inch I'm with the latest processes in it. You know is a great machine and remember apples. The party line is the Intel. MACs are going to be supporting me right Max for years to come. Yeah. We know his ally, but nevertheless is the party line. Soviet. The Party line we know a contact because we do know that. Well obviously. We you know the difference is you and I have been through this transition before you went through. Certainly. Went through once yet I remember how quickly off the Intel MACs came out. All the power PC stuff dropped away. Yeah. They were immediate. They were absolutely within months. Talked have a power PC machine it's like well because the problem is they would they would just so lacking in performance compared the Intel machines. Now it's going to be the same with these apple silicon oviously particularly for the for the native APP Sapolu we'll see we'll see how well The. At Rosetta to software they have worse but. The difference the difference could be an I'm speculating here just knowing from my experience with using. On silicon windows 'cause I had the that arm silicon, a windows computer which I love and these great and when you have nightly compiled windows APPs on it's fantastic. When you run the translated stuff is okay. I'm sure apples is going to be better than that. But there are some things you just can't translate drivers. For instance, they run a different level of the operating system. You can't translate them on the fly. So basically if you've got. A peripheral will something that needs any sort of driver the com- Sean, slice it by that by that system it just doesn't work now that those things that are the problems that I suspects apple wants to have good Intel MACs lying around for. So if somebody comes in and says, I'm thinking you know particularly their business customer or hiring customer saying now during a professional workflow and need kitten, it doesn't work on these pneumatics. They can say, well, we have a McKay that it works on. Yeah. It'll be six months worth and they'll be gone. Well the you hope that every the different the difficulties you don't know what the third party software markets can do in terms of their adoption apple can only do so macho, US look using this on looking using this road. PODCAST ahead probe of PROCASA here yet now, it has an APP that you run on your Mac to basically pull the podcast off the St car and convey uses a a broadcast format to to put together on the on the chip. So when you want to pull out individual tracks yet to use their up to now, that might well run perfectly well in translation or it might not. If if I'm using this I. and. He doesn't run on on a apple combat. I'M GONNA. Need INSOMNIAC or I'm GONNA I'll worse I'm GonNa go oh fun. I'll just do it on a windows. PC Gumbo windows. Pacey. So that's the reason why I think you know and. I don't. I don't know how big the penetration of maxes in the corporate. Space I don styles on that but I see lots of them around. And who plenty of them yet plenty of them are running. The windows name relational windows in virtualization Windows boot camp to allow people to use is maxine environment where there's windows software as well. Away though to bigger that I think most people realize because so much more software. For workers is being deployed in the cloud as an example where I work every single thing I do other than the negative What is it Oh, the email client. What am I talking about from office outlook I use outlook But I could get that through the web if I wanted as well but everything else. Web based in fact when. The Web, the Web, the web version of outlook is ver- she's good as the. US The division very much anymore I do you know way big outlaw uses and I do most of it on the weather and here's the thing the crm that we use for work. Works much better at on my i Mak using chrome than it does on the PC at work using chrome, and now a lot of that is my computers he sees rubbish it is crap but nevertheless, I could take I could buy my own Amac a twenty one inch with a small sst and pop it on my work desk plug in my big monitor to that and it would it would blow everything I'm doing at work away. Yeah. But I digress, I, I think I think the problem with you know you. You're absolutely right things are moving to the cloud, but you'd be surprised how much I see where legacy it is to sticking around this love Nevada. Just because nobody's well. That Salem. That's actually updates. It's not just that though it's job protection for it guys. Well that as well but the thing is is that it's it's very difficult. Yeah. To go to your head of finance because for some reason, I, t always seems to be overseen by the head of Finance. and. Go Right. I want X. thousand dollars for a team of three people and six months to take this APP, that. That we've got an and move it to the cloud move to the web, we're updated wherever because the first question think goes goes the fun guy goes why is it not working or is it going to break and when you come nobody's says really old and clunky. He goes fine I'll find you money for that one I've got. We've got some spammy, and so he goes to the Baltimore List and it never gets updated until there's a crisis and I see this in my business time and time and time again where I'm called in to look. Suite of applications and they say right Walsall Strategy and I go well that one there that will mean that one there those are on things that are unsupported the are. Potentially security false yet, and aren't GonNa work on your computer next two or three years time, and then the first question was. Do, we really have to do that. And then the second question is, can we take the business processes are working those apps and do them in one of our other outs we already have. Yet because the just reluctant to update a lot of these line of business applications they would. There is really as a case of we bought it once we never will spend any money on again and that's the issue have, and this is how we ended up with a couple of years ago the net just being flattened by a worm because they were running windows. Xp Still. So, let's move on Yeah Apple was all over the tech world this week when it comes to. Applications in this case facebook and stadio. Apple is not letting the flow. was. Microsoft's was the one that calls the plane. Well. Thanks filed it no, it wasn't. It was facebook initially and then Microsoft join them. Complaining Well Myself Yeah Microsoft have an have a streaming gaming platform as we do but there's of course at all about the apple until after Okay. FACEBOOK got rejected and facebook made this big stink that hey, apple users did you know on your IOS devices? You can't play our streaming games on our new facebook gaming. APP. Because apple says we can't. but here's the thing. This is what bothers me is true which is true. Apples, denial or apples reasoning is weak sauce to say the least. Well I. You know I. Think. A somebody apple marketing got caught flat-footed by this and came up with A. Kind of frankly bullshit known response. Yeah. which talks about things unrelated to the thing when he fat they already had and maybe this is related on Phil Schiller is to step down from. Head. Of Head of the APP. So hasn't he? He's become an apple fellow. He's not employed anymore Yeah. He's kind of stay. He's basically. Pozniak. Yeah he's about long that long gone rights retirement no did retire. The Apple, an apple follow is an unpaid. We'll call you in for your vice occasionally exactly and I wonder if they're that transition calls this mango messaging to happen because let's face it a couple of weeks a few weeks ago when the whole business with the hey dot com app just before ww DC apple were you know they were coming out and you can like not like what they were saying. What they're saying, but they were certainly swinging for the fences in terms of what they were, what how strongly they were saying it whereas this was just we missed the reason. All of these APPs have been rejected is because it's been in the apple store policies for about eight years that you can't have streaming. Software APPs on on a on the APP store for the policies right there. There's no ambiguity is not one of these ones where they got one rule for one one roof for another basically says if you want to try and stream software. To the to an irs device from somewhere else that is not allowed in and they're saying, well, what about? NETFLIX'S A streaming software they're streaming content's just like a yeah. Exactly. Operate anything else. The the real difficulty of call center. I suspect the reason this this was was implemented. Everyone's go. ooh La Que they wanna you know it's nothing to do with that because this rule has been their fears is basically because if you have a game that involves, let's take him. GTE for an example, right? If you have a game. Like GTE remember the hot coffee MoD when somebody tweaked the game so that you could actually. Be Supper prostitutes off gays. Any wanted what everyone says. Okay you can have sex with the. I've also. Mistaking. Of beating up a prostitute is just regular game. No problem that do that. Noha Coffee. When when you? And this wasn't something they monitored the game to add this actually was in the game. The rockstar attended You know what? This isn't gonNA. Never removed the code. So on the side of things, some very enterprising hackers found the code, turned it on, and then you could have sex in the game, right? Okay. So that sort of content is something apple probably doesn't flammable and if you if you while streaming games from another place, then somebody could load again allows you to do something like that and then GonNa have you know angry Mums Ryan's Congress going apple family keep playing dirty game on my paint ample isn't doing anything about it and Apple with trying to. Head off at the pass they basically saying we don't have an opportunity to the the games are cells by loading them as individual APP onto the store. Then we don't want the Games on the platforms he can't stream them from somewhere else. Yeah. That's I. think that's the thinking behind it and there's Nothing wrong with that is. A perfectly legitimate approach to take. The problem is, is the media is kind of bonus up at proportion because with com a few weeks ago, and because there are rumblings that the you in particular is coming apple for antitrust practices ever the way they allow people to ups the rules in the APP store where an. The difficulty is is increasingly because apple on just really. Dealing with this problem of what is that? They're still trying to defend their position on the APP store even though there are some fairly legitimate complaints being made about their. Their model they you know this, they're just gonNA get increasingly batted in the press like this every time something this comes up whether the argument is legitimate or not because it's a good story say here we go apple ever the media trying to create narrative that apple is behaving in an stress way with the APP store which something I don't quite agree with because they're not monopoly. So well, you can always go to somebody else's platform if you don't. Make any money at all the. Monopoly argument is. That that's not nothing to do with antitrust the tour it's the fault. Those are the platforms they don't make money. and plus I if Microsoft and facebook. Wanted to get streaming games to mobile users, they can do it. Still all they have to do is run it through a web page. there are concerns that the web browser versions almost good. Man. I've. Yeah. That sounds to me Lookin' engineering problems. I don't I. Don't understand. I understand what facebook is making a big deal of this because they are a mobile company I don't understand why x clap mark software making big deal is nobody because they have mos. Streaming? They have yeah open. In their right mind is going to be streaming ExCo box. Gatien. Cloud I fire playing the momentum could if it worked, you do that. It doesn't even even if it works absolutely perfectly is still can be sake experienced because he's on an iphone. Yeah. Is You're right especially cannot not those sorts of game. Oh. What's the different? What's the difference between a first person shooter on the IPHONE and a first person shooter xbox. It telling me that people who already have an xbox rather play that game using control. I find. That either or it's at the same you can. You're you're at school and you're at lunch and you pay any breakout your phone you play a little bit, Halo. You're at work Aaron launch you WANNA play Halo you're at the bus stop you're wherever it doesn't matter the point is you go into the shitter and I want you I'm GonNa play the xbox while I'm in there There's nothing wrong with that in fact. I kind of would like to have seen this come to the iphone to be quite frank and there's work around if apple says, it's because you can't. We can't review them separately fine than Microsoft or facebook come back and say, okay. So what we're GONNA do is we're going to submit this at with these games. We're GONNA, let you go ahead and review these games. This included right now and any time we're going to release a new game. We won't push out to the mobile platform to review and approve they could you. Know. I think it's I think it's far less complicated than that because what you doing there is trying to find. An excuse for for putting an exception to the rule, and this is kind what's goes apple in trouble anyway because the exception to the rules with hey dot com and with net flicks in terms of what they get charged and everything like that is and the the lack of clarity is what's been causing these problems in the first. Consistent that's why go with this. Because then you call. Okay, wait a minute then. Saying. This and we say okay so we'll. Know they they're not saying that they're just saying streaming APPs allowed in the APP store. They have not given any agreement or justifications. They've said, game streaming APPs not allow the APP store is perfectly clear. Frankly. I. Don't understand why anybody reading that would spend the time and effort to develop a streaming APP full the full the I fine. Well, here's the thing things change over time and platforms mature and get faster and better and networks get better with four. G.. On the way you'll be able to stream. Truly. Platform on X. box or or playstation games to your mobile device with. So difference in quality that is only do. What you do in that case is he goes apple a saying we're thinking developing this like on the iphone we lock on the IPAD, but you have this rule that says we can't do that. Can we come to an arrangement because that's actually they have done with Netflix's and with all the? Where they've they've they've right I. Don't think that's school practice because the problem is they make those changes and they don't put them in the APP store policies. Yeah and then it becomes a you know when we decide and if you fall on the cusp of that like like basecamp dead, then everyone gets all bent out share right? What am I don't WanNa see. Is Apple opening up the APP store for anything like this because then we get into the situation that ANDROID has right now, which is just awful awful. APP stores with so much crap Bennett. That's stealing data but. By, the same token. Apple does need to change man I mean they they can't stick lease policy from two, thousand and seven and two, thousand and eight because the world is changing gaming is changing applications are changing and if you don't change with it, this is what happens you get blown up in the media. Especially what they're non-reply reply that they sent out you're absolutely right about that. But yeah, things need to change I I understand why facebook Microsoft will be upset but they're headbutting against. What why not release a halo APP. On iphone which ties into your progress on Xbox, but it's a standalone game if you will. I'd love they did. I'm sure apple would apple would would be perfectly happy with that but they don't WanNa do that because they wanna have a hundred games on their streaming service and the after redevelop each one of the fit for that for Iowa I. Think Apple Really does need to look at us and change some policies and put new policies in place to allow systems. Like. xbox streaming and facebook gaming and the facebook game he's going to be asked we all know that that's going to be awful because they have right now is awful We know it on on how terrible is using the facebook website on an IPAD. Is Awful but regardless. I know it's awful. It's just it's. It's a joke, but regardless, apple does need to get with the time here a little bit. I and this is not me citing with facebook. Microsoft it's this fact they need. They need to upgrade their policies they need to if they want to continue to be the the market leader in money at any rate if not market share they need to change I might have lost ABC's Tiller. I'm so hey, you robot it out I mean I I get there. So anyways okay. two more. We're GONNA keep oops we're going to keep these brief. Toshiba is formerly and finally exiting. The laptop business which I think is sad news they made some. Add. Up. Well I. Went I don't what your experiences because I know you wear a Mac guy from very early on, but I was I into. Festival condor meager stuff on that one I got PC's and in the. Late eighties early ninety s the if you wanted a real, you know a proper looking laptop Yup Toshiba become they quality hardware back on. Yeah exactly. These these were you know by by modern standards, very big heavy machines with multiple crimes, screens, running dos, and windows three point one that sort of thing. But you know they were built like tanks and they keep the keywords remaining they were the ones everyone aspired to Mike. Everyone, they were. They were like the you know the Mac Book of their day. Really the Chiba laptops the clam shell laptop. and the and for many years they still did have. A great designs they've been kind of on the declined for a long time and I believe what this is actually they they sold most of the laptop division to somebody else are, but they had a share in it and they finally divested that share which means they completely out. So they've been they've been kind of circling the drain for some time, but you know a lot of the layout and features of what you have in a modern Dell or a modern. Age Pecan PC, you can trace right back to A. So she in the PC space? Yeah they were they were cooperating Powell books, but nevertheless will shape as a we've been wanting to reactivate are wicky. Trolling for a while so Toshiba might have to come up in their some time. last his and you know what? I completely. Maybe I knew this, maybe we even talked about it, but I completely flush it out on my memory Google taking over fitbit. I do I completely forgot about this. This was a year ago that this was announced. I have no memory of it. Well, the I think the reason is it's one of those non sequiturs like what the hell no one will google wants to get into that business. You know and and this is Google again, they they've missed around three or four times with different swamp smartwatch platforms failed, and then they go and they failed and now said rolling the right and they're trying to find somebody else's but why why do? I think because I think they want to take something that people buy, which is not a Google, watches and yet people do by fitbit's and be really google fit bed is kind of a also ran at this point. How many? To An apple watch and how long. Business what two, thousand and eight, but this is, but this is the thing fit bit were on the way down a couple of years ago I think Google sore chance to get them for cheap. And they thought we can build up again. So a couple years ago would have been when this deal was I thought to be put together acce- ecstasy year ago, and now Google funds itself in the invidious position that. The European Commission is doing an antitrust investigation on it, which is very, very odd because as you say, Fitbit is not the Marquee League. Cy. Why You know it's not a it's not an antitrust one. they're concern according to. The skiers, they don't want yet. They don't want health information that Google and will collect and that fitbit currently does and passing that on to advertisers or anybody else that and I agree. You don't see and this is why I think apple when it comes to this kind of stuff has a lot better reputation because everybody knows apple is not gonNA share this information with anybody. You know you're gonNA tell if a company comes to apple a health insurer and wants access to apple's going to tell them to jump in a lake getting that what do you on your mind and nor is apple advertising us. You know, hey, you know what? We kind of notice your workouts lately Here's some less calorie food you might want to consider who've. Yeah you know you're not going to see that. Would you see it from Google eventually if they take over fitbit and have access to that I I can't say I would trust Google with this information. Well, they've done this before when they bought nest Yup yet they said they would keep the dice separate from Google when is a quiet and then? Later, they. Five years later, they took the data facebook as well. said that what's that was going to be independent and now they're looking at ways of bringing the data into facebook. So you know these companies because obviously. That's why they bought into these things. They want the data because that said business and they'll say wherever they say to get approved from the EU or the US government, but yet at the same time. As people who cover tech like we do we know damn. Well, they're lying about it and this is the problem. And it's going to remain a problem for another ten years maybe fifteen. In that people who are in these governor or? Organizations don't understand. Tack. And in two you get more people that are in positions of power within the government. Now, I'm not talking about elected positions. I'm talking about you know city commissioners and you know comptrollers and people like that. That understand technology. You're going to continuously run into problems that they're asking the wrong questions or they really don't understand. They're just like, Oh, this looks bad and they look stupid when they do it but this is a case where I actually agree with the European Union that they're kind of taking a step back and going Oh, wait a minute now we don't. We don't think we want them to to do this and I. I'm kind of with him. And Google here. So all they need to do is basically run interference Google fully three or four years it's going to take for them to retire fit bitten Chelsea down anyway, which is what they did this this. This'll be the deficit hurt but then again, the bits going to go away regardless, they just took what one hundred and It's in the story here a hundred. And thirty. No. Hundred. Dollar loss. How long are they gonNA survive taking loss at big I would. I can pretty much guarantee. It won't be very much longer if Google doesn't buy pet google. Fit fitbit will be out of business. Two years from now they'll be gone. Yeah. Yeah and but look. Bad By. Yes. I don't have A. You have asked. I. Had one before. The Apple. Watch came out. Why don't you? because of cost. This much better. A you know and and you look at this list of global shipments in the story here apple and then Jeremy Samsung of Hawaii. So Samsung, I've got their own watch platform. And they peddling it alongside their phone. So there's some synergy there and jamming hallway the two companies that have chewed up fitbit's business, which was for the Non Small Watch health tracker because they can chin those things out for appropriate third FIC- charges. And they rip off their designs as well. So you at says that. It's You know look for those who are fitbit fans all four of you. I'm sorry but they should it their time is over they're done. Yeah. I I don't like to say that. But I don't see that. Am I wrong I don't think I'm wrong. I don't think. I know I don't think. So I think apple is very much later in the space and then I think like I just said, I think most people with android phones he won't have a a fitness tracker. They are the by Samsung because Samsung phone bond cheap Chinese worth. I don't think many people goes. V V is had other problems while you remember that. was wasn't maybe Garmon there was one of one of these ones that basically sent the data to the cloud and then The Islamic State found they could watch where the soldiers running around full bastion in Afghanistan because the dice was being uploaded to cloud. That's that's scary. Stuff like that the stuff like that as well, which you know is hard but. This is unfortunate. What happened good on that they got acquired by Google that means the people what they can go some salt of. and. I got. A full suit Ronnie off. So. That's our show here on tat fan this week, we love to give feedback from you did get another Email about Cable Management From Joseph. And his first thing was He said, thanks for the mentioned almost wish I was a it was a two way conversation there. Dude come on the show sometimes could be You just gotTa wake up we'll. We'll we'll do a whole show. On. Cable. Management. Desk. Kind of. Demanding area. Come on the show man. You see me you send me people listening so four. At the I thought you said it was fooling though this late show. Okay. So we're going to wrap up this episode of Tech van send us, email the show at Tech Fan PODCAST DOT com. Go to FAN PODCAST DOT COM or my Mac dot com leave a comment they are or on our facebook page or on twitter a Cenex Week on Geeks pub David. C.

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TechFan 384 - Finding Toy Up

TechFan

1:06:35 hr | 1 year ago

TechFan 384 - Finding Toy Up

"You're listening to another great podcast in the my neck podcasting network. Tech fan podcast number three hundred and eighty four am Tim Robertson. Hello, David Cohen. Hello, David Cone on. Hello. Tim Robinson drill a head. See what I when I do the podcast. I have only one ear completely covered in my headphones and the other one partially. So I get a little bit of a stereo sign for you from you. But I can still hear my own voice in what's going in here in the background. But right there at the beginning I had both ears covered. So I sound a little muffled as I was talking and didn't like that. As when you talk with your fingers in your out sounds. Yeah. What is it? Good headphones. So they block out the sound pretty good. Even though they're not noise canceling headphones, and they're probably ten years old. Now, they're amazing. And I love him, and they were very expensive ten years ago, and they're probably more expensive now. I'm not planning on buying any new headphones anytime soon, so I have take care of these. When I'm down when I'm done. I wrapped the cord because in I couldn't use it might rain new iphone without an adapter. And I have a little hook up above my desk that I put them on. Actually, I've got four or five pair of headphones up there that I kind of rotate through one of them is a noise canceling noise, cancelling noise, cancellation bluetooth headphones that are kind of my mowing the lawn headphones. And I don't like the headphones that go in my ear. I know we've had this discussion before I like over the ear headphones not on the ear. I like over the ear headphones and up my resolve different. It's something stuck him on locales. Yep. Yep. So what's going on with you this past week anything exciting nothing? You saw seemingly simul timeout. Invading up in really present whip funding a document outs dice. I that's comfortable flight and looking forward to relaxing the weekend and not doing very much sounds like fun. I then I actually a couple of pitchers this morning. So one was one was from a week ago, which was terrible and one was from this morning, which wasn't. I mean, it's not as much snow, and it's not as cold, but it will still pretty this not fun. You know, it's winter. So it is what it is. And then I sent you if I'm not mistaken a third pitcher a screen capture. Yeah. So I thought I will talk about that right here at the beginning. I've mentioned in the past recent past that I was going to kind of help MAC stock moving forward. And it's official. I'm doing the sponsorship for MAC stock that doesn't mean I am sponsoring max talk. Okay. Phrase that was much similar for big check from you big check. Yeah. I'm actually. Trying to work with some new sponsors for the expo and conference coming up in July been nice if you can come again sometime, David. Yeah. It's going to be tough. Because the the law summit was there that was when my my mother-in-law died and so full round the signs on every year. So I think that's going to be difficult in the short term. But we'll see what happens going forward. The other thing. I Dave is Toronto Milwaukee coming with me, which might mice alleviate the problem someone. Absolutely. Plus, I've never met her in person. So that would be cool. Yeah. That'd be great. I'm probably going to bring Brooke with Megan this coming year. I still think coal would be extremely bored. Most of the time, but Brooke really enjoyed herself at the last MAC stock. So it's going to become a a a a brook in dad thing that we do every summer for a while. And yes, I'm going to be working with Mike going to try to find some new sponsors and partners. And I'm going to talk about it a little bit more than I have in the past you on the show because I've got an. An active interest. If you will and helping the show succeed. No, of course in you and me promoting it here guy gas promoting on the my MAC show. Some of the other shows the network talking about it, we give it a lot of press if you will and every year, we post pictures, and we have some, you know, coverage at my MAC dot com. But we're going to stop that up this coming year because again, I've got an interest in the show now. So, but we would have been helpful anyways. We we really like MAC stock. It's this. It's the spiritual successor to a few of missing MacWorld expo. I've I've some opposite is kind of a it's a mix between us a group and the next by. Yeah. If you'd like the condo sold feel over sound that then definitely is with attending an honor. Remember, Las Palmas? I there's some people who drive very little distances across the sites to get to that show some came from Arizona. Yeah. Those remind met guys, by the way. Few guys from Minnesota, sir and Nevada in. Yup. Scenes cold as well yet? So people come all. And of course, people fly into because it's just it the event takes place north of Chicago. So you can fly in from pretty much anywhere in the world to Chicago hair international airport, and take an Uber. It's pretty easy. Plus, usually there's volunteers guy surreal is generally one of them that will volunteer to dry people from the airport up to the event, which is really cool really nice of them to do. So as it's good fun. Yep. I totally went volunteer to do that, by the way. Well, my square doesn't get good gas mileage. It's not done it. It's it's fun. Yeah. You did it the last time you were there took someone to the airport, and then she was going to a different airport than when you were going to. Yeah. Like, see quite Chicago. So that was nice. There you go. She didn't. We don't have to. Yeah. Let's talk about some of the stuff that you put in the show notes, and I kind of want to start with this one because it just cracks me up. So we talked about this maybe a month and a half two months ago, if that Chinese come sorry Samsung was partnering up with supreme. And supreme is the really hot marketing company in Samsung, kind of made a big splash that they're teaming up with supreme too. And of course Samsung is known is that the apple copycat company. That's what they do at least in the mobile phone industry. And it turns out that the supreme that they were teaming up with was kind of like them a copycat company. They were it was a counterfeit brand. Supreme is popular skateboard fashion. And and supreme Italian was who they actually think with who are. It's murky exactly why they Al offensively. They all some sort of spin off the on the real deal, and effectively snake the rights to the supreme name in that particular territory and of trading on ever since right? And the other Samsung knew that and didn't care or alters the the they didn't do due diligence and sold nicer premium seemed it was the real when he wants. No, I think that they they knew they did care, but they didn't care. They care that it wasn't the real one. But that's fine with them. They were looking at profiting from being known as a company working with supreme you that was a fake one. They thought most people wouldn't research or look into it. And just assume that wow, that's pretty cool and move on except the internet. Didn't let that happen. Dave, everybody, not just and. For yet. Bicycling it became, you know. Samsung and the fake supreme is what became known and Oviously that wasn't probably good for either of those two brands Samsung has tightened a couple of months best reconsidered and decided that they're not good to continue in that collaboration. Shocker. Well. About fake. Well, full suffice going around a lot of fake and AT and T is proud of their fakery day earlier. So proud of being a labeling something that's completely fake. Even though everyone is very. Derogatory? Well, yeah. And it's divisive even among their own customers. People are like come on really let the problem is. Unfortunately, this is the issue is that this is a marketing thing and marketers have Shang, and what we're talking about is AT and T is rolling out. They already did to some Android phones. And now they're doing it with I phones in a public beta that instead of saying four G now five G and then a tiny little e yet. And this is a festive Louis represents the top-end full g LT technology, and let's be clear by the standards police and everything else. This is not a full g LT. Absolutely nothing to do with anything that can be remotely considered five G settlers technology, which is completely different move might. This this full jail t the study and agents. So this is a victim of the IT marketing trying to say we've got a politest network. We've got the false this network when you haven't spicy and even Lucien of the existing technology, and they much like I think the previous story of the Samsung thing, they they'll counseling them outside of the tech space denies and so people go to the store and the goat. Well, we've got we've got five G E technology. Now, I most people will say, oh, what is that? Really? How different from what everyone else has. And what that question, and they will be able to get to be lied to to be told. Oh, it's better than everyone else's too. I can't stand. This kind of. I hate this kind of stuff. I really really do. It's just it's gross is marketing to the the worst denominator. Well, yeah. It's basically exposing the fact that most of that customers don't know anything about this technology, so is lying to them. There's no question. This is this isn't marketing doublespeak, this isn't just simply painting your products in the best pitcher available which is what marketing supposed to do. This is outright lying this. This is false. This is. Yeah. This is the most equivalence I've. Take basically buying supposed to come out with new Toyota Camry. And they did something to enrich the fuel. Make sure so that's the call had a little bit more power than have before if they if they named that technology supercharge. Right. And they said, this is a supercharge Camry, not supercharge, but supercharge Camry most people would go, well that's rubbish because supercharge being something, and it doesn't mean what you've done here. So that is a lie. And they would be. Oh, yeah. Well, you know, it's just tickets is fine. Most people going with think they will buying an actual supercharge Camry when they woods, and that's a lie because you will deceiving customers into buying something. They might not buy because if you haven't told them the line. And that's that's what bothers me is they seem to think it's ok they're defending it. Offend this. The proud of it. That's what bothers me more than anything. They think they've been so clever. Yeah. Slapped down for this. I really do what they want because this is the telecoms industry in the telecoms Detroit. It's allowed to do what it wants. I are pretty much. Nobody looks out for the customers. Even the regulations minutes. Look lookout for customers is in bed with the telecom industry, and unfortunately, we live in a world where everybody now does this all the time. It's been normalized. Everybody doesn't matter. This. We live in the world of alternative facts. This is the definition of an alternative fact, which in most people's minds is a lie that you call it an alternative facts. And somehow that makes it ok well with everybody. It's some of us actually still believe in the truth. And in this case, you know, me when it comes to technology and standards specifications. Truth can be absolutes. There is no grey area. Can't rebrand science. No, that's what I like about science. It's either true or not true or it's not proven yet in if it's not proven yet. It's very clear that this is simply we're looking we're trying to discover the truth. Just disgusting. I don't know. I don't know. Why? They wouldn't get slapped down by those. But you're right. There are absolutely not. Of course, the regulators that are out there. At least with this administration seems to be very we don't care. It's all about a company making money. And if it's lying to customers were okay with that, it's kind of their MO. So we're not going to get into of that though. Let's move on. Then wasn't extent. We've got David somebody somebody wanting to get paid. So this this is this has been a big story. I'm I think we we missed something whilst we because. Well, which was the the FaceTime bug that apple had and this is kind of related because this other apple security exploit that somebody is discovered. This is a guy who has apparently I say apparently because he's not giving us any evidence of this video. They has apparently demo exploit allows somebody with access to a MAC running Mojave to get access to all the keychain pulse. Woods which is the encrypted database. The Olmecs have with the assistant pulses and everything in and he says that this exploit his, easy and simple and foolproof. But the thing is is that because he's a security, I'm using the woods with I quote, say researcher. He wants a bug bounty for turning the data this apple apple doesn't operate bug. Bounties for the man they are in the upright froyo s subjectively. He said, well, I'm telling you about going public only exploit, but I'm not going to give any detail. So apple they pay me. Thanks very much. Because now, we're all insecure and people can defend people have been defending gun. We'll he's he's he's not turned over how the exploit works to anybody. So we know any less safe than we all we were before. And that's not true because the nature of hacking is that once, you know, something is possible. It gives you an idea of where to go try and find it. And it's probably only message time before somebody replicates this exploit and because Apple's won't be given opportunity to patch. It that means we're vulnerable. So thank you very much. But in some respects, don't you think that your regardless of apple has a bony or not? If he finds an exploit shouldn't be rewarded for that. Well, he's doing apple job for them yet. We're this Mon Mon position on this, really. Is that? It depends. What your view is if your view is to do this because you want you want to earn a living, then you should go work for a company that pays your salary to do security research. If you want to do this work because you want to make the world of at a place, then you should use responsible disclosure describes the stuff to the company, and then if they fail to patch it, then you within your sigo public. However, this guy Pitz wants to do not work for anybody else. He wants a fund exploits then turn them in bountiful them. So he won't see us as a way of living. Now, my my view on that is if you don't if you don't want if you know, the apple will not pay you for these exploits because they don't have a bug bounty program. Don't go looking for them yet. Go and go and do some other research this paid if the if that's the way you keep a roof over your head. That's fine. People have rights when a living. Yeah. But what you don't get to do is effectively extort people, which is what they're doing here. He's basically saying I found this bug. It's a serious bug. But you're not going to pay me. And if you for it, so I'm not going to tell you where it is. Yeah. That is in the public domain blackmail. I'm afraid that's true. Yeah. And that is what I can't countenance. Here is fun. He knows everybody knows that apple doesn't. Now. You can keep is a separate discussion with an apple should issue. Bounties for the MAC. They do. I m s. That kid who found the from the face, Tom, exploit way, you get the way it was found that we FaceTime. You could. You could inadvertently spy on the post new cooling. He got paid for them. He didn't also be the difference. He turned to entertain his mother tried their damnedest to get the bulk to apple an apple dropped the ball on that vote. Eventually went up realize what was going on. They said, you know, what you deserve. Even though you've also for payment, you deserve to be paid for this. Because this is an important bugging you've discovered it, right? But what the kid did not do is having been rebuffed. My apple yet is go public about it and say I found this terrible Bopha, I'm not selling one hundred. How how to do it until I see much from Tim cook? I should pay a bounty. Early especially with one of the richest companies in the face of the planet. I completely agree. I booked bounces are Paul of the security industry. Now, an eight doesn't make sense for apple to pay bug bounty for us and not have a similar scheme for the MAC. I completely agree with that. But that is not my point my point here is if you want apple to pay bug bounties for the MAC yet. What you do is go and find bugs and then town tool the media. I found a bug and afla too cheap to pay me, and they should be paying me because it makes all of us less secure and. Results in apple changing their policy and paying for bugs. What do you say about this guy? Then I'd say he actually affects changes apple comes back and says, you know, what you're right, and we want to make sure the MAC is as secure as possible. We're going to implement this change. We are going to pay for book bounties in MAC OS. And we're going to reward you for this. You're going to take things festival doubt ingred with the way he's going to bounce it because he's still endangered every case about doing hit. And secondly. I think that it's not right that he's revolt if his behavior, frankly, I think I think he's given up his right to win a bug bounty. Even when this book because the ways behaved. Yeah. In my that's my personal opinion. And. In in any if anything he's probably made it less likely that people are going to get bucked bounces for behaving this because apple could very Raleigh turn around the site. It's the we don't negotiate with terrorists argument, isn't it? It's like what we if we capitulate to this and give this some money, then then this is going to happen over and over again. Why were they able? Yeah. I think apple does need a policy change here. I think it would be good for all of us that they did. But I definitely wouldn't reward. This guy for. The way he's behaved. It's it's kind of crazy. Yeah. I agree. I agree with you on that. But I do agree with his contention that while I'm not going to release it unless I'm paid. Okay. I I get that. But then don't make a public. Don't make a big stink of on it because then you look petty petty and small, and that's you're painting yourself into kind of a corner here that doesn't benefit you long-term. Nobody's going to want to do business with you. If this is the way you behave. Speaking about behavior. Say this one before our, however, I'm going to transition into that would be a C spot. This one is. I'm not a big fan of Jeff Bezos. I'm just not. But it's undeniable what he created pretty much by himself to start. Amazon is. Very impress press. There. They do some things we don't agree with. But we both use Amazon products. Jeff Bezos being started. Absolutely on these back. Limb because he's he's going public about it. So yes, I think I think people know anything about Jeff Bezos now that he has a reputation of being the world's nicest, man. And we've talked before about whether you kind of need to be a bit of fools or a bit of a hard ass, or or, you know, even a jerk to be able to be successful as some of these people up by accounts yet in his personal life. He's not the world's best person known cheating on his wife. And. Yeah. Well. Plenty of people do that justifying saying, it's right? But he's not he just because he's the CEO of Amazon doesn't mean that he doesn't have the same human filings as anybody else, and I think that's an important point to make. However, I don't have those feelings I would never. Well, but, but you know, what I don't say that because my wife's about eight feet away from me right now. I know. I just think if you don't want to be with someone than stop being with someone don't start being with someone while you're still with somebody else. It's one of the cruelest possible, man or woman as one of the cruelest things you can do. I don't I don't like the he is a public figure should know better eight while he should he should know that. Those sorts of personal things. Even though he's go right to a private life. Those things aren't going to be because of his nightshirts a public figure north just as the Amazon, but also the the chief executive space company and most importantly is the head of the the owner of the Washington Post should understand that those things are going to be picked up by the knees pipes. Yeah. Yeah. I want to be fair to him. I think he kind of owns that. He's heels. He is not. I mean, plenty of people in his position would go out putting out. Lawsuits and trying to get. Judgements that prevent people from talking about it, certainly plenty famous people have done in the past including the current sitting president. So he's not done any of that. He's just kind of let it just kind of roll with him. At least he's going that going for him. However, one is happened is that he has been approached by. I think what they called American media Inc. In the National Enquirer. Who basically to bowl the story down said to him, but we have some pictures of some personal pitches. If you pay have been from certainly they gave him a full description of all the pictures they had of him. They appear to have been hiked from his fine or is the lady's phone from Avon. And they said we are going to publish these and embarrass she with them unless you sign the nondisclosure agreement. That means that you anybody associative you will claiming that American media media. The owner of the national Kwara has. Has been has been working to to support some political? License that they've been working with the Saudis that they've been killing stories and the light for the sitting president. Up stories, and then nor publish them full. But by by them up so they can't be published on the. Publishing the people who they like, basically, they're super corrupt. It's they are exactly the opposite of what you would think a newspaper or news program or journalists would actually do that what they are. Basically, they're stone. Everybody's known the inquirer has been scum forever. They live forever and ever tabloid trash. But this is a whole different thing is the problem with this is this is. Yes, they say if your client agrees to season this defamatory behavior by that by that. It's it's. Effectively because what happens when he found out that these pictures have been hacked. He he haunted investigates strong fund that how it happened. And the gnashing quantity that. Because they probably have committed or have paid somebody to commit some sorts of crime in order to get us pitches. Because then to make matters worse. They commit a crime here by trying to blackmail. Well, I'm waiting for indictments to come down. Got to be particularly as particularly is. Apparently, they already have an immunity deal with the investigation of this because they are on record having admitted that they've done this by a story and then pay somebody off by full before with with playboy models. So by continuing this behavior and trying to blackmail someone they're in big trouble because just be bad enough. They were trying to block Basil's as the head of Amazon. The head of an improvement company but puts slot. An even worse spin on in the fact that this is the man who owns a major news. Yeah. So the this is, you know, stifling of speech crimes. The these. These white male is. Is a federal crime would. Why extortion is not crime, extortion fulsome able extortion crime racketeering? And that sort of thing this is this is affecting. This is not a million miles away from. Nice store about nice. You've got here. Shame. You something happens to it like most private life. You maybe shame. Something happens. Stop talking about us. Stop investigating us organ. Release these photos of you that's blackmail, and oh, by the way, that's a federal crime. And and you know, I give it up to Jeff visa, I really do. My my opinion of them actually went up quite a few degrees. When I because I wrote this entire thing that he wrote himself, and he literally pasted in the Email from. The chief content officer at AM I listed Dylan Howard, explicit explicitly the photos, they had presumably to try and demonstrate to us what an idiot. Why would you put that in writing and put that out there? What a fricken Avia. Vian counting on him being. So embarrassed by this not wanna talk about it. Them didn't it. I guarantee you that this this Martin or I'm sorry. What's his name? John p fine is that it. Keep the Joan find is the legal counsel. Well, this guy is a legal counsel just set himself up for. Going to jail. I mean, he's the one that's delivering the ransom note. Yeah. Yeah. I think I think this sums up basil says these communication cement. I'm lonely protection for weaponising journalistic privileges hiding behind important protections and ignoring the tenants and purpose of true journalism cool side don't want personal choice is published pulses Peyton at well. Well-known practice of blackmail, political favors political tax corruption. I profess the stand up roll this logo ver- and see what cruel down. But the reason they've done this is because this is standard MO too. Many people have most people don't have the resources that are Jeff Bezos has. Well, the something something actually says in his medium posts about this is where several of journalists have had these type six us on them. So. Capitulated simply because they couldn't take the risk of losing their livelihood with stuff. Like this happening. There is a wide immoral which is people take lots and lots of stupid fiction pictures with the phones on they need to stop it. Yeah. Take pictures. Don't take pictures that you wouldn't want your mother your friends to see. I read not necessary. Or if you don't do the moment device. That's connected to the girl was a story. I don't think we talked about it here. I think I read about it on Facebook or somewhere like that. And I know I talked to Julia about I couldn't believe it. Ladies phone broke. Iphone? She took it into a T mobile. Yeah. It was is definitely a T mobile store. Maybe we talk about it here. I'm not sure. And she they said, you know, we can't really fix that. It's it's going to cost too much to fix it. The screen was broken something else. Messed up on it. So she agreed to get a new phone and that they will transfer the information from her old phone to the new phone now. In doing. So she unlocked the phone, so they could transfer the information she was talking to somebody else in the store friend of hers that actually works in that store. Why these two guys doing it turns out she had her the wireless headphones on they didn't know that they were going through her camera role? They found some. Let's just say some compromising video, right? And they started watching it and she could hear it on her headphones. So they she knew exactly what they were doing. And she's suing that. That branch of T mobile at this point. I I, you know, I couldn't believe it. I thought oh my God. Are you kidding me? These guys should totally be one of them are left the company they'll still works in the store. I thought she's already follow lawsuit and that person still works in the store. Are you kidding me? Find that guy what kind of scum owner. Now, look it's not owned by t mobile most he mobile stores are not owned by t mobile the franchises. How is crime Comey, isn't that? They haven't been arrested for them. I don't know. I don't know. I don't remember exactly where it was. And what the statue is there? But I don't know if she unlock the phone handed to them, and they come across that kind of stuff on the phone. What is the law? I don't know. I mean, she handed them unlock device with video on it that she wouldn't want anybody to see. Well, then why did you elect the phone at hand to them? Now. I'm not saying what they did was right or proper absolutely not. It's disgusting behavior. They both should be horsewhipped. But. That's different than the law. So I don't know obviously from civil standpoint sure absolutely consume. I don't know what the rules are. But i'm. Nick, I'm not in any way. Trauma victim blame that lady. Or Jeff bays. Also, anybody else go don't do that. With your phones. The I'm just saying as a general rule in my opinion. If you don't tell us or pitches than there is no risk of anybody abusing privilege or breaking the law on getting hold of those pictures. Everybody wants say private pictures of incensio intimate moments. There all devices out there that don't connect that you can do keep them private. Polaroid camera. So side. I have no transition from that. Oh, come manual the king of transitions. One thing. Everybody does want is an ipad. Week. How how about if you want to use a standalone cameras Rickwood your instant, your gonna need a device to manage those pictures on? Yeah. So. Have you see? Go. Has you know their specials page, and I found this on their specials page, and I was like this is actually really really good deal. They have a sixteen gigabytes silver I air with cellular. It's not just the wifi one. This went also sell her on it. Excellent condition for one sixty four eighty eight that deal that is a really good deal. So that an ipad air is still very capable. Ipad. I mean, I've got an ipad air here. That's. Mom, wife, sleep day. Yeah. That's the one Julie uses the ipad air, that's a great machine. And if you're not doing a whole lot of video or storage and big games or anything on their gigabytes. More than enough for browsing the internet exactly cellular connected as well. So you always seem to that probably good not intimate pitches on that. Sixteen gigs. So we're okay. Speak. God straw struggle. Sinking myself. Probably because I have to use those zoom feature quite a bit. No, this is a really good deal. If you're looking for maybe your new we've got to be cracking, your iphone or your eye pad or maybe you've got an older one that still uses. That does that won't run. Most of the newer stuff or you just need a secondary ipad that you're going to take with you. Here's one with cellular hundred it's one hundred sixty five bucks. People have have the decent these tablet high in. But then when traveling gun school some a lot that and they're worried about having stolen dropping something. Then they get a cheap one. This is getting very careful machine for the same money that you might get a lousy Chinese Android tablet, full. Absolutely one hundred percent, correct. Look, these are all been reset. So it's going to be like, you're the first user. But they've been broken in. So it's even better. I think this is a quite honestly, it's a hell of a deal OWCP gives you a ninety day warranty on it. So you got three months to play with it. You're going to find out real quick if it's not working, right? So put a link go ahead. W C to to bring them in. So tell me what's the breaking in procedure for Pat on trade we play frisbee with them. Right. Okay. But in roomful of Nerf who dropped it's not gonna do anything. Okay. Just mines. Absolutely. So I'll put a link to this ipad air sixteen gigabytes silver in color, which means it's white on the front at my MAC dot com. Antique fan podcast dot com. Less jump into our Wicky trolling. And I picked up lifting one since we had nothing, but bad news here. This seems like negativity be gone one of my all time favorite studios movie studios. David. That I think that their track record almost speaks for themselves. Although they are not completely unbe set by bad news, founder was kicked out of the company for pretty bad behavior. But let's not. Of course, we all talking about the rotor Coleman studios. No, we're talking about Pixar. Pixar animation studios, commonly referred to Pixar is a computer animation film studio based in Emeryville, Emeryville, caliF. Now, a subsidiary of Walt Disney studios so picks are actually began in nineteen seventy nine is a graphics group part of Lucasfilm. So think about that heritage now, by the way, they bought Pixar before they bought Lucasfilm. So so. Goal can do that movie. No, well, actually Disney did. So at the time remember, this is nineteen seventy nine this is after the first Star Wars movie came out and George Lucas now working on not one but two sequels to Star Wars The Empire Strikes back on the return of the some of what Lucas had done in. It wasn't even CGI. It was just what's the word. I'm looking for practical effects yet for the first Star Wars movie was groundbreaking. It was amazing. But some of the technologies he wanted to use for the upcoming movies, simply didn't exist. You know, he he's created subsidiaries underneath his own film company. And this was one of them and. They made some software. I remember it was called render manned. And I just looked on the bike APM. Correct. That would allow what we would consider primitive computers to do some animation stuff that would make his films better. And now, of course, as that subsidiary got more popular more powerful, they started doing work for other studios as well. Eventually, however, the guys who started it. Edwin cat Molin LV Ray Smith wanted to make a movie themselves pure animation, but computer animation and never been done before. And. Lucas wasn't a big believer. He knew it was going to take a lot of money. And he just wasn't really interested in doing that. Although say eighty. Stuff because he was divorced and done all the souls movies and basic cash, so he's spun out. Basically pixar. And the person who bought it was a guy by the name of Steve Jobs. He became the majority shareholder now event that was nineteen eighty six how long ago that Steve Jobs bought this nineteen eighty well. Yeah. Yeah. Certainly true that. A lot of people forget how long ago that was computer graphics in media was very very much absolute infancy infancy Batman do small-scale stuff fats. I remember that. The pixel involved in the generation of can them computer sequence in the wrath of con-, you know, the Genesis video which shows a torpedo hitting a planet and terra foreign turf. Performing thing was rented in CG, and that was a ground-breaking secrets because nobody had ever seen if that because the way they wanted to angle the cameras and move around the planet, and you see the wave of the Genesis affect on the on the planet. It was they couldn't do it. Well, yes, basically, it would have been to have that sequence done practically for what's a very short. Forty forty five fifty minutes. Fifty seconds sequence in the movie would have been prohibitively expensive. Couldn't do it. I watched a couple documentaries overtime on Pixar. And that was one of the things that focused on that. It literally could not be done. Not the way that the director of that movie wanted to be done with the camera angle in that following around. It just it couldn't be done. And so they came to Pixar Pixar did it and it came out. I remember watching that in the movie theater. That was amazing. I didn't think at the time while they made that on computers. I completely bought the this is a simulation on this spaceship that they're seeing what this would actually happen. Yeah. It was amazing. I think that's part of the reason that picks husband, successfully, then the tools are just a they want to work in computer graphics, but they don't want to show of computer graphics. They won't graphics disappear. They just wanted to make it to to use that technology to make great animated movies. Well, yes, that was the the hope that it doesn't matter. How great the technology is they didn't wanna make a computer animated movie they wanted to make a movie. Yeah. And they knew. The only way to do that is for you to believe in the characters believe in the story forget that you're watching computer animation and simply enjoy what you're seeing which is the movie because I don't care how slick it looks look at independence day two which came out a couple of years ago. Now horrible movie looks amazing is terrible movie. So we don't care how pretty it looks at the movie doesn't work, and you go back and watch the original Toy Story now which was first full length animated feature which was amazing amazing. It wasn't amazing because the way it looks and that was nineteen ninety five. But you get the point is is that modern standards toys story. She looks a little bit primitive. The point is is that. Within two minutes of getting into the movie. You completely forget you watching computer animation because you become involved into the into the story. I mean that we don't give me one. They were very clever because by choosing to do toys, put less strain, the animation the pulse of that movie where they actually show real people rough by standards. Sure that the point is is that it doesn't matter because the majority of the Thais place in the world that they could render. Well, and yeah, the story in the carrots is engaging. They could have done it with stick fingers, and you would enjoy enjoyed as much. No, I remember watching the documentary, and they spend a lot of time on that movie Toy Story, and how is developing and they found a company that would distribute the movie, and that was Disney and Disney their CEO at the time insisted that it be grittier. So they actually made the Woody care for kind of an ass to. And when they first saw the first rough cut of it. It didn't work at all. Because no one liked Woody and. They did something very brave. They went and changed everything without basically without Disney's approval. Disney said scrap it it's not going to work, and they said, Nope. They took two weeks rewrote, the whole thing and it worked and what we got was pretty much the work of those two weeks. Thirty million dollar budget, which is nothing. It's nothing even in ninety five. That's nothing for a full length movie opening weekend. Twenty nine point one million dollars. It made its money back almost in the first weekend. Gross unadjusted. So it's not doesn't count today's dollars. In North America was one hundred ninety one million worldwide three hundred seventy three million. And that's just the movie that's nothing to do with mentioned or anything. No merchandising must be billions. And that also didn't consider. Videotape at the time or DVD's or you know, remember this ninety five DVD's come out until ninety nine. That's when they hit. No copy of soy story that we had homes on type also sitting with me. Here's my story about Toy Story. I was I had. Gone through divorce and that was living on my own. And I was living in this little duplex. It's a nice place. Don't get me wrong. And Rachel my oldest daughter would come over every Friday night when I got out of work, and I would have her every week and until Sunday when she went back to her mom's house, and it was heartbreaking to hated shoot always cry when she had to go back to her mom's house, she had so much fun with me. But it was just the two of us. You know, I would let her watch whatever she wanted to watch. Now, I was broke. I mean, I was I did not have much money. All my money went to the bills and making sure Rachel is taken care of and could eat when she was at my house. If you look at pictures from me from like a year in there. I'll send them to sometime I've actually had people jokingly said I looked like I was suffering from aids. It looked like I was I was way way skinnier than I should have been. But it's still a happy memory in that I remember she would get there. And we go for walks and stuff like that. And that's what do you want to watch toy store? I had Toy Story on videotape. And it was that big poofy VHS package. Remember, those the the case was kind of poofy Phelan. We wore that original copy out and actually had to buy another copy. That's how many times we washed it. I remember laying on the couch with Rachel snug up against she's all of three years old because this was ninety seven. So the movie obviously was out on videotape, and she would have her head on my arm, and we're both facing in her she'd sweat when she fell asleep at my arm will enslave would be soaked in her sweat, but I would wait to the movies over because I moved. She would immediately wake up and keep watching the movie, I watched Toy Story, I'm not exaggerating three hundred times not exaggerating because you'd watch it four or five times every weekend, and I didn't mind because it was such a fantastic movie. Now, I could I could literally talk with the movie with the dialogue. And I haven't seen it at this point probably ten years, maybe more, but even coal all these years later still likes Toy Story. That's how good that movie. Is they followed it up with a bug's life which. Head a much bigger budget of one hundred and twenty million dollars. It did make it's money back overtime. But I think everybody agrees a bug's life is not as good as as Toy Story. It's it's an okay movie. But I don't think it comes close to Toy Story. No, I think. Yeah. It's it's. Well, because I've always been I was preferred ants. I thought answers a better movie came out around the same time. It was the thing. Kind of a remake of. Not the magnificent seven because the magnificent seven were actual confines has similar movie that way, you know, it's the same conceit, which is the guy thinks he's hiring. Hiring warriors. Protect them from the bullies. All right. And then he has out and get the guys to help them. It was it was a little bit derivative clever. But it was the third movie that came out with was Toy Story two. Now Toy Story to actually I think that's the one they rewrote in two weeks. Regardless choice story to comes out that was supposed to be a direct to DVD release that wasn't going to hit the theaters, but they made it such a good movie. Some people say it was a better story than the original Toy Story. Yep. That that scene with the cowgirl. Yeah. You say, no, I'm watch toy soy to again recently. And I hey, I've seen the secrets before realize it was the same sequence. They did for the bear. And Toy Story. Three kind of this is remember the housing dies of being with my owner. And then I got left behind. They didn't Toy Story two as a grown, man. I was choked out. Good. I'm like, oh my God. Got me. So they they hit the ground running really well their fourth movie was monsters Inc. I thoroughly enjoyed monsters. Yeah. Such a good movie. And I thought the casting of John Goodman, was brilliant. Most people want to point the finger at sully, which is what's his name the comedian? Junkin? The other one is. Billy crystal. Everybody likes to point to Billy crystal of what he was perfect for the role, and he was, but I still think is John Goodman that really is the the heart of that movie. I think I think the concept behind that movie. It's just amazing the. Real that they use teleporting does come into your midnight. And they get power from your fear is a fantastic premise on the idea of monsters being like a performance to cer-, try and scale you scare the kids. Themselves a terrified of the case. I think it was the v movie that that made picks are what they are today. However because up to this point they were fun movies. They did have that stirring seen in Toy Story. But it was the growth of a character and the emotion in finding nemo that man, what a powerful movie that is you know, it. It was fantastic. It was so much better than I thought it was going to be, but I shouldn't have been surprised because at that point. It's a Pixar movie and even to this day, if it's a Pixar movie, you know, it's going to be good. Although I will say they may have lost a little bit of that just a little bit. Can be can hit gold every time. I think probably. Finding funding nemo I would say is probably one of these probably alongside Toy Story is the best I've ever made. There's one in there that there's two when there that I think deserve to be right there. All the next one. They're all seek. Yeah. I kind of saying criminals, it's something different. Is the best fantastic for movie ever made? But that's that's my point. He's almost so good. But he's not picks on movie. Here on is also the first movie that they hired an outside director to come in to make his movie at Pixar. That didn't start life as a Pixar movie. If you will he came in pitch this idea. Went to Pixar. Make it cars after the Pixar was okay. What everyone wants to dump on the front Chaz on love the calls. Maybe I think defend testing. I haven't seen cars three. I haven't seen country yet either. But I think they all hugely underwrites it, I think people might to sneak down on them because they would have pet projects which unless but actually I think I I think the caused me great movies. Good movies. Yeah. We'll I think I've watched the many many times, and I think they capture something that people don't appreciate. But I I think I really enjoyed them. Reta to was the next one. I didn't know what to make of rat tat to we. I liked it better. The second time. I saw that. I did the first time. Yeah. It's it's it has some really, yes. Really great moments incredibly realized characters. I think the problem is is that. For me. Still I find the premise is is just flowed. I think the eye of of of a rant the wants to be a chef is eight just quite get doesn't quite a little bug. When I roll. The next two movies. However, I would say is. It may be there to best movies. And I say that after saying what I said about finding nemo. I'd probably put finding nemo number three. I think they're too best movies or the next to wall e which is so good. Now, I say that. And I watched this morning knowing that we were going to do this. I decided I was going to watch us a little bit of Wally. I watched the whole damn thing. I couldn't I couldn't stop. It's that good. It is there's hardly any dialogue. And you completely by these two little robots fell in love that completely in love. So he's the problem because I know what the next movie after will say, which is up. Yup. Yeah. Now, the problem. They are great move. I take a doorway. I've watched it so many times. In terms of looking at pixels output. I think the problem both those movies have is they have long sequences in them that are better than the rest of the movie. I agree. That kind of you know wish. The whole those sequences won't that first twenty minutes where there is no dialogue. They print. The tire story out. We have no dialogue just from watching. What this robot does? And the first ten minutes of us. Basically do the main characters entire life leading his motivation again without any there isn't a human ally. That doesn't get choked up watching the first ten minutes of I mean, you know, you completely there's no dialogue, and you completely understand that this man loved this woman so much, and he never did the one thing that she always wanted to do never did it, and that's one regret in his life. He it tears him up that he didn't do this thing. And that's basically take her out into the world. And after up, I think there's some really good movies. But none of them match. That those right there. That's the peak. Toy story. Three comes out. It's okay. I liked it. But three is a good movie. But again that another one that suffers because it has that place equi- at the end. Some much better the rest of the movie it is. Yeah. Cars to this. Okay. I think is just as good as cars brave. I love brave, but it doesn't really feel like a Pixar movie to be honest. I remember watching us coal was pretty young. When we watched brave, and he did not want to watch brave. He was adamant he did not want to watch this movie. I kept saying let's watch it. We I have for while, you know, watch brave buddy. It's a Pixar movie you're going to like it. I think he didn't want to watch it or like it because it was a girl character, and he was way into the. I'm a boy thing. I don't like girl toys, you know, how boys get sometimes. He watched that movie scowling until the three little brothers run through the house naked, and we had he laughed so hard at that scene. His face turn red. And he kept making us back up the movie to watch that scene over and over. And it made me laugh out loud in my face, turn red simply because he was laughing so hard at that's my memory of brave. I liked the story concept. I liked that. She's here's this girl. That's every bit as capable of the boys, and she ends up proving it I liked the story. But it was okay. I think I brave is one of those ones where they had to do a complete pivot and on it. I think with Brian the director might be fired. I fell came across in the movie, and they will. You know, something I think the problem. The other problem with brave is the star of the movies have. That and computer mentioned before. Me. Couldn't get a story was I couldn't get pulse. How great her walls wasn't. Of course. That's where the technology is over riding the story monsters university was the next one. It's okay. I didn't I didn't take to that one toll the one I didn't take to the next one inside out. I come to see where you coming from with that. Fabulous. It wasn't an Ottawa's onto weld. I just thought the premise is really stupid. Yeah. These little little people live inside your head. And they're the different emotions and stuff that you feel. I. I the only thing I really liked was Lewis black being angry all the time that I liked the rest of it. I was the site. This is this is not good. The problem. I had with it wasn't so much the premise the premise that did the carrots is where they left the Brian and had to go on a journey. I just didn't. I agree with you hundred percent, the good dinosaurs. Actually, a pretty decent movie. But again, this Disney animation movie, it does not feel like a Pixar movie. And it's yet another, you know. Going on a boy edge type of thing. The next one though was really good finding Dory. Now, it's still kind of finding nemo and it picks up immediately after finding nemo, and it still has the charm of finding nemo. I just don't think it has the heart of finding nemo. It was just everybody like Dory from finding nemo. Let's have a movie that really focuses on Dory and some much of a retread in this movie fake. Okay. I know what you mean. But actually it was an incredible executed. You know, had some great characters in it. It did. But at the end of the day, it just felt like they just had to make a sequel. I I never thought finding nemo needed a sequel while he's his thing back in the day. Picks said they weren't gonna do sequels suck it into it for toys story too. Because they were trying to get out of the what they thought was a quite an egregious contract that they had with Disney in terms of because basically they did all the work on the money. And this week. We're going to make a sequel with you. Well, that was basically what it was Disney said we're going to do it anyway. So we're going to do. So they kind of. The floodgates really cars. Three was the next one the eighteenth movie have made so far. I haven't seen it. I don't know anything about it. I don't really have any desire to see this. On on king to see. I just have to it yet. That's all the calls. Maybe the nineteenth movie. I don't know. If you've seen cocoa yet. It's extremely well done. I really liked to cocoa. Yeah. I haven't seen that on the kids have seen. It's it's basically the. I like that number twenty is we're wrapping up the Sepah soda tech fan is the incredible too. Really good movie. I liked it will. Wanting a sequel to the incredible 's and it picks up, right? Literally, the beginning of incredible. To is the end of Incroyables. I it will good as incredible 's. I agree. I agree. Yup. I did like the discovery mode that you get in the incredible. Especially with the kids kind of learning their powers, and and Jack Jack being what he is. You could suggest that the idea of, you know, the good guy being brain control to be bad is is slot done tripe inside. But it was still really well them. I I really liked the incredible too. I thought it was well done. I it's one of those movies that is as good as the original. So that is our Wiki trolling Pixar. I don't think they've made a dud yet. But of course, I haven't seen cars three they've made a couple that aren't as great as the others. There's some movies in there. I never want to see a sequel. I never wanna see a Wally sequel. I never want to see a sequel. The rest are what about we missed out planes. That wasn't made by picture wasn't it. No. It's a Disney animation movie. They just made it in the same universes. Cars. Clients as well. Rescue movies. I've seen five minutes of each maybe. I think the thing is I'm a sucker for the home. Call thing I make. With may wear low people don't like it trips. Retrigger is certainly does. So we'd love to hear back from you guys, send us an E mail. It's the show at tech podcast dot com. Or of course, you can go to tech podcast dot com or my MAC dot com and leave a comment in the show notes. Course, we are on Twitter at tech podcast. It's amazingly, and we are on the Facebook David we're on for next week. I'll see them, my friend, see.

Pixar apple Disney David Chicago Jeff Bezos Amazon Samsung director David Cone Tim Robinson AT Tim Robertson David Cohen Brooke
TechFan 427 - It's all gone a bit pear-shaped

TechFan

1:12:43 hr | 4 months ago

TechFan 427 - It's all gone a bit pear-shaped

"Tim's faction walked down by technical difficulties. Go to show today. You could say everything's gone a bit passionate tech fund four to seven. Everybody is one of your regular co-hosts here David Cohen. And with this is tech for number two to six. I think I checked five ten minutes ago and since then we've had technical problems and the reason that Tim is not here is because he's having massive technical problems so joined by owing who was only Geeks punctured loss week and is here with us again this way high and I and I have a lot less technical problems I hope you can. You can get cry. You can't get crime running on your on that pro which is yeah. I do not understand that it is what did I just say. We were two eight six forty seven. Yeah this is four twenty seven so I don't know what I'm talking about on this show have to fix that enticed as they say so still living the crazy times how things with you are. You still crise yet. Yeah it's everybody. The only thing you're allowed to drive for now is Going to the store or going to the doctor or essential work driving and people don't follow that though there's there's they're they're going to get a little more serious ended. Sounds like yeah that took in here that talking here about something to pull people either an awesome wake they. Are they going while the doing so a very much? The same thing you fat. I found out just before we started recording today. That both our prime minister in the health sector secretary have full covered nineteen symptoms so going very well so to death. That will happen to me if they have. That means the whole cabinet. Has IT so expert? Talk government grind to a halt. Beck's really I've been clean straight days. It's scary we. We looked at that and I put my stocks out because the stock market was making me really nervous and usual. Great timing right before it did. Its rebound yes recent rebound. But I think we're GONNA. We haven't seen the worst of this yet. There is a suggestion that we're GonNa get you get Y you sophis- that we'll have a couple of months of restrictions and that will keep the level of infections down but then when they relax those restrictions bounce back up again and then we'll have to kind of keep bouncing through until enough people have enough immediacy from having had the disease ready actually had it means he kicks in and kind of conduct pushes it down. Who the hell knows at this point on night in the TV? They said that you know it's usually worse in the winter than the summer so they said when we go to summer the other half of the world goes to winter and they think that might cyclic back again to because they'll they'll raise and they'll bring it back here as we go towards winter gap the only thing that seems to be set in his. The everything is very uncertain. Exactly Yeah Yeah so. This is interesting but you know. I had a long cove with my company this morning. And one of the things. We were talking about how we dealing with it from a business continuity perspective and because we're all cloud based ready fat. Yeah the fact that we've had to close our office and are working from how he hasn't really slowed down that much at all so where we're a small company but we are quite fortunate in that respect but I know there's an awful lot of people who are struggling with this and an awful lot of people around forty have jobs that just don't really support homeworking in. Yeah if you have an office job. It's fine but if you have anything that involves doing things you can't really often bring Heim. He cannot bring the Amazon warehouse high from the packages Kenya. I'm wondering what they do about that. Because they said there may be slower than normal forgetting things. Though I see Amazon guy drive up and down the street every day. Now Sometimes. Several Times a day going by so obviously. They're trying apple. I I work for a lucky enough. You know that they're big company and they're already setup for this but it's still harder you know used to be. I just walk down the hall tap on. Someone's hey we need a problem when you got to fix this now. I've got to find him online and set up a time to talk and get the conferencing up and running with him or her and it. Just you know it's it's harder but we're getting stuff done. Yeah one of the one of the Complaints Achy. My Seo made was He said the moment he feels like. He's working more hours than he would. Normally he's took seventy seven day and and it's all back to back. Calls and descends is getting conference call fatigue a I agree with him. I usually get on about eight and I'm on to seven or longer. Sometimes I find myself working harder and I don't know if it's because I'm not being distracted because it's just harder to do but you sort of get tired of Webex in your face for a while but yeah. That is a problem. It's interesting from the things that come up my again. My See. He has his bed with teams. Which is what we use that. I'm if he has more than five people on the call. He can't see their faces at once. Because basically populates the screen. And then it leaves everyone else. Conifers a small box at the bottom and then they They video and he comes through when they speak and he doesn't like that he likes to be able to save all on so he started using zoom. Because that allows you see everybody at once which is a you know any start going on about ill. We need to get zoom in this. That and the other I was thinking he was meaning as a fullback. Two teams if cased cased teams went down so I went and get got pricing on. You know how much it would cost the whole company to get zoom. And what the pros and cons. What the different software levels were. And then he went. No I just meant just for me for the management. I'm not I'm not interested in spending six seven thousand pounds a year on licenses for everybody and that's kind of what it would cost. Allow there are discounts available because all of these companies are recognizing that people using the more answer they wrote. They're offering discounts. The webex discount that she generous. We like that. Yeah but we get teams as poverty. Three six five subscriptions so that Lavar of default choice and many of our clients typically in the public sector in the warriors have Microsoft office three six five loss so they get teams at the Bundy. Foam is okay. You know it does the job that all of these things much much really. There's not and there's no anyone that stands head and shoulders above the other arena. So my back's I've used. Webex a couple of times without the clients who have webex accounts. That's probably use facetime in that poll. I don't know why they chose Webex sits but when we set it up there's a button you can press that puts everybody up at grid instead of allied and We were laughing that it looked like the beginning of the Brady Bunch. Yes Oh you're in the middle so I was looking up and looking left and looking right there are people laughing because it's like exactly what I thought and it works fine until you get maybe thirty people on and then you get the audio is good but some of the video starts to fade so we dow fate turned off our video until we speak just to keep the bandwidth down for people who don't have oughta bandwidth. Yeah did you say that? That video has been going around about the light he was. I think it was the same cool. And she decides halfway through the coal to the bathroom and she gets tired. Just see again showing that great of AP we just see. This horrified looks salt spread across the team as they realize what's going on. Yes and she. She very carefully puts her phone down on the floor. Desert like she's she's pointing yourself. She's doing some sort of weird tick tock video but it's because she's trying to be able to see the screen while she's set in the bathroom and she just has no idea that the cameras on so as as a default. I tend to always have the camera because I I mean I like using the camera for one to one because then you know just like we. We sometimes each other you know. We can't see each other speaking. And so you might get your voices might collide but for a whole of eight or ten or even more than that people. I don't see the value of the video that Sh- because you've got the time little box and you can't econ monash raval faces at wants to see who's going to speak ranks. I think maybe forty five people in it and they don't fit on the screen. Yeah Mac pro and they all don't fit on the screen but I think that one of the reasons why how does teach everybody did know how to put their picture in the icon. Because that's not yet revealed line on Webex for me. I had to do it on the on the web. Client not on the MAC client but they want to know who's on the call so there because theoretically once you get the link you just jump in and assist. We had Cisco Meetings Systems that on the tables at work there cook into Webex. And maybe that's why they picked. Webex 'cause they they hook together so someone can sit in. A CONFERENCE ROOM. Used the conference room thing. It'd be a webex person on the call and it's weird you get all these people come in and you go. Who's that I don't know that is because they're worried about people jumping in on calls me so that's a problem as well. The other issue on finding is that Obviously everyone's had to adapt to this and companies like mine which already used to. It is fine. We've never used teams as much we using it now. Which I guess the good thing really But you know for the kids schooling Musonda College and they're relatively tech savvy. They already have classroom systems and management systems and stuff so in the main they using that and I think they they also have teams. I think some of his teachers have set up a couple of teams channels for distributing sophomore heavy. But my daughter's school who has never done anything like this before they you know. They're embracing technology in the from that point. Uvs Good but the problem is every single teacher needs to be using a different system and we're actually juggling about five or six different systems now to keep up with doses work and it's it's exhausting here because he ever. I'm sorry that many people know well. No the problem is is that each teacher is solving the problem on their own. So the going out and finding something so somebody will use Google and then somebody else were used like some educational system they found and then somebody else will use on the open source. Somebody doesn't do you like that. So they're just using email and sending out sending out worth three mile but again then you know one one this. There's one take the teach- one day he'll scan it and send it as a picture the next day next day. Sending word documents And so they need printing because my my daughter can't work off the screens to work off a phone screen or paper to war with say. Then you're trying to figure out. How do I print it now and always upside down and you know the scans not very clear and a justice massive overhead? And I'm doing I'm doing quite technical support. Small wife to try and keep them top of all of this and then you get a ride. Just well I've set you something to do on this system and we some educational websites on C. Then you had to register and then you have to sit out. And sometimes they need to client and so said they might also can't necessarily user IPAD. She's got use a computer and it's just like it's kind of out of control really and it shows. There are so many options available but without a little bit strategy and thought behind it it can become could just another? I've ahead and the the other thing is the quantity of work. She's gang is just like immense is yet. She sat down and did it. All you know she'd be conduct during a forty five hour week. Just doing schoolwork and I am. I know for they don't do this much in. The school compensating for not being in the class. I think that that whole time should be used for homework. Maybe and maybe there's an aspect of some of the teachers going. Well you know I want to justify my ongoing salary so I need to be juicing all the time maybe this is where I am listening to gas. He has a sound bite. I love which is You know I don't know I'm just making it up go along. That's what it sounds like. Except I don't know if that comes from raiders of the lost Ark or what movie but it's I love that because that's the way I feel half the time it just make it up as we go along traffic. That's exactly that's that's awful. I don't have kids so I don't see that I watched my neighbors. Kids are having that kind of problem. We'll hear the weird thing. Is here my neighbors teacher. He teaches in I I don't know if it's Oakland. Public schools are Berkeley public schools. And I said well are all the kids online now and he says well we have computers. We can give out but not all the kids. 'cause it's not an affluent area have Internet. So if one kid can't have it they're not allowed to give it to everybody else has it becomes. That person's being shunned said everybody is important. Yeah I get oh I completely get it but they should be like okay. We're not using the buildings in the heating. We got enough money to buy Internet now. It's not they should be able to get a deal from comcast because they're all about schools and stuff so they're matching like eight one of the things. Which if you decide to solve the problem. There are easy ways to solve the problem. You just you buy laptops with Simson or you buy mobile hotspots with a limited amount of data on and distribute those out as well to the kids who need it. It doesn't sound like the same thing that that's insoluble but again it's just like we've just been saying rather than each school district making going along you ideally want strategy behind it so we all. Kinda JOINS UP. And that's that's where it becomes hard because then you need meetings slides and decision makers and You know and you need to push it through a supply chain and all of that and that that is difficult to do especially in these times when everyone is working from home and not necessarily carnival joined out away. They normally are well. That's a question I had for. You does did you do you find and I I hear it on for people I talked to. I don't see it happening at apple because they're already streamlined. Decision making to to work like this. You know we do a lot of our stuff's on our computer but are decisions being made quicker with less oversight. Because is harder I think in in some respect the way Mike companies responded as they are a senior management team are having and there's only like fifty sixty overs but the senior management team Having a call every day in the afternoon and they talk about issues and so from that respects we all seem decisions get made more quickly than I normally would when they only tend to meet for once a week and even then they only have limited amount necessary. Cover the entire. You do get things which are was bumped down to the bottom of the gender and never get looked at some right. They go on for months and months and months. So in that respect we we are improving our decision making but then again that doesn't scale very well so if you are and what having words for law public sector organisations UK. I know that nobody can doing is feeding into any decision making process. Then you have to file at least a week before the meeting happens so it can be processed massage importance to the agenda and supporting papers circulated to everyone is going to be there and then they had to have the meeting and they can. They have to have time to coveted. Reached that point of the agenda to discuss it. You know and you not always brought into condos support. The work done your afternoon. You know and so then Eka find. Decisions are not made because they go. Well we this this this point this point and this point we don't really understand so we're GONNA have to go back and ask ask for more currency on that and so that meant pokes for another month you know. So you can imagine those sorts of bureaucracies really gonNA struggle in this environment. My you're actually doing all that stuff from home and you relying on the people who are doing the decision making to a little bit more of the lead Legwork to make sure that reform to making the decision rather having an army of bureaucrats come to help them get everything table full of decision making a mean and I think that some of the difficulties facing in the UK at the moment is a big problem at the minute that none of the hospitals are all the hospitals are saying they don't have the proper personal protective equipment to deal with virus with patients with the virus. There are huge shortages. Now you see pictures on TV of the warehouses full of this stuff but the problem is without essential bureaucracy to identify who needs wat- who's GONNA receive it. When's it coming? Get it on the Laurie. Get somewhere to accept it and finally and it away someone. The Hustle win distributed inside the hospital. That is that. That's Burt Bata Logistics. But the problem is if you don't have a logistics organization geared up to do that because normally hospitals don't have to do that. They just order what they need from local suppliers and they can't do that in the moment. Then you have a big gap and it's again that clearly. Our government is struggling to solve the moment. I think they're they're basically their solution. Is that bringing me army into one thing on one thing. The military knows about is about logistics. Indeed I was GonNa ask you that if the military is getting involved. I you know we have the same issues here. I was wondering if you saw the article that yesterday the on. Musk is going to turn one of his giger factories into making respirators head about that. I hope it works. Because that's so I'm asthmatic. So this whole virus scares me to death because I've already been in the hospital twice this year with with a bad flu just before this stuff broke out and was about close to being put on a respirator. I mean they were feeding oxygen. And so that's me because I'll be one of the people they said. Well he's an older guy will give it to the young people because doctors have to start you know doing triage on. Who gets what I think? That's the whole idea of social. Listening right is towards dot have so many people at one time yes to try and stop the spread of the speed of the transmission of illness by keeping people physically away so the the voracity forest is not only able at close range is not something that hangs around in the air for longtime every mutates to do that. We we were in trouble so as long as you keep away from people and you don't touch surfaces which people might have corporal breathed on then relatively hall to spread it but the problem is people interacting 'cause proximity point easy to spread it so that's the challenge we saw all are equivalent here in the UK is a dyson. You know the company a vacuum cleaners and the very expensive fans and stuff like that. Oversee Electric Motors. That move air is their specialty. And somehow they've also put themselves forward and they're trying to get a model of ventilator up and running in their factories instead the his the thing the hardware is one thing but having people who can run the hardware receiver. That's going to be the shortfall. I think Rather than you know normally countries are very good at changing out stuff when they have to show within a couple of weeks. Lost people chaining at respirators or ventilators. As long as it doesn't establish design that you can take and kind of build the bits for but but having people who know how to use them is the is the challenge I I have a ventilator here in the house because I have sleep apnea and about twelve months ago I was a I was leveled up my sleep apnea. They decided that the C. Pap that continuous pressure machine. I had was not out to the job anymore because it couldn't go so high enough pressures the unneeded so they put me on to bypass up which is means rather having one pressure. That's all the time basically Ape IS OFFENSIVE. Nicer condo breathes for you so you have a break pressure for in breath and then a low pressure for the out breath but you're varied so you actually have to basic. The machine ends up timing you to whatever it set for your breathing breathing independently and that is effectively. It is it says it right there on. The box says it's ventilator. So how do you wear a face mask? I've a mosque that I face every night. That has to be tight on so it doesn't leak. And then the highs the custom machine. So there's no oxygen evolved room but it's actually pressurizing that and it's actually conned making me breathe and obviously higher end ventilator. Does that for people who actually breathe themselves so it actually puts pressure inside at eight You know the the need to use your die from muscles what she breathe. If you're not able to breathe on your own but I think the ventilation for covert nineteen. These is in the middle ground. The problem is you can breathe but your lungs were full of fluid and so you need assistance. You need to make sure that the right pressure gets into get down to the Busselton secure sedated so I don't know whether I could find out how to use ventilator in a in a in a medical kind of supportive role Yvonne wanted to but you know I can't imagine it's not complicated but you'll take the skills to do that and then to be able to configure the machine to to do that and then obviously keep an eye on the patient to make sure that is keeping them keeping them well on keeping them. So that's the skills gap so having the technology is one thing but the skills as well are they talking about. They've set up in London and Failed Hospital in a conference center is going to have to wards of two thousand beds each quip offensive. Isis too because London is a big hot spot for this disease. it seems to be infecting and creating more patients in London than anywhere anywhere else in the country but they were talking about what possible run to patients. Two beds one ventilator. Sounds like Right level of care right there. I wondered I used to scuba diving. Scuba TANKS THROUGH VENTILATORS. Et sort of them in your mouth and they push at you when you breathe in and you can set the pressure on him. I was like why not just use scuba equipment. They have a solution for this. They just need the air being generated. I guess Khabour understand. There's different levels like I've been on a ventilator y just like your sleep apnea machine where it just helps me breathe They use it for medications. Asthma MEDICATIONS AT TIMES. But some of these people were being intimidated. Which is that's yours me. I'm so coster PHOBIC. I don't know if I did have to knock me out to do that. Yeah not not something. That is an unskilled job. Toge- deep down. He couldn't get in the right place. Go to not damage anything on the way. You've got an yeah you've got to not. Hec perfection by putting that that is Skill stuff then. Yeah yeah well. This is depressing. Was Try something else so have you been. You said it'd be working from home. Have you had time to do anything enjoyable while you're lots in House? I'm only part way through it because I'm being very careful as I build it. I got Dr Dino's and small computers. Awhile ago I've got I've got one. That's like three dollars sitting in my hand here. That's got WIFI built in. So there's a guy who makes these displays called LEXI's L. I. Xie that they look Nick C. Tube. But they're done with plastic egg inlet for to light up the numeral you need and so. I took some of his code. He he did library and I been building a digital. Caulk out of it and it's really amazing because it turns on and go get the fetches the time and it's right three blocks for this little thing. It's I don't even know makes it? I'd have to get trying to name. Remakes bought them off. It's called D. One mini kind of cool. Also got a kit to make an old. Pdp Eleven Computer France Ano and you stick on these are on the back and they have the code available and it emulates the PCP. Eleven of the time you even plug a terminal into it which. I use my computer to do which I find funny. I use a computer that has thousands of times more processing power to connect to a computer. That's emulating in something from the nineteen seventy s kind of fun. I I was at a trade show a few years ago and I saw. They had a similar kind of thing but it was an emulator of the original the marketplace that kind of kicked off and say Yeah. That's the one year the peak. I call them. I remember the inside. There was another one like that but you enter. You did it by toggle. Switches on the front the inside. The that's right. Yeah Yeah and they have to switch tacos and this is the pay. Dp eleven a little bit like that. Yep It has switched dog on the front it was a UNIX based machine. It was a little further along but yeah if you look at this panel he will say well. That's just a modern more modern insight. It's it looks same kind of thing. Different color yeah. I've I've I've always presumed the people bought as I can pieces lining the solitaire wasn't and that was the one that Kinda read the really kicked off kind of computing Asuka Valley. That was the one that Steve Wozniak sore and the marks of wrote the basic foreign and whenever CDs I think what how can you basically because all it has its total switches. But I presume you have to connect something else to it to actually use a computer. Yes I had one so believe it or not used sometimes used audio tape recorders so it you get a modem on it and you just record the sound of motive makes some simplifying it but and then you play that back in it loads in so and then there was paper tape readers that some people have the equivalent of toggle switches. So you could save what Utah Gould in on paper tape or you could get. Someone gave you a tape. It was already recorded that. Deloitte those programs up and they had. I remember when the floppies came. I had an early him. Cy and we use to a couple of us. We shared it. Believe it or not and we bought shugart eight inch floppy disks. They were huge thing was immense and it didn't hold very much on the farthest but you could save took forever to read and write from them but in those days it was kind of cool because it worked on that first generation tube computer that are high school and that was the same thing it used an IBM typewriter and paper. Tape Punch and reader to get things in an off of it and it was a tic TAC toe was an advanced program for it. Yeah 'cause I mentioned most of the stuffy. Doom competes like that. It's the sort of thing. Is that nowadays pokey calculator? You're probably your wife says more consecutive do you watch war games right. They say walk INS. Yeah and he what he was showing there. We built a thing called the demon dialer and pick up your modem dial a phone number and listen for Modem tone if it didn't get one or two hang up and go to the next number and you let that run on run all day long and you'd come back and try and twenty five thirty modems that answered what they are so you start hacking on him that that really happened coup so interestingly enough you talking about how do we know they're Just a couple of days ago I was putting together a a new system eyeball which is called a pie top and this is effectively as a laptop for Spree Pie. You don't know about that. Yeah so basically you get this kit with the roles reply and what you do is you. Now you slide the cable down an underneath where part where keeble goes this kind of like look set of magnetic rails and then towards the end. There's a couple of busboys and what you do. Is You screw your reply in there and you connect it to the US this kind of Mayo USB preowneds coming out in the back of the things he plugged into the and it's all designed to match the Roth report. Form factor plug the US being there and then put it down and then there's a kind of a a mother a little ball that goes on the side that plugs into the HD and the Audio Jack at the Ross reply And that's that's used to give it yet to give your screen output and then there's like a like a kind of cooling system that clamps down over the top and what that does is it also she gives the plugs into the pins on the side of the rows ripon. Gp Pins back that gives you power to the board see put all that script and you may choose. Usd caught in the slot. The Cable Becker. And then turn on this. This kit comes with a fourteen screen a an cabled and all the outputs you need and then there's a whole lot of other stuff that you can plug in into this rail system but basically when you turn on them basically. What it's done is is made. Iran re Pints Laptop. And you know it's it's actually really really cool because it takes the Ross pies great but the problem is you need a lot of kind of stuff. Tobacconists of it. You need to have a good. You need to keep on a mouse. You need to have power supply. You need to have a connection to a monitor and the problem with the Monitor is most bonuses are connected to other things and with many of having laptops now. I don't have any freestone assists in my house so actually doing anything wrong. Replies kind of a bit of a pain in the neck because you have to get it out fundamentalist plucking altogether. Sit Down with me and then when you finish you need to put it all away again. This is great because they can just sit with rows ripon lap and just do whatever I want with it and it's all self contained and yes they it comes with some. East isn't educational things so it comes with some car bomb cheesed. You can use as a template to make things that you can then put raspberry Pi accessories into and then has a breakout boards and speak current software. That you can plug in under the laptop cable next two rows free pie so you can start doing prototyping or interfacing using some of the the hats and the things like that. Do you can get for US reply. So it's a little bit for maker Kit really but in the form factor and it yeah is is really kind of cool bright green thing. I'm looking at. Yeah when I when I when I got out in the kitchen table. Alexander galls type things playing on this nintendo switch anyone. Oh my God that is the mice disgusting color. It is kind of a straight. Why was looking at the Pie for net by top four now and that they decided that everybody wants aqua colored? Things were strange colors. They're having collars so it's like two hundred forty nine dollars. It's not bad it's hold is harder to get hold of now. That used to be because I don't think they sold. It was originally kickstarter project. This I don't think they sold as many as they were hoping for. They actually have like a desktop version. That conner looks like a raspberry Pi Mac Way You don't have the the battery the laptop keyboard and if he might not it's basically just the the surrounded big screen you pluck you bring your cable monster to it but the the selling now is almost like a standalone desktop unit. The just basically beefs up there refine that's based on the four so the pilot is apparently tried one yet but apparently much more powerful and much more usable as kind of as a as a full desktop computer replacement. But yeah you want them around this got this it was not it was a like a boxin. Ebay so I pay much less than the guy right for it which I was Kinda pleased he was interesting. I'd ordered one a little bit like this'll kickstarter. The actually didn't build the Rosbif Pi. Ata The idea was that it was a laptop dock style finger. Just get in on the side and they need at the side and it never. I've been told it was sent and then never arrived. He was driving Christmas and a never came so anyway a few weeks ago I received this and they went. Oh yeah there was a problem with our distributor in the UK and apparently some of them were sent to uk but then never got shit to now. They don't know what happened to them so they can send you another one said. Excuse me mom back. Yeah well if you know. That's a problem. Reach out to your customers. Make sure that what you sent to them arrived. It does surprise me. I mean I have. I have a cut another board called the MOJO. And it's actually been outdated now. That is like sort of like a Raspberry. Pi with a F. PGA on it. It came with a. I love the name Pie. Top because it's on top. And it came a embedded micro. Led Display Board. Just conches on top of it. I was playing with that. And here's a here's a lesson for people who do raspberry Pi those things programming. Don't pug more than one in at the same time on your computer. 'cause I was trying. I was trying to download a program to one. I was downloading. It wasn't working downloading it and I realized I was pushing it to the PGA board instead. I've completely disabled the small. The talks over the US the USB processor so it's now dead. I have to figure out how to put a tag on it. And Reese group Flash. Because it's dead program wasn't running now. I know why feel so stupid. Why did I am literally WENT DOES NOT COMPETE? And then dine. We'll be the thing that flashes to says pick a port in defaults to a port talking to my raspberry Pi. Sure go now do it again. I'll do it again until you. So that's kind of fun. I the other thing I'm doing is like we talked about before on last week. Catching up on TV. That I just haven't had a chance to watch. Yeah you know. It's it seems like when when I'm working I have A. I have a long commute. I drive an hour and a half in bad traffic each way every day. I could take a bus an apple bus but that would take two hours but the advantages. I can work on the bus because they have wi fi on there so when I get home we have dinner. It's already like eight thirty quarter to nine. By the time we're done cleaned up and I just don't even want to sit down and watch television screen. Yeah so A lot of bad. Tv now gets an finished picard. Last night that was the ending was fantastic. I'm I'm only about halfway through so spoil sports. They advertise though that the next season is coming so they've got renewed. I think I think as soon as they produced the first couple of episodes it got kind of auto renew drive there and then because you know they knew it was going to be. It was going to be kit saying it was slow to start though. Yeah a lot of these shows are because they know that some people are going to binge over over episodes because people who don't watch each week by week but wait until then sit down and watch it and so I think they they're in the habit of taking their time and spending a lot of time establishing the scenario and the characters and where they are and that sort of thing now. The problem with that is is that you could do that. Well we can do badly. I know I know from watching. Some of the marvel shows on Netflix. That some of those they just seem to drag because you know I. I don't like the situation where something dramatic happens and you think right. They've got a response to that straight away and then the next episode. They just don't like it didn't happen. Yeah or we must get to that. It's not due today. We're GONNA do quoc sitting around talking about it before we get over there and the ones that we get on broadcast TV here. I flash and SUPERGIRL DC. Oh aren't they some? Sometimes there's a line that but something that flick shows of suffered from that as well where a they just decided to focus on away from the main storyline. And sometimes it's almost like it's a filler episode. So they just come to get a progress in my store and drop that free an episode or two while we talk about something else or investigate something else and yes well on screenwriter. But sometimes it's done better than others. Econony win is going on and I think is a particular problem of these streaming shows because they have an order of ten twelve. Whatever it is episode Seville and I think sometimes what they do they sit down and kind of plot there are over those episodes and realize they have some gaps. They go to Philly. This only else. Isn't that usually the show? That where they have the guy date they're gonNA ask a well. You did this. And they show clips from the old show and then and then this happened and they do. I just saw that. I think supergirl did that this week. Back flashbacks show that they used to do that yet. When they actually literally run out of plot didn't have time to build one over a sometimes I believe some of the science fiction shows. I remember back. In the day the the but roaches and the twenty fifth century show. Yeah with one year. There was one of those they did occur. I'm sure they did. At least two Kana flashback type episodes and they write famously. The end of the first season of Star Trek the next generation. They did one as well. You always have to have some framing device where they are to sit around. I remember when and then screeches howls into alternative in the science fiction. Show that won't they often do is normally knock somebody out and make them replay their memories or something like that and I think I think both the buck Rogers in the Star Trek one did that and the starter when I remember. They did it because basically they didn't have the budget to full season and so they decided that they would do one of the shows to save some money because producing the the the framing things at the end was like doing a third of a show own standing says and they could fill me over about two days rather than five or six days of a regular episode and the rest of is video editing company. I worked for Berkeley Systems. People young people won't remember them but they did all this. Flying Toasters screensavers did a star Trek screensaver. And I got. I was part of that product project helping on that so we got to go to paramount to next generations. And I I met Major Eric. Berry love shoes did she did she. Did she kind did she do the the flat competes voice? Oh yes because she was. She was forced at the The enterprise compatibles and she. Yeah she was and I'm almost all the shows. The older shows she was the computer and she promised me and I never got did done that. She would do my answering machine tape in the computer where I was talking about this exact same thing and she said Yeah. They end up behind schedule. What they do is when they're ahead of schedule. They'll build what they call a filler episode. Which like you said it takes a day day and a half to shoot and they and it's all up to the editor to cut it back together properly and still give him a rest to catch up to catch their breath or when they get behind to have an extra week now to put out another you know to build another episode because they used to build them you know not far ahead of when they were showing him. If I understood that correctly I you know I mean I love those sorts of shows particularly. I know that loss week Tim was Kinda pooh-poohing the those DC shows you what I love them to Arrow and the flat all the Arab Russia is Arrow the flash legends tomorrow. We'll figure those things. They are not great television but they aren't staement nevertheless. But but you know what working on those shows must be bruce because it you literally are doing a new episode every week. Filming it either. Six or seven days nonstop for for months and the for twenty four hundred sides is what I learned to do. They they produce. I mean nowadays mid season hiatus and stuff like that is not necessarily as bad but certainly back in the star trek days. That's exactly what it was. They were turning out a new episode every week. So the creative team on there would be looking at the episode that was currently shooting. They would be post production on previous episodes and then they will also be writing and doing prep for upcoming episodes all same time. So crazy often wondered. Did they do it ahead of time? They put eight episodes and they can and then they start doing the ones that go after that well. I'm sure it's different nowadays. Because you know I start production. These shows is probably easier than it used to be because the modern tools we have you know you can do no flaw in in the camera and using CGI now that in the past used to have to do in with practical stuff. I mean did you see that video. That came out probably about months six weeks ago about how they shot. The men delorean out outdoor scenes on. This page is incredible. Is it's on the Disney. Because it's yeah it's it's it's not. May you probably find out on Youtube. But basically the majority of the outdoor says they do on this is like a big cube begin as like a big sound state but the entire thing is covered in led wall right so not only can they project scenery behind the actors. As they're they're doing stuttered without having to do camera compulsive which the way that's normally. It looks more realistic. Because you're actually seeing a scenery there and it's a high enough definition. You can't tell it's a scene but the other thing is the whole set actually lights the scene right in the way that it would be worse at in the desert. So you're talking about that is actually natural. Yeah they don't lie. They can put the coloring in the lighting wherever they want it. I was thinking of an early version when Tom Cruise did what was. I can never remember the name of that movie where he was living up in the clouds and he was supposed to uplift in oblivion and that that set was built with rear projections so in that set in the clouds. They were really projecting the outside to get the light. Feel of what it would be like. If you're hanging up in the clouds. Angie exactly they'd be developed this dream by computer they can change the sets on the dime which with with all the production things you had to move your entire production to a different set. What you feel. That was half a day's work probably. They could just change it in the camera. So they can swiftly move from one set to another by just changing the background changing the lighting and the also the other thing they were doing is they were actually experimenting with special effects in the scenery so as ships and things were being rendered and we're moving stuff like that they would. They could try them out in the space and they could actually block the shot depending on what the Speth Franks. We're going to do which is something that normally is post production you kind of have to stick with the shorts you've got so don't get me wrong. The mandatory as a tremendously expensive show to produce and I'm sure that technology probably costs a fortune. But what in the outpost produce something looking at it? You could not tell that those were not real. Says they weren't going to jungle planet or jungle scenery desert scenery. All of that sort of thing. The the what is able to produce the kind of movie called the C. Staff and yet they're able to produce very very quickly. I think that's tremendously exciting for production and probably allows them to stop sauce being commoditised. And everyone's using it and probably allow these Cheney Shazad much more quickly during my boss was talking to me about this. He wears a chrome helmet. And if you do green screen kind of stuff then you have to render all the reflections and everything else and I think he said this lets them get the lighting on the helmet. So they don't have to do the rendering on him. They get light from the walls. Which is it's a brilliant idea. I I haven't talked about it and that's where I heard about it. I have to go watch this. I'm looking on youtube now to see if I can find it for something. Yeah I'll find it and send you a link. Lincoln show notes. I wonder if that's why Boba Fett in the original trilogy movies. He had like painted beat-up Armor. Was maybe that reason. Think about that. If you're standing in front of a green screen and ship takes off behind you you need to light the scene with the color of the somehow do that and that was a tough problem then so if you didn't if you had someone who was really reflective so. I'll give you an example. I did a did a documentary on Atari and they sat me on a box. Is The guy who I would box. And then they put these colored lights coming in from different angles and they were changing while we were talking again. I said when we took what is going on. And he says we'll when you see the actual show you'll understand in the show. I was green screen behind me and there was like video games playing and objects moving on the screen. And that's when these lights would change color so my color would reflect different color depending on what was behind me way to do that. I thought it was very cool now. This does huge scale. It's pretty amazing. It's not only that the difference is is that with this system you can. The director on the shoot can decide what he's going to show rather than having to shoot and fill something in later. Because then you know that limits your creativity if if you you're having a chat with somebody and you go off on a tangent about a different video game and maybe you weren't associated with but they WANNA put the graphics in the background now they can just do it maybe take a break and then just do it. Whereas if they start with the light from major havoc then they're stuck with a lot from major havoc e can't be they can't be showing something else while you're while you're talking so this this replace green screens that are I think. I think this is the with this as much as possible. You don't want to composite after the shot you actually want to do. It live on set. Sure that I think about the post production time it takes to do that. You're right these these shows want to look like they're on bigger sets. I used to like about star. Trek is it wasn't just the ship they used to go out to real locations and shoot things but that's expensive. It is and not only that you always even when the next generation you always got this discontinuity because you could always tell. When they're on a planet hell set which was the generic planet that they set up for alien planets because rocks. Yes exactly the way where the those the ones whether the guys in red shirts would normally die within the first five minutes. Yeah but you always knew when you were there because it was obviously filmed inside and yet when they did an an outdoor shoot. It looked completely different. So when Kirk is fighting the gone on right yeah you knew that that was out in real life in the desert because you could tell because the whole look of the show look completely different than it did when they were inside a planet hell that just showed up on another show. That's about the ankle rocks. They look at the time and I see him in a couple of other shows. Was that that maybe yeah that's right. That place is not far from Los Angeles a once. You recognize those that particular outcrop rocks and you start looking three. You'll see everything absolutely in fact you just watch picard. Where when he when he went to to. What's what's the name of the of the girl who who had the falling out with and yeah with the curly hair. Yes again. That secretary. It was the he was his former protege who he had kind of had a big falling out when he left. Starfleet her trailer was in from those rocks. And I'm sure they did it as a deliberate her marsh to the original star Trek overtakes when they recognize it. But it's yeah it's it's quite famous is quite famous and once you want is a particularly distinctive outcry. Once you want you're looking for you'll see everywhere and it kind of takes you out the show less of it. When I was at paramount that time we were there for the the present- presentation of the Final Episode Next Generation. But they took us on a deep space nine. There's a photo of me somewhere if I can find it. I'll give it to you to put in the show notes sitting at a control panel and the bridge on the control center of deep space. Nine I have to tell you when you see a set like that completely breaks your vision of what the show is about right because you can build what you think this thing. Looks like like this? The curly stares at the stairs that went up to the upper deck or may would as we're the rails right and then they had the sound of Concha concord but the set that crack me up is they have a set. They call the cave. All those other scenes were they were underground in something where rebe resets of the cave sound stage. So am I remember the one where doctor have to sneak into this secret? Space there climbing across the. That's all done in this one cave set that they just pushed the rocks around That was disappointing. One hundred feet off the ground. Oh that's too bad was that sometimes. That's the thing you don't WanNa look to fall behind the camera for a short time as a contractor and got to see underneath. Disneyland and thing they call it a basketball court which is not a basketball court. It's a hoop on wall up on the top we got. We toured of all the behind the scenes. It's actually pretty amazing. They designed that part to not ever see anything delivered right. Yeah you never see. Walk over the heck down the main street. Go to get some stuff to the Coca Cola pavilion. Now it's all comes up from behind in Epcot. They suck the trash out underneath the trash cans. I guess I guess you don't also don't see Mickey Mouse with his head of run behind the back of the building of a secret though. There's a rule if so I was. I had a different badge as a contractor. If a non Disney employees is is is present. You must the characters must be in character. So when they were touring us down underneath the gave us a tour of the underneath. This big u-shaped underground characters. That were down there. Keep how to keep their heads on and being character because we were employees when you came round then they don't like anybody down there shake says once they got into their backrooms. I'm sure they can take that off. Also a lot of the characters wore headsets. They don't talk yet. There's they also they also double as a security person so if they see something they can speak into this. Vox Microphone. They've got and it goes to the security team so they can send someone out so if one of those characters see something wrong. Make an alert security as well as the security security people walk on Nick. I'm going to go up to goofy guy. Hey goofy snitch. That's so they said it's only the ones that don't speak goofy. Just be Mickey. Does it. Goofy dozen what. What kind of brings the idea? Down is the fact that I'm sure they already see very well in his trip in. Yeah the newly looking through the mouth they because they know we have like a black black nylon over the mouth and then that's when they normally are because that's where your eyes are if you not eight feet tall like Mickey. Mouse is in the seat. I don't know if this is true. This is just told to me by one of the guys. When we were touring that they that they have they can they have radios and they can. They can call security if they need to but can you imagine it gets hot in southern California and being in a goofy costume. Yeah Yeah Florida Florida as well which is some. I do believe some of these. Anti air conditioners in them fans of some sort right. Yeah they've got some sort of cooling in there because yes you it would you but this is. This is why you know Mickey comes out. And he's any signs if graphs on the puzzle free pages and thereafter about fifteen minutes. He goes away again. And that's basically stop. The presumably spoke to cast member inside from expiring from the Heat. It's gotta be horrible. I just can't. I'm high doesn't a t-shirt and shorts if I'm walking in Disneyland these universal in February We went all the Harry Potter stuff. But what he has to walk through the parks to get to the Harry Potter stuff is not near the entrance My daughter had pictures taken with with some of the simpsons. Yeah I am those what they call streams and so they have. I mean it wasn't particularly that Tommy. But they would have exactly that prome even the even the smaller ones and then in the evening we. We saw some of the marvel characters over near the park. They worry more conventional costumes still quite stuff and yeah it must be. He must be a rite of passage for actors or people. Who Want to you? I would imagine actors to to go and working on those parts doing during one of those you know I. I mean the the girls who play the the princesses you know you. Just basically. They've got they've normally got the costume but also a big week on and then you have to sit there. Smiling sweetly everybody for exactly. That's the hard part you got. You got ten one hundred kids running up all day long grabbing at you and you have to not want to go get that it's like. I don't know if I could do that. How did you like the Harry Potter stuff? I haven't seen it yet. We if you if you're into Harry Potter it's amazing because they really have the reproduction of what you've seen on screen absolutely down you know so we go to dig- in La you even go through kind of it looks like you're walking through the wall again to diagnose and then once you're in there everything is what you've seen on the screen you know. They got the Green God's Bank. They've got the leaky cauldron. Leaky cauldron is is easing venue. So you can go in there and you have your launch your overpriced universal lunch which is kind of English themed and then you get brought to bear pumpkin juice off as well so it really puts you in the experience. They have this system as well where he by A. Conver won't when you get there which interacts with the scenery so they have these areas rainfall these areas. We do you know it's kind of marks a magic trick and basically we have to do is eat for each one. You had to move the Wand in a certain way I think the ones debase. You just have an infrared tip and then they have cameras scanning scanning for the the shape of the movements. If you if you get it right then something. Something in a window will lie. Sao Paulo projection happens on the so. It looks like you've done a magic trick. Yes advertisement they show a girl spinning and pointing it at the school and the school lights come on is that there are hundreds of kids. I think that so each of those things cue it becomes it becomes a little bit of a kind of a game is can you find the off the beaten off ones where you're not gonNA have to queue up for ten minutes? To geometric protocols is what takes you out of it is if you've seen fifteen kids in front you do the same trick. The self is to me doesn't sound like he's much fun. I think I would want to hide him around the park and have them switch on and off so they're not always the same accessibly but the one I wanna see and if you can find this on youtube now they is the rise of the resistance that ride. We were laughing. My boss is a big Disney fan as well and we were sitting in office before we had to work from home and he's looking on. Disneyland he goes. Oh my God park. Attendance is down to almost nothing. I may on a plane and go down there. And then the next day they coast park because too many people shocked. Yeah but that's the whole ride is up on is up on the on Youtube. Yeah it's an amazing piece of work because they the one that gets me that when you if you watch through it there's the line is actually part of the ride so walk through this star destroyer whatever. The particular ship happens to be and they have the the hanger. There and the whole hangar wall is opening looks like space and they've got A. It's must be a huge laser projector lighting their whole wall. That's I want to see this this this one. I stand in line for this one. It looks pretty amazing. I'M GONNA I'M GONNA. I'm GONNA shut this out new sheep now. Because they're all you can find all these attractions online so that the one that was most like that for us was the one inside hogwarts castle where you basically you're lining up and you go on the rides in universal studios all these ones where you're you're in a cab and it kind of moves but not necessarily yours is like that but as is smaller just motion simulator. It's basically on the track and it's moving is moving in time with projection stuff on on a big screen so econo- tries to put you in the middle of the action and some of them are better than others to be on this. But that's what the whole course ride does so. The idea with the hopewell's ride is that the cost has been locked down and they want to get out to the Harry policies. I want to get out of the quidditch match. Sober as lining up you. You basically aligning inside hogwarts castle. So you see the paintings that taught to you and that you know and talking to themselves as well and then you actually coupon doubles. And he is the office from the movie. And he's there on their projection system so it looks like he's there on the balcony talking talking about a and then they have another one where it's kind of the The Mess Hall. You know the the coal dining rain and then you see Harry Potter and his friends kind of Auckland About Caen. Talking to each other and all of that. So that's when you when some of these bribes when you carrying an hour around off you've got to have that stuff in this key people insane and Kinda put them in in. I did Ryan Star Tours. You're talking about right with like star tours. Sorry you're talking about a ride like starting over is uses that Technology Barbosa. You're in a cab probably about six right people. It doesn't WANNA track. But then what happens is every seen it stops on any. And you're looking at something in front you which is normally a practical set with some re projection type stuff. They use in the modern that that Hologram style. Things that we've seen over the policy is it. Looks like that. So the carrots has lost their in the scene even though they're actually being projecting shape glass and then what happens is whatever happens on there so things might fly you or the scenery might drop you. Draw WITH IT. You see so vehicle. Is the motion. The motions does controversies in time with what you're seeing on the screen. And then they puff air. We'll try you in heat and that sort of thing to try to make you feel like you're in it and this is say The some of them are better than others. We did the Green Dots Bank Bank right. Which is a similar site type of ride a roller coaster? That's not a roller coaster as more like a roller coaster than the other almost. But he's using the same. Technology is not very cool Riley Costa. But the problem with that is that the plot that was going on was all being taught by these these characters in re in holographic projection on the scenery. But the right was allowed. You couldn't really hear what they were saying very well so you could you come after I couldn't anyway. I don't know what the kids did so after halfway through the Rhonda kind of got tuned out of it. Really and and the problem is if you're not into it then it becomes you just being shaken around. He wanted to stop thinking about some of the motion rides at Disney. The haunted mansion. They were smart. They put the speakers behind your head. Yeah and then they use phasing to get the sound so you always can hear at. That's a hard problem. Figured that out with their parades that the next time you go to Disneyland Park when you watch one of the parades note that the sound comes from everywhere yeah and the speakers in the buildings and stuff are all synchronized to what's in front of you which is just really a brilliant design. It's just amazing that that you're standing on you hear the sound of the thing in front of you and you realize weights coming from behind me and across the street very impressive on that just one fine recommendation. Before we finish now we just got Disney plus here this week say it was just Tuesday that it came out so we kind of binge watching our way through it. Because we've not we've not had it as long as you guys have. There is a documentary. I have queued up and probably GonNa what she tonight and basis and behind the scenes imaginary documentary so they did those on Walt Disney's world of color ride years ago and what they've done is they've taken a bunch of those clips from the originals and they've added stuff to them and I've seen that I've seen them on the original form so it's cool to see him again yeah. I'm looking forward to that. Because the pond see stuff to me his you know the magic of of making it so artificial is to me is real matching neat. I know but but but but I think the way they pull it off I I also I remember going to the original ATCO ninety nine hundred and I just felt that the environment they created you know it was so neat and well. I'm Annette Crosbie. Kinda messed around ever since then. Because they don't really know what to do with it but back in the original day the fact that you know it was so neat. Well laid out an organized and the music everywhere and the sidelines gray and a everywhere you went. You could see something different and all of that. It was just so impressive. And it's always. It's always kinda really got me that every little thing you you can think of and a Lotta things you haven't thought of. They have thought of kind of engineering today. They use computers but before I said I did this contract work. They have a model of the area. Tiny model not tiny. But it's it's on the table. And a little periscope like thing they could put down on the ground and see what happens when they placed a building. What it does to the sidelines. Actually thought about that. My favorite hidden thing was in parts of the Caribbean. You go down a waterfall and they didn't. You didn't go down because I thought that would be fun and they go down a waterfall because the entrance to the right is against the edge of the park and they build. The ride took part of the parking lot. So the ride down to get underneath the train and everything to do the ride. And that's why he come back up at the end the mansion. How do we get people underneath the exit the edge of the park? Yeah these guys thought. It's I find today. A lot of stuff is too much stuff done with video. That was I went to not too long ago and I was. I was disappointed that everything was some video trick because I really liked it like you said before that they really thought about fixing the environment. Physical physical work so yeah physical rights as well. I mean I've always enjoyed is more than these met startles when I was new and it was incredible but that technology got overseas in the theme parks. Realize you're not in there was one in Las Vegas at the Luxor Hotel. Done that one but I think I did. I did a SIM. Those about two or three rise like seaworld and it was just like yeah but this is his name back to. The future was at universal for a while the secrets of the pyramid. It's not there anymore. Douglas Trimble who who does a lot of these special effects guy? He said that it was it was three part story. And then they got rid of the. The imax screen turned along ways. Which is kind of weird But they're right. There was not bad. But it's the same thing you're in a dome and your car is moving around. And they're projecting things on you. Yeah Yeah Yeah it's still it's still fun and hopefully seen people be able to go back to theme parks and enjoy them again and wallace rapidly drained of cash. Tell you what we went. We went for a day and could've bought whole vacation for what we say. But you know sometimes you gotta do for the kids. He wouldn't understand that the kids when you go the kid. I'd do it for me. I'm Mickey Abbott my kids. I WANNA go see this one brother lives. It lives in Paris. Free Move to perish. He basically played hooky from work afternoon and went out so you Disneyland. Parents spent pernicious com works while he was there. One of his sons. Go hand trapped in a door at school and bobby mashed up his finger. He's able to get hold of him because he was give away. The Fatty Visit Disneyland. I smoke out. You saw the one in Tokyo. Tokyo's person one and there's there's nothing like the country jamboree singing Japanese to give you a good smile that that certainly image in my mind. I'm sure on the comfortable life. That's always great to talk to you. Thank you for allowing me to join you today. Pleasure come in now. I just need to remember what we talked about the show. So the most Timothy Mad and Yeah hopefully speak to you again thanks. Do you have a good day and keep well there. Please do our best. Thanks very much and everyone listening to it. All right bye bye.

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TechFan 425 - CoronaTesla

TechFan

1:04:06 hr | 5 months ago

TechFan 425 - CoronaTesla

"You're listening to another great podcast and the my neck podcasting network. Tech podcast number four hundred twenty five. I'm Tim. Robertson joined by David Cohen. Hello so we were off for two weeks. You're on vacation and I decided I didn't feel like doing a show with almost did almost dead but I thought at the last minute you know what this is. Take a couple of weeks off here. We've been doing this Tech van for ten years. Now we can afford a two week vacation every now and then we've earned it so you were in Florida for a couple of weeks. I was in West Palm Beach the president. At least when I arrived I saw a picture of him standing the other day because he's very fat and not not that I. Can you know talk much? But he leans forward to try to hide it so his tie doesn't go out so funny it said. Yeah he's he. Setting the cuts had an interesting figure. So right now of course in the world. Everyone's freaking out about the corona virus I'm personally waiting around for the bottles of James Virus is And people are freaking out about it. Not Rightly so Well it's a very minor thing but the media's covering it like swats of countries are just dying off and it's just not happening and I. I get a little frustrated when I see this. It's kind of like the weatherman when bad weather is coming in you know they're doing facebook live every five minutes in their live on twitter and the news all about them pending disaster storm and you get three inches of snow and you're like really but that's that's the beauty of a story like this because it's impending disaster so you can speculate as much as you want and nobody's GonNa come back at you because you're saying well this could happen at look. I I think the reality with this is that they've tried very hard to contain. It is becoming clear that is not now not contained it springing up all over the place. There is probably going to be a period of the next two three months when this rip throughs rips through a number of countries populations and that is going to be challenging for some people among those populations so yes that respects but it's really no different than the flu and it's not going to kill more people than the fails. I think the concern from a scientific point of view is that the virus mutates I get it. Sometimes they meet in Population. Sometimes they come back stronger and the other thing is that this virus has proved to be worse than about flu for some people and the reality of most of our health. Western health systems is that we can't cope with these extraordinary events. They I saw something also said they. Reckon there is about eight hundred thousand spare critical care beds in the UK. And if you look at a like a wanting five infection rate where where he gets more serious than the flu from Corona virus that we basically don't have the capacity to cope with it go through the entire population and that is the concern. I think is a pretty resilient? When it comes to those people will put aside political or religious or whatever differences. And I'm not too worried. I think the trick at this point and as as somebody who lives in the House with two people you have Immune deficiencies and so are aiming compromise. We are thinking about if it becomes prevalent in the population. Here how we will deal with it and we making some plans. We put some things in place and sorry bonfires. Yeah basically I've ordered barbed wire and say we're GONNA go full or not. I tried to explain to kids the other day why they now asleep on pile of cans. Well you know we all make sacrifices children. You know I was thinking about what you're talking. You're famously not on facebook. Although you do have a facebook account you've never used it. Yes you don't log in so something came up the other day I forget what it was and you texted me about it and I thought how the Hell is. He know that because only posted on facebook and of course. I'm friends with your wife now on facebook. She's so she's my face mole. Yeah she. She's the spy. Basically anything interesting comes up and you'll time she tells me about it straightaway. Funny That was the the issue you had with them. Pay Pal the. Oh Yeah Yeah. Let's talk about this. This is tech financially. I was going to speak about this. I don't know if I put a note in here to talk about it or not It doesn't look like it. Shocked her So what happened was I have a pay pal account. Obviously and it's linked to my bank account. It's actually linked to two different ones once just for a car payment so I'm not too worried about that. The only money in there is there for a few minutes before I make a car payment. That's basically empty but the other one is my business account and that's what I use them. Daily BASIS BILLS. And all that stuff. I've never had a problem with pay pal. I heard the horror stories but I've always been pretty cautious about. I don't keep much money in there to begin with so I get a text one morning in the tech. Says we found some suspicious activity on your pay pal account I forget exactly the wording but basically for seven hundred and something dollars If you made this purchase press one if not pressed to so immediately. I pressed to why wasn't in a position to do anything on the computer at the time but about an hour later I was so I jumped into the pay pal the paper by the way and logged in side and immediately put in a I don't know what you call it. The When I just dispute I guess and so it was under review and then they had like three different transactions and the other two were legitimate. They were the new account that I set up for the car payment that I was just mentioning so what I do. Is I get money in my pay pal account? I use that to make Julius payment Julie's car which is nice and because the new bank that we're using for that account is really got a nineteen ninety s interface on their website. It's almost impossible and move stuff around. It's just it's horrible so I just ended up with a PAP- house I can dump money through pay pal into it. Make a car payment. Well my balance is zero so much to allow my money and then pulled a little bit more out of my bank account. Well that was through. Pay Pal Yup SOx Yup and so I said I I fell out the whole forum and I say this one's not real and these other two are legit so about an hour later. I get an email from pay pal saying we didn't find any suspicious activity. We think this is a good sale. So your money's gone sucks more so I do a Google search of call pay pal mind the phone number and I call. I get this really nice lady on the phone and she says I the first problem was she claims and I know I didn't but she claims that I put that that was a legitimate purchase. All three of them and they said no clearly I didn't And I said number number one no. I didn't I clearly said this one was Fraud and number two. Why would I buy five copies digital copies of Microsoft PowerPoint? So the other aspect from them is they have seen legitimate purchases coming from that seller. Microsoft and they can see every year my xbox gold membership renews through Pay Pal. So that's why they thought it was suspicious and then they said that's not suspicious because he's done business with these people before. So here's the issue and by the way the the the end result is they reverse it. They put all the money back. They put into my bank account. Everything's good people. Did the right thing and it took us twenty four hours so I could say on the phone. They're fantastic their initial response was good The only if I want to actually logged into the website and put a dispute in. It probably would have been fine. They said that's where the confusion was. Call so that's kind of on me but not really because it's not really clear. Well Sir what wrong. During that was a species transaction right but they had already opened the dispute via taxed. Yeah so I've been ideally. Do mainly sound like you'll problem that I'm giving me a benefit. Because at the end of the day they did the right thing. They did a timely basis. This is not the pay Pella Bowl there. There are a lot better now. So where do you think the breakdown is? Where do you think people got in? Normally the way this happens is that you have the same pulse with multiple accounts. No wasn't the NOPE. Did somebody bring up and trying to pretend to be? Changed the password. No that that comedy the only count remember what said where the purchase come through three muck soft exactly so figure out where the breach was Microsoft. Straighten YEP YEP turns out that might that account has been compromised for years because back in two thousand sixteen. They got me for Two hundred dollars that I never noticed for a digital copy of Microsoft office so that helped lend legitimacy to this purchase. Yeah so obviously. Microsoft account has been compromised and somebody was logging into my Microsoft Account. They bought five copy digital copies of powerpoint and then immediately resold them on Ebay or something. Yeah so the fixes to go in Microsoft account which I did change the password set up to t factor two factor authentication. So I think the problem is fixed but I posted this on facebook and much condensed version. I just went through but really the point is. If you've got an account on the Internet they can draw money especially from Paler Bank Account. And you haven't changed that password on a long time and people are sending out there thinking what's never happened. I'm sure I'm fine. Just go change your passwords. Look the elderly. They count the higher the risk that you've used that password somewhere else because back in the day we did that. That's that's point one point two is the Iverson count. You don't use very much not going to notice if things disappear or things change. And that's what's happened to you and the third point and this is a policy. I've started not now is don't store financial information inside the account of a third party now because I have to with with paypal because the ones you do you have to log on to regularly to us to factor you have to use every security facility that they give you Microsoft. I didn't just reset my password. I actually went in there and remove my pay off and I think this is what I started doing now. Basically most websites will allow you to store credit card or something in the account and for the vast majority of those now at I removed as I don't I don't take that option up because precise this risk of don't want an account to be compromised and because of that compromise them get access to my bank account my credit card. I mean it wasn't. It wasn't a life changing event for me which is why. I forgot about it when we first started the show. And you had to remind me what it was but it was stressful enough. For a day we were talking about Is About seven hundred fifty. Some people seven hundred fifty dollars is there's no. There's not many office. Who in a fortunate position to be able to get all seventy dollars? I can swallow that yet. No I'm not saying it's not an insignificant amount of money. I'm just saying you know I'm not going to lose my house because of but but there are plenty of people who use these services who would you know and and it would not be hard to lose that sort of money and so they realized you know you're not gonNa make the mortgage payment this month or you know you've got a you've got a God forbid a different more critical bill to pay like a tax bill Laura or a hospital bill. Something like that and all of a sudden. You haven't got the money to do it. Actually pay your taxes and really. There's we don't want it to be situation where we lose any money to fraudsters let alone seven hundred dollars so yeah. I think I use lost pulse for all my passwords pretty much every website that I go to is in there now you know what law spouses frequent. It will do a check where actually looks all your passwords venture by any commonalities renting and say you know we can do this? It can go and change all these things that is something that people should do. And if you don't have a lot of these accounts but you know the ones you do go and log onto the see. What's going on with them? Perhaps reset the password with something that can be stored in a pulse manages. So it's more secure. The apple one is also very good. If you do on your phone your ipad you Mac and yeah again. Think about whether you really need the convenience of having to type of not not having to type in a credit card number when you made the transaction at these places especially nowadays most all the apple things up google the android ones of the same. We'll store locally on your phone credit card details or Apple Pyo. Google play whatever. Let you use that to pay for purchases? So you don't really need to store your credit card information inside inside a website of you know something you you anybody wants you. We go to You KNOW BILL DE PO DOT COM. Only every only wants to buy something from there. You don't need to fill the credit card on this. I know you know doesn't take us people if you only have one or two cars. They know the numbers. You just talked them for memory. You don't need to get the card out and look at it and that sort of thing is not much of a hardship. It certainly less less of a hardship than trying to chase down bank nor credit card companies to dispute transactions. All say. That was the biggest thing for me. Was You know the phone calls? And checking the email is and you know this lady on the phone from pay pal was very accommodating and she agreed the this does not look legit other. Why I said Number One. I'm not a PC user A Mac user. Yes you can get powerpoint for the MAC but I don't use it ever. Why would I buy five copies of it? No who buys five copies of the same piece of software and she laughed and she agreed that yeah this looks and she put her own notes in there so when it when it when they finally rule in my favor and it was less than twenty four hours. It really was You know I filled out the survey and Ed written her her name down and I called her out on my survey instead. It was great job because it's a lot easier to log into a company's website and complain about something than it is to give a compliment when it's due and I think in today's society as a whole lot easier to jump onto facebook and twitter and complain about a company. Well I think there's an awful lot of people who complain about companies without never interacting with the companies rather than. Well that's true. Yeah how often Bono facebook companies but but how often do you jump on and say? Hey you know what guys? Let me spend two seconds here to say. I haven't lost power in a long time. Great Job Your Energy Company and tag them in it you know. It doesn't take much but we never do that. We just WANNA complain all the time. So anything happened in Florida Tech Wise. It was exciting to you. Let's see well first of all I'd call. We hired was a a K that had called play on it so it was nice. Use that for a week and I was actually pleasantly surprised by how good the Kiel's Kale kids getting better. I I I had training What's Today Friday? Saturday training on Wednesday in Detroit unfortunately had to raise the snowstorm. There naked hit on the way back which was not fun but I was in the sequoias. I wasn't too worried about it And it was for the brand new twenty twenty highlander. Which I've already been selling. We've had it for a month and a half now but hey now we get training on it and Part of this training. Is You get to drive. Not only the new highlander. But some of the competitor vehicles and you rotate through these different vehicles. And I drove Let's see I got to drive the Ford Explorer and Kia telluride right and I could tell you yeah. I look sell Toyota so I'm going to try to be a little bit biased on that but not on the test. I really WANNA know how these cars before they're like because of my customers are come in. They sent him also looking at this. I want to be intelligent about you. Know talking about the competitor's product The Ford was terrible. This is one of the worst vehicles I've ever been in. I mean it was and this is a brand new vehicle this over fifty thousand dollars. It was it was horrendously bad I would push really hard on the accelerator. It would leap at take my foot off of it and it kept going and trying to find the gear before it would finally wind down it was. It was unbelievably bad. I could not believe it I thought this is how much and it just felt so dated. It was so plastic and just junk I mean it was just. I can't believe Ford selling this as some kind of a premium cards as bad the flip side of that is a key telluride That was really good. I mean it was. It was almost as good as the The highlander it's a little bit less. I didn't like the Stereo as much as it's not as intuitive and they have a candy bar screen so it's long but it's really thin and it actually looked like it was at a weird angle like the hidden lined up on the Dash Writer. Something strange it's kind of weird but the seats were comfortable. They had some features on there that. I wish the highlander did It was it was a good vehicle. I can understand why somebody would shop us against that. I'm sorry we had an awesome. We'd help wanted a mid size so the The ultimate massive COMPA- sending competitor appreciate car. Anyway yeah he was enormous plenty space some nice equipment on it. Yeah including the complex not the wireless compliment forty but some. Yeah we used to call play for navigation. We drive out to lender and back with that which was great. Yeah look by English standards not great gas mileage but then become bigger optimus don't retain their value and all. They're they're actually not very good at all but when you compare it against the camera while it's night and day especially the build quality is just not there you know. It was functional. We comfortable Oh sure adver week no problem enough this this and also I think it was the key or one hundred hundred. I winner in Israel in December. The one in Israel had the self-driving both of stay within the lines steering and then it had to write our cruise control. So they're on. The highway certainly didn't really have to do an awful lot. All you just have to hold the wheel trailers have it's GONNA call had the self steering he didn't have the right L. CONTROL. But it's it's really. It's really interesting because I find with the self steering is you're not really sure how much to trust it so well. It's using a video camera and it's looking at the lanes trying to make minute corrections to keep you in the center of your lane. I personally when whenever I drive a car. That has a Self Steering Orleans. Centering is what it's called lane assist. I don't like it because you can feel the steering wheel move independently of what I'm doing. They don't this is this is the thing it does. And and the reason I say you don't know how much I don't know how well it was going to stay around a corner. The one I had in Israel was a better system. You could pretty much if you wanted to take your hands off the wheel until it. Couldn't it would complain in terms. That's it. What I'm saying is if you if you did take your hand off the hands off the wheel briefly and you were going approaching corner it would go around the corner no problem as if you were driving it this. This kid didn't really feel quite as good as that but I find it interesting. Is that you get these systems. Don't know quite how much faith you can put in them and You know there's a very fine line between not having much faith and then having too much faith in this guy. Talk about yes. There was a guy who was killed in a in a tesla. The number one these accidents in Florida not far from where I was a few months ago it was one of these ones where at try the trailer pulled out in front of Vin. He was playing on his phone or something like that and the college is basically went straight onto the trailer and he was chopped to to And it's supposed to be a particular problem with Tesla's but you post this story about Tessler. Self-driving found was interesting. Because this guy well. This is a couple of weeks ago And actually had posted it before we did the last Geeks pub Well next week I'll talk about this and of course now. This is almost a month out of date and there was a follow up to it but the story started with a Man. Buys E. U.'s? Tesla it went to auction a dealership bought it net dealership. Sold it to this guy and when the dealership bought it it was listed with the autopilot system. Which is a very expensive system that people that own a tougher can upgrade to while Tesla then did a audit found out that the new buyer did not buy this feature so they disabled it remotely and then they made it right. They went and they turned it back on. But it does bring up a very interesting question. especially for someone like me that actually sells cars for a living. It used to be David. I go by car and the dealership brand new or used doesn't matter that the dealership says it comes with this feature right. It's got antilock brakes awesome. I want until like brakes on my car so I buy the car when I resell antilock. Brakes are still there some mechanical thing right so obviously the next buyers going to take advantage of the antilock brakes to But what about an auto dry feature that is already built into the car? Tesla's simply can turn it on or off his the this is. This is a part of the problem. Here is this test. Tesla with disrupted model because they sell calls with hardware features bill in but a turnoff. They wrote they famously. You can by By Tesla with a certain range for the battery certain level of power for the battery. And then you pay them a couple thousand dollars and they will magically give you extra arranged by basically telling the call so put more juice in the battery Within within certain limitations but basically you can they. He's kind of like Intel sometimes on the clock chip and sell it to you. When you found if you turn features back on them gave it more juice it will become a full pension or something like that back in the day and this is the same sort of thing they will sell you a car with a battery. That's rated for four hundred miles but they'll sell it cheaper and they'll say oh this one only does two hundred forty miles and then he can pay extra to get the extra range buckled and and the the self driving features are the same. They are low levels of software at all. But actually the hardware is ready. Bill McConnell the what I find problematic about this is first of all right. They did an audit after the guy bought the car. But actually the dealer had bought the GOB call directly from Tesla auction editor auction. And at that time they the dealer the car before they resold it to this guy. The call was listed as having these heart cells upon it features which presumably influenced the bidding on the auction of course so it is therefore disingenuous. Tesla having sold it like that so then turn around and say oh actually. That's you pay for it to. That's not there and secondly yeah. This guy's getting dinged for something. He was so The dealer Sony by good faith and hit. They sold it to the guy in good faith. And the Tesla have decided through some unknown process that in fact these features don't exist. What I also found. Frustrating is obviously the press coverage of this says intervened and everything was put back to the way it should be but even then they said Oh it was down to miscommunication. No he wasn't no well. Listen Cuny -cation was tested saying we have decided we will not give you these features you paid for not all sorry. We got your name role or anything like that. Yeah that's bull and if you you know one or turn around and say hold your hands. We made a mistake and she clarified. What your policy is because you don't WanNa clarify because this is eventually going to. They're going to get sued for this eventually. So here's a question David over. And above Tesla you go to a number one I buy a product and it has all these things. They're software based I'm done using it. I sell it and I have the right to sell it. It's my product. What right does the company have then to go in there and screw around with the secondary buyer? I I have a problem with that. Well yeah this this a couple of levels of this first of all. We're not just talking about you. Know A gooey. Four is a piece of functional software. We're talking about a safety system that comes with the CAU- theoretically this person could have bolt call us in Hansol's upon it to you know like like Super Mario on his phone while driving down the highway right which is something that no any world was would advise somebody do but people do that. Sort of thing Tesla. Then the next day they get in the car. Unbeknownst to them Tesla turned off over there. Get the call. The other highway they set. The system has the wheel and the car immediately swears cost-related traffic and caused a pileup. Kills Them. Your that is on Tesla if they turn PA the safely system of without notifying the user. I think is very very bad practice. I also think there's a level of corporate intrusion here. I personally th this this turn me off from Tulsa completely. I know they did the right thing. At the end. I will insist that they only did so because they got busted and the PR was horrendous for them I don't trust them now. Why do they think they have any right to manipulate my vehicle? After I bought it. Well this is. The problem is is Tessler is one of those Silicon Valley companies that you know it's failed. Fail FALSE FAIL OFTEN. It will work itself out in the end but the problem is they all now a big consumer company not as plucky little startup anymore and these things have real world. Quincy's for their customers and they need to formalize these policies so that everybody knows what they are. The blurry thing here is that they are treating this these functions as just software patches on the mets because of the background and where they originated about. Yes the difficulty is that even even in software right. You know everyone knows that the re the legal reality software is that you don't buy the software you buy license to use the software and there are various different ways. Those licenses can be transferred when you sell the products but in most cases the If if there is a limitation on selling license on with the product is clearly stated up front. Everybody knows it mark sauce. Rem flies ince's for instance. Everyone knows that the cheapest ways of backup windows. It's a buy it with a new computer and we're heading on who you buy it from. Sometimes you may not have the right to sell that particular copy windows on when you sell the hallway there on licenses the work like that but you can't everyone kind of knows that upfront. You're getting a limited war cheaper. Oem license that's perhaps title hardware not tied to a person conversely. Everyone knows that. If you have Adobe Photoshop from wherever they call it now their subscription model career of basic cloud yeah that is tied to the person and walnut person paying the money on an ongoing basis. You have the right to use that software on any piece of hallway you want. These things are clearly defined. The point is the customer with a minimum of Investigation and sitting down with their supply of you can understand what they can and can't do the difficulty here is what Tesla is trying to do. It have their cake and eat it and say okay. We're not going to clarify exactly what it is. But when we decided enough on actual interest will around say oh you know that that featured in transfer when you walk car and that is so stupid. Yes now some people have made. I watched A. There's a lawyer that I subscribe to. He does a a video every couple times a week on Youtube. Any covers a wide variety of topics. He's a little bit arrogant. But that's okay so lawyer I I like him though and I agree with a lot of the things that he's more of a consumer advocate than anything so I automatically I like the Guy He had people sent him this story and he discussed it and he didn't really come into any conclusions. He kind of took the tack that you know what this is going to have to go before a judge eventually and and we're going to need a legal ruling on it because it is kind of a gray area so the thank you the what he kind of compared it to is he said he he bought a new car and it came with a free trial of Sirius. Xm and he enjoyed it for three months and then that feature turned itself off and if he wanted to continue to use Sirius Xm he would have to become a subscriber now. This is the antenna and the software is built into the car and it worked. It did exactly what the dealership and the manufacturer Senate went to. It will give you a free trial after which if you want to continue working or using it he would have to pay and he likes Siriusxm so he actually subscribed and he's a pair or he's a he's a he he can use so he resells the car and he d activates his account on there now. Second buyer does it. It's built it's there. He can see it but it doesn't work so he has to pay now. So is the auto feature autopilot feature in Tusla more into a subscription service like Siriusxm. Well or is it an actual feature of the car that once one person buys it in the car? The manufacturer does not have the right to retroactively who they have no agreement with the new owner retroactively. Go in and manipulate their vehicle but the problem the problem with another she breaks down this that with a Sirius. Xm trial the the the the the features in the title. You know going in that as a trial yet. You know is a subscription service that that's original buyer but yeah but the point is Sirius. Xm Is marketed and sold as an ongoing subscription service. Everybody who knows anything about Sirius? Xm If you contact them if you go into a dealer an awesome about it it will be explained to you that to continue to receive. Services requires an ongoing payment of money which is called a subscription. What Tesla Kennel do in? My view is asked for a big chunk of money on a purchase basis. That save right now. You have to feature because it's not a subscription. Don't think I'm the guy bought the upgrade to the car. The car's been upgraded. I don't care if it's a physical upgrade where you put in tires on the car or it's a software. I don't think those two things should be A difference if a manufacturer got payment to upgrade this vehicle. I don't think legally they should have the right to take it away. That's like if I go buy new tires A week later I go sell it to somebody. This car in discount tire comes and takes tires off. Because they didn't sell it to this guy they sold them to me. That doesn't it this way. This would be easy to be clarified because this model would work right considering instead of a SIRIUSXM subscription buying Amazon book on kindle right a little bit more ambiguous. It's not I'm big use. It's perfectly clear without if you buy an Amazon ebook on kindle so I say I go out and buy Seton King's latest novel on my kindle. Right I pay money for that physical that by basically licensed to that book but it is tied personally to me and my account is perfectly clear that if I sell kindle somebody else yeah and don't give them my account details and that book is not available to them is tied to me even the one paying a one of pine for it now so I wonder if that if in the Tesla stuff that's called if if he was called clearly called out then this would be a non story because Tesla would say which is is very clear terms and conditions that when you buy the autopilot upgrade that is your personal purchase and is licensed to you as an individual and it is non transferrable to anybody else even if you sell the car. But they don't say that because they don't have that written down they basically saying well. We want to treat it like that where we choose to. But we're not going to tell anybody about it and is legally very unreason when and the reason they don't call it out is because they know that they probably will be challenged in court. And there's a good chance a really good chance that they're going to consider they being. The courts are going to consider a car quite different type of purchase than a kindle fire. Yeah you know I think from forget the cool from it could seem as standpoint. I think many buyers would be put off with the idea that you might pay eight thousand dollars to feature to Tesla. Yeah that they then if you sell the car so you can't use it anymore. Doesn't work anymore. Eight thousand dollars vaporizes valley. They say oh. I'm not GONNA do that. They like you and I are saying now. Think say this puts us off Tesla and so that is why they want to keep it quiet because they don't want they don't want that negative perception beginning what they really need to get from this. Just be honest one hundred percent and I agree with you too I personally. I'm of the opinion that while Tessler I think is amazing technology and I think they've done so much to popularize. The the the concept of a electric vehicle is something that's realistic replacement for combustion engine vehicle. I got absolutely credit them for that because before before they came along. Electric vehicles. Were a niche thing and now they are in stream. Yeah and I'll I'll give them of that and you know the stuff as well. I think they've done the law even though I think they oversell. And to the point of dangerousness in some cases the fact that that's also brought the concept of you know we may one day get to autonomously driving vehicles again into the mainstream. I applaud them for that. But personally I wouldn't buy a Tesla today because I'm worried long-term by the way the company will exist yet because well. I'm not worried about that as much because I think they would just be bought out to. Maybe but the brand itself is worth more than the park. I think yeah. The marketing practices some of their sales practices and certainly from wife had some of it off. The market and capabilities are seriously lacking compared to. Here's my problem. Here's my problem with Tusla and it's kind of a big problem. When it comes to companies in Silicon Valley I can kind of respect the facebooks. Say we're just GONNA do this and we're GONNA BE DISRUPTIVE If it doesn't work out it doesn't work out But that's that's our philosophy. We're going to break things fine. I can choose not to use facebook but when it comes to a car you can't have that philosophy and I think that is the philosophy of Tusla. We've got this great new autopilot feature. We tested it for a whole six months and we're just going to roll it out to people on the road now. That's quite different because when you break things in that situation you're talking about people's lives and not just the Guy who bought the car that's testing out this new feature but the school bus. The Guy runs in to kill twenty. Has that happened? Not with a Tesla vehicle yet. But I think they're getting away with doing with their business model that no other car manufacturer could ever conceivably get away with and they're getting pass from the press for it. This whole autopilot. All You keep hearing about is how bad it is and it caused an accident and and they always try to blame right while the driver took and say yes because that's what tests promotes. It's an autopilot feature. Now they'll say oh. No you still have to pay attention. Bs. That's not how they're trying to promote it. Organic say we have to keep your hands on the wheel and you have to pay attention with the thing is called also pile autopilots in everyone's on the stand thoroughly one of the place where also poly technologies us which is an aircraft aircraft in an ultra pie in an aircraft specifically designed so the pilot does not need to hold onto the controls. No the parking literally get up and go use the bathroom. Say has to go to work. Like an autopilot. Otherwise you go to something else Dr not. That's not as sexy and they're not going to sell cars because of assisted driving because then it's just like a Prius but fortunately quite literally in some cases killing their customers because they're encouraging him to basically do the motion equipment against the bathroom while they drive their cars and it's exactly then when it goes wrong dead and they always blame the customer. There was the the most most recent high profile one report came out the other day with this. Was the weather. Call Vince? The vintage apple employees he game on his iphone eight into central reservation the crash barrier that been there been taking our previous accident so he went straight to concrete and he was killed now. Yes should the government playing on his iphone? No but again come back to the thing. Things called also pilot. It's going to encourage be mentally lazy to think. They don't need to stay the car and in fact he had reported on. Several occasions is covering tools the virgin this place and Reported Tesla and they haven't fixed it yet. They quick enough to disable the over the Over the air also pilot for the guy and paid the money but when he comes some of your posing a safety problem oh well you know they haven't got to that one yet right and that this was any other auto manufacturer Kia. Oh my God could you imagine the press they would be getting and there would be a hint of of racial bias was about to say if they would always say the Korean company and unfortunately particularly in the states there's been long remembered the whole four pinto gas tank thing yet. Everyone knew about for years and nobody did anything about it until it was based the thrust into the public limelight whereas you know yes if if a Japanese car or a Korean car or certainly nowadays a Chinese car had those German car think about the whole emission scandal missile scandal with VW. You know there's this huge story that I read The Detroit free press about six months ago about Ford. They have this Double Clutch Transmission. doesn't use fluid by the way so dry clutch that is Will lose power right and it's been going on for over a decade and every dealership knows about it. Yeah and they're they haven't fixed it yet and they've been hiding this fact and they're and they're saying there's not a safety recall on it because it's not a safety feature even though the car will literally lose power on the highway so what to which. I responded really so so that Ford executive who says this doesn't say to put your seventeen year old daughter in this little Fiesta and she's doing eighty miles an hour on the highway with a semi barreling behind her. And She just loses power. Is it a safety feature now? Jerk off well no okay. Let's face it. It's down to the lobbying of the of the American American also industry. With American Congress has allowed to be generally sub-standard they competitors for the entire history of the American auto industry. Well you through the seventy s. Come on this. Let's be real here. So I'm telling you this as somebody who who's drip drives in American cars and then driving foreign cars. When I'm in the states on reasonable regular basis starting in the eighties I agree with you for that. In the seventies and sixties in the fifties the American cars were some of the best the south. They're making an England at the time. Were jump the stuff that are making in German. Were junk Japanese didn't even exist at that point. They had these little it just it if it was an automobile and you wanted. Equality One. It was a cadillac. It was a Chevrolet. Those cars were great. Starting in the eighties it all went downhill and they've never recovered and because they They just let these junked cars out there and they still have buyers. I don't know by anybody would customer the other day. They're looking at a corolla. And there's nothing sexy about a curl Toyota Corolla but it's one of the most dependable cars you can buy. That little sucker will go and go you keep the oil change you keep it washed in and do regular maintenance on it like you've got it in any car it will just keep going and other car that this girl was looking at was a Chevy Cruz. One of the worst vehicles out there. It's just an it's just a piece of genetic and I'm like are you kidding. Me Let me let me let me let you listeners into a dirty little secret okay if you come to the UK. Yeah you can't buy Chevrolet calls here. Chevrolet tried to try to establish themselves of brand here with American imports converted for Britain. They just didn't sell because they were overpriced and they were terrible. Yeah the brands are owned by American Companies Ford General Motors which is Vauxhall in the. Here's the other dirty secret is their calls. Here are much much better than equality equals in America the Ford in the UK are not the same for because they had a lot better and have to compete with the European competitors and then also companies and they are much much better cars than the 'cause you guys bond the states they were both right in our points up through. I'm going to say about seventy eight. Gm cars for cars. Well not so much Chrysler We're very good vehicles. They really really were. That was the height the sixties the fifties Part of the Seventies. That was the height of the American auto industry as far as reliability and build quality. And all that it just went downhill afterwards and it. It's just it's bad it really is and look. I know there's some listeners out there they're going to like my Ford whatever great. I'm glad you like it. I'm glad you haven't had any big problems with it. Now go onto Kelley Blue Book and see what it's actually worth right now. Yeah it's it's it's I and this isn't my opinion. This isn't like well your opinion. They don't make good cars. No this is the industry of this because we see what the resale value on these cars are. We see the problems because see all the massive Disatisfaction and and then you gotTa do is look at the the list of the cars that need the least amount of work and people keep the longest. Guess what's not on there and Archaic House. Yeah and look and this. Isn't me say while Tim. You Sell Toyota. So you're anti American car norm. Not I I actually want seriously and this isn't just cars either. This is all industries. This is P. C.'s. This phones I want everyone to make awesome products irregardless of one that I may be selling or using because if everyone's making awesome products guess what the best of the best half to do even better. It pushes everyone. Ford and as a consumer. Because that's what I am. First and foremost I am a consumer. That means I have better choices. You have better choices. I want everyone to do well. I want really good products out there. I don't want one that so far superior to everything else. That's why I do want Andrew to do better. I use an iphone but I would love it if android would do a whole lot better now. I'm not talking about sales. I'm talking about quality because that's GonNa make apple do better. I think the MAC is really really in trouble as far as quality and so many more bugs and things not working and it's it's taken a huge step back in the last three years a big time. I want windows to get a lot better. So apple will actually get off their whatever and and do what they should have been doing with the Mac all this time yet. But they're not so so when I say the American car companies are not doing well from a reliability a quality product. It's not my opinion. Yeah this is the fact that that a Japanese companies and Korean companies can build a call they can easily do two hundred two hundred fifty thousand miles with just regular maintenance without major components. Failing and the Americans can't do. That is not sorcery. Yeah right it's not magic if they can do it then. It's perfectly possible. Yeah if Toyota can make a car that can do that. All the all the the minicabs. You'll see here in Manchester yet. The vast majority of them Toyotas. And there's a reason for that is because they will just keep keep running. You just maintain you change the oil. You take the tires. The brakes consumables on the call. Yeah I keep it regularly service and they will just run and run and run without you know five to ten thousand pound. Hora Hora Bill. Every few years I I've had customers come in. Tuck it about all the they really liked their whatever. It is It's usually a Chevy Ford. I have had to replace the transmission twice. Nfl like that's just a given them like. Are you kidding me ALMAC now? That's not to say other manufacturers Toyota Honda Se rude. They don't ever have problems. Sure they do. But it's not on every single frigging car and it's not commonplace. There's no complacency when there's a problem like that I know I won't talk about here on the show is There's a good chance that I'm actually going to be replacing my sequoia but not not because the car with the commission no well I do need a wheel bearing but that's a consume all that you know it's got a quarter of a million miles. I'm surprised there's just one wheel bearing starting to squeak on me and it's another vehicle. That's another Toyota. But it's GONNA be a hybrid if I do it and it's going to get twice the gas mileage. And that's why I'm considering. I LOVE MY SEQUOIA. David knows I do. He's been he's seen what I did to that trump. I love it the new vehicle. I'M NOT GONNA love it as much. I love the gas. Mileage own is going to be very comfortable. But it's about saving money for me. I can buy this car. Put some money into it Get at least twice the gas mileage and sell the sequoia and still have money left over yet. So you know what I consider it. If it was a chevy pickup truck at no I wouldn't even. He's he's something to say about that. Which is yellow to bring bring us back to our top regular top which is technology. One thing that I think hasn't ever you know we've talked about. How TRANSFORMATIVE TESLA. I've been with electric cars but listen. Let's make shoutout for Toyota and hybrids here? Yeah that's a technology they invented and you can go buy a hybrid car today and it will do hundreds of thousands of miles without you having to regularly change the batteries. Yay Without Esol. Toyota invented popularized actually Hanukkah yet. But they did a thing. They perfected it. They took a technology and they made it mainstream and they also made it work and it's one of the most reliable technology is on the road today. I know again plenty of those. Toyotas I see driving his minicabs around here in in Manchester are hybrids and they're not you're not. Ups is they are all the presses which just keep on going. Yeah and you don't have to replace. The battery packs regularly. You don't need to. I remember talking about Tusla. You a musk's making a statement years ago Before Tessa became really tesla that he didn't actually WANNA make cars. That really wasn't his goal. That what he saw for tests on the future was They would start with the cars. They would make him popular they. They wouldn't sell in huge numbers but that really wasn't the point. The point was to bring back because remember the very first cars electric cars. They weren't gas-powered. The second generation of cars were gas was a steam powered cars. That of course didn't go anywhere and then they found oil in Texas and the rest is history But what he wanted to do was bring back the electric car and he foresaw Tesla as leading that charge. Not just with their cars but become in the battery supplier and the electric generator the electric motors in the cars for other car companies like Toyota or GM or Saab. Or whoever. I don't think Saban actually exists. Yeah well I'm GONNA stop for. That's what his goal was because quite honestly David that's where the money is a part supplier supplying say a quarter of the auto industry with with with batteries. Oh my God. Do you know how much money tussle would make as opposed to manufacturing their own cars in a smaller slice if every single vehicle sold as opposed to You know the full slice of of of a small number of vehicles in the Malk as much better proposition. Yeah it's not. I mean I personally don't know why they haven't gone back to that. I think Elon. Musk has become Ilan mosque. Yeah he sure Tony Stark at this point. He's a little sight of that vision. In the you know the rapid drive to reduce its EGO and popularity he. He he started buying into his own. Pr and the guys way. Out of control of his believes he's vehicles are better than other manufactures vehicles. And they're just not know and that's and he's got go you know it's all about these is he's very much. I think the self driving is very much a part of this. I think if they hadn't gone down a putting all this autonomous vehicles. I think he'd be far less interested in making mobile tesla but I think he needs now. Lost folks that and he's looking at becoming. The biggest also manufacture in the world really shouldn't happen surprise. Surprise the the other. Big Automakers has said well you know we. We make so much profit every year. We can afford to develop road sisters. We don't need to buy Tesla's especially given the big dig Yup and for those who think this is the Anti Tusla thing here I've driven into trust. I drove a tesla. They're awesome but as a company. I don't trust the company I think e mosque is. I think he's crazy now. I I don't know what happened to the sky. I think he he read too many of he. He's a real life Tony Stark. He actually believes that now I do think he's a visionary I just think he needs someone above him. Well took trollers childhood. You look through the of of technical. Innovators look look at going back. Edison Tesla Nikola Tesla himself very often. These people are an immense geniuses but not necessarily well full packing what happens a lot. Is they get to the popularity of Steve Jobs. And I'm talking about prior Steve Jobs or Elon. Musk and then something happens and they learn humility. Steve Jobs did when he got fired from apple and started. An accident came back and he learned a lot of humility. He learned a lot. Better business. Acumen after that. No question about it Mosque hasn't had that moment yet. He will I hope because I think if he does we'll get the Elon. Musk a old as far as not being such an ass and in I think his ideas are such that. If you take his ego out of it and his erotic behavior smoking pot on podcasts and just saying stuff that the FCC is GonNa find you for. I mean just call some guy a pedophile. I mean come on man If he gets back to if he just matures let's just put it that way he follows. The course of Steve Jobs laid out that he gets fired from Tusla and he comes back eventually to resurrect the company I think he will be a much better person and his products would be a lot better and I think he will be transformative at that point but the way it's going right now it just looks like to me that. Tesla's heading for disaster. It really does. I think they're going get bought out within the next five years because they can't sustain what they're trying to do all it's GonNa take as prominent person getting killed on the test because autopilot feature before Congress starts opening up. You know investigations and stuff like that. That's that's that's the course that they're kind of on and I hope they correct because I love the technology behind all of this stuff. Yeah I really do yeah. We don't call. It is an amazing thing. People here my brother had a tesla and he said it really was amazing technology. The problem is is that yet. People are so focused on. It's a self driving car when it really isn't an I'm hearing now. Apparently some people hang weights from the steering wheel of their Tesla's hold the Hold the wheel so they can fool the talk sensors into thinking that they were holding. It's like no no if the thing says you've got to hold the wheels of reason for that you can hold on the wheel. You need to look out the window and of course here other manufacturers. She built systems into their calls. That mean the cart full it. They look at where your eyes are going and turn the system off if you not staring out the window. You know who I mean you you do. You need to let me look is like anything else you can get a toss about whether it was a good or a bad thing to market the technology this way and to sell it this way and to allow people to use it in this way but it's becoming clear now there have been enough accidents. There's been enough problems that that basically to again do that thing. Hold up your hands and say you know what we have this slightly wrong. We need to do this differently. We're now not calling also pilot. We are downgrading our statements on the capabilities and we are building new systems in the car to make sure that first of all it doesn't crash in the ways that the crashes have happened so that needs to be fixed and secondly we make the call much more aware that the drive is not going to pay attention and basically not to rely on the system. Well will you can rely on his next week. Dave and I will be back but now with the Tech Fan. We'll be back with the GEEKS pub. Of course that's our non techie. Show where we talk about. Oh pretty much whatever we do whatever we want yeah No big movies come out recently. That either one of seen that. I don't think I cough unlock movie. Swallow is flying to the states back so I have. Oh I have to send me a list just in case I have not caught up said this course picard continuation of Picard. That's been really good behind a couple of weeks that now but yeah. I slammed behind one week so I guess I got one episode of catch up. But we're going to. We're going to all of that a week from now. We hope that obviously if you're subscribed to tech fan and you're listening this probably are you will get the next episode of Kicks Pub eventually the shows? We'll split not yet. It's whenever the wind hits me But make sure you subscribe to Geeks Pob once that happens in the meantime. We'd love your feedback. It's the show at Tech PODCAST DOT com. Send US your feedback on. Tell us how much of the we're wrong about. Some thing that we talked about on the show. We'll discuss it again. We'll we'll bring up your valid points and if you're really passionate about something come on the show with us. It's a Friday morning. We have you on the show and he you know Tim Cook. I've Kinda we are joined by Elon. Musk yeah I would love to have him on. That'd be awesome and I can guarantee I wouldn't fan boy out absolutely. I would try to win him as an investor but that's a whole different thing so they'll be passed strategies basically. It's sick the throw him out in the podcast studying theory or tatum enough where he comes in and buys us to shut. Us Up. I can be shut up with enough money David Ambience ULTA pilot thing but So we'll see you guys in a week David. I'll see you eat that.

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