20 Episode results for "David Carey"

185 The Longevity Economy is Product Management

This is Product Management

26:58 min | 2 years ago

185 The Longevity Economy is Product Management

"This is product management. We feature the brightest minds across the numerous disciplines that fuel modern product teams. Join over fifteen thousand weekly listeners to learn from product leaders authors, and founders from companies such as Spotify under armor Intuit strikes base camp and Airbnb they'll share their insights and best practices for experimentation user, research leadership corporate innovation and more to receive updates on the latest episodes subscribe to our newsletter at this is product management dot com. Hey, I'm your host Mike fish by. Welcome back. This episode. You'll hear from five entrepreneurs who are building products for aging consumers, I met them all at demo day event that AARP hosted at their headquarters Kerry shop founder of embodied labs to vote co-founder of Omni labs, Renee king, founder of tech your elders Brian Ganden, founder of loop and David Owen COO of my wound. Doctor discuss their approach to building products for aging consumers and the opportunities for innovation in this large and growing market. This is product management is produced by alpha the world's leading companies use ALPHA's on demand user insights platform to make data driven decisions about users products and new markets. Request a demo at alpha HQ dot com slash t I p m. My name is Kerry, Sean, I'm the CEO and founder of body blabs embody labs is immersed platform. That drives improved outcomes in elder care. So we harness the power of immersive technology like virtual reality, and augmented reality to train caregivers and to offer solutions for the elders that triggers, sir. My personal connection to the company. Started for me when I became a caregiver myself when I was in my late teens, my mom got diagnosed with early onset, Alzheimer's disease and in my mid twenties. I was her primary caregiver alongside my dad. And he started needing some help from people like home health aides because my dad, and I were really struggling. So as I was hiring her care team. I I was just my eyes are really open to what professional and family caregivers do and some of the challenges we face in being able to. Really understand who are carrying or and how to best meet their needs. Hi, my name is and under seal and go found only labs and at Omni labs, we make home robots that can have improved a quantity of live of us. A and one of the votes of we've been focusing on C kit, and so I'll robots allow can't give us or family members to in remotely over internet. So they can be anyone would and they can drive the robot around into home have two way video and audio communications with the CIA's today. So they can spend time together watching movie cook together or even take a walk together. My name's Rene, the company name is called tech your elbows, and we're technical service. We are we help caregivers who are carrying or an elder find technologies they can use to help lighten their caregiving burden. So whether it is a financial platform or disease specific technology may be some assistive technologies some apps somewhere Ables some isolation. I guess you can say devices smart home devices different things, we essentially listened to the caregiver via if they text us the our chat or some of them prefer to call or Email or redo a lot of zoom calls. We just listen to what's going on what's their caregiving story. And then we start to make some recommendations as for what technologies they could integrate into their caregiving to help them. Get a little bit of. A break from the stress of caregiving. My name is Brian Gannon. And I'm the co founder and CEO of loop based out in San Francisco and loop is a two things really. It's a private social network for families. And we also sell a piece of hardware a display based product that's kinda similar to digital picture frame. But much more advanced generally, people communicate through pictures and sending pictures videos in today, they do that through you know, sometimes you sent through emails as here's how you follow my life. Sometimes you do over social media text messaging all these forms in with respect to though call aging population. Sometimes even though they might have a phone or an ipad. Sometimes it's just a little more challenging to open up. These sort of we still call hand-held compute devices and go searching in digging for all these pictures and content. So by adding in this piece of hardware this display if you're. You know, obviously, our website is joined Luke dot com to look at with this gadget looks like almost resembles in old school TV radio from the fifties or sixties in it actually has channels. And so, you know, as Fender from me to my mom, for example, on the sender of picturing videos of my kids, I can create a channel like, Alex, which is my son or another channel like Catarino to my daughter, Emma, brother can do the same thing. These channels are than on this digital picture frame slash TV and my mom can literally scroll through like TV in turn the channel knobs in tune in to pictures videos of my son, Alex or Catarino, my brother's kids, and in addition to that this picture of video-sharing system, we also video chat. And so my mom through just turning dial can dial into my family, and my loop in it'll just direct connect in a way instead of video chat in similarly, I can on my son could even dial turn a knob in the dial. My mom. All as alternately, wrapping all this together. What we've done is create a family communication system and made it really easy for everyone to stay connected. I'm David Owen. I'm the CEO of my wound. Actor my background is in product management, primarily in healthcare pretty much, mostly and technologies of speech recognition, natural, language processing, but always in healthcare after the last company apart of we sold to nuance and spent a couple years working on the integration of the company there, and then left for the next thing. And I really wanted to get closer to patient care. I get a lot of satisfaction out of knowing that you're helping patients and even as a vendor where you're three five steps remove it was satisfied by thought. Wow. Could I get involved something where we have direct patient care? And actually a prior investor that invested in prior company, I had called me up. That's Dan, Hannigan, the CEO of my wound doctor and told me about the idea for my wound doctor and as all explain we do provide direct patient care. So it was perfect timing for it. I was. Interested in the history of the company is the chief medical officer companies top rated plastic surgeon in Nashville, Nick, see king. He had been providing for about a seven year period he'd been providing consults to emergency departments throughout the greater Nashville area on wounds, and he was using today considered low tech, Email texting pictures, and so forth to provide those consoles and Dan met up with him and said, hey, this sounds interesting. This doesn't have to just be Nashville. If you're doing something like this. It's Telehealth, and it could be provided nationwide. And Secondly, we could bring technologies to bear. That would make sure it's compliant, and scalable, and that's where I got the phone call with my background in product management to come in and help with that. So what my wound doctor offers is a app that allows you to securely take a picture of the wound. The picture is encrypted. It's not. Out of your photo album. It's actually encrypted and sent encrypted transport to Amazon web services and store there in the cloud from there. We employ a team of certified wound care, nurses, and our chief medical officer in his team of physicians are all as well as their specially in plastic surgery, they're certified in wound care, and they look at the pictures. Their algorithms have actually automatically nurtured the circumference of the wound more accurately than manual measurement. So from there, they in our our cloud server, they're looking at the wound. And then they decide treatment plan. We have standardized clinical care protocols that have written instructions on how to care for the wounds, and then also short ten to twenty second video links on each step of the care. We message that back to the patient or the provider who's taking care of the patient through our application, and then we ship out a supply pack. Of all the supplies. They need to care for that wound for a two week period. Well, everyone seems to be talking about products from Eleni eels Kerry to Rene, Bryan and David are using technologies such as augmented reality and robotics to build products for aging consumers, according to report by AARP and Oxford economics or more than one point six billion people in the world over the age of fifty in two thousand fifteen and this number is projected to double by twenty fifty what -tunities is the growth of this age group present for innovators. The aging care market is huge just between on segments like residential care. Home hair on how nursing care, man. Some of the other elder supporting services any gets a three hundred thirty seven billion dollar market growing your over your about six and a half percent. The market opportunity is definitely there. I think as a technology company in the elder care space. One of the big things I've learned is technology is it's not a panacea or a solution in and of itself. It's really important that that the human factor is integrated in the N ten use of the technology and in other care, specifically think most businesses tend to run a little bit on the the less adopted side when it comes to being tech forward. So repotting sampling really had an impact on the radio Bill out. Are end to end, I really make it user friendly. So that you don't have to feel like as our healthcare provider us Mer that you need to be a the R A our expert or who unquote nerd to approach the technology. We really try and make everything really turn key about the solution. And not about the hardware or on the almonds. That are more on the tech side. What's fascinating is that, you know, everyone in some ways we were wondering at the beginning is like us in our own problem are people just gonna start sharing more pictures on social media than everyone's who's going to be on Facebook in you know, that's really going to be the facto way. So we made a bet right? That we thought that for the family base stuff that there's going to be this sort of deeper need for a level of privacy and intimacy. Let's call it that we could carve out for ourselves into her like, you know, here with these guys in San Francisco may be east coast based and we have a unique problem, but we get people from across the world. Now that are coming in asking us in. They have the same sort of problem. Call and we do think that loops not a need or want. It's a need people. Have this need to stay connected with your family in they generally don't live near their parents and that pattern exists whether in Europe your Asia or South America. Whether you're in San Francisco, or if you're in the middle, Oklahoma, we talk with these customers is always the same thing. My mom lives over here. My brother sister live over there were struggling because we have these variety of ways to stay connected, but none of them really work, all that great sky kind of breaks on me. Sometimes I don't see the text message pictures. I don't like to eat it like it's been credibly fun. I should say as you build something with a notion of an idea, I pastas, and then to see it play out on sort of global scale where everybody gets it. It's growing. There is opportunity in the space. It's just pinpointing. What's the right opportunity trying to build these little separate silos of things? I see a lot of like people go through an experience in the create a solution. But the solution is integrated with other solutions seemed to be really mindful of that. 'cause it's like how many of these solutions are we gonna create that like how many where are we going to put on someone how many different apps going to that are not all connected to be the one platform that a caregiver can use like how many things are they going to have to incorporate win. So I think you have to be mindful of that coming in to try not to create something that already isn't Lexa ble enough to be living on something that already exists and flexible enough that it can integrate with other things. So you definitely if you're building with blinders on thinking, this one segment is this. One solution solutions. All you need to do that. I think you're going to be limited. Carey says that aging care is the three hundred thirty seven billion dollar market, and Brian has found people all over the world that have a need for new technology. However as Rene said building products for these consumers doesn't come without challenges. It's been fascinating experience. The CIA's is they have very unique concerns and needs. And also the have a lot of interesting take on technology on contrary to the believe that is sometime they don't use new technology but received a lot of seniors actually van excited to trial robots even drive the robot around and pick a food from the dining hall that has been very interesting speier's fuss one interesting angle is that as we work with a c- we actually uncover a lot of the concerns that kind of novel us a target segman. Wound have news, for example privacy is the biggest concern. And even when we say, okay. You know, no one is watching you. No one is using the camera. They would not be comfortable with that, Stu. And so we have to. You know, have different design changes to incorporate the feedback. So the end result is for for our robot. When is not being in used when charging we actually have facing the the wall, and that actually peace of mind for use it. Our customers in elder care are businesses like senior living communities or home health agencies end by being a carryover myself for over a decade in working with these kinds of organizations. I really feel like I can empathize and understand the voice of our customer really understand that unique needs of the aging care market. It's not one that I think is is simple to crack. So I do feel like it's it's been really a unique experience to have been in some of the places where now serving the products that we create. We really always had this idea that looked which is wanted to be so damn intuitive that virtually anybody could use it for, you know, things like most products have touchscreen, and we've found that we really didn't need to have a touchscreen. Because really all we wanted to do when we found when we prototype. It was people generally wanted to kind of navigate through content. And so that's where we got this idea of why don't we use the old analogy of TV 'cause everyone's sort of familiar with channels, and how to, you know, a channel is different subject matter in a move through channels, and I'm gonna move through stations in jail or something like that. It was a bigger challenge. Because we couldn't just say, oh, this is a one product, and I just need to get this constituent right of older people generation we kinda had a get for everybody. Tuke says as long as you're mindful of their concerns seniors are actually quite excited about using new technology personal experiences. Caregiver helped carry empathize and understand the needs of her customers. Brian stresses the importance of making the product feel so familiar and intuitive that virtually anyone can use it what other product strategies and techniques have helped them grow their companies. I think the most interesting aspect to product management, and my name role is the decision making how to decide what's a priority to have as a feature and then managing against other priorities. One of the sayings in product management is you have all of the responsibility, and none of the thirty. And a lot of product managers will come to me and say, you know, how do I ensure I have credibility when I go and talk to the developers because they seem to be very skeptical of the requirements. I bring to them and my background actually in college. I majored in anthropology, and what I found is applying the skills of anthropology is been very helpful and product manager, and what was unique about anthropology say compared to psychology and sociology is you surveys sociology loves using surveys. You do research research prior researchers, of course. You do interviews psychology very on doing interviews. But one of the things is really emphasized in anthropology is observation as well. And I've brought that to product management. So I'll do research all talk to customers and interview them, and we'll also do, you know doodle poll or whatever survey for questions going in serving them what often happens in the surveys? And the interviews is people will tell you the ideal of their job or what they know their boss expects them to do their job. But if you sit quietly and observe them, especially if you embed yourself for a couple of days, you'll see their actual behavior. Mentioned in virtual reality. Are, you know, new new in the sense that there is now commercial hardware available to use them as solutions to our everyday problems? I think the question of why immersive is always really important to answer. So I think a lot of what happened with the our early on that it was really cool and really flashing exciting. But the UAE has taken some time to really take root. And when we think about the why for what we do immersive technology lets us do something really well that we can't do with any other methods day. So that things like from a training standpoint, you can actually embody someone who is maybe a different age or gender race in you are and culture, even and you can embody these different scenarios and have different perspec-. Taking opportunities in you insight into things that you otherwise wouldn't be able to have insight for the one example of that is needed a repeated a training program for caregivers around end of life decisions on. So you got to embody someone who is a fictional character. But is based on a lot of research design that we did in our pre production process through interviewing he bull that had ended life diagnoses and people who worked in hospice care or did research in space, and is you embody this man named clay. He gets terminal cancer diagnosis from his doctor in then he has made some decisions about how he wants to leave the out the final days of his life, and he decided to go on home hospice in the new actually experienced the end of your life through this perspective as clay. But then on the flip side we've created a caregiver role playing engine. So that you can actually embody the roles of your future. Care practices, and you can practice doing things like having the difficult conversation with place family members about respecting his wishes. That's a great example of why we allot of can't face end of life. I mean, we can't face that until it's our time. And so in this kind of simulation, you're actually able to develop skills end, Nick, proactive behavior changes that could impact the way you move out your life. Because this is a very unique news segment. A lot of the things that we learned is we have to observe them first hand to interact with them to see how they use the product and really spent on Indian by him. And they are auto is hard for engineers, especially in take to understand the news. You have these in home, visiting senior living facilities just kind of sit and observe how to interact, you know, how they talk to each other. How they walk around things that. One of the interesting thing about how robot is that we manufacture them owing house in California. So as a truly made in USA, so we three print the part and combine them, and so is the three printed robots, but this allows to either very quickly. So we can incorporate the feedback from us a modified design and wow, new motto. So for the last two years we had retentions robots. So injection moulding. Right. Then you had to make the more you had to send it to, you know, like Asia, for example, it would take a couple of weeks before you can get the new robot. Plus, we use a three apprentice. And so we send a model to the printers and printer the machine will print out the parks, and we can assemble them play. We can do this low volume and deployed test them see how they work and from day. I think the key really for us was making sure your prototyping testing. And you're not really designing for yourself. And maybe that's kind of what I was getting at were. There was a question of okay have listened to our customers enough or we kind of just building for ourselves. And the way you figure this out in is much as possible you try to build a prototype in get people's reaction to it in. This is kind of wear leg is an example. We regionally had a touchscreen our product and we delivered that prototype to people. We just noticed that seems obvious but a touchscreen, but people would kind of scrunch down and try to get their face close to the screen because that's how you use a computer. That's how us phone put the screen right next to your face. But if device is sitting on the counter top you've got almost kneel down to do that. And we saw people just kind of intuitively need to like lower themselves and recent wall. Well, that's not right. What you wanna do? I wanna get back to that picture to my friend who just came over the house until. So we just rethought in reciprocate. Let's say and have to use touch twenty. What would be the right user interface, the fastest and easiest one to solve the problem. And so in that case, we came up with these knobs, which now has begun our signature, and that's really a lot about how people can look at us in it signifies, everything or similize almost everything we stand for which is about simplicity. And so anyways that by doing the right thing and just listening to our customers and kind of watching how they do things. We're able to create a pretty cool innovation when we started out. This probably was a lot more about the simplicity angle in. How do I keep people connected? But now, the broader theme that people are bringing to us in the benefit that they see they're getting from loop is that there's an element of privacy to it inherently. Right. This is like your own private social network. You know, this is your own private Facebook. And that is why this has become kind of a bigger bigger idea. I think this is why AARP has partnered with us. You know, I think AARP as a much broader mission than any one thing. They I think there you can see them being very modern with way, the approach things holistically, and he gets tracked into as we're building something very broad, but has in terms of connecting families, it we just do it. Great way that's relevant to the world is privacy angle. And that can really help people in change your lives. You know, so Fleiss Latian. Just simply saying connected is super relevant in one of the top in call issues facing people. Just remember that what we're building. You just have to treat it like, it's a hypothesis. That's what it is. And you're just gonna constantly iterating rate rate and validate about eight validate until you really solidly proven your hypothesis to be correct. David Carey to Brian and Renee have shared their approach to building products for the long jetty economy. Observe your users firsthand build prototypes in based on feedback. And be mindful of the unique needs of your users. Learn more about carries company at embodied labs dot com, David's at my wound doctor dot com. Brian's at join loop dot com. Brenes tech your elders dot com and to at Omni labs dot com. You can find links to their websites linked in profiles at this product management dot com. That's our show until next time. This is Mike fish buying from alpha.

AARP CEO Brian Rene Omni labs founder ALPHA San Francisco CIA Facebook Mike fish Nashville medical officer David Carey Renee king Nick
Alabama is almost as awesome at basketball as it is as football. What? Plus: Duke in trouble, NCAA Tournament rants (College Basketball 01/20)

CBS Sports Eye On College Basketball Podcast

56:55 min | 3 months ago

Alabama is almost as awesome at basketball as it is as football. What? Plus: Duke in trouble, NCAA Tournament rants (College Basketball 01/20)

"Hey david carey parachutes wednesday january twentieth. Two thousand twenty one. Welcome back to the cbs sports eye on college basketball. Podcast where we sometimes discuss camel party. Dodo burs early. Black man. norrland is here with the deadly. We gotta talk about alabama. What in the world has happened at alabama the crimson tide. The extended their winning streak to eight games on tuesday with five seventy five. That's a thirty point victory at lsu. They took forty three three pointers. They made an sec registered. Twenty three of them. John petty made eight j von quarterly. Josh primo each made six now. Alabama seven zero in the sec in possession of a two game lead in the loss column of the league standings. The team started four and three now. Twelve and three norlander. Do your best to explain how nato has turned alabama basketball into alabama football. That's really where this is headed. Isn't it this is. We're seeing a morphing in progress here. That is unbelievable I think you tweeted something like that. Too by the way It's listen this has been absolutely incredible. and what they did on tuesday night amounts to one of the more surprising and impressive performances of the season so far it almost felt like alabama could almost Could almost name the score that they were they were going to get there so petty. Who by the way. Give a little heads up here. I'm doing on the thursday court report. I'm gonna have my mid season kinda coach the year player that your top ten nominees and in light of what he did. He's gonna make that top ten. I think it's legitimate at this point There's there's just no doubt about obama's in control of the sec. Especially after what. We saw elsewhere in the league last night and and they notes he has had. I mean it's been quite a journey over the past month or so you know. E e from calling out coach k. Walking it back. Did you see what he said in advance of the game earlier this week i did not he based on mytalk basically said that i'm going to paraphrase here he basically said and he how about to paraphrase it. When you listened to the quote it was not as dismissive as his tone was. His tone was respectful but he was basically asked about going on the road. Playing elite top twenty five teams like lsu and how players would adjust but there are no fans and he said. Listen it's just amazing parish. Nato's man he goes like they just don't have fans in their normally. I don't know if it's really going to be all that different for guys this year. Like you know it's a big building. They're a good team. But i honestly you know they don't fill it up So our guys have been playing in venues without fans they don't have fans this year. It's not going to be that much different. I mean it is unbelievable and again. He was not doing this tongue in cheek. He was not doing this sarcastically. He was just kind of trying to gently but matter of factly say people notice. You don't care about basketball. That building is never more than fifty percent full and so it shouldn't be that much of an environment adjustment for us this season. He says all that and then goes out making through it. I don't think i've ever been there for a game. I haven't. I've always been curious to go there. I've never been there for a game either but for you live close you i mean i can get there pretty quickly. I've been there for a football game. Multiple football games. but i've never. I don't think i've ever been there for a basketball game. Which is odd now. That i think about it. Yeah that is actually need to You need to amend that as as quickly as possible but anyway when And yeah oats just Continuing to be one of the one of the best quotes here is. Here's one of the quotes. I just pulled up quick. Homecourt advantage is less than it used to be. Lsu didn't have a very raucous crowd with us last year. Guess would be home. Court advantage is the same for them this year as any other year come on man incredible and And then lo and behold they back it up to go in there. They romp alabama's looking. I'm not saying it's a top ten team. I'm saying it's looking implying playing like a top ten team as of late and who knows maybe eventually winds up getting there. I put them in the top ten of the top twenty five and one. I mean you know they still got some not great stuff on the resume. A loss to stanford lost a western kentucky. But what do you do with the team. That's just beating everybody's brains in because that is what they're doing right now and they're not just beating people they're beating people to death. The past three wins. They were fourteen of thirty from three against kentucky. Fifteen of thirty six from three against arkansas. Twenty three of forty three from three against lsu so they've played fifty two of the one hundred nine three pointers. They've attempted in their past three games. Sixty three percent of their shots at lsu were three point attempts and on the season forty seven point. Three percent of their field goal attempts are three pointers which ranks eighteenth nationally. Would you believe it's eighteenth nationally but only third in the sec trivia time here we go lay it on me okay. So what teams in the sec. Shoot more threes per per game or per per the three point shot down three point range. A higher percentage of shots from three point range. Before i answer that would i be. I don't know if you have the car. The entire list in front of you kentucky last on that list i do not have no catalyst and for definitely arkansas's above them got to believe it right. No really arkansas not above alabama. Three point right not saying. This is not something to you about okay. The auburn for sure auburn auburn actually leads the sec. Forty eight point. Seven percent of its phil goal. Tim's come from three that rings tenth nationally. and then the only oh this is. I'm trying to think of what other team. I'm going to be surprised by. Gp because if you ask me. I would have said top. Three auburn alabama arkansas. But it's not arkansas. We know it's not kentucky. I know. I rick if it's not kentucky tennessee might be rick. Bars is not shoot. Threes that team they. They're at least traditionally has been the case. And it doesn't seem like it'd be florida. Don't think mississippi state wind guess is all missing kermit. It's not the answer is a the should not be surprising. Given the way. This stuff works basketball. Football people say. Football's a trickle up sport that that happened at the collegiate level then start being implemented into the nfl even high school to college to nfl. Yes okay basketball's a trickle down sport it goes. Nba down things that happened in the nba. Come down to college basketball. Obviously in the nba. Now percentage of shots from three point range is a very important thing so it may be shouldn't surprise you. That the team in the sec. That does this more often than any other team. Besides auburn has a coach with an mba background. So vanderbilt's my first. Gus given that that's right. Okay that's by the way it's not working out from right now. Venables foreign six is the only thing that has not won. A league. Game in the sec. So far but that doesn't make sense now that you laid out yeah. Auburn is attempting forty eight point seven percent of its shots from beyond the arc vanderbilt. It's forty seven point. Four and auburn is forty seven. I mean and alabama is forty seven point three. Those are the only three power conference schools who were attempting at least forty seven point. Three percent of their shots from three point range. Like i said alabama's been really hot this season but on the really hot in this past three games but on the season they're shooting roughly thirty one threes a game making roughly eleven of them per game. They're getting thirty three points per game on average from beyond the art and by the way this isn't much different from last season last season. Forty nine percent of their shots were three point attempts and they made thirty four point nine percent of them instead of thirty five point. Nine the big difference. Why was alabama sixteen and fifteen last season in alabama. Now looking like a top ten team this season last season. They couldn't guard one hundred and fourteenth in just defensive efficiency right now. They're eleventh in adjusted defensive efficiency. So they're still shooting the ball the same way more or less but they're guarding differently. And that is the reason. Alabama has gone from okay to looking like a possible if not probable sec champion. Yep defenses the big key talked about an h. Last weekend and they rank better overall on defense slightly but better on defense offense so far this season maybe a game like this brings more attention to that Or maybe it doesn't because they dropped one hundred five and set the sec record for three pointers made though but yeah riding. High men have not lost since six days before christmas and at twelve and three and with with a talented roster. This isn't surprising. In regard to the talent they have preseason top twenty five. I top twenty five team in the eyes of some but no one quite saw this coming. This is also the longest win streak for alabama's program eighteen seasons so and they haven't won seven in a row in the sec. Since the late eighties. So big. Time stuff here. And i love her. Jones is a wonderful wonderful defender and he's even been able to step up and hit some threes this year. Which i think is just one of those things that expands their dynamism overall and makes them genuinely good enough team to make a final four run. And it's sometimes it's hard for for us. As as media people are fans wind like alabama making a final four is like texas tech making a final four. We've we had never seen it before. So to envision. It is something that can be hard to do. But i do think that there's enough talent on this team to be able to do that. This season quarterly. has been able to adapt shock. I love jane shackelford game and then petty is is just you know he's hitting hitting another level and the fact that they are doing this by the way not being at full strength. I think just deserves Emphasis know jordan. Brunner in this game. he still out For the next couple of weeks and even without him they they look terrific and it just so happened that they're big game landed on the same night when tennessee put up against florida. And so because of this as we sit here and chat. It's not just that alabama's first se again. It's i by two games. Lsu tennessee missouri and kentucky all have to in the loss column bama has zero. And now it's it's projected to win the not a guarantee but with the way it's been playing. I think it's a. It's a safe bet at this point. There's no debate about whether this is an effective way to play basketball shooting this high of a percentage from three pointer this this high percentage of your shots from three point range. It works in the nba. It has worked in college basketball. Most notably with villanova a few years ago. You know that villanova team in two thousand eighteen. That won the national title forty seven point five percent of its shots from three. They made forty point one percent of them. They want an ncaa tournament. Here's what i would ask you. Obviously it worked for villanova. 'cause they made about forty percent of all of the shots at alabama. The percentages is lowered thirty. five point. nine is this a reliable way to operate in a single elimination tournament. If the goal is to actually win four games and get to the tournament. Do you have any concerns about that. Maybe not because of this and this could have been to a certain extent. It could have been the opponent. Of course you can call and louis so yes. It's it's not. is it reliable a seven game. it's like okay. We have one cold night. One called nine insult tournament right so lsu ranks one twenty-seven in defensive efficiency and it just has not been it hasn't been an effective defensive program under will wait in fact we'll wait Were recruited differently from vcu. That's obviously putting it lightly But the defensive fingerprint if you will. Vcu under we'll wade was way. Different than lsu bama took advantage lsu's just on an elite or even a very good defensive team so against better defensive teams in the tournament might not be reliable. I also wanna bring up other Crazy factoid stat about The game last night. And this came from jared person who is a researcher with espn hat tip to To kyle boon not cop porter about this because he dropped us in our slang jaw. Strong jaw kyle boon So in addition to the twenty. Three's alabama scored thirty points on tuesday night with attack drives at the rim and six points at the foul line every single point. This is you wanna talk about. You know ultra-modern and i don't know if this was explicitly by design or if it was just basically Behavior in games and practices that resulted in this. Every single point alabama made was either a three pointer close to the rim the foul line. There was not one. Mid range shot that was made by alabama last night. And that is that is taking you know the absolute fullest extent of of math putting it on the court and doing it we have seen mba. The nba moved to this aggressively in the past half decade in alabama. At least in one single game did it to maximum effect. Because your best shots if you can make them a three's worth more than two speaks to itself and then you're going to have a higher rate if you shoot within five feet of the rim than if you are seven to nine thousand feet from the rim and so you want your most effective shots as as possible. No mid range shots it can sometimes make for a less creative game but it can be a more efficient way to win and certainly can help you guarantee so an answering your question if it can get close to mastering this then yes. It's chances of winning in the tournament. We're going to be great if it can be that good from close range and not as reliable as tuesday night because we shouldn't expect that but still trying to hit close to forty percent of the team. Yes there is something there now in the nba. The only you're not allowed to take mid range shots unless you're kevin durant then you can do whatever you want but everybody else. We're at the rim or were launching from three to answer my question. I think you can trust alabama in a single elimination tournament playing this way and the reason is because of what they are on defense like if they were just an okay defensive team that i'd be a little concerned because you know if you make thirty six percent of thirty three's you'll probably going to be fine in most games but if for whatever reason that goes down twenty percent and a forty minute game and you're okay defensively you're probably losing but they're good enough defensively to keep themselves in games. They're good enough defensively to endure a cold stretch. So i like this team i. I moved them into the top twenty five and one last week jumped him up pretty high after what they did over the weekend and now i've got him tenth in the top twenty five one after another just completely overwhelming performance. Their next game. Scheduled is going to be saturday at mississippi state and like i wrote the twenty five and one on wednesday morning. They are becoming one of the big stories in college basketball for purely basketball reasons you earlier this season it was because of a quote from the head coach about mike. Now it's because they're bombing anybody who steps on the court with them. Duke lost seventy nine. Seventy three at pitt onto the blue devils are now five and four. Are they really gonna miss the nc double a. tournament. We'll get into that next but first check this up the you kind of like this guy but when you can't decide between the filet o. Fish or the big mac in he says mortgage both thank you. You definitely mike this guy meal. Get it at mcdonald's when he get two of your face for six bucks. Limited time only practice and participation may vary singled him regular price support for this podcast comes from progressive. What would you do with an extra eight hundred dollars. Buy a plane ticket. Pay down your student. Loan treat yourself to those shoes. You've been eyeing with progressive. You could find out drivers who switch and save save an average of seven hundred ninety six dollars on car insurance get your quote online at progressive dot com and see how much you can be saving national average annual car insurance savings new customer survey to save with progressive in two thousand nineteen. So duke lost seventy nine seventy three at pitt on tuesday. The blue devils fell to five and four. They're now oh and three in quadrant one opportunities. The best win is over a notre dame team that's eighty-sixth that kim palm. There is not much to the resume and they've got some questionable losses. Norlander you concerned about duke making the incident tournament. I mean i don't have. I gotta be honest. If duke makes it doesn't make it. I got no concern. It's not something that i'm thinking about it Should be concerned. What what are you thinking about it now. Top three things you think about it night right now. Top three things you think about it night. I mean it really. It's on a night by night basis. Here what are the. What are the three things you thought about last night. okay Last night i thought about What the next song. I was gonna learn on guitar. Turn debate with. That's going to be Sultans of swing dire straits. mastered it. kinda. Wanna get in there. Thought about what we can talk about on the pot. Thought about the to thought about that. And frankly i thought about how glorious day was going to be because as we record this podcast. We're a little more than an hour away from having a new president officially. So kinda got kind of got jacked up over that got jacked up over over over potential return to a normal democracy. Sorry that's weird what about you. What did you think about. So i think a lot of people were jacked up about that last night and carried over into today. What did i think about last night. I thought about what. We're gonna do. The podcast i thought about. Here's the problem sometimes. I can't remember what i thought about exactly is a cop out by the way that's fine. We can steer we can see right back into the topic. Here i thought about. I thought about what i would be able to carve out a little more time to complete season. Three of cobra kai at thought about that for a minute. I don't know that. I don't know that i've reached a conclusion but it entered my mind. I don't think so much at night. I try not to. Do you think a lot. All right according to bart tour t rank forecast after the loss. He's got duke at fifteen point seven percent chance of getting into the incidentally tournament and It was significantly higher than that prior to the game still under fifty percent maybe even under forty percent but we are at that point here. You know so we've we did. This phase was kentucky and we've completely moved on forever and now we really get into it with duke. I wasn't surprised. You and i both picked pit to win this game. We thought it would and it did and crack congrats depit. By the way it's eight and two with a four one record in the league jeff capable is the first player ever to be coach k. Which is obviously notable In a game am although. I'm sure he's not the first one ever. If ever played one on one like you know back in the day but whatever Mike the only former system to beat mike chassis. So that was a first time thing last night and pittsburgh is going to be a team that i think up to make the instantly tournament with duke five and four looking at its next game scheduled to be on saturday against louisville. That'll be an interesting one. But yeah the wind's against compensate. Bell herman at notre dame and then home to bc and wake forest not even close to good enough. If we started this ornament today. That would be weird but duke wouldn't be in it if we started it tomorrow. Also weird duke would still not be an. It's got a lot of work to do and we could be very well looking at a situation. Where duke and kentucky minimally in addition to other big schools like arizona. We know maybe indiana maybe north carolina could all be out of this year's tournament. I i guess. I'm not surprised. I mean i'm obviously surprised. Kentucky is this bad. But i could have sort of envisioned kentucky not living up to expectations. I'm surprised duke is bad you know. They returned to rotation player so they were at least two players ahead for the most. I know whatever you think. Kim brooks but like kentucky duke return to high at least in theory high level guys. They enrolled some high level. Guys i thought duke would at the very least be a top twenty five team and i guess they still have time to get there but you know they're just not good right but like it wasn't even surprising that they lost pit evidence being that you and i both picked them to lose at pitt. They've done nothing. This season through nine games to suggest even for a second that they're good basketball team like at least kentucky has had a moment here or there where you go okay. Maybe they figure some stuff out. I don't think there's even been that moment. Would duke because duke look good single game this season where you go okay. That's what i thought we were going to see. I don't think they've even had that game. They i mean depends on your opinion and notre dame but they did they performed relatively well at notre dame and matthew hurts. Been decently consistent So i think that's notable But for they have not had a signature game for a win. That definitely hasn't happened. Maybe you can come because the biggest piece of optimism for duke on tuesday was the fact that you had jaylon johnson come off the bench score twenty four points and have the best game of his college career resemble the kind of player that they thought he was going to be more consistently throughout the season. So if that can be the case going forward. Yeah maybe things can change. But i to see was i mean i you know. He wasn't even best player on the floor. I mean just sham penny was frigging terrific. Thirty one points fourteen boards. He continues to be awesome So even even in a in a defeat where at a star performance they still don't even have the best player on the floor and that's just for duke fans. Listen pockets the that's just something. They're not used to seeing there and so yes. There's a little bit of adjustment. The only thing i'll add here is that i'm not surprised by this in the preseason i was i would have if you told me if you told me i we're going to guarantee you that at least one of duke and kentucky's not going to have a good season i would pick do. I just didn't think to do the overall talent warrant being a top ten team either grudgingly put him in like my top fifteen. I didn't want to do that. But again i kinda had to trust the history there. So did i see five and four coming. No did i see a season. Where duke wasn't going to be like a top three team in the acc coming guess. I didn't think it was going to be Going to be an elite team in here. It's it's a totally different situation altogether. And we'll wait and see if the greatest greatest you know coach in college basketball history arguably right up there with With mick cronin can can somehow turn it around him to the tournament. That can still happen. But we just haven't seen evidence that it's going to happen yet. Well the best thing going for duke right now. Is that the not that good. I mean there's only two teams in the top twenty five at kim pa. I'm from the acc. Virginia and florida state. So duke is down relative to normal standards. Duke is down relative to expectations. Duke still might be good enough to win enough games in this league even in its current form to to make the instable tournament for whatever it's worth. Kim has them still finishing eleven. Seven in the acc and eleven seven in the acc. Probably be good enough. That'll probably get them there. But the idea that we are sitting here on january twentieth reasonably envisioning an ncaa tournament without duke without kentucky. I think you can save with possibly without michigan state possibly without north carolina. Possibly without indiana. Those are some of the biggest brands in the sport that all could be watching the most unusual instability tournament in our history from out somewhere. And if we get to that point. That's obviously going to become one of the most dominant talking points in college basketball when we when we get to march and And we've got the tournament tuesday night things. You've got florida beating tennessee. Pretty badly purdue upsetting ohio state those were. Usc also lost oregon state team. That wasn't ranked the people. But i did have them in the top twenty five so those were some other at least developments in the past twenty four hours that are worth highlighting. Yeah for sure Yeah good point on usc. So i had that. I had the quad box up on my My apple tv espn app. Which is extremely helpful. This time of year and i had the usc oregon state game on But just never had the volume of on it. So i i watched it but i never heard the commenting team and it was. It was on my radar but not but that's that's a stinging singing loss there for the trojans which are trying to keep pace with ucla and frankly now falling well behind The bruins dammit grown into the stock of no one on this podcast is leading the pack twelve in his undefeated in that league. So that's a that's a c bump loss for usa. There's no doubt about it. You heard it here. I asked for the two other results. You mentioned i just gotta talk about them. Real quick tennessee. I'm well first of all. I think florida to win the game outright. So i'm not surprised by the outcome but i'm surprised by the margin absolutely florida is maybe one more weird loss away. Maybe it's coming this week at georgia from being maybe the weirdest team out there. It's seven and four. It's lost florida. State bama kentucky in mississippi state. It's windsor lsu tennessee. I don't know what to make the team If we did a if if we ask jerry palm to mock up a new bracket right. Now i'm guessing on the strength of that wind. Florida would probably be in the field right now. Maybe just in the first four but boy. oh boy tennessee. What you're doing Gp i think had you go in you know like twenty six and one this regular season. That's not going to happen. Four and two in the league. And that's that's a problematic loss and then Yeah just a quick note. Purdue like ohio state. I was pretty confident was gonna win that game. Nope was seven and five. Gp on the morning of january eighth just twelve days ago and it was two and three in the league it was staring at. Its next four games. Three of them being on the road against michigan state michigan's eighteen without was better than it is right now in indiana team. We thought was better than it is right now. Obviously winnable game at home against penn state and then a really tough game against ohio state which purdue already defeated earlier this year. In december proven. You're hoping out of that two and two and maybe continue to tread water. Now man matt painter just continues to get it done just a foreign. Oh in that stretch now. Six three in the league. Eleven and five overall and whereas if you did you either way too early bracket projections. In the first week of january purdue would have been definitely above team riding riding the fence there now. They're they're in. You know they've got so much room to spare Because the qualities of these wins and they're gonna take more losses of course but I don't think there are many teams. In fact there might not be more than two or three teams in the past two weeks that have done more to help their stock than what produce been able to do by virtue of not just winning the games beginning three road winds. That'll be all log squad win so that was a big time game for for the boilers. Yeah one note about purdue. I think this put some in the minority. Once practice started they have not had to stop one time. They have been without interruption due to covid issues. Obviously another notable result villanova played on tuesday night. Beat seton hall of is phil novas first game since december twenty third so. I just thought it was interesting. That as purdue starts to go on this little run they are one of the handful of teams from power. Conference that once practice started. They've had no issues. So a tip of the hat to those guys for a by all accounts live in the right way and being careful. But i think you can reasonably suggested it has an impact on the season like the other teams have to shutdown practices. They have not spend a missed games. They have not and now they're sitting here. Yes i agree with you looking like an ncaa tournament team. The officially announced on tuesday. How it expects the ncaa tournament to unfold like walk us through it. How is this going to work. We now get dates for the first four and everything else. Yeah it was pretty close. I guess they're close. I was talking about being closed. of course i am. what are you talking about. I missed one day. Yeah i did a good job. What when you're talking about. Here's what we i i didn't i didn't see you. I didn't see you get out there and And making an an guessing what what the dates were. What was that about apologized for not guessing at something. I working in a right or wrong business. Are you a chicken. I think so okay. So we're gonna selection sunday on march fourteen and then the first four. I got thoughts. Okay i got. I got no shortage of thoughts here. Okay well guess. Throw throw a throwback. Gp back in the day. This is like seven eight years ago. I'm going with this. He would file a column and then like three or four times over like a five month span. He would just file another column where he wasn't done and it would just be additional thoughts. Do you remember the additional thoughts online. I vaguely remember jeff. Bordello right now and say remember additional thoughts he will instantly remember it no doubt about it not file another four hundred word column and it would be. I got some additional thoughts on that thing. I wrote about one hundred percent. This is back during you know like the blog areas. Who's just like you know what i'm just gonna drop thing there anyway. I got so sometimes. I would have some additional thoughts. You often have additional thoughts all right. I've got thoughts and additional thoughts here. Okay so the first four is going to be on thursday march eighteen. I talked to dan gavin on tuesday night. There's a cuna that's a. cbs. Sports dot com. That you can read in the app or you can click through on the pod description. I'll drop the lincoln there as well. The first four is going to be at hinkle and assembly hall and starring assembly hall and mackey arena and The reason for this close again. I was close. I was close. But i was wrong. The reason i ask him why why not henkel and he said because all of the venues in indianapolis we're going to have x. amount of courts in the convention center. I've told you know they're gonna try and get twenty practice courts in there and then lucas oil is going to have to courts you got. Is jim hinkle. Bankers life all of those venues are also going to be used for practice schedules. And so since everyone's saying in indianapolis made those logical sense to play the first four out in bloomington and west. Lafayette said that the other venues can be used for as many practices as possible which does make sense. Tell you what. I think that this should be and we'll have to wait and see how it all goes but once we go back to a normal tournament schedule first round thursday friday. I think that the first four should always be wednesday with four games and just make it a day basketball game four in a row. See if that ever changes. I think that this will actually introduce us to a. Because i think what's going to be good about this tournament amongst other things is we're going to be forced to wait for the past ten plus years. We've had this deal. Where selection sunday comes. We love it and then inevitably. You're either driving home from work if you're on the east coast or in central time. You're driving home from work. You're getting dinner ready. And you don't even realize it. But the first tournament game is technically started on tru tv. And you're trying to eat dinner like it just kind of sneaks up on you this year. You're not gonna have anything until thursday and your and for the young ones out there. You're going to actually feel what it's like to truly wait for the tournament to start on that thursday and it's kind of a it's a good anxiety and i think that's a wonderful thing and so going forward. I would hope that this works and that we put offer four games on wednesday and then as it's going to happen this year all those winners will feed into the first round results. Two days or move so this year every first four game on thursday. The winners will play on saturday. What do you think about that. I'm fine with that. I if i if you would allow me to change something with the first floor it would have. It would be that. It's all at large bids and no automatic if you want to. Gpu can mess with the first four. Do whatever you like. that's what i'm doing. I'm i'm putting the auto bids and the main bracket from the jump and we're having the last eight at large bids compete in dayton to try to advance into the main break. I agree with you. I asked gathered this very thing. This will be the one thing away from the from the piece. Here is his exact quote on why they did not do i said did. Did you even consider it. You tell you why. I can tell you why. Because they don't care about the little schools they just like they'll they'll eliminate one of them each before they get to the main bracket yep. He didn't say that. But that's all i know he didn't say that. But that's the real answer. He said unless there was a very compelling reason to go away from the normal format the committee wants to maintain as much normalcy as possible. We honestly we didn't consider that we had bigger fish to fry. I can probably speak for the committee on this. It's gonna be hard to do this tournament with the model that we're used to making change of just for change's sake only create more complications. Were trying to limit complications right. It's a reasonable question to ask. But it's not the kind of level of detail that we've been focused on because the complexity of this enterprise endeavor is so massive that having some normalcy something that we can embrace. I understand gavitt saying there. I appreciate him taking thirty minutes to talk to me on tuesday night for this piece to just give a little more info as to what we learned and what we still don't know what he can't say but simply swapping out sixteen seeds for at large is is not adding to the complexity of this whole enterprise. There it would be way better. You'd have teams from power conferences. Yeah that have been Underperforming frustrating but you could also have duke or carolina playing in the first four on thursday and creating even more urgency there I think it's just a misfire. On behalf of the committee and the the sixteen seeds should get the privilege of getting to play in the first round as it's constituted normally. They're the only argument against this. Is that if you're a sixteen seat and you win that first four game you do get an ncaa tournament unit. So you do receive money for your conferences. And that's why you don't see more. Pushback is because every single tournament you have at least two sixteen seats in slow major leagues that are guaranteed to get their leagues money. Because they've earned an ncaa tournament unit by way of a victory so that's the only positive upside for and it's not an insignificant upside. Let me be clear i. I wasn't suggesting necessarily that. They should do it this season. I understand we're danced coming from like let's just. Let's let's change the things we have to change and leave everything else alone. I get that. I mean in general going forward if you allowed me to tinker with the first four. That's what i would do and because right. Now let's be honest about the first four four games to on a tuesday night to wednesday night and on each one of them is interesting and the other one nobody cares about. You're watching to sixteen. You're watching team. You've never watched before. Probably if you're casual basketball fan play. You don't know any of the players. You probably don't know the coaches are you know. Is that one of. Them's going to win. And then two days later going to get the probably get the brains beaten by a one c. Nobody cares about those games so my way is just it. It works on multiple levels. It allows everybody who gets an at large bid to be the main bracket so that you get that experience of playing duke plank kentucky playing virginia you know you get a shot at something. You're guaranteed a shot at a historic moment and even if it doesn't go well because it likely won't you still get that experience of day before the game. You're in the press conferences. logist like do kentucky is. You're probably walking walking past them in a hallway Practicing in that in that arena. And then you get to go on the court in a game. Everybody's going to watch and yeah you'll probably lose but one day you'll be able to tell your kids man. Let me tell you about the time i played against zion williamson and cam radish and that other guy you know like you get you get a little bit. You have that. That's worth something. So and then it so i think it's awesome for the sixteen and then it creates four interesting games instead of two interesting games for the first four. The argument against it is the one that you mentioned. And i've actually had coaches of sixteen seeds. Make this point. I'd rather do this. Because i'd rather go to the first four a. because i've got. I've got a realistic chance to get my league. Check but b. I might can get an ncaa tournament. When i've had a coach sixteen. Sixteen say if. I win that game i have. I am somebody who has won in. Ncaa tournament game. The details are they are what they are but i can forever say. Oh yeah. I wanna game in the tournament. And that's worth something to them and i think you're right that's why more don't fight for it even if i wish they would agreed i of the schedule. So we're going to have the first round on friday and saturday. The second round on sunday and monday. The sweet sixteen as predicted by yours truly will be the following saturday and sunday. Those will be all standalone games. Which is going to be a new thing so normally the sweet sixteen is on thursday and friday. And you'll have two games in the in an overlapping windows in the seven o'clock window in the nine thirty window. No this year. The sweet sixteen. You hearing me correctly. Saturday and sunday. March twenty seven and twenty eight. Every single sweet. Sixteen game will have its own. Tv window from early afternoon the evening. I think that's going to be a wonderful bonus for this year than the elite eight will be in prime time on monday and tuesday march twenty nine march thirtieth the final four and championship game as we've previously told you remain on schedule with april three in april five. They're just a quick thought on On all of them more than just a quick thought here Randomly have gotten a lot of questions about this. I'll just address this people wondering if like big ten teams are going to be able to play in big ten venues. The answer's yes. No indiana efforts in the first four is not gonna play the simply will go to mackie and likewise if produced the first fourteen it will go play the simply hall but gavitt confirmed and like if if butler makes sixteen those games are going to be at henkel and bankers life. Fieldhouse that in a second butler would be guaranteed to play. At bankers life makes the sweet sixteen but any other big team is going to be put in henkel. And if it is it's just gonna be a matter of filling the bracket. They're not going to give any sort of special treatment. The the oppo those teams and those are not familiar enough with those venues that is considered to be any kind of advantage there. So if you're wondering if michigan is going to be able to play A first round game at assembly hall. Because it's a big ten team. The answer is yes that might happen or it could go to lucas oil. But there's no. There's nothing about that that is going to To preclude those teams in those leagues with those affiliated venues. I've gotten that question like fifteen times. So also the asp as predicted assembly hall and macarena. They're gonna host to first four games. And then they'll each host two first round games on that friday and saturday Gavett wouldn't confirm this to me on the record at another source confirmed me expect those games at assembly and mackey to be in the afternoon unless circumstances force it otherwise because they want the team to be back in indianapolis at night where everyone's gonna stay there. No site will ever host more than three games. In one day do cleaning protocols. I asked gavitt if he knew. Basically how much time it's gonna take between the end of the game and the next game to start in the same venue. He said yes. We know that answer. No not going to tell you right now. You'll probably know it when we jointly announced our tip time template with cbs and turner. Which is that a secret clare. The secret how long it takes to clean something. I just tell. I asked that. Because i'm curious but he's not he's not he's not giving it up so we're gonna probably find that out in february. I ninety minutes two hours. I don't know but i don't. I don't understand when people keep secrets. That aren't worth keeping like the grizzlies do this all the time. They'll jaren jackson junior will be injured. And it's like okay. Well you know exactly what the injury is. Obviously you know what the timetable for a probable possible. Return is obviously but they will never say they will never do the jaren jackson out until he's ready to play but they will never or rarely put a timetable on it. It's like why are you being secretive about like a baseball. Pitcher has an arm injury and they say head surge. Today was successful. He's expected back beginning of august. Like what what. What is so doing that. I always like my friends who worked with the grizzlies. I'm like what secrets. Are you keeping today about stuff. That's really not that important in. Here's one idea that they can't tell you how long it takes to clean court seems unemp- unimportant and also i hear you. I hear you. But i asked him at the That's the answer that i got there So I did ask why you know why lucas oil stadium's going to host the elite eight and final four which we know. It's not going to be filled with fans to me. That's just a bummer. Like i thought this was going to be the one year and the only year for the next century where we would have the national championship game. Played in the basketball venue hasn't happened since ninety six kentucky over syracuse in new jersey. And i thought that would happen. But i do have an answer. Why didn't happen so initially the nwa thought it was only going to get bankers life. Fieldhouse home the pacers thought it was only going to get it for the first weekend for practices and then for games and then the subway went back to the pacers and it wasn't the they went back to the pacers and said. Is there any way that you would be willing to allow us to have your building for a second straight weekend because what happens is the pay. The nba hasn't released the second. Half of its schedule yet. And what happens is teams who their buildings go to the nba. And say you know you you always make schedule but here are the dates where we have issues that we need to work around and so the pacers went to the nba and said the end. Subway has asked us if we would block off from march fifteenth until truly like march thirtieth into hughes. The building. pacers said yes which is no small thing by the way. That's that's like a significant deal for an mba franchise to say we're not gonna use our building for fifteen days. But that's what's going to happen there. I asked him if they considered why. Why not just go first round bankers life because you need the venues second weekend. The pacers can use it and then the championship weekend. You go back to bankers life and use the same amount of time that the pacers aren't using it gavitt no that in consider that and he didn't tell me this but we already know widening. Consider that they didn't consider it because they are going to. This is me guessing. I don't have this directly. But i'm using logic and i'm using the facts that are available. Lucas oil stadium at the end of the nfl season was allowing ten percent. Fan capacity. obviously. The wants to have fans if it can if it can safely do it in marion. County health officials the same people that allowed the colts to have ten percent capacity. They are expecting that the same health officials which are working in conjunction with holding this tournament will allow the symbol a to have to at least ten percent or something in that in the building. There's a huge. There's a huge difference between doing that in a football stadium in basketball arena. Bankers life fieldhouse holds about twenty thousand people. Lucas oil stadium has a capacity. Just seventy thousand if you up it. If the if the pandemic gets better still the worst pandemic i have seen. I've never seen one like this before. Okay even if it gets to fifteen percent capacity allowance. The difference in people allowed in the building. That aren't you know media people that are you know players coaches all that out. Seventy seven seventy eight hundred people and when you're talking tickets potential concessions however. They're going to do this safely as they can do it. It's a significant difference there and so that's why it's happening. That's exactly the reason why because the nwa. It's another way for the to be able to make money. I understand why they're doing it. Call me a purist. That's fine with me on this. I just wish they had been willing to just say no. You know what 'cause there's nothing stopping from doing the title game. And i understand why. They can't have the pacers building but they could have had if they wanted it and they chose not to. And they're gonna play at lucas oil. Where do you land on this. They're doing what they have to do to make the most money they can possibly make. They're doing what they always do. What are you talking about. I know that but would you western even normal times. They play these games in domes. Oh i understand that that could still sixty five thousand tickets instead of twenty thousand diggers. It's a math problem. So of course they were gonna take this to a dumb because even if you are restricted on how many fans you can have. You can have more in a bigger building. This is the least surprising thing of my entire lifetime. But what would you prefer if you had the choice. What would you. I would prefer for them to play it in a basketball arena in in in in stopped a tying itself so tightly amateurism like i changed the whole thing. Change everything about the ebola but they are tied to the way they do things and this falls completely in line with the way that they do things they are trying to maximize the money that they can make you know in connection with the biggest event that they put on surprise surprise. I know i hear you. I hear you. I do think we can move. I do think that this year I think that thursday i four. It's gonna be like you know a really good cocktail hour with amazing orders at a nice wedding and it will satiate you before you get to friday because the one thing that gotta la blowback on or at least a lot of people re tweeted with comments when when the schedule came out. Was this sucks man. That thursdays gone. Well it's not entirely gone like you're going to have the ncaa tournament. Starting on thursday. There will be day basketball on thursday. And then you're gonna get. It means that much to you have week dance tournament basketball. I get that you're still going to get it on friday and if anything that might be the most cherished treasured first round weekday in history after we didn't have a tournament last year so i still think that that friday is going to be absolutely up. There's more in the story at. Cbs sports dot com. Encourage you to read it. gavitt He didn't give up a ton gave up some stuff. I did ask him for those. That are curious about this. Because i i did have a few people reach out. frankly You know coach amongst because people want to know what's the going to do about you know if a team can't play in the tournament and i'll have more about this also on thursday in the court report. We'll talk about it on friday but did ask avid. Hey guys have even if you can't tell me like. Do you have your plan in order for what you're gonna do if a team gets to indianapolis and suddenly can't play or if a team is an auto bid winner fails these seven consecutive tests. Covert wise goes on pause. Then just like teams are going on pause right now and can't get there like. Do you have confidence that you will have. Sixty eight teams compete in this tournament. No matter how you get to that sixty eight via forfeits and substituting in and he said premature to answer that that is now what they are getting to this week next week the week after and they'll plan to release that in In february it's obviously a significant hurdle. Doing everything possible. They can to avoid having that happen To the extent where how about this when teams traveled indianapolis. Gp by plane or by bus like every year. The end subway provides schools charter. Planes chartered buses. So they can. they can fly private. But when you do that everyone has to be six feet apart. And i don't know how you will police this to be honest but it is going to be an nc double a. mandate No one is allowed to eat or drink when they are on the planes or the buses when they are leaving to go to indianapolis. They're doing this in an effort. That if someone i think pops positive the contact tracing will allow potentially for the team to not be eliminated. You see what i'm saying but it is a. It is going to be quite strict in terms of what the the covid protocols are going to be in and around the tournament. We'll get more into those details when we get into march all right before we get out of here over the next couple of nights. Because we'll talk to you again on friday morning. A handful of interesting games not many handful. Small hands Indiana at iowa. Probably the most interesting thing inside kara. Hi arena thursday night. Nine o'clock eastern in the end enters eight and six overall three and four in the big ten zero wins over top forty five. Kim pom teams there oh and five and quadrant one opportunities. The hoosiers need a signature win. Do you give them a realistic chance to get one. Thursday night at iowa define realistic. I mean why. Don't you just google now defined parameters on this. I'm going to actually give you the official definition of realistic gimme. A percentage realistic is having or showing a sensible and practical idea of what can be achieved or expected. Doesn't sound realistic to me. Does it realistic. You indiana winning at iowa is not sensible is not a practical idea of what can be achieved or expected. I'll tell you this. They ain't nothing all season that would make you think it's practical or sensible to expect them to win at iowa but it is college basketball so you never know you never know not expecting it. This would be. Maybe the biggest. One of archie miller indiana career if he pulled it off considering the circumstances of the program right now and how good iowa is and how well iowa been playing as of late luca garza still the front runner Leading candidate my is national player of the year. So yeah. I mean. I'm an i'll be watching and plenty interested. That's probably the most riveting game riveting overboard actually intriguing. Maybe even that's too much the game that you might want to give some rubber neck treatment to indiana iowa on thursday i think is a is a good one there because they actually interested in it because this is what interests me in any college basketball season the teams that weren't supposed to be good that are great and the teams that were supposed to be good that are struggling especially when those teams are big brands with passionate fan bases that start hashtags fire. Rt could that gets tweeted at in my direction after every indiana loss. So i'm actually genuinely interested in this because iowa is about what we expected them to be. But indiana was. I had a preseason top twenty five and they aren't bad they aren't bad they just wing they just don't beat good teams but they're not bad they just don't win games. I know it sounds like like contradicts each other. But i think it's actually true there are there are not bad team for whatever. Reason can't win games often enough. I hear you. That's the most intriguing one Usc at stanford stanford needs that. That's a five o'clock tip on f s one on thursday. Just he's stanford needs to get that kind of win if it wants to build return resume. I don't know the pac twelve is definitely again at least foreign chance for six six one of them's going to have to be sanford and you win. A home game against is a home game. They're playing santa cruz. it's done. I love playing their own frequent county at this point. That's an important one and then I just wanna give love to a mountain west hip here. Colorado state utah state. It's late on thursday eleven o'clock f s one. Both those teams are teams. We've talked about on. Cbs sports h hugh recently colorado state's ten and three just lost at utah state on tuesday. It's got a good opportunity here. Utah state's twelve three yet to lose the mountain west nine clearly tracking toward an ncaa tournament bid and the mountain west utah state boise state colorado state. Those are the three that are really competing for fantasies. Probably slipped a little too much there. We'll keep an eye but give a little love to teams out in the mountain range there. Craig smith utah states Certainly done a wonderful job. Nickel medved at a colorado state as well so in addition to the the indian iowa game will command the most attention But you know the rams of of csu in the aggies of utah state both Trying to to get themselves in a position to to have at large consideration. And that's a big one for colorado state. Do you know why carver hawkeye. Arenas named carver hawkeye arena. Have you ever thought about it. that's Yeah no i. I i know the answer a that's carver hawkeye. He he. I believe I think he was in his teen years. When tony was two years old. Carver hawkeye was a very famous. He was a very famous. You know he didn't make a lot of a lot of inroads in basketball but but people don't realize I was. I was squash team in the late. Eighteen hundreds magnificent dominance. Some might even say you know on the level of a dynasty Carver hawkeye very famous squash. Coach in late eighteen hundreds None of that is true. It's a weird name. Usually you get an arena named after a person. John paul jones arena. Or you get a name arena named after like your tiger stadium. You don't really usually get a name plus the mascot like if it was john paul jones cavalier arena. You don't really get. That guys are named after carver hawkeye right. No the hawkeyes were named after hall. Just talk and then carber is roy. J carver still remember. Roy j i think roy j became cover hawkeye again once he wants legal age change. What if roy day-car carver actually changes his name. Do carver hawkeye. So when you introduced him you'd be he. I'm i'm gary tears. It's nice to see you. Sam cobra high. That's something that asked name okay. He was an industrialist and he started the carver pup factory. I learned all this last night. He donated ninety nine point two million dollars just before he died in one thousand nine hundred one of a heart attack in spain at the age of seventy one and for that nine point two million dollars. He's had his name on that building ever since. That's pretty good value back. We're talking about them now. So you're damn right as good value of fortunately roy j never got to walk inside. Carver hawkeye. it didn't open until after he was dead at the moment of silence for roy j aka carbohydrate been missing. You missing you. A lot shouts to devon down to chester south. Carolina shelf stereo. Mefin teagle jude justin. Now thank you guys for listening. Once again of the island college basketball podcast in the middle of the worst dumbest most idiotic pandemic my lifetime. I like this i never. I never seen one like this. I never. I never thought. I'd see one like crazy. The craziest insane dumbest never seen the president in thirty one minutes. I never seen one like this. No lander although hey good news. I got my mother. A vaccine appointment got my father vaccine point. Got my wife vaccine appointment offer next week. So that's that's right huge goodness. We'll talk to you on friday until the intake multi for a leg up on your book every single day. Yes every day we got you covered on the early yet. A daily betting podcast powered by sportsline. Join me the coach. Is i bring you the best campers directly to your podcast app every morning by eleven. Am early edge. Knows your time is money. We aim to deliver you. The betting need to know in under ten minutes. You're sportsbook won't know what. Hit them from the gridiron to the basketball court. There's a sharp side of the action. You'll be armed with it. Be sure to download and subscribe to the early age powered by sportsline part of the cbs. Sports podcast network available in apple podcasts. Spotify stitcher or wherever else. You listen to podcasts.

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#304: Are Core Values Worthless?

The EntreLeadership Podcast

31:50 min | 2 years ago

#304: Are Core Values Worthless?

"If you ask people to show up every day, and you don't tell them what we're building why it matters where it's going. You are really hurting that person's mental health helping business leaders grow themselves their team and their prophets. This is Andre leadership. Now, here's your host Ken Coleman coming from the music city. This is the broadcast of leaders by leaders four leaders. Thank you so much for joining the conversation are feature conversation this episode with Donald Miller a good friend of ours. But on the program many times, we're going to talk specifically with Donald this time about mission statement and core values, how do they coexist? And then I'm excited. Introducing a Dave and carry way who are going to share their story. What did they do when days father who's essentially the mission? Not just the mission statement when he passed away. How did they handle that transition specifically with mission statement and? Core values when the very soul of the organization pass while you're gonna love this, very practical stuff. And then we got a great resource for you from our friends at Belay it all happens right now, let's get to it. Donald Miller is an author bestselling author speaker. Now, the CEO of story brand a company that is helping tons of businesses clarify their messages, this conversation is as ground level, practical as it gets here. It is my conversation with Donald. This is fun many times. Donald Miller spin our guest. Now, you're in studio. The first time in the studio my right or is the cyclist second. You've been on sodas different. You guys have cleaned it up. Oh, we have looks great. Well, let's good. We probably had Stacy come in and say, Ken, let's go let's tidy up a little bit. But good to have you here. We're gonna talk about several different topics. But one that I'm excited about diving into is its corporate speak. Yeah. I think when I say it everybody conjures up pretty clear image of what this means. But I think you have some very clear and strong opinions on what it really should mean. Let's talk about this idea core value core values, we actually take them serious at Ramsey solutions. You've got them everywhere. Which is what you needed to you to paint on your walls should a core value look like sound like act like well, I want to back up a little bit because core values actually tied to your mission statement. And so let's talk first about the mission statement, I'm not a big believer in the mission statement as it is printed most of the time, which is what gives me, oh, it's a bunch of. You know, we exist to increase the efficiency of the, you know, business, speak, blah, blah, blah. I was in a boardroom recently in architecture firm in downtown Nashville, and we were talking just the C suite. I mean, these are the executives in its Skyros in downtown Nashville. I said, well, you got to you know, if you want to unify your team, you're gonna have to clarify your message. You're gonna have to have some sort of story that people can live into and the CEO said, Don, we spent forty eight hours at a retreat, recently, we came up with our mission statement, we've got it. That's our guiding principle it's painted on the outside of the wall of this conference room. So we've got that covered. And I said, I didn't I wasn't that the retreat. I don't know if they're missing statements. I said your mission statement is not going to work probably kind of a bolt thing to say. But I believe it, and he said, no it is. I mean, everybody in this room. We did forty eight hours coming up with our mission statement. And I was like I don't say anything else don't say anything, and I pointed at the CFO, and I said what's the mission statement? And he didn't know, oh, boy he was at the retreat, of course. And it's painted on the outside wall Watkins, much business speak nobody remembers and then even if they can remember you. Outta your entire team. He stand around the Mississippi. You read it on the side of the wall. Like, nobody remembers it the next day and not only that if they could remember they wouldn't know how to take action on it. And so what we really need in our mission statement of core values. The the first thing is we need very simple language. And here's the other thing that you need instead of stating your mission statement, right? Invite people into a story. And so I turn around I looked at the city of Nashville, you're looking at the skyline, and I said think about something like this, you're architecture from what if your mission statement were the average urban infrastructure causes a low level of anxiety. And most people we exist designed buildings that give people a sense of peace that they wanna walk into and feel comfortable working in. Yeah. I'm just making something up. Right. That's a story. It's a problem that is causing people pain that we as a company fix in order to release them from their pain and have a happy life. So if you actually put that on your wall and. You talk about that. As a team I could probably go to any of your team members. If you've talked to him about maybe four or five times brought it up at every Keno. There's another thing once you get the stuff that you have to repeat it you have to do a propaganda campaign to get people to memorize it's right? But then I actually go to a team member say, hey, why are you guys exists? He would turn on say. Well, you know, most urban skylines. Create a low level of anxiety. And we want to ease that with the kind of buildings that we build good sense of peace, and whatever they're going to around it. But then the other thing that that does want it. It gives me a sense of mission. You know, that's what you want. Right. The mission statement instills a sense of missions, right? When most people's mission statements, instill a sense of confusion. Yes. And so on and so on so we wanted to be extremely memorable one. And we want to invite people into a story and instill a sense of mission or passion into their work life. That's not just good for the bottom line. It's incredibly good for the bottom. It's good for our people's mental health when somebody wakes up Viktor Frankl's work. You know, he's the Vinnie psychologist when some. Many wakes up and has a sense of that they need to get out of bed in order to solve somebody else's problem. It gives them a deep sense of meaning purpose agency in their live, which is associated with mental health. So our mission statement is incredibly important, and it cannot be vague. And it should not include business be let me just give you some practical by not only do we have a mission statement as a company we train the world's greatest business leaders is our mission statement that's pretty easy to understand. We train the world's greatest business leaders. Right. I know what we do. But each department has a mission statement. So we created a department called the hospitality team and hospitality team exists to give gifts to people to make sure that our workshops and conferences are very memorable. We found a guy who's paid three thousand dollars kind of our last works. I've sleeping in his car. And we said on it right hotel room five hundred dollars in cash. We're so glad you're here. That guy's gonna win by the way, if you are your last dollar to grow yourself. I bet on you. But you know, we said we don't. Your money. Right. That's the hospitality team. So we created the hostile team largely out of that story. I, you know, every comes back to be with the mission statement, and it's this business jargon. And I Email her today and said what if it's just the hospitality team exists to help people love and remember their experience with story ran well now instead of create officiency through productivity and Boba anybody who's on the hospitality team knows their job. And I'm talking to a customer, and I know my job is to help them love this experience. And remember it forever. And I will do anything it takes to help them love this experience. And remember it forever. That's why St. language is so important and instills a sense of mission rather than a sense of confusion. It starts with the mission state. Well, let's stay there. I say win until every maybe it's something like this. I hear that. And I hear it's clear it's easy to understand. But it also has a certain amount of lack of boundaries to it. Yeah. It's is that intentional because now she gets the side every team. On that team decides ways. I here's the situation. We're supposed to love and create. You know, what is what is that? Now wondering about budgets, right, and how much these people are going to spend and can you? Well, one thing that you always have to balance is you have to empower your people. I just talked to Lahore Scholtz co-founder of the Ritz-Carlton. He empowered every single person every from the janitor at the Ritz to the whoever's the executive running that particular property every single person can spend two thousand dollars of corporate money on any customer to make them happy. He empowered the entire team. Yes. You can spend your limit is two thousand dollars. Of course, reds has been wildly successful. The most iconic brands in the world, you got to empower your people. So I would know and every and I had this conversation. Look, you know, if overhead creeps up, and you know, what I call the engines on the airplane, the thing that brings in the money shrinks down we have to defunding at this department. You teach people to think that way, and they you can try. Trust them. Well, and to your point here, even though it'd be curious to know, did you talk to Scholtz about how many times or at least a ballpark? How many times it employees actually spent the full two thousand we didn't? But I can't imagine. It was very often. I don't think so it might have been a hundred dollar solution. Yeah. You know, competent night, or whatever sakes. Interesting. All right. So you say that this is a pretty bold statement. We should only have three core values. Yes. That's actually from Qin Blanchard. It's a paper that he wrote. It's a lot of his stuff. But sure geek out on politics Ken wrote a white paper on how to turn around the American government wrote about five years ago, actually, flew out, San Diego guy. We went through the entire white paper. And I asked him questions because he's eighty three. Now, he's alive, and I want this to live forever. That's great. But in that white paper, he talks he repeats some things that he says about organizations he says one people can't remember much more than three or four. So here's a neat thing. I did when we realized we suffered from this problem we had seven or eight core values, you know, they were vague business language, those kinds of things I decided we're gonna string into three. But we're actually a film a little documentary about redoing our mission statement and core values, so when we had our first meeting to talk about this actually had our camera guy communist said, hey, pull people out of the room one at a time and ask them what? Our core value is on camera and one of our team members was able to say one of our core values. That's it. That's how hard it is. So imagine imagine not having a mission statement and not having core values. Right. That would be like me calling. You. Saying, hey, can you want to go on a road trip with me? What's the first question you ask? Or are. We going exactly what your team is doing. You're saying let's go and they're going where. Exactly. Right. And when your mission statement, we exist to be more productive and provide efficient solutions to innovative problems. They're gonna doll chasing his tail. Well, it's like this. It's like Ken. Let's go on a road trip done where to a place where the sun is good and the air is temperate. Yes. And you're going where right, right? That's exactly what we're doing to our teams. And not unlike the whole Viktor Frankl thing if you don't they wake up in the morning, they have a problem, they're solving for other people is akin to mental health is socio mental health. If you ask people to show up every day, and you don't tell them what we're building why it matters where it's going. You are really hurting that person's mental health. They have to sit there for eight hours and work for absolutely no reason, you take somebody. And you say, listen, I'm going to give you eighty five thousand dollars this year say that the most they've ever made thirty five eighty five thousand dollars. Here's where we want. You take this pallet of bricks and Bill. Build a brick wall on that side of the parking lot when you're done, and what you chisel that brick wall down and build it on this side of the parking lot. When you're done wants, you chisel that down and build it back where it used to be you do that for a year, and I'm gonna give you eighty five grand. They'll estimate. Absolutely. It's what they didn't concentration camps. I it's it's. Yeah. Yeah. So we we gotta get our mission statement, that's the negative the positive is when you actually get the mission statement and core values ride you motivate inspire a team you unify team. And you immediately, increase productivity and efficiency. It is the cheapest thing you can do to increase the efficiency and become a lean machine is mission statement and core. Vice that's the importance of the mission statement, so vicious statement is the plot of the story that you were inviting people into where we are going. Why does it matter? What's my role? These are three key questions that you say you got to be for someone to simply understand the answers to those questions within the core values and the Michigan how they work together. That's right. So your mission statement and core values worked together to answer three questions that every employee has. And that is where we going. Why does it matter and what's my role? Right. So mission statement is where we going and probably why it matters. It's going to answer both of those. That's and so after that its core values, which is what? My role, and you know, this is a umbrella version of what's my role. What's my role needs to get down to what am I supposed to do today? But in the core values really are how am I supposed to behave. And so if I hire an actor, if I'm a director of a movie and hire an actor, and I don't give them a script. And I don't tell them. What this character was about? What they're like they're supposed to be. That's a form of torture. Also because we say action, and they don't know what to do. Right. They can't wing it. They need to know what this thing is about. What am I supposed to do? How am I supposed to behave? Those core values are incredibly important. They should be actionable. So we exist a train the world's greatest business leaders. How are we going to do that? There are three core values. One is be the guide and what we mean by be the guide is an everything that you do help the customer win period. Help them win. Find out what their finish line is. And get them. Their help them get their second is B M vicious. So we want to always say, you know, we're here to win. I mean, we're here to win a Super Bowl and third is B. Positive. That's about it. I mean, I could add a fourth and believe me I want to write. There's so many great core values. I want to add they won't remember the fourth member of the problem. I had the beginning of the year. Remember them. I've got it on video. It's hilarious. So they're going to remember be the guide B, M vicious and be positive and they're actually in rank order, so they cancel each other out. They can cancel each other out if I'm trying to help a customer win, right? But that customer, you know, is they paid three thousand dollars beat my workshop they're sleeping in their car. They have well. The Embiid side to be would say, you know, I don't wanna cop their hotel room or give them some cash because that's not going to help us win. But the am Bishen comes second to be the God. So if I say, my main ambition is to help this guy win, my second one is to be am bishops than I have to say, you know, what helping this person win cancels out my emission, I dislocated on and help them win. That's the most important one. And then the third is be positive. And we actually say, you know, there's a sentence behind each of these positive. We say an almost every situation we see the bright side. And I put the word almost in. Because if a tree falls on top of the office. I don't want somebody walk in and go on some night. There are certain reasons. Yeah. So they have to be in rank order, Ken Blanchard. Talks about Disney parks core values and their their first core value is safety. Right. And then they have courtesy. So if I'm being courteous to a customer, and I hear somebody screaming I need to stop being courteous to this customer and go with the primary value of safety. So really your core values are informing how people should live within the workplace. They're incredibly important. You know, I want to touch on something and then we'll move on. But I want to touch on what I think is a reality. And that some people struggling with looking at their business a lot of small business owners, you know, you know, where audience, well, so let's just pick plumber electrician or some type of trade. Okay. Now you and I can sit there and come up with eight reasons why that company matters tremendously. Yes. But I think some small businessmen and women they have a struggle going as the leader as maybe the owner. How does this matter that much nobody really brags on us somebody talks about us? We sell windows or whatever. It is how do they overcome this idea that well it having hard time coming up with? Why what everybody else doing matter so much? Well, let's talk about just a mission statement for a plumber Michika plumber might be we, you know, I don't know we help fix people's pipes or whatever. But I would actually come with something much better than that. I would say we fix people's plumbing and east attention of having a stranger in their home. Yeah. You should I just that actually motivates very different behavior. Yes. Our dishwasher went out two days ago, and we called six different plumbers. None of them could get to it till Monday. My sister is visiting town. We got dishes pun about any. We have ten people coming over for dinner tonight all family, and we need a dishwasher. So my sister who's a miracle worker found somebody sixty five year old man comes into our house, and my wife immediately falls in love with us guys the sweetest nicest guy, he says, look, it's actually he's brutally on. Honest. He says this is a three dollar part that they're charging us about two hundred fifty dollars for and I have to Mark it up. You can actually get a new dishwasher for about two hundred dollars more than what I'm charging. We can have it installed. It's five hundred bucks to fix this. And I just want to be brutally us. It's actually three dollar problem that because this this this is what we have to charge. He's brutally honest. And my wife said, I'll get the checkbook, you know, because I don't want this being a landfill. You're telling me it's going to last another five years, and it would cost me another two hundred dollars to replace it. And we don't have a dishwasher, and he said, well, I just wanted you to know everything that we know. Right. You think we're calling him again -absolutely? I'm an telling every until store you just entree leadership. That's right. And I don't know what their core values are. But my guess is one of them in that culture. Right. Is honest. That's right. They are honest with the customer, they consider them partners and solving their plumbing problems. Yeah. And we'll go again here is we had a similar story. Big giant planner falls off the front of the house. Middle of winter rips off five pieces of siding, my houses exposed can't get anybody out there. Find a contractor guy comes out makes a point to get it all taken care of quickly. Yeah. He's my wife's favorite guy on the planet. Above me. Yeah. Several levels of a little jealous of this guy, sixty five zero zero dishwasher. Exactly, right. Yeah. And so that's the point is if you're trying to figure out all this romantic language. Don't forget what you've taught me. And that's why updates the question. You're meeting need. It's peace of mind. Yes. What that guy did on my siding thing was not fix something ugly? My neighbors know me, they know we're not the clamp. It's they know I'm going to fix it. It was peace of mind about weathering is it going to water going to get in downside 'cause a ten thousand dollar problems. Offing the problem. That is not the problem, you're solving you're solving the emotions that come with the problem that you're solving pretense. That's you understand that. And you instill that into your core values you provide direction you create a team alignment unity. You give people mental health, and you add value to your products, and that value makes your products worth more. It makes people enjoy them. More talk about the more. Here's the great thing about mission statement in core values, it is completely free to create it and to instill. Absolutely. I mean could cost you some pain on side of wall. Maybe a couple T shirts. Hat coffee, mug, whatever and it will direct your entire team. Okay. One more follow up. Yes. One thing we hear from our tribe. Yeah. People that are in this trade business specifically it's hard to find good help. Yeah. If they don't like me, they don't like my the way we do things can go work for somebody else. It's hard to find good people. Yeah. Lemme ask you based on what you just said. Said yes, when you instill these core values and a tradesman looks at himself as not just a plumber or not just a carpenter or whatever it is electricity. But they align with what you're telling them, and they go wait a second. I've never worked for somebody. Who were I now see myself totally different doesn't that lend itself to not just keeping that talent? But attracting other trading because they go this is this is mission for me just to tradesman. Yes. Mark Miller at Chick-fil-A who you know. Oh, yeah. Marks a great guy. Chick-fil-a spent every year they identify their number one problem, and they create a piece of curriculum around that problem there number one problem, you know, this last year was attracting and retaining top talent. So they spent millions. They went to string finders. They end on research Gallup has not done research. Nobody had done research. Nobody had ever done research on how to track top town. They spent millions of dollars trying to figure out how to do it. And they came up with three things to. Talent look for a better boss a brighter future and a bigger vision. A better boss a brighter future and a bigger vision while so where does your mission statement to things a brighter future? That's a bigger vision. I can't help you with your better boss, you, that's you and me we just have to be better people's, right? And we're part of their talent magnet. Right. So right now Storebrand is blowing up, and I'm discovering that yes, I have to pay people. I have to pay them pretty good salary. And we wanna keep that going and those are all percentages. You're trying to figure that stuff out. But when I heard Mark say that which was weeks ago months ago. Really, I said, okay. Well, I can definitely offer them a better boss of bigger vision and a brighter future. And so I sit down with our mission statement and say, look and forty eight months. Our mission statement is going to be, you know, something akin to the American workforce is not being developed that's unfair. And we're going to give everybody a cost effective way to develop their people. We will develop the entire American. Workforce. When I say that too right now, I'm recruiting a guy who's a major player in an NFL team. I want them on my team is not a player. I'm sorry. Physical player. He's a part of the part of the organization, I'm recruiting him. He flies into town next week. I don't think without that mission statement, and that understanding of we're doing something. Yes. To change the world. That's right. I don't think he's even returning my phone calls. Yeah. Another guy from a prominent family is a CEO of a big organization debating leaving his state because he could easily run for governor. He's now very interested in coming on staff at story. Brent why because we have this sense of mission. Yes. And so it's it's not only unifying your team and giving people mental health your mission statement if it's done, right? If you write some lousy, we exist to create productive innovative artisans solutions to you're not gonna attract anybody. I don't know what that means. But give me a mission. We're gonna go over that hill. That's right. We're gonna take those guys down because they've been tear. Arising this village thrown and I need your help. And they'll come one of our development guys took a fifty thousand dollar pay cut to leave his company and come to our company, you know, developing guys a really expensive. And spells these the best in town. He came I didn't fully realize that I got two calls saying I offered him a hundred thousand dollars more than he was making. You offered him fifty thousand dollars less than what he's was making any went with you. I got that call twice and why mission stay mission. Yeah. Absolutely. He didn't even more money. No. We're going to pay him. We're going to have to pay them to keep them. Yeah. But he might. Hill end up making more you anyway, where you probably smells that to seeing here. Here's what he's saying. I mean, I'll say this you won't say it, I'll say it in this situation. He doesn't need the money, but he's willing to take that cut which is seemingly nuts to most people people. But he believes in the vision and the mission so much. I think he probably believes if this thing always. Opportunities. Didn't do anything for his heart. Somebody guys really pin me down and said tell me how you did it. And I'm like I bought him a burger. I mean, I don't know how I did it. What do you look for some trick? I didn't like Jesus sleazy. The only answer. I had was I guess talked to his heart. And the guy literally was like the point. I didn't think about that. I'm not at all human being. Yeah, he wants to go where you're going. Yeah. Yeah. That's not only just you want to go there. He's gotta take us there. Yes. He gets to lead. Yes. Hinson and get I tell people this on my show, you do that the money will take care now. It's fine. You gotta do what you love that moves your heart. Full enjoy that conversation, again story brand all things Donald Miller. Great way to go is just go to story. Brand check them out online are entre leadership team, by the way is come up with a great great resource that fits into the conversation. We just had how create core values, obviously, Donald Miller gave us a great framework tremendous context for using this resource from entree leadership. Specifically there's five steps for developing and communicating your company's guiding principles. So you're gonna learn how to develop the right core values for your team and implement them. If you want to get it text create core values now, that's all one phrase. No spaces create core values texts that two three three four four four. That's three three four four four or click on the link in the show notes. Well, it does it get any better than a real life. Testimonial. Insulin thing to talk about principles and some of the practical tips, we give you every program. But. But Dave and carry way as I said at the top of the program they had to deal with this and deal with in a situation a huge vacuum. If you will were as father, who's the heart and soul, the founder of the company he passes away. What do you do next specifically around this conversation? Here are David Carey. We were brand new business owners his father had passed away. And so the team members the whole atmosphere was like they're a little bit afraid, right? The godfather has passed away and what happens now so and we were a fearful we had never done this before. And now our whole where his dad was our net before and he had done a great job of stepping back from the driver's seat letting us strive and being there as just the safety nets. We always had him to go to an end ask would we do? Now. What do you think about this decision is this right? And he would smile and nod and reassure us, and and it was wonderful. He was phenomenal was a phenomenal mentor and coach, and he he was gone. We came back. We tried to assess what really is our culture. Yes, we had a culture at that time. But we needed to defy. Fine. It a little more kind of like put flesh on the bones and figure out who are we an at led us to creating a mission statement and coming up with what our core values are our core values, we're not aspirational at all. They really defined who we were already that was already in our DNA, and we needed our team to know. So that coming into our culture, the core values that we initially came up with was four, and then we added three more and the teams reception of those they agreed and not that we were looking for agreement, but they came to us independently and said, these are things that we totally agree with this. Because that's who we are ready. Are that to you guys are ready are that's who we want to be. That's the train. That's the bus that we want to be on. And that's something that we can believe in an live because we've already seen it. Practiced right. The biggest thing I noticed when everyone understood agreed with an adapted to the core values that we had I didn't really see the impact right away outside of our organization. But what I saw inside our organization was that it gave kind of a new heightened sense of purpose and a wind in the sails like we can do this. We can do this. Where before it was kind of like, I don't know if we can do that. That's a big stretch. Now, it was like, yeah, we can do this. And so at this time we were negotiating with a giant customer to try to win some business from them. And they were demanding that we jumped through all of these hoops and goal would be changed every week. And it was just it was laborious and painful and mostly and messy, but our team they really rose to the occasion. And here we are this little tiny David of a corporation. Shen against in a sense. This giant multi billion dollar company, Goliath. They were Goliath and our team was meeting them toe to toe, and they were killing it. Our team was killing it. So they were coming this. Big corporation was coming to the table. Unprepared. Disorganized dish. Shoveled beaten down pressure from their top, you know, two and the art team was coming to the table refreshed invigorated encourage it's like bring it we've got this. We know our product we know who we are. We know what we can deliver. And it was it was phenomenal. Say a special thanks to Dave and carry for sharing their story. We love when we can get some, you know, main street stories of people that have actually had to deal with some of these challenges that you're dealing with. And they came through them on the other side. So great stuff, Dave and carry appreciate you so much. Well, we love our friends at Belay, and what they bring to you our audience specifically nine questions to ask when interviewing a virtual assistant. Now, let's just take the entire conversation. We've had this program. Now, a lot of people want to have a mission statement a lot of people would like to have core values. But the reality is if you're frayed to admit, it don't be lot of you just feel like I don't have time to get to that. I'm too busy being the chief everything officer as my grandad used to say, you're busier than a one arm wallpaper hanger. I mean, it's just crazy. So how can you help with all the load? How about a virtual assistant our friends at Belay are going to help you assess where you're at nine questions to ask when interviewing? Virtual assistant to make sure that you know that you've got the right one. So in this resource blaze compiled, a list of nine questions to ask a candidate to help you get a jump start on your prep work. So the interview does what is supposed to do. And that's get you the right person to help you. So that you could do more of what you need to be doing basically only what you should be doing as the leader. So click on the link in our show notes to get this free resource the Belay resource get it right now by clicking on the link in this episode's show notes. We'll that's going to do it on behalf of the entire entree leadership team. Thank you so much for listening. We'll talk with you again, very soon. Hey, folks, I wanna make you aware that we have other great podcasts from Ramsey solutions. Here's a sample of the Ken Coleman show. According to a recent Gallup poll, nearly seventy percent of Americans are disengaged at work. If you dread going into work every Monday morning, and you're just trying to make it to the weekend. The Ken Coleman show is for you. Everyone has a sweet spot. Your sweet spot is at the intersection of your greatest talent. In greatest passion. We will help you. Discover what it is. You were born to do. And then we'll help you create a plan to make your dream job. A reality you matter, and you have what it takes. Join the conversation on the Ken Coleman show to hear full episodes. Just search Ken Coleman in items or go to Ken Coleman, show dot com.

Donald Miller Ken Coleman Dave Ken Nashville CEO Viktor Frankl Ramsey solutions executive David Carey virtual assistant Andre CFO Watkins Mississippi Stacy Ken Blanchard reds Goliath
Dr. Rachel Levine Is First Openly Trans Federal Official Confirmed by U.S. Senate

TIME's Top Stories

03:46 min | 3 weeks ago

Dr. Rachel Levine Is First Openly Trans Federal Official Confirmed by U.S. Senate

"Brought to you by a new memoir from jeff. Immelt the former. Ceo of general electric. Raw honest intimate. Hotseat is that. And more as emily recounts what. It's like to be a leader in times of crisis by your copy of hot seat today. Wherever books are sold. Dr rachel levine is the first openly trans federal official confirmed by the us senate by david carey voting mostly along party lines. The us senate on wednesday confirmed former pennsylvania health secretary. Rachel levine to be the nation's assistant secretary for health. She is the first openly transgender federal officials to win senate confirmation. The final vote was fifty. Two to forty eight levine. Had been serving as pennsylvania's top health officials since twenty seventeen and emerged as the public face of the state's response to the coronavirus pandemic. She is expected to oversee health and human services offices and programs across the us president. Joe biden cited levine's experience when he nominated her in january levin will bring the steady leadership and essential expertise. We need to get people through this pandemic no matter their zip code race religion sexual orientation gender identity or disability biden said transgender rights. Activists have hailed levine's appointment as a historic breakthrough. Few trans people have ever held high level offices at the federal or state level however the confirmation vote came at a challenging moment for the transgender rights movement as legislatures across the us primarily those under republican control are considering an unprecedented wave of bills targeting. Trans young people one type of bill introduced in at least twenty. Five states seeks to ban trans girls and young women from participating in female scholastic sports another introduced in at least seventeen states seeks to outlaw or restrict certain types of medical care for transgender youths. None of these measures has yet one final approval senator rand. Paul confronted levine about medical treatments for transgender young people including hormone treatment and puberty blockers during her confirmation hearing february twenty fifth levin replied that transgender medicine is a very complex and nuanced field with robust research and standards of care and said she would welcome discussing the issues with him in the past levin has asserted that hormone therapy and puberty blocking drugs can be valuable medical tools and sparing some transgender youth from mental distress and possible. Suicide risk a pediatrician and former pennsylvania physician general. The wien was appointed as pennsylvania's health secretary by democratic governor. Tom wolf and twenty seventeen. She won confirmation by the republican majority pennsylvania senate however senator pat toomey a pennsylvania. Republican voted against levine's confirmation wednesday and pennsylvania the pandemic struck seniors nursing homes disproportionately hard compared to other states. Timmy said this was due in part to poor decisions and oversight by doctor levin and the wolf administration he also said an extended. Lockdown advocated by. Levine was excessive arbitrary in nature and has led to a slower recovery a graduate of harvard and of tulane medical school levinas president of the association of state and territorial health officials. She's written in the past on the crisis medical marijuana adolescent medicine eating disorders and t q medicine.

levine pennsylvania Dr rachel levine david carey Rachel levine levin Immelt general electric emily Joe biden senate jeff biden us Tom wolf senator pat toomey wien Paul wolf administration Timmy
Sauce's Swimming Challenge - The Power Trip After Party

The Power Trip After Party

35:17 min | Last month

Sauce's Swimming Challenge - The Power Trip After Party

"The power trip after party presented by bud light seltzer. Like never unsound sound for good. I have my said something. Nobody got fired. Welcome ma the after party park cattle. Whoops it's eight fifty nine. It's the eighth day of march. It's twenty twenty one. Well let me ask you a question now. My tattoo guy as was gonna finish tattooed today on the leg of dolly parton can receive. Now i want you to see what it's done because right now you'd be like maybe anybody. How much of her is done. Like the whole outline of it but you gotta you know colored and stuff like that and it hurt like hell by the way like maybe the second most pain i've ever had for tattoo and i don't know why regardless so. He sent me a text at six thirty tomorrow and said were good for tomorrow at noon. Right now my point is today at noon now. He might have just been going to bed so his tomorrow might be today. You know what i mean. yeah. I'm trying to decide and i sent him a text but if he's asleep he's asleep he's not gonna let me know. So do i go there for my normally scheduled tattoo and noon yet because do have like a paper trail that it's today. Niger have texting. Yeah then yeah. I would go today. It has to be today right but yeah because he said tomorrow and it was at six thirty a. Him but he could have just been getting home from work then because he works all night. Long where is it spring park known on the way home. Oh my tattoo on my left shin shin. Yeah he's doing these The series of tattoos were they are What do you call it. More straight portrait. Only there this big. They're literally like four inches by four inches incredibly detailed and that's kind of his sauces penis. That's incredibly. She said no q four inches. Four jets cubed mostly. I would deal with that if i had to sure. Sure by four. I can see that being awesome for trade. Put a square a square peg in a round hole. Exactly jesus it's not. Have you ever seen one a square peg or around all and there was a great show square pegs if you are if you are sending text at six thirty in the morning saying i'll see you tomorrow. I don't think you say that about something. That's five and a half hours out man. Tuesday i think it might be but it's just checked to make sure it's supposed to because it's not it's not like he's shit fish oil spill. A moral right knows that five and a half hours now is still monday. So my guess is it's tuesday. Yeah which be cool because you know. I thought i'd be dead by today. Of course one hundred percent gentleman be asleep. Boy what a beautiful day out there. The you gotta ride the hog. I haven't got. I got to get out of storage. So is if. I don't have to get it out of storage. Is it safe now. There's too much salt and sand out there. It's not very safe but you know just to write it up to the you know the market or whatever. What are you. Run takers the market. There's a lot of people yesterday and they don't care right because of the rocks shit on the road but it's just how it is. It's just how it is all right so you guys. Ibm you guys ever listened to the vets and quotes podcast. No have no okay. Support it financially. Good for your buddy those guys so I listen every now and again just to kind of catch up to see what's hidden what's land with stick enforcing you know because i like those guys. I'd like to listen to make me laugh. And they did a deep dive and this latest issue bets did on old bets that never came to fruition. I show you tweeting about the so. Hey we can definitely dive into this now no pun intended but we got gotta bring this up tomorrow because i forgot to bring this up today. Yeah brings up on the actual show. Check this out do you know how did you hear what i'm talking about. Why they played audio. Ben and this audio is so old that you were still working at the pizza place and coming here to work with us right by working at the pizza place. We don't mean you were just. They're working hard to eat as much pizzas possible. You actually were employed there. Yeah right so the best. I can figure might have been two thousand twelve. May two thousand thirteen mehta and we had this this argument on the air. Because you said you could swim at the lifetime pool down and back five times without stopping or without touching the floor and we fifty bucks and you swore that there was no doubt i was like no chance in hell that you can do that. Now keep in mind. Yeah i just lost like seventy five pound right right You were adamant like you were chance. Unbelievable i i know. I couldn't do it and i couldn't have done. We're not talking like he's not setting records with speed jesse. But that's the difference. Doggy paddle the differences. You can't stop. Is i think that's easier than you think if there's no time limit if you can really truly take your time or even float on your back for a little bit and backstroke at to take a break. I think he could do it if we give them. A specific kind of not even not a world record pace but if we gave them a time limit like dude. You got to do this under the freestyle. Good point right you have. You can't show stroke exactly or even just well that's fair but yeah but no line on your back backstroke in at the brand. I don't think i could. Currently i'm to deb fat. I don't think i could. I really don't think i could. I mean i'll try you willing to pay any lifetime but the one over there. Yeah of course okay. it's so it's not something like adamant that you know. But i used well but i was probably the lightest ever been back then sir now. I'm a fucking human thumb. Yeah i i don't know if you gave me. It gave me a month without swimming in. I could lose some weight and getting a little bit of shape. I bet i could do it. Yeah you could do it now. You don't think so. No no and i remember because the reason the bit came up. I'm pretty sure. Because at the time i was trading for an indoor triathlon. The time was doing so. I was working with a swimming coach every year. And i knew that i couldn't do without stopping. Here's here's why though if you gave me a month and could i get not like sweat. I wouldn't get in the pool. But i could get a strategy for my. I mean my brother does it. My brother could swim one hundred laps. I bet right but Yeah if you gave me a month. I could do it. Yeah if you give me a month. I'll do it for bucks fifty bucks and i'll take on any anyone else who thinks i can't work for fifty bucks limit rewind here you said. Let me lose weight. I then like wouldn't. She used the pool training to lose weight. No i'd probably ride the peleton. Because i don't think i have bill but you wouldn't jump in the water until the day of the wouldn't that wouldn't that now. I don't mind you train and now you want okay. Yeah yeah okay. Yeah you can train with greg. Louganis don't gayness was a diver head. Yeah one of my favorite olympic said. Yeah shirt today and time as far as how long he has to do or like certain certain stroke justice the distance for a lab. How far is fifty meters fifty meters fifty down in back as one hundred a five hundred meter so wait a minute down in back five times or so down. Cattleman counts as one back down back. Sorry now i'm starting. That's double the distance. And i thought saw said to swim there. Yeah yeah i could do it. Yeah one month from today. Today is the one of freestyle the whole way. Yeah no snow no stopping chirping on your back. Yeah right yeah all right so you can do it on the podcast. You said you would be willing to drown rather than lose. Fifty dollars was probably depressed from a decision. I'd made your but yeah yeah i can do it. Yeah yeah give me one month. Let me see if i can help Let me point out the fact that you're going to do much better than this sauce. But i want to make fun of myself at this particular moment Years ago. I was still playing still playing by the way so painful. Peak physical condition. Yeah pretty much. Better condition way more peak than i am now. I made it three quarters of a lab not down back. Just just downs down. Yeah my back cramped up. Because i went balls to the wall shirt like you like. Oh this is gonna be easy. I go man fucking. I made it three. Core is the way down stopped because both my lattes cramped up hoof panicked. Ono added doggy paddled. Okay yeah held onto the edge from not. I'm not like five minutes from my heart rate to come back down to make it back down across to the shallow because that's will freak me out. It was like i was going from the shallow into the deep end goggles. On 'em watching myself get deeper in a feeling myself fail. Oh my gosh. Yeah yeah badness. there's no So then there was that was. That was the embarrassing partner. So then i had to move. So then i get out of the big pool and go to the pool. Oh god to where. When i was swimming everyone of my strokes and my the tips of my fingers touching the bottom. That's how shallow water. And that's the only place i felt safe. So good luck to you. Oh you scared the hell out of yourself all right. We're gonna call because apparently does get away on this much. The limit here. I'm so not stop as long as you don't stop your good shed water. Oh yeah he could do that because be trains. I want you gonna try. Where are you. Where are you going to train. No idea. i'll i'll double it. He said it's fifty bucks. Yeah i'll throw put one hundred you can't i'll throw fifty and one hundred bucks against it. Are you willing to do that. I'll do. I got smell willing to bet with ben as well. Let me talk to my brother as a long way. Come on phone worked for me. Baby we gotta talk dive. Mrs. he's unemployed so he's got plenty of spare time. I don't think you realize how long it is until you get in the water. That's what brands said. Call cannot die one more time. How do you dial it. Colin dav now. Is this that sexy. Bitch dav lambert. This would be da da. I don't even know if he told you we were calling you dino. Why we've called you not really no data with your brother paul. He needs your help to maintain we have made a bet that is actually that we made in two thousand thirteen and power trip. Oh yeah exactly and we never followed the long pay. Payoff it is it is fifty bucks can sauce swim down and back end at an official sized pool down and back five times without stopping so ten lengths of the pool at at a fifty meter length at any pace any pace. But he's got a he cannot stop even once and can't flip onto his back and take a break. He asked her freestyle the hallway without stopping. I mean yeah. I would think he could if it's at any pace that's just like i. It would be similar to send like. Can you walk my. Oh yeah i can walk. A mile of it can take me twenty five minutes. I could do it but this is no doggy. paddling either. Essentially be more xylitol and moving in swimming freestyle without you. Don't need to explain. Swimming could not the of walking. That's not the same thing. Actively swimming is not like all right. Now you're going to tread water for a little bit. You're gonna doggy paddled for a little bit or backstroke. This is full on freestyle swimming. Ten consecutive laps. Plus your brother. Even your brother can't drown while walking. Which is what is so. Ten laps is what two hundred fifty meters. Yeah i got a second here. He's twenty five meters things. It's fifty. well yeah one. One length is twenty five or so yes fifty would be a lap. Yeah okay so again. now we're back to a hassle. Yeah five hundred. Five hundred meters fifty. Still the take today. You would say the you would say the not. So you're saying one one blanks so swimming one way. Twenty five meters so back and forth. Yes is fifty fifty or if he's doing five laps. Yeah it's two hundred fifty. When i'm seeing different olympic size pool believer back me up on. This length is fifty meters. Yeah so just one point. Maybe that means down in back. That's not really showing when somebody listens to this podcast. If you work for lifetime we need to find what the length of a standard lifetime. Fitness pool is end to end. It's twenty five white wide wide if you were if it is five hundred. Is that change your mind at all. I still think he can do it. All right they go. You got you got faith in your. I'm shocked what would be your strategy. Westland swam at all. Oh god a longtime i. Can't i mean honestly ten years twenty years probably ten. He's he's got a month. He's going to do a one month from today. Oh he's got a month to yeah. I think so all right if he can take as much time as he wants. Yes i i. It's going to be difficult swimming. You know ten laps or five laps or whatever the hell we agreed upon super kimbler easy but but faith. How many could you do. How many laps can i do. Yeah i guess one of my training sections. I did an hour. That was thirty six hundred meters table my half sunday more than two hundred and fifty. Ding-dong this about two hundred and sixty milliliters. I don't know what your liquid get. Hell did well okay. What will you teach me how to swim. Sure where are we going to go swim today. You can join me today. Can you teach me how to dougie. Where are you going to swim. Lifetime limit. I'll go there. My house was stopped by correct. They would be a tournament on yesterday. main events. Yeah i was the previous sunday if it was last night. I don't know i didn't watch it. I was I went to canterbury yesterday. That's the first time i've played poker in a long time. I've been watching too much. Wtt and lingo martensson is way too hot. I know we talked about her this morning. That hawk was really out of out her when she was in studio a handful of months ago. At attractive lady yeah. She's a ten and a half. Did you win money or are you going back to roulette. No i i was there for a long time. I only like eighty bucks all in all it was worth the the entertainment value. i guess. How's your band danny. Games morning fire lit as the kids would say. Would it help if sauce wore some kind of bandanna or maybe some kind of skullcap when he swam lab. Well yeah you got. You have to wear a skullcap but you don't want to have anything that increases drag. That's not right. But i don't have any hair or balls shave your head not gross. No i'm not doing that. Shave your balls shave. Your manscaping dynamics scaping sack. Is this swimming. Sooner it's in public depends on. Who gets loans. Changes his pouch shaping peanut pouch for fifty bucks if i ground. I think you should do it for free. Offer you double that. Don't dobbs you hear that zach shit pants it in the morning show. I gotta tax. I didn't hear us act. Not wanna know that texted you so no text me. Why is wandering the hallways the target back on the shit. All right well dob. You're you're an american treasure. And i love you got neither now appreciate it to all. I'm going swimming. Today i'm out. That's what i'm hoping for that right there. Right trained to. But i'm busy before we get the final beth and everybody placed their bets. You have to get a handle on exactly how far this distances. What down in back. Five times means it'll add lifetime park. No which lifetime would you rather do it. Anyone but then you gotta pick one. We're going to look it up online. Exactly which one. You're talking about fifty meters one way but not every lifetime is olympic. Spends on plymouth. Yeah fine find out what the plymouth pool is. Yes are you a member. Know what the fuck all right. Well i'll have to get that finagled. I'll get that done a figured out. Yeah i'll ever lifetime power trip feats of strength should be something you guys do once a month. Yeah can you imagine right during festivus embarrassment sweat. We need this on lake tonka and you swim five hundred meters straight out into the lake to a boat. No yeah wearing a white vest so of my own. I went to lifetime not long two weeks ago. Something like that. And i decided i was going to go ahead and bench press because it's been a while and I had to put the twenty-five on us so fucking embarrassment. Like jesus christ man back in the day. Nothing but plates right shit. But i just took the bar and i did just to stretch out and i'm like it ain't going to be much more than that. Was the first saturday played like we're back in high school when you were like football. Football football man million years ago. Who was the best bench pressing was. I was so good at it. Because i have such small. I've such little arm. Same thing for me was squats. I'm short so i could just power through our three. Had the school record for awhile to puck and courtesy. Innisbrook it. But i can squat with the rest of them best of him. You know what. I'm starting to doubt you of because i was leaning towards that you could do about fifteen minutes ago but I would argue that when i was younger. The thing i was best at when it came to athlete with swimming. Because i grew up on a lake. I could see that. I was super fast at swimming and i was never on the swim team but it was a super fast swimmer and i could swim all day. Not tired man. When i get into the pool now with my kids just swim in half a lap. And i can start to feel it my lungs. Swimming endurance is a different kind of yes county bathroom. It's the best work. It's because it's because it's lo- Low impact but my point is is. I'm not a swimmer. Like i was twenty years ago. I think i would struggle to do ten down and backs without taking a line. My back Break tread water break. I think that's going to be tougher than you think. You can do. It kind of depending on his heart. Exploding saw points for real. Because it's you're gonna be huffing and fucking puffing man you're puffing him water like you're talking about he start to panic a little bit and you're like fuck this fifty bucks nothing to me. You just call lifetime which plymouth one all right so you got. He called me two point. Eight six meters or twenty five yards. That's nothing twenty five yards so he would so down and back. He's he's swimming. Two hundred and fifty yards. That's two and a half football fields. Yeah without stopping. I still don't think he can do it. I don't either. I'm with you. I think your heart will explode. That'd be that's that's a great. That's a good point just in your heart explodes. We should put the money in escrow fund. In case you'd ass away because otherwise it's gonna it's just gonna feel fucking thirty like shaking down. Thirteen feel bad about shaking down the cash and say hey a sorry for your loss and this is super awkward because this is at the funeral but yeah i'm gonna need you to drive this tesla home one. The one thing. I'll give you give you some advice. And i now it sounds so stupid so simple but trust me when you get in the water. You're gonna think you think you're not going to think about because it's it. It should be automatic. You have to rhythmically breath yet. No that is you think that you can hold your breath longer per like stroke before you turn your head to the side knocking. Alas for fucking two hundred fifty yards. Yeah ause let me give you a little to the last time. I was in the water which was like a year two years ago. I couldn't believe how my brain forgot didn't like turn all the time on like on time to get your breath and then once you once you miss a breath you're fucked sauce. Check this out. This is true to think about this. That's true david carey and tried to hold his breath when he was stroking he died. Yeah why don't wanna michael. Hutchence held his breath when he was broken and he died. Yeah can't hold your breath dude. That won't must have a spotter. I'll be by go in. Yeah yeah. I'll save you will you. Yeah of course. But i'll be laughing. I'll pray drown hardware. What's what's your level now with two hundred and fifty yards six six to seven. I think i can witnesses it on. A scale of ten yeah. I'm confident we'll go. What's the total ledger here. That's what that's what we gotta figure out right now before we wrap this up. 'cause you're worried about even he's gonna die. I'm not going to. i'm not that fucking on. Its shape that's what she means Okay i'll say it for you to know. Can i read the text. I just got. I don't know if this was supposed to be private or not but Three minutes ago. Donald lambert just texted me and i read. I take back everything i said. I realized that swimming takes effort. Which paul is totally lacking hits a lightbulb moment that he realized that this is gonna take effort recounting. What a deck all right. So i got fifty bucks fifty bucks anybody else's money. Yeah who i'll take. No no oh come on one person. Does anybody else want to take his side. And then you can bet with them on the other side i in the last fifteen minutes. I flipped from. I think he can do that. I realized how far it is. I just don't think he can do it. Can we can take action. Yeah right. i'll take anyone's way. I would bet all of the money if he could do the things that we talked about it. If you could tread water take a break or doggy. Paddle oregon. I think the easiest safety net is to lie in your back in backstroke and take a break. Then i think you could go the ten laps without touching the bottom. So i i have to do this you to be faced all american style. Roll and turn and go. You can't hang onto it for a second push off of dolphin kick as far but if you're in the middle of the landlord you can't go vertical and stop and catch your breath. You have to keep swimming. That's that's i think. So here's a size that i have for you. Corey who or zach or brienne if we're on agreements that he's not gonna do it. You wanna side on which lap gives up all great. That's a good bit something. This is something we could. Do you know week or two long. I'll be up until the point swim. Hang it other people we can get the whole power trip crew involved in this will broadcast this right. I mean hell. Yeah why not right. It's it's i think it's within one hundred yards. So it's it's between laps two and four where he would say i i am you wanna you want to hold onto this and think about it because all aside bed would want to think about it. But that's my rain right now. Is it somewhere between before. One hundred yards taps out right. How long do you think it'll take six years. How long would it normally take someone Average time like a normal non professional swindler. Roughly a ten or so minutes No chance you can tattered or do it in five to six some you know yeah more cardio enthuse people can do it in seventy eight. Yeah if this is ten minutes straight. If you have any idea the lung capacity during but i can ride the peleton at a high rate of speed or forty. That's what i'm saying is this is not the same. This is a different kind of law. I like this is an accidental. Half a gulp of air in your lungs. You're if we're over we're ten minutes is inaccurate time. Guess it's that. I'm willing to bet almost any amount of money that you want that you can't do it all right and i flipped from sauce can do it to name your price and fifteen minutes. I like it. I'm so glad they brought it back. Because i completely forgot we had at the day. We did it so all right. We'll revisit it as we closer. You're going to start training. Yeah maybe a little bit percents. This is the thing percent chance he gets into a pool before he gets into a pool. Who i think he will the week of. Because you're gonna do the pelleting get cool. You're going to lose some weight and try to get in better shape next four weeks and that will help but i wonder if you actually swim before you actually swim. If you were still single. I would say pretty close to zero that you're gonna get in the pool before him but your your jenny myskina say yeah your ass in the pool. Yeah good point. Yeah here is. I'm just thinking out loud. This is the most likely scenario over the next four weeks about a week and a half from now. Sauce comes into the morning show at five thirty five in the morning and he says yeah i got in the pool i lasted half a lap. I'm out there's no point in doing it. Because i couldn't make it a whole lap. Let alone tens in. That's not going to change in the next two and a half weeks. So i'm out. My alarm will go off on thursday morning. I'll check my email on the shitter. Vin mowed my fucking exactly. Eddie one hundred. I'm like finally sauce came out. What is what's what's your best athletic attribute or skill set. I'm actually pretty good at swimming. You're good swimmer. I was always doing that as a kid. Just like yeah. Did you play any organized. Sports no i was on the dance team. How yeah that's that is the stay in from you know all the team members competitive dance. Yeah what was that. Like the chicago for real. That was always the thing and We can god damn line dancing chicago so but now i'm not a fan okay. So you can be a good analysis you know what. What's the word damn analyst. Jesus that's what i heard online for this This whole telecast. We're going to do of sauces swimming challenger. I'll take that challenge. Where the broadcast i gotta learn how to do play by play play by play at the bowling league. Apparently i can't wait. I wanna probably right now. Man movie is it That will ferrell starts sinking to the bottom of the pool. An and that's like when sound of silence starts coming on. Yes right yeah. That's we might need an underwater. Kim just in case starts floating the already. We're good we'll have it as much it's going to be a snuff film. What a fight. Yeah i think i should be. I think i'll be able to do it. I really do all your on. All you guys don't think i can so Yeah i can do it. I hope you can for your sake. I but besides him. Being ben i doubt any rest of you couldn't do i know for a fucking fact i could you make. It seem like that. I couldn't do it no way again. Forty years over twenty years ago. I would have bet my bank account that i could do it now. I don't think i could do. And that's factoring in if i don't think i have to think i'm a better swimmer than you and i don't think i could do it. Yeah i mean. I think you without draining. What year were you born. Eighty two okay. Nineteen eighty two dash. Two hundred twenty one. Do you have a particular song casey. Give yeah the distance spy right. She's this will be extremely ironic. If the song that distance is was overwhelmingly on there goes on swimming the distance turning now anyway. Good for you paul. Yeah we're all rooting for you. Know you're none of you are live by. I won't die. If he dies he dies right. That's damn right about how about just as a As like a an olive branch to saas we get just a smoke. Show female to be lifeguard. That just in case you struggle. Some just ten died just show. Smart cowboys were speedo that overman. Or whoever who's in the sandlot kid with the wendy pedic on. Have wendy engage. Give me mouth to mouth talk. I only do it down below to do it. That's how i was taught swimming. Instructors do intend to twenty nine like is like this tire inflation stem arafah tire. Get along and get to put your mouth on that to blow it up. Didn't work ever. I don't know. I blew up one part of him. It was the weirdest thing. No yup and then a deflated. All right. that's gross. I'm getting closer to betting that he taps out before we do it. That's the thing. And if i want to side bet like you have to if you if you tap out before it goes like in more than fifty bucks. You have to do a swim. Sued fucking shoot for something like that founder. A whole calendar h. o. l. e. fraction a fraction fraction man. You killed it on that dude. Seven seven can't get feel for that. I keep the record did corey rosie get eight because everybody gets different question but still. Yeah but it was good. Yeah yeah that that. That's a couple of did not think you'd get guest. You would get four in. The great lakes was one of the four. That i thought you would get so you got seven and you didn't get one that i thought you would absolutely get so. I'm using down when you're in that eight nine range a big dipper thing right so i just it one two three four and then i just assumed it's one two three. You gotta well done record. We think it's i thought it was eight eight. Yeah i got it. Yeah rosy niner tied. I don't know if rosie got ready. You still hasn't paid us. Yeah no nobody many money. Today and again i continue. I probably will get twenty texts and tweets and emails from people today saying why not give the money to the guy who if he if. Nobody guesses the right. I get that all the time. I don't know i don't think that's anyway. I would just volunteered in every week or here. Here's the fatal flaw. Because again you got to play devil's advocate and try to figure this out. Throw me in the box. And you give me ten questions and i know that if none of you get it right i get the money. Why wouldn't i just get zero. Take the money never or or maybe get one right and then tank case. Somebody thinks i'm going to more communities changes the game and you also don't want to say if somebody gets all ten that they win the money because then then it's completely on youtube that aren't capable of running the table right. Try to come up with absolutely so far. I think the games perfect. I don't i i think it's super fair for both parties. The person that's in the box doesn't know who they're winning or losing four. Today you had no white. We told you it was a sweat but you didn't know who had a chance of winning or money. You thought i would get to write but you play it straight up because you don't know who you're helping or hurting. Yeah and the rest of us way more fun now. Yeah i just i. I don't think that this needs to be altered at all yet. And i'll tell you what if there were running odds during the game i would have bet a million dollars that you were going to win. Because i didn't think he'd get seven. I didn't think ten right. You know what. I thought that was going to be. If we were going to that last question. I would have absolutely taken that site but we didn't school at the last four goddamn killed it. Thank you killed all right. That'll do it. Thank you mick michelob. Ultra organic no shelter. No right thank. You might seltzer. Lemonade seltzer seltzer lemonade. Drink up shriners. Yeah peace out.

swimming bud light seltzer Louganis Colin dav Bitch dav lambert freestyle swimming lingo martensson dolly parton
Special Edition: The Mueller Report and the Barr Letter

The Lawfare Podcast

56:24 min | 2 years ago

Special Edition: The Mueller Report and the Barr Letter

"I'm Benjamin witness, and this is the law fair podcasts special edition emergency addition, March twenty fifth two thousand nineteen you know, why we're here today. People started on Friday when Bob Muller declared himself finished and delivered his final report to attorney general Bill bar Bill bar on Sunday delivered himself of a four page summary of that report a summary as to its quote principal findings on quote. Excuse me. That summary raises a lot of questions it also answers a lot of questions, or at least some and it has provoked cries of vindication from the president and his defenders a lot of head scratching. So we are here to evaluate it. All I'm here in the new jungle studio with Susan Hennessy and carry Cordeiro and on the line from a remote location is David Chris everybody, welcome back. So carry get us started. How do you read what Bill Barr did and did not do? So I I think it's useful to stay from the outset that we have not yet seen the special counsel's report. And what the attorney general released on Sunday afternoon was a very brief summary of very high level conclusions. And it was only on two parts of the investigation significant parts. But if we look at the based on what we know of the special counsels work over two years, which included many different aspects of an investigation and prosecutions of multiple entities and people what the attorney general put in his letter only pertained to two of those and those two are the issues that would have most directly affected the president the issue of collusion. Or as the attorney general is excuse me, as the special counsels theory of it was conspiracy that was the legal theory and obstruction, and I think on the my initial take is that on the. Collusion or conspiracy piece? I always thought that it would be a high bar to reach to be able to establish that Americans were part of knowing participants in and reach a criminal prosecution. Standard that they were participants in the Russian intelligence activity. I think to retake prosecutive standard is a would have been required substantial evidence on obstruction. I don't think I'm alone in saying that the most surprising element of the attorney general's letter was that the special counsel did not make a recommendation as to whether the evidence on obstruction would have met a prosecution standard or would have satisfied criminal elements of obstruction. And instead, holy appears to have holy deferred to the attorney general in that. But. But we haven't seen the report. And so right now, we're only relying on what the attorney general put in his letter. All right. So let's let's deal with the collusion side of this first, and then come back to the obstruction side because I think the obstruction side is significantly more complicated, and actually is complicated. By the fact that there's more information, and so we we're we we have the benefit of relative ignorance with respect to collusion. So let's indulge in the ignorance for a minute. David when Bob when Bill Barr says that Bob Muller says that he could not find a pro a case of conspiracy of any American associated with the Trump campaign to assist the Russians in the electoral interference. Do you? You how close in your mind is that to the president's no collusion or conversely is it merely saying there is not adequate evidence to prove a criminal case here. How how much vindication does who get to claim from this? So the the president, of course, described that report in terms that are just plain vanilla faults. He said it was a totally Ghana ration- when the report itself even as described by bar, go that of its way to say something quite different from that that it is not an exoneration. And it is in a way a measure of how far we've come as the country that nobody even blinks at the president's very blatant mischaracterization, and that it is reported widely. But what the report did find with respect to the conspiracy prom as opposed to the obstruction prong is quote. The investigation did not establish a conspiracy or other agreement on election and appearance between members of the campaign and the Russian government. Well investigation did not establish. Could mean we looked at the evidence, and we found virtually no evidence of an agreement or conspiracy. But it also. Could mean we found substantial evidence, but not enough evidence to return an indictment and under the newly renamed Justice manual. Prosecutors. You know, do not return indictments unless they believe that the admissible evidence is able to allow them to obtain and sustain a conviction on proof beyond reasonable doubt. So, you know, just to give you a sense of the room that is left by bars description here, it could be anything from outright, and total innocence and a complete lack of evidence of any agreement or cooperation between the two sides Trump campaign and the Russian government or it could be as strong as proof by clear and convincing evidence enough to get you a verdict in a civil trial, but not quite by proof beyond a reasonable doubt. I don't see any way to know what that investigation did not establish phrase really means at this point. And we're going to have to wait and see. To see what you know in culpa, Tori, or derogatory evidence smaller sites, and and why he thinks it falls short of indict ability. Susan I on the one hand, I say. Bill bars. Very smart guy. He knows that much of this report is going to become public. He would be deranged to give raw to allow for a top line summary that is going to be dramatically contradicted as a narrative matter if not as a technical legal matter when the body of the report becomes public that is if to go back to David's description, if Bob Muller's actual finding were was while we found clear and convincing evidence of the worst forms of collusion, comma, we could not we did not establish that a conspiracy had taken place within the meaning of the law. He would be quite crazy to issue a letter that describes that report the way he did on the other hand, I am aware of. Enough highly disparaging material in the public record, for example, the Trump Tower meeting that I continue to scratch my head and say what kind of you know, what kind of reasonable. Vindication. Should we assume this may mean when you think of the range of possibility here, you know, lopping off the extreme ends of it? We find that the president was actually never engaged with Russians at all. He was delivering flowers to children and talking about the importance of the rule of law through the entire period on the one hand versus we came within a hair's breadth of proof beyond a reasonable doubt on all fronts, and we merely didn't bring a case because you know, the the evidence had been you know, was tainted by. Some difficulty where do you think the realistic range of possibilities here? Well to start I would say, I don't think Bill bar would be at all drain JD to write a summary letter. That was factually accurate and yet painted an altogether far rosier picture for the president. Then the underlying material of the report painted. I actually think that is a relatively shrewd move on his part both in terms of potentially sort of paving the way for for this report coming out and also in in terms of giving the president favorable headlines knowing that people were going to inevitably quibble over sort of the the underlying report. So as a as a threshold matter, I don't. The premise. I don't buy the premise. I'm not saying that to presume bad faith on bars part. I think that he probably is offering what he believes to be a reasonable summary. But I think that there are strong incentives for him to be as favourable as possible to the president. And so, you know, I like, David light. Carey said we have to see the underlying report before we can do sort of a meaningful analysis of what it means in part because the delta is so incredibly huge. So it's huge on the metric that David was referring to in the sense of is there no evidence than they looked everywhere. And they really couldn't find any indication of US persons participating in this at all. Or is it just barely squeaks below the threshold of sort of indictable behavior, or is it something in between or whenever Muller? Whenever bar is describing the the conspiracy that Muller did find which was a conspiracy that existed on the Russian side. He says that they found two major elements of that conspiracy. This sort of IRA propaganda trolling operation. And then the GRU hacking and distribution of emails they're quite specific in saying they didn't find any US person who assisted or conspired in those efforts. They don't say anything else about lots of other contexts that we've at least heard reported may have happened. And so what what are you thinking of when you for example, the entire all of the reporting relating to the Trump organization's ongoing negotiations with the Russian government regarding the construction of Trump Tower Moscow now that's not part of collusion. Right or or sort of the central inquiry. That's really really relevant to what the president and his campaign and associates were doing and communicating and participating in with respect to the Russian government does nothing to do or at least is not directly related to these two efforts. So again, I think that there's a possibility, and we have to allow for it with an open mind that this report is really good. For the president. That actually know the answer is they looked everywhere. There's they really didn't find evidence. Yeah. Maybe there was some, you know, imprudent conduct even things that people might sort of Wagga finger up, but just we didn't get within a country mile of anything. That's a moment consider criminal. I think that's a live possibility a genuine one. But I think just as live a possibility is the idea that either we're talking about conduct that just falls short of criminality. Or we're talking about a presentation of conduct that is not directly related to a criminal conspiracy. But is nevertheless, highly relevant to the basic fitness of the president of the United States and a highly relevant to one representations. He major the American public at the time into how we should view his efforts to interfere with influence. I I don't know how I don't know what word to use. Without sort of getting all the way up to obstruction. You know, the the investigation after the fact into that conduct. And so just that's all a long way of saying. I think the the delta here is so massive we have to see the report, and I really don't think we can conclude all that much from bars language other than that. It's quite vague. And it leaves open a wide range of possibilities. And also it is probably not factually false on its face. All right. So I want to bring in a guest who we don't actually have in in the room or remotely, which is a hybrid personality that I'm creating of the president's defender slash mixed with Glenn Greenwald mixed with maybe rich Lowry, the national review editor who was tweeting similar things the other day, all of whom are saying, basically that all the people like us have a lot to answer for right now. Because we've been you know, hyping fair Reuss for two years we've been insisting that there's a big deal here. And that we've kind of built up as a sort of hallmark of of you know, the. The president's supposed illegitimacy. This idea that he was in fact, colluding with Russia and we've insisted on the importance of the Muller investigation. And we've insisted in this, of course, in different ways applies to all of us. I suppose we've insisted that he was a threat to the integrity of the Mueller investigation. And now the Muller investigation has in fact played out to its full conclusion, and it has not substantiated the premise and so as as Glenn Greenwald. I noticed a particular tweet storm of his on this. You know, was sort of pounding the table that this is basically, you know, all of us were wildly spectacularly wrong. And so this is sort of a moment of accountability for us. So carrie. I I have my own view of this. But I'm I'm interested in in in yours. Are do you feel in any way that the findings of the Mahler investigation on collusion are a rebuke to you or anything that you believe? No because there was so much activity that took place in public for everyone to see that as a former national government national security lawyer as a former counter intelligence lawyer was so unbelievably bizarre to witness probably the primary example was the president's summer twenty sixteen statement Russia, are you listening and calling on a hostile foreign nation to release emails of a political opponent. That was so bizarre from a now. Security standpoint. And then all the ensuing lies that came out of the administration for nearly every contact with Russian government or Russian surrogates over a period of the campaign and into the presidency itself that could have been so easily explained if the the Trump campaign and Trump administration would've would've explained it. And so there was an remains an enormous amount of information that still hasn't been explained regarding the president and the campaign and his administration's interactions with Russian government and Russian surrogates. I wrote on law fair in December of twenty seventeen that the Muller investigation. The special counsel report was not going to be like a truth commission that it was. Not going to explain everything all the way. And so I don't think that the fact that the special counsel did not find evidence to support that the president and his team were engaged in a criminal conspiracy to negate all of the information that has been in our face for over two years. So let me push you on that a little bit. I actually agree with you completely. But I want to but I want to ventilate it a little bit. If the Muller finding substantively in that range of possibility that we were talking about is wildly on the sculpture, Tori side that I that there's nothing. There's no substantial information that isn't already public. It's just a series of random reckless comments by people a series of people who took meetings who shouldn't have taken meetings prof cut out professor who meets with an adviser to the campaign Carter page being Carter page if you take all of that. There's nothing more than any of that on Paul Manafort being a money launderer. You look at this fact pattern that presented publicly as a somebody who did national security investigations in the Justice department, and you say no way, this doesn't get investigated. It was worthy of investigation. And let's not forget that the special counsel was appointed to begin with because the president fired the chief investigator who was running that counter intelligence investigation. And then he said on television for everyone to see that at least part of the reason he fired that individual was because of the Russia investigation. So I understand the argument. And and I have friends in town who would probably argue that who are more sympathetic to the administration who would probably argue that they were just wildly incompetent as opposed to. To corrupt or malfeasance or or or criminal. But the lack of explanation and the continual lying is I think what certainly justified the investigation. Okay, david. I you know, you are also have a background in national security investigations. Do you agree with that? Is there any way? This fact pattern that presented to the F B I and eventually to the to what became the Mahler investigation. Is there any way in any conceivable universe that that does not get taken very seriously and investigated very seriously? No, I think it's important to second-guessed oneself frequently even if it's painful like reading your own transcripts of trials, and it's important to adjust to the fact that the facts come out and learn from them, and if people were hyping the results or front running the results of Muller investigation. Okay. But the investigation here was not just clearly justified. I said before a different podcast on luster. Given the fact that we're presented the bureau had no choice, but to pursue it. It would have been dereliction of duty to ignore it. And write it off as mere incompetence or assume that everything was in its upfront. I and the president's behavior during the course of the investigation was likewise completely outside the range of historical norms and practices for presidents who respect the independence. Of investigation and law enforcement. So I I'm with Kerry, you know, I think it is important, you know, not to just be completely result-oriented and start tweaking analysis to you know, she desired results, but I don't really have much out of any kind. Whether this investigation was justified or indeed unavoidable and whether the president's behavior both in advance and then while it was going on with out of bounds. So Susan, I want to this is a great segue to the question of the the aspect of this investigation that bars letter does not address it all which is the counterintelligence dimensions of the investigation, y you know. The collusion prong of this letter addresses whether there was a criminal conspiracy. But we know from the New York Times is reporting that when this investigation opened including open at the time of the firing against Jim Komi against the president. It was opened partly as a criminal matter on instruction, but partly as a counterintelligence matter. And so my question is is there any indication in the bar letter. What happened to those counterintelligence equities? I think the short answer to that is no right there are that is one of the pretty significant holes apparently NBC is now reporting that there's the FBI is going to brief the gang of eight as to the counter intelligence findings to quibble with the premise a little bit rubber Muller did find a criminal conspiracy. He indicted, many many individuals perfect to a criminal conspiracy. He didn't find US persons who participated, and that's that's relevant to the counterintelligence piece because it offered a really really rich accounting of the nature of the counterintelligence threat and those indictments themselves served as unimportant deterrent function moving forward. I also think it's worth keeping in mind. The amount of information that was made public either through sort of the the special counsel's office kind of speaking indictments and through media reports which is highly relevant to sort of core counterintelligence questions ordinarily whenever we're talking about a counterintelligence investigation. We're not necessarily talking about someone being the witting agent of a foreign power were talking about in appropriate illicit and potentially dangerous foreign influence, and so I do think that finding out the full nature of the Russian conspiracy is is important as a defensive counterintelligence matter. I do think finding out the nature of the president's engagements and business business associations. The degree of context. His advisors were having. Undisclosed contact with Russian individuals. I do think it was. An urgent national security threat that the sitting national security adviser had had a conversation prior to coming into the White House in which he offered to or made representations of the incoming administration was gonna lift sanctions. And then lied about it. So the FBI that is a counterintelligence threat, and by exposing that information, and we've had many discussions about the the sort of the the effects of leaking and the consequences of that the way it which was exposed that itself is one way to respond to really serious threats. And so on that metric alone lots and lots of continued unanswered questions. But also, I think lots of basics success stories and an a pretty compelling example of why counterintelligence investigations are important in the first ones, I want to close this part of the discussion with one piece of evidence in the Bar Lev. Letter that there is actually evidence of some degree of collusion. If not evidence that constitutes a indictable case of conspiracy. And that is the following sentence. The special counsel issued more than twenty eight hundred subpoenas executed nearly five hundred search warrants obtained more than two hundred thirty orders for communications records issued almost fifty orders for authorising of pen, registers, etc. Etc. I want to focus particularly on the phrase executed nearly five hundred search warrants, and I wanna assert that first of all the standard for doing a search warrant most of those are presumably for emails, and there that is orders to companies to produce e mails the standard is still probable cause. And therefore unless we assume that. All five hundred of these search warrants are issued to in connection with the obstruction component of the investigation. We have to assume that these reflect that the government had probable cause against a lot of people in matters related to this conspiracy in indictment this conspiracy prong, so David my my mischievous question for you is is Bill bar here acknowledging that actually there may have been probable cause about a lot of people's behavior that didn't amount at the end of the day to proof beyond a reasonable doubt of conspiracy. Are put those two ticks about Muller's investigation in the front of this letter not for that purpose, but to establish the thoroughness of it, and therefore bolster confidence in the conclusion of the investigation did not establish a conspiracy. But I do think it's worth pointing out is you've just done five hundred search warrants means five hundred findings of probable cause. Of course, you can have multiple search warrants, and you often do for any one user in sometimes even for anyone account. And of course, also not every subject of a search warrant that is not every account holder is necessarily a US prison. They may have been gathering information on another person's. So there's you know, I wanna sound to note of caution. But there is obviously a number a lot of judicial finding behind this of probable cause. And. Even if in the end, it doesn't get you over the line in a criminal matter. It is still relevant to the counterintelligence investigation. We've been discussing presumably and gives you a sense of you know, what may be part of the outcome of that investigation. Let me also add on Ben I want to tweak a little bit. Perhaps the way that you're suggesting we we read that which which I framed intentionally provocative -ly, by the way, part part of the difficulty with extrapolating from the attorney general's summary letter is I read that section of the letter that describes all of the legal process that was issued including the five hundred warrants I read that to pertain to the special counsels entire investigative activities. That means the Flynn case the Manafort case, the gates case all the other individuals who were prosecuted for lying to federal government officials. I read those numbers those statistics as encompassing all of that investigative activity all of the IRA prosecution. The everything that the special counsel did not merely not merely the two. Limited points that the attorney general's letter includes findings about which is only collusion as a pertains to the president or the president's campaign and obstruction. That's interesting because the paragraph in question is only about those two issues but the sentence in but the the relevant sentence is in arguably encompasses the entire investigation. And I don't know. I mean, we that's one thing that I'm just suggesting perhaps an alternative reading. But I we don't know until we have more information perfectly possible. And this would be consistent with the aggregate findings right that there's thirty seven defendants altogether. And you can generate a whole lot of search warrants out of thirty seven in my mind, the numbers make more sense when you put it in that context that's perfectly fair. I I do think it goes to the idea though, that even the most basic factual representation in a summary is just not enough information. You. You cannot conclude anything essentially until you have the underlying report except one thing which is that the special prosecutor concluded that there was not a criminal case here on conspiracy. Right. And that the investigation is concluded both pieces which are unequivocally. Great news for the president. But anything beyond that in terms of sort of assessing, the political consequences, or even sort of the the legal consequences in the sense. We're talking about things like impeachment. I don't see how this letter even begins to touch on that stuff. All right. Let's turn to obstruction says, we here's the we dealt with a simple stuff the collusion side. Let's deal with the obstruction side. So here. We have a really peculiar statement by the attorney general about the special counsel's view. And then additional layer that reflects the attorney general's view the special counsel all we really know is that the special counsel for some reason made a decision not to make a decision about whether the president had obstructed Justice. But instead laid out all the evidence detailed in his report the arguments for and against considering it as an obstruction or at each incident as a set of obstructions, I suppose and then. Declined to go further than that, the attorney general notes this and then layers on top of it his own view, which apparently the deputy attorney general shares that the president's conduct does not amount to obstruction of you that is broadly consistent with the one that he articulated, although not exactly the same. But broadly, consistent with view that he articulated in his memo that became controversial during his confirmation. And so my first question David, should we look at this as a situation in which Bob Muller punted this decision to Bill bar or should we look at it as a situation in which Bob Muller? Declined to address this question for some other reason and bar jumped in to fill a gap. Right. So I don't know who Bob mother was trying to whether it's bar, and or the congress, but I did find this to be the most surprising aspect of or description of Muller's report that is I think I would've expected Muller to make a finding on criminality even in the face of the bar on that is the prohibition on indictment of a sitting president. And I I did find it surprising. I I have to believe that he would have known that leaving that space open would 'cause they'll Bart still. And I would be surprised if he was the prized that or did so, but he may be thinking that you know, because the president can't be indicted. There was no need to address these very difficult legal questions and in a way that may be. Eight mother saying look, this is just not the kind of issue that criminal Justice system, or I can really resolve for you. And so I'm going to have to pass it to the political, folks. I don't know. I'm puzzled by this is the thing again that I found the strangest I think it would have been far more conventional for him to make the finding of criminality one way or the other. I knowledge it may be a hard case. But prosecutors make our judgments of that sort, and I don't know what he was thinking. And it's the one thing I really want to understand most of all probably when and if we see the full report. Yeah. I think if you look at the language of the bar letter, it would suggest it would it would not. So just that Muller had intended for bar to fill that space. Even if you might have suspected that bar was going to the letter says that that the special counsel's office was declining to make a traditional prosecutorial judgment. That's not saying they couldn't reach a decision or they felt that the decision the that the attorney general was in a better position to make the decision that language to me suggests this is not an area, presumably because of the difficult article two questions, and because of the fact that the DOJ guidance says you cannot indict a sitting president that they were essentially saying there is no traditional prosecutorial decision to be made. I do think that it's worth noting as we've discussed that bar inserting his judgment as to obstruction. And the fact that there was not that this. The didn't meet the legal standard for obstruction has no operative affect other than providing the president. Cover in sort of headlines. Right. His spell that out. Because I I know what you mean there. But I think a lot of listeners won't why doesn't it have operative effect? So when Muller delivers his report to the attorney general he is not delay. He is he is not making a recommendation as to charging the president on obstruction. That doesn't mean that the question remains open right Muller has exclusive jurisdiction here. It means that the matter is closed for the purposes of the department of Justice. And so it's not as though there was then this void that the attorney general needed to step in to declare. And I say this does not rise to obstruction. It was always going to go to congress to the extent. Congress gets this full report. And so Barr could have said nothing, and that wouldn't have changed anything in terms of the the legal position of the department. And so. I he might have felt a duty or obligation to offer his view of things, but it didn't have any effect other than the early narrative framing because certainly on a matter in which Robert Muller after this this this very thorough investigation. Basically says, you know, there is lots of evidence on either side, surely that is going to be an issue that congress is going to have to render an independent judgement on Kerry. What do you think is is this a situation in which Bob Muller punted something or is it a situation in which Bill bar arrogated something to himself or is it just not clear yet? I think I just think it's impossible to know right now without knowing first of all what the evidence is. That's in the report on the points of obstruc. Action without knowing what the substance and level of consultation. There was between the special counsel's office and rod Rosenstein, when he was the acting attorney general for purposes of this investigation, and then between the special counsel's office in attorney general bar once he came on board. It's just really hard to know whether or not the special counsel independently came to this decision not to make a prosecutorial recommendation or whether he decided not to do it because there was a difference of legal opinion between the special counsel's office and the attorney general's office and the deputy attorney general's office or whether he decided not to do it because making a prosecutorial recommendation would have been irrelevant because the remedy for a president who obstructed Justice is political. I just don't think that we have enough information to understand that dynamic. And I think the only way to understand it will probably be number one to see this portion of the report and number two to hear from the attorney general, perhaps the deputy attorney general and perhaps the special counsel in a congressional hearing. All right. I wanna make up a bunch of facts and use them to make a case for what? Bob Muller appears to have done here. And then have you guys any of you who want bat me back, David you seem to be the most concerned about the way Muller appears to have handled this, so maybe maybe you'll attack this. But here's my my gut instinct when I read this part of the letter, which is Muller made a judgment that this is ultimately an impeachment question. It is not you know. Yes, you can make an argument that this violates the crew. Final law. It raises novel issues of first impression as to the interaction of the of the obstruction statutes with article to those questions are freaking hard. And since you're barred from indicting, the attorney of the sitting president, anyway, they're entirely hypothetical questions. So really what we're staring at here as some of us have been arguing on law. Fair for a long time is a constellation of facts that relate to the accent, the normative acceptability of the president's conduct vis-a-vis the law enforcement apparatus that serves him. And so what do you do in this situation? Which is and the answer is gasp you behave like Ken Starr, which is to say, you you use the criminal Justice apparatus to gather a whole. A lot of facts, and you report them in a somewhat truth commission like fashion, and you don't way in on the legality or illegality of them. Because frankly, that's a side point the relevant point is does congress think they are or are not impeachable offenses. And so what Muller may have been doing? Here is saying the fundamental role of the special counsel is to create a record of the substantive behavior of the president in interaction with law enforcement for purposes of of evaluation along non-criminal axes by other actors, I congress, and therefore I don't really need to decide whether it does or does not violate the obstruction statutes as limited by article two. Well, I think that subject to the going to carry and I made about how there's no way to know. I think that that explanation of the desire to pass the issue to congress, and therefore not have to make any judgments that aren't essential to that resolution, and that course of action probably the most likely explanation. But again, I really like to see the report, I think, you know, on the other side of it number one he had to know that or would take up the issue. Seems to me if you're thinking about this you have to know that maybe he doesn't care. But I think he had to know that I do think the ultimate finding of criminality by the special prosecutor or by special counsel could be relevant to the political debate. I agree. It's a different standard, of course, under diekmann during the other political remedy, but still I think it would be a helpful in relative relevant finding to make. And I suppose thinking ahead, you know, the bar is against indicting sitting president, but one way or another it's possible two years or so from now we may not have Donald Trump's sitting in the White House. And I guess it would be an open issue for prosecution at that point. So I guess I think it may very well be that when I read the report, I will say I now understand, and I can really support and think mother's choice was justified. I suspect though, I. I will also think that it would have been permissible and justified for him to make that finding and if he were able to make that finding I think it would be helpful one to make. Carried you have thoughts. I think I agree with everything that that David said there in I'm just thinking while we're while he was talking what I was thinking about was what of the special counsel had not made a recommendation on other parts. So in other words, the the attorney general's letter appears to say that the special counsel did make a recommendation into determination based on the facts of the collusion and the conspiracy issue. So what I'm curious about is why a decision on one aspect that affected the president and not on another that affected the president. I, and I think the answer to that may well be that the obstruction issue is centrally and only about the conduct of Donald Trump as president. Whereas the conspiracy issue is about his the conduct of all the people around his campaign. It's about you know, it's about every Griffin who slipped into Trump Tower. At various times. It's about Felix Seder rate. It's about all these other people who whatever they do have in common with one. Another don't happen to be the president of the United States exercising article two powers. All right. Let's wrap up. Susan. I'm where what happens now, do you have any, you know, Bill Barr says at the end of this at the end of this letter that he's working expeditiously to resolve sixty issues and get out as much material as possible he is still committed. He says to doing that there have been no substantial leaks so far. What do you think are we working toward a process in which the body of the Muller report with exceptions becomes public over the next few days weeks or months, or are we working toward a process in which there is a huge confrontation over the future of this report or both? I think both it is. It remains inconceivable to me that this could conclude without the American people and not just congress. But the public actually seeing almost all of this report with very narrow exceptions. I would imagine there will be fights. Even over six immaterial to the extent there's on a classified material and to the extent that there's any exertion of executive privilege. And so I don't think that we've seen indications from the Justice department that there. Acting untoward here and are going to try to withhold things. They don't think are properly withheld, but we're we're clearly saying the Justice department anticipates withholding something and if they would try try and withhold anything whatsoever. There is going to be a serious legal confrontation over that. Because I don't think congress would or should walk away from. This this episode in American history without having obtained as much information as the legal process will allow them to an I don't just think that that's going to be limited to the Muller report. I think we are going to see a substantial fight over the underlying investigative materials as well. Kerry. What do you think is this a situation where okay Muller bar is going to redact a bunch of sixty protected material? They're going to quietly tell congress. Hey, these twenty pages relate to an ongoing matter that you really don't wanna screw up by us making this public, and this is the classified annex that we absolutely cannot make public, but we will brief the intelligence committees. Of course, like we would on any counterintelligence matter and congress says, okay, we put up a pro forma fight on the following. Issues. So that we can. But basically, the there will be a process that will make enough of this public. So that congress can go about its business, and we can all go about evaluating what we think of low-fare Rusen and Donald Trump's role in it. Or is this a situation in which, you know, the bulls have put their head down, and they're charging toward one another, and we are going to have a huge the fight that we thought we were going to have over, you know, might have over the impeachment of Donald Trump is as an initial matter all going to be about the disclosure of the substance of this report. I think the first part of what you described would be totally consistent with what the attorney general committed to doing and his confirmation hearing in terms of his commitment to transparency and and making as much of the report public as he possibly could. I do think that if he asserts too much. It makes too many assertions regarding or or if they're substantively is so much grand jury information on the obstruction piece in particular. I think congress is going to fight most strongly on the obstruction of the information supporting the obstruction factual findings. And so to the extent that he tries to withhold information on that piece, I think that they will fight fairly substantially in. And we might see litigation on that point. I do want to say one thing before we close on the national security side of things, and this comes to something that Susan mentioned at the very beginning on the reporting that the gang of eight is being briefed on something. And it just that that report indicates that there is still there is a reason many of us are not finding all of this to make a lot of sense. And I think that gang of eight report kind of highlights it because if there is some aspect of this ongoing investigate. Nation that is so sensitive that it can't be briefed to the full house intelligence committee, and the full Senate intelligence committee that it can only be briefed to the gang of eight that indicates to me that there is some part of this that still perhaps a fax of the involvement of US persons or something that is beyond just the activities of four of a foreign intelligence service because I'm just having a hard time coming up with what would it be that that the full intelligence committees could not receive and but the Devin Nunes could receive will because he is still part of the gang of eight. So so just pointing out the irony not make the argument that well, they're trying to keep it from the most partisan partisans because because he is still the ranking member on the house intelligence committee, and so he will receive that information. And so I just think that there is there is a reason why. Based on the information. That's just in the attorney general's letter in based on what we've heard so far publicly that is still not all adding up to this being completed investigation and everything sort of being resolved as it relates to twenty sixteen and and the counterintelligence issues that are related, David. What are you see you look forward? Do you think this is a this letter is a good faith initial effort by Bill bar that promises. Additional major disclosures that will begin to answer all the questions, we've all been discussing or is this a sufficiently measly effort on the part of the attorney general that it simply sets up a a a a confrontation that is going to be vicious or conversely, as it a good faith effort that is that, you know, the Democrats are so. Deranged by Trump derangement syndrome that they will not take. Yes. For an answer in terms of the disclosures. That bar is promising. I think possible that I say yes to everything you just said, I have no I have no basis to question the fundamental good faith of Bill VAR, I know him a little bit. And I and I may not share the same view of what the law is. But I do think he's committed to rule of law. And so I start with the presumption that you know, he he may have written this from a certain perspective. But the factually accurate in. It's not intentionally misleading in any way. And I would take considerable evidence to get me off of that view. Just because that's what I think he's about he's smart and he's committed to following the law as he sees it. I think we probably will end up seeing most of this report one way or the other the pressure in the system to have it disclosed. And so great that if the, you know, an accommodation can't be reached, then I. Think you know, stuck we'll come out, even even by leaks. I just I'm not condoning, but I'm simply describing state of affairs. I do think they'll probably be some confrontation around the edges of what can be disclosed. It seems to me the incentive at least in part may encourage that. I think a couple of interesting aspects that we haven't touched on that may go to the question of what gets disclosed are for what did Muller get for all of his two thousand eight hundred subpoenas and five hundred search warrants and so forth. Did he run into any evidentiary roadblock in his investigation that leave gaps that need filling and might be subject to being filled later with additional investigative efforts over time and second what's the relationship between the core work that he kept for himself and all the work that he's fun out that may be ongoing because we've discussed ironically, I think, you know. Bar could say to the congress that you don't want to disclose all that stuff real compromise all these ongoing investigations that. I'm sure you all in congress at least in the democratic side of Rabi to see done. So we better not talk about that. And I think he will you know, end up putting the congress possibly in a little bit of a hot seat on that. But I'm curious on both of those aspects and how they will bear on the question of disclosure going forward. David Carey, Susan. Thank you all for joining us today. The law fair podcast is produced in cooperation with the Brookings Institution. Whether it's a special edition emergency podcast or a regular addition normal podcast, you should rate the law fair podcast because we don't advertise. We don't, you know, do all those things to promote podcasts that other podcasts to do. We don't do any of that. We just have you to share us on Facebook on Twitter on Instagram. I'm on Pinterest and on all the podcast distribution services. You use? You should leave us a rating our music when we have music, which we don't on special editions of the podcast is performed by sofi. A Yan the law fair podcast was produced an edited today as well as audio engineered by the one the only Michaela Fogel. And as always folks, thanks for listening.

president Robert Muller special counsel attorney David Carey United States Russian government congress Bill bar Donald Trump Bill bar Bill Barr Trump Tower deputy attorney general Susan Kerry Ghana Justice department
Girls Gone Hallmark: Playing Cupid

Long Story Short with Megan and Wendy: The Podcast

34:51 min | 2 months ago

Girls Gone Hallmark: Playing Cupid

"Hey everyone welcome to girls. Gone hallmark a bonus episode of long story. Short the podcast. I'm megan i'm wendy today. We're discussing playing cupid part of the brand new love ever after series on the hallmark channel for february for anyone who's new to us these bonus episodes were worn out of the fact. That megan is a longtime hallmark van. And wendy is fairly new to the hallmark game but you know four months into this. I would say you're quickly becoming a leading hallmark expert. I mean i haven't missed a movie since november so i feel like historian at this point. I do think you might need to retire. Your new title. You're just knew her. Yeah exactly wolf. If you want. More of my speech listened to a regular. Podcast episodes that drop every tuesday. You can also find this at megan. Wendy dot com where we publish our full show notes for every episode as well as regular blog posts. One of my current favorites is the how to make iced coffee at home post. Because i feel like it was a real revelation when i realized it doesn't have to be terrible. Made it home. So if you're like me and you'd like to try that. I've got a lot of ideas there for how to make it great. You can also follow us on instagram where we are megan and wendy l. s. and join our facebook group long story. Short east We also love your emails. You can reach us. At meghan and wendy at gmail.com we would love to hear from you re read every single one of them. It might even show up here on the show so she emails and if you really want more from us you can subscribe to our patriot on real beginning exclusive content from like video episodes bonus podcast episodes that can be heard anywhere else and even though exile long story short videos which the people have actually been asking for. I know it's crazy kind of love it. So this week's movie is playing cupid. And wendy. do you have a synopsis of this movie. I do a you know you asked me every time and never ready for it but here it comes. It is playing cupid a modern day. Emma finds david martinez being secretly setup with his daughter's teacher when the young girl begins a matchmaking business for a school project. Hey i think that's a pretty good synopsis. i don't think so. Oh tell me why because the synopsis suggests that the daughter sets up the dad and the teacher and that doesn't really happen. yes they just. She sends them the secret admirer. No no no no no she. League require no. that's not matchmaking. Well how is in matchmaking. She's like behind the scenes trying to get them together. That's all like emma. Storyline there where she's like trying to make things happen. she's not saying. Hey joe meet susie. You guys should date just trying to like them together. So they think it's their own idea a story honey stinger. Yes do watch that show. Of course i did. Of course i did. I just heard her on in an interview the other day of surprised to hear she's still in the game. She still matchmaking. No yes just not on reality. Tv correct interesting. What happened to her show. What was that called matchmaker. I think it was called the millionaire matchmaker. It that's it that's it. I wonder why they canceled that. Show i who knows okay. Let's jump to first impressions. No news and notes. Google didn't give me a whole ton of news and notes on this movie. No like many many many many many others. it was filmed in canada. Yup and it was based on the novel. Playing cupid by jenny meyerhoff however the synopsis of that novel. Leads me to believe that the story is more about clara storyline. And perhaps the others are incidental. It i did nothing more than look at the amazon synopsis. But the image on the cover i kind of thought. It was like a tween teen focused novel. That was then adapted for hallmark. It is published under the hallmark imprint. No no no scholastic a hallmark channel now. An original movie like decal on the front of it but it is it is a scholastic book which means that it. It's it's audience is tweens and teens. No i agree with that and jenny. Meyerhoff did get a writing credit on this movie along with. Then who is a prolific hallmark writer as well Okay so i just had. This is what makes me like not irritated but annoyed when they take like. I know you say this happens all the time. But they take up book and they took like dash of the book. You know because this because obviously more about claris storyline but the movie is is obviously central around the budding relationship between david carey so they took a dash of playing cupid. The book and a dash of emma and whatever and mixed it all up in the hallmark blender. Yeah i think it's very very loosely. Based on the book. I mean they do have the same character names but other than that. I would agree. They just took inspiration from it and then a diet to be home arche. it doesn't honestly bother me I don't like it when they say it's now a hallmark original movie because it's not really right. It's not like you're watching. You know what. I love the jenny han all the boys. I loved before series where those are adaptations of the books. Like there's some creative license taken in the movies but they're very true to the book. I would say that's not the case here and as a reader who then watches movies. I find it really hard sometimes to watch movie of a book. I've read 'cause i'm like the whole time. I'm like without how it wasn't the book. Was that how. It wasn't the book. And i can't focus on the movie itself so i understand what you're saying. Well and the other thing too is. I wonder if these characters have david and carey exist in that book I doubt they do. I don't know. I think i'm more interested in watching an adaptation of the book rather than a Inspired by yeah. I liked clara. Storyline a little bit better. I kind of liked the younger actors and they're cute little like matchmaking business. When i was in middle school we had. I wish i could remember what it was called. But there was the you filled out a survey and then you were given life. Your compatibility matches done valley yes. It was done around valentine's day. And i can remember like being that. It was seventh and eighth grade middle a lot. I was a so inappropriate. Thinking back is so weird. I can't remember what we called it. But i know that It was run by the pep club. High you know. We were like cheer skirts. Even though for no good reason and we. I can remember like a inputting information as obviously it wasn't on a computer like we didn't have the ability to collect google forms so people filled out surveys and we input them all and then their compatibility with spit. I don't know honestly my memories. Big but i do know that it happened and Seems odd that that was allowed at the middle school. I'm pretty sure it would be allowed. Now yeah that sounds like a carnival game. It doesn't sound like you know like a legitimate middle school project so weird. It was like a fundraiser. It was like you pay to get your anyway. I go so wrong. don't you think so honestly thinking about it. now. I'm like god. I have second hand embarrassment imagining myself on. Someone's list and then thinking like oh i don't want match with her totally terrible fire. That teacher who's ever i did that kit anyway. This movie claims to be a remake of wendy. Apparently has some issues with that statement but because the story is not about clara. The story is about david and kyrie. that's she features pretty heavily. You know a lot of these movies that have kids in them. I think she gets a bigger role than we see. Many of the other movies that have kids. She's not incidental. She does have a fully fleshed out storyline. I think yes agree agree. I may be read. Emma in high school but i i know many adult women have a strong affinity for jane austen novels. And i haven't read any of them since i was in high school and i'm starting to feel like maybe i should but they remade the movie emma and twenty twenty and it stars On you taylor joy. Who was the star of the gambit. Which makes me want to rewatch it because i find her so fascinating to watch. Hang on just a second. I think she was nominated for a golden globe for emma o. Let me just look here. Because i think she was nominated for both the queen's gambit and emma. That'd be that such a good golden globes wire during that there a great episode of the podcast at talks about the golden globes. And why they're actually kind of garbage. Aside from the fact that there picks were totally racist like the people that get to vote is such a small insular. Group does not really representative of hollywood itself. I highly recommend it will lincoln in the show notes. It's very funny and very informative awesome. Here we go best performance by an actress in a limited series on yet. Taylor joy for the queen's gambit and also for best performance by an actress in a motion picture musical or comedy for okay. Yeah that's awesome. Wow stellar year for her. I really enjoyed her. She was kind of brand new to me. Not kind of. She was brand. New to me in the queen's gambit but she's also in peaky blinders which i started and honestly fell asleep in the first five minutes which is again not a judgment on the show. I fall asleep easily watching. Tv in bed. But i would like to go back and watch it strictly for her and the accents. she's also like a horror movie. I can't i know. I can't remember the name of it all link in the show notes. Somebody's scores mary now. My personal favorite remake of emma is clueless one of my all time favorite movies. I'm a to hardcore alesia silverstone fan site in the movie theater. I don't remember if i made. I've seen it hundreds of times. I love that movie. I used to watch it over and over. You know. it's still creeps me out. that like. She gets together with her stepbrother. At the end however i do love everything else about it. Yeah i mean. They're not related though. I know but it's still weird. You know. I went to college with her. Her you would busy silverstone and you all went to the same college. Yeah at the same time. Actually because she and. I took a lisa and i took photography like in the same semester. We weren't in the same class. We were often in the dark room at the same time and that was my college claim to fame was pre or post clueless. It must've been po. This is one thousand nine hundred eighty eight ninety nine. Okay host winded clues. Come out before ninety nine thousand five. Yeah you those. My besties celebrity college at you want to write. This isn't tom. Hanks the sun there to call when a call. And as louise girl i. I went to college with the girl who played Dylan mckay's younger sister. Beverly hills two one. Oh she was in one of my Chemistry classes at school. Yeah but what was your first impression of this movie and fortunately this movie fell super flat for me. I was very excited for it. And i thought it disappointed big time. I didn't like it as much as i liked a beverly hills wedding. I didn't hate it. It was just an okay movie for me. It was fine. I didn't hate it either. You know there. I have a visceral reaction to some movies that i cannot stand and we have talked about them here on the pike. This was not one of them. This was like super flat for me. Like i was like my okay. Is it the winter getaway movie for me. Like i didn't hate it. I was just like okay. Yeah yeah yeah yeah. Exactly exactly all right. So what did you like about this. Is there anything you liked. I do have a short list of things that i like to. I'm i ap. I thought the sets were vibrant and bright and beautiful. And i know this is like a stupid thing but coming off of all those christmas movies and the winter movies when everything is cold and bleak and whatever. The christmas movies were cold and blake but the weight. So i just thought these were like beautiful. The restaurant like all these like vitamin colors. There was this one thing to. They took like the candles on the table. They were in a jar but then on around the jar they wrapped like colorful tissue paper. And i thought what a great idea. I've never seen that before that. Did you notice. But i did think the ratings beautiful. I love the restaurant. I thought the middle school looked like a business office really. But then i thought they did a great job of like making it bright and vibrant. Like what you would see at school. Yeah i like the dance up at the dance. Look great the decor for that. I agree i agree Tell me some things you like to have a few more. But i'm curious. I love the ain't now mountain high enough dancing like i watched partisan while i was getting ready and was totally dancing. Love that song real. Remember the titans moment for me. Anga like no i need fun. I loved it. I will not be brought down from this moment. I loved it. I'm gonna talk about that specifically in our next segment of what i would've wished for but okay. Yeah not a faith. I also enjoyed all the food talk so much food top and it wasn't like let's have eggnog and sugar cookies boring right. It was like unique and he was talking about family recipes and it made me want to go to that restaurant and have the and given to me now. I love. I like when they make food almost a character in a book or a movie. I like that. I feel like that's good writing when you can like Make your viewers want to eat what you're talking about. I love that. I love madam. Okay what else. Oh goodness okay. That was not true. I did love nicholas gonzalez. Oh i thought. He was corroborate packed. Him he was great. I have some notes about him. Okay so what else i liked was with the exception of the main female lead. I thought the cast was pretty diverse android that i appreciate that. I liked that there was an early kissing. Wasn't not only at the end but it was like almost an hour and a half in when they were in the was it. Where were they there in. The restaurant immediately ain't how night i've seen. Okay hold on. I liked the cassim. Hold on. I have thought i will get to those who i thought that tortilla seen when he was like you need some more oil now little bit of flower i was like this is almost sexy but it didn't quite get there but it was there breathy talk. What's quite a bit. Yes real heavy in that moment i. That's what i was like. Hello nicolas gonzales else can find. You left him. So yeah. that's that's how i got for like okay. Shall we talk. Roadblocks place in the way of our movie couple is that no. I don't have many the only one i have is. The ex wife seems to be a problem in the expert shows up. I have even is back. I also have very early on. Oh carry a long term boyfriend that we're going to have to get rid of where move onto the real story will. They're also t was the she might have to move back to where to her mov. My gosh but we've talked about this before. But this is a hallmark where we were. The families are like you need to come home like you went there and it didn't work. What part of it didn't work. She broke up with her boyfriend so now she can't stay in. This city has an adult employed woman. I don't understand that so a noisy has a full life there. She has friends and a job. she's obviously great at. I know that could have been cut out of the movie for me. I also have a and david are at odds over a school project. Oh gosh now that to which was manufactured drama for me because all of his objections seemed completely absurd. When he's like this isn't going to succeed. I wanted to be like dude. It's a fake school project. All she has to do is go through the motions. She doesn't actually have to make any money. I know well the whole thing where he was like. This is not going to succeed. I was like dude. We have e harmony we have. These are matchmaker services. That people are making a ton of money off of so. Hey maybe it is going to succeed and the middle school level. What happened allies on all those raging hormones. Come on right all right. I have a feeling you have several in this next category. Which is what we wished for is. I'm gonna let you just hop right in okay so i. The two leads lacked any chemistry for. I just thought they were so mismatched. Okay no way. And plus like she's a couple of inches taller than him. And i didn't like that. I thought it was a very obvious. Just bugged me. It just bugged me. I would have rather seen. And i even wrote this down. I would have rather seen alexa pano vega as carey in this role. Do you remember alexa. Vega from scherf from taking a shot at love but i cannot believe your height shaming him. I'm not high. I mean i'm really not it's just it's it just bothered me. Sorry it's so funny to okay. But but i heard right down here. I thought nicolas gonzales who played. David was believable. I cared about his character as a single parent You know i really liked him. I just thought it was a mismatch between him. And laura vandersloot route. Who played kerry. I wanted more of the scene. When eva the long lost mother arrives to find david and carey kissing. All we have is. What do we have here and then cut to commercial and then it come back and it's the next day that story just lead to know where it was like not even relevant that she came back it didn't it didn't even matter as a whole it didn't even matter well. I liked that there was some resolution there because they have her offscreen the entire time and up. Until you know the last fifteen minutes and i had wondered. Are we going to see her because she was just kind of this invisible conflict happening between david and clara and not really between the two of them. But i think she was creating conflict where it didn't exist And the mom also was like. Why are you letting her do this project if it's you know. She's going to be embarrassed when nobody shows up at the restaurant which was so. I've never seen two parents link invested in supporting their eighth grade daughter in their fake business last and it was in the daughter was okay with like she's back. We're a family in a different way. Now i don't know i liked that. There wasn't that like trying to tear them apart anymore when she moved back to the area. Listen i just did not care about that character or her coming back. I didn't like her when she answers the door to carry. And i felt like she had that moment of like. We're having family time right now. And i was like but you're not getting back together right. My whole problem with that scene was didn't they just spend the entire evening author restaurant and doing her singles speed dating thing and then now they're having family time at home. Like what time of night is this. There's a lot of time continuity issues. Yes she was at the dance waiting for her secret admirer. Seven o'clock and then boom. She's at the restaurant hosting the speed dating. There were a lot of am i wrong. Were those different day before valentine's day. I was confused. But i do think the dance was the day before they did not explain that very well. I thought i thought no i agree. I will get to that lip singing part in a second. But this is what i really would have liked from the story. I would have loved if they would flip this story upside down and made the single dad a gay man who meets his daughter's teacher who was also part of the lgbtq community. Wouldn't that have been a great movie. Yes but it would not have featured a gay man who was also not super white in the hallmark world. Oh you think. I i think i think hallmark is making baby steps. I don't think they're like i think. Whoa that's like we can give them one thing that we can't give him too many. I look. I d- i yes i i would have loved that as well like if if clara was trying to set up her dad who was newly single with her teacher. I would've love that. That would have been so cute. I like it somebody rate that we knew somebody. I'm gonna i mean just. Maybe you're just not going to see that on a hallmark movie yet. Hopefully in the future we will see ya have we gotten. I don't think we've had gay lead couple. I know we've had some same sex couples that are supporting even strong supporting characters. But i don't think we've had a lead main couple yet. I don't think so. Lifetime did hallmark is like dipping. Their toe in real slow. I wanna give more credit to the people who watch these shows. I don't want to think that homework is countered to their audience de now but they are yes and believe me. There are people in my life. Who feel who are very upset with hallmark. Not people that. I enjoy but people know who are upset about the direction. Hallmark is taking their movies and i think at some point i think at some point hallmark is going to have to say this is the world we live in. We're going to represent real people and be okay with losing people who are homophobic and reading and like is that the audience that you want at some point. You're gonna have to look at what the bottom line means to you. Yeah we're here for your homework. We want that okay now. Let's get to your favorite scene. Which was my least favorite scene. I can't my eight no mountain high enough now. Okay when they just showed him doing it. I thought oh my god. This is adorable. This is the music montage. That i love that i want from every movie but then when she jumped in i was like super cringe the entire time. It went like too long for me and i can't believe i'm going to say this. They used carrots for the microphone. And it was far too phallic. I am twelve years old. So i'm sorry. They needed to use a wooden spoon. Just was like i'm lacking uncomfortable with. It doesn't seem agree that it was long. And i was thinking like i wonder if they needed to make this to fill this. Also in the opening scene the opening moment where it's like the opening notes of the song or plank. Did it feel like it played more than actually does in the song he has ever going to get to the words of this song. Are we just getting instrumental totally. Because i would like came in to sing the first line. I was like wait. That's one of the first line goes. Why didn't they play it to a minute. They're not gonna use the actual longer is gonna get some like in mental of him dancing. I did think it went long. I wondered what they were going to do with those carrots afterwards. Like are we going to throw them away. Not in that sense but yes. I agree that is where my mind went. They were not going to be used for consumption that they were gonna go into the trash. I wasn't being dirty. That's what you were suggesting. No you know dancing around a restaurant. Kitchen just fills unsafe for me to mention hops. Up on the i was like the minute you put your. But where hoping on a service supposed to be sanitary. I agree it would. I don't know i. I was so uncomfortable by the entire thing. With the exception of his very solo part. At the beginning i was admittedly focused on him in that dancing. He had more of the moves than treat. She says so. I'm not china shit all over these movies and the actors and actresses. She's just it was a mismatch casting. That's what i'm going back to. I don't think that she's like a terrible accident. She was fine. I just think it was a mess. Matching casting that questions potholes and things we need to discuss. Okay i got a few shocker. I've a big question. How can a restaurant afford to be closed on valentine's day. How much are these people paying for this speed dating program that allows them to just say like not going to be open on valentine's day. We're gonna let you have your project. She should have. Did the project like at lunchtime and then the restaurant could have opened for dinner time or pre valentine's day right. You wanna meet. Somebody be four valentine's day. There's also a lot of times like There's a lot of continuity issues. I have not gotten any timing issues. But the tortilla making night. Clara is at basketball which we know from our previous scene ends. It may be nine o'clock. What time are they making tortillas at the restaurant is completely closed and empty of people or is this the restaurant that they only open occasionally. Yeah see that's stuff drives me crazy too So this movie takes place in seattle during early february. I don't think they were dressed for it. It's a lot colder rainier in seattle during this time of year agree like she's in her beautiful jackets which i love every movie when they have the beautiful jackets on and they had that kid mowing the lawn before school like no no shiny day. Yeah not happening. There's a there's a day in the movie in the morning. The dad comes into the classroom and is upset with her in the afternoon. She and her friend out running and then at night. They're like at pta meeting and she's back in her work clothes. I was like wait a minute. Yeah is happening here when she because and the only reason i knew it was the same day. She's like oh. He came to my classroom this morning. They didn't need that this morning to make that. Pta meeting believable could have been any night just thought. How many hours do you have in your and why would you change back into your work. Clothes for pd meeting. I also noticed in that scene to either in the morning. Her hair was pulled back. And then at the t. pta meeting it was down continuity. I those those things. Drive me crazy and i don't know why not him like a dog. You know what i mean. I just notice this crap another thing. I actually posted this on. Our girls gone hallmark instigating this morning. Cinna hearts i login up. isn't it actual candy napho. Which is why. It's so weird that they zoom in on the name of them over and over again several time. Yes that was so bizarre right. And i swear. They were using hershey kisses in their candidate names. Oh probably but didn't sponsorship. So they're not gonna. There is a line there. They said that. The pta candy grams made enough money for field trips for the rest of the year. I was like holy crap. What are they chart meghan. I have both been integral parts of the pta and her children's respective schools. You don't make that much money. Bought all that candy and all of this applies plus with their selling them for plus. How big is this school. No fields are expensive. The buses are expensive. My kids are paying. No shit forty five dollars a kid for field trips last year which blew my mind. I don't know that seems like a lot for royal drip used to be like eight dollars. Yeah anyway. I'm just saying no. I don't believe it also who i know like he. David and his ex bought her a new laptop. Who bought a desk and a chair. They bought them with the fed raising money. That's supposed to go to school. But now the teachers getting a new desk and chair. I knew she makes a joke about it at the very beginning. But then there at the awards ceremony or whatever and they just like push out this desk and push out this chair. We buy you this furniture. Like how did you get it. They're like what you were going to win. Yeah exactly and then they give her this laptop. It's a refurbished laptop with a bow on it. It's not like in a box. It's not a brand new. So bizarre it was. I did think. I will admit though. I did enjoy that moment as much as tearing it apart right now i did think it was a sweet moment where they get for those things as unbelievable as i think it is. Yeah i mean it's because your husband does a similar program his own school no yes and he's been on the receiving end of surprise gifts like he was a helpful. Honda teacher appreciation week recipient which was up on experience. So like you know. I cry when i see teachers. Teachers need to be recognized. I absolutely sam behind that. I just thought it was. So i did and getting sense like where did the money come from the school supposed to get up by like no no. The teacher gets a new desks oregon. You can't have the computer saying that you don't know all right. Is there anything else at all. I have time to rate it. I'm a little nervous. I want you to go i. I'm giving movie two and a half stars. Wow perfectly average serviceable fine. What did you give me hills wedding. Three stars three meteo. I loved beverly hills in comparison to this movie i gave this one and a half stars their characters i mean not the characters but they acting the casting just killed it for me all right so next week. We have mixed up the mediterranean featuring jeremy jordan not all right and sorry. I had a A posted a poll on our instagram stories and the vast majority of people even though the majority were to annoy fans did not remember that line which i was disappointed because it's such a burned in memory. They're not true. Nine hundred zero fans. And you know you can search at hashtag on instagram jimmy jordan. Alright things come up. Sadly that clip does not come out. It just does not exist anymore. It's got it somewhere on the internet if you missed it. Yesterday we published an interview with julia. Sherman wolf the writer of taking a shot at love among many other hallmark. Release it with love. Give it a listen. She was an absolute delight to talk to you and we're looking forward to more movies from her. Of course you can catch our regular podcast. Every tuesday and while you're here if you would leave a rating or review we would absolutely love it if you enjoy us and until next time have a great week bye bye.

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Cyberstalked: Cari Lea Farver

True Crime Brewery

1:56:20 hr | 9 months ago

Cyberstalked: Cari Lea Farver

"True Crime contains disturbing content related to real light crimes. Medical Information is opinion based on facts of a crime and should not be interpreted as medical advice or treatment listener discretion is advised. Well come true crime brewery I'm Jill and I'm Dick. In November of Two Thousand Twelve Carrie, Leigh Farber, just up and left everything behind her new boyfriend her job and even her son this was not like Kerry who was a responsible worker a reliable friend and devoted mom then an alarming string of texts from Carey's phone set everyone on edge carries new boyfriend Dave. KROUPA. Was surprised by her abrupt change of heart. But it only known her for about two weeks. After carry mistress son's high school graduation and her own father's funeral her mother Nancy was certain that the person communicating with her by text was not her daughter. Join us at the quiet and for cyber stalked carry farber as carries family members worried about her dave crew PA believed that she was stalking him and his on again off again lover Liz Golyer David Liz reported break INS arson and death threats as obscene messages from carries phone and social media accounts poured in. After a three year time period, thousands of these messages were received not until the past of a sociopathic killer was exposed and digital forensics were utilized was the truth behind carries disappearance brought into the light. Or Beard today is a Nice Nebraska beer called Malaysia Twat from Nebraska Brewing Company. Didn't I knew French did you? Knew a let off. So this is a strong. Ale. To eleven point three percent alcohol by volume. Definitely one, we're, GONNA. SIP The pretty beer clear golden yellow, big thick wait head that retained well left a ladder lace taste of fruit some wine. And the old the Funky nece you know that Sorta tart sour stuff I really enjoy those flavors. Agreed. Beer yeah yeah when you taste and Scott some fruit. peppery spice, and then later in the tasty get more wine and oak from the barrel it's dry beer very good beer and again we're gonNA sit this one. Okay. Let's open it up. All right. So I'm already here at the quiet and I'm way ahead he has come on are read enough for to move. Did we now now like two feet behind me you're? Okay why don't you go ahead and start this? This is very kind of a complex story, but I tried to put it together as simply as I could. So we might have to do a lot of talking to understand exactly what was happening but very complex just a crazy story. I would second that this woman is just over the top yes. Did not carry and not carry right let's start. We'll do some family background because we like to do that we do so carries parents were Nancy and denny. And they fell in love with Nancy's just nineteen years old and then he was twenty one. They got married in nineteen seventy then in nineteen, seventy, two, their son Adam was born. Followed by Carey in nineteen seventy four. Nancy chose Adams name. So then he was to choose Carrie's name. Nancy wanted to name their daughter Kelly. Yes but after Kerry, well, yeah I guess Danny had seen this young girl singer on the Johnny Carson show I think it was really liked her thought she was talented and like the name Kerry. But then he changed the spelling to see a R. I Which I guess. Kind of. Plagued Carey in her youth because everyone was always misspelling her name. You gotta be careful with that. Right you do and this is before there were so many made up spellings like there are now me now you know that they're going to have special spellings of the kids names a lot of the time whatever whatever name you pick. Yeah exactly. The double E. The L. G. H. You know. All different variations, but anyway, Kerry had a hard time with people. Either mispronouncing or misspelling her name because of that. These were young kids when they got married they didn't have a lot of money at least early on. Danny work two jobs. And then finally he got a good paying position as an insurance actuary. This folks actually make pretty good money. Nancy was a skilled secretary. She is always organized and efficient. But like a lot of young marriages, it didn't last. So and Adam was four and can carry with eighteen months. Old Appearance got divorced. Adam maintain a close relationship with his father. Kerry was young when the divorce happened. So she was closer to her mother. But then he was a good father and carry visited him often as she got older. In nineteen seventy nine Nancy had been on her own for three years and it had been nine years since she had spoken to her high school sweetheart mark rainy. Nancy and mark were children together and their parents were really good friends. So in their parents would get together when they were kids Nancy and mark would play together along with their siblings. Now, once she was in junior high nancy began to notice mark romantically and he was one year ahead of her in school, but they continued to see each other. Nancy was shy and mark was the class clown and they were a couple from the time. She was fourteen until she completed high school. They used to go out on double dates go to concerts dances the whole nine yards. Yard then she met Denny and dump them right or are they broken up before I know of it was that simple? I mean, they attended different colleges. So mark was an art major in Missouri and Nancy went to business school in des, Moines Iowa, and that's where she met Denny. So I wouldn't say she dumped mark. You know that kind of thing happens that does yeah. So by the summer of Nineteen seventy-nine, Nancy had been a single mom for a while. And when she is invited to a friend's wedding back in her hometown of Macedonia. She is pretty excited. She learned mark was going to be there. So that sounds like we're gonNA maybe rekindle the Highschool Romance I'll absolutely. Now Mark For his part was happy to see her there and found out that she was single. So at the wedding reception it was obvious that they were still attracted to each other mark asked her out. And the rest was history. Yeah exactly. They got married in nineteen eighty one and he was a teacher. So she was happy to see how well he was able to get along with her kids. He taught drama and art. But then he made a career change because he needed to make more money and he ended up as a salesman but he was surprised that he kind of enjoyed the work and he ended up keeping that job for thirty years. -mergency must elected. Yeah. They're mom would say that Kerry was very different from her brother in many ways where Adam was kind of clingy and a bit of a Momma's boy carey was independent and she just loved adventure by kindergarten. It was easy to see that she was really smart to. She was the only one in her class who knew how to read. Then, at age six, carry helped her teacher by reading books to the other students and she was put into a gifted and talented class. But even in that class she remained at the top. So really bright. No entertains curry continued to do well in school, but she did have a rebellious phase. When she was sixteen years old she and a girlfriend went out drinking with some boys and she ended up staying out all night didn't get home until the next morning. While she and Nancy had their arguments, they always made up. She went away to college and Kansas. She got good grades. But she also took the time to meet people go to parties and do what college kids do. Yes. A pretty well rounded. She had boyfriends in college but none of them lasted very long. She seemed to get bored pretty easily. She get tired of a boy and break up with him after a few weeks or a couple of months but you know she often remained friends with them. So she was personable Carey met frank her son Max's father when she was at the University of Kansas after they decided to break up, she discovered that she was pregnant. So they decided they'd make an effort to remain a couple and parent together but predictably didn't work out. Carrie was really worried about how she was going to support herself in a baby. So she enrolled in a special six month computer programming course. So it was a quick chorus but if you were bright, you could really get a good job with that certificate. So her grandparents paid the tuition for her and she did end up getting a very good paying job just weeks after she gave birth. So frank lived far away and he wasn't involved disappearance at all really. But fortunately MECs head to GRANDPA's in his life. So he had some male role models. He did carries twenty three years old with a baby, but she was a strong woman and a loving mother over the years. Carry got married and divorced twice. She changed jobs several times. But she continued to be devoted to her son Max. She had moved to Topeka for couple of. Years. But she missed having a family nearby. So she moved back to Macedonia. In Two thousand twelve, she was living near her mother and working with computers. In a job, she really liked one day. She had to take her two thousand, five Ford explorer in for repairs and she felt a strong attraction to David Kupa. Who is the mechanic working on her car day? Was a thirty four year old who had recently ended a relationship with the mother of his two children. Yes and at this point, Carey was thirty seven. So a couple years older than him. So Dave was dating, but he was clear with the women he saw that he wasn't interested in monogamous committed relationship. His twelve year relationship with Amy Flora had ended recently leaving him to enjoy his freedom while he figured out what he wanted to do with the rest of his life. Amy Dave had tried to work things out, but they were just really different. and. The big thing was that amy had expected they would eventually get married, which is reasonable. They had two children together. But he never proposed. And after twelve years, amy decided she needed to move on. So they did remain pretty friendly and they parented together pretty well trying to make it easy on the kids. But it was over after twelve years. And in that summer of twenty twelve Dave head regular visitation with his children. But he was otherwise all alone. He was living in an apartment in a large Omaha apartment complex and that was near the shop where he was a manager hiatt tire. So he was thirty four, but he was lonely. He'd been out of the dating scene since he was in his early twenties. So he had no idea where to meet women and that's where online dating came in. He started going on match dot com. Okay. Cupid e harmony, and plenty of fish and I guess primarily, he liked plenty of fish and that's where he met most of the women he dated. So. This is a free membership with over fourteen million people visiting the site daily. Each profile has a photo online name and any information the person wants to share basically, but there's no background checks. Sued Wild West kind of yeah. So Dave was able to just put in a location, an age range and other characteristics that he wanted in a woman and all these matches would pop up this. This sounds like tinder. A little bit. Yeah. Not The heavens recollection of tinder right. But online. You know there's just no way of knowing if people are telling you the truth, there's no background checks. But you know I guess most of the inaccuracies are harmless like wait looks. Maybe. Money. Sure. But sometimes, members are married lots of times. They use a photo that's like ten years old or you know pretend they're making more money stuff like that. But you know especially as a woman I, think you need to be cautious. Oh, there's no question. So they've understood the women who were cautious would agree to meet only and very public place, and during daylight hours, David heard horror stories of women being attacked by men. They met online for his own safety dave that while some women had jealous ex-boyfriends, he felt like he was able to take care of himself, which is this kind of fooling yourself because if they have a jealous ex boyfriend who comes in with a gun, how you going to take care of yourself who's GonNa do some kung-fu or something i? Guess you're not a Dave Fan we'll just say that now I can asshole. Don't be sorry. So once Dave decided to meet women. There is no shortage of them. David. Meet them for coffee or lunch. And if they're attracted to each other. Might end up having sex, but Dave always made it clear beforehand that he was not interested in a relationship. He didn't want to have sex with a large number of women. But he didn't want a monogamous relationship either. Well I think in Dave's ideal world he was just going to date like a handful of attractive fund women. Who wouldn't make any demands on them? So is that too much to ask I don't know apparently no. I mean I don't think it's really what most women want to hear. No this is Dave's world right? Dave Swirl. So he wanted a woman that would be free like he was and have no problem playing the field and you know there were a few there but most women wanted more and that's not surprising. Of course, right? Well, you have to think back to his earlier relationship he's living with this woman for twelve years. They have two children, but he won't propose here. How can marriage too much of a commitment if you have children together, that's more of a commitment or it is. Yet saves. Whole Outlook is kind of annoying. Very annoying. Here's uses looking at it like he viewed his relationship. Yeah. No strings attached. Sure. I'm living with this woman for a dozen years ahead to kids with her. But we're not really together. Yeah. I can leave anytime. I want so. Heck with him and I don't think that everyone who doesn't get married but has a family together is like that but he certainly seemed that way. Or watching the dateline episode just What I've read about an I just don't have any good thoughts about dave he seems like he's stuck in adolescence or something while share about Lee. Just concede that he's not the worst person in the story. Oh sure. Yeah do that okay. So let me just talk a little bit about Dave's upbringing. A tiny bit. He grew up in Sioux Falls South Dakota and he was born in nineteen seventy six. He's the oldest of three boys and this family were southern Baptists. So they went to services on Wednesday and then twice on Sundays. Interestingly, enough neither Dave nor his brothers ever got married. and Dave was the only one who had any kids. But their parents were married for forty five years. So what did that marriage look like wondering wondering? Three brothers yeah. I just wonder if maybe there was something going on there that turn them off to getting married who knows but you know when Dave talked about his childhood, you just seemed to think it was a paradise everything was great. He said his parents rarely argued and they really encouraged him in his brother's interests supporting his playing football until he was injured and that was in his freshman year of high school he was injured now he wasn't good to consider playing in college, but he did have a small collection of trophies. But in the ninth grade, he broke his leg the night before the first game of the season and just out of sports altogether and rebelled. Grew out his hair started smoking cigarettes, and then after high school, he moved to Denver and he joined the National Guard. After, two years there he was discharged and there was something about them not paying him and he wouldn't show up. But Anyway, he was discharged and he decided to go to college and get an associate degree in automotive engineering because he was good with cars. It's a good idea. Yeah. Her betrayed. Absolutely. Now he was working in council bluffs Iowa when he met amy floor again, amy is his live-in wife. WHO's the mother was two children not a wife but yes. Live in girlfriend for twelve years in mother of his children. Live in. Okay. She was petite and soft spoken. They had a mutual attraction and they were pretty quickly a couple. Exclusively in two thousand, one, their daughter Callisto was born followed by a son they named trae in two thousand three. And when Dave got a promotion, the family moved to Madison Wisconsin but they didn't have any wedding plans. He never did not ever and Dave stance on getting married became the biggest issue that the couple had. Amy wanted a wedding and lifelong commitment they were living together and raising these two kids. But for some reason, Dave didn't want to get married. So this conflict grew over the years. As a young working couple, Amy Dave were really stressed over money a lot and they worked opposite shifts. So one of them could be with the children all the time. But that also made it. So they had no time alone together. So, they did stay in Wisconsin for about a decade but amy Mr Family and friends Beckon Iowa. So in fall of twenty eleven, they moved back to council bluffs and soon after that is when they split up. so that's when Dave moved into his apartment in Omaha and he had nothing with him but a basket of clothes in his computer. He was in Omaha with was about twenty minutes away from where his children were living. Council bluffs had cheaper housing, but he wanted to be closer to his job. So. What he was doing basically at that point in his life as he was working all day spending time with his kids and then he was pretty much alone in this bare bones apartment. So before long he was online dating. and. He did eventually meet a woman named Liz. So. This is one of the major protagonists in this story. Crazy woman pay close attention. So, Liz is about the same age as Dave. Maybe a little older, maybe a couple of years. This is slim had big breasts which Dave, really liked and long dark hair. The I met at a restaurant to talk and drink coffee. and Dave thought she was very attractive. Now, he hadn't been dating for very long. So pretty nervous about this date. and Liz came across to him. As very intense and sexy they both had kids around the same age. So they had something in common to talk about. David told, Liz how his long-term relationship had recently ended? And he wasn't looking for a serious relationship. Liz nodded said I understand. She was busy with their own kids she said, and she just opened her own business called Liz's housekeeping. Yes. So the to head a few coffee dates and he finally got up the nerve to kiss her he said on their fifth date then they had sex that same night and continued to hookup on a regular basis. Liz clearly liked him and he liked her but after a few weeks, he became restless. He was attracted to her at he definitely enjoyed the sex, but he didn't feel much of a mental or emotional connection between them. He said she was always really enthusiastic for the physical part of their relationship, but they didn't have much to talk about. Dave was fairly smart. He liked to read and he was interested in politics and Liz wasn't a reader. So, she wasn't really capable of discussing anything that interested him like current events even and even though he was leading this life is a mechanic he was a reader he did have you know an intellectual side. And if he ever did commit, he thought he would need a woman who could have some meaningful discussions with him. So. He did continue to pursue other women but he never hid that fact from lizzy always told her. That that's how it was and continued seeing her but obviously, she wanted more, she just wasn't admitting it. Will Yeah. His spouting all this crap about her how I like to read and I need someone to discuss things with I need a mental here. You don't like him. I'm sorry I'll start talking about. So. Just about a month into seeing each other list got quite clingy. She apparently wanted more than Dave was willing to give her. Dave told her that he enjoyed spending time with her but it was only casual sex friendship. He would never be your boyfriend. Well. That sounds like a good thing for Liz. Well, you now okay I. See what you're saying about what he's saying is very Dick Ish because if he doesn't WanNa have a commitment as soon as a woman seems like she wants to he should not be with her at all. He's kind of leading her along by continuing to have sex with her. Even though he knows she wants more. So way I look at it were sure look at their way to admit he keeps saying he was up front and he told her that but that's not how emotional work. Well and he's he's upfront entire that he doesn't act upon it. Well he says I'll continue having sex with you but that's it which isn't the way it's supposed to well because you're gonNA think that as long as. Close to him and having sex with him, there's a possibility of long-term relationship. That's the impression he's giving her right, right? Yeah. He's not really rejecting her totally. So she's being strung along and I I can see that okay. So I can see in that way I think he was you know kind of an idiot but if liz called an s to get together, he said he was up front you said well, I have a date with another woman and expected her to accept that. And she would try to see mine concerned but her behavior show that this was really bothering her. And a lot the lot laundry we did bother. Yes. Apparently more than anyone knew. Well, this is where we get into some of the games that started to be played. Yes. So Liz would begin showing up at Dave's apartment. Just, before he was ready to go out on a date I, don't know how she knew. I guess. He must've told her he's gone out on a date. But Liz would show up she would show up wanting sex, which he was happy to do with her always such a nice guy. Yeah. But. Then he noticed the pattern that was. Would show up and sexy clothing after he got home from work and have sex with him just before he went out as like, she is trying to wear him out. So that he was gonNA be less likely to sleep with his date. After he had been together with Liz. they you know he still young. And this predates sex didn't stop him from having sex with someone else later in the evening. Sure. But I think that should have been a sign right there that maybe you shouldn't see this woman anymore. He. Did say he encouraged lists to see other people and even warned her that she was wasting her time if she expected him to change. But. This said she couldn't date more than one man at a time. It just wasn't her thing besides she really liked Dave but her jealous side was very soon revealed. After, Dave would return from visits with his children. Liz would accuse him of sleeping with amy their mom. Well, that's probably not for out accusation and probably still was well, we don't know that. Knowing. How Dave operates from in this on now you know date okay. They've been like this. Well Liz became very passive aggressive. According to him she was nagging him. I don't like that word I. Think it's a little sexist, but that's what he said. So he broke up with her several times, but she'd always return and offer him sex and he would cave in and go along with it. So I'm sure it was really reluctantly that he did that when Liz was an obsessing over amy. Women Dave thought she was fun to be with then in. September two, thousand, twelve Liz insisted on talking about the direction of their relationship. She was reading his refusal to commit as a sign that he just couldn't show his true feelings and she wanted him to tell her how he really felt about her and not wanting to hurt her dave said, he told Liz that she was attractive any cared about her but then he said, I'm never going to make a commitment to you. So what Liz proposed was this idea of a four week temporary commitment to move their relationship forward and I guess she really pushed that he tried to ignore it for awhile but she was sending these long emotional emails and then he tried that it's not you. It's me thing to break up with her but she wasn't going to give up I guess. least that's the way he saw it. And then Dave mccarey. Your he met her the old fashioned way in person as we said earlier, she brought her car and for a minor repair and there is an instant attraction. Carey was tall confident and beautiful day felt like the attraction is mutual. But since he was at work and she was a customer, he didn't act on it. That's probably a good thing. You're. But two weeks later while he was on the plenty of fish website, he saw carry hit a profile on there. So he got excited any center a message hi I know you and carry wrote back and they had a short little friendly interaction. Then a couple of weeks later, Carey was back at the shop with her explorer and Dave went out to the parking lot to look at one of her car's windows that had been sticking. And they're they started chatting and had this real chemistry. So they ended up exchanging phone numbers. But you know when all this happening, he was still seeing lists. and. Maybe some other women who knows I'll? Share. Now he he and Liz went to a big Halloween party in October of two thousand, Twelve Lewis had made them togas out of white sheets. And she has so many take their picture as she was cuddling up to him the matching togas made them look like a real couple but Liz was disappointed again because his dave's attitude wasn't changing. He seemed more distracted than usual and she thought that he had another woman on his mind and we think he did we think he was really into carry at this point. Well at least in his mind while sure he was very interested in her room and three days after that party carrying Dave had their first state. They met an applebees. They had drinks and a great conversation and he found carry to be very witty. She made him laugh. He learned that she was a computer programmer, an expert coder which impressed him I'm always impressed with people who can code per it is she worked for West Corporation which was located less than a half a mile from Dave's apartment. And she lived in Macedonia Iowa with her now teenage son Max. So David enjoyed his time with cary but he was constantly distracted that night by a flurry of texts and phone calls from Liz. He tried to ignore it but then finally excused himself and called her back and Liz said that she left some things at his apartment that she really needed right now and she couldn't wait. So of course that was annoying, there's no reason why she suddenly needed to get her toothbrush and some pots and pans and a couple of t-shirts that she left at his apartment. So he told her that he was on a date and he couldn't drop everything and they do it another day. And he and cary ate dinner and then he invited carry back to his place. So carried drove herself and met David is apartment complex before they could even sit down though his phone began ringing and then the security doorbell buzzed in. That was loud. So they really couldn't ignore that buzzer. The Intercom was broken. So he had to go down to the building's front door and there was lists on the other side of the glass door, and now she was insisting that she needed her stuff right that very minute. and Dave said I have a date here and that's when she began to cry and said, you know you better let me and I need my stuff and just wouldn't let it go. So, think there's a sign there that this woman's not stable. You. Thank. You can call him a Dick. You know all you want, but there's something wrong with her clearly. There is an will learn more about that. Won't we? Yeah I. Guess Sort of his problem is he didn't recognize what he was dealing with their. Well, which might be hard to do he may or not have. He might also have been thinking to himself. I can get laid anytime. She wants to come over. Why would I get rid of her? Yeah. That's part of that is little P. Brain works it could be. So the Dave went back inside and explained his situation to carry and apologized. Now. He says a carry was understanding about the situation and laughed it off. She told Dave call me when everything straightened out. He walked out to the door. As they're leaving listed, Neva acknowledged carry. Then, Dave letter in they went up to his apartment and had an argument. Joe It looks to me like you've been wrapping up more gifts over the past month. Yeah. We've had a real uptick in subscribers to T. C. B.? Premium. I think it might be due to the added benefit of ad free versions of all of our shows that were offering now. So now Tigra grabbers get a bonus episode each month. And the free gift of their choice but they can even get weekly episodes without the ads. They deserve it. Our listeners are kind loyal and they send US excellent comments in case suggestions. Don't you think Oh, absolutely it's true. Our listeners are the best. No kidding. Thanks Tigers. Yea. If you haven't subscribed to the premium show and you're interested just dropped by Thai grabber dot com and it out, see what you think. A great idea. wiz wanted to stay and talk about the relationship but dave insisted get your stuff and leave. Yes said at that point? He shouldn't have seen her anymore. Really. nope. But we don't know if that would have really changed anything because she was definitely not right mental I. Don't think it would have. Because of her obsession with this but certainly didn't help did at note, right? So. It was only nine pm that night when Dave called Kerry after Lizard left his apartment and carry invited him out to her place. So he was really excited to go see her. This was about a forty five minute drive. and carry lived in a small two bedroom house she had purchased from her grandparents. So really charming little place and they had the whole place to themselves because her son was spending the night at his grandparents house. So Dave really liked carry right from the beginning. He thought she was really laid back beautiful, smart and funny. She. Also seemed really independent and self sufficient, which was really attractive to him. That was very different from other women he'd been with. So they began kissing on her couch and before things got any further carried stopped him and told him that she wasn't looking for commitment if they were going to have sex that's all it was. so He loved that. She had had several bad relationships and wasn't ready to get serious and she liked her freedom and didn't wanNA give it up. So that's like music to his ears harm. Sure. Must have thought he'd hit the mother lode or something. Absolutely. So they both wanted the same thing and certainly relief not to feel pressured. so not surprisingly Dave's ended up spending the night a carries. There are both busy with their kids in jobs, but they managed to see each other. Pretty, much every other day. Let's is pretty hot and heavy I. Think this is. A brand new relationship yeah neither one of them WanNA relationship is the funny part. Must have been good sex. Yeah. Maybe but still you know Liz wasn't gonNA give up now. No Way. On November first, she sent Dave along kind of incoherent email. It was urging Dave to talk about his feelings and she said she would never expect him to stop seeing other women and she didn't expect him to make a commitment to her but then less than twenty four hours later she sent an email with a totally new tone. This was very abrupt and biting. She was offended that he hadn't answered her earlier email. So, he just ignored that. which probably didn't make us happy probably not but according to Dave he and Carey were just getting along great sometime in the next week Liz called for more items that she'd left a Dave's place and he planned to just drop the stuff off. But he wasn't even in Liz's door when she came onto him and the ended up having sex right there, and then it loses place and I guess lists felt happy like she made him forget about Kerry but you know that only lasted for the duration of the sex, he still wanted to see Carey. So that wasn't changing anything or things changed and he really I just feel like it was irresponsible for him to sleep with our knowing how she feels about him. They've for his part. So the encounters fun. And that was it in his mind his relationship with Liz over. An assist last fling. Right. Got To tell Liz that. This differently though. November tenth she tried to set up a date with Dave. Now he turned her down. So she became more and more unhinged Lee Ya at this point she's totally obsessed with this guy. Totally. Yes. So I I'm going to take just a minute here to go into a little bit of Liz's history. Or think that's important because she really did have a history of on stable jealous behavior in her relationships. About, ten years before Dave Liz had been the very jealous ex girlfriend of a guy named Dirk roads. And Dirk began seeing a twenty two year old named Melissa Strom when Liz wasn't over dirk yet. In fact, at that point, she was obsessed with Dirk. Dirk had a two year old son named Peter. Who Melissa really began to? But Peters Mom Liz was a problem. So she had a kid with Dirk. They'd broken up and Liz is not dealing with it well. You're they were extensively sharing custody of Peter they were. Yes. So when Dirk met Liz still going by her real first name, which was Shana. and. She was already a single mother of a girl named Trina who was about to when she met Dirk. So it was only a short time after dirk began seeing Liz winless got pregnant by him. And they stayed together because of the baby. But Dirk would say that Liz was just constantly jealous and she would accuse dirk of infidelity on a regular basis even though he'd been faithful but he just couldn't take the possessiveness and that's the main reason they broke up. And after he moved out of Liz's house. Dirk Melissa. Whence Liz found out the dirk was seeing someone. She began showing up uninvited and unexpectedly. Dirk tried to be polite. He introduced Melissa Liz. But Liz was angry and hostile towards. Melissa? Yeah one day Melissa was at Dirks apartment while he was at work and someone begins banging on the apartment walls and this would turn out to be Liz. Throwing furniture and personal items that belong to irk at the apartment door. She knew Melissa was there because Melissa's car was in the lot. And before she left, she piled up so high that even the people on the door was blocked. So this incident had really terrified Melissa. Thinking that Liz's coming after her. and. She didn't know what all the loud banging was at first. So when she told Dirk about it, she was kind of you know crying and upset but he told, Melissa, she was overreacting. Jesus. Yeah he was just kind of. These. Guys are just not getting it. These not much better than Dave in that department where you don't have to raise the bar too high to be better than. Any well, anyway was very attentive father, but Liz would use that to manipulate him and Melissa could see that Liz Keyed Melissa's Mitsubishi Eclipse while at darks place and she'd keyed it so bad that it costs thirty, seven hundred dollars to repair. So this was more than a little scratch, your yeah. Then it was weird because Liz began to take a pharmacy tech course and that was Melissa's profession. Hurts Weird. Then Liz got extensions to make her hair long like Melissa. and. She bought a similar car Mitsubishi. Some Melissa thought. This was creepy. Dirk would just say Oh you're overreacting. Choose. So Melissa and Dirk eventually married. and. They did have a son together Liz never stopped stocking them. Until, they did divorce the marriage didn't last long and then several months after the divorce list stopped stocking. took. Awhile. She committed identity theft she purchased over five hundred dollars in cleaning supplies. Using a credit card that she had taken out and Melissa's name. This is used to start or housekeeping business. Remember she told Dave that that's what she is doing. Yeah, she she did kind of start it, but it never really took off and I don't think she worked very hard at it. She was too busy stocking people and in two thousand twelve as she was pursuing this relationship with Dave she was already in a relationship with another man at the time and this guy's name was Garrett Sloan and it seemed like she was just using the sky. So he had a pleasant suburban childhood but he also grew up with some obstacles he had purchased disease. So, he had to wear braces on his legs your that's a hip disorder. So not a good thing to have. You get arthritis nasty stuff. Well, he had uneven leg length and had surgery, but it only partially corrected it. So his experiences with the condition led him to earn his bachelor degree in Exercise Science, and once he began working in that field, he was really attracted to the computer technology and ended up becoming an IT specialist and he worked for pot. Awada. Me County. Garrett didn't have many girlfriends partly because he had a weight issue. But by September two thousand and ten, he had lost fifty pounds and his feeling pretty good about himself. So he posted his profile online and talked about his plan to continue lose any extra weight. And that's how he met Liz Online. Yeah about two years before she met. Dave on their first date losing Garrett watched a movie at his place. Liz was insulted the Garrett head made any moves on her and tried to have sex with her. Garrett found himself having to convince her that is just getting to know her and is trying to be a gentleman when they finally did become Intimate Caravan Liz to be kind of robotic and lacking passion. So this is really different from how she was with Dave, the way that he tells it. So I guess I'll I can get from that as she was just using. Garrett and she was really into Dave. And that's the only reason I can see that being an issue. She did show her jealous site with Garrett. But you know he had didn't have much experience any saw that as a sign that she cared about him. So he was kind of flattered fool he. In about two months into his relationship with Liz he was contacted on Yahoo Messenger by man who said he was listening boyfriend. So third guy and his name was Alan and he told Garrett that Liz still lived with him. She's a busy woman that Liz. So Garrett confronted lives, and of course, she denied everything to the point where he ended up apologizing to her and that's kind of our worked in this relationship. When he thought about it, he realized that he had never been to loses place. Also, another thing about Liz what she never show affection to him in front of other people. So most people didn't even know they were a couple. So he's definitely being used and seems to be few weeks later, Lucent Garrett a text telling him that she is moving back in with Alan. So exist saddened Garrett but he accepted it and he moved on. Then, just after the New Year. Liz Texted Garrett and asked to meet him for lunch and a talk, and at this restaurant this told him that Shia kicked Alan out and it was over for good. She said she missed and she wanted to try again. Right. But I mean, the whole pattern was just using him. She brought her sister and her children to Garrett's apartment building to use the pool, and then one day Garrett saw Liz her children and another man swimming in his apartment complexes pool. So enlists saw him. She had ignored him there and the next time Garrett spoke to her he was telling her how hurt he was by that behavior. But she turned it around on him. Saying that the guy she brought over was just a friend in what's your problem? You're too jealous. and He fell for that for a couple of years anyway. Your who did in June of two thousand, Twelve Garrett bought a house in council bluffs and he'd known Liz for almost two years by then and felt like they were getting along. And also, he didn't mind that she needed his financial help lot. so He'd give her money to cover her bills. He was very understanding that she was a struggling single mother and he was always there to Babysit for her too when she had to work nights Liz didn't tell Garrett any specifics about this cleaning business, but he accepted that night shifts were part of the deal. So Liz till Garrett that in addition to running your own business, she was taking classes to become a dental hygienist and working part time as a nurse. He didn't know where she worked never even bothered to ask I guess but just believed her. And despite all the our she was supposedly working, she was always short on money. But he thought he loved her and he was proud to be able to help her and that's the way it went for a while. You're now on July fourth twenty. Twelve. Garrett's noticing it loses losing interest in really seeming to be. In zero watching a fireworks Liz was texting with your mechanic. She told Garrett Oh it's just an innocent thing and he really wanted to believer. But. At the same time, it's hard to imagine Liz in her mechanic were texting for hours about car repairs. That's really I do that don't i. I mean you find a good mechanic? You don't WanNa. Lose and now and you WanNa talk to him for a few hours here there tore course and what she didn't tell Garrett of course is that she'd met this mechanic on a dating website and that she was sleeping with him. So Dave is a secret to Garrett and Garett is just as much of a secret to Dave. Today lists was really careful to present herself as this loyal girlfriend who just patiently waiting for him to realize that he was in love with her but that really wasn't who she was at all. No. In fact on October Twenty Six, twenty twelve when Liz was at that Halloween party with Dave in their togas Garrett was probably babysitting her kids. Yes should began to obsess over days relationship with Carrie. Garrett had no idea anything in their relationship was any different he continued to help with babysitting, giving her money and taking her and her kids have cast food joints. In the winter of two thousand, Twelve Garrett invited Liz to celebrate the holidays with his relatives but she wouldn't she had no interest in that. and. She didn't buy him a gift. He bought Christmas gifts for her and her children. Then on New Year's Day two thousand, Thirteen Garrett received a strange text from someone named. Carrie who said she was a friend of Liz. So things got very strange room of see how strange. Carey was on facebook with she received a friend request from someone named Sam Carter and she didn't recognize him. His photo was of an attractive fortyish man with dark hair and he was smiling wearing a suit. His profile said that he was from Kerry's hometown. Macedonia had a population of just over two hundred people also. So everyone knows everybody. Yeah and it was also out that he spelled Macedonia wrong with an E. instead of A. And when she looked at his post, though see photos of familiar places in Macedonia. But she didn't accept his friend request on November thirteenth she did send a private message. You know just saying, do I know you by this time Carey was spending several nights with Dave? And she was working on a project for work and Dave's apartment was super close inconvenient to her job. So her son Max was happy to spend some time with his grandma and she was able to skip the commute and get two hours off of her day. Once, the project was complete. She knew she'd have more time and she'd spend more time with her son going to his games and things. Sorted been two weeks since David Carey's first day and on. November. Thirteenth they got up early and Dave left for work at six twenty five. When he left carry was on her computer sitting on his couch working on her project she was still in her pajamas and she was smiling joking with him and they were both looking forward to spending that evening together when they both got home from work. In our carry didn't show up for work that morning and this confused her supervisor. For one thing carry was reliable and she always called issues going to be late. And in fact that very morning she had called in at six fifteen to give an update on the coding she'd completed. then. She planned to verify the work when she arrived and her co workers were waiting for. So I am the supervisor talks to her that very morning she says, here's what I've done. I'll be in surely to go over stuff but by mid morning is still no sign of carrying. So her supervisor called her. But Gutter voicemail. She left a message and she continued to try and reach carry all day. Carries Laptop live or facebook account at six, forty, two in the morning at nine, fifty, four, her phone log onto facebook and Dave Kroupa was unfunded. So. That was weird very, and then twenty minutes later Dave got a text and the message was really shocking. It came from carries phone and she s Dave if they could move in together and he said, no, know that's not in our plans but just seconds later he got a text beck saying fine, fuck you don't contact me again I hate you go way. So this is weird because when he left his apartment, she smiling everything's fine. And then she on friends among facebook and sends them that text and I think a smarter man would say something's not right here but he just took it at face value that it was carry doing that you're I guess he's not as smart as he thinks he is probably not. Well. When Dave, went home that evening from work everything was quiet and there was no trace of carried his apartment. The abrupt break-up was really hard to believe though carried seemed really reasonable and positive. So he was disappointed but then he tried to look on the bright side. You know they don't even seeing each other for two weeks and if that's what she was really like then he'd really dodged a bullet that's one way to look at it. Sure. So he just decided to feel relieved and not get caught up in any more dramatic relationships because Liz was already handful. This was more than a handful. Now at the same time, Nancy, who's carries mom hadn't heard from her daughter for two days now then she received a strange text extensively from her the text said that she's going to take a new job. This is quite puzzling to Nancy because carried said, she really loved the job she had. She'd been working hard to complete a project so she could enjoy a weekend with family members at her half brother John's wedding back. Max was going to be an usher in the wedding. And at the same time, her father Danny was dying of stomach cancer and the wedding had been moved up so he would be able to attend. So everybody knew this was gonna be the last time that all in though would be together as a family. Yes. So it was kind of a big deal that she be at that wedding very big deal. But after that Tuesday morning text, there was no more contact from Kerry. Nancy did call her over and over again and she wanted to know when Kerry would be picking up Max to drive them to Des Moines for the wedding. There was a rehearsal dinner Friday, and they plan to spend the night at a hotel. But when Friday came and there was still no word from Kerry they really didn't know what to think and Nancy was worried. And carries father was at the rehearsal dinner, but he is too ill to attend the wedding itself. CARRIES ABSENCE OF CERTAINLY DISTURBING And the family was hoping all the time that they were there that she would show up. Because Kerry was not the type of mom who would be out of touch with their child for more than a day. So people thought that something definitely was wrong yes. She missed the wedding and also she didn't show up for a friend's baby shower which she was supposed to host her. That's a tough one. Yeah. So that following Friday Nancy called the police report her missing and when the officer from the county sheriff showed up at Nancy's house. He really didn't share her degree of concern about Carey. So that was frustrating they pretty much thought Kerry was a grown woman who didn't have to check in with her mom. But Nancy do that carry win just leave her son behind. She knew of course, she doesn't have to check in with me, but she always has. So something's outright. Your will I and I think we've seen that police departments are taking this more seriously now that it's not just an automatic twenty, four hours, forty, eight hours whatever we'll share but this is only eight years ago. and. I think it was mishandled I. Mean it was really an extraordinarily long time before the police took her disappearance seriously and I guess that's because they were believing that she was communicating. Looking into carries facebook activity. They saw that Sam Carter had answered carries a message by saying that they had attended Iowa Western community college together. Notably Sam's grammar was as bad as spelling. Just. A week before Sam's friend requests carry had rejected a friend request from someone named Amber Mildew. An ambush photo was of a slim laud wearing big sunglasses. According to both facebook pages, amber and Sam were both from Macedonia but they both had spelled it incorrectly, they both had used an e instead of an egg. Yeah. So really weird. And everyone in Macedonia knew each other but no one knew Sam or amber. Interesting yes. So there's no real evidence that Kerry was endanger and her case turned out not to be a big priority for law enforcement she was treated as a missing person and her name was entered into the national database. So, this meant that if her driver's license was checked anywhere in the country. The results show her as a missing person. I'm sure there's not a high yield on that, right? Now I. Mean. You just have to happen to be pulled over I guess right? So while carries families worrying about her. Dave Kroupa is becoming afraid of her. Because within days of that text break-up, he began getting angry texts from carries phone. The messages had terrible grammar and spelling. And they focused on Liz calling her a fat ugly Hor. Carry, it seemed unfazed been lives had showed up at his apartment that first night. But now she seemed like this obsessive Jealous Person. So it was just weird. Yes. Shoes things don't add up do they now but Dave just seems kind of oblivious. So lose called Dave to tell him that his crazy ex was harassing her also. And she wanted to know how could have gotten her phone number and address. According to Liz carry it broken into her garage painted whore from Dave on a wall. And what does that even me? Weird thing. I don't know Dave had planned to see Liz again he said, but he felt obligated to meet with her to discuss this harassment which he felt kind of guilty about Liz, described the vandalism on her garage door and she also said that some checks had been taken. So she reported this to the Omaha Police Department. Then, Dave soon received an email from carry admitting to breaking into the garage. Then one of the check showed up in a photo that was texted to Nancy's phone from Carey's phone. And this check was made out to Kerry and signed by Liz's legal name. Shana, gullion. So the memo indicated that the check was for the purchase of carries bedroom furniture. and. What Kerry had sent a message about was she wanted Nancy to let the buyer come and pick up her furniture. So very convoluted, very convoluted. It is. So some of the furniture were antiques the carry head inherited from her distant relatives. Nancy, couldn't believe carry would sell it. She texted back that she needed to hear carries voice I. So she knew the texts was coming from her. By, this time. Is Pretty sure that it wasn't Carrie who's doing texting? Whoever it was lashed out after that until Nancy she assists to bed mother. Carrie would never have done that. And side from the Nastiness of the texts, the grammar was horrible. and carry was always meticulous about her grammar and language Skills Leon even punctuation. So. As time passed and Nancy talked to law enforcement more and more she told them that carry had a history of anxiety and that one doctor had diagnosed her with bipolar disorder. So, officer said they were familiar with the disorder and that people often stop taking their meds and had these kind of meltdowns. So they're kind of brushing it off again, and this was just impossible for Nancy to accept I mean, the idea was appealing in many ways because if Kerry had a mental breakdown, she was still a lot. But. Why wasn't Carrie calling and talking to her or her son? Nancy wondered if Carey was being held against her will and being forced to send these texts, I mean, maybe these grammatical errors were made on purpose kind of as a message to her family that something's wrong. Sure. Can Syria think that? Yeah, I mean we'll all these things are going through Nancy's mind because it's just so hard to understand, and of course, the whole family's just bereft. They are no contact with who they think is Carrie. If you tell someone who sends you a text, you know just call so I can hear your voice why wouldn't they? Yes Nancy did wonder about this guy that Kerry had been seeing an Omaha. She did know that his name was Dave. But she didn't know his last name and she didn't have any contact information. She certainly would have been shocked if she had been able to see the texts Dave had been receiving. Or to hear about the vandalism allegedly done by carry. Right because this is her daughter, she knows that she wouldn't do those things. Right, so we have two different law enforcement agencies in two different states doing two different investigations with neither one knowing the others case and I think sooner a big part of the reason why this took so damn long police in Iowa though it carried left on our own police. Nebraska, believe the break in at Liz's house had been an isolated incident. Deputy Randall Phillips of the Pot Awada Mickey Sheriff's Department. was assigned to the case, and this is just three days after Kerry had been reported missing. The first thing he did was send texts and call and left a message on her phone. To which he never responded when he interviewed her supervisor and Co Workers, they said that the less day they seen was Monday. The day before she disappeared. And at that time she'd given no indication anything was wrong or that she had planned to move away. So. If Kerry still headphones, she could be located by cellular tower pinks and police said narrowed her location down to an area of just a few blocks and they searched that area for her vehicle, the Ford Explorer, but had no luck so that picture of the check that carry had texted to her mom was looked into. and. It was a starter check with no name or address printed on it but the signature Shana Golyer was legible. So detectives went to Liz's house, and this was a rental where she had reduced rent under Section eight and when they learned that Liz carry in Davor in this love triangle that kind of made them Wanna speak to her. Absolutely. Lose told the detectives carry it blamed her for the up with Dave. And the checkbook had been stolen from her garage. When they went to talk to David Hi at tire, he told them about all of the texts that he'd been receiving. Yes. So at this point to police, it just seems like Carey is a stalker. And if carry was stocking, David Liz, she may have been hanging out near loses house. They recognize that it was possible that carry no longer was in possession of her phone but they thought it seemed really far fetched that someone would be impersonating her and sending these texts. So they made this poor conclusion that Kerry was jealous and behaving like a woman scorned and just kind of let it go at that for a while. But. After detectives left high tire, Deputy Phillips got a text from carries number. So this text read. I don't care about this missing person report, but I would really appreciate it. If you leave Dave Kroupa out of it, I will be leaving the state. My mother overreacted I've been to my house a few times. Doesn't Phillips. Wonder about this text how would carry no that he was investigating Will because he tried to call her and they left a message on her phone. Okay. Right Yep. I guess he kinda took it at face value, but to speak with her before anything was going to change. No kidding. So Phillips responded to Carrie's phone that if she was to be stopped by police, she would be held until the matter was settled her missing person report would not be removed from the database until investigators could verify that she was. Okay. Right and that meant speaking to her that's right. Carries phone responded Dave texted me and said, you had the sheriff at his work please stop talking to people have nothing left to say to anyone I want one person to go away for destroying everything for me. So this is really crazy stuff. No Kid who's ever writing this stuff is really not mentally well, no this is just kerner mushrooming into a whole bunch. Of different things. Yeah and it just seems like in some ways silly you know and just not believable. But basically, for Dave, the whole thing was just wearing on them and making him tired. Then one night as he sat alone watching TV he got a text from carries phone saying that she could see him in the chair in a blue shirt and this was accurate. So he was quite startled her this is. contemporaneous thing. Yes. Someone's watching it here. So he ran outside to look for, but the woods around the complex were really dense and unlit and he didn't find anybody. They're also incessant calls to his workplace that were threatening his job 'cause he wasn't working on the phone then his ex amy began to get threatening texts. Their kids were threatened. Dave wouldn't let them out of sight when they visited him. Yeah. But Dave started dating Liz again and they were kind of comforting each other. Because they were both being harassed. In sometimes when they were hanging out together, they would both receive an email at the same time. Liz's phone was usually across the room in her purse when this happened. Even. Though. Dave. Hadn't been the one to break up with Carrie protects began to take on this kind of romantic tone as if they were still a couple. And she repeatedly referred to Liz as whore but then she'd say she was really looking forward to seeing Dave again says just to his are more and more. Carry seem to continue. Being on facebook. Presence there. Anyway on November twenty first she announced she has moved to Kansas for a new job. Then on November twenty sixth, she referred to Davis her great Guy Dave hadn't seen her since the morning she sent him break-up texts. So the fact she was seeing them as a couple made her seem mentally ill and delusional well, sure while Nancy knew that either someone was impersonating her daughter or carry had really lost her mind. So, Nancy and MACs were really worried and confused Nancy knew that carry loved her son. But if she was alive, she definitely wasn't in her right mind. So Nancy made this difficult decision to go to the court to get guardianship of Max. And if Kerry returned and she was okay, the guardianship could be reversed. It's a good move by her. Yeah. I mean she was kind of afraid that if carried did have a breakdown, she might pick him up and he could be in danger. Right? So on January six, two, thousand, thirteen. Nancy logged onto facebook and so new message from carry. This was a new page created her name. She apologized for missing her father's funeral. Then when Nancy Astor to call so she could hear voice. carries. Responses. Very. Defensive. She was angry but said, she would call it some time. She. said she was grateful that her mother had her son. But said that she could leave her son and move on with someone new. Very weird stuff certainly for any kind of mother say that. So, Nancy was pretty certain that this wasn't carry communicating with her. I mean after that, there was this bizarre posts that showed up on Carey's new facebook page, and it was a hand with a diamond engagement ring with the caption reading, Dave and I got engaged. Nancy could recognize that it wasn't carries hand. So this whole new facebook page was definitely the work of an impostor. So I feel like if police had just looked into that and checked IP addresses, they could have figured this out sooner instead of taking three years. Probably, on that same day that the ring picture was on the facebook page, Dave received an email from someone claiming to be Kerry. and. It read. You will do exactly as I say and then I will let her go. So there was a photo attached that showed a woman in a car trunk with duct tape over her mouth in her hands tied behind her back. He couldn't tell if it was Liz but the woman did have dark hair. and. There was another message saying you will dump Liz and you and I will start seeing each other again. So really bizarre but Dave was a little worried that maybe it was Liz in the picture. So to be sure he texted Liz, to find out and Liz was fine. then. On January eighth Dave who's driving through his apartment parking line and he noticed a vehicle buried in the snow. Does snow in Nebraska right absolutely. Doesn't it snow a lot there? Can. Look like the car had been driven several days turned out a black Ford explorer carries car. So, how is Kerry getting around without a car? Dave did know that it wasn't there since November when she disappeared. So called the police, they towed it to the Omaha Police Department impound lie, right? So November carried disappeared from his apartment and then he finds the car in the parking lot in January eighth but there was a big time period between then where no one knew where the car was then it was brought back there. have been brought back there. Yes. It's very strange. She'd been reported missing an Iowa, but she had actually disappeared in Nebraska. So her case was still being handled in two states in two counties and I really think that there continued to be some confusion because of that. Or no question coordinate things together, right? Yeah. So David, Liz showed investigators the abusive texts that were sent to them by this supposed stalker and they were thousands of messages for them to scrutinize. They signed waivers to the to the contents of their cell phones to be downloaded, and this meant that they could have access to both data that had been deleted and not deleted. But I don't think Liz knew that the deleted stuff could be found and brought out. Right? She's she's figuring probably. That if I deleted it, it's gone forever. I think so. Now. Lizard. Backed off asking Dave commitment. But then she began to ask him for one night a week devoted to her. She made Dave feel guilty for all. She was enduring from his ex girlfriend Kerry said Dave. Finally agreed that Wednesday nights would be a good time to set aside to be with Liz Nice in. Well. I guess he was just really impressed that she was being so loyal to him and they were kind of bonding over being harassed. Example how stupid this guy is? Well Yeah I don't know stupid stored but kind of oblivious to things and not real sharp on no human behavior at least. But you know he thinks well, Liz putting up with all this stuff for my ex girlfriend and she's still being loyal to me and she doesn't want commitment. She says so I don't know if he should buying everything she says, but he did think that the stocking had brought them closer together. And of course, that's what Liz wanted all along. Yep. So in that way, it's working for lists. Yeah. Was To this point. Yeah. So carries a Ford her explorer was thoroughly processed by a crime scene technician. No fingerprints on the exterior. An inside the vehicle is very clean. Clean to clean. In fact to cloth seats still had vacuum Markson. And there is a faint pink stand in the middle of the front passenger seat. There are very few things inside, but the rear cargo area had jumper cables and empty grocery bags. So it seemed that the entire car had been wiped down because there were no prints on the car itself, but there was a fingerprint fast on an empty mid container that had been left in the. Cup holder between the two front seats and I would imagine the person who was wiping down the interior of the car would have picked that up to clean underneath it, and then just didn't remember to wipe off the mint container the move. Well, yeah. So this print was scanned and entered into the system, but there was no match. So whoever's it was didn't have a criminal record. West Corp had depositor carries last paycheck into a checking account. There is a balance in this account, ten thousand dollars or so. With no withdraws being made. There were two transactions that were kind of suspicious. Her Debit Card had been used twice in November. Whence Walmart, and once at a dollar store both stores were in Omaha and both occurred over a week after carried last been seen. An alert had sent to carry and she hadn't responded. So the bank froze her debit card. And at the same time, carries family continued to get facebook messages from someone claiming to be carry, and that just seems really hurtful to me. I mean beyond whatever happened to carry the fact that someone would pretend to be her and harass her family like that is just awful. So removes Nancy told police that someone had stolen carries identity, but they didn't believe her then we get to April two, thousand, thirteen about five months after Kerry went missing. And Nancy, got a call from a man. WHO said he was Dave. KROUPA. and. He said Kerry had called him and she was at a homeless shelter in Omaha. So, Nancy was nervous but really excited by the possibility that her daughter might be alive and it just had a mental breakdown. So whatever was going on, she wanted to bring her home and help her get better. But she was smart enough not to mention it to carry son because she knew it could be a false alarm which it would turn out to be. So her husband mark was out of town and she got her brother Jeff to drive her to the shelter. Nancy called the police the agreed to meet her at the shelter. And once at the shelter, the police went inside and had nancy wait outside the a photo carey in with them. But then they came out of the shelter alone huge disappointment Carey had never been there nobody recognized her so it was all just some weird prank chester mother prank. And when Dave was contacted by the police, he denied that he had made that call. Then about a week later April twenty second mark rainy gave the police permission to search carries house. But nothing was found there to help them I mean remember she was in Omaha when she went missing. So nothing really happened at her house. So, then in May Maxine, a message to carries new facebook page. He was in agreement with his grandmother that page had likely been created by an impostor, but he wanted to be sure. So at first he messaged high. Hi. And the response was weird said, Hey, little man. Now. Carry it never called him little man. And he now fourteen year old. So suspicious, Steph. Max typed in three questions to give the person away to prove shoes carry. What is my. Middle Name. What was the name of our first boxer and who is my best friend growing up? There was no response the same time, the person who is sending these emails and stuff continue to do so. To Dave and Liz. And she began to threaten loses children. Calling them ugly just like their horror mother. Such seemed like Liz was the victim here. But the harassment also started going out to anyone who Dave dated. On May eighteenth the facebook imposter uploaded a new profile picture of Kerry and this was a photo of her with her dad that had been taken about a month before he died. And it had been taken from her previous real facebook page. So someone had taken that and started a new page. So. There is some kind of computer knowledge there. Certain amount seems to be that summer. The mother of Dave's Children Amy had a window broken with the brick. and Dave got threats against his own children then. One Night Dave was walking home from a local bar. I guess he'd had too much to drink to drive home. So when he was walking across the parking lot to his apartment building, he saw someone crawling between a car and the building. And he recognized that it was Liz. He didn't do anything about it. But when he sobered up the next day, he did ask her about it and she claimed that she'd been drunk and didn't know what she was doing. So I don't know why he would let that go but he did. Told you why. Then one night when his daughter Callisto stayed up late she said, she saw a ghost in the house and she threw a shoe at it. The figure had retreated. So at the time Dave Dismiss, this story, his daughter just having an overactive imagination. But when he looked back on this, he'd thinking know could have been in his apartment. certainly could have been. Yes. Now that summer of two, thousand thirteen. Davis continuing to deal with stocker at the same time is getting more and more tired of Liz because she was nagging him more than ever and she has more jealous than ever. She kept insinuating. That they were sleeping with amy, the mother whose kids. In Beckmann Dave for started seeing Liz amy was also seeing a new guy in Amy's boyfriend drove her to pick up the kids at Dave's apartment. So when she called Dave to let him know he told her that Liz was there and amy was happy about that because now they could all meet each other and she wanted to know the woman who would be around her kits and Dave got along fine with Amy's new boyfriend but Liz was very hostile. She wouldn't even shake amy's hand she just glared at her so the kids didn't like Liz either but amy told the kids you need to be respectful to Liz because your dad likes her and she's Your Dad's girlfriend. So even amy is seeing it as more of a relationship. Yes. Well, it's the whole plan, right? Yeah. Yeah. Late in the night on August sixteenth two, thousand thirteen. Liz set on fire. The Fire Department was notified in the morning about house fire. They arrived in about five minutes. But the fire already burned out. Liz, was in the front. Yard. Carreno Renault people in the house but her pets, two dogs a cat and snake died in the fire. There were two suspicious things about the fire that we noticed right away. When was that? There was a guest cannon living room floor. Well. That's a giveaway. That's never a good sign is and there was evidence at the fire hit originated in multiple places. and they're also two catches damage by fire. But they were not close enough to each other. So the fire hadn't spread from one to another. So classic arson sounds like but Liz told the fire investigator about this jealous woman who'd been stalking her so she's really trying to lead them to think that Kerry, did this. and. She told them that she'd been working with the police to try and help catch carry. According to Liz carry had started the fire in an effort to murder her children. She believed she said, she had proof in the form of a threatening email and she showed them the email. It ended up that there were six separate areas identified where the fire had originated. So it was officially classified as arson. Dave was at work when Liz called him to tell him about the fire and he felt guilty and came to comfort her. So they got back together again spending their Wednesdays together, Birkin the routine at now Dave didn't know was that lizard been about to be a victim from that house it's a section eight rental. And she was moving into Garrett's house remember the Chubby guy she was using never lost weight. A little bit but I think he was still a little heavy anyway that doesn't matter but she's using that man a nice guy it sounds like. Right enlisted until Dave, the new address was she claims she was afraid Kerry would find out where she and her kids were Dave. Didn't know much about Garrett he didn't even know that he was actually Liz's boyfriend. Oh, not at all. She didn't want him to know that she didn't want anyone to know that. But by the end of August she was living in Garrett's basement and he said she rarely came out of the basement and she was just a real slob he babysat for her and he fed her kids and did all the stuff. But when she bought groceries or Cook, she wouldn't include him. So, he started to wonder if she was even working anymore because she never left to go to work. She just went out on Wednesday nights and she was often dressed up not wearing scrubs or whatever. So it was weird. So I, think he's kind of catching on that. She's not being honest with him. Slowly, Garrett had been getting messages from named carry since the beginning of two thousand thirteen. She was flirting with him and she was pretending to be LIZ'S FRIEND In late January. This mentioned Garrett that she was being harassed. But she wasn't specific about this. And then Garrett was contacted by the sheriff's Office for an interview. Right. So now we have Kerry supposedly contacting Dave Liz eight me and now Garrett, but being flirtatious with Garrett. So, this is all just some discombobulated crazy plot. router and Weirder, but Gareth was employed by the county. So it was odd win detectives asked him personal questions. They learned that he was in a relationship with Liz when they saw photo of Garrett on her phone data that they'd pulled up and they told gear at the photo had been labeled fat ass by Liz. So this was shocking and pretty painful for him. Right? He cares about her. Emmy thought she occurred about him. Yeah. But apparently, not at all. Then he learned that Liz was being harassed because she was dating this Guy Dave Kroupa. The mechanic as he knew him and detectives believed that listen Dave had given Garrett's contact information to carry trying to get carrying Garrett to become a couple. To get her to stop harassing them now if you can follow that. That's a tough one. Okay but detectives think that Liz and Dave took Garrett's contact information and sent it to their stocker who they said was Kerry. And are trying to pawn her off on Garrett. So leave them alone the idea of Liz plotting with another man against him was really painful for Garrett to absorb though. And that wasn't what was happening anyway Dave wasn't doing that. He wasn't. But certainly could have been Liz trying to get Garrett to like this person named Carey. I don't know. It's just weird. So Garrett confronted. Liz. I she denied everything and Garett ended up apologizing to her once again. It, occurred to Garrett that maybe the detectives had misled him to try and throw often get information from. That's kind of naive he was very naive but you know like I said he hadn't had a lot of experience with women and he was super shy and Liz was very manipulative I. mean she took manipulation to a whole new level for sure. So she was sending phony emails to Dave from Garrett claiming that Garrett was involved with Kerry and asking if they wanted to double date. Solicit hope that these emails were going to convince. Dave that Kerry was still alive I guess. In Dave showed no signs of doubting that carry was alive and she was the stocker. So, Liz Liz's definitely full Dave at least. And such a long time had passed since curious family had seen her they were completely convinced that the texts and messages they were receiving had not been written by Kerry your now in the spring of two thousand fifteen? New Detectives were assigned to carries case. And! TO AVOID TUNNEL VISION One of the detectives worked as if carry was still alive. And the other work the case is murder case. I was certainly beginning to look like she wasn't alive. She had withdrawn any of her money. She had used any of our credit cards or debit cards. Then the big question was well who sending all these texts. Why would carries killer personality for three years? I usually female victims are killed by an intimate partner or a family member so that certainly made Dave a primary person of interest. But as he was eliminated from Peo- I status the focus turn to Liz. And as they read emails and texts, Liz's obsession with day became more evident police found the from the two thousand, thirteen kidnapping hoax and the metadata on the phone showed it had been taken with an LG phone identical to the one Liz owned right. so that was the email that was sent with a picture of a woman who looked like Liz bound in the trunk of car. or it could have been the back of the explorer actually. On on December fifth of two thousand fifteen. Liz made a nine one one call from a deserted park. And this was dark creepy place at night it had to Omelette let parking lots. It was at six, forty, one pm but in December, it's pretty dark by then. And Liz was crying and she said I've been shot in the leg. She said that the assailant was a female who shot a couple of times but only hit her once. She was shot once in the thigh, but the bullet had hit the bone or any major blood vessels. So she was apparently lucky in that way. So. Liz said she'd been sitting on a bench about one hundred yards from her car when she was shot then she seemed to come to this realization all the sudden. It was amy flora she said Amy shot me. And she told a detective that amy had only appeared in yelled at her. So you like fucking Dave and then shatter ran off into the night. So. This is some story. Isn't it and to think you're GONNA get away with it is just idiotic and crazy. So what was her reason for being in this dark creepy place at night? Yeah. Good question. Anyway. So, Liz gets rushed to the hospital. Amy Sitting at home on her couch playing games on her IPAD, and she heard noises outside somebody is obviously outside her door. She called it who is it? Police, and she opened the door. She was confronted by three officers with guns that'll get your attention on it. Certainly, it would be terrifying. The police told Ab that lists had been shot and that she said, Abe, was the shooter. Ab was terrified but she couldn't help but laugh a bit. I. Mean it was crazy. She hated guns and the idea that she would have shot anyone just would not be believed by anyone who knew her anyway she'd been home for hours with their children and she agreed to let the police search her home. An officer called the hospital to let officers there. No that it didn't appear that amy was the shooter and when they told this to Liz, she said, well, it had sounded like, amy. Then, Liz Call Garrett to tell him she'd been shot. In Garrett had been getting suspicious of Liz and getting more and more concerned. She told him she was just going to. Walmart. So what was she doing in the dark part? But Liz asked him to come to the hospital. He said, well, no, I'm not bringing the kids there. So he called Dirk. And had dirk pick up the kids. Then Garrett did go to the hospital by himself. Garrett asked Liz if the shooting had something to do with Carrie and Dave has that's all he'd been hearing about through texts. Liz cried and didn't answer and she really couldn't give any good reason why she was at that Park. So Garrett you know naive maybe a little slow on the uptake, but he had finally figured that something bad's going on with lists. He'd been more than patient but now he wanted out of the relationship finally. List asked him to pick up some of her things and bring them to her in the hospital. She wanted a tablet to play games on. But when Garrett got to the house, he couldn't find the charger for it because remember she was quite a Slob. He finally got the charger from under her bed but was really shocked because he saw computer under there that had been stolen from his home in a burglary two years earlier. So it seems that Liz had staged burglary of his home. Yes, it does. So, this is good evidence for Garrett to start figuring out what's going on. Yeah. Just get the hell away from her Yup. Dave also is shocked when he heard about Liz's shooting. He went to see Liz but she didn't mention it amy had been the shooter. 'EM, US at the police station, and she agreed to take a polygraph. But she failed that. She had assumed wrongfully that if she told the truth, the politics would prove it but she was so nervous that she probably failed because their blood pressure and breathing rate were so elevated. Yeah, anything I could read about it. I think there's like an eighty to ninety percent accuracy on a polygraph. So ten to twenty percent, wrong I. Can certainly see why it isn't allowed in court. Kidding and despite her failing that test, she was quickly ruled out as a suspect. Her neighbors could verify that she'd been at home and when they showed up at her home, they'd touch the hood of her car. It was cold. So her car hadn't been driven recently. Back in two thousand thirteen, what they call a logical download loses phone had only retrieved existing data. But now they did a complete physical download and they found incriminating evidence that Liz had thought was irretrievable from her phone. One thing this had done was she used an APP called texting. and she tied it fake email accounts that she'd set up and Carrie's name. She used this account to send hundreds of threats to Dave in herself. And she was actually able schedule a messages to be sent ahead of time. So she could put in, I want this threatening message sent to my phone in Dave's phone at nine thirty knowing that she'll be sitting watching TV with David that time. So He's GonNa think there's no way that list could have done it right right. This way she could just sit on the couch and the message would pop up on their phones and she could just be an innocent victim. Produce. Sophisticated. Some of the things she did worse sophisticated. And some things were stupid. You're detectives got warrants for facebook Yahoo Google. Okay. Cupid twitter and a few other sites and they checked. Ip addresses. The emails associated with those and the dates when these accounts were made. So list probably had no idea that detectives were learning about her web of lies because she'd used proxy servers to conceal her Ip address and VPN's with our virtual private networks that will make it look like her device was tied to a remote computer. So those are all things that were pretty tricky. There were twenty thousand emails at least that had to be looked at. And then they also reprocess carries Ford Explorer. In an effort to locate late and blood. However no no evidence was found. Eliza story about being shot changed a little bit each time she told it. When one version she had seen a truck in the parking lot. Then in another version, she saw people walking around on the trail before the shooter showed up. With, said, she had been shot while sitting on a bench then she said she'd been on the ground. And the Council Bluffs Police Department and the county sheriff investigators. agree that Lizard Likely Shot. Herself. They got a warrant and they put a GPS tracker on. Loses car. then. They had it set up so that if her vehicle Gardner Amy's apartment complex, they would receive text alerts. Wow. Well Yeah. At this point, they're figuring out that Liz is posing his carry and probably did something to carry but now they're afraid she's going to do something to me. They think by telling them that amy shot her she's trying to set amy up as carries killer. Sure. The GPS tracker actually alerted the police many times each day because Liz would drive through a parking lot but she drive away. If. She'd stopped there for more than a minute officers were to rushed to the scene. Liz was called into the police station for an interview on December fourteenth two thousand fifteen. The detective explained to her that he was working on a missing persons case and that some remains had been found. said that they were waiting on an ID but that they believed the remains belong to carry leaf carver detectives had made this up in the hopes of getting information from Liz. So wasn't true. But now at least the investigation is starting to go in the right direction. It took a hell of a long time certainly did. This was as she had met Kerry. And she told him about the encounter, a Dave's apartment. She said that carry walked out as she was walking in and carry it called her a bitch. And this is the only timeless said she'd ever seen carry. Then she suggested to the police at amy could be the real stalker. The detective said, he hoped to build a case against amy. But. He didn't yet have enough evidence. So. He Asks Liz. If she had any evidence of threatening statements from Amy, please share them with the police. And guess what they're setting her up here. So four days after liz forwarded an email to the detective claiming to have received it for Mamie the subject line was I shot you. I guess that's pretty direct not subtle and the e mail read I shot you list to make sure Dave stayed away from you. I got rid of the gun. Looks like the police have been arrested me no, one has proved that it was me. So this is really stupid from someone who was pretty tricky with the computers. This is just so obvious. Not Super Clever. She'd fallen right into their trap really she confessed while pretending to be amy. But. The detective from the sheriff's Office wasn't investigating the shooting they were interested in carries murder. So they told lists, they needed specific carries murder to build their case against amy when of course, they're actually building their case against lists. Because they know, amy didn't do any of this birthright, right? That December Twentieth Liz forwarded. Email to the detective, and in this one, amy was giving details about Kerry's murder. So isn't that convenient? Yeah. Well, you know we know what the police are looking for. So I'm GonNa take care of this. Yeah. Let's give it off but this was a long rambling email. I'll just give you the highlights. So it said when I met Crazy Carey, she would not stop talking about Dave she tried to attack me but I attacked her with a knife. I, stabbed her three to four times in the stomach. Then I took her out and burned her I stuffed her body into a garbage can and it ended up in a dumpster. I will never admit this to Dave or the police. Dave will always take care of me and protect me so I will never go to jail. So I can just imagine the detectives were really happy to see this. Yes. They really encouraged Liz to share more details about the murder. And they're thinking you know a lot of this is probably true. It's probably true of what Liz did to carry probably. Yeah. No. So to get her going they told her don't tell Dave ABC killer but of course, she couldn't wait to tell Dave that because she's jealous of amy she wants to get rid of her to. She does. So then indeed, January of two thousand Sixteen Dave called the detectives. Asking about the secrets Lizard told him about amy so you're right this couldn't wait to talk to Dave. Now she told him right away and the the detective told Dave to avoid Liz cashews dangerous. Well. Yeah Dave. Knew that amy didn't do this. Liz been telling Dave that amy was dangerous. But the idea that amy could hurt anyone just couldn't happen. He knew that the detectives met with Dave and they explained that Liz was responsible for everything all of that harassment. And they couldn't tell him all the details but they told him that lives was behind carries disappearance, and now they were really worried that list would hurt amy or the children. So at the detectives requests Dave moved in with amy and the children. And this was all part of the plan to push Liz to become completely unglued. On February first of two thousand, sixteen Liz was super upset. She called the detective in tears. She. It. Looks like the only person who benefits is her first amy she gets to shoot somebody kill another person and move in with Dave. She went into why they hadn't arrested amy yet. So that's really weird. She gets to shoot somebody kill another person and move in with Dave as if while moving in with Dave is the big prize, the prize raise, it just shows so much craziness. Your then there amaury mill confessions from amy purportedly showed up and the emails describe carries, for Tattoos. And the Interior her home. Yet it in two months since carries Ford explorer had been searched. So now the police removed the front seats and peeled back the upholstery because remember there was that pink stain row the passenger seat when you pulled the upholstery off, had this large red stain that had saturated the foam. And did react to the Blue Star spray? So they were able to get some of carries hair from her mom and they swabbed carry son's cheek for DNA. and. They were able to figure out that the blood was carries. So now we definitely have a homicide. And thing that's worrisome. A little bit is that she's out there they haven't arrested her. It's very scary because she would definitely kill amy in a heartbeat. Infect February Dave was napping on amy's couch when Iraq came flying through the dining room window. The GPS LIZ's car placed her there at the same. Leah remember they had it. So it would balart and let them know if she stopped at ABC's place. So Liz was arrested she pled guilty. and was released on bond. This is the worry among investigators about how a rage was escalating or seem to be escalating, and it was entirely possible that she could kill again. We'll absolutely and she was willing to sacrifice her pets. We've tissue Dow pretty horrible I. CAn't Imagine. Liz's new apartment was search when she left for work in the morning and they took every electronic item including several cell phones. Also. They found a video camera that had belonged to carry that had been missing from her home. One of the cell phones proved to have been used to call Kerry's mother in April of two, thousand thirteen. So Liz had been the one to call Nancy and tell her that Kerry was in a homeless shelter Liz had an APP that could change her voice. So she would sound like a man and she'd said she was Dave. Lizard used Garrett's Internet and Wifi, and her activity was linked to the impersonations of Kerry and Amy. And a picture was found of the interior of carries car, and this picture was from December two, thousand twelve. So just weeks after carried disappeared. and. This was while the explorer was supposedly missing. So why would she have been able to take a picture of carries car? If carries car was missing? Why indeed. So Liz was arrested at her job and this is for an unpaid traffic ticket. She was taken in with a detective for interrogation and they're asking her questions about Carrie. When asked us? She'd ever been in carries cars. She said No. That's the detective explained to her about finding or fingerprint on this min container and carries car. Then he explained to her about cellphone and WIFI records. Yet carries phone was located to have been at Liz's home after she went missing. So the detective told her that they could prove that she'd been impersonating both Kerry and amy. And after being confronted with this mountain of evidence, really Liz stop talking she wanted a lawyer Gruden idea but detectives believe that carry had been attacked in the car the bloodstain was there. But, they had no body no murder weapon Liz had left this. Digital trail though which showed her locations and it even proved premeditation on her part. So an arrest warrant was issued on December twenty, second two, thousand, sixteen and six officers showed up at Liz's and surprised her while she was still in bed. Took her down to the station booked her. She waved her right to a jury trial. So that meant that a judge who's GonNa decide on the verdict. Dave group attorney tablet from storage that contain an S. D. Card with multiple photos deleted. This carded one time been in Liz's phone. And as you scroll through the photos on it, you could see pictures of business children's selfish and when very strange photo disappear to be a close up of a tattoo on foot. So they requested a photo from Kerry's mother. And discovered that carries tattoo match the one in the photograph the. Forensic pathologist. Dr Michelle. Elif studied the photo and determined that the foot was in a state of decomposition. So it seemed that lists had taken this photo as kind of a six souvenir. The. Photo of this lifeless foot though proved that Kerry was no longer alive she had been murdered. Nebraska had reinstated the death penalty in two thousand sixteen. But Liz wasn't a candidate for it. Her trump began on May tenth two, thousand seventeen where she was charged with first degree murder and second degree arson. Her motive was presented as her wanting Dave Kroupa and not letting any other woman get in the way. The state head thirty, two witnesses. The defense called zero. Liz Did have a new twenty, two year old boyfriend. Who for her trial clothing and he was willing to testify for her They didn't have anything to offer I mean at the time when Kerry was killed. This kid was still a teenager. Yes. She was like twice as age. Anthony Cava, a very skilled digital forensics expert. was probably the most important witness for the prosecution. He was very prepared. He prepared a powerpoint presentation illustrated's testimony and he really made it easy for lay people to understand. On the morning that carried disappeared someone had logged onto carries facebook page from Dave's apartment at six, forty two am remember. and carry had been on her computer when Dave left for work at six, twenty, five am. So it's totally reasonable to believe that Kerry had done that log in. But then at nine, fifty, four am. She logged in again and unfriendly Dave? So we know that that was done by Liz probably after she attacked Kerry. and. Kerry's computer has never been found. Cover was able also delay out loses steps. As she created the San Carter Amber Mariano. Fake facebook profiles. Leah. This is what showed premeditation because she's making up fake people to friend her to try and lure her. Yeah Sam Carter was a made up but the photo belonged to a doctor from the east coast. An amber mildew was a character lizard made up years earlier and had used that account many times for online deceptions right so this wasn't her first Rodeo certainly wasn't, and that's why I wanted to go back to dirk a little bit earlier because we just need to know that she has a history of this. This didn't just come out of the blue. No. So the closing arguments in her trial began on May twenty third. And the judge gave his verdict the next day he found Liz, guilty of killing Carey Lee Farber with premeditated malice and she was also found guilty on the arson. She was offered a plea deal if she would reveal the location of carries remains but continued to maintain her innocence. So that wasn't going to happen. She was sentenced to life in prison for the first degree murder and eighteen to twenty years for the are set. And she did appeal in two thousand, eighteen in that appeal was denied. AMAC's followed his mother's footsteps and studied computer programming coding and data science in College. Dave and amy continued to Co Parent. But they don't live together and they have not reunited as a couple. Liz's daughter Trina was put into foster care her son Peter Lives with his father dirk. Liz continues to maintain her innocence. Yeah and Kerry is just remembered by her family and friends is this loyal person who really had a bright future that was taken away by this evil person? In her remains have never been found now no, let's just fascinating. The depths that someone will go to put forth. This line is just amazing well absolutely, and I was just going to go into our sources and the book that I read about this. It's titled Tangled Web which is so appropriate because this is just Such a Web that she created. Eventually just kind of catching herself in it. Yes. It got too heavy too many lies placed on top of lies on top of Lisin. Well Yeah. Things crash down eventually well, and just the mental instability of Liz plus I mean Liz had no empathy. No compassion for people obviously. Know. And I'm just I'm thinking she shot herself then. Yeah. It didn't just grazer she shot herself in the leg she could hit a federal artery. Work done some real damage? She is willing to do anything for. Dave. It just amazing. So you don't understand what a prize Dave early is. Do you know? I guess, I, just don't see it I. Guess if you could see it through Liz's is you'd see a whole different guy probably would but detailed web the book I read was written by Leslie Rule Who. Is actually an rules daughter which I found fascinating. There's a foreword to the book where she talks about how she went into the police station and did some things with her mother I. think she was a photographer in the courtroom. So just fascinating. Some other sources are Omaha World News Online archives the Dateline episode you mentioned, which is titled Scorned and that Season Twenty six episode one and the narrator on it is my favorite Keith Morrison. So you might want to check it out. TACB's music was written and produced by Tristen Capelle. So why don't we do a little feedback and wrap things up we will have a voice mail in two emails and I amended dimmer shorten them a little bit because this episode is lasted for a while. So let's do the voicemail I. This is from Jamie. She has actually to case suggestions, but it's the second case that we're GONNA talk about. Agile Dick. This is Jamie in North Carolina I know you guys generally skip over all the frilly words people say on that I. Just do want to let you know that I appreciate your podcast in the research that goes into each episode and medical aspects and the different perspectives that you guys share. So thank you for that. So I've been rewatching episodes of. Mysteries during this pandemic where there's not a lot else to do that spark media call in with a couple of taste suggestions that I personally haven't heard any podcasts cover and look to hear your guys takes on it. I. There's had binion's death which probably was very well known at one time but I think there's a whole generation that's unaware the story. And Slick to mystery on whether he was murdered or whether he was overdose and there's a lot of intriguing the story including his family casino ownership and management and organized crime connection and buried treasure The second case that I had to suggest is Nancy Segal There's a lot of information on her in the FBI Archives Court records, and there's a book about her she was a gambling. Addict and Con Woman, who's taken advantage many people but she's most well known because she got away with murder and Risley's disposal of World War Two veteran Jack Hawkins for seven years. She financially drained him and she kept collecting social security checks in his name after his death but there's a lot more to it anyways thinks for the consideration and you guys are doing well in staying happy and healthy. Thanks. Thanks Jamie. Yes. Thanks B. We're doing okay we're hanging in here. So the had been in one. We've talked about and I imagined some at some point. We'll do it. How can he was a big poker player larger than Life Guy in Las Vegas I think he started the world series of poker or was involved anyway interesting story and and we'll get around to that the other one this Guy Jack Watkins who was killed by Nancy -Sego. She has his long history of. Attaching herself to people and something happens to them really anyway, this Guy Jack Watkins was killed. And his body got stuffed into a trunk. In nineteen ninety, six. They found the trunk, but he is body was identified for over seven years before they found out who he was and his companion who is Nancy who is also by the way thirty years his junior. was arrested tried and convicted of his murder. so that's a very truncated version of it, but it's a fascinating case and I think we might look into that some more. I always enjoy the story of con- person like that. That's interesting. I was thinking of watching those old unsolved mysteries and I probably will. We just been kind of busy watching while we just watched. I'll begun in the dark which was excellent. I thought. And I know I'm kind of late to the party here but it made me have this interest in the golden state killer case, and then I ended up watching a few different things on that. But yeah I would like to get unsolved mysteries. We will do that and I know as you mentioned the golden state killer. We're going to be doing that when at some point this whole DNA stuff is just fascinating I. Know I know it is. Yeah. It's said fascinating story. So, let's do a couple emails. Okay, we have an email from Laura and it's a case suggestion. Laura says, she loves the PODCAST Laura wondering if you would ever consider doing a podcast on the bike path rapist altea. Mayo. Sanchez from Buffalo New York. Would love to hear your take on it. Thanks and keep up the great work. So I don't know if I pronounced his first name correctly probably not. But. I've never heard of this case of you are never heard of it either and this go was active. Over thirty year period in his wow. He was found guilty of raping and murdering three women and he raped another ten to fifteen more. So. A and this is awful long time. To be active at these crimes before he got. Caught yes. Absolutely. So I thought that'd be an interesting to look into. Yeah, I would like to look into that one. So thanks Laura will do that and then we have a case suggestion from friend of the show Cindy. Cindy is one of our frequent flyers we love hearing from her. Yeah. She always has good cases in good good ideas for us. Yeah. She's great. So this one cindy wants us to look into the Margie Velma Barfield murders these occurred in North Carolina. She was sentenced to death and the death sentence was carried out. Is A book called death sentence by Jerry bledsoe. The tells of the case. Now, she says, I've read this book before I've downloaded it. So. In a nutshell, Margie Velma Barfield was confess murderer of six people. And her. Legacy as I guess, she is the first woman executed in the United States. When capital punishment was reinstituted and she was killed by lethal injection in nineteen eighty seven. So is this a serial killer thing or was this a mass killing? No serial killer? Well, that's rare a woman. Yes. Very rare. So thank you send it. Yeah. Thanks Cindy. We'll definitely read about that. Okay. That's all we have for feedback today. We'll have some more next week. and. We'll be back with another case. Yeah. I'm looking forward to that one too. Oh, this one just flabbergasted me. This one was interesting I hope not too confusing. There's so much to it. Tried to make it rose trying to pay close attention he kind of have to yeah. Then we'll be back next week with that's Sherri. Rasmussen case you're good. Let's a good one that were studying right now. Okay. Why hope everyone is keeping safe and taking care of yourselves and we'll see you next time at the quiet end. We'll be there by by our guys. In Dave's ideal world, he would date a handful of attractive and fund women who wouldn't. Wouldn't make the man. In his ideal world daily De, tractive and fund women. Who would take? You can't do it. We'll get to that I'll have plenty of time wine him.

Amy Dave Melissa Liz David Carey Kerry Nancy Dirk Melissa Max Carrie Macedonia amy Thirteen Garrett David Liz Golyer Dave Fan Dave Swirl Adam mark facebook Liz Online Danny
Worn Down from Lockdown - Still Untitled: The Adam Savage Project - 6/9/20

Still Untitled: The Adam Savage Project

34:30 min | 11 months ago

Worn Down from Lockdown - Still Untitled: The Adam Savage Project - 6/9/20

"Welcome to still untitled. Trust I'm well I've Adam and I'm norm. Hey, everybody. Hey! Will you're treating you? You're in a black void. Today I was looking forward to seeing what fancy background you WANNA buy. Okay along. Let's see we got. You know what it's. It's in this time. It's really the little things that little little kind of things that are that. Take me away from the day to day like. Background you're going to bring into our zoom call that I look forward to, and I'm being serious that what was that? Was that called? Neil degrasse Tyson's pajamas. The Star Scape. His Pajamas or I'm sure he wears one of those really long sleeping caps. This is one of the God. Really. This is one of the twenty fifth anniversary. Hubble images. Which one but I think it's the it's a Nebula of some kind. It's nebulous what the picture is actually. I have never. Lewis Well Duncan just well well as your figuring, you're scrolling through back on the people listening to audio, who can't see it? I. WanNa I WANNA, talk about well last week. You, of course. If you listen to the PODCAST, we We had a conversation here and on this is only a test about what's going on the world. And it was as if you've listened to what it was Kinda. Hard conversation for even us to talk through and verbalize and and I want to thank people for listening because the feedback was really encouraging. Feedback was like so encouraging I was really I really moved by Yeah. Our conversation built accepted and processed, and that's what we were doing. We were. We were situation for what it is and tempting to process it with each other, and of course we're all doing that with ourselves. But it, it is incumbent on us as all of us as citizens going through just really difficult time in the world. To process this stuff and talk honestly about it and I. Very I was very chuffed to use a British. Wonderful British word I was just to see the response to our conversation last week and there was. Always do all in agreement with us which I thought was not only expected, but also really welcome because even those of you out there who don't fully agree with US agree with you know certain things. Their responses. We're thoughtful. Paragraphs in paragraphs sharing hell, they think about it and how it may have changed, and you could see that you know. The the the range of opinions is too wide spectrum, and we're hopefully all at least engaging in a dialogue I. I was pleasantly surprised by the lack of lining, which is always nice in those kinds of conversations I also people sharing heartfelt. And challenging their preconceptions, which was all all you can ask for I think. In that kind of cut especially on Youtube I also got a ton of. A good book suggestions and then some resources we're talking to kids about what's going on. which is one of the things I had asked at the end of the show. Yeah, Pop Up more and more to will, it's funny. I ended up just. We record the Monday last week and I talked. Talk my daughter on Monday evening because the JOE is out because. You couldn't not talk about it based on what was going on. We're talking about school in your conference calls and stuff like that and We. Just I just explained what was. Hey, we link isolate. What was going on to the best like I didn't open? It didn't simplify things and she was like. Oh! I knew things were. Bad for people you know, but I didn't realize in, and we had a good conversation about so you know the other thing that happened after our podcast last week was last Wednesday. We hit you San Francisco had a massive, massive and super peaceful protest. That started here in the mission and moved through the streets and ended at the police station. And I spent about two hours in the middle of that protests. I don't know if you guys attended, but it was. Really moving and really amazing just as one note. I wanted to point out like everyone's been saying. What about Cova transmission, and I can only speak to the protests that I was in, but here in the bay area there was not a sick, the only face not covered with with a mask, was young, African American up on a horse in the middle of eighteenth and Dolores Street. Street but besides that every human I could see was wearing a mask in two hours is spent in this dense crowd. I brushed against maybe three people. That's how assiduously the crowd was maintaining a distance as the time as being super unified, it was it was a beautiful experience to be part of in just as covert as a pandemic health crisis. You know this very much. Reality and the institutional racism that we're talking about. Is Health crisis as well well to be honest? I it will go down in history in protests, history as one of the great self owns of all cell phones that to to battle protesters peacefully protesting police brutality. The police broke out a whole bunch of eighty. I mean yeah, every single one of those videos of people getting shot or pelted with pepper, spray or Whatever, whatever warner dispersal. Reporters getting whacked with shields. All of that illustrates the exact point that people are there for. It's engendering this like we were talking about with the podcast, a set of really really important conversations where I think. Culturally, the overton window is shifting in the in in a way that I am hopeful about. Jeff. It also brings to light that the type of dialogue. We send social media and we talked about last week. How social media as much as it's a tool to propagate the sugar radiation? And facilitate conversation to some extent, the the vary. By nature the the short form. format of it. doesn't allow for a lot of context to be shared allows a lot of things be taken. In ways that they weren't meant to be taken. which way that conflict? It's fueled. It's the ultimate. Take Right. And you couple that with the fact that everyone can scupper social media to be the bubble that they want so it feeds them I mean, and these machines have been weaponized. To use a specific word, but purposefully have been weaponized deliver us, precisely what we want to see what what fulfills our world, no matter what it may in the platforms that give everyone of a platform of voice to post on as an account also makes these. Mixed everything feel more personal to you. Where if someone if we took a stand against racism, you know people feel like. If even if they don't want to take a, they're being called racists in in it makes the ability to criticism. brings that to light like the inability for people to to take criticism and take things very personally which happens in you know. It's amplifies basically all the kind of conflict avoidance. The ways that conflict rise up in day to day interactions in workplace. All of that just gets. multiplied. Yep Well. I mean and also find me the person who can take criticism easily under all circumstances I mean. We all, it's something that we all have to have to come to terms with over the course of our lives, and especially eight tenths and especially intense. There's there's hey. You could have done a better job on this report at work. And then there's hey, maybe you're a racist. This whole time when you thought you were doing good things and those are two wildly different types of criticism, and it's really really hard to take serious criticism and and listen when somebody challenges deeply-held beliefs. Yep, so props to people who have a yes or are working for it as probably we all are. It's also a lot. Like we had a a conference car weekly meeting amongst. Them and. There's we have this every week. Have tested. The whole team gets together on zoom to chatted off into chat about the week. The catch up on our lives and talking about the business of the week. And what's going on, and it's Cetera this week. Man was so hilarious because it was like it was like the Brady bunch with the depression filter. Oh No. It was all like this was like? Those like you all look like I feel like yeah pretty much. And, that's because. Those little, there's so much and we're all internalizing it, and as active as we can be I, it's. It's very draining right Which is why we know that a lot of people tune in and watch what we make of as a way to kind of balance, what's going on in the world and their own lives and well right right right I, mean I very much appreciate that people feel like the videos that were put now are a safe space to kind of. Down regulate, and that that's a that feels important, right? That's I use. This does that. I watch for the same exact reason kind of get my head straighted. You know every day carries with it so every day carries with it so many weird hidden. Strange feelings and it was fascinating to see the whole tested team kind of feel downtrodden because. We're three months into this. We're. About the Twelfth Week. Am I right? That's right. Yeah, and you know. Despite the fact that I'm lucky enough to have this up the monotony of not doing anything, but coming here five days a week spending the weekends driving around the bay area with the dog. The monotony's to me and it's getting to everybody. Yeah Yeah. I think I hit one hundred. Ninety five days right now. Wow and It's. I mean it's funny. Because the things I really look forward to talking to you guys and talking to Brad on the other podcast, so I do regularly, and and and the moments it's it's funny. My grandmother used to tell stories about the blitz when I was a kid who she was seventeen when the Germans started bombing London on the rag, and I completely misunderstood those stories looking at them now because she she would tell a story about one of her neighbors on her block. You know scout everybody in the block working together to scrounge enough eggs and enough flour and sugar to make a wedding cake for somebody WHO's getting married. During during rationing. And I would, and then they'd all come together and come to the wedding, and they all have you know a literal bite sized piece of cake so that everybody can have as many people as possible to have a little bit of the cake. And you know when you're ten and you're hearing this story thinking Oh shit, that's terrible. Nobody got the cake and like this cake. Was this huge sacrifice but now? You think about the things that break up the monotony of the regular, and and make make things in, and not just to be clear the thing we're going through it. It's it's awful. It's tragic. TON OF PEOPLE WHO've died. I don't think it's the same as being bombed every every night by I. You know the fastest I. Yeah yeah, but but I. Don't think it's any anything close to a couple of, but I can understand that the value. And I thought this was I thought these stories. The point is I thought these stories of how horrible it was during the about. Privation and what they are stories of banding together and. They're wonderful stories about humanity finding ways to make the best of an awful situation so yet like Gina and my daughter decorated the hallway in our house. They do this thing at school every every year called Oceans Week where they study a different part of the ocean, and they usually decorate the entire school, and and they were like. Let's just decorate the hallway. I'll put some pictures on twitter later, but they may jellyfish out of Lake, paper lanterns, and papered the whole wall, and there's coral reefs, and there's died goals and the whole thing. Like every time I walk down the hallway. It makes me smile, so so do something ridiculous in your house is. On that front We hung a bunch of pictures in our basement and garage recently because we freed up a wall and one of the things that we did not move from. That is the seal that my son thing one. Painted and stapled together as a kind of paper pillow for exactly that project at Mira Loma at this point like. Twelve years ago. That's awesome. Yeah, I. Mean I hope that years down the line. We look at this time. It's going to be worn as seach changes actually happen of course, but we're also going to see the quarantine in lockdown period, which we don't know how long you know, we could be at the very beginning of this could be other year another year and a half two years until a vaccine, but a time the that fosters creativity, an introspection right on the and people being home and having more time themselves. Is One to make people more thoughtful. And to maybe want to see a lot of really cool creative output from it from now literature to different types of storytelling You know we've gone through the people improving their home video production phase. That was the first month we've gone through those the bread making phase. The I'm in the REDO. The house phase where like okay I'm like I'm so looking at the same walls, the same setup and literally this past weekend we spent two days literally cleaning reverse in the living room, just putting everything on the opposite side. Nothing is better I've listened. We did this over the past couple of years. We've done a major reorganized our house and frankly. What it's led. Do US always parts of Your House that you use, and then there's parts of your house to get relegated for storage, or maybe that project never finished one weekend. And the long, and the short of the reward that we did just meant that we're using every part of our house for using every corner of it, and it's really efficient, and we got a bunch of stuff out for donation, and that just felt really Cathartic. We did that early in the lockdown. It's taking stock. Taking stock of all the things you see accumulated, and you know just as. It's being introspective in a way that you relate to the place you live your. Home and to to be able to have space. Yeah, indeed it. It's It's funny. The paper towel paper towels become kind of a metaphor for for the way we've changed in our house. Because you know, we just use paper towels completely thoughtlessly, and and you need you need some. Wipe up three dots of water on the county. You're gotTA. Pay, swiping. And I'm like. Wow, what a Christ! What an Asshole! Katie Coleman at Org camp a few years ago, did it talk and she was telling us how like she, in Shell Shell Unger and we're talking about how they bathe, and how they use consumable stuff on the station and Katie said she would get a paper towel when she was on orbit and she would use it. She used one little tiny corner one day, and then she'd folded up and put it someplace, and this is blocking us at the next viper mouth when she was eating lunch, or whatever and then you know, then she would use every single piece of the. Amazing, an enduring the first. Two months of this when paper goods were in tight supply. I think we use tools, paper towels, and most of them were for things like you really don't WanNa use we got. We got a bunch of rags, and you know got some districts out and started using that stuff for more things than we were before. Really no change, no I mean. It meant that when we watched the towels every other day, there was a few more things in the washing machine using paper towel paper. Now Claw towels, cloth, Napkins and stuff like that. It's like it's little. Doesn't have an impact on anything. No, but it means I probably we both. My wife and I grew up in households in the seventy S. where paper towels were the napkins, not the smell. Like, and so we joked down the paper. Towels are fencing Napkins, we say. Is No. You got the select a size. Ones out there. They're perfect. They're exactly the right size face. Yep, exactly exactly life. That's that's. Good rag is. A precious thing? I mean it's. Like I feel in a weird mood great 'cause last week we were dressing very intense stuff that was going on, and this result is still going on still going every night. And With the video proof majority of the City Council of Minneapolis voting to call the police department, it feels like a glimmer of real hope. It feels like the possibility of genuine change and the number of people carefully explaining what fund the police means on twitter. that does not mean we are going to have any policemen. There are certainly some libertarians arguing for that, but I don't think anybody is seriously educating that as a real world solution to our problems, and that's not what the police means. It makes me again the discussion ill substantively. Slightly different and that feels hopeful it. On one hand I agree on the other hand I watched for four years half of the people on my feet, saying that when Colin Kaepernick, took a knee and Yaps, athletes took knees. They were being rude to the police or the flag, or whatever nonsense Republicans think and you know on the other hand it. It could not have been made more clear by everyone involved I know was about. Extrajudicial killings police violence, so you know. Totally totally true by the way. Have you guys seen John Oliver show this week. It's very good. I've never seen him this angry. Not even close and it's. It's rhetorically beautiful, and also Seth Meyers and his team who just got back? They all Colbert Seth Meyers took a week long break last week. They're back this week. And all of them are on fire. They are. They have dispensed with the idea of comedy. Not It's not that they're not funny. It's that they are speaking truth to power We've been watching tons of bear and seth this week, and it's just been amazing. William Own Chinchilla. Astronauts and we talked about last week. Was the SPACEX launch as Dragon. Their historical. Yes, and there was a whole delay two weeks ago. You're getting ready Adam to how to do A. livestream with discovery watching launch of course as well no now. Because! It was pushed the Saturday, and then it went off without a hitch launch work. Yeah, my Gosh! What's landed? Totally historic. Private. Prided Company got. Cooperation with NASA got to human beings into space. Completely amazing. It's. It's funny, we. I mean obviously that happened was nineteen eighty-one I. Remember sitting around at age six watching that my daughters about the same age we sat down and watched it. She was really really bored with the whole thing right up until the moment the rocket launch, and then it is the most cool thing in. Just, wait, you're about to see some really cool business. The videos much better now than it was when we were kid when I was a kid. I I've never seen a I. Mean I've never seen daytime. Rocket Launch I think the one I went for insight. Couple of years ago was through Hayes, and so we could hear it, but not see it, but I hear that. The brightness of it is something that you cannot really communicate. Even with video, just how bright that rocket is, even like the little ones that I've seen from far away because you know when you're in Florida at Disney, and they launched something from Canaveral. You can see it the minute after launch or whatever you still see them and it was it was. A tiny tiny point of dark and a lot of light as my remember now and. It was it was inspiring as a lesson in what human beings can do when they or collaboratively I, you know I I really I. I believe in that message. I believe I believe in exploration, and I believe in in in that Michigan just really exciting to see it to see at work super gratifying. You guys watching anything so anytime. We just spent the last couple of days burning through two of my favorite David admendment films. Heist. With Gene Hackman Sam Rockwell Rebecca pidgeon. Ricky Jay Delroy Lindo and Danny Devito as the villain wow heist. The great, it is a quadruple cross movie man, this it is. You gotTa pay close attention. It's a delightful and amazing. And then the next night we watched last night. We watched spartan with VAL kilmer Derek Luke. And Kristen Bell and a just both stunning intense wonderful action movies. I I remember absolutely loving Spartan, when I saw it and I don't think I sadly I. Don't remember a lot about it right now. Spartan is really worth your time. I have watched it probably half a dozen times as it came out in two thousand and four. smarten done in Ronin are a good Combo right. I can't give. The amendment. Ronin does Rosen commits this cardinal said which is. The. The I I've a friend who can't abide movies that have the title of the movie in the movie. Oh right where. Says, the title of were the usual suspects, your or and the biggest biggest of the most egregious example of this jagged edge, in which someone says jagged edge like six times in the course of the movie jagged edge. There must be super cut right we're. Ronin not only has an opening credit that says Ronin in feudal Japan, the Ronin masterless sambo point, and then twice in the movie you have someone say that exact phrase to someone else will in Japan. A Ronin was a masterless Samurai twice I'm sorry I know I'm getting a pitch, but roden drives me crazy for that. They're they're. Definitely already super cuts on youtube where. The movie! Ah, in the span of like two minutes. You're eighty one hundred movies new. The quote right starting. Nice. At least screened years ago, yeah. I feel like this is a screen segment. Maybe but I don't know what happens in the movie I. Always Turn Danny. Upon the. Name of the movie. So I, watched death race two thousand this weekend, because it's leaving criteria at the end of the month. Before. It was the luckiest thing I've seen in a really long time. But you know not good kind of interesting. It was originally thought to remain. The original. Yeah, the one just to be convinced David Carradine on or is it a kerosene? David Carey And but Sylvester stallone plays the baby face, so David carrying plays the anti hero and and semesters. Stallone plays the the baby face. Good guy inside the world. Who's rally, so the setup is? People have to there's there's a race every year and the people make the raise. They have to get points by killing pedestrians. People walking right. There's a budget icky horrible stuff goes with that. So carrying plays like the heavy use been maimed and injured, but has managed to win three times or something and sly stallone plays the always second-place face, good guy to David Carradine's bad guy, and it is it is it is exploitative and Schlocky and horrifying, but I'm glad I watched it so corman. It's Gorman. It is I. Think maybe the most Corman. I don't know for sure. Begin carrying of course famously took the role income. Fu that bruce leak created as a series and ESPN put out a two hour Bruce Lee documentary called me water over the weekend, which is really worth watching what in Crow? Being very young, it's one of those like Bruce. Louis forget how short of a career he actually had an America because it's so many in Hong Kong, and you pass away before enter. The dragon actually came out So that was part of the you know the legend but there's so much we we've seen all. All the footage you see, the screen tests the famous Green Hornet screen. Tests all. He had done but they even so they found some really old archival footage of his first few movies in Hong Kong solace. That's definitely while recommended criterion speaking of that. They just put out a pack of Jackie Chan movies. Going from like his old like late seventies stuff the hyena movies to ends with police story. Police Story to has also been releasing films by African. American directors for four free. Yes, yes. As part of the contributing to the National Discussion and You know everybody doing their part in those little little gestures a lot. Yeah, and then the other recommendation I wanNA give is finding the Amazon. Prime has just a wealth of documentaries that are like these kind of some are high quality summer, the more kickstarter like documentaries. One last night. Yes, this one's called waves. It is super high quality. It's directed by. A woman who's the professor of sound at USC I wanNA say but it basically is a history of sound films starting with the jazz singer time you heard. Talkie all the way to the creation of Dolby with you know apocalypse now and really profiles. Walter Merch and Ben Burtt. From how exciting! How? Rights from of traffic park and Pixar fame their careers, and basically they all came from that same school of like Walter Merch with Lucas, and for Coppola and an Ben Burtt was hired for Star Wars because Alzheimer's wasn't available, and Gary is from was hired for for Pixar because Ben Burtt wasn't available how they're all. Sound designers and sound editors yeah, but the whole spectrum of no fully to special effects audio dialogues eighty are. All that stuff? I've been watching a ton of videos online of this old Tony. WHO's a youtube maker very entertaining, very unassuming with some lots of really great. Great. Great Shop. Advice and actual execution of said shop advice been all the machine tools for me. That's I can't stop watching videos of machine tool operation. and I know that speaking of Youtube. Shoe shop work. We're doing Ortiz a collaboration. That's coming up in the coming months. with Andrew Kline whose who reached out to you after a livestream at their acuity a? Working with you on a workbench. Yes, someone was asking me about my bench, and I did a I talked about the bench, and I talked about making one and talked about various options that I understood I needed. Something and Andrew reached out and said I make these benches. Familiar with his vices, which are use a very have plex front with visible gears and two speeds for operating the so that you can operate fast for opening quickly and slow and there's. Some really cool linkages in there and Azru is in the middle of. Making me a workbench, and the the would for this workbench is monolithic. Actually it it it. It looks like it's GonNa be to giant slabs of Monolithic would boards. The whole thing is documenting. Include some links because he's doing like he does a lot of digital work just plans and stuff, and so we're watching it. Come together through Youtube and eventually get to the cave this you're thinking. Adam is going to be take the place of that primarily pencil. You have your lights attached to it is yes, it will live there. It will not roll. Because I have learned the limits of making things roll. I understand that current bench is cobbled beautiful. It's so beautiful, but like the amount of kind of things have been bootstrap to it from pastors to slam sin and lights. Off Big huge that. Enough it also turns out that my grandfather, who was a maker of my grandfather, was a surgeon who had home shop and did a lot of his own repair, and actually my grandfather, my grandfather had. A. Remote control for the volume on his television in the seventies that he built. And I am going to purchase a television and replicate this as one day build, so you guys could see the cleverness of my wonderful straight designed to, or was it like a puddle in mechanics, kid or something like that? This was not electric. It was entirely mechanical, okay and It was his invention entirely. Laugh your ass off when you see it anyway? my grandfather's workbench. were benchtop with two vices attached to it still exists and. It is now in a storage space in New York. Where at some point I will. I will get it out here. I like the fact that I will still have gripe others, expense but Edrich. Clients will be the central one in the in the in the space Hossam. That I think I'M GONNA have to get rid of one of these benches I don't know whether to live at tested or we will. I think we'll take it. Over, we'll figure it out. Yeah, whenever we get a chance to get back in there. But. Yeah, that's that's a lot I. mean there's so much going on. It's good to see you guys it. Wasn't. The world is waking up a little bit bit by bit. I mean we're not ready to start having tested everyone back in the space, but we're starting to talk about what the Best Practices the film industry is using It's fascinating. Shoot coming up in the next few months, and as it's approaching. It's a moving target of safety and we're. We're adjusting to that, but. Slowly, which is the right pace? Bigs are starting to vote. Yeah and Like I, said I the thing I. Hope that we come out of this. Whenever we come out of this is that people will be will have used that time wisely to be active. Either in activism, or to be more introspective or no really flex that creativity and learn a skill. Make something you know. Whatever do something make fight entropy. It's lovely to see you guys again. As you on the SEO next week. North on the site this week, getting excited one day bill that's going up probably tomorrow. That's actually something. We film back in February. Oh. Wait! With another Youtuber Has With numbers Oh. That's. Will I, think you guys are really enjoy that, and then of the last ones we did before is. We have three that we have not published yet from that and I think timing wise want get this Mike because you're. You're making so much stuff. And then I will also say I just uploaded three new where they built from last week. Insane the the thing devise that you showed us the podcast a month ago. Now that whole process that's going to be shown so and that's actually. Joey sent me the rough of that to do. Some very should for yes, I can't wait to see that one. It's a good yeah. It's a good project. Guys behind each other in the world. We'll see you later. Guys,

youtube Adam Sylvester stallone Bruce Lee Seth Meyers Neil degrasse Tyson Ben Burtt David Carradine Ronin Star Scape Hong Kong Lewis Andrew Kline Japan Ronin Katie Coleman twitter US
102: Stage 13 | Pau  Pau | Tour de France 2019

The Cycling Podcast

49:09 min | 1 year ago

102: Stage 13 | Pau Pau | Tour de France 2019

"You are listening to cycling PODCAST ADDED TO THE FANS in association with have fun fastest closing in awhile to the omb of cycling was character right and watch in twenty nineteen as a partner education fast and Kenyan sharam stage setting today will invoke well Francois which is down from the finish line here in Po- at the time trial finished <hes> only a few minutes ago and well. We're expecting Julian Phillips territory and yellow this evening but we weren't expecting him to extend his advantage over not just go thomas but everyone he's won the stage going Thomas in second place Thomas again conferred Rigoberta Iran Fourth Ricci v Steven Krause Reich six people Pino seven on everyone else really is counting their losses. Yeah I mean in you know I've always been a great fan of Judea and Philippe and starting to interview him free four years ago and you know probably looking ahead to great things but to that extent. I must admit you know it's it's surprising rising. Let's let's face it. We knew I was but I mean look I mean already you know WanNa stage took the Jersey was impressive throughout the season and then we thought that this was the the moment when an extraordinary season not come to an end but we thought to wane a little bit and no I've been we knew he could win time trials. I remember seeing in in a very difficult time trial mbui in Pyrenees a couple of years ago but on a coli like that against guideline guarant- Thomas or even Ritchie pause whatever it's a I in his career is never been at that level but the problem is not the question is now. Where is he going to stop? You Know Tomorrow Tamale. We all said we'll be the probably the real tests but now it's difficult to know seems to be unstoppable. It's it's really really the stunning surprising mesmerizing them in his money thick well. I would having a conversation today with someone who may have in having a conversation with other Felipe about his future plans and while the compensation went along the lines of if someone like Darren Thomas can win the Tour de France. Why can't Julian Felipe they have similar characteristics? We really have a race on our hands now not just in the sense of the Tour de France but in the sense that we must go and find our esteemed colleague Richard More where on we're on bottles judy this evening we've been instructed to pitch him a nice cold beer so we'll we'll head back to the press room and and Hook up with Richard the good thing whereas the finished like we were it of course to to talk to the two riders were the ones who are doing well to plunge to dive into the milius creme with the rest of the guys and get a couple of quotes that also it was it was fun opportunity to talk to the Tim Directors to the staff of <hes> some writers who didn't didn't do so well and more later on the podcasts well. It's all about lucky. He loved the scrum. You're frustrated rugby player. I think cross while I was in position a Steven Krause right because he came over the line having I put in a creditable performance unfortunately I got squashed in between all the T._v.. Cameras and then he didn't answer any questions in anything other than Dutch so that's how it goes. Sometimes your <hes> your lucky sometimes you fumble the ball and you're unlucky some trials I even worse for the riders because I mean they just finished a very very demanding efforts that harsh raises he's at he's at its limits and all of a sudden they see this kind of frock of of guys you know well well US criminal random like like all they were in the light and all of sudden the shadow of the press you know trips upon them and start asking questions. They don't even have time to breathe and questions are coming from all areas. It's a little bit silly. Let's face it. You know it's always difficult to talk to riders at the Finish Line when the just finished on tantrums even worse especially because I often don't know their result. They don't know how they've done so they're hearing for the first time whether they've had a good day or a bad day. Yes exactly it's sometimes you're the bringer of bad news. Sometimes we bring the the the the messenger of of the good news the journey asking the question themselves on no guy is I don't know what the positions are and and sometimes you have your very strange sometimes serve realistic interviews well from Soi from the heat and the hectic scrums of the finish line down in Po- We've retreated into the countryside in SAF castaway and we're back with Richard Moore who had a very relaxing relaxing afternoon working very hard on future right yeah Yeah Yeah Yeah No. I was focused really hard on the time-trial. I watched that I think it was a time trial wasn't we don't we don't know where he watched it but I mean you you you. You took on a little but of Suntan. Thank you are working on that today. That was a future project. I was working well to be fair. You went and covered like horse this morning Richmond early start all right A. Rod Rosenstein fifteen kilometers more or less from here on the on my Austin Cycles atoll folding bike which had very nice currently coming to town on today the covered course <hes> terrific race that will be the subject of our two zero on Monday. I say also the be about of course in the next episode of Psych can poke Femina Exxon then with without doing lots of unlock does pick step yeah the Whitney no other instances our common friend G._M.. Plato from Reuters at a scoop of sorts today talked to high ranked officials Aso and they told him they were working hard on a project of the women's race of the they didn't say would be to the front of the importance of the tour. I Yeah I think back to our event in Brussels when Richard You were sort of saying how I didn't really have a team of people looking women cycling seriously and and said P._k.. The Voice of Radio tour kind of stepped in and said Oh well actually they they have put together a team of people yet clem on us a US well Roy story in Lamont today crediting cycling podcast Femina in his story and the does seem to always get this around the time of course has always asked always asked questions about their plans for women's cycling so there's always a story or either that comes out to La course apart from the racist south but this is quite promising and am I like the idea of styling event set to the front something that's the way to go because today was a fantastic race and not see it was a great a great they've today for for fans in the course have women defied lops and then the men do <hes> one lap time trial. You know if you're if you're a roadside today at a fantastic team and the women's race was an absolute a cracker again for the second year in a row Mina voss was a winner with an incredible jump on the on the climb up the finish so often in the men's race chops well. We recapped the the winners from today stage down on the finish line Francois. Let's wrap up with the rest of the town of the attack stage thirteen twenty seven point two kilometers time-trial starting in Po- finishing impo- and while the early leader was shot Hager of team Sun web and then Casper screen or turning quickstep took over and he was leading for a long time we saw Steffen Kuehn Swiss time-trial champion crashed I saw him come through the finish with the side of his skin suit or ripped off so <hes> he managed to get the result the his talent probably would have merited and then Thomas again really scorching time and sat in the seat of the Finnish for much of the afternoon his compatriot the Belgian time trial champion and probably the favorite for today state or one of the favorites for today's. I state particularly after winning the time trial in Critique Doodo Fina last month what went out crashed out while it was a really nasty looking for still slightly unclear even from watching the TV pictures a couple of times exactly what happened but it appears that he caught the the advertising banner is attached to the side of the barrier. I talked to the Combo vs MMA p._R.. Guy At the finish and he was uncertain about exactly what had happened whether he's handled the barriers or whether the from from wheeler clip the feet of the barriers or whether he just got tangled up in the the advertising banner but a heavy phone an pretty nasty gash in his leg and taken to hospital an out of the race which had a real shame for Beinart oversee WANNA stage coach last week and had been going really well the battle I recapped down on the Finish Line Julian Felipe of course won the stage beat going Thomas by fourteen seconds to extend his lead in the Yellow Jersey on the one hundredth anniversary three of the Maya Joan which is being celebrated today and tonight in Po- three riders who lost time in crosswinds we go back to Iran Ritchie poor and Tibo Pino did very well and had they not lost that one minute forty Pino in Iran would be third and fourth overrule today that just shows you how costly that being caught out in those crosswinds words especially today really just highlights what good form there in the other big G C rider to do well was Henry. Massey is up to fourth overall behind Allah Philip. Thomas and Steven Krause like mass now also has the White Jersey but I suppose the day really focuses on the writers who lost significant time Yaacob Phu Sang lost a minute and seven egg Umbono. I mean we can talk about this but really surprised me. Losing one thirty six six naira container one fifty one Martin two zero six and Adam eight to eight Adam Yates didn't really stop at the finish just pedal straight off <hes> that signal to me disappointment especially when he sports director Matt White was talking about you know thirty being catastrophic this morning sure was white corrections corn and we've come so far through the tour without a significant corrections corner last night. I thought I spied to Matt Wilson the Mitch Albom Scott Sports Director. I am fact spectator Adolfo Ganger David Portland and <hes> sorry Matt David Get mixed up you do quite similar <hes> any mutual on Scott look but it's got a good look. Actually Sir Julian Dean no no it was legitimate and you can tell them apart anyway. Roman Day who really is becoming us at a footnote in this tool he was at two twenty six so the time trials are always the same on they we we kind of assess the damage in the gains at the end of the day and well. The question is now Julian. How far can he got the fastest closing in a while to the almost cycling Chris Character Ryden Watch in twenty nine thousand nine as a partner education I and Kenyan Sharam thank you very much indeed ktar headline sponsor Rafeh and reminded the the are working with the F. Education Asian? I produce some pines films with education. I the first one from the twitter fronts focuses on Rigoberta Iran. Who has you mentioned Lionel in a barnstorming performance ace each capable of a good time trial <hes> is Iran and <hes> road very well today indeed vehicle going past four on the on the stage? It's fantastic and when we look at results today there is that sense of regret isn't that these guys Iran poor for on piano and lost that time in crosswind stage because you look at how hard you work in a time trial that to gain a few seconds and you look at the one minute forty they lost or more and they are and thing that was completely needless because if nothing else time around especially when like today which was really testing course it's a real test of form and it's a real indicator of you know how people are going An- Allah Felipe is pigging Gary Thomas Enough attention on Olof elite performance buff. I think I could detect and guarantee Thomas at the finish a slight there was a sense that he didn't feel like he'd be able to get all out. I'm not that must ring faint alarm bells I think because he would certainly be an expected to be asleep to then. Perhaps we should be focusing as much on Karen. Thomas has on Allah Felipe after today. Yeah I mean I sit on the line. Were soaking relying on <hes>. How in a way I was shocked folks? I know it might be a strong word. I am by joining the elephant. Progression is very strange because in a way we anticipated you know is evolution from from promising young you know the almost first real they were pro season second in what flesh what on second year and so we were expecting him to become a great then classic specialist. We knew it would be doing all right on on one week stage races because he won tour of California. <hes> you know the the Pyrenees he was a real container two or three years ago. We need the winning a native time. Try to me so all these little things we knew he could do but what has been doing this season and since installers toured France is as we say in French Blue Hill is it up to burn the stages like is is is going is going up the ladder much quicker than we thought he would and and and I don't think there were many people including Allah Philippe himself you know who fought that every week we we believe that it would it would retain you know you keep the Jersey today but to win there in front of so the question is is allocated extraordinary or are is the other main contenders of the tour not esque good as we expected or if they really worked hard to be fitting in the third week of the tour in the Arctic because he was everybody's you know real care before the start of the tour the whatever the the answer to that the the result now is tomorrow to Molly. We all said Ashley is a real test and that's when Philippe Lose Jersey but I'm not convinced about it anymore. The last time the Frenchman wearing the Yellow Jersey wanted time toil on twitter fronts when nine hundred ninety four and it was off in only one tour so there's been lots of talk over at the finish line about even Garin Thomas's himself said if Allah Philippe keeps the same kind of legs <hes> is had so far is going to win the tool attempt to be surprised by the idea without it's very fanciful to to to imagine winning the tour but it's not there again yeah but but in a way but in a way when you look at Elephant Pass the Tour de France trump's performances he won the the Polka Dot Jersey last year is a better performance than the Franz in the past then Garin Thomas ad an ad before he won the tour himself so after ask the stunt you came out with their but Laura fee on Nineteen eighty-four. Did you say lots Frenchman to win in in wearing the Yellow Jersey okay so we know WanNa time. Tron eighty-five was not in the Yellow Jersey at that point. I can't remember no. I don't think so I'm pretty. I'm pretty sure what I'm saying the last the last Frenchman to win time-trial at all in to the front pissed off Mojo in two hundred one below last Russ want to to win it <hes> time travel with the Euro Jersey on nothing with the thing I'd say about Allah Philippe is he has pedigree on every kind of terrain and when when you look his season so far this season he won straughter Bianca he won milan-san remo he one flesh while on last year he won two mountain stages in tool. We know he can climb fast. My point prior to lap launched fee was whether he could climb in the sort of defensive role of having the Yellow Jersey in an holding the wheels when rather than being on the road on the attack trying to win a stage. You could almost say that elephant has done this one day version of what guarant- Thomas. Of Chris Bradley Wiggins made to sort of blueprint footsteps towards the Tour They WanNa came very close in Pyrenees or Romandie or the Dolphin and build towards the tour that way Allah Felipe has has been good since since the start of the year. I don't see the logic necessarily in saying that because he's one of those races in the spring the he's suddenly going to run out of juice now run out of gas. Now my concern would be how intensively he's raised this to front. So far I mean we're thirteen days in thirteen stages in and he you know he he showed on probably half of those stages in one form or other. I think is well worth seeing that the time trump today really you you know if if any time trough Ceuta dollar Philippe it to it was today it should a punchy right of these tough little climbs it was quite technical and as Daniel Free Television style free pointed out on twitter the score in head Ted time-trial confrontation was in Garin Thomas Town sleep is now six four to Thomas so it's so close to that you might imagine and I think the point you make Francois by where the other you know. The della writers underperformed they were missing. Tom Damola were missing. Ah Chris from were missing Rohan Dennis of course but the Mulan Fruit in particular. I get the sense that Thomas didn't feel at the end of the race because that's what you speaking here before he knew the alphabet she beaten his time. He was a guy who clearly didn't feel like he'd done the best time trial of his life and you know that I as I say a time-trial such a task to form you know on a writer knows from time as writing through the finish regardless of his time he knows was that if he does is just it's not there. You know we've seen Siamese when he's done. He's been on really on fire and really on farm. He He's capable of a brilliant time trial it such a such a test and our sleep is is it clearly on great form uh-huh we haven't been on our forty minute climb yet still were to ease into tour but we're very very early in terms of climbing is like a Jiro in that respect true bought prompt while you were saying to me this afternoon how the assumption that because we haven't done a forty minute climb because we haven't done repetitive mount impasse after mounting pass it somehow been easy. The stress of the tour is being in in mixing the challenge making the Rhythm Change Day by day and Francois. You made the point about the change of rhythm this weekend you go from a climb with a descent finish to a time trial to the to me which is a beast to this new finishing foie which is going to be grumpy naughty similar to the the finale lap launch Delfi really you want the word you used was cruel because no way for <hes> cruel in the old fashioned sense of the Tour de France being this kind of ultimate test. There's no real sense of rhythm for the riders to just settle in and go right now I can just ride and and just just you know knock out my rhythm tempo and it will be okay. It's yeah it's kind of a triathlon you know because the the kind of change pace is changed bikes. I mean you know change the swimming leg here from sure I mean you triathlon swimming somebody well. It wasn't a bit of swimming in the tour in the bus. Remember possessed the GUA. Some guys got caught by the by the flood of in <hes> but the intriguing really tomorrow sage. I'm not going to try to tell you guys listen to the podcast tomorrow intriguing intriguing. We'll be the as you say the climb up the tomorrow forty multimillions climbed because we haven't seen the the <HES> T. menial train which is very different trend from the sprint training that that's the leading up the mountain. We haven't seen that yet and we're not sure is going to happen pretty confident infidelity will but we haven't seen that yet and and and what can you do to my vocal <hes> twenty eleven kind of tour and hold to the the problem with you mentioned last year. He won in one stages in one the Jersey but he he went he went into breakaways. He can't go into breakaways now. It will be in this yellow. It will be at the at the very center of the Yellow Jersey Group you know and his Yellow Jersey Group would be of course paced by Tim ineos what would happen wounded in those conditions we saw the plausibility and every time the Taryn was becoming hard the only guy who could stay with him with `enrich mass <hes> it so probably you know laughably be isolated or salt off tomorrow. <hes> when Tim Yours will will try to impose his will they I mean will they be in a position to do that. It will be the real test of what was doing. What are Tim Yours you know riding the tour the same as they did in the past or not? I mean the the the the probably the answer to that question would be tomorrow but let's not pretend to go and Thomas had a bad day I mean it's all relative relative and I mean he will still look at the results and say that he is forty six seconds ahead of Steven Steven Krause right quick I mean with the greatest respect to cross bike that that won't worry him. Forty six seconds would take quite an effort to you know to hold back by going on the offensive. The worry would be en masse just sliding up their into fourth place overall quietly. I mean I kind of wrote him off. The tour Switzerland only really on the basis of how he looked on the bike on that mountain state way when in front you know he finished second in the well to last year so clearly can race over three three weeks and his job will be to be good in third week no doubt but it's not been a terrible day for Thomas ahead of everybody other than elephants. He has imposed the pecking order within team in your you know he really has <hes> assertive right to pack the grain prior to Bernal am still write him off either. I mean you know we haven't had these monster climbs yet and we could see <hes> a different complexion to the race. When we get there Iran container even the day-to-day Bernal these guys might might come in thrown on? I think penal again Pino loss time the other day but not because he's locking form he showed today he's in fantastic form and and I still think feels a lot to offer this race. I do to it but talking about burnt Bernal. I was disappointed. Many people were disappointing. We've talked to Nikola bottle and we listen to your to say yesterday and he was he was putting using the Thomason Bernal in the time for all of this roughly the same level allows one minute Sir Twenty something I think <hes> number two what not while to alphabet which means to he lost a minute on Thomas Thomas as well it it it just kind of blow in the in the in the internal Iraqi of the two and finish up at a trot to talk to Marie espionage speaking Spanish and the looked ill ill look quite not dejected but a little bit disappointed as you said Richard they know when if done well and he didn't do so well so I'm so it's it's all in Spanish. It's could be trusted because you have this Colombian. Ca League you know asking questions you know for forever and then very very short answers from Burnell. Who's just basically saying you know a team time? Trials are always hard but you know even the brevity of his answers and effect. They refused to answer answering questions in English prove that he's at a blow today shirt that I I think what caused team car the back of the facts lease coverage of the two to Franz. He's being sponsored by what boy that powering us all the way from here to. Paris I think now cost-effectiveness score. Oh Wow yes. My cost-effectiveness score is low today. They will finally anyway last night. We heard from what bikes Dr Barney wainwright about the pedaling effectiveness score. This was a new one on May but he explains how you can use this to make real gains on the road for most people is pretty straightforward to improve pedalling effectiveness school and just your general uh-huh pedaling technique. What the what can you do get that real time feedback so that you know when you make a change to a movement you understand whether it's positive or negative effects for those people who have a walk like I've seen you have what also have access to what bikes and spend a good amount of time? It's usually over the winter period when you indoors outdoors sometimes but where where you spending significant time in those when you can actually pay attention to what you're doing and you can start to make some progress and he gets so you get that feedback from using it being quite care about while you're doing it what you're trying to do to try to do in terms of technique getting that feedback that live feedback from the walk bike with the view or the putting aside from the school and then just investing time in that enjoying doing that even three weeks most people would start to see a significant change something. You couldn't really do on the road because you would know whether what you're doing is having a a real improvement on not because of so many other changes are going well that that was Bonnie wainwright and conversation me Lionel because as I said last night I got my peddling ineffectiveness score and through through using the biking what you said there is really true. I mean when you become aware of the fact that you're you're paddling. Stroke is being analyzed ee start to concentrate on it more uneven from one session to the next he can increase his score and not just not that mindset of of concentrating focusing on how an has he said last tonight is not just about an even after all the way around the pedal stroke. Is You know there are certain points in the pedal stroke where it's more effective to push hard or pool yeah and on the rock steady equipment like the bike atom you can work on that <unk> technique in a controlled environment is difficult to do the out on the road when you go to deal with traffic junctions roundabouts and what have you but when you're indoors on on what by Cottam he can really concentrate on honing that technique and then transfer it to your outdoor cycling after you've kind of made some improvements and some gains on Bonnie wainwright came out with this pedaling effects and the score. Do you think he would come up with podcasting effect in the score for us as well. I think we're GONNA have to ask him after the tour. I'm if you would like to buy a what bike atom you have until July the thirty first to purchase one and get one hundred pounds worth of sigma sport vouchers with it simply visit W._w._w.. Dot what by Dot Com Slash T._C._p.. One hundred that's T._C._p.. One hundred the number one zero zero and use a CO T._C.. Pay One zero zero at the checkout to get your one hundred pounds worth of Sigma Sport vouches twenty-eight as your podcasting effected the Score Tonight Line Generous. I mean one of the stories from today was obviously want Venar. I read 'em Rob. Hatch has tweeted the analysts. <hes> in Holland have reported that wow venar has a deep caught through his flesh and muscle has just been operated on your was warning don't you when you see a writer being given not medical treatment for as long as he was being given medical treatment and it's a terrible end to what's been fantastic I tour for him on and it weakens. One of the teams is set to play a big role. I think in the tour over for the next week in a bit and so a big loss to UGM VIZMA but very sad and to the stage that he was trying to win for what Venar it's always difficult you know to try and find explanations when writer as a crash them they might be. You know lots of explanations but impression while did he did. He hit you know the foot of the barrier or something in any case it which is what is obvious just in a little bit like Val Verde crashed you know on the tour <hes> couple of years back and you know hurt himself very badly at the time he seems to me that EM- miscalculated the corner into took much too tight and then there was kind of an educational what to do and e- kind of <hes> you know crashed on the in the you know India advertising banner there but my impression was the he was he was he actually was going so fast yet older the best intimated times he probably tried to cut the corner a little bit too short and and my impression was at its source easy to see the safe from you know from where we are but it's it's a little bit. It's forty easily. It's been a little bit too greedy. Maybe on this concept. The consequences are terrible. Obviously I'm our word for his country and Thomas Again. I mean we we said the other night after he wanted stage that he has all the tools to be a grand tour contender. Perhaps you know but he chooses to use his talent in a very specific way yeah. He's a fabulous writer. Well nearly one Jiro. I mean with the attack on on Stelvio Oh V._i.. When he won the stage but but <hes> came well fairly short in the end I think third overall in the Jiro but yeah he's got everything has an end? What's curious? I suppose is that he would give it everything today. I mean <music> when you look at the upcoming stages okay tomorrow on the two Malay- Sunday into Voire. Maybe maybe the name stages and hard enough for again but certainly the stage to gap would be is kind of the same same sort of older more experience of God but in the in this working fashion that the the the kind of you know maverick or not not fitting into the usual categories is not very I did similar to sleep you know in in many ways because <hes> but in time to us again never did much in in in classics either I mean is very strong. Is You have the impression that the thing to do with Tim Wellens at the end of the story last year you know well was inspired from our friends. Lobby Wall bus in the well some debate over that yeah sure but anyway anyway that doesn't approach to the they haven't approached aside Yafe which is interesting and I have a little bit of concern for Tim Wellens of the influence amount again is best friend has over in the maybe Tim Wellens cements seems to be taking the same kind of pattern. You know like <hes> I'm going to do the kind of Satan enjoy instead of the cycling they could be profitable for me and then maybe two months is worth more than than than what you know against seems to the ambulance of yes I quite like it though I like the founding team also embraces that and encourages the eh well the roommates obviously on the rest they posted quite amusing picture of wellens lying in bed looking lovingly at again ironing King of the Mountains Jersey. I mean you go be careful with an iron on a line theon reckoning probably on a very cool setting <hes> otherwise the Docs would smart go tomorrow itching to say this two weeks the Polkadot Jersey this year gives me the he be GBS. It's all on talks are in need clear rose. It looks like somebody's playing connect four with it. Don't should be offset anyway. That's another bigger joint. I'm spot but almost again I mean he's somebody who really has found his way in in his career. You know he's a laundry and who doesn't really want them. Do the Florida's Ramsey's <hes> he doesn't have a massage after racism. I know massage after a race since about two thousand seventeen I think <hes> you know he doesn't necessarily he's finding his own way. Not necessarily going with everything. Anything no demands or history says you must <hes> he's also one of the funniest writers on social media on twitter in particular. If you don't follow Thomas again you should because he's he's very good value on on twitter and in person person he's quite dirty. He's but he's very dries knee made very dry. Am I mean I think a lot of people the other way round on social media in an absolutely love. He's a great interesting replies with shorts fantasy but there's always kind of ironies but shy I mean he's a show them but he's he's. He's a great writer and it's great to see individuals like you know why not try and win the time trial stage. You know well yeah why no no. I'm not criticizing him. No I'm just slightly. I mean you while we I use the phrase. Yesterday I want music and but in to you you you might use of your form when you have it because you just never know and <hes> you know he might be. He might be cooling the line in Paris in in a week and it's time and then writing the Vuelta threes all three this year so who were the who the loser's say I thought I mean from my I was directing operations here from from my from the pool number number one loser in my opinion on the tariff well. I mean remove. Are They not already lost to assure but I mean you you you you could would you. I mean you fish oil. <hes> official take on this by Girolamo hair was his confidence back. The legs are bike and you try to limit the damage in the time-trial but today spent at the finish line spent ten minutes talking to von Avenues manager and every data loss to know what do said it kind of put the blame on a coach you know th they in most teams usually tim direct spots directors and tim managers are not the one who control the way <hes> writer <hes> trains they all have their personal coaches and loved medically would reassess we the coach what went wrong because <hes> it it it just come to understand. What's you know what's what's going on? Bass book to WHO couple of Valor riders lost a bit of Time Today we hear from Dan Martin Yeah we talked to <hes> Yucca Fugger Song and Don Martin which in a way in a new so much because Dan Martin is the symptom of writer as they I mean is this this even if these type of course was probably more suited to him than normal time-trial. He was pretty happy with himself. Actually after the time trial and <hes> and also yeah talk to Jack of Zong was not <hes> yeah well it was the same he was not didn't look so disappointed about his is <hes> time travel and and seemed to imply delays with coming back so loses but not quite the heat was the biggest surprise you become this morning twelve o'clock temperatures gone soap sandwich and I extract away no but the reason he went really quick. You know it's always cool cost. You have to concentrate at all times and that's what you can ask for. We needed the timing and obviously suits me especially your heart on the first part and then hold on towards the end you know but generally doing every T- you go out hard and then just try and get to the finish line you know so it's <hes> yeah I'm I'm happy have improved a lot since <hes> since last year. Not thanks to the team so we'll keep working on it you know and I was I was not a hundred years but isn't that good was a hard one but I think my pace myself good that's right to to give it everything into in decline and to gain as much time as a good day and then to to survive into last coming to finish put the last part this is quite hot and for a moment is quite some some headwinds in modern earlier today telling us any better every day. That trend continue yeah. I think so I think so. I mean this morning when I doc don't think money 'cause unto now I've been feeling the highest tips of the bus every day and then I was like something's mission you know it's still not there. Maybe it's gone so hopefully hopefully that's the right thing goes on for the rest of the cycling podcast at the twenty nineteen to the phones is supported by scientists <music> financing spots fueled by science. Thank you very much indeed to signs a sport for their very generous support of the cycling podcast and their support of you in your endeavors. You can get twenty five percents off off your scientist sport products with the S._I._S. C._P._i.. twenty-five scientists board DOT COM don't forget also to enter their incredible competition to win a day in the team any team car either the third Britain or the Vuelta and scientists for our exclusive nutrition providers to Tim team any us of course and tens of Competition Goto scientists for DOT com forward slash sign up. I'm GonNa Mention Stacey Snyder's mugs again Stacey Snider at AH friend in America's been making these beautiful limited edition mugs and selling them in aid of good causes and the good causes that we selected for the Tour de France mugs are the West Lothian Cycle Park and you cycling facility in central Scotland. David Carey Scholarship Fund in memory of a young boy in Virginia in the U._S.. Who was a mild keen cyclist who very sadly died in June this year after a long battle with leukemia and funds being set up in his memory to help young cyclist who've been otherwise have the opportunity part in cycling activities so am the mugs will go back on sale second batch because the first bite sold in eight minutes the next batch will go on sale on Tuesday July the twenty third during stage sixteen and they'll go on sale at nine A._M.? U._S. East Coast time which is three P.. M. French time the website for Stacey Snider Ceramics Dot Com S. S. N. Y.. D. E. R. CERAMICS DOT COM. I'm she sung them through C.. N. Z. E. T. S. Y.. Dot Com as well and so look for her they are details in our newsletter as well and if you haven't signed up attorneys that's right you can do so at the cycling PODCASTS DOT COM also Senate chance of winning the Austin Cycles Ato fooling bike. I've been zipping around on. 'em So good luck in trying to get one of Stacy's mugs because they've been very much in demand zipping accurate. Is that an accurate description of your I wrote about I wrote thirty kilometers city or not by actually Lionel covered quite law grown. You did leave at four thirty this morning. This is talk for that call I was I the fairly moving I can tell you. I'm not I'm not doubting the bikes performance. I'm dying. You'll is it time for the team. Oh Comma Com. Well Tom Chow. I don't know if I said but I probably he didn't say Brussels but time travel die as a tricky one there wasn't any Bossi's anyway because everyone was staying in Po- and it seemed and so there weren't many buses at the start and there weren't many buses at the finish and well. I wanted to keep the authenticity anticipation of outside the team bus <HES> so they're like likely if you if we talk about it anticipates I take this opportunity to because maybe we didn't mention you mentioned in the tale of the top but. This is a hundreds of anniversary of the New Jersey. We should actually senior song but has no song <hes> but one thing I wanted to point out because we started from Brussels Brussels the birthplace of Eddie Murphy's but it also the birthplace place over. I Guy I now forgotten who on three tours of France and this guy was Philip teas and Philip Tease. <hes> said you know later in life that he was the first wear the Jersey not version Christoph he was not an unofficial Oh Yellow Jersey but he said East coach and ask him to wear a different Jersey too. You know so that the spectators could you know point out our this is the race leader because increase off was I've ordered the Jersey Midway through the race and it didn't it wasn't introduced reduced. The Star Turn Phillipi said <hes> you know I I the the first guy to wear a Distinctive Jersey two point you know sought out the race leader from the race of the of the boys was me so <hes> it was probably before the war actually before the the the the twenty nine thousand thirteen so that this kind of controversy <hes> on on these so we may be we celebrating the young with anniversary anniversary that doesn't exist well the Eugene Christopher's Christoph well with slightly mocked wearing the Yellow Jersey initially you know he's the banana or whatever you the Canary Canary not saying yeah well the Banana I mean bananas. You know our team cars at Brown Rally Yeah Yeah it was a one time celebration in a lot of Yellow Jersey whereas was in town to say you couldn't you couldn't move bumping into Yellow Jersey holder you. Couldn't I mean well. I spent most of the one of the reasons I reason an outside the team bus installment today. Sorry listeners is because I spent a lot of time chasing Greg lemond around Po he's in town for one day only as invited the two to France along with lots of other Yellow Jersey whereas I won't spoil <hes> the story because <hes> it will featuring kilometer zero next week <hes> but you know ninety nine two or three times nineteen thousand nine the greatest tour of all time sector. Is this the greatest of all time the closest to overtime one by eight seconds. We'll be telling a bit of that story in slightly different way because I think a reasonably familiar stories and it but I wanted to catch up with Greg on Kathy his wife who were in town just for today and I had to fight my way the security import today was absolutely incredible and the reason for that is the French President Emmanuel Macron is in town to have dinner with the Yellow Jersey wearer and there was also maybe <unk> dijon whereas about down so difficult confusion confusion kidding move bumping probably especially if you need to know a police assault the yellow jerseys from the yellow vests Oh my God yeah well that was my assignment today and it took some doing actually because I had to break through the security court on in a couple of places places but I managed to do it and well done next week well done Lionel am not to come in two zero supported behind score. The latest episode came out today by the data that's being collected at the Turin and and used used by teams and fans interested in episode to learn about high. They're trying teased eighth also enhance the fan experience and especially the the roadside find experience so that's that's an interesting development. I think we should wrap things up for tonight. Shouldn't we got big day tomorrow looking forward to terminally but you mentioned pauline on I think four is one of the most underrated cities and fronts. We come here a lot but renting today. It's very understated sort of place isn't it. It's not sure choice not fancy but it's is lovely and there's a lovely can relax five is surrounded by the Chinese I mean we're on their skirt SUPPO- here and we're looking at on a on a mountain range in front of us which just in the kind of through the mist you know that kind of Blue Louis Maintenance and the distance and it's beautiful is a lovely place Francois is attitude towards the southwest is slightly different. Is that because you're from the South East your your living the southeast not that they're they're a part of the south. I love and I have nothing against at all but I told you as we were driving around town. I've never managed to Canada <hes> tame. I never know where I am table yeah. We were you know when we're driving around. I never know where I am in it so it looks to me and I find it really easy time because there's this big long straight roads through the center of it and then there's a there's higher up and then as the old tired and there's a hotel couldn't quickstep always staying but a scene I I never unfunded pettibone moisture because we always there's pressroom is always in the same place. Polly Bouma might UN tenth <hes> lunch in the same restaurant. You know it's funny. Any Austin slash team sky away stayed in the park on hotel. Oh talent Niane well every time every time though every time but I stand up don't always stay in La Palmera which is where they were busted in two thousand and seven months and I actually but one footnote today M MM-HMM WE heard from Jerry Ryan last night's episode em and he said he had some special balls of wine. Defar on that was Jerry definitely day right and he was I was very impressed and interest see him there <hes> Lacoste today at what she avidly I mean they've got women's team that unlike some of the other women seems prompts is very much as an integral part of the mission Scott Setup and I spoke to Jay Ryan on the finish is there right armada. SURPRI almost won the race and you know he was very invested in that performance and and he was very disappointed at the end and I said did you bring extra wine in case you know you wanna course as well and and he had and he's going to send them all bottles of wine. What am I was? I was talking to him about the women's team. He said when they set up he insisted remember. It's all his money and that's team. He said he insisted on the women having exactly the same equipment physio support for medical support coaching and everything that the man have and they're just to see him there today was you know was was. was you know good because it was a bit low key at the Star lacouer there were more people there are the Finnish m Yeah Award Award for Gay Ryan and we'll hear from him in the next episode of the second podcast Femina. That's the way to go and while the last one to you you were at you know you were at the poodle most of the afternoon enjoying the Saugus thing on the types some of our listeners I have been following. Oh Info to my great surprise. The Adventures of my little friend women put it through and I thought I'd lost it to today and actually I found it he was he was actually sitting by the pool with rich. Just before we go a big thanks to friends of the podcast people have signed up at the cycling PODCAST DOT COM to get exclusive access to our friends specials. Thank you very much. There are few good episodes coming up soon and thanks to Allen Owens Stuart Westley Michael Giddings Things Mark Sheldon Andrew Logan and Tristan Oldham and a big thank you to rate your Westwood Andrea Johannesen David Atwood Yaacob Wallstrom and Martin Quinn Sean Lee Christopher Standish Guy Hotly Jonathan Than Jenkins Robin Baker possibly Jacob all strip on the Yacob but who knows Oh yeah I was saying start getting attacked by a B.. I think I'm wearing this <hes> Peleton suncream rich we were sandwich very kind of the people peleton coconut e smell and it seems to be much loved by the the the bees of poll so that in this area if you listen to U Bs if you listen to the podcast you know.

Darren Thomas writer Yellow Jersey twitter Francois Julian Felipe Iran Tibo Pino Lionel Philippe Steven Steven Krause Thomas Thomas rugby Po- We partner France Chris Bradley Wiggins Julian Phillips Iran Ritchie
Remembering the Territories: World Class Championship Wrestling

Busted Open

50:15 min | 1 year ago

Remembering the Territories: World Class Championship Wrestling

"David Greco in DC W legend Tommy Dreamer book back on the territories and delve into world class championship wrestling. This is busted open some remember the territory special. Welcome to busted open remembering the territories and this one is one of my personal favorites. World Class Championship wrestling. We're GONNA talk about a top to bottom and who better to do with me and my partner in crime here at nine. Am each and every morning eastern time right here busted open. It's the innovator of violence. It's the landlord of the House of Art. Gore himself the one and only Tommy Dreamer. How are you man? I'm doing great. I thought we were doing the job or one. But we're going right to world class. I should have changed my shirt but anyway let's talk world class championship wrestling. That was phenomenal. It was phenomenal. There's no doubt about it and I said it's my personal favorite territory because it really is If you look at the innovation of World Class Championship wrestling you know the way that they the mics. You know near the ring they did it completely different. Shot it completely different Tommy than any other territory and a lot of what they did is still used on TV today. Absolutely and the beauty of it was. It's I guess Movement forward always like with production with it had somewhat of a big time sports feel with Bill Mercer being a commentator bringing the camera into the ring they did so many things that are different but really made it stand out and it went from I would like to say a regional just basically Texas promotion. you was purchased in what like nineteen sixty six by Fritz von Erich and then it just kind of blew up and I always talk about when you think of the territories you I find it so amazing that in one section one state you can have wrestling literally seven nights a week Running in all these different towns and like every house doing really really well. And here's the thing when you look at World Class Championship wrestling because when you look at world class championship wrestling you mentioned Fritz von Erich and you have to talk about friends. Fritz von Erich when you talk about world class wrestling but you know from nineteen sixty. Six To nineteen eighty-one. It was big time wrestling. It didn't become world class championship wrestling until late. Nineteen eighty one and really the big years of world class was from eighty to eighty six by nine thousand nine hundred sixty sorted decline. Eighty seven and eighty eight. Were definitely decline years. So when you look at the heyday of world class championship wrestling Tommy. It was really only four years but those four years or historical. Yeah and when we go back to quickly the production you know that was Keith Mitchell. He was involved in that and then from world class you went to WCW. He's shot every episode of Nitro from there he went to impact or TNA. You WanNa call it what was TNA. I E shot all of them up until he just went to eighty w Shot as now shot every episode of Eight. Uw So Keith. Has been a pioneer as well as kind of being like A. I know for a lot of us. When you're dealing with stuff in the truck. He was like a if go mafia terms a conciliatory to What's going on and what he brought to the table. What like you said is still being felt and seen today but those boom days I remember you know when we saw Gino Hernandez take the one man gang chain and great the Cadillac. Or you know we discussed on a previous podcast steel cage. When Terry Gordy closed it on The head of Kerry von Erich costing him the shot at they brought the cameras in there. But you could feel those atmosphere. We we talked about. Look at the swarm of people hugging the baby faces and just as boom period of pro wrestling. Which is all based upon the von Eric's as the baby faces and all the evil counterparts to the Bond Eric's because there was I don't feel looking at it now but back then. There was no drop off in baby faces. You had your on Eric's you had whoever was going against them. But you had your Bugsy McGraw as your spoilers Jose authorities. Everybody who was there was a star and people were into those matches even like the opening matches. You know if there was a friend do sick Versus Brian Diaz or whoever those matches are everyone who was in that territory was considered a star because of that great television they had as well and I. I'm glad that you said that. Because like Brian Adidas who early on I guess you can look at it as almost enhancement talent but then grew and grew and then you saw him just get better and better in the ring and that was lost on the fans. They saw that too so that a few years later you would buy him into being in a main event match. That's what it was great. It's almost like you know like a football team before free agency. You know how they got built by the draft. You had a last place team. But they started building different pieces to the puzzle on. Then you know two years three years four years down the line a team. That maybe was a team was now playoff team and then maybe even a few years later a super bowl team was the same thing in world class championship wrestling bite. You can have somebody on the undercard and then three or four years down the road there in the main event match. That's what I love so much about world class championship wrestling. And Tommy. You ventured it. It was a regional Dallas Fort Worth promotion but it was a national promotion. I mean it was. It was used eight the tours into Israel because world class championship wrestling was so big. And you can make the argument if they wanted to. They truly could have been a national product before Jim Crockett promotions and before the WWF. Absolutely I remember watching it every Saturday In New York Madison Square Garden at five o'clock and then it moved to seven o'clock Just because sometimes. There's a lot of Yankee Day Games. And this is when the Yankees are on it and it just did boomed and for exactly what you said. I remember immigration of how simple it was if you had Fritz von Erich who is this established wrestler in that market And then he had his young sons they would if you were a baby face. You're a friend of the Von Erich. I remember King Kong. Bundy I coming in. And he was from Alaska and he was dislike. Lumberjack Alaskan guy that they found in the von Erich like well. Let's train you to be a wrestler and then what happens you of course turns on the Eric's and you know Brian. Use was another one he supposedly. I don't know if this is true. Went to high school with Kevin Boehner and actually ask him on that but They attached their other baby faces to their top and it really really helped them for when they turned you. Think of the group's Devastation Inc. H H with Gary Hart was always the nemesis and it was perfect because Gary Hart. Who is the older guy? He hated Fritz von Erich so he also brought in all these other guys to beat up as sods if it was the Great Kabuki the Magic Dragon. All these different guys would come in to go against on. Eric's such a simple formula but yet done so so well and I remember seeing the first time they took it to Israel and they were it was like a president or the pope coming to the country like flocks and flocks of people and showing that footage to was kinda different. Because now you're saying like. Wow people love this company so so much and they had memorable cards in the cotton bowl that memorable cards at Texas stadium you know. Everyone remembers the first a parade of champions in one. Thousand nine hundred. Four where Kerry von Erich beat ric flair to become nwea champion in front of forty two thousand fans but when you think of world class championship wrestling because he saw each and every week on your television and that was the sport a terrarium when you talk about historical venues in the history of pro wrestling. Tommy just like the w arena in Philly the sport a Tory among Dallas. Texas is right at the top of list. Absolutely I remember the one of the first time I ever went to Dallas. I wanted to drive by the sport. A terrarium and it was just like this old building. I was able to see it and I was like man I wished I had the opportunity to wrestle there. I was wrestling when it was still around during the US W. A. Days going in there but It's no longer there but people still take pictures of the legendary Sports Taurean Basically an empty empty building I mean empty space but Yeah man if you think about how. Every week people would flock to that place and there's a documentary out there whether they brought Kevin von Erich through that building. It was amazing and isn't really a a conversation about the tragedies that have fallen World Class. It's kind of all about the positives of the territory world-class though the tragedies. Kinda led to the falling of it but to me it's more about the celebration of this amazing amazing territory and I'm glad what you said Tom. Because there's been so many documentaries about the fall of world class championship wrestling in the tragedies around world class championship wrestling. That's not what we're going to be talking about today. We're GONNA be talking about the triumphs of world class championship wrestling and when you think about world class championship wrestling obviously you think about the sport at Torian. But you also think about the family behind. And that's the von Eric's David von Erich Kevin von Erich Kerry von Erich Mike von Erich Chris von Erich the Father Fritz von Erich. We'll get into all that and probably the greatest feud in the history of pro wrestling. And we'll do that. When Tommy Neier back remembering the territory's its world class championship wrestling right here on busted open. You're listening to busted opens remembering the territory's World Class Championship special only on Sirius. Xm Fire Nation Channel. One fifty six Anthony Smith on anime tonight. Is this now the moment? Wherever we're GONNA just engage he as maybe the best live on planet or just engaged. She's on the middle better than Tony Ferguson. So I'm not sure if they ran that back if it would look much different. Maybe that was the effect like maybe. It's not Tony. Maybe he didn't have an off night and just engaged. You just gotTa make if you look back at this point. There's a strong argument to be made. Adjusting may be the best one hundred fifty five in the planet. Stacey Thursday seven to eight. Pm Eastern on Sirius XM fight nation. This busted open remembering the territory's world class championship wrestling special. Here's Dave Look Rica in DC. W Legend Tommy Dreamer. Welcome back to busted open remembering the territories with my tag team partner that handsome Tommy Dreamer Tommy talking about world class championship wrestling today. And my personal favorite territory when you think of all the elements and Kinda reminds me of these. Cw Not just a hardcore style and we do know world class wrestling at times could be that strong style that we see in Japan. But you know a lot of the elements that's missing if you watch it on the wwe network just like e c w you know. The music was a huge aspect of world class championship wrestling. You know when you think of the free birds and you think of you know free bird by Lynyrd skinner playing and you know you think of the junkyard dog with a another one. Bites the dust and Kerry von Erich. You know to Tom Sawyer. Music was a big element of world class championship wrestling. Oh absolutely you know as you're saying it I have Visions of Kerry von Erich in White Daisy Duke. Shorts cough wet hair oil on his chest. Coming out to What was it that whitesnake video riding the horse on his it always do those videos Leading up to like a big match and that was for him go into take on Ric flair. And if you watched it today you'd be like this is how you're promoting Office guy in the world and he just slow motion. It looks like it would be a joke today but yeah man all those videos. I remember they did an eye of the tiger video To that but there were so many different elements. And what you said I think is the best word. The feuds the feuds and we've talked about this so much feuds and angles or what really drew the business of professional wrestling back then and even though they went to the well a lot it was because it still worked the free birds and Navan. Eric's like I said before the free birds came in as the von Erich friends and then all of a sudden they turned and it wasn't like a classic turn where all of a sudden they just jumped him. It was over that Christmas night Match that we went over on the podcast where Terry Gordy slammed the cage on Kerry's head costing him the title but Michael Hayes was trying to be indifferent but once you turned on von Erich you're immediately hated because they were so loved but like devastation. Inc feuding with them or Gino Hernandez increase atoms feuding with them. Hernandez always kind of the. He'll but Chris Adams if you remember came in as Kevin von Erich friend Yep and that ye turned on him with a famous super-quick All this different. It's so easy because as Sadly people know your friends do turn on you and in real life and that was always portrayed against the beloved von Eric's and we talk about greatest feuds and I think when you make a list of the greatest foods of all time in pro wrestling on or near the top of that list is going to be the free birds in the von Eric's and like it's like you said the free birds came in as friends of the von Erich. That quickly changed that Chris night you and I did a watch along to carry and Ric flair in the cage of from Star Wars at the reunion arena on Christmas night. You can see that. Watch along or you can hear that. Watch along on the busted open. Podcast WHO's Click and subscribe and like but honestly. Tommy you look at that feud even though it went on for years it didn't matter that was one of the greatest feuds because it never got old and never got tired because you had so many compelling personalities and characters in that feud and it takes you know they heel and face to tango to make it. Michael Hayes was just amazing. You know with that over the top personality in wise ass character and he had Terry Gordy as the muscle. And Buddy Rogers's body Roberts is just like that mind that knew how to get under people's skin one of the greatest feuds of all time off dude absolutely. I say it's top three in the Tommy Dreamer world which is Dusty Rhodes and Kevin Sullivan. Tommy Dreamer Raven the free birds and bruiser brody versus Carlos Cologne. Those are my top feuds. We'll do a whole talk about that one day but We talk about Feuds and and how they made things special another guy and you know learning stuff about the business was a lot when who was booking. A lot of it was Gary Hart and then when he left David Manning Had a piece of the book Bronco Lubich had a piece of the book When you say my did you of you. Cw W that is Kinda profound because if you think about it like I've heard well Bronco Lubich also had A. He had a town that he helped promote and we had a baby doll was on. She said her parents had a town that they helped promote for world-class so all these group of people. Now when you went to that town like her father you know a referee. She used to do stuff and it did have that family element to it but everybody who came in like worked it would be like you were owned a little piece of the company in the Senate. If your house was up you get paid more So I mean stuff like that is just like I love that because you see like again the rise of it but Yemen the I'm trying to think of once the von are like wild. There were there who is another top super duper face. No one could surpass them and it would be different today because everyone would be like. Oh it's because they're the sons all this stuff really work good athletes. They really were draws that. We're going out there and working I've always said this triple h gets a lot of he He not so much anymore. Back in the days because he married. Stephanie McMahon but at one point triple h was the best. He'll in the business and it doesn't matter who you are as long as you could back it up in the ring the fans would accept and I think that's why the fans accepted the von Erich so much and they also all complemented each other so well and like the breakdowns of it were. Kevin was the high flier. Carey was more of a brawler and the muscular guy and David was the all around Great Wrestler. He was the one primed. He was the big brother he was the one primed and ready to be the NWEA champion. And that's another beautiful thing that they always did was. They fought for a prize. There was the Americas heavyweight. The Americas title was the number one regional title but when Rick Flair was coming into town. Guys would fight for the bigger prize and to me. That was pure genius because you also you had the great if it wasn't Harley race I associate world-class more with Ric flair because his amazing battles but Harley race was in the mix a lot while he was champion to and it made that. Nwea title so special. And that's what's amazing about world class because you know Tommy every every territory had their hot baby-faced that you wanted to see become nwea champion no like amid south. There was the junkyard dog for a while. Then it was Terry Taylor you know in Georgia championship wrestling. It was know Tommy Wildfire Rich Ringo around the country at the top territories but with world class. It was it wasn't just one person was an entire family. You know you know it could be carried von Erich it could be David von Erich could be Kevin von Erich. You Know A. It didn't matter. They were just all as equally popular. And I'm you know we're GONNA get Kevin von Erich on here in a few minutes. Can't wait to talk to him. I'm sure he's got stories about you. Know the fans and how they would claw him when he would go to the ring. You know Gil Brandt and Gillibrand. If you don't know the name he was the scout and you'll player personnel director for the Dallas Cowboys for decades under Tom. Landry in TEX SCHRAMM and I had a conversation with Gil Brandt Gil Brandt Nada wrestling guy. But he knew the von Eric's because he even said it to me. He said there was a time. Where the Vine Eric's were as popular as the Dallas Cowboys in the mid eighties? The cowboys were a mediocre team. So you look. That was the height of the popularity of the von Erich. So he would tell me that they were on par with the Dallas Cowboys in the Fort Worth Dallas Texas area. Think about that. They're really tells you how big that family truly was. The first time I got to meet Kevin. Von Erich was when he came to impact wrestling when they did a pay per view there and they had his sons on the show against The von Eric's and Kevin was in the corner and when Kevin got announced the place blew a gasket and I it was just like and that was so many years removed from world class championship wrestling. But like I always say wrestling fans never ever forget 'em even his hall of fame speech was spectacular And he got an amazing amazing reaction there for someone who really was never on. Wwe television. Yeah it's it's crazy when you really think about just the popularity of that family and that promotion how much it meant for Texas and the economy and and unfortunately when the economy did take a nosedive in the late Eighties World Class Championship. Wrestling went along with it. But you know you mentioned Kevin von Erich in Kenya von Erich is a wwe hall of Famer. But he's more than that to me. He's an icon. He's a legend. He's truly a hero. And when we come back Tommy we're GONNA talk to that hero and legend Kevin Von. Erich GonNa join US right here on World Class Championship wrestling remembering the territory's I'm busted open. You're listening to busted opens remembering the territory's World Class Championship special only on Sirius. Xm Fight Nation Channel. One fifty six your home for all things. Combat Sports is Sirius. Xm fire nation. Start Your Day with Hall of fame. Pro Wrestling talk on busted open. Respect these men and women that build the business and the barracks keeps you up to date on all things boxing. Boxing is the fear of young. Expect Gary Thomas. Has you covered for mixed martial arts? Joe Rogan is the most important influencer in all the fighting broken down like nowhere else only on Sirius? Xm Channel One fifty. Six David Greco legend Tommy Dreamer book back on the territory's delve into world class championship wrestling. This is busted open some remember the territory special welcome back to bust it open remembering the territories and Tommy as I said my favorite territory of all time world class championship wrestling. And who better to talk about it than one of the legends one of the heroes of world class to one and only Kevin von Erich Heaven. How are you today good? How are you buddy? I'm great lettuce is like I'm I'm talking to Kevin von Erich from my house. Are you get me? This is like a dream come true. Well I'm sure glad to be here and then terminates good to see you again to my friend lives excited to talk to. You. Haven't seen in a while though I feel like I'm part of the von Erich Family. Because you're my favorite person of follow on twitter because of the boys and diving off a cliff in your grandchildren. You're very uplifting person and there ever a time. We need to be uplifted. You need to follow Kevin von Erich agree. Just nothing but fun on the incharge of free time here. Let's let's my. That's my job is to stay relaxed. Wait a second. I don't mean inter up. I'm getting a phone call here. Hold on this song. Remind you anything Kevin you know. The U Mark. He's playing Tom. Sawyer know that what are you playing? I can't hear it. Go hold you get old. It's my play Tom. Sawyer was curious music. Play in Eric in terrible mark. Tommy I swear they don't get onto. Tommy he's my buddy for sure. When I went to I was a show I did for several years ago with the boys told me what told me. I was looking for chair. An atomic came into that role in the. He gave me a three or four chairs. He told that good up this go paved the road for us. Snl Like this guy smack man all about respect you know the business you brought up the right way. Come on now. Don't arts ride? I did like the appreciate it to. Let's who's the shoes on on the other foot? Now is on the old man and watching these young tigers there. But it's a it's a great seat here to Kevin Can you explain to our listeners? A big like we're talking about the territory's was an average week for you like what shows you guys worked. But like you know ten. We had tend to be Aussie talking about mid south. What was an average week being arrested in world class? Championship wrestling Well it wasn't uncalled for us to work seven days a week we work and sometimes twice on Sunday. You know 'cause we we're we had such a such excitement. They wanted to run as many shows as possible. And you're there was a tie where I was working two or three shows a day. We'd have shorter plane for but you know we witness so much so much guys were in the territory you know they would work. Dallas and Fort Worth and then there was a TV on Austin and Houston was Thursday and Friday nights and so But the Russ was just you know towns end the WCW that we run called spot shows and then with the with midsouth just right over there it was pretty calling for the guys who work a few shots for mid south to during the loop. We wanted to keep all the guys working as we could. And so with W WITH MID SOUTH OVER. There was easy to do and plenty of road trips. Nice and you're a you're on the road a lot but for fans like Tommy and Tommy from New York and myself from New Jersey. You know watching world class wrestling every week. You know it was the sport a Tory and that venue meant a lot to pro fans you know. What do you think of when you hear sport a them? You know the history of that venue if you could describe it us well. You know When people talk about it now I think they kind of sensationalize a little bit the other way because it was you know. Yeah it was an old going and it was It didn't have installation and it was but there's a lot of things say regardless everybody that worked there. I think really love that building it but it wasn't dirty like didn't stink but because the food was really good sport a tour we talk Os and hamburgers and chill and cheeseburgers and French fries and a in the near with your your your Cotton Candy Cokes. And all that but you know it was. It was a good place to eat. You could really have dinner her. You know if you did Monte Nido according to art some Tacos and our cheeseburgers over. They were good and We wouldn't have sold that much food. If the place start at didn't stink. It was just old. You know it was. It was clean. It was old but it was clean. What about the fans the fans that would be at the sport a? I'm the one thing I always remember watching it on. Tv was like there was like a string around the ring. The hell the fans back talk about like when stranglehold would hit and you become down at entrance ramp to the ring what that what emotions were going through your mind. Will you know that's another thing? I'm glad you brought that up. What we we look at what we're doing out there are what the people have a good time. That's what we are. We thought it was important in the little kids. Especially the little kids you know. They're going to go home and they're gonNa kill the parents about what they had and what they like the most about the show and we thought it was important. They're able to touch us. Get up to the rain and sun their autographs and even stand on the Apron. We couldn't get in the ring but it was okay with me and all the rest of my brothers to let them get up on the Apron and not and be treated like you know like like little kids and it was just. I think it was important to have that in the excitement. And so you know the entrances went. came off great was the music but But all the kids getting up to touch it. They're not going to hurt you. They all have pens. And you might get poked or whatever but but it's it's worth it. It's they're going to have a great time and I wish they'd go back to that. I know they're worried about insurance. And all but the kids aren't going to hurt us. I think it's a it's really good and you know the kids that's all. They have long find when they come ringling that so. I think we're really on the mark where we did that. It's funny when you talk about the business bag van when heels were allowed to get real heat. All you had was a string at prevented you know from hitting the ring but yet today when you have Who can't get heat? They have barriers and security to prevent Wrestlers fans to go after wrestlers. When if you think about it you really should just have a strain because no real heels could actually get eat anymore. Because you're not allowed to her from Tory kind of insurance worried about. I have gotten sued on my own show because a guardrail. Hit A fan but Yeah I think it's for insurance and also Just those like you said it's it's a lost. There's loss pieces of the business. That are so so needed. I'm happy that starting to bring back managers. They're such a key component to the business. I just think through time. It's just like world class wrestlers such stars but the fact that I was able to touch a star to me made. Y world-class was so so special. Because you guys were actually ascertainable to your fans or glut here say that Homeo- that does what we're shooting for the kids to be part of you know because a lot of kids that they don't have a picture of her they don't really have the money to spend and so you got to sign a ticket stub or even a piece of little scrap of paper. You know anything but at least they got something in their hand you know and they don't have to pay for it so I'm glad we did that. Our wish they bring more of that too. In the history of world-class everyone equates the the free birds and the Bond Eric's feud when Terry Gordy slammed the steel cage into Carries head which was an amazing angle Do you think that was when the territory clearly popped or you? Did your best business. I'm sorry on this very did. I think that was curious. What do you think that was when the territory popped or you? Did your best business. Oh No that was a great angle. It was but it was just another angle told me. To tell the truth you know a hesitate to go on about The Free Birds. Because I don't want to take any way away from Chris Adams Gino. Those guys were a great tag team and you know how Israel just set on fire over there. It was like we built such a business there but those they never even saw the free birds you know it was all Chino increased and so And they later on. They did but all that excitement was over gene. Chris and so I WANNA give those guys credit and not to mention Kabuki Dragon. We had a lot of those guys and you know so. Many so much good talent came through but that was a super good angle With the chair with the slammed the cage door in a Santa Claus in all it was it was really good. But Laura don't take Chino because they were. They were just Christmas morning but toughest guys I know you know. There are a lot of our business were close with He. He was so was good. Yeah go ahead. I'm sorry I know the company always had booker's but how much did your father just let like. Let's say Gary Hart Just book or did did he have a lot of influence on what was going on as well or did he handle like the business aspect of it will. Jerry was good because he was he knew a lot of people. And that's which you want in a book or you want somebody that knows knows a lot of people that we could just movement the moving into the end the company and it worked really good. Gerry was good for that but as far as or take anything from Jerry. He had a good mind and he was a a all. The guys is number one advantage. Was that how will he go along with the boys? Now I know Jerry is not real popular type but he was popular when everybody wanted to. Work world-class over all the numbers. And so and so knowing Gerry was important. I mean if you knew Gerry you had a a leg them. A leg up in so jerry was great it probably I think. Probably the best booker we have. You Know Kevin when I look at some of your greatest matches and you know if I had to make a list of my top ten favorite matches of all time. One of those matches would be you and Chris Adams at the cotton bowl. I thought that match was absolutely phenomenal from nineteen eighty four. Do you have a favorite match of yours. Is there one match? You look back on as one of your favorites. Well that's the question. They're because doing so. Many wrestling matches the nineteen years in Russell at so much. Believe it or not. It's just not on television. Forget it it's just too many of them when you you see TV. Oh that one. But I just forgot so many but It's funny that you know you're lamarcus. Some people may remember our matches all but I can remember like clean beaches For instance Billy Robinson and nuts a match. It's on Youtube. I only always admired him. He has A. he's a great mind for the business. Thought he would have made a great chance to back in those days but I had a good match with him or just on Youtube the other day and so I'd have to say that's one of my just a great name like billy than there were so many good men are Russell Dorna. If it's not on type I can barely remember Tony talking about without the TV. It just modest will never happen. Sometimes you to the good part about social media fans will send you clips of what happened. I was like man. I totally forgot. I had that match. Who isn't that something? Kevin something that we talked about before you joined us was how important bill. Mercer was in the history of world class championship wrestling. And you know. He's kind of forgot about as far as some of the greatest. Play by play announcers in pro wrestling. And then I also mentioned Mickey Grant who was a director for world class championship wrestling. How important or those two people and World Class will. I'll tell you something that no one knows I ever told anyone else but Osteo Mickey grant and we're making creative and bill but bill mercer was was our voice and he was a great man. One of the. He's a legend. You know he was one of the only newsmen around when JFK under an assassination and he was there and on the spot and you know he took it and ran with it and he was divorced. Dallas cowboys. He's always in the right place at the right time. It seemed like he's a great mass. Russ you know when I got out a wrestling essay out when I was starting to wind. My career down in the nineties are Russell. Mexico City and in the Caribbean people wondered where would but I went down to San. Jose took Mickey Grant N. Bill with me and I was negotiating TV. Deal on Retro Tall. There's a channel down there. It's three six nine one company. And it's the IT's in San Jose Costa Rica. And it's it's sports news everything and so I was putting the show out there in these guys. Were really hot for the show. Wanted to put it on and A learned something so crazy it found out a turns out and actually in Third World countries. They're not so concerned with high ratings. They they're not concerned with ratings at all it was all about getting their person elected president like that's why you on the TV station in Central America is because you've got someone you WanNa have elected this president nuts really they own. It's like a a a A. They all know they all do but that it in Dutch down their in Costa Rica that they could care less about ratings. It's all about getting or mandarin elected. You could say the same in today's society about the news but that's not to live in our world wrestling Norwitzki. That something Kevin. I'm going to ask you to straight up mark questions that a young Tommy Dreamer needs to know. Are you ready? Okay straight up mark questions number one did you in Brian. Diaz go to high school together. And where you were you friends in high school. Yep Smarter Fuck Best. Friends Curie was in Bryan. It was in carries class and Roy was there. Were both running box and Willie good bikes. Jerry was fullback and Brian was the tailback and I think they both don't thousand yards on to earn about two thousand dollars. That's really soften 'em. Brian was the family friend for sure and he was like a little brother to me because he curator always to go. But Ya and glad. Brian got into wrestling but once he he had an ankle with me. You know it's business and you know we went cyber her. You know it's not just him and I'm glad for it because he's a tough guy and he would dish it out by he's doing okay. I think he went to prison but he got out. And he's like a he's a good man and he was a good man then but he's he had some problems and he got us all thrown now so if you see brought a DSL there watch him. He's a good athlete. I don't know if he's still rustling but he's but I'd marry him the way carrying himself. yeah man. I mean I remember that whole feud and everything you but if you talk about we were talking about earlier. The beauty of world class and to me it's always storytelling. It's good versus evil. And The von Eric's were always good and somebody betrayed them and it would instantly be a top heel for the company. And that's how you do a lot of money but it was so simple and if you I came in like even like a Senate King Kong Bundy was found by the von Eric's and then he turned and like that simplistic booking was money. All the time and stories old as the Bible you know good versus evil or told me that's exactly right that's really and you so. I don't think we did that purposely. It was just It's just that's the way it came out when you're putting something together. Good versus evil. The people can sink their teeth into that. They understand it. And when you take real real points like like like a right enroll on. I mean the people can sink their teeth on that they feel like they're part of it. It that's one thing I think. Neglecting nowadays they. They don't have that aspect. I think that was really important for for us. People to get behind your you know my second. Mark question is this is urban legend. You were facing three men. You put a claw on one a claw on the other and then picked up your foot and put a claw with your foot on the guys. Ed Architecture told me that sounds great. I love to clean up but corny was put on. I don't want to say I didn't say I just don't remember that Jack. Victory told me that story. He said it was He was one of them and he got the claw from the foot. And I was just like I don't know about that. One so of cost pass through the years if both hands are occupied and I have to do something. That's why I took my boots off. You know it's not necessarily two. It was to be quicker and move around better but you know told me I would. I could pull hair with my feet. I can hold on the rope talking to all sorts of cheat will stuck with boots on so I would do anything I could get that much. Yeah in Heaven by votes on head coach to me. I needed if I needed to pull the trucks or Puma here. I did use those yeah. It's so funny. I'm watching World Class. Today on the W. W network and they bill mercer asked you how come you took the boots off and you just exactly the same answer. Which is so real. You're like that's just me? I liked B barefoot. Like you things without it and it's the same answer today. I love it. They told me you know curate to Curie Luxembourg foot now believe carrying would of Russell Burford Edmund for that. That injury right wants a bit videos. Keri Russell say Lauda third four I know back in the day there was always like who could be the next NWEA champion. Who was the top guy for the company in your opinion? I know it'd be hard in their prime. Who was the best all around? Athlete Yourself Carey or David or for the family. Will you know their whole old different ways to define athlete? You know what I mean All AROUND WORKER. Probably the most versatile. Because you know I was a hydro earn high hurdler and a sprinter and a fullback and I also did discus and shot and a lot of my brothers were but I think the bribe but I. I was the most versatile I'd say that Kerry was a great football player A great disc store and a great wrestler. You know so and then die Dave. Was You know devoted with what he did? Is that the way divorce with basketball. Practice practice practice. That's the his UH is mantra. In anything that you're short or you're practicing you'll get good at it. You put your heart into it annual and you will achieve and that was taped so David Carey were both. I don't want to take anything away from because they're both super athlete spent on But when it comes to versatility that I I think maybe get that one but What a great wrestler he was and Kerry was there just a phenomenal athlete. Around in so You know it's kind of hard to ask me. But what he was he was to take you think for Mike either just was looking at a newspaper article the other day that you know we have a bunch of we brought over from Texas and also we're Mike was in track meet in junior high and he broke in five events and he set five meet records out and three of them were records that he himself himself had set your before in in seventh grade and so it was a fellow athlete. We're just so busy wrestling. We didn't have time to to really watch him but Mike was something else. I hear these videos. Mike was an athlete but he really was in a really good athlete to now Chris. Chris wasn't Chris had the The asthma in it hit them really hard but not Mike. Mike was a good athlete and was his way when he got when he when he died aged Bloomberg Kevin. How important were the wrestling magazines? Y- Tommy and I did an episode about you. Know with George Napolitano and stews stacks and Bill Apter. How poor were those wrestling magazines to popularity for you and get your name out there to an audience that might not have been able to watch world class championship wrestling. The wrestling magazines were never really. They didn't really get down to world class. They pretty much handle New York in that area up there in their this kind of held the way it was you know in so but that was just kind of their way of a promos are supposed to people over that. We didn't have a lot of a look at the magazines. Come down come down to Texas. Now what we started rushing then bill after and George the Polito Pronounce it. But in Stu and those guys are your started coming down then but before that that we didn't we didn't have wrestling maximes actions come down to Texas. That was just a northern thing but it it started up soon and smother goes through those Japanese. The those or shoot. I'm GonNa have some good. Japanese men works Georgina. Waly Waly Gilmore Gucci with name while Yamaguchi with the Japanese Baseball magazine. And all that stuff. Yeah Yeah right wall. We started doing the Nog later on. That was not joey we are. We really caught on but the magazine started coming down and the Japanese magazines too. That was a that was an aspect of it. I suppose We we didn't have a whole lot of Texans down your mo stories. Though Kevin. I WanNa ask you about your son's. Because they were good enough about a year ago to come in studio with us. You know Ross Marshal von Erich who are doing great things with M. L. W. wrestling. And you know how how do feel they progressed. And they've created quite a buzz with L. Lali so problem the way the ratings have come up from the boys came always just pat on the back Steve. I'm just so proud of him. And they tell me and the company the heads of the company. Tell me you know how ratings are doing and the market share and all. I'm so proud of the boys and the way the way they're doing it right. Keep their word they just. They're as solid as they get here out at Pembina have just the take care of us. You know. They pay the bills they feed us. They didn't they just everything. And it's what a way to live. I just delegate the authority to my and it was the best decision I ever made. Pamela I just live here and they just take care of everything. They need. Cars feed of branch the the sheep the any any building. We have to move their all over it. Just it's a beautiful life out here. Good signs that's good sons. You Have Kevin. That's awesome the year Kevin. Thank you man. This has been an absolute pleasure. This is like a bucket list for me to be able to talk to you today for the special and the Talk Abou World Class Championship wrestling. We truly appreciate the time today. Thank you so much. Listen anytime you to do show Koby. I've had never list Evan. Honestly man you're you're living legend and I say it from on the first time I met you. You open the doors and paved the way for so many. You and your family made people fall in love with wrestling and I just want to say thank you because of what you and your family did for so many man flicky Tommy. God bless your heart you say the most encouraging thing up. I sure appreciate friendship was a pleasure for me to know you and you to you guys were just number one anything I can ever do because a count me in and let me say to the to the viewers out there make you offer still remember me after all this time. We're going to get through this. I know the has got us down. But it's going to be I. It's it's passing at. We'll be fine. It's going to go with your coming in from what I understand. The temperature in the sunlight kills this thing. So it's GONNA be great everybody's cheer up and love each other and as a great summer this has been busted open remembering the territory's world class championship wrestling. Special Check Sirius. Xm On demand for more Sirius XM fire nation content. Follow us on twitter at busted open radio.

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120: A Sad Week In Cycling

The Cycling Podcast

55:03 min | 1 year ago

120: A Sad Week In Cycling

"You listening to the cycling podcast in association with rapper the fastest clothing in the world tour the home name cycling with character ride. 'em watch with rapper in two thousand nineteen as they partner e f education fast and canyons throb sir. My name's richard moore and you're listening to the cycling. Podcast is a very sad week for the sport with the tragic sanjay death of bjorn lomborg at the tour of poland on monday. Lionel bernie is to holiday this week. I'm here in london with daniel free and daniel we do sadly have tragedies in cycling and we've had to cover the deaths of writers in racist before on the podcast and it's obviously all was extremely signed an extremely difficult and this one has i think hit people particularly hard because lamberto was only twenty two. He was very fresh faced kid really in only his second season as a professional with law sydell world to a team of course an awful tragedy m. I and i think a few things have shocked. People am about his age of course his promises talent. I'm not sure how much these should be fighters and how much we more than someone's death breath but he was a great talent fourth and flesh wound this year best young rider and the dolphin a bit later on second to dig bernal matured l'avenir a couple of years ago and bernal now of course being the recent third of france winter so bjorn lomborg was someone who was very much on our radar wasn't a and we were watching his progress with great interest yeah definitely definitely was rich and he had been since a very weight had a a sparkling amazon career he has to ten professional lost year <hes> <hes> and wasn't supposed to ten professional but he looked at twelve do a number of his peers guys who competed against the law as an amateur lights burnell <hes> civic off who had turned professional <hes> and that sort of changed his mind so we decided at the start of last year two thousand eighteen that would time professional it is the curious incident when he went to his first right what was going to be <unk> told under in two thousand eighteen i mean he hadn't been signed signed up to the u._c._l._a. Testing pool following to be eligible but he went there anyway <hes> wrote i think in front of the race read the whole rice <hes> so that was one thing that immediately brought him the people's attention but since then he really distinguished himself with result sudden he and he was nicknamed when nine matchbox <hes> a very diminutive rider small in stature and but was inclined toward fronts as we started in brussels this year and it's it's been how long has it monte seventy-six lost belgian told france when i did a little feature fry t._v. Talking to people about the likelihood of <hes> of a belgian tool when i in the near future and always name it came up with kind of n._f._l. But another name was bill lambreks yeah very sad indeed. M <hes> happened on stage. Three of the turpan stage four was neutralized. We've seen this before as well. It's the cycling's way of paying tribute. I suppose if somebody dies mid midway through stage race and i remember him take third final concert tally when he died during the <unk> franson ninety-five the tribute have you paid by his motorola teammates and this was similar where you know the the teams wrote a long procession lots of signal led the my and came in to the finish stop before though i am for a minute silence i mean really really hard to watch <hes> the bunch just sort of moving along in silence silence and appraise slow pace and then this this tribute at the end just before the line i mean you you really shoulders walking in the bunch and and writers rubbing their eyes and and and crying as they expect and i think lots of pseudo team have been offered the opportunity to carry on in the race and it seems that some of them will am speaking became the day after that tribute unbearably saadun and is the news obviously has dominated this week in a week where we thought we were going to be talking mainly about another young belgian remco remco even the pull in his incredible. When the san sebastian classic we will talk about that a bit later on we'll hear from john. Peter delete the journalists at news on both bjorkland breath and on remco evidence pull a little bit later on i must speak a bit more about lumber but the husband of course other news since the turtle the fronts and some racing and which will will cover now am i mentioned the san sebastian classic comes a week after the turn of francis is a great race on prey prey challenging course on a really surprise as surprising winner this year in nineteen year old ramco ever nepal great things have been expensive and but not not quite so soon and he won ahead of greg von alvarez fellow belgian mark hershey the young writer at teams. Someone who is also twenty i think has she and overloads may be that performance but that that was pretty store near remember he put in some very strong performances start the year in the three classic in particular i bulletin at the finish there and you know he from beyond his expectations there so third at san sebastian a phenomenal result for him and evan pull was was very impressive indeed. We'll talk a bit more about him. Later on in the first edition of the women's race in san spicier it was won by lucy kennedy of australian mitchelson skull the head of janaka and and sing on paolina roy akers am in london the right london classic elliott vivian any one the bunch sprint their head of santa and his teammate and leader man decoding quests that michael moore cove the women's race the previous evening was run by lorraine a- we after a cursing wheel was disqualified paid for a dangerous maneuver because the big crash at least osama was second corn rivera was third at poland obviously has been overshadowed by tragedy the sweet but stage one one by paschal ackerman the german sprint bronze grow stage two by luca mez sketch of michigan scott unsafe three also by <music> ackerman <hes> the two of us. Tom pitcock was the winner there a his freshman testing and big mountains. There was a stage at lop launched table fee that he won again. Another writer of great things are expected and i'm going to mention <hes> another event that is not something we really. We cover in the regular. Podcasts are explore series over the winter will definitely cover this but a few coping are one the transcontinental race. She's a twenty a four year old medical student from germany. It was her first race and she's the first woman to win transcontinental race. I'm not really a lot of people's imagination heard on radio for this morning nine an incredible story on like say. We'll definitely have an issue with her. In the explore series later in the year or at the start of next year <hes> a bit transfer funds for news as well august. I of course is the date on which teams are allowed to nine signings for the following year matthew trenton to c._c._c. from mitchelson and scott. We expected that miquel landa to borrow morita from movie star expected not to <hes> brandon mcnulty team emerets gabriel colleague league. The young british writer is joining movie star from team wiggins lacolle. M elliot vivani fabio sabatini takover this from decoding quickstep is that we also expected that for a long time and laura's nelson joining his brother oliver nelson a._g. To our lost more at transfer news what's more transfer news as well and will try and keep you abreast of the big transfers over the coming weeks the fastest clothing in the world tour the home of if cycling with character ride and watch with rather in two thousand nineteen as they partner e f education fast and canyons rammed. It's difficult i can only i speak from a male perspective but it's difficult for the modern mail to feel confident when wearing spandex and or lycra my name is taylor phinney and i read for e af education. I pro cycling team therefore your comfort and your and your confidence. This is essential. When you're when you're putting on your your bicycle clothing i will admit that this is the most comfortable in the most confident that i felt. They're the best bib shorts in the world. Thanks very much to our headline sponsor rafeh very grateful to them for their support on a reminder that you can follow the e-education first team through the films that raf have been making. You'll find them <hes> the rafa channel on youtube or raffard dot c._c. Few from the <unk> france <hes> including the man who direct which follows their sports threat to the charlie we alias andreas clear earlier and tom southam which an interesting insight into them and and the work that they do so you'll find that rafeh dot c. r. youtube and we were talking earlier on of course by the awful tragedy this week and bjorn lomborg sadly passed away just twenty two years of age during stage three of a tour of poland. Am i spoke this week to belgian journalist. Yom petered league of news about lumberjack than reaction to to his death in belgium. Here's what john peter had to say. Yeah i mean j._p. It's been a week of real contrasting emotions in belgium. You had started the week with you know that celebrate thing even polls win in san sebastian the last twenty four hours of sue a real shadow must have fallen over belgian cycling. Yes that's that's exactly what it is. We we have <hes> the black and whites coughing on newspaper today. Where yesterday's newspaper was all the optimism and do free about <hes> euphoria about even pool so the contrast is indeed indeed huge and it is like you say everybody big epic tragedy what happens to our comic lumber quite unusual belts and right away. He was a climber and and you know tip for great things and say jason so on. I mean how much how much did you know him and knew about him. I didn't know him personally. I knew him as a second journalist would would no. I knew about his result about about the ardent classics where he finished fourth in the in the flesh balloon he wanted youth cassation and dolphins year <hes> but he appeared on the the very popular talk show even below which is broadcasting during to france he was invited as guest and really. Everybody took a big liking to him. After this <hes> this show because the way he presented himself he's very very humble and and very <hes> eager to talk with <hes> with the other guest was. I think it was a deep lanka. He listened to his story. He had a certain naive fifty about him. That made him very very sympathetic very likeable team law to pseudo you know again. You've got a a week of contrasts emotions in belgian cycling book for that team a summer of contracts after their incredible tour to france you know they eight hundred real successful time there with stage wins and the tim wellens in the polka dot jersey as well for a while. You know flat team. It's a real belgian. Institution institution isn't that they will have been very hard as well by the death of off such a young rising belgian talent the tour was was a big success due to win three stages with caleb you and than the stage win of tomas the hands they you had to have been <hes> quite harsh criticism of of lotto pseudo before the tour and then they kind of got the best possible result out of it and then <hes> to contrast that with what happened to columbia right now this is must be must be terrible and i'll also also the they've had earlier experiences liked it with stick luke's which is very beautiful very very tragic story at the same i so for a lot of people involved like like much agenda general manager. I think he bring back a lot of uncomfortable memories and his yes my thought analyzed sympathy are really with with him with everybody a- with within the local salty pizza leaguer at journalists <hes> had used a talking about bjorg lumber. 'em and the the awful tragedy of his death and he mentioned his team lost to saddam who had such a an incredible difference with their four stage wins there. I'm and we're on a real high after that and annette to see them the team that handled through poland dealing with something you know none of them i mean some of the most poignant <hes> social media posts were pictures from the breakfast table in the morning of of you know of sage three bjorn lomborg sitting there you know for those riders to have him as a teammate in the morning and then carry on in the race with i am i. I really don't know how they have they deal with on how as a team they can cope with us not returning something. We maybe underestimate an a. Applies not only to the riders team but was the whole peleton to to and get back on their bikes and we think finished tour poland <hes>. I think that's that's gonna be really tough for everyone. Competing that for lots of pseudo i mean this is the the lightest really in a series of very difficult episodes for the team in two thousand fifteen chris bushman's that riders thing was salata teams called at the time crashed in the vuelta and he subsequently coma for a week after that <hes> he made a full recovery is actually writing now. Roy was writing loss for vitale concept retired. I think <hes> now and of course there was the ice in the involving a stick brooks the two thousand sixteen tour belgium and <hes> an even worse crashing he was in for seven months and he's still very much recovering from that shots <hes> he actually came to the tour de france share was in to lose it was the first time he'd been to <hes> a major bike race i think since he's crossed and that was a very poignant moment name environment speaking to a couple of belgian collies day jellison and they said that it was actually quite difficult. It was a difficult experience for a lot of the writers white is also. I think some of the families there a few of them have departments their their children there and it was not a comfortable oh feeling necessarily for all of them to have a guy who had an almost died and and in fact people still refer to recovery and and the fact that he didn't is a bit of a miracle recall he was almost pronounced dead after that crash <hes> and and that was that was quite uncomfortable. I think for some of the riders to have him there and when there was going into battle the tour de france and and now they the team has another heartbreak to overcome. It's a real family team in a sense as a real family emily vibe about it the way they've kept that stick brooks as part of the family since his accident. 'em is certainly reflects. Well on them and i'm sure it'll be the same here with v._r. Glommed brexit. He'll remain a part of the family. I was one of the really sad things again to read was his parents where they're in poland in with them. <hes> they'd taken a holiday overseas to follow him in that race. It was going to be a a build a build up to his first grand tour the vuelta so am heartbreaking and that's a team. That's been a team. That's been around for a long time run by mark. Sorry john you do get the sense that this is more than just a cycling team that there is this kind of this this family dynamic to it. The cycling podcast is supported by sciences sports. Science and sports healed by science. Thank you very much to science sport for their longstanding support of cycling podcast and of you you can get twenty eighty five percent off. All your scientists port bronx sciences sport dot com with the code s._i._s. c._p._i. Twenty five at science in sport they'll come and now daniel obviously this week's news and cycling overshadowed by the death of your mom breath but we had thought we'd be talking about another hello young belgian writer of huge promise and that's remco evan the pull and the nineteen year old who went to san sebastian and one in quite as sensational fashion i mean he was dropped in the race he as he got back carney collected bottles from the team car that 'enrich mass the defending champions ulan l. a. felipe who who dropped out pretty early masters obviously the writer the m evan opole was thinking about as he collected bottles and and even think has he followed thomas queens when the trek segue freighter right are about twenty kilometers to go and i think he was following him and just to mark that move to to help mass in the finale but but ended up being mass helping a evan because on that very very steep final climb before the dropbox diane into san sebastian. That's the the the mughal tonk torah climb. It's a really narrow steep road up to twenty two percent and places. I've actually climbed up at myself at kind of an of fashion. I mean on a bike with lou. Enough gears tell him to gallop but dropped by diner still quite long way back in san sebastian evans pull for such a small guys very good time trials as well. He dropped screens on the way up the climb screens of course just like the tour de france and which was pretty amazing. He looked really powerful. All the way up the climb and the kind of just stayed the same it was thirty forty seconds evan opole helda all the way back into sun sebastian it was it was a phenomenal performance performance on nineteen years of age. We've really not seen anything quite like it before knowing not standing pedigree. If you've of <hes> rice for a long time i mean i'm really precocious performances that come to mind am thomas love chris. Remember him two thousand four sacred lesotho he he won a few days off these twentieth birthday and garage sale like winning the national championships beating the air example in two thousand six as a teenager <hes> and he subsequently went on to win the world championships under twenty three world championships later that year but they were fairly good examples of of flames the burn on very brightly early on in their careers and then faded slightly. It's it's difficult to avoid or not the conclusion after seeing the weekend and <hes> the hype is is very justified in this is someone who's not just going to be a good writer but he's going to be potentially dominant ride in psycho which for me <hes> this is not you know if you think about emerging sort of stalls dominant figures and guys who can really reign supreme remove recycling i would. I always imagine that the next one of those figures would come in different package in the sense the <hes> <hes> i cycling broadens its reach across the world that we would see someone come from a part of the world or someone who who looked very different like ah for example the same boat in sprinting came along and he was something <hes> the though while the eighteen look like sprints are look before he was my toilet around in a different way. I always thought that that would be the case in cycling. It's easy to imagine that would be the case event. Opole is is acquire an unremarkable looking guy physically. He's he's a small but it's not a typical climate billed as <hes> as you say look very powerful of the weekend but he's certainly not the <hes> doesn't have the bill. You decide it with a brilliant. Tom charlie's so i it's just quite staggering really what he's managed to do. So early and you know you go back. A year and people were starting into sort of murmur about this phenomenon wasn't genie ranks one pretty much every racy taken paul in for a couple years and when my since he started cycling having had a very promising football career and at that stage a year ago the people i started talking about him turning pro <hes> and skipping the under twenty three rights completely and it seemed like a preposterous idea and ashley quickstep unpopular federal criticized for any he is skipping under three ranks. I mean he's still eligible to ride in the under twenty three order. This has been a controversial in the past where writers on world through teams have taken part and under twenty three road race and time trial and he has said he doesn't want to to do he wants to ride the senior road racing in yorkshire this year and you'd have to imagine these great trump's gonna win it. Wow i mean i think all he's performances so far of everything he's achieved. I'm the performance that will always stick him. On the east riding the junior world championships she's lost year in innsbruck where he coughed the back on pretty much right through the whole field and and then won the rice <hes> he won't do that. Obviously in the senior championships in new york ship bought <hes> already getting to a point where uh uh he's very much in contention for a leadership role in the belgian national team. Isn't it yeah i mean you would have to think so i mean san sebastian is two hundred and twenty seven kilometers. It is not a short not quite as long as the world's and this year in particular world. Championships is is a very very long road race. 'em cyril gilmar the legendary former director m still coach. The of the french national team isn't a am eh said of evan we can. He's not the new merck's but merck's plus keno with a taste of bernal and killing combat. Pay the kilian mbappe. There were one invite race the french footballer. I mean not a little bit hyperbole there. Perhaps from mcgee mar yeah. I mean that's ridiculous. Isn't it really <hes> econ econ. E e can say already. We don't really know wise. Limits arts so to suggest that he <hes> you know the three writers plus plus. A footballer through an end seems a bit fanciful one. I think is a nice counterpoint to that. Typically self-effacing roger de blaming said something along lines of well. I was also good as nineteen year old he just having he lamented the fact that he wasn't allowed to turn professional not young and how how done so he would have produced similar results else yeah development <hes> throwing cold water on the event apple hype and obviously n._f._l. And his exploits will now be be subject on scrutinized by the whole belgian cycling community <hes> the the the pundits like developing her always trotted out whenever there's a big story slacking so in belgium in the one one one slight reservation i have about event oppo is a worse place to be precocious young cyclist dan belgium. Maybe he's moving to monaco andorra or some other tanks even apparently he's he's moving to. He does seem quite a level headed guy. I mean has performance at the junior road race in last year was beyond you know convincing crushing dominant it was it was unbelievable. I mean you know he had been held up in a crash two minutes off the back chased them got back on and he doesn't seem to tire. That's the thing i mean i think even on this this climate that we can this very very steep climb and he just had bundles of energy and and it's hard to know i we're gonna hear a chat with young pizza again but even who he knows very well and it's a hard thing for the couldn't quite set to manage him over the next few years because at nineteen he got me thinking about him. As a twenty five twenty six ciro twenty-seven-year-old right are not just the next couple of years and how'd you manage his his progress on on his own. I guess desperation to write. Some of the biggest traces could be another three years before we see a grand tour for example and but here's what young peter pflieger said. He's a cycling correspondent. I hadn't used bond or one of many me and say he knows even on fronts. He wasn't in san sebastian as we hear a probably quite soon gonna be the remco poll correspondent one of one of several news baden j._p. I saw you in san. Sebastian lost year chasing after greg von vermont and the this this year a belgian one this year and you were there. No no no we made a big mistake and we won't ever make a mistake think again. We discussed during the two trials. Should we go to <hes> south of boston. Yes or no and because of my experience of lost you were indeed. I try to chase dreadful and then get him. We gotta decided that it wasn't worthwhile since we don't have sunday's newspaper as well in belgium and the reason on saturday so does no real urgency so we decided not to go which <hes> of course a big stage but you couldn't. I mean van verma assayed. Did you couldn't have expected even poll shirley to win such a big race so young exactly well. You never know oh but this to expect this would be kind of a bit ludicrous even think to to suggest that he would win say bostian given that he had <hes> never raised that this dense that he never done a world who race so that would be yeah very very something that you couldn't come. Nobody was what was the reaction like in belgium to his win very euphoric of course it's. It's been the ultimate confirmation. I think of his obvious talent before there's always been reservation small reservations when he he wanted to what happened series. It was only the hammer series when you wander the baraza belgian tour. It wasn't a world who race and now it's just a race where there there are no possible reservations patients what he did was so amazing so so unthinkable that that everybody just finally gives into this hypoth- real bill and yeah there was a big big optimism about neligence future and especially with the the talent is obvious but how does ee seems very kind of mature level headed. He speaks very well this his personality come across in belgium just like you say he seems to be very mature and wise before is is used. I i interviewed him after his double world title in innsbruck and already ten. It struck me like often when you interview really really young young. You guys are young writers. There's certain when it comes to dealing with the media he doesn't have that at all. He's very aware of what he say what he says and he wouldn't surprise me if as a as a football player he had some kind of media training because he was in he knew how the game game were very obvious and that's very rare for an eighteen year old guy and maybe that's a bit of a dangerous well because he the and it takes a bit away of his authenticity. Perhaps <hes> he always plays down his victories and of course what you're supposed to do but it seems like he he's very aware of the image that and the importance of his words after a race and in that way his mature at that this continuity or knife is not not really there. I think it's interesting isn't it. I mean what do you do with a gamut. The pressure will be enormous. The expectation in belgium will be enormous that he's the next tom boonen or the next addy eddie marks. He's still only nineteen could be three years before he rides a grand tour high. Do you think patrick lefevere unto kernan enquist that will will manage his career over the next few years. That's an interesting question <hes> this season that they would keeping him on very very small race program but he so talented that kind of buyer because of his talents they have to give him more races and bigger races so he's been ahead of the schedule i think for his entire life and and indeed like you say what they think now is to <hes> do the tour de france three years for the first time but honestly honestly. I don't think that we will wait. It will take as long as three years before we see him toured france. There's a big expectation dictation or a big question mark in belgium right now. What can you do in the tour and to think that it would trees before we see him there. I i don't know but i think perhaps it would be a wise thing to to wait with the biggest possible race for another trees that would perhaps not be a bad idea but there will be a lot of pressure to put them into earlier. I think i'm finally on the poll. How big the figure is he already now in belgium in the kind of sporting landscape <unk> much coverage to get an how am hope poplar uh-huh major figure has he become already. I think one of the most prolific writers or even spokesman in in embarrassment at this time my friends who are not into cycling they only talk to me about what is he gonna win. How good is he. It's it's difficult to overstate the impact. He has already like we had up to five or six pages in our monday's newspaper about his win and celsius so he's really really big if you see the the best <hes> clinked pieces on our website. If even a pool is in the headline people click all it. It's it's really he's very very big at the moment. Does he have a nickname yet. No that's where you come in. Fact podcast is famous well. We'll get to work out with that milo burning call them connie ball. Then was yeah yeah he is. He is small isn't quite diminutive for which makes strings. He's such a good time in the is quite small but if i may add there was an interesting piece i told the belgian newspaper where they say that the shadow broker is a bit above even a pool at this at this moment and i think that is true because everybody in cycling seems seems to be very cautious not to add too much to the hype and not too over hyped and you could even <hes> in the country on the live broadcasts saturday the caller who was a very knowledgeable commentator he he was a bit reluctant to to add credibility that even a pool would would win the race. He said if any other writer would be like eight case to go would be in this position would be super excited but because it's even the pool we kind of play play down a little bit and that's that's the sentiment that a lot of people have not not to over hype and not to contribute to the high because everybody the little bit complacent to what happened to phoebe and nobody was to make the same mistake again. I think shoot shoot that i i. I think about cars team. The back of the facts lee said p._k. Voice of race radio at the two fronts interrupts this week's episode to remind me to tell you that it is sponsored insert by locker at lock is the community driven bicycle shooter game changing concept to ensure your bike and gear in which you only share the true costs of of damages and thefts with other members of the lack of community. It'll take my word for it. Let's hear from alaka customer night. He had a recent experience an unfortunately speeds which he had to make a claim. My name is chris owen. I've been lucky customer since early two thousand eighteen and i do do the road cycling musk's racing track racing turnhill and commuting. My recent experience with locker was i was on a talking holiday in the bus country having a great time and unfortunately have a bit of a crash on the descent and did mccullough ban couldn't do anything about that but also it'd be damage to the bike and got back and needed a few things done to <hes> some repairs to the bike and lucca assorted out really quickly. It was amazing. Well first thing is always my doctor and then i went to the bike shops and got a crash report just to check that everything was okay. They they said the few bits and needed to be fixed including some damage. The chain ring didn't quite know how it did that putting the crash report to locker and within three hours how to go from the body shop to say luck had called them and sorted out the claim and comeback can get all sorted. It was amazing. I mean i got online spoke to the guys at adlakha copa immediately sending all the stuff that i needed to do they processed it really quickly and within a matter of hours that sorted out with the body is still recovering covering. I'm afraid kankkunen despair collar bones so thank you to lock up for sponsoring this week's episode of the cycling podcast like a bicycle icicle insurance powered by the community and if you'd like to check out what locker have to offer an insure your bikes on equipment go to lock. I don't cool dot u._k. Locker dot co dot u._k. Find out more about bicycle insurance powered by you. Join a community of cyclists is to play fair and take good care to save each other money on insurance daniela's first time we've made since the turn of france. I do want to ask you about on the moment but we we were listening to 'em vlieger. They're talking about ramco ev nepal and you made an interesting point well th there's a a slight parallel here with someone else who is who's come to cycling from another sport and other disciplined enough <unk> h <hes> <unk>. He's coming to sports sports discipline. You say this is the first sucking pause world exclusive tour de france partly premiums robots used to ski jumper <hes> however <hes> not that i was speaking to his manager <hes> swiss gentlemen cooling matia galley at the jiro on we talked about rogue lychees <music> trajectory his <hes> of his career so far in cycling and my saints me that one of the key things in his view is that rogue lich has always had a positive the positive postive momentum because <hes> he's he's moved through the the different steps and he's moved up the ladder very quickly and smoothly <hes> you <hes> he always had positive experiences <hes> he pretty much one i did on than he had success straight away when he turned professional and this is kind of created a feel-good factor pose an internal kind of positive momentum which has probably fueled and helped his success success <hes> thus far the difficulty will come as it may be rogue later this year when for the first time he ceased to exceed expectations <hes> dan and i think the same will probably happen with available at some point <hes> you know i it's it's easier to succeed at something when your aw you coming off success <hes> the the the motivation tends to flow a lot more easily says it's also you mentioning that unusual nature of his emergence from a country like belgium where am he's. He is clearly uh on a liar <hes> he's from a country with this great cycling tradition and culture and yet unusually perhaps for a belgian cyclists. He's come to the sport quite late. Yeah <hes> i mean four years ago is still playing football for belgium under sixteen on the left on the sixteenth just a little bit business before we carry on leap back on the on the tour de france and we've got a couple of friends specials one has it's just been released. The jeeter rosa diaries with lizzie banks and taylor wiles early great listen available to friends the podcast and coming up lunch with jonathan jonathan voters <hes> lionel went for lunch john varas as the title suggests during the third fronts and that's a really interesting listening as well touch on some of the ah things covered and authors recently published autobiography buys a really. It's a really good lesson now. I'll be coming out for friends of the podcast very very soon. A couple of episodes woods coming out this week. The latest podcast femina is i on thursday this week. <hes> lots packed into that of course from the arosa. Some of the other recent races and on friday the second episode of service course our monthly show that focuses on tack and equipment and so on presented by tom walley on cure mcvitie. That's coming on friday now. We've also got our tour coming out later. In the year first of all on event and harrogate at the world championships on friday the twenty seventh of september the royal hole in our biggest event will ever have done and you can get tickets at the cycling podcasts dot com. If you click on live events than the site will take you to our live events page on the harrogate event. Is there as our events in our grand tour which is kicking off in bristol the bristles georgia's hall on monday eleventh of november then cardiff's david's hall choosing the twelfth worcester huntington the whole on the thirteenth wednesday at belfast mac m._a._c. on friday the fifteenth remember our best selling events are almost sold out in belfast do go to the website for tickets for that soon then we'll be doing events at the arts theatre in london on the eighteenth and the twenty fifth of november the less their wife theatre on the twenty eighth of november and manchester r. n. c. m. on saturday the thirtieth november still a few more dates on venues to to be an offense but you can go to the psych podcast dot com and get tickets for those live events live events during the site finally before we go back to france and we we are on the lookout for good causes for the welte we'll be selling more stacey snyder's beautiful handmade monks they sold the jiro and they sold even quicker undeterred the turkey france so they raise lots of money for good causes and that money has been handed over to the west lothian psycho park and the david carey scholarship scholarship fund. Thank you very much indeed to all your support for those on a sadness you nominations for good causes for the vuelta please. Email is best contact at the cyclic. Take podcast dot com now. Daniel will see a lawyer that because you were you were you were. You were all self-important with a camera crew following you around everywhere you went. You know you always had your your your your team. My sirens wailing tour on there like a fireman guy kim kardashian the tour and hey what's up all right. She has a camera crew falling around all the time anyway at the end of the tour you gave it four y. You're famous. Wayne glossed prostrate thing <hes> you gave it four still two three sons i as the only five star to of all the the tours that you've covered am i'm surprised to i guess if you had a four and a half star rating it might have gone <hes> if you had a seven star rating seventy gloss rate thing as as we adopt this stealing magnus courts hotel rating system and then it might have been you know on its own somewhere nudging towards the maximum score it kind of been too far off well weeks ago was convinced that it was going to get five stars but the odds were a big disappointment because of the the imponderables the weather there was an element of that i mean i suppose a christian prudhomme. A couple of days is from the end and he made a convincing case or strong case for the the the inherent drama of the landslides and on the state to team the adding to <hes> the the magic of this torture franz but i think that added to what came next shorten states the next stay which wasn't a fantastic speedco the <hes> i thought that it was a bit of an anti climatic was a bit of a <hes> a meeting no on ways to end one being a fantastic tool yeah predom- spinning things a little bit there the you can't polish a landslide. Can you can't polish a mudslide. I mean it was obviously you see disturbing for the race and just the weather and the ops was disturbing for other reasons as well. I mean the fact that has never had that in its in all its history history and it was i said before but i was in the car just had the race in the the the way the the weather transformed from being very very nice and sunny and clear blue skies into this can agree house scape it was it was amazing with solid ice beneath us. I am cars skidding off the road cars stopping it was it was it was almost unbelievable. You compare them as kim kardashian. I had the helicopter. I had the the two and a helicopter copter on just occasionally. It's just easier daniel to get get from a to b in a helicopter. I probably no. I'm i'm not that's not become a habit <hes>. It was very very much a one off. I can assure you and the other thing that you were talking about before we started recording was the the the pino documentary was released on the final weekend of the tour <hes> and not really call people's attention not just cycling funds but in in france in particular thank you had a huge impact well an and taught franz many fantastic captivating storylines <unk> favorite was though tiba peanut story and it was captured brilliantly silently by franz television. <hes> documentary should add on the phone sunday. I think would advocate tibo <hes> it was supposed to we're supposed to be out documentary but they had some good footage in the story. Roy was so so captivating acting they run into forty five minutes in the end and everyone pretty much knows the story. <hes> knows how tibo tool when <hes> the some fantastic highs. I think the state's insanity in the last half hour of the state's son was probably the best half hour remember told france in since i've been covering for las eighteen years with filipino of the front on a stage where you wouldn't really expect too much to go on as far as the general classification indication was concerned and then <hes> from this sort of triumph of that day to the despair a couple of days later of the stage <hes> pinot lost harming crosswinds to albay and one of the the really fantastic segments of the abbot tibo <hes> documentary was to serve debrief the postmortem after that and very very rural footage of pino getting on the bus and and really tearing strips off his teammate antony ruined i sort of muttering to himself about how useless they were and how useless antony root been when william bonnie and stefan kuntz kept him safe for two hundred kilometers between them antony anthony roux would not monitored for even twenty kilometers and you know i just thought it was a it was a fantastically raw antidote to some of the slightly more contrived sports documentaries. You mentioned that we're seeing now which have their own have value <hes> little stuff being put out now while net flicks and i was in prime <hes> focusing on american sports some very very good. You'll essentially a airbrushed a bit diluted whereas this i believe it was it was very rural and <hes> i know some of the people were on the documentary. <hes> nikola j the repulsive fronts television was very <hes> very much involved in and told him this week harshly about how it it'll come together why <hes> pino decided to let a camera crew film pretty much everything <hes> the tour and apparently and pinos must be when i was a huge football fan and lost you. There was a flammable documentary from the world cup of the french national team team <hes> filmed by some of the people on pino loved it so much that he had suggested. I do something similar for <unk> francais. The initiative apparently had all come from him. I'm an any it was a bit of a surprise to me and a lot of other people incl- including nicola <hes> because peanut always someone who is. He's always been kind of shunned. The limelight doesn't revel in doesn't like social media. Particularly <hes> is quiet private person quite discreet individual do <hes> but for some reason he thought this was going to be something that was worth doing very much was but something that people always have at pino is he's very authentic. Character earn strikes me that this was a very authentic portrayal of of his struggles successes and struggles at the time. I guess thoughts wjr signed up to something that would offensively show people and it seems to have done and and i think you know there are people i know my wife is that isn't really into cycling didn't wouldn't have been able to pick table of <hes> a lineup of you know people <hes> she washed and was absolutely captivated by an captivated by pino himself and i think we'll have done you know when we talk about. I don't know if we talk about crisis and french cycling clean buck. There'll be a lack of heroes a lot of really identifiable stars. I think it will have taken peanuts a whole new audience and on the sport as well on on the back of pino well. I certainly rich in in an era in age. When people suspect the along the way sport is presented is quite cynical contriving arriving quite synthetic and we do get a lot of athletes <hes> portraying that image of themselves on social media and people get a little bit weary of some aspects of i think peanuts authentic authenticity does come through and did come through really strongly and it did. I think the documentary people focused on the were very emotional seem remote mattia which was also fantastic watching people were a little bit cynical about it. They suggested that maria was humming the cameras. If you know my <hes> i think he he has a similar the similarities in his view of the media in his approach to the media <hes> to to wait tiba penafiel n._f._l. About i mean he's not particularly interested. He someone who i think if he was to do a list of the values that he <hes> <music> holds most dear and thinks most important authenticity would be at the top of that list. I'm an anonymous was authentic in documentary so i think on an emotional level the scenes with him and peanut really will connect with people did connect with people but also just on a very granular level. I think sometimes people i'm a bit naive about the tiny details go into <hes> winning race or success or the dictate success or failure in a race and the stage the scenes on <hes> the stage and i'll be in the crosswind really brought into focus. How <hes> whoa been a tiny mistake so an it'll happen on this. What became his magic. This infamous roundabout that had cost pino almost was two minutes and not ultimately could have been the difference between him winning and losing the tour and and they all came down to basically whose fault was it and was it the fault of the dart tapes who yes yes had given the riders maps and had briefed them on that particular part the cost but they hadn't gone into enough detail on that roundabout was it the fault of the the individual who most teams now have someone who goes ahead of the race on the day of the rates and feeds back information so would have seen the way the roundabout was setup was it therefore was was it the peanuts teammates for <hes> anthony rule. You know i mentioned and often we do look races and sports inventing we <hes> would broad we paint with broad brush brush strokes. We say and we resort to cliches peanuts. It's not good in the third week. Pino is to follow in this respect that respect but it really eh comes down to these tiny sort of pixels in the in the huge pitch <hes> makes up the total france and i think that's why this is a tour weather's five wine glasses are now. It's a tour we will return to backtracking said about predom- is right in a sense. I think that stage nineteen in particular will be dissected and luke ta and you know the the wafts from that stage numerous that the drama of of the weather the decision to stop the race to the top of these are her decision was has made who made these are the things that will return to the crosswind sages another one. They're all these things that went on that. Will you're almost crying. Cry out for us to go back and revisit already and discussing. I think that's what will this tour one for the ages in a sense you know it's afterlife will be will be long long and very very interesting and you know what's going to happen with egg bernal in the future as well yeah muslim affairs far as the fringe concern on is this this will be this could unfortunately be the high water mark in terms of drama emotion hope expectation for the next <hes> an opportunity take for the next few years because <hes> someone was quite difficult to to imagine suddenly peanut on dollar philippe being in contention <hes> to win the tour again in the future when you look by now you imagine panel's going to be stronger next year. Crease-free might be back. He might be as strong as he has been in the past and thomas there again do milan might be back and he'll be you would imagine strong again <hes> you would think that after the success from a french point of view of this year the cherry groove new christian prudhomme the two guys are essentially responsible for designing the tour will will be something similar but <hes> does lightening strike twice in the same way that it's this year. I'm not so sure they'll be just waiting for david go. Do i guess the french m daniel warp finally before before we go you mentioned the rumors of his move to jimbo vs my what do you know about that. Sun web seemed determined to keep them. They've gotten under contract and they're sequel pressure coming from you movies my who seemed to something quite a bit money swilling around yeah i mean i had during the sort of i it was a done deal pretty much <hes> but done in the sense the it was decided that he was gonna leave and he was going to go by this but the details were not sorted on happened salted yeah. I think that's what will happen. He will be writing for them next year but that raises other questions and they will then have three leaders three gruntal leaders in rogue lich cries why can undo milan <hes> who i don't imagine attention will be willing to share out the three grand tours <hes> and each league one of them. I think that probably all gone. I on the tour de france next year well before we go this week. I mentioned the friend specials episodes coming up and we'll also have two different road trip available at some point <music> so vast that it's going to take weeks to to hammer into shape m. the g. rosa diary is definitely worth a listen and lionel's lunch with jonathan vaulters simulate really really good listen our thanks to a few of you have signed up as friends the podcast recently neal huff graham tough then fell organ rhyme these names feeling devlin evelyn irene robert robertson adrian murray paul mortimer alister campbell building. That's the campbell might be ben bartlett. Paul mullen mulinuu matthew busby oliver could lexi brown elizabeth levitz richard worley under morris says are holler meal <hes> andrew gifford mar blackford. Thank you very much to your and we're very grateful to you for your support. Thank you very much daniel see next week. Thank kirk's. You've been listening to the cycling. If you enjoyed this episode please write us some lever review on facebook and i just search online for the cycling podcast. This episode was edited and produced by adam bowie.

france writer belgium san sebastian daniel free bjorn lomborg football poland roy akers Lionel bernie pino london partner innsbruck bernal evan opole peter pflieger motorola mark hershey
J2 Global CEO Vivek Shah on being a serial acquirer of media businesses

Recode Media with Peter Kafka

46:00 min | 2 years ago

J2 Global CEO Vivek Shah on being a serial acquirer of media businesses

"Today's show is brought to you by Microsoft, Azure, with advanced analytics and artificial intelligence, Azure, helps businesses amplify bold, ideas and scale them worldwide hear more about how Azure enables innovative teams to push their ideas further a little later in the show and start your free account today at Azure dot com slash trial. This is Recode media with Peter Kafka. That is me I'm part of the vox media podcast network. I'm here in New York City of box media headquarters Vivek shot, they get your name. Right. You did. We me CO j two global company. Probably have not heard of I've heard of it. You've heard of it formerly see of Ziff Davis media company. You may have heard of it may be using other people that is someone that I wanted to bring on for a while because he doing something sort of counter to a lot of other media companies. He's been in the news on and off the last couple years because he was gonna by Gawker media one point did by Mashal, I'm assuming maybe you're in the market for other distressed assets. Always in the market. We can talk about that. Let's set the stage. Explain what j two global is show. Jay is a four billion dollar publicly traded internet information services company. So to your point maybe not everyone in your audience has heard of Jade. To but you've probably heard of the forty one of the forty or multiple of the forty plus brands that we own so we own hygiene, we own Mashal we own PC MAG. We own speed test. We own Everyday Health one of the whole conversation about speed test and a little bit. And we'll go on we own basically forty brands there. Either ad-supported content or subscription supported services, and you used to just run the digital media portion of the thing. And now you're on the entire yes. So the whole mcgilla is about one point two billion of revenue half of that revenue are subscription supported internet services. Things like Yvonne campaigner viper, which is antivirus and the other half is digital media. Which is if Davis and Everyday Health in the connection between the digital media side of the company and the rest of the company is what other they're all internet. I look at is the idea that mash Abol is supposed to feed viper in somewhere. To Sara supposed to be necessary. Think of us as a portfolio company, and we love the diversification that a portfolio bring so diversification is business model addresses subscription. It's content versus services, it's verticals tack health etcetera. So from our point of view, they're connected by the internet thread, and there's another connection, which is these are all businesses that are playing some role in the analog to digital transition. So I think of you as in prior to all this you were at timing running their their brands rising star one had runs if Davis you can go Google's if Davis at one point a giant magazine publisher, eventually bankrupt out of bankruptcy is now a publisher of a smaller portfolio of assets that you won't. Yes. I think you a guy who for the last three or four or five years pretty much to anyone who would ask would say. Most of you guys are doing it wrong. Most of the media business is. Going in the wrong direction. You're raising too much money. You're pursuing this advertising base slash Facebook slash Google bail strategy. It's not gonna work you can do a victory lap. Now. If you want because it kind of sounds like you had it, right? All along. I mean, look, I think from a digital media point of view, we understood pretty early on that display only by display I mean ad banners. And pre roll ads alone wasn't gonna work. Right. So recognizing that we needed multiple revenue streams, which when you go back to my Time, inC days when you go back to your magazine days, we've always had multiple revenue streams subscription there's advertising stuff. So we understood that right? And so when you look at what we've done on the media side more than half of our revenues are not display advertising. So it's either performance marketing, which we can talk more about, but it's basically driving transactions and driving leads. So yes a form of advertising, but different not R P base not request for proposal based not ad served base. But really driving transact, and you're not getting paid for showing someone getting. Paid when someone do some. So to be clear we do have a display advertising business, and it's a substantial in two hundred fifty million dollars a year. But we have north of that in performance, marketing and subscriptions, so back to your original point. Yes, I think we saw that display only wouldn't work. I think the other thing that probably distinguishes us from some not all digital media companies is we're very earnings and cash flow focused. So we run the business and sort of a really traditional way. Right. It just happens to be a digital media business. But from our point of view, we're here to generate cash is that is that just simply a function that you're publicly traded, and you have to show that no, I think, it's our mindset, and I think, you know, going back to my Time, inC days what maybe not everyone associates with timing. But I do a very disciplined company, it ran a very sound business. So the fifteen years I spent there really train. Wind me to run a media business like a business, and it was in decline for a lot of that time and it was being buff. You had the same internet problem that everyone else had, but you guys were making money year after year after year and all the folks who were there, I'm assuming that includes you said man, the problem was is that we had to take our profits and hand him over to Time Warner, and we could never do anything else. He l look. So I think the one thing that if we could have done differently. I think is to take the cash that we were generating from our operations and invest it back into the business either in the form of investments in the business operating investments or capital investments or acquisitions, and so I won't go through the acquisitions would've showed us. Well, we had a list that if we had transacted on any of those I think would have fundamentally changed that company. And so when I moved into if Davis, so I spent fifteen years at time timing when I moved into Ziff Davis just understand what Ziff Davis was. Ziff Davis had just come out of bankruptcy had one brand that was BC MAG doing sixteen million revenue losing some millions that we acquired for about twenty two and a half million dollars. So I didn't start with necessarily the most example. But what we understood was that. There was a path for that brand that if we could take the cash we were going gonna generate from that brand and acquire other brands, which we started to do that we could start to build something interesting. And really it's from that early Colonel which was two thousand and ten to today, we have a six or media business. So we understood the role that acquisitions could play in building a modern digital media company too. So that's an important part. And I think that distinction. So let's explain what performance marketing is. I think broadly, this is what people call ecommerce. Now, it's a combination of at least at least when the talk my media company. Yeah. So it's the combination of. Ah for us. It's affiliates. Ecommerce so. Links on articles that drive your users to a commerce site to transact, and you get paid when when someone click on the link or when they go there, and then maybe by or in some way, transact on the on the other side. Correct. So turning consumers of content into consumer products and services, it's something that I think a lot of businesses now are doing last year's a lot of lot of vox media hasn't little group dedicated to this BuzzFeed does the New York Times went out and bought wire cutter. And that is the core of that business. Is you go ask them what kind of refrigerators, should I buy buy this one you end up at best buy, and maybe the maybe wire cutter gets a cut of that deal. So we saw that eight years ago, and that's a two hundred and fifteen million dollar a year business for us and think about the margin profile of that's very high right because I've already spent my costs on detoro infrastructure at cetera. It also is different than your traditional ad. Business where someone says I'm going to buy a certain amount. And then you fulfil it here. It's uncapped as long as you drive. A transactional pay you, and we love that characteristic of the business. So yes, it's more competitive. More people are focused on it. But I actually think that's a positive because I'll tell you when we started an affiliate commerce most affiliate, publishers weren't the highest quality aditorial publishers. Now, you look at the affiliate commerce industry, and you've got under numbers. We've got New York Times. You've got the properties inside of this building vox, you've got quality product magazines, really pushing. Yeah. So that's good. So so that is performance marketing, another element that we have that some of these companies also have or may not have is legion where there are certain products and services, particularly in the enterprise, you're not going to transact online where we're helping collect lead forms that turned into something that a salesperson can follow up very old model and has been around as long as the internet's rape VI model. Right. Waxes and wanes, I think depending on sort of like there was a lot of credit cards stuff mortgage stuff comes back and forth, but for things high consideration products, right? Correct. Correct. Correct term for it where someone if if they lose a customer, they're gonna make an enormous amount of money. So they can pay you a significant chunk of money for that lead. That's right. They are allowable as high so given that that's the core of your business or the main thrust of your business when you're. Looking at things you wanna buy or maybe even build? I'm assuming that means that anything you're looking at has to to work in that model. So again, this is not everything. So let's go to the j two portfolio for a second. I think if you are affiliate commerce and performance marketing is one play in our playbook. Subscriptions is another is another play. But let's focus on performance marketing since we're talking about it, and we can get into subscriptions. So yes. So take Mashal. We had looked to acquire Mashburn some years ago. I love the brand I reached out to Pete Cashmore the founder, great guy. This was just last year or the deal. So we bought it last year too. Yeah. But some years ago I approached the company about buying and beat at the time chose to raise capital, and he did and he raised a Fairmont account. This is a property just to go way back that started off as a my space enthusiasts blah. He started when he was like twelve or something, and it's telling you how to modular my space, right, then became. Slake fantastically sorta successful nerdy tech specific site. And then over time intentionally tried to get much bigger and much broader. And that was the challenge. Right. I think when when we were having our original conversations, and it was a tech and digital oriented publisher. It was a profitable business. It was a great business. I think once they raised capital it changed their ambition. And so they went beyond that focus on Dettori. But more importantly, they went into a studio business, and they went into a business. Call velocity which was a software business, and I think was studio business meaning video content. We're going to make stuff, yes. For social platforms for the check books that have been out by content unit flexible by show from us. Correct. And so look I think what ended up happening. It went from a money making business to a money losing business and then over time all of those losses eight into the venture cash. Was on the balance sheet, and they're not a money. And so we look at it and say, okay, but wait a minute. If you go back in time, and if you reverse those decisions, it was a good nice core profitable business, and in inside of our portfolio. That's fantastic. So we're looking at a manageable. You say all right. It's a business with over many page views. Are you interested in the entirety of the business? Do you all we care about is specific part of that business because that's what we can attach affiliate adds to. Well, I think we in that case before you even got into adding affiliate revenue to it. Was there a profitable core? And the answer is. Yes, I mean, the the pro there was a profitable business that was inside of an unprofitable company. And so if you can reverse the decisions that made unprofitable and get back to the profitable core, your ready in a good place. And so that's what we did. Now, you layer in a new revenue stream in this case affiliate commerce, and you're in a great position so fast forward a year. Now, I think when we. We acquired Mashal their annual losses were an excess of sixteen million dollars a year. They are now a solidly profitable, you know, prime mid single digit millions business for us. It is I'm assuming you had to shrink that staff in order to get to that. Well, I mean, you'd had you've had to you know, you look for when you when I talk about reversing decisions he do that one or two ways you can try to sell pieces of the business off that you don't feel our core in this instance, they weren't really saleable assets. Or you make the decision that they're difficult decisions. But they're the right business decisions to narrow the workforce to focus on the core business. And so, yeah, you're almost shrinking to grow the business. But the alternative is a situation like Mike with business goes away entirely. Which would be a shame a brand like Mashburn. Well, should not have gone away. And thankfully, it did not go. Did you guys look at Mike? We didn't know. So why why look at a measurable, but not a Mike from very? Very very ten thousand foot perspective, they seem like similar their publishing on the internet. They're targeting younger people something different since right? One is mashed bullet established a profitable business. Right. So in its history as I said in profitable in the past it was and then decided to expand with venture money into areas that made it unprofitable, and you can reverse that. Yes. So that's a key difference. The second is if you going to participate in affiliate commerce, you need a brand that has some thority over helping inform some buying decisions Mashal has that. So when Nashville talks about the best VPN or the best headphones of the best, laptops, you'll pay attention. See you need a brand that can be attached to that kind of content. If you're going to be in the affiliate commerce business. So thirty in thing that also has affiliate commerce attached service journalism what we call service journalism when we were. I want to know what kind of headphones to buy Google when you get a list of ten results. One might be wire-cutters one mash Mashabela one might be the verge. Correct. You can make money by attaching adds to those recommendations, correct? So you you also looked famously made a bid for Gawker media when they were in bankruptcy, the stalking horse. You're the stalking. It didn't end up picking it up went to Univision. Correct. That's a whole other story now. But what was the plan had you had one that bit Gizmodo in life? Hacker to great brand tech side, and sort of generalized how to get things done. So. Yeah. So they were I think a perfect fit within our portfolio within our tech media portfolio. They had already started down the affiliate commerce path with something called Kinjo, which was really more a commerce content management system. God bless you. If you could explain that, Nick Denton tried for ten years. I think it was just basically technology to inform affiliate commerce. So they went down a path. We understood we thought we could exceleron that path. And so we were optimistic about our abilities with those properties. I think the rest of the properties were less of a fit trust. And we would have thought of ways possibly to you know, figure alternatives out for those. But we mow them off. Yeah. Yeah. And we've done that and other you know, we sold three businesses last year at j too. So we're not averse to that. It's gotta fit within the portfolio, but we really like those two brands, and we're like the price we were in it. I think if I'm not mistaken we were at ninety million dollars at that time. So it is you would have bought the entire portfolio. I think minus Gawker dot com. You would've been very interested in to those properties and figured out. What to do with the rest of them people? Forget this because Moto was the original property for Gawker Gawker came after his motto, right? When you buy an asset like a mash -able, or when you look at by an asset like a Gawker media, and they have a different culture than the j two's, if Davis culture, how do you think about how you're gonna figure out that transition how you're going to keep the people you want to keep from the the company you're buying look. I think it comes down to people wanna be in a position where they can succeed where they can win where we can invest where we can be on offense we can acquire. I mean, I think that's one of the things that's been very compelling to a lot of the people that we've acquired into the company and have stayed with us is they're able to leverage our balance sheet are cash to go and do more and build larger businesses. So so it sounds very rational. Right. But when you're talking, especially music media, right rural Delic lot of us are delicate flowers, and we think that our work is. Very important, and we're, you know, advocates of the first amendment, etc. And you go to somewhere like Ziff Davis Davis specifically like we have a model where we are gonna make money when people come to our site click on a link, and it's a good business can be very good business. It may not be sexy. It may not be interesting to someone at a cocktail party. It may not get covered in one of the teen media blogs. Do you have to sort of go to people say this is the new reality? Can you soften that blow for that? But I don't I don't think and I'm not asking them to think entirely about J to a massive thing about their brands you work at I g n. We acquired ITN. It was not a successful business. It had been a successful business, and we returned it to its par glory. So everyone who works at I gen feels like I work at a great brand. We did the same with the PC MAC PC MAG was bankrupt. Now the team there and a lot of those folks have been there for awhile field fantastic because they're part of a winning brand. I think the same as happening now at Mashal where you've got members of the team who feel really good about the fact that this is a successful profitable business that isn't going anywhere. It's very hard to imagine this when working with with the Gawker folks, especially when you see sort of what happened at Univision where they were theoretically more aligned, you know, cut to a year later, the the folks that Gawker slash Gizmodo, a writing really savage pieces about how F their owners are. I can't imagine that culture working with your culture. Yeah. Look, I think if it's if they perform and deliver results more satisfied, right? So we're I mean, you know, me enough that you know, we're not trying to impose some. Overarching corporate will one of the things I think we've done really well j two is let each of the brands determine their own paths with certain understanding around requirements around results at cetera in this discipline. But in the end, there's a self determination job. And then after you've done your job or as long as you've done your job. You can fly your freak like, yeah. I think that's absolutely right. And look, I know aditorial cultures. Right. I mean, I spent fifteen years at timing. And so we understand that fundamentally they wanna be in a position to do what they're here to do it if I can create an environment that allows. Allows these aditorial folks to write produce video audio whatever it is. And the way they want. They feel good about that right versus. I don't think people within our portfolio a worried about whether or not we're gonna make payroll whether or not we're going to be around in three months, and if you can the digital media landscape, there are a lot of people worried about whether or not their company's going to make payroll that is a very good theme. I return through and come back in just a second after here from fine advertiser. This is advertiser content. When disaster strikes affected families and communities. Call on aid organizations for relief and to help them rebuild their lives. We have responded to more than three hundred fifteen disasters around the world. 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Plus, they offer free shipping and free returns on all US orders. We can make that even better for fifteen percent off your first order, visit marine layer dot com. Enter the. Promo code, Peter at checkout, that's marine like marine and a layer the layer dot com, promo code, Peter. Record Leveque show CEO j two global we were just talking about the media landscape last year was rough seems like this year is going to be rough. I mean, if you were community genius to figure this out, right? If you were worried about where your money was going to come from last year that might be even more acute this year. One. What does that mean for your the existing business? You guys have I was looking at your last Q three looks like you were down a little bit on the media side. No overall up for the year. But I think the Q Q three was down year over year. No, no, no. Yeah. I think. Yeah. Absolutely. I blame it on my phone. Yeah. No. So we. Look we fundamentally we acquire businesses. The j two acquisition system is core to what we do. So we are entering into a market where we see some sort of deflation in prices that'll be good for us. So just to give you an order of magnitude over the last ten years, we have spent two point two billion dollars as a company acquiring companies. I think since our inception which is about two decades ago, we've acquired one hundred seventy companies so it is core to what we do. So for entering in two hundred environment. That is a buyer's market. That's fantastic for us in assuming that is going to be a lot of stuff out there. I'm sure a lot of stuff comes to you already. Think we kind of cover this. But just just lay it out one of the things that you most want to buy and one of the things that you wanna take a pass on. So look, I think that it was suing there's some things where there in the middle where like I don't wanna pay this for. But if it's offered basically new price, we have a an expression we use that we sort of paraphrase from Berkshire Hathaway, which is we buy fair businesses at great prices or great businesses at fair prices. And so what does that mean that means that there are businesses that you know, where the value is there where we see an opportunity to change something to create value. Whether that's the shrink to grow that we talked about the that's introducing a new revenue stream. And then there are businesses that are just fantastic businesses that we can throw fuel on the fire, and whether that's we can help them with marketing, whether that's we can help them with cross sell whether that's we can provide capital for them to pursue their ambitions. We'll look for those businesses too. And so a business like. That is cla or humble bundle or offers dot com. These are businesses that were fast going businesses when we bought them and all we have done is made them better, right, which is different than maybe some of the other properties that we were talking about where it was more of a turnaround situation. So we'll look across the landscape for opportunities. And ultimately the price that we pay is a function of where that businesses if you talk to the folks NBC at Comcast who up until a couple years ago, we're putting a lot of money into properties. Like this one media BuzzFeed they bought shares and snap. Now, they'll say is we're not very interested in companies that are dependent primarily in advertising. We're not very interested in companies that are Facebook dependent Google dependent are you in that same boat. Or is there a world where some of those things make sense for you. Look, it's case by case. Right. So I I think what they say is we really like commerce businesses. We like this consumers pay money for something. And and and we can partake in that. Look, I think, you know, ultimately, we look at every acquisition opportunity with one central question, which is can we create value? Right. And so and there are multiple ways in which we've created value. So it's hard for me to sort of say anything definitively like we will never do this. And we will always do this. It's case by case, and it should be right. And so we're very good at is identifying evaluating diligence ING transacting integrating acquisitions where we feel. We can create value such that it's got to be this where by owning the business. We have made it better. Right. That that we unikely can make about I assume there are two kinds of things coming across your desk. One is a Mike or a mash -able where we're we are out of money. We are going to have to close the door fair businesses a great price of X number of days. Like, someone isn't bias. We're going away. And then I'm assuming there's another buck. Bucket of people who say we business we can keep operating the business. It's just not what we thought it was going to be and or investors want out are those harder to make happen because you're trying to please different constituencies versus one thing as a fire sale in dollars dollar. I mean, again, look, I think transacting in general's never been easy, right? A lot of things have to line up. We tend to be very good at it. Because I think we very quickly come to a point of view and can move decisively and with integrity. And I think you know, we have good reputation when we transact that we behave. We behave the way we say we're going to behave. So there's no re-training. There's no sort of, you know, eleventh hour renegotiations that's not who we are. Because transactions are core to what we do so maintaining our reputation in the marketplace is critical. So no again, I think that in the third category of businesses, which really are these are great, fundamental businesses. They don't need to sell. But they recognize that if. They can get access to our balance sheet. Maybe they can go do something interesting. So let's talk about UCLA because we talked about it earlier speed speed Saint out if you if you Google speed test, if you've if because you your internet doesn't work as fast as you think it should maybe even downloaded the app because you're nerd like myself. You get that the little the gauge the gauge hit it and tells you your internet slow cracked so assume that you made money by showing me a banner ad there. You've told me I'm wrong. So step back and talk about the size of Okla. Sue cla has three hundred sixty million installs of its app all organic on various mostly phones. So that's an extraordinary statement people like me who put it on my own. So it's more than just a narrow universe of people. I figured I was really really narrow slice of nerd them. Because most people just go my internet doesn't work throw their phone. No. So three hundred sixty million installs the app. So when we looked at acquiring the company, you're right. It fundamentally. Ran programmatic ads so adds that it didn't sell that Google placed within the websites Batat not or within the app business. That's the business, and he was growing because the usage and the traffic was growing. So we looked at it. And we came to understand it because we were working with them on some editor real content. Oh, tell us the fastest is peas tell us the fastest mobile network. So we knew it was that's an interesting business. And so as we got to know them, we said, look, what are you doing with all of this information, you're sitting on this incredible view into broadband and into networks and into experience is just to be clear. Right. So me being frustrated with my internet speed other at work, or at home is somewhat is is interesting to a point to me. But if you multiply me times three hundred million people, and you know, what my internet will always internet speeds are in lots of different places, you know, where they are that becomes valley. But why well, I think the aggregated view, not the individual view, the aggregated view into the quality and performance of networks, and whether that's Verizon's network or Comcast network or Sprint's network or Vodafone's network. That's interesting to those sellers of broadband and allows them to understand where they're weak and where they're competitively disadvantaged. And so it actually helps all of us what it does is. It's kind of a rising tide lifting all boats, where we're helping these networks understand where they need to do better. So you buy that you have information that you're selling it. We sell subscription product the data as a service product, they get a real time view into the state of their networks versus their competitive set in. Territories by devices by operating system by time of day. There are a lot of variables that go into the experience. You have is a customer with the idea that it. Could inform their spectrum bidding. You know when they go into those auctions to bid on spectrum. It can inform their network investments can form a lot of things about the very product that they're selling that's valuable. So when we looked at who khloe said, okay back to where we started great business. Great natural growth rate great usage selling advertising, programmatic Lii. And now there's this other part of the business that we can layer into it. So UCLA as sellers to us like the vision had some concerns about investing to build the infrastructure loan company. Correct. We were building a business intelligence software platform. That's not what they did that takes capital. That's where coming into j to. We don't think twice that is a good capital investment. Then they had a list of companies down detector, mosaic echo companies. You may not have all that are. In this world of broadband intelligence that we have now acquired for okla- that are part of the business unit. So back to why does a new click it interested in j two they would not have made the investments, I think in the speed test intelligence products. That's what it's called the data service, and they certainly wouldn't have gone out and acquired the businesses that we've acquired for them, and that allows them to build something really special when I down in an era where people are particularly now. At least the press is particularly interested in privacy. I'm sure I've clicked the button that says sure this. Okay. I'm sure I also have not thought of why? No because I talked to about it. But I'm sure the ninety nine point ninety nine percent of people who are doing. This are not considering their data is being is gone up somewhere as being resold. Aggregated? It's not personalized are you concerned at all in an era with GDP are just an increase in privacy that a product. Like that takes information, and sort of resells it is is vulnerable in someone. Look, I think number one if you see the disclosure that we have it's very strong. It's very apparent. It's not hidden. And it's very clear what we're doing. I guarantee you that that we could walk around and find however, maybe be downloaded that app around here. And then of them have any idea what they've signed on for. He even though they've clicked. Yes. And they're intelligent people. And they'll look I think so as as far as how you would compare disclosures versus others. It's as good as it gets. Yeah. You may argue that no one ever looks at the that's that. I I can't solve human nature. But what are we doing? We're providing data to make your experience better. That I'm not targeting ads. We get a lot of inquiries into our data ad targeting for location data. We don't do that. We don't sell that. So our data business is not what you hear about with a lot of other companies where they're essentially selling your information. So someone can target an ad against you. That's not what we're doing. Are there other quiz up there? So that's the only when you're going to buy in that category where things where you can take maybe consumer behavior and figure out a different way of monetize in the new traditionally done. It's a great question. And it is thank you the one is it is when we start to think about the different models. We like, how do you find properties on the internet that have an engaged audience where the exhaust of what they do is a body of information that a company would find very valuable. Not for at targeting but to run their business exhaust, meaning the data. That's picked up in the transit. Yes. And that's an interesting perspective. Right. I mean, we have fundamentally we have audiences would try to extract rent from these audiences historically, the main rent was an ad, but there are. Attention. I put an ad in front of it. That's transaction. And you get that. Whether you've thought it through whether it's just the way, you've always, that's right. But can that audience by virtue of what they're doing in form business intelligence that's one product, and then the other piece of this which is a good segue to our humble bundle. Transaction is can we sell a subscription service to our audiences? That is not put a paywall in front of the thing. You were getting for free. I've never heard of humble bundle until I was looking at your here. Q three was morning, which apparently misread anyway. It is a fantastic business. So it is a subscription service where you get access to a trove of games video games. And every month, we give you a handful of new games. And so you pay this one fee think of it almost like a subscription video James version of this has been there's been subscription gaming's. But this one is done pretty well. And I think the reason it's done. Well, is that they've got a great perspective on which games to include each month. We also finance our own games. We have proprietary games that are humble games that come into our service. So it's a little bit. Like, you know, when you start to think of like a net flicks you start with licensed content, and then you start to move into original content. We sort of done a very similar thing. But the important thing is to it's a it's a great business on its own. They've done a fantastic job. But we have I g n which has the largest audience of gamers worldwide. So instead of saying as many publishers have done, well, how do we charge? Our users for something. They're already getting which is the continent. I Jan we're not doing that. We're seeing leverage audience coming in here. Say a paywall. Yes. Or we're not going to call it a pay while we're going to call it a at affinity group in we're going to give you extra to right. You pay us know what we're saying is we have the service over here. And we're going to. Get it. So when you look at most subscription businesses, the number one expense marketing acquiring subscribers that is the number one expense. You will see in most subscription business. You're doing the math how much pain to acquire this. This is how long are they gonna stick around customer versus the lifetime value. Right. That is the CAC versus LTV equation that is the formula of subscription businesses. What happens when your cat goes down though, because you're an owner of audiences, and that's our other epiphany. So when we think about our media businesses, we think about what subscription services can we build or acquire that are of interest to our markets into our audience is so that we can have a Whealy attractive caq LTV equation. So that is different. So when a lot of media companies talk about we're going for subscriptions. They're really talking about trying to get. Their users to pay for something that has historically been free tough. That's hard. Oh, getting paid for that was free a month ago right on this very site. It's not just information. It's the information used to get for free. We're not gonna charge you pay that's hard. But doing what we're doing that I g n and humble bundle is attractive. So that is another model where we think about what other subscription services are out there that somebody else's invented that when plugged into our re him would normally have to pay. I g n to advertise that business is on the business. You're saving money precisely it's want to go back to the thing. We talked about at the beginning of the year or beginning of this conversation. We had David Carey here a year ago, he was running Hearst the time saying, these businesses are all these digital media. It's easy to say it's easy to lose money in a digital media business, and I'm going to buy you and all your air on shares collectively partially, right? Do you think that rate of failures slash consolidation is going to celebrate this year? Well, let me start by saying I don't want anyone fail. So we don't root for people to fail said. No. And look I think that fundamentally I'd much prefer to be buying healthy businesses, and you don't want you don't want distressed asset buyer. I just wanna be viewed as a crater of value in the acquisitions that we do we won't create value die, and we won't create value. That is is an excess of what anyone else could do with the asset. I can tell you that in the end when you can get a fundamentally healthy business at an attractive price. That's the most optimal occasion. So that's what we'd rather have a month. You know, are you rubbing your hands together saying all right? This is the time to buy again, we buy all the time. So from my point of view, every market upmarket down market, flat market, where acquires I mean, if again, if you look at J two's history, if you look at the digital media portion of to the non digital media portion Ajay to we transact, that's what we do. So whether the market is a good market or bad market. We're gonna find opportunities. That's what we're good. So I don't sit here and think too much about things going to be able to control which is the marketplace in the end again, I'm simply saying my preferences. I'd rather have quality businesses that we can get at reasonable prices. What's life like for you running a public company that again, most people wanna think this includes Wall Street haven't heard of at time Inc. You're rising star. I probably heard slash Sawyer day. More often, you'll probably on more panels. Yeah. I think you relatively anonymous right now is one of the reasons cited to have you here. How important it is for you to have increased profile other for yourself or for the company if it's a benefit torch shareholders than it's important, right? And so I think the way I've approached myself in this last year's the CEO which to and it's only been one year is very much just focus on results focus on getting to know Archer holder base and our analyst universe, and and I've known them. But. Not certainly in this seat. And so that's been super important. I think what we wanna make sure of our that those who invest in public companies who would consider buying a of j com, which is which is our ticker symbol that the information's out there for them to make an informed choice. That's important, but there's some sales in this. Right. You do need to sort of Ray. I mean human beings are human being. And if they haven't heard of the company, and you need to start explaining to them with the company is that is a harder sell than if the, oh, I I I know. Building awareness of the company. Amongst those stakeholders is important. So I wouldn't dispute that getting personal recognition and and seeing my name out. There doesn't look Recode media pug has come on all because hug, Peter. Thank you know. Now, this is going to you're going to zip right up. Most admired seats. Listen. I, you know, again, there are plenty of great companies that produce terrific shareholder returns that like us are very much focused on results and less focused on press unless focused on bringing attention to ourselves if you look in the media industry, this seems to be a correlation between the things that have most buzz and working least seemed to be highly correlated. I'm not going quietly. So I don't know I, you know, I I don't think we need to over think it. But to your point, look, you're right. We're probably I've said this. We are the largest internet company that many people have never heard of. I mean at four billion dollars of enterprise value. That's a public number. That's on a made up number. It's a real number. We get reprised every second of every day is a public company. Yeah. This should be more awareness of what we're doing. And how we're doing it. But I will tell you that. I think those in the media industry in the internet business, even in the public markets. Think awareness is increasing. I think you're going to see your Werner's increase passed. So I'm glad I was able to help affect thanks for coming on great to be here. Thanks to you for listening. We love that you listen. Even more. If you tell someone else about this show, you know, how to do that. So please do that. If you're feeling extra generous review on apple podcast or wherever you listen to fine podcasts. Most particularly this one. Thanks to our sponsors. Thanks to Kate thirteen invokes media. They sell ad. So you can listen to Recode media for free Joe Robbie EDA's this show. He's awesome. So my producers gold, Arthur Eric Johnson, you the Rico media audience. You are the most awesome of all. We'll see you next week. Hello, Recode media listeners. This is enthusiastically telling you that I'm going to be at south by south west and March perhaps I'm there right now as you're listening to this. If you're going to be there, maybe there right now, you should go to the deep end by vox media. That's our experiential space, which means it's a space. You can hang out and do cool things like drink and listen to live music at the Belmont. Which is a ten minute walk from the Austin convention center. Friday, March eighth through Sunday March tenth will be hosting a series of live podcast musical spotlights. Eater approved food and much more. I'm going to be there. Cara Swisher is going to be there. The host of the verge cast. You're going to be there and boxes the wheat. 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108: Stage 16 | Nmes  Nmes | Tour de France 2019

The Cycling Podcast

53:15 min | 1 year ago

108: Stage 16 | Nmes Nmes | Tour de France 2019

"You are listening to this podcast added to the House in association with the fastest closing in a well to the cycling character right and watch in twenty nineteen as a partner education. I and Kenyan Sharam Stage Sixteen today. Well Chops his whole. Isn't it's often sultry in them. Where are we? I just said where we are well. We're outside of friendly baugh where we recorded our press conference last night. I'm we've come back here. Having initially tried to record our podcast outside an Irish bar called your people weren't very friendly there where they lying. There were another Irish either the <hes> yeah I I must say I got a little bit <hes> angry <hes> to say the least you know these <hes> unfortunately fortunately <hes> as you might have experience as a tourist in the south of France from time to time you come across and I'm very sorry to say that's quite frequent. <hes> on some you know bartenders or restaurant landlords not very been polite and kind of pushing you away because the table is dressed for dining and you're not supposed to be having bureau that sort of this is unacceptable. You know if that happens to you just leave the place and and you'll find there's lots of places as as well and it's unfortunately having been bought the restaurant owner myself. I know that these practices are rife and sometimes you don't take physical checks on just leave the place with your feet Francois Soi seen Francois so angry about anything and I'm wondering whether it's a combination of factors temperature Francois's been wearing shorts this afternoon again. Ordinary strictly enforced on the boats about gazette <hes> that <hes> you know over three nine. That's that's when over forty one. I said he's a limited over. Which I you know it's allowed where salt so? It's my last chance to add them. Actually maybe we'll talk about later but gas for the end of the week is where will table. I think we're all wilting our way. Francaise will today in the heat and it was a sprint stage. They fail fast finished by Caleb you in the winter the only thing faster than Kim storyline obe I needed to say in order to make that was a neat segue into Uh. I'M GONNA bite to say the only thing fasten Caleb today was the sale of Stacey Snyder's mugs. Oh the second batch of cups went on sale today and they sold out in four minutes. He's been getting shorter and shorter the the window of opportunity to buy one of her a beautiful at second podcast monks which have been sold at the on the tour and we'll also have well to raise money for good causes on this occasion West Levin Cycle Park New Cycling Facility in central Scotland and also David Carey Scholarship Fund who memory a young boy in Virginia who was a very keen cyclist on who very sadly died in June this year after a loan by the Fund has been setup his name to to help young kids who wouldn't otherwise be able to cycle take part in cycling activities so to really good causes on a lot of money raised for them and it's all thanks to you listeners and the response to the cups has been well. It's been very gratifying hasn't it. It's been wonderful to see the enthusiasm to to buy them and to support the good causes unto beautiful objects as well well. The thing is Richard. You said this earlier I completely agree with you. The Way Stacey has documented the making of the cops and these beautiful homemade objects. They're all you you know individual. They contain the quirks of being an individual unique handmade product and well. The only regret is she can't make enough over them. Seemingly I mean if they sent out in four minutes. Dimond is <hes> is obviously from from you. The listeners and we hopefully repeat this yeah. Why not why not? There's obviously demand there. We're sorry for everybody tried to get one and we're very pleased for those who who tried and did get a who enjoy owning it on with the stage wjr then Lionel it was <hes> well strange today starting and finishing name. Am I think the tail up no one over to you well. You're right Richard. It was a strange day for us so much to second rest day in a way or perhaps a first rest day because we traveled over from walk yesterday so rest day off with four truncated. We didn't get a lot of downtime yesterday but today with the the stage going out from name and out into the countryside back into name it gave us an opportunity to have well. I had my first lunch in an actual restaurant since Brussels not aging in motorway services or eighteen in the press room that was a real treat off the two and a half weeks. I'll have to say I thought this is still the top Taylor here the race itself. I can summarize enough handful of sentences. I were five riders in the break. Laws back of Dimension Data Stephan Rosetto coffees Alexis Guja of A._G.. To our Lucas Visnovsky of C._C._C. Paul our lean of total direct energy. They were out in heat all day. They were caught with only two and a half kilometers to go oh and then came the sprint and it was another impressive finish by lotto she dolls Caleb you and who wins his second stage of the tour and Lotto's third in all he was ahead of Elliott Viana and Dylan Groenewegen and Peter Sagan the big news on was a Yfu sang lying ninth overall this morning crashed with around twenty eight kilometers to go and he is out of the race and so everyone shuffled up a place on DC tomorrow a more demanding stage goes from in point guard up to gap and the gateway to the Alps as they say it's the fastest quizzing in a well tool the almost cycling with character Ryden Watch in two thousand nineteen as a partner education education fast and Kenyan shoreham. Thank you very much indeed ktar headline sponsor Rafeh on reminder if you want to own beautiful peddler Ducharme t shirt or Cycling Jersey or Casquette Taraf C._C.. On you'll find the second podcast podcast range of clothing there we will be a awarding up pelata Sharm t-shirt again this week at the end of the week. I'm we'll be looking for nominations of writers deserving of the pedlar ducharme awards so keep your is peeled on sending your nominations to us please line on dementia fool sighing. I the race <hes> he's not broken anything. Apparently we saw him being delivered to the medical van near the press center where he was scanned and so on and there were scenes there with his his wife <hes> with united site in a couple of TV crews trying to to film what was going on and she was getting extremely angry. I mean it was very hot. <hes> I'm sure tempers were fraying has not but scenes as I say I said the medical trump but I guess <hes> disappointing moment for her on for Yaacob fool sighing and not one that she really wanted to be on camera of course not but I can understand the other side of the story as well. We often see see those images. Don't we on T._V.. Over a writer entering or exiting the X ray truck which is normally down the near. The pressroom isn't on yet but if you're if you married to the writer who is going to be checked I imagine in pretty uncomfortable to be followed by T._v.. Cameras but that is the kind of Goldfish bowl of the Tour de France isn't a and <hes> well. It's part of life on the tour. I just realized that we see even introduce you properly tonight. Francois only at the start with the you seven so you say where we were that said sorry you spoke to Yaacob full sang the finish yes so well actually when obviously as usual crush happens to to arrive or especially prominent one there was quite a quite a crowd of our colleagues on the bus not preying on on the casualty but just to to get to know what our body was and how it happened because <hes> have been quicken we couldn't and sit so lost Michelson which is usually the the guy we talked to the team director wasn't there obviously it'd been to <hes> you know hospital or to medical checks with the so while we waited for for you know for his teammates. To come back to the bus I mean most of them waited for him and try to to see what they could do to you know <hes> take him out of trouble and fortunately they were told to go ahead and leave him behind because they obviously realize we love our buddy was sought to pillow Bo was actually just behind the Yucca foods on when the crash took place while this is what he had to say saying that crash just in front of me and <hes> three or four riders threats to the various were crossing down narrow roads and also the asphalt was didn't do nothing he went straight to the barrier anything he has a broken something in the hunt huge play for the team obviously yeah but if he doesn't move in in the moment for sure he has something serious and now important positive that we are not going to Ooh she finally were fighting and leads to try to maintain up then and game some positions day by day but <hes> now greg going to change a auditees. Obviously he didn't have any any adopter yeah for sure said Something Broken Peyot Bill Bal there of Astana boss climber apparently on his way to Bari Morita next year to who caught with Mika Lonzo we believe but another crash today was <hes> <hes> involving Darren Thomas the defending champion thing that was missing from your Taylor via top Lionel. We got your Omelette for lunch but we didn't get Gary True. I guess the defending champion is being on the floor law three times but I mean it was <hes> as I go. I very very light one. It was it was I mean it was a strange on like he ran into a corner on a roundabout with a big curb and it seemed like he peddled died then hit the curb with his pedal flipped his bike right around any foul quite heavily on some speed to me like it would be a crash rates. Maybe not pay up a bad injury but the shock of that will be something that he he certainly feels tonight on in these last days of the tour of the recovery is so important that you might just have a slow bearing on on how he recovers granted the same tell you you have these what we call infringer luck of the winner owner and <hes> well which which means basically the when you're on form and and and doing alright crushing and you know you don't hurt yourself whereas when you're on the downwards per spiral you <hes> you you crush and you hurt yourself and I was you know obviously the case too bad crushes one put him out of the race. <hes> you know Astana had been doing so well for the whole season. All of a sudden you know coming to kind of crisis and now you know so obviously the beginning stage wins. I suppose the main goal now in maybe tomorrow as early as tomorrow which is good state for them. <hes> whereas you know Garin Thomas felts a couple of times on the tour felt on the tudors fell to the Swiss as well and re well reasonably you know without any serious consequence which is probably could be seen as as a good thing you know well we can't continue without focusing on the state winner well you and less here a little sign for the law to Saddam bus which I got to just after he crossed the line so some signs there from outside the law to Sudan Boston were law them well gas and V._I._p.'s are they had a couple of sponsor nine cents on the day so maybe they were people connected with the sponsoring companies they'll become siddall law through next year and but there was champagne bottles being open and lots of cheering for the right as they return. They're having a really good <unk> fronts. Aren't they belting Tour de France. That's the third stage win again. One Senator Yan you and one in two lose again today. They've had to poke could on Jersey since champagne country on the show that have Tim Wellens. I've been very prominent breakaways and the wind for you and edgy him ahead of the other sprinters. He's the first one to not your second wind in this tour and I think it was quite striking to see the overhead short with you and a bike lengths ahead but well ahead of the other three who are all in a line via Negroni Reagan and Sagan and so you can say you know he's sort of head and shoulders above the rest in the final two hundred meters particularly when you consider that he not got the benefit of a full on lead out tray and he doesn't really need one today he came through what straight through the Middle Ralian was certainly the fastest there was no dispute about it's interesting passing because in India the other in his previous victory to the will of the Green Vegan and anyone clear this time <hes> I mean I I haven't seen the details of of the sprint but it seemed to me that it just it. Just you know made a sprint I it it didn't take anybody's will just sprint to the finish line was the fastest which is even more impressive to win in different fashions. <hes> of course he looks a little bit style is quite reminiscent of McGovern issues. I mean even mccamish himself. <hes> you know paid tribute to to you in and saying are similar inside they were you know kind of dimunitive not not not that powerful but more more based on velocity than on strength and power and and let's face it I I in my opinion these two victories. You know we're waiting. We're expecting a lot from Caribbean as as as as we said <hes> anymore when you want in this first stage is to Franz debut blue was kind of delayed I mean he could have started like much earlier but now with these two victories can of established himself as probably the men to beat you know while you mentioned Kevin Dacian biased quirk of fate in two thousand and eight companies one in both to lose name he also won in <hes> where was it not bone and a chateau rue the tour is not going to those places this year but you and you mentioned his delayed debut in the Tour de the front and if we think back richer to our live event in London back in November December twenty seventeen might white kind of revealed Caleb you would be going to the tool to make his debut from Richardson Scott in two thousand eighteen and then that didn't happen he was he was really kind of left out of the lineup because of the focus on on the D._C.. And that paves the way for you to move to Lotto Seattle so out the finish I spoke to the boss of Lotto she dial Mark Sergeant and then his old boss Matt White or Mitchelson Scott just to get that <hes> thoughts on you in the second stage win. Can you explain how you sign Caleb you and because this time last year he was not writing Brown to commission start left him out of that team. I was quite sure that he would be one of the fastest wins for the future coincidence I saw him and I told him what I thought about him and he was thrilled also by the team and doing for him from there it okay and all that I was right. I'm you've had some big sprinted in the last ten or fifteen years Robbie McEwen Andre Gripe. Can you compare to those guys yet well. He's <hes> his difference. If you compare you have to compare compare with acuity because he's also very aggressive on <hes> looking for the wheels he wants and Nomi has done today lost I think and he <hes> he made it all by himself up. So you start. It's way too early for him but he he manage to get a great. He's much modern sprinter because he doesn't need lead out train of five or six guys loud really but they were there. They were making the tempo so he's he can do his thing. He wants to do it by himself the train and and that's where you so <hes> so good. They didn't have the fastest in front of him so he went for anyone. That's the most important today on how about pirates now that it's calm but have some oxygen in front wunderlist this lofty you guys have to make quite difficult decision with Len Caleb you and go sprinter. He's calling because couldn't into what you wanted to do but when you see him win a couple of stages away he's won them. How do you how do you feel what do you think I'm happy for? Arm but he he's a great guy. He's worked very very hard to get where he where he has. There's no there's no bad blood there at all. It's it's a business decision and he can't do you can't do both things properly. Let us at all done due general calcification. They've primary focus is around the classics and so it was a great great detained for him to go to. We're going to different track J._C.. In all in all three grand tours and also will to rice in general every will to arrest we go to where we competitive to taught win it and now with the reduction team sizes from nine to eight and sometimes eight two seven minute rosters. You know trying to have a sprinter support crew climb is doing J._C.. Either do it properly if you tried to do both things it can backfire but it just shows the ride Aleve and find the team that can accommodate them. You you start to see the best of them a hundred percent and look at the end of the Caleb one everything but the size of the font on our team we had developed since he was twenty nine thousand nine years old and had the same wrought through airports Amy Walter One and the so <hes> it was the last book for him to take and congratulations shoot that I I think what caused team car. The back of the facts lease P._k.. For reminding us to tell you this episode about Turano coverage is sponsored by the what atom we've spoken in previous episodes to Dan Bigham the hoop what Mike Track team and we mentioned how stable the what bike atom feels so we wanted to ask Dan what his experiences these were and whether the stability the what like atom helped win trying to do effort maximum walks they've gone about looking at how does apply throughout the bike and whether needs to critically brace that in quite why platform as well see getting rocking he can do obsolete full gus sprints not not worry about that as we did the White One K. challenge is a facebook live video somewhere and Johnny Pizza Two thousand one hundred on it and batting moved yeah. There's not an issue that's all it out perspective and just a couple of years ago when we were into every time we dean sprint shot when he makes stunned on the tip I so make sure you rip you. Bike ofo toll off or whatever so yeah it's upset you rock steady for that. You cannot folks it one bit. The frustrating thing about is for it makes it ought. Let's take it around everywhere soccer tickets to go more with the Augusta in reality. Every price I think is worth just having such solid and stable Indo training tool says I have one in the shooter Missouri which is a bit naughty I but again he just means you don't have to worry you'd have to drag bikes in and out with the altitude is just also the Narran because it's so easy to adjust you've got sliding subtle for aft- up down same again withdraws and the extensions on there as well say everyone's positions can be on in in seconds really really easy just training. John had enough to Mexico a few months time to be only say the I I could. I could have told you that the what atom is stable when you're two thousand plus USS Watts. They didn't need Dan big. Tell us that I dispute this dispute this. I WANNA see your numbers because he's number sound power. No Mile and I don't doubt the WOP I gotta I doubt you I did feel though even with my mediocre wars it didn't wobble. There was no rock-solid very steady and the other thing about is its footprint so to speak. It's very small you can push away into the corner of the room when you're done with it and really takes up very little space whatsoever. If you'd like to buy what Mike Atom you can do so what dot com and you have until the end of July to get one hundred pounds worth of sigma sport vouchers with every by atom purchased go to what bike dot com slash T._C._p.. One hundred and Music O._T._C. pay one hundred when you check out that's T._C.. Pay and the number one hundred before the break we heard from montage of lots of Saddam and Matt White of Mitchelson Scott Caleb Ewan as suggested Ni- went on the leasing. He's never finished the grand tour. This is the furthest he's ever been in. A grant started four before three geos three Jiri. I'm one VUELTA. He's never never got to the end and that there were some whispers that he may be off the stage. <hes> not would not would seem silly and I wouldn't with this chance opened up a third a third stage on on on the shelves Eliza and he must be delighted to to be here and to be in this art form because I you know to go through the new team. <hes> it was a really I think it was a really important season for him and for his team because he was sep into the shoes of Andre Gripe will those are big shoes to fill on very different writers aren't they. He's very diminutive Caleb Ewan and he's he's a huge gorilla boundary gripe will but you know for him to seize one-season Gio on here is is fantastic for him and for his team you spoke to their well their new new new manager yeah definitely <hes> John Long and I well. That's exactly the question asked him what what next I mean. You know. <hes> that that there's a bumpy stage to gap tomorrow it. Could you know which could very <hes> very well fine for tomorrow Gaynor. Tim Wellens to to keep chasing <hes> K._O._M._O.. Points and also <hes> longest seemed to imply the immune would go all the way to Paris in spite of apparently Lee ferry very hot mountain while we knew the mountains in the Alps would be tough but apparently they going to be very cold and stormy as well so <hes> could Calabrian survive <hes> these these Alpine ordeal <hes> <hes> well. Let's let's listen to join us to say. Confidence is important for sprint so you think that now thanks to these victories. It can go a level higher. I think that the confidence is there. Since the beginning of the season we have seen that that we are totally totally focusing on on those statements for him and that the seven writers which are on the tour of France are totally focusing on them on all those stages weasel the exception and that even if he was in <hes> into trouble <hes> in the stage today's I go doc that would be real. We directly stopped all team to a to wait for him because we knew that just after as we have more one more opportunity and and you say that guys like these were not Willens Thomas against they were taking six guys to bring him back to the Peloton into be sure that they can survive the civil to finally three shorts probably stormy stages in the Alps. I it'll be a matter of survival enough yet. No it will be survival not only for Kelly by people but first. Let's concentrate tomorrow. We have an ice age we have to gap may be an opportunity for breakaways. We'll see so. Let's take stage-by-stage final word on Caleb you and before we move on I'll refer you back to Adam. Blinds lives interview with them. which was the first blind interview series? It was really fascinating to learn by versatile writer. Caleb Yin was in his youth. You know he's not just a pure sprinter. That's obviously is his specialism now but he was a guy who has a a generic twenty three writer climbed with the bachelor them and hit a funny story about the world championships thing in Florence where the commentator confused with Colombian. He thought that he was a Colombian writer just because he was climbing moralities is quite diminutive. The Colombians are similar similar build so there's more to Caleb Ewan than just the final two hundred meters of a race so you know he's got every every chance of making it to Paris winning on the Sean sleazy once again going back to the cavendish comparison. I mean you remember how bad mawkish felt. Every time you know is <hes> climbing abilities. Were put into question you know. How could we forget Marquez racing again today returned to racing or is it tomorrow <hes> he's racing this weekend? We know we've gone overall battle to concentrate on the next few days. Not We're not really sure maybe what to expect tomorrow. It's a sort of transition stage setting up to huge stages three huge sages and they all S- really is it. I'm lost track of the days. Tomorrow's widened saying the so then Thursday Friday. Saturday are the baked days in the Alps the finish today I spoke to heavier architecture. The coach not many aunts who looks after Agan Bernal among others. I just wanted to get from him. A sense of how Bernales had into these crucial stages because there's been talk about you know of any else got it right in terms of having their writers come to the boil at just the right moment in these sages. Everybody knows when it's going to be decided Thursday Friday Saturday perhaps out today. Perhaps the turbo we decided on the final climb enemy. Here's our tech on Bernal. He's still young right this second grunter but he's a very. A strong position in in the final week how busy physically at the moment yeah he's feeling okay. No I think one of these strengthens their recovery. We Solange as well the third week he was doing a really good job for the team. This year is <hes> is pretty much the same nokia feeling well well. <hes> recovery arrestee yesterday was really good for him this morning. He looks really really well so were looking for the last week to the heat as well. I don't know something is something that will find now now. Maybe he the race too much with the heat but he likes both when he skied and also when he's called he lays both extreme conditions because he thinks that he said the race can be harder on when you when you feel good you want you want to raise now. It suits really well to him Saturday and Sunday the modernization apprentice was he performing there at the level. You expected from him. Yeah I think he was for performing really well. If you see how extraordinary people was in the race and only the climbing the power they produced and <hes> health as they went. I think him he superformula well. He had a really good numbers. We are hoping to have the same as we keeping the Alps I mean altitude a factor as well and he comes from Bogota with two thousand six. Hundred Meters is on a factor in his favor this week as well. We have so I think he when <hes> racist going up to two thousand meters is GonNa be a benefit for him because <hes> as you said he lives at twenty seven hundred meters ovation in hip Akira in Columbia quite a few kilometres during the two difference of <hes> two thousand meters so we hope he's going to be a benefit for him and he's going to perform really well at this. Did you can win the Ter- who's GonNa win the for a high turnout I think he's one of the gangrene and jeers world so <hes> for last as long as a we have the winning teams we're Happy Cycling Podcast and the twenty nine hundred to the France is supported by fainting sports science books fueled by science. Thank you very much indeed science sport for their support of the cycling podcast and you can get your twenty five percent off. SCIENTISTS POURED DOT COM with the Code S._I._S. C. P. Twenty-five S._I._S. EP twenty-five are reminded to the scientists are running a finalist competition to win a day in the team any team. I ended the Vuelta or the tour Bresson. It's your choice. You will also win four hundred pints spending money transport and two nights accommodation. There are some great runners up prize as well and that to enter the competition. All you have to do is go to scientists dot com forward slash sign up sciences sport dot com forward slash sign up good luck with that now I was mentioning the the stages that we've got coming out lionel but more detail on those yeah well tomorrow stages of atypical stage to GATT. We always know what's going to happen in. There's always a climb what six seven eight kilometers from the finish finish and then a descent down into town could be one from the breakaway unlikely that the riders will be particularly active not least because they're on any bone seconds on that final climb tomorrow the next stage on Thursday to value our Asia is really difficult. It goes over the Cold Avar which is two thousand one hundred nine meters a code Zoa which two thousand three hundred sixty meters and Nicole Duke two thousand six hundred forty two meters and there's a time bonus on the top before aw descent down into that said that's a real difficult stage then on Friday. The stage goes to teen is actually pretty short one hundred and twenty six point five kilometers. If you look at the profile these are all way to the Cold Deli's around that bonus seconds on that climb and then climb up to teen the finish which is not that difficult coming as a summit finish that will certainly you know whether we see action on the penultimate climb leading to that well we'll we'll have to wait and see and then on Saturday it could as we've been speculating all day rich could come down to the final kilometers of Delta in the before that we've got the Cormet de Roselend and then climb climbed valter any than a brute it goes up really for the last thirty five kilometers of the stage and the last eight or nine hundred meters probably not dissimilar to the new that they did on lap launch the bill fee in the first last week. We were talking morning today. Browse for about the you know the tactics here and when I was talking to him he was saying problem. Here is Julian Felipe is is ahead and he's the first not that has to be cracked. They have to put him to the sword soared by setting a fast pace somewhere on on the climbs but of course no one wants to do too much because the whoever cracks the not somebody else may greedily come along and they need the contents of the not ahead of them to get allergy. I suppose my wife this morning he <hes> he presented the ALA fleet loss over an hour by the time we get to Paris. He says the explosion is going to be huge says it's coming might I interestingly Olof. Leap probably didn't go for a ride at tall on the right stay on. He didn't do any press off the stage today as required by the the the right in the day off tonight I can make discretionary well application to the organizers to not do the media stage winner. It has to go but but the Jersey stays in the euro for for a long while things on ten days and maybe is it the case probably <hes> as you know can say no to one while I didn't. I didn't know that I don't know we'll see anywhere they 'em. It was also interesting day brill's for <hes> really tip Timika Landa. He said he's he's the one guy who who has the ability to attack on climate sustain a getaway now we've I've watched and thought well is he being allowed to get away because he's a bit further back overall but according to Brill's for is you know he has. He has a sort of ability that I love writers. Don't have any still I say threat this. It's morning I was talking with our other journalists to magnus blackouts. You know the Brian Throw <hes> German writer which you know we all <hes> like very much because he's nice talkative I think with all the Shaam <hes> and we asked him for his one top three in Paris said Mick Alumna I mean without any hint of an as he tation so yeah I'll be off. Everybody has had the impression that we were always talking about Tim O. Pinole losing one forty but London also lost as we are now eight to nine in a crash and it was it was one of the one of the guys in the Pyrenees I mean the the there was obviously the the most <hes> <hes> you know mostly efficient climate in appearance but meek Alumna was was was pretty close in terms of the results I heard somewhere I can't remember where the list of who performed best on in appearance in in terms of Simon and London was just behind Pino where obviously Simon years he didn't do so badly because he went to stages as well so May- maybe a laugh is predicted with the men on the on the way down and London men on the way up and another another very important factor I as mentioned before I had a look at our weather forecast to know how to dress in the since I wore shorts to there. I'm afraid is probably going to the last hour wear shorts because songs are predicted to towards the end of the stadium are in gap up and then the the the three next days I mean the the big plays in the mountains look to be absolutely grueling in term of weather forecasts big storms heavy storms the temperature going down and on on the on the on the Trucial Denver Vertebras <hes> that the maximum temperature scheduled for the time being is twelve <hes> with an starting at like six in the morning so <hes> I mean if you're going to go to the last stage around US Alpine find stage you know take your on Iraq and and and you know winter gear because it's going to be very very very cool and cold around could plus <hes> rainy so this could affect really the outcome of the weather gods smiling on people Pinot because we know he doesn't like the extreme heat he wouldn't want to be climbing and this sort of temperatures woody today who knows I mean what's the possibility of a stage being shortened because of the weather or even even on our. Let's not speculate. I know I'm just contemplating idea of the race the for the win thirty years after nineteen eight thousand nine in the closest finish ever and the race for the Yellow Jersey coming into the final climbing five writers six riders May Sill having a shot at winning. I mean imagine could happen. We'll talk about it again and <hes> you know because today's talk about way but but you know I I know the the Clem too well doing very well and all these valet going up from Mucci because I as as you know I covered Alpine skiing a lot and it's civilian well and the once again what one regret we could have the from the fact that we missed some Duma learn on Chris Room on the storefronts <unk> because what we as we go up to the Vertebras we go would normally kosher there and that's where you have the Olympic Board you know for ski jumping so I I mean I it. He would have been familiar tearing seeing Oh. What's the connection between drug login ski jumping? I Dunno curveball there are we are we thinking feature Rhino no no on the team bus outside the team bus nickless Roach team somewhat Miko. How was your restaurant restaurant very absolutely did nothing you didn't rod you guessed it off course yes sorry but that that's included in doing nothing? No we did a an hour and a half in the morning. <hes> actually extra probably a bit less but an hour and a quarter just kind of find a nice coffee place in the center and then you kind of stroll back to the hotel in the afternoon was more about <hes> you know <music> as a as stupid as it sounded ass couple of weeks for so hectic that your suitcase just kind of slowly distorted becomes a mess so I just kind of took my time reorganizing my rain bags and reorganizing the suitcase making sure everything is nicely folded. You're not going to need stuff out. You're running back these next a couple of days pretty warm down here. You used to these kinds of temperatures comfortable yeah of them <hes>. I don't know I mean I've never complained about the heat the French off the Irish off. Maybe <hes> used to the rain. You've got to the past oppose folk world again yeah although you know I think your buddy does it apps and as much as I've been living abroad for almost twenty years now since I was fifteen <hes> I think my load rain. I slowly disappeared. What should the poor being for you could come to Mulan being here would be a very very different race for you guys? How are you kind of <hes> you know managing that? Could you kind of have a free rein. Did it kind of lack of definition sometimes no not at all <hes> the teams strategy is very very clear here. It's every day we take it. As a one day race we go to sage with a better cards so the strategy is more clear than ever <hes> obviously it's a hundred percent different strategy if Domos there but the plan is clear and the thing is it's. It's just not an easy plan the sick to you know when you go for stages you find yourself fighting against the top products were also going for sages and it doesn't mean when you try and win. His Age actually GonNa Win One <hes> obviously it would have been very different with <hes> rotting in protection of Tom and making sure keeping keeping in position riding from in the mountains. It's a very different tactic now we it's all about using everybody strength in <hes> in the best way possible on the particular say for example when there was four of us up the road you today while Nick yes and case sacrifice themselves south put me in the best position onto the climb Michael took over on the second part to make sure that we're going to rise to get at the bottom of the line most as I've been doing that work for Michael Riding in the front two thirty eight ago. There's not nothing about saving energy for the next day because we kind of trying to shared load and work as a team is towards this goal of trying to win a stage you wrote a tour ten years ago changed much since then can you can you think back to two thousand nine and unrecognized with different yes and no because I mean psyching in general has evolved not only the tour so it doesn't change from one day to the other so it's kind of progressively changed. I think I've just <hes> kind of sunk it in without really paying attention. I mean ten years ago. This would have been a skin tight Jersey the jerseys in two thousand nine look woman baggy and the Pike. We've all kind of <hes> back technology. I guess you don't notice because it's always evolving yeah. I mean that's true that a couple days ago for example I posted a throwback photo from two dozen ten when we did a terminate and I have <hes> you know have the Speedo on the front with the cable going around to fork. My Jersey is a little bit baggy. My sleeves rope to hear much of the so higher up than they are now and I remember when the I think it was garment at the time came on the shelves visa with the skin suits and as I watched this election and then now everybody's running a road suit or whatever they name it but <hes> it's very similar but I think it was two eleven. I think it might have been when the garment guy showed up with a skin suit on the last day under saying what's this case short sage but <hes> where are you gonNA put your food and and to be honest <hes> once I've tried the the road suits I found another that because I've kind of broad shoulders and I just felt that without having to shop stripes <hes> I was able to breathe better and largely I mean this tour is open is probably the most exciting tool for almost thirty years do. Do you know if that will feel not when you're in the race do you do you feel it's an open race and anything can happen and the end. Could you tell me who you think's going to win and it's GonNa take a lot of energy over the next couple of days to get rid of athlete but I still believe Jake. Although I think today the best Climber Independent on Gary Nicklaus route so your latest victim Lionel so am the wish seems. Have you still got to do. I haven't done one hundred zero. I haven't done by v SMA haven't done total direct movies MMA tennyson that wasn't outside the team sat with something very similar was hang on. Where did you take place on interviews? Take place very key distinction between doing an interview outside the team bus and doing outside the team but I should have taken the nickel roads victim to outside team. It is a little bit like cheating because every time you don't know who to interview good to Nikola Road because his is nice looks four or five languages and I wanted to do Wilco Kelderman bathing not here so yeah difficult difficult to try had to do <hes> somebody F- education. It's very difficult very difficult. Games use the F. Education first because they arrived late. They had to get a police escort into town on time they arrived with only about an hour to go and <hes> that meant they they hadn't had that team meeting and then they had to sign on and I'll tell you I'm I'll try them another day but that would be ironic wouldn't if I got to go to the end of the regime hadn't managed to have a word with somebody from AF education I it would be <hes> we'll finally tonight. I'm calling link occurs from the Associated Press A._p.. John Lester tweeted <hes> a series of tweets this morning by his great great grandfather are really quite incredible story as a link between his great great grandfather and today's stage and I thought I would going ask him about today. When we met at the press center the fringe banana an Englishman a Frenchman and an Englishman yeah well put tell us the story that you posted on on twitter today well I'm here at the race covering the Tour de France for the Associated Press and it so happens that today they went up and down a hill where my great great grandfather was cycling back in nineteen forty eight from a football match in which store also went through today and on his way down the hill well he had an accident and suffered a fatal head injury and so we were talking about this last night with <hes> you know mom and other members of our family and you know because they will going out they will out there today basically pretty much where he had this accident and Hamill Ducas <hes> actually has very interesting sort of personal story? He was a French Protestant pastor which is like a priest during the war and actually worked to shelter Jews from the Holocaust so he was providing people with fake identity papers back to baptism papers and save some Jews from from possible execution by the nuts is afterwards in one thousand nine hundred ninety two he was recognized by the Ad Vashem Holocaust memorial in Jerusalem as being amongst the right chesser basically people who non-jews who during the war had helped Jews in this very dark time in their history and so yes we ended up talking about this and it just struck me that this is very much a story of the tour because every day. The race goes past some little thing that will mean something to somebody. It strikes me when we're driving on these roads and you see the little memorials by the side of the road of people who've been killed in car accidents or motorbike accidents and this just today it happens to be a story where the where it happened to touch my family so that's why I tweeted what I did and it also turns out just to make an even long story longer that Hemel jackasses son hct was in the French resistance and he was executed in nineteen forty four <hes> while his dad was also you know as I said before <hes> doing his bit to and sometimes the father and son now both on the Yad Vashem Memorial <hes> for what they had done during the war Robert would be your grandfather's brother earlier. I am old. You did not do forty eight. He was my great great grandfather. My Mother's grandfather Hobart do cass was my great uncle. It was nice today because of Emerald Yukos's his only surviving child is now ninety-three Anne she lives. It's right next to where the race Zoom Pasta. Her kids came out to the race. <hes> route which is at the top of the hill where they're great grandfather was killed and my mom's <hes> was down at the bottom of the hill it kind of had a very personal feel very personal sort of family sort of field you know today through does it doesn't it. I suppose as you say it shines a light on places villages buildings hells and puts them in the in the spotlight for a day and analyze these stories till almost have new life breathe into them absolutely because you know this is the only sporting event that actually moves around right you go to a football match your in a football stadium. The tour is going through. People's lives going through people's history is going through people's towns villages right past their houses every single day and so basically it's it's a sporting event that goes right into your front yard right into your house right into your family history <hes> and that makes it so unique under feel special to be able to tell this this family story again as well and through members suppose as being a special day for me today and you know to be honest with you. I mean this is a story that I've heard many times since growing up and but never really spent the time to <hes> as I did today <hes> to sort of really dig into his family history and I hadn't actually realized personally that he was on this memorial in Jerusalem or bear either either and there's there's a there's very little swimming spot that the ride is actually should've stopped off today which is about a kilometer away from his house and when I used to go there as a kid every day to go and swim in this horrendous heat I used to walk past Roberts <hes> This is a War Memorial oiled with his name on it so he always kind of been present today. SORTA gave me a chance to sort of really dig into this story and I was kind of surprised myself so yeah it has been a very emotional so you looking up old pictures on on your computer there. You're writing stories about working. People read the story that will be on on the Associated Press Wire and A._p.. News Dot Org which our website <hes> and those photos for my dad who's kind of like a <hes> history hoarder of our family. He's been gathering together loads of photos and it's that when I sent him a message today photos of him on Hobart and sure enough. He's got a whole bunch of them so hopefully they'll be on this story as well as Joel Master set a very typical sort of twitter fronts story a lovely story on the A- precious day for him and his family which was nice here about. We should wrap things option. Shouldn't we fellas ahead for dinner. In name. We had a lovely dinner last night <hes> overlooking amphitheater in name <hes> with a few colleagues from the pressroom and roundabout this evening. I'm quite keen to type something just something nice and simple relatively early night before we we move on again for these final few days in out because well the tour is all coming down to the last few stages now. Isn't it so we need to be. We need to recharge batteries Japan feel. That name has allowed us to do that. It's been lovely. Yes bar the band service. It's been a very pleasant Forte Ariza so here hasn't it. Francois absolutely more yeah name is quite a nice little town. I mean if you come in the area. Korea I actually last night where we're dinner in at the top of a new museum called museum row if you're into Roman era and you like you know archeology and all these you antics things that we know you need a re nine old monuments in the town but his new museums ap apparently absolutely gorgeous and and while the restaurant was nice as well. I'm just GONNA mention theft in the restaurant. Last night we all loaded are starters and Richard and I had ordered the same starter <hes> Buffalo Mozzarella with <hes> some local tomatoes and a little bit of Pesto and well Richards is always dr around on the table when the started arrive and he he encouraged Francois to steal my starter but what was amusing welcome to swap them the starters yeah so I had a small portion but what was amusing was then Hannah troop who who you may remember co hosted the explore series with me last year and he's now working for education I she swooped in to swap earth even smaller starter with one stone me at backfired horribly actually I I I was I was left with a very meagre starter indeed so once again you come to come to name avoid they. The the restaurants I kind of mentioned there are very nice wounds and once again tried to music row Disa- great plays you're and you're just in between Montpellier great place and Arles which is also a brain in place to to come and visit an any few into you know this kind of the south southern atmosphere miniature in atmosphere and you like you know what we call. What Michael old stones you know the kind of monuments from the past you have a great one listener kind of taunted me saying <hes> given the the stage today we'll be going through vineyards all they can you recommend wines and you mentioned Kostya the name which the winds in the in the area of him we had actually concealed Anima Rosie last night which was quite good actually but to be honest I if we're talking about red wines at go more for the ones in the multi region unlike big Lou <hes> are the mini were made of Canyon the in in in going to carcassonne or even the red ones near nearer to our he should go to our our salary mutiple this his area try out in Milan Henry Millin? That's great ones as well but the plus if you go for Roseanne Nim not from named as little village Tavil is probably the most the most famous rosie in the world so there we are <hes> the the the the little wine lesson that was that was supposed to be giving. It's just been given an going back to my beer. Well Yeah. Hopefully we'll be nice rosa tonight. We're in rosy rosy country rosie weather's it sounds like Neem is about to kick into party mode abandoned about to start playing here. They were little bandstands around town lost night so live music was kind of drifting through the streets pleasant late Cynthia Law Yeah Forego Daunting Today on my Austin Cycles Ato folding bike. If you want to win one of those sign up for a newsletter cycling PODCAST DOT COM and then through the newsletter you can enter competition. Tell us why you should win. This bike is a beautiful carbon-fiber folding bike on. We'll read a few more entries for tomorrow night. I think before we go some thanks to France the podcast and reminded that you can sign up as a friend of the podcast at the cycle pump gas dot com. Most recent episode was lunch with Dave Bradford. There's lots more episodes to come including <hes> audio diaries from the Gerusa by Taylor wiles and lizzy banks who WANNA stage. They're not not becoming sin on. I I think lots of other episodes exclusives friends podcast coming as well my thanks to those who've signed up recently Timothy Main Nigel hartill John Lyons Jonathan Lewis Sabe Ramsey Anderson Schneider you and Jenny Craig COMERC- Not Tennyson Cokes Michael Chertoff Joe Tickets Lee Chapman Jonathan Cuts Nicholas Russin and a big thank you to Susan Taylor Michael Stuart Adam Nash Susan Ross Paul Gaining and Sarah World. Thank you fellas. Thank you Richard See you tomorrow. Well see now but Dr <music>.

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Hearst President and CEO Steve Swartz on Helming a 132 Year-Old, Family-Owned Media Powerhouse

KindredCast: Insights From Dealmakers & Thought Leaders

44:30 min | 2 years ago

Hearst President and CEO Steve Swartz on Helming a 132 Year-Old, Family-Owned Media Powerhouse

"Hi. I'm Viva Ramani. And welcome to episode fifty four of kindred cast a biweekly podcast featuring insights from dealmakers and thought leaders from the world of tech media, and everything in between kindred cast is a production of kindred media, powered by lion Trie on today's show. Steve swertz, the president and CEO of Hearst corporation, sits with lion. Tree CO are able or cough to discuss his unique perspectives at the helm of the hundred thirty two year old family run media powerhouse conversation ranges from Hearst, prescient move into business media, and services to swertz, his well, regarded personal style, which she describes as IBM salesman. Circa, nineteen sixty tune into here how Steve and his colleagues are writing the next chapter of this multi generational juggernaut. It is my pleasure to be sitting here with the president and CEO of the Hearst corporation. Mr. Stephen source, thank you very much for being here. Thanks for having me. It is one hundred thirty year history hearse has grown to own conic print and digital brands like bizarre. L cosmopolitan, the San Francisco, Chronicle and more. They also have steaks and Amy ESPN and owned companies in the business information sector like Fitch Ratings was Steve at its two thousand thirteen and in senior positions for decades prior Hearst, which starred as a newspaper business now trousers, all areas of media, finance and business. Steve has one of the more unique executive this in the world as a leader of a very influential mass media company that controls acids of legacy and new media as well. Leading business information conglomerate and doing it as a private company. Steve, welcome. Thank you for being here with us on Kidger cast, thank you hearses one of those companies that I've talked internally about being. Model like it'd be so bold for how to really build a proper family. Run business. Let me just say that. I hope you and I can get together. When we celebrate the hundred and thirty second birthday of Lyon, tree. Thank you very much. If we get to the thirty second birthday lines of you happy to start. You know, we're only seven years in the making so far, but Hearst is a unique company. So tell me why, or how it is to work at a private family owned business. That's generational nature. I think every company is unique in their own way. I think some of the things that said as part I mean, we are a hundred and thirty two years old. We had a very dynamic founder William Randolph Hearst to was constantly challenging the business side to look for the next thing that made sense in the context of a media company, you know, here's someone who was born fabulously wealthy, because his father was one of the most successful miners in the great gold and silver, rush. Senator George Hearst. So he didn't really even have to work, but he went right into the newspaper business because he wanted to make a difference. He bought afternoon newspapers because he wanted to serve. The common man, and that the working man's paper was the afternoon paper, but he pushed us into magazines. He pushed us into radio before he died. He lived a very long life. He bought one of the first television stations and nineteen forty eight so he established our culture at our place of pushing beyond your comfort zone to look for new areas of growth and innovation. And then we had another icon, ick leader, my predecessor Frank Vanik ran the company for almost thirty years, and he pushed us much more into broadcast television and into cable television and got us going in what we call business media, which are companies like fetch. And so, yes, we're privately held we're actually owned by trust. The fact is, they're both management trustees and family trustees that trustees tend to be lifetime appointments. So we have people who keep a long relationship with the company it reinforces, the culture, reinforces the history, I think all of that. Makes it a relatively unique place to work, but there's something about the culture or maybe the charter, or even the trustees that encourage hurston the company and yourself as chief executive to put more money into the company for growth and innovation and not just to manage the assets of old. I really think it starts with the founder and I think that again, because we've had this trustee system, the keeps executives and family members with a long direct relationship with the company, I think that's how these things get passed on, and they don't get lost one of the shame of public companies, people reach a certain age. And then they're out there not only out as CEO or chairman, but they go off the board. One of the things that I think, helps us is that we just have this history that we're supposed to keep pushing we're not just building the company for today's colleagues and today's dividend recipients, but for future colleagues future dividend recipients, and that's just been passed on. I think it's in our DNA when I became CEO, I didn't have to change anything that was already in the culture, and of course, Frank still right down. The hall is our executive vice chairman make ensure that I don't screw things up hardly. But not. Only did you know the mandate when he became executive. But you also knew that the part of the role is to innovate is to change is to diversify the business again. A new business lines which you've done beautifully somewhat say her may not even be described as a media company. I mean, how would you describe? I will we like to think of ourselves as entertainment information and services company, but I would argue that a hundred and thirty two years ago, we were the same thing because when William Randolph Hurst, persuaded his father to let him take over a newspaper that his father, owned as part of a wide diverse holdings of Senator Hearst, the San Francisco Examiner in eighteen eighty seven I would argue at that time and still to some degree today that newspaper, particularly back then was a principal source of entertainment, a principal source of information and provided all kinds of services to the community hundred and thirty two years later. Would argue that we are obviously entertainment through. Yes. PIN through the history and lifetime channels principally in our local stations information. Yes, is still news, but has also morphed over time into financial credit information through Fitch aviation and information through a company called camp that we own fabulous company, and then the services have become more software services camp as an aviation data and software company, we have a couple of medical software company. So I would argue that while the actual execution elements have evolved. We've stayed in three broad areas of entertainment information, and services because one of the reasons why actually start doing this podcast is because of the storytelling opportunity around this industry, and really not only where we're going, but where we've come from, and that's why. By looking forward to this conversation with Steve because you have a sense of media, and information services is not being a static concept, but where we came from and where we're going very much still in growth mode, and innovation mode. And that is a hallmark for the industry. Most times these are public companies and very hard to transition into these new models, as a public company Bentley, when you have a traditional beat ABI business, which is media in most cases now to beat ac- to consumer business, also very difficult the skill set. So everyone says, I wish I was just a private company doing this, but you have the luxury of doing so there's a give you a different way of taking risk of being bold, as a private family, controlled business versus being public whichever wanna Republic ever is a long time. We have no current need or plans to be public one of the great things about our portfolio. Is it generates a very significant amount of free cash that allows us to keep invest? Sting in the kind of businesses that we want invest in without going to the public markets for equity capital and actually using very little debt as well. So, I think, though that it's not so much public versus private. It's a legacy and its credibility. So whether we were public or private, we would not have been able to pull off the expansion that we had over the last several years into more and more business data medical data or business or medical software. If we hadn't had a legacy of doing that which came out of trade publishing, so you go back forty or fifty years through various acquisitions. I don't think trade publishing was ever a top of mind strategy for the company, but through various acquisitions, we got some trade publications some of which we still publish we still publish Lor covering weekly. And if you wanna know what? That's about the name says it all, but it's still a profitable industry publication. So we continue to do that. But back forty fifty years ago, we were publishing magazines called American druggist. We republishing magazine called motor, which was for people who repair cars for living, fortunately, for us, the publishers of those to trade magazines, again, forty fifty years ago decided that as good or better business would be to be collecting data in their industry. And of course, at the time they had the publish this date in big books, because there was no internet, but American druggist spawned, a company called first databank, which we own one hundred percent of, and it is the largest source in this country of drug dosing information, drug interaction information that is relied on by hospitals and pharmacies across this country. And in some other countries that came out of American druggist motor more from a magazine about how to fix cars into a database as to how to fix cars and repair times and, and repair cost estimates. And is now a fabulous data business that is put together. I think it's in the realm of twenty seven or twenty eight straight years of revenue and profit growth, so we did more aggressively decide Frank Bennett, and I when I was fortunate enough to become his chief operating officer in two thousand eleven we jointly decided with the tremendous support of our board, and particularly our chairman will Hearst to push more aggressively into business data and business off wear, and since that decision we've made nine billion dollars of backwards issues in that area alone, including, including Fitch, we own a smaller piece of fish, we now one hundred percent. A fish and what is forever one's audience and sort of a rating agency component kids, one of the global ratings agencies clearly along with SNP and Moody's and Fitch itself has a long history. And I think Paul Taylor and his team are CEO there do a fabulous job, and it's global rating agency and then it has other non raidings financial information product. So it is a large global financial data provider. Now when you say ratings obviously, this is not media ratings. No, you're talking about bond rating. Right. But the debt markets and the financial markets, so you start off as a Wall Street Journal. Reporter, I believe way back when take us through how that skill set and being very well read gives you the qualifications to be overseeing this conglomerate and building this company. Most of us have had any success in life. And if it from just having head great mentors in from the time I joined the Wall Street Journal, I got to work with such giants in the businesses. Norm perlstein and James b Stewart who writes a famous column now for the New York Times. And I think that what you learn as a financial journalist, is how to analyze things you have to some things up quickly. You have to master a number of different industries. So I was fortunate enough to both cover Wall Street than I was an editor on the front page desk, and then you had work on Cynthia. Sizing these big stories that could've come from the farm bureau's or the Washington bureau. So I think it was at still a very young age. Still in my twenties, a great learning experience. And then when I hit expressed to my bosses at the time a long-term desire to be on the business when a chance the Wall Street Journal, and her started talking about publishing the financial magazine. They said to me, my bosses at the journal so, well, this would be a good opportunity for you on Choubey our lead Representative on this project, and that led to the push into the business, interestingly enough that project, which was called thus mart money magazine, which we brought out in nineteen ninety one I think Hearst person that was put on that project. David carey. And he did a fabulous podcast with you, and David went on to run our magazine division in a fabulous way. And we've been good personal and business friends over since. Now, his graduated to becoming a student at Harvard. Now he is on the Harvard campus and advanced leadership program, and I have a son, who's on the Harvard campus as sophomore great from journalists to business person, and then obviously in chief executive senior executive Hertz corporation along the way. What could you point to for your ascendancy, that was an accolade, or sort of a bold Beth that you've made that got everyone's attention saying, well, this person really could lead this company. I don't know that it was anyone thing. And I think most of aside from the way you dress. The. Look, a lot of things in live his lock in being in the right place at the right time as long as you're working hard and trying hard and, you know, I think smart money, the fact that smart money ended up being a successful launch with myself, as the launch editor in David as the launch publisher. I think another thing that actually kinda helped me in an odd way, David decided after we were up and running a couple years to move on. And he joined nother fabulous media company at Conde nast when he moved on Frank Bennett, who has been my principal mentor in life. And I've been very fortunate in that Frank said to me, would you be interested in taking over David's business, I'd responsibilities, and I guess I was around thirty one at the time and I very much was so that was my first time with that. I was fully on the business, and it was really a lucky turn of events both the David decided to move on. And that Frank decided to give me a chance while it's worked very well. And now as the CEO, would you say that the most innovative moves that you've made or the boldest move may have been in the businesses area way from media? I think the biggest decision that Frank and myself and our board med was to push harder in to what we call business media, which is the Fitch and the medical and the transportation data off where businesses because I think it was relatively clear back, then this was early two thousand eleven that the entire consumer media sector some of which were still growing at a rapid rate. Certainly ESPN was knocking the cover off the ball and an e was blowing through their numbers every year PA positively. Yes. But I think it was clear what we were seeing happening with newspapers getting disrupted by technology and magazines getting disrupted by technology and yellow pages. Getting disrupt that the same thing was inevitably going to happen to the television business. Maybe not as dramatically because television, is it self digital business, but was going to happen. Something was going to happen to the model and we were getting at that time, roughly ninety percent of our profits from consumer media. So we decided in our board and our management team. It really is in many respects, like a partnership at Hearst of all of various division heads, and senior executives and our board, and certainly Frank. We decided that let's push more aggressively into an area that was already working for a so we had the credibility. We just weren't as big as we felt we needed to be. And now in two thousand nineteen we expect almost forty percent of our profits to come from these e to be businesses. Meanwhile, what we thought would happen has happened, not in a dramatic way. But clearly we're seeing some changes in the business model of. Television that has not in any way. Made it a bad business. It is still a very good business, but it's growth pattern has clearly been altered by the changing technology and media landscape. Could you give us a sense of speaking out, how big hurston, what the diversification, as well as a private company, we reserve, the right not to talk about our profits? We did about eleven and a half billion dollars of revenue and we run at a very respectable margin and about forty percent of that you'd think is you said as businesses in two thousand eighteen it was thirty three percent of our profits came from the business media. It's business media sits tend to have a higher margin. So they're not as big a percentage of our revenue. But of our profits thirty three and because our business media portfolio is growing at a double digit clip while the consumer media side. Is not growing anywhere near that fast. This year we think it'll be about forty percent of our profits. And obviously, if those patterns continue, and we're pragmatist so we don't know. But obviously, we will move and I think we would be in better shape, if we move more toward a fifty fifty balance or even just given the prevailing climate north of fifty fifty in favor of the BBC stuff. So this is what I'm really impressed with, because we all love the media business, and obviously, you have your tentacles, a lot of places in that business, and that's been a legacy part of the company, but to really plot out a diversified model that gives you hand growth and business diversification. The same time, I think if I could be bold is the beginning of your legacy the long way to go. We both fans of writer. David brooks. I've been studying his concept, even off the New York Times up ED's of what he calls his second mountain. We this is a personal development, but even from a business perspective. We all climb. Our first mountain, we've spoken about it a lot, which you reach your core competency, hopefully around our age groups and then you start to hit a valley of thought about what you really wanna be in the future versus where you came from. And that valley is a very self-aware process of what the business looks like and where you wanna go, and then you start climbing your second mountain, which is kind of a scary place to be because not where you came from. But it could be a very joyful productive exuberant experience because it's really taking on a new chapter. Once you have a purpose about that, then it can be transcended. That's how I think about you. But how you're working with hurston transforming the business in your direction? Well, first of all, David Brooks is fabulous and perhaps the best columnist writing today, and like you on excited to hear about his new book, and to read it at hers. I've already read it. Area. You're nothing if not flunked doesn't surprise me at all. I think that it hurts. At least it really is a partnership. I don't look at this as in any way my legacy, again, we're building on William Randolph Hearst, did. And Frank bin ich did, and he still with it. We still have this fabulous group of trustees who are both some retired members of senior management who are still very actively involved, some daily, we're just very blessed all of the divisions of hers, whether it would be Jordan were LeBron Hearst television are thirty three stations or David. And now Troy young running magazines Mark all them who's now our chief operating officer at the corporation, but he ran newspapers for many years. Now. Jeff Johnson neared Kim Lonnie who helps us oversee our entertained before we just have fabulous group of folks, Paul Taylor at Fitch or can great camper. We just have a fabulous group. Of really CEO's of their own business eve, Burton Burton, our chief, legal officer and matures CFL, I'm going to leave somebody out some purpose about this. But, you know, we just have a fabulous group of folks in its collective partnership again. We got a great board. Very supportive will Hearst in the hers family. So it's a collective and really what we've done is really a continuum that starts with the founder. So we're just building off of that to some respects in it. See David Brooks thing on YouTube, so I guess I'm a little familiar to some degree. I think what he could also be talking about, is what people do outside of work, and we all work most of the time. But obviously, there's also can be another leg that doesn't necessarily have to interfere with what you're doing businesswise. But, you know making more of giving back more of a philanthropic commitment, more of the civic commitment. And there again, you know, working at hers, that's just. Baked into the DNA. We are all expected. We've got David carry now up at Harvard in this advanced program, trying to learn more about the not for profit sector that will influence what he does either in his business life or in his private life going forward. Certainly, many of our trustees will is very Finland. Thraw bec- Frank Bennett spin on the New York Presbyterian hospital board for forty years and has served as its chairman served as chairman Lincoln center. So we learned that Franken regard because the chairman of the center, yet for Germany into the center, so trying to follow in his footsteps, there's well and, and, you know, work on things like Lincoln center. I'm also pleased to be on the board at New York Presbyterian, a very a privilege to be on that Boorda, chairman of the Associated Press. So some of that is what one does to make a contribution in areas that are not directly, but can be related to what you. Do in the workplace for sure. I want to talk about the area of partnerships because Hurst has been known over long time with one very notable example, which we're going to bring up of being just a phenomenal partner, contributing partner investor, but one that's very easy to work with, and obviously very productive to work alongside and these referred to ESPN. So Hearst for longtime at a twenty percent owners reviews peon in partnership with Disney, which has been the majority holder, take us through how that came to be, and why that parts of it works so beautifully relation with Disney overall. Well, yeah, I mean we're just so fortunate to be tied. Disney is innovating on so many levels when you're thinking about the great CEO's in general, or particularly great CEO's in the media business. You've gotta start with Bob Eiger. So the history of it is hurston ABC, when it was a stand alone company back in. The early eighties Leonard Goldensohn the phenomenal men who build ABC and Frank Bennett came together and decided to have television partnership, that would aim at this new thing called cable television and out of that partnership came the lifetime channels, and eventually the history channel Leonard also bought for ABC ESPN, then capital cities, the fabulous team of Murphy, and Burke with Warren Buffett as their biggest shareholder came in and quired ABC. So our partner became cap cities ABC during that time twenty percent of ESPN that was not owned by cap cities ABC came up for sale that twenty percent had been owned by the RJR, Nabisco company, and after the famous takeover by KTAR that spawned the book and movie barbarians at the gate. They decided that they needed to sell down some non-core assets to pay down dead. And so they put their twenty percent and Frank and his colleagues at the time acquired that twenty percent aided by the fact that there was a comfort level at cap cities, that we would be a good twenty percent holder to their eighty. I know they regret not actually buying it themselves. But we benefited from that, and then in the mid nineties, Disney acquired cap cities, and they have been our partner ever since and the relationship is really fabulous. And it's really across a huge swath of our media portfolio. So clearly Disney owns and controls ESPN. They own eighty percent. We own twenty percent. We like to think that we're very supportive and been good board members. But they're calling the shots and Jimmy Petar the relatively new head of ESPN is just doing phenomenal job. He fifty fifty we and Disney own. On eighty history in lifetime and some of their other channels together, and we have a relatively new CEO there. Paul Bucci hairy who once against just doing a phenomenal job running any, and then we own fifteen ABC affiliate television station. So we're really all in, in the television business as a partner of Disney, you look at what Bob has done, first of all, you know, realizing I think before just about anybody did that cable had carried the game for a long time. And while cable wasn't going away. New growth needed to be put in place and Bob position. Disney to have that new growth from blockbuster brands and his acquisitions of Star Wars, and marvel and picks are just totally put them in place for a new era of growth, and certainly inspired us for us. We couldn't go into the movie business. William Randolph Hearst had tried that decided that wasn't for us and move. Moved on. But for us that new Lega growth was business media, I was very inspired by what Bob had done at Disney. And now he's positioning Disney as the leader in going direct to consumer with the great brands and we're already benefiting. Yes. Bien pluses, off to a great start as a relatively new streaming brand. So we couldn't have a better or more important partner than Disney. Yeah. But that partial continues to evolve mean the eighty twenty partnership peon that's clear. They call the shots your reporter and you probably obviously very involved in what's happening even though Disney's and. A fifty fifty partnership is not easy because usually a fifty one forty nine or someone has to call their shot, but fifty fifty you coming together making decisions together is wherever an issue like who has a hand when there's a I mean it's really been great over many decades. This is one of those partnerships where the contract never comes out of the drawer. We've always been able to jointly make decisions and keep things going. And any has just had phenomenal growth over the last thirty years. What do you think now that the Disney FOX deal is closing or just closed, or set the close, depending on, when we actually released this podcast? It's a obviously very much imminent that is now going to be a content drug or not with direct consumer offering and getting bigger and bigger in his own. Right. How does that change your with Disney? And is there some sense of the partnership is kind of left behind, or will that ultimately be part of that whole contents? Edgy. Well, I can't speak for Bob or Kevin mayor or any of our great partners there. They'll have to and do a great job of laying out their own strategy. All I can say about it, and he is it, it's a big company. It's a significant company on its own. It's a significant part of our significant part of Disney's earning. So you can't imagine anything of that size and quality. I mean right now, and he has pretty much any way you slice it three networks in the top twenty so they don't think you get everything in terms of an e being left behind as significant s but we are in a scale moment for media. Right. Which is evidenced by the Disney FOX deal eight to two Time Warner. Comcast sky other notable examples as well. Do you get concerned about being subscale orders? You're partial Disney, make you feel more comfortable. You're either to one of the scale players, but we'll see. I mean, obviously, as you say the landscape keeps changing I wouldn't single any outlook every. Media business regardless of its size is evaluating change and trying to figure out what the future is. And it's hard to say if you wanna look out five ten years, where we'll be where the traditional bundle will be where new bundles will be how big affect your will streaming be what will be the relative consumption patterns traditional brands, versus more, Netflix, or Amazon, of course, Disney will now control fabulous, Brandon Hulu. And so I just think for all consumer media brands what the future holds is hard to predict, but all I'll say about an e is three channels in the top twenty I feel pretty good about the top twenty on the cable dial. Yeah, but how do you think about from direct consumer perspective, but we'll have to see, I mean, I think everything in the direct to consumer world is relatively nascent except for Amazon, and if you other players, so, yeah, Netflix, of course. So we'll see. Yeah. And broader topic on technology mean technology has to be brought into any businesses days, not just about the consumer video places even software companies and business services and even this podcast. Right. This is a new technology, even though it sounds like an old technology and the audio business. Your first podcast, I'm happy to be welcoming you into the new frontier here, but tell me about how Hearst, incorporates technology know-how in partnerships United together, the Microsoft CEO summit. So I know that you're in the game and involved, but how do you think about as a business leader? Well, obviously, there are many layers of technology. I think what we're most excited about is what we think, is the dawning of phenomenal new age of productivity across businesses across the world in, you know, much is been written. Professor Gordon wrote the seminal book about how what has happened in the modern era. Has not produced the same level of dramatic leaps in productivity, as we had with the dawning of electricity. Refrigeration aviation would have you kind of thing that so far, the digital revolution of the streaming revolution or whatever kind of hasn't really produced that level of change. And there's been a lot written about Larry Summers in particular about a level of stagnation, and the economy. I think, though that we're on the cost with artificial intelligence machine learning opportunities for automation. I think we're on the cusp of a great leap in productivity, and we're excited about it, and trying to use it across every Hearst business mostly from the notion that armed with insights pattern recognition in what have you from the computational power? That's out there today. That no individual has the time or resources to do. I just think our folks across the creative side, the business. I defined scan be making better decisions, and I think that's going to be pushed across so a big focus for us that Mark all the Marci fop rating officer is leading is just to make sure that we are integrating machine learning. And there aspects of artificial intelligence in every business operation using fabulous off the shelf, tools, hiring, some fabulous, statea, scientists, and mathematicians. And what have you to make sure that we're constantly trying to take our data put it into better forms, and then run some learning against it and make better decisions, so projecting or speaking for our audience here, and listen to you talk, you sound like a very sophisticated Stewart of capital and business executive, but there's also a very funny. And warm and inspirational side to Steve sports, because I know that side of you and you could let it out a little bit here. It's safe because we do share with each other are year and letters that we send up to our people, and I'm grateful that you haven't trusted me to read your and get a sense of your leadership style. And I appreciate your taking a look at mine, and giving me your feedback as well. But give me a sense of how you lead. It's a big company obviously, you have company of a deep bench, you have Frank as inspirational executive vice chair and leader, but really, it's kind of a lonely job. So leadership is really there to serve the people and the company and you do a great job of that. And I saw that really through, you're writing your letter. So what does your style who I, I love the concept of any annual letter because hopefully our colleagues benefit from it because we're relatively diversified company. And we want them to have a full appreciation of everything that's going on the opportunities the challenges, and where each of our may. Divisions is headed your letter is notable for a lot of business insight, but you also have book recommendations, which takes it, one step farther than mine, or even Warren Buffett's. And I think all of us are inspired by Warren's letters. I've read them all and commend anybody who hasn't read them, all they are phenomenal forty plus years of business history. And maybe going on fifty years of business history and insight and wisdom. And it's just amazing to read them. So I think many of us who write letters, Jamie Dimon, of course, rights phenomena letter are inspired by Warren, and his ladder riding at that, Microsoft, comatose able to tell war, and, and then typical and he immediately turned around and recommended two or three letters that I should read that I hadn't read before just a fabulous. That was a great time to warn we got to go to Bill, Gates's house and see the library and in, you know, Saudi and the Dow's doing such a fabulous job running Microsoft. So that was. Great to be able to be that conference leadership. I think today not just for Hearst. But for most businesses is about collaboration. It's about working through differences to come up with a shared vision. Everybody's going to have different perspectives. Not all of our senior team gonna gre- on everything, but getting people comfortable, and with a path, and working through and building consensus for it working with our management team. Our trustees are bored. I think it's a lot about that. And I think things like an annual letter can add clarity because it's a very fast moving world and sometimes you gotta step back at Hearst. I think, again, we're fortunate that whoever is in the ios spot is supported by group, trustees and board members and again, fabulous senior folks, and I said, I know it leaves somebody out, but did wanna mention you know, rich Malik who are executive vice president for business media Willie was integral to. Building that portfolio that we have of businesses today. So tell something interesting about Stephen Schwartz. Most people don't know. Well, interesting is a loaded word, and what do you do for fun? I love to read loved to read history. I think the one volume biography of Churchill that came out that the New York Times pushed hard is just really. I mean what a life what an amazing lie that rob. Andrew Roberts, just phenomenal. And like to be current and reading about policy in thinking, and you've recommended the trilogy the sapiens and. To home dad. So those are great by the Israeli he's fabulous. And so I've read all of those I like to read a lot, I like to watch a lot of ESPN. My wife says, you know, I hope you don't think this is actually counts. His business sitting there watching, you know, basketball game or football game and lacrosse games and travel or your wife likes travel. My wife is always planning something, and thank goodness because we get to see the world to her, and then finally, I'm trying to learn how to play golf, I think after a year and a half of lessons, making a little bit of progress. It's great because it concentrates the mind, there's a little ball, sitting on a nice piece of grass. The ball doesn't move and it's just so confounding the inability to hit it squarely is quite a challenge, but making progress my one recommendation for you on that topic of golf is, I would suggest you pick a ping pong. Instead, it's a lot, more efficient fifteen minutes, you're done you can go back home. Go back to your office, and you get the same kind of rush to say this about pink pie. I was a good ping pong player when I was a kid, we had a table in our basement, and a sister who was two years younger, and she would got invited to all the parties when we were in high school, and I wouldn't. So I would be in the basement playing with another guy who didn't get invited to the parties either we got very good at ping pong, but I had a humbling experience. And I think all of us do as we get older, and particularly as our kids get older ones, almost twenty one and one's about to turn seventeen and they became such great ping pong players. I taught them to play. And now I don't think they'll play with me, and if they would I wouldn't enjoy it, so we have much retired after seeing how far you can play it into your older ages. I pride ourselves that we have a ping pong table here in the office from day one, and even as grown, we've kept it in a flushed out all the best ping pong players media because they come over here to play some with a change of clothes because they're so. Serious about it. And they're so good at it that they come in, and they wanna make sure they don't get to work up. Steve. I appreciate your being here finished with us on the book that you're reading today that we should all take advice from, I'm reading so many at the same time right now and what I've really been trying to do. I'm reading about two or three all in the realm of machine learning or artificial intelligence, and I can't for the life of me. Remember the names of any of the three but I think all of this needs to really educate ourselves in that area and be on the cutting edge. And, you know, one last anecdote from the Churchill book, he wasn't just a visionary in terms of where he saw the menace of Hitler and Nazism. He was incredibly knowledgeable about the technology of the day. He had this quirky professor, who would come. Visit him all the time and make sure that he was totally current on military technology. Aviation technology. So when he took over he really was ready to lead the British war effort. I'm trying to learn from that all of his can learn from that none of us is innate -ly as knowledgeable 's, we should be about these areas, but we all have to both read as much as we can, but also find the people either inside our company or outside who really know about this, and make sure we're constantly talking this through because I think the implications are very great indeed side note, because you're gonna talk about golf, all the things are interested in, but really from my perspective where you thrive is in your style, and how you dress and I have that whenever I got up in the morning knowing on a C you it changes the way that I dress because I feel like after Brandt because they're one of the more impeccably-dressed executives out, not the fed anyone else out there. But you just adopt above. Well, let me just respond to that by saying since people can't see the two of us on this podcast as I sit here. I am in my usual uniform, which is kind. Kind of IBM salesman. Circa, nineteen sixty I have a navy blue suit on a white shirt, a blue tie and black high socks. I'm looking over there a bore cough, who looked like he just stepped out of a plug one of our publications Esquire. I mean, there is a subtle check shirt, there's a striped tie that goes exactly what the colors of the check. There's a very interesting, shall we say, I know he spent some time in London. There's a very British looking kind of cardigan and the sued has a lot of subtle texture to it. I mean this man is really well dressed, and he knows it. So the last time area came and visited Hearst he was as turned out as he is today, and he insisted that we take a picture. So my sister took a picture. And then area had the picture framed and he sent it to the house, and we're not sure who did it may have been one of the boys may been somebody's who here's a picture. So in our family room, we have pictures of all of our family members, you know, the kids cousins, nephews nieces, whatever and one day, I'm looking at it with my wife and we're both looking. We says, how did bore cough getting our family collection? So there is the picture of area at me right in the middle of the sports family election. So that just for me underscores the ubiquity of area, bore cough, he is truly these elig of modern New York life. Live ratio, many ways to cover a client, and this is one of our. Coach. Well, I'm glad that were on audio and not being visualized. We look nothing like the way. Okay. Well, thank you for being with us on kindred cast. And I look forward to the continuing to learn from you and our collaboration. And watching you thrive both in giving back as well as in your sheep executive rollovers. Well, thank you area agree, pleasure. Thank you very much. I hope you enjoyed our show today. If you wanna check out any prior episodes, you can find us on apple podcasts, Spotify or wherever, you listen feel free to leave a review there. As it helps people find the show. You can also follow us on Instagram, Twitter and Facebook at kindred cast for behind the scenes photos, and info, keep listening and see you next time. Shen.

Hearst corporation William Randolph Hearst CEO Disney Frank hurston ABC executive Steve Senator George Hearst president and CEO David ESPN chairman New York Times founder Frank Bennett Fitch Ratings David Brooks
Christian DelGrosso & Kristen McGowan Aren't Allowed to Golf Anymore

Worst Firsts

56:27 min | 1 year ago

Christian DelGrosso & Kristen McGowan Aren't Allowed to Golf Anymore

"Listen to real stories about today's most popular celebrities and influencers. I have your number one source and it's our hollywood podcast cast behind the fame. What's going on everyone. I'm tony morris creator host and ceo of hollywood's most talked about celebrity news outlet of all all time holly wire hollywood's behind the fame podcast reveals juicy celebrity relationship stories tips and advice on how to be a true influence influence her in the positives and negatives of being in the limelight identity stars like post malone billy eyelash arianna grind day before anyone else. Even it knew who they were. My co host jenna rosenberg pride ourselves on knowing who the next big household name is before anyone else does once you listened listen to behind the fame you'll laugh. You'll cry and you even feel like you're actually part of the conversation holly wire behind the fame catch new episodes every week available salable anywhere you download your podcasts. Are you listening to this episode on himalayas if you are congratulations because you're already using the best new podcast app out there if you're not well you're loser and missing out so get it together. <hes> whether era podcast or a fan himalayas is designed with you in mind and has a ton of cool new features like curated share. We'll play list collections made just for you along with personalized allies recommendations to help with content discovery and the best part is it's super easy to use. It's definitely my favorite listening app and i'm sure it will be yours too so do yourself a favor and download himalayas today and be sure to follow my show worse i once you're there by the the camera is focused on christian wonderful gas. They are christian and which is great christian christon <music>. He's christian. She's kristen. You guys get it. Are we okay. Is everyone okay. This is worse. I which christian did already you told me your worst dating story but worse. I burst has expanded. It's just my dad watching this now. It's crazy in my dad. Subscribers say sell excited to have them watching this basically basically now on the show. We are doing any worse. I like. I worst job. I worst drug. You have all christian too. I i wanna hear so i i drug literally. There's been a there's a job. I worth over or doth. How do you go from that to that. I was expecting to say something house. My that's so fucked up these is i'm reading mental like us. It's insane insane okay so i'm so excited so i don't know which one of you wants to start first sharing your first were pursuant to us share to want to hear one of mine circuito i know i don't know if i've shared this before but i was. I was telling tom yesterday. Qatami did the podcast yesterday and i was telling him about the first time i had sex and it was the worst like i was so paranoid. I was eighteen and and i was so paranoid. This guy was like a rock star like druggy guy. You know whatever clearly my type hasn't changed. A married now by the way yeah so like he hit on me was so sweet. I don't know if i've shared this before anyway i i i ended up going back to his house like after hanging out a couple of times. He told me how beautiful was all the time he was amazing. He was actually so sweet. He was covered in tattoos so hot so go to his house right and it's like it's kind of like you know like a drug den but it's cool. It's like it looks like an opium dan but i'm like oh. Maybe that's his style at school so we're like hanging out <hes> we go to have sex and i'm like oh my god. I'm so scared i was eighteen. I was like can you put two condoms on your under watching it. Are you serious aunt dad to condoms extra safe over here. Can you put you condoms on. I'm just scared. Barrett hit like a big like it was just like scary for me okay because i'd never had sex or two condoms and condoms. Make sure that i'd extradite don't get pregnant right so to put two condoms on. We have sachs super uncomfortable for me. Obviously feels like i'm just sticking like a fucking rubber chicken vagina meals various christ they have the rubber chicken goes further overseas speak just rubber chicken rubber chicken my vagina alan. We're losing our sponsors. They're all about to call up literally pull out. Certainly we're having sex. It's so painful. I'm like okay. I'm like non joy myself. He's not enjoying himself because he's got to condoms actually did that now. This is what the why did do it so we're done having sex and then we go out to the living room or hanging out and he just started shooting heroin stolac literally like there. There's a reason why his plays like opium. Oh my god because he had he had all these tattoos all over him. Oh my god which is crazy because tommy does too and this wasn't tommy tommy. This is another guy and all these issues and you just started shooting up heroin and then i realize in the koi fish tattoos yet i conceal the track marks so it was a heroin addict so then i freak out and i'm like jesus christ doing heroin holy shit but he didn't look like a druggie like he looked like place rocker place was like his his place was like rock star like drapey like kind of like the movie. Would you midst lying in two weeks out. I freaked. I was like on the guy teaching me the hospital. I think i've aids my god so scared i was taking home immediately and then i went to the hospital now that you're on heroin drive me home oh dr driving b._m._w. Almost almost crashing drives me home. I go to the hospital. I'm like i'm pregnant and i think i have aids like literally both every time everything i've aids and i'm pregnant i and my it's going to be an aids baby. I was ready to call eunice. After it was awful it was i was so bad they were like. Oh ma'am you're fine. You're not pregnant and you don't have aids because they used to. It's was freaking out. What do i have. I know right mike that would scare me away forever. We're never waste oy ever have sex again for a really long time ruined. I feel sorry because he never seen anyone don't even would it was crazy and then he was like once on am all know only eighteen with a rubber chicken vaginas. It was really scary you guys so i freaked out it was out of there and yes and then i never heard from him again and i'm really not if i shared that story. I feel like i kind of share. It didn't really give all the details. That was my first time. Having sex that scarring it was so scarring lake the scar ring now for holidays yet but yeah go ahead. Tell me you guys. You're like one time. I was making out with this this girl and like okay. There's the worst i've ever tell me. I don't know if we can help the heroine's story jesus wait so tell me kristen christian getting jealous christian get jealous of what does he get jealous. When you talk about other guys know well. The thing is you just see me. We've been dating for like the only guy really a- you've never been with anyone else kirsch. No that's amazing thank you. That's beautiful tape-recorded. This was the the grand canyon road. I wanna come through a roadblock. They really what was called. Worse i literally. I should get my bachelor anyway great. No it's great. It's it worked out because my husband's got a big weiner so so i if it's perfectly plugs it up you know oh my god this podcast i i it's by extends. It's not it's not meant to be dirty. Okay people knock it off. Keep it clean guys free. We're getting clean okay. Sorry go ahead okay so was i. What would you have towards. I guess tell me your first worst experience. It can be anything okay. She's all humanity for. I don't even know if i've ever told you. I think it's funny to all girls. This is like a girl or you. Are you ready. I might have told because it's just like stupid embarrassing okay. I don't know if it's inappropriate okay but the first the verse time i ever used a tampon. Oh my gosh yes. Those are horror stories. Tell me i know it was happening down here. Christian can't relate okay so i had to go talk to a swimming trip the next day so i had to use tampons. It was one of those things someone have to figure this out. I didn't have any help i didn't have to. I didn't talk to anybody about how to do this. You you didn't get the tampon. I this is added to the rick from behind red lobster. Thirty five cents gave her the ball oh down on drug tampa. Oh my news three times the way it was your mom. I got it from my mom right and they were cardboard. Ones uncomfortable. I didn't know anything about different types or anything so i'm like okay. This has tampons all just use that anyways. I don't know what happened but i feel like it was halfway there and then i started sweating everything circling black lacking a pass down hit my head on the wall and i was laying on the floor how horrible on halfway yes okay. I don't know what it happened so i'm sorry this is so weird david carey shit. We ought to do this really hit. The <music> god. I'm never doing that again. It was more humble. It was bad the summer camping walking. What have we got like fucking. She's about eighteen on hanging cooter bloodbath in there but why is houston. She's not dead. Just unconscious woken up yet still in there ah enough for the crimes into invest markers around her body. She doesn't wake all out in trying to flow <hes> so it was traumatizing but i didn't tell anybody years later. 'cause i was so embarrassed. Did you ever learn how to put them in without die. You still find her pass down. That's still happens to a person listen. That is a hilarious story are either for story like was it just me like i panicked. Start sweating blocked out hit the wall and then that what was that were you okay after that i think so. I don't even know how long i was. I was home alone so that's dangerous is the first time do not try alone. I used with like you. Just bring your door neighbor. Hey listen. I'm about to do this set doc. Please help neighbors like we know what though you could've sued the tampon company probably. Can we still do that. It's like pulling everything from back. In time. I put a champion ipad awardee artie p._s._a. Remember ladies tell me that. I made a pastor in the backs a fat. This is the same thing to train prevent my flow do you. That's an early story period. When i was like sixteen at at camp topic that christine k. i was using the tampa onto gordon camp right because they had ham their camp by the way which i got kicked out another story. I'll tell you guys. I ended up tying up my christian camp counselor and pushing him down a hill roy. I was so bad. I wouldn't shut the fuck up during class. Obviously it was just so much worse because it's a christian so he was like you know. We're just trying to get through this scripture. He's like is there anything. I can do to get you to not make any noise and i was like let me tie you up. I will be quiet the risks and he let us let us such a passover passover and make that joke right so the whole group ties him upright and then he's like yeah the the whole class like i got all of them to be evil. I was like the heathen i was like. Come on guys like the devil so i turned all the class and we tied the teacher upright and he's on one of these rolling chairs like we're in right now. Okay now that i'm tied it. Let's talk about scripture and i'm like oh. We're going down taken literally nice. They were literally on this giant hill in a cabin and he's like what are you guys doing. They pushed him out the door and he's like five permanent. Literally seven two years surly rolls down the hill and bumps his head. He's rolling in the chairs hairs mesler screaming. He's tied up. We can't put his kids so i kind of laughing and i'm like that's right. That's right devil's nose still trying to go along with realizing you're crazy. The man get in here. I want to go back to jesus so then i got kicked out obviously pussies. Oh my god season. They're not gonna handle going down to mountain literally this not i remember watching him. Bounce his body on a rolling in over and here. She is now out of pocket you no. He didn't believe but you know. He got hurt but it's okay i you know i don't wanna be there anyways. I got what i wanted. I got to go home so it's a great story. Are you yawning say now mm-hmm. That's rude when you talk too much that your body china india laver. I'm boring christian story guy. Add tell us your worst something. What is it about that but what about which the golf course. Where did you first work. Was it awful. I can't imagine he's working anywhere. It's tilted backup <music>. You're gonna break it break. She's so used to it. She's like chris <music> deep. We'll talk about it later. Sorry about that all right and the popularity and you're all the way back this clock club that and we'll talk about later okay so craigslist grocery store nothing about this the worst of the worst situation okay. It's uh-huh anybody else but him and it really follows the whole yawning thinks oh. I'm not narcolepsy. She thinks i'm narcolepsy falsely asleep balat stay up late member christian when we used to hang out he would literally be we'd all be sitting there and he would just be on the couch and like we'd all be hanging out talking good time we'd look over and he'd be asleep thinks it's normal. He thinks a lot of people don't do that talking into the mike. Let me let people even older. I like you obviously have some kind of problems. We don't sleep so we compensate all night. Yes danes. I take a nap. Where can if someone's like story about jesus. Thank you can stories. It's always it's always like the slowest stores up like where i'm just like. Oh my god. I love the stories over here yawning anyway. Let's your your voice over yon- once they just like. We need to put more assuming uniform. Put this thing okay worst story. I want to hear it. You're delaying yeah one of the worst stories yes. I have many give give best one. I think the funniest one was. I worked at a golf course oh my god so many people i knocked out with golfing. I was okay so i wanted to work behind the counter. That's why applied just they had the most laid back job and they got paid like fifteen bucks an hour to stand behind the counter clock people when they came in. I used to change the garbage is in the bathrooms and i think it was like two or three times a week. You know the driving range of course drove the picker that would pick up the bugs inch. Oh my god we had a huge driving range so that would take like an hour and a half to do it. Sufficient amount trusted you with that they didn't they didn't know me back then but now they no yeah never let them in here again and i'd like to fall asleep. The motion boats anything he'll be like this is like one of my first jobs. It's not like do you say i addition this lovely but i probably would like so monotone about it a <music> this young guy to be your awful wedded. Why what is it what is anywhere awful. What is lawful lawful. I can't christian. He has already married anyway. It's awesome. Whoever so i'm working this golf course right and i was like i was doing anything to stay awake in that. I would like to be smoking cigarettes just trying to stay away. 'cause i couldn't the red bull cigarettes. I'd still be passing on my god. Imagine like this. There's the front where everyone's driving the balls and hitting exactly and every time i would pull out nothing ever kill the trying to hit me with the gumbo sir yeah. That's the thing you didn't know that everyone tries to hit the pick but it's because their cage so they wanna hit it one one time actually at abundant. It's snuck through the side. My friend who's driving into hit him in the ribs and he didn't see him. The cardiac killed his guy all my guy fucking some driving this car right. They teach me on easy. I'm driving it and imagine people driving the balls. Go that way you have to you. You have to come in and out like this towards the people and then away okay. Thanks for the visual yeah. I would be going towards him so one time like when i not often i fall asleep. I'm usually still like me a lot like if someone tells me make a left visit girl. Let sure i make it perfectly too so like i'm like nodding off and like i know i'm kinda tired. I'm still driving. I it's summer. It's hot summer sweating passing out in the cage in the spark engaged gates and i'm driving towards the people he's gonna stop bill know him. I don't know if he doesn't look like he's awake in the body and they're just passed out. Just come in full force at you trying to drive golf balls so like there's literally a little hill that comes up to where the people are driving and i was passed out by the time i got to that and i pulled up and was coming over his hill passed out and and i remember waking up to the scream of people so i woke up and i noticed that like i was all the driving age and people were running out of the way you and i was like i was like send the next stop the car and they're like the fuck you doing and i was sorry i am off. I had to come up to get the balls up here acquired in the same day in multiple days after the driving me just tell you like how far you're hitting with the sign. I cost that range so much money me because i used to run over the size sleep driving the car right. Let's give the narcolepsy. They do not operate when fucking dizzy tired right heavy machinery what does your the only rule that they have is if you're not gonna krishan never test driving straight for like five minutes time it must be like britney could do bernie could stay awake listening to like my head to sleep to he's. He's not listening to anyway sleeping part omega so yeah so the signs are used to destroy. I would wake up to me. Running over science teacher got going like commun- then all of a sudden just look back and it would be bent and upside down and the and the guy who would run the range. I'd turn around into this out the front door like what the book okay. This is where i got fired for. Almost killing people the trash can yeah somehow made excuses for it so they didn't take it seriously. The reason was i was a week doing so so like we said this one this one golf cart that was really fast that only we could drive the people that work there so like like like like forty fifty kilometers whereas now which is fast for governor out it's literally and like our golf courses like in the middle of the field so i used to take you off road. Sometimes when i go to clean the bathrooms out in the middle of the field oh i would go off road and i didn't realize it at the time but they they had cameras around the course that like always keep an eye on each hole right right so i took it off road and i found like these moguls and i literally went full speed like overalls moguls and then hit this jump that put me back onto like whole like twelve so came also it was like having a blast ahead god they're off aw pull back into like the the gulf the the the pro shop and my manager comes literally like the second i pull and he walks out and he's just like i speak do inside for your second in christian boy and i go inside and he calls me upstairs and he's taking your head. Oh my god this is from the time. I was killed. People wheel this machine all the time from off roading with golf cart. He goes like this. He brings me in his office and has a bunch of screens on the wall and he takes a remote and he goes like this. He said it's going through and stops cold. Whatever it was twelve and then he reminds it and pushes play and he's sitting there with me and you're just see this in ars stops it and he's like is this kind of behavior you think is fit for for work ethic the golf course and i was like i know what to say through through the outskirts of the golf course aw i got caught going down the i five couldn't get my foot off the gas zinc the shittiest. Excuse all i didn't know what to say. It's just like my it won't happen again. He's like you're right. It won't happen again because you're packing you stuff and you're leaving the fire. Where does like what did you do. Oh look at you now. An actor musician weinstocks vine star your wife if is a and beautiful. You're killing body. Oh boy man. Will you guys all know about me. Everyone's like am. She had plastic surgery. I never had plastic surgery just f._y._i. I i've gotten injections. I've gotten fillers lawyers and botox and all kinds of stuff. It's changed my face which i love so grateful for my face used to be shaped like a jalapeno and now it's more normal looking so <hes> whatever makes makes me feel better. My self esteem is better so <hes> you know what judge me if you want to but it's all good <hes> people like getting stuff done as far as i know and people are scared and always have questions and girls are like how do i know <hes> what person to go doing. How do i know what procedure i want. You know i'm scared to get botox like what happens. What does it feel like all these questions and you know you can you can join in online forums and astra girlfriends or whatever but it's nice to have professionals to talk to you so there's this new company called spotlight s. p. o. t. l. y. T. spotlight dot com where basically it's like all of the beauty skincare whatever situations nations that you have questions about answered they are these people that work for the website that specialize in all of these things from you know fillers facials cels and everything in between cosmetic injectables all kinds of things fat freezing and they are there to answer your questions help you provide help w find a provider in your area and you know get going so i if you wanna do it or if you don't want to obviously there's no requirement that you have to get the procedure done but you can easily chat with these aesthetics specialists so if you ever have any questions about an ascetic treatment or you're looking for one in your area you know spotlight dot com s. p. o. t. l. y. T. e. dot com. You just go there. Slash worst from the podcast spotlight dot com slash worst and you can chat with all these aesthetic specialists. Ask them all the questions that you want and if you decide to move forward with any aesthetic treatment they make it easy for you to find a qualified provider. They have a database of over thirty thousand local healthcare professionals and <hes> they make it easy for you and help you set it up and get going so if you have questions about medical stuff like me all the time constantly think i'm dying and nita to answer questions you can head over to spotlight dot com again. That's s. p. o. T. l. y. t. t. dot com slash worst and ask away and hopefully <hes> get all the answers. You're looking for cool new product alert <music>. Hello it's called myrow and it's d- odorant and i'm wearing it right now and it's paraffin free and it's seoul fate free and it's long lasting and it's nontoxic and there's no aluminum's and you're not gonna die from. It would ooh who could ask for anything better guys. Let's be completely honest. 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That's refillable so it's not like you're like wasting plastic by getting a new deodorant case every every time they come in this like cute little round pod that you use to screw up and you just put the rotor in it and it it's like in this little clip case and it clicks in and then you scroll you use it. It's just really really awesome. I love it. It's super convenient and honestly <hes> you basically a reducing your plastic waste by fifty percent so we're trying to save the environment over here guys <hes>. I don't know if you are but i am. I kind of want kind of want to be able to live here for a little bit longer so it's agree agree way to do it. If you wanna smell good if you you want to save the environment if you want to leave a not a crazy carbon footprint on this earth. If you want the future to be good for everyone and you don't wanna have aluminum in your body visit my myrow dot com slash worst w. o. r. s. t. and get fifty percent off off your order. That's m. y. M. y. r._o. Dot com slash worst you get fifty percent off of your daughter and and it comes in a refillable pot and it smells is really good and you're a small really good and it's good for your body and you're not gonna hurt the environment okay. It's a win win. I'm outta here. Do you like going on picnics. No no one likes going on picnics next. I mean maybe you do. Maybe you're listening to this in wyoming on a picnic right. Now i don't know anyway. It's really hard to take a cold beverage and have it remained. Cold the place that you're going. It's difficult. You know you have to put ice in it or you got a freeze it before you go somewhere i mean i get i get a bottle of water out of my fridge and it's a plastic bottle and by the time am i get to where i'm going. The bottles usually warm and that's disappointing and so i was looking for alternatives you know not only to lessen my carbon footprint on this earth but to <hes> you know try try to find something that would keep my drink. More keen drink warm. Keep my drink cold and i found this company called broom actually saw them. I advertised on facebook. They have these he's like really cool. Different colors and styles like there are these there these tumblers and mugs and <hes> you know they come in all different shapes and sizes czyz pint-size for for coding beer. I mean you could put water soda. Whatever you want in it. They have these amazing retractable top so they're spill proof their shatterproof and they're insulated so that they keep your drink nice and fricken cold exactly how you want it like your heart <hes> so so i discover them it because i was i attracted by the way they look. They're super sleepwalking. I mean i personally ordered to in the carreira marble style. They look like they're made out of marble because you know guys. I've got to keep a fancy over here <hes> and also assoc getting tired of you know throwing so much plastic. I mean these these companies with these water. Bottles are spending four ninety nine for twenty four cases of water. God knows how many times a month depending on how bigger families and it's kind of a waste so <hes> this roommate company is offering you guys fifteen percent off of your order. Should you decide you know what i'm going to just just use filtered water. Put some ice cubes in the thing and <hes> you know help the planet out because god knows we need it. I mean come on global. Warming is a real thing and it's happening so if you wanna to carry around a stylish looking drink cup and help the environment win win situation head over to brew mate dot com. That's b. r. u. M. a._t. Dot com and enter the promo code worst w. o. r. s. t. for fifteen per cent off for you and your our family i mean they make everything they have even like rainbow sparkly flasks with like glitter tops and then they have like sleek matte black designs for the guys who are or just to cool. I mean they have everything for everyone in your family so there's really no excuse and if you think about all the money that you're going to be spending on what cases of water bottles year after year you might as well by something that's reusable. You can wash it in your dishwasher. It keeps your drinks extra cool and it's spill proof shatterproof even better than a plastic water bottle come on and it looks way cooler not to mention that because we're all about looking cool so if this seems like something for you head over to roommate dot com b. r. u. M. a. t. dot com and enter through the promo. Code worst w. o. R. s. t. at checkout to have the cool streak of your life. Don't you hate the starship. Though can we talk about it yeah. I don't i don't hate it. I mean it's kind of like x. Anything mickey mouse club like that's what i look at it and he's like mickey mouse for like derelict's guys you. The history like this is history like i think they're going to write about it one day. Maybe really yeah what about talk already starting to find you have to understand how big and how much of a footprint it left on social media. There's nothing like yeah like even youtube at the time like more people were talking more about binding. It's it's like stars like what i'm going to get out of like being that's cool grades here last one of the xbox stars yeah yeah you guys all used to you know it's so funny. When timing i got married it was like tommy lee mary's mary's bein star. I'm like i did stand off for years movies t._v. Nope okay then. I see how many marriage binstock it has the biggest footprint. I guess that's the way i look. I never i never booked like the huge shit so that's why that's why you're in movies. You did <hes> we are your friends right so cool. Your cares about that other dogs mouth in my mouth lincoln next to daniel day-lewis jobs out. I was in a lot of stuff pride. Prejudice movies philadelphia with tom hanks good no big deal. Just forget about concert now. It's all good. It's fine. I'm totally fine with it like i'm cool with. How do you feel. It's kind of crazy because it's like it's weird now like i didn't you kind of notice that like if we don't post oh stuff that's funny. People don't like it. Do you get that or now. You have to live in <hes> constantly be funny which or or or people are like. What is is this like. I can't take like people were having posts like a pretty photo or something. You know like like funny yeah they're like. What is this shit like. We don't wanna see you you wearing outfits and we want to see memes or like videos. You know like it's replacing him for a long time. I noticed that you kind of weaned off. The means a little bit. I've you're posting means like pretty pretty problem with having fun making them and then. I was just kind of like you know but i'm like i'm always changing. You know what i mean. All i wanna do like this was fashion or like. You know what i'm talking about things desiigner. I'm talking about like you know comedy videos. I'm doing this. Do not like you can only do you want to hear about the rest of open like audience because that's one thing i noticed i noticed that like and this is just about connection anyway. It's just like the i noticed the more that i had like real like real conversations about real things that was going on with me. Yeah people would start to be like oh. I didn't realize that you had this stuff going on. I didn't realize that you enjoy doing stuff like then. When you come out of the blue people were like what the fuck are you doing. You should change it but if you kinda i did like i would talk about you know and make a lot of jokes about my anxiety because obviously like i you. Are you guys now. I've like really bad and like we yeah we have like around. We make jokes because we you suffer so doc plays toes. It's like our little escape but yeah. I've talked about it. A lot and i think a lot of people you know i i know a lot of people resonated with jesse. The american meam course i loved it in there and like stuff like that and so people were like all like i relate to it and i get it and that was really nice but then like after that came out a lot of the people also were like you know. You're secretly depressed like you're not really finding. It was like a weird like people people were like two sided ended about some people were like oh. I think it's really great that you like spoke out about your problems and then other people were like oh so all your funniness is just a front and blah blah blah blah blah. It's weird yeah. No it doesn't have to mean that you live in a comedy life like it doesn't mean the refund all the time i think would the miscommunication was as you were saying how we use humor as a way to cope with the stuff but <hes> us creating stuff. That's comedic doesn't mean that that's what we're using the humor humor. The humor is more so like with an us yes yes. That's still missing me here. Because you can talk about stuff. You can make it more clear yeah exactly yeah. No i try to i try to like i tried to talk about it and also like i love you know seeing people and just like catching up and in getting to like being happy. This is what makes me happy like hang out with my friends and laugh yeah like that's the best medicine that's like better than anything even more so connecting with people because i noticed like some people you'll sit down with and it's like yeah you have a good laugh but then you notice that they're nowhere near connecting with you. I feel like we could always have a real aside. Aside from us always messing around with allow yeah yeah. I'm really talking about stuff because we do have a really dark side. We really excited yeah yeah. I think it's great because he's put stuff out there being honest about his anxiety. You put stuff out. There and i think i listened to it more. When it's coming from somebody nobody where it's kind of shocking because expected out of you guys and even when you meet you know people meet christian and then they're like. I didn't know he was like so serious yeah. My grandma was like like she wants. She didn't know him as well. It was like watching shows about this coming back. Got awesome drugs for work. I'm working. He was so polite and calm. All it's really asshole. Yes as you were living off those videos. I guess like recognize me in public. They kinda <hes> <hes>. What's it called they take a double. Take sometimes because com the it's me you put you on aww that's so crazy you don't do you suffer from that stuff too or not really as much. I don't <hes> she doesn't know why you're so lucky. Well a healthy family like your parents and stuff. I would say i was the youngest and dealt with everybody else. So then i was just like be fine. Help everybody that kind of thing okay so my mom sometimes calls me when i tell her you know what's going on. She's like but are you okay. I'm like mom. I'm always find like i've never gone up down in good hands. I noticed this with a lot of people like me and you can probably relate more because we've gone through like really dark dark times j._r. Torch shifts your perspective about and that's why we have anxieties because perspective is pretty clear like she's been taking taking care of like also like with me. I make sure that i take care of and a lot of people don't have from a lot like like you and you've probably been to the exact same thing is like being screwed over auburn than caring about people and then realizing that they are shady out to get you ask like our guards. Are everything yeah. You have to be so careful. That's why i literally like i mean i moved albus obviously and so. I don't see people out but i kinda just like an scared and like hold up you like it. I mean tommy and i spent like literally literally ninety percent of our time just in the house with each other yeah which is fun yeah. It's great you know but then i was like oh i should hang out with friends like sometimes you know. Then gets gets really small part yeah because i came out here and he was telling me all like the scary stories of like you don't trust these people this thought so then for me coming here hearing all that i feel like i've just never ever let anybody close to me kind of thing. It's and it's worked out fine for the difference between us as we didn't have that. We didn't have that going into business. We didn't have taleh touring a little bit. It's the worst thing is i've had people that have been so nice to my face and then i've gone into meetings and have them have people like in meetings for jobs be like oh that a person was in here in like said they they don't like you or they don't understand why you're popular and that kind of thing and i'm like whoa i would never do that. In person she saw i hate the people think that you're in competition with somebody else because everybody like offers their own kind of thing. Can you can't beat somebody else. You guys offer different things so to someone for someone to shut you down leah. We're all desperate crazy. It's kind of crazy but people are so competitive. I know this business like they are. I don't wanna be in either. I don't like and then like people try to get my head logo. You don't get as many likes as so and so or you like to work on this or that and i'm like i don't care. I don't pose the likes post because it's fine. Thank you know whatever it's kind of crazy but i think we're moving further and further away from <hes> and i wrote about this too. I think we're moving away from art meaning. You're an artist and then when i look at you i know you're not. It's like with everything that you're going to do because you're going to still be very successful and i know that but like we have tax but the door has become less and less about that because it's all now social media just become like a popularity clarity chase. It's serious about creating things that like or connection and i stopped posting like pictures and stuff like that on my page when people come to my page i want them to like get to be able to laugh not ever watched something. That's going to mess with their mind or make something holy crap locale. Popular is our look what he has look. I want them to be oh this relate to me. 'cause that's me when i create comedy. You create comedy. That's us. We're a piece of us coming out into social media and people can laugh and that's why they laugh because they can relate a two and why can they relate to it because it's us to make people laugh as much as possible because i just feel like there's nothing better than laughing. There's literally nothing better. That's why i say okay for nine years. I've been with him like i'm always like he keeps you laugh so funny like it's always fun and like the fact that i literally woke up one morning. I was like we literally laugh every day. They like that makes me happy. So how blessed we are yeah. You have a partner who like you can hang out with and like make a career out like you guys made a career out of what you do oh and like laugh and have fun together and that's your job like how cool is that. It's so grateful that i wake up show blast literally very sweating now lydia a._m. To count like your was. It sounds like meetings to try to describe yourself something to look at psychiatrists said. If i'm having a panic attack she said look at something in the room and describe it to yourself so i would just like a psycho everywhere. I went when i wasn't on medicine. Ah blanket on the world has moved on it and there she stitched looks like your mind. Can you remember this being the piece. I think she's rehearsing talk that he looks nervous sweating. Have you talking to myself think he's like in your head to talk out loud as i was like i was trying trying to get rid of the panic. Would it didn't work yeah. I think there's something wrong with my <hes>. I was just telling tommy this the other day. I wanna get off. I've taken antidepressants eventually want to get off. It'd been on it since i was like sixteen but every time i've tried to get off of it i have like a mental breakdown which is awful. I basically just start having so many panic attacks so they can't get out of bed like and people think panic attack attack is just someone being like nervous where i literally like came on one breed. I think i'm having a heart attack. I feel my heart like squeezing wheezing. Get pain in my chest. I start sweating like it's literally agenda of licko withdrawal thing to also like well. Here's the thing i actually weaned myself off of like under a physician's care. I weaned myself down and then at the end of you know i'm honest. Drug called effects are the were struck on the planet. Well not guinness sponsorship. I the <hes> so basically the drug they say is more addictive than heroin. She's like really bad. Add like one of my girlfriends is actually gonna going to get antidepressant because she's been struggling and they were like we will never put that anyone on that drug. Get it was years ago so it was like the best thing they the hat at the time and i tried everything else i tried wellbutrin and zoloft and paxil a sarah quill lex the pills forever tried every single one every single one and then finally they were like we're going to try affects her for frio and they put me on a really high dose of it and it basically like maybe your body gets addicted to it like right away. So you forget a dose for a day. You like start. Your brain like starts like it feels like your brains constricting and you can't see cedar got operated vision and like you know it's it's it's horrible. There's literally if you google that affects her withdraw. Look similar tears literally like post like a blog dedicated to how evil the strongest like in your body so addicted to it which is scary crazy because i feel like many point now where i don't need it but it's done so much chemical interference to my brain that i when i don't have it it just automatically. The panic attacks coming. You know i was when i finally did get off it. I was taking benadryl like i would take benadryl like ten benadryl a day so i wouldn't have panic attack. Why would benadryl isn't that this calming obvious to me. Whatever keep me from having heart like wow you know it was it was really bad and i like and then i just was like you know what i couldn't go to auditions. I couldn't go to meeting yeah. That's debilitating to call you about it. We yeah <hes> patient in my apartment. I hope you're doing what did you do did you. How did you get through it because could you seem like good right now. I'm still seward's. Battle have not a panic attack in probably two years. That's like full. It looks like i'll get them here and they're talking about full blown panic attack i had i was at both steakhouse and and i got carried out on a stretcher from bos- they custody the heart attack right everything. I thought having everything i shutdown seizure. You wonder if it's like a seizure asia type. It should to degree similar. Shake my heart. It was racing is exciting tunnel vision. I was like i can't see things. Look over my brother and mike please call nine one right now because i'm dying like trying to call nine one one vast by member like being outside and they put me on the stretcher and went back when they say it's just a panic attack. You're like you can't be right. The scary thing is they didn't tell me that until i got to the hospital so like they checked on my vitals whatever they were trying to take my check my blood pressure but i was shaking so much that they couldn't get like a proper blood pressure reading so they got to the hospital. I got rushed in and they made me do a series of like brain. Tumor cancer type tests immediately went into testing so like i was i i was like panic attack having other panic attack within that panic attack from all the testing i it just that was one of the most traumatized and triggered the anxiety heidi right thinking once that happens scares large-calibre focused. I'm starting to realize like dog. You start to realize your triggers to you traveling abroad anytime tommy and i go anywhere far away i automatically can. I get sick before we go. Wow like i my body is the reaction like if we have to go to another country or go on vacation. It should be fun right. Shia look forward to note. My body's just like you're going to feel awful like it. Just shuts down because it's like my biggest fear is i'm going to be somewhere where i can't get saved like. I'm going to be somehow record to like. There's no hospital nearby like faulk like always sit. Sit and kristen can attest always have to sit like if brought a restaurant or anywhere up to sit back facing everything they need to know like where am i saw aw back turned. It's scary you guys. It's really scary notes. Did you take anything for an hour now. If you don't have to talk about it if you don't want to know. I don't take anything for for now but do you ask like what i've been doing. I think it's just about like balance in your life and say how much i admire you for not succumbing to taking any any kind of drugs. He never been go another scary point for me. That's another anxious point for me was taking a drug that i literally couldn't live my life like oh really to. I went to view anxiety about drugs do right. That's part of the anxiety getting taking taking it too. That's why i take like i'm on antidepressants antidepressant. I weaned myself down to the very lowest dose of it but i do get scared. 'cause my my doctor's like you have a valium prescription. You need to use it valium. We'll get like old old like it'll get expired because i'm so scared to take it because it's also an addictive drug but i'll be skydiving a panic attack like freaking out seizing up and he'll uh i'll call him and you know i need help and go. You're having a panic attack. You need to take the valium. That's what it's for like. It's kinda crazy. It's good that you've of managed to do it without. I'm very like admire that i noticed like you have to come down to the root of the problem too ultimately because for me that was it was always looking at like what's that's. Why am i feeling this way and had to break everything down because i wasn't willing to accept that the people that i was around. Were like not the best people that i should be around the pressures around about being around those people style lifestyle all these things i was just like i need to get out of this because it's only gonna lead to really negative things because of the situation that i noticed is that the more pulled away from things did away from well. I think the thing too is also like acting and auditioning. It's a lot of anxiety and that was like the the peak of it. You're going out like two times a day sometimes do it was hectic adopt addition. You're just trying to be more selective now. Disputes like because it takes takes a lot out of you know and it's it's almost like i think a lot of us creators do that because like it's like i get showings -iety rhythm before auditions like the whole night before i'm fucked over them like i can't sleep mike tossing and turning thing about my lines like what what's going to happen whatever panic attack excuse me in the audition like you i do. I do that thing too but once they get the job okay like once a month. Mike okay tickets. Auditioning was really like self tapes and i'm like i don't know how you you guys. Do this like. This is not something i would want to do but i all priests you guys for doing doing obviously. It's more fun once. You're working. I see what you have to go through to get to that point. So it's a lot of work. It is and you know tommy all helped me with lines and it'd be like ten pages and who like to memorize all this this. He's like what if you don't get it then. I don't get it and he's like what we used to time. I would never do this. Shit this shit this shit shitting. You might not get it. What a what a waste of time. I love him. He's so funny anyway. I wanna heino. Where can we follow. You guys. Tell saul at christian the h._r. I s. t. I a. n. Just like christian gallon is going at christian mcgowan yeah and you'll see on his page bill it out because butch christian mcgowan f. t. seven. It's so funny like a whole relationship by the <music>. Okay we're trying to rise subscribe to worse i. I'm amanda cerny and i'm summer rae and we want you to listen to our new ooh podcast. Oh honey this is where our lovesick listeners right in their diary entries and we give our best advice. Oh hunting covers anything from catching your crushes attention to live in your best single. I and we have some very special guests that you don't wanna miss so make sure you download url honey podcasts on <music> apple podcasts or your favorite podcast app. Oh honey oh honey. Oh honey honey toil on what celebrities are doing. This is what you wanna hear something that represents glam everything was too much pressure is too high and that's kind of where the song came out how artists maintain relationships while on the relatives friends cannot come with you and they come in after a weekend i yeah i don't know how you do this ayla celebrity how'd you stay mentally healthy focused on just like trying and to take some time off in the future. What goes on in the real lives of celebrities. This is the real behind the scenes. Look at the fans aren't komo celebrities whatsoever behind the thing paulie wire. Holly wire is bringing kneel behind taking the face to face.

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Episode 9: Quentin Tarantino Part 2

Five Things with Lynn Hirschberg

1:26:11 hr | 1 year ago

Episode 9: Quentin Tarantino Part 2

"We're back with part two of Quentin Tarantino and five things with Lynn. Hershberg as I said in part one Quentin is one of my closest friends which means that he has a lot to say. He's always very interesting and today's episode picks up where we left off. It's not exactly your usual five things. He really only did three things but with Quentin you. Just listen to anything. Asked say Do Westerns okay. So let's do one thing so let's talk about let's make did you have to have two incidents in your life. We've done person place thing after due to incidents. So why don't we do the incident or the event being being when reservoir dogs was at Sundance. Well going to sundance with reservoir dogs because that was zero to fifty kind of moment. Yeah well it was like Were you nervous. Well one just getting a sundance was was was was a big deal because I remember there was like another friend of both selling making my editor and Dean Parasol. Her husband's also filmmaker. They had another friend of theirs. WHO had made an independent film and we were both trying to get accepted at Sundance that year and and there was like a lot of movies that came out that year? That didn't get accepted to sundance that year. That actually did really okay. Well like Nick Gomez Laws of gravity got refused by Sundance. And because of what had happened with sex lies and tape. If you didn't get accepted at sundance it seemed like Like it was the end of the world. Your only chance of really breaking out would be go go to sundance how that actually changed and partly changed. Because of that year after that year they started coming up with slam dance because there were like. Hey look at all these really terrific. The big movies that made a made a mark that year but couldn't even couldn't get played at Sundance Right. Videotape was the year before to a couple of years. Before you about three I I think yeah I think it was ninety. Okay maybe been eighty nine but I think it was ninety. I'm sure you're actually. I remember in ninety two are sound the people were doing our sound with you know. They're big movie. That year was Kafka. Oh yeah he was this follow up because because sex lies and videotape. was there a little. Okay well we'll work on this little little small film and then became big and so now there they were putting the entire company behind his followers should work out and I was I. Was there small movie movie that year than they did. I would reservoir dogs so the thing is we get we go to Sundance and it was a dream come true in every way one on to actually be a filmmaker to actually. I have a finished film and I have a film that I'm happy with and I feel that I'm proud of and then I get to go to You know that whole year going on the Film Festival circuit was was a blast. So you'll be to go to sundance was play the Egyptian uh-huh yeah eventually played too small theaters before that and then the big Hollywood screening Egyptian which was on the second week but the thing about it though was it ended up being. It was exciting because of the whole life experience. If at all was very exciting but the other thing that was really incredibly exciting. That was like the way alternative Music Outta Seattle was about to explode and maybe it was in the process of exploding. The films that played at Sundance that year were to start an explosion of American independent cinema. That would last for the Knicks. Six six years I would be on the Film Festival Circuit and talk to different critics from different countries and I was okay. So what is the most exciting cinema going on right now and you ask me at that time just a little bit. Before it had been Hong Kong would have been the place that that was the most exciting in the late eighties early nineties and they were like no. It was Hong Kong now. It's American independent cinema and it was because because you know basically for the next twelve twelve months. All those films have played a sundance. They went all around the world. The strictly ballroom this one and then they little by little filtered out out started getting any started playing in the independent theaters and started you know and these directors the Hal Hartley's and everybody started like really having their critical fans and having their your fans and we're going to the next one was and then they were immediately booked all being Toronto and this and that and And and some of those guys. They were accumulating leading a nice little Group of movies that it was exciting. It was exciting. It was interesting and it became a genuine business where you would talk to like saying they like A theater owner guy like who used to run the Dobie in Austin Texas he existed from independent films and they were earth thing. People people saw trainspotting. Yeah Yeah people saw these movies they were they were it was a bit like being rockstar. People people young people in College. We're following them. And all of a sudden now it wasn't music performers that they had on their wall all it was like the poster from the independent movie that they liked might be goldfish. It might be trainspotting. It might be pulp fiction and might be a headshot poster reservoir dogs could be El Mariachi or it could be Antonio Banderas from a DESPERADO. But it was. It was some of those guys. Beat Jay and silent Bob. I had the reservoir dogs poster on my wall and you told me it was a fake. It it's not licensed but I never had a problem with those guys. I didn't need that money much rather than make me a pop cultural the poster poster. Yeah I have the original section posted with her the paperback book. Well I sold out of Miramax Miramax. Yeah Yeah I have it in Cork Board. I think it was in the lobby like on an easel. Picked it out. Ah I never told anyone that. But that's the truth. I took it. Walk town fuck you keeping you have plenty more are those with that. Game I'm the pulp fiction groupie. I absolutely absolutely you. You you definitely earned the right. None of us were super aware of that back then but that was was kind of the way it was and I started going on the Film Festival circuit and started. Seeing these people at more places became a weird kind of community entity well for I mean I actually. I was a little naive. I mean there was a thing where I thought that you know for the next thirty years. Me and Allison Anders. Nick Gomez amidst all be making movies together. And you know we'll be watching each other's cuts and this and then the other end Tony Raisin L. The rest of them and and yeah and the reality is they all did pretty good but they weren't able to forge a theatrical movie career for thirty years right it's hard it's very hard. That's why when people say like that. I'm going to quit after thirty years. That's a long. That's a long career. A lot of people don't make well they don't want you to quit. That's why they don't want you to ever quit I. Unfortunately I'm in that so was it. Did you have fun when during reservoir dogs at Sundance Dance. Was it a fun event or was it just sort of overwhelming. No it was a blast. I I had. I had a fantastic time. I was really taken seriously. We have you have the the film played great. It was one of the film played great. I met seemed like I met all of Hollywood which was very very exciting. Yeah I was one of the boys so that's always nice. Great you felt like you were part of a community which is always nice. I absolutely felt like I was part of the community but also frankly I feel it was one. I felt like I was part of a independent film community but I also felt like I was part of Hollywood because is by that point in time. It's been about a year and a half that I'd been doing stuff in Hollywood both making reservoir dogs and like you know all the agents read it. That's how everyone one knew who I was. Right is when the agents got the scripts to submit their actors right. I had this I have somewhere. Somebody's in the script for pulp fiction. US have both fiction but the person I think your systems have made the script and forgot to take off the page. There was going out to the actors in mind and I always treasure that page because so many people all different part of the thing. I wanted those part part of the thing about it wasn't so much. These are the people who want the parts part. The thing that one of the things that Mike Simpson told me he goes okay. So here's the deal you give them your wish list of things you want are the things that are are important to you and then once they sign off on that then that's it right. Yeah there's nothing there's nothing they can say they they've they've they've looked at your terms they've and they've agreed right right so it was like if you WanNa think about certain actors put them all there. It wasn't necessarily that I I was thinking. Oh Hey this person is the perfect person to play pumpkin versus honey. Bunny it was the idea of coming up with about six or seven names for everybody right and and then and have them sign off right on all those different between this group of actors. I could actually put together fiction right right well. It was less trying to narrow it. All those definitely thought about it but it was more about creating a nice pool of actors to choose from that. I wouldn't have to go back and get permission. I see well I love this. I went ballistic list so then you came back and did you think did you. You did your world tour. So let's do the second incident and I know what I want. I want to get off this movie making okay so what I thought well incident second event. Okay uh-huh okay so look. This is a book I wanted to. Because I've been thinking about stuff like this. I wanted to okay so the second second event that I wanted to go through is me going to the movies. Nineteen seventy-nine excellent. Because I think think I probably saw more movies to send the John Lewis the screen world so every movie. Every movie that was released in America in one thousand nine hundred seventy nine. I love this is in that book for foreign the studio features eighty. It's always always confusing. It's always like they always say eighty when they mean seventy nine. I see okay so they make this book is the cause of seventy nine hundred. Nineteen seventy I love of this. WHO's John Willis? He's The guy who has done screen world. He started screen world. I think in sixty six sixty six sixty eight. Oh and love this. Okay go ahead okay. So nineteen seventy nine. So that's like I think I'm sixteen now seventy nine. It's an interesting year because you know I'm kind kind of A. I'm that I actually being officially a teenager. I'm officially I. I think I think when the year starts. I'm not yeah I think in-school but I'm going to quit school during that year and I'm already working with a community theater group so actually acting in a Mac actually acting in plays and and then working as a assistant stage manager on this production and acting in this production and hanging around adult fifteen or sixteen. But I'm pretending to be eighteen or nineteen eighteen. Okay so they think I'm older than I am and I'm hanging around a Shitload of theater adults. I mean they're all just butcher bakers and candlestick maker doing community theatre. But say they take they take your fucking seriously and my taste is getting more refined. This is also the year I start the not only as a revival cinema. That's close enough in time because I was kind of question the South Bay area so I read about all these movies playing at the in Santa Monica and Beverly Hills at the royal and the Music Hall Theatres. I can't go see them but finally there was a place called the cinema and Hermosa Beach. That actually was starting to show. They would have Lena where where mel double features and they'd show Laurentien Alien Wife Mistress and Z channel. Then to the area I see so the Laura Antonelli Antonelli thing you're you're no jack of La was like no one else knew Laura Antonelli but Z channel. Okay so I I can literally go through this and so the whole point is I will say every movie that I saw in one thousand nine hundred seventy nine and and the point being is I saw at the theater when it came out in this year. Not that I saw later. Now that I saw it later on Zee on TV or I watched it on video later I saw editor Revival House. I had to in one thousand nine hundred seventy nine. I went to the movies and paid and saw it. Okay Okay so first film here is a Disney movie a But I want to be young. Adult movies called takedown wrestling movie about a college wrestler. Then Lorenzo Lamas was was Edward Herman was the teacher. Flounder Stephen I from animal houses in it. Maureen McCormick is the girl in it but the whole thing was about Lorenzo Lamas and this is the rocky guy who was the young wrestler It was okay I again. I was really interesting any movie that had a young guy who is like the could be the start. He could be me. I always imagined I've always that dude. Imagine me watching learn and take down. Imagine that's me there was actually. It was an Italian guy later in the movie that is I wanted to know I'd be more that all right hardcore four I saw hardcore when it came out all right so I did Allama Mall Theater. Everyone the rejected the ending when the girl went home with them all right and they literally bullshit I. I did see boulevard nights but I didn't see it in seventy nine I saw at at the Carson twin cinema as a lower. No no no no no no I thought I thought I saw on the hood. I saw at the Hawthorns six boulevard nights. That was pretty boring. They got the low rider culture and it got it got it got the culture and the clothing right on but it was a very cadets. TV Movie Kinda Story. Buck Rogers in the twenty fifth century. I saw that a couple times. I saw that Gerard. Thought he was really quite good in the movie and it it was actually kind of and it was actually kind of interesting because it was like a star wars came out in nineteen seventy seven and it became the sensation and so they needed a science fiction movie right away and and but as they were big so so for a year. They're waiting for another science fiction movie. They're gonNA make them so they're all going to come out at the end of seventy nine but they had done and Buck Rogers in the twenty fifth century for television and they could get it out sooner so this was the first one out of the gate I kind of liked to did we like it. Yeah it was fun yeah it. There's a phone when I even watch the series for a little bit. Okay I normal rate so norma Rae at the theater did you like it. Yeah I saw it a couple times. Yeah imagined I was going the wrong Lee mineral a little young for the Ron Liebman magic over one of the the older version of that guy. I don't I don't break. I like Eric Roberts. All right I'll be Ron Liebman type. You could be the union activist. Name was a big Fan of us on a couple of times. I've seen it a couple times sense. This is a fast break with Gabe. Kaplan yes right. The basketball movie apparently every time they show it on. ESPN and always just kills really to this day. It's like the ducks ducks also in the same vein of the young guy. Making a movie especially at leg in this supposed to be Italian. Kind of Shit was voices with Michael Irving. She's a girl the kid from the from the wrong side of the tracks that helps you become a dancer and kill reviewed that but I think no she didn't she did she. Did she know she a. She likes on King. Yeah she put down nose. Used to make fun of Amy Irving at this time. She changed her tune with gentle but she really made fun of her a lot in for the competition did she make funding funding for in the DEPALMA. The one where she's with Andrew Stevens whatever that's called with twins no she. She doesn't talk about He. Mirroring that much in the in the fury review or Andrew Stevens for that matter. Okay Okay China Syndrome. So not only do I see China's syndrome. I remember I snuck into that theater because it was a multiplex and they had load seating and I snuck in so I snuck in so I came in I saw the ending I that whole ending with Wolf Grimly Arizo. I saw the Big Climax Sarah and I saw the whole theater of be affected by the climate. Then I stayed to see the rest of the thing but that was a big innings. One question before I forget. Is there any major like ten Poli kind of movie like Star Wars. You didn't see or didn't see until much later. I there might thank you. Jim Miss you know like the Matrix or something. No of course I saw like well. No there's a lot of stuff now all right. That doesn't count now. I've never seen the Harry Potter movie. I right I saw the first avengers when I saw the the second one. But I saw captain America's civil war award which is like an adventure movie. Yeah definitely. There's there's all kinds of stuff like that. I've never seen a hurt locker locker. I've never seen a not hurt locker. I've in her locker. The Hunger Games. I never saw that because I love battle royale so much. I'm just offended. That goes to these saluting quicker. Okay so oh boyfriend by Paul schrader Talia Shire. I saw that not only. Did I see the movie version of Bell Jar. I actually wrote a review for it for a singles magazine and then actually gave wrote reviews. It would give you the press screening tickets so I wrote two reviews. I wrote the review for the Bell Jar. Sixteen sixteen. Yeah yeah a revote a review for the Bell Jar. Would you get me writing review of Belgium with no concept of book whatsoever. Just only there's only the movie Azazel was directed by Larry Peers. The Guy who did the other side of the mountain and started Marilyn Hassett. Okay I I liked it. It's very good. I don't know I would. I liked it then hair all right which I thought the Cinerama Dome home when it came out I thought was I. I think is kind of a travesty now but people loved it when it came. I loved it back then I would. I cried to let the sunshine but Burgers burgers grave and everything and Roger Ebert pick to this movie. CBS favorite movie of the year. Now I think it's lame I agree. It was all right and it does not hold up. But there's a reason but there's also a real reason why doesn't why to me it doesn't work and part of the big reason why it doesn't work is he's actually. He gives a good performance in the movie. Maybe it's the casting of of John Savage as Claude Ra. So when they cast him as Claude. He can't can't do the songs that's not what he's there for well. Claude has as many songs as Burger right and the movie so when they they they pretty much neutered to a non character who only has authenticity going for him because he does look a little Oklahoma all right so so so they neuter Claude and they make Burger way too. Big Now. Burger has clawed saw. He has Burger Song Claude Song and it just froze it completely really off the character. Claude needs to be important character as Burger right. I think it has other problems to a lot of things a lot out of a dozen work beverly Dangelo. Yeah but even like the whole thing. I remembered the three sixty of ren woods singing. Aquarius being great. But he doesn't even when you watch it again it's like he keeps cutting into his. He doesn't really let the shot really developed. The way needs to develop okay same Love at first bite George Hamilton Manhattan Woody Allen following up any hall and in this huge big incredible credible way eight year a film that I saw four times. Because I know this next one little romance Diane Lane Yeah Completely. I completely identified with the French kid. You would be good as a French kid. I wouldn't have been known to all right. I wouldn't be good in that role. Oh but identified with the French kid. I actually identified with A. He was watching Burt Reynolds movies. And and the staying and he's watching Butch Cassidy and the Sundance kid and he's watching hustle with Catherine Deneuve. And so I was just really taken again with that with that whole story. Yeah yeah very taken with Diane Lane and also like the little kid knew about movies. He knew he knew that like her. His his MOM's director lover was a bad director. Oh He's a director. Everybody hates them. There's only one trick Peres match the remake of hurricane asylum. When my mom MIA Farrow Ferro in Dayton caney was the name of the island boy in it never saw but yet I knew that that's pathetic? I think The Champ John Boy. I saw shredder. Little Ricky shredders saw that last embrace. Jonathan Demme's hitchcock doc in thriller that he did with a Roy. Scheider Janet Margolin. I liked it a lot I it was it was a little a little dry then and it's still drying now. Frankly but I kind of like it. It's an interest it's got an interesting spice story but it has a big climax. That's very very exciting at the at Niagara Falls. Did you take notes on an you. Just remember them all that well exactly alien we. We asked the events of the year yes absolutely one of the events of the year holds up to this day as as well if not I think of the movie so far. Alright think alien in Manhattan like the other two so far escape from Alcatraz which was too dry for me back I love I love it I love it now I wrote I wrote a review on the new beverly website that I'm real proud of anything but I love it now but it was too dry for me back then. It's really good though a movie movie that actually holds up even better. I like it more now than I did. Then was Richard Lester Butch Cassidy and the Sundance early years. We showed it at the new beverly a little bit ago. Go at play. Plays really great tax. And they're great together. They're great together and there's even like sequences you can tell that. Were like leftover from Bill. Goldman's original script left that he couldn't stick in. I'd heard that he put a couple of sequences and you watch them if you can tell exactly but they are too. I think Tom Barringer was most gorgeous person he was was great. That was that was that was a great time for him and Richard Lester and Richard Lester was doing great stuff at that point in time one of the big hits of the year which I never quite understood there was one of those movies. That was a huge hit. It was funny. I don't think I thought it was quite. It's funny as everybody else did. Though was the in laws I never saw it. Yeah I definitely saw the in laws. It was funny and I liked it but it was. I darken Peter Peter Falk and it was a smash hit. It was one of the big hits of the year. And he's a spy or something. Yeah uh-huh yeah the in laws of their daughter. Sir Albert Brooks the main event with Barbara Barbara and Ryan. O.`Neil the muppet movie. So that North Dallas Forty fucking loved it North Dallas Forty when it came out and I thought I thought we know what the Hell's forty maybe. Maybe maybe this is true. I thought that was so adult. No me too. That was that was when I was like. He's he can't get out of bed. He the girl sleeping. I mean it was very they know Dr Wakes up the first images in waking up with the with the blood on the pillow from from the bleeding nose. First thing he does light up a join yeah or a feels all the aches and pains and his bodies out of the mind Mendon Shit and I think he does have sex with the guy's wife and she's he's kind of exotic normal like football player kind of way and then you end. The humor was so profane. Yeah and so here is one thousand. Nine hundred. Eighty nine would have been my favorite movie of the year rocky to okay one rocky to more than rocky one. Who's the opponent and Rock Creek again? It's big it's their big rematch and there also was this aspect aspect because after rocky stallone. His followups didn't do well in the press. Made a big big deal about that. About how fist flopped opt and in paradise alley was a flop. I didn't know what I saw. I saw free time that but they we're really taking him taking the press machine that made him the Cinderella boy was now rolling over on. They go out. We can't really. Oh well he can only play this stupid box. It's all you can do. And and he's completely flopped out and he's and he's a real loud mouth and his press S. interviews and so then he comes out with rocky to and now he's directed rocky so rocky to kind of has to work or he has a b a semester. Come lately and that's a smash. It's a terrific movie actually betters others on the aspects of rocky and he is beyond charming and the film. It was like you know after all the whole so the whole semester. Salone the celebrity it kind of got put through the ringer right to a giant degree but to see him play the rocky character again. It actually reminded you why you like rocky so much in the first place and and like the first rocky movie is more of a character study this is more of a personality polity expansion right but it works completely as a personality expansion and he kind of has the audience audience in the palm of his hand. That was one of the reasons decide that it was like. I was so happy for him that he pulled it off. And and I the movie meant a lot not to me and it was again was inspirational. Start trying to give shape after you see the movie. 'cause I'd open them montage moments but there are also even was just the idea that still kind of redeemed himself and he ends up telling his story are because it's like he kinda shows is what it's like to be a star and then kind of become a bit of a laughingstock like the rocky character does and then he has to kind of come back so in his own way. Actually it tells the story even a little bit more personally and rocky to than he did in rocky one but then the other thing that I'm also kind of gene splicing about was after. I've seen the movie times was effected had on audiences they really loved rocky. They wanted the best forum. And and there's this one moment almoner it might just be a mistake of montage or something but you know part of the thing in the movie is he has a spending spree. That happens at the beginning of the film. Revise is the necklace and he buys jackets and he buys all this shit and one of the things he buys is a Transam with the big Gold Eagle on it and then now he starts losing all of his money he starts trying to get rid of everything. And he's trying to sell Paulie the Transam and and then he then he does then the things get lifted up and he's going to fight Apollo creed starts one of their montages and things are going good. His wife was in a coma. She's out of the coma now and she says I just want you to do one thing for me with that win. Mickey what are you waiting for. It starts to gonNA fly now on. Taj is done that and so he starts off by just doing his job so he runs out of his his is Philadelphia tenement. And you see the Transam Arcton the back now. Couldn't just be a mixup of editing. That like by the time emme he put that in there. It was meant to be foreseen before he sold the car but it's after he sells the car polly and the and the audience is so rooting rooting for him. He's got the car back. Things are going good for him. He got the car back and that was running going good. How many times did you see it? Six seven in the first engagement alone. Yeah Franklin Jealous Dracula deer which I actually Still like breaking away. which was a big film that year? Who A I don't think it holds up I do? I recently actually holds up pretty well the enemy though Hor which has a couple of times even though I didn't care for the wonders unders which I loved that about six times to this day whenever I find myself in a bad neighborhood territory the marlins as the folk singer girl more American graffiti. I never saw. It was a very good job. Okay apocalypse now which was to me rocky was my personal favorite movie but apocalypse now was the movie of the year right as far as I was concerned and I took the bus to Hollywood to see it at the Cinerama Dome and got the program that they gave out and I still have the life magazine. Brando on the cover was into into everything about apocalypse. Now I've been reading about it for years. Couldn't wait to see that that's one that I imagine being one of the guys on the boat and of course you could have been any of them. I would have wanted to be frederic forrest character. Of course well Frederic Forrest is good but you could also been WHO's the surfer? Nah I'm not going to beat it over. Sam Bottoms Serve Robert Young's movie rich kids which I thought Sneak preview back on the East F. Sneak previews remember that. Of course I saw. I saw raiders of the lost Ark at a sneak preview. Don't you see it with. I was by itself. It was like there was a thing sneak preview picture and we went when back then normally. A sneak preview was attached to another movie. So it's like Oh so you're gonna see this thing but if you stay. I think there was an ad in the times and in times and I knew enough to know that something about it was like I didn't know Harrison Ford really but I wanted to see it. We'll rich kids. Were sort of like the Ardy New York version of a little romance home. I see also a when it came out a Concord Airport Nineteen seventy-nine. I've seen that. Recently it was on do the Retro Channel or whatever the one the one that I like the one that I've actually seen a few times that I really like is airport. Seventy seven. The one with Jack Lemmon is the good. Yeah it's a pretty good burt Lancaster's kind of funny because it's so antiquated exact us but I do love it on the airplane. They all like in. Once upon a time in Hollywood everyone dresses up to fly. They do and justice for all with. I think it's three times just for the ending alone. How how big Richard Gere Fan? You were the APP was falling all those guys and now the thing is I knew I could never play. Which Gere's here's character but there is his buddy in the movie chick venire for two seconds? Had A little moment. 'cause he played Mar of the leather man in thank God. It's Friday how he was kind of guy and thank God. It's Friday. This was his follow up movie. It was the woman in Yanks At least I barker. Oh okay as she later. Did Editors Way cutters cutter's way is a good movie. Maybe not I feel. That was a big thing at the time. meteoroid meteoroid theater when it came out with Nelly would and Sean Connery When a stranger calls I saw that when it came out ten I saw that when it came no ten was that year black stallion? I saw that when it came out. Movie called Avalanche Express with Robert. Sean Lee Marvin Robert Shaw's last movie. I saw that when it came out starting getting over with Burt Reynolds. I saw that when it came out. I've never seen it can't experience. Oh Yeah No. It's terrific Yeah James L. Brooks James. It's his first. It's the beginning of James Brooks because this is first script where it's like okay. What he would do as other things is there right and starting you know like New Orleans scripts are there before even she started directing Fisher I didn't see the fish that saved Pittsburgh when it came out but I did see Stanley Kramer's movie. The runner stumbles symbols with Dick Van. Dyke and Kathleen Quinlan were there a priest and a nun. Phone love realized controversial K.. Didn't see the the Saw The rose with Bat yes. Great Santa I didn't see it in seventy nine. It didn't started playing again. Big Time in the in in one thousand nine hundred eighty so this was this engagement screen so I didn't see the Great Santini. I did see one thousand nine. Forty one couldn't wait to see nine hundred forty one went to disagree with everybody. I loved it. I read the paperback novelization. The Bob Gale wrote how realize how much they could out of the movie and I went into this and again I was one of the ones where I took the bus from the South Bay to see making forty one at the center of a Dome Dome being there. I saw that I didn't quite appreciate it. I liked it but I didn't quite appreciate Star Trek the motion picture which talk myself into liking all right and I talked to myself on the liking. Even though I didn't really quite like it then I saw it again and I didn't quite like it then. I saw it again ten years later and I didn't quite like it but then I saw it two years ago and I showed it to Danielle on my wife and she had never seen any star trek movies and she liked it and finally sing it a fourth time completely taking taking in what. It's not. I finally could see it for what it was. I can't appreciate it also. It was just kind of fun about saying William Shatner starring the literally at that time the most expensive movie the and who's the villain it doesn't really have a villain. Yeah it doesn't have a problem a black hole which had Robert Forster and I saw that that I saw this now now. It's now all the big science fiction extravaganzas. They've been making for a year. Now they're all coming out at the end of the jerk. I naturally so that a couple of times all that jazz not only do I see all that jazz when it came out playing on one of the few theaters in the South Bay the UA Turin's that was a standalone theater. Most of them were multiplexes. Two other ones in the South Bay and but one of the They usually played the big epic movies like an apocalypse clips. Now or a close encounters star wars would play there but the U. E. Torrance managed. I have managed to have really wonderful experiences. I remember like like even seeing Annie Hall there on a Sunday so new Willey on movie didn't know anything about it just I was fourteen eighteen fourteen. Yeah I just because it came at the year before. Yeah Yeah and so I. I just looked in the newspaper. It was playing at a three thirty. You show on a Sunday. I didn't even tell my mom what I was doing. I just hopped on the bike. Rode out there and saw any hall and little little. Did I know I'm seeing a real piece of cinema art. That my twelve or thirteen year old brain's not really kind of it's equipped equipped to handle it but it's handling it. It's a thing right. I've seen thank right and you knew it and the thing. That's even hard for critics. It's time to to to decipher right. I mean some people thought it was a joke machine because they couldn't see the depth and signed it. Wasn't that a while. My mind was blown but but I had seen something. That wasn't wasn't bananas and take the money or take the money and run. And so I I remember. I rode my bicycle home. So I've just seen Annie Hall and it's left it leaves you kind of melancholy kind of wistful feeling and I'm I'm having melancholy wistful fillings about something. I've never lived and I ride the bike home and I just kind of go in my room and I remember blind down on the bed and thinking about what it was that I saw. Wow that's so nice one of my favorite movie memories of coming home from Sunday afternoon. It's still daylight outside. My mom didn't even know I went to the movies you know and I'm just kind of having this private moment with any hall and I ended up having a similar thing with all that jazz however the thing that I remember about all that jazz by this point in time I'm lying about my age and I'm working at the pussycat theater right. I remember this so I'm working on a porno theater. I'm sixteen years old saying I'm I'm eighteen and I'm working at the pussycat theater and I just get off work and I go and see and I. It was Friday today and I just got paid Friday night and just got paid and I go see all that jazz and while I'm in the theatre. Blue is my paycheck. Yeah it was that I was the Trappist disaster and I still like the movie so much I was still happy. Even with a design a tragedy a a disaster disaster disaster and I still love the movie. I still thought it was terrific. I didn't really get all that jazz when I saw it as a kid to be honest I I I like it. I love it now but at the time I found it like she's death I don't know the whole thing was a little actually got that. It's I think I got everything I needed to get and I didn't I didn't I didn't bother me. Yeah I saw Richard. Richard Leicester's Cuba when it came out can do much for me. the electric horseman which was really good. At the time I saw chapter to which I didn't didn't care for when it came out and now comes down to the more exploitation. He kind of things I think independent movies I circle of iron. which was David Carey? Movie is is based on the Bruce Lee. Scream played the silent flute. Obviously Richard Pryor Live in concert. I saw this Shixiang classic movie. Bermuda triangle did like Noah's Ark didn't back So the warriors when that i-it's hi it's absolutely did I say I'm a big Fan of this movie. We recently at the new. Beverly and I've actually I actually. I'll tell the story to people from time to time. It's interesting enough. It's almost a better story until the movie was the movie. The promise by Gil cates. The Guy did the directed Academy Awards all the time. A phoebe cates his father author. Shyam Potok what is it not the promised by Shyam Potok. No no no. No it's a real fun seventies tearjerker. It's Steven cones and Kathleen Quinlan. And the whole idea. Is They're young lovers and they're going to get married and and Stephen Collins rich whereas a big company Big Real estate firm and his mom is beatrice straight. And she's she she's the monarch that The Patriarch runs everything. And he wants to marry this girl out of College Kathleen Quinlan and the and the mother like doesn't She's not good enough for you. You can get somebody else that Kinda Shit and screw you old lady. I'm GonNa marry her right now and so they go to get married and it's a rainy night in the car. Crashes Interfaces destroyed absolutely destroyed so the mom comes down to the hospital the sun's GonNa be. Okay he was thrown from the car. He's just out of it right now but he's going to be fine but the woman tire face just been destroyed so the mother goes to the girl and says look I will pay for you to have a new face and I will fix your face up and everything but you can never see my son again will what does he have to say. Well when I told them about your your face is destroyed. You know he wants out of the situation and he doesn't know anything about this so she thinks that the sun through her over so she accepts her deal and then when the sun comes to the mother tells the son that she died so the woman gets a new face now she looks like Kathleen Quinlan when she becomes a famous photographer. Well The sun goes out and now he's not married to her he commits to a being a big businessman and he finds her photography and he wants to. It's going to build a big series of banks and he'd like to use her photographs photographs as the way to advertise the bank in an artistic way so and so he goes to see her and he doesn't recognize her. She looks different now. She who knows who he is and she thinks she threw him over. So he's giving. She's giving him a hard hard time through the whole thing and he has no idea why he's giving her a hard time and he keeps pursuing her and keeps pursuing her and she keeps giving him a hard time then they start liking each other and then she reminded again about what she thinks he did and the whole thing ends up is early on in the film and the opening credits you see them going through some fair and Santa Cruz or something and and and she buys a piece of shit beating necklace from Emma. You have some hippie vendor and so they're up in Santa Cruz and they're looking over the lake. The lake it's the ocean. They're looking at the ocean on the rocks and it's all pretty and she lifts up a rock and she takes the beats and says these represent our love and at some point twenty years from now or thirty years from. Now we'll come up and we'll open this rock. I can well look at these beads. And they'll think about you know the love that we share with each other right now puts the rocky top of it so now they. They seem like they're going to get together but she he still doesn't know the story and and she thinks she has. She knows the wrong story and then finally she has a big explosion. She tells them the F. O. and and now she just has to eradicate the whole thing so she hops in a car and she's GonNa Drive to Santa Cruz to find. This is going to find the rock. And she's GonNa take the beat is gonNA throw him in the ocean and then the good rinse the bad rubbish enough of this ethin- guy and so he goes to boyfriend and he's like why don't you leave her a little. Look what is everyone talking to you about. And then the boyfriend finally tells him the story and so now he's going to the Rock and say and so she's driving with her driving all night and now at sunrise and she parked the car and she climbs up the hill and the music going big and then she gets to the Rock and she opens up the rock. And there's nothing there and then we hear Stephen Collins say be looking for these turns around and he's holding the Shitty beach afraid I can't I can't give you these beads very important to me. They're very meaningful to me to the person that I love more than anybody else in the world. I bought them for her and see I was told she died and so to me. These beads are are more important than life themselves so if he wanted to destroy them. I'm afraid I can't let you. Because they mean that much to me it and then everyone cried. Melissa Manchester's things that theme song for the promise. I said at the time I always great et got the worst review of the year in Los Angeles Times. I think I think it was like. Oh my God. People are laughing at the movie. This is so corny. I really liked a tear. Jerkers back that and so I read that hct review and saw the ten thirty show the Friday it opened at the ball. I was telling me cry and like I say you don't have to. I actually liked telling the story that actually reduces down all right. It actually has a nice effect. That story getting great getting through this. I almost feel like I saw the movie. That's that's why my version it has the benefit of being short phantasm which all my friends loved. And I didn't care for that much star crash which was an Italian billion star wars. Rip Off all right and these played theatrically and they all play at the only. I'm not naming him if I didn't see him at the theaters then did it. Does the half of those. I didn't know my be pictures. California dreaming a which was a beach movie directed by John Hancock. The Guy who was fired from jaws to you and which also starred Desk Christopher it was his second that year he did Both a breaking away and California dreaming so recently recently. It's not bad at one of the best movies dawn of the dead of course Interesting absolutely it's not good headbutt. Donald is very good. But a post apocalyptic movie directed by Richard Competent. The Guy who did Making county line called ravages that had a Richard Richard Harrison it. I also saw a cheerleader comedy called. Hots and H. T. S.. Anybody anybody duty was in that. Actually Malibu high which actually Malibu High Melba high was that it was a creditor national movie and was actually pretty terrific griffin started this girl named Joe Lansing that. She's one of the fines of seventies exploitation movie. She did one movie and then she disappeared. Just this one and remember when Kevin Thomas reviewed actually kind of made it a a bears up a bears this kind of comparison. He compared it at the time to honeymoon killers. Now it's a cheap ass thirteen day crown international movie shot at a a some South Bay high school. But it's about a girl who's she's kind of obsessed with this guy this kid at the school and I. She starts blackmailing her. She starts having sex with their teachers and blackmailing him to get better grades. Well that works uh-huh and always works and then she then she starts becoming a prostitute through this pimp guy but as opposed to something like angel. She doesn't kind of go through degradation. She kinda controls everything but Dan she actually is about that. She figures is out a way that she can kill a couple of She can kill a couple of people and get their money and so she does that and and all of it is kind of because of this like little scumbag that she likes to kind of center on the road to degradation a little bit until eventually she's GonNa get even on him. Wow and it's kind of good. It's it's a pretty good movie and she's really kind of terrific in the film. Okay wrapping this up also from current International Van Nuys Boulevard which I saw and Don deluise. `As directory all debut. Movie called hot stuff with him. and Suzanne pless Shannon Jerry Reed will be called hometown USA. Hey which was a America Rafidi kind of thing that Max Baer did Chuck Norris's second movie force of one. Yeah which had. Also Ron Ron. O.`Neil include Gallagher in it the Bruce Lee they kind of put together from the Bruce Lee movie game of death calling camp in that one camp camp night wing Arthur. Hiller movie about bats killer bats the prophecy John Frankenheimer's bear horror movie ecology. The movie that has this wild crazy baronet I would tell you Sharon Robert Foxworth Again only picking stuff I saw the villain. How Needham's Adams movie with Kirk? Douglas Margarethen Arnold Schwarzenegger Oh what actually when the Frisco kid which is horrible Robert Hall second the last movie with gene wilder and Harrison Ford. But a terrific movie and I actually think the best screenplay of a written for an exploitation movie the movie The lady in red the Pamela Sue Martin and written by John Sales and I think it's the best that movie could be remade now Jennifer the Lawrence and the and the and the legal and would be fantastic and David a russell could do it and he wouldn't change a word of he shouldn't change a word of the script it should be done like once upon a time in America or something and they had two weeks to shoot and they and Martin had a big moment as she was a little. It's a classic and it's it's it's it's I think it's the best explanation script of all the movies ever made. Connect Martin where she gets pregnant or something. There was another movie was well well. She didn't good stuff. Yeah Yeah Rock and roll. It was the year rock and roll high school. Wow I saw that. And that was a big. Yeah America Thon when John Ritter or the Neal Israel movie wasn't that good and to give us a crappy sexploitation movie called Swat me which was awful Swat at swap meet swap. Meet okay seven. Not The David fincher movie but the Williams Smith movie which actually it's a Andy sedaris movie and it. Looks like an indies. Adair's movie but I was happy to see William Smith was the star of it. Sammy stops the world. which was Sammy? Davis is live videotaped version of him doing and production adoption of stop the world. I want to get off. It was done by the same people that did the Richard Pryor live in concert like the magic. You're watching a shot on videotape. Tape live production of Sammy Davis Junior. Doing Stop the world. I WANNA get off. Did you like it. No I thought it was ripped off. skate town. USA which was the second roller disco movie and in has a which I saw three to four times at the theaters and it was unwatchable. Had All these horrible comedians like Gary Mule deer and and Vic Dunlop not funny and crazy like Dave Mason sections. Where with the movie just stops us? Dave Mason Boring estimates sings a song but but it has an Apache dance disco roller skating Apache dance between Patrick swayze before he became famous in the bad Guy Patrick swayze and his dance partner where they do to a disco version of under my thumb. Wow and it's an amazing sequence. We're three to four you you. I literally watched it four times just to see that. Dance sequence on roller skates on rollerskates. A Jaguar lives which which Stars kickboxing star. Joe Louis getting done the in here. roller boogie. which was the other roller? Disco move with Linda Blair. A movie called Scavenger Hunt which was done by Michael SCHOLTZ AGO did Cooley high that's sort of like a sort of like a big movie. COOL TERRIFIC WANNA be. It's a mad mad world Leeann. Is it Kennedy's penitentiary. Okay so that is and I'll do real quickly. That's the American ship foreign which will be a little easier. Because I wasn't going to that many foreign movies at that time but I saw wife Mistress Marcello the Laura Antonelli Maranhao I saw the innocent with Giancarlo Jeannine Lawrence and I saw the great train robbery with down. Yeah with a less than down. Sean Connery Michael Crichton movie saw and loved the silent partner with Elliott Gould. ooh and Christopher plummer just say something about Laura Antonelli for do we actually think she could act. I think really well all right. Not only that how I made a point of how well she could act because She was she was kind of known as a wet dream queen. Yeah that's part of the thing was because wife mistress and divine nymph like literally played for six months at eleven theaters and it was like and it was six months of like just that wife mistress ad in the newspaper and there was star Disea- channel and there was even but but she was no. She was driving people to the Linley theaters. Man She was a draw and all of for old movie started getting released a year. Like how funny can sex be and all these other way a mistress was was being release. She was she was. She's not only that there was actually a fame. They pretty big in Italy or just in America she was. She was very big in Italy but she just she became an arthouse Queen Queen Anne and so like that movie and Oliver Old Movies and some of those weird sex comedies. She did this all started getting released because it just her name alone. A high heels with a clause show Bro and the question and also they at one point in Los Angeles Times they had still of her from wife mistress which discerning negligee Lang on Shalon I remember it was a long legs and by that point in time you were older though wife mistress had been played for six months straight so it was like wife mistress has lakes six big month in Los Angeles Angeles not too so that when it came out licotta Foale saw that brought the house down to see look default one thousand nine hundred ninety eight when it came out on a Saturday night and a jam packed theater. You never heard hilarity like the last twenty minutes of that job. I mean it just brought the house down. I have often meant when I saw. The Mike Nichols version. I cracked up. Oh I just re watch that about two years ago at home alone with it will not home alone with a buddy and we were surprised at how much we were laughing. We thought it was. I mean what's his name. Hank Hanover Street. Which I'm always a big fan of them? Big Peter Timespan anyways meatballs which I saw at a sneak preview mentioned that the Bill Murray at one of the Los Translation parties I go. I saw meatballs up the sneak preview on the Friday then they had a big stick previewing. I remember that Friday was a big day for me. And and Didn't see moon raker dizzy. Moon Moon Record. Why not were you in an anti bond? No I really like the the spy who loved me but moon raker just seems Stupid to me. It just seems stupid. Have you seen it since not never seen record. See there we go. That's the one that's one of the ones I missed for sure. Life O'Brien Brian. All Right which I thought was hysterical. When it came out sauce soldier of orange all right it was a little over my head but that was one of the ones when I was able to start racing foreign films that the code that was that was one of the porn films of the year? Actually that was a soldier of Orange freaked me out as a child because I had never seen a naked man. Yeah when you saw soldier of Orange. She's naked and I was like. What is that really like kind of freaked out by soldier born time after time which where he like you know with the girl? Oh Yeah Yeah Yeah. There's a whole thing. Remember time after time McDowell time travel movie it was terrific love and bullets which was Charles Bronson movies. Movies has a really good cast actually Luna which I didn't care for it didn't understand the best one. Yeah I never thought about it. Read the Pauline Kale L. Review the Europeans which board me And I did not see the divine then. I've seen it since I Russia printed since really good Canadian film I really like running them with Michael Douglas Douglas Quadrophenia was another one at that time Michael Douglas movie called Adam at six. Am Six sixteen. I like that I like that too. I think that's a a good movie star. Yeah I think so too and I liked him in that period and particularly I think it was a good period months. Low budget stuff I saw at the theater is beyond the door part. Two which was Mario Baba's last movie receive a theatrical engagement. Also noticed unsee font though or also known as shock. Oh at least in America's B. A. B. Beyond the door part to winter kills which I'm a big fan of to this day love winter. Kill Love that movie. That was appalling. Kale review that I read and then felt I had to kill us. Terrific also saw. The kids are alright who movie. That was the documentary. Actually rock and roll high. School was a sneak preview with the reg with a regular movie. Kids are all right so I actually came for the last forty five minutes. It kids are all white to see rock and roll highschool deba CRONENBURG's the brood. Every so that's why I think it's the best movie along with the fly city on fire the Hong Kong one but a Canadian disaster movie that had a very newman from a vanishing point. And and let's Uh the shape of things to come. which was a Canadian version of that? That book done trying to make it a star wars as possible with Jack Palance and Carol Linley The Australian film by Patrick by Richard Franklin home a fan about Patrick Shame of the jungle which was an interesting x rated animated film. A that had. That's done really really. Gross and very very national lampoon the script by Michael O'Donoghue and we called a shame of the jungle. Shame Johnny Weissmuller. The third is the data. Shame but also Bill Murray does voices in John. Belushi does voices in Illinois. Does waste get released. Yeah I was there at the theaters I saw the fifth musketeer which was a pretty good version of a man in the iron mask. No it's not Michael. York is a Abo- Bridges and Sylvia. kristel I missed it I thought it was Michael York. If he's in the three musketeers kind. Yeah okay sorry and and I think we're getting to the very end of the year. I can't pick that because I didn't see at the theaters. Oh this I did see it. The theaters all right. The last one is a bruce lie. Moot movie called the Tattoo Connection. And how was it. Which is it's not bruce? Lie It's Jim Kelly hey what are you. That was my nineteen seventy nine and were you did you. Did you find yourself loving movies. Even more after the end did that year. Well yeah the the other here that I thought the movies along with seventy nine thousand nine hundred eighty and not only joan another day the another but you also have to think that the other movie this year because actually it was released for one week and seventy eight to qualify for the Oscars but the other film. This year was deer. Hunter really played in nineteen seventy nine. It just pay for one week and seventy eight to qualify for the cat. Did you wait no. I couldn't wouldn't go that week That we played in West because I was just too far away but yes so if you were to ask me that I think well I didn't have to choose because I was always able to say the deer Hunter One thousand nine hundred ninety eight move even though officially it was nineteen seventy nine all right but if I had to choose deer hunter would have been the movie that would have in the movie of the year for me rocky to would have been the movie that I enjoyed. The most deerhunter was the one that I had the most intense relationship intense relationship wave and really holds up. Yeah absolutely does even though I even though I one hundred more I would have still chosen apocalypse now. Okay just stop apocalypse. Now as a more grander statement. And the more grander adventure and filmmaking. Even though you liked your hundred deer hundred I think I to me. I think again I didn't have to do it. He's like keep putting it in. Nineteen seventy eight because they worked at a wormhole for me to do that with so I never had. I never had to make the match up in a one on one competition but I actually think when I think when I saw deer oh I thought it was the best movie ever made. That was the best movie I've ever seen and I saw like I saw like six times during its during nineteen seventy nine. Did you ever do the thing which I I did with deerhunter where I watched. I sat there just watched it again. You can't do that anymore. which is really sad? Yeah these big gaps. Yeah I know I was always I if I could just got to. The Russian roulette seen. Yeah exactly but look I pay for that fucking wedding a million times. When he's not that that's the part I always like? I mean it's all the fall of Saigon stuff that I don't care about so much but he's incredible when he comes back to narrow to the end part is amazing. There's something so broken about him but I mean I actually think so beautiful but I actually think that maybe there were walking his there there were there were. There were exciting scenes than there were thrilling scenes and they were good action scenes whether it be jaws or and there were emotional scenes in movies whether it be the end of close encounters serves or or you know the the prom sequencing carry. There's all kinds of scenes that affected me in a big way but there was nothing like the Russian Roulette Sane right all right that I'd ever seen before where I was in that room and like I saw all the movies six times in a three hour movie. Six Times in the theater one was engulfed with the characters and hanging out with all their tomfoolery during into deer. Hunting cabin yeah. They're singing along singing in the bar and getting Dr Love when they say yeah but having he said all of that it was that sequence in the In the prison camp that just blew me away. I had never been a been put in a sequence like that before and again impaling cow where it was like you know she actually thought a lot of the movie was Bs and even made a point about the idea that like well. You know. Everyone's saying this guy is so great and the only thing he's done is he's moving well basically he's just made the big three hour very pretentious cleese movie. It's very similar to that. But she goes. However it's got the Russian roulette saying and it's just the greatest pieces of cinema that has ever been directed that has ever been acted that has ever been edited? There's been sounded. I mean everything about out that sequence is just one of the is just is just everything you go to movies for right. Have you seen it recently. I saw it about four years ago. Well I've seen it before that because after Cimino die we had a little retrospect and so I saw his kind of goddaughter when saw together but both the more meaningful screening is. I'd saw three years earlier. You're at Terry's festival in a lien on his little. Here's the movie festival. Leon and Camino was there for a retrospect and then he introduced a screening of The deer hunter and the Museum of we're at the thing together and so we went and watched watch the together and that was the time where I hadn't seen it in about a decade. I definitely had seen it since. I've been a filmmaker and I was already thinking about the hateful eight So I was watching how he shot the weather and I was really taking taking a taking that in and how we got the missed you for all the deer hunter scenes when they're in the mountains and stuff and so I started like hitting hitting him. What questions about thinking? Wow you gotta get this place set up you gotTa have three places you can drop trigger on if you need to like. Maybe this doesn't get snow and you have to be able to compete with. This place gets too much now. You'RE GONNA be able to compete for their. You have to have three places you could. You could pick up the production and go to if you need to if you really if you're really going to be that serious about shooting the weather then that's what you're doing. You're shooting the weather right. You GotTa do what it takes returns to the weather and you've got to do what it takes for me to whether you're building it around the weather and I remember asking him about we're talking about the movie and here's the thing. Michael Cimino didn't talk about the deer. Hunter you made you know. I don't talk that much about poke fishing because different wants me to. And he didn't make a point about not talking about the dinner but he was there for the a whole week so we've got to get pretty familiar with each other. We everyone kind of AIDS at the same diner every restaurant every day. So you really get you. Have you have lunch with everybody and almost almost dinner with them every night. Kind of really get to know everyone right so like now. You're GonNa this movie together and then we'll be together so you really start really breaking down that whole being a guest at film festival the way the way when I was more open was like when I used to go from. Yeah and so after he he he doesn't watch the screening of the one hundred but he's at the big dinner they have afterwards so now I'm just peppering with questions and he's answering the questions I can ask him anything about the deer hunter. I want And he'll give me the answer a told me a story about. He had his cut of the movie and then universal universal get their cut. which like you know reduce the the the wedding sequence by lot? Just you know butto movie down to a more manageable blink. So probably think about like ninety minutes but say less than two hours and then there's his version which I'm imagining is like. You know two thirty or two forty years and and so he hated their cut but that was their right to do their cut. He had his so they were GonNa do with thing where they were gonNA show his Co. and they're ever filmed got on the better score from the audience would be the cut that goes out at the theater so he screens his Co. screens and it gets it gets a good Gets a good rating when it comes to would you recommend it so it it gets a Good rating so now. They're showing the other and he's in the projection booth. What's going on and and it was a real weird jerry rig thing that they did because I don't think it was even on reveals time so it's like the actual film film is threaded through the projector and it's going to another projector at the exact same time? I don't remember what the deal was but it was a situation where it's not just. Attached is to two reels. It's attached to the project is attached to the real. The real is going to the projector and snakes out along the floor of the projection. The boot to a to a platter system but they're not connected so the film is actually. It's not going to work running across the keeping all moving but the film was actually running just above the floor. Wow to the real to the wet real coming straight out of the lab. And he's sitting on a chair and he sees the film going by his feet. And this is the cut I and this is a universal to our version another movie and he's looking at the film and he's looking up the film and he stepped up and it gets all jammed up the projector and everything shuts down and so they all get sucked up the lights come up for a little bit and they will give us a second. We have to fix it and then they fix it and they get a back up again but because of the break aac in the thing and because there was a problem because the lights went up and everything like that it got a lower score fantastic and his version tastic. But that wasn't the deal you got the better score. So he went he cheated. That's such a great story and then the other story he told me but what wasn't a story it wasn't a story. It was an interesting an interesting observation from him after deer hunter. If you read the Book Final Cut. He wanted to do. fountainhead right. I know and and any wanted eastwood the play the architect. Fountainhead and he said Eastwood came damn close to doing it and he said the only reason you didn't do it. It is because Gary Cooper had played the part before he didn't want to work and he did and he didn't want to be always felt they'd been associated. Gary Cooper said. You WanNa play a rule that Gary Cooper played right and Michael was still to this day it was like Oh I came so close to making the perfect found because I had the perfect guy and it would have been amazing but then I ask for project though I asked him about and talking about deer hunter one of the things I realized watching deer hunter. I guess it's six years ago now. Maybe less watching being an that screening. I realized that I didn't really understand the movie. Back in seventy nine. When I sought six times I understand I understood the bigness of the movie? Right I understood the EPA quality of it but I didn't really get get what it's about and watching it that time all of a sudden I really saw was about and then I brought it up to Michael and he said and then he backed up. Yeah this is exactly what it's about it's not about the Vietnam War. It's about a town in Pennsylvania that is tied to this old world. Russian Catholic tradition. I mean one of the things is strange about the movie is is the entire wedding ceremony the entire pomp and circumstance of all the old ladies in the town and all the young men and all the young ladies ladies at the wedding. They all serve a function. It's not just the normal best man and bridesmaid function that it all has something to do with this. Russian Catholic a tradition. That goes back like a hundred years. Goes back way beyond America right and and like everybody. Everybody in the town is part of this. Russian Catholic tradition and we don't even know what they're doing now half the time we watch and do we just know that they know what they're doing right. They all Kinda speak Russian. A little bit you know that the parents all speak Russian and then the kids all have an understanding of Russian to some degree. And it's about this town in Pennsylvania which might as well be town in Russia. which might that has little to no connection with the wider American world other than their jukebox? Right or their television satellite. Maybe neither radio right and their life. The idea is to make their life the way it's been for the last hundred hundred years. Yes now as the sixties going on little by little by little outside forces are imposing themselves on the pop culture way in a cultural way to some degree but for the most part even the young MC are still holding onto an old line right an old an old way of being and and they're supposed to stay and they're absolutely say you're not supposed to leave and then a cataclysmic. A clinic event happens to three of the young men and how it changes them forever and it changes the people that they know in the town forever and the people and then when you see them there little group at the end of the movie there are completely changed changed and devastated people. Yes it's true and it has nothing to do with the Vietnam War it's simply a cataclysmic event. Absolutely and I don't think I understood that at all in Nineteen seventy-nine. Did you know I saw it as damage to the individuals. I didn't get the town. I did not get the town. I'm Martin mostly saw to me. It was what war does to you. Yeah that's what I thought but I did not. I did not make AAC any bigger deal than if the three guys. We're in Tennessee. Moonshine and I thought that the I mean honestly felt similar similar. I think to you that the I'd never seen anything like the Russian releasing I had never i. I felt so devastated by Ed like in this kind of profound. It wasn't even like a movie. I was living in this thing but frankly I'd never seen walking in Annie Hall. Yeah I had never seen the just kind of jokey Tomfoolery of the Camaraderie. Yeah that the guys had during their entire deer hunt during the night afterwards after the wedding. And everything where it's like it's not played like a movie it's real life and and it's really a funny lady real life and those guys are really funny and their lottery together and their bullshit together. They're really funny. And there's also this feeling of dread Constant dread with the Blah Blah with the wine on the. Yeah on the drinking. The movie breaks down what you would expect for a movie be because I mean the wedding saying you might as well be at the wedding right all right and then you might as well have gone hunting with them right and then you're thrown into that. Pow Camp exactly and then you might as well be in the POW camp exactly. Yeah and also. They're acting as saying just so. Yeah it's Deniro. Now we got a game. I mean it's just I the greatest film-acting ever I mean it's it's really something and then you know and so great to see him. I'm in the Irishman. I won't tell you anything but it's what you used to say. That Deniro movie wasn't Evatt. Feels more like oh I believe it. And Pacino yeah mostly tie believe in the movie is. Here's the thing though is so I remember asking Michael. I go because you know. He was from Pennsylvania Coal Mining town. I ask Michael Cimino I go to Michael. What live Charles Bronson had played Michael in deer hunter? was he up for you know something. Yeah I can imagine made his call her. Yeah he made he you know. He made his career with Eastwood Thunderball And which McCullough Walter Hill made his career With Charles Bronson. Yeah he wrote. He wrote hard times. Jan Michael Vincent Larry Gordon. Since it's Charles Bronson runs yeah sure great and even and actually at the same at a different festival but the festival Walter Hill was there and they were having a montage of some of his movies and they showed Charles Bronson from hard time they go. Wow you charlie hadn't said yesterday I mean none of those movies might have happened right. I mean it all came down Charles Bronson Charlie Bronson saying yes to me as a first time director and then I mean if he had said no none of those other movies ever ever happen. I mean he actually was the guy that put me there and so I ask so. I'm interested in. I just throwing out so I go. Well what about Charles Bronson playing Michael. And that's Michael. Is the name of the character. Robert Deniro plays and he was out of it. We was adamant about two things adamant about no that wasn't right but then adamant for me to understand why it was like no no no no no no Charles would be all wrong from Michael. You'll be all wrong. Michael has to be a king among men. Michael has to be a king and Deniro and that rented Tuxedo. Oh driving that shitty ass coupe. Deville he's a king among his peers. Right he's he's he's beyond. He's from another time. He's from another world when he stuck in this world and in a straight you in a weird way the tragedy of the war opens him up. It gets him out out of this town. He is not he should not be of this town. He is a cane right. He shouldn't be of lusting after his best friend during his best friends Wipe it works at the grocery store should be with somebody grander. Yeah these guys and when he comes it comes back and when it comes back. It's it's not the same he he's not the same and there's no way he's going to stay spend any more time there after the after they get through singing. God bless America but he made a point. 'cause that's why Bronson wouldn't be right because I don't see him as a king among men but I really respect Charles Bronson. I really respect suspect a man. I respect the mattress Bronson was I respect that Charles Brown. I respect what he became. I respect where he came from respect that he worked the coal mines and respect that he came up the way he did as an actor. And so I so even though. I don't think it's right from Michael. I know why you're saying that why you're saying that you're right be wrong. So that's good but I think people also forget how beautiful Robert Deniro was so clear you something so unique about well there was also for that matter was also I actually have actually have a memory. That was really amazing. Was Back on the Mike. Douglas Show would do this Mike. Douglas did a show where it was like. The whole show was New York New York. Now all right yeah. So it's like a Liza Minnelli is co hosting it and she comes out so she started off. She's thinks the world goes round. Then they start then they talk with Mike for Awhile her in Liza then then they bring crazy and he comes out and he talks about the movie and they show behind the scenes crap and everything and Mary Kay place comes out and she's a little haggard on the Mary Hartman. She's moving so that she talks for a little bit then Diana Abbott Rubber Dinners comes out and saying honeysuckle rose from the movie and then she goes and joins them on the couch and they're talking and then go so you're married to bobby right. And she goes. Yeah you know goes where's bobby now. Because Robert Darren doesn't do each just backstage. She's watching me and they get Robert Deniro to come out. And so Robert De Niro. He's making deer hunter so he's in his beard and so Robert Deniro in his one hundred. Beer your comes out on the Mike. Douglas Show to thing for New York New York. And he's he's as Laurie anything he's learned out and he sits down and that's what I'm doing a movie right now so doing something right now. Is that what the what the beards about. Yeah Yeah I'm doing right now. Yeah it's called Darren I'm working with a lot of really really actors guild get actors and I respect. Oh well I cou a sticky John Savage in these people that might have a Michael Douglas's great. Yeah and then Mike Douglas and and then not Michael Douglas Douglas. And then the whole episode ends with Liza Minnelli Doing Big New York New York the end of the episode uh-huh and you're like this is the great it was really now is just amazing to imagine due to remember seeing Robert Deniro. While he was making Darren are having being an iconic walk out with the beard and being shy and being really shy. Yeah it was like looking at the looking very beautiful all right. I think we're done. We can talk all day. So thank you so much Quentin. It's always always wonderful speaking with you and I can't wait to do another podcast with you and maybe we'll get to the second two questions. Thank you for listening to season one of five things with Lynn Hershberg. Make sure to subscribe so you can be the first to hear season two. We're going to continue to have great talent awesome. TV people some surprises and some legends. That I can't wait for you to hear. This is the end of the first season. And there's some people I really would like to thank especially especially first of all Schon Assadi and Michael Beckford. Who have done a brilliant job creating this podcast with me? I'd also like to thank ceremony. Says says and the team that W magazine and I'd also like to extend a special. Thank you to Robert Shore. The roads such a brilliant theme song and as always I send my thanks to Sora ooh La La la La

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One Flew Over the Cuckoos Nest v Ratched

40 Going On 14

1:56:23 hr | Last month

One Flew Over the Cuckoos Nest v Ratched

"Talk never never say hello everybody. Welcome to forty going on fourteen. I m patrick joel. And i'm josh and watching. One flew over the cuckoo's nest and wretched. This week is backing up my theory that if your name is mildred. You're one of two things so somebody's grandma or fucking evil or somebody's evil grandma. Oh yeah i guess you could be. Both i need to modify this theory or somebody fucking evil grandma all right well. Let's address the elephant in the podcast. First of all. Mike is not here this week. Instead we have a guest star in blake from history of bad ideas. Everybody say hi blake. Hi thank you wanna give it a little bit of information about yourself sure. Of course hey Coming to you live from the cincinnati. Ohio History of bad ideas You're can find a son. Twitter facebook You know it's great to be back. I haven't seen you guys over a year. I was kind of missed out on the fact that there was no gen pan in person. This past year is normally. I like to come up and bother you guys. You wash your instinct game shows. And i've i've grown a full inch over the last year sideways out. You know we are. We are podcasting brethren. I think we started shortly. After you guys in i know we've crossed pollinated in the past several times back and forth though. I do have to ask. When did you guys move onto fifty going on fifteen. We're getting there. I mean. I was not yet forty when we started this seven eight years ago. I was the. I still am the baby of the group. I was like thirty seven thirty eight when we started. And we're up seventeen and a half months away from being fifty. That's and i'm the first one. Yup and then mike and then me and then eventually josh eventually me. Yeah so yeah. Actually you guys will eventually be able to drive right eventually. What for now. You'll find us at twelve not twelve noon on saturdays. We're not twelve noon on saturdays anymore. We're still on geek. Life radio though along with such shows as all things transform rush the shining wizards wrestling podcast. Html all the things. And klay radio's own red dead radar the sh- mortgage borg bom bom bom that getting there. It's definitely not it though. How events eventually but for now you can find us on. Itunes blueberry stitcher. Talk shoe padras. Fm noon fm dot com a spotify iheartradio tune in radio amazon music. And of course we're always on pod being where we'd be happy to have any of your reviews or ratings and you can reach us all the normal places social media and give us a call at seven or eight. Now wrap that seven eight six nine nine. Seven two seven ditto. Do we have any listener feedback. Speaking of which any point smells emails. None of that no no. Nobody loves us. What a much jerks he said because he totally checked the voicemail number. I think he did. I was convincing. Your bluff definitely worked on roll all right well. Then without further ado. I think it's about that time. Bruce week music movies t and speaking our. I don't know. I can't do the high voice because it loses me. So that's we don't do that voice either because i mean we want that lost and that it's not going anywhere all right. We'll see if that caught this weekend. Doing november nineteenth nineteen seventy five. The release of one flew over the cuckoo's nest right so music. The number one song in the land was island. Girl by elton. John followed up by lionized by the eagles. Too good songs. Yeah a watching you know not that one. No not that. One is is probably. The song went comes to fronting a band. I have sung more than any other. Yeah i could see that. Yeah it's just wild because Like it almost doesn't matter your age. You probably know that song. It's fairly easy to play and it's just a nice easy easy listening type song that if you don't listen to it sounds like you know it's it's about a nice couple if you don't listen to the words kind of like that's also true of island girl. Don't listen to the words. It's probably about a nice couple. No it sounds like it's about a nice couple. If you don't listen to the words okay never mind. Same is also true of berserk point. Yeah i think. I may have lost my point somewhere. Move along sign. would you like to making. I think he's talking about romantic. Love thing of the world sound like a nice couple point taking no shut up. All right so queen's bohemian. Rhapsody went to number one in the uk where it remained for the last five seventy five and the first four weeks of nineteen seventy six. Otherwise known as the wayne's world song yes Yeah it definitely made. It definitely made a big difference in in the everlasting success of but he mean rhapsody for sure. Like i'd heard queen before wayne's world came out but i'm not entirely sure i had heard bohemian rhapsody more than once it really wasn't. I mean it was kind of semi popular when it first came out but it was like a flash of the pain and only lasted a couple of weeks at number one. it wasn't like phenomenon or anything right. What i would have known would have been. We are the champions and we will rock you before world after that. Like i celebrated their whole catalogue said previously talking about queen. I mean it's still. I'm in love with no. I'm in love with my car. But i mean what is okay. Well then why why why. Why why why do you do that. bring up. i'm in love with my car. yeah. Brian may need some love once in a while. O'brien may is amazing. That song is but though moving on. Should i a bicycle joke here. That song is not good either. But i like that song. It's not working one song. It's a fun song. Fund sucks at bottom girls my best friend those are great songs headlong thinned iron eagle and i love that ending right. Yeah speaking of which. Thank you patrick for that video. You're welcome did look delicious. All right moving on travis. Barker drummer for blink. One eighty two and plus forty four was born in fontana california on november. Fourteenth was pretty confused by that blink minus one to plus four four. Just sort of weird algebra in the show notes. You too much homework. I think it's new math. I have to solve for blink. What the hell is released. November eighteenth the fourth studio album by rufus rufus featuring chaka khan eventually won nineteen seventy-six billboard album of the year one a patrick's favorite artists. Shocker chuck check a great eighty song. Yeah see and just another step in my lifelong proof of seventies musicians. This album shock. I was good back then and in the eighties fell apart like wet elephant poop. Just all the if you were good musician in the seventies you sucked in the eighties. That's the thesis a win that also carry over for rock bands that went into the disco era and then came back out in the eighties. This rolling like the rolling stones disc album. I forget what was at or even kiss even at some disco songs too. Yeah i really got sucked. Med yeah i know that's not going to make the show trying to think somebody to disprove that but so far would have come up with. We've occasionally taking issue with a couple of points but usually even if we love the song in the eighties. Patrick will not abandon his thesis. I would. I believe you're about seventy percent true. You just believe you're about ninety five percent true. Yeah because you like some songs that suck like. I just called to say i love you as much as i love. Stevie wonder that's a bad song it's just saccharin and crappy. There's like the the the backbeat is like like a casio preset backbeat. It's just the whole song. It's sappy and shit and i've got one that's not as good aren be stuff. You're absolutely right. Yeah michael jackson. All of his stuff is in the eighties. Yeah but he had quite career in the seventies as well. True could stuff. There's at least one dress better in the seventies to if you have to go to basically one of the most transcendent pop stars of all time to find your champion. I'll i'll give you that concession. Because there's not a whole lot of michael jackson's out there well then i'm writing this down. My diaries. patrick said something good. And if you're going to stevie wonder you can't just cherry pick because part time lovers amazing and it was in the eighties. I don't know. I don't know i seriously would not call that song beijing. I mean it's okay. It's got a decent beat. You know but. I mean the lyrics are kind of repetitive. And you know it's basically a song about About adulterers so. I don't know how great a bit of a soggy it is. I mean it's okay being about adulterers. That's that's relevant in the same way that we're talking about lionize. Don't listen to the lyrics. Goes to those about nice couple questionable island girl island girl question mark and finally dirks bentley. american country singer was born in phoenix arizona on february nineteenth on. Sorry oh yeah. This is real bentley's nine studio albums have accounted for twenty five singles on the hot country songs and country airplay charts of which seventeen of reached number one seven more of a singles have reached the top five. And i can't name a why can't name one either. Oh his big one was one of his first ones to If you if you ain't lovin. No that's that's george strait and i actually looking biggest hits and i still don't know any given name of the of the first one that came to run kind of plane no not that. That's literally his biggest hit. Because that's how google what's after the end long them gone. What was i thinking. That's the one that i know. Yeah yeah nothin about training and tears and beers and pickup trucks. Oh yeah what was i. Thinking is all about that kind of stuff good. It's all about his regrets of what he did while he was drinking. So i know what i was drinking but what was i thinking is a drinking. That's the only way to fly only with into the word. So i thought it was about a nice couple pilots. Shut all right. Moving adds a movies. A number one movie in the land was three days of the condor. A political thriller directed by sydney pollack and starring. Robert redford faye dunaway. Cliff robertson. And max von psycho. This mike would have seen for sure for sure. The only the only thing. I remember this movie is a weren't. They like a racing car on the highway next to the ocean. That's the only thing i remember. And i've seen condor man. I've seen alan re days of the condor i. I don't think i've ever seen this. I think max. Von sydow was eighty years old at the time too so so this is ten years after he was born. I mean it's got a hell of a cast. What i don't think yeah a guy. Maybe i may have to watch this. Movie's release this week included. Are you know what you know what i was thinking. I was thinking of the graduate. Somebody sorry two very different similar cars and roads and you know california. Coast way all right. I'm sorry i wish they thinking give warriors movies released this week. Included stardust in of the damned inserts macintosh and tj fear over the city permission to kill the human factor and the acronym of the week which is a a hd which i'm pretty sure stands for abba brutalizes. Hungarian disco regular waterloo. Nope sorry. I can't believe that's not what it is. It is actually a boy and his dog. That's the only one of these. I've seen hughes close. I don't think i've seen any of those in. If that's the case if these movies released this week you know. One of the kookiness had a very good shot of becoming as popular as it did if this was the competition not good. I want to see macintosh and tj again. Have you seen that. Sounds like a buddy cop show right his dog or his monkey. I know joel. And i watched a boy and his dog together. That's the one with back. Travolta it's miami vice of boy. A boy boy macintosh tj. That premieres right after a ten speed and brown shoe. You're thinking of don johnson on. Just yes dick sifi Movie that is boring shit. I believe it's a little rabi to guess who was macintosh and tj. It was at the prequel to be j and the bear is a story of the forming of apple and trader. Joe's that was fair over the city moving on tv hate moving onto television. That's my cue. The top shows in the land were all in the family. Rich man poor man laverne and shirley and maud. That's a that's a good line up right there. It's linda rollercoasters. With that is 'cause i don't know maud. I never liked maude as a kid. I never like maude. But as an adult. I've seen some episodes and it's not as bad as i thought it was. You know maybe. I need to revisit as an adult i do. I haven't watched it in a long time. So someone to reboot maude. It's gone the yeah. You're right all the just wait. That's what hollywood does i hope. Reboot liberated shirley i. Oh no i. I was as a latchkey kid. I mean i was baby sat by vernon sherline. Oh i love that show so much. My my cat is named booboo. Kitty all that so appropriate. Yeah yeah it's it's too it. And of course i mean how can you how come let lending squeaky never got their own spin off show. Yeah try not. They may have did. Maybe that's why. I don't remember it if it didn't go that well the lone wolves the lone wolves exactly and why didn't milk and pepsi ever take all right. Never mind i. It's it's a sped. It tastes like a a flat shake. I was going to ask if you had tried it. Yup okay. I have answer. They did make a pilot for a lengthy squeaky in the army show and it was not picked up in the army. What did they get drafted for vietnam or something. I guess yeah it was the head writer of laverne and shirley was asked that question why there was never a spin off and they made a pilot was called lenin square. You in the army and abc passed on it. Yeah what a horrible setting for the two of them. Why would you rhythm in a place that restricts the shit out of them like. They're not gomer pyle. You know they can't. They're not just going to go along with everything. Oh that's just i mean. Maybe that's the comedy they were going for the to greece being forced into the army being drafted and then the horrors of war. Good team squeaky edition. It wasn't a sitcom. It was a drama. That's let just often the corner rocking back and forth chewing on his hand. He's got a gun in his mouth in the bathroom then mash gone wrong. Letting squeaky mashed. Oh my oh okay So i guess. I should move on november. Twenty third sneak previews the first american film review. Show premiered this. Launched the careers of your guys. Chicago's critics gene. Siskel robert heaver. Who remained a staple among film critics as a team through various programs for the next twenty four years and i must add much copied in imitated even to this day. Oh for sure. I think everybody myself included forgot. Their show wasn't just called cisco any work. It was actually called sneak previews i'd completely forgotten that. I used to love watching that. Even though i hadn't seen half the movies at the time it was on the air probably not even that many. I always enjoyed watching it. Yeah i always had a good time to listen to this to bainer back and forth. you know they. They had some good conversation. Good chemistry and and Really enjoyed them very much as as much as i disagreed with a lot of their views. Especially roger ebert a lot of respect for that man and if you guys haven't seen his the documentary life itself It's really it's really good. It's a little hard to watch. Sometimes after he has his job removed. Yeah that's right. He had jockey answer right. It's a little jarring to watch but yeah but the technology. They used considering how much talking he'd done to basically recreate his own voice. Now it's pretty cool. Apparently only called sneak previews from seventy seven to eighty two. Then it was at the movies from eighty to eighty six and then it was just siskel and ebert with what i remembered from. Eighty six to ninety nine. I vaguely remember. All three of these shows. I remembered it is at the movies. I remember that had does my first introduction to them to all right now. I know you guys are waiting for this one on november sixteenth. Donny and marie. An american variety show debuted the show starred brother and sister. Donny and marie osmond. Donny had become popular singing a music group because he was a little bit rock and roll the osmond's and marie You know one of the youngest sister's to reach number one in the billboard country music with charts with paper roses because she is a little bit country. Yes i watched the show. Obviously i do not have happy memories of the show. It's definitely something i watched. It was one hundred percents. Something i watched because i don't know i don't know if you guys remember that little secret embarrassing confession. I made one show about this whole my former. Love for donny osmond. I wanted to be him. He was kind of cool. I used to tell people. I used to tell people that was my name i i was. I went through a phase where i was like signing. My paperwork is done teachers teachers by bye by elimination figuring out who it was. You know wearing a football helmet painting black and calling it. His hair color shirts bell bottom pants right split making very subtly overtly so subtle overtly sexual innuendo between me and my sister. You know that kind of stuff y through mix things up brought in their other twenty brothers and sisters from utah. Far too much hugging going on here on set. Do you know i. I would have to say in regards to her Health food commercials is. She's aged very well. It's either that or she had a very good plastic surgeon combination of both. Yes she she looks great. Yeah it's amazing now donnie. I can't say. I haven't seen him so he was yeah. He was on the singer season. Two or season one. Oh wow yeah. And he looked to they both. They both look like they're in their early forties genetics. They made a deal with the devil. It that's how they got their show. Wouldn't it be ironic. Don't think moving on you said trademark that real quick. Because i think you do have a good movie there. Donny and marie got their show. Donnie and marie and the devil. The devil makes three devil and masailand or a netflix series. Oh that's that's a likelihood true crime documentary but the osmond's trying to think it would be called. I don't know but they're gonna have tiger king interview. He actually like fits their era and genre of clothes and hair. I mean he's dead in. It's probably trying to play to the other chat. Josh yes yours. You were saved by octa infusing play. What a four believes moving onto sports on february nineteenth cincinnati reds. Second baseman joe. Morgan was named nationally. Mvp ray for cincinnati on february eighteenth calvin murphy of the houston rockets ended his then. Nba record streak of fifty eight games with a made free through cincinnati. Today actually wasn't his because somebody coughed when he was on the line. That happens all the time. Though i mean or i know i know what it was squiggly noodle the first time the squiggly noodles made their appearance in the nba arenas team on army with lenny noodle. That's right. Chris moneymaker american poker player. Who's two thousand and four win. At the world. Series of poker main event sparked the modern day poker. Boom was born november twenty first and that should say two thousand three win two thousand and four that his real name. Yes that actually is his real name. Which is one of the reasons him winning with such a big deal because it made such good television he was. It was an accountant named moneymaker and he entered a eighty dollars tournament online to win a seat into a bigger tournament to win a seat into the ten thousand dollars by tournament and he wanted to turn amounts and got into the main event and ended up winning the whole thing. And it's been a millionaire ever sets because talk about being Shoehorned in by your name right now and it caught on. He went on. I mean it's honestly literally part of the reason why i could make a living in poker. Is chris moneymaker because he got so popular at it. Made it made poker so popular so fast and so quick. He was on letterman. He was on I mean he was. He was doing book tours. And you know all kinds of stuff and it made an enormous poker boom that we're still kind of surfing the wave of. I'm glad i changed my last name. From fart sniffer festival. Moneymaker you'd take it never live. You would have had at least not shit scheffler right. Say who's who's the guy. He beat to win. That poker championship is it is last name. Like fourth street checker. No actually it was. Sam farr who was from houston and he's a guy that i actually have dealt to and i know him. Wow yeah he. He lives here in huston. He plays in some of the games i do. I smelt it joel marx. Never grenade i yeah. I started thinking about an idiot. All right let's get the hell out of this tweet. This last bullet. Point jason williams. Nba point guard and member of the two thousand six nba. Champion miami heat was born in belle west. Virginia on november eighteenth nicknamed the white chocolate he was known for flashy jaw-dropping plays on the court not to be confused with a shotgun williams from the nba. Right yeah not a big big difference. Big big difference indeed difference. Can you imagine being jason williams dummy dead jason williams and then having another jason williams come through and just like totally screwing up. It'd be like chris. Moneymaker had a twin brother who just sucked at poker was bankrupt. It's instead of winning the w. sob shot the dealer. Might the last boy scout and instead of being account he was like a busboy or soccer. Oh my god we need to get out of this tweet keyboard joel. He got the same musical talent that we have in our podcast. All right. so this week's show we are doing. A one flew over the cuckoo's nest versus the new network show. Wretched has one season on it. we'll be covering that in the now but for the then we're gonna talk about the one thousand nine seventy five like i said. One flew over the cuckoo's nest A quick summary here Written by jacob oberfrank whoever that is familiar with that name everybody knows jacob over for his name is my name to all right. Mcmurphy has for the jingle hammerschmidt joke and you did not disappoint. I don't like to disappoint. i don't like to just do something. A lot doesn't mean. I like to do it like then i like to do that don't we. All mcmurphy has a criminal past and has once again got himself into trouble and his sentence by the court to escape labor duties in prison mcmurphy pleads insanity at a set to award for the mentally unstable once here mcmurphy both endures and stands witness to the abuse at degradation of the oppressive nurse wretched who gained superiority and through the flaws of the other inmates mcmurphy and the other inmates band together to make a rebellious stance against the atrocious nurse. Wretched fairly reasonable summary. It's a little wordy but it's good. Yeah i i don't know if i'm jumping the gun or not. But was nurse. Ratchet really oppressive in this movie nebi. Now that i watch it as an adult as compared to you know a young child. I remember watching this movie with my dad. You know because he is a big jack. Nicholson fan and i remember back. Then you know kinda disturbed by but he is an adult and it doesn't nurse kind of get a bad rap in this. I think this is definitely something. We shouldn't safer later for sure that it's definitely something we need to talk about. I think that's a great question. But i think yeah. We're we're jumping a little too far off in the deepen from the beginning up cast and crew and some trivia and we'll we'll circle back. Yeah so this is a directed by meals foreman By her to him. Yeah for sure that was. That was a trick question. Okay jokey joke yeah. He has directed Lot of lot of things Each known throughout hollywood so. I don't think i needed this go through his list. Everybody knows him right. We lose. I mean the big ones. Like amadeus people. Versus larry flint. This is probably the biggest man on the moon. I don't know. I like that one. A lot hair beautiful. Hey i like here. It's one of my favorite musicals. Yeah all right. So i guess we'll go over a couple of things he did. Yeah yeah meals foreman The writing credits Lawrence how been goldman and the novel was originally written by ken. Cassie read the novel. Yes i have as well. So yes i i have read the novel a young adult having seen the movie i it was a pleasant surprise. Shame here yeah. Yeah josh have you read. this is the rare normally. I'm the one of the people talking has read the book. This is the time. I'm the only one who hasn't that's great. Yeah that was going to point that out if you hadn't like this be the first time we've all read it in josh. Hasn't wow he's usually the one that's read the book For some reason we have the play version of one. Over the cuckoo's nest was written by dale wasserman. Well i mean the play was a big deal. I don't know if it's in I'm trying to get two thousand. Michael douglas stuff or kirk. Douglas douglas michael where he played mcmurphy on broadway. Yeah yeah. He handed it over to mike for this movie. He's one of the producers. That's also why is names associated with rachid. That is all correct. I'm blowing the trivia. I'm sorry that's all good. Good one of the interesting things. I wanted to say about the novel before we move on past can jesse's novel is it from the point of view of of chief himself. Which was the surprising thing. When i i read it. It's good yeah. I was not expecting that so neither was i. Honestly tell you the truth as a kindred brother there it is like oh hey because you expected to be from. Rpi rb mc. Murphy's point of view. Douse the movie. Yeah exactly and then here know cnn here and everything from his his point of view and it made the movie making a little more sense. 'cause you understand the gravitas of him talking about how you know how small he feels like now. I feel as big as a mountain right now. And you know Gives you a lot more context for his character and the things he says for. Sure for sure Before we get too much into that again let's go through the cast We're going to go through. This is an alphabetical order. I'm going to pick and choose some of these because there's a lot of them to go through The the semi famous Hey it's that guy. Michael berryman lease ellis semi famous and horror circles. He's a legend. Yeah exactly he's you know. He's known in strict circles very well and motion does not at all Moving on scatman cruthers appearing in yet another jack playing terkel the guard the easily bought terkel the guard. Yeah right a young still short. Danny devito playing martini time initiate. This is nothing his so young. An unrecognizable is sweat. God every time. I see him in the movie. I think he's bob hoskins and i was watching it with laura. I'm like all right. You're going to see some familiar faces. And she could not pick him out for the longest time. Oh wow that is awesome. Yeah he's great. Hit meanness hit me. You hit me. Joseph alec as cini one of the nurses is land fenders. I guess you know. The famous louise fletcher as nurse. Wretched herself Let fletcher what else was she in. Its wish anything. A won an academy award for this. Yeah this is obviously what she was most known for. She did a couple of star trek episodes and flowers in the attic using fire spreader. Yeah so unfortunately not not much of a career path this but she did win the academy award. I mean she was still working until a couple of years ago. Yeah still alive good career. Yeah just solidly under the radar Sydney elastic as cheswick who basically Idolized mcmurphy wanted to be his little lackey much as he could until the day. They elected electrocuted the shit out of him and then he realized that murphy was not as for hero. Christopher lloyd a another one for loyd never answer you may know him as from such things as taxi back to the future when he bucks who framed roger rabbit and it's interesting that you got to taxi along here in this movie. Yep yeah that's true. We plays taber. Another one of the inmates ellsworth another inmate his played by dwight marshfield. One of the two girls that get snuck in who's the other girl rosenberg. Andy rosen candy. Rose being played by louisa moritz and candy being played by muse. Small yen louisa. More it's She was a stock like seventies. She was in a coupla cheech and chong movies. She was in death race but not death race. Two thousand death rates two thousand with david carey. Yeah she was she was in the jews in the rockford files like a happy. Hooker goes to washington like she was a standard female actor if they needed somebody pretty for a movie in the seventies kind of like christopher lloyd moving onto the next one these star of the show the famous a- jack nicholson again like meals. Foreman do i really need to go into his cv. Jack nicholson one of the most famous members of hollywood. This early film of his before he was huge. This was a movie that kind of almost made him the first movie. Well we're going to get in a trivia. I'm sure you're talking about the oscars. So yeah but he plays the arpey mcmurphy randle. Patrick mcmurphy the lead of the movie. The spark macguffin the the guy who makes everything happened the anti hero. Yeah really is then next. William redfield Famous character actor playing harding and his last role. If i remember correctly or pretty close to eat he died like the next year. After this will sampson as chief brandon juicy fruit. He was so good. Yeah this is. This is a great role. Obviously Vincent chevelle as frederickson. Another one of the inmates who like a very much very much like michael. Barone is not known by most but very well known by certain circles. Oh for sure like. He is a very distinctive character actor. Yep yeah when you see him you like. I know that guy. Yeah you're absolutely right. It is like i know that guy in boy does he look good in. This film is at part. I mean he played a lot of different things in men in black because he fit the fit the roles very well he's also boast in ghost. Yeah and then. Lastly the one last one talk about is very very young. Brad dorothy billy bibit participant pivot this. This was the first movie he was in the an introducing credit at the end of the Opening credits in what an action there. Yeah brad door. Who if you're not familiar with brad door Get familiar. there's odds are that you have been seen at least a dozen movies. He's been in and not even known it is a yeah one of the things that bothered me when i was watching this again for homework for this episode. I said i kept looking at Billion like i know that guy really know that guy because he saying things got very distinct is and facial features and stuff and then. Of course i had to cheat and go look it up because i can pinpoint it like. He's wormtongue. yeah. I mean some of the things he's been we go through it. He played the dock in deadwood yet. Doc cochran is where. I usually think of him. I that are star trek. He's been he's been in What else chucky yeah. He played the voice of chuckie. Yeah yep he's in Nightwatch with you gregor which is a personal favorite of mine to share. I mean he's he's he's a chameleon of an actor he liked gary oldman just disappears in his roles. He was sheriff bracket in the nba halloween films which was probably my favorite part of those films his portrayal but yeah so Very very young bread fun fun to watch him. Actors s off from a young age right. So moving onto trivia will samson as chief brandon was a park ranger in oregon near where the movie was filmed. He was selected for the part because he was the only native american the casting department could find your match the characters incredible size. I knew that actually thank god. He had some acting ability. I mean you know 'cause he doesn't say a lot but he still has to interact and play that character. And all things considered i i'd say nailed it for character. That doesn't say a lot. He's got a lot of presence in the movie. Yes in when he does speak. It's very it's very soft. You know contrary to like somebody that big you would be so this over boasts louise fletcher was so disturbed by her own performance that she couldn't watch the film for years by this. Really gonna come by another one of these bullet points. She was so upset with the fact that other cast members could laugh and be happy during filming while she had to be cold and heartless that near the production. She removed her dress at stood only her panties to prove the cast members. She was not a quote. Cold hearted monster the seventies admit those format. You know he does require some nude scenes letting squeaky were unavailable working. They were in the army and dean are. Bricks was a psychiatrist and director of the oregon state hospital where the film was made during filming bricks. Correctly diagnosed william redfield with leukemia. That would kill him. Eighteen months later they know how to him. That sucks. you're on this big movie that went on to you. Know be this huge academy award winning phenomenon. And what's your memory of it. I found that. I had cancer and then eventually passed away. That's dnr brooks was the guy who played doctor spivey the one who checked him in and everything and gave him his entrance interview interesting and lastly something i was gonna say earlier second of only three movies the other two being it happened one night and the silence of the lambs to win every major academy award meaning best picture best actor best actress best director best screenplay adapted or original so it was a good movie yeah to all right yeah is okay so yeah that's the cast a trivia and now is the time can macintosh tj so. I'll start with the traditional question. Even though i know the answer. This is not anyone's first time watching this. I presume no it is. It is interesting. I haven't seen this probably for maybe twenty years. I mean when. I first saw this like i said earlier when i was a kid i was watching it with my dad and then of course later i read. The book was pleasantly surprised sales from chief's perspective better and then you know like i just watched it this weekend. You know to get ready for you guys. And i watched it again. I'm like man. This is a really good movie. And then through different prism. Like i brought before in the movie version. I i don't think louise fletcher place. Such a horrible person is is mildred. I- rachid i look at it now and i'm like well. She's doing her job. She's trying to keep everybody under control kenya. When i was a kid. I always thought it was like more extreme but obviously the the worst thing she did was threatened to tell billy about you know. His sexcapades His mother whether she did know him or not whether she's lying telling the truth. I don't know i see i. I work in mental health care. Basically and since i'm in special ed schools and you do not serve people giving them access to services or medication based on whether or not they're doing what you say that that's fucked up. So yeah i i do think she's definitely horrid now she. She is lighter version of the character. Then we're gonna talk about in the second half but she's definitely manipulator and rules with an iron fist and a lot of the stuff. She cracks down on its mildly disruptive like. We're not talking about people doing harm to themselves or harm to others which is in mental health. Care that's going to be like that's when you intervene. Yes but she's just like i don't like these people aren't doing exactly things my way when i say how i say. And yes she. She definitely manipulates and controls. See when i've seen this movie. I've lost count. How many times. I've seen it one of the first. Dvd's ever bought and Matt brown and i used to watch this on the regular in college Freshman year and so like it's one of those movies. I can actually actually can quote. But i tend to agree with blake and as i was watching it and then moved onto the series. Some of our methodology may not be appropriate. And especially in this day and age would be you know probably grounds for dismissal. But you know i feel like she's kinda got a little bit of a a are out to be too well. I mean in in the key. Even ken ki ki was a little surprised that she became this kind of metaphor for the whole kind of messed up system because she is trying to maintain control in a situation. That can be a little chaotic. And i i don't feel like i feel like our hearts in the right place. She's just not quite got the right tools to do the job i think. She does care about the inmates while the patients to the extent that they don't defy her. Yeah and i think that's the key is i think she sees them as inmates. Not as people and that is exactly the wrong attitude like in the wrong business if you care more about controlling you care at all about your ego. And that's the thing is she works with her ego. Like most of the problems aren't necessarily a problem. Where the unit is being disrupted and things are gonna get dangerous. It's she's taking it personally because things are supposed to be her way and they always have been and as soon as her egos threatened she snaps back and she snaps back pretty hard. How much of that as her decision though. Yeah i think. I think i don't have the perspective of you know real life and professionalism in regards to you know mental health care in and stuff but in a d you both guys bring up some really good points that i really think about but you know it it is she she snaps into that It would what do you think that. She's doing is actually defensive. Because when she's running the group therapy sessions. You know she's working. She's asking questions. He trying to get people to answer in participate in murphy's like this is all bullshit what the hell you guys doing. She's like i think she's honestly doing what she thinks is correct and right because she points out. She's like well you know she goes around the the group saying he's here voluntarily. Leave anytime you want. You know this person's here so she's probably thinking she's doing great things and making progress for these for these guys because they haven't left. They're all there voluntarily which blows mic. Murphy's mine away and sets off a pretty pretty negative spiral. Because he feels like he was you know misled but some of the stuff that happens to the other people on the ward. I don't like. I said. I don't know how much of that is is policy. How much of that is the decision. And how much hers. Because i don't know if she actually is the one that sent them for electroshock therapy or once. There was the big argument. Everybody went sideways. Whether that's your least come away. The doctor's like i take them up. They need a a dose of electroshock therapy to cool the fuck out. And i don't know how much of that was here. It's for sure that the bigger villain then. Mildred ratchet is the system and mental. Health care has been Super dysfunctional still is but like things honestly. Weren't that different from this until about twenty years ago and they're still not where they need to be eight electroshock therapy to. I remember being when i was a kid watching this for the first time i was is by elza unbelievable. I'm like holy crab. They used to electrocute people's brains for this kind of stuff and and it is kind of interesting in following up a little bit with ken. Casey is you know Having him worked in the. Va you know where some of this stuff comes from. You know the guys that you want a good biography you go back and learn about this guy but you know and this is a this is a man who wrote this book in regards to shock therapy. That hoped himself up to a car battery and had his buddy shock and so they can feel. It's to figure out what it's like but you're right. It's almost like How somebody in a mental health care facility where you're supposed to be taking care of these people. Put them through this. Such a what i would consider a horrible and barbaric treatment. I mean as well. And and ken. Casey base nurse ratchet off an actual person That that was on where he worked. She was the head nurse there And i saw i. When i was doing some research. He was quoted that when he saw her again years later he said she was much shorter and much. More human than here remembered so you know perspective. I think that goes to the point of them being there voluntarily. They walked in voluntarily. But when you get into that situation with the staff it's almost like you create your own cage like after a certain point you've got this institutional mindset where even though technically illegally can you leave. Yeah but are you ever going to know. Because you're completely dependent on the structure. You obey s second nature and that's really what our anti hero is fighting against the whole institutional mindset where they're imprisoning themselves. It's that catch twenty two you know. Hey this is crazy. Yes that's correct so i'm crazy please. Grammy no the fact that you realize it's crazy means. You're not crazy so you ask you flying bombing missions. That's another episode. We we did. We did not so long ago probably like two years ago. Whenever i think something's not so long ago i find out. Oh yeah that was. Three years ago i love catch twenty but in but anyways. Yeah you'd think about it. And that's what i think is where mcmurphy in the movie stars to crack because he he's realized he's completely at the mercy of this system. Now how do you get out of the system. That says you're supposed to be there. Well and he. I mean ferrall intents and purposes at least from what i gather from the the what. We're watching the film you know and having seen it so many times. He obviously threw himself into that thinking. Okay you know go in here. You know do my sixty day evaluation or whatever and then beyond mary way or it's either way it's going to be easier than being at the work for work. He thought his sentence was sixty eight days no matter where he spent it. So why am i gonna spend it on the workforce spend it over here with all the nuts and then when he finds out. Well it's not sixty eight days if you go that route. It's when they say you can get out yup and when you're pushing back like he was i mean they have every reason to to keep you there and there are studies where there are people who did social experiments who went undercover check themselves into a mental institution and found it very difficult to get out like even once their credentials were revealed They had been forced to be medicated. They had been diagnosed and like it was very tough for them to secure release so stuff. That happens yeah. You hit on like a a phobia of mine. Is you know if you think about you know periods in history and all that kind of stuff. And then you know. Books and literature like nineteen eighty-four net not being in control your own destiny being at the complete mercy of the system. Somebody that's in control of the system in his just doing it because they know they can do it you know how do you get out. How do you escape that you're and when it comes to the staff sometimes it's like what you see is what you expect to see. You expect to see a crazy person. So you're able to interpret almost any set of behaviors and sort of like normally stress reaction. Yes exactly as being crazy. And if you're at now those situations i mean there's some wiggle room there for possible misdiagnosis. Because you know he in different situations you may react differently to that and therefore that can lead you down a different path than what maybe what happened if you would have done it al patient or if you never would have been diagnosed to begin with so you know again it It's kind of a slippery slope right i. I can only imagine what would happen. If i'd been voluntarily. Or maybe involuntarily by a family member committed like i. I don't feel that. I'm danger to society. I take care of kids. Who have this kind of thing. But like if i was in that situation could i earn insecure my freedom. I'm not confident that the answer to that question is yes but i'll fun fact. I was institutionalized twice of by choice And obviously was was made out fine on both occasions. But you know the diagnosis. I received while in the care of the hospitals was not the same diagnosis. That had once. I went into outpatient. You know psychiatrist Counselor group therapy sessions and bobby. I'm fine now so you know you never know it's Now after after putting it in this context now at little scary looking back on the schick dark fast even gotten to the right murphy that was going to save. You did end up on this podcast so That was a foregone conclusion now isn't necessarily going to bring that up when you said that it was like winning high. Do you have anything to say about. We haven't heard from you in a while. So i'm throwing you save us pat to confront you talk good talk. Yeah i to like joel. I don't. I don't know if i want to. Yeah i've spent some time in an institution like these before for suicide watching things like that in the past. And you're you're definitely right one of the worst feelings while you're in there is the feeling of. It's not up to me whether or not and not not having your own freedom. I mean it just like you know being insomniac and waking up at four in the morning and trying to go into the break room area and being told you know we're not gonna the lights on because the lights don't come until six just little things like that you know so. I'm just going to sit here on the dark. I guess it makes wanna go to prison because yeah for sure can't even i can't even imagine what the well. Yeah another fun. Another one topic. Yeah i spent seventeen hours in a holding cell once. I never got released in the general population or anything. Thank goodness but yeah that was that was fun for me for the whole thing was like okay. Well that's yeah don't wanna do that again is a turkish. Prison now is worse as a texas prison. Oh god man yeah yeah so how about the ending like since since i kind of feel. We're heading to a natural conclusion towards the break. Let's at least talk about the ending. Where our chief basically puts mcmurphy out of his misery. Iconic has a classic. Yeah well basic- basically what what has led up to. This is the fact that mcmurphy. Just it's a battle between a woman who win you. Stand up to her. She stamps you out as fast as she can because she does not play games. And then you got mcmurphy. Who is all about playing games. He's like hey. I just want to mess with you would have fun. We're having a lotta. We're we're doing some tests back and forth some ha ha. You know you do this. And i do that. He thinks he's like almost in a high stakes prank war with no just going to drop a nuclear bomb on you and when he finally snaps and tries to kill her after what she drove. Billy bibit to do when we kill himself. And he kinda snaps in realizes the stakes are real here. Tries to kill her and she says okay. Well you know being the that she is she's going to take it one step further. You're gonna attack me and tried to kill me while i'm gonna take away with you. Love the most your your freedom in your ability to think for yourself and taking her. i don't think. I don't think it was her decision. But i think it was definitely her recommendation. I definitely had a voice in that happening. You're assuming now because you never really see the decision if you if you go by the knowledge we have. Now of the show ratchet. I mean they. They make a point of talking about how the nurses run the hospital. Yeah even at that point. Doctor spivey wasn't the one that was around dealing with them all the time. It was always the is always the The guards and the the orderlies or looking for and when it comes to case management. You're going to go to the person that has. The data is collecting the data. And they're gonna make their recommendation. They're going to have the loudest voice so yeah. I definitely think ratchet personal vendetta is one of the greatest factors leads to his lobotomy. And death but i mean in a way it's kind of a pyrrhic victory for her because her voice is taken and her power sort of broken. Yeah but over. Mcmurphy is still a violent person. 'cause you get that in the past because he's had assaults your fucking that's right but so you know he is prone to violence in a remember. You know as as much of a fun loving guy. He is in the air you know he. He has pretty special pass in. He is prone to violence so but then on the flip side. I understand where you're coming from your right. You would go to her in the people that deal with them on a daily basis. You know but i'll tell you what the classic with big chief realizing what they did to him and I like the that he says. I'm going to take you with me. And then he's in the snuff some with the pillow as in like he's freeing him with his spirit right so it's almost like very symbolic almost native american symbolic i'm gonna take you with me. You know by taking his spirit with him as he finally goes and takes the idea. That mcmurphy had you know buster the window in he you know i. D iconic shot of the movie of courses him. Running you know Off into the distance running through the wall parodied on the simpsons. After you know after reading the book like we all said that he gives what he goes before he realizes he's been lobotomize. I i feel biggest mountain. Yes an emotional light at that point. I'm ready now. I have a question about this and Like i said that was founded on the simpsons but Upon watching this again and not having read the book and at least two decades i have this feeling and maybe i'm wrong. Read that when he's telling the story about his father and how you know he he. The bottle sucked the life. Out of him. I get the sense that when he Basically euthanize is big murphy. That that's the same thing he did to his father and that's why he's there. I don't know if that's true. Because i remember what what it said in the book but with the way he tells a story and then the way he ends it and what he says to him. It feels like he had done that before. As as a mercy killing. But it's a good theory. But the difference was as he'd he'd regained hisself were. I can't remember why he's in there. I haven't read the. I read the book in fucking had twenty years ago or so nineties so i don't necessarily remember why he was in there. That's a good theory. That i cannot disprove. It just felt it felt like it with the way they'd written the dialogue that that was. How great was that The whole the whole the whole boat seen take taking the boat convincing the harbormaster charter up. Professor all doctor goes through their all doctors. Except for the one nude except for harding. Professor harding everybody else's doctor. Dr martini dr. This professor harding. Danny devito said that that that that whole take that whole scene took a week to film and to this day he still gets nauseous even thinking about it should everybody but jack nicholson got seasick at one point during that week house. Good getting can i ask one question. I and i know how hollywood is and you know how hollywood can't come up with new stuff. In they loved reboot everything. So what do you think that. Is you know you kind of get it a little bit with rachid with all we'll do the prequel thing but do you think there are actually deal actually trying to remake this movie. I think ratchet turns into success. They probably will or they'll make it a series. Maybe that's the thing is. I think television shows more likely because you don't see dramas remade quite as much as other genres just like if you're doing sifi There's a fifty fifty shot if you're doing horror it's like an eighty percent chance if your movie was any good or sometimes even if it wasn't. It's getting remade. It's gonna eleven remains action comedies action comedies. Any of those fairly likely. But there's a real short list of dramas that actually remade. Yeah but it would be interesting if you would have to cast with actors from today. I i think you can almost make a good game. You know game an addendum to this podcast of who you replace. It'd be fun. But i think it would have to be a bunch of no names just like because none of these guys were known at the time. Yeah that's right. this is the movie. May jack right. And tom hardy as randolph speed. Networks i dunno played here declared bronson so the rock as chief. Tom hardy as nurse ratchet. Tom holland gonna be ronda. Rousey hollandaise billy. Bibit eddie murphy. Every other inmate and martini played by dana veto. Oh i think we're kind of headed towards a natural spot where we can take a break when we come back. We're going to talk about the ryan murphy. Prequel showing us the birth of the antagonists kuku nest wretched in the show rachid deal. When we come back. I want my cigarettes. Nurse ratchet cigarettes cigarettes great woman. We are back. thanks for waiting for us. We're going to talk about The new show rachid all about the it is a prequel to one. Flew over the cuckoo's nest talking about mildred nurse. Mildred wretched in the days before our p mcmurphy or story origin story. Exactly 'cause movie takes place in sixty. Yeah are late fifties surly six. I forget i looked this up now. I forgot yeah. They specifically mentioned the president at one point. I can't even remember who was no I think. I think it was ford during the early sixties. Yeah and the novel with sixty. Two tv show is forty seven through like fifty the first season anyway so the description taken off of net flicks is. Wretched is a suspenseful drama series. That tells the origin story of asylum nurse. Mildred wretched in nineteen forty seven. Mildred arrives in northern california to seek employment at a leading psychiatric hospital where new and unsettling experiments have begun on the human mind on a clandestine mission. Mildred presents herself as the perfect image. Of what a dedicated nurse should be but the wheels are always turning and as she begins to infiltrate the mental health care system and those within it. Mildred stylish exterior belies a growing darkness that has been smouldering within revealing. what true monsters are made revealing. that monsters are made not born man. That is a very verbose description. Thanks it's interesting that i i'm not sure. Granted i didn't hundred percent finish this. I know i'm getting a little ahead of myself but this whole true monsters are made not born. That is a description that at least at the beginning of the series is at odds with what it seems like. The series is trying to say. I watched the entire season. I did to actually. I made it fifty percent. I rarely make it through the first of these things that we watch for these shows. But this one i did. And it wasn't necessarily well spoiler wasn't necessarily out of just straight enjoyment of it was just because i started watching on my breaks at work instead of instead of just fucking around and playing gin and stuff so look to be an all growed up right ed made it. I made an adult decision patrick's growing up. He's all grows up. Let's let's get into cast in a guessing crew and series directed by ryan murphy. Did two episodes Michael up and doll two episodes nelson cragg jennifer lynch daniel minahan and jessica. You all did one episode. That is david lynch's daughter. Oh okay i did not know that. She's a director. And that is mr daul son and everybody should know ryan murphy from american horror story among many other. Yes but not from that. Sarah paulson connection. That is why it reminded me of american horror story. Okay we're gonna get to this because this is very. This is the most ryan murphy that ryan murphy ever ryan now. He's not he's the other half of his team isn't with him. He's got a different. I would've put so much ryan murphy all over this well i. I'm going to revisit get to that. So yeah series. Writing credits Ken cassie obviously for the original book. ryan murphy wrote all eighteen episodes. I guess so for developed using this well developed created and everything written by him. And evan evan romanski is that correct. Nevermind ski romanski. Six episodes written with ian brennan and to jennifer salt. I don't know any of those minor. Writers do you know I know her her sister pepper. He just wanted to pepper that in. They're gonna flavored spring. You guys he's pod all right moving on. Yeah we don't. We don't need another p like that. We had a problem. And i'll five gone with the string bean. I'm sorry so moving onto series cast. Obviously the the main star. Sarah paulson as nursing mildred rachid. You know her from such things as american horror story and everything else you watch on net flicks cheese everywhere. She's she's big right. Now is with justifiable reasons. Yes yeah and she's a particular favourite of the ryan murphy like he keeps going back to that. Well yes gasping. Her she is his muse. Apparently speaking of which the second cast member also is a ryan murphy. Favorite finn wit rock. Is that right in in there. I can't it's went rocky right okay. Been went rock plays edmund tolleson. The eze crazy is he not crazy. Is it going to the chair going to stay in the asylum edmonson killer of priests and savior of roosters lover of animals. Yeah he he plays his role really well she does. It would be scared a room with him. He's got a very intimidating presence. Yeah he he's basically the guy who's not evan. Peters who is like the other ryan murphy male lead and then of the list of Of big names actually continues down the line. We've got cynthia. Nixon playing gwendolyn briggs Mostly known for sex in the of course and she's been on broadway she's Well known actress. Judy davis as nurses. Betsy bucket judy davis Joel character aren't ya. tell us about. Judy davis the only thing. I really remember her from is New the new age with her peter weller. But she's he's an old school actress. That kind of. I mean she's still been working but she's kind of fallen off familiar to me. But i didn't know from what and knew joel. She was in barton fink. I was like waiting for you to say what. What was she barton fink. She's a minor character. Audrey taylor got movie sucked and i wanna say she was naked lunch. But i've not a hundred percent. Sure that now i think you're correct brent. What did you think of borton. Yeah she was a naked lunch. Yep she was Way of why did go you brent williams wife. Well they william burroughs characters by anyway blake. Yes have you seen barton fink a time ago. All right then you're excluded union on it because there's some dissension upon that film here. I wanted to side of the line. You were on if early. Petric's outnumbered in case fisticuffs. Come come call in. You know i wanna to know what side you were on Every every time barton fink comes up. it's very contentious. Yes all right moving on dr richard. Hanover is played by john. John briones now there. American horror story alumni. Oh is it just one season but a recent season. The huck finn again. The war veterans huck. Finn is played by jarver. I'm not familiar with him as an actor. He's he's kind of an up and comer he's done. He's got like twenty credits to his name right now but yeah he sees coming up this wealth. The new teen wolf wait. We did a show. Yeah it wasn't that bad. I was pretty wasn't horrible. It just wasn't great. Cw soap opera. Yeah exactly that's fine. He's coming out in the batman algeria. Go see up and comer. What i say you're right right and then The leftovers that's where i know him from otani. Who was he in the left overs. he was scott frost. He was stuffing. Dude all right moving on Nowhere you may know her from her storied career in hollywood miss sharon stone whose lays lenore osgood the wealthy woman looking for revenge for what dr hanover had done to her son. She was almost unrecognizable. Right well i knew. I recognize who like i was like. Who is that because she sort of fulfilled the same role type of role. That you expect jessica lang to play an american horror story. Good call. But i was like. That's not just laying. it's much younger. Holy shit that's sharon stone. Yeah she's now. You're no sharon stone. It took me a couple of episodes to figure that out next week. Amanda plummer as louis by the the the hippie. What would you call her. The peeping tom. manager yeah. I love amanda plummer. I was so happy to see her. This series nurse dolly who is The love interest. For mr. Ed mattel tillerson. This played by alice anglert. Yeah yeah suddenly. The the robot from futurama showed the cop and the the asshole of the year award goes to governor. George wilburn played vincent de frio holy shit he was an asshole held. Wow that's he'd good actor. Yeah they wrote that guy really really friendly like i think he jessica lang though for the yeah yeah. He's their visit enough rio. Which now retaining water i mean. He wasn't exactly small in daredevil no fluctuate so he really does. He goes up a lot of times for the roles. I think he wasn't. He wasn't small in the break-up either he so amazing he said yeah. I celebrate his entire catalogue. Donuts in the footlocker again. I'm back to the gun in the mounting is that sounds like the strangest euphemism of her and i don't know any of these last four need to be mentioned The very last one sofi okay. Nato played charlotte go ahead. I just mentioned her. You're supposed to say so fi. Okay nato played. You ruined my joke. Oh yes she's been in a lot of stuff like hotel rwanda. She was a minor character influx. Like i knew. I had seen her from something she's gonna be in death on the nile when it comes out. Oh she's she's done a lot of a lot of tv and she's one of those faces you see or know like i know her from somewhere but you're not necessarily sure where he realize it's everywhere yup the pivotal role in ace ventura when nature calls she the rhino the princess. That's where that's why laura who that is all right. Moving onto trivia murphy uses color in the costumes and sets to represent themes yellow equals deceit. Blue equals neutral radicals evil or badness. Whitey was purity. Green equals honesty. Sometimes the costumes subtly change you as one team transitions to another. I would not call it subtle. I liked the color cells. Yes i did too. But i would definitely not call it subtle now. Now it's a very loud show. Yeah as no back. Young nurse wretched is played by actress. Sarah paulson who is four years. Older than louise fletcher was when she played old nurse. Wretched in one flew over the cuckoo's nest. That's good trivia trivia. i was like what. Oh oh oh hi. And then he was like wait a minute. She's how much older for years crazy right. That will what's crazy about that. She's only two years younger than i am. Are two years older than i am. Yeah i was going to say. She's she's right in the wheelhouse between our ages. So the original nurse ratchet was only forty. She looks a lot older evil ages. You sorry louise fletcher or makes your younger depends. If you're drinking the butternut donny. Osmond not the years. It's the mileage. Did tied donny. osmond. I heard that tally role. Musical themes from the soundtracks of composer. Bernard hermann are used throughout the series including Excerpts from the subjects vertigo north by northwest at cape fear. psycho as. Well why would they put ridley that period cycle as well. What your psycho was made in three words sentence. And lastly when. Sarah paulson heard rosanna. Arquette on the media talking about how after denouncing harvey weinstein. She hadn't worked much in the industry. She contacted her to offer her a role in this bill. The role of anna. The worker who had did not even recognize. When i saw her in the credits says like who the hell is. I looked. oh she played anna. Well who the hell was anna. Come on man. You had heard amanda plummer both from pulp fiction routes. Yep yep so yeah As we said earlier thoughts no first of all a who got far farthest in this. I watched the whole thing. Joel watch the whole thing correct. And yes sir. I five episodes and i didn't get quite as far as blake. Did five five is the majority at least five eight true. I kinda altered. I've gotten what i needed to. I found this pretty rough watch but it was intriguing still but it was still a little bit a little bit difficult for me but there's gonna what what do you mean clarify difficult as in I i really. I really can't emotionally connect with any of these characters. And i think that's a good thing but you wanna root for somebody in this and there are times where nurse ratchet in this. This version of nurse ratchet. There are times where you're like you can't root for but then you kinda do depending upon the situation you know. She does have a bad side. Obviously you as the observer watch you never know when she's being manipulative and when she's being genuine honest yes. That is correct. You don't know if she's playing that person or character or their. She's being genuine. You know like when she helps break the two ladies out you know. Is she being genuine because she's realizing her own situation in her own. You know feelings that she's dealing with you know and you know. Obviously the relationship between her and her brother is disturbing at this point. But i haven't seen the yet you know but you get a lot more. You get a whole episode about that at towards the end okay. Good i mean. I intend to finish it. He's not joking. I literally up at show. Yeah so it's kind of interesting. Because you know i almost kind of want to root for her. Sometimes but then. I can't you know. And there's not really a redeeming character you know other than hawk think but But it is kind of graphic you know a lot of people you know sensitive but i love the colors. They're riding all intentionally bold flat nineteen fifty The the you know the cinematography. I like how the directors and the scene shoes at how they can just build a mood. You know visually. This is a striking serious. It is visually striking series. It is and so there are a few things that ryan murphy does well and that is cinematography and like building a compelling story where by the end of what's going on there's a breadcrumb that makes you want to find out what happens next and again i think that those elements are present. Here the and it is. I think that's probably why. I've i've made it as far as a half in intend to finish. I mean just. The intro itself lends itself to questions of. Why do things happen throughout the intro. And to be honest by the end of the last episode. You've only got a small portion of that intro figured out i'm glad you mentioned the intro because while i do not intend to finish this. I super appreciate that. The opening theme song is my favorite piece of classical music down aqap and you know what other movie that was in. It's been in a bunch of movies room. Stone is the obvious. That's the one i was looking for tombstone. Oh it was yeah. It is the theme song when she's playing the double a side billy zane. Yeah the the foul. Yeah oh yeah okay now and learning. I am learning something. I wanna say. One of the main reasons. Like i said this is the most ryan murphy thing that ryan murphy ever ryan. Murphy is because like every single character the word i would use to describe them as lurid like they're everyone either has a dark secret or twisted perversion or past. That is fucked up somehow. Like even like bucks wears his on his face from his time. In the war every every character feels like an rpg character l. Yeah they are a little caricature at times. And i was just like you know i. I'm not anti ryan murphy. Like i watched nip tuck. I watched like five seasons of glee. I watched a bunch of american horror story. Was i just kinda felt like i've already seen a lot of his storytelling and this is just more of the same. But one flew over the cuckoo's nest flavored. And i kinda think. After the episodes i saw i'd had enough i. I kinda got what. I needed out of this well and upon posting online. That was watching this for the show. I got that from a couple other people that said that you know the made it through a couple of episodes and stopped and they were like. Oh it's pretty pretty good made it through the whole thing. Yeah i i have thoughts but if you have something to say blake go ahead. You just burn something in me when you're when you're You're talking about all the characters in in you're talking about the rpg's in there. I think something. I just realized i come to this. Epiphany they're in a mental hospital and everybody that's in there is broken. Everybody is broken in needs fixed. So it's not just the people that are they're seeking help to get corrected throwing broken people. You're right they all have their perversion or the all heather in dale have. They're insanity and that and and yeah and the fact that they are the forgotten dregs of society is why so. Many charlatans are able to get an even on the staff there all the fake. Oh my gosh yes. Crack in your right reveals behind all the characters. Yeah so oh crap. I realized that in the cast list. We missed a semi major actor like. He's a big character. Actor are corey stall who Place the detective turn hitman. Oh yeah yeah. He was completely left off. And like i. i've been following him since. Obviously he was an ant man. But where i i remember in countering. Him was house of cards. Yep a main antagonist ant man. Oh sorry oh no. I was just i. When you're talking about broken characters. i was thinking. Well he's one of the characters that barely interacts with the asylum itself. Holy crap yeah. He's a pretty big actor. We should mention him that. That's all i have to say. I i have kind of a love. Hate relationship with american horror story like there are some seasons that like asylum. Which i know. A lot of people didn't care for is probably my favorite season that i've seen followed by a freak show but i i have a hard time finishing it by. I don't know if it said it's there's too much going on or that it's the way it's portrayed. There's something about the show that doesn't draw me back into watch another season and so i haven't seen a lot of the reasons so watching this I kind of came in a little bit without preconceived notion it while it is very beautiful to look at. I found myself hating what they did with the character. They turned to like almost. Like a hannibal lecter esque type villain and as i spoke about in the first half. I don't see her as that. And it's almost like ryan murphy's like okay. How can i make this. American horror story ratchet and the they turned her into this just multi. Murdering obviously came from came from the point of view that she was an evil woman and lobbyist through the right back. But i mean they they turned to into such an evil person that yes. It's it it really cognitive dissonance there for ya. Yeah it it. It was detrimental to the source material. Because there wasn't that much in the source material to build this off of and where he was pulling it from. I i have no idea but i found myself enjoying the experience of watching it as a from an artistic standpoint but hating it at the same time from the character standpoint and the big one of the biggest things that i had problems with is Well not the biggest thing but one of the things had problems with is if i remember correctly in the kinky book and then the the film it's a state run hospital. It's not a private institution. If i remember correctly and it which they run yeah can. That's why the doctor had kept having meetings with all kinds of officials. That's what i thought. And during the course of the show and spoiler alert. i don't know where they revealed it but she's not actually a nurse. I'm like what the fuck are you talking about. Yeah okay she might be able to slip through into a private institution. That's not run by the state. But how enough fuck did she get on to a state run mental hospital without any credentials. Why they ended up making it privately owned before the season was over and thirty was. Oh sorry would you going to say because halfway through the season suddenly there's a new character and she's the owner of the place and that's addressed. Just joel's question. Is she worms her way into an interview that she's not qualified for and gets a provisional like manipulates to make sure that there's an opening when they're going to need staff gets a provisional Like trial day and then hides the body for the doctor and all of a sudden she's invaluable. I don't mean on this show. I mean by the time the sixties roll around. And she's okay. I gotcha working with randall. Mcmurtry mcmurphy sorry A how in the hell did she get hired there. Because i mean granted things were a little different than but i don't think they were different enough that they would have hired her on and made her. You know the head nurse at this state run facility. If she had no no proof anywhere that she was actually a a trained nurse that she was actually went through schooling. I can even speak to that now. Granted this is private and not public. But you'd be surprised how often credentials are missing and just no one has done. A regulatory pass like people who are administrators. Like i want to be careful. Because i'm still actively in the inventory in the industry and i will clarify that. I'm not talking about anyone who i'm working with now but i have known people in the past that have not had the credentials to do their job and it's just been missed fake it till you make it and yeah if no if when you've been there for ten twenty years one even bothers to ask who you work with and until the state comes through doesn't audit of like does everyone have the qualifications to do their job. You can get away with it for literal decade. I dunno given today. But but i. But i understand your point when you're comparing this wretched to the floor of the cuckoo's nest the end. It's very interesting. My daughter's twenty five bins ratchet and she loved it and she was. She's american horror story fan in so this weekend we sat down together. I said. now you're gonna see where nurse ratchet comes from. This one flew over accused. Nasa told her about kissy kinky and stuff in. I think she was kind of shocked. Like this completely different person than what i know in for me on the flip side being. The old guy haven't done one flew over the cuckoo's nest. I come into this rash it. You're right. I see how i can't part of the reason that i'm having a difficult time getting through it but still want to is then. I can't put that ratchet. In connected to the ratchet that's in the movie like if they would have made a series and negated the whole nurse ratchet aspect and just like call the angel of mercy or something and it was you know about nurse flanagan. I would have enjoyed the series a lot more. But because you gotta be irish on racist okay. Nurse smith on that back to our andy. I just felt like they were. They were shifting over the the source material. It just. I think they did a disservice to the character of nurse. Ratchet in the original source material like. She's this nurse. Ratchet is much more Sociopathic and much more Just i mean for lack of a better word evil. I mean there's there's just there's there's no debate there's no anything watching. Once over the cuckoo's nest we can have. The debate is nurse. Ratchet watching ratchet. You'll you're like okay. Well the decision is made for you right. Oh she she's Prepared to hide bodies and and chop heads often stage murderers. And and just all this kind of crap you know She's gone well beyond just a woman who you know is a control freak too. She's just a straight up sociopath. Dexter type well on. Oh sorry i just wanted to build on this point because there's one thing you guys are missing and i don't disagree with you but there isn't big blank. Spot between one flew over. The cuckoo's nest and ratchet nurse ratchet also appears in once upon a time. Well as a very clearly evil character so the character as a villain. This is not unprecedented. As the only point. I want to throw out there but the characterization in in once upon a time is i mean i again doing. I've never seen the show but in the some of the The the study of it Or was it you know. People said she was like a big crybaby. And it wasn't it didn't really it didn't have the same tone as one flew over the cuckoo's nest and again i haven't seen it so i don't know you would have more knowledge on that than i. I have seen. Although i was not watching regularly by the time her character showed up but she has gone beyond just this character who has appeared twice and she is an icon of a very particular mental health nurse. Who was a bad person as the archetype and they're riffing on that theme in one of the things about about different big difference between the movie and the show is that it's a lot easier. It's kind of like the the jaws principal. It's like it's a lot easier to let your imagination go in. One flew over the cuckoo's nest as who. She is as a person because she spends ninety percent of her time. Just staring deadpan. And you can't have a eight episode. Tv show with nurse wretched just staring deadpan. At the camera. she's gotta have personality. She's gotta have lions she's got to have this and that so it's like one of those things where like you know in in the original jaws. The shark was much more intimidating. Because you saw a lot less and it built up tension in whatever whereas if it had been the original version like with steven spielberg wanted where the shark had been involved in fifty to sixty seventy percent of the shots. It would have ruined it. And that's kind of what happened with this series as they ruined nurse wretched by having her by peeling back to many of the layers. We'll and there's some aspects of the characterization that makes sense like you talk about you know how she sits there and she just kinda cold and and stares and you kinda get the sense that her job is her life when she leaves work. I imagine she goes home to a house by herself. You know makes her plane. White toews has her t. You know reads a book And goes to bed. you know. There's not a lot to her daily life. She's kind of shut down to emotional attachments. And i think they kind of playback i think she's like a an edm raver at night because they have her get into a relationship and it's obviously are going to be a doomed relationship eventually and the the nature of her relationship isn't accepted at the time so i can see where she would have some of those characterizations that are carried over. But sometimes you just don't do the han solo origin story. I mean maybe you're right. In this case less would be more you know so and i mean even in episode where they give her back story via the puppet show. It still doesn't justify our actions. It gives her more of a reason. But it doesn't justify it no not not at all and as far as just the overall story arc. I didn't like how they tied up some of the things by the end of it. I don't want to spoil it for you know for blake or anybody listening. That wants to watch the whole thing. I didn't like the the the day that they use to just. I didn't i didn't like it at all. You know what i'm talking about. Agile and how they're leading into a second season. Well no i'm talking about like what. What spurred the character coming back in the final episode of spurring on the escape and all that kind of stuff. Yeah i did not care for that at all. I was like come on. That just felt to hannibal lecter ice. Yeah and just to forced into everything as you know. It just felt too too lazy. There was a lot about this. That i didn't like just because i watched all eight episodes doesn't mean i liked it. I just found myself continuing to watch it because you know the game kept going so i kept having breaks and i mean i don't know if i would watch the second season or not i mean it's over fact i'm not going to if if and when it happens i mean. I assume it's done fairly well. I don't know what the ratings are but I mean they clearly of pitched it and it's got a listing having a second season. That's i don't know what stage at but that it's been announced so at least addaction spend picked up for sure attack happening. I just i don't know it was it was it was it was pretty. I mean but i didn't. I didn't like a lot of the characters. I didn't like the way it ended. I didn't like he's almost character. Motivations including for rooting for. Yeah the mayor. I met when we've had this discussion before on some of our episodes. I'm not one of those guys. It i don't need to have somebody to root for. I don't need like a character to like something. I don't care i just like a good story and i felt like you know this had potential to have a good story but it never really it just kinda through a bunch of shit against the wall and just you know didn't really have a great story just had a lot of average stories. I mean you can have deplorable characters. That are your leads. I mean just look at shutting it. Well it's always sunny in philadelphia. They're deplorable characters but you like him a clockwork orange. That's what i was thinking about. you know. then that's a horrible movie. Not a bad movie. But i mean it's it's it's hard to watch and your quote unquote heroes of the film. Your main protagonist is not a good guy. But there's something about it that you know makes it interesting and you want to watch it and you want to see the ark of the character. Yes in in your. You're right you want to give the character near the nature versus nurture one of you. Were talking about the breakdown. You know You know the the made not born when it won't have commented bay born says. So you're you're right. You're an observer i guess in your right. You don't have to be rooting for anybody. And it is kind of hard to watch. You know the you know You know what you're talking about. So you're you're you're you're watching them go through their story. I guess yeah. And i don't know i was the one that was talking so much about made not born whether that's even true at the beginning of the series and that may be true by the end but in the first couple episodes especially with the reveal that ratchet and tallest or brother and sister. I feel that If someone's gotten this far in the episode they're not afraid of that initial conceded. The series is that. There's something with this family. That if they were made they were starting to be forged into monsters almost from birth and that kind of to me begs. The question of the both of these members of this family were like this. Maybe there is something to the idea that they were born this way. Well and they they try ryan murphy or whoever came up with a i assume it's it's his conceptualization of it tries to make that point later on in the in the show that you know she wasn't born that way she was made into that bhai her you know her upbringing her surroundings or both of them right and they both kind of took a slightly different pads. But i still don't feel like the justifications that he provided are ample enough to really to ring true and i'm guessing that the justification for the brother is sexual abuse at the hands of priests and hers is society's pressures against any form of being out as someone who's a lesbian. No okay. I bet that would have been my prediction from what i've seen. Thus far i i would agree but the apparently there's there's a twist that i did not see coming. Yeah they they didn't they didn't go down the the The road you thought they were gonna go down at least but i mean it doesn't necessarily make it An interesting is not the word. I'm looking for but you know compelling got it's not the obvious Kind of not too predictable one right now. I mean it's like he tries to take. I don't wanna say a trope because it happens to people on a regular basis but he tries to take a certain trope for this type of behavior and he Kind of turns it up to eleven for shock factor. I feel but it still doesn't cause i know people that are been in similar situations that have turned out to be amazing human being so you know it can go both ways. But i don't know it just. It felt a little heavy handed. Forced the shock factor. You talked about gets back to my statement that all of these characters are lurid in some way and yeah. I think that's what i was kinda getting at. And it's it's it's murphy you know. It's he likes to kinda pushed the boundaries a little bit with his storytelling whether it's to the absurd or it's to the extreme From the other seasons of american horror story. I've never seen glee or what other show. You mentioned that he was part of a nip tuck. I mean they're scream queens. There's a bunch of others. I i think i've seen a couple of episodes of virtually everything that he's done and a lot of those. He's partnered with tim. Manera on who was a big Driving factor behind the x. Files so yeah. a man. Manera was a producer on this. We didn't mention him in the cast. But there are frequent collaborators and nip. Tuck is pretty is isn't it. I mean yeah. Yeah and i guess that's the thing is i know i've been like kinda down on this but it's more this in particular then His stuff in general. I know that i'm a fan. But i've obviously watched quite a bit of it. Yeah so there's something there. There's something of value i just. This one didn't hit for me because it was it was too much And i don't think it necessarily earned all of the this episode. We're going to discover three more sex scandals in two more people who are struggling with their sexuality like those are stories worth telling but. I'm not sure that this the framing earned those plots. Like i said it's just. It's just a smattering of average stories. Instead of just five or six really good stories and he's capable of telling good stories about people struggling with their sexuality in a society. That does not approve. I've seen that and other stuff that he's done. It is not it though. This was not. Yeah you want to see a more mature. Take on that watch pose Watch even some of the early episodes of glee. There's some good stuff there even though gag leaves not exactly hard hitting but yeah this. This one did not work for me. So are we at that point. It sounds like we're we're. We're gonna ask the obvious question. The thumbs up thumbs down for a few original end the the now i think so. Okay yes and no one else got. I say let's let's do it. Let's start with patrick thumbs. Up thumbs down on then. Now thumbs up for cuckoo's nest. Obviously it's incredible movie. And i mean i i would. I would like to go thumb sideways for ratchet. But i'm not gonna do that. i will commit. I will say thumbs down. Just because i i mean it was fine. It was fun to you know. It was fun but it was nice to watch. It was pretty show that i i enjoyed the costumes. And the looks and the cars and everything in the period piece and all that stuff but the acting was good. But i just i don't know it just. It was never really compelling watched it because i wanted to just get through all eight. It wasn't like. I felt like i needed to get through all eight. I was like okay. I think i'm gonna get through all eight for this show. And so i just did it and i'm not gonna watch the second season i don't have to. I gotta give it a thumbs down about usual. Well i mean obviously one group is necessary thumbs ups one of my top ten favorite films of all time for nurse ratchet if you could take it and make it a different character in the same circumstances based on that i would i give it a hesitant thumbs up But because you know they insisted on it being this character. It's really apprehensive. But i'll leave it at that just like i said it would be good enough on its own. Just that threw a big monkey. Wrench yourself a lot of things but nothing about your thumb. I'm giving it a hesitant thumbs up. But even though i feel like c. Oliver nurse ratchet fair enough. We're going to give our guest host on earth going last because mine is super obvious. A big thumbs up for one flew over the cuckoo's nest and a pretty emphatic. Thumbs down for ratchet work. Yes i'll tell you. What the one thing that i really learned this evening is that i have to work the word lurid more conversations like i like that word Still tree is another good one. Who've sultry i'll i will have to. I mean it's no brainer. One through you know fluid cuckoo's nest definite thumbs up Nurse ratchet i like. I said i'd like to give it like you said earlier. I like to give it a thumbs sideways. Almost going down on some things Really wishy washy. But before i could actually do a an opera down for it i i would like to complete the experience. I i wish. I did before We worked this evening but Life gets in the way sometime. So i made it so far through but i can't say for Alice anglers character. Give her three thumbs up right. So you have your thoughts about whether any of the things we've talked about whether ratchet in the original was a good person or not We did she get a bad rap. Ish she the monster that We're making her out to be throughout her character journey through multiple forms of media. I want to hear what you have to say on the subject Give us a call at seven zero eight and our app. That seventy six nine nine seven two seven and of course if you want to hear more of the show you can always find us on apple podcasts. Blueberry stitcher talk shoe poverty. Fm noon fm dot com as we said at the top of the show. We appear on geek. Life radio i. You can also find us on spotify iheartradio tune in radio son music all sorts of places and you can interact with us on discord on our facebook page. We're all over your internet's google forty going on fourteen if you can't find us then you're not using google properly and let's give blake a chance to plug history about ideas. One of the few podcast. Besides our own that. I've ever listened to thank you very much. Yes history bad ideas. We are not a history podcast in yes it. it's great. Thank you very much guys. I had a lot of fun here tonight. And you know we need to get you know you guys Coming on over to ours as well In the same thing. I tunes twitter facebook You know it's in radio Lipson gig life radio coming back. It's great Same thing denno all right cool and before we get out of here joel. What are we got coming up the next couple of weeks. Well we've got a visit to hazzard county to hang out with the dukes We're talking about sleeping dreams. Their road trip movie. Show coming to america parts one and do and believe it or not. We're doing a punky brewster. Show much against i think. Pat's chagrin. yeah. I don't believe it coming. I'm sick that we cromer. And all i wait now. That was a cartoon so thanks for listening. Thanks for being here. Blake my pleasure. We'll see you in the next coming weeks in the meantime medication time. I want might cigarettes medication time. I wouldn't mind cigarettes cigarettes. Let me. I don't believe i'm crazy. What who jerk offered here. The significance of that is that at the clearfield. Cheese company in kerr wins ville pennsylvania. Arnold narasaki debuted invention a method. Math methods are walkie. Doesn't derail me but method does to wrap six hundred. Individual slices prevented start over. Jesus christ. I didn't slammed a red bull before we start. It's raining right now. like i'm feeling a little tired of hammer back one of these things all right.

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1:43:35 hr | 3 months ago

Dirty Jobs Host Mike Rowe, Baseball Hall of Fame, GameStop Stock And The Origin Story Of Billy Football

"Hey what's up guys. It's big cat before you start listening to this episode. I want to let you know that we're running a special sale on all barstool merch. Go to store dot barstool sports dot com and use code podcast for ten percent off goto store dot barstool sports dot com and use code podcast for ten percent off on. Today's part of my take. Mike rowe mike rowe from dirty jobs. He's got a new series out. We talked to him about it. Six degrees micro very very interesting interview an interview that we started talking about jerking off chickens and it was turk by far the most turkeys. The most fascinating way you could do it. Also he has like one of the greatest voices of all time so a very different type of interview that we've got today we've got game. Stop baseball hall of fame. Aaron rodgers Clean up from monday. Hot see cool. Thrown are darling. Jake might have been put into a corner. A charity corner box into a charity corner for swearing on the podcast and then we finished with guys on chicks a great wednesday show for everyone before we get to all of that cash app. Go download the cash upright now. Use code bar so you get ten dollars for free ten dollars. Aspca the cash app is the greatest app in the world. We're gonna talk about stocks in a minute. You can buy stocks on the cash app. You can also buy bitcoin. You can do it all it links directly to your bank account. It's super super easy to use. The cash app is the best out there so go download it support us support cash app cash app studio. It's just the best. It's the best app. Just do it. Just do it right now. Do solid and you get ten dollars for free. Go buy some game stop stock. Maybe not maybe amc. I think is the next one. We're gonna get to all that but cash up cap cash app. Download it use code and ten dollars. Free ten dose. Spca google playstore or apps store today with the cash. Okay let's go shin part of my take presented by the cash app. Download it right now. Use code bar so you get ten dollars for free ten dollars. Aspca today is wednesday january twenty seventh and the weight of history in your hands is heavy. Who said that quote was at winston churchill fighting nazis or was it. Tom verduci filling out a baseball hall of fame ballot and leaving the greatest baseball player of all time barry bonds off of it that was. Jfk's inaugural address. Wait asked not what the writers can do for you. Ask ask not what baseball can do for you. Ask what you can do for baseball. And in this case leaving off four of the greatest players of all time so it is baseball hall of fame Season when the writers get their shine when the writers get to tell you how important their job is to decide the fates of the players. We love to watch which just an aside. I don't know why it's up to the writers. It should be the players. it should be players voting peers. Like hey who was the hardest guy to ever get out. How about barry bonds. He should go in either way. Tom verduci we had to a few few different things that happened. They top ritchie released a video. That i'm saying i'm gonna throw it out. There is going to be unintentionally the funniest video of twenty twenty one. It started it. Was tom verduci sitting in his beautiful sunlit office or study in his house and some pro. I don't know probably like suburban connecticut began. I guarantee you. He just calls his voting room. He uses here to sit. Sits down he. He's got like a specially engraved letter opener that he uses to up the ballot and then he sits down with the one with like a quilt pin and he does every year the same way and so the video started We'll put a couple of clips but it started. The weight of history in your hands is heavy. The baseball hall of fame. Vote is a triumph in minimalism. Weight of history in your hands is heavy even what it is but one sheet of paper. The baseball hall of fame ballot is a triumph of minimalism. It's a fucking piece of paper dude. And then he went. This is the best part about the baseball hall of fame. These stupid fucking reporters. That think they're the most important people in the world. He essentially doing a love letter to a piece of paper. In the simplicity of voting via mail one page no logos. Nope pictures received and returned by mail. And it's like. Hey that's us something. We should applaud in today's day and age. When you could fucking email your vote in and not have this entire process. Essentially it was like yeah. Look baseball. hall of fame sends me this. They don't even stamp it because they're cheap and i got to send it back and isn't that just so fucking pretty. It's like day baseball games in the world series. It's like i think he's a hot dog in the bleachers. It's like none of those things tom. Verduci you are you suck your own dick for fucking six minutes with this video and i still loved it. Well it's perfect because day games in the world series is like back when nobody could watch baseball on television. People missed world series games because they were at work like daytime world series games series no batting gloves and a hotdog in the bleachers. There is a timeless beauty in simplicity. It's been this way since voting began in nineteen thirty six. Now you can watch it on. Tv everyone can watch you. Tell me which is better to him. It's like yeah. It was only when a select few could partake in this activity. That's when it was great. The video was it was like the celebs singing imagine video. It's that video of twenty one where it's that self important. They should just have shut. Baseball writers would like you to bruce springsteen in the background doing their own version of the imagine video. And it's it's ridiculous. Because barry bonds is a fucking hall of famer. He's making a promotional video showing about you know like how great this process is while we're leaving off one of the biggest players one of the biggest part of baseball history that's ever existed. It's it's ridiculous and i'd like to ask The writers how many of you used substances and tools that weren't around for the for the old days of baseball right to use the internet. Guess what day. They had to file it using a typewriter. Sounds like it's easier for you to do. You should be judged against the people that you compete against not against number basically. They're saying. I'm not going to vote these guys end because i don't think they're better than math. Yes readily available espresso shots. I can guarantee you. They didn't have that. Nineteen forty to die like occas footnote diet cokes. Right exactly i mean. Don't even get me started with with the adderall usage of baseball writers. It ends though. Tom verduci he goes this whole video and at the end he has the line. I mean the fact that he's narrating his own video is just so funny. He doesn't even realize that part but he says that's so he's talking about the baseball hall of fame in this very important thing. The most important thing in the entire world is filling out your baseball hall of fame vote which by the way fourteen voters just left it completely Blink yet which credit them that is that is true activism that is true standing up against the man but he ends it with this whole thing. About how the baseball famous so important. And he says that's when you truly understand the weight of what you hold in your hands and then he gets up out of his boating room and he walks in his sun drenched boating room and walks off without even mailing. The fucking thing in your. I like that. The guys that did not file guys are girls that did not put a ballot in the mail back in. They probably just don't care they probably just check the mail and they're going to see it in there like a month and be like oh shit. Yeah here's my fan vote. Meanwhile tom verduci is creating like a jerk off instruction porn for himself. And i love that. He's he essentially made this video because it's something a he would have wanted to watch a baseball writer do when he was growing up right. It's really market to himself mark. It's it's it's future. Tom produce congratulating little. Tom verduci on growing up and getting about for the baseball hall of fame. And i have to take my hat off to the baseball writers because there were very smart when they started the hall of fame. Because if you get in on the ground floor. It's like any awards. Show out there if you just declare that this award show that you're presenting. Guess what you have. The power moving forward for all eternity and so then people just have to market themselves to you and kiss your ass over the course of years so that you're the one that gets a gatekeeper institution. That really has nothing to do with writing about baseball. They think writing about baseball is more of a sport than playing baseball correct. And jake make sure you put this in there. Get a reminder that we need to make a video sucking our own dick's before the turkey awards this year and how important it is. The weight of history is in our hands. Every time we give out a fleet made up award The other story. I saw mark. Craig who writes for the athletic wrote a column that was titled. I wanted to know why felt so crummy about my 2021 hall of fame ballot so i asked a neuroscientist this israel i cannot believe these people exist. I actually am so happy. They exist because they make our jobs so easy the fact that no baseball writers have even like a one percent of self-awareness makes our jobs easier because we can sit back and watch tom verduci. Write a love letter to himself and jerk off his boating room and then we can have a good laugh and be like what the fuck is baseball doing. Leave it up to the fans laying fans vote cat. You buried it. What did the neuroscience say he. I didn't have was. Is there a brain reason. Why feels bad. But maybe because you convinced yourself over the years that you're so important that everybody should look up to you because you get to check a piece of paper. Do they even get a sticker. I don't even seasoned worker. That says i voted on it. Do you know what it is. I could tell you. I didn't read the article. But i guarantee the neuroscientist. Hey you know why you're you're having so much trouble with this is because you all made so much money writing about barry bonds and how baseball was back when sammy sosa and mark mcgwire. We're hitting home runs. And now you're playing holier than thou yea that probably feels like you're really shady person because you are. Yeah exactly. You're slapping the people in the face that made you all your money that got us to this point. Because if you're at if you're at that point in your career where you're able to make a self documentary about your courageous votes. Then you're definitely a guy that was on the come up in the nineties that was cashing the checks and everybody knew that they were using steroids. This why they should make the asterik shaped wing of the hall of fame. There should be if you want to say like okay. Everybody that played in the nineties and early two. Thousands there is there's looming doubt over whether or not you were on the juice. Just make a room in the hall of fame that shaped like an asterix and then put all the stuff in there that you have with these guys let them in and then see which room gets more attendance. The one where it's like in the deadball era. I'm gonna go see three fingers. Mordechai exhibit again are no. I'm gonna go watch. barry bonds. Hit a home run. Seven hundred feet. They should actually instead of making it. The asterix room. It should just say a big sign above it and say these guys fucking ruled and you know it parentheses. Fuck baseball writers. Yeah i mike greenberg rules. We should give more power to baseball writers. We should actually give them the opportunity to vote people out of the hall of fame. We should actually make them. We should pack the court and it should just be only the supreme court should just be the baseball writers. Well i. I'm just saying like what if we made like five thousand more baseball if you've ever written the word baseball on the internet boom you're a hall of fame voter. I have a question for jake. Are darling jake jake. I know deep down There's been a point in your life where you aspired to be a chroma. Ginny baseball writer. Who decided who is making the hall of fame. Do you still hold those feelings. I mean yes you're right. I my first. My first step into the business was as a writer. I was the sports editor for the cyberspace circuit high school but not really anymore because i've position my stance to wanting to be a broadcaster so i don't really envy The people who are voting. I envy the people who are calling the big games. Okay okay right fair jay circuit if you were offered a vote in the hall of fame you take. It would be an honor. It'd be an honor. it would be. I think what they should do. They should have this. Be like an in-person ceremony. Where but it's only like the most unathletic baseball writers so the real heavy sweaty. Like four hundred pound guys with suspenders and comb overs. I want them in a room sitting like a jury and they bring the players up one by one like they're on trial and then just these fat slobs explain to bury bonds or or to. Alex rodriguez like. Here's why i'm not voting into the hall of fame and just see that dynamic in the real world at play. Yeah actually you know what it should be is tom. Verduci has to strike barry bonds out to keep him out of the hall of fame. Yeah or on the field. About what if what if you give tom vertucci and knife right. We're big into knives and guns in terms of her new rules this week. Give tom verduci knife. And then put him like on. In acre of land with barry bonds and barry bonds doesn't get any food or water and see if tom verduci can kill barry bonds within a week. I like the most dangerous game. Jake tell me this. I just wanna make sure that our future is secure. You know and not naming names but you know at least a couple people from your life is a big j journalist that watch that tom verduci video and they're like dow was awesome. Yes okay good line. Yeah yeah. I just wanna make sure their kids still out there. That are watching like mitch. Albom and bob costas and tom verduci be super self-important and be like that is what i wanna be. Bob costas is super important so forgot toward self employed. Donate money to the radio station. I got a lot of opportunities at. Oh wow so. You're he pays you off no he. That's what happens. They pay off the future broadcasters so they won't say anything bad about him. I do idea that there should be a tight. Not like a height limit in terms of your short. There should be a height limit in terms of your talk to vote for the hall of fame. so i only one like ken. Rosenthal bob kasich. You have to be under five six to vote for the hall of fame. That was actually a good foreshadow. Because jake did get paid off listened to after the micro interview we did get to donation to the barstool. Fun for jada on the podcast. So makes you turn tune in for that all right other things. We've got to talk about aaron rodgers. of course is staying packer. That was all for not on sunday night. Everyone melting down. Everyone saying oh my god. It sounds like he's singing about it. Actually proves how ridiculous like twitter and the internet could be which will get you in a second with game stop but one tweet a couple of tweets of people watching that zoom being like sure felt like he's saying goodbye and then it's an entire story and then he was like no. I'm not going anywhere. I was talking about other free agents on the team. I knew deep down. He wasn't going anywhere. Because i think it's destiny for aaron rodgers to torture my soul for another decade. But what i mean. Wh you know you you don't think he's going anywhere right. Pf i want to believe that. He's going to pretend like he might be going somewhere for this entire offseason and probably for years after that too. Because it's fun to talk about. I i like the fact that aaron rodgers knows that. He's stirring up drama so when he when he did the interview after the game he knew exactly how people are going to react. He was like. I'm gonna be despondent. I'm going to act. I'm gonna treat him like my family. Essentially we're all one big family here in green bay so i'm gonna act like i'm very disrespected. And like i might be on the outs and might split after this and then come back. Clean it up later. I'll get another week in the in the news cycle where i'll be able to clarify what i meant. And then you have to think like the packers would aaron rodgers be able to force his way out of town. Probably i think if he was thinking enough dick about he probably would be able to. You're right. I don't think he's going anywhere but i'm still i'm gonna pretend like i don't actually believe that and like yeah might go somewhere because it's more fun i think he'll just be there forever and every time that i start to think he's getting old he'll be like oh here's another mvp. I noticed we did not. He did not say that he was not going to become the fulltime host. Jeopardy did not deny that tat strew. That's true we have. Yeah i mean the other anything else from championships sunday. I saw that video of josh allen. Being a leader and hugging every bill in the sideline made me a little sad. And yeah i mean. We're we're gonna get going for the super bowl here soon. Yeah i mean. I think that's about the only big story that came out of it. Besides the fact that people love to remind us that we were wrong about the chiefs and credit. We were the first to say that we were wrong about the chiefs. We broke that story. There's mind me. I said it of a quarter in half into the gate when i realized how wrong i was about the chiefs so we own up to our mistakes. We were very wrong about the cheese. And i'm going to bet on the chiefs. Although i did kind of have a moment or did the problem with the super bowl is with the weeks. You just have so many moments where you can second guess yourself and be like oh actually maybe i like this bet instead of this bet but i need someone to just hold me to it. I'm going to bet on the chiefs. Yeah what's up. hey. I don't think he should. Why thank wants to bid on tom. Brady i was thinking about making the biggest bet. My life ontario tom ready before we left detroit and i was like. I'm going to wait two weeks and think it out. But i think that's where i'm end up okay. I like that if you do it. Yeah they'll be givers. Three good reasons to bet on the books on friday show are okay all right before we do hotseat cool throng game stop. We gotta talk about game stop. It is the story that is sweeping the internet right. Now if you are on the internet or familiar with with what's going on here's a very shortened version of it. As far as i understand. Because i asked everyone to explain to me like six year old and i got some good responses but essentially game stop is like a nothing stock. We all know came stop. It's it's a brick and mortar place that sells video games. It's basically a dinosaur and this one guy on it has been like. hey all. These hedge funds have shorts on game. Stop for to go down. I'm going to start pumping it. We're all gonna pump it and every time it goes up. The rich guys have to buy more of it to cover their short which then makes it go up even more and essentially. It's a perfect storm where this stock that is. Essentially obsolete stock is now gone up from four dollars to two hundred dollars in the span of five days. Yes and the big guys are losing all the money and the little guys on radio and the internet are are robbing them blind. Which if you don't love this story you have no soul it's awesome. I love it a lot and what's happening is they're finding out the message. Boards and common sections. Are there like the new factories and coal mines. The twenty first century so wall street is wall street just now figuring out what athletic directors in lane kiffin of known for years. Which is that like you. You cannot write any sort of federal regulation. That's more powerful than just a group of people who love to post a message board and they're they're getting fucked over by it which is perfect for game. Stop because game. Stop actually the king of oh. Yeah your your copy of donkey. Kong country is worth fifty cents. Now so i know you paid graph. Yes yeah so. I i love it i love. Buying people are buying stocks as a joke. And it's actually fucking over entrenched wall street billionaires and distributing all. They're taking money from the very rich and giving it to the poor so basically like the libertarians of read. It have invented taxes taxing people. And i fucking you. How can you root against the people on reddit. Right now is there a is there. Renault are your heroes. I know i'm not the only thing. The only thing that makes me nervous your stock. I'm cynical on guy. I think it's just stands. Yeah i'm cynical about all this. So i assume that eventually the hedge fund guys will have so much money that they can wait everyone out and fuck everyone over like i feel like they always went no matter what even if this is a win. The battle lose the war type of situation. I don't know enough about finance. But that's my. That's what i'm nervous about that. The little guys winning right now but the big guy always wins. But maybe i'm wrong and maybe they'll just take this fucking place down and it will be incredible. It's it's like the end of your favorite book though big cat the bay bridge when they're like i read it in the movie. I don't know if you've seen the movie. They did a movie about it at the end of the movie. They're like and all the people that were involved in. This got arrested and they did time and they changed the entire way that like the financial should is structure in something. Like just kidding. Nothing really happened. I feel like that's it's the same type of thing where it's like. It should change things but it. Just they're gonna figure out a way to just pay so. I saw that there was one dude that has so much exposure to it. That if there's like a pretty big hedge fund that if it gets no there's different one worthy gets up to like a hundred fifty dollars a share two hundred. What's up was melvyn. Melvin if he gets up to one hundred fifty dollars per share this entire hedge fund is out of business which is our did after hours or so far exposed. Yes oh what will probably happen. Is there's going to be one hedge fund that goes out of business like bear stearns or whatever and then they're going to come back rewrite the laws so going to be illegal to talk about stocks online and now they're fucking you again for the next hundred years but make you feel like you've won this one. But even that. Melvin hedge fund. I saw that steve cohen and another guy put in a bunch of money into it to try to save it so they essentially now own. Melvin and that's all it's going to happen it's like the guys are going to come over the top and they're going to win more than anyone but the only thing to be said is that ilan tweeted out the wall street bets like he's the richest guy and he's kinda. He's kinda siding with the with the rebel. He is an internet college elon. Musk is deferred. he's become a billionaire. Yeah yeah he's got some poll he's got some so i i kind of hope that it keeps going up. I mean i love this. Can we do this with another stock. I guess if we say it then we can't no no no not as on mc no. Stop billy abilities. Like billy of course saw. This didn't understand what was going on in. Hey let's just by blockbuster. But shorted billy block is cheaper. Nobre levers you'll you're you're missing the where someone shorted it right there. So when are you telling me that. Someone has shorted blockbuster. That's worth forty cents. Yeah way more who somebody. That's that's how that's what it's damage when ted still revive it. I mean who out there is actually buying stocks of blockbuster. Not shorting it. I'm pretty sure that exactly. Yeah i i don't know i listened billions not a financial adviser despite what you might think about them I think that Maybe there's a lot of people that have started under armor. I still have a lot of under armour stock from when i bought. I bought a shitload underarm stock. Just because they came out with ugly shoes for steph curry back in two thousand and sixteen so many get that rumor going out there like very heavily leveraged on the short side and under armor. Be real jumped off. I just i. Yeah when i ask people to explain it to be like i was six. Someone told me. I think we kind of invented this idea. Well we didn't because it happened before but someone said to me. Espn tweets that mitch. Trubisky's bad bears fans tweet. He's good to change the narrative and make. Espn look bad. The more people that tweet your bisky is good. The more pressure. Espn faces tweet. He's good at the end of the day. Espn is forced to tweet. Good about trubisky. That's the mvp. Yeah yeah you're right exactly what we did. We didn't see we force them to give an award to it and we squeeze we squeeze out drew brees and his forty second birthday or something like that. Yeah that's exactly you're right. That's actually a very good comparison for this. Whatever whatever happens. I we have to get in on one side or the other. I can't just sit here on the sidelines of history and not pick a side where and put my money. I think i think i have to buy. I think they're forcing me to buy game. Stop do we we twelve right now. Gone beyond the side of the fucking hedge fund. These guys are the worst. I'm going to buy. They're saying the red i. I was reading a lot in the wall street. Pets read it today and like they're all like you know. Get two thousand. Hold tila thousand. Yeah you know that there's like some old saying where this the second that Like my dentist start. Asking me about a stock is the time that i know i'm supposed to sell it or like the cavs. Start asking you about a stock or something like that. The second sports podcast start talking about a stock. Probably the right time to sell. But you know what fuck it. I'm in but when i asked him point. Yeah when i asked on. Twitter explains me like a six year old. A lot of people explained it to me and about half the other people were like. Well now. it's over. We've reached if big cat tweeted out it. It's the dow. Yeah it is. It is officially over. You're like five days late dude. The party's over. Thanks i am. I am the marker on the closing bell of when the party is over. I tweeted about it. I think. I am i because i thought about buying some and i know it's gonna go down right away. I think that once magic johnson recaps. Today's news on twitter at that point. It's time to unload all right. Let's do some hotseat cool thrown brought to you by our friends at coors light. The big games right around the corner and everyone's pumped now only for football but for commercials cores wanted to create the most refreshing out of all time so the bring it to a place. No big game commercials ever gone before. 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Watch the virtual dreams stimulus from the comfort of your bed and dream your way into your very own big game. Commercial could core cores. Big game dream dot com. That's cores big game. Dream dot com now to sign up to be one of the first to experience. We have to do this guys. We have to do this. So share them a share with them your thoughts at coors light on social media with the hashtag cores big game dream and check it out of course big game dream dot com experience. The first big game. Add that only runs in your dreams celebrate responsibly Twenty twenty one course brewing company golden colorado in fort worth texas. We're doing this and we will tell you how it went because i'm excited for this. I wanna dream about the beautiful blue mountains on like can so go check it out cores. Big game dream dot com. Okay how cool thrown. Pfc okay my hot seat is presidential dog twitter accounts you remember back in two thousand sixteen. There was a big. That's when the like we rate dogs and the racism dog got into a big online dispute over who is more racist well These dog beefs are back in a big way. So somebody started a twitter account called the oval populace get it and said office and They tweet out statements from joe. Biden's dogs like referring to their humans as their humans and other like fun little dog slang like that seems like it's fun right. Well guess what they're gonna be right now with rival twitter account at the first dogs and at the first dogs. Their account is dedicated to the first dogs of america. Champion major biden are humans portis and florida's are heck an awesome right. So you might wonder. Hey these two accounts should be on the same side here right. Like rising tide lifts all boats. Not the case. The oval office had to issue a safety announcement about their rival account. Actually excuse me a safety. Pau nouncement friends. The first dogs pretends to be a white house affiliated. Paul count our account. They have a white house. Dot gov lincoln their bio and made it. Look all very serious. We notified twitter safety and other relevant white house humans. We have never been mean canines before but this is impersonating a official institution. It's wrong doing humans like that is wrong. We know from trusted sources. They're not in any way shape or form. Poss- opiates with the white house So there's it's it's real here on the streets. This is going to get ugly. I think that i stand on the side of the account that is pretending to be the official account because at least they have balls enough to be like saying yeah. We're the official count of these fucking dogs and the other is like saying. We're just here to have fun pretending to be dogs. It ruins the mysticism of it for me. If you're going to try to be the dog be the fucking dog tweet like the dog all the time you have to do that i. It's up there with the baseball. Writers are infatuation with first dogs. Yeah stewardship their hacking goodwill offers and my cool thrown is dead. Zoo animals Oh that's who soon way to now. No because we've got print we've been waiting. We've been waiting for somebody to fill the gorilla size hole where a heart seats possible ever since. Two thousand sixteen harambee was taken from this way too soon and i think we have. No i think we have at hank. It's move faucet. The lion loss of the lion. He died right. R.i.p foster singapore's zoo right saving children. No chano even better than that. So we know seasonal did yeah. They're best friends pause and they. They announced his death yesterday. By nounce the birth of son simba. They say they turned it into a life announcement being like. We have a new cub. Simba named after disney's the lion king and it was conceived with semen from the father. Move fossa then. They added on that move. Fossett died during the ejaculation procedure when he was accidentally electrocuted by the product. They stuck up his ass to make him come. So lhasa died getting his prostate zapped and his his sperm was it was maintained and they gave birth to his son just the other day. There's any justice in this world. This son will just mall all the fucking he'll he'll grow up to just mall all know he'll know he'll boo cocky. Everyone yeah the trainer. So yeah he'll he's just gonna not all over so symbol is it's it's the continuity of fossils seed and. I think that we should respect for faucet. He went out the ultimate high like. They're definitely be some people that try to chase this high. That's gonna be the new Auto erotic fixation like instead of being david carey and hanging from a noose while you crank off. It's like just stick. Stick this electric fence wrapped around a baseball bat. Up your ass while you come and just let it go from there. So yeah our foster. We're thinking about you buddy that is that's a pretty valid. Yeah vowed replacement. i know. We should sell t-shirts baby. Trojan jakov sleep. Well i'm just. I'm i'm more to try and keep up on simba. He's the chose. Yes yes but does we got to buy some baseball cards of simba. It is funny. It's hot in the streets. It is funny that move foster died got thrown to his death and then simba's the lion king. That's exactly what's going to happen. Simba's either just come all over them all the time or he's gonna kill all the traders yes absolutely. That's that's some angry jisr. Yeah he was made out of. Yeah what if what if this is like the new x. Men that's born. He's got electrity in his body. Yes yes Hank you're hot seat. Hot seat is billy's boy. Jose can saco so caleb caleb presley are. Coworker went out there to a sunday conversation. And they sent a camera guy to film. Because we're trying to get footage for video and he tweeted yesterday. We had a camera guy in vegas for five days now. Waiting for jose can go train. Because jose can just isn't training so i think think he's on the hot seat. Oh listen to that billy. That's rat poison billy. He's training so i talked to. I talked to caleb. Yesterday billy i. He's training he's just duckie. He doesn't want to be filmed training. I think he's just added to lot different. No i think he's. I think he's just so slow billy that like you're going to have to beat him with speed because the scouting report to kill gave me was. He is very very big and he was scared about his size. But there's no chance that he has the speed to take down. Yeah so i knew. I was going to outlaw. Sloan if you know if anything. So i've just been training speed punch output. That sort of stuff. You know foot move. Yeah like movement. So i'm right going into the fight. Our reveal too much. But i had a plan going into the fight. I got so is stuff. That first video that i released me fighting was legitimately for my first week of sparring okay. There's gotta plan until they get punched in the face to face several times. You need to let one of us punch you in the face. Just let me ask you this. Billie so rough. And rowdy billy verse. Jose could say goes coming up next friday right before the super bowl. We're going to be in west virginia. I've been thinking about this. You are my champion. So i obviously rooting for you with all my heart if you were to lose because we have to just throw these things if you get knocked out. Would you be upset if i laughed because i think my reaction will be to laugh if the thing is i'm not gonna i've been punched in the face biological war athletic stronger guys than they can saco at this point of his life and i didn't get knocked out. I got knocked down get knocked out but if i lose it's going to be by i'm not going to get out in the first thirty seconds like you know there's no no i don't think that's either. I don't i don't think that that either. I was just trying to play it out my head because like i'm gonna be announcing the fight so my reaction is going to be very natural. Whatever was thinking about it. I was thinking about it and i think if you got knocked out i would be very. I would be worried for you and feel bad. After the fact but in the moment i'd laugh and be like whoops. Now's a bad idea. It's still gonna fight yeah. Of course he's not going to recuse yourself. no i have to. I fuck. I'm gonna call and just call jose scumbag look raid now. I've been funny business. Like totally hyper focused on this fight. And it's sort of cloud. I had no idea what was going on in the rest. Because i was also in quarantine so i was just super hyper focused on this and i am going to kill this guy. I've like been an isolation punching stuff in working out and just like have you come. I'm two hundred and ten. Come on two hundred ten pounds in five pounds of seem. are you coming. Oh you are. you're dot com. Not coming back i. I'm real backed up. We're what if. What if i think actually urban myth billy. I look this up before my no. No it's not really we talked. We talked to teddy atlas. He said that the best price fighters he's ever been around. They save it up and then they drink it right before they go. Yeah so what we what we gotta do what. I've actually been studying it Tyson fury he spoke at seven times a day but you seven times a day until the last week. Then you stop so you you accurate your body. Your body no. I'm not saying this is what the science says your body to high emissions in then you have zero emissions in a builds up all inside of you and then you like get angry at everybody around you and try to punch things dick's wrong. That's why he pissed off. I mean look what happened to move. Fossa he came in he instantly. I can't have that happening. You i cannot have nothing is going near my prostate at all ever. So that's out of the question would equipment. I think what we should do is we should. We should make a title belt for this and it should be called. Like jose canseco is a swollen rat and then even if he wins he asked to hold up. The jose canseco was a swollen rat built. Yes i liked that. I liked that Wait where are we. Thank you do your cruel trump on my couture on his florida. Why they know you know what. That's good enough. Great all right. My hot seat is they They want to host the two thousand twenty one olympics. This summer of tokyo bows out. Sheriff plus just give tell florida. They're getting everything. My seat is the nba security. You guys see the the bam kyri jersey swap that went down which is highly illegal in today's nba. It was very funny. They they essentially had to do it. Like it was a truck deal and The nba security is now on the hot seat because jersey swaps are not allowed but guys are finding a way to jersey swap. So we need to figure out how we can stop these players from playing forty eight minutes against each other sweating all over each other breathing over each other and then doing the absolutely ridiculous thing of swapping jerseys which is that's how you spread corona virus. Yeah he he put it under a shirt. He's walking off the court he's like i don't have anything that's a tough look for the nba in the protocol. Yeah yes very tough and then my cool is hard body. Twenty twenty one. Because we've delayed it. I just want to let everyone know. People were trying to get in shape the sheer heart body. It's going after the super bowl. I've been stuck in a casino for six days. I mean eating candy. I've been living inside of a casino. It does not. It's not conducive hard bodies. So i'm delaying it. So if you haven't started don't worry you haven't missed anything february. What's the super bowl. February seventh february seventh is super bowl. Yeah i'm being the gym february eighth and you won't. You won't see me out of the gym until my body is hard. There's there's a gym in the old age q that is going to get extensive use. Okay not not by me. I will not be going to that gym. But because i'd have to walk there. Yeah i i feel like hard bodies our shower. I'm not about the hard body lifestyle. No but we should just stack up shit dude wipes manua be having a hard body. I don't think goes with the rest of this. You know. well it's it's more. It's i mean. Let's be honest not going to be hard. It's going to be just less soft so less. Soft body twenty twenty one. I wanna maintain my hug ability though you got to be a little bit soft. Yeah i gonna My hot seat is ben aspirin. He's officially fighting. Jake paul in a boxing match Ben aspirins not striker. He's a ncaa wrestling champion. So if he gets knocked out by jake paul. It's gonna be really disappointing. Jake paul is going to continue to have a fraud. Boxing career billion jake. Paul is a new win. It's they're exactly. It's an eclipse. but jake paul picks guys who have zero reached by the way. I a hundred percent. Beat the shit. Out of jake paul. He wouldn't touch me. But jake save that for after the after. Yeah cut the laker. Even if i i'm the only way lose two consecutive no fucked up really really billy you got us. What you're saying is when you beat. Jose can saco if you lose will laugh whatever but when you when you beat him. That's when you say. I'm calling out paul brothers that they'll never fight me actually would beat them. They only choose guys. They know they can roy. The that's the only reason they wouldn't fight you. Floyd mayweather only reason. They're fighting billions. Because billy's to via was if i was if i was five to zero reach but like jack and looked athletic. I probably still wouldn't fight. Be like we could totally wouldn't fight. You know they would be like. You're you're the part of my take intern right. I'm not getting to be totally fucking do. Never i do love how looks online and bill. You even have to admit this that when you see a headline on tmz being like jose canseco to fight. Sports intern yikes. That's a tough. Look for jose canseco. You should never be. You should always like. Will you know eventually when you graduate college. You have a full-time job. Whenever you want it. But i think part of your contracts should be that you have to be referred to as an intern forever. Just so he can sunning people with this shit. We're like this turn a hell. it's like a. it's like eighth. Graders held back five. This is are you registered and gray shirt it okay is it a cool thrown is celebrate so i had another one doesn't sound like you have one all right. Let's get chickens yet yes. I've caught all them several times. It's actually quite easy. When you like corner them okay psycho dot. That sounds so bad. Before we get to micro ziprecruiter ziprecruiter dot com slash. 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That's where you can find the best jobs. That's where you need to be posting the best jobs if you want to find the best people for your job. Ziprecruiter dot com slash. Pmt four free ziprecruiter dot com slash pmt ziprecruiter. The smartest way to hire okay here. He is micro. Okay we now. Welcome on a very special guest. You know him from dirty jobs you know him from being the voice of discovery many many years you know him from shark week about fifteen years ago from qvc you also should be watching his new show. It is micro. he has new show out. It's called six degrees with micro now streaming on discovery plus so i was Watching some of the previews and the show as far as i understand is very daunting you basically like everything is connected in the world. I'm going to go back in history and figure out that connection. Do you think that's kind of an overachiever. Move like what made you do this. Because that seems daunting yeah. We were swinging for the fences. You know from the promotional side of things but in reality i needed something to do during the lockdown and and i thought you know dirty jobs was a rumination on work. Somebody's gotta do it on hobbies returning the favor on decency. I wanted to do something around history really for people who would never watch a history show. So i thought well what if we just identified two seemingly disparate points in the context of a really ridiculous question like can a horseshoe find your soul mate or can a mouse trap cure your hangover. Or how did a volcano redeem eminem's career right the more preposterous the better and then taken our to take a deep dive down the youtube rabbit holes and find at least six links that can actually get us from point a. to point b. the thing about the show that made it fun for me anyway. Was we throw everything at the screen. Right animation archival footage puppets we recreate the launch of the hubble as well as the san francisco earthquake with puppets. Just because we can Actors and re-enactors. Some of whom aren't all that talented wearing costumes. That aren't very convincing sometimes in wigs. That don't really fit doesn't matter hired my My my old buddy chuck who. I went to high school with great actor who portrays thirty five or forty historical figures. I love at orly. so we just. It's a hot mess of stuff designed to illustrate the incontrovertible fact that all the information in the world is now available to everybody online but never before has it been grouped in a chronology. That is so seemingly insane. That's really interesting. It's strange because until you just kinda pitched that that show. I hadn't really thought of it but a few years ago. I think we were speaking with somebody Maybe at the history channel about doing a wikipedia wormhole thing for a wikipedia club along the same lines where you just follow the links around the internet. It is fascinating how everything's kind of tied together Can you go back. Real quick kin a mousetrap cure hangover. That's the one i'm interested in. Sure i mean spoiler alert the only way to really explain how this thing spills out is to sort of. Just tell it to you but you know higher. Amac's created the first repeating mouse trap about two hundred fifty years ago. He also created the light ball a thousand other things including the maxim machine gun and the maxim machine gun changed the course of the the first world war. It killed somebody people so quickly and made so much noise and was so easy to conceal the allies to know how to deal with it so they took a tuba a giant war tube about twenty feet long and they pointed it at the ground and it identified the sound waves of this gun as well as from artillery and by using sound ranging they were able to identify where these guns were. Well they also learned that would sound ranging you could identify where oil deposits were and now suddenly a guy named karcher comes along and winds up using this technology to create texas instruments. And the next thing you know we're creating the germanium and silicon valley comes along in the whole race for making things. Small gets big. And at the same time that's happening over it's stanford but guys were working on. It are experimenting with lysergic acid. Which of course as lsd and we take a whole side trip on what happened lsd. And how that fueled the counterculture which ultimately impacted our decision to leave vietnam while we left vietnam. A guy named david tran happened to be on one of the boats and david tran went on to create saracho. The hot sauce that makes any bloody mary taste a whole lot better than otherwise would. And so when you have a bloody mary with sarah sauce and at the odds of getting rid of your hangover exponentially better but of course it wouldn't have happened if higher maxim had in created the first repeating mouse trap swell. So he did it. Is there a part of you when you pitch this show. You're like it almost as calling your shot. Like grow my. I'm so successful. People like me so much. I can pitch this that. I'm just thinking if anyone else pitched this they'd be like all right. Dude i'll get the hell out of here. Maybe get a little bit of focus before you come back with your pitch. But you're like. I'm mike rowe i'm gonna pitch this and they're gonna love it and it's going to be a great show and you don't even have to make the show you just like. Yeah they accepted. This isn't that crazy you know. I love to say based on my incredible wit charm and persuasive ability. I sold it in the room. But i didn't. What what i mean. All that happened but the pandemic also happened and suddenly networks for like we don't even know how to make a tv show anymore and i had a sponsor who was willing to help absorb some of the risk so i put in some money. Sponsor picked up the slack. I was able to make the show before it found a home. And that changed everything And so then you know. I went back into the room and showed it around and rather than having to pitch it the way i just did to you. I just said you just watch it right done right. If you dig it you know. I got five more. If don't i'll find somebody else. So yeah i wasn't really calling my shot. Although i like the way i felt when you said that it's more about i mean and this was part of the pitch to not to be earnest about it but dirty jobs was attributed to my grandfather a guy who could build a house without a blueprint right And it became a rumination on work. This is a tribute to my dad. A guy who taught american history to high school junior high school kids for thirty years and he said to me years ago. He's like look. My job is not to present the facts. My job is not to inform my students. My job is to make them give a damn about topics they otherwise wouldn't and ultimately that never changes you know when it comes to history today. Everybody's got a different version of how they like to believe it. And so i do too but i don't make any pretense about it. I just say these things happen. Charles newbold invented the iron plough that led to the agricultural revolution that impacted by boban. All we go So i'm doing is taking facts. That aren't in dispute and putting them in a chronology that nobody's done before and then saying well there you go six degrees. It's tv show it. I mean it's also genius because it's it's a comment on where we are as a country where you're like you know what people probably aren't going to be reading history books. Let's make a tv show out of it. You're smart you're ahead of the curve. Well i'm also looking around and seeing people today convinced they can change our present by altering the past You know you can pull down all the statues you want. It's not going to change the facts of what happened. We can't improve the future by you know shining up the past it is what it is and how we let it impact us today that matters like if you if you look at history the wrong way. Where if you look at look at it through an angry lens. Well you're gonna have people knocking lincoln off mount rushmore but if you provide some sort of context and force people to see what happened. Not in the context of Some historical time line but rather in a way that impacts your neighbor and everybody else then it becomes relevant and then maybe as a fait coast. I get a little bit more permission to go a little bit further than i otherwise would To me it sounds like you sat down. You're like i'm mike rowe. I have the best voice. In america i can. I can literally read the encyclopedia and people will tune in and listen to me. Read the encyclopedia and it worked. That's the great part about it. And honestly i think i would probably listen to you read. Yeah probably the dictionary. You've got a very soothing voice. I read that you are an opera singer. I don't know if you still if you credit that for your narration voice or if the narration voice came first and then worked under singing voice afterwards but it seems to work very very crooked road. You know i add. I had a stutter. When i was a kid but my voice also changed early when i was young. I sound pretty much at eleven years old. Like i do now so once i in its own right like an eleven year old while everybody want with a deep vote. It was weird man. I mean we went from a guy who talked like this guy was like. Hey how are you you know it. Just it was very strange But yeah you know the opera was the thing if you want to see something really weird. I'm sure you have access to the internet right now. Google micro reads phonebook. Okay and This is like ten years ago. Somebody said i'll give your foundation a cheque right now for twenty thousand dollars. If you read the phone book. Because i think it will help me go to sleep so i i recorded the phone book and i put a chunk of it on youtube. And it gets it still gets passed around once in a while and I mean a lot of weird things but sitting there for a few hours recording a phone book you know at some point you gotta look at yourself in the mirror and dude what what happened to you. Yeah you're you're basically like the only fans accounts with feet pictures but it's your voice. Everyone's getting turned on your by. Your voice should start an onlyfans where you just record things behind a paywall. You could retire everything. So you mentioned your fa- foundation. Your foundation micro works foundation. I love the idea of this. So people don't know i. I think most people have seen dirty jobs but dirty jobs wasn't just a tv. Show something you kind of enacted in real life. The idea that blue collar work Trade school these things are important. Not everyone is built. You know or wants to go to college you know. These are important jobs that need to be done my question for you of all the jobs. So you've done you know three hundred plus dirty jobs. Have you ever thought about podcasting. Have you ever thought about the trade or are we a dirty job because me. Just throw this out there right. We come into here on a sunday. We watch twelve hours of football straight. We gamble on every game. We eat disgusting Food that probably isn't great for you. And then we record a podcasts. At midnight i would contend. That's not much different than being like I think one time you you were like Reindeer dentist like what's the difference. This is a dirty job. This is a hard job. Wouldn't just say i look you'll get no argument from me. I think all jobs have the potential to become dirty depending on how broadly you define the term. But it's the it's the sameness of job that in many ways can ultimately make it dirty. If you that thing you just described that twelve hour day you sit there watch football you cold pizza. You forget to take a shower do that. Three four five ten days in a row twenty days hundred days. That's when you know that's when your brain starts to change. And that's why. I don't care how glamorous it is. In fact i know glamorous. I know fashion models it's disgusting. Their job is disgusting but the the things they wind up having to do over time that you would never think about our our gr- opera singing is disgusting. The costumes you have to wear the sweet. Did they smell like a hockey outfit. You never know it. You're sitting there watching the opera. Some guys up there whaling away. He smells like ass man. I'm telling you. I've never encountered a professional opera singer in the midst of a performance who smelled any better than an athlete at the end of the fourth quarter. I mean we had to watch sixteen jets games this year and i challenge you to. The bears often a more difficult job in america than that. Yeah hey man. I still remember the day. Mid march nineteen eighty four. I guess it was was at eighty six when the colts left. Baltimore That that for me. I mean since it's still you know you guys are basically a sports thing. I'll tell you that that changed my relationship with organized sports forever. You know what watching those mayflower vans. Leave baltimore in the middle of the night headed for indianapolis i. I've never been able to watch a football game or any organized sport the same way since so sounds like this is the dirtiest job you need to come in in shadow us first sunday and see how it ranks against all these other dirty jobs. You've done like. I'm i'm actually fascinated by your your podcast and your job. I i do. A podcast is very different from yours. But i'd say smart you can say smart yours a smart ours. I was going to go with precedent. Important lightning well obviously important but also a game changing. Yeah and apocryphal. But also short. You do like short-form podcast. Which i think you know like we essentially do like twenty of your podcasts. Every week so we work harder. You work smarter which goes against your whole thing which is work smart. Yeah here white collar exactly so we're really down here in the kid. Yeah but that's it. This is the only thing you guys do you know. We read a lot of mock drafts. Yeah yeah. I also watch college basketball. Come on must be exhausted. Yes i am. We're going to get back to my corona second. Before we do jack jack jack pocket. You know what tonight is. 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Yeah well there were three hundred you know and honestly i mean i get that question a fair amount and i normally just spin thirty. Those three hundred ten percent that are on a wheel of filth in my mind. And when i spent it it doesn't matter which one it lands on their all honest answers that question because you can't compare chick sexing to castrating a baby lambs with your teeth and you can't compare the at to hanging upside down on the mackinac bridge six hundred feet in the air welding and you can't compare that really to opal mining in coober. Pedy australia where you're lowered on a boatswain's chair into a sixty foot shaft. That's about the width of a manhole cover. And you can't really describe the claustrophobia that washes over you as you look up and see that little tiny dot of blue get smaller and smaller and smaller. You can't compare collecting semen from a turkey really to anything in fact that's it right there. You have all of turkey. come. I have a poster would do wanna hear honestly what that job entails yeah. I'll tell you jacking off a turkey. Yeah that's it but jacking off a turkey. That's that's child's play. I mean i. I don't know what's in your mind's eye but the first thing you have to remember is that the turkeys penis is inside. It's asshole oh right. It's called a clay cup and typical of most. Avian and by the way. The process i'm about to describe is the reason. Everybody gets a turkey on thanksgiving. There would never be enough turkeys in the country right there. Bradford right that's right. They can't get together to actually do it the old fashioned way because they're full of steroids so they're chester big so they can't mate so what you do. Is you take like that and you put it upside down between your thighs and you and you squeeze it a little bit and then somebody hands you ajar like it's just a little jar. Looks like a baby food jar and the lid on the jar has two holes in it and inside of each hole is a straw so you hold the straw in your free hand and then you direct your attention to the clo ak- on the upside down turkey between your thighs. And then with your you start to stimulate the clo- ak- in the time honored tradition that all males are no doubt familiar with his high. If you do it right. The orgasm that runs through the turkey will allow the semen to collect in. Its rectum to do is. He comes into his own ass jar. What a mask. No he comes into his own ass. Oh said you wear masks yes jack. You're he's upside down. Ejaculates and the seam and then puddles like a disappointing bill of mill in its in its asshole swoop in nature. How does does he then have to open his asshole up and then go to ask with the female with the hen. Well a they actually face each other in nature and then they roll back and the lady parts smashed into the asshole of the male bird and all the Gelo cody gets transferred through some miraculously way. It's very difficult. I mean it's it's kind of a miracle that there's ever been a baby turkey born when you consider the fact that they can't actually you know it's it's not the typical in and out thank for a very imperfect german pornography thing. We're talking about here. Yeah this this hits a little too close to home when you're like yeah. Their breasts are too big in their dick is in their asshole that you look directly at me when you said that so i was like ship. Okay ought to sit on your lap with a little baby food. That's basically what it is. You play the cards you get so you know. The odds are against it in the first place but anyway you gotta turkey upside down. Between your thighs. His rectum is full of spunk. You'd take jar with two straws and what you do is you. Put one straw into the rectum right into the sperm and they put the other straw in your mouth. And you start sucking. Did you get real quick. Did you think while you're doing this. There's got to be a better way to my mouth. Yeah the thought went through my mind. You know it's the twenty first century guys. Maybe there's a tool that is a bit more sophisticated than a jar with two straws in it but what you do. Is you create a vacuum in the jar by stuck in on one straw right and then you even late. The other straw into the turkeys rectum and as that vacuum intensifies. The sperm will come through the first straw and collect in your jar. And when you get all the sperm out of the rectum. You spread your thighs. And the bird falls to the ground and flies off to boast and brag with the boys and then they bring you another one and then you do the same thing again the thumb yep straw rights and this goes on for awhile. You know until you're jars is full of Sperm and then you take the sperm from the jar and put it in these little pipe pets. And then you put that into a An injector gun. And then they bring you the hands and you go ahead and put that through their which called the vulva and you pull the trigger and bo. You got pregnant turkey. So all right so i would imagine that one was one where you're like. I couldn't imagine myself doing this every day. Is there has been a dirty job where you think back and you're like you know what i actually really enjoyed that and i could do that for a living. Sure i remember. You've been in new york. Surely we were sitting right now. Yeah now yeah you're in new york right now. Your act did no have you noticed the Wooden water towers yom top of virtually every building over five stories. You know if you haven't once you look for that's all you see. They're everywhere and a those wooden water tanks. Hold all the water for the building. They're on the roof right. 'cause gravity gets it to a whole lot faster than if you have to pump it up but the tanks a basically been built by the same company for the last one hundred. Twenty years called rosen wick and they need to be replaced. You know every twenty thirty years or so and these guys have the contracts on all of these tanks so what will happen is at nine o'clock you know the apartment empties people go to work. These guys climbed to the roof and they one piece at a time disassemble tanks. Now some of these are thirty forty stories right and you're at the very very top standing on a wooden platform that you're ultimately dissembling. And then they build a new one in the same day and the the teamwork and the The speed with which these tanks are replaced day in and day out is is a mix of like construction one oh one and cirque du soleil. These guys are just death defying doing man's work in a in a real team oriented fashion. It's it's a marvel to watch. And i had a ball doing it And was glad to go home with all my fingers attached because they're swinging axes and malls. You know hundred fifty feet in the air balancing on one foot. I mean it's it's incredible to city. And i really had a good time doing that. One of those are the those are the coolest because those are you. Think of you know where we're at as a Civilization and you just take all these things for granted and you don't realize you know someone's fucking a turkey someone's building an entire water holder on top of my building while i'm at work and that's where the emmy comes in. Whoa look at that. That turkey change my career That turkey still calls. Yeah gay man wait. Wait you coming back to minnesota. I miss your fancy opposable thumb. The best way i ever had did you. Did you request a picture that turkey just so you could always like you know. Remember your day with it. That turkey is seared into my retina picture but a friend of mine did blow that one up and so yeah i i keep it on the wall to remind me that no matter how weird my baguettes you know i could be jerking off at there. It could be stranger getting an itch for that stuff when you're not working on a new project when you're not out there doing something like your new show. Are you like man. I really wanna get out there and and get my hands dirty. You know it's funny. I just got off the phone with the network. Actually and they're they're open to rebooting the whole thing. And i'm i'm really of two minds you know i. I don't think i'd. I don't think i could do the same show the same way. And nor nor would i want to. But i do feel like it's a good time right now to get out there and and do another show about essential work. Whatever that means right. Because i don't think it means what we think it means and i think people would welcome a new look at what people do in the course of making a living But the thing that i miss most and and the thing i've been able to do in this new show so i guess really i don't miss it but the important thing Wasn't the specifics of the job. It was the way we shot it and it was having a behind the scenes camera. That never stopped rolling. We never did a second take on on dirty jobs. You know what you saw for. Better or worse was what i saw as it happened and That's the trick in my world. You know nonfiction. If i can if i can shoot a show in a way that makes the feel like they were there with me rubbing out little turkey heine right there with me. Then that's what matters right. It doesn't matter if it's a history show. It doesn't matter if it's squishy facebook show like the one i'm doing now called returning. The favor doesn't matter if the viewer feels like they're with you then you get you get permission to do damn near anything. You want yeah. There's always something that. I really enjoyed about dirty jobs. Which was you're taking sometimes outrages subject matter like jacking off turkey and you're but you're treating the work that's being done with a lot of dignity ultimately and shining a light on on people that you know sometimes might be looked down upon because maybe they didn't go to the same school somebody else or maybe it's not the job that everybody dreams of growing up. What was what what was the. Are i guess. What i'm asking is like when you were getting ready to do the show How were you making sure that the Spotlight was was on the right places. And it wasn't turning it into like a cartoonish sideshow at some times. Yeah that's a great question honestly and Make great i mean. I don't mean to suggest that like all your questions aren't great. It's just that of questions you've asked so far. That is top twenty. Thank you It the lesson is isn't where to shine the light. The lesson is where not to shine it and in my world i had been impersonating a show host for twenty years at one hundred different jobs. I've worked every network doing every kind of show and all that was bullshit. All of was to me hitting the mark saying line and trying to convince people. I know more than i do by talking like this right. I mean that's what a host does. And i was happy doing it and i'd probably still be doing it because i did. Okay but in a sewer in san francisco in two thousand two I had an encounter. I had been hosting a show called evening magazine and my mother. My mother called me that morning and said michael your grandfather. Who was my my idol by the way a guy who built a house without a blueprint like the one i was born in. She said a. Your grandfather is ninety. One he's not going to be around forever. Wouldn't it be great if when he turned on the tv before he died he saw doing something that looked like work rate line. So my mother right. So i said well. It's a good point so that night. On evening magazine i went into the sewers of san francisco to host the show. Just to get my mother off my back and When i was down there. I ran into a sewer inspector. A guy named crews whose job was really just to kind of keep an eye on me and show me around. But while i was down there we were attacked by thousands of thumb size roaches more rats than i've ever seen in my life and i fell face first and a river a shit and long story short. I couldn't do my job. But i could help him. And my cameraman wound up filming me working as an apprentice with sewer inspector who was replacing the rotten old bricks in the sewers of san francisco with no bricks backbreaking difficult unspeakably disgusting work but really really really important because if that guy calls in sick for a few weeks and everybody else who does what he does. Those sewers collapse and all of san francisco is covered in shit which is funny because it kind of is now today anyway. But that's another story. The point is when i looked at the footage that my cameraman got that day of me working not hosting but working with an actual expert. It became obvious to me that that's something. I would wanna watch as a viewer. Because i i had been Humbled i mean the sewer didn't let me do my job. The way i wanted to the only thing i could do down there was helped the sky and so when the spotlight shifted from me as a host pretending to no more than he did to the actual dude who was doing the actual work then. All kinds of great information came out. Vis-a-vis our conversation and along the way the viewer got to see some giant condoms floating by on a river of crap. And you know all sorts of other weird things you would ever expect to see on show and so that was the footage that sold dirty jobs ultimately and that was the phone call from my mom that sent me into the sewer and that's the reason. The show is dedicated to my grandfather. Who just wanted to see me doing something on tv. That looked like work before he died. And so you know. None of that was on my mind when it was happening. But looking back yeah. I wouldn't be talking to you right now. If it weren't for rat the size of a loaf of bread that jumped on my shoulder drove me into the sludge and ultimately convinced me to work with the sewer inspector instead of host to show. Well it also sounds like your mom was trying to convince her dad that she did a good job as a mom by raising a son who wasn't totally worthless Well look it's kind of like being the son of a of a great athlete or the daughter of a great athlete. Like the pressure. The pressure on that kid. you know. Cal ripken junior. Junior or whatever's in like how how in the world right my grandfather really could build a house without a blueprint. He could he could take this watch apart and put it back together blindfolded. Never read the instructions. Anything in his life right. I was sure. I was going to follow in his footsteps now up until i was seventeen and The truth is just because you're passionate about something doesn't mean you can't suck at it and and the handy gene like like the athletic gene in many cases is recessive. And i get it the things my grandfather could do with a construction mindset. I just didn't get it. you know. And so he told me when i was seventeen. Yeah get a. you can be a tradesman. He said just got a different toolbox. Because you're never going to be able to do what i'm able to do. And that was a big lesson in a hard lesson. But that's why i got in the opera. That's why i got in show business. And that's why twenty years later. Twenty five years later when my mother called me it was like yeah for my grandfather had do whatever i could so he saw me. Before he died in the sewers. He saw me on the golden gate bridge. He saw me do all sorts of things and That's all it was supposed to be three one hour specials to get my mother off my back but people watched and they wrote billy matt they wrote in there was like it wasn't just we like the show it. It wasn't like we like you. It wasn't about that it was. You've got to see what my uncle does. From any way you see what my sister brother uncle has cut right all these letters from people who wanted to share But they do for a living and that ultimately is what made me think. Oh okay this is something more than a smart aleck crawling through river. A crap making the occasional joke. So i you're smarter than us I think it's safe to say but you realize you did just right you another episode for six degrees like you need to six degrees of your own life with how your your grandfather became handy and how your mom was Ashamed of of the beta son that she raised and how it ended up with you doing thirty jobs. Everybody has a story man and you know five six ten degrees. I'll show you. This will freak you out more than turkey off. That was that was. What is this genealogy of michael gregory okay and so latest thing damn. This was put together by a fan of dirty jobs. Couple years ago. I was on a small private plane and we landed in maine and when i landed. I took a selfie of me in front of the plane and the tail number was on in on the tail number. Some guy tracked me down to where i was. And this guy's name was jesse hagen and he put together it taken a year. He's genealogist and he put together the entire story of my whole life going back ten twelve fourteen generations cheese unrelated to lord. Baltimore right guy. Shows up at a private airport and gives this to den so lucrative they say was not to be a creep here but I've been studying is completely freaked out. Because i've had like stalking issues and stuff like that over the years you had the dronut show. Yeah it's pretty. Oh yeah the drive. Is there many many many many weird and strange stories but having a waiting for you at dark next to your little tiny plane with a giant book saying micro. I have something for you. It's the story of your life and your family's life yes but that. Yeah it's crazy. That is crazy. My last question was american chopper. You did the voice for that now. Was that your easiest job because basically every week. You could be like big paul's mad at little paul. Little paul's mad at big paul bike gets made. How did that like did you just submit it one for every season. Narration is is my favorite thing to do Well that's not true. My favorite thing to do is everything. Right it's gotta be a mix of everything but narration is is awesome and that story actually is is funny because i went in. Read the copy like you always what. I had no idea what the show was to know anything about it. And i got the booth. And i sat down and the engineer said gimme a quick mike test so i i read it poorly on purpose like i was just imitating a bad. Dj meets car salesman so it was like a father. A son the drama. The deadline american chopper. Right just that well. In my headphones i hear the producer guy named hank cap shaun. He's like hey mike. On hank i'm like oh. Hey hank how are you doing mike test because all of that that that was great. I love that. I thought he was kidding. So i said let me do it once more the way i wanna do it and so i did it the way i wanna duty said. Oh yeah that's terrific grape. While he uses the mic test. The joke and he puts into american chopper. Not only do i wind up doing one hundred fifty episodes of that with that same ridiculous voice. They go on to produce american hot rod young american casino. Ufc ultimate fighter. Twenty other shows out of the same shop. And i did the video for all of them and every show that hank was on. He's like you know what i want. Drama mike voice. Oh that's perfect. That makes me that makes me so happy because i love that show and i love. That's the story behind it. God and now on deadliest catch you're right. It's the same thing when seasons seventeen vast bering sea. I never meant to do that all right. Well let's let you go. Everyone go checkout six degrees on with micro on streaming now on discovery plus your now Recurring guests you have to come on. Next time we ask or for voice over work voiceover. Can you just say. I'm mike rowe handover your man card. I'm mike rowe. Handover your man card on par. You're watching pardon. My take that those guys again. I sorry i interrupted shit dude again. You're watching pardon my take with those two guys. I love it perfect mike. Thank you so much and we do expect you to to show us for an nfl sunday for whenever dirty jobs comes back. I don't think you can handle not man. And you're going to be begging to mass. Lose her shoes issued accepted. Okay shelby done all right. Thanks appreciate to meet you. Mike rowe is brought to you by. We love three as the industry leader in delta t h c products. I three ci hard when i got home from detroit. Put me to bed. Had a real good night sleep. I has slipped lake seven and a half hours non. Stop all to the three chief for that one. All the products are formulated by biochemist in made in the usa grown hemp three cheese. Delta eight is a federally legal version of thc. More functional alternative. Marijuana gives an amazing buzz. You get a great body field but you get a clear head less anxiety unless paranoia. It's available online at three. Cheat dot com. That's the number three c. h. dot com and at select retailers around the country. You have to be twenty one to purchase member. It's not cbd psychoactive. You're gonna get a buzz. You get a nice pop from it so please use it responsibly. Three dot com. That's the number three c. h. I dot com shot for delta. Eight vapes gumy's tinctures and oils can make your own homemade edibles out of them use promo code. Pardon at checkout get five percents off your order five percents off your order use promo code. Pardon at three key dot com okay. Let's guys on checks before we do. That are darling. Jake has been put in a charity corner so we said on sundays show. I wasn't putting the corner volunteer. No jake did you. Because i don't think that you volunteered to do this until we brought it up on sundays brainer. So it'd be a tough decision this moore's an easy decision. Someone donated a thousand dollars to the barstool fund. And you're going to swear correct. Yes shot to awol jack. Aws how did he stipulate on which cuss word now. Okay so what i was gonna say is i think we should keep this going if you donate a thousand dollars and you show it proof. It has to be from this point forward so you can't have already donated it. You get to decide you get to decide what's swear or racial slur. That jacob say on her pocket no can make lists but say the seaward. Yeah i i went to talk. I think we gotta take. I think we gotta start it out properly and just have jake drop a hard f- bomb i think that's a that's a good way to like play our flag and be like yes. We're really going to do this. Jake yes jake. Yeah what i was gonna say. I fucking love helping small businesses. All right good job. Good job sorry. Sorry to young listeners. By the way you know if if this blocks me from calling a game one day. Because i'm helping good 'cause i'm not going to lose sleep over that. Oh here we go to left field. That'll make to nothing ballgame so now what. I'm definitely going to donate by the way. I i'm to get you to say something really bad but okay so we'll get going forward donate thousand dollars. Get to decide what cheek is going to say on the podcast but we needed proof and some words are off limits. What words off limits. Yes say them you to say. I'm otherwise i'm going to be like well. He'll say i can't even spell. There's a phone line now okay. You can't even spell it a bubba. Can you take jake saying fucking and just have that like looped over and over again and the take on me autry. thank you Yeah and actually like we should make i. I'd like to figure out way for it to be my my my phone call my ringtone Maybe we should make necklaces in the in the barstool sports store that just play jake sing fucking over instead of the intros where it's like. Hey guys it's big cat. It can just be jake sang. Fucking fuck fuck. Fuck swearing in the beginning of all these podcast. It'd be very funny. If that's what eventually got us the explicit tag on itunes yes yes all right Let's do a couple of guys on chicks senate everyone on hughes this week. Not guys on checks but we can you sub guys may come off as weird. But how would you describe the smell of the pmt studio lavender. It's mostly old jeans. That's the best way. I can describe it. I it anything this. The smell goes back and forth. The smell was back and forth because there was a time. When i think someone exploded pumpkin in there that it smelled godawful. There was a time when we we had like. We're trying to do like knives out. Mystery situation where there's if you look at the ceiling above me. There's all this red juice and for a while we all were accusing each other and then bubba just walked in days. That was me my bad. Yeah i it smells like everything is beer coffee like for some reason right now. I don't know why does a little bit. Like mountain dew and dip piss. Did you piss walked into the studio pissing. There's corner into bottle. I don will pick him. Yes that's pretty much what it smells like. Yeah a little bit like and it's funny. You bring up like the pumpkin because it's almost like The carpet and here's a little time capsule so sometimes. If we cleaned the carpet it brings out the stench that pumpkin that exploded in two years ago and then the whole studio smells like rotten pumpkin again for a week. Yes like the rings of a tree. Yep why didn't they can t half to do soggy sorrows when their team lost in the playoffs. Why didn't we because hypnosis to and also we totally expected our teams to lose. So i don't it wasn't really sorrowful. Yeah we were just for. I did it. For cody parkey. That was one that i didn't see coming in that. I thought the bears actually had a really good team that year this year the bears got in from a fucking technicality letting in seven teams. Awol's smear on disagree awol here when we have people back in for in person interviews also. Honk what's the latest you're bubble have stayed up producing a show. I think once this vaccine gets wrong. i'm ready doing. I'm ready to hit the road again. Like i don't. I don't know if we're going to happen again. But i i really hope that it does. Yeah i mean. Currently i'm not because i again. I'm living in a casino. But i i am ready for in person interviews again. Would you over under fourth of july over probably realistic. Yeah we gotta get we gotta get more of the the special interviews and remember that that. Lee that cuddly. Yeah yeah that was good. Yes by way breaking news real quick breaking news breaking news bringing news details. John hayman just tweeted. Ema just tweeted gladys torii hunter mark. Burleigh tim hudson poll above five percent. Indus- remain on the ballot. Well i didn't vote for them. The five percent rule is dumb and too many great players have been knocked out early by it. i love it fucking. Brick has as a not torey hundred fan. I'm just glad to see him still around. That's essentially just up to the puerto right in their face. They're like your just see. no. I didn't invite you to this party. But it's cool that you're here. I'm going to give this guy. Grit corn real quick win. Are the car sticks. Coming back in stock. I was too naive to see the value earlier. And now i'm kicking myself. Please advise That's it we do. A special run ran into production issues Yeah making sticks anymore. Covid his blame ever. No you know what we'll do is we'll do. We will absolutely once we get to a few more states for the barstool sports book. We will do a car stick. Bet yeah and we will. We will have car sticks giving away because that will be a fantastic bet. Hey big cat and pf t what are the things. You are most proud of in regards to the show. Michael i think just keeping billy alive for the last years has got to be way up there. Well you keeping. Billy live me trying to kill. Yeah he might die next week but up to this point like they can't take away those years has somehow i mean billy's lifespan. After joining the show. I think everybody was. Betting would be basically like larry threes. Yes what am i most proud of. I'm honestly most proud of that. We're like going on year five in. It's it's crazy that we've had this audience for this long and it just everyday kind of feels like not even real. I remember at the beginning like week. This many people are listening and then it just kept kept happening. And i guess it's cool that everyone just like chill out and stuck around how. Yeah cool guys way to just hang out with you guys are you. Guys are good hang. We appreciate it. Yeah right right exactly what we thought the party would have ended by now but everyone still here so guess what. Beer still flowing. Let's have some fun. How'd you guys find. Billy and will you guys be betting against him against jose can take away. And where can you bet on this fight. I will also lead. Not betting against billy wait wait. Fps to use you. See what he just is a class hake where hake where they've been on it. I know i'm reading the question. I might have added something in the end that i was curious of obviously now. It's clear where aware hank i'll play. Barzal app actually. There were you can bet on five of the twenty five thousand dollars. That's incredible but there's a question first. How did you guys find. Billy billy billy applied as it was actually so great because hank wrangled up all the video or intern interns like there's twenty people. I think we interviewed that day and he said to. Pf he's like. I know who you guys are gonna pick. But i'm not gonna tell you. Who and then billy showed up out of breath with a five page resume stapled that had like i dunno seventeen georgia leary's fucking resume and We were like hey this him in the and he was like yep art your heart the thing that also that that made me say that in the first place was that there was like twenty interns as doing interviews and i had lost my tv remote from my apartment and my roommates guide and gotta get a new one. And so i interviewed billy. I was like this kid kind of character. And then i was like. Can you run to best. Buy for me to get me this remote. Or whatever and i legitimately walked upstairs. Came back downstairs five minutes later and he's come back here. It is and it was like so fast. I was like. How did you even come back this fast. And then from there. I was like you know this kid got it. Also i it actually is a good lesson to with our two interns that we've ever hired or three county julie football but the yet but not being super super fans actually was big in their favorite like jake showed up thinking that he was going to be a columnist for barstool sports. Billy showed up pretending that he listened when it was very clear he had never listened. I eat someone is high school. Classes like broke ourselves kind of cool. He's like yeah. You know what. I'm gonna try and get a job there. I think there was one line on his resume that was just typed out url to his huddle highlight film. Because i'm trying to click on this perspective. What i'm you present us. What happened so i listened to show every day. Drive me to school and high school because we're only three times week right. Well well it takes me three times. Yeah like sometimes the show like was long commute so then one day i followed hang on twitter and looking for new york city based interns. It was late my senior year of high school and Like my high school had had to go. Get an internship like to like. So you have to go to class like after a ps redone. So you can just fuck around for your senior streep so. I like applied to the internship. At bar still like. I send my resume to hank. And i was like oh man this would be like so cool of. This happened to never happen like i like. Why would they choose me out of like for no reason and then i went to the interview i was sitting in the waiting room with all these dudes one guy was dressed. Like the ridler or something. If you don't remember that like there's all these guys like these like sunday. July had like tons of stories but like i've seen him out on thirty seconds ago but i have no idea what he's talking to keep us now. It's like there's no way. I'm going to get this job my side. I just explained everyone who's sitting in the room with me and we don't care hard and he was like party like relieved that i wasn't going to get it because like i can just go tell my buddies about this. It'll be hilarious tonight in the interview last came back with you guys. Other words keeps getting the worst story of anything job that hey you've got the job and i was like why can't do it also pay. You made it a lot easier. I think we're like we're gonna tell you like the table. Yeah what was your first impression of hank. Big cat remember the remote. Yeah i remember the remote really mentioned that in your like twenty five minutes story. They will because it sucks did. Don't give that tone billy. The story sucked. I know but i was like you. Know like legitimately. I had no idea like why you guys wisely. You're telling the story again anyway. So but i so i went back. Then you guys were like ally younger no but like you guys had higher muscle mass and you can see in your face like yours heads. We're like this big back. Remember that that's your takeaway was lights in your way. So you're saying that their heads have gone way bigger since then. They've actually gotten smaller. Believe i met you. Oh my god all right well in the show on that. You can't even better than that. I love you billy. We're going to kick the she out of jose. All right what's number. There's one stuck in ninety. Nine draw have to redraw ramped. We drop thousand route. Frogs can freeze about two. It was about to pick eighteen and defrost themselves eighteen. Seventy three ninety nine would frogs can defrost themselves and frees himself to around derek. Jeter i know that hall of fame heading that billy. What are you know that. I watched nature document that yeah very well acquainted with the fact that last year that frogs can warm up from the inside number one player number one god in vote is to two to twelve. I love you you ever on friday. Guess talk what what allan poe's a day report prop up up up helping small business suits.

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1314: "Gnarler"

No Agenda

3:19:17 hr | 3 months ago

1314: "Gnarler"

"Cool baby this is so much cooler. Adam curry john's divorce january twenty first. Twenty twenty one. This is your ward winning one asian media assassination episode thirteen hundred fourteen. This is no agenda. Resetting the simulation demand broadcasting live opportunities on thirty three years the frontier boston taxes on capital of the drone star. Staying the morning. everybody. I'm out of curry and from northern silicon valley where apparently donald trump is still president. I'm john cedar skills. Oh man oh. Wow this is so interesting why you read. The the thing i posted on the social would actually happened. No but let me guess. Because i back up one second and we'll see if this if this corroborates first of all i haven't contacted anybody who had Give me all of these reasons. Why donald trump would be our president. Today i've waited. I'm waiting to see if they contact me and also observing what they're doing in public than what they're saying and oh my goodness we are going back fifteen years in time and we are now returning. Can't believe this is the doing this. We are now returning to. The united states was sold and into a yellow. Yeah oh yeah. It turned into a corporation. And what happened on. And what happened. On inauguration day with joe biden became president of the corporation which is now surrounded by the military. Donald trump will be after military tribunal. Trials will become president of the true united states and then he'll get us back on the gold standard and save the world. That is literally what i'm hearing. I've heard this from fifteen years and you know what it may all be true. Your name is an upper case. You're of the state audit. Have we not done this. All have shares. No you are the actual asset of the corporation of the united network. That's where we can do all this spending is that is that where You postal now. What i posted was this person by the way this effort went by. Oh cars eight railcars ladies and gentlemen. We have a special economic zephyr report. Alert the guys over at cnbc. It looks like joe. Biden is getting us back on track pun intended bitcoin down and currently at thirty one thousand three hundred and forty three wrath. Hard that would have been equivalent if they had the male carbon nine car train anyway and nine nine karn cheese. This crazy holidays operation. Peration warp speed baby. I have no idea why there's so many cars training poge john. Hello so he. So here's how it goes you what you miss was over the weekend. I deal less or no. I missed something. Yeah yeah over the weekend biden and a good portion of the senators and a all these people. Brian arrests were all arrested. And so it was agreed that because it would be tough on the concrete or deal with all these arrests and biden being camel that they decided that they'll go through the play the game so they're running things but in trump is really in charge is really in charge and he will. He will resign his office which has to do. But that's a fake is still in charge and these guys are just going to be going through the motions bullcrap. Well this is why i said. Resetting the simulation because seriously fifteen years ago this was. This was the number one and probably before conspiracy theories. Were really known. Such as conspiracies and everything became a conspiracy theory. And i researched this now and this is the kind of stuff that wesley snipes went to jail over. Because from this you get the logical conclusion that Taxation is illegal and people go to jail for this stuff whether it's true or not people go to jail for it now. There was another data. Point is that biden traveled to the inauguration not on the traditional military plane but on a civilian private plane and the national guardsmen during. The motorcade all turned their backs. This is true. Actually video mall turning their backs on on biden. So yeah you know what sand me a memo when you've got it all figured out because they have other stuff to do now. I do have an ethic for guy. I forgot all about that corporation. Nonsense ch- it's like right back in your face. Here's a worthy of playing. Since crack and by the way will the cracking his here. The opening of the alex jones show. This is the end of the country. Folks and i don't say that to be exaggerating or be mean about it. You better mark the point we got taken over and then they're gonna start the mass reeducation starving everybody out making you salute them making you prove to them. You're a good little menu abba job. This is going to be so humiliating for the american people. This is gonna make sherman's reconstruction of the south look like a cake. Walk a tea party. An exercise in enjoyment. If we ever beat this thing it'll be in the history of like these people were hitler. I mean. this is unbelievable. It's not like oh we're getting there. It's bad things out of control. It's it's they just begun. Thought they're going to take your pension funds. They're going to bankrupt. They're going to cut the power off the oil off. They're going to open the borders. It's over it's over it's all gone. It's all over. They're going to activate the buddha lose. fbi ad l. terror forces. They're going to start blowing everything up. Then they're gonna come and arrest all the patriots. The idiots will jared so they're gonna shut your power off. They want you starving in the streets. They wanna rape your wife. Third jacob burns your all over all over. Enjoy all your games on america's rotting and deserves it now. The satanist aren't good god. Just let them have their way now. So all your games over all the tv watching all the laziness all the slack. John's over it's over going to be just like a baby at six months being chopped up in it's mother's womb human nonessential your. They're gonna kill you because you don't care x. Sounds like sounds like a day record. Really wow that we band that guy. Alan no no no no. You can't ban something like that. That's epic and again. That's totally potential. Brought up a topic on potential ice. Oh potential eyeso- one. Well there's more so we'll just keep it on on deck keep okay well. Let's he mentioned. I have to clips Kercheval oh one. American no newsmax. Isn't he on newsmax. I don't know where he is. But here's an intro to it super clip this dershowitz hoops second students at harvard. Now at a set up kind of re education camps and moral rehabilitation centers and institutions preventing people who had the to work in the trump administration. I mean it's he saying the same thing. Is alex jones. Just a little calmer. The same idea goes blow anywhere else. Says it says the mainstream all democrat outlets and everyone else in. this is not a great super clip. Because it's too long. Yeah i mean it's really long because it wasn't tight. It wasn't done by doom right but this is the super clip re education and the question is how are we going to really almost deep program. These people who have signed up for the cult trump experts say they see cult like behavior. We have There are millions of americans almost wrong way almost all republicans who somehow needs to be deprogrammed there they. They're members of a cult. The trump is cold. And we have to be deprogrammed because they've been brainwashed joy. I really believe that they have been brainwashed by this misinformation campaign. so how do you d- radicalize. These people joining us. Now is stephen harrison. He's a mental health professional. Who has been helping deaprtment if you send me next time i'll cut it up. I can do that in real time. It's just they almost got it right. Ran people out of cults for decades. He's also the author of the cult of trump. There are millions of people who believe that the election was rigged how to program them once we educate them interact and empower the person to start thinking for themselves. I think a lot of people are going to have to be deprogrammed. We had a program addressing white supremacists that we had programs federal programs that went towards funding organizations like these that de radicalize people and president trump pulled the plug on federal funding for some of these programs and so one thing that we know is that we have to get that funding right back up and we probably need to double triple quadruple or increase funding for these de radicalization programs. So we can look to history though. What ultimately outbreaks that power structure in the south is enforcement right. There has to be consequences. David atkins's in dnc member. As you said he's also the leader of the california democrats and he is suggesting that over half our country needs to be reprogrammed. Not just seventy five million people that voted for trump the conservatives in this country a bernie sanders staffer was caught on undercover camera. Saying that trump voters should be sent to re education camp must be guarded against by creating establishing reeducation centers in the south worst. We would take all the people who needed to be reeducated into the new way of thinking and teach them how things were going to be. I s well. What is going to happen to those people that we re educate die-hard capitalists and the reply was that they'd have to be eliminated and when i pursued this further. They estimated that they would have to eliminate twenty five million people in these re education centers. And when i say eliminate i mean million people part of it is we have to break through our kind of private idea. That kids belong to their parents or kids belong to their and recognize that kids belong to whole communities wants it's everybody's responsibility not just the households. Then we start making better investments. I have decided we really need camps for adults. No ma'am a number a number of clips that play into this because this is incessant. It's actually quite good even though it was long as quite good with with all of the mainstream talking about reeducation reprogramming camps. And before you go on. I have to tell you something. The re education. Apparently you know. It's catching up to somebody. 'cause i finally got one of the lib joe's to bet me. What's the bet. Well at only one of them would do it. The other one refuses to wage with me. Since i have dave neither one of them have ever beat me in five years or blogger. Ten problem the bet is the following and it was it was it was blowing off. Steam trump you know is just the beginning when trump gets impeach found guilty. And then they're going to they're going to uncover all the stuff you know just straight out of alternate he says and then matches a matter. Bet i says okay. What was the betty says. The senate will not convict trump. It's not possible as they need seventeen republicans to turn on him and he still no one's in their right mind could commit that kind of political suicide. I guess there's three that will do. Ask romney romney for sure. Yeah ben sasse in one other amer cousy or one of those. I think they're both gonna. They're gonna go so he said okay and then he started. I could see it happening. I even it was just over over. Texting is well. it's gotta be two to one. You have to pay me two hundred. Because that's what a creep and so i said i thought about it for a minute i. I tried to get him to wait a minute. This guy's gonna bail for good okay. I'll take the bet. I'll take a pay you two hundred bucks and you pay me a hundred. It's an easy hunters no way. This is going to happen but this is the these are the same people that are talking about reeducating but conservatives. So i'm here. Was that need re education. Well okay so. This is exactly the problem. Both sides are saying that you don't you can't make a super cut out of conservative saying this because they're not on television but i hear the same thing reprogramming not re- education. That's very left thing to say. But deprogramming reprogramming. I've heard all these terms and the fact is everybody needs to deprogrammed himself. And you can do that quite easily. And i'm gonna put together a program and i would probably published a jubilant how you can deprogrammed program yourself no matter what side of the political spectrum. You're on but let